HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fierkelab@bchm.biochem.duke.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Shawon Dunston (ICK!)
Date: 28 Jan 93 13:51:58 GMT
Organization: Biochemistry

Shawon Dunston     Born 3/21/63 Age 30 next opening day

Year    G    AB    Ave    OBP    Slg    R    RBI    HR
1991   142  492   .260   .292   .407   59     50    12
1990   146  545   .262   .283   .426   73     66    17
1989   138  471   .278   .320   .403   52     60     9
1988   155  575   .249   .271   .357   69     56     9

4 seasons that are all in all, pretty indistinguishable from each other,
occurring at what should be the peak of his career, while playing half his
games in one of the best hitter's parks in baseball.  Now he's recovering
from a season-long injury, and will be 30 years old on opening day.  I don't
want him at SS, and I sure as hell don't want him in the OF.

You might say, "Well, SS don't hit much...".  I tend to operate on the theory
that getting one good bat out of your two middle infield positions is doing
well.  Who would I rather have as a middle infielder in the NL next season?

SS -- B.Larkin, O.Smith, Cordero, J. Bell, T. Fernandez, maybe even A. Cedeno
(projected for .236 BA, .271 OBP, .373 SLG in 81 games with the Astros acc.
to STATS.  Since he's 23, I'd rather suffer a little with him at SS this
season than with Dunston.  After all, Cedeno may BETTER his predictions. 
Dunston won't, if he's playing at all.  A similar, but weaker case can be
made for Royce Clayton.  Jose Offerman has a stronger case, but can he field
the position?)

2B -- Sandberg, DeShields, R. Thompson, Biggio, J. Reed, possibly G. Pena
(Maybe even C. Garcia or J. Kent, but not E. Young)


And as a utility player, certainly I'd rather have M. Duncan or Blauser than
Dunston.  Probably M.Sharperson also.

It appears to me that Dunston, if he has fully recovered and returns to form,
will be an offensive force with total value similar to that of Kurt Stillwell
or Rey Sanchez.  That's at his best.  If he doesn't get his job back, then
forget about it.  Why take a chance on this guy?  If you are going to take a
chance, why not try someone who might help you if things go his way this
season?  (aka Offerman or Cedeno).


Eric Roush			Deck us all with Boston Charlie
fierkelab@			Walla Walla Wash and Kalamazoo!
bchm.biochem.duke.edu	Nora's freezin' on the Trolley,
				Swaller Dollar Cauliflower Alla-ga-Roo!

				Walt Kelley
From: paul@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Paul R Krueger)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Re: Questions about the Flying Australian
Date: 27 Jan 1993 15:18:06 GMT
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4

   Dave Nilsson will be a full-time starter for the Brewhas at catcher this
   year. Unless he flops miserably, he should start in about 150 or so games.
   He has put up some mind-boggling minor league stats (hitting .418 I think
   at AA El Paso a couple years ago, a hitters park, but impressive          
   nonetheless) and I would be surprised if he wasn't a capable major league
   player. I'd expect him to hit somewhere around .280 with about 10-15 dingers
   and around 70 RBI. Of course he did have shoulder problems last year and I'm
   not sure if he's fully recovered yet.

   --salty


Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: kbanaian@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu (King Banaian)
Subject: Re: Any news about these players?
Keywords: ward, montgomery, joyner, canseco, guzmanju, guillen, franco
Organization: Pitzer College
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 19:24:01 GMT

In article <1jvjphINN5kq@aludra.usc.edu> kbrennan@aludra.usc.edu (Kirk Brennan) writes:
>I'm about to ink the following trade; I'd appreciate any comments.  
>I'm starving for saves, by the way, I have a decent staff of starters.  
>Standard, by-the-book RLB rules.
>
>I give up:
>
>   Wally Joyner  (16)
>   Juan Guzman   (10)
>
>I get
>
>   Jose Canseco  (39) ouch
>   Duane Ward    (5)
>     -or-
>   J. Montgomery (16)
>
>
>I'm leaning towards Montgomery, 'cause he's the proven stopper.  Ward 
>seems to be up for getting a fair number of saves, but his arm hasn't
>proven me the longevity.
>
Gosh, what exactly does Ward *have* to do to impress you.  Let me tell you, 
I've spent two years saying "Greg Maddux pitches so many innings, he can't 
last at this rate" that I let him get by me at $13 (along with several other 
owners) two years ago.  He's been over 100 IP each of the last five years (
no starts) and has maintained K/BB over 2 for the last three.  The Jays will 
now use him less than before.  For $5, he's a screaming "Grab 'im", and I'd
run, not walk, to the phone to consummate the deal.  He alone is worth it.  
I'd rather get burned paying $39 for a $33 Canseco season than $10 for a $1 
Billy Hatcher season.


>Any word on the health of these two cripples?
>
>Ozzie Guillen?
All set and ready to go.  I don't want him, but I own many SS already.

>Julio Franco?
Will only qualify at DH, unless you have weird rules.  .440 slug DHs are not
a rare commodity.

P.S. to Les re:  Doug Henry.  Brewers have only minor leaguers to replace 
him (anyone remember Chris George?).  If you have good ratio elsewhere, he'd 
be a good selection.  He'll probably chip in a few buzzard wins.
From: demers@cs.ucsd.edu (David DeMers)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Re: Gollenbock, Benson books out
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:40:20 GMT
Organization: =CSE Dept., U.C. San Diego

In article <1jtejj$l73@agate.berkeley.edu> srubio@garnet.berkeley.edu (Steven Rubio) writes:

>Don't listen to me, though ... I did a piece on the Giants' bullpen for
>his book last year and totally missed on Rod Beck. :-)  (This year I'm
>pushing Scott Brosius as Bay Area sleeper.)

Hee hee! In our league, one owner picked up four Giant relievers.
Afterwards, I got Rod Beck for $1 and announced "LTA spent $32 on
San Francisco relievers, but I got the closer".  Lucky guess, but
it was the quote of the year in the yearend newsletter.

(of course, trading Mike Morgan and Dave Hollins for Chuck
McElroy and Geronimo Pena, and spending a lot of money on
Eric Davis got me 8th place... but I still have Rod Beck!)


-- 
Dave DeMers			 	        demers@cs.ucsd.edu
Computer Science & Engineering	0114		demers%cs@ucsd.bitnet
UC San Diego					...!ucsd!cs!demers
La Jolla, CA 92093-0114	(619) 534-0688, or -8187, FAX: (619) 534-7029
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: arrow@netcom.com (Les Arrow)
Subject: Re: Gollenbock, Benson books out
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 07:03:22 GMT

In article <1jne3f$otj@agate.berkeley.edu> srubio@garnet.berkeley.edu (Steven Rubio) writes:

  <Benson Propaganda Deleted>
>
>Steven who actually tries not to do a damn thing until the Bill James
>Baseball Book comes out

Just as a quick note to those awaiting the Bill James Book. It came out real
late last year and I don't know about you, but I was very disappointed in
the format and liked the year before's much better.

Also, a store I used to happen by in LA, is owned by a man who meets with 
James every year. He told me Bill James is tired of doing the books, and
would love to stop if he didn't have to put his children through college.
Sounds like a joke to me, but maybe that explains all the guest writers in 
the last book. 

Finally, if you are interested in this store, it is called Sportbooks and is
in Los Angeles on Beverly Blvd. Last year I got a signed copy of The Baseball
Book and there are usually a dozen signed copies available as soon as the
book comes out.

Take care.

--Les
Date: Wednesday, 27 Jan 1993 21:07:25 EST
From: <RVESTERM@vma.cc.nd.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: help with ptp (ibm version)

hey.  does anybody know what the code is for players' stats in
the ibm version of ptp? i mean, what is the translation between
a bunch of hex numbers in the players' file and, for example, a
player's number of doubles against lefties?

i'd like this information because i'd like to rank the players for
a draft using some formulas of mine, and it would be much easier to
write a program to do the work for me - assuming that i know the
code - than to actually look at each guy's stats, plug and chug with
a calculator, write it down, and then sort it all afterwards by hand.

thanks for any help anyone can give.

bob vesterman.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: jmkerrig@vela.acs.oakland.edu (KERRIGAN JOHN M)
Subject: Re: Argh! APBA (comp) stuff for sale
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester MI.
Distribution: world,local
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 01:52:53 GMT

In article <21JAN199321400553@violet.ccit.arizona.edu> bdunkle@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (DUNKLE, BRIAN) writes:
>
>        Damn. This is the biggest mistake I've made in a while.
>        I got answers to some of my concerns, but...this just isn't what I
>want in a game. I wish we could combine the APBA play-by-play and such with
>PTP's interface and supprt progs.
>

You can!!!  It's called Strat-O-Matic version 4, and it will be available
in less than a month.  I am an ex-APBA player and I highly recommend you
look into it.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
**        John Kerrigan        a.k.a.  jmkerrig@vela.acs.oakland.edu        **
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: srubio@garnet.berkeley.edu (Steven Rubio)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Re: help with ptp (ibm version)
Date: 28 Jan 1993 08:34:46 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

Try this:

Open up a buffer to your harddisk using a print spooler, so that all
printer output goes to a file instead.  Then run the various Report
options for PTP, choosing Real instead of Computer stats and Printer
instead of Screen output.  You'll end up with a gigantic ASCII file that
can be imported into spreadsheets etc.

Or just pay Stats Inc to get the stuff from their online service.

Steven
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 17:08:37 EST
From: <JAW141@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: APBA Cards are IN

Attention all APBA baseball Fanatics,

          The cards arrived at 2:00 PM Friday, 25 Jan 93.
From: Timothy.J.Young@dartmouth.edu (Timothy J. Young)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Re: Bip trade update
Date: 28 Jan 93 22:16:38 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

In article <kbanaian.216.0@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu>
kbanaian@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu (King Banaian) writes:

>  Billy Pilgrim, St. Cloud GM, 
> notes that Bip's owner, the Pale Hose, may try to up the ante to Jose 
> Guzman.  The staff currently consists of Rijo, El Sid, Jose Guzman and 
> Tomlin, backed by Gross, Gubicza, Portugal, Bones and Mark Gardner.  Of the 
> others, Porch had a good season before he went down.  The Hose seem 
> uninterested.  Pilgrim seeks advice on whether an upgrade to Guzman is 
> warranted to capture Bip.  (Remember that we only count slug, steals, ratio 
> and errors in face-to-face play.)  Only Bret Boone is currently available at 
> the keystone sack for the Broadbrimmers.


-Tim Young, Dartmouth College, Class of '96
The opinions expressed here are not necessarily those of Dartmouth
College, its students, or anyone else.
"Not everyone can carry the weight of the world..."- R.E.M.
GM, Flyby Knights, Thurman Munson Franchise Baseball League
(Worcester,MA)
1992 Bob Feller Division Champion
From: srubio@garnet.berkeley.edu (Steven Rubio)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Re: Any news about these players?
Date: 25 Jan 1993 03:17:50 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu
Keywords: ward, montgomery, joyner, canseco, guzmanju, guillen, franco

Duane Ward has been in double-figures in saves for five years as a BACKUP
stopper.  In each of the past two seasons he has struck out more than a
batter an inning.  He is only 29 years old.  Over the past five years he
has allowed only a .223 BA and a .301 (!) SLG.  The only thing keeping him
from getting more saves in the past, Tom Henke, is now with Texas.  Ward
should get 30+ saves in 1993 with great ERA/Ratio.  He will be worth close
to $30.  If someone offers him to you for $5, take him quick before the
guy comes to his senses.

Steven

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: kbanaian@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu (King Banaian)
Subject: Re: Walker offered
Organization: Pitzer College
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 22:05:14 GMT

In article <43874@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> demers@cs.ucsd.edu (David DeMers) writes:
>So, I'm in a roto-type league, NL only, with categories
>BA, SLG, R+RBI and SB - CS for hitters; standard
>pitching categories except W replaced with W + (W - L).
>
>He has Larry Walker at $15 (L3).  He wants Geronimo Pena 
>at $5 (R4), Brian Barnes at $1 (R3), Dunston at $15 (R4) 
>and Morandini at $1 (R4).
>
>(L3 = long term, expires end of 1993; R4 = regular,
>option year is 1994, etc.)
>
It's interesting to me that you put up the contract lengths.  You have 
rights to Pena for two year;  you can only have Walker for the upcoming 
season.  How close are you to winning???

>I think Walker produced about a $45 season last year, 
>but is likely to fall back to about $35 worth or so.
>Still, pretty valuable to have around.  Barnes, 
>Dunston & Morandini are all worth their contracts
>but not much more.  Pena, on the other hand, could
>be Barry Larkin Jr - STATS projects him to hit .258,
>slug .385, get 125 R+RBI and steal 30 with 14 CS.
>That's about $17 worth by my calculations.  So,
>nod to Walker.  But Pena could be even better, and
>is young, and I could make him $10 and get 2 years
>from him...
>
>I'm hesitating, mostly  because I'm trying to
>get McGriff for a bunch of bodies (we have to
>freeze at least 10 players, and a couple of
>owners are going to be stuck freezing stiffs
>at $10 salaries).  But is this a reasonable
>deal anyway?
>
McGriff is a better stick, but I think I'd play for Walker, given the next 
line...

>Gant is my only big stick; I've also got Karros
>& Luis Gonzalez at great salaries and Daryl Boston
>at $3.  I'd like McGriff... but Walker ain't chopped
>liver...

See, Walker, Gant, Gonzalez and Boston make for a pretty decent outfield.  
If you go for McGriff, Karros is a CI and you are out of luck if a bargain 
1B comes along (I'd favor Conine as that guy, myself).

By Roti-Stats, you are gaining $14 by replacing Karros with McGriff, if 
they produce at last year's values.  You gain $22 by replacing a Boston with 
Walker.  And this isn't a bad deal.  Pena is notoriously a lazy fielder, and 
if he starts screwing around at 2nd again, he'll be out of there faster than 
you can say "Jose Oquendo".

Do this trade.  Maybe you can still package enough for McGriff, but there's 
plenty of first basemen to give you value from that CI.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: colin@ug.cs.dal.ca (Colin Edward Mac Donald)
Subject: Kreuger and Williams
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 14:52:32 GMT


Any one know where Bill Krueger(sp?) has ended up? I had him in a AL league
last year and left him on my roster after he was traded to Montreal...I know,
bad managing...Has he come back to the American League or is he still in
the NL.

Also, are both Bernie and Gerald Williams going to start in NY this year?

Thanks,
	Colin Mac Donald
	colin@ug.cs.dal.ca
	owner of Big Mac Attack, Halifax International Rotissiere League
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: wall@cc.swarthmore.edu (Matthew Wall)
Subject: Gollenbock, Benson books out
Followup-To: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Organization: Hi, I'm Matt, and I'm...a Boston Red Sox fan
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 22:01:08 GMT

"How to Win at Rotisserie Baseball" by Gollenbock, et al and
"Rotisserie Players from A to Z" by the immortal John Benson 
are both out in the stores this week.

A couple of quick impressions:

The Gollenbock book is better this year than last. They include a couple of
topical essays on expansion, and even better, Benson's list of 101 top
undervalued players. Some of the strategy sections have been revised, and a
little bit of the advice is "better", I guess. Still, it's annoying how
much chest-pounding they do about their own league, and the way the info is
laid out continues to be very annoying. I wish they'd get off their duffs
and bother to do some '93 projections instead of having *all* their stats
as '92 values (although Pete does make the point that the last year's value
is just as accurate as most '93 "predictions" for performance.)

Benson's new "lite" version of the bigger and later-appearing Rotisserie
Book is simply an alphabetical listing of about 1200 players and pitchers,
including most of the reasonable minor league prospects. This book is a
little hard to use because there's no index and no lists of any sort (which
is why you may want to sneak into your bookstore and crib the 101 top
undervalue list from the Gollenbock book, although of course if we all do
that, they'll no longer be undervalued, what?) but it has concise
evaluations of the players from rotisserie perspective and a to-the-point
listing of '92 stats and '93 projections with "high" and "low" projections
to supplement the dollar value. Benson himself urges you to use several
different sources and not rely just on him, but he's more often more
correct about the actual *values* in my experience than any of the other
major publications. I would also recommend this as a guide when considering
trades of guys you don't know too well during the season, since it's a
quick but alphabetic guide -- just try to keep up with minor leaguers in BA
or USATBBW to keep current. Quibble: transactions are about six weeks out
of date, which is only to be expected with a mid-January publication.

Note well, by the way, that The Sporting News Fantasy Baseball Owners'
manual uses Benson's values and very likely his reports for their player
guides, so for the casual rotisserian, at $6.95 you might as well just buy
that. Buying the complete Benson "lite" book gives you a little extra
player background and more players, but all in the margins.

The publication date for the Big Benson book is 2/25...


- Matt

---------------------------------------------------------
This space left intentionally blank until spring training.
From: rdunkle@aal.itd.umich.edu (R. M. Dunkle)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
Subject: Questions for Exp. APBA (comp.) players - please!
Date: 21 Jan 1993 14:08:50 GMT
Organization: Campus Computing Sites, University of Michigan
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: apollo46.aal.itd.umich.edu
Originator: rdunkle@apollo46


	I had this game in '84, when it was really the only choice, and
when they sent me the winter special offer, I bought it again - but I can't
make myself play it, because:

	1. There's no way to get any kind of comprehensive stats on how the
team and players did in real life. I got ten past seasons with this, and I
don't know the stats for all of the teams...I can look at players one by one,
but come on.
	2. In order to replay a season with any realism (pitching rotation 
especially), I have to re-load the teams 162 times for the team I'm playing, 
and another 90+ times for the other teams, even if I do the unrealistic for
the other teams and have them play 12-game series with the same starting 
pitchers. This has got to be a joke, right? 

	Is there a way around any of this? I can't believe the game would be 
this unuseable. I like the action/play-by-play, but I don't have the spare time
to waste with some of this crap.
	Maybe they'll give me my money back for the whole package, but I doubt
it.
	If not, anyone want to buy APBA 1.5, statmaster 2.2, Draft 2.0, and
Micromanager 1.0 with ten season disks? :(
	Please, please tell me I'm wrong about this.
-- 
* Brian A. Dunkle | rdunkle@aal.itd.umich.edu <- REPLY TO HERE!! Not "engin" *
* Also available at bdunkle@ccit.arizona.edu  <- Where I really am, but VAX  *
* Support systems analyst, Information Technologies Center, AzHSL    /\      *
* Detroit Red Wings fan, stranded in the desert, Tucson, Arizona     \/      *
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: kbanaian@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu (King Banaian)
Subject: Re: More trade ideas
Organization: Pitzer College
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 18:32:11 GMT

In article <9177@news.duke.edu> fierkelab@bchm.biochem.duke.edu writes:
>In article <kbanaian.211.0@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu>
>kbanaian@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu (King Banaian) writes:
>>>I probably have the second or third strongest winter roster.  
>>>The league is NL only; BA, SLG, R+RBI, SB-CS; ERA, WHIP, 2W-L, S.
>>>
>>>If I keep Rijo and Dunston, I'm down to $121 left, but have a 
>>>helluva starting rotation and all my middle infield.  
>>>
>>You can have that rotation anyways, since pitchers are plentiful.  So keep 
>>Dunston and pray very hard that he smartens up and goes to the OF.
>
>I don't understand this advice.  If I recall correctly, Dunston STUNK the last
>two seasons as a SS (with the bat, and before the injury.. let's see, one year
>with OK average, some power, one year with even less average, and always an
>AWFUL OBP, which will cut down on his runs  Will get stats later, post
>tomorrow), so why on earth would you want his bat in the OF?  Sell him, trade
>him, or cut him, but for God's sake, don't KEEP him! 

If you have to move him to your outfield if/when the Cubs do, I agree with 
Eric.  The scoring rules I've played with let me keep him a SS for the rest 
of the year.  And as a shortstop, using your categories, he does pretty damn 
well:
Year	BA	SA	R+RBI	SB-CS
1990	.262	.426	139	20
1991	.260	.407	109	15
1992	.315	.384	10	-1	the injury
avg. SS	.250	.336	114	 8	NL only, 1992, from McWeekly

Even in 1991 he's above average in three of four categories, for a 
shortstop.  Note that the McWeeky average is built on a 162 game season, 
a la Cal.  So you get plus speed and power out of Dunston.
True, if he's traded you lose power and some of those RBI.  And with 
Sanchez, the Cubs apparently think they could trade Dunston for the right 
offer.  But he'll start the season with the Cubs, IMO, because they'll get 
more for him after he proves he can play.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball.fantasy