HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: meiboy@tsoft.sf-bay.org (MeiBoy of UCU)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: $758 for an oil change?
Date: 20 Aug 92 10:54:23 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: The TeleSoft BBS and Public Access Unix, +1 415 969 7958

>
>I thought I would put my $.02 ($500) into this discussion.
>
>I just got the following quote:
>
>I called Swanson Ford in Los Gatos, CA (recommended by several people)
>and they said the 30,000 mile service is $550 - 575.  That includes
>fuel injection service (clean injectors throttle body...) changing all
>filters on the car, tune-up, scan all codes (computer system).  He says
>the SHO is actually $150 cheaper than a car with auto transmission.
>
[paragraph eliminated]

>Now that's on a SHO, and I can't imagine that they charge less for a
>SHO than for some of the other cars Ford makes.  $758 sounds about right
>to me if you have auto tranny.  Keep in mind that the 30K service is a Major
>service point, so I figured it would be in the neighborhood of $500.
>
>Tom Pickett 
>tpickett@auspex.com
>SHO  GOZE

	I was the one who originally asked about the $758 for an oil
change. Of course, it was an exageration, but I wanted to know what
goes on at the 30,000 service.
	I just got my Taurus Wagon back from the service and it was
a little less than the original quoted price of $758.  It turned
out to be $712.  Since it does have an auto transmission, that's probably
why the cost was in the 700's.
	The total cost of the parts (6 sparkplugs, 3 different filters,
gasket, and some power purge device, and some other things) plus all the
oils and lubes and fluids is $159.  The labor was the major expense
at $553, calculated at $68/hr.  Of course, the labor cost of each
individual task is already set, for example, rotating the tires is
set as a half an hour job.  
	The $553 for labor does include lots of stuff such as:
lube all locks and hinges, pack front wheel bearings, balance wheels,
alignment, service auto trans., check air bag, engine tune-up,
and oil change.
	All this cost a lot, but for someone who is not a
do-it-yourselfer, what choice do I have.  You might say "go to a
outside mechanic" which might be cheaper, but, as someone
accurately pointed out, they always find something else wrong
with your car.  Even if the mechanic is honest, and I'm sure
there are some out there, they can't possible know everything
they need to do for a Ford Taurus (or any other car for that
matter) to keep it in shape.  They might do a tune-up and oil change
for the car, but do they know about all the other things called for by the
factory that they need to do?  At least the Dealer does a complete
job.
	For now, I'll stick with the dealer to be safe because
a private mechanic ruined the engine of another car I had and I
couldn't prove that he did it.
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: rvn@icd.teradyne.com (Rafael Vidaillet)
Subject: Re: Does anyone like the new Prelude?
Reply-To: rvn@icd.teradyne.com
Organization: Teradyne, Inc. Boston MA
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 20:50:01 GMT

	I used to have a '90 prelude and was waiting for the '92 to
	get a larger engine, better suspenson, 4ws and ABS, but
	once I saw what they did to it I got myself and Eagle Talon.
	Why? because I tought of the Prelude as a 'classy' car,
	but the new one lost it all, so if I'm going to be pushed
	to the aero-funky-looking-young-person-car then I might
	as well go all the way... 

---
 ______________________________________________________________________
/                                                                      \
| Rafael Vidaillet--MS: H71|   Internet:  rvn@dewey.icd.teradyne.com   |
| Teradyne Inc.            |                              _            |
| 321 Harrison Ave.        |   Voice:   (617) 422-2422   |_) \  /      |
| Boston, Ma. 02118        |   Fax:     (617) 422-2837   | \  \/       |
\______________________________________________________________________/



Xref: sparky rec.autos:20248 rec.autos.tech:11373
From: darkstar@toz.buffalo.ny.us (peter leone)
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech
Subject: Re: '86 Subaru - reset EGR light, how?
Keywords: subaru EGR light
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:43:06 GMT
Organization: The Tower of Zot - (716)691-3865

thomas@bit.UUCP (Thomas Walter) writes:

> 
> Another one of those "how do I turn off the EGR light" request.
> ;-( 
> 
> '86 Subaru - where is the magic "button"? A fellow Datsun Roadster
> enthusiast asked this of me, as I know "all about cars!" Sigh, I have
> enough fun keeping up with 25 year old roadsters!
> 
    I went through this on my 86' Subaru about a year ago. If you like do 
do your own service on your Subaru, I recommend that your go and get a 
copy of "How to Keep Your Subaru Alive" by Larry Owens. It's a great book 
that give ssimple instructions on how to fix amlost any thing on Subarus! 
 Here is how to get the light out. From How to Keep your Subaru Alive" 
quoted without permission. "Remove the plastic panel on the lower left 
side of the dashboard. Remove the screws that attach the fuse box, then 
pull the fuse box away from the dash. Dig around amongst the wires behind 
and above the fuse box until you find a blue connector plugged into 
another connector. There should be a green connector nearby that's just 
like the blue one , except there insn't anything connected to it. 
Disconnect the blue connector and plug in the green one where you 
disconnected the blue one. Install the fuse box and plastic panel."
        I do recommend that you  check the Evaporative Emmissions Control 
System. Our Environment is hurting enough as it is.

                                Peace,
                                        Peter Leone
Darkstar@toz.buffalo.ny.us                              Go Sabres!!!!!!!!
Prodigy: hdhx79b                         Buffalo Bandits MILL World Champs!
From: Brian.E.Hannon@dartmouth.edu (Brian E. Hannon)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: "Factory Air"
Date: 16 Aug 92 08:53:21 GMT
 <1992Aug15.125714.21469@esseye.si.com>  <327mj7#.esprit@netcom.com>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <327mj7#.esprit@netcom.com>
esprit@netcom.com (Alan F. Perry) writes:

> As far as I know, Honda still does not install A/Cs at the factory.  They
> are installed by the dealer.  My most recent data point in this a friend
> who bought a 90 Integra.

As of about a year ago, Integras and Civics weren't, Legends and
Accordions were installed at the factory.  Honda has since come out
with a "new" air conditioning system, so I don't know if the same still
holds...  as for the Vigor, I dunno.

I heard something really interesting, though...  a rumor that Toyota
installs all the major a/c components on all their cars at the factory,
and for people who ask for the air, the dealer charges $1000 to install
a switch, belts, and charge it with freon.  Is this true?

Bri
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: root@acpy01.att.com (System Administrator(CXNIXCN1))
Subject: Re: Does anyone like the new Prelude?
Organization: AT&T IMS - Piscataway, NJ (USA)
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 19:34:47 GMT

>I think new Prelude looks OK ( well so-so) from the front and ugly from 
>the back. The rear spoiler makes back look a little better.
>
>I am not against HONDA, I own HONDA myself but if '94 ACCORD is not 
>better then Camry and '95 Legend is not better than ES300 and at least 
>equal to GS300, HONDA may find itself in BIG trouble in U.S.

This is what I think HONDA Motor Co. should do to retain its market share :

New ACCORD has to be larger and more powerful.
It needs a V6 on top of the line model, and needs to be more fun to drive  
than CAMRY or TAURAS, providing the same amount of comfort and ride level.
Also the styling needs to be more modern and to provide anti-lock brakes
as an option on all models as well as two air bags.

New INTEGRA will have to compete with new 318i, so major work needs to be
done in all areas.

New VIGOR (variation of ACCORD in Japan) may have the V6 from top ACCORD,
but has to be more of a sport sedan ( a la 325i) and also provide more
luxurious appointments (a la ES300). 
The styling is also a key (otherwise why not just buy an ACCORD).

New LEGEND has a hard act to follow, to beat LEXUS ???
It will have to be a combination of styling, performance and comfort
for less money than GS300. Difficult task since GS300 is RWD car.

New RWD V8 ACURA will have to be better than the new ('95-96) generation
of LEXUS LS400 and Q45 and compete in price with AMATI.

HONDA will also need to introduce the new entry level car, below Civic line.
(Civic became much to expensive for an entry level car).

HONDA minivan will have to look as good as Previa, with the V6 power.

HONDA SUV will have to be as practical as Explorer and have power of 
new Grand Cherokee. 

And by the way HONDA will have to redesign its automatic transmission,
to compete with Toyota smooth-shifting unit.
They also have to start bringing into U.S. their best VTEC engines, 
that are currently only available in Japan and Europe.

Taking into consideration HONDA current financial situation and the 
amount of money Toyota Motor Co. can afford to spend for it's new models, 
most of this is very difficult to do, but lets hope.............


Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen)
Subject: Re: 1987-1991 CAMRYS may lock you in the car
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 19:59:34 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.171318.10622@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> mike@mote.Berkeley.EDU (Mike Friedrich) writes:
>Or Toyota could tout this as a *feature*, as on some Chryslers, where the
>doors automatically lock when the car exceeds a certain speed (15 mph?).
>Ugh!  Let me decide when to lock my doors; the locks don't prevent the
>doors from opening in an accident, anyway, but they do prevent your
>rescuers from helping you out of the wreckage.

no, they don't prevent the doors from opening in an accident,
but they do stop a dude with a knife from getting in the car with
you (a definite concern if you're driving in northeast d.c. at night).
-teddy
From: ziny@nynexst.com (Ziny Flikop)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: windshield problem
Date: 18 Aug 92 15:58:55 GMT
Organization: NYNEX Science & Technology, Inc.

I have Buick and Galant. On each of them about 80,000 miles. I drive them on the same road. On Buick I have an  original windshield, but on Galant I am changing
 already fifth windshield now. Can somebody tell my why?



ziny@nynexst.com
From: PRAX@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Mail Order Tires
Date: 12 Aug 92 23:56:43 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center

Keep calling, or stop by a few shops on a Saturday late afternoon, or find
a shop that does work for racers. I found a shop in the California Bay area
that swaps tires around for me for about $50.00 mounting and balancing on
slow days. These were 265/50-15's on 8 1/2" wide rims and a few shops in the
nieghborhood could not do them (too wide). But this tire shop had no problem
with them. He does a lot of work for auto-crossers with shaved and really
wide tires. He now gets a LOT of tire business from me.
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving,rec.autos.tech
From: root@acpy01.att.com (System Administrator(CXNIXCN1))
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Performance of CAMRY LE V6
Date: 12 Aug 92 19:40:41 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T IMS - Piscataway, NJ (USA)


In July issue of MOTOR TREND there was a comparison test between the 
CAMRY 4cyl. and ACCORD 4cyl, but they also looked into CAMRY LE V6.
According to them CAMRY LE V6 has all the performance characteristics
that are equal or better of sports sedans that cost over $30.000.
Since CAMRY LE V6 can be bought for about $18.000, that made me wonder.
The numbers MOTOR TREND had, made it better performer that ES300,
525i, Legend, J30 etc.

What do you think about it ???
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: 6868310@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: FOR SALE
Organization: Lockheed Missiles & Space Company, Inc.
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 21:00:59 GMT

1991 MERCURY CAPRI CONVERTIBLE, NEW CONDITION, ASSUME PAYMENTS + CASH, CAN
BE REFINANCED AT CREDIT UNION AND PAID FOR IN 3 YRS. ILLNESS IN FAMILY.
CAR HAS ONLY 17,000 MILES.   COLOR WHITE W. BLK TOP. EVES. 408-492-1255.
ASK FOR CRAIG OR REGINA.
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mns6569@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Subject: '82 Cressida
Reply-To: mns6569@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 13:34:27 GMT

A friend is just about to buy '82 Cressida. Car appears to be in excellent 
shape, but has 112Kmi on it. The engine of cource is a straight 6.
Questions:
Is it worth $3000?
Any known problems?
How long these 6's live? 4-speed Automatics? Rear ends?
Is tere a timingbelt or chain? Is the engine freeweeling?
There's a lot of wind noise around door frames. Solutions?
There's a bit of vibration through gas pedal. Whatizit? :-)

Please respond asap, we're talking offer now.
And does anybody have a broshure or a factory manual they are willing to 
sell?
Please post or email.
Thnks in advance. Mike.S
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving,rec.autos.tech
From: dprkmt@inetg1.ARCO.COM (Ken Tubman)
Subject: Re: Recommendations for Mini Van
Reply-To: ktubman@arco.com
Organization: ARCO Oil and Gas Company
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 14:23:17 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.102726.5173@mr.med.ge.com>, bednarek@picard.med.ge.com (Dennis Bednarek Mfg 4-6971) writes:
> 
> Why don't you consider a full size van.  The price dif is not that great
> and the room is great.  Remember you have one in the popper now but ho
> w do you know that is yhe last one.
> 
> Seriously I have a 20 series Chevy van that pulls 20 miles to the gallon
> and wouldn't complain about it after 130,000 miles.  Lets see someone
> pull that off a min van.
> 
Our Chevy Astro is only half way to 130,000 mile but I don't see a big
difference in the mechanical aspects of the van from my previous, full
size chevy van.  The engine is even bigger (4.3 V6). 

I used to drive our old van but my wife drives the Astro.  She is much
more comfortable handling the Astro than she was the old van.  
The newer extended Astros might be a nice compromise.

I really like our Astro, in terms of design.  It is a small van, not a
big car like some of the others.  (I don't mean to imply this is better,
just different.)  We can seat 8 adults comfortably.  (By the way, we
have the LT model, which has different seats.  I think this makes a huge
difference in comfort for back seat passengers.)

The features in the van are just about perfect for us.  (Now, if only
I could afford one of the new ones with ABS and shoulder harnesses all
around.)  There are pockets in the backs of the seats so each of my
kids has their own pile of junk when we go someplace.  The middle portions
of the rear seats fold down to make tables.  (I call these "kid 
separators.)  We have fit enough luggage and supplies for a two week
vacation, and the newer ones are even a bit longer.

I have had some problems though.  The differential failed at around
58,000 miles.  The A/C blower motor started to get weaker after about
4 years.  I replaced it recently.  I had some leaks from the 
transmission (rear seal) at around 56,000 miles.  The front bracket 
that holds the alternator, A/C, and power steering unit to the engine 
cracked after about 60,000 miles.  The idler arms are apparently 
notorius for wearing out after about 20,000 miles.  Mine were no 
exception.  (I heard the front bracket crack is also a common problem.)
My opinion of the entire front suspension is fairly low, actually.
It doesn't seem to stay aligned as well as my other cars.
While it was still fairly new (less than 1 year) I transmission work 
and one of the shocks snapped in two pieces.  

I don't know if the new ones have improved.  I guess it depends what
you expect of your car.  I like the design enough that I would
probably buy another one, but then, I also own an Alfa...


-- 

Ken Tubman          ARCO 
ktubman@arco.com    2300 W. Plano Parkway
(214) 754-3871      Plano, TX 75075

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: tbigham@shearson.com (Tim Bigham)
Subject: Caring for leather seats
Organization: Lehman Brothers, NY
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 16:06:17 GMT

I would like some recommendations for leather care products to clean and 
preserve seats. I've heard on the net to avoid Armour All as this tends to
dry leather with prolonged use. If anyone has had positive experiences with
a particular product or method, please post or email a response.

Thanks in advance,
-Tim

--
Timothy J. Bigham			| All opinions expressed above are my own
Lehman Brothers, Inc.			| and should not be construed as those of 
AMEX Tower, World Financial Center	| my employer.
New York, N.Y. 				|
From: neilw@informix.com (Neil Williams)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Saturn featured on cover of this weeks BUSINESS WEEK
Date: 13 Aug 92 01:05:36 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <1992Aug11.141553.14469@fid.morgan.com> joec@fid.morgan.com (Joe Collins) writes:
>
>The net is BW feels that GM had better learn the lesson of 
>Saturn's success but recognizes that GM, with scarce resources,
>needs to allocate future funding carefully among Saturn, Chevrolet,
>etc.
>
>Stempel (Chairman) has some reservations since he thinks that
>Saturn owners can simply graduate to bigger GM cars, i.e. Chevrolet, 
>Oldsmobile, Pontiac, etc. BW disagrees with him.

This has got to be the funniest thing I've ever heard!  A saturn
owner buy a "regular" GM car like Chevrolet, Olds, or Pontiac???

Saturn owners who'd switch to a chevy raise you hand....

>BTW - I own a 1991 Saturn SC, and like it alot. 

What do you think?  Would you upgrade to a normal GM car and dealer?

--Neil

-- 
Neil Williams: neilw@informix.com

Seen on my last trip on United: "If you are seated in an exit row 
and can not (sic) read this card... please notify a crew member."
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mas6d@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU (M. Anne Shackelford)
Subject: car wax
Reply-To: mas6d@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU
Organization: University of Virginia Computer Science Department
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 13:24:20 GMT

I've have just waxed my car, but a bit of the wax has gotten onto the textured
black plastic trim around the car.  I can't seem to get it off. 

Do you know of some sort of solution that would dissolve the wax that is
embedded in the plastic trim?


Thanks,

Anne
mas6d@cs.virginia.edu
Xref: sparky rec.autos:20345 rec.autos.tech:11455
From: yuanj@ucbeh.san.uc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech
Subject: How to buy the book? (Was Re: '86 Subaru - reset EGR light, how?)
Date: 20 Aug 92 16:47:28 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: Univ. of Cincinnati

In article <JqLRPB2w165w@toz.buffalo.ny.us>, darkstar@toz.buffalo.ny.us (peter leone) writes:
> thomas@bit.UUCP (Thomas Walter) writes:
>     I went through this on my 86' Subaru about a year ago. If you like do 
> do your own service on your Subaru, I recommend that your go and get a 
> copy of "How to Keep Your Subaru Alive" by Larry Owens. It's a great book 
> that give ssimple instructions on how to fix amlost any thing on Subarus! 

How does one buy the book?  Where?  Cost?  Do you have to spsecify the year of
your car when you choose the book?  We are curious!


Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: rvkl60@aus18a25.sps.mot.com (Tom Mathes)
Subject: Are all motor oils the same?
Organization: Motorola Inc, Austin, Texas
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 15:15:30 GMT

I have a new car (a Saturn SC), and I was wondering about the
quality of motor oils lately.  I've used Pennzoil in my previous
car, but the mechanic at the dealer thought Pennzoil was one of
the worst oils on the market, due to too many additives in it.
He liked Valvoline and Quaker State, but I've also heard some
horror stories about Quaker State from years past.  Now, I'm
thoroughly confused.

Any net.wisdom on what which of the above 3 oild is best, in 
a 5W-30 grade, ?  I know lots about Mobil 1, and know it is 
better than the three above oils, but I will stick with a
mineral based oil.  I change my oil and filter at 3K intervals,
so I don't feel that the synthetic will buy me much.

Tom Mathes                                e-mail : rvkl60@aus18a25.sps.mot.com
Motorola Inc. / MOS Memory Products Div.  phone  : (512) 928-7627
Austin, Texas
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: cat@pluto.dss.com (Iain Wacey)
Subject: Re: $758 for an oil change?
Organization: Datability, Carlstadt, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 20:09:34 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.105423.21815@tsoft.sf-bay.org> meiboy@tsoft.sf-bay.org (MeiBoy of UCU) writes:
>>
>	All this cost a lot, but for someone who is not a
>do-it-yourselfer, what choice do I have.  You might say "go to a
>outside mechanic" which might be cheaper, but, as someone
>accurately pointed out, they always find something else wrong
>with your car.  Even if the mechanic is honest, and I'm sure
>there are some out there, they can't possible know everything
>they need to do for a Ford Taurus (or any other car for that
>matter) to keep it in shape.  They might do a tune-up and oil change
>for the car, but do they know about all the other things called for by the
>factory that they need to do?  At least the Dealer does a complete
>job.

 Saying that an independant mechanic won't do as good as job as the
dealer is just plain wrong.  I drive SAABs, for which parts are fairly
expensive, and take them to an independant mechanic in SW Vermont. He
and his sons know at least as much as the dealer mechanics because
they attend the same courses and receive the same printed material as
the dealer mechanics.  The thought of paying $750 dollars for a 30,000
mile service on an American car is revolting.  The 60,000 mile serivce
on my SAAB will only be around 300 dollars and that includes replacing
the oxygen sensor.
 Do you really feel that by over paying for labor that you are getting
a better service than if you took it to someone who only charged for
what they actually did?  Do you feel you would fare any better if it
is the dealer that screws up your engine?

Iain Wacey
cat@pluto.dss.com




Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
From: agwiii@fang.att.com (Grayson Walker (660-7949)(12/92))
Subject: Re: Radar Detectors and regular people
Followup-To: Speed Limits
Organization: AT&T Tax Systems Development, Maitland FL
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:37:25 GMT

... low speed limits must be left over from the 60's......  What! CRC Check!

The only President impeached in this Century gave us the 55 mph speed limit.
The (claimed) motive was the "gas crisis".

One of the planks in Ronnie's platform was to abolish the 55. This was first
term RR.  Guess what, it didn't happen.

In the 60's, some states were posted at 70 or 75 on the Interstate. Nevada
was posted at "safe a proper". That meant on a clear dry day, you could
pass a Nevada Trooper at 100+ and not get a ticket.

Today, we have the prostitution of law enforcement by the various forms
of speed control that have NO SAFETY purpose -- only economics.

Forza!


Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: jimf@centerline.com (Jim Frost)
Subject: Re: BMW Highway Patrol Car
Organization: CenterLine Software, Inc.
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 18:22:10 GMT

jlysagh@hubcap.clemson.edu (james joseph lysaght) writes:
>It registers to 180 mph but is expected to go more.  THe
>officer driving says he doubts it will be long before he is required to
>determine just how much more.

I personally would be terrified to find that *anyone* was driving
180mph on public roads, in *any* car.  I really hope he was kidding,
since an officer doing that speed is as much a menace as anyone else.

>It has all the fancy
>trimmings; leather interior, CD Player, power everything (windows,
>seats, locks, etc.).

Nice.  I hope they remove the CD player though, it doesn't seem
appropriate.

jim frost
jimf@centerline.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos