From: jrd@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.novell
Subject: Re: Urgent: Novell, HP3000, NCSA-Telnet, Reflection. Anyone?clo
Date: 29 Jul 92 15:52:29 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1992Jul29.205158.19883@news.acns.nwu.edu>, fchen@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (FuGwo Chen) writes:
> Hi, everyone:
> Month ago I have been trying to post the question about Novell Network and
> the connection to HP 3000 and HP 9000. For some reason the title and
> signature went through, but without content. Took me month of trial and
> error, I finally figure out what is wrong for posting. Thanks to Luke
> Brennan from Australia to follow up on that and gave me some ideas. 
> Here are the question and hope some people can give me some more idea.
> 
> University Backbone
> --------------------------------------------
>     |
>   ----------
>   |repeater|
>   ----------
>     |              Kellogg Backbone
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>        |        |       |              |         |
>     HP3000   HP9000  NW 3.11 server    PCs   HP ET HUB
>                                             | | | | | |
>                                             P P P P P P
>                                             C C C C C C
>                                             (Diskless Computer Lab)
> 
> Hope this give you some general idea what our system look like. HP 3000 is
> running MPE/V with HP Network Service and Wollongong loaded. HP9000 is
> running HP UX. All the PC in the LAB are using HP EtherTwist 16 bit board.
> PCs on the Kellogg Backbone is either using 3C501 or using 16 bit board. I
> have try both and the result is the same.
> 
> What I would like to accomplished is to:
> 1) Let the PC in the LAB to be able to login to Novell System (easy part);
> 2) With the ability to telnet to HP9000 or UNIX machine on the University      
>    Backbone. I think I can use the packet driver and NCSA-Telnet to do so;   
>    (not difficult);
> 3) With the ability to connect to HP3000 with TCP/IP or anything that will   
>    run the terminal emulation program for HP system (Reflection from WRQ).     
>    CONFUSING! (still not difficult).
> But when I want everything join together. All hell broke lose. I don't know
> the clean solution. I got confused by IPX, IP; ODI, NDIS, Packet driver; which
> one I should used to get it work with what I want.
> 
> Option:
> NCSA:      I can use it for telnet to UNIX box with packet driver. WRQ said
>            as long as it is int-14 compatible. I think it is but no sure.
>            Therefor, I can not get it working with Reflection to talk to
>            HP3000.
>  
> HP:   Their answer is have Network Service on the HP3000 and PC. I got it
>       work to connect to HP3000 and using Reflection. But how can I telnet
>       to other UNIX box.
> 
> WRQ:  They provide another product call 3000 connection using NDIS driver.
>       I think it use the Wollongong TCP/IP. (Not 100% sure) I can get on the
>       HP3000 as a student and use the student menu. But from time to time
>       the refreshing of the screen is estrum low. Like 3 minutes per screen.
>       When I check the HP3000 all direct connection is working fine. Doesn't
>       indicate there is any problem on the network traffic unless I miss
>       anything? Using the same software to connect to the UNIX box all the
>       message got scrambled.
> 
> Question 1: Does anyone connecting to the HP3000 going through Novell. 
> Question 2: Does anyone have the similar system that we got?
> Question 3: If not, any suggestion?
> Question 4: If yes, how do you do it?
> 
> Response will be greatly appreciated. Just imaging I got 3 lab need to setup
> before the end of August pending on whether I can get the answer of this
> -- 
> Fu-Gwo Chen                     | The old believe everything;                |
> Northwestern University -KGSM   | the middle-age suspect everything;         |
> 708-491-2870                    | the young know everything.                 |
> fu-gwo@nwu.edu                  |     -- from fortune cookie                 |
--------------
	Maybe it would be useful to separate goals from means. Some goals in
your case are to use NW file/print services while also doing Telnet to other
hosts. This is a very common situation and has been solved several ways around
the world. The common method is to use a Packet Driver to operate the Ethernet
board and run IPX and the Telnet application on top of it, via the BYU patches
to IPX (typically in file NOVELL.EXE in the Packet Driver archives). Another
is to use ODI drivers and run either Novell's Lan WorkPlace/DOS or MS-DOS
Kermit v3.12 on top of the ODI driver directly. A third is to use ODI and
the shim ODIPKT to form a new Packet Driver interface on the top of ODI, and
then use IPXODI to ODI and Packet Driver apps to ODIPKT. I think you will
find that skipping NDIS is doing a favor to most clients. However, Novell
provides the ODINSUP shim on top of ODI to form an NDIS interface for apps
requiring that approach.
	If you are forced to run an HP-terminal emulation program then an
Int 14h interceptor (== slow and bulky) is an option. See, for example, FTP
Inc's TNGLASS interceptor or Novell's LWP/DOS Telapi Int 14h interceptor.
	Joe D.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.novell,sci.image.processing