From: cpage@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Carter C Page)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian
Subject: Re: ECSTACY followup
Date: 19 Nov 92 07:13:59 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

This discussion originally was about the use of ecstacy.  I know very little 
about that drug in particular, but I have always felt that *every* drug that 
has an effect on the mind is spiritually dangerous.  God gave us a rational
mind and any affect that a drug (alcohol included) might have on it allows
the opportunity for Satan to delude us.  Another point to raise about illegal
drugs would be their physically harmful effects.  If I do anything to 
intentionally destroy my body, I would be slapping our creator in the face.
The following is taken from the article that sparked my interest in this
discusion:

The article says:
>it's a well-known fact that these drugs are safer than alcohol, yet alcohol
>is legal.  We live in a hypocritical society.  People are dropping like flies
>as a result of alcohol, and families are being ruined.
("these drugs" refers to ecstacy, LSD, etc.)

I totally agree that there is hypocrisy in a society that pretends that alcohol
is not a harmful drug, but to pretend that other drugs are not harmful is
ludicrous.  I have an old schoolmate who used LSD once and would be happy to 
tell you about the dangers of LSD.  That is, whenever he happens to wake from 
his coma.  Drugs are dangerous and unpredictable.

>	I'm not advocating the use of drugs, and I certainly agree that they
>induce unreal feelings.  What I'm saying is that in some cases, these false

Two observations:
1) Previously, LSD is described as a "sensory-enhancer" in this article.  
   Induction of unreal feelings is *NOT* sensory-enhancement!
2) "Unreal" is the part that gets you into the most trouble.  God created a 
   real world.  Losing touch with that reality will cause someone to lose touch
   with God, with eternal consequences.

>My best friend, who had a
>hideous childhood and for a long time didn't care about living, tried ecstacy
>this past summer.  The change in his attitude toward the world is phenomenal.
>Before he was full of hatred and depression.  Now, when my friends meet him,
>they think he's one of the most hyper, happy people they've ever met.  And
>no, he doesn't need it all the time to stay that way.

This is a drug enduced happiness.  I'm sure that after you jump off a cliff, 
you get a pretty cool feeling while you think your flying--before becoming a
piece of modern art.  This may sound like an extremely harsh comparison for 
"minor" drugs, but I think it clarifies the whole point.  Feelings come and 
go. It is apparent that many people think that good feelings are the key to 
life, but there is only one key to Life: Jesus Christ.  Once someone relies 
on anything but God, he's bound for a fall.

>to heal a lot of hatred and misguided ideals in this world.  The Holy Spirit,
>idealistically, is the true answer to the world's problems.  But there are 
>a lot of people out there who cannot relate to religion.  Charles Manson,
>for instance:  Sure, you can put a Bible in front of him and tell him it'll
>change his life, but I'd be willing to bet my life savings he'd stay the same.
>On the other hand, if you put a pill in his mouth, he'd be giving you hugs.

The Holy Spirit, along with the Father and Jesus, are *realistically* the 
answer to the problems of those who live in the world.  If you give Charles 
Manson a drug which has him giving you hugs, that would be pretty amazing; but
false affection induced by false emotion will not help anything.  Just to 
reitterate my whole point, a drug may effect you today and tomorrow, but 
knowing Jesus Christ has an eternal effect.  And that is real.

>certain people.  It's a very mild drug (in addictiveness), and I've never
>known anyone who has ruined their life because of it.  That, certainly,
>does not follow Satan's ideals.

At *any* level of addiction, something besides God has control over that
persons life.  The only other cosmic force that seeks control is Satan, by that
line of reason, I totally disagree with this argument.  I hope everyone who 
believes that drugs do not harm one's relationship with God would prayerfully
rethink his position.  May God guide all of our hearts in understanding.

>						Increase the peace!!!
						(Through Jesus Christ)

			Love in Christ's name,
				Carter Page