HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hap@scubed.com (Hap Freiberg)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: "Jehovah" TRIBE OF SPACE CANNIBALS
Date: 9 Oct 92 23:22:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: scubed.1992Oct9.232255.985
Organization: S-CUBED, A Division of Maxwell Labs; San Diego CA

In article <1992Oct6.171654.1567@cnsvax.uwec.edu> mcelwre@cnsvax.uwec.edu writes:
>
>          
>                          CONTRADICTIONS about God
>
>               Christians should all HONESTLY and thoroughly 
>          investigate the CONTRADICTIONS between the Old and New 
>          Testaments in terms of their descriptions of God. 
>
>               The God of the New Testament is described as a God of 
>          LOVE, MERCY, and PEACE. 
>
>               The god of the Old Testament is described as a JEALOUS, 
>          VENGEFUL god, a WAR-MONGER.  He said "Thou shalt not kill", 
>          and then proceeded to help the Israelites to kill TENS OF 
>          THOUSANDS of Arabs in order to take their land.  [And the 
>          zionist PIG$ from Israel are still doing it today!] 
>
>               Can the two Testaments POSSIBLY be talking about the 
>          same thing?! 
>
>
>               The "god" of the Old Testament was actually a TRIBE OF 
>          RENEGADE SPACE CANNIBALS, with a leader named "Yahweh", who 
>          was the commander of a UFO SPACECRAFT ("pillar of fire", 
>          "pillar of cloud", etc.), and a GENETICIST who CLONED Adam 
>          and Eve FROM HIMSELF and put them on this planet which was 
>          ALREADY INHABITED at that time.  And the "first born sons" of 
>          the Israelites became ROAST DINNER for the "JehovahS". 
>
>               All of this may sound UN-believable to most Christians.  
>          But try reading the Old Testament with these things in mind.  
>          For example, read the part about one of the Old Testament 
>          characters, Jacob, I think, WRESTLING WITH GOD, AND WINNING!  
>          [ ALWAYS use the KING JAMES VERSION.  Later versions are PER-
>          VERSIONS! ] 
>
>               See also the book "THE LOST TRIBES FROM OUTER SPACE", by 
>          Mark Dem (?). 
>
>
>
>               UN-altered REPRODUCTION and DISSEMINATION of this 
>          IMPORTANT Information is ENCOURAGED. 
>
>
>                                   Robert E. McElwaine
>                                   B.S., Physics and Astronomy, UW-EC
>
>

Man, you sure must have taken some bad drugs...Were I you,
which I thankfully am not, I would either take something
else or give up drugs altogether.

Hope this helps.

Hap
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: fsars@acad3.alaska.edu (Allen R Sparks)
Subject: Re: What does BC really mean?
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 22:57:35 GMT

In article <28466@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM>, wats@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM (Bruce Watson) writes:
> I'm bothered by the fact that there is no year zero in the A.D. B.C scheme.
> I'd assumed that this happened because the scheme was created before 
> the zero was in common use in the west.
> 
> -- 
> Bruce Watson (wats@scicom)  Tumbra, Zorkovick; Sparkula zoom krackadomando.  

As a result of there being no year year zero, the year 2001 is really
the beginning of the 21st century instead of the year 2000.  Yet, most
people will celebrate the year 2000 as the beginning of the new
century.  This bothers a lot of people too.  === Al Sparks
From: wats@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM (Bruce Watson)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: Identify this series, please.
Date: 6 Oct 92 20:38:14 GMT
Organization: Alpha Science Computer Network, Denver, Co.

In article <1992Oct4.024831.9795@panix.com+ jwp@panix.com (JongWoo Park) writes:
+
+
+Please identify this show.  Here are some hints.
+1) It's a documentary series about WWII.
+2) Each episodes ends with a shot of grave yard with many white
+   crosses.
+3) I am not sure, but I think it was made by BBC.
+4) I saw this in mid-70s in Korean.  The Korean title translated to
+    English is "The Tumultuous Century".
+
+If anyone can identify this series, I will appreciate greatly.
+Thank you.
+-----
+Jongwoo "Ain't it fun to be crazy?" Park     jwp@panix.com

I think you are referring to "World at War". I saw it in the US in
the mid-70's. It was on either A&E or Bravo on cable or our local
PBS outlet in just the past few months.

-- 
Bruce Watson (wats@scicom)  Tumbra, Zorkovick; Sparkula zoom krackadomando.
From: cramer@optilink.UUCP (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: World Culture and Western Culture
Date: 7 Oct 92 16:50:34 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA

In article <1992Oct6.152054.18015@cbnewsi.cb.att.com>, hlin@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (hua.t.lin) writes:
> >In article <1992Oct1.224600.17393@nntp.hut.fi> c34657b@saha.hut.fi (Tuomas Viljanen) writes:
> >>where; when mankind discovered iron, it immediately began to forge swords. If
> >>the Chinese had discovered tthe nuclear fission, they surely would have immed-
> >>iately began to build atomic bombs. No need for Western depravity for this.
> 
> OK. The Chinese invented gun-powder, but did not use them in war.

They didn't use them for projectiles, but they certainly did use
gunpowder in warfare.  Rockets were used to startle and surprise
their enemies.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
Lesson learned from Gov. Wilson's signing of AB 2601: if you don't get 
your way, have a riot.  Next time, Gov. Wilson will cower appropriately.
From: visser@convex.com (Lance Visser)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: pre-WWI book opinion sought
Date: 17 Oct 92 02:03:45 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In <23984@optima.cs.arizona.edu> patrick@cs.arizona.edu (Patrick T. Homer) writes:


+>While browsing in the local B. Dalton's last weekend, I came across the
+>book:
+>	Dreadnought
+>	by Robert K. Massie
+>There was also a sub-title, but I don't remember that precisely.  From
+>the book cover, it's subject matter is the events leading up to WWI, 
+>mostly among the British and the Germans.  As this was an area I know
+>next-to-nothing about, I was intrigued.  However, before shelling out
+>the bucks for the book, I thought I'd tap the net's wisdom about this.
+>Has anyone read the book?  How accurate is it?  Is it easy/difficult to
+>read?

	Massie wrote Nicolas and Alexandria as well as Peter the Great 
just in case you have read either.  I would classify the style as sort
of popular history centering on personalities moreso than events in
and of themselves.

	Nonetheless its a very good and easy to read history of english
and german naval competition (and relations in general) leading up
to the first world war.

	The downside (for me anyway) is that the book is telling things
from the british perspective and goes into far more detail on british 
politics than german politics of the era.  They hit the kaiser and
the usual "big" German figures, but most of it comes out from the
traditional british view of the situation.

	Its very easy (as these things go) to read.  
I can't fault its accuracy much, but then again Massie's books as far
as I can remember are not usually full of new revelations anyway.
He usually never departs from traditional history in terms of events
and their importance.  
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: mls@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (mike.siemon)
Subject: Re: What does BC really mean?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 18:20:22 GMT
Summary: zeros

In article <28466@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM>, wats@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM
(Bruce Watson) writes:

> I'm bothered by the fact that there is no year zero in the A.D. B.C scheme.
> I'd assumed that this happened because the scheme was created before 
> the zero was in common use in the west.

The A.D. scheme was invented by Dionysius Exiguus in the 4th century,
and yes zeros were not in common use then.  (As someome else has pointed
out, the spread of the usage in later Europe had much to do with Bede
using it as the chronographic framwork of his history of the English
church.)

Old Dennis constructed his scheme in connection with Easter calculations
(which is where Bede picked it up from.)  It is worth noting that the
part of the Easter scheme involving the 19-year lunar cycle was treated
in a way that *implicitly* takes the year before 1 A.D. as the zero point
for a modulus operation to calculate the "Golden Number" of a year.  It
was generally the case that astronomical tables (as in Ptolemy) in late
Hellenistic practice used a circular symbol for 0 (a slight extension of
Babylonian practice that somewhat earlier still used a space for 0.)
-- 
Michael L. Siemon		   "Oh, stand, stand at the window,
					As the tears scald and start;
mls@usl.com			   You shall love your crooked neighbor
standard disclaimer			With your crooked heart."
From: crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: What does BC really mean?
Date: 11 Oct 92 19:39:42 GMT
Organization: Syracuse University

In article <4645@moscom.com> de@moscom.com (David Esan) writes:
>In article <1992Oct8.130423.8057@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> rrothaus@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Richard Rothaus) writes:
>>used a new dating system that paralleled the A.D. system except backward.  He
>>introduced this in a French textbook in the 17th century using a.C.  (apres
>>Christ) which was adopted by English speaking scholars as B.C.
>
>My French is a little rusty, but apres means after (as in "Apres moi, le deluge"
>of Louis XV).  a.C. would correspond to AD, not BC.  
>
      

How about "Avant Christie?" It works. Can you forgive Rusty French?

Chris Dunlea
crdunlea@rodan.syr.edu
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: blucey@vax1.tcd.ie
Subject: Re: UN-WISE QUOTES from the Past
Organization: Trinity College Dublin
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 11:25:24 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.021035.9084@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, pdunn@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Patri

" There is a world market for about 5 Computers"
Tom Watson Sr.
Chairman IBM 1943



Brian M Lucey
School of Business 
Trinity College, Dublin
                                                
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Re: Thomas Jefferson
In-reply-to: C05705DA@WUVMD's message of Wed, 07 Oct 92 08:15:38 CST
Organization: pubs
Date: 7 Oct 92 12:36:30 CDT

Someone at Washington University writes:

   Thomas [Jefferson] disliked slavery much more than 
   Abraham Lincoln did.

This statement is ridiculous: unsupported, unmeasurable, untrue.

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 12:28:33 EDT
From: <DXZ102@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: LOOKING FOR A FEW GOOD HAMS

I'm looking for source material on amateur radio operators, specifically
diaries, logs, or journals from around 1906 to 1920. If someone could direct
me to these sources I would be most greatful. Thanks!

Newsgroups: soc.history
From: deacon@apelc5.inf.ethz.ch (Andrew Deacon)
Subject: Re: Enigma Codes and Alan Turing
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 20:30:54 GMT

In article <1992Oct9.155826.12396@cs.brown.edu>, dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:
|> morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay) writes:
|> 
|> #I've just been to see the rather good play "Breaking the Code" about
|> #the life and tragic end of Alan Turing.
|> #In the pub afterwards, disagreemenst ensued about whether Turing
|> #did have a brainwave than enabled British scientists to decipher
|> #the code or not.
|> 
|> He did break the code, more accurtaely he led a group of mathemticians
|> and engineers who did it. 

Its always difficult to know who should get the credit. The three Polish
mathemticians felt that they did the initial work (the British never used
them although they offered to help). Most of the poeple in the group
cracking the codes were not mathemticians but professors of German, History
and Classics. I think Turing moved around a bit and was not always with
the code cracking group.  

|> 
|> #Did the Allies capture a code-book?
|> 
|> I think they only captured the machine, but not the code-book,
|> so a lot of work was necessary to break the code. If I am not
|> mistaken they got it when a German submarine surrendered.

The Enigma code machine consisted of a number of rotating discs (origionaly
three and later five). Each rotor discs translated an incoming letter to
an outgoing one - these were known by the Polish - but were changed at the
outbreak of war (but could not be changed very often). They did work these
out for the different arms of the German millitary.

Every day the rotors had to be set in a specific order and position to
synchronize the sender and receivers machines. At first the Polish found 
that the Germans used ABC - later QWE (top left three letter on the keyboard).
But this changed dring the war. What they needed to do to find the start 
position was to guess a word (or words) in a message and then work out all the
rotor possitions that could produce the known word and then decode the
rest of the message and see if it made sense. I am not sure of all they
ways the used to establish a starting position - or if they used code-books - 
but the mistakes operators made were exploited.

Sometimes things went well and they were able to break a whole lot of
messages, at other times when the Germans changed something, they had
no luck for months sometime.

One of the problems was that the Navy used codes for positions and weather
information. They did eventualy get a code-book from some boat which
then allowed them to understand the codes in the coded message. Is this
possible the code book being refered too? 
 
|> #Can anyone tell the whole story?

As far a I know the details of the work done is still secret! Thus the
stories about the code breaking are rather fragmented. 

I read about this stuff some years ago - so...

- Andrew Deacon (deacon@inf.ethz.ch)
From: de@moscom.com (David Esan)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: What does BC really mean?
Date: 9 Oct 92 12:30:37 GMT
Organization: Moscom Corp., Pittsford NY

In article <1992Oct8.130423.8057@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> rrothaus@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Richard Rothaus) writes:
>used a new dating system that paralleled the A.D. system except backward.  He
>introduced this in a French textbook in the 17th century using a.C.  (apres
>Christ) which was adopted by English speaking scholars as B.C.

My French is a little rusty, but apres means after (as in "Apres moi, le deluge"
of Louis XV).  a.C. would correspond to AD, not BC.  


-- 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 -->     David Esan      de@moscom.com  
 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: hyde@cs.dal.ca (Bill Hyde)
Subject: Re: Enigma Codes and Alan Turing
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 15:27:56 GMT

In article <Bvuxuv.2L7@dcs.ed.ac.uk>, morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay) writes:
|> I've just been to see the rather good play "Breaking the Code" about
|> the life and tragic end of Alan Turing.
|> 
|> In the pub afterwards, disagreemenst ensued about whether Turing
|> did have a brainwave than enabled British scientists to decipher
|> the code or not.
|> 
|> Did the Allies capture a code-book?

	It is very complicated, and the story is told in a biography
	of Turing (called, I think, "The Enigma") by a british
	mathematician (Hodges?).

	The poles captured a german coding machine, but simply having
	the machine did not mean that messages could be decoded,
	as the settings had to be known.  Fortunately, the Polish
	mathematical tradition was very strong between the wars,
	and through the use of group theory the poles were able
	to decode some messages.  The machine and this information
	were sent to the U.K. before the fall of Poland.

	During the war the germans several times changed their encoding
	machines, generally making them much more complex, so Turing
	and his fellow workers (three of whom, coincidently, were
	chess masters - of which there were only about a dozen in the
	U.K. at that time) were kept busy breaking ever more complex
	codes.  Eventually a computer had to be built to aid in the
	cracking - though without the mathematical work, even the
	computer couldn't have cracked the code fast enough to be
	useful.


	The above is what I remember from Hodges book, read some
	years ago.  Probably someone on sci.military or some math
	group can give you greater detail.

						Bill Hyde
Department of Oceanography
Dalhousie University,
Halifax, Nova Scotia
hyde@Ice.ATM.Dal.Ca or hyde@dalac
From: v128juxa@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (SCHUYJUANNAH)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: Thomas Jefferson
Date: 7 Oct 92 19:21:00 GMT
Organization: SUNY@Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <92281.081532C05705DA@wuvmd.wustl.edu>, C05705DA@WUVMD writes...
>this to be one of his four great acheivemnets.  Thomas disliked slavery
>much more than Abraham Lincoln did.

Probably because Tom was a slave owner and Abe was not (to my knowledge).
If a person owned slaves and he wanted to free them, but couldn't, he 
*would* dislike it quite alot!
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: MJFORRES@SUVM.SYR.EDU (maurice)
Subject: Re: UN-WISE QUOTES from the Past
Organization: Syracuse University
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 12:46:13 EDT

In article <1992Oct14.021035.9084@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
pdunn@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Patrick L Dunn) writes:
 
>Along these lines, the head of the US patent office just after the Civil War
>made a statement that the patent office should be shut down because everything
>that could possibly be invented already had been (I can't remeber exactly what
>he said.
 
I remember hearing an NPR report a few years ago which debunked this
story.  A man who claimed to have done extensive research on this
said that he could find no evidence that any director of the Patent
Office ever said any such thing.  But that's all I remember from the
NPR report. . . .
 
Maybe followups should go to alt.folklore.urban?
 
maurice
                                                 Maurice Forrester
                                                 mjforres@suvm.syr.edu
From: chrisp@regenmeister.Sun.COM (Chris Prael)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: Enigma Codes and Alan Turing
Date: 13 Oct 1992 23:35:07 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: regenmeister

From article <1992Oct9.203054.21146@neptune.inf.ethz.ch>, by deacon@apelc5.inf.ethz.ch (Andrew Deacon):
> In article <1992Oct9.155826.12396@cs.brown.edu>, dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:
> |> morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay) writes:
> |> 
> |> #I've just been to see the rather good play "Breaking the Code" about
> |> #the life and tragic end of Alan Turing.
> |> #In the pub afterwards, disagreemenst ensued about whether Turing
> |> #did have a brainwave than enabled British scientists to decipher
> |> #the code or not.
> |> 
> |> He did break the code, more accurtaely he led a group of mathemticians
> |> and engineers who did it. 
> 
> Its always difficult to know who should get the credit. The three Polish
> mathemticians felt that they did the initial work (the British never used
                ^^^^^^^^^
                eh?
> them although they offered to help). 

The Poles did the initial theoretical and practical work, including 
developing the first piece of machinery.  When the  Germans conquored
Poland, they took their work and equipment to France.  The French, then,
shared the Poles work and equipment with the British.  This sharing by
the French was the beginning of the British effort.  It must also be
noted that the Poles had successfully broken at least a couple instances
of Enigma encryption, but they were not yet able to do this with
sufficient regularity.  

As you say, the Poles offered their services to the British and were
turned down.  However, it is nessicary to note that when the British
turned the Poles down, they were in possesion of the Poles papers and
the equipment they had developed.

> |> #Can anyone tell the whole story?
> 
> As far a I know the details of the work done is still secret! Thus the
> stories about the code breaking are rather fragmented. 
> 
> I read about this stuff some years ago - so...
> 
> - Andrew Deacon (deacon@inf.ethz.ch)

The enigma documentation was made public in the mid 70s. A number of
books on the subject were printed then.  This has all been quite public
for a good while, now.

Chris Prael
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: rrothaus@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Richard Rothaus)
Subject: Re: What does BC really mean?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 13:26:32 GMT

























Mea culpa.  Avant, obviously not apres.
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: alan@solb1.essex.ac.uk (Alan M Stanier)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Sir Ralph Hansby
Date: 9 Oct 92 09:48:59 GMT
Reply-To: alan@essex.ac.uk
Organization: University of Essex Computing Service, Colchester CO4 3SQ, UK

I am trying to find out more about the life of Sir Ralph Hansby, who
fought on the Royalist side in the English Civil War. Can anyone
point me at a reference?

Thanks


--
   Alan M Stanier   |   alan@essex.ac.uk   |   +44 206 872153
Favourite Error Message: no administrator found for LEVEL-SEVEN
Newsgroups: soc.history,sci.econ
From: sug6@amber.uchicago.edu (Patrick Sugent)
Subject: Re: What was the cause of the 1930s depression?
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 15:00:44 GMT

peercy@crhc.uiuc.edu (Mike Peercy) writes:
>This caused a run on US gold, being the only nation still on the gold
>standard, at a greatly undervalued exchange rate due to the preceding
>inflation.  The reaction by the Fed was the raising of interest rates
>(just like in Britain very recently)--the worst thing that can happen
>in a depression.  A new wave of banks failed, and the US entered the
>darkest depths of '32-'33.  FDR suspended gold payments in '33.
>
>Now to return to the world of make believe, there are many near-
>parallels between the 20's and the 80's.  In the 20's, there was
>a large growth in the money supply.  In the 80's it was and is a
>large growth in the _future_ money supply (in form of debt).  Also
>the similarities between Bush and Hoover are, I'll admit, staggering.
>
>However, a rant about "deregulation" and "merger mania" and "supply
>side economics" in the 20's needs a little more substantiation than
>a landslide victory for Clinton, no?

  Ah, a much more reasonable article than the post you were responding
to.  I would like to add the effect of Smoot-Hawley protectionism to your 
list of "things that made the depression worse".  Also, many will add that
"The New Deal" did a great deal of economic harm causing the depression
to be longer and deeper. However, that is more debatable.

  Also, I would like to add the Bush has been more the President of
"re-regulation" not deregulation.  In terms of just numbers of regulations,
Bush has nearly undone most of what Reagan did with "de-regulation". 
(By looking at pages of regulations, not the best way, but one of the
simplest. :-) )


Pat


-- 
Patrick Sugent				E-mail me if you really want  
sug6@amber.uchicago.edu 		a response.  My USENET reading
(708) 447-1771				is haphazard at best.
Xref: sparky soc.history:8904 bit.listserv.history:5207
From: patricka@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Patrick Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.history,bit.listserv.history
Subject: 1948-49 West Berlin Blockade?
Keywords: Ernst Reuter
Date: 10 Oct 92 02:09:09 GMT
Followup-To: soc.history
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.


Anyone care to expound on the 1948-49 West Berlin blockade
& the role of Ernst Reuter?
 
Love,
Zemu
 
"Ronald Reagan: a triumph of the embalmer's art." - Gore Vidal