From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Vegan dilemma concerning pancreatic enzymes.
Date: 22 Aug 92 04:34:17 GMT
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <1992Aug22.000509.357@btcs.bt.co.uk> traub@btcs.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub) writes:
>Perhaps you should re-read what you originally said. I am after references
>that show that dietary changes cannot alter the balance of bacteria in
>the gut. "There's not much you can do about that." was your remark.

Ah.  People on different diets over time may develop somewhat different
populations of gut bacteria, different proportions of one bug to another,
etc.  There is no necessary significance to this.  My comment was in
response to the comment on colon cleansing, which referred to the process
as cleaning out old (bad) bacteria, and replenishing your gut with new
(good) bacteria.  THIS is what is really faulty thinking, a distortion of
what happens and why.

>>See above.  There have been many studies looking at the effects
>>of diet on the fecal bacteria population.  Eating yogurt or taking
>>live acidophilus supplements has a definite, but transient effect.
>>That is, if you want to sustain anything other than their ordinary
>>levels in the gut, you have to keep taking them.  The population of
>>the gut is far more varied and persistent than you imagine.
>
>Next I suppose you will tell me that candida infestation is all a
>figment of people's imagination as well?

Well, everyone has candida in their gut.  It's part of the normal flora.
Candidiasis (that is, an overgrowth causing a variety of symptoms), with
the exception of vaginal infections, is very very rare, and is seen mostly
in people with impaired immune systems (and I don't mean "meat eaters",
I mean people with AIDS, on cancer chemotherapy, people with uncontrolled
diabetes, etc.)  Even antibiotic therapy does not cause this as often as
it is claimed by the Yeast Police.  The pop-culture phenomenon of "yeast/
candida" as a cause of diffuse illness in otherwise healthy individuals
is just nonsense.  It attracts people who might have been suffering from
"neurasthenia" or "hysteria" back in the 19th century.

>>I did in a later article.  This is a remedy for a diease which
>>doesn't exist.  There's no such thing as "impacted feces".
>
>Now you really are showing your *ignorance*. Try reading up on
>diverticulitis.

"Impacted??"  Get real.  And perhaps you might read what I said about
diverticulitis in a later article.  Listen, the proponents of colon
"hygiene" are not talking about diverticulitis.  They're talking about
your colon as a toxic waste dump, slowly poisoning you until you decide
to follow their regimen, at which point your hair gets shiny again and
everything starts going your way.

>>The only assertions I ever make are those which are commonly accepted
>>by reputable scientific research.  I know that won't count for much in
>>some people's eyes.  So be it.
>You still haven't provided *one* reference.

Look it up, Michael.  Stretch yourself.

>That's the way, assume a superior attitude without bothering to
>read what was said. These colon cleansing programs *work*.

Of course they do.  You take a laxative, and shit comes out.  Wow.
And you feel so fresh-n-clean afterwards.  Kissing sweet.

>Recent studies show a relationship
>between colon infestation and arthritis as well.

Nonsense.

>>An unhealthy attention to the "health" of one's colon, and a
>>desire to "clean" it, is hardly a mark of a vegan or a vegetarian.
>>Please don't tar folks with such a statement.
>I personally feel that colon-cleansing is an absolute waste of time
>for a vegan and probably a waste of time for most vegetarians but
>that doesn't mean I would knock someone's right to try it out.

It's a waste of time for anyone.

>You however can't help yourself. Whenever an article appears in this
>newsgroup that is outside your narrow medical perspective you
>insist on jumping up and down shouting 'bunkum' for all to hear.

If not me, who?  If not now, when?  They'd never hear it otherwise.
As I said, that's not doing anyone any favors.  The ignorance most
people have of their bodies and how they work is a prime reason why
they can be preyed upon by fanatics.


-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg