From: b645zaw@utarlg.uta.edu (General Jubilation T.)
Subject: Re: ** The Birth of NEW-ISRAEL ** ( Re: Death of America xx )
Summary: We may not get there ourselves, but might as well try our best.
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords: God's will be done, no matter what comes.
Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 04:01:00 GMT

In article <1hqiekINN3n6@spim.mti.sgi.com>, 
mpolen@suntory.mti.sgi.com (Mike Polen) writes...

>General Jubilation T.) writes:
>|> 
>|> So no one other than -*GOD*- can save us now, economically or otherwise.
>|> Without a spiritual renewal, all our efforts will be like trying to breath 
>|> life into a corpse. In a nation where it's ok to express your private sex-
>|> uality in public, how much more then should one express their personal 
>|> spirituality likewise? Anywhere and anytime. Personally.
>|> 
>|> So this is the way out, the only way -- through GOD. Not because you want 
>|> yourself saved (shallow self-preservation) -- but because you want to truly
>|> know and love GOD. The overflowing of such will set all else right. The 
>|> offer still remains, all that's needed is to accept it. The alternative 
>|> is to coldy turn away, and walk into the pit of destruction. That's just 
>|> the way it works.
>|> 
>|> So let's bury the ghost of America. And turn to welcome the birth of the 
>|> nation of NEW-ISRAEL in our land. A nation chosen by GOD and saved by GOD.
>|> Not because there is any mystical entity which can be called "a nation,"
>|> but because we each more than any other people, enjoy a personal relation-
>|> ship with Our Creator -- One-to-One. Amen.
>

>Just as not all of us practice homosexuality or conservatism or liberalism 
>or etc., not all of us believe in this approach to life.  There is certainly
                        ^^^^^^^          
>no data to show that those that believe in -*GOD*- have been saved "economi- 
                                 ^^^^^^^
>cally or otherwise" -- except maybe evangilists and popes.  

Yes, the key point is that if there were reliably repeatable data, there
would be no call for belief. Our written historical record (6000 years
worth) suggests that people, nations, and other human institutions most
all go through a process of birth (formation), waxing, waning, and death
(disintegration). The data then is that no human organization persists.

Our theories suggest this process will likely be true for the race, the
planet, the solar system, and the universe. So each entity is unique it
seems, history and science considered. Perhaps those who profess to be
reincarnated have no need for "belief," but it certainly seems that re-
searchers, scientists, and theorists do. Belief in their own faculties 
as a start, if nothing more.

>Whatever happened to "God helps those that help themselves?"  

Good question. I started to track down the source of the quote about 
4 months ago, and quite forgot about it. I'd narrowed it down to Sam
Clemens, as I recall. As long as God is part of the effort, it sounds
great to me.

>Maybe you should turn to the athiests who, because they don't believe 
>someone else will make problems go away, know how to try to fix things 
>themselves.

Good point. Can you suggest any atheist with a proven record of accom-
plishment? (Other than Sam Clemens. :) Just because someone is a non-
believer, doesn't mean I wouldn't trust them. Which reminds me of the 
libertarians. Though I wouldn't want a government run by libertarians 
exclusively, I'd like to see a lot more of them in government to help 
check the compulsive spending and power consolidation of the present 
partisans. Even if it's only a guess that they'd be able to have any 
impact.

But it seems that there is plenty of room in our country for believers
and dis-believers of all types, which is an attitude that could likely
improve the persistence of any nation, (this is unproven of course). The
United States seems to have been the most interesting experiment as a 
"melting-pot," and still only remained viable due to people's willingness 
to overlook the insanity of civil war and heal the division of families 
and other wounds. The key points here are compromise, tolerance, and
commonality of interest.

It doesn't appear that the compulsive spenders and power addicts now in 
government are willing to compromise with the more prudent folk (whether
classically conservative, libertarian, or other). In fact it seems that
governance has devolved into a matter of sports-competition where there
are only winners and losers, (the prize being who gets to be master and
who gets to be tax-slave). America has failed in this regard, and likely
fatally; winner-take-all government doesn't work (historically), especi-
ally when the "winners" cheat or commit crimes. 

I could just stop here and assume that there is no way to overcome such
divisiveness, and indeed there may not be if left to merely human concern.
But I believe that by bringing GOD into the matter, we can overcome those
issues that divide us; even though there may be no way to save the govern- 
ment or the nation. 

My main point is that there is a spiritual community greater than the or-
ganization called the United States, which taken collectively may be called 
the Kingdom of God, (and for historical reasons is called New-Israel). 
But it doesn't exist as a human institution, nor ever will. It does exist 
spiritually, and acknowledges the collective of individual instances of 
each person in their unique relation to GOD, (no matter when or where).
On this basis I make my appeal.

I might have called it "The True World Order," but it's actual physical 
institution will not occur until the coming of the Messiah. We who believe 
prepare and anticipate in our dealings with one another that good physical 
community to come. 

Between the Garden-of-Eden and God's City to come, New-Jerusalem, we may 
take the best conception of both, divinely inspired, as a model for how 
to live together. And likewise, the reformation of Israel as a nation, 
again and again, suggests that commonality-of-faith can overcome enslave-
ment, conquest, and diaspora. In such we are the New-Israel.

My faith remains that unless GOD is involved, no nation can long stand.
There is nothing to suggest otherwise. I urge those who believe in GOD
to place all factionalism, whether partisan, nationalistic, denominational,
institutional, or otherwise, as having little import next to their relation 
to and love of GOD.

   |
-- J --
   |
   |  Stephen 

Xref: sparky talk.politics.theory:5566 talk.politics.misc:65576 alt.conspiracy:13518