HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: New Insight on Headaches
Organization: AT&T
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 21:31:22 GMT

In article <1992Nov2.142452.150@nntpd.school.edu> dave@school.edu writes:
>AP 11/05 20:51 EST V0386
>Copyright 1992. The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.
>   LONDON (AP) -- "Not tonight honey, I'll get a headache" is more than an
>excuse for people who truly suffer from sex-induced headaches, doctors say.
>
>   A new Danish study reassures those who get headaches only after orgasms that
>they may have a temporary problem. 

I imagine this may be caused by having sex with ugly people.

GMS
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: eager@eagercon.com (Michael J. Eager)
Subject: Re: Voting Analysis
Reply-To: eager@eagercon.com
Organization: Eager Consulting
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 01:47:58 GMT

In article 3407@nntpd.lkg.dec.com, edp@math.zk3.dec.com (Eric Postpischil) writes:
>In article <mike_steiner-101192123813@192.35.50.131>,
>mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner) writes:
>
>>The fact remains that if a statistically significant number of people do
>>not vote, the only thing that can be determined from this fact alone is
>>that x% of the people (or stated number of people) did not vote.
>
>How can you state that is a fact when I have given a counterexample that
>disproves it?  You have not addressed the counterexample at all.
>
>>This reason is so prevelant that it drowns
>>out any other "message" any individual might want to send by not voting,
>
>Ah, yes, the "drowns out" principle of information theory.  I'm sure
>that was an epiphany of scientific insight, but I seemed to have missed
>the announcement.  Would you be so kind as to give me a reference to
>some published work on "drowning out" messages so that I can study it?
>
>>and is the only one considered by politicians and the press.
>
>The politicians and the press are not the only people who participate in
>and affect government and society.


Yeh, how about them Cubs.

---
Michael J. Eager		Michael.Eager@eagercon.com
Eager Consulting		(415) 325-8077 
1960 Park Boulevard, Palo Alto, CA 94306-1141

Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: skh4161@mvs.draper.com (Kjeld Hvatum)
Subject: Re: IQ Test Creation Question
Organization: Draper Laboratory
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:28:00 GMT


>From: "gilbert.m.stewart" <gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com>
>Message-ID: <1992Nov11.153255.15070@cbnewse.cb.att.com>
>
>>>Why not devise a problem that takes you a certain amount of time to
>>>complete and expect the "smarter" person to do it faster?
>>>
>>WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG.  If I pose problems at the 4th grade level
>
>I can see how one may jump to this conclusion.  However, it is a generalization
>and is wrong.  There are many questions which can be answered by employing
>an elegant solution, but for which there is a brute force method which takes
>longer available.  In these cases, the time factor is a useful measure of
>intelligence and, for that matter, creativity, which, I am told, is a harder
>quantity to evaluate.

This isn't a black-and-white issue in IQ and aptitude testing by
any means.  A few of the subtests on the Wechsler are pure speed,
while designers of aptitude tests like the GRE and SAT actually
try to make them not speeded.  It is pretty well known in the
testing community that shortening the time allowed for a test
like the SAT artificially increases its reliability (defined as
the "repeatability" of the score compared to the spread).

If the SAT seems a little speeded to some, it has more to do with the
practical constraints of test administration than anything else.  The
ETS has a criterion that about 80% should be able to reach the last
question on a section. They figure the other 20% are doing too poorly to
profit from extra time.

Here's a relevant passage, which I've posted before in this newsgroup,
from the book "Beyond IQ", 1985, by Robert J. Sternberg, well-known in
recent years for his work on human intelligence.  This is from the
chapter "Exceptional Intelligence", p. 290.

"We have avoided the extreme emphasis on speed of processing that
characterizes many psychometric and information-processing assessments
of intellectual skills.  We believe that despite the many fine features
of reaction time or speeded responses, in general, as dependent
variables, they need supplementation when one's goal is to understand or
assess intellectual giftedness.  We believe that what primarily
distinguishes the intellectually gifted in their performance is not that
they are faster, but that they are better in their insightful
problem-solving skills."
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper)
Subject: IG in Flevohof
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 16:10:07 GMT

So--did anyone go to the International Gathering?
Did you enjoy yourself?

--
Jean L. Cooper    (BITNET: JLC5F@virginia.edu   CIS: 70253,1114)
"The true University of these days is a Collection of Books." 
                                           --Carlyle                        
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: Marylin Vos Savant.  Personal info request <=****
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:41:47 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.145510.1557@nntpd.lkg.dec.com> edp@math.zk3.dec.com (Eric Postpischil) writes:
>In article <R1PVTB4w165w@iowegia.uucp>, quest@iowegia.uucp (Steve J.
>Quest) writes:
>
>>My first reaction to the name is "what a lucky person to have a 
>>last name of Savant".
>
>It might not be luck; a family might have been named for their
>characteristics.  I've been told "Postpischil" is Czechoslovakian for
>"quick witted".
>

I'll bet sarcasm is as hard to convey through nomenclature as it
is via the net.

GM("Being A Smarta**, As Usual")S
From: jcooley@miracle.com (John Cooley)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Transportation to RG's
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 92 01:38:36 EDT
Organization: Miracle Computer Consultants


Lorel writes:

>I have many times been in the unfortunate position of needing to bum a 
>ride to various Mensa events.  Please have a heart and do not criticize
>folks who ask for help.  I know that coordinating transportation for an
>entire RG load of people is a pain, but most would not ask if they were
>able to get themselves there.
                                
This sounds like Lorel's volunteering to be Boston Mensa's RG travel
co-ordinator!!!!   Yay!  (I always love it when people step forward
to volunteer!)

;^)   -John
       
 ==========================================================================
       John Cooley              Zappa as a waste management engineer: 
                                  "Hey, there, Brother!  Whatcha
    jcooley@miracle.com            doing with that Cosmic Debris?"
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Mensa Japan
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:14:47 GMT
Followup-To: rec.org.mensa

In article <1992Nov4.231539.23201@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>,
jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper) wrote:
> 
> The article of the Mensa Constitution that was cited in the
> derecognizing of Mensa Japan was IX.D.1, which says:
> 
> "A national Mensa may be derecognized by the Board after
> a full and fair investigation, if, in the opinion of the
> Board, the national Mensa has engaged in acts inimical to
> Mensa, has failed in a major way to perform its duties
> under this Constitution, or has tolerated irregularities
> in the testing and admission of new members."
> 
> That's all I know.
> 
> By the way, the "Board" mentioned here is the International
> Board of Directors.

I read that also.  However, I had previously read (and I don't remember
where) that Mensa Japan was derecognized because its membership had fallen
below the number that is required to be a national Mensa.  That's all that
I have seen or heard about the matter.                        

+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Now that I have a reader that can do .sigs, I can't think of a witty |
|one to put here, so I won't.  All normal disclaimers apply.          |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: More usefull dialogue about Canadian activities and other topics.
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 16:50:16 GMT

In article <BxHuqo.46B@cantua.canterbury.ac.nz> chisnall@cosc.canterbury.ac.nz (The Technicolour Throw-up) writes:
>From article <mike_steiner-301092144549@192.35.50.131>, by mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner):
>> You received a reply from someone who is not a Mensan, and who had a
>> humorous signature.  I replied to that signature with a humorous message. 
>> That, in turn, elicited a flame.
>
>Well here's a funny thing mike - people's taste in humour vary quite a lot.
>You replied to Steve's signature with a message you thought funny.   I
>personally thought it wasn't terribly funny.  Many people in this group no
>doubt also thought it funny (like you) and no doubt there were many others
>(like myself) who didn't think it funny.  When I saw your reply I was a
>little puzzled as to it.  It didn't look funny to me so, given your history
>of flaming, I took it that, for reasons unknown, you had decided to flame
>Steve.  Apparently, as you now explain, it wasn't a flame - but thats what it
>looked like to me (and probably to many others as well).  Does it not strike
>you as possible that Steve may perhaps have a different sense of humour from
>you and, like me, had come to the conclusion that you had flamed him and that
>he therefore replied in kind?

Or you're all just trying to be funny and nobody gets it.

GM("Occam's Reason")S
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Voting Analysis
Date: 10 Nov 92 20:42:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: 192.mike_steiner-101192123813
Followup-To: rec.org.mensa

In article <1992Nov9.150238.1762@nntpd.lkg.dec.com>, edp@math.zk3.dec.com
(Eric Postpischil) wrote...

...more of the same old stuff.

The fact remains that if a statistically significant number of people do
not vote, the only thing that can be determined from this fact alone is
that x% of the people (or stated number of people) did not vote.  A
person's not voting can be for any of a number of reasons, the most
prevelent being indifference.  This reason is so prevelant that it drowns
out any other "message" any individual might want to send by not voting,
and is the only one considered by politicians and the press.

+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Now that I have a reader that can do .sigs, I can't think of a witty |
|one to put here, so I won't.  All normal disclaimers apply.          |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: radams@BNR.CA (Rodney Adams)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: IQ Test Creation Question
Date: 9 Nov 92 21:11:11 GMT
Reply-To: "Rodney Adams" <RADAMS@BNR.CA>
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

In article <1992Nov9.075425.11655@eagercon.com>, eager@eagercon.com
(Michael J. Eager) writes:
|>You do not need superior intelligence to create questions.  IQ tests
are a range
|>of questions which are given within a specified time limit under very
specific
|>circumstances.  

Not all IQ tests have "a specified time limit under very specific
circumstances," 
examples of which are ISPE's W87, Hoeflin's Mega and Titan Tests, and
Langdon's 
LAIT and LIGHT.  In particular, Hoeflin's tests and Langdon's LIGHT not only 
lack a strict time limit, but they also allow the use of both reference
materials 
and, except for Titan, calculators.  All of the above tests are also
unsupervised.
Superior intelligence is, I would contend, more of a necessary
prerequisite for 
such tests, although some problem types, such as the aforementioned number
series problems, may be easier to devise than, for instance, a problem asking
for the number of bounded planes in an object composed of several
interpenetrating
geometrical solids.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Rodney G. Adams
The opinions expressed above are not necessarily those of my employer.
As if you didn't already know that....
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: rhs@world.std.com (Richard H Schwartz)
Subject: Re: Xerox of GMAT score OK for admission?
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 00:28:03 GMT

jcooley@miracle.com (John Cooley) writes:


> My question is: "Is it OK to xerox a friend's GMAT score to get into
> Mensa ?"

Sure.  Because you can't get in with a GMAT score.  Correct me if things
are different now, but when I "xerographically reproduced" my GMAT report,
GRE report, and SAT report and sent them in, I got back the GMAT report
with a nice letter that said something to the effect of "Sorry, but we
don't take GMAT scores.  We have forwarded your GRE and SAT scores to our
membership office..."


-- 
             Richard H. Schwartz, Scheduling Systems Inc.,
            1000 Massachusetts Avenue, Cambridge, MA  02138
                  (617) 864 8330; FAX (617) 864 8377
                          rhs@world.std.com
From: stein@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Halden Stein)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: IQ Test Creation Question
Date: 6 Nov 92 22:21:46 GMT
Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle

I understand how someone with an IQ greater than mine can develop
test items to judge my abilities. Who creates the test for someone
such as Marylin Vos Savant (highest IQ at the moment)? It seems that
the test creators would need to have higher IQs than the test takers.
From: rr@chem.ucsd.edu (Roxanne Rohmann)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Xerox of GMAT score OK for admission?
Date: 10 Nov 92 16:18:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: network.1dondjINNkfq
Organization: Chemistry Dept, UC San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: chedccf0.ucsd.edu

In article <09Nov92185719@miracle.com> jcooley@miracle.com (John Cooley) writes:
 > 
 >  My question is: "Is it OK to xerox a friend's GMAT score to get into
 >  Mensa ?"
 >                                 - John Cooley
 >                                   The Troublemaking LocSec of Boston Mensa

I seem to recall that something really close to that happened
out there in your neck of the woods already... A LocSec and a 
brother, wasn't it?

   ---Roxanne Rohmann
      (former LocSec) San Diego Mensa
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: johnson@sleipnir.mnesouth.corp.mot.com (Mark Johnson)
Subject: Re: Xerox of GMAT score OK for admission?
Reply-To: johnson@sleipnir.mnesouth.corp.mot.com
Organization: Motorola Wireless Enterprises, Schaumburg, IL
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:15:44 GMT

In article <09Nov92185719@miracle.com>, jcooley@miracle.com (John Cooley) writes:
=) My question is: "Is it OK to xerox a friend's GMAT score to get into
=) Mensa ?"

Well, I've heard the case made that cheating on the proctored test is an
acceptable way to get in.  After all, the proctors are Mensans, and if you
were able to outwit them...
-- 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| "Johnson"                              |Just because you're paranoid doesn't|
| johnson@sleipnir.mnesouth.corp.mot.com |   mean they're not out to get you. |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Let's face it; if our lawyers knew what went on here, they'd shut us down.  |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: bbs-phaedrus@jwt.UUCP (larry wink)
Subject: Re: IQ Test Creation Question
Reply-To: bbs-phaedrus@jwt.UUCP
Organization: The Matrix
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 13:16:40 GMT


hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:

>In article <4125@bcstec.ca.boeing.com> stein@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Halden
>Stein) writes:
>}I understand how someone with an IQ greater than mine can develop
>}test items to judge my abilities. Who creates the test for someone
>}such as Marylin Vos Savant (highest IQ at the moment)? It seems that
>}the test creators would need to have higher IQs than the test takers.

>I question your basic assumption.  By analogy, while not an Olympic class
>marksman myself, I'm certainly qualified to judge such a competition and
>even to train Olympic competitors.

I question your basic analogy.  An operational definition of a bulls-eye 
exists, so anyone can determine if a given competitor achieved the objective.  
There is no such operational definition of intelligence.

Having been educated in the physical sciences (physics, if it matters), I have 
always found it amusing that those in the social sciences have no concept of 
operational definitions.  The common thread in this newsgroup appears to 
mirror the social sciences perfectly.  Everyone talks about intelligence, 
admits they can't even produce a good conceptual definition, and then proceeds 
to argue the merits of different testing techniques.  Take a hint - when 
intelligent is properly defined, the definition will naturally include the 
method by which intelligence can be measured.  Standardized IQ tests measure 
standardized IQs (the social science's circle jerk) and have very little to do 
with measuring intelligence (and yes, I am a Mensan and have rarely scored 
less than 4 sigma on these standardized pieces of trash).

As to the less intelligent testing the intelligent, I find my patience well 
tested by discussions in this newsgroup.

 --Larry Wink
 Internet: fdmwink@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu or ljw@pro-magic.oau.org
 Bitnet: fdmwink@ucf1vm     Usenet: bbs-phaedrus@jwt.UUCP     GEnie: l.wink   
    "A Mind forever voyaging through strange seas of thought ... alone."
From: skh4161@mvs.draper.com (Kjeld Hvatum)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Analogy tests ( GRE general )
Date: 9 Nov 92 04:12:00 GMT
Organization: Draper Laboratory


>From: Frank Pinto <rolls@cis.umassd.edu>
>Message-ID: <BxBytD.I18@umassd.edu>
>...
>I wander if anyone has any meunomics or
>clues (hints)
>as to how to go through an analogy test?

Get "Practicing to Take the GRE General Test, No. 9", the latest in the
series of ETS bookslets containing released GRE's (real ones given in
the past).  Then practice, practice, practice...  For a more humorous
and cynical view of the best strategy (including some hints the ETS
won't tell you), get the Princeton Review book on the GRE too.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: scott@bogus.network.address (Scott Tai)
Subject: t: Moral Kiosk
Reply-To: scott@bogus.network.address (Scott Tai)
Organization: /usr/scott
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:42:34 GMT


moroney@ramblr.enet.dec.com writes:
: scott@tailab.org (Scott Tai) writes...
: > 
: >chorley@vms.ocom.okstate.edu writes:
: >: I was wrong about Scott Tai: the name is not a trekkie pun after all.
: >: Scott Andrew Tai, or S.A.T. for short, is the product of someone's warped 
: >: sense of humour:
: >: 	If the person/cipher exists, I invite it to come out of the 
: >: electronic closet and allow us to send e-mail to it.
: > 
: >One has only to dare!  It's mensa@nyx.cs.du.edu.
: 
: OK.  I dare the person(s) who posts as Scott Andrew Tai to reveal their true
: name, and the true username that they post from, which should be local
: to the taco.cc.ncsu.edu newsserver they forge from, and reachable via mail.
: 
: I Double dare.

That's not the plan.  You are welcome to torture me to death for your
amusement, only allow me to amuse myself a little in the same style,
and refrain from insult as much as you are able.  

mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner) writes:
: When the author of a message has a history of falsification and lies, the
: message should be judged by its author as well as by its contents.  When
: the author of a message makes himself the subject of criticism, then
: criticism of him is not out of order.

How can you deliberately get up such paltry falsehoods?  I have been so
far forbearing with you, sir; not that I was ignorant of your miserable,
degraded character, but I felt you were only partly responsible for
that; and some of the others on rec.org.mensa wishing to keep up your
acquaintance, I acquiesced--foolishly.  Your presence on r.o.m is a 
moral poison that would contaminate the most virtuous.

--Scott Andrew Tai

Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: IQ Test Creation Question
Organization: AT&T
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 15:16:40 GMT

In article <4125@bcstec.ca.boeing.com> stein@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Halden Stein) writes:
>I understand how someone with an IQ greater than mine can develop
>test items to judge my abilities. Who creates the test for someone
>such as Marylin Vos Savant (highest IQ at the moment)? It seems that
>the test creators would need to have higher IQs than the test takers.

I am told that MVS spent quite a lot of time studying various IQ tests
to improve her eventual score.  Assuming this is true, and, based upon
her written material, while not a dunce, she does not seem particularly
gifted at least verbally, it would not matter in her case how smart
the test makers were, since her goal would be to anticipate their
particular expectations, "right" or "wrong".

In any case, I disagree with your assumption.

GMS
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper)
Subject: Re: Help....college is killing me!!!!
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 17:20:45 GMT

I agree that the world isn't as bad as it's been
painted.  I enjoy my life a great deal, even though
it's hard work.  I really think that younger people
take things much too seriously--I look back at myself
at the age of 21, and shudder at how dumb I was and how
much I thought I knew.  It takes a certain ... perspective
... to get the true picture of the world, and age certainly
provides that perspective.

And, yes, one can control the world much more than one
may think, although it takes some effort and work.  The
people who feel controlled instead of controlling are 
those people who don't make the effort the take control
of their own destiny.
--
Jean L. Cooper    (BITNET: JLC5F@virginia.edu   CIS: 70253,1114)
"The true University of these days is a Collection of Books." 
                                           --Carlyle
From: yaros@sab57.larc.nasa.gov (Steve Yaros)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Transportation to RG's
Date: 12 Nov 1992 14:53:15 GMT
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, VA  USA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: sab57.larc.nasa.gov

Here in Tidewater Mensa, we rent a 15-person van for our Great Dismal Swamp RGs,
which we hold in mid-February.  We offer transportation to and from the Norfolk
Airport if the person takes the time and trouble to request it.  We've found that
it does not cause a big drain on the van or our time, and in a pinch we can ask
someone to use his POV for an airport run.  On Sunday, after the brunch, many
of our members volunteer their POVs for an airport run on their way home.

I must state, however, that we usually attract 125 people or so to the RG, so
we're really not a huge operation!

We have a special chairperson for the transportation who also arranges tours 
to local attractions and schedules the van for general schlepping.

                                                  Steve Yaros
                                                  Tidewater Mensa LocSec
                                                  and 10th GDSRG Registrar 

-- 
                           |                                                   
    Steve from Norfolk     | ...be aware that a walk through the river of most           
 yaros@sab57.nasa.larc.gov | people's souls would scarcely get your feet wet...
      804-864-3050         |                                  Deteriorata 1977
___________________________|____________________________________________________