From: rlc1028@zeus.tamu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: Children in Same-gender Families
Date: 14 Dec 1992 00:09 CST
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station, TX
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: zeus.tamu.edu

In article <602@blue.cis.pitt.edu>, psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek) writes...
|In article <13DEC199214395709@zeus.tamu.edu> rlc1028@zeus.tamu.edu writes:
|>
|>	Sounds to me like there /wasn't/ much love if she hates them so.
| 
|But you weren't there so what it sounds like to you doesn't really matter.
|I can tell you just from what I hear from her mother today that she did
|all the politically correct stuff with both her daughters and it did 
|nothing but harden their opinion against gays.

	Hmmm.  As you said, more on this as time permits.  I'm interested
in hearing her tale.


|>	So, would you rather Gay parents teach their children that their
|>parents are evil sick people?  I'm sure that will lead to a loving 
|>relationship. 
| 
|What I want is really irrelevant, I'm not a gay parent so I couldn't 
|care less because I know that even if I did care since I won't walk 
|lockstep with gay activists, my desires would be dismissed out of hand.

	Any question I ask you is relevant.  

	Anyway, what you seem to be proposing is a neutral position.
Don't let the schools teach anything about family units, and don't 
encourage parents to teach their kids anything about family units,
specifically same-gender family units, since it is bound to backfire,
and the kids will hate the parents anyway.

	Since I am aware of the often counter-productive effects of 
activism, I consider your point to be somewhat valuable, if I am stating
it correctly.

	I will, of course, disregard a general conclusion that "it will
always backfire," since I know of lesbian families which have had success
in helping their kids through the peer persecution bit.  So, I know it will 
not always backfire.

	Now, what about the institutionalised approach? this Rainbow
Programme...?


|In addition to my wife (and her sister experiences) I can compare my own
|understanding of homosexuality with that of my son's.  When I was his age
|we knew little more than they existed, no one was teaching "tolerence"
|and we gave them little more than a second thought.  My son and his 
|school friends have had this stuff crammed down their throats for years
|already, not only from teachers sympathetic to gay causes, but in 
|everything from music (read MTV) and their television show.  The result 
|is that I have heard 10 year olds in a school yard trying to out do each
|other with ways to "kill fags and lezzies" with a zeal that would make
|Hilter proud.  Further questioning of my sons told me that those aren't
|the exceptions in attitudes amongst his peers, it's the norm.  

	So, basically, kids will hate, and making them aware of a minority
group only gives them one more object to hate.  This notion has a certain
appeal, because we all know that kids do tend to make fun of other kids and 
other groups.

	I am a Sesame Street child.  I wonder if the social engineering 
that those liberals at PBS put into that programme had any effect on me?
Well, I grew accustomed to children of other races fairly quickly, and 
never learned to hate them, though my rural elementary school was all-
white, and racist ideas did exist in the kids there.  

	My parents discouraged me from discriminating against race.
I did not rebel against having their values crammed down my throat.
Perhaps it had something to do with my relationship to my parents, I don't 
know.


|You can not force or legislate tolerance and the current attempts to 
|do so are building an ugly monster that is going to take you breath away 
|one day.  You need look no further than the rise in gay bashing and
|violence to know what I'm talking about.  You want to see the result
|of allowing gays into the military over the objections of the majority?
|Read the Clarinews article about the gay sailor that was beaten to death
|by his shipmates for being opnely gay. 

	Like, if the Gays would just keep their place, no harm would ever
come to them.  

	Legislating tolerance for a minority does bring the bigotry that 
exists out into the open, and to a head.  G-d, remember all the Black
towns in the south that got burned when those nosey Northerners came down 
and tried to stir the Blacks into demanding their rights.  There was a 
backlash.  There is still hatred for Blacks today too, and some of this is 
new, rising from the attempts to impose quotas in job hiring.  But do I 
dare say that these days Blacks are more accepted in our society?  Or 
would they have been better off if no legislation had been enacted to help
them break from their place?

	It's a little hard for me to argue in favour of the Rainbow
Programme when I don't know exactly what it is teaching.  Besides, it's not 
my purpose to do so.  But I am going to argue in favour of teaching kids
tolerance.  If it fails, and kids learn to hate from each other, I figure
that they'd still learn to hate along the way anyway.  But I don't think
it will fail in all cases, and encourage parents to teach their kids.

	I wonder if you really disagree with the principle of teaching 
social tolerance to kids, or just disagree on teaching social tolerance for
Gays.


|Be my guest, I'm not the one that will suffer the backlash should I be be right
|and you be wrong.

	Don't be too sure of that.  I doubt I have anything to worry about
if I teach my kids not to persecute minorities.  


|America must've gone through quite a change the last month and a half.  Since
|Clinton promised a cabinet that "would look more like America," it must be that
|we've all become far left academicians or career politicians.  The ivory tower
|is rebuilt, communism lives and its advocates are working for Bill Clinton! 

	Wah!

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