HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Processes in ctrl-Y state -detection
From: kyle@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca (Kyle Maschmeyer)
Date: 1 Oct 92 10:27:01 GMT
Organization: Sharecom Ind.
Nntp-Posting-User: kyle

I want to write a .COM file that will tell me what processes, if
any, on a VMS system have been control-Y'd and are sitting at the
DCL "$" prompt, able to be "CONTINUED".

What do I look for? The process state is just "LEF" and it looks
exactly like a process waiting for a DCL comment that hasn't been control-Y'd.

Is there any way to tell with F$GETJPI items?

Mail directly to me, please, as I don't always read the network stuff.

-- 
| Kyle Maschmeyer, B.Sc.	| Internet address: 			     |
| Programmer/linguist		|  "animal::kyle"@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca	     |
| c/o Sharecom Industries, Box 8| To specify on VAX/VMS:		     |
| DeWinton, Alberta, Canada	|  "'animal::kyle'@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca"     |
| Tel. (403) 256-4766 days MST	| Alternate, if the quotes are a problem:    |
|				|  kyle@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca		     |
From: ofer@taveng.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: Why is Graphics of SOFTPC so slow on a VAXstation 3100/76 SPX ??
Date: 5 Oct 92 16:04:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: rdg.1992Oct5.160446.9224
Reply-To: ofer@taveng.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <00960F37.ABCDAF40.477@v36.chemie.uni-konstanz.de>, vaxinf@V36.CHEMIE.UNI-KONSTANZ.DE writes:
|>Path: rdg.dec.com!news.crl.dec.com!deccrl!caen!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!ucbvax!V36.CHEMIE.UNI-KONSTANZ.DE!vaxinf
|>From: vaxinf@V36.CHEMIE.UNI-KONSTANZ.DE
|>Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
|>Subject: Why is Graphics of SOFTPC so slow on a VAXstation 3100/76 SPX ??
|>Message-ID: <00960F37.ABCDAF40.477@v36.chemie.uni-konstanz.de>
|>Date: 21 Sep 92 11:13:42 GMT
|>Sender: usenet@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
|>Organization: The Internet
|>Lines: 7
|>X-Unparsable-Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1992 13:10:28 CET
|>
|>I have a question about the SOFTPC on a Vaxstation. We are disappointed about
|>the speed, if one tries to output graphics, i.e. from Alchemy. Can anybody 
|>confirm this experience or has someone found a method to speedup the things?
|>
|>regard
|>Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann
|>
|>

You didnt specify what VS you were using at the time, but I'll assume its
VS3100m30.

I encountered the same speed problem when working on a MONO VS3100m30 and 
after a some examination I came to the obvious reason:

	a VS3100m3x simply has not got enough power ! 

The VS has only about 2.4 VUPS which compares to about 6-8 VUPS on A386DX33.
add to that the overhead of the emulation - at least 60% of CPU and you can 
understand why the VS seems so slow.

Using graphics only makes things worse - You have to either emulate BIOS which
handles all Display changes through the x86 emulation, or use direct access
into display memory space, which needs to be translated to VS display...  



-------
		O.S., Ofer Sheinkin

	E-MAIL: ofer%taveng.enet.dec.com
	  MAIL:	P.O.Box 2682 Natanya 42126 ISRAEL
	 Phone: (int.)-972-53-626308

The opinions mentioned above are my own, and mine only.
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
From: gvrod@isuvax.iastate.edu (R Eldridge, VMS FOREVER)
Subject: Re: TK50 vs. TK70, or something like that.
Reply-To: gvrod@isuvax.iastate.edu
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 14:28:56 GMT

cranem@edsi.plexus.COM (Mike Crane) writes:
>[...]
>
>Can you write to TK50 tapes in a TK70 drive, or does its compatibility
>only extend to being able to *read* TK50 tapes?
>
>[...]

the TK70 drive can only *read* TK50 tapes. it *can't* write them.


rod eldridge
vms systems support      gvrod@isuvax.iastate.edu
iowa state university    gvrod@isuvax.bitnet    
(515) 294-7498           fax: (515) 294-1717
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: VMS AST's in VAX BASIC- how?
From: kyle@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca (Kyle Maschmeyer)
Date: 2 Oct 92 08:43:44 GMT
Organization: Sharecom Ind.
Nntp-Posting-User: kyle

VMS:
Does anyone else in the known world use VAX BASIC, and if they do, do
they know how to pass the address of BASIC subroutine to a system service
for setting up asynchronous traps?

Specifically, I am using Sys$QIOW with IO$_SetMode!IO$M_CTRLYAST
to set up an AST to execute when control Y is pressed. I have managed
to do it in MACRO but I would prefer to do it in VAX BASIC.

Specifying the name of an externally compiled subroutine and passing
it by Ref, by Value, and by Desc have all failed.

Replies to me directly please.
-- 
| Kyle Maschmeyer, B.Sc.	| Internet address: 			     |
| Programmer/linguist		|  "animal::kyle"@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca	     |
| c/o Sharecom Industries, Box 8| To specify on VAX/VMS:		     |
| DeWinton, Alberta, Canada	|  "'animal::kyle'@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca"     |
| Tel. (403) 256-4766 days MST	| Alternate, if the quotes are a problem:    |
|				|  kyle@yogi.hsc.ucalgary.ca		     |
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
From: S_REHFELD@rzmain.rz.uni-ulm.de (Rehfeld Tobias)
Subject: ACLs to Processes ?
Organization: University of Ulm, Germany
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 22:09:40 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

Is it possible to set an ACL to a process, that I have all rights to this
process from another account?

eg I want to do things like SHOW PROCESS and STOP from a process owning
USER_1 to a process owning USER_2.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Tobias Rehfeld
 E-Mail: S_REHFELD@rzmain.rz.uni-ulm.de
         S_REHFELD@dulruu51.bitnet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
From: pershing@teal.csn.org (Paul Pershing)
Subject: Re: Canceling effect of F6 key
Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc.
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 18:55:34 GMT


>...actually, the VMS terminal driver munges the sequence sent from the keyboard
>(<ESC>[17~) into a ^C.  your application and/or DCL environment is then
>interpreting the ^C to be a ^Y.....

Speaking of VT220 function keys... I have looked (it seems like) everywhere
for the codes used on F1-F20, including the DO key, and maybe even the
PF1-PF4 keys that are used on our VAXstation 3100s, so I can create a set
of function keys on my PC term program at home and be able to function
when I'm dialed in. I can't find them, and I do not have access to any
of the VMS/VAX documentation (where I'm told such definitions are), and
I've tried about everything..
	Could someone out there email me a list of the key definitions (or
ESC codes, whatever they are called) for the VT220 series? I'd be
very appreciative!
	Or, maybe someone who knows where I can get a term program via
ftp that does VT220 or even 300_SERIES emulation with all the keys?
	Or, if there's a place on the net where I'd be able to find
this, please let me know.

Thanks!
Paul Pershing

-- 
++++--------------------------------++++--------------------------------++++ 
Paul Pershing >>>>>>> *** >> F U R T H E R ! <<< *** <<<<<< pershing@csn.org
RMN * 400 W. Colfax Ave. Denver, CO 80204 * (303)-233-9231 or (303)-892-2633
++++--------------------------------++++--------------------------------++++
From: gavron@spades.aces.com (Ehud Gavron 602-570-2000 x. 2546)
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: Help needed in reaching a SPAN node via decnet
Date: 6 Oct 92 06:24:00 GMT
Reply-To: gavron@ACES.COM
Organization: ACES Consulting Inc.
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1

In article <1992Oct5.154009.15522@midway.uchicago.edu>, 
trgs@midway.uchicago.edu writes...
# 
#Hi,
# 
#Can anyone tell me how to reach a SPAN network node by decnet.  Do I need
#to configure decnet to access the node?

	Yes, Trgs, DECnet needs to be configured for you to use DECnet.
	Yes, Trgs, You need to be connected to the SPAN network (or a network
		connected to SPAN) to reach a SPAN node.

	Does any of this seem the least bit obvious? 

#Thanks,
# 
#-Gowrishankar 

	Ehud

--
Ehud Gavron        (EG76)     
gavron@vesta.sunquest.com

Yes, I know it's now called NSI/DECnet and that Ron Tenactin is no longer
its God.  I just figured the poor guy had enough problems without being
confused as to WHICH network he's not connected to.
From: hansg@risken.vd.volvo.se (Hans Granqvist)
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: Utility to delete 0 block file
Date: 4 Oct 92 15:46:42 GMT

ARNE@ko.hhs.dk (Arne Vajhxj) writes:

>> > I am looking for a file utility that deletes 0 block file. Is such a utility
>> > available?
>> 
>> Don't know of a utility, but a RENAME of that file to another will cause
>> RMS to "lose the file", i.e., it will be deleted.

>????
>A little experiment showed, that it do NOT on my system (VMS V5.5-1) !
>AND I find it hard to believe, that RENAME will do this on any VMS
>version !

(Hey, why so hostile?)

It most certainly will if we all talk about the same sort of files. What
I naturally thought was the case of file being discussed was the ones looking
like FILE.TYPE in this normal DIR:

...
ASCHMECK.C;1        4/6               <and some date here>          
FILE.TYPE;1       no such file      
GSCHMECK.C;1        4/6                       
XSCHMECK.C;1        4/6                       
...

A normal file of size 0/0 poses no big problem, but the file of type
FILE.TYPE in the example above is tougher. It cannot be DELETEd as RMS
will not see it (it does not exist). Nor can it be copied or edited. But
a RENAME will cause RMS to actually lose the file, i.e., it humbly
informs you that your file has been lost whilst doing the rename. 
--
Hans Granqvist, Volvo, Gothenburg, Sweden. Thank you for reading!
From: BRAND_T%AMGATE@MUVAXA.RFERL.ORG
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: DCL to check for identifier
Date: 30 Sep 92 10:22:39 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

From: BrandT
Date: Wed, Sep 30, 1992 11:20 AM
Subject: RE: DCL to check for identifier
To: InfoVax; 
MUVAXA::MRGATE::IN%"cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!darwin.sura.net
!jvnc.net!nuscc!edbis@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU"

>Hi... Here I am again with another question.
>
>Which lexical function would allow me to get the default login directory name?
>I need to check if this directory exists but the F$SEARCH command does not
>support checking of valid directory that exist... any suggestion?
>

How about:
$ DIR    = TRNLNM("SYS$LOGIN")
$ Exists = F$PARSE("''TheDir'") .NES ""  ! returns 1 if file exists, else 0
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: DESVA: How fast?
From: fantini%boot.decnet@edwards-tems.af.mil
Date: 30 Sep 92 15:38:49 -0700
Organization: T&E Mission Simulator - Edwards AFB, CA


Hello Net:

What is the average I/O capacity in 4 blk I/O per second of an Ethernet
controller card called a DESVA? This device is connected to a 
VAXstation 2000 workstation. Any other performance info is welcome.
Thanks.
						-Jay
-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fantini@edwards-tems.af.mil   | 6510 TSWS U.S.A.F. Simulation Lab
Mathematican & Loose Cannon   | "Im Berechnung liegt Wahrheit." - Me
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: KSULLIVA@BENTLEY.BITNET
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: Changing Newmail count
Date: 27 Sep 92 23:36:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: BENTLEY.01GPAH47DJU00001OM
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

>
> I am running VMS version 5.4-3.  When I log into my account it says
>I have 9 new mail messages but I am unable to read them.  Is there
>a way to reset the new mail count?  I looked in mail help and there
>is a SHOW NEW_MAIL_COUNT command but not a SET NEW_MAIL_COUNT command.

        There is no direct way to set it. If you have no messages in your
        NEWMAIL folder (i.e. DIR/NEW shows no messages), then READ/NEW will
        reset your new mail counter to zero.

        Kevin
From: nreadwin@micrognosis.co.uk (Neil Readwin)
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: DCL procedure to extract nodename from PID
Date: 2 Oct 92 09:21:35 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet


>> $! Note that if you happened to do the following then DCL takes and
>> $! exception and therefore your process gets deleted :-)
>> $!
>> $! write sys$output f$getsyi("NODENAME",,csid)
>
>	Although, it appears that there was no mention in the release
>	notes, this bug was fixed in VMS 5.4-3.

I discovered it on a machine running 5.5! Neil.

Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
From: dsw@pequod.mit.edu (David Woodruff, dsw@mitlns)
Subject: Summary: DVI to LN05?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Keywords: DVI, LN05, laser printers
Organization: MIT Lab for Nuclear Science
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 16:12:00 GMT

Hello net,

I have been told that DVITOLN03 from the DECUS TeX distribution will work fine
with an LN05 printer.  In fact the LN03, LN05, and LN06 are all supported.  The
LN3 files will print directly to the LN05.

Thanks to Tom O'Toole and Tony Scandora, and especially to Harry Flowers!

I don't yet have an LN05 printer on which to try it out.  The person who is
purchasing it may yet decide to get the PostScript upgrade for it :-)

                                Regards,
                                                Dave


*******************************************************************************
"Call me Ishmael.  Some years ago-- never | David S. Woodruff  26-407
mind how long precisely-- having little   | MIT Lab for Nuclear Science
or no money in my purse, and nothing      | 77 Mass. Ave,  Cambridge MA, 02139
particular to interest me on shore, I     | (617) 253-6943
thought I would sail about a little and   |   
see the watery part of the world."        | dsw@mitlns.mit.edu   MITLNS::DSW
From: billb@crpmks.uucp (Bill Bochnik (Info Systems))
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: How to avoid mount verification during server reboot?
Keywords: mount verify, VAXcluster, LAVc
Date: 6 Oct 92 19:27:37 GMT
Reply-To: billb@crpmks.UUCP (Bill Bochnik (Info Systems))
Organization: Ciba-Geigy Corporation

In article <Bvnwz4.BEs@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca> oci@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca (Chip Campbell) writes:
>We occasionally have to reboot the boot node of our LAVc (NI cluster)
>and we'd like to lessen the impact on users on the other nodes, ideally
>to the point where they experience a pause but no serious interruption.
>Currently, when we do this, the satellite nodes put disks on which
>files are open into a mount verify state, that does NOT go away when
>the server re-boots.  Other disks (with no open files) seem to dis-mount
>and re-mount normally.  The only way to put the mount-verify disks back
>into operation seems to be to terminate the processes with open files,
>whereupon the disks dismount.

Do you mean that that go into a MOUNT VERIFY TIMEOUT state, or that they stay 
in the MOUNT VERIFY state?  The first can be helped by increasing the timeout 
parametre in sysgen (MVTIMEOUT?).  The second is a serious problem.  

-- 
Bill Bochnik			| It's hard to be a James Bond in an Abbott
Systems Analyst 		|	and Costello world.
Ciba-Geigy Corporation		| Signed and sealed, they deliver oblivion.
philabs!crpmks!billb		| It's worse than that, he's dead Jim.
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
From: sander@rm222.enet.dec.com (Warren Sander)
Subject: Re: Decwindows/Motif Logo
Reply-To: sander@rm222.enet.dec.com (Warren Sander)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 18:01:02 GMT


Here is what you need to do to get rid of the 'digital' from the 
background and put your own in..

In sylogicals put the following line

$ define /system/exec decw$login_background -
		sys$common:[sysexe]decw$background.com

In sys$common:[sysexe]decw$background.com put the following:

$ set noon
$ n=0
$ set proc/prio=1
$ On error then goto START
$   START:
$ n = n +1
$ set proc/name="DECW$LOGIN_''n'"
$ ico:==$games:ico.EXE
$ ico -b
From: JVinson.OSBU_North@XEROX.COM
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: How do you ftp savesets back thru Unix back to the Vax successfully?
Date: 29 Sep 92 23:02:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: Xerox."29-Sep-92.15:58:25".*.Jeffrey_Vinson.OSBU_North
Reply-To: JVinson.OSBU_North@xerox.com
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

Hello all,

I am trying to acquire RCS, first of all, for VMS (or any source code control
package).   The only place I can find RCS are at ftp sites, in the vax92a
saveset.   Has anyone 'split' RCS from the entire saveset by any chance so the
entire saveset doesn't have to be operated on??

My problem is this:  I ftp out from a Sun to get the many pieces of the VAX92a
directory.  I then mv them to a VMS nfs'ed (MultiNet/TGV) directory mounted on
the Sun.  I do the  file(.cld) operations on the files (/type=fixed,
/record_size=32256), create one large saveset, and I get a CRC error reading
file when doing a "backup/lis vax92a.bck/save", in particular
**BACKUP-E-BLOCKCRC, software block CRC error**.  What gives?

I also tried doing file operations on each piece, before creating the larger
saveset, with the same error.  Are there more file operations that have to be
done or what?  I noticed that assemble.com does not mention the /record_size
switch, but I did it anyway.

I also tried the create/fdl example that someone posted last month.  This
truncated the file somehow, so when you do a backup/lis, it just stops after
the 'first piece', (i.e. it only lists like the first dozen files or so).

Can anyone tell of their success in getting the ftp'ed pieces back to VMS (thru
Unix)??

Thanks in advance for help,
Jeff Vinson
415.813.7492
JVinson.OSBU_North@Xerox.com
From: munroe@dmc.com (Dick Munroe)
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: Omen Technology
Date: 3 Oct 92 19:15:06 EDT
Organization: Doyle, Munroe Consultants, Inc., Hudson, MA

In article <01GPHEHSD1008WWRBS@scorva>, CAPTANSKI33@SNYCORVA.BITNET (CHRIS TANSKI) writes:
> Does anyone have an address (email or postal), phone number, or whatever
> for Omen Technology Products? I have some questions about their zmodem
> d/l tool. Thanks.
> 
> Chris Tanski
> 

Chris,

Check the InfoVAX: How to find software... FAQ.  There is a pointer
there.  If you didn't keep your copy, you can get a new one by sending a
message containing:

SEND INFO-VAX

to fileserv@dmc.com

Dick Munroe
-- 
Dick Munroe				Internet: munroe@dmc.com
Doyle Munroe Consultants, Inc.		UUCP: ...uunet!thehulk!munroe
267 Cox St.				Office: (508) 568-1618
Hudson, Ma.				FAX: (508) 562-1133

GET CONNECTED!!! Send mail to info@dmc.com to find out about DMConnection.
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
From: larry@vishnu.eco.twg.com ()
Subject: Re: Glen Everhard's FDDRIVER as NFS Client driver ?
Reply-To: larry@vishnu.eco.twg.com ()
Organization: The Wollongong Group (East Coast Operations)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 21:31:30 GMT


In article <00961507.33C1ED60.8930@ifn.ing.tu-bs.de>, meyer@IFN.ING.TU-BS.DE (Eckart Meyer) writes:
|>Path: eco.twg.com!uunet!stanford.edu!agate!ucbvax!IFN.ING.TU-BS.DE!meyer
|>From: meyer@IFN.ING.TU-BS.DE (Eckart Meyer)
|>Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
|>Subject: Glen Everhard's FDDRIVER as NFS Client driver ?
|>Message-ID: <00961507.33C1ED60.8930@ifn.ing.tu-bs.de>
|>Date: 28 Sep 92 21:38:37 GMT
|>Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
|>Distribution: world
|>Organization: The Internet
|>Lines: 26
|>
|>
|>        Glen Everhard submitted his FDDRIVER to various SIG-Tapes. This
|>        Driver "simply" forwards I/O Requests to a detached process running
|>        in normal user mode. Idea is, writing NFS client code in process
|>        context would be much easier (and would not crash the system after
|>        every edit...) than writing a new driver. Perhaps it would be not
|>        very fast, but speed is not important for me.
|>
|>        Before inventing the wheel again and again: Anyone who did this or
|>        a similar thing? And if Glen is listening: Is it a good idea?
|>
|>        We are using CMU-TEK TCP/IP.
|>
|>        --Eckart
|>
|>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|>Eckart Meyer                                     Address:   Schleinitzstr. 23
|>Inst. f. Nachrichtentechnik                                 3300 Braunschweig
|>Technical University of Braunschweig                                  Germany
|>                                                 Phone:      +49 531 391 2454
|>E-Mail:   meyer@ifn.ing.tu-bs.de                 FAX:        +49 531 391 5192
|>          I7100501@DBSTU1.BITNET (not preferred)
|>VMSmail:  PSI%26245050351130::MEYER (DATEX-P)
|>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|>
|>
|>
Eckart,
	I know that there are at least two emminently qualified people who
could respond to your query.. One is Joel Stevick, who wrote the Wollongong
NFS Client (also runs over the UCX stack), the other is David Kashtan who 
wrote the TGV NFS Client.. Maybe they will take pity and respond. If I were 
you I would go and buy one of the two pieces of software..(naturally I think 
you should buy ours ;-) Both I believe took at least 1 year of invested 
engineering time to get to the point where you would want to use it.. Both are
excellently engineered... 


-Larry.
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: MAIL Logical name doesn't work.
From: don@zl2tnm.gen.nz (Don Stokes)
Date: 26 Sep 92 00:16:44 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Wolery

SZYMON@ucinvl.uci.agh.edu.pl ("Szymon Sokol") writes:
> Well then, is it possible to permanently SET TRANSPORT ? It is rather annoying

<sigh>

It *is* permanent.  You don't need to SET TRANSPORT every time you start up
MAIL.  Did you try it?

--
Don Stokes, ZL2TNM (DS555)                        don@zl2tnm.gen.nz (home)
Network Manager, Computing Services Centre            don@vuw.ac.nz (work)
Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand              +64-4-495-5052
From: oberman@ptavv.llnl.gov
Newsgroups: comp.os.vms
Subject: Re: Seeking beta sites for Pony Express mail gateway
Date: 29 Sep 92 16:28:18 GMT

In article <1a81pdINN718@gap.caltech.edu>, carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Carl J Lydick) writes:
> In article <10480@gollum.twg.com>, deven@twg.com (Deven) writes:
> 
> [29 lines of shameless advertising omitted]
> 
>>	Currently we are soliciting beta sites to run the new Pony Express 
>>	mailer to test the BITNET and UUCP support.  If you would like to be 
>>	a beta site, please contact:
> 
> Did anyone else think this seemed more like a commercial than a request for
> beta test sites?

Yes, it did. And it's not the first time. 

While people like Reese and other technical types are very valuable members of
the community, when the marketing types discover the net, it can cause
problems. The last time was about 2 years ago, but I don't remember who the TWG
person was. May have been someone else, entirely. Either way, a quick refresher
on acceptable use and non-commercialism would probably be appropriate.

If it does not happen again, I will chalk it up to inexperience on net.culture.
If it keeps up, then some pressure on the comapny may be in order. But as an
admitted fan of one of their competitors' products, I don't think I want to be
involved beyond this note.

R. Kevin Oberman			Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
Internet: koberman@llnl.gov		(510) 422-6955

Disclaimer: Don't take this too seriously. I just like to improve my typing
and probably don't really know anything useful about anything.