HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mheney@access.digex.com (Michael K. Heney)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.space
Subject: NSS in Washington DC?
Date: 25 Jan 1993 14:48:30 -0500
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

I'm trying to get hold of the NSS folks in Washington, DC, to see if
I can't give away some of my time :-).  I'm a former L-5er from
Ann Arbor, MI now living in the DC area.  I'd like to see what's
going on in this area, and volunteer (or work for pay!) when I'm
not actively earning a living. 
 
Unfortunately, I've had problems reaching anyone.  I can't find a
phone listing for SpacePac; there's problems with NSS's phone number,
and I even tried motorcycling over and knocking on the office door
(granted, it was during the inaugural week festivities).
 
Anyway, I'd like to find a way to donate some time to NSS and/or SpacePac.
I can be reached by e-mail, at home at (301) 933-0809, or at work at
(202) 233-9066.  Please either pass my name/numbers to Those In Charge
if you know them/talk to them/are them, or point me in the right 
direction.  Thanks much.
-- 
Mike Heney                |   Senior Systems Analyst and     |  Reach for the
mheney@access.digex.com   |  Space Activist / Entrepreneur   |  Stars, eh?
Kensington, MD (near DC)  |     * Will Work for Money *      |
From: leech@cs.unc.edu (Jon Leech)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.space
Subject: Re: Goldin News from This Week's Space News
Date: 27 Jan 93 22:34:03 GMT
Organization: The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
NNTP-Posting-Host: mahler.cs.unc.edu


    From Av. Week's 1/25 "Washington Outlook" column:

    ON HOLD

    NASA chief Daniel S. Goldin has been having a hard time getting
    his phone calls returned - no matter who is in the Oval Office. As
    the White House changed hands last week, he still had not heard
    from either Administration on how long he is to stay. Oddsmakers
    here say not long, but at least through next month's shuttle
    mission. Goldin has made it clear he would like to stay, and he
    has some strong support in Congress. House Science, Space, and
    Technology Committee Chairman George E. Brown, Jr. (D-Calif.)
    likes him. And Goldin's diligent promotion of minority contractors
    has caught the eye of Rep. Louis Stokes (D.-Ohio), the new head of
    NASA's Appropriations Committee.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.space
From: aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer)
Subject: Re: Soyuz vs. reality
Organization: Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 23:19:28 GMT

In article <1k1k4sINN5ai@mojo.eng.umd.edu> sysmgr@king.eng.umd.edu writes:

>>If Lockheed is seriously considering launching Soyuzes on Protons...

>Funny, they seem to have more information at their disposal than you or I, and
>they're considering it. 

Your being a bit selective here Doug. When I post about modifications which
the manufacturers say is possible you assure us that those contractors don't
know anything. It seems that you only think contractors know anything when
you agree with what they say.

  Allen

-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Allen W. Sherzer | "A great man is one who does nothing but leaves        |
|  aws@iti.org     |  nothing undone"                                       |
+----------------------141 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
From: sysmgr@king.eng.umd.edu (Doug Mohney)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.space
Subject: Re: Soyuz vs. reality
Date: 27 Jan 1993 16:11:50 GMT
Organization: Computer Aided Design Lab, U. of Maryland College Park
Reply-To: sysmgr@king.eng.umd.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: queen.eng.umd.edu

In article <1993Jan27.021543.12312@iti.org>, aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes:
>>In the Real World is that it ain't so easy. Unless you take the Sherzer line.
>
>Well golly Doug, just yesterday you where perfectly happy with Lockheed
>estimates about Proton. You argued that we should accept them because
>Lockheed knew more than you or I.

>Yesterday Lockheed took the 'Sherzer line' with your approval because
>you liked what the experts said. But at other times when you didn't
>like what the experts say, suddenly they don't know what they are
>talking about.

Given the tasks they are proposing, it's relatively low risk, does NOT involve
people to sit in the capsules, and is (key phrase) politically feasible.

>Funny how overruns and unforseen problems disapear when Doug likes the idea!

Allen, you're talking out of both sides of your mouth again. Kinda like how,
when you live out your fantasies of killing the Shuttle, you end up pandering 
out the savings to everyone else's pet projects.

I'm still waiting for your solutions to fund Delta Clipper to completion, and
how you are going to single-handedly kill Shuttle with the embedded NASA
astronaut corps and Rockwell International able to outlobby and outspend 
you by a large ratio. 

What, haven't found anyone at NASA to personally spit on lately? 

                    I have talked to Ehud, and lived.
  -- >                  SYSMGR@CADLAB.ENG.UMD.EDU                        < --
From: David.Anderman@ofa123.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: talk.politics.space
Subject: Re: Soyuz lifeboats - la
X-Sender: newtout 0.06 Jan  3 1993
Date: 22 Jan 93  09:31:06


PV>Proteon launchers never existed. There is a heavy Proton launcher (pay
PV>of up to 22 tons in low orbit), but Soyuz spacecrafts are launched by 
PV>launchers. The design goes back to late 1950s, they are very reliable 
PV>dirt cheap. I think that the idea to buy both spacecraft and launchers
PV>Russia may be fruitful.

The idea is to get Soyuzes up to Space Station Freedom to serve as
lifeboats - the Soyuz launchers is not powerful enough to put a
Soyuz spacecraft into a 28 degree orbit, so NASA wants to launch
the Soyuzes inside the Space Shuttle.


PV>
PV>I repeat - Proton _never_ launches Soyuz into orbit. It is used for la
PV>of Mir station modules and other heavy stuff.


Not even Protons can get the Soyuz into the orbit of SSF.

So what do you suggest we do?

___ WinQwk 2.0b#0

--- Maximus 2.01wb
From: sysmgr@king.eng.umd.edu (Doug Mohney)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.space
Subject: Re: Soyuz vs. reality
Date: 26 Jan 1993 17:04:25 GMT
Organization: Computer Aided Design Lab, U. of Maryland College Park
Reply-To: sysmgr@king.eng.umd.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: queen.eng.umd.edu

In article <1993Jan25.231928.27776@iti.org>, aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes:

>Your being a bit selective here Doug. When I post about modifications which
>the manufacturers say is possible you assure us that those contractors don't
>know anything. It seems that you only think contractors know anything when
>you agree with what they say.

No, I personally disagree with your fast and loose budget numbers. I do NOT
disagree with any contractor who says they can do anything (for the proper 
amount of yankee dollars). 

I disagree with your philosophy of beer can budgeting your "proposals" while
high-balling the "competition" and kicking NASA whenever you see an opening.


                    I have talked to Ehud, and lived.
  -- >                  SYSMGR@CADLAB.ENG.UMD.EDU                        < --
From: robichau@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (Paul Robichaux)
Subject: Re: THE DIVINE MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE
Reply-To: robichau@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov
Organization: New Technology, Inc.
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 18:24:39 GMT

In <1993Jan25.181647.3311@cnsvax.uwec.edu> mcelwre@cnsvax.uwec.edu writes:
>               First, Jesus Christ was NOT unique, John 3:16 NOTWITH-
>          STANDING.  There is ALWAYS at least one such perfect living 
>          Master (God Incarnate) PHYSICALLY ALIVE in this world AT ALL 
>          TIMES, a continuous succession THROUGHOUT HISTORY, both 
>          before and after the life of Jesus. 

Well, there you have it: now that explains where Dr. Beter came from.
-- 
Paul Robichaux, KD4JZG              | May explode if disposed of improperly.
Mission Software Development Div.   | Printed on recycled phosphors.
New Technology, Inc.		    | ** PGP 2.0 key available on request **
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:26183 talk.politics.soviet:10684 soc.culture.europe:11370 soc.culture.greek:12465 soc.history:10927 soc.culture.turkish:14877
From: hallam@zeus02.desy.de (Phill Hallam-Baker)
Subject: Re: BUSH BOMBS ISLAMIC CONFERENCE TODAY
Reply-To: Hallam@zeus02.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 21:30:24 GMT

In article <1993Jan20.003224.29666@das.harvard.edu>, adam@endor.uucp (Adam
Shostack) writes:
|
|>BTW, do you really think that without a revolution, Suadi Arabia will
|>drift towords democracy?

Nope, I think there will be a revolution, hopefully it will drift towards a
democracy later (cf english civil war and the puritans with contemporary Iran).

However I do expect revolution in Kewait as the "first to save their skins"
royal family gets progressively more unpopular. This may well lead to change in
Saud.


--

Phill Hallam-Baker
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:26194 soc.culture.yugoslavia:10676 soc.culture.europe:11379 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:1352 soc.culture.croatia:495
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.europe
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Re: The circle is closing in....
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 20:14:52 EST
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <12418.3248.uupcb@factory.com> michael.polymenakos@factory.com (Michael Polymenakos)  writes:

> Even if the subject falls on the agenda in the future, recognition of
>pseudomacedonia will be a long way to come.

But in the end, in the end, in the final end of it all - they win.
Does the "Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus (TRNC)" ring a bell? 


"	Let us now look at what happened in the Greek community of Cyprus
from 1963-1974...
	Makarios never appeared to have regretted the fact that his 
13-point proposals, made against the background of suspicion and tension, 
precipitated the break-up of the bicommunal State. Probably he thought that
the ensuing state-within-the-State situation was preferable to what 
preceded it. At least the events of December 1963 got him off the Zurich-
London hook, and now he felt free to lead his people in a new struggle
towards a goal which would certainly not be a Greco-Turkish State. What
was this new goal to be? The answer was given by him in scores of speeches
and other public statements he made before and after December 1963. To take
a quite typical example, on 3rd November 1963, at Paralimni Church he said:

	 'What is our desire? We have proclaimed it many times: our union
	  with the Motherland, eternal Greece. What will our reply be if
	  such a solution is made difficult, and if some think compromises
	  are required or that something be given in return? No is the 
	  reply, and the struggle will continue until complete fulfilment.'

Again, in interviews with Greek Cypriot newspapers, he explained his 
position in these terms:

	 'The real victory will be achieved when Cyprus will be annexed
	  to Greece without any concessions whatever... I am for Enosis
	  but it must be genuine Enosis without curbs or strings. (Ethniki
	  newspaper, 1.10.1967)'

The same idea was expressed by the House of Representatives which on  
26th June 1967, passed unanimously the following resolution:

	 'Interpreting the age-long aspirations of the Greeks of Cyprus,
	  the House declares that despite any adverse circumstances it will
	  not suspend the struggle conducted with the support of all Greeks
	  until this struggle succeeds in uniting the whole and undivided
	  Cyprus with the Motherland, without any intermediary stages.'"

Serdar Argic

                           'We closed the roads and mountain passes that 
                            might serve as ways of escape for the Turks 
                            and then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)
                           'In Soviet Armenia today there no longer exists 
                            a single Turkish soul.'    (Sahak Melkonian)


Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: adam@endor.uucp (Adam Shostack)
Subject: Re: islam & ethnicity
Organization: Aiken Computation Lab, Harvard University
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 17:22:31 GMT

In article <1993Jan27.143439.27783@dsg.cs.tcd.ie> ahmed@dsg.cs.tcd.ie (Ahmed El-Habbash) writes:
>Applying the Islamic law within an Islamic state is not different from
>applying any law in any state. The Islamic law in any Islamic state must
>apply to all people under that state regardless of whether those people
>are Muslim or have any other religion.

	I must disagree with your first sentence.  Applying a
religious law is wrong.  Appyling a religious law to people of another
religion is not only wrong, but a prescription for disaster.

	The only law that has any moral force behind it is one created
by a democratic process.  

Adam
Adam Shostack 				       adam@das.harvard.edu

"If we had a budget big enough for drugs and sexual favors, we sure
wouldn't waste them on members of Congress..."   -John Perry Barlow
From: ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: ITERFADA WATCH
Date: 24 Jan 93 17:33:41 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <4996@copper.Denver.Colorado.EDU>
aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa) writes:

>In article <4662@bimacs.BITNET> ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich) writes:
>>The Inrwefada is a wave of Inter-Arab violence , parallel to the
>>intifada against the Jews.
>>Bellow find the INTERFADA death toll.
>>( Through January 10 1993 )
>>
>> Killed for "cooperation with the authorities"    769
>> killed in internment camps                        43
>> killed incidentally in actions against Jews        6
>>  TOTAL                                           818
>>We shall overcome     Gideon Ehrlich     ERETZ YISRAEL
.....
(ANISA):
>" You are talking about the nonsensical ravings of a lunatic mind."
                             ^^^^^^^^^^^            ^^^^^^^^^
What is the purpose of that racial comment?
Muslims do think the lunatic way and compute their "year" sollelely
according to the lunatic month ( 12 LUNAR monthes = 1 Muslim-year )
and henth their "year" is about 11 days shorter then the actual
sun-year. But what that has to do with "nonsense" ? .

If the aim of the year is just to serve as a long enough time-period
for measuring people-ages and historical events then it is good enough!

Gideon Ehrlich   ERETZ YISRAEL
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: zionism in crisis / Ethiopian Aliyah
From: adam@endor.uucp (Adam Shostack)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 20:58:50 GMT
Organization: Aiken Computation Lab, Harvard University

In article <74284@cup.portal.com> L-Bueno@cup.portal.com (Louis Alberto Bueno) writes:
>chrism@cirrus.com (Chris Metcalfe) writes:
>>In article <74244@cup.portal.com> L-Bueno@cup.portal.com (Louis Alberto Bueno) writes:
>>Anyway, 100% of the Beta Israel community has been airlifted to 
>>Israel in Operation Moses and Operation Solomon.  What is your point?  That

>please give me further info on the possible
>imbalance between the influx and treatment of Ethiopian Jews vs. Russian
>Jews, or, should I say, the balance of such?  I have no hard opinion on
>this subject at all; any and all facts/opinions are welcome.

	In an interview on 1/20/93, Interior Minister Arye Deri said
that the immigrants from Ethiopia receive special treatment in Israel,
with state allocated funds amounting to four times that given to
immigrants coming from other countries.

	(This is adapted from Israeline)

>>Many of the Beta Israel have been located in Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, as well
>>as in Beer Sheva and towns in the Galil.  I spent an interesting afternoon
>>last April walking through the Georgian and Beta Israel neighborhoods of
>>Beer Sheva.

>	Now that was said without condenscion or sarcasm.  So far, so good.
>Unfortunately, the glaring ommission here is: What *did* you see in these
>neighborhoods?  What were the living conditions like?  Who exactly were the
>denizens thereof?

	Having met some of the Ethiopians now living in Jerusalem
(people who entered in 84-85), they were living much the same as the
other Israelis I visited with.

Adam

Adam Shostack 				       adam@das.harvard.edu

"If we had a budget big enough for drugs and sexual favors, we sure
wouldn't waste them on members of Congress..."   -John Perry Barlow
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:26336 talk.politics.soviet:10784 soc.culture.europe:11464 soc.culture.greek:12616 soc.history:11015
From: dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren)
Subject: Re: islam & ethnicity
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 03:06:23 GMT

wmuhanna@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Waleed A Muhanna) writes:

# Believe away, as you wish.  It seems that nothing will get through to you.
# I give up.

So do I. Unfortunately, every debate with you deteriorates into a war
of attrition. No point in continuing.

Nontheless, perhaps a *factual* response from you would be illuminating.
You simply deleted my questions:

1) Was Rushdie sentenced to death *because he is considered a Moslem*,
   which makes his crime worse?

2) If the answer to 1) is "yes", why was he considered a Moslem?

# Crimes have been committed in the name of Islam and Christianity.  Those
# who misappropriate/use the name Islam/Christianity to justify their
# crimes should be condemned.  The same applies to those who use the
# name of world Jewry and Judaism. 

Yes, that is reasonable.

# Thanks.  Would you support a repeal of all laws in Israel that
# discriminate against non-Jews?   Would you support a genuine democracy
# in Israel, one in which all citizens (both Jews and non-Jews) have equal
# rights?   Yes/no?

Probably, if I had any power of influence, I would, although with regard
to national security matters one would have to take a closer look.

Are you willing to condemmn the continuing calls, all over the Arab
world, to the annihilation of Israel?

# You had to go back to the old game of trying to find justifications, ha?

Eh? So we can wake up one morning and forget everything? How nice that
would be. The Arab world has tried, and large parts of it are still
trying, to wipe Israel out. And you think it is not relevant to what
decisions Israel takes?

# Yeah.  But, tell me Danny, who committed the original sin in Palestine?  
                                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^
Hey, you guys still using this expression? 

# Are the Arabs driving the Jews into the sea?  

Well they sure have tried, have they not?

# Or is it the Israelis who are
# intent on driving the Palestinian Arabs into the desert?

I am not aware of any practice of driving them into the desert. Thinking
about Kuwait, maybe?

-Danny Keren.


Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:26039 talk.politics.soviet:10649
From: perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman)
Subject: Re: leibowitz
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Distribution: talk,world
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 23:32:24 GMT

In article <23273@venera.isi.edu> arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens) writes:
>In article <2022@spam.ua.oz> jaskew@spam.ua.oz (Joseph Askew) writes:
>>
>> In article <1993Jan18.144458.195@vms.huji.ac.il> backon@vms.huji.ac.il writes:
>>
>> >Wayne, I have a terrific idea. Spend $10 and phone Leibowitz. His home phone
>> >(from the U.S.) is: +972-2-255449. His home address:
>> >Professor Y. Leibowitz
>> >Rechov Ussishkin 62
>> >Jerusalem, Israel
>>
>> I don't want to appear totally ignorant here but didn't Professor Leibowitz
>> die in 1991? Are we talking about the same Leibowitz? The biochemist who
>> talks about 'JudeoNazis' or whatever. A really old guy who fled from Hitler
>> in 193something? Are you sure he is still alive because I am sure I heard
>> he died.
>
>Not only is he not dead, he was just this week nominated for the Israel
>Prize, a high honor to be bestowed upon him by the Israeli state.  I
>suppose Mr. Backon should hurry and inform the Isareli government that
>Leibowitz is nothing but a maker of bad coffee rendered mentally
>unbalanced by deaths in his family.

Pardon me, Yigal, but where does Josh Backon say this, or anything that
prompts this, in the above?  He doesn't, is the answer.  

-- 
"How sad to see/A model of decorum and tranquillity/become like any other sport
A battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee." -Tim Rice,"Chess"
     Eric S. Perlman 				 <perlman@qso.colorado.edu> 
  Center for Astrophysics and Space Astronomy, University of Colorado, Boulder
From: jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: zionism in crisis
Date: 26 Jan 93 13:50:52 GMT
Distribution: talk
Organization: Edinburgh University

In article <1993Jan24.043211.12263@cs.brown.edu> dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:
   kgivon@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (karen lee givon) writes:
   
       [something inconsequential]

   And that, Karen, is what makes Wayne's blood boil: that we are still here.
             ^^^^^
   -Danny Keren.

Surely you mean Keren, Keren?
^^^^^^
(cue for "Police Squad"-style joke :-)






-- 
===Jeremy Henderson===jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk=          

"I'm not including the previous postings on this topic because I found the 
majority of them to be far too nasty for my liking." - anonymous net.loser
From: bv652@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ilan Uri Woll)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: ITERFADA WATCH
Date: 23 Jan 1993 17:17:31 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: bv652@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ilan Uri Woll)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich) says:

>The Inrwefada is a wave of Inter-Arab violence , parallel to the
>intifada against the Jews.
>Bellow find the INTERFADA death toll.
>
>( Through January 10 1993 )
>
> Killed for "cooperation with the authorities"    769
>
> killed in internment camps                        43
>
> killed incidentally in actions against Jews        6
>                                                 ____
>  TOTAL                                           818
>
>
>We shall overcome     Gideon Ehrlich     ERETZ YISRAEL
>

For curiosity, what's your source?
-- 
---  !      ^    !\  !
 !   !     /-\   ! \ !
___  !__  /   \  !  \!  
                        Avoid cliches like the plague" George Shaw