HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: @moci.uucp
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Organization: ICOM, Inc., West Allis, WI
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 92 02:16:49 GMT
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes:
: In article <1992Aug30.175116.4493@ra.msstate.edu> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
: > In article <Yk5Ar*LT0@caleb.UUCP> jdp@caleb.UUCP (Jim Pritchett) writes:
: > >In article <1992Aug22.042013.16635@kas.helios.mn.org>, Rob Healey writes:
: > >
: > >> 	The 3000T '040 ad in byte this month was sad because it showed
: > >> 	how far behind the times Amiga really is. On one page you
: > >> 	had the 3000T '040 for $5998.00. 5 pages later you have a DELL
: > >> 	33Mhz 486 system that can do more for $2699.00. It's sad really
: > >
: > >I think that the 040 is faster than the 486.  What do you mean by "do more?"
: >
: > More apps, more expansion boards, more colors, more pixels, more HD,
: > more RAM, more...
: >
: 
: Since that Dell comes with Win 3.1 and DOS 5 factory installed, more means
: the standard windows applications/accessories that come with - including term
: program, audio digitizing software, midi player, prowrite caliber WP program,
: etc.

Besides the WP, the rest is garbage unless you have the hardware. Term
programs under MS Windows are worthless. 

: 
: What can you do with an Amiga right out of the box?  Not much.  You can
: edit text files with andy finkel's EMacs (if it's still part of the OS
: distribution)...

What can you do with DOS on a PeeCee right out of the box? What in the world
can you do with a PeeCee with MS Windows right out of the box? At least with
an Amiga you get a decent OS.

: 
: > Skip Sauls
: > skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
: >
: >
: >
: 
: --
: Amiga programmer of: GRn, MailMinder, Budokan, Beyond Dark Castle, Dark Castle
: Sega Genesis programmer of: Dick Tracy and Marble Madness.
: Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
: 1124 Fremont Ave.
: Los Altos, CA 94024
: 
-- 
|      //                           |                                       |
|     //  Jerry Ponko               |    ICOM, Inc.        (414) 321-8000   |
| \\ //  (jerry, root, postmaster)  |    2424 S. 102nd St.                  |
|  \X/   UUCP: ...uwm!moci!root     |    West Allis, WI 53227               |
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: dtiberio@libws1.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio)
Subject: Re: NEW AMIGAS!
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 14:33:23 GMT

In article <u894776.715409035@bruny> u894776@bruny.cc.utas.edu.au (James McCoull) writes:
>NEW AMIGAS? NO! NEW ARCHIMEDES! FROM THE LOW END TO THE HIGH END!
>
>
>Also feel free to contact me for further information on these machines!
>
>PS: I am only posting this for the folks who may have heard about the new
>amiga machines... and are dissapointed.
>
>James McCoull  u894776@bruny.cc.utas.edu.au

	Since when is it up to you to decide that people are upset
about a machine that is not released yet? Did you say the same about the
Archimeded a week before it was released? Everyone seems to think that 
CBM is releasing new machines next week. They won't be upset or happy
until then. And my horoscope says that I will be greatly releaved on
the 11th of the month...hopefully either from CBM's new machines
being released that day or because I win my lawsuit on the 10th. I am
hoping for the second though....

	Not that I believe my horoscope anyway. I just happened to glance
at the page today while doing the crossword. 



-- 
      //   David Tiberio  SUNY Stony Brook 516-473-5156 AMIGA  DDD-MEN   
     //  bounce-resistant:    dtiberio%libserv1.ic.sunysb.edu@sunysb.edu
   \X/	    Perot for President 1-516-399-2259 Long Island, New York

 	PPPP  EEEEE RRRR   OOO  TTTTT    IIIII N   N      999  2222
	P   P E     R   R O   O   T        I   NN  N     9   9     2
	PPPP  EEEE  RRRR  O   O   T        I   N N N      9999  222
 	P     E     R R   O   O   T        I   N  NN         9 2
 	P     EEEEE R  R   OOO    T      IIIII N   N     9999  22222
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: Unreal demo, blah
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 18:45:07 GMT
X-Posted-From: connection.prospect.com
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

rjc@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Ray) writes:
>
>but Unreal is no match for demos
>like Hardwired, Unreal is pathetic in comparison.
>

Unreal is also one of the first few PC EuroDemos.  Give 'em time.

>
>The fact that it takes
>a 486 to get any real demo performance out of SVGA shows the
>efficiency of using stupid frame buffers for something as complex
>as a demo.
>

Unreal runs at full speed on my 386.

>
>I know from personal experience how hard it is to
>do a simple half-screen sin-wave scroller on the PC (even using
>the so-called special tricks like mode 13h)
>

I can see already how much you know.  Mode 13h is not a special trick; it's
just the standard VGA 320x200 256-color graphics mode.  The 8-bit planar
modes like X and Y are the special tricks.
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jseymour@medar.com (James Seymour)
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
Organization: Medar, Inc.     Farmington Hills, MI
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 23:53:47 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.182429.6852@klaava.Helsinki.FI> lindblad@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Jarkko Lindblad) writes:
>jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>: In article <BtM61A.Bs@starnine.com> mikeh@starnine.com (Mike Haas) writes:
>: >>

[Lotsa oft-repeated machine, o/s, && cpu debating (?) deleted]

>
>Okay, if I now add my commet to this we're surely on our way to the
>4535464th CPU war. Perhaps it is better if I save us lot's of
>bandwidth and don't start to proove you that 68k-series is
>be...oops...I almost started the war....better stop now....stop it
>Jarkko, stop stop sopt. Stop. Huh, finally I managed to stop myself.
>Damn, I'm thirsty.
>

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

*This* is what really makes reading this newsgroup worth wading thru
all of the oft-repeated machine, o/s, && cpu debating.

>--
>Jarkko Lindblad
>lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi

-- 
Jim Seymour				| "If NT is the answer, it must
...uunet!medar!jseymour			|  be a really silly question"
jseymour@medar.com			|      Warner Losh
CIS: 72730,1166  GEnie: jseymour	|      Computer Power Software
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 15:02:44 GMT
X-Posted-From: connection.prospect.com
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz (John Bickers) writes:
>
>>>Big deal.  An Amiga 500 does the same.  How about with a ray trace
>>>happening in the background?
>
>> Never tried it.  Have you?  Didn't think so.
>
>    Some combinations I have tried on the Amiga with no editor
>    degradation are:
>
> [various multitasking examples]
>

Your point in posting these?

>
>    I have never done (or personally seen done) even one of these
>    things on a PC, despite working in an office full of PCs.
>

I see.  So that means that a PC can't do these things, right?

>>
>> It still isn't even close to OS/2 in terms of functionality.
>
>    This is like saying that it doesn't even come close to duct tape
>    in terms of functionality.
>

I didn't realize "duct tape" was an OS.  What machine does it run on?

>
>> Why would you need drivers for an OS that's so chained to specific hardware?
>> If you were just a little less ignorant, you'd know that there's no need for
>> drivers in a system that doesn't support device independence.
>
>    The generic hardware comes with drivers that are already
>    installed. For example, the serial.device driver comes with the
>    machine. If you don't use an external serial board, then that's
>    all you'll need.
>

The point, please?  All PC operating systems are the same way.

>
>*** John Bickers, TAP, NZAmigaUG.        jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz ***
>
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: Chris_Millar@lppl.mi.org (Chris Millar)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Commodore meltdown?! 
Distribution: world
Date: 27 Aug 92 17:01:27 EST
Organization: Les's Place BBS

Ouch!

-- Via DLG Pro v0.992

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: haley@unixg.ubc.ca (Ross MacGregor)
Subject: Re: IFF database of .advocacy folks
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 23:18:48 GMT

In <1992Aug30.203942.14211@ra.msstate.edu> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:

>I have the source code for 2 or 3 IFF viewers for MS-DOS and the results on
>a VGA display are as good as a flicker-fixed Amiga.  Also, the SOX program
>will convert IFF sounfiles to a SoundBlaster format, so it should be no

Where can I find this SOX program?  Is it available via ftp?

Thanks.
-- 
Ross MacGregor           |  These views are my own and can be considered 
haley@unixg.ubc.ca       |  absolute truth.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: barrett@scooby.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Best rumor of the week!!
Date: 31 Aug 92 02:04:15 GMT
Reply-To: barrett@scooby.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett)
Organization: BLAZEMONGER INCORPORATED


	I heard a rumor that "Jeff Young" is actually an assumed name
that Irving Gould uses when he wants to post to USENET.  Any truth
to this?

	If you post a reply, please be sure to omit all definite and
indefinite articles ("a", "an", "the") and every other preposition.

                                                        Dan

 //////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
| Dan Barrett -- Dept of Computer Science, Lederle Graduate Research Center |
| University of Massachusetts, Amherst, MA  01003  --  barrett@cs.umass.edu |
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\/////////////////////////////////////
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling)
Subject: Re: Slu Aspiks vs Jeff Young
Organization: North Carolina State University
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 07:34:36 GMT

gfm@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (George Francis McBay) writes:
>kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling) writes:
>>Lighten up, Slu!  I don't think too many people take Jeff seriously.
>
>	Yes, but either:
>
>	o Jeff is Serious
>       o His scam is quite complex

Too hard to tell in this group!  I'm beginning to think that Skip is Jeff ;-)

In any case, it's wrong to make fun of anyone's general English.  (Longtime 
readers have noticed time and again that people usually resort to making 
personal attacks whenever they don't have a good counterargument.)

And if Jeff is serious, then at least his postings are usually so wildly
fanatical that it's hard to believe anyone can't find humor in them :)
Even when they contain absolute garbage, or some painful bits of truth.

cheers - kevin <kdarling@catt.ncsu.edu>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: don@chopin.udel.edu (Donald R Lloyd)
Subject: Re: Atari Falcon Discount Supermachine
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 20:19:01 GMT

 Chris_Millar@lppl.mi.org (Chris Millar) writes:
>
>
>Funny that you mention that you wish C= had come out with a 
>console version of the Amiga - there was a proliferation of rumors 
>that Atari had an ST game system in the works - this was around 
>1987 or 1988 - Then in 1991 Atari showed several game developers a 
>

     Actually their were rumors about an Amiga-based console machine from
CBM some time ago also, but it never materialized.

>What do you mean by "resorting to third party hacks" in reference 
>to TOS?  There have been no third party hacks to TOS - except for 
>Warp 9.........otherwise, it's been original all the way through.  

      I think he was referring to MiNT, which, if I'm not mistaken, is
a third party product...

>I expect that you have never seen TOS 2 or TOS 3 - I doubt it, 
>makes the old TOS's look like kid's stuff............

     Which shouldn't have been too difficult :-)
     Admittedly, though, th same can be said for AmigaOS <= 1.3 vs
AmigaOS >= 2.0.0

>I said LOW END DTP - Atari's main DTP platform is the TT - it has 
>a VME bus and 1280x960 monochrome resolution.  Regardless, the 
>processor direct slot can take just about anything it wants - in 
>fact Jim Allen (maker of the Tiny Turbo and Turbo030 boards for 
>ST's) is already done with the design of a board that will add a 
>50Mhz 68030 and a driver for 1152x870 monochrome resolution - 
>reason being, that "Mac" mono mode is supported by pretty 
>inexpensive monitors - and is somewhat of a Mac standard.  BTW, 
>this isn't rumor - it's fact.
>
>Actually, max res is 768x480................

     Great.  My ECS A3000 can do 1280x400 now in 4 of 64 colors.  With
an A2024 monitor, I could do 1280x800 in 16 shades of grey without having
to buy extra hardware (other than the monitor) to do it. 
     To borrow your phrase, "This isn't rumor - it's fact".  The same is
true of several 50MHz '030 boards for various Amiga models that have been 
shipping for some time, as well as '040s (even for the 500!), etc.



-- 
Don Lloyd                / "...my brain IBM; so if you see me acting strangely,\
don@chopin.udel.edu      \ don't be surprised." - Styx, 'Mr. Roboto'           /
Gibberish is Spoken Here.          Publications Editor, AmigaNetwork 
      MicroSoft Slogan: Resistance is Futile.  You Will Be Assimilated.
From: Chris_Millar@lppl.mi.org (Chris Millar)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Atari Falcon Discount Supermachine  Re: Sydnes is gone?!!
Distribution: world
Date: 31 Aug 92 00:25:56 EST
Organization: Les's Place BBS

>hypertext is becoming the standard form of documentation through
AmigaGuide
I KNOW what hyper-text is - any fool does........I am more refering to the
massive tome that accompanies Windoze 3.1 - it's a full length novel, and
if you don't read it, you fumble around for a long time!


-- Via DLG Pro v0.992
From: ggiles@cie.uoregon.edu (Gregg Giles)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: A4000 Specs? Who knows.
Date: 1 Sep 92 02:19:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: nntp.1992Sep1.021924.15396
Organization: University of Oregon Campus Information Exchange

In article <1992Aug31.015904.19379@leland.Stanford.EDU> torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie) writes:
>
>  Actually, especially at the low-end, I can see lots of opportunity
>for a machine which has just a floppy and a CD-ROM.  You can stick
>600MB of stuff on that CD-ROM, and if you allow machines to run
>from read-only devices, there would be a great market for 
>pre-made CD-ROM disks which come with the operating system and
>games/applications already set up on disk.  Why do you need more
>than a floppy disk to store your letters/check accounts on?

   Why? Convenience. I got sick of searching for certain disks years ago.
If someone needs a CD-ROM, then chances are pretty good that they already
own a hard disk. The days of the disk-only computer are gone: hard disks are
standard on most computers. (Besides, the slow access time of CD-ROMs hardly
make them a viable alternative to a hard drive right now.)
   Trust me. I work with CD-ROM daily.


-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregg Giles (Dynamix, Inc.)                 BIX: ggiles 
All opinions expressed are my own.          Internet: ggiles@cie.uoregon.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene)
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000 & HYPE!
Organization: University of New Hampshire  -  Durham, NH
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 22:20:33 GMT

>I have a Quadra on my desk at work. It is impressive, for a Mac. The 040 in
>it almost makes the Mac OS as fast as my 030 Amiga at home. Except that it
>still does not multitask.
>
>All I can say is, if anyone can use an Amiga, and then be happy with a Mac
>or a PC, then they were not using the Amiga right!

	Speaking as someone who has owned both an Amiga and a PC, its really
   not that difficult to be happy using a PC after an Amiga.  After all, OS/2
   multitasks just as good as the AmigaOS.

							G.Greene
From: barrett@astro.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Product opinions
Date: 4 Sep 92 18:56:44 GMT
Reply-To: barrett@astro.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett)
Distribution: usa
Organization: BLAZEMONGER INCORPORATED

In article <1992Sep4.134513.25869@lonex.rl.af.mil> kopackm@lonex.rl.af.mil (Michael A. Kopack) writes:
>1) If C= had planned on releasing KS3.0 this month, why did they even bother
>making 2.1?

	I doubt they'll release KS 3.0 this month, but I bet they'll announce
it.  On the other hand, 2.1 is probably ready for release.  2.1 enhances
2.0, and 3.0 adds support for the new graphics chips.  If this is true, then
it makes sense to me.

>2) Where the heck does the A600 fit in the big picture of things?

	A multi-million-seller game machine?  The C64 of the 1990's?

>3) when is C= gonna get the picture and stop producing machines with OLD
>processors. I mean, the 68000 was really good back in '85 and '86, but the
>thing just doesn't hack it today.

	I agree.  I suspect Commodore knows that plenty of games don't run
on the 68020/30/40 due to illegal programming practices, so they are keeping
the 68000 in the low-end machines so the game players will be happy.  Just my
guess.

>7) Everyone keeps complaining that the AA chip machines should be backwards
>compatable with the older machines. Do I hear the old 640K MS-Dos nemesis
>lurking??

	Not at all.  Making the AA chips compatible just means emulating
the old chipset, so your old software will run correctly.  I don't think
that's bad.  Would you prefer to buy new software?

>8) VM should be included and I'll be downright pissed if it's not in 3.0!!

	Fine with me, as long as it can be turned on and off.  I'd rather
have memory protection than VM anyday.  I have yet to run out of RAM (with 10
MB), but individual programs can still crash the computer, so MP is more
important to me.

>10) They must be joking with the price of the A3000T! Crap, I think I'll
>just go buy an 040 accelerator for my A500! I can do one hell of an upgrade
>hack for $6000. Anybody interested??? I'll take your money!!!!

	"List prices" are meaningless.  I don't think consumers will have to
pay $6000 for an '040 A3000T.

                                                        Dan

 //////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
| Dan Barrett -- Dept of Computer Science, Lederle Graduate Research Center |
| University of Massachusetts, Amherst, MA  01003  --  barrett@cs.umass.edu |
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\/////////////////////////////////////
From: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: A4000 Specs? Who knows.
Date: 31 Aug 92 14:41:54 GMT
Reply-To: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Organization: Flying Cat, Inc.

In article <1992Aug30.224805.29041@nntp.uoregon.edu> ggiles@cie.uoregon.edu (Gregg Giles) writes:
>In article <1992Aug30.194513.12500@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N Barrett) writes:
>   What amazes me is this: Commodore hasn't announced anything, and you are
>already flaming them for things they've never done. Can't you just keep your
>mouth shut until September like the rest of us? Come on, give us a rest.

Hey, that's nothing.  A couple weeks after 2.0 was released, Marc
posted a two page rant about 2.0 Notepad.  About how terrible it was.
And why did C= waste time on it anyway.  And why was it in the operating
system anyway.  And so on.

The only point his post missed was that there was (and is) _no_ 2.0 Notepad.


>Gregg Giles (Dynamix, Inc.)                 BIX: ggiles 


			andy

-- 
andy finkel		{uunet|rutgers|amiga}!cbmvax!andy

"Some people think MS-DOS is a necessary evil.  They are wrong.  MS-DOS
 is _not_ necessary."


Any expressed opinions are mine; but feel free to share.
I disclaim all responsibilities, all shapes, all sizes, all colors.
From: jsg@ccs.northeastern.edu (Jonas S Green)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
Date: 27 Aug 92 09:26:25 GMT
Organization: Comp. Sci. @ NU


Quoting Various Peope ::

>> I can tell you what I'm going to be doing - I'm going to buy one of the new
>> systems when they appear (assuming the price is reasonable).  I plan on using
>> Amigas for years to come, and look forward to the introduction of new
>> technologies, such as RTG, in the not-too-distant future.
>>
>> Maybe I'm an optimist, but that's the plan.

Atari seems to have reappered with the new Falcon. They are showing it off at
the September Boston Computer Society General meeting. Fortunately, I have 
learned my lesson from the Amiga, and will not jump into this platform. 

Also C= early buyers seem to be getting screwed quite a bit. Witness:

 Early A3000 owners:         OS 2.00 + 40 MB HD
 Early A2000HD owners:       2090A PC Hard Drive, not SCSI
 Early A2500   owners:       68020 card instead of a 68030.

>Sorry, but you sound like you want to chain yourself into a dead end.  FWIW,
>OS/2 is as much of a dead end, at least for now.

For now OS/2 seems to be a much better solution than DOS 5 and/or Windows 3.1,
I have not played with OS/2 long enough to tell, however. If I were to buy a
Intel CPU now, I would probably go with OS/2. 

>> >Read what I wrote:  OS/2 apps ARE AmigaOS apps.  I have seen both, know
>> >both from a technical perspective, and I know they are the same.

Could you elaborate on this a bit? I have programmed in AmigaDOS quite a bit.
I know all about the various libraries & devices you have to open. In what ways
are they similar to OS/2?
From: aces@mcode.amdahl.com (Jeffrey D. Smith)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: More AmigaWorld Lies
Date: 3 Sep 92 14:36:28 GMT
Reply-To: jds30@amail.amdahl.com
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale Ca.

In article <1992Sep3.070214.21249@news.iastate.edu>, barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N Barrett) writes:
[lotsa stupid stuff deleted]

Marc, will you please SHUT UP?!  Take it to .advocacy