From: cla04@seq1.keele.ac.uk (A.T. Fear)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Re: OSE: A troskyist fringe group
Date: 29 Sep 92 15:59:58 GMT
Organization: Keele University, England

From article <1992Sep29.114931.16422@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU>, by 8800529@hydra.maths.unsw.EDU.AU:
>>However if someone could show that OSE regularly shot policemen, blew up buildings etc, I would agree that the
> 	You forgot to answer (or ignored) the point I made about the fact that
> the British Leagal system jailed a number of Irsih citisens (Berminham seven 
> you mentioned) while they new they were inocent. Your reply was in the form 
> that IRA should be prosecuted and braking the law a bit to protect society is 
> accepted.

Now where did I say that? Nothing could be more counter-productive in
dealing with terrorism than not going by the book. I fear the fiasco of
the Birmingham Six will have put more guns in the IRA's armoury than a
lot of Noraid propaganda has managed. But what is the 'British Legal system'. The
jury who convicted the Birmingham Six certainly didn't know they were
innocent, nor did the judge who sentenced them. This case rests on the
suppression of facts by elements in the police force which led to them not
being presented in court. This has now been dealt with via the appeals
procedure, admittedly at an excessively slow speed. 
As for prosecution my position is clear, if you blow people up, shoot
them etc you should be arrested and if the police have done their work
correctly, gaoled or even executed, you should not be
arrested for circulating a pamphlet. I really think that's enough about
the IRA. It distresses me to give them free publicity.

> That offcourse is my interpritation of a vage answer. My question would be
> that you can see social injustice in a case of the OSE five were the
> court has not decided on there fate and you don't have all the info
> needed

The reasons for the arrest and charges faced have been posted several
times. No one has challenged them. I would be grateful if any one could
tell me if what has been posted is false.


>> I'm no friend of terrorism under whatever
>>initials it hides. On the other hand the printing of a pamphlet
>>(particularly this one) seems a harmless enough thing and moreover pamphlets and slogans are about as far as OSE's revolution
> 
> 	The sectret in this argument is the word you put "seems".

Alas, a mild English idiom for "is". 

> Oh and another missinformation passed on to the net by the OSE member ..
> He mentioned that strikers were walking down major Athenean streets holding
> banners in the front asking to free the OSE five. I doubt if anybody has
> any knowledge of the OSE five. And those people were holding banners to free
> jailed strikers (Please jump on this one because you don't know why they were 
> also jailed)

I don't want to jump on this one because I believe you. Left fringe groups have
a habit of attaching themselves to larger social movements and claiming
them as their own. A classic example in this country would be the
Miners' Strike. Please don't think that I like OSE, I don't, I'm a right-wing conservative. I just think they have the right to put their point
of view.

>>will ever get. Everyone is allowed to dream - even Trotskyites and in my
>>case Thatcherites.
 
> 	The Tounge does not have bones but it can brake bones"
> 
> In other words, words can be more dangerous than action. People should not be 
> allowed to advocate violence.

By and large I agree, though as I've said persecuting small groups that
advocate armed revolution is counter-productive. It gives them a false
sense of security and publicity and they've no chance of doing this anyway. If they get round to hurting
people, then 
they cease to be a joke and it's time to stop them doing this. The point is though that the charges in
this case are nothing to do with this eccentric stance of OSE on armed
revolution (otherwise surely they'd have been dealt with years ago), but simply about their disagreement with the Greek
Government line on Macedonia. 

> If somebody that seems harmless enough is on the
> streets asking for members to form a new group that will create violence
> he should be jailed.
 
But how does disagreeing with your government create violence?  It
happens round here all the time, but Keele seems pretty peaceful.

Andy
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