From: mjln_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Mikeey J. Lin)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion
Subject: Re: What the pro-lifers do not tell you
Date: 9 Apr 92 19:22:01 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

In <1992Apr9.061030.27993@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> smccabe@author.ecn.purdue.edu (Sarah A McCabe) writes:

>I have the feeling I am fighting a losing battle here.  But I am going
>to try again.  Mikeey, please bear with me here.  Read what I have
>written carefully and please respond to that.  I am going to point
>out below where I make a statement, you say that's not what you 
>meant and then seem to repeat exactly what I said originally.
>Now what we may have here is a failure to communicate, but I would 
>like to understand what exactly you are proposing.

	Alright Sarah. I thought I expressed my views clearly but I guess 
I better re-state it so there would be no confusions. :)

	
>OK, we are agreed.  Teenagers of all ages should not be having
>sex without knowing the consequences.  (I take it this is what you
>mean by "proper sex-education").

	Okay, glad that we can agree here. :)


>Isn't that what I just stated?  "over 15" means teenagers over the age
>of 15, i.e. out of Junior high School (BTW I picked 15 because as I
>recall, that was the age you first proposed.)
	
	Okay, my mistake here. How about at age 13? (My point here
applied to Junior High School Students, I admit I forgot their ages)
Does age 13 sound better to you?


>Again, isn't that what I just said?  There is nothing in point 3 about
>condoms at all.  I just said that teenagers of all ages should have
>access to sex education.

	I was clarifying my statement in the original posting, I was NOT
trying to answer your statement. By the way, I did agree 100% with you on
the fact we should give all teenagers sex education.


>I am sorry, but again I do not see the difference between what you are 
>saying and what I said.  Point 4 deals only with the issue of condoms and
>junior high school aged teenagers.  Do you or do you not support the 
>idea that junior high school students should have access to free or
>low cost condoms?

	To make the answer simple, No. I would not support free or low cost
condoms in JHS because I personally believe it is an indirect way of us 
telling these kids that sex at age 13 is acceptable and regarded as okay.
Some people may object to this because they say we have to protect them
by giving them access in JHS, I say if we educate them, they would know where
they have to go to get birth control. We don't need to provide birth control
for them in JHS. There would be too many oppositions from varies groups.

 
>Gee, I never said "deny access" either.  I said "deny *easy* access" by
>this I mean that teenagers are going to have to go through some difficulty
>(i.e. the embarrassment of shopping in a drugstore) in order to get a hold 
>of condoms.  I am also puzzled that you expect Junior High School students
>to act like "responsible adults" by shopping for their own condoms, but
>concede that it is probably a good idea not to demand this from High 
>School students.

	You're right about your point here except there was one thing
you forgot to mention I have not said anything about having condoms 
available in High School. I did not state my view because I thought this
was a touchy issue to bring up. By the way, I feel the availability of
comdoms in High Schools should vary from school to school. Once again,
like I said before, the "local drugstore".
 
>Again, you are trying to force children to behave like responsible adults
>but don't expect older teens to do so.  I just don't get it.

 	Like I said before, I never mentioned the "older teens". 
If you're still confused, please refer to previosus statement.


>My apologies for any offense.  I hadn't realized your position.  Which
>brings up the point that this really doesn't have much to do with 
>abortion, but then neither does a lot of other stuff in t.a.
>I still don't think your arguments are logically consistent; and I
>think your policies could actually contribute to the hardship in this 
>world.  

	Apology not necessary. I usually try to verify a person's position
before making any "personal" comments first. As for the fact that you feel this
has much to do with t.a., I would disagree. Sex Education, contraception, and
the availability of contraception is directly linked to birth control. My 
"Policies" may differ from many people, but I believe for the most part, it is
fairly logically consistent. I came from a poor background and as a result,
were exposed to many of the "problems" that poor minorities were faced with
in NYC. (The Bronx especially) I know how unaware most of the teenagers are
about sex education. Most of the guys are "too cool" to have to learn anything
about sex and a lot of the girls are not well informed about their body. Of
course there are exception, but not too many from what I've seen. Just thought
you might want to know a little about where I'm coming from. I certainly hope
that my "policies" won't contribute to any "hardships". If that's the case,
then I may be wrong. However, I think I'm right about this one. :)

			 				Mikeey
					    mjln_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu

Quote of the day: An excess of something is always good for you.
		(Mikeey after finishing three bowls of ice cream)

>Sarah McCabe
Newsgroups: talk.abortion