HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rhs@world.std.com (Richard H Schwartz)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Which is the Best RG? (Was: Re: A Truly International Gathering)
Date: 16 Apr 92 23:30:59 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

Mike_Steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner) writes:

>In article <TERRYK.92Apr15083451@fenix.encore.com>, terryk@encore.com (Terence M. Kelleher) writes:
>> 
>> In article <15Apr92013514@miracle.com> phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill) writes:
>> 
>>    My top 5 (in order) are:
[...]
>>    RG at the end of the Universe   Manchester, MA <<---------------+
>>                                                ^^                  |
[...]
>                                                                     |
>Didn't the original say Manchester, NH? >>---------------------------+

Mike Dukakis annexed New Hampshire into Massachusetts several years ago.  :-(

-rich
-- 
             Richard H. Schwartz, Scheduling Systems Inc.,
            1000 Massachusetts Avenue, Cambridge, MA  02138
                  (617) 864 8330; FAX (617) 864 8377
                          rhs@world.std.com
From: choy@skorpio.Usask.CA
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: A criticism
Date: 14 Apr 92 17:12:42 GMT
Reply-To: choy@skorpio.Usask.CA
Organization: University of Saskatchewan


Greetings and salutations

Suppose the universe is bound by physical laws. All of us are forced to
act according to these laws. Intelligence is just something we've
concocted, not clearly either. Anyone who thinks he has
intelligence is really fooling himself/herself/itself. We may be credited
for having achieved so much, but our achievements are not great (maybe
we don't live in a great universe).



Henry Choy

choy@skorpio.usask.ca
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: A REAL CHALLENGE: Fermat's last theorem..
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:59:39 GMT
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University

kyle@uunet.uu.net (Kyle Jones) remarks:

>Anyone seriously interested in the problem should go read the
>sci.math FAQ posting, with has a lot of information and
>references as well.
>
>This is one of the reasons why I don't think rambling about
>random topics is appropriate here.  Much of the posted
>misinformation about what has and has not been proven 

The posting may have been incomplete, but there was *no*
misinformation. For the record, (and future posters) my 
original posting dealt *solely with the n=3 case* and only
one person (so far) has claimed that that has been proved.
My only error was to refer to this specialised instance as 
being 'Fermat's last Theorem' when it in fact is of a more
general nature. 

>about the
>theorem could have been avoided if the original poster had went
>to sci.math first.

Oh, Kyle! <sigh> maybe you're right, but I doubt we'd have got that
juicy bit about the subway station ..

Anyway, my posting was *NOT* that of an expert holding forth on a
critical topic
and making false and uninformed claims. It was more like starting a
thread 
about something I found intriguing, and that has at the very least,

1> enlightened me (and at least two other people) about the current
  status of the problem, and

2> might get someone else to comment on, perhaps, some related problem
that I (or somebody else) would be interested in. 

Whether the problem is ever solved is not of immense importance
to me, nor is a desire to dwell on long winded proofs in sci.math.
I probably will look it up, though, now that I know that a proof 
exists. 
Organization: Masters student, Mechanical Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 16:09:23 -0400 
From: David O Hunt <dh4j+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: SEMMANTICS in May

Is there anyone going to SEMMantics in Detroit this May?  I'm considering
going but one thing that's bothering me is the hotel prices.  Is there
anyone (non-smoking) that'd be interested in sharing a room?

David Hunt - Graduate Slave | My mind is my own.          | Towards both a
Mechanical Engineering      | So are my ideas & opinions. | Palestinian and
Carnegie Mellon University  | <<<Use Golden Rule v2.0>>>  | Jewish homeland!
============================================================================
Email:  dh4j@andrew.cmu.edu        I think, therefore I am paid. (S. Harris)

"You should be furious that polluters are threatening your great-great-
grand children's lives!"---Iroquois chief speaking about the environment.

Xref: sparky rec.org.mensa:3051 rec.arts.sf.written:5723 rec.arts.sf.misc:1380
From: edp@MATH.zko.dec.com (Eric Postpischil)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa,rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Passage from _Asimov Laughs Again_
Keywords: Asimov
Date: 13 Apr 92 11:52:27 GMT
Reply-To: edp@MATH.zko.dec.com (Eric Postpischil)
Followup-To: rec.org.mensa
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


    Here are the last paragraphs of Asimov's last book, _Asimov Laughs
    Again_.

         Janet and I met on May 1, 1959, and fell in love at once.
         Unfortunately, there was nothing I could do about it.  I was
         married.  It was an unhappy marriage, but I was married.  And
         I had two small children.

         So we could only correspond and yearn for each other, until
         my marriage broke up.  Since then, we have lived together,
         gotten married, and the point is that for thirty-two years
         now we have stayed deeply in love.

         I'm afraid that my life has just about run its course and I
         don't really expect to live much longer.  However, our love
         remains and I have no complaints.

         In my life, I have had Janet and I have had my daughter,
         Robyn, and my son, David; I have had a large number of good
         friends; I have had my writing and the fame and fortune it
         has brought me; and no matter what happens to me now, it's
         been a good life, and I am satisfied with it.

         So please don't worry about me, or feel bad.  Instead I only
         hope that this book has brought you a few laughs.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Subject: Re: Fermat's flunkeys (was Re: A Real Challenge)
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 06:21:26 GMT

werme@alliant.com (Ric Werme) remarks:
>In article <1992Apr9.071904.22693@ncsu.edu> cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu
(CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA) writes:
>>Well, it so happens that it *WASN'T* around when I took math, or
number
>>theory. Furthermore, only last year, (about 8 months ago, to be
precise)
>>I had a long and interesting discussion with a Faculty member
>>(CS, not Math) about Fermat and he wasn't any the wiser.
>
>I guess it must be my age, but I would have thought that any faculty
>member worth an F would be familiar with FLT.
>

No, no, maybe I should rephrase that. when I said he wan't any the wiser,
I meant that neither of us were aware that the n=3 case had been *proved.* Of
course he was aware of FLT, or we wouldn't have had a long  and interesting
discussion...

>
>so, why do Michael and I think this is so well known and Chris and other
>posters have only recently heard about it?
>

Recently? No, I heard about FLT in high school.. though it was through a pal.
Again, no one was aware at the time that a solution existed.. 

>In my case, I grew up during the "golden age" of _Mathematical Games_
>in Scientific American.  Soma cubes, flexagons, math puzzles, and such
>great stuff.  I'd guess I ran into FLT through Gardiner's column or
>something he inspired me to read.

But: did you know about the (n=3) solution at the time? 
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
If you did, then you certainly make a good point there.

Otherwise, FLT isn't any different from the innumerable puzzles and problems
that appear randomly in different groups on USENET, in that many are 
familiar with it, and then again, many are not. It was for the latter's,
and my own benefit, that I made the posting in the first place.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: rhs@world.std.com (Richard H Schwartz)
Subject: digressions (was Re: TIME TRAVEL)
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 23:54:54 GMT

chisnall@cosc.canterbury.ac.nz (The Technicolour Throw-up) writes:

>Correct. Those threads have nothing to do with mensa anymore and, if they
>continue much longer, should really be moved to the appropriate groups.

leaving behind more than half the participants, since most of them don't
read the "appropriate" groups.

>Fact of Usenet #17:  Such digressions always happen.  There are always people
>who don't bother to edit their newsgroups lines.  A minority of them are
>unable to due to an impoverished setup at their site, but most are simply
>careless.  The fact that some people continually post to the wrong newsgroup,
>even when a thread has noticeably digressed from its origins, should not be
>taken as an incentive to do likewise yourself.

Nobody reads all of usenet.  Most people only read a tiny fraction of the 
available groups.  If someone in r.o.m. makes an off-hand comment in the
middle of a mundane post, and a new thread starts up to discuss e.g., the 
relative merits of dark chocolate versus milk chocolate, and enough people in 
r.o.m are interested in this thread to keep it going, why on earth should
it move anywhere else?  So that anyone who is interested in it has to add
another group to their .newsrc file and filter through all the boring
stuff there (e.g., articles about white chocolate :-)).

Someone made a comment earliear about the hierarchical structure of usenet
being there for a reason... that it wasn't just some programmer's idea
of a neat thing to do.  This is true, although the convenience of using
the Unix (tm) filesystem to index messages, and the horrendous performance
implications of a flat message space certainly made the choice almost a
foregone conclusion.  But the organization was designed to allow individuals
and administrators to easily filter traffic.  In the case of administrators,
the organization makes it easy to enable and disable groups of groups.

Many sites don't get the alt hierarchy at all.  Coincidentally, the 
"appropriate" groups for some of our digressions probably fall somewhere in 
alt, so some of the participants won't be able to switch even if they do want 
to read the other group.  

rich

p.s.  If there are intelligent aliens out there, they could be reading
usenet!  The traffic is certainly going out over enough satellite links,
and super-sophisticated aliens may have some planet-sized dish antennae
that can pick it up.  Imagine if they were listening in on us...  Their
first conclusion would undoubtedly be that humans have two small eyes, a 
thin nose, an upward tilting mouth, and no body at all.  Sideways.  :-)  

-- 
             Richard H. Schwartz, Scheduling Systems Inc.,
            1000 Massachusetts Avenue, Cambridge, MA  02138
                  (617) 864 8330; FAX (617) 864 8377
                          rhs@world.std.com
From: eab@uh.msc.edu (Edward Bertsch)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Who's in charge here?
Date: 13 Apr 92 23:09:54 GMT
Article-I.D.: uc.1992Apr13.230954.20109
Organization: Minnesota Supercomputer Center

Again, I am in charge of this newsgroup.  But I will not exercise my powers
as a network GOD until I receive the weekly $50 payment from each reader
and poster of this newsgroup.

The Ed has spoken
--

Edward A. Bertsch (eab@msc.edu)   Minnesota Supercomputer Center, Inc.
Operations/User Services          1200 Washington Avenue South
(612) 626-1571 work               Minneapolis, Minnesota  55415
(612) 645-0168 voice mail

	"Read _MY_ lips: I won't be voting for Bush in 1992"
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: sue@netcom.com (Sue Miller)
Subject: Re: /T/ Mensa Frauds Exposed - reasons exposed
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 92 17:09:47 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article <1992Apr3.204326.13369@ncsu.edu> tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai) writes:
>roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
>
>> You know, you've got enough gall to be divided into three parts!  First
>> you don't want to hear about the -- indisputable -- fact that some
>> groups LEGITIMATELY discriminate, something that's germane to a
>> discussion of whether Mensa's discriminatory practices are legitimate,
>> and now you start talking about S African social problems. 
>
>Apparently you can't count, as you only listed TWO parts.  I don't have a
>problem with people who haven't mastered our decimal system; however, I do
>have a problem with someone who alters what I've said.  I never started
>talking about South African social problems; I originally had a brief

I don't have a problem with people who haven't studied Roman history
and don't recognize a bit of hysterical humour - so I'll help you
out on this one.  Omnia Gallia tres partes est.  All Gaul (France)
is divided into three parts.  He was talking about your chutzpah,
and nothing else.  I can't remember which dead Roman said that.
It's been too long since I sat in Latin class (which subject I dearly
loved, believe it or not).

I have no comment on the rest of the treatise.  It made my eyes
glaze over. (yawn)  Maybe I'll go watch some cricket now; a test
match sounds exciting by comparison.
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: Who's in charge here?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 23:16:45 GMT

In article <14157@claris.com>, Mike_Steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner) writes:
> In article <1992Apr7.223005.14397@cbnewse.cb.att.com>, gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart) writes:
> > 
> > In article <14155@claris.com>, Mike_Steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner) writes:
> > > In article <1992Apr7.153927.28024@cbnewse.cb.att.com>, gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart) writes:
> > > > 
> > > > In article <702648459.F00001@blkcat.UUCP>, Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson) writes:
> > > > > I wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > >  DA> If memory serves, he is the moderator (not in the "censor" sense
> > > > >  DA> of moderated newsgroups, but more like the "guy in charge")
> > > > > 
> > > > > phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill) replies:
> > > > > 
> > > > >  PH> I am _NOT_ in charge here (I'll leave that job to Al Haig :->).
> > > > >  PH> Nor is Ed Bertch, nor is ANYONE.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Then is there nobody "empowered" to speak on behalf of the newsgroup itself?
> > > > 
> > > > That would be me, my son!  What is it that you wish to know that the
> > > > most intelligent person on this newsgroup may bestow His knowledge
> > > > upon thee?
> > > 
> > > How do you know that you're the most intelligent person on this newsgroup?
> > > Did you compare IQs with everyone else here?  Even if you were the most
> > > intelligent person on the newsgroup, how does that empower you to speak on
> > > behalf of the newsgroup itself?
> > > 
> > > Enquiring minds want to know.
> > 
> > Well, if you don't know, I'm not going to tell you.
> 
> Well, if that's the way you're going to be about it.....
>  
> > > 
> > > (this message is smiley-captioned for the humor impaired--all others
> > > will smile even without the caption.) :-)
> > 
> > Better check.
> 
> I did.  The humor non-impaired smiled before reaching the smiley.  The humor
> impaired didn't smile before reaching the smiley; most of them didn't smile
> even when they saw the caveat and the smiley.

Smileys are a crutch that those folk could become addicted to, and soon
there would be federal programs supported by OUR tax dollars putting
smileys on all the humor in the world, like some twisted barrage of humor
"applause" signs, leading the addle-pated Dangerously Grim through
their unenjoyable boring lives.

Oh, man, we have our own private thread!  Isn't about time for someone
to post something about them not enjoying it so we should stop talking
about it?  "Hey, you guys over there!!!  I'm not interested in what you're
talking about!!  So shut up!!  I SAID, I'M NOT INTERESTED IN..."

Or, "Humor?  THAT'S not MENSA RELATED!"

Or better yet, start a flame war claiming I'm not really in charge of
this newsgroup.

GMS
From: phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Rebuttal
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 92 19:24:33 EST
Organization: Miracle Computer Consultants

alopez-o@neumann.waterloo.edu (Alex Lopez-Ortiz) writes:
>
>How about writting an extensive reply arguing why mensa does not discriminate 
>by excluding 98% of the population? 
>
>I'm certain it will stop any more bozos for a while.
>
>-To start with it may give a solid reply to many concerns.and it will keep 
>them busy while they read it :-) :-)
>
>
>This reply could latter be included in the FAQ list (which, btw I haven't
>seen in a while).

I'm posting the FAQ weekly.  On sunday or monday.  It always has the subject
of 'Answers to Frequently Asked Questions' or something like that.

>
>
>Here is  an outline
>
>
>-Intelligent requirements for Mensa are essentially the same as athletic
>requirements for sport teams.
>
>-Examples of when and where people with higher IQ may prefer to talk with 
>other mensas (same as Magic Johnson prefering to play a one on one with
>Larry Bird than with me!)
>
>-Intelligence Bashing.- Previous articles give extensive testimony towards
>people being uspet with intelligence.
>

I'll consider a secion for Mensa anti-bashing in the FAQ.  But I have
reservations about that.  I don't like to go on the defense when there isn't
an definite offence present.  And it doesn't look good if all you read is
the FAQ.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Hill                     | "All you people in TV land,           |
| Miracle Computer Consultants  |   I will wake up your empty shells.   |
| Email: phil%miracle@merk.com  |  Peak time viewing blown in a flash,  |
|  -or-  phil.hill@channel1.com |   as I burn into your memory cells.   |
| FAX:   (508)875-3297          |  'cause I'm alive." - Peter Gabriel   |
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/ Tai's Truths
Date: 8 Apr 92 22:34:56 GMT
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory

Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes:

> You are obscene--you have no redeeming social value, fuckface.

And I can tell you're a great judge of character.

---------
Scott Tai
From: roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: /T/ Mensa Frauds Exposed - reasons exposed
Date: 10 Apr 92 15:14:25 GMT
Organization: Princeton University
Originator: news@ernie.Princeton.EDU

In article <1992Apr9.221421.10640@Cadence.COM> 
vince@Cadence.COM (Vince Gibboni) writes:
>(Roger Lustig) writes:
>
>> -- Nobody has been able to find inherent differences in test outcomes
>> from different ethnic groups.
>>
>
>    Perhaps this is true for ETS tests, but it is not true for IQ tests.
>    Certain ethnic groups _have_ shown significant differences in average
>    IQ, although, admittedly, most of the studies in this area are fairly 
>    old (as it is now considered to be in rather bad taste to point these
>    differences out). This could be contributed to cultural bias on the part
>    of test, or to the dispropotionately low socio-economic status of 
>    certain ethnic groups, or, perhaps, to a correlation between intelligence
>    and race. It's my impression that, although most will not publicly 
>    say it, most psychologists favor the latter. (Well, at least the ones I 
>    know do). 
>    
The key word is "inherent."  Yes, everybody from Yerkes to Jensen has
found "racial" differences in IQ, but as you say, these have not been
successfully separated from the other factors you mention.

As for "bad taste," look again.  This topic is still pretty common.  

As for psychologists favoring the latter, look what you wrote: a
*correlation* between intelligence and race.  That's there.  We know it.
The issue is the *causality* involved.  Nobody has enough evidence to
make claims about genetic influence on intelligence.

(Especially given the state of the debate over what intelligence *is.*)

R
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: bhatia@snow-white.ee.udel.edu (Sunita K. Bhatia)
Subject: Re: A REAL CHALLENGE: Fermat's last theorem..
Keywords: Nobel 
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark
Distribution: all
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 18:45:41 GMT

In article <2246.29EA8497@kennel.FIDONET.ORG> Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes:
>
>Faust II writes about "Re: A REAL CHALLENGE: Fermat's last theorem.." to All
> [13 Apr 92 10:16]
>
>>Yeah; I spent a few weeks on it back in high school. Actually, I proved it.
>>The proof *is* elegant, but a bit on the long side. I'll see if I have time
>>to type it in later...
>
>FI>  Don't do that ! Copyright it, and get a noble prize before you 
>FI> send it in. (assuming you're right)
>
>He would do much better if he could win a Nobel prize.  Being noble is find
>and dandy, but winning the Nobel garners fame and fortune.

Which would be great, except that 

*there is no Nobel prize for mathematics!*

Now the Fields medal, on the other hand . . . .  ;-)

----- Sunita K Bhatia
----- bhatia@ee.udel.edu
----- Disclaimer:  I don't speak for UD, and it doesn't speak for me.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: MCAT scores?
From: mcbeanb@brandonu.ca
Date: 15 Apr 92 11:07:42 CST
Organization: Brandon University, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

In article <2248.29EA849B@kennel.FIDONET.ORG>, 
Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes:
> 
> mcbeanb@brandonu.ca writes about "Re: MCAT scores?" to All  [13 Apr 92 12:44]
> 
> M> Correlation correlshmation :)  
> 
> You mean "correlation shmorelation," durn it.  If you're gonna type Yiddish,
> please get it right. :-)

Please accept my humble apology.
  
Brian McBean  -  McBeanB@BrandonU.Ca
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: mrmrks and beating a dead horse ...
Date: 13 Apr 92 00:55:36 GMT
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University


sue@netcom.com (Sue Miller)writes:
 
>In article <1992Apr12.100124.16814@kth.se> tordm@vana writes:
>>In article <c0tj1=b.sue@netcom.com>, sue@netcom.com (Sue Miller) writes:
>>[text deleted]
>>>I don't like new-nazis but I don't
>>>hang around their offices or bulleting boards telling them so.
>>
>> Why not? Do you agree with nazis? Do you accept them? Maybe Scott's a man
>>of action and not of acceptance? Do you see people in Chile or South
>>Africa accept the discrimination put on them? they act... They might seem
>>stupid, dumb or even naive to those discriminating, but they act...
>
>[deleted]
>
>Somehow I find it difficult to equate the political situations in
>Chile and South Africa to some obstinate cuss' personal problem
>with a social club.

Well put. This specious use of bogus analogies to defend Scott's 
paranoid obsession with a non-existent problem should be discouraged.
From: csz55@seq1.keele.ac.uk (Christopher Wrigley)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: INTELLIGENCE DEBATE
Date: 13 Apr 92 13:47:22 GMT
Organization: University of Keele, England


Scott,

_All the 'evidence' you supplied is now quite old.  Much of it has
already been proved either cooked or not valid under other
circumstances.  Please get up to date with the current argument in this
area... I suggest reading material other than the 'Introduction to
psychology' texts that have clearly been the source of the info you
cited.

I might have commented on each argument seperately, however it was
hurting my eyes with the >80 column band width spilling over onto the
next line.
		Chris
__
Christopher  Wrigley           "Have not children the right to keep the
University of Keele, England      secrets of their hearts from you?"
JANET - csz55@uk.ac.keele           (Lindkvist - Strindbergs "Easter")
BITNET - csz55%seq1.keele.ac.uk@ukacrl