HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gre253@mis.csiro.au (Steven Green)
Subject: Re: Marantz Surround Sound Processor
Organization: CSIRO ITS
Distribution: aus
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 01:08:31 GMT

In article <9222300.15277@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> dorset@mullauna.cs.mu.OZ.AU (Mark Dorset) writes:
>I dont know if anyone can help me but if so, muchly appreciated...
>
>I have a marantz midi hifi model 583, and in the manual it says that one
>can buy a surround sound processor for it. Does anyone know any details of
>cost, model #, etc for this system? It has a ribbon cable at the back of the
>amp for such a thing, and a surround on/off button on the front. According to
>one hi-fi store Marantz make a general purpose surround sound processor for
>about $499, but after ringing around further, another place said that this
>will only work for the video recorder as it needs a `loopback' or something,
>and doesnt use the ribbon cable etc. I want surround for the CD, Tape, Phono
>etc of course so this doesnt help much. The man also said that there was a
>surround sound processor made like the one I want, but it was never released
>in australia. (typical, i'd think)... Can anyone help me out with this?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
>

You can add surround sound to any stereo amplifier. Since the surround info.
is carried in the stereo signal. I know Marantz make one, but it is an analog
unit. Have a look at the Yamaha DSP-E1000. It is designed to give you the
5 additional ( centre, front and rear effects ) channels needed for
full 7 channel (ala-Yamaha) Pro-Logic surround. Your amp provides the
2 main channels. Also, it uses digital signal processing to do the 
surround decoding, so gives a cleaner output with more channel separation.

-- 
* Steve Green     *  "Hey Rocky, watch me pull a rabbit outa my hat!"    *
* Comms Group     *  "That trick never works"                            *
* ITS Branch      *  "Nothin' up my sleeve - PRESTO"                     *
* CSIRO Australia *  "No doubt about it - I gotta get another hat"       *
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: nics@ee.uts.edu.au (Nick Snoek)
Subject: Re: watts RMS? what watts conversion?
Organization: University of Technology, Sydney, Australia
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 22:21:57 GMT

rodneycc@brt.deakin.edu.au (Rodney Dorbolo, CFA (User Access), Burwood, Vic., Aust.) writes:

>Hi all,

>I need to know how Watts are measured, and more importantly Watts RMS.

Rodney isn't the only one confused about this issue. It seems most HI-FI
marketing people are as well.

RMS (Root Mean Square) is a mathematical operation used to compare AC signals.
As power is always positive, it is NOT required to calculate the RMS, it is
sufficient to calculate the AVERAGE ! RMS power is simple a marketing buzzword
for continuous average power, that is, the amount of power (P = VI averaged over
some long time) the amplifier is capable of producing. It is much more impressive
to spec an amplifier on it's peak power, which is Ppeak = Vmax Imax. This peak 
power is needed to accurately reproduce transients (those we hear so much about
nowadays with CDs). Especially because an amplified capable of producing say
100 W average on a sine wave, is acually producing 200 W peak. This is without 
any 'headroom' - another buzzword meaning the amount of scope these 'transients'
have to exceed the average power level. 

Therefore an amplifier capable of producing 100 W average power on a sinewave,
with a 'headroom of 3dB' (power capability for transients = 2 x average) should 
be specd at 400 W 'peak' (or PMP peak music power, HA HA).

Basically, don't believe any specs.

Stay suspicious of salesmen !

Nick

Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: mpulver@research.canon.oz.au (Mark Pulver)
Subject: Re: watts RMS? what watts conversion?
Organization: Canon Information Systems Research Australia
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 05:22:13 GMT


Strickly speaking decibels are logarithm of a power ratio, I 
can't remember the actual formula, but roughly a 3db change is a 0.5x power or
2x power change (depending on the sign). Being
a ratio the value of this number is meanless unless you know is being
compared.  Such a frequency response of speaker are measure usually
from where the energy level at is the end frequencies is 3db below
the energy output at 1k Hz.  Noise to signal value the ratio of
the energy of the noise in a signal to the signal.  ...

But often dbs are used as absolute noise measurement where 0db is basically
no noise, and 120db (or 160) will cause damage to your hearing.
-- 
Mark Pulver (mpulver@research.canon.oz.au)    _--_|\ 
                                             /      \
Canon Information Systems Research Australia \_.--._/
1 Thomas Holt Drive, North Ryde, N.S.W., 2113.     v 
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: derbyc@tplrd.tpl.oz.au (Derby Chang)
Subject: Re: Speaker Question + advice needed
Organization: Telectronics Pacing Systems
Distribution: aus
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 23:16:56 GMT


rodneycc@brt.deakin.edu.au (Rodney Dorbolo, C&CS, Deakin Uni.,Burwood,
AUS) writes:
> 
>1) I am in the market for a new pair of floor standing speakers for my
>   sound system, but I am not sure what to look for? The pair I have now
>   are o.k and really loud (I mean loud) but they seem not to have enough
>   vroooom (bass) I turn up the volume and find myself grimacing instead
>   of feeling it flow. Cash range I am looking at are $1000 - $1500.
>   I have heard seen good reviews here about Interdyn(S.F) and Infidelity
>   I have also seen some ads for these Acoustic Research Holographics
>   speakers but these could be out of my range (we can dream though).
>   I also have been looking at Wharfdales (SP?), Petersons etc.
>   Any comments on what are better, useless etc.

To get away from all of the Interdyn, Richter, AR reviews here, I'd like to
put in a hearty recommendation for another Australian-made speaker - the
very elegant Audiosound Laboratories Motet 8015.  Its a three-driver
two-way bass-reflex floor-standing model, that I had had for the past 6
months or so.  I listen to a wide range of music and they seem to suit much
of it.  They are quite efficient speakers (they quote 90dB) so you should
hear plenty of oomph from even modest amplifiers.  The two bass drivers
provide an extremely accurate bass that never sounds boomy.

For some pop music they can sound a little on the bright side, but I
suspect that that is how the sound engineers have mixed it, so the music
will sound OK on systems that don't have much of an high end.  There is a
switch on the back of the speakers to select between `studio' and `home',
the former being the straight through mode, the latter has a slight
attenuation in the upper frequencies.  By the way, this is an indication of
the pedigree of Audiosound speakers - they provide studio monitors for the
ABC (the Motet's big brother, the Linz, are used as monitors in the Sydney
Opera House).

And for the final clincher, they are so sexy to look at.  Tall, slim and
black.  They sell for $990, from the manufacturers here in Sydney.  I'm not
sure about distributors in Melbourne.

Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: edh163c@monu1.cc.monash.edu.au (J.R. Wells)
Subject: Re: watts RMS? what watts conversion?
Summary: There ain't no such things as Watts RMS
Organization: Monash University, Australia.
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 01:34:58 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.033614.21658@mel.dit.csiro.au>, gre253@mis.csiro.au (Steven Green) writes:
> In article <1992Aug25.015034.15612@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> scott@psy.uwa.oz.au (Scott Fisher) writes:
> >gre253@mis.csiro.au (Steven Green) writes:
> 
>  [everything deleted]
>  
Come on guys. RMS is *only* meaningful for AC voltages. It's way of
relating DC and AC voltages. It used to be measured by things what got
hot when you stuck volts on them. Two volts RMS made the same amount of
heat as two volts DC. When you work out the power, V^^2/R, what you have
it *average power*. 

What people who (mis)quote Watts RMS are trying to specfiy is the average
power something makes when driven by a continuous waveform (eg. a sine wave,
rather than music). There can be very large differences between the peak and
average output of an amplifier.The standard way to measure peak power is to
drive the thing with a tone-burst, a short burst of sine waves, surrounded
by lots of silence. The idea being that it more closely models music where
the peak to average energy differ by something like 10:1 (depends on type
of music). 

Which is more meaningful I don't know. I do know that amplifiers which soft-clip
the waveform (don't cut it off square) sound better when *over* driven. I also
know that modern tweeters, which have very ridge suspension and voice coils 
which are really well attached magnetically, don't like being driven with
square waves.  They smash themselves to pieces real quick. 

Finally, the more the better may not be true. It's much more difficult to make
a high-powered amplifier (> 100-150watts) which sounds as good as a smaller
one (< 100 watts). Thankfully there's a trend to make speakers more efficient
again; the world maybe recovering from Mr. Bose where you needed a power station
to make the things make any reasonable amount of noise.

Byebye,
  jon.

Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: scott@psy.uwa.oz.au (Scott Fisher)
Subject: Brands.
Organization: University of Western Australia
Distribution: aus
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 03:13:25 GMT

I notice certain brands receive little attention in the US audio groups
such as Luxman.

In those groups (rec.audio, rec.audio.high-end) I see a lot of talk
about Adcom, Thiel and Carver products.  To the best of my knowledge
these are almost unheard of in Australia.  Can anyone enlighten me as
to why?  And also an assesment of their quality would be good too.


Regards Scott.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Scott Fisher [scott@psy.uwa.oz.au]  PH: Aus [61] Perth (09) Local (380 3272).                
                                                             _--_|\       N
Department of Psychology                                    /      \    W + E
University of Western Australia.                 Perth -->  *_.--._/      S
Nedlands, 6009.  PERTH, W.A.                                      v       

Joy is a Jaguar XJ-6 with a flat battery, a blown oil seal and an unsympathetic wife, 9km outside of a small remote town, 3:15am on a cold wet winters morning.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: callum@bain3.bain.oz.au (Callum Gibson)
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
Subject: Reasons why Scott should have BT-2's (was Re: watts RMS?...)
Date: 31 Aug 92 05:27:15 GMT
Distribution: aus
Organization: Bain & Company, Sydney, AUSTRALIA
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Scott Fisher (scott@psy.uwa.oz.au) wrote:
> PS..any one have any good ideas on how to convince my wife to allow a set
> of Interdyn BT-2's in the house, I have the BT-1's.  She thinks BT-2s are
> "too large" (tall) :-)

Tell her they make good pot plant stands.

regards,
    Callum
-- 
Callum Gibson                           callum@bain3.bain.oz.au
Eyeball Temporary Analyst/Programmer    BH : +61 2 258 1620
Fixed Income Division                   Fax: +61 2 258 1128
Bain & CO, Sydney, Australia.           AH : :-)
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: callum@bain3.bain.oz.au (Callum Gibson)
Subject: Re: Reasons why Scott should have BT-2's (was Re: watts RMS?...)
Organization: Bain & Company, Sydney, AUSTRALIA
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Distribution: aus
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 05:53:24 GMT

Scott Fisher (scott@psy.uwa.oz.au) wrote:
> Sorry Callum...the BT-1's make better stands as they are more "square" at the
> top rather than the rectangular shape of thew BT-2's...next? ;-)

Okay, they block out all those unsightly pieces of bare wall.  Yuck!

regards,
    Callum
-- 
Callum Gibson                           callum@bain3.bain.oz.au
Eyeball Temporary Analyst/Programmer    BH : +61 2 258 1620
Fixed Income Division                   Fax: +61 2 258 1128
Bain & CO, Sydney, Australia.           AH : :-)
From: st_waldman@zodiac.dsto.oz.au
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
Subject: Looking for preamplifier
Date: 30 Aug 92 22:10:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: zodiac.1992Aug31.091012.1
Organization: D.S.T.O. Aeronautical Research Laboratory

Hi,

I am looking for a preamplifier in the $600 to $1000 price bracket.
It must have inputs for two cassette decks to allow dubbing either
way. Of course, the usual CD, tuner, phono, and aux inputs are required.
I would also prefer defeatable tone controls, maybe even with a midrange
control as well as the usual bass and treble controls.

I also saw an ad in a US hi-fi magazine for and Adcom preamp with
a built in tuner. I might be interested in something like this if
the price is not too high, as I don't have a tuner at present.

Any comments or suggestions most welcome.

Witold Waldman

WITOLD@HOTBLK.DSTO.GOV.AU
From: mawson@aldetec.oz.au (Graeme Mawson)
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
Subject: Re: Reasons why Scott should have BT-2's (was Re: watts RMS?...)
Date: 1 Sep 92 12:24:36 GMT
Distribution: aus
Organization: Aldetec Pty Ltd, Perth West Australia

In article <1992Sep1.063056.2701@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>, Scott Fisher writes:

Re: reasons for the wife to allow purchase of Interdyn BT-2's ...

> >Tell her they make good pot plant stands.
> 
> Sorry Callum...the BT-1's make better stands as they are more "square" at the
> top rather than the rectangular shape of thew BT-2's...next? ;-)

Yeah ... tell her that they sound better and look better and that you won't
buy her the XJ-6 unless she lets you buy them :-) :-)

All the best!!
Graeme
-- 
Internet: mawson@aldetec.oz.au           "As for me and my house, we will 
Perth, Western Australia.                        serve the Lord."   <><
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: scott@psy.uwa.oz.au (Scott Fisher)
Subject: Re: Looking for preamplifier
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 01:59:57 GMT

st_waldman@zodiac.dsto.oz.au writes:

>Hi,

>I am looking for a preamplifier in the $600 to $1000 price bracket.
>It must have inputs for two cassette decks to allow dubbing either
>way. Of course, the usual CD, tuner, phono, and aux inputs are required.
>I would also prefer defeatable tone controls, maybe even with a midrange
>control as well as the usual bass and treble controls.

The Rotel RC980BX is $700 and comes with No tone controls and separate 
Record/Listen selectors with (Phono MM/MC, Tuner, CD, Aux, Tape 1 and Tape 2)
I'm not sure that you will beat this for less than lots of dollars.

the Rotel RC960BX is $400 and comes with all the above features plus
defeatable bass and treble tone controls (6dB +/-).  

>I also saw an ad in a US hi-fi magazine for and Adcom preamp with
>a built in tuner. I might be interested in something like this if
>the price is not too high, as I don't have a tuner at present.

For $750 the Rotel RTC950AX is a Tuner/Preamplifier and comes with Remote
control (volume, tuner, select) and tape 1 & 2 and defeatable (6dB+/-) tone
controls.  Don't be mislead by the price...this is an excellent unit.

>Witold Waldman

Regards Scott...
_______________________________________________________________________________
Scott Fisher [scott@psy.uwa.oz.au]  PH: Aus [61] Perth (09) Local (380 3272).                
                                                             _--_|\       N
Department of Psychology                                    /      \    W + E
University of Western Australia.                 Perth -->  *_.--._/      S
Nedlands, 6009.  PERTH, W.A.                                      v       

Joy is a Jaguar XJ-6 with a flat battery, a blown oil seal and an unsympathetic wife, 9km outside of a small remote town, 3:15am on a cold wet winters morning.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: scott@psy.uwa.oz.au (Scott Fisher)
Subject: Re: Ensemble speakers
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 06:05:53 GMT

bill@rsphys.anu.edu.au (Bill Alford) writes:

>Does anybody have opinions on the Ensemble PA-1 speakers?

Yes, the Interdyn BT-2 is a great (Australian made, Seas drivers) floor
standing speaker and can be had for around $1500 with haggling.  The Interdyn 
BT-1 is a cheaper alternative (same tweeter, different Seas woofer) that is
also floor standing and looses out only in deep bass extension and costs $950 
with haggling.  LT-1's and P-1's are both stand based and cost $600-900 and
are also worth a look.  

:-) :-) :-)

No sorry I know nothing about Ensemble PA-1 speakers....well I do now...
they're speakers :-)

Regards

Scott Interdyn, woops! Fisher.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Scott Fisher [scott@psy.uwa.oz.au]  PH: Aus [61] Perth (09) Local (380 3272).                
                                                             _--_|\       N
Department of Psychology                                    /      \    W + E
University of Western Australia.                 Perth -->  *_.--._/      S
Nedlands, 6009.  PERTH, W.A.                                      v       

Joy is a Jaguar XJ-6 with a set of Interdyn BT-2's in the boot on their way
home to your place :-) 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: t8800568@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
Subject: Re: Speaker brandname advice
Date: 27 Aug 92 19:44:48 GMT
Followup-To: aus.hi-fi
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

In article <1992Aug25.104559.164392@dstos3.dsto.gov.au>, sgl@aeg.dsto.gov.au (Simon Langsford) writes:
> Hi everyone
> 
> Sorry if people are sick of talking speaker brands  (is there an FAQ?),
> but I am fairly unfamiliar with manufacturers names besides the 
> more promoted (ie Pioneer, Marantz, etc etc). Of late I have come
> across names such as JBL and Paradigm which I have absolutely no
> knowledge of. Forgive my ignorance, but what sort of a name do these
> companies have (specifically JBL and Paradigm). I have been looking
> in the range $400-$600 for speakers typically around 60-70W rated - 
> how do these compare to the likes of Wharfedale and also Sony, 
> which were others I came across. Any other recommendations?
> 
> Thanks

JBL arent too bad IMHO.  Little lacking in detail though.  (well, this has
been the case for the JBLs I have heard.) 
	I havent actually heard a pair of Paradigms, But I believe they
are very well thought of.  The bottom line is that you should listen before
you buy.  I am biased, in that I favour the more detailed sound offered by
speakers such as the Richter Oracles, and Mission 780s, (or 760s) rather
than the big bass sound of bose or JBL.  You may be the opposite.  

######################################################################### 
#   NAME: Timothy O'Connor.       #  QUOTE: Roses have thorns, shining  #   
#   toc@arcadia.mc.phillip.edu.au.#  waters mud, and cancer lurks deep  #
#   T8800568@phillip.edu.au       #  in the sweetest bud.               # 
#########################################################################
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: scott@psy.uwa.oz.au (Scott Fisher)
Subject: Re: watts RMS? what watts conversion?
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 01:43:26 GMT

gre253@mis.csiro.au (Steven Green) writes:

>>[lots of stuff deleted...]
>>
>>
>>Although more "good" watts IS definitely better I recently upgraded from a 
>>Rotel RA820-AX (30W RMS, 8 Ohms, 0.05% THD, 100dB S/N) amp to a Rotel RB 
>>980-BX power amp (120W RMS, 8 Ohms, 0.03% THD, 120dB S/N) and I love it...
>>Unfortunately it uses 400W just sitting there turned on with no signal the
>>820-AX used to consume about 25W :-).

>400W just sitting there! What does it DO with the power. Does it run hot?

Yup, like a little heater.  Most of the 400W seems to turn into heat.  The
harder you drive the amp the better the power output to heat ratio seems
to get :-)

The manual just states..Power Consumptuion: 400W, although when it is sitting 
there I suspect the power consumption is around 200-300W and when you rev it 
up the power consumption goes up to the quoted 400W...although this is all 
speculation based on the amount of heat the thing generates.

Regards Scott.

PS: Anyone have a simple method of checking it's power consumption?
_______________________________________________________________________________
Scott Fisher [scott@psy.uwa.oz.au]  PH: Aus [61] Perth (09) Local (380 3272).                
                                                             _--_|\       N
Department of Psychology                                    /      \    W + E
University of Western Australia.                 Perth -->  *_.--._/      S
Nedlands, 6009.  PERTH, W.A.                                      v       

Joy is a Jaguar XJ-6 with a flat battery, a blown oil seal and an unsympathetic wife, 9km outside of a small remote town, 3:15am on a cold wet winters morning.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: aus.hi-fi
From: scott@psy.uwa.oz.au (Scott Fisher)
Subject: Re: watts RMS? what watts conversion?
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 09:04:45 GMT


MATGBB@LURE.LATROBE.EDU.AU (BYRNES,Graham) writes:

>> 400W just sitting there! What does it DO with the power. Does it run hot?
>I really can't believe this. My power amp dissipates 90W at idle, and the
>WHOLE front panel is a heatsink, 150X400X75 mm, weighing 2kg. In summer it
>still makes 55-60 deg C. 400W is the idle dissipation of a 100W/ch class A
>amp. Have a look at the size (and cost) of a Krell or Levinson...

>I think you may have your figures wrong (even 40W seems high for a Rotel,
>but believable)

In response to the issue of power consumption of Rotel gear I knocked up
this from the latest 900 series catalog and my own manuals...


ROTEL Amplification power output to power consumption (a summary)

Power Amplifiers:

Model     Output Per Chanel   Power Consumption
-----------------------------------------------
RB990BX:  200W                550W
RB980BX:  120W                400W
RB960BX:  60W                 300W
-----------------------------------------------

Integrated Amplifiers:

Model     Output Per Chanel   Power Consumption
-----------------------------------------------
RA980BX   100W                400W
RA960BX   60W                 300W
RA940BX   40W                 260W
RA930BX   30W                 180W
RA920BX   20W                 120W
-----------------------------------------------

Other stuff...

CD Players: 30W
Pre-Amps:   10W
Cassette:   30W
Tuners:     10W

I should point out I have no idea if the consumption is at rated RMS
power output or all the time.

Regards Scott.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Scott Fisher [scott@psy.uwa.oz.au]  PH: Aus [61] Perth (09) Local (380 3272).                
                                                             _--_|\       N
Department of Psychology                                    /      \    W + E
University of Western Australia.                 Perth -->  *_.--._/      S
Nedlands, 6009.  PERTH, W.A.                                      v       

Joy is a Jaguar XJ-6 with a flat battery, a blown oil seal and an unsympathetic wife, 9km outside of a small remote town, 3:15am on a cold wet winters morning.
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