From: locklin@titan.ucc.umass.edu (Lupo the Butcher)
Subject: Re: Oh so worried.
Organization: Campus Crusade for Cthulhu
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 03:47:18 GMT
X-Posted-From: titan.ucc.umass.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <1992Dec18.064005.24858@ucsu.Colorado.EDU> radinsky@spot.Colorado.EDU (Wayne Radinsky) writes:
>drake+@cs.cmu.edu (Drake) writes:
>>>>>> Is it "dangerous"?  Can the "satanic" affect someone who doesn't
>>>>>> believe in it?
>>>>>
>>>>> If Satanism is for real, absolutely yes!!!
>>>>>
>>>>> You don't have to believe in quantum physics to get killed by a nuclear
>>>>> bomb.  The same must hold true for Satanism, or it's nonsense.
>> 
>> Maybe some of you would like to come up with a definition of what
>> exactly Satanism *is*...
>
>Satanism [in this context only] -- n. the ability to summon and
>influence demonic spirits, and possibly induce the spiritual posession
>(see below) of someone else.

>There are more "humanistic" definitions that have nothing to do with
>this; see the FAQ file for more general definitions.
>
>>>My point, however, is: IF Voodoo hexes are for real it's just as
>>>possible for Sagan to get hexed as it is for him to die from AIDS.
>> 
>> Interesting theory.  What do you mean by "for real?"
>
>I mean real.  Gravity is real, anti-gravity is not (but the concept is
>real).

This is rediculous. You have completely ignored the possibility that a voodoo
"hex" is merely a psychological phenomenon which only effects those who believe
in it. My Vietnamese roomate believes that too much ginseang root will make him
impotent(!). I am willing to bet that it does have that effect on him in large
doses but the same substance has quite the opposite effect on me 
(unfortunately. The stuff is so useful for its other benefits). So what is the
deal here? Does it make you impotent or not?
He also believes that the juice of a pig's heart has all kinds of tonic 
properties & it seems to work on him. I doubt very much that it would have any
noticable effects on me, as I do not subscribe to this belief. 

>>>>> Oh ye of little faith! If deomic possession is for real, again,
>>>>> absolutely YES.
>> 
>> What meaning, again, do you assign to "for real?"
>
>I mean real.  Gravity is real, anti-gravity is not (but the concept is
>real).  (You asked twice).

As before, demonic posession could very well be a subjective psychological
phenomenon. If this were the case, belief, conscious or unconscious, would
be THE important factor in demonic posession...

>>>>> I didn't say what my beliefs were!  (I was saying, =if= posession exists,
>>> then...)  And if you want to know, I believe possession is a possibility,
>>> but I'm not convinced of its reality.
>> 
>> How do you define possession so as to believe in its possibility?
>
>Think of the body as being a car, and the soul which animates the body
>as the driver.  Spiritual possession, then, would be analogous to
>someone trying (or succeeding) to steal your car.  In other words,
>someone other than you is controlling your body.

O.K. If you want to do it this way...

>Techniques such as ouija boards and automatic writing invite "someone
>else" to control your body.  These might lead to possession, if you're
>unable to get this entity back out.  It's like, asking someone to drive
>your car for a while, but not being able to get them out of the
>driver's seat when you want it back.  This is the only means of possession
>I've read about.  If anybody knows of others, please post.

Astrology? Reading of Occult books, such as the "Necronomicon" (chuckle).
Numerology. Tarot cards. Automatic writing. Ceremonial magick. Wicca. Role
playing games. Going into non-xtain churches. Practice of hinduism. listening
to various types of music (Not just heavy metal either; the blues were 
considered "satanic" for example). Yoga.
I could go on & on... Basically anything the church fathers (ever notice how
they are always fathers?) do not like & see as a threat to their authority is
an automatic demonic threat...

>If we believe in life after death, the possesser could be a deceased
>person.  The spiritual realm could also be inhabited by entities that
>never incarnate, such as angels or demons, who could try to possess
>people.

Booga Booga!

>I say it's a "possibility" because, having never been possessed myself,
>I can't say from personal experience that any of this is true, or is
>not true.  If anyone has personal experiences, please post.

Yah, I would really get a kick out of that. I promise not to flame ya either.

-Lupo
Newsgroups: alt.satanism