HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Alfvaen)
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Alfvaen puts his name in the subject line...;-}
Keywords: and joins the picnic too
Date: 6 Apr 92 18:23:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: kakwa.1992Apr6.182334.19204
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada


Alfvaen finally decides to get around to having some picnic food...having  
been the first to actually do anything out on the meadow(obviously this  
means that his reading of Delta City part 3 is still in his relative  
future, although he remembers it distinctly...).

He wanders out past Stumpy and his periodically generated piles of  
soapboxes, and various people dancing at various altitudes, until he finds  
a picnic hamper with his name written on it in Georgian(his favourite  
alphabet).  On the top is a big button with "PRESS ME" written on it.   
Alfvaen, mindful that the beginning of April is not that far away(even  
though it's still Didi's birthday, which is proof enough of the Place's  
time-warping abilities)  ("Let's do the Time Warp again" kitten and  
Castellan sing from somewhere nearby).  Anyway, Alfvaen presses it and  
leaps back.

The hamper unfolds into a cushiony surface designed to offset the  
generally uneven nature of natural settings.  In the center are a number  
of trays of varying temperatures, undoubtedly designed by the makers of  
those things that keep hot things hot and cold things cold...Alfvaen lifts  
the lids in turn, growing increasingly delighted by the contents of  
successive dishes.  Hot boiled lobster, with a dish of butter...escargot  
with garlic butter and garlic toast...raw broccoli, turnips, carrots, and  
green onions with sour cream dip...cheddar cheese perogies with sour cream  
and real bacon... a Reuben sandwich generously stuffed with corned  
beef...and, to finish it off, a sour cream cheesecake.  Alfvaen licks his  
lips appreciatively.  "To whoever organized these picnic boxes--was it  
Nick?--my deepest appreciation.  Letting my imagination run wild is rather  
fun...  It's a good thing my wife isn't here--she's dieting for Lent."

"Of course, there is one drawback--now I'm hungry.  Have to go have lunch  
now...;-}"

--

---Alfvaen(and no, this isn't my real name!)
Canadian Network For Space Research, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
If you stand on your head, you will get footprints in your hair.
Current Album--She's Having A Baby Soundtrack
 "I know you have a little life in you yet
  I know you have a lot of strength left."
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
From: renglish@cello.hpl.hp.com (Bob English)
Subject: Becoming a murderer
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 18:48:06 GMT
Organization: Hewlett Packard Labs

Bob walks up to the bar and hands Mike a dollar. "A tall glass of your
bitterest brew," he says, then heads over to the line.

"At 12:01 AM on April 21, I will become a murderer.  The State of
California, acting in my name and in my behalf, will strap Robert Alton
Harris into a chair and drop cyanide tablets into a pail of acid, ending
his life.  I do not condone his acts, but neither do I wish for his
death.  I do not need his blood on my hands to restore my faith in a
just society.  80% of the people I see when I walk down the street do."

He raises his glass above his head.  "To those who feel their right to
kill outweighs the right of others to live without killing, and whose
thirst for blood makes murderers of us all, may your thirst be quickly
sated.  It is not only criminals who suffer when you kill, but all those
in whose name you act."

He drains his glass in one draught, then fires it into the flames and
walks slowly to his seat.

--bob--
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
From: lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Speaker-to-Minerals)
Subject: Re: Epistemological Question
Reply-To: lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 19:53:11 GMT

In article <9204082011.AA07993@yrloc.ipsa.reuter.COM>, dgil@ipsaint.ipsa.reuter.com (Gillett, David) writes:
>     I'm trying to put a few thoughts in order, and encountering a difficulty
>where concepts that seem obvious and intuitive are resisting formulation as
>clear epistemological distinctions.  I'm hoping that Ray can suggest a way
>around the difficulty, but copying the group since some of you others may have
>valuable insights as well.
>
>     My question is this:  I am given a piece of hearsay evidence about an
>event.  How do I distinguish between History (a record, of indeterminate
>accuracy, of a 'real' (we're talking epistemology, so those quotes stay for
>now!) event), and Fiction (an account, of indeterminate accuracy, of an event
>which was conceived but never enacted)?
>
>     I'm pretty certain that I/we *do* distinguish between these.  I'm looking
>for some epistemological *basis* for that distinction.

Well, for me, it comes down largely to a question of whether the accounts I
hear of the event have the right amount of consistency.  I've personally
rejected a philosophy of solipsism because I've concluded I'm not smart enough
to manage it.  I've also decided that I've never met anyone smart enough to
manage it.  So I look for things like:
	1)  Is there any claim made that the account I'm hearing can be
	    verified via physical evidence (even if that evidence is not
	    immediately accessible to me)?
	2)  Can I find several accounts that don't obviously spring from a
	    single original account?
	3)  Do the various accounts agree, more or less, on the features that
	    would have seemed most important at the time?
	4)  Do the accounts differ in minor details?
If the answers to all four questions are "yes," I conclude that the account is
likely to be history.  If none of the answers are "yes," I conclude it's
probably fiction.
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
From: ablanch@physics.su.OZ.AU (Shonias)
Subject: Re: abortion
Organization: School of Physics, University of Sydney, Australia
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 01:23:26 GMT

In article <204786@unix.cis.pitt.edu> seawasp+@pitt.edu (Ryk E Spoor) writes:
>	The Sea Wasp grins as they start trying to get rid of the soapboxes...
>silly creatures, as soon as anyone else starts talking more will just appear!
>[deleted (very valid) problems with the death penalty]
>	"The problem, though, is that it is VERY rare to encounter cases
>which are THAT horrid and THAT ironclad, wherein there is essentially NO
>doubt of the criminal's guilt or the enormity of their crimes."

"This is very true, and there is one (not altogether satisfactory)
alternative. In Australia we finally have a sentence that is called "life"
and means life. Never to be released. There is a big problem with this, 
and that is, that we have found a criminal, so vile that we have taken
his/her freedom away from them for all of their lives, but we are supporting
them, it costs society a lot of money to keep people in gaol. But, there\
is the element of doubt. One option is to allow the criminal the choice
to die. Not a lot would choose it, but some would, you only have to look
at the number of suicides in prisons. Some would choose to die, in which
case, they have obviously decided that they are guilty, and who can be
a better judge than the person themselves. I am not suggesting that this
is a total solution, but it seems such an obvious beginning, I don't
understand why it is not used."

"You were right Sea Wasp, they just keep piling up." She steps down,
only very narrowly missing hitting her head on the rafters, "There
are some advantages to being this short!"

Shonias
(Who is wondering why she got herself involved in this discussion...)


>
>				Sea Wasp


--
************************************
I have no need for moonlight
You're wrong to trust in sunlight
For I exist, not just in song,
But in life itself, in so many forms
To leave you cold.
************************************
From: seawasp+@pitt.edu (Ryk E Spoor)
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Re: abortion
Date: 12 Apr 92 17:32:50 GMT
Distribution: world,local
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


	The Sea Wasp, having read much of this discussion, finally tosses
his own comments in.

	"It's tough to argue with people when their positions are based from
a single proposition whose veracity cannot be established. In this case,
if you believe that human life truly begins at conception, then it's
inarguable (to me, at least) that  an abortion at any stage is murder.
	"I don't believe that, of course. If a collection of undifferentiated
cells is to be considered human, then, given techniques in cloning technology
now extant or soon to be in existence, I commit involuntary manslaughter
every time I bump into a wall and damage some cells, and a surgeon commits
mass murder with every operation.
	"My standard for human involves sufficient development to be capable
of thought beyond the animal level. That means that something which is 
outwardly human but the size of a dinner roll CANNOT be human; it has not
got the mass to have even the brain of a cat yet, no matter what it looks
like.
	"It's intelligence that distinguishes man from animal. If it
was something PHYSICAL, directly, that we called human, then a man with
a wooden leg would  be less human than he was before he lost his leg. I
don't accept that. It's the mind and the behavior that determine humanity,
or personhood. Thus, a truly self-aware machine which behaved in a human
fashion, would count in my book as human and infinitely more valuable than
a collection of 200 cells which might possibly develop into a human, but
might die *in vivo* or otherwise not survive to term, let alone to
adulthood.
	"Thus abortion is, to me, something which involves only ONE person
directly; the potential mother. And it is HER choice alone, at least 
until the third trimester when the status of the fetus starts to become
more questionable."

					Sea Wasp


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
.        ..               .             .        *           .      .
 .     .      :      .        _*_    .        .          .             ..
.   .     .   .      @---====OOOOO====---@~/^\    .     .       .       .
   .   *     .     ..         ^*^  .    .  ;;;      .      .      .   *
 :    .     .    .        .      .            .*         .     .        .
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interphase Accomplished. 
Sea Wasp docked, Outring Sector 5.
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
From: lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Speaker-to-Minerals)
Subject: Re: Simulation program NEEDED -- please help...
Reply-To: lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 21:23:13 GMT

In article <204728@unix.cis.pitt.edu>, seawasp+@pitt.edu (Ryk E Spoor) writes:
>
>	The Sea Wasp rematerializes, holding a familiar piece of paper.
>
>	"Apologies for those who have seen this before, but the prior
>postings of this request -- on this and other boards -- have gotten
>only ONE even partly useful response (thanx Bear!) and I'm hoping that
>there is another, easier solution to my problem than writing the thing
>myself [as a programmer, my skills went out in 1980 or so]. Thanks and
>respond if you can!"

Have you posted to sci.energy?
From: trumpins@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Barbara Trumpinski)
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Re: names
Date: 7 Apr 92 03:04:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: ux1.1992Apr7.030417.15440
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

In <1992Apr6.213302.14389@cs.rose-hulman.edu> lindercs@HYDRA.ROSE-HULMAN.EDU (Galadin (Craig Linderoth)) writes:

>In article <1992Apr6.130422.18174@gdt.bath.ac.uk>, ee8net@gdt.bath.ac.uk (Nicki Trasler) writes:
>>>	Galadin looks at kitten who is now in his arms looking at him
>>>expectantly.  He peers into her eyes and then with a sweep of his cane he
>>>changes the music into a .... Tango!!.
>>
>>Nicki, who's been providing the music for the dancing with the aid of
>>her guitar, looks up in astonishment as her hands start playing faster
>>of their own accord.  Looking at Galadin's face, however, she doesn't
>>resist the change but takes the music from his magic to her own.


>>
>>When they've finished dancing, Nicki looks pointedly at Galadin.
>>
>>"Please warn me next time you're going to do that!  After all, you only
>>needed to ask!"
>>
>>She grins at him to show she's not really annoyed.
>>
>>"Well, any time you need some music, just ask."
>	Sorry about that Nicki, I should have warned you.  I am pretty
>impressed with how quickly you were able to handle the change though.  Mike,
>give Nicki whatever she wants.  From now on I will make sure and ask and sorry
>again.

kitten, flushed and out of breath, can't speak at all, but she glows
to show how much she admires both the musical versatility and the
skillful dance partner....


--
***************************************************************************
conan the librarian a.k.a. kitten           /\ /\  barbara ann 
"my life's a soap opera, isn't yours?"      {=.=}
                                              ~   trumpins@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu 

"kittens today are not properly trained--the way that they were when
victoria reigned." asparagus (gus: the theatre cat)
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Re: All mind and no heart?
From: razer@tiamat.hacks.arizona.edu (THe Artful Dodger)
Date: 10 APR 92 18:05:46    
Reply-To: razer@tiamat.hacks.arizona.edu
 <1992Apr9.191453.29819@cco.caltech.edu> <1992Apr10.153419.6433@midway.uchicago.edu> <1992Apr10.213405.19118@bmerh2.bnr.ca>
Distribution: world,local
Organization: Razer IntressenGemeinschaft
Keywords: compassion
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-a4  

>In article <Mumble>, sjane@bmers248.bnr.ca (sjs) writ
>> Kateri
>>> lydick
>>
>>>"Consider the following:   Shared
>>>pain is lessened ONLY IF THE PERSON EXPERIENCING THE PAIN FREELY CHOOSES TO
>>>SHARE IT.  
>>
>>Kateri cheers, "Well said!"
>>
>>	"When someone you loves is in pain, your first instinct is to try to 
>>heal them, of course.  With our culture the way it is, the general rule seems
>>to be to try to talk it out.  While that can work, and you probably should 
>>make the offer, if they say they don't want to talk about it, listen to them!
>>Let it drop until *they* bring it up again."
> 
>sjane pops up from her lurking spot and exclaims, "Gee, that sure strikes a
>nerve, but what gets me is not so much 'talking about' the problem, its the
>advice offered to solve the problem!
> 
>Y'see, when I'm depressed and complaining about something, I'm looking for
>Compassion, not some quick fix-it scheme.  If some poor soul suggests a fix for
>me, I just get mad at them because (in my depressed, negative state) I see it
>as an indication that the other person thinks I can't fix the problem myself
>("So you think I'm stupid, do you?") !!
> 

	Arty smiles and pats Sjane on the head.  "I read an article 
in some magazine about a year ago which suggested that this is one of
the lagest stresses in a relationship.  Men tend to give advice when
women are only looking for compassion."

The Artful Dodger P65331727@CCIT.Arizona.Edu|Razer@Hacks.Arizona.EDU
"Can you imagine us years from today, sharing a park bench quietly?
  How terribly strange to be seventy!"
		-Paul Simon & Art Garfunkle "Old Friends" _Bookends_
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
From: aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Alfvaen)
Subject: Re: The Sentence From Nowhere
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 17:41:01 GMT

Alfvaen writes
> 
> "Wilma, you're a geek and a loser, and I don't want you on my softball  
> team."

Alfvaen's face turns beet red.  "Please disregard this post--I meant to  
type talk.bizarre, but my brain had other ideas.  No offense intended..."

He goes to hide his face in shame.
--

---Alfvaen(and no, this isn't my real name!)
Canadian Network For Space Research, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
If you stand on your head, you will get footprints in your hair.
Current Album--X:Ain't Love Grand
 "There's a big, ugly city out there."
From: trumpins@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Barbara Trumpinski)
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Re: abortion
Date: 12 Apr 92 14:01:40 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

In <1992Apr12.080231.1207@ucc.su.OZ.AU> ablanch@physics.su.OZ.AU (Shonias) writes:



>This also leads into many other issues, not the least of which is that
>of adoption, which, in Australia at least, is so actively discouraged,
>that it can cause far more pain and trauma than an abortion, I see easy
>adoption as being one real option for a woman (or couple) who don't want
>a child, but in Australia there seems to be this insane atttitude that
>you are some kind of unfeeling beast to give up your child. What is even
>more insane is that a woman will be made to feel even more guilty for
>giving a child up for adoption than having an abortion.This is primarily
>a result of the belief that there is an irreversible bonding that goes on
>during pregnancy. I have at least one counterexample to this claim in
>my family, and I DO NOT believe that this bonding is some physical,
>inevitable thing. I don't understand why the issues of abortion, adoption
>surrogacy, government child support and many other issues are so
>religiously separated, and no one ever looks at them all together.
>They are inseparable as far as I can see.


kitten jumps in on this one, too.....(i need SOMEBODY in my mailbox to
keep me busy so i won't get into these discussions)

"adoption is not easy here in the u.s. either.  i have a friend who
basically grew up in a foster home...oh, he lived with his
parents...but they were foster parents to several other children...he
saw a lot...and has carried it with him...i think the saddest thing i
ever heard was when he was telling me about one of these children who
died...and he was glad.  they child was handicapped, had been sexually
and physically abused and had no chance of any kind of "life" .  it
was virtually a vegetable and he said that it was better off dead,
even though the loss was unbelievably painful for all the folx who had
cared for it.

i work with a woman who is infertile...she has gone to doctor after
doctor and clinic after clinic...trying to get pregnant.  she and her
husband are trying to arrange for an adoption...the system is making
it impossible for her to get a child... all those people who
stand around outside abortion clinics and say...'give your baby up for
adoption' have NO clue what that entails...both for the woman involved
and anyone who wants to be an adoptive parent..."

kitten has started ranting....time to do something else....
--
***************************************************************************
conan the librarian a.k.a. kitten           /\ /\  barbara ann 
"my life's a soap opera, isn't yours?"      {=.=}
                                              ~   trumpins@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu 

"kittens today are not properly trained--the way that they were when
victoria reigned." asparagus (gus: the theatre cat)
From: rmarsh@waikato.ac.nz
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Nightfall
Date: 9 Apr 92 02:19:29 +1200
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

  Stumpy is lying on his back munching his way through a roast chicken leg 
courtesy of Nicki's picnic menu and gazing at the sky. The shirt of many 
colours changes yet again, to a deep indigo flecked with pinpoints of white
light. Stumpy closes his eyes and concentrates willing the onset of night 
and is rewarded by a spreading of colour in the sky. Stumpy opens his eyes,
gets to his feet and walks into the bar.
  "Port please Mike, and some matches." Mike produces the port and a
matchbook.
  "Hope you're not planning to burn my place down." He says in mock serious
tones. Stumpy smiles and tosses him a kiwi dollar then picks up the
matchbook and glass and heads back out into the meadow toward the pile of
ex-soapboxes. He casts about until he finds a relatively flat piece of
ground to put his port down on, then opens the matchbook and removes a
match.
  "I guess this fire will take a while to build itself up properly,
hopefully the daylight will last until it does." Stumpy strikes the match and
sets light to the bottom of the stack of wood. Picking up his glass he
steps back and scuffs a line in the the grass with his foot. 
  "I would wait until dark to do this, it seems appropriate to do it with
stars in the sky, but it's already long past time I paid my respects." 
  Standing at the line he has so recently enscribed, Stumpy drains the 
glass, his shirt turning a shade that might be read to indicate a certain 
level of intoxication.
 "To Isaac Asimov, one of the greats. And to Death, may he choose not to
take us until we are ready." He pitches the glass to its destruction in the
slowly spreading fire and returns to his place at the picnic. For the rest
of the evening his shirt shows a mixture of starry night scenes, deep 
evening colour and fire hues.

-- 
Robert 'Stumpy' Marsh | Brought to you from the bottom of the world
rmarsh@waikato.ac.nz  | both topographically and socio-politically.
+64 7 855 4406        | Whatever happened to Godzone?
    SnailMail: 95 Fairfield Rd, Hamilton, Aotearoa (New Zealand)
From: daq@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Doug Quarnstrom)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 18:16:15 GMT
Subject: Re: Isaac Asimov has left us.
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: alt.callahans

In alt.callahans, aralph@cix.compulink.co.uk (Alan Ralph) writes:

> He died yesterday. No doubt the obits will be flying in by the ton.
> 
> "The man who laid down the Laws of Robotics."
> *CRASH!*
> 
> Alan Ralph <-> Kimberley MonTemplar

The first law of Robotics is:

Never let them see you sweat.

doug
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Monday, 13 Apr 1992 18:52:46 EDT
From: Abner Mintz <AXM113@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: re: abortion

Something kitten said a while back touched off a memory.

One of my friends my freshman year was very pro-life (not for religious
reasons, either ... he was a Marxist socialist!) and I am pro-choice.

I once, trying for reducio ad absurdum, pointed out to him that if a pregnant
woman drinks alcohol, she can severely harm the fetus.  Similarly with smoking.
If we're truly trying to protect the fetus, shouldn't this be prevented?
Furthermore, this exposure can harm the fetus even if the woman doesn't know
she's pregnant yet (in this case, miscarriages can be induced - the woman has
a chemically-induced abortion without even knowing).

I then asked him if he was going to try to prevent this too, and if so, how in
a way that allowed freedom for the prospective mother?

I swear, I'm innocent, I only meant to give him something to think about ...

A few days later, he told me that he thought that it should be made illegal
for women between the ages of menense (sp?) and menopause to buy, possess, or
use alchohol or cigarettes ...

I don't argue about abortion much anymore.  It's too dangerous.
From: AXM113@psuvm.psu.edu (Abner Mintz)
Newsgroups: alt.callahans
Subject: Re: Potstickers
Date: 8 Apr 92 13:06:32 GMT
 <rr6gqINN84c@agate.berkeley.edu> <1992Apr7.153853.10621@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu>
 <92099.085819AXM113@psuvm.psu.edu>
Organization: Penn State University

Tizrak smiles.

"Was that actually the Giant under there, or me just throwing my voice?  Only
the Giant knows for sure ..."