From: Lubosh <Lubosh.Hanuska@anu.edu.au>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: WHAT WE OFFER GOD?
Date: 12 Nov 1992 03:16:36 GMT
Organization: ANU Canberra
Distribution: world
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X-XXDate: Thu, 12 Nov 92 22:16:40 GMT

In article <CHRISTIA%92110907221301@ASUACAD.BITNET> Jesse Carnes,
NOTJIC@LSUVM.BITNET writes:
>Indeed the matter is worsened when we see Christ saying that "...no one
can
>come to me unless my Father enables him" (John 6:65).
>A bit of INABILITY wouldn't you say?
>
I think I did say in my posting this is also a puzzle. I am not going to
impose my Catholic beliefs on anyone, but "the grace of God is needed for
salvation" is a part of the doctrine, and it obviously does have
something to do with the words of Jesus quoted above... As I already said
before the contradiction comes when we suppose that we only can become
Christians by receiving the grace of God - but why would we ask for
something we don't believe in ?!? In other words - let's presume that
those who do not believe in God can only gain faith by grace. Then there
are two possibilities - 1. a man who does not believe in God neither
believes in grace, and thus never *wants* to get it, and 2. a man who
does not believe in God does genuinely *want* to find the truth, and thus
unconciously *wants* the grace from God who is the only Provider of it.
I know that it will now come back to the "Catholic apologetics", but I
can't avoid it in this case: I am also the case of somebody who
effectively lost his faith, but I suppose there still was a sufficient
"deal" of grace. I was born into my Catholic Church, and grew up with it,
but as I grew up also in intention to fall into sin, tand I became a
sinner, I wasn't able see clearly, I started questioning the existence of
God, etc. In the end I did not want to be a Christian anymore, and I felt
it as a limitation to my freedom. But I also *wanted* to know what the
real truth about the world is, and I was looking at it from different
points. When I now look back, I can see how many people around me had
prayed for me, how much did their example mean for me...We can not give
our faith to others, but there are many means how one can "impose" God's
grace on somebody else without the other one knowing about it. Jesus
himself told us several times to pray for others, even to pray for our
enemies - why would we do it if they couldn't receive grace by our
prayers... As I said I was born Catholic, and many times I did not want
to be Catholic, and I did not want to believe in God, and I was asking
myself - why wasn't I born into another family without any faith,
wouldn't it be so much easier for me ?!? But being in the Church,
receiving the sacraments, and being with people who believed and lived
their faith, who prayed for me got me *lots* and *lots* of grace.
Evangelization is in a very core of the Church from the very beginning
when Paul was travelling around the whole known world to teach in the
name of Jesus; of course the means were not always justified, as in time
of Crusades, but it's already another topic. I wrote a lot, and I am not
sure if it brings a bit of light..., but I hope it does. 
In love of Christ,
Lubosh