HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: indu@iss700.Columbia.NCR.COM ()
Subject: Re: August'14 (A nice Book and Historical Errors)
Originator: indu@iss700
Organization: NCR Corp, E&M-Columbia, Columbia, SC
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 92 18:21:45 GMT

To: g9220348@cc.uow.edu.au
Subject: Re: August 14'.. (There is a nice book...)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan

In article <1992Sep4.121751.17616@cc.uow.edu.au> you write:
>i000@iss700.Columbia.NCR.COM () writes:
>(stuff deleated of reference article)
>
>>  HISTORY IS NOT Re-CREATED BY WRITING BOOKS :-)
>>  IT HAPPENS.  YOU ONLY LEARN AND TRY TO UNDO IT 
>>  if any HISTORICAL ERRORS TAKE PLACE ! :-)
>
>
>History is history.
>
>It is past.
>
>It cannot be undo.

 True! BUT YOU CAN UNDO HISTORICAL ERRORS! THAT IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY.

>
>If you think creation of Pakistan is a historical error then
>what were the cause of it.

   Islamic fundamentalism, where this strata of society was lead by some
   GROUPS for their personal motives. Also a failure by Indain leadership to 
   draw a line between Appeasement and Involvement in a national meovement.
   And in the eagerness to get political freedom, ignoring that 
   converted-Hindus  are being misled. This led to their impatience with 
   fundamentalists. No decisive force to guide the nation and counter 
   British propoganda. And falling prey to their propoganda-machine, and 
   english system. Both Jinnah and Nehru were products of this. 

>
>If India has learnt anything from the creation of PAkistan is to
>repeat the same mistake. The answer is in hand : Sikhs are asking Khalistan.

  NOT SIKHS! Say Pakistani trained terrorists. If their motives are forming
  a sikh state, (as some Indian Leader has said)
  Punjab state would be enlargened, with its capital being shifted from 
  Chandigarh to Lahore within the Constitutional Frame Work of India.

  WHAT HAS PAKISTAN LEARNT AFTER 1971. Smuggling-of-nuclear-bomb? Any way,
  once we form Akhand Bharat, all these would not solve our problems. We need
  to tackle our POPUPLATION problem, and other problems on Economical front.
  As you know whole of Pakistan is Economically Bankrupt and is still 
  continuing with this Nuclear madness. We should tackle these. Atleast,
  if we focus our vision in that direction, then some start ! After all,
  we cannot let small countries overtake  OUR COUNTRY Economically.
  Atleast these economical changes have started in Greter Bharat! It is only
  in the minor Part(present PAKISTAN)  where we need to create this 
  awareness and sense of responsibility.

>
>
>Bye
>Adil

  *******    Garv Se Kaho ! HUM HINDU HAI!!!     ********
  *******        SWAYAM EVA MRIGENDRATA          ********

-Indu.
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  The views expressed above are on my personal basis.                 |
|  No Group or  Organization   can be held responsible                 |
|                                ( for those in quest of truth .......)|
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: narain@bass.bu.edu (A.V.S. Narain)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: The End of an Era, Hyderabad State
Date: 16 Sep 92 03:08:50 GMT
Reply-To: narain@bass.bu.edu (A.V.S. Narain)
Followup-To: soc.culture.pakistan
Organization: Boston University College of Engineering

In article <195kllINNbds@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan) writes:
       deleted..
>
>	Would you two guys be surprised( heard-it-for-the-first-time kind)
>that as far as U.N.O. is concerned Case of Hyderabad is still unresolved
>and is on the agenda of the Security Council.
>
>Mansoor Khan

        Thats true.Even I have heard that the Indian armed forces when they
entered hyderabad commited lots of atrocities.Had it not been for our
razakar brothers who staked their lives to protect hyderabad's populace,
nothing could have stopped them in their mayhem.Many sisters' "izzat" was
protected by these pious souls(razakers) from the raping devils belonging
to the indian Army.We pakistanis should organise another razaker movement
and let us try to undo what has happened in 1948-49.......:-)))

-narain:-)
Xref: sparky soc.culture.pakistan:14598 soc.culture.indian:30762 soc.culture.bangladesh:4733
From: hassan@cup.portal.com (hassan monu alam)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Pakistan-Israel ties
Date: Wed,  9 Sep 92 17:55:02 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Far Eastern Economic Review, 10 September 1992
---------------------------
PAKISTAN-ISRAEL TIES
Esmat Abdul Meguid, the Egyptian secretary-general of the Arab 
League, told Pakistani leaders during his late August three-day official 
visit to Islamabad that most of the Arab states were preparing to 
recognise Israel and that Pakistan cold help to make the decision almost 
unanimous if it established relations with Israel at the earliest 
opportunity. While Islamabad's reaction is not known, Pakistan's 
ambassador to the US had stated in an interview with an Indian 
newspaper that his country would follow the Arab lead over Israel.
From: mmpjh@angelo.amd.com (Javed Hussain)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: URDU word processor
Date: 14 Sep 92 22:13:12 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Santa Clara, CA

SALAM!
	
I recently posted an URDU word processor. I got couple of emails asking help
in decoding the files. Rather than answering individually, I am posting this for everybody who do not know how to decode the uuencoded files and unzip them.
	1. There is a uudecode available from ftp sites (SIMTEL) for IBM PC
	and is also available on most unix boxes. Use that to decode all
	uuencode files. It will create some *.zip files. If you decoded on
	unix box then, down load to your PC. 

	Here is what you do:
		uudecode intext.uue
 	Make sure that all *.uue files are in the same directory.

	2. On Pc there is a utility (also available from ftp sites(SIMTEL)
	to unzip these zipped files. Use PKUNZIP ver. 1.1 to unzip the files.
		Here is what you do:
		pkunzip intext.zip
			
I am sure, there will be someone in your organiztion, who can help you how to 
do both of above.


Khuda Hafiz,

Javed
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: milind@agni.cc.nd.edu (Milind Saraph)
Subject: Re: The End of an Era; The Seventh Nizam of Hyderabad
Reply-To: milind@agni.cc.nd.edu (Milind Saraph)
Organization: Univ. of Notre Dame 
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:24:00 GMT

khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan) writes:

>Off the battlefield, the Muslim community fell before a massive 
>and brutal blow, the devastation of which left those who did survive
>reeling in bewildered fear. About 200,000( 2 lakh) muslims were
>massacred.

Do you have any reference for this?  This is the first time I have
heard this.  

-- Milind Saraph
From: karabulu@cae.wisc.edu (Hasan Karabulut)
Subject: Re: Cultura dar Afghanistan
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering
Date: 12 Sep 92 07:40:14 CDT

In article <BuG9sz.JGv@ucunix.san.uc.edu> minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas) writes:
>Salam alaikum,
>
>it seems that the comment I made, "so how about some muslim brotherhood" made
>someone upset. I apologize. I did not know that it would be offensive. On
>another newsgroup I would have been an "asshole" and insisted I was right,
>however, in this case, I think it was un-called for. I am slightly, not
>too much, aware of how Pakistan, Iran, and Saudia Arabia have been trying 
>to manipulate the outcome in Afghanistan, and this bothers me alot because
>not just because I am from Pak, but also because I have always believed and 
>always wanted to believe that Pakistan was being self-less in helping a
>neighboring Muslim country, and a country with very close language and cultural
>ties at that. Also because I have Afghani friends who can speak Urdu, I can 
>speak Pashto (somewhat). I put in the comment of Muslim brotherhood only
>because a I saw a shit article implying somwhow that Afghanistan "belonged"
>to Iran, as if that was Iran's birthright. I only said this to emphasize
>that any sort of political unification should and must come as a result of
>Islamic ties. That's all.
>
>sincerely
>zafar minhas
>
Islamic brotherhood is real. If we are not able to practice it,
its only our fault. Because, we have other causes, nationalism,
self-interest, politics, etc.. Because we are not sincere muslim.
Because, we say 'there is no god but Allah' bit we are not
aware of its meaning.

I read Br. Zafar's message and the long reply. Yes, there are 
problems, there are muslims with motives other than islam. But
we did not believe in Allah because of these people. We believe
in Allah because He exists, because He is the creator of all of us.
And there is a day of judgement. On this day, whoever fighted for
Islamic causes and whoever fighted for other things will be clear.

Even in the time of Resulullah (saw), there were 'munafiks'. You
cannot get angry with munafiks and weak muslims and turn back to
Islam. There is only one God. If you turn back, there is no other door
to knock!

jazakumullah
---

Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.african,soc.culture.african-
From: ahussain@prism.poly.edu (Arshad Hussain)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: In praise of Hasrat Mohaani
Date: 14 Sep 92 12:56:52 GMT
Organization: Polytechnic University, New York


Ba-wajood-e idd-aay ittaqaa Hasrat Muj-hey
Aaj tuk 'uh-day ha-wus ka wo fasaana yaad hay

  Chupkey chupkey raat din .....

Arshad
From: khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: REPOST: Gallery of Freedom Fighters
Date: 9 Sep 1992 21:28:17 GMT
Organization: Computer Engineering and Science, Case Western Reserve University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: king.ces.cwru.edu


	Starting early last month, I have been posting copies 
of articles from a diary  published by PIA in 1990. Since many people,
especially students were on summer break, I  am reposting the articles
I have posted so far. 
M.A.K.
Cleveland.

		Gallery of Freedom Fighters
		===========================

	Pakistan International Airlines( PIA) published 
a diary on The Golden Jubilee celeberation of Pakistan Resolution
in 1990. Along with lots of stuff on the history of Pakistan Movement,
it also contained profiles of some of the freedom fighters.
I hope to post these articles on S.C.P for the benefit of its
readers all over the world.

Mansoor Khan
Cleveland, Ohio.

P.S. The diary talks about following people,

	Sir Syed Ahmed Khan, Hasan Ali Effendi, Mohsin-ul-mulk Mehdi Ali Khan,
Navab Viqar-ul-Mulk, Sir Sultan Muhamad Shah( The Aga Khan III),
Maulana Obaidullah Sindhi,  Maulana Shaukat ALi, Maulana Muhammad Ali( Johar),
Hakim Ajmal Khan, Navab Salimullah( of Dhaka), Maulana Hasrat Mohani,
Maulana Zafar Ali Khan, Chaudhary Rahmat Ali( who gave Pakistan its name),
Dr. Allama Muhammad Iqbal, Maulvi A.K. Fazlul Haq(Sher-e-Bengal),
Chaudhary Khaliquzzama'n( who was elder brother of famous Dr. Salimuzzama'n
Siddiqee of Pakistan), Sir Abdullah Haroon, Navab Bahadur Yar Jang,
Hussain Shaheed Suhrawardy, Raja Sahib of Mahmoodabad( Amir Ahmad Khan),
Khwaja Nazimuddin(2nd Gov. Gen and 2nd Primeminister of Pakistan),
Navab Muhammad Ismail Khan, Sardar Abdur Rab Nishter, Allama Shabbir Usmani,
Ms. Fatima Jinnah, Begum Shahnavaz, Lady Haroon, Liaquat Ali Khan,
and Mohammad Ali Jinnah( Quaid-e-Azam).

==
From: kmubarak@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kamal Mubarak MD)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: sex in hereafter (was Re: the terminator part n : )
Date: 11 Sep 92 02:23:21 GMT
Organization: The Ohio State University

I wrote:

>>My dear Gopal, you missed  the  point  completely.  You see, I am *not*
>>interpreting the Qura'n.  Not at all.  I am only giving you a *literal*
>>*translation*. It is you who is *interpreting* the Qura'n, and that too
>>in a sexist manner.  Have you forgotten?  Let me quote for you your own
>>writings. You begin the discussion by stating very clearly:
>>
>>  MEN who go to heaven will be serviced by young VIRGINs. (Seems like someone
>>  was letting their sexual fantasies run awild. No mention is made if WOMEN
>>  are serviced by young STUDs).

Gopal writes:

>You missed out 4 very important words that preceded that above paragraph.
>They were "From what I heard (or was it "read"?)" .  The fact is that i
>did not make any interpretations of my own. I used the literal translations
>just as you caim to be doing. I also posted a source where the word hoor
>is reffered to as Maidens. I did mot make that translation.

[Gopal's description of his own "character assassination" deleted.]

My dear Gopal, the lesson to learn is very simple. Somebody may have taught
you that in high school.  Don't believe everything you read.  And when  you  
say something, be very sure of it.

>If heavens exists, I will definetely choose the Muslim heaven.

That might not be easy.  You might have to become a Muslim first :-).

Kamal Mubarak.

--
The best books are those which startle you by contradicting  your  opinions
and beliefs.  You learn more from your enemies than your friends.
St John Ervine.
--

P.S.  BTW, you still haven't quoted 55:72-74

     71.  Hurs restrained (as to their glances) in (goodly) pavilions:
     73.  Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
     74.  Whom no *man* or Jinn before them has touched;

to *prove* that the Hurs referred to here are the female variety....

Please do so....  Then I can bash you some more!
From: khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Hasrat Mohani, Gallery of Freedom Fighters
Date: 13 Sep 1992 18:19:30 GMT
Organization: Computer Engineering and Science, Case Western Reserve University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: king.ces.cwru.edu



>Wasn't Hasrat Mohani also president/office-holder of Communist Party of India?
>I heard that somewhere but I am not sure. Does anybody know anything about it?

>By the way, I do consider him a sincere politician and devout muslim.
>(Not that my consideration otherwise could belittle his greatness.)


>Azeem.

	I remember reading about Hasrat Mohani's association with
Communist Party of India( before 1947, India = Pakistan + India + Bangladesh).
Muslims were very active with Communist Party before 1947. And for that 
matter, they still are active in the Communist Party of todays India.
	Sometime after 1947, Sajjad Zahir, a leader of Communist Party of
India came to Lahore from Lucknow. After being unsuccessful in promoting
Communist Party in Pakistan, he went back to India. He was a well known
Urdu writer of his times. 

Mansoor Khan
From: anajam@athena.mit.edu (ADIL NAJAM)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: bill unwaan.......titleless
Date: 11 Sep 92 21:44:05 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology





	woh jiss ghumand say bichRRa, gilla tou uss ka hai
	kay saari baat mohabbat meiN rakh rakhaoo ki thei





	ADIL [humm jo tareek rahouN meiN maaray gaa-aye....] NAJAM
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: husaia@aix.rpi.edu (Atiya Husain)
Subject: Ghazal Time...
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy NY
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 22:55:37 GMT


Tujhi say ibtayda hay to hi eik din intaha ho ga
sada-y-saaz ho gi or na saz bay-sadaa ho ga

humain maaloom hay hum say suno mayhshar main kiya ho ga
sub uss ko daykhtay hon gay wo hum ko daykhta ho ga

jahannum ho kay jannat jo bhi ho ga faisla ho ga
ye kiya kam hay humaara or unn ka saamna ho ga

azal ho ya abad donon aseer-a-zulf-a-huzrat hain
jidhar nazrain utthao gay ye hi eik silsila ho ga

Jigar ka haath ho ga hashr main or daaman-e-hazrat
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: aam9n@honi1.acc.Virginia.EDU (Ali Ahmad Minai)
Subject: Re: Heavenly speculations (was Re: the terminator part n : ))
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 22:50:58 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.151238.24841@ucunix.san.uc.edu> minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas) writes:

>The word hoor in Arabic from the Quran does not imply women in Heaven as a 
>reward for living the pious life. I have been reading this string of articles 
>and am sick of the sexism that is being implied. The word hoor in Arabic and
>as translated in the Quran means a heavenly partner. It implied in Arabic a
>person with large eyes, since that was a signg of beauty. The Quran says the
>people of heaven will get hoors. That is both men and women who have lived
>according to the way expected for them will get heavenly companions. The Quran
>does not specify male or female, and hoor is a word that implies either male or
>female. There are many hadis which state what the nature of the hoor will
>be, but we have to keep in mind that these are hadis and not quran. furthermore
>i am getting sick and tired of seeing islam being denigrated like this. you 
>people are worse than the folks of soc.culture.iranian. please show a little
>bit of respect to islam and talk in a respectful manner.

I think Zafar makes an excellent point here. We should stop all this talk of
Islam and sex in the same breath (well, the same electronic stream), and refer
only to "male or female heavenly partners with large eyes" (how large, 
one might be tempted to ask, but the pious steer clear of such temptation).
At the risk of a little impiety, though, one might speculate that the hoors
mentioned in Zafar's article (and the Quran, it seems) are a race of nocturnal
aliens. I have always been intrigued by the fact that a significant proportion
of alien races portrayed in pop SF have large eyes. Perhaps this is the
result of an ancestral memory dating back to pre-OS (OS=Original Sin) days,
when Adam and Eve dwelt among the gentle, large-eyed folk of Hoorworld.
Whatever the merit of such speculation, though, one thing is clear. NO SEX!
OK? And, no, the hoors are NOT true hermaphrodites; that would be too
convenient. As pointed out in the article above, the word hoor can refer
to either male or female but not both. Never both. Is that clear? Be
respectful! Respect your elders! Respect hoors! Or move to soc.culture.iranian.

Ali Minai

Xref: sparky soc.culture.pakistan:14736 soc.culture.arabic:3654 soc.culture.african:4792 soc.culture.afghanistan:980 soc.culture.turkish:9976 soc.culture.lebanon:4024 soc.culture.asean:6095 talk.politics.mideast:20056
From: ghayalm@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Manoj Ghayalod)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.african,soc.culture.african-american,soc.culture.afghanistan,soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.lebanon,soc.culture.asean,talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Algeria Vs. the US hypocrisy -From NYT-
Date: 14 Sep 92 18:39:35 GMT
Organization: University of Cincinnati

In article <BuJyvB.GLD@ucunix.san.uc.edu> minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas) writes:
>
>
I have some questions
>
>5)all people are allowed to run for office with the exception of the head of
>  the government and that is only for a muslim (which makes sense since in an
>  islamic state the head of the government would have to be a muslim)
>
Why does the head of the government have to be a muslim?  What if a non muslim
agrees to the principal of the Islamic state, why can't he be the head of
the government?  Most of the rules seem conservative, but fair to me.

>6)the non-muslims of that country enjoy special rights (they do not have to
>  be in the military, in return the pay a jizyah, the money which is used is
>  for their protection in war) the non-musims are known as dhimmi which is
>  short for dhimmat-ullah (protected by god).
>
What if non muslims decide to serve in the military do they still have to
pay jizyah?  Is it compulsary for all muslim males to serve in the
miltary, if not, then why are the ones not serving in the miltary asked to
pay jizyah?

>3)i think that a large minority of scholars believe that it is acceptable
>  for a woman to be chosen as khalifah or amirah. **
>
>** controversial statement so i will explain my view from what i read later
>
Would like to know your view and also why the majority object.

>in an islamic country the khalifah or amir has the added responsibility
>that all of the people are properly clothed and fed, not a single person
>can go unclothed or unfed.
>
I don't think it is possible.  How do you think this can be done?

>
>hope this helps
>
>zafar minhas
>
>
Manoj
>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: alam@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (ALAM AFSHAN)
Subject: squicking. is Re: the terminator part n : )
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 01:41:12 GMT

kmubarak@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kamal Mubarak MD) writes:

>There are other solutions, of course. The Triple Cocktail (no pun intended) of
>amitriptyline, yohimbine, and testosterone is a high potency medication.
an attractive woman attracted to 1'd b p high potency soln to lotsa men.
but such optimal solns r hard to find :)   

>>> >+ gdness(ever known a copse to marry again or do other rotten stuff?)

>You are not implying sq***king, are you?
anything 1 did to the copse besides washing & burying it'd q pssbly b sq'king:)
(i came across this term in some of the stranger newsgps i freq.
for the uninitiated:) squicking is going beyond what 1 is comfortbl w/.
something that grosses 1 out. comes from the squicking sound made by nails
scratching a blackbd)

>>> >Afshan. where *does* 1 apply for a licence to kill:)

>Medical school, of course!
is that all?!i thought i'd have to get a posn in MI5 hq :)

>>So please dont edit your articles, let us see some RAW stuff.
here's a raw 1.innocent rdrs pls hit n NOW.
some teenage boys happ'nd to b outside this window where a woman was 
undressing.as she divested her undergarments 1 screamed & ran.his friends
rushed to him asking what was wrong.he said in a shaken voice'my dad said if
i ever saw a woman nude i'd turn to stone. and part of me just did!'

>If there is enough interest (from both sexes), I can post excerpts....
yes.post them.if any1 doesnt particularly wish to rd it (i dont cons knowledge
to equal corrupn per se) they can always hit n.        

>Kamal.
Afshan. doesnt think she wants a licence to kill only to stun:) :)
From: abbasa@ul.ie
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Islamic Information & News Network: Info
Date: 14 Sep 92 17:21:24 GMT
Organization: University of Limerick, Ireland


Muslim World News is covering news regarding Muslims in very
good way. It would have been better to strengthen and expand this agency 
rather making another" Dairh inch ki Masjid".  Muslim would
never learn a lessom from the history. Today, Muslims are suffering
because of divisions, groupings, and sects.  Mr. Mughal, you probably
want to increase another group. Thank you very much.

regards,

Asad. 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: kmubarak@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kamal Mubarak MD)
Subject: Re: the terminator part n : )
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 22:20:37 GMT

>its not just the soul.there will b bodies in the hereafter which will
>either b suffering in hell(there r lotsa descriptions eg skins burning
>and being xchgd for new skins which r burnt also) or finding delight in hvn.

That is one interpretation.  I, for one, would be quite content to leave my
body to merrily decompose six feet under.  And I would not be surprised  if
my Creator does not grant me a material existence in the hereafter.

>>regions of a soul, or can one? Is what is mentioned in the Qura'n to be
>>taken literally, or is  it  meant  to  be  a  sexual  allegory  to  the
>>spiritual pleasures of the hereafter?
>God knows! the only thing clr to me is that there is q eno' motivn to try
>to get into hvn and avoid hell.
>
>>Kamal.
>Afshan. i dont have a soul a soul has me

Kamal [Would know my name if I saw you in heaven?] Mubarak.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan