From: ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik)
Subject: Re: The Deity of Jesus: More Biblical Evidence
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 23:51:43 GMT
Organization: Apple
Followup-To: talk.religion.misc

In article <1992Oct14.155439.16361@tc.fluke.COM>, emery@tc.fluke.COM (John
Emery) wrote:

I looked through the list, and I'm not especially impressed. In general
the list contains cites where outside people state Jesus is son of 
God that does not imply that he is a God, or then directly that he is
a God. Which does neither constitute any real evidence because if someone
calls me God, and writes it down it does neither provide people with
evidence that I am a God.

Also, if I would say "I am who I am" would based on the logic now
imply that I'm also a God, which does neither really make any rational 
sense. Finally, instead of tearing apart all those statements, producing
a long entry, I selected by random two of them:

> Luke 17:15-18 15 One of them, when he saw he was healed, came back,
> praising God in a loud voice.  16 He threw himself at Jesus' feet and
> thanked him-- and he was a Samaritan.  17 Jesus asked, "Were not all ten
> cleansed? Where are the other nine?  18 Was no one found to return and give
> praise to God except this foreigner?" (NIV) [When the leper came back to
> fall down at Jesus' feet and thank Him, Jesus said it was God they were
> glorifying]

Here's a good example where twisting of the contents suddenly gives
us evidence that Jesus is God. To start with someone thanks Jesus, not
at statement of someone being a God. Secondly Jesus says that why didn't
anyone else praise God, that neither implies that he is God, just states
that why didn't anyone else *praise God*. Praising God and thanking Jesus
are quite different things. Let us say this samaritan said:
"Thank God that you Jesus healed me".

Would this automatically imply that Jesus was God. According to the logic
adove yes. However anyone that thinks rationally would not agree on this.
Glorifying God because Jesus helped one is not the same thing as a
direct map of God to Jesus.

> Mark 14:61-64 61 But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer. Again the
> high priest asked him, "Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed One?" 62
> "I am," said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right
> hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven." 63 The high
> priest tore his clothes. "Why do we need any more witnesses?" he asked.  64
> "You have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?" They all condemned him
> as worthy of death. (NIV)

This is the second sample. The Jews directly asked Jesus if he is *the
son of God*, and he says yes. BUT HE DIDN'T SAY THAT HE WAS GOD, instead
he was the son of God. I could also state that I'm a true believer 
and a son of God, and that does not make me a God. 

I'm still looking for objective historical evidence showing that Jesus
did miracles and was a God, and as long as the Bible is the only source,
we might as well then state that the Book of Mormon shows that Mormonism
is real. These two assumptions operate with the same logical tools.

Have a nice day,
Kent

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Kent Sandvik (UUCP: ....!apple!ksand; INTERNET: ksand@apple.com)
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