From: dgross@polyslo.csc.calpoly.edu (Dave Gross)
Newsgroups: soc.men,alt.feminism
Subject: [misc.activism.progressive] Feminist group disrupts men's meeting
Keywords: Campus NOW Brownshirts, Enough for Dinesh D'Souza's next book
Date: 22 Dec 92 22:55:56 GMT
Reply-To: dgross@polyslo.CalPoly.EDU (Dave Gross)
Organization: Mousebat, Follicle, Goosecreature, Ampersand, Spong, Wapcaplet,                 Looseliver, Vendetta & Pang

Newsgroups: misc.activism.progressive
From: New Liberation News Service <nlns@igc.apc.org>
Subject: NLNS: Feminists Integrate Men-Only Rape Talk
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 13:24:50 GMT

Feminists Integrate Men-Only Rape Talk
Jenny Brown, The Gainesville Iguana

GAINESVILLE, FL (NLNS)--Nearly twenty years after feminists busted into the
men-only Blue Key Banquet, Campus National Organiziation for Women members
forced their way into a Dec. 10th rape talk which was to allow only men.
"Groups of priviledged people aren't going to meet alone and figure out how to
end their priviledge." concluded Campus NOW after several women representing
the group entered and asked questions during the Rape Awareness Week forum
that had been billed as "men only."
	Feminists' discomfort at the increasing emphasis on men-only rape
talks became alarmed when Campus NOW member Bill Stephenson attended and taped
a men-only rape program last year. After listening to the tape, Campus NOW
activists concluded that the forum was not only not helping to stop rape, it
was perpetuating sexist beliefs and behavior, and they decided to integrate
this year's program.
	In a particularly glaring example from the tape, forum leader and
University Police Department officer David Andrews stated, "Approximately 50%
of rapes reported are false. The girls [sic] are trying to get back at
someone, some girls are emotionally unstable, maybe her parents can't afford
to keep her in school, so she's looking for a way to get back to the house...
So [false reports] that's the reality, something you always have to keep in
mind [if a woman tells you she's been raped.] You might want to sign a
contract before you make love. [Male audience laughs.] It's a part of human
nature. Women see a way to get something they want and they're going to use
it."
	Campus NOW went to this year's forum with leaflets containing rape
statistics and a page on why they were there, which contained the quote above
on the reverse side. When NOW arrived, two women officials in the Division of
Housing physically blocked them from entering and engaging them in a long
discussion. After about ten minutes, NOW officers decided that the discussion
was just a stalling tactic and they pushed their way into the room. Seven
women entered in all. In addition, two male NOW members attended the function
as part of the protest. (Later, Assistant Housing Director Vicki Williams, one
of the women who had physically blocked the door, was quoted in the Alligator
(the University of Florida mainstream paper) as saying, "I didn't want the
women they coudn't come into the room.")
	NOW distributed leaflets to the all-male audience. The housing 
officials followed them around taking the leaflets from the men, saying "You
don't have to keep that." One man said he was told three times that he didn't
have to keep the flyer.
	This year's program was again led by Andrews and by a female peer 
educator from the Sexual Assault Recovery Service, who said it was the first
workshop she'd ever led. Her presence there was a concession to a demand by
NOW. They had called the University Police Department to ask that a woman lead
the workshop.
	Despite charges that NOW was violating the men's right to freedom of
association, it turned out that the women were the ones illegally being
blocked from entry, since under the Sunshine Law "stricktly speaking, it had
to be open to everyone that wanted to go" Paul Gates, a research assistant at
the Brecher Center for Freedom of Information was quoted as saying in the
*Alligator* two days later.

"Comfortable"
	The main reason given for having a men-only group was so that men
would "feel comftorable asking frank questions about rape without fear of
retribution" in the words of police spokeswoman Angie Tipton. Former organizer
Daniel Klein said the forum's 'purpose was to provide a comfortable atmosphere
for men to discuss rape and ask questions about it.'
	Many feminists said that they thought it was wrong for men to feel 
comfortable about rape. If men feel uncomfortable in a forum like that, that's
good, said one feminist who is a man.  But people who attended both last
year's forum, which had just men, and this year's, stated that there was much
more free-flowing discussion this year. Even Andrews stated after the program
that with or without women it was "pretty much the same." He stated that at
this age, "they pretty much put into words what they're thinking."
	And one student reporter wasn't at all shy about how he felt about 
rape. When a Campus NOW member wouldn't give him her name in an interview
after the program, he said to her "I hope you get raped," and left. She later
went to his reporting class, announced what he had said to her, and asked if
this was how reporters were supposed to act.
	With women present, however, the program organizers did not play the
audiotapes they had played last year. One had a woman talking about being
raped and another was a tape of a 911 telephone call by a woman as her house
was being broken into and as she was being attacked. Stephenson described the
latter as a "snuff tape." The organizers explained that they were too graphic
for women to hear. "We can get raped, but it's too graphic for us to hear" one
woman complained bitterly. Instead of hearing the tapes, one of the NOW women
testified about being raped in order to support a point she was bringing up.
Others talked about their own and friends experiences trying to report rapes
to law enforcement. Others cited statistics wherein nearly half of men said
that they would force a woman to do something sexual if they didn't think they
would be caught.
	The formal presentation was short and boring. The discussion following
it centered around what constituted rape and women raping men, Stephenson said
he thought that the main point of the questions about what constituted rape
was to figure out how to get away with it. NOW members who attended were
amazed that the facilitators allowed the audience to go on and on in
misconceptions and distortions. When it became clear that the obvious answers
would never be given (such as the legal definition of rape, or why women don't
report rape) NOW members raised their hands and contributed their comments.
	Another theme, which consumed a large portion of the program, was
women raping men. When the woman moderator, Liz Kretzedemas, pointed out that
this was a vanishingly small portion of all rapes, she was ignored and the
audience continued to talk about it for several more minutes

Better Facilitators?
	In the face of the blatent inaccuracies on the part of Andrews and a 
completely legalistic approach to why rape is bad, some people argued that the
problem was with the leaders of the workshops, not that they were men,
necessarily, but that they weren't well trained. But student government spent
a considerable amount of money getting the out-of-town male expert to another
forum last year, the one which was reported to have concluded that men
couldn't help it.
	And while a woman co-presenter is a step forward, the audience members
simply ignored what she had to say on more than one point.
	It is odd, too, that organizers will play tapes of women in the role of 
victim, but will not admit women themselves, who might be angry or manifest
other signs of fighting back.
	At a time when budget constraints and the tendency of the university 
to want to hide rape have severely curtailed victims services, it's shameful 
that UF is spending money and energy on men-only programs of doubtful 
effectiveness.

Resistances
	Many men and some women expressed disagreement with the action. NOW
was criticized for everything from violating a constitutional right to freedom
of assembly to just hating men.  In consciousness-raising after the action,
many women said that they had changed their minds several times on the issue.
Things that made them think the action wasn't good were that they were
concerned about NOW's reputation--that it was a difficult action to explain
and understand-- that it was very hard to stand up against criticism from male
and female friends--that there were certain legal rights that people had to
meet together-- that maybe men all on their own would learn to stop raping.
"We want to think there's one good guy who will stand up," one woman stated.
Reasons to do the action were: Experiences with men in groups being worse than 
individually--not wanting a group with priviledges talking about an issue of 
vital importance to your life while exluding you--the tape of the previous 
year's talk--the analogy of black people being exluded from a talk on racism--
that there aren't enough gus who are feministsb if it messes up women will pay
the price--it's better to organize the most effective thing.
	Stephenson said he used to defend all-male groups and that in his case
it had to do with men wanting to feel good about how great they are and not
wanting to believe that there are some issues men can't resolve on their own.
	Most people who testified in the evaluations of the action agreed that 
it was good that it had been done.
	
Changes
	Some people interpreted NOW's action as meaning that they believed
that men couldn't change. But an editorial signed by the 7-member Campus NOW
Board stated "Just as women must live with men's sexism towards us every day,
men who care about women in their lives are going to have to bear it when we
tell it like it is, not cringe and say they're scared and that we're hurting
their feelings... men who truly want to fight rape will welcome us into their
forums so we can tell our side and so we can confront them on their oppresive
attitudes and actions." While men could change, a men-only forum was not the
way to achieve that change.
	Women have been excluded from higher education, higher-paying jobs,
Florida Blue Key, the Florida legislature, and many other all-male clubs which
have been integrated only through organized and militant feminist action. It
is ironic that men-only clubs are coming back in the guise of being "for the
good of women."
	The Campus NOW Board editorial states: "Based on our experience with
men-only groups--fraternities, men's sports, groups of men screaming at us
from cars--men in such groups frequently and openly display sexist attitudes
and tend not to object, but rather reward one another for sexist actions.
Because of this, Campus NOW stands against men-only groups."

The Gainesville Iguana can be reached c/o CISPLA, PO Box 14712, Gainesville,
FL 32604.

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