From: laut@alien.gici.com (Bill Laut)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian
Subject: Re: Christianity and economics
Date: 16 Oct 92 08:13:25 GMT
Organization: Gull Island Consultants, Inc.

In article <Oct.13.01.08.31.1992.21834@geneva.rutgers.edu>, mangoe@cs.umd.edu (Charley Wingate) writes:

Aahh!  This sounds like an interesting discussion going on...  Please bear
with me while I post my two-cents worth.

> I have been following the economics discussion and how it has inevitably
> turned towards a "traditional" theology of thrift, ....

I am a born-again believer who for the past twelve years has wanted to 
share the Love of God through the medium of motion pictures, specifically
through the avenue of computer animation.

I won't get into my testimony now, but suffice it to say that around 1987 I
finally was able to make enough money free-lancing that I started buying the
equipment I would need.  I chose to start off buying the audio taping and
mixing equipment, and got myself a nice, cozy 8-track studio.  My mistake
was in trying to hurry along the process by going into debt for it.

To make a long story short, I'm finally getting the last of that debt paid
off, and all I can say is "THANK GOD!".  I know what it's like to get caught
into that debt, have a downturn, and then have creditors calling you,
threatening to sue, etc.  Once down that road is enough for me.

Now, I'm trying the traditional method of "Christian financing:"  pay cash.
I find that I have to wait less time if I finance the assets out of my
cash flow, than if I take out a loan.

> 
> I can understand some of REXLEX's feelings in the immediate case.  Being
> able to use the money for other purposes is a reason not to build and not to
> get into debt.  Issues such as these require attention.
> 

There's bunches of issues that could be brought up here.  First, over in
Exodus, the Bible talks of how God gave the Israelites the necessary skills
of building and artistry to create a temple for His use.  Perhaps, on the
next expansion, "put your faith where your mouth is," and (as a body) 
believe God for the necessary skills so that the entire church can work
together to build their own building.  Just like the Israelites.

Secondly, "one can put a thousand to flight, whereas two can put ten
thousand to flight."  Essentially, we're talking the scale of economics
here.  If everybody in the church participated, it would shrink down the
amount of work to managable units that could be scheduled and completed.

I could go on, but I think you get my point.  It's not so much that I
am pointing my finger in judgement.  I'm simply elucidating alternatives
for future consideration.

>
> The more economic/theological reasons given, though, deserve more critical
> treatment.  In particular, Burkett's admonitions about "hard times coming".
> The economics of prosperity are still obscure; if they were not, we wouldn't
> be in the mess we're in.  The economics of depression and contraction,
> unfortunately, are very well understood.  After a financial crisis,
> people contract their spending, and those put in hardship burn up their
> savings.  The resulting decreases wipe out more business, putting more
> people in distress and fear.
> 

Where's your faith?  Over in Deuteronomy **it*is*written** "Remember, it
is the Lord your God who gives you the power to get wealth, in order to
establish His Covenant."  And over in Phillipians it is written "... and
my God shall abundantly meet your every need in His Glory in Riches in
Christ Jesus."  Finally, from Psalm 91:  "A thousand may fall at your side,
ten thousand at your right hand, but it will not come near you.  Only a
spectator shall you be, [you yourself inaccessible in the secret places of
the Most High] as you witness the reward of the wicked."

Finally, remember Jesus' own admonition:  "The eye is the lamp of the soul.
If your eye is filled with light, then your entire body is illuminated.  But
if the light that is within you is darkness, then how great is the darkness!"

In other words, don't focus on all the hell that's breaking out in the
world around you.  God (to me, at least) is *very* clear on the subject:
Follow me, and leave the dead to bury their own dead.

> The one line I object to completely is this:
> 
>>the point is that if Xians are faithful stewards, God will supply.
> 
> The reality is that what God supplies very often is not financial security.
> 

Whose "reality" are you talking about??  Certainly not mine!  We are called
to "imitate God, as dearly beloved children imitate their father."  And 
again, over in Romans, God "calls things that be not as though they were."

Re-read all of my comments in this posting.  They are applicable to your
conclusion.

For what it's worth, here is my perspective on the "New Deal:"  When you
accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior, you enter into a covenant relationship
with God on Jesus' side of it.  Inside that covenant there all sorts of
promises that God makes to you, but they only apply if you keep your end
of the deal.  Usually, keeping your end of the deal means taking God at His
Word (regardless of the outside temporal circumstances) and refusing to
give up on the image that God paints of you.

Will there be struggles?  Of course!  Go back and review the parable of
"The Sower Soweth the Word."  Walking with God in this present world will
always be a struggle, because you are bucking the stream.  But, it doesn't
mean you have to let the stream win...

-- 
Bill Laut			Internet:  laut@alien.gici.com
Gull Island Consultants, Inc.	Phone:     (616) 780-3321
Muskegon, MI  49440		>> "Usual disclaimers, apply within" <<