From: hporopudas@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: Re: forwarding
Organization: Nokia Telecommunications.
Distribution: sfnet
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 13:49:15 GMT


In article <1992Sep7.185018.24797@cc.tut.fi>, jk87377@cc.tut.fi
(Juhana Kouhia) writes:

     ...osa poistettu...
>
> En ottanut artikkeleja mielivaltaisesti.
> Otin kaksi sinun artikkeliasi ja yhden kommentin koskien sinun
> persoonaasi.
>
     ...osa poistettu...


  T{ss{ on n{m{ pari muuta juttuun liittyv{{ kirjoitustani sci.math :sta.
  Viimeinen oli vain sen takia, ett{ matemaatikot saisivat ideoita siihen
  mit{ he yrittiv{t todistaa. Minun mielest{ ongelma kaikissa aiheeseen
  liittyviss{ kirjoituksissa oli se ett{ yritettiin todistaa huonosti
  m{{ritellyn tai m{{rittelem{tt|m{n "God" olemassaoloa tai ei-olemassaoloa.


           Hannu.



X-News: tnclus sci.math:13161
From: hporopudas@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject:Re: Proof of God's Existence
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 15:51:24 GMT
Message-ID:<1992Sep6.175124.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi>


In article <ARA.92Sep4201537@camelot.ai.mit.edu>,
ara@zurich.ai.mit.edu (Allan Adler) writes:
> Hannu writes:
>
>>Definition: God is Existence.
>>Theorem: Existence exists.
>
>
> This is not a defintion. Even if I knew what "existence" was, I would
> still have to figure out what "Existence" is.
>
> Allan Adler
> ara@altdorf.ai.mit.edu

    As I said earlier I think that we humans can never define "Existence"
  completely, this is partly due to the point of view that there may exist
  several unknown dimensions in very small scale about which we don't know
  anything at the moment and about which we perhaps will never know anything.
  And "Existence Himself" is possibly capable to choose the form and scale of
  His manifestation as He likes. These are the main reasons why it seems to
  me that it is senseless try to define "Existence" completely.

            Hannu.

 "Good is one, pleasant is an another matter. These two lead man to very
  different goals. Who chooses good, will become happy. Who keeps pleasant
  better, will loose his goal. Wises let never pleasant delude themself.
  They choose good. Mads become entangled only in pleasant's toils and they
  get lost.

  Thrown to ignorance man gives himself to work and employment and by
  keeping himself sensible and learned he steggers without goal like
  blind lead by blinds.
       ...

  Body is like a waggon, in front of which sences are harnessesed like horses.
  Mind is like bridle, with aid of which driver, in other words, brains keeps
  horses, in other words sences, holds in check. Soul controls waggon, and
  the road is matter's world, where sences are working. If bridles are not
  kept firmly and wisely, then sences get on the loose like refractory horses,
  and waggon does not get to the destination. If man is wise and holds
  his mind in check, then his sences are like good horses, controlled
  by a good driver.
       ...
  When knots of heart are undone and man is free from earthly attachments,
  man becomes immortal."

              (Indian wisdom, Kat'ha upanisad, roughly translated)



X-News: tnclus sci.math:13221
From: hporopudas@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject:Re: GOD - THE FINAL CHAPTER
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 15:36:43 GMT
Message-ID:<1992Sep8.173643.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi>


In article <1992Sep8.001627.90029@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au>,
kevin@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au writes:

   ... deleted stuff ...

> In closing, I have also noted another line of argument running - something
> like the following.
> 1. God is existence.
> 2. You can prove the existence of existence in some modified set theory
> (Of course, in normal set theory, you can't.)

   ... deleted stuff ...


   I have here below my text a story about "Spirit of Universe"
   (="Existence") taken from Indian wisdom:

            Hannu.


  "Earth, water, fire, air, ether, thought, reason, and individual
   consciousness are eight fold division of my nature.

   Physical nature that I described is my lowest form of manifestation.
   Another and higher nature of mine is life's principle, by aid of which
   universe is maintained.

   Realize that these two forms the womb for all living beings.
   I'am the beginning of the whole universe and that where the universe
   breaks up.

   There is nothing outside of me. The whole universe depends on me like
   pearls in ribbon.

   I'am taste of water, sun's and moon's radiation, holy OM from all
   veda-books; I'am voice of the space, I'am men's bravery.

   I'am eart's sweet smell and fire's heat, life of all beings, self dicipline
   of ascetics.

   Know that I'am the basic seed of all beings. I'am wise's buddhi, brilliancy
   of celebrated.

   I'am strength of strong, which is not contaminated by lust and passion.
   I'am that love in every beings which is not against dharma.

   Know that purity, passion and lifeless are all from me. These conditions
   do not affect to me, but they are in me.

   Deceived by these three conditions whole this world does not know me,
   I who am above it and eternal.

   This divine illusion, which I bring about and which is based action on
   properties of nature , is difficult to win; but those who resort to me,
   wins this illusion."

  "Whole creation lives and moves under power of mistake, mislead by opposite
   pull - and push - forces."

  "Because I'am above all changeable and unchangeable, I'am known in general
   and acknowledged Highest Spirit in veda books."

  "I penerates whole this world in form of without manifestation; all beings
   are living in me, but I'am apart of them."

  "I send warm; I hold back rain and send rain; I'am immortality and death;
   I'am existing and also not existing."

  "Meditate that like to all around moving storm wind is binded to the space,
   likewise all beings are depended on me."

         (Indian wisdom, About God and nature, rough translation)



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