From: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com (Bill McGarry)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.l-hcap
Subject: Handicap Digest # 2971
Date: 14 Oct 92 06:00:27 GMT
Reply-To: Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Approved-By:  Bill McGarry <wtm@SHELDEV.SHEL.ISC-BR.COM>


                             THE HANDICAP DIGEST

                                 Issue # 2971

                         Wednesday, October 14, 1992

Today's Topics:


                                ******


                               Re: S.I.G.N.S.
                              Re: DEAF DRIVERS
                                 S.i.g.n.s.
                              re: Hearing Aids
                               Sign References
                         Re: How to get on other bbs
                               New Born Deafie
                                 Relay Texas
                                re:S.i.g.n.s.
                               re:Deafie world


                                ******


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                              Bill McGarry (Moderator)
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Subject: Re: S.I.G.N.S.
From: Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'keeffe)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/26 - SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 RC> Thanks.... Got that one! It's good for the basics... but I'm
 RC> looking for shop specific signs. These seem to be rare...

Rick, I'm aware that Prof. Richard Amore and Susan Rhode at East
Stroudsburg (PA) University have done some research with shop specific
signs at Tobyhanna Army Depot.  I have no idea whether or to what extent
their work would be transferrable to bookbinding.  The major interest
was development of a voice-to-sign translation system and chose shop
specific signs as a manageable subset to work with.

If you'd like to contact them, the address is Dept. of Computer Science;
East Stroudsburg Univ.;East Stroudsburg, PA 18301.

--
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Internet: Jack.O'keeffe@f26.n129.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: Re: DEAF DRIVERS
From: Joel.Kogen@f1.n107.z94.fidonet.org (Joel Kogen)
Organization: FidoNet node 94:107/1 - Net 107 Technical O, Edison NJ


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 I can understand that when i was taking my Sing lange Class we
 meet a few person that are H.I./or Deaf and how the drive is the
 Pay more Att to the Roads and use the Right and left and reviewer
 mirrors all the time with drive that don't have h.I. and or Deaf
 the usely just look at the Right and left mirro and not the reviere mirro.
 I know this for a Fact since i run a local REACT team in IL that
 Pill all the Accient Report but that a Differt storry.
//
 take care.
/s

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Internet: Joel.Kogen@f1.n107.z94.fidonet.org




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Subject: S.i.g.n.s.
From: Rick.Catania@f22.n230.z1.fidonet.org (Rick Catania)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:230/22 - The Special Needs B, Whiting IN


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

PC>Just a word of caution at this point....you may already have this under
PC>control....but make sure you have representation on your committee doing thi
PC>work who are "Native" users of American Sign Language if you want your work
PC>to have any semblance of acceptance by the Deaf Community.

PC>Up Thumb, Paul."

Thanks Paul!  Well.... The way I feel is that whether the Deaf Community
accepts this or not is besides the point. It would be nice if they
did...  The major objective here is to present the instruction to
students in a way they may understand it. By chance these students are
deaf. My son is a student who will be affected by the outcome of this
project. If it helps him learn.... then I'm all for it.

Despite the fact that notifications have been sent out, Deaf
organizations have been notified directly, there has not been any one
which fits the "Native users of American Sign Language" category
volunteering their time and efforts.

As I figure they're just people.... They have their own personal things
they're involved in... that they want to do... The invitation is always
open.

We could always kidnap a few reps and force them to sit through our
meetings/workshops.... heh heh   Sorry about that...

Take Care...

Rick

 * SLMR 2.1 #T375 * Help is appreciated when it's needed...

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!230!22!Rick.Catania
Internet: Rick.Catania@f22.n230.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: re: Hearing Aids
From: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Steve Brother)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:369/11.1 - The Branch Office, Pompano Beach FL


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

MO>HELLO THERE! I AM NEW ON THIS THING.  I ALSO LIKE TO LEARN MORE ABOUT
MO>HEARING AIDS MYSELF. I WEAR TWO HEARING AIDS AND RIGHT NOW THEY ARE
MO>SEVEN YEARS OLD!  SO I AM PLANNING TO LOOK FOR NEW ONES SOON.  SO
MO>ANYBODY OUT THERE GOT SOME PARTICULAR BRAND YOU RECOMMEND?

Since I became Deaf and wheelchair confined from a four car accident in
'89 I found that OCTICON E38P is the best, but you really should go and
talk to ENT (Ear Nose Throat) doc and a Hearing Aid Specailist and see
where you hearing level is at. The E38 is the most powerful hearing aid
that can be worn behind the ear. BUT BE CAREFUL! If your hearing loss is
not profound, then its not for you. Check it out first with the Hearing
Aid Specialist.

                                        -- Deafie.

                                                sk.

 * OLX 2.1 * Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic

--
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Internet: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: Sign References
From: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Steve Brother)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:369/11.1 - The Branch Office, Pompano Beach FL


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

JK> you might like to Try the
JK> The Joy Of Signing
JK>By Lottie L. Riekehof
JK> The ISBN# 0-88243-518-3
JK>  Sorry I don't recalled the Price i think it around 20.00
JK>  you can call you local book store I know waldan Books carrie it.
JK>  ( if the have any left.)

There's alot of sign language books out there, but the question is, Do
you want to learn sign or do you want to learn ASL (American Sign
Language) that the Deaf use?

I found the BEST books are:

A Basic Course in American Sign Language
by Tom Humpries and Carol Padden

American Sign Language (four books 3 are student versions, one teacher)
by Dennis Cokely and Charlotte Baker

The "ABC in ASL" book tends to be more on vocabulary but it give the
basics to ASL. "American Sign Language" focuses more on the language
than on the vocabulary. Both are published thru T.J. Publishers, Inc.

 * OLX 2.1 * Hello, I am part number ||#||||#||#||#||

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!369!11.1!Steve.Brother
Internet: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: Re: How to get on other bbs
From: Bob.Hay@p3.f54.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Bob Hay)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:105/54.3 - JOBS BBS, Portland OR


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 > IMHO, our problem is that hearing aid manufacturers do not perceive
 > hearing aid users as their market.  The manufacturers sell to the
 > hearing aid dealers, so that is the bunch they cater to - not us.
 > The dealers are interested in a simple product they can sell quickly for
 > a huge markup, one that does not require they invest in expensive
 > fitting equipment.  Until the marketing situation changes, I doubt we
 > can expect significant technological progress.

I think you have some good points there.  Contrast that with the eyeglass
industry which is very sensitive to user desires and as a result there are
many options.  Granted some of them are glitz, but there are a lot of choices.

Maybe the average hearing aid buyer just isn't very demanding.  When i got my
first aid, my audiologist showed me the options, i picked one that seemed good
and i am still wearing it 12 years later.  Now, when i go back to pick out
number three i will be much more picky and do some serious shopping around for
features.

A good aid, i think, should not only give good performance but also minimize
the number of weirdies you need to deal with everyday (feedback from something
moving in close proximity, using the telephone, exposure to bursts of noise,
etc. ).  These things, if poorly handled, can cause stress which we try to
ignore but is there nontheless.

bh.

--
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Internet: Bob.Hay@p3.f54.n105.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: New Born Deafie
From: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:124/2120 - Fingers Talk, Irving TX


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 TB> Gosh, sorry, didn't mean to offend you.  I've read, "heard" and used
 TB> the term in SF Bay area for a couple years now.  I agree, some folk
 TB> do think "hearies & deafies" sets things up like "us vs them" but
 TB> it's just been a newspaper-note abbreviation.  English is the
 TB> culprit (as usual)...."deaf" being an adjective and "hear" being
 TB> a verb.   I was also limited by Wildcat! subject line length.

Oh, you didn't offend me, I just gave you my opionion.  The above
statement from you is exactly WHY there are so many groups.  What
the Deaf Culturists don't realize is that as long as they try to
isolate themselves into separate groups, the harder it is for
ALL of us to work together.  It doesn't matter if one is deaf/
Deaf/HoH, we all share a common bond.

 TB> From what I've seen of modern American's, any parent should go
 TB> for counseling/training/support.  "Murphy Brown" may be fiction
 TB> but it has some basis in reality.

I am not sure I agree with you - getting involved with support groups
is great but I don't always see the point of counseling.

 TB> These parents are sensible, but this is novel territory for them and
 TB> their duaghter's sibs.

I imagine it is true but parents shouldn't always go by what others
say - the best education is to get involved with support groups
as well as check out research material but at the same time, do what
they think is best for their child, not what someone else tells them
is best.

 TB> This strikes me as the same main-streaming (or oralism) that I got
 TB> caught in.  It also sounds like some of the "war" that's going on
 TB> this year about the colear (sp?) implant for children.

What is wrong with mainstreaming?  In the long run, mainstreaming
is really the best route to go.  Also, with cochlear implants for
children - I think this is a great opportunity to help the future
generation of deaf/HoH children.  Granted, they don't work for
everyone but who knows, with all of the new technology improving
daily, what benefits deaf/HoH children might gain from the cochlear
implants?  No one should deny the children this chance to try
them out if they are eligible for them.

 TB> I've heard both sides.  I haven't made up my mind. And I _DON'T_ want
 TB> this to flame out of hand and have the moderator slap my typing
 TB> wrists.

As the moderator, I think you are having a little trouble differentiating
my messages.  I'm not posting as a moderator - I'm posting as ME on
a personal level.  I do not slap others for having a different
viewpoint from mine - I just have problems with one who posts such
negative messages and consistently keeps others riled.  To date, there
has only been one person who did that and he chose to leave this
echo.  He never could figure out what he was doing and ignored any
helpful tips from others.

We all are here to have fun, share information, our life experiences
and well as make new friends.

I'll be sharing with you some more information with you later on.
Stay tuned until 11 for the latest!  (grin)

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!124!2120!Ann.Stalnaker
Internet: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: Relay Texas
From: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:124/2120 - Fingers Talk, Irving TX


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

Relay Texas has implemented a new regulation that requires each
RA (Relay Agent) to identify whether they are female or male.

When the RA's take your call, they identify themselves using
their agent number with either a F or M beside the number.

I personally like this new regulation very much as I've always
wondered if the agent I was conversing with was a male or
female.  <Curious Anniewich as always! ;-)>

While this new regulation is an improvement, it is nice to
know the service is continuing to operate under the professional
standard that it should.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!124!2120!Ann.Stalnaker
Internet: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: re:S.i.g.n.s.
From: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Steve Brother)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:369/11.1 - The Branch Office, Pompano Beach FL


AS>. . . . . . There are many
AS>deaf/HoH folks who use PSE and SEE, so ASL is not the only
AS>sign language.

True, but remember all PSE and SEE is based upon ASL. ASL is the true
sign language. PSE and SEE techinally are not sign languages.

AS>--- Maximus 2.01wb
AS> * Origin: Fingers Talk BBS - *DFW USA* - (214)513-0861   (1:124/2120)

 * OLX 2.1 * ... SENILE.COM found . . . Out of Memory . . .

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!369!11.1!Steve.Brother
Internet: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: re:Deafie world
From: Steve.Brother@p1.f11.n369.z1.fidonet.org (Steve Brother)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:369/11.1 - The Branch Office, Pompano Beach FL


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

MO>I didn't learn anything about deafness and its culture until I went to
MO>Gallaudet University.  I  often wished I learn to sign prior entering
MO>Gallaudet, I never realized  how much I was missing information in
MO>public schools.  I strongly  believe that no matter how much 'hearing'
MO>the deaf kid have, they should have the right to use sign language as
MO>another means to communicate.

MO>Well, I hope I didn't step on any toes in discussing this issue!  Its
MO>gets real personal.  Its even tough on deaf/hard of hearing individuals
MO>who have ability to use their speech with others who don't sign.  I get
MO>mixed feelings as to where to I belong.  I wonder is there are others
MO>who feel the same way I do.  I get annoyed when people say, but you
MO>speak so well why do you want to call yourself DEAF?

heh - I feel the same way. Back in 1989, I was involved in a four car
accident. I was the worst of them all cuz my truck was the first one
that got rear-ended then pushed into another car in front of me and so
on. Just a few months later, I became profoundly deaf (110 db in both
ears). What makes it an interesting was the fact I was learning sign
language to become an interpreter. I wanted to do free-lance
interpreting to supplement my income while attending college.

Now, at this point, I had two options. One, I could try and assimilate
myself back into the hearing world by lipreading alone. Since I grew up
as a hearing person for 21 years, I know my way around. I can voice
perfectly, and all I had to do is learn how to lipread. Two, I could
continue learning sign language as another way for me to understand
conversations and communicate.

At first, my parents discouraged me to learn sign. "You don't need to
know it" I was told by my mom (she also held onto the idea that I was
still hearing, which led into a breakdown in our relationship). When
asked by other people of why learing sign language I relpied "Why not?"
I'm deaf. I should know how to sign was my reasoning. If you were going
to work with a deaf person you should know sign. Its the same reason
like if you were going to work with French people, you should know how
to speak french, right?

I found out that sign make life easier. When I went back to college, I
used interpreters. I didn't have to worry about missing information from
the teacher when facing away or talking while writing on the blackboard
or when a student  sitting behind me asking a question. I had the
interpreter right there in front of me, getting everything that was be
spoken in the classroom. I also like it cuz I can't always depend on
lipreading alone. Sometimes I misunderstood what was being said to me.
Other times, it was the person themselves. They either talk to fast or
they mutter. On men if they have a mustache or beard, it almost
impossible at times to comprehend of what is being said.

What really helped me out was the Deaf themselves. They helped me out. A
friend of mine named John became deaf at the age of 3, but he could
voice and lipread, but he preferred signing. For 63 years, that's what
he did. I met him at the Deaf club, and I told him about my problems. He
even helped me out on tricks of lipreading, like looking up on the lips
instead of down when someone mutters or little lip movement, stuff like
that. When I asked him "Do you consider yourself Deaf or Hard of
Hearing?"

he relpied (in sign): HEAR you-SAME-me. THINK-YOURSELF, DEAF,
HARD-OF-HEARING, WHICH? ("Your hearing loss is just the same as mine, so
what do you think of yourself, deaf or hard of hearing?")

DEAF, I sign

WHY?

KNOW SIGN, I sign

VOICE, LIPREAD, YOU CAN. THINK DEAF, WHY?

you-SAME-me? ("you can also voice and lipread like me?" I signed back)

GROW-UP, DEAF, ME. STATE SCHOOL me-GO. GROW-UP HEARING YOU. THINK DEAF,
WHY? ("I grew up Deaf. I went to the State School for the Deaf (in NY).
     But you grew up as a hearing person. So why do you consider
     yourself Deaf?")

Good question I thought. Why do I consider myself Deaf? Sign is one of
them. Well here it is. I signed:

DEAF VALUE, SUPPORT. LIKE DEAF. LIKE A-S-L. LOVE SIGN. (facial exp:
condition sentence) INDEX(point at)- thumb finger, SIGN, INDEX-index
finger, LIPREAD, CHOICE -thumb finger

translation: I support Deaf values. I like being deaf, and I like ASL. I
love to sign. If I had a choice to Sign or lipread, I rather Sign.

                              -Deafie.
                              sksk

 * OLX 2.1 * Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic

--
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                                ******

                  End of Issue # 2971 of the Handicap Digest

                                ******
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU