HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Children in the sca
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 21:32:00 -0500

 On 12-14-92 LADY GUINEVERE wrote to DIANE PILKINGTON... 
<lines deleted> 
 LG> DP>From: Diane.Pilkington@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Diane Pilkington) 
 LG> 
 LG> DP> [he confirms that he won't allow anyone under the age of 25 to 
 LG> stay 
 LG> DP> in his encampment at wars] 
 LG> DP> DY> From experience we have found that young people should camp 
 LG> with other 
 LG> DP> DY> young people or with their parents. 
 LG> 
 LG> DP> I am 24 years old. I object strongly to the above statement 
 LG> DP> on the following grounds: 
 LG> 
 LG> DP> (b) I actively dislike the company of people "my own age"; as 
 LG> DP> a general rule, they are a rowdy, shallow, thoughtless lot. 
 LG> DP> Emphasis is on -rowdy-. I have always gotten along much better 
 LG> DP> with people who are at least five years older than I. I would 
 LG> 
 LG> I agree.  then there are those who enjoy the company of yournger 
 LG> "friends".  Not everyone is at the same itellectual, spiritual, or 
 LG> emotional age levels as prescribed by society.  I don't really like to 
 LG> hang around people of my own age either.  they tend to be stuffy and 
 LG> want to sit and watch T.V. all day. 
 LG> 
 LG> DP> Maturity should be the deciding factor, not a mere accident 
 LG> DP> of chronological age. 
 LG> 
 LG> Hear, Hear! 
 LG> Lady Guinevere 
 LG> ___ 
 
Greetings from Michael Fenwick to Lady Guinevere and H.L.Serena. 
 
My ladies, I could not agree more with you. The only problem I see 
is how to determine, quickly, without giving offense, and objectively, 
who is sufficiently mature for a given activity. This is, as we 
mathematicians say, "non-trivial". 
 
Michael Fenwick (Mike Andrews) 
 
 
... OFFLINE 1.42 * Barony of Namron, Kingdom of Ansteorra
From: Trebor
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: On the nature of armor....
Date: 21 Dec 1992 03:33:25 GMT
Organization: Middle Kingdom
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: cc210-3.cl.msu.edu

I've been in the society for 4 years and have been actively,seriously training
to fight since last april. I'm currently wearing a pickle bucket lourka (sp?)
under a tabard. I'm a college student w/o much money or time which greatly
affected my armor decisions. I don't like how the lourka looks,but it does give
adequate protection and it allows me to play. If I hadn't have been able to
purchase it, my helm and my leather legs for $40 from someone who quit the SCA
I doubt that I would be fighting now as I would not have had the time to make
armor. I am working on replacing this with a velveteen coat of plates w/plastic
plates. This won't be as authentic as steel plates,but has it's own advantages.
First off I can make it with the tools I have avilable, it's light so I will be
less likely to go down with a heat emergency at war (this is a large
concern,I've had problems in the past) and when im done It will look really
nice (if I do it right). I see SCA armoring as a balance between
safety,authenticity,looks, expense and the limits to my armoring skills ( which
are very,very basic). My new armor will meet my needs with out, i think,
offending others(by appearance) or giving me too much of an advantage over
others due to the lighter weight. I realize that I'm sacrificing the knowledge
I would gain by fighting in armor that was as authentic as I could make it, but
other considerations are more important too ME.

Trebor Stephenson
Barony of Northwoods
Middle Kingdom



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: cearr@cwis.unomaha.edu (Jesse C. Neese)
Subject: Re: Persona's vs. Person's Ethnicity (was Re: Through a looking glass, darkly)
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:08:44 GMT

        Greetings,

       I am CEARR MACBRENDAN, I am an Irishman of Celtic descent, this 
being the year 960.  I have spent my youth being trained by my 
grandfather in many arts( among my favorites are storytelling and 
art (visual-type), but now I am being trained in the arts of war
and it looks as though I may soon have to help defend my homeland.
      That was fun. I always like typing in Persona.  If that isn't
creative anachronism I don't know what is.  I am Jesse Neese. My
mother is a mix of heritages from the isles.  Mostly English, Welsh
and Irish with a little scottish (oh, I almost forgot, she is also about
half German.)My father is half Italian.  The other half is a mystery.
My grandfather was an orphan and all we can find out is that his name
was Neese.  That makes me 1/4th Italian, 1/4th German, 1/4th English,
Welsh, Irish and Scottish, and 1/4th whatever I want.  I usually
say Irish because I like it.


                                  CEARR MACBRENDAN
                               Lonely Tower, Calontir
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: cassie@worf.nas.nasa.gov (Cassandra L. Baldassano)
Subject: The SCA Religion? ( was: Through a looking glass, darkly)
Organization: NAS Program, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 21:02:48 GMT

Greetings from Euriol of Lothian

In article <cf=nwyC00WB9M2h3kc@andrew.cmu.edu>, David Schroeder <ds4p+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|>  
|> Fourth, I believe the SCA is particularly attractive to people who
|> are a bit "odd" by the standards of conventional society and that
|> the SCA functions as a supportive community for people who don't
|> have strong senses of "belonging" elsewhere.  Highly educated
|> blacks -- who might find the Society appealing -- might not need 
|> the SCA for their sense of community because they would tend to 
|> find it more in their families/religion, etc.
|>  
|> +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
|> Bertram of Bearington                                      Dave Schroeder
|> Debatable Lands/AEthelmearc/East               Carnegie Mellon University
|> INTERNET: ds4p@andrew.cmu.edu                         412/731-3230 (Home)
|> +------------------------ PREME * Press On * PREME ---------------------+
|>       "He indulged in every excess, yes in each licentious whim..." 

I have often consider that the SCA might be a "religion" to some people. But
by no means a conventional one. Often I hear of people talking about different
church socials, and how much of a community atmosphere they provide and a
sense of belonging. This is definitely one of the things that the SCA provides.
But the SCA also provides a set of guidelines, specifically the ideas of
Chivalry, Honor, Courtesy and Trust, which I believe almost make it a type
of "religion".

The biggest difference in the SCA as a "religion" as opposed to a standard
religion is that it doesn't conflict with most of the standard religions. That
is why there are so many people of different religious backgrounds in the SCA
(notably: Christians, Jews, Pagans, Muslims, etc.), and people like me who
claim no affliation with a religious organization.

I think I'll run and hide now.

Euriol
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: schuldy@progress.COM (Mark Schuldenfrei)
Subject: Re: Membership Money
Organization: Progress Software Corp.
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 13:58:42 GMT

comptec92024@camins.camosun.bc.ca writes:
  Could anyone tell me what happens to the money sent in for SCA memberships?
  I have been curious for a while, and I don't really buy the storie that it is
  spent on newsletters.

Ah, hostility towards authority, with no facts to go on.  Thanks for the chuckle.

It has been a while since the SCA Board of Directors has published a financial
statement, but that's OK: The budgeting process is done at the end of the
calendar year anyway, and published at the beginning.  Looking at the budget
projections published as notes from the April Board meeting (The projections
were completed June 2nd, 1992), here are some of the numbers for 1992 (projected):

  Total Income:   674,351
  Total expenses: 602,371
  Total income:	  71,980

  Plans for the income:
    Capital acquisitions:  12,500
    Stock Clerk inventory: 14,000
    addition to savings:   45,480

  Expenses (sample, not complete):
    Periodicals:  283,247
    Insurance      34,907
    Office in CA: 186,160 (rent, salaries, taxes)
    Board:         14,441
    Stock Clerk:   53,942

That's not too bad, actually.  For example, according to the latest TI, it
costs the SCA $1 an issue.  Newsletters eat up most of the rest, and
the Compleat Anachronist pamphlets and the Board Minutes are supposed to
be self supporting (in the sense that subscription costs cover all of it,
non-subscribers do not contribute toward them).

The large amount of the cost of the office in CA, is actually an inaccurate
gloss on my part: I lumped all salaries paid by the SCA under that
category.  Much of the salaries do go to the Registrar and staff, but
some is paid to TI editors.  Since these are jobs that can take most of
a workweek each week, this doesn't seem too unfair to me.

The Stock Clerk is an expensive proposition.  Typsetting a book can cost
$3,000 or more, and the cost of printing a run of 3,000 copies can
easily be $15,000 dollars.  And we keep several books in stock, as well
as back issues of the Compeat Anachronist and TI.

Did you have any more specific questions, or did these facts either satisfy
you or confirm your suspicions?

	Tibor
--
Mark Schuldenfrei (schuldy@progress.com)
[I'm just showin' you my opinions: this ain't a gift]
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 14:47:49 EST
From: Therion <HZS@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Rattan Sword-making
Distribution: rec

Parlan comments on my shrink-tubing question:

>I too use shrink tubing on my swords.  I find it about
>doubles the life of a stick to around 4 months.

A rattan sword only lasts you four months? Good Gods, man, how hard are you
folks hitting each other?  (only 1/2 smiley here.)

Actually, I'll make the guess that either 1) your source of rattan is coming
up with some *really* lousy stuff, or 2) you're using something like a
telephone pole wrapped in carpet for your pell.

In the case of #1, yeah, I can understand how it happens - last month I
borrowed a brand new zweihander from a friend, and Drakkar (a 380 lb fighter
using a greatsword) broke it when I straight blocked a cross-cutting rib shot.
We inspected the rattan, and found that not only was it quite dried out, but
the fibers inside were not very densly packed at all.  Rule of thumb for
checking rattan denseness - look at the end. The more closely packed the pores
are, the denser the rattan (roughly, your mileage will vary).

If it's case number 2, try using a suspended system for pell work. I use an
old football tacking dummy in a duffle bag, with a carabiner attached to the
top so that I can either attach it to a rope hanging from the tree in my
backyard for use or hook it to the ceiling in my workshop for storage.  Hitting
a solid non-moving pell will destroy a sword faster than drilling it out,
filling it with lead, and showing it to your Kingdom Earl Marshall will.

Now, if I gave you too much benefit of the doubt and you really hit hard enough
to pulp swords after four months usage, please send a description of yourself
and where you live so that I can hopefully avoid ever having you hit *this*
poor old body .... :) :) :) :).

                                          Therion

 //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
     internet:        ||    Therion Calgate     ||  I know some folks who say
 hzs@psuvm.psu.edu    || Mountain Confederation ||  that 14 ga helms last them
                      ||        Warlord         ||  less than a year. Yowtch.
   I said what?       ||   of House Decadence   ||
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
From: tbarnes@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas wrentmore barnes)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: HELP! name searching.
Date: 20 Dec 92 17:38:14 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

In article <466-JNEWS-2.1@smylex.UUCP> Godfrey de Shipbrook <jlee@smylex.UUCP> writes:
>Greetings from Godfrey!
>
>Bjalfi writes:
>>
>> If anyone reading this list is
>> trying to come up with a persona name, PLEASE dig up a copy of the
>> Decameron, the Canterbury Tales, Egil's Saga, the Tales of the Thousand
>> Nights and a Night, the Song of Roland, or whatever medieval literature
>> appeals to you, and read it through paying attention to names you like.
>> You can come up with truly lovely stuff that way, which is always a
>> Good Thing.
>
>Not only that; you can be entertained, and maybe even learn a little more 
>about the period you're interested in for your persona.
>

Also, most period literature tends to consist of short stories linked to
gether with a common theme. This makes them great for Bardic
Performances.  Another good book-full of period jokes, anecdotes and
advice on what to do and how to behave- is *The Courtier* by Bathazare
Castiglione. It is a must for any late period courtier persona and is
entertaining reading for virtually anyone else. (It was written at the
end of the 15th C. in Italy). At the very least, it gives you a sense of
just how old some of our jokes really are.

Other good books:

	Aesop's Fables
	The Golden Ass
	Piers Plowman  
	The Arabian Nights (His Grace, Cariadoc, has memorized at least
the first 7 tales of the Thousand Nights and a Night, he tells them at
Pennsic every year; one tale per night- great stuff! I'm not sure if he
knows the REST of the tales, since Pennsic breaks up before he tells the
eighth tale. Very clever, his Grace...:).

Lothar  \|/
         0
Organization: Doctoral student, Industrial Administration, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
From: andrew@bransle.ucs.mun.ca (Andrew Draskoy)
Subject: Seeking news of Constantine the Varangian
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 19:54:24 GMT

If anyone reading this knows the whereabouts of Constantine the Varangian,
(mka Lachlan MacQuarrie) founder of Ar n-Eilean-ne and Ice Valley, and most
recently (to my knowledge) of Lyndhaven, please contact me.

Miklos Sandorfia (mka Andrew Draskoy)
andrew@bransle.ucs.mun.ca
From: Longshot@f19.n291.z1.fidonet.org (Longshot)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Children in the SCA
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 22:02:01

A node called Beth Appleton, said to node Longshot,
about Children in the SCA, on 07 Dec 92  18:19:48.

 BA> Welcome to Ansteorra, where this Duchess got 
 BA> the idea we had to have 
 BA> things for kids to do, and officers to 
 BA> promulgate having things for
 BA> the  kids to do, and thus the Ministery of 
 BA> Children was birthed.......

 L>    I don't think that you would be much impressed if events were held 
 L> exclusively "male".

 BA> I would be just as annoyed if the autocrat specifically announced 
 BA> "Ladies' Activities".  If you have to hold specific stuff for the
 BA> kids,  then it implies that the rest is not open to them.  Far better
 BA> to just  figure out how to make the NORMAL activities child-open, than
 BA> essentially denigrating them by putting them in a special, segregated
 BA> class.

lo'
   Unfortunately, I did not state myself very well in this aspect.   Because
there are obviously some things that children can not participate in (the
most obvious being fighting), the Ministry of Children organizes activites that
almost anyone (certain rare exclusions for reasons that will not be discussed
here) can help participate in and are incouraged to.   We have had a very
successful program in this manner.

 BA> I will note that the founder was responding primarily to those 
 BA> children who are "dragged along" -- i.e., they are just there because
 BA> their parents are there, and they really have no interest of their
 BA> own.  Gwenllian Cwmystwyth

   Unfortunatly, there are situation like this that occur.   I was not aware of
the scope of the comment.   I think though that it is a bad idea to condem any
atempt at "childrens" activities because of some problems.   Baby with the
bathwater thinking if you ask me.
                                              - Aindries


 * Origin: Calontir -- We Deliver. (1:291/19.0)
From: sinister@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Not Re: Face-thrust force
Date: 12 Dec 92 22:56:30 -0400
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

In article <97w502C62ein01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com>, branwen@cerebus.ccc.amdahl.com (Karen Williams) writes:
> In article <1992Dec10.115241.9427@ac.dal.ca> sinister@ac.dal.ca writes:
>>	I agree....  I keep getting told "It was clean, straight in, but
>>it was light...".  
> 
> If you're talking about face-thrusts, I have a solution. Our armor standard
> for the kingdom (the West) is that we are wearing open-faced helms with a
> nasal. If we are thrust in the face, we're dead (no armor). This doesn't
> magically mean that any time a sword gets near a face, the person is dead,
> but it means that you don't need to worry about having to hit too hard or
> getting hit too hard when face-thrusting. 
> 
> Branwen ferch Emrys
> The Mists, the West
> 
> --
>                                           Karen Williams
>                                           branwen@cerebus.ras.amdahl.com

	I was speaking of a standard shot, not of thrusting.  Eastrealm (here),
if the helm moves, its good.... it's *hard* to strike light for a face-thrust.

	Cosmano
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: tbarnes@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas wrentmore barnes)
Subject: Re: Through a looking glass, darkly
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 16:53:18 GMT

In article <cf=nwyC00WB9M2h3kc@andrew.cmu.edu> David Schroeder <ds4p+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>Also, on yet another Bertram-esque semi-tangent...
>
>  How often do folks chose personas that are _connected_ to their
>  actual racial/ethnic background, versus the stereotypical 
>  "blond samurai" ?
>

Being Heinz 57 WASP myself, I chose a Rhenish German persona, partially
because of my ancestry. It was only later, when my father did more
genealogical research, that I learned that at least one of my ancestors
migrated from the region where my persona was from! Sometimes I think
there may be such a silly thing as race memory!

I think that SCA folk choose a persona based on one or more of 3
factors:

1) Search for roots - SCA can be an offshoot of "ethnic pride". I think
that this accounts for a certain number of "unusual" personas, like
Hungarians, Lithuanians, and some Jewish personas. I know of very few
East European personas created by people who do not have at least some
Slavic blood.  

2) Liked the Culture/Artifacts - At an extreme level you have people who
chose a period just because of the neat armor or weapons. It also
explains part of the fascination of the Celts, Japanese and Norse
cultures.

3) Historical High-point Culture - People like to pick a winner. That's
why 9 out of 10 Norse personas you meet lived between 900 and 1100 A.D.,
as opposed to pre- or post- "Viking" age. It also explains English 14th
C. Personas, Italian 15th C. personas and 16th C. Japanese.

Lothar \|/
        0
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Heraldic questions...
From: vnend@nudity.UUCP (David W. James)
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 92 15:51:50 -0500
X-Mailer: Fernmail 1.1

parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr) writes:
> Please understand, I *do not* want to see that happen. ButI also
> don't want to get involved with an organaization, the COA, that I
> feel is actively preventing SCAdians from practicing good
> heraldry.

	Do you have any examples of this?  You've thrown down a gauntlet; I'm
calling your bluff.  Let us hear some examples of this "good heraldry"
that the CoA is preventing people from practicing.

Kwellend-Njal
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: sjgg6239@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Susan J. Grant)
Subject: weaving/spinning mailing list?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 17:49:25 GMT

Greetings to the Gentles of the Rialto!

I have heard that there is a mailing list for weavers and spinners,
but I could not find any information in the recently posted FAQ list.
Can anyone tell me of such a group? I'd love to talk about spinning with
others who have similar interests. Thank you for any assistance...
-- 
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+       Susan Grant                               sjgg6239@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu +
+	University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign                            +
+       Alwynne of Rivenstar, Middle Kingdom                                +
From: acsoedf@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Eric Frohnapple)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Not Re: Face-thrust force
Date: 13 Dec 92 15:39:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Dec12.225630.9502@ac.dal.ca>, sinister@ac.dal.ca writes...
>In article <97w502C62ein01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com>, branwen@cerebus.ccc.amdahl.com (Karen Williams) writes:
>> In article <1992Dec10.115241.9427@ac.dal.ca> sinister@ac.dal.ca writes:
>>>	I agree....  I keep getting told "It was clean, straight in, but
>>>it was light...".  
>> 
>> If you're talking about face-thrusts, I have a solution. Our armor standard
>> for the kingdom (the West) is that we are wearing open-faced helms with a
>> nasal. If we are thrust in the face, we're dead (no armor). This doesn't
>> magically mean that any time a sword gets near a face, the person is dead,
>> but it means that you don't need to worry about having to hit too hard or
>> getting hit too hard when face-thrusting. 
>> 
>> Branwen ferch Emrys
>> The Mists, the West
>> 
>> --
>>                                           Karen Williams
>>                                           branwen@cerebus.ras.amdahl.com
> 
>	I was speaking of a standard shot, not of thrusting.  Eastrealm (here),
>if the helm moves, its good.... it's *hard* to strike light for a face-thrust.
> 
>	Cosmano



	I think that the East people are just a LITTLE confused about the
rules for face thrusts.  We have just instituted the rules allowing them,
we have gone from open faced helms to closed face helms, and were not sure
when to use what.  Good thing there are no melees to speak of right now...
	Anyway, we are currently using the rule (in our barony) that only
people that have been 'authorized' by our knight marshall may use face thrusts.
Even the people who do this authorization don't seem to have the rules totally
straight!  There is no doubt that any real thrust to the face it a good kill.
BUT, regular hits are not so cut and dried...There seems to be a policy that
any non-thrust to the face should be taken as if we were using closed faced
helms.  (Totally different from what I was told a month or 2 ago...)  For this
reason, people may seem to be taking fairly hard shots to the face compared
to thrust.  I guess you simply must remember that thrusts put a LOT of impact
on a helm...

Akryn
From: cliffwd@soda.berkeley.edu (Cliff Draper)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Japanese garbs
Date: 13 Dec 1992 00:08:43 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

Hail Cyberspace Travelers!

A friend of mine from a wee shire in Northern California (without net
access) is attempting to make  full Japanese combat gear.  And he would
like to know if they wore colors to mark a clan or family heritage, ....

Does anybody have any info on these Japanese family colors or are they
just a myth?

Thanks,
-Cliff
 cliffwd@soda.Berkeley.Edu

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca