From: CX6L <CX6L@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: Re: Thoughts on GURPS
Organization: McGill University
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 16:58:20 GMT

In article <2B64AF5E.20190@ics.uci.edu> mmadsen@bonnie.ics.uci.edu (Matt Madsen) writes:

>In article <25JAN93.21297613.0159@VM1.MCGILL.CA> CX6L@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CX6L) writes:

>"...a ST 19 character can reliably _lift_ 616 pounds..."  What does "lift"
>mean?  Does that mean dead lift (pick up off the ground)?

It means the maximum that the character can push, pull, lift or
hurl, using Extra Effort, under normal circumstances (ie - no
special preparation, no lever, etc).

>The point is that someone with average strength can bench press 150 lbs. or
>so, in real life, and there are people who can bench four times that.  I

In GURPS, your "Maximum Normal Lift" is 25*ST, at all ST scores.
However, on a ST minus N roll, you can lift (10*N)% *more* using
Extra Effort. If the ST minus N roll is 16, then you are pretty
much guaranteed to lift that much. You'll fail on a 17 or 18,
but even a ST roll for Normal lifting would fail there, so I say
this is the Maximum *Reliable* Extra Effort Lift.

EG - ST 19, Maximum Normal Lift = 25*19 = 475 pounds.
     A 16 or less ST roll is a (ST - 3) roll, so you
     can lift 3*10% = 30% *more* with Extra Effort.
     That's 475*(1.3) = 618.5 pounds (the book was
     *low*! Get it?

>If it's not, strength isn't linear                                     r in
>GURPS, as they claim.

Show me this claim. I couldn't find it. I think this is common gamer
myth, and not a GURPS rule! Almost seven years of GURPSing, and I've
seen no such rule . . .

>To clarify, the point is _not_ that you can't make a character who can lift
>600 pounds; the point is that you can't make a character who is four times
>as strong as average.

Maybe not, but hear me out.

Lifting:
     Requires a ST roll. So a ST 10 rolls 10 or less to lift his
Maximum Normal Lift of 250 pounds. A ST 14 person can lift at 40%
Extra Effort on 10 or less, and a ST 18 person at 80% Extra Effort
on 10 or less.
 So:    ST 10    10 or less    250 pounds
        ST 14    10 or less    490 pounds, or 1.96 times ST 10
        ST 18    10 or less    810 pounds, or 3.24 times ST 10

Striking:
ST 10     Average Thrust (1d-2): 1.67
          Average Swing  (1d):   3.50
ST 14     Average Thrust (1d):   3.50, or 2.1 times ST 10
          Average Swing  (2d):   7.00, or 2.0 times ST 10
ST 18     Average Thrust (1d+2): 5.50, or 3.3 times ST 10
          Average Swing  (3d):   10.5, or 3.0 times ST 10

Carrying:
     A "standard pack" of 72 pounds.
     ST 10, 6*ST < 72 < 12*ST, so Heavy Encumbrance, -3 Move
     ST 14, 4*ST < 72 <  6*ST, so Medium Encumbrance, -2 Move
     ST 18, 2*ST < 72 <  4*ST, so Light Encumbrance, -1 Move

     Hence ST 14 experiences 1/2, and ST 18 merely 1/3  of the
slowing effects of encumbrance felt by ST 10.

Now look at these calculations: I think you will agree, that for
all relevant purposes (within the average game), a ST 14 character
is TWICE as strong as a ST 10 character, and a ST 18 character
is THREE TIMES as strong as a ST 10 character.
    Note this: (18/10) = 1.8, (1.8)**2 = 3.24, or about 3
               (14/10) = 1.4, (1.4)**2 = 1.96, or about 2
 . . see the point? ST is QUADRATIC in GURPS, not linear. *IF*