From: jdelisle@udel.edu (J. G. Delisle)
Subject: Re: Marvel Implosion Imminent? (was: Re: Marvel copies DC... again)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Boyz from the Dwarf
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 04:39:00 GMT

In article <1iaojbINNaep@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>, intruder@cats.ucsc.edu (Isaac N. Truder) writes...
> [stuff about the horrible quality of Marvel UK deleted... besides, it's
>  all true] 
> 
>more.  I see nothing to attract me to these titles.  And as such, I have
>to agree with you that, sooner or later, these WILL be the first to go.

	I agree with you.. with one exception. Death's Head II seems to be
doing fairly well in the ratings, but the others are a lot lower. Look at
the Mys-Tech wars: the major players are the X-People, Shield, and the
Avengers. The UK heroes are just around for token appearances, it seems.

>My bet for the next to go will be the 2099 titles.  The problem with all

	I don't want to agree with you (Spiderman 2099 is fairly good, even
though I don't like Leonardi's art), but you're right: new universes are 
always the first to go.

>these "New Universes" that Marble and Dee See are trying to create, is
>that they're always doing pretty much the same old crap, without any
>ties to the original company Universe.  Nobody is willing to invest the

	Yes, but if the "new universe" titles have ties to the original line,
then not only are they not "new", they're just the same old crap in the same
place. 

>time to familiarize themselves with an entire new line of titles if they
>don't offer anything significantly different from the titles they're
>already reading.  The New Universe, no matter how many times they told
>us it was different from the Marvel Universe, was the same old crap --
>though at least at the beginning, it was done WORSE.  Probably third to

	I think the large part of that was people looking for Marvel-type
heroes in the real world... instead, they got "real people" heroes, who
weren't as exciting. Shooter eventually got it right (check out some early
issues of Valiant comics). 

>go (and they'll do it more quietly) will be the reprint titles -- one
>for the X-Men and TWO now for Spidey.  It may take longer to get rid of
>these because they're just so cheap, but probably after a while it won't
>be worth the effort.  And, I forsee a possible big storyline somewhere

	I doubt it. The reprint titles are probably the cheapest titles to
put out, and considering the fact that most of the issues being reprinted are
more expensive than the reprints, new collectors will keep buying them. 
	The ones to go will be:
	A. The ones with constant crossovers. Example: Marvel UK
	B. The less successful Big Push books. Examples: Cage (#87 of last
	   months top 100), Darkhold (#97), Nighstalkers (#84), and
	   Nomad (#89). Rise of the Midnight Sons and Big Guns books will
	   be first..
	C. All non-Marvel universe titles (2099, Marvel UK)

>in the future revolving around all the "New Heroes" being killed off (a
>sly way of getting rid of all the bombs like SLEEPWALKER, DARKHAWK,
>CAGE, etc.)  Stretching it here, but I think we all know what books at
>Marble are just not doing it, and will have to go in the eventual
>implosion.

	Kill off heroes? Marvel? Bahahahahaha! They'd cancel the books with
a double sized foil embossed cover (costing at least $2.95), and just take
away the hero's powers. Comebacks and crossovers -- increase interest in the
character, then re-start the series at issue #1, double sized, with a foil
embossed cover.

>WHEN will this implosion happen?  Who knows.  But if you read the recent
>MARVEL: FIVE FABULOUS DECADES... hardcover, you'll see that Marvel's
>history has been full of periods of expansion and then rapid cutbacks.

	Probably within 18 months. Tops. Marvel's annuals this summer won't
be the crossovers we all know and love, they'll be introducing new characters.
Previews hasn't listed any heroes who'll be debuting, but I'm sure all of them
will get their own titles within a few months. How many more titles can their
market support? Sooner or later, something will have to be cut. Most likely
the new titles that aren't doing well, and the non-Marvel books (UK, 2099).

>Anyway, a lot of doom-saying going on here, but it's all just theory.  I
>really would like to hear if anyone is willing to say Marvel is not
>setting themselves up for a fall this time.

	I agree with you... Marvel's market seems aimed for the younger 
crowd (differing opinions welcome) for the most part. They simply can't 
afford to buy more and more Marvel comics. Other companies (DC, Valiant)
tend to have a bigger share of the older market (ie, people with jobs) who
can afford more titles (well, in general). Marvel will just oversaturate
itself into a hole.
	Even when the fall comes, it won't be a deathblow for Marvel. Books
like Punisher, Spiderman, X-People, and Ghost Rider are hot properties...
the company could probably survive on them alone.


	Just MHO.
	Joe Delisle

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