HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nancy@genie.slhs.udel.edu (Nancy Lebovitz)
Subject: Re: Asthma, adult onset
Organization: UDel, School of Life & Health Sciences
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 20:36:20 GMT

In article <1hadehINNdu2@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> fish@ecst.csuchico.edu (Kevin Haddock) writes:
>In article <1ha9jcINN4uf@grapevine.EBay.Sun.COM> greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM writes:
>
>As far as controvertial asthma treatments go, check out the book:
>
>The Emperor Wears No Clothes   by  Jack Herer
>
>This book is all about the Hemp conspiracy.  According to this book (and
>sources are listed therein) the BEST treatment for asthma especially
>in children is smoking pot!  I have not personally tried it but the evidence
>they give is compelling and thanks to the DEA the doctors are not even
>allowed to research it to find out why!
>
>BTW, if you think this is far out (some of you M.D. types out there)
>go buy the book yourselves and go ahead and disprove it.  Jack offers
>a $10,000 reward for anyone who can disprove anything in the book.  It
>just might make a payment or two on your malpractice insurance, who knows!
>
>
!?!

I've known a couple of people with lung problems (one asthma, one not) 
who had real problems with smoking marijuana. _Eating_ marijuana might
be theraputic for asthma, but smoking it would be one of the last things
I'd experiment with if I had asthma.

>ncy
Nancy Lebovitz
nancy@genie.slhs.udel.edu
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: sdb@ssr.com (Scott Ballantyne)
Subject: Re: homeopathy
Organization: ScotSoft Research
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 02:17:07 GMT

In article <1h7r3vINNk5q@grapevine.EBay.Sun.COM> greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM writes:

   Homeopathy never 'died out', it was politically stamped out by the AMA
   in the early 1900's.

This is both untrue and biased. The AMA did not stamp out homeopathy,
it died out when allopathy adopted scientific methods and started
making progress in treating human diseases. Both homeopaths and the
general public rapidly abandoned the homeopathic remedies for
something that actually worked.

Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: bsimon@elvis.stsci.edu (Bernie Simon)
Subject: Re: homeopathy
Organization: None. This saves me from writing a disclaimer.
	<BSIMON.92Dec22154843@elvis.stsci.edu>
	<schumach.725074603@convex.convex.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 12:19:32 GMT

If you read my first post, you would have seen that I listed several
double blind studies which show the effectiveness of homeopathic
medicines. Can you cite some studies which show that homeopathic
medicines do not work any better than placebos?
--
Bernie Simon	(bsimon@stsci.edu)		ad astra per aspera

Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: tscwhitehead@cc.weber.edu (Clarke Whitehead)
Subject: Re: Eczema and holistic cures
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Weber State University
Date: 28 Dec 1992 08:46 MST  

In article <Bzy430.5o@ssr.com>, sdb@ssr.com (Scott Ballantyne) writes...
>In article <1h8b0dINNc4c@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> fish@ecst.csuchico.edu (Kevin Haddock) writes:
> 
>   If however you want to go it on your own, you can either fast for 5 days
>   on springwater or go on a rotation diet.
> 
>That sounds like a good solution to eczema - NOT. Why use an ointment
>when you can spend a lot of money and time on worthless trips to a
>clinical ecologist?
> 
>Both of you would be well advised to investigate the extensive
>literature on Clinical Ecology and food sensitivity before putting
>yourselves in the hands of these snake oil salesmen.
> 

Scott,
Kevin was responding to a question I posed, and I appreciate his response.
I've used the ointments, and still do use them as needed, but I would prefer
to find a more natural solution, since the ointments are known to have some
negative long-term effects.  I would appreciate if if you would resist the
urge to cut down sincere replies with your obviously biased opinion.  I
would hate to see people restrain from making sincere recommendations due
to fear of being flamed.  Let me choose what remedies I try and which I
ignore.

Clarke
From: traub@rtf.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: Bates method (natural vision improvement)
Date: 29 Dec 92 09:42:46 GMT
Organization: BT Customer Systems, Brighton, UK

In article <BzvL60.3M7@ssr.com> sdb@ssr.com (Scott Ballantyne) writes:
>In article <1h7vu4INNfem@flop.ENGR.ORST.EDU> shreeved@ece.orst.edu (David Shreeve) writes:
>
>       "The Art of Seeing" by Aldous Huxley
>	---Yes!, this is the same Aldous Huxley of Brave New World fame
>	   who did a good deal to popularize the Bates method in the 40s.
>	   I guess he was near blind until he discovered Bates.
>
>Huxley was not helped by the Bates method - he ended up nearly blind.

That's you into the kill file. Informed scientific rebuttal is one thing,
but uninformed answers like yours, posted simply because you refuse to
believe that someone's personal testimony is of any value, even when Aldous
Huxley clearly did manage to regain a large percentage of his eyesight, are
simply a waste of bandwidth.


-- 
Michael Traub
BT Customer Systems, Brighton Systems Centre. traub@btcs.bt.co.uk
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard)
Subject: Re: homeopathy
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 20:01:02 GMT

In article <BSIMON.92Dec23141255@elvis.stsci.edu> bsimon@elvis.stsci.edu (Bernie Simon) writes:
>In article <1992Dec23.171758.3859@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>
>lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>
>   >If you read my first post, you would have seen that I listed several
>   >double blind studies which show the effectiveness of homeopathic
>   >medicines. Can you cite some studies which show that homeopathic
>   >medicines do not work any better than placebos?
>
>   Yes. Its called avagodro's (sp?) number :-)
>
>Saying the homeopathy can't work because it contradicts currently
>accepted theory doesn't seem a scientific attitude to me. 

So where is the new scientific theory? When it seemed Cold fusion might
be real people went searching for what would allow it to work, I don't
see any one trying to find a new theory that would allow homeopathy to
work. 

>In fact, it
>reminds me of the clerics who refused to look through Galileo's
>telescope at the moons of Jupiter because they "knew" all heavenly
>bodies revolved around the Earth. The scientific way to proceed is to
>conduct clinical trials and see if homeopathy (or accupuncture, or
>some other system of alternative medicine) works. Fortunately, the NIH
>has recently allocated $9 million to conduct tests of alternative
>medicine. So we will have some hard evidence on which to base our
>opinions. 

I will agree with that. However if I had to decide on treatments
I wouldn't risk my life betting that something that hasn't been
tested, and requires violation of know physical laws would work.
I might as well jump off a building and hope that I grow wings
quickly :)


-- 
------          Join the Pythagorean Reform Church!               .
\    /        Repent of your evil irrational numbers             . .
 \  /   and bean eating ways. Accept 10 into your heart!        . . .
  \/   Call the Pythagorean Reform Church BBS at 508-793-9568  . . . .
From: greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: homeopathy
Date: 23 Dec 1992 17:41:51 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: antizen.ebay.sun.com


In article 725074603@convex.convex.com, schumach@convex.com (Richard A. Schumacher) writes:
> 
> Of course, the fact that homeopathic preparations have no value
> beyond that of a placebo may have something to do with the
> decline of homeopathy.


<Yawn> Now there's a true scientist for you.

"gee, it doesn't fit my little closed view of the world so it must be bogus" 

But I'm sure Richard that you wouldn't dare express such an ignorant
and biased opinion without trying homeopathics for yourself. That just
wouldn't be open-minded.

Greg


Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: jlevine@apollo.HP.COM (Jennifer E. Levine)
Subject: Re: eyes etc.
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 21:59:50 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Chelmsford, MA

In article <1992Dec22.034622.22919@ultb.isc.rit.edu>, rxv9839@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Bob Vogel) writes:
|> The "natural eye care (by the xyz{i forget} method etc.) is mentioned as a
|> possible discussion topic.  I would be most interested in a basic informatinal
|> possible discussion topic.  I would be most interested in a basic informatinalpost on this topic, about which I know nothing.  Eye care professionals seem to
|> feel that everyone will need glasses between 40-50 (perhaps a slight generalization) and I'm sure there must be some opposing viewpoints out there.
|> The reason for my interest is a most unusual occurrance.  I recently went to
|> motor vehicles to renew my license.  They hold a little paddle over each eye
|> while doing an eye test.  After the test my right eye was totally blurry
|> and would not focus for about 15 minutes.  Got an eye exam--doc said, no 
|> problem, not uncommon.  About 4 months later I lay on the bed for an houror two with my arm against my eye.  This time my eye was out of focus for about six
|> hours, coming back very slowly.  This occurance seems to be most abnormal.
|> Tried a second eye doc today--results the same no problems found now, may needglasses soon.  don't really know what it is.  Any observations or similiar experiences and even causes would be appreciated.  Rest assured in advance that I
|> will not take any comments as prescriptive and I am already and will contineu
|> in full consultation with my eye care professional.
|> 
|> Is there still a Society for Orthomolecular medicine in San Francisco??
|> Are doctors still associated with it??  They had some interest in mega-vitamin
|> therapy and such, I think.
Hi,

I don't know if this will help. 

When I was younger, my eyes would not work together. It 
was not obvious by looking at me but it made it difficult
when I read. I went to an eye doctor in my home town who 
specialized in these problems. 

I went through eye therapy. I did exercises with my eyes.
After some time I was able to read more easily and my grades
shot up.

As I get older my eyes have started having a similar sounding
focus problem to yours. My doctor has said that some eye 
training will help my problem. I have not started yet. 

--Jennifer 
jlevine@apollo.hp.com
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: buzz@wccf.mit.edu (Sheila Gay Buzzee)
Subject: immunization
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords:  immunization
Organization: MIT - Whitaker College
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 15:58:00 GMT

  Yes, there are risks associated with immunizations, but there are undeniable 
benefits when the disease is particularly nasty and the vaccine is 'safe'.  I 
am currently being vaccinated for Hepatitis B, using a recombinant DNA 
technology that mimics the virus but CANNOT give me Hepatitis.  As Hepatitis 
has been causally associated with liver cancer and I am exposed to untreated 
human blood and tissue samples, I think I would be immensely foolish not to 
take this precaution.

  Immunization is also required for travel in certain countries, as well as 
for admission to certain universities.  I would gladly go through the series 
of immunizations all over again for another chance to see Kenya and Tanzania.

  I think this issue is too complex for pat answers.  Talk with a trusted 
friend who has some medical knowledge.  Find out what the real risks are for 
the disease in question, and what type of vaccines are available.  And don't 
forget important considerations such as school admittance.  I am fortunate to 
have a very informed and liberal father, who embraces a number of 
non-traditional treatments but also recognizes the value of more standard 
practices when they are neccesary.  He has been a very valuable resource.

  Best wishes and good luck with your decisions.

  Buzz 

Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard)
Subject: Re: Asthma, adult onset
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 19:48:40 GMT

In article <1ha9jcINN4uf@grapevine.EBay.Sun.COM> greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM writes:
>Dr. Kaplan,
>
>What is your official position regarding whether or not homeopathy
>should be allowed to be practiced in this country?
>
>I won't try and grapple with someone so much more educated than myself,
><seriously>. I have been using Ventolin anywhere from 6 to 10 times
>a day (more or less) for 2 years now. 


>It wasn't until I made drastic
>changes to my diet 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>(working with Dr. Elson Haas in San Jose) and then
>began recieving accupuncture treatments that I was even able to stop
>the use of Theophylline (sp?) which had my blood pressure in the range
>of 160/100 to 180/110.

And what happens with just the diet changes alone? I have several relatives
with food allergies which where not directly associated with the given food
but instead caused general problems that went away when they stopped eating
the food. I don't think you need to invoke eastern medicine to explain the
difference.

>My asthma was basically non-affected by weather changes, except cold, 
>rainy weather where bronchial infections usually occur. I have intentionally
>but reluctantly avoided the use of steroid inhalers but sometimes use
>Chromilin Sodium (sp?).
>
>As an MD obviously opposed to homeopathy, what would you possibly have to 
>offer me that would bring with it the promise of correcting my asthma?

Where was the homeopathy in the treatment? 

>My initial consultation with my ND cost me $105.00. How much would you
>charge me?

BTW-
 I'm not against alternative treatments, but I do think it is a mistake
 to throw science out the window. If something does seem to work it would
 make sense to test it scientifically and see if it still holds up. 

-- 
------          Join the Pythagorean Reform Church!               .
\    /        Repent of your evil irrational numbers             . .
 \  /   and bean eating ways. Accept 10 into your heart!        . . .
  \/   Call the Pythagorean Reform Church BBS at 508-793-9568  . . . .
From: levin@bbn.com
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: homeopathy
Date: 23 Dec 1992 19:02:12 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com

In <1992Dec23.182340.23710@vexcel.com> dean@vexcel.com (Dean Alaska) writes:
|One possibility is that the dilution process (which is more complex
|than just a simple dilution) modifies the matrix such that the
|immune system believes it is seeing the actual ingredient.  

The matrix ???

More babblespeak, more jargon?
From: walker@skat.usc.edu (Michael D Walker)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: echinacea
Date: 22 Dec 1992 08:47:39 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: skat.usc.edu

>>Len Alshan <LMACC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
>>   Has anyone had any experiencing using echinacea.  If so, please tell me
>>   type purchased (extract,power,pills) and dosage used.

>bsimon@elvis.stsci.edu (Bernie Simon) writes:
> [....] My experience was that it provided some relief, but did not
>eliminate the colds. In contrast, I took some homeopathic medicine for
>a cold two months ago. It provided dramatic overnight relief and the
>cold was gone 2 days later.

Bernie,

What do you mean by homeopathic medicine?

Mike




-- 
 /  /\ /\ Mike Walker      walker@usc.edu   uunet!usc!walker  \ /  /  
/ / \ /   University of Southern Cal,   U Computing Services \ \\/\\  
\/ \/ \   University Park, LA, CA 90089-0251  (213) 740-7382  \/  / \/
Jay Leno for Cray Computers - "Crunch all you want.  We'll make more."
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
From: schumach@convex.com (Richard A. Schumacher)
Subject: Re: eyes etc.
Organization: CONVEX Computer Corporation, Richardson, Tx., USA
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 01:29:57 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In <1992Dec22.034622.22919@ultb.isc.rit.edu> rxv9839@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Bob Vogel) writes:

>while doing an eye test.  After the test my right eye was totally blurry
>and would not focus for about 15 minutes.  Got an eye exam--doc said, no 
>problem, not uncommon.  About 4 months later I lay on the bed for an hour
>or two with my arm against my eye.  This time my eye was out of focus for about six
>hours, coming back very slowly.  This occurance seems to be most abnormal.
>Tried a second eye doc today--results the same no problems found now, may need
>glasses soon.  don't really know what it is.  Any observations or similiar
>experiences and even causes would be appreciated.  Rest assured in advance that I
>will not take any comments as prescriptive and I am already and will contineu
>in full consultation with my eye care professional.

Is your "eye care professional" an optometrist, or an ophthalmologist?
Does that person test you for glaucoma by checking your intra-ocular
pressure?
From: dan@cafws2.eng.uci.edu (Dan Harkless)
Subject: Re: Chiropractic advice
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 30 Dec 92 21:59:01 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.131424.14546@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> thagerma@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Teresa D Hagerman) writes:
>
>Since I started spending much of my workday at a desk and/or a pc, I've noticed
>an increase in neck, shoulder and upper back pain.  I've tried stretching 
>exercises at work and they do provide some short-term relief...but I still ache
>at the end of the day.
>
>I am considering chiropractic care. A co-worker gave me a gift certificate for 
>a visit to her doctor, so there won't be any cash at stake for the first visit.
>
>Suddenly, many well-meaning friends and family members are warning me..."it
>will cost an arm and a leg"..."it does more harm than good"..."they're a bunch 
>of quacks"..."you just need to get more exercise"...and so on.
>
>Does anyone have any advice?  Any experiences (good or bad) to share?

	I would say it depends on the Chiropractor.  Certainly there are quacks
out there.  I was amused the other day to drive by a little converted house
with the sign out front:

  PALM READER
  -----------   
and Chiropractic

	But I have the utmost faith in my Chiropractor.  It can be pricey.  
Each office visit is $30, and if you're in very bad shape (as I was before I
started going recently), it can take quite a few visits, on a one-a-week basis,
to get you back into shape.  However, if the Chiropractor is good, it's worth
the cost.

	I too work on computers much of the time - for school _and_ work.  
Before I started going, my neck often got *really* sore.  It hasn't since.  But
the other improvements in my health are what really makes it worth it for me.
My chiropractor is very holistic, and delves into nutrition and other aspects
of health.  I was having serious energy problems before I started going, and
it's much better now (and still improving).  Also, I have a sensitivity to
molds, and am on a special three-week diet to rid them from my system (and also
to get rid of a sensitivity I developed to white rice after overdosing on it
at the commons...)

	Anyway, to make a long story short, if the Chiropractor knows what he's
doing, it can be *extremely* valuable.  I've been to mediocre and pretty good
Chiropractors in my time, and have now found an excellent one.  There are also
out-and-out *bad* ones out there, so be careful, and good luck!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Dan Harkless                | "The sore in my soul                         |
| dan@cafws1.eng.uci.edu      |  The mark in my heart  ->  Front 242,        |
| dharkles@bonnie.ics.uci.edu |  Her acid reign..."        Tragedy >For You< |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: traub@rtf.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: Midwifery
Date: 30 Dec 92 08:55:28 GMT
Organization: BT Customer Systems, Brighton, UK

In article <1992Dec30.040025.3983@sarah.albany.edu> la1002@albnyvms.bitnet writes:
>As a future midwife (I'm a pre-nursing student now), I am curious to
>know what the general opinion regarding lay midwives and certified
>nurse midwives is.  I plan to get a master's degree in midwifery and
>a bachelor's in nursing, and hopefully, another bachelors in sociology
>with a minor in psychology.

My  wife  and  I  had  occassion to use midwives recently when our daughter
was  born  at  home  in June. We had two certified midwives and one trainee
present.  We  could have elected to have additional lay midwifes available,
but  since  UK  law  requires  two  certified midwifes to be present at any
planned home births we had no need for additional midwives.

I  personally  felt  comforted by knowing that the midwives were certified,
but  I  was  a  little  taken  aback  at  how ready they were to use modern
medical  quackery.  For  example they apparently have to recommend that our
child  be  injected  with Vitamin K at birth and then we have to explicitly
refuse  and  then this is noted as such in the records. One wonders how the
human  race  survived  the  first  few  thousand  years  without  Vitamin K
injections  at  birth,  but  that's  another  story. I suppose they have no
choice  but  to  follow  the  health  department's  guidelines,  but  it is
annoying because they are not even meant to offer an opinion.

We   read  about  half  a  dozen  books  on  the  subject  of  home  births
beforehand,  I  can't recall the names of the titles. We found a local home
birth  group  which  had  set  up  a  library  of books to swap. All in all
Brighton  was  a  very  good  place to have a home birth and the nurses and
midwives were  very  supportive.  This  contrasts with some areas in London
where  the  staff  are  so  backward  they  frown on home births and breast
feeding  and  anything  not  traditional  (even though these traditions are
all less than fifty years old).


-- 
Michael Traub
BT Customer Systems, Brighton Systems Centre. traub@btcs.bt.co.uk
From: dean@vexcel.com (Dean Alaska)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: homeopathy
Date: 23 Dec 92 23:45:41 GMT
Organization: VEXCEL Corporation, Boulder CO

In article <schumach.725153283@convex.convex.com> schumach@convex.com (Richard A. Schumacher) writes:
>
>>Keep in mind that the most popular uses for homeopathy are where
>>allopathy has nothing to offer, such as chronic conditions and
>>viruses.  There is nothing to lose in tryinh it in these cases.
>
>It's an old pattern: people with no hope will turn to anything for
>comfort. As medicine learns how to treat the conditions, homeopathy
>will retreat from them. Example-in-the-making: What is the homeopathic
>treatment for cystic fibrosis? What will become of it if the gene
>therapy for CF now under test is shown to work?
>
>And there is something to lose: money and time. Desperate people
>can bankrupt themselves and their dependents chasing rainbows, or
>waste precious months that might have increased their chances for
>survival.
>

Keep in mind that the typical bottle of homeopathic remedies cost
a few dollars - not a lot of money considering the expense of
allopathic medicine.  Nobody bankrupts themselves on homeopathy
and there aren't many (any?) who are getting rich from it.

There are plenty of examples in the history of scientific
discovery when theories were not proven for a long time due to
limitations in the _ability_ to test the theory.  There are plenty
of theories that were finally disproven.  Neither has happened
with homeopathy yet and only time will tell for sure.  However,
it appears that you are certain as to what the result will be.
-- 
==============================================================================
A thought for the holidays:
   "Wine is living proof that God loves us and likes to see us happy"
	- Benjamin Franklin			dean@vexcel.com
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative