From: lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor)
Subject: Re: Talk about bias... (was Re: game decided on last play)
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:16:51 GMT

Meeks 16th lie: article #16 post-stop

>In article <1992Aug12.220601.23011@cbnewsk.cb.att.com> lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor) writes:
>>>So, ... The Bulls with Jordan and Pippen (two all-stars, Olympians, etc..) 
>>>aren't up there?  
>Jordan has been around since 84, last I looked.  
You didn't just say Jordan, you said "Jordan and Pippen (two all-stars ....). 
Pippen wasn't an all-star until the 1989-90 season. So the Bulls weren't
up there until that season.

>Why?? Thomas has been an AllStar since 82.  Dumars has been there since
>the early 80s.  
The 1985-86 season wasn't early 80s. Dumars wasn't an all-star until 88-89.

>Same with the rest of their team (Laimbeer, etc..). 
So? how many superstars did they have before the Bad Boys era? Name them.
I couldn't.

>You mean it only counts if you win the championship???  
Well, there is such a thing as powerhouse, not neccessarily champion, 
favoritism too. 

>Well, Boston hasn't
>done that since 86'.  He didn't even play but 6 games in 88-89.  Only
>60 games in 90-91, and only 45 this year.  So, Bird must not have been
>much of a factor the last couple of years.  McHale has been out quite a
>bit as well.  Johnson hasn't played for 2 seasons now.  Looks like part
>of your time is not covered very well.  You claim superstar benefits...
>Johnson is gone, Parish is no longer a superstar, Bird only played half the
>season, McHale only 56 games.  Where did they have the "superstar" benefits
>you speak of???  
Over a time-span of 12 years. So what if this past season was a drop off? 
Several years after their last championship, McHale and Parish were still 
all-stars, that along with the sure-HOF status gave them the "superstar"
benefits.  And they were still a division winner in 1992. One third of the
teams haven't won a division since the Bird/Magic era.

>Hmm..  The Celtics have Parish, McHale, and Bird.  Parish is HOF due to
>longevity, but was never really "superstar" level, or perhaps just barely.
Yes, like 8 all-star appearances during that period. Can you say that of any 
of your "HOFers"?

>For the last couple of years, Bird and McHale have been hurt quite a bit,
>and not as dominating as before.  
Oh, so their superstar favoritism only dropped off for the last couple of 
years? Good, how about the first 10 years in the Bird/Magic era?

>Other teams???  
>San Antonio in the early 80's had George Gervin and Artis Gilmore 
Nope. Artis and Gilmore played together for only 3 seasons (83-85). 

>Philadelphia had Dr. J, Maurice Cheeks, Moses Malone, and Barkley.
Mo Cheeks is no HOFer and not even Parish's status. The four of them had 
been there for only two seasons (1985 and 1986), and their peaks never 
overlapped:  Barkley became a superstar in the late 80s, after Moses and 
Doc were gone.

>As well as World B. Free and Bob McAdoo at one point.  
They were no HOFers. Bob McAdoo wasn't even there for half a season (he
joined the team in late Feb. 86). 

>In the very early 80s, Houston had Calvin Murphy, 
Calvin Murphy is no HOFer. 

>Elvin Hayes, Moses Malone (And, if you
>go as far back as 79-80, they had Rick Barry).  
Oh, now you count Moses for both Houston and Philly? so both Houston
and Philly enjoyed superstar favoritism in the same time span in the 
early 80s because of ONE Moses.  What logic!

>The Lakers had Kareem,Magic, Worthy, Cooper, Scott, etc..  
At least you get this right.

>Denver had Alex English and Dan Issel.  
Dan Issel retired in 1985. That's less than 1/2 of the time span we talked
about. And Alex English is no Larry Bird. Dan Issel is no Parish.

>Chicago has Michael and Scottie.  
Wrongo. Chicago didn't have Michael in 1980-84, didn't have Pippen in 80-87.

>Detroit has Isiah and has had others like Dumars, Dantley, Laimbeer, etc..  
Wrongo, didn't have Dantley in 80-86 or Dumars in 80-85.  Laimbeer/Isiah 
aren't Bird/McHale/Parish either.

>Now, we have teams like Phoenix, with
>Barkley and KJ, with Majerle, Ainge, and Chambers.  
Oh, so a future season of potential favoritism == favoritism of the past
12 years?

>We have Golden State with Hardaway and Mullin.  
Nope, didn't have Mullin in 1980-85, didn't have Hardwary in 80-89. They
only had Joe Barely Cares, who made the McHale/Parish trade the steal of
the century.

>We have Utah with Stockton and Malone...
Nope, didn't have Malone in 80-85. Didn't have Stockton in 80-84, was only
a spot player in the first two seasons.

>Some of these players may/may not make it.  Many already have.  
But your timing all screwed up. You are trying to equate 3 seasons of 
Hardaway or 5 seasons of Issel to 12 seasons of Bird/McHale/Parish.

And BTW, I thought you were going to name at least 3-4 HOFers for EVERY TEAM 
during that time span. The best half-ass job (besides the Lakers) you can 
do for these 8-9 teams is the Spurs with 2 HOFers for 3 years together?

Better find a couple more teams with Kareem/Magic/Worthy/Nixon....

-- 
                                          Edward Lor
                                          lor@cbnewsk.att.com
                                          
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro,rec.sport.football.pro