HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sschaff@roc.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Stephen F. Schaffner)
Subject: Re: Buddhism & Science
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 21:37:59 GMT

In article <Jan.3.15.27.27.1993.9413@ruhets.rutgers.edu>, farris@ruhets.rutgers.edu (Lorenzo Farris) writes:



|> Relative to the ideas of rules of thumb. In orthodox physics today,
|> something which even many physicists seem to forget, the dominant
|> interpretation of the descriptive value of physics is the Copenhagen
|> Interpretation, which in essence says, We have no idea what is really
|> going on, but with this model we can predict what we will measure when
|> we set things up this way.

	Hmm, my impression of the Copenhagen Interpretation is more along 
the lines of "This is what's going on, but certain questions that, based 
on analogy with the macroscopic world, we would expect to have answers, 
don't, just as the question 'what color is an electron?' doesn't have 
an answer."


|> Quibble: there is only energy, and space-time. And the equations are
|> by no means simple. Just the approximations are.

A quibble on your quibble: the equations are simple, it's the solutions 
that are complicated.


-- 
Steve Schaffner        sschaff@unixhub.slac.stanford.edu
	The opinions expressed may be mine, and may not be those of SLAC, 
Stanford University, or the DOE.
Newsgroups: sci.philosophy.meta
From: gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Cultural Appropriation and the New Age
Distribution: world
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 93 08:19:24 GMT
Organization: STAFF STRATEGIES - Anthropologists & Training Agents


In article <1il4iqINN9sf@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> haynes@cats.ucsc.edu writes:

 > In article <C0K38J.Eo8@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> msteiner@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
 > (marge steiner) writes:
 > >     One thing that strikes me is that the New age Movement
 > >came to prominence when it did--in the 1980's.  While I
 > Gee, and I always thought it was a phenomenon of the Sixties (where the
 > Sixties really means 1965-74, the Seventies means 75-84, etc.)

Oh no, not more of this. Please be discerning in your scholarship.

While I have no problems with your overlapping of decades, the Flower
Power/Hippy movement of the "1960s" was quite a different order of
social dynamic from the New Age movement of the "1980s". In particular
the former was characterised by an extremely vulgar materialism among
the younger generations accompanied by a grossly escapist and drug-
induced sexuality, with only very marginally transcendental influences
bearing upon it. The latter phenomenon is very much represented by a
fully transcendental catharsis among professional people I think are
suffering from something like Toffler's Future Shock, and struggling
to hold onto very traditional roots indeed.

Creatures like Timothy Leary and Charles Manson were among the leaders
of the first event, while Prince Charles and Shirley McLean are among
the second. Completely different types. Charles was here to endure the
rigours of Geelong Grammar (and made a bit more human by us larrikin,
disrespectful, outback Australians) while Leary was getting all those
flower children to blow their own brains out with LSD, in fact.

Gil
From: wout@dutentb.et.tudelft.nl (Wout Serdijn)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Bateson in Capra's Turning Point
Date: 5 Jan 93 11:40:36 GMT
Organization: Delft University of Technology, Dept. of Electrical Engineering

Does anyone knows the exact text, quoted by Fritjof Capra, from Gregory Bateson, which says something like this:

I for myself have put the descriptions of .. and .. , .. and .. galaxies put in a box, to forget them .. In another box I put the living things; crabs, people, the question about beauty

Thanx, Wouter
.
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
From: jz27@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Jeff Zucker)
Subject: Bugs at sci.anth
Reply-To: jz27@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Jeff Zucker)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 23:34:38 GMT

I regularly read about a dozen newsgroups and browse many others. 
Sci.Anthro is the only one that consistently gives me messages like 'NFS
Lookup Failed at Server'  'Article Exists but Unavailable'.  Does anyone
else on the list get these messages?
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
From: shaman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (David Melton)
Subject: testosterone
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 04:01:46 GMT

Greetings and salivations!

	We were sitting in the livingroom talking about testosterone levels
and the corpus callosum this evening.(neat topic for light conversation, huh
:-)  We were wondering, has there been any new banter on the age old quest-
ion of nature vs. nurture, as it relates to the development of homosexual
behaviors?  In particular, we were curious about testosterone levels during
the first trimester.  I hold no opinions on the matter, so don't bother
flaming me:-).

========  
 I(  )I     David A. Melton                      
 I \/ I     shaman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu                                        
 I /\ I     Priest, Our Lady of the Hourglass Wiccan Church  
 I(  )I     Blest be thee and thine!
========
-- 
========  
 I(  )I     David A. Melton                      
 I \/ I     shaman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu                                        
 I /\ I     Priest, Our Lady of the Hourglass Wiccan Church
From: gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: On pets
Distribution: world
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 93 10:03:23 GMT
Organization: STAFF STRATEGIES - Anthropologists & Training Agents

An intriguing item in the local newspaper yesterday:

      LONDON: British company boss Hugh Pilkington-Cushion is suing
      his former wife -- for the return of his two favourite teddies.

      He claims teacher Jane Thomas took the bears, Henry and Nautie,
      after claiming in her divorce petition that he showed more
      affection to them than to her.

      Mr Pilkington-Cushion, 51, says Ms Thomas, 43, took the bears
      from the couple's house in Surrey to her new Cornwall home. He
      is believed to have spent $8,800 so far in his bid to gain
      custody of the pair.

      Ms Thomas complained that the bears were always in the marital
      bed. The couple were married on a boat packed with teddies in
      1988 and divorced two years later.

                                   The West Australian 5 Jan 93, p.9

Gil
From: delancey@darkwing.uoregon.edu (Scott C DeLancey)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Australian languges (was Re: Have you heard of any good..).
Date: 8 Jan 1993 23:34:46 GMT
Organization: University of Oregon Network Services
NNTP-Posting-Host: darkwing.uoregon.edu

In article <C0Jwst.7wF@acsu.buffalo.edu> v187ef4y@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Patrick J Crowe) writes:
>
>No.  If you can find one, look at a linguistic map of Australia.  About 80%
>of the island is one language, but up in the Northern Territory there are
>some 20-30 different languages.  (don't flame me; I know lang=cult is not a
>perfect one-to-one correspondence)
>
You mean language FAMILY.  About 80% of Australia was occupied by
speakers of languages in the Pama-Nyungan family, but that's a
couple of hundred languages.  In the north there are another ~26
families--I don't know how many individual languages are involved, but
it's a lot more than 20-30.

-- 
Scott DeLancey			delancey@darkwing.uoregon.edu
Department of Linguistics
University of Oregon
Eugene, OR 97403, USA
From: twallace@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Todd Wallace)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Re: "modern" anthropology
Date: 12 Jan 93 14:51:23 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: George Mason University, Fairfax, Va.

I am looking for books on what I would guess would be called
"modern" anthropology. Specifically, I am looking for analyses
of group interaction within large cities, use of "ceremonial"
clothing (e.g. suit-and-tie, police uniform, etc.), migration
patterns of indutrialized cultures, and so forth.

Is "modern" anthropology the correct term for what I am
interested in? 

Thanks,
Todd Wallace
From: fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Re: Have you heard of any good...
Date: 11 Jan 1993 04:25:36 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

In article <726571771snx@tillage.DIALix.oz.au> gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick) writes:
>
>
>"Politics" I tend to regard as something pertaining to cities, as
>derived from the Greek "polis". Some related words are "metropolis",
>"politician" and "police", which are inappropriate to the notion of
>aboriginality.
>
>Gil
>
Actually, the Greek word 'polis' originally meant 'settlement' or
'village' (with 'autonomous' being understood). In classical times
it had the meaning of 'independent polity' or 'city state', but
could also mean 'organised community' (this is what Aristotle meant
when he said 'man is a political animal' -- humans are animals that
live in organised communities). Unless the aboriginal peoples of
Australia lived in unorganised communities, the concept of politics
certainly does apply.

-- 
Dawn over the dark sea brings on the sun;                      
She leans across the hilltop: see, the light!
--------------------------------------------------------------------
fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu  
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
From: buchignani@hg.uleth.ca
Subject: Re: Hutterites Today
Reply-To: buchignani@hg.uleth.ca
Organization: University of Lethbridge
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:44:45 GMT

re: total Hutterite population. Perhaps I have it wrong. Although there
has been a bit of a debate on whether or not Hutterite birth rates
(once among the highest in the world) have decreased of late, everyone
agrees that it remains at around 2.5%/yr. Male "defections" seem
to run only about 7%/generation, and women's much less; they
therefore continue to expand rapidly. If unchecked, they would
number about a half million in a 100 years.

I just checked my notes, that indicate there are around 35,000
Hutterites in total--but there's no reference, so...

Norman Buchignani                e-mail address: BUCHIGNANI@HG.ULETH.CA
Department of Anthropology
University of Lethbridge
Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada
From: gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Have you heard of any good...
Distribution: world
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 93 05:41:26 GMT
Organization: STAFF STRATEGIES - Anthropologists & Training Agents


In article <86250@ut-emx.uucp> martini@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu writes:

 > *female* shamen?  As in, women with the role of shaman, not just midwives?
 >  
 > All sorts of anthro types that I ask seem to think "Yeah, there are such
 > critters.." but dont seem to *know* of any, so the question is put to you..

Somebody might be tuned into my place.

We had some senior Aboriginal women here this morning (they left about
2 hours ago) for a meeting on herbs and bush medicine, where some of
this business was raised.

Only partly do we worry about these Christians coming around. The main
part is that it is our own business, and has nothing to do with anyone
else unless they are here with us.

Maybe that's the reason we don't seem to know of any . . .

Gil
From: msteiner@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (marge steiner)
Subject: Re: Cultural Appropriation and the New Age
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 17:04:35 GMT

     Gill, thanks for your provocative response to my
posting.  I am well aware of the literature on religious
syncretism, i
and know very well that Christians appropriated pre-existing
Rjoman practices, etc.  I also rsealize that professionals
often use the New-age movement as a coping strategy.  It is
certainly benign, and better than many coping strategies I
can think of--i.e., drugs.  Nonetheless, there are still
aspects of the Movement that I find troubling, in particular
the sense of complacency that is often reinforced.  Yet,
from an anthropological standpoint, I find the phenomenon
fascinating to watch.  One could look at networking in the
movement, for exasmple, or how spirituality is defined,
milennarian aspects, for example, and other questions.  By
the way, I'm not Catholic and, if anything, I consider
myself a humanist.  Let"s continue this discussion.

        Marge
From: martini@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (ok)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Have you heard of any good...
Date: 6 Jan 93 20:07:54 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

*female* shamen?  As in, women with the role of shaman, not just midwives?

All sorts of anthro types that I ask seem to think "Yeah, there are such
critters.." but dont seem to *know* of any, so the question is put to you..

Newsgroups: sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology
From: stcmille@panix.com (Steve Miller)
Subject: Re: Evolution in anthropology
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 14:51:43 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

In <1993Jan1.212755.6895@nmsu.edu> bgrubb@dante.nmsu.edu (GRUBB) writes:


All together:  LAMARKIAN
		    ^	

It's pretty futile to talk about what kind of evolution cultural
evolution is most like.  It is most like itself: totally unique.
Culture is not a biological organism.  There is nothing except
analogical thinking to make us think it is.  

The idea that a different kind of biological evolution takes over at
each punctuation of social change is absurd.  

   

>Evolution in anthropology is intresting because it is the interplay of three
>not totally compomatable theories of evolution: Darwinian, Lamarcian, and Chaos
>(Better know as puctulated equlibium)  Darwinian evolution works until we
>start using tools and begin to communicate, then Lamarcian evoltion takes over.
>Lamarcian evolution's use of 'inharence of aquired charactistics' works better
>for informantion that Darwinian evolution.  Chaos theory starts opperating
>at the time of sendentary groups and involves the interaction of Darwinian and
>Lamarcian theory with the culture that has and is contiuing to evolve.
>Chaos theory has been seen in network theory where there are forces that
>each have there own law but whose interactions are not realably prediatable
>but also follow a set of rules that can resemble other systems.
>Comments welcome.
-- 

__________________________________________________________
Steve Miller				stcmille@panix.com
		A Famous Rock Star!
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology
From: stcmille@panix.com (Steve Miller)
Subject: Re: Evolution in anthropology
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:17:27 GMT

In <1993Jan4.220647.15087@nmsu.edu> bgrubb@dante.nmsu.edu (GRUBB) writes:

>Unfortunately, you are making the same mistake many anthropologists make
>it is NOT the idea of biological selection that is being used but the
>PROCEESS of that selection.  i.e. The culture best suited to its enviroment
>will survive ("Survial of the Fittest [culture]".

The idea that all or most of what we see in society is "selected for" is
tautological at best, misleading or just plain wrong at worst.  Social
"traits" are subject to a much different kind of "selection."  Now we
can perhaps talk to some extent about something like Steward's culture
core being selected for - but even here it is awfully difficult to
invoke these concepts in a meaningful way.  Are you prepared to say
that, for instance, the sounds of the English language are the way they
are because they represent the most surviveable language sounds for our
environment?  


I mean, sure, you can think in terms of Dawkins' "memes" or whatever you
want, but the units of "cultural evolution" are terribly difficult to
define - much harder than a species or even an ecosystem.  

I guess there's not much doubt that, as an analogy, we have to say that
sociocultural evolution occurs via Darwinian, Lamarkian and Punctuated
Equilibria.  But all that shows is that biological evolution is not a
good theory for social evolution.  (actually, its my understanding that
social evolution theory predates biological evolution theory, which was
to some extent based on it - see Erasmus Darwin)  
-- 

__________________________________________________________
Steve Miller				stcmille@panix.com
		A Famous Rock Star!
From: banks@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Address for P BIELLA?
Date: 4 Jan 93 16:31:14 GMT
Organization: ISCA

I would be grateful if anyone out there could supply me with an
address (postal - and email if there is one) for PETER BIELLA,
a visual anthropologist believed to be at Stockton State College
or University in Pomona, New Jersey.

'The World of Learning' does not seem to list this institution.

Sorry, but please reply direct to me as I only read the list
occasionally.

Many thanks.

Marcus Banks, Oxford
banks@uk.ac.ox.vax
From: sclera@milori.ccit.arizona.edu
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Re: Cultural Appropriation and Old Age
Summary: drivel and mindless banter
Keywords: bob
Date: 4 Jan 93 18:28:50 GMT
Reply-To: bob@sclera.physics.arizona.edu
Distribution: world,local
Nntp-Posting-User: sclera

Courtesy of: nsmca@acad3.alaska.edu we have -

>In article <1992Dec31.090126.1@milori.ccit.arizona.edu>, sclera@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>> 
>>>You sure you're a Christian? You don't sound like you know Christ.
>>>Besides, all the real Christians I know hate religion as much as
>>>Christ does.
>>>
>>>-V.Goff   "...always in trouble"
>> 
>> Yawn.
>>
>> C.S. Cornuelle
>> bob@sclera.physics.arizona.edu
>
>Interesting drivel from both?
>Is this some hidden anthropolgical agenda post?


Not really.  I'm just one of the flame-challenged folks.  Too much
Mutlu too young, it seems  8^}

C.S. Cornuelle
bob@sclera.physics.arizona.edu
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology
From: erwin@trwacs.fp.trw.com (Harry Erwin)
Subject: Presentation Available
Organization: TRW Systems Division, Fairfax VA
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 14:33:47 GMT

The following is available via surface mail if you want a copy:
"Social System Dynamics: Memes, Genes, and Neural Networks"
To be presented by Harry Erwin to the First Interdisciplinary
Conference on Evolutionary Systems, January 16, 1993

-- 
Harry Erwin
Internet: erwin@trwacs.fp.trw.com

Newsgroups: sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology
From: ed_eck@milkwy.enet.dec.com 
Subject: Re: Ethnicity of the Carthaginians?
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 15:40:07 GMT


In article <2340@newsserver.cs.uwindsor.ca>, bouche2@server.uwindsor.ca 
(BOUCHER DAVID            ) writes...
>Does anybody out there know what was the ethnicity of the people
>of Carthage?  I had heard that Hannibal was black, but I saw a 
>portrait of him on a coin and it was impossible to tell one way or
>another... 

> 
>- db
> 

Carthage was, of course, founded by the Phonecians. The Bacas (Hanniibal's
family) were direct descendents of one of the founding families.
Cathagenean society was set up with a few very rich and powerful families,
most of whom were descendents of the original founders, and a great
number of poorer families, most of whom were descendents of the original
tribes in the area. There was not much mixing between the groups.

So, Hannibal and his family was Semitic, whereas the population of Carthage
was predominantly North African.
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
From: msteiner@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (marge steiner)
Subject: looking for colleagues in expressive culture/conflict
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 19:52:16 GMT

     I am also working in an area of New Brunswick, Canada, where three cultures interact--Anglophone, Francophone [Acadian], and Micmac.  I am working with singers who are bi-lingual and bi-cultural and looking at patterns of musical and linguistic code-switching.  I am also looking at the influence of the Miramichi Folksong Festival on these singers's ex[ressions of ethnic identity.  I would very much like to correspond via E-mail with persons who have similar interests.  As an unemployed Ph.D. I sometim



es feel a bit isolated, and it would be nice to meet new colleagues and share work.

     Please send all correspondencae to msteiner@ucs.indiana.edu.
        Sincerely,
        Margaret Steiner, Ph.D.
From: gil@tillage.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Cultural Appropriation and the New Age
Distribution: world
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 93 15:11:10 GMT
Organization: STAFF STRATEGIES - Anthropologists & Training Agents

Sorry, Maria, But I don't see *anything* you have written as being in
any way at all relevant to *anything* I wrote. I simply don't know why
you wanted to respond at all. Perhaps you simply do not understand that
there are quite different perspectives on the world from yours, and
are thus unable to walk around to the other side and look back at it
from there. Viewing totally different attributes, from quite completely
different angles.

The question remains why Christians want to challenge and punish those
who have a different idea, when we don't bother any of you people at
all. What is it you want from us?

Gil

Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
From: shaman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Shaman)
Subject: Re: Have you heard of any good...
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 05:12:14 GMT

Greetings,
	I don't remember the names of the women, but there are several
interviews with female shamans in a book entitled _Profiles in Wisdom_
by John McFadden.  Hope it helps!

========  
 I(  )I     David A. Melton                      
 I \/ I     shaman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu                                        
 I /\ I     Priest, Our Lady of the Hourglass Wiccan Church  
 I(  )I     Blest be thee and thine!
========
-- 
========  
 I(  )I     David A. Melton                      
 I \/ I     shaman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu                                        
 I /\ I     Priest, Our Lady of the Hourglass Wiccan Church
From: haynes@cats.ucsc.edu (Jim Haynes)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Re: Cultural Appropriation and the New Age
Date: 9 Jan 93 00:00:26 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: hobbes.ucsc.edu


In article <C0K38J.Eo8@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> msteiner@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (marge steiner) writes:
>     One thing that strikes me is that the New age Movement
>came to prominence when it did--in the 1980's.  While I
Gee, and I always thought it was a phenomenon of the Sixties (where the
Sixties really means 1965-74, the Seventies means 75-84, etc.)
-- 
haynes@cats.ucsc.edu
haynes@cats.bitnet

"Ya can talk all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was!"
"No it aint!  But ya gotta know the territory!"
        Meredith Willson: "The Music Man"
From: v187ef4y@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Patrick J Crowe)
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology
Subject: Re: Australian languges (was Re: Have you heard of any good..).
Date: 12 Jan 93 20:15:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1il32mINNbu2@pith.uoregon.edu>, delancey@darkwing.uoregon.edu
 (Scott C DeLancey) writes...
>In article <C0Jwst.7wF@acsu.buffalo.edu> v187ef4y@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu
 (Patrick J Crowe) writes:
>>
>>No.  If you can find one, look at a linguistic map of Australia.  About 80%
>>of the island is one language, but up in the Northern Territory there are
>>some 20-30 different languages.  (don't flame me; I know lang=cult is not a
>>perfect one-to-one correspondence)
>>
>You mean language FAMILY.  About 80% of Australia was occupied by
>speakers of languages in the Pama-Nyungan family, but that's a
>couple of hundred languages.  In the north there are another ~26
>families--I don't know how many individual languages are involved, but
>it's a lot more than 20-30.
> 
Thanks.  I stand corrected.  My only defence is that I was trying to remember
a linguistic map of Australia which I had seen a couple of years ago.

-Pat Crowe
Newsgroups: sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology