HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brady@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (Sucks To Be Me)
Subject: New version of Mac ZIL?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 02:35:46 GMT

Is there a newer version of the infocom interpreter around that I could
get a hold of? I just found OLD versions of Zork I,II,III and Trinity,
but the interpreter is very old. It is the version that restarts the 
system after every quit. I am hoping to remove the old interpreter
and attach a newer one. What will this take? Will it cost? I am pretty
much a novice to heavy programming, so a detailed account of what this 
might take would be appreciated. That is, of course, if it is possible
at all!

To give you an idea of how old these versions are; the last time the 
Zorks were modified was 1984, and 1986 for Trinity.

WHOOPS... change the ZIL in the header to ZIP.

	thanks to anyone who can help,
		Sucks to be Me


-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
			    |If you ever fall off the Sears Tower, just go real
Sucks to be Me  	    | limp, because maybe you'll look like a dummy and
                            | people will try to catch you because, hey,
From: dmb@case.ai.mit.edu (David Baggett)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
Subject: Re: TADS e-mail address
Date: 11 Nov 1992 17:47:59 GMT
Organization: MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: case.ai.mit.edu

In article <1992Nov10.205406.19672@Princeton.EDU> jacobw@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Jacob Solomon Weinstein) writes:
>The e-mail address I have for Michael J. Roberts, creator of TADS, does
>not seem to be working.

You have to mail to his Compu$erve account now:

	<73737.417@compuserve.com>

Dave Baggett
--
dmb@ai.mit.edu           MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory                  
ADVENTIONS: interactive fiction (text adventures) for the 90's!
dmb@ai.mit.edu *** Compu$erve: 76440,2671 *** GEnie: ADVENTIONS
From: tbrengle@wiretap.spies.com (Tim Brengle)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
Subject: Re: Adl?
Date: 6 Nov 92 18:38:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: wiretap.BxB53z.3EH
Organization: Spies in the wire, information co-op, (408) 867-7400

It is gratifying to see that my old friend ADL is still alive in the
hearts and minds of designers.  :-)

Tom, I'm very interested in the mods that you made to our code.  Can I see 
them?

BTW, multiple actors worked great but multiple PLAYERS never got tested.
At the time there was no good way to handle it on all the architectures
in which we were interested.

If coerced, I might be able to dig up source to the CP/M version.
===========================================================================
Tim Brengle, co-designer of ADL
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: protonen@daimi.aau.dk (Lars J|dal)
Subject: Re: Advsys and Alan
Organization: DAIMI: Computer Science Department, Aarhus University, Denmark
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 15:11:57 GMT

Russell L. Bryan <rbryan@Mail.trincoll.edu> writes:

>I am personally an avid user of TADS, but I would be interesting in
>seeing these other two systems.  Is there a Mac port for them?  If so, is
>it shareware?  If the answer to either or both is "no," then ignore this
>message entirely.
>
>-- Russ

Yes, there is a Mac port. I quote from Dave Baggett's (regularly)
posting on the Unnkulian UnderWorld series:


> Appendix A
> -----------
>
> Where to get TADS via FTP:
>
> TADS is available for the PC, Mac, and Atari ST, from the following sites:
>
>	msdos.archive.umich.edu: msdos/games/textadv/tads.zip
>	atari.archive.umich.edu: atari/games/tads/tads.lzh
>	mac.archive.umich.edu:   mac/games/games.utilities/tads1.04.cpt.hqx
>
> TADS is also shareware, and we strongly encourage you to register if
> you use it since we feel it is a powerful, innovative, and very inexpensive
> development system that deserves to be paid for.

... and I would add that without the manual you won't get much fun of
the system.

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Lars J|dal                  | Q: What's the difference between a quantum |
| email: protonen@daimi.aau.dk|    mechanic and an automechanic?           |
|                             | A: A quantum mechanic can get his car into |
| Aarhus University           |    the garage without opening the door.    |
| Denmark                     |                    -- David Kra            |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: pww+@A.GP.CS.CMU.EDU (Peter Weyhrauch)
Subject: Consistency in Worlds
Originator: pww@A.GP.CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 21:41:57 GMT

Phil, you seem to have good ideas for the physical world consistency.

The Oz system also uses a link-based system to represent the physical
world.  And you are right -- maintaining consistency is tough.  In
addition to IN and ON, we had PART-OF as well, but that was not as
tough as IN and ON.  The advantage is that once you have the system
set up, extending the set of actions is easier.

Unfortunatly, that was just the beginning, since this didn't seem to
capture notions like doors.  I thought long and hard about how to
implement doors.  If a room (a container object) connects to another
room (another container object) through a door, how are all these
objects related?  We ended up implementing a general notion of
"connection" between any two objects.  These include both action and
sensing connections.  So, doors, phone-lines, telescopes, radios, and
the mail slot in the front door, which I never could get exactly
right.  (Here's a teaser: what can you see and hear if Andre the Giant
has just hung you on a coat-hook on one side of an open door?)

This leads to a general question of how realistic you want your world
to be.  An absolute simulation of the world is impossible, if you
believe the physicists, and presumable anything close is too
computationally expensive.  On the other hand, worlds with only ROOMs,
SOLID_OBJECTs, and PEOPLE might seem a bit limited.  The answer is
clear but unhelpful: do as much as you need to tell you story.
However, if you are building a general system, you have more than one
story to tell.

	Peter Weyhrauch
From: goetz@acsu.buffalo.edu (Phil Goetz)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
Subject: Re: >World simulation
Date: 11 Nov 92 23:09:59 GMT
Organization: State University of New York at Buffalo/Comp Sci

In article <appelo.721480775@dutiag> appelo@dutiag.tudelft.nl (C.J. Appelo) writes:
>
>I was thinking of modelling light, sound and air (or liquids), so you
>can specify how they "go through" (? what is that English word again?)
>objects. So, sound, for example, spreads among links in the semantic
>network. The volume reduces when it passes a link with a filter
>(a door, a container). For the birdcage the filter for air/liquids
>(or just substances) is 0 and for sound and light too. For a glass
>bottle the filter for light is (nearly) 0, for substances it is 100
>and for sound it is somewhere in between. (When a filter is 0 it lets
>everything through, when it is 100 it blocks.)
>
>This could be an answer to te problem Jamie mentioned, where walls
>should direct sound only in a single direction. It also solves 
>another problem I had with the idea of an area of effect. The area of 
>effect for sounds should be different for different sounds. You can
>hear a bomb explode on the other side of an island, but the singing
>of the bird will have much less influence (especially when he's in
>the swimming pool). The sound of the bomb will have a much higher 
>starting level. Also light and sound travel in different ways,
>and should have different areas of effect. You could easily model
>a recording studio, with a sound-proof glass window.

The idea of spreading activation for sound using filters is brilliant!
However, it requires a formalization of the connections between
locations.  The connections that {Peter Weyrauch?  Dave Bagget?
I can't remember} talked about in Oz might be like this.  But then you
also have to add containing as a "connection"; in this case the filter
between A and C is the object B which contains C and is in A.

Phil Goetz
goetz@cs.buffalo.edu

Disclaimer: My opinions do not reflect those of
the KGB.University of Buffalo.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: jamie@kauri.vuw.ac.nz (Jamieson Norrish)
Subject: Re: {Re: Re: Adv. generators}, Puzzles & Pulp IF
Organization: /u/student/jamie/.organization
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 21:36:37 GMT
	<1992Nov12.203225.14960@pollux.lu.se> <1dv99tINN8qb@life.ai.mit.edu>

In article <1dv99tINN8qb@life.ai.mit.edu> dmb@case.ai.mit.edu (David Baggett) writes:

   This does seem to be true, now that you mention it.  But conversely,
   wondrous places are easy places to create adventures.  To put it
   simply, it's hard to find a reason why there'd be a Cheez Door or a
   blessed +6 ring of Totally Kick-Butt Firebolts just lying around on the
   street somewhere.  But once you change to a fantasy setting, such
   things are acceptable without explanation!  In a fantasy setting,
   creativity is almost totally unconstrained.

I think that rather than creativity being almost totally
unconstrained, the need to justify what you create is missing, or at
least in many cases. I don't think this is a good thing; I would much
rather find an ordinary object in an ordinary setting, which had a
reason for being there, than finding an amazing object in an amazing
place, with absolutely no justification for it being there.

No matter what sort of setting you are creating, the same amount of
work needs to go in, I think, so that players can actually relate to
the environment, and everything in it. Just because it is a fantasy
setting does not mean that you can just stick in anything anywhere
with no explanation.

IMHO, of course.

Jamie
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: schwarts@cps.msu.edu (Steven Eric Schwartz)
Subject: Re: Adl?
Originator: schwarts@atlantic.cps.msu.edu
Reply-To: schwarts@cps.msu.edu (Steven Eric Schwartz)
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Michigan State University
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 15:53:49 GMT


Has anyone here ported ADL over to an Apple IIgs system using C?

-- 
Steven Eric Schwartz            "It's not safe out here. It's wonderous, with
(schwarts@cps.msu.edu)           treasures to satiate desires both subtle and
125 East Wilson Hall, MSU        gross.  But it's not for the timid."
East Lansing, Michigan  48825                           - Q, "Q Who"
From: dmb@case.ai.mit.edu (David Baggett)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
Subject: Re: So you want to write a text adventure?
Date: 11 Nov 1992 05:15:11 GMT
Organization: MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
NNTP-Posting-Host: case.ai.mit.edu

In article <1992Nov10.223307.12111@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> crawford@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (James E Crawford) writes:
>Where can I get TADS and (roughly) what price range am I looking at?

TADS is available for the PC, Mac, and Atari ST, from the following sites:

	msdos.archive.umich.edu: msdos/games/textadv/tads.zip
	atari.archive.umich.edu: atari/games/tads/tads.lzh
	mac.archive.umich.edu:   mac/games/games.utilities/tads1.04.cpt.hqx

I don't know what the current registration fee is, but it's somewhere
in the $30-$50 range.

Dave Baggett
--
dmb@ai.mit.edu           MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory                  
ADVENTIONS: interactive fiction (text adventures) for the 90's!
dmb@ai.mit.edu *** Compu$erve: 76440,2671 *** GEnie: ADVENTIONS
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: adam@owlnet.rice.edu (Adam Justin Thornton)
Subject: Re: >World simulation
Organization: Milo's Meadow
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 19:29:02 GMT

Wow.  Adding the physics of diffusion and reflection would
make for a very realistic setting.  Sure, it would be large
to encode, since the effect would be something like raytracing
(though each wall is, I guess only one point), but with today's
memory sizes...neat!  If anyone implements this, I'd love to see it.

I'd also like to see the ALAN Floyd code.

Adam
-- 
"And in the heartbreak years that lie ahead, |++| adam@rice.edu |++| Cthulhu
 Be true to yourself and the Grateful Dead." --Joan Baez  | 64,928 | fthagn!
"Very often, a common stone, thrown away and despised, is worth more than
 a cow." -- Paracelsus | If these were Rice's opinions I'd shoot myself.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: Russell L. Bryan <rbryan@Mail.trincoll.edu>
Subject: Re: Advsys and Alan
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A726A9A921013165@downes1-101.dynamic.trincoll.edu>
X-Xxdate: Wed, 11 Nov 92 17:14:33 GMT
Organization: Starving Writers of America (sole member)
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 17:12:10 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.151157.22777@daimi.aau.dk> Lars J|dal,
protonen@daimi.aau.dk writes:
>>I am personally an avid user of TADS, but I would be interesting in
>>seeing these other two systems.  Is there a Mac port for them?  If so,
is
>>it shareware?  If the answer to either or both is "no," then ignore this
>>message entirely.
>>
>>-- Russ
>
>Yes, there is a Mac port. I quote from Dave Baggett's (regularly)
>posting on the Unnkulian UnderWorld series:
>
>
>> Appendix A
>> -----------
>>
>> Where to get TADS via FTP:


Uh, Lars... I believe my message was requesting the location of one of
the other two systems.  I already have TADS.

-- Russ
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: tjfs@tadtec.uucp (Tim Steele)
Subject: Once again: any help on Bureaucracy?  Lost posting?
Organization: Tadpole Technology plc
Distribution: rec
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 22:51:46 GMT

I gather from someone that a posting may have been made in reply to my
request for hints on Bureaucracy, but I'm afraid I didn't get it.
Could I ask the person who posted to post again and/or mail me direct?

Thanks



Tim
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: Russell L. Bryan <rbryan@Mail.trincoll.edu>
Subject: TADS -- Course Announcement
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A72948E9A3033165@downes1-101.dynamic.trincoll.edu>
X-Xxdate: Fri, 13 Nov 92 16:58:33 GMT
Organization: Starving Writers of America (sole member)
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 16:56:02 GMT

I now have nineteen applications for the TADS course.

I truly had no idea that the idea would be so popular, and quite
honestly, I'm a little overwhelmed.  Offering the course for free was a
fine idea when I thought I would be dealing with five to ten people, but
every morning another three applications show up in my mailbox.  This is
not a complaint, because I really am excited to have so many people
interested, but it does mean that I'll have to do a lot more work and
take a great deal more care in constructing the lessons.

With this in mind, I have decided to put off the first lesson until
January 30th, when I know that everyone will be back from vacations and
such.  In addition, if there is anyone here who already knows TADS pretty
well, I could use a partner, if you've got the time.  I've made a
commitment, and intend to keep that commitment.  However, I can take only
one more application at this time.  An even twenty will go through the
course, from beginning to end -- they will, essentially, be beta testing
the course for me.  When all is finished, the lessons will be revised
according to the comments of the "students," and a new course will be
offered again in the summer of '93.

The course for '93 will NOT be free.  By that time, I will have invested
so much time into developing the course that I will not be able to
justify the work without receiving some compensation.  However, at this
moment the course is still completely and utterly free of charge.  If
you're even thinking of getting yourself invovled with TADS (The Text
Adventure Development System), then send me your request now and register
your copy before January 31st.  There will be a waiting list set up in
case people presently enrolled choose to drop out.

-- Russ
From: dag@hpsemc.cup.hp.com (David A Graves)
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 19:28:29 GMT
Subject: Re: TADS e-mail address
Organization: HP VAB Programs
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction

Michael Roberts gives his Compuserve and GEnie email addresses in the TADS
manual.  They are 73737.417@compuserve.com and M.ROBERTS10 on GEnie.
Email to any other addresses (such as his place of employment) is not
appropriate.

By the way, the zip code for High Energy Software is incorrect in Russel
Bryan's posting.  The correct address is:

       High Energy Software, 
       P.O. Box 50422, 
       Palo Alto CA 94303.

It's nice to see increasing interest in the TADS language. 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: Russell L. Bryan <rbryan@Mail.trincoll.edu>
Subject: Advsys and Alan
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A724954A1D013165@downes1-101.dynamic.trincoll.edu>
X-Xxdate: Mon, 9 Nov 92 22:23:06 GMT
Organization: Starving Writers of America (sole member)
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 03:20:45 GMT

I am personally an avid user of TADS, but I would be interesting in
seeing these other two systems.  Is there a Mac port for them?  If so, is
it shareware?  If the answer to either or both is "no," then ignore this
message entirely.

-- Russ
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
From: jacobw@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Jacob Solomon Weinstein)
Subject: TADS e-mail address
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 20:54:06 GMT

The e-mail address I have for Michael J. Roberts, creator of TADS, does
not seem to be working. Could somebody please e-mail me the correct
e-mail address for him? 

Thanks.
From: max@west.darkside.com (Erik Max Francis)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
Subject: What do you need in an adventure generating system?
Date: 7 Nov 92 21:04:50 GMT
Organization: The Dark Side of the Moon +1 408 245 SPAM

I had recently worked out an object-oriented adventure generating system 
that resembled LISP, and was very excited about it.  (It was going to be 
called GOOGOL, for Generic Object-Oriented Game Operating Language.)  
Unfortunately, I soon discovered advsys, which is almost exactly the same 
-- and it certainly has exactly the same basis.

I'm wondering if people are happy with the current adventure generating 
systems that are out there.  I'm not trying to start a 
"my-adventure-generating-system-is-better-than-yours" war; I'm curious if 
people think that their needs, insofar as generating adventures, is being 
met by what's out there.

I'm still interested in GOOGOL, or at least OOP adventure generating 
systems in general, and am wondering if people have specific gripes about 
the software that's out there, and if 1. it would be useful to start over 
with another perspective, and 2. what limitations are frustrating people.

Thanks.

----------
Erik Max Francis   Omnia quia sunt, lumina sunt.  Coming soon:  UNIVERSE _ | _
USmail:  1070 Oakmont Dr. #1 San Jose CA 95117  ICBM:  37 20 N  121 53 W _>|<_
UUCP:  ..!apple!uuwest!max   Usenet:  max@west.darkside.com   464E4F5244   |
From: crawford@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (James E Crawford)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
Subject: Re: So you want to write a text adventure?
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:33:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: jhunix.1992Nov10.223307.12111
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore

Where can I get TADS and (roughly) what price range am I looking at?

Jim
From: Jack.Smoke@launchpad.unc.edu (Jack Smoke)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.bodyart
Subject: Re: advice for nose piercing (first  time)
Date: 5 Nov 92 21:40:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: samba.1992Nov5.214041.4839
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service

In article <MUMBLE>jpage@hamp.hampshire.edu writes: >
>
>
>okay...ive  read all of the advice given about how to take
>care of a pierced nose....im thinking of getting my nose pierced..
>what im looking for is advice on HOW to do it....
>cann i get the piercing stud at an earring store?
>is it better to do it yourself or have someone else do it
>?
>
>any adivce fromm those  who successfully pierce their nose?
>_jen  

First, I would suggest NOT using a regular stud.  If you put the back
on, it can be too tigt, hard to clean, and a host of other problems.
If you don't put the back on, you run the risk of loosing the stud.

Try either an Indian nostral stud (Looks like an earing with a wierd
back).  These are becoming more widely available in headshops and what
not, but if you can't find one, try Gauntlet mail order.  Or use a ring.

Use a proper piercing needle.  Again, these are available from Gauntlet.
If you're stoic, you could probably do it yourself, but it's a lot
easier to get a friend to do it.

Walk in Beauty.

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: rec.arts.bodyart
From: jpage@hamp.hampshire.edu
Subject: my apologies.....
Organization: Hampshire College
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 21:41:38 GMT

Hi there folks...
i just got done reading all of the "body art police' postings, andd
again, I want to stress that my statement was very harsh and
did not mmean for it to read that way.  I am new to the net
and am not really knowledgeable of the etiquette....

And are all private postings supposed to stay private unless?

All points taken.....thanks for all of your resposes....I would have
never known I was not communicating correctly without your
feedback.....

Boy, do I feel stupid.  :)
-j
Newsgroups: rec.arts.bodyart
From: tjreynol@zephyr.cair.du.edu (five left and cut!)
Subject: Re: unsafe piercing and supplies
Organization: University of Denver
Distribution: rec.arts.bodyart
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 22:33:50 GMT

I bought a needle from the same place that was definitely not old
and worn. I trusted that it was sterile, it sure seemed new to me.
Since the place sells Gauntlet needles, I wonder if someone at 
Gauntlet had screwed up. Would blood and tissue remain moist in 
a sealed needle package? I just don't see how they could use the 
needle over and over, and repackage it. The shop is a reseller.
Not a manufacturer. Since one of the artists/piercers there has
won the 'Best of Denver' award for two years in a row, I seriously
doubt he would risk his reputation on a $2 needle.

Just my 600 pesos.
Tim
Newsgroups: rec.arts.bodyart,alt.postmodern,alt.sex,alt.tasteless,alt.religion.scientology,alt.good.news
From: tpehrson@javelin.sim.es.com (tim clinkenpeel)
Subject: Re: Phineas Gage
Reply-To: tpehrson@javelin.sim.es.com
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 00:36:36 GMT

jrsmith@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (J. R. Smith III) writes:

>...
>	Hey, anyone else remember Phineas Gage from the old Ripley's strip?  
>He was the railroad worker who got a steel pipe blown through his skull in
>an explosives accident, and lived happily to show off his new blow-hole.
>(You may have seen Ripley's neat drawing of Gage in the title sequence of the
>short-lived Ripley's TV series a few years ago.)

>	Anyway, to make a long story short, where can I get a piercing
>like that?  I think it would be cool to walk around with a bar or sword 
>Sticking out of my face.  And if people made fun of me or tried to put
>me in a freak show, I'd pull out the bar and hit them with it!  Neat.
>What doctors are licensed to do this piercing?  Anyone near Boston?

yes, but do you also recall the end of this tale?  after the accident, mr.
gage was quite the different man in regards to personality.  whereas he
formerly was a respectible, hard-working and kind individual,
post-head-piercing he was quite the irascible, uncooth drunkard.  now i'm not
saying the latter behaviors are to be shunned, rather that perhaps your new
personality would not care for the gaping orifice through your puss.  

something to consider.
-- 
	       there is no religion when a man has  good curry
				       -
      tim clinkenpeel: aberrant analytical skeptical agnostic idealist.
		     -- i exclusively represent myself --