HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: doom@leland.Stanford.EDU (Joseph Brenner)
Subject: Re: Scientists' fictions and plays
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 92 23:42:52 GMT

This may be a little late (the system ate my first try), but
I wanted to second the recommendation of C.P.  Snow's _The
Search_.  It's an excellent book, focusing on a problem with
academic honesty.  I found many of the details
fascinating... e.g. doing X-ray crystallography with some
really funky techniques: cranking the crystal orientation
around manually while looking for a maxima on an analog
gauge.

Unfortunately, _The Stranger's and Brothers_ series is
rather long, and tedious in places.  I bogged down in _The
Masters_, and never managed to finish all of it.  (I'm a
strong opponent of capital punishment, except for British
authors who persist in reminiscing about their childhood, the
old boy's school, and so on.)

Some other possibilities: 

There's a mystery novel by Issac Asimov called _The Death
Dealers_, about a murder committed in a university chem lab.
It touches on some of the same issues that C.P. Snow wrote
about.

I've never read _Arrowsmith_ by Sinclair Lewis, but I
understand that it's about the conflict between humanitarian
concerns and applying the scientific method to medicine
(e.g. do you let your control group die to prove a point?). 

Incidentally, restricting the field to non-science fiction
is understandable, if only to narrow down the search result
a bit, but it may be a mistake: most science fiction isn't
really about science or scientists, but rather about
engineering (when it's not about pseudo-scientific magic or
mysticism that is...).  However there are a few books like
Gregory Benford's _Timescape_ that compare favorably to C.P.
Snow's work, despite being on the wrong side of the genre
fence.  (I think I'll post a separate inquiry to
rec.arts.sf.written about this, to see what turns up.)
From: luther@i5160e.nrl.navy.mil (Luther)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Another DAVID EDDINGS Q & comments on ..Kell.
Date: 13 Apr 92 21:59:34 GMT
Organization: US Naval Research Laboratory, Acoustics Division

In article <m=xjx_q@lynx.unm.edu> vjmurphy@carina.unm.edu (Phred T. Platypus) writes:
>
>    The Diamond Throne
>    The Ruby Knight
>    The Sapphire Rose
>
>   All three are currently out.  I don't know about the fourth book.
>

I don't think there is a fourth book - this is supposed to be a 
regular ol' trilogy, is it not???

And now... my comments about The Seeress of Kell, with possible SPOILERS!!
I read another posting from someone who didn't like it, and I must 
agree - 



Was any of this book supposed to be a suprise? Is Eddings enough of a 
simpleton to think he was actually creating suspense as to 

	1. which character would buy the farm??
	2. who would become the Child of Dark & Child of Light??
	3. which Child Cyradis would choose??

Sheesh. I kept hoping he'd throw out a curve ball, that he'd have the
guts to kill off one of the major characters, that he'd suprise me as
to ANYTHING WHATSOEVER. But no such luck. It really pissed me off that
I waited almost a year to read this book. And the sad thing is, I remember
really liking the previous books in the pentology. Were they really better
than The Seeress of Kell, or do I just have awful taste in books?

I got the impression that Eddings was only interested in finishing
the series, and didn't really care whether the last book would be
satisfying to his readers or not.

There's lots more I could whine about, but I'll wait to see what others
have to say.

KL
---------------------------------------------------

" 'Eureka' is Greek for 'This bath is too hot'. "
			- Tom Baker / Doctor Who
	Ken Luther
	Naval Research Lab.
	Washington, D.C. 
	luther@v5160.nrl.navy.mil
---------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,rec.arts.poems
From: wojdylo@maths.uwa.oz.au (INFIDEL)
Subject: Re: Structuralst Crit and "S/z" and applying it
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 10:03:37 GMT

fscll@acad3.alaska.edu (Chris Lott) writes:

>Anyway, that being said, for my final paper in a Literary Crit class I am
>going to be applying constructionist criticism to a modern text, Ray Carver's
>story "Menudo" to be exact... 

>Well, as structuralism is pretty new to me, and I don't think I have even a
>minimum grasp on it compared to what I should have to make the criticism
>effective, I am trying to solicit responses.discussion.tips from anyone that
>is familiar with the theory or has used it before.

[...]

>this is the best I can do. I am not looking for someone to do the work for me,
>I would just like to discuss it with someone that is familiar with the
>process,... .

>thanks in advance for any help you can give ,me... .


Burn your books on structuralist theory; go out and live.




>-- 
> __________________________________________________________
>|  Christopher L. Lott  --- Poet and Pauper                |
>|__________________________________________________________|___
>|  fscll@alaska                | "And now what shall become of |
>|  fscll@acad3.alaska.edu      |  us without any barbarians?   |
> ------------------------------|  Those people were a kind of  |
>                               |          solution."           |
>                                -------------------------------


jw
From: mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Homosexualism
Date: 24 Mar 92 21:15:12 GMT
Organization: Electronic Frontier Foundation
Originator: mnemonic@eff.org

In article <1992Mar20.205806.26500@watserv1.waterloo.edu> msmorris@watsci.waterloo.edu (Mike Morris) writes:

>But the principle, remember, is that of a ``clear and present danger''
>of the speech-act *causing* harm.

That used to be the test. It has since been supplanted (or clarified, if
you prefer) by the U.S. Supreme Court's decision in Brandenburg v. Ohio in
the late '60s. That case, which involved a Klansman who was uttering what
by today's standards would clearly be called "hate speech," led to the
Court's holding that such speech could be banned only if it was an attempt
to incite imminent lawless action *and* was likely to cause such action.
The mere advocacy of lawless action, if it's not imminent or if it's not
likely, is Constitutionally protected expression.



--Mike





-- 
Mike Godwin,     |"Les vrais paradis sont les paradis
mnemonic@eff.org | qu'on a perdus."
(617) 864-0665   | 
EFF, Cambridge   |          --Marcel Proust
From: kardaras@en.ecn.purdue.edu (George S Kardaras)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Greek Books
Date: 12 Apr 92 03:53:25 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

Hello,

I would like to know if there are any bookstores in the
US selling greek books. 

If there are any, do they accept orders by mail?

Thanking you in advance,
George S. Kardaras
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: comptec91006@camins.camosun.bc.ca (Michael Botten)
Subject: Re: Another DAVID EDDINGS Q
Organization: Camosun College
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 05:54:01 GMT

In article <kaschenb.702853897@sfu.ca>, kaschenb@fraser.sfu.ca (Kevin Ernest Aschenbrenner) writes:
> 
> 
> Does anyone know the names of the next books in
> the series that began with THE DIAMOND THRONE?
> I remember reading it, and then not seeing the rest
> of the series...are there anymore?  Has he finished
> it yet--or is he going to make us wait like he did
> with the last one.
>
Wasn't the next one called "The ruby (something-or-other)?"
Can't really remember - so this might be totally wrong...
_______________________________________________________________________________
               __    __   __ ___ ___  __
 /\  /\  o |/ |_    |__/ |  | |   |  |_  |\ | (Well, isn't this special...)
/  \/  \ I |\ |__   |__\ |__| |   |  |__ | \| CompTec91006@Camins.Camosun.BC.CA
_______________________________________________________________________________
 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto)
Subject: Re: read any good books lately?
Organization: Lehman Brothers
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 15:25:35 GMT

> Read any good books lately?

Nope.  I've been watching college basketball, lately.

I have been reading a little poetry lately -- mostly Eliot, Spender, Yeats,
but a little Baudelaire, Maxine Kumin and e. e. cummings, too.

r.a.b's Joe Green & Barbara Hlavin have posted a few nice things in
r.a.poems -- but most of the stuff there is crap.

I did start reading Edith Wharton, though.


Mark


PS

Here is my favorite Stephen Spender poem -- hope you like it.



                        From My Diary

                        Stephen Spender



        'She was', my father said (in an aside),
        'A great beauty, forty years ago.'
        Out of my crude childhood, I stared at
        Our tottering hostess, tremulous
        In her armchair, pouring tea from silver --
        Her grey silk dress, her violet gaze.
        I only saw her being seventy,
        I could not see the girl my father saw.

        Now that I'm older than my father then was
        I go with lifelong friends to the same parties
        Which we have gone to always.
        We seem the same age always
        Although the parties sometimes change to funerals
        That sometmies used to changed to christenings.

        Faces we've once loved
        Fit into their seven ages as Russian dolls
        Into one another.  My memory
        Penetrates through successive layers
        Back to the face which first I saw.  So when the last
        Exterior image is laid under its lid,
        Your face first seen will shine through all.


Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir)
Subject: Re: ENGLISH AS SHE IS SPOKE
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 13:37:00 GMT

Bonita Kale writes:

	"Rubbers" is a nuisance, since there really is no other word for 
	what you put on over your shoes, unless you want to get into 
	"rubber overshoes" and sound weird.  And yet the word has taken 
	on a distinct sexual tinge.  

Aha! Here the British can be helpful. Their word -- or one of their words --
for these things is galoshes. This is so excellent a word that you should
consider importing it. A. A. Milne's son, Christopher Robin (obligatory
literary reference) wore them.

	Which reminds me of a question I had regarding British usage.  
	C.S. Lewis (d. 1963, so this was a while back) had a guest who 
	asked to use the "bathroom".  He showed him to the room with 
	the bathtub in it, as a lesson not to use American euphemisms.  

This sounds like Lewis. Most Americans (Statesmen?) don't seem to realize
just what an assole C. S. Lewis really was. This is a prime example. 

	So what is the straightforward, non-vulgar usage in Great Britain? 

Bathroom. There is no need to go into exquisite detail of the particular
bodily function you need to perform, and it might likely involve three
seperate pieces of equipment, viz. the toilet, the bidet and the washbasin,
all of which will, in the normal way of things, be in the same room, the
bathroom.

Some plumbing supply houses call the bathroom sink the lavatory, I believe,
but otherwise, the word is confined to school teachers who can't bear to
let the little ones say "bathroom".  But I think I've heard that the
British use the word for what we (equally foolishly) call the toilet. 

						Francis Muir

francis@sep.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto)
Subject: Re: Moorcock's reference to Harlequin
Organization: Lehman Brothers
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 21:54:16 GMT

rose@acf9.nyu.edu (David Rose) writes:

> Commedia dell'arte was a form of theatre that originated in Italy in the
> 16th century.  It had probably died out as popular entertainment by the
> mid-18th century.  There weren't actual stories, but improvisations based
> on set characters.  In addition to Harlequin and Pierrot, these include
> Pierrette, Columbine and Pantaloon.  These characters have been worked
> into later literature and art forms, particularly dance.  August
> Bournonville, the Danish choreographer and ballet theorist, made extensive
> use of the commedia dell'arte traditions (sans the sleeve gestures that
> passed for emoting), for example.

Reading this, two visions come to mind.  The first is a production number
from the movie THE BOYFRIEND, starring Twiggy and Tommy Tune.  Twiggy is
dressed as a sad Pierrette, as the corus sings "Poor little Pierrette, where's
your Pierrot?"

The other vision is of a PBS production of THE TAMING OF THE SHREW, from
the mid-70s.  It was done in the Commedia dell'arte style, which seemed
to fit it perfectly.

Mark



Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: gretzky@wam.umd.edu (Keith Robert Gretzky)
Subject: Italo Svevo
Originator: gretzky@rac2.wam.umd.edu
Organization: University of Maryland at College Park
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 21:28:19 GMT

Has anyone read Italo Svevo's _Confessions of Zeno_?

If so how did you like it?
Xref: sparky rec.arts.books:8081 alt.cyberpunk:2115
From: koziarz@chinet.chi.il.us (Louis Koziarz)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Gibson's new book
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:30:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: chinet.1992Apr15.193013.6061
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX

>Forgive me if I am a bit behind the curve on this, but I just read about
>William Gibson's new book _Agrippa_ (the Book of the Dead). 

From piecing together various threads here on alt.cybpk, _Agrippa_ (the Book
of the Dead) is a multi-media art piece that is being produced in a very small
number.  Gibson's contribution is a disk with poetry that contains this virus,
but it is not a full-fledged Gibson novel.  There was some traffic earler about
a working title _Virtual Light_, but I have read nothing further.

Concerning another post, there are two William Gibsons in the card catalog.
The one responsible for Neuromancer, etc is usually listed as 
'Gibson, William 1947- ', the other author responsible for the mentioned works
is just plain 'Gibson, William'.  No relation. (or is there???? )  

-- 
Louis Koziarz
koziarz@chinet.chi.il.us
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin)
Subject: Re: Who is Elia Kazan ?
Originator: mnemonic@eff.org
Organization: Electronic Frontier Foundation
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 21:41:52 GMT

In article <Rob.vanGerwen-10/04/92+16:15:54@McVanGerwen> Rob.vanGerwen@phil.ruu.nl (Rob van Gerwen) writes:

>He is a director.
>If my memory serves me right he has made several movies with Marlon Brando,
> e.g. On the Waterfront. 

Elia Kazan is also known for his willingness to name names as a witness
before HUAC.


--Mike




-- 
Mike Godwin,     |"Anyone who has obeyed nature by transmitting a piece
mnemonic@eff.org | of gossip experiences the explosive relief that
(617) 864-0665   | accompanies the satisfying of a primary need."
EFF, Cambridge   |          --Primo Levi
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: wald@theory.lcs.mit.edu (David Wald)
Subject: Re: read any good books lately?
Organization: Laboratory for Computer Science, MIT
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:22:37 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.225452.29417@cs.yale.edu>
loosemore-sandra@CS.YALE.EDU (Sandra Loosemore) writes:
>This newsgroup has seemed kind of slow lately.  Is everybody too busy
>reading books to post here any more?  :-) What have you all been
>reading?

Let's see...  A couple of books I've recently finished:

  _Immortality_, by Milan Kundera.  A very nice book; both comfortable
  and thought-provoking.  This overlapped _The World According to
  Garp_ in my reading, and I couldn't help thinking of it as evidence
  against those who ask what parts of a novel are "real"; that wasn't
  the focus of the book though.  As usual, I really like Kundera's
  characters.

  _Silverlock_, by John Myers Myers.  I want to own a copy of this
  book.  Anyone have any leads?  It's apparently been in and out of
  print repeatedly for decades, but it's not in print now and I can't
  find any used copies.

-David
--
============================================================================
David Wald                                           wald@theory.lcs.mit.edu
   "Blessed are the peacocks, for they shall be called sonship of God"
             -- Matt 5:9, from a faulty QuickVerse 2.0
============================================================================
From: br@bnr.co.uk (Brian Robertson)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: read any good books lately?
Date: 8 Apr 92 08:29:27 GMT
Reply-To: br@bnr.co.uk (Brian Robertson)
Distribution: rec
Organization: BNR Europe Limited, London Road, Harlow, Essex, GB



I have just finished reading two books.  The first was Colin Thrubron's
_Turning Back the Sun_, his latest.  Thrubron normally writes travel books 
but has now published four novels.  I have also recently read _Falling_,
which follows a similiar theme to his latest book.  They are both worth 
reading as his depiction of the `loner' is very evocative.

The second was Thomas Keneally's _Towards Asmara_, about four Europeans 
who are travelling through Eritrea with a rebel escort.  I am not sure
how much of the book is factually correct (and would be interested in
comments other readers may have), but the book was very enjoyable.  It 
is the first book I have read by Keneally, but it wouldn't be the last.

Of course, if you are short of something to read try James Kennaway's books:
not everyone's favourite style but well worth the effort.

Cheers for now

Brian
From: cramer@optilink.UUCP (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: holocaust books
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:39:46 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA

In article <1992Apr9.171801.4931@odin.corp.sgi.com>, joyce@deco.csd.sgi.com (Joyce Richards) writes:
> why is it if you have a mass murderer, there is the murderer, and then
> the victims.  jeffry dahlmer's name was in the papers.  he murdered
> n number of victims.  but when we talk about the Holocaust, it's usually
> said:  6.25 million Jews died. and gays and gypsies and priests and artists,
> etc. or were lost.  or disappeared.
> but we don't say the ruling German Government killed ...
> why is that?  am i wrong to guess that PC talk avoids ugliness?
> 
> joyce.

More likely, because it's an incomplete statement.  The German
Government did it, but so did the Croatian Government, and a fair
number of other governments, some of them puppets, and some of
them not puppets.  There were also plenty of murders committed
by enthusiastic volunteers in Eastern Europe.

It's certainly true that without the governments involved, the
Holocaust would have been more like a big pogrom.  I don't doubt
for a second that liberals would prefer everyone forgot that 
without governments, and their efforts at disarming the victims,
the results would have been radically different.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
"The mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a
favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately, by the grace
of God." -- Thomas Jefferson
Xref: sparky rec.arts.books:8101 alt.books.technical:103 misc.books.technical:848
From: sds@cnmss.tredydev.unisys.com (Sunil Shah)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,alt.books.technical,misc.books.technical
Subject: Re: HELP
Keywords: HELP
Date: 16 Apr 92 14:36:59 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Unisys Corp. cnmss.tredydev.unisys.com

Try quantum books they can be reached at
quanbook@world.std.com
-- 

Sunil Shah   		       | UUCP:   ..!gvlv2!tredsvr!cnmss!sds
Unisys corp. Tredyffrin PA     | Internet:  sds@cnmss.tredydev.unisys.com
USA  19301      (215)648-3702
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: emma@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Emma Pease)
Subject: Re: ENGLISH AS SHE IS SPOKE
Organization: Stanford University CSLI
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 17:10:35 GMT

In <1992Apr17.145636.15275@morrow.stanford.edu> francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir) writes:

>Out here (note correct use of "out") in
>California we talk about the "freeway system" but "getting on the
>Interstate". The freeways themselves are either identified by number,
>"I5", or by name "the Long Beach". I'm a name man myself, but most
>of my axcquaintance seem to like numbers. i can never remember which they
>mean, and there is this dreadful business here in the Peninsula where
>North and South are called East and West.

>Confused in Palo Alto

I tend to be confused by the numbers also (except for Route 1).  But
the names can be so confusing for instance there is the fun of
Junipero Serra Blvd. and Junipero Serra Freeway (not the same road,
both within a mile of campus, both major); it's not surprising that
people use 280 for the latter (or is it 101?).  I blame the
north/south confusion partly on Stanford's insistence that campus maps
have SSW as the up direction thereby bewildering all new students and
partly because to head up the Peninsula you head west.

We seem to be heading a fair distance away from books and literature
so I've included a poem that I feel is appropriate to the season. 

Loveliest of trees, the cherry now 
Is hung with bloom along the bough,
And stands about the woodland ride 
Wearing white for Eastertide.      

Now, of my threescore years and ten,  
Twenty will not come again,           
And take from seventy springs a score,
It only leaves me fifty more.         

And since to look at things in bloom
Fifty springs are little room,      
About the woodlands I will go         
To see the cherry hung with snow.   
                                      
                        -A.E. Housman

-Emma
 emma@csli.stanford.edu
From: wetering@sea.com (B. Van de Wetering)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: More English second authors (was r.a.b FAQ)dir
Date: 9 Apr 92 00:06:39 GMT
Organization: Systems Engineering Associates

In article <1992Apr8.164801.13870@samba.oit.unc.edu> joan@med.unc.edu (Joan Shields) writes:
>Jan Williem Van der Wetering wrote in Dutch and then
>translated his books into English.
>

Having read at least one of his books in both languages, I'm not sure that
they are straight translations.  I seem to remember a paragraph near the
beginning of one of his english books that describes the rank hierarchy
in the Amsterdam police force.  This paragraph was missing in the dutch
version.  There may be other instances where he adds descriptions of typically
dutch things in his english versions.


-- 
Brian Van de Wetering INTERNET:wetering@sea.com 
		      UUCP:...!ucsd!soledad!wetering 
		      VOICE:619/581-6181 x307
Systems Engineering Associates, 2204 Garnet Ave Suite 303, San Diego CA 92109
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.sex