From: kenny@osf.org (Kenneth Crudup)
Subject: Re: BLACK ATHEISM
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 09:07:17 GMT

In article <1471600051@igc.apc.org> Ralph Dumain <rdumain@igc.apc.org> writes:

>(1) Do you keep your attitude toward religion strictly to yourself
>and a few confidantes, or do you feel free to mention it openly?

I don't bring it up unless asked- trying to press my beliefs upon others
is the province of the "faithful".

>(2) Have you experienced or do you fear ostracism because of your
>non- or anti-religious orientation?

For the most part (see #3 for some exceptions), screw 'em if they can't
handle it. I've got my own life to live.

>(3) Do your family members accept your attitude to religion, or 
>are they hostile, especially female family members?

My mother just knows I'm going to hell and is always trying to convince
me to repent. There are some older, (female) members of my family that I
haven't "outed" myself to yet, because I don't want to hear all the bullshit.

>(4) Were you brought up with religion?  What made you reject it,
>or did it just never stick?

I'm descended of Southern Blacks. Religion comes hand-in-hand with that, of
course.

Why do I reject it? I can't, as an intelligent person, do several things:

<1> - stomach the idea of a (single, or more, depending on whom you talk to)
omnipotent God who is responsible for everything from the Sun in the morning
to raising the dead.  My feeling is that religions came about from a need
for ancient peoples to be able to explain away what they couldn't understand-
if they had no pat explanation for something, it was due to "God". There are
many things that Mankind will never understand, but quite a few we do that we
don't need a deity available to provide a quick explanation.

<2> - For the sake of argument, lets just say there's a God out there.
Which one is the "real" one? I was raised Christian because my mother is
Christian, but if I had been born at another time, or to another set of people
I would have been Jewish, or Islamic, or Buddhist... you get the idea. I
believe that a moral value system is all you need, and you can therefore
dispense with all the Hail Marys or the Tithing or the Satyrs or the praying
to Mecca, etc. I don't see why an organized religion is necessary for that.

<3> - see why the hell many American Black people are so entrenched in a
religion that is not only our own, but it was used to justify enslaving us.
It's so damn stupid, it's tragic.

<4> - give a lot of credit to people whom I see are some of the biggest
hypocrites around. How many religious "leaders" have gotten into trouble?
How many religious people do you know (by "religious" I mean those always
espousing their God, and have a holier-than-thou attitude, for example) who
"only drink a little" or "only swear a little" or only "cheat a little" or
whatever- I don't care about what what they do or don't do, its just they
claim to be so into their own religion, but break all of it's rules. The
extremists like Wildmon, et al., are in a class to be despised by themselves-
I don't need someone to force their beliefs on me, or anyone else.

<5> - comprehend all the stupidity. Despite "love your man as brothers" the
Jews hate the Arabs hate the Christians (who can't stand each other- the
Protestants hate the Catholics) hate the Moslems, etc. Hell, there's
"holy wars"! Gimme a break.

<6> - I have a mind of my own. There's too much "lemming mentality" among
the faithful for me. My opinion is that the only thing separating the
Jim Jones Georgetown cult and your neighborhood First Baptist Church is a
matter of degree. "Getting Happy" and "speaking in tongues"? Mass hysteria.

As for if there's an afterlife, and what it's like, I'm willing to wait and
see. I'm more concerned with making something of what's here and now, the
only reality I truly know.

>(5) Do you feel that blacks are more die-hard religionists than 
>other groups, or do you think the degree of religiosity is 
>comparable to others in the same region of the country or with 
>a similar educational level?

I think we (Blacks) are more religious than most other groups, IMHO. Actually,
I think there are too many of us who use it as a crutch.

>(6) How do you feel about the power and prevalence of clergymen 
>as leaders in the black community?
>(7) Do you feel that religion has impeded the black community, 
>and in what way?

One thing I can't fault organized religion for is it's role as a moral and
communal focal point for the Black community. Its one place we can get to-
gether and get things done in the community, etc. What I don't think helps
us is the "social club" attitude of every church I've been in.

>(8) What connection do you see if any between black religion and
>politics and the quality of today's leaders?

I don't really see any, as I haven't been looking, but I think Church and
State need to stay far, far apart.

>(9) Do you think there is a connection between religiosity (or 
>lack thereof) and hatred towards other groups (Jews, Koreans, 
>Hispanics, etc.)?  Or for that matter a propensity toward 
>conspiracy theories?

Have no real idea.

>(10) How prevalent do you think paranormal, occult, and pseudo-
>scientific beliefs (voodoo, astrology, dream books, etc.) are in
>the black community, and do they bother you?

I don't know or care about those things. There are a whole lot of us who
read, but also actually believe those horoscopes, which, I'm sure you've
already surmised, I think are complete bullshit. Witness all the ads on 
BET for "Psychic Advisors", 900-numbers that people can call to get
paranormal advice. Bet they're making a mint. We can be so damn gullible
sometimes.

>(11) Are there any particular negative experiences regarding
>religion that you have had?

Not really. I guess I just woke up one morning and decided that this whole
idea of organized religion was a huge waste of time.

>(12) Do you have close friendships outside of your own racial/
>ethnic group, and do you think your atheism/skepticism is somehow
>a contributing factor?
(and)
>(13) If you are male, do you know any female black atheists?

I don't really care about someone's religious beliefs (unless they are
trying to press something on me, which in that case they're history- I don't
have time for the pain), so I couldn't tell you.

>(14) Do you know of famous black historical figures who are/were
>atheists/freethinkers?  Do you know of any that we do not?

Nope.

>(14a) Does it matter to you one way or the other?

Couldn't care less.

	-Kenny

p.s.- what is this, a survey? :-)

-- 
Kenny Crudup, Contractor, OSF DCE QA
OSF, 11 Cambridge Center, Cambridge, MA 02142	+1 617 621 7306
kenny@osf.osf.org			OSF has nothing to do with this post.
	  Religion: The longest-running gag ever played on Mankind.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,triangle.politics,talk.politics.misc