From: sfm@manduca.neurobio.arizona.edu (Stephen Matheson)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion
Subject: Re: Pro-Choice Criteria for Personhood
Date: 10 Nov 92 04:34:29 GMT
Organization: University of Arizona UNIX Users Group

From article <1992Nov9.215034.3629@kestrel.edu>,
by mcdonald@kestrel.edu (Jim McDonald):

[lots of debate deleted]

> I'm genuinely puzzled by the belief systems of people who say
> they think a zygote is a person, given the existance of people
> who are chimeras (i.e., are derived from two or more zygotes that
> fused).  Maybe you could help me understand.  (You are an expert
> on your own beliefs, after all!)
> 
> Since you believe a zygote is a person, could you please satisfy
> my curiosity about your beliefs in the following situations?
> For what it's worth, these are not all hypothetical situations--
> some are well documented, and all are plausible.  (I would
> personally guess that all have happened, but it's rather
> rare that genetic tests are performed that provide definitive
> documentation--usually this only happens when a person has
> noticeable medical problems as a result of being a chimera.)

I'm genuinely interested in this phenomenon.  Could you provide 
references?  Thanks!

>  o When a zygote fuses with another zygote, do you think that two people 
>     literally become one?  (If you believe people have souls, did two souls
>     become one?)

I don't know.  I don't know.  I believe that the life of a developing
human is precious, and that that life begins at conception, but
I'm not afraid to admit that I have no idea what this means in
situations such as you describe.

>  o Do you need to know what happens later to answer the question above?
> 
>     E.g., what if the cells derivative from one zygote form the
>     majority of the resulting body, and the other zygote merely
>     provides some blood cells?  Did the first zygote remain a person
>     and the other stop being a person?
> 
>     Alternatively,  what if each zygote develops into half of the
>     resulting body?
> 
>  o What if two zygotes fuse, then one dies?   Did the survivor have
>     continuity as a person, or did it disappear into a new composite
>     person and then re-emerge as itself again?  Or did it re-emerge
>     as a new distinct person?
> 
>  o What if the zygotes fuse, divide once, then the resulting cells
>     separate into two pairs of cells (each pair derived from a single
>     zygote) that go on to become
>     twins?  Did two people become one and then re-emerge as two again?
>     If so, are they same two people that existed in the original zygotes?
> 
>  o What if,  after one division as above,  twin A derives from one
>     cell derived 
>     from zygote 1, while twin B derives from three cells--one derived from 
>     zygote 1 and both derived from zygote 2?
> 
>  o If you think two fused zygotes persist as separate persons, then if one
>     becomes most of a woman while the other becomes her ovaries, would she 
>     be comitting murder if she has her ovaries removed?
> 
> |> >_/_/_/  Brian Kendig                             Je ne suis fait comme aucun
> |> 
> |> -- 
> |> Frank.ODwyer@ap.mchp.sni.de   "You take slaves when you make us free,
> |>                                when you make us free your way"
> |>                              World Party - 'Ain't going to come til I'm ready'
> |>                    
> 
> Yours in puzzlement,
> 
>   jlm

If you really want to know what I believe, it's this:

	"I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully
	made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well."
		Psalm 139:14
--

Steve Matheson   Program in Neuroscience   University of Arizona
sfm@neurobio.arizona.edu
Newsgroups: talk.abortion