From: rlewis@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca (Robert Lewis)
Subject: Re: Bicycle Paths
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 17:21:37 GMT

schinder@leprss.gsfc.nasa.gov (Paul J. Schinder) writes:

[deleted section]

>First, bicyclists in Copenhagen were definitely second class citizens
>in spite of the presence of bike lanes on the major roads.  In order
>to turn left, they had to wait for at least one light (even if the
>original was green, the way to turn left seemed to be to ride to the
>opposite corner and wait for the light to change on the cross road.)
>I didn't see anyone make a vehicular left turn there.  In France about
>all I saw in Paris were the separate signals for cyclists at some
>intersections; they seem to work well enough.  In England, Cambridge
>had inferior and dangerous "bike paths" just like the US, as well as a
>road or two with no motor vehicles allowed.  

I did ride in England, including Cambridge and Oxford (similar cycling 
environment to Cambridge), and your comments on Cambridge are correct.
It was interesting to note that, by my estimation, a large number of
cyclists (50% ?) simply did not use the bike paths (this was even more
the case in Oxford where the bike paths were even worse).  One thing
that also needs to be noted about Europe is that pedestrians have far
more limited rights than in North America.  While pedestrians have the
right of way at zebra crossings (of which there are relatively few) they
must yield to vehicles everywhere else.  While around here one can
reasonably expect vehicles to yield to pedestrians at yield signs or 
stop signs (which are very rare in England), vehicles will never do so
for pedestrians.  This is not a reflection of a hostile attitude by
vehicles operators but simply a reflection of the law and habit, they do
not expect pedestrians to attempt to cross in front of them.  As an
aside, for those thinking of cycle touring in the United Kingdom, the
real difficulty you will face is not is adjusting to riding on the left
(that is relatively quickly adjusted to) rather it is your position as a
pedestrian both in looking the wrong way when it comes to crossing a
street and in realizing that, for example, even though you are walking
along a major street and are crossing a minor one intersecting it and
which is marked with a yield sign (actually a painted line one road
rather than a sign) cars will not stop for you.  At every intersection
you must stop and make sure that there is no traffic in all four
directions regardless of the nature of the intersecting roads (i.e.,
just like riding on a bike path or a service road).  Another aside, much
of the centre of Cambridge has recently been close to all vehicles
including bicycles.

>                                                     As for motorist
>attitudes, since I wasn't riding I couldn't really tell.  

I found that the attitude of motorists was better in England was better
than here (and from what I hear on the Net, much better than in the U.
S. of A.).  I never found that we were yelled or honked at (though that
doesn't happen much to me here either) and, more tellingly, motorists
didn't blow a gasket if they had to slow a bit for us or wait a few a
short while in order to pass us.  While some cyclists I talked to
complained about motorists and, in particular, motorists passing too
closely I only noticed this happening with cyclists who rode too far to
the left (i.e., too close to the curb).  

It seemed to me that the primary reason for the above was not so much a
'better attitude' by motorists as it was that British motorists were
simply better (i.e., more competent, better trained, and more
knowledgable) than North American motorists.  It seemed to me as well
that of equal importance was that cyclists were much better 'drivers'
than are cyclists in North America (though the worst cyclists I found
were in Oxford and Cambridge).  Far more cyclists signal turns there, it
is rare to find cyclists on the sidewalks, most cyclists use lights when
they ride at night (I would estimate that less than 10% do so here),
etc.

>                                                          And didn't
>someone post here within the last few months that in some European
>country (fuzzy memory has it as either Germany or the Netherlands)
>cyclists must legally yield to cars in all circumstances, so they were
>legally second class?

I.e., they have been relegated to the position of pedestrians, which in
Europe is second class, albeit they do try to guild the cage of second
class status from time to time.

[deleted section]

>--------
>Paul J. Schinder
>NASA Goddard Space Flight Center
>schinder@leprss.gsfc.nasa.gov


Robert M. Lewis
Department of Sociology
University of Alberta
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles