From: branwen@sage.cc.purdue.edu ( )
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: proofs
Keywords: reality, existence
Date: 14 Oct 92 02:12:53 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center

In article <Bw2EGx.12u@acsu.buffalo.edu> v125p7c5@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Michael Lamanna) writes:
>
>	I will attempt to offer a proof that a proof has bassis in reality.
>		If I can prove something to be true then a proof exists.  If it
>exists then it is real. If it is real then it exists in reality.
>
>	Line   statement	reason
>
>	 1	If a then b     given
>	 2	a               given
>	 3	therefore b     1,2
>	 4	if b then c     given
>	 5	b               3
>	 6	therefore c     4,5
>
>	I will prove that gravity is what holds you to the surface of the
>earth.  
>	Gravity is a force exerted by one body (earth) onto another body
>(people).  The direction of the force is toward the center of the larger
>body, because large masses attract smaller masses.  The earth has more mass
>than a person therefore a person is attracted to the earth.
>
>	if a greater than b then b attracted to a
>	a greater than b
>	therefore b attracted to a
>
>	If you wish to deny the proof as real then you are free to leave the
>planet, and never bother us again.
>
>	Since I proved something in reality then proofs are real.  You may
>judge the validity of the proof, but do not say that they are not based on
>reality.  The above is a proof that you are held to the earth. You really are 
>on the earth so the proof is real, unless you are non in reality.
>	
>	I don't think that this group was created to prove or disprove anything, 
>but rather to talk about the myths, legends and stories involving vampires.
>The choice is yours rather to believe in them or not.  
>
>
>
>						Michael Lamanna
>					     University At Buffalo
>					       Civil Engineering
>
>	"It is easier to get forgiven than permission."
>
>
>lamanna@ubunix.cc.buffalo.edu
>v125p7c5@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu

         This terminal is completely screwed up, so please forgive me.
   However, relevant to the article at hand.:

        A proof is only real if the givens (assumptions) are accepted.
    If I refuse to accept your given (their reality dependent upon the
  reality of proofs in the first place) then their is no way to logically
  and acceptably reach or agree upon your conclusion.
      I don`t like the idea of eliminating reality merely because we
 cannot all agree upon a set of assumptions, but your argument that a
 proof is real is lost without the premise that proofs are real.  You cannot
 prove something by citing its existence.  That is where the whole question
 of the existence of vampires began.  You cannot base any proof of the
 existence of vampires upon the premise that vampires do exist.  It is a
 circular argument, as is the argument that proofs are real because they
 exist.  The notion of vampires exists, and there are those who believe that
 vampires exist.  But neither of these truths can in any way prove that
 vampires exist.  Likewise, the idea (or use of) proofs exists, and there
 are those who believe proofs work, but you cannot prove the actual existence
 of proofs on either of these premises.
       That is my two cents worth.  With that said, let's get back to the
 real subject...bitten any good necks lately?


       Remember, My name is Glenn...leave the owner of this account alone.
   Flame me on the netboard or remain silent.  Thank you.