HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: elk@cblpo.att.com (elk)
Subject: Re: GURPS Rewrite
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 21:08:39 GMT
	<1992Aug13.065132.17815@news.columbia.edu> <3299@bcstec.ca.boeing.com>


 >         One thing I would like to see is a 'fast-resolution' combat for
 > high-defense-roll characters that merges with the normal system. Currently,
 > the only suggestion that GURPS makes is to resolve hitting as a quick
 > contest between attack skill and defense roll - which pretty much makes
 > defenses obselete, and all-out attacks the 'in' choice.

I don't think I can disagree more.

My gaming group decided that combats were just taking too darned long.
We only meet monthly, and we'd rather spend some time role-playing
instead of all of it resolving a combat.  So, we went to the quick
contest method of resolving combats.

Defense is *NOT* obsolete.  It is absolutely essential with this
method.  What we've discovered (and we stuck with quick contest by the
way) was that if you want to live through combats, you need GOOD
armour (and plenty of it) and you need those defense skills to be way
up there.  

All-out attack is useful if you think your opponent can't hit you, or
if they can't get enough damage through your armour (like someone
using a rapier on a guy in plate mail).  But, if your all-out attack
doesn't just put the other guy on his butt THIS round, then you have
to face an attack on nothing but PD next round.  You will get hit.
Plain and simple.



--
+------------------------+  
|Ed King                 |  Evolution hasn't had enough time to 
|elk@cblpo.cb.att.com    |  determine if having too many neurons is 
|                        |  a survival trait.
+------------------------+
From: wt0b+@andrew.cmu.edu (William Henry Timmins)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Improvisation!
Date: 16 Aug 92 21:21:53 GMT
	<1992Aug16.030758.58183@cc.usu.edu>
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

I think I'll add my voice to the thread.

	I generally improvise the flow of the game, and prepare the background
in fairly good detail. (Which often goes unused, but hey) The way I look
at it, I create the world for the characters to live in. They have their
own motivations and desires. It's up to us to create characters with
motivations that are FUN to play!

	Generally, I prepare maps, diagrams (ship specs), and other such stuff,
but it's usually fairly simple (and computer generated). 

>Yes, but the difference is that you're just making it up here and there,
>while in a prepared scenario, the characters are discovering things set
>there for them to discover. Example -- the players are searching a room.
>In an improv game, there might be something there, maybe not. It depends 

	Well, you generate what makes sense. "SHOULD there be a gem there?" I
think, based on how built the place, lived in it, etc. Same as I'd do
with prepared games.

>on if you just make something up to be there. In a prepared scenario, 
>there is a definite reward system. If the players are clever, they might
>decide to look under the floorboards (where there is ALREADY a key, gem
>gun, whatever). If they do, they are rewarded by finding the prize. Now,

	I don't have 'prizes'. I think that's rather simplistic. The goal is
not 'find the treasure, kill the monster!', the goals are ongoing
desires of the party. If a character NEEDS MONEY, finding a gem is a
prize. If a character needs food and is miles from civilization, finding
a gem is an annoyance.

>in improv games, the players are just searching in a room that wasn't 
>there 5 seconds ago, and there may not be anything there unless you come
>up with it. If they do find something, it's not a reward, it's just some
>thing you thought into existance seconds (or even minutes before). See
>the difference?

	No. What does it matter when you thought it up?

	Now, in response to the rudeness of the 'pro-preparation' people, let
me state an opinion- people prepare when they can't be clever or
creative enough, and need lots of time to think things up. When they get
more intelligent and talented, they improvise more, because
improvisation is more flexible, challenging, and inherently better in
every way than preparing. Props can be made on the fly, or can be made
after things come up (ie- scroll they find is shown to them the next
session)

About 30% of what the previous paragraph said is intentionally
exaggerated. Guess which 30%.


BEH!

-Me
[Pooh Bear incarnate.]
<B1 c+ f+ w g+ k+ s+ r- e+ p>
From: ajross@husc9.harvard.edu (Andrew Ross)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Dangerous Journeys Questions
Date: 15 Aug 92 20:29:32 GMT
Distribution: na

jnoyes@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (James E Noyes) writes:

>I have been wondering about a couple things in this game.  One of the
>mechanical aspects I was wondering about is this.  This is just an
>example and if you can answer my questions, you will know how to apply
>it generally...

>If I was an alchemist, would the Heka that my other Heka-generating
>KS Areas produce only be good on my Alchemy castings or do I also
>get the castings for Divination, Dweomer and Magick and the other
>Heka Areas as well...If this is the case, then alot of the castings
>will be available to anyone who has the Heka skills.

Yes, you would absolutely get the additional castings. Vocation does not
do anything except grant a K/S bundle and determine the possibility of
full practice. If a magic K/S areas says it grants castings, it grants
them to anyone who possesses it. Incidentally, in the Magick
book (without which DJ/M is incomplete as a set of rules) there is a limit on
how many spells the caster can "keep in his head", thus making the 300+
spells available to the bona-fide mage a little more manageable.


>Also, can ANYONE get Heka skills and cast spells.  I have a character
>that is a thief and he chose Necromancy, does this mean that he can
>cast Necromantic cstings and anything else that he chooses with
>KS areas?  If you can help answer these questions I would really appreciate
>it.  Please give page references when applicable.  I am trying to figure this 
>system out.
	Yes, nearly everyone gets Heka, and anyone with Heka can cast
spells if the proper K/S areas are known. NOT everyone can be a full
practitioner (read more under priestcraeft and dweomercraeft if you are
uncertain of the meanings of full and partial practice). Unless an HP is
particularly unlucky, they get their vocational trait as Heka, and may get
other traits as well.

>Also, can anyone give an accurate date for the release of THE EPIC OF AERTH 
>book.  there isnt a hobby store locally tht can give me any information.  They
>all say the same thing "No idea"

I have "no idea" :) Actually, I think it was supposed to come out this
fall...? I don't remember.

E. P. Ross
ajross@husc.harvard.edu
From: menery@de3a1066a.osd.mil (Ristonofer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Music & Roleplaying
Keywords: Roleplaying, music
Date: 17 Aug 92 13:32:48 GMT

I have always liked to use music as a mood-setter in my AD&D game.  

For the "normal" campaign feel, I use either Irish Folk Music (or Clannad/Enya)
or quiet classical music ("Rites of Spring", Piano concertos, etc.)  

When action is going to het heavy, something more aggressive is called for, such
as Wagnerian Overtures, "The Planets" or most Symphony by Mozart.

Soundtracks from horror movies come in handy for setting a darker mood.

I have a 5-disk CD player that I usually set up before the game to fit with 
what I have planned.  It's usually worked well, although once or twice I've made
a bad choice (2nd CD of Yessongs in an adventure that turned out a bit more
:wq

--
Ristonofer
menery@galt.osd.mil
Lucid observation.  Snappy retort.  World-embracing cliche.
Witty non-sequitir.
From: batemanc@p4.cs.man.ac.uk (Mad Chris)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Improvisation!
Date: 13 Aug 92 16:26:33 GMT

ericg@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Eric Chris Garrison) writes:

>I was reading the GMing goals thread, and someone mentioned
>improvisation vs. preparation, and it lead me to ask this
>question of GMs in this group:  How much improvisation do
>you do?  Do you improvise 10% of the time, when characters
>"go off the map"?  Do you improvise 50% of the time, writing
>up a skeleton for "run time" fleshing out?  Do you improvise
>even 90% of the time, having a basic premise and just "wing" it?

Depends entirely on the system.

Cyberpunk: 10% prep, 90% imp
Stormbringer: 50% prep, 50% imp
Outlands: 80% prep - but prepared seperately from week to week
Star Wars: 100% prep AND 100% imp. Special case.

It varies from case to case, but that's pretty representative.
'Star Wars' IS prepped into chapters, but the contents of chapters is
pure improvisation. And I ALWAYS do scripts for between chapters. 
Darth Vader often appears as commenting on rebel actions ( but the
players never meet him ) and when it's time to do the scripts, we take
turns in passing the milk bottle to do out Vader impressions!

Mad Chris.
From: jacobus@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Appleseed for GURPS...
Date: 19 Aug 92 18:03:12 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center



I'd go for an Appleseed worldbook for GURPS.

I have one or two friends who would, too.
From: robert@isgtec.com (Robert Osborne)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Improvisation!
Date: 14 Aug 92 04:19:00 GMT

Where do you guys get your % of improv?

If it's prep time vs. play time then I'm about 50-50.
If it's read from sheets vs. improve time then I'm about 95-10.

I like to have more than basic ideas before GMing.  My players
are sticklers for realism and detail (What colour is the bed?
Does that coat of arms match anything we've seen before?)
and on the fly improve just doesn't cut it.

Rob.
--
Robert A. Osborne   ...!uunet.ca!isgtec!robert or robert@isgtec.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: impster@ais.org (Charles Budensiek)
Subject: Re: Music & Roleplaying
Organization: UMCC
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 17:04:28 GMT

The all time best piece of music for atmosphere would have to be the sound
track to 'Lord of the Rings'. I'm not talking about the cheesy Hobbit music,
but the movie that used 'real-animation' if ya know what I mean.

If you want to set a downright foreboding atmosphere, the theme for Moria is
PERFECT. Just imagine several bass voices singing 'Moooorrrrdooooorrr' to
some all to dreary classical music.

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: praxis@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Laura L Perkinson)
Subject: Re: The Benedictine Problem (amber question at bottom)
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 02:13:46 GMT

	The heck with this bow scenario. At the time Benedict was
planning on dismembering Corwin, HE WAS MISSING AN ARM. Darn tough to
fire a bow that way.
	Secondly, Benedict couldn't just pull a longbow + arrows from
out of some shadow. That's an ability of members of the Courts of
Chaos. An Amberite would have to ride into said shadow, pick up the bow,
then ride back to the shadow he came from. This is no instantaneous
process. Corwin would have had time and a half to give Benedict the slip.
		Praxis
	"I trusted him like a brother. Which is to say, not at all."
From: ratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri/Stainless Steelratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri/Stainless Steelratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri/Stainless Steelratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pier)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Diceless or Senseless?
Date: 11 Aug 92 22:08:55 GMT
	<RATINOX.92Aug7110628@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu>
	<1992Aug10.180820.26090@sco.COM>
Reply-To: ratinox@meceng.coe.northeastern.edu
Organization: 3WA, Boston Office. Or Nu Meta Chi. Take your pick.
Old-Message-ID: <RATINOX.92Aug11180855@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu>
In-reply-to: paul@sco.COM's message of 10 Aug 92 18:08:20 GMT
X-Get-A-Clue: Have two, they're small.
X-Signature-Virus-Protection: Version 1.51
X-Posting-Software: GNUS 3.14.1 [ NNTP-based News Reader for GNU Emacs ]

>>>>> "PJ" == Paul Jackson <paul@sco.COM> writes:

I said:
>...[Dice not relevant] and we (the players) can usually predict the outcome
>beforehand.

PJ> The key word in the above sentence is "usually".

The "unusually" is when someone rolls a "critical hit" and blows the whole
scenario apart at the seams. This is, IMO anticlimactic and not fun.

I'm not responding to the rest of this, because I've already made my
opinions known.

--Rat

||||| | | | |  |  |  |   |   |    |    |    |   |   |  |  |  |  | | | | | |||||
                                                   __        ___ 
Richard Pieri, Northeastern's Stainless Steel Rat/   | /| / /   | The Worlds
Internet: ratinox@meceng.coe.northeastern.edu   /__  |/ |/ / /| | Welfare Works
    UUCP: ...!northeastern.edu!meceng!ratinox  /   | /| / / / | | Association:
  BITNET: UA_RLP@NUHUB{.BITNET}               /__  |/ |/ / /  | | I will solve
  USNail: 14 Westdale RD  Holbrook, MA 02343 /   | /| / / /___| | any problem
 ICBMnet: 42 deg 1 min N, 71 deg 0 min W    /    |/ |/ /_//_____| for you.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: jtd@world.std.com (Jonathan T Drummey)
Subject: Re: SRun: Mag 3 Cyber Eyes in Combat
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 20:14:39 GMT

In article <Bt3rtt.Jtx@news.cso.uiuc.edu> dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly) writes:
>juola@bruno.cs.colorado.edu (Patrick Juola) writes:
>>In article <BszxGt.9pI@news.cso.uiuc.edu> dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly) writes:
>>>If you can see the target better, like as if it were in front of you, it's
>>>easier to hit. I'd say a full sized image of the person vice the reduced 
>>>size you see at a large distance just might be helpful.
>
>>How?  It's not going to be any easier to figure out if your gun
>>is pointed in the right direction.
>
>Hmm. That smartgun link that superimposes a blinking crosshair where your
>gun is aimed isn't any indication of where you are aimed...
>

Actually, have you ever tried to spot something relatively small (like a
bird in the middle of a lake) with a pair of binoculars?  It takes
several seconds (i.e. >4) to zoom in.  Another example of great
magnification - try using a microscope at 100x magnification while
using your hands to move the slide.  A millimeter of movement translates
into quite a bit of perceived distance on the slide, just as it would
real-world using a smartgun link and some sort of optical magnification.

At the high end of optical magnification and using a smartgun link (I don't
allow it in my campaign w/out special cyberware costing a few more
thousand nuyen, but that's a tangent) ), moving one's weapon a millimeter
or two would make the crosshair skitter across your field of vision when
you're looking at a target 400 meters out.  It would take some time
to zoom in *and* coordinate your smartgun link.  I think one action
per range category of reduction is not that unreasonable, especially
when your average samurai will already be getting 2 or more actions...

jonathan
jtd@world.std.com



Xref: sparky rec.games.frp.misc:4140 rec.games.frp.advocacy:1861
From: a_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Gurps Supers is still broken : was Re: Best Super system
Date: 18 Aug 92 13:57:01 CST
Distribution: na
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

In article <1992Aug15.174830.1760@news.columbia.edu>, jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim) writes:
> laird@think.com (Laird Popkin) writes:
>>dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly) writes:
>>I guess we disagree.  I would rather that the players "got with the genre"
>>and did things which are appropriate to the genre than the system warp its
>>rules in an attempt to force the players to do the right thing.  In my
>>experience, players who are straight out told that, for example, they're
>>playing comic book good-guys who don't shoot to kill, play along, whereas
>>players who are forced by unrealistic rules (e.g. ambushes do double
>>damage) end up sitting around making fun of the rules.  Your mileage
>>obviously differs...
> 
> 	The trouble is, players generally will not do this consistently, 
> especially when it is to their disadvantage. People can either ridicule 
> their behavior or ridicule the rules - either one is 'unrealistic' because 
> the action and genre is 'unrealistic'. 

	In most 4-color comics, the supers don't run around shooting guns at
each other. About the only time you find people using guns in them are
non-supers (police, thugs), and even then the weapons are weak enough that a DR
of 10-15 will be sufficient (easily affordable for a 500 point character).
Supers simply do not use killing attacks on other supers in most 4-color
comics.  The trend in recent years is very much away from that (Punisher?).
The damage reduction rules on p.85, set at 1/2, would seem to work very well
for 4-color comics.

Brandon Cope
From: dunning@chainsaw.ecn.purdue.edu (GALACTIC COMMANDER)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: HERO's cheesy $ flow cost...
Date: 20 Aug 92 20:44:00 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <Bt90sn.Krw@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> joshua salter <jsalter@silver.ucs.indiana.edu> writes:
>	HERO is riddled with problems, but is the best I have seen so far...
>
>								-jsalter

If that is the best one you can find then you must not be looking hard
enough.  :)

Seriously though the money is from the background of superheroics and
comics in general (Champs base).  Why doesn't Tony Stark just buy himself
a TacNuke and drop in on AIM islands - he has the money or facilities to
build one himself.  Why don't all of these constume criminals just purchase
guns and lay waste to the non-protected supers?  It all boils down to the
style of genre you are playing in.

Money has its uses in any game - it is a fact of life, but don't let it
overpower the style if it is not supposed too.  Everything has its price.

Chip

-----------------------------\_/-----------------------------
 Elwood H Dunning III         |     I am a pirate, I don't
  GALACTIC COMMANDER          |           DO decency!!
--

-----------------------------\_/-----------------------------
 Elwood H Dunning III         |     I am a pirate, I don't
  GALACTIC COMMANDER          |           DO decency!!
From: kcrook@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Prince Of Amber)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Diceless or Senseless?
Date: 13 Aug 92 17:24:53 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

Benedict, being master of all weapons could have taken Corwin out from a
distance.  Also, fuming mad does not reflect the edicts of Musashi,
whom Benedict is styled after...  This is Zelazny's screwup, not the
game's, but the example is rather weak and wouldn't be likely to occur
in a well-run, well-role-played Amber game.  Higher warfare and cool
heads would have killed Corwin (or any other of lower warfare) without a
problem.  That's one of the problems with the game.  
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: adelekta@kentvm.kent.edu
Subject: Re: Vampire
Organization: Kent State Univ.
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 17:15:41 GMT

 
 IMHO, Vampire is one of the best rpg's I've played.
The playing system makes sense and is rather simple (having recently rolled up
a character in the Rolemaster system, it's something I appreciate :)
 
 The combat system is a bit complex at first, but as long as the GM is familiar
with it before running a game (it took my GM quite a few sessions before he got
it straight, which was annoying) it's okay. Just make sure you have lots of
10-sided dice around.
 
 Role-playing wise, I *really* like Vampire. It has lots of potential for
characterization, and the rules encourage you to develop and play your
character in accordance with his/her Nature and Demeanor (the books give lots
of good options for Nature and Demeanor - my favorite character is a visionary
at heart (Nature) but acts like a pedagogue (Demeanor).
 
 One thing I'll say about the game - it requires a good GM! As in, one that has
a good use of description and who can build the atmosphere appropriate to the
scenario of vampires in the 20th century.
 
 I hope this has made some sense - It's hard to describe the game in general
terms, and I wanted to say more than just ramble on about how much I like it.
 
 anne
 
 "The way to a man's heart is through his stomach and up"
From: doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Speaking of ambushes II
Date: 18 Aug 92 19:57:15 GMT
Reply-To: doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu
Organization: Department of Chemistry, UCLA

In article <1992Aug15.010751.58173@cc.usu.edu>, sl9b4@cc.usu.edu (Deep Six) writes:

[stuff deleted]

>I've suggested a mix, where the PCs use both close range and distant 
>range weapons to ambush, but they can't agree on which is more important.
>I'm not necassarily looking for a discussion on the merits of close
>range or long range combat, I'm more looking for examples from other 
>campaigns of ambushes that worked well, backfired, etc., from both players
>and GMs.

I don't have any specific examples, but a good way to mix the two philosophies
is to set up the short-range folks so that the enemy walks into them after the
long-range dudes start firing.  While more difficult to arrange than a simple
ambush, chances are that the foes will be even less prepared for the second,
short-range hit than they were for the long-range ambush.


-Doug Gibson
 doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu

Neither UCLA nor the National Science Foundation has a clue what I am doing.
They just pay me to do it.

"We have to tear you to shreds because we care." - EAC
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: braca2@cspyr1.cs.adfa.oz.au (BRAY CHRISTOPHER)
Subject: Re: Improvisation!
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy, Canberra, Australia
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 07:54:55 GMT

canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson) writes:

>	Well, I like to prepare as much as possible, but any GM knows that
>that ain't much!  I concentrate on having a very solid background in the
>campaign.  Before starting up a segment of the campaign I know the major
>NPCs of course, the basic geography and especially the cultures I'm moving
>the PCs in.

I am starting up a large fantasy world at present for my own system.  To
generate my NPC's I use a method of Tarot Divination.  This means that
when the players meet an NPC I know more about his character, than about his
little quirks, it gives me some freedom in how I portray them, and allows
me to have them progress as well.

	On the note of preparation I have all my major NPC's (including ones
never met but I feel will be useful) in a large WEB diagram.  Each of the
npc's connections (emotional,financial, political, etc ) is drawn in.

	Now if the players do something to NPC a in one session I then 
look at mr WEB when the game is over and say 'OK, npc A has just lost a
division of his troops, and a trading wagon.  He is going to be annoyed.
He cant pay his debt's to npc B, and so will hassle npc C to pay up.  Ahh
npc C is married to npc D's daughter, who the players were annoying in the
session as well.  This may prove interesting.'

	I find that it allows my improvisation to be alot more realistic
	in terms of the universe the characters are in.
                              -=[   hook   ]=-
-----------------------------                  ----------------------------
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      \        /                      |    Another dream unfulfilled"
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