From: lb@cs.man.ac.uk (Luben Boyanov)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.greek,eunet.politics
Subject: There were Macedonians but ...(Re: THE NEW BULLY OF THE BALKANS)
Date: 6 Sep 92 14:48:36 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Organization: Dept Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K.

In article <4766.3248.uupcb@factory.com> michael.polymenakos@factory.com (Michael Polymenakos) writes:

[deleted]

>  Greeks today call themselves Macedonians, and object to the
>  misuse of the name by other countries. The name "Macedonian" was not used
>  for the Bulgarian population of Vardar before Serbia took over Vardar
>  and named it's inhabitants "Macedonians" to distance them from Bulgaria
>  and Albania.

Wrong. The name Macedonians was and is still laregely used in Bulgaria to
describe Bulgarians from Macedonia. In almost the same context all books
from the past refer to "Macedonians". I wanted to find out what foreign
travelers and observers wrote on the matter, and for this purpose I've
taken several books from the library dating from the beginning of the
century. In all of them the terms "Macedonia" and "Macedonians" are
laregely used. Check it for yourself if you wish. Now, if you want to
discuss the problem of national identity - that's another story. It's
unchallenged fact that there was no "Macedonian" national consciousness
(and there was no such ethnic group) 70 years ago. All ethnic maps and
descriptions, which you can check (from the past) DO NOT HAVE "Macedonian"
as an entry - there are Greeks, Bulgarians, Serbs, Albanians !!! and
others. But no Macedonian. However, in all books the authors write about
"Macedonians". All books deal also with the movement for independent
Macedonia and NOWHERE CAN BE FOUND ANY Greek objection about the name !!!
If the real issue for not recognizing Macedonia at present, are the
pretentions of some people who have only read books written and printed in
Belgrade and Skopie - then address the problem as such. But do not spread
misinformation on the subject.

>  Are we going to have to go door-to-door telling people "No it's those
>  Macedonians, we are different Macedonians"?

Yes - why not. In fact there will be 3 different Macedonians on the Balkans
- Greek, Bulgarian and Macedonian Macedonians. All 3 belong to different
nationalities. I agree that there is a confusion but why don't people try
to think how to solve this confusion, instead of arguing on other matters?

>  Peace concerns. Bulgaria has in the past used "Unification of Macedonia"
>  as an excuse for agressiveness: During WWI, Bulgaria joined the Central
>  Empires and occupied Vardar.

But you don't describe Greece's aggresiveness during all wars, do you?
And furthermore, you must mean LIBERATING, as the people from Vardar
Macedonia considered themselves as Bulgarians - just like the Macedonian
Bulgarians in Greece (who were 9% after the BWs and 5% after WWI of the
entire Greek population).

For YOUR information, both the Allies and the Central Powers promised
Vardar Macedonia to Bulgaria, as at that time there was no argument about
the national consciousness of the population in the region! The Bulgarian
king Ferdinand was waiting to see which side will take the upper hand and
didn't join the war immediately. Later, when he thought that the Germans
will win and after, Austria and Germany gave 2 big loans to BG the events
took pro-German direction. The Bulgarian King made his wrong decision,
which costed dearly Bulgaria - further lost of Bulgarian territories and
human life. For Ferdinand - the price was the loss of his crown. Unlike his
father, Boris III didn't have such choice 26 years later. He did his best
Bulgaria to stay neutral, but he couldn't because of (+ several other
factors), the tight economic dependecy of Bulgaria from Germany - at that
time 68% of all Bulgarian imports and exports were with Germany (unlike
half of that percentage for Greece + the strong English promise for help).

But if we come back to the years before WWI - you can see that in all maps
and documents, the population of Vardar Macedonia is described as Bulgarian
and not Greek. Please inform yourself on some matters, in case you have
interest in Macedonia.

>  back on its claims, and there is every hope that Bulgarias first democratic
>  government will not pursue those claim, it is clearly the best interest

The population in Vardar Macedonia (and I think that the same is valid for
the Bulgarian speaking Slav minority in Aegean Macedonian :-( )
DON'T FEEL as being Bulgarian any more. Neither such feelings have the
majority of the Bulgarian people - i.e. that in Greece or Macedonia there
is some considerable Bulgarian population (don't speak about individual
cases). It's out of question to talk about Bulgarian claims on those lands.
In the past - the matters were quite different. Don't mix these historic
periods and the driving forces behind each event - they are very much
different.

[deleted]

>  Michael.


Luben


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Let us not allow splits and splintering to frighten us. It is, indeed, a
pity, but what can we do, since we are Bulgarians and all suffer from one
common disease"
				Gotse Delchev
--------------------------------------------------------------------------