HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cf123@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Christopher Leigh Putnam)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
Subject: Re: If someone were to ask you...
Date: 27 Jan 1993 06:53:21 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cf123@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Christopher Leigh Putnam)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


I was showing tapes of corps to a group of my high school peers one day, to
give them an idea of what drum corps was.  I chose to show them the '86
Devils (best show ever), the '89 SCV (allegedly the best ever), and the '91
Star (toughest show ever).

I felt that these 3 shows gave the viewers a good cross section of styles
in music and drill.  It also could keep them interested because of the
music like Phantom of the Opera and the drill moves of Star and the awesome
sound of the Devils.  If you had to show someone just one year, I would say
the '91 Star show.  When I showed this assembled group of high school
students that last "cross rotation" of that show, they about died.  There
is nothing else out there that proves better the physical demands and
mental demands of DCI better than that 15 seconds of film.  When people,
even uninterested people, see that move, they can't help but be astonished
that they could move at that speed while playing that music and hit that
picture as perfectly as they did.  The epitome of DCI.  IMHO.
-- 
Chris Putnam (still a Blue Devils lover at heart)
Euphonium/Baritone
Star in '93?????
Go Devils Winterguard!!!!!
From: scottm@helena.stat.uga.edu (scott mclure)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
Subject: Re: If someone were to ask you...
Date: 27 Jan 93 01:13:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: rigel.1993Jan27.011304.3350
Organization: UGA Statistics Department

In article <C1H510.FLs@news.cso.uiuc.edu> bjh42543@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Brian J. Haag) writes:
>scottm@helena.stat.uga.edu (scott mclure) writes:
>
>>When people ask me what drum corps is, I tell them its semi-professional
>>marching band, only more like competitive sports than halftime shows.
>>They generally get the idea, and some of them even want to know more.  I
>>try showing them the 1990 Cadets show, which usually captivates them.
>>I've never had anyone tell me it was anything less than interesting.
>
>I may regret asking, but why this show?
>
>-- 
>    Brian J. Haag             |  "System + Spirit = Success" -- Gary Smith
>    bjh42543@uiuc.edu         |                                          
>    Senior, Dept. of Finance  |   My opinions don't necessarily represent      
>    University of Illinois    |   what *I* think, much less anyone else.                     

Brian,
	Simply because it was a fun show and displays much of the basics
about DCI that I appreciate, which I think are helpful to a new person
trying to follow it.  The show had power, flair, silliness, and
precision... which is what DCI is really about.
	Oh, and it's one of the few tapes I have in HiFi that can be
used to show the visual and audio entertainment values in corps.
	Scott
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: scottm@helena.stat.uga.edu (scott mclure)
Subject: Re: Woodwinds (was Re: Cadets cymbal line)
Organization: UGA Statistics Department
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 22:10:19 GMT

No! Woodwinds are not welcome in drum corps as far as I'm concerned.
Part of the beauty and challange of corps is to translate music written
for other idioms into music than corps can play.  Yes, Appalachain
Spring would sound lovely with woodwinds and strings, but hearing Cadets
play it the way they did in 87 was breathtaking.  It didn't subtract
from the piece, it added a different dimension.
	Also, speaking as a former woodwind player in high school, it
would take 60+ woodwinds to balance a 64 piece brass line, which would
either make a limit of 128 members impossible, or would expand the
corps' size to 200, which is too damn big for DCI.  We've already put a
pit in the size of a major orchestra, let's draw the line somewhere.

Scott McLure

Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: rdorocke@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (rob lawrence dorocke)
Subject: Re: Woodwinds in the pit?
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 19:55:13 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.091932.10173@iscsvax.uni.edu> phelps1230@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
>In article <C1FnsI.Isn@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, rdorocke@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (rob lawrence dorocke) writes:
>> In article <1k1mbhINN6gc@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> monroesa@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Scott A Monroe) writes:
>> Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
>> 
>> Personally, I believe that a small amount of NON-marching woodwinds would
>> be acceptible.  This would enable the corps to add different tone colors 
>> in the ballad sections of their shows.  I am strictly opposed to those
>> members marching, but 5-10 members in the pit area would be OK.
>
>I hadn't thought of this application, and it seems reasonable to me, only....
>I think it would have to be a pretty quiet ballad to be able to hear that few.
>Are we going to amplify them? Arrangers would have to be sure to double those
>parts, also...in case of a rain show. Can you imagine if Finals week was rainy?
>> 
>Brooke




Woodwinds carry pretty well in large stadiums, so there is no reason to 
amplify them for the big contests, but the corps could have problems in the 
smaller, HS stadiums.  I HATE AMPLIFICATION!! (Sorry, just had to get 
that in).

Rob 
(rdorocke@ucs.indiana.edu)
From: bthomas@dion.gac.edu (Barbara L Thomas)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
Subject: Re: Woodwinds (was Re: Cadets cymbal line)
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:57:44 GMT
Organization: Gustavus Adolphus College
NNTP-Posting-Host: dion.gac.edu

In article <1993Jan25.222007.16345@rigel.econ.uga.edu>  writes:
> That's the other thing I forgot.  It IS impossible for woodwinds to
> perform in wet weather without ruining pads.  I missed an entire high
> school football game because it was raining.  Never even went to the
> stadium.  As often as shows are called off on account of rain now, you
> add woodwinds and they will more than double.  

That's not necessarily true at all!  I am a woodwind player, several  
different ones in fact.  (I am working on the trumpet though, but think  
that I will have more success on the mellophone and flugal... I seem to  
work better in the lower registers... and don't have problems with keeping  
an even pitch.)  Anyway, I have marched countless times with both flute  
and saxes in the rain.  As long as you dry them out properly when you are  
done there is very little difference between brass and woodwind when  
playing in the rain.  So you can't use that excuse...  Not that I think  
that woodwinds should be in drumcorps although it would answer every dream  
I've ever had, but that is not one of the good reasons....

--
Barbara L. Thomas
"The World may never know."
bthomas@nic.gac.edu
From: stderic7@cicero.spc.uchicago.edu (Eric Camburn)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
Subject: Re: Opinion poll (was Re: where is everyone)
Date: 22 Jan 93 17:07:17 GMT
Organization: U of Chicago, SSPPCC

In article <1993Jan21.201750.14031@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> tmv@cupid.cc.bellcore.com (vandewater,thomas m) writes:
>Here's my 2 cents worth on your opinion polls....
>  
>In article <1jf9uqINNdkr@early-bird.think.com>, fath@mbcrr.dfci.harvard.edu (Michael Fath) writes:
>> 0.  Who will be the next non-Championship corps to win DCI (meaning of the 
>> corps who haven't won yet, who will win first)?
>  
>Blue Knights - I don't think Crossmen have a totally distinctive look and
>style yet to win championships.
>  
Other poll responses deleted.
I gotta disagree with you here.  I think the Crossmen have a very distinctive
sound at least.  One could, I think, make the argument that many drum corps
have a similar look (ie psuedo military uniform, plumes in hats, etc.).  
However, within their "New Age" format during the last couple of years
I think they have etablished a pretty unique sound.  For example, as a total
ensemble, I think the corps has come the closest I've heard to authentically
duplicating the "feel" of modern electronic music.  Very often, attempts
to put modern electronic music into the drum corps idiom comes out very 
schmaltzy (sp?) sounding.  There are some points of the Bluecoats show from 
last year that I would throw into this category (my very subjective opinion
here).  Sorry you '92 Bluecoats out there.  Similarly, at certain points I 
think the Crossmens' drum line did a good job of duplicating the feel 
of a modern set player.  I'm interested in hearing others' opinions
about translating modern electronic music (e.g. rock, new age, etc) 
into the drum corps idiom. 

++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++
|                    							   |
| Eric Camburn				abaeric7@polis.spc.uchicago.edu    |	
| Department of Education                                                  |
| University of Chicago                                                    |
|                                                                          |
++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++--++++
Xref: sparky rec.arts.marching.drumcorps:390 alt.drumcorps:2745 alt.colorguard:268
From: cf123@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Christopher Leigh Putnam)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps,alt.drumcorps,alt.colorguard
Subject: Attention Tom Sakoda!!!
Date: 23 Jan 1993 23:02:24 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cf123@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Christopher Leigh Putnam)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Sorry to waste bandwidth, but I still haven't heard from Tom Sakoda yet. 
The email you sent me doesn't have an address that I can send email back
to.  Please send me an email with a return address, or post it here.


Sorry to waste anyone else's time.
-- 
Chris Putnam (still a Blue Devils lover at heart)
Euphonium/Baritone
Star in '93?????
Go Devils Winterguard!!!!!
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: kab33254@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Hard Harry )
Subject: Re: Woodwinds (was Re: Cadets cymbal line)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 06:41:57 GMT

I have marched saxophone for 8 years now and
can certainly see that it *could* work in drum 
corps.  Sure, clarinets and piccs are kinda
weak, but saxes can really back up mellophones
and are certainly played with greater intonation.
With a decent mouthpiece saxes can play at
a volume that could add to almost any hornline.

The problems with this are #1 tradition
			   #2 weather isn't good on the horn
			   #3 with only 128 spots where do you cut?
			   #4 it isn't a bugle

I almost did PR Cadets back in 84 but the prospect of
putting down my sax and learning baritone didn't excite
me.  Now its too late to learn brass and besides, i would
have already aged out. so it goes.  Woodwinds would certainly
open up the activity for some, but is it worth the
hassle?

anyway ... just my $.02


-- 
{----------------------------------------------------------}
{        .. __o     Kevin A. Butler                        }   
{      ... -\<,     kab33254@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu              }                  
{___.....(_)/(_).._________________________________________}
From: dostal2060@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
Subject: Re: Small Talk
Date: 23 Jan 93 10:55:56 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

In article <1993Jan23.093410.10108@iscsvax.uni.edu>, phelps1230@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
> In article <1993Jan22.131452@IASTATE.EDU>, knights@IASTATE.EDU (Andrew H Combites) writes:
>> As I sit here and try to think of something to talk about, I was thinking of
>> some friends of mine that are marching in some Class A and A-60 or Division
>> II/III corps.  Whatever they are called now, I was wondering which of these
>> corps people like.  We spend so much time talking about the big guys that some
>> people might think there are only 12 or 17 or 25 corps out there.  Lets get some
>> opinions on some of the smaller corps.  We've all seen them at shows and surely
>> some of the things you have seen them do must be worth discussing?
> 
> I would beg to differ. Those of us still marching, and in Division I, have
> little chance of seeing the other divisions. I fact I had only seen one or two
> until finals this year. The Colts had the dubious honor of playing the anthems
> at II/III finals, and we had the rest of the night off to watch corps. What an
> eye opener! I would have never realized there was such talent in these groups.
> Somehow the division number sounds like it is denoting quality, not quantity. 
> This attitude was squashed in me as I watched corps after corps, and I cheered
> heartily when the Madarins won their title. Imagine ten horns putting out that
> much sound! Wow!
> I would strongly urge anyone who has the chance to check the other divisions
> out. Many of them have as much quality at top 12, but choose to remain small.
> 
[stuff deleted]

I agree.  Did anyone see Kiwanis' show last year?  They did a lot of Danny
Elfman stuff (The Simpsons, Beetlejuice, etc.) and it was a kill!  I guess the
Bart flags were what really got my attention.  Kiwanis' show was more
entertaining than several of the big corps' shows last year.  And how about
Northern Aurora?  One of the most improved corps around last year--horns
especially.  Pioneer--I like them better every year...  Mandarins were cool,
and Suncoast Sound (back as A Class) reallykicked last year.  Unfortunately, I 
didn't see most of these corps until Div. II/III finals--but it was worth it!

Jack Dostal
Bari/Euph
Colts 91, 92
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: knights@IASTATE.EDU (Andrew H Combites)
Subject: Re: 1993 Predictions
Reply-To: knights@IASTATE.EDU (Andrew H Combites)
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 22:29:37 GMT

In article <1jq1dpINNjle@gap.caltech.edu>, michaelw@cco.caltech.edu (Michael
Wong) writes:
> niel@cars.com (Niel Bornstein) writes:
> 
> >Well, having had a boring day at work, I've compiled your
> >predictions into the Unofficial r.a.m.d Contributors'
> >Poll.
> 
> >Your predictions so far (as of 1/21/93):
> 
> >1	Cadets of BC 
> .
> .
> .
> >19	Academie' Musical
> >20	Southwind 
> >tie	Troopers
> 
> 
> >Looks reasonable to me so far.  Any comments?
> 
> >Niel
> 
> 
> 	Exsqueeze me?  Baking powder?  I can't help but be a little 
> biased in my judgment but why would you think that Academie would enter
> top 25 this coming season?  What is the latest on Academie anyway?  I 
> presume they were rather good in 1990 when they broke top 25 but I never
> saw their show that year.  Did anyone see it who would care to give an
> opinion?
> 	
> Michael 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
>
*******************************************************************************
> * Michaelw@cco.caltech.edu      * "All work and no play makes John a Techer."
*
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *     California Institute of Technology     
*
> *    '89 baritone, '90,'91,'93 contrabass,  Mandarins Drum and Bugle Corps   
*


The first time I saw Academie' was during finals week at Buffalo.  The QC
Knights came in 6th place in A-60 that year and Academie' won.  None of us had
seen or heard them ever before so we wondered what they were really like.  After
the first phrases of their opener, I realized that they deserved to win.  There
hornline was only 20 members strong but sounded like about 45!  They were as
clean and perfect as anything.  Guard was super and the marching style was
excellent.  If they had 128 people with the same talent as the corps in 1990,
wevery other Top 12 corps might as well give up because they would easily win
every year.  In 1991, the corps did get bigger, but the talent level was not as
high.  I think all of this is remarkable since most of the kids play violins or
oboes as primary instruments and the average age of the corps was only 14 and a
half that year!  Way to go!

Later,
Andy
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: scottm@helena.stat.uga.edu (scott mclure)
Subject: Re: Small Talk
Organization: UGA Statistics Department
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 18:17:48 GMT

Being a little sentimental, I have loved watching Southwind come back to
power to take the last two Div. II titles.  For a smaller corps, they
have a very powerful hornline and a fun show.
From: bthomas@dion.gac.edu (Barbara L Thomas)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
Subject: Re: Woodwinds (was Re: Cadets cymbal line)
Date: 27 Jan 93 04:03:25 GMT
Organization: Gustavus Adolphus College
NNTP-Posting-Host: dion.gac.edu

In article <C1Fzy6.GEr@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>  writes:
> My old high school has been using odd percussion instruments for the  
last
> 5-6 years.  Bruce McConnell of the Bluecoats has been the wind and  
percussion
> arranger for us - he mainly introduced the odd instruments to us.  We  
have
> used hubcaps, brake parts, large springs and many other odd metal  
objects.
> 
> Our competition always made fun of our pit and the audience was always
> amused when watching us.  It is not every day that you see 3 people  
playing
> a set of hubcaps like a marimba.
> 
> Rob
> (rdorocke@ucs.indiana.edu)
> 
Our highschool band (sorry, I know this isn't drumcorps) did one song my  
senior year in which they used a vacuum cleaner and several other  
household appliances.  There was another one in which a large salami was  
used as a mallet for the gong before being thrown into the audience.

--
Barbara L. Thomas
"The World may never know."
bthomas@nic.gac.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: knights@IASTATE.EDU (Andrew H Combites)
Subject: Re: what are you people thinking??
Reply-To: knights@IASTATE.EDU (Andrew H Combites)
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:09:31 GMT

In article <1993Jan20.182520.7693@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>,
jwise@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Jeff Wise) writes:
>      As everyone else does, this is my personal disclaimer.  This post is my 
> opinion, and nothing but my opinion, and of course it's biased, otherwise it 
> wouldn't be my opinion.
> 
  Stuff Deleted...

> 
> Realism as of 1/20/93         Idealism as of 1/20/93
> ---------------------         ----------------------
> 1  Blue Devils                1  Cadets or SCV  (it doesn't matter ideally)
> 2  Cadets                     2  SCV or Cadets
> 3  SCV                        3  Blue Devils
> 4  Cavaliers                  4  Scouts
> 5  Star                       5  Crossmen
> 6  Crossmen                   6  Star
> 7  Scouts                     7  Bluecoats or Blue Knights (something Blue)
> 8  Phantom                    8  BK or Canton
> 9  BLuecoats                  9  VK
> 10 Freelancers               10  Phantom
> 11 Blue Knights              11  Boston
> 12 VK or Boston              12  Spirit
> 13 Boston or VK              13  Sky Ryders
> 14 Spirit                    14  Marauders
> 15 Glassmen                  15  Colts
> 16 Marauders                 16  Academie' or Southwind
> 17 Sky or Colts              17  Glassmen
> 
>      Whoever is in charge of the flame shield, let it go, I'll ride this one 
> out.
> 
> Jeff Wise
> Bluecoats 86-92
> Spirit Staff 93

Did you intentionally leave the Cavaliers out of your Ideal list for the top
12?

Just Wondering,
Andy
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: tmv@cupid.cc.bellcore.com (vandewater,thomas m)
Subject: Re: Opinion poll (was Re: where is everyone)
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 20:17:50 GMT

Here's my 2 cents worth on your opinion polls....
  
In article <1jf9uqINNdkr@early-bird.think.com>, fath@mbcrr.dfci.harvard.edu (Michael Fath) writes:
> 0.  Who will be the next non-Championship corps to win DCI (meaning of the 
> corps who haven't won yet, who will win first)?
  
Blue Knights - I don't think Crossmen have a totally distinctive look and
style yet to win championships.
    
> 0.5  Which non-Finalist corps will break into the top twelve first?
Glassmen, I guess...but how about Marauders?
  
> 1.  What is the best corps show of all time?
> 1984 Garfield Cadets 
I have to agree with that one.  Also 1987 Cadets, 1988 SCV (their first
Phamtom year).  
 
> 2.  What is the most difficult show of all time?
> 1991 Star of Indiana
Yes, I agree with that also. 
  
> 3.  Who is the best drill writer (past or present) of all time?
George Zingali - he reshaped and redefined the entire activity.
  
> 4.  Who is the best arranger (past or present) of all time?
Jim Prime has been the tops for the past 10 years...he gets my vote (if
that is what you meant)
  
> 5.  What was the best horn line of all time?
Nothing sticks out here... 
  
> 6.  What was the best drumline of all time?
I'm no drummer, but the drumline that was most memorable to me
was the Bridgemen from 79-82.
 
> 7.  What was the best colorguard of all time?
No idea....
  
> 8.  Who is your favorite corps?
Cadets, naturally, and whoever else tries to further the activity each year.
   
> 9.  Which corps will be the next to fade out?
Santa Clara...don't know what a new director is going to do with the corps.


That's it!
Tom
---
Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps
From: owens@cyclops.cambridge.ibm.com (Dave Owens)
Subject: Re: Opinion poll (was Re: where is everyone)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 93 14:48:19 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

In article <1993Jan21.201750.14031@porthos.cc.bellcore.com>, tmv@cupid.cc.bellcore.com (vandewater,thomas m) writes:
|> Here's my 2 cents worth on your opinion polls....
|>   
|> In article <1jf9uqINNdkr@early-bird.think.com>, fath@mbcrr.dfci.harvard.edu (Michael Fath) writes:
|> > 0.  Who will be the next non-Championship corps to win DCI (meaning of the 
|> > corps who haven't won yet, who will win first)?
|>   
|> Blue Knights - I don't think Crossmen have a totally distinctive look and
|> style yet to win championships.

It's funny how different two people's impressions can be.

Blue Knights are at the top of my non-unique-image-cookie-cutter-drum-corp
list.  I think the Crossman have, if nothing else, a very distinctive look
and style.

Go figure.

==============================================================================
   David Owens                    VMID:        ODAVID at YKTVMH
   SVS Multiplatform Development  Internet:    odavid@watson.ibm.com
   IBM Research                   
   One Copley Place               Disclaimer:  I am not a spokesman for IBM.
   Boston, MA 02116

   You are only young once, but you can stay immature indefinitely.
==============================================================================

Newsgroups: rec.arts.marching.drumcorps