HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: spain@galvia.enet.dec.com ()
Subject: Re: Terrorists
Reply-To: spain@galvia.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 20:46:30 GMT

--
In article <Bz3KAt.L11@newcastle.ac.uk>, D.A.Harrison@newcastle.ac.uk (Dave Harrison) writes:

|>>What of the terrorist actions by the  prod. provos such 
|>                                             ^^^^^^
|>>as the UDA (recently banned political group, when in reality
|>>a terrorist group) and the UFF?
|>
|>So far as I am aware there is nothing provisional about the
|>UDA and the UFF. The usual term for such groups is 
|>"paramilitaries" or "terrorists" (the choice of term depends
|>largely on the opinions of the speaker).
|>
|>I'm probably wrong about this, but I wonder if Sean's use of the 
|>term "provos" is the context of the UDA / UFF is a symptom 
|>of a wider lack of knowlege and / or understanding of the 
|>situation in the north of Ireland. 
|>

The provos is a slang term for the Provisional IRA.  There was a split
in the 70s into the official and provisionals.  Paramilitaries and
terrorists are generally used for all terrorist organisations including the 
IRA and Loyalist terrorists.  The term "Provos" generally means the IRA.
  

       Gary Spain, DEC, Galway, Ireland   - spain@galvia.enet.dec.com

  On being a football fan: "I am aware of the downside to this wonderful 
  facility that men have: they become repressed, they fail in their 
  relationships with women,their conversation is trivial and boorish, they 
  find themselves unable to express their emotional needs, they cannot relate
  to their children, and die lonely and miserable. But you know, what the hell?"
								   Nick Hornby 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: walker@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Graham Walker, 227 West Old Main,268-3847,)
Subject: Re: Scottish Kings and Queens (long)
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 16:04:08 GMT

From article <1992Dec16.095135.1@csc.canterbury.ac.nz>, by phys218@csc.canterbury.ac.nz:
> 1107-1124               Alasdair I, son of Malcolm III.
> 1214-1249               Alasdair II, son of William.
> 1249-1286               Alasdair III, son of Alasdair II.
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Lyndon Watson                              L.Watson@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wern't all of thes Alasdairs Alexanders?

						GW

Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: mh10006@cl.cam.ac.uk (Mark Humphrys)
Subject: Re: Ireland...Catholic Church
Organization: U of Cambridge Computer Lab, UK
Distribution: soc.culture.celtic
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 17:40:48 GMT

In article <RUAIRI.92Dec10210123@silvia.sy.ssl.fujitsu.co.jp>, ruairi@sy.ssl.fujitsu.co.jp (Ruairi.H) writes:
|> 
|> 	
|> 	I remember hearing a few years back ( high school ? ) that the
|> group with the highest ratio of violent deaths (ie the most dangerous
|> category of person to be) was an unborn child in America.
|> 	I, personally, find this repulsive and while not against
|> abortion in all cases am against abortion on demand.  If, as it
|> appears, the majority of Irish people agree with this it means we
|> live in a democracy not the 15th century.
|> 
|> 	And no I'm not very religious ............


 1. I *don't* think that the majority of Irish people agree with you any more.

 2. Even if they did, who cares?
    If democracy is brute majority rule, then Iran, Hitler's Germany 
    and pre-1968 Northern Ireland are/were examples of democracies.
    Minorities and individuals have rights too,
    no matter what the majority says.

 3. You are male. Let women choose what to do with their own bodies.

- Mark Humphrys
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams)
Subject: Re: What is sago?
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, California
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 18:22:05 GMT

> esh2@po.CWRU.Edu (Evelyn S. Hlabse) writes:
>
>I have a cookbook called "Recipes from the Orkney Islands" published
>in 1978.  One of the recipes for a tomato soup calls for something
>called sago.  I've never heard of it.  Can someone help?

Though my dictionary says otherwise, I've always heard
it's the same thing as semolina...
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
rod williams -=- pacific bell -=- san ramon, ca -=- rjwill6@pacbell.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: This Favourite Lie Again
Date: 17 Dec 92 19:06:45 GMT
Organization: U of Arizona CS Dept, Tucson

In article <20159.2b2f8da8@ul.ie>, byardd@ul.ie writes:
> In article <27891@optima.cs.arizona.edu>, gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell) writes:
> >  Of course they have a case. How can you argue with it? The damn Republic
> > continues to look like the last bastion of 15th century thinking left
> > in the western world - I am frequently shocked and disappointed at the
> 
> Thats funny coming from someone living in a country whree the Death Penalty
> is still in operation.

 I know I couldn't sleep for weeks after Ted Bundy got snuffed... cried
like a baby. Poor guy. So he killed and mutilated a couple dozen 
coeds and a small girl - so what? It would be wrong to allow the state
to kill him.... 


					gln
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8145 soc.culture.british:17503
From: fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Date: 15 Dec 1992 05:39:47 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

In article <1992Dec14.163027.3496@newstand.syr.edu> crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea) writes:
>In article <1992Dec12.033652.688@fwi.uva.nl> hm@fwi.uva.nl (Hans Mulder) writes:
>>In <JIM.92Dec11122231@hunter.cs.strath.ac.uk> jim@cs.strath.ac.uk (Jim Reid) writes:
>>>As for Queen Elizabeth, she is known as Elizabeth the Second. This is
>>>misleading as the nation she rules has not had a Queen Elizabeth
>>>before. Some Scots find this offensive, since Scotland has never
>>>had a Queen called Elizabeth until now, although England had one
>>>during the 17th(?) century. 
>>
>>Lots of countries have queens known Elizabeth the Second:
>>Antigua & Barbuda, Australia, Bahamas, Barbados, Belize, Canada,
>>England, Grenada, Guernsey, Jamaica, Jersey, Man, Mauritius, New Zealand,
>>Papua New Guinea, Scotland, Solomon Islands, St. Kitts & Nevis,
>>St. Lucia, St. Vincent & the Grenadines, Trinidad & Tobago, Tuvalu.
>>
>>How many of these have had queens called Elizabeth before?
>>
>Actually, considering when they were claimed by England, virtually
>all these countries, with the exception of the far Eastern/Pacific
>dominions, had an Elizabeth I, including Canada and everything in the
>Western hemisphere...except Jamaica and Belize, I believe.
>
>Chris the Smartass Imperial Historian
>`
Er, given that with the exception of Man, Guernsey and Jersey, all the
above became English (or British, for those acquired after 1707)
after Elizabeth Tudor had gone to meet her maker, that is more than
doubtful.


-- 
____________________________________________________________________
Dawn over the dark sea brings on the sun;                      
She leans across the hilltop: see, the light!
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Economist Article On Irish Election
Date: 16 Dec 92 10:13:45 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

In article <1992Dec15.145918.28845@news.nd.edu> ulick@michaelangelo.helios.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford) writes:

   Thanks for posting - the typical British Propaganda type piffle I have 
   come to expect from 'Business' publications. 

Don't worry, the Economist always talks rubbish.  It's an extremely
frustrating magazine, because it's packed with interesting facts and
pathetically stupid opinions/bigotry, hopelessly mixed together.
--
	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)

		
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: walker@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Graham Walker, 227 West Old Main,268-3847,)
Subject: Crimmond
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 17:24:42 GMT

From article <1992Dec17.162652.10210@spider.co.uk>, by alisonjw@spider.co.uk (Alison J Wyld):
> 
> 23rd Psalm, also known as "The Lord's My Shepherd".  Usually sung a
> funerals.  I've always been told that it has particular associations
> with Scotland, particularly when sung to "Crimmond" (the tune thats
> used at funerals).  Its also often sung at Weddings.  I believe its
> because its one of the 3 hymns everyone knows (Morning has Broken and
> Abide With Me being the other two)
> 
> Alison.

The tune is named after a small village in the NE of Scotland of the
same name. Also this is the village were Edward Griegs grandparents came
from; I believe the changed their name from Greig (ei being pronounced
as the e in egg) to Grieg (ie being pronounced as the ee in keep); alos
I know the spelling of the names is probably wrong but the pronouncation
is right.

I also heard or read that one of Immanual Kant's grandparents came from
Scotland. Is this true?

												GW
p.s. Crimmond is near Mormond Hill as in the whaling song sung by many
and in particular Judy Collins.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: Gerry.Mulvenna@launchpad.unc.edu (Gerry Mulvenna)
Subject: Re: Scotland Demands Democracy!
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 16:06:17 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.150224.29006@news.nd.edu> ulick@michaelangelo.helios.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford) writes:
>In article <1992Dec15.130034.17226@samba.oit.unc.edu> Gerry.Mulvenna@launchpad.unc.edu (Gerry Mulvenna) writes:
>>reassured that it was so well supported.  I remember similar media treatment
>>meted out to a 20,000-strong Poll Tax demo in Edinburgh some years ago.
>>
>>It is odd how 1000 demonstrators in Moscow seems to be more news-worthy
>>than 100,000 muslims in London or 10,000 Republicans in Belfast etc etc.
>
>What's odd about it????  Are you in Belfast or Chapel Hill (just curious).

Ulick, I am bemoaning the fact that national media have a tendency to
take an interest in distant social movements often averting their eyes
from equally or more significant (in terms of population) movements 
on their own doorstep.

Unfortunately, the only way I can presently access Netnews is by
TELNETing to Chapel Hill which explains my odd signature.  Does anyone
know how I could supplant this default with my own?

Gerry Mulvenna (osg1688@v2.qub.ac.uk)
Belfast, Ireland

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Pogues BOOTLEGS!
From: <MIWHC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Sunday, 20 Dec 1992 00:40:02 EST
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

I have one Pogues bootleg from Italy on disc and feel that unless I can
get more rare Pogues stuff (and early albums) ASAP I may well take to
gettin in ma kayak, headin down the Hudson, takin swallers a mung, and
paddle out to sea. My Pogues empitness is hurtin so bad I'm damn near
close to siphonin the oats outa a horses arse.

                             --- Rick Yukon, the Trailblazer.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
From: crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea)
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 13:18:41 EST

In article <1gjr34INN1o8@network.ucsd.edu> fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister) writes:
>>>
>>Actually, considering when they were claimed by England, virtually
>>all these countries, with the exception of the far Eastern/Pacific
>>dominions, had an Elizabeth I, including Canada and everything in the
>>Western hemisphere...except Jamaica and Belize, I believe.
>>
>>Chris the Smartass Imperial Historian
>>`
>Er, given that with the exception of Man, Guernsey and Jersey, all the
>above became English (or British, for those acquired after 1707)
>after Elizabeth Tudor had gone to meet her maker, that is more than
>doubtful.
>

Are you SURE of that statement? Elizabeth gave Sir Walter Raleigh and
Sir Humphrey Gilbert letters of marque to attack all Spanish ships
of the main and the general theatre of war--on a grand scale--was the
Caribbean. Several Caribbean islands were taken in the 1580's and 1590's
to launch what did become mainland assaults on the Yucatan Penninsula! 
Barbados, too, was in full swing as a sugar slave island by the 1590's
because we know that the prisoners of the failed Revolt of the Earls 
in Ireland spent the rest of their lives in what was sardonically referred
to as "New Ireland"  because of the high number of indentured Irish
sugar workers. 
Canada, too, was partially in English possession by 1603 because Humphrey 
Gilbert and Raleigh established bases in Newfoundland. 

So there was an Elizabeth I by 1603 in several of what became the 
Dominions.

Of ourse, the whole argument is facetious. It doesn't matter a
fig, because England is and always has been the ONLY nation of the
United kingdom that really mattered throughout its history.

Chris Still the Smartass

fig, because Englan
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: erich@wubios.wustl.edu (Erich Schraer)
Subject: Re: Scottish Kings and Queens
Organization: Division of Biostatistics, WUMS, St. Louis, MO
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 21:37:52 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.093758.1@csc.canterbury.ac.nz> phys218@csc.canterbury.ac.nz writes:
>Graham Walker asked, "Wern't all of thes Alasdairs Alexanders?"
>
>Yes, that's the English name that they're given, just as the Conns are
>all called "Constantine" in English.  While I'm sure that "Conn" is an
>old Irish name (Conn of the Hundred Battles and all that), so that
>"Constantine" is just an arbitrary translation, for all that I know,
>"Alasdair" may be a Gaelicised form of "Alexander".
. . .
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Lyndon Watson                              L.Watson@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
>------------------------------------------------------------------------

Actually these Conns should be Constantines (or Gaelic versions).  The
Latin name Constantinus was borrowed into Gaelic very early.  The form
Constantine is an anglicization--the form I've seen most often in old
chronicles and synchronisms for these three kings is Causantin.  I've
never seen anything in Gaelic or English that called them Conn.  It's
also interesting to note that Constantinus was popular as well in Welsh
where it takes the form Custennyn.

				--Erich
--
  / Erich Schraer                               St. Louis, MO  63110 \
 /  Division of Biostatistics                 erich@wubios.wustl.edu  \
 \  Washington University School of Medicine    Voice: (314)362-3681  /
  \ 660 S. Euclid Ave., Box 8067                  Fax: (314)362-2693 /
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: esharp@sage.cc.purdue.edu (The Baker)
Subject: Song.
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Distribution: all
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 00:53:19 GMT

 Last night my sister was telling me about a song she had heard being sung
in an Irish-theme bar.  While I know it could very well be just a song that
this group that was playing might have written, I was wondering if it
IS a "real" (i.e. widespread) song, and what it is called.  Here is what my
sister told me the chorus was: "Wer'e on the one road, maybe the wrong road,
we're on the road to God knows where."  That's all I know of it.  If you
have any information on it, please contact me.  

******************************************************************************* All animals are strictly dry, they sinless live and swiftly die.
But sinful, Ginful, beer soaked man survives three score years and ten
                                                -origin unknown-
*******************************************************************************
Edwin Sharp
esharp@sage.cc.purdue.edu
From: calum@ivy.clu.cf.ac.uk (Calum Gordon)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Edinburgh Demo
Date: 15 Dec 92 15:40:11 GMT
Reply-To: Calum Gordon <calum@clu.cf.ac.uk>
Organization: Computational Linguistics Unit, Univ of Wales College of Cardiff
Posting-Software: GNUS: NNTP-based News Reader for GNU Emacs

How about some news about the Edinburgh Homerule demo last weekend,
from those that were there. We don't get the scot.* groups here and
the media coverage was woefull. According to more than one "quality" paper
the question has been buried since the election, although on recent 
trips north i've found this to be far from the case. Another example
of the general ignorance and disinterest of the "other" nations in the
union shown by the majority in southern britain. 

--
** Calum Gordon <calum@clu.cf.ac.uk>      ** TEL: +44-222-874000-x5310 **
** Computational Linguistics Unit (CLU)   ** FAX: +44-222-874293       **
** University of Wales College of Cardiff ** JAN: <calum@uk.ac.cf.clu> **
** ----- "People with (a) CLU use Suns; CLUless people use Macs" ----- **
From: littlec1@jaguar.uofs.edu (Chris Little)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: This Favorite Lie Again (clarification)
Date: 14 Dec 92 16:06:24 GMT
Organization: University of Scranton


Thanks to Tim and Paul (who know who they are), I'm compelled to clarify a
recent posting in which I said:

>While I share your animosity towards the IRA, I'm sorry to say that while
>their battleground may in the most part be confined to the 6 counties (&
>London), their reign certainly is not.  There seems to be much support for
>these terrorists throughout Eire also.

While I'm aware that the recent elections reflected badly on Sinn Fein support
and while I believe that IRA support in Eire is diminishing, I'm not convinced
it's dead and don't know if it ever will be.  Any support is SIGNIFICANT. 
Perhaps I should have that used word in the first place.

I also believe that the elections don't necessarily reflect the sentiments of
the populace in all facets of life.  Maybe they reflect the priorities of the
populace, which at the moment seem to be the country's economy, employment and
a life more than financial worry.

The level of controversy in s.c.c (to the point of personal bickering and
attacks) is ironic.  I recently said (generalised) to my brother that many of
the Irish uprisings throughout history (as portrayed in our history books)
seemed to have failed because of a single factor such as a spy, a traitor,
miscommunication, other more immediate concerns, or maybe even the weather. 
His response was: "Yes, and even when we did come close a solution, we started
a civil war."

--
Chris Little, Programmer/DBA                    University Computing Systems
                                                University of Scranton
  LITTLEC1@JAGUAR.UOFS.EDU                      Scranton, PA 18510
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Cromwell
Date: 15 Dec 92 15:59:34 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

In article <1992Dec13.102103.13683@newstand.syr.edu> crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea) writes:

   Regarding Ulick Stafford's comments on Cromwell, I also
   remember the Ladybird books being quite filledwith praise for
   Cromwell. My impression of Cromwell from modern historiography
   was that he was feared by everyone and loved by few. To this day, I
   have to ask whether those children's books were typical of English
   attitude, or what? As I've said, most historians, left or right,
   view Cromwell as an intolerant dictator.

Most remarks about Cromwell that I've come across in the British media (the
BBC mainly, I suppose) have been quite anti-Cromwell, but mainly because he
was anti-Royal, rather than for any better reason.  I've never really come
across much pro-Cromwell sentiment anywhere - I haven't seen the Ladybird
book in question.  I did have a children's book set during the English civil
war which was quite shamelessly pro-Royal, however.  

I can imagine that attitudes to Cromwell might have been shaped by political
attitudes at the time the Ladybird book came out - Tories being pro-Royalist
and Labour supporters pro-Roundhead; but that's just speculation.
--
	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)

		
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea)
Subject: Re: Scots Wha Hae lyrics
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 10:54:19 EST

In article <1ggcohINNar3@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> esh2@po.CWRU.Edu (Evelyn S. Hlabse) writes:
>Here are the lyrics by Robert Burns (who else)
>
>Scots! wha hae wi' Wallace ble,
>Scots! wham Bruce has aften led,
>Welcome to your gory bed,
>Or to victory!
>Now's the day, and now's the hour;
>See the front o' battle lour:
>See approach proud Edward's power -
>Chains and slavery!
>
>Wha will be a traitor knave?
>Wha can till a coward's grave?
>Wha sae base as he a salve?
>Let him turn and flee!
>Wha for Scotland's king and law
>Freedom's sword will strongly draw?
>Freeman stand, or free man fa?
>Let him on wi' me!
>
>By oppression's wores and pains!
>By your sons in servile chains!
>We will drain our dearest veins,
>But they shall be free!
>Lay the proud usurpers low!
>Tyrants fall in every foe!
>Liberty's in every blow!
>Let us do or die!
>
>So may God ever defend the casue of 
>truth and liberty, as He did that day?
>Amen.
>
>This was writtein in September, 1703 and is properly called
>"Bruce's Address at Bannockburn"
>
>This is not my idea of a national anthem.  It is gory and
>sexist.
>
I don't know about sexist (come on, really?) but it doesn't make sense
in English. 
National anthems are generally militaristic and therefore gory in
detail. Hopefully the age of the National State is over.

Chris
From: gdb15@grebe.cl.cam.ac.uk (Guy Barry)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,uk.politics
Subject: Re: Scotland Demands Democracy!
Date: 15 Dec 92 19:56:19 GMT
Reply-To: gdb15@cl.cam.ac.uk
Organization: U of Cambridge Computer Lab, UK

In article <1992Dec15.114205.7137@rdg.dec.com> cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn) writes:
>
>In article <1992Dec14.180127.1@vaxa.strath.ac.uk>, cabr01@vaxa.strath.ac.uk writes...
>>Well, on Saturday the 12th of December, 25000 protestors filled the streets
>>of Edinburgh to take their greivance that Scotland has no say in who governs 
>>the Scots. [...]
>>    This may be news to Netters. The BBC did not mention it on a national
>>level. 

Not true; it was given airtime on the Radio 4 news, after the coverage
of the summit.  It wasn't a huge piece, but it was more than a mention.
--
Guy Barry, University of Cambridge | Phone: +44 (0)223 334757 
Computer Laboratory                | Fax: +44 (0)223 334678
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street  | JANET: Guy.Barry@uk.ac.cam.cl 
Cambridge CB2 3QG, England, UK     | Internet: Guy.Barry@cl.cam.ac.uk 
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8119 soc.culture.british:17449