From: stephen@orchid.UCSC.EDU (x4604 (Hauskins))
Newsgroups: ba.politics
Subject: "Monsters Among Us right here?"
Date: 22 Nov 1992 02:36:23 GMT
Organization: Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: orchid.ucsc.edu

In article <1992Nov21.131434.15514@cs.ucla.edu> robert@oahu.cs.ucla.edu (Rob Karmolinski) writes:
>phil@netcom.com (Phil Ronzone) writes:
>
>>The two new sexual orientations are men that molest small boys,
>>which aren't homosexuals by your reasoning, and men that molest small
>>girls, which aren't hetereosexuals by your reasoning (via extension).
>
>>Clever.
>

I suggest that you read some scientific literature on how distictions
are drawn about molestors and pedophiles in the classification of sexual
orientation.  The classifications are in general adjective not noun.
We say homosexual pedophile and heterosexual pedophile becuase of the
relationship between the sex of the victim and the molestor.  But this
does not eliminate a subgroup of sexual offenders who are heterosexual
or homosexual and sexually abuse childern.

A pedophile (hebephile,gynephile,androphile) are types of people who like 
having sex with childern.  The next step of classification is based
upon frequencies of same-sex and opposite-sex encounters.  But much
of the literature makes it clear that pedophiles do not seem to be
strictly interested in the sex of their victims.  In fact many molest
both sexes.  This  is a type of sexual activity classification, and
researchers add the adjective of homo and hetero in relationship to
the sex of the molestor and victim.

Now there are homosexuals and heterosexuals who only get aroused by
adult males and females.  They are then either homosexual or heterosexual
in their desire for sexual contact and then we classify it a little
furthur by saying that a person is homosexual or heterosexual (a noun)
not an adjective.

We have to make clear distinctions about how we view someone as a 
pedophile and/or molestor.  There are different mechanism at work,
we obviously agree that these people have a serious problem, and we
need to understand what their motivation is for their crimes.  So just
to attempt to lump groups together lessens our ability to analysis
these behaviors.

Clayton and seemingly you want to make sure that everyone gets the idea
that homosexuals are somehow tied into this whole child molestation thing.

>>You know, 47% of all violent crimes are committed by black males. Using
>>your logic, I can claim that blacks commit NO crimes -- those people
>>with black skins commiting that 47% aren't blacks, but CRIMINALS!
>

That is at best not a logic comparasion or argument.  If an individual
is black then he or she is black... period. If you want to use 'black'
as a noun that is fine as long as you correct about statistics, but
to say then if someone commits a crime therefore they must be 'black'
is not correct. And what you are trying to say is, that if a pedophile
male molest a male child he is homosexual (noun) that is not correct.

So if a pedophile male
molest a male child, that does not make him 'homosexual' by name (noun)
it can be said by adjective that he committed a homosexual child
molestation... which tells us that it was a same-sex molestation.

>>Sorry -- sexual orientation is defined by WHAT you are attracted to,
>>not the AGE of what you are attracted to! Otherwise, some men aren't
>>hetereosexuals, they are men-fixated-on-nubile-18-year-old-large-
>>breasted-dumb-bimbos and so on.
>

Bull- since we cannot even tell for sure why people are sexually attracted
to childern, we cannot therefore say that it is just homosexual or 
heterosexual.  Much of it has to do with power over another inidividual
and childern present the easiest targets.  I have heard convicted molestors
who say that they were not interested in the sex per se, they wanted
the power and were intoxicated with the power of the situation they were
involved in.

A rapist is usually on a power trip, domination or revenge, I have read
studies that include statements of convicted rapist that all they wanted
was power and control over the individual.