From: hudson@athena.cs.uga.edu (Paul Hudson Jr)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Homosexuality and Christianity
Date: 17 Apr 92 19:43:24 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens

>But if Adam was perfect, how could he be corrupted by sin?  How did sin
>enter the world if God is perfectly good and is all powerful?  (See my post
>on the topic, if interested, or I can mail it if you missed it)

Feel free to mail it to me.  I may have missed it.  I think God created
the ability to choose.  Adam chose to disobey.  But I do think that God
knew what would happen, because Christ was the lamb from the foundation
of the world, and I do not think that God is bound by time and three 
dimensional space like we are.

>Real true hate comes as we see how others treat those that they do
>not like or do not wish to associate with.  A child learns responses by
>observing his environment.

Lets discuss anger.  Jesus spoke of how he that was angry with his
brother faced condemntion.  Do you think anger is learned?  How can 
someone learn anger.  We do not know what others feel when they are angry.
We can associate facial expressions with anger because we have felt it
before.  Can a child feel hate-filled anger?

This might turn into an original sin discussion.  Any of us might be
have a weakness or predisposition toward a certain sin from a very young
age.  Some may be cleptomaniacs from childhood.  If a cleptomaniac
becomes a Christian, he shoulds learn not to steal, or even covet.
If he falls into sin, he should repent.  But the church should not
say that it is okay for him to steal, or covet, simply because it is his
weakness.

>>We are to yeild to His hand, but without His pressing, we could not change.
>Well, I'll have to stick with Luther here.  God only gives grace to
>understand Scripture or follow Him.  He does not act directly to force you.
>He provides the evidence, and you decide.  Ultimately, you are permitted to
>reject him, if you wish.

Maybe this parti is becoming a discussion over words.  If we follow the
Lord, He must lead.  Without his leading we cannot follow.  

>>>As for homosexuals, you must compare them with heterosexuals.  What is
>>>natural for heterosexuals is unnatural for homosexuals and vice-versa.
>>>They are both innate traints, well inside our physiologcal and mental selves
>>>that we can no more change than we can move the sun from it's path.

Maybe our different uses of the term "homosexual" is causing confusion.
Do you think it is sin for one to participate in a sex acts with another
of the same sex?  Do you think it is wrong to have sex with another of
the same sex outside of marriage?

>But yes, it is a predestination question...

I do believe in predestination, but I am not a calvinist.  IMHO      
from reading Romans 9 it is obvious that God predetermines, but I think
too many invalid conclusions have been drawn about predestination.
As humans, we reason from a perspective of living in time, we think in
a linear time, or circular time perspective.  I don't think we should
concern ourselves too much with how God runs the universe.  At least
from our perspective, as we can see in the Scritpures we do make choices.

Link Hudson.




>
> -Steve
>-- 
> The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
>                        -------------------
>     adams@spss.com                           Phone: (312) 329-3522
>     Steve Adams                              Fax:   (312) 329-3558