HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rws@duke.cs.duke.edu (Ronnie W. Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Shaq on the Olympic Team...
Date: 19 Nov 92 20:49:04 GMT
Organization: Duke University Computer Science Dept.; Durham, N.C.

In article <1992Nov19.142431.1096@altair.selu.edu> tmis1862@altair.selu.edu writes:
>
>
>>Why?  Laettner was the POY winner and consummate winner.  His performance
>>during the season made Shaq's lofty stats look weak.  And every time they
>>went head to head, Laettner go the best of O'Neal.  I think Laettner was
>
>No, wrong answer.  Last time they played in Baton Rouge O'Neal definetly
>won the battle.  While the game was close he held Laettner into being
>basically a non-factor.  At the end of the game, the stats were close
>but Laettner scored most of his points after the game was decided.


Well, I'm glad I've started skimming this group to see how some of my
favorite recent college hoopsters are doing now in "basketball as theater".
Historical revisionism has hit basketball as well.  If you can gain access
to a tape of last year's LSU-Duke game or look at the stats, to call either
player a "non-factor" is not accurate.  There was a particular 3-point basket
that finally broke the game open.  Guess who made it?? It certainly wasn't
Shaq.

In that game Shaq did the things he does well and Laettner did the things
he does well.  Shaq certainly had a much better game at Baton Rouge than he
did the previous year in Durham.


-- 
Ronnie Smith      East Carolina University      Greenville, NC
   (and still at Duke a little bit)
 INTERNET: rws@cs.duke.edu
The next Duke Invitational,  April 3 - 5, 1993 in New Orleans.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: markham@brtph597.bnr.ca (Andrew Markham P205)
Subject: Pippen Overrated? (was Suns Report: Phoenix dominates Jazz)
Organization: BNR Inc. RTP, NC
Distribution: world,local
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 14:40:02 GMT

jwnagle@loglady.ninds.nih.gov (Jim Nagle) writes:
>In a recent post Jeff Hawkin writes:
>>Any person who has ever watched him play doesn't play into this "gun" shit 
>>either.....hell Jordan and Scottie "Mr. Overrated" Pippen (You can't tell me
>                                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> you wouldn't rather have Rodman or the well-rounded Majerle instead)put up a
>> lot more shots (and miss a lot more)
>
>While I am no Bulls fan and would agree that at one time Pippen was
>                                                                ^^^
>overrated, his improved shooting, defense, court smarts and all-around
>skills (oh yeah I forgot his ball-handling) make him arguably the BEST SF in 
>the league. Perhaps one could argue Barkley is better but I consider him 
>actually a PF. 

Not that they necessarily prove anything, but FYI here are Pippen's first 
week stats (along with the players mentioned above and a few other relevant 
ones)...

Player    G  Min  Fg-Fga  Fg% Ft-Fta  Ft% Orb Trb Ast Stl Blk  Pts  PPG
------    -  ---  ------ ---- ------ ---- --- --- --- --- ---  --- ----
Pippen    6  233  53-113 .469  14-22 .636  24  65  43   9   2  122 20.3
Barkley   4  169  36- 69 .522  31-40 .775  20  62  24   3   6  103 25.8
Majerle   4  152  15- 51 .294  12-16 .750   7  22  14   6   2   47 11.8
Rodman    4  109   6- 17 .353   0- 2 .000  11  36   5   1   1   12  3.0

L.Johnson 6  237  43- 93 .462  20-25 .800  15  72  21   5   2  108 18.0
Mullin    6  262  62-118 .525  24-29 .828   4  21  16  11   6  152 25.3


IMHO, Pippen is the premier SF in the East with LJ a close second.  I 
wouldn't let Rodman carry his jock.  Rodman can rebound better, defend a 
little better, and the buck stops there.  

In the West, his competition is Mullin and Barkley.  Majerle wouldn't be 
carrying his jock either.  With Mullin you get points galoreso it would 
depend on what your team needed.  If you had a quality point guard and 
good rebounders, you might opt for Mullin.  Pippen is a more complete 
player, so he is my choice.

As far as Barkley is concerned, only under one scenario would I have him 
at SF instead of PF.  With K.Malone on my team, Barkley would play SF, 
otherwise Barkley would start at PF with Pippen at SF.

Clear enough?

-- 
Andrew W. Markham (markham@bnr.ca)
Bell Northern Research, Inc.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: jdt29225@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jazzy J )
Subject: Re: Why Golden State will be the next dynasty.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:49:31 GMT

kthompso@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Kevin Thompson) writes:

> Remember the Spurs about 10 years ago? 

	Now, HERE's a fun team to watch!  They featured the likes of 
	the Iceman (George Gervin), James Silas, and Larry Kenon -- and
	U want to talk about throwing it up?  Talk about points galore
	(was Doug Moe the coach of this team? -- or did he already move
	to Denver?)  Anyways, they sure couldn't play any defense --
	which has been proven in the past few years, U have to have to
	win championships.  If the Spurs scored 130, their opponents
	would score 135.  If I recall, however, they did make it pretty
	far in the playoffs in those years, though.

	Jazzy J
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|   " I try to discover a little something to make me sweeter..."   --Erasure |
|   Jazzy J               jdt29225@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu         U-Illinois/Urbana |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: khansen@staff.tc.umn.edu ()
Subject: Wolves Trade
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 13:38:34 GMT

The Minnesota Timberwolves traded reserve guard/forward Gerald Glass and 
reserve forward Mark Randall to the Detroit Pistons for guard Lance Blanks and
former Timberwolve Brad Sellers.  As a condition of the trade, the Timberwolves
also received the Piston's second round draft pick in the year 2000.

Glass did not fit in with  Coack Jimmy Rodgers and GM Jack McCloskey and has
seen limited playing time this season.  Mark Randall seems to be a victim of 
numbers as the Wolves have plenty of players at his spot.

Sellers, who played in 14 games for Minnesota during the 89-90 season, and
Blanks were both acquired by McCloskey while he was GM in Detroit.

Now the Wolves only have Doug West, Felton Spencer, and Luc Longley as 
remaining draft picks from the pre-McCloskey era.

-----------------------------
-Kevin Hansen----------------
-Minnesota Twin Family Study-
-University of Minnesota-----
-khansen@staff.tc.umn.edu----
-----------------------------
From: alan@sierra.unr.edu (Alan McKay)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: San antonio
Date: 18 Nov 92 16:13:46 GMT
Reply-To: alan@wrc.unr.edu (Alan McKay)
Organization: Desert Research Institute, University of Nevada

In article <1ec23aINNi5k@network.ucsd.edu> kkothman@weber.ucsd.edu (Keith Kothman) writes:

>Add Antoine Carr to that list, although he's not out for the
>year (anyone know when he'll be back).  And Del Negro had his nose
>broken--also out.  Daniels has played well in his absence, although
>he gets burned some on defense.

Antoine started and played pretty well in last night's (11/17) Spur's win
over the Cavs. Lloyd Daniels contributed 19 points, I believe. 


....al
w.a. mckay
desert research institute
reno, nevada
From: jte@beefheart.cc.columbia.edu (Jeff Eldredge)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Shaq at Meadowlands
Date: 17 Nov 92 22:20:01 GMT
Reply-To: jte@beefheart.cc.columbia.edu
Distribution: usa
Organization: Columbia University

In article <1992Nov17.162440.15930@cbnewsm.cb.att.com>  
ortcm@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (thomas.mcguigan) writes:
> In article <1992Nov17.134731.20@research.nj.nec.com>  
adam@research.nj.nec.com writes:
> >
> >Saw Shaq against the Nets Saturday night.  The kid is impressive.  But
> >he needs to work on his basketball skills.  ...  The Nets collapsed
> >defensively on Shaq, double- and sometimes triple-teaming him.  Shaq
> >tried to go up strong to the hoop every time.  He needs to find the
> >open man.

I was at the Meadowlands, too.  As you implied (later in your post), the  
Nets actually didn't double or triple-team until late in the game.   
Because they knew how dangerous Orlando's perimeter shooting is.  
  
> >Drazen Petrovic had an off night and was a non-factor.
> 
> We here in Orlando like to think that Nick Anderson might have had  
something
> to do with that.  Nick has really been working hard to improve his  
defensive
> skills.  In addition to his game  against Petrovic, he virtually shut  
down
> Glen Rice in the second half of the Orlando-Miami game on Nov. 6.

Something shut down Petro.  Probably Anderson, and also probably the  
failure of the Nets to work screens (also credit to Orlando D).  Anderson  
was amazing the whole night.  Petro was cold, too.    

> 
> >and Sam Bowie (!) muscled/stood up to Shaq early on and he got in foul
> >trouble in the 1st quarter.
> 
> Yes, Bowie did a good job of muscling Shaq.  But to be fair, two of  
O'Neal's
> 3 fouls in the first were the result of rookie inexperience/trying to do  
to
> much. One was a reaching-in foul, the other was when O'Neal pushed  (I  
think)
> Petrovic or Anderson out of bounds while diving for a lose ball.

One thing he'll learn fast is that he doesn't have to be too, too  
aggressive with Bowie.  Sam is clever, but he's not exactly an offensive  
force.  

From the looks of things, Shaq will have his work cut out for him when he  
goes up against the titans (Daugherty, Robinson, Olajuwan - if healthy,  
and probably Ewing).  But let's face it, this guy is going to be a force.   
One thing I didn't see any evidence of was an outside shot....

/jte
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: emdynle@next01wor.wam.umd.edu (Em Dyn chi co' em trong tim anh)
Subject: ACC ROOKIES IN NBA
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 15:16:24 GMT

It looks as though besides the Shaq, the two most productive rookies  
elsewhere have come from the ACC.  Walt Williams is doing very well  
although he doesn't start.  I expect him to be a starter soon.  Gugliotta  
is doing very well with the bullets also.  They have both helped their  
teams greatly.  I expect to see one of these teams with the last playoff  
slot and one back in the Lottery
From: ellie@ora.com (Ellie Cutler)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Mouthguards
Date: 16 Nov 92 13:39:19 GMT
Article-I.D.: ora.Bxt9xK.MvK
Distribution: world,local
Organization: O'Reilly & Associates, Inc.

>In article <1992Nov13.032510.1@violet.ccit.arizona.edu>, f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin) writes:
>        .
>QUESTIONS I WANT ANSWERS TO:
>
>Does anyone in the NBA wear a mouthguard?
>
From the Celts - Parish and Sherman Douglas.

-- 
        Ellie Cutler

        ellie@ora.com               
        uunet!ora!ellie
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks)
Subject: Re: Pippen Overrated? (was Suns Report: Phoenix dominates Jazz)
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 92 16:21:59 GMT
Distribution: world,local
Organization: VMARK Software, Inc.

In article <1992Nov19.224150.19351@alw.nih.gov> jwnagle@loglady.ninds.nih.gov (Jim Nagle) writes:
>in a recent post (Jerray Wei) writes:
>
>> As for premier SF in the East, ever hear
>>of Dominique Wilkins?  Last I heard, 'Nique was averaging over 30 ppg and
>>shooting better than 50%.  Not as well rounded as Pippen, but a good notch
>>or two ahead of him in scoring and a slightly better rebounder.
>
>Wilkins is a 1 dimensional player who takes way too many bad shots
>even if he is the only scoring threat on his team. He has nowhere near
>the all around game Pippen has especially defensively. Nique's FG% may
>be >50% now but check it at the end of the season.
>-jim

Not been watching much basketball lately, have you.  Dominique is NOT a 
one-dimensional player.  He is one of the top offensive threats in the game,
comparable to Mr. Jordan.  He can score at will with a good, but not great 
outside game (better than Pippen's) and a great driving/slashing/posting/open
court game, even better (IMHO) than Pippen's.  He is a better rebounder than
Pippen as well, and a decent passer, though Pippen is better.  He is an ok
defender, but not as good as Pippen.  He is the #1, and in many years the only
scoring threat on the Hawks.  Pippen gets a lot of his numbers living in the
shadows of Jordan, which help him considerably.  Dominique,like Jordan, can
score in either the running attack or half-court set.  Pippen looks lost in
the half-court set.  You are right he doesn't have the all-around game Pippen
does, but remember that he is a much, much better scorer, better rebounder, and
a better passer than he is given credit for..


-- 
David T. Meeks            || "New shadows tugging at the corner of his eye
VMark Software, Inc.      ||  Jostling for attention as the sunlight flares
uvmark!davem@merk.com     ||  Through a curtains tear, shuffling its beams
davem%uvmark@merk.com     ||  As if in nervous anticipation of another day"
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Jimmy Jackson
From: cken@ocmatt.cc.oberlin.edu
Date: 17 Nov 92 16:37:01 EDT
Organization: Oberlin College

Where is Jimmy Jackson, formally of Ohio State. I thought he was drafted by the
Dallas Mavericks but haven't seen anything about him.  Has he signed, is he
hurt?  
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: tannerg@carson.u.washington.edu (Glenn Tanner)
Subject: Re: Benoit Benjamin
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:50:50 GMT

>Does anyone know why Benoit Benjamin didn't play in the game
>last night?  He was a no-show in the boxscore.... did Dana Barros
>really play 41 minutes?
>
>Thanks
>
>Pete

Ben-wa has a sore knee, and the Sonics were on the first night of back-to-back
games.  Dana scored 11 points in the first quarter, and Rickey Pierce hurt his
foot during the second quarter and didn't play in the second half, so Karl 
gave Dana a lot of minutes.

GT
From: mlsa@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (MICHAEL LAUREN SHERMAN)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Who are the worst players in nba?
Date: 19 Nov 92 16:58:32 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

In article <1eehrbINNa2f@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu>, rodmur@ecst.csuchico.edu (D
ale Harris) writes:
>In article <92323.163241IO20738@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> IO20738@MAINE.MAINE.EDU writes
:
>>Everyone is always talking about who they think is
>>the best at each position, etc.  I would like to
>>know who everyone thinks are the worst players in
>>the NBA.
>
>Ralph Sampson.  Course he isn't playing any longer, the Kings are still
>paying him 2 million a year though (a buy out of his contract, this is the
>last year).  I suppose there must be a few Kings in the list but I
>actually don't know all the players, a few years ago Jim Les was listed as
>one of the worst players, but he's improved quite a bit from that time.
>
>
>--
>   __        _                     Dale A. Harris  {rodmur@ecst.csuchico.edu}
>  /  )      //                           /   "Is gone... he left for Mexico to
> /  / __.  // _      , , , __.  _       /_  _  __  _  get a job, due to the
>/__/_(_/|_</_</_    (_(_/_(_/|_/_)_    / /_</_/ (_</_ deterioting US economy ;)
>
The Washington Bullets
-- 
MICHAEL LAUREN SHERMAN
758-0207
MLSA

"I really do appreciate the fact you're sitting here, you're voice sounds so
wonderful but your face don't look too clear so barmaid bring a pitcher,
another round of brew, why don't we get drunk and screw?"- J. Buffett
From: terra@reed.edu (Terra Goodnight)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Clippers 101 - Knicks 91 (11/19/92)
Date: 23 Nov 92 20:06:38 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Nov23.200638.5472
Organization: Reed College, Portland, Oregon

nyk 91, lac 101   19nov92

*John Starks was pulled from the game by Coach Riley after playing only 10 min.*

nyk ( 4- 4)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
campbell,tony     31   4   6   0  0   2  2   -  2   1  2  1  1  0  0  0  0   10
oakley,charles    25   1   2   0  0   2  2   - 12   0  4  1  2  0  1  0  0    4
ewing,patrick     39   6  16   0  0   7  8   - 13   1  5  0  5  3  0  0  0   19
starks,john       10   4   6   0  0   4  4   0  0   0  0  0  1  0  0  0  0   12
rivers,doc        18   2   7   0  0   0  0   -  1   6  1  0  1  0  0  0  0    4
mason,anthony     36   5  10   0  0   6 10   -  9   2  0  1  1  0  0  0  0   16
blackman,rolando  14   0   6   0  0   1  2   0  0   3  4  0  1  0  0  0  0    1
smith,charles     13   1   4   0  0   0  0   -  2   1  2  0  1  0  0  0  0    2
anthony,greg      27   5  10   1  1   2  2   -  1   5  4  2  5  0  1  0  0   13
davis,hubert      27   5  14   0  1   0  0   -  1   3  3  1  1  1  0  0  0   10
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
nyk totals       240  33  81   1  2  24 30   0 41  22 25  6 19  4  2  0  0   91
FG, 3P, FT averages:     .407   .500   .800       team rebs 14

lac ( 4- 4)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
manning,danny     34  11  23   0  0   5  6   - 10   3  5  1  3  1  0  0  0   27
vandeweghe,kiki   25   4   8   1  1   1  3   -  2   0  1  0  1  0  0  0  0   10
roberts,stanley   10   1   6   0  0   0  0   -  1   0  4  0  2  0  0  0  0    2
harper,ron        35   6  12   0  2  10 12   -  4   3  2  2  5  1  0  0  0   22
jackson,mark      40   4   8   1  1   4  6   -  5   9  2  0  2  0  0  0  0   13
norman,ken        32   4   8   0  0   0  0   -  9   1  2  0  0  1  0  0  0    8
williams,john     23   0   3   0  0   3  4   -  2   1  3  2  0  1  1  0  0    3
vaught,loy        20   6   9   0  0   0  0   -  5   0  3  0  1  0  0  0  0   12
grant,gary         7   1   3   0  0   2  2   -  1   0  2  2  3  0  0  0  0    4
jackson,jaren     14   0   1   0  0   0  0   0  0   3  0  0  0  0  0  0  0    0
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
lac totals       240  37  81   2  4  25 33   0 39  20 24  7 17  4  1  0  0  101
FG, 3P, FT averages:     .457   .500   .758       team rebs 12

nyk   26  17  27  21  -   91
lac   26  24  19  32  -  101

attendance 13919, time 2:18, officials: JODonnell,LJones,KMauer

*if anybody has offensive rebounds stats for this one, send them to me!*
Terra
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: boisseau@chpc.utexas.edu (John R. Boisseau (Jay))
Subject: Do the Spurs play at home on Wednesday, Nov. 25?
Organization: The University of Texas System - CHPC
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 16:42:09 GMT


The subject line says it all. I will be in San Antonio on Wednesday,
Nov. 25, and I would like to know if the Spurs have a home game that
night. I don't need an entire schedule (although that would be
appreciated), just the info for 11/25.

I usually read only the college sports newsgroups, so an answer by
email would be grealty appreciated.

Thanks,

Jay Boisseau

-- 

*********************************
  John R. Boisseau ("Jay")       
  Department of Astronomy        
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: mark@tc.fluke.COM (Mark D. Nagel)
Subject: Re: What about Seattle?
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 21:06:20 GMT

>Though Seattle is still undefeated, they haven't played any of the top
>teams so it is hard to gauge them.  So far, they have beaten Houston twice
>at a neutral site, and the Lakers and Sacramento at home. 
>All these teams are at best mediocre.

Huh? I don't know what Huston's record is now, but I don't think they are
"mediocre". Didn't they just beat San Antonio (;-))? LA, well, they aren't
deep enough. Sacramento had a 3 and 1 record. Didn't they just beat San
Antonio (;-)) -- poor Spurs -- wonder what's wrong.

>By contrast, Portland has beaten Denver, Phoenix, and Cleveland at home and
>Golden State on the road.  Golden State is not at their best right now
>but Phoenix and Cleveland are legitimate title contenders.

I don't think that Denver is to be considered a heavyweight. Pheonix was without
KJ (it makes a BIG difference). Cleveland had just went into double OT against
Golden State the night before: I'd have thought that Portland should have won
by a bigger margin.

Anyway, both Seattle and Portland are undefeated with four wins. I guess we'll
see what happens when they both start hitting the road. They are scheduled to
play each other on 12/18 and 12/22.

>Like everyone, we will have to wait and see.  It's still too early.

Like 78 games too early :-)

Go Heat!
-- 
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Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: mark@tc.fluke.COM (Mark D. Nagel)
Subject: Re: BOXSCORE cle06sac06.15nov92
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 21:41:00 GMT

In <BxvCvy.3zs@news.cso.uiuc.edu> jdt29225@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jazzy J ) writes:

>alecb@gacvx1.gac.edu writes:
>>sac ( 4- 2)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
>>simmons,lionel    44   6  16   0  0   5  7   1  7   6  4  1  4  0  0  0  0   17
>>tisdale,waymon    44   8  19   0  0   1  2   2 10   6  4  0  0  0  0  0  0   17
>>causwell,duane    20   4   5   0  0   1  2   1  7   0  4  0  2  0  0  0  0    9
>>richmond,mitch    47  12  21   3  4   4  4   0  8   6  1  1  2  1  0  0  0   31
>>brown,randy       41   7  10   0  0   0  2   1  3   4  4  1  2  0  0  0  0   14
>>williams,walt     35   9  15   1  4   2  2   3  6   5  5  0  3  1  0  0  0   21
>>les,jim            9   0   1   0  0   0  0   2  2   2  1  0  0  0  0  0  0    0
>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>sac totals       240  46  87   4  8  13 19  10 43  29 23  3 13  2  0  0  0  109
>>FG, 3P, FT averages:     .529   .500   .684       team rebs  9
>> 
>	Now, here's a good example of a team using it's starters too much
>	early in the season.  Pretty much a non-important non-conference
>	game, and they use basically only 6 players?  And this early in the
>	season?  What's the purpose behind this?  I'd say people like Mitch
>	Richmond are going to be barely able to walk by the time the end
>	of the season rolls around.

>	Jazzy J

Good observation. Seems like there wasn't too much of a rotation happening
when they played Seattle either: It showed in the fourth quarter. I guess
you can do these sort of things with young legs.

Can't beat having depth though!
-- 
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From: cs161feu@sdcc10.ucsd.edu (Anthony Minkoff)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Questions
Date: 24 Nov 92 00:54:00 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego

In article <1992Nov23.194930.11303@midway.uchicago.edu>
hh15@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>1) Has any player in the NBA history EVER had a quadruple double?  I
>mean double digits in any four of the following categories: points,
>rebounds, steals, assists, blocks (and maybe turnover? :) 

Hakeem Olajuwon had one a couple of years ago.  There have been
others.

Tony
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro