HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lady@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Lee Lady)
Subject: Re: Starting an alternative medicine newsgroup
Followup-To: sci.med
Summary: Not me.  
Keywords:  Alternative medicine newsgroup
Organization: University of Hawaii (Mathematics Dept)
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 10:19:22 GMT

In article <16666@pitt.UUCP> geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks) writes:
>OK, John suggests we start an alternative medicine newsgroup.
>      ...  
>them.  I really wish that one of the proponents of alternative
>medicine would start the group rather than us doing it, since
>the person ramrodding it should be interested in participating
>in the group if it is formed, and I am not interested in
>participating.  Kingsley, you out there?  David, Bob?  Anyone?
>Even Lee?

I think that alt.psychoactives and the new  sci.med.nutrition  function
pretty well to give me what I'm interested in.  I've learned quite a bit
from them, especially from Steve Dyer's postings.  This is the sort of
thing I want to see -- where people post information on alternative
approaches and those who have conventional expertise offer criticism on
a factual basis.

The only alternative medical approaches I am actually a proponent of are
zinc lozenges and tryptophan.  And tryptophan was not actually all that
useful to me personally -- maybe because I was not willing to take a dose
larger than one gram without supervision.  

And then there's NLP, of course, but you can take a look at
sci.psychology for that.  Actually, recently the NLP postings have been
threatening to take over sci.psychology and we may need an alt.nlp group
after all.  

--
It is a poor sort of skepticism which merely delights in challenging
those claims which conflict with one's own belief system.  
                                                          --Bogus quote 
lady@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu         lady@uhunix.bitnet
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: cease@carina.unm.edu (Cecilia De Blasi)
Subject: Re: women in science
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 92 02:26:10 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <1992Sep30.025437.24415@news.columbia.edu> stone@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Glenn Stone) writes:
>In article <fy+p1jd@lynx.unm.edu> cease@carina.unm.edu (Cecilia De Blasi) writes:
>>In article <1992Sep21.212836.261@news.wesleyan.edu> RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Ruth Ginzberg) writes:
>>> This is in part to
>>>address the widespread apathy toward, or distaste for, science among bright
>>>women college students. 
>>
>>
>>The situation at Wesleyan University must be vastly different than that
>>at the University of New Mexico.
>
>How do you know?  Do you have any numbers, or is it just a matter of
>impressions?
>

Just a matter of impressions...  Certainly, it is true (as your numbers 
indicate) that there are usually more women than men in science classes.
However, I do not believe there is a 'widespread apathy or distaste for
science' among women; my medical school class is about 57% women.  Women 
were always well represented in my physics, astronomy and math classes at
UNM, and most of us held our own in those courses.  Ruth Ginzberg's claim
is just too extreme for me to swallow...  unless the situation is different
where she is; thus my comment.

- Cecilia De Blasi

-- 
| courtesy of Cease of the Not Well Defined at This Time |
|        cease@unmb.bitnet    cease@carina.unm.edu       |
|    We're only immortal for a limited time.  - Rush     |
**********************************************************
Xref: sparky sci.med:18000 sci.med.physics:402 sci.bio:3382 sci.bio.technology:256 sci.physics:15474
From: markr@sound.cts.com (Mark B. Reinhold)
Newsgroups: sci.med,sci.med.physics,sci.bio,sci.bio.technology,sci.physics
Subject: Bone-muscle lever types
Summary: find more bone muscle lever groups
Keywords: bone muscle levers
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 92 20:07:04 PDT
Organization: SDCT 1-619-461-3415

Hello All;

I have been given a challange by my anatomy professor, and am
looking for help.

She has challanged us to find any more type 1 or type 2 lever
types in the body than the ones that she has given us.

For type one, there is only one, which is the alanto-occipital
jt. - raising the head off the chest.

For type two, she gave us two examples, standing on your toes,
and the JM join movement.

Does anyone know of any other joints in the body that would fit
in either of the above catagories?

Posting or mail would be great. I check these newsgroups
everyday, and sound is very well connected for email

Thanks for you time and effort

Newsgroups: sci.med
From: jmd9888@zeus.tamu.edu (DURHAM, JAMES MICHAEL)
Subject: Blood analysis questions
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 15:06:00 GMT

Howdy,
     I am doing some research on blood analysis.  I have found almost all the
information I need in our medical library, however I cannot seem to find any 
information on the Federal requirment (practices and proceedures) on testing
Blood and plasma.  Does anyone know of or know where I can find such government 
type requirements?  Also who would be the governing agency if a company was
doing testing blood for people like the Red Cross or local plasma centers?

Many thanks in advance,
   Michael




********************************************************************************
*They came for the 4th amendment, I said nothing for I wasn't a drug dealer.   *
*Then they came for the 2nd amendment, but I said nothing, I wasn't a gun owner*
*Then they came for the 6th amendment, but I kept quiet, I knew I wasn't guilty*
*Finally they came for the 1st amendment, and it was too late to say anything. *
********************************************************************************
From: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: help, please.  need info on candidiasis
Date: 28 Sep 92 15:42:13 GMT
Reply-To: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Distribution: sci.med
Organization: Univ. of Pittsburgh Computer Science

In article <BONNIE.92Sep22221738@aigyptos.nmsu.edu> bonnie@nmsu.edu (Bonnie Hargrave) writes:
>
>
>I have just finished reading "The Missing Diagnosis" by C. Orian Truss
>M.D. (1983) which discusses in laypersons' language the symptoms and
>treatment of chronic Candidiasis.  Now I would like to find more
>up-to-date info.
>
There is no scientific evidence that Candida is a problem for healthy
people.  These books are considered fringe extremist.  Candida is
a normal flora in the gut.  We aren't sure of the consequences of
taking chronic fungicides, but they might not be so good.  

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gordon Banks  N3JXP      | "I have given you an argument; I am not obliged
geb@cadre.dsl.pitt.edu   |  to supply you with an understanding." -S.Johnson
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky sci.med:18252 misc.fitness:7661 misc.consumers:17326
From: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Newsgroups: sci.med,misc.fitness,misc.consumers
Subject: Re: Vitamins and the FDA (Pt. 1 of 3): Viewpoint
Date: 1 Oct 92 15:24:48 GMT
Reply-To: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Followup-To: sci.med
Organization: Univ. of Pittsburgh Computer Science

In article <BvCoMH.BHD@ddsw1.mcs.com> starkid@ddsw1.MCS.COM (Lance Sanders) writes:

>   Cursory examination of mainstream data overwhelmingly demonstrates that 
>high-quality vitamin supplements, at low and safe levels (but necessarily 
>higher than those proposed by the FDA), exhibit profound capacity for 
>general prophylaxis and therapy, as do various amino acid concentrates (L-
>Tyrosine in particular). 

What does "high-quality" mean and how did these mainstream studies
control for quality?  I'm not aware of any such mainstream data.


>   I find it grotesque that the FDA chooses to render vitamin supplements 
>impotent while simultaneously approving food technologies such as 
>irradiation, which not only introduces trace carcinogens into the food 
>supply (radiolytes such as benzene, etc.), but also reduces the vitamin 
>content in foods, often by as much as 50% (and cooking would reduce 
>nutrient levels even further). 
>

I am aware of no evidence that radiation introduces any trace 
carcinogens or benzene or that it reduces the vitamin content of food.

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gordon Banks  N3JXP      | "I have given you an argument; I am not obliged
geb@cadre.dsl.pitt.edu   |  to supply you with an understanding." -S.Johnson
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jsl+@pitt.edu (John S Lundberg)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Prevalence of Hyperobesity
Date: 28 Sep 92 13:19:46 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <16521@pitt.UUCP> geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks) writes:
>I've encountered patients who claim they eat very little despite
>being quite obese, but when the nutritionist has kept calorie
>counts on them, they invariably are eating more than they
>thought they were.  This isn't to say there aren't obese people,
>especially women, who are very sedentary and eat very litttle
>and yet are still obese.  But usually this isn't the case.

Here's one data point to consider:

I've been on a self-tailored diet since June 8 and have been keeping
a food log since July 24.  I knew that I had been overeating and
seriously so but the food log has shown me exactly how poor of a 
judge of nutritional content I was.  It's easy to eat 5000 calories
per day and not feel especially stuffed, I've learned.  I don't
think I was ever really aware of how calorie-dense much food is
even though I knew that I was overeating.  

Once I reduced my daily caloric intake (and made sure I really was
eating less by keeping the log and avoiding foods high in fat etc)
and increased my exercise (by walking), I started to lose weight.
I still have a way to go to meet my goal, though, but after slightly
less than four months of this I'm feeling optimistic.  Keeping the
food log is something I never tried before and I think it has made
an enormous difference.  On previous dieting efforts I think I was
probably yo-yo'ing between eating too little and eating too much;
with the food log, I have confidence that my intake actually *is*
what I want it to be (1200 kcal/day is my target).

I suspect that my experience would be typical of the majority of
people who are overweight, Adiposity 101 notwithstanding.  My own
decidedly-nonprofessional view is that most people can lose weight
if they can make fundamental changes in their approach to exercise and
food and then stick to those changes over the long term.  Saying
that is, of course, easy: doing it is hard.  But I know people who've
lost weight and kept it off and don't see any reason why *I* can't
do it, too.  
-- 
John Lundberg  
jsl@unix.cis.pitt.edu 
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: hank@well.sf.ca.us (Hank Roberts)
Subject: Re: Safety of zinc supplements?
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 20:46:05 GMT


My personal experience using zinc lozenges for sore throats (works for me!!)
is that I notice overdose effects at five to ten times the 'RDA' per day.
Effects:  upset stomach, metallic taste in mouth, food tastes funny.  Easily
fixed by stopping the zinc til the next day.

I've been told that an overdose of zinc actually causes copper poisoning, for
reasons I've forgotten.  In any event it's a transient effect.

Several people on the handicap mailing list reported trying _large_ doses
of zinc for tinnitus, and throwing up.  I've had very mild tinnitus for
some years, and on reflection noted that it bothered me in the summer, when
I scarcely ever use zinc throat lozenges.  So I've been using one or two
50-mg dietary zinc tablets per _week_ and the ringing in the ears goes away.
When it comes back, I remember I've forgotten the zinc for that week.  Now
my tinnitus is very mild, just annoying at bedtime, not the really distracting
stuff that people with profound deafness experience.

Back to zinc lozenges:  I found I could break them into haves or thirds,
and still suppress a painful sore throat just as effectively by using such
a chunk every hour or two, without getting the upset stomach at all.

The RDA is always printed on the packaging; I
would suggest working out your own comfort level empirically.

Note also a related issue, 'zinc fume fever' that hits metalworkers: also
an overdose of zinc, resulting in flu-like symptoms (transient, known for
ages).
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: georgec@eng.umd.edu (George B. Clark)
Subject: Re: Doctors' credentials
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 14:01:27 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Sep28.204251.27190@uvmark.uucp> susan@uvmark.uucp (Susan Todhunter - (JWT)) writes:
>
>What is a "problem patient"?
>

A "problem patient" is a patient who is hard to get along with. It's the
same scenario as a "problem customer" in a retail store, i.e. a customer
who complains as a matter of habit, even if his complaints have no
merit. It is someone who whines.

Newsgroups: sci.med
From: marco@sdf.lonestar.org (Steve Giammarco)
Subject: Re: Chest pain
Organization: Best lil' ol' Pubnix in Texas
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 14:03:24 GMT

Dear Anonymous Person with Chest Pains:

I began having chest pains as you described 13 years ago. Sometimes
mild, sometimes crushing. Every visit to an emergency room (about
2/yr) resulted in the same diagnosis: Nothing or Nerves.

This was eventually diagnosed as Panic Disorder, treated using an
antidepressant (desipramine or Norpramin), and about 1 year's 
group therapy.  Turned out that ALL of the features of this disorder
for me were psychological. I have been off meds for almost 2 years
and haven't had another episode. You may be experiencing the same
stuff as I did. Entertain seeing a panic-attack-knowledgeable person..
From: stone@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Glenn Stone)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: women in science
Date: 1 Oct 92 13:30:57 GMT
Reply-To: stone@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Glenn Stone)
Organization: Columbia University

In article <1992Sep30.150039.293@news.wesleyan.edu> RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Ruth Ginzberg) writes:

>there is an extremely funny article in (i think) SCIENCE AND FEMINISM, ed. Ruth
>Bleier (1986?), which "deconstructs" the language of "Hardness" & "Softness"
>w.r.t. science, where "hardness" is equated w. "masculinity" & "softness" w.
>"femininity".  it creates rather interesting visual imagery w.r.t. this
>"hard"/"soft" discussion...

At Cambridge they use a distinction between Heavy Science and Light
Science, which also has humor potential, which also has humor
potential.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Glenn Davis Stone                                BITNET: stone@cunixf
  Columbia University            INTERNET: stone@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: susan@uvmark.uucp (Susan Todhunter - (JWT))
Subject: Re: "Problem Patient"
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 19:48:16 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Vmark Software, Inc.

In article <1992Sep29.140127.10092@eng.umd.edu> georgec@eng.umd.edu (George B. Clark) writes:
>
>A "problem patient" is a patient who is hard to get along with. It's the
>same scenario as a "problem customer" in a retail store, i.e. a customer
>who complains as a matter of habit, even if his complaints have no
>merit. It is someone who whines.
>

I'm not sure I understand.  Does this mean a "problem patient" is one a doctor
doesn't like?  Do you mean by your analogy that if a doctor cannot at first     find a cause for a person's complaints, the doctor then determines the com-
plaint has no merit and the person is a problem?


-- 

  Susan Todhunter
 
  Internet: uvmark!susan@merk.com, UUCP: uunet!merk!uvmark!susan
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: sysapj@gsusgi2.gsu.edu (Arturo P. Jimenez)
Subject: Silicon Breast Implants
Summary: What is the latest on Silicon Breast Implants
Keywords: Silicon Breast Implants Surgery Problems
Organization: Georgia State University
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 21:50:41 GMT


I have a friend who is considering having silicon breast implants for a
breast enlargement operation.  Any information which would give insight
into the procedure and safety of the operation would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance for your responses.

-- 
===========================================================================
Art Jimenez                                      sysapj@gsusgi2.gsu.edu        
Georgia State University Research Foundation     Phone: (404) 651-2648
Wells Computer Center, SPIN-X Development Group   
"NUTS!" -- General A. C. McAuliffe  Bastogne, France  December 22, 1944
===========================================================================
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: akcobb@unix.amherst.edu (acapella)
Subject: FT4 thyroid function?
Organization: Amherst College
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 03:35:21 GMT

I had my thyroid function tested a while ago, and in it included FT4.
I'm wondering what this is, and what it means if it is abnormal.
Specifically, if anyone knows if I should go right away to a doctor,
because I'm not seeing one now and it would be hard to arrange an
appointment with one.  Any help?  Thanks..
From: drand@spinner.osf.org (Douglas S. Rand)
Subject: Re: NATURAL ANTI-cancer Remedies
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: 30 Sep 92 18:08:34

In article <"30-Sep-92..9:26:31.EDT".*.James_S._Bright.wbst129@Xerox.com> James_S._Bright.wbst129@XEROX.COM writes:

   >                          NATURAL ANTI-CANCER REMEDIES
   >                                 A 3RD OPINION

   LOTS of CAPS that EMPHASIS major points of REAL interest.

   Well, my chemistry is a little weak and I've only been in Biology class for 4
   weeks now, but I counted at least half a dozen contradictions off the top of my
   head. Can't believe I even spent the time to read part of the stupid thing....

   What's this doing on "SCI.med" anyway?

Because there is a large body of people who believe that all that
is wrong with the world is someone's fault.  They find conspiracies
in every shadow and grasp anyone's critique of their conspiracy theory
to prove that the conspiracy exists.  

Since every conspiracy theory that I'm aware of requires that the
conspiracy is "secret", none of them can be disproven.  Occationally,
one becomes proven, just enough to supply some examples.  Usually
these theories involve secrets held by such a large group that
the probability that the secret would remain so approaches zero.

Not having read the original post,  I don't know what their theory
is,  but I'd guess it ran in the lines of "Orthodox medicine treats
cancer with poisonous chemotherapy (true really) and ignores all those
wonderful natural alternative treatments that have been proven
(to their minds) to cure cancer in (fill in the blank) percent 
of cases."  For me It falls in the same camp as 200 mpg carborators
kept quiet by Detroit.


--

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Douglas S. Rand <drand@osf.org>		OSF/Motif Dev.
Snail:         11 Cambridge Center,  Cambridge,  MA  02142
Disclaimer:    I don't know if OSF agrees with me... let's vote on it.
Amateur Radio: KC1KJ
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rind@binoc.bih.harvard.edu (David Rind)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Yet another Lyme question
Date: 28 Sep 92 01:50:11 GMT
Organization: Beth Israel Hospital, Harvard Medical School, Boston Mass., USA

In article <1992Sep27.172718.11900@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>
 odp@ldgo.columbia.edu (carl brenner) writes:
>In article <1877@hsdndev.UUCP>, rind@binoc.bih.harvard.edu (David Rind) writes
>> >> Neither of these papers discusses relapse rates.  
>	This thread got started when someone else (not me) said something
>about a 50% failure rate.

Again, a failure to prevent late sequellae is not the same as a relpase.
The paper in question did discuss failures of this sort (though nowhere
near 50%).   The distinction matters.  The original post I had responded 
to was saying that 2 weeks of therapy was inadequate and that longer
courses of antibiotics were needed for early Lyme.  In dealing with
an infectious disease, in the absence of empiric evidence one way
or the other, seeing *relapses* would be strong evidence that longer
courses of treatment are needed.  This is not true for late sequellae
which may or may not be altered by longer therapy -- only a trial
of different courses of antibiotics could answer that question.

>	The control group never had Lyme.

This was what I was concerned about in the experimental design.
PCR is so inordinately sensitive, that any contamination of the
CSF (perhaps by blood as the needle went through skin) might
cause a positive PCR result.  The study might be more convincing
if the controls were people with Lyme who clinically did not seem
to have had CNS dissemination.  Otherwise, how do you know that the
DNA being detected is really coming from the CSF?

-- 
David Rind
rind@binoc.bih.harvard.edu
From: km@cs.pitt.edu (Ken Mitchum)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Arrogance, arthritis, & Banks
Date: 2 Oct 92 14:39:19 GMT
Reply-To: km@cs.pitt.edu (Ken Mitchum)
Organization: Univ. of Pittsburgh Computer Science

In article <BvEq4L.3H@wpg.com. russ@wpg.com (Russell Lawrence) writes:
.. or speak on things they are not informed on?

.Is there any reason why any licensed doctor would lie?   Questions
.involving quackery cannot be resolved by pitting one person's
.credentials against those of another.  

Hmm. I guess there is no difference in legal advice from a lawyer and
from the guy down the street or on the net. I should just be able to
choose from them based on their arguments.

 -km
From: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Arrogance, arthritis, & Banks
Date: 28 Sep 92 14:52:53 GMT
Reply-To: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Organization: Univ. of Pittsburgh Computer Science

In article <1992Sep23.161921.26070@anasazi.com> john@anasazi.com writes:
>
>Let me suggest an alternative. I think it important that the experts
>(such as Gordon, Mark or Steve - and a few I have left out) at least
>note on the net that the theories are wrong and why. I don't think lengthy
>debate is appropriate - especially within the areas of expertise of our
>experts. If the quack reposts, it can safely be ignored, but I don't think
>it should be ignored the first time.
>

Well, what is "the first time"?  These things come back over and over
again.  I think if you had an archive, you would see that the
first time this sort of thing is done, but it can't be done every
time.  But yet, there are alway new people reading who think the
doctors are just flaming if they pooh-pooh chelation therapy,
for example, for heart disease.  They weren't around when it was
hashed out in detail.

>Ultimately we need to subdivide sci.med to get the politics and quack
>theories into separate groups. Maybe we should also have a

I've advocated this for a long time.  The cryonics group has been
a great boon in getting that stuff off of sci.med (although in
the months it has been in existence it has only had a few posts,
far fewer than the total number they put onto sci.med.)
I think the problem is people want to stay in the general forum
because it gives them a soapbox.  It's no fun preaching to the converted.
Maybe some of that is true on both sides, I don't know.  But I'd favor
splitting the group.

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gordon Banks  N3JXP      | "I have given you an argument; I am not obliged
geb@cadre.dsl.pitt.edu   |  to supply you with an understanding." -S.Johnson
----------------------------------------------------------------------------