HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jones@pyrite.cs.uiowa.edu (Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879)
Subject: Re: What is an interlocking? (was: Signal type)
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 20:13:33 GMT
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA

From article <Bts42L.C85@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>,
by roma@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Roma):
> 
> The mechanical control via rods and levers are indeed interCONNECTED to the
> switch linkage.  However, the term interLOCKING more accurately refers to
> the mechanical (or electrical) apparatus inside the tower that prevents an
> unsafe action.

If you want to be strict with terms, you can split things up roughly as
follows, based on my reading of a few different operating rule books and
Maintenance of Way Cyclopedeas:

The interlocking machine prevents unsafe settings of signals, turnout
points, and such.  This machine typically sits in a trackside and is
directly connected to the control levers used by the tower operator to
set the signals and turnouts.

The interlocking plant consists of the interlocking machine plus all
connected signals, moving parts of turnouts, control levers, train
detection equipment and interconnecting links; more loosely, the term
also includes all trackage over which movement is controlled by the same
interlocking machine.

A signal or set of switch points may be described as being interlocked,
in which case, it is part of the interlocking plant and controlled by
an interlocking machine.

The term interlocking, used as a noun, usually refers to the entire
interlocking plant, loosely.  Thus, if Hammond Tower houses an
interlocking machine, an engineer might be heard saying "I'm just
entering the Hammond Interlocking" as his engine comes in sight of
an interlocked signal controlled from Hammond Tower.

				Doug Jones
				jones@cs.uiowa.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: mchenry@guvax.georgetown.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: need help on railroad songs
Date: 4 Sep 92 18:45:42 GMT
Organization: Georgetown University

I have heard that you folks recently had a long thread on Songs of the 
Railroad. If anyone has a summary of that thread, please send it to me. I 
would like to make a railroad compilation for my 8-year old nephew. I cross 
posted widely so I am getting quite a few messages in. 

Thanks. Please respond to my e-mail as I don't read this group (at least 
not yet).

Bill McHenry, an admitted cross-poster...
mchenry@guvax.georgetown.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: dkantor@uspi2.Prime.COM (Dave Kantor)
Subject: Re: MBTA Expands Commuter Rail Service
Organization: Prime Computer, Inc.
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:48:11 GMT

In article <168568C56.M00209@MBVM.Mitre.Org>, Len Bachelder writes:
>  
> As far as I know, both of these extensions are still officially in the plans.
> But I wouldn't hold my breath.  Massachusetts is as broke as any other State,
> perhaps more so than most, and any money available for commuter rail is going
> first to the Old Colony,

Any idea when south shore (Old Colony) service will be opened ?

> then to double-tracking the Haverhill line

Any plans to extend this line to New Hampshire ?

> ...Worcester and Newburyport. 

There was an article in the Middlesex News recently regarding the Worcester
extension, and specifically the controversy surrounding the proposed location
of the Westborough station.  Appears that there is some serious NIMBY action
going on that may end up delaying the project.


> An extension beyond Stoughton to Taunton and perhaps all the way to
> New Bedford is officially planned, and politically desirable.  The MBTA (or
> some other State agency I'm not sure) owns the right of way from Stoughton to
> Taunton, and of course beyond that there is regular freight service to New
> Bedford.  However, it would be a very expensive project - on the same order of
> magnitude as the Old Colony extensions, and thus IMHO probably won't happen in
> our lifetime.
>  

What makes this project so expensive (not disputing it, just curious) ?

One more question...do you know if electrification work has begun on the Boston-New Haven segment of the Northeast Corridor ?  I thought I saw an article some months ago regarding this.

>  
> Len Bachelder        Archives Committee, Boston and Maine RR Historical Society
> MITRE Corp.           Secretary, Massachusetts Bay Railroad Enthusiasts
> Bedford MA 01730      Member, 470 Railroad Club
> <M00209@mbvm.mitre.org>

-- 
===========================================================================

Dave 'The Rave' Kantor     "I'm gonna call myself on the phone someday and
dkantor@s55.prime.com       tell myself to shutup." - Miles Davis

I support the Knicks and anyone who's playing against the Celtics...
===========================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: chuck@nimbus.drexel.edu (Wombozni Klik)
Subject: Re: MBTA Expands Commuter Rail Service
Organization: Drexel University Department of Physics
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 14:41:13 GMT
X-Posted-From: nimbus.physics.drexel.edu
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu


Commuter rail may be expanding all over the place, but not in Philly.
SEPTA started this week convening public hearings on cutting out most
weekend rail service on the regional rail lines, and chunks of
off-peak service as well. This isn't exactly an idea with wide public
support. 

I have a question for all you other cities with expanding rail service
- what kind of press or advertising is the new service getting? SEPTA
spends nil on attracting potential passengers, through TV or radio, or
in print...

Chuck

Chuck Browne
Drexel University Department of Physics
chuck@convex.physics.drexel.edu
From: dtyler%jt_home.uucp@amber.athena.lkg.dec.com (David Tyler)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Reqest
Summary: reqest
Keywords: Reqest
Date: 22 Aug 92 01:20:26 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Totally Disorganized..

Please ignore any post from this end that seems rude or offensive, That
last post was quite a mistake. (not the DRG&W post).

Can anybody give some info. on the "Ware River Branch" of the Boston&Maine?
(Now Guilford).  Any tapes about the subject around?, info. would be much
welcomed.

(Seen In Boston "No. End" get it?) 

David M. Tyler.........Go Devils!
From: dp2r+@andrew.cmu.edu (Denise Pullen)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Rail photos ... where do I ...
Date: 2 Sep 92 04:24:48 GMT
Organization: Drama, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.rec.railroad: 1-Sep-92 Rail photos ... where do I
... by RICHARD F. JONES@alpha.s 
> But I do not know where or how to do such a thing ... so hence this 
> posting.   If you know of any magazine/publication/etc that would 
> perhaps be interrested in seeing some of my photos, please let me know 
> the name/address/phone and a contact person (if known).  

I suggest that you pick up a copy of Trains Magazine. If you don't have
access to it you can send either color slides or 8x10 glossy b&w or
color prints with borders to:

Trains Magazine
Kalmbach Publishing Co.
21027 Crossroads Circle
P.O. Box 1612
Waukesha, WI 53187


They suggest that you only send a maximum of 10 at a time and include a
description of each photo as well as place you name and address on each
one. They will pay for publication.

-D-
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: daniel.lee.van.epps@um.cc.umich.edu (Daniel Van Epps)
Subject: W&LE Zoarville station arsoned
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 19:10:11 EDT
Organization: EECS @ Univ. of Michigan

Maybe this has been written about already, but while on vacation back
home, the old W&LE station at Zoarville, OH, was torched by arsonists. 
A note that many barns are also being burned in the area.  The station
was located just west of Rt. 800 and the W&LE overpass and had a nice
rural Victorian design.  From walking around it at night, I noticed the old
branch of the PRR (from Mineral City-Dover) crossed the W&LE close by, &
they forgot to tear out a signal when they abandoned it.  Another loss.

-dlve
 
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: pierson@empror.enet.dec.com (dave pierson)
Subject: Re: RRs in highway ROWs
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Distribution: na
Date:  3 SEP 92 08:11:32    

In article <5299@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>, jbcst+@pitt.edu (John B Coxey)
writes, in part:

>   Just wondering,  if you have an elevated system,  how do you keep
>from hitting it with automobiles (in an emergency situation)?

	You don't.  Its a problem.  The possibility of a crash on either mode
	leading to problems for the other is nontrivial.  In the case of the
	Washington DC Metro, where it shares RoW with existing rail lines a
	crash sensor is built into the fencing (its the thick black cable).

	This will (in theory) inform the metro signalling of an intrusion and
	set the signals/train control to stop.  (I got this info years ago, on
	an NRHS trip on the METRO when it was younger.)  I vaguely recall
	similar precautions in Boston on the Orange line extension, but am NOT
	sure.  I do no know if the DC system informs the RR signalling system
	of the intrusion.

>     I'm thinking about the PA-TPK.  Seems like there is a serious wreck
>on there every week.  Just about every time I've been on there, I've
>seen a wreck, or new evidence of one.

	Something similar ought, IMO, to be included in shared RoW situations.

thanks
dave pierson			|the facts, as accurately as i can manage,
Digital Equipment Corporation	|the opinions, my own.
146 Main St			|I am the NRA.
Maynard, Mass	
01754				pierson@majsty.enet.dec.com
"He has read everything, and, to his credit, written nothing."  A J Raffles
From: R.Todd.Minsk@dartmouth.edu (R. Todd Minsk)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: NYC subway track connections (was Re: Old cars never die, they 
 just....
Date: 1 Sep 92 23:28:41 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <1992Aug27.022332.26804@panix.com>
dfl@panix.com (Danny O'Bedlam) writes:

> Great Story John !  never heard that one before, but its convincing to
> my ears.  Incidentally a few years ago when NYCTA rehabbed the 207th st
> shop, a connection was built to the Bway line near 215th St station,
> providing another significant link between the A and B divisions.

If I'm not mistaken, there is another connection between the IRT (4)
and the IND (D) somewhere between Yankee Stadium and Woodlawn.
Newsgroups: rec.railroad,sci.physics
From: roma@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Roma)
Subject: Re: Photo of grade-crossing accident
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 00:06:17 GMT

babb@rapnet.sanders.lockheed.com (Scott Babb) writes:

>40 metric tons is a mildly overloaded tractor-trailer!  I've seen many
>coal train cars that specify loaded weights in the 100 metric ton range.

>If idiot "B" were to stand in the path of one of our local coal trains,
>the he would be attempting to defy a mass more in the 10000 metric ton
>range.

Don't forget that the 100-ton figure applies to the car capacity -- there
is also the car's tare weight to be considered.  The typical empty weight
for this type of car is about 20-30 tons.  Thus, a 100-car train of 100-ton
hoppers would weigh an average of 12500 tons.  This equates to about 13778
metric tonnes.
-- 
Jon Roma
Computing and Communications Services Office,
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Internet:  roma@uiuc.edu      	UUCP:      uunet!uiucuxc!uiuc.edu!roma
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: stev@vax.ftp.com  (stev knowles)
Subject: Re: F7 in Watseka, IL
Nntp-Software: PC/TCP NNTP
Organization: FTP Software, Inc., Wakefield, MA
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 15:28:42

In article <1992Aug31.161106.2956@bradley.bradley.edu> casey@bradley.bradley.edu (Chris Langston) writes:

>In <BtpKxu.14s@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> larsenp@mace.cc.purdue.edu (Paul Larsen) writes:
>
>>On my way back from a Colorado vacation, I drove through Watseka, IL.
>>Just visible between some buildings was an F7 sitting on the UP/TP&W
>
>The loco was purchased by the new TP&W and will be sent to be rebuilt and 
>repainted in the New York Central Lighting stripe paint scheam. It will be


geesh, there has been alot of movement on F7's recently. i recall reading
that UP was sending a F7 ABA set to be refurbished for exec train use . . .
 .
From: lip@s1.gov (Loren I. Petrich)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Old cars never die, they just....
Date: 26 Aug 92 14:29:49 GMT
Organization: LLNL

In article <1992Aug26.083648.42566@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> richard@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>In article <25757@dog.ee.lbl.gov>, b_nbca@icarus.lbl.gov (Bruce Nordman) writes:
:A few years ago, a friend's uncle had a contract with the Santa Fe to wreck
:surplus freight cars and cabooses in Topeka.  We visited his operation one
:time.

:His contract specified that he cut the undercarriage out, return it to ATSF,
:and do whatever he wanted with the rest.  Typically, he could sell the
:cabooses, and would deliver them on a flatbed truck.  As for most of the
:boxcars, he would burn out the wooden interiors, cut the rest up with a torch,
:and sell the scrap steel.

	I guess the cabooses become mobile homes :-)

:He would also sell you a complete (minus the undercarriage) boxcar to use for a
:farm shed.  To my untrained eye, these cars appeared to be in great shape --
:made me wonder why they were being wrecked.  I seriously considered having one
:delivered, but I didn't really have room on my lot here in the city.  Would
:have made a great storage building, though.

	Why get rid of the boxcars?

	My guess as to the answer is apparent after watching several
freight trains recently. A big railroad growth industry has been
container freight, where one carries big boxes on flatcars. Like
containerized shipping, this saves a lot of time in loading and
unloading; one does not have to tie up the ship or the cars with
loading lots of little boxes (or other items) -- only a much smaller
number of bigger ones. Piggyback carrying of truck trailers has been
another growth industry. I would guess that the undercarriages will
be used as sources of parts for new railcars, such as the
aforementioned flatcars.
From: burke@doright.Tymnet.COM (John Burke)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: re: NYC subway track connections (was Re: Old cars never die, they just ...
Date: 3 Sep 92 00:46:09 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: BT North America (Tymnet)

Joe.Russ@mixcom.mixcom.com (Joe.Russ) writes:

> dfl@panix.com (Danny O'Bedlam) writes:
 ...
> > my ears.  Incidentally a few years ago when NYCTA rehabbed the 207th st
> > shop, a connection was built to the Bway line near 215th St station,
> > providing another significant link between the A and B divisions.
> 
> If I'm not mistaken, there is another connection between the IRT (4)
> and the IND (D) somewhere between Yankee Stadium and Woodlawn.

You are right, Joe: that's what I meant to indicate (but didn't spell
out) in my posting
of Fischler's story about saving the Lo-V's, when I talked about
them sneaking trains through the Jerome Ave. yard.  The yard is right
west of the Bedford Park Blvd. station on the Jerome Ave. (4) line,
with track connections both north and south of the station into the
yard, it appears, in a couple of aerial photographs I have of that
area.  In those photos you can clearly see lots of IND/BMT (woops, I
mean "B division") trains laid up in the yard, so it obviously is
connected to the Grand Concourse line (D, C), since those cars cannot
get there via an IRT el.

__________________________________________=
    _    __=======================__      /  
   |8|   |III  HHHHH III HHHHH  III|     |   My employer doesn't give
    |    ||_|________|_|________|_||     |   a *** about my opinions
___| |___=`O"-"0' `-=====-' `O"-"O'=________ on trains.
 " '^` "  "  "  "  "  "  "  "  "  "  "  "  "
burke@hobbes.Tymnet.COM  (John Burke)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: dfl@panix.com (Danny O'Bedlam)
Subject: Re: Old cars never die, they just....
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 02:23:32 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Panix, (New Yawk City)

Great Story John !  never heard that one before, but its convincing to
my ears.  Incidentally a few years ago when NYCTA rehabbed the 207th st
shop, a connection was built to the Bway line near 215th St station,
providing another significant link between the A and B divisions.
-- 
***********************************************************************
* Danny O'Bedlam  = dfl@panix.com = cmcl2!panix!dfl = Danny Lieberman *
* PO Box 3131 Church St Station, New Yawk, New Yawk, 10008-3131 (usa) *
***********************************************************************
From: hawesgb@ucbeh.san.uc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Stream trip
Date: 4 Sep 92 08:22:37 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: Univ. of Cincinnati

Two great train trips with steam !!!!!!!

Cincinnati to Muncie Ind.
Sept 19

Cincinnati to Danville KY. with a highlight of passing over High Bridge.
Sept. 20 

Steam:
Norfolk & Western #611 4-8-4
For tickets or info call 513-651-RAIL Cincinnati Railroad Club.

Cost:
$64.00 for Saturdays trip.
$64.00 for Sundays trip. Both are round trips 
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: cal@ee.ryerson.ca (Calvin Henry-Cotnam)
Subject: Re: Signal type (was: Re: Semaphore Signals)
Organization: Ryerson Polytechnical Institute, Toronto
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 16:05:30 GMT

In article <Bts4IF.Cw0@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> roma@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Roma) writes:
>My experience seems to
>indicate that all Canadian signals are numbered, whether absolute or
>permissive.
>-- 


This is true, and therefore the reason to use the "A" on signals
that are usually permissive.


Calvin Henry-Cotnam, CATE            |    MY CANADA INCLUDES CANADIANS!
Ryerson Polytechnical Institute      | I would really like this to include
Toronto, Ontario, Canada             | Quebec - but I won't hold my breath.
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: dave@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Dave Rasmussen)
Subject: SFO airport to Davis?
Originator: dave@opus.csd.uwm.edu
Organization: UW-Milwaukee Computing Services Division
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 17:09:38 GMT

I need some advice from transit people in the SFO/Sacramento corridor.
I need to connect from SFO airport to Davis. 

The obvious easy solution is to rent a car (I've reserved with Alamo
for $24.99 a day for 4 days. This is my backup, but I'd rather use transit.)

My flight to SFO arrives Nov 5 at 21:10 if on time. This rules out
connecting with #14 at Oakland.  What would you recommend I do to get
to Davis by transit after say 21:30 from SFO airport?

On the way back I leave SFO at 12:50, so I would be inclined to take
#721 from davis to Oakland and hope Amtrak still has a shuttle to Caltrain.
Some old notes indicate that there is a samtrans bus
that leaves the Millbrae Caltrain station for the airport?

Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: campbell@redsox.bsw.com (Larry Campbell)
Subject: Re: more on Amtrak's purchase of NY GPO
Organization: The Boston Software Works, Inc.
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 03:56:11 GMT


In article <1992Sep1.211900.12165@panix.com>, dfl@panix.com (Danny O'Bedlam) writes:
> 
> 	the plan for light rail across 42nd street is still in planning,
> and still a go, from what I hear.  and yes, having this LRT line connect
> with the JAVITS CONVENTION CENTER has been suggested.

Is this to be a surface line, or a subway?  If surface,
is the entire width of the street to be closed to auto
traffic?
-- 
Larry Campbell             The Boston Software Works, Inc., 120 Fulton Street
campbell@redsox.bsw.com    Boston, Massachusetts 02109 (USA)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: jon@shell.com
Subject: Re: TRIP REPORT NEW HAMPSHIRE
Originator: jon@spjerint
Organization: Shell Oil
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 14:50:47 GMT

>|> I find it interesting that you list all the steam locomotives,
>|> but do not make any mention of their diesels which are now
>|> just as historic.  Could it be that train fans, myself
>|> included, are still a bit contemptous of diesels?
>|> This is a topic for discussion.  How do fans feel about
>|> early diesels preserved by clubs and museums?
>
>My interest in trains lies mainly in steam.  Personally, I feel steam
>engines have much more class and character than their diesel counterparts.

I like steamers, too.  I'll go out of my way to see or ride one.  But I
think the diesels are interesting, too.  Steamers having more class and
character? well maybe.  Diesels are certainly more elegant.  After
recently having a close look at UP 3985, a friend commented that it
looked like the result of 50 years of hacking in steel.  Maybe 100
years is more like it, but I think his comment is about right.  For
instance, the engineer kept venting steam and water from a vent on the
left side, between the two sets of drivers.  We looked closely, and it
appeared that it was venting (draining?) the smokebox.  Now, this is a
loooong loco.  The engineer had a handle he turned back in the cab,
that was connected to a valve on the smokebox via a long, multi segment
(with u-joints) shaft.  The valve works on the smokebox leaked like a
sieve, and water and steam poured out of it.  A long pipe, with no
small number of twists and turns, worked its way back from this valve
to the vent between the two sets of drivers.  Since we call it spagetti
code, I guess this would be spagetti steel.

I do like the steamers, and this monster was VERY impressive.  But,
its easy to see why they couldn't compete with the diesels.

Jon Holdman, jon@shell.com
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: eoliver@laurel.ocs.mq.edu.au (Eddie Oliver)
Subject: Re: Signal type (was: Re: Semaphore Signals)
Organization: Macquarie University, Australia.
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 08:29:42 GMT

The use of fixed warning signals (in the circumstances described in various
recent postings) is just part of a broader use of such devices.

Many parts of the world have long had "fixed distants", i.e. signals
in a position where a distant signal would normally be but where it is
decided that a variable indication is not required. 

The tradition of using a normal signal arm fixed at caution gradually evolved
into many other forms of equivalent warning, e.g. specially shaped symbols
(often triangles for some reason) and location boards bearing the name of
the impending area where caution is required.

(For American readers, you'd probably prefer that I said "fixed at approach"
instead of "fixed at caution" - that's one of many differences in signalling
terminology between  British/Australian and US/Canadian practices! Maybe we
should start a tabulation for general reference ... ?)

Eddie Oliver
From: adrian@ntmtv.UUCP (Adrian Brandt)
Subject: RE: advice on scanners wanted
Organization: Northern Telecom Inc, Mountain View, CA
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 20:03:19 GMT

In article <01SEP92.14194487.0087@VM1.MCGILL.CA>, CZ94000 <CZ94@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA> writes:
|> If no one has responded yet, what are you waiting for?  I know
|> from reading rec.railroad that many of you use scanners for
|> railfanning.  We'd be grateful if you would share your knowledge
|> on this subject.

You might like to give alt.radio.scanner a try.

I don't think there is much specfic to railroad scanning that sets
it apart from a general "what's a good scanner question".

I'll mention a few things that come to mind.

Since I think most railroad (like 99%) radio frequencies are
in the 160 to 162 MHz range, you should be sure that the scanner
can receive frequecies in that band (usually called VHF-Hi) well.
I can't think of a general purpose scanner that doesn't cover these
freqs., so look for ones with the highest sensitivty in this
frequency range.  The lower the number (usually expressed uV: e.g:
0.5uV), the better the sensitivity.  This will determine how weak
of a signal you'll be able to listen to.  Railroad radio signal strengths,
especially of radios in the field (portables and talking trackside
detectors) tend to be quite weak.

-- 

Adrian Brandt (415) 940-2379
UUCP: ...!ames!ntmtv!adrian
ARPA: ntmtv!adrian@ames.arc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: rec.railroad