HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pranata@watserv.ucr.edu (Krisanto Pranata)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The Voyage: A Synopsis
Date: 14 Oct 92 17:19:33 GMT
Article-I.D.: galaxy.22961

In article <1992Oct13.230011.23079@nuscc.nus.sg> smoliar@argon.iss.nus.sg  
(stephen smoliar) writes:
> In article <1992Oct13.084300.12326@uvm.edu>  
cavrak@newton.emba.uvm.edu.uvm.edu (Steve Cavrak) quote fro THE NEW YORK TIMES:
> >The sets for "The Voyage," designed by Robert Israels, are among
> >
> Note that this is the same team that gave us 1000 AIRPLANES ON THE ROOF.  The
> Stephen W. Smoliar; Institute of Systems Science

Well, I hate to burst your statement of "facts" here, but I do beleive that the  
set design for 1000 AIRPLANES ON THE ROOF was NOT done by Robert Israel, but  
rather by Jerome Sirlin (who I beleived did set design for a production of  
Wagner's Ring Cycle and also THE HYDROGEN JUKEBOX (Glass and Ginsberg))


Robert Israel did work on the sets of one of P. Glass's opera and I think it is  
AKHNATEN (but I'm not sure on this)



kris

pranata@watserv.ucr.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rsi@scf16.scf.loral.com (Rich S. Ishikawa)
Subject: Favorite Beethoven piano sonatas!!!
Organization: Loral Space and Range Systems, Sunnyvale, CA
Distribution: rec
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 18:48:01 GMT



Just thought I should start a new thread...   My favorite sonatas by
Beethoven:


All time favorite (in descending order):

1. Piano Sonata #32 Op.111     - His last, his greatest and most emotional.

2. Piano Sonata #31 Op.110.    - Pretty joyous piece.

3. Piano Sonata #?? Op.31 No.2 - Fantastic middle period sonata. Very lively.

4. Piano Sonata #?? Op.10 No.3 - Most favorite early piano sonata.

5. Piano Sonata #30 Op.109.    - Really nice sounding late sonata.

6. Piano Sonata #?? Op.90.     - Very exhilarating 2nd movement.

7. Op.57, Op.54, Op.106, Op.101, Op.13, Op.27#2, Op.28 - all really 
   nice pieces, but not as awesome as the above pieces.

8. The remaining ones...


I can emphatically guarantee you'd really like the 1-6 piano sonatas if you 
haven't listened to them (assuming a proper Beethoven interpretation, of
course).

Did I leave any out??



-RI






--
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
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-*-*-*-* rsi@scf16.scf.loral.com -*-*-\   - can't be the question.  /*-*-*-*-*-
-*-*-* Loral Space and Range Systems *-*-*-*-* (408)734-6337 *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
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From: Bill_P_Pearce@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Gluck's Iphigenie en Tauride
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 92 22:10:34 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

    I like to share my enthusiasm from time to time for a newly
discovered (that is, newly discovered by me) work thatI find very
enjoyable.  This time it is Gluck's "Iphigenie en Tauride" - I just
bought a recording and liked it very much.  I was gratified to learn
that it is regarded as Gluck's masterpiece (not that I would stop liking
it if it were not, but it is reassuring to find out that one's judgment
is shared by those who are qualified to know).  It is too bad it is never
(or hardly ever, I would think) performed; I think only "Orfeo de Euridice"
amont Gluck's operas is ever done today (at least that is the only one I
have ever seen).  I imagine it would be difficult to stage and perhaps
would not sit too well with modern audiences, with the deus ex machina
(or dea ex machina, I guess, since it is Diana in a cloud) at the end, and
Orestes and Pylades spending so much time professing love for each other
(an 18th century convention, I think, not the way a modern audience would
look at two men swearing undying love) and vying for the right to die 
in place of the other.  I would think it could be quite effective, though,
as the music is powerful and very dramatic.

       Bill Pearce
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: bryan@netcom.com (Bryan Higgins)
Subject: Brendel's Beethoven on Vox Box CDs
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 08:02:10 GMT


Can anyone tell me when the ultra-cheap (each "Vox Box" volume is two discs for
$8 at Tower Classics in Berkeley) Brendel recordings of the Beethoven piano
sonatas on Vox were recorded?
-- 
Bryan Higgins, Berkeley, California  (bryan@netcom.com)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: spg@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Stephen P. Guthrie)
Subject: used cd store in Stuttgart
Originator: spg@Xenon.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 13:40:28 GMT

Does anyone know of a store that buys second-hand classical cds
in the Stuttgart (Germany) area?

     Thanks,
     Stephen Guthrie

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Re: Opera in the vernacular
In-reply-to: 00hfstahlke@bsu-ucs.uucp's message of 14 Oct 92 22:00:08 GMT
Organization: pubs
	<Bw487F.Kuo@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>
	<1992Oct14.170008.10589@bsu-ucs.uucp>
Date: 15 Oct 92 10:17:25 CDT

Herb Stahkle writes:
...
   It gets hard enough sometimes in English.  I've seen conductors
   struggle with the line "Who is this king of glory" from the chorus
   "Lift up your heads" in Handel's Messiah.  They think that the "this"
   must be stressed and substitute "the" for it, changing the meaning
   considerably.  This results from failing to realize that English also
   has an unstressed "this" whose use differs slightly from the use of
   the stressed "this." ...

This brings up my anti-favorite musical treatment of words: "the bombs
bursting in air" in the Star-Spangled Banner.  It would be easy enough
to put "the" before the beat, unstressed, and give "bombs" a longer note
on the beat, but we force the syllables into the predetermined musical
line, with a resulting effect of "THUH-b'ms bursting in air".  Maybe we
should trash it and use Bernstein's America, or maybe Springsteen's Born
in the USA, at baseball games.

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com

From: chrisr@hpcvra.cv.hp.com (Chris Robson)
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 00:35:10 GMT
Subject: Thanks, and more book Qs.
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Corvallis, OR, USA
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical

Hi,
	Firstly, many thanks to the people who posted or e-mailed responses
to my question about books on the history of notation. I intend to make
my way to my local library with a fist full of inter library loan forms
in a week or so.

	I have another question on books which you guys may be able to
help me with. I am looking for a dictionary of musical themes - the type
where you can transpose a toon to start on C, look it up in the back and
it refers you to the work you need. I have seen these books, but not recently.
None of the local stores have one (not even Powells in Portland), so I
guess I will have to order one, so - can anyone give me the info I need
(Title, Author, ISBN, Price)? If more than one of these beasts exist, then
recommendations would be most welcome.

	E-mail or post, although I suspect others may be interested in
these (given the number of 'What is the toon used on ...' postings).

		thanks,


			Chris. xxx.


P.S. Hi Simon, How's Wagner? Persuaded the BCS to do Tristan yet?


________________________________________________________________________________
    "It's a sobering thought that by the time Mozart was my age he had been
                    dead for two years" - Tom Lehrer.
________________________________________________________________________________
Chris Robson, MS 5UR5			Phone:	(503) 750-2766
HP Corvallis Division			Fax:	(503) 752-7811
1000 NE Circle Bvd.
Corvallis, OR 97330			E-Mail:	chrisr@hpcvra.cv.hp.com
USA
From: wilcox@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Pachelbel Canon(s)?
Date: 16 Oct 92 14:54:29 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <910773f.4.719202066@ace.acadiau.ca>, 910773f@ace.acadiau.ca (HEATHER LEE FYFFE) writes:
> 
> There is only one, original Pachelbel piece, known to us today as the 
> canon.  It is true that it is actually a chaconne, but I had heard that 
> Pachelbel himself erred in the naming of it.  

As a resident pedant, I just thought I'd point out that it is a chaconne on the
ground bass DABF#GDGA *and* a canon in the treble lines. As for
instrumentation, I think it was originally for violins and basso continuo, but
I'm sure you could make a reasonable case for substituting almost any treble
instrument.
-- 

Stephen Wilcox             |   Remember what happened to the dinosaurs!
wilcox@maths.oxford.ac.uk  |    I did---and look what happened to me.
From: lampson@software.pulse.com (Dave Lampson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Brendel's Beethoven on Vox Box CDs
Date: 12 Oct 92 20:29:08 GMT


In Article 39849 of rec.music.classical, Bryan Higgins (bryan@netcom.com) writes:
>Can anyone tell me when the ultra-cheap (each "Vox Box" volume is two discs for
>$8 at Tower Classics in Berkeley) Brendel recordings of the Beethoven piano
>sonatas on Vox were recorded?

I believe these recordings were made between 1962 and 1965 (give or take a
year or two).  The recording quality is quite good, though there is some 
variation, as you'd expect with any such under taking.  The sonatas have
been released in four volumes, and they just recently released a Vox Box 3 
(3CDs) with many of the variations and other smaller piano pieces (not
including the Diabelli variations).  The Diabelli variations and the 6 
bagatelles Op. 126 are available on a Vox Turnabout single-CD release 
(PVT7200).

So, that brings the total number of CDs available in Brendel's Beethoven
cycle on Vox to 12.  Given what Roger said, it appears that there are
at least a couple more to come before the cycle is complete.  For instance,
"Fur Elise", a couple more bagatelle sets, ecossaises, and numerous shorter
pieces have not been released.

I have (incomplete) sets of the sonatas by Gilels, Arrau, Michelangeli,
Goode and Barenboim.  I've also heard the more recent (late '70s) set
Brendel did for Philips.  Overall The Vox recordings hold up very well.
Michelangeli and Barenboim are my least favorites.  The digital recordings
by Gilels, Goode and Arrau are excellent on the whole.  Still, I don't
hesitate to recommend the Vox recordings as a low-cost place to begin.
Particularly when you can get these occasionally great performances
by Brendel (which I favor marginally over his more conservative and 
somewhat less exciting Philips set) for a little over $30, you can't 
go wrong.


Dave
lampson@pulse.com

For detailed lists of Recommended Classical CDs, Basic Repertoire and Buying
Guide access cs.uwp.edu (131.210.1.4) by anonymous FTP, or email me for info.

Contribute to the rec.music.classical biography project!  Email me your bio!


Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: icking@gmd.de (Werner Icking)
Subject: Re: Alternate Classical-Music FAQ Memo
Organization: GMD, Sankt Augustin, Germany
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 12:44:03 GMT

In <1992Oct13.164910.18433@newstand.syr.edu> jmwobus@mailbox.syr.EDU (John M. Wobus) writes:

>Alternative FAQ Memo for Classical Music
[...]
>How to read this document: Picture a ":-)" after each sentence.
[...]
:-)

>(14) Who is better: Bach or Beethoven?
[...]
> (o) Was he also a fine improviser?       yes     yes
  (p) Is his name Bach                     yes     no

> Now we can answer this question once and for all: Beethoven
> got 12 yesses to Bach's 11.  Sorry, Mr. Bach.

Wrong! 12 : 12.  Sorry Mr. -- ahemm, what is your name?

Werner

PS:

>(15) What's the deal with temperment?

>  Just - has nice (beat-free) major 3rds and 5ths.  It is hard
>   to play much with it without getting into different versions
>   of notes (i.e., sometimes when you play an A it is higher
>   than others).

"Real" string players (if not confused by keyboard or fretted instrument
players) use this :-)

--
Werner Icking        Werner.Icking@gmd.de        (+49 2241) 14-2443     __o
GMD - Gesellschaft fuer Mathematik und Datenverarbeitung mbH          _`\<,_
Schloss Birlinghoven, P.O.Box 1316, D-5205 Sankt Augustin, Germany   (_)/ (_)
                             "Der Dativ ist dem Genitiv sein Tod." ~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Beatles and the canon
In-reply-to: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU's message of Wed, 14 Oct 1992 14:58:21 GMT
Organization: pubs
Date: 14 Oct 92 13:58:19 CDT

Roger Lustig writes:

   Of course, if you want to match up a modern to Verdi, Lennon and
   McCartney make him look pretty sick, y'know?  The "common folk"
   know about a hundred more of their tunes than they do Verdi.  Perhaps
   500.

Roger, you've previously said that the Beatles consitute something like
a modern canon, and I've been wondering about this topic in general.  My
daughter and her friend seem to know the Beatles as well as we oldsters
do, but I know people in their 20s and 30s who don't know their songs at
all.  For a few decades people have been saying that the chestnuts by
Kern, Gershwin, Porter et al are "classics", a permanent canon.  But
when my daughter played Star Dust in a musical program, essentially no
one there knew the song (still, I believe, the best-selling song of all
time).  My wife, a musician, didn't know it.  Only the oldsters and a
few who are specifically interested in pop classics knew it.  I find
this regrettable, but it's making me think that even the biggest pop
hits eventually join "After the Ball" and "Over There" as historical
curiosities.  Aber des Herrn Wort bleibet in Ewigkeit...same with
Beethoven?

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Britten's 4 Sea Interludes
Organization: pubs
Date: 16 Oct 92 10:54:08 CDT


I've heard bits and pieces of Britten's Four Sea Interludes from Peter
Grimes and I think it's a cool piece.  I would like to get it on CD but
I have no idea where to start.  Do you r.m.c'ers have any recommenda-
tions?  If so, what are they?  Please e-mail your responses to me since
our news feed is VERY flaky.  If there is much interest, I will compile
the results and have them posted.  Thanks.

John S. Humanski
humanski@sunfs1.dsd.northrop.com

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: le01167@portal.lasc.lockheed.com (Ron Nadel)
Subject: Re: Brahms 3rd Symphony (Repost)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Lockheed Aeronautical Systems Co. - Rye Canyon
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 92 21:51:11 GMT

In article <92282.173939ECOSLB@BYUVM.BITNET>, <ECOSLB@BYUVM.BITNET> writes...

>I'm looking for a good recording of Brahms 3rd and would appreciate
>your recommendations.  The recordings I have seen in local stores are
>Szell (Sony), Bernstein(Sony and DG), Karajan (3 different recordings),
>and Toscanini.

Karajan is my favorite Brahms conductor, even though he never takes a
repeat in the sonata movements.  The recording you mentioned with both
the 2nd and 3rd on the same CD dates from the 60s, and this is my favorite
of the 5 he did, but the 3rd is the least satisfying of that cycle.
Nonetheless, it makes a great bargain with a very good 2nd on the same
CD and the sound is surprisingly fresh (ADD).  Karajan's best Brahms 3rd
comes from his late 70's set which is also available as part of a DGG mid-
priced complete set of the 4 symphonies (although, the others from this
set are not all as great), and the sound is very very good.  He made his 
final Brahms cycle not long before he died, and to me they pale when 
compared with his earlier attempts.

I've heard the Bernstein DGG recordings, and the sound is terrific, but
I just don't care for his readings, maybe I've just had too many years
to hear Karajan.

I'm not a Toscanini fan in general, and heard his Brahms on RCA Victor LPs
years and years ago. they didn't do anything for me.

I've not heard the Szell, and actually would be interested to hear from those
who've heard his and Karajan's give a comparison.

I've also heard Brahms cycles by Giulini (2), Solti, Haitink, Boult, Kertesz,
and the Karajan sounds "right" to me.

Ron
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Glass meets Clive Barker response
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 14:56:59 GMT

In article <1992Oct13.075353.11199@dartvax.dartmouth.edu> Joseph.J.Marcheso.Jr.@dartmouth.edu (Joseph J. Marcheso Jr.) writes:
>In article <98436@bu.edu>
>jaeger@buphy.bu.edu (Gregg Jaeger) writes:

>> With this sort of reaction to new composers
>It's sad that you confuse novelty for originality. Every period was
>accepted within 80 years but this modern and atonal music gets more
>detractors every day. 

Glass atonal?  This is news.  

(For the record, atonal music is also *listened* to by many more people
than it used to, as well.  (And I won't even bring up the matter of
atonal film scores...) )

>Its a music of snobs 

Well, at least we know what'as atonal and what's not...

>and the musically well educated get back to basics get back to Verdi

Well-educated, eh?  Tell me again about atonal Glass -- for that matter,
about *modern* Glass.  Seems quite postmodern, if not anti-modern, to
me.  

Now go and look at your favorite performers--and then explain why *they*
like to perform that "music of snobs"...

Roger
From: inr@eccles.caltech.edu (I. Neill Reid)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: re: La Phil
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:26:00 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology
NNTP-Posting-Host: eccles.caltech.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

To refresh my memory, I listened to a couple of recordings of Mahler 3
last night - Tilson Thomas and the LSO (whom I unjustly maligned over
the evil Mrs. T.) and Kubelik and the Symphony Orchestra of Bayern Rundfunk.
I would not be so foolhardy as to actually claim on this newsgroup that
either was the definitive version, but both  have a greater cohesion in the
first and second movements than I heard at the Phil on Saturday. The
main reasons, I think, are that they both take less of a pause between 
segments and Tilson Thomas at least grows into slightly faster tempi after
the change of direction. Saturday I had a definite feeling of full stop -
dramatic pause - start up again. Both recordings also explore a wider 
dynamic range, in particular being less sparing in growing to f and above.

 That sais, and nitpicking aside, I agree that the LA Phils playing was 
better than I've ever heard before. But overall I found the performance
to be good - even very good for the latter movements - but not great.
It was certainly a lot better than I expected.

 Neill Reid - inr@eccles.caltech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer)
Subject: Re: The Abuse of Classical Music
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 14:39:58 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.132044.8442@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> fernande@cps.msu.edu (Jose Roberto Fernandez) writes:
>One of the greatest abuses to me is the (over)use of Gershwin's Rhapsody
>in Blue in the United Airlines commercials.  Hearing it over and over
>(in short excerpt form) has seriously harmed my enjoyment of that piece.

I agree.  They could have used it once, and any association would be
forgotten after a year.  Nowdays, I don't think you can listen to
Rhapsody In Blue without seeing runways and air traffic control towers.
It is like they adopted it as their corporate logo, and people will
think it is United's and not Gershwin's. 

Jeff 
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: pkbockus@gsbphd.uchicago.edu (Keith Bockus)
Subject: Re: Vox Box (Was Re: Brendel's Beethoven on Vox Box CDs)
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 15:22:30 GMT

abrocke1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Aaron Brockett) writes:

>This seems like a perfect opportunity to pose a question about the general
>quality of the performances on the Vox label. I know it's often misleading
>to attept to generalize about the output of an entire company, but if
>anyone could do so, I'd appreciate it. 

Okay, here's a really gross generalization.  Their recordings
of solo piano are often _very_ good.  E.g., Abbey Simon's Ravel,
Frank Glazer's Satie, Ivan Moravec's Chopin and Debussy, and especially
Jerome Rose's Liszt "Annees..." are worth far more than you'll
pay, with both performance and sound quality being first-rate.

I've had less success with their orchestral performances. 
Relative to the competition, I've found that both performance
and sound quality fall somewhat short.  They have many  
acceptable recordings (e.g. Rach. Piano concertos), I just 
haven't found any that are my first choice for listening.

Keith Bockus
 
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: le01167@portal.lasc.lockheed.com (Ron Nadel)
Subject: Re: Why switch to CD?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Lockheed Aeronautical Systems Co. - Rye Canyon
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 92 21:04:16 GMT

I avoided switching to CD for several reasons.  I have thousands of LPs
and over the years spent thousands of dollars for hiss, pop, and tick filters,
dynamic range expanders, equalizers, and record care gadgets.  When friends
listened to music with me, they often could not tell that it was an LP.
Even so, some of my favorite pieces were beginning to show age, etc.

Then, one day in a local record chain, I noticed a major error in the price
tag of Solti's Gotterdammerung CD.  The kid who did the pricing mistook the
"-2" in the record number to mean 2 cds (there are 4).  The entire Ring and
a copy of Parsifal were mispriced in this fashion (half priced) .  I could not
resist and bought them all, and the next day bought a cd player.

I share Jon's opinion that CDs are much more convenient than anything.  Many
of my LPs sound better than some of my CDs (although many CDs do sound great
too).  To be able to listen to an entire act of a Wagner opera without leaving
your chair is a real pleasure (or an entire symphony).  

I have spent much money on duplicate cd recordings of some of my most beloved
LPs, but don't regret it, because I had been periodically re-purchasing them
when they were still available as LPs as I wore them out.  Interestingly
enough, when I compare some of the ADD CDs with the LP version, the CD does 
not always sound as good or better than the LP.  But, I can't tell you how
much trouble I used to have with the sound of surface noise (especially on
London/Decca) that I no longer have.

Ron
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical