HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mrc@Ikkoku-Kan.Panda.COM (Mark Crispin)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Inflation (of fears, not prices)
Date: 5 Nov 92 19:37:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: Ikkoku-K.MS-C.720992265.662824084.mrc
Organization: University of Washington
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: Tracy Monaghan <monaghan@cac.washington.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0

Tracy -

>I thought the general charge was that [Carter] was vary [sic]
>effectual in causing inflation.

No; the inflation was already there.  Carter wanted to stop it, as did Ford
(remember WIN buttons?), but Carter lacked the strength of will to do what was
necessary to bring inflation under control.

>And again I ask, why such dire warnings?

The reason is that there is a great pent-up demand within the political base
that forms the root of the Democratic Party platform for a number of
government programs which had been stalled for the past 12 years.  Many of
these programs are inflationary in nature.  I can not see Clinton cutting back
on entitlements.  Clinton's hoping to take money from defense spending as well
as `taxes on the rich' to increase entitlements -- not realizing that any
monies from such steps should be used to get rid of the national debt.

We really need to abolish the entire welfare state, but Clinton won't do it.
It'd be political suicide for him if he did.  Even Reagan lacked the courage
to attack the welfare state except in rhetoric -- entitlement spending
increased under Reagan.
From: larryd@stein.u.washington.edu (Larry Desoto)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: The Election
Date: 6 Nov 92 22:42:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov6.224212.25351
Organization: University of Washington

Mark Crispin <mrc@Ikkoku-Kan.Panda.COM> writes:

>     You don't have to be `rich' to survive the Clinton years, or to
>have assets out of the country.  I took the hint of the Reagan
>phase-out of the interest tax deduction and paid off of my consumer
>debt.  The only loan left is the mortgage, for about half the value of
>my house [thank you, PNW money-grubbers selling your homes at inflated
>prices, I love you all!!!].

>     Ever since, I've been squirreling money away, a little bit at a
>time, into investments and savings, with a chunk out of the country.
>It ain't big bucks, but it's a lot better than living from paycheck to
>paycheck and paying exhorbitant credit card interest.  It's
>interesting, if you don't use your credit lines you can end up
>affording to buy a lot more toys!!

[...]

>     Good investments: look for the Puget Sound economy to get worse
>with the cut in defense spending.  Land, especially around the bases,
>should start coming down.  There will be bargains to be had from very
>motivated sellers, for buyers who can afford to speculate and hold on
>to empty housing units.

>     Yes, there is money to be made during the Clinton years.  A LOT
>of money.  Too bad it'll be on the backs of those who live from
>paycheck to paycheck, who think that Clinton will be their savior.
>Remember what P.T. Barnum said `is born every minute.'  It isn't as if
>they weren't warned.

Yes, I can already see a way to make money during the Clinton era provided
he does what he said he would (always problematical) and congress goes
along.  I'd rather make less and not see the USA get the shaft but the
people have chosen the worst out of a bad set of choices.  I'll be damned 
if I am going to sit around and get shafted too if I can avoid it and
if it comes out of the backs of Clinton supporters, well, that's life.

--
Larry
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: bill@Celestial.COM (Bill Campbell)
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Organization: Celestial Software, Mercer Island, WA
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 16:30:48 GMT

In <1992Nov9.230940.16564@u.washington.edu> monaghan@cac.washington.edu (Tracy Monaghan ) writes:

:In article <1992Nov9.204554.19304@mdd.comm.mot.com> bradley@mdd.comm.mot.com (Michael Bradley) writes:
:>In article <1992Nov9.174738.26395@u.washington.edu> dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts) writes:
:>>rick@eaglet.rain.com (Rick Lindsley) writes:
:>>
:>
:>General gay propaganda deleted
:>
:>>If anyone doubts this, consider for a moment that religion IS a
:>>matter of personal choice.  What would you think of a proposed law
:>>declaring that Christianity is unnatural, immoral, peverse and
:>>wrong, and requiring the schools to teach it as such?
:>
:>That is what the public schools teach, if not explicitly then
:>implictly
:>

:That is what history teaches us :)

History teaches that organized religion and holy wars have been
responsible for most of the death and destruction in the world's
history.  Nothing scares me more than someone with religious fervor
trying to save my soul!

We are supposed to have separation of church and state in the
U.S., but that hasn't kept the anti-abortion types from trying to
foist their religious views on the rest of the population.

Bill
-- 
INTERNET:  bill@Celestial.COM   Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!bill   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!bill   Mercer Island, WA 98040; (206) 947-5591
SPEED COSTS MONEY -- HOW FAST DO YOU WANT TO GO?
From: tron@tc.fluke.COM (Peter Barbee)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Date: 10 Nov 92 16:54:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: tc.1992Nov10.165439.5189
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA

>>If anyone doubts this, consider for a moment that religion IS a
>>matter of personal choice.  What would you think of a proposed law
>>declaring that Christianity is unnatural, immoral, peverse and
>>wrong, and requiring the schools to teach it as such?
>
>That is what the public schools teach, if not explicitly then
>implictly
>

Bully for them.

Peter B
From: mrc@Ikkoku-Kan.Panda.COM (Mark Crispin)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: The Election
Date: 5 Nov 92 18:40:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: Ikkoku-K.MS-C.720988817.1103527590.mrc
Organization: University of Washington
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Mime-Version: 1.0


     You don't have to be `rich' to survive the Clinton years, or to
have assets out of the country.  I took the hint of the Reagan
phase-out of the interest tax deduction and paid off of my consumer
debt.  The only loan left is the mortgage, for about half the value of
my house [thank you, PNW money-grubbers selling your homes at inflated
prices, I love you all!!!].

     Ever since, I've been squirreling money away, a little bit at a
time, into investments and savings, with a chunk out of the country.
It ain't big bucks, but it's a lot better than living from paycheck to
paycheck and paying exhorbitant credit card interest.  It's
interesting, if you don't use your credit lines you can end up
affording to buy a lot more toys!!

     Note though that when your foreign holdings, etc. total to more
than $10,000 you have to start filing US Treasury reports.  If you
don't, you are in deep do-do with the IRS if they ever find out.
Below that, you're on the honor system to report interest and capital
gains.  Some people worry that the reports are an invitation for the
government to confiscate your foreign bank accounts...  [Ridiculous,
you say?  Don't forget that FDR confiscated all citizen-held gold in
1933.  In 1964 LBJ extended it to gold in foreign countries as well.
It remained *illegal* for Americans to possess gold until 1975!]

     Speaking of gold, I don't think gold is a good investment.  Yet.
I have a little bit, but that's been flat so long I'm not willing to
throw more money at it until I see some movement.  I get a gold bugs'
newsletter, and those guys are chortling for joy at a Clinton
presidency; a `best case' for gold or so they say.  They're predicting
$2000/ounce gold prices.  Considering they've been wrong for the past
12 years, I don't know if I believe them now...

     Good investments: look for the Puget Sound economy to get worse
with the cut in defense spending.  Land, especially around the bases,
should start coming down.  There will be bargains to be had from very
motivated sellers, for buyers who can afford to speculate and hold on
to empty housing units.

     Yes, there is money to be made during the Clinton years.  A LOT
of money.  Too bad it'll be on the backs of those who live from
paycheck to paycheck, who think that Clinton will be their savior.
Remember what P.T. Barnum said `is born every minute.'  It isn't as if
they weren't warned.
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: jrm@pgroup.com (John R Mudd)
Subject: Re: Inflation (of fears, not prices)
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 22:24:17 GMT
Distribution: pnw
Organization: The Portland Group

In article <1797@rwing.UUCP> pat@rwing.UUCP (Pat Myrto) writes:
>Seems that much of what I see posted that "Clinton wants" was much of
>what Bush wanted, but was thwarted at almost every turn by partisan
>power plays.  Much of what was yesterday considered Very Bad, is now
>suddenly to be regarded as Very Good.

Perhaps I am too cynical, but you're not really *that* surprised,
are you?

... John
From: slh@gibdo.engr.washington.edu
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: The Election
Date: 5 Nov 92 06:17:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: gibdo.1992Nov05.061406.16091
Distribution: pnw
Organization: who cares

In article <1992Nov4.231539.28294@nwnexus.WA.COM> edm@halcyon.com (Ed Morin) writes:
|alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler) writes:
|
|>Looks like the forces of evil have been voted out and the forces of
|>good have been voted in.    :)
|
|I certainly would _not_ say that!  I think I would phrase it like:
|
|Looks like the forces of evil have been voted out and replaced with
|"blow-dried" ones...
|

	``Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.''
From: gee7759@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Glenn Elliott)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: help finding WSU
Date: 10 Nov 92 19:15:05 GMT
Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]


Some friends here at work have been trying to get ahold of people at
Washington State University, but all email bounces.  The address we
have been using is userid@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu...

Does anyone know if this is indeed the correct address?  If so, have
you ever had any success sending email?  If not, does anyone know
what the correct address is?

Thanks for your help.  Reply by email and I'll post a summary.

Glenn
-- 
Glenn E. Elliott               | Anyone who believes that what I say or do
Computing Systems Analyst      | represents the policies or procedures of
Boeing Computer Services       | The Boeing Company has more lawyers than
gee7759@eeidf002.ca.boeing.com | they have common sense.
From: monaghan@cac.washington.edu (Tracy Monaghan )
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Date: 9 Nov 92 23:09:40 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov9.230940.16564
Organization: UW Computing

In article <1992Nov9.204554.19304@mdd.comm.mot.com> bradley@mdd.comm.mot.com (Michael Bradley) writes:
>In article <1992Nov9.174738.26395@u.washington.edu> dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts) writes:
>>rick@eaglet.rain.com (Rick Lindsley) writes:
>>
>
>General gay propaganda deleted
>
>>If anyone doubts this, consider for a moment that religion IS a
>>matter of personal choice.  What would you think of a proposed law
>>declaring that Christianity is unnatural, immoral, peverse and
>>wrong, and requiring the schools to teach it as such?
>
>That is what the public schools teach, if not explicitly then
>implictly
>

That is what history teaches us :)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: richa@grizzly.CNA.TEK.COM (Grizzly Amber)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Inflation (of fears, not prices)
Date: 11 Nov 92 18:06:48 GMT
Article-I.D.: master.3890
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Redmond,  OR.


>>  It's bad enough that they are in the money printing business.

Sorry, friend, but the government does not print money anymore.
Notice on all the green in your wallet, that you no longer have
Silver Certificates or Gold, nor do you even have US Notes. What
you are carrying around is Federal Reserve Notes. And the
Federal Reserve system is private, even if directed by government.

Your money is printed by private business,  not goverrnment.
Does this scare you? It should.  The more you learn about the
Federal Reserve, the more you will become fearful of our future.
From: prager@mdd.comm.mot.com (David Prager)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Date: 9 Nov 92 22:14:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: mdd.1992Nov9.221430.22217
Organization: Motorola, Mobile Data Division - Seattle, WA

In article <1992Nov9.204554.19304@mdd.comm.mot.com> bradley@mdd.comm.mot.com (Michael Bradley) writes:
>In article <1992Nov9.174738.26395@u.washington.edu> dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts) writes:
>
>>If anyone doubts this, consider for a moment that religion IS a
>>matter of personal choice.  What would you think of a proposed law
>>declaring that Christianity is unnatural, immoral, peverse and
>>wrong, and requiring the schools to teach it as such?
>
>That is what the public schools teach, if not explicitly then
>implictly
>

Not always. Think of the situation where a substantial portion of the 
class or school is not Christian. The administration and faculties in
schools where this is the case seem to go out of their way to be sensitive
to the shift in the cultural/religious/racial balance. In my own experience,
I went to public schools where a large percentage of the student population
was not Christian. The teachers knew and respected this fact, sometimes to
the extent of being silly.

Imagine an entire grade school, four classrooms each of  K-6, with no
Christmas decorations or pagent. It really seems funny now.

===============================================================
David Prager					(W)206-487-5837
Motorola					(H)206-485-4397
Mobile Data Division
19807 Northcreek Parkway		
Bothell, WA 98011			prager@mdd.comm.mot.com
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: newell@sequent.com (Donald Newell)
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 92 11:34:02 GMT

In article <1992Nov8.174212.6515@sequent.com> dickwin@sequent.com (Dick Winningstad) writes:
>I am not a Christian fundamentalist. But I voted for Measure 9.
>I had a lot of trouble with the third paragraph directing the state to
>set up a program discouraging homosexual behavior, but in the end, I
>voted for 9.
>[...]
>but the state and local governments are swinging
>toward a progay stance, in my view, now. The more odious provisions
>calling for direct action would have probably been thrown out by the
>courts.
>[...]
>The OCA may be misguided in their views, but at least they put their
>program before the voters instead of maneuvering behind the scenes
>which is what was going on up to now.


 The intent of Measure 9 was to discriminate, plain and simple.  The "progay"
 government stance I hear about most often was the executive order by
 Goldschmidt barring discrimination in state jobs. Alas, this was overturned
 by M8 a couple years ago. What terrible laws are being instituted at the
 local level that I haven't heard about?

 I'm not sure of the efficacy of putting the right to not be harassed up
 for a vote. At what granularity should this happen? Which of your 
 prerogatives are you wanting me to vote on?

 Don N.


 Proclaimer: Neither of our statements should be construed as being
             representative of Sequent or the people who work there.
From: charlesw@sail.LABS.TEK.COM (Charles Wilson)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Date: 11 Nov 92 18:44:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: sail.12874
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

In article <1992Nov10.163048.20093@Celestial.COM> bill@Celestial.COM (Bill Campbell) writes:
>
>We are supposed to have separation of church and state in the
>U.S., but that hasn't kept the anti-abortion types from trying to
>foist their religious views on the rest of the population.
>
>Bill
>-- 
It's not just anti-abortion that these religious types are foisting on
us:  Just because their Bible say "Thou shalt not kill" we have to make
it a law?  If I don't like my neighbor, why can't I blow his head off
if I want to?  And what about stealing, lying, cheating, etc.  If
I want to do these things, what right does the religious right have to
stop me?
From: dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Date: 10 Nov 92 00:32:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov10.003228.24006
Organization: University of Washington

bradley@mdd.comm.mot.com (Michael Bradley) writes:

>In article <1992Nov9.174738.26395@u.washington.edu> dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts) writes:
>>rick@eaglet.rain.com (Rick Lindsley) writes:
>>

>General gay propaganda deleted

Actually, I'm not gay, but from you I'll take this as a compliment.

>>If anyone doubts this, consider for a moment that religion IS a
>>matter of personal choice.  What would you think of a proposed law
>>declaring that Christianity is unnatural, immoral, peverse and
>>wrong, and requiring the schools to teach it as such?

>That is what the public schools teach, if not explicitly then
>implictly

Really?  And just where is this policy written?

Or is this just another example of "Anything less than the Republic of
Gilead is Anti-Christian?"

-- 
David Barts  N5JRN                      UW Civil Engineering, FX-10
davidb@ce.washington.edu                Seattle, WA  98195
	All truth passes through three stages.
	First it is ridiculed.
From: davidb@zeus.ce.washington.edu (David W. Barts)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Inflation (of fears, not prices)
Date: 11 Nov 92 04:48:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov11.044822.22107
Distribution: pnw
Organization: University of Washington

In article <1992Nov11.000055.11239@fylz.wa.com>, fyl@fylz.wa.com (Phil Hughes) writes:
> Andrew Klossner (andrew@frip.WV.TEK.COM) wrote:
> : The robber barons who *ran* those S&Ls didn't get a dime from the
> : bailout.  Even the ordinary folk who had stock in those S&Ls lost it
> : all.
> Not true.  The robber barons got money in the form of the loans they
> got to make, many to each other.  Then, as part of the bailout, the
> S&Ls were bailed out and then re-sold to the same robber barons so
> they can do it over again.  If we (our tax money) is going to bail out
> an S&L then we (our government) should run it instead of reselling it.

... not to mention all the bailout money that went to reimbursing
brokered deposits.

--
David Barts  N5JRN                      UW Civil Engineering, FX-10
davidb@ce.washington.edu                Seattle, WA  98195
From: monaghan@cac.washington.edu (Tracy Monaghan )
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Inflation (of fears, not prices)
Date: 9 Nov 92 20:22:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov9.202253.4846
Distribution: pnw
Organization: UW Computing

In article <2112@shaman.wv.tek.com> andrew@frip.wv.tek.com writes:
>[]
>
>	"Deficit is not the main problem.  Fixing a sluggish economy
>	... is (IMHO) the main concern."
>
>How would you do the latter without addressing the former?  If we
>accept the philosophy of spending our way to recovery, we find our
>hands tied by the deficit.  If we increase government borrowing,
>interest rates go up and the economy tanks.  If we print more money,
>inflation fires up and the fixed-income folks are out on the streets.
>That leaves increased taxation ... but haven't yet figured out how to
>tax our way out of a recession.

Agreed, agreed, agreed.  I agree 100% that the last 12 years have got up
into a horrific bind.  After hearing about the horrors of the "tax-and-spend"
democrats, we've come to learn about the horrors of the "borrow-and-spend"
republicans.

Perhaps with a line-item veto (which Clinton wants), some form of
capital-gains tax rate reduction (which Clinton wants) and an overhaul of
the welfare systems (which clinton wants), some "pork" can be cut, some
spending reduced, and some investmetns targeted to creating jobs and not
creating (paper) wealth.  Perhaps.


>
>	"Ask the thousands (possible millions) who lost most or all of
>	their savings in the S&L crisis what fun the eighties were."
>
>Everybody with $100,000 or less in the bank got a full refund from the
>government.  Do you suggest that thousands of people had most of their
>savings in the stock of failed banks?
>

No.  Many had their savings in S&L's not protected by the FSLIC, though.
(and speaking of banks, any guesses how many will be closed after Dec 19?)
Newsgroups: pnw.general,seattle.general,alt.society.anarchy
From: sgs@stein.u.washington.edu (Steven Smith)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wanted: Post election comments on Prop. 9
Date: 13 Nov 92 21:01:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov13.210122.15265
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <1992Nov13.174545.13614@nwnexus.WA.COM> edm@halcyon.com (Ed Morin) writes:
>
>What I mean by this, is that _I_ would probably not like homosexuality being
>taught in a public school, but I understand that in a public school that
>if a significant percentage (not necessarily a majority in my opinion) wish
>it to be presented, they have that right.  However, I think that _all_ sides
>of the arguments for _and_ against it should be presented in an unbiased way
>with some mechanism that ensures a teacher won't offer bias.  If I find that
>I, as a parent, still don't like what is being presented, then I can either
>try to persuade the school board and other families that it should not be
>part of the curiculum, put my kids in a private school with enough families
>that agree with me or home school them.

What does it mean for homosexuality to be "taught" in schools? Is the teacher 
going to "teach" the mechanics of homosexual sex? A core set of values and
beliefs that are supposed to reflect homosexuality? What?
I'm heterosexual, but I don't recall ever being taught heterosexuality in
schoool.  My wife is a teacher, and it's not in her curriculum, either.

It seems what a lot of people mean (not necessarily Ed, but his article brought
this to mind) when they say schools are teaching homosexuality is that they
are not telling children that homosexuality is wrong or evil.  What they
are actually *teaching* is tolerance of differences among people.

I think the use of the term "teaching homosexuality" is nonsense, and does
not further the debate in any way.

--Steve
-- 
 sgs@u.washington.edu             * "The boys with cars want motorcycles
 Steve Smith                      *  and the boys with motorcycles want
 University of Washington HR-20   *  cars!"
 Seattle, WA 98195                *    --D. Wiggin-"Philosophy of the World"
From: robert@slipknot.rain.com (Robert Reed)
Subject: Re: Inflation (of fears, not prices)
Reply-To: robert@slipknot.rain.com.UUCP (Robert Reed)
Organization: Home Animation Ltd.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 02:17:27 GMT

In article <1797@rwing.UUCP> pat@rwing.UUCP (Pat Myrto) writes:
|
|Just curious - why is a line-item veto (which Bush also wanted) now
|such a Good Thing, when last year it was such a Bad Thing?  Do the acceptable
|rules change depending on party affiliations?

Well, I don't know about anybody else, but I'm just as opposed to Clinton
having a line item veto as I was about Bush.  It simply concentrates too much
power into the Executive division of government.
________________________________________________________________________________
Robert Reed			Home Animation Ltd.		503-656-8414
robert@slipknot.rain.com	5686 First Court, West Linn, OR 97068

There's a pizza parlor near my place that only sells slices.  It's funny 
watching the guy throw up all those little triangles.
--Steve Wright
________________________________________________________________________________
From: zeke@fasttech.com (Bohdan Tashchuk)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Quote for the day
Date: 5 Nov 92 08:38:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: fasttech.1992Nov5.083816.27480
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Fast Technology

In <1992Nov5.000132.1912@u.washington.edu> monaghan@cac.washington.edu (Tracy Monaghan ) writes:

>"When we got into office, the thing that surprised me the most
>was that things were as bad as we'd been saying they were."
>                                  --  John F. Kennedy

This sounds like what Jack Kemp will be saying in January 1997.