HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jlundy@bilbo.encore.com (Joe Lundy)
Subject: Re: Blue Jays-Gillick
Organization: Encore Computer Corp.
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 14:47:34 GMT

In article <1gq0ulINN1iv@transfer.stratus.com>, jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann) writes:
|> 
|> No, a better analogy might be gasoline.  You drove home today,
|> say, with Texaco unleaded regular. It would be unwarranted 
|> speculation to assume that you would have made it home OK if
|> you had Mobile Premium in the car instead.
 
No, but you would get a free Dolphins glass.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Joe Lundy           Encore Computer Corporation, 6901 W. Sunrise Blvd.    |
| jlundy@encore.com   Mail Stop 811, Ft. Lauderdale, FL  33313-4499         |
| Most important stats of all time:  The youngest Marlins fan is here!!!!!  |
| Adrianne Lundy Born 10/19/92  Hght: 1' 7", Wt: 8 Poops: Left Burps: Right |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: genetic+@pitt.edu (Dr. Dave)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: MLV thoughts after the '92 season
Date: 15 Dec 92 15:38:27 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Department of Industrial Engineering

Thus spake genetic+@pitt.edu (Dr. Dave) (That's me):

>In looking over Steve Smith's position-adjusted MLV numbers for the '92
>season, a few interesting things crop up:

Ack!  That should be Steve *Stein*.  Apologies, Steven Z...


-- 
       David Tate        |"Out of the dugout endlessly swinging,
 dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu | Out of the manager's throat, the sound fundamentals,
 Prof. of Story Problems | Out of the six-month season..."            
 Member ORSA, TIMS, SABR | 	Walt "Lefty" Whitman
From: sweda@css.itd.umich.edu (Sean Sweda)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: idiots.
Date: 18 Dec 1992 19:16:53 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan ITD Consulting and Support Services
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: stimpy.css.itd.umich.edu
Summary: Mets mis-management
Keywords: Harazin/Cashen DIE DIE DIE

In article <1992Dec14.195327.15056@asd.com> scott@asd.com (Scott Barman) writes:
>
>Schofield was brought in to play shortstop.  Because Kevin Elster's
>shoulder was not responding to his surgery, who was going to play short?
>Howard Johnson was committed to center field and they did not feel
>comfortable with Bill Pecota at short on an every day basis.  Besides,
>Pecota got hurt himself.  The Mets needed a shortstop.  Schofield was
>made available and the Mets made a trade.  They plugged a whole with
>someone who was actually a shortstop.  So tell me, why is that dumb?
>

Sorry, Whitey raped us on this one.  No way do you trade 2 quality young
pitchers for a shortstop who can't hit .250

The fact is that in both instances (Schofield and O'Brien) the Mets
(mis)management paniced and payed too much for a stopgap.  And don't tell
me that two good young pitchers are the going price for shortstops of
Schofield's calibre.  We got Fernandez (who only makes about a half-mil
more a year) for a middle reliever and a non-prospect.


-- 
***********************************************************************
Sean Sweda					sweda@css.itd.umich.edu
GM/Owner Motor City Marauders
Internet Baseball League	     "the Mets signed Frank Tanana?!?!"
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Blue Jays-Gillick
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University, Sudbury, ON
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 03:03:47 GMT

In <1992Dec17.002229.28458@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:

>In article <1992Dec16.222334.13983@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>>the functions or purposes of a cigarette lighter and the drive train are
>>not the same.  the cigarette lighter makes no claim that it contributes
>>to my safe arrival.  A better comparison is the tiny jet in my carburetor 
>>and the drive shaft.  I wouldn't have made it without either.

>Why?  Prove it! :-)

Well I don't really like these analogies because sooner or later they break
down.  I guess taking the drive shaft out of the car might be like taking the
shortstop off of the field.  perhaps the carburetor is the 1b man.  Do you
really want me to prove that a team that only fields 7 players can't win a
major league game?

>But if you want to use "claim" of contribution, then this is senseless.
>Griffin, for example, makes no claim either that he's an essential part of
>the Blue Jays' success.  So what does that tell you?  Nothing.  David Cone
>didn't make that kind of a claim either.  What does that tell you?  Nothing.

I guess you are saying that these players did not accept a share of the
playoff and WS winnings?

>>Well yah, the car ran and I got home OK.  Should I consider a discussion
>>worthwhile that centred on whether the drive shaft or the carberutor jet 
>>was more important to my journey?  Furthermore, should I feel safer knowing
>>that I had the best jet and the best drive shaft before the journey while 
>>not even understanding that there is far more to the car than those 2 parts?

>Prove that Griffin is as important as a drive shaft.  If you can't, don't
>bother asking anyone to prove anything from now on.

Nope.  They won with Griffin.  If you think they could have won without him
then the onus is on you to prove it.  And you can't.  I can prove that they
won with him.  And if you can't prove that they could have won without Griffin
then you can't prove that Griffin was any less valuable to the team than
Alomar.

a pleasure, as always,

rm

-- 
roger maynard
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Blue Jays-Gillick
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University, Sudbury, ON
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 03:22:38 GMT

In <1992Dec15.161714.2075@sni.ca> dave@snitor.sni.ca (Dave Till) writes:

>I risk sounding like a broken record, but I must again point out that a
>manager's job consists of more than setting the lineup and ordering up fancy
>in-game strategies.

>I claim that the hardest part of the manager's job is actually *managing*
>his players:  making sure that no conflicts break out which affect the
>team's performance, and ensuring that everyone is happy with his role
>and giving their best on the field.

I think you are wasting your time here Dave.  The nerds can't measure this
kind of contribution so they claim it doesn't exist - or if it does its effect
is trivial.

>Look at the record:

>1989:  took a team that started 12-24 under Jimy One-M and went 77-49 with it.
>The Jays were in last in June, and went on to win the division.

>1990:  finished 2 games out of first, and were in contention right until
>the final weekend.

>1991:  won the division again.

>1992:  won the whole thing.

Some of us understand that the only true measure of quality is merely  
the measure of a team's success.  Others feel that success is incidental
to quality. 

>Had Earl Weaver or Tony LaRussa done this, the mediots would be singing
>his praises in three-part harmony.

>Sure, the Jays put a great team on the field, and it's a lot easier to win
>when you've got the horses.  But baseball is filled with organizations who
>have top-flight talent but don't know how to utilize it; as a Red Sox fan,

yep.  Jim Leyland is a real genius ain't he?  

>I'll take Cito, thank you very much.

So should every team in baseball.  At least in '92.  Because the team he
managed won it all and that's all there is to win...

>--Dave "got any third basemen you're not using?" Till

Where the heck is Roy Howell hanging out these days?

rm

-- 
roger maynard
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca
From: demers@cs.ucsd.edu (David DeMers)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Giants and Bonds - a $43 million mistake?
Date: 11 Dec 92 18:22:51 GMT
Organization: CSE Dept., UC San Diego


 In <92345.100327COP80196@UCF1VM.BITNET> Bill Laird <COP80196@UCF1VM.BITNET> writes:
|> [...]
|> 
|> >Don't get me wrong. I think Bonds will help out the team quite a bit.
|> >Unfortunately, the price that comes with him far outway the advantages.
|> >The Giants would have been much better off going after Dave Stewart.

Oh my.  Bonds is likely going to provide about 5 more wins all by himself,
maybe more.  Stewart probably has negative value at this point, though
he could bounce back again.  Yes, the Giants need pitching help.  But
the OF was pretty stinky too.  Help anywhere leads to more victories, why
not get it where you can?  Bonds is cheap at the salary the Giants are
paying, compared with the idiocies of other teams.  I mean, $6.5MM/year
for Joe Carter??  Kirby Puckett??  $2.4MM/year for SPIKE OWEN?  

Bonds and Maddux were the bargains of the free agent signing.  McGwire
probably will be cheap too - a lot of teams have shot their wad already.
Pittsburgh and Atlanta could use him (as could Oakland...).  I'd
kind of like to see him as a Brave, though Klesko might be ready.

Bonds created, what, about 140 runs last year? (maybe 120, don't
have my references here).  So call it 14 wins.  That puts him
at $500K per win for the Giants.  A bit pricey - that makes
a 90 win season cost about $45MM in payroll.  But, the youngsters
are cheap - and even the stars on the Giants are pretty reasonably
priced.  Clark probably returns 10 wins for his $4MM.  That's a
nice base to start from.  Pitching is risky, and only a Clemens
really can return as many as 10 wins (in terms of net value, 
of course there are a lot of 15-20 game "winners").  

No, I think the biggest offseason mistake of the Giants was letting
Rapp go.  He can pitch.

-- 
Dave DeMers			 ddemers@UCSD   demers@cs.ucsd.edu
Computer Science & Engineering	C-014		demers%cs@ucsd.bitnet
UC San Diego					...!ucsd!cs!demers
La Jolla, CA 92093-0114	(619) 534-0688, or -8187, FAX: (619) 534-7029
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: vince@victrola.sea.wa.us (Vince Skahan)
Subject: Re: Orioles' Tix; Better Get Started
Organization: Vince and Suzie's Underpowered PC
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1992 18:59:23 GMT

tkevans@eplrx7.es.duPont.com (Tim Evans) writes:

>The Orioles just placed 1993 single-games tickets on sale this weekend,
>and had long lines at the ticket windows.  Considering that last season was
>a virtual sellout, and that this one looks to be one, too, you may want
>to order tickets now.

as somebody who was fortunate enough to get tickets in '92 for a game,
anybody with the opportunity to go for it should do so...that place is
an absolute shrine to baseball as it should be.

-- 
     ---------- Vince Skahan --------- vince@victrola.sea.wa.us ----------
"USENET is not an obsession. It's just something I have to do all the time."
					quote from Jan'93 Unix World article
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Subject: Re: Brett Boone
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 00:36:30 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.174720.26689@watson.ibm.com> mjones@donald.aix.kingston.ibm.com writes:
>ts@chainsaw.ecn.purdue.edu (Thomas Ruschak) writes:
>: In article <AwS=GYC@engin.umich.edu> chyang@metaphor.engin.umich.edu (Chung Hsiung Yang) writes:

>: >	Now Seattle has young Bret Boon at the second base.  He came 
>: >from the Boon lineage in Baseball and he seems to be a solid player.

>: 	What's so special about him? I know baseball is in love with sons
>: of old players, which can be good or bad, but still, what's good about him?
>: I didn't get to see him play last year, so all I have to go on is his age
>: (21?), and his stats:

>: BATTERS   BA   SLG   OBP   G  AB   R   H  TB 2B 3B HR RBI  BB  SO SB CS  E
>: BOONE,B .194  .318  .224  33 129  15  25  41  4  0  4  15   4  34  1  1  6

>Yeah, there's nothing special here, but it's only 129 AB. His raw minor
>league stats last year were
>  BOONE,B .314  .485  .398 118 439  73 138 213 26  5 13  73  60  88 17 12
>Of course, that's in Calgary, so they need adjustment. His MLE for last year:
>  BOONE,B .262  .387  .325 118 408  47 107 158 21  3  8  47  38  95 10 10

>That's pretty darned good for a 21-year-old second baseman! The Calgary
>stats are pretty much in line with his other minor league numbers. The 129
>AB is probably a blip. Expect better next year.

Well, it's okay, not great.  Certainly better than Harold Reynolds.  But
he was *23* last year, not 21.

-- 
David M. Nieporent   | Is it too early to start making predictions for 1993?
niepornt@phoenix.    | Probably, but that never stopped me before.
   princeton.edu     | ALE: Baltimore ALW: Chicago NLE: Montreal NLW: Atlanta
Baltimore Orioles 93 | AL MVP: Cal Ripken  AL Cy Young: Mike Mussina
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: akamholz@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Andrew E Kamholz)
Subject: Destrade in Florida (was My picks, AL/NL East)
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 00:31:31 GMT

In article <lws.16@eembox.ncku.edu.tw> lws@eembox.ncku.edu.tw (WenHsiang Lin) writes:
>> Orestes Destrade will pop 270 with 20 homers.   
>
>    Is it very difficult to hit home run in Marlins' home ground?
>Orestes Destrade consistantly hits around 40 homers for every 130-game
>season in Japan. I expect him to have more than 20 homers for Marlins
>in next season.
>
Ahh, yes, but let's not forget that he is in an American-size park (all of
which are considerably larger than all Japanese parks) and facing major
league pitchers. And, he's no Cecil Fielder. Of course, Fielder was no
Cecil Fielder when he left America, so I could be wrong and Destrade could
go long-ball crazy.

-AEK


Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: mjones@fenway.aix.kingston.ibm.com (Mike Jones)
Subject: Re: Brett Boone
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 17:47:20 GMT
Reply-To: mjones@donald.aix.kingston.ibm.com
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

ts@chainsaw.ecn.purdue.edu (Thomas Ruschak) writes:
: In article <AwS=GYC@engin.umich.edu> chyang@metaphor.engin.umich.edu (Chung Hsiung Yang) writes:
: >
: >	Now Seattle has young Bret Boon at the second base.  He came 
: >from the Boon lineage in Baseball and he seems to be a solid player.
: 
: 	What's so special about him? I know baseball is in love with sons
: of old players, which can be good or bad, but still, what's good about him?
: I didn't get to see him play last year, so all I have to go on is his age
: (21?), and his stats:
: 
: BATTERS   BA   SLG   OBP   G  AB   R   H  TB 2B 3B HR RBI  BB  SO SB CS  E
: BOONE,B .194  .318  .224  33 129  15  25  41  4  0  4  15   4  34  1  1  6

Yeah, there's nothing special here, but it's only 129 AB. His raw minor
league stats last year were
  BOONE,B .314  .485  .398 118 439  73 138 213 26  5 13  73  60  88 17 12
Of course, that's in Calgary, so they need adjustment. His MLE for last year:
  BOONE,B .262  .387  .325 118 408  47 107 158 21  3  8  47  38  95 10 10

That's pretty darned good for a 21-year-old second baseman! The Calgary
stats are pretty much in line with his other minor league numbers. The 129
AB is probably a blip. Expect better next year.

   Mike Jones  |  AIX/ESA Development  |  mjones@donald.aix.kingston.ibm.com

Awakened by his presence, she proceeds in her frail, sensitive way to have
sex with everyone in reach but the housemaid and perhaps the dog (though the
dog wasn't talking).
	- Mark Leeper on HENRY AND JUNE
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: sullis@aix.rpi.edu (Sean C. Sullivan)
Subject: Has Tom Henke signed with the Red Sox?
Summary: Has Henke signed?
Keywords:  Henke, Boston, Red Sox, Rangers, ex-Blue Jays
Organization: Rotisserie Polytechnic Institute (Troy, NY, USA)
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 16:47:09 GMT


Has Tom Henke "officially" signed with the Red Sox?

I don't think he has.
What is the holdup?
Is he talking with other teams?

-- 
# Sean C. Sullivan (sullis@rpi.edu) | R.P.I. | DISCLAIMER:  Not!   #
# (AFS home directory:  /afs/rpi.edu/home/95/sullis)               #
# "Holy mother of God, what is Lou Gorman smoking?" == Dave Kirsch #
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Subject: Re: Blue Jays-Gillick
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 07:52:40 GMT

In article <1992Dec16.212155.3280@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>In article <1992Dec16.164157.16703@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:

>>I agree with you that the most important thing a manager does is manage the
>>players.  I find it interesting that Leyland gets (deserved) recognition
>>for his handling of players, and is generally regarded as a good manager
>>for it, despite his in-game strategies and batting orders, while Gaston
>>doesn't.

>LaRussa and Leyland are white...Cito Gaston and Felipe Alou are not...
>some sportwriters who write about baseball and vote for manager of the
>year have Marge Schott disease.

I'm certainly not about to disagree with the sentiment expressed about
mediots, but I think these are poor examples.

There are *good* reasons to choose LaRussa over Gaston, like the fact
that at least LaRussa has read enough of the rulebook to understand the
concept of "pinch-hitters" and seems to demonstrate a basic knowledge of
role-players and OBP.  (Not OBP, per se, but he seems to use people like
Blankenship and Browne and Ready, when all they really give a team is
walks, compared to other managers who would let these people sit on the
bench because of the things they *don't* do.)

As for Leyland/Alou, there is a more likely reason why Leyland is
favored -- he has a longer history of winning, and he *won.*  Most
mediots, like Roger Maynard, have a hard time understanding that the
world is not black-and-white.  Group success does not prove individual
talent; because the Pirates won does NOT mean Leyland is good.  But they
can't handle that -- it's too complex.  Win=Good.  Lose=Bad.  That's all
they can handle.

I'm perfectly willing to accept simple-mindedness over racism for most
mediot comments.
-- 
David M. Nieporent   | Is it too early to start making predictions for 1993?
niepornt@phoenix.    | Probably, but that never stopped me before.
   princeton.edu     | ALE: Baltimore ALW: Chicago NLE: Montreal NLW: Atlanta
Baltimore Orioles 93 | AL MVP: Cal Ripken  AL Cy Young: Mike Mussina
Xref: sparky rec.sport.baseball:35927 soc.women:21418 soc.men:21078
From: psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball,soc.women,soc.men
Subject: Re: Women Sports Reporters
Date: 12 Dec 92 18:00:27 GMT
Followup-To: rec.sport.baseball
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Dec12.034809.7245@athena.mit.edu> cmk@athena.mit.edu (Charles M Kozierok) writes:
>
>your clip of Heather's comments are totally out of context. they were
>made in the middle of a major war with a major jerk, and were meant to
>be sarcastic. that moron has finally been silenced, so let's let dead dogs lie.
>

Ah see folks, I was willing to let the thread die at the request of other
posters but...

I can't let this simple minded clod think he's actually gotten the better of me
so here, we, go, agaiiiin!  

PSG

-- 
"Now if a lawyer, or doctor, was sloppy in a diagnosis and 
 hurt you; you could sue.  The advantage of being a journalist 
 is, you can be sloppy, not do your homework and hurt people,     Paul Tsongas 
 and it's just part of the game.  It's not a game!"              4 - DEC - 1992
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: cosper@seq.uncwil.edu (Kit Cosper)
Subject: Re: Trivia Question
Organization: Univ. of North Carolina @ Wilmington
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 02:49:22 GMT

jjungbau@yoda.eecs.wsu.edu (Jim Jungbauer) writes:

>In article <1992Dec15.230447.23093@ntmtv> robh@ntmtv.UUCP (Robert Hendriks) writes:

>>THE eight ways of reaching base safely (first or otherwise) are:
>>
>>1. walk
>>2. hit
>>3. hit by pitch
>>4. wild pitch on third strike with batter beating the ball to first
>>5. fielders choice
>>6. error
>>7. catchers interference
>>8. player leaving the field while time is in

>I know that every time I've heard the answer to this question, "error"
>and "catcher's interference" have been listed separately, but isn't the
>latter just one instance of the former?  I've always wondered why it gets
>treated separately.


	I think the differene here is that if the ball is hit
	it is a fielding error, if the catcher interferes it
	is a procedural error.  With that said, where would fan
	interference come in?  (Tried to find my rulebook, but
	it's lost under the post-exam clutter on my desk...)


	Kit

-- 
   Kit Cosper                        cosper@seq.uncwil.edu         
   PP-ASEL-IA                        AMA 31022
From: genetic+@pitt.edu (Dr. Dave)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: paul harrington or mark mcgwire: who's the liar?
Date: 11 Dec 92 18:04:29 GMT
Organization: Department of Industrial Engineering

Thus spake cmk@athena.mit.edu (Charles M Kozierok):

>i heard an interview this evening with paul harrington, who is
>basically lou gorman's boss.

>he said that the red sox were "never close to signing mcgwire,
>neither in terms of money or *of interest*" (-not- an exact quote,
>but pretty close).

>i heard mcgwire say he was very interested in coming to boston, and 
>he sounded sincere (i.e. it didn't sound like the usual "oh yeah,
>boston would be great" stuff). so which one of them is full of it?


Rule of thumb:

If an owner (or other management tool, such as a league president or the
commissioner) and a player disagree publicly about the facts, the likelihoods
are about as follows:

	1. They're both wrong (either lying or mistaken): 50%
	2. The owner is lying, player is not: 47%
	3. Player is lying, owner is not: 3%

The above are based on a small sample of personal observations, corroborated
as best I can.  Your mileage may vary.


-- 
       David Tate        |"Out of the dugout endlessly swinging,
 dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu | Out of the manager's throat, the sound fundamentals,
 Prof. of Story Problems | Out of the six-month season..."            
 Member ORSA, TIMS, SABR | 	Walt "Lefty" Whitman
From: mlake@irscscm.UUCP (Marshall Lake)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: All-time Red Sox team
Date: 19 Dec 92 05:04:22 GMT
Reply-To: mlake@irscscm.UUCP (Marshall Lake)
Organization: Internal Revenue Service, Washington, DC

In article <1992Dec16.150752.7885@rz-berlin.mpg.de> campbell@rz-berlin.mpg.de writes:
>In article <1992Dec12.230023.34715@watson.ibm.com>, mjones@fenway.aix.kingston.ibm.com (Mike Jones) writes:
>> In article <1gba79INNhpv@fido.asd.sgi.com> coolidge@speaker.wpd.sgi.com (Don Coolidge) writes:
>>>In article <1992Dec10.195508.23031@watson.ibm.com>, mjones@fenway.aix.kingston.ibm.com (Mike Jones) writes:
>>>|> To sort of paper over the angst I've gotten from Lou Abbott's (I know, it's
>>>|> It seems like there's a really good first team, but my bench is kind of
>>>|> weak. Who am I forgetting?  	
>>>|> SP  Cy Young
>>>|> 	Roger Clemens
>>>|> 	Lefty Grove
>>>|> 	Smoky Joe Wood
>>>|> 	Luis Tiant
>>>
>>>	Bill Monbouquette
>>>	Bill Lee (well, occasionally. And for pure entertainment value!)
>> 
>> Actually, Lee was the next name on my list. He did win 17 three years in a
>> row, no mean feat for a lefty in Fenway. I don't think I could take
>> Monbouquette over any of those guys, 
>> Tiant:                     Eckersley:          Lee
>> Gallons of radioactive beagle excrement that will be buried: 34,000
>> 	- Harper's Index, April 1991
>
>How do Mel Parnell (another lefty) and Dick Radatz (Reliever on shitty teams)
>stack up?
>						Joe C.

What about Lonborg (sp?)?  Did he have more than one really good year?
And what about Babe Ruth?

-- 
Marshall Lake
...!uunet!{media,mimsy!bogart}!irscscm!mlake
mlake@irscscm.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball