HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Reg Foulkes
Subject: Re: ParcPlace Hiring Trainers/Consultants (Mt View, CA)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 14:10:13 GMT

In article <1330@pacsoft.com> mike@pacsoft.com (Mike Stefanik) writes:
 
Reg Foulkes writes:
: Next time you have a job to fill don't ask for someone with specific 
: programming skills (or engineering or whatever). Ask for someone with 
: general skills of good reading, writing and comprenhension with an interest 
: in the area required. Then test him/her to see if he seems to have the 
: right stuff (is he quick on his feet? does he read and fully understand?
: does he learn with minimal instruction?). 

Mike Stefanik writes:
>Of course companies specify they want someone with specific skills; but take
>note that this is a *wish list* for the employer.  In all cases, there is
>a compromise between what the employer wants, and who is available for the
>price the employer is willing to pay.
 
 Yes, but my point is more basic than what you have said. Orginally you stated 
that you wished to see people with more general skills enter the work place 
and that education should remove its myopic focus. I agreed, but I also implied
that to get people of this type, it would require employeers to seek out 
people who have a good general education with some specific skills. To seek 
those that maynot have a B.S. Comp, but have a good general background and 
track record.

 Check any local paper and read what skills employeers are asking for and 
insisting on. Employeers are insisting on specific skills C++, APL, 
smalltalk etc. Hence, if you do not have the specific skills, eventhough 
you may have years in other languages your resume will be passed over. 

--------------------------------
Reg Foulkes                             Bell-Northern Research
riskit@x400gate.bnr.ca           2745 Iris Street
Telephone :(613) 763-4131     Ottawa, Ontario., Canada  K1Y 4H7
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: gkrog@nynexst.com (Gina Krog)
Subject: Re: Harrassing calls after posting resume
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Distribution: misc
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 21:04:09 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.125902.14117@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> kitx@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
>I recently got an obscene phone call (at 5:30 Saturday morning, I might add) 
>from some jerk who got my name and phone number from my resume posted in 
>misc.jobs.resumes   Have other women experienced this problem?  I also got
>quite a bit of legitimate response to my resume, but it made me wonder about
>the wisdom in posting my home phone number where it was accessible to the 
>world.  I didn'have the option of using my work number, since my job was about
>
>to end.  Any suggestions?
>-- 
>Sari Lynn

A possible solution to this problem: get a voice mailbox that you use for all
business relationships and avoid giving your home telephone number to ANYONE besides
friends and colleagues that may need to get in touch with you directly. A voice mailbox 
is very inexpensive (I have a service that only costs me about $10 per month) and you
can get your messages from any touch-tone phone.. 

Although you may still get an obscene "message" from time to time, you won't have to 
deal with a prank phone call that interrupts your sleep, dinner, or favorite TV show. 
By the way, I answer my voice mailbox as if it were a phone machine in my home office 
(for example "I'm sorry I cannot take this call at the moment") so callers don't realize 
they can NEVER actually reach me directly with that number. I find it very practical to 
talk to prospective clients on MY terms -- I never have to worry about being caught off 
guard and can choose who I wish to respond to and when.

Hope this helps,

Gina Krog
From: peng@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Kaping Peng)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Need Advice About Salary Requirement
Date: 31 Jul 92 01:55:44 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania


I saw an ad in a newspaper and sent my resume to the agent a 
couple of weeks ago. 

I got a phone call from the agent. He told me that his client
wanted to interview with me by phone. He also asked
my salary requirement. The salary given in the ad is more than
$50,000. When I said it was OK within the range he told me that
the salary was for a Ph.D. (I have had an MS degree). I feel my 
background and experience for this position is as good as a Ph.D.

I would appreciate it if somebody could give me some suggestions
about:

	1. Do the employment agents always give a high salary
	   in the ads to attract more applicants?

	2. Do the agents earn somey money from the difference between
	   that their clients offere and that the applicants
	   require or they just paid by their clients?

	3. If I give a range much lower than that appeared in the ad,
	   can I sill argue with the company about the salary when 
	   talking about the salary?

Thanks.


Kaping
From: laws@ai.sri.com (Kenneth I. Laws)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: >>>>>>> glass ceiling
Date: 26 Jul 92 23:27:14 GMT
Organization: Computists International
In-reply-to: aaron@gamma.com's message of 20 Jul 92 04:49:07 GMT

> With an MBA maybe Ken could have led the company to 18 billion in
> sales yearly instead of the measly 14 billion?

DEC's board necessarily looks to the future rather than the past.
At least as far as the next quarter.  :-)

If Olsen had an MBA, maybe he would have groomed a successor
instead of ousting anyone who became sufficiently competent
to be a threat.  The board had to consider the future of the
company, and Olsen himself was a threat to that future.

Or at least that's how the Boston Globe reports it.

					-- Ken
--

Dr. Kenneth I. Laws, (415) 493-7390, laws@ai.sri.com.
Moderator of the Computists International AI/IS/CS mutual-aid association.
Ask about my weekly online career newsletter, The Computists' Communique.
From: "tom betz" <tom.betz@execnet.com>
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: home health care jobs
Date: 28 Jul 92 17:05:57 EST
Reply-To: "tom betz" <tom.betz@execnet.com>
Distribution: misc
Organization: Executive Networks Information

A friend of mine is seeking agencies and recruiters who specialize in the
field of home health care services.  She is seeking work in the financial
management of those services.

I would appreciate any information anyone may have on the subject.

Please email to this account or to tbetz@upaya.panix.com -- and thank you.

---
  OLX 2.2  My opinion does not necessarily reflect my opinion.
--
Executive Network Information System  (914) 667-4567
International ILink Host
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc,ne.forsale
From: khcheng@amherst.edu
Subject: moving sale
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst Mass.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 11:54:16 GMT


For Sale

GE  VHS HQ Hi-Fi STEREO VCR (GV-7685)   $180
	- VHS Hi-Fi Stereo Sound
	- Special Effects (EP Mode) : Slow Motion, Stop Action
	- Built-in TV Broadcast Stereo Tuner with S-A-P
	- Remote On-Screen Programming
	- 4 Program/1 Month Timer
	- Wireless Remote Control (also controls GE TV)
	- 155 Channel Cable Capability with Auto Channel Set-up
	- OTR (One-Touch Recording)
	- Perfect Condition (box & manual included)

Mac II computer $2200
(For Desktop publishing)
 Apple RGB 13 color monitor
 Quantum 105MB  new external hard disk
 Monitor stand
 5 MByte RAM
 System 7.0
 A lot of software and manual

HP DeskWriter Printer (MAC) $350 (one month old)
- 300 dpi (Laser Quality)
- 4 pages per minute
- Everything that came with it
- one print cartridge
- Cable included (didnt come with it)

CAR: Mazda GLC 1980  standard $700
	-new brakes, battery
	-just passed June 92 state inspection 
	-runs well

Technics GX700 Stereo Receiver $320
	-Dolby Surround, 220 Watts
	-Programmable remote control
	-1 year old, perfect condition

Technics Double Tape deck (RS-TR 165) $120 
	-auto reverse in one
	-remote capability with Technics receiver
Organization: The American University - University Computing Center
Date: Friday, 24 Jul 1992 23:36:08 EDT
From: <GHADSAL@auvm.american.edu>
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Salary for programmer
Distribution: misc.job.misc



...... through it my way when you find out please.  Mail bounced back
at me, so sorry for the genral waste of bandwidth.
---
---
Guy Hadsall
Dept. of Health and Fitness        . o        c ,
The American Univeristy             "#v--  --v#"
Washington, DC                      /'>      <`\

ghadsal@auvm.american.edu
---
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: Eli.Mantel@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Eli Mantel)
Subject: technical job fair, 7/27-7/28, Tysons Corner, VA
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 22:03:36 GMT

This is from the 7/19/92 Washington Post:

Technical Career Fair, 7/27-7/28, 3-8 p.m.
Embassy Suites Hotel, Tysons Corner, VA

Presented by WRC AM 980, DPMA, IEEE
Managed by Lendman Group, 804-473-2450

This fair is oriented to Computer, DP/MIS, and Engineering professionals. Check
the 7/26 issue of the Washington Post for a list of participating companies.
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: kbanerje@grad03.math.ncsu.edu (Kaushik Banerjee)
Subject: Abt Associates, Inc.
Organization: North Carolina State University
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 22:40:04 GMT


Does anyone have information regarding Abt Associates, Inc. located
in Bethesda, Maryland? Please e-mail me if you do.
Thanx

K. Banerjee (kbanerje@math.ncsu.edu)


-- 
                     (  (    "Any one can stop smoking; it takes a 
  ______________________ ) )  real man to deal with lung cancer!"      
 (_______(______________%%%
 
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: oneil@odin.unomaha.edu (Sharon O'Neil)
Subject: Re: What men and women wear (Re: Need suit and tie for a job interview ??)
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 04:19:24 GMT

rudoff@mdd.comm.mot.com (Doug Rudoff) writes:

>In article <1992Jul13.162857.20410@ncar.ucar.edu> ilana@kiowa.scd.ucar.edu (Ilana Stern) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul13.133233.10791@b11.b11.ingr.com>, cottle@b11.b11.ingr.com (Tim Cottle) writes:
>>  
>>> One question:  why is it that the female interviewees are invariably properly
>>> dressed?  I can't think of one instance where one was not properly turned-out.
>>
>>Women have a lot more latitude, as well as choices, in clothing.  There is
>>not a whole lot of variation among men's business clothes -- dark suit,
>>light shirt, tie.  About the only differences are the cut of the suit and
>>the pattern on the tie.
>>
>>A woman can wear a dress, a blouse and skirt, a pants suit, a skirt suit,
>>a dress with suit jacket, etc. in most business situations which require
>>dressing "for success."  Although the stuffiest companies would probably
>>look down on a woman dressed in anything other than the exact complement
>>to male business attire -- dark skirt suit -- some of these combinations
>>span a wide range of formality and are appropriate in both formal and
>>informal settings.

>True, but a man can get away with having only a few suits (a friend
>who worked at EDS only had three). But a woman is socially required to
>have many more outfits than a man.

>Men have less lattitude in what they can wear, but it's less expensive
>for them and they don't have to think too hard about which suit to
>wear.

True.  I suspect that a man with a few good suits and a LOT of good shirts
and ties would be able to get by cheaper than a woman who is almost compelled
to have a different outfit for each day of the week over about a two week
period.

Also, we have *STUPIDER* clothing to wear.  Have you priced a pair of panty
hose lately!?!?!  These stupid things about never last and while there are
"superhose" advertised, they're not usually in a wide assortment of colors,
a wide assortment of sizes, or widely distributed.

Don't forget the fact that a woman will have to wear matching shoes with
each outfit she is compelled to have to present a "successful image."  And
of course, matching accessories (ie. earrings).

Plus a skirt requires a slip and a sheer blouse requires a camisole.

And women's clothing tends to be made of poorer quality to begin with.

>This has become a gender related issue, so I'm cross-posting to
>soc.men and soc.women.
>-- 
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>Doug Rudoff          Motorola, Seattle    INTERNET:rudoff@mdd.comm.mot.com
>                                            USENET:uunet!mdisea!rudoff   
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Sharon O'Neil
oneil@odin.unomaha.edu
From: rem@public.BTR.COM (Robert E. Maas  rem@btr.com)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Proofreading or First reader jobs...
Date: 28 Jul 92 02:34:23 GMT
Organization: BTR Public Access UNIX, MtnView CA. Contact: Customer Service cs@BTR.COM

(The original article probably would have been more proper on misc.jobs.resumes,
but since I'm turning this into a general discussion rather than a formal
request for a job I guess I'll continue the thread here rather than just
posting my own proofreader-resume on misc.jobs.resumes.)

I too would like to earn some money proofreading or something like that,
finding errors in English-language writings, reviewing/criticizing writing
content and style, etc. But I have no formal training or experience in
that area. Is it possible to earn money in this way, or is this just a
pipedream with no moneymaking potential?
From: kingchu@ttidca.TTI.COM (King-Hang Chu)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Head Hunters list in Seattle
Date: 27 Jul 92 17:48:00 GMT
Reply-To: kingchu@ttidca.tti.com. (King-Hang Chu)
Organization: Citicorp/TTI, Santa Monica

Hi,

  I am posting this for a friend in LA who has no access to this newsgroup. 
  Please send replies to kingchu@ttidca.tti.com and I will direct it to my
  friend.


  Can someone send me some contacts of head hunters/recruiters in Seattle. 
  Many Thanks.
From: allyn@netcom.com (Mark Allyn)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Security Clearance
Date: 21 Jul 92 06:30:04 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

You talk about serious debt. How serious do you think they will get
itchy with? In my own case, I have about 2,500 in credit card debt with
an income of 40,000. Is this something they will get antsy about??
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: thsskac@iitmax.iit.edu (Kevin A. Chin)
Subject: Bonus Criterion and %
Organization: Illinois Institute of Technology
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 17:22:44 GMT

A large automotive company gave out several million in bonuses
to it's management while at the same time laid-off a bunch of 
blue collar workers. The company was losing money for the year.

Just a couple of questions:

1) When can an employee *expect* a bonus?

2) What is an "average" bonus, as a % of pay?

3) Lawyers,sales,marketing types often get bonuses, 
	do computer people (not included in above)
	get bonuses?

thanks.
Kevin
From: jamesc@genghis.borland.com (James Chuang )
Subject: Re: More on glass ceilings
Originator: jamesc@genghis.borland.com
Organization: Borland International
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 06:58:42 GMT

>From: akerson@deimos.srg.af.mil (Pete Akerson - akerson%srg@uunet.uucp)
>Subject: More on glass ceilings
>Organization: ARINC Research, Corp.
>Date: Thu, 23 Jul 92 17:05:26 GMT
>
>Sounds like what we're all talking about here is a class distinction
>between management and workers. (no, I'm no flaming Red !)
>The managers at (sounds like many) engineering firms see themselves
>as of a different social caste than the workers, much in the same
>way the managers of a coal mine do. 
>So I assert that engineers, programmers, etc. are just expensive
>coal miners; very little has changed in workplace dynamics since 1900.
>--
>Reply-to: akerson%srg@uunet.uu.net
>Or sometimes: akerson@srg.UUCP  or akerson@srg.uunet.uu.net
>Disclaimer: X was invented by the Japaneese in order to sell more memory chips.
>- Pete 		akerson@srg.srg.af.mil is the wrong address.
>

So Carpel Tunnel Syndrome has replaced the Black Lung Disease.....

jamesc
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard)
Subject: Re: Where do old programmers go?
Organization: The Turing Project, Charlottesville Virginia.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 22:52:38 GMT

In article <64172@hydra.gatech.EDU> ccoprbm@prism.gatech.EDU (bruce mccullough) writes:
>In article <1992Jul23.152523.19558@sei.cmu.edu> rmg@sei.cmu.edu (Richard Green) writes:
>>We advance to positions of authority where we can ruin the careers of
>>arrogant young snots who won't wear suits to job interviews! ;-)
>
>Yesss - Very good!!
>HA- HA!!
>
>MY .02 gOTTA BE A FREAKIN NUT NOT TO WEAR A SUIT TO AN INTERVIEW.
>DAMN SURE WOULD EXSPECT MORE FROM PEOPLE IN OUR LINE OF WORK OR JUST ABOUT
>ANY JOB RELATED TO PEOPLE WHO POST TO THE NET. sOMEONE FLAMED ABOUT US
>NOT LETTING POOR PEOPLE HAVE THE CHANCE-(not) IT'S UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL
>TO MAKE IT IN LIFE(ALTHOUGH HELPING THE WEAK SHOULD SOMETHING WE ALL DO).
>tHIS IS AMERICA YA KNOW YOU CAN DO JUST ABOUT ANYTHING YOU WANT.

Oh no BIFF wears suits to interviews :-)
-- 
>>Unix/C Contract worker available 5 years C/unix work experience<<  ______
Available for Telecommuting/Travel and contracts on the T Line       \    /
in the Boston MA area. Send me e-mail for a copy of my Resume.        \  /
       -- VWIS 508-793-9568 (2400 baud), Linux support BBS.--          \/
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: dhesi@rahul.net (Rahul Dhesi)
Subject: Re: Need suit and tie for a job interview ??
Organization: a2i network
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 17:35:55 GMT

In <1463@outland.UUCP> richard@adpgate.UUCP ( ADP OPuS) writes:

>  My hope is to someday work in a place where many different individual 
>  people work.  Some may be sikhs with turbans, some may be expressing 
>  their African heritage, women will have short and long hair as will 
>  men.  And the best part of my dream is that leaders and managers will 
>  not be chained to sartorial stereotypes; the black woman in the 
>  multi-colored garb may just as possibly be the company president as 
>  the man with the waist length hair just as possibly as the man 
>  with the sport coat and tie.

Very nicely worded.  However, would your tolerance extend to somebody
who wants to work in the nude?  Somebody who wears a Nazi uniform?
Somebody who wears a KKK outfit?  I'm sure I could find some sort of
work outfit (or lack of it) which you might not tolerate.  And you
might have reasons which seem good to you but not to others.

The point being that the difference is quantitative, not qualitative.
As another example, in the US I often find people sneering at the
Middle Eastern customs that discourage or disallow certain parts of the
human body (e.g. female faces) from being visible in public.  The same
people are very comfortable with the US custom that won't allow certain
other parts of the female and male bodies to be visible in public.
--
Rahul Dhesi <dhesi@rahul.net>
also:  dhesi@cirrus.com
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc,misc.jobs.offered
From: wevans@ecst.csuchico.edu (Bill Evans)
Subject: Programmers Wanted With C++, X Windows And Networking Experience
Organization: California State University, Chico
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 22:49:41 GMT

Location: Sacramento Valley

    OPTX has openings for 3 solid programmers with the above expertise.  
    
    The positions will be temporary additions to our staff and may result 
    in an offer of permanent employment upon completion.  So far it looks 
    like we have at least 3 months worth of work for these people.  
    Contact information is provided below.  Faxed resume desired.
    *** A minimum of 2 years industry experience is required.


                                ABOUT OPTX...

    OPTX Professional Services maintains a staff of software engineers 
    skilled in the areas of:

    - C And UNIX Development, Porting And Training 
    - UNIX System Administration  
    - Object-Oriented Development, Technology Transfer And Training
    - Database Technology (UNIFY/ACCELL, Informix, Ingres, Sybase)
    - X Windows Application Development
    - Compiler Design And Implementation
 
    Specialized Services Include:
    - Software Development Process Consulting
    - Project Management Consulting
    - Expert Knowledge Of UNIFY/ACCELL Internals
    - Design And Implementation Of Object-Oriented Language Compilers
    - Design And Implementation Of Object-Oriented Language Runtime Systems
    - Utilization Of Our Full-Time Project Development Teams And Facilities
 
 
   OPTX consultants are available for projects at any location world-wide
 

                Contact:  Bill Evans, Manager 
                  Voice:  (916) 899-2110
                   Fax :  (916) 899-2102    

                       
   We will always consider senior professionals for addition to our staff


                OPTX Professional Services is a division of:     
                
                          OPTX International
                          PO Box 6661 
                          225 Main St.
                          Chico, CA, USA
                          95927-6661


                OPTX Is An Equal Opportunity Employer
-- 
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: iesltd@telesys.tnet.com (ExecuSearch)
Subject: Re: Slimeball Recruiters??
Organization: [Guest Account] TeleSys Development Systems, Mesa AZ
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 23:24:34 GMT

In response to your posting of July 22, 1992 -- International ExecuSearch 
offers a very sincere apology to Mr. Guthrie.  Yes, our recruiter did 
screw-up -- to put it bluntly.  Our only defense is he is very new to our 
organization and in his exuberance to succeed, overlooked the obvious 
implications of his actions.  Please look back to your first days on the 
job and feel some empathy and forgiveness for a very embarrassed 
recruiter.

Brenda Fent,
General Manager

-- 
International ExecuSearch, LTD.
6560 N Scottsdale Rd. STE J-100
Scottsdale, AZ 85253                         iesltd@telesys.tnet.com
(602) 991-5000                        ...!ncar!enuucp!telesys!iesltd
From: rc05@gte.com (Ramesh Chandak)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: TEN INVALUABLE RULES FOR THE SUCCESSFUL CONTRACTOR
Date: 27 Jul 92 01:55:45 GMT
Organization: GTE Laboratories Incorporated, Waltham MA

Yello, what's happening? 

I came across the following ten rules for the contractor. They are distributed
by a headhunter in MA to all contractors who work thru them.  I'm posting this
to the net to know what fellow net-contractors think about these rules.

Ten Invaluable Rules for the Successful Contractor
--------------------------------------------------

1. Don't Insist on being right

2. Never Complain

3. Don't give advice

4. Follow Instructions

5. Don't Abuse the Clock

6. Regard Every Job As Important

7. Don't Conduct Personal Business on company time

8. Don't Stand out for the wrong reasons

9. Don't expect praise

10. Look the part
    A contractor is a farily expensive purchased commodity, so do your
    best to dress in an appropriate professional manner at all times.

Any thoughts from fellow netters on these 10 so-called rules for the
contractor ?

- Ramesh
From: cliburn@doc.bmd.trw.com
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Where do old programmers go?
Date: 23 Jul 92 11:14:01 MST
Distribution: usa

In article <64172@hydra.gatech.EDU>, ccoprbm@prism.gatech.EDU 
   (bruce mccullough) writes:
> 
> MY .02 gOTTA BE A FREAKIN NUT NOT TO WEAR A SUIT TO AN INTERVIEW.
> DAMN SURE WOULD EXSPECT MORE FROM PEOPLE IN OUR LINE OF WORK OR JUST ABOUT
> ANY JOB RELATED TO PEOPLE WHO POST TO THE NET. sOMEONE FLAMED ABOUT US
> NOT LETTING POOR PEOPLE HAVE THE CHANCE-(not) IT'S UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL
> TO MAKE IT IN LIFE(ALTHOUGH HELPING THE WEAK SHOULD SOMETHING WE ALL DO).
> tHIS IS AMERICA YA KNOW YOU CAN DO JUST ABOUT ANYTHING YOU WANT.

What?  Did you intend to say something?  Meaningful?