From: G.M.Suddes@newcastle.ac.uk (Gareth Suddes)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: the five doctors
Date: 18 Nov 92 12:48:07 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: University of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK, NE1 7RU

ph9991_manfr@rivers.acc.uwrf.edu writes:

>> Stuff deleted. Main question was how did the 2nd Doctor know about Jamie and
>> Zoe in the 5 Doctors since he regenerated straight after they were sent home

>>  Anyone want to explain this one?
>>

>We also know from dialog the Second Doctor has with the Brigadier that
>he does now in "The Five Doctors" recall the events that happened
>in "The Three Doctors," as they say "Don't forget Omega."
>Also in "The Three Doctors," the Doctor all make mind-links at various
>times in the story for rapid communications between the two or
>three.  It seems logical to me that during these communications,
>the Second Doctor could take a nanosecond to ask the Third if Jamie and
>Zoe are alright or what happened to them or why the Third seems to
>have blocks on his time travel knowledge....etc.
>So, that is when the Second could have learned of Jamie and Zoe's
>being sent home and memoryu erasure.

 Good explanation. What seems to escape some people is that the Doctor's
timeline is altered when he meets his future selves in the 3/5/2 Doctors.

  simple example...

    The second Doctor was scooped from his own time stream in the 3Doctors and
therefore met his own next incarnation. From our view point we have viewed the
Doctor's timeline right through from An Unearthly Child to The Three Doctors
passing such stories as The War Games and Spearhead from Space.

  In Spearhead the Doctor analyzes his new face and eventually comes to the
conclusion that it will grow on him. A few years later The Three Doctors takes
place and his second incarnation is scooped up. When the second Doctor is
returned to his own time stream he NOW has knowledge about his own future.
History has been altered. If we now followed the second Doctor from this point,
events would take a slightly different course to that which we've known and
hence the Spearhead scene would be DIFFERENT. The Doctor would now recognise
his new face immediately and think..."Oh of course, I'm fancy pants now aren't
I. Oh well, seems I'm stuck with it!"

 One further ramble. When Zoe and Jamie were returned to their own time the
Time Lords did say that they would remember their first adventure with the
Doctor. This is consistent with their meeting in the Five Doctors when they
obviously recognised the Brigadier when they couldn't have remembered him from
the Invasion.

  Listen carefully to the Doctor's emphasis in the line from the Five Doctors,
 "When the Time Lords sent you back to your own time they erased your memory of
the time you spent with me so how do you know who WE are?"
                                                 ^^^^
                                         Definite emphasis on the WE.

 Just remember though, "It's a tricky thing this time travel business"
 Perhaps some sort of timeline diagram would help in this case...

Gareth
________________________________________________________________________________
\ "You are now entering the Justice Zone. Beyond this point it is impossible   /
 \  to commit any act of injustice."                                          /
  \__________________________________________G.M.Suddes@newcastle.ac.uk______/