HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: marcia@netcom.com (Marcia)
Subject: Re: Taking SO's for granted
Organization: The Dolphin Conspiracy, Phase II
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 03:29:30 GMT

In article <AfLi0nC00iV043aH9y@andrew.cmu.edu> "Paul S. Hrynko" <ph2a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>I want to know what other AR's think of physical vs. emotional
>involvement...whether if the emotional ties are strong enough in a
>relationship, if a relationship more platonic or more physical with
>someone at school is possible.  

It doesn't matter if the ties are strong enough: it matters what you have
agreed to with you SO as being the parameters of the relationship. If you've
agreed that you can be with other people, then fine. If not, that's fine.
So long as you BOTH know where you stand.

>If one relationship is meant to be, can another develop?

I don't believe in "meant to be". Relationships happen and grow and stay
strong because you want them to, because you believe in them, and because you
work at them. If you feel that more than one is right for you, then you 
deal with that, and if not, you deal with that too. 
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marcia Bednarcyk                                  ADDRESSES: marcia@netcom.com
"Sweaty Snugglebunnies."                                     mlb@cisco.com
Newsgroups: alt.romance
From: petitc@nuge105.its.rpi.edu (Christopher Jon Petit)
Subject: Re: Romance and Babies
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 05:33:18 GMT

soswald@charlie.usd.edu writes:

>In the day-to-day flurry of trying to accomplish to much in too little time,
>you will need to find time to "smell the roses".

  Well put.  And this also holds for regular relationships---if you try to
start that only after you're married, you'll really have problems trying to
get it started out.


-- 
"Protect endangered species!  Contribute to the Exxon Supporter's Fund!"
"Pay no attention to that little man behind the keyboard."
"If you want to look for fish, best not to look in desert."
"The greatest beauty in the world is beauty that is private."
From: ap.6575@cupid.sai.com (AJ)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Curious?
Followup-To: alt.romance
Date: 21 Jan 1993 19:20:30 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: 141.214.24.226




How many men are intimidated by extremely independent women?
I am very independent, however maintain my femininity, but
I keep meeting men with low self-confidence/esteem who have
a problem with my independence and very direct, open approach
to everything in life.  When I do have a SO, I give 100% to the
relationship while maintaining my independence.    

Advise or comments at all will be appreciated.  Thanks in advance.
:-)
From: trf2a@Virginia.EDU ("Tanya Fleming")
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: INTERRACIAL ROMANCE
Date: 27 Jan 93 02:16:48 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia

apdolan@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu  writes:
> All of my romances in recent years have
> been with black women(I'm white).
> I heard earlier today about an old book
> "Marriage across the color line", 1965,
> by Larsson that tells some interesting
> stories about how some interracial couples
> first met and how some had to do strange
> things to keep seeing each other. For example,
> imagine being a mixed couple in the South
> thirty years ago. 
> 
> A woman who has been in interracial relationships
> told me today that it was interesting that I met
> black women mainly in places close to home, but that's
> where I spend most of my time. I am interested in
> hearing about any similar stories, books,or other
> items with any interracial tie-in. Contact
> me at apdolan@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu   Does
> anyone think that this topic m ight merit a 
> board of its own? You can also post on this board if you wish.
> with comments and answers. If I hear of any more
> interesting books or articles I'll post them as well.
> 
> .
> 
I can see this subject having its own board.  It is a subject
of great interest to me because I am on the exact opposite end
as you.  I am a black female who is dating a white male.
Unfortunately, the only thing I have read on the subject has
been in magazines.  For instance, one article stated that
interracial dating is less common with a black female and white
male (no surprise, but the percentages were rather low).  Of
course, any of the talk shows will provide the same information
and they alway s have at least a few shows a year with an
interracial theme.

I can't even begin to imagine what it would have been like to
date interracially 30 years ago.  It seems to be difficult
enough for people today.  Reading about those older couples,
however, would probably give me the strength to deal with just about
anything I might face in this day and age.

Why is it that you have dated black women recently?  Is it a
preference or do the women you find yourself interested in just
happen to be black?  I'd be interested to know.
From: ga@mrih.no (Gard Abrahamsen)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: topics to avoid on first date
Date: 27 Jan 93 11:17:44 GMT
Organization: More og Romsdal Ingeniorhogskole
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Jeremy Friesner (cs64wag@sdcc8.ucsd.edu) wrote:
> In article <1jv0imINNf5h@gap.caltech.edu> peri@cco.caltech.edu (Michal Leah Peri) writes:
>  >>>Please feel free to add onto this list, in which I will only begin to
>  >>>uncover the dos and do nots of beginning a new romance.
>  >
>  >>A: TOPICS NEVER TO DISCUSS ON A FIRST DATE
>  >>
>  >>       1. Reoccuring Skin Inflammations
>  >>       2. Ethnic Jokes
>  >>       3. Satanism
>  >>       4. X-Significant Others
>  >>       5. Super bizarre sexual fantasies or problems
>  >	 6. Bad credit
> 	 7. Why C is better than Pascal
>	8. The bug you can't find in that programme.

     _____
    / o o \  <== Self portrait
===OO=====OO=================================================================
= Gard Eggesboe Abrahamsen                         PO Box 5061, Larsgaarden =
= Gard.Abrahamsen@mrih.no                             6021 Aalesund, Norway =
= finger ga@samson.mrih.no and read the .plan    (last update: Jan 25th 93) =
=============================================================================
    \_/ \_/  <== shoe size 42            ^^^ reduced .signature
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Equality - Let's get serious
From: jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu (jason 'Think!' steiner)
Date: 22 Jan 93 12:10:08 EST
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

mysti@sierra.sybase.com (Mysti Rubert) writes:
> jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu (jason 'Think!' steiner) writes:
> 
> |> 
> |> actually, you have to watch those statistics. the ones that 
> |> claim women are making 60% of what men do don't take into 
> |> account the amount of time, experience & education women have 
> |> compared to men. when the numbers are adjusted for such factors, 
> |> they indicate women make about 95% of what men do (if they 
> |> indeed are doing the exact same job, have the exact same 
> |> qualifications & work the exact same number of hours per week).
> 
> "Working Woman" magazine noted that among physicians and lawyers
> women had lost ground to the tune of approximately 20 cents on the
> dollar.  The number of women in traditionally male jobs is dropping
> fast, especially in the construction trade.  

the first is certainly not good. the second i could care less about.
if the number of female construction workers -were- going up you'd
be complaining that it was "only" construction work & that the glass
ceiling was still in place.

> Women are actively discouraged from getting the experience, 
> education and promotions needed to be equal to men.  

i agree with you on this.

> So your "reworking" of the statistics (which completely ignores the 
> widely accepted concept of "equivalent" jobs) is meaningless.

i don't agree with this. it's nothing but a knee-jerk response
to information you don't like. i don't care what the "widely
accepted concept of equivalent jobs" is. i care what equivalent
jobs are, period. someone who works 40 hours a week is not doing
the same job as someone who works 50 hours a week.

> By the way, can you please quote your source.

the original article was in soc.men several months ago. this week
there was an article in my school newspaper, which stated that the
unadjusted number is now up to 70%. again, that doesn't take into
account such basic things as hours worked & postion.

jason

--
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`
`,`       "Every great gift is a kind of curse." - Camille Paglia       `,`
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,` jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu ,`,`,`
From: u31b3hs@cip-s02.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (Michael Haardt)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: ASCII and VT100 Pictures available per ftp (was Re: [Picture] ...)
Date: 28 Jan 1993 09:30:18 GMT
Organization: RWTH-Aachen, Deutschland
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: cip-s02.informatik.rwth-aachen.de

I got many requests, so I made my pictures available per ftp. You can
get them from ftp.thp.uni-koeln.de[134.95.64.1]:pub/linux/tmp/*
or[134.95.80.1]:pub/thp/linux/tmp/* if you can"t reach the first server.

They are stored as compressed tape archives, so do "uncompress lp.tar.Z"
and "tar xvf lp.tar" to unpack them.

Have fun!

Michael
--
Twiggs are root are a wonderful tree (tm) Twiggs & root 1992
Newsgroups: alt.romance
From: laser@buckwheat.cray.com (Catherine Hartman  {68387 CF/DEV})
Subject: wedding gift for my betrothed???
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 26 Jan 93 15:49:16 CST



Do any of you wonderfully romantic people have any ideas of what I 
could give to my incredibly NON-sappy fiance as a wedding gift?

I'm 25 and he's 30.  We live together and both have professions in 
the computer industry.

I would love  (LOVE) to give him something great, but we both have
just about everything we could want as far as jewelry goes.  We just
bought a house, and that's almost completely furnished.  He has 
all his stereo and sports equipment.

What I'd really LOVE to give him is something he would never expect
or that would be incredibly touching.   He is excellent at spoiling
me when it comes to gifts, but he never gives me ideas.  (Mainly 
because he doesn't need anything).  And....I've never seen him
at a loss for words.  Maybe I'm babbling, but those of you with
NON-sappy SO's or spouses understand.  To give them something
that touches their hearts is the GREATEST gift of all....And with
all the wedding stress, my hearts working, but the brain is fried.

Cost is an issue....nothing over $300.00.

Any ideas would be appreciated immensely.


THANK YOU IN ADVANCE,
===============================
    _____
   /    /
  /                 /      *
 /     ___  __/__  /__        ___
/     /   |  /    /   /  /   /__/
\____/|__/\_/\___/   /__/\__/\__

Catherine M. Hartman
Catherine.Hartman@cray.com
Cray Research, Inc. 
(715) 726-8387




--
===============================
    _____
   /    /
  /                 /      *
From: weaver@jetsun.weitek.COM (Michael Gordon Weaver)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Advice please!!
Date: 26 Jan 93 17:53:57 GMT
Organization: WEITEK Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1993Jan25.210627.10562@ac.dal.ca> rtousi@ac.dal.ca writes:
>Hi
>   Is it right to try and steal a girl from a boyfriend who is making her
>life miserable by his neglect, even though she still loves him. But she openly
>admitts he's making her life Hell.
>
There isn't a clear right or wrong about this. If she leaves him and
ends up with you, I wouldn't feel guilty about it. But trying to break
them up is a bad idea. Wouldn't you worry that she would let someone
else steal her from you?  And she will tend to feel that she was pushed
into leaving him, rather than freely choosing, which might lead her to
resent you.

If you want her, let her know, but do it subtly. You don't want to look
like you are pushing her into leaving him. Don't give her too much
sympathy about her boyfriend. It is tempting, but remember, she has
chosen to be with her boyfriend, and her misery comes from this. If you
are sympathetic about it, you will be helping her keep up the idea that
her misery is unavoidable, rather than a consequence of her choice.

Peace,
Michael.
Newsgroups: alt.romance
From: hudel@waterloo.hp.com (Chris Hudel)
Subject: Re: Date of Valentine's Day (was gift suggestions needed!!)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 19:18:50 GMT
Organization: Hewlett Packard (Panacom Division)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8.5]

Daniel L'Hommedieu (eagle@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu) wrote:
: For all those in Long-Distance relationships, just remember that
: Valentine's day this year is on a SATURDAY!  Amtrack, here I come!
:
Boy are you ever lucky!  Up here in Canada, Valentine's day is on
a SUNDAY.  Oh well, Sunday's not too bad. :-)

--
                                                         Chris Hudel
business: hudel@waterloo.hp.com                         519/883-3080
pleasure: chudel@watarts.uwaterloo.ca             
(Pleasure forwards to business...)       - all comments are mine, not HP's -
From: dswt@bnr.co.uk (Stewart Tansley)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Advice please!!
Date: 26 Jan 93 19:22:43 GMT
Organization: BNR Europe Ltd, London Road, Harlow, England.
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.199.202.48

In article <1993Jan25.210627.10562@ac.dal.ca> rtousi@ac.dal.ca writes:
>   Is it right to try and steal a girl from a boyfriend who is making her
>life miserable by his neglect, even though she still loves him. But she openly
>admitts he's making her life Hell.

I think this is a proposal for the FAQ! :-)

Give it a go, but most experience will tell you (a) you'll have a very
tough job and (b) she wont be worth it anyway, as she's screwed up enough
to have a relationship with some jerk.

===========================================================================
Stewart Tansley     | BNR Europe Limited              |  'Be cool, or be
                    | London Rd, Harlow, CM17 9NA, UK |    cast out...'
dswt@bnr.co.uk      | +44 279 429531 x2763 (ESN 742)  | Subdivisions, Rush
===========================================================================
  'You know how that rabbit feels -- going under your speeding wheels...'
===========================================================================
Newsgroups: alt.romance
From: demetri@cgrg.ohio-state.edu 
Subject: Interracial Romance
Organization: OSU Advanced Computing Center for the Arts and Design
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 00:06:19 GMT

 I have a number of resources, but none of them at my fingertips.  A more
recent book was called The Rainbow Effect by Kathlyn Gay.  It is usually
classified in the library as "Juvenile literature" but is not really a
kiddie book.  It discusses dating, marriage, and children.  Mark ("Kaffir
Boy") Mathabane and his wife Gail wrote Love in Black and White about their
own interracial marriage.  Somewhere I have a list of organizations,
including national ones, such as Citizens for a Multiracial America.  
There are also magazines such as Interrace and New People.  I would love to
see a newsgroup for this topic but I'm not sure the interest is there.  I
asked the same question in soc.couples and never got any response.  If you
have any questions about the things I have mentioned, you can mail me.
                               Renee

 
Newsgroups: alt.romance,alt.polyamory
From: tuff@ellis.uchicago.edu (Geoff Tuffli)
Subject: Re: Polyamory again (was Re: last night...)
Reply-To: tuff@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 05:02:30 GMT

In article noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring) writes:
>
>Our relationship has gotten closer because of it since ours is not built on
>some stupid idea of possession and exclusive ownership, but one on giving.
>I can't be all things to her, and she can't be all things to me.  I choose to
>love her unconditionally - that is the best form of love, imho.  I will never
>put the requirement of monogamy on my romantic partners - trying to restrict
>another person on the matters of love is *not true love*.  It can never deep
>down lead to any kind of trust - it is an inherently untrustworthy act to
>demand monogamy - do you want to build a close relationship on such a
>foundation?  If a person chooses truly on their own to be monogamous that is
>great - they are doing it because of their love for their partner.  But to
>*demand* it of others is not right, for me at least.  Monogamy is a fine and
>workable lifestyle option (actually the default in our culture at this time)
>if both people of the relationship are *truly* committed to it - it *only
>works* to enhance the relationship when both *voluntarily* choose monogamy
>because of love for their partner and not because it was taught as the only
>way to be in our obsessively uptight monogamous culture.
>

	Some points that might be worthwhile in considering...

	Polyamory is, I completely agree, a perfectly acceptible type of
relationship, but despite your avowal of it as an alternative, you do lob
a few blows directly at the concept of monogamy that I think reveals a
misunderstanding of what and why people may prefer monogamy.

	Monogamy is not, I feel, a matter of possessing your partner, nor
is is a matter of trust even, as you correctly, I think, pointed out, trust
should not require that you be looking over one's partner's shoulder --
such is hardly what can be construed as trust.

	To me, at least, I prefer monogamy, demand it in any long-term
relationship I might undertake or have undertaken, simply because it is a
matter of rapport, or, to put it another way, complete and utter focus
in that aspect of one's life. One can certainly love any number of people;
as it has been stated, the more people you love, the more you CAN love,
but rapport or focus is by definition a thing that can be done with only
one person at a time. This is not love, per se, though it generally requires
love; it is not "becoming" the other person, it is matching the other
person.

	People need and want and desire different things in my experience
(think Myer-Briggs as a good example of this, for those who know of it),
and what I described above is what *I* want and desire. For others, it is
irrelevant, and love alone is perfectly satsfactory. For some, even that is
not desired on any deep level. Matter of taste, matter of personality. The
upshoot is, tho' polyamory is perfectly fine, moral, what-have-you, I feel
it is unfair to label monogomy in the terms you have.

	Geoff Tuffli
	The Green Griffin
From: jmorriss@uwsuper.edu (JON M. MORRISSETTE)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: I am I cheep or What?
Date: 26 Jan 93 21:20:49 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin - Superior, Wisconsin
NNTP-Posting-Host: 137.81.10.189



   Ok for some time now my SO has forbid me to buy her anything, and i have
been feeling vary cheep about this becuase i had give her something that
i dont use any more for X-mas and she just bit my head off for wanting to 
buy a birthday present for her. And right now I feel like i am being
overly cheep with her. Am I?
From: ccsmh@sunlab1.bath.ac.uk (Mark Harding)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Advice please!!
Date: 27 Jan 93 09:03:01 GMT
Organization: Bath University Computing Services, UK

In the referenced article, rtousi@ac.dal.ca writes:
>Hi
>   Is it right to try and steal a girl from a boyfriend who is making her
>life miserable by his neglect, even though she still loves him. But she openly
>admitts he's making her life Hell.

I'd be careful that the boyfriend doesn't find out - otherwise you may find
yourself on the receiving end of some abuse!

Actually I am in a similar situation:

Until 2 months ago I was living with my ex-girlfriend. Every Friday I'd go out
with my own friends to the local pubs where we met some girls. We struck up a
friendship with them which basically existed only in the pubs - I had no 
desire to be anything other than friends while I was in a relationship. It is
a very friendly/flirty friendship. I don't think my ex was too keen but like I
said If I am with someone then I am *WITH* that person only - she knew that.

Anyway, I have split up with my girlfriend and for the last two
months have been depressed, sullen, sad etc but trying hard to get over her :-)
It's getting better *slowly* . . .

Now, one  of the girls has a boyfriend who we decided was a bit *wet* and when
we pointed this out to her she readily agreed. So a friend and I decided to
ask two of the girls (one involved) out - if she said no, fine - if she said 
Yes then great.

She said Yes, I said jokingly, 'do we need to invite your boyfriend' - she
said, 'Oh him? Forget about him.' 

So, there you have it. The way I look at it is - if the relationship is on the
rocks and she is aware of the fact, then she may not need much encouragement
to end it - show your interest and see what happens.

Saying that - this date is only a *friendship* thing as far as I am concerned.
Maybe it will go further - I'm not sure I'm ready - I'm having *far* to much
fun being single :-) Of course if anything were to happen . . .

Mark
From: knighttl.duvm.ocs.drexel.edu
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: I am I cheep or What?
Date: 27 Jan 93 17:05:44 GMT
Organization: Drexel U.

In article <jmorriss.1.0@uwsuper.edu> jmorriss@uwsuper.edu (JON M. MORRISSETTE)
writes:
>
>
>   Ok for some time now my SO has forbid me to buy her anything, and i have
>been feeling vary cheep about this becuase i had give her something that
>i dont use any more for X-mas and she just bit my head off for wanting to 
>buy a birthday present for her. And right now I feel like i am being
>overly cheep with her. Am I?
>

		It sounds to me that she is playing games with you.  She really likes you
buying her things but just wants it seem like she doesn't.  Tyr to talk to her
and get her to tell you what she wants that is the first step in a successful
relationship,  COMMUNICATION.  That is why so many fail.  If that doesn't work
then try these next few suggestions.

		I can understand how you feel,  I have done the same thing to guys in my past
and God only knows that I have paid for it.  Some advice that I can give you is
to try and listen to her when she says how much she wants this or that maybe
you can find something in the conversation that you can afford.  Maybe taking a
trip to the store and remebering what she looks at or comments about.  If she
is with you and comments on how much she likes this sweater that is usually a
hint that she would like you to get it for her. 

		Another suggetion is try to do romantic gestures that don't have to envolve
large somes of money.  Like send her a bouquette of ballons or bring her
flowers for no reason,  a little bit of romance usually sweeps any girl of her
feet.  If she still complains that she does not want you to buy her any thing
then tell her you to make up her mind.  




						C-YA BYE!
							Terethia Knighton
								
								B.K.A.
								*Tere*
From: aaron@minster.york.ac.uk
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Curious?
Date: 26 Jan 93 11:32:14 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of York, England

I for one, and I noticed someone who agreed with this, find independent
women more attractive than dependent. Someone who has enough of a 
personality and self esteem to go out and do things for themselves tends
to be more interesting than someone who becomes dependent or feels the
world owes them something. It is one thing to be willing to compromise
in a relationship but another to be totally malleable. I want someone
to speak up for themselves. I don't want to go out with someone that is
so weak that I unaviodably wield ultimate power because that is not what
I want to do. (Far more likely to be the other way round)

		Aaron Turner