From: bullis@polari.com
Subject: Re: burning in with filters on multigrade fiber
Reply-To: uunet!polari!bullis
Organization: Seattle Online Public Access Unix.  (206) 328-4944 (all lines telebit-equipped)
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 22:50:32 GMT

hargitai@acf5.NYU.EDU (hargitai) writes:

>Hi,

>I've been long usin Agfa Insignia as my only paper. But now that I
>went through The Pyro Book, (the part when he talks about printing
>on Ilford MG fiber for the ability to burn in with graded filters)

>I started to wonder if it made sense to switch?

>joseph

I have yet to see the Pyro Book.  It would be interesting to know 
what he says about burning/dodging with filters.

You don't need a whole set of filters, actually.  Two is usually 
enough.  Usually, about a 30 Blue (just for dodging, and mounted
on the end of a wire) and a 30 or 40 Yellow, just for burning.  I
just can't really think of any time when you would really need it
the other way around, because you usually need to dodge shadows 
which are underexposed, and they always need to be increased in 
contrast.  The blue does that.  And highlights needing to be 
burned down USUALLY need to be decreased in contrast if only to 
bring them into range.  So burning with the yellow does that.
The exception would be when blocked-up highlights are a problem, 
but that is another thing altogether.  (the kiss of death).

The other odd thing is that pyro stains a yellow, which acts as
a progressively increasing low contrast filter.  Under some circum-
stances, you can have a print with very snappy shadows that becomes
flatter and flatter up toward the highlights.  This can be pretty 
strange.  With the higher contrast filters, the blue component of 
the filter and the yellow stain in the negative cancel each other 
out, producing a wicked printing density as the paper sees it.  So
it is possible to get -- using filters with brown negatives -- a 
MUCH greater spread between the low and the high grades.  Btw, in
case it isn't clear in the preceding, the stain is in proportion 
to the density.  That is, more silver, more stain also.

Now, I use MG paper and filters to burn and dodge often.  The 
best way I have found to do this is to print WITHOUT a filter,
if I can.  I adjust the overall contrast by using a two tray
development.  I use Beers, the softest mixture in one tray and the
hardest in the other.  Dektol/Selectol-Soft works just fine too.
Then, from this overall adjusted contrast, the low/high variation
takes care of the usually impossible problems.  This works very 
well with NON-pyro, NOT brown negatives.  

This can be an incredible technique.  Others I have showed it to -
especially an intermediate photo class I taught a couple of years 
ago -- have reported elation at being able to print those "all-
night" negatives quickly and easily.  
 
Do try it.  It is a rather unorthodox way to use MG papers, but it
works like a charm.

In fact, I think pyro negs, and also pyrocatechin, work best on 
graded paper, because you get fewer surprises from the color of the
stain.  I do use MG on pyro negatives when there is a reason, such
as to control extreme contrast or conversely extreme flatness.  But
by and large, pyro negatives really work best on graded paper.

BTW I do like insignia very much, but have found it to be somewhat
marginal in its consistency.  It burns me up to buy a #2 and a #3 
and find them pretty much identical.  I used to like Record Rapid,
which Insig seems to resemble, and have missed it greatly since it
disappeared in 1966(!).  I don't know why Agfa has always seemed to
have trouble with consistency in their papers, and their distribution
as well.

Larry