From: magnus@brisk.ii.uib.no (Magnus Alvestad)
Subject: Re: net.rpg
Reply-To: magnus@ii.uib.no
Organization: UVBS -> SFK/T-DSA / SOPS - HOS / RNoN
	<1992Nov8.083753.5173@alf.uib.no> <10965@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au>
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 92 03:21:58 GMT

>>>>> On 9 Nov 92 02:24:01 GMT, mav@cs.uq.oz.au (Simon Dennis) said:

	Simon> Repl to  magnus@ii.uib.no

	Simon> As the suggester of the d20-d20 system with a table for
	Simon> each skill I would like to make a couple of points in
	Simon> defence.

I agree with a lot of what you say here, but I think there are a few
things speaking for the d100 system with one table and descriptions.

	Simon> When I was deciding on dice I did think about using
	Simon> larger dice. The problem is availability. At least in
	Simon> Brisbane d100 are pretty rare. D20's were the largest

Uhm? I didn't intend using a d100, we always use d10 x 10 + d10 -
which comes to the same thing. This gives you the added bonus of
switching the digits f.ex for hit location when rolling to hit.

	Simon> Certainly, this makes for a large number of tables, but
	Simon> then as with Rolemaster the players only need to have
	Simon> those which they use regularly and for the GM we have
	Simon> all table lookups computerised anyway.

Yes, well - I've been playing Rolemaster with a fairly experienced GM,
and it did take some time. Especially in large encounters. Also, the
system is not very easily expandable. If you want to implement a new
genre, you will have to make a new table for every weapon you add. 

	Simon> The great advantages in this system are its simplicity
	Simon> and generality. We use the same mechanic for skills,
	Simon> for determining the weather, for determining the number
	Simon> of life points a character has in character generation
	Simon> etc. It also allows a great deal of detail without
	Simon> extra cost in terms of play. For example, in unarmed

Well, I feel that it constricts the imagination of the GM. I think the
roleplaying profits on letting the GM come up with effect, successes,
failures etc. This is part of the fun!

	Simon> removed from play but is removed out of the process
	Simon> altogether. It isn't necessary to think about it even
	Simon> in character generation. It is hidden in the tables.

I prefer doing these things real-time, so you get a feeling of what
you are doing. For the same reason I use computers for just about
everything, except for roleplaying. It's no fun rolling the dice with
a program. The papers, pens, calculations, dice rolls, etc. - it's
part of the roleplaying. I may just be sentimental, but this is how I
think it should be. 

	Simon> The second proposal, (i.e., having a generic skill
	Simon> table which is then cross-referenced to determine the
	Simon> result), I think is really little different. You still
		:
	Simon> Certainly the tables you have would be less
	Simon> complicated, but then you have less detail and can't
	Simon> deal transparently with skill costs and the logarithmic
	Simon> improvement curve. We actually do have a generic table

No! You don`t lose on detail because the GM spends his time filling in
the details. I think the GM should be used as a story teller, not as a
bean counter or page flipper. 

	Simon> something for which there is no skill - but you simply
	Simon> can't get the fine grained resolution which you want
	Simon> for varying things such as life point determination,
	Simon> and weather generation with such a system.

I think a good GM is a lot more fine grained than your most detailed
table. Agreed, your system makes for a much simpler system to play
from the GM side, but is it worth it? I don't want a computer to
create my character, even if it does it better, with more detail.

There is a human touch.

	Simon> For those interested we are planning to release Lore as
	Simon> a shareware hypertext, complete with a world called
	Simon> Imoso, the skill determination software etc in Feburary
	Simon> 1993. If you would like to be notified at the time of
	Simon> the release please send me your name and email address.

I'm looking forward to it.

-Magnus
Newsgroups: rec.games.design