From: llama@tramp.cc.utexas.edu (sine nomine)
Newsgroups: alt.angst
Subject: Re: No meaning
Date: 5 Jan 93 19:53:21 GMT
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Stephen (sbate@atl.ge.com) wrote:

: So... mayflies are in even worse shape than us. We're comparing humans
: to the cosmos, not humans to a mayfly. Big difference.

and the cosmos is in better shape than we are. so what? do you really
*want* to live forever?

: Just ask yourself, "what difference will it make in 1000 years if...".
: I've had great success with this approach.

it's a great approach until you turn it on its side and start saying
"it won't matter in 100o years, so why bother?"

: I never said we couldn't change anything. I used cattle as a metaphor.
: Don't take it too literally. I also mentioned a significant difference
: between cattle and humans -- we have the ability to escape our fate. (It's
: amazing how our consciousness filters certain messages.)
: 
: Acknowledging your fate doesn't save you. It only gives you the
: *possibility* of escape. Without realization of the "terror of the
: situation", escape is impossible.

i don't know. if people are born and live their lives and think
they're happy, if they go to work and go home and watch tv then screw
the spouse if it's thursday and go to sleep only to get up and do it
all over again and they think they're happy, who am i to tell them
they're not? we each choose our own form of escape. the life i
described sounds frightening to me, but some people *want* that. they
deal with angst by ignoring it. how can i decide whose happiness or
contentment is "real"?

: If you can *make* life please you, you are definitely a special
: creature.  Almost everyone else, *hopes* life pleases them, or
: *imagines* life pleases them, or stays so intoxicated in infatuation
: or other chemical addictions that they don't *care* if life pleases
: them. 

i'd say that people who've put themselves in a state where they don't
care if life pleases them are doing what makes them think they're
happy. i phrased that badly in the original; i should have said "i try
to live a life that is pleasing to me." that *is* in my control; if i
am doing things that make me unhappy, i can try to find ways to change
them. it's hard a lot of the time and sometimes it takes years to
figure out what i need to change, but it's my life and i can do things
that affect it.

: Do you feel the same way about people in abusive relationships,
: dead-end jobs, self-destructive chemical dependencies, etcetera?  All
: these situations "suck". Should people just insist on enjoying them
: anyway? I don't think so.

i didn't say that i admire people who stagnate in situations that
suck. i said that i admire people who acknowledge that at base, life
is a bitch. to paraphrase m. scott peck, that life is difficult is one
of the greatest truths, and once you truly accept it, you partially
transcend it. once you accept that life sucks and stop railing at the
universe because your life has been hard and unfair, you can get on
with *doing* something instead of just being angry and petulant and
expecting that life should be easy. people who've managed that are
people i admire and want to learn from. all of that is unrelated to
particular situations.

that better?

--
sine | deb
"it's these little things, they can pull you under
 live your life filled with joy and thunder" -- rem

Newsgroups: alt.angst