HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dclason@dante.nmsu.edu (Dennis Clason)
Subject: Re: Do U.S. clarinet sections use identical instruments?
Summary: I think it's a regional thing.
Organization: New Mexico State University, Las Cruces, NM
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 22:58:16 GMT

In article <1992Dec12.192827.390@otago.ac.nz> coscsjc@otago.ac.nz writes:
>In a recent symphonic band workshop we in the clarinet section noticed
>that between us there were a fair number of different brands of
>clarinet: Buffet, Leblanc, Yamaha (Custom), Boosey & Hawkes, Noblet
>and Wurlitzer.  This reminded me of something I once read (possibly in
>one of Jack Brymer's books) claiming that some wind bands and
>orchestras in the U.S. try to achieve a uniformity of sound in their
>clarinet sections by demanding that the players play on identical
>instruments -- and possibly also similar mouthpiece and reed setups.
>Is this really true?  I find it hard to believe that this would
>achieve anything given that different clarinettist's sounds (and
>desired sounds) can vary so widely.
>

I think it's basically a regional thing.  When I was growing up
in Bakersfield, California the best clarinet teachers in the area
all played Selmer Series 9.  All their students who had pro axes
had, yep, Selmer Series 9s.  When I moved to Kansas, the teacher
at Kansas State played Selmer, so the kids played Selmer.  Here at
NMSU, our best clarinet players play Buffet, and sure enough, 80%+
of the clarinet students here have Buffets.  You almost never see
a Selmer here.

In the horn section, California is big on Conn 8Ds, but here in New
Mexico people play Holtons or Yamahas.  In Central California the
most widely used trombone was King, with a few Conns and Olds.  Bachs
were almost unknown, and I was a radical playing a Bach.  In Kansas,
the usual tenor 'bone was a Conn 88H, with a smattering of Bach 36
and 42.  There was not a King to be found.  Here Bach is the dominant
trombone, with a smattering of Yamahas and Conns.

The closest thing I've heard of to trying to unify a section occurred
when I was playing in the Kansas State U Symphony and the conductor
came back to tell us we were the best heavy brass section he had 
had in a University Orchestra -- what were we playing.  As it
happened, all the trumpets were playing Bach Cs and the trombones
were all playing Bachs of various descriptions.  Purely coincidental,
but the director attributed it to the horns and not the players.  We
were somewhat offended, to say the least :-)  It made us want to go
get the Conn Directors from the applied brass class and play the next
concert on beginner's horns.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: gustavo@dent.uchicago.edu (Gustavo Comezana)
Subject: Re: Greatest living conductors
Organization: Dept. of Mathematics, U. of Chicago
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 15:24:57 GMT

In article <BzFyvM.1wq.1@cs.cmu.edu> acid+@cs.cmu.edu (Christopher Colby) writes:
>
>After sitting through mediocre performance after mediocre performance with
>Maazel conducting, the thought of putting him anywhere near the top tier of
>recent conductors rings very false.  It's ludicrous how much money that guy
>pulls down here in Pittsburgh.
>
>-chris

Is it just my impression, or Maazel *was* a much more interesting
conductor early in his career? I mean, it is hard to believe that,
say, his Sibelius cycle in Vienna (witness 2nd, 4th and especially 7th
symphonies) or his Romeo (Prokofiev) could come from the same guy that
perpetrated "The Ring without words" (aaaghh!).


                                                 G.
From: smw@ira7.ecn.purdue.edu (S. M. WU)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: beethoven's symphonies
Date: 19 Dec 92 19:03:15 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <1992Dec18.4216.25741@dosgate> "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com> writes:
>   >z    Subject: Beethoven's Symphonies
>
>If you'll indulge me, Sams, just next door to HMV, is selling off the
>EMI Furtwaengler discs at C$6.99 each. If you can find all 5, it's a
>bargain. Mono sound, but echt Beethoven in execution.
>

How about the Furtwaengler's recording of Beethoven's symphonies on
'Virtuoso' label?  I bought a set of 5 discs including all but the
2nd symphony for only US$18 (in mono, too).  Are they considerably
inferior to his EMI recording, individually or as a whole?  Is there
any EMI disc(s) worth owning in addition to the Virtuoso set?
From: zornow@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Claudia Zornow)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Do U.S. clarinet sections use identical instruments?
Date: 16 Dec 92 00:47:20 GMT
Organization: HP SSD R & D

Stephen Cranefield writes:

>...  This reminded me of something I once read (possibly in
> one of Jack Brymer's books) claiming that some wind bands and
> orchestras in the U.S. try to achieve a uniformity of sound in their
> clarinet sections by demanding that the players play on identical
> instruments -- and possibly also similar mouthpiece and reed setups.
> Is this really true?  

In general, I don't know, and I'm curious to see the replies.  
But I did read an article in "The Clarinet" magazine some time ago
(I could go through my back issues if anyone's dying to find out 
more) about the new Wurlitzer clarinets.  The author (of course 
I can't remember who) claimed that they sound so different that 
if one player in a symphony orchestra changes to Wurlitzers, the
rest of the section should change as well.  

Claudia
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: richardh@convex.com (Richard Hargrove)
Subject: Romancing the Note (was: Pachelbel, Beethoven, and Mel Gibson)
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 13:26:17 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In article <BzECG1.6K1@cs.columbia.edu> tait@cs.columbia.edu (Carl Tait) writes:
>In article <105123@bu.edu> spacefox@acs.bu.edu (Godfrey Degamo) writes:
>>
>>What's the best music to romance a woman at the piano?
>

[ a great deal of advice deleted ]

>gives you a lot of bang for your buck.  (Perhaps that was not the best
>choice of words.)  It's not very hard, but sounds damn near impossible.

Or perhaps it was.

richard
-------
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: broken@venison.bae.bellcore.com (Tony Brokenborough)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: Bell Communications Research
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 20:32:33 GMT

In article <1992Dec17.055240.28207@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com>, johnme@ecs.comm.mot.com (John Meyer) writes:
|> In article <1gnii7INNibh@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> stinerkt@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Kevin T Stiner) writes:
|> >I just listened to Brahm's Symphony #1 over and over and over...  The  
|> >final movement is possibly the BEST ending to a classical piece I have  
|> >ever heard!  That sparked me to ask this question to find out what else I  
|> >should listen to to hear some amazing endings:
|> >
|> >What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?
|> >
|> 
|> 
|>  Mahlers' 9th
|>  Bruckners' 8th
|>    Both great masterpieces
|> 
|> 
|>  john
|> 



Bruckner ????? 

Can any good thing come from him ?
From: martino@wpi.WPI.EDU (Robert Paul Martino Jr)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The worst composer in a millenium
Date: 14 Dec 1992 14:40:52 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpi.wpi.edu

>In article <1992Dec12.165335.17469@news.columbia.edu> rsm13@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ravi S Moorthy) writes:
>I had the misfortune of buying Oliver Messiaen's "Turangalila Symphony"
>conducted by Rattle.  To give credit where it is due, it is the worst
>music I have ever heard.  Pardon me Messiaen lovers, but I cannot make
>any sense of his mumbling mystecism or the interminable bird calls.
>
>Ravi

Well, I too just recently got my Turangalila Symphony CD from BMG (the
Chung/Bastille "definative" recording) and listened with an open mind
because I had been warned by Messiaen fans here that this (or any
of his pieces) are hard to get into.

However, I found that listening to the first two or three movements 
was comparable to hurtling through a huge roller coaster.  Yes,
it is hard to swallow, but not any harder (at least for me) to get
into than something like Rite of Spring.  Actually my first reaction
to Messiaens music was that it reminded me of Stravinsky.  

Maybe it was because my brain was overloaded after the first few
movements but everything else kind of went over my head until
the satisfying conclusion of the last movement.  The sound quality
of this recording is great, and the electonic instrument(won't
attempt to spell) adds a really special feeling to the symphony.

Its not something I'll probably play very much (just like I don't
just casually listen to my Bartok or Stravinsky CDs) but I don't
regret getting this CD.

Rob

-- 
Rob Martino                          |     (clever or particularly funny
martino@wpi.wpi.edu                  |      philosophical quote here)
Worcester, Massachusetts USA         | 
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rwilmer@gateway (R. Wilmer)
Subject: Re: NEWS: Pavarotti booed out of the SCALA
Organization: Mitre Corporation, McLean, VA
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:34:49 GMT

In article <Bz65ss.8q@news.udel.edu> conrad@brahms.udel.edu (Jon Conrad) writes:
>In article <1992Dec11.193207.2286@linus.mitre.org> rwilmer@carrier.mitre.org (R. Wilmer) writes:
>
>>In article <Bz3tvA.HGt@news.udel.edu> conrad@brahms.udel.edu (Jon Conrad) writes:
>
>>>.  The one time I've booed was for a baritone singing
>>>Germont in Philadelphia, who went flat on every single phrase as well as
>>>scooping from below into every single note (not just first notes of
>>>phrases).
>
>>Perhaps scooping
>>from the depths but never reaching the surface?
>
>He scooped AND he
>flatted.


Anna Reynolds recommended that I learn the part of Magnifico in 
Rossini's Cenerentola.  I looked at his aria and noticed that
for nearly two entire pages, he sings everything on one single
pitch: a---well over a hundred times a.  Since your posting
I have been imagining (in a kind of self-inflicted nightmare) your
Germont singing this piece.  Perhaps crueller than booing him
would be to get him to record Magnifico's aria and then force him
listen to it.

Richard
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: NEW New Grove?
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 07:45:33 GMT

In article <1992Dec20.062000.7076@news.columbia.edu> gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener) writes:
>An article in the Dec. 13 Washington Post apparently intimated that there
>might be a new edition of the New Grove before the end of the decade.  
>Not having procured a copy of the article yet (one is on its way to me), 
>I'm not sure what was said, but I'm curious if anyone knows what the
>official word here is.

>As I understand it, the last revision took a decade.  I know they've been
>spending much time on the new Opera dictionary, so I'm wondering what might
>be the earliest we'd see a New New Grove?  Is 7 years really enough time
>for another revision?  Or was the Post being optimistic?

Depends on what they do. Grove 6 was a 97% (they said) rewrite; only
a few major articles (e.g., Schubert) were taken over from Grove 5.
I don't think we *need* a new Beethoven article or, for that matter,
new stuff for most of the terminology; Grove 7 wouldn't be as radical
a job in any case.  

Also, the technological hurdles (assuming the thing is to come out 
between cloth covers) wouldn't be as great next time.  It took them
2 years just to get the typesetting right last time.

I'd say that Grove 7 requires about a 30% rewrite from Grove 6 to
be a worthwhile buy; and that Grove 6 (esp. bibliographies) will
be sadly out of date by 1999 in many ways.

Roger
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: apter@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter)
Subject: Re: Debussy, Shostakovich, and... ?
Organization: Morgan Stanley & Co., New York, NY
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 20:41:56 GMT

>doom@elaine36.Stanford.EDU (Joseph Brenner) wrote:
> I like Debussy, I like Shostakovich, what else would you
> predict that I'd like?

Shostakovich:  

By all means listen to the symphonies of Carl Nielsen.  
Start with Bernstein's recordings of 3 and 5, on CBS/Sony.

You might also enjoy Bohuslav Martinu's symphonies.  A
very fine set of the six has been recorded by Neeme Jarvi,
for BIS.

And if you're feeling adventurous, I'd also recommend
Havergal Brian's "Gothic" symphony, on Marco Polo.

Finally, a pair of CDs by another immensely gifted Dane:

	Vagn Holmboe
	Symphony 4, Symphony 5
	Symphony 6, Symphony 7

Both on BIS.  




Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: fernande@cps.msu.edu (Jose Roberto Fernandez)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Originator: fernande@atlantic.cps.msu.edu
Reply-To: fernande@cps.msu.edu (Jose Roberto Fernandez)
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Michigan State University
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 16:38:09 GMT

In addition to others already mentioned:

- the last movement of Mozart's Sym. #41
- the finale of Wagner's Gotterdammerung 

-- 
Jose Roberto Fernandez
fernande@cps.msu.edu
Computer Science
Mich. St. Univ.
From: bellmann@qut.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Wagner and Jews?
Date: 14 Dec 92 16:33:09 EST
Organization: Queensland University of Technology

In article <1992Dec9.012721.4208@cs.ucla.edu> pierce@lanai.cs.ucla.edu (Brad
Pierce) writes:

> the composer's odious view of Jews. (I do still find it troubling that the
> music-"consuming" public isn't made more aware of these views.)

What for, may I ask? What good would come around by making the music-consuming
public more aware of irrelevant facts? Why not let them enjoy the music instead
of telling them they should not on the grounds of ideological reasons?
My mother always disliked Richard Strauss because she knew of his supposed nazi
sympathies. The first time I heard the "Metamorphoses" I was overwhelmed, and I
still think it's one of the best pieces of music ever written. Now, many argue
that it is really a requiem for the Third Reich. I don't know, I suppose it
might be. Others think it's a requiem for the Dresden Opera. But what does all
this matter? I guess we agree music is not a language, it does not convey ideas
so whatever the source of the composer's inspiration it's irrelevant to the
feelings the piece may evoke in us. His ideology surely had some part to play
on the genesis of the music, but its effect was limited to the biochemistry in
the composer's brain. All we know is the final product of this process, and it's
silly to believe that it is somehow magically contaminated by malevolence,
bigotry, sexual deviance or mysticism. I can understand the reaction of the
survivors of the Holocaust to Wagner's music, but the people who was born after
the war don't have a good case for rejecting it. It's just their loss.

Hector
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Lost Masterpieces was Re: Dresden was Re: One-work-composers
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 06:30:21 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.152555.5048@fid.morgan.com> apter@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter) writes:
>In article <1992Dec17.234323.18029@Princeton.EDU> roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig) writes:
>>In article <1992Dec17.225720.4602@fid.morgan.com> apter@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter) writes:

>>>New thread:  Presumably great works which were, or might have been, 
>>>lost or destroyed.

>>On my list:
>>--the Cambrai Choirbook
>>--Monteverdi's Arianna
>>--Schuetz's Daphne

>In fact, the exchange about Dresden which prompted my question
>brought Schutz to mind.  I've always assumed that the firebombing
>was responsible for the loss of at least some of Schutz's work, but
>your reply to the original poster suggests that this is not so.
>What's the story here?

Perhaps some autographs were destroyed, though I don't know that this
is the case.  However, ther ewas already a very extensive Schuetz
edition in press (1890's, I think!), and anything that was in Dresden
would have been transcribed for it.  Moreover, the second (Baerenreiter)
"complete" edition was underway, and so source material would have been
very much in the awareness of musicologists, etc.  

As I said, material in the State Library was not touched; I've used
their Heinichen scores, for instance, and everything that Seibel 
described in 1911 is still there.

Daphne -- the first German opera -- has come down to us only in its libretto
by Martin Opitz.  (Schuetz and Opitz -- a collaboration at least as 
great as Strauss and Hofmannsthal...)  Of course, *most* 17thC operas 
have come down to us in this way, libretti being published in numerous
copies, and scores being copied only once or twice in most cases, but 
this one is a shame for so many reasons.

Roger

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ted@dgbt.doc.ca (Ted Grusec)
Subject: Re: Bartok in "The Shining" (was Bela Bartok info.)
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 22:06:34 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.203657.20097@viewlogic.com> brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg) writes:
>
>In article <92350.134032MLH119@psuvm.psu.edu>, <MLH119@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>|> Could anyone tell me what the name of the piece of Bartok's music that was
>|> used in the soundtrack to the movie, The Shining.
>|> Any information would be greatly appreciated.
>|> 
>|> Michael Hock --- MLH119 at PSUVM
>
>Seems to me they used some excerpts from a piece with a title something
>like: Music for orchestra, piano, and celeste
>
>I'm not sure of the title; perhaps someone else has more precise info.

Music for Percussion, Strings and Celeste
Much of the goryer music in the Shining was from Penderecki>
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Ted Grusec - Communications Research Centre, Ottawa, Ont., Canada
Xref: sparky rec.music.classical:18836 bit.listserv.allmusic:14258
From: IMAGING.CLUB@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("Imaging Club")
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,bit.listserv.allmusic
Subject: Optical Music Recognition - Bibliography available
Date: 17 Dec 92 19:43:49 GMT
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs

This sounds very interesting indeed, so I'm reposting it here.

-----------Michael.Willett@OFFICE.Wang.com---------------

sci.image.processing, Dec 17, 1992

Contents:
  Optical Music Recognition - Bibliography aviable

------------------

From: roth@sitter.ips.id.ethz.ch (Martin Roth)
Subject: Optical Music Recognition - Bibliography aviable
Organization: ETH Zurich (Swiss Federal Institute of Technology)
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 13:08:53 GMT

I compiled a bibliography for Optical Music Recognition (automatic
reading a scanned-in page of music, pattern recognition).

PostScript and BibTeX files are aviable via ftp from maggia.ethz.ch
(129.132.17.1), login ftp, directory /pub/roth/omrbib.

If you can't use ftp or can't uncompress *.Z files, drop me a mail.

Comments, additions about new publications are welcome!

_______________________________________________________________________
      _   Martin Roth                Martin Roth      ETHZ, ips, RZ F16
|\  /|_)  Mail: roth@ips.id.ethz.ch  Sandacker 14   ETHZ, ti, IFW B45.2
| \/ | \  Dipl. Eng. Comp. Sci. ETH  CH-8154 Oberglatt   g 01/256 55 68
          (F-)emails welcome!        Switzerland         p 01/850 32 75
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------

*** End of news from sci.image.processing - Dec 17, 1992
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 18:50:38 GMT

stinerkt@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Kevin T Stiner) writes:
: I just listened to Brahm's Symphony #1 over and over and over...  The  
: final movement is possibly the BEST ending to a classical piece I have  
: ever heard!  That sparked me to ask this question to find out what else I  
: should listen to to hear some amazing endings:
: 
: What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?

Do I get more than 1?

	Mahler 1, 2, 6, 9, 10
	Bruckner 8
	Beethoven 9
	Beethoven Grosse Fugure (from Qut Op130)
	Shostakovich 11

That'll do for now, but it's in no way exhaustive


--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Re: If I'd only read farther...
In-reply-to: r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca's message of Fri, 11 Dec 1992 04:52:58 GMT
Organization: pubs
Date: 11 Dec 92 11:21:12 CST

Richard Smith writes:

   Chabrier springs to mind as a one-work composer in the vein in which
   this  thread is going. All you ever hear is Espana, even though he
   wrote much  more. He was greatly admired by Ravel and Debussy and was
   a great  influence on much turn-of-the-century French music. Very,
   very, very  unjustly neglected.

Here's how I discovered Chabrier.  I once fell asleep with the radio
playing, tuned to a station that went off the air at 12 or 1.  It
started broadcasting again in the morning with no initial announcement,
but only by playing a piece of music that floated into my dreams and
brought me to consciousness in the gentlest way imaginable.  When I was
fully conscious, I wasn't sure what had happened--had I imagined that
music?  I later called the station and learned that the piece was the
Idylle from Chabrier's Suite Pastorale.  This has been a favorite of
mine since.  (Ansermet's version seems the best.)

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com
From: ucap22w@ucl.ac.uk (Martin S T Watts)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Bartok in "The Shining" (was Bela Bartok info.)
Date: 16 Dec 92 16:00:06 GMT
Organization: Bloomsbury Computing Consortium

brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg) writes:


>In article <92350.134032MLH119@psuvm.psu.edu>, <MLH119@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>|> Could anyone tell me what the name of the piece of Bartok's music that was
>|> used in the soundtrack to the movie, The Shining.
>|> Any information would be greatly appreciated.
>|> 
>|> Michael Hock --- MLH119 at PSUVM

>Seems to me they used some excerpts from a piece with a title something
>like: Music for orchestra, piano, and celeste

Isn't that Strings, Percussion and Celeste? I think it might be. From my
memories of the film credits I think the particular recording used was one
of Karajan's with the Berlin Phil.

Martin Watts.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,alt.conspiracy