From: kumar@ug.cs.dal.ca (kumar yelubandi)
Subject: RE:  Nazis (radical or conservative)
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 13:00:56 GMT

>From: pjm@anegada.sps.mot.com (Patrick J. McGuinness)
>Subject: Nazis: Radicals or Conservatives? (was Re: On having a mixed ...)

>They overthrew these institutions because they were radical totalitarians.
>It means nothing that conservatives might have made some changes to Weimar
>- and I disagree with you that conservatives would have anyway, since
>Weimar was hardly ultra-liberal (what with Junkers like Hindenberg in power).
>You can't simply make Nazi's equal to cultural conservatives simply
>because they were not liberals.  The *Communists* would
	
	The Nazis were not liberals.  They were not conservatives.
	They were radical fascists.  The overlap between
	conservatism and fascism is real to the extent it serves
	fascist ideology.  The overlap between liberals and fascists
	is defined, mathematically anyways, as the null set.  

>have done the same thing the Nazis did. In fact, one might argue
>that the Russian Communists provided a model in so many ways
>for the Nazis: politicizing the armed forces, concentration camps,
>youth corps indoctrinated with the dominant ideology, etc.

	Yes.  And one might argue the "Russian Communists" provided a
	model for US slavery, ie. all slaves were considered equal
	and all were employed.  But chronology tells us otherwise. 
	You can't blame the communists for everything. 
		Politicized armed forces, concentration camps, 
	youth corps indoctrinated with the dominant ideology:  I suspect
	these things are standard operational procedures in any war
	perpetrated by single-minded, slightly-crazed megalomaniacs,
	ie. Caesar, Genghis Khan, Napoleon, Hitler, Lenin-Stalin, 
	    Saddam; to name a few. 	 

>And the Nazi's destroyed and perverted the German Universities, by
>burning and outlawing the then politically incorrect books, by firing
>dissident and Jewish Professors, by forcing the propogation of their own
>ideology, etc.
>No conservative would have destroyed the fine University tradition like that.
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
	
        University has always been a courtship of open minds and free,
	unadulterated thought.  Yes, conservatives have contributed much
	to the University tradition.  No, they have not contributed much
	to the "fine University tradition".  

	(I hate to be a stickler, but shouldn't that be propAgation?   
	 Oops, sorry...conservatives have been getting enough bad 
	 publicity on spelling.    :)        )


>>So to sum up, the Nazis were culturally conservative.
>I disagree. The Nazis were culturally and operationally radicals.
>---
>Pat

	The Nazis were culturally and operationally radical, yes.
	But they were radical fascists with a great deal of support
	from the conservative German population.  And if any,
	among Germans, suffered psychological trauma from watching their
	German "race" commit crimes against humanity against the Jews, 
	I suspect those were the liberals.
	


	Kumar

ps:	I watched on TV last night, first, a badly emaciated Somalian
	infant being carried by a medical worker ( I believe, from the
	humanitarian group "Doctors Without Borders"), and second, on CNN,
	the jingoistic extravaganza enjoyed by some 2000 or so deeply 
	religious "Republican Christians".  I guess it's not so hard to
	ferret out those who quote the Bible, from those who understand 
	it.

	(And before I get accused of being partisan, I think a lot 
	 of potentially useful money (and camera time) was likewise 
	wasted at the great masquerade ball in Madison Square...hypocrites
	to the left of me, jokers to the right, here I am stuck in the
	middle with you!)

	
-- 
                                  *******************************************
   Kumar Yelubandi                 **  I don't believe in a lot           **
   (good wines > good times!)      **  of things. And I quit thinking     **
   ...in the year 2525...          **  six years ago...so don't bother me ** 
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