HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sunder@altair.crhc.uiuc.edu (Srinivas Sunder)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Perot....GONE!
Keywords: King G and the killers
Date: 21 Jul 92 15:31:54 GMT
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
NNTP-Posting-Host: altair.crhc.uiuc.edu

In article <1992Jul20.203827.26534@reed.edu>, philip@reed.edu (Philip Moore) writes:
|> In article <1992Jul20.175733.8875@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> johnnyp@HALDI.LCS.MIT.EDU (John D. Piscitello) writes:
|> >
|> >	Perot had money, and he was in a dead heat. He just dropped out
|> >because he didn't feel like running anymore.
|> >
|> The activity of the last few days actually suggests that Perot is still very 
|> interested in the issues that have kept him politically active for the last
|> few years.  I never considered the rumors about threats against his family
|> until I started thinking about the timing of his withdrawal speech and its
|> consequent effect on Clinton's popularity.  If King George sent the word that
|> Ross was gonna get popped if he stayed in then I hope Clinton wins by a 

Why is this not posted to alt.conspiracy (and talk.bizarre) as well?

And I thought that conspiracy theorists were by now confined exclusively
to Australia!!!
  

-- 
Srinivas Sunder                                         sunder@crhc.uiuc.edu

If my employer shares these opinions, he deserves them.
********************************************************************************
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.clinton
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Clinton misqotes Bible
From: dhammers@pacific.urbana.mcd.mot.com (David Hammerslag)
Date: 21 Jul 92 15:28:41 GMT
Organization: Motorola Computer Group, Urbana Design Center

Does anyone know enough about Clinton's religious beliefs to speculate
as to whether his misquote of I Cor. 2:9 was likely to be through ignorance
or a deliberate distortion?

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Hammerslag            | Don't give me facts, I want the Truth.
dhammers@urbana.mcd.mot.com | 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:35961 alt.politics.elections:9174 alt.politics.perot:1088 alt.mcdonalds.smut:7 alt.fan.dan-quayle:2052 alt.politics.marrou:205
From: werbick@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (WERBICK LAWRENCE JAR)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.perot,alt.mcdonalds.smut,alt.fan.dan-quayle,alt.politics.marrou
Subject: Registering to vote at the DMV (WAS: RE: Farewell Perot)
Date: 25 Jul 92 17:16:15 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado at Boulder


[lots of stuff deleted]
>Rob mentions that he thinks people/states shouldn't be coerced into registration
>But the drive behind this country is the involvement of the people.
>Voting is the one way you can act as a part of the group which governs us.
>In effect, it IS our responsibility to vote, and coercion(sp?) to vote is not
>bad - a little distasteful, but it does get the voters to come out.
>
[a little more deleted]
>
>doug w.

	I live in Colorado, and we already have the ability to register to
vote at the DMV. I find it quite convenient and utterly devoid of coercion.
They merely ask you, "Would you like to register to vote today??" and offer
you the form if you do. I would be against coercion of any sort in this
country, but this is clearly not the case in this situation.

	As for whether or not states should be *forced* to offer this, I
personally don't care. I think it's a good idea, and if people don't like
it, they can merely choose not to participate. Or, they may choose to
register and simply not show up to vote. 

--Elizabeth

--
this .sig was grazed on a free range, not brought up in a factory.
support free-range .sigs!!!!!     eroberts@slate.mines.colorado.edu
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:35012 soc.men:13490 soc.women:13861 alt.censorship:6083 misc.legal:14618
From: robert@informix.com (Robert Coleman)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,soc.men,soc.women,alt.censorship,misc.legal
Subject: Re: Hate Speech Okay, says the Supreme Court
Date: 20 Jul 92 18:22:57 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

egnilges@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Ed Nilges) writes:

>In article <1992Jul19.194934.12733@midway.uchicago.edu> thf2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>>
>>Well, if you can't find anything in Posner, how about Coase?  Donohue?
>>Baird?  Landes?  Calabresi?  Shavell? 

>Howsabout I just play Posner's game and refuse to read the texts of
>people with whom I disagree?  For this is what Posner does with Derrida.
>Howsabout I just play the neoconservative game of feigning
>incomprehension and calling that which is really unacceptable to me
>"confusing" or obfuscating?  Don't worry, Tedster, Mike's gonna tell us
>all about Law 'n Economix, and (since he, like Posner, is no friend of
>French obfuscation) he's gonna explain why it is not deep-down unjust to
>poor people.

	Ed, I really expected better.  "Posner was ignorant, and feigned
knowledge, so it's OK if *I'm* ignorant and feign knowledge too."  But thanks
for letting us know that you only explore one side of an issue before making
your grand proclamations; now I understand your postings better.

Robert C.
-- 
----------------------------------------------
Disclaimer: My company has not yet seen fit to
	    elect me as spokesperson. Hmmpf.
From: chf0@newshost.gte.com (Curtis Fennell)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Using killfiles is a form of censorship (was: Re: A Modest Request
Date: 28 Jul 92 17:38:47 GMT
Reply-To: chf0@gte.com
Organization: GTE Laboratories, Waltham, MA

In article <1992Jul25.180444.14954@Princeton.EDU>, egnilges@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Ed Nilges) writes:
|> Using kill files IS a form of censorship.  

Oh, this is rich!  What a card!

|> First of all, a metaphorical reference to murder is made in the
|> description "kill" file, showing a suppressed rage and desire to "kill"
|> one's opponent 

HA,HA,HA,HA! Oh, that's a good one Ed!

|> I assure Mr. Starr that he will have to catch me and
|> (non-metaphorically) kill me first.  

"I have never killed anyone, but I have read many obituaries with
pleasure"
		-badly paraphrased from Clarence Darrow

|> Anita Hill (decried as a lunatic for bringing needed information re
|> a Supreme Court nominee to the attention of the Senate Judiciary
|> Committee) 

And hailed as a champion of womens' rights, sought after to make
speeches, receiver of standing ovations in public appearances, etc...

|> And someone might want to pass the word to Mr. Starr that:
	
Then again, we might not.  He asked not to receive anything from you
and I, at least, will respect his wishes.

But seriously, folks:

The right to freedom of speech is NOT the right to be heard.  There is
nothing in the constitution or the bill of rights that guarantees that
an individual has the right to have his/her opinions heard - only that
he/she has the right to express them.

Oh, and I've been meaning to ask you, Ed - since you are against cross
burning in any form - should there be laws prohibiting the burning of
crosses at Ku Klux Klan meetings, where no blacks are allowed?

Not that I expect an answer....

-- 
============================================================
Curt Fennell    [   "One should forgive one's enemies,     ]
chf0@gte.com	[    but not before they are hanged"	   ]
============================================================
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: ncovey@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (neil covey)
Subject: Bush's troubles
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 15:07:30 GMT

Though Quayle may have put his foot in his mouth again with his seeming
endorsement of choice on the Larry King show, the real troubles seem to
me to be Bush's.  I know that even the Democrats call the current lead
Clinton enjoys in the polls a "souffle lead," but there are some
differences betweent this year and the last election.  For one thing, I
don't remember seeing so much sniping coming from Republicans before.
This Dump Quayle, Dump Darman, Dump Brady movement we hear so much about
these days is not just a media story. Prominent Republicans are carping
at the Bush administration.  Yesterday's (Thursday's) New York Times
quoted Bill Bennett, Alfonse D'Amato, Richard Lugar, and Richard
Viguerie--some in support of Quayle, some not--on the insufficiencies of
the Bush administration.  It will be hard for Bush to say the poor
performance of the economy is the fault of congress when Clinton and the
Democrats can quote D'Amato, Viguerie, and Bennet saying that Bush has
put forward no plan and has no message.  I'm starting to believe Clinton
can win, I'm even starting to believe he will win some states he's not
expected to win.  If Arkansas, DC, and perhaps Minnesota are the only
safe places for Clinton/Gore, Utah and South Carolina may be the only
sure bets for Bush/Quayle.


Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: pjm@anegada.sps.mot.com (Patrick J. McGuinness)
Subject: Re: "American Ideals" (was: AMERICA IN DECLINE)
Organization: Motorola Inc., Austin TX
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 23:38:46 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.204326.22743@nocusuhs.nnmc.navy.mil> perez@mgr.hjf.org (Charles Perez) writes:
>>It's too bad the US didn't learn anything from the recent collapse of the
>>USSR.
>
>I certainly learned something: that the world collapse of statism is
>something I can hope to see in my lifetime.

Yes, and that is a great and wonderful thing .... This
thread started with a discussion of American ideals, and I'd like
to reweave that in here:  With the collapse of the USSR, the
world is increasingly turning to the "western" powers, and to 
America especially, to find the political and economic ideas that
can make their societies develop and prosper.

Twenty years ago, only a fraction (I would guess 15%) of the people
in the world lived in democratic countries, and socialistic
central planning was the modus operandi of most third world countries.

In the next twenty years, most countries will embrace democracy and
will develop market-oriented economies.   American ideals
will increasingly become world-wide ideals. 

>>"Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

I suggest a different quote for what we shall see in our
lifetimes: " You ain't seen nothin' yet!"
---------
P. McGuinness
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.clinton
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Subject: Re: Which of you is 'good enough' ?
Organization: Texas Instruments, Inc
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 22:50:45 GMT

In article <archer.128@utkux1.utk.edu> archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:
>In article <lzfmyk.crisp@netcom.com> crisp@netcom.com (Richard Crisp) writes:
>
>>Others like me consider homosexuality to be immoral, illegal and 
>>disgusting. I believe the majority of Americans agree with me.
>
>I think that most people consider sexual preference none of their business.

Actually, I suspect that most straight men, at least, feel about it
the way I do.  Disgusting?  Yes, but then a gay man probably finds the
idea of sex with a woman rather disgusting, too, although I can't say
that for certain.  Illegal?  Yes, in this state it most certainly is,
at least insofar as any active homosexual relationships go.  But there
are lots of stupid laws, and the one about gays also covers things
that a lot of straight people do, so I'm not sure what that proves.
Immoral?  HOGWASH.

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
From: etjue@lbl.gov (Eric T. Jue)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: AIDS: What the Gov't Isn't Telling You
Date: 29 Jul 92 21:25:57 GMT
Organization: LBL
NNTP-Posting-Host: 131.243.64.95
X-UserAgent: Nuntius v1.1

Sorry, I messed up my 1st posting...

I heard an interesting talk show on 7/27/92 concerning a new book titled
"What the Government Isn't Telling You About AIDS."  The author of the
book, Dr. Lorraine Day of UC San Francisco, offered her findings on the
air and fielded questions from listeners.  According to her, research has
shown that the AIDS virus is not a fragile virus and that it may survive
up to 7 days in a dry environment and up to 14 days in a moist one.  It
follows from this that AIDS may be transmitted through all types of
bodily fluids, including sweat, and not just through blood.  She mentions
other interesting findings on AIDS which she says the government is
intentionally hiding from the public.  Her findings are all based on
clinincal research documentation done around the world.  Her book may be
ordered by phone at (800) 537-2437.  I hope people who have heard
anything about Dr. Day or her book will post their thoughts to this
newsgroup.  Thank you very much.
QUIT
Thank you very much.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: burke@tss.com (Jim Burke)
Subject: Re: USPS (Was: Question about Clinton's "didn't inhale" remark)
Reply-To: burke@tss.com (Jim Burke)
Organization: Teknekron Software Systems. Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 18:06:54 GMT

In article <ATAYLOR.92Jul27170333@gauss.nmsu.edu>, ataylor@nmsu.edu (Nosy) writes:

|> 	Note, btw, that USPS has a monopoly on 1st class
|> 	mail, protected by the Federal government. 
|> 	US Post Offices are Federal property.
|> 	Postal employees are Federal civil "servants".
|> 	
|> 	If the USPS is an "independent company", how can
|> 	I set up such a company, please, with a guaranteed
|> 	market, armed men to squelch any competition,
|> 	and so forth?

I would support the government opening up first class mail for competition
as long as the competition was on a level playing field.  In other words,
if UPS can guarantee that they will deliver mail to any person in the 
United States, no matter how remote their location, as the USPS is required
to do, then fine.  If private enterprise can do a better job cheaper, let
them do it.  What you would find is that nobody would compete.  It would
cost so much to put enough infrastructure in place to provide the same
service, that the cost would be much greater than it now is.  Look at what
Fed Ex or UPS charge for services that are almost first class mail (i.e.
overnight and second day deliveries).  They currently skim the cream off the
top and leave the rest of the non-profitable business to the USPS.  
Unregulated, they would do the same thing for first class mail.  USPS rates
would skyrocket, while the private company would make the easy deliveries
and rake in the profits.  The net outcome would be a fragmented mail system
that doesn't work as well.  Kind of like the AT&T breakup.

-- 

	Jim Burke	"Life is uncertain - eat dessert first!"
	Teknekron Software Systems		... burke@tss.com
  	phone:(415) 617-2432			... uunet!tekbspa!burke
From: jscott@AFIT.AF.MIL (John R. Scott)
Subject: Re: FACTOID: BANKS HAVE MORE MONEY IN US BONDS THEN LOANS
Organization: Air Force Institute of Technology, WPAFB OH
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 14:58:38 GMT

In article <Bs48Jn.Gx5@apollo.hp.com> goykhman_a@apollo.hp.com writes:

>(reprinted without permission from the Boston Globe, July 28, 1992)
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>           BANKS HAVE MORE MONEY IN US BONDS THEN LOANS
>                        by William Goodwin
>                          AMERICAN BANKER

>NEW YORK - For the first time in 27 years banks have more goverment
>securities on their books than business loans.

>Data released by the Federal Reserve Board showed that commercial 
>and industrial loans outstanding slipped to $598.5 billion at the 
>end of June, while holding of US goverment securities climbed to
>$607.3 billion.
>...
>-------------------------------------------------------------------


>-- 
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Disclaimer: all opinions are mine.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This seems to explain why the banks are not making any private business 
loans.  It appears to me that the long range effect of this type of banking 
activity will be a major decrease in banking as an influence on the private 
sector.  I say this because corporations will probably turn more to non-
banking methods of raising cash, on a permanent basis, if this banking 
investment trend continues.

AN ASIDE:  Interesting the banks are investing in the insurer of their 
liabilities(deposits).

John

Comments are mine not those of my employer.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,ca.politics
From: nelson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson)
Subject: Re: aids conference in cuba
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 19:56:05 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

In article <1992Jul29.170657.4534@dazixca.ingr.com> ronp@dazixca.ingr.com (Ron Phillips) writes:
>In article <Bs5p6D.9rC@apollo.hp.com> nelson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson) writes:
>>
>>  2.) The fact that doing this would require a Constitutional and 
>>      major statutory changes, not to mention a major mindset change,
>>      whereas aggressively attempting to develop a cure would not.
>>      Cuba is a police state.  For a free country to take away 
>>      your civil rights for the "crime" of being sick opens up a 
>>      lot of scary doors.
>>                  
>
>What "Constitutional and major statutory changes" would be 
>required?  The various state/county/municipal health codes allow
>quarantine for potentially fatal diseases (smallpox, diptheria).
>Why would the addition of AIDs infectees to the list of those
>who can be quarantined require something different?


   Because currently HIV infected individuals are not contagious
   by casual contact and so *as individuals* do not represent any
   threat to the public health, unlike people in the past who
   could be locked up in a leper colony.   It was that threat to 
   the public health that contagious victims of other diseases
   represented by just walking around which was used to justify
   taking them out of public circulation.   

   Indeed, given today's greater emphasis on individual rights
   (despite what some net.libertarians would have you believe) 
   it's quite possible that if you tried to forcibly confine a
   victim of one of the diseases you mentioned above in 1992,
   he'd have lawyers all over you like spots on a Dalmation. 

   
---peter


   

  
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.theory,alt.discrimination
From: mpolen@gelato.mips.com (Michael Polen)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: not feminazis but femiloonies (was Re: A feminist style socio-economic reform!!
Date: 21 Jul 1992 18:24:10 GMT
Organization: MIPS Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: gelato.mips.com

mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
> 
>>REFORM 1.
>>	"All women who deliver normal children should be compensated in
>>monetory terms for their child bearing services".

>Simple reason why not:
> 
> Given that women are not coerced into childbirth
> they clearly receive what they consider to be adequate compensation.
> If they didn't they wouldn't have kids.

Women do not have children.  It takes two people, a man and a woman.
This argument prolongs the myth that women are only here to have children,
and that if they get pregnant it is their fault.  If the man accepted
his responsibility for the action, the welfare of children, and their
mothers who are taken out of the workforce, would not be the problem
it is today.

As to coercion, if a pregnancy occurs, women are indeed coerced into
pregnancy by right-to-life activists.

Hell, I'm not even a member of NOW.  I just found this argument patronizing,
narrow minded, inaccurate, and immoral.
From: judson@watnxt2.ucr.edu (Michael Judson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Iraq, Uraq, Heraqs
Date: 29 Jul 92 00:46:56 GMT

In article <154au8INN8d6@agate.berkeley.edu> bks@alfa.berkeley.edu (Bradley K.  
Sherman) writes:
> 
> There you go again Mr. President.  Where is the outcry from Kuwait,
> Saudi Arabia, Turkey and Syria?
> Sorry, George, but the USA
> is not needed to apply pressure to Saddam.   Even Luxembourg could
> carry out this mission.  Take another Halcion or deal with the
> real threats to U.S. security: poverty and ignorance.
> ----------------
>     --Brad Sherman (bks@alfa.berkeley.edu)
Get serious.  Do you think Saddam is going to listen to Luxembourg,
a country whose population is less than most univeristies?  And do
you think Saddam is going to listen to Kuwait, a country whose emir
he exiled?  Get real.  Think about.  The United States has a strong
enough military that Saddam would be able to see.  The others are
virtually non existent (relativelt speaking).  Although it is not our
"right" to be there defending the world, since we can, we should.  What
makes you think that Saudi Arabia (his next door neighbor who might 
have the biggest influence on him) would make Saddam change his mind.
For over a year now he has denied U.N. inspection teams.  And why is
this?  Because the countries you say should be pressuring Saddam don't
have a big enough military.
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:36425 alt.politics.elections:9318 alt.politics.perot:1130
From: mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.perot
Subject: Re: What Happens to Perot's Name?
Date: 29 Jul 92 08:42:12 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, QMW, University of London, UK.

From: rdippold@cancun.qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold)
MBS110@psuvm.psu.edu (Norman St. John Polevaulter) writes:
>>Okay, here's my beef with the Libertarian Party: their hypocrisy in claiming
>>to be an independent, different, totally new third way around the two big
>>parties -- and then spending all their time posing as rabid right-wingers
>>finding Eeeeeeeeevil socialists under every bed.
>
>It's not necessary to be right-wing to despise socialism, just
>commitment to freedom.

Whose freedom? Where is freedom when your lack of resources
compels you to virtually sell yourself into slavery to those
who have "chosen" to be born to rich parents? Good education,
good health and good housing do a lot to give people freedom,
and one way of providing these things is through the state -
that's socialism. I agree that there are problems with
socialism, and I would not describe myself as a socialist, but
I do at least recognise why people are attracted to it, and do
not dismiss them as Eeeeeeevil.

Matthew Huntbach
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.clinton
From: hlin@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (hua.t.lin)
Subject: Re: Question about Clinton's "didn't inhale" remark
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 15:19:58 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.144051.5832@m5.harvard.edu> borden@m5.harvard.edu writes:
>In article <1992Jul18.174122.7142@infonode.ingr.com> haefner@infonode.ingr.com (Mark W. Haefner) writes:
>
>As a matter of fact, MTV asked Bill Clinton and the other major candidates
>to go on TV, as part of a effort they've been making for several years to
>get young people to be more politically involved.  (I think it's called
>"Rock the Vote", but I'm not sure.)

It was "Chose or Lose."
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:35688 alt.politics.elections:9053