HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: svaldez@ocf.berkeley.edu (Steve Valdez)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: Re: Traffic Survey
Date: 30 Jul 92 19:31:15 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
X-Posted-From: tsunami.berkeley.edu
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <1992Jul29.191115.15072@sco.com> tonyj@sco.com (newt technology baffles pissed old hack) writes:
>But see also CVC sections 40801 thru 40805 (Speed Traps).  These are
>the sections that cover Steve's example.  By the way, the latest CVC
>includes an amended s.40802, to take effect from 1 Jan 1993, which
>applies to all roads; the exemption for 'local roads' in the
>current s.40802 is not in the new s.40802.

I went and dropped in on the local traffic court since I'll be in court
in a month or two...  every officer prosecuting a prima facie case
presented the judge with the appropriate traffic survey (so much for
the they-don't-come-up-with-it-so-it's-a-speed-trap strategy.) 

As a sidenote, (maybe this should be in Misc.legal), I was wondering
if anyone has tried conducting their OWN traffic survey..  Of course
you would need to get a radar/lidar gun and follow the CalTrans
regulations for doing this(100 or more cars measured) --- would such a
survey be COMPETENT evidence in court???  I wonder... 
Xref: sparky ca.driving:1807 rec.autos.driving:4685
From: leem@jpl-devvax.jpl.nasa.gov (Lee Mellinger)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Front license plates
Date: 30 Jul 92 15:18:43 GMT
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory (NASA)

In article <yJRooB1w165w@fringe.rain.com> dean@fringe.rain.com (Dean Woodward) writes:
:jtchew@csa3.lbl.gov (JOSEPH T CHEW) writes:
:
:3.  If a car is designed and built without a place to put a front plate, then
:    they can't require you to have one. (The '84 & newer Corvettes as my
:    example.)  There isn't a Federal law stating that all autos must have
:    front license plates, so it's up to individual states.s
:Dean Woodward           |  OK.  Last time.  This is my machine. This is my


Even if the car is designed and built without a place for the
front plate, it must be put on.  The law doen't care about the design
of the car, only that the license be visible from both the front and
the rear, it is up to the owner to figure out how.

See my prior post about late model Corvettes.

Lee

"Mit Pulver und Blei, die Gedanken sind frei."

|Lee F. Mellinger                 Caltech/Jet Propulsion Laboratory - NASA
|4800 Oak Grove Drive, Pasadena, CA 91109 818/354-1163  FTS 792-1163     
|leem@jpl-devvax.JPL.NASA.GOV
From: thekid@mcl.ucsb.edu (mona "the kid" ismail)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: HELP! unfair ticket
Date: 22 Jul 92 02:27:36 GMT
Distribution: ca

I recently got a ticket in Sacramento on Fair Oaks Blvd near Garfield

The CHP was coming towards me (i.e. he was going the other direction)

I was in traffic with a moron in a blue Chevettee with the left blinker stuck
on ahead of me and he was going 38 mph (I know 'cause I checked my spedo).
We were in the #1 lane.  A honda accord also pull out from a side street.
in the right lane there was a white ford (F150 about '77 I think).  Everyone
was going the same speed and the only person I passed was a white LTD who was
going 35 mph.

The speed limit is 40 mph on this road and there are curves.

The CHP pulled me over about .4 miles later saying I was doing 56 mph by his
estimate and 59 according to his radar.  He said that my car was in heavy 
cornering conditions and it looked like a race car (This was my mom's olds delta
'88).  I asked where he got my speed and he says I was all alone for a bit.

THIS IS NOT TRUE.  There were two other people in the car and they can support
me in that there was no heavy cornering, we were in traffic the WHOLE time,
and we later went through the same corner 5 minutes later at 42 mph and one
person said "I think that was faster".  Also the officer wrote down the time
wrong (off about 5 minutes).

What can I do?  Please help

mona ismail
thekid@mcl.ucsb.edu


Newsgroups: ca.driving
From: appgroup@Cadence.COM (John Wilson)
Subject: Re: Death Race 5000
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 22:24:54 GMT

Last night I was driving home on 101N near Mt.View when I saw two cars parked
on the right side of the road, plus one car parked next to the center divide
FACING THE WRONG WAY.  None of the cars appeared to be damaged, and there
was a woman sitting in the passenger seat of the car in the center divide.
I wish I could have seen how the car got that way...
From: gaborno@oilpan.aero.org (Neal Gaborno 74-35 x62650)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: Re: sponsored littered removal
Date: 23 Jul 92 22:46:32 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Company, EDSG

In article <18975@fritz.filenet.com> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk) writes:
 <stuff deleted asking about the adopt-a-highway program>

>It means that the sponsor is paying for litter removal on that
>particular stretch in exchange for the advertising provided by the
>sign.  The litter is still picked up by CalTrans employees.

Not Always.

I was sweating my butt off last Saturday on the northbound side of the
14 picking up trash with the Antelope Valley Corvette Club. Last time
I checked, I wasn't employed by Caltrans :). 

We were given a brief safety orientation by a Caltrans employee, then we
took his hard hats, vests, pickers, and trash bags and went to work. We
pretty much got everything that didn't require rock-climbing, except for
the ten trillion cigarette butts. We'll get those next time if someone
remembers to bring a broom and a dustpan (they were too small to get
with the pickers, and nobody had gloves). We're gonna attack the south-
bound side of our marked area of responsibility next month.

The sponsor can hire people (not necessarily Caltrans employees) to do
the cleaning, or if they're broke like we are, they'll pick up the trash
themselves. 

>What I'd like to know is this: if they can't find a sponsor, does 
>that mean the litter won't get picked up?
 
Caltrans crews are sent to maintain portions of the highway that aren't
sponsored.

{}{}{}{} neal (gaborno%valkris@hac2arpa.hac.com) 
{}{}{}{} Famous last words of the Antelope Valley resident in July:
{}{}{}{} "Yeah... but... (gasp)... it's a dry... (gulp) heat...." (thump)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos,rec.autos.driving,rec.travel
From: davelett@athena.mit.edu (Richard Sun)
Subject: Re: Alternatives to AAA?
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 06:58:17 GMT

Discover Card also offers some type of emergency road services.  To find
out more, call 1-800-DISCOVER
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: Re: Primary Offense Seat Belt Law on Wilson's Desk
Date: 24 Jul 92 21:51:29 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Distribution: ca
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA
Originator: daemon@sword.eng.pyramid.com

>In article <1992Jul21.045006.8964@informix.com> aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic) writes:
>>
>>If you're rear-ended at 90 MPH, unless you're in a Mercedes or equivalent,
>>you won't live to sue.  You should have seen the "60 Minutes" bit on seatback
>>failure last week...

In article <1992Jul23.064049.29971@csi.jpl.nasa.gov> eldred@rrunner.jpl.nasa.gov (Dan Eldred) writes:
>
>On the other hand, Indy car drivers more typically than not survive
>200 mph crashes with nothing more than bruises.  It indicates what is
>possible.


   So do NASCAR drivers...and the technology that keeps these folks
   more or less in one piece is WAY more adaptable to passenger
   cars.   

   How much do you think you would be willing to PAY for a NASCAR
   type protection which allows you to walk away from 150 mph
   crashes?


Xref: sparky ca.driving:1754 rec.autos:18123 rec.autos.driving:4485
From: aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Safe Driving
Date: 21 Jul 92 04:58:45 GMT
Followup-To: rec.autos.driving
Distribution: ca
Organization: The Hellen Keller-Bondurant High Performance Driving School for the Blind

In article <1992Jul15.212129.887@btree.uucp> hale@btree.uucp (Bob Hale) writes:
>In article <jimf.710618823@centerline.com> jimf@centerline.com (Jim Frost) writes:
>[ much deleted ]
>>Remember that 55mph doesn't make the roads safe, it saves gas.
>                                                     ^^^^^^^^^
>This is a common misconception.  Many modern cars (and a few older
>high-performance ones) get better mileage at 65-80 than they do
>at 55.
>Bob Hale                                      ...!ucsd!btree!hale

Exactly which cars are these?  Air resistance is the chief culprit in
mileage decrease at high speed.  I seriously doubt that any car has been
proven to get better mileage at 65-80 than 55.  Do you have any research 
that backs this claim?


--
Alan Denney      aland@informix.com      {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland

"How do you make a dog 'meow'?  You put it in the freezer for three days,
 take it out, and put it across a band saw.  'Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeooooooooooow'!"
    -- George Smilovich
Xref: sparky ca.driving:1779 rec.autos.driving:4625
From: aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Front license plates
Date: 25 Jul 92 20:24:38 GMT
Organization: The Helen Keller-Bondurant High Performance Driving School for the Blind

In article <collin.712018279@angelo> collin@angelo.amd.com (Collin K. Ong) writes:
>Is the front license plate legally necessary in California?

Yup. CVC $5200, $5201.

>I would like to leave it off cause it looks better off, is more aerodynamic,
>(and won't get taken by a front-only photo radar system).
>However, some of my friends claim to have been cited for not having the
>front plate.  What's the real deal?

Some people get away with it for years.  I have a friend who was cited on the
fourth day without the front plate.  As traffic fines in CA escalate by the
day, it's a question of how much you're willing to pay for the privilege.

--
Alan Denney      aland@informix.com      {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland

"Cities are among the most cosmopolitan places on Earth."
   -- Dianne Feinstein, addressing a conference on the future of cities at SCU
From: gaborno@oilpan.aero.org (Neal Gaborno 74-35 x62650)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: Front license plates --- $50 fine?
Date: 27 Jul 92 20:02:59 GMT
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Company, EDSG

I've been told that there is a fine of $50 that goes with this
infraction. Is this true? I got caught for this about five years
ago, and all I had to do is go to the CHP station and show that it
was mounted.


{}{}{}{} neal (gaborno%valkris@hac2arpa.hac.com) 
{}{}{}{} Famous last words of the Antelope Valley resident in July:
{}{}{}{} "Yeah... but... (gasp)... it's a dry... (gulp) heat...." (thump)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
From: dec@netcom.com (Dennis Chapman)
Subject: Re: Traffic Survey
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 92 00:18:40 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Distribution: ca

In article <1992Jul30.195008.5130@kronos.arc.nasa.gov> chucko@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Chuck Fry) writes:
>
>If you do this, try to avoid using radar.  Those of us with detectors
>will be fooled into doing the posted limit, rendering your survey
>inaccurate.  I believe speed can be checked by a variant of the
>pneumatic devices used to measure traffic counts by many local
>agencies.  This would be preferable in any case, since it is
>unattended and can work round the clock.
>

  I believe that some surveys have been taken by the tow-along radar-emitting
speed annunciator.  You may have seen one of these beasts, a trailer holding
a large sign stating "YOU ARE TRAVELING AT xx MPH", where xx is your current
speed.  I would think it would be quite easy to add some type of recording
device to one of these.
  There was one which was moved around to a few different locations within
the San Lorenzo Valley this past spring.  Some time later, CA Highway Patrol
setup some speeder shooting galleries at these very same spots.
  There was an ironic outcome of a survey along Graham Hill Rd, between
Santa Cruz and Felton.  The survey indicated that the average speed was 37mph
in the 25mph zone.  To permit the use of radar to catch the speeders, the
limit would need to be raised to 35, reflecting the results of the survey.
The neighborhood got the local supervisor to keep the limit at 25 arguing
that the higher limit would encourage people to drive even faster. The
outcome is radar can't be used to catch speeders along this section of road.

> -- Chuck Fry  Chucko@charon.arc.nasa.gov
>    Ardent fan of appropriate speed limits

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Dennis Chapman             See with your ears, listen with your eyes
dec@netcom.com                                           - Ken Kesey
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: ca.driving
From: black@beach.csulb.edu (Matthew Black)
Subject: Re: Primary Offense Seat Belt Law on Wilson's Desk
Organization: Computer Engineering, CSU Long Beach
Distribution: ca
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 15:45:33 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.045006.8964@informix.com> aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic) writes:

>In article <18839@fritz.filenet.com> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk) writes:
>>...
>>Ie, if I'm driving in my car, following all the rules (except the belt
>>rule), and get rear-ended by a drunk going 90mph, I want to still be
>>able to sue the drunk who is clearly wrong.  Perhaps I can't sue for the
>>same damages as had I been wearing a belt, but not precluded totally.

>If you're rear-ended at 90 MPH, unless you're in a Mercedes or equivalent,
>you won't live to sue.  You should have seen the "60 Minutes" bit on seatback
>failure last week...


>--
>Alan Denney  #  aland@informix.com  #  {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland

> "The driver says, 'One more cup of coffee and I'll be all right...'
>  'Pop a Bennie, another Bennie'..."             - The Bobs, "Bus Plunge"

What "60 Minutes" failed to mention is that the seatbacks of the
Mercedes collapse at a few miles higher.  Do you know of any reclining
automobile seats that can survive a 60mph rear-end smacker?  I think not!
********************************************************************************
Matthew Black                             *    The opionions expressed are mine.
Computer Engineering & Computer Science   *    No warranty whatsoever whether
California State University               *    express or implied is hereby
Long Beach, CA  90840                     *    conveyed.
Xref: sparky ca.driving:1830 rec.autos:18905 rec.autos.driving:4707 rec.travel:10965
From: asylvain@felix.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos,rec.autos.driving,rec.travel
Subject: Re: Alternatives to AAA?
Date: 31 Jul 92 16:57:12 GMT
Reply-To: asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Organization: Foundation for the Increased Wealth of Chipmunks

Written in article <1992Jul30.193808.17715@adobe.com>
 by usenet@adobe.com (USENET NEWS):

: I've been less than thrilled with AAA for some time, especially
: in light of their reputation as an auto insurance company. I
: switched my auto insurance to Kemper several years ago, but I 
: am still a member of the AAA auto club, primarily to have
: emergency road service.
:
: Are there other large, well-established auto clubs offering
: this kind of service throughout the U.S.?

Well, my dad belongs to the National Auto Club (NAC).

Monkey Wards has an auto-club now, and they used to bombard me with
requests to join.  Thinking about it, it's been some time since I've
been bombarded by them, so who knows.

Shell, Chevron, and any number of other oil companies have their own
versions of auto-clubs.

OR, you can just buy a Mercedes-Benz or a Cadillac, and get free
road-side service that way ... !!

-- 
The Chipmunk.
Opinions are mine, batteries not included, void where prohibited.
A real patriot is the fellow who gets a parking ticket and rejoices
that the system works.
Xref: sparky ca.driving:1811 rec.autos.driving:4691
From: levine@dinsdale.ics.uci.edu (David Levine)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Front license plates
Date: 30 Jul 92 17:06:45 GMT

Dean Woodward writes:

>3.  If a car is designed and built without a place to put a front plate, then
>    they can't require you to have one. (The '84 & newer Corvettes as my
>    example.)

California requires display of both the front and rear license plates
[CVC 5200], period.  No mention of an exception is made for cars
designed and built without a place to put the front plate.  BTW, I
find it hard to believe that GM would sell such a car in the U.S.; can
an owner of an '84+ Corvette confirm that there is no provision for
mounting a front license plate?

>    there is a Federal law regarding side marker lights, so all cars *do* have
>    to have those, except older cars that weren't built with them (some
>    pre-70's Camaros, I can't remember which year.)

1968 model year:  side marker lights required
1969 model year:  side marker reflectors required (lights optional?)
1970 and later model years:  side marker lights _and_ reflectors required

(1967 Camaros don't have side marker lights or reflectors.)

to accept the universal responsibility of doing | David L. Levine
good to all sentient beings, and if that is not | Internet: levine@ics.uci.edu
possible, to do no harm                         | UUCP: ...!uunet!ucivax!levine
  -- paraphrased from the Fourteenth Dalai Lama | BITNET: levine@uci
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos.driving
From: helfman@aero.org (Robert S. Helfman)
Subject: Re: Front license plates
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 04:51:07 GMT

In article <collin.712018279@angelo> collin@angelo.amd.com (Collin K. Ong) writes:
>Is the front license plate legally necessary in California?
>
>I would like to leave it off cause it looks better off, is more aerodynamic,
>(and won't get taken by a front-only photo radar system).
>However, some of my friends claim to have been cited for not having the
>front plate.  What's the real deal?

Yes, a front plate is legally required. Yes, they're ugly, particularly
on some cars.

Here's the simplest solution: Keep the plate in the trunk.
Use bolts with wing-nuts so you can easily re-install it if you get
stopped. My  1977 BMW 320i looked just awful with its front plate because
the 10mph bumper stuck out so far. Every time I was stopped I would offer
to put the plate on, and each time the cop went along with it, although
they would always run a make on the car. (They always assert that having
one plate makes them suspect the car is stolen.)

Once I was stopped by a Manhattan Beach motorcycle cop who followed me
for nearly a mile before stopping me just for the missing plate. I was
just west of Inglewood Avenue (the boundary with Lawndale) when he
stopped me. I offered to replace the plate, and installed it while he
ran the make on his radio. When he said he was happy and I could go, I
drove across the street, stopped the car, got out and removed the plate,
put it back in the trunk, smiled and waved at him, and drove
away. He was not amused, but there wasn't shit he could do about it.

The only problem with having no front plate is that you are always
giving the Man 'probable cause' for a stop. Admittedly, they can always
find SOMETHING to stop you for, but having no front plate is just
giving them carte blanche. (Incidentally, an L.A. Sheriff's watch commander
at the Lennox station told me that he hates having his front plate 
on his Porsche because it's ugly, and that he gets stopped all the 
time in Manhattan Beach because of it. Guess I wasn't alone!)
  

Newsgroups: ca.driving
From: slagle@lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Slagle)
Subject: Re: Front license plates
Reply-To: slagle@lmsc.lockheed.com
Followup-To: ca.driving
In-reply-to: antoniou@buitc.bu.edu's message of 28 Jul 92 16:28:18 GMT
Organization: You wouldn't ask this if you'd seen my desk.
	<1992Jul28.062018.8056@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> <92101@bu.edu>
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 06:56:54 GMT

In article <92101@bu.edu>, antoniou@buitc.bu.edu (George Antoniou) writes:

> In article <1992Jul28.062018.8056@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> mperlman@nyx.cs.du.edu (Marshal "Airborne" Perlman) writes:

>>your car comes by 4 times (i think) in an hour..you are leagally crusing...
>>but then agian..just say "HI..WE'RE DUMB AND LOST"

> What is legally cruising...???

No, he said "leagally" cruising.  That's cruising according
to the league rules of the National Cruising and Gawking 
League.  It's only a demonstration sport this year, but
will have medal status at the 96 games.  Hi..we're dumb
and lost...
--
----
Mark E. Slagle                                 PO Box 61059
slagle@lmsc.lockheed.com                       Sunnyvale, CA   94088
408-756-0895                                   USA
From: alehecka@sdcc13.ucsd.edu (Augustin Lehecka)
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: Re: pre-oiler
Date: 23 Jul 92 20:32:34 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: University of California, San Diego

If you get a copy of 'Hot Rod' magazine, you will find the add.
The usefulness of pre-oilers is debatable though.  All the 
motor oils on the market are very viscous and stick to inner 
surfaces of the engine, therefore, there is no such thing as 
a 'dry start' unless you have not driven your car for years.
I believe you can protect your engine better by using synthetic
oils.
						AUGUSTINE
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
From: geraghty@emba-news.uvm.edu.UUCP (Kevin M Geraghty)
Subject: Re: Safe Driving
Originator: geraghty@newton.emba.uvm.edu
Organization: University of Vermont -- Division of EMBA Computer Facility
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 13:20:21 GMT

From article <1992Jul21.024512.4149@scifi.uucp>, by njs@scifi.uucp (Nicholas J. Simicich):
> In article <iVRcNB7w165w@major.panix.com> dos@major.panix.com (Dave O'Shea) writes:
>>jdonsbac@cvbnet.prime.com (Jeff Donsbach x4365 5-2) writes:
>>
>>> In article <22202@hacgate.UUCP>, kemasa@ipld01.hac.com (Kemasa) writes:
>>> 
>>> > What is the difference between 65 and 70 when the speed limit is 55?
>>> 
>>> In Massachusetts, $50.00. ;-)
>>In New York, $150 and 20 days in prison. No shit.

Right.  New York has a prison overcrowding problem. So they're going
to release all the muggers and rapists 
early to make room for the really hardened criminals:  drivers who go
over 70 on 55mph freeways.