From: reynard@susie.cs.scarolina.edu (John Reynard)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Least Valuable Players (career)
Date: 10 Apr 92 18:57:14 GMT
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science


dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu (David M Tate) writes:

>Everyone loves to argue about MVP's, but I want to introduce a new concept:
>the LVP.  The LVP is the player who costs your team the most just by being
>in the lineup.  In order to avoid confusion (given that the very worst 
>players never make it to the majors at all), we'll make this a cumulative
>stat, so that a true LVP is LVP by virtue of being pathetic for long periods
>of time.  

>There are players who are good offensively and bad defensively, and get 
>played because their offense is thought to outweigh their defense (which it
>usually does).  And there are player who are rotten offensively but great
>defensively, and they are played because it is thought that their defense
>outweighs their lack of offense (which it often doesn't).  But there are 
>also players who are rotten offensively *and* defensively, and yet play full-
>time year after year.  These amazing players can rack up some truly awesome
>negative career value stats.

>In _Total_Baseball_, Thorn and Palmer attempt to measure hitting, fielding,
>and baserunning in terms of runs above/below average for the team.  There is
>some question as to exactly how accurate the defensive numbers are (not very,
>is the consensus), but the offense and baserunning aren't too bad, and they'll
>do as a basis for gross comparison.

>Thus, we get Carney "Tree Stump" Lansford, who has been worth somewhere 
>between 100 and 150 runs offensively in his career, but a whopping -211 
>runs in the field (according to T&P), which is the worst I've yet found.
>Or, Eddie Brinkman, whose 95 runs on defense go partway toward ameliorating
>-287 runs at the plate and on the bases.

>I've scanned about half of the _TB_ ratings, and come up with a few of the
>all-time career LVP candidates.  I'll let you guess who the #1 player on the
>list so far is.  (Numbers through 1990 season.)

>Player			Batting		SB runs		Fielding	Total

>???????????		 -269		  -22		  -32		-323

>Tom Thevenow		 -297		   0		    9		-289

>Granny Hamner		 -145		   0		 -138		-283

>Joe Dugan		 -151		   ?		 -105		-256

>Ivy Olson		 -216		   ?		  -32		-248

>Julian Javier		 -182		   3		  -67		-246

>Tim Foli		 -297		  -9		  70		-238

>Felix Millan		 -103		  -6		 -128		-237

>Rafael Ramirez		 -162		 -11		  -43		-216

>Denny Doyle		 -138		 -13		  -60		-211

>Roger Metzger		 -178		   3		  -35		-210


>Dishonorable mention:  Frank DeMaestri, Chico Fernandez, Tito Fuentes, Chick
>			Galloway, Damaso Garcia, Mario Guerrero, Hal Janvrin,
>			Billy Martin, Eddie Brinkman, Dal Maxvill.


>Any guesses on The Champion?

Shawon Dunston or doesn't he have enough playing time to rack up those #'s

>-- 
>          David M. Tate            |"The man who hath no music in himself
>     dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu       | Nor is not moved by concord of sweet sound
>  A poem should be dumb, / As old  | Is fit for treason, stratagems, and spoils
> medallions to the thumb.-MacLeish | 	Shakespeare, "Merchant of Venice", A.V
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