HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gjm11@cus.cam.ac.uk (G.J. McCaughan)
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
Subject: Re: 3 puzzles
Date: 30 Jul 92 22:14:53 GMT
Organization: U of Cambridge, England

In article <1992Jul30.155941.2434@cs.cornell.edu>, karr@cs.cornell.edu (David Karr) writes:
> In article <78930@bcsaic.boeing.com> lbaum@atc.boeing.com (Larry Baum) writes:
> >In article <1992Jul26.233848.20722@Armstrong.EDU> water772@Armstrong.EDU (Kelly
> >Waters) writes:
> >
> >Well EIGHT is alphabetically before FORTY, but how about:
> >
> >ALEPH-NOUGHT
> 
> Heh-heh.  I like this.
> 
> 
> >(actually, there is probably a definition of ALEPH-EIGHT)
> 
> Didn't Isaac Asimov end The Realm of Numbers with a notation that
> would be spelled out "aleph aleph nought"?  If this is valid, then it
> is alphabetically before "aleph <blah>" for any finite <blah>, but
> after "aleph aleph aleph nought" which is after "aleph aleph aleph
> aleph nought" which is after ... and so forth ad nauseum.
> 
> -- David Karr (karr@cs.cornell.edu)

Well, actually "aleph-aleph-nought" doesn't strictly make sense, because (going
briefly into technical mode here) the subscripts on "aleph"s have to be
ordinals, not cardinals. "Aleph-aleph-nought" should be "aleph-omega-nought"
or just "aleph-omega" for short.

So indeed aleph-eight is the alphabetically earliest cardinal number.
Well, sort of; there are actually too many cardinals to give them all
names. Aleph-eight is the alphabetically earliest one with a generally
agreed name.
--
From: markc@eomer.hw.stratus.com (Mark Christensen)
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
Subject: Re: 3 puzzles
Date: 23 Jul 92 17:16:38 GMT
Reply-To: markc@eomer.sw.stratus.com (Mark Christensen)
Distribution: rec.puzzles
Organization: Stratus Computer, Hardware Engineering

In article <1992Jul23.141217.22081@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> jil@uts.uucp (Jamie Lubin) writes:
>In article <5071@transfer.stratus.com> markc@eomer.sw.stratus.com (Mark Christensen) writes:
>>Here are three puzzles:
>>
>>[1]
>>	What is the first number, when spelled out (e.g. O-N-E) is
>>in alphabetical order?
> 
>40  (F-O-R-T-Y)

Correct.  
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
From: dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu (RING, DAVID WAYNE)
Subject: Re: Different objects
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 00:32:00 GMT

>>>wjcastre@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (W.Jose Castrellon G.) writes:
>>>>>How about constructing two different objects that cannot be distinguished
>>>>>by reasoning within well-established theories (plus lab data -- references to

>In article <1992Jul19.192213.10027@eng.umd.edu>, russotto@eng.umd.edu (Matthew T. Russotto) writes...
>>Hmm...  I suppose it would.   Neutrons and anti-neutrons should work,
>>but I can't think of a way of holding them, and besides, they are
>>unstable.  

Okay, how about optical trapping of atoms? Hydrogen and anti hydrogen for
example. Or probably any different atoms would be hard to tell apart. Any
experts out there?

Dave Ring
dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu
From: ph@venturi.ama.caltech.edu (Paul Hardy)
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
Subject: carrying the torch
Date: 25 Jul 92 02:34:36 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: California Institute of Technology


I haven't been reading this group for too long, so sorry if this has been
previously posted.

You are in a room with three switches.  Each switch controls a light bulb
in another room; that room is not visible to you.  You know which position
is on and which is off for the three switches, and may throw them in any
order you like, then go into the other room, where you must determine which
switch was connected to which light.  How can this be done?


In case that was too easy, how about the following sequence:

3 6 9 27 ?

				--Paul
--
This is my address:         ph@ama.caltech.edu
This is UUCP:               ...!{decwrl,uunet}!
This is my address on UUCP: ...!{decwrl,uunet}!caltech.edu!ama!ph
Any questions?

"Does Emacs have the Buddha nature?"  --Paul Hardy   "Yow!" --Zippy
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
From: skataba@pbhyf.PacBell.COM (Sam Atabaki)
Subject: Re: 3 puzzles
Reply-To: skataba@PacBell.COM (Sam Atabaki)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Distribution: rec.puzzles
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 00:45:07 GMT

In article <5071@transfer.stratus.com> markc@eomer.sw.stratus.com (Mark Christensen) writes:
>Here are three puzzles:
>
>[1] What is the first number, when spelled out (e.g. O-N-E) is
>in alphabetical order?
Forty

>[3] A king decided to have some fun one night and summoned three
>prisoners to be brought up from the dungeon.  They were brought
>before him and the king made an offer:
>"I have a box with five hats in it", he started.  "There are
>three red hats and two white hats. You will be blindfolded
>and asked to take one hat from the box.  At that time, each
>one of you will be unblindfolded and shown the hats of the other
>two prisoners (but not your own).  Then you will be asked to
>identify the color of your hat.  If you are wrong, your head
>will get chopped off.  If you don't know, back to the
>dungeons with you.  If you guess correctly, I will set you free."
>
>(Assume these prisoners are somewhat intelligent and give
>correct answers.)
>
>The first prisoner took his blindfold off, looked at the other
>two prisoner's hats and said, "I can't tell what color my hat is".
>
>The second prisoner also responded as the first prisoner.
>
>The third prisoner, who was blind, said, "I know exactly
>what color my hat is".
>
>What color is the third prisoner's hat and why can't it be the
>opposite color?

Prisoner #3's conclusions:
From prisoner #1 statement: If prisoners #2 & #3 both had
white hats, prisoner #1 would have been able to tell the color of his
own hat (red); so:
	(Limitation 1) BOTH #2 AND #3 are not wearing white hats.
					(they are both red or one red and one white).

From prisoner #2 statement: If prisoner #3 was wearing a white
hat, #2 would have been able to tell the color of his own hat (red),
according to (Limitation 1). Therefore, #3 must be wearing a red hat.
QED.

-Sam.
 
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
From: tjoa@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Richard Tjoa)
Subject: Re: Rift in the fabric of the space-time continuum?
Summary: Yes, there was one!!!
Keywords: rift space time continuum sex
Organization: You see...  Burke Lee.
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 20:47:22 GMT

In article <JESPERSE.92Jul24125013@rft28.nas.nasa.gov> jesperse@nas.nasa.gov (Dennis Jespersen) writes:
>
>On Monday morning, July 20, 1992, I happened to glance at my digital
>watch and noticed that it indicated the date was 7/19.  The time
>(hours and minutes) on the watch seemed correct.  "That's odd", I
>thought, "I'm here at work so it's probably not Sunday."  I reset the
>date to 7/20.  Later that afternoon I noticed that the date on my
>watch was 7/21; the time still seemed correct.  I was momentarily
>disoriented, not knowing for sure what day it was.  "Maybe there's
>been a rift in the fabric of the space-time continuum, and it's really
>Tuesday now."  I soon convinced myself that it was still Monday, and I
>reset the date again.
>
>Monday evening I glanced at my watch again and suddenly realized what
>had happened.  What was the explanation?

You work for some time-zone crossing organization, but more likely, I really
think there was some kind of rift in the space-time continuum.  Why?

1)  You had your problems
2)  I called my friend last night, and she thought it was about the 17th
    of July, not the 22nd
3)  I had to reset the clock on my phone because it gained (?!!?) a day on
    me


-Richard
I feel older than I did a week ago.
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
From: jimhsu@athena.mit.edu (Jimmy M.D. Hsu)
Subject: Just wondering...
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 21:14:51 GMT

I only just thought of this one.
Someone else's post gave me the idea:

What if three people are playing,
and they decide that face cards are
death cards.  Again, same ideas as
"The Killing Joke", but they need
to get each of the three types of
face cards, Jack, Queen, and King
of any suit to lose.

Now what is the best strategy?
(Sorry if this one is trivial.
I didn't think it through.)

So what if Jokers can be any
face card and as soon as there
is enough (Jack and 2 Jokers,
or Queen and King and Joker)
the game ends?

--
James Amdee  MIT

Would you make a million dollars
if others would die?
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
From: tolman%asylum.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Kenneth Tolman)
Subject: Re: 3 puzzles
Date: 24 Jul 92 00:05:15 MDT
Organization: University of Utah, CompSci Dept
Distribution: rec.puzzles

>>	A man walks into a hardware store and goes to the clerk
>>and says he wants an item.  "I'll take one", he says. The clerk
>>says that that will be $1.  "How much for 12", the man asks?
>>That will be $2 the clerk respond.  "OK, I'll take 125", the
>>man says, to which the clerk responds, "That will be $3 please".
>>What is the item that the man is buying.
>
>Those little numbers you stick on the front of your house to indicate the
>address.

Alternative answers:

 1) The man is intending to plant his garden.  The store sells the same plant
as a full grown one, as seedlings in a set of twelve, and in a package with
125 seeds per pack.  The man wishes to plant his whole garden, which is
fairly large, but he does not want to spend too much money.  Hearing that the
full grown plant is a dollar, he asks for the twelve, hearing that is two,
he realizes that either is too much for his whole garden, so goes for the pack.

 2) The man is buying the actual letters which are cursive units to spell
those numbers.

 3) The man is buying into a gambling thing- with very strange odds.

Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
From: mmokhtar@attmail.com
Subject: Re: Crossing a river
Originator: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 13:49:44 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.173556.5883@iscsvax.uni.edu> althof5805@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
>How can the kings arrange things so that there are never more thieves than
>kings on either side of the river?  Swimming is out (unless they decide to pick
>up a few pet alligators), and each time the boat returns to the starting point
>there will be an uneven number of people on each side of the river.

  Nice puzzle. My notation below shows the first shore, the boat and the second
shore. The shores always show the number of kings and thieves after the boat
arrives:

  3K 3T  --0K 0T--  0K 0T
  3K 1T  --0K 2T->  0K 2T
  3K 2T  <-0K 1T--  0K 1T
  3K 0T  --0K 2T->  0K 3T
  3K 1T  <-0K 1T--  0K 2T
  1K 1T  --2K 0T->  2K 2T
  2K 2T  <-1K 1T--  1K 1T
  0K 2T  --2K 0T->  3K 1T
  0K 3T  <-0K 1T--  3K 0T
  0K 1T  --0K 2T->  3K 2T
  0K 2T  <-0K 1T--  3K 1T
  0K 0T  --0K 2T->  3K 3T

Regards,

Mazen Mokhtar
From: karr@cs.cornell.edu (David Karr)
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
Subject: Re: vacuuously false?
Date: 29 Jul 92 19:44:31 GMT
Organization: Cornell Univ. CS Dept, Ithaca NY 14853

In article <Bs5pw4.MEp@rahul.net> dhesi@rahul.net (Rahul Dhesi) writes:
>
>     if today is Monday then tomorrow is Tuesday
>
>Is this vacuously true on Friday?


Yes.

The statement is always true.  It is vacuously true on Friday because then
today is not Monday, and non-vacuously (if there is such a word) true on
Monday due to the definition of the weekdays.

Any decent course in logic would explain this.

-- David Karr (karr@cs.cornell.edu)
From: dik@cwi.nl (Dik T. Winter)
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
Subject: Re: Digital Invariants (was Number Theory)
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:20:08 GMT
Organization: CWI, Amsterdam

In article <9207251813.hoey@aic.nrl.navy.mil> hoey@AIC.NRL.Navy.Mil (Dan Hoey) writes:
 > 
 > Andy lists all the digital invariants up to 14 digits, and I wrote a
 > program that confirms his list.  The next few are:
 > 
(upto 25 digits).
 > 
 > I have also verified that there are no digital invariants of 46 or
 > more digits.
 > 
 > David Wells lists one more digital invariant, though, of 39 digits:
 > 
 >     115132219018763992565095597973971522401
There is a trivial other one of 39 digits:
       115132219018763992565095597973971522400
 > 
 > and he says it is the largest one known.  However, I am not sure but
 > what this may have been proven to be the largest one that can exist by
 > whoever discovered it.  I do wish Wells were a little more
 > conscientious with his attributions.
 > 
Going through my archives I found some files dated May 22, 1985.  From this
I find that there are theoretical grounds that the maximum number of digits
is at most 60.  But indeed the largest one is the one shown above, there
are non with more digits.  Extending the table to the end:
26 digits: none
27 digits: 121204998563613372405438066
           121270696006801314328439376
           128851796696487777842012787
           174650464499531377631639254
           177265453171792792366489765
28 digits: none
29 dogits: 14607640612971980372614873089
           19008174136254279995012734740
           19008174136254279995012734741
           23866716435523975980390369295
30 digits: none
31 digits: 1145037275765491025924292050346
           1927890457142960697580636236639
           2309092682616190307509695338915
32 digits: 17333509997782249308725103962772
33 digits: 186709961001538790100634132976990
           186709961001538790100634132976991
34 digits: 1122763285329372541592822900204593
35 digits: 12639369517103790328947807201478392
           12679937780272278566303885594196922
36 digits: none
37 digits: 1219167219625434121569735803609966019
38 digits: 12815792078366059955099770545296129367
39 digits: 115132219018763992565095597973971522400
           115132219018763992565095597973971522401

I have tried it also for other bases.  If we also count the trivial one
digit numbers I find the following:
     base    total     max digits (max to search)
       2       1          1( 2)
       3       5          3( 7)
       4      11          4(13)
       5      17         14(20)
       6      30         18(28)
       7      59         23(35)
       8      62         29(43)
       9      58         30(52)
      10      88         39(60)
      11     134         45(69)
      12      87         51(78)
I do not see a particular pattern.
-- 
dik t. winter, cwi, kruislaan 413, 1098 sj  amsterdam, nederland
home: bovenover 215, 1025 jn  amsterdam, nederland
dik@cwi.nl
From: dhesi@rahul.net (Rahul Dhesi)
Newsgroups: rec.puzzles
Subject: vacuuously false?
Date: 29 Jul 92 15:33:39 GMT
Organization: a2i network

Normally an assertion

     if A then B

is considered to be vacuously true if A is known to be false.  But
consider this assertion:

     if today is Monday then tomorrow is Tuesday

Is this vacuously true on Friday?
--
Rahul Dhesi <dhesi@rahul.net>
also:  dhesi@cirrus.com
From: jimhsu@athena.mit.edu (Jimmy M.D. Hsu)
Subject: Can anyone do better?
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 04:19:44 GMT

Dave Ring has an answer, but
could he explain how he arrived
at his approximations, briefly?
How about a generic formula?
Or the fifth spade variation?
Or does this beat a dead horse?

(Any guesses on the nine spot one, btw?)
I would love to see generic formulae.
Brute force is less elegant, in general.

--
James Amdee  MIT
Look!  By the way he moves
his head!  HE'S NUTATING!
From: CAPSA <capsa@igc.org>
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Date: 24 Jul 92 22:00 PDT
Subject: Re: Computers & chess ethics
Nf-ID: #R:92204.150925U55342@uicvm.uic.edu:435507810:cdp:1451600013:000:298
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!capsa    Jul 24 22:00:00 1992


Bert, it was Tarrasch -- NOT Tartakower -- who said (as part of a more personal
statement) that, "Chess, like love, like music, has the power to make men
happy."  While Tartakower has -- and deserves -- a great reputation for wit,
Tarrasch could write a fine line, too.

Fraternally,

Jerry Bibuld
From: emarkp@ocf.berkeley.edu (E. Mark Ping)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Re: Castling and Check
Date: 27 Jul 1992 18:32:09 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: earthquake.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Jul24.201522.2472@sco.com> richardr@sco.COM (Richard Robinson) writes:
>
>In article <1992Jul20.235847.14002@husc3.harvard.edu> elkies@ramanujan.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies) writes:
>>No.  On the other hand they would do well to plug another recently
>>discovered hole, this one concerning the definition of check: as the
>>rules now stand, you're in check if you king is attacked by 1 or 2
>>pieces, but not if attacked by 3 or more.  Thus Norman claims a White
>>win in the position WKf6,Qe5,g5/BKh8,Rb7,Bh5,Nb8 with 1.g6?! Nd7+ 2.Kf7+
>>N:e5++ 3.g7+!!? (Kf7 is no longer in check!) Kh7 4.g8Q+ Kh6 5.Qg7#,
>
>If the rulebook does not use 'exactly 1 or 2' pieces, or synonymous language
>I would think that being attacked by 3 or more pieces is still being attacked
>by 1 piece.  That is, they are not ruling out the case of being attacked
>by more than one piece.  My default interpretation would be that 'attacked 
>by 1 piece' should be equivalent to 'attacked by at least one piece'.

  It's interesting that both the FIDE and USCF rulebooks both specify '1 or
2 pieces' attacking the king.  However, in the USCF rules, it says
specifically that the check must be parried by one of the following:
capturing the checking piece (not possible if attacked by two), blocking the
check (again not possible if attacked by two, also is specifically mentioned
as not possible in the case of a knight being the attacking piece) or by a
king move.  So under USCF rules, the case mentioned above is not legal,
because the player did not parry check with one of the allowed ways.

  As a side note, I couldn't find *anything* forbidding the king to move
into check!  Both rulebooks simply defined check and said that it must be
parried on the next move.  So if I move into check, I guess I just have to
move back out on the next move?!?!  Does anyone have better eyes than I and
can spot such a restriction?


-- 
Another student, lost in the sea that is called Bezerekely.  His name?
E. Mark Ping
emarkp@ocf.Berkeley.EDU

  "Stand aside, I take large steps."  --Michael Dorn
  "Say, that's a nice bike." --Cyberdyne Systems T-1000
  "Pituita es."  --Unknown Latin Scholar
From: annan@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Re: Computers & chess ethics
Date: 29 Jul 92 14:48:54 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAXcluster

In article <1992Jul29.120421.28382@visus.com>, nash@visus.com (Richard V. Nash) > In article <92209.184146U13054@uicvm.uic.edu> U13054@uicvm.uic.edu (Howard  

> Sorry for getting into this late but...
>    Mechanical memory and human memory are fundamentally different.

This sounds dangerously close to "proof by assertion". What is the reasoning
behind it? Of course the brain is squishy and grey, computers are hard and,
well, grey. This one is anyway. Is this the "fundamental difference" or is
there another one?

Don't tell me that the difference is that computer memory is infallible: I also
have a huge infallible memory (until I die or grow [more?] senile). And so does
everyone reading this.


>I  
> suspect this is because the mechanical device has the ability to exactly recall  
> what it has in memory, and the human cannot. This is not a trivial difference  
> or even a quantitative one. It qualitatively differentiates the type of  
> memorys.

I can exactly recall huge amounts of my memory, and I'm not unusual in that
respect. I can't access _all_ of it: is this really the "fundamental
difference"?

Perhaps you mean I can't program it easily: but then, some people can, and I
could get a lot better if I tried. So this can't be the difference either. What
is?

-- 
James Annan.
                [--------------------------------------]
                [  "The only good Tory is a lavatory"  ]
                [--------------------------------------]
From: drchip@cup.portal.com (MYRON A LIEBERMAN)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Re: Chess Chow, again
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 00:26:33 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

While I could, and perhaps at a future time will, give a detailed review
of "Chess Chow" I think the very detailed information on the last few
issues were well described by Dennis Baker and Bruce Leverett. I see no
reason to repeat what is already well documented, however I do want to
make a few comments regarding the magazine. What is their goal? Only the[D
publishers can answer that and I think they did when they describe a chess
magazine that is fun to read. Chess Chow is at the very least fun to read.
I speak here about consistency as well as specific articles. One of the
aspects of tournament chess that is not captured in any other American
chess magazine to nearly the same degree as it is in CC is the social
aspect. Tournament coverage often touches on the unique incidents, events,
and impressions that can make a tournament memorable off the board while
not sacrificing in-depth analysis to do it. The pictorial coverage of the
St Martin tournament coupled with Joel Benjamin's article and games (June
July 1992 issue) is second only to being a participany or spectator at
St Martin. The June-July issue also balanced the Marshall and Manhattan
CC championships with a page of chess poetry (and a humorous disclaimer
about chess poetry competition). While it may be true that the Chess
Trivia column will contain items that may be inside jokes to certain
people it still helps solidify the atmosphere of professional chessplayers
as being people definable and interesting personalities. Frankly, one of the
problems chess has had with media coverage historically is the lack of
a body of "trivia" that makes personalities out of people. The writing
style for most of the articles is personal, even for game analysis. Joel
Benjamin's "Swill" column points at potentially flawed analysis and helps
writers think more thoroughly before publishing analysis that might be
questionable. The U.S. Men's and Women's Championship coverage in the
October/November,1991, issue clearly shows the value of a first person
account of an event. Joel Benjamin and Vesna Dimitrijevic take the reader
with them on a quest for the championship. Liz Neely's brilliancy prize
game against Krystyna Wieckiewicz was presented as part of the coverage.
The bottom line is that Chess Chow presents the agony regularly :) and the
ecstasy...and the personality of chess. The games. The people. The humor.
The instruction. The concerns. The events. Good job, Joel and staff. This
is a welcome addition to chess journalism. 
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess