From: jamalin@newton.ccs.tuns.ca (Nadeem Jamali)
Subject: Re: Karachi and Sind 
Keywords: Pakistan,capital
Organization: Technical University of Nova Scotia, Halifax, N.S.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 03:59:11 GMT

In article <dogar.711992119@opal4> dogar@rtsg.mot.com (Haroon H. Dogar) writes:
>>In article <N1R-AP-@engin.umich.edu> chaudhry@schroedinger.engin.umich.edu (Iblees) writes:
>
>First, Iblees writes some BS. However, this does not surprise us as Allah has
>warned us that the sole mission of Iblees is to try to mislead the Muslims.  :-)
>
>
>jamalin@newton.ccs.tuns.ca (Nadeem Jamali) writes:
>
>Then, however, Nadeem writes some more BS agreeing with and commending Iblees.
>
>This does surprise Hum because, in doing so, he totally abandons his main point.
>The discussion began because you stated that Pakistan was not created for Islam.
>I responded along the lines of "Bullshit, an entire generation fought, 
>sacrificed, and died for an Islamic Pakistan."

I have already answered all these questions... I haven't used the kind
of language you feel so comfortable with... may be that's why you fail to
understand.

>Because of your ethnocentric hatred of the Muslims from UP/CP/Bihar, etc.
>you denigrated all of their sacrifices and declared them irrelevant.

1. I do not hate anyone.

2. I have already said enough about the "sacrifices" of people from 
   "UP/CP/Bihar".

>I responded with the story of my own Punjabi tribe to illustrate the point.
>Along came Iblees whispering in the ear [Alathhee yu waswesu fi sudurinnas.
>minnal JINNati wannass] saying, "That was then, this is now."
>[Sorry, this whole Iblees symbolism is just too fun to pass up. As Naveed
>says: sometimes I just slay myself  :-)]

No relevant arguement up there. I have made my stand on Punjabi immigrants
clear more than once... what's your point?

>
>Now, you seem to be saying: Yes, well that's [Iblees is] right. Even if
>Pakistan was created for a different reason, why should that bother us.
>We should be able to have the type of country that WE want. The sacrifices
>of previous generations, the whole reason for being of Pakistan are irrelevant.
>

I have never meant to imply that Pakistan was created for reasons other than
what I said I believe it was. If such an implication was so obvious.. I
apologise for not being clear enough.

>I submit that your sampling for the WE is not complete, because I believe
>that if you were  able to ask the people of Pakistan if they wanted
>the rule of Allah or the rule of Kufr, they would overwhelmingly choose
>the former. It is, perhaps, their tough luck that they continue to be 
>ruled by Kufr and that they have the Devils that continue to whisper
>in their ears.

You have every right to ask the people any stupid question... try asking that
question to someone from a country with a better literacy rate... he'll laugh
at you... It's a shame that we take our people's naivete for granted.

>Either Pakistan has yet to fulfill its original goals, or it was the
>biggest fraud perpetrated upon the Muslims of the Subcontinent.

Pakistan yet has to fulfil its goals... true... but those goals are not
what you want them to be... not even what I want them to be. The goals
are what the people of states that joined Pakistan voted for. And that
was a confederation of the Muslim-majority states.

>If the truth is the latter, then I say to all of you, as a disenchanted
>youth from the foreign-born generation that looks to the land of our 
>ancestors and sees such ethnic hatred, crime, immorality and disdain
>for Islam, that your country is misnamed. Instead of a capital P at 
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>the beginning, it should have a small p preceded by an Na.
>

I might just find it difficult to forgive you for making such a remark about
my country... well, but I can hardly blame someone whose life is not linked
with it as is mine. It is very typical of "Pakistanis" settled abroad to give
their idea of what is good for Pakistan... there is something that makes
them believe that they know more than those who are living there... these
people won't have to face the consequences of the decisions they make on the
basis of some vague ideology. For us Pakistan is more than just an area on
the globe, a name in a book... we happen to live there... and we, and our
future generations will have to pay the price of wrong decisions made today...
I feel more confident with the decisions we make than those that some baboo
sahib living in US makes who'll probably never _have to_ _live_ in Pakistan.

>
>-hd
>reaching for vasotec pills

What you and your likes are doing right now is just try to exhaust me.... to
frustrate me by repeating things again and again.... commenting on my posting
without quoting any part of it.... you must be real desparate....

Nadeem

-- 
Nadeem Jamali                                     jamalin@newton.ccs.tuns.ca
						 
School of Computer Science			  
Technical University of Nova Scotia		  (902)420-7882  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan