HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: d0per@dtek.chalmers.se (Martin Hiller)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: A2000-D??
Date: 10 Apr 92 08:49:17 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology, Gothenburg Sweden

hjalmar@cbmswe.se.so.commodore.com (Peter Hjalmarsson Sweden) writes:

[Deleted]

>Let me say this in bright bold letters:

>THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN A2000C or A2000D. There is only A2000A and
>the "usual" A2000. What people (stupid, ignorant dealers) mean when they
>say A2000C is rev.6 or later of the motherboard. PLEASE DEALERS, WE DON'T
>NEED ANY MORE USER CONFUSION!!!

>>Someone must know...(Dr P. Kittel vielleicht???)

>I think Peter and the others at Commodore Germany is busy telling the above
>to their dealers, at least I hope so.

>>- Martin
>>    // Martin Hiller (d0per@dtek.chalmers.se)| "You come from nothing,
>> \X/   Gothenburg, Sweden, Europe            |  What've you lost? NOTHING!"
>                    ^^^^^^ I felt kinda obliged to answer

I knew that, but I was wondering if anyone knew what the dealers meant.
But I thank anyway!

>Peter Hjalmarsson
>Amiga Support Engineer, Commodore Sweden
>hjalmar@cbmswe.se.so.commodore.com

-Martin


--
    // Martin Hiller (d0per@dtek.chalmers.se)| "You come from nothing,
\\ //  Chalmers University of Technology     |  you go to nothing.
 \X/   Gothenburg, Sweden, Europe            |  What've you lost? NOTHING!"
 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|  - Life of Brian (Monty Python)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: justin@mik.uky.edu (Justin Sullivan)
Subject: Re:  Mac OS just sucks -- "ease of use" = "lack of freedom"
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 12:45:25 GMT
X-Bytes: 

Philip McDunnough writes
> Word is totally inadequate for long technical documents. Why not ask the 
> AMS,etc...why they have standardized on TeX? AmigaTeX is every bit as
> good as any Unix TeX you will find. You basically don't know what you're
> talking about.

Word 5 is MORE then adequate for long technical documents. Word 4 was not.  
(FrameMaker was, though)
I am well aware of the fact that AMS has put their support behind TeX. That's  
because TeX can be used on any platform, and it does the job. Word 5 would make  
the job much easier, but not everyone uses a Mac. Most AMS members use UNIX  
systems or mainframes of some sort, where text is the only way you have to  
interact with the system (except for X). 

--
*******************************************************************************
* "Imagine sky.. High above, in Caribbean Blue.." <sigh>                      *
* The University of Kentucky doesn't pay well enough to share my opinions.    *
*******************************************************************************
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: 8939527@hydra.maths.unsw.OZ.AU ()
Subject: Re: Intel HW
Organization: University of New South Wales
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 11:13:34 GMT

In article <1992Apr11.060632.14773@ux.acs.umn.edu> har@ux.acs.umn.edu (--SeebS--) writes:
>In article <1992Apr11.052921.21547@sbcs.sunysb.edu> dtiberio@csws17.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio) writes:
>>In article <1992Apr10.213210.5408@seas.gwu.edu> gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
>>>In any event Mr. Shekhel did not say what performance he was comparing.
>>>Perhaps the 386 falls faster from a 2nd story window.
>
>>	You are so out of it that I can't believe you would think such
>>a thing. Now I know better than to listen to any more of this crap. I don't
>>care if you have been using a 486 or an XT; your personal opinion doesn't
>>mean anything. How dare you claim that the speed of a 386 is any different
>>than an A3000 when dropped from a 2nd story window...they both accelerate
>>at 9.8 meters per second, which is around 32 feet per second!
>
>Not necessarily; see, there is also air resistance, which is a function
>of size. So, like, you have to compare weight per square inch, at least,
>and possibly aerodynamic concerns.
>
>Perhaps Mr. Haynie can help us out here... What *is* the maximum airspeed
>of an unladen A3000?
>
 You all have it all wrong. You see it's like this. No theory no matter how wellproven via other theory, you cannot validate it unless you test it. You see we get to see people testing IBM's all the time. Woooo there goes another one out the window. Now thats fast. Now for the Amiga nobody has ever cosidered to even leav it next to a window. Aha and there's Blazmonge leave it out the window and it just floats, after a while it begins to rise !!! Now that's what I call a benchmark No diffrent optimised comp


ilers in site.
From: lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Jerry "knows" 486's faster than 68040.
Date: 10 Apr 92 20:21:22 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <1992Apr8.011715.20741@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au>, davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn) writes:
> In article <1992Apr7.165843.1@cc.helsinki.fi> lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi writes:
>>
> 
>>68040 has 8 general purpouse registers and 7 general purpouse data registers
>>(all 32 bit). Didn't 486 have 2 *general purpouse* registers and several
>>others? That means more register shuffle on 486.
> 
> I suggest you learn a little more about the 486 before flaming it.

Perhaps I should.

> User mode on the 68000 series has 8 data registers, which can be used
> interchangeably, and 8 address registers, one of which is used as the stack
> pointer.  All are 32-bit.  In the 386 (and 486), you have 4 "data" registers,
> called EAX to EDX, and 4 "address" registers, consisting of base pointer,
> source and destination indexes, and the stack pointer.  All of these are 32

So 486 has 4 general purpouse registers?

--
Jarkko Lindblad
lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi
From: kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Game Machine Specs
Date: 7 Apr 92 07:39:13 GMT
Organization: North Carolina State University

daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes:
>[...]  Aside that from that, few computers have sprites, DMA-driven sound,
>DMA-driven floppy, Copper, Blitter, or for that matter, DMA-driven hard
>disk (though you wouldn't count that in the Amiga chipset total anyway,
>that's System DMA not Chip DMA).  That's where all the numbers come from,
>but numbers are silly anyway.  

Well, no and yes.  They simply have to be used correctly.  Four audio DMA
channels isn't a silly number to point out if you're comparing to another
system with say, only one channel.  But yes, that oft-quoted "25 Amiga DMA
channels" is definitely silly when used in most comparisions.  Especially
when it seems to include chipram memory refresh.  Woof :-)

>The functions are what should be stressed.  If you have a pointer or other 
>small objects, sprites are extremely nice to have around -- it doesn't do you
>any good for a text-only system.  If you have multitasking, DMA driven I/O is 
>extremely nice to have around, it doesn't do you much good for a single
>tasking system.  People who like to argue over specifications generally get
>lost in numbers; what those numbers actually mean is far more important.

Exactly my point.  But you said it far better.

regards - kevin <kdarling@catt.ncsu.edu> <76703.4227@compuserve.com>
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:11995 comp.sys.mac.misc:8765
From: mike@maths.tcd.ie (Mike Rogers)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.misc
Subject: Re: Video Toaster
Date: 4 Apr 92 20:59:56 GMT
Organization: Sometimes found in a quite disorganized state in Trinity College
              Dublin. Freedom==Anarchy. My opinions are, like my total lack of
              organization, entirely my own fault.

In article <1992Apr2.003526.15902@seas.gwu.edu>, gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) wrote:
>Now that is the real point.  If you dislike the $4000 Video Toaster
>setup because it does not match the performance of a $500000+ setup,

Hmmmm. 500000 divided by 4000 equals 125.

That's a lot of toasters/inputs/keying/whatever, anyway you look at it.
-- 
Mike Rogers,Box 6,Regent Hse,##EveryoneHasTheRightToFreedomOfOpinionAndExpressio
TCD,EIRE. <mike@maths.tcd.ie>##nThisRightIncludesFreedomToHoldOpinionsWithoutInt
###############################erferenceAndToSeekReceiveAndImpartInformationAndI
deasThroughAnyMediaAndRegardlessOfFrontiers...#10 UN Declaration of Human Rights
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt)
Subject: Re: *** ULTIMATE BASHING for PeeCee Users
Organization: Occidental College, Los Angeles, CA  90041
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 00:30:35 GMT


What the bleep is OS/9?  Where can I get it?  What does it run on?

Thom

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: dano@usl.edu (Dan Stephenson)
Subject: Re: Amiga - Did I make a mistake?
Organization: Univ. of Southwestern Louisiana
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 04:19:28 GMT

philip@utstat.uucp (Philip McDunnough) writes:

>In article <1992Apr14.124834.24880@ms.uky.edu> justin@mik.uky.edu (Justin Sullivan) writes:
>[ ]
>>
>>UNDERSTAND COMPUTING!? PCs are not intended to sit on a desk and look pretty  
>>all day. They are not playthings. They tend to be very boring, yes (but have  
>>the greatest games.. :), but they are workhorses. That's why computing is here,  
>>and that is why it stays. Because it gets work done. If businesses did not  
>>consider computers useful, computing would have died out long ago (although we  
>>know this will never happen... just for the sake of argument).
>>Only an idle observation.. Time to get back to Windows 3.1 (with Civilization  
>>running in the background :)

>If it were up to business to lead the way in innovation we would all be using
>candles. There are other important uses for computers. Moreover, in my opinion
>if it's not fun, challenging,etc...it's not worth doing. I'd much rather
>work on a computer/article/book/etc...that I enjoy than on a "workhorse".
>The "workhorse" attitude has hurt a lot of very talented people.

The biggest uses of personal-level computers today is in business.
No two ways about it.  It is a solid foundation in the business field
which give a large user base and therefore much more incentive to
develop non-business things later.  That's why I see PC clones
eventually and soon enough doing anything any Mac or Amiga, etc. could
do, better/cheaper _because_ of a large user base=>competition,economy
of scale, etc.

Business leading the way wrt computer use seems inevitable.  Even a
really shitty spreadsheet is LOTS better than doing it by hand, for
example.  I personally find no great joy in traditional business apps 
(although word-processing can be interesting)(and look better than MY
handwriting :)  ), but like for several products, good product, all
wooing me with better and more feature, and incredible competition. This
means software and hardware.

I too would not 'enjoy' to sit around on Lotus123 all day long, but
I thik you're 'throw-it-out' attitude wrt the role of business is all
wrong. 

>>> Just my 2 cents worth.
>>
>>You forgot the tax.. 

>Sorry, my $2 worth.
Gawd, where do YOU live, in a high-tax urban area???
>Philip McDunnough
>University of Toronto
>philip@utstat.toronto.edu

Oh, I guess so. :)

-Dan
.

--
Daniel Anthony Stephenson, player of Praetorius, namer of The Solarium.
dano@srl01.cacs.usl.edu das9674@usl.edu
"I can be, what I want to, and all I need is to get my boogie
down"- Al Jarreau.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: 040 and 486 and nap42487 knows nothing about CPUs.
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 19:29:47 GMT

peterk@public.sub.org (Peter Kittel) writes:
>
>>Wow.  For a man of your education, a PhD, your attitude sure is arrogant.
>
>Well, I always *try* to be polite, but I don't always succeed.
>
>Yes, I really bash on Intel, I have very bad experiences with their
>design, and this I reported. And I got the impression that this opinion
>is shared by all people I know that come from the same experience,
>having programmed both brands. Why on earth is that arrogant?
>

Assuming that your opinion is shared by everyone else *is* arrogance.

>
>It appears more to me that you yourself don't really know much about
>all this stuff, so I would recommend you to check your wording and your
>real knowledge about the subject a bit better in future before posting.
>

Oh, *IT APPEARS TO YOU*, I see.  Why don't you tell me *why* it appears to
you that I don't know much about this stuff?  Could it be because I have the
temerity to disagree with thee?  A thousand pardons...

>
>Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel
>
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: johnsd2@jec307.its.rpi.edu (Daniel Norman Johnson)
Subject: Re: Mac OS just sucks -- "ease of use" = "lack of freedom" ?
Reply-To: johnsd2@rpi.edu
Organization: Information Technology Services, Rennselaer Polytechnic Institute.
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 20:58:26 GMT

In article <463@kas.helios.mn.org>, rhealey@kas.helios.mn.org (Rob Healey) writes:
|> In article <1992Mar30.094525.15388@srd.bt.co.uk>, jhawes@everest.srd.bt.co.uk (Jason Hawes) writes:
|> |> But having said that . . . x million Mac users can't be wrong . . . . .
|> |> they just need a different OS . . .
|> |> 
|> 	Sure they can be wrong, just like millions of PC users. It's
|> 	called the "lemming"/"pi'd piper" effect.

Of course they're wrong, they're not using Amigas are they? :)

Sorry, just could not resist. I actually agree, a lot of people
assume GUI=Macintosh (the way even more assume PC=IBM PC), and
this is incorrect.

|> As far as your mum
|> 	being able to use a Mac as opposed to a command line interface.
|>
|> 	I worked in student labs for 6 years, until a person was SHOWN
|> 	how to copy files on either machine they'd spin their wheels.
|> 
|> 	There is nothing inherently obvious about anything in the Mac
|> 	interface or Windows for computer illiterates. People have to be
|> 	shown at least once how to do something. This "inherently obvious"
|> 	claim is a pile of it no matter who is making the claim.
|>

Hmph. Lemee try to make it make more sence. A lot of people seem
to think the GUIs mean that you just touch they keyboard and...

	YOU HAVE SEEN THE LIGHT YOU KNOW HOW TO USE THE COMPUTER...

which, as you've noticed, is cow pucky. What GUIs do is minimize
how much you must learn, and how much you must remember.

for learning:
	THat's what a standardized UI is for (graphical or not);
	learn it once, you're done. Well, maybe not but at least you
	already know the basics (what's a button, a scrollbar, a
	menu, a window, etc)
	Also, it tries to have a metaphor. Ex: deleting a file in
	MacOS means putting it in the trash and emptying the trash.
	Not immediately obvious of course (it could be any number of
	other things) but once you have heard it once, the "trash can"
	serves as a reminder.

	That's how its supposed to work.

for remembering:
	The idea is that you should never *HAVE* to remeber anything.
	I wish. However, you don't have to remember commands (you can
	always go look), filenames (just point at it), what mode
	u r in (you minimuze modes, and have a visual representation
	of any that are left- you can always see that) and so on.
	There are still things that must be memorized (like what a mouse
	does), but its a big improvement IMHO. 

None of this is transmitted by osmosis, of course. You still have
to learn something, or you'll just be spinning your wheels.
-- 
			- Dan Johnson
And God said "Jeeze, this is dull"... and it *WAS* dull. Genesis 0:0
From: ajaffe@amiganet.chi.il.us (Adi Jaffe)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: *** ULTIMATE BASHING for PeeCee Users
Date: 6 Apr 92 04:02:18 GMT
Organization: Amiga Network Information Systems

In article <56840@cup.portal.com>, TomK@cup.portal.com (Tom R Krotchko) writes:
>Is it considered proper to poke the eyes of someone who says the
>initials GUI as "gooey"?

Saw some salesbabe on the Home Shopping Network say "Microsoft gooey" once..
Needless to say, I was throughly impressed at her technical knowledge--I mean,
she convinced me right off the bat that she knew EXACTLY what she was talking
about (haha, yea, right, and Elvis lives in my closet...)

Ive also heard some salesgoober on the same shopping network claim that the
"Intel 2-8-6 was the newest chip out on the market."







Talk about capitalizing on a buyer's stupidity..Then again, thats the IBM way.



DMK
Organization: The Leader Desslok School of Diplomacy
Date: Friday, 10 Apr 1992 01:17:31 EDT
From: Norman St. John Polevaulter <MBS110@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Game machines and such

In article <1992Apr9.052121.10584@seas.gwu.edu>, gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G.
Washington) says:
>I wonder about this.  Let us suppose that the A600 is priced at about $250.
>For those who want a game machine, this is still a bit high compared to
>SNES and Genesis.

A given, considering that it's a computer. Still, our games ARE cheaper...

> People who want an inexpensive home computer are more
>likely to look at cheap Intel PCs, since these are what the "average user"
>is familiar with.  People who are more familiar with computers, and the

Exactly what "cheap Intel PC" are you going to get for $250? A used
IBM PC/XT if you're LUCKY! You're certainly not going to get high-res
color graphics, impressive stereo sound, and a fantastic multitasking
environment such as WB2.0 in a $250 Intel machine!

The situation's quite familiar. C='s low-end stuff tends to be
unbeatable wrt bang-for-the-buck; C='s high-end stuff is admittedly
somewhat overpriced, assuming you're the sort of person who buys
personal computers based on statistics instead of whether or not
you enjoy using them. For enjoyment, the A3000 beats and will always
beat any Intel/MS-DOS machine hands down. Does anyone dispute this,
out of curiosity? I'd be interested to hear from someone claiming PClones
are more fun than Amigas...

>Amiga in particular, will not be happy with the A600.

With all due respect, us high-end weenies aren't the target
market for the A600. The target is the HOME COMPUTER MARKET.
There's a lot more of them than there are of us, and in fact they're
the ones who made Commodore a billion-dollar company, not us.
I can't fault Commodore for going where the big money is, especially
since history has shown that low-end success does not cause them to
ignore the high-end. We're going to get something, don't worry. I'm
not impatient, as I own the most fun computer on the market.

>I may be wrong; we will see.

I think you will be surprised.

Assuming the A600 ultimately settles to an excellent price like $250, that
is. (I wouldn't be surprised to see it start around $500 just to grab anyone
who's actually willing to pay that price, but ideally it should be at
$250 by Christmas. Come on, Commodore, you can do it...)

[Your blood pressure just went up.]       Mark Sachs IS: mbs110@psuvm.psu.edu
 DISCLAIMER: Penn State cares about my money, not my opinions.
  "All my father wanted to do was make a toaster you could really set the
    darkness on -- and you perverted his work into those horrible machines!"
From: costin@cs.mcgill.ca (Costin RIZAN)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Date: 10 Apr 92 02:15:49 GMT
Organization: SOCS, McGill University, Montreal, Canada

In article <7192@dirac.physics.purdue.edu> murphy@gibbs.physics.purdue.edu (William J. Murphy) writes:
>In article <1992Apr4.170302.12128@cs.mcgill.ca> jerry@cs.mcgill.ca (Gerald (Jerry) KUCH) writes:
>>In article <1992Apr3.204240.1975@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> nap42487@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Nishith A. Patel) writes:
>>>Also, I challenge Amiga owners to run their fastest serious app (as in their
>>>fastest CAD program, spreadsheet, or other processor intensive app for high
>>>end work) and compare it to the speed of the fastest app for that purpose
>>>available for the IBM under OS/2 2.0 (or a Windows app under Windows 3.1)
>>
>>Ok, so let's run Bob's Software Inc.'s "DildoCAD" on the Amiga, and then we
>>should compare it to SuperDuperInternationalMegaBusterKillerCorp's 
>>"BlazingDeathFastCAD" on the 486.  Sounds like a reasonable way to compare
>>the raw performance of the systems they're running under...
>
>I did this a few years back, Manx C 3.6 (I think) vs MicroSoft C 5.0.  I ran
>the Manx on an A2000, MSC on a 386 Zenith.  The A2000 had 2 floppies and
>3MB RAM, the PC had 80MB HD, 5MB RAM, and was 16 MHZ.  I compiled Tony
>Richardson's PLPlot library on both.  Guess which one was faster?  The
>Amiga!!  I think the main reason was on the Amiga, you could make the
>compiler resident using ARes or some such.  On DOS, I have never seen
>a mainstream compiler that could be used as a TSR, so you have to 
>load the compiler for each file you are compiling. 

	Actualy I believe that you could have the compiler reside
on a ramdisk. Never actualy tried it but I don't see why that
wouldn't work. 

>What a joke!

	Ha,Ha?!?!?
From: Mike_Whalen@agwbbs.new-orleans.LA.US (Mike Whalen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Wild rumor, potential for massive sea change in Amiga world...
Date: 13 Apr 92 18:53:35 GMT
Organization: The Amiga GateWay BBS * New Orleans, La.

In a message dated Mon 13 Apr 92 06:41, Leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (thomas Va
wrote:

> Can you say.... (deleted to save precious bandwidth from impending doom)

  Can you say.. tons o' kiddies saying "Mommie mommie.. I want the Amiga..
it's Nintendo k00l to the Macs.. er.. Max.. sorry guys.

  Can you say.. BIG Nintendo Exec: WHAT Softlogick doesn't want to give us
80% of their profits? The next incarnation of Amigas shipped out will have
a SoftLogick LOCKOUT CHIP!

  Can you say.. WordPerfect and Lotus turning up their noses COMPLETELY?

  Can you say.. Amigas the size of office furniture to hold all those
lock-out chips.

  Can you say.. Thirty new games in one month all centered around one main
program which was at one time Double Dragon 5 : The Search for Plot?

  Can you say.. A workbench which looks strangely enough like a Mega Man
game? (You must get through Level C to access CLI?

  Can you say.. I am running dry with these?

  Can you say...

I knew you could.. 

 (and as a tribute to Sam Kinison..) SAY IT SAAAY IT!



-- Via DLG Pro v0.991

Yet another fine quality message from.. Mike Whalen Brand Message Prod.
If you like it.. you like it.. if not... FNORD!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams)
Subject: Re: Will the Blitter become redundant?
Organization: James Cook University, North Queensland
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 92 01:32:55 GMT

In article <1992Apr7.140540.11864@uwm.edu> gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block) writes:
>Not even the 040 can outperform the blitter in all cases.  Not even in
>most cases.

What is this based on?  Remember that the 040 is much faster than an 030.
 
>Greg

-- 
Colin Adams         Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland
Shadowplay Software PO Box. 1201, Aitkenvale, 4814.  Townsville.  Australia.
I've seen you smile, but I've never really heard you laugh.  So who is rich
and who is poor I cannot say. - The Smiths
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy