HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: petesk@microsoft.com (Pete Skelly)
Subject: Re: Mondo 2000: R. U. Sirius
Date: 21 Aug 92 08:29:52 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation
Keywords: like, totally, y'know

In article <20AUG199200352143@deimos.ucc.umass.edu> s7356911@deimos.ucc.umass.edu (DYLYN) writes:
>Bill writes:
>>... Our society has been organized in pyramidal power structures for 6000 plus 
>>years-- it's an ingrained tendency, now...
>	Sorry, don't agree, for a number of reasons.  First,  it's true some
>hierarchical societies existed roughly 4-6 K years ago, but they were 
>exceptions.  The great mass of societies were egalitarian ones at that point.
>	I especially disagree with the "ingrained tendency' point.  How does
>6000 years (barely a moment in the evolutionary timetable) of stratified states
>counteract the million or so years of human existence in egalitarian societies?
>I admit hierarchy is a dominant way of organization now, but I believe we
>anarchists at least have instinct and evolution on our side.   One of the 
>things that attracts me to some cpunk writing is that, sometimes, it mirrors
>capitalist society as it is now ( _Count Zero_, "Stone Lives" in the _Mirror-
>shades_ anthology) -- cutthroat, mercenary, without regard for human needs 
>unless there is money in it.

Wait a second.  Could you name some of the egalitarian societies.  
I keep on trying to think of some, but every time I think I get close,
I find hierarchical constructs.
Tribal societies have an obvious hierarchy.
The Family has some similarities to a hierarchy.  (well, in most cases
it is one).

In fact, even true anarchy tends to stratify pretty quickly, with the person
with the most resources of importance (be they guns, money, cars, whatever),
being the person on top.

The only way you can keep truly egalitarian is if you only have one person.

As far as ingrained tendency, well, stratisfied states have existed for
millions of years.  There's a food chain isn't there.  Most social animals
develop a pecking order.  


petesk@microsoft.com
My Opinions...
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: So exactly what is this group about?
From: richard@paragon.folly.welly.gen.nz (Richard Parry)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 17:55:34 GMT
Reply-To: parry_r@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Distribution: world
Organization: Masterful Enterprises UnLimited.


In article <713995222.F00005@csource.oz.au> Adrian.Scott@p2.f158.n633.z3.fidonet.org writes:

 > To: frank@i1.msi.umn.edu (Loren Frank)

 > LF>Hello. As you probably guessed from the title, I am new to this
 > LF>group, and
 > LF>I was curious to know exactly what this group discusses. (I read
 > LF>a number of
 > LF>articles but deriving some consistent theme was beyond me....)

 > Well is supposed to be based on the Role playing game "CyberPunk" I think, or
 > the Deep dark future? I would like this question answered too.. teheh cya

Well, this group is for the discussion of all things Cyberpunk.  More
technical conversations go on in alt.cyberpunk.tech, and creative
stories are in alt..chatsubo, and so on.

Discuss the RPG if you feel like it, or books, or movies, or...

Later!

Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: steiner@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu (jason "Think!" steiner)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Books
Date: 17 Aug 92 21:53:28 GMT

acsbk@UMASSD.EDU writes:
> >From: petesk@microsoft.com (Pete Skelly)
> 
> >How about a few IR LEDs, which are fed with a signal which is the
> >off code for most of the popular TV remotes.  Walk into any bar and
> >kill the television just by being there.
> 
> Now this I like. a few other good ones: 
> boost a garage door opener through your car stereo's amplifier
> and put it on an omnidirectional antenna. Open all the garage's you
> drive by.

won't work. well, it used to. then someone -did- it & the garage
door opener manufacturers started using a simple coding scheme
to prevent it. someone posted a diagram of a device to run through
all the codes on alt.locksmithing.

> Broadcast on the x, k and ka bands from a beam antenna from the
> front of your car.

you can buy kits to do this.

> stick a funnel on a dog whiste and glue it under your hood. (or
> better yet, someone else's)

you can buy the equivalent of this in supermarket check out lines.
as an "anti animal collision device."

> Hook a variable speed strobe light to your grill and change the
> stroboscopic  frequency while approaching an intersection.

one of my friends hooked up some strobes underneath his rusted
out Honda. he had a great CD player/stereo system in it tho', and
would cruise into town playing thunder & lighting or jet engine
sound effects while the strobe lit up the ground around him.

> oh dear I think I am getting a little to anti-establishment here..
> 
> (famous last words.)

yup.

> L8r ppl

maybe we should make the anarchy symbol a part of the ASCII character
set. then we can -all- be rilly kewl. or c00L or whatever the hell
it is these days.

jason

--
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,
`, "Get off the cross. We need the wood." steiner@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu `,
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,
From: Jeremiah.Blatz@dartmouth.edu (Jeremiah Blatz)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: TECH GAP
Date: 19 Aug 92 22:04:55 GMT
 <1992Aug18.135132.11085@uwm.edu>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <1992Aug18.135132.11085@uwm.edu>
aragorn@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Strider) writes:

> Which resources can we turn to to find out how to apply this
> level of tech to our live (ie magazines, tech manuals, books, how-to books,
> trade magazines)?

How to learn about tech in 3 easy steps.

1) Go to Radio Shack (Hey, It's America's Technology Store! :-)    )

2) Buy every scrap of printed material you can find.

3) Read it.

Note: It is sometimes possible to skip step (2), but it tends to p|$$
people off. :-)

Now, don't forget to build lots of nifty gadgets!

Jeremiah
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: acsbk@UMASSD.EDU
Subject: Re: Books
Reply-To: acsbk@UMASSD.EDU
Organization: UMASS DARTMOUTH, NO. DARTMOUTH, MA.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 13:14:26 GMT


>> Broadcast on the x, k and ka bands from a beam antenna from the
>> front of your car.
>
>you can buy kits to do this.

Damn, knew I should have applied for a patent.
=)

>> stick a funnel on a dog whiste and glue it under your hood. (or
>> better yet, someone else's)
>
>you can buy the equivalent of this in supermarket check out lines.
>as an "anti animal collision device."

Well, the idea was more to use the lower freq.s to >attract< dogs
to produce some sort of demented piede piper sort of effect. can't you just see
your neigbor tooling through the neighborhood being followed by a pack of 
yapping dogs?

>> Hook a variable speed strobe light to your grill and change the
>> stroboscopic  frequency while approaching an intersection.
>
>one of my friends hooked up some strobes underneath his rusted
>out Honda. he had a great CD player/stereo system in it tho', and
>would cruise into town playing thunder & lighting or jet engine
>sound effects while the strobe lit up the ground around him.

Sounds good, I like it. I used to have 10+ feet of wire on the stereo speakers
so that I could either hand them out the window to another vehicle or flip the 
speaker over and stick it to the roof of my truck. real obnoxious. Worked
great once. Went to go see a Star Trek movie while blasting the opening
music from ST:The motion picture (which is now the ST:next gen. music BTW.)
Its great to just not care what people think sometimes. or perhaps it 
is thinking that you dont care what people think when you're being a 
fool.. I'm not sure which.

Actually the idea with the strobes has to do with those little lumps on the
traffic lights in major cities' intersections.

>maybe we should make the anarchy symbol a part of the ASCII character
>set. then we can -all- be rilly kewl. or c00L or whatever the hell

hmm. last I saw it was k00l, k0dez and L8r and reHI and d00dz. heh.

whtevr.

Brt Klkovch
ACSBK@UMASSD.EDU   "It's like someone painted the house with WARM paint"
From: "eliot gelwan" <eliot.gelwan@channel1.com>
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: c-punk and etc.
Date: 16 Aug 92 03:04:00 EST
Reply-To: "eliot gelwan" <eliot.gelwan@channel1.com>
Distribution: alt
Organization: Channel 1 Communications

On 08-15-92 ROBERT REAY wrote:

RR|>In article <1992Aug7.135905.28919#cis.umassd.edu>
RR|>acsbk@UMASSD.EDU writes: >    Yes, I think the idea of having
RR|>read _Neuromancer_ 10 times and >putting anarchy sigils on
RR|>personal items is silly, when used as a >qualifier to say
RR|>'look ma! I'm a cyberpunk!' These are the folks >who would buy
RR|>'Cyberpunk Cereal' for breakfast. I am not pointing fingers
RR|>mind you, but this is Alt.Cyberpunk, not Alt.Cyberpunk.Fans

RR|I saw (in a store called Utopia) a black t-shirt RR|printed
RR|with about a 20 5" anarchy logos.  Is it just me or does a
RR|preprinted (even well ordered) anarchy shirt seem a little
RR|silly.

Uh, for those of us who might buy Cyberpunk Cereal for breakfast,
what does an anarchy logo look like, please?


...eliot                                         |
Internet: eliot.gelwan@channel1.com             -*-
    RIME: ->CHANNEL [R/O okay]                   |

---
EZ 1.39 #178 [in Brookline MA 12:05 am, Sunday 08/16/92]
--
Channel 1 (R)   Cambridge, MA
From: randolph@cognito.cognito.ebay.Sun.COM (Randolph Fritz)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Non-conformism
Date: 13 Aug 92 13:46:52
Organization: St. Dismas Infirmary for the Incurably Informed
	<1992Aug13.105343.3546@microsoft.com>
	<1992Aug13.202224.4250@src.umd.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cognito.ebay.sun.com
In-reply-to: tedwards@src.umd.edu's message of 13 Aug 92 20:22:24 GMT

I think it's alienation that makes people want to write (or at least
not care if they have written) destructive viruses, Thomas.  (Dear
gods, do we all dream of being Frankensteins?)

__Randolph Fritz  sun!cognito.ebay!randolph || randolph@ebay.sun.com
  Software Support Project Manager, Customer Service
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: acsbk@UMASSD.EDU
Subject: Re: Books
Reply-To: acsbk@UMASSD.EDU
Organization: UMASS DARTMOUTH, NO. DARTMOUTH, MA.
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 17:59:58 GMT

>From: petesk@microsoft.com (Pete Skelly)
>>
>>As far as you wearing LEDs, you have every right to and I'll support that,
>>but as to you're reason?  Why do you GOT TO.  Who's making you.  If you want
>>an expression of technology, well, LED's are a nice expression of ancient
>>technology, but nearly every household in the US has a modern expression
>>of technology.  It's called NINTENDO.  LED's could almost be considered
>>pre-information age.

Nintendo? =) ooh, wow. thats the one with the 6502 chip on the mboard isnt it?
or is it a 68000? jee whiz. all that raw _POWER_. I dont think I can STAND it!
 
6502- in the Commodore 64 originaly.
68000- in the Mac Plus. 8Mhz.
and I bet they're hooked to one of them thar COLOR televisions!
(I jus luuuuv interlace do def!)
bwahahaha! 


>How about a few IR LEDs, which are fed with a signal which is the off code for
>most of the popular TV remotes.  Walk into any bar and kill the television
>just by being there.

Now this I like. a few other good ones: 
boost a garage door opener through your car stereo's amplifier
and put it on an omnidirectional antenna. Open all the garage's you drive by.

Broadcast on the x, k and ka bands from a beam antenna from the front of your car.

stick a funnel on a dog whiste and glue it under your hood. (or better yet, someone else's)

Hook a variable speed strobe light to your grill and change the stroboscopic 
frequency while approaching an intersection.

oh dear I think I am getting a little to anti-establishment here..

(famous last words.)

L8r ppl

Bret Kulakovich                 "This isn't representationalism because...
acsbk@umassd.edu                        .. PTHBPTHBHb!"
a.k.a. Asshurbanipal
a.k.a. tHe fRaNt!
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: tagg@hg.uleth.ca (Nathaniel Tagg)
Subject: Books
Reply-To: tagg@hg.uleth.ca
Organization: University of Lethbridge
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 19:40:39 GMT

     Just in case any of you guys care, there is an excellent Canadian author
by the name of Spider Robinson.  His novel, _Mindkiller_ is not really cpunk,
but it is sort of pre-cp, in the sense that the events occouring in the novel
could be part of a timeline that lead up to cp.  Well, actually, not really,
but it is a good novel nonetheless.  _Night_of_Power_ might be a little more on
the cp side, but.. well, forget it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Nathaniel Tagg               The U of Hell,  Lethbridge, AB
    "It's just a matter of putting one point seven nine five three seven two
and two point two oh four six two eight together."     --The Doctor 
___The opinions expressed by the author of the preceding message are not 
nessesarily representative of the opinions of the author of the
preceding message.____
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: cwagner@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Christian Wagner)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Movie: Hardware... is it cp?
Date: 19 Aug 92 06:30:55 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <9208172147.AA04697@magnusug.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> nhaldar@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Neil A Haldar) writes:
>I just saw the Movie _hardware_ for the 3rd time, and realized it had some 
>pretty neat cp-elements... like the underground culture, the idea of selling 
>scrap metal found in the "zones" to various dealers, etc...
>Anyone else with thoughts on this?

Methinks you missed the point.

"Hardware" was about the reduction of humans to the level of machines, and the
declining worth of human life in a mechanized culture. It's theme was that of
the individual becoming subserviant to the machine. 

You snagged the trappings, Neil, but you missed the thematics. "Hardware" is
cyberpunk because of it's theme, not it's "look" or the various elements you
mentioned. 

-- 
    "Well, do you ever get the feeling that the Story's too damn real
                        and in the present tense?"
               Christian Wagner - cwagner@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
From: drennan@acfcluster.nyu.edu (XIXAX)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Mondo 2000: R. U. Sirius
Date: 19 Aug 92 15:49:27 GMT
Organization: New York University

In article <RANDOLPH.92Aug18145314@cognito.ebay.Sun.COM>, randolph@cognito.ebay.Sun.COM (Randolph Fritz) writes:
> Hierarchic social patterns are an ape, even monkey thing. 

I would venture that heirarchies are a male construct. Corporate companies
headed up by women are more likely to show concentric or "spider web" set ups,
with one person in the middle, but everyone on the same level, as it were.

Furthermore, everyone is equal on the net...

______________________________________________________________________________
|Dany Drennan <+> Interactive Telecommunications Program, NYU |  Technology   |
|drennan@acfcluster.nyu.edu|xixax@aol.com|xixax@echo.panix.com| is  Autonomy  |
_______________________________________________________________________________
From: Loring Wirbel <lwirbel@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Date: 15 Aug 92 14:39 PDT
Subject: Re: sonic yth==cp music??
Nf-ID: #R:199214.735.3712@channel1:322211230:cdp:1300100009:000:571
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!lwirbel    Aug 15 14:39:00 1992


SY music is very uneven, but their best albums are outstanding, regardless
of whether they fit a cyber definition or not.  "Daydream Nation" and
"Dirty" are good choices; "Evol" and "Goo" are not as good.  I keep expecting
to hear more SY-Neil Young collaborations to follow up on the joint tour of
last year -- incidentally, they covered Young's "Computer Age" in The Bridge
tribute album of Neil Young.  SY is also rumored to have recorded several
other covers of songs on Neil's "Trans" album, from which "Computer Age" came.
Loring Wirbel
EETimes
lwirbel@igc.apc.org
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Mondo 2000: R. U. Sirius
From: wce@hogbbs.scol.pa.us (Bill Eichman)
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 02:01:24 EDT
Organization: The Heart of Gold BBS, Lemont PA

mike@highlite.uucp (Mike Wiik) writes:

> There's something to be said for having some loose bux. Read FM-2030's
> _R.U.A.Transhuman?_. The poverty-stricken agrarian technopeasant of
> the future will probably have a neat, cheap deck, but he'll still be
> tilling the fields himself.

Where can this file you mention be found?

I guess it depends on which side of the "tech-ownership" gap you end up 
falling into. But I'd predict that they'll be many hundred or thousand 
technopeasents for every person freed into "transhuman" status.... Our 
society has been organized in pyramidal power structures for 6000 plus 
years-- it's an ingrained tendency, now, and the new slaves are waiting 
in the wings.

> 
> Now, of course, no single human ('cept B.Gates) may be able to afford
> all the products in the M2K catalog, BUT A CONSORTIUM OF CYBERPUNK
> NIGHTCLUB INVESTORS COULD!!!!!!:-)
> 

A good idea. There's no end to gopod ideas-- builkding the organization 
that can realize those ideas is the tough part.

Later, Bill
From: drennan@acfcluster.nyu.edu (XIXAX)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: 'Lectronic Publishing
Date: 12 Aug 92 22:45:09 GMT
Organization: New York University

As far as Mondo or any other actual, quasi- or pseudo-cyber journal go(es), to
say that the fact that it is *printed* is wrong in some way is kinda ridiculous.
Paper is still "universally" a "standard" if you will, while electronic
versions of magz are either elitist by virtue of what kinduva rig you need to
"read" the thing, and/or platformist by virtue of what machine is needed to
"run" the thing.
                                                    
Besides, ASCII is a designer's nightmare.

Oh yeah, I think that Circuitry as Fashion should be functional at the VERY
least. I hate to see silicon wasted...

-- 
_______________________________________________________________________________
|Dany Drennan <+> Interactive Telecommunications Program, NYU |  Technology   |
|drennan@acfcluster.nyu.edu|xixax@aol.com|xixax@echo.panix.com| is  Autonomy  |
_______________________________________________________________________________
From: system@korova.uucp (razorback)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: a book (w0w)
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 15:47:43 CDT
Organization: VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783

morton@qucdntri.ee.queensu.ca writes:

> In article <5TBiPB11w165w@korova.uucp>, system@korova.uucp (razorback) writes
> > 
> > i recently read a book called (yep, you got it!) 
> >                   Lethal Interface
> 
> 	WHO IS THE AUTHOR? It would make it easier for me to find the book.
> 
> 		Thanks, 
> 		Stephen. 


yup, just remembered that tiny fact...:> 

mel odom (if you wanna kiss 5 bucks goodbye)
squid

--
              VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783
        "where you can find the Zeta Greys SAFEWAYING themselves
                into the WONDERBREAD *heart* of America!"
From: osendai@well.sf.ca.us (Mark Pesce)
Subject: Re: Ender's Game
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 07:02:43 GMT


It might be fair to point out that _Ender's Game_ has one very fine
example of teleoperation in it, which is certainly a cyberpunk
technology (witness Case 'riding' Molly).  Of course, the outcome
in this particular case is more pointed, and more moralistic.
That itself may be enough to disqualify it from being cyberpunk,
but it _is_ cynical and ridden through with enough technological
angst to make a fair play at cyberpunk.

Just thought I'd put a word in for the other side.

Mark Pesce
Ono-Sendai Corporation
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: reay@bnlls1.nsls.bnl.gov (Robert Reay)
Subject: Re: Ender's Game
Organization: Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, NY 11973
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:57:19 GMT

In article <dXb-_S=@engin.umich.edu> neufeld@math.lsa.umich.edu (Russell Neufeld ) writes:
>
>Ender's Game is a fantastic book, but in *no* way is it cyberpunk.  Neither
>is anything Heinlein ever wrote for that matter.  Anyone who says these
>books are doesn't have a clue as to what cyberpunk is.  
>
    Your being harsh.  Most people just dont consider punk as big a part of
cyberpunk as I (and it looks like you) do.  


			-Rob


Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: aragorn@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Strider)
Subject: Re: TECH GAP
Organization: The Banzai Institute
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 13:51:32 GMT

tripstr@cats.ucsc.edu (Christopher Todd Courtois) writes:
[text deleted]
: 
: 	I'm not sure what the point of my ranting is, other than I wish
: 	more people would stop believing that they *can't* understand
: 	technology, and "just do it".  So, if you're a person who is
: 	interested in cyberpunk, virtual reality, or nanotech, don't
: 	just read about this stuff: try to make it happen!  We've all
: 	seen enough of this technology to know it's something we want
: 	to be able to use to release our creativity,  but now we need
: 	to get down to work and empower the average person with these
: 	fantastic tools.
: 
: 	Food for thought....

Yes, this is food for thought.  If indeed those of us who are reading about
this and ranting/raving about the tech as you are here, where do we go to
not only read about it but also find out how to do it?  It seems that what
we read about the recent levels of tech is almost all `on-the-surface'
imofrmative.  Which resources can we turn to to find out how to apply this
level of tech to our live (ie magazines, tech manuals, books, how-to books,
trade magazines)?


Steve J. White
aragorn@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
skeptic@large@9600bps
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: EIVERSO@cms.cc.wayne.edu
Subject: Re: Proposed newsgroup: alt.music.techno
Organization: Wayne State University, C&IT
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 01:47:01 GMT

In article <16odcfINNja7@network.ucsd.edu>
mmaxwell@ucsd.edu writes:
 
>>There is discussion of a new alt.music.techno newsgroup going on
>>in alt.config.
>>
>>Please participate if you like.
>>
>What?  Alt.rave isn't good enough for you?
 
As a matter of fact, no!
>
>Disclaimer: I am not a reader of alt.rave, nor do i want to be.
 
Me too! Thus the desire for a techno group.
 
>Matt Maxwell
 
--Eric
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk