HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: skenny@pico.engr.mun.ca (Shawn Kenny)
Subject: Re: Birthday bumps
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 15:35:47 GMT

spain@galvia.enet.dec.com () writes:

>--

>|>>In article <1992Aug26.002041.17665@microsoft.com> georgere@microsoft.com (George V. Reilly) writes:
>|>>>When I was growing up in Dublin, we had a rather ugly custom of
>|>>>giving somebody the "bumps" on their birthday.
>|>>>Does this happen anywhere else? 

>Yah also in Limerick, another variation apart from dropping someone was for
>people to take turns to kick the recepient as he was thrown in the air.

>A friend of mine hates to see it happen now as he knew somebody that ended up paralysed after getting bumps during his wedding reception.

>|---------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
>          U.S.A. here we come
>          God thinks he's Jackie Charlton
>       Gary Spain, DEC, Galway, Ireland   - spain@galvia.enet.dec.com
>|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------|

It happened when I was younger in Nova Scotia and Newfoundland (15-20
years ago) but I don't see that "tradition" today.
--
=================================
skenny@pico.engr.mun.ca
St. John's, NF, CANADA
"Have a touton or do without'n !"
From: downey@enh.nist.gov
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re:  FYI - Politics in NI
Date: 4 Sep 92 02:26:06 GMT
Organization: NIST


mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach) writes:
> As for "Celtic symbols," I think you should distinguish between
> the Celtic regions as they actually are, and the romantic image
> of celticry as people who read and sword-and-sorcery novels
> would like them to be.

mark@cs.hw.ac.uk (Mark Riordan) writes:
> Good Point

Mathhew,

You repeatedly insist on bringing up the "romanticization" of Celtic
culture, Celtic history, etc.  May I point out that all cultures
contain some degree of romanticism and yes, I agree with you that
history has oftentimes been romanticized.  Maybe that is part of
human nature, but that is another debate.

When I related the information that a Celtic symbol had been used
in NI by a republican, I was interested in the power of Celtic
symbols.  In America, our flag is a powerful symbol that can invoke
and provoke many emotions depending on the context in which it is
used.  All cultures use (and have) such symbols.  I was searching
for an answer from a critical and/or historical perspective, not
another complaint about so-called "celticry and sword-and-sorcery
novels," to use your words.

Laura
downey@enh.nist.gov
From: mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Celtic Cross
Date: 3 Sep 92 09:19:51 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, QMW, University of London, UK.

From: sej@allspice.unx.sas.com (Samuel Johnson)
>I have sat by and read this celtic cross thread for a while now thinking
>"Well, I'll finally learn the real origin of this symbol." Then I noticed
>that the thread took a different turn: one of christianity bashing.
>I'm not suprised at this, the current rise in such sentiment can be seen
>everywhere in the states especially on the nightly news or television shows\
>where any christian is automatically branded as a "right wing extremist
>who refuses to accept anyONE who doesn't believe exactly as they do."

What a load of nonsense. The fact is that church attendance
figures in the USA are massive compared to those in Europe and
the dominance of the Christian religion is huge - no politician
dare admit not to being a Christian of some sort (Jews in this
context being regarded as honorary Christians). I read a recent
opinion poll which showed that over 40% of people in the USA
believed in Biblical Creationism, a position which is regarded
here as associated only with the more extreme fundamentalist
fringes of Christianity.

Is it not Christians themselves who should be blamed for the
association of Christianity with "right wing" extremism. I mean
not only those at the fundamentalist fringe who seem quite
happy to associate themselves with right-wing politics, and who
seem quite happy to call themselves "Christian" without any
qualifying label, despite the fact that their ideology has
nothing to do with real Christianity and everything to do with
20th century capitalism, but also those other Christians who
stand quietly by and let them get on with hijacking the name
"Christian".

Matthew Huntbach
From: soren@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Barratt Moy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Celtic Harps?
Date: 28 Aug 92 04:06:32 GMT
Distribution: soc.culture.celtic
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois, USA

Hello there

I have recently heard lots of really great Celtic Harp music.  And I am    
considering learning how to play it.  Could anyone tell me how difficult it is?
Or how much the harps cost?  Or lessons?  Or if they know anyone who teaches in 
the Chicagoland area?

THanks

Soren
From: swade@ocf.berkeley.edu (Wade Shen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: FYI - Politics in NI
Date: 3 Sep 1992 18:05:18 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: tempest.berkeley.edu


You shouldn't generalize on the topic of the racial stock of the Irish
Protestant.  The fact is that they majority of Irish Protestants are 
from English speaking backrounds, but many are from Irish speaking backrounds.
MANY are from Scotland, and some are from the highland regions where they
spoke and still (to some extent) speak a goidellic language.

And although you are correct in pointing out that the usage and revival
of the Irish language has primarily been a symbol of republican sympathies
recently, its revival actually begins at about the turn of the century in
the form of a literary renaissance in Ireland.

Thanks.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: dooley@helios.physics.utoronto.ca (Kevin Dooley)
Subject: Re: Birthday bumps
Organization: University of Toronto Physics/Astronomy/CITA
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 14:34:43 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.132727.23814@rdg.dec.com> spain@galvia.enet.dec.com () writes:
>--
>
>|>>In article <1992Aug26.002041.17665@microsoft.com> georgere@microsoft.com (George V. Reilly) writes:
>|>>>When I was growing up in Dublin, we had a rather ugly custom of
>|>>>giving somebody the "bumps" on their birthday.
>|>>>Does this happen anywhere else? 
>
>Yah also in Limerick, another variation apart from dropping someone was for
>people to take turns to kick the recepient as he was thrown in the air.
>
>A friend of mine hates to see it happen now as he knew somebody that 
> ended up paralysed after getting bumps during his wedding reception.

Is that an Irish custom?  It was common back home in Saskatoon (Canada)
also, and there are very few Irish people who settled that area, it is
mostly Ukrainian, German, northern European and some English.  We did
both the ordinary bumps and also occasionally the 'kicking' variant
mentioned above.

	Kevin
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: stacey@aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu (Stacey B. Martin)
Subject: Maeve
Originator: usenet@essex.ecn.uoknor.edu
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 13:39:53 GMT
Organization: AUS

(I hope this one gets posted - sigh). 

Is the hill or mountain outside Sligo that has the rock mound on top
the grave of Queen Maeve? 

Thanks-
Stacey
From: mark@cs.hw.ac.uk (Mark Riordan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: FYI - Politics in NI
Date: 3 Sep 92 13:28:05 GMT
Organization: Dept of Computing & Electrical Engineering, Heriot-Watt University, Scotland

In article <1992Sep2.141447.21832@dcs.qmw.ac.uk> mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach) writes:
>From: smckinty@sunicnc.France.Sun.COM (Steve McKinty - Sun ICNC)
>In article <31AUG92.10125231@enh.nist.gov>, downey@enh.nist.gov writes:
>
>        > How important are Celtic symbols in NI?  Is Irish spoken or
>        > taught much in NI?  These are just a few questions that popped
>        > into my head while I was watching the show.
>        >
>tongue, and there is nowhere in NI which is naturally Irish
>speaking. It has however been adopted as a symbol by those of
>Republican sympathies, to the extent that there are some who
>are said to be bringing up their children speaking it as the
>first language, though for the parents it would be a
>textbook-learnt language.

This is a rather dangerous generalisation. Adoption of Irish by
those with Republican sympathies has indeed been happening but
it represents a very small percentage of the amount of activity
concerning the Irish language. 

To associate Irish totally with catholics is while probably true
in NI it is not the case elsewhere in Ireland. For instance
the present Church of Ireland Archbishop of Dublin is a fluent
Irish speaker. 

>As for "Celtic symbols", I think you should distinguish between
>the Celtic regions as they actually are, and the romantic image
>of celticry as people who read and sword-and-sorcery novels
>would like them to be.

Good Point

>
>Matthew Huntbach


-- 
| JANET:    mark@uk.ac.hw.cs   Mark Riordan,                                 |
| Internet: mark@cs.hw.ac.uk   Dept of Computing and Electrical Engineering, |
| (031) 449-5111 x4172         Heriot-Watt University, Edinburgh, Scotland.  |
From: mcgraw@titan.Kodak.COM (Edward McGraw)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: re: Celtic recordings
Date: 31 Aug 92 18:26:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: eastman.3582
Organization: Eastman Kodak Co., Rochester, NY

From mcgraw Mon Aug 31 12:55:41 1992
To: mcgraw@titan
Subject: Recordings


Some good Celtic Recordings, not in any particular order:

Nollaig Casey - 'Lead the Knave' 
Chieftains - 4, Live, and RCA 5798 w/J. Galway
Tommy Peoples - Solo 7012
Tom McHaile - OLP 1001
Craobh Rua - BTB010
Chris Droney - Gael 102
J. Daly & S. Creagh - CEF 057
DeDannan - Sh79005, SIF 3040
Ceoltoiri Laighean - CEF 035
Kilfenora Ceili Band - STAL 1013
Sean Maguire - 33AV139
Matt Molloy - LUN 004
Cherish the Ladies - GLCD1119
Winston Scotty Fitzgerald - any Celtic issue
Jimmy ShandUs Band - of the 50's - 78 reissues
Austin Stack Ceili Band - 1 cut on 'Irish Phonograph', EMI
Trian (Carroll, McComisky, Sproule) - FF70586
Na Fili - SOLP1010
Sean OURiada - CEF032
Leo Rowsome - CC1
Frankie Gavin (Frankie Goes to Town) - BKL 001
McCusker Brothers Ceili Band - 33AV138

The above is mostly instrumental, and a painful attempt to 
limit the list from a 40 year collection of Celtic material.
Maybe vocals and Celtic related stuff some other time.
Ted.      mcgraw@titan.kodak.com
From: cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: FYI - Politics in NI
Date: 3 Sep 92 11:34:03 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, Scotland
In-reply-to: walker@sun.soe.clarkson.edu's message of 2 Sep 92 16:13:10 GMT

In article <1992Sep2.161310.6476@news.clarkson.edu> walker@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Graham Walker, 227 West Old Main,268-3847,) writes:

   I do not want to sound like a pedant on this point (but I am going to
   nevertheless), but the settlers of which you speak were mostly Scots,
   and if the point is push it can be argued that originally they can from
   Irland in the 500s(?), therefore Irish Gaelic is part of their
   inheritance also (even though it was a little further back).

The peoples of Scotland variously spoke Norse, Gaelic, Inglis (later Scots),
and Welsh.  I would think that most of the Scottish settlers spoke Scots when
they moved to Ulster, though I don't know for sure.
--
	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Offensive - Impure Mathematics
From: Henry Corcoran <CORCORAN@NDSUVM1.BITNET>
Date: Tuesday, 25 Aug 1992 15:37:33 CDT
Organization: North Dakota Higher Education Computer Network

Here, here
From: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Robert Kee
Date: 27 Aug 92 13:59:39 GMT
Reply-To: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Organization: COMANDOS Project, Glesga Yoonie

dam@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (David Morning) wrote:
> gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell) writes:
> rlwilliams@gallua.gallaudet.edu writes:
>>> I saw an add for a series of three books by Robert Klee... a "green flag" 
>>> series... I wonder if anyone has read it and what he/she might think of 
>>> it...
>>  Could you post any info you find on this? I've been trying to find a source
>> for the Ireland series that was narrated by Klee on PBS (I assume it was a
>> BBC production originally) and also a copy of the book "Green Flag" - I have
>> not been able to find either....
> I think this should be Robert Kee - not Klee.
> The TV series was called "A History of Ireland". If you're referring to the
> book of the series, it was called, surprise, 'A History of Ireland'.

Different book.  "The Green Flag" dates from 1972; I've only seen the three
volume paperback series.  "A History of Ireland" is a one-volume
abridgement from 1980.  Library of Congress catalogue entry (and why does
somebody in the UK end up providing this information to Americans???):

   Type of Material: Book
     LC Call Number: DA950 .K43 1972b
             Author: Kee, Robert.
              Title: The green flag; a history of Irish nationalism.
   Publication Info: London, Weidenfeld and Nicolson [1972]
  Phys. Description: 877 p. illus. 24 cm.
              Notes: Bibliography: p. 823-839.
           Subjects: Ireland--Politics and government--19th century.
           Subjects: Ireland--Politics and government--20th century.
           Subjects: Irish question.
     LC Card Number:    72186086
               ISBN: 0-297-17987-X


The only book of Kee's I've read is his history of PICTURE POST, which is
pretty good.

-- 
--  Jack Campin    room G092, Computing Science Department, Glasgow University,
17 Lilybank Gardens, Glasgow G12 8RZ, Scotland   TEL: 041 339 8855 x6854 (work)
INTERNET: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk or via nsfnet-relay.ac.uk    FAX: 041 330 4913
BANG!net: via mcsun and uknet     BITNET: via UKACRL    UUCP: jack@glasgow.uucp
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,sci.physics,sci.misc
From: fred@iapetus.earth.nwu.edu (Fred Marton)
Subject: Re: Impure Mathematics
Organization: Geological Sciences Department, Northwestern University
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 22:37:50 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.220526.9695@noao.edu> muller@noao.edu (Beatrice Muller) writes:
>Well, I am sure you could use mathematical terms in a funny way without
>reference to rape. Rape is never funny or cute!
>
>Beatrice

my point was that one should be able to laugh at one's self
(i was replying to the point of roles being switched, not the
act itself).  i've just come across too many people without
that ability and it irkes me, especially when they say i don't
have the right (or am insensitive, or whatever) to make fun of
myself.  

fred

-- 
 
 *****************************************************************************
 **   F. Cung Marton              **    "You're looking at me as if this    **
 **   fred@earth.nwu.edu          **    weren't a scientific explanation."  **
From: balewis@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Birthday bumps
Date: 26 Aug 92 13:20:43 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <42301@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk>, mic@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Murray Cole) writes:

> In article <1992Aug26.002041.17665@microsoft.com> georgere@microsoft.com 
>  (George V. Reilly) writes:
>>When I was growing up in Dublin, we had a rather ugly custom of
>>giving somebody the "bumps" on their birthday.
>>Does this happen anywhere else? 
> 
> Certainly used to happen in deepest Fife, just as you reported. Hardier
> victims were just dropped for the last "bump".

It seems that this custom is fairly widespread. It certainly used to
happen in Berkshire and Oxfordshire, and I'd be very surprised to hear that
it had died out! A friend tells me that it's not unknown in parts of Wales,
either. 

Bridget Lewis
University of Oxford
balewis@vax.ox.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,alt.pagan
From: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn)
Subject: Re: free lionfood! (was: Celtic Cross)
Organization: Digital Equipment Co. Ltd., Reading, England
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 08:13:10 GMT


In article <2AA5BEBE.7901@ics.uci.edu>, pkammer@alesia.ics.uci.edu (Peter Kammer) writes...
>	Oh BTW, one extra note.  The inverted cross _can_ be a christian
>symbol, under the name of "The Cross of Peter."  Peter didn't consider himself
>worthy to die in the same manner as Christ.  Tradition is they accomodated
>him by hanging him upside down.
> 
And there's also the St. Andrew's cross.

Craig

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Craig Cockburn, Digital Equipment Co. Ltd, Reading, England.     Suas
  Internet: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com                           leis
  UUCP:..!decwrl!edieng.enet.dec.com!cockburn                      a'
                                                                   Gha\idhlig!
  Views here are my own, and are not necessarily those of Digital
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:5675 sci.physics:13765 sci.misc:1535
From: toms@fcs260c2.ncifcrf.gov (Tom Schneider)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,sci.physics,sci.misc
Subject: Re: Impure Mathematics
Date: 28 Aug 92 20:21:14 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.celtic
Organization: Frederick Cancer Research and Development Center

In article <1992Aug27.182603.28922@newshost.lanl.gov> jlg@cochiti.lanl.gov
(Jim Giles) writes:

>In article <suzanne.74@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com>, suzanne@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com (Suzanne Barrett) writes:
>|>     COPY OF ENTIRE STORY POSTED *AGAIN*

> it's about as old as the century

At least 10 to 12 years since I first heard it.

> It is, however, inconsistent to *both* distribute it *and* condemn it.

Yup, and a waste of bandwidth.

  Tom Schneider
  National Cancer Institute
  Laboratory of Mathematical Biology
  Frederick, Maryland  21702-1201
  toms@ncifcrf.gov
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn)
Subject: Re: Need help with pronunciation
Organization: Digital Equipment Co. Ltd., Reading, England
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 07:27:38 GMT


In article <1992Sep1.214326.20796@aio.jsc.nasa.gov>, daggs@l42bb.jsc.nasa.gov (Clark) writes...
> 
>	Can anyone give me some guidance on Gaelic pronunciation? I am
>pretty much ignorant of it. Thanks
> 
Which Gaelic- Irish, Scottish or Manx?
Any particular region? eg. Donegal, Skye, etc 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Craig Cockburn, Digital Equipment Co. Ltd, Reading, England.     Suas
  Internet: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com                           leis
  UUCP:..!decwrl!edieng.enet.dec.com!cockburn                      a'
                                                                   Gha\idhlig!
  Views here are my own, and are not necessarily those of Digital
From: oconnell@vms.macc.wisc.edu (Kevin Patrick O'Connell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Irish Times subscription info--got any??
Date: 1 Sep 92 16:50:18 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin Academic Computing Center


Does anyone have an address to which I can write for a subscription to 
the Irish Times?  How much does it cost?  Can I get just the weekend 
or Sunday edition?  What other Irish periodicals are 
amusing/interesting/inflammatory/otherwise notable?  Does Dublin have 
a Fleet Street-style scandal sheet?

Are there well-loved columnists in the Irish Times (or other 
publications?  

Please post yer answers here on the net--perhaps more folks would like 
to read 'em!

Thanks, 

Kevin
From: ccsdgdc@gdr.bath.ac.uk (Douglas Clark)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: close
Date: 27 Aug 92 09:45:18 GMT
Organization: Bath University Computing Services, UK

In article <1992Aug26.221940.1@gallua.gallaudet.edu> rlwilliams@gallua.gallaudet.edu writes:
>I saw an add for a series of three books by Robert Klee... a "green flag" 
>series... I wonder if anyone has read it and what he/she might think of 
>it...
>
>rlwilliams@gallua


'The Green Flag' by Robert Kee is published in three volumes by Penguin.
I think it an excellent history of Ireland laying bare the bones of
the Troubles.
-- 
Douglas Clark                                  Voice : +44 225 826039
Regional Services,                       JANET : D.G.D.Clark@uk.ac.bath
Bath University Computing Services, UUCP : ...uunet!mcsun!uknet!gdr!D.G.D.Clark
Bath, Avon, England BA2 7AY    ARPA : D.G.D.Clark%bath.ac.uk@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: suzanne@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com (Suzanne Barrett)
Subject: Re: FYI - Politics in NI
Organization: Lockheed Santa Cruz, CA.
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 14:09:03 GMT

In article <184hsaINN37a@grapevine.EBay.Sun.COM> smckinty@sunicnc.France.Sun.COM (Steve McKinty - Sun ICNC) writes:

>In article <92246.132552CORCORAN@NDSUVM1.BITNET>, CORCORAN@NDSUVM1.BITNET (Henry Corcoran) writes:
>> If Irish language has disappeared to the extant you say,this is unfortunate.
>> Not just because of a romantic ideal, but any language is a fudamental part
>> of culture. It defines how one looks at the world and the way we think and
>> approach problems and life in general.
>> 
>The original question was about N. Ireland, where Irish is rarely used, but
>there are other (rather remote) areas in which it is still the first language.
>There is an Irish-language radio service, and both TV stations have programs
>in Irish. It used to be the case that you needed a qualification in Irish to
>get a job in the Civil Service, anyone know if that is still true?

>Steve

Steve,
  In '89 I did an article for a Dublin-based publication on Irish colleges 
in the gaeltacht.  I was informed by one of the college managers that Irish 
is still required for government jobs.
  Suzanne
-----
suzanne@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:5648 sci.physics:13677 sci.misc:1524
From: mitchell@oac3.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Philip Mitchell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,sci.physics,sci.misc
Subject: Re: Impure Mathematics
Date: 27 Aug 1992 14:11:30 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.celtic
Organization: UT Health Science Center Houston

In article <1992Aug26.214334.5602@news.acns.nwu.edu> fred@iapetus.earth.nwu.edu (Fred Marton) writes:
>In article <1992Aug26.185715.5040@noao.edu> muller@noao.edu (Beatrice Muller) writes:
>>
>>I totally agree Suzanne! I wonder if they found it funny if the two
>>genders would have been reversed!
>>
>>Beatrice
>
>sure, why not?  it's known as having a sense of humor.
>
>fred

Without belaboring the point...

     Oh look!  What a collection of mathematical puns, and put together in
     a story.  How amusing!

     Oh, but the story portrays the assault and rape of a woman.  That's a
     real problem, in which real people are physically and mentally scarred,
     and from which recovery is difficult.  It has been compounded in the 
     past by an attitude that projects the 'blame' onto the victim or that
     refuses to recognize this violence as a crime at all, because 'boys 
     will be boys.'  And it is a crime that is only recently being recognized
     as a crime of violence against the individual.  Since this recognition
     is so late in coming, there are probably a lot of people who are 
     sensitive to the issue, and will be mad as hell if someone suggests,
     in whatever way, that rape should be considered in any other way.

Reversing the genders does not really convey the same emotion since most 
men never have to worry about it (note the 'most'...there are exceptions to 
everything).  Maybe a 'funny' story full of puns about war atrocities, read
to the victims, would produce more comparable results.

-- 

   Phil Mitchell                                 Office of Academic Computing
   UT Health Science Center          6431 Fannin MSB 4.022, Houston, TX 77030
   voice: (713) 794-1189              internet: mitchell@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic