HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: London Philharmonic Orchestra
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 03:44:26 GMT

In article <+5-p#ck@lynx.unm.edu> lundgren@vesta.unm.edu (Chad Lundgren) writes:

>Hello.  I'm writing a story which has the London Philharmonic Orchestra
>as one setting.  I would like to know more about this.  Could anybody
>recommend books on the subject or describe the concert hall in detail?

The LPO was founded in 1932 by Sir Thomas Beecham, who also founded
the current incarnation of the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra after the
war. The LSO was founded in 1904 by players from another orchestra
(which one anybody?) whose conductor was cracking down on the 'deputy
system', whereby all a player had to do was ensure that his (usually
hisin those days) chair actually had a player in at for each rehearsal
and the final performance. Surprisingly conductors found this a trial!
The LSO (and I know yo didn't ask this) still does this - or did 30
years ago, when George Szell recorded Tchaikovsky 4 with them. He was
furious to find that 50% of the orchestra at the recording session
were different people from his concert performance a few days earlier.
To make matters worse, after the first take John Culshaw, the
producer, *deliberately* played it back to Szell at a low volume in
order to make it sound weak. This - as Culshaw intended - turned
Szell's fury into a total rage, he went straght back into the studio
and unleashed one of the most amazing torrents of sound you'll ever
hear. It's available on a mid-price London CD.

Sorry I strayed from your topic a bit, but that's one of my favourite
stories. 

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: abrocke1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Aaron Brockett)
Subject: Re: Orchestras/conductors
Organization: Swarthmore College
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 02:33:39 GMT

In article <H59QBGAW@cc.swarthmore.edu>, dgottli1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Daniel
Gottlieb) writes:
> 
> In article <1992Oct1.042835.13776@nuscc.nus.sg>, art30248@nusunix1.nus.sg
> (NG LING LING) writes:
> > 

> Everybody forgot two of the best American orchestras: Minnesota Orchestra
> (Edo De Waart (spelling) and St. Paul Chamber Orchestra (I think Hugh
> Wolff, but don't kill me if I'm wrong).
> 
Hugh Wolff (sp?) is indeed the music director of the St. Paul's Chamber
Orchestra, replacing Pinchas Zuckerman. This is his first season in that
position; he's been with the New Jersey Symphony for some time. He made the
switch at least in part to spend more time with his family. I have no idea
who has replaced him. 


--Aaron Brockett, whose fiance's parents have a subscription to the NJ
Symph.



Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: smoliar@argon.iss.nus.sg (stephen smoliar)
Subject: Re: Mahler and all that Rott
Reply-To: Smoliar@ISS.nus.sg (Stephen Smoliar)
Organization: Institute of Systems Science, NUS, Singapore
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 23:22:32 GMT


I found the following material about Rott in the de La Grange Mahler biography:

		Bruckner certainly had some artistic and personal influence
	on Mahler and Krzyzanowski, but much more on one of their friends,
	Hans Rott, whom tragedy prevented from fulfilling the brilliant
	career for which he seemed destined at the conservatory.  For
	three years Rott studied the organ under Bruckner, became an
	excellent improviser, attended Krenn's third composition class
	with Mahler, and during this time played an essential role in
	Mahler's life, for they were united by spiritual as well as
	creative bonds.  "We felt ourselves," Mahler later said, "to
	be two fruits from the same tree, growing from the same earth
	and breathing the same air. . . .  We could have done great
	things together in our new musical epoch."  Mahler always spoke
	of Rott with affection and admiration and often consider Rott's
	compositions superior to his own, particularly on one occasion,
	when he regretted winning a prize in his place.  Mahler told his
	mother of this doubts so movingly that Marie Mahler burst into
	tears and said, "What injustice!  when Rott's work was better
	than yours!"

		Rott's life, like Wolf's and Krisper's, was fated to
	end tragically.  He left the conservatory in 1878 without having
	won a single award, and accepted a post as organist in a
	monastery at a starvation wage.  Mahler went to see him
	in his tiny cell, where a supply of sausages hung from
	the ceiling.

		Shortly afterward Rott fell victim to a series of
	disasters.  He was driven from the monastery in a particularly
	humiliating way:  the monks, who hated him, accused him of
	stealing and selling books from their library.  With Bruckner's
	help, he then tried in vain to get another post as organist in
	Vienna, and finally became choirmaster of the Mulhouse Concordia
	choral society.  Before his innocence was finally proved, Rott
	went insane and was shut up in an asylum, where he used his
	manuscripts as toilet paper, saying:  "That's what human works
	are worth!"

		According to Mahler, Rott had composed a remarkable
	symphony at the age of twenty, which should have become the
	"basis of a new symphonic genre."  He always regretted the
	complete destruction of Rott's works, especially the "Strange
	Lieder", which Rott had carried in his head instead of
	writing down.  "What music has lost with him cannot be
	measured," Mahler later said.  One detail he recalled
	that is particularly striking is that Rott, like himself,
	seems to have devoted himself almost entirely to the lied
	and the symphony, and this could have been one of the causes
	of the great artistic sympathy which united the two young men.
-- 
Stephen W. Smoliar; Institute of Systems Science
National University of Singapore; Heng Mui Keng Terrace
Kent Ridge, SINGAPORE 0511
Internet:  smoliar@iss.nus.sg
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Band arr. of L. Mozart horn duet?
Date: 5 Oct 92 17:56:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: tamarack.CB.92Oct5125655
Organization: pubs


From: baumgart@sunfs1.dsd.northrop.com (baumgart john r)

I am looking for an arrangement of the Leopold Mozart Horn Duet for
concert band.  If anyone knows of the existance of such a beast,
please let me know via e-mail (baumgart@sunfs1.dsd.northrop.com)
before 16 Oct.  After 16 Oct, reply to humanski@sunfs1.dsd.northrop.com.

Thank you,
John
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: twright@deimos.ucc.umass.edu (TODD E WRIGHT)
Subject: Re: Why switch to CD?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 20:56:00 GMT

In article <1992Oct5.084101.10082@bsu-ucs.uucp>, 00hfstahlke@bsu-ucs.uucp writes...
>I think I'm one of the last non-CD owners.  And I'm finding that state a little
>frustrating but the thought of changing it not attractive enough outweigh the
>frustration.
> 
>The problem is that recordings I'd like to own I can't buy because I don't have
>a CD player.  I could correct that by buying one, but every time I think of
>doing so I compare the prices of CDs and cassettes and decide that I still
>don't really want to do that.    (I'm probably not as poor as I am tight.)  
> 
>The question is, "What are the advantages of getting into the CD market?
> 
>As I see it, there are two advantages:
> 
>1.  CD sound quality is better than tape or LP.
> 
>2.  An increasing number of good recordings will be available only on CD.
> 

       I'm new here, so try not to flame me too bad.

Another advantage to CDs is durability. If you take good care of a CD
they can last you a lifetime, but cassettes wear out if you listen to
them over and over, stick a magnet on them, accidentally tape over them,
feed them into an evil machine, break the tape, etc.  CDs have superior 
sound quality and will last forever with minimum care. 

   Long live the CD; pun intended subconsciously. :-*

You can always have your cassettes and gradually build up a supply of
CDs, as a previous post said (sorry about lack of name).

  - todd     
                    "Music is a higher revelation than Philosophy." 
                                         -LvB
From: hurben@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Mike Hurben)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: On Wagner motives...
Date: 29 Sep 92 22:37:07 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO  80523

There is a particular motive in Tristan that has always got to me.  It
occurs early in Act 1, immediately after Isolde sings "Wer wagt mich zu
hohnen?"  It is a very agitated, restless figure on the strings, and it
shows up everywhere during Act 1, but not much after.  Any ideas on what
it is?

  Mike Hurben
Xref: sparky rec.music.classical:13770 rec.music.misc:24534 rec.music.makers:10018
From: epohl@hubcap.clemson.edu (Erik Alan Pohl)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,rec.music.misc,rec.music.makers
Subject: .Composer biography blurbs and discographies .
Date: 3 Oct 92 17:58:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: hubcap.1992Oct3.175808.3869
Organization: Clemson University

Is there extant a ftp site where I might find information about composers
(compositions, history, styles, etc.)? 
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It's still hard for me to have a clear mind thinking on it.
 But it's the truth even if it didn't happen."(One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest)
---Erik Pohl at epohl@hubcap.clemson.edu--------------------------------------- 
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ridgway@athena.mit.edu (Lee Ridgway)
Subject: Re: Beethoven's Song of Joy
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 18:55:06 GMT

I don't have the English translation handy, but I saw a horribly dumb ad for a
newly published set of keyboard variations (for organ, I think) on the tune,
called "Ode to Joy." The ad talked about "a joyous set of variations on the hymn
tune made famous by Beethoven." That publisher has some pretty dumb people at
work in the marketing deptartment!
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: hudu@well.sf.ca.us (Scott Marley)
Subject: Re: haydn symphony recommendations
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 07:31:19 GMT


Roger Lustig rattles off 20 Haydn symphonic masterpieces--the Paris and
London symphonies, plus numbers 88 and 92--but that's just for starters.
You could add another dozen or so masterpieces from Haydn's Sturm-und-Drang
period alone.  The quantity is amazing.  And to think that fifty years ago
Haydn was known for very little beyond that loud chord in the "Surprise"
symphony!

Haydn *is* a bit more difficult a composer to get to know than Mozart.  His
music is a bit more cerebral, a bit more concerned with classical form, and
with the balance between the heart and the head.  Conductors who try to
force him into a late Romantic style of playing only succeed in making him
sound like a failed Brahms.  Half of what Haydn is about is the appeal to
the intellect; if you only listen to him for the appeal to the emotions,
you're missing half of what's going on in the music.  Pay attention not just
to the content but to the form as well: he's constantly playing with the
forms he himself perfected, stretching them out here to underline an
emotional point, or collapsing them there to speed a fast movement along its
way, or twisting them around in order to play games with your expectations
of what the shape of the movement should be.  There's a popular myth that
the classical forms were some sort of "straitjacket" to the composers of the
period, that the Romantic composers had to break out of.  Not so; or at
least if the forms are a straitjacket then Haydn is Houdini, because half
the pleasure is seeing how deftly he can slip in and out of the damn jacket
whenever he pleases.

Scott Marley
hudu@well.sf.ca.us
From: nad@cray.com (Ned Deily)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Falstaff Returns to the Met
Date: 6 Oct 92 05:02:35 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.185430.5008@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com> lms@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com (Max Stern 310-524-6152) writes:
>In article <92270.101732KSSHC@CUNYVM.BITNET> Ken Sherrill <KSSHC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
>>The Met's revival of Falstaff last night was a delight...
>>
>>[remainder of review deleted]
>

Having missed the rest of this thread during my brief vacation in the 
Big A, I will only add that Saturday night's (3 October) performance
was also a delight and the televison cameras were there to record it
for broadcast next season.

As much as I admired the Falstaff, I think the cameras should have
been rolling the night before for the Met's Les Contes d'Hoffmann 
revival:  restudied with a fair amount of new music added, a new set
for the Venice act (now in last place), Vaness and Domingo in fine
form each, and can anyone possibly compete with Ramey when it comes
to devilish roles (remember his Mefistofele at the City Opera)?

Ned
From: diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Dido and Aneas -- Reminds Me...
Date: 28 Sep 1992 16:00:10 +0800
Organization: The University of Westrn Australia
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: uniwa.uwa.edu.au
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Mike Quigley (Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca) wrote:
: (to get back to that "mindless thread")...
: 
: Dildo and Anus
: And what about Pelly's Ass and Melly's Hand?
:                         

This is obviously a reference to George Melly's memoirs, "Rum, Bum and
Conertina".
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: vinay@cs.toronto.edu ("Vinay K. Chaudhri")
Subject: Strictly Strings
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 1 Oct 92 15:13:00 GMT

Has anyone read the book called "Strictly Strings".  It has been
highly recommonded by my violin teacher.  I am not able to find 
this book in most bookstores here.  I would like to  have any 
comments about this book and if possible the places where it can
be ordered from.  (It is authored bu Dillon and two others and 
comes with a tape).

thanks,
vinay.
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: haydn symphony recommendations
Date: 1 Oct 92 22:51:03 GMT
	<1992Sep30.171005.42112@bas-a.bcc.ac.uk>
	<1992Oct1.013402.12261@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>
Organization: pubs
In-reply-to: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA's message of Thu, 1 Oct 1992 01:34:02 GMT

Deryk Barker writes:

   Now let's all lay into Handel's bloody Messiah.

I don't care how much of a warhorse it is--I never get tired of it.

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Bach Cello Suites on Period Instrument: Rec. Wanted
From: phoogenboom@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 6 Oct 92 14:27:46 EDT
Organization: Wesleyan University

In article <1992Oct6.065125.8678@midway.uchicago.edu>, pkbockus@gsbphd.uchicago.edu (Keith Bockus) writes:
> I'm looking for a recording of the Bach Cello suites
> on a period instrument, but haven't found any 
> recommended recordings.  Any suggestions 
> (or reasons why I should not be looking for
> such a thing)?

I recommend you post to rec.music.early.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: jec@pilatus.zurich.ibm.com (Jean Cherbonnier)
Subject: Alexandre Rabinovitch
Date: Mon, 05 Oct 92 10:01:25 GMT
Reply-To: jec@pilatus.zurich.ibm.com (Jean Cherbonnier)
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center


I am looking for recordings of Rabinovitch's compositions. 
Anybody heard of CDs, tapes ... ?

Thanks.

J. Cherbonnier
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Haydn symphony recommendations?
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 18:03:28 GMT

In article <1a3qmaINN1ud@sol.usc.edu> asbed@sol.usc.edu (Asbed Bedrossian) writes:
>In article <dube.717575530@milton> dube@milton.u.washington.edu (Ric Dube) writes:
>>     I have just recently started listening to classical music and have
>>determined that a lot of music from the late 1700's appeals to me.  I
>>especially like Haydn's "La Poule".  Would anyone be able to recommend
>>any of his other symphonies which may have a similar feel?  I'm not
>>really looking for any recordings in particular, but just his symphonies
>>which are generally considered his best compositions.   
>
>At the expense of inflaming all my serious friend here on r.m.c ...
>
>If you're looking for something with a similar feel, symphonies 1 through
>106 might please you.

He actually (according to H.C. Robbins-Landon) wrote 107, but one is
lost and two aren't numbered, they are called A & B. They were
included on the supplement to the Dorati series, together with various
alternative movements for the numbered series.

>But if you're _really_ looking for excellent Haydn, get some Mozart. I
>especially love his G-minor symphonies (25 & 40). (This is not to put down
>papa Haydn, as I, too, love him dearly.)

Have to disagree, much as I admire Mozart's later symphonies, I think
that Haydn is a *far* finer symphonist.

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: bmtong@cucs11.cs.cuhk.hk (Tong Bo-Ming)
Subject: Re: Mahler 1
Organization: Faculty of Engineering, The Chinese U. of Hong Kong
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 01:26:02 GMT

steve@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter) writes:

>In article <2OCT199209173769@portal.lasc.lockheed.com> le01167@portal.lasc.lockheed.com (Ron Nadel) writes:
>>In article <1992Oct2.022221.5496@cucs5.cs.cuhk.hk>, bmtong@cucs11.cs.cuhk.hk (Tong Bo-Ming) writes...

>>  And what is Giulini doing these days?

>Have a listen to his Bruckner 8th (DG, twelve CDs).

>>
>>Ron

	I don't think there is a better Bruckner 8th than Giulini.  His 9th
(DG) is also great, except the recording.  Why didn't he record a complete
cycle, or the 7th at the very least ?

Tong Bo-Ming
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: music scores cost a fortune!!!
Date: 1 Oct 92 22:57:59 GMT
Organization: pubs
In-reply-to: s892024@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au's message of 1 Oct 92 04:52:52 GMT

Richard A. Muirden writes:

   
   I was browsing in the sheet music section of a music store looking for
   some Shostakovich scores for my own intrest and was shocked to see the
   prices on the "small" pieces! My mind boggles at what the score for
   the Leningrad symphony or 10th would cost! Outrageous! How can people
   affoard them? :-(

Simple--just wait for them to be in the public domain.  Of course you might 
be less interested in the work when you're 97 years old.

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: smoliar@argon.iss.nus.sg (stephen smoliar)
Subject: Re: Eerie Music (was Re: rec.music.classical FAQ)
Reply-To: smoliar@iss.nus.sg (stephen smoliar)
Organization: Institute of Systems Science, NUS, Singapore
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 10:47:33 GMT

In article <lcenlaINNkbq@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> jamesc@bassclar.Eng.Sun.COM
writes:
>
>Also, there's a piece by Kagel for organist and two assistants 
>(perhaps titled "Improvisation Adjutee"?) that was recorded in the
>late 1960's on a Columbia Odyssey disk of new music for organ.
>The two assistants run around "preparing" the pipe organ as it's
>being played, and shriek and laugh like maniacs frequently.
>I played that as background music for trick-or-treaters one year.
>
I have done the same.  The title is "Improvisation Ajoutee" (with a acute
accent on the penultimate "e").  The piece requires very rapid registration
changes, which is why the organist requires assistants.  They also provide
vocal sounds "in a tone-color scale ranging from humming to shouting" (from
Richard Teitelbaum's liner notes to that wonderful Odyssey recording).  (What
do we have to get Sony to do to reissue it?)  I suspect a live performance
would be as much fun as the recording, but I bet it helps if you cannot see
the performers.
-- 
Stephen W. Smoliar; Institute of Systems Science
National University of Singapore; Heng Mui Keng Terrace
Kent Ridge, SINGAPORE 0511
Internet:  smoliar@iss.nus.sg
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Encores? Unusual performance by the Melbourne Symphony O
Date: 30 Sep 92 13:45:32 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

> Arto Wikla writes:
>
> I thought Canada was in America, but I must check my atlas!! :-)
>


That's OK, I always thought Finland was in Norway... );-)

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Karlheinz
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 15:00:28 GMT

In article <BvE7Fv.7FL@quake.sylmar.ca.us> brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder) writes:
>In article <1992Sep28.210533.23041@menudo.uh.edu> chem91@Elroy.UH.EDU writes:

>>(to rekindle a firestorm) was anybody else as sickened as I was by the
>>*pathetic* John Cage "obituary" in this month's *Gramophone* (about 3
>>paragraphs, barely mentioning his music, and making him sound like a clown).

>Actually, it gives me new confidence in them.  At least they know a pretentious
>clown when they see one.

So do we, Brian, so do we.

Roger

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: lundgren@vesta.unm.edu (Chad Lundgren)
Subject: London Philharmonic Orchestra
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 92 00:11:51 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

Hello.  I'm writing a story which has the London Philharmonic Orchestra
as one setting.  I would like to know more about this.  Could anybody
recommend books on the subject or describe the concert hall in detail?
Also, I've heard from reliable sources that the London orchestra is
run by the musicians.  Can anybody confirm this?  Also, what is the
relation of the London Symphony Orchestra to the Philharmonic, or are
they two different names for the same orchestra?

Also, any information on auditions would be helpful.  The orchestra here
in Albuquerque has union guidelines for how the auditions happen.  I would
expect similar kinds of results?

As an interesting side note, I extrapolate that in the future, Europe will
have a stranglehold on all the top notch and innovative orchestras because 
the U.S. government does not help the symphonies nearly as much as European
governments seem to.

Informations, criticisms, and flames (if they're well-written) are welcome.
I'd prefer email, but if you feel like you *have* to impart your knowledge 
to everybody here, feel free.

-- 
Chad Lundgren  
Internet: lundgren@vesta.unm.edu   or  lundgren@ariel.unm.edu
Bitnet:  LUNDGREN@UNMB                 Location:  35 N 106 W
When most Americans see the word 'socialism', they see red.
From: jseboldt@pnet51.orb.mn.org (John Seboldt)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: works for bizarre bottom-heavy ensembles (was: Gordon Jacob)
Date: 29 Sep 92 01:05:01 GMT
Organization: People-Net [pnet51], Minneapolis, MN.

Though it's not strictly classical, no list of "bottom-heavy ensembles" would
be complete without the South African vocal group Ladysmith Black Mambazo, one
of whose Cd's I have on the Shanachie label.  Lotsa basses (bassi profundi!),
thinning out to one tenor on top.  What a sound!

:  John Seboldt...Minneapolis, MN...                            :
:  As a ham, K0JD...as a human...well, you judge!               :
:     UUCP:{crash, tcnet, petrus, quest}!orbit!pnet51!jseboldt  :
:     ARPA:crash!orbit!pnet51!jseboldt@nosc.mil                 :
:     INET:jseboldt@pnet51.orb.mn.org                           :
From: david@xlnt.com (David Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Beethoven Sonata 32
Date: 29 Sep 92 19:33:45 GMT
Organization: XLNT Designs, Inc (XDI)

[comments about Beethoven's 32nd piano sonata sounding like American jazz]

There is an earlier Beethoven piano sonata which sounds very much like
ragtime in one passage.  I do not remember which one.
-- 
David Johnson
XLNT Designs, Inc. (XDI)
david@xlnt.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical