HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: SIG 226 9mm
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:16:36 GMT
Organization: The Cat Factory

In article <1992Oct10.024605.23678@newshub.sdsu.edu> ucsd!sdsu!hercules.SDSU.EDU!news@uunet.UU.NET (Alan Young) writes:
}I saw a movie called FEDS (with beautiful Rebecca DeMornay) not too long ago 
}and in one scene they had SIG 226 (not 100% sure about the model number) 9mm. 
}I gathered from the dialogue that this handgun is a very good one, able to 
}handle different load powers, so on and so forth. It was a great looking gun 
}indeed.
}Can anybody shed light about what this gun is, the exact model, how good it
}really is and where I can write to get a manual?

I didn't see the film, but anyone who owns a SIG P226 will be happy to
tell you they're one of the finest combat pistols made.  My only complaint
about mine is it's a bit large for concealed carry.  Otherwise, it's very
accurate and _extremely_ reliable (no jams of any kind in over 1000
rounds).  Contrary to popular non-wisdom, they can handle +p ammunition
loaded within SAAMI maximums.

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@polymath.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                   Turn the rascals out!
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483     No incumbents in '92!
Santa Monica, CA  90405
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Remington 870 magazine extenders?
Date: 10 Oct 92 13:39:26 GMT
Organization: The Cat Factory


I've finally decided on the shotgun I want.  On advice of a couple of LAPD
SWAT team members, I'm getting the model they carry:  A Remington 870 with
assorted aftermarket options (side-car, rifle sights, parkerized finish,
sling and associated hardware, flashlight built into fore-end).

A local shop is selling them complete for $699, but I figure I can put one
together myself for about $550 (those flashlights are expen$ive -- about
$100 for a good one.  Pointers to less expensive sources appreciated).

My only concern is for the relatively short magazine (4+1).  I'd like to
get a magazine extender, preferably from Remington, if they make one, and
preferably not requiring a gunsmith to install.  Anyone know of such a
beast?

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@polymath.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                   Turn the rascals out!
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483     No incumbents in '92!
Santa Monica, CA  90405

[MODERATOR:  Let me also toss in a request for info from anyone who knows
how to set up a ghost-ring sight on the 870, other than just buying the
whole gun as a Gunsite special.]
From: bercov@bevsun.bev.lbl.gov (John Bercovitz)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Sources of criminals' guns; was (Re: Lies and statistics)
Date: 9 Oct 92 23:39:37 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, California

In article <19294@smoke.brl.mil> gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes:

#In the case of criminal/police weapon preferences, to a large
#extent the correlation can be explained by a combination of
#what is readily available on the market (including what is
#stolen from gun stores, in the case of criminal weapons), and
#effectiveness of various weapons with regard to criteria that
#would not be too different for police vs. criminals, such as
#availability of ammo, man-stopping power, portability, etc.

Doug brings to mind a point I've been curious about for a very long
time: Has anyone studied the sources of criminals' guns?  Percentagewise,
how many guns in criminal hands are stolen from thee and me, how many
are bought outright because the DOJ didn't properly check out the
applicant, how many are bought illegally from private parties, how many 
are stolen from armories or smuggled across the border? 

John Bercovitz     (JHBercovitz@lbl.gov)
From: cmk0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (CHRISTOPHER MARK KULP)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: question on compact guns in 007-james-bond movie
Date: 11 Oct 92 23:13:23 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

In article <19298@smoke.brl.mil>, gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes:
#
#In article <1992Oct3.004947.5470@latcs1.lat.oz.au> jd@latcs1.lat.oz.au (John Di
mogotsis) writes:
#-      In the latest "007" movie "Lisence to kill" Bond works with a CIA
#-opperative called 'Bouvier' who is a nice looking girl who carries 'two'
#-very small compact semi-autos, one in her purse and on the inside of her
#-right thigh (one advantage for a dress!).
#
#Nah -- that's the first place I'd look!
#
Seeing that movie inspired me to consider a buying a small semi-automatic.
After examining what was available, I decided on the small Baretta, .22
caliber.  It feels and shoots great, and is ideal for carrying (what other gun
can you slip right into your pocket).  It has a .25 caliber twin, but I
believe that the .22 is fine - after all, why pay extra for an odd and more
expensive caliber.  The only thing I changed was to use white enamel on the
sights.

Oh yeah, I re-watched the 007 movie, and I believe that she was carrying the
.25 nickel plated versions.
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------
===========
=         =
 =       =
  =    =
    ==
From: viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Carrying while hunting - CCW
Date: 14 Oct 92 12:08:39 GMT
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA

morlan@afit.af.mil (Bruce W. Morlan) writes:

#In Ohio (and I presume elsewhere), when you are hunting an in season
#animal (say, deer with a black powder rifle), you are not allowed to carry
#a second gun (e.g., a 357 pistol), presumably to keep you from using the
#"more accurate" weapon to actually make the kill.

	This is indeed the reasoning, but you should check with your
local DNR, including the game wardens and not the front desk alone,
about laws in your specific area.  Rabbits and squirrel are not, I've
been told, subject to this law when in season, but deer are.  As I've
noted before, I always carry a pistol while hunting for the express
purpose of having a bit more security running off tresspassers.  The
game wardens I've talked to have accepted this reasoning.

	Just a thought: if you're hunting black powder, are black
powder pistols legal to carry too?  It would see that hunting with
two guns is not illegal, so how would this be ruled?  Most likely for
the worse, but it's a thought to ponder.  So long as you're not
"cheating" I don't see the problem.

<Dan Sorenson, DoD #1066 |"I see angels on Ariels in leather and>
<z1dan@exnet.iastate.edu | chrome, Swooping down from heaven to >
<viking@iastate.edu      | carry me home."   ---    R. Thompson >
<ISU thinks I need more education, which they provide for a fee.>
From: n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Wife and Guns
Date: 8 Oct 92 00:54:34 GMT
Organization: Western Washington University

C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob) writes:

#I gave my wife a few catalogs to look through and recommended that
#she pick a .22 (thanks to all who suggested that - I should know
#better than to start her out on something bigger).
#Her choice - The Taurus Model 94 .22 revolver.  Nine shots, stainless
#with a 4" barrel and adjustable sights.
#Before I order one, could someone post their opinions on the gun?
#Thanks!

If what you want is a .22 LR revolver, I can't think of a better
gun to buy.  I can't say this as an owner, but I spent a long time
looking at different choices for a future purchace, and this one 
is the best, imo.  Owners have told me they are happy with them.
I prefer the 3" stainless version, but I can't think of why not
to get the 4" either.  Get them both!  %^)

Jim Del Vecchio
From: joe@decoy.uoregon.edu (Joe St Sauver)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: API Intro Pistol Class, Albany, OR, Oct 31-Nov 1
Date: 15 Oct 92 23:58:41 GMT
Organization: University of Oregon Network Services

Jeff Cooper's American Pistol Institute is offering their API
Intro Pistol Craft Clinic at the Albany (Oregon) Rifle and 
Pistol Club, October 31st-November 1st, 8-5 PM each day. The
clinic will require about 300 rounds, and costs $300 plus a 
$15 range fee. For more information, contact Larry at 
(503)-632-6839. 

They need a minimum of 12 people to proceed (but no more than
24). If you are interested (but not right now) you might still
want to get in touch with Larry since the class may be 
rescheduled for some time in the spring if it doesn't get the
required enrollment in time for this fall.

For those of you not familiar with Oregon, Albany is about 
half way between Eugene and Portland on I-5. Not exactly a 
tourist mecca in and of itself (except perhaps during Albany's 
annual timber festival), but the coast is maybe an hour
to the west, and the mountains/Willamette National Forest is
about an hour to the east. 

Any shooters with more time than money who live within
commuting distance of Eugene, Oregon, can also drop me a note
if they'd like some information about a 42 hour introductory
handgun training class that's available through Lane Community
College here in Eugene; this course includes 12 hours of 
range time on three weekends (you shoot about 500 rounds), and
satisfies Oregon Concealed Handgun License application
requirements. The LCC course is taught by Mike Steen.

Mike Steen and LCC also periodically offer an intermediate 
handgun course which includes actual night firing, an 
introduction to IPSC and other shooting sports, an introduction
to handloading and additional material not covered in the
introductory course.

Joe St Sauver (joe@oregon.uoregon.edu)
From: keith@scorpio.ic.cmc.ca (Keith de Solla)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Hi-Power parts
Date: 14 Oct 92 12:08:42 GMT
Organization: Canadian Microelectronics Corporation

Does anyone know a good source of replacement/performance parts
for Browning Hi-Powers??

Also, does someone make IPSC type holsters specifically for the 
Hi-Power, or will one for a Colt 1911 style pistol work?
(I know, I know, all REAL competitors use a 1911 in .45 or .38super
well, I'm Canadian, eh, and the hi-power is our service pistol and
I like it, and I'm buying a second one. So there.  :-) :-)  :-)  )
(and the Moderator would say???  "good! buy another hi-power, AND
a .45 1911, AND a .38super 1911, AND..........")


-------------------------------------------------------------------
| Keith P. de Solla        | "I don't enforce the law, I regulate |
| CMC                      |  human behaviour"                    |
| keith@orion.ic.cmc.ca    |    - Commissioner Scali              |
From: futrena@wkuvx1.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: sniper rifle in 'Navy seals' movie?
Date: 8 Oct 92 00:53:04 GMT
Organization: Western Kentucky University, Bowling Green, KY

In article <92280.121704U53734@uicvm.uic.edu>, U53734%uicvm.uic.edu@OHSTVMA.ACS.
OHIO-STATE.EDU (Wesley Bielinski) writes:
# I love movies, too bad they're unrealistic.  The weapon is real, the effects
# of the round were unreal and the scope was pure SF (that is, Science Fiction).
#
# Wesley J. Bielinski                    | "I love my country,
# SGT, USAR       U53734@uicvm.uic.edu   |   it's my government I fear!"
# 12th Special Forces Group (Airborne)   |
#      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I agree with you on that one.  Then again, I have also heard that the
government and its technology is always at least one step ahead of
what they admit they have.  The stealth fighter is a good example.
For a while, the government denied its existence.  However, there were
pictures taken of the fighter on its "test" (yeah, right) flights over
the western part of the US.

On the other hand, I rather not know about those things, because the
government would have to "silence" me.
--
+===============================================================+
|Nathan Futrell                 |DangerMouse:  Penfold...       |
|futrena@WKUVX1.BITNET          |Penfold:  Yes...?              |
|Western Kentucky University    |DM:  SHUSH!                    |
|Bowling Green, KY USA          |P:  Oh, Ick!                   |
+===============================================================+
From: sykes@donner.cc.bellcore.com (sykes,michael)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Where can I get spare mags in Eastern PA area or mail order
Date: 12 Oct 92 16:48:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: tbird.199210121547.AA29258

Here is my second post to the group.

[AI thank everyone for their response on the first one "what's the restriction
on carry in public places". Anyway here's a second question:

I have a Taurus PT58 (I saw the stories on the trouble one guy had with his)
and I wanted to get extra magazienes (sp?) for it. does anyone know of
any places in Eastern PA that stock or can order extra mags?? I'm not
opposed to mail ordering a mag so I'll welcome any mail order addresses too.

Thanks ,

michael
From: wwarf@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Wayne J. Warf)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Wife and Guns
Date: 8 Oct 92 00:52:46 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

In article <9210071139.AA23695@mimsy.cs.UMD.EDU> C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob) writes:
#I gave my wife a few catalogs to look through and recommended that
#she pick a .22 (thanks to all who suggested that - I should know
#better than to start her out on something bigger).
#
#Her choice - The Taurus Model 94 .22 revolver.  Nine shots, stainless
#with a 4" barrel and adjustable sights.
#
#Before I order one, could someone post their opinions on the gun?

I've been considering buying one also. They're very nice little 
revolvers, well built and accurate. A friend has one and I've used it on 
occasion. I'd reccommend it.

-- 
 +--------------------------------------------------------------------+
 | Wayne J. Warf -- WWARF@ucs.indiana.edu -- I speak for myself only  |
 |"Government is like fire, a dangerous servant and a fearful master" |
 +--------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: dd@ra.cs.umb.edu (Dave Dunbrack)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Citizenship ?
Date: 11 Oct 92 15:36:25 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston, Dept of Math and CS

In article <1992Oct5.160318.2042@walter.bellcore.com> bellcore!bae.bae.bellcore.com!wind@uunet.UU.NET (Wind Chen) writes:
#I live in NJ, therefore speak for NJ only.
[...]
#A legal alien on permanent resident status has the same right as
#a Citizen, as far as the firearms ID is concerned.  Procedure is
[...]

  Again, the People's Republic of Massachusetts has regulations which few
if any other states (not even NJ!) deem necessary. Citizens living in Ma. 
need an FID to purchase long guns, but resident aliens cannot apply for
an FID. Most resident aliens thus wrongly believe that they cannot become
gun owners. Ma. law has a provision which will let resident (I'm not sure
about non-resident) aliens buy firearms, by getting a special permit which
must be renewed on a yearly basis. I believe that the local police chief
is the issuing authority just as in pistol permits, so it may be impossible
to get one in some towns and easy in others. I can double check this (ie.
who issues it, and status for non-res aliens) if anyone is interested.

	Dave
From: pyro@wpi.WPI.EDU (Stephen D Tomas)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: SKS for sale in MA
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:15:23 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute


I have an SKS 7.62x39 rifle that I bought about 2 months ago.  When
I purchased it it was new/unissued (read NOT reconditioned).  I also
bought a case (1360 rounds) of East German surplus ammo to go with it.
I have 1280 rounds left.

I took the gun to my gun club's range (80 yds) and found it very easy
to keep good groupings.  The gun has an attached, folding, bayonet, a 
sling, an ammo belt, and a field cleaning kit that stores in the stock.

Problem:  Money this year at school is much tighter than I expected it 
          to be, so I will be taking offers on this.

IF YOU LIVE IN MA, YOU MUST HAVE A MA FID CARD TO PURCHASE THIS!
Also, you should bring a MA blue transfer card (from the police station)
to complete the transfer.

Send replies email or call 508 798-3991.
Steve Tomas
pyro@wpi.wpi.edu


p.s.  I will respond to all offers and I will not flame you for a 
	low offer (I also will not give the gun away).
From: dlamber@andy.bgsu.edu (Don Lambert)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: What does Magnum mean?
Date: 8 Oct 92 21:56:13 GMT
Organization: BGSU University Computer Services

In article <9210081313.AA12341@flubber.cs.UMD.EDU>,
kunz@avalon.physik.unizh.ch (kunz peter) wrote:
# 
# In article <1992Sep28.120627.22022@email.tuwien.ac.at> holger@vmars.tuwien.ac.at (Holger Reusch (Dipl. Gerhard + Joe)) writes:
# #
# #The cartridge was called ".357 Magnum", with .357 reflecting the bullet
# #diameter (in principle the same as for .38 Special, the ".38" must have
# #been a marketing hype :-).
# #
# maybe calculators weren't very exact yet :-)
# 

To tell the truth .38 Special is .358 diameter. Very often .357 and .358
bullets are interchanged. Next type you buy a box of bullets (not ammo) ask
for .358 and .357. Load them the same and see which shoots better for you.

I personally have a .357 Mag that likes .358 bullets.


Don Lambert
University Computer Services
Bowling Green State University
        	       	       	       	       	       	
INTERNET : dlamber@andy.bgsu.edu
From: cvalj001@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu (Daemon Hobbs)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: SKS full length scope
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:24:00 GMT
Organization: Cal Poly Geography


  Are there any full length scope mount kits for the SKS out there?  I don't
mean the small pistol scopes but rather a full length scope.
-- 
---
Daemon E. Hobbs, Cadet, AFROTC
Senior, (Carto/RS/GIS) 
Cal Poly Pomona Geography Dept.
Email: cvalj001@csupomona.edu
Phone: 714-869-3590
From: biocca@bevsun.bev.lbl.gov (Alan K Biocca)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .40 S&W Help Sought
Date: 8 Oct 92 00:53:09 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, California

In article <9210061503.aa06869@sco1.qdeck.com> burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge) writes:
#In article <1992Oct2.163801.11217@henson.cc.wwu.edu> n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:
##gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes:

##What I don't like about the glock is the fact that you don't get a
##second chance on a misfire.

#On my 17 (the Glock17 being built for carbine primers) the dent is
#_so_ savage that I don't care.  If it didn't go off the first time - 
#another shot like that won't do any good...

Inspecting the dent of a fired case doesn't give a very accurate sense of
what the firing pin did - the dynamics of the cartridge going off change
the look of things considerably.  There is some information there, but
several factors are involved..  To illustrate this fire an empty primed
case sometime and take a look.  The times I've done this the dent has been
far less impressive..

NOTE: Firing an empty primed case produces a surprisingly loud noise, ear
and eye protection and normal firing safety precautions are advised...

Alan K Biocca
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Loaded Clips
Date: 10 Oct 92 13:39:18 GMT
Organization: The Cat Factory

In article <tmi.718437304@well.sf.ca.us> tmi@well.sf.ca.us (Peter Kasler) writes:
}In <9209300801.aa11961@sco1.qdeck.com> burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge) writes:
}
}#In article <1992Sep25.015920.1974@odin.corp.sgi.com> barnes@cowboys.esd.sgi.com (Jim Barnes) writes:
}##If I have my clip loaded but out of the gun, the gun is still considered
}##loaded.
}##Right?
}##Now what if I have a unloaded clip in the gun and a loaded clip near
}##by???????
}##Am I still in trouble?????
}
}#In California, you still would be in trouble.  The rule of thumb being
}#immediate access to both gun and ammo at the same time.  Granted I have
}#broken this thumb on many occaisions.  They are supposed to be separate
}#and locked.
}
}	Not true! The law in California is very clear and well-settled
}on this point, despite the fact that numerous "experts" and cops don't
}know what is legal and what is not.
}
}	PC 12031 says, in plain English: no ammunition can be in or
}attached in any manner to the firearm. Period. A loaded magazine (or,
}for that matter, ammunition in any form) that is _not_ in or attached to 
}the gun can be in the same container as the gun without any violation
}of the law.

Alas, 'tain't necessarily so.  Regardless of how we ordinary citizens
think the law _should_ be interpreted, individual jurisdictions, judges
and police officers have their own ideas.  I was recently told of a case
where a judge ruled a man in violation for having a _speedloader_ in close
proximity to his pistol.  Up 'til then _everyone_ I'd talked to thought
that speedloaders weren't a problem because they couldn't possibly be
considered part of the gun.

}	Urban myth notwithstanding, if someone is arrested for
}violating PC 12031 (having a loaded gun in a public place without a
}CCW) because he or she had an empty gun in the same container as one
}or more loaded magazines or ammunition in any other form, and no other
}facts exist to complicate the matter, dismissal of charges should be
}rather routine and not difficult.

What should be and what is are very different things.  Even if you're
right, being a test case can be incredibly expensive and time consuming.

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@polymath.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                   Turn the rascals out!
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483     No incumbents in '92!
Santa Monica, CA  90405
From: bbx!bbxrbk!russ@unmvax.cs.unm.edu (Russ Kepler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Spent brass lead hazard... test kit found lead
Date: 8 Oct 92 00:53:45 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <1992Oct7.043102.10356@michael.apple.com> ems@michael.apple.com (E. Michael Smith) writes:
#My guess is that handling fired brass is a significant risk and that
#it is well worth it to find lead free primers, especially if you 
#shoot alot.  Some kind of brass pre-tumbling wash/rinse is probably
#a Very Good Thing.  (But what?)  Handling lead bullets is most likely
#something to wash up well after.  Handling a lot of brass, even clean
#brass, ought to warrant a hand wash too, since naked brass registers
#with a lead content. 

As a reloader and a bullet caster, I'll have to disagree with you.  I
reload hundreds of rounds a month mostly with my own cast bullets.  I
handle alloyed lead and spent cases on a daily basis, and recently had
my blood lead level checked.  It came in about 1/3 of the way up the
scale to the point where there would be some concern.  To me the risk
isn't there.

As a point in interest: you're likely using a lead test designed to
detect lead in ceramic glazes.  These tests are going to be very
sensitive to veryl low lead levels.  That is quite suitable to
detecting lead in plates and bowls - you eat from them.  Most of us
don't eat from our brass cases or shotgun hulls.

I'd say that your tests show that one should definitely wash your
hands before eating after handling cases (loaded or unloaded) and
after any trip to the range.  I would agree fully with that assessment
(and usually wash my hands before leaving with water from a gallon
jug).

But extending that to an attempt to replace your primers with some
unknown lead free primers is, in my opinion, a bit of a stretch.  If
you find lead free primers at the same price as the current primers,
and they're even close to the same reliability I'll change over, but
not at triple the price.  (Double?  we can argue anout that later...)

-- 
Russ Kepler, posting from home
Will hack unix for food 		(.sig stolen from dt - sorry, dt)