HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mark@thor.asteroids (Mark Bakke)
Subject: Re:      CAREFUL WITH THAT PROPELLER!!!!
Reply-To: mark@network.com
Organization: Network Systems Corporation
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 19:07:45 GMT

In article MUSIC@NMUMUS,         FABY000 <FABY@NMUMUS.BITNET> () writes:
>From what I have read the large panel raising bits should not be used
>with fixed speed routers.  I believe the recommended limit is 1.5 inches
>diameter for the bit.  If one calculates the speed of the tip of the bit
>it is moving very fast.  I would stop using the bit until I obtained a
>variable speed router in order to slow the bit.  Roger Barry


I have to agree.  A 3 1/2" bit at 20000 rpm is doing about 210 miles per
hour at the tip.  This is twice as fast as a 10" tablesaw blade!

Mark A. Bakke
mark@network.com

Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: wood@rtsg.mot.com (Dan Wood)
Subject: Re: BANDSAW INFO REQUIRED
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 18:51:08 GMT

   Hmmm, and just when I thought that this group was flame-proof.

   I thought that our "open borders" were supposed to be mutually
beneficial.  I guess I'll have to be careful where my next truck
comes from, my Ranger was made in Canada.  Come to think of it,
Samuel Adams is better than Molson anyway...

   Truly sorry about the lakes.

   If an article is emailed, then it is certainly directed at you.
Otherwise I'd assume that it's for general reading.  Any debate
over the nationality of the majority of our readers?  I found the
info regarding the Delta bandsaw useful.

   Lighten up!

-- 
*********************************************************************************
*	Dan Wood   Motorola Inc.	*	 Moto and I disclaim       	*
*	wood@rtsg.mot.com 		*	 everything in this post.	*
*********************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: hubcap@hubcap.clemson.edu (System Janitor)
Subject: Re: Water and Wood: A beginner's question
Organization: Clemson University
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 17:58:34 GMT


The folks around here who run the local lumber mill (and their family
has run it for 75-100 years) call quarter sawn ``rift sawn''. Maybe that
is what you are remembering (rip really = rift).

?

-Mike
From: roche@cs.rochester.edu (James Roche)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Changes to Frequently Asked rec.woodworking questions
Date: 1 Sep 92 14:44:32 GMT
Expires: 5 Oct 92
Organization: Computer Science Department University of Rochester
Frequency: monthly

265c265
< 		New Yankee Workshop - Norm Abrams
---
> 		New Yankee Workshop - Norm Abram
-- 
Jim Roche
roche@cs.rochester.edu
University of Rochester Computer Science Department Rochester, NY 14627
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: hollen@megatek.UUCP (Dion Hollenbeck)
Subject: Re: Incra jigs
Organization: Megatek Corporation, San Diego, California
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 01:04:45 GMT

>>>>> On 27 Aug 92 22:22:55 GMT, jde@esix.everex.com (Jeff Ellis) said:
Jeff> Nntp-Posting-Host: esix.everex.com

Jeff> I have been thinking about getting a incra jig for my router table,
Jeff> has anybody used on of these a lot? 
Jeff> How easy is to do dovetails with it? Is the incra pro a lot better 
Jeff> than the standard jig? From the ads it seems to be a better buy.

Incra Jigs are WONDERFUL!!!!!  I originally thought I would make some
fancy boxes and practiced on doing finger joints, dovetails, and
double dovetails.  They were real easy.  Still have not gotten around
to making boxes, but have done lots of meat and potatoes carpentry
work, all sorts of precision positioned dadoes and  square holes and
other such stuff.

The BIG advantage of the Incra Pro is that when you flip up the clamp,
you just slide the two halves of the jig and then reclamp in the new
postion.  On the regular one, you need to loosed a large wing nut,
lift the top half of the jig to clear the rack teeth, slide it into
position, and then re-screw down the wingnut.  Also, the Pro is lots
bigger.   I feel it is well worth it.  If you are having trouble
deciding, why not call Taylor Industries who make it and ask when a
woodworking store in your area is having a class.  Taylor sends one of
their designers all over the country giving classes and he gives you
lots of good informatin you will not get even if you buy both the book
and the video.  He has LOTS of practical experience using the Incra
Jig before he hired on at Taylor.  Look at the ad for the Pro, the
nightstand is Perry's work.

-- 
Dion Hollenbeck       UUCP: {uunet, ucsd, sun}!megatek!hollen
                      INTERNET:            hollen@megatek.com
Megatek Corporation  9645 Scranton Rd.  San Diego, Ca.  92121
From: bennett@adobe.com (Bennett Leeds)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Re: CAREFUL WITH THAT PROPELLER!!!!
Date: 27 Aug 92 16:05:51 GMT
Reply-To: bennett@adobe.com
Distribution: world, na, usa
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated

Mark Frazier writes
>... The guy I'm about to
> 	build kitchen cabinets for wants curved tops on his doors, so you have  
to
> 	do it with the hand held router.
                       ^^^^^^^^^

Mount the router upside down in a table. It's a lot safer. When hand held, 
riding along the edge of a board, more than half the router's weight is not 
over the wood, so it's easy to tip the router - which can be dangerous. For 
large panels, the Sears/B&D/Hirsch/PC store bought tables are too small. Make
sure your table is large enough to support the work even if you weren't holding  
it.

And, of course, don't forget the oft-mentioned recommendation of using a  
variable speed router on its low settings.
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: buurlm@viva1.crd.ge.com (Lars Mikael Buur)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Ryobi 10" Precision Cutting System
Date: 25 Aug 92 20:17:16 GMT
Organization: GE Research & Development

I am seriously considering buying this table saw. It is about twice as much as I had planned to spend but it does seem like a very nice saw. If you have a minute I would like to hear your opinion on the Ryobi and other table saws. Also, is $600, including the stand, a decent price?

Thanks,
Lars Buur 

PS I've read the FAQ, but I don't have any tool reviews readily available (not even at the library :( )
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: bennett@adobe.com(Bennett Leeds)
Subject: Re: Wood for drain board?
Reply-To: bennett@adobe.com
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 21:36:56 GMT

Bennett Leeds writes
> (if you drip some water onto it the wood absorbs the wood)...

Obviously I mean "the wood absorbs the water." Sorry 'bout that.

- Bennett


From: shaw@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Shaw Moldauer)
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 23:24:41 GMT
Subject: Re: CAREFUL WITH THAT PROPELLER!!!!
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking

> twin cutters whizzed around. Maybe what I need is variable speed router
> to slow it down, but I'm convinced that if I let go, my router could double
	The directions which came with my big cutters recommend a
maximum of 10000 RMP.  Most routers run 18000-24000.
> So take heed, make several passes (I did 3) when using these big panel raising
> bits.
	Always a good plan.
> I'm in the market for a good panel raising plane now. Something that will
> let me hear my Mozart while working.
	That wouldn't make Norm proud :-(
> 
> MMF - The Red Oak Baron.
				-Shaw
From: Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Re: Stock Preparation Question
Date: 27 Aug 92 06:06:20 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada

crogers@sctc.com (Clyde Rogers) writes:

> Does anybody know of a method of stock preparation that does not require
> either:
> - skill with a jointer plane (or am I overestimating the difficulty of stock
> preparation with a plane?), or
> - both a jointer and planer
> 
> I'm basically trying to figure out if I can get away without spending big
> bucks getting both a jointer and planer.

For jointing and surfacing wide surfaces, I use a router.  Essentially, you
move the router horizontally in a flat plane (held up by rails and a sled, or
some other method).  The surface tends to be fairly rough, but a finishing
plane or scraper quickly takes care of that.  It is as accurate as you make the
set-up; it's great for making wide panels of a specific thickness.  tear-out on
difficult woods can be much lower than with a planer.

It's slower than a wide-bed jointer and planer, and the surface isn't suitable
directly, but it handles very wide surfaces--and it costs a whole heck of a lot
less.  :)


ps.  It's also a lot cheaper and easier to replace and sharpen a router bit
than a set of jointer and planer blades.  :)

--

Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca
From: lakia@ipact.com
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Dove Tail Jigs
Date: 2 Sep 92 17:16:00 CDT
Organization: IPACT, Valparaiso IN


Has anyone purchased the dove tail jig that is listed
in harbor frieght (Item: 07595-0CRA)?  The guide on my Riobi
is 7/8", and I can't tell if it will fit the comb.  My
old Sears dove tail jig won't accept the guide for my
Riobi and there seems no easy way to adapt the guides
from my old Sears router for the Riobi.
	Anyone know of other guides are available
for a Riobi router?

Thanks-

Earl Lakia			Email:  LAKIA@IPACT.COM
IPACT Inc.			Voice:  219-464-7212
260 South Campbell		FAX:    219-462-5387
Valparaiso, IN   46383
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: billn@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com (bill nelson)
Subject: Re: BANDSAW INFO REQUIRED
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 20:44:33 GMT

M21605@mwvm.mitre.org writes:

: cheapo tools.  I should add for the record, the Delta 14" is US made and
: the castings are done in Wisconsin.  Most of Delta's US made tools use
: Brazilian castings made using tropical rainforest wood for the coking
: process.  If you are like me, you might want to check with the factory
: on the origin of the castings on the product you are considering before
: unknowingly helping to defoliate the rainforest and unemploy our countrymen.
: I better sign off now before I provoke a riot!

Bah! Do you eat meat? Do you drive an automobile? Do you use imported woods
in any of your projects? If so - then you are directly, or indirectly, helping
defoliate the rainforests and "unemploy" or countrymen.

If the foreign product is better, for the same price, then I will buy it.
Why should I pay higher prices for inferior equipment? 

Bill
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: clarke@acme.ucf.edu (Thomas Clarke)
Subject: Gilliom Responses
Organization: University of Central Florida
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 13:01:47 GMT

Haven't got any mail about Gilliom in a couple of days,
so here is the summary:

First here is extract from Gilliom's latest add in FWW.

Gilliom Manufacturing Inc, PO Box 1018, St Charles, MO 63302
(314) 724-1812

Sells "GIL-BILT" kits for 12" and 18" BS, 10" tilt-arbor table saw,
lathe/drill press, 9" tilt-table saw, 6" belt sander, spindle shaper
and circular saw table.
$2 for catalog, $7.50 for plans (refundable against order) for
any mahcine, $25 for plans for all eight machines.

I inquired specifically about the bandsaws and got following replies:

From John Kleist, johnk@ulysses.atmos.colostate.edu
 My current bandsaw is a 12" Gilliom a friend of mine built.  While the saw
is usable, it is far from perfect.  I think that the worst problem is that
the particle board/2x4 support structure is not rigid enough.  There is a
lot of vibration; the alignment changes when the blade is tensioned.  I
suppose that these problems could be fixed by changing the design... but
the quality of the metal parts is also marginal.  The wheels aren't round;
the castings are rough; the bearings are simple bushings.

From John Miller, jrm@cblpe.att.com
	I built the 18" Gilliom bandsaw. My interest was in building a saw
that could saw wood as well as metal. I didn't think that the wooden cabinet
that they specified would be strong enough for my purposes so I modified it
and built it from 1/4" steel plate. Overall, I am happy with the components
I received from Gilliom although I did have to exchange the 18" wheels a
couple of times until I received some I liked. I wanted the wheels to be
"round" +-.005. That is a hard spec to get for a wheel that size, but
eventually that sent me some. The guides are poor and tend to wear quickly.
I plan on upgrading these eventually. Overall, the project cost me close to
500$ and at least half was the cost of the materials for the steel cabinet.
I could have bought a Delta 14" saw for about the same $ and a lot less
trouble. However, if you build the cabinet from wood, then it will be
cheaper. Realize that you will not be able to tension it as you would a
saw built from steel. If you can't tension the blade properly, then resawing
could be a problem.

From Grover Furr, furr@pilot.njin.net 
  I have a friend who has done a lot of woodworki /a hobbyist, like
myself/ and who swears by his Gilliom 18" bandsaw. 
  Somewhere /FWW?/ years ago I saw an article about building and
strengthening a Gilliom bandsaw. Check the FWW index.

So, it seems if you take the time to make sure the parts you get
are good and beef the saw up, you can get a pretty good saw.
Guess, I'll have to order the plans and decide how much my time
is worth.
--
Thomas Clarke
Institute for Simulation and Training, University of Central FL
12424 Research Parkway, Suite 300, Orlando, FL 32826
(407)658-5030, FAX: (407)658-5059, clarke@acme.ucf.edu
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: scotth@harirud.com (Scott Herzinger)
Subject: Re: Smoothing edges from a table saw cut(HOW?)
Organization: Wind River Systems
	<1992Aug24.224132.16593@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com> <5094@dove.nist.gov>
	<1992Aug25.163656.2352@porthos.cc.bellcore.com>
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 18:42:29 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.163656.2352@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> patter@dasher.uucp (24224-guthrie) writes:
   >In article <1992Aug24.224132.16593@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com> billn@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com (bill nelson) writes:
   >>jhp@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Jim H. Puga) writes:
   >>: I've started my bookcase project and have a question.  I cut my
   >>: pieces a little bigger than needed and figured I would straighten
   >>: out the edges by some other means(I didn't want to try and do
   >>: exact cuts on the table saw).

   So far I've seen just about every power tool mentioned in this thread
   except a jackhammer.

   What's this aversion to a plane?

I think it's the natural aversion to planing edge grain and glue. As I
recall, the original question mentioned that the workpieces were plywood.

Scott			scotth@wrs.com
From: ron@pilot.njin.net (Ron Natalie)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Re: Water and Wood: A beginner's question
Date: 2 Sep 92 16:29:00 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

>>I'n new to woodworking too.  Could you please explain what quarter-sawn stock is?

> It's a sawmill technique. They first cut the log into quarters...[omitted]

Actually, that's not a very accurate description of the process.
Suffice it to say that "quarter sawn wood is taken with the board
cut perpendicular to the rings, "plain sawn" wood is taken parallel
to the rings.  Even "Plain Sawing" a tree will yield a couple of
quarter sawn boards (the ones closest to the middle of the tree).

> The method is the most wastefull cutting method, but it produces the most
> stable wood.

In addition to stability, there's quite a difference to the grain
appearance in some wood (oak is a good example).

-Ron
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Date:         Sat, 22 Aug 1992 19:55:05 EST
From:         "Lawrence E. Rondot" <RONDOT@IPFWVM.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: Morten Mortise and Tenon Jig

I talked to my local woodworkers supply shop about this thing.  They listed
it in their catalog last year and I was working on a table that it could have
been useful.  The owner said he listed it after he saw a great demo at some
convention/vendor party.  He said they got a few in, and they tried to do a
demo for a customer.  They gave up after a couple hours tring to get the
thing set up properly.

Now I don't really have time to play around tring to figure out how to out
smart a piece of equipment.  This guy is TALENTED with all kinds of tools and
he told me to forget it.  I'll believe him.

I ended up just taking the time to set up my router table correctly.

Larry Rondot     Rondot@IPFWVM.Bitnet  -or-  Rondot@SMTPLink.IPFW.INDIANA.EDU
From: kevin@cs.adelaide.edu.au (Kevin Maciunas)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Re: CAREFUL WITH THAT PROPELLER!!!!
Date: 26 Aug 92 02:06:58 GMT
Organization: CS Dept, University of Adelaide
In-reply-to: mmf@evolving.com's message of 24 Aug 92 14:14:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug24.141400.28206@evolving.com> mmf@evolving.com (Mark Frazier) writes:

   I bought my first panel raising bit last weekend, and this weekend I finally
   got the time to use it. It's 3 1/2" in diameter, straight cut, and I had
   to make a 3/8 lexan base for my router just so it would clear the metal
   base and still cut to the right depth. When finished, I turned it on and used
   it on scrap to see how it worked.

   Woooaaaahhhhhhh!

   I knew it was big, but nothing had prepared me for the noise it made as the
   twin cutters whizzed around. Maybe what I need is variable speed router
   to slow it down, but I'm convinced that if I let go, my router could double
   as a model airplane. I don't remember breaking out in a sweat just from 
   using my router, but this time I did. This thing was scarry.

Have you read Pat Spielman's book "Router Jigs & Techniques"?
Particularly the first couple of chapters.. on safety!  3.5" of
(carbide) and steel @ 26,000rpm = huge tip velocities.

Try mounting your router in a shop made router table [the last
chapters of the book describe a **terrific** table].  You can also now
buy vertical panel raisers whose max diameter is approx 1".  If you
make Pat's table, you can mount the router horizontally, so that the
"vertical" bit is parallel to the table top.  No problems then about
wobbling the panel!

   I'm in the market for a good panel raising plane now. Something that will
   let me hear my Mozart while working.

   MMF - The Red Oak Baron.

If you are really serious about this, do what I did.  Make a *pair* of
wooden bodied planes.  There is an excellent article in the FWW book
"FWW on Planes and Chisels".  For the simple bevel edged panels, I cut
95+% of the waste on the tablesaw and then finish with the planes.
Very quick.  Very quiet.  Very nice.

Of course, for the fancy ogee profiles, I still use the router (with
vertical bit..) but still try to slice away as much waste with the saw
as is reasonable.  Routers are wonderful, but big bits ought to come
with a health warning....

Cheers,
/Kevin

Kevin J. Maciunas			Net: kevin@cs.adelaide.edu.au
Dept. of Computer Science		Ph : +61 8 228 5845
University of Adelaide			Fax: +61 8 228 1206
GPO BOX 498 Adelaide 5000
SOUTH AUSTRALIA
--
Kevin J. Maciunas			Net: kevin@cs.adelaide.edu.au
Dept. of Computer Science		Ph : +61 8 228 5845
University of Adelaide			Fax: +61 8 228 1206
GPO BOX 498 Adelaide 5000
SOUTH AUSTRALIA
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
From: bednarek@picard.med.ge.com (Dennis Bednarek Mfg 4-6971)
Subject: Re: Black Lacquer finish?
Organization: GE Medical Systems, Magnetic Resonance
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 08:03:36 GMT

Glenn A. Malling (SYSGAM@SUVM.SYR.EDU) wrote:
: In article <1992Aug24.202514.26573@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
: piz@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (G G ZIPFEL) writes:
:  
: >        Is there a "Black Lacquer" product?
: >
: >        Help!
:  
: If what you're looking for is the black piano finish it's just
: black nitro-cellulous lacquer.  See you local auto paint store.
: It's the same stuff they put on GM cars before the acrylics
: became common.

Well if it's auto paint, then what about modern acrylic auto paint
if the new stuff is better on cars is it better on wood to?

:  
: Glenn A. Malling (SYSGAM@SUVM) or sysgam@suvm.acs.syr.edu
: Syracuse University Computing Services   +1 (315) 443-4111
: Machinery Hall  Syracuse, New York 13244-1260

--

  
###############################################################################
###NEVER - NEVERMORE###########################################################
###############################################################################
####################################What are the contents of the oblong box?##
###############################################################################
  The usual disclaimer of self and employer applies to all above comments.
#
From: boykin@gte.com (Joseph Boykin)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Re: CAREFUL WITH THAT PROPELLER!!!!
Date: 27 Aug 92 18:29:01 GMT
Reply-To: boykin@gte.com
Distribution: world, na, usa
Organization: GTE Laboratories

In article <1992Aug27.160551.829@adobe.com>, bennett@adobe.com (Bennett Leeds) writes:
|> Mount the router upside down in a table. It's a lot safer. When hand held, 
|> riding along the edge of a board, more than half the router's weight is not 
|> over the wood, so it's easy to tip the router - which can be dangerous.

I won't argue against the merits of a router table -- I definately
prefer one to hand-holding a router.  However this posting, and a bunch
of private email I've recieved in the past week has me confused.

Why is it that so few people seemed to have figured out that
you can use another piece of wood parallel to the one you are
edge routing whose sole job is to support the "other half" of the
router?  Not only does this make things safer, but it also
provides a better cut since you are pretty much guaranteed
that you won't accidentally angle the router.

jb

----

Joseph Boykin
Principal Investigator
	Distributed Computing Systems
	GTE Laboratories, Inc.

Vice-President of Technical Activities
	IEEE Computer Society

Internet: boykin@gte.com
Phone: 617-466-2803
FAX:   617-466-2137
From: sjc@cs.purdue.EDU (Steve Chapin)
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Subject: Re: Incra or Leigh?
Date: 1 Sep 92 05:53:03 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, Purdue University

}} In article <1992Aug31.204901.12486@bmerh85.bnr.ca> wedge@bnr.ca (Rick Wedge) writes:
}} 
}} With all the posts about the Incra jig, I'm wondering if that is the most 
}} popular jig out there.  Is anybody using the Leigh dovetail jig?  How does
}} it compare to the Incra?  I think it's a bit more expensive, is it worth it?

I think comparing the Incra to the Leigh is like comparing a pickup to
a Ferrari.  If all you want to do is drive as fast as possible from A
to B, then get the Ferrari.  If you want to haul some wood, go
camping, and also get from point A to point B, get the pickup.

The Incra can be used to make dovetails, but that isn't its primary
purpose.  It is a versatile gadget to which you can affix a jig or
fence, and make repetitive cuts.  The Leigh will make dovetails
faster, but that's it (provided, of course, that I'm thinking of the
right jig, no mean assumption in my present mental state :-).

Both of them are wonderful, provided you know what you're getting.  It
takes extra setup and equipment to cut dovetails with the incra, but
you can also use it for precise settings of your router table fence,
etc.

sjc@cs.purdue.edu               Steve Chapin           Today's Grammar Lesson:
                The effect of his affected accent affected her,
                   and effected a change in her affections.

  "Oh my God!  I shot my eye out!"  (Ralphie Parker, in "A Christmas Story")