HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: smb@ulysses.att.com (Steven Bellovin)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Sand under Swings?
Date: 2 Sep 92 15:29:38 GMT

In article <1992Sep2.002749.12405@actrix.gen.nz>, Dennis.Ingram@actrix.gen.nz (Dennis Ingram) writes:
> A recent article in a New Zealand parenting magazine that I subscribe
> to covers this quite well.  Apparently sand or grass surfaces are as
> bad as asphalt if a child falls from a height (e.g. from the top of a
> slide).

Umm -- I'm not quite sure what to say.  Sand -- at least 12" (30 cm) --
is one of the officially-recommended choices of the U.S. Consumer Product
Safety Commission (a government agency).  Dirt, on the other hand, is
not acceptable, because it gets packed down.  As I recall, grass is
intermediate -- it would be ok, but the underlying dirt has a tendency
to get packed, though not as much as bare soil.

> The best surface seems to be bark chips, as they absorb impact
> very well, and are cheap.  I doubt that they would attract feline
> attention either...   also, depending on the age and inclination of
> the children, playing with the bark chips can keep them occupied safely
> too.  Many of the playgrounds in my area use bark chips and I can
> vouch for them.  You need a good depth, say about 150cm.

150 cm!  Did you mean 15 cm?  Bark is recommended here, too, but at
a 30 cm depth.

> You need a good depth, say about 150cm.  Another
> common surface used is padded plastic mats, made from recycled
> plastic, that have an open grid pattern.  They are laid down so that
> grass grows through the grid squares.  These are apparently best for
> high wear areas.

I've seen plastic mats here, too, though not the grid kind.  They're
expensive, though.  Note that you need to cover the ground for a fair
distance out from the equipment -- kids don't simply fall straight down.

For those in the U.S., the Consumer Product Safety Commission and the
professional organization of orthopedists both publish free pamphlets on
playground safety.  There's a lot more to be concerned about than simply
the surface underneath the equipment!
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: johnnyb@flamingo.ims.com (Johnny Battle)
Subject: Re: help with almost 3 year old
Reply-To: johnnyb@flamingo.ims.com
Organization: Integrated Measurement Systems
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 21:14:04 GMT

k.a.perkins writes:

>I need some advice on toilet training... 
>My daughter will be 3 in October.  She has had some success in
>actually peeing and pooping in the potty chair, but she really
>prefers not to do that.  She knows what to do - we have read
>books, watched videos, been lavish in praise when she does the
>deed - but she doesn't like to.

I would explain to her (again) how important it is to you that
she use the potty and why.  I would then offer her a deal: if she firmly 
agrees to use the potty rather than her pants whenever possible,
and then proves it by using only the potty for a week you will buy
her a new dress or doll, or take her to a movie, or do something
that you know she really wants.  This puts the ball in her court.
Let her know that its completely up to her when she gets the reward.
Whenever she is ready to make the deal and stick to it, you will
keep your half of the bargain.  I have found this to work well.  It
lets the child retain her dignity and develops an understanding of
mutually beneficial agreements. (Oh, by the way, you probably need
to make allowances for real "accidents" such as 3-year olds will
sometimes have.)

Some people may say this kind of prearranged reward is actually
a bribe, and they don't want to get into having to bribe their
kids.  But to me, "bribery" is paying someone to do something you
both know is wrong.  Whereas, this involves getting her to do something
you both know is right, and it develops a mutual respect.   

>My reaction to this is getting pretty poor.  I was really angry at
>her today, and I feel pretty frustrated.  I made her wipe up the
>floor and rinse out her clothes - of course, I helped with this because
>almost 3 year olds aren't very efficient at these things - but I
>feel pretty bad about my reaction. 

I don't think you should feel too bad about getting angry.  We
all do that.  You don't sound abusive.  Making her help to clean up 
seems like a reasonable thing to do when she consciously chose to 
make the mess.  Just make it very clear to her that, despite your anger,
you still love her.

******************************************************************** 
Johnny Battle             "Mysteries are to lived, not understood."
                                              -Pundit Ravi Shankar


Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: kgatling@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Keith E Gatling)
Subject: Re: MATH QUIZ
Organization: Manlius Pebble Hill School; Dewitt, NY
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 20:41:17 EDT

And I don't get it either.  But since it's supposed to be so offensive,
could you please explain it to Mr Peabrain here by email rather than on
the net, so that no one else gets offeneded?

Thanks!

--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Keith E Gatling                                  kgatling@mailbox.syr.edu *
*          Opinions?  I've got plenty of them.  Just ask my wife!           *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
From: dresser@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Debra Dresser)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Breast Fed Baby takes Bottle!
Date: 3 Sep 92 19:05:19 GMT
Reply-To: dresser@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Debra Dresser)
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

Howdy!

I've lost track of who asked what questions on this subject, but my
day care provider found a method I haven't seen mentioned yet.  She
gave Danny ( 6mo ) a bottle by himself, walked to the other side of
the room and ignored him (watched but didn't let him know).  This child
who thought bottle was play and chew time sucked the whole 4 oz down!
It's a simple solution for the stubborn yet social child!


		  /|
		 / |\                  Debra Dresser
		/__|_\           "Sailing on a second wind"
	       \______/
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: lowry@watson.ibm.com (Andy Lowry)
Subject: Re: Walkers: should I get one?
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 22:02:15 GMT
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

With all the positive posts about walkers, I feel compelled to point
out that these things are dangerous, according to last year's Consumer
Reports guide to children's products (I don't have it with me else I
would give the proper title and provide direct quotes) and other
sources (specifically various parent's magazines and my pediatrician).
Consumer Reports flat-out recommends that these products never be
used.

Some horrendous percentage of head traumas sustained by infants are
walker-related.  A child tumbling down the stairs in a walker is very
likely to be severely injured or killed.  Infants are capable of
generating surprising speed in walkers, and high-speed collisions with
fixed objects, thresholds or simply changes in floor level can also
result in spills, pinched fingers, etc.  And they can cause items on
top of tables and bookcases and the like to come tumbling down.

Infants may enjoy these things tremendously, but if they're that
dangerous, is this really and adequate reason to use them?  There are
lots of other safer things infants enjoy as well; doorway bouncers
provide some similar sensations but in a much safer manner.  And I
seriously doubt that any child is going to understand and be affected
by the withholding of a walker.

A question to ask yourself: if you feel bad about withholding a
walker, is it because you're convinced you're depriving your child of
something they truly should not miss, or is it because you want to
experience the same squeals of glee from your child as you've seen
other parents get from theirs?  If an honest evaluation points to the
latter, I'd suggest you not compromise your child's safety for this
"drop in the bucket" of parental satisfaction.
--
Andy Lowry, lowry@watson.ibm.com, (914) 784-7925
IBM Research, P.O. Box 704, Yorktown Heights, NY  10598
From: jbutterf@mal-s1.gatech.edu (Jill Butterfield)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Who cares about length (Was: Our newborn, and birth experience)
Date: 26 Aug 92 13:37:38 GMT
Organization: Georgia Tech Res. Inst., Modeling & Analysis Lab

In article <1992Aug25.185514.12216@cnmss.tredydev.unisys.com> dgs@cnmss.tredydev.unisys.com (Dave G. Sokolowsky) writes:
>In article <1992Aug21.004646.22757@intellistor.com> grun@intellistor.com (Paul Grun) writes:
>>	   22 inches long (does anybody really care about that?)
>                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Yes, my "little" brother does.  At 11 lbs, 2 oz and 24 inches, he was the
>biggest baby that we knew.  Then my son came along at 11 lbs, 5 oz and 
>23 inches.  Now my son is the biggest we know, but my brother insists it's the
>length that counts.


Hmm... well, my sister's first baby was 11lbs 6oz, 24 inches. Her second
was 12 lbs, 2 oz and 24 inches. The third was a measly 11 lbs 0 oz, and
22 inches.  

By the way, the first child, a boy, is now in 7th grade, wears a size 
11.5 shoe and is expected to be at least 6'8" when full grown! My sister
is 5'7", and her husband is 6'1". Don't know how they ended up with
such big kids! (The second kid, a girl, is now in 4th grade and wears
a size 8 woman's shoe! that's bigger than what I wear!).

jib
-- 
Jill Butterfield, Research Scientist       EMAIL: jbutterf@mal-s1.gatech.edu
Georgia Institute of Technology, GTRI Modeling and Analysis Lab
"Happiness is excitement that has found a settling down place..."
-E.L. Konigsburg, _From the Mixed-up Files of Mrs. Basil E. Frankweiler_
From: millerj@belize.crd.ge.com (Julia K. Miller)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Are Fetal Heart Monitors needed??
Date: 31 Aug 92 12:53:34 GMT
Reply-To: millerj@belize.crd.ge.com (Julia K. Miller)
Organization: GE Corporate R&D Center


	I had a monitor  on the whole time because that was the hospital
policy when  you are induced  because of a marginal non-stress test.  Most
of the labor it didn't do anything except free my husband from having to
time the contractions.
	However, when I started to push the babies heart rate  really
dropped and stayed  down.  They made me lie down on my left side between
contractions and the rate would come back up  immediately.  If they hadn't
had the monitor on they probably wouldn't have caught this and I don't
know what the result would have been.  The cord was wrapped around the
babies neck which caused the problems.   With the monitor they could  tell
it was rebounding so didn't even think of a c-section.  Without  it, I 
don't know if they would have picked up on the drop and just done a c-section
or what.  For me, I think the monitor turned out to  be good tho it was
annoying to have it attached the whole time.
	Here, they have it on for 15  minutes every  hour for a normal
labor.  I can't say whether I think that is useful or not since you could
have the nurse do it manually.

Julia
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: karinc@ssd.intel.com (Karin Coffee)
Subject: Re: Johnny-Jump-Ups
Organization: Supercomputer Systems Division, Intel Corp.
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 17:26:15 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.181921.10743@src.honeywell.com> jgelhaus@src.honeywell.com (Jennifer Gelhaus) writes:
>Since there's been so much debate about walkers lately, I'd be interested
>in hearing what everyone has to say about Johnny-Jump-Ups. I know people
>who swear by them, but have also read that they can cause injury to the
>child's legs if it jumps up then comes down and hits the floor. Any
>comments?...

We had one, and my son loved it.  We hung it in a wide doorway that was
between the dining room and the kitchen.  That way he could swing and jump
while we made dinner, without being underfoot.  I have pictures of him
sound asleep in it too.  He hated his walker, and never used it much,
but he loved his Johnny-Jump-Up.

He has always been a climber.  Now, at 7 years of age, I'm having to stop
him from climbing on the counters in the kitchen to get things!  We never
noticed any injuries.

Your mileage may vary.


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||    \ /  ^  \|  ^  /|  ||     |  |  (--||  | ||  __||  __||  __||  __| |
||__|__||__|__||__|__\|__||_|\__|  \_____||____||__|  |__|  |____||____| |
|________________________________________________________________________|
                       |   karinc@SSD.intel.com  |                       
                       |_________________________|
From: mlinda@novell.com (M'Linda Taylor)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Walkers: should I get one?
Date: 26 Aug 92 21:23:40 GMT
Organization: Novell Inc., Austin, Texas

In article <14337@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu> pburch@bcm.tmc.edu (Paula Burch) writes:
>
>In Diane Lin's excellent summary of walker dangers, it sounds as 
>though nearly all of the walker-related injuries were due to falling 
>down stairs, and most of the remainder to an inadequately-childproofed 
>home. 
>

If you choose to get a walker (and after the child can toddle) please
be sure to keep the lid down on the toilet (and after the child can
toddle) make sure there is nothing the child can climb up on near the
washer.

I have read about instances where a child drowned because he tipped
over trying to play in the toilet (what *is* it with kids and toilets
anyway?!?!) and another where a child had to be resucitated after 
climbing up on something and falling into a washer that was on a soak
cycle with the lid up.  I realize that these are rare occurances, but
it only takes ONCE.

M'Linda

************************************************
*           - Lonestar -                       *
*Internet: mlinda@novell.COM                   *
*UUCP: {ames,sun,apple,amdahl}!novell!mlinda   *
************************************************
From: dlin@weber.ucsd.edu (Diane Lin)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Need Volunteer tfor Babyproofing FAQ File
Date: 26 Aug 1992 15:43:40 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu
Summary: Judy is losing net access shortly
Keywords: FAQ, volunteer


Judy Boxer, the keeper of the FAQ file on Babyproofing Ideas, is
going to be losing net access shortly.  We therefore need a
volunteer to take over the file from her.  Since the file is already
compiled, the work involved would be minimal--responding to requests
for the file takes only a few minutes per month.  Please e-mail me
if you are willing to take over the file, and I will update the
Index accordingly.  Thanks in advance,


-- 
Diane C. Lin			"Live now; make *now* always the
dlin@weber.ucsd.edu	         most precious time.  Now will 
(Dylan's mom, 20 months)	 never come again." (ST:TNG)
From: gelman@imasun.lbl.gov (Frida Gelman)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Thomas the Tank Engine
Date: 31 Aug 1992 16:30:52 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory
Reply-To: gelman@imasun.lbl.gov (Frida Gelman)
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.128.44

In article <drew.714981044@cs.anu.edu.au> drew@cs.anu.edu.au (Drew Corrigan) writes:
>jbrindle@halcyon.com (Jennifer Brindle) writes:
>>Are any of your kids into Thomas the Tank Engine and Friends?  My 3YO
>>just LOVES Thomas and Percy and Gordon and James and Mavis and Toby
>>and Henry and Edward and Henrietta and Annie and Clarabel and.....
>
>Yes. My daughter Amy (3.5yrs) loves them. She has a "Thomas Toothbrush"
>and a Thomas Re-useable Sticker Set. (That is, a plastic coated card


	YES, YES, YES!!! My 3.5 year old boy LOVES the anything Thomas
as well. He is a real train fanatic and loves anything related to trains.
We have complete die-cast set (exept Harold) and a box with track on it
that one of the motorized Thomases runs on. We also have flashlight, books,
puzzels, and various bump cars. We have a VHS tape that we bought but we
also taped lots of Shining Time Station episodes from the air so he
likes watching them.

	Also, there was a "Great Railway Jorneys of the World" series,
that just ran on PBS here. We taped that and Bernie wants to watch it
all the time. He also likes Brio, the Tomy plastic train sets (sort of
like Brio but made out of plastic and cheaper), HO trains (he is not
allowed to play with those right now because of his 11month old sister).
His favorite, though is an old Lionel steam engine (from the 70s so it
is not one of the $400 ones) and a short layout that daddy made for him
to look just like daddy's elaborate one. He hugs that engine, kisses it
and reads books to it.

	...sigh... If only he treated his sister with so much love!!!

BTW, for those of you in the Bay Area, the Amtrak ride to Sacramento is
beautiful and they are running $1.00 return fare deal now. And the train
museum is only 2 blocks a way from the train station. Give the train
maniac in your life a real treat!!!
(I'm in no way associated with Amtrac)

					Frida.

--
Frida Gelman 
All opinions are those of the author
gelman@imasun.lbl.gov
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: betsyp@apollo.hp.com (Betsy Perry)
Subject: Re: Booster seats in aircraft
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 18:02:40 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

In article <SHAFER.92Aug28100837@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov> shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) writes:
>There was a little article in this morning's LA Times pointing out
>that one should _not_ use booster seats onboard aircraft.  All the
>major airlines recommend that you not use them, but they are not
>prohibited in the FARs.
>
>The reason for not using them is that aircraft seats will fold forward
>in an impact, injuring the child.  This doesn't happen in cars.

I'd like to clarify that this refers to *booster* seats, not
*infant-toddler* seats (the hard plastic ones).  Infant-toddler
seats have a sticker on them certifying that they are safe for
use on airplanes.

I'd like to add that I think our Fisher-Price seat actually made
our last airline trip with our (then) 22-month-old much easier:
it was a familiar environment, and she already understood the
rules.  (E.g. no moving around in the aisles!)  She played contentedly
with various toys, ate the airline lunch, and then fell asleep
-- right before landing, wouldn't you know it!
                                
Betsy's Golden Rules of Sane Air Travel with Toddlers:

1.  Don't leave home without a Travel Magna-Doodle.

2.  Order two kids' meals -- one for you!  My husband and I agreed
    that Ellen's USAIR kid's meal was MUCH more appetizing than
    our lunches.  (Macaroni & cheese, chicken fingers,
    grapes, and Oreos versus Mystery Stuffed Chicken,
    Greasy Rice, Tossable Salad, and Spice Cake.)
    Call the airline 24 hours in advance and tell them
    you want a special meal; they'll do the rest.

3.  Make sure the people who issue your boarding pass know you're
    travelling with an infant seat.  On one leg of our flight,
    we had to move, because the infant seat would have prevented
    use of the emergency exit in the row behind.  Fortunately,
    the row ahead was happy to swap with us.

4.  Make sure there's a complete change of clothes in the
    diaper bag.  (I know, you knew this anyway.)  
    
-- 
Betsy Hanes Perry   (note P in userid)     betsyp@apollo.hp.com
Hewlett-Packard Company
"It seems to us that the readers who want fiction to be like life are
considerably outnumbered by those who would like life to be like fiction."
From: miki@aftac1.llnl.gov (R. Miki Moore 423-9712)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Baby Cries in Carseat
Date: 31 Aug 92 15:45:21 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
Originator: miki@aftac1.llnl.gov


it was a guarantee crying session anytime we put laura in
a car seat. for that reason did the following:
  1. tried to always have 2 adults traveling (2 kids)
  2. limited rides with her (long trips were definitely
     out).
  3. when she graduated to a toddler seat where she
     could wiggle out, i would hold one foot (sometimes
     i had to take her shoes off, otherwise my hand got
     very damaged).
  4. if things got really bad i would stop the car. get
     her out of the seat. hold her and "discuss" the issue..
     ...when the car is moving she is in her seat..no
     options are available.

in spite of all this we still visited relatives 100 miles
away on a regular basis. went grocery shopping every
saturday morning, took them to day care, went to the
zoo, etc....of course our nerves often suffered but
once we got there she was fine.
-- 
Miki Moore
Lawrence Livermore National Labs
All opinions are those of the author only
miki@aftac1.llnl.gov
-- 
Miki Moore
Lawrence Livermore National Labs
All opinions are those of the author only
miki@aftac1.llnl.gov
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: re: Baby Cries in Carseat
From: ace@kryton.UUCP (Catherine Beckstead)
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 19:00:29 PDT
Organization: Paradox Alley F&SF BBS 805-492-8789

demartinib@cpva.saic.com writes:

> In response to the request for advise for a friend who's baby cried in the ca
> unless snuggled on mom's lap:
> 
> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE ask her to reconsider removing the baby from the car sea
> The idea of a child becoming an instant `airbag' for the parent in the event 
> an accident or sudden stop makes me shudder.  Too many children (and adults)
> are killed because available safety restrains are not used.  Is it worth your
> child's life just because they are unhappy in the car?  (Yes, I have had to
> listen to non-stop crying before, but I NEVER considered holding the child on
> my lap to pacify them.)
> 
> For those who try to justify it with notion that they drive more carefully
> when the child is unrestrained, what about everyone else on the road?  Do you
> really think that everyone else is taking YOUR child's safety into
> consideration when they dart in front of you, run a stop sign, brake suddenly
> etc.?  
> 
> Brenda DeMartini
> SAIC, San Diego CA
> 

Here, here!!  It brings tears to my eyes everytime I see a baby in a car
not in a carseat, but on mom's lap, or crawling/climbing around the back.
I hate it, and find it absolutly criminal and child endangerment.
The parents should be prosecuted.  If a baby is crying in the carseat, let
him/her cry.  Find something that comforts her/him, a pacifier, a bottle
(if the child is can hold it herself).  My son used to like his bottle
when riding in the car, and it usually just put him to sleep.  When he
was an infant, he liked the pacifier, and that usually kept him quite.
Otherwise I just didn't worry about it and kept driving.  It wasn't worth
it to me to get into an accident trying to comfort a child.  There are also
toys that can attach to the carseats.  But my guess is that the original
poster was talking about a young infant.  All I can say is buckle the
child up, and don't worry about the crying.  They'll soon stop.  Besides, 
makes for a good lung workout.  Most serious injuries and deaths of 
children in car accidents are due to the child not being in a carseat.
These injuries and deaths are preventable.

-Buckle up the one you love.


-------------------------------------------------------------------
Catherine Beckstead                    ace@kryton.uucp
"Do you want to argue with a can of deodorant that registers
NINE on the Richter scale?"        --Ace, in "Dragonfire"