HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: djohns@elm.circa.ufl.edu (David A. Johns)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Rage, ranting and race
Date: 13 Nov 92 10:13:25 GMT
Organization: University of Florida, Gainesville

In article <T7XuTB1w165w@netlink.cts.com> galan@netlink.cts.com (Greg Gross) writes:

[Note: Our site apparently never got your response below to my
posting.  I'm taking this from your response to the posting from Wm.
Douglas Withers. I hope it's not taken out of context.]

# > White suburbanites are not flocking to aid poor Appalachians or
# > Bosnians, any more than American blacks are crying over
# > conditions in Somalia or even Haiti.  People live in small
# > worlds.
#
# What makes you assume that we as a group have no interest in what
# is happening in Somalia or Haiti?  Do not mistake a sense of
# powerlessness for a lack of concern.

I think I'm using the same criterion you use in determining the
prototypical white person's attitudes toward the plight of American
blacks -- results.  How much money or personal effort is flowing from
American black communities to these impoverished, oppressed countries?

[And now from your more recent posting to Mr. Withers...]

# Whites powerless? An interesting concept. You need to elaborate on
# it a bit more than you have here, though.

I think you're mixing two meanings of "power" here, Gregg.  Whites on
the average may be "empowered" in comparison to blacks because they
have fewer restrictions on "the pursuit of happiness".  But this does
not mean they have the "power" as individuals to do anything on behalf
of blacks.

They do have voting "power", of course, by force of numbers.  But
governmental policies that will benefit the poor and oppressed are far
too remote and complex for the average person to evaluate.

I don't see that the average white has any more power to change inner
city conditions than does, say, the average middle-class black.

David

P.S. By the way, as long as our system is filtering incoming messages,
if you want me to see your reply, it might be a good idea to mail me a
copy.
From: joan@koala.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: the legacy of European Conquest (was Interracial Dating)
Date: 7 Nov 1992 19:01:00 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: koala.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Nov7.155159.3632@panix.com> lkk@panix.com (Larry Kolodney) writes:

[part deleted]

]>Sounds like that's YOUR understanding of "stone age."  All "stone age"
]>implied to me is technologically undeveloped.  At that much can't be
]>denied about the Native Americans.  They has not developed the wheel
]>or any kind of metal smelting (two of the keystones of technological
]>development) at the time of Columbus.
]>
]>Now you may think that technological development is not all good.
]>Fair enough, but you can't deny that the American Indians had very
]>little of it.

Probably a better term could be used than "technological development".
Although the native americans had not had the industrial revolution
they had many, and many highly-developed technologies.  

Perhaps "industrial development" would convey the meaning better.

Joan V

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: dem@engin.umich.edu (Darryle E Merlette)
Subject: Re: Need Evident for two well known comments
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 15:08:10 EST
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor
Keywords: income,Napoleon,sphrinx

In article <1992Nov9.235030.2005@nosc.mil>
sterrett@nosc.mil (Anthony E. Sterrett) writes:

>I need some support evidents for the comment that during the 
>Reagan Admin the upper 2% household had 50%+ of the wealth.
>Any support.

From _Scientific American_, May 1987 "A Surge in Inequality" by
L. C. Thurow:
"According to the US Bureau of the Census, the share of total
income that went to the top 20%  of all families was 43.5% in
1985, the highest level recorded since the data were first 
collected in 1947...Conversely, the income share of the bottom
60% of the population in 1985 was 32.4%, the lowest level ever
recorded...The top 2% of the population receive 14% of total
income and have 28% of total net worth. Similarly, the top 10
percent's share of income (33%) almost doubles to a 57% share
of net worth. In contrast, the bottom 50% of the population have
4.5% of total net worth. About half of the country's top wealth
holders got there by inheriting their holdings and half through
their own efforts. In the top wealth group 98% are white." pg. 30

More specific to your request:
"If one leaves aside homes and real estate, the top 2% of all families
are found to own  54% of all net financial assets (stocks, bonds,
pension funds, and so on), the top 10% to own 86% and the bottom 55%
to have zero or negative financial assets." pg. 32

>Second, The Napoleon blew the nose off the sphrinx.

I know Dr. Ben Jochannan's (sp?) book _Africa: Mother of Western
Civilization_ mentions this. I've also seen it elsewhere but 
can't recall exactly where at the moment. Perhaps C. F. Volney's
_Ruins of Empires_?

Hope this helps,
	Darryle
From: jumper@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Michael Lanham)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Saying Goodbye to Peewee <was Spike Lee>
Date: 7 Nov 92 04:35:08 GMT
Organization: North Carolina State University

[below is referencing Peewee (Philip Stromer)]
lovegod@wam.umd.edu (Donald Andrew Agarrat) writes:
>Thank you, Warren, for the warning.

>My last words to you, White man, are that we do not need you for  
>shit.  We simply do not need another White man who thinks he's  
>doing us a favor.  We need more of our people patting each other  
>on the back, because God knows that there's a  White man waiting  
>outside just waiting to put us down.  Just go away.

>Damn, I feel sorry for your children ...

Oh Brother...peewee is right about one thing, everyone sitting around always
blowing smoke or anything substansive (ie legitmate use for praise) eventually
smothers lively discussion.  I came to this group KNOWING there would be whites
posting and wondering what they felt like. I think I already have a feel for
what most brothers and sisters are feeling, this group backs up most of those
thoughts. 

I have learned a few things, including items of note from peewee, donald,
carl, and gabrielle(whom I mistakenly called a guy at one point...i did not
read the attribute line).  Barbara and everyone else provide tidbits here an
there also.  BTW, I already know how I feel so having peewee say his thang
aint no big deal to me.  I grew up with very little racism or overt prejudice
in my life.  Because of that I find it harder to identify with those who have
grown up around bigots.  You may think I am wrong but unless someone is
obvious about their prejudices AND acts on them, I refuse to go out of my way
to even think about racial motives to everything.  

I can literally only change a small sphere around me.  The way I do that is
when I hear somebody say Jew I think human, Japanese..human, spic...human,
brother...HUMAN, sister...HUMAN, wop...HUMAN, you get my drift?  When folks
tell me I got prejudices, I say yeh I do, but I try like hell not to act em.
(wonder if i offended enough groups in that first sentence :-)

He who will not reason, is a bigot; he who cannot is a fool;
and he who dares not is a slave.      --- Sir William Drummond

Michael Lanham       mjlanham@eos.ncsu.edu   &  jumper@catt.ncsu.edu
From: peewee@infoserv.com (Philip Stromer)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Gun Control
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 18:57:44 PST
Distribution: world
Organization: Friends of Lenny Bruce

        >some folks in this country think this country would be a
        >better place to live if everyone of us carried around our own 
        >little snub-nosed pistols, small and cute little assault rifles, 
        >cuddly bazookas and even personal nuclear devices (PNDs), 
        
Someone call me?  :)        

I love the idea of everyone walking around with guns.  The thugs out 
there would think twice if they thought every potential victim had a
gun.  Car jackings would be less popular if the bad guy thought the
driver had a gun at his side, ready to blow his head off.

        >I don't know ANYONE that would REQUIRE people to be armed. 
        
What about Pat Buchanan?  :)        

        >Now, shoot me if I'm wrong, but if there were no handguns and 
        >no assault rifles anywhere, absolutely anywhere, in this country, 
        >how many deaths would we have from shootings?"

BLAM, you're dead!  Just kidding.  Your question is an idealistic one,
but not realistic.  If we had no crime, we would have no need for cops,
either.  

        >"But what about the government taking away all our individual 
        >rights, stealing our homes, our property, stealing our children, 
        >rapists in the streets, cracked-up wackos breaking into our homes 
        >and killing us just to get our pocket-change?"

Sounds like a good reason to keep a gun.  If I only wasn't so CHICKEN of
them, I'd go out and buy one.  But I'll stick to my Akita dog as my
protector.

--Philip Stromer (peewee@infoserv.com)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: tzs@carson.u.washington.edu (Tim Smith)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,misc.headlines,alt.activism
Subject: Re: Court Ruling
Date: 10 Nov 92 20:14:56 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov10.201456.11831
Organization: University of Washington School of Law, Class of '95

bing@jazz.concert.net (Carter E. Bing) writes:
>
> COURT ALLOWS INSURANCE CUTS:
>    Supreme Court action Monday will allow employers to sharply cut 
> health insurance coverage for workers with AIDS or other costly 
> illnesses. Without comment, justices declined to hear the plea of 
> the estate of John McGann, whose Houston employer cut AIDS 
> coverage from $1 million to $5,000 after learning he had the 
> disease in 1987. McGann died last year at 47.

This is misleading: they didn't "allow" the cuts: they declined to hear
the case.  This can be done for a number of reasons that have nothing
to do with the issue at hand:

(1) They may want to wait for more lower court decisions before taking on the
issue themselves.  The Supreme Court often likes to let the different
circuits think about something and explore various arguments for both
sides before the Supreme Court makes a decision.

(2) There may be gaps or other problems in the record or there may be
facts missing that makes the Court feel that this case is not a good
vehicle to use in deciding the underlying issue.

(3) Time.  The Court has to refuse to hear many cases because there
is not enough time for all of them.  Many cases that otherwise would be
heard are rejected for this reason.

(4) Court politics.  For example, suppose there is a Justice who wants
to make a broad ruling on some point.  Suppose a case comes along that
could be used to support this, but that Justice feels that the majority
would decide on narrower grounds.  That Justice might think that if the
Court takes the case and makes the narrow decision, they may not get a
shot at subsequent cases that would provide the basis for the broad
ruling.  That Justice may then vote against hearing the case, prefering
to wait for one that will provide a better chance of getting a majority
to agree to make the broad ruling.

(5) The guy is dead.  Is there anything to decide?  Would making a decision
here be infringing on the power of Congress?

(6) Is there a Constitutional or Federal question?  They may think that the
issue is controlled by state law.

(7) If there is a Constitutional or Federal question, will it determine
the outcome?  If the answer to the question the Supreme Court is being
asked will not change the outcome (e.g., the appealing party lost for
more than one reason, and the reason not being appealed would still
cause them to lose), then the Supreme Court might not see a need to
hear the case.

--Tim Smith
From: wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.MIL (Wm. Douglas Withers -- math  FACULTY <wdw@sma.usna.navy.mil>)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Rage, ranting and race
Date: 6 Nov 92 18:19:57 GMT
Organization: U.S. Naval Academy

In article <BxAz5E.I85@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> kautaj@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (kauta) writes:
>In article <2359@usna.NAVY.MIL> wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.MIL (Wm. Douglas Withers -- math  FACULTY <wdw@sma.usna.navy.mil>) writes:
>>Now, a sincere question here:  What makes some people
>>assume that whites as a group have no interest in what is happening to
>>blacks in the inner city or elsewhere?  Do not mistake a sense of
>>powerlessness for a lack of concern.
>
>What makes *you* assume that whites as a _group_ are powerless??

Let's consider civil rights legislation as an example.  In the 60's
a group of legislators (mostly white, mind you) passed laws aimed at
making equal opportunity a reality (fair housing laws, fair lending laws,
voting-rights laws, equal-employment regulations, and more).  Other
white people opposed these, some out of plain racism, others because
they agreed with the chosen ends but not with the means.  Now, 25 years
later, we find a large segment of the black population is in worse
shape than before the laws were passed.  Which group of white people
do you expect to feel `powerful' now?  Which are the villains and which
are the heroes?

Find some white people and ask them whether the government does what they
want it to.

>Are you really in the military??

No. Are you?



-- 
Els Withers                   email: wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.mil
Department of Mathematics     phone: (410)267-3192 / fax: (410)267-4883
United States Naval Academy
Annapolis, MD  21402-5002     Senri no tabi mo ippo yori...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,triangle.politics,talk.politics.misc,soc.women,talk.rape
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american



damn!  finally a note reponding to the original seed... how
come every note that has spike in the subject line becomes
a free-for-all forum??!!?  why don't y'all just start a 
thread called FREE-FOR-ALL ?

everyone just :) :) :)

peace,
pjm.
From: johnson@whitewater.chem.wisc.edu (Art Johnson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: AIDS and the CIA (was Question)
Date: 8 Nov 92 17:32:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: pslu1.1992Nov8.173229.20754
Organization: Physical Sciences Lab, UW-Madison

In article <stovall.721181535@ficus.cs.ucla.edu> stovall@ficus.cs.ucla.edu  
(Steven Stovall) writes:
> 
> A while ago I reposted in s.c.a.a. some of Billi Goldberg's sci.med.aids
> articles on the Wistar Origin of AIDS Theory, which postulated that  
early
> polio vaccine innoculations in Zaire may have introduced simian viruses
> into humans which were precursors for HIV. That theory has lost some  
steam,
> although it is still not clear to me that samples of the 1959 vaccine  
stock
> (which were said to still exist in the freezers of the Wistar Institute)
> were ever found and tested.

     Recently, samples of the 1959 vaccine stock were found in Wistar's  
freezers. The Institute plans to have the viral DNA amplified by PCR and  
then sequenced to determine whether or not contamination with SIV in fact  
occurred. The work will be done by at least two outside laboratories not  
affiliated with Wistar.  
__________________________________________________________________________ 
_____
> 
> steven stovall
> stovall@exeter.cs.ucla.edu
> (310) 825-7307

Arthur Johnson
johnson@whitewater.chem.wisc.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,triangle.politics,talk.politics.misc,soc.women,talk.rape
From: rslugg@med.unc.edu (Robert Slugg)
Subject: Re: Eva Clayton bio
Organization: UNC-CH School of Medicine
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 23:15:23 GMT

I'll always bet on the woman with a gun and no training over the woman w/o
the gun.  If you think you are safer without one, then don't buy it.  Same
with abortion, if you are against them, don't have one.

Bob
From: nigel.allen@canrem.com (nigel allen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: nbcsl
Date: 9 Nov 92 23:20:57 GMT
Reply-To: "nigel allen" <nigel.allen@canrem.com>
Distribution: soc
Organization: Canada Remote Systems

Here is a press release from the National Black Caucus of State Legislators.

 Black State Legislators to Hold '92 Conference in New Orleans
 To: National and Assignment desks
 Contact: Kofi Owusu of the National Black Caucus of State
          Legislators, 202-624-8833

   WASHINGTON, Nov. 9  -- The National Black Caucus of State 
Legislators (NBCSL) will hold its 16th Legislative Conference 
at the ITT-Sheraton New Orleans Nov. 30 through Dec. 6.
   NBCSL president, Colorado State Sen. Regis F. Groff; conference
chair, California Assembly Member Gwen Moore; and host committee
chair, Louisiana State Sen. Diana Bajoie, announced the conference
theme: Revive, Redesign, Rebuild BLACK AMERICA "...with liberty and
justice for all."
   More than 1,000 participants are expected to attend and salute
NBCSL's growing membership.  This week's election results have added
more than 100 African American state legislators to NBCSL's ranks,
for a total of nearly 600 across the nation.  Ten African American
state legislators who were elected to the U.S. House of
Representatives and former NBCSL member Illinois Senator-elect Carol
Moseley Braun will also be honored.
   "This is the largest political movement since Reconstruction; the
largest political power shift in this century," Groff said about
the Nov. 3 state and Congressional elections.  "Effective use of this
growing political power gives African Americans dynamic influence in
deciding the political priorities and fiscal solutions to America's
many problems."
   Invited speakers include: U.S. President-elect Bill Clinton;
Illinois Senator-elect Carol Braun; Democratic National Committee
Chairman Ron Brown; University of Oklahoma Law Professor Anita Hill;
Joint Center for Political and Economic Studies President Eddie
Williams; General Benjamin O. Davis; and others.
    ------
   NOTE: NBCSL staff will be in New Orleans beginning Friday,
Nov. 27.
 -30-
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Xref: sparky soc.culture.african.american:10664 talk.politics.misc:58241
From: dc4l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Dean Calloway)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: DEBATE: Statement - 10/19/92
Date: 5 Nov 92 06:25:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.oeyIfwm00Uh782m9kx
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.soc.culture.african.american: 4-Nov-92 Re: DEBATE:
Statement - 10/.. by David Veal@utkvm1.utk.ed 
>        OK, how high?  Personally, I don't like the idea of the government
> choosing something they don't want you to do and then slowly raising the
> cost out of everyone's reach via taxes.  There's a point where you stop
> funding the government and effectively start banning things.

However, if you consider the costs imposed on others by people who make
use of alcohol and cigarettes, wouldn't it be far more responsible to
increase the taxes on these items (and I'm talking substantially)?

Alcohol is the single largest factor in crimes and accidents.  The
debilitating effects of cigarette-smoking are well-documented.  The
costs of paying for the problems associated with these two products are
being funded by the government right now, through the legal system and
health care.

In Canada, cigarettes and alcohol are taxed heavily.  People still smoke
and drink, but their habits are curbed by the costs.  Additionally,
revenues needed to pay for the problems stemming from booze and nicotine
now become available through the taxes imposed on them.

I would guess that the cost of a heavy drinker to society is
significantly higher than the price he or she pays for a six-pack.  Why
not make them pay more of it?

DCAL
Xref: sparky soc.culture.african.american:10668 alt.politics.clinton:15897
From: locker@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Locker)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.clinton
Subject: Thank God for Ron Brown
Date: 5 Nov 92 21:12:08 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

The title says it all.  IMHO, the event that really got Clinton's campaign
rolling was the Dems' convention in NYC.  Remember, it was during that
time that Clinton moved from third to first in the race, a position he was
never to relinquish.  I think the total shock of seeing a (relatively)
united Democratic party encouraged many Americans to give them a serious
listen.  Ron Brown deserves a lot of credit for the convention, and in
turn, the victory.

Anyone care to speculate on the man's future?

__
Jon Locker
U. of Illinois
"na na na na/na na na na/ hey hey - goodbye!"
From: gds@york.cs.ucla.edu (Greg Skinner)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating (The Atomic Dog Speaks)
Date: 9 Nov 92 20:57:56 GMT
Reply-To: gds@cs.ucla.edu (Greg Skinner)
Organization: in your face!
Originator: gds@york.cs.ucla.edu

In article <1992Nov9.203317.9531@cbnewse.cb.att.com> ronaldd@cbnewse.cb.att.com (ronald.h.davis) writes:
>but doesn't it so often seem that the one's doing most of the
>complaining seem to be women who:

>	a)weigh 300+pounds.  hey! there's *always* been a shortage for
>         these pigs.
>	b)have a half dozen kids by as many different guys.  who wants
>         to work hard all their lives just to raise *other* guys' kids?

Comments like this justify black women calling black men dogs, etc.
This isn't doing any of us any good.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: buckmr@marcus.its.rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire)
Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: People Of Color Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual Mailing list
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 23:40:29 GMT



--------------------------

Contact: glbpoc-request@geri.ucs.dec.com

Purpose: glbpoc is a mailing list for lesbian, gay, and bisexual people of
         color. To be added to the list you must provide your full name and a
         complete internet address.
--------------------------

-- 
RON BUCKMIRE, 11 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735. ***Clinton-Gore 92!***
vox:(518)-276-8910 fax:(518)-276-6920 buckmr@rpi.edu buckmr@rpitsmts.bitnet
"A visceral recoil from homosexuality is the natural reaction of a healthy
society wishing to preserve itself." Pat Buchanan, March 27, 1991, N.Y. POST
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: dem@engin.umich.edu (Darryle E Merlette)
Subject: Re: Detroit's Rodney King Incident
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 92 16:53:18 EST
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

Malice Green was the brother's name if I'm not mistaken.
Eyewitnesses said two cops beat him with metal flashlights
for an hour while 5 other cops watched. Afterwards, one of the
policemen threw up and the other attempted to wipe the blood
off his hands.
Yes, Detroit does have a Black mayor and police chief, and I suspect
things will be handled much differently than in LA. The 7 officers
have already been suspended *without pay* and indictments are 
expected soon.
	Darryle
"All 7 and we'll watch them fall..." -- Prince
From: peewee@infoserv.com (Philip Stromer)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Spike Lee
Date: Sun, 08 Nov 92 09:46:50 PST
Distribution: world

        >You are just another pathetic White man.  
        
Just because I don't follow Sister Souljah?  One out of two ain't bad;  
I am indeed white.
        
        >Your people already have enough to be ashamed of ...

And who are "my people"?  If you're talking about whites that owned slaves 
as "my people", you're in error.  "My people" never came to the U.S. until 
the 1930's, long after slavery was abolished by the 13th Amendment.
               
Ross Perot was called "racist" when he said "your people", so maybe you
should stop doing what he did if you expect to be taken seriously by the
casual reader of this newsgroup.

--Philip Stromer (peewee@infoserv.com)