HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: king@ssvax.gte.com (Larry King)
Subject: Re: Clark traded from the Sox?
Organization: GTE/SCSD
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 17:06:24 GMT

In today's Boston Globe they reported that Clark is going to see a
shoulder specialist about some recurring stiffness he has been having.
They think that they will have to do orthopedic surgery to find the
problem.  If they do, Clark is gone for the season.  On a side note,
Clark will NOT be a member of the Red Sox next year.  Management is
going to buyout his last year, probably by this upcoming weekend.  I
think Jack, along with Reardon knew that they were gone when the west
coast road trip started. 

--
Larry King
GTE Government Systems, Needham, MA    		(617) 455-3384 
E-Mail : king%ssvax.dnet@get.com
From: rsmith@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Russ Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Analysis of Canseco Trade
Date: 1 Sep 92 15:34:21 GMT
Organization: Olivetti ATC; Cupertino CA, USA

In article <18026nINN9lb@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> sfh@po.CWRU.Edu (Steven F. Hubbard) writes:
>   I agree that most of Oakland's free agents will  be let go after the season.
>However, I think they will also make an effort to sign Steinbach.  A quality
>catcher who hits is difficult to find -- he'd also be valuable to a team trying
>to raise some young starters.  

They may not be able to sign Steinbach even if they want to. Steinbach has
been hinting that he is considering signing with the Twins next year because
he's from Minnesota and would like to go back there, settle down, and raise
his family there. Assuming the Twins would be interested(and Brian Harper
is pretty good), its a very logical choice to sign him.




Russ Smith
*******************************************************************************
"A bank is a place where they lend you an umbrella in fair weather, and ask
for it back again when it begins to rain."
                                          Robert Frost
********************************************************************************





>SfH
>
>        
>
>-- 
>Steven F. Hubbard                 **  That restaurant is so crowded that 
>Case Western Reserve University   **    nobody goes there anymore. 
>Department of Physics             ** 
>Cleveland, OH 44106               **                   Yogi Berra


Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: savoy@hg.uleth.ca (Jim Savoy)
Subject: The Change-Up
Reply-To: savoy@hg.uleth.ca
Organization: University of Lethbridge
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 23:25:56 GMT


A while back, someone asked how a change-up was thrown and what motion it
takes, and since none of the net.pitchers responded (or perhaps because it
is so obvious to everyone that they left it alone!), I ventured a guess:
At first I said that it was a ball that starts out one way and then suddenly
breaks the other (unlike a curveball, which has a uniform breaking motion).
But then I scrapped that and said that a change-up might just be a slow
fastball (a misleading "change" of speeds, thus the term "change-up"). 
I received a few mail messages suggesting that the latter was correct, and
after watching the Mets-Reds game on ESPN on Sunday, I now know that the
latter is indeed correct. Joe Morgan showed how Belcher (I think it was Belcher
he isolated on) threw his change-up. He said that the grip is weaker than the
tight fastball grip, causing the pitch to look like it's coming in as hard as
the previously-thrown fastballs, when it really is quite a bit slower. And
I guess gravity might cause it to drop a bit too. Case closed.

 _____________________________________________________________________________
     Jim Savoy          University Of Lethbridge         savoy@hg.uleth.ca

 Mr. Neutron: This is a nice area.
 Mr. Entrail: It's like a bloody graveyard. I hate it.
 Mr. Neutron: It's handy for the shops and convenient for the West End.
 Mr. Entrail: If you like going to the West End. I think it's a stinking dump.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: hymowitz@whatever.cs.jhu.edu (Hymie!)
Subject: Re: Collusion or Sanity?
Organization: Creative Sensualities dept, Jacquie's House of Underwear
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 21:49:41 GMT

i almost wonder if, in the near future, we're going to see some baseball
owners filing chapter 11, and slicing a 'zero' off the end of every salary.
could the owners do this en masse and force the mlpba into a renegotiation
a la the misl's $66,000 salary cap?

plenty of people say that the owners have plenty of money to cover
these $6,000,000+ salaries.  i wouldn't bet on that money lasting a lot
longer.  the new tv contract is going to be less.  unless the economy
turns around, more fans will not be going out to the ball game (as in 
pittsburgh).  which means less people buying $4.00 beers.

--hymie
hymowitz@cs.jhu.edu                                         hymie@jhuvms.bitnet
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From where you are, can you see Grand Central Parkway?  You can?
Then you're lost.                                                --Edith Bunker
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: sybesmer@uther.calvin.edu (Eric W Sybesma)
Subject: Re: Blockbuster Trade
Organization: Calvin College
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:07:47 GMT

king@ssvax.gte.com (Larry King) writes:


>	As far as this season goes, they should have no problem holding
>onto the West.  Minnesota has won 3 straight but I don't think they will
>make up the 6 games they need.  Look for them to finish 2 or 3 back. 
>Oakland should be able to beat whoever comes out of the east and then
>the WS looks interesting but if it is Atlanta, I think Atlanta will 
>win.  

	Before we jump to conclusions,  Oakland gained 8 games on the
Twins in one month of baseball.  There is one month of baseball to be
played.   Despite a horrendous August, the Twins lead the A's in
pitching, hitting, and RBIs.  Statistically, the Twins are a better
team than the A's, except in the W-L column.  I would not be a bit
surprised if the Twins take the A.L. West.  After next week Wednesday,
the story will be more developed.

	Let's enjoy the race, instead of proclaiming it over.

				E.S.
--
Home Address and Phone               Internet addresses  
Eric Sybesma   (616) 243-5913        School: sybesmer@uther.calvin.edu
514 E. Burton St.                    Work:  (E-mail only) (616) 241-7280
Grand Rapids  MI  49507                   sybesma@benzie.si.com
From: f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: bonds for justice
Date: 26 Aug 92 22:07:16 GMT
Distribution: na,local
Organization: University of Arizona
Nntp-Posting-User: f67700241

In article <bone.714852175@luciano.Stanford.EDU>, bone@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Douglas J. Bone) writes:
> What could one get for Justice?

A lot, since he was ROY a mere 2 years ago and his basic skills haven't
eroded.

> How old is Bonds?

28, a couple of years older, I think.

> Who do you think will have the better career-- Justice or Gant?  I would
> have said Justice last year and would be still so inclined, though his
> injuries are worrisome (a bad back this year, not on DL since early Spring).

This is tough to answer, you can make a case either way.

If it were my team, I'd choose Gant:

He's fast enough to play center field,
he's a good power-speed player,
he has the same ability to take a walk (led Atlanta last year)
not injury-prone.

All this makes it more likely he'll be playing after Justice is
retired.

Now, if the Pirates are REALLY sure that they won't sign Bonds after
the season, I'd say they should trade for whatever they can get.  Bonds
for Justice makes sense in that context.  If the Braves threw in a
prospect (Kelly Mann?), it would be even more of a no-brainer.
-- 
Greg "Mockingbird" Franklin      Interviewer: "Sir, how do you spell relief?"
f67700241@ccit.arizona.edu               Dan: "R-O-L-A-I-D-S-E."
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: eboritz@watarts.uwaterloo.ca (Efrim Boritz)
Subject: Re: Boggs Toronto bound?
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:56:23 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.120739.2125@merrimack.edu> desmondw@merrimack.edu writes:
>
>how great it would be if the Jays snatched him [Boggs]in the off season. They
>definately could use a good hitting 3rd baseman(Grubers lousy) and they
>REALLY need a lead off hitter which Boggs also does well. He is the perfect
>addition to the Jays lineup. Take a look:

Have you ever checked out Boggs' stats outside of Fenway.  He has a *major*
home field advantage.  He is not a solution for the Jays.  Yes, they need a
new 3rd baseman, but Jeff Kent will do for now. Leadoff? Why not Alomar?

>
>                            1. Boggs (3rd base)
>                            2. Alomar(2nd base)
>                            3. Carter(OF)
>                            4. Winfield(DH)
>                            5. Olerud (1st base)

Why does everyone (including Cito) put Olerud down here? Bat him third.
Hell, bat him second.

>                            6. Maldanado (OF)
>                            7. White (OF)
			replace with Bell - Devo is great in the field but what a bat
>                            8. Borders(C)
>                            9. Lee (S)
>   This looks pretty unbeatable to me!
>                                                Bill


Nick.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: hasch@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu (Bruce M Hasch)
Subject: Re: Orioles sign 30 year lease
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: The Johns Hopkins University - HCF
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 22:44:00 GMT

In article <1992Sep2.120642.21857@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu>, satrape@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (James V Satrape) writes...
> 
>In today's (9/2) Baltimore Sun: the Orioles and the city of Baltimore
>agree to a 30 year lease for Camden Yards, replacing the 15 year agreement
>the Orioles signed prior to construction of the new park.

Great!!  We Baltimoreans have are quite paranoid about losing the Orioles, 
especially after the loss of the Colts eight years ago (I can still see those
Mayflower vans...).  I've got a feeling that the expansion slated for next
year is going to be the last one for a LONG time, and there are going to be 
a lot of cities trying to steal franchises away from others.
           (We've already seen the beginning of this...)

>  Other than
>the extension of the term, the primary change seems to be in the way
>the stadium rent is determined.  Previously, the Orioles rent was a
>percentage of their "profits", they typically paid high rent in years
>they did very well, and sometimes no rent in other years.  Recently, this
>formula has caused some problems between the tenant and landlord, specifically
>related to what expenses could be deducted from the gross income.  The
>new formula gives Baltimore city a cut of the ticket sales, concessions,
>parking, and advertising.

A few years ago, the city was QUITE annoyed when Jacobs deducted the cost of
the damages awarded to the players as a result of one of the collusion 
rulings.  I think this was the impetus behind the new contract.

Although it would have been really comical to see Jacobs try to explain
how the O's didn't make any money this year...

> 
>Rumor is that Eli Jacobs is trying to sell the team, and the recent 
>actions (signing of Ripken and new lease) are designed to make the team
>seem more appealling.  (Take it for what it's worth, I didn't make up the
>rumor).

Recently, Jacobs defaulted on a $20 million or so loan to a local bank.  
Apparently, the Orioles were not involved in the loan in any way (as collateral
or whatnot), but Jacobs may be having financial problems.  The rumors about
Jacobs selling the team have been going around for a LONG time, and I'm
not about to believe them at this point.  

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bruce 'Slower than Sam Horn' Hasch             hasch@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu
Brad Pennington Fan Club                       O's all the way in '92!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: spira@panix.com (Greg "Sarcasm Is A Way Of Life" Spira)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: DAVID CONE TO BLUE JAYS
Date: 30 Aug 92 21:11:32 GMT
Organization: Boo!

In <5307@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek) writes:

>David Cone's pathetic debut, Kevin Mitchell's poor year and Gary Shefield's
>sudden hitting prowes has brought an question to mind.  Has there been any 
>National League player that's been able to make the transition to the American 
>League with any degree of success?  In the last few years that is.   

Well, Shane Mack and Roberto Alomar come to mind.  Candy Maldonado has
done better since moving over to the AL.  Dennis Eckersley, of course.
Rafael Palmeiro became a star after he switched to the AL, though he's
had a bad year this year.  Greg Jeffries and Keith Miller are both hitting
better in the AL than they had recently in the NL, and Kevin McReynolds
is doing about the same.    

Greg
-- 
  spira@panix.com       "The one-O delivery to Fisk.  He swings.  Long drive,  
 cmcl2!panix!spira      left field!  If it stays fair, it's gone!  Home Run!"  
158-17 Riverside Dr.                     Ned Martin, 10/22/75   
Whitestone NY 11357          (Insert your favorite baseball moment here) 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: sweda@css.itd.umich.edu (Sean Sweda)
Subject: Re: DAVID CONE TO BLUE JAYS
Organization: University of Michigan ITD Consulting and Support Services
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 20:55:21 GMT

In article <5309@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek) writes:
>
>Actually from what I hear it goes more like this...
>
>IF Hojo isn't traded, and there's still a good chance of that happening,
>he will go back to third.  The Mets are now openly saying that he gave it
>his best shot but the experiment was a failure.  Assuming Johnson doesn't
>get traded and the PTBNL is Thompson next year's Mets should look something
>like this...
>
>1B Dave Magadan 	(Murray signed for only one year didn't he?)
>2B Jeff Kent    	(his natural position)
>3B Howard Johnson 	(got a better idea?)
>SS Kevin Elster/	(I know what you're saying but read the last paragraph) 
>   Dick Schofield 
>CF Ryan Thompson	(if he's really the PTBNL)
>RF Bobby Bonilla	
>LF Vince Coleman	(Though I suspect they won't be able to resist the 
>			 temptation of trying to sign Bonds, they never learn)
>C  Hundley     
>
>Of course this is just my best guess based on what I hear on the New York 
>radio.  And all subject to revision pending the expansion draft results and
>the annual free agent feeding frenzy.  
>

Actually Murray (sigh) signed a 2-year deal, and rumor has it that the
contract includes a clause which forces the Mets to protect him.  

I'm able to get WFAN sometimes here in Ann Arbor, but I haven't been
able to listen recently.  Ideally I think this would be the best lineup:

1b - find a way to get rid of Murray's salary, put HoJo here.  I've 
been wondering for years why the Mets haven't tried him there, he couldn't
possibly do as much damage defensively as in CF or at 3B.

2b - Kent.  Looks like a young Bobby Grich type to me...

3b - Magadan if he'll resign at a reasonable amount, if he wants more
than 1 or 1.5 mil a season, then a Donnels/Pecota platoon here is 
acceptable.

ss - Schofield/Elster/Pecota it doesn't really matter, even when we
were good our shortstops sucked.  Personally I don't think Elster is
the answer, his so called "pop" is pretty overrated and if his arm is
shot, he's no defensive asset.

lf - Coleman if we can't get rid of him, otherwise a Boston, Gallagher
platoon would work ok.

cf - Barry Bonds.  See my comments at the end.

rf - Bonilla

c - Hundley, O'Brien, and Sasser

rotation - Saberhagen, Gooden, Fernandez, FA pitcher, Whitehurst/Schourek

closer - Anthony Young

With the money saved by dumping Murray, Coleman (hopefully), Franco, and
Magadan (if he wants big-time cash), we can afford to go after Bonds and
a pitcher like Swindell.

Mets management is going to have to "face the facts", if they don't try
to put a team out there that is capable of winnig the division they are
going to continue to see shrinking attendence.  The only way to do this
is to sign Bonds and replace Cone, if they don't commit to that then
not only will they continue to stink, but nobody will care either.

c-ya

Sean
From: wwr@calmasd.prime.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Needed: Stats Wizard to answer question.
Date: 1 Sep 92 17:04:05 GMT
Organization: Computervision - A Division of Prime Computer

I need some help with some, actually, *a* statistic -- namely attendance.

If anyone out there has stats for the week of the August 23 to August 29, I
would be deeply in debted to them.  (If you're in San Diego, Padres tickets on
me, or if you're going to be visiting San Deigo, you too can be one of the few
who attend; I'd happily bribe you with tickets :)

Thanks in advance... walter
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Bri Farenell)
Subject: Re: Red Sox poll?
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 16:22:28 GMT

tedward@cs.cornell.edu (Edward [Ted] Fischer) writes:
>Depending on what he gets for them or signs with the now-freed salary,
>the Sox might even be competitive in '93.  But only if they keep the
>young core of Plantier, Vaughn, Wedge, Valentin, Cooper, and Zupcic
>intact to supplement Clemens, Viola, Dopson, and Harris pitching.
						
Again, what about their only hitter having a good season, Jody Reed.

>Clemens may not win his 4th CY, but he still rules!	tedward@cs.cornell.edu

No kidding!

--------------------------------------------------------------------
BRI FARENELL			           GO ADIRONDACK RED WINGS
CLARKSON '95			         1992 CALDER CUP CHAMPIONS!!
FARENEBT@CRAFT.CAMP.CLARKSON.EDU   Calder Cup Champs: 1981 1986 1989 1992
					
rec.sport.hockey's AHL contact

"Hockey must be a great game to survive what the NHL has done to it."
		---Howard Baldwin, Penguins' owner

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: claudius@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: Clearing Waivers
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 92 22:32:12 GMT

In article <la25c0INN9p2@mizar.usc.edu> pcaster@mizar.usc.edu (Dodger) writes:
>Can someone please answer this question?
>
>How is it possible that Cone cleared waivers when just two
>weeks ago, Bobby Ojeda DID NOT clear waivers.
>
>Seems to me the rest of the National League WANTS to see the
>Dodgers finish in last place.  It makes no sense that a
>pitcher of Cone's quality could sail through, yet Ojeda
>was blocked.

Because the rest of the major leagues know that if Cone were traded, the team
that trades for him would have to give up talent to do so, while Ojeda could
have been had for essentially nothing.
From: ken@mizar.tcs.com (Ken Emery)
Subject: Eckersly was (Kreuger trade & a though on Witt)
Organization: Teknekron Communications Inc.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 16:54:58 GMT

In article <17vv28INN36r@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> dxf12@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas Fowler) writes:
>
>     Didn't think I could get here between classes and scoop anyone, but
>you've missed the Kreuger-to-Montreal trade the Twins made.  It wasn't as
>big, probably, as the Orioles' one, let alone the real biggie of the season.
>     Now, my thought on my the Athletics got Witt as well.  Well, 2, actually.
>Number one, as part of their rebuilding project, keeping only a few free
>agents, everyone should remember a fellow named Dave Stewart they picked up
>in '86 off the scrap heap.  I imagine Larussa figures that could happen again
>with Bobby Witt suddenly finding himself.
>     My second is, suppose they're not re-signing Eck.  Couldn't they just
The A's have signed Eck to a two year 7.5 million contract earlier this
month.
>
>send Witt to the Instructional League, teach him to go with just the fastball
>and one other pitch, and turn him into Goose Gossage II. (Goose from his
>days with the Yanks, not now.)  Maybe Witt's control will be better when he
>doesn't try to overthrow, but just goes out for an inning every time, like
>Eckersley did.  Would Larussa and Alderson have been thinking that?
>     It's gonna be a great series between the last-hurrah A's and the Braves. 
>-- 
>Doug Fowler: dxf12@po.CWRU.edu      :    "Every baby born into the world is
>Real home: Canton, Ohio             :  finer than the last."--Charles Dickens
> Trying to follow in the path of our :     "A baby is an inestimable
>Lord;anything close will be a success:  blessing and bother."--Mark Twain
Bye,
ken emery
(the trade sucks rental on two players for 30 days and a never was pitcher 
for a superstar, texas wins hands down).
GO A'S

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: ron@osf.org (Ron Birnbaum)
Subject: Re: Jose Canseco to Texas...
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 18:20:29 GMT

In article <55947@olivea.atc.olivetti.com>, rsmith@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Russ Smith) writes:
|> 
|> According to today's SJ Mercury News, Canseco is 28, Sierra is 26(Witt
|> is 27 and Russell is 30). Sierra is considered to be a disruptive influence
|> in Texas' clubhouse, 

  Who considers Sierra a disruptive influence?? I've heard the guy's a 
  gentleman! Maybe the fact that he's a free agent is a bit disruptive this
  year - but the guy sure is no Canseco or Henderson. Rueben is very popular
  with his teammates, from what I've heard. But in Boston we're pretty far
  from Texas, so perhaps I haven't heard everything about him - please
  give some details!


 Wonder Years,
-Ron

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: sckelm@iastate.edu (Steven C Kelm)
Subject: Players value
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 17:37:55 GMT

I'm interested in the opinions of the net regarding some players 
who have not had the seasons that were expected of them.  I'm listing
five players but feel free to add to the list.  How do the hometown 
fans feel about them, how does management, and what would be needed 
in trade for them, i.e. untouchable, you can have him, etc. 

Chuck Finley - regarded as one of the better lefties in baseball, but 
               having a horrendous year.

Phil Plantier - picked as probable ROY before season started, now in minors.

Derek Bell - another pre-season ROY but can't seem to crack the line-up,
             which is amazing when you think of the year Devon White has had

Todd Zeile - see earlier net discussions

Andy Benes - seems to be more of a victim of spotty run support than 
             anything, but the world was expecting a break-through year.
             I think he has the ability to be one of the best pitchers 
             in baseball.  It's too bad the owners seem to only see the 
             pitchers W-L column, which really doesn't mean much.

David West - just kidding! (I think only his mother and Andy MacPhail 
             think he will ever amount to anything.)
               
Any and all comments welcome!

Steven Kelm


Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball