From: rmv@ukc.ac.uk (raj)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
Subject: "...kt"   --- mystries of the unexplained
Date: 11 Jan 93 16:29:32 GMT
Organization: Computing Lab, University of Kent at Canterbury, UK.







In a previous article, narayana@oracorp.com (K. T. Narayana) says:

>A.L. Bhasham in his book "Wonder that India was" writes
>that the aboriginal Tamils of the Pandya, Chera, and Chola 
>regions were fierce warriors, and they used to fight wars
>among themselves out of hatred for one another. The author
>specifically mentions that after each war these people 
>used to conduct "cannibalistic festivals" to celebrate
>victories. There is an edict of emperor Ashoka that he
>brought righteousness to the Pandya, Chera, and Chola 
>country.
>
>What are these cannibalistic festivals? Were there any
>Tantric rituals that these cannibals used to practice
>in those rituals. Are there any pointers to the exact
>ritual (the sources and their authentic translations,
>preferably not the Tamil scholars).
>
>...kt
>

-- 



It seems to be a fashion to concentrate in defamation of the rich cultures esp
among the neighbours. We have witnessed many  "educated" people displaying
their abysmal ignorance/shameful deliberate misintepretation. But now
we also come across a person who stuffs his own words and ideas into an 
authors mouth. 

       As talking facts seems to be obsolete, I like to re-introduce this
habit to those who have long forgotten this.

           Unlike  "...kt" I have quoted the authors words, book name
and  also page number so that others can also check waht I say.



          First of all , this article seems to suggest that Asoka brought
roughteousness to the "aboriginal tamils of that Pandya, Chera and Chola"
who were invloved in "cannibalistic festivals". If this is true this is
obviously a great change, a great influence. We Tamils will LOVE to 
thank Asoka and his decendents.

                  BUT unfortunately for  "...kt", the popular books I read
does not seems to aggree. 





"Asoka(the Great) Emperor of India (270 - 230 B.C), grandson of Chandragupta,
founder of Maurya Dynasty."
          ----  "A populsr dictionary of Buddhism" by Chirstmas Humphreys,pg36



"Even in the first century of the Christian ere the south seems to have felt
little influence from the Aryan culture of Nothern India."
            ----  The Cambride History of India, volume 1 Ancient India,pg 596
    


"The apex of the peinsula was occupied by the ancient Dravidian kinngdoms
of the SAtiyaputas, the ChEras, the ChOlas and the PAndyas. With these
independent nations Ashoka's relations were merely such as might be expected
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
to exist between friendly powers."
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
            ----  The Cambride History of India, volume 1 Ancient India,pg 515
 ps
the letter which had a dash on top in the book are written in capital
(as you cannot type "over" scored letters :-(((  ) 




I donot need to explain things as I believe that the quotations says it all
so simply & explicitly.


Now let us goto the book "...kt" quoted and see what the socalled
edict has to say .

        
               


"Asoka's edicts are in the nature of official pronouncements of policy, and
instructions to to his officers and subjects. They contain many personal
                                              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
touches, and the drafts were probably composed by the emperor himself.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
   ..........

   In Asoka's own words:
        "When the King, Priyadarsi, Beloved of the Gods, had been consecrated
	eight years, Kalinga was conquered. 150,000 people were thence taken
	captive,  100,000  were killed, and many more died. Just after the
	taking of Kalinga the Beloved of the Gods began to follow
	Righteousness, to love Roughteousness, to give instructions in
	Roughteousness. When an unconquered country is conquested, people are
	killed, they die, or are made captive. That the Beloved of the Gods
	finds very pitiful and grievous .... Today, if a hundredth or
	thousandth or thousandth part of those who suffered in Kalinga were
	killed, to die, or to ke taken captive, it would be very grievous to
	the Beloved of the Gods. If anyone does him wrong it will be forgiven
	as far as it can be forgiven. The Beloved of the Gods is not only
	compassionate, he is also powerful, and he tells them to repent, lest
	they slain. For the Beloved of the God desires safety, self-control,
	justice and happiness for all beings. The beloved of the Gods
	considers that the greatest of all victoriesis the victory of
	Righteousness, and that [victory] the Beloved of the Gods has already
	won, here and on all his borders, even 600 leagues away in thje realm
	of the Greek king Antiyoka, and beyond Antiyoka among the four kings
	Turamaya, Antikini, Maga and Alikasudara, and in the South among
	the COlas and PAndyasand as far as Ceylon"
            ----  "The Wonder that  was India"   by A.L.Basham pg 53 - 55




    To start with this only says that Asokas princeiple of "righteousness"
were also accepted by others. Ie not to conquer other countries. 
To interpret this as if Asoka brought "righteousness" to "cannibal
Chola ect"  one needs a wild  immaginateive mind obsessed with defamation.
          Again the author himsel suggests that this seems to be the words
of Asoka himsef (rather than an unbiased independent record of truth).

      I DEFY "...kt" TO QUOTE THE PAGE NUMBER OF THE BOOK AND THE EXACT WORDS
AS APPEARS IN THE BOOK WICH SAYS  THAT "aboriginal tamils of Chola etc"
CELEBRATED  "cannibalistic festivals". I have the book & browsed through the
whole book. There seems to be no such evidence. 

           It is possible that "...kt" had a dream & the author told him
secretly ;-))




Ok . Now let us see what kind of person Asoka was , to take his words as
gospals.  Again I am only quoting from the same book ;-))


"Asoka of the Buddhist legends is, in the words of a 19 centuary authority,
 'half monster and half idiot', his humanity and practical benevolence
 overlaid by accretion of monkish legends of later century; "
            ----  "The Wonder that  was India"   by A.L.Basham pg 58
 


  "Asoka was by no means an other-worldly dreamer, but every inch a king,
  a little naive, often rather self-righteous and pompous....."
                                                  ^^^^^^^ 
            ----  "The Wonder that  was India"   by A.L.Basham pg 58



NOTE the word pompous !!!!

"Despite his remorse at the conquest of Kalinga, he was too much a realist to
restore it to its original ruler, whoever they may have been, and he continued
to govern it as an integral part of his empire".
            ----  "The Wonder that  was India"   by A.L.Basham pg 56


An obvious evidence of hypocracy !!!


              Now I leave things to the readers intelectual capability
to come to a conclusion.



                         raj