HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: vic@cd.com (Vic Serbe)
Subject: Re: Anyone out there successfully get a 14.4K modem running on a Sun?
Organization: Central Data Corp., Champaign, IL
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 15:41:28 GMT

In article <EJH.92Dec14093418@khonshu.colorado.edu> ejh@khonshu.colorado.edu (Edward J. Hartnett) writes:
>
>I have been in the market for some high speed modems for me and my
>boss to be able to dial in from home or from the road to our Sun IPC.
>There has been a little talk on the net that the sun can't handle the
>throughput in the serial port due to stupid Sun problems with hardware
>flow control, which can be fixed, but only at a high price.
>
>Before I tell my boss to get ready to write (another) big check to
>Sun, can anyone who has successfully implemented a high speed modem on
>his or her Sun (I have an IPC, but I'd be interested in hearing about
>any sun), please post a brief summary of the solution you used?

Our scsiTerminal Server has properly implemented bi-directional hardware
flow control for this exact reason, and is what I've been using to run a
few different V.32bis modems for quite some time now. Rather than post
data sheets-n-stuff here, why don't you send me email if you want details
on our products. They are local ports to the sun (NOT ptty's), and support
baud rates up to 57.6K.
 
Also, anyone else seeing this posting is also welcome to email, call, or
FAX inquiries in. We also have a VAR program, an educational discount, and
quantity discounts.

>Thanks in advance.
>--
>	Don't blame me, I voted against Amendment 2!
>
>Edward Hartnett				ejh@khonshu.colorado.edu
>

--
Vic Serbe       "Makers of the scsiTerminal Server."
Central Data scsiSupport | PH# (800) 482-0315 x237    |
vic@cd.com               |     +1 (217) 359-8010 x237 |
uunet!cd.com!vics        | FAX +1 (217) 359-6904      |
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: Supra to Tbit hi-speed conn????
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 00:43:31 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <BzGKyL.BH2@news.rn.com> larry@news.rn.com (Larry Snyder) writes:
>What is (are) the difference(s) between the Trailblazer and the T-Plus
>besides a black verse off-white case?

Actually, even that's not a reliable difference.  Early TB+s had the black
case (and in my opinion, are the better for it... for one thing, the old
case is essentially rainproof... and if you think that's not important
for a modem, well, neither did we until it rained in our machine room
recently... various things were damaged, but the TB+s, directly under
some of the biggest drips, didn't even drop their UUCP connections until
we killed power.)
-- 
"God willing... we shall return."       | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
       -Gene Cernan, the Moon, Dec 1972 |  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems,biz.sco.general,biz.sco.opendesktop,comp.unix.sysv386,alt.bbs.unixbbs
From: larry@news.rn.com (Larry Snyder)
Subject: Re: Trouble with FLOW CONTROL and FAS and rzsz
Keywords: modem fas flow usr courier sco odt
Organization: Gator Communications - Feeds-R-Us 219-289-3745 
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 17:22:01 GMT

dlucy@sandr.COM (Doug Lucy) writes:

>The troubles start with using Foresburg's rzsz programs. We use XBBS to
>run (actually test) a small BBS. It appears to work fine, but gets
>bogged down after the first 10k or so of a Zmodem or Ymodem upload or
>download. XBBS runs rz or sz to accomplish this. 

sounds like you are not actually using hardware flow control. 
hardware flow control needs to be enabled in the modems as well
as the driver (kernel).  Here is our HST setup on our server

USRobotics Courier 16800 HST Dual Standard Fax NVRAM Settings...

   DIAL=PULSE  B0  F1  M1  X1
   BAUD=57600  PARITY=N  WORDLEN=8

   &A1  &B1  &G0  &H1  &I0  &K1  &L0  &M4
   &N0  &P0  &R1  &S0  &T5  &X0  &Y1  %R0

   S02=043  S03=013  S04=010  S05=008  S06=002  S07=060
   S08=002  S09=006  S10=007  S11=070  S12=050  S13=001
   S15=000  S19=005  S21=010  S22=017  S23=019  S24=150
   S25=005  S26=001  S27=000  S28=008  S29=020  S32=001
   S33=000  S34=000  S35=000  S36=000  S37=000  S38=000
   S41=000  S42=126  S43=200  S44=015

   STORED PHONE #0: 
                #1: 
                #2: 
                #3: 
                 C:

here is /etc/gettydefs:

HST# B57600 HUPCL OPOST ONLCR TAB3 BRKINT IGNPAR IXON -IXANY ISTRIP ECHO ECHOE ECHOK ICANON ISIG CS8 CREAD # B57600 HUPCL OPOST ONLCR TAB3 BRKINT IGNPAR IXON -IXANY ISTRIP ECHO ECHOE ECHOK ICANON ISIG CS8 CREAD #login: #HST

here is /etc/inittab:

Ca07:23:respawn:/etc/getty -r -t 30 /dev/term/b07m HST
Ca08:23:respawn:/etc/getty -r -t 30 /dev/term/b08m HST
Ca09:23:respawn:/etc/getty -r -t 30 /dev/term/b09m HST
Ca10:23:respawn:/etc/getty -r -t 30 /dev/term/b10m HST

here is /etc/uucp/Dialers:


HSTslow =,-, "" AT&M0&K0&I0&N&H0E0Q0V1X1\r\c OK\r ATDP\T\r\c 2400 \r\m\c\d

HSTfast =,-, "" ATS7=90S27=16B0E0Q0V1X1&M4&S1&R1&H1\r\c OK\r ATDP\T\r\c CONNECT \r\m\c\d

here is /etc/uucp/Devices:


HST /dev/term/b07s,M - 2400 HSTslow
HST /dev/term/b07s,M - 57600 HSTfast
HST /dev/term/b08s,M - 2400 HSTslow
HST /dev/term/b08s,M - 57600 HSTfast
HST /dev/term/b09s,M - 2400 HSTslow
HST /dev/term/b09s,M - 57600 HSTfast
HST /dev/term/b10s,M - 2400 HSTslow
HST /dev/term/b10s,M - 57600 HSTfast
-- 
Larry Snyder                                    internet: larry@gator.rn.com
keeper of the Gator                                  uucp: uunet!gator!larry
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: chelf@lunatix.uucp (Chad Helfenberger)
Subject: Re: zoom 14.4
Organization: Lexington Public Access Unix. -KY- (606) 255-9121
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 22:02:40 GMT

>In article <1992Dec15.144034.27677@ns.network.com> gally@barsoom.network.com (Jerry Gally) writes:
>>A few weeks back I bought a Zoom 14.4 v.32bis faxmodem. I was at first quite
>>pleased with its performance, but discovered that 50% of the 2400 baud modems
>>I tried to connect with were not compatible with my Zoom ... I would appear to
>>recieve a continuous stream of garbage from the remote modem after connection.
>>After unsuccessfully dinking with the problem for an extended period,
>>I decided to contact Zoom for a resolution. 
>>After dialing the Zoom technical service line repetitively (i.e. at least 50 times) for over 1/2 hour and only getting busy signals, I finally managed
>>to get through and immediatly got put on hold (long distance toll call from 
>>Minnesota to Boston) for 45 minutes. I then was basically told that I 
>>probably had a lemon and that I should exchange it.

I have the same problem with my modem (Zoom 14.4 V.32bis NOT a faxmodem).  
Obviously, there is some problem with their implementation of V.22bis.  At 
one point, I had two modems on the m-board; one 2400 and the Zoom.

Several times, I called with my Zoom (a 2400 bps connection), and received 
the same pathetic garbage that you got.  Called back on the 2400 and all was 
clear, so it was obviously not a line noise problem.  It is not a 'lemon'.  
Apparantly, MANY of the Zoom V.32bis types have this problem.  I think Zoom 
is just trying to duck the problem.  Any other comments?


-- 
Chad Helfenberger
(chelf@lunatix.uucp)
From: ajayshah@almaak.usc.edu (Ajay Shah)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Practical Peripherals (modems and fax-modems) ?
Date: 17 Dec 1992 14:34:06 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: almaak.usc.edu

I'm shopping for modems to use with Suns, and it looks like
PP has a good price edge over the others.  Is there a catch?

I'm looking at the 9600 baud "standalone" modem.

Does their 14400 fax/modem work well with the free fax software?

        -ans.
-- 
Ajay Shah, (213)749-8133, ajayshah@rcf.usc.edu
Organization: Hidden - I don't speak for them...
X-Stuff:      <This should be witty, but I'm too tired right now.>
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 10:21:45 EST
From: David B. Horvath, CDP <MBADBH@rohvm1.rohmhaas.com>
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject:    Digicom Eagle+ / DOSFAX Lite software

Does anyone know of a good substitute for DOSFAX Lite by Delrina?  I got a
copy of it with my Eagle+, but the software keeps hanging during a send
via the capture function.  If I use the FAX Administrator, it seems to work
properly.

I called Digicom's tech support and other people with a similar configuration
have reported problems.

    - David
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: engp2116@nuscc.nus.sg (Rainer Bachl)
Subject: BEST modem V32bis,V42bis
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 06:25:04 GMT

Hi all users of the >>BEST<< 1496EC modem,	

have you also got problems with this modem ? My modem still cannot
recognize certain signalling tones in Singapore, e.g. no BUSY and
sometimes the modem fails to recognize a successfull connection.
The firmware is version V1.09 and V1.3 (hope I got it right).	
Maybe we can share our experiences ?

Please email at engp2116@nuscc.nus.sg

P.S. BEST is a taiwanese company offering their fax-modems which can
     handle V32bis, V42bis in Singapore for roughly 375 US $.

 
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: vrv@cimage.com (Victor Volkman)
Subject: Sysop Modem Discount Report #18 Available
Organization: Cimage Corp, Ann Arbor, MI
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 16:53:10 GMT


            Sysops Modem Sale Programs -- SYSMOD18.ZIP -- 09-DEC-92
                Straight Talk About Modems For Sysops Since 1991

    [INTRODUCTION]

         You may have heard that various modem manufacturers offer
    discounts on high-speed modems to qualified sysops.  However, you will
    soon find yourself chasing down every BBS in the country trying to get
    all the details.  When you get the details, you still have to sort
    through and find out who really has the best deal.  Since I've spent a
    couple years doing this for myself, I figured other people would like
    to save the time and trouble as well.  I've been a Sysop since 1988
    and would like to help anyone else along that I can!

    [HOW TO GET SYSMOD18.ZIP]

    HAL 9000 BBS:  (313)663-4173  1200/2400/9600/14400 v.32bis
                   (313)663-3959  1200/2400/9600/14400 v.32bis

    ftp:           pinto.cimage.com (or 139.171.201.125)
                   latest version in /pub directory
From: jiml@psg.com (Jim Long)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: Interesting phenomena with ZyXel U-1496E+
Date: 17 Dec 92 16:38:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: psg.1992Dec17.163839.19486
Organization: Pacific Systems Group, Portland Oregon US

In article <TOM.92Dec17075724@amber.ssd.csd.harris.com> tom@ssd.csd.harris.com (Tom Horsley) writes:
>I have a program which dials up the NIST computer time number and sets my
>computer's time. The way the NIST system works, you echo the characters it
>sends you, and NIST computes round trip delay times, flagging the time once
>it gets a consistent set of round trip delays (by changing a '*' to a '#' in
>the line it prints).
>
>When attempting to run this program with my new ZyXel U-1496E+, NIST never
>gets consistent round trip delay times (this is all at 1200 bps).
>

I see the same behaviour here (with my E+).  I contacted Life Sciences 
Software (are you running TIMESET 6.0?) and found that if I _do not_ use
the line delay adjustment (B instead of Alt-B), it works.  So I have
sacrificed a little bit of accuracy, but at least now it does work.
-- 
uunet!m2xenix!jiml  or  jiml@m2xenix.psg.com
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Distribution: world
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 10:59:06 -0800
From: Zero_One@p101.f701.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Subject: ZyXEL 19.2k question
Comment-To: Lars_Poulsen@p101.f701.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Reply-To: Zero_One@p101.f701.n202.z1.fidonet.org
X-FSC-PATH: 202/701

 > In a message of <Dec 09 13:55>, Paul Levin (1:105/7) writes:
 >> PL>Not only is the 19.2Kbps useless unless you are talking with
another
 >> PL>ZyXel, so is the 16.8Kbps.  USR also has a 16.8Kbps which is
useless
 >> PL>unless it is talking with another USR.

 > In article <724092191.AA00000@therose.pdx.com>
 >    Jim.Long@p1.f48.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Jim Long) writes:
 > Jim>Heck, V.32bis is useless unless you're talking to another
V.32bis modem.
 >
 > Jim>English is useless unless you're speaking to another
English-speaking
 > Jim>person. And even then....

 >> PL>The difference is that ZyXel has given out
 >> PL>it's 16.8 technology to Rockwell International (so I'm told)

 > Jim>My understanding is that _anyone_ that wants it can have it.
 > Jim>In my uneducated opinion, Rockwell is perhaps one of the least
 > Jim>likely to do anything with it (of their own volitiion).

 >     I don't work for the Rockwell modem group; but I do _use_
 > Rockwell
 >     based V.32bis modems in a big way.

 >     My impression from the rumors that I hear (some of them in
 >     comp.dcom.modems) is that because everybody is pushing to have
 > their
 >     own "fast" extensions included in the V.fast spec, we may well
 > see
 >     a spec with many incompatible encodings to choose from, and a
 >     startup handshake that determines which ones are common to the
 > two
 >     modems. Sort of like the relationship of MNP5 and LSW in
 > V.42bis.
 >     Determining the "best shared protocol" taking into
 > consideration the
 >     line characteristics will be very tricky, and I would expect
 > many
 >     problems like "why do my ZyXEL V.fast and my USR V.fast only
 >     communicate at 9600 bps when my line is clearly capable of
 > doing
 >     28.8 as evidenced when I put two UDS modems on the same port ?
 >     The UDS will do 24.4 with both the ZyXEL and the USR ?"

 >     In this situation, a company improves its own position to get
 > the
 >     competitors to implement its optional V.fast dialect.

 >     If this is how V.fast gets written, the users will not be well
 >     served.
Lars,

Our 19.2 has nothing to do with v.fast.

Tyrone Horton
(Zero One)
Tech Support
ZyXEL USA

--- FMail 0.92
 * Origin: ZyXEL USA (1:202/701.101)
From: Vijay_Anand@transarc.com
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: ZyXel FAQ yet?
Date: 14 Dec 92 07:04:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: transarc.sf==uAf0BwwqQboFsQ
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X-To: comp.dcom.modems.usenet


Looking at the interest in ZyXel 1496E and E+ modems in this newsgroup,
would it be a good idea to write up a FAQ for 

1. where to buy ZyXel's
2. How to configure a ZyXel to send/receive fax/voice
3. How to configure a ZyXel to answer incoming modem/fax/voice automagically.
4. Third party software that work with ZyXel modem/fax/voice, and how to
set these up
5. Info about the latest ROM upgrades, what features implemented, bugs
fixed, how and
where to get them.
6. Miscellaneous hardware/software hacking for the ZyXel

I'm very much interested in such a FAQ or a mailing list. I faced lots
of problems setting up these features, and it would be nice to have a
FAQ to help newbees. Sometime ago I saw a post by someone who was
writing some software to handle the ZyXel's features. Sorry, I didn't
hold on to the mailing address. I would like to hear opinions on a FAQ
or mailing list from people doing such work, and people interested in
hearing them.

Thanks,
Vijay
vijay+@transarc.com
From: dhunt@infocom.UUCP (David Hunt)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Hayes Smartmodem 1200B Card
Date: 14 Dec 92 21:20:01 GMT
Organization: INFOCOM Public Unix Server, +44 [0] 734 340055
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]


Hello Netters,

I have a Hayes Smartmodem 1200B Card and was wondering if anybody could help 
out with switch settings, the board has the following dip & jumpers

dip switch (with CT3 3 on it) and S1, S2, S3 as the switch labels

I can only find one place with a jumper on it ("P2") with the markings 
'A'/'B'/'C'

Can you tell me what possible configurations are possible (I know there are 
quite a few) but ones letting me set it up as COM1 or COM2 should do nicely

To save on bandwidth, please EMAIL, will summarize if useful to net.

p.s. I know this is an old modem, but may be useful to a child (especially 
     if it is FREE)

Merry Christmas & a very Happy new year
--
dhunt
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: steve@mark-one.inet-uk.co.uk (Steve Parkinson)
Subject: Supra-supra modem problems
Organization: Mark-One Public Access UNIX (+44 942 273926)
Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1992 22:07:57 GMT


 
My friend and I both have Supra V32bis faxmodems, with v1.200-H ROMS. We don't generally have problems logging onto other boards, only when we try and connect to each other. Here's what happens:
 
We both set port speed to 19200. (+ RTS/CTS) We've also tried it with much higher baud rates.
 
1) We both do AT&F2, then one dials the other. 2) Phone rings, ATA to pick it up. 3) Carrier cycles around - locks on. 4) CD in LED display, but no CONNECT string yet 5) LOADS of garbage from modem. 6) either drops the line, or hangs
 
OK - so I think - maybe it's the compression/correction negotiations which is causing this garbage
 
I try AT\N%C0
 
1) No effect, still garbage. (but at least we don't get LP or DC in the LED)
 
OK - maybe if I try to limit the connection to 12000 or 9600.
 
1) AT&F2 then ATS37=9 2) THIS DOES NOT WORK. The last few times we tried it, we got '96', '72' then '144' in the window, then the modem dropped, all before I got CONNECT. 3) even with ATN too, to limit the connection to 9600 only, it doesn't work.
 
We often get RT appearing in the LED, which doesn't seem to help at all.
 
I know that a lot of people  have had no trouble with this machine. I have seen many of your at&v dumps, but none worked.
 
I have tried limiting the speeds used with s109, and although this does seem to limit the rates used, it doesn't improve reliability of connection. I've also tried limiting the speed with both s37 and s109 in conjunction, but this doesn't work either.
 
We have, on occasion, got a connection (never above 9600), after about 1/2 hour of trying, but even if we call again straight away, with exactly the same settings, it's no guarantee that it'll work.
 
To try and help me understand the problem, maybe someone can explain the following:
 
a) What exactly is the difference between a RETRAIN and RATE RENEGOTIATION.
 
b) If I do at%g0%e0, should that stop both of the above from being invoked,    and if so, why does it still say RT when I do it?
 
c) What about the commands which start with '-' - do they work? I can't    make them work. I quite wanted to try some.
 
d) Does anyone know if I can use the test modes to asses my situation, and    if so, how?
 
e) Why is Supra's tech support always busy?
 
f) How much are Zyxels, and where can I get one?
 
Thanks a lot.
 
Steve
 

Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: camirkin@athena.mit.edu (Chad A Mirkin)
Subject: Intel Satisfation/400
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 18:47:13 GMT

Hi You All:
I am planning to buy a Intel Satisfation/400 for two reasons. One it has a
UART chip; two it seems to have received good reviews.
There is a 400/E which is an external modem without UART chip and the ability
to distinguish voice calls from fax signals
Reading this conference I hear so many people being less than satisfied 
with many fax-modems that I am having second thoughts about it.
I would appreciate hearing from anyone who owns this fax-modem. Also, is the
Intel software that comes with it, any good?
I understand there is a Canadian company marketing software where a regular
modem can receive and send faxes. Has anyone any info on this?
Thanks for any input.
-Mario Lazzarin
From: geoff@zswamp.UUCP (Geoffrey Welsh)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: FTP Access in CANADA ?
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 22:44:10 EST
Organization: Izot's Swamp

tapc1@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Naamat F. Naom) writes:

> As I have  finished my studies at university and am about to leave for
> Canada, I was wondering if anybody there (Thornhill,Ontario) could give
> me an idea about the methods available to get FTP access and email from
> a PC in the above mentioned area.

   If you're interested in IP connecting your PC, UUNET Canada is based in 
Toronto.  There are a couple of other places to get UUCP connections (price 
generally proportional to service), but I don't know where to go for FTP 
access.

  Geoffrey Welsh, 7 Strath Humber Court, Islington, Ontario, M9A 4C8 Canada
geoff@zswamp.uucp, [xenitec.on.ca|m2xenix.psg.com]!zswamp!geoff (416)258-8467
                Now I've lost everything, I give to you my soul
           And the meaning of all that I believed before escapes me
                  In this world of none, no thing, and no one
                            - Genesis, _Afterglow_
From: jcburt@gatsibm.larc.nasa.gov ()
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: GATEWAY TELEPATH @ $1
Date: 15 Dec 1992 19:26:51 GMT
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: gatsibm.larc.nasa.gov

In article <6939.48.uupcb@uttsbbs.uucp> john.navas@uttsbbs.uucp (John Navas)  writes:
>mrosen@nyx.cs.du.edu (Michael Rosen) writes:
>
> JN> If you will carefully check the ads you will see that the
> JN> TelePath is indeed advertised as a separate product that will
> JN> only be sold to those that purchase or have previously purchased
> JN> a *separate* Gateway computer system (*any* Gateway system).
> JN> That is clearly a per se unlawful tie-in sales practice.
>
> > How is that an unlawful sales practice?  I certainly think it's
> > limiting themselves to the potential customers they could get if
> > they opened up sales to anyone (which they seem to have done,
> > according to your experience).  But I don't see how only selling to
> > existing Gateway owners is unlawful.  I really don't think Zeos or
> > any of these other mail order companies that advertise in Computer
> > Shopper are going to sell me a hard drive or whatever as a separate
> > item.
>
[...stuff deleted...]
>Best regards,
>John
>
>CAVEAT:  I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice.  The above is
>only my understanding as a layman.  Consult your own attorney.
>             

I did check with an attorney...Gateway's action *are* legal...
From: wbe@bbn.com (Winston Edmond)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: ZyXEL problem in Australia
Date: 16 Dec 92 13:07:05
Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman, Inc., Cambridge, MA
NNTP-Posting-Host: crystal.bbn.com
In-reply-to: mlaufer@tartarus.uwa.edu.au's message of 16 Dec 1992 16:13:34 GMT

mlaufer@tartarus.uwa.edu.au (Matthias Laufer) asks:
>... Frequently I encounter a problem when ringing an Australian number.
>... Does anyone know what I can do to solve he problem.

Release notes for v5.04A:

    14. For New Zealand version, correct ring back to be detected as busy
	problem.

It looks like getting the latest version will fix your problem.
 -WBE
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: rorem@bert.eecs.uic.edu (Doug Rorem)
Subject: Re: GATEWAY TELEPATH @ $1
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 23:19:44 GMT

john.navas@uttsbbs.uucp (John Navas) writes:

>jcburt@gatsibm.larc.nasa.gov () writes:

> JN> If the action is lawful, why did Gateway change its practice in
> JN> response to the complaint I filed?  ;-)

FYI.. Gateway isn't the only company that does this.  Drew Kaplan
(aka DAK industries) advertises CD-ROM bundles in his catalogs
separately but has fine print that says you can't buy them unless
you buy a CD-ROM reader as well.