HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sbb@panix.com (Steve Baumgarten)
Subject: Re: I'll be at PABA (was Re: Dr. Who replay score)
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 19:28:52 GMT

In article <C15xI9.55w@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Keefer) writes:

   Wow!  Someone else who has actually admitted to going to PAPA.  Oh, I
   guess I should say that I will be going (and so is Kevin).  Neither of
   us has been to one before, so we're really looking forward to it.  The
   only thing that I really wonder about is how to qualify.  I mean, you
   can't really take straight scores, because you can easily score more
   points in Dr. Who than, say, Fish Tales (on average).  Anyone care to
   comment on the qualifying procedure?

Hey, we expect lots of people at PAPA 3 -- it's less than a month
away, folks.  My understanding is that qualifying rounds will work the
same way they did last year -- you play something like 8 different
games and add your scores together.

So you're right: since some games are inherently higher-scoring than
others, those games take on added importance.  But if you think about
the scoring on most recent games, it's all very inflated and you could
just as easily get a really high score on one game as on another.  I
know I can get a higher score on TAF than I can on DR. WHO, mostly
because I never play DR. WHO much and so I'm not very good at it.

It's not perfect, but how else could you do it?  I thought about
coming up with an "average" score for each game, then the percentage
you beat this average score would be multiplied by some set value for
your total score.  Something like that.  But it's pretty hard to do,
given all the different scoring opportunities on modern games
(especially Williams games).  What's the "average" score for DR. WHO?

Maybe some of the other people who were in PAPA 2 last year could
comment on this; my feeling is that it worked out about as well as
could be expected.  There will also be more than just one competition
this year (there's also going to be doubles, single-ball challenges,
and more).  And the finals will be run under PAPA rules, so your score
won't really matter, except to break ties.

I'll post another PAPA 3 update next week; hopefully we'll have a list
of the games in the qualifying and final rounds by then.

--
    Steve Baumgarten       |  "New York... when civilization falls apart,
    PANIX, New York, NY    |   remember, we were way ahead of you."
                           |  
    Email: sbb@panix.com   |                            - David Letterman
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: ssfels@cs.toronto.edu (Sidney Fels)
Subject: HELP with repairs for World's Fair machine
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 23 Jan 93 00:03:08 GMT

Hello!

I have a pinball machine called World's Fair made by Gottlieb.  It is
an older machine (not sure of exact date though) which still uses mechanical 
scoring.  I am planning on doing repairs to it since it stopped working 
over a year ago; however, I have discovered that the schematics are lost.  
Does anyone know where I can get copies of schematics for it?  Also, I need 
to know where I can parts for it, does anyone know of good suppliers - 
preferably in the Toronto area?  Thanks alot.  

Sid Fels
ssfels@ai.toronto.edu
From: marston@coos.dartmouth.edu (David Marston)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: One discrepancy in Smithsonian article
Keywords: Smithsonian magazine pinball article
Date: 22 Jan 93 12:07:41 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

Overall, I liked the article about pinball in the January 1993 issue of
_Smithsonian_Magazine_, and I'm glad they ran it. They seem to have a
good grasp of the reasons why amusement pinball (with flippers or not)
could get confused with gambling pinball, as exemplified by bingo
machines. Then they talked to Roger Sharpe about convincing the NYC
officials of the difference:

   Sharpe remembers going up to one of [the pinball machines] and
   demonstrating how it worked. "There were five lanes at the top, and
   I explained that if I pulled the plunger back just right I should be
   able to get the ball in the lane I wanted." [He did, and they were
   convinced that it's a game of skill.]

Which is laughable because plunger shots to aim for a certain hole are
also possible on bingo machines and other gambling pinballs, being the
one component of skill you *do* have when playing them. I believe that
Sharpe understands this, and I hope that he went on to describe the
other forms of playing skill that he demonstrated at that meeting. But
as quoted, it doesn't make sense.
.................David Marston          uunet!dartvax!coos!marston
                                        marston@coos.dartmouth.EDU
--
................David Marston          uunet!dartvax!coos!marston
                                        marston@coos.dartmouth.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: sigma@degas.ipl.rpi.edu (Kevin Martin)
Subject: Pinball Archive Announcement
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 14:09:37 GMT

I will be maintaining a small archive of pinball-related text files in an
anonymous FTP directory:

ftp.ipl.rpi.edu:/sigma/pinball

Currently, there are only three files, I think.  What I would very much
appreciate is if everyone would send whatever they have, including the Tips
sheet, quote sheets for games like Funhouse, rules sheets for games like
TAF, the regular FAQ, et cetera...  The PAPS list is welcome also, as is
the Rochester list.

It seems like there's plenty of stuff to archive, and it gets posted so
infrequently, I thought it would be nice to have it in one place.  The
archive isn't writable - it's best if you just mail files to me.

-- 
Kevin Martin
sigma@ipl.rpi.edu
"I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY didn't you BELIEVE me?!"
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: jeremym@ravel.udel.edu (Jeremy A Moskowitz)
Subject: Re: revised index for The Addams Family
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 21:41:26 GMT

In article <C1JFIC.BzJ@cs.psu.edu> flee@cs.psu.edu (Felix Lee) writes:
>Someone's already made a start with sounds...

Hey, that's Mr. Someone to you. :-)

-- 
     // Email: jeremym@brahms.udel.edu------\  Monitor of---------------\
    //  Registered Commodore Amiga Developer|  Comp.sys.amiga.EMULATIONS| 
\\ //   "I'm spellunking."- BAB  "There's medicine you can take for that."- BB
 \X/           My Life Needs Cheap Dubbed in Sound Effects - Anon. 
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: sigma@degas.ipl.rpi.edu (Kevin Martin)
Subject: Re: I'll be at PABA (was Re: Dr. Who replay score)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:20:48 GMT

sbb@panix.com (Steve Baumgarten) writes:
>It's not perfect, but how else could you do it?  I thought about
>coming up with an "average" score for each game, then the percentage
>you beat this average score would be multiplied by some set value for
>your total score.  Something like that.  But it's pretty hard to do,
>given all the different scoring opportunities on modern games
>(especially Williams games).  What's the "average" score for DR. WHO?

Hard to say.  I guess you could base it on the average of the scores
actually made, so your performance would be relative to everyone in your
division.  It seems like a problem for a statistician.  As for how fair it
is, well... Dr. Who is the biggest unbalancer.  Overall, though, it seems
it'll be better than last year.  If I understand correctly, last year you
had something like Hurricane going up against The Addams Family.  You may
as well not bother to play Hurricane.

>Maybe some of the other people who were in PAPA 2 last year could
>comment on this; my feeling is that it worked out about as well as
>could be expected.  There will also be more than just one competition
>this year (there's also going to be doubles, single-ball challenges,
>and more).  And the finals will be run under PAPA rules, so your score
>won't really matter, except to break ties.

It would be nice if I could play and feel as if each game were going to
contribute as importantly as any other to my score if I did reasonably
well.  But that simply won't be true.  I'm curious about two things:

1) What do you mean by "the finals will be run under PAPA rules"?  What are
these rules?

2) What were scores in each division like last year?  Sure, they were
different games, but I'm thinking that by taking into account the difficult
tournament settings and my own scores on these games, I might get an idea
of which category I should enter.  I was going to avoid the A division
because I envisioned Rosenhouse, Sheats, Stetta, etc. putting several
Billion on each machine...

>I'll post another PAPA 3 update next week; hopefully we'll have a list
>of the games in the qualifying and final rounds by then.

Best news I've heard all week.

-- 
Kevin Martin
sigma@ipl.rpi.edu
"I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY didn't you BELIEVE me?!"
From: ben@monmouth.edu (Bennett Broder)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: Replays on fish tales
Date: 27 Jan 93 16:37:21 GMT
Organization: Monmouth College, W. Long Branch, NJ  07764

In article <1993Jan27.155626.27722@dmu.ac.uk> se2jg@dmu.ac.uk (jonathan gregg) writes:
>Does anybody know whether the operator of a Fish Tales machine
>has the ability to check how many free credits have been given
>away compared to the amount of money put in?

Yes, the machine keeps track of paid credits, service credits, replay
credits (for each of the four possible replay levels), specials, matches,
and high score to date credits.

Most operators use the auto-percentaging system where they set a desired
free play percentage and the game automatically adjusts the replay score
every 50 games to try to achieve that percentage.

-- 

Bennett Broder               Monmouth College
                             Computer Services
ben@monmouth.edu             W. Long Branch, NJ 07764
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: dap@portal.vpharm.com (David A. Pearlman)
Subject: Re: I'll be at PABA (was Re: Dr. Who replay score)
Organization: Vertex Pharmaceuticals, Inc.
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 17:28:17 GMT

In article <b1k3xqg@rpi.edu> sigma@degas.ipl.rpi.edu (Kevin Martin) writes:
>sbb@panix.com (Steve Baumgarten) writes:
>>It's not perfect, but how else could you do it?  I thought about
>>coming up with an "average" score for each game, then the percentage
>>you beat this average score would be multiplied by some set value for
>>your total score.  Something like that.  But it's pretty hard to do,
>>given all the different scoring opportunities on modern games
>>(especially Williams games).  What's the "average" score for DR. WHO?
>
>Hard to say.  I guess you could base it on the average of the scores
>actually made, so your performance would be relative to everyone in your
>division.  It seems like a problem for a statistician.  As for how fair it
>is, well... Dr. Who is the biggest unbalancer.  Overall, though, it seems
>it'll be better than last year.  If I understand correctly, last year you
>had something like Hurricane going up against The Addams Family.  You may
>as well not bother to play Hurricane.
>


A simple scheme that would seem to make some sense would be to:

1) Determine the average score on each machine, Ai.
2) Determine the standard deviation of scores on each machine, Ri.

The scores on a second machine Sj  could then be made roughly equivalent to
those on a machine i, Si, as:

Sj (modified) = Ai + (Ri/Rj) (Sj-Aj).

This would be much fairer than a scheme where high scores (either average
or potential as evidenced by a high standard deviation) on some machines
nullified the importance of other machines.


dap
-- 
=============================================================================
    David A. Pearlman

Vertex Pharmaceuticals Inc.                     email: dap@vpharm.com
From: kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Keefer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Next Explanation
Date: 25 Jan 93 07:47:05 GMT
Organization: Virginia Polytechnic Bureaucracy, USA

The next message will be the rules for The Machine Bride of Pinbot.  It was a
request, so I went ahead and did it.  If I can, I'll write up other requests
as well, but not for any game more recent than Fish Tales, since my new-game
exposure is limited to say the least.

Enjoy, send the usual stuff to me.

BTW - Revised Fish Tales later today or tomorrow (Monday or Tuesday).

keith
-- 
|kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu|Choose the |"I heard it was exciting - just like  |
|.....Keith P. Johnson.....|/\  Logical|a spike in volleyball!"               |
|.1711 Whipple Dr. Apt. 11.|XX  Altern-|                                      |
|...Blacksburg, VA 24060...|\/   ative |      - Kelly on "Saved By the Bell"  |
From: ben@monmouth.edu (Bennett Broder)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: revised index for The Addams Family
Date: 28 Jan 93 15:02:48 GMT
Organization: Monmouth College, W. Long Branch, NJ  07764

In article <C1JFIC.BzJ@cs.psu.edu> flee@cs.psu.edu (Felix Lee) writes:
>This is my current copy of the index for The Addams Family.  The
>machine is a little over one year old now.  Now that there's an
>archive site for rulesheets, it seems like a good time to post a
>corrected version.

>Graveyard value.  Starts at 1M.  Advanced by the {Graveyard} bumpers,
>and collected at the {Swamp}.  After it's collected, it's reset to 1M
>unless you've hit the {Train target} during this ball.  A {Train
>Wreck} holds the Graveyard value over to the next ball.

One error and one omission on this entry.

The graveyard value isn't reset when collected, it is reset at the end of
the current ball, unless held by a train wreck.

The graveyard value has a maximum value of 4M points.

-- 

Bennett Broder               Monmouth College
                             Computer Services
ben@monmouth.edu             W. Long Branch, NJ 07764
From: holland@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Rich Holland)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: Star Wars skill shot (was Re: Insta-Drain(TM))
Date: 24 Jan 93 09:45:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: matt.1jv2loINNnn5
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

lazuli@stein.u.washington.edu (Fred Sloniker) writes:

>BTW, is anyone else cheesed about the stormtrooper shootout sequence?  You
>practically have to have the guy next to you bang the button for you!

That's the easy way to do it.  I can manage myself 99% of the time -- shoot
the ramp or around the back through R2D2 when it comes up, and start firing.
Make sure the lever is in the DOWN position though, or it won't fire.

In speeder mode, just start firing.  After a couple scenes, you automatically
hit the storm trooper on the speeder bike and get 10 million points...

-- 
Rich Holland              | INTERNET: holland@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
100 Jardine Terr., Apt A7 | BITNET  : holland@ksuvm
Manhattan, KS  66502-3357 | UUCP    : ...!rutgers!matt.ksu.ksu.edu!holland
char*p="char*p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
From: keatesm@cs.man.ac.uk (Martin Keates(MSC RJH))
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: Digitized TAF Pinball Sounds on WU ARCHIVE
Date: 27 Jan 93 14:07:41 GMT

>What?  No "Tripppple Jackpot"?

What?  No "Fifffty Millllllion"?

>-- neilski

Martin

>sarcastic

Even more sarcastic
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: sigma@degas.ipl.rpi.edu (Kevin Martin)
Subject: Re: Wanted: The playing guide post
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 17:22:32 GMT

kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Keefer) writes:
>Hmmm...  I think it was just posted again recently, so it shouldn't have
>expired yet (I'm talking the last 48 hours).  Try looking back a few
>articles, and you should find it.

It was just posted, and so it is now archived on
ftp.ipl.rpi.edu:/sigma/pinball

So far, I have:

The Addams Family rule sheet (flee@cs.psu.edu)
Fish Tales rule sheet (kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu)
Funhouse rule sheet (phaedrus@u.washington.edu)
Funhouse quotes listing (rc3u+@andrew.cmu.edu)
Hurricane rule sheet (kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu)
PAPA III announcement flyer (I typed it in)
Playing Tips FAQ (hlsw_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu)
Pinball Survey of the South (sigma@ipl.rpi.edu)

If I've gotten any of those responsible-person addresses wrong, just let me
know.  And if you have anything else (text files only), send it along.

-- 
Kevin Martin
sigma@ipl.rpi.edu
"I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY didn't you BELIEVE me?!"
From: al@hpscit.sc.hp.com (Al Knox)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 00:05:49 GMT
Subject: Pinball Trader???
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara, CA
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball

Unfortunately, I was unable to attend the Pinball Expo and talk with
the folks at the Pinball Trader booth. Does anyone know when we will
see another issue of the Trader?

Thanks,
Al Knox
From: broberts@uafhp.uark.edu (ghunwi')
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Please tell me a good price on a pin...
Date: 27 Jan 1993 18:31:03 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

can someone tell me a good price for the purchase of a pin that I found?

Kicker, by Chicago Coin. In real good shape. The playfield is clean with little
wear showing. (no bare wood anywhere) Plays fine.

They want $300 for it. Is this a good deal? This would be my first pin if I buy it.  Thanks in advance. 

( I tried to post this before, but didnt get any response & wasnt sure if it got out there...)
--
|========================================================|
|     Bruce F Roberts           |                        |
|        ( ghunwI' )            |      > vIta'pu'be'     |
|     broberts@uafhp.uark.edu   |                        |
|========================================================|
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: sigma@degas.ipl.rpi.edu (Kevin Martin)
Subject: Re: Keefer's Guide to Fish Tales!
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 08:19:12 GMT

Thanks, Phaedrus... I'm sure Keefer will fold in your additions before
Monday.

I have a Fish Tales question he may have failed to mention.  Do Fish Tales
machines have no way of retracting the drop target once it has been raised,
or is this a common problem with FT?  On a machine we play in Roanoke, the
drop target sometimes is up when it shouldn't be, and Keefer thinks it's
because the machine has no way of retracting it, only raising it.  To make
matters worse, it may be coming up by accident on that machine at times.

-- 
Kevin Martin
sigma@ipl.rpi.edu
"I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY didn't you BELIEVE me?!"
From: marston@coos.dartmouth.edu (David Marston)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: worlds fair
Date: 27 Jan 93 04:28:34 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <1993Jan25.4950.8068@dosgate> "terry cumming"
<terry.cumming@canrem.com> writes:
>World's Fair is a 1964 machine....
>You can get a schematic possibly from:
>1) Premier Technology (Gottlieb)
Don't bother trying this. I think they have divested all their material from
the electromechanical era.

>2) Mike Pacak
>3) Steve Young
Either of these guys could sell you a copy if they don't have an original
to spare.
--
................David Marston          uunet!dartvax!coos!marston
                                        marston@coos.dartmouth.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
From: kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Keefer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: revised index for The Addams Family
Date: 28 Jan 93 17:07:33 GMT
Organization: Virginia Polytechnic Bureaucracy, USA

Jackpot goes up to 25M, not 20M.  And Graveyard value is maxed at 4M.

keith
-- 
|kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu|  // Amiga!|"I heard it was exciting - just like  |
|.....Keith P. Johnson.....|\X/  "It's |a spike in volleyball!"               |
|.1711 Whipple Dr. Apt. 11.|really not |                                      |
|...Blacksburg, VA 24060...|that bad!" |      - Kelly on "Saved By the Bell"  |
From: kjohnson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Keefer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: HS2 Secret Mania *FEATURE*
Date: 26 Jan 93 21:23:28 GMT
Organization: Virginia Polytechnic Bureaucracy, USA

Well, I was playing HS2, and had been doing well off and on.  At any rate,
at one point the replay was at 101M, and I had around 40M, and 3 cars show
up at the Donut Heaven.  Thinking that I could use the extra lock, I went
and started it.

Early flailing got me around 9M points, and all of a sudden I notice I'm
about 3 lights away from finishing all 9 of them.  Great, I think, I could
REALLY use an extra ball.  So I get the one that's left on the middle bank,
then a careful shot toward the vertical bank to knock out the other 2.
Fortunately, I got a good couple of jet bounces, and next thing I know,
CRACK, Replay awarded!

It seems that completing these stoplights during Secret Mania awards like
FIFTY MILLION points!!  (My score might have been higher before Mania; so
it is POSSIBLE that it's only 25M.  I'm pretty sure it was 50M though.)
Not only that, the extra ball didn't light, and the 3 banks started a
weird blinking pattern (all of one bank would light, then the next, like
the individual colors usually do.  This indicated to me it was not possible
to try to complete them again.

I know SM has all these bugs and what not, but this is incredible.  It has
found new life and purpose in my book!  :)  What I would really like to
know is if anyone else has done this or seen it done, to confirm.

Hey, Lyman, maybe YOU could try it out on your machine?  If you still have
it?  :)

later,
keith
-- 
|//----------------------\\|  Do your  |This .signature is one of 84 currently|
|/     Keith  Johnson     \|  eyes  a  |available to me.If you too want such a|
|\CS Major--Pinball addict/|favor- PLAY|wide variety of .signatures, then send|
|\\----------------------//| PINBALL!! |a check or money order for $49.95 to..|
From: holland@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Rich Holland)
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball
Subject: Re: Star Wars
Date: 24 Jan 1993 15:41:43 -0600
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

sbb@panix.com (Steve Baumgarten) writes:

>The arbitrary availability of certain key game awards is a now a
>standard "feature" on Data East games.  What happens is that after
>some arbitrary number of awards have been given to other people, the
>game decides that it won't give any to *you*, or that if it will,
>it'll make you work a lot harder to get them.

That sucks.  *pout*

>This is true of the EB on the ramp, as well as the shot that relights
>the kickback.  And no, there is no way to disable this horrid "feature".

Well, there's got to be -- sometimes the 3'rd ramp litghts the extra
ball, and sometimes it doesn't.  Does it reset it to this after a 
certain number of games without the extra ball being awarded, much
like it unsets the EB on the ramp after a certain number of prizes?  :-)

-- 
Rich Holland              | INTERNET: holland@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
100 Jardine Terr., Apt A7 | BITNET  : holland@ksuvm
Manhattan, KS  66502-3357 | UUCP    : ...!rutgers!matt.ksu.ksu.edu!holland
char*p="char*p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}