HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mjc+@cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
Subject: miking bodhrans
Date: 27 Dec 92 20:02:40 GMT
Article-I.D.: NL.mjc.725486560
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Can anyone here give me advice on the best way to mike a bodhran?  I've 
never been happy with this aspect of any of the recordings my group has
attempted to do -- either the bodhran dominates or the richness is lost
and all we get is dull thunking.  We do our recording all at once (on
multiple tracks, but playing together), as opposed to laying down one track 
at a time.

Thanks!

Monica
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Subject: Re: Any Info on ddrums brand of pad/synth?
Reply-To: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Organization: Yale University, Department of Computer Science, New Haven, CT
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 07:42:31 GMT

In article <schultz.3@stpaul.ncr.com> schultz@stpaul.ncr.com (STEVE  
SCHULTZ) writes:

> Somebody please point me in the right direction to find
> out more information  about ddrums - a brand of drum
> pads/triggers/drum machine brain/etc.  I saw  a used set
> of these at my local store and they were rather
> interesting... what is used market price, MIDI
> limitations, upside/downside, etc. 

ddrums are pretty much the top-end (along with Simmons
SDX) in electronic drums.  They are very expensive, but
offer incredible sensitivity and dynamic range that
many drummers feel approach those of acoustic drums.

I've seen two versions of ddrums.  The earlier
incarnation - ddrumPLUS! -  was not MIDI equipped,
although it may have been available as a later retrofit,
and had six channels.  The later (current?) incarnation -
ddrum2 - has MIDI, and has eight channels.  Both versions
use pads with "real" drum heads.  Sounds are stored in
plug-in cartridges.  There are 1000 (!) velocity levels,
and response time is 2-3 ms. 

I played a set in NYC - nothing else has ever compared in the
realm of electronic kits.  Then again, the six piece
ddrum2 kit cost about $6,000 at the time! 

Many "name" drummers have used/use ddrums: Rick Allen, Kenny Aronoff,
Wille Stewart.

The contact info I have from a marketing packet several
years old is: 

	ddrum
	POB 166
	25 Lindeman Drive
	Trumbull, CT 06611
	(203) 374-0020

Note the company isn't really located in CT; it's located
in another country (Sweden, I think). 

--
Nathan Janette
PPP link from hilbert.csb.yale.edu

Please reply to: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (NeXT)

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Subject: Re: Xmas toys - Alesis D4
Reply-To: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Organization: Yale University, Department of Computer Science, New Haven, CT
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 05:30:57 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.203031.24661@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>  
drums@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (robert.e.wisnack.jr) writes:
> 
> 
> Boy..... nothing beats a Christmas when you get 
> some cool toys.  This year Santawife bought me
> the Alesis D4 and the SS Stealth Bass drum
> trigger.  The only problem is that the b.d.
> trigger is not for a double pedal, which I have.
> My question is: does anyone know of a good trigger
> that can accomodate a double pedal.  I was looking
> at the KicKat.  I found a store here in N.J. selling
> it for $110.00.  I also called Sam Ash and they want
> $179.00.  Does anybody have anything good or bad to
> say about this ?  

That $110 price seems unlikely.  They cost about $200
around here in stores not known for robbing customers.
I'm having some problems with it, but I can't isolate
the problems to the pedal, the DrumKat-EZ, or the
SR-16 sound module.

--
Nathan Janette
PPP link from hilbert.csb.yale.edu

Please reply to: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (NeXT)

Xref: sparky rec.music.makers.percussion:353 rec.audio.pro:2661
From: roper@chinet.chi.il.us (Bill Roper)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: miking bodhrans
Date: 30 Dec 92 04:50:29 GMT
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX

<1hn0cuINN3d5@rave.larc.nasa.gov>
<1992Dec29.144626.4882@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Distribution: na
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
 
 
I was recently working with a 4-track master that was sent to me by
a friend in Winnipeg.  He plays (among many instruments) a bodhran.
I put together a trial mix, dropped it to cassette, and took it home.
There, I put it on my big old Pioneer speakers with the 12-inch woofers.
"What," I said, "the hell is that?"  I heard (felt?) pressure waves
coming across the room at me.  This was bad.  "What did he do, put
the mike an inch behind the drumhead?"
 
So I called him up.  "How did you mike the bodhran?"
 
"Oh, I clipped a mike to the back of the drum."
 
"Please don't do that again."
 
The second tape was better...
-- 
Bill Roper, roper@chinet.chi.il.us
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers.percussion:371 rec.audio.pro:2678
From: cullen@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: miking bodhrans
Date: 2 Jan 93 01:43:59 GMT
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

Bill Roper writes:
> By the way, my suspicion is that in the live applications discussed
> elsewhere the fellow on the board eq'd that low end away.

No, actually, the request of the player was to have a pantleg-moving
type of low end to the drum. In other words, extreme proximity effect,
with boosted LF EQ on top of that, and reverb as well. 

Like I said, I don't listen to this type of music, and therefore
I have to go by what the musicians and possibly the band manager 
request.
					Mur
					Cullen@ac.dal.ca
					Cullen@ug.cs.dal.ca
From: nunis@hpsgm2.sgp.hp.com (Simon NUNIS)
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 06:24:53 GMT
Subject: SR-16 and MIDI
Organization: HP Singapore Notes-Server
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion

hi everyone.

i recently bought an Alesis SR-16 and am very happy with it except for the
fact that i can't get it to respond to MIDI properly.  i have the following
setup:

channel 11
drum in v1
drum out off
clock in off
clock out off
pgm chg off
midi thru on
drum map 00-09

here are the connection stats:

      roland u20    (out)------->(in) pc
                    (in) <-------(out)

                    (thru)------>(in) sr16  (thru)------->(in) midiverb3

well, basically, i use the u20 to control the sr16...wanna be able to use
the sr16 as a drum expander.  what happens is that for every 10 notes i
send to the sr16, only 4 or 5 will sound correctly.  the others just 
either remain quiet or sound the wrong note...any ideas?

please post or email.

thanks.

simon.
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: hamm@weejordy.physics.mun.ca (Craig Hamm)
Subject: Acoustics of Drums: Physics Today Article
Organization: Ocean Sciences Centre
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 18:19:09 GMT

	I just remembered having an article on hand that was published
	in the March '92 issue of Physics Today.

	It starts:

	Acoustics of Drums, by Thomas D. Rossing

	Though such renowned physicists as Rayleigh and Raman have studied
	drums, our understanding of their acoustical behavior remains
	incomplete.  Digital computers and holographic interferometry
	are now helping to fill in the missing pieces.

	
	Thomas Rossing is a professor of Physics at Northern Illinois
	University, in De Kalb.  He served as president of the American
	Association of Physics Teachers in 1991.


	------------
	
	It's a very good article covering topics such as:
	snare drums
	kettledrums
	bass drums
	Indian drums (tabla and mridanga)

	Happy New Years all you drumheads!

-- 
  Craig Hamm, Memorial University,|   
  Newfoundland, Ocean Acoustics__/   
  DoD #1500,      ____________/          
  1981 Maxim 650 /            
  _______________| 

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
From: ddaye@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (David C Daye)
Subject: Re: miking bodhrans
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 16:27:44 GMT

In article <C022s6.GGD@chinet.chi.il.us> roper@chinet.chi.il.us (Bill Roper) writes:
><1hn0cuINN3d5@rave.larc.nasa.gov>
><1992Dec29.144626.4882@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
>Distribution: na
>Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
> 
>[...] a friend in Winnipeg.  He plays (among many instruments) a bodhran.
>[....] "What," I said, "the hell is that?"  I heard (felt?) pressure waves
>coming across the room at me.  This was bad.  "What did he do, put
>the mike an inch behind the drumhead?"
> [....]
>"Please don't do that again."
> 
>Bill Roper, roper@chinet.chi.il.us

Gee, that's very understandable, and I'd expect this result no matter where
within the rim the mike was clipped, even out near the rim where we had
ours, no?

But we used this setup in clubs and on stages run by some very good sound
men; ie, guys who could set up a band of bizzare acoustic instruments they
had never heard, and tweak the board faster than our players could begin
to ask for adjustments, and impressed both players and audiences.

The obvious questions are: 1) Were we lucky that these pressure waves
were below the bottom end range of our Radio Shack electret;  and/or
2) Did the sound crew simply activate some sort of rumble filter at
the board?  Certainly none of these crews complained.

David Daye.
-----------
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: dlg1@quads.uchicago.edu (deborah lynn gillaspie)
Subject: beaters for Taos drum
Reply-To: dlg1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 22:04:26 GMT

Hi,
I've returned to drumming after a long hiatus (parents insisted that
violin was a better instrument for girls; now that I'm grown up I can
do what I want and have returned to my first love.<grin>) I'm currently 
taking lessons in drum set and orchestral (that's how my teacher operates at
the beginning levels) and am having a blast. I've got a couple of questions 
for y'all:

1) Any suggestions for beginner cymbals that don't sound like s***? The
ones we play on at lessons are so bad they offend my ears. I HATE cheap
sounding percussion.<g> I expect to get some drums when my brother-in-
law gets his new set, but there won't be cymbals. Have been drooling over
the orchestral Zildjians at lessons, but can't afford 'em for jazz work
unless they have a bottom-of-the-line I haven't seen advertised in MD.

2) Any suggestions for types of beaters for an 18" double headed Taos
drum, natural skin heads? The beater that came with it is typical Native
American padded leather on a twig, but this drum is very deep and has lovely
tones in various spots on the head. Am wondering if a bodhran tipper would
be worth trying...

Also, FYI, I was REALLY pleased with the tambourine I got from the House
of Musical Traditions. My drum teacher wanted to buy it from me when he 
heard it. Nice people to do business with, and very accomodating. I heard
about them from another brother-in-law, who plays tabla and often orders
from them. (I'm still trying to figure out how I got the trumpet player
when there are all those drummers in the family...and he's the only one
who left music for a day job!)

Best wishes for a Happy New Year! --Debbie Gillaspie

"Last one into the PhD program at Chicago's Graduate Library School;
does this qualify me for the Endangered Species List?"

-- 
Internet:         dlg1@midway.uchicago.edu
Bitnet:           dlg1%midway@uchicago
  
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers.percussion:373 rec.audio.pro:2682
From: mbreen@sdacs.ucsd.edu (Michael Breen)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
Subject: SR...not?
Date: 3 Jan 93 05:48:40 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: sdacs.ucsd.edu

In article <1992Dec30.202005.9806@ac.dal.ca> cullen@ac.dal.ca writes:
>
>Thanking god that he has only been asked to do SR for a Pipe Band once,
>and had the eminent sense to leave the PA off. Got compliments, too!
[this is really only the sig attachment]

This reminded me of the time I was running sound for a reggae band.
It was about the third time I'd run them, and after a little "professional"
convincing, I had their stage volumes just so.
I eventually turned off all the channels except the vocals.
They sounded better with drums, two gits, kbds, bass, and trumpet acoustic
than they ever did with everything reinforced.

I got compliments all night, from band and customers.

Michael Breen
singing and philosophizing
(yes...I could hear the customers!  Amazing, huh?)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
From: roper@chinet.chi.il.us (Bill Roper)
Subject: Re: miking bodhrans
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 05:40:19 GMT

<C022s6.GGD@chinet.chi.il.us> <1992Dec30.202005.9806@ac.dal.ca>
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
 
 
Um, the particular problem with the pressure waves off the bodhran
(which I forgot to mention) was that he had bounced and pre-mixed
several tracks together, including the bodhran.
 
Now, a little eq will make that nasty low end go away normally, but
not when it's VERY LOUD and mixed in with the lead vocal of a baritone.
 
I actually had to use one of the cuts off the original tape (the second
tape had a weird glitch in the song that was unfixable with my gear)
in the final mix.  I used the sidechain input on my DBX166 to
selectively compress the bodhran.  The one and only time in my life
I've ever used that input...
 
(By the way, my suspicion is that in the live applications discussed
elsewhere the fellow on the board eq'd that low end away.)
-- 
Bill Roper, roper@chinet.chi.il.us
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers.percussion:362 rec.audio.pro:2670
From: cullen@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: miking bodhrans
Date: 30 Dec 92 20:20:05 -0400
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

Bill Roper writes:

> I was recently working with a 4-track master that was sent to me by
> a friend in Winnipeg.  He plays (among many instruments) a bodhran.
> I put together a trial mix, dropped it to cassette, and took it home.
> There, I put it on my big old Pioneer speakers with the 12-inch woofers.

Serves you right for mixing on monitors with no Bass response. 8-)

> "What," I said, "the hell is that?"  I heard (felt?) pressure waves
> coming across the room at me.  This was bad.  "What did he do, put
> the mike an inch behind the drumhead?"
  
But, seriously, how loud was your listening level at home? 
It brings to mind the old Fletcher/Munson Curve, and the possible 
topic of how much bass is too much, and what flat response is at 100
dB SPL, and whether response at 90 should sound like response at 100,
or have the same energy/frequency as at 100. Impossible in recording
terms, but always a factor in live sound or reproduction.

And, on the other hand, some people want a kind of proximity effect
on drums, such as the bodhran to enhance the bass response. This 
would fit more under a label of progressive celtic than traditional 
celtic, although the distinction is quite blurred locally.

But, there's always the step of using a high pass or inserting more
equalization, or just compressing the shit out of it, although this 
may well be impossible in Bill's case.

Just a few more points of discussion I thought I would throw out.
						Mur
						Cullen@ac.dal.ca
						Cullen@ug.cs.dal.ca

Thanking god that he has only been asked to do SR for a Pipe Band once,
and had the eminent sense to leave the PA off. Got compliments, too!
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: smills@news.weeg.uiowa.edu (MuffinHead)
Subject: Re: "My first set," sort of... ideas?
Keywords: drum, rums, sums, um.. tums
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 09:29:37 GMT

wes@ian.stx.com (John S.) writes:

>In article <1992Dec28.064452.31560@news.weeg.uiowa.edu> smills@news.weeg.uiowa.edu (MuffinHead) writes:
>>    Used cymbals can
>>only be polished and run over with your car to change the pitch. :)

>HEY!!! That's a great idea! I've got an old "KRUT" brand cymbal that
>I'll have to try that on. It might turn into a decent cymbal. Thanks
>for the suggestion, Muff. You're a genius!

   Heh, and to think that I was only joking. But you reminded me of the
cheap little 14" cymbal I bought for $12 at a sheet music/cheap stereo store.
I used long nosed pliers and bent a lip around it so it turned into a china-
type. This was *extremely* soft metal. It turned out to be a very cool accent
cymbal while it lasted. I had to bend it back into shape every month or so.
It eventually started cracking all over the place, shards flying around. 
Then I bought a Wu-Han. Just think, pre-made china cymbals! ;D

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: smills@news.weeg.uiowa.edu (MuffinHead)
Subject: Re: Review: Dave Weckl, Heads Up
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 20:10:33 GMT

dchavez@tincup.enet.dec.com (Dale J. Chavez - Colo Spgs) writes:

>    If I have one complaint of Weckl, it's that he doesn't play with enough
>    feeling, or soul.  ...
>    ... I think Vinnie is probably as
>    technical as Weckl, but he also has the ability to play pop/rock
>    material extremely well (check out the latest Sting live video).

   I highly agree. After I first got into Corea and found this Dave guy with
the weird last name, I thought he was THE drummer. Then, with each new album,
I found he didn't change much. It was the same thing with different notes.
Then I found the Soul Cages Tour video and had my first real experience with
Vinnie. Needless to say, my definition of THE drummer has changed (once
again:).
From: purelght@deeptht.armory.com (Eric Braun)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
Subject: Percussion Videos & Tricks
Date: 30 Dec 92 21:31:39 GMT
Reply-To: purelght@armory.com
Organization: Eric Braun Associates/PureLight Inc.

Hi,

Can anyone out there recommend good videos or other resources for learning
new percussion tricks, rhythms, etc. I'm particularly interested in
African, Latin, and other ethinic rhythms and Poly-Rhythm tricks.

Thanks in advance...
-- 
+-------------------------------------+
| Eric Braun	purelght@armory.com   |
+-------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: anzlovar@wl.com (Bob Anzlovar)
Subject: Re: How About Some talk about *Hand* Drummers!
Followup-To: rec.music.makers.percussion
Summary: Drums don't always get caught in traps!
Organization: Warner Lambert / Parke-Davis
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 15:37:33 GMT


In article <BzMwwF.3GA@irvine.com> you write:
>This *somewhat* follows this thread...

How 'bout a new thread for the hand-drummers lurking out there? (I know
you're out there, just not saying much!)

>...can anyone reccommend any albums of really primitive/intense
>percussion oriented music?  I *love* an intense tribal sound: like the
>rhythm solo in Peter Gabriel's _Rhythm of the Heat_ & Pigface's
>_Bushmaster_.  Not Jaluka or Stewart Copeland.  Music to pierce your
>body by.

I'm not familiar with Pigface, & I'm not a set drummer (I'm a
hand-percussion player). I like _Planet Drum_ by Mickey Hart. Also, I
like Babatunde Olatunji's _Drums of Passion_ CDs.

I don't have my CD collection at hand to list any more at the moment.
Anyone else know of any hand-percussion music I need to hear?

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Bob Anzlovar                    | I wrote COBOL once, but I didn't like
(anzlovar@wl.com)               | it. I didn't compile.
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion,rec.audio.pro
From: ddaye@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (David C Daye)
Subject: Re: miking bodhrans
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 14:46:26 GMT

In article <1hn0cuINN3d5@rave.larc.nasa.gov> kludge@grissom.larc.nasa.gov (Scott Dorsey) writes:
>In article <mjc.725486560@NL.CS.CMU.EDU> mjc+@cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio)  
>writes:
>> Can anyone here give me advice on the best way to mike a bodhran?  I've 
>
>This is an instrument that is very difficult to close mike.  Much like the
>violin, the frequencies that are produced by the instrument vary considerably
>with the angle of the listener on the axis of the instrument itself.  The
>
>When you close-mike something like this, it tends to become very shrill if
>miked on-axis, or to lose all of its high frequency response if miked off
>axis. 

As a piper and bodhran-player's spouse, but not a recording pro, I'll add
a few remarks.

Close miking bodhrans can actually give a very dull sound depending on the
position of the mike; near the center of the drum the low fundamental is
most powerful while near the rim the high harmonics are more pronounced.

For stage work we tied/hung a Radio Shack electret element inside the drum.
In the center it yielded pure dull thump (useless for Celtic), but as we
approached the rim we restored all the tonal color we needed.  During sound
checks with talented sound crew we found they had no difficulty delivering
whatever tone we wanted -- to live stage standards at least.  But in
radio studio work for example, even if we used a real mike we got better
tone balance with the mike nearer the rim, not dead center on the head,
if we had to close-mike.

With the element only 1" from the head we virtually never had feedback
problems and, of course, the drummer didn't need to maintain a fixed
position.  There may be a more professional solution for you that's
analogous to our approach.

Of course, once we were able to capture the tone we wanted, we still
had to decide how to mix it with the band, and how much of the bodhran's
full glory we could afford when guitar, harp and pipe players all wanted
their bass heard.  Some of the answer for us lay in thoughtful construction
of the medlies, to let each instrument be fully appreciated at various 
points in the program.

David Daye.
-----------
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: smills@news.weeg.uiowa.edu (MuffinHead)
Subject: Re: Difference between various pad controllers for MIDI?
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 19:31:17 GMT

msjle@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Joi L. Ellis) writes:

>smills@news.weeg.uiowa.edu (MuffinHead) writes:

>>performance can be managed by only clicking to the next song. There are 64
>>patches. (I don't know *why* they didn't just go 00-99 instead.)

>Because it's a computer inside, and computers deal in powers of two.
>The next highest power is 128, and 3 digits complicates things... (IE
>one more led display and the circuitry for it, more space on the front
>panel, more memory to hold the next 64 entries, etc etc.)

   Yeah, I realize that. I *meant* how hard would it have been for Roland
to use all 8 bits (256) instead of only 6 (64)? Not hard at all. Look at
Simmons. In the SD9 (? One of those middle-early models) they gave you 99
patches. Ninety-nine. That's 157 left over patches floating around just
because they didn't include an extra 7-segment LED on the panel. Roland
could have *at least* done the same.
   Unless you were brought up on base 9, it's kinda hard to figure out that
21 is after 18 when you're playing and have to switch patches.

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion
From: drums@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (robert.e.wisnack.jr)
Subject: Xmas toys - Alesis D4
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 20:30:31 GMT



Boy..... nothing beats a Christmas when you get 
some cool toys.  This year Santawife bought me
the Alesis D4 and the SS Stealth Bass drum
trigger.  The only problem is that the b.d.
trigger is not for a double pedal, which I have.
My question is: does anyone know of a good trigger
that can accomodate a double pedal.  I was looking
at the KicKat.  I found a store here in N.J. selling
it for $110.00.  I also called Sam Ash and they want
$179.00.  Does anybody have anything good or bad to
say about this ?  

- Thanks for any info.
- Bob Wisnack