HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: MUSCLE by Samuel Fussell
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 22:24:53 GMT

In article <1992Sep9.184408.14898@skylinx.sa.com> sunny@skylinx.sa.com (Sunny Heck) writes:
>I just finished reading this book, and I felt that some of the
>comments that Fussel got from the gay guys, about him being gay
>but just not knowing it yet may be more to the point than he
>cares to admit.  after all there were very few women in his life
>during the four years that he described in the book, and, probably,
>even fewer before that.  of the women described, one cheated on her
>fiance with him, G-spot had unsightly hair growth, but at least she
>used to be cute before she started lifting, oh, almost forgot about
>her breasts being firmer than his...all gym bunnies are airheads, and
>to top it all of the hearsay evidence of an appendage growing on 
>one of the bodybuilder girls.  will that work for men also?:)
>overall, the book had exercise descriptions that you can find in any
>M&F magazine, coupled with a mesogynistic attitude.  this guy hates
>women and reeks of it.  any comments?

Yes.  You make many assumptions and accusations and don't capitalize
enough.

GM("Literary Critic of the Future")S

Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: g5000005@nickel.laurentian.ca
Subject: Re: Wanted: NordicTrak Ski Simulator
Organization: Laurentian University
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 14:34:58 GMT

In article <1992Sep15.070546.2337@stortek.com>,
 pae@blackcat.stortek.com (Phil Earnhardt) writes:

>Maybe the problem arises from limitations in how you perceive a NT should
>be used. You can raise the elevation of the front of the machine. Faster
>running-style strides will raise your effort. Ditching the pole straps and
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>using small hand weights give you entirely new options for using the machine.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
	?? The above illustrates my point! Why not just buy small hand weights
and walk stairs, or walk/jog around the park or neighborhood? This goes back 
to my original comment: the NT isn't really worth the money! If you have modify
a piece of equipment that radically, then what are you paying for?

	Remember, I said that any exercise is better than no exercise. I have 
never said that you couldn't get any exercise benefit from the NT. My point is 
that for the money, there are cheaper (and more efficient) alternatives.

>Doing skating-style asymmetrical pole plants with hand weights and a
>skating-like leg stride raises *my* pulse rate quickly.

	Can you do skating-like leg stride raises on an NT now? I am not 
familiar with this model. The models I have seen only allow you to shuffle your
feet forwards and backwards. Where does the resistance against raising your
legs come from?

>This points to a phenomena of the misc.fitness group: the different
>communities that participate here. One major bifurcation is between
>primarily-anerobic and primarily-aerobic fitness types. Within the aerobic
>types, there's a further sub-division: folks interested in a baseline level of
>fitness and athletes interested in maximal performance and training aids.
>Most of our misunderstandings and conflicts come from interactions between
>these various sub-groups. Fortunately, it's also the source of our great
>diversity of opinions.

	I apologize if I seemed rude, Phil. Yes, I agree that are divergent
groups here. I am a new reader to misc.fitness and have missed out on the
general flow of discussions. I tend to react quickly to what I percieve as
misinformation in terms of fitness: there are a LOT of so-called experts
floating around who have no scientific basis (or only pseudo-science) to their
fitness theories. 

>--phil

Nordic Norm
From: mazur@inmet.camb.inmet.com (Beth Mazur)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Subject: Re: name of this exercise..
Date: 7 Sep 92 16:45:32 GMT
Distribution: misc.fitness
Organization: Intermetrics Inc, Cambridge MA

In article <TMR.92Sep7160547@fat-controller.bham.ac.uk> tmr@cs.bham.ac.uk (Tim M. Read) writes:
>I was wondering if anyone could put a name to a form of exercise I heard
>about a while ago, so that I know where to look to get more information.
>
>It consists (so I understand) of tensing muscles, (eg) as if you are pushing
>against an imaginary object. Apparently the exercise is obtained by
>different groups of muscles working against each other. The good thing about
>this is that it can be done anywhere (eg on an aeroplane, or train journey),
>without any equipment or space.

Sounds like isometric exercise.  I would guess that most of these
exercises fall in the "toning" category--they are neither aerobic, nor
will they help to build muscle mass.

Beth Mazur                   "...life is more than a vision.  The sweetest
mazur@inmet.inmet.com         part is acting after making a decision."
...!uunet!inmet!mazur                                  -- The Indigo Girls
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: sunny@skylinx.sa.com (Sunny Heck)
Subject: Re: MUSCLE by Samuel Fussell
Organization: Scientific Atlanta, Inc.
Distribution: us
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 92 18:44:08 GMT

I just finished reading this book, and I felt that some of the
comments that Fussel got from the gay guys, about him being gay
but just not knowing it yet may be more to the point than he
cares to admit.  after all there were very few women in his life
during the four years that he described in the book, and, probably,
even fewer before that.  of the women described, one cheated on her
fiance with him, G-spot had unsightly hair growth, but at least she
used to be cute before she started lifting, oh, almost forgot about
her breasts being firmer than his...all gym bunnies are airheads, and
to top it all of the hearsay evidence of an appendage growing on 
one of the bodybuilder girls.  will that work for men also?:)
overall, the book had exercise descriptions that you can find in any
M&F magazine, coupled with a mesogynistic attitude.  this guy hates
women and reeks of it.  any comments?

sunny
From: robin@fisher.bio.uci.edu (Robin Bush)
Subject: My crooked legs
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Reply-To: robin@fisher.bio.uci.edu
Date: 6 Sep 92 16:31:45 GMT


Can anyone relate to this problem? Probably not, but here goes....

My legs look like someone cut them off just below the knee, rotated the  
lower halves outward about 10 degrees, then welded them back on. So not  
only do my toes point out, the entire bottom halves of my legs do too.  

This hasn't been a problem (nobody notices this unless I point it out),  
and maybe it still isn't.  I never exercised a day in my life until about  
2 years ago (I'm 36), but have gotten in pretty good shape by doing   
aerobics, swimming, lifting weights, etc.  I started running a little last  
year, and tried running sprints earlier this summer, but I got shin  
splints, and now I can't seem to shake them.  I'd do things like quit  
running, or only swim for a couple of weeks. Then I'll go back to aerobics  
or try running just a little.  Things would be fine for a while, then the  
shin splints would come back.

I am willing to give up my dream of running the hurdles like Edwin Moses -  
all I want to do now is to  shake these splints. So now I am doing daily  
shin stretches and exercises, as recommend by both the stretching guru,  
Bob Anderson, and by you all, the net doctors.  I am hoping this will  
work.  But when I am doing these exercises on my warped legs, I can't help  
but wonder if I am fighting a losing battle.  All this talk of pronation,  
supination, orthotics, etc., is by people whose legs are basically correct  
to begin with.  If I straighten my feet out, my kneecaps are almost  
face-to-face!  

Does anybody else out there have a problem like this? Any hope?  I hate  
limiting my activities unless I absolutely have to.

----------------------------------------------------------
Robin
From: mahoney@cs.utexas.edu (J. Jeff Mahoney)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Subject: Using weights with STEP Reebok (was How to work all muscles)
Date: 11 Sep 1992 09:31:37 -0500
Organization: Just Do It Society
NNTP-Posting-Host: deimos.cs.utexas.edu

In article <1992Sep10.222005.7502@stortek.com> pae@blackcat.stortek.com (Phil Earnhardt) writes:

>You can even use hand weights while doing step aerobics, but be careful!
>There appears to be a linkage to using hand weights on steps and and
>lower-body injury.
>

     This is something that I would like to get more information on.  I've been
teaching STEP Reebok for over a couple of years, and usually include at least a
portion using weights while maintaining a very simple step pattern.  I find this
to be tremendous upper body work, but I noticed in one of Reebok's recent flyers
that they have not YET approved the usage of hand weights with the STEP.
     Does anybody have any more info on this?  Is there a (documented) linkage
between hand weights on steps and injury (as per above)?
     I would most like to hear from other instructors, especially authoritative
info (either from a recent workshop or journal article).  Are most (any) of you
using hand-weights while stepping up and down?  Those of you that take STEP classes,
what does your instructor tell you about this?

thanx for any info that I can pass along to my classes...

-- 
*** jeff mahoney   e-mail: mahoney@cs.utexas.edu   compuserve: 70243,3525  ***
** Artificial Intelligence Laboratory, Taylor Hall 2.124,  UT Austin 78712  **
**       Voice: (512)471-9589        Answering Machine: (512)389-1349       **
*** - I'd rather be doing aerobics, playing golf, country-western dancing  ***
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: jreece@sousa.intel.com (John Reece)
Subject: Re: Refrigerating Potatoes
Reply-To: jreece@sousa.intel.com
Organization: Intel - Information Technologies
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 15:51:41 GMT

In article <79547@ut-emx.uucp> shoroff@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Bart Simpson) writes:
>In a cookbook I read recently it was mentioned that refrigerating potatoes
>converts the starch in them to sugar. (complex carbohydrates to simple ?)
>How true is this? I've certainly noticed a definite difference in the 
>texture of them, but is this what happens? Should be a matter of concern 
>if that actually happens, right?

McDonald's original french fry recipe called for aging potatoes in cold,
but not frozen, storage.  The aforementioned chemical changes apparently made 
the resulting product a lot more tender.  They switched to using
standard, pre-cut, frozen fries decades ago.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Reece			"Oop. Ack. Pfffthpt"	
Not an Intel spokesman 			- Bill the Cat
From: mickw@autodesk.com (Mick Washbrook)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Subject: Re: '92 Mr. Olympia & Steroids, a criticism.
Date: 14 Sep 92 21:03:34 GMT

In article <1992Sep12.120234.1@vax1.tcd.ie>, kellyfj@vax1.tcd.ie writes:
> 
> and I'm sure there are lots of 'clean' people around, but those guys in the
> upper echelons of 'the industry' are not clean. I can't wait to see how long
> guys like Haney live with all the drugs in their system. 

You can get a good idea about what bodybuilders who are off drugs look like
if you see the pictures from the last WBF show. Mike Christian looked as
thin as a rake, Mike Quinn looked like the Michelin Man, and Danny Padilla
was off as well. However, Gary Strdom looked as good as ever, though I'm
a little sceptical about the claim that all the bodybuilders were clean.
Professional bodybuilding wouldn't exist without steroids--period.


--
mickw@autodesk.com

Ewige Blumenkraft!

Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: wittmann@engr.wisc.edu (art wittmann)
Subject: Re: 3-day workout
Organization: College of Engineering, Univ. of Wisconsin-Madison
Date: 8 Sep 92 13:01:08 CDT
Originator: wittmann@muskie.engr.wisc.edu


In article <9209081718.AA16970@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>, SSDC2@BROWNVM.BROWN.EDU (J Green) writes:
|> >From: bc@campbell.Gwinnett.COM (Bob Campbell)
|> >  The other day I did heavy triceps only to find out that it made
|> >  it tough to do bench presses.
|> 
|> until this statement i was reading your original post thinking "nah,
|> i won't answer that, it's up to you, a matter of preference".
|> 
|> but ALWAYS train triceps AFTER chest or shoulders.
|> and ALWAYS train biceps AFTER back. the rest is up to you.

Just to add a bit in agreement...

My general rule of thumb (and think others would claim it as well...) is
to do large muscle groups / compound movements first and then work towards
smaller muscle groups.

So for legs it might be squats, then leg press, then stiff leg deadlifts,
then calf work.  The idea is to tire out the big groups then work smaller
groups that are less dependant on the biggies.

Art
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: jefft@athena.mit.edu (Jeff Tang)
Subject: following weight workout with aerobic workout?
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: misc
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 04:47:13 GMT


Is this a reasonable regimine?  Three times a week an hour of upper body
weight work, followed by some lower body aerobic workout (lifecycle,
stairmaster, or walking/running).

Thanks,
--
Jeff Tang
jefft@athena.mit.edu
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: tordm@vana (Tord G.M. Malmgren)
Subject: Re: Max Heart Rate Formulas for Men vs Women
Reply-To: TordM@VanA.PhySto.SE
Organization: Department of Physics, University of Stockholm -- Sweden
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 16:11:59 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.031856.5733@news.Hawaii.Edu>, lisap@olomana.soest.hawaii.edu (Lisa Petersen) writes:

>I've seen in a couple places that maximum heart rate can be
>approximated by 226 minus age for women, and 220 minus age for men.

 actually, this 220-age is a rough approximation, a more accurate one is
209-0.6xAge for running, and 205-0.7xAge for bicycling.. (source of this
is "Runner's World") why the difference I do not know, perhaps smaller hearts?




---------------+--------------------------------
 Tord Malmgren | InterNet: TordM@VanD.PhySto.SE | These opinions are my own,
               | BITNet  : TordM@SESUF51        | and NOT of this department!
---------------+--------------------------------
 Department of Physics, University of Stockholm 
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: Wanted: NordicTrak Ski Simulator
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 22:22:00 GMT

In article <1992Sep15.163702.7160@stortek.com> pae@blackcat.stortek.com (Phil Earnhardt) writes:
>In article <1992Sep15.093458.1@nickel.laurentian.ca> g5000005@nickel.laurentian.ca writes:
>>In article <1992Sep15.070546.2337@stortek.com>,
>> pae@blackcat.stortek.com (Phil Earnhardt) writes:
>>
>>>Maybe the problem arises from limitations in how you perceive a NT should
>>>be used. [...]
>>	?? The above illustrates my point! Why not just buy small hand weights
>>and walk stairs, or walk/jog around the park or neighborhood? This goes back 
>>to my original comment: the NT isn't really worth the money! If you have modify
>>a piece of equipment that radically, then what are you paying for?
>
>Because people *like* the Nordic Track! Maybe they like it more than those

I'm going to be marketing a new, revolutionary fitness machine/system
called the Nordic Box.  You use it by putting rocks in it and picking it
up over and over.  The flexibility is amazing, as it's a modular system.
You can do step exercises, then, adding wheels, you can use it as a
skateboard.  Putting large metal discs inside and adding a bar, you
can reconfigure the Nordic Box System to do benchpresses.  Then, by
driving the Nordic Box System to Switzerland, you can do mountain-
climbing!  Digging a hole under Nordic Box, you have another place to
dump your money with no discernible benefit!  Try The Nordic Box Fitness
system!  With Nordic Box, the future is later than today!  (Not available
in stores, because then salepersons are in closer proximity to customers,
and the latter may be prone to throttling the former.)

Watch for Nordic Bag, Nordic Closet, Nordic Basement and Nordic Friend's
Garage systems, available soon.

GM("Stores in an Airline Baggage Compartment")S
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: sunny@skylinx.sa.com (Sunny Heck)
Subject: Re: MUSCLE by Samuel Fussell
Organization: Scientific Atlanta, Inc.
Distribution: us
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 13:15:34 GMT


>>overall, the book had exercise descriptions that you can find in any
>>M&F magazine, coupled with a misogynistic attitude.  this guy hates
>>women and reeks of it.  any comments?

>Yes.  You make many assumptions and accusations and don't capitalize
>enough.
>GM("Literary Critic of the Future")S

Guilty, as charged :)

Gordon brought up a good point: just because the guy hates women ( and
the rest of humanity) certainly doesn't mean that he is homosexual, I
apologize to anyone offended by this unintended "accusation".  

>Excuse me for my rudeness, but who the hell gives a shit?  Who cares if he has
>sex with men, women, or baboons.  If this is all that you got out of the book,
>then I think you should go back to 4th grade and study reading comprehension
>again.
>
>-Rob

His having sex with baboons would have sold a lot more book copies.  Is it
the steroid combinations, administration, and packing that I missed? Duh :)
You are excused.

-sunny
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
From: horwath@rtsg.mot.com (George Horwath)
Subject: Re: Muscle by S. Fussell
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 19:27:32 GMT

n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:

>After giving up lifting and the drugs, he dropped down to 200 lbs over
>4 months and stayed there.  When I read that I was thinking that if
>hypertrophied muscles will go away so quickly, what's the point of 
>spending all the time and effort to maintain them?

That's one of the biggest problems I had with the book - Fussell stresses
that exact point at the end. Yet, most things in life worth working for
are not permanent. What is the value of time spent by an individual?
Fussell might say the business owner working 16 hours a day is a 
genius; the flautist practising 8 hours a day is an artist; the bodybuilder 
working out 3 hours a day is a dope. In all three cases, hard gained 
accomplishments will quickly disappear once an individual ceases the 
activity. Yet, each considers his time spent important and good. 

Sorry, I wax philosophical here.

-George

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                            |     Motorola
"Then, suddenly, it came to me -            | I speak for myself,
  I was a rabbit in a human world."         |   not my employer
                            -B. Bunny       | horwath@rtsg.mot.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Xref: sparky misc.fitness:7175 ba.food:3152
From: khaw@parcplace.com (Mike Khaw)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness,ba.food
Subject: Re: coffee grnds, aluminum pots unhealthy??
Date: 6 Sep 92 03:21:13 GMT

In <1992Sep5.232158.19745@leland.Stanford.EDU> mfabrega@raynet.com writes:

>Another question: my espresso maker is made of aluminum, which is possibly
>risky, since aluminum has been linked w/ Alzheimer's.  Any data on this?

While research has shown a correlation between Alzheimer's and excess
accumulation of Al in brain tissue, no *causative* relationship has been
established. Correlation does not necessarily imply a cause-effect
relationship.

Seems you would get the most medically valid information from your
doctor rather than from ba.food, however.
--
Michael Khaw	Domain=khaw@parcplace.com, UUCP=...!uunet!parcplace!khaw
ParcPlace Systems, Sunnyvale, CA	PRODUCT INFO: info@parcplace.com
From: sfjr@wam.umd.edu (Steve Russell)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Subject: Re: How to work all muscles
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:36:29 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park

In article <1992Sep10.222005.7502@stortek.com> pae@blackcat.stortek.com (Phil Earnhardt) writes:
>In article <1992Sep8.075521.6549@iscsvax.uni.edu> westendorf@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
>>Does anyone out there know of a list of exercises that will work all muscles.
>>I'm trying to lose weight and wanted to build a little more muscle mass.  I
>>have access to a weight bar and some weights.  Thanks
>
>Muscles where you're in a standing position *and* doing something with your
>arms will get most of the major muscle groups. If you've seen any Nordic Track
>ads, you know that x-c skiing (and Nordic Track machines) do this quite well.
>Lower-tech (and lower-cost) upper-body exercise can also be accomplished by
>using hand weights when walking (outside or on a treadmill), exercising on a
>stationary bike, and using a stair-climbing machine.
>
>You can even use hand weights while doing step aerobics, but be careful!
>There appears to be a linkage to using hand weights on steps and and
>lower-body injury.
>
>One non-weight-bearing exercise that zaps most of the body's muscle groups is
>rowing. The Concept II erg is the superior exercise machine for this. Note:
>the rowing stroke is quite subtle; it's easy to do it incorrectly. If at all
>possible, get an experienced rower to coach you periodically on the erg.
>
>You may want to get a copy of _The New Fit or Fat_ for a whole lot more
>information about this. In particular, to lose fat, you want to be spending
>the majority of your time in aerobic exercise. Weight lifting is a fine
>supplement to aerobic exercise, but it should not be the dominant activity in
>your program.
>
>> Mary
>
>--phil

Mary-

     There is an excellent book by Joyce Vedral, THE FAT BURNING WORKOUT that
uses the concept of supersets but with small dumbells to try to achieve the
muscle working and fat burning aspects of aerobic exercise that circuit
training machines often fail to do.  I've tried it myself and if nothing else
it is a fun change of pace.

Steve R
From: bc@campbell.Gwinnett.COM (Bob Campbell)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Subject: 3-day workout
Date: 7 Sep 92 15:25:37 GMT
Organization: Suncrest, Mulberry & Fairlawns Frisbee Club


  I recently posted asking for suggestions about a 3-day workout.

  However, several mail messages pointed out that the impression
  I gave was that I meant 3 days a week...

  What I meant was that I am now able to go to a workout schedule
  of 3-days-on-1-day-off repeatedly.  Problem is...I don't know
  if that's more effieicnt or not but I'm willing to try it.

  I have been working out on and off for about 4 years with mixed
  results.  What I would really like to do is get stronger all
  around, especially for sports I like to play like softball and
  golf.  (For example, I remember a couple years ago that for
  some reason I was hitting the golf ball MUCH further during a
  time I had been doing extensive abdonimal work.  I guess there
  is some connection there).

  The problem I have (and seem to have always had) is that it's
  not clear to me what exercises should be done on the same day
  as others.  That is, should triceps & biceps be done the same
  day?  Should it be broken down into "pushing" movements one
  day and "pulling" the next?  Should legs all be done the same
  day?  How many exercise should be done for each muscle group?
  Is two enough?  (That's generally what I do now).

  The other day I did heavy triceps only to find out that it made
  it tough to do bench presses.  Working out hard doesn't bother
  me...it's wasting energy that can be better used some other day
  that I am trying to avoid.

  Also, for the first time I am wondering if my age has a little
  to do with this.  I turned 40 this year.  As I said, I didn't
  start doing this until about 4 years ago.  I still have skinny
  arms at 6' 2", 195 lbs.  My upper body is particularly weak
  and always has been.

  Any good workout suggestions?

  Either private mail or public postings are welcome.

  Thanks.

 |________________________|_________________________________________|
 | Bob Campbell           |      "Think not of the hours wasted     |
 | campbell@Gwinnett.COM  |      But of all yet to be tasted."      |
 |________________________|_________________________________________|
Newsgroups: misc.fitness,ba.food