HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: johnh@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (John J Humpal)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Does reading this group make you depressed? The story of a victim.
Date: 9 Jan 1993 12:58:08 -0500
Organization: Homewood Academic Computing, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore, Md, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu

In article <C05vFC.IIv@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>
>   Word processors, spreadsheets, databases, desktop publishing programs, 
>drawing programs, etc.  My definition of "productivity" software includes
>software that allows a computer to be used as a tool for the composition of
>documents, reports, presentations, and other forms of media.  Basically, 
>productivity software is software that allows you to actually create 
>something substantial, something that actually exists.  I don't put the

	In other words, productivity software is almost anything?

> [someone else interjected:]
>>WordWorth and
>>Finalcopy are pretty good text editorts, probably not as good as MS
>>Word for Windows, but good enough for 99% of users.
>
>   Typical Amigoid mentality.  Belittle Mac and IBM versions of the few 
>software applications that are better on the Amiga than on the Mac or IBM, 
>but completely excuse the mediocrity of Amiga applications that are not as
>good as their counterparts on Mac or IBM. 
>
	Marc, nobody "belittled" Mac or IBM products.  Reread the above
sentences carefully and prepare a 500 word essay on clarity of thought and
the art of rhetoric.

>   If a morphing program for the Mac had 99% of the features needed by
>low-end video users, but was not nearly as powerful as a similar Amiga 
>morphing package, would you excuse the Mac morphing package as being 
>completely adequate?  No, you would flame it as being complete inadequate.
>
	So, you're clairvoyant?
      
	Marc, I'm confused and I'm willing to admit it.  I don't understand
why you stick with an Amiga since it doesn't do what you want it to do.
There is no shame in coveting or even owning an Intel based machine running
DOS/Windows/OS/2, so why don't you just put an end to your anguish and
get one of the latter.  I promise you we won't snicker very loudly.  And
you can still drop in to .advocacy from time to time and gloat about your
spreadsheets and databases. :-)


-- 
-John

John J. Humpal -- johnh@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu -- short .sig, std. disclaimer
From: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us (MARK BROWN)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Does reading this group make you depressed? The story of a victim.
Reply-To: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us
X-Software: Legend (216-825-2747) UUCPShell v4.9/med20Dec92
X-Disclaimer: Opinions of users do not necessarily reflect those of managment
Date: 4 Jan 93 22:52:51 EST
Organization: The Legend BBS Public Access (216)825-2747

You'll Find that the 68000 is most likely the most popular Imbedded 
control system chip in the world. Everything from HD controllers to 
Modems to Printers Utilize the 68K. 
     Mark

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: dtiberio@engws10.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio)
Subject: Re: The Truth about Iowa.....
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 22:44:23 GMT

In article <roelle.726508908@uars_mag> roelle@uars_mag.jhuapl.edu (Curtis Roelle) writes:
>Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman) writes:
>
>>Iowa is a basket case in the United States -- it's full of cornfields, and
>>looked down on as a place full of yokel farmers and -cornfields- without
		            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

	I hate hicks and farmer boys. I hate everything they stand for,
especially the part about putting food on my table. I can do without the
food. I wish all farmers would just die. I can live off of lawn clippings.

>wrong way" by an ear of corn in the past.  Have you ever stopped to
>consider how many of our food products are based on corn -- not to
>mention wheat, rice, oats, or barley?  Think about that next time you
>snarf a bag of Doritos.  Unless your diet excludes corn, you would be
>better off not displaying your hypocrisy in public.
>
>As far as culture, it is in the eye of the beholder.  The agri-culture
>may just be too suble to be observed by insensitive people.  As far as
>jokes go, great.  Why don't you tell us some so we can all enjoy a
>chuckle or two.

	Obviously, for Mr Flame and friends, the above was sarcasm. I hate
it when people pick on farmers. they may be different, but they feed our
world.

	And I wish we could start using corn based fuel substitutes as opposed
to oil. It would be great for our agricultural industry, which is shrinking
every year.

-- 

      Amiga Graphics Association BBS (516) 473-6351  24 HRS 14.4 v.32bis
Thanks Gwen. Like I said, I had faith in #3. At least it answers the phone now.
	
                                                                            
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: HELP--AMIGA OR IBM PC CLONE?
From: lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU (LaMonte Koop)
Date: 11 Jan 93 03:06:16 -0600
Reply-To: lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
 <C0nMw8.326@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> 
 <1993Jan10.220842.23518@ra.msstate.edu> <C0o5oF.Iv3@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>,<1993Jan11.075858.18965@ra.msstate.edu>
Organization: SCS GP/Engineering Cluster

In article <C0o5oF.Iv3@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod) writes:
>
[ other discussions about SVGA boards deleted]
>
>or custom chip.  This board I was looking at uses a 68008 CPU.  Is that
>a newer version of the chip that powers the A600?

    Yes, but not necessarily a more desirable one if that is what you are
attempting to infer.  The 68008 is basically a 68000 limited to an 8 bit
data bus and a 20 bit address bus, as opposed to the 68000's  16 bit data
bus and 24 bit addressing capability.

                 ----------------------------------------
           LaMonte Koop -- SCSU Electrical/Computer Engineering
 Internet: lkoop@tigger.stcloud.msus.edu -OR- f00012@kanga.stcloud.msus.edu
              "You mean you want MORE lights on this thing???"
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: dtiberio@engws10.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio)
Subject: Re: Byte's Amiga 4000 review...
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 22:23:35 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.162755.6993@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>Skip Sauls (skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu) wrote:

>: As for being ripped off, ask the software engineers
>: who worked on OS/2 about the Amigas in their labs...
>I've read two of their books, and there was no mention of the Amiga...

	I have the book "OS/2 - How We Made History", and on page 32 it says,
and I quote myself when I say, 

	"After lots of planning, we decided that OS/2 needed a good solid
base to develop on, so we decided to copy everything that we thought was
good about the AmigaOS, and then we had the skeleton for OS/2. We then
multiplied the overhead and size of the executables by 10x to prove that it
was meant to run on IBM clones."
	
>: No, but you can get an A1200 for around $600 that is comparable to 486sx
>: SVGA systems for twice the price.
>If you think a 1200 is as fast or powerful as a 486sx, you are sadly mistaken.

	He said 'comparable', not 'fast or powerful'. Actually, it is anyway,
so your point is moot. AGA moves sprites an infinite time faster than SVGA.
Animation is also faster, and special screen handling is much better. Plus
AGA is a standard, and SVGA is not. 

>: Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate
>| JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |


-- 
      Amiga Graphics Association BBS (516) 473-6351  24 HRS 14.4 v.32bis
ixemul.library mpeg_play mpeg_movies jpegs gifs 3d_objs music_mods adobe_fonts
	 login: ANONYMOUS password: GUEST for unrestricted downloads
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:33466 comp.sys.amiga.hardware:22854
From: jperkski@kentcomm.uucp (Jim Perkowski)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: 486's are in no way upgradeable to Pentiums
Distribution: world
Date: 12 Jan 93 10:03:25 EST
Organization: No such thing as organization. Life is chaos!

In article <1993Jan11.152907.20119@crash> uzun@crash.cts.com (Roger Uzun) writes:
>Some of the Amiga bashers have stated that the Intel Pentium (formerly
>586) will be available as an upgrade to all 486 users.  This is
>not the case.  The Pentium uses a drastically different memory
>architecture, and is a much higher performance chip.  To use
>it in an existing 486 design would really hamper the performance
>of the CHIP.
>Many existing overdrive sockets have additonal pins for a future
>overdrive chip which will have many pentium like features, and
>will provide higher performance than existing 486's.
>Please look at the Nov 16 issue of EE times, page 121
>for a quote from Intel on future overdrive options.
>
>-Roger
>--------------------------------------------------------------
>bix: ruzun
>NET: uzun@crash.cts.com

What does this have to do with comp.sys.amiga.hardware? Are you saying that
the 586 will work in an Amiga. Is C= coming out with a 586 machine?
--
_________________________________
        (Jim Perkowski)
kentcomm!jperkski@legend.akron.oh.us
kentcomm!jperkski@aldhfn.akron.oh.us
  (Where am I when I need me?!)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: mlelstv@speckled.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst)
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Organization: Max-Planck-Institut f"ur Radioastronomie
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 11:59:48 GMT

In <C0BIn0.M7E@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>   On the surface, the Macintosh works very well.  The way the Apple Menu is
>available from any program is very nice.  When you launch any program, a
>description for that program is always available by selecting the "About"
>entry in the Apple menu.  The 'Edit' menu is similarly always available from
>any program, so that nearly all programs support cutting and pasting with 
>the clipboard.  The Multifinder menu is also always available from any program,
>allowing easy navigating through the Macintosh's approximate equivelent to
>the Amiga's screens.

Of course this has nothing to do with the OS as it is a function of the
applications on the Mac.

>Amiga's stock icons are also drawn from a 4096-color palette, and not from
>a 16-million-color palette.

With only 4 colors this is hardly an issue.

>window (as it is now).  But many of the other problems (such as the Amiga's
>completely non-functional clipboard) may not be solvable.

It is a question writing a clipboard utility. MultiView can be a bases
for that as it can display arbitrary data.

Regards,
-- 
Michael van Elst
UUCP:     universe!local-cluster!milky-way!sol!earth!uunet!unido!mpirbn!p554mve
Internet: p554mve@mpirbn.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de
                                "A potential Snark may lurk in every tree."
From: Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: The Truth about Iowa.....
Distribution: world
Date: 4 Jan 93 17:43:15 EDT
Organization: Amiga Colony BBS

.>>. a message dated Thu  1 Jan 93  0:32, Peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com
( wrote:

 P> Path: tegra!ulowell!news.bbn.com!olivea!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!rutgers!cb
 P> mvax!cbmehq!cbmger!peterk
 P> From: peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com (Dr Peter Kittel Germany)
 P> Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
 P> Subject: Re: Does reading this group make you depressed? The story of
 P> a victim.
 P> Message-ID: <10375@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com>
 P> Date: 30 Dec 92 16:29:50 GMT
 P> References: <58064@dime.cs.umass.edu> <C01GsK.L4C@news.iastate.edu>
 P> <29DEC199218114334@cs.umass.edu> <C022t9.B9G@news.iastate.edu>
 P> Reply-To: peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com (Dr Peter Kittel Germany)
 P> Organization: Commodore Germany
 P> Lines: 19

 P> In article <C022t9.B9G@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N.
 P> Barrett) writes:
 >In article <29DEC199218114334@cs.umass.edu> FFatkin@cs.umass.edu (Marc
Atkin) writes:
 >>
 >>Fact is that the Amiga is very well-known in Europe
 >
 >   The fact also is that many Amiga owners in the U.S. don't give a rip
about
 >Europe, Bosnia, or Swaziland.  If the Amiga is not strong here, support
is not 
 >available here, and hardware and software are not available here.  These
are
 >enough reasons to dissuade a person from ever getting another Amiga.
 P>                              ^^^^^^^^
 P> You could *perhaps* say "a US person", but you always extend your
 P> negative
 P> opinions as if this would be valid for the whole world! THERE IS LIFE
 P> OUTSIDE IOWA, AND EVEN OUTSIDE USA!!! And much more life with the
 P> respect
 P> of the Amiga, let me tell you.

 P> -- 
 P> Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to \\  Only my personal
 P> opinions...

{more on the DLG editor -- SOME people can remember editing commands for
more than a millisecond after having looked them up and them NOT being on
the screen -- I just -looked- at the set of commands for the editor for DLG
-- who the hell used Telix, do I -care- about Telix?  I know some of the
EMACS commands, some of the SAS/LSE editor commands, why the **** do I have
to learn ******* TELIX commands and have yet bunch of incompatible BS chew
up neurons I'd rather use for information PROCESSING, not -garbage-
storage!!!!!!}

Iowa is a basket case in the United States -- it's full of cornfields, and
looked down on as a place full of yokel farmers and -cornfields- without
much culture, interesting things to see, or intelligence..... [Iowa's part
of the "bread basket"] There are lots of jokes about there being nothing of
interest between the east and west coast of the US -- it's a 6 hour
airplane flight, over a lot of -boring-, flat, -cornfield- landscape.  It's
less tedious than -driving across- the midwest (I've never drived across
Iowa.  I;ve driven for 9 hours across Kansas, I've driven across Texas..
Iowa's merely further north.  It's -boring-... the same landscape without
change for hours....


-- Via DLG Pro v0.992
From: alan@xserver.uts.amdahl.com (Alan Bomberger)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Amiga OS weaknesses and strengths
Date: 5 Jan 93 18:02:20 GMT
Organization: Amdahl

I am glad someone mentioned the clipboard.  The Mac has
a "Put this stuff on the clipboard" and a "get stuff from
the clipboard".  If the Amiga had supplied these simple
intuitive interfaces, I would have used it instead of
an application internal clipboard.  It may be that underneath
the covers the Mac clipboard is complex but since day 1 there
has been a simple application oriented interface.  

Gad, I sound more and more like a Mac supporter.  I spend
time on the Mac advocacy group bashing  myths about the
Amiga.  I wish more people would take the time to learn
about other systems so they could spend more time sharing
strengths.  Of course using words like "Broken" doesn't help!

Non-functional maybe :)

-- 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod)
Subject: 3DO news
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 16:44:28 GMT

Newsbytes, reporting on the Consumer Electronics Show says that 3DO is
nothing like what people in this newsgroup have been rumouring it to
be.  I can't quote it too extensively, but your BBS might carry it,
either under "Newbytes" or "clarinet" so that you can see that I'm not
stretching anything.  Because of legalities, I won't post it, but I
will mail it to anyone who asks.

Anyhow, 3DO is NOT producing ANY hardware.  It is producing a standard
piece of hardware, like the CD-I or MPC.  I get the impression that
this thing a high-end 32 bit RISC based, MPEG/Kodak supporting CD-I
type machine that is supposed to attract adults and children.

In other words, I don't see what it has to do with the Amiga at all!


Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: iank@microsoft.com (Ian Kennedy)
Subject: Re: More Amiga OS weaknesses and strengths
Date: 06 Jan 93 19:18:06 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <C0E2BM.224@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>>SuperDuper etc.
>
>   Wrong.  If CrossDOS were properly implemented in the OS, selecting the
>'format' menu entry would simply result in a window that gives you MS-DOS
>and Amiga formatting options in one window.  You would not have to use anyJCL]3extra disk-formatting programs.

Well, under 3.0 when you fire up the foramt utility you get a GUI
which allows you to select what drive to format. Clicking on "PC0:"
and then on the format button results in a DOS format disk. No special
extra commands. Just use the format utility in the system drawer. And I
believe if you give "format drive pc0: name foo" it will automagically
format MS-DOS format becuase you selected the DOS disk device name.

I know this is too hard for you and that's why yer bitchin' about it
all the time but for the rest of us it's pretty damn simple.

Ian.
-- 
"Apple's attitude toward its ROM code is a little like that of a rich kid
toward his inheritance. Not actually knowing how to create wealth himself,
he guards what he has with hysterical fervor." - John Perry Barlow
MAIL : IANK@MICROSOFT.COM			 Crime and Puzzlement
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: kennethm@cc.gatech.edu (Kenneth Moorman)
Subject: Re: More Amiga OS weaknesses and strengths
Reply-To: kennethm@cc.gatech.edu (Kenneth Moorman)
Organization: College of Computing
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:58:07 GMT

In article <C0Gqzv.3q6@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>
>   So is PostScript, and TeX bares a far greater resemblance to PostScript 
>than to WP.  No, thanks.  I don't feel like putting 10 hours of programming
>in to design a page, when I can do it with Mac WP in ten seconds.
>
>---
>| Marc Barrett -MB-  |  email: barrett@iastate.edu
>--------------------------------------------------------------------

Actually, with LaTeX, I have only had to custom design a page 
once in the two years I used it (for articles, papers, journal 
submissions, short stories, poetry, etc, etc, etc). 
Grabbed the manual, read for about five minutes, fired
up the trusty old text editor, spent ten minutes designing it, 
used page previewer, spent another ten minutes making MINOR
adjustments (I'm a die-hard perfectionist).  Total
elapsed time : 25 minutes.   Plus, I later discovered that 
a page style similar to the one I needed was already in 
existence on a TeX ftp site.  

TeX is a godsend when doing large (100+) technical documents
with figures, tables, and formulas.  
  
			- Kenneth Moorman (kennethm@cc.gatech.edu)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod)
Subject: Re: Byte's Amiga 4000 review...
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 20:24:58 GMT

>>REXX.  THEY were multitasking before you were born.  So what in OS/2
>>was "ripped off" of the Amiga?
>
>How long have they had a popular widely available multitasking OS for the
>Intel architecture?  As for being ripped off, ask the software engineers
>who worked on OS/2 about the Amigas in their labs...

What is it that you think is in OS/2 that wasn't invented (probably by
IBM) long, long before the Amiga?  Just because there hasn't been a
"widely available multitasking OS for the Intel architecture" doesn't
mean that multitasking originated with the Amiga.  If the Amiga had
never existed, OS/2 would have been multitasking in competition with
Windows, NeXT, SysVR4.2, Solaris, NT and VMS.

Or did they ALL steal the concept from the Amiga.

As to REXX...It's not a very nice language anyways.  The only reason
IBM includes it is because ALL of their operating systems do.  I would
prefer if they would replace it with Perl or something.  It was by no
means "borrowed" from the Amiga.

>No, but you can get an A1200 for around $600 that is comparable to 486sx
>SVGA systems for twice the price.

An SVGA 486 system without hard drive would be the same price as the
$600.00 A1200.  Except you would have a real CPU.  For kicks you could
throw in a soundboard, for $250.00 that has a 68000 on it.  No, the
Amiga does NOT have a patent on coprocessing.  There are cheap
soundboards for the PC that have as much CPU power as the A600!

>Paul, why are you worried about the Amiga?  You obviously like the Clones,
>so use them and be happy with them.  No one here cares what machine you use
>and your arguments are simply ignored by most people.  Are you like many 
>others who have sold their Amigas and bought Clones?  Aren't you happy with
>it?  Why do you read and post to the Amiga groups?  Worried that you might
>have made the wrong decision?  Or are you an MB wannabe?

I spend time here combatting inaccuracies like 486s 
that sell for twice the price of A1200.  Check out this month's
computer shopper.  486s for <$1000.00 WITH hard drive AND monitor!
Take out the hard drive and monitor, and you are at A1200 price!

This is of course  a ridiculous comparison.  A 486sx with no hard drive
is useless, and an A1200 without hard drive is pretty damn near useless
too.  It is excellent competiton for a super nintendo, though.

I also hang out here for kicks watching the Amiga users defect one by
one.
From: dtiberio@engws10.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: HELP--AMIGA OR IBM PC CLONE?
Keywords: Neuroses lobotomies penis envy spam spam spam humbug
Date: 12 Jan 93 09:20:01 GMT
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook

In article <1itb3sINN9m9@mozz.unh.edu> ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene) writes:
>'> Flipping through my AmigaWorld... 16-bit sound card, CD quality: roughly $600
>'>	for the SunRize product;
>
>	Isn't $600 for a 16 bit sound card kind of expensive?  I mean, you can
>   get a Gravis Ultrasound which does the same for around $140.
>
>							Greg Greene

	I don't have the specs in front of me, but can assure you that the
AD1016 != Gravis Ultrasound.

-- 
      Amiga Graphics Association BBS (516) 473-6351  24 HRS 14.4 v.32bis
ixemul.library mpeg_play mpeg_movies jpegs gifs 3d_objs music_mods adobe_fonts
	 login: ANONYMOUS password: GUEST for unrestricted downloads
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: Byte's Amiga 4000 review...
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:12:44 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
X-Posted-From: hemi.msi.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

Chris Hurley (mr_scary@lakes.trenton.sc.us) wrote:
:
: Although I've never seen an A1200, I did have my 2 mb A500 running 
: Kickstart 2.04 for over a year (before migrating to OS/2) and I would 
: easily say that my A500 performed on par with most any 386 that was sold 
: through our store (standard VGA machines with 2 mb memory or so...)  
: (When running Windows, or OS/2 on 6 and 8 mb machines).  That's not to 
: say that those machines weren't fair.  (I'm getting to like OS/2, but I 
: have 10 mb of memory)  Just to say that the 1200 probably performs quite 
: well with the bulk of 486sx machines that are sold day-to-day.
:

Well, I've had the opposite experience.  My 386/33 w/Windows 3.1 seems to
be a bit faster than an A3000.  And don't forget -- a 486sx is about twice
the speed of a 386 (at the same MHz).
--
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
| JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
| Drummers do it... |     Burlington, MA USA     | in my book of memories.   |
|    ... In rhythm! |        jerry@msi.com       |         -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+