HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: re: another poem
Date: 30 Sep 92 14:29:49 GMT
Reply-To: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Organization: Ailanthus Project

usr77@pil.UUCP writes:

> Re: Re: another poem
> By: cortese #0 @skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) USEnet
>
> > After hearing so many net men personally flame me for all the times
> > got turned down for a date because they didn't make enough money or
> > drive a nice enough car, I have a real hard time taking this serious
> > The next time that cute little number you're interested in laughs at
> > and then turns around and dates the schmendrick in the next cubicle
> > drives a BMW, tell me this again with a straight face.
> > Blessings,
> > Janis
>
> As a member of the collective class "net.men", I am completely confuse
> as to why ANYONE would personally flame you over a woman who didn't
> have to be you turning him down over a date. Have I missed something
> obvious or what?
>
cos humans are irrational?

> As for the relationship between $$$ and getting dates... that is not s
> I need explained to me, I figure that until I start making serious mon
> again, I'm out of the dating game.
>
well, you couldn't disprove that by ME.  i'm on welfare, and i don't
ask people for dates.  it's not necessarily that i am afraid of being
turned down (well, i am, but that's anotehr thread), but if you don't
have decent money, dates on a regular basis are TOO DAMNED EXPENSIVE!!!

although one CAN just arrange to cook for someone.  that works.
especially if you are an excellent cook...

                                                  -ailsa


=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                    ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com
Desire.  The weight of.  The weight of our              ________
desire.  Then laugh, cry, but laugh             Silence \      / Action
more than you cry, and when you hold               =     \    /    =
the world in your hands, love Her.               Death    \  /    Life
                     - Alma Luz Villanueva                 \/
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: markbr@radian.uucp (markbr)
Subject: Re: Mabinogian
Summary: gamers
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 18:51:36 GMT
Organization: Radian Cormp.


Bekki mentions not playing much RPG any more, due to the male gamers &
their expectations. I haven't played in a while, either, but it's more for
time & company. You do have to find the right people to game with. I 
dropped from one game a a store, because of these 2 idiot 16-year-olds,
who attcked my elf, even though he was more experienced, AND leading the
party, because "their friends were dwarves..." (needless to say, they
got wiped up). Then there was the game that a friend ran: he was (35-50?) 
there were two 18-year-olds, a 16-year-old girl & her 4x father, and me,
and another friend. After some real *stupid* moves on the part of one of
the 18-year-olds (both guys, btw) & the girl's dad, let's see: one or two
guys' characters got sex-changed, and we all wound up on a quest. Have
y'all ever heard the phrase "men's consciousness raising group?". Most of
the guys (me incl. were running female characters. By the end, the younger
guys had picked up a few thoughts & attitudes, while the father hadn't a *clue*
as to why he got killed (after greeting a Sphinx w/ the phrase "Hi, pussy!").
And the guy running it trimmed trees for a living. 

File that last one under the headings of "don't judge folks by their looks",
and "what matters is who you play with".

	mark
From: cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: another poem
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:55:38 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine

In article <2AC90089.9638@news.service.uci.edu> cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
>
>A plain and loud woman who acts dumber than her
>boyfriend just to reassure him or won't call herself a feminist because
>she's afraid of being thought of as "unattractive" pisses me off far
>more than a pretty, soft-voiced woman who has her own opinions and
>expects good treatment.  You are far too hung up on looks and are
>assuming that we are, too, and that bothers me.  

Got caught up in the more-less paradigm.  The cringing woman pisses me
off PERIOD.  Anyone who expresss themselves well and uses their brain
pisses me off nary a whit.

Blessings,
Janis 
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Subject: Re: books to avoid
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 02:05:42 GMT

conib@peri.gvg.tek.com (Coni Britten) writes:

>Dear WenD:

>In article <9209292228.AA19288@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> ST801706@BROWNVM.BROWN.EDU writes:
>>book is ultra-ultra-ultra feminist, as in the brand of feminism
>>where all women are perfect and all men can sink into a swamp and
>>die.

>As a feminist, I have to object to your equating feminism (with ultras
>attached or not, it's still feminism you're referring to) as being anti-male.
>At any level.  This concept is definitely what folks like Jerry Faldwell
>and Rush Limbaugh want people to believe -- they both repeat this bogus
>"aspect" of feminism quite a bit.

>Feminism and man-hating two different things.  Period.  If they are not,
>then by your definition, a man can not be an ultra-ultra-ultra feminist.
>Obviously they can, and are.

>Sorry about the flame, but, well, there it is ... we speak our minds in
>this newsgroup!


>Coni Britten
>conib@peri.gvg.tek.com

Well, by this definition, Z. Budapest is not a feminist.  I wonder how she would
like to be told that.  Coni, you are imposing *your* idea of feminism on all
of feminism.  WenD made it very clear that sie was not referring to all of 
feminism but to one extremist end of it.  If you don't believe that there are
extremist feminists, I can quote stories from my lesbian and bi women friends
who have been attacked for associating with males.  Also, there are certainly
men who are man-haters, who accept the idea that men are the evil perpetrators
of patriarchy.  There are lots of people who are self-destructive.


              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)

******************************************************************************
Newage is hypoallergenic spirituality--
it's for people who are allergic to the word religion.
                                   --Jon Jay Obermark
From: alyoung@kiwi.ucs.indiana.edu (Amy Young Leith)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Pagan Rock Artists...
Date: 4 Oct 92 04:19:59 GMT
Organization: Indiana University, Bloomington


I would think that in most cases, trying to guess someone's religion
by their songs is at best chancey.  One of the wonderful things about
music is that it is all open to interpretation, and we each can
probably find different meanings in the same songs.  

Also, from taking into consideration the whole span of what many
musicians write about, they write about a lot of things they may not
personally support 100 percent. 

amy
-- 
alyoung@kiwi.ucs.indiana.edu for personal mail
			    All business mail to alyoung@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
       I only speak for myself.  Anyone who thinks differently is a fool.
From: pharvey@mipos3.intel.com (Paul Harvey)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Witches and death
Date: 6 Oct 92 18:20:45 GMT
	<aHw4RB1w165w@hogbbs.scol.pa.us>
Organization: Intel Corporation, Santa Clara, CA USA

In article <aHw4RB1w165w@hogbbs.scol.pa.us> 
wce@hogbbs.scol.pa.us (Bill Eichman) writes:
>Maybe all we need are personal and individual explanations for death? 

OK, so what is your personal and individual explanation for death?

>Who knows? I think if this modern paganism wants to be taken seriously, 
>it's eventually going to have to develop some form of rigorously tested, 
>yet flexible general philosophy. I imaginbe it will be one of those 
>"evolution in action" sort of things, wherein the less useful ideas get 
>left behind....

Less useful ideas, to whom? If you do a "survival of the fittest" to religion,
what you get is the religion that is best marketed and has the most militant
followers. Just look at Christianity, Paulist Christianity is the one that 
won in the West. Does that mean it is the "most useful"? And "general
philosophy"? Is such a thing possible in a world of individuals? Diversity is
good right? And Unity also, correct? But, is Unity worth giving up Diversity
to obtain? Isn't a better goal to strive for Diversity and try to achieve
Unity of Diversity? One "general philosophy" is "Do the right thing". Is that
not enough? What more do you seek? What more do you desire?
From: popec@freeside.com (PopeC)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Who do you kneel to when you pray?
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 92 12:06:48 CDT
Organization: Rivendell BBS / Hou, TX. / +1 713 941 2236

jmm25@po.CWRU.Edu (Jessica M. Mcgeary) writes:

> 
> It's not always the Christian way to fear one's deity, Corun.... though
> I will admit it does seem, sadly, common. Of course, I'd probably be burnt
> at the stake anyway- I'm hardly what you'd call a typical Catholic- but I
> always pictured God as more along the lines of Roman law than British law.
> According to the good Jebbies at Fordham (I think; me mum told me this when
> she was getting her master's there), British law is generally an ideal code
> of behavior. This is how you should be, the  absolute shining ideal, and if
> you get it wrong you will be punished severely. Roman law was explained as
> being more along the lines of, This is how we'd like you to act, or
> how we think you're likely to act; if you mess up, it's all right, you're 
> human. Just try not to screw up again, okay?
> 
> 'Course, I was raised in a more or less Italian family. Kinda biased my view
> of the situation. I'm not especially afraid of what I view as God, but then,
> it's hard to be scared of someone who seems more or less like your favorite
> grandfather, or your mother.
> -- 
> Jessica McGeary
> jmm25@po.cwru.edu
> Case Western Reserve University
> Remember! Arguments should be FUN!


If God had meant us to fear him, He would have given us adrenal glands
the size of muskmelons.


**********************************************************************
* Pope Charles - Subgenius pope Of Houston & The Golden Triangle Area*
*       Laughing at everything in the Universe, including the        *
*       concept of laughing at everything in the Universe.           *
*               rivdell.sccsi.com    Houston, Texas                  *
**********************************************************************
From: wolfe@wolves.uucp (G. Wolfe Woodbury)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: editing
Date: 27 Sep 92 02:55:08 GMT
Organization: Red Wolfe @ The Wolves Den
X-Md4-Signature: cfd759297088bb633a86bbbc42a826ac

In <ReBoRB4w165w@hogbbs.scol.pa.us> wce@hogbbs.scol.pa.us (Bill Eichman) writes:
>Picayune, yes, but net ettiquette involves editing out quoted material so 
>that only the needed lines are left as a reference. Maybe some have an 
>excuse, but page after page of quotes is not net.polite. Thanks.

Excuuuuuuse me?  Like all other etiquette, politeness on the net means
to use (un)common sense when dealing with a situation.

Not all users have the option of using an editor that is easy to use, or
that they have access to the documentation for.  Not all users,
especially in the non-technical groups, are past masters of 5 different
and mutually unintelligible editing paradigms.

It may not be net.polite of some to leave excess quotes and materials in
their articles, but, as Miss Manners, Emily Post and Dear Abby all
agree, you are more impolite for pointing out the faux pas.

				Wolfe
				making no claims to be polite net.wise

[Hmm, did we ever decide what the masculine/male equivalent to the Crone
was?  Some days I feel so positively net.ancient!   "...he's been with
us since before the beginning."  --I think we're all Bozos on this Bus]

				howling at nothing
-- 
G. Wolfe Woodbury @ The Wolves Den UNIX, Durham NC         [use the maps!]
UUCP: ...dukcds!wolves!wolfe   ...duke!wolves!wolfe    <Standard disclaimers>
Domain: wolfe%wolves@cs.duke.edu    wolfe@cds.duke.edu
    Above all, we celebrate.   Celebrate the Circle Statement of Purpose
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: st923058@pip.cc.brandeis.edu (Rosaleen Dhu)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: etc.
Date: 3 Oct 92 21:12:53 GMT
Reply-To: st923058@pip.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University


	1. HAPPY BIRTHDAY, LORRIE!
	2. I was looking at the inlay card for my tape of Metallica's "Kill
'Em All" (no anti-metal flames s'il vous plait) and noticed that Cliff
Burton, Metallica's now-deceased (sniff) bass player, is wearing some kind
of medallion around his neck in the photo. Anyone know what it is?
	3. Melissa wanted to know what kind of music people listen to. I am a
music major and consider myself a classical musician. I do a lot of work with
musical theatre, partly because I've done stage tech. for it and partly
because I am going to be a music teacher and kids like stuff from musicals
better than they like the stuff that is written for children's choruses these
days. However, I do listen to some heavy metal--I ignore the lyrics, which
are often homophobic, racist, anti-female or just plain stupid, and listen
to the music, which is often very good. Of course, I also listen to pagan
folk stuff like Gwydion, and British Invasion rock, and '50's stuff, and...
well you get the point. I'd love to discuss music thru e-mail if anyone's
interested.
	4. Still workin' on a New England alt.pagan gathering. I talked to
two people in Plymouth, NH. How far is that from where some of you in New
England live? (Badly constructed sentence--my apologies.)
				Stars light your paths,
							Rosaleen
From: billn@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com (bill nelson)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Who do you kneel to when you pray?
Date: 30 Sep 92 20:15:36 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA

radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz) writes:
: billn@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com (bill nelson) writes:
: > I guess it depends on when you "curse". I do so when I am displeased
: > with something - like when I foolishly hit myself on the thumb with
: > a hammer. I do not curse when I am angry. So, to me, there is nothing
: > serious in a curse - the subconscious does not have the chance to
: > act.
: 
: Hi Bill
: 
: You miss the whole point.  The comment "the subconscious does not have
: the chance to act" is meaningless.  If you were to say "The CONSCIOUS
: mind doesn't have the chance to act" then I'd accept it.  But my
: point is that the SUBconscious is the part of you which acts first
: in quick decisions, such as the decision whether or not to curse.
: The point of the curse is irrelevant.

No, I didn't miss the point. You are correct, I should have said "the
subconscious has no reason to act when I curse". 

To me, profanity shows disgust or unhappiness - it does not show
anger.  I would be more concerned when I am too angry to curse.
That is when I would expect my subconscious to get into the act.

Bill
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: kbennett@milton.u.washington.edu (K. Lena Bennett; Slacker Goddess)
Subject: Re: tarot decks
Organization: University of Washington
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 15:26:29 GMT

A couple people mentioned that some stores display samples of some
cards in a deck in a photo album or in those little plastic sleeves.
This is better than nothing, but I really prefer the stoers that let
you look through an entire sample deck.  Sometimes there is a deck
that I like the general style of but in which a few of the cards are
rendered in a way that would make it very difficult for me to feel
comfortable with using that deck (sexism or blatant heterosexism --
note I *didn't* say heterosexuality -- for instance).  I like to do a
spot check of my "favorite" cards (the ones that have been historically
most meaningful to me) and see if the artist's vision is compatible with
the way that card "feels" to me.  And if a store is only showing a few
cards, you can get a general feel of the deck but not necessarily find
all the information you need to make the purchase.

Lena
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: tarot decks
From: t00022@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
Date: 29 Sep 92 10:19:55 -0600
Reply-To: t00022@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
Organization: St. Cloud State University, St. Cloud, MN

In article <kali.717493961@milton>, kali@milton.u.washington.edu (embrace the void) writes:
>
> I have the Rider Waite deck, and am likely to have it until I design my
>own and get someone to do the artwork, and I do not recommend it.  Waite
>spent his creative and spiritual energies, as far as I can tell, rebelling
>from Christianity, and that is the main tention that infuses his deck.
>
>On the other hand, it is cheap.
>
>I really liked the Jungian deck, and if I had excess funds, would probably
>buy it.  I do a great many (well, @5/week) for friends and acquaintences,
>and often think longingly about the other deck.

Just some additional information....

	The artwork on the Rider-Waite deck was produced by Pamela Colman
Smith.  As so often happens with artists, she was not given the recognition she 
deserved during her lifetime.  (Don't remember when she died...sometime in the 
1950's, maybe?)  A friend of mine calls her the Mother of Modern Tarot.  Smith
was the one who "recreated", in a sense, the cards of the minor arcana and made
them much more interesting to look at.  Because of Smith's work, my previously
mentioned friend thinks that this deck should be called the Smith-Waite deck. 
Not a bad idea, IMHO.  
	This deck has influenced many other decks, such as the Robin Wood deck,
and (if I remember correctly) the Connolly and Hanson-Roberts decks.

                                                      Fledermaus



Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: corun@access.digex.com (Corun MacAnndra)
Subject: Re: Pagan Cussin' (was: re: who do you kneel to when you pray?)
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 23:16:06 GMT

In article <2AC5FB11.8460@news.service.uci.edu> cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
>
>I may have a slight advantage out here in SoCal; there just ain't no
>dagos `round!  Consequently, I can swear in the busted-up Italian curse
>words I heard when I was little and no one knows what I said.
>
>Blessings,
>Janis 

My favourite Italian cuss phrase is one I picked up from Chico Marx, the
"Italian" Marx brother. I probably don't have the exact wording, and it's
probably not even real Italian much less real good Italian, but it's;

"Piatza de moscas um feriachi tuzzi patz."

And of course I'm spelling it mostly phonetically too. Someone once told me
that it might actually translate out to;

"Everyone here is crazy, but I love 'em anyway."

Which might even be applicable for describing this forum. ;-) -hugs-

Bb,

Corun


-- 
===========================================================================
    Corun MacAnndra    | To sit with a pretty woman for an hour seems like
  Dark Horde by birth  | a minute. To sit on a hot stove for a minute seems
    Moritu by choice   | like an hour. That's relativity. --  A. Einstein
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Subject: Re: Offerings...
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 19:22:53 GMT

barclay@RAIL9000.gatech.edu (Barclay Blanchard) writes:

>Here's one for the Bitch Goddess (Morgana, is it, Bran?)

Well, Morgana is the name *I* use.  It is allegedly a Welsh version of the
Morrigan, but I haven't seen verification of that yet.  Other people will use
other names, as is appropriate.

BTW, I like the poem, I'm gonna keep it.  

Remind me and I'll post a poem called _The Black Bird_ by the High Priestess
I work with sometimes.  I think a number of people will enjoy it.


              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)

******************************************************************************
Newage is hypoallergenic spirituality--
it's for people who are allergic to the word religion.
                                   --Jon Jay Obermark
From: gil@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: night and winter
Distribution: world
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 09:01:00 GMT
Organization: STAFF STRATEGIES - Anthropologists & Training Agents
Reply-To: gil@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au


In article <80738@ut-emx.uucp> amadeus@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu writes:

 > One of my *favorite* things is to be outside, at night, during a
 > thunder-and-lightning storm.  It makes me go all elemental... :)

Evenings, at the end of the Wet Season in the Northern Territory . . .

Daybreak in the Western Desert . . .

A storm all the way from Antarctica hitting the Gippsland coast . . .

Sitting on the ground with each of the animals sitting with you, part
of the same ritual space, discussing Law together with the ancestors.

More than elemental
Totally incarnate
Invisible
All knowledge
Ultimate intelligence
Absolute bliss

This is the start of The Dreaming.


Gil Hardwick                                      gil@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au
Independent Consulting Ethnologist                            3:690/660.6
PERTH, Western Australia                                 (+61 9) 399 2401
   * * Sustainable Community Development & Environmental Education * *
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: kditto@nyx.cs.du.edu (Kimborly Ditto)
Subject: More Offerings
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix @ U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 20:53:27 GMT


Here's another offering to you guys...

I got this catalog in the mail a couple of months ago, and thought it
might be of interest to some of you.

The place is called Design Toscano, and it is a statuary (sp?) place. 
They have LOTS of stuff - their catalog says that if you don't see it in
the catalog, call and ask.  And - that works!  I called looking for a
reproduction of a really obscure piece, and the HAD IT.

I ordered one of their gargoyles, and the Quality is Excellent.  Although
the gargoyle is made of plaster, they have a finishing technique that
makes it look like aged iron.  They have many other finishes as well.

(this is starting to sound like a commercial!! :))

Most of their stuff is classical, and their catalog costs $6.00 (the cost
might be refundable on first order, I'm not sure)

The address is:
Design Toscano
7 E. Campbell Street
Arlington Heights, IL  60005
1-800-525-0733

Within the next two weeks I'm going to check out their gallery, soI'll let
ya all know how is is.

Blessings!
--Athena