HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: claird@NeoSoft.com (Cameron Laird)
Subject: Re: hedgeapples
Organization: NeoSoft Communications Services -- (713) 684-5900
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 14:26:24 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.233328.27352@nosc.mil> filipell@nosc.mil (Pamela R. Filipelli) writes:
			.
			.
			.
>If we're talking about Bois D'Arc Apples (as they are called in Oklahoma
>or Central/North Texas), my mother says if you put them in the garage,
>they keep the roaches out.  You couldn't prove it by me.  But she
>swears it's so.  
>
>No, they are not eatable.  I think they are just big green brain-looking
>round seed pods with one use--to grow more Bois D'Arc Apples.
>
>>>I still remember how amazed I was that they actually float.
>
>Yep, they float.  And they are hard and heavy.  Weird.
			.
			.
			.
More *M. pomifera* lore:  yes, there are some of us
who have beliefs about their efficacy as pest repel-
lants, "odor trappers" (like baking soda), and
bucolic decorations.

The wood fascinates me, for a variety of reasons.
One year, I was on a kick of making garment buttons
from it.  Lacking all else--and I recognize that,
for most people, it does--the stuff burns great.

Why is it that field guides show it limited to
parts of Oklahoma and nearby states, but in fact
it's all over?  This is another tale whose details
interest me (tease:  know what the connections are
to the Mutiny on the Bounty and Thomas Jefferson?),
but I'll confine myself to reporting that it's a
consequence of a post-Civil War "craze" (in the
sense of tulip bulbs, or South Sea bonds) for
fencing prairie lands.

A young lady from Montgomery or a proximate
Indiana County made cookies from hedge-apple flour
as a science fair project around 1970.  My recol-
lection of her results is that the treats were
edible, but not worth the trouble.

The fruits also substitute for high-caliber snowballs.
-- 

Cameron Laird
claird@Neosoft.com (claird%Neosoft.com@uunet.uu.net)	+1 713 267 7966
claird@litwin.com (claird%litwin.com@uunet.uu.net)  	+1 713 996 8546
QUIT
m (claird%litwin.com@uunet.uu.net)  	+1 713 996 8546
From: rln@metasoft.UUCP (Roberta Norin)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Hand-powered chipper/shredder?
Date: 12 Nov 92 22:27:17 GMT
Organization: Meta Software Corporation, Cambridge MA

psmith@alfred.carleton.ca (Peter Smith) writes:

>In <1992Nov10.183331.19175@edsi.plexus.COM> gcs@edsi.plexus.COM (Greg C. Steiner) writes:


>>Is there such a device as a hand-powered chipper/shredder?  I 
>>don't have $200 to spend on a 3hp electrical one.  I also prefer 
>>to use elbow-grease to get my yard work done.  
>>I'm not looking to chop logs...just leaves, grass and a few 
>>branches that get trimmed each year.

>Yes!

I've always thought it would be neat if you could have a garbage
disposal on your kitchen sink that would save the ground up stuff in a
container so you could throw it on the compost.
From: nwfuw@igc.apc.org (National Wildlife Federation)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Milkweed Seeds Needed
Date: 8 Nov 92 16:35:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:cdp:1453300098:000:443
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!nwfuw    Nov  8 08:35:00 1992



I'm trying to add to a butterfly/native perrina\enial perennial garden and am looking
for a seed source, preferably from the northeastern US , for purple
milkweed, Asclepias purpurescens.  The plant resembles swamp milkweed
but has dark lavendedrr flowers.  It will eventually be a popular 
perennial, but have never seen it in the trade.  Would appreciate any leads.
Thanks

Craig Tufts, Chief Naturlaistalist
National Willdlife Federation
From: sjo2693@tesla.njit.edu
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Horse-radish
Date: 12 Nov 92 14:28:37 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology

Anyone out there have any experience with growing horse-radish...how
deep do you plant the root...what does it look like when it's growing
when do you harvest?????Any info would be helpful..
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: djd@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (david.j.daulton)
Subject: Mazus repens
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:48:50 GMT

I have planted a neat little groundcover in my garden, Mazus repens
(I don't think there is a common name).  It is only about 1" high,
has pretty little blooms, and spreads quickly and thickly, leaving
no room for weeds to get started.

I thought I had found a good "living mulch" for my raised bed, but
now I am not sure.  It seems the daylillies, miniature roses, and
other plants it has surrounded are not doing too great, and I wonder
if it is choking them out.

Has anyone else had experience with this?

Dave Daulton, Columbus, Ohio, AT&T
From: marlab@sunblock.EBay.Sun.COM (Marla Berg-Vivit)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: winter garden
Date: 12 Nov 1992 01:05:47 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: marlab@sunblock.EBay.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: sunblock.ebay.sun.com

What other things can I plant for a winter california
garden?

I have so far:  broccoli, peas, garlic and beans.
would carrots fair well?

thanks


Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: us048503@mmm.serc.3m.com (Art H. Hurst)
Subject: Re: groundcover for steep hilside w/cement
Organization: 3M Company
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 15:24:34 GMT

In article <1992Nov3.140159.912@calmasd.prime.com> jhb@calmasd.prime.com (Jim Bishop) writes:
>
>Well, what did the soil engineers, local landscapers and garden
>supply houses recommend?  And what was your "no luck"?  Did everything
>die, or are you referring to the landslide?  If you are referring to
>the landslide, would anything have held up in the deluge?
>
>I'd recommend some deep rooted natives but need some more info.  BTW, now
>is the time to plant natives... and it's the best time of year to plant
>non-natives too.
>
>Jim

 	My wife went to a local nursery and talked to the resident
	landscape expert who when she found out we were putting cement
	in the soil said she didn't want to be involved! Even for money!
	We are in the process of rebuilding the slope. We had ivy on the
	slope for 25 years with no problem. It appears that the slope
	was never originally compacted properly but with 14 " of rain
	per year it was never a problem. Last year we had 32"! 6" alone
	the day it failed, and that on top of about 1 week of heavy
	rain. Some people have said to use coyote bush, oleander, some
	even ivy. The city inspector said 'no ivy'. Some say to use a
	spray seeder, but my wife has seen two places that did that and
	both are totally dead! We are about two weeks from putting
	something in. The whole project is in progress right now. 
-- 
Art Hurst                                         Email: ahhurst@mmm.com
3M Company                                        Phone: (805)388-4170
Digital Storage Products Division                 FAX:   (805)388-4804
Camarillo CA 93012
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: breland@cobweb.mcc.com (Mark Breland)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Habanero Peppers
Date: 10 Nov 92 14:41:00 GMT
Organization: MCC

In article <1992Nov9.153913.12327@schbbs.mot.com> C11815@maccvm.corp.mot.com (Josette Giacobbi) writes:
>Mark, You mentioned you have Habaneros Peppers.  If I have you my address
>could you send me a few seeds?? josette

This'll probably aggravate the heck out of the seed companies, but sure, send e-mail
with your address and I'll get some to you... :)


Mark A. Breland
breland@mcc.com  "...speaking only for myself, no others and vice versa etc..."
From: jhb@calmasd.prime.com (Jim Bishop)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Freesias in the Bay Area: info please
Date: 7 Nov 92 07:51:29 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: -

In article <1992Nov5.182340.4638@midway.uchicago.edu>, safi@ellis.uchicago.edu (pedro natalio safier) writes:
> 
>  Hi,
> 
>  I am interested in growing freesias in my garden; I live in El Cerrito, CA
>  (East Bay area). Any help will be appreciated.
> 

Pretty easy.  Just plant them so they are a little below the soil in a
spot that doesn't flood when it rains or get heavy frost.  They aren't
really picky about soil, but adding some organic matter and balanced
fertilizer won't hurt.  If you plant them a couple of inches deep,
they'll stay upright better, but they seem to prefer being just under
the soil.

Jim
From: Doug.Hemken@launchpad.unc.edu (Doug Hemken)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: hedgeapples
Date: 13 Nov 92 16:07:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: samba.1992Nov13.160707.17190
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service

In article <BxLxG3.7I6@NeoSoft.com> claird@NeoSoft.com (Cameron Laird) writes:
>More *M. pomifera* lore:  yes, there are some of us
>
>
>Why is it that field guides show it limited to
>parts of Oklahoma and nearby states, but in fact
>it's all over?  This is another tale whose details
>interest me (tease:  know what the connections are
>to the Mutiny on the Bounty and Thomas Jefferson?),
>but I'll confine myself to reporting that it's a
>consequence of a post-Civil War "craze" (in the
>sense of tulip bulbs, or South Sea bonds) for
>fencing prairie lands.
>
In the days before a cheap process for making barbed wire was invented,
folks came up with clever methods of fencing the prairie:
 
OSAGE ORANGE HEDGES
	J.N. Collett, Shelby Co., Ind., set Osage Orange plants one foot
apart, cut back the first season's growth to within six inches of the
ground, and so continued to cut every June and September to within six
inches of the former cutting, until sufficiently high, when only the
September cutting was continued, to keep the hedge in reach.  He finds it
a protection against all stock except hogs.  He regrets not having planted
more closely.

	-- _American Agriculturist_ vol.20:p.177 (June 1861)


How many of us would put in 8 years of planning, effort, and patience for
a 4 foot high fence?


-=> Doug Hemken
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: account@mtu.edu (Eleanore Kyllonen)
Subject: greenhouses
Organization: Michigan Technological University
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 21:49:36 GMT

We are thinking about adding a greenhouse and have sent for and recieved the
"Janco" information.  EXPENSIVE!  Any information from others who have built
or researched and planned but haven't yet built a greenhouse would be most
helpful.  We live in a rural area so we don't have access to dealers.  The closest market with showroom or dealer displays would be about 4+ hours away.  We
are looking at something attached to our house that would double as a sun room
and would need to be heated in winter.  Winters here in northern Michigan are 
very cold (30/-30 degrees) with hundreds of inches of snow.
From: jhb@calmasd.prime.com (Jim Bishop)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: David Austin roses--help?
Date: 6 Nov 92 21:14:01 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: -

In article <1992Nov5.033855.7718@casbs.Stanford.EDU>, 
kathleen@casbs.Stanford.EDU (Kathleen Much) writes:
> OK, folks, I've read the catalogs and the Organic Gardening article
> and decided to take the plunge and order some David Austin English
> roses.  Now I really need to know HOW BIG they will get in northern
> California (Menlo Park on the SF Peninsula).  The people at David
> Austin Nursery in England said they might be double the size of the
> ones in England, and that their catalog gave English sizes (it's about
> the same as the descriptions in US catalogs).  I'll be ordering Mary
> Rose, Heritage, and an apricot one whose name I forget just now
> (starts with A).  So far, I haven't found a source for Pretty Jessica,
> Ambridge Rose, Emily, Sharifa Asma, Chaucer, L.D. Braithwaite, or
> Evelyn, which I would like to try (any suggestions? I've tried Wayside
> and J&P, plus local nurseries).  Most of these are reputed to be less
> susceptible to mildew and rust than some of the others.
> 

I have a one year old Heritage, Perdita, and Abraham Darby.  All are
palish pink.  Perdita blooms the most often.  Heritage and Perdita are
little shorter but wider than hybrid teas after one year.  All are
somewhat rangy.  They all had some mildew this spring.  This is rarely
a problem here, so I was suprised.  All have blooms that hang down,
fortunately they are all planted where you look up at them or I'd be
really pissed.

> Can anyone help with the projected size of these varieties? And has
> anyone had DA roses that weren't deciduous? If so, which ones? 
> 
No idea on deciduous or not since this is the first winter.  However,
I had to pick off the leaves to force dormancy on a lot of roses last
year since the winter was so mild.  I perfer some dormancy since
removing all the leaves is part of my spray-free program.

> I'd also love to find an evergreen climber besides Lady Banksia
> (preferably pink). Any suggestions?

Well, I'm training Abraham Darby as a climber on pillar in front of
the house.  A.B. is supposed to spread to 8 to 10 feet, but I'm just
tacking the long canes to the pillar.  There is also a shorter
bush-like plant below that sends up the long canes.  It is a pale
pink.  The blooms stay very cup shaped and don't open as fully as I
would like.  The foliage is dark green and glossy.  I have 2 canes
over 7 ft and this is just the first year.

Jim
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: sll@aries.bellcore.com 
Subject: Weeping Willow
Reply-To: sll@aries.bellcore.com
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 16:05:20 GMT


I just bought a 7 foot weeping willow.   It appears to be pretty sad
looking!  A few branches toward the top.  The trunk at its thickest is
about 2-3 inches in diameter.

I live in Northern New Jersey and am wondering how long I should expect to
wait until this tree looks more like a mature wipping willow.  I have
been told that they are considered fast growers.  How fast is fast?

It is planted by a lake, in good top soil.  How often should I fertilize?
What should I fertilize with?

Thanks for any info.  I really want this tree to fill out.

Sharon
sll@aries.bellcore.com
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: snyder@henry.ece.cmu.edu (John Snyder)
Subject: Re: Market Gardening in Ontario
Organization: Physics Department, Carnegie Mellon University
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 05:56:47 GMT

In article <psmith.720884874@cunews> psmith@alfred.carleton.ca (Peter Smith) writes:
>This past year, I did a small amount of market gardening and selling
>at a rural market in Eastern Ontario.  I hope to gradually increase,
>and perhaps make it a decent family business someday.
> 
>Does anyone know if there is any sort of information package from the
>Ministry of AG, the feds or other agency that helps a new market
>gardener/farmer to understand the rules and regulations of this
>"industry"?
>
>For instance, I have many questions related to legalities of: selling
>by weight; selling crafts along with produce; roadside stands; and
>taxation, to name a few.
>
>Any leads one can provide would be greatly appreciated!
>Thanks in advance
>

This sounds interesting.  I would like a copy of what you find out.

John
snyder@henry.ece.cmu.edu
From: klier@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: RFI: Cardiocrinum Giganteum Mail Order Source
Date: 13 Nov 92 14:49:52 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

In article <1992Nov13.173148.2456@delfin.com>, mr@delfin.com (Mark Rosenberg) writes:
> Anyone know where I can get some Cardiocrinum Giganteum bulbs by mail order?

McClure & Zimmerman-- address in catalog lists.

Kay
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: breland@cobweb.mcc.com (Mark Breland)
Subject: Re: Pepper Plants
Organization: MCC
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 14:43:03 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.041925.18703@engage.pko.dec.com> moroney@ramblr.enet.dec.com writes:
>In article <1992Nov5.150324.1@vax.sonoma.edu>, butler@vax.sonoma.edu writes...
>>I've let my summer garden go for this year, but the pepper plants are
>>still flowering and producing peppers.  My questions are: How long do
>>these things live?
>
>I believe they're perennials when in places where cold can't hurt them.  I've
>heard of a bell pepper tree on Key West, Florida.

It's amazing how hardy peppers are (until the first hint of freeze)...One  of
my bell pepper plants I planted in late February is 6 feet tall and still bearing.
The only problem I've encountered is that the plant grows faster than the
supportive branches can handle.  What happens is that the weight of the
fruit (or water when it rains) combines with gravity and breaks the branches.
Unfortunately, most flowers and fruit develop at the extremities of the the
branch, so pruning may result in less production.  I haven't tried the pruning
thing yet...it's been enough to just stand in the yard and gape at a 6 foot plant!
My jalapenos and habaneros remain at reasonable 2-3 foot heights (a bit rangy
though) and also continue to bloow and fruit.  I'd say keep on harvesting and
see what happens...


Mark A. Breland
breland@mcc.com  "...speaking only for myself, no others and vice versa etc..."
From: langston@langston.cs.utk.edu (Mike Langston)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Tree eradication?
Date: 5 Nov 92 22:03:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: utkcs2.lfj6goINN8ki
Reply-To: langston@langston.cs.utk.edu (Mike Langston)
Distribution: world
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Tennessee
NNTP-Posting-Host: langston.cs.utk.edu

simple mowing takes care of ailanthus around here;
birds seem to be the real vectors

-- 
mike langston <langston@cs.utk.edu>
department of computer science, university of tennessee
From: walker@hpl-opus.hpl.hp.com (Rick Walker)
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 03:17:16 GMT
Subject: Re: Is there any plant db ?
Organization: HP Labs, High Speed Electronics Dept., Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.gardens

In rec.gardens, Giovanni Resta <resta@iei.pi.cnr.it> writes:

> Is there any plants database available by ftp or telnet ?
> My dream is something like the RHS Dictionary (+50000 entries,
> I think) online, but any kind of botanically accurate data are 
> welcome (plants descriptions, common names, cultivation notes,
> ethnobotanical information, uses ecc.)

Dear Giovanni,

It would be great to have a comprehensive online "dictionary" of plants.
I'd like to see something that gave culture, taxonomic info, chromosome
counts, etc.  I have heard of some modest lists of common plants being
included in some "shareware" landscaping programs.  You might also be
able to find some CD data disks of some botanical reference books.

I have written a small expert system that implements a dichotomous key
for identifying 55 major flower families of the High Sierra range. Nothing
fancy, just a computerized version of what you'd normally see in any
field guide.

I also have a listing of about 400 taxa of carnivorous plant names.  An
ongoing project is to add descriptions and cultivation notes to this
list.  Jan Schlauer maintains an exhaustive taxonomic bibliography of 
carnivorous plants, listing for each one the original defining reference.
Obsolete synonyms are also catalogued and cross-referenced.

There is also a taxonomic database called "SysTax" that is currently
being used
     -    by Th. Stuetzel (Bochum) for a revision of the
          Eriocaulaceae and management of the botanic garden
          Bochum
     -    by H. Reese-Krug, F. Weberling and J.R. Hoppe (Ulm)
          for a revision of the Valerianaceae
     -    by M. Gschneidner for the management of the botanic
          garden Ulm
     -    by H.H. Hilger (FU Berlin) for a revision of the
          Boraginaceae (intended)
     -    by H.A. Uhlarz for management of the botanic garden
          Kiel (intended)

You can get more info on this system by sending a request to
systax@spezbot.biologie.uni-ulm.de.

About the best I've come up with so far is an old-fashioned book shelf
full of books...
--
Rick
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: psmith@alfred.carleton.ca (Peter Smith)
Subject: Re: spiders
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:05:05 GMT

In <1992Nov9.164624.13706@cbfsb.cb.att.com> djd@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (david.j.daulton) writes:

>Regarding an herbal remedy for spiders, here in the Midwest (U.S.A.)
>there was a pioneer superstition that hedgeapples keep spiders out of
>the house.

>The hedgeapple is one of the few trees to thrive in prairie areas, its
>wood lasts long as fence posts, but its fruits (dangerous if they fall
>on your head) are of no use.  Maybe the pioneers figured it must have
>SOME use, and this is the best I could come up with.

>I don't know of any experiments to see if it works.  Maybe someone
>could put a few hedgeapples in a box in a garage or something, and
>see what happens.

>Personally, I appreciate spiders, but have a visceral fear of them.
>I carry outside any I find in the house, but leave alone any in the
>basement--based on the theory that, if they can live down there, they
>must be eating something worse than themselves.

Excellent point!  I agree completely.

>Dave Daulton
From: ellenb@diva.Berkeley.EDU (Ellen Boyle)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: winter garden
Date: 12 Nov 1992 23:33:28 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: diva.berkeley.edu


Some other winter vetables I have growing:

In the Bay Areas (and other areas, I'm sure) you can
easily grow all sorts of lettuce greens (my favorite
is a California Mescalin [sp?] mix that I get from
Shepards), sorrel (an annual -- my 3 year old loves it),
kale, cabbage, chard, onions, potatoes, collards, and 
lots of different herbs. 

And, yes, carrots do fine.  My problem is the snails
love the new sprouts as much as I love the full-grown
carrot so I have to plant them in differenct parts of
my garden.  Some they find, some they don't....

--Ellen
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: How high do Century Plants (maguey) get?!?
From: lynx@surrey.amigans.gen.nz (Lynsey Gedye)
Date: 8 Nov 92 20:18:18 GMT-12
 <1992Nov3.140159.912@calmasd.prime.com> <1992Nov5.152434.25445@mmm.serc.3m.com> <=w_ql7#@lynx.unm.edu>
Distribution: world
Organization: Prime Line, Wanganui, New Zealand

In article <=w_ql7#@lynx.unm.edu> rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu (Roger Squires) writes:

>I'm reading a superb novel by Cormac McCarthy called _Blood Meridian_,
>and at one point his characters are riding through a maguey 'forest':
>
> ...they rode through strange forests of maguey -- the aloe
> or century plant -- with immense flowering stalks that
> rose forty feet into the desert air.
>
>I've seen a few of these plants when erect :) and they were no
>higher than 15 feet or so.  I think McCarthy is exaggerating and
>would like a top figure from those in the know.  Thanks bunches!

  Hi Roger:

  Hmmmm...  makes a change from ants, cats and fairy rings, but I still
  think looking at plant erections is rather borderline - next damn thing
  we'll be discussing anthuriums, cleistocactus, and dare I mention it...
  Amorphophallus titanum   =:)!

  No doubt there's heaps of netsperts with answers but I suspect that
  you're right if the story is set in Africa (tm).  Seems most of the
  aloes are native to that continent, and indeed have somewhat less than
  40 feet long stalks.

  If the story is set in the Americas (also tm) then McCarthy might've
  meant Agave.  Yep, they look alike, they walk alike, at times they
  even talk alike...  but, when they go to the showers...

  Agave salmiana (Mexico) has an inflorescence 9-18m high.  It's culti-
  vated for "Pulque" (booze).  A.sisalana (sisal-hemp) has a branched
  inflorescence to 6m.  A.applanata, 9-12m.  A.americana - commonly
  called "Century Plant" can spike to 12m when the plant is about 10
  years old.

  Now, Roger, if that makes you think you were in the back row when
  mother nature passed out these er, attributes, check out photos of
  the A.attenuata and be grateful.    (Barely subdued chortle!)

--
           lynx@surrey.amigans.gen.nz    lynx@amigans.gen.nz