From: maupb@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr J L Saunders)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.urban,rec.nude,alt.religion.kibology,alt.slack,alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Driving without shoes
Date: 27 Jan 1993 12:28:14 -0000
Organization: Computing Services, University of Warwick, UK
NNTP-Posting-Host: clover.csv.warwick.ac.uk


In article <B3D1VB13w165w@codewks.nacjack.gen.nz> system@codewks.nacjack.gen.nz (Wayne McDougall) writes:
%maupb@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr J L Saunders) writes:
%
%> In article <9aLFVB6w165w@codewks.nacjack.gen.nz> system@codewks.nacjack.gen.n
%> 
%> %I've been in situations where I've put the brake down as hard as I could
%> %[and stopped behind a staionery idiot with less than a foot to spare - quite
%> %a relief after 70 km / hr]. Rec.autos.* would know far more than me on this
%> %subject. But a) I'm not too worried about skidding if I'm travelling in a
%> %straight line, 
%> 
%> I certainly would be if you were coming towards me!
%
%Well, perhaps unlike you, I make sure I'm in the right [correct] lane.
%[This is a teeny bit offensive, because that's how I found your comments.

Well, perhaps unlike you, I'd be worried if someone on the other side of the
road locked their brakes (note the word brakes - not tyres) and skidded
towards me. Likewise, I'd be worried if someone in the same lane as me, and
going in same direction, skidded into the back of me as I stopped at a set of
traffic lights.

%> % and b) if you're worried about tyres LOCKING, well again as 
%> %long as it is slowing me down that's fine too.
%> 
%> You zoomer! It's not fine to lock the wheels of a car - on any surface other
%> than gravel or snow that will give you hardly any deceleration. The correct
%
%well lookee, I did say "as long as it is slowing me down". You are talking
%about when it is NOT slowing me down, so your comments are n/a. I carefully
%phrased it that way, because I know people have different definitions of
%"tyres locking" some of which are fine and some aren't (for braking
%purposes).

Okay - I assume what you mean by "tyres locking" is "tyres making a horrible
screeching sound, indicating that the limit of their coefficient of friction
has been exceeded". Maybe my assumption is wrong, but say it isn't... then the
decellerating force provided by a set of tyres that have exceeded their limit
of coefficient of friction is much less than that provided by a set of brakes
used correctly (even drum brakes).

%> procedure to do an emergency stop is to apply pressure initially as in normal
%> braking and then increase the pressure until you are braking very hard. If yo
%> lock the wheels you should take pressure off the brake pedal and then re-appl
%> pressure as before.
%
%Agreed. That is what I would do if I was NOT slowing down.
%
%> %In summary, I want to be in a position where I can apply maximum force to
%> %the brakes.
%> 
%> You ought to have some driving lessons - you might learn something that'll 
%> save someone else's life! When you've had the lessons, then you can start
%> telling people how to drive.

%Well give me a brake. I was not telling people how to drive. I was saying
%that wearing shoes means that I can put my foot down hard on the brake
%without worrying about it curling up because of some reflex action.

Granted

%Furthermore, in the incident I cited (which you have failed to quote), I
%DID brake as hard as I could, the wheels did NOT lock, and I did stop less
%than a metre from this idiot on the wrong side of the road [who was also
%stopping thank goodness]. I COORECTLY assess that I did not have time to
%apply pressure initially as in normal braking as you suggest. If I had done
%as you suggest, I would certainly have crashed. I can cite other accidents
%where [quote from police report] "the driver must have literally stood on
%his brakes" for example, immediately.

Well, you see if the driver had *literally* stood on the brakes, not a lot
would have happened :-) However, if one were to execute an emergency stop
correctly, one would indeed end up standing on the brakes, figuratively 
speaking. However, what's important is how one gets there. By stamping on the
brake pedal as hard as you can, you are increasing you chances of going into
an uncontrollable skid. Much of the point of the initial progressive braking
is to allow the suspension to settle into "braking stance" before full force
is applied. The only situations where you would actually want to lock the
brakes/wheels are when you are braking in thick snow or gravel.

%So what's your problem?

An intolerance of misinformation.

Apologies to all those of you who, like me, had thought this thread long gone.
Also, apologies to Wayne if I have misunderstood what he means by "tyres
locking"

%-- 
%  Wayne McDougall, BCNU
%  This .sig unintentionally left blank.
%
%Hello! I'm a .SIG Virus. Delete me and make the world a happier place.

Cheers,
Jason
-- 
                       Jason L Saunders [ RouE ]       
                     email: maupb@csv.warwick.ac.uk
snail: Warwick Business School, University of Warwick, Coventry CV4 7AL, UK

Newsgroups: alt.folklore.urban