HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: draskovi@usc.edu (Zoran Draskovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Massacre
Date: 5 Oct 92 03:41:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: aludra.1apuo4INN19u
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

Mr. Richard Ross, an independent US reporter, who visited the Bosnian village
of Milici, where the Moslem forces slaughtered the Serbian population, affirmed
in an interview for "Channel S" of the Serbian TV in Bosnia, that he has person
ally seen about 30 victims of the slaughter.
"These people did not die in battle but were simply killed in their home.They 
were slaughtered two-three days ago.They were not soldiers", commented Mr.
Ross.
Ross indicated that Serbs from Milici were "tortured, humiliated as human bei-
ngs and physically maltreated.They did not die of a bullet inn battle but were
attacked from the back.They were strangled, stabbed with knives, their heads we
re smashed with mallets."
"We talked with the coroners, and they told us that some of the victims were
circumcised while they were alive. That means that they wanted to humiliate
them", commented Richard Ross.
"I want England and America to understand that these men were killed in cold
blood.They were monstrously murdered.There were no CNN, BBC, ABC or NBC crews
present today."
Asked whether this is a chance to make the world realize what is happening in
Bosnia, Richard Ross answered that he didn't know who would see those images
in England and in the US.
"All I know is that I have seen, as an independent reporter, these men killed 
by the Moslems."
(Politika, September 30, 1992.)
From: sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: State Dept. confirms 3,000 Muslims massacred in Serbian camps
Date: 3 Oct 92 23:26:31 GMT
Organization: Enea Data AB

Nenad Antonic (na0i+@andrew.cmu.edu) writes:
>	After so many massacres of innocent Serbs by bloodthirsty
>`Green Berets' in Bosnia, reported by impartial Serbian media, and
>kindly translated by Mr. Zoran Draskovic, let me just mention this
>biased report by UPI of even more biased US State Department
>assessment. Those people at State Department must have been totally
>ignorant, because from the articles translated from Borba, Politika, etc.
>it is clear that such concentration camps were operated only by
>Croatian Ustashas.
>...

I'm afraid the sarcasm is somewhat uncalled for here. One thing
does not exclude the other, and although the sources Zoran Draskovic
has cited, are hardly ones we assign very high credibility, they
seem unfortunate to be without base. The fact that the Serbs are
practicing ethnic cleansing in the areas they hold, does in no
way excuse Muslims or Croats who performs similar excercises in
the areas they hold.
-- 
Erland Sommarskog - ENEA Data, Stockholm - sommar@enea.se
There are many sorts of Macedonians: Greek, Bulgarian, Roumanian, Macedonian...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: ljubicic@mundil.cs.mu.OZ.AU (Robert LJUBICIC)
Subject: Forgeries
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 01:52:53 GMT



	Dear Mr. Pavlovic
		You claim that I put that SHIT in s.c.y but that 
		is absolute Crap if you have proof I suggest you
		show it otherwise I suggest you shut up. 
			Cro-Views has nothing to do with 
		incident, minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au has many users
		who are Croatian and SERBIAN so I suggest you
		look elsewhere.


			R.Lj

Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Why Eduard? Re: The Order of Ante Pavelic bestowed upon Zlatko
Supersedes: <92271.154732U15231@uicvm.uic.edu>
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Sunday, 27 Sep 1992 16:34:29 CDT
From: <U15231@uicvm.uic.edu>


There is a point when a discussion between two persons that do not
agree is no longer a discussion but an assult. I think that youEduard
crossed that point.

Have a nice day

Zlatko Sijercic
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia,uw.general,alt.atheism,can.general
From: Nigel.Allen@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Nigel Allen)
Subject: Pope to visit Albania?
Organization: NDA
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 05:25:55 GMT

(from the Chicago Tribune, Sept. 27, 1992)
 
Once-atheist Albania wants pope to visit

 VATICAN CITY -- Albania has invited Pope John Paul II to visit the Balkan
country that called itself the "world's first atheist state" while under
communist rule. Albanian Premier Aleksander Meksi met Friday with the
Vatican's secretary of state, Cardinal Angelo Sodano, to discuss the Roman
Catholic Church's attempts to reorganize in Albania, papal spokesman
Joaquin Navarro said.

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: condic@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: USTASHA GENOCIDE
Date: 2 Oct 92 10:20:50 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

If you love the truth, Good Morning!
 If you do not, no human communication is possible!

NO MORE LIES--Reposting #27

"To claim that ca. 700,000 [Serbs] were killed in the
concentration camp at Jasenovac is pure nonsense. One has
to ask oneself: How could it have been possible, when
within the borders of today's Croatia and Bosnia-Hercegovina
there were ca. 1,966,000 Serbs in 1941, and 1,610,000
in 1948--and this in spite of many migrations and many
killings not attributable to the ustasha?"
--Dr. Bogoljub Kocovic, World War II Victims in Yugoslavia,
(in Serbian), Veritas Foundation Press, London, 1985, p. 54.

-- 
************************************************************
ANYONE CAN HAVE AN OPINION ON ANYTHING,INSTANTANEOUSLY! BUT,
OPINIONS, AS SUCH, ARE GENERALLY WORTHLESS, UNLESS THEY ARE
WELL-GROUNDED ON SOUND EVIDENCE AND VALID ARGUMENTS! J.CONDIC,
E-MAIL:CONDIC@GW:WMICH.EDU;GEN.STUDIES,WMU,KALAMAZOO,MI 49008
*************************************************************
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: de2j@poe.acc 
Subject: UPI
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 12:54:56 GMT

Subject: Serbs carry out 'ethnic cleansing' operation in Bosnian capital
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 12:49:42 PDT

	SARAJEVO, Bosnia-Hercegovina (UPI) -- Serb forces evicted up to 200
non-Serbs from their houses in a resumption of ``ethnic cleansing''
operations in the Bosnian capital Wednesday, ordering them on short
notice to vacate their homes and cross into Bosnian-controlled
territory, U.N. and Bosnian officials said.
	A U.N. source said the Red Cross estimated 150 people were forced
from their homes in Grbavica in the southern part of Sarajevo, while a
Bosnian police source estimated 200 people were involved, making it the
largest such expulsion in the 6-month-old seige of the Bosnian capital.
	Some of the family members, taken to a police station after crossing
by foot from the northern side of the Miljacka River, said they were
given 10-minute warnings to pack their belongings and leave.
	``It's happened a couple of times'' previously but on a smaller
scale, said Sonata Kreso of the Bosnian International Press Center, who
said most of those expelled in the incident of ``urban ethnic cleansing''
were women and the elderly.
	Bosnian officials said they knew no reason for the incident, but they
speculated it might indicate that Serbian militiamen are preparing for
the start of the harsh Balkan winter.
	Those expelled from the area along the Serbian front lines were
mostly Muslim Slavs, who made up about half of the city's pre-war
population of 500,000 people, police said.
	The expulsions came amid sporadic shelling and sniper attacks in the
Bosnian capital. At least 24 people were killed and 165 wounded in
Bosnia-Hercegovina in the 24-hour period that ended at 10 a.m.
Wednesday, including seven killed and 54 wounded in Sarajevo, republic
health officials said.
	The city's hospital ran out of the diesel fuel needed for its
electrical generator about 1 p.m. and doctors were forced to perform
surgery for a while under the light of a bulb connected to an automobile
battery.
	``We were hurried by the people running the generator to finish
operations because we would soon be in complete darkness,'' said Dr. Edo
Jaganjac, a doctor on duty at the hospital, shortly before the fuel ran
out.
	A spokesman for the U.N. Protection Force in Sarajevo, Adnan Razek,
said UNPROFOR later supplied the hospital with 4 to 5 tons of diesel
fuel....
From: draskovi@usc.edu (Zoran Draskovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Zagreb
Date: 1 Oct 1992 22:31:38 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu


	ZAGREB, Croatia (UPI) -- Two United Nations helicopters clearly marked
as U.N. craft were fired at Monday near the Croatian capital Zagreb,
according to U.N. officials Tuesday.
	``It is of imense gravity when people open fire on you from the
ground when you are flying peace missions...It's not what we expect,''
Cedric Thornberry, head of the U.N. civil affairs said.
	The helicopters, flying to Zagreb from Daruvar in north central
Croatia on a regular daily mission, were not hit and there were no
injuries, according to Thornberry.
	When asked for confirmation that it was the Croation army that fired
the anti-aircraft weapons, Thornberry replied, ``Well, it occurred 20
miles from Zagreb airport...and nobody suggests that it was little green
men from Mars.''
	The Croatian authorites had been given notification of the
helicopters'departure the day before, according to Thornberry.
	The helicopters were flying 45 feet apart at an altitude of 330 feet
in Croatian air space when one of the pilots saw some yellow flashes
coming from the ground and then bursts of smoke and fire between the two
crafts, a statement issued today read.


Xref: sparky soc.culture.yugoslavia:8964 soc.culture.greek:9439
From: cc433336@LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Constantinos A. Caroutas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.greek
Subject: Re: Australian Acceptance of Macedonian Passports
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:45:17 GMT
Organization: Colorado State U. Engineering College

In article <9227619.1023@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU>,
sachz@montebello.ecom.unimelb.EDU.AU (SAS) writes:
>
>ACCEPTANCE OF MACEDONIAN PASSPORTS (Australia) 

Is that in the same way the USA accepts TRNC passports? They stamp on them
that the holder is a person without a country...
--
Constantinos A. Caroutas

"It's easy to make mistakes when others will be held responsible."
From: rdowlati@rd.hydro.on.ca (Ramin Dowlati)
Subject: Re: Croat hypocrisy
Organization: Ontario Hydro - Research Division
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 16:55:47 GMT

In article <80397@ut-emx.uucp> josic@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Kresimir Josic) writes:
>
>[stuff deleted] ............... "Croats are a genocidal race".
On behalf of Josic I apologize for the typographical error. Please read:
                    "Serbs are a genocidal race".

-Cheers
-Ramin
>
>Have a nice day
>Kresimir Josic
>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: dmatic@athena.mit.edu (Davor Matic)
Subject: Eduard Wiener bool
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 20:37:25 GMT

In article <717367606@locust.cs.duke.edu>, wiener@duke.cs.duke.edu (Edward Wiener) writes:
|> >You probably joined recently to netnews and don't know about fruitless
|> >discussions on this group about borders, genosides, war crimes, respon-
|> >sibilities etc. I understand your frustration regarding this article.
|> >Hey but that is soc.culture.yugoslavia. What else can you expect here!?
|> 
|> 
|>       Perhaps one should not expect decency from a person like you.
|>       How dare you post this drivel to a newsgroup which is filled
|>       with netters whose relatives were slaughtered like cattle
|>       by the Fascists of Independent Croatia?  Have you not a grain
|>       of humanity left in your soul?
|> 
|> -- Eduard Wiener


Statements like this are the prime example of fruitless dicsussions,
unsupported accusations, and fighting over personal insults and positions
rather than real problems and interests of different sides.  I really 
feel that you shoud not tell anyone how to post or what to say before
you look in the mirror and wipe the foam from the corners of your mouth.
Just a suggestion...

				Regards,
				--- Davor
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: Jos Hrvatska ni propala
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 92 07:31:03 CDT
Organization: INFOPLUS support, Wheeling, IL

wiener@duke.cs.duke.edu (Edward Wiener) writes:

> 
> >Jos Hrvatska ni propala dok mi zivimo.
> 
> 
>    Croat ___ will not disappear as long as we live...
>    Could someone provide a translation for the word "jos"!?
> 
> 
> >That goes without saying. How come the Serbs think they can create all
> >this warfare and not get away with it? Try as you may, the Croats will never
> >surrender and inch of its territory. Meaning : ALL CONQUERED TERRITORIES
> >IN CROATIA WILL BE RETURNED. Well no Greater Serbia this time.
> 
> 
>    Well, Croatia has already lost one-third of its territory
>    as a result of the stupidity and ruthlessness of its leadership.
>    Therefore, you've already missed the boat, Cro.  Those territories
>    within Croat boundaries which are populated predominantly by
>    Serbs will not, can not, and should not be returned.  So long
>    as these dangerous nationalists and genocide-apologists are
>    ensconced in power in Zagreb, the life of every Serb is in danger.
>    There will not be peace in Croatia until a change of government
>    is effected.
> 
> 
> >- Chicago Cro
> 
> -- Eduard Wiener

Eduard, you are nothing but a fool.  The only thing that I can aggree 
with is your critizism of present day Croatian leadership.  Granted, 
Tudman did screw up in some areas.  That's because he is not a 
nationalist.  He was a WW II parison fighter, who fought against the 
Ustasa along with this Serbian friends and Tito.  
  On the other hand, if HSP\Paraga was elected, he would know what to do 
with the Serbian question, just as Pavelic did.  The Ustasa were Croatian 
freedom fighters of WW II. They defended Croatia's historical borders 
(i.e. Drina) against the Cetniks (Greater Serbianism) and the communists. 
 The Serb trash has always wanted to create their "Greater Serbia", and 
the Ustasa responded in the only way that the Serbs understand, by FORCE.

  How stupid you are.  ALL of Croatia's territory will be returned.  The 
U.N. looses its mandate in Croatia next April(?), and if our land isn't 
returned, then the Croatian armed forced will take it back.   
  My only regret it that the Ustasa didn't finish what they set out to do 
in WW II. 
   There was no genocide committed my the Ustasa in WW II.  The 
communists have been spreading this lie for the past 45 years.  The Serbs 
use this phrase in order to justify their presend day crimes.

Eddie, you don't understand the situation.  You're nothing but a 
Serb-loving piece of crap who doesn't know what he's talking about.
Just shutup and go back to your beloved Kosovo.  The Albanians are 
waiting for you.

Za Dom Spremni !

Damir

--
damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Infoplus BBS, +1 708 537 0247, v32bis. Home of Infoplus.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.yugoslavia:9001 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:234
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Monday, 5 Oct 1992 10:24:59 CDT
From: <U52148@uicvm.uic.edu> (Chicago Cro)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Eddie...Eddie...Eddie


I don't speak a ficticious language, i.e. Serbo-Croatian. Therefoere your
point about my language ability is MOOT! I will, over time, master my
mother tongue, namely CROATIAN! I have never in the past advocated
the expulsion of the NAZI Serbs from Croatia. But now I see these new
NAZIS must be dealt with like the original ones in Germany after WWII.
Look it up and see what was done to keep Germany in check.

I hope you wake up and smell the coffee.

-Chicago Cro
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: USTASHA MASSACRES
Supersedes: <92271.160157U15231@uicvm.uic.edu>
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Sunday, 27 Sep 1992 16:31:19 CDT
From: <U15231@uicvm.uic.edu>

Milan Stojanovic writes:

        BTW, is it the same Zlatko who introduced himself with the history of
Bosnia like this: " There was Kulinban, then I have heard there was Tvrtko"
and nothing more?

        Yes, read Zlatko, read ...

Zlatko Sijercic reply:

Yes, you are correct Milan. Except that I posted the article IN ORDER TO
FIND OUT ABOUT HISTORY OF BOSNIA. In ex-Serboslavia nobody thought us
about Bosnia, for the reasons we see today.

If still interested, I can refer you a couple of excellent books about
the subject. If you have some, please post it on soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna.

Thank's

Zlatko
   ------------
   |\ \*   *  |    LONG LIVE INDEPENDENT
   |* \ \     |
   |  * \ \ * |  BOSNIA AND HERCEGOVINA !!!
    \   * \ \/
From: sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: Demented Damir
Date: 3 Oct 92 23:21:14 GMT
Organization: Enea Data AB

Edward Wiener (wiener@duke.cs.duke.edu) writes:
>      That's right.  Independent Croatia is indeed headed
>      by a fascist government.

But you don't think the government in Serbia is fascist, or?
-- 
Erland Sommarskog - ENEA Data, Stockholm - sommar@enea.se
There are many sorts of Macedonians: Greek, Bulgarian, Roumanian, Macedonian...
From: draskovi@usc.edu (Zoran Draskovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Baranja
Date: 1 Oct 1992 23:22:28 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

Sunday night, a group of about a dozen Croatian terrorists made an unsucce-
ssful attempt to penetrate the protective belt of the Baranja Police, and has
been liquidated.According to sources close to the Baranja Police, this indi-
cates that Croatia has not renounced to its plan to forcibly bring refugees 
back to Baranja, in spite of UNPROFOR warnings.
It seems that the Croatian commandos had orders to verify the readiness of the 
Baranja Police and to inspect the situation along the demarcation line.
Baranja Police informs the population that they are prepared to defend the bord
ers and that they will not allow any surprises.
(Borba, September 29,1992.)
From: draskovi@usc.edu (Zoran Draskovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: cleansing
Date: 2 Oct 1992 20:24:09 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

Moslem-Croat troops have ethnically "cleansed" over 70 Serbian villages, as
reported in The London Times(7/26).This includes the cities of Travnik, Novi
Vitez, Zenica, Kupres and Vares.
The number of Serbs from Bosnia seeking refuge in Serbia is about 300,000
and growing, according to Velibor Ostojic, Minister of Information of Serbian
Republic.
Also, according to the Serbian Red Cross half the Serbian refugees escaping
from Croatia, came from peaceful areas, where they found themselves fired from
jobs, their homes and business blown up or confiscated.Out of 150,000 Serbs
who lived in Zagreb, only half remain.Virtually all Serbs have been "cleansed"
from Gospic and Zadar where they have lived for centuries.
From: damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: Demented Damir
Date: 4 Oct 92 14:06:27 GMT
Organization: INFOPLUS support, Wheeling, IL

wiener@duke.cs.duke.edu (Edward Wiener) writes:

> Damir Matanic writes:
> 
> 
> >You said that your father did the killing in Jasenovac.  So, he was 
> 
> 
>       Wait, Croats claim that there were no atrocities committed
>       against Serbs and Jews in Independent-Puppet Croatia.
>       Is your conscience bothering you, Damire?
> 
> 
> >Croatian huh?      An Ustasa ?!?!?!?!?!?
> >  You have Croatian blood flowing in your veins?
> >You're nothing but a damn Yugo-Cetnik S.O.B. ! 
> 
> 
>       Have you seen a psychiatrist lately, Damir?
>       I am Russian, not Croat, remember???
>       Did you have foam at the mouth and bloodshot
>       eyes when you wrote this nonsense?
> 
> 
> >The Ustasa fought to defend the Croatian and Muslim populations in both 
> >Croatia and Bosna-Hercegovina.  There was nothing "fascistic" about them.
> >Let me guess, you would probably say that today's Croatian leadership is 
> >also fascist, eventhough the H.D.Z. is made up of former communists.
> >Independent Croatia=fascist state, huh?
> 
> 
> 
>       That's right.  Independent Croatia is indeed headed
>       by a fascist government.
> 
> 
> >If you are part Croat, the you're a trator. Go back to the Yugo newsgroup 
> >where you belong.
> >Rot in hell cetnitcko stoko !
> 
> 
> 
>       It would appear that the credibility of net.Croats
>       converges to zero.
> 
> 
> -- Eduard

First of all shithead, no ever said that 0 atrocities were commited.
Serbs were killed.  But not the 1,000,000 that has been constantly 
reported by anti-Croats.

  You said that your grandfather did the killing in Jasenovac.  You told 
me this in the private letter that you sent me.  So what gives?  Now you 
say this isn't true.  You're the one that needs the shrink.  First you 
say one thing, then you do a 180 and state something entirely different!

  My only regret is that there still is a Serb population is Croatia and 
B-H.  Next time, I hope 1,000,000 do fall dead.  

Listen little boy, don't lie on this net.  It doesn't do much for your 
image.  

communist Croatian leaders=fascist state------huh, you are sick in the 
head!!

--
damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Infoplus BBS, +1 708 537 0247, v32bis. Home of Infoplus.
From: 8800529@hydra.maths.unsw.EDU.AU ()
Subject: Re: Australian Acceptance of Macedonian Passports
Organization: school of Mathematics UNSW
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 23:00:44 GMT

In article <9227619.1023@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> sachz@montebello.ecom.unimelb.EDU.AU (SAS) writes:
>
>ACCEPTANCE OF MACEDONIAN PASSPORTS (Australia) 
>
>   The honorable Gareth Evans Minister of Foreign Affairs.
>
>   With great pleasure we have received the news about your
>governments acceptance of Macedonian passports.
>
>   I am very pleased we have this opportunity to thank you 
>about your efforts.
>
>   The contribution of you personally, the Government and
>Australian people and your willingness to develop the
>process of building the Republic of Macedonia as a Soverign
>and Independent state is comparable. I am thankful that  
>Australia is open to seeking ways to improve relationships
>and co-operation with our country, and I ask that you will
>support us in our honest search for the right way to bring
>justice, peace, social and economic development to
>Macedonia.
>
>   Australia and Macedonia now have a unique relationship
>made from our contacts and from our people who live in 
>Australia.
>
>   They would be happy to support this kind of policy for 
>our country
>
>   We are proud of your support, and we are eager for 
>Australian engagement and look forward to building a
>prosperous relationship with Australia.
>
>Sincerely,
>President of VRMO-DPMNE
>Ljupco Georgievski
>
>Avstralisko Makedonski Nedelnik, 29 Sep 92.
>
>

	Well only a few weeks ago I posted a message conserning the acceptance
of the passports. It was done after agreement with the Greek goverment. The
agreement was that there should be sme sort of way for people to travel. 
So now anyone that enters the country with a "Makedonien" passport will
get a sticker that states that acceptance of such a passport no way relates
to acceptance of a state by the name Makedonia.uch was said by the same
person you were thanking. 
	I wonder if you will post a message concerning the reply. Sortoff a wet
shower ?
	George