HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: akao@.com (Adam Kao)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Two new FAQ panels (for editing): Panel 1 for dealing with flamewars
Date: 13 Nov 92 02:39:51 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Redwood Shores, CA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.


In article <Nov.12.11.06.33.1992.12686@net.bio.net> charleen@net.bio.net (Charleen Bunjiovianna) writes:

>Why not post your ba.general FAQ series (which for the most part
>consists of non-newsgroup-specific stuff) to every newsgroup you read?
>Why bother referring new readers to news.announce.newusers, the
>newsgroup specifically for new users?

I think the reasoning is that we've tried to refer new readers to 
news.announce.newusers for years now, but large numbers of them
don't hear us, don't listen, can't or won't access a different group.
So, we hope this will be more effective, precisely because it's
harder to ignore.


>I wouldn't have any problem with the articles 1) if they were truly
>FAQs (lists of Frequently Asked Questions).  They're not.  The latest
>two are just something Eugene Miya apparently thinks is cute.

This seems to be an objection over content, less severe than the original
post, which seemed to object to the very idea.  No one is claiming the posts
are perfect; I'm sure Eugene is willing to improve them in response to
specific criticism.


> 2) if
>they proved to be effectual in preventing flamewars.  They're not.  You
>really think Eric P. is sitting there at Stanford saying, "Wow.  Look
>at that FAQ.  Guess I better not post any more articles about Japan in
>ba.general if I know what's good for me, huh?"

The idea is that the posts will be read by the people who might respond
to Eric P.  These are generally people who are new to the net and haven't
learned that flaming is a waste of time.  If these posts can help speed
that learning process, flamewars will be shorter because less people will
be flaming.


>I now return you to your regularly-scheduled lovefest.  Kissy-kissy
>everyone!

I've misinterpreted my share of posts, but I have to say that this
strikes me as a bit grumpy.  I can think of a few reasons you might
write this (a bad day, perhaps) but let me take a guess and say that,
no, we are not all in love with Eugene Miya and no, we are not all going
to ignore your opinions in favor of his.

Adam


PS Suggestion: a "bell the cat" program that would monitor a group for
a particularly repetitive poster, and post a response (say, max once a
week) which summed up old criticism and answers to outrageous
statements.  Needless to say, such a drastic measure should be
reserved for only the worst offenders, to be determined by, say, a
two-thirds majority.
From: charleen@net.bio.net (Charleen Bunjiovianna)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Two new FAQ panels (for editing): Panel 1 for dealing with flamewars
Date: 11 Nov 92 01:48:23 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: BIOSCI International Newsgroups for Biology


Two *more* FAQs you're going to autopost?  I can't be the only one who's
getting tired of seeing the old ones.  (And, yes, I know how to build a
kill file, thanks.)

I'd like to see some discussion on this before you barrage us with
more automated postings.

Charleen

Newsgroups: ba.general
From: kuo@acuson.com (Ray Kuo)
Subject: getting to SFO from South bay
Organization: Acuson; Mountain View, California
Distribution: ba
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 21:51:11 GMT

Does anyone know of shuttle busses which run from the Mountain View
area to SF airport?  Or is Caltrain the best way to go?

Thanks,
Ray
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Need San Francisco Hotel Recommendations
Date: 11 Nov 92 17:15:13 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Distribution: ba
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <1992Nov11.004522.18353@ultra.com> jeffj@ultra.com writes:
>I'm looking for recommendations for hotels in San Francisco.  I'm specifically looking 
>for a nice place to spend my wedding night :^).  Of course, dis-recommendations are
>also welcome.  Price range?  I said it's for my wedding night...


   Romantic "by the beach" (in which case you really want 
   Sausalito), yuppie plush, or old money filthy rich?

   Probably the snazziest is the Mark Hopkins...and the top o the
   mark restaurant for brunch.
From: koga@pioneer.arc.nasa.gov (Dennis Koga)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Sunnyvale Townhouse For Sale
Date: 10 Nov 92 21:57:34 GMT
Organization: NASA Ames Res. Ctr. Mtn Vw CA 94035

***************************************************
*****  Sunnyvale Townhouse For Sale by Owner  *****
*****         614 North Garland Terrace       *****

Three-level End-unit Townhouse, 17 yrs. old
Approximately 1500 sq. ft. plus 200 sq. ft. Bonus Room
3 Bedroom, 2.5 Bath
Tiled Deck off Master Bedroom
All Electric Kitchen w/Dishwasher and Disposal
Redwood Deck off Dining Room
Gas Fireplace in Living Room
Small Front Garden/Patio
Convenient Washer/Dryer Hookup on Bedroom Level
Large Two Car Attached Garage with Indoor Access
Finished Bonus Room off Garage 

About the Cherrywood Complex:
98 units, with Swimming Pool, Clubhouse and Spa
Newly Shingled Roof done this year
New Firewalls in Attic
Homeowner's Dues includes Earthquake Coverage
Quiet Complex with Limited Car Traffic (Security Gate)
Convenient Location: near Fair Oaks and Old San Francisco Rd.
Easy Access to Community Center, Bus, Shopping and Expressways

Price:  $222,500

Contact:  Dennis Koga at (415) 604-6285 day
                         (408) 737-0988 evenings
From: bryce_jasmer@next.com (Bryce Jasmer)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Any banks with modem access in the Bay Area?
Date: 10 Nov 92 19:48:26 GMT

When living in Portland, my bank (Credit Union really) had a really nice 24  
hour automated telephone access number where you find out the balance and  
make loan payments from checking, and transfer money, and do all sorts of  
useful stuff.

A friend, who still lives in Portland, has a CU that has modem access. You  
can set up various authorized outpayment companies (the phone company,  
gas/elecrtic, Nordstroms, etc.) and you can dial in every month and have the  
CU write and send out the checks, all automatically. All in all, it was  
pretty secure because you would have to set up authorized places to send  
checks to. Of course, there was also the full range of account statements,  
histories, transfering between various subparts of your account.

My current CU doesn't even provide 24 hour telephone access (and I tend to do  
most of my banking work at 2am, not "banking hours".)  :-(

Does anyone know of a bank/CU that does this in the Bay Area? Please email me  
the name and phone number (of a real person, not a modem) and I will  
summarize. I would like to think that Silicon Valley leads the banking  
industry in things like this.

Thanks,
Bryce Jasmer
bryce_jasmer@next.com
From: claude@color3.UUCP (Claude Goldsmith)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Seeking Recomendations for Floor Tile - Fremont Area
Summary: Looking for reliability, quality, and reasonable cost.
Keywords: n
Date: 6 Nov 92 15:50:46 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: LMSC, Sunnyvale

I'm looking for someone who can replace carpeting in my dining area
with ceramic tile.  I could go through the Yellow Pages and make some
calls, but I'd rather give the work to someone with an established
reputation for quality.  Price is important, but I'll pay a little
more to know the job will be done right the first time.  

I live in north Fremont so someone in southern Alameda County or
northern Santa Clara County would probably be best.

E-mail responses to me and I'll post a summary.

Claude Goldsmith, CFII <claude@sunfse.ese.lmsc.lockheed.com>
 twisted-pair (408) 742-7514	      | Opinions expressed are not 
 on the air - WB6UOO                  | necessarily those of my 
 through the air - Mooney N6416U      | employer.
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: marv@netcom.com (Marvin Raab)
Subject: Re: Two new FAQ panels (for editing): Panel 1 for dealing with flamewars
Organization: user of Netcom Public Access Unix, SF Bay Area
Distribution: ca
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 19:31:11 GMT

In a<1992Nov11.191048.19593@netcom.com> shannah@netcom.com (Teri Miller) writes:

    [in favor of FAQ's]

I also think the FAQ's are a good idea and certainly a reasonable guide,
especially for new people.

I think that news.frequently.asked.questions should become a new newsgroup 
with each article having the newsgroups FAQ as the subject.


                 -marvin



-- 
Marvin Raab                                  
marv@netcom.com                              Mountain View, CA 94040
apple.com!netcom.com!marv                    415-961-6501 (h)
From: eager@eagercon.com (Michael J. Eager)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Attractive Nuisance (was: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions)
Date: 8 Nov 92 19:52:25 GMT
Reply-To: eager@eagercon.com
Organization: Eager Consulting

In article 1083@netcom.com, mzimmers@netcom.com (Michael Zimmers) writes:
>
>And no one has answered my question.  That you dislike this fact doesn't
>make it not so.

Everyone has answered your question.  You continue to claim that every 
answer is not an answer.  So there is a stalemate.

>>Each person is responsible for their property.  This includes the responsibility
>>to maintain it in a fashion which does not pose unreasonable harm to the society
>>or to the members of the society.
>
>You're really not worth the time, but ONCE again:  who did you turn to
>in order to ascertain this responsibility?  Where did you get your
>definition of "unreasonable"?  How did you derive your right to trespass
>and to hold me responsible for the consequences of your crime?

If you look at the previous posting and other postings by other people,
you will note that I and others turn to the courts and lawmakers to acertain 
this responsibility.  You don't like answers like this, since you have
claimed that they are legal arguments, not moral arguments.  

The argument is a moral and legal argument dating back to Hamurabi, at least.

You want to muddle things together.  Nobody has ever said that a person
tresspassing is not guilty of a crime.  It just is not relevant to the question
of whether you are responsible for maintaining your property in a safe fashion.


>
>No one has answered this.  Your pompous assertations don't qualify.

Again, this is the answer you will get from me; you have received a number of
answers from other people.  They are all well reasoned responses.  Labeling
them as "pompous assertions" and then whining that noone ever answers you
only indicates that you can never be answered in a way which you will not
discard.

>
>That would surprise me, but it's still pretty recent in comparison to
>the relatively constant period of centuries of fee law.

If by "fee law" you mean property law, I don't think that it has been
constant for centuries.  Perhaps only in your mind, not in fact.

>
>Can you provide a specific reference?  I promise I won't be so rude as
>to term it "blather".


But you would be so rude to call me a jerk and describe my responses as
pompous?  

[ I have run out of steam responding to your quasi-claims to have some
perfect knowledge of something which no one else understands -- this 
"fee simple absolute" which you have bandied about.  I am also tired
of hearing that noone anwers you, when you deny all answers.  So I will 
not respond to any more of your posts on this matter.  Go ahead, have
the last word. ]

---
Michael J. Eager		Michael.Eager@eagercon.com
Eager Consulting		(415) 325-8077 
1960 Park Boulevard, Palo Alto, CA 94306-1141
From: henry@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: How much to pay the "preacher"?
Date: 13 Nov 92 21:55:44 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems; a div of Booz, Allen & Hamilton

aegl@ossi.com (Tony Luck) wrote: 
->....  But neither she, nor us have any real clue as to what is
->the "normal" fee for this.

you could ask her ... i don't think she'll be bashful; after all,
these things would be her bread and butter ...

--
# henry mensch / booz, allen & hamilton, inc.  / <henry@ads.com>
# "fight the real enemy."  -- sinead o'connor, and many others.
#     for information on the league for programming freedom, 
#                     write to lpf@uunet.uu.net
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: georgew@hspice.portal.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: Information on balloon rides
Organization: Meta - Software
Distribution: ba
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 00:47:47 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.211834.26726@leland.Stanford.EDU> kob@leland.Stanford.EDU (Walter Kob) writes:

>I would be interested in taking a balloon ride in Napa Valley. I noticed
>that there are several tour organizers and I'm wondering if someone could
>give me some recommendations for a good organizer (prices, dependability,
>attractive program).

     I actually haven't done this in Napa, but I did try it out when I was
visiting San Diego last year.  I had such a great time I asked the operator
about San Francisco Bay Area outfits, and they recommended Napa Valley
Balloons (or something very similar).

     Oh, contrasting my experience with one other poster's, our launch was
in the evening.  It also cost a bit more: $130/person.  Personally, if what
the other person was saying concerning dawn launches, I'd schedule another
trip to San Diego and go from there.

							George


-- 
----
George J Wu,  georgew@hspice.portal.com  (Warning: Our email is very flakey.)
Meta-Software,  1300 White Oaks Road,  Campbell, CA 95008,  (408) 369-5400
Never be the first to believe.  Never be the last to deceive.  ---  Chess
From: eager@eagercon.com (Michael J. Eager)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Attractive Nuisance (was: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions)
Date: 8 Nov 92 19:57:25 GMT
Reply-To: eager@eagercon.com
Organization: Eager Consulting

In article 7904@netcom.com, mzimmers@netcom.com (Michael Zimmers) writes:
>In article <184161@pyramid.pyramid.com> lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell) writes:
>
>>In article <1992Nov6.013614.2737@eagercon.com> eager@eagercon.com writes:
>>>First, lets knock down some straw men.  The rights of property owners have
>>>never been constant, for centuries or otherwise.  They are continually being
>>>refined and defined by courts.  This is not new.
>
>>    You left off the concept that, even in the United States, a
>>    property owner does NOT have full and exclusive rights to
>>    private property.  
>>
>>    There have been several Supreme Court decisions that establish that a
>>    private property owner may have to give UP rights if there is 
>>    a national interest at stake.  This has been used to obtain
>>    property rights for freeways, railroads, etc. etc.
>>
>>    There are also other restrictions on private rights due to water
>>    rights, timber rights, mineral rights, etc. etc.
>>
>>    Some of these are national issues, some are local issues.  There
>>    are even sunshine laws, zonings, SID's etc. etc. that clearly
>>    establish precedents that the rights of individual owners are
>>    ALWAYS subordinate to public safety, beauty, issues and/or the
>>    rights of neighbors.    
>>
>>    Not that (Michael Zimmers) has a clue about any of this.
>
>If you weren't so busy being obnoxious, you'd have had time to read
>a post I made last week identifying some of the very things that
>you mentioned.

Actually, Michael, you mentioned only one of these in your posts.  You
mentioned exactly four items: eminent domain, police action, condemnation, 
and easements.  

>
>Why are you liberals so hostile to those who question your right
>to interfere with our lives?

Lon isn't hostile to people who have questions, only to people who
haven't a clue.  Actually, I don't think he is hostile to anybody, you
just don't like having people point out that your arguments ignore the 
real world.

---
Michael J. Eager		Michael.Eager@eagercon.com
Eager Consulting		(415) 325-8077 
1960 Park Boulevard, Palo Alto, CA 94306-1141
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: root@rigel.IntelliCorp.COM (Operator)
Subject: Kahn's Corner Pharmacy - AVOID IT!!!
Date: 6 Nov 92 04:50:47 GMT


Today I had the unpleasant experience of attempting to have a
prescription filled at

                Kahn's Corner Pharmacy
                200 Main Street
                Los Altos, Ca  94022
                415-948-9220

I have met more reasonable people at an IRS audit.  After being
subjected to a cross examination, with questions ranging from the
nature of my profession to why I had chosen this pharmacy, the
pharmacist demand a picture id.  I explained that I have never been
asked for such id at a pharmacy, ever, and that I objected to her
request.  I stated that I did not wish to release personal information
and that I would wait while she called my physician for verification.
At this point she became livid and demanded that I leave the store
immediately as I was disturbing the other customers (there were no
other customers in the store).

I had my prescription filled 1 block away with no problems.

Later in the day I began to think that I might have acted in an
unreasonable manner, so I took an informal survey of 14 individuals.
Not one in that group of 14 had ever been asked for a picture id at a
pharmacy.  Someone suggested that this might have been a prescription
for an FDA controlled drug.  I checked, it is not even scheduled
(maybe a schedule IV).

So, if you get sick and want medication in Los Altos, go to someplace
other than the Kahn's Corner Pharmacy.  (In my humble opinion)

Newsgroups: ba.general
From: pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai)
Subject: Re: Toyota repair: Summary
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Distribution: ba
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 06:33:25 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.021025.307@news.arc.nasa.gov> whitney@pioneer.arc.nasa.gov (David Whitney GDP) writes:
>I ended up at Kurts who seemed to be a good guy,
>but boy is repairing a Toyota expensive these days.  
>e.g. '87 Camry headlight = $150+.

You went to a mechanic to repair a headlight?
I'll do it for $125. Plus you get a free loaner car.
(we have an extra Toyota Corolla now that we bought a
Mitsubishi Expo)

-- 
My opinions are my own.
From: mike@fionn.lbl.gov (Michael Helm)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Looking for chic antique shop
Date: 13 Nov 1992 08:49:13 GMT
Organization: N.I.C.E.
Distribution: ba
Reply-To: mike@fionn.lbl.gov (Michael Helm)
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.128.60

I'm looking for antique shops with lovely photogenic exteriors, for a
photo project.  It need not be strictly an antique shop, but any place
whose window display or whatever _could_ suggest antiques would do.  I
would prefer places in near proximity to the Bay Area.  Thanks for
you suggestions!
Xref: sparky ba.general:4983 ba.food:3731 ba.market.misc:8501
From: michel@babasse.Eng.Sun.COM (Michel Cekleov)
Newsgroups: ba.general,ba.food,ba.market.misc
Subject: Mountain View Street A Faire, Sat Nov 14 and Sun Nov 15
Keywords: Street Fair, Food, Music, Kids Entertainment, Family Event
Date: 12 Nov 92 21:21:23 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: babasse





	SECOND ANNUAL STREET A FAIRE BEING HELD IN 
	DOWNTOWN MOUNTAIN VIEW




	Mountain View Street A Faire will be held Saturday, November 14
	and Sunday, November 15, 1992 from 10 a.m. to 4 p.m. on Castro
	Street in Downtown Mountain View.

	This "giant block party" features an arts and crafts show,
	interactive booths with games, displays, and sites for the
	entire family. The streets have been renamed Kids, Big Kids,
	and Food Street to correspond with the types of activities you
	will find there.
	
	A Taste of Mountain View returns with foods from local
	restaurants including cajun, Chines, American and barbeque.
	While eating patrons can enjoy entertainment on Food Street
	with dancers, Brazilian music. guitarists, and big bands
	performing on the entertainment stage. Kid Street entertainment
	will include puppet shows, clowns, storytelling and musicians.
	Thera are also activities such as chalk drawing, games for
	children 6 and under in the Tots Playland Arena, speed
	pitching, and a jump rope challenge.

	The show is a family oriented, fee event. It is being held on
	castro Street. From Highway 101 use the Shoreline Boulevard
	exit westbound. Plenty of free parking is available.
From: kob@leland.Stanford.EDU (Walter Kob)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Information on balloon rides
Date: 6 Nov 92 21:18:34 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA

Hi there,

I would be interested in taking a balloon ride in Napa Valley. I noticed
that there are several tour organizers and I'm wondering if someone could
give me some recommendations for a good organizer (prices, dependability,
attractive program).

Thank you very much for your help.

Walter
kob@d31ha1.stanford.edu
From: efk00@cd.amdahl.com (Eddie Kieger)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Profit from Drug Smuggling - Legally!
Keywords: Forfeiture, Rip off, Unconstitutional law.
Date: 9 Nov 92 16:41:41 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1992Nov6.204822.1@fnalo.fnal.gov>, maxwell@fnalo.fnal.gov writes:
>In article <1992Nov2.225727.14817@fico.uucp>, ala@fico.uucp writes:
>> In article <1992Oct27.203526.27706@kronos.arc.nasa.gov>
>chucko@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Chuck Fry) writes:
>>>I urge anyone with a conscience to stay well clear of any auctions
>of
>>>so-called "drug lord" property.
>> 
>> My experience has been that these "drug-lords" put their property up
>as
>> collateral on their bail, skip the country, and THEN the property is
>sold.
>
>Nope. The *overwhelming* majority of stuff seized from "drug-lords" is
>taken
>from regular folks who just happened to get busted or who simply fall
>under the 
>gov'ts suspicious gaze.  
>
>You should know that in 80% of the cases of forfeiture, NO CHARGES ARE
>EVER
>FILED. No one is accused. No one is arrested. No one goes to court. No
>one is
>found guilty. 80% of the time.  


If this 80% number is true (I'm not questioning your reliability, but 
am courious about the source), then if you buy some stuff off the 
street 'cause it is a "good deal", you are LESS likely to be buying 
stolen goods. I wonder if some of these victims are LATER arrested 
for violent crimes against government agencies and/or property??? 
Wouldn't really blame 'em if they were (some might consider that a 
reasonable act.....) They've got a right to be REAL PISSED!!!
>
>If I thought there was an 80% chance that the merchandise I was bidding
>for was
>stolen, I wouldn't even consider it. 

Isn't the USA wonderful these days???
From: torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Time to arrive at U2 concert
Date: 7 Nov 92 03:41:22 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: CS Department, Stanford University, California, USA
Originator: torrie@Xenon.Stanford.EDU

Hi, 

  This is my first concert event at the Coliseum, and I'm looking for
advice on when I should get there.  The tickets for U2 say 7:00 p.m., 
but the support acts (Public Enemy in particular), I would prefer to
miss.  
  Does anyone know when U2 will come on stage (I presume about 9:00
p.m.)?  Is it possible to find your way in to the event after the
stated concert time (I have the crush-everyone General Admission
tickets).  If not, is the best to do arrive on time and just grin and
bear the music I don't like?

Evan.
(reply by email if you don't think anyone else will be interested).