Newsgroups: bit.listserv.gaynet
Date:         Wed, 15 Apr 1992 11:17:02 -0400
From:         gaynet@ATHENA.MIT.EDU
Subject:      GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 284

In this issue:
                   VT Houses Passes Gay Rights Bill!
                           Gay Radio History
                               please....
                           US Teens and AIDS
                    GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 283
                    GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 283
                            The Bible (fwd)
                         Church Herald article
                        What's wrong with `GAY'

Please send messages for the entire list to gaynet@ATHENA.MIT.EDU,
requests to be added or deleted to gaynet-request@ATHENA.MIT.EDU, and
personal replies directly to the other person, not the entire list.
Postings to GayNet are public communications.  If you must keep your
privacy, send your messages to gaynet-anonymous@ATHENA.MIT.EDU.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: rpi.mail.gaynet
From: buckmr@rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire)
Subject: Re: VT Houses Passes Gay Rights Bill!
Distribution: local
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 02:46:09 GMT
Apparently-To: rpi-mail-gaynet

WARNER@myriad.lib.middlebury.edu writes:

>The VT House gave final approval to its version of our Gay Rights Bill!!!!
>The vote was 73 to 67! The Bill now moves to conference committee to
>reconcile the House and Senate versions... primarily minor wording changes
>(which included the removal of a definition of "family" which included
>same-sex couples) The Governor yesterday restated his promise to sign it,
>welcoming passage by saying "It's in the long Vermont tradition of people
>protecting people's rights to privacy and their civil rights."
>It makes one proud to be a Vermonter!
>                                Michael.
Yes! But why are they removing ``family'' as same-sex couple, too? I'm confused.
Are the queer groups just compromising on this issue to try and get the
rights bill into law and then concentrate on domestic partnership/family
issues later?

Great news, though.. :-)

Let us know when the Guv signs it...

-
RON BUCKMIRE, 11 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735.
uunet!rpi.edu!buckmr||buckmr@rpitsmts.bitnet||buckmr@rpi.edu||+1 518 276 8910
PrinceMADONNAMariahCareySineadO'ConnorGeorgeMichaelKateBushEnyaCocteauTwins
MTVCNNFOXNBCCBSVH1RobertBarnardIsaacAsimovGoreVidalGlennCloseMerylStreep

------------------------------

Newsgroups: bit.listserv.gaynet
From: cmcl2!panix.com!roy@uunet.UU.NET (Roy Radow)
Subject: Re: Gay Radio History
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 03:25:37 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

In digest <9204132128.AA25854@Toto.MIT.EDU> gaynet@ATHENA.MIT.EDU writes:

>To All Gaynet Folk,
>      I'm currently trying to put together an article on the history
>of gay and lesbian radio programming,without much luck. The only
>ones I've so far come up with are Cleveland's Radio Free Lambda
>( 1975/76 ) and Cincinnati's Gaydreams ( hosted by John Zeh from
>1981-1982 ). Any information on current or defunct shows, people
>connected with them or similar stuff will be gratefully accepted.
>                                    Rob Ridinger
>                                    C60rbr1@niu.bitnet

WBAI (Pacifica Radio) in New York City has a long history of
gay and lesbian radio. You can write them at 505 8th Avenue
NYC, or phone 212 279 0707.

Yours in Liberation,

Roy

-
Roy Radow		roy@panix.com         ...rutgers!cmcl2!panix!roy
North American Man/Boy Love Association -For a packet containing a sample
Bulletin, publications list and membership information send $1.00 postage
to: NAMBLA Info,  Dept.RR,  PO Box 174,  Midtown Station,  NYC NY  10018.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 23:00:41 MDT
From: Rob <r_adkisson@ACADEMIC.MIT.EDU>
Subject: please....

I'd appreciate it if people would stop using tildes (~) to separate messages....
They cause my vax to automatically disconnect me!!!!!!  It's a real pain then
to try and read.... Thanks!
--Rob

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Apr 92 09:34:59 EDT
From: dwoolwin@cc.gettysburg.edu
Subject: US Teens and AIDS

Rep. Patricia Schroeder of Colorado's Select Committee on Children, Youth,
and Families has just issued a report on US teenagers and AIDS. It is
entitled "Teens and AIDS: A Decade of Denial". Anyone interested in seeing
the preliminary findings, or rather a summary of them, can obtain them by
calling the committee at 202-226-7660.
Last night she was on McNeil/Lehrer and had to face off with some real
idiot of a minister from California, who said that Congresswoman Schroeder
was working in conjuction with "gay activists" and was in an "unholy
alliance with NOW" . I would like to believe that he was such an idiot that
he did his own cause only harm. He also claimed that condoms should not be
used because of the much hyped rate of failure and because "they were not
designed to protect against AIDS" which strikes me as the most bizarre
argument against condom use I have ever heard.
Only in America should such arguments be taken seriously by large numbers
of people. I have heard it said, and I increasingly believe it to be true,
that ours is largely a truth denying culture. I think Christianity, as
practiced by the majority of Christians, has done much to promote this
denial of truth and the willful blindness in the face of simple facts.
David E. Woolwine                         717-337-6187
Sociology and Anthropology Department     dwoolwin@cc.gettysburg.edu
Gettysburg College
Gettysburg, PA 17325

------------------------------

Date: 15 Apr 92 08:39:00 CST
From: SHAYS@zeus.unomaha.edu
Subject: RE: GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 283

    Thanks for helping me find the Articles on Christianing and homosexuality.
Every one who sent me stuff I want to tell you it was exactly what I needed..
Again thanks :)

- --------------
Scott Hays
SHAYS@zeus.unomaha.Edu

------------------------------

Date: 15 Apr 92 09:20:00 CST
From: NHESS@zeus.unomaha.edu
Subject: RE: GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 283

Just a post from the middle-aged straight woman from Omaha - Overheard
in an Omaha Supermarket early this am----Two thirty-ish women looking at
tabloid while waiting in line.  One points to lead line "Kristy McNichols
tries trial marriage with gal pal"  Woman #1:  Do you see that?  I didn't know
she was gay!!  Woman #2:  She's not - take my word for it.  Woman #1:  How do
you know?  Woman #2:  She had lots of boyfriends on Eight is Enough.  She
couldn't be gay or she wouldn't have had boyfriends.  No one on TV is gay,
anyway.  I just stood there in disbelief - ah, the travails of ignorance
run rampant through our people.  How can anyone ever hope for non-discrimination
when everyone knows that gay people just don't exist.   Really ticked me off
but I didn't get a chance to say anything because they left.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 07:33:48 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: The Bible (fwd)
From: An Anonymous Sender

- -------- Text of forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 07:32:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Loren Meissner <lmeissne@u.washington.edu>
To: gaynet-annonymous@athena.mit.edu
Subject: The Bible

I'm wondering if it would be possible to keep the Bible and Homosexuality
stuff off Gaynet? Perhaps a more appropriate forum for the "coming out" class
and the pro-and-con Bible discussions would be the alt.politics.homosexuality
bulletin board. Gaynet is for those who are Gay/Lesbian/Bi etc., and
"to be or not to be" homosexual is not an issue here. Those who are coming
out or the Southern Belles among us who are still hung up on the Bible stuff
might want to post on alt.politics.homosexuality. Thanks. Loren at University
of Washington in Seattle.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 11:07 EST
From: VERBEEK%HOPE.BITNET@mitvma.mit.edu
Subject: Church Herald article

By popular request, here it is:

The following article is posted here by the author, with his own permission.
<grin>  It originally appeared in the `Platform' (guest columnist) section of
the March 1990 issue of `The Church Herald', a magazine published by the
Reformed Church in America.

Please note that some of my comments in this article were flavoured for easier
digestion by its primary audience, and do not accurately reflect my current
(or former) theological beliefs.  Your mileage may vary.  Offer void where
prohibited by law.
---------
``Living In Sin?''
by Todd VerBeek

      The 1989 General Synod passed a resolution calling on members to create
a climate welcoming of all people, including those of various disabilities,
languages, ages, and sexual orientations.  The inclusion of "sexual
orientation" sparked considerable debate.
      How should the RCA respond to gay people?  Should it welcome them as
they are, or is their sexuality incompatible with the Gospel?  Before
exploring this question, we need to understand what homosexuality *is*, what
it is *not*, and to what kind of *people* it refers.  Then we can examine what
Scripture says about it.

      Homosexuality is a life-long affectional attraction to individuals of
the same gender.  It refers to the feelings a person has, not the sexual
activity they engage in.  For example, sexually active prison inmates are
usually heterosexual in their orientation, as are children who "experiment"
with same-gender friends.  Celibate gay priests and gay people in mixed-gender
marriages are still homosexual, despite the fact that they do not engage in
same-gender sex.
      People do not choose to be gay.  Why would anyone choose to risk
derision from their friends, physical assault, loss of their jobs, rejection
by their families, and religious condemnation?  Gay people have no more
decided to be gay than straight people have decided to be straight.  Gay
people do, however, face the decision of whether to acknowledge their sexual
orientation.  As much as ten percent of the population is faced with this
question.
      We don't yet know why people are attracted to one sex or the other (or
both).  We do know that sexual orientation is already set by age 5, though
individuals may not properly recognize it for some time.  Children and
adolescents cannot be "recruited" to become one or the other.  A few well-
intentioned religious groups claim to "convert" gay people, but candid
discussion reveals that "successful" cases already had heterosexual feelings,
and still have homosexual feelings they can't fully ignore.
      Homosexuality is not a mental disorder, a fact recognized by the
American Psychiatric Association and the American Psychological Association.
The feelings gay people have naturally for their partners are the same as the
feelings heterosexuals have for theirs.  Lesbian and gay relationships can be
as nurturing and monogamous as heterosexual relationships.  If society did not
actively undermine them, but instead gave them comparable support, more same-
gender relationships would match or exceed the longevity of heterosexual
marriages.
      Most lesbians and gay men are not especially masculine or feminine.
People who fit these stereotypes are just more readily *identified* as gay
(whether they actually are or not).  Gay people shop at the same stores, work
in the same offices, live in the same neighborhoods, and worship at the same
churches you do.  The only real difference is the gender of the people they
fall in love with.

      What does Scripture say about homosexuality?  Interestingly, very
little.  The Gospels record no mention of it by Christ.  There are a few
passages that have been commonly thought to condemn it: the story of Sodom and
Gomorrah, Levitical law, and certain comments by Paul.  However, as we gain
better insight into Scripture, there is considerable reason to question the
blanket condemnation of homosexuality.
      Genesis 19 tells that when two angels visited Lot's house in Sodom, the
men of the city demanded that Lot send them out, so that they might "know"
them.  This passage condemns homosexual assault, but does not condemn loving
gay relationships of the kind we see today.  Biblical passages curse Sodom
repeatedly for mistreatment of visitors, but nowhere for homosexuality.
      Leviticus 18:22 states, "You shall not lie with a male as with a woman."
However, Leviticus also forbids wearing clothes woven of two materials (19:19)
and eating pork, lobster, or clams (11:7,11).  Yet we do not say today that
poly/cotton shirts or clam chowder are abominations, because we know that such
ceremonial laws no longer apply.
      The reference in Romans 1:26-27 to those who lustfully "exchanged
natural relations for unnatural" has often been thought to denounce same-
gender relations of any kind.  Saying that this passage *also* means committed
relationships between people who are naturally gay, is reading things into the
text.  After all, society of Paul's time did not even understand that such
people existed.  The disapproval of hedonistic experimentation is evident here,
but this passage does not speak clearly about loving, gay relationships.
      In 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, the RSV says that "[no] homosexuals...will
inherit the kingdom of God."  However, the New International Version (which
follows Paul's words and meaning more faithfully) speaks more specifically, of
"male prostitutes" and "homosexual offenders".  Since most gay people are
neither sexually abusive nor prostitutes, this should not be read as a
condemnation of all homosexual activity, just of particular homosexuals who
are sinful.

      Some people categorically condemn all gay men and lesbians, but surely
God would not exclude us from grace for feelings we do not choose to have.
Some say we must change, but though God *could* change our orientation, He
does not, and countless devout Christians remain gay.  Some self-righteously
instruct us not to "practice" our sexuality, but Paul advises that celibacy is
not for all...it is better to marry than to let love smolder unfulfilled.
      Society shouts that the love we feel is wrong.  But prayerful meditation
quietly assures me that mutual love in the context of a greater love for God
can only be good.  My faith is in the loving God who speaks to me in that
still, small voice.
------------
Todd VerBeek is a member of Hope Reformed Church in Grand Rapids, Michigan.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 11:08 EST
From: VERBEEK%HOPE.BITNET@mitvma.mit.edu
Subject: What's wrong with `GAY'

Will: >What I would like to know is, since when did "Gay" not include everyone
      >with same sex partners? Why does it know seem to apply strictly to men?

In an ideal world, we could just say `gay' and people would automatically
think of the broad diversity of male and female, dark and light, etc. people
who are attracted to those of the same gender.

But what *really* happens is that someone says `gay' and people think of
white, middle class men.  By being more specific (`lesbians and gay men') we
remind people that our community includes *both* women and men.

The question we are now facing is whether we need to add `bisexual' to the
phrase, to remind people that not all of us in this community are Kinsey 6's
(entirely homosexual).

        Cheers, Todd

------------------------------

End of GayNet Digest
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