Newsgroups: rec.sport.cricket

In rec.sport.cricket, ABEGLEY@ccmail.sunysb.edu (Anthony M. Begley) writes:

}> Although I think Pakistan has
}> the best and most varied bowling attack in the world today.

}Though not varied enough to get Gower out twice on a perfect bowlers
}pitch :-) !!

Being a big Gower fan myself, I am happy it turned out that way. His
four tests prior to the series (the last against India, three in
Australia ) had three centuries in them and he hasn't hurt his chances
in this series. Believe it or not, I was cheering him on from the
friendly confines of my living room.

But to be fair, Pakistan didn't need to get Gower in the first innings.

}Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion and people ought to respect them for
}doing so. Pakistan may have the best (and most varied attack) in the world --
}its certainly not a bad attack. However, doesnt anyone else believe, as I do,
}that if Pakistan has the best attack in the world then there is a pretty bad 
}shortage of good bowlers today. 

Of the test playing nations, only WI and Pak have a good bowling side.
Part of the decline in bowling standards is the increasing importance
of one-day matches. Getting wickets is definitely less important in
one-dayers, hence the decline in the number of strike bowlers. The
slow medium stuff that contains the opposition seems to be the most
popular way to earn a living.

}Wasim and Waqar are certainly world class
}bowlers but I cant rate the rest of the attack as world class. Is it just me
}or is the standard of bowling declining. How can we compare this Pak attack
}to that of the West Indes in the late 70's/80's, or to Lille and Thompson.
}Where have all the world class spinners gone to ?

To be fair, Lillee and Thompson didn't have much of support either. Walker
and Mallet were definitely not world class. India's spin quartet of Bedi,
Chandra, Prasanna and Venkat was truly awesome, but India had no pace
bowlers at all. Roberts, Holding, Croft, Garner were phenomenal, but
they never had a decent spinner after the great Lance Gibbs. Pak attack
may not compare to Lillee and co., Bedi and co. or Roberts and co. But
it is better than what other teams can field today.

IMHO, Mushtaq is the best spinner in the world today. He does not
compare to Bedi and co. He is not better than Qadir. Not yet. But
he is good. England middle order is not reading him at all. With
Lamb and Botham gone, England have possibly the strongest batting
today. They cannot come close to Fredericks, Greenidge, Kalli, Lloyd,
and Kanhai, but who has a better batting side today ? Pak bowling is
dominating the England batting and that is why I rate this Pak 
attack so high.

}England do not have any world class bowlers at the moment, nor do India or
}New Zealand, I suppose. Even the West Indes are not as fearsome as they 
}used to be.

England is going through major overhaul. Atherton, Gower, Smith, 
Ramprakash, Munton and Mallander did not play in the WC final. That
is a lot of changes. In between came and went Malcolm, Salisbury
and Russel. Tuffnel, Lawrence, Fraser, Foster, Defreitas are all
around somewhere. I think the attack will be decent by the time
they get to India.

}We all know this, thanks. Dont think I dont respect Pringle, but in this
}longing for a quality strike bowler people like Pringle, Munton, Mallender,
}etc are unfairly blamed for being trundlers. Its not their fault, we just
}expect them to be like IT Botham in his hayday and they are not. All
}of us remember the times Pringle has bowled on a flat fast good track and
}got massacred (like everyone else). Like the rest of the bowling he only looks
}good on a bowlers wicket (Headingly) -- thats why he shouldnt be playing
}at the Oval. At least with genuine pace (however crap Malcolm is)
}we might get the odd batsmen to make a mistake.....hopefully.

Pringle and Lewis are England's best bowlers now, IMHO.

}You think Im implying that English umpires are completely impartial and the 
}rest of the worlds umpires (esp Pakistan) are not. As all the sensible 
}posters have been saying no country's umpires collectively are any better than
}anyone elses. Every country has its umpires who SEEM to favour the home side,
}although this is more likely a psychological feeling of being picked
}on in a foreign country (argue that one :-) ).

English umpires are no more impartial on the average. 

}> We have to work on this THOUGHT process a little bit. I think you have to
}> quit thinking that your umpires are the best, impartial, and dismiss it
}> off as "all the luck seems to have gone England's way" when they make bad
}> decisions. If you are going to give the umpires the benefit of the doubt
}> then you should extend that to all umpires, not from your country alone.

}Thanks a lot ! I think this is abit harsh. If i implied that I think English
}umpires are better than anyone elses then sorry , I didnt mean it.
}All I was trying to do was think of reasons why lots of respectable
}people do think as a whole they are fairer. Another reason I omitted is that

I think it is the other way around. England umpires may be more competent
than others, but they are certainly no more impartial than an Aussie
or an Indian umpire.

}English umpires stand in the toughest cricket league in the world 
}(no flames please), IMHO, where every nations best players come to play.
}Thus, they meet and judge the cricket of every countries top players. 
}Surely this improves their umpiring as compared to umpires who never meet
}English players before an incoming tour.

I have to give you this one. However, bear in mind that experience does
not make you any more impartial, just more competent.

}> I hope you will remember to say this when England tours India. It gets
}> very hot in India, you know.

}Yes, but despite whatever arguments arise, so many runs will be scored and 
}there will be so many meaningless draws that hopefully it wont
}matter over disputed run outs.

Let's wait and see.

}By the way I couldnt believe my eyes when some Indian posters keep
}on discussing how many runs England will make this winter.
}I realise its better to be realistic but this pessimism is very disturbing.
}Its like everyone realises India are crap at the moment (SRT excepted)
}and dont want to lift their hopes too high in case they are diappointed.
}Come on guys -- be abit more optimistic, please. England dont have the greatest
}team in the world, but at least we think (misguidedly maybe) we can win
}any game!

England is a better side than India. No question about that.

}This is getting sillyagain. Its always back to the Gatting incident isnt it !!
}How many other incidents of English dissent can you name ? I dontwamnt to
}pick on Pakistan in particular, but even the most unbiased people of all nations
}(except Pakistan) would admit they re the most fervent team in the world (which
}is fine as long as they dont act like they have been on this tour).

Gatting incident stands out only for the apparent encouragement it
got from TCCB. That sent a very bad message to the rest of the
world. Rana was attacked for being biased, not incompetent. And
Gatting was rewarded, not reprimanded.

}There is no excuse for any player of whatever nationality to EVER even 
}talk to the umpire about a decision.
}Neutral umpires would be better but the problem lies in the cricketers
}attitude towards winning games at all costs. 

}> rajeev

I agree.

}Hope all this ranting was taken in the spirit in which it was intended,
}Rajeev. No offence , of course.

Yes, certainly. Didn't mean to get carried away by this discussion.

}Tony "rooting for the Minor Counties at marlow and arnt they doing well'' B.

rajeev