HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tannerg@carson.u.washington.edu (Glenn Tanner)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: AP Top 25 (Was Re: Miami Can Not Be Denied!!!)
Date: 12 Oct 92 23:04:51 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

>>Miami and Wash play a common opponent, Arizona. If Arizona goes up to
>>Washington, and doesn't do as well as they did against Miami, then you
>>have your answer. Wash #1. If they do better than they did against Miami,
>>then Miami #1. Who has FSU, Penn St and Iowa played? Clemson? Piddly. Miami
>>just isn't in the Pac-10, and doesn;t have to face the level of 
>>competition that the Pac-10 provides year in and year out.
>
>Bzzzzzt! Thank you for playing but that is the wrong answer! Carol Merril will
>have some nice parting gifts for you! This common opponent garbage has gone
>way too far now! AZ shows up in Miami, the week before the FSU game, in the 
>third week of the season with a 1-1 record and plays the game of its life and 
>loses. But bouyed by that confidence building loss they kick the corn-squeezins
>out of UCLA and are now threatening to have a good season. They wil NOT sneak 
>up on Washington now. Washington, like Miami will probably be playing much 
>better ball in week 8 or 9 than in week three. AZ will likely get creamed in 
>Seattle. 
>
>-- 
>Ronnie

Well, Bzzzzzt! Thank YOU for playing but that is the wrong answer!  The game
is in Tuscon.  Carol Merril is fresh out of parting gifts.  Would you settle
for a kick in the groin?

GT
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: cls4@ra.msstate.edu (Charles L. Spirrison)
Subject: Worst Rule in College Football
Organization: Mississippi State University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 18:45:47 GMT



The worst rule in college football?

No doubt in my mind --> the defensive pass-interference rule!

The quarterback throws a perfect long pass (e.g., 30+ yards) to a receiver 
who has outmaneuvered the defensive back(s).  The defensive back simply 
interferes.  Instead of a 30+ yard gain (and perhaps field goal position 
or a TD) the offense gets 15 yards and a first down.

IMHO this is a bad rule because it encourages DBs to interfere on long passes, 
if they think they might be beaten for a big gain.  Especially on a Hail-Mary.
                   ^^^^^
I'd much prefer the following:  If the foul occurs within 15 yards of the 
line of scrimmage, give the offense 15 yards and a first-down.  If the foul
occurs more than 15 yards from the line, spot the ball where the foul 
occurred (or on the 1 if in the end zone) and give the offense a first down.

Opinions or other nominations? 

cls4@ra.msstate.edu (Opinions are my own) -- Go Mississippi State!
From: tsau@cae.wisc.edu (Johne Tsau)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Purdue Info?
Date: 12 Oct 92 16:53:21 GMT

Being an avid Wisconsin Badger fan, I'm interested to know as much
about our next opponent as possible?  Can someone give the rundown
and the lowdown on Purdue?  Strengths, weaknesses, star players,
offense, defense, etc...

Thanx, it would TRULY be appreciated. :)
--
Johne...   Kariel the Margrave
"The question the truly scientific ask is 'Did God make man,
 or did man make God?'"

UNIX Address            : tsau@cae.wisc.edu
Real World Address      : 5348 Brummel St, Skokie, IL 60077
Real World Phone        : (708) 674-2947
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 18:27:16 EDT
From: Kurt Ludwick <KEL111@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Biggest Rivalry in the Country?
Distribution: usa

The biggest rivalry in the country is Red Lion vs. Dallastown.   End of story.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Bo wants back!! Was: John.Cooper.must.die.die.die
From: demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man)
Date: 12 Oct 92 23:48:11 EST
Distribution: usa
Organization: Demonic Possesions, Inc.

In article <2f6-Fh#@engin.umich.edu>, hajel@engin.umich.edu (john hajel) writes:
> 
> I saw in an interview with Bo, that he wants to go back into
> coaching.  Maybe Ohio State will offer him a job??
> 

	Job, hell!  Offer him the whole state!

Brett                                                      
_______________________________________________________________________________
Proconsul Computer Consulting                                        CHA-CHING!
Better, Cheaper, Faster					       (Pick any two :)
Disclaimer:								   NOT!
Xref: sparky rec.sport.football.college:16468 ba.sports:595
From: jabbi@rembrandt.Eng.Sun.COM
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college,ba.sports
Subject: Need Pay-Per-View Info on College Football (Bay Area)
Date: 16 Oct 92 19:51:04 GMT
Reply-To: jabbi@rembrandt.Eng.Sun.COM ()
Distribution: usa
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.  Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: rembrandt


Anybody out there who's been successful in getting 
college football games on pay-per-view in the 
SF bay area? I called the local cable co. and they 
know nothing 'bout it!! Apparantly they don't carry 
any games on ppv.
(...yet another one of those bay area specialities that 
makes me sick.)


will appreciate it if anyobody out there can send me 
useful info. Thanks.

Aman
(jabbi@eng.sun.com)
From: kenttj@cnsvax.uwec.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Iowa 23, Wisconsin 22
Date: 11 Oct 92 07:43:36 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin Eau Claire

Wisconsin	22
Iowa		23

	This game was one that Iowa deserved to win.  Hartlieb was
outstanding, passing for almost 300 yards, completing 31 of 51 passes.
Both teams had their not-so-great moments, Iowa failing on a couple of
4th down conversions, while Wisconsin's offensive line was inconsistent
all day.  Brent Moss, filling for the injured Terrell Fletcher again, had
yet another outstanding game, rushing for 158 yards and 2 touchdowns. 
Bevell was off yesterday, connecting on only 7 of 20 passes.  Wisconsin
certainly did not play like they have the last four weeks, but Iowa has
to be given credit for this win.
	Next week, Homecoming vs. Purdue.  Any predictions?
			Purdue	   13
			Wisconsin  27

Also, can someone tell me about that back from Georgia?  He sounds like he
could kill a guy if he ran over him.

					Terry Kent
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: kbowers@esrc1.uucp (Ken Bowers)
Subject: Re: Marsee Computer Rankings and Predictions for 10/10/92
Organization: University of California at Berkeley
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 17:34:27 GMT

In article <DPASSAGE.92Oct7165308@soda.berkeley.edu> dpassage@soda.berkeley.edu (David G. Paschich) writes:
>In article <1992Oct7.071957.15189@newstand.syr.edu> demarsee@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Darryl E. Marsee) writes:
>
>     1. MICHIGAN       (937)
>     2. KANSAS         (899)
>     3. WASHINGTON     (896)
>     4. CALIFORNIA     (885)
>     5. NEBRASKA       (859)
>
>Two questions, Darryl:
>
>1) What drugs are you on?
>
>2) Where can I get some?
>
>David Paschich


What is it with the need to flame the guys who run these computer 
ratings?  First of all, a lot of work goes into these things; second,
why attack them personally when they're telling you what the program
spit out? 

I haven't spoken with Darryl about this, but I suspect he may
not personally think that Kansas is the second best team in the
country. He may not even think that Kansas has produced the 
second-best performance in the season to date (after all, that's
all these programs can measure). He's put together a program, and
this is the result--do you think he should only post his rankings
when they line up with the polls? 

My experience in e-mail with the folks who do computer rankings is
that they are happy to get reasonable feedback ("your system seems 
to overrate blowouts of weak teams") or questions (ie, "how
much influence is left from preseason rankings now that we are
in week six?"). Maybe you think the rankings are annoying or pointless--
fine, press 'n'. The posts are long, but there aren't a lot of them. 

Ken B.
From: ronnie@uts.amdahl.com (Ronnie Townsend)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: PSU is Overrated!!!!!!
Date: 13 Oct 92 21:24:03 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1992Oct13.131322.12814@cbnewsm.cb.att.com> jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:
>In article <92287.074450KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu>, KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu writes:
>> 
>>   Penn State is one of the top programs in the country who consistently win
>> over top 10 teams, right!!!!  WRONG!!!  A.P. reports that in the "Joe Paterno
>> Era", PSU is 10-41 against teams that ended the season in the Top 10.  Now
>> this may be misleading because a team may be #9, loses to PSU in a bowl game
>> and drops out of the top 10.  But look at that record!  That is a .244 winning
>> percentage.  It goes to show that the Lions have built up their record on the
>> Eastern Michigans, Marylands and Bowling Greens of the world (I am a Maryland
>> fan, but facts are facts, PSU owns us, 32-1-1).  The Penn State program is
>> over rated and people should realize that.  After all, they have played one
>> ranked team all season, at home, in front of 96,000 of their own fans, and
>> they lost.
>
>Give us a break.  Penn State has won two national championships during the
>80's including a victory over, what was considered one of the the best
>college football teams of all time, the '86 Miami Hurricanes.
>
>I have no idea what the Lions record is against top-10 teams.  But losing
>by a slim margin to the best team in the country is not the sign of a poor
>football team.  Penn State is not as good as Miami, but they are definitely
>a top-10 team this season.  And they have been a good team consistently
>over the years.  If that isn't a top-notch program then what is?

Wait a minute! Two MNC's in the 80's for JoePa? 

1980 GA Dogs
1981 USC The one in LA
1982 Was this Penn State's other year? 
1983 UMiami
1984 BYU Frauds
1985 Oklahoma
1986 Penn State
1987 UMiami
1988 Notre Dame
1989 UMiami
1990 Colorado/GaTech
1991 UMiami/UWash


All this aside, anybody who doesn't concede that Penn State has a top-flight 
program is brain-dead. 

-- 
Ronnie
-------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not cynical... I just don't believe in anything....
From: mm42@prism.gatech.EDU (Mark Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: SEC tie-breakers
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:21:53 GMT
Organization: Ramblin' Wrecks from Georgia Tech

owen@ducvax.auburn.edu wrote:
}
}So, Auburn, Bama, and MSU all have 2 conference losses, and it can't
}be decided by head-to-head, since each of the 3 teams are 1-1 against
}the other 2.  Am I correct in assuming Bama goes to the championship
}game, since only one of its losses are in the division?

Extracted from Jon Schmidt's excellent article on the new SEC
format:

B. THREE TEAM TIE (OR MORE)
   (Once the tie has been reduced to two teams, go to two team tie
   breaker format)
  1. Combined head-to-head record among the tied teams.
  2. Record of the tied teams within the division.

Yep, Alabama's 4-1 record within the division would beat out
Auburn and MSU's 3-2.

-- 
Mark Mitchell           Georgia Tech            mm42@prism.gatech.edu
   "Close only counts in horseshoes and hand-grenades."
                                 "And computer rating systems."
From: ash@ulysses.mr.ams.com (Alan Harder)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: The Bowl Coalition fails yet again
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:41:00 GMT
	<1992Oct13.233854.2232@u.washington.edu>
Organization: American Math. Society

In article <1992Oct13.233854.2232@u.washington.edu> sujan@stein.u.washington.edu (Sujan Punyamurthula) writes:

   >How about this scenario

   >Alabama loses to Tennesse
   >Miami loses to Syracuse( They have good field goal kickers!)
   >Washington beats Michigan in Rose Bowl

   >then I wonder who will be the National Champ?????

More likely:

Alabama loses to Tennesse
Miami loses to Syracuse( They have good field goal kickers!)
Washington loses to Michigan in Rose Bowl

Then Michigan will be national champion.  Go Syracuse!  Go Tennessee!
Go Blue!
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: crs@stein.u.washington.edu (Cliff Slaughterbeck)
Subject: Re: Pac Ten Woofing and Poofing (Re: AP Top 25)
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:53:45 GMT

gidi@Hilbert.Stanford.EDU (Gidi Avrahami) writes:
>
>Not so, Ronnie!  That description applies to Zona's game against
>Stanford at Palo Alto.
>
>Other surprising similarities between U-DUB and LSJU:
>
>* White haired genius coach
>* Punishing defense
>* Small quick RB with lots of all-purpose yardage
>* Win streak at the Rose Bowl
>* Similar weather (see Doug's report)
>* Washington's mascot is a dog, Stanford's mascot is a tree.
>
>Just a coincidence?  I don't think so.
>

Not to mention a crowd of woofers from each school who occaisionally like
to ignore the facts when it inconvieninces them--oh wait I'm sorry, that
applies to just about every d*mn school discussed on the net, doesn't it?
('cept Rutgers, of course.  Dear ol' Bob would never fib...:-)  ).

****************************************************************************
Cliff Slaughterbeck           * 
Dept. of Physics, FM-15       *   Hey Matt!  The diffusion pump is full of
University of Washington      *   water again!
Seattle, WA 98195             *
****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: dbrod@eng.clemson.edu (Douglas Brod)
Subject: Re: Biggest Rivalry in the Country?
Reply-To: dbrod@eng.clemson.edu
Organization: College of Engineering, Clemson Univ.
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 14:37:25 GMT

In article 12720@hubcap.clemson.edu, trev@hubcap.clemson.edu (Trevor Bauknight) writes:
>milius@proton.med.umn.edu (Bob Milius (BMEC)) writes:
>
>>What are the biggest, oldest, most intense rivalrys in the country and are
>>they as intense to both teams?
>
>Wait and see what happens when the 0-10 South Carolina Gamecocks step
>into Clemson's Death Valley.  No comparison...
> 
>Trevor Bauknight         trev@hubcap.clemson.edu    ...gatech!hubcap!trev
> 
>                                                     +-----------+
>                                                     | _> ###    |
>                  go Gamecocks...                    |     |     |
>                                                     +-----------+

Being a Clemson student for the past three years, I have seen the Clemson-South Carolina rivalry up close.  The only people who think  it's a rivalry are the 'Cocks.  I spent most of my life in the suburbs of Columbus(Ohio), and I'd have to say that Ohio State-Michigan is bigger.   

By the way, Trevor, who are you?  I can't find your name in the phone book or on the directories on the mainframe.  The only Bauknight I can find is a visiting Chemistry prof.  How'd you get an account?

Doug Brod
dbrod@eng.clemson.edu
From: kprashan@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (hyderabadi)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: ESPN Studio Show Question
Date: 12 Oct 92 22:33:40 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.190902.19806@u.washington.edu>, tannerg@carson.u.washington.edu (Glenn Tanner) writes:
> Is it in Craig James's job description that he must disagree with everything
> Lee Corso says, or is that just what any normal human being would do?
> 
> GT

Yes and Yes.

Guys like Corso, Beano Cook, Norm Hitzhes [or whatever the spelling
is] etc. sit there and mostly spout off old myths and insane
predictions. 

There is one sports book in Las Vegas where all the handicappers
yell "Norm!" when Norm Hitzhes comes on with his 'predictions' on
ESPN's Sports Sunday morning, and then proceed to tear up imaginary
betting tickets as he proceeds to pick his 'winners'!! 



_______________________________________________________
| Prashanth                    |                      |
| U. of California @ San Diego | prash@raman.ucsd.edu |
#######################################################
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: COWAN@ssrl01.slac.stanford.edu (Paul L. Cowan)
Subject: Re: Lies, D**n Lies, etc (Re: PSU is Overrated!)
Organization: CALIFORNIANS ON THE ORIENT EXPRESS
Distribution: World
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 19:23:35 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

In <92287.074450KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu> KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu writes:
:  
:    Penn State is one of the top programs in the country who consistently win
:  over top 10 teams, right!!!!  WRONG!!!  A.P. reports that in the "Joe Paterno
:  Era", PSU is 10-41 against teams that ended the season in the Top 10.  Now
:  

Please excuse me for following my own post, but another comment on the 
lies, d**n lies and statistics thread: Few team are ranked in the final top 
ten with as many as 3 losses. Considering the very top teams have often gone
undefeated, let's say the average record of a team finishing in the top ten
is roughly 10.5-1.5 (.875). That means that on the average the teams that 
played final-top-10 teams have a winning record of something like .125 in 
games against these teams. So, Penn State's winning percentage is almost double 
the average in such games, and that is a record sustained over 25 years!
Looked at from the proper perspective a *satistic* of 10-41 sounds pretty
impressive.

Now try this one: using the above estimate, the total number of losses of all
the top ten teams at the end of a season is maybe 15. Times 25 years is 375
losses, so let's round up and say 400. Of the roughly 400 losses sustained
by teams that finished the year in the top ten during JoePa's career, his 
teams won about 1/40th of these. Since there are over 100 division I-A teams, 
PSU has clearly won much more than their share.

Get the idea?


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
P. L. Cowan     Please send replies, comments etc. (no flames thank you) to 
COWAN@ANL.GOV  (I'm posting from my own account, but not the preferred one)
        "Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is a War Room!"
from _Dr._Strangelove_or:_How_I_Learned_to_Stop_Worrying_and_Love_the_Bomb_
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: chico@athena.mit.edu (Thomas A Weston)
Subject: Re: Penn State QB situation
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 21:58:45 GMT

In article <92284.092341MJR127@psuvm.psu.edu>, MJR127@psuvm.psu.edu (mark rieker) writes:
|> 
|>         Ooops! My mistake. I meant to say that Craig Fayak is Penn State's
|>      back-up quarterback, not Chip LaBarca.

But at least Chip is probably a better kicker...
From: gt5448b@prism.gatech.EDU (James Corbett)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: NOT! (was Re: Virginia WINS)
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:34:00 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article <1992Oct12.142531.7736@software.org> oconnor@software.org (Jim O'Connor) writes:
>
>In article <Bvxv6M.8xv@rice.edu>, rbutera@owlnet.rice.edu (Robert John Butera) writes:
>> 
>> go jackets!   (and why the heck did Maryland score 26 points?)
>> -- 
>
>I feel the same way. Maryland should have scored a lot more! What was it, 2 or 3 
>interceptions inside of the Tech 30? Forth down and 1 on the Tech 8 and Maryland's 
>second string QB throws one in the dirt with a receiver STANDING in the end zone with 
>no one within 10 yards of him.

Gee!  I suppose it never occured to you that Tech has something called defense.
If you put enough pressure on the quarterback, you just might come up with an 
interception or force the QB to throw a bad pass.  You make it sound like
Tech was mighty lucky Maryland didn't score when it seems like Tech played 
sound defense inside of their 30.

Let's see now. Three games ago Tech beat Clemson by 4.  Then NC State by 3.
Then Maryland by 2.  If we can beat FSU on Saturday by 1, I will be very happy.
Of course, I know I will now get flamed.




>James P. O'Connor





-- 
CORBETT,JAMES FRANKLIN   mail: gt5448b@prism.gatech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: billms@eecs.umich.edu (William Mangione-Smith)
Subject: Re: Who is number 1?
Organization: University of Michigan
	<92280.103656TOM@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
	<1992Oct6.215632.11840@ultra.com>
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 13:59:08 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.215632.11840@ultra.com> rajiv@ultra.com (Rajiv Dhingra) writes:

   -> After this Saturday when Cal upsets Washington and Penn State does the same
				   ^^^^^^                           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
   -> to Miami, Penn State should then be ranked #1!!

   A Penn State win would not be an upset, the Vegas line is 1 point
   in their favor.

The betting lines are designed to even the money bet on each side and have
nothing to do, directly, with how anybody in vegas expects the game to go.


Bill

--
-------------------------------
	Bill Mangione-Smith
	billms@eecs.umich.edu
From: landers@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Hazard Class Mage)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Freshman QB's....
Keywords: any impact players...
Date: 7 Oct 92 14:23:48 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center

In article <1992Oct6.172358.7845@doug.cae.wisc.edu> saunders@luther.che.wisc.edu (Brian E. Saunders) writes:
>
>When Eric Hunter started at Purdue as a freshman, he came out on fire.  
[...]
>Since then, he's pretty much been a disappointment.
>-- 
>
>Brian E. Saunders			saunders@luther.che.wisc.edu

Bear in mind though, that Hunter wasn't a "starter", he was the third
string reserve, when he walked on the feild for the first time folks
were saying "who is that?".  He did start several games after that.



-- 
   <===========================><===============================>
   || Christopher Landers      ||  Stamp Out Silly Signatures! ||
   <============== landers@mentor.cc.purdue.edu ================>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: swanger@ducvax.auburn.edu
Subject: Re: U2 at Legion Field .........
Organization: Auburn University, AL
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 12:54:47 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.173013.3474@b11.b11.ingr.com>, mcconnel@b11.b11.ingr.com (Guy McConnell) writes:
> In article <1992Oct9.205308.9549@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov> jwilson@homeboy.msfc.nasa.gov writes:

>>Also, it was reported that Bono was quitting the band due to allegations
>>that he beat one of his groupies with a microphone stand.

>     You guys are really lacking for something to talk about, huh. 
> I've seen this basketball related thread appear far too many times
> on a *football* newsgroup.  The real scoop is that Bono is in
> trouble for copying a Bob Dylan song and not crediting him.  When
> asked about it he said, "I just forgot the quotes". (Sorry David, I
> wasn't going to use it but I had to)

A plagiarized plagiarism joke!

-- 
David Swanger,   Auburn University, Alabama,   swanger@accs.duc.auburn.edu 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: chyang@anaphora.engin.umich.edu (Chung Hsiung Yang)
Subject: Re: The Bowl Coalition fails yet again
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 16:56:07 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor
Originator: chyang@anaphora.engin.umich.edu


In article <1992Oct14.122620.2310@mlb.semi.harris.com>, dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com (David Head) writes:
> 
> The Bowl Coalition can't fail "yet again" because this is the first year it is
> going to be in effect.  And it is not actually failing, it's just not being allowed
> to work because the snooty Rose Bowl prefers to be picky picky choosy about who
> plays in their dusty old bowl game.  Until the Rose Bowl stranglehold is broken,
> I don't feel that Washington or Michigan or any of the other Rose Bowl eligible
> teams can complain if they don't win a national championship.  To the University
> of Washington; if you truly want to be national champs and earn some respect for
> your allegedly stilted west coast brethren, then come out from behind the Rose
> Bowl fence and take on Miami (or Florida State I'm hoping).  Looks like it's
> "tradition" or national respect.  You choose.

	Rose Bowl is still pretty good.  The international exposure is really
really good.  The money is really really really really really really really 
really really really really good. 
 
	Beside, PSU is joining the Pac now.  So the competition should be
better.  

	How about Miami or FSU join the Big Ten?  

- Just an idea.

- Chung Yang