From: knapp@spot.Colorado.EDU (David Knapp)
Subject: Re: I Tend To Be Pro-Choice Because:
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 17:48:05 GMT

In article <1992Sep1.134831.18210@nocusuhs.nnmc.navy.mil> perez@mgr.hjf.org (Charles Perez) writes:
>In article <1992Aug24.234019.8609@csus.edu> chaneysa@nextnet.csus.edu (Stephen A Chaney) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug17.020302.5094@nocusuhs.nnmc.navy.mil> perez@mgr.hjf.org (Charles Perez) writes:
>>>
>>>The "coat-hanger argument" (that laws against abortion drive women with
>>>unwanted pregnancies to risk their lives using unsafe methods of aborting)
>>>is a valid argument against any anti-abortion legislation short of
>>>defining abortion as murder.
>>
>>Which means, since pro-lifers are working to ensure that it is defined as
>>murder, that the entire premise for this argument of yours, is probably not
>>worth reading.
>
>If they believe it is murder, why do many of them want to permit it in
>cases of rape or incest? Murder is murder, right?

It's whatever appeals to their individual values.  Maybe "family values?"
Many pro-life folks are also for the death penalty.  Many also blow up 
clinics.  Many are affiliated with fundamentalist Christian denominations
which preach love, caring and understanding.  But are we expecting 
consistency in their arguments?


>>>If abortion is murder, there can be no compromising the fetus's rights.
>>>If it is not murder, there can be no disregarding the deaths of women from
>>>back-alley abortions that result when abortion is proscribed. Any
>>>"compelling state interest" must be weighed against *all* of the
>>>negative consequences of restrictive legislation.
>>
>>Well, using drugs is not murder instantly, but we ban it and we live with
>>the consequences of illegal drug use, every day.
>
>*Should* we, though? Personally, *I* don't ban drug, nor do I want
>to see them banned.

Drugs do not fit into some people's sense of 'morality'. It is therefore
imposed on the entire populace.  If we allow this to happen with abortion,
it may continue to be extrapolated to many other facets of one groups'
sense of moral correctness.  I see 'family values' now beginning to be imposed
by conservative groups. Now homosexuality is immoral.  Having a child out
of wedlock is immoral.  Let's pass a law a day to help keep America from 
"going to hell in a handbasket."

Of course it's not the land of the free any more, but heck, are we a moral
bunch or *what*?


>>Tell the American people that you'd consistently apply this reasoning to
>>issues outside of abortion - like drugs.
>>
>>Then, forget any hopes you might have of being elected to any office.
>
>Popular opinion doesn't make *anything* right.

Not according to the current fascist movement. Might makes right.

>>While
>>you're at it, join the Jerry Brown or Bill "Don't Inhale" Clinton Club.
>
>Who says *I* want to do drugs, just because I don't want them
>criminalized? Many things *I* find distasteful I nonetheless wouldn't
>want to see banned.

But see, you're as bad as a junkie in the gutter because you feel it is an
individual's right to do with their bodies what they choose.  It's a "bad"
thing so we're going to force it out of your choice list.  Because we 
have superior moral stature, we're going to decide what you can and can't do
in your closet.


>
>>===============================================================================
>>Question: If you don't have truck bombs and thousands of fanatics to
>>	  sacrifice their lives and drive them, how do you scare a 
>>	  nation into giving in to your demands?
>>
>>Answer:   Buy coat hangers and encourage women to kill themselves
>>	  with them and call yourself "pro-choice".
>
>As if the only reason a woman died by a coat hanger is because some
>pro-choicer encouraged her to.
>
>Stick to facts, don't make yourself look ridiculous trying to set up
>a straw man.


Too late.

-- 
David Knapp                                      University of Colorado, Boulder
Perpetual Student of                               knapp@spot.colorado.edu
Chemistry, Physics and Planetary Science. (not necessarily in that order)
Xref: sparky talk.abortion:34855 alt.abortion.inequity:3473