HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jle@locus.com (John Elghani)
Subject: Re: News from the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip.
Organization: Locus Computing Corp, Los Angeles
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 93 03:48:54 GMT

In article <29971@castle.ed.ac.uk> jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson) writes:
>>THEY SHOOT TO KILL !!!!!
>Sources, please.

You don't need sources, what you really need are destinations.
Destinations of the dead bodies, that's a proof.  Go to the
grave yards, and you'll  see how they really "SHOOT TO KILL"

You don't expect sympathy from a ruthless occupier.

jle
				"WA EDDO LAHOM"  SADAQA ALLAH ALAZEEM.


Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: cubsfan@camelot.bradley.edu (Michael Silverman)
Subject: Re: israeli lobby
Organization: Priests of the Temples of Syrinx
Date:  8 Jan 93 06:44:49 GMT

Just what powerful "Israel lobby" thinks Warren Christopher is
anti Israel? 

Definitely not AIPAC...do you know of any other "pwerful pro-Israel"
lobbies?

PS: Coming from a supporter of Israel (myself), I find Warren Christopher
to be very fair minder concerning the Mid East, and I think he was a
good choice by Clinton.


--
cubsfan@camelot.bradley.edu

"One likes to believe in the freedom of baseball" - Geddy Lee
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: bob1@cos.com (Bob Blackshaw)
Subject: Re: In 1 day, it will come, THE DEATH OF MUTLU/ARGIC
Organization: Corporation for Open Systems
Distribution: world 
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 18:21:50 GMT

In <1igrr9INN922@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> bv652@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ilan Uri Woll) writes:


>--------------------------------NEWSFLASH-----------------------

>On Wednesday, January 7, Hassan Mutlu a.k.a Serdar Argic was convicted
>of numerous chargesincluding character assasination, and bad breath.

>Sentencing will be tomorrow, punishment could range from 2 years in jail
>to death by slow torture (as was requested by the Turkish Embassy.  

>Apparently, should execution occur, there have been thousands of requests
>to be the killer.  More News as it occur.

>In only one measly day, the death of Mutlu/Argic, can ya believe it!

You mean to tell me that Mutlu/Argic is a person? And all this time
I thought it was an AI experiment gone awry.

>-- 
>---  !      ^    !\  !
> !   !     /-\   ! \ !
>___  !__  /   \  !  \!  
>                        Avoid cliches like the plague" George Shaw

REB
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.greek
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: GREEK INVASION IN CYPRUS 1974..cont..
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 93 20:40:15 EST
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <C0CLzw.rp@acsu.buffalo.edu> v999saum@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Varnavas A. Lambrou) writes:

>The attrocities of July, 1974 and new ones in the course of the second 
>offensive in August were effective in terrorizing the population of 
>the occupied area.

The Greeks started massacring the Turkish population on Cyprus 
in 1974. How do we account for this phenomenon? Amnesia?
In 1974, Turkiye stepped into Cyprus to preserve the lives
of the Turkish population there. This is nothing but a simple
historical fact. Unfortunately, the intervention was too
late at least for some of the victims. Mass graves containing 
numerous bodies of women and children already showed what
fate had been planned for a peaceful minority.


 Article by Giorgo Bocca, Correspondent of Il Giorno
 Date: 14 January 1964

 DAILY HERALD (London)

 AN APPALLING SIGHT

And when I came across the Turkish homes they were an appalling sight.
Apart from the walls, they just did not exist. I doubt if a napalm bomb
attack could have created more devastation. I counted 40 blackened brick
and concrete shells that had once been homes. Each house had been deliberately
fired by petrol. Under red tile roofs which had caved in, I found a twisted
mass of bed springs, children's conts and cribs, and ankle deep grey
ashes of what had once been chairs, tables and wardrobes.

In the neighbouring village of Ayios Vassilios, a mile away, I counted 16 
wrecked and burned out homes. They were all Turkish Cypriot homes. From
this village more than 100 Turkish Cypriots had also vanished.In neither village
did I find a scrap of damage to any Greek Cypriot house.

Serdar Argic

                     'This war quickly developed into one of extermination. 
                      We closed the roads and mountain passes that might 
                      serve as ways of escape for the Tartars [Turks] and 
                      then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)
From: revans@euclid.ucsd.edu (Ron Evans)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: What Gaul!
Date: 8 Jan 93 07:40:01 GMT


NO. I oppose as a matter of principle Jewish, muslim, catholic or
other religiously or ethnically-determined states. 

     One doesn't often encounter a research center opposed
     to France.

In article <23182@venera.isi.edu> arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens) writes:

First, France is not religiously/ethnically based. 

	"Ethnic": designating a heterogeneous population, as
	distinguished by customs, characteristics, language,
	common history, etc.   [Source:  Webster's]
	Est-ce que je me fais comprendre?
-- 
Ron Evans (revans@math.ucsd.edu)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU (Stewart Clamen)
Subject: Re: Jordanian Palestinians (was: israel & hamas)
Originator: clamen@BYRON.SP.CS.CMU.EDU
Reply-To: clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
	<1hm7f4INNmvi@manuel.anu.edu.au> <Bzynt7.HHn.1@cs.cmu.edu>
	<1hmr70INNljc@tyl.anu.edu.au> <1992Dec28.230547.13464@nysernet.org>
	<1hov16INNohn@tyl.anu.edu.au>
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 11:05:20 GMT

In article <1hov16INNohn@tyl.anu.edu.au> bdm@cs.anu.edu.au (Brendan McKay) writes:

   astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:

   >bdm@cs.anu.edu.au (Brendan McKay) writes:

   >>In 1954, Jordan passed a law that defined as a Jordanian citizen
   >>(i) someone who was a Jordanian citizen according to either of
   >>    two earlier laws, and
   >>(ii) someone who was not a Jew, was a Palestinian citizen in 1947,
   >>    and whose normal place of residence was Jordan at the time of
   >>    passage of this law.

   >>Note that Jordan in (ii) then included the WB according to Jordanian
   >>law.  This is from memory, so some details might be wrong.  I am
   >>certain that Jews were expressly excluded in part (ii); this was
   >>claimed to be in retaliation for Israel's Law of Return.

   >Funny how Israel didn't expressly exclude Arabs from being citizens.

   Funny how I didn't say anything about Jordan expressly excluding
   Jews from being citizens.

You are right, you didn't.  I suspect that that restriction comes from
earlier citizenship laws.

I have read that is a capital offense to sell property to a Jew in
Jordan.  I cannot imagine how Jews could be Jordanian citizens.

--
Stewart M. Clamen			Internet:    clamen@cs.cmu.edu
School of Computer Science		UUCP: 	     uunet!"clamen@cs.cmu.edu"
Carnegie Mellon University		Phone: 	     +1 412 268 2145
5000 Forbes Avenue			Fax:	     +1 412 681 5739
Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3891, USA
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:24675 talk.politics.soviet:10222 soc.culture.greek:12039 soc.culture.europe:11007 soc.history:10538 soc.culture.jewish:24552
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.history,soc.culture.jewish
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Armenians serving in the Wehrmacht and the SS.
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 93 20:04:43 EST
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <1i8tuoINNcj8@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> bv652@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ilan Uri Woll) writes:

>1. I AM NOT AN ISRAELI APOLOGIST, I am pro-Israel, but I recognize when it 

Very sensible. So you hate Muslims/Turks for ideological reasons 
regardless of what they do. A typical "arromdian". But, as early as 
1934, K. S. Papazian asserted in 'Patriotism Perverted' that the 
Armenian Revolutionary Federation (ARF) 

        'leans toward Fascism and Hitlerism.'[1]

At that time, he could not have foreseen that the Armenians would
actively assume a pro-German stance and even collaborate in World
War II. His book was dealing with the Armenian genocide of Turkish
population of eastern Anatolia. However, extreme rightwing ideological
tendencies could be observed within the Dashnagtzoutune long before
the outbreak of the Second World War.

In 1936, for example, O. Zarmooni of the 'Tzeghagrons' was quoted
in the 'Hairenik Weekly:' 

"The race is force: it is treasure. If we follow history we shall 
 see that races, due to their innate force, have created the nations
 and these have been secure only insofar as they have reverted to
 the race after becoming a nation. Today Germany and Italy are
 strong because as nations they live and breath in terms of race.
 On the other hand, Russia is comparatively weak because she is
 bereft of social sanctities."[2]

[1] K. S. Papazian, 'Patriotism Perverted,' (Boston, Baikar Press
   1934), Preface.
[2] 'Hairenik Weekly,' Friday, April 10, 1936, 'The Race is our
   Refuge' by O. Zarmooni.

Serdar Argic

                     'This war quickly developed into one of extermination. 
                      We closed the roads and mountain passes that might 
                      serve as ways of escape for the Tartars [Turks] and 
                      then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)

Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Deportation vs. Murder
Date: 11 Jan 93 04:13:22 GMT
Organization: Princeton University
Originator: news@nimaster

In article <1iptmiINN97r@life.ai.mit.edu> gwydion@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Mercenary Programmer) writes:
>In article <SHAIG.93Jan9012801@vivaldi.think.com> shaig@vivaldi.think.com (Shai Guday) writes:
>
>>Until you produce some source or reference that butresses your claim,
>>more than a foreign language linguist, I see no point in continuing this.

>From the Random House College Dictionary:

>an-ti (an/ti, an/te) n., pl. -tis. Informal. a person opposed to a
>particular policy, action, etc.

>Sem-ite (sem'it or esp. Brit., semit) 1. A member of any of various
>ancient and modern peoples originating in SW Asia, among whom are
>the Hebrews and Arabs. 2. A Jew. 3. a member of any of the peoples
>supposedly descended from Shem.

>The meaning derived for "anti-Semite" by using the above does not
>conflict with the meaning that you posted.  In fact the meaning you
>posted is just a subset of derived meaning.  All that you have been
>abe to show is that Jews have been given special treatment by the
>people who claim to be the guardians of the English language.  This
>is neither surprising nor interesting.

Look up the meanings of the term "anti" and "dote," and try to put them
together to get the meaning of "antidote."

You can't do it.

Any more than you can do what you're trying to do.  English is NOT
logically consistent.  It is driven by usage, not etymology.  And since
Anti-Semite was coined to mean hatred towards Jews, and used that way
for 100+ years, that's what it means.

-- 
David M. Nieporent   | "We don't need anymore [sic] wretched refuse.  It's 
niepornt@phoenix.    |  time to send the Statue of Liberty somewhere else"
   princeton.edu     |      -- Jack "Not a bigot" Schmidling, 1/7/93
Baltimore Orioles 93 |
From: shaig@Think.COM (Shai Guday)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: News from the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip.
Date: 8 Jan 1993 14:52:12 GMT
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.think.com

In article <29974@castle.ed.ac.uk>, jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson) writes:
|> 
|> You're forgetting, Makowsky knows *everything*. There are lots more where he
|> comes from, that's why they don't need to bother with trials in Israel.

Sorry to tell you but Makowsky lives in the United States.  As a pro-
kahanist his views are considered to be no more than fringe views by
the majority of the Israeli population.  Therefore, your statement
in regard to Israel is needlessly inflammatory.

-- 
Shai Guday              | Knowing martial arts allows one to remain calm when
OS Software Engineer    | confronted by idiots, secure in the knowledge that
Thinking Machines Corp. | you could dismember them easily, while you calmly
Cambridge, MA           | proceed to dismember them easily.
From: gwydion@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Mercenary Programmer)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: JLE IS STILL ON
Date: 10 Jan 93 19:37:38 GMT
Organization: Free Software Foundation
NNTP-Posting-Host: spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu

In article <4898@copper.Denver.Colorado.EDU> aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa) writes:
>(I can see it now:  Salam, ya houriyat ... you haven't SEEN jihad yet!)

Sick.  Sick.  Sick.  :-)
From: aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: jews as a race
Date: 10 Jan 93 19:22:50 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado at Denver

In article <1993Jan9.124204.4511@ifi.uio.no> michaelp@ifi.uio.no (Michael Schalom Preminger) writes:
>
>The zionist movement was  aiming to build a home for a group
>of people that BY FATE were jews, and as such homeless and under a 
>continuous threat.

True.  Except they forgot, upon establishing such a home, the basic
priniciples and philosophy of human rights.  They forgot the years of
suffering that they endured under Nazism, by enacting similar racist
and ruthless policies against the hundreds of thousands of Arabs whom
they drove off the land.

>I think concepts should be held apatrt.  

How can you believe in the state of Israel under religious precepts if
you maintain a secularist point of view?  They are definitely held
apart by different ideologies.  If you want to believe in a state for
all Jews on a secularist level, do not use historical biblical claims
to justify your existance in Palestine.  On the other hand, if you wish
to believe in and uphold religious standards to support this state, it
would be more legitimate, although the Bible never stated that Jews would
always live in the Land of Milk and Honey, and it had its stipulations -
based on unshakeable belief in God and in practicing His Laws and Commandments.
 
>Zionism was not a religious movement, and is not a "modern form of Judaism"
> Many people that identify themselves as zionists are not happy for the israeli
> governments politics.

This reminds me of an article that I read where the author stated that
Israel (Zionism) has replaced the religion of Jews in this country.

>I share your feelings, but you must remember that zionism was 
>responding to a world situation where human love was not exactly the
>dominating power.

And, in turn, it enacted policies where human love and respect for other
cultures was not the dominating factor(s).  This is, indeed, very tragic
for a people whom had been oppressed for so many centuries, that they are
so insensitive towards others.

Anisa
	"For a person who takes a step, in the pursuit
	of truth and righteousness, all that happens
	is good."
From: cpr@igc.apc.org (Center for Policy Research)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: israel as asset
Date: 11 Jan 93 01:40:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:1993Jan9.1777.22304@channel1:-1829802906:cdp:1483500320:000:360
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!cpr    Jan 10 17:40:00 1993



It has been hinted by someone that deportations are sometimes legal
and can be resorted to by any country.

I would like to have references to legislations of democratic
states which permit deportation. can someone help ?

as much as I know, deportations are considered a war crime, but
it seems  the the learned judges of the Israeli High Court
don't agree.
From: adam@endor.uucp (Adam Shostack)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Cat Steven's visit to Israel (& concert!)
Date: 6 Jan 93 18:51:39 GMT
Organization: Aiken Computation Lab, Harvard University

In article <1i9iu6INN9m6@early-bird.think.com> shaig@Think.COM (Shai Guday) writes:
>In article <1993Jan4.033754.4597@newshub.ccs.yorku.ca> you write:

>>You cannot enter any Arab country with an Israeli entry stamp on your
>>passport.  Until you can prove, with some legitimate sources, your
>>above statement, we can understand this to be a pure propoganda piece
>>that contains no credibility.

>Are you sure that the above holds true for Jordan?  I seem to remember
>friends leaving for Amman by way of the bridge...

Yes, Jordan allows this through a loophole in the border laws.  Since
they do not recognise Israels existance, there is not a border with
Israel.  Passprt control registers you as entering the country in
whatever town you end up in (depends on the bridge).  They ignore
where you entered from.  This can cause problems when you travel to
other Arab countries, which know what entry stamps exist when someone
enters Jordan via Israel. [1]  The way to avoid this problem is to fly
into Jordan.

[1] Israel, in an effort to make life easier on travellers, will stamp
your passort on a removable sheet.  Once you leave Israel, you discard
the visa, and there is no way to determine you've been there.  Cuba
does the same thing, to allow Americans to visit Cuba, against the
wishes of the US government.

Adam

Adam Shostack 					adam@das.harvard.edu

What a terrible thing to have lost one's .sig.  Or not to have a .sig
at all.  How true that is.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: bf3833@pyuxe.uucp (80010-feigenbaum)
Subject: Re: israel vs. the world
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Distribution: talk
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 93 21:27:58 GMT
Summary: U.S. and Israel


Wayne,

You seem to have a lot of facts about the U.S./Israel relationship.
Bearing in mind what you know, do you really think Israel would be
the only "loser" if the U.S. "changed its policies", i.e., cut off
aid, stopped supplying arms, etc.?

If you think Israel is behaving barbarically now, what do you think
she would do if she were not handcuffed by the U.S.?  Specifically, 
how would Israel react to Arab agression if she couldn't rely on
America supplying her with conventional arms?

And don't forget - the end of the U.S./Israel relationship would 
probably bring down the government of the limp-wristed Rabin.  His 
replacement would probably be more "agressive" in defending Jews
against Arab murderers.

Just some food for thought.

Ben Feigenbaum
From: flax@frej.teknikum.uu.se (Jonas Flygare)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Jeremy and kindler, gentler democracy (was drivel about Deportations)
Date: 7 Jan 1993 11:34:18 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Control and Systems, Teknikum, Uppsala
Distribution: world
Reply-To: flax@mizar.docs.uu.se
NNTP-Posting-Host: frej.teknikum.uu.se

In article <29949@castle.ed.ac.uk>, jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson) writes:

[stuff deleted]

|> It always gives me a good laugh to see comments on Northern Ireland from
|> dimwits across the herring pond. Compare and contrast:

|> The Birmingham Six: Mistakenly imprisoned after a trial, later released after
                                                            ^^^^^
It's nice, the way you make it sound like it was a short while after, that 
someone discovered that 'oops, we made a mistake' not _several years_..
|> much public outrage and serious examination of the judicial system.

|> The Lebanon FourHundredAndEighteen: Deported in contravention of the Geneva
|> Convention, without any trial whatsoever, to overwhelming public support, and
|> rubber-stamped by the Israeli Kangaroo^H^H^H^H^H^H^H Supreme Court.

See above. Say, should we wait one or two years in this case?? Also, where is 
your reference to the _approval_ by the ISC, that does not correlate to what I 
have read.

|> Ghaza Strip: A place where little girls throw stones.

You have been to Gaza, I hear..

|> Belfast: A place where armed men leave Semtex.

And we all know what 'Irish confetti' is, right?

--------------------------------------------------------
Jonas Flygare, 		+ Wherever you go, there you are
V{ktargatan 32 F:621	+
754 22 Uppsala, Sweden	+
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:25107 soc.culture.greek:12155 soc.history:10628
From: bv652@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ilan Uri Woll)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: What is this doing on page 15
Date: 4 Jan 1993 07:38:26 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: bv652@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ilan Uri Woll)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu

I was reading the San Francisco Chronicle, when I saw this article.
Jan 1 1993

The story was about Egypts recent raids arresting el Islamiya members,
so far they have arrested over 700.

My question is:  Why is this on page 15?
                 Why isn't CNN covering this?

Israel deports 415, it's on page 1 of every paper in the country, and the 
lead TV story.

Why doesn't Egypt punishing terrorists rate the same newsworthyness of 
Israel punishing terrorists?

Can You say "hypocrisy" boys and girls?
-- 
---  !      ^    !\  !
 !   !     /-\   ! \ !
___  !__  /   \  !  \!  
                        Avoid cliches like the plague" George Shaw
From: jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Jeremy and kindler, gentler democracy (was drivel about Deportations)
Date: 7 Jan 93 09:43:23 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

In article <17810@umd5.umd.edu> spinoza@next06wor.wam.umd.edu (Yon Bonnie Laird of Cairn Robbing) writes:
~
~Oh, but according to you,Jerry,  they have. If what you say is true , then  
~the only thing the Israelis are guilty of is taking a page from the  
~domestic policy manual of the UK for Northern Ireland. 

It always gives me a good laugh to see comments on Northern Ireland from
dimwits across the herring pond. Compare and contrast:

The Birmingham Six: Mistakenly imprisoned after a trial, later released after
much public outrage and serious examination of the judicial system.

The Lebanon FourHundredAndEighteen: Deported in contravention of the Geneva
Convention, without any trial whatsoever, to overwhelming public support, and
rubber-stamped by the Israeli Kangaroo^H^H^H^H^H^H^H Supreme Court.

Ghaza Strip: A place where little girls throw stones.

Belfast: A place where armed men leave Semtex.







-- 
===Jeremy Henderson===jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk=          

This message cost the net hundreds if not thousands of dollars.
Bloody good value if you ask me.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Subject: Re: israel vs. the world
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 93 01:15:55 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.150956.14128@ncsu.edu> hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem) writes:

>It is not so much the individual soldiers who are to blame but rather
>the occupation itself. The superiors who send soldiers into situations
>where they are not needed and for which they are accomplishing nothing
>but stirring up resentment and anger are the ones who are ultimately
>responsible, in my opinion. 

By the same token, Americans and the UN should get the hell out of
Somalia and let them sort things out for themselves.  And they should
stay out of Bosnia for the same reasons.  Your logic is flawed.

>Furthermore, because these soldiers are protecting no Palestinians 

I spoke to an Israeli soldier who served in Gaza just a few weeks ago.
He told me that the local Arabs are constantly running to the Israeli
soldiers seeking protection from the PLO and Hamas murderers who
terrorize them.

>The Israeli government should end the occupation and should allow the
>locals to police themselves. 

When the Israelis let the Arabs police themselves, the blood will
really begin to flow.  If you don't believe it, look at any Arab state
in the Middle East to see how right I am.  

-- 
Jake Livni  jake@bony1.bony.com              10 years from now, George Bush will
American-Occupied New York                   have replaced Jimmy Carter as the
My opinions only - employer has no opinions. standard of a failed President.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast