From: rose@acf9.nyu.edu (David Rose)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Proposed Skills Info Template
Date: 11 Apr 92 19:25:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: acf9.rose.703020344
Organization: New York University

Hi Brian!

bpostow@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Brian Postow) writes:

>ok, but perhaps it could be a little less.... well... like a
>programing language??? It still seems a little constricting. I would
>be more inclined to do something like this more as a paragraph about
>what each skill does...

  Well, I WAS looking at it like a database. :-)

  I think that we are looking at this from two different sides.  The
Rulebook already has text descriptions of the skill, and these
descriptions are the ones that I would use to introduce the skill to
a new player.

  From a player's POV this should be sufficient to give them an idea
of what use the skill is, and enough information to be able to use
the skill actively (i.e. whether or not one can use a skill as an
active defense, and whether or not this mode may be used unskilled).


  I think that the templates could be a powerful tool for the GM to
better (more enjoyably and consistently) play the game.  It would
help in three distinct ways:

  1. It would help in designing adventures.  As you point out, skills
     like find which are not used combatively against another creature
     are against a difficulty which is assigned by the GM.  The
     template would be a guide for determining difficulties.

     (Example:  Wu-Han hides a secret communique from Pharoah Mobius
      in his desk.  How difficult will it be for the players to find
      it?  Well, I know Wu-Han's stealth, and can judge how much
      care he put into hiding the communique.)

 2.  As a GM, every once in a while the players stump me by doing
     something I wasn't prepared for.  O.K., that is part of the
     game.  However, I would like to be able to work out ahead of
     time reasonable guesses.  For instance, how much easier is it
     to find something if you don't care about not breaking things?
     (Gestapo type search.)

3.   Same reason as 2., except sometimes it makes sense for the NPCs
     to respond to the players in a way that wasn't worked out ahead
     of time.  For instance, does the Inquisition wish to demolish the
     players motel room seeking the stolen microchip, or do they
     want to try and search unobtrusively as possible?  This choice
     cannot simply be made ahead of time because what the NPCs do
     is in part determined by their prior interactions with the
     characters.

> the modifiers are an interesting idea, if you
>want to deal with them, but IMHO they go against the philosophy of the
>Torg system which is make it as SIMPLE a system as possible and people
>will have to Roleplay to make up for it.

  However I have not added, in principal, any KIND of information which
isn't already present in the Rulebook.  The GM's Skill Modifiers sheet
summarizes the discussion of skills in the GM section, and some of these
skills have modifier charts.


>... This method also has the
>advantage of people with subspec of skills. for example, I have a
>character who can read faces really well, sort of a non-psichic Diana
>Troi. He can say "I think that they are holding something back" and he
>plays poker real well B-). The closest skill that We could find for
>this was Evidence Analysis [if you have a better one, tell me, I
>haven't played him yet, so I can still change]

  I would play this as a skill different from Evidence Analysis, although
if pressed to use something on the moment, that is probably the skill
that I would choose.

  Why not make it a separate skill?  It is enough different from EA
to be clearly distinguishable.  An example of this is the Tracking
skill, which is also EA in a specialized form.

Body Language (PER) [Social: 6]
  The ability to read a person from their expression and posture.
  May be used unskilled, except as an active defense.
Macro:
  [fill in the blanks (I forgot what the template was)]
Action:
  [likewise]

  Where your GM and you could decide upon some modifiers for common
situations and work out the mechanics of how you could use the skill.

  Of course, if you have a GM who sacrifices realism and flexibility
for following the rules as already stated, then I can see where you
have a problem with this.

> Now, I can say that he
>is skiled in all parts of EA, it fits his character, but he doesn't
>quite have a 3 in it [it is his tag skill] so... the GM can [This will
>be the first that he will hear of it so ... B-)] make say reading
>faces a much lower difficulty level than for other people, and say,
>finding clues, much higher. well, maybe not MUCH, but you get the
>point...

  I think it's a good skill.  It suggests roleplaying nicely.
Bargain for using it as an active defense against fire combat and
energy weapons.

  I can think of a lot of other uses as well.

(You see his hips start to twist into your direction and jump behind
 the dumpster before he unloads his Automatic at you.)
--
David Rose
Courant Institute of Mathematical Sciences
251 Mercer Street, New York, NY 10012
rose@math12.cims.nyu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg