From: ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti)
Subject: Re: Karelians the palestinians of the north
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 07:04:17 GMT

Bob Hammarberg (hberg@polisci.umn.edu) wrote:
: In article <1993Jan20.121444.21075@jyu.fi> ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti) writes:
: 
: 
: >I have got the article via a friend. It is a good thing that an international
: >magazine focus on karelian question and people get to know about
: >the occupation of Karelia,Salla and Petsamo (Petsenga).
: 
: Jarmo, you silly fascist revanchist:  Finland's claims to Petsamo are 
: extremely tenuous.  The area was given to Finland by the Dorpat treaty in 
: 1921 (or was it 20?) just so Finland could have an outlet to the Arctic 
: Sea - before that, Finland had no claims to the area whatsoever.

So you consider it completaly correct that SU attacked Finland 1939 
according to the agreement they had made with Nazi-Germany and occupied
big parts of Finland and thrived 440 000 persons to flee to those
parts of Finland which SU did not succeded to take.  Winter War
1939-40 lasted 103 and 1941 SU attacked again and Finland lost again
more areas and people. 

Today I have seen with my own eyes in Sortavala how russians live
in old finnish houses whose owners are in many cases livin still
and suprise , suprise in Jyvaskyla. The stronger can take from
a weaker what he wants? It is not faschism acoording to you?


: 
: As for Carelia, whatever parts of this (ill-defined) area belonged to 
: Finland did so only after Staraja Finlandija was united with the Grand 
: Duchy.  Before (and after) that Carelia belonged either to Sweden or to 
: Russia.  

The fact is that the people fled from their homes and now in those
houses live russians, ukrainians, the places are given russian names,
the history is told so that like there had not been any war 1939-40,
because Molotov-Ribbentrop pact "did not exist". I know personally
people who have been in their old houses and the new owners have
suprised that there are people who once owned "their" house.

so I can come to your home, throw you away and it is mine. If you
resist me you are a faschist? Or do you think international moral
and private moral are two different morals?
: 
: But I assume you want to invoke the principle of Blut und Boden, don't you?  
: The Carelians as the oppressed blood-brothers suffering under the yoke of 
: foreign oppression....  Bring them into Suur Suomi (Grossfinnisches 
: Reich)!  Carelia - Finlandia irredenta!  (Do you wear black or brown shirts?)
: _

The karelians are the palestinians of Scandinavia. Very little known
problem but however it is existing.

Is problem existing if it is not a known problem, asked once a professor
of mine during a philophy lecture. I mean many people like to bury the
karelian problem by not speaking about it, but does it make the problem
does not exist?

Or is it so that Sweden is afraid of "a new Yogoslavia" in the neighbourhood?

What is so bad in taking this fact of life to the agenda, the destiny
of karelians who lost their homelands? I know pwrsonally many and
they cannot forget it.
jr 

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