From: looi@ssf-corp.dhl.com (Wan Looi)
Subject: Re: who's right ...  [was Re: racial harmony- Yasmin]
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 05:22:09 GMT
Organization: DHL Worldwide Express, Redwood City, Calif., USA


In article <1992Nov17.164124.22909@ems.psu.edu> nor@hekla.pnge.psu.edu (Nor-Azlan Nordin) writes:
>
>I don't think you made your points clear.  And, I don't think you are
>telling the whole truth about your previous flaming session or
>discussions (?) with me and many other Malays about Islam (three years ago).  
>I know most of them already graduated.  That doesn't mean that you can 
>mouth off false info about you in this newsgroup. 

again, only you, me and your allah know. insya-allah, your allah 
will burn me to hell if i lie. fair enuf?

>Yes, Islam is superior than others (for me) because it is my religion.
>Of course, I will always feel Islam is the most righteous religion.

here's where the problem begins... if you were to say that in arab,
pakistan, or any islam homogenous society, it's perfectly ok and
understandable. but, sorry pal you live in a multi-racial country
and it only fosters hostility if you mouth off "my religion is
superior..." to non-muslims (or kafir in your lang).

>If I think Islam can offer something good to Malaysia, I will try to
>propose it, or at least introduce it.  But, what did I and many other
>muslims get when we mentioned the word "Islam" in the newsgroup? You
>people asked us to get lost or go to other newsgroup.  Where is the
>discussion?  How did u conclude Islam is not feasible for Malaysia
>(we haven`t discussed about it yet)?  Now, tell me who is intolerance?  
>Ignorance? Stoopid?
>

i can't speak for indians and other non-muslims, but i'd say most
chinese don't want to have anything to do with islam. they are 
"allergic" to islam as much as "unclean animals" are "allergic" to
muslims. the main reason why most chinese don't feel related to 
islam is because the rigid islam code of life (most, if not all)
is highly alien and almost incomprehensible to chinese who are
under heavy confucius influence. the only likely way you may
convince chinese of your belief is to bring up the similarities
and common values between the two. i can assure you any effort
to superimpose your belief to chinese, by force or otherwise
will result in unthinkable consequence.

on top of that, most non-muslims that i know don't buy in the
idea of mixing religion and state affairs. i.e., they want a
secular state, period. 

>No, I did not impose Islam on you or anybody.  What I was hoping is to
>see some kind of discussion about Islam as an alternative to Malaysia's
>racial problems (in full scale).  Of course, in any kind of
>discussion, some people tend to get carried away.  It is natural.
>Nobody ever asked or said "Yo...you Chinese, Indians and all non-muslims, 
>convert to Islam now or we will cut you to pieces".  
>

but, can we trust religious leaders, especially malay supremacist
and islam fanatic (as you admitted you are one) like you?

look what happened in kelantan? first, pas said the shahriah
would apply only to muslims. they even made the pledge to
non-muslims in kelantan and dap before the election. now,
look what happens, they are imposing it to non-muslims as
well w/o even getting consent from the non-muslim communities
and the "pact" they had had with dap! where is the integrity?
evidents are abound! this is only ONE example, i can easily
throw in a few more if anyone is interested. 

btw, please don't tell me pas is not a true muslim party as i 
see a tendency among muslims to disassociate any wrongdoing of 
muslim with islam or say things like, "oh, saddam is not a true 
muslim... iran is not a true islamic country..."

>Understandable cos' they are muslims.  In the states, the Whites think
>Christianity is the best.  I have been accosted by many Christian
>preachers over here at Penn State.  Nice people; but, not convincing
>enough.  Yes, they also proposed Christian morality on me.  And, I didn't
>think they are FANATICS.  I knew that deep inside them they feel that
>their religion is better than mine (or, superior).  I didn't give the
>two hoots about it cos' for me my religion is superior than theirs.
>So, they evangelize me, I eveangelize them.  Fair right? 

again, you are still in the dreamland of a homogenous muslim world.
your thinking of superiority is obviously an ingredient to your own 
illusion of fanaticsm and supremacism.

>>3 years ago, I called this person, zam PIG cos' he uttered 
>>outrageous racial slurs and remarks at my people. but, i now 
>>realize that it's ethically wrong to equiv anyone with animail 
>
>Liar!!!!  You said it but did not practise it. 

i abhor lying. my integrity and consistency will continue to 
withstand your false accusation and distorted facts.
tahan lasak seperti tayar dunlop!

>
>So, what is it then? A HYPOCRITE?  You have no right whatsoever to get
>angry to ZAM cos' you are the same.  Your attitude towards the Malays
>are the same as ZAM's towards the Chinese.    And, of course, my

thanks buddha, i do not stoop to lowly as your potential mentor, zam did.

>attitude towards you is the same as ZAM's towards you.  I expect the
>same from you towards me.  If u don't, I don't care anyway.

why should i? your sick mentality only shows the world how
unnoble your upbringing is. leave alone, your religious belief
which has "molded" you what you are today. i kasihan kan you lah!

>
>I have changed my attitude toward the Chinese in Malaysia but certainly not
>your kind.  My last posting after a week flaming session with the
>

you have not. you've repeatedly shown your malay supremacy and
islam fanaticsm. prove me i'm wrong.

>Australians expressed my intention.  That posting was not dedicated to
>you and your kind.  That's why I am still flaming people like you
>untill now.  And, I don't have any special privileges given to any race 
>when it comes to flaming.  I flamed the Chinese, Indians and the Malays as
>well (as if flaming is my way of life :-)).
>

so, you're now a self-proclaimed flamemonger? i luv it!

>Yeah...I am KURANG AJAR and BIADAB.  What is the point to be nice and
>friendly to a person who will never change.  Talking nicely will make
>you "naik kepala".  So, being kurang ajar will at least make you slow
>down a little.  So far so good......

glad that you finally admitted you're anak kurang ajar and biadab.

see, i don't have to prove anything but you've already admitted a
lot of things. (first fanatic, the come rude & unruly, flamemonger,
a**hole) what's next? 8-)

>
>Come on, how many times did you write emotional postings in this 
>newsgroup (similar to this one)?  Many times as far as I can
>remember.  Did you really do what you said?  

so, you expect me to be rude and unruly like you, flamemonger?
come on, with your SUPERIOR religious upbringing, you can 
certainly do better!

>You have to earn whatever you say.  You can't just say you have grown
>up and became a better person, and everything will take care of
>itself.  Prove that you have changed, then tell the world.  Please
>don't tell the world first and then change.  It is BULLSHIT!!!!
>

i need not say more. whether or not i have "grown up", the image
manisfests itself in my writings. on the other hand, you haven't
changed a bit, after all these years! still a flamemonger!

>>it amazes me that you finally admitted that you're a FANATIC... 8-)
>>need i say more?
>
>Then by default you admitted that you are a HYPOCRITE, need I say
>more?.  BTW, I am not surprise at all.   I have been telling you that
>many times before, but you didn't notice it.
>

can you kindly point me where in any of my writings did i admit or
imply that? putting the words into my mouth again, huh?

in critical thinking 101, it says

"unassigned variables are always DEFAULTed to NULL values, not some
random values."

now, you have just earned yourself another title "LCDS" 
(Logic Compreshion Defiency Syndrome) besides the more
affluent "ECDS". 8-)

>
>Yes Allah knows best.  And, may Allah burns you in HELL!!!!
>

well, we shall see. mudah-mudahan, buddha thinks that i should
go thru the rebirth cycle before attaining nirvana. in the meantime,
i'll let my buddha "negotiate" with your allah. fair enuf?
and, please don't let your allah burn you before me, otherwise
tak aci lah? 8-)

>
>If you can come up with a list of goodies about me, so do I.....
>

good, let's see what you've got!

>
>So, you are a CHINESE CHAUVINISTIC PIG.
>

call me whatever you want, most netters have already seen
your "true colors".

>
>So, you are a NATO member (NO ACTION TALK ONLY).  
>

i wish i could be a NATO member.. but, until i move to
europe, until i assume my american citizenship, i'll
always be an ASEANite (A Sane & Educated Asian Netter)

>
>So, you are a person with two faces with nothing straight in you
>except your hair.
>

cool, you're almost becoming zam, the second! i still remember
zam said "... nothing could straigthen chinese except their 
hair...". of course, this is not 3 years ago; it's as recent as
1 year or so ago.  *he* *he *he* ...

>
>So, you are a person who distorts facts in order to save your ass.
>Shame really....

again, you have no proof. only u, me and your allah know. i'll
let my buddha settle with your allah. okay?

>
>You are a HYPOCRITE (talam dua muka)
>

again, call me whatever you want... my integrity says it all.

>
>Yes sir.  You deserved all of them. 
>

feel sorry for ya... after spending so much govt and taxpayers'
$$$, all you've learned is the street language... hope you don't
do the same when you write your thesis, okay?

>
>>just remember tis, your distorted accusations and facts, and your 
>>use of distasteful words are gonna come back and haunt you for a
>>long long time ...  
>
>That's why your statement of "Melayu boleh golong tikar...." still haunts 
>you till now.  Advise yourself first.  If you have changed fully, then
>advise me.  I will listen to you if you do change.
>

i haven't seen u changed a wee bit, so i can safely assume that you
wouldn't change for a millienium years!

while we are at it, please help me paraphrase exactly what i
said (as your falsely accussed) 3 years ago? and, please help
me construct a proper sentense how "Melayu boleh balik kampong.."
oops, "....boleh golong tikar.." can nicely fix into

	"... if you despise the system here so much and so
         obsses with your islamic way of life, why don't YOU
         golong tikar and balik kampong or go to mecca?"

>
>OK.  Take out everything.  So, I can be an ASSHOLE in this newsgroup.
>I thought I am already an ASSHOLE.  Well, if somebody wants to 
>enhance my ASSHOLE-ness, what the heck....go ahead.
>

not yet, the interesting "thing" has yet to come... if you prEy
[not pray] for it, it shall come...

>
>You got it buddy boy....
>
>
>              "TIDAK AKAN HILANG MELAYU DI DUNIA"
>

cool! let's keep it up, okay? also, can you please
translate it into english so that non bm speaking
netters can understand?

>
>Well, a good question deserves a good answer.....
>
indeed!

>This country offers an excellent educational opportunity (purely,
>academic).  Unfortunately, morality (pornographic, extra-marital
>affairs etc.) is in the record low.  That's what despised me.  
>

are you implying that american values are pornography, etc
is that what you have learned about american moralities
and values? i think it's your racial and religious superiority
complex that cloud your comprehensive of others' values
and beliefs. again, you're known to have {E,L}CDS! 8-)

>Not only that.  Penn State offered me assistantship to do M.S. in
>Petroelum and Natural Gas Engineering.  They needed me. So, as a nice
>guy I accepted it for academic reasons and, of course, Penn State
>Football.  Now, they still wants me to do PhD.  Sometimes, it is tough
>to be SMART and HANDSOME at the same time, you know :-) :-) :-).
>

oh, most postgrads i know do receive some form of assistantship anyway,
so it's not new. but, r u sure you can get by the living cost
and tuition fees w/o any grant/loan/scholarship/workstudy
from "someplace"?

i lived thru it and i knew what it is like. so, don't fool me.

>
>Are you and Mr. Quayle related by any chance?  
>

no, i'm an asian, he's a caucasian so can't be related. but
i like his persistency over the family value issues, tho'

>
>-Azlan "smart and handsome guy" Nordin-
>           Penn State

but i thot' you said you're HANDSOME, but not SMART as shown below:

   "Anyhow, I accept your condolence.  I am not smart, I am not genius,
    and I am not the nicest person on earth, but, I sure know one thing
    ---  I am HANDSOME.  If Cindy Crawford has a chance meeting me, she
    probably not ended up with Richard Gere. :-) :-) :-)"

one day you say one thing, and one day you say another thing...
just like bill clinton! please make up your mind!

well, i'll be going on vacation comes this thanksgiving weekend. 
hope to see you again after i return. 

	selamat hari balasbudi to you!


hou whei yu qi,
LEI YUENHUA

zi @ 11/18/92


	     (opinions are solely mine. i'm liable for the contents)
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