HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (FreeKill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Lack of borg hosts
Date: 1 Oct 92 13:56:41 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <wemjDGi00VpZEW99ha@andrew.cmu.edu> jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Joseph E. Beck) writes:

>>It will help emphasize TEAM PLAY not hurt it.
>Someone else (I forget the name) made almost the same comment when
>they released their borg.  They thought it would allow people to be
>removed from the combat and look at the strategic situation.  A little
>later he decided he was wrong.  Give players a really mondo device for
>killing people and they'll use it.  

That was probably me, and yes, I was wrong.  Personally, I feel borgs ruin
the game.  The only reason I use one is if I see the enemy with tons of
borgs on their side.  Then I just grab my borg and pummel them until they
leave or until I get into bronco, whichever comes first.

My borg (Sunborg) had a lot of potential for helping you do strategic things,
but it's largest usage was pure combat.  I think a good player should be
able to handle both ends at once.

Brian

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig)
Subject: Re: From the statBOY:  The OFFICAL Fall '92 INL SCHEDULE.
Organization: Indiana University Astrophysics, Bloomington, IN
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 08:44:17 GMT

An early prediction - Farm Team East (c'mon Tim, we had better names suggested
than this!), an at-large team of new-to-the-INL types, goes 0-3 before the face
off at the end of the year with our alter egos from the west.

Why?

Our first three games are :

Off the Top Rope
Illuminus Cartel
Side Salad

Ouch!

at least we didn't draw Xgolems too.

Of course, we are playing to gain experience, but I wonder if we'll live long
enough to gain any.

	Entropy
 
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Subject: me, freekill, and hector
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 14:29:51 GMT


In a fit of cluelessness, Brian Paulsen writes:
>))And as to your claim about you, MUCUS, and Brian being the core... 
>))well, you obviously are having those delusions Brian experiences 
>))occasionally. If I had to pick the core players on your team, you would 
>))NOT be one of them.  Duck, Rob, John, and any of a host of other 
>))players could beat the tar out of you on any given day.

>Rob, you overrate yourself.  John is good, but I pummelled the shit out  
>of him on Friday while playing a scout.  The duck has just been awesome 
>the last few times I've seen him.  The duck is also much more of a team 
>player than ANY other player in the game.  

>)Justin doesn't belong to the school that you don't brag on your  
>)abilities.   

>Kinda like you from what I'm reading in your reply :)

I didn't say the above passage...get your includes right.  Sandia did.  I  
said John and Duck were better than you and hector, and they are.  I also  
said that this shouldn't be taken as an insult because they are the two  
best in the game, IMHO.  Of course you can get the best of them on  
occassion, but that means nothing.  They do make mistakes.  I don't ever  
post about my abilities, and I will continue to not post about it.

Justin Botelle writes:

>)Justin doesn't belong to the school that you don't brag on your  
>)abilities.   

>Neither do you.

See above, moron.

>)Incidently, I think the core of TWNN is 1) Red Shirt 2) MUCUS PIG 3)  
>)Wreck.  Not 1) FreeKill 2) Hector 3) MUCUS PIG.

>I'm surprised you included Wreck.  he's not from CMU.  He can't be as  
>good a base (or better) than Balton, Balinor, Tortoise, Videodrome, or  
>yourself. I mean, he's not from CMU (or Berkeley).  You must have needed  
>a third player.

Should've known to not expect fairness from you justin.  When have I ever  
said a player couldn't be top notch if he wasn't from CMU?  I have nothing  
but respect for wreck.

>)I honestly don't think Hector and FreeKill know HOW to win.  They always  
>)seem to find new ways to mess up.  

>This is a new one.  Care to fill me in?

Sure.  It takes some experience with close games to understand how to win  
one.  I don't think either you or brian have that experience yet.  With  
every game you are improving, and as you improve so does TWNN.

Why do you two continue to flame everything in site?  I reply to a post  
telling the honest truth, and all I get is pure pain, misquotes and all.   
Get it straight, guys.  After 2 years it gets old.

Oddly enough, 3 TWNN members have sent me mail agreeing wholeheartedly  
with my posts.  Perhaps you should ask your team what YOU are doing wrong,  
instead of assuming that the problem lies elsewhere.  There's a thought!   
If you want TWNN to win it all (which you have the ability to do) you'd  
better get your act together.

Rob
aka Spaceace!
From: srt@aero.org (Scott "TCB" Turner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: New Imbalance Record?
Date: 5 Oct 1992 15:57:56 GMT
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aerospace.aero.org

This seems to happen quite often on Calvin.  For some reason it's
always the Feds who are taking advantage of the odds.

Why doesn't the server enforce more equal sides?  It seems to me that
when the imbalance becomes > 1, the server ought to force the next
corpse on the bigger side to switch sides.  Is this a FOCS?

					-- Scott T.

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick)
Subject: Re: CMU arrogance, and "ogging"
Keywords: Eugene Santos, "Huh?" and "What?"
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 14:12:04 GMT

sredmore@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (S Redmore) writes
> Hello there,
  [...]
> (CMU = Central Michigan University?) 
  [...]
> I figure that it must be a bug in
> the "client" that I have (thats the user interface side of the software
> in case you didn't understand).
  [...]
> On to my next question... What is an "og" or "ogger"?  I guess the two must
> be related...  The only thing that I can think of is that it's related to
> the Orion "Og" who appears at certain times...  He's really really good.
  [...]
> Does it have to do with the 
> jerky effect that happens when I play from a machine that is far away
> from the "server" machine? (thats the one that you connect to.)  I don't 
> think the jerky effect is too bad.  I don't die any more than normal
> because of this.  I think people are just making up excuses for not playing
> well.
  [...]
> Back to the CMU teams... I mean, come on guys... You aren't that good.
> As for this "Balton" person, I have more than a few hours in a starbase
> (20, to be exact), and think that I could do just as good of a job.  
> Starbasing isn't all that hard.  I think that he is just another example
> of CMU arrogance.

This is my favorite fake post of the week.

Jonathan H., jch@cs.cmu.edu                        Spaceman Spiff, Flying Pig
I run a Netrek information archive.   Access: [1] WAIS (gourd.srv.cs.cmu.edu, 
port 6000, name netrek-ftp)  [2] AFS (try cd /afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/jch/netrek)  
[3] Anon FTP from gs69.sp.cs.cmu.edu   [4] e-mail from ftpmail@decwrl.dec.com
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re:  Side Salad says what?
Date: 30 Sep 92 14:50:41 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

exodus@IASTATE.EDU writes
> 
> 
> 
>   That was our FIRST ever INL type game as a team against Side Salad and  
> we did have a few clueless players that night. We've noticably improved 
> game by game. If you some players not firing at cloakers, maybe it was 
> one of the clueless guys we pulled in......*shrug*......i dunno. I will 
> say this- you'll never genocide us again. That's as good as a challenge, 
> so feel free to take it as such. You shouldn't judge us on that 
> scrimmage.
> 						Exodus

Can anyone say, brian paulsen?  (inside joke, exodus, you wouldn't get  
it).  I guess we'll have to do it again.  We'll set up a time...

Rob
aka Baconbits Boy aka Spaceace!
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: What's wrong with Rob?
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:48:34 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Michael Moore writes
> 	*sigh*  Everyone seems really upset at everyone else.  Rob,
> particularly, has obviously concluded that he ain't gonna put up with
> it no more.

Well, i think some problems in my personal life have spilled into my  
netrek life.  I have been short with people for a couple of weeks now.

> 	Hey Rob, does this mean I can't have dinner with you and Balton?
> I mean, if you're going through this "phase" right now... maybe I should
> just wait a while. .... :-)  
> 
> 	-Tsai Jen.... 
> 
> 	Michael  (Who honestly must say he feels Tom's comment was a

Well sure you can have dinner with me.  We'll invite along all the CMU  
netrek "studs".  Then we'll do the proper thing, and log on some hours on  
bronco after we eat.

I wonder how many flame wars we'll be able to start while we are eating??  
hehe

Rob 'A kinder a gentler netrek player'
Organization: Senior, Chemical Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 12:02:26 -0400 
From: Kevin Michael Bernatz <kb32+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Side Salad says what?

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 30-Sep-92 Side Salad says what?
exodus@IASTATE.EDU (455)

> . I will say this- you'll
> never genocide us again. 

Hmm,
	Sort of reminds me of UPenn's statement last year to the same
effect.... which we happily proved him wrong (as well as Masters).

-KB
 Rear Admiral "Watch what you promise mister!" Akira
From: tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu (Timothy C. Worsley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: INL schedual
Date: 29 Sep 92 02:05:26 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


	Mike "Chi" Juster just wrote to me about the INL schedual, which he
doesn't like.  I've got the funny feeling that he's going to embarass
the hell out of us again, and I'd like to appologize in advance and
point out, once again, that you shouldn't assume that we're all like
that.

ZZnew guy
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: george@saturn.ece.cmu.edu (George Cebulka)
Subject: INL: FLEE vs OTTR
Organization: Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 18:52:13 GMT


Organization: Sophomore, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Fri,  2 Oct 1992 07:05:05 -0400 
From: Greg K Chung <gc2n+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Possible Scrimmage

IC is looking for someone to scrimmage against this Saturday.

None of our scheduled opponents can make it, but we'd like to get in a
good game anyway.  If your team can play us at 7:00PM Eastern, please
reply to me immediately. 

If no team responds, I'd like an IC vs. The World matchup.  Anyone and
everyone invited.  Individual players should send me email if you're
interested and I'll get back to you.

Greg
The Network 
(Why won't anyone play us?  It smells of conspiracy.  Reeks.)
From: mcn@cwru.edu (Michael C. Neuman)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Possible changed in the "E" message:
Date: 26 Sep 1992 12:51:45 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
Distribution: world
Reply-To: mcn@b62103.student.cwru.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: b62103.student.cwru.edu

In article <Bv6n1r.K9@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu  
(Alec Habig) writes:
>In article <1a19frINNhtr@agate.berkeley.edu> jjudy@argon.berkeley.edu (Jack W.  
Judy) writes:
>>1234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890
>>F0->FED  HELP! F0 near Ear: 0% dam, 100% shld, 100% fuel, 0 armies!
>>			^-- (Nearest planet)         ^-- Gotta have this!
>
>It seems feasable, and is already EXTRA COOL!  Let's do it!

  What's this "let's" stuff, white man. You want it, you write it. And if  
you're that much of a neophyte to the code that that "seems feasable", then why  
are you consulting us on what features to add? 

  And the distress idea stinks because of the special case:
1234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890
F0->FED  HELP! F0 (Starbase!) near Cas: 0% dam, 100% shld, 100% fuel, 0 armies!

  Besides, if you don't know where your teammates are, then either they're  
clueless because they're somewhere they're not supposed to be and deserve to  
die anyway, or you're clueless for not knowing where they're supposed to be.

>PS - The "Killed by" addition to the kill messages from god is a lot of fun,
>it'd be nice to see that implemented in more places.  It's good to see things
>like :
>
>"R2(bb) was kill 1.20 for F5(sc) <phaser>"

  If you're that enthralled by kill messages that you actually have time to  
make sense out of garbage like that, you need to spend a little more time at  
maxwarp, and a lot more time looking at your tactical.

-Mike, aka "Gee I like that west division..."

--
Mike Neuman                mcn@b62103.student.cwru.edu
(NeXT netrek hack)  NeXT archive: b62103.student.cwru.edu:/pub/games/netrek
"To make a machine that will be proud of us." - Thinking Machine's motto
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: INL Proposal:  Pregame Peace
Date: 28 Sep 92 04:48:47 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

Leonard, let's compromise.  How about if you can send PEACE to yourself
and you are turned into an independent, at peace with everyone (including
other independents, of course).  That way you don't have to worry about
people killing you while you message, and yet people can still practice
(and not be bored stiff).  Of course, sending WAR to yourself would undo
PEACE.

Justin
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: INL Proposal:  Coaches
Date: 28 Sep 92 17:57:35 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <60681@mimsy.umd.edu) sjsmith@cs.umd.edu (Stephen Joseph Smith) writes:
)botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle) writes:
))I've been putting this off, because I know that the chance of it passing
))is probably pretty little (I'm sure Steve will find some stupid reason
))to bitch about it), but here it goes.
)
)Eh?  Am I the "Steve" in question?

Nope.  I meant Steven von worley (sandia)
)
)Anyway, I think ninth-slot noncombatant is a good idea.  I judge it not
)bloody likely to make it into the fall INL server.  Maybe someone who 
)likes this idea should set up a server somewhere, and we'll see how it
)plays?
)
)(There are two possible modifications.  One is relatively easier: just
)give the ninth player a galactic map, no tactical, and allow message sending.
)The other is harder: switching between player viewpoints seems non-trivial,
)and if someone wants it, they should probably write it.)

Galactic only should suffice.  Anone want to try it out?  doorstop?

)- Gamera

Justin
From: mel1@soc6.acpub.duke.edu (Douglas Melamed)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Lack of borg hosts
Date: 30 Sep 92 22:47:16 GMT

I feel the need to clarify a few things regarding borgs.

1. Using a Borg is not cheating. It is much more realistic than having one
person try to dodge, fire phasers and torps, det and, tractor/pressor at the
same time.

2. Borg users are not all scummers and dogfighters, many are great team players.
It's not the client but the player that makes the difference.

3. Using a Borg does not take the skill out of the game. On the contrary, it
de-emphasizes dog fighting and allows one to concentrate on team play. It adds
a new dimension to the game.

4. Borgs are not hard to kill. An average player can easily kill a bad borg
player. It's as easy as charge-run dodge charge-run dodge, and when they
run out of fuel they're very easy to kill.

5. Anti-borg complainers worsen things more than they help them. They taunt the
other player taking away from everyones enjoyment of the game.

6. In my experience Anti-borg players are mostly clueless players who are much
more rude and obnoxious than any borg player I've ever met.

7. MOST IMPORTANTLY CHILL OUT IT'S JUST A GAME! I believe that the standard 
client should contain many of the so called borg features such as number of
armies next to planets and shield energy shown by color of shields and auto
compute trajectory. It will help emphasize TEAM PLAY not hurt it.

8. Lastly, Give me a damn good reason why borgs are Satan reincarnate as some
of you seem to think.

Thank you for your time, I just wish the anti-borgers would show some rationality
for a change.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sincerely yours,
Muckraker	(Author of MuckBorg)

P.S. I play human much of the time myself, Both have value and both should be
supported. (i.e. Let there be Borg servers and let there be human servers)
and never the twain shall meet. If you don't like Borgs on a server that allows 
them GO ELSEWHERE. I think the Borg players should be allowed to ask human players
to leave. After all there are plenty of places that cater to Human only anti-borg
usually rude, always egotistical types! *I CAN SEE THE FLAMES NOW* such as
RWD4 and DISCOVERY.

P.S.S. Could the players on sturgeon get a clue please :)

P.S.S.S. All IMHO!
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: where Duck Dodgers stands against Gb
Date: 30 Sep 1992 03:46:41 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <4em=rBq00awHM2W0w6@andrew.cmu.edu> "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
)Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 29-Sep-92 Re: where Duck Dodgers
)stan.. Tom Holub@soda.berkeley. (81)
)
)> ...proving once again that you don't need to be from CMU to be a weenie.
)>  -Mojo
)
)	As of yet, I have disagreed with Tom about virtually every important
)INL decision that he has ever made.  In spite of that, I've always felt
)that he had good reasons for making his decisions; I just had different
)criterion.  I've respected his decisions even when I think they're dead
)wrong.  
)	The only think that I do not respect Tom for is his senseless CMU
)bashing.  It's true that we have flamed, bitched, and shown off a lot,
)then, so have a lot of other schools, and a lot of other people.  So why
)the hell do we get ALL the flack.  I for one am sick of it.

I beg to differ.  Nearly all the major problems I've had running the
INL have been generated by CMU.  I realize that CMU'ers are not 
universally condemned to weeniehood (and I wouldn't call you, personally,
a weenie--I don't mind people disagreeing with me), but in my experience
CMU has a disproportionate number of weenies.  It certainly has a
disproportionate number of people who hate my guts, fairly or otherwise,
and that certainly helps to remove my CMU-bashing inhibitions, if ever
I had any.

One thing the CMU weenies (<--note, not condemning the school, just the
weenies) have always failed to realize is that if I have erred in my
administration of the INL it has been on the side of accepting too much
input from others rather than not enough; most of the ideas that were
most heavily flamed were not originally from me.  The original INL server,
for example, which I caught hell for, was based almost completely on
suggestions from Terence.  Halftime was not my idea.  At-large teams
winning tiebreakers was my idea, but I had heavy popular support (from
everywhere except CMU, basically).  I did not and do not deserve to
be called Emperor Holub the stupid fuckhead by the likes of CrackPot
and Mergatroid, and yes, I've grown to resent it somewhat.  I
apologize to those of you who have tried to keep your comments 
constructive.

I still will enjoy beating Side Salad and that weenie Duck.
 -Tom
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Lack of borg hosts
Date: 26 Sep 92 01:08:20 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <MekoTca00awOJf4lhp@andrew.cmu.edu) jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Joseph E. Beck) writes:
)
)Donald Tsang:
))So I made my server No Borgs today.
))
))Sorry.
)
)
)I'm glad there are no borgs on sturgeon, it just got a lot more
)playable (the worse were borgs who didn't read messages, asking them
)to leave was a waste of time).  One question, did you get rid of the
)ability to fire phasers at 50% power but at full fuel and wtemp cost?
)
))(now I have to write anti-runnerscum features... arghh..).
)
)Be careful at what you try to prevent.  Often people who are running
)are trying to accomplish something.  A lot of people find rwd4's
)vector torps very annoying because they penalize people who are trying
)to accomplish goals (if you go out to bomb and someone chases you can
)can't fight effectively while running to their planet, so you have to 

With the wtemp and vector torps, you are penalized for firing excessive
rearward torps.  If your firing torps to kill while running, then you're
a runner scum... period.  If your firing to be left alone, vtorps will 
not change this.

)stop and fight them).  I'd suggest leaving the game as it is.  If
)someone wants to run let them.

But they're so annoying.  I can remember one night when I was playing
on bigdog.  Ged was basing well above Kli (at and, I think).  THe rest
of the kli were there.  Our front line was above Kli.  I was a CA being
runner scummed by 4-5 BB/CAs.  It was ridiculous.  It was fun though.
I got so pissed, I ate Fried Blue Orions at a frantic rate for the next
5 minutes.  After that, there was this vacuum from Kli to our front line
planets.  It was funny.  Anyway, I think running while firing should be
punished.  It's also what you'd expect to happen in "real life" if you've
ever taken any Physics
)
)	joe 
)	Purple haze


Justin
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: IAState team borgs way to victory! Film at 11...
Date: 2 Oct 1992 10:57:17 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Oct2.031349.19802@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu (Chris Siebenmann) writes:
)
) Followups have been redirected to alt.games.xtrek, the agreed-upon
)place for rants, boasts, and screaming at each other. If you think
)you have a real gripe, take it to the INL council; don't try to try
)ISU in the court of public opinion. It backfires.

alt.games.xtrek is not the agreed-upon place for anything.  In fact,
I sent out an rmgroup message on it several days ago.
 -Tom
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 20:20:47 -0400 
From: Tomato Boy <stimpy+@cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: RESPONCE TO PAUL BROOKS
	<1992Sep30.175655.16848@umbc3.umbc.edu>

new lady netrek player writes:

# 
#  But, alas, I try.  If you would have any good advice or important facts on 
# tactic and strategy,etc, I'd be happy to read about them.
# 
# Madeleine...alias Headwound Harry @ fife

Oh, Madeleine, I'd love to discuss tactics and strategy with you.
What are you doing Saturday night??


--Rick
I promise not to ogg you.  :)