HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: strom@Watson.Ibm.Com (Rob Strom)
Subject: Re: Violation of Netiqutte (was: Stan - Hatred is unbecoming)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 21:16:50 GMT
Organization: IBM Research

In article <1992Nov16.182846.6058@tamsun.tamu.edu>, wjh0265@tamsun.tamu.edu (William Hobson) writes:
|> I echo Stan's words - just because I disagree with the Gay Rights Movements 
|> agenda, it does not mean I have "hatred" in my heart.  I am a Bible believing
|> Christian and I learn from there (the Bible) that homosexuality is wrong.
|> This does not mean that I hate homosexuals - quite the contrary, it is an
|> essential teaching that I am to love all men, not just those who agree with me.
|> I therefore resent the implication that if you disagree, you hate.  It just
|> doesn't follow!
|> 

But if you defend Stan's position, you are doing more than disagreeing.
You are saying that that you don't want gay scouts and scoutleaders
participating with your children.  That's more than disagreeing.
I disagree with Christians but I don't believe that they should
be thrown out of scouting.

I don't buy the arguments that the exclusion of gays or atheists
from scouting is based on Biblical values.

1.  There are other Biblical values which you are not so vehement
    about making the basis for exclusion. As you know, the Bible 
    teaches that it is wrong to eat shrimp, and yet I see no campaign
    to kick shrimp-eaters out of scouts.

2.  Your Christian Bible teaches that everyone is a sinner and
    you should take the plank out of your eye before taking
    the speck out of your neighbor's.  Even if you think
    gays are "sinners" you should recall that Jesus defended his
    socializing and breaking bread with sinners.  Why
    are you making an exception for gays?

My opinion is that gays are being excluded because there is
a popular prejudice, rooted in fear, against gays.  The
Biblical and other "moralistic" arguments are rationalizations
for the prejudice.  

-- 
Rob Strom, strom@watson.ibm.com, (914) 784-7641
IBM Research, 30 Saw Mill River Road, P.O. Box 704, Yorktown Heights, NY  10598
From: hunter@master.lds-az.loral.com (Bill Hunter)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: The Character Factory
Date: 20 Nov 92 16:49:46 GMT
Followup-To: rec.scouting
Organization: Loral Defense Systems - Arizona

Found a great old book called "The Character Factory", by Michael
Rosenthal.  Baden Powell's Boy Scouts and the Imperatives of Empire.  A
great book that shows some real parallels to our social problems of today. 
With all the net talk on so many social issues, people may want to read
this to understand what "Boy Scouts" really means according to the master!

Bill Hunter
Scoutmaster, The Vertical Edge
Loral Defense Systems - Arizona
1300 S. Litchfield Rd.
Goodyear, AZ  85338
PH 602 925 7929  Fax 602 925 6988
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: wlieftin@cs.vu.nl (Liefting W)
Subject: Re: Project C.O.P.E.
Organization: Fac. Wiskunde & Informatica, VU, Amsterdam
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 10:13:08 GMT

rascherm@mcs213a.cs.umr.edu (Robert L Aschermann) writes:

>I am heavily involved with Project C.O.P.E. at Camp Geiger, St. Joseph, MO.  
>I am extremely interested in talking to others involved in C.O.P.E.  
>Camp Geiger was the home of the first BSA C.O.P.E. course 10 years ago.
>I would like to find out what has happened to the program since then, and how
>it has changed.

One question: Next time you post such an article, will you
1. Be more clear, or
2. Limit you article to the american net.

There's hundreds of readers outside america who will not understand a bit of
this, including myself.

Wouter Liefting
wlieftin@cs.vu.nl
From: ckennedy@doc.helios.nd.edu (chris kennedy)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Sad News - Green Bar Bill is dead
Date: 19 Nov 92 14:44:49 GMT
Organization: OUC, University of Notre Dame

In article <1eg2qaINNf26@gap.caltech.edu> keith@cco.caltech.edu (Keith Allan Schneider) writes:
>hilding@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com (Hilding Holroyd) writes:
>
>>In article <1dvprlINN4cd@gap.caltech.edu>, keith@cco.caltech.edu (Keith Allan Schneider) writes:
>>> Does anyone else find it ironic that GBB, perhaps the most well-known
>>> and respected member of the Scouting organization since LBP, was gay?
>>> keith
>
>>Let's have some PROOF, here and not just flames. I have seen accusations
>>that Baden-Powell was gay. Now I see one that "Green Bar Bill" was gay.
>>_I don't buy it!!_  No one has the right to make such accusations.
>
>Well, I had previously heard such rumors about both and had no knowledge
>of the illness.  How did he contract AIDS?
>
>keith
>
Who the hell said anything about Green Bar Bill dying of aids, I thought that 
he died because he was old.  As far as rumors as to him being gay, it seems 
that anyone who is not married by the time they are 30 is accused of being 
gay, especially by the self proclaimed outers, and even more so if they are 
involved with youth, as in scouting.  

chirs
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: macman@bernina.ethz.ch (Danny Schwendener)
Subject: Rec.scouting change - PLEASE GO AND VOTE
Organization: Peppermint Software Inc.
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 19:21:30 GMT

Well, the call for vote is now (finally) out. With a typo,
too, and I present my apologies for that.

The discussion period has shown that there were valid
arguments (IMHO) both for and against the reorg.
Now, it is up to you to weight the points and make a decision.

Whatever you decide to vote, please SEND IN YOUR VOTE.
This is your group. So shape it the way you would like it to be.

Vote, and do that soon enough. If you change your mind during
the voting period, send your vote again. Only your last vote
will count.

Oh yes, and a last reminder: you are free to state your opinion
on the net (although there was plenty of time do do it before
during the discussion period -- which is now officially closed).
However, don't forget that only the filled vote ballots sent to
vote@bernina.ethz.ch will be considered in the count.


-- Danny Schwendener         macman@bernina.ethz.ch
   Wolfsmeute Nidau/Glockenhof, Sihlstr. 33, CH-8001 Zurich, Switzerland
   m.h.c. Troop 14, San Francisco
From: bob.kenyon@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Bob Kenyon) 
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: PROGRAMS FROM OTTAWA
Date: 16 Nov 92 18:24:00 GMT
Reply-To: bob.kenyon@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Bob Kenyon) 
Distribution: world
Organization: Freddy's Place BBS - Edmonton, AB - 403-456-4241

DHBK>I am trying to get hold of a copy of the scouting computer programs from
DHBK>HQ in Ottawa. Can anyone help me find them? I understand that they are
DHBK>available on a BBS somewhere.

DHBK>Thanks.

DHBK>Doug Heaton
DHBK>Trainer, Edmonton Region
DHBK>Edmonton, Alberta.

Doug

Sysop left me a message saying they had loaded some files to dir98.

---
 . SLMR 2.1 . Bob Kenyon - Service Scouter, Edmonton, AB. Canada
From: ad980@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Paul S. Wolf)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Sad News - Green Bar Bill is dead
Date: 19 Nov 1992 21:51:52 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


The info my council office has is that GBB died while traveling
in Switzerland (at age 92).  He had been on a long trip including
Japan  prior to Europe.

I hope I'm still travelling world-wide at that age.

May his memory be for a blessing.

Paul Wolf
SM- Troop 96
Greater Cleveland Council 440
From: arneberg@SPARCserve.cs.adfa.oz.au (Bjorn Arne Berge)
Subject: Australian scouts want penfriends : -)
Followup-To: arneberg@SPARCserve.cs.adfa.oz.au
Keywords: Australia, penfriend, all over the world
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:26:26 GMT

Hello all!

And now: A posting from Canberra, Australia...:-)

I am writing this on behalf of some of the scouts in the troop,
in which I currently am a scout assistant (soon to be scout leader).

The scouts are in the agegroup 11-14 years old, and would very much like 
to have penfriends from other parts of the world involved in scouting
in the same agegroup. I am sure there are lots of people "out there"
that would like some Australian scout penfriends. 

I will pass all adresses and messages over to the scouts. And, this
is a snail-mail request only... :-(

Yours in scouting

Bjorn Arne (a Norwegian a long, long way from home...:-)

           ========================================================
           Bjorn Arne Berge                   |  "Scouts do it    |
	   arneberg@SPARCserve.cs.adfa.oz.au  |   in the bush.."  |
           "Blant alle lande i ost og vest,   |-------------------|
	    er fedrelandet mitt hjerte nest"  | "Join the ....."  |
           ========================================================





Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: hayesj@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (HAYES JAMES MICHAEL JR)
Subject: Re: 13th Point
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 22:58:55 GMT


B-P only made up 9 laws.  In US we added 3. B-P wouldn't make a 
quip about the thirteenth.
-- 
  Mike Hayes             |"Knowledge is good."  - Faber College Motto
  WWW                    |"Knowledge and Thoroughness" -Rensselear Poly Motto
  Unemployed Tech,       |"No, thank YOU!"  -Groucho Marx, 'A Day at the Races'
  Driven to banging my head against engineering physics for 4 years.
From: keith@cco.caltech.edu (Keith Allan Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Gays you miss the point.
Date: 21 Nov 1992 11:13:16 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: punisher.caltech.edu

>At what age does the typical gay male know that he is gay?  I would think that
>at ages 11-12-13 or so, boys are just beginning to find out who/what they are.
>I doubt they can make a lifetime decision at that age.

You are speaking as if boys actually *decide* to become gay or not.  You
seem to be saying that homosexuality is some sort of lifestyle choice.
This has not been substantiated by research.  Instead, it seems that humans
(the population on the whole) caontain a wide spectrum of all sexualtieis.
Some people are purely gay wihle others are purely straight.  Most people,
though, are somewhere in between.

And, I also don't see how you think of this "decision" as a "lifetime
decision."  Are you saying that once a person has sex with someone of
the same gender, that they cannot still have a family and a "normal" (by
your definition) life?

keith
From: jlykset@eis.calstate.edu (Jon D. Lyksett)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: The Character Factory
Date: 20 Nov 92 19:01:28 GMT
Organization: Calif State Univ/Electronic Information Services

Also try "The Boy-Man" by Timothy Jeal.  When read in concert with "The
Character Factory" you get a real fine grounding in the life history and
social aspects of what drove B-P and his founding of the Scouting movement.

Jon Lyksett
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: scottb@col.hp.com (Scott Brunton)
Subject: Space Derby Help Wanted
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 17:40:45 GMT
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division

	Our pack has traditionally held a Pinewood Derby each spring and
is looking to try a Space Derby.  I contacted our local DE to see if
he knew of any other packs that may have experience in running one.  He
was not aware of anyone.

	I would appreciate help and direction in any of the following
areas (and others if you think it important):

	* how to construct the track
		- I had been told that the runs can be as long
		  as 50-75 feet ... apparently, these spacecrafts
		  really fly!

	* how to start them off
		- I recall reading that a starting block can be made
		  out of wood that would lock the propellors until all
		  spacecrafts are ready to be released

	* material to use a runners
		- I had been told that monofilament fishing line works well

	* how to determine winner (is electronic necessary?)
		- again, I had been told that close finishes over a long
		  run are not likely; however, placement may be important
		  for subsequent rounds

	* your choice of advice
		- I'm open to ideas!


	Thanks, Scott Brunton (scottb@col.hp.com)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito)
Subject: Re: Stan, Stan, Stan.....
Organization: The Software Engineering Institute
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:08:53 GMT


In article <Bxo10K.4M7@cs.uiuc.edu>, Carl M. Kadie writes:
 
|> rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito) writes:
|> 
|> >I think that this is not the case.  For First Class mail, a LETTER is the
|> >property of the sender, and not the recipient!
|> 
|> Not so. The letter is the recipient's property. The recipient can burn
|> it, sell it, and show it to others privately. The copyright, however,
|> belongs to the sender. This prevents the recipient from publishing it,
|> copying it, or exhibiting it publically (beyond what fair use allows).

Indeed -- I wasn't precise enough.  I should have said that the CONTENTS of
the letter remain the property of the author, and cannot be made public
without the author's consent.  This was the context of the discussion
regarding the publication of email.  It is NOT fair use to post email.

Sorry, and thanks for the correction.

Rich
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: mpg92118@dit.upm.es (ANDRES CANCER ABREU)
Subject: Australia Pen Friends
Organization: UUES, Asociacion de Usuarios de UNIX, Spain
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 16:53:21 GMT

Some one posted an article about Pen Friends, can u send me your e-mail
i have informed my scout group about it and there can be some one interested
i dont promise anything yet but....

I have using all my abilities lost your post about it so i dont have your
e-mail.

	BUENA CAZA!!!!!

		Akela of the ETAWAH pack.

--
____________________________________________________________________________
\ Andres Cancer Abreu.             $  When I think back in all the crap    / 
\ E.T.S.I. Telecomunicaciones      $  I learn by highschool. It's a wonder /
\ Madrid                           $  how I can think at all.              /
\ e-mail mpg92118@oasis.dit.upm.es $  'Kodachrome' Simon & Garfunkel.      /
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: phill@bohra.cpg.oz.au (Phill Solomon)
Subject: RE: Attacting Rovers
Organization: Computer Power Software
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 02:23:49 GMT

>From: jfarmer@fraser.sfu.ca (Jason Michael Farmer)
>Subject: Rovers
>Message-ID: <jfarmer.721672416@sfu.ca>
>Sender: news@sfu.ca
>Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
>Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 16:33:36 GMT
>Lines: 16
>
>What do you other Rovers out there find to be the best method of recruiting new
>members from younger sections and from outside of Scouting?
>
>Jason Farmer
>11th Sur-Del "Errant Knights" Rover Crew

Well it is best if firstly you have joint activities with you Venturer unit(s)
so they can see the fun you have and are interested in coming up. It also
helps dispell any myths that Venturer leaders my have (sorry George). Cub
nights etc and taking the Scouts abseiling is also good group PR for any crew.

Outsiders, advertising. Quite a few shopping center display happern from time
to time around here, also in community halls have Rover posters etc.

Yours in Scouting,

Phill Solomon
Secretary - Council for Yarra Batman Area Rovers
Activities - Yehudi Rover Crew
3rd Doncaster West Scout Group.

P.S. sorry not a followup, problems with my news reader.
-- 
Jason Farmer                 |  Daisemi'in rhhaensuriuu
jfarmer@fraser.sfu.ca        |      meillunsiateve
Simon Fraser University      |           Rh'e Mnhei'sahe yie ahr'en:
Burnaby, British Columbia    |  
Canada                       |   Mnahe afw'ein qiuu;
                             |      rh'e hweithnaef
                             |           mrht Heis'he ehl'ein qiuu.


-- 
Phill Solomon.                              ACSnet : phill@bohra.cpg.oz.au
TODAY IR&D                                  UUCP   : uunet!munnari!bohra!phill
CP Software Export Pty Ltd. (ACN.006640133) FIDONET: 3:633/363 Swinestud 
Division of the Computer Power Group - Melbourne Australia Voice: +61 3 8230222
From: wepps@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (William R. Epps)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: 13th point (was Re: A Scout is Tolerant?
Date: 16 Nov 92 20:40:09 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech Computer Science Dept, Blacksburg, VA


	Gee, I always thought that the 13 point was:
		
		A scout is resourceful.
From: EAC106@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: square knots
Date: 23 Nov 92 19:33:43 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

Dear fellow Scouters,
  Hi. My name is Eric (Eagle Class of '88) and I'm an Assistant Scoutmaster now
 with Troop 117 in Altoona, PA.  Two questions about sqaure knots:

 1) How many are there, and what are they for?  I have heard several stories,
     but no one seems to know for sure.

 2) Which square knots are Boy Scouts (not adults, but Scouts) permitted to
     wear on their uniform?  Are there any others besides the religious award
     knot?

Thanks,
 Eric
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: jlw3@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Joseph L. Wood, III)
Subject: Re: Fund-raising
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Middletown, NJ
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 18:48:45 GMT
Keywords: scouts fund raising

We sell fertilizer every spring.  We go out on the first
Sunday afternoon in March and take orders for a variety of products.
We then make up an order for our supplier who gives us a really
good deal and arrange for the loan of a semi to bring the stuff to town.
On Friday 12 days later we deliver to the customers.  We are
a very small troop and we can pull in $1500 from even our small town.

The fact that we deliver is our competitive edge.  Our prices aren't
any better than the local nursery store.

Joe Wood
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: brent@convex.com (Brent Henderson)
Subject: Need patrol spirit building game
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:54:47 GMT
Distribution: rec.scouting
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
Keywords: games
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

	We are about to attempt a reorg. of our existing patrols,
becaus the ages of the patrol members are too similar and there is
no natural leader.  Some of the scouts I have talked to seem to 
resent the idea that there will be 'new/young/little' scouts in 
their patrol.  What I'm searching for is a game will emphasize the
importance of having these new scouts.  The game can either be 
indoors or out.

					brent@convex.com

Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: rascherm@mcs213a.cs.umr.edu (Robert L Aschermann)
Subject: Project C.O.P.E.
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 03:03:02 GMT
Organization: University of Missouri - Rolla

I am heavily involved with Project C.O.P.E. at Camp Geiger, St. Joseph, MO.  
I am extremely interested in talking to others involved in C.O.P.E.  
Camp Geiger was the home of the first BSA C.O.P.E. course 10 years ago.
I would like to find out what has happened to the program since then, and how
it has changed.
From: hunter@master.lds-az.loral.com (Bill Hunter)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Rec.scouting change
Date: 23 Nov 92 18:11:05 GMT
Followup-To: rec.scouting
Organization: Loral Defense Systems - Arizona



> how about rec.scouting.bsa and rec.scouting.everyone_else
> 
> --
This seems to be appropriate.  Certainly BSA is the worlds largest group
and has many unique issues.



Bill Hunter
Scoutmaster, The Vertical Edge
Loral Defense Systems - Arizona
1300 S. Litchfield Rd.
Goodyear, AZ  85338
PH 602 925 7929  Fax 602 925 6988
From: keith@cco.caltech.edu (Keith Allan Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Sad News - Green Bar Bill is dead
Date: 20 Nov 1992 06:27:27 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: punisher.caltech.edu

j_butler@tincup.enet.dec.com () writes:


>As I heard it, he died of a heart attack. At age 92. 
>A memorial service is being planned for the 1993 National Jamboree.
>I give as much credence to his having had AIDS/ARC as I do to "Elvis Sightings."

Well, someone posted in here that he "died from AIDS complications"...

keith
From: silk@mcl.ucsb.edu (ken mencher)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Weather Reports Nov 22/92
Date: 24 Nov 92 00:24:07 GMT

Warmer climes??

well, the temp is running 'bout 15 deg cen. in the evening/night (which is
when i'm usually up) with moderate winds from the south/southwest.

Ocean temp is running 'bout 12 deg cen, with 2-3 waves out of the south.

(maybe somebody further south than me can pass on word what's down there?)

silk
silk@mcl.mcl.ucsb.edu
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: John_Morgan@mindlink.bc.ca (John Morgan)
Subject: Christmas Games
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 06:46:05 GMT

Does any one out there have any games to play at a Christmas party?  The
games must have some sort of Christmas theme to them so tag, dodge ball etc.
are out for this once a year occasion.

P.S.  The game should be for boys from 6 to 14 so this might make it a little
      difficult but any game could be adapeted so post away.

John Morgan, 4th West Whalley Scouts, Fraser Valley Region


--
######################################################################
#                        #                   ARMY                    #
#  John Morgan           #              Another fine game            #
#  a345@mindlink.uucp    #              By Milton Bradley            #
#                        #                 Ages 17 & up              #
########################################
Newsgroups: rec.scouting