HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: FA.TJM@forsythe.stanford.edu (thom mckean)
Subject: Re: date characteristics
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 18:51:39 GMT

In article <4555@unccvax.uncc.edu>,
goodrum@unccvax.uncc.edu (Huckleberry Muffin) writes:
>>In <1992Apr01.234724.7665@watson.ibm.com> margoli@watson.ibm.com (Larry Margolis) writes:
>>>In  <1992Apr1.213810.29442@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com>
>>>brunette@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (H L Brunette) writes:
>>>> That said, it's not easy to ask women out.
>>
>>>What's so hard about saying "Want to go out some time?" ???
>>
>
>        There's not a thing hard about saying that. You say it,
>then she says "Oh sure, I'd love to" and you both feel real good
>about it and never deal with the question of *when* and *where*
>you're going out, or even establish whether she wants to go out
>with you or just go out.
>        Asking for a real date, now that's hard.

It's much harder to ask "Want to go out sometime?" than asking for a
"real date" (that is, giving an actual date/time/place).

Asking for an unspecific "date" causes much awkwardness in both
parties and possible feelings of rejection for the asker.  Say the
man pops the unspecified date question, and the woman would rather
not go...she generally feels awkward turning this person down (it's
no fun telling a person "no, I do not want to go out with you at any
point in my life") and the degree of rejection for the man is
extremely high.

Much safer to ask "Would you like to go see Chick Corea Friday night
at Slim's?"  If the woman is interested, she'll say yes.  If she's
not interested, she'll say, no, thanks, I'm busy/gotta pluck my
eyebrows/watch the hockey game/train for the Olympics.  the man can
then rationalize away the rejection, which is still there, but to a
much lesser degree than in the unspecific situation.   If she's
interested, but can't go, she'll be likely to say, "I can't, but
perhaps we can go out on Saturday [or some other day]."

This seems to work for me pretty well.  It's nonthreatening to
either person's ego.

Thom
Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: michele@dgbt.doc.ca (Michele Guillet)
Subject: Avoiding dating married people 
Organization: The Communications Research Centre, Ottawa, Canada
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 92 15:25:07 GMT

In article <1992Apr9.020355.20800@mks.com> fredw@mks.com (Fred Walter) writes:

>All the affairs I know about started out with the third person not knowing
>that the cheating partner was married. They'd be given phone numbers that
>were slightly wrong (so if they found out the right one it would look
>like a mistake). They'd be told to only call at work because they're
>never home. (Oh, what else was Judy told by her guys ? I can't think
>of anything else right now.)
>
That's one thing I insist to have with the men I date, their home numbers
and I make sure to tell them that I will call and I do call without
giving a specific time.

That's a relatively easy way to find out if someone is involved
in a live-in relationship or is married. The other thing I do is ask
up front, a number of people who wouldn't tell you, will not deny
it when directly asked.

Since I don't want to get involved with someone who is seriously
involved with someone, these two things are useful.

-- 
Michele Guillet 			The Communications Research Centre 
3701 Carling Avenue, Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA, K2H 8S2	tel:613-998-2384
Internet: michele@dgbt.doc.ca	
Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: browns@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Stuart Brown)
Subject: Re: Exchanging phone numbers (was Re: The "first" "move" (was Re: A R C ))
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:55:40 GMT

>>my phone number or said they called, don't call either. I think
>>a number of people seem to think that asking for a phone number 
>>(or saying they'll call you ) is a polite way to close a conversation 
>>and say good bye.
>
>That's an interesting thought--anybody out there take this particular
>approach?  Oh, well; nobody ever said that polite couldn't be
>confusing.

"Goodbye, I love you, let's do lunch!"

"Sure thing, I love you too. I'll have my girl call your girl."
-- 
Stuart M. Brown                               Postdocs rush in where wise men
U. of Manitoba, Dept. Plant Science, Canada       Fear to tread. 
browns@ccu.umanitoba.ca        
				Disclaimer?? Sure: "That Disc is Mine!"
From: state@sargent.cs.unc.edu (Andrei State)
Newsgroups: soc.singles
Subject: Re: Another gem!  (on changing and being authentic)
Date: 14 Apr 92 01:26:35 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill

Walter Lego writes:
>
>Do men ever post gems on the net?

Dan Mocsny.


Andrei
From: stef@Apple.COM (Stef Jones)
Newsgroups: soc.singles
Subject: Re: The "first" "move" (was Re: A R C )
Date: 14 Apr 92 19:41:52 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

>Yep...all the aggressive women are at cons...my most recent ex SO
>(went out 2.5 years) I met at a con...she molded the circumstances so
>I would drive her home, and later asked me out.  She _would_ call you
>up and say "hey you with the blinders on...."
>
>So it just goes to show, if you want to meet aggressive women,
>put on a tunic, buy a big sword, read up on wicca, and march right
>over to your local SciFi/Fantasy convention or medievalist society.
>
Works both ways ... seems like most of the guys who appreciate
"aggressive" women are also at cons. 

--
Stef                 In the force if Yoda's so strong, construct a 
stef@apple.com       sentence with words in the proper order then 
                     why can't he?                         /fortune
Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: pooh@group-w.uchicago.edu (Pooh @ the Utility Muffin Research Kitchen)
Subject: Re: Peeking through the curtain
Organization: Medieval England, Iowa
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:30:45 GMT

In article <ku8tp9INN3b1@news.bbn.com> dhardin@spcink.bbn.com (Dawn Hardin) writes:
>I agree with rON here.  Anyone who is obsessing on saying "I love you"
>twelve times a day (past the first couple of days that you're saying it,
>or on a honeymoon or whatever) is either trying to convince himself or
>you. 

But this begs the question, Dawn: what *is* the right number?
19?  15?  10?  3?  and those pesky integers ...  Who gets to
decide what the "right number" is?

I think it really depends on the personalities involved.  Some
people find it easier to give birth to a sand-covered water buffalo
than say "I love you" even once; other people love to say it to
everyone.   The only problem arises when you have one person of
type A and one person of type B in a relationship.

Personally, I like saying it, and it's very difficult for me
to be around a type A person because I feel as though I have to
restrain myself out of deference to his preferences.  When I'm
in the giddy phase of a relationship, every time I open my mouth
a declaration of affection falls out, and every time I close my
mouth I bite one in two that was trying to *get* out.  (Apologies
to Mark Twain.)  It's not insecurity; I just kind of bubble over
with enthusiasm.  (Oops!  sorry about the carpet.)

>My husband told me he loved me at least twenty times a day right up till
>the day he left.  Don't ask me how many times he told me I was beautiful.

Well, in that case he probably wouldn't have meant it any more
even if he'd only said it once a day; this just proves that he
didn't take the words seriously.  I know a couple that has been
married, oh, must be five years now, and they are STILL sickeningly
affectionate every minute of the day.  I haven't tried counting the
number of times they say and show that they love each other because
I would have to give my full attention to it instead of eating their
party refreshments. :-)  

>(Or maybe I'm still just raving and totally unable to deal with
>romantic subjects rationally.)

Hey, I'll join the raving club.  Move over. :-)

Pooh
      pooh@group-w.uchicago.edu

Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: intrigue@milton.u.washington.edu (Angelwing)
Subject: Re: The "first" "move" (was Re: A R C )
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 15:33:27 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.033910.20910@helios.physics.utoronto.ca> wong@bullet.ecf.utoronto.ca (Peter Wong) writes:
>
>The person making the "first move" is the one who breaks the ice. In
>the above example from Angelwing, the ice hasn't been broken yet
>and those inhibitions are still there.

Okay okay!  Sheesh!   I agree ...but what someone edited out of the
previous post was me saying that even though a women *is NOT* obviously
aggressive, if she's interested it'd be fairly obvious to any man who
doesn't have his head in the clouds.  Get it?  I'm not saying that being
around and flirting is making the first move.  I'm saying that being
available and open makes it obviously to men so that they're not all
scared about being turned down or rejected.  You are much more likely to
approach a person who you are quite certain is interested in you, right? 
That's all I'm saying.  Granted, I don't have practice being the
aggressive person.  Tried it once .. didn't like it.  And frankly, I've
never *had* to do it.  I guess because if I'm interested in someone I make
sure they know it.  I make *sure*.  I like playing the game and, like
somebody said, I like playing by my rules, too.  It not only works for me,
though.  Lots of women use this stratagem.

Angelwing - Oh lord.

*------------------------------------------------------------------*
* Angelwing       |"Two things are wanted by a true man, danger and*
* U. of Washington| play - therefore, he seeks woman as the most   *
*                 | dangerous toy."       Friedrich Nietzsche      *
*------------------------------------------------------------------*

Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: rudoff@mdd.comm.mot.com (Doug Rudoff)
Subject: Agressive/Not Agressive Women
Organization: Motorola, Mobile Data Division - Seattle, WA
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 20:40:54 GMT

In article <1992Apr13.194938.4102@ait.com> eleanor@ait.com (Eleanor Evans) writes:
>Apropos of which, get those votes in!  The poll is still continuing.
>In case you've forgotten the question:  Women, please e-mail me whether 
>you are or are not aggressive in initiating relationships, and whether 
>you wish you were or not.  
>
>We need those results!!!!!  So far, the tally is 6 aggressives, 1 not,
>1 man who wrote in to say that all the women he knows aren't.  I'll 
>published detailed responses--there are some pretty interesting comments
>in there--with attributions removed after I get more input.  I'd like
>to be fair to the non-aggressives, and give them a little more time to
>get their votes in.....

I'm interested in seeing the comments, but since an aggressive woman
is more likely to send you a vote, we won't get a good idea of what
the non-aggressive woman thinks.
-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Doug Rudoff          Motorola, Seattle    INTERNET:rudoff@mdd.comm.mot.com
                                            USENET:uunet!mdisea!rudoff   
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
From: richl@reed.edu (Rick Lindsley)
Newsgroups: soc.singles
Subject: Re: Male visual orientationREFRESH
Date: 8 Apr 92 04:18:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Apr8.041846.14217
Reply-To: rick@eaglet.rain.com (Rick Lindsley)
Organization: Reed College, Portland OR

In article <1992Apr7.222544.26970@midway.uchicago.edu> pooh@group-w.uchicago.edu (Pooh @ the Utility Muffin Research Kitchen) writes:
    
    Now announcing Dr. Poohth's Wild Sex Thang School of Inner Beauty
    and Lime Jello Maneuvers !!  (gee, this is sounding more and
    more drieuxistic ...)
    
    Increase your Sexual Market Value ((tm) Dan Mocsny, Inc.)!!
    Daily lab exercises with Nubile 18-year-olds With Velcro Shoes!!
    Correct the Kama Sutra!!
    Argue Esoteric Techniques with Masters and Johnson!!

I've seen the classroom. Pay the tuition. Worth every penny! :)

Rick
From: johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira)
Newsgroups: soc.singles
Subject: Re: buying things
Date: 8 Apr 92 16:34:42 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Inc.

In article <1992Apr6.151353.28217@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> drmax@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Marianna Max) writes:
>
>Hey Mel, I know of this really great beach along the Yucatan Penn that you
>have to hike (from where the bus drops you off) two miles of jungle to get
>to. Bordering it is an old coconut plantation with some old buildings. The 
>beach lies along a lagoon protected by a reef. Absolutely the clearest
>bluest water imaginable. On a headland in the middle of the lagoon is an 
>old ruin of a Mayan lighthouse. Coconuts year round, fish and conch and
>lobster in the reef that you can spear. The jungle is interesting too,
>orchids and iguana and an occasional unidentified. I didn't see another 
>soul the whole week that I camped there. 

Any chance of having the next boink here.  It sounds like paradise.  I've
been Yucatan and it's beautiful.  The combination of the jungle, the
beautiful beaches and the warm, clear, blue waters and the presence of 
the Mayan culture make it a facinating area.  Yucatan Penn, eh.  If
this is prison, have me arrested.
-- 
+=============================================================================+
| John Fereira                Al Bundy for President          
| johnf@auspex.com         "He's as good as the next guy"                     |
+=============================================================================+
Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: Peeking through the curtain
Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1992 22:15:35 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.ibm.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In  <1992Apr9.173045.27200@midway.uchicago.edu>  pooh@group-w.uchicago.edu (Pooh @ the Utility Muffin Research Kitchen) writes:
>
> I think it really depends on the personalities involved.  Some
> people find it easier to give birth to a sand-covered water buffalo
> than say "I love you" even once; other people love to say it to
> everyone.   The only problem arises when you have one person of
> type A and one person of type B in a relationship.

I don't think type A with type B is a problem per se; I think the problem
arises when the type B person expects the type A person to reciprocate.
If the type B says "I love you" and expects the type A to respond "I love
you too", and they don't, and the type B feels hurt, *then* there's a problem.

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
From: dhardin@bbn.com (Dawn Hardin)
Newsgroups: soc.singles
Subject: Re: Peeking through the curtain
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:56:09 GMT
Reply-To: dhardin@spcink.bbn.com (Dawn Hardin)
Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman Inc., Cambridge MA
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com

In article <1992Apr8.182027.10624@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> tlode@isis.cs.du.edu (trygve lode) writes:
>In article <7sqj2ff@lynx.unm.edu> blowfish@carina.unm.edu (rON.) writes:
>
>>If you tell your SO you love them, say, once a day, that is fine.
>>But if you feel it necessary to tell them you love them, say, 12 times a
>>day, that is excessive, and shows that your confidence on if you love them,
>>or not, is weak.
>
>I have to take issue with this--how often and in what way you express
>your love to your SO should depend on you and your SO, not distributed
>through some sort of quota system.  Once a day and twelve times a day
>are perhaps both a bit extreme, but I've known people who wouldn't be
>comfortable with more than once a day and others who really wanted to
>be told twelve times a day.  Fortunately, saying "I love you" in words
>or otherwise isn't a limited resource that we're in danger of running
>out of if we fail to use it sparingly.

I agree with rON here.  Anyone who is obsessing on saying "I love you"
twelve times a day (past the first couple of days that you're saying it,
or on a honeymoon or whatever) is either trying to convince himself or
you.  And the person who really wants to be told twelve times a day is
feeling insecure about it.  He doesn't need to be *told* about it twenty
times more.  He needs to be *shown* once or twice.

My husband told me he loved me at least twenty times a day right up till
the day he left.  Don't ask me how many times he told me I was beautiful.
The next day he says, "you know, I don't think I ever loved you in the
first place."  Multiply saying it twenty times a day for ten years, and
then weigh it against one "NOT."  We're not talking about love at all here,
we're talking MUTUAL INSECURITY and protesting too much is waving a big
red flag.

(Or maybe I'm still just raving and totally unable to deal with
romantic subjects rationally.)

Dawn
Newsgroups: soc.singles
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: The "first" "move" (was Re: A R C )
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 20:13:10 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.IBM.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In  <kujk8vINNdpm@news.bbn.com>  dhardin@bbn.com (Dawn Hardin) writes:
>
> Silly boy, I'm surprised I have to tell you this.  You offer to help them
> celebrate May Day, of course.  You *do* already have a cool helmet, don't
> you?
>
> And May Day is even coming up.  (Wish I knew a guy with a helmet to help
> *me* celebrate.)

Before I volunteer, I'd like to know *why* a helmet is needed.  Is this
a head-banger ball?

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
Xref: sparky soc.singles:10626 soc.couples:1941 soc.men:8150 soc.women:8720
From: epg@nature.berkeley.edu
Newsgroups: soc.singles,soc.couples,soc.men,soc.women
Subject: Older men and younger women (advice needed)
Date: 8 Apr 92 02:04:56 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: U.C.B.
NNTP-Posting-Host: nature.berkeley.edu


Why would a man not want to date a woman who is considerably younger
than he is?

I've had two relationships in the last year end almost before they
started in which the men I was involved with were uncomfortable about
dating me because of my age.  I'm 25, well educated and have had more
than a handful of relationships.  My first "interest" is 38, the second
is 39.  In both cases, we were friends for several months before getting
involved.  

I became interested in each of them because they were nice, interesting
men.  When they turned out to be older than I'd thought, it didn't
bother me because I already liked them.  They both say that I am
beautiful, caring, intelligent and very mature.  So if they think I'm so
wonderful, why does my age matter?

The only thing that I can point to is that they were afraid of the image
our relationship might project because both have high-profile jobs.  In
meeting their co-workers on more than a casual level, however, I always
recieved respect.  I did find it somewhat uncomfortable when people I
met would say "when I was <your> age ..."  Eventually I even heard
something along the same lines from both men.

How much stigma is really attatched to dating someone older/younger?  Is
dating a younger woman something that men want to do in fantasy, but not
reality?   I don't want to have this happen every time I start a
relationship with someone older than me, so if you have any
advice/wisdom to share, I'd like to read it.

Thanks,

little 'e'

p.s. Please forgive the crossposting.  It was difficult to figure out
who might be best to answer my questions.
From: dhardin@bbn.com (Dawn Hardin)
Newsgroups: soc.singles
Subject: Re: Discussion Of Romantic Songs
Date: 9 Apr 1992 14:16:35 GMT
Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman Inc., Cambridge MA
Reply-To: dhardin@spcink.bbn.com (Dawn Hardin)
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com

In article <3840056@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM> wjb@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Bill Buse) writes:
>For a change of topics, how about a discussion of romantic songs or 
>favorite songs that could be considered to be romantic.  :-)  

"The Torture Never Stops" by Frank Zappa.  We used to jokingly refer to
this as "our song", and it turned out to be remarkable descriptive.

Dawn
Newsgroups: soc.singles,soc.couples,soc.men,soc.women
From: nimmo@scb3.larc.nasa.gov (Nancy A. Nimmo)
Subject: Re: Older men and younger women (advice needed)
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, VA  USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 19:28:04 GMT


>Why would a man not want to date a woman who is considerably younger
>than he is?

>I've had two relationships in the last year end almost before they
>started in which the men I was involved with were uncomfortable about
>dating me because of my age.

  I have found the reverse to be true.  I have had 2 relationships with men
  both at least 13 years older than me (in their 40's), and
  they loved being involved with a younger woman.  
  They both loved 'showing' me off to their friends, and many
  of their male friend were either married to or also involved with much
  younger women (mostly bimbo gold-diggers). 
  I broke off the relationship both times because I became
  tired of being on display all the time.
  Nancy

Newsgroups: soc.singles,alt.romance
From: browns@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Stuart Brown)
Subject: Re: To pursue or not to pursue...
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 19:42:58 GMT

In article <1992Apr17.004120.1@pomona.claremont.edu> greg@pomona.claremont.edu (Tigger) writes:
>
>And then she called me the other night.  Apparently she called our
>mutual friends because she was depressed because she had just turned
>down a proposition from her ex.  They suggested she call me, and for
>some reason she did.  That was about 9:30pm.
>
>We were on the phone until 5am!  We have a hell of a lot in common.
>In fact, from what our friends have told me, and from what I learned
>during that conversation, she is almost exactly what I'm looking for.
>There are, however, a couple of problems.  First, she lives four
>hundred miles from here.  Second, it became obvious to me (though 
>not to her) during our conversation that she is still hung up on
>her ex, even though he is using her.  He even essentially raped her
>once, though she doesn't apply that term to the incident, and she
>is still defending him, and her friendship with him, and even her
>occasional sleeping with him.
>
>the same boat I did before simply because he's there and I'm not,
>except on weekends once or twice a month.  Our mutual friends think
>that she'd drop the other guy like a hot potato if she had someone
>else to take his place, but I'm not so sure about that.  And like I
>said, is someone she could only see a couple of times a month really 
>taking his place?

Nix on this situation, dude.  You are buying yourself more heartache than
you can afford- even on the budget payment plan (via Long Distance)

Why do you want to set youreslf up in a relationship where you are "The
Fixer" to her messed up life.  Do you really think that lack of wonderful
you is the only reason she has been stuck with Mr. Schmuck for so long?
Why step in and let her slide smoothly from a screwed up relationship into
something new with you?  

You have got to see that the woman needs to get her own house in order before
she could have any reasonble hope for a new relationship.  

Now if you just want to help her out with a pity boink, or a revenge fuck, or
a "see I don't need you" screw, then fine- but you are just a bit player in 
the larger drama of her ongoing relationship with the ex.

[I once made the mistake of getting involved with a woman in the process of
breaking up with a guy who was less than wonderful for her.  I got a month of
good sex, they are getting married now.]

	-Stu


-- 
Stuart M. Brown                               Postdocs rush in where wise men
U. of Manitoba, Dept. Plant Science, Canada       Fear to tread. 
browns@ccu.umanitoba.ca        
				Disclaimer?? Sure: "That Disc is Mine!"
Newsgroups: soc.singles