HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: richard@adpgate.UUCP ( ADP OPuS)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Re: acoustic pianos versus digital pianos/keyboards
Date: 14 Aug 92 19:05:56 GMT
Article-I.D.: outland.1492
Organization: ADP Dealer Services R&D, Portland, OR

bw@hpcvxgmr.cv.hp.com (Bill Wilhelmi) writes:

>    Reasons to get a Digital Piano (keyboard, synthesizer, whatever):
> 
	-- list of reasons omitted --
> 
> Did I miss anything?  Anyone care to add to the lists?

	Yes.  For me the biggest benefit in using a digital piano lies 
	in my ability to record with it without the need for great 
	microphones.  Just two line outs into my mixer and I've got 
	a good piano sound (stereo too!).

	As far as the quality of sound discussion on this thread, I 
	wonder how a digital would ever be able to sound the same as 
	a real piano when you consider what happens to the blend of 
	string harmonics as they combine with one another in random 
	as determined by the piece being played!!!
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: fpeabody@nyx.cs.du.edu (Darren Jacobson)
Subject: Info Wanted: Mesa Boogie MK IV
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix @ U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 04:24:16 GMT


   I would like to thank everyone for the great response I had concerning
amplifiers and tone.  A few people mentioned the Mesa Boogie MK IV as
being a very good, versatile amp.  Could anyone who has one comment
on this fine piece of equipment?  (Size, Features, Price, etc.)

   Thanks in advance...
X
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:9115 alt.guitar:7364
From: EIVERSO@cms.cc.wayne.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,alt.guitar
Subject: Finger callouses in a hurry
Date: 22 Aug 92 03:24:43 GMT
Organization: Wayne State University, C&IT

A recent post reminded me of the problem I sometimes have when I go for
long periods of time without playing my guitar.
 
The problem is you lose your callouses, and if you try to get back into it
in a hurry, you'll get painful or bloody fingertips.
 
The solution is a first-aid product called New-Skin.
Put a heap of it on *before* you start playing and it'll help ease you
back into a heavy practice/playing mode.
 
--Eric
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:8935 rec.music.synth:13438
From: simmons@ittc.wec.com (Garry Simmons)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.music.synth
Subject: Upgrading Radio Shack PZMs
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:48:49 GMT
Followup-To: rec.music.makers
Distribution: usa
Organization: Westinghouse Electric Corp., ITTC, Pgh. PA.

I know this came up recently, but I didn't own any PZMs then. What is the prefered
method of upping the voltage to the PZMs? A number of phantom power and alternate
battery combinations were discussed, but I didn't save them. Please respond via
email if possible, but I do read r.m.makers and r.m.synth everyday.

Thanks in advance,

Garry Simmons
simmons@ittc.wec.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers

In rec.music.makers, dickw@IASTATE.EDU (Richard Wallingford) writes:

> In article <1992Aug12.130236.13195@dale.ksc.nasa.gov>,
> sdavis@laforge.ksc.nasa.gov (Steve Davis) writes:
> 
> >Personally, I'd prefer almost any acoustic piano (even one in marginal  
> >condition, as long as it holds a tune) to an electronic; the sound, feel, 
> >and presence of a digital piano is just not there, IMHO.  
> 
> If you search long and hard enough, you can buy a second hand piano
> for under $2500 which has an adaquate feel and tone.  Then you
> must pay about $75 per month to keep it in tune and maintained.  

My God, man!  You have got to be the pickiest pianist on the face of this
earth!

For most amateur and I dare say even professional musicians, $1500 buys a more
than adequate upright piano, which you can keep maintained in tune for under
$100 a year.  $1000 up front and $50 a year probably suffices for most people,
certainly the vast majority of amateurs.

If this ($2500 pianos) is what people are talking about when they say a digital
piano can be cheaper, they may have a point.  *BUT*, and this is an incredibly,
mind-bogglingly big "BUT", the difference in sound and feel between a $1000
piano and a $3000 piano is NOTHING compared to the differene between either of
these and a digital.  If you are so sensitive as to not be satisfied with a
$1500 piano, I don't understand how you can even stand to listen to a digital
piano, much less actually play, or God forbid own one as your sole instrument.
The sound would be incredibly harsh and cold, with no resonance whatsoever.
This bothers even me, who can be made happy with a piano that costs only in 3
digits; I am baffled how someone who can't be satisfied with a real piano that
costs under $2000 could do anything but run screaming from an SC-55.  I suppose
individual taste differ, so I am not by any means flaming you for your opinion.
But shame on you for suggesting to the hordes of potential piano buyers that
there is no chance of finding a piano for under $2000 that will sound as good
as a digital!  I have to believe you are probably unique in this viewpoint.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marc Sabatella           Winner, 1992 First Annual Bill Evans Lookalike Contest
marc@fc.hp.com
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:9052 alt.guitar:7242
From: dhi00@ccc.amdahl.com (Dario H. Impini )
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,alt.guitar
Subject: fender lace sensor question
Date: 18 Aug 92 15:55:01 GMT
Reply-To: dhi00@juts.ccc.amdahl.com (Dario H. Impini )
Distribution: na
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

anybody know whats in a fender lace sensor?  ad hype says its a
revolutionary new way of "reading" the strings but i want to 
know whats really in there.  is it hall effect sensors, active
pickups, or just coils like everybody else?  

d
From: ai.torosian@mcc.com (Dan Torosian)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: 1926 Silver Conn Soprano Sax
Date: 14 Aug 1992 15:10:55 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu


Posted for a friend - 

Local sax legend Smoky Joe Miller is selling a vintage Conn curved
soprano sax.  It's silver (brushed on the body but lacquered on the
keys), the inside of the bell is gold with lacquer, it has rolled tone
holes, and it's in great condition (he does repairs, and I think he's
just finishing overhauling it).  Sorry, but I don't know what price he's
asking.

His phone number (in Austin, TX) is (512) 835-9383
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: bw@hpcvxgmr.cv.hp.com (Bill Wilhelmi)
Subject: Re: acoustic pianos versus digital pianos/keyboards
Reply-To: bw@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com
Organization: Interstate 5
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 18:34:41 GMT

In article <92224.193720U21187@uicvm.uic.edu>, John Schulien <U21187@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
|> In article <1992Aug11.190702.8814@hpcvusn.cv.hp.com>, bw@hpcvxgmr.cv.hp.com
|> (Bill Wilhelmi) says:
|> >My wife is the musician in the family.  She has a Kurzweil K1200 keyboard and
|> ...stuff deleted...
|>
|> Hmm. Does the Kurzweil have a weighted keyboard? I play a Korg SG1 keyboard

Yes.  But the action is just not the same as the acoustic.

|> ...stuff deleted...
|> 
|> Of course, the digital piano has its advantages. It stays in tune, and I
|> can push a button and it's an electric piano, or an organ, or a marimba,
|> or a digital frog, or whatever!

Which is why we got one.  My wife performs in alot of different churches.
The Kurzweil (and Emu Performance 1+) is always in tune and sounds better
than a screechy, old, out-of-tune, off-brand piano any day.  If the church
happens to have a decent piano, she will play a number of tunes on that.
But at least she has the security and versatility of the keyboard.

-- 
 Bill Wilhelmi    
 Hewlett-Packard - User-interface Technology Division CV
 1000 NE Circle Blvd.  Corvallis, OR 97330
 bw@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com
From: kinch@hpwrce.mayfield.hp.com (Kinch Malapitan)
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 21:13:42 GMT
Subject: Re: "Rainbow Records"?
Organization: the HP Mtn.View Resp. Cntr.
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers

Yeah, I got those mailers, too... I don't trust junk mail, in general, so I
suggest talking to an Entertainment Lawyer BEFORE you give out your music...

       

============================================================================
= The above is a personnal comment - my employer has nothing to do with it =
============================================================================

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: M02449@mwvm.mitre.org (Joe Gems)
Subject: Re: Device to slow down music without changing pitch - know about it?
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, McLean VA 22102
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 14:53:08 GMT

In article <Bswvv3.8n0@research.canon.oz.au>
andy@research.canon.oz.au (Andy Newman) writes:
 
>
>james@wrs.com writes:
>>I was at a music camp last week, and someone mentioned that they had
>>heard of a device that can slow down the playback of a piece of music
>>without changing its pitch.  A little like a half-speed tape deck,
>>but doesn't drop the music an octave.  Does this sound familiar to
>>anyone?
>
>Sounds like a few drummers I've played with :-)
>--
>Andy Newman (andy@research.canon.oz.au)         "int - God's own type"
 
Actually, yes! I've seen this device advertised in Keyboard Classics magazine
(**definitely** not to be confused with Keyboard magazine). If I remember, I'll
get the information this weekend and post it on Monday.
 
BTW, changing speed with no effect on pitch is the way it is for any MIDI rig,
since performance information rather than sound is being manipulated.
 
     Hope this helps - more on Monday!
             Joe
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: groak@kronecker.mit.edu (Paul Gunnells)
Subject: (related to) acoustic pianos vs. digital pianos
Organization: MIT Department of Mathematics
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 23:47:50 GMT



	This is a tangent to the earlier conversation about digital pianos,
but after seeing that so many people were willing to discuss the issue, I 
thought it might be a good time to solicit some advice.  My digital setup
is a Yamaha KX88 driving a ProFormance +, and frankly I'm more than a little
dissatisfied with the sound.  Fortunately, I know that it's not the sound
module but rather the cheesy amp that I'm running it through, and I think it's
time to move on to a better system.  So my question is, what should it be?
I'm thinking I'd like to get some sort of stereo amp and some small studio
monitors (I checked out some of these in a shop and seemed like the response
was pretty good), but I don't know anything about amps or speakers.  I'd
also like to try to get a better set of headphones than the ones I currently
use, but again I'm kind of clueless as to what's available.  So what have
the ProFormance users out there tried?  Any advice?

Thanks,


Paul.
From: eijkhout@cupid.cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Re: acoustic pianos versus digital pianos/keyboards
Date: 12 Aug 92 17:44:43 GMT
Reply-To: eijkhout@cupid.cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout)
Organization: University of Tennessee, Knoxville - Department of Computer Science
NNTP-Posting-Host: cupid.cs.utk.edu

In article <92224.193720U21187@uicvm.uic.edu>, John Schulien <U21187@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:

|> Yes! A digital piano will always sound like a recording of a piano. It may
|> sound like a recording of a supurb piano, but it will never sound like a
|> real piano. With a real piano, you have a huge, three dimensional sound
|> source in front of you. Not so with a digital piano.

Hm. People are being clever nowadays: my baldwin digital has a couple of
built-in speakers, and the balance shifts gradually from left to right
with the higher 'strings'. Fairly realistic effect. Lows really come from the
left, highs from the right.

Victor.
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:9054 rec.music.bluenote:6344
From: eijkhout@cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.music.bluenote
Subject: What the expert says about digital/analog
Date: 18 Aug 92 16:45:33 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee, Knoxville - Department of Computer Science
NNTP-Posting-Host: cupid.cs.utk.edu
Originator: eijkhout@cupid.cs.utk.edu


The other day I came across a quote about analog/digital that I trust
more than the ravings of Neil Young in Guitar Player a while ago.

Source: Mosaic Records brochure number 9,
interview with Rudy Van Gelder, quoted from a NPR interview:
(Van Gelder was a prcticing optometrist in the late 40s when he set up his
first, modest recording studio in the living room of his parents' home in
Hackensack, New Jersy. In that room he would go on to record most of the
major East Coast jazz artists of the 1950s, 
including virtually every session for
Blue Note and Prestige Records as well as many classical dates for Vox and
other labels.)

[the interview starts with some history, and a number of quotes about
why Van Gelder believes in two-track recording, using no headphones,
no dubbing. Just straight recording the music.]

``If I'm going to do a session and I can choose what I want to choose,
I will choose a digital recorder. There's just no question about it.
[...]
Digital recording has been totally reliable for me. It finally does what
a tape machine should do -- really, just store what you're putting into it.
No analog machine ever made could do that correctly. None. Not even the best,
the most expensive, could ever do what a properly designed two-track digital
machine will do. We're talking about clarity of sound, clean sound, wide
range, beautiful, no noise problems.
	To me it's made working a pleasure. It's like starting all over
again and being excited about things, like being able to play back a great
sound to the group right after they've played it, and they can 
hear it right then. Everybody know it's good. Before they go home.''

And this from a guy who has been uniformly praised for making
beautifully sounding recordings.

Victor.
From: tottori@west.darkside.com (Tottori)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: effects and such.
Date: 17 Aug 92 01:23:20 GMT
Organization: The Dark Side of the Moon +1 408 245 SPAM

i don't know much about what effects to buy and how i 
can incorporate them into what i do. yet, i am interested
in sometimes in the near future, buying a MIDI set up
for effects, instead of using separate pedals.
what brands are used a lot? what are dependable?
what will go with my Peavy classic 212?
some effects i am interested in are delay, distortion, chorus..
From: jvb@wyse.wyse.com (Jack Van Breen x2666 dept220)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: SansAmp Description
Keywords: what's it do?
Date: 22 Aug 92 18:34:03 GMT
Organization: Wyse Technology, San Jose

This is in response to a mailmsg that I got from Josh(Hi there:)

For those of you who do not know what a SansAmp, I'm going to try to cox
these fried ol' brain cells into giving a  quasi-adequate description.

The SansAmp comes in two flavors, a rack mountable box which I've not seen
yet, and a 'stomp-box' which I have, so that's the one I'll address here.

It's a small box with a foot switch to take it 'off-line' as needed. For
variable controls it has Bass, Treble, 'Drive' (or some such:) and
'Volume'. (the names may be different, but that's what they do:)

It also has a 8 (or 10) position dip switch by which the user may set the
basic 'flavor' of the beast. There aint know way I can remember them all,
so perhaps some kind soul who does can ammend this post:) (I'm suure
someone will, please be gentle:)  Since I can't remember them, this is what
they basically provide.  There's a switch that simulates a close miked
speaker cabinet (I believe a 4 12" marshall:). There's 1 or 2 switches that
alow you to choose between your basic Fender Twin and Marshall Stack
tonanilties.  There are a couple of choices for mid-boost and there are 1
or 2 choices for gain (ie crunch, clean, sweet, (my names not theirs:)

The purpose of this beast is to allow you to go into the studio and get
just about any type amp sound you could desire with out lugging it around.
(ie you go directly into the board:)  Sure makes session work sweet:)  Of
course for live work you could do the same thing (Hand a line to the sound
man and say "THis is my sound, just make it lound enough, dont' f*ck with
it!":):)  But you'd really have to trust him and your montiors:)  You
Woulld be guarrentied being heard without having to kill every one on
stage:)   Anyway, I'd buy one if I had the money, but I don't;-( Oh well>)
-- 
Jack Van Breen (standard disclaimer, these are my own ...)
Product Support, Wyse Technology, San Jose, CA
...!uunet!wyse!jvb
jvb@wyse.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: sdavis@laforge.ksc.nasa.gov (Steve Davis)
Subject: Re: acoustic pianos versus digital pianos/keyboards
Organization: NASA
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 13:02:36 GMT

Mark Nichols writes
> My girlfriend is interested in buying a piano. She is only interested
> in playing classical music. She is about an intermediate in skill
> level. Since we are in a apartment we are considering one of
> the digital pianos since it has adjustable volume and headphone 
> outputs.

  Personally, I'd prefer almost any acoustic piano (even one in marginal  
condition, as long as it holds a tune) to an electronic; the sound, feel, and  
presence of a digital piano is just not there, IMHO.  That being said, I do  
find the current generation of digital pianos to be great fun... especially  
those with a few good electric piano sounds added in.  But I would never  
suggest that any serious pianist buy one as his/her primary instrument.

  Good luck with whatever you decide upon.

Regards,

Steve
--
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
| Steve Davis                      | sdavis@laforge.ksc.nasa.gov |
| NASA, DL-DSD-32                  | (NeXT Mail preferred)       |
| Kennedy Space Center, FL  32899  |                             |
| (407)867-7582  fax:(407)867-2173 | #include <disclaimer.h>     |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: g_house@goes11.enet.dec.com (Greg House)
Subject: Re: A gig from heaven
Reply-To: g_house@goes11.enet.dec.com (Greg House)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 22:50:28 GMT


Great story, Karl!  I love reading about things that go like that.

Congratulations!

Greg
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: srh3@Ra.MsState.Edu (Steven R. Hollis)
Subject: MIDI question
Organization: Mississippi State University
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 05:34:01 GMT

Hi guys.  I have a question maybe someone
can help me with.  I have a yamaha psr38 and a korg sq-8 8 track sequencer.
My question is, can I use the different MIDI channels to combine
several instruments.  When I try, it always plays everything
in the instrument selected on the keyboard.  Isn't there some way
to select the instrument through MIDI.  

Please respond directly to me because I am not subscribed to this board


Thanks in advance
Steve

--
================================================================================Steve Hollis--Your friendly neighborhood zoology major
srh3@ra.msstate.edu
================================================================================
From: daver@felix.filenet.com (Dave Richards)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Re: acoustic pianos versus digital pianos/keyboards
Date: 18 Aug 92 02:07:15 GMT
Reply-To: daver@fritz.filenet.com (Dave Richards)
Organization: Costa Mesa, CA

In article <1492@outland.UUCP> richard@adpgate.UUCP ( ADP OPuS) writes:
>	As far as the quality of sound discussion on this thread, I 
>	wonder how a digital would ever be able to sound the same as 
>	a real piano when you consider what happens to the blend of 
>	string harmonics as they combine with one another in random 
>	as determined by the piece being played!!!

Well, any possible harmonic effects produced by the interaction of
multiple strings should be able to be modeled and duplicated by the
digital system, so I don't think this would be as difficult as you
think.  But I don't know to what degree this is implemented in present
hardware.  Also, realize that most of this harmonic mixing takes place
in the ear/brain, not in the instrument.  Acoustic pianos have damping
devices on each string and are otherwise designed to eliminate as much
"sympathetic resonating" as possible.  The slight amount that remains
is probably "bad" in terms of an ideal instrument, but through con-
ditioning over the years, a certain amount has become interpreted as
"good", because even the most expensive acoustic instruments will ex-
hibit this "defect" to some degree.

Dave
From: shunter@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Dark Star Crashes)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: earplug info wanted
Keywords: sonic filters?
Date: 12 Aug 92 20:09:46 GMT


A while back there was a discussion on earplugs but I've lost the
files. There is a kind of earplugs, I believe they are called Sonic
FIlters, make up in San Fran I think, that are supposed to attenuate
all frequencies equally.

Does anyone out there in net.land have any info on these?

AdvTHANKSance

Dave


-- 
***************************************************************************
*                           Dave Chesavage                                *
*                      shunter@igrad1.ucsd.edu                            *
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.music.compose,comp.music
From: shiv@bnr.ca (Shiv Naimpally)
Subject: Re: FORMULA for AtariST
Reply-To: shiv@bnr.ca (Shiv Naimpally)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 13:55:56 GMT

I wrote to both authors for a copy of FORMULA. One them (the musician
who is at Wessleyan) sent me a disk and a copy of the manual. The other
(the computer science guy in California) sent me an order form asking
for $25 (or something like that) to defray expenses. So write to the authors.
(Check the Keyboard article a few years back discussing HMSL, FORMULA, etc.
as it lists contact names).

If you still have trouble finding a contact email me and I'll see if I
can dig out the address.

cheers,


Shiv

shiv@bnr.ca
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:8940 rec.antiques:1174
From: kpmartin@thinkage.on.ca (Kevin P. Martin)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.antiques
Subject: Looking for info on Brinsmead pianos
Date: 12 Aug 92 15:52:35 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

I've recently acquired a piano made by John Brinsmead & Sons
of London, and I'm trying to figure out (amongst other things)
how old it is. So far, all I've been able to find about this
company is its founding date, the year it went public, and
which other company eventually bought it.

Does anyone have any information on how good this piano might be
(once repaired -- some parts are in rough shape), how old it might
be (the serial number appears to be 13806), or any information about
the company?

Please reply via e-mail. Thanks in advance.
		-Kevin Martin, Thinkage Ltd., Kitchener, Ontario, Canada
		 kpmartin@thinkage.com    kpmartin@thinkage.on.ca