HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rdb1@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (ronald.j.deblock..jr)
Subject: Re: Great American Recreation Corp (GRARE)
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 14:11:25 GMT

In article <1992Sep9.003231.15574@desktalk.desktalk.com> eric@desktalk.com writes:
>This is posting for Calvin Kennedy at:
>	ckennedy@oracle.com
>
>Calvin has been contacted by a firm called Hibbard, Brown & Company,
                                            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>Eric Lieber
>

This raises a flag for me.

Until recently, the bozos at Hibbard, Brown would call me at my office
at least every two weeks, sometimes more often.  Always the same guy.
Always the same pitch.  I always said, "I'm not interested, please stop
calling me."  They stopped for about two months, and then started up again.

I haven't heard from them since I moved to a new office.

I will NEVER do business with Hibbard, Brown.

-- 
Ron DeBlock  rdb1@cbnewsj.att.com  (that's a number 1 in rdb1, not letter l)
AT&T Bell Labs   Somerset, NJ  USA
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: sullivan@brandx.enet.dec.com ()
Subject: Mutual fund research checklist		
Reply-To: sullivan@brandx.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation, Maynard, Massawhat?
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 20:46:03 GMT

Has anyone created a list of things to ask about a fund before investing. I'm
planning to create a checklist for myself, and was wondering if anyone has done
this.  I'm thinking in terms of something like this...

Fund Name: _____________________
Telephone: _____________________
contanct:  _____________________

type of fund:___________________  (ie, aggressive growth, growth,etc.)

return		19??   19??  19??....(last 5 to 10 years)   Avg.

                ____

top 5 holdings	percent

...

and so on.

If not, I'll post mine whenever I get it done for critism.

Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: tony2@prefect.uucp (21131-gozdz)
Subject: Re: Japan no more
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 16:27:49 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.152638.10936@cs.brown.edu> jhc@iris.brown.edu.UUCP (James H. Coombs) writes:
>
                 [deleted]

>>What's more, their predictions summarized every month
>>in "Market Logic" (but not in the MFF!) are rather poor
>>as well. I'm not going to renew my subscription...
>
>Although according to Hulbert, Market Logic has been a market beater on
>timing (in untaxed accounts).  Mutual Fund Forecaster has not been a
>good performer.
>
>--Jim

Maybe I should clarify my previous statement - I meant
only their mutual fund performance predictions, not
their stock picks published in ML.

Tony
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
Antoni S. Gozdz                tel  (908) 758-2931  |  Bellcore  NVC 3X-261
tony2@prefect.cc.bellcore.com  FAX  (908) 741-2891  |  Red Bank, NJ 07701, USA
                           no .sig, strictly business
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: cjb3701@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Chris Bigenwald)
Subject: Gold investing
Reply-To: cjb3701@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 02:22:41 GMT

What is the best way to invest in gold/gold certificates?
From: bkottmann@falcon.aamrl.wpafb.af.mil (Brett Kottmann)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Cellular frequencies, 50% ROI!?
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:32:20 EST
Organization: Logicon Technical Services, Inc.

In article <3480022@hpwrce.mayfield.hp.com>, kingsley@hpwrce.mayfield.hp.com (Kingsley Morse) writes:
> Touchtone Engineering has offered to apply to the FEC on my behalf for
> cellular phone frequencies that are being auctioned off. They say applying
> will cost $7,000 and should have about a 50% annual rate of return. It will
> be a passive investment.
> 
> Has anyone heard of Touchtone Engineering or the latest FEC auction. A 50% 
> annual ROI sounds too good to be true.

	:) the too good to be true part happens when you and N+1 other people
give them $7000.  They then submit an entry for that group *as a unit*, so the
return is then divided among N+1 people.

	They usually lure people in by stating that there is "safety in
numbers" but what they are essentially doing is selling Nth parts shares in one
cellular unit.

	Do it yourself instead.

Brett--------------------------------------------------------------------------
	"Why the courts don't tell a husband who has been living off his wife
to go out and get a job is beyond my comprehension."--Joan Lunden
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: timlee@public.btr.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: 401k expenses Re: Fidelity Fund Options
Date: 12 Sep 92 05:25:55 GMT
Reply-To: timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee)
Followup-To: misc.invest
Distribution: usa

rot@mickie.id.macsch.com writes:
|I'm think its the other way around. 
|401(K) plans administered by Fidelity or another mutual funds
|group are likely to be more expensive than your simple 401(k)
|plan administered by bank or an insurance company. That's why
|larger companies can spread the higher costs over the large 
|number of employees. 

While that may be true in general (with many mutual fund companies
charging 2% due to large 12b-1 fees), some mutual fund companies
can be less expensive.  Where I work, the 401k plan is managed
an insurance company which charges from 1.2% to 2.3% annually
and provides very poor customer service.  Many mutual fund companies
with good reputations for performance and service (e.g. Fidelity,
Vanguard, Scudder, etc.) charge lower management fees for their funds.
For 401k plans, they may charge additional fees, but even with those
they may compare favorably.
 
|Although you may not be paying a front-end load to buy into Fidelity
|funds, your company may be paying high adminstrative fees. I'm not
|certain whether these fees are paid by the company or by their
|employees.

The insurance company running the plan where I work hardly discloses
anything unless one asks (and asks the right question).

If any change in 401k laws should be made, it should be a change to
make disclosure of fees, investment policy, and investment risks
mandatory.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee                 timlee@btr.com  ...!decwrl!btr!timlee
This message comes with no warranty, not even an implied warranty of
fitness for any particular purpose.
From: bkottmann@falcon.aamrl.wpafb.af.mil (Brett Kottmann)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Gold investing
Date: 14 Sep 92 14:39:36 EST
Organization: Logicon Technical Services, Inc.

In article <1992Sep12.022241.10437@ultb.isc.rit.edu>, cjb3701@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Chris Bigenwald) writes:
> What is the best way to invest in gold/gold certificates?

	If you want the actual gold, you can buy coins/bullion.  For that route
I'd invest in coins, especially from a country currently in disfavor of your
host country.

	You can also buy certificates or "stock" in companies that mine/trade
gold, or as gold-backed securities.  There are also mutual funds for this.
	If you want safety, go with the mutual funds.  If you want return on
investment, go with gold mine companies or gold trading companies.  But watch
out for the risk!  These are highly volatile.  A war or change of government
can make your investment worthless overnite.

	Coins are my favorite.  They also have collectors value.

Brett--------------------------------------------------------------------------
	"Why the courts don't tell a husband who has been living off his wife
to go out and get a job is beyond my comprehension."--Joan Lunden
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: keith@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Keith Hawkins)
Subject: Re: Great American Recreation Corp (GRARE)
Reply-To: keith@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Keith Hawkins)
Organization: Bell Communications Research (Bellcore)
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 20:43:05 GMT


This message includes several messages regarding the subject of
GRARE and HIbbard, Brown.

The connections here are incredible.


First off, Great American recreation  is the people who operate
Vernon-Valley, Great Gorge and Action Park.


In one article (Jeff Eastman) writes:

|> These are the same turkeys I wrote about when I asked for advice on
|> how to
|> get rid of a broker a few months ago.  Stay away from them!
|> Jeff Eastman
|> 
|> 


In another article, George P. Cotsonas writes:

|>Indeed!  From what I have heard, Hibbard Brown is in the same class
with
|>First Jersey Securities, now defunct firm which brought GRARE public.
|>I lost money on GRARE, and First Jersey Suckurities was the absolute
worst,
|>lying silver-tongued self-servicing scum of the brokerage world,
|>to be brief.


I can't believe it.   Hibbard-Brown is the same broker I had a bad
experience with
myself.  I complained to the net about Hibbard Brown awhile back. 
Someone back then said that
Hibbard, Brown  used to be called something like "First Jersey
securities".  But had
be gotten into trouble with the SEC and had disbanded and reformed under
the name
of Hibbard, Brown.

This is incredible!!!!  So they are the same jerks doing the same thing
under a 
different name.  There even using the same stocks by which to screw
people.  Wonderful.   
I'm wondering if the SEC can't just pemanently remove
someones broker's liscence.  That would put an end to this crap in a
hurry.

The rule should be...You get got doing this kind of crap just once, and
you're finished in
the brokerage business.  Period.  End of story.  No exceptions.

Gee... Maybe they haven't learned their lesson yet.

Anyone interested in a class action suit against an inscrutable
brokerage firm???  :-)

I wonder if it would be worth compiling a composite of all the
complaints about
Hibbard, Brown and sending it to them just to let them know that people
out
here are on to their little games?

Appalled and amazed,
-Keith





Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: jaeastman@anl.gov (Jeff Eastman)
Subject: Re: Great American Recreation Corp (GRARE)
Followup-To: misc.invest
Organization: Argonne National Laboratory
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 16:50:35 GMT

These are the same turkeys I wrote about when I asked for advice on how to
get rid of a broker a few months ago.  Stay away from them!
Jeff Eastman


In article <1992Sep9.141125.15865@cbnewsj.cb.att.com>,
rdb1@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (ronald.j.deblock..jr) wrote:
> 
> In article <1992Sep9.003231.15574@desktalk.desktalk.com> eric@desktalk.com writes:
> >This is posting for Calvin Kennedy at:
> >	ckennedy@oracle.com
> >
> >Calvin has been contacted by a firm called Hibbard, Brown & Company,
>                                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >
> >Eric Lieber
> >
> 
> This raises a flag for me.
> 
> Until recently, the bozos at Hibbard, Brown would call me at my office
> at least every two weeks, sometimes more often.  Always the same guy.
> Always the same pitch.  I always said, "I'm not interested, please stop
> calling me."  They stopped for about two months, and then started up again.
> 
> I haven't heard from them since I moved to a new office.
> 
> I will NEVER do business with Hibbard, Brown.
> 
> -- 
> Ron DeBlock  rdb1@cbnewsj.att.com  (that's a number 1 in rdb1, not letter l)
> AT&T Bell Labs   Somerset, NJ  USA

_______________
Jeff Eastman
jaeastman@anl.gov
_______________
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: topgun@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Chandra Bajpai)
Subject: Question about stock listings
Keywords: bank cma
Organization: Brandeis University
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:17:26 GMT


If you look in the paper like the Wall St. Journal, the stock listing is
displayed in the following format:

         High    Low   Close
XXXX     5/8     1/2   9/16

If you ask the broker, he quotes as Bid & Asked.  For instance in this
case the bid & asked may be 9/16 bid, 5/8 asked.  1/16 of a point
is the spread for the specialist.

My question is, does the newspaper listings mean a trade has taken place
(the specialist has matched up a buyer & seller) at that price?.  So
in other words, trades have occured between a low of 1/2 and 5/8 for that
day.  Or is it that the asked price is listed as the high price of the day?

The reason for me asking this question is when I am tracking a particular
stock during the day, I never seem to get the "high" price for the day.
Or a trade does not go through for that high price.

Thanks,
Chandra Bajpai
topgun@brandeis.cs.edu
From: sartin@88opensi.88open.ORG (Rob Sartin)
Subject: Re: 401K rollovers and new possible retirement changes
Reply-To: sartin@88opensi.UUCP (Rob Sartin)
Organization: 88open Consortium Ltd., San Jose
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 92 21:46:30 GMT

In article <1992Sep4.170032.16465@sierra.com> shannon@sierra.com (Shannon Maher) writes:
>side effect.  It seems as though, if your 401K plans allows 
>distributions while you are still employed, that you can directly roll 
>these distributions into a qualified (and self-directed) IRA - thus 

Yeah but....

As I understand the proposed rules, if your plan has an in service distribution
option, the money withdrawn is eligible for rollover.

How many plans are currently allowing in service distributions?  Of those
that allow in service distributions, how many allow it in cases other
than financial hardship or consider financial hardship to include "the
available investments suck"?  I don't think too many people will benefit
from the proposal as I currently understand it.  I have yet to work or
interview at a company where I'd be able to use in service distributions
to do a rollover under these rules.

Rob
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: jhc@m2lll.uucp (James H. Coombs)
Subject: Re: Japan no more
Reply-To: jhc@iris.brown.edu.UUCP (James H. Coombs)
Organization: IRIS - Brown University
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 15:26:38 GMT

In article <1992Sep13.184519.7069@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> tony2@prefect.uucp (21131-gozdz) writes:
>In article <12SEP199209290483@rosie.uh.edu> st1lv@rosie.uh.edu (McLeod, Stephen) writes:

>What's more, their predictions summarized every month
>in "Market Logic" (but not in the MFF!) are rather poor
>as well. I'm not going to renew my subscription...

Although according to Hulbert, Market Logic has been a market beater on
timing (in untaxed accounts).  Mutual Fund Forecaster has not been a
good performer.

--Jim
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: rajeev@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (rajeev.dolas)
Subject: Wanted CPA recommendation.
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: nj
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 15:58:54 GMT

Howdy all,
	
	Sorry to bring this request on this group, but I feel that
	I will get a better response here than a *.misc.* group.
	I am looking for a good CPA and also for horror stories to
	stay away from one! I will summarize responses.

	Thanks in advance.

Raj Dolas.


Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: r.cornejo@att.com ( R Cornejo )
Subject: DM or LTSG Money Fund?
Reply-To: r.cornejo@att.com
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 20:44:22 GMT
Originator: rcor@ihspb
Keywords: DM, LSTG, Interest Differential


Does anyone know of means/funds by which
to invest in DM or LSTG where one assumes 
nearly full currency risk with access to 
prevailing market rates of return? 

The hope is to circumvent managers' hedging 
strategies that effectively reduce interest 
rate differentials to zero, e.g. Dreyfus, 
Scudder or Vanguard funds.

Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: shah@tay1.dec.com (Amitabh Shah)
Subject: Re: Great American Recreation Corp (GRARE)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation, TAY1, Littleton MA
Date: 9 Sep 92 10:17:45


On 9 Sep 92 00:32:31 GMT, eric@desktalk.com (Eric Lieber) said:

> Has anyone heard of either GRARE or Hibbard, Brown & Company?

I haven't heard of GRARE, but if what I have heard about Hibbard Brown is
true, then they are in the same class as Used Car Salespeople, televangelists,
and Republicans :-). 

I would advise your friend to stay away from them.

-amitabh.
--
______________________________________________________________________________
Amitabh Shah                                   shah@tay1.dec.com----(INTERNET)
Digital Equipment Corporation                  santur::shah----------(EASYNET)
Software Performance Group                     +1 508 952 4430---------(PHONE)
151 Taylor St. Littleton MA 01460              +1 508 952 4197-----------(FAX)

Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: jhc@m2lll.uucp (James H. Coombs)
Subject: Re: Fidelity Fund Options
Reply-To: jhc@iris.brown.edu.UUCP (James H. Coombs)
Organization: IRIS - Brown University
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 04:30:37 GMT

In article <BuBpIL.1FL@taligent.com> cep@taligent.com (Christophe Pettus) writes:
>In article <Dmerrill-090992130325@47.140.3.216> Dmerrill@bnr.ca (Dana Merrill) writes:

>Taligent uses Fidelity to manage their 401(k) plan.  You have a choice
>of five plans (Growth and Income, Magellan, Overseas, and two others
>that I don't remember right now), all without loads.

Well, this is better.  At least you have a growth & income as well as a
growth.  Again, consider carefully before investing in Overseas.

>however, have the ability to invest in EVERY Fidelity fund.  Pity; I'd
>love to use the Fidelity Investor Select System instead of the standard
>investment choices ...

Two Fidelity funds get top risk-reward rating from BusinessWeek:
Contrafund and Select Food and Agriculture.  Of course, no yokel company
pension planner will consider either of them.  In fact, as I understand
it, none of the 403b plans can use the selects.

>Fidelity charges the company a significant amount for the privilege of
>having their 401(k) in each investment possibility (presumably to
>offset the lack of a load), thus limiting the investment options.

Well, this explains it.  I would rather pay the loads.

--Jim
From: bkottmann@falcon.aamrl.wpafb.af.mil (Brett Kottmann)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: TelMeX: buy?
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:19:54 EST
Organization: Logicon Technical Services, Inc.

In article <1992Sep9.212328.1676@cybernet.cse.fau.edu>, tom@cse.fau.edu (Tom Horton) writes:
> Some of the people I trust are suggesting I buy some shares in Telefonos de  
> Mexico (TelMex), the Mexican phone company.  I've seen the ValueLine sheet on  
> this (they rate it "highest" for timeliness), and everything looks pretty  
> attractive.   One of my friends said this stock has been discussed a lot in the  
> last few years, with many people thinking that it's hot.  If it was discussed  
> here, I missed it so I'm wondering whether any of you have taken a serious look  
> at it recently.

	Take a look at Forbes, Aug 17th 1992.  They discuss the Mexican market
(among other good things :).  If it's not that issue, it's the week before or
after that.

	The impression I got was to stay away from TelMex and go with some
other concerns that have a lot more potential.

> BTW, I'm mainly looking at stocks for long-term growth; planning for retirement  
> in 30 years or so.

	How about fast growth so you can retire sooner? :)

	There are also funds that invest in Latin/Central America that are
traded publicaly.  There are a couple that trade on the NYSE, and being with
'Latin America...' (investment, growth, etc) '...Fund'.

	These might be a good choice if you like the region but want to
diversify.

Brett--------------------------------------------------------------------------
	"Why the courts don't tell a husband who has been living off his wife
to go out and get a job is beyond my comprehension."--Joan Lunden
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com (Maurice E. Suhre)
Subject: Re: Make 20-38% in Stock Market / year
Organization: TRW, INC.
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 00:01:09 GMT

In article <Bu2nwH.61I@encore.com> rcollins@1.com writes:
	Strategy of buying high yield stocks deleted.
>... it might be interesting to see a list of these and have
>netters speculate about why the market has such low hopes for these
>securities?  

The usual problem with dividend stocks paying an unusually high yield
is that the earnings aren't enough to cover the dividend and there is
an expectation that the dividend will be cut.  After all, you can't pay
out more than you take in indefinitely, unless you are the US govt :-)
-- 
Maurice Suhre
suhre@trwrb.dsd.trw.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: tony2@prefect.uucp (21131-gozdz)
Subject: Re: Japan no more
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 92 18:45:19 GMT

In article <12SEP199209290483@rosie.uh.edu> st1lv@rosie.uh.edu (McLeod, Stephen) writes:
>Well it was a nice ride but Yesterdays 4.5% drop is basically the signal I use
>to get out so I'll be waiting for the Nikkei to drop a bit before I get back
>in.  For now it's off to Scudder's Short Term Global Bond fund (9.28%) with the
>last of my hard earned dollars. 
>However, the MFF is recommending Twentieth Century Ultra again (27% expected 
>return in 12 mos) so... I may finally switch companies.

Well, if you look back at what the MFF has been 
forecasting since last fall for the 20th Century Ultra, i.e.
Nov +27%
Jan +22
Feb +21
Mar +21
Apr +22
May +16
Jun +22
Jul +27
Aug +28,
and if you consider that the fund is now -10.6%
vs. its Nov. 1, 1991 NAV, how much confidence can you
have in their supposedly superior econometric model?
And this is _not_ an isolated example!

What's more, their predictions summarized every month
in "Market Logic" (but not in the MFF!) are rather poor
as well. I'm not going to renew my subscription...

>---
>Cheers
>Stephen McLeod        Well my stomach has finally settled after 5 days.  Only
>The Eternal? Student  9 days before I go back in again.

Tony
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: billj@b11.ingr.com (Bill Johnson)
Subject: Re: TIAA/CREF
Organization: Intergraph Corp. Huntsville, AL
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 17:01:13 GMT

In article <5740@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>, cdost+@pitt.edu (Constantin D Orogo) writes:
|> Anybody out there know of or have any experience with TIAA/CREF. I'm
|> thinking of investing my 403(b) into their organization.
|> 
|> Thanks in advance,
|> Constantine Orogo
|> cdost+@pitt.edu

I haven't had any personal experience with TIAA/CREF.   I do recall seeing an
article in the current Money Magazine or Kiplinger's Personal Finance -- I
can't remember now which it was in...  Anyway, the article was all about the
TIAA/CREF.

Bill
---------
billj@wcj.b11.ingr.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: M18611@MBVM.Mitre.Org (Kathy Wilk)
Subject: Reading Quarterly Reports
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford MA 01730
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 20:33:48 GMT

  Does anyone have an explanation of what to look for in a quarterly report
when judging the health of a company?
  I have started looking at the quarterly reports of the companies of some
stocks owned by my investment club.  What I focussed on were: long-term debt
and overall cash position.  I found that one of the companies looked to be
more in debt (long-term) than last quarter and had less cash.  Yet, for the
same period, Dean Witter gave it a glowing recommendation and talked about
it's decreasing debt.
  I looked at the cash position and long-term debt following the recommenda-
tions of Peter Lynch in 'One Up on Wall Street'.
  I realize that there are other factors to be considered in the balance
sheet (does anyone have recommendations as to what those factors should be?)
but I looked at those two amounts to try to determine whether the companies
could survive a worsening recession.
  Accounting is BORING but I think this should be basic research for our club.
We are not interested in joining the national association of investors' clubs
(don't remember the name).
  Any books besides Lynch's that treat this subject?
  In talking to other people who 'dabble' in the stock market, no one is even
remotely interested in analyzing these reports.
  Got tips, success stories, etc., from your own analyses?
 
 
 
                        K. Wilk
                        M18611@MBVM.MITRE.ORG
 
            <--********************************-->
 'Thrusting my nose firmly between his teeth, I threw him to the ground
  on top of me.' - Mark Twain
            <--********************************-->