From: pawel@tethys.ph.albany.edu
Subject: Re: Nazi camps
Reply-To: pawel@tethys.ph.albany.edu
Organization: SUNYA School of Public Health, Albany, NY
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 20:10:20 GMT

In article <dobo.715023929@swalwell>, dobo@cs.UAlberta.CA (W. Dobosiewicz) writes:
>dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:
>>Is it possible that more Jews took jobs like shopowners because
>>they were not allowed, or discouraged, from other types of jobs?
>
>
>Numerous pseudo-historians advance just such a theory. Amazingly, there is
>no truth in it, as far as I know (excluding highest offices, that is).
>Let me elaborate in two parts:
>
>1. Why in trade? Because it was more profitable than other occupations!
>
>- source of income of Polish Jews (1931): 42.2% industry, 36.6% trade,
>	4.5% transportation and communication, 4.0% agriculture,
>	2.3% science+education+culture.
>Note that among the overall population, 60.6% were peasants, who were on
>average far poorer than the rest of the society. Nobody particularly
>longed to be a peasant.
>	(A comment: many Jewish historians claim that Jews were not permitted
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>	to farm in Poland. What a rare bullshit! Of course, they were, but
        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>	they were sane enough to avoid it. Somehow 4% - 125000 - did get into
>	it.)

  I cannot agree with that. It depends what do you mean by Poland.
The statement is true about post-1918 Poland, but not necessarily true
about Polish lands under Russian rule in the XIX century (pale of settlment
and so on).  The source of income cited by you reflects long historical
process, not just the legal situation in free Poland. The history of
limitations imposed on Jews in Europe is well known and documented.

>2. Official discrimination against Jews in certain professions.
>Which professions are we talking about?
>Two of the three highest-ranking police officers were Jews
>(according to the Gestapo, which disposed of them, while forcibly
>retaining the rest of the police force in their service).
>It was difficult for a Jew to become an army general,
>but it was just as difficult for a peasant's son.
>One place where Jews were openly not welcome OFFICALLY was in the
>ministerial cabinet (i.e. highest ranking bureaucrats).
>
>The above is describes OFFICIAL discrimination. Social discrimination (BUY
>CHRISTIAN campaign) or bullying (BENCH GHETTO at universities) were not
>government sponsored, merely tolerated forms of antisemitism. Many Jews
>thought (and the survivors still do) of them as being very hard.
>

  Again, you are right and not right at the same time. For the person
being discriminated against it makes very little difference whether
the discrimination is "official" or just "officialy tolerated".
It is well known that in pre-IIWW Poland existed "Christian" labor
or union organizations explilictly excluding Jews from their ranks
(for example lawyers).  This of course limited the job opportunities
for "non-Cristian" Polish citiziens.  It is interesting to compare
this situation to the legal situation in US even AFTER IIWW.  Jews
were excluded from many universities on similar basis (see A.Dershovitz's
book Chutzpa for elaboration).

>
>
>W. Dobosiewicz

  There is a grain of truth in Danny's theory. Jews found it easier
to advance socially in the areas which were not protected by either
tradition or social exclusion.

                                  P.Penczek