HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 18 Dec 1992 15:55:01 MST
From:         Madge McBurney <ISPMOM@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Prayer request
              18 Dec 1992 15:17:00 MST from <SKLEPZI@SSB1.SAFF.UTAH.EDU>

I'm posting Steven's message again so that those on bit.listserv.christia
will be able to read this too. (Keith, I will be praying for your friend).

Christia co-owner   Bitnet:   ispmom@asuacad
Madge McBurney      Internet: ispmom@asuvm.inre.asu.edu
----------------------------Original message----------------------------

On Fri, 18 Dec 1992 15:17:00 MST Steven Klepzig said:
>Usenet mail forward.
>******   START OF FORWARDED MESSAGE   ******
>
>From: drice@ponder.csci.unt.edu (D. Keith Rice)
>Subject: Prayer request
>Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 20:53:22 GMT
>
>Please be in prayer for a close friend of my wife and myself.
>Her name is Lesa.  She is having two lumps removed from her neck
>tomorrow.  She won't know until Monday if they are cancerous or not.
>
>Thank you for your prayers.
>
>In Christ,
>Keith
>
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 11 Dec 1992 15:30:08 EST
From:         "jones, mark" <JMJONES@UGA.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Teaching children
              11 Dec 1992 14:24:10 -0600 from <coen@ACC.WUACC.EDU>

Dear Jim,
I could not resist writing to you about your boys. Jim, dont you
give up! If these guys have been raised in the love and admonition of
the Lord, then you have done all you can do! Be there for them and just
keep on teaching. Be patient. the Bible says "...when they are OLD they
will not depart from it....". I know what Im talking about because I was
in your boy's shoes.

My friend I was raised from day one in church. We were taught the Word day
and night. I saw the Heavenly Father mirrored in my parents so! I saw my
folks tithe, put us through Christian schools and help less fortunate
people on what I know now was a very modest family income. I witnessed on
several occasions people being born again in our living room. Thank God for
my parents! I was saved at a very early age, and was actually a dynamic
witness for Christ until one day I discovered the world-system.
Jim, for whatever reason, I too had to satisfy a silly infatuation with
sin. Actually it was more rooted in pleasing the crowd, standing can be
very lonely for a kid. This was in the late '70's! How much more difficult
it must be in '92!

I just want you to know that the training, and most of all my genuine
experience with God kept me and preserved me through those tough times.
My parents were tough, yet patient and loving and throughout my rebellion
we maintained a good relationship, yet I knew where they stood. My point
is: DONT DESPAIR! The Word you have placed in them will not return void!
My prayers are with the boys, brother. God Bless you...In Christ...Mark Jones
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 18 Dec 1992 14:55:06 CST
Comments:     Answering received message
From:         MICHELE LOFTON <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
Subject:      re: civil rights? why?

> The fear is that the law is so broad that we will have to hire
> homosexuals in positions that do not make sense from a Christian
> point of view.  I do not want to have to hire a teacher in our
> Christian school who teaches that homoexuality is a valid alternative
> lifestyle.

> Does that make sense?

I value your opinion about that.  If you were hiring someone for your
church or a private school, you would want and should be allowed to
hire someone who teaches the Christian point of view of that church.
However, Christian point of view is being played out now where it
affects others' lives.  If a homosexual was hired to teach at a public
school, validation of homosexuality would not be a part of the curriculum.
They would teach whatever subject they were teaching.  Not hiring a good
teacher because they did not bring with them your Christian point of view
would be a waste of talent on your children's part and a loss of livelyhood
on his/hers.  What if you found out that a wonderful teacher at your
son's/daughter's school who means the world to your son/daughter is gay?
Would you insist that the teacher be fired even though subject matter
taught was algebra or grammar.

Michele Lofton <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
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Date:         Wed, 16 Dec 1992 11:47:13 CST
From:         Lonnie Schubert <S096556@UMRVMA.BITNET>
Subject:      Hope (was Re: Calvinism)

>[ lots deleted ]
>way I believe.  1 Pet. 3:15 says "Alway be prepared to give
>an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the
>hope that you have."  There are many scriptures that one may
>use that would seemingly contradict these that I don't have
>answers for... yet.  But one day God will make all of this
>known to us.
>
>Mike Benson

Mike,
Hope, in general, is defined as "expecting that your desire
will be fulfilled".  It denotes no certainty.

Wherein lies hope in the belief that every individual will
be saved or damned based solely on God's whim and on nothing
that anyone else can do nor ever has done?

I suppose that one could hope to be among the saved, but to me
this seems total folly.  If the belief is in fact the truth,
one's fate is fixed; it is certain.  No hope.

Lonnie Schubert
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:14:00 -0400
From:         STYLESBG@WATT.CCS.TUNS.CA
Subject:      Re: Thanks, Liz!! (Smile, Carol!!!)

I would simply like to say that the conversations written between you,
Theresa,  and you,  Liz,  have greatly touched my heart tonight.  I'm in
the Lab at the University after having worked at my job that keeps the
bills paid.  I am down about the slowness of my research and the fact that
we have had an instrument that has not been working properly for about 6
weeks.  I guess I'm also a bit tired.  Seeing your frank conversations
blessed me immensely,  and also challenged me with the fact that we are
part of a wonderful family and need to hold each other up in prayer constantly.

Last night in Church we looked at "The Loving Touch of Jesus"  by looking at
a number of times in the Gospels where Jesus touched people.  The first one
we considered was in Mark 1:40-42,  where He,  being moved with compassion,
reached out and touched a leper.  We stayed with that one for quite awhile
and God met us.  Some in the Congregation have experienced very deep hurts
that only God can mend.  We had the experience of the Lord move very quietly
but also very firmly and continue a process of healing wounds.  We know His
that He will show us all more and more of how to truly experience His setting
us free.

Just thought I would share this,  praying that the Love of the Lord Jesus
would pour forth upon the whole Christia family.


Psalms 91:1.

Pastor Bill
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 18 Dec 1992 19:24:54 EST
From:         "Michael A. Kline" <MKLINE@VDH.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Christmas Carols in Public Schools

As you know, most of you, I work for the State Department of Health in
Richmond, Virginia.

You'll need some background first. When my address says "Main Street
Station," it is because this place used to be a train station back in the
1800s, early 1900s. In fact, it's supposed to be the largest "spanned
steel building" in the United States or something like that.

I sit in a 10-12 x 15-16 foot office. The walls are only 8 feet high, but
the ceiling goes up another 2-3 stories. A HUGE building, nearly 3 football
fields I think they told me. The ceiling at the outside wall starts up
about 20 feet, and the whole length of the building, in the center, is a
skylight. Let's see I can try to Illustrate.
                                      /
                                    /    
                                   |      | <--- Skylights on both sides.
                                  /               This area about 50 feet
                                /                 from the second story
                              /                    floor.

At the one end of the building the ceiling is high enough they have a 3rd
floor. Okay, I hope you have an idea of how big, how open, the building is.

This afternoon???? What to my ears should come, but people singing carols
and songs about the birth of our Lord Jesus Christ! We had our Christmas
party and with all the openness, when you amplify a voice, even a little
bit, it reverberated through out the whole building. Neat!!!

Maks.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 18 Dec 1992 08:25:00 +1000
From:         Ken Diefenbach <DIEFENBAK@TOPAZ.UCQ.EDU.AU>
Subject:      Christmas Sharing

Well, we haven't set up too many traditions except that if Christmas is at our
house (ie we aren't travelling to my folks who are 500 K away) we set up a tree.
But perhaps a tradition has been set up this year with a local carols by
candle-light in our little town/settlement.

The band from my church came down (I help out with Christmas carols so I played
too) and we had a turnout of 250+ which was great. The kids and parents all
were rapt in the night. Much better than the goings on at the school function
where the P & C had decided to have a licenced do (ie alcohol available) "so
that the fathers would come along too". I wasn't at that meeting (was in New
Zealand) but was very annoyed at the idea. What a message to send to your
child - "I'll come along and watch you Christmas thing if I can get a drink or
ten as well"... No more on that from me.

Our minister basically ran the night. Lyn (my wife) got the thing up and
running while I was away in NZ and everyone pitched in. I think a lot of people
were thinking about that sort of thing, but no-one had set up anything definite.
So off it went and I think all the locals want an annual one.

I was impressed that the band came down. When I was a regular bandsman the
thought of yet another Christmas commitment (not quite the YACC of Unix) was
about the last thing I'd ever want. It was touching to think that the band as
a whole obviously does give a darn (or whatever) which I'd had some doubts
about. (Longer-serving members may remember me having something to say about
that early this year...)

Anyway, that's about it for Christmas traditions from us. One I really don't
miss too much was the band I started in used to start playing Christmas carols
in a caravan park at 4:30 am on Christmas morning.  (I got to check out the
Christmas fare early & _then_ I thought it was good. "When I became a parent,
I put away such Silly things"

Regards and a happy and holy Christmas


Ken D.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 18 Dec 1992 13:39:56 EST
From:         "jones, mark" <JMJONES@UGA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: GAY CIVIL RIGHTS
              18 Dec 1992 12:17:12 GMT from <ANDRUSKO@MAIL.LOC.GOV>

My friend, your views are your views and mine are mine.
My intent is not to challenge your views but I will flatly state
that I do not appreciate the tone of your " yellow teeth" attack
on someone. Christia is no place for such pathetic adolescent behavior.
My advice to you is to grow up and support your argument with facts; if
you feel the need to discuss someone's dental hygiene, while calling them
a liar, I would suggest you do it somewhere else, preferably
privately. As I understand it, our listowners do not give of their time
and talents to support such idiocy. I can say with a high level of assurance
that no one is edified, and our Lord and Savior is not glorified by such.
Sincerely.......Mark
From: YA67@FERRIS.BITNET (carol nemec)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: RE: more loving/caring list
Date: 16 Dec 92 17:34:06 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

Shelby--

P.S.  It seems that everyone is a lot more caring and loving since I was
      on no mail last week.  It is a welcomed change.  PRAISE THE LORD!!
      (Smile).


------->>
Shelby, you must have been praying for us while on no mail  :-)
Thanks!!

Carol N
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:58:06 -0500
From:         "N. L. Tinkham" <nlt@GBORO.GLASSBORO.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Abusive relationships

As a footnote to the discussion about Julie Nott's friend who is in an
abusive marriage, I offer a book recommendation:

   Battered Into Submission:  The Tragedy of Wife Abuse in the Christian
   Home, by James and Phyllis Alsdurf (InterVarsity Press, 1989).

_____________________________________________________________________________

                                              Nancy Tinkham
                                              nlt@gboro.glassboro.edu
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Organization: Virginia Department of Health
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 17 Dec 1992 22:17:13 EST
From:         "Michael A. Kline" <MKLINE@VDH.BITNET>
Subject:      Just some Misc 700 Club News

    Just some neat things the 700 Club is doing. Just notes taken while
they were talking.

    Michael Little reported to Pat Robertson, that they have had
5,000,000 letters in the Soviet Union in 1992 alone. They have 300,000
people enrolled or requesting enrollment in their Bible study classes.
The applications are coming in at 1,000 letters a day. These are letters,
people have written in, 5 million this year alone.

    Albania, the most atheistic country on earth, they're using Army
helicopters to distribute our books on "The Life of Jesus". Every school
child, there's about 600,000 of these booklets in Albania language we
have passed out in the last month or two.

    Rumania, we've had over 1,200,000 letters. Supper Book and Flying
House are back on as well as other programs. And the 700 Club is going to
start on the national network in Russia, next month.

    We've been to China, there's an opening there. Our first French
broadcasts are beginning on several programs in Zaire. We're taking it to
all the Franco Phone(?) nations of Africa.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 09:02:52 CST
Comments:     Answering received message
From:         THERESA BLACKWELL <TBLACKWL@USMCP6.BITNET>
Subject:      Thanks, Liz!! (Smile, Carol!!!)

Ok, I think Liz hit the nail squarely on the head.  It's about time!
She mentioned the word pride.  And she also stated that we "all have
a big dose of it whether we think we do or not"...(Lookin' at her post
as I type this, so I'll get the quote right....How's that, Liz????)
I'd like to ask for prayer.  For me this time, and it's due to the fact
that I have been a bit "uppity" lately.
Sure hate it when that happens.  I should learn to trust HIM more, and quit
tryin' to do things my own way.  Goofed really big this weekend, and I'd
not do that again to save my hide.  My dad got on my case really good.
Needed it too.
Oh well, I'm glad my Dad's a Christian, and can tell me-one way or the
other-to slow down, and stop thinking about SELF so much.  Lots of things
goin' through my mind lately, and it's enough to sometimes make me forget
that God's actually there when I get in a bog.  Whew!....Shame on me.
-------------------
Carol...
I know what you mean when you said "Embarrassed"...Remember Christy's
situation???  I felt the same way.  Wasn't until David came along, that
FINALLY UNDERSTOOD my 19-year old sister's feelings.  Lemme tellya, it's
tough to go to a younger sibling for advice, but...I had to.
Christy knew, and was right there to say, "Hey....you'll get through this!"
I believe that Mike and Lisa will come through all of their trials, with
Christian grandparents for Heather-Marie, I don't see how they WON"T.
God's there, gal...HE never left.  Just hang in there, and keep leaning
on the Lord.  He'll bless you, as he always has.  Thanks for the
testimony, and the guts to acknowledge this situation.
I know how you feel, although I'm AUNT, not Grandma! :) ;)
"You are the Light of the World"
"........the Salt of the Earth"
"Blessed are the pure in Heart, for they shall (?See God?) ....
_someone help...?_"
------------------------
I echo Liz's statement about this list.
I've found a fellowship among fellow Believers, that sometimes I don't
feel with my own family (at home, or Church)...Thank you all for the
prayers, and support lately, and I praise HIS Mighty name for the love
shown to all here on Christia.  Sometimes we have our "squabbles', but
we're still in this "Together".
'Romans 8:28-29"
God Bless you all today...
"THE G".... (Theresa)
PS...Good to see SHELBY CROSS back on the list!

 * <TBLACKWL@USMCP6.BITNET>
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Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 11:37:00 EST
From:         "Carl A. Lahetta" <U952020@RUTADMIN.BITNET>
Subject:      Open Heart Surgery

Hello,
   This week, Tuesday or Wednesday, my father-in-law will have triple bypass
surgery.  Please pray for him and his family.  Also, right now a family friend
of my in-laws is having open heart surgery in the same hospital.  I would
appreciate the prayers.

Carl---+
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Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 14:49:53 EST
From:         Dan Harling <harling@ROADRUNNER.PICTEL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Tools of the Deceiver (was Teaching children)

> Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:55:47 GMT
> From: Dr Nancy's Sweetie <kilroy@GBORO.GLASSBORO.EDU>
> Subject:      Tools of the Deceiver (was Teaching children)
> To: Multiple recipients of list CHRISTIA <CHRISTIA@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU>
>
> Jim Coen writes an article I largely agree with, and then says:
>
> > The prince of this world, the destroyer, the deceiver, the liar, is
> > preying upon our children. Television, movies, music and peer pressure
> > are his greatest allies in this battle for your children and mine.
>
> I do not agree with the last sentence.  Motion picture/broadcast/recording
> technology are tools (well, groups of tools) -- and nothing more.  They
> can be used by people for good or ill, but in & of themselves they are no
> threat to anyone.

I understood him to mean that they are largely being used to that
effect, not that they are bad in and of themselves.  Perhaps "allies"
was a bad choice of words, but these tools are indeed being used very
effectively in that battle.


> And there are other ways to create those weapons, not requiring TV or schools
> full of worldly kids: rotten families, lousy churches, taking advantage of
> weaknesses in those who represent God -- lots of things can be used to make
> a person hate someone, and lots of things can be used to keep people in the
> darkness of ignorance.

Agreed.  While these tend to be the most widely distributed sources
(and thus most highly visible), they are not the only means in the
Accuser's arsenal, and we would do best to watch for *anything* that
promotes sin, rather than focus our complete attention on the half-
dozen most frequent offenders, and neglect other areas entirely.
____________________________________________________________________________
Daniel A. Harling                        (harling@pictel.com)
PictureTel Corp.             Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of
Peabody, MA  01960                   PictureTel Corp. (so there!)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 16 Dec 1992 11:52:40 CST
From:         Lonnie Schubert <S096556@UMRVMA.BITNET>
Subject:      Differing interpretations

Lonnie Schubert said:
>Does anyone besides me actually believe  that the
>scriptures are alive and powerfull (Heb 4:12), and that
>any given passage always has more than one real and
>true meaning?

& Bernice replied:
>Well, my friend, ---- not ANY given passage, but many
>given passages! and they make me feel alive too.  and
>they give me hope.  and they give me the answer to my
>needs and they make me feel as if God is in them and
>talking to me through them.

Thanks Bernice, and I agree.

Nonetheless, my point in the above statement was that
different interpretations of the same passage are not
necessarily mutually exclusive.  In fact, they are often
complimentary, leading to fuller revelation and greater
strength for life when taken together.

Lonnie Schubert
(PS, God is truely in them <His words>.)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 10:48:00 +1000
From:         Ken Diefenbach <DIEFENBAK@TOPAZ.UCQ.EDU.AU>
Subject:      Christmas Down Under

Christmas Traiditions remembered....

Barbeques at my grandmother's with watermelon and a zillion cousins on Christmas
day after lunch. (There were 9 in my dad's family). My dad hitting a ball into
the only custard apple hanging on the custard apple tree. This aforesaid custard
apple having been the object of a dire threat made by grandma to anyone causing
it grevious bodily harm.... (Can't remember if anyone ever told her, just the
look on dad's face as it fell....)

Playing Chrismas carols on the back of a truck from 9 til 4 on the Sundays in
December. Very hot, sweaty, and bum-numbing on wooden seats. Wasn't all bad -
we carolled at the beach and in the "innocence" of youth it was handy to
know the music off by heart. Gave one more time to observe the available talent.
Shudder.... Wait til my boys get to that age.

Singing carols in the hospitals and nursing homes around Nambour (on the
Sunshine Coast, north of Brisbane in Queensland... probably _not_ on a map
near you except Ian W.) and steeling one's vocal chords when a carol with a
high note was coming up.....

Hmmm. and more of the same.

To all on CHRISTIA, have a Happy and particularly Holy Christmas. Thanks for
all the support provided over the year. I trust that I've been able to provide
some of the same. May God richly bless you one and all. If you've got snow
around you, think of me with the temperature hovering mid-to-high 30s Celsius
(90 -100 Fahrenheight). I'll have a swim and surf ( and just maybe I'll get the
sailboard wet......) for you all. For those who have sent me personal email
through the year as well, thanks heaps.

I'll still be reading my mail over the Christmas-New Year break (probably in
an effort to avoid ironing or some other equally odious task), so your
messages will still be read..

God bless
Ken D.
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Date:         Tue, 15 Dec 1992 16:45:39 -0700
From:         cartnaj <cartnaj@EAGLE.SAFB.AF.MIL>
Subject:      Christianity?

I agree that the MOST important thing is to remember that God is the Creator,
and that Genesis is the basis for our Christian doctrines.  So I feel that we
should pay attention to what the scientists are saying and study His creation
in order to give a reason for why we believe.  It is important HOW He created
since He bothered to tell us in Genesis.
                                                Joe C.
                                                cartnaj@eagle.safb.af.mil
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