HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Combat Archery
Date: 13 Aug 92 23:54:19 GMT
Reply-To: whheydt@PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA

In article <arrow.713740857@milton> arrow@milton.u.washington.edu (Ken Martin) writes:
>(I don't know West's war arrow specifications, so I won't
>try to comment on them, but I will specify An Tir's war arrow rules.)

Due to rapid changes in the office of War Marshall (and some attitude
problems on the part of various offcie holders . . .), they've been in
a state of flux.  I *live* here and I know the current War Marshall
and I'm not sure what they are this month.  So--all in all--I'm afraid
your problem this was US.

>The number of inches on the crossbow
>is calculated by measuring from the string when it is uncocked to the
>string-holder/trigger thingamajig.  

Since the preferred triggering system is called a 'rolling block', I
surmise the assembly you are referring to is the block.

	--Hal

        Hal Ravn, Province of the Mists, West Kingdom
        Wilson H. Heydt, Jr.,  Albany, CA 94706,  510/524-8321 (home)
-- 
Hal Heydt                    |    "Boycott Time-Warner"
Analyst, Pacific*Bell        |         --J. Danforth Quayle
510-823-5447                 |    "... kill all the lawyers."
whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM    |         --William Shakespeare
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: kevin@isi.COM (Keradwc an Cai)
Subject: Pennsic not-a-war
Organization: The Internet
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 20:26:14 GMT

Tibor, Hossein, and Bertram (among _many_ others) commented on
the shift from "War" to "<something else>". Bertram's question

> My question is "Now what?"  Will Pennsic flip flop from being a war
> to being a fair/tournament from year to year?  Will there be a backlash
> and ten more years of just "Wars?"  Will "Grand Pennsic" catch on as a
> name?  Might we not say that a "war" is one of the elements of the
> "tournament?"  (Any precedence for that one, Hossein?).

makes a good long-term investigative project.

However.

Without shifting tradition and' traditional history' at all, the Grand
Fair concept can be maintained quite easily:

Pennsic Fair (or whatever name it ends up with) is held to honor the
the anniversary of a great conflict between kingdoms. Seems pretty
straightforward. There's a tournament, some 're-enactments' of earlier
battles, and a host of other activities to pursue.


Keradwc
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 | Keradwc an Cai     |       Adfui, Feci        |  In the Mists of the West |
 |--------------------|--------------------------|---------------------------|
 | Kevin Connery      | Quality must be designed |   Speaking FROM, not FOR: |
 |                    | into software; it cannot |   Integrated Systems, Inc |
 | kconnery@isi.com   | be patched on afterwards |           Santa Clara, CA |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Organization: Doctoral student, Industrial Administration, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 11:08:54 -0400 
From: David Schroeder <ds4p+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Some Future War

Greetings good gentles,

I am an unabashed AEthelmearc patriot and fully expect us to be a 
kingdom of our own in 2-3 years.  (Please note, this is not out of
any anger/dislike/whatever for the East -- more a recognition of
the _service_ it would do our parent realm by making it more
manageable in size, an understanding of AEthelmearc's growing
cultural distinctness, and an appreciation of all the interesting
things that could be done with Pennsic in the future, given a
"neutral" kingdom "owning" the site of the "War.").

Listening to the Opening Ceremonies at this recent Pennsic
(where in years past the heralds of the East and Middle traded
mock "insults" until War -- or in this case, a Grand Tournament --
was declared) I had a vision of similar ceremonies at Pennsic XXIII
or Pennsic XXIV or the like, when AEthelmearc is a kingdom, too.

The Silver Buccle Herald of AEthelmearc would take the field and cry,
"Who comes to disturb the peace of these Our fair lands?"

Brigantia and Dragon, principal heralds of the East and Middle would
answer.  "We do!  We come to claim Our ancient right of battle upon
these fields!"

Silver Buccle responds, "Your ancient rights will be respected.
If you wish to fertilize *Our* land with *your* blood you have 
Our leave, so long as you do not molest Our serfs or Our cattle."

Brigantia says, "We find these terms acceptable."

Dragon adds, "Your serfs are safe, but our fighters must eat and
good red meat gives strength to sword arms.  We claim the head of
one beast in ten to feed our army."

Silver Buccle concludes, 

       "Then We shall stand by our comrades of the East!"

and the War would be off and running...  It would work equally
well as a "Grand Tourney" kickoff, with a few adjustments.

I'm sharing this "vision of the future" for the fun of it and to
emphasize that AEthelmearc becoming a kingdom need not lead to
major changes in Pennsic, and perhaps might enhance some aspects
of the ceremony of the experience.

Take good care, friends...  my best to you all!

   -- Bertram --

+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
Bertram of Bearington                                      Dave Schroeder
Debatable Lands/AEthelmearc/East               Carnegie Mellon University
INTERNET: ds4p@andrew.cmu.edu                         412/731-3230 (Home)
+------------------------ PREME * Press On * PREME ---------------------+
      "He indulged in every excess, yes in each licentious whim..." 
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: guth@unixg.ubc.ca (Geoff Guth)
Subject: Re: Instructions for ancient kilt - feileadh mor
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 06:28:08 GMT

In article <3TVoPB3w164w@ailanth.UUCP> ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:

[Stuff about Puritans and Beau Brummel deleted]

>
>but the puritans were NOT an obscure religious group in america.  they were the
>dominant religious group in most of new england.  their infulence on our
>culture has been quite profound, much more extensive than most peopel
>realize...

I'm not as much of an expert on american history as I would like to be, but
the vast majority of the Loyalists fleeing the American Revolution were
not Puritans but Anglicans (or Episcopalians in the U.S.)  It seems to
me that, at least by 1770, the majority of the English colonists in
British North America were Anglican.  Anglicanism was also the only religion
to receive any kind of official sanction in any English colony outside of
Quebec.  I realize that the Pilgrims play a big role in American mythos, but
I would hesitate to say that they played as big a role in American history
as yuo make out.

My apologies to the good gentles of this bridge for bringing up a topic
that is so hopelessly OOP.  In my defense, let me say that I would love
nothing better than to bring back the houpelande _et_al._ as the cutting
edge of fashion....

>
>                                           -ailsa

-Richard.
>
-- 

|Geoff Guth                          |Si hoc signum legere potes, operis boni |
|Richard Britnell de Salisbury (sca) |     in rebus latinis alacribus et      |
|guth@unixg.ubc.ca                   |        fructuosis potiri potes!        |
From: moss@cs.umass.edu (Eliot Moss)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Grand Pennsic
Date: 20 Aug 92 13:56:09 GMT
Reply-To: moss@cs.umass.edu
Organization: Dept of Comp and Info Sci, Univ of Mass (Amherst)
In-reply-to: schuldy@progress.COM's message of 19 Aug 92 20:30:32 GMT

Tibor> Some of my favorite moments:

Tibor>   The presentation of a chain, from the Chivalry of the Middle, to the
Tibor> Queen of East, whose champions had beaten them.  The chain was made of
Tibor> one link from each member of the chivalry's personal chain.  Duke Sir
Tibor> Eliahu presented them.  I've rarely seen a finer tribute.

As one of Queen Margaret's retainers for the week, I'd like to pass on that
she seemed quite moved by the gesture, and the chain will be carefully cared
for and passed on from Queen to Queen as a treasured part of the regalia of
the East (unless of course, a future Queen thinks of something even better to
do with it than to display it in a place of honor!).

On the "War" versus "Tournament" discussion, to those of us who have been
attending Pennsic for many years, this may seem in some ways only a fine
point. However, words shape attitudes, perhaps even more so among the
impressionable young and new members, and I think the "Festival" and
"Tournament" idea is a much better one than "War". Emotions can run high,
especially when people are tired from camping out, exposure to the weather,
staying up late, and so forth, and I think reminding folks that this is a
display and that any competition is supposed to be friendly cannot hurt at
all. But as always, that's a personal opinion.

		Aell Aethelwita, called Ellethel
		Barony of Bergental, East
--

		J. Eliot B. Moss, Associate Professor
		Department of Computer Science
		Lederle Graduate Research Center
		University of Massachusetts
		Amherst, MA  01003
		(413) 545-4206, 545-1249 (fax); Moss@cs.umass.edu
From: arrow@milton.u.washington.edu (Ken Martin)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arrows (was Authenticity, A
Date: 19 Aug 92 05:05:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: milton.arrow.714200715
Organization: University of Washington

vnend@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (D. W. James) writes:

                      golf tube arrows
                      vvvv
>	With three of them hastily made, and 15 minutes practice with my
>new 50# bow I could hit a slightly less than man-width lightpost at 30 yards
>about 50% of the time.  They are less accurate and slightly shorter ranged
>than Markland blunts, but not nearly as bad as some people like to claim
>that they are.

Quite true, with a *50* pound bow.  If the rules back east are the same as those out here, the maximum poundage on a war bow is 30#.  At 50#, I think that golf tube arrows might be workable, but I've never tried golf tubes in any case.  I also don't know what the impact of a 50# would be like, but I would be willing to do the testing.  Provided that there were 35#, 40#, and 45# bows to use gradually building up the poundage....  :)

--Alan Fletcher
arrow@u.washington.edu
From: salley@niktow.canisius.edu (David Salley)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Agincourt ???
Summary: Next Time???
Date: 13 Aug 92 22:26:32 GMT
Distribution: rec.org.sca
Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208

Hadrian writes:
> The Heavies at Agincourt probably didn't have too much fun :-}
> The next time they went out to play and saw a host of archers
> they probably went home.   

The NEXT TIME ????  What next time?  There was NO next time for them!
They were dead, finished, kaput, pushing up daisies, la morte, gone to
that great big battlefield in the sky.  ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) 

-- Dagonell
From: carl@silver.lcs.mit.edu (Alexander of Kiev (mka Carl Alexander))
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Principality futures (was: Re: Drachenwald to be kingdom)
Date: 21 Aug 92 12:47:00 GMT
Organization: The Rialto

Aell Aethelwita, called Ellethel, writes:
>
>.... And of course that leads to: what about the northeastern part of the
>East, which is now seriously considering principality status. 
 
I don't want to take up a lot of bandwidth on an issue that is of 
primarily regional interest, but I'd like to hear the thoughts of 
people from elsewhere in the known world on one particular aspect of it.
(Given my suspicions about the limited interest in this issue, e-mail 
is probably better than posting here.)  Since I am a rather recent 
immigrant to the East, and to Carolingia, it may well be that I have a 
rather different take on this issue than other people in this area. To 
me, it seems that the sensible thing would be for the East to consider 
engendering two new Principalities in the near future:  a northern 
Principality, intended to eventually spin-off as a Kingdom, and a 
central Principality (roughly Mass., Conn., & R.I.), designed as a 
permanent Principality along the lines of The Mists, Cynagua, and 
The Sun.  (I won't go into all the reasons why I think this is a good 
idea; a lot of them come down to the fact that I 'grew-up' in An Tir 
when it was still a Principality, and I really liked having both a 
Principality and a Kingdom to play in.) 
 
I'd be interested in hearing from those of you who live in the 
current permanent Principalities about what you find to be the
advantages and disadvantages of such an arrangement.
 
Thanks in advance,
 
Alexander of Kiev                       Carolingia, East

Carl Alexander                          Harvard Square, Cambridge, Mass.
carl@silver.lcs.mit.edu
From: aboz@egf-bbs.uucp (Aboz the Untidy)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Trimaris events in October ??
Date: 12 Aug 92 05:34:03 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: EGF, MN Public Access Unix

Our seneschal and her family will be traveling to the Orlando area in
October, and would like to attend any events that might be happening then
. (She doesn't have a computer so I am posting this for her).  She has
writtn to the autocrat of one event in mid-month, but has yet to get any
reply.  If anyone has info on which I could pass on to her, please e-mail
me.  Thnx.    plains!egf-bbs!aboz

Berwynn

-- 
Berwynn Aethelbryght, Pursuivant of the Shire of Elverod, Grand Forks, ND
                BKA (Known on the BBS as) Aboz the Untidy
From: leeu@stacken.kth.se (Leif Euren)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Calling the Barony of Caerthe
Date: 18 Aug 92 10:54:37 GMT
Organization: Stacken Computer Club, Stockholm, Sweden


Peder Klingrode greets the Rialto: Frid vare med Eder!

As I visited the Barony of Caerthe, Outlands, in July, I promised to
post my net-address here on the Rialto. As I returned from my vacation
just this week, I haven't been able to do it before. Anyway, it's

	leeu@alex.stacken.kth.se

Sorry to have wasted your bandwidth.
-- 
  Herr Peder Klingrode                    | Leif Euren    Stockholm, Sweden
  Holmgard, Nordmark, Drachenwald, East   | leeu@alex.stacken.kth.se
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Stitching in the dark
From: pols055@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
Date: 20 Aug 92 10:22:03 +1200
Organization: University of Canterbury, Christchurch, New Zealand

Greetings from Southron Gaard,

Someone recently asked whether embroidery and such crafts was only done in the
daylight hours Well, actually yes!

In 1303 the city of Paris passed a set of regulations regarding the
professional embroiderers of that city. One of the regulations was that
embroidery was not to be done by candle light, thus only during daylight hours.
And there were fines in place to enforce it.

My source is Kay Staniland, Medieval Craftsmen: Embroiderers, British mueseum
Press, 1991 (?): a very interesting source if you're interested in embroidery.

Apparently as time went on there was some pressure to lift this ban in special
cases providing that there were assurances that the work would continue to be
of a high standard.

I personally dislike embroidering even under normal electrical light: sunlight
really is the best.

Welcome back all you Pennsic-ers

Eleonora van den Bogaerde, Southron Gaard, Caid
Simone Hindin, Christchurch, New Zealand.

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: MOLLER_JORDAN@tandem.COM
Subject: Combat Archery: Measurements
 Unto Keith Rogers: Perhaps a spring scale, like the type used in physics class
 to determine the spring constant of various coils, might be adapted to fill
 this need (with a few pertinent calculations for the results you nee
Organization: The Internet
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 19:38:00 GMT

From: Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Authenticity, Atmosphere & SCA
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 22:23:18 -0500

betel@camelot.bradley.edu (Robert Crawford) writes:

 RC>  But still, it doesn't match with the idiocy of people taking
 RC> pictures of a _fire_ with flashes _on_.

And from too far away for a flash to be useful for *anything*.
From: Suze.Hammond@f56.n105.z1.therose.pdx.com (Suze Hammond)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Pennsic Update (End)
Date: 17 Aug 92 16:34:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: therose.714160741.F00002

DS>  From: ds4p+@andrew.cmu.edu (David Schroeder)
DS>  Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
DS>
DS>  Greetings good gentles,
DS>
DS>  The weather was bright and the clouds were disappearing as folks
DS>  broke
DS>  camp on Sunday.

Isn't that always the way?  :-)

DS>  All in all, it was a wonderful war... [er, isn't that "wonderful
politically correct Police Action" ;-]

Moreach 
 
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: traite@sdac.harvard.EDU (Shirley Traite)
Subject: Scots garb for Women
Organization: The Internet
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:21:24 GMT


19089212211800E               0014800000000
Date: 19 Aug 1992 12:21 EST
From: TRAITE.SHIRLEY (Shirley Traite)
To: sca@mc.lcs.mit.edu
cc: TRAITE.SHIRLEY
Subject: Scots garb for Women
Attach: 


Good Gentles on the Rialto,

I've been following the discussion of kilts (a male garment)
and wonder if anyone might have information on Scottish period
dress circa 1150-1200 C.E. for females?   My "Scots" 
garb consists of a T-tunic with an arisaid which I've sort of 
guessed at.  I've  yet to find any documentation.   
As I am a lowlander, I suppose it doesn't really matter; I often dress as
an English woman.  

__________
Elizabeth of Falkirk
(Shirley Traite)
 traite@sdac.harvard.edu

.
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: cctimar@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (Charles)
Subject: Re: Pennsic Update (End)
Summary: Great Horse
Organization: Vanderbilt University student of numerology
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 21:35:16 GMT

To all upon the Rialto doth Charles the clerk send his greetings!

Bertram of Bearington writeth:
> Someone or some group constructed a picture of an early period horse
> the size of a football field on the side of the hill overlooking
> the battlefield...

The Horse Clans were flying a banner all week, that was roughly, "vert the
Salisbury Horse argent."  Seeing the same device filling a hillside makes
me suspect that they might be responsible.
-- 
    -- Charles, student, in Glaedenfeld, Meridies
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: rday@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Robert E Day)
Subject: Re: Principality futures (was: Re: Drachenwald to be kingdom)
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 18:36:18 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.163323.21088@pbhya.PacBell.COM> whheydt@PacBell.COM (Wils
on Heydt) writes:
>In article <1992Aug21.124700.22424@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> carl@silver.lcs.mit.ed
u (Alexander of Kiev (mka Carl Alexander)) writes:
>>I'd be interested in hearing from those of you who live in the
>>current permanent Principalities about what you find to be the
>>advantages and disadvantages of such an arrangement.
>
>Disadvantages:
>
>    Generates large quantities of Royal Peers
>
>What with 4 Principalities (two reigns each in 3 of 'em and 3 in the
>other one--I think) and 3 reigns a year in the kingdom, we accumulate
>Viscounts and Counts fairly rapidly . . .
>
Is this necessarily a bad thing? It seems to me that this arrangment would 
allow more people fo fulfill their "Dream" in the SCA. The extra 
Viscounts/Counts/Dukes are(IMHO) a small price to pay for this.

_
Otto
-- 
If the price that I must pay to obtain my *  Robert E. Day/Syr Otto von    *
freedom, is to acknowledge that the Gov-  *  Schwartzkatz, Shire Mugmort   *
ernmet was granted the power to infringe  *  Barony Middle Marches,        *
on them, then I am not free. Paul Anderson*  Middle Kingdom                *
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: abend@tortoise.cis.ohio-state.edu (dan edward abend)
Subject: Ohio Renaissance Festival
Organization: The Ohio State University, Department of Computer and Information Science
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 16:31:36 GMT

The Ohio Renaissance Festival is held annually in Waynesville, Ohio near
Cincinatti, Ohio.  Last year it was held six weekends from AUG 24 - SEPT 29.
Does anyone know if it will be the same this year?

Dan Abend (abend@cis.ohio-state.edu)
I'm not a knight, but I play one on T.V.
From: cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Pennsic in brief
Date: 18 Aug 1992 22:52:48 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Aug18.205254.15073@watson.ibm.com> mittle@watson.ibm.com (Josh Mittleman) writes:
>
>The weather sucked green rocks. 

Ah, isn't it marvelous how people's perceptions differ.

>I arrived Saturday to race the rain to see
>who got to get into my pavillion first. 

The Storm of Great Ferocity and Note hit while Justin, Caitlin, and I were
still in the car searching for dinner.  White lightning flashes flickered
all over the cloudy dome of the sky, seldom if ever touching the ground,
and after a while the rain started coming down in sheets, so that we had
to dash for the restaurant's portico through a parking lot two inches deep.
After five hours sitting squished in a stuffy warm airplane listlessly drinking
Diet Coke and looking _down_ at the thunderheads, it was exhilarating.
By the time we reached the site the storm was over and there was nothing
to do but pitch my mushroom and crash.

>The rest of week alternated among
>dreary rain,

Mostly light sprinkles, pleasant while they lasted but not enough to cool
off the general steam-bath ambiance; except for Saturday afternoon when
it rained with a certain amount of enthusiasm.  I did see people scurrying
around wrapped up in cloaks and plastic bags while I wandered cheerfully
along in my Scotchgarded sun hat and light cotton gown saying, "My, isn't
this nice!"

>dank overcast,

Hey, those are Mists.  We didn't exactly bring them with us, but they
came looking for us, and now Prince Alfred wants me to compose a song
about how the Mists kept creeping onto Pennsic lands, bringing back the
legends and the deeds of long ago.

>bitter-cold nights,

Only once was it cool and wet enough for me to wear my boots instead of
my Birkenstocks.  It was never cold enough for me to wear all those
woolly socks people said I should bring.  I slept in a lightweight 
short linen tunic instead of my warm nightgown, and only the last two
nights were cool enough for me to sleep _in_ my sleeping bag instead
of _on_ it.

>and steamy sunshine.  

Hot and muggy, all but the last two days--but whenever I complained about
the heat and mugginess, all the Easterners said, "Oh, ho, you haven't
seen anything yet; we were just remarking about how cool and pleasant
this was."  

So as Master Randall used to say, "_De gustibus non disputandum est,_ or,
there is no disputing that Gus is in the east."


Dorothea of Caer-Myrddin                               Dorothy J. Heydt
Mists/Mists/West                                              Albany CA
Argent, a cross forme'e sable

Disclaimer: This is the Cozzarelli Lab's account, not mine--but I don't
think anybody else ever reads it.