From: benjamin@rice-chex.ai.mit.edu (Benjamin Renaud)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.french
Subject: Re: Engineering studies in USA and France
Date: 30 Sep 92 21:02:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: life.28628

In article <92273.215718COMTET@FRECP12.BITNET> COMTET@FRECP12.BITNET writes:

-Comme j'espere que des Americains reagiront a mon article j'ai decide
-d'ecrire en Anglais.  I won't say that I am the best informed on the
-subject but at least I hope this article will bring strong reactions
-and polemic on a subject that should be debated : actually I think
-tahat the American Engineering studies are far too much oriented on the
-direct productivity of their engineers without giving them theoretical
-tools to understand what they do. For me it is well described by th e
-word RECIPES. 

A widely spread myth in France...

-Actually I was astonished by the faxt that I met a student beginning
-his Phd in Fluid Mechanics who had never known what a vectorial space
-is and who had very little done any functional analysis.

I did vectorial spaces and functional analysis as a undecided (major
non-declared) freshman at MIT. I don't know where your PhD guy was
coming from, but I would check twice before generalizing as you do in
your next paragraph.

-Therefore on fundament subjects he was at the level of a student of
-the second year of university in France. He told me the whole teaching
-before the PhD was oriented rather on practice than on theory.

As i said, it's all a question of where you're coming from. The
-major- difference between the US and the French educational system at
the college/grad school level is that in the US, there is no national
standard (set by the state or de facto) and that lots of places can
grant PhDs. I once met a Doctor in Barbecue Philosophy (with a diploma
and everything) You have to compare what's comparable... Any physics
major here at MIT knows all the theoretical maths relevant to his or
her field.

-Therefore anyone shouldnt be astonished that the students of French
-Engineering schools are easily admitted in Stanford or MIT 

Have you tried to get in lately? You should take a look at the
statistics before making such radical claims...:-)

-providing that they pay. And there another problem : in the US the
-selection is too often made by the money and less by the level the
-people have.

Another myth, and even more: utter BS (n'importe, mais alors n'importe
quoi en francais). In engineering especially, tuition and living
expenses are almost invariably covered in the form of a RA or a TA, or
some fellowship or other. US Universities do NOT selection based on
income.

-In France a student who studies pure mathematics or theoretical
-physics is much envied and respected. In the USA a pure mathematician
-is regarded as a kind of lunatic, that won't help the society
-immediately, therefore unnecessary.

Nonsense. I should know, that's what i do, and i get plenty of respect
;-) (i really do...)

-The whole teaching in US lacks Mathematics and doesn't consider Maths
-as primer whereas for me it is very important for any scientist to
-have a good knowledge of that subject.

Therefore all American scientist suck, and that's why US science suck
so badly ;-)? US science recognizes the importance of pure maths just
as much as European science does. I think you are a victim of popular
cliches, and that it's very omportant to look into an issue carefully
beforecontending such strong arguments.

-    Gilles Comtet-Varga
-    COMTET at FRECP.bitnet

Benjamin Renaud 
benjamin@ai.mit.edu /// benjamin@athena.mit.edu /// dod 676
The opinions stated above are the sole responsibility of their author.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.french