HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hummell+@pitt.edu (Andrew G Hummell)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Supplements for Multiple Systems
Date: 15 Sep 92 07:26:41 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Sep13.161803.919@ccsvax.sfasu.edu> z_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu writes:
>In article <1992Sep11.215349.23527@afterlife.ncsc.mil>, acadams@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Arthur C. Adams) writes:
>> 
>> Wouldn't it be great if, some day, role-playing supplements
>> were released with stats for _all_ of the appropriate systems?
>> 
>
>	Or better yet, do what I do: convert the system yourself. I've
>translated (in varying degrees) Torg, Traveller, AD&D Spelljammer, and
>BattleTech to GURPS. I know of a basic effort of someone on GMAST-L a few
>months ago to do the same thing with RTG Cyberpunk.
>
>Brandon Cope

There is a product put out by The Armory that is supposed to be the ultimate
conversion book.  I have been meaning to pick it up, but haven't as yet.
The current Wargames West catalog lists it for about $11 US.

According to the listing, it allows one to convert characters (and equipment?)
from any major system to any other.  It lists a number of systems covered,
such as xD&D, GURPS, Palladium, Champions, etc.  (these are from memory, so
forgive me if I err)


Andy
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  "I'm not insane...just a reasonable facsimile."  | Hummell@unix.cis.pitt.edu
  "Character is what you are in the dark."         | Andy Hummell ...that's me 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: bcd@fang.att.com (Brendan Dwyer)
Subject: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Keywords: TW2000
Organization: AT&T Tax Systems Development, Maitland FL
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 06:08:29 GMT


    TW2000 has got some major flaws to it.  They say each charater must eat
three kilos(6.6lbs) of food per day.  Yeah (said in a Wayne Campbell voice).
The U.S. Army tries 3500 calories per day per troop.  If you ate 6.6 lbs
of rice per day that would be more than 3500 calories.  BTW, the Viet Cong
used to survive on a handful of rice per day for weeks on end.  Next, a
M1911 .45 cal pistol does 2D6 of damage per round.  Let's say Chuck "Black
Death" Licata walks into a building with his M1911 in hand.  Suddenly, a
Soviet soldier enters the room.  Chuck raises his automatic pistol and
fires off one round which strikes the Soviet in the head.  Let's  say
this Soviet is named "Androv the Average" which means he has a constitution
of 5 (on a scale of 1 to 10).  That means he has a 10 hit points for his head.
Chuck inflicts an average amount of damage (3.5 pts per die) for a total of
7 points.  Androv has received a "slight wound" according to the rules.
Let's say Chuck has a great shot which inflicts 12 points of damage.  Androv
now has a "serious wound".  Now, I'm no ballistic/forensic specialist,
but I would assume a good shot from an M1911 would blow a large chunk of
skull and grey matter away.  My brothers father in-law was a member of
the 1st Marine Division during WWII.  He carried a M1911 (along with his
Thompson Submachinegun) for the sole purpose of killing wounded Japanese
soldiers who would otherwise shoot him in the back if he were to let them live.
As he describes it, two shots from his M1911 killed every time.  Now I 
understand why this game never became more popular.


Brendan Dwyer
From: v054nn84@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Foto...Taking pictures again, and Happy for it!)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Quick Combat
Date: 6 Sep 92 09:58:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

I think the idea of allowig fora sudden flury of action iswhat promptedthe Star
Wars idea of each combat 'round' is 5 secondsand each round is subdivided into
as many or as few actions as are taken.  If someone shoots 3 times then there 5
second round is broken down into 3 phases but if no onedoes much of anything
otherthan jockey for position the 5 second round is one phase and that's that. 
Now if you *really* want to get down to the level of the absurd you should look
at one ofthe advanced *optional* sets of rules for Phoenix Command (who ever it
was who said that Living Steel players were rulebook lawyers shoul A. look at
Phoenix Command and B. check and make sure they were not including all of the
*optional* rules before casting aspersions...) which breaks the round down to
one-onehundredth (yup 1/100th) of a second for determination of shot droppage
over long distances.  That is going a little too far...

Skeksis - Me transmitte sursum, Caledoni
From: leifmk@Lise.Unit.NO (Leif Magnar Kj|nn|y)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Time mechanics, healing and aiming
Date: 6 Sep 92 14:48:44 GMT
Organization: Norwegian Institute of Technology

In article <1992Sep5.094350.58655@cc.usu.edu>, slp66@cc.usu.edu writes:
 > OK, this is a tangent off the Time Mechanics arguement, but I mention it
 > because it is dealing with the realism issue.  Let's say you are getting healed
 > after a AD&D fight.  You've taken, oh, 20 hit points.  Your Cleric walks up and
 > heals 19 of them.  You know, when you wake up tomorrow, the one  hit point is
 > healed by sleep.  Fine.  I think that's ok.  
 > 
 > Now, GURPS.  You are in a fire fight.  (TL7) You get hit with, say, an M-16,
 > that does 2 points to you (after getting through your armor).  Your medic walks
 > up to you and does first aid.  After 5 minutes, the medic rolls a 6 sided dice
 > and hey, you get 2 points back...your healed.  Now, how did that happen.  You
 > were shot and wounded.  THen, 5 minutes later....your are healed.  THis wound
 > should take at least a week to heal, maybe longer.  There just isn't any
 > realism.  
 > 
 > Ok, now, why do I think that AD&D is more realistic?  Well, it centers around
 > the one minute round.  You can still move and fight.  If you get hit on, say
 > the 20 second mark, you've still 40 seconds to adjust (you know, scream, whine,
 > moan, complain, die, etc).  As somebody in this thread has pointed out, not so
 > in GURPS.  Every second you can get hit and not notice it.  Let's say I'm
 > playing GURPS.  (TL7) I'm aiming my gun at a target say, 200 yards away.  The
 > round before I shoot, I get shot.  Let's say I've got good armor and the bullet
 > does no damage.  Does the impact of a piece of metal traveling at 2000 feet per
 > second and impacting me with 800 foot pounds of force even affect my aim? 
 > Nope.  Thats just not real.
 > 
 > Matt
 > -- 
 > 
 >        **********************************************************
 >        ******          Stranger In A Strange Land          ******
 >        **********************************************************

What about the GURPS Knockback rule?  Using the standard rules, 8 points (or more)
of impact damage (this is BEFORE armor) will knock you back 1 hex (or more), and
quite possibly make you fall over.  I say this would affect your aim quite a bit.
:-)

Leif the .sigless
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Keywords: TW2000
Date: 14 Sep 92 05:45:49 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology

In article <BuIy14.2E4@news.cso.uiuc.edu> dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly) writes:
>bcd@fang.att.com (Brendan Dwyer) writes:
>The damage in Twilight is unrealistic. Yes. The damage from modern weapons
>is unrealistic in every roleplaying game out there, except maybe the
>Pheonix Command based ones and SR II on ultra-deadly.

  Millenium's End is also on the realistic/hideously deadly side of the 
spectrum, I think.... (yes, I have it, yes, I think I understand it, but no,
I'm not totally certain about certain skill levels:)

>Axly

-bertil-
--
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."
"This is the famous Hasan B Mutlu-trigger, insert it in your .sig file today!"
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: mmcalees@cs16.UVic.CA (Michael McAleese (One of 'Those Dudes'))
Subject: Gun combat in Boot Hill
Organization: The Forgotten Legions of... uhh... umm...
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 01:37:09 GMT


   Someone posted regarding the unrealistic gun combat in Twilight 2000
and while I cannot comment on it (I've never played it) I did want to 
put in a good word for the gun combat in Boot Hill.  "Boot Hill?" you
ask, aghast.  "Isn't that made by TSR?!?"  Well, yes.  Or perhaps "was",
I'm no longer sure it's still in print.  Regardless, due to having seen
both the movie "Unforgiven" and a double-feature of Clint Eastwood 
sphagetti westerns at the local University's theatre, a bunch of us had
to try running a western adventure.  Boot Hill was the game of choice,
it was simple and quick.  Gunplay has a satisfyingly risky nature to
it, as you simply roll for hit location and then the severity of the
wound: slight, severe, or mortal.  A couple of severe wounds will take
out most people, and a mortal wound is self-explanitory.  You can't 
ever take combat lightly, no matter how good you are if someone gets
in a shot at you there's a good chance of getting really hurt and a
reasonable chance of snuffing it.  For example, on the percentile roll
for hit location, 86-100 is the head.  On head shots, the wound chart
has mortal wound at a percentile roll of 61-100.  Bang!  Yer dead, 
varmit.  Fortunately the PC's made it through the whole adventure, 
foiling the bandit's scheme and emerging only horribly wounded, not 
dead.
   Whatever system you want to use, I'd really reccomend doing a one-shot
western adventure with your gaming group, they're lots of fun and 
everyone can easily identify with the setting and characters.  It's
a bit of work to avoid it degenerating into roleplaying "Blazing Saddles",
but worth it.

-- 
*     mmcalees@csr.uvic.ca (Michael McAleese) : I speak only for me...       *
  "Man can believe the impossible, but never the improbable." - Oscar Wilde
  (For snooping gonvernments: heroin, cocaine, FBI, CSIS, CIA, albatross...)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: eebonar@sn01.sncc.lsu.edu (Dave Bonar)
Subject: Re: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-10949]: sn01.sncc.lsu.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4   
Reply-To: eebonar@sn01.sncc.lsu.edu
Organization: News and Views from LSU
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 20:41:51 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.020751.28172@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, sdt8s@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Steve Tilson) writes...
>Speaking of TW2000 unrealism...
> 
>First thing you know, my
>character, a G2 type with an M-60 GPMG, is confronted by a
>ten year-old girl armed with a fragmentation grenade. "Good
>heavens!" my character shouts, and aiming for the chest at a
>range of three feet, opens up. The first two shots miss. The
>third hits the girl in the foot. She curses and stumbles back
>into the house.
> 
>Perhaps it was just poor GMing. IMHO you have to make
>allowances for point-blank combat, no matter what the player
>rolls.

	Sure, you have to take the point blank range into acount.  But
you also have to take the target into acount.  Maybe she started to
turn and flee while you were raising the gun (I hate characters who
carry M-60s as personal weaponry; too sterotypical and too munchkin).
You were afraid she'd make it to the house so you started firing before
really getting set.  The first two shots plow into the ground and the
third hits her ankle just as she reaches safety.

Dave
__________
Dave Bonar
eebonar@lsuvax.sncc.lsu.edu
__________
From: z_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Date: 14 Sep 92 12:01:33 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

In article <1992Sep13.060829.8129@fang.att.com>, bcd@fang.att.com (Brendan Dwyer) writes:
> 
>     TW2000 has got some major flaws to it.    Next, a
> M1911 .45 cal pistol does 2D6 of damage per round.  

	Actually, a .45 ACP does only 1d6, same as a 9mm P or .32 ACP.  A
friend of mine pointed out that with doing maximum damage, you can't kill a
generic character with a pistol round to the head. Um, right.

Brandon Cope
From: sl9b4@cc.usu.edu (Deep Six)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Time mechanics
Date: 8 Sep 92 16:41:22 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1992Sep6.160104.841@ccsvax.sfasu.edu>, 
 z_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu writes:
> In article <1992Sep4.173844.1968@news.columbia.edu>, 
 jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim) writes:

>> 	People act differently in swordfights with real blades against an 
>> opponent who wants to kill you than in SCA combats. Shooting a person is 
>> more difficult than target practice. Statistics will back me up here - in 
>> police encounters, shots fired at close range, even arms length, still have 
>> a high chance of missing. I would recommend the movie 'Unforgiven' to those 
>> who find this hard to believe. 
> 
> 	I haven't seen 'Unforgiven', but I would seriously advise people to
> avoid basing combat rules off of movies, unless they are going for cinematic
> rules.

Depends on what movies you watch. Some movies don't try to glorify combat
or try to make combat ``look cool.'' Some movies try to give the viewer an 
idea of how fast, furious and confusing it is. One that springs to mind is
84 Charlie MoPic (The Chalie MoPic Company). It's about a project started
in Vietnam called ``Lessons Learned.'' The idea was to attatch Army motion
picture camera operators (MoPics) to line units to record procedures specific 
to the areas and situations of Vietnam. The film is shot from the POV of
one such MoPic attatched to a LRRP team in the Central Highlands. The fire
fights are confusing at best, and a couple of them are so short that if you 
look away you miss them.

Okay,
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chadd  VanZanten  SL9B4@CC.USU.EDU  +  ``The  hardest part about fishing is 
that all the fish are underwater.'' -- 3m Sportsman Bassmaster how-to video
Xref: sparky rec.games.frp.advocacy:2245 rec.games.frp.misc:5441
From: bell@monet.cs.unc.edu (Andrew Bell)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy,rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Time mechanics, healing and aiming
Date: 13 Sep 92 03:45:10 GMT
Followup-To: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Organization: The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

In article <z0vn90b@lynx.unm.edu> quirk@pioneer.unm.edu (Gym Z. Quirk) writes:
>The prototype for GURPS combat was _Man to Man_.  However, Steve
>Jackson freely admits that the ancestor of GURPS is _The Fantasy Trip_
>which is composed of _Melee_ and _Wizard_.

At least in its latter stages,  TFT was composed of _Advanced Melee_,
_Advanced Wizard_, and _In the Labyrinth_.

   -Andrew "Getting too old..." Bell
bell@cs.unc.edu



Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: thantos@runic.via.mind.org (Paul Williams [SysOp])
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Date: 15 Sep 92 19:19:05 GMT
Organization: Runic Writings / Lawrenceville, GA

sl9b4@cc.usu.edu (Deep Six) writes:

> 90% of all games have unrealistic PC damage rules. It's unavoidable. PCs
> have to be tougher than real people, or they would die too easily and RPGs
> would be unending and frustrating character generation sessions. 

Or the PCs can get a clue and start avoiding combat unless they have a
decisive advantage, like intelligent people.

An Ars Magica mage is a definate decisive advantage.


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thantos@runic.via.mind.org (Paul Williams [SysOp])
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy,rec.games.frp.misc
From: richv@hpinddu.cup.hp.com (Rich Van Gaasbeck)
Subject: Re: Time mechanics, healing and aiming
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 19:13:26 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Cupertino, CA.

>>>>> millerl writes: Nntp-Posting-Host: fred.wharton.upenn.edu

millerl> GURPS is descended from a tactical one-on-one
millerl> combat boardgame.

Aha!  So I'm not the sole person on the planet that remembers Melee.
:-)

Richv
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: cs125a89@eng-nxt05.cso.uiuc.edu (cs125 student)
Subject: Re: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1992 00:23:08 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.230510.944@ccsvax.sfasu.edu>  
z_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu writes:
 
 
> 	Also irritating in T:2000 is that a 3-round burst is just as  
inaccurate
> as firing full-auto, when it really is a bit better.


Actually, the game does have rules for making 3 round bursts more 
accurate. They are in the Special Operations Supplement. They alos
can be taken directly from Dark Conspiracy, which is where they 
showed up first.


Innocennt Bystander
From: sl930@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Hostility in Gamers toward Certain games
Date: 7 Sep 92 13:30:28 MDT
Organization: Utah State University


In item #2087, David Lockwood <bsrae@warwick.ac.uk> writes a snobbish
little tirade attacking RPGs. 

Well, Dave, one obvious question here, what the hell are you doing on 
rec.games.FRP??

Oh, and I can't buy that whole maturity bit either.  Anyone who puts down
another persons hobby because they view it as inferior is either not very 
mature or has a self esteem problem.

sl930@cc.usu.EDU
Organization: Computing Technology Services, Michigan Technological Univ.
Date: Sunday, 13 Sep 1992 12:58:11 EST
From: <PNNAGATA@MTUS5.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Time mechanics
Distribution: world

In article <cmqTqB1w165w@swob.nullnet.fi>, maxxon@swob.nullnet.fi (Mikko
Kurki-Suonio) says:
>
>leifmk@Lise.Unit.NO (Leif Magnar Kj|nn|y) writes:
>
>> Recently heard of an NPC in a local TW2000 campaign who survived a dead-on
>bo
>> hit from an antitank missile.  Has anybody out there seen what those
>missiles
>> to armored tanks?  What do you think it would do to a real-life person?
The person might survive it, but he will not be very functional.

>> that would be a classic case of DAO ("Dead All Over")...:-)
>
>Actually, there is a very big chance that the fuse won't go off after
>striking such a soft target. It's designed to work on tanks, not men.
>Generally speaking, a high-powered rifle (e.g. .50 BMG) does a lot more
>damage to a single man.
>
>However, if the fuse _did_ work (is there a mechanic for this in TW2000?
>I don't recall) I must still disagree with you. Again, the missile is
>designed to work against tanks. The jet of superheated metal is only 1
>or 2 inches wide. If hit on arm or leg, yes that limb would be a goner
>but the man might survive.
>
>I think this is a case of trying to kill a fly with a cannon. A cannon
>is a great weapon doing lots of damage, but against a single fly, I'd
>still use a flyswatter...
>
In the Special Operations supplement to TW2000, there are rules for resolving
direct hits with armor piercing rockets, etc.  You could survive, if you only
got hit in the arm or leg.  You would have that limb after the incident, but
at least you'd be alive.
>--------
>maxxon@swob.nullnet.fi (Mikko Kurki-Suonio)
>Sweet Oblivion (+358 0 8092678, V.32bis 8N1) Official SRP Headquarters
>
>
From: jacobus@symphony.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: WARP WORLD
Date: 9 Sep 92 03:31:03 GMT
Organization: Purdue University



Actually, I have looked at, and own CORPS.  However, the question was about
WarpWorld.  There also isn't a "fantasy" per se supplement for CORPS just
yet, but I'm trying to rectify that.
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why TW2000 eats wormy dog turds.
Date: 14 Sep 92 05:41:11 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology

In article <1992Sep14.014855.16614@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> ins769v@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au (Veltyen) writes:
>Isn't the damage modified by range?

  In t2k1, yes, not t2k2. They changed this by making penetration and damage
less dependent.

>-Veltyen

-bertil-
--
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."
"This is the famous Hasan B Mutlu-trigger, insert it in your .sig file today!"
From: m2a7@sci.kun.nl (Axel G.+ Hein R.)
Subject: Re: Killing rolemaster pc's
Organization: University of Nijmegen, The Netherlands
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 08:19:23 GMT

>Marijan_Madunic@panam.wimsey.bc.ca (Marijan Madunic) writes:

> I have a problem (guilty complex) about killing pc's. After all they do
> spend a couple of hours creating these pc's. Can anybody help me in getting
> over this problem.

Well... I'm a RoleMaster GM myself, and there are a few ways to
get over your problem.

First, it should be possible to survive any scenario, but the
players will have to struggle for survival. If something goes
terribly wrong because of a die-roll, I would let them slip past,
because it's not fun to die because of a bad roll. BUT, if the
PC's would do something totally stupid, I'd say, let them die and
pay for their stupidity. I allways have 2 reserve PC's at hand, so
if someone looses a character, that person can scoop up a new PC,
and get going again. Of course, the new PC is of lower level, so
most of the time, my players are very cautious. 

Of course, players don't get the type of character they would want
to play, but what I deem necessary for the plot. Tough luck for
them, better watch out next time. ;)

Greetings,
	 Hein Ragas
From: v054nn84@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Foto...Taking pictures again, and Happy for it!)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: marvel
Date: 4 Sep 92 23:12:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

RE:  Marvel Super Heroes

I have played Champions, Marvel Super Heroes, Villains and Vigilantes, and
Golden Heroes an of them all I think that Golden Heroes is the best.  MSH is
fun but for my money, Golden Heroes all the way.

Skeksis - Me transmitte sursum, Caledoni!
From: v057qkmm@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (BABBLING SAGE)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Real Sci-Fi Games
Date: 13 Sep 92 00:22:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Sep12.201414.7875@honte.uleth.ca>, std_fleming@hg.uleth.ca writes...
>In article <20vnync@lynx.unm.edu>, quirk@pioneer.unm.edu (Gym Z. Quirk) writes:
>>In article <BuFC47.1q0@acsu.buffalo.edu> v057qkmm@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (BABBLING SAGE) writes:
>>>In article <BuF9Dp.7x6@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly) writes...
>>>>>v057qkmm@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (BABBLING SAGE) writes:
>>>>>      Eridani: Warriors dedicated to the perfection of the Self.
>>>> 
>>>>       Gee, sound familiar to anyone else?
>>> 
>>>	Yeah, it's a part of a name of a star system. So?
>>
>>Well, ask any veteran Trekk{ie,er,ist} what Vulcan's home star
>>is...;-)

>   Hey!  Aren't "Orion Rogues" lifted from STAR TREK, too?
> 
	No. Star trek had Green Orion Women. And about Eridani: It's a real
star. BL is not the same universe as Star Trek, so what if it uses Eridani?
They're nothing like Vulcans anyhow. Both systems happened to use the real
universe.

> 
>John Fleming                            

Bluerazor