From: hakim@bigq.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: soc.religion.bahai
Subject: The Claims of The Bab (was Refutation of Baha'i....) (Part 10/10)
Date: 4 Dec 92 14:35:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.47215
Organization: -

Continuation from part 9:

HS>His apparent insanity saved his life in more than one occasions
HS>(5).

Interestingly enough such an insanity did not save His life in Tabriz.
I wonder why? It is rather interesting to note that at the occasion of
the Martyrdom of The Bab in Tabriz, the choice was given to those in
His presence to recant and leave, as His secretary did according to
the directives of The Bab. If the Bab was insane and often changed His
mind and recanted, then why did they kill Him along with a companion,
while they let His secretary go unharmed?

HS>(5)* Talkhise Taarikhe Nabil Zarandi;
HS>    Rowdat-ul-Safe Nasiri;
HS>   * Kashf-ul-Gheta'a, p. 204;
HS>    Nasikh-ul-tavaarikh;
HS>    Kavaakeb-ul-durriah (The brilliant stars)

Would you care to present the content of "Kashf-ul-Gheta'a which you
have kindly offered the page number for, and demonstrate for the
readership of this forum HOW you have reached this conclusion!? If
not, I will be very happy to do so.

Let us assume that The Bab is who you claim Him to be and has
committed what you suggest He has. Proving such a theory using Baha'i
sources is a rather questionable approach. For sure you do not believe
that Baha'is are that mindless to preach something contradictory to
their own sources, do you? I am very interested to know your opinion
on this.

HS>His writings for the illiterate laymen had some effect among the
HS>Babis,

Many of the people who accepted the message of The Bab were according
to Comte de Gobineau among the most intelligent and educated people.
He writes:

"Public opinion holds that the Babis are to be found in every social
class and among the members of every religion, with the exception of
Nusayris and the Christians, but it is especially the EDUCATED
CLASSES, THE MEN OF LEARNING who are suspected of sympathy with
Ba'bism. It is believed, and with good reasons, that many mullas [i.e.
Muslim clergy. KH] and, among them, outstanding mujtahids, magistrates
of high rank, and high court officials..., are Babis."

	('Les Religions et les Philosophies dans l'Asie Centrale' p. 251)
	["Translation" p. 79 --rdt]

HS>and they rioted against the government in some cities. In Isfahan,
HS>the rioters were aided by Governor Manucher Khan Gurji, a Russian
HS>of Armenian christian origin (6).

[In private correspondence the author indicates that he interprets
this statement as an attempt to draw political inferences without any
historical support -- to make "a point out of nothing."  He adds that
religious rioting as the direct result of people accepting the message
of The Bab was not unique to Manuchihr Khan nor related to his being
Christian. --rdt]

The point which you have totally missed here is that Manuchir Khan
accepted Islam as a result of meeting with The Bab.

I read the material you have cited in reference 6, and would like to
respectfully request that you quote the material from Baha'i sources
and demonstrate your point in a similar style as I have used. If it
was not for the sake of brevity, I would have presented every one of
the Baha'i sources you have cited in your references to (IMHO) more
fully refute your claims. I hope you realize that accomplishing such a
task would require me to compose a book. God willing, answer to the
rest of your accusations will be supplied later.

						Part 10 of 10
Warm regards,

Kamran Hakim