HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: leafs (PLAYOFFS and EXPANSION DRAFT)
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca
Date: 11 Jan 93 15:29:59 MST
Organization: Mount Royal College, Calgary, Alberta

In article <1993Jan10.153023.1@kean.ucs.mun.ca>, slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
> Keep in mind that I'm making these predictions with the Leafs' current
> line-up (ie. Grant Fuhr in net) -- however, it's entirely likely that
> Fuhr won't be a Leaf come playoff time.  And if the Leafs are forced 
> to trade Fuhr (because of the expansion draft) they new players would
> probably cause me to re-evaluate.

Although the choice between Fuhr and Potvin may be tough, I don't think it's
that hard at all. The Leafs can keep both of them by protecting Potvin and
exposing Fuhr. I doubt that the expansion teams would take Fuhr, a 31 year
old goalie with maybe four more years left in him, who makes $1.6 million 
dollars a year. His age and the fact that he is overpaid will keep them away.

> Speaking of the expansion draft and that each team can only protect 
> 1 goalie, is it possible that the Leafs could make a deal with another 
> team that would benefit both during the draft and then swap the 
> players back to their original teams afterwards?
>  
> For example, (as far as I know) each team can protect 9 forwards, 5 
> defenseman, and 1 goalie.  So, let's say Buffalo had 6 defenceman and
> 0 goalie they wanted to protect and Toronto had 4 defencemen and 2 
> goalies they wanted to protect.  Could Toronto trade a goalie (Potvin) 
> to Buffalo for defenceman-x, either team could protect said players,
> and then at the end of the season they could trade the players back to 
> their original teams?  
>  
> I know it's theoretically possible, but would this be legal?  Who the 
> NHL management come down on the teams for pulling something like this?

Yes, they would. The NHL passed a law before this season that prohibits teams
from making trades with the sole intention of "hiding" players in the 
expansion draft. This rule was passed because of some things that happened
before last summer's expansion draft, involving precisely what you suggested.
I forget exactly who the players were, but Winnipeg was one of the teams 
involved. The punishment is a fine somewhere in the neighborhood of $500,000...

								Alan
From: roney@selkirk.sfu.ca (Chris J. Roney)
Subject: Re: leafs (PLAYOFFS and EXPANSION DRAFT)
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 21:04:41 GMT

slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:

>> Does anyone think the leafs will make the playoffs this year?
>> Or even win the Stanley Cup?
> 
>IMO...
> 
>I think the Leafs will finish in 3rd place in the Norris and take 
>Detroit in 6 or seven games.
> 
>If they face Chicago in the second round they'll lose -- probably in 4 
>or 5.  If they face Minnisota in the second round, they'll win in 6.
> 
>After that they'll lose to Vancouver, maybe Calgary.

     I see it a little differently - I still think Detroit will be the
toughest team to beat come playoff time, and I really don`t think the
Leafs would come out on top against them.  Chicago, though, I think
they might be able to knock off.  Minnesota - who knows, given how
they seem to get so much tougher in the playoffs.  I wonder if the
Leafs might turn into that type of team under Burns?


> 
>Keep in mind that I'm making these predictions with the Leafs' current
>line-up (ie. Grant Fuhr in net) -- however, it's entirely likely that
>Fuhr won't be a Leaf come playoff time.  And if the Leafs are forced 
>to trade Fuhr (because of the expansion draft) they new players would
>probably cause me to re-evaluate.
> 
>Speaking of the expansion draft and that each team can only protect 
>1 goalie, is it possible that the Leafs could make a deal with another 
>team that would benefit both during the draft and then swap the 
>players back to their original teams afterwards?
> 
>For example, (as far as I know) each team can protect 9 forwards, 5 
>defenseman, and 1 goalie.  So, let's say Buffalo had 6 defenceman and
>0 goalie they wanted to protect and Toronto had 4 defencemen and 2 
>goalies they wanted to protect.  Could Toronto trade a goalie (Potvin) 
>to Buffalo for defenceman-x, either team could protect said players,
>and then at the end of the season they could trade the players back to 
>their original teams?  
> 
>I know it's theoretically possible, but would this be legal?  Who the 
>NHL management come down on the teams for pulling something like this?
> 
>I think that Fletcher wouldn't mind trading Fuhr, but I think he'd 
>like to keep him at least for this year's playoffs.
> 
>Stephen Leaf, er... Legge
>SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca


     I think it is possible to do the type of swapping you are talking
about (seems to me a bit of that sort of thing went on last expansion
draft), but it could be tougher to swing with players of this caliber.
Sure makes for a tough decision for the Leafs, though, doesn't it?
Much as I would hate to see it happen because of its effect on them
for this years (and next years) playoffs, if the decision has to be
made, I think I would trade Fuhr.  They would get a lot more for him,
and at best I could only see him help them get through one series or
so right now.  Might as well think more about going for the whole
enchilada in two or three years (geez, I'm still talking like a
deluded Leaf fan of the past - I wonder if things really are different now?).
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 1/9
Organization: University of Toronto Chemistry Department
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 09:32:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan10.044754.4161@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>They've been moving channels around in my cable system, but I found
>SCNY again today ...
>
>* Ray Bourque is steamed up at Bruins management and wants out. (!)
>A possible deal would be a package featuring Bourque for a package
>featuring Trevor Linden.
>

Cam Neely II...I heard rumours that Linden may be sulking a bit because
Modano was able to extract a contract for twice as much money from the
North Stars, than what Linden was able to extract from the Canucks...
the perils of signing first amidst a period of salary explosion...Linden
signed a four year contract...that was for too long a term in an era
of salary escalation if you have aspirations or think that you are
a superstar class of player.

>* Another trade rumour: Patrick Roy and Eric Desjardins for Luc
>Robitaille and Kelly Hrudy.
>

I'm beginning to feel sorry for Luc...he's the Kings most marketable
commodity, and thus always is involved in trade speculation, and through
all the speculation, which regularly reappears like clockwork, he
continues to consistently produce and perform.  He deserves a better
fate.

>* Paramount/MSG exec Stanley Jaffe may have been behind Roger
>Neilsen's firing, as Neil Smith had been away in Europe for
>two weeks ...
>

Which goes to show that even a suit can make a correct decision at
least some of the time...

...it's now shut-up-and-produce time for Messier...he is a brave soul
to assume responsibility for the 50 years, by forcing the coach he could
have always used as a scapegoat out of the organization...and in New
York none-the-less...if anyone doubted Messier's guts and courage
before, one can't any longer.  If the Rangers don't perform now, Messier
knows that it will be him that will be blamed.

We haven't had a player-coach in a while...we, in essence, do now.

Gerald
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WJHC: Final Scores and Standings
Organization: Ericsson Telecom, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 14:47:04 GMT


 1993 WORLD JUNIOR HOCKEY CHAMPIONSHIPS
 ======================================

       *******************************************************************
       * Congratulations CANADA !!  1993 World Junior Hockey Champions!! *
       *******************************************************************

 FINAL STANDINGS:   

		   GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P

 1. CANADA 	    7  6 0 1  37-17 +20  12
 2. Sweden	    7  6 0 1  53-15 +38  12
 3. Czechoslovakia  7  4 1 2  38-27 +11   9
 4. USA		    7  4 0 3  32-23 + 9   8
 5. Finland 	    7  3 1 3  31-20 +11   7
 6. Russia  	    7  2 2 3  26-20 + 6   6
 7. Germany	    7  1 0 6  16-37 -21   2
 8. Japan	    7  0 0 7   9-83 -74   0

 Canada wins gold due to head-to-head result vs Sweden.


 Saturday, December 26:		USA - Canada               0-3
				Sweden - Germany           4-2
				Russia - Japan            16-0
				Finland - Czechoslovakia   5-2

 Sunday, December 27:		Canada - Sweden            5-4
				Finland - Japan            7-0
				Germany - Russia           0-4
				Czechoslovakia - USA       6-5

 Tuesday, December 29:		Russia - Canada            1-9
				Sweden - Czechoslovakia    7-2
				Finland - Germany         11-0
				USA - Japan               12-2

 Wednesday, December 30:	Czechoslovakia - Russia    1-1
				Sweden - Japan            20-1
				Germany - USA              3-4
				Canada - Finland           3-2

 Friday, January 1:		Canada - Germany           5-2
				Russia - Finland           1-1
				Japan - Czechoslovakia     2-14
				Sweden - USA               4-2

 Saturday, January 2:		Finland - Sweden           2-9
				USA - Russia               4-2
				Japan - Canada             1-8
				Germany - Czechoslovakia   3-6

 Monday, January 4:		USA - Finland              5-3
				Czechoslovakia - Canada    7-4
				Russia - Sweden            1-5
				Germany - Japan            6-3


--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| contact for Swedish hockey  
Organization: H&SS Dean's Office, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 16:48:22 -0500 
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: puck in wrong net?


Thanks to everyone who replied to my "puck in the wrong net" question,
by either posting or sending me email.  I enjoyed reading them.

Mom.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: gjl@phx.mcd.mot.com (George Lloyd)
Subject: FAST 50 ANSWER
Followup-To: Alex Scoring Machine 
Organization: Motorola Computer Group, Tempe, Az.
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:24:50 GMT


From "the NATIONAL HOCKEY LEAGUE OFFICIAL GUIDE AND RECORD BOOK"

Most Goals, 50 Games From Start Of Season:

61 Wayne Gretzky, Edmonton 1981-82
   Wayne Gretzky, Edmonton 1983-84
54 Mario Lemieux, Pittsburgh 1988-89
53 Wayne Gretzky, Edmonton 1984-85
52 Brett Hull, St.Louis 1990-91
50 Maurice Richard, Montreal 1944-45
   Mike Bossy, New York Islanders 1980-81
   Brett Hull, St.Louis 1991-92

NOTE: The NHL does not have an "OFFICIAL" record for the fastest 50 goals.

Geoffrion DID score 50 goals in a season but he DID NOT do it in 50 games.

The NHL MUST consider how many games the TEAM plays in, NOT how many games
the player plays.  Jari Kurri scored 50 goals in his first 50 games of
1984-85.  Kurri scored his 50th goal in the teams 53rd game so he does not
get included in the above record.

*******************************************************************************
When I asked a Chinese Malay if he was going to give blood for a Blood Drive 
he said:
"What is inside a Chinaman should stay inside a Chinaman....
                               .....Unless there's money to be made from it!"
Ditto for Motorola's opinions!

George James Lloyd 
Motorola Microcomputer Division
2900 S. Diablo Way       DW234
Tempe AZ 85282
********************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: bse@controls.ccd.harris.com (Brian Eugley)
Subject: Bruins trade?
Originator: bse@rs2
Organization: Harris Controls
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 17:42:27 GMT


This weekend I read about a possible trade between Edmonton and Boston.
Bernie Nicholls for Vladimir Ruzicka and maybe other considerations.  Has anyone
heard anything about this?  As a Bruin fan, I would like to see a swap of Rosie
for Bernie.

Brian
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: ESPN Changes Game for Tommorrow
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1993 23:47:26 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO  80523

Couple notes:

ESPN has changed their game for tommorrow to Winnipeg-Los Angeles.  They
also have games scheduled for the next two weeks.

ABC has done their first promo for their NHL coverage, including the words
"Stanley Cup Playoffs" in what can be seen in 1993.

Also,  Prime and SportsChannel have officialy merged.  A little late, I
would say.


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  The redhead accross the aisle.           *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  --A student responding to the question   *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *    "what will I remember from Beginning   *
*  over 500 students served       *     Computing after I graduate."          *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: ESPN
Date: 8 Jan 93 00:41:53 GMT
Reply-To: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Distribution: na
Organization: The Bates Motel

mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:
>
>ESPN has changed their game for tommorrow to Winnipeg-Los Angeles.

Through the weekend, they were advertising NY Islanders at Buffalo
Sabres for Friday night, and my NY Times TV Listings still reflect
that.

>ABC has done their first promo for their NHL coverage, including 
>the words "Stanley Cup Playoffs" in what can be seen in 1993.

I don't watch NFL Monday Night Football, so I probably won't see them
'til my next Nightline, probably right after Saddam's anti-aircraft
batteries get bombed by the U.N. forces ...

>Also,  Prime and SportsChannel have officialy merged.  A little 
>late, I would say.

I dunno ... what might worry me is that the owners will have short
memories and get greedy, now that they'll have more coverage with all
of the Prime outlets available.  That, plus PPV and possibilities for
Disney At Night would be too tempting ... the UPI article that I just
read mentions that Prism and SC Philadelphia are included within the
sphere of "Prime SportsChannel Networks", having 41 Million homes
(but, we don't know just how much SC book-cooking is involved in those
figures; SC bamboozled the NHL with figures for *potential* homes, not
actual subscribers esp. for their pay services -- the NYT has a figure
of 16 Million homes in yesterday's Business section article on the
NHL, a far cry from the nearly 30 Million that they claimed upon some
sales of the SCA national games to third party outlets).  If anything,
I would worry for the future of hockey on ESPN.

Besides, the director of PSC will be James Dolan, who heads Rainbow
Communications (producer of "(Power Stick*) Hockey Week" among other
sports features) which is another arm of the Cablevision empire having
Chuck Dolan at the helm -- that name should ring a bell, he's trying
to buy the Islanders.

Paramount's MSG Network (Rangers/Knicks/Yankees) had been radically
changing its programme line-up since December, probably anticipating
this move and dropping its Prime affiliation since it is blood rivals
with SC New York.

gld

* On TSN, it's only "Hockey Week" ...
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@cunixd.cc.columbia.EDU 		President Bush should
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			pardon Amy Fisher NOW!
From: tj06+@andrew.cmu.edu (Thomas J. Joyce)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Tocchet-Jagr fisticuffs
Date: 11 Jan 93 08:21:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.0fIPeFq00iUy03b1h7
Organization: Administrative Computing & Info Services, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


These stories sound like a derivative of "Jagr sez this, Jagr sez that".

The way I heard it [from a reporter in the locker room] was that Jagr
stood up, bitching about not getting enough time on the power play.
Tocchet came over and pushed him into his locker and told him to shut up.

Granted, the original story is a little different. Both have a Jagr/Tocchet
scrap at the core. Probably a lot of heresay in both stories.

You have to ask the question: "By the time stuff like this gets to us,
how truthful is it?" Granted, the usual rsh reader likes hockey and
may feel close to the game. But do any of us work for the clubs themselves?
Even if somewhere were to, do you think they'd let negative stuff out
like this?

This isn't meant to defend Jagr. I have some friends who've met him at
nightclubs; their impression was that he came off as arrogant and a
real woman chaser.

tom
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: vlad@erg.sri.com (vlad)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry's Coach's Corner summary - Jan. 2
Organization: SRI International, Menlo Park, CA
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 93 19:39:05 GMT

In article <allan.726216257@st-lina> allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:
>
>
>Here's a summary of Don Cherry's coach's corner from January 4, 1993
>from a Calgary game at the Saddledome.

>
>He questioned Winnipeg
>management, whether this lesson was sinking in, and asked why
>they were stacking their team with Russians. 

Don's attitude towards hiring practices is not an unusual one. Without
delving into history, one can see today's German neo-Nazis preoccupied with
having too many Turks working in their country. In Russia itself, there are
numerous people meticulously counting the numbers of Jews in various
organizations (just to make sure that not too many of them are in one
place). Etc., etc.

But it is truly amazing that in a country like Canada, famous for its
anti-bigotry laws, you guys have your own xenophobe with his own
ultra-popular TV show, who raises this question of too many foreigners in
each and every show of his. 

By the way, is he also as hateful towards French-Canadians as he is towards
foreigners?

>
>Don recalled people who only a few years ago were criticizing Canadian
>coaching, saying they weren't teaching Canadians to skate, pass, etc.
>Only Don stood up to say Canadians were the best. 
>
>Finally, Don brought up the Spengler cup, where the Canadian team
>was thrown together, but still managed to win gold.
>
>Don finished with a message to kids... "Don't get caught in the
>'Canadian Syndrome', where if its Canadian its bad... [Canadians
>are best...Russians], they're nothing."


Gee, this man is a truly prolific thinker. He never repeats any one thought more
than 127 times in one show. 


Vlad

Employer disagrees




Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: kuip@sus.edu.eur.nl (F. Kuiper)
Subject: DUTCH CUP-FINAL + results and standings
Summary: dutch hockey final + results and standings from the NIJHB
Keywords: dutch hockey
Organization: EUR
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 12:46:23 GMT


Howdy Folks , 

Last wednesday the final of the dutch cup was played between Rotterdam and 
Geleen. It was a rough game , won by ... Geleen !

DUTCH CUP FINAL :

Gunco Panda's / Rotterdam   -   Meetpoint Eaters / Geleen  4 - 2  (0-0,2-1,2-1)

The final was played in Eindhoven, watched by 2200 hockey-fans (sold-out).


The results of last weeks games :

Last Tuesday :
Gunco Panda's / Rotterdam  -   Forbo Flyers / Heerenveen     1 - 5 

Last Wednesday :
Pro Badge / Utrecht        -   Lepelaers Trappers / Tilburg  3 - 8 (2-2,1-3,0-3)

Last Weekend :
Pro Badge / Utrecht        -   Gjaltema Rams / Assen        19 - 7 (5-2,8-3,6-2)
Flameguards / Nijmegen     -   Lepelaers Trappers/ Tilburg   6 - 7 (2-1,3-3,1-3)
Forbo Flyers / Heerenveen  -   Meetpoint Eaters / Geleen     6 - 3 (2-3,3-0,1-0)
Gjaltema Rams / Assen      -   Gunco Panda's / Rotterdam     1 - 4 (0-2,0-0,1-2)
Gunco Panda's / Rotterdam  -   Pro Badge / Utrecht           9 - 1 (7-0,1-0,1-1)
Meetpoint Eaters / Geleen  -   Flameguards / Nijmegen        9 - 2 (5-1,1-1,3-0)
Lepelaers Trappers / Tilburg - Forbo Flyers / Heerenveen     8 - 5 (4-0,0-3,4-2)


The standings now are :
        	
                 w	t	l	gp	pts
Geleen	        14	1	5	20	29
Rotterdam	13	2	6	21	28
Tilburg	        14	0	8	22	28
Nijmegen	12	1	8	21	25
Utrecht	        9	0	11	20	18
Heerenveen	8	2	11	21	18
Assen	        0	0	21	21	0

With only one week left to play, the first 4 teams are almost guaranteed to 
go to the play-offs, so the defending champion Utrecht will probably not make 
it. 
Next week is the last round of this season, see you then !.

Friso Kuiper
e-mail : kuip@sus.eur.nl
From: kim@guppy.uucp (Isaac Kim)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Stern the next Roberts....Nah
Date: 12 Jan 1993 05:35:41 GMT
Organization: UC San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: guppy.ucsd.edu

In article <1993Jan11.153728.3031@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>>My method of common Points/PIM would give the Man Byng to 
>>Kevin Stevens with Gary Roberts in second place.  This gives equal
>>credit for toughness and skill.  (BTW, watch out for Ronnie Stern
>>taking the Man Byng in a few years).
>
>As tantalizing as it is to envision from our standpoint as Flames fans, I have
>to disagree that Ron Stern will be the next Gary Roberts. Stern is a good
>skater and stuff, but does not have the hands necessary to put up Roberts-like
>points. All Stern will ever be good for is killing penalties and the 
>occasional fight. (Which, I have noticed, he very seldom wins). With Roberts,
>he had put up some big numbers in junior with the Ottawa 67's, and there was
>never any question that he had the talent to score in the NHL. The question 
>was always "when will he prove it?". With Stern, he will never prove it 
>because the talent isn't there.
>
>Sorry, Issac. I'd love to see you be right and have Stern develop into a
>Gary Roberts, but in my heart I know it will never happen.
>
>                                                               Alan

Sorry Alan, I was just joking about Ronnie Stern.  I think I put his
projected season point total at 71.  That would be a good career for
old Ronnie.  The little I seen of Craig Berube has surprised me since 
he seems to actually possess some skill, but again he will never be
in Robert's league.  Maybe Paul Kruse(sp)  ????

Isaac (kim@bull.ucsd.edu)

BTW Keep on sending those great Flames info-posts.