HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dd@ra.cs.umb.edu (Dave Dunbrack)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: What does Magnum mean?
Date: 30 Sep 92 11:27:58 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston, Dept of Math and CS

In article <1992Sep27.134018.29891@ke4zv.uucp> wa4mei!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman) writes:
#Magnum is simply a *marketing* term. It's applied somewhat haphazardly
#to various cartridges reputed to be "powerful". Note for example that
#a .22 Hornet is more powerful than a .22 Magnum and both are hotter than
#a .22 Long Rifle, and all three are much milder than a .22-250. So the
#magnum description is fairly meaningless other than as a *name* for a
#particular cartridge.
#

  As someone else already noted, in handgun cartridges "magnum" usually
means "longer and stronger". While this could possibly be construed
as a marketing ploy (but you won't catch *me* loading a .38 or a .45 to
the pressure levels found in a .357 or .44 mag), the same cannot be
said of the term "magnum" as applied to shotshells. In this case the term
means the shell has more *shot* (not more powder) than a standard shell,
and is generally longer by about 1/4".

	Dave
From: laird@stable.ecn.purdue.edu (Kyler Laird)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Are there restrictions on carry in public places
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:57:28 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

kmarko@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com (Kurt Marko) writes:

#Note also, as
#someone has previously mentioned, that Federal law prohibits carrying
#firearms in airports (which are under Federal [FAA] jurisdiction), and
#other federally regulated buildings or areas (I'm not sure what the Forest
#Service's policies are).

Hmmm...not that it is a definite indicator of law, but I had my pistol
taken at an airport (long story) by security/Indy police, and it was
given back to me fairly quickly without mention of the illegality of
carrying it in the airport - just not to the terminals.

Just another data point - doesn't mean it's on the line...

--kyler
From: eads@col.hp.com (Rick Eads)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Info on Dakota Arms, .41 Mag SA requested
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:59:09 GMT

A friend of mine asked me to get him a Ruger Blackhawk in .41 Magnum.
I suggested alternative calibers to him but he insisted this is what
he wants.  It seems that both Ruger and S&W are sandbagging the .41 as
they are not providing units to most distributors and are not accepting
backorders or providing ship dates.

I have the opportunity to obtain a Dakota Arms SA pistol in .41 for
$220.  I don't have any experience with this company and would like to
hear from anyone who could tell me how this pistol compares to the Blackhawk.
Accuracy and reliability are key factors that I am interested in.

Thanks in advance,
R. Eads
eads@col.hp.com
From: mvjh3@mvuxn.att.com (James M Hajjar)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Are there restrictions on carry in public places
Date: 28 Sep 92 21:56:31 GMT
Organization: AT&T

#From article <199209281440.AA21774@tbird.cc.bellcore.com>, by sykes@donner.cc.bellcore.com (sykes,michael):
# Hello,
# 
# This is my first post so please be gentle : ) !
# 
# Question: 
# 
# If you have been granted a permit to carry concealed weapons are there
# any places that you are not allowed to carry at all. (e.g. public places
# such as malls, sports arenas, etc.) I would figure the police would 
# give you such a hard time you might as well leave your weapon at home.
# 
# I have a CCW permit and I was wondering if I am justified in being a litte
# aprehensive about carrying in a public place, or am I overreacting.
# 
# Sorry if this is a FAQ or irrevalent to this group.
# 
# Michael 

Good question!  I live in Massachusetts and personally know a person who
was busted for carrying while in a building that served alcohol (bar).  The
police took away his gun, and his permit to carry.  He later had the gun
returned (damaged!!), but the pistol permit was revoked for good.  While I
would never carry my pistol in a bar, I wonder if there are other places (in
Mass.) where carrying a pistol could result in the loss of my permit to carry?


Jim Hajjar
AT&T Merrimack Valley Works
North Andover, MA
From: mccon@ssdd475a.erim.org (Joe McConnell)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Last of the Mohicans Artillery
Date: 5 Oct 92 02:19:46 GMT
Organization: Environmental Research Institute of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan

(re an article that said the guns were fiberglass ...)

Did it say WHY?  I would think this would be more expensive than getting
reasonable reproductions.
--
Joe McConnell  | Opinions expressed are the   | Don't blame me!  I voted for
mccon@erim.org | author's, not the employer's.| Stephen Maturin!
From: steffen@stud.cs.uit.no (Steffen Baeroe)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock adoption
Date: 3 Oct 92 20:37:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.1992Oct3.165834.25105
Organization: University of Tromsoe, Norway

In article <1992Oct3.003922.5337@latcs1.lat.oz.au>, jd@latcs1.lat.oz.au (John Dimogotsis) writes:
|> 
|> 	Has the Glock been adopted by any large organization, police-force or
|> military?
|> 								Thanks.

The Norwegian Armed Forces have adopted the G17.

Steffen
From: dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu (Donald R. Newcomb)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Children and toy guns...
Date: 3 Oct 92 20:37:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: ra.1992Oct3.163514.26446
Organization: University of Southern Mississippi

In article <9210011512.AA25586@outmail.microsoft.com> davidst@microsoft.com (David Steckler) writes:
#I've already decided that my (future) children will not own toy guns that
#look anything like real guns. There are guns and there are toys and they
#are separate things. I would never dream of telling anyone how to raise their
#kids (especially since I'm not a parent yet), but I just thought I'd relate 
#this story as food for thought.

Dave,
 What you suggest is exactly the way we handled the situation with our
boy. The closest thing he ever had to a TOY gun was a clear plastic,
day-glow green water pistol. My reasoning went along these lines:

1. I wanted to teach him to never point a gun at anything or anyone
   in fun. If you point a gun at it, you mean to destroy it.

2. I wanted to teach him that guns are serious and should only be used
   by adults or under adult supervision. If his friends are playing
   with their dad's revolver he should leave the area and tell an
   adult. There should be no confusion about what guns are for.

3. Despite popular opinion to the contrary, I am not perfect :-).
   I have been known to walk off and leave the safe open. If I
   see my child or a neighbor's in the house with a gun, I don't
   want to have to guess if it came from my safe or the toy box.

-- 

Donald R. Newcomb
dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu
newcomb@usmcp6.bitnet
From: spf@hoqaa.att.com (Steven P Frysinger)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock mini-9mm (was AMT Backup .380 problems...)
Date: 26 Sep 92 15:38:54 GMT
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories

# 	I am looking forward to the release of Glock's new mini-9mm, which has
# 	been described to me as "a single column magazine Glock pistol,
# 	roughly the same size as a Walther PP." With Glock's reputation for
# 	quality, this should be a real neat gun.
# 
# I own a Glock 23 and am *very* happy with it. If Glock comes out with a 9mm
# the size of a Walther PP, I'll buy it before shooting it, and I'll pay
# just about anything for it. Does anyone have any good gossip on this? Where?
# When? How do I get my hands on one? (!!!!!!!!!)

I, too, have been eagerly awaiting Glock's "ankle gun" (that's where I
carry my backup, currently a .38 Colt 2"), since my duty gun is a Glock 17
with which I'm very satisfied.  In Ottawa this summer, I spoke to a Glock
salesrep about it.  He said:

A) There won't be a Glock compact until they finish building their factory
here, since they can't import a gun so small.

B) He's not so sure the gun will be 9mm; .380 requires less material in the
slide, which is an issue for an ankle gun.

While my Colt's fine for now, it's a pain requalifying with two different
kinds of handgun (going through double relays is bad enough, without having
different pockets of different ammo);  plus, the Glock 17 is such a sweet
shooter, I know that if the little one is half as good it'll be a big
relief compared to the snubby.

So waiting is uncomfortable, and I'm not sure what to think if it's a .380.
My Division is making noises that they'd approve the use of a .380, but
to me it would be better to carry one type of ammo (if I lose my service
pistol in a scuffle, and I'm crouched in a ravine wetting my pants and needing
to reload my backup gun, it'd be nice to be able to tap into the rounds in
the big mags on my belt!).  As far as stopping power, as a backup pistol
I follow the "something is better than nothing" school.  The only other
thing I'd worry about is mixing up .380 and 9mm, which seem to me to look
similar (especially in the dark when you're wetting your pants).  At least
the .38 spl ammo my current backup uses is esily distinguished from my 9mm.

I'd welcome other, more cheerful rumors (like "Yes, the Glock ankle 9mm
is available now, and is being mailed free of charge to current Glock
owners...:-)

Steve Frysinger
From: bbx!bbxrbk!russ@unmvax.cs.unm.edu (Russ Kepler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Handgun Ammunition Debate
Date: 28 Sep 92 19:39:35 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <1992Sep27.162324.18931@ncsu.edu> hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer) writes:
#  I haven't read any of the literature on this one-shot-stop topic,
#but haven't noticed anyone mention anything about a model or avoiding
#bias in data selection, etc.  Has it been overlooked in the postings,
#or isn't it there?

I'm not sure how one would go about avoiding a bias in the data
selection given that the argument is that selecting for "one shot
stops" *is* a bias in the selected data.

I guess that the only thing that you could do is to take the 2 shot
stops, the 3, then the 4 and analyze for the same sorts of results as
you got for the 1 shot stops.  Anything that had a relatively high one
shot stop should have a good 2 shot stop (at least in the represented
population).

The problem is that with multiple shots the time between the hits can
be the critical factor.  The longer between the shots the greater the
blood loss, and the larger the blood loss the sooner they stop. 
Removing this bias from the data could be near impossible, and may
well explain the selection of one shot stops in the original data.

-- 
Russ Kepler, posting from home
Will hack unix for food 		(.sig stolen from dt - sorry, dt)
From: hes@ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Catalog of books on Military History
Date: 6 Oct 92 01:02:17 GMT
Organization: North Carolina State University

Q. M. Dabney & Co., Inc. Booksellers
P. O. Box 42026
Washington, DC  20015
301 881 - 1470

just sent me a 272 page catalog of

Old, Rare, Used and Out-of-Print Books on 
Military History

Part 1 - WW II
Part 2 - General Military: American Revolution; Boer War; Custer and the
 Battle of Little Bighorn; Korean War; Mexican War; Napoleonic Wars:
 Spanish-American War: Vietnam War; War of 1812; WW I; Indian Wars;
 Ordnance; Naval; Manuals; Ancient Wars: Foreigh Wars; Etc., Etc.
Part 3 - Aviation History (Including WWI and WWII)
Part 4 - American Civil War

  Just thought somebody might be interested.

--henry schaffer  n c state univ
From: root@hland.nullnet.fi (Timo Tuomi)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .38 & .357 (was Re: .222 and .223)
Date: 27 Sep 92 11:28:00 GMT
Organization: NullNet ry, Finland

rigg@ssdt-tempe.sps.mot.com (Dana Rigg) writes:

# My understanding of the Desert Eagle is that it is chambered for the .357
# auto-mag, not the .357.  If there is an auto that is chambered for .357 and

  IMI's Desert Eagles are 'normal' .357 magnums, not auto-mags. Also, the
  .44 model is chambered for the .44 Remington magnum, ie. the normal .44 mag.


Timo Tuomi, Helsinki, Finland !
     root@hland.nullnet.FI    !        This host is protected by
     ttt@purkki.apu.FI        !            Smith  &  Wesson.
From: wwarf@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Wayne J. Warf)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Citizenship ?
Date: 4 Oct 92 02:27:11 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

In article <1992Oct3.164424.26942@ra.msstate.edu> dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu (Donald R. Newcomb) writes:
#In article <1992Oct2.221840.27024@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> wb@mtqua.att.com (Werner Baumgartner) writes:
##Is being a Citizen of the USA a prerequisite to being permitted to legally
##own or purchase firearms ? What standing does a legal alien on permanent
##resident status have in this regard ? Are these Federal issues or local,
##State, municipal issues ?
##
#Werner,
#  As with all other issues in a federal republic there are both Federal
#and local legal issues. I can't answer questions about state and local 
#laws in your area. My reading of US Federal law (I am not a Lawyer) tells
#me that if one is a legal resident alien in the US, he will fall under
#the same regulations as a citizen. Non-resident aliens may purchase a
#firearm with a leter from their embassy. The letter must state the
#type of firearm he may purchase.

I've never heard the letter requirement. I used to work for a gun shop
part-time a few years back and the only requirements was that you not 
be an illegal alien and that you had identification with an in-state 
address. This may be a local requirement or a way to purchase without
showing that you live within a particular state.


-- 
 +--------------------------------------------------------------------+
 | Wayne J. Warf -- WWARF@ucs.indiana.edu -- I speak for myself only  |
 |"Government is like fire, a dangerous servant and a fearful master" |
 +--------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: donb@igor.tamri.com (Don Baldwin)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: sf area shooting
Date: 1 Oct 92 23:31:52 GMT
Organization: TOSHIBA America MRI, South San Francisco, CA

In article <9209250311.AA03349@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu> vcsc546@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu (student) writes:
#I would suggest you call the San Francisco Gun Exchange (a store). They
#have a list of places to shoot. IMHO, the bay area genraly sucks for
#shooters, for gun owners in general. Sorry to be such a drag. 
#Gun Exchange #:  415.982.6097

On the contrary, I think there are a lot of good places to shoot in
the Bay Area.  If the original poster will tell me where he/she would
like to shoot, I'll be happy to supply them with a decent place.  I
have BAYPROFS' excellent guide to local ranges right here in the office.

Letsee...there's an indoor range 5-10 minutes from my office, by car.
There's a range at/near Coyote Point.  There's Sunnyvale Rod and Gun,
Los Altos Rod and Gun, a couple more indoor ranges in/near San Jose,
a location that includes a DCM 200 yard range near Morgan Hill.  About
18 area ranges, altogether...

Safe shooting,

   don

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I'm sorry but your Constitution has been recalled for overhaul.  Please
 relax and cooperate with your local DEA agent.  Otherwise, we shall be
 forced to shoot you."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don Baldwin  -  Software Engineer  - e-mail to:  donb@tamri.com
From: stlee@eos.ncsu.edu (STEVEN TUN-HOU LEE)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: NEW,HELP?
Date: 6 Oct 92 19:40:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: ncsu.1992Oct6.180226.26961
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos


I am fairly new to shooting and chose a 92FS. I know it is a defensive 
handgun so I don't expect clovers on my target but the thing shoots way 
low. I aim for the top of the head and hit somewhere in the chest at 25 feet.
 Is it supposed to be that inaccurate? I had the thing braced so I know 
it isn't me. The groupings as far as I am concerened are great, just a foot
too low. I am aiming with the dot on the target or else it would be even 
lower.

Also, with the high cost of 9mm I would like to start reloading as I intend to
shoot often. Any recomendations? Am considering spending up to 150.00 for 
equipment. Any suggestions are welcome. Also any books or manuals you can 
recommend?
From: hes@ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Neck Sizing of Brass
Date: 6 Oct 92 11:16:43 GMT
Organization: North Carolina State University


  Just an example of how small tolerances can be, and the choice of
resizing dies.  I've been neck sizing my brass with Lee Collet Dies,
and have been very happy with the dies and the performance.  However
due mostly to the discussion on the net I got the idea that I should
try Wilson dies.

  So I ordered a Wilson neck sizing die for .222 Rem.  This requires
ordering a bushing which does the actual sizing, and one must give
the inner diameter measurement for this bushing.  I followed
the (Sinclair) catalog instructions, took the only loaded ammo I
had, measured the neck and ordered a die 0.003" smaller.

  It came, and I rushed to use it - resized a case, placed a bullet
in the neck - and it fell through!  What?  It turns out that the
case I measured was from one brand of brass, and all the empty brass
I had was from another, and this other brand was about .002" thinner
in the neck.  This isn't much, but it is too much!  Grrr!

  Since the Lee Collet Dies work by putting a mandrel inside the
neck and then pressing the brass down to the mandrel - the case
neck thickness doesn't matter, the neck will be sized correctly
regardless.

  Oh well, I hope that (with the new bushing I've already ordered)
that the new dies will improve my accuracy.

-henry schaffer  n c state univ
From: kdlin@colt45 (David Lin)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Concealed Weapons Permit ( again.... )
Date: 3 Oct 92 20:37:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: cherokee.199210031543.AA20950
Organization: U S WEST Advanced Technologies

#rob@spot.Colorado.EDU (Rob Cuthbertson) writes:
#Ken Burner (kb13+@andrew.cmu.edu) writes:
##David Lin (kdlin@uswest.com) writes:
##
###what are the good excuses to tell him/her about why do I have a loaded 
###shinning beautiful pistol in my car? Thanks again.
##
##I hope you're not thinking of leaving the pistol in your car.  Car theft
##in Boulder must be as popular as it is elsewhere in this country.  You
##don't want to lose your car AND your shiny weapon...
#
#I'm sure that car theft is as bad or worse in Boulder, but David will have
#a different problem if he tries to bring his pistol to work.  I work in the 
#same building (one suite over, in fact -- hi David!) and U S WEST expressly 
#prohibits firearms of any kind on the premises, including the parking lot.

I asked a simple question: what are the legitimate reasons to have a gun
in your car? Firstly, someone speculated that I might leave the gun in
my car unattended. Secondly, someone (Hi Rob!!) extended that speculation
to leaving the gun in my unattended car in my employer's parking lot.
Next thing you know, someone will come up a story like: Ten years later,
David's 5-year-old son may find his way to his daddy's employer's parking
lot, manages to open David's Ferrari, plays with David's shinny pistol,
and shoot himself at the foot.....

Moral of the story: extrapolation may not always give you the best
                    results. ;) ;) ;)

I'm still waiting for someone to convience me that a CWP can be good for
me.....

Happy and safe shooting,
David
-- 
 K. David Lin, Ph.D.            | E-mail: kdlin@advtech.uswest.com
 Science & Technology Division  | Reserved for future use.
 U S WEST Advanced Technologies | Disclaimer: Only personal opinions.
From: bbx!bbxrbk!russ@unmvax.cs.unm.edu (Russ Kepler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Lee bites back.
Date: 6 Oct 92 19:39:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: bbxrbk.1992Oct6.142421.3561
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <13400045@iftccu.boeing.com> bressler@iftccu.ca.boeing.com (Rick Bressler) writes in regard to primers going off in a Lee press:
#You tend to get what you pay for....  The Lee isn't a bad press.  It is simply
#a bit less sturdy in some areas and less forgiving.  Unless it has happened 
#recently, I don't think Lee offers a lifetime warranty.  I can state that 
#the Dillon case feeder (in my case at least) works well all the time....

I'm wondering what it takes to have a primer go off while loading. 
I've crushed primers into cases where a significant amount of the
primer was flattened and no primer has gone off (yet).

So what it setting these primers off in folks presses?

-- 
Russ Kepler, posting from home
Will hack unix for food 		(.sig stolen from dt - sorry, dt)
From: upchrch!joel@peora.sdc.ccur.com (Joel Upchurch  )
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Are there restrictions on carry in public places
Date: 1 Oct 92 13:04:32 GMT
Organization: Upchurch Computer Consulting, Orlando FL

sykes@donner.cc.bellcore.com (sykes,michael) writes:

# If you have been granted a permit to carry concealed weapons are there
# any places that you are not allowed to carry at all. (e.g. public places
# such as malls, sports arenas, etc.) I would figure the police would 
# give you such a hard time you might as well leave your weapon at home.
# 
# I have a CCW permit and I was wondering if I am justified in being a litte
# aprehensive about carrying in a public place, or am I overreacting.

The rules must be different in your state. In Florida you get a copy of
the relevant ordinances for Florida with the CCW application packet and
you must sign a statement saying you read and understood them with your
application. It includes a list of the places that you can't carry a
firearm. I won't post the list for Florida, since the rules may be
different in other states and might cause confusion.

(If your mail bounces use the address below.)
Joel Upchurch/Upchurch Computer Consulting/718 Galsworthy/Orlando, FL 32809
joel@peora.ccur.com {uiucuxc,hoptoad,petsd,ucf-cs}!peora!joel (407) 859-0982
From: davep@hpfcpp.fc.hp.com (David Post)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Sight picture and eyes
Date: 2 Oct 92 11:39:17 GMT

I wonder what is going on with my eyes.

The past few trips to the range I have noticed the my dominant eye doesn't
seem so dominant anymore.

I seem to focus on the handgun's front sight ok, but often there are two
target images.  I don't exactly need to work to make sure I have the right
target, but it is distracting.  It is especially bad when there is motion in
my field of vision.

When I lower the handgun and my focus shifts to the target, I see one
target.

I'm not so sure what I am observing is abnormal, but something has changed.
Has anyone else noticed this?

David Post    davep@hpfcpp.fc.hp.com  hplabs!hpfcla!post