From: shaze@cs.ubc.ca (Scott Hazelhurst)
Subject: Re: UPI: Ciskei troops kill fifteen as ANC marches on Ciskei capital
Organization: Computer Science, University of B.C., Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 92 21:28:46 GMT

detrolio@andromeda.rutgers.edu (David De Trolio) writes:
>>	The latest phase of the campaign will concentrate on the homelands
>>and is aimed at strengthening the ANC's influence in areas where black
>>authorities favor the South African government, and normally suppress
>>ANC activity.
>If you favor anyone else beside the ANC, is it then grounds for your
>authority and position to be threatened by the ANC?  This is fair?  This
>is reform by the self-appointed future leaders of SA?

Politics is about influencing other people. It's funny how most
white South Africans and others applauded the mass action in
East Europe which brought down the regimes in East Germany
and Czechoslovakia peacefully and even in Romania where it wasn't
peaceful. What is wrong with mobilising your supporters to
march? This is a standard democratic right, what is unfair about
this, especially considering who Gqozo is and how he got to power?

Constitutional discussions are now happening at CODESA (OK
at the moment they are not happening). But, logical arguments
aren't going to win things (not by themselves anyway). All
the parties at CODESA have to have something else to back them
to win anything -- they have to have some bargaining tools.

The government has power already. It has the machinery of the state
including instruments of control like the SADF, the SAP and the 
SABC. They also have the tacit support of the business community.
What does the ANC have? The (fickle) support of the international
community is about all. Most of their supportters (like 90%)
don't have a vote. That leaves one tool left (unless you
support violence) -- mass action of one sort or another. I 
personally don't like mass action because the ANC leadership 
can't always control the outcome of actions and violence does
sometimes occur from the side of the ANC supporters. But
this doesn't mean that it is not a legitimate political weapon.
For people who don't like the ANC to use mass action, there is
a simple solution. Have an election for a constituent assembly.

>>	The ANC leadership believe Gqozo is the weakest link in the chain of
>>black political figures who are, actually or potentially, the ruling
>>National Party's allies in a democratic election.
>Again, it is not possible for the Nats or anyone else to maintain allies
>or supporters throughout SA?  It seems to slip people that in a general
>election, the Nats could win.  Experience and ability is on their side.

Well this is an easy debate to solve. Just have an election. If the
Nats are going to win, why are they so scared of having an election.

>>	Minister of Law and Order Hernus Kriel and his police commissioner
>>Gen. Johan van der Merwe stationed themselves Monday in King William's
>>Town, the closest South African town to the Ciskei capital, to monitor
>>the situation.
>This should at least put to rest any questions about the concerns or
>presence of senior members of Security Forces.

In what way. The first reaction I heard from the SA government was
that it was the ANC's fault. As far as I can see, the only point
of them being there was to do damage control after the event. 

>And what if the country [Ciskei] does not wish to rejoin SA?  

So, why is Gqozo so scared of having a referendum, that
would solve it.

We cannot afford to have incidents like this happening. Perhaps the
ANC were wrong to have organised the march: the government's
response was predictable. They need to think very carefully about
protest in the future. The government needs to think
very carefully about how it brings to heel the security forces
which are ot of control (like the Ciskei army and KwaZuly police).

Scott