HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pierson@empror.enet.dec.com (dave pierson)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Grade crossings, etc. (was Re: Deaths on Railroad Prop...)
Date: 29 Dec 92 16:26:20 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

In article <1992Dec29.061217.11022@ecsvax.uncecs.edu>, ehr@ecsvax.uncecs.edu
(Ernest H. Robl) writes...
>In article <1992Dec28.215228.1@fnala.fnal.gov>, khartman@fnala.fnal.gov writes:
>> 	I have been interested in the methods used to "lift the gates" while
>> a train is close to a crossing, but not moving.  Setups that use the Diesel
>> horn to activate the gates, or a slow moving train/timer.
>> 
>> 	Can anyone give us a more technical view of how these different 
>> systems operate?  Thanks for the information!
> 

[good stuff deleted...]

	Simplest solution is a delay: if the track circuit is occupied longer
	than <x>, the gates go up.  This requires a "cut section" track
	circuit, audio frequency overlay, or a "presence detector" (Metal
	detector type, radar, etc) to relower the gates as the train starts.
	Since the train will be moving slowly at restart, the reduced distance
	(tho not time) is acceptable.

	I believe there are rf based systems, with remote control from the
	loco cab.  Sometimes the dispatcher has CTC control over the gates,
	usually on an exception basis.

thanks
dave pierson			|the facts, as accurately as i can manage,
Digital Equipment Corporation	|the opinions, my own.
40 Old Bolton Rd		|I am the NRA.
Stow, Mass, USA	
01775				pierson@msd26.enet.dec.com
"He has read everything, and, to his credit, written nothing."  A J Raffles
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: "nigel allen" <nigel.allen@canrem.com>
Subject: Train station car rentals and long-term parking?
Reply-To: "nigel allen" <nigel.allen@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 21 Dec 92 09:11:26 EST


There is a car rental booth outside Union Station in Toronto (Tilden
Rent-a-car, the Canadian affiliate of National Car Rental). I think
there is a Hertz rental counter (or at least a courtesy phone -- that
is, a yellow phone without a dial that is connected to a Hertz office
when you pick it up) at Central Station in Montreal.

I seem to remember advertising from a car rental company on VIA Rail
ticket jackets, but I forget which company was advertising.  I haven't
seen that advertising lately, now that VIA has switched to thicker
tickets that don't need an airline-style ticket jacket.

Even if there isn't enough potential business to justify a full-time
rental booth at a given railway station, perhaps a car rental company
might find it worthwhile to provide a courtesy phone and free delivery
of cars to the station.

 When I was in Britain in May and June, I didn't notice any car rental
locations in railway stations there, but I wasn't really looking for
rental cars. Trains are nicer!
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: wchutt@alex.monsanto.com (Bill C Hutton)
Subject: GG-I book?
Organization: Monsanto Company
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 21:22:48 GMT


Can anyone tell me the name of a book(s) that discusses in detail the
GG-I locomotive?

Please respond directly to e-mail wchutt@monsanto.com.

Thanks in advance.
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: jwilson@taylor.cs.Colorado.EDU (John Wilson)
Subject: Re: Moffat Tunnel
Keywords: n
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 18:01:36 GMT

The Needle's Eye Tunnel,  had been fixed or was going to be fixed,
but then collapsed again, and there were people there and one
of them lost a foot.   There was talk of blocking the
tunnel or skylighting it.  I think the conclusion that repairing
it was no longer an option.

John Wilson
From: sam@terapin.com (Sam Lewit)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: European Air Deregulation
Date: 1 Jan 93 01:27:59 PST
Organization: BBS

European railfans correct me if I'm wrong, but I read in the paper today that
starting Jan 1 the major airlines will become deregulated. According to the
article there has already been severe price dropping on major european markets.
The article goes on to say that some industry observers predict one of the most
expensive air travel markets is turning into a flying bargain basement on Jan
1.

Lufthansa started with price cuts of about 50 percent on fares to Germany from
around Europe. KLM, British Airways and SAS quickly matched the fares. KLM
announced ROUND TRIP fares from Amsterdam to major German airports of $104 ($52
each way!).

This is great news for european travels, but what does that mean for Europe's
fantastic rail passenger services? Will europeans still pay more to train when
the plane is cheaper and faster (and arguably safer?). It almost seems
inevitable that what has happened in the US what with fuel prices cheaper than
bottled water, and airfares MUCH cheaper than rail travel (in almost all
corriders), will happen in Europe. Any opinions? I hope I'm wrong.

Sam Lewit                 | "We shouldn't be blindly opposed to all progress.
2550 Shattuck #73         | But we should be opposed to blind progress"
Berkeley, Ca. 94704       | Terrapin Transit BBS 24 HR BBS Newsfeeds Free
Internet: sam@terapin.com | 510-486-1422 3-2400  510-841-9320 HST/v32bis
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: Joe.Russ <Joe.Russ@mixcom.mixcom.com>
Subject: ICC delays decision on WC's purchase of GB&W and FRVR
Organization: Milwaukee Internet Xchange BBS, Milwaukee, WI U.S.A.
Date: Fri, 01 Jan 1993 07:18:03 GMT


[From the December 30 Milwaukee Journal Business Section, posted
without permission]
 Railroads
 UNION CALLS MERGER DELAY A VICTORY
 
 Non-union employes get
 a chance to organize
 before deal closes
 
 Associated Press
 ----------------
 Union spokesmen are claiming a victory after the Interstate Commerce
Commission's decision to delay until Jan. 28 its order allowing the
purchase of two Wisconsin railroads by the Wisconsin Central
Transportation Corp.
 
Union officials had sought to stray the sale while an election is held
on union representation for employes of one of the lines being
purchased.
 
Wisconsin Central, based in Rosemont, Ill. said Tuesday that the ICC
decided it needed more time to review the latest pleadings by rail
unions regarding the proper application of ICC-mandated labor
protective conditions.
 
Edward Burkhardt, Wisconsin Central president, said the delay hampered
the plans of his company's Fox Valley & Western Ltd. subsidiary to
acquire the Fox River Valley Railroad and the Green Bay and Western
Railroad.
 
"ICC's last-minute action seriously disrupts the plans of hundreds of
shippers, employes and communities who were eagerly awaiting
tomorrow's scheduled start-up of the [Fox Valley & Western]," he said.
 
Edward Garvey, an attorney for the United Transportation Union, called
the delay a "major step forward."
 
The union has filed for an election for employes on the Fox Valley
Railroad, who were not unionized. The Green Bay and Western is a union
railroad.
 
The Wisconsin Central had hoped it "could avoid working out an
agreement with the union for the [Green Bay and Western] and forcing
employes of [the Fox River Valley Railroad] to just accept the
implementing arrangement," Garvey said.
 
[End of article]
-- 
Joe.Russ@mixcom.com
WISE Div., NMRA
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: johnm@hpmcaa.mcm.hp.com.mcm.hp.com (John Mosbarger)
Subject: Re: Unusual tunnels?
Organization: HP Cardiology Business Unit - McMinnville, OR
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:03:15 GMT

David G. Baird (Baird_David@Tandem.com) wrote:
: > 
: > Isn't there also a spiral on the Roaring Camp, Big Trees, & Pacific (or the
: > other RR with a similar name that operates in the same area)?
: > 
: There was a spiral trestle, but it was vandalized in the mid-70s (arson).
: The railroad quickly built some switchbacks to bypass the trestle. You
: can walk down from the summit of the hill, and follow the path that the
: trains used to take. I walked out on the trestle a ways. It's all charred,
: but can take an individual's weight no problem. But, it's very high, and it
: gets scary. 
: 
: DGB }

     I remember reading that the trestles were built to SP specs.

John
--
*****************************************************************************
| John Mosbarger          |    You know why many people commit suicide      |
|                         |    during the holidays?  It's because they're   |
| HP McMinnville, OR      |    forced to spend time with their relatives.   |
|                         | 	                  --John Belushi            |
| johnm@hpmcaa.mcm.hp.com |                     	                    |
|***************************************************************************|
|                     Opinions are mine and mine alone.                     |
*****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: gaarder@anarres.ithaca.ny.us (Steve Gaarder)
Subject: Re: DMU's and putting the world to rights.
Reply-To: gaarder@anarres.UUCP (Steve Gaarder)
Organization: /etc/organization
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 92 20:39:31 GMT

In article <63030@mimsy.umd.edu> mangoe@cs.umd.edu (Charley Wingate) writes:
>Americans
>don't want to be huddled together into urban areas while the countryside
>around them is basically empty-- that's what a lot of mass transit planning
>looks like.

Unfortunately, as the population expands, that's exactly what we need
to do if we want to have any countryside left.

Steve Gaarder
gaarder@actech.com
From: bob@1776.COM (Robert Coe)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: High Speed Rail Questions
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 92 14:15:55 EST
Distribution: na
Organization: 1776 Enterprises, Sudbury MA

cal@ee.ryerson.ca (Calvin Henry-Cotnam) writes:
> The process I believe is called "Thermite", and is similar to the way
> the propeller on an ocean liner is repaired when not near repair facilities.
> ...
> I believe the process involves using scrap aluminium (shredded pieces
> provide more surface area), some compound containing iron and a catalyst
> compound, ...

Thermite is what was supposedly used in that famous old MIT fraternity prank
wherein a streetcar was welded to its rails at the stop in front of 77 Massa-
chusetts Avenue (and not in Kendall Square subway station, as some revision-
ists have suggested).  The prank cannot be repeated, as the line was down-
graded to trolley busses (and later, alas, to diesel busses).  :^|

   ___            _                                           -  Bob
   /__) _   /    / ) _   _
(_/__) (_)_(_)  (___(_)_(/_______________________________________ bob@1776.COM
Robert K. Coe ** 14 Churchill St, Sudbury, Massachusetts 01776 ** 508-443-3265
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: ehr@ecsvax.uncecs.edu (Ernest H. Robl)
Subject: Re: Grade crossings, etc. (was Re: Deaths on Railroad Prop...)
Summary: keying crossing gates open
Organization: UNC Educational Computing Service
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 06:12:17 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.215228.1@fnala.fnal.gov>, khartman@fnala.fnal.gov writes:
> 	I have been interested in the methods used to "lift the gates" while
> a train is close to a crossing, but not moving.  Setups that use the Diesel
> horn to activate the gates, or a slow moving train/timer.
> 
> 	Can anyone give us a more technical view of how these different 
> systems operate?  Thanks for the information!


In some cases, the cheapest solution, in both freight and passenger
operations, is to manually "key" the gates open.  There is a box at
trackside with an electrical switch which overrides the track
circuit and opens the gates again as long as the train is stopped.

I've seen three variations on this:

(1) Standard toggle switch is inside the box, the cover for which
is locked with a switch lock.

(2) Switch key itself activates the control circuit.  Crewman
inserts the switch key into the device and turns it to activate
the override circuit.

(3) Same as (2), but the activation box requires a special key,
which is not the same as the switch key used in the area.  (Used
at the Amtrak station at Selma, NC, where one of the platforms --
the one with the key device -- is on a connecting track between
CSX and NS tracks.  This track is normally only used by Amtrak
trains, and, as far as I know, only Amtrak crews have keys to this
device.)


For the automated solution:  Track circuits on mainlines can be
set up to detect how far away the train is and how fast it is 
moving.  Then, there's a "program" with a set of rules that
determines, based on distance and speed, when to close the gates --
and, to re-open them if it detects that forward motion has stopped.

Obviously the latter requires a bit more equipment than just
running a cable into a box equipped with a simple on/off switch.

-- Ernest

-- 
"My other computers are Nikon N8008s and an SB25." -- Ernest H. Robl
Ernest H. Robl (ehr@ecsvax)  Durham, NC, USA   +1  919   286-3845
                                         FAX:  +1  919   286-1696
This .signature meets plate C specifications (for rec.railroad fans)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: memanuel@cbnews.cb.att.com (mark.emanuele)
Subject: Re: Deaths on Railroad Property: common sense or am I an Idiot?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 04:21:34 GMT

 In the town of Hazlet, NJ the North Jersey Coast line has a station . 3/4 mile
past the station is a grade crossing. This crossing is activated while the train
is coming into the station. Train sits in the station for 3-4 minutes to
load/unload. Grade crossing has gates down for 3-4 minutes with no train in
sight. Cars start to go around gates thinking gates are malfunctioning (local kids used to take jumper cables and short the track circuit to activate gates) Train comes and just misses car.

This seems like a situation that could be corrected by NJ Transit easily,
however when I contacted them, they looked at me like I had three heads.

Am I nuts, or is there a simple way for them to correct this VERY dangerous
situation. (It happens at least daily).  
Oh, BTW the station is barely visible from the crossing (Bethany Rd.)
-- 
Mark A. Emanuele			memanuele@attmail.com
Sr. Network Engineer			(201)331-4713
AT&T Easylink Services	400 Interpace Pkwy   Parsippany, NJ 07054
From: wbrill@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Warren Brill)
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 21:16:09 GMT
Subject: Re: Railroads named "Pacific"?
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.railroad

In rec.railroad, exudeb@exu.ericsson.se (Dave Breeding, xt-dGR,) writes:
[Much stuff deleted]
> >
> >Wasn't the original name of the Milwaukee Road
> >Chicago, Milwaukee, St. Paul, and Pacific?
> 
> 
> Also: Roscoe, Snyder, and Pacific (west Texas shortline)

Answer: NO. The "and Pacific" was added after the turn of the 20th century,
I believe, to reflect that the Milwaukee was being turned into YET ANOTHER
transcontinental, at the same time as the Western This and That (Gould roads).
Later it was discovered that America didn't really need that many trans-
continentals, but that's another story. 
BTW, another Colorado road with "and Pacific" was:

Denver Northwestern & Pacific

Original name of the Denver & Salt Lake, a.k.a. the Moffat Road, now part
of Denver & Rio .... oops Southern Pacific :-(

 
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
o                                          i---i_________________      o
o    Warren T. Brill, a.k.a.          *----|[|]|  #### #### #### |*    o
o    wbrill@hpxxx.fc.hp.com         i_|___/|___|\________________|_i   o
o    wbrill@hpfcso.fc.hp.com       =++()=()=() `========' ()=()=()++=  o
o                                  =================================== o
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: dcooper@bluff.compserv.utas.edu.au (David Cooper)
Subject: Lubricated Track (was: Oil Bearings)
Keywords: oil
Organization: University of Tasmania at Launceston
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 03:29:47 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.223512.12593@mel.dit.csiro.au>, ajw@squid.mel.dit.CSIRO.AU (Andrew Waugh) writes:

>
>The 'reasonable attention,' however, is getting more difficult today
>as employee's no longer have sufficient experience with oil bearings.
>Locally a small group of enthusiasts restore and maintain vintage EMU
>stock for special occasions. This stock is, of course, fitted with oil
>bearings. On one such special occasion, shortly after it had been
>restored, the two car set was rostered to replace a modern set on a
>short electrified branch in Melbourne. It would spend its day running
>up and down the branch. The employee detailed to ensure that the oil
>boxes were filled took his instructions literally and filled them right
>up. This was far too much and the excess oil slowly drained out the
>back of the bearings. Much of this oil found its way onto the rail
>head and thence to the wheel treads. Braking consequently became a bit
>problematic!
>
>andrew waugh

This reminds me of something I was told some years back about 'lubrication'
being applied to rails on a cane tramway in Qld. Apparently some local lads
decided to have a bit of fun. At the time the local sugar mill still
operated small (Fowler?) tank locos (2 ft gauge). These hauled a string of
unbraked 4 wheel trucks. There is a longish grade a couple of kms to the
east of where I lived at the time and when an easterly was blowing at night
I could hear the locos slow to a crawl as they humped their load over the
crest of the grade. It all had to be timed right, because there was a sharp
left hander over a level crossing after the crest. With an unbraked load
the driver had to be careful not to allow things to get away. Judging by
the exhaust sound the loads were pretty much at the limit. Very interesting
listening on a frosty or foggy night when the rails were damp.

Anyway, someone decided to grease/oil the rails on the grade. The train
stalled and slid a good way back down the hill, the loco being dragged by
it's load.


-- 
David Cooper                        Senior Computing Officer (Academic)
Computing Services                                  UTL Network Manager
University of Tasmania                             Phone: +61 03 260598
PO Box 1214 Launceston 7250 Australia                Fax: +61 03 264232
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: FBCB@iunsys.iun.indiana.edu
Subject: BN derailment in Montana (Empire Destroyer/What Can I do in MSP?) 
Date: 24 Dec 92 20:22:03 CST
X-Received: by usenet.pa.dec.com; id AA25885; Thu, 24 Dec 92 18:21:17 -0800
X-Received: by inet-gw-2.pa.dec.com; id AA11933; Thu, 24 Dec 92 18:21:14 -0800
X-Received: (from user FBCB) by IUNSYS.iun.indiana.edu; 24 Dec 92 20:22:03 CST
X-To: rec.railroad.usenet

Can anybody report on a BN derailment in Montana? I do not have
ready news access to Montana news. A radio station in Chicago
stated that because of the derailment, Amtrak has "permanently"
canceled its Empire Builder west of Minneapolis, and while
first class passengers will be flown to Seattle, Amtrak has decided
to leave the coach passengers "stranded" in Minneapolis.
Happy Holidays!

Dave Chary
fcb@iunsys.iun.indiana.edu


Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: stev@vax.ftp.com  (stev knowles)
Subject: Re: Heritage Fleet was Re: Amtrak orders Viewliners
Nntp-Software: PC/TCP NNTP
Organization: FTP Software, Inc., Wakefield, MA
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 13:41:03


In article <92365.112647CSS3@psuvm.psu.edu> CSS3@psuvm.psu.edu writes:

> does offer rail cars for sale to the public. During a visit at Beech Grove
> shops during August 1991 I noticed that Amtrak had placed a number of cars on


how did you get a tour of beech grove?



From: jbrandt@hplred.HPL.HP.COM (Jobst Brandt)
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 22:22:00 GMT
Subject: Re: Italian railways--is 1st class worth it?
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories, Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.railroad

I find the train classes interesting because when I rode them a few
years back they  had: Rapido : local, Diretto : express,
Direttissimo : IC intercity with surcharge if under 100 km trip.  If
the current postings are accurate, it seems that FS has a more
moderate perspective of the speed of their trains.  The notations
that I experienced may have been left over from "Il Duce".

jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: cal@ee.ryerson.ca (Calvin Henry-Cotnam)
Subject: Re: High Speed Rail Questions
Organization: Ryerson Polytechnical Institute, Toronto
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 22:38:00 GMT

pierson@empror.enet.dec.com (dave pierson) writes:
>
>	One starter, without references handy, is Potassium Permanganate.
>	I have seen pre batched kits employed, with "ceramic" one shot molds,
>	thermite mix and starter.  Starter is optional, since a track gang
>	usually has an acetylene torch handy.
>

That was it!
I previously mentioned a demonstration of the Thermite reaction in an
high school chemistry class.

The ingredients were powered iron oxide, aluminium shavings, and
potassium permanganate as a catalyst.  A short strip of magnesium was
used as a "fuse".  The fuse was ignited and it burned down to ignite
the mixture to produce the reaction.

As I mentioned previously, there was a small shower of sparks followed
by the crucible containing the mixture cracking into pieces and a nice
red/orange blob of molten iron falling to the asbestos pad.


Calvin Henry-Cotnam, CATE          | "...My brain IBM"
Ryerson Polytechnical Institute    | "So if you see me, acting strangely..."
Toronto, Ontario, Canada           |                  STYX, Mr. Roboto
From: bob@1776.COM (Robert Coe)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Effect of population density
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 92 07:45:28 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: 1776 Enterprises, Sudbury MA

mangoe@cs.umd.edu (Charley Wingate) writes:
> Application of European experience to the USA is basically relevant to the
> northeast.  Even then, it is limited by the ease of moving away.  Americans
> don't want to be huddled together into urban areas while the countryside
> around them is basically empty-- that's what a lot of mass transit planning
> looks like.

That point is basically valid for intercity travel, but for mass transit the
reverse can be true.  For example, in the outer Boston suburbs where I live,
most houses are built on lots about an acre in size.  We can get away with 
that because we're not particularly short of water, and a large yard won't 
turn into a dust bowl.  In California, where keeping a large yard watered 
would be an expensive, almost anti-social undertaking, houses are crammed
together on tiny lots.  The result is that the suburban population density 
in much of California (and in some of the drier parts of the midwest) is suf-
ficient to support mass transit, while ours isn't.

   ___            _                                           -  Bob
   /__) _   /    / ) _   _
(_/__) (_)_(_)  (___(_)_(/_______________________________________ bob@1776.COM
Robert K. Coe ** 14 Churchill St, Sudbury, Massachusetts 01776 ** 508-443-3265
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: rmrin@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (r.m.rickert)
Subject: Re: Captial Limited question
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 13:42:56 GMT

In article <1992Dec25.200320.1038@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> jis@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (jishnu.mukerji) writes:
>In article <Bzruvx.1wL@nocusuhs.nnmc.navy.mil> organic@usuhsb.ucc.usuhs.nnmc.navy.mil writes:
>>Does anybody know when the Chicago-D.C. train is going to 
>>start using the Superliner cars?  I want to take it this 
>>spring and get last chance to use the old dome cars  
>
>Yes, according to an Amtrak speaker who spoke at a NARP region meeting
>in '92, the Capitol Ltd. will become a Superliner train. He did not
>state any specific date for this, but one would suspect that it will
>be within the next couple of years.
>
>Jishnu Mukerji
>jis@usl.com
>

This last week's "Tracks Ahead" (new series) had an interview with an Amtrak
spokeswoman and she gave a date like 1995.
-- 

Dick Rickert  AT&T Consumer Products Laboratory