From: panlilio@acs.ucalgary.ca (Victor P. Panlilio)
Subject: Re: Elle MacPherson causes rape?
Summary: More LAUGHABLE conspiracy theories
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 92 08:59:24 GMT
Expires: Mon, 30 Nov 1992 05:00:00 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta
Keywords: PC bullshit
Followup-To: alt.supermodels

In article <1992Nov6.030057.28538@dragon.acadiau.ca> 891666t@dragon.acadiau.ca (Trish Turliuk) writes:

Responding to the discussion about women's insecurities...

> No. I disagree with that. If a person is constantly told that
> they are not smart not thin enough..etc etc that person
> ultimately develops (unless you can totally block it out,
> become untrusting, a poor listener and generally more cold
> hearted) some sort of insecurity.

Depends who's doing the telling. If, say, your parents call you a
stupid, fat, ugly brat all the time, then you're *likely* to grow
up not feeling very good about yourself. That doesn't mean all of
society is to blame for your parents' emotionally abusing you!

Also, you do not need to block out stuff or become untrusting to
get past the BS. All you need to do is recalibrate your BS-meter.

This is usually called growing up and taking responsibility...

8^)

>The same goes for the idea(l)s reinforced in today's society by advertising,
>fashion, tv/movies. Advertising is especially the worst- we are constantly
>told what is wrong with us. Hell, I didn't even know what 'ring around the 
>collar' was until I saw an ad saying to watch out for its evil presence. 

Um. Ring around the collar is like ring around the bathtub --
disgusting, advertising or no advertising. If you don't like
advertising, there's a simple, elegant solution: IGNORE IT!

But I think ignoring the ring won't make *it* go away....

8^)

Unless, of course, it's the kind that goes around your finger.
That one usually fetches a tidy sum, and much else besides...

And who said diamonds were a girl's best friend, hmmm? One of
those sexist, manipulative, capitalist-leech gem companies that
exploits blacks in South Africa so we can have fancy cut glass?

While men slave away so they can *afford* to buy these things?

Hey, maybe I can offend EVERY persecuted group in one posting!

8^)

(Take one part tongue-in-cheek, sprinkle liberally around...)

>Ads targetted at women are constantly trying to make us want to strive for
>the unattainable body, face, hair, legs .... We see pictures of the so-called

Unattainable? Says who? I happen to photograph fashion models and
"real" women all the time, and *both* types are beautiful. If any
of you think everyone has to look like, say, Christy Turlington or
Paulina, then you're the ones with the REAL problem. When we grow
up we are supposed to be able to distinguish between fantasy and
reality, right?  People who can't, or won't, should seek help. In
my experience, the models are "real" people, too, just prettier.

I guess that's part of the reason I enjoy being around them so...

8^)

>perfect bodies- a 5% population of women whose pictures are air-brushed to

Sheesh. Perfect bodies? Hee-haw. As I've written elsewhere, even
a supermodel like Claudia Schiffer has unshapely legs and a very
pronounced overbite. Lauren Hutton (remember her?) has gap teeth.
Cheryl Tiegs has thin lips. Cindy Crawford has a crooked smile.

The list goes on and on. Get the picture? *Nobody's* perfect.

8^)

>eradicate any 'flaw' and after seeing thousands upon thousands of such photos,
>women look at themselves in the mirror and feel that they can't compare.

Women look at *themselves* in the mirror, and more likely see a
balding, paunchy, middle-aged man standing behind them, a man who
may very likely be having an affair with someone younger, sexier,
and more enthusiastic in bed, because they have deep, unresolved
problems with their self-identity and their relationship, which
won't be fixed by getting a facelift or a new wardrobe, either.

>But the ads tell us we can do it. Don't stop striving. Buy this new x and it
>will help.

>Bullshit.

Well, if you see past the advertising hype, what's the problem?
Others may not? That's THEIR problem, not yours. You may as well
advocate censorship if you don't want to see that type of stuff.

>I want to see a real woman.

I see them everywhere! Look at the so-called "lifestyle" ads, in
print and on television. I've been studying ads for both content
and presentation since I was in grade school in the early 70's,
and ads serve as a cultural barometer, and a very good one, too.

I even see more and more men appearing with babies, nowadays...

8^)

>Did you know that women has hair under her arms that grows- just like men?

Sure. But if she wants to shave it, that's HER prerogative. If
the prevailing aesthetic is such that this is considered highly
desirable, then significant numbers of women will likely choose
to shave their armpits, because doing so makes them that much
more attractive, especially to males they want to be with...

8^)

Pray tell, what on earth is wrong with that?

(It sure helps to sell more diamond engagement rings, though!)

>Women also have it on their legs.

And usually on their pubic mounds, and on their heads, and on
their arms, and above their upper lips...ta da ta da ta da...

8^)

Unless you happen to be Sinead O'Connor in a depilatory frenzy.

This reminds me of a joke:

"She has *everything* a man could want -- muscles, a moustache,
 and even some hair on her chest!"

*snort* *groan* *cough* *gasp* *wheeze* (rolling on the floor)

Hey, and guess what? I didn't even inhale! Bwahahahahahahahaha!

(Any of you out there with hair on the soles of your feet?)

*grunt* *urghh*...(oops, I think we got the wrong species here!)

>Women burp and fart and take big shits in the toilet.

Need we state the obvious? Such indelicacy is dismaying, sort of
like publicly stating that one picks one's nose and eats boogers.

8^)

There is such a thing as poor taste, after all, and some people
are so utterly devoid of grace and refinement that they cannot be
tolerated in polite company, even by the kindest, hardiest souls.

>Women get bags under their eyes when they are tired.
> "    have bad breath in the morning.
> "  can have any sized/shaped breast, bum, leg, nose, lip, ear...

Blah blah blah blah blah...and if it's something that *can* be
helped, what's wrong with having a choice? If one doesn't have
any choice in the matter, that's a different story altogether.

Personally, I'd use an effective toothpaste and mouthwash, and
I'd floss regularly, if morning breath was a genuine concern.

8^)

Let's hear it for choice! Choice in what mouthwash we'll use!

(Comrade, use only the approved mouthwash, or risk punishment!)

>The fact is we see *one-type* of women portrayed everywhere as the idealized
>women and even this isn't a real type for she is subjected to hours of makeup
>and airbrushing before she goes in front of the camera. The majority of women

Baloney. I work in this business, and some of the models I have
photographed go practically barefaced or with very little makeup.
Of course, these are the ones who have good skin to begin with.

Are we going to condemn them for having been so fortunate, hmmm?

Go ahead. Cast the first stone. I dare you! I double-dare you!

(Victor gets into a heavily reinforced bunker, just in case)

8^)

>don't see themselves reflected in society at all. How many models have you  
>seen with crooked teeth?

Lots, in person. Bad teeth abound in this business. For example,
you NEVER see Paulina smile. Neither does Stephanie Seymour...

But the distance from Paulina's hairline to the midpoint between
her eyebrows, and from there to the tip of her nose, and from
there to the tip of her chin -- well, now we're talking EQUAL!

(Did any of you know this particular criterion for "beauty"?)

And this was pointed out to me by none other than...a woman!

(and a pretty ardent feminist, at that! And yes, she's straight)

8^)

>The message we're fed is that

Need we eat everything that is put before us? Is there a menu?

>we should be that *type* of person for she is BEAUTY and this keeps women 
>striving and feeling inadequate for she can never be air-brushed nor part of
>the unrealistic (and socially constructed) 5%. 
>
>Trish

That's the message that *YOU* are reading into it, and perhaps
many other uncritical thinkers suffer from an inability to see
past the hype and the bullshit. Advertisers sell dreams, and it
is dreams that keep human beings striving for goals. We would be
very impoverished if we could not celebrate beauty for the sake
of sparing the feelings of an insecure mass of people who envy
those who're more fortunate than they are in their natural gifts.

*I* don't blame *anyone* for the fact that I don't look like the
Marlboro Man or Mel Gibson or Hunk-What's-His-Name, so why should
*anyone* get upset if not all women look like Christy or Cindy?

All this conspiracy-theory stuff is getting *REALLY* tiresome.

Sheesh. What a *typical* example of muddleheaded PC-thinking!

Our Mother in Heaven, spare us this agony...

Victor 8^)

(who will state for the record that hordes of women howled and
hooted for his friend, one of the male models in last night's
lingerie fashion show, to TAKE IT ALL OFF -- so there you go!)
Newsgroups: alt.supermodels