HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cullen@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: SM58 Selfdestructs first recorded instance was Re: SHURE SM-58's
Date: 15 Apr 92 02:27:16 GMT
Distribution: rec.audio.pro
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada


> In article <OSYSTEMS.92Apr11130232@world.std.com> osystems@world.std.com 
(Cary T Conrad) writes:
>>
>>I have been following this group for the past few months with
>>a great deal of interest. Most of the discussions on the topic
>>of mic's ahve centered around exotic high priced models. This
>>is great though it leads me to this question:
>>
>>Does anyone still use Shure SM-58(Ice Cream Cone) mic's for
>>live sound support?

Yes, a lot of rock people use it because they have memorized response curves 
for four or five different foh rigs and half a dozen monitor models.

Also some vocalists don't like using anything else(???).

Re: The header
They were indestructible, up until Saturday night, when a 58 suffered complete
failure for no apparent reason. It was used on Friday, locked in the Bar 
Manager's office, and didnt work saturday. All connections are good, and the 
mic wasn't dropped. I've never seen it happen before.
							Murray
							Cullen@ac.dal.ca
From: rost@rgb.dec.com (My name is Brian Rost)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: Recording bass guitar
Date: 15 Apr 92 13:00:11 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1992Apr14.172618.20518@intelhf.hf.intel.com>, dcovell@hfglobe.intel.com (David Covell) writes...
> 
>2. The strings on my bass may not be my best choice. The bass is a good copy
>of a '64 Precision and has half-round strings. The tone is not overly bright
>like most round-wounds, but does seem to have more of a metallic overtone
>than I really need. I don't relish the prospect of going back to old flat-
>wounds ;^(
> 
>I can afford to buy a DI box but I don't want to unless it'll provide an
>audible improvement. I've experimented with using the recording output on
>my Mesa Boogie MKIV, but it doesn't really sound any better than the 
>matching transformer.
> 
>So, what's the right approach? Is a DI box really necessary? I have a good
>compressor and 31-band EQ, so perhaps I'm just not using them correctly.
>I'd appreciate any hints/helps, as the bass sound is the worst aspect of
>my recordings and is pretty frustrating. I have good monitors, so it's not
>a problem of my hearing an accurate playback.
>My material ranges from latin jazz to country and is mostly acoustic guitar
>driven, so the bass has lots of space, both time and frequency-wise.
>Thanks for any help.

You haven't really said what the problem with the sound you get is, but I've
found that as far as EQ goes, the 800-1K range is where most of the metallic
sound comes from, so cut here.  Cut at about 200 Hz if it sounds too boomy or
boxy, boost at 100 if you want a deeper bottom.  Above 4K you can cut if you
need to reduce hiss.  Compression should be applied only if the signal seems to
be peaky, that is the attacks are very loud, but the sustaining portion of the
note is not.

					Brian Rost @rgb.enet.dec.com

					508-568-6115

	****************************************************
	*						   *
	*  The above does not reflect the opinions of	   *
	*  my employer.					   *
	*						   *
	*  If music is outlawed, only outlaws will be      *	   
	*  musicians.					   *
	*						   *
	****************************************************
From: hjv@phil.ruu.nl (Hendrik Jan Veenstra)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: Headphones for Monitoring Recording
Date: 13 Apr 92 18:27:35 GMT
Organization: Department of Philosophy, University of Utrecht, The Netherlands

chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com (Chris Christensen) writes:

>In article <1992Apr13.141102.13182@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> prj@gamba.lcs.mit.edu 
>(Paul R. Johnson) writes:
>>What is the rec.audio.pro wisdom on the best headphones to use for
>>live recording of concerts (in my case Early Music concerts)?
>>I need ones that have closed/isolated earpieces so I don't
>>disturb other people (I'll be in the audience), and that give an
>>accurate representation of the sound (of course).

>I have used my Sony MDV-V6's for many years in the manner which you
>describe.  I have yet to be dissapointed.

How about the Beyerdynamic DT770. Never used them in live-recording situations,
but I bet they're as good there as in the studio. 2-way speaker system, very
clean sound (and closed earpieces of course). One of the best headphones I've
heard.


--
Hendrik Jan Veenstra - Department of Philosophy
University of Utrecht - The Netherlands
USENET: hjv@phil.ruu.nl   * don't worry about life; it's not permanent *
From: gt3281c@prism.gatech.EDU (TABLER,JOHN ALEXANDER)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Shocking (IT IS A SINE WAVE)
Date: 6 Apr 92 16:40:10 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article <3 Apr 92 22:12:01 GMT>  Murray Cullen@ac.dal.ca writes:

> In North America, the standard household wiring is a single phase or leg
> off the generator (which has three, spaced at 120 degrees apart, physically).
> This leg is stepped down by a pole transformer to 220 volts, with a center tap.
> This center tap is connected to ground and is called neutral. The center tap is 
> 110 volts from each outside tap. The center tap is used as neutral in your 
> house. 
>    
> In commercial wiring, all three legs are stepped down to 110v and brought inside
> the bulding. One tap on each of the three transformers are tied together, and
> used as neutral, tied to ground. Since the generator coils are 120 degrees
> out of phase, you get 208v potential between any two legs. However, the wave is
> not a sine wave.

I agree with most of what you say, except about the 208VAC line-to-line voltage.


 IT IS MOST DEFINITALY A SINE WAVE...

   (do the math!)    For a three phase system as described:
   if the three phases are:   (I will use q for my angle, I can't make a theta)
 
             Va = 120volts at 0 degrees = 120*sin(q)
             Vb = 120volts at -120 degrees = 120*sin(q-120) 
             Vc = 120volts at +120 degrees = 120*sin(q+120)

   So, Va-Vb = Vab = 120*sin(q) - 120*sin(q-120)
       
      I wish to show that this is (1.7320508)*120*sin(q+30),  For this I will
      use the widely known 'double angle formula, which states:
            
                sin(a-b) = sin(a)cos(b) - sin(b)cos(a)
      
      Also the fact that square root(3)= 1.7320508 (here I will write r3) 
            (note that : 208 = r3*120)

   Proceeding with the proof, we wish to show :
 
      120*sin(q) - 120*sin(q-120) = r3*120*sin(q+30)
       
   Applying the double angle formula, and moving the q-120 term to the
   right, (also cancelling the 120's from each term) we get;
                
      sin(q) = sin(q)cos(120) -sin(120)cos(q) +r3*{ sin(q)cos(30) + sin(30)cos(q) }

      We know that sin(120) and cos(30) both = r3/2
        Also,      sin(30) = 1/2   and cos(120) = -1/2
 
   Plugging in these values, we get;
      
       sin(q) = -(1/2)*sin(q) - (r3/2)*cos(q) + r3*{ (r3/2)*sin(q) + (1/2)*cos(q) }  

              = -(1/2)*sin(q) - (r3/2)*cos(q) + (3/2)*sin(q) + (r3/2)*cos(q)

              = (3/2 - 1/2)*sin(q) + (r3/2 -r3/2)*cos(q)
          
              =  sin(q)
       Thus completing the proof.   
   So, you see, the line to line voltage IS a sine wave.  Shifted 30 degrees 
positive, and scaled by root3.  
   You are correct about residential wiring, two legs, 120VAC each, and 180 deg out.

Bye
John T.


.
From: dlyons@necis.UUCP (Dave Lyons)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: Speaker Enclosures for Auto
Date: 17 Apr 92 18:05:28 GMT
Organization: NEC Information Systems, Acton, MA

> In article <bdm1.703215909@Ra.MsState.Edu>, bdm1@Ra.MsState.Edu
> (Billy D. McNair) writes:
> 
>>Hi.  I'm not sure if this is the correct group, but .....
>>
>>I am considering designing a speaker enclosure for my brother's
>>Volkswagon Beetle ( '67 ).  Any constructive comments on the
> 
You want to put your brother's can into a speaker enclosure ?????  I've heard
of doing some strange things with Beetles but that's a new one on me
                                   -- Dave --
-- 
******************************************************************************
Dave Lyons                             dlyons@necis.nec.com  (603)878-2567 BBS
Opinions expressed are mine.    My company doesn't even know I'm here (Shhhh!)
******************************************************************************
Organization: Music, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 00:00:23 -0400 
From: "Raymond C. Chick" <rc4n+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Long Cable Runs?

I record classical music on location and often have long cable runs from
microphones to preamps or mixer.  To find a good monitoring room I may
have to use 150' to 300' of cable. Will this have any effect on s/n,
frequency responce, or any other things ?

Raymond Chick  
Organization: Music, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 15:20:42 -0400 
From: Riccardo Schulz <rs6k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: VCA's

This company called Solid State Music (SSM) made an excellent VCA, at
least judging frkom the specs and their reputation.

SSM was acquired by Precision Monolithics, which in turn, in the last
year, was acquired by Analog Devices.  I believe Analog Devices is
continuing the SSM line.  They are a huge company, but it may take you a
while tao track down exactly who can send you the catalog and
description of the device you want!

They were supposed to send me their latest audio catalog (with super op
amps for line receivers, line drivers, A to D and D to A converters,
etc.) in December, but so far, nothing>

You might get in touch with your local electronics dealer (Pioneer or
Allied, for example). They should be able to give you a phone no or
perhaps a catalog.

If you need more information, let me know.
From: chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com (Chris Christensen)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: Where can I get...
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:44:03 GMT
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1992Apr8.222123.8993@ccad.uiowa.edu> timv@ccad.uiowa.edu 
(Timothy VanFosson) writes:
>...a flexible gooseneck with XLR connecters (M-F) so that I can hook up
>   a (cheap) mike to our mixing console's talk-back input?  Mixer
>   is a Yamaha 1642, which has an unbalanced (I think) XLR input above
>   the main sliders.

Black Audio Devices, 805-653-5557  $24-31 depends on length and
"color".

>...a small low-intensity light w/magnetic base that runs off 117V AC
>   to use with the same mixer, and a similar one with a clip for an
>   amp case?

The "Little Lights" are the standard of the industry.  They should be
available from your local music/sound supply store as well as through
mail order.

>...a decent set of headphones that won't fall apart, reproduces sound
>   accurately ;-), and costs less than $50? $100?

For my money the Sony MDR V6's are good.  I take care of mine but they
seem rugged. I don't believe that they will stand up to a lot of
abuse.

>I'm just trying to make our soundman's life a little easier, ya' know.

All the above and keep the stage volume down!  If you really want to
help!

-- 
Chris Christensen                  The opinions I express are my own,
chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com            and sometimes they are wrong!
916-478-3419 FAX 916-478-3887      After all, I AM only human.
From: nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: How to mic drums.
Date: 7 Apr 92 16:34:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.1992Apr7.163403.10682
Reply-To: nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu
Organization: Yale University, Department of Computer Science, New Haven, CT

In article <1992Apr7.060616.5548@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> payam@landau (Payam  
Mirrashidi) writes:

> A question along the same lines: How do you eq a kick so it
> sounds strong and tight and not boomy.  I usually mix off of
> a 26 channel Soundcraft 400, so I have a low, a high and two
> parametric mids available.  In addition, I am using a RE20
> mic. 

I use EV N/D-457 mics for all drums.  Yes, even the kick! For
the kick drum, I experiment with placement, but usually
go for close to the beater head strike zone.  To me, the
articulating click of the beater is an important part of
the kick drum sound I desire.  Then, I have the drummer
kick, while at the board I boost the mid EQ by about 6 dB and
sweep it until I find the click sound I want.  Depending on
the drum, some low bass EQ may be needed. 

> I guess any hints for miking a snare with SM57 would be
> appreciated too! 

One interesting hint I read in some magazine was to use a
second mic on the underside on the snare to pick up the
resonating wires.

--
Nathan Janette		"I'm a NeXTstep man,
Dept MB&B, Yale Univ	 I'm a NeXTcube guy"
New Haven, CT
nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu (NeXT)
From: rmontgom@orlith.bates.edu (Robert Montgomery)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: FORESALE: Misc Stereo
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:47:11 GMT
Organization: Bates College, Lewiston, Maine

In article <4232@gold.gvg.tek.com> chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com (Chris Christensen) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.203845.26783@e2big.mko.dec.com> glantz@tay1.dec.com writes:
>
(stuff deleted)
>>Likewise, I'd prefer not to see discussions of green markers and "audiophile"
>>speaker cable in here -- unless there are any pros who actually use such
>>stuff in their work, and are interested in telling us how and why.
>
>>Anyone else feel this way?
>Anw seconds?

Just remember (and I'm a prime example) that there are (most likely) alog
of us out here who work for places with very low budgets. So called
"audiophile" equipment is sometimes all we can afford. For example,
a radio station where I work as the local sound tech runs ALL the on air
broadcasts from a couple of $200 Tascam CD players. The Theatre where I 
work recently had to downgrade (due to equipment failures) to a tape
deck of the "tool room and scene shop" variety until money could be
raised to fix the other ones.

Sometimes it is useful to learn how to turn, as the saying goes, "Chicken
Shit into Chicken Salad."


                      Thanks,

_____________________________________________________________________________
                              ROB MONTGOMERY
                                "MURDOCK"
rmontgomery@bat.bates.edu                          rmontgom@orlith.bates.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Like Bates College cares what        |     "There is no technical problem
I think, anyways.                    |     so complex it cannot be solved
                                     |     by brute force and ignorance."
_____________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
From: bill@bilver.uucp (Bill Vermillion)
Subject: Re: Amp power rating/Monster cable questions
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 00:52:52 GMT

In article <1992Apr1.163743.17519@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> gwg33762@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Garret W. Gengler) writes:

>o I've heard tales of the wonders of monster cable, but have lumped them in
>  with the green markers and those plastic ring weights... For the above
>  system, is monster cable necessary?  The speakers are JBL 2600's - small,
>  cheap home type with a 5" woofer.  The bass roll-off is fairly high, like
>  around 80 Hz.

Put it this way Monster Cable can't hurt.   We were having some
problems with low end in the studio many years ago.   The amps we were
using had fixed gain, and the gains were adjusted by the Urei
crossovers after the Urei equalizers.

We were playing around one day and put in another amp that had gain
controls.  We found that at identical settings one side was louder than
the other.

I ran to the back room and grabbed a 12 guage AC extension box, undid
the plug and receptacle and snaked the connector in through the port on
the front.  (The speakers were Westlake TM1-A's - and were nailed into
the framing as the room was constructed.  Conduit in a hole drilled
into the side of the box was the only way in.)

Now, hooking up that one wire, and leaving the other still in the other
speaker, this side which was quieter was now louder.

A friend of the studio owned a high end store  and he sold us MC at his
cost - and for the 100feet or so and considering what we had in the
building the difference in price over regular cable was insiginificant.

We then re-tuned the room.  Previously we were down 3db at 53Hz, using
Urei Soni-Pulse for tuning.  With the MC we were down 1 dB at 40Hz.
That was the lower limit of the testing equipment.

One other thing, we ran a double run of MC for each of the speakers.
We found out that the original wiring spec'ed to be installed wasn't
and we were running 16 guage to the speakers.    

So we effective ran dual runs of 12 guage.  The other nice thing about
MC is that it is very flexible.   Even with a can of cable grease it
was not easy pulling the MC.   Regular cable with it's stiffness might
not have been able to be run.

Now - as I said - it can't hurt to run MC.   Since standing on a ladder
and removing a pair of 15" drivers to be able to get in to connect the
cables is NOT an easy task, we did NOT test any other cable.   In
retrospect two runs of standard 12 guage might have worked.


But for your 5" woofer you probably won't notice much of a difference.
This system used dual 15"s and it did definately extend the lower end.


-- 
Bill Vermillion - bill@bilver.uucp 
                - ..!{peora|ge-dab|tous|tarpit}!bilver!bill
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
From: button@italy.alc.com (Russ Button)
Subject: Re: awesome Klipschorns and speaker lifespan
Reply-To: button@italy.alc.com
Organization: Ascent Logic Corporation, Inc.
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 01:40:45 GMT


In article 11285@ksr.com, kenyee@ksr.com (Ken Yee writes:
>   Here's a thought...a live performance is part bodily sensations...the
>   music waves running over your body add another dimension to the
>   music.  Comments?  

This is a bit of philosophy that has its merits, but can get you into
trouble in a hurry.  For instance, I went to a concert last night.  I
took a friend who's a great jazz tenor player.  She's sitting there
bouncing her head to the music, as many jazz players will do (me
included).  Some lunatic sitting behind her hit her on the head with
his program notes because her head bouncing bothered him.  Now tell me.
What audio system could reproduce *THAT* live concert experience!  :-)

As for music waves running over your body, if you couple a good sub-woofer
with the Celestion's, you'll get plenty of that.  Trust me.  If you're 
willing to "roll your own", look up the August 1976 issue of Audio 
Magazine.  I built my first loudspeaker from that sub-woofer construction
article.  It has 21 cubic feet of internal volumne and uses a single
15" bass driver.  It is 3 db down at 20 hz and can blow out match flames
with a 60 watt amp.  Although not as efficient as a K-horn, you'll get
PLENTY of physical sensation with it, and the K-horn doesn't even begin
to get down that low.

Another thing to consider is the possible live concert experience that
could come from being busted by the police, when your neighbors complain
about your K-horns playing too loud.  That's assuming you live in a
single family dwelling.  If you live in an apartment, then your live
concert experience may resemble a major frontal assault directly from 
the folks downstairs.

Have fun!

Best wishes,

Russ Button
button@alc.com
From: chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com (Chris Christensen)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: Mic pre-amps
Date: 8 Apr 92 22:03:17 GMT
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1992Apr8.192913.4917@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> prj@gamba.lcs.mit.edu 
(Paul R. Johnson) writes:

(text edited)

>I am, however, interested in possibly getting a mic preamp to use
>when recording performances.  I've seen Gabe Wiener recommend the
>Benchmark that he uses, and I've also had the Symetrix SX 202
>recommended.  Can Gabe, or anyone else, discuss the range of such
>machines that exist, the relevant features that I should look for,
>and the relative prices?  If I can get ahold of a couple of
>different preamps to test, how should I go about comparing them?
>Other specific recommendations?

I use a Stewart MM-4s mic mixer.  It has four inputs, switchable
mic/line, 4 level/pan controls and a dual concentric output level
control.  The output is switchable between +4 and -10 out.  It is
balanced in and out and has phantom power.  The unit is powered by a
24 VAC wall transformer.

Runs about $300 U.S.

I like it, it imparts no particular "sound", very neutral.

-- 
Chris Christensen                  The opinions I express are my own,
chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com            and sometimes they are wrong!
916-478-3419 FAX 916-478-3887      After all, I AM only human.
From: rs6k+@andrew.cmu.edu (Riccardo Schulz)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Shure mics
Date: 13 Apr 92 21:16:47 GMT
Organization: Music, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

<Does anyone still use Shure SM-58(Ice Cream Cone) mic's for
live sound support?>



Yes, of course we still use them, also Shure SM 57s too.

A few years ago we were recording and doing [mildl] sound amplicfiation
for two Indian musicians, Zakir Hussain on table, and someone else, I
don't remember exactly who.  We had decided to use Neumann KM 84 mics
for both recording and sound.  Zakir didn't like them.  We just happened
to have an SM 57 and decided to try it.  Much to our chagrin, he liked
the Shure better!

So far no one has complained about our Schoeps mics or preferred Shure
SM something or other to them, but you never can tell!

The Shure Beta series seems to be pretty good too.
From: Janne.Anttila@lut.fi (Janne Anttila)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: Headphones for Monitoring Recording
Date: 15 Apr 92 11:18:22 GMT
	<1992Apr14.020345.1194@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>
Organization: Lappeenranta University of Technology, Finland
Disclaimer: Ei kaupungin ty|ntekij|ill{ ole luppaoikaa.


Try Sony's new closed headphone model CD-550. Its inexpensive and
sounds just fine.

 
--
	Spirits make me move in mysterious ways...
						   Janne Anttila
From: rc4n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Raymond C. Chick)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Voice Regonition
Date: 17 Apr 92 18:05:56 GMT
Organization: Music, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

I'm looking for info on voice recognition systems for the blind. 
Especially systems that could be used with electronic music equipment,
such as MIDI sequencers. Any related info would be helpfull.
 
Raymond Chick
From: hydeed@mwk.uucp
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
Subject: Re: awesome Klipschorns...............
Date: 15 Apr 92 07:25:17 CST
Organization: M. W. Kellogg, Houston TX

In article <11227@ksr.com>, kenyee@ksr.com (Ken Yee) writes:
> pwalczak@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Paul Walczak) writes:
>>a cult thing.  AND I've heard rumors that the Big Bassmonsters weren't 
>>going to be made anymore....   So I guess what I'm saying is that even if
>>you bought them and for whatever reason wanted to unload them, you probably
>>wouldn't have a problem and you probably wouldn't even lose much money.
>   Care to elaborate a bit about the rumor?  It sounds like a consideration...
>>Paul "who was going to buy Klipsch until they turned plastic" Walczak
>   Care to elaborate about this a bit more?  ----------^^^^^^^

I think he's trying to say that Klipsch is going to stop production of the boat
anchors.  It wouldn't be too soon.  My friend's father had a pair in his living
room.  They sounded OK, but they were replaced by a pair of Bozak's, which sound
much better.  Fully equipped, they sport two 12" woofers, 4-4" mid's, and six 1"
tweeters.  My roomate has a lesser equipped pair with one woofer and two
tweeters.  They are adequate for our small apartment.  A Stereo 70 amp drives
them pretty well.  


Phil H.
hydeed@mwk.uucp