From: jagreath@eos.ncsu.edu (JOSEPH ALAN GREATHOUSE)
Subject: Re: Fraternal Reality From a Greek
Originator: jagreath@c00100-100lez.eos.ncsu.edu
Reply-To: jagreath@eos.ncsu.edu (JOSEPH ALAN GREATHOUSE)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 08:48:02 GMT


In article <1992Nov21.083215.12554@umr.edu>, ckincy@mcs213h.cs.umr.edu (Charles Kincy) writes:
=>In article <1992Nov20.195428.25027@rtsg.mot.com> gatchall@rtsg.mot.com (Scott W. Gatchall) writes:
=>>In article <1992Nov19.193725.21918@umr.edu> ckincy@mcs213f.cs.umr.edu (Charles Kincy) writes:
=>>>In article <1992Nov18.150031.21368@rtsg.mot.com> gatchall@rtsg.mot.com (Scott W. Gatchall) writes:

[flames deleted]

=>Please.  I'll put my school's academic record against your alma mater's
=>any old day.  Espcially vis-a-vis the costs of attending.

How about mine?  I would say that $654/semester at one of the nation's top
engineering and sciences schools is an _extremely_ good deal.

=>However, our Greek system is extremely dismal.  And I have heard from
=>friends that Greek society on other publically-funded campuses are
=>still pretty bad, if not as bad as ours.

Your perception of the Greek system is dismal.  But, the fact that the 
Collegiate Fraternity fills a need expressed by society at college has not
changed.  

=>>logic  ... here's a classic example of a hasty generalization which
=>>seems to be an infectious disease amongst anti-greeks.

=>Hasty generalization?  Hardly.  We're talking about one entity here.
=>Greek organization.  Greek society.  And the evils that come from
=>it.  How is that generalizing? 

You lump everybody in a fraternity into one stereotype and base your arguments
on that stereotype.  Generalization.

=>There are no generalizations.  What you are attacking are imaginary
=>syllogisms.  We are not saying "Fraternities are evil; X is a member
=>of a fraternity, therefore X is evil."  That is not the message here.

Yet you base your arguments on generalized stereotypes.  Quite hypocritical.

=>That is the message *you* perceive, and for that I am sorry.  It's
=>not my fault that you don't know how to read for comprehension.  
=>I guess it's a failure in your education.  Not your fault, you under-
=>stand.  But, hey, you had a fine fraternity.  There can be no doubt
=>about that!

=>No, the message is that the Greek system is an obvious power game.
=>One that needs to be put to an end.  Unless everyone has an equal
=>chance to play.  Which they do not.  And.  That's.  It.  

I disagree.  As I stated before, there is a need to establish a niche for 
oneself at college.  Each individual should be allowed the broadest possible
choice of ways to establish that niche.  Becoming a member of a Greek letter
organization is one way to do this.  I don't disagree that there should be
co-ed organizations.  There should also be single-sex organizations.

=>We're not asking that the Greek system be abolished.  Granted, it
=>would make some of us happier that people didn't need to have their
=>egos stroked by minions of the fraternity system, but we would be
=>happy to see two little reforms instituted in the Greek system.
=>[1] no hazing; [2] no discrimination.  Period.  That means, no 
=>denial of membership because X is a _________.  

=>As a bonus, we're even asking you to do it voluntarily.  For your
=>own good.  Because a fascist administration may get just a little too
=>upset at you, and, *whoosh*, no more Greek system.  Wouldn't that be
=>a shame?

I just love having somebody else tell me what to think and how to think it.
It isn't facist administrations that I worry about, it is facist individuals
such as yourself.  As for getting rid of a Greek system, I would hate to imagine
the lawsuits which would be filed against a public institution for what would
amount to discrimination based on membership in a Greek Letter Organization.

=>The bad behaviour of Greek society reflects badly upon academia.
=>And the harmful things it does harms the image of all college students
=>everywhere.  It needs to clean up its act.  Now.

Let me correct your generalization:  The bad behaviour of some organizations
within the Fraternity system reflects badly upon the entire system.  Many 
chapters *have* cleaned up their act.  Many others are starting to.  The
process is long and difficult, but in the end, worth the effort.  It *cannot*
just happen overnight, as you assert.  Change is easy to talk about, but getting
a group to change is very difficult.
  
=>cpk

-- 
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*                                                                        *
*  Joseph A. Greathouse            *  All opinions are solely mine.      *  
*  Theta Chi Fraternity            *  A non-hazing, leadership-oriented  *
*  Delta Rho Chapter               *  organization, promoting Alma Mater *
*  North Carolina State University *  and the concept of a Helping Hand. *
*  Final Score:  Wolfpack 31 - Wahoos 7  Go Pack!!!!                     *
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