From: muehlhau@en.ecn.purdue.edu (John Muehlhausen)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Faith vs. Reason
Date: 31 Aug 92 08:33:10 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <fRYkH6X@quack.sac.ca.us> pharvey@quack.sac.ca.us (Paul Harvey) writes:
>In article <1992Aug30.093825.859@en.ecn.purdue.edu> 
>muehlhau@en.ecn.purdue.edu (John Muehlhausen) writes:
>>You just shot yourself in the foot big time.  You see, we have been delivered
>>from slavery to the world, but guess what?  In its place is "slavery" to God.
>>Who better to lead a blind person down a path than his creator?  This is not
>>avoiding responsibility - I must still put one foot in front of the other.
>>The only difference is that God is telling me where to put it, which is much
>>more trustworthy than me telling me where to put it.  BTW, the whole concept
>>of being a "slave" to God is VERY Biblical...  I _do_ have freedom in this
>>slavery, but by the following definition:
>>   Freedom is the ability to do what you know is right, not whatever you
>>   want.
>
>I find this unbelievable. I assume you are of European descent. I have
>never understood this longing on the part of Europeans for the good old
>days of slavery. The desire for an all knowing and just slave master to
>conduct your life of slavery for you. This is so sad and a waste of a
>creation and an insult to the creator. You have been freed, any shackles
>are of your own design, any slave master will mislead you to the way of
>darkness. Wake up while you still have a chance! YOU ARE FREE, now walk
>that freedom walk and talk that freedom talk. It is not easy and you
>will have to take responsibility for your actions and you will not have
>a slave master to blame, but it is as the creator intended. You have
>been delivered FROM slavery, why do you cling to the shackles? Why do
>you aspire to a slave master even when you know that any slave master
>will mislead you into the darkness? In these days of freedom, there are
>still slave masters available for those who miss the days of slavery,
>but they are all of darkness. You were freed by the way of light, go
>towards that light, not back towards the darkness of slavery. Do not
>insult He who freed you by returning to slavery against His action. I
>have no doubt that someone is telling you to walk blindly, but it is the
>fool who does not question who this leader of the blind slaves is. You
>know who freed you, it should not be difficult to figure out who would
>mislead you back into slavery.

You have said nothing new and apparently have not heard what I said.
Within living the Christian life I am not free in the way that you are
saying.  I am bound by God's very narrow will.  I don't mind though, because
His will is the best way I could live my life.

   Paul, a BOND-SERVANT of Christ Jesus... (Romans 1:1a, NASB, E.A.)

   What then?  Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace?
   May it never be!  Do you not know that when you present yourselves to
   someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey,
   either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in
   righteousness?  But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin,
   you became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching to which you
   were committed, and having been freed from sin, YOU BECAME SLAVES OF
   RIGHTEOUSNESS.  I am speaking in human terms because of the weakness of
   your flesh.  For just as you presented your members as slaves to impurity
   and to lawlessness, resulting in further lawlessness, so now PRESENT YOUR
   MEMBERS AS SLAVES TO RIGHTEOUSNESS, RESULTING IN SANCTIFICATION.  For when
   you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.
   Therefore what benefit were you then deriving from the things of which you
   are now ashamed?  For the outcome of those things is death.  But now
   having been freed from sin AND ENSLAVED TO GOD, you derive your benefit,
   resulting in sanctification, and the outcome, eternal life.  For the wages
   of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus
   our Lord.  (Romans 6:15-23, NASB, E.A.)

I have a hard time relating to Christians who have non-Biblical stances on
anything, so forgive me if I am a bit stubborn on this point.  I am in
slavery to God, but that is how it should be, and I couldn't be happier about
it, so what's the big deal?

John M.