From: dxf12@po.cwru.edu (Douglas Fowler)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian
Subject: Re: "Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him."
Date: 3 Oct 92 06:24:49 GMT
Reply-To: dxf12@po.cwru.edu (Douglas Fowler)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)

In a previous article, DSIMON@thor.nafb.trw.com (D_SIMON) says:

>Job 13:15 says, "Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him."
>
>My question is how loyal should a person be to God?  Would you
>trust, serve, love, and work for God even if He killed you?
     Ah, but He is going to kill us as the penalty for sin.  Those of us
who believe in Jesus can escape damnation, though.

>Even if you knew He was planning to send you to hell anyways?
     This is a tricky one; I must admit that I would be hard pressed to,
because I feel that I am repentent enough, having asked Jesus to be my
Lord, to go to Heaven.
     I'm not so sure if, before the message of salvation through Christ
in the New Testament, one would say 'no'.  More about that after your next
group of comments, though.

>Job believed in eternal life, but I don't think that he was
>absolutely certain.  But he remained faithful to God even though
>(it appeared) God had forsaken him.
>
>These are somewhat theoretical questions, but they have practical
>import as well.  Sometimes a person (such as Job) experiences such
>terrible loss and tragedy that they think that God has forsaken them.
>And sometimes they die in the midst of their tragedy.  We advise them
>to remain faithful to God because it all pays off in the end (heaven).
>But should we be faithful to God only because of what WE can get out of it?
>If faithfulness to God DIDN'T pay off (e.g. if there was no heaven, 
>or if the person knew somehow that he was going to hell anyways) 
>would there be any possibility of encouraging the person to remain 
>faithful to God?

     I admit, I tend to mostly read the NT when I read the Bible.  I'll have
to look at the book of Job again, but I know that, as Jesus said, the prophets
longed for His coming.  They remained faithful to God even though there
was no resurrection at that time; only when Jesus died and rose from Hell
(the fundamental part of faith, IMHO, as it shows He died for sinners, too)
did it occur.  I have somtimes wondered if Job and the others knew that they
would have to spend some time in Hell because they were sinners before
being raised up via the Lord.  If this is the case, they did not know when
Jesus would come, only that He would.  Hence, people like Job may well have
known, or at least suspected, that they would be condemned anyway.  And, I
don't remember Job making mention of a Savior coming, so in his case it could
be argued that he had no hope. (As I said, I would have to re-read.)  If this
is the case, here is a man who did just that - remained faithful even though
he knew God may condemn him.
     I think it would be much harder now, since we have the promise of
salvation through Jesus.  Still, though, some believe that they will suffer
in Purgatory.  This is not the same as Hell, but it could still be very hard.
     So, is there any possibility of a person remaining faithful to God,
keeping the commandments and the like.  Yes.  Is it highly probable?  Job
was a man of exceptional patience.  Those who believe in Purgatory still have
something to look forward to in the end, so if we don't count them, I'd say
there is a rather low probability.  Perhaps this need for reassurance through
Jesus is why He is so important.
-- 
Doug Fowler: dxf12@po.CWRU.edu      :    "Every baby born into the world is
Real home: Canton, Ohio             :  finer than the last."--Charles Dickens
 Trying to follow in the path of our :     "A baby is an inestimable
Lord;anything close will be a success:  blessing and bother."--Mark Twain