HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: vek@spacsun.rice.edu (Vincent E. Kargatis)
Subject: Re: Zorn: Spillane and the recent Japanese releases
Organization: Rice University
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 04:05:06 GMT

Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> regarding "Spy vs. Spy:"
> it makes perfect sense. I do agree that it just didn't come out too well
> on some songs ("Lonely Woman" for instance), but overall good.

They didn't do Lonely Woman onthat album. NC *did* do it on NAKED CITY, with a
kind of Roy Orbison groove. :)
 
> Anyone heard the new Henry Threadgill release on Axiom yet? any impressions?

Upon first listen, my favorite of the three albums. Very very good.
-- 
| Vincent Kargatis		     |	Dept. of Space Physics & Astronomy |
| vek@spacsun.rice.edu		     |	Rice University, Houston, TX       |
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Albert Ayler
From: kenz@local.host
Date: 21 Jan 93 09:47:41 -0600
Reply-To: kenz@local.host
Organization: Organization, City, State, etc.

In article <RSHAPIRO.93Jan19111721@kariba.bbn.com>, rshapiro@bbn.com (Richard Shapiro) writes:
>	<1993Jan19.023319.9862@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
>Organization: BBN, Cambridge MA
>Lines: 13
>NNTP-Posting-Host: kariba.bbn.com
>In-reply-to: wjh@cbnewsl.cb.att.com's message of 19 Jan 93 02:33:19 GMT
>
>In article <1993Jan19.023319.9862@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> wjh@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (william.j.hery) writes:
>   >* DIW issued THE FIRST RECORDINGS VOL. 2 - made from a used vinyl
>
>   The question is was there ever a Vol. 1? I've never seen it on CD, and
>   from Sandeep's comments wonder if there was an LP Vol 1, but they never
>   found a copy to put on CD? 
>
>
>There's an old lp release of volume 1, still available from Cadence.
>Unfortunately I don't remember the label offhand (contact me by email
>if you want that info, and I'll check when I get home). It's just
>called THE FIRST RECORDINGS -- no volume indication. The material is
>similar to vol. 2.

The first recordings was issued by GNP Crescendo (GNP-9022), in 1973.  
Liner notes by Charles Fox.  This includes the pieces "I'll Remember
April", " Rollins' Tune", "Tune Up", and "Free", all standards except
for "Free" written by Ayler.  According to Slim at Cadence, this is 
indeed the same as the so-called Volume 1 from DIW.  I don't see it 
listed in the latest Cadence, however I have seen copies in stores in
Minneapolis on LP.

Lord's Discography gives a fairly comprehensive list of Ayler recordings
and the various labels the music has been issued on.  I can give a rundown of
what I have later with annotations.  

Bill Kenz
Moorhead State U. 
Library
Moorhead, MN  56563
internet  kenz@mhd1.moorhead.msus.edu



Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote,rec.music.info,rec.answers,news.answers
From: cook@bebop.esd.sgi.com (Doug Cook)
Subject: Re: Clinton raises the dead at inaugural
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 19:05:36 GMT


In article <Jan21.172455.73312@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>, gordons@CS.ColoState.EDU writes:
> 
> Readers of the Denver Post were happy to read that President Clinton sat in
> last night with an all-star band of Herbie Hancock and Thelonius Monk.

Apparently, it's true. The Monk in question was Thelonious Jr., on
drums.

	-Doug

Doug Cook, cook@sgi.com		Software Engineer	 Silicon Graphics, Inc.

"...Men ought to be treated well or crushed, because they can avenge themselves
of lighter injuries, of more serious ones they cannot..."	-Machiavelli
From: rardin@binah.cc.brandeis.edu (R. Lynn Rardin)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Cadence order is nigh - opinions please!
Date: 27 Jan 93 18:06:24 GMT
Reply-To: rardin@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University

In article <1k6i6kINNaa0@hpfcbig.sde.hp.com>, mjs@fc.hp.com (Marc Sabatella) writes:
>Michael G. McMahon (mcmahon@owlnet.rice.edu) wrote:
> 
>> Michel Camilo Trio: "Suntan"  Evidence 22030
>>   Just wondering how Michel comes across in a trio format.  Is this a
>> very early album?  Also, who are the other 2?  That could make a great
>> deal of difference.  
>
>I've never heard him in anything but a trio format, so I guess I can't compare
>his trio work to whatever you are familiar with.  He has that same kind of
>Chick Corea / Eddie Palmieri sound that Gonzalo Rubalcaba does, but much
>slicker, and without the overtones of Cecil Taylor.  On the trio albums I've
>heard, he is so dominating pianistically that it hardly matters who the bassist
>or drummer are.

The sidemen on SUNTAN are Anthony Jackson (b) and Dave Weckl/Joel Rosenblatt 
(d), I believe.  Like Marc, I'm most familiar with Camilo in a trio setting.  
Personally, I prefer MICHEL CAMILO or ON FIRE to SUNTAN.  S just didn't grab 
me the way the others did.

-Lynn  (rardin@auriga.rose.brandeis.edu)
From: wjh@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (william.j.hery)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Penguin Guide: Short Review & 5 Star Recordings
Date: 26 Jan 93 04:11:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbnewsl.1993Jan26.041130.18061
Organization: AT&T

andys@Ingres.COM (Andrew Sherman) writes:
>One thing I really like is that there is a consistent voice (or
>should that be two voices?). It's not like the Rolling Stone Jazz
>Record Guide where you don't know if the reviewer of any particular
>artist is their biggest fan or their worst enemy....

In reading the reviews, I don't find them to be completely consistent--in
fact some records which are co-led are reviewed under both artists and in 
at least one case got different ratings!

Although there are only 2 authors listed, and there is no reference I can
find to any other reviewers, I find it hard to believe that this is entirely
the work of two reviewers, especially if the recordings are reviewed with
any care (meaning several close listenings). At 1200 pages and many reviews
per page, ther seem to be well over 10,000 albums reviewed. The average
time for CDs seems to be approaching 60 minutes (compared to 45-50 minutes
for LPs), and many of the albums are multiple album sets, so there is
probably over 10,000 hours ov music reviewed, or 5,000 hours per reviewer.
Given about 2000 hours per year in the average work week (40 hours/week,
50 weeks/year), if they each listened to the records once, as a full time
job, it would have taken them 2.5 years just to listen. Through in a bit of
time to write a review (or do they do that while they listen to the next
one?), maybe listen to some of them a few times (how could you not listen
to a 5 star record a few times; how could you give a record 1 star in
good conscience without a few listenings to give it a fair chance;
how could you give ANY rating fairly on one listening)...so even
3 listenings per album means 7.5 years each AS A FULL TIME JOB.
I don't believe it.

I suspect that some of the reviews are "cribbed" from other reviews,
probalby in Wire, and from recollections of things they haven't even
heard for years--or maybe never heard, but heard the repuation of.
Either that, or there are a bunch of uncredited reviewers. In either
case, I would like to see signed reviews, so I can see who reviewed them
and get a mental "profile" of how a reviewer's taste compares to mine.
As much as the * ratings in Rolling Stone don't agree with my judgement,
after a while you get to know what to expect from different reviewers, just
as you do from the reviewers at downbeat, Cadence, Wire, etc.

>Also, what should we call it? "Penguin" sounds silly.  How about
>"Cook and Morton"?

I kind of like Penguin. Especially since I think Cook and Morton is
not giving some of the credit where it belongs.

What's wrong with Penguin's anyway? I bet its not PC to make fun of Penguins
:-) :-)

Bill Hery
AT&T Bell Labs
201-386-2362
hery@att.COM
From: kenz@local.host
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Red Mitchell
Date: 25 Jan 93 10:05:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: msus1.1993Jan25.160535.2187
Reply-To: kenz@local.host
Organization: Organization, City, State, etc.

In article <1993Jan25.194049.15192@news.cs.brandeis.edu>, rardin@binah.cc.brandeis.edu (R. Lynn Rardin) writes:
>Does anyone happen to know bassist Red Mitchell's _real_ first name?  I'm 
>curious for dbase purposes...
>
>-Lynn  (rardin@auriga.rose.brandeis.edu)
===========================================
   Red Mitchell's name:  Keith Moore.   Born Sept. 20, 1927.  Died recently.
     (New Grove Dictionary of Jazz. vol.2  p.114.

Bill Kenz
kenz@mhd1.moorhead.msus.edu
===============================================
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Elvin Jones
From: kenz@local.host
Date: 28 Jan 93 09:33:25 -0600
Reply-To: kenz@local.host
Organization: Organization, City, State, etc.

In article <1993Jan27.220134.15543@colorado.edu>, mciver@kibblesnbits.cs.colorado.edu (William McIver Jr.) writes:
>I really want to see Elvin and I know he probably won't
>come to Denver/Boulder area anytime soon.

>Does anyone know what he is up to these days?
=====================================================

    A friend of mine saw him recently in Minneapolis with a kind of Tribute to
Coltrane thing.  Javon Jackson was in the band.  He said Elvin was terrible,
there was no balance between the drumming and other instrumentalists.  He also
said the mostly young band was very weak except for Jackson.  The bassist, this
friend said, "sucked!"  Also, it cost 20 or 25 bucks, and Elvin played less
than an hour.  He was very disappointed.  Elvin is coasting on his past
laurels.
There is a nice fairly recent recording on the Blackhawk label where he is
"reunited" with McCoy Tyner, and Pharoah Sanders plays sax.  Offhand, I don't
recall the others on the LP.  I bought it as a cut-out in October.  If you see
it you may want to pick it up.

Bill Kenz
=====================================================
>--Thanks--------------------------------------------------------
>William J. McIver, Jr.          mciver@cs.colorado.edu
	
>------------------------------------------------------------------
From: burger@sphinx.ece.wisc.edu (Dick Burger)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Stan Getz, Best of Verve Years, Vol. I
Date: 26 Jan 93 22:09:35 GMT
Organization: Univ. of Wisconsin-Madison; Electrical & Computer Engineering

In article <0fNNcNK00YVX838Y1y@andrew.cmu.edu> Eugene Kuo <ek1i+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Hello!
>
>I was wondering what you all can tell me about the aforementioned set? 
>I don't know much about Mr. Getz, and have heard very little of his
>recorded output.  Suggestions for better Getz albums?  Compillations? 
>Labels?  Any and all input welcome.  Thanks in advance!
>
>eugene

   I always liked the Stan Getz/ Dizzy Gillespie album on VERVE.
From: hsu@walnut.sfsu.edu (William Hsu)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Cadence order is nigh - opinions please!
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:00:17 GMT
Reply-To: hsu@walnut.sfsu.edu

In article <C1FIz3.J2C@rice.edu>  writes:
> 
> Spencer Barefield: "Xonogenesis 2000", CAC 2
>   Advertising works.  What's the deal with this disc, and why do I want
> to buy it?  I think it's Spence's penetrating stare.

Well I bought this because I've really enjoyed Spencer Barefield's
work with the rest of that Detroit crowd (Anthony Holland, Tani
Tabbal etc) But I was a bit disappointed. There are several pieces
with a string quartet, and Barefield string writing is often muddy
and uninspiring. I also had problems with James Carter's thin,
abrasive sound on soprano (and I tend to like abrasive sax players).
The pieces were more "inside" than I would have liked. Overall the
CD was not very well-recorded. But there are some interesting moments,
and it's possibly worth picking up used.

I know Carl Baugher or one of the Cadence reviewers said: if you don't
like this you *can't* be a fan of improvised music. Well all I can
say is, if a reviewer makes remarks like that, he can't be a good
reviewer. It's fine that we don't agree on the music, of course, but
silly generalizations like that just lose my respect very quickly.
(Oops, did I just make a silly generalization? :-))

Bill
From: gel@sys.uea.ac.uk (Gareth Lee)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: who is tony coe?
Date: 24 Jan 93 16:18:46 GMT
Organization: UEA School of Information Systems, Norwich, UK.

dcm@pd.org (Howard Hunnicutt) writes:

>Tal Herbsman (talh@quip.eecs.umich.edu) wrote:
>> 
>> on a recent purchase of franz koglmann's _a white line_ i particularly enjoy
>> the playing of 'guest' saxman tony coe. any information/reccomendations on/for
>> him?
>> 
[deletion]

>Tony Coe is every bit as much the master - ask Paul Bley.  Between slugging
>it out in the studios for 30 years in England (He replaced the lead solos of
>Plas Johnson on the Pink Panther theme when Mancini had to go to England
>to save money - an economic reality, unfortunately), Tony has played in 
>the excellent Kenny Clarke-Francy Boland Big Band.  He's one of those
>unknowns that you hear in elevator music that you wonder why he isn't 
>playing better music.  The equivalent for guitarists is Tony Mottola.
>Or maybe Howard Roberts, who died this year.

Coe played as a member of Mike Gibb's band during a recent UK tour accompanying
John Scofield.  There were so may fine players in that band (Steve Swallow,
Kenny Wheeler, Bill Stewart) he only got one decent solo spot but played with
great spirit.

As for recommendations look out for any of his collaborations with Stan Tracey
(ie. "NOW" on STEAM RECORDS, 1983ish).  I hear that Tracey has just been
'discovered' by Blue Note - and after about 50 years playing professionally.
I just hope the sudden success doesn't go to his head!!  Coe also released a
recording as a leader about 2-3 years ago called "Canterbury Song" - I think
it was released on Mole Jazz.  I can probably get you more details about
these two realeases if you're interested.

Jazz music trivia no. 137:  Tony Coe was awarded an honourary degree by
the University of Kent at Canterbury a couple of years back for services to
music.  And who says we don't appreciate our musicians!!

Gareth Lee.
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: jgthomas@crchh420.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (John Thomas)
Subject: Re: Ornette Coleman discs ?
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 23:11:01 GMT
Reply-To: John Thomas <jgthomas@bnr.ca>              
Organization: BNR, Inc.

In article <C17srp.7q7.1@cs.cmu.edu>, tygar+@cs.cmu.edu (Doug Tygar) writes:
|> In article <1993Jan16.185004.24912@news.cs.brandeis.edu> rardin@binah.cc.brandeis.edu writes:
|> >In article <1j9963INN47l@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu>, ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer) writes:
|> >>I think the most essential Ornette recording is In All Languages, since
|> >>you have both Prime Time and the Quartet playing a lot of the same
|> >>material.  I don't think this is available on CD any more, but you still
|> >>might find it.  The Jazz Record Mart is selling it on vinyl still, but
|> >>they say it is out of print.  You can mail order from the Jazz Record
|> >>Mart in Chicago if you must have it.
|> >
|> >I think IAL is available on CD in Germany.  I'm pretty sure I saw it listed 
|> >in the CD International catalog as being available somewhere in Europe.
|> 
|> Apparently, that title has now been deleted in the UK and Germany.  I'd be
|> very interested in anyone has information on an available CD version of this
|> title.  Thanks!

Please post as I (and I'm sure others) are interested too!
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: marvo@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (ronald.f.roberts)
Subject: Re: Sun Ra
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 18:58:22 GMT

In article <vc85nq4@zola.esd.sgi.com> sik@grosz.esd.sgi.com (Seth Katz) writes:
>
>In article <MfNK4Kq00iUyA2d3N4@andrew.cmu.edu>, rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu writes:
>> from Ron Roberts:
>> > 
>> >I'm still trying to determine whether "Pictures of Infinity"
>> >is an album title as opposed to a tune.
>> 
>> Pictures of Infinity is an album title. There is no song with that title
>> by Sun Ra. the album is a live 1968 recording released by Black Lion
>> records. It is currently out of print, but some Black Lion stuff is
>> being reissued on cd, so maybe it will be available again sometime soon.
>
>I have seen it on CD as an expensive import.

Thanks! How expensive?? :-)


-- 
Ron Roberts      rfr@pruxp.att.com or att!pruxp!rfr      (609) 639-2242

   "'Nardis'...composed, yet unrecorded, by the Prince of Darkness?"
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Ornette Coleman discs ?
From: kenz@local.host
Date: 26 Jan 93 12:51:52 -0600
Reply-To: kenz@local.host
 <1993Jan16.185709.9195@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> <1993Jan17.063321.5866@grot.starconn.com>,<1jmso9INNl4j@mozz.unh.edu>
Distribution: na
Organization: Organization, City, State, etc.

In article <1jmso9INNl4j@mozz.unh.edu>, tcw@kepler.unh.edu (Tim) writes:
>In article <1993Jan17.063321.5866@grot.starconn.com> brian@piano.grot.starconn.com (Brian Smithson) writes:
>
>>A couple of other Ornette albums I like, but which are a bit obscure now, are:
>
>>New York is Now Vol. 1 [was there ever a Vol. 2 ???], on Blue Note, with
>>  Dewey Redman, Jimmy Garrison, and Elvin Jones.
>
>  Aha! It's about time someone mentioned this! I've never seen "vol. 1" in the
>title, though. I thought it was just "New York is Now". There is another album
>with this same group called "Love Call". Ornette plays trumpet on a few tracks
>on this one. These are both available on CD and are excellent!
- 
>|    Tim Webb     
>|    tcw@kepler.unh.edu  
=========================================================
    Somewhere I read Elvin Jones wasn't too happy with these sessions. 
"Critics" have mentioned the rhythm section didn't quite mesh with either
Coleman or Redman.  Jones' drumming is a little heavy-handed, very unlike that
of Coleman's other collaborators of that time period, like Ed Blackwell, Billy
Higgins, or Charles Moffett, I think. 

Ironically, though, Coleman's use of a "heavy" drumming style like
Elvin Jones is very apparent in his Prime Time bands, Shannon Jackson isn't
exactly delicate!  And Denardo Coleman's use of drum machines, plus his more
"on-the-beat" drum style, seems to carry forward the concepts of "New York is
Now"                                   
and "Love Call."  This is especially apparent when Prime Time uses two
drummers.

I've liked the two above recordings for Dewey Redman's contributions.  That's
also one of the reason's I mentioned the album "Crisis" in an earlier post. 
The two saxists work amazingly well together.  The "rhythm" section of Haden
and Denardo on "Crisis", to my ears, is a more provocative unit, no disrespect
to Jones' or Garrison's work with J. Coltrane or other artists.

Bill Kenz
Moorhead State University
==========================================

Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: euaaen@eua.ericsson.se (Anders Engwall)
Subject: Re: King Records
Organization: Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 08:38:00 GMT

milliken@scofield.Corp.Sun.COM (Gary Milliken) writes:

>Recent postings about the song "Fever" reminded me how hard it is to find
>original recordings on the old King Records label, which also had the first
>versions of "Dedicated to the One I Love", "The Twist", "Honky Tonk", "Sixty
>Minute Man", "Work With Me Annie", "Good Rockin' Tonight", and lots of others.

>Here is a list of hit and semi-hit records from King Records, including stuff
>from King's subsidiaries Federal and DeLuxe, that would be great to see
>reissued on CD (let's say, "The King Records Story", like the Scepter Records
>package that came out last year).  The list excludes any James Brown songs,
[...]

Splendid idea! I have myself marvelled for some time about the impressive
King/Federal roster.

However, a few of the artists already have their King/Federal material
available on CD, through excellent Charly compilations. Thus, I heartily
recommend:

Wynonie Harris -- Good Rocking Tonight -- Charly CD CHARLY 244
Johnny "Guitar" Watson -- Gangster Of Love -- Charly CD CHARLY 267

and one by an artist not on the list but great anyway,

Ike Turner's Kings Of Rhythm -- Trail Blazer -- Charly CD CHARLY 263

I suspect there is more.

-- 
Anders Engwall				Email: Anders.Engwall@eua.ericsson.se
ELLEMTEL Utvecklings AB			Voice: +46 8 727 3893
lvsj, Sweden				Fax: +46 8 727 42 20
     "I Costa Rica tl de inte att min rika rkost rkar kosta mer n rostad rkost"
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: marvo@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (ronald.f.roberts)
Subject: Re: Sun Ra
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 17:21:29 GMT

In article <wfNdRrW00iV3Q1U20O@andrew.cmu.edu> "Roy D. McKelvey" <rm0n+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>I have a cassette of "Pictures of Infinity." I believe
>that it is on Black Lion (or is it Leo?). I've never
>seen it anywhere else (on LP or CD).
>
>It's mentioned in the Rolling Stone Jazz Guide if that's
>available to you (they don't say much about it though).
>
>I'm going blank on the titles it contains, but it's in
>my car, so I could let you know if you want. One title
>is "Outer Spaceways Incorporated", and there's a great
>version of one of my favorite tunes from Sound of Joy,
>but I can't think of its name.

Thanks Roy! The above info is sufficient.
-- 
Ron Roberts      rfr@pruxp.att.com or att!pruxp!rfr      (609) 639-2242

   "'Nardis'...composed, yet unrecorded, by the Prince of Darkness?"
From: rardin@binah.cc.brandeis.edu (R. Lynn Rardin)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Red Mitchell
Date: 25 Jan 93 19:40:49 GMT
Reply-To: rardin@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University

Does anyone happen to know bassist Red Mitchell's _real_ first name?  I'm 
curious for dbase purposes...

-Lynn  (rardin@auriga.rose.brandeis.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: mcgonig@eeserv.ee.umanitoba.ca (Gordon McGonigal)
Subject: CD review: FURIO DI CASTRI -- WHAT COLOUR FOR A TALE
Organization: Dept. of Elect. & Comp. Engineering, U of Manitoba
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 08:54:33 GMT

WHAT COLOUR FOR A TALE - FURIO DI CASTRI  ......................  Splasc(h) 351
Di Castri (b); Stefano Cantini (ss); Ramberto Ciammarughi (p); Manhu Roche (d).

Now here's an interesting album of original compositions.  It sounds very
similar to what Eberhard Weber was doing with Charlie Mariano in the
late 70's.   Is it a coincidence that Weber's band was named Colours --
or that the word "web" arises in the liners (maybe that's going too far)??

I'm already a big fan of Di Castri's big warm sound, and his great
melodic sense, but this was the first I'd heard from his sidemen here.
However, this is a very polished band -- every member is a first-rate player.

These are mostly ECM-ish, uncluttered pieces.  Clean and crisp, they
are played with an intensity that assures no hint of aloofness.  A few
of the tracks show nods to Weather Report, especially a melancholy
synth/soprano duet, and a Caribbean thing (ala Brown Street, but Di Castri
is *not* from the Jaco school).

I like it a lot.
--
                                   * * *
Gord McGonigal                                  mcgonig@eeserv.ee.UManitoba.ca
Dept. of Electrical & Computer Engineering
University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, CANADA (R3T 2N2)       phone: (204) 474-6295