From: traub@btcs.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg,alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Between the Fats/Oils or are all fats evil?
Date: 12 Aug 92 11:09:58 GMT
Organization: BT Customer Systems, Brighton, UK

I have addressed two message at once here, sorry for any resulting confusion!

In article <ELI.92Aug11113132@regal.cisco.com> eli@cisco.com (Steve Elias) writes:
>In article <1992Aug11.173035.12543@cs.ucla.edu> tiff@oahu.cs.ucla.edu (Tiffany Frazier) writes:
>   traub@rtf.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub) writes:
>   : Actually all the available research seems to indicate that for a *vegan*
>   : a *typical* (i.e. low percentage of saturates) high fat diet has no
>   : nastier side effect than excess calories (and the general problems
>   : of obesity).
>
>for a vegan with propensity for high triglycerides/cholesterol, 
>your statement is incorrect, imho.

Maybe I should have said a *typical* vegan. There are obviously going to
be some people where the above statement does not apply.

>i suspect that you could
>actually not find much "available research" in that area, though
>i would be most interested if you could point me at some of the 
>available research you refer to, as i am about to learn if <20% 
>calsfromfat diet has lowered my blood lipids/cholesterol.

>   since MacDougall happens to be laying around my office, we have a quote
>   (with cites): "All fats - saturated and unsaturated - are involved in the
>   growth of certain kinds of cancer cells.  ... What's worse, the unsaturated
>   fats in such highly touted vegetable oils as corn oil, safflower oil, and
>   olive oil, and the margarines made from them, are the fats that most promote
>   the growth of cancer....[ paraphrased: and while saturated fats are bad for
>   arteries and heart.]"

Try 'Vegan Nutrition, A Survey of Research' by Gill Langley. He
sites the NACNE and COMA reports recommending less than 30-35%
fat by calories, with less than 10% saturated. The book contains
various references to fat and disease and indicates the average
vegan intake of fat by calories is around 34%. The book states
that womb, breast and gallbladder cancers are related to *obesity*
rather than fat intake per se. You may notice I did mention obesity
in my original statement. One should not confuse fat intake and
obesity, even though excess fat intake may lead to obesity. This
book also makes 19 references to other research in the fat section
*alone*. This book is a must!

I must say that MacDougall's statement about vegetable oils sounds
pretty all encompassing, and here you are having a go at my statements!
I have seen *many* works stating the advantages of linoleic acid.

>   : What I am trying to say is that for vegans I don't think fat is an issue.
>   : (Saying that I start my week long fast today due to excess fat intake
>   : while staying at home playing dad).
>
>what i'm trying to say is that i think your statement is incorrect.
>blanket statements are usually incorrect, ya know.

>   One may not agree with MacDougall's (& Pritikin, Ornish) 10% fat in diet
>   arguments and I don't want to start any long argument here ... but I do
>   want to counterbalance a statement that seemed much too strong.

Well it wasn't actually intended to be a blanket statement, more
like a cotton sheet, it is summer after all:->

>week long fast?  BOGUS.  not a healthy way to lose weight or diet,
>in my humble opinion.  keep eating, just don't eat fats, silly!

Silly nothing! Try reading 'Successful Fasting' by Dr Hellmut Lutzner.


-- 
Michael Traub