From: NETOPRBL@ncsuvm.cc.ncsu.edu (Brian Lane)
Subject: Re: Jews For Germans
Organization: North Carolina State University
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 14:27:48 GMT

In article <1993Jan10.172504.25008@wam.umd.edu>
mstern@wam.umd.edu (Michael Stern) writes:
>
>IThough the number of people who _identify_ themselves with
>the Nazis is indeed small, the number of those who do not
>demonstrate, loot or beat up foreigners yet share their ideas
>regarding German supremacy is quite large.  Let's
>face it - extreme nationalism and aspirations to global hegemony
>have a prominent place in German history.  The recent news from
>Germany demonstrate that there now exists an opportunity for
>those ideas to be brought to the forefront again.  That, IMHO,
>is a dangerous trend.
>
>
Hmmmm then we'd better ban all countries.....since ALL countries
suffer from nationalism and aspirations to global hegemony.
Even the UK had its empire....hmmm should we be denying the Brits
their country becuase of their oppression of the third world countries
that they "colonized"? Germans are just a convenient punching bag since
they have the convenient recent history. Much the same could be said of the
Japanese (perhaps even with a bit more truthfulness behind it if you didn't
comprehend their society..)
>
>Precisely!  Maybe if former SS henchmen would tell the truth to
>their children and grandchildren, these offspring would realize
>the magnitude of the horror that their family members one unleashed
>upon the world, and we would not be going through the re-birth ofteh
>Nazi school of thought.
>
Historically nationalism bred from fear of the unknown (in this case
the economy troubles of what was East Germany and what is to be the
future of the new Germany) has never been based on rationality.
Look at the US, surely after fighting against fascism during WWII they
would be against such things as racism...and yet when the japanese
begin to attack their industries with competition the people
turn to nationalism and a general dislike of the orientals...
>
>I disagree.  When it came to non-Aryans (Jews, Gypsies, etc),
>germans of that era were VERY cruel.  There have been plenty of
>documented evidence (which I will provide sources to, if you wish)
>of average middle-class Germans turning their longtime Jewish
>friends into teh Gestapo.  I do not need to tell you what happened
>to those people.  In my view, that qualifies as utmost cruelty.
>
>
I'll leave this part alone...your ignorance of history is abhorrent.
>
>If your grandfather (the SS officer) captured my grandfather
>(the partisan peasant) during WW-2, he probably would have
>tortured and killed him.  Consequently, I would not be here
>to debate with you.  Granted, to you that probably means nothing.
>But to me it is a very sobering and frightening perspective.
>I do not hate you - I pity you, and your people who in 50 years
>have not reconciled themselves with the horrors that were once
>committed, and seem hellbent on repeating them all pver again.
>t
>
>
I'll just finish this post by saying that your bashing  of germans is
no morally better than the very things you're trying to speak out against.
(i.e. violation of human rights by nations and their governments)
Brian
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish