HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik)
Subject: Re: Men Not Getting It
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 10:59:32 GMT
Organization: (getting there)

amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:

 >the classic route for straight guys to get it is having a daughter.
 >it doesn't work for everybody, but apparently it goes a long way
 >for some.
Pity the daughters of those for whom it doesn't work!

 >for a few, what does it is having a woman partner they think of
 >as their best friend.
And then, those who are without the merest hint of a trace of a clue
are unlikely to have a woman partner they think of as their best
friend.

 >you identify a lot with your closest friends,
What-- with a *girl*?!  Naw...

 >so it's something of a shock to discover that they are besieged
 >in ways you aren't.  it's just not fair, these guys say.  and
 >then maybe the light goes on.
Arnold, of course, is talking about those men on the edge of
comprehension.  And I agree, they're a lot more interesting than the
hard-nosed (or otherwise anatomically rigid) guys, but they aren't
nearly so nice to know as the ones who've already made the
connections by the time you (by which I mean I) get to meet them.

 >arnold (who's been on both these trails)
No; really?

[For those who suffer from irony-detection deficiency anemia,
this article might serve as a strengthening exercise.] 


-- 

  Mara Chibnik
  mara@panix.com                Life is too important to be taken seriously.
From: dgilly@us.oracle.com (Daniel Gilly)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Faulty Logic (was Re: Can anyone tell me about this TV show?)
Date: 20 Nov 92 20:43:08 GMT
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Redwood Shores CA 94065
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <1992Nov20.024503.16801@spdcc.com> rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue) writes:
>mudge@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (MUDGE BRIAN WAYNE) writes:
>
>>  THE WALL STREET JOURNAL (no, i'm not shouting, that's the way they
>>print it) Nov-13, 1992.  I don't remember which section, but you can
>>bet it wasn't "finance".
>>  Apparently, some researchers think that e-mag waves do something funny
>>to the pineal gland, causing a cancer link.
>>  Unfortunately, the study was not a causality one.  That is, they first
>>started with X number of cancer patients, and then found out how many
>>of them used electric razors.  Naturally, the electric razor use could
>>be merely coincidental.
>
>	Yup - it's psuedo-science.  There's lots of it going around
>these days.
>
>	I leave it up to the reader to look for it - I won't be baited
               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>into giving a list ;-)
>
>	I'll bet most of those people surveyed also used toilet paper...
>which of course then makes it carcinogenic...  (if that sounds ridiculous
>you should read some of the REAL reports!)

Well, here's a good example I read once in a book about logic:

Someone observes that more traffic accidents occur on days when
people walk around with open umbrellas.  Conclusion:  umbrellas
cause car accidents.  

Of course, this ignores the effect of rain on both accidents 
and on umbrella use.
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel Gilly                                 Oracle Corporation
dgilly@us.oracle.com                         Redwood Shores, CA
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: Patrick Stewart & "Space Age"
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 12:34:11 GMT


In article <1992Nov17.053627.25536@reed.edu> nelson@reed.edu
(Nelson Minar) writes:

>In article <1e9nj1INN4ep@mizar.usc.edu>
adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

>[Patrick Stewart]
>>I was at a cocktail party he attended once (name- drop, name-drop,
>>name-drop) and his RAOUNDED TAONES are even worse in person.

>WHAT?!  How dare you insult Patrick Stewart you..  you..
>velveeta eater.

Young man!  I remind you that this is a decent, upstanding
newsgroup and that your remarks are spread, er,
disseminated, er, broadcast all over Wisconsin, where our
motto is "Eat cheese or die." We do *not* allow even the
word for that ...  "product!"

I will, however, immediately snarf your line into my book of
insults, for shameless re-use.

>He's more of an icon than Marlene Dietrich and Errol Flynn,
>put together!

That's something of a low-libido combination, as icons go, I
think.

>I think I would swoon dead away, were I at a cocktail party
>with Patrick Stewart.  How do you do it?

You open your eyes *very* wide, flutter the lids a few
times, say "oh" softly, drop your diet Coke, and crumple
obtrusively to the carpet, taking care not to bump your head
on the corner of the coffee table on the way down.

This is not to be done willy-nilly, however -- too easy to
get stepped on, rather than noticed.

<> There was this weird little weasly kid I went to elementary
<> school with.  If there was a fight he would hang around and
<> if one or the other of the participants got pinned or held
<> down this kid would leap in and kick him a few times and then
<> run away shrieking as he was chased home.  Anyone can get
<> attention, but it doesn't ever really satisfy the need for
<> respect. -- Greg Parkinson (glp@fig.citib.com)
-- 
[Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin]
[Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson]
[Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888]
[---------> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <---------]
From: scott@bbx.basis.com (Scott Amspoker)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein (was Re: Scott Masden)
Date: 16 Nov 92 18:12:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: bbx.47
Distribution: na,uk
Organization: BASIS International, Ltd., Albuquerque NM USA

In article <1992Nov16.005955.8860@pellns.alleg.edu> mccombj@alleg.edu (The Great Gazoo) writes:
>In article <1992Nov15.172253.29546@spdcc.com> rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob  
>Donahue) writes:
>> 	Translation - I support queers if they give my $$$.  Oh, joy.
>
>Not exactly... I interpret this as his wanting to be taken seriously as an  
>_artist_, not just as a body.

Hmmm.  I'm left to wonder why he seems to display his body at every
opportunity.  Maybe his gay audiences are taking their cues from him
and that caught him by surprise.

-- 
Scott Amspoker                       |    
Basis International, Albuquerque, NM |  Too bad ignorance isn't really
                                     |  bliss.  Then it could be outlawed.
scott@bbx.basis.com                  |
Newsgroups: soc.motss,soc.bi
From: gtoal@nyx.cs.du.edu (Graham Toal)
Subject: Re: Oprah 11/19
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 92 15:54:28 GMT

In article <1992Nov21.205142.9481@dsg.cs.tcd.ie> cjmchale@dsg.cs.tcd.ie (Ciaran McHale) writes:
>A lot of people think that if it could be proven that people are "born
>gay" then oppression of gayfolk would stop. I don't think so. After all,
>black folk are born black yet that fact doesn't stop a racist bigot from
>hating blacks. Similarly, about 50% of the population are born female
>yet that does not many men from being sexist.

It's worse than that.  The xtian fundie attitute is 'it's not the sinner
we despise, but the sin'.  If they can prove that 'the sin' had a biological
basis (inherited genetics or some developmental thing in the womb) then they
will feel *totall* justified to forcibly 'cure' 'sufferers' by locking them
up in psychiatric homes against their will just as they do at the moment
with 'Satanists'.  What's more, I'd lay money they'd change their attitude
to abortion damn quick if they could determine that a child in the womb
would grow up gay.  They're extremely good at finding Biblical justifications
when it suits them despite being deaf and blind to Biblical quotations
working the other way.

G
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: stephena@netcom.com (Stephen Arrants)
Subject: Re: Inconsistency re CO boycott
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 22:19:23 GMT

In article <1992Nov16.224637.7072@macc.wisc.edu> anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
>
>In article <17933@autodesk.COM> owen@autodesk.com (D.  Owen
>Rowley) writes:
>
>>I've watched you fill this newsgroup with the official 
>>Anderson line for a few years now, and have also watched you
>>heap your special brand of creamed scorn on those who dare to think
>>aloud outside of your accpted gnorm.
>
>You mean I'm about to become an official Yahweh cult now?

Are you going to be holding auditions for official Temple male prostitutes?
From: lmadison@nl.oracle.com (Linc Madison)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Advice sought on living in UK
Date: 23 Nov 92 14:21:28 GMT
Reply-To: lmadison@ie.oracle.com (Linc Madison)
Organization: Oracle Europe

First off, I only meant that the weather in Brighton would be *nicer* than in
Scotland, as in "not as brutally bad in January."

Secondly, just in case anyone has been trying me by e-mail, please note that
my address is lmadison@IE.oracle.com, *not* lmadison@NL.oracle.com.  My NNTP
                       ^^                            ^^
host is in De Meern, The Netherlands, but I am in Dublin, Ireland.  That
means that any e-mail I send out gets to go through Holland *and* California
before venturing into the Real World (tm).

I just bought my tickets on Friday to visit England the weekend of Dec. 4-7,
via Stansted Airport, but the rest of the itinerary is up in the air.  I will
certainly be making excursions to some of my candidate locations, but details
remain to be worked out.  My actual move will be around the first of the year.

As for expenses and the exchange rate, I hope to make the exchange rate as
little an issue as possible -- the goal is for the trip to be self-sufficient,
neglecting transatlantic airfare cost up front.  (Yes, I do have a work visa.)

-- Linc Madison  ==  LMadison@IE.Oracle.Com  (Dublin, Ireland, temporarily)
From: pieter@cs.caltech.edu (Pieter Hazewindus)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: The het woman in gay male fiction
Date: 20 Nov 1992 00:26:03 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology
NNTP-Posting-Host: hector.cs.caltech.edu

steven@cray.com (Steven Levine) writes:
>[Funny observations deleted]
>
>What concerns me is the strange trend in gay male fiction
>that every young gay angst-ridden man has a fabulous straight
>female best friend who takes care of him and fixes him up and
>cooks soup when he's sick and understands fashion almost as much
>as he does.  Sometimes this woman is overweight, and she always
>knows a lot about art.

Yes, this woman is a terrible cliche.  She serves as a convenient way
to keep the narrative from spinning out of control.  Joe Keenan is
Exhibit A in this regard.  But who else are you going to cast in this
role?  The parents?  The lover?  The boss?  The hairdresser?  We all
know what an effort it is for most men to try to be supportive.  So,
voila, the fabu female.

The only writer who does not have woman characters (at all) is Dennis
Cooper.  He says he has trouble writing about women, and that he is now
trying to ease into it by writing about a transsexual.

>Who *is* this woman?  Do any of us know her?  Is there something
>missing in my life because I don't have a straight woman
>best friend who runs an art gallery and wears drop-dead clothes
>when she accompanies me to glittering cocktail parties?

I know her.  She doesn't run an art gallery (she would, though), and we
don't go to cocktail[*] parties (I won't), but she exists.  She knows
how to cook a good dinner, too.  It is a great comfort to know that
there is always someone you can call up and talk to, without sex or
power or whatever getting in the way.  In fact, it was a surprise to me
to find out that there are gay men -- no, men in general -- who do not
have a close woman friend.  I always feel the emotional support is a
one-way thing, although she would probably disagree.  All I do is
listen.  She tells me how to run my life.

[*]:  Which reminds me of the time, when I was still learning the
language, that she introduced me to a friend as a "cocksure young
man."  I could only guess what that meant, so I blushed.

In other literary news, Paul Monette yesterday won a National Book
Award for nonfiction for his autobiography "Half a Life." The book
is a must-read.

Pieter Hazewindus                               pieter@cs.caltech.edu
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon)
Subject: Re: discrimination at CMU
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:10:37 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer, Inc.
Followup-To: soc.motss

In article <1ee7sqINN9i3@mizar.usc.edu>, adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
wrote:

> Heavens.  When was it that Rene Auberjonois was there?  Or Sada
> Thompson?  The late 1950s?  Besides, quite exceptionally talented
> students (one thinks of Meryl Streep at Yale)

Ah, now one thinks of Meryl Streep as 'expecionally talented.'  I
do recall the feather boa being ruffled not too long over mention
of Meryl Streep by one so onerous as myself.  However, come to 
think of it, you did use 'exceptionally talented' then, too.

An 'exceptionally talented mimic' I believe were your exact words...

*X*
(who believes the Sigourney Weaver studied at Stanford - though
perhaps she went to both Stanford and Yale...)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon)
Subject: Re: Not Enough Sucking on Keanu
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 17:36:25 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer, Inc.
Followup-To: soc.motss

In article <+9hq3qa@lynx.unm.edu>, lazlo@triton.unm.edu (Lazlo Nibble)
wrote:

> Having seen him in 'Idaho', 'Point Break', 'Dracula', and a both 'Bill And
> Ted' movies, I can assure you that each and every person reading this 
> message has a piece of furniture somewhere in their home that's a better 
> actor than Keanu Reeves is.

Furniture is a good analogy.  He's just kind of there.  Kind of wooden.
Kind of safe.  Comfy to look at.  But I would have prefered River
Phoenix in the roll...

*X*
From: rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein (was Re: Scott Masden)
Date: 15 Nov 92 17:45:42 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1992Nov15.174542.707
Organization: insert anything here

markm@ogicse.ogi.edu (Mark Morrissey) writes:

	Touche.

BBC
From: Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein (was Re: Scott Masden)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 18:58:51 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <69732@cup.portal.com> <1992Nov18.155625.23186@netcom.com>

Steven Arrants misses the point:
>>>Yeah, so?  You've done it at the Lone Star, George.  Double-standard time?
>>Pull that stick out of your ass. I was referring to his penchant
>>for dropping 'trou as an identifier, notoriety about which might
>>have reached further than his name.
>>
>And pull your head out of your ass, George. Your penchant for the same (along

... has nothing to do with this.

>with the "old in-and-out", pissing contests on the patio and the like identify
>you to those who don't know you.

...and did I *SAY* there was anything wrong with his penchant for 
doffing his pants?

*NO*!

It was something of an afterthought, added (as I said) as an
example of his notoriety that might have spread to BBC's
attention.

 
() To paraphrase a friend of mine on GEnie, "even normally
() friendly folk are starting to sprout fur and growl at
() passersby..."
()      -- Amanda Walker
-----
[> George D. Madison | NBCS: B8f+t+w-e+s+k+a!cv | Just say NO to razors! <]
[> It's a BEAR thing -- you wouldn't understand. <|> furr@cup.portal.com <]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein
From: <SECBH@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Sunday, 15 Nov 1992 06:29:12 EST
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:

>Well, not quite. He's an ugly white boy who thinks he's black and
>does rap music to prove it.....  *UGH*.

In article <74296@apple.apple.COM>,
richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel) comments:

>I find your statement above to be fairly racist and worthy of calling to
>your attention.  Surely you did not mean it to sound as it reads?

I don't see a glimmer of racism in George's statement.  Would Flying
Squirrel or someone else who finds the comment racist please explain
howso.

Jack Carroll
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: larry@bradley.bradley.edu (L. D. Stratton)
Subject: Re: ***Accessories!!!***
Organization: Bradley University
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 23:37:04 GMT

In <1992Nov18.131253.7292@hemlock.cray.com> steven@cray.com (Steven Levine) writes:
>In article <Bxv90y.9z8@cs.vu.nl> fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:
>[How to accessorize with motss-ers]
>FJ -- you've got to come visit the U.S.  There are lots more
>choices who would be happy to have you try them out and on.
>In fact, if you could get yourself over here, I'm willing
>to bet that we could find people across the country -- and
>into parts of Canada -- who will put you up and feed you
>and show you around and off, at no cost to yourself beyond
>the transportation.
>So this is my question:  Is such a tour in the works?
>Now that you're not working at the Cockring, anymore,
>whatever that was.
>I'll take care of the Upper Midwest part of things.  Do I
>hear from any volunteers from other regions?
>-Steven

   Count on me for Chicago, St. Louis and all points in between.
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Inconsistency re CO boycott
Date: 16 Nov 92 22:37:20 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison


In article <17933@autodesk.COM> owen@autodesk.com (D.  Owen
Rowley) writes:

>I've watched you fill this newsgroup with the official
>Anderson line for a few years now, and have also watched you
>heap your special brand of creamed scorn on those who dare
>to think aloud outside of your accpted gnorm.

Go for it, Owen.

-- 
[Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin]
[Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson]
[Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888]
[---------> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <---------]
From: richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Bear Crap
Date: 19 Nov 92 04:06:43 GMT
Organization: Xiola Blue

Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:

>And this is just one example.... It goes on *much* further.
> 
>() >How do the hypothalamuses of bears and twinks compare?
>() Before we examine that question you first need to
>() establish that twinks indeed have brains.
>()      -- Rob Bernardo

Yep, whine about being disenfranchised by those who don't practice it against
you, and then post the above at the end.

How many ways can you spell the word hypocrite, GDM?  No one has been anti-
bear in the Marky Mark postings until you growled, and then they've been
anti-GDM, if anything.

When you stop drowning in the pool of your pity party and realise that some
of us are just expressing our preferences for hard, hairless bodies much in
the same way you want 'em hairy, we can "all get along".  I can't help the
fact that the media is so biased (gay or straight).  Frankly, I don't know
what it would take to convince you that I (or anyone else) isn't anti-bear;
I just prefer hairless bodies when I want to get my juices flowing.  Neither
my b/f nor I are any measure of hairless (except our heads ;^) ).  What do
we need to do: say "some of our friends are...", have motss.archive pictures
submitted embracing your fave bear, admit our troubled ways?  

I'm being honest here, GDM.  What do you want that we, the readers and posters
of soc.motss, can reasonably accomplish?  We cannot change the media (nor are
we responsible for same).  I try and call out all forms of prejudice, for our
"community" (ugh) needs none of it.  I don't like anti-bear postings any more
than anti-twink, or anti-color, or anti-anything.  We've had well enough of
that.  Suggest solutions, not this hypocritical vitriol.  It convinces no one.
-- 
a flying squirrel is: richard@apple.com  Apple Computer Inc.

i'm your girl            friend
i'm your squirrel        friend
i'm your round the world friend

"In America, we can't even get corruption right."  - my CFII.
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.politics.homosexuality,co.politics,co.general,talk.politics.misc,co.politics.amend2.discuss,boulder.general,csu.general
From: cuffell@spot.Colorado.EDU (CUFFELL TIMOTHY MICH)
Subject: Re: Colorado Amendment 2: The First Fatality
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 01:35:38 GMT

In article <Nov16.200447.36650@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> wallsj@CS.ColoState.EDU (jeffrey joel walls) writes:
>>The Governor is not trying to get the Amendment declared unconstitutional,
>>nor can he legally do any such thing. His job is to enforce the laws of
>>the State, regardless of his opinions about them. In fact, he and the
>>Attroney General are _required_ to defend Amendment 2 in court.
>
>  Well, possibly, but why was he on TV saying that he was against
>  2 and would do anything possible to declare the amendment
>  unconstitutional?
>
>Jeff
>
The Gov. is not forsworn to uphold Amendment 2 until some time in Jan., when
it becomes law.

-- 

-Tim Cuffel
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Sucking on Keanu Reeves
Date: 18 Nov 92 03:44:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1992Nov18.034451.28877
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <74375@apple.apple.COM> richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel) writes:
>You could always ask Matthew about that surly waiter we had.  He was neither
>cute nor personable.  

Perhaps it had something to do with the dinner companion you had that evening.
Surly is as surly does.

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.politics.homosexuality,co.politics