HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: wwc@vsnhda.cern.ch (Wolfgang Wander)
Subject: Re: What terminal program should I use to call a UNIX machine from my ST
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, Geneva
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:11:42 GMT

marco@sys6626.bison.mb.ca (John Perry) writes:

>I was wondering if anyone could recommend a modem/terminal program to use
>when I dial-up UNIX machines?

You'll need a good vt100 /ansi or vt200 emulation. In my opnion there
are only two alternatives, which go both confirm with tests for
this emulations. The one is he good old uniterm, a fast but not
GEM-based terminal. The second is my terminal programme CoNnect, which 
is available in release 1.91 now runs completly in GEM and supports
all mamachines including the falcon. On a MEGA STE, the falcon or a TT
you even can use higher baudrates then 19200 (eg 38400 or 57600).
There exists and english version but no english documentaion  so far.

    Wolfgang

Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: church@fraser.sfu.ca (Mike James Church)
Subject: zoo21.ttp
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 02:39:56 GMT

I can't get it to work!  I have no ramdisks loaded, and a few .zoo
files to decompress.  

double click on zoo21.ttp

type: x file.zoo

I have a single floppy, 1 Meg system.

What am I doing wrong?  Suggestions?  I will as always, be grateful...

    _______                                  
   /   _   \_                __                    
 Mike | |__| |__   __ _ ____|  |__       
   |  |  _|     ) |  | / _\ _\    )
   |  |_|  | |  |/   |  |  (__ |  |
   \_______/_|__|_/__|__\____/_|__| 
    church@sfu.ca
From: cal@otter.hpl.hp.com (Colin Low)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 22:46:38 GMT
Subject: Re: A Bomb in the Post
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories, Bristol, UK.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st

>I have a problem which might appeal to the older Atari user. It is a
>bug which has been driving me nuts for years, and if I don't get a
>fix I'm going to fill my hard disk full of gunpowder and mail it to
>Atari.

Thanks to those who responded here and via e-mail - I think I have some
useful clues.

Cheers,
Colin
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Kermit file transfers at 9600 bps
From: J.J. Lehett <JJL101@psuvm.psu.edu>
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 20:04:39 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: Penn State University

In article <93005.195549JJL101@psuvm.psu.edu>, J.J. Lehett
<JJL101@psuvm.psu.edu> says:
>
>
>    Also, for receiving a file to your ST from the vax, be sure you Zmodem
>is set to receive 'escaped control chars'.
>

     Argh, the above was meant to say, for receiving a file on the VAX from
the ST, be sure your zmodem is set to send 'escaped control chars'.

------------------
J.J. Lehett     : Atari's, puzzles, games, MIDI, fractals, Kawai K4's...

  - Work: JJL101@psuvm.psu.edu           Penn State CAC
  - Genie: J.LEHETT2
  - Delphi: JLEHETT@delphi.com
From: okes@essex.ac.uk (Simon Oke)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Convince me to stick with Atari.
Date: 11 Jan 93 23:10:01 GMT
	<1993Jan9.211529.28668@news.th-darmstadt.de>
	<1inib3INN15g@life.ai.mit.edu> <1993Jan11.115159@cs.bham.ac.uk>
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Essex, UK.
In-reply-to: dxo@cs.bham.ac.uk's message of 11 Jan 93 11:51:59 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.115159@cs.bham.ac.uk> dxo@cs.bham.ac.uk (David Oakley) writes:
|
|      +--------------------------------------------------+
|      |  David Oakley,   ASTRAsoft shareware producers.  |\
|      |  Internet: dxo@cs.bham.ac.uk                     | |
|      |  RealMail: 6 Watlands Rd. Bignall End, S-O-T     | |
|      |            Staffs ST7 8QQ, England.              | |
|      +--------------------------------------------------+ |
|       \__________________________________________________\|
| Kryten : 'Pub: ah, yes, a meeting place where people attempt to
|	   reach advanced states of mental incompetence by the
|	   repeated consumption of fermented vegtable drinks.'

No comment.

--
Simon Oke, 3rd year Computer Science
undergraduate at the University of Essex, UK.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: hutch@bellman.lanl.gov (John Hutchinson)
Subject: Re: NEW ATARI SUPPORT Part 2
Reply-To: hutch@bellman.lanl.gov
Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 15:08:22 GMT

In article 524@solace.hsh.se, jonord@solace.hsh.se (Joakim Nordlander) writes:
>In <1993Jan7.110251.15497@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> richard@op.ph.ic.ac.uk (Richard Syratt ) writes:
>
>
>>Well, that started off on the wrong foot.  Maybe these guys should have
>>looked at an atlas before they started.  I'm talking about the registration
>>form, USA isn't the only country on this planet...
>
> Well, the americans belive so... They don't know nothing about the 
>geography in Europe... :(
>
> /Jocke

Yeh, sure.  And all Americans (that's with a capital "A", please) wear sixguns
and deal drugs on the street, too!  This is more "only in America" tripe.

I agree that *most* Americans are very inward looking and isolationist by nature
but hey, no intelligent human being likes to be stereotyped, OK?  Next time,
kindly use the politically correct "IMHO" for these grandiose observations.

And besides, most everyone knows the captial of Austria is Canberra.  :)
                                                ^^^^^^^
---

___________________________ John "HUTCH" Hutchinson _________________________
_________________ Fair Dinkum Technologies     Member - IAAD  _______________
________________ "No worries, mate... it's from Fair Dinkum!" _______________
____________ email: hutch@bellman.lanl.gov   GEnie: FAIR-DINKUM _____________
From: wbdst+@pitt.edu (William  B Dwinnell)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: ADVOCACY: Re: a blurb
Keywords: PC piracy
Date: 13 Jan 93 02:43:45 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


Several times I have seen GEM criticized, here and elsewhere, somewhat
unfairly. GEM is NOT an OS, first of all- it, like Windows is PART of an
OS- they both provide some system level functions, most noticeablty the
screen management, but do not run by themselves: hence, neither is an
OS, nor an application.  Since GEM is not an OS, it is neither multi-
tasking nor single-tasking. Lastly, GEMs biggest problem always was 
Apple, which used legal means to suppress its economic rivals, unfairly,
in my opinion. True, this does not change the current technological
state of affairs, but at least the record should be set straight.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: hjwulfso@unix.amherst.edu (Harris Wulfson)
Subject: Re: ADVOCACY: Falcon - Why I'm buying it...
Organization: Amherst College
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 02:11:25 GMT


I totally agree. It seems to me that the Falcon030 is optimized for music
music music. With some converters and software it will operate just like 
a $2000 dedicated sampler. I don't know if anyone is writing this software,
but I DO know that Digital FX (the company the owns Hybrid Arts) is working
on a Falcon version of their direct to disk recording software. To do that on a
Mac requires aa $1000 Audiomedia ][ card which is not as flexible. In addition,
the Falcon will do real-time digital effects. A dedicated effects box could
cost $500-$1000 easily. The Falcon also has built-in  MIDI ports.
    To tell you the truth, I just ordered a Macintosh, because don't see the
Falcon as a good main computer. If I get a Falcon, I will view it as an 
impotant addition to my musical gear and a game machine. I'm not going to
use it for spreadsheets.

--
Harris Wulfson
hjwulfson@unix.amherst.edu
  
  /  /                               _
 /==/ __  __  __  ' _     /   )     // /) _   _   __
/  / /_|_/ /_/ /_/_/_)   (_/_/ /_/_//_//_/_)_(_)_/ /_
                                     /
From: wells_s@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz (Steve Wells)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Question : ___ M-ROS ___
Date: 10 Jan 1993 05:27:33 GMT
Organization: Wellington City Council (Public Access), Wgtn, Nz
Reply-To: wells_s@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
NNTP-Posting-Host: kosmos.wcc.govt.nz

In article <743@vercors.frec.bull.fr>, heritier@delta4.frec.bull.fr (Franck HERITIER) writes:
>Does someone know what is M-ROS for Atari ST ? What is the editor
>of this multitask system ? Can you evaluate it ?
>
>Thanks.
>
>Frank.


M-ROS!?  Maybe you mean M-TOS!?  (Correct me if I'm wrong).

It's just like GEM (the usualy desktop), except you can run several
programs at once, the screen output of which is put into windows instead
of drawn to the screen!

(That's *sort of* the basic idea 8-)

I've never seen it myself (apart from a picture).  Looks nice, but can't
say much more!



 =============================================================================
 | O O    Computers:  Not just machines, they're a way of  |       |||       |
 |  o     life.  Your computer *IS* your religion!         |       ||| TARI  |
 | \_/    Steve Wells - Wellington, New Zealand.           |      / | \      |
 =========================WELLS_S@KOSMOS.WCC.GOVT.NZ==========================
From: mm68@unix.brighton.ac.uk (Lost Boy)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Mail-Server Help Needed
Date: 11 Jan 93 14:20:35 GMT
Organization: University of Brighton, UK

Sorry folks, but this is a redundant message now, cos I have fixed the 
problem, but any site addresses still welcome.


-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|On the end of every wizards staff is a knob! - T.Pratchett                 |
|									    |
|Michael May, Brighton University, Sussex, England			    |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: A belated Happy 1993 to all the Z*NET Atari International readers
From: jonc@status.gen.nz (Jon Clarke)
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 93 20:02:12 GMT
Reply-To: znet@status.gen.nz
Distribution: World
Organization: The Z*NET Global News Gateway in Parnell New Zealand.
Keywords: rnews is working again (sorry for the delay)
Summary: From the Z*NET Crew world-wide Happy 1993

.                                                      

                                                       
                                                       .-~~~-,
                      Ron (The Boss) Kovac            (       )
                       Z*NET International          (         )
                               -^x^-               (          )
                             /~     ~\           (           ) John Nagy
                            |         |         (           )  The other
       From the             |         |        (           )     BOSS
Z*NET INTERNATIONAL CREW    |     __ _,       (~~~~-(     )
      HAPPY 1993           /\/\  (. ).)       `_'_', (   )
   SEASONS GREETINGS        C       __)       (.( .)-(  )
                            |   /~~~  \      (_      ( )
                            /   \ ~===='    /_____/` D)
                          /`-_   `---'         \     |
                     .__|~-/^\-~|_/_   |^^^^^^^||    |
                    __.         ||/.\  |       |OooooO
                    \           ---. \ |       |      \ _
                   _-    ,`_'_'  .~\  \|__   __|-____  / )
                  <     -(. ).)   > \  ( .\ (. )     \(_/ )
                   ~-       _) \_- ooo @  (_)  @      \(_//.
                  / /_C (-.____)  /((O)/       \     ._/\~_.
                 /   |_\     /   / /\\\\`-----''    _|>o<  |__
                 |     \ooooO   (  \ \\ \\___/     \ `_'_',  /
                  \     \__-|    \  `)\\-^\\ ^--.  /_(.(.)- _\
                   \   \ )  |-`--.`--=\-\ /-//_  '  ( c     D\
                    \_\_)   |-___/   / \ V /.~ \/\\\ (@)___/ ~|
                   /        |       /   | |.  /`\\_/\/   /   /
                  /         |      (   C`-'` /  |  \/   (/  /
                 /_________-        \  `C__-~   |  /    (/ /
                      | | |          \__________|  \     (/
                                    
                 The Editor         Z*NET PACIFIC    Z*NET South
                  Ed Krimen          Jon Clarke      Chris Thorpe
 


 Jon Clarke                                                     Z*NET Pacific
 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
  jonc@status.gen.nz           GEnie: J.Clarke6        Hexagon: HSBC NZM EBD
  Phone: (+649) 358-5589       IFNA : 3/772:105        GEM    : NZM CABLES
 =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
     "Practise safe computing ! Wear a write protect tab!" jc 1988
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: keiths@Cadence.COM (Keith Sabine)
Subject: Re: KnifeST
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 10:23:05 GMT

In article <memo.836842@cix.compulink.co.uk> apelled@cix.compulink.co.uk writes:
>In article <1hostpINN1km@golem.wcc.govt.nz>, sheppard_r@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz writes:
>
>>I did write to HiSoft about the buffer problem, soon after I had brought
>>the software, but there reply was more or less they were not interested,
>>not what I would call good customer support..
>
>    i also have reported a bug to hisoft with little response. In general
>they are very good with on-line support on Cix. Mention was made though of
>a major upgrade in the pipeline so they are probably concentrating on this.
>If it appears on the front of a mag then i would guess they regard it as
>deceased. All IMHO.

IMHO too I have never had much luck with Atari software developers.
About three years ago when Prospero 'C' came out it seemed like the
answer to my problems - a decent 'C' compiler with source level
debugging for the Atari! But alas it was not to be, it had several
nasty bugs. I wrote to them a couple of times, even sent examples
of the bugs but nothing. So I threw that compiler away... The moral
seems to be unless you're a big customer you're on your own. If anyone's
found something to the contrary, I'd love to hear it! :-)

Keith.
From: dxo@cs.bham.ac.uk (David Oakley)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: RFD: What to do with comp.binaries.atari.st/comp.sources.atari.st?
Date: 11 Jan 93 12:21:53 GMT
Organization: ASTRAsoft, Stoke-On-Trent England.

I really think we need an st.flames or st.advocacy (sp!) section, 'cause I can't
stand spending most of my time pressing Session Kill on things. I would Author
Kill some people, but they might just say something and I'd miss it!

So how do we go about it? Do we need a petition of some sorts?

David.

     +--------------------------------------------------+
     |  David Oakley,   ASTRAsoft shareware producers.  |\
     |  Internet: dxo@cs.bham.ac.uk                     | |
     |  RealMail: 6 Watlands Rd. Bignall End, S-O-T     | |
     |            Staffs ST7 8QQ, England.              | |
     +--------------------------------------------------+ |
      \__________________________________________________\|
Kryten : 'Pub: ah, yes, a meeting place where people attempt to
          reach advanced states of mental incompetence by the
          repeated consumption of fermented vegtable drinks.'
From: Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Convince me to stick with Atari.
Date: Sat,  9 Jan 93 16:21:41 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1993Jan9.211529.28668@news.th-darmstadt.de>

>>I'd like to hear some arguments convincing me to stay with a sinking
>>ship, Atari.
>Why doncha buy a nice Mac and **** off ?
 
Yeah..!  Doncha just love the clear, convincing, lucid, well thought out
arguments we Atari owners can come up with..?
 
We sure convinced you, didn't we..!
 
BobR
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 16:38:45 EST
From: J.J. Lehett <JJL101@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: .APP doesn't work on my MegaSTE

In article <11617@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au>, marshall@cs.uq.oz.au (Marshall Harris
(G.M.)) says:
>
>I have a Mega4STE with TOS 2.05. I can't get any .APP files to open: if I
>double click on them, I just get the "Show - Print " dialogue box.
>What am I doing wrong, or what haven't I done that I should do?

      Take at look at your newdesk.inf file.  Look for the line that starts
with a #G and has the *.PRG in it.  You should also have this line the exact
same except for *.APP in place of *PRG   Add this extra line to your
newdesk.inf file, and all should be well.
------------------
J.J. Lehett     : Atari's, puzzles, games, MIDI, fractals, Kawai K4's...

  - Work: JJL101@psuvm.psu.edu           Penn State CAC
  - Genie: J.LEHETT2
  - Delphi: JLEHETT@delphi.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: mh1@irz208.inf.tu-dresden.de (Michael Hohmuth)
Subject: Re: zoo21.ttp
Reply-To: hohmuth@freia.inf.tu-dresden.de
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, TU Dresden, Germany
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:13:03 GMT


In article <church.726287996@sfu.ca>, church@fraser.sfu.ca (Mike James Church) writes:

> I can't get it to work!  I have no ramdisks loaded, and a few .zoo
> files to decompress.  
> 
> double click on zoo21.ttp
> 
> type: x file.zoo

I think your problem is that older versions of the built-into-ROM Desktop
convert all letters of the parameter string into upper case, which zoo 
does not like: A option "X" is very different from option "x" for zoo.

Get yourself a command line interpreter (shell) like Gemini or gulam. Shells
usually do not convert arguments to upper case.

Michael
--
Internet: hohmuth@freia.inf.tu-dresden.de
From: wells_s@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: Editor???
Date: 8 Jan 93 21:09:25 GMT
Reply-To: wells_s@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Organization: Wellington City Council (Public Access), Wgtn, Nz
NNTP-Posting-Host: kosmos.wcc.govt.nz

If you take First Word out of 'WP' (Word Processor) mode, you can then
save the file normally, and it will be in ASCII format!
From: marshall@cs.uq.oz.au (Marshall Harris (G.M.))
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Re: .APP doesn't work on MegaSTE
Date: 13 Jan 93 00:18:04 GMT
Reply-To: marshall@cs.uq.oz.au

I wrote, earlier:
>I have a Mega4STE with TOS 2.05. I can't get any .APP files to open: if I
>double click on them, I just get the "Show - Print " dialogue box.
Thanks to all who replied. The line for .APP was missing in my NEWDESK.INF.
It's fine since I edited it. I don't know how it went missing in the first
place!

--
  _-_|\        marshall@cs.uq.oz.au (Marshall Harris)|ph:+61 7 365 2908
 /     B <--+  Department of Computer Science        :fx:+61 7 365 1999
 \_.-._/    |  University of Queensland, St.Lucia
      v     +--Brisbane, Queensland, 4072 AUSTRALIA (The Sub-Tropics)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: Mark Kovarski <kovarski@zooid.guild.org>
Subject: Re: The fight of the FLAMERS!
Organization: ZOOiD BBS
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 06:57:25 GMT

wmtwen@urc.tue.nl writes:
>Yoopeeeeyeah!
>Finally the fight we have all been waiting for. Finally two of our best
>Atari-bashers :) are flaming each other.
>Who wants to place any bets?
>The odds are a bit better for Mark K, but I have more respect for Darek
>M's opinions because he seems more knowledgable.
>But as we all know in flamewars facts are not as important as CAPITAL
>STATEMENTS!!!! 
>
>lets just hope this will make an end to all bashin of people in this
>newsgroup so we can continue to share information.
>
>Erlend.


My question was plain and simple. Was GEMulator tested under OS/2. Mr.
Mihocka's response was that it was not his responsibility to test it even
though he teste it with:

A) MS-DOS
B) DR-DOS
C) Windows

He pointed out to me that the GEMulator is targeted at, "cheap Atari users
buying cheap 386 and 486SX clones." I am not in this cathegory since I own two
PC systems, both loaded with 16 and 32 MB of RAM and one 486/50 and the other
486/33, both DX system.

He stated that I can return the GEMulator board if it doesn't work but if I
would do it, I want it in writing. Mr. Mihocka, I can understand your
arguments up to the point when you bring it and accuse me of spreading FUD.
Furthermore, stating that it is my own uncertainty of OS/2 running DOS
programs. It is no news that OS/2's DOS is better than DOS but like with many
Microsoft folks, and they have done it before, they are very famous to buil
"traps" so certain programs will not function with OS/2. Latest example is NT
and OS/2 and their multi-boot facilities.

While a little more professionalism would be appropriate, the answer was more
or less understandable.

Best Regards,
Mark K.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: hojo@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (HC Johnson)
Subject: Re: Spectre GCR (Mac+ emulator) vs. Mac MS-Word 5.1???
Followup-To: comp.sys.atari.st
Summary: Glad someone else has this problem
Organization: AT&T
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:39:44 GMT

In article <C073v6.H79@ais.org>, plucky@ais.org (Chris Adamson) writes:
> [Apologies for massive cross-post -- I'm at wits end!]
> 
> 	Well, I just tried to install my academically-priced Word 5.1
> and the Installer tells me I don't meet the requirements for
> installing Word 5.1.  Neither "Easy Install" nor "Customize" is
> available.  What really ticks me off is that I installed and
> 
>     ============================================================
>    / Chris Adamson    /       FREE LEONA HELMSLEY!!           /
>   / Michigan St. U.  / Limit 1 Leona Helmsley per customer   /
>  / Media Arts Prgm. / ------------------------------------- / 
> / M.A. student     / plucky@umcc.ais.org , plucky2@aol.com /
> ===========================================================
> DISCLAIMER:  Academic 11th in the Big-10 and you think they care about THIS?!

I also have this problem with Word Perfect and the latest MAcinTax.

It seems to be a problem with the INSTALLER.

I survive by installing on a real MAC, then use an archiever compresser
to put it back on floppies that don't need to be INSTALLED.

Another input.  A friend (R. Dutt on the net) suggested that the following
also works:
	1. copy each disk to be installed to a separate directory.
	2. tell INstall that the disk it wants is in that directory rather than
		a real floppy.

Hopefully others can comment on this INstaller problem and solutionig.


Howard Johnson
ATT BELL LABS
att!mtatm!hcj
hcj@mtatm.att.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
From: mrz5149@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Subject: Re: 823k compression source
Reply-To: mrz5149@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 16:19:54 GMT

  magic = $87654321 (a constant used for formatting)                virgin = intitial value of sectors (usually $E5E5). Can be any  umber as long as the high nibbles are not F.                      

 magic = $87654321 (a constant used for formatting)

-------------------

This little "magic number" always puzzled me. Would it be, by an chance,
the skewing for the track? Or is is just a value the 1772 needs?

Thanks.

 +--------------------------------------------+------------------------------+
 |          Michael "Zoooks!" Zucca           | Spam, spam, spam, spam, spam |
 |    Internet: mrz5149@ritvax.isc.rit.edu    | Spam, spam, spam, spam, spam |
 |    Printing And Applied Computer Science   | Lovely spam, woderful spam!  |
 |   RIT - Rochester Institute Of Technology  | Shut up. Shut up! Shut Up!   |
 +--------------------------------------------+------------------------------+
From: pf21@unix.brighton.ac.uk (Paul)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Subject: Amiga Disks
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:10:18 GMT
Organization: University of Brighton, UK

Does a program exist that allows the ST to read/write Amiga disks?

Please let me know, thanks in advance.

NI.
-- 

        Paul Finch - Leader of the WIMPs forever organisation
        pf21@uk.ac.bton.unix      or      pf21@unix.bton.ac.uk
 "ADA was invented to give Basic programmers, something to look down to"
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st