HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: steveb@cernvax.cern.ch (Steve Bougerolle)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Beef(was: Cold Showers)
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:10:24 GMT
Organization: CERN, Geneva, Switzerland

In <1992Apr10.183250.8649@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> bberbeni@isis.cs.du.edu (Bill Berbenich) writes:

>My great-grandparents were ranchers up thataway in Alberta.  Could be that
>you and I are kinfolk somewhere down the line, Steve, old boy.  GGparents
>stayed there, but the offspring moved south, ending up in Nebraska.  From
>there, things diverge quite a bit.

*shock*

Well, it's possible.  I have about two hundred relatives in Alberta alone
(I could recall a hundred from memory the last time I tried it).  Let's
see, did your great grandparents happen to be named Lunn, Willock, Evans,
Cox, Maufort or Dingreville?

Oops, I forgot the Nugents.  But they never moved west, so never mind.

(Obanswer to unasked question: Yes).

-- 
_|\ |V| /|_  Steve Bougerolle, U. of British Columbia Physics Dept.
\  \| |/  /   and the OPAL experiment, CERN, Geneva CH
 >_______<    STEVEB@CERNVAX.UUCP  STEVEB@CERNVM.CERN.CH
     !        STEVEB@CERNVM.BITNET  45397::STEVEB (HEPnet)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: hillman@carina.unm.edu (Dan Hillman)
Subject: Re: A flock of peeves
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 06:40:37 GMT
Organization: Dead Goat Graphics
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Apr9.180556.23773@cbnews.cb.att.com> sek@cbnews.cb.att.com (stephanie.e.kearns) writes:
>
>2)Getting the bright idea a year and a half ago to get a degree in
>Commercial Art, being 3/4 of the way done, but now have the stupid
>electives to take, i.e. Western Civilization, Math, and Small Business
>Management.  And being sick of it all at this point.

You think that's a peeve? Wait until you graduate and learn how much
money most commercial artists make.

Bwhahahahaha!!!

d "or you can have someone at Kinkos do it for ten bucks" h

-- 
"I used to be an extravert until I decided I hated people. I hate parties, I
 hate classes and I hate going to the supermarket."   -- Melissa Paterson
From: geoffm@purplehaze.Corp.Sun.COM (Geoff Miller)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: New Subject Line
Date: 9 Apr 92 18:07:48 GMT
Organization: Schweizerische Flugwaffe
NNTP-Posting-Host: purplehaze.corp.sun.com



C'mon, !Al, killfiles are for wimps and people like Jabice Maria Cortese.


In article <31347@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk> Not_Al_Crawford@ed.ac.uk (Not Al Crawford) writes:

>As an island nation our fleet is perhaps rather larger than would be 
>required by somewhere like, oh, Switzerland, but c'mon, Tim, the UK 
>isn't exactly noted for having any Major Firepower at sea these days. 


Yeah, being a landlocked country, Switzerland doesn't need much of a navy.
They've got a great air force, though.  Any country that flies pristine
Hawker Hunters has to be okay.



Geoff


-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Geoff Miller                    + + + + + + + +        Sun Microsystems
geoffm@purplehaze.Corp.Sun.COM  + + + + + + + +     Menlo Park, California
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
From: rickg@netcom.com (Rick Gordon)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Twain was right!
Date: 14 Apr 92 21:02:32 GMT
Followup-To: alt.peeves
Organization: Netcom - SF Bay, Cal Northifornia

In article <kumdetINN67g@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> Geoff Miller writes:

> [ Talking about smaller countries making nuclear weapons, then: ]
>Then, of course, there's the matter of delivery systems.  Smaller nations
>generally lack the expertise, wealth and technology needed to design and 
>build long-range missilies like ICBMs, or long-range bombers and tankers,
>or SLBM-capable submarines, and the larger powers aren't about to sell them
>what they'd need.  I suppose it's conceivable that a small nation could 
>modify an airliner to carry a free-fall nuclear weapon (after they'd gone 
>through the aforementioned trouble and expense of building one) and try to
>sneak it into someone's airspace, but their chances of success aren't even
>on the scale.  After all, air defense identification zones exist for a 
>reason, and speaking from personal experience, I can tell you that they're
>taken very seriously.  For example (not from personal experience but quite
>relevant), Israel shot down a Libyan Arab Airlines 727 full of passengers 
>several years ago when it strayed into Israeli airspace.
>
>Ergo, the "anyone can" approach is an extremely unlikely scenario, and
>therefore a waste of intellectual time.

While there are some advantages to an airburst, why do you assume this
is the preferred method of delivery?  I'm sure you're aware of how small
tactical nukes can be made, Geoff.  The delivery system you drive to
work could handle it.  I'd bleed 5psi or so from the rear tires before
starting out, though, just to be on the safe side.

ObPeeve: Missing the obvious.

>Geoff

-- 
Rick Gordon        |  "The more things change, the more different 
rickg@netcom.com   |     they get." -- S. Krishna of Copenhagen
From: booter@Autodesk.COM (Elaine Richards)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Engineers
Date: 16 Apr 92 19:16:08 GMT
Organization: Autodesk, Inc., Sausalito, CA

In article <1992Apr15.024055.6295@cs.yale.edu> yarvin@cs.yale.edu (Norman Yarvin) writes:
>Jennifer Mina <JMM151@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>Peeve: Engineers -- Need I say more?

Peeve: Peeves without wit or substance.

>No.  You have already said enough to brand yourself as terminally clueless.
>
>I would not be surprised in the least if you disliked all people who have
>any form of ability or aspirations whatsoever.  But have no fear.  This is a
>democracy, and there are enough of you so that we have to treat you nicely.
>
>Have fun flipping burgers.


Peeve: That overriding sense of self-importance that is so common
among young technologists. They seem to believe that if you are not
a technologist, you are somehow less intelligent, creative, ambitious
and so on. I saw the same attitude among lawyers as well. Listen up,
people - Just because someone else is not obsessed with what you are
obsessed with does not mean that that other person is [insert negative
character trait here]. Got it? 

!Peeve: Some professions are not littered with self-important children.
These include accountants, nurses, firemen, cops (for the most part),
postal workers, insurance professionals, realtors, clergy persons
(until they become bishops, anyway), and elderly waitresses who keep that
coffee cup filled in those old, greasy truck stops.

ObServation: If it were not for folks who flip burgers, the United
States would be greatly lessened as an experience.

ObWish: To have time for folks to flip burgers and fill my coffee cup
in places like Taos, Chicago, New Orleans, Brooklyn, Bangor....

ER
--
*"I mean it could make a big difference in your life if you thought that 
*you didn't need to depend on some musty old dogma thats riddled with
*translation problems, and started acting from the center of your own being."
*					-Owen Rowley
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: lester@naomi.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Les Bartel)
Subject: Re: advertisement pricing
Reply-To: lester@naomi.b23b.ingr.com
Organization: Dazix, An Intergraph Company
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 18:09:17 GMT

|> In article <1992Apr10.183947.19325@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu> 
|> pmmuggli@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu (Pauline M Muggli) writes:
|> 
|> >peeve:  advertisers who try to fool me by pricing items at 
|> >$ 2.99 or $ 2.95  as if i'm going to truncate 99 cents and think
|> >*wow* it's only two dollars.

Or the price of gas.  It may be posted as $1.239, and most people will
say it's $1.23 when in fact it's much closer to $1.24.

How did that get started anyway?  The .9 cents part that is.  Why don't
I ever see any other fraction of a cent besides 9 (other than the
seller wants to make an extra penny [almost] per gallon)?
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: hillman@carina.unm.edu (Dan Hillman)
Subject: Re: Psychology (was: Re: Lawyers not Chemists)
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 92 08:41:37 GMT
Organization: Deathcheeses of Wisconsin
Keywords: *WARNING* Psychobable Ranting

Jenni Sheehey writes:
>
>No, it's not new.  Behavioral psychology has about a 90% cure rate with
>phobias (rough estimate from the top of my head), and has been
>successfully curing them for quite a while.

Peeve: Inconsistent labels in psychology. Phobias are usually cured by a
process of systematic desensitization which the therapist begins by
having the client imagine an anxiety-producing situation. This process
gets lumped under "behavioral psychology" when, in fact, it has nothing to
do with behaviorism. Behaviorism deals with the mind-body problem by ignoring
the concept of mind. It is therefore impossible for any therapy from the
behaviorist school to begin by asking the client to imagine something.

MongoPsychPeeve: People who confuse behaviorism and associationism.

>ObPeeve: Having to defend my field all of the time because very few
>people know as much about it as they think they do, and everyone thinks
>they know *all* about it because they've had one or two experiences with
>it.

Agreed. There's nothing more annoying than working a peevesome summer job
during college (my own summers working in a quahog packaging factory springs
to mind) and having people asking you what you're studying:
	Worker Dude: Hey, college kid, whatcha studyin'?
        Foolish Dan: Psychology.
        Worker Dude: Whoa! Hey, look out for this kid, he's gonna
                     psychoanalyze all of us!!!

Eventually, you learn to lie:
        Worker Dude: Hey, college kid, whatcha studyin'?
          Wiser Dan: Molecular biophysics.
        Worker Dude: Oh.


>RelatedPeeve: Many people act about psychologists the same way they act
>about Christians: If I've met a bad one, all of them are bad.

In my own experiences there are two kinds of psychologists: The first kind
are the statisticians. These are basically harmless math geeks who view
psychology as a puzzle in which the object of the game is to apply rules
of order to the most disorganized beastie around, the human psyche. The
second kind of psychologist is the therapist. These folks make it their
business to surround themselves with people who have problems.

I'll take the math geeks every time.

d "and I *loved* my stats classes. damnit." h 
-- 
"When I am introduced to an undertaker I categorize him at once as a
 sanctimonious money-grubbing necrophiliac. I realize this is an unfair
 generalization. I don't care."      -- Lawrence Block
From: dmunroe@gollum.wr.tek.com (David Munroe)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Where'd he get his name?
Date: 14 Apr 92 18:02:54 GMT
Organization: Tektronix, Inc

In article <1992Apr14.030533.4351@samba.oit.unc.edu> Bill.Berbenich@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Bill Berbenich) writes:

>What I wanna know is - Where did Nosy get his name?
>How about Evil Engineer doin' it the Cowboy Way?
>And where did Booter get her name?

I think it came from her machine name, since Elaine always signs her posts
as ER.  I'd bet "booter" is the name of a cat, though.

>About the GIFs - I want to see all of the wimyn of alt.peeves.  How many of
>you wimyn are in your 20s?

Next on Geraldo: the wimmen of alt.peeves!

I want to see if a particular female Poaster matches my impression of her
as a young Lauren Bacall.

-Dave
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Our top story tonight: Generalissimo Francisco Franco is still dead
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: booter@Autodesk.COM (Elaine Richards)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: what should I do?
Date: 7 Apr 92 20:46:56 GMT
Organization: Autodesk, Inc., Sausalito, CA

In article <1992Apr7.100248.24792@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux) writes:
>
>Friday I ran into a young lady and asked her for some midol.
>
>the following monday she ran into me and I was complaining
>about water weight, feling bloated, and being generally crabby.
>
>Is this something a guy should worry about?
>


Yes.

Peeve: Silly questions.

ER
--
*"I mean it could make a big difference in your life if you thought that 
*you didn't need to depend on some musty old dogma thats riddled with
*translation problems, and started acting from the center of your own being."
*					-Owen Rowley
From: Not_Al_Crawford@ed.ac.uk (Not Al Crawford)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: New Subject Line
Date: 10 Apr 92 08:04:38 GMT
Reply-To: Not_Al_Crawford@ed.ac.uk (Not Al Crawford)
Organization: Penicuik People's Revolutionary Sheepdog Liberation Front

And lo, geoffm@purplehaze.Corp.Sun.COM (Geoff Miller) spake unto the masses saying:
>
> Yeah, being a landlocked country, Switzerland doesn't need much of a
> navy.

I'm sure they do have one though - a couple of dinghies on Lake Geneva or
something like that.

> They've got a great air force, though.  Any country that flies pristine
> Hawker Hunters has to be okay.

Definitely.

AntiPeeve: after last night's election result (even though I didn't get the
result I really wanted) it's going to be *fun* today watching all the
people who were saying "Ah, now the Tory bastards are going to get what
they deserve" beforehand going around with shocked expressions of disbelief.

--
		Not Al Crawford - Not_Al_Crawford@ed.ac.uk
 "Isn't it nice/Sugar and spice/Luring disco sheepdogs/To a life of vice."
From: geoffm@purplehaze.Corp.Sun.COM (Geoff Miller)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Smoking Surrogate
Date: 13 Apr 92 15:28:45 GMT
Followup-To: alt.peeves
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Menlo Park, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: purplehaze.corp.sun.com



In article <5427@catnip.berkeley.ca.us> bandy@catnip.berkeley.ca.us 
(poultry in motion) writes:

>>In article <19951@castle.ed.ac.uk> egev05@castle.ed.ac.uk (B A Page) writes:
>>>ObScene:  John Major, wearing a purple lycra posing pouch, going down
>>>on Thora Hird

>>ok, i give. what's a posing pouch?

>It is a thing you put your dick in that holds it up and out of the way.


Also known as a "codpiece."



Geoff


-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Geoff Miller                    + + + + + + + +        Sun Microsystems
geoffm@purplehaze.Corp.Sun.COM  + + + + + + + +     Menlo Park, California
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
From: bandy@catnip.berkeley.ca.us (poultry in motion)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Russ is Everywhere
Date: 6 Apr 92 21:08:59 GMT
Organization: The People's Number Four Cat Farm, Berkeley CA, USA

dac@prolix.pub.uu.oz.au (Andrew Clayton) writes:

+> Peeve: I have never found a used bookstore (in the U.S.) that has
+>    *any* Iain Banks in stock.   :-(

+I recently ordered the three books in his series "Use of Weapons"
+etc. They sound keen.

OOOH, Andy, are you *as* *scared* *as* *I* *am*?
-- 
real address: bandy@catnip.berkeley.ca.us
last choice:  lll-winken!catnip.berkeley.ca.us!bandy

"It's not an adult feature unless someone's gooey at the end."
 -- Bill Hicks
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: ELLBRUA@YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu (The Lemming)
Subject: Re: Bogroll Peeve
Organization: Yale University
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 92 13:20:55 EDT

In article <31431@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk>
Not_Al_Crawford@ed.ac.uk (Not Al Crawford) writes:
 
>CRESTA TOILET TISSUE SYSTEM
 
  [description of toilet tissue system deleted]
 
>This brain-dead design is highly peeveworthy.
 
  [peeves deleted]
 
Another big peeve about this particular system is that sometimes the
roll gets rotated so that the end of the paper is somewhere inside the
plastic drum rather than dangling through the opening.  It's quite
annoying to try to rotate the roll back around so you can reach the
end of the paper, especially when it is almost depleted.
 
 
Alex Elliott
The Lemming.
ellbrua@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu
From: scott@festival.ed.ac.uk (Scott Larnach)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Lemon Gin, Rape
Date: 8 Apr 92 17:03:51 GMT

hillman@carina.unm.edu (Dan Hillman) writes:
> ... Dan Quayle ...

>Don't let his wife hear you say that last bit. Whew! She's grim. She's
>scarier than pissing blood.

Reminds me of something I saw on "Saturday Night Clive", a UK show
hosted by Clive James. He was talking to P.J.O'Rourke over
satellite and asked about Mrs. Quayle. O'Rourke said something
like "Put it this way: I wouldn't like to wound her and have to
follow her into high grass".

S
From: banta@blagg.Eng.Sun.COM (242 lbs before cooking)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Smoking Surrogate
Date: 9 Apr 92 06:10:28 GMT
Organization: Sun, Moon, and Stars
NNTP-Posting-Host: blagg

Our favourite liberal hacky-sack, (Don Baldwin) writes:
>Maybe nobody said anything because you're 6'2" and were plugging away
>at seals with your ObGun at the time?

I'm 6'6", son.  Just because Geoff Miller is 6'2" and you look up to
him, don't assume that's true of everyone you look up to.

And if I was spotted "plugging" seals, it wouldn't have been with a
gun.

drew
banta@abingdon.sun.com
--
Somehow, I have a problem taking a hurricane named "Bob" seriously ...
					-- Akkana Peck
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: baldwin@carina.unm.edu (Chris Baldwin)
Subject: Re: Poasters unmasked
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 92 10:39:37 GMT
Organization: Atheists for the Development of a Better God

In article <1kvj5zm@lynx.unm.edu> hillman@carina.unm.edu (Dan Hillman) writes:
>In article <1992Apr9.224821.15145@odin.corp.sgi.com> Jeff Zurschmeide writes:
>>I think the time is ripe for posting some physical descriptions 
>>of us. But to be fair, I think we should describe each other. 
>Today's Poster Unmasked: Chris Baldwin (baldwin@carina.unm.edu)	
>
>   I first imagined Chris Baldwin to be extremely clean cut; 
>lanky and blond and somewhat preppy, probably about 6' tall 
>with close-cropped hair. 
	Gee, Dan, 1 or of 5 aint bad...I am just a smidge under 6'.

>It was after midnight, and he was 
>working in the worst of all of UNM's computing labs. 
	This is not the worst, but merely the second worst.

>   Since (and including) that night, I have never seen Chris wear 
>anything other than a white t-shirt and jeans (and ObShoes, of 
>course).
	I wear plenty of t-shirts that aren't white! Also, one night
when you came in here, I had on a pair of sweatpants, instead of jeans.
Blatant untruths and assaults on my character!

Coming Soon: The Real Dan Hillman. I'll try not to think about that Jabba
the Hut comment when I'm writing it.

ObPeeve: This peeve most recently manifested itself in a fairly compugeeky
way, but I will endevour to make it relevant to the rest of you. Anyway,
one of the supervisors at another computing center here on campus came in
tonight to do a little word processing. Our server was down, but she didn't
bother to mention to me that there was a problem. She ignored the problem,
as it didn't really affect her, since she could connect to the other
server and use it. So, about an hour later, I get a bunch of users 
complaining that they were having problems with the server, so I went
over to check it out and she tells me that it has been down since she got
there. This wasn't a big problem, but it was one that needed to be dealt
with. And it doesn't take a lot of effort to walk the 15 feet over to 
where I was and say something about it. So, my peeve for the day is people
who ignore some problem around them, especially someone who is in a 
position to do something about it.

Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: tcws@convex1.tcs.tulane.edu (Bill Sirinek)
Subject: Re: Short gals--->Tall guys
Organization: Tulane University, New Orleans, LA
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 21:34:27 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-21417]: convex1.tcs.tulane.edu

In article <32516@darkstar.ucsc.edu> carolo@cse.ucsc.edu (Carol Osterbrock) writes:
>>
>>Why don't they look for someone a little more their size?  All the girls
>>that I could ask out, of course are dating the 7-footers!!!
>>Heck, that's a foot and a half difference.  They almost need a stepladder
>>to kiss the guy goodnight!!!
>
>Yeah, NO KIDDING.  Why don't those little short gals leave some of the
>big ones for us women who can see over the steering wheel?  Never mind
>the kiss goodnight, the poor guy must get a major back injury trying
>to do a 69.
>
But HEY, she can STAND UP and give him a blowjob!!!!


--
| Bill Sirinek                     Snail: Box 3799, Tulane University     |
| Computer Science Major                  New Orleans, LA 70118           |
| Tulane University               BITNET: tcws000@tcsmusa                 |
| New Orleans, Louisiana        Internet: tcws@convex1.tcs.tulane.edu     |
From: steveb@cernvax.cern.ch (Steve Bougerolle)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
Subject: Re: Gender assumptions
Date: 9 Apr 92 15:09:43 GMT
Organization: CERN, Geneva, Switzerland

In <x7rj#1.rickg@netcom.com> rickg@netcom.com (Rick Gordon) writes:

>"Primary relationship partner"?  God help us, it's another jackalmouthed
>obfuscatory euphemism, and one I've never seen before.  PRP.  Pronounced
>in moments of abandoned passion "pirp", presumably.

Well, I don't know, Rick.  I like that one more than SO, myself.  SO sounds
incredibly cumbersome and obnoxious to me.  PRP, on the other hound, could
be pronounced "porp" which has a pleasant sound to it, and best of all
rhymes with "pork."  So you can say things like "within 48 hours I'm going
to pork my porp."

(Presumably in Sonja's original message it was the other way around, though).
-- 
_|\ |V| /|_  Steve Bougerolle, U. of British Columbia Physics Dept.
\  \| |/  /   and the OPAL experiment, CERN, Geneva CH
 >_______<    STEVEB@CERNVAX.UUCP  STEVEB@CERNVM.CERN.CH
     !        STEVEB@CERNVM.BITNET  45397::STEVEB (HEPnet)
Newsgroups: alt.peeves
From: sethb@fid.morgan.com (Seth Breidbart)
Subject: Re: Concert Behavio(u)r (Was Re: Things my wife does (revisited)
Organization: peevish
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 23:03:11 GMT

In article <11005@autodesk.COM> booter@Autodesk.COM (Elaine Richards) writes:
>In article <1992Mar31.195015.22370@fid.morgan.com> sethb@fid.morgan.com (Seth Breidbart) writes:
>>
>>ObPeeve: The low SAQ people sitting in row 3 of the Dead concert in
>>Philadelphia a couple of Tuesdays ago, who persisted in talking to
>>each other.
>
>
>You could hear them over the music in the third row? 

No, I could hear them in the (anti-peeve) second row.  They were
behind me.

Actually, it isn't that loud up there.  It's 90 degrees from the main
speakers, so the sound is mostly from the stage monitors.

>I really don't feel sorry for you. If you were that devoted, you would
>be leaning up on the stage with a silly smile on your face.

The low SAQ types in front of me called the usher to have anyone
ejected who didn't have a seat in that row.

Anti-peeve:  They were sufficiently low SAQ to have paid in excess of
$150 per ticket.  They were peeved to find out I paid $27.

Peeve:  Geoff's posting on this thread expired before I got to respond
to it properly.  He said something like

>A surprisingly effective method is to politely ask them to quiet down.

Peeve: Around here, it would be surprising if such a method were
effective.  Last time I tried it (in MSG last fall), the BDI in front
of me turned around and screamed his loudest (with wide-open mouth)
directly at me.

ObWeapon: A well-aimed sneeze.

Anti-peeve: see ObWeapon.

+++++++++++++Seth----------sethb@fid.morgan.com+++++++++++++++++++++++
I was so groggy one morning after a night of partying that I had to go
to the bathroom and run some water down the sink drain so I could tell
which hemisphere I was in.  -- Geoff Miller (who let him out of afu?)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++