HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kk881595@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (kevin knappmiller)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: Re: "BYTE" review of DV/X
Date: 27 Jul 92 17:02:21 GMT
Reply-To: kk881595@longs.LANCE.ColoState.Edu
Organization: Engineering College, Colorado State University

> >I would like to hear any users comments on what they think of the review of
> >DV/X in this month's BYTE Magazine.
> >
> >But then I don't understand much software pricing at all.  I like
GNU's pricing
> >stucture myself.  I don't mind paying money for good stuff and Borland's
> >educational prices are about right, and Quarterdeck's used to be.
> >
> >Somebody at Quarterdeck seems to be listening, so I wonder if they can give
> >us the low down.  What bright marketing person decided that pissing off your
> >loyal customer base was the best way to make your new product succeed?
> >
> 
> Yup, we're listening.  
dd
> Of course, no one set out to upset "loyal users".  We make software
for IBM type
> PC's, and the majority of them that are networked are networked either via 
> Netware or a LAN BIOS type network.  We included support for that.
> What we (apparently ) DIDN'T realize was how tremendously important and 
> popular a product DVX would be in the Unix world.  There seems to be a 
> massive and voracious appetite for this product in that market and while
> we certainly expected interest there, it may not have been proportional to
> the obvious importance (obvious to us now) of this segment of our market.
> 
> -- Doc Williamson <support@qdeck.com>

When I think about it that's probably why I'm upset.  Where did the
marketing people
think that most of the current X-applications were being run?  How many people
on Netware and LAN BIOS are remotely displaying X?

Most of them don't need DV/X,  have never heard of DV/X or DV in it earlier
incantations or Quarterdeck except maybe QEMM.  I think its the TCP/IP people
who have been drooling over the potential of DV/X for years as you constantly
put the release date back and back, and then when you do release it,
it's in a form
that costs us about 4 times as much to buy as the Netware people, when
in many cases
we are educational institutions and have less money.

It sure looks like Quarterdeck just decided that they needed a more uppercrust
clientele, and decided to dump us po' folk.

I doubt the techies know much about it, but I would bet that someone in upper
management or marketing made a decision that was along those lines.  But
what goes
around comes around, and since they are the ones that probably own a
large fraction
of the QD stock, poetic justice may be occuring.

It's probably still not too late though.  A really magnanimous gesture
might improve
your karma.

Kevin Knappmiller
Solar Lab
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO  80523
(303)491-8215
kk881595@longs.lance.colostate.edu
From: kk881595@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (kevin knappmiller)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: "BYTE" review of DV/X
Date: 21 Jul 92 23:17:09 GMT
Reply-To: kk881595@longs.LANCE.ColoState.Edu
Organization: Engineering College, Colorado State University

I would like to hear any users comments on what they think of the review of
DV/X in this month's BYTE Magazine.

We have been thinking about buying DV/X since they came out with their
upgrade offer, but after reading many of the postings in this newsgroup
have come to the conclusion that it is best to wait.  Many of the issues
addressed in this newsgroup are very significant, especially the overall
cost of the product if one wants to write code or port code.

I thought the article was quite misleading and if that was all I had to
go on, would probably have made a rather expensive mistake.

I really don't understand what Quarterdeck is doing.  In their multi-page
tear out advertisement the only price they quote is the price of the
machine they seem to be recommending one run DV/X on: 
a 25 MHz 386 SX that they say costs under $1000.  Yet to run DV/X
on a network, and buy their software and FTP's software for retail
one is paying about $275+$200+$375=$850 or almost the cost of the
hardware alone.   Now I understand I can get the upgrade and BW-TCP
for a total of $322.50, but the ~$800 price is what someone
will first see when they try to find out
how much DV/X  might cost them to run.  I don't see how that is going
to make a lot of people love Quarterdeck.

But then I don't understand much software pricing at all.  I like GNU's pricing
stucture myself.  I don't mind paying money for good stuff and Borland's
educational prices are about right, and Quarterdeck's used to be.

Somebody at Quarterdeck seems to be listening, so I wonder if they can give
us the low down.  What bright marketing person decided that pissing off your
loyal customer base was the best way to make your new product succeed?

Kevin Knappmiller
Solar Lab
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO  80523
(303)491-8215
kk881595@longs.lance.colostate.edu
From: bodoh@xraylith.wisc.edu (Daniel J. Bodoh)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: Re: dv program similar to mem status
Date: 31 Jul 92 05:15:22 GMT
Organization: Center for X-ray Lithography, UW-Madison

In article <Jul31.023247.60372@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> peters@CS.ColoState.EDU (eric peters) writes:
>hi, i was wondering if there is a program out there somewhere that will
>tell me exactly how much base, EXP and EMS memory each currently open window
>is using.  Memory Status just tells what is left.  thanks

Well, Yes and No.  If you've seen my DVSI package, you know that it
contains a PS program which displays info on each window.  The current
version of DVSI (2.00) does not give info on expanded memory, but the
next version (2.10 - currently in alpha testing stages) will do just
that.  Here's an example screen dump of DVSI 2.10's PS:

HNDL SW TK MAP  TTLk CVk EXPk SYSk ST CPU TIME CPU UT KY NAME
ce1a  ?  1 7f8e 1689 697  992 245  wt 00:13.23   0.0%    DV System Task
c718  1  1 0912  280 216   64   7  sl 02:28:41  43.5% DX DESQview/X Server
c7af  2  1 127a  139 139    0   4  wt 01:35.52   0.0% DW DESQview/X Window Man
cb15  3  1 1ee6  367 367    0   3  pz 03:32.13   1.6% KT Kermit
c8c4  4  1 23ca  623 559   64  12  sl 10:33.60  42.4% BD Big DOS
c934  5  1 1c32   41  41    0   3  wt 16:18.09   9.2% PS DVSI process status
c9a4  6  1 1cf6   26  26    0   3  wt 02:27.90   1.6% MT DVSI memstat
c9fe  7  1 2a66   35  35    0   3  wt 03:20.22   1.6% DF DVSI df

SYSk is the *remaining* system memory in that window.  EXPk is the
amount of expanded mem in use in that window -- note the Big Dos window
is using 64K.  CVk is the conventional mem in use (includes the memory
that the program sees plus some DV overhead), and TTLk = EXPk + CVk.
Note: this screen is subject to change without notice.  I may be putting
more memory info on there before the official release of 2.10.  The ST
column is the status as shown in DV/X's SYSMON (this is not available
for ol' fashioned DV).

DVSI 2.10 will go into beta testing soon, I hope.  Besides this new
PS stuff, there have been some significant improvements  to the print
spooler utilities.  I'll be announcing the beta test here...
-- 
Dan Bodoh                       | U.S. Citizens: For less gov't and more 
Grad Student                    | freedom, vote Libertarian.  FTP think.com 
University of Wisconsin-Madison | pub/libernet for more info.
From: n.margetic@ucl.ac.uk (Nino Margetic)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: BC++ v3.0, MS-Kermit beta 3.12 and DV v2.42/Qemm v6.02
Summary: It doesn't work for me...
Keywords: Problems...
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:41:02 GMT
Reply-To: nino@mph.sm.ucl.ac.uk (Nino Margetic)
Organization: University College London


Hi,

I know that Kermit/DV problems have been going on and off the net for 
quite some time now; but here, the situation is somewhat different. Kermit
and DV work fine together in quite a few combinations (DV + Kermit +
WP51 for DOS + Qedit + List + MSH_200 + some other things), but the
moment I load BC++ v3.0, Kermit refuses to display any characters in
the console mode. I checked that characters are going in and out thru
RS232 (9600bps), but *nothing* is displayed.

Furthermore, I have to load BC++ as the last window, becouse otherwise
it takes over *all* available memory, regardless of the settings in
the PIF file. The minute I exit from BC++, and do 'set port 2' in
Kermit, everything works fine.

N.B. I am *not* using Stealth. I installed the official patches for
BC30 which are on the Simtel (exec,matrix initialization,dpmi loader).
Hardware: 33Mhz 486 + 8Mb RAM + ET4000 (if relevant).

Can anyone give an answer to the above?? Can anyone send me his/hers
PIF for BC++ v3.00??

TIA.
--
Janet: n.margetic@uk.ac.ucl                \     Nino Margetic         
Earn/Bitnet/Internet: n.margetic@ucl.ac.uk  \    University College London, UK
Bang: ...!mcvax!uknet!ucl!n.margetic         \   +44 71 387 9300 /x 53 13
From: tjmeyer@acsu.buffalo.edu (Thomas J. Meyer)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: Scaled DOS Window
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:18:20 GMT
Organization: UB
Originator: tjmeyer@autarch.acsu.buffalo.edu


Whoever,

Every time I open a scaled DOS window, the background and text colors are ridiculous.  Is there a way to control this? e.g., have a white background with black text?  Also, is there a way to change the font used in the windows?  The documentation accompanying the software is really lame...

					Thanks, TJM
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
From: marke@dev1.csg.ssd.fsi.com (Mark Easter)
Subject: Re: Future of DV-X?????
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 02:27:46 GMT
Distribution: us
Organization: FlightSafety Simulation Systems Division - Tulsa

In article <40348@ogicse.ogi.edu> francis@atmos.cse.ogi.edu (Francis Moraes) writes:
--text follows this line--
>   I have been trying to get through to QD for some time. Would some kind soul
>   like to mail me or post the IP address of qdeck.com (I have a lousy name
>   server). Thanks.

Are sure you aren't getting through???  They are NOTORIOUS about not answering
email!!!!  I have an ongoing remote slip problem open with them and after weeks
they have not answered any email yet!  On the other hand, FTP who is copied on
all my email to qdeck.com, answers everything right away, and it's not even
their problem.

Anyone from qdeck listening (for a change!)?

-- 
                                                                         
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
From: as789@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Francisco J. Diaz)
Subject: Help!
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 16:24:16 GMT


Hi All! I need some help in setting up DesqView. I'm using
DesqView v2.42 & QEMM v6.02 in my 386-40 Mhz. I would like to
know how do I load 2 shared programs for the same window, that is
go to the advanced setup and on the shared program put 2 of them.
One is DGANSI and the other 1COPY. I have tried putting both in
the same line separated by a space, comma, semicolon and other
but it doesn't seem to work! Can anyone that understands what I
mean help me out? Thanks! :-)
-- 
|     Francisco J. Diaz Rivera     |                           |
|     University of Puerto Rico    | If the shoe fits, buy it! |
|  "I hate calculus classes!" :-)  |           - Imelda Marcos |
|     STUD137@CUTB.UPR.CLU.EDU     |                           |
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
From: sumargoh@serss0.fiu.edu (H. Sumargo)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: DesqView/X Installation
Date: 24 Jul 92 21:37:09 GMT
Reply-To: sumargoh@fiu.edu
Organization: FIU Electrical & Computer Engineering

I have just installed a copy of DesqView/X on my 386 computer with the specs as follows:
     386-20, Zenith Computer
     8 Meg RAM
     387 Co-Processor
     Western Digital Internet Card
     MicroSoft Mouse (2 buttons)
     45 Meg Hard Drive (ESDI)
     DR-DOS 6.00 Operating System
     MicroSoft Windows 3.1

The istallation went smooth until I was told to reboot the computer to perform
the OMPTIMIZATION.  When the computer booted up, it loaded the QEMM386 with no
problem.  The problem starts when after it loaded from autoexec.bat.  It hang
over there with interminently searching through the hard drive.  Then, a message
appreaed saying that I/O error.

Any suggestion is welcome by sending it to sumargoh@fiu.edu.  thank you.
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
From: allbery@NCoast.ORG (Brandon S. Allbery KF8NH)
Subject: Re: DVX and DOS Graphic apps (was Re: DV/X and Tame?)
Reply-To: allbery@ncoast.org (Brandon S. Allbery KF8NH)
Organization: North Coast Public Access *NIX, Cleveland, OH
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 01:42:10 GMT
Followup-To: comp.os.msdos.desqview

As quoted from <1992Jul28.013909.26770@xraylith.wisc.edu> by bodoh@xraylith.wisc.edu (Daniel J. Bodoh):
+---------------
| Here's a partial solution to the problem:  Has QOS considered it?
| 
| There are a variety of graphics display standards available,
| one that I can think of off the top of my head is Borland's BGI.
+---------------

I think *you* need to consider that the features of the X server are
determined by GSS, not QOS.  Now, if you can convince *them* to provide BGI
and Windows APIs, etc., then you've got something.  (I would suggest that,
with the PC market the way it is at present, a Windows API should have a much
higher priority than a BGI driver.)

+---------------
| >[] DESQview/X:  turns your Sun into a PC peripheral.
| 
| I know people that would cringe in pain at the thought...
+---------------

You *really* want to make them ill?  Suggest to them that Solaris/Intel will
do the same.  :-)

++Brandon
-- 
Brandon S. Allbery, KF8NH [44.70.4.88]: allbery@NCoast.ORG, bsa@telotech.com
Senior Programmer, Telotech, Inc. (if I may call myself that...)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
From: burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge)
Subject: Re: DV/X and Tame?
Organization: Quarterdeck Office Systems, Santa Monica CA
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 17:47:48 GMT

>| }since X can't allow "runs in background=N".  Everything running in an X server
>| }MUST run in the background.
>| 
>
>I suspect the "runs in background" stuff is still pure DESQview.  And in that
>case it means that the process is in the foreground if and only if it is
>directly (essentially) attached to the keyboard.  Problem is, under X *no*
>program except the X server is attached to the keyboard!  All other programs
>are X clients and talk only to the X server (and possibly to other devices,
>such as a modem).
>
>++Brandon
>-- 
>Brandon S. Allbery, KF8NH [44.70.4.88]: allbery@NCoast.ORG, bsa@telotech.com
>Senior Programmer, Telotech, Inc. (if I may call myself that...)

This is the case.  The server is the foreground task.  Only when direct window
(one that runs full screen without a border) does anything but the server
become the foreground task.  This is why the Runs in background selection
has been removed from the DVP.

Bill	burge@qdeck.com
From: aml@world.std.com (Andrew M Langmead)
Subject: Re: Turning off DV/X windows 3 support
Organization: The World @ Software Tool & Die
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 20:48:11 GMT

knipe@mksol.dseg.ti.com (richard l knipe) writes:


>If manifest is run from inside of dv/x, it shows a 560K memory
>block allocated as "DVX.WIN3".  Is this memory region setup
>exclusively for windows 3?  If so, how is it turned off?  I
>don't use window 3 and would like the 1/2 meg back.

>Richard Knipe.
>knipe@me.uta.edu

That is the memory block for the third window (process,) not Windows 3.x.
Once conventional memory is filled up, DESQview starts allocating 
large frame EMS handles for each process running.
The counting is funny in DESQview/X because the X window server is the
first window (process.) The window manager is the second window.
The first window the user sees as a window is given the handle DV:Win3
(also the first two fit into "conventional" memory so don't show up
as EMS handles in Manifest.)

If you open another window, (DOS window, another Manifest, etc.) You will
see a new EMS handle named DV:Win4. This is the fourth DESQview process
(not Windows 4.0 support.)
-- 
|Andrew Langmead - A frustrated Mac/Unix programmer stuck in an MS-DOS job    |
|Usenet=aml@world.std.com      |S. O'Conner "We Live in a dangerous Age       |
|bix=a.langmead CI$=72411,1560 | To say how you feel is to lay your own grave"|
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: Re: Redirecting to COM1:
From: mike@batpad.lgb.ca.us (mike batchelor)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 92 22:39:38 PDT
Distribution: world               
Organization: The Batchelor Pad

gabe@angus.mi.org (B. Gabriel Helou) writes:

> Has anybody had problems redirecting modem commands (or anything for 
> that matter) to a comm port?  Some of my batch files work fine under 
> plain DOS, but hang in a Desqview DOS window.  A ctrl-alt-del removes 
> the window, but this is getting to be a bit of an annoyance.

I see you are posting with Waffle v1.65.  Do you use a FOSSIL?

Activate the FOSSIL before doing the redirection.  Works great here
with X00.SYS.  I take the modem off hook with a simple 'echo ath1 >com2'
after turning the FOSSIL on.

Turn it off again before starting Waffle, since FOSSIL aware programs
should be allowed to turn the FOSSIL on themselves.



[] ---
[] Mike Batchelor -- mike@batpad.lgb.ca.us
[] Long Beach, California
[] I love DESQview/X
From: pecquet@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: Re: Conventional memory under DV
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:04:41 EDT

In article <1992Jul21.145514.22713@qdeck.com>, burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge) writes:
> In article <sanders.47.711642334@server.physics.lsa.umich.edu> sanders@server.physics.lsa.umich.edu (Michael Sanders) writes:
>>There have been questions about the amount of conventional memory
>>available under DV. Here is the result of running Manifest in a DV
>>window on my system.
>>
>>From earlier postings, it seems that I am using an excessive amount
>>of DV Data memory.
>>
>>My question: What determines this? DV setup? If so, what factors?
>>If not, then what?
>>
>>Memory Area   Size   Description
>>040C - 0412   0.1K  (04AB)
>>0413 - 0419   0.1K  LOADHI
>>041A - 0420   0.1K  LOADHI
>>0421 - 0431   0.3K  4DOS
>>0432 - 0483   1.3K  DV Environment
>>0484 - 04A9   0.6K  DV
>>04AA - 1389    59K  DV Data
>>138A - 9FFD   561K  [Available]
>>Conventional memory ends at 639K
>>
>>
>>Michael Sanders                                Internet: t.m.sanders@umich.edu
>>Physics Department                             Bitnet: sanders@umiphys
>>University of Michigan                         Telephone: (313)936-0799
>>Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1120                       FAX: (313)764-2193
> 
> Michael,
> 
> The area indicated as DV data contains the portion of DV that must be loaded low(about 13K) and the part of DV that didn't fit in the HMA and available high
> RAM.  Free up some high ram, either by using Stealth if you are not already,
> loosing some TSR's (load them in a TSR DV window) or by allow DV to use the HMA
> if it not using it already.  DV uses all 63K of the HMA where other programs
> only use part (and only one can use it at a time)((for now)).  DOS=high uses
> about 40K of the HMA.  Letting DV use it would show a 20K improvement over
> DOS=high.
> 
> Bill	burge@qdeck.com
> 
You should also check what memory in the first 64K that QEMM is excluding 
by default.  DV seems to use up _all_ excluded free memory in this first 
64K.  When I added I=0C00-0FFF (if I remember correctly) I increased the 
dos memory in a big dos window by 10K.
-Joseph
pecquet@mps.ohio-state.edu
pecquet@ohstpy.bitnet
From: swf@teradata.com (Stanley Friesen)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: Re: Game program hangs DesqView
Date: 29 Jul 92 18:21:17 GMT
Reply-To: swf@tdat.teradata.com (Stanley Friesen)
Organization: NCR Teradata Database Business Unit

In article <1992Jul28.170515.13017@qdeck.com> docw@qdeck.com (Doc Williamson) writes:
|>|  Most games try to give
|>|you the highest available resolution, and especially if this is 1024x?x? or
|>|most hi-res modes in 256 colors, which will tend to lock up DV, especially
|>|when you try to rbing up the DV menu.
|>
|>Well, this is annoying, and could even be the problem, except for one thing:
|>
|>The program locks up *immediately*, before it has displayed *anything*,
|
|Normally just switching modes doesn't lock up the window, but it could.


This does seem to be the problem, I told the thing to use 'EGA' mode,
and it came up fine (at least it no longer locked the screen). (Still.
this is very annoying - it means I don't get to see the realistic
graphics, just the cruddy graphics).

Now I get what looks like a DV/QEMM error window about needing '8'
"EMS buffers" for this program.  Is this saying it wants a 128K EMS page
frame, or is it saying something else?

|>Another thing that has sometimes caused problems is games (or other software)
|>trying to do fancy sound stuff (my new Compton's Encyclopedia scrambled
|>itself when it tried to play a sound bite, but that only locked the one
|>window, I could still call up my DV menu and get rid of it).
|
|Most programs try to produce "realistic" sound by grabbing the timer interrupt
|and speeding up the timer FAR beyond the normal clock ticks rate (like 200
|times faster).  It is amazing you were able to recover.  Unless sound programs
|are set up to address a sound card directly (that operate at these much higher
|clock rates) they rarely work under DV.

Well, it is actually rather unpredictable.  Tetris Classic works fine,
but Carrier Strike locks the system, and the CD-ROM software just scrambles
its window and locks itself up.


Is any if this any better under DV/X?  Or does trying to us VGA hi-res
still blow it away.
-- 
sarima@teradata.com			(formerly tdatirv!sarima)
  or
Stanley.Friesen@ElSegundoCA.ncr.com
From: DIXONW@arizvm1.ccit.arizona.edu (Bill Dixon)
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview
Subject: S3 video chip performance?
Date: 27 Jul 92 20:12:22 GMT
Distribution: world,local
Organization: University of Arizona


    Much attention has been given recently to the graphic accelerator
cards using an "S3" chip (along with some others). These are usually
advertised for Windows (not X, the other one) and purport to make this
GUI interface a bit speedier. My understanding is that they also slow
down (or at least do nothing to improve) DOS text video performance.
Since DV/X seems to move graphics all over the screen would it benefit
from one of these video accelerator cards? Any one have experience?
Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.desqview