HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tneale@aeras.uucp (Tom Neale)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: GPS -- A Potentially Dangerous Technology
Date: 8 Apr 92 03:20:18 GMT
Reply-To: tneale@aeras.UUCP (Tom Neale)
Organization: Arix Corporation, San Jose, CA.

In article <1992Apr3.192010.14816@aosg.gsf.dec.com> ahv@raven.aosg.gsf.dec.com writes:
>>Since the government can turn of VORs and NDBs, why does it matter if
>>they can also turn off GPS?
>
>Not being a military type, I can't see it as a big deal either.  There always
>inertial navigation and last time I checked there was no way to turn the off


One of the primary reasons for the existence of GPS is so that the military
has the means to accurately update their Interial Nav Systems.  In fact,
that was also the reason for a GPS predessor know as TRANSIT or, SatNav.

INS is great for short periods of time.  Unfortunately, they drift and
eventually give you bad absolute position data.  TRANSIT and GPS provide
the means for *very* accurate absolute position fixes and INS can fill
in the coverage gaps and/or provide finer resolution for maneuvers.

GPS update:

SV25 is now fully operational and commisioned.  The next launch (I don't
know the SV number yet) was due last Monday and was postponed for weather.
Haven't heard the new date yet.

GPS: the ninth utility.
-- 
Blue skies,     | ...sun!aeras!tneale   |
                | in flight:     N2103Q | Entropy isn't what it used
Tom Neale       | in freefall:   D8049  | to be.
                | via the ether: WA1YUB |
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: reece@eco.twg.com (Reece R. Pollack)
Subject: Re: Motion 'Discomfort'...
Reply-To: reece@eco.twg.com (Reece R. Pollack)
Organization: The Wollongong Group (East Coast Operations)
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 92 16:53:51 GMT


In article <1992Apr6.000056.12477@infonode.ingr.com>, kerl@cmack.b11.ingr.com |>After three years of putting it off, I've decided to take the plunge and
|>start my PP-ASEL training next week.

Congratulation!

|>Questions:
|>
|>1. Do I get to look forward to getting this way every time I take a training
|>flight, or will this condition pass with experience?

In most cases, this will pass with experience. I'd also expect it to go away
once you start handling the controls. A lot of people get carsick if they
try to watch someone drive, but don't get sick while driving themselves.

|>2. Is medication counterproductive?  My instructor feels it is, and
|>states that "I'll get over it after a few flights."

Not only will it be counterproductive, it may well be illegal. The traditional
anti-motion-sickness drugs are Scopolamine or other central nervous system
depressants. These may impair your judgement and slow your reactions, which
could be hazardous to your health.

|>3. Are there any tricks (short of not flying) that might help?  My instructor
|>also said that not concentrating on objects in the cocpit helps.  I was trying
|>to practice doing scans of the surrounding airspace, since I wanted to start
|>developing this habit as soon as possible.

Most motion sickness is a result of a disagreement between your sense of
balance and your other senses. Being bounced around makes your middle ear
think you're moving around, while your eyes, looking at the plane, say you're
not. If you have (and concentrate on) a definite horizon, your eyes will
probably agree with your ears.

Don't think about how sick you feel, because that'll only make it worse. Keep
the cockpit cool, and loosen restrictive clothing. I've found that rapid,
shallow breathing (almost panting) will help at critical moments, but be
careful not to over do it and hyperventillate.

|>4. How does one deal with nausea in tight situations?

In critical situations, you'll be too busy to be nauseous, at least until
you're back in the clear. IMC (Instrument Meterological Conditions), or
simulated IMC may be different, and a lot of people get a bit queasy during
the Unusual Attitudes part of their training.

--
Reece R. Pollack
Student Pilot -- Warrior N7022C
Prepping for my checkride at 56 hours...
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: ikluft@uts.amdahl.com (Ian Kluft)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation,news.groups
Subject: Re: creation of eunet.aviation
Date: 12 Apr 92 03:11:18 GMT
Followup-To: news.groups
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Systems Software, Sunnyvale CA

In article <6351@lib.tmc.edu> jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard) writes:
>In article <1992Apr10.235619.18511@sics.se> lhe@sics.se (Lars-Henrik Eriksson) writes:
>>Also, not all US readers are happy with discussions of non-US issues.
>>Particularly not attempts to generalise a discussion from being
>>US-only by taking up international (or European) issues. I have been
>>flamed several times for doing this. Other European readers have been
>>sending me e-mail saying that they do not like posting on rec.aviation
>>for fear of being flamed.
>
>Geoff Peck's netiquette posting specifically discourages this. I would suggest
>a reply flame (via email) to the miscreants, and then ignoring them. I'm sorry
>that there are people who would drive others away from this group because of
>their nationality. [...]

Agreed.  I had no idea people were doing this to Lars-Henrik and others of our
European net.friends.  What's been described here is very poor netiquette.

However, if this has been such big a problem that the Eurpoeans feel that a new
newsgroup is the best solution, then whoever is taking the opinion poll on
news.groups can count my opinion in support of the effort.  Understand that,
even after eunet.aviation is created, there are plenty among us who will
welcome international participation on rec.aviation.  You can ask us for
support in the future when any individuals practice the kind of misbehavior
that you've brought to our attention.
---
Ian Kluft				| #include <std-disclaimer.h>
ikluft@uts.amdahl.com			| If I don't identify my aircraft...
UTS Systems Software Division 		| can I report a UFO sighting? 
Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale, CA	| do I need a UFO rating?
From: hurvitz@oscar.UUCP (Dennis Hurvitz)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: NEEDED:  Do's/Dont's for California trip
Date: 10 Apr 92 00:08:31 GMT

In article <122140092@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM>, myshatyn@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Mike Myshatyn) writes:
> This  September,  or so, I am  planning  to take a 2 week  flying  vacation
> through  California.  We will fly from  Colorado to San Diego and then work

> concerns  flying  into/thru  busy airspace so that is not a  constraint.  I
> would welcome suggestions on the following based on netters' experiences:
                  San Diego
>                 Montgomery Field
>                 FBO?
>                  - San Diego Zoo
>                  - Old Town
>                 FBO?

but hey, sandyeggo *is* southern california. rent a convertable and
drive up pch (pacific coast highway, that's california speak) with the
top down, and your ray bans on. drive over the coronado bridge and see
the hotel. walk thru the joint. drive down the coronado strand, but look
out for the seals, navy seals that is...  :) have lunch at la salsa, an
hoist a brew at the red onion.  :) i'll join ya for that one.. 

and oh yeah. park in transient at myf, and buy fuel from the self serve
chevron or exxon island (full serve 1.85/gal)  myf has a real nice ils.
i wouldn't expect much worse than 500 over. 1000 ovr is more common when
its ifr. expect thin stratus if anything. it never rains in southern
california you know.   :) 

dennis hurvitz
From: ludeman@astroatc.UUCP (Weekend Pilot)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: How do you cope with turbulence?
Date: 8 Apr 92 15:49:22 GMT
Reply-To: ludeman@astroatc.UUCP (Weekend Pilot)
Organization: Astronautics Technology Cntr, Madison, WI

In article <1992Apr5.204036.1461@debisa> n6vbg@debisa (Javier Henderson) writes:
>
>I've been flying for about a year now, and I still feel ssssoooo uncomfortable
>flying through bumpy air. How does one get used to it to the point where it
>doesn't matter anymore? 

At the risk of provoking the ire of the net, I recommend some sailplane
dual with an experienced XC soaring instructor and a corresponding amount
of reading on the subject.  Just about everything we do involves turbulence  
of some sort, whether it be atmospheric convection under cumulus clouds
ridge lift close to the rocks and trees or the rotor under a mountain wave.
First off, it's a tremendous amount of fun, and second (more to the point)
I think you'll learn quite a lot more about the way the atmosphere works
and where all those bumps come from -- that in itself  can go a long way
toward easing one's discomfort.  If you pursue it to the point that you
can take your knowledge one step further so that you can make all that 
atmospheric energy work *for* you on an extended soaring flight, that's
an almost guaranteed cure.  In case this sounds to the uninitiated like
an exercise in airsickness torture, it's not -- at the low airspeeds
used in thermaling the ride is a whole lot less rough than bangin through
the same part of the sky in a 152 at cruise.


-- 
Evan Ludeman              "What a waste it is to lose one's mind --
rutgers!cs.wisc.edu!       or not to have a mind.  How true that is."
astroatc!ludeman                     -- J. Danforth Quayle 
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: spagiola@amy5.stanford.edu (Stefano P. Pagiola)
Subject: Re: Aviation on a metric basis ?
Organization: DSG, Stanford University
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 92 17:08:34 GMT

>>   An advantage of measuring distances in nautical miles is that it is a 
>>   'natural' distance.  Ie 1nm = 1 minute of latitude.
> 
> Well, now, what makes 1/60th of 1/90th of the distance twixt equator
> and pole so significant? ...
> 

I think the more important point about metric for computational purposes  
is that is is decimal, while inches/feet/miles are not.  If the unit  
system was centi-feet, feet, kilo-feet, etc, that would already simplify  
things tremendously, and would mean that, IMHO, metric would not have any  
substantial superiority.  Except of course that everybody else uses it.
--
-
Stefano Pagiola
Food Research Institute, Stanford University
spagiola@leland.stanford.edu (NeXTMail encouraged)
From: m12566@mitre.org (Skip Guild)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: VFR Pilot Files IFR !!!
Keywords: Flight Plan Preparation
Date: 16 Apr 92 18:09:54 GMT
Article-I.D.: mitre.m12566.53.0
Organization: MITRE Corporation

Now that I have your attention...

Have non-earth shaking FAA Flight Plan question for net-
land.  

How should/must a non-IFR certified pilot complete Block 14 
(Pilot's name, etc) on the FAA Flight Plan for an actual 
IFR flight when he will be flying under the hood with a 
CFII or instrument-rated safety pilot?  Obviously the 
instrument student needs to file the flight plan for 
practice but does he use his name or the name of the CFII 
in Block 14?

I was told by several CFIIs to use the name of the 
instrument-rated pilot in Block 14 as "only instrument-
rated pilots can file IFR flight plans."  This I do when 
filing verbally through an FSS and no one is the wiser.

Now the kicker.  I also like using DUAT and usually file 
VFR flight plans computer-to-computer as it is easier and 
faster.  Unfortunately DUAT (at least Contel's version) 
automatically inserts the DUAT subscriber's name into Block 
14 and this is the one item in the Flight Plan their 
computer will not let you override.

My reply to a question on this matter from Contel included 
a statement that "on training flights it is not necessary 
for the instructor's name to be put in the name field.  If 
you want, you can put 'TRNG FLT PIC lname' in the remarks 
field where lname is the last name of the instructor.  FYI: 
Name fields are never transmitted as a part of the flight 
plan to the ARTCCs.  They are kept locally in the DUAT 
system as a matter of record only used for detailed event 
reconstruction for SAR."

Does this sound right to net-land?  Granted this is an 
artificial and hopefully temporary situation (until 
becoming instrument rated myself), but it bugs me not to 
be able to use DUAT for instrument training flights the 
way I have been instructed with regard to verbal filing to 
the FSS (namely, using CFII's name).  As a result of the 
Contel reply, I researched and can find no statement in the 
FARs or AIM which specifically requires the instrument-
rated pilot to actually file the flight plan.  For that 
matter, is it necessary to ever mention the instrument-
rated pilot anywhere on the form?  Note Block 14 
specifically calls for "Pilot's Name", not PIC.  They are 
not the same.

Answers please quote specific FAR/AIM requirements and not 
"this is what my CFII says."
From: landry@solvit.enet.dec.com (Chris Landry)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Nearby N-numbers
Date: 8 Apr 92 14:26:23 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


I rent and fly a Hawk XP with number N736DH.  Last year it was in the
shop for a while for painting.  The first time I was to fly it after that
I walked up to the FBO and saw a nice shiny Hawk XP parked out front -
N736NH.  Confused the hell out of me.  I actually went in and asked them
why they changed the number before I realized (of course) that it was
a different plane.  "My" plane was parked out on the ramp, and was now a
different color!

chris

Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: earlb@ssd.intel.com (Earl Brabandt)
Subject: Re: Commercial Checkride passed
Organization: Supercomputer Systems Division, Intel Corp.
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 17:32:36 GMT

In article <53576@hydra.gatech.EDU> randy@khan.gatech.edu (Randal T. Abler) writes:
>
>If somebody is interested in a multi-engine rating, it looks like it would
>be cheaper to get the commercial ME rating first, then go back and do
>the commercial single in something like a C152, since most twins are going
>satisfy the requirement for demonstrating ability in "complex" aircraft.

I often combine the multi rating with the initial comm certificate.  You need
two airplanes for the checkride, but the DE's around here don't care if the single
is "complex."  A J-3 cub is OK!  All the complex stuff is done in the twin but
no chandelles or lazy eights.  That airwork is done in the single along with 
emerg. landings.  All engine emergencies in the twin are single engine.  Because
we have a Seneca that rents for $89 / hour wet, it doesn't cost much more to 
pick up the multi at the same time as the comm and take only one checkride.  It's
a very good way to go.

Earl Brabandt, CFII,S & M airplane
From: dlevy@viper.engin.umich.edu (David W Levy)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: 360 turn on final by commuter airliner
Date: 3 Apr 92 13:30:37 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor
Originator: dlevy@viper.engin.umich.edu


In article <40538@shamash.cdc.com>, gkc@freddie.udev.cdc.com (gordon k chace) writes:
>                     ...  Who makes the ATR42?
> 
Avions de Transport Regional, which is a partnership between Aerospatiale
(French) and Alenia (Italian).  Nice plane, at least my one ride was a
good experience.
From: PJERN@CHGVMIC1.VNET.IBM.COM
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: re: Delayed Reaction
Date: 7 Apr 92 17:24:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: ucbvax.9204071823.AA06354

lmiller@aero.org writes:

> Were you within the Wilmington ATA?

No, I was 11 miles south of the airport. (I got out the plotter and
measured, later)

I am going to file an ASRS report, if only to add the datum to NASA's
database. I may go talk to the accident prevention folks at the local
FSDO, as well. (I haven't decided on whether that's a good idea.)

I still have engraved in my mind what an Aerostar looks like, up close
and personal.  I may have a little trouble under the hood for a while.

IDNNS .signature|
(pjern@chgvmic1.vnet.ibm.com)
From: Cessna@kn5f.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark T. Evert)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: aircraft rental insurance
Date: 9 Apr 1992 13:49:46 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Loral Space Information Systems

In article <1992Apr8.183127.10919@u.washington.edu> 
donnyj@milton.u.washington.edu (Donald Sudy) writes:
> Has anyone heard of such policies?  Or is rental insurance normally 
included
> in the rental fee?

Your FBO is correct.  His insurance insures him, not you.  The insurance 
company may pay the FBO off for any damage that you cause, but unless they 
waive the right of subrogation, they can come after you for damages.  This 
is standard.   Our flying club (which operates on a leaseback basis 
similiar to a lot of FBO's) gets around this by carrying the insurance in 
the clubs name and our policy specifically states that members are covered 
under this policy and no subrogation can take place.  Our members are 
still liable for the $500 deductable.   I've been to a few FBO's that 
require rental insurance which is available through AVEMCO for a couple 
hundred bucks a year.   Most FBO's are like the one you describe.  I would 
check very carefully to see what your potential liabilities are.

Mark T. Evert

Cessna@kn5f.jsc.nasa.gov
(713) 282-5525
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: M21208@mwvm.mitre.org
Subject: Re: VFR on top
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, McLean VA 22102
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 08:40:46 GMT

In article <65130@apple.Apple.COM>
stadler@Apple.COM (Andy Stadler) writes:
 
>
>In article <64978@apple.Apple.COM> cep@Apple.COM (Christopher Pettus) writes:
>>I got about 0.1 of actual climbing through the cloud deck.  The briefer
>>had said that the tops were around 6,000', my cruising altitude.  What
>>he didn't tell me is that they were 5,975'!  ...  The ride was a bit
>>bumpy, but the view was so spectacular that when I offered my
>>passengers to climb up 500' VFR-on-top, all three insisted that I stay
>>at 6,000'.
 
Minor (sort of) quibble.  Aircraft operating VFR-on-top have to maintain VFR
cloud clearance, and 500' above the tops isn't enough...
From: Charles.K.Scott@dartmouth.edu (Charles K. Scott)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Composite landing gear
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:17:23 GMT
 <5141@ssc-bee.ssc-vax.boeing.com>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <5141@ssc-bee.ssc-vax.boeing.com>
prang@ssc-vax.boeing.com (Ron Wanttaja) writes:

> I'd stick with the aluminum, especially for an rough-field airplane like a
> Christavia.

This is only the second response I've gotten about this inquiry but it
echoed the first one which came to my E-mail address.  Basically I've
learned that composite gear legs aren't what they're cracked up to be. 
The best part is that I've learned of another source for custom made
aluminum landing gear.  "Great Plains" sells them and they are built by
Ed Sterba.  I haven't spoken to Ed yet about it since he is down at Sun
n Fun right now. . . but I will.  My only other source for custom
landing gear was "Metal Masters" and they had quoted a price of $800. 
I'd like to do better than that if possible, or I'm back to cutting
down Cessna 150 gear legs.  Those guys are real heavy.

Thanks for the info.

Corky Scott
From: jak@hpbbrd.bbn.hp.com (Juergen Klaiber)
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 05:54:18 GMT
Subject: Re: at Denver  on what else but waiting I can do.
Organization: HP Mechanical Design Division
Newsgroups: rec.aviation

sorry for the mangled headline. It should read:
   Temprary License Expires. Part Two

Juergen
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: gaynier@elec.uq.oz.au (Ron Gaynier)
Subject: Re: Motion Discomfort...
Organization: Prentice Centre, University of Queensland
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 23:33:22 GMT

In <1992Apr7.053543.2460@craycos.com> rh@craycos.com (Robert Herndon) writes:

"|"Ron Gaynier (gaynier@elec.uq.oz.au) writes:
"|">Gerald Rada (radack@ces.cwru.edu) writes:
"|">
"|">> In addition to the things mentioned already, some of the factors that
"|">> in my experience have contributed to feelings of nausea in the cockpit are:
"|">>
"|">> 1. Engine noise.
"|">>
"|">> Solution: Use a good noise-cancelling headset.
"|">>
"|">> 2. Engine vibrations.
"|">>
"|">> Not much you can do about this, except switch to a different plane.
"|">> Unfortunately, the most comfortable planes may also be the most expensive.
"|">
"|">The REAL solution to engine noise and vibrations is to get rid of it
"|">and go fly a GLIDER.
"|">

"|"  While this works fine for eliminating noise and vibration, I find
"|"gliders worse than any other vehicle I know of for inducing motion
"|"sickness.  The reasons probably include:

"|"  1) Good thermalling days are bumpy.
"|"  2) Lots of time is spent cranked over in 60 degree banks
"|"  3) Lots of time is spent suffering from 2+ Gs (in 60 degree banks)

"|"and I'm sure there are more I'm forgetting...

     4) Negative Gs when running into sink.

I stand by my original comment about the solution to engine noise and
vibration but perhaps I should have added : ).

My problem with motion sickness is when someone else is flying. This is
a real problem since I'm training to be an instructor!


Ron Gaynier
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: nigel@modcomp.uucp (Nigel Gamble)
Subject: Another rec.aviator becomes Tiger owner
Organization: MODCOMP, an AEG company
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 22:28:19 GMT

I was on the point of buying a Piper Warrior three years ago when I
discovered that only a US citizen or permanent resident can register an
aircraft in the US.  I am British, and at that time I was not a
permanent resident.  I am glad now that I didn't buy the Warrior,
because since then I have been introduced to the Grumman AA5A Cheetah
and AA5B Tiger.  After spending many exhilarating hours in rented
Grummans, including a vacation trip from Fort Lauderdale, FL to St.
Paul, MN and back, I decided that when I eventually became a permanent
US resident I wanted to own a Tiger.

Well, my `green card' came through last October, and last week I bought
the Tiger.  I was fortunate to find exactly what I was looking for
at my local American General/Grumman American FBO, Locair at Fort
Lauderdale Executive Airport, so I was able to avoid any expensive
cross country trips to view what might have turned out to be
unsuitable aircraft.

I plan to fly N28491 up to Dr. Dan Masys' CBFI on May 3rd.
--
Nigel Gamble					uunet!modcomp!nigel
AA-5B N28491					modcomp!nigel@uunet.UU.NET
From: martin@patricia.verfahrenstechnik.uni-stuttgart.de (Martin Hepperle)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: UAG 88-143: Airfoil Coordinates
Date: 6 Apr 92 12:10:49 GMT
Organization: Institute A for Mechanics, University of Stuttgart, Germany

Hi,

I am looking for a set of coordinates of the UAG 88-143 airfoil,
created by Prof. D.Marsden at University of Alberta around 1989.
Can someone tell me a source for the x-y coordinates or -- even       
better -- has someone these data online and can mail me a copy ?

Thanks, Martin.
From: radack@ces.cwru.edu (Gerald Radack)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Motion 'Discomfort'...
Date: 6 Apr 92 17:01:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: usenet.1992Apr6.170117.28825
Organization: Computer Engineering and Science, Case Western Reserve University

In addition to the things mentioned already, some of the factors that 
in my experience have contributed to feelings of nausea in the cockpit are:

1. Engine noise.

Solution: Use a good noise-cancelling headset.

2. Engine vibrations.

Not much you can do about this, except switch to a different plane.
Unfortunately, the most comfortable planes may also be the most expensive.

3. Any physical or mental stress (tiredness, hunger, sickness, etc.)

Solution: Take care of yourself. Avoid flying when you have one of these
conditions. (But don't eat a meal right before flying either! :-))
-- 
Gerry Radack
EEAP								(216)368-2808
Case Western Reserve University			    radack@alpha.ces.cwru.edu
Cleveland, OH 44106
Newsgroups: rec.aviation