HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
From: fheitkamp@desire.wright.edu
Date: 19 Aug 92 07:12:48 EST
Organization: Wright State University 

In article <1992Aug18.164701.17958@ctr.columbia.edu>, jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
> davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn) writes:
>
	[ stuff deleted ] 
>>
>>[scrollbars]
>>I know - my question was: does OS/2 have them in shell windows, as an option
>>at least?
>>
> 
> Yes, it does.  Whenever you resize a shell so that not all of its rows or
> columns are visible, scrollbars show up automatically.

	Jerry,  I think what David meant (He can correct me, natch') was
	that, on the Amiga there are programs that allow you to move your
	mouse pointer to the edge of the screen and by clicking the mouse
	button, the screen will scroll in that direction (no scroll bars
	are invloved).  Also depending how far from the edge you move the
	mouse pointer, you can control the speed of the scrolling.  This
	feature is great for browsing through a large text file (I really 
	think this is cool, sorry)  Does OS/2 have a utility like this?

> 
>>
>>David Meiklejohn                  | Internet : davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au
>>
> --
> +-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
> | Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
> | Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
> |    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
> +-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
> |           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
> |                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
> +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Fred Heitkamp,  ** Not an organization.  My opinions only **
From: edzard@blade (Edzard Kolks)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: A3000T ad (was: Re: New A3000T ?!?
Date: 21 Aug 92 10:49:51 GMT
Organization: MCGV Stack, Eindhoven University of Technology, the Netherlands.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

gerber@orion.astro.uiuc.edu (Richard A. Gerber) writes:
: 2. I (and most people) wouldn't know what an '040 looked like if hit in the
:    face with one.

It has either a heat sink or a cute little fan on top. If it doesn't have one
of these, ir probably isn't a 040. :-)

: 3. The only place I've ever seen what an A3000T looked like was in a 
:    picture in a magazine. I doubt there is one within 150 miles of me.
:    If you gave me one and covered up the C= logo, I'd have no idea
:    what kind of computer it was just by looking. Don't expect me to
:    recognize a picture in a magazine. 

Tower case, with a key to lock it, disk drives like the 3000 Desktop.
The only thing from which you can recognize it, is the disk drives
or the cover (like the one in a 3000 Desktop) for that, plus the lack
of lights, buttons and all those ugly things PC tower cases usually
have (Like IBM's 1.44 on the floppy. Did you know that 1.44 Mbyte
isn't an integer number?)

					Peter.
--
Peter Korsten, in real life peter@stack.urc.tue.nl
expansion.library/ConfigChain : Configure the whole danm system
- Amiga ROM Kernel Reference Manual, Includes & Autodocs, 2nd edition
--- This signature will change when I get the 3rd edition ---
From: lindblad@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Jarkko Lindblad)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: amiga rules!
Date: 17 Aug 92 16:39:08 GMT
Distribution: comp
Organization: University of Helsinki

: The reason the C-128 failed was because there was no software SPECIFICALLY for
: the C128 side.  The only piece of software I saw which took advantage of the 
: 128's capabilities was BASIC8.  It could make the 80 column video work wonders
: for the 128.  But other than that, there was nothing.

Well, there was VizaWrite for 128-mode too...

: Also, I believe the incompatability came from the fact that the 128 had a 6510
: installed and used it for both the C64 and C128 modes.  The  C64 however had
: a straight 6502 processor.

Incorrect. C-64 has 6510, C-128 has 8502. Vic-20 has 6502.

--
Jarkko Lindblad
lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi
From: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re:  Len Stys <-> Jeff Young? The same person? Secret lovers?
Date: 17 Aug 92 14:17:13 GMT
Reply-To: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Organization: Flying Cat, Inc.

In article <1992Aug17.115459.29913@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au> davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn) writes:
>In article <1992Aug16.063804.1782@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N Barrett) writes:
>>In article <34298@cbmvax.commodore.com> andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel) writes:
>>>
>>>Actually, I think that instead C= would have gotten into IBM PC clones 
>>>in a real big way;
>
>I wonder if they would have done any good?  Their PCs sell ok (not well, just
>ok) at the moment - maybe they could have done better if that was the main
>focus.
>

Exactly.  If it had been the main focus, things would have been different.


Also, back then, the PC line was pretty much one machine, and only
two incompatible graphics standards.  Someone could still develop
something like the Mindset and think it had a chance of success.
(it would have if it could only have run programs for the IBM PC :-)  )
 
>>   They may also have successfully gotten into UNIX workstations six years
>>before the development of the A3000UX.
>
>Probably only in Europe, though.  Who would have bought a workstation from the
>C64 company?  Things are bad enough now, but back when the 64 was more than a
>memory?
>
>>I do not remember all of the details,
>>but Commodore had a Z8000-based UNIX system around 1985 with a nice 800x600

Maybe. It was running Coherent, rather than Unix, and the Z8000 processor
never quite took off in the marketplace.

>>I also remember that the first litigation
>>between Commodore and Atari right after Jack Tramiel took over Atari involved
>>this workstation and not the Amiga (as is commonly believed).  Were it not

As I recall, the first litigation actually involved some of the hardware
engineers on the Z8000 project leaving C= and going to work for Atari.

>>| Marc Barrett -MB-  |  email: barrett@iastate.edu
>David Meiklejohn                  | Internet : davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au


			andy
-- 
andy finkel		{uunet|rutgers|amiga}!cbmvax!andy

"The good news is that there is a program for the PC that converts between
 300 different graphics file formats.  The bad news is that it's needed."

Any expressed opinions are mine; but feel free to share.
I disclaim all responsibilities, all shapes, all sizes, all colors.
From: spice@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Date: 19 Aug 92 03:52:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: drycas.1992Aug19.085215.1845
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

In article <34476@cbmvax.commodore.com>, andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel) writes:

So Andy , what do you think of the Atari Falcon? That was you on GEnie during
Sam Tramiel's conference wasnt it?

                                 Scott Corley

spice@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gcasa@wam.umd.edu (Gregory John Casamento)
Subject: Re:  Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 05:00:38 GMT

In article <root.0295@rkamiga.UUCP> root@rkamiga.UUCP (Rick Kelly) writes:
>
>This would seem to be politically unsound on the part of Commodore.  When
>China takes over Hong Kong in 1997, Commodore could easily lose that plant.
>At this time, companies who are already in Hong Kong are working on
>contingency plans for pulling out.
>
>It's almost funny.
>
>--
>Rick Kelly		Rick's Amiga		Framingham, Mass.
>
>		think!unixland!rmkhome!rkamiga!root
>

Commodore will lose nothing.  The People's Republic Of China has promised to
leave Hong Kong alone after they reclaim it in 1997.  In other words, they
are *NOT* going to drive into Hong Kong with tanks and take everything by
force.  Many US companies have production plants in Hong Kong. Some of them
are planning to take a chance and stay there.


-- 
Gregory John Casamento  --  gcasa@wam.umd.edu
**** The opinions expressed in this article are the of Greg's Amiga ****
**** And not of Greg himself.  He is currently being forced by his  ****
**** Amiga (at gunpoint) to write this article.  :) :P B) BP ;) :O  ****
From: mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re:    I am giving up on the Amiga
Date: 13 Aug 92 12:13:32 GMT
Organization: Amiga makes it possible
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16f (beta) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith

In article <root.029b@rkamiga.UUCP> root@rkamiga.UUCP (Rick Kelly) writes:
> In article <mykes.0c39@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG> mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes:
> >In article <root.0285@rkamiga.UUCP> root@rkamiga.UUCP (Rick Kelly) writes:
> >> In article <1992Aug6.155409.21280@newshost.unh.edu> pss1@kepler.unh.edu (Paul S Secinaro) writes:
> >> >In article <root.027z@rkamiga.UUCP> root@rkamiga.UUCP (Rick Kelly) writes:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>I need yet another UNIX box, and I'll probably buy Dell SVR4.  It might
> >> >>make sense for me to buy a complete PC + UNIX package from Dell.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >Isn't Dell offering their SVR4 for something like $495 if you buy it
> >> >preinstalled on one of their machines?
> >>
> >> Yes, $495 for 2 user license and $795 for unlimited.  I would get the
> >> unlimited user license and still save $500 by buying an integrated
> >> package.  I would have to look at the Dell hardware prices before I
> >> make a decision.  The big expense will be disk space.
> >>
> >
> >I just bought the Dell 486D/50 - it ZIPs.  It runs windows plenty fast
> >for my (Amiga-user) tastes, too.  I bought OS/2 but haven't installed it
> >yet...  That $500 you save will buy you a 300 Meg drive :)
>
> The choice of graphics card seems to be very important when setting up
> a Windows system.  A friend of mine with a 386/33 just upgraded from
> Windows 3.0 to 3.1, and upgraded his video from a cheap Paradise SVGA
> card to a Diamond Steath with S3 chip.  The difference is amazing.
>

FWIW, when you have DIG, you aren't going to be fast.

>
> --
> Rick Kelly		Rick's Amiga		Framingham, Mass.
>
> 		think!unixland!rmkhome!rkamiga!root
>

--
Amiga programmer of: GRn, MailMinder, Budokan, Beyond Dark Castle, Dark Castle
Sega Genesis programmer of: Dick Tracy and Marble Madness.
Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
1124 Fremont Ave.
Los Altos, CA 94024
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams)
Subject: Re: People, CALM DOWN!
Organization: James Cook University
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 02:53:23 GMT

In article <9512@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com> peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com (Dr Peter Kittel Germany) writes:
>Ok: You must consider NMOS, *not* CMOS. Got it?

Hmmm.  It certainly sounds like you are implying the AA chipset is still
NMOS.  This may still be true for Agnus, but Lisa and Alice ?!?!

>Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to \\  Only my personal opinions...

-- 
Colin Adams       Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland
  "And if I seem a little strange, well that's because I am." - The Smiths 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
From: rhealey@kas.helios.mn.org (Rob Healey)
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 14:57:24 GMT
Organization: Rob's home system, Hopkins, MN

In article <pat_meloy.0gre@outb.wimsey.bc.ca> pat_meloy@outb.wimsey.bc.ca (Pat Meloy) writes:
= CDTV itself (the CPU) is finished. They are now working on accessories.
=Has it not filtered into your brain that perhaps the MPEG add-ons etc are
=ACCESSORIES? Think of it like this. Development on the A2000 stopped long
=ago, yet we are still getting HD drives, network adapters, AA chipsets, and
=the like. Gee, that must all be "vapourware" since development on the 2000
=doesn't exist!
=
=Get a brain,
=Get a life,
=Get outa our faces!
=
	You might do well to check the facts before spouting off. The AA
	chip set won't work on a 16 bit CHIP BUS like the 2000's and 3000's
	have. HD's are due to PC and Mac demand, not Amiga demand. There
	are only 2 ethernet cards made for the Amiga, Zorro II by the way
	so they are 16 bit not 32, and they were made a few years ago.

	VERY little has changed since the 2000 came out functionality wise,
	the 3000 sped things up with some 32 bit paths but that's about it.

	The NEXT machine should be quite a step forward but it should have been
	released about the time the 3000 was...

	Let's hope they can the 2000, slip the 25MHz 3000 50M into the
	$1k range and put the A4000, or whatever they call it, in the
	current 3000 price slot. At least then they be more price competitive.
	Of course those of us on the North American continent will have to
	import from Hong Kong or Germany as no Amiga computers are made on
	our continent anymore, i.e. import fees and taxes will raise the
	cost for us. B^(. Just as the free trade agreement was about to
	come in to being too...

		-Rob
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block)
Subject: Re: Perot ?
Organization: University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 03:45:40 GMT

griffin@frith.egr.msu.edu (Danny Griffin) writes:
: Wrong...the death penalty is punishment for the 'murder'--unlawful taking
: of an innocent life--that the perpetrator commited.
: And I'm saying you're wrong.

It should never be LEGAL to take someone's life.  Not even a
murderer's.  That's what it is.  It's the taking of someone's life to
punish someone for being convicted of murder.  Convicted of does not
equal is guilty of.  It should be, but it doesn't HAVE to be.

I don't think I'm wrong.  If you could find some way into making me
think that murder is right under certain circumstances, then perhaps
I'll vote you into the presidency.  I just don't think you can do it.

Greg

--
(: (: (: (: Have you overdosed on smileys today?  Why NOT!?! :) :) :) :) :)
(:	  "Flesh-pressing:  It's not just for politics anymore."         :)
(:	gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu			Gregory R. Block         :)
(: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: iank@microsoft.com (Ian Kennedy)
Subject: Re: Falcon 030 specs released!  No more rumor...
Date: 11 Aug 92 17:27:27 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <1992Aug8.131749.22078@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jyoung@nyx.cs.du.edu (Jeff Young) writes:
>
>You have $700-900 A3000?? Maybe many developers with Falcons will 
>challenge you but you have to give $1000 rebate because of price
>difference!!! 

I'll conceed this point Jeff. If the Falcon does indeed ship at the
price stated with the features you have posted it will be more than a match
for any stock amiga curently available. I'll reserve judgement on the
OS untill we have some first hand accounts of the MultiTOS thing.
-- 
/* IanK@Microsoft.com		*/
/* I want my 32bit chip set	*/

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.multimedia
From: jprad@faatcrl.UUCP (Jack Radigan)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Sofware Piracy & Software Prices
Date: 17 Aug 92 12:08:00 GMT
Organization: FAA Technical Center, Atlantic City NJ

bleys@tronsbox.xei.com (Bill Cavanaugh) writes:

>How is game evaluation in the store any easier than word processor
>evaluation?  The picture on the box isn't any more descriptive on
>games...  The user interface isn't usually even alluded to on game
>boxes...  Hell, sometimes you can't even tell if the game is arcade or
>adventure!

  The assumption being that you're dealer lets you try it in the store,
games canb be evaluated that way, applications need more time then a 10
minute test drive.

  -jack-
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: 8939527@hydra.maths.unsw.EDU.AU ()
Subject: Re: Death Becomes Amiga!!
Organization: school of Mathematics UNSW
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 23:50:18 GMT

>
>>on my basic premise -- The AMIGA will die a slow agonizing death unless good
>>standard spreadsheet and wordprocessing software packages become available
>>for it SOON!!!! 
>

	In a previous post it was mentioned that the advantage of OS/2 is
that it runs DOS and windows. Yet the amiga runs MAC software better than
OS/2 does DOS and windows. The result is ... Word 5.0a works great
for my A3000. Not to forget that my friends MAC IIci (Or something)
68030 computer is slower !! Well granted I checked it out in 256
clolors but then again Word to me only needs two colors. Same goes
for exel. A note to make compressing a full disk on my friend
mac took beond 20 min !!! (On a 680309) I mean lha blows it away. And
even stuffit in Amax goes much faster. Amax worked out very cheep
for me. And it was well worth it. Word at an educational discount
was $150, and Amax i cost me $50 !(With the cartridge at the CBM show
in Sydney) I got Amax II software and the roms on disk and ...
viouala.
	A MAC 
		George




>
>Crystal
>  ;>


Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.atari.st
From: dleland@dante.nmsu.edu (LELAND)
Subject: Re: A3000T ad (was: Re: New A3000T ?!?
Organization: New Mexico State University, Las Cruces, NM
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 08:48:47 GMT

Well, we shall see. Every once in a while a C= bigwig ccomes by our Amiga lab
and says there are going to be some "big big" things coming down the tube at
WOC. "This time it will be different." All I say is, "I'll believe it when I see
(or C=) it.  :-|  . 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: eas3714@ultb.isc.rit.edu (E.A. Story )
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
Originator: eas3714@ultb
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 01:40:23 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.143959.2210@ctr.columbia.edu> jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>heuvdp@cbmnl.nl.so.commodore.com (Paul Heu vd Netherlands) writes:
>>
>>Well I would think he is right though. Or do you really think
>>IBM decided to include MS-DOS and WINDOWS compatibility
>>because they thought it would be a good feature..
>>
>>I would think they did so because they HAVE to be compatible
>>with those to even sell OS/2 .. So I would call it a
>>NESSESITY, not a feature..
>
>Look up the word "feature".  It means "characteristic".  It doesn't imply
>anything about desirability.  For example, an crooked nose is a facial feature
>that's not necessarily desirable.

What the hell are you talking about then?  I could say that AmigaDOS has
the feature of being able to run 68k binaries... thats a feature that
OS/2 doesn't have.  You see why you're being involved in this
discussion?  It pretty obvious that you implied that having DOS/WIndows
compatibility is a good thing for OS/2 and not having it is a bad thing
for AmigaDOS.  (Point of fact, ever hear of a bridgeboard?..duh)

Jerry, Frankly I am getting tired of you weaseling out of arguments.
Hell, someone even PROVED that you stated OS/2 is superior to AmigaDOS
after you challanged them to try and find the article where it was.  I
don't really care, and in fact, OS/2 *does* sound like a superior
operating system.  But either you say something, or you don't.. If you
can't live with the consequences.. DON'T SAY IT! 

You wanna argue semantics?  Argue with a linguist... ok?  Implication is
everything in this newsgroup.

                                ---Ezra


-- 
"THAT is a DRY turtle.  That turtle is NOT moist!"
Ezra Story, a student at RIT, and
eas3714@ultb.isc.rit.edu, his trusty(?) mailing address.
From: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Date: 18 Aug 92 00:28:07 GMT
Reply-To: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <34413@cbmvax.commodore.com> daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes:
>In article <mykes.0cnz@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG> mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes:

>>CBM told EA in 1985 that the A1000 would have a price tag of $1000.
>>So, EA jumps on the bandwagon and pumped big money into Amiga product and
>>advertising.  Then the A1000 comes out at a price of > $2K.  

>The original A1000 list price was $1495.  

As Andy reminds us all, the A1000 list price was actually $1295 on introduction.
I was thinking of something else here.  I know I got mine for under $1200 in
early '86.

-- 
Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Amiga 3000) "The Crew That Never Rests"
   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh      BIX: hazy
	"Work like a horse, drink like a fish"	- Psychefunkapus
 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams)
Subject: Re: Pournelle (and Byte) strikes again!
Organization: James Cook University
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 02:24:18 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.182536.1@ulkyvx.louisville.edu> jcjust01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu (J. Crazyrat Justen) writes:
>
>For those of you who won't see September BYTE until October...

Try Novemeber or later...

>The Amiga 3000T by Jerry Pournelle
>(*most* spelling and grammatical mistakes are my own.)

Well it was a reasonable article.  It could have been so much more positive
for the Amiga if there was some popular software available and 
installed on the machine (Excel/WP or compatible clones).

With the ability to read/write IBM files in the OS, there should be
a definite market for a powerful spreadsheet that can export/import
Excel and Lotus 1-2-3 files.

-- 
Colin Adams       Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland
  "And if I seem a little strange, well that's because I am." - The Smiths 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: dtiberio@libws2.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio)
Subject: Re: Amiga has it all
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 07:38:35 GMT

In article <1992Aug23.014540.9891@gbrmpa.gov.au> matt@gbrmpa.gov.au (Matt) writes:
>
>After just seeing Workbench 3 in action I have to say I'm not really all
>that impressed. The palette program with it's Windows/Mac-like colour
>selecter is a nice touch, should look pretty cool with AA.

	If CBM is working on or planning to release a Workbench version
3.0, it will be because it has to be compatible with the newest kickstart
versions that they would be working on. How much of an improvement was the
Mac finder when you compare version 4 to 5 to 6 to 7? 7 was big, but the
others were not that crucial. In fact CBM puts more into the Workbench
then Apple puts into the Finder.

	I am happy with my Workbench. There is always room for improvement,
but those improvements don't have to be major overhauls. As far as we know,
the Workbench CBM is developing now may support everything we always 
wanted. And if it doesn't, find a PD program that does.


-- 
      //   David Tiberio  SUNY Stony Brook 516-473-5156 AMIGA  DDD-MEN   
     //  bounce-resistant:    dtiberio%libserv1.ic.sunysb.edu@sunysb.edu
   \X/	    Perot for President 1-516-399-2259 Long Island, New York

 	PPPP  EEEEE RRRR   OOO  TTTTT    IIIII N   N      999  2222
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Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy