HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rhaar@albert.cs.gmr.com (Bob Haar)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Spray Foam Follies
Date: 27 Aug 92 17:00:34 GMT
Reply-To: rhaar@albert.cs.gmr.com
Organization: G.M. Research Labs

In article 1965@wdi.COM, pestes@wdi.COM (Laurin Pestes x82570) writes:
|>I tried some of the aerosol expanding foam insulation 
|>around a prehung door I installed recently. It filled 
|>up the gaps too well, oozing out of the gap, although
|>it was easily trimmed off later. The real greif came 
|>later when I tried to close the door again. The door 
|>wouldn't close, but ran into the jamb instead.
|> 
|>As it set, the foam expanded and forced the door jambs 
|>out about 3/8 inch, even though they were fastened with 
|>several large (#10, 3 inch long) screws on both sides. 
|> 
|>Luckily, a heavy hammer and several more screws pulled 
|>it back into usable alignment, and the only damage was 
|>covered over with another coat of paint. 
|> 
|>The moral of the story: Save the spray foam for places
|>where it's well isolated from anything with close
|>tolerances, unnecessary to clean up, and remember it
|>keeps on expanding for an hour or two until it sets up. 
|> 

When I have used this stuff in years past, the instructions
clearly warned that the foam would continue to expand
as it hardens. They also said to practice in places you
where overfilling wouldn't cause problems. 

I suppose that not all brands would have the same quality
of instructions.


---
	Robert Haar               InterNet : rhaar@gmr.com 
	Computer Science Dept., G.M. Research Laboratories
DISCLAIMER: Unless indicated otherwise, everything in this note is
personal opinion, not an official statement of General Motors Corp.


Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: cthorne@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Charles E Thorne)
Subject: Re: Questions on Closing
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 19:29:26 GMT

In article <13245@texsun.Central.Sun.COM> pstryjew@colsun.Central.Sun.COM writes:
>
>I am preparing to close on an house next week and have a question about what day
>to close.  Currently the closing is set for the 1st, but I may be able to change
>it to the 31st.  I know about the prorated interest and first mortgage payment
>date, but what I am wondering about is making most of the seller paying closing
>costs.

I don't think the day of closing will affect your benefits from the seller,
since the day will not affect points or closing costs.  The major thing it
will affect is when you pay what.  If you close on the 3lst, you'll only
owe one month interest (with your first payment the first of the following
month).  If you close the 1st, you will pay a month of interest, but your
first payment will be a month later.  Example:

	Close 31st August--pay 1 days interest--first payment Oct. 1
	Close 1st Sept.--pay 30 days interest--first payment Nov. 1.

If you're buying rental property, it's more of a difference, as you would
collect a months rent, if you close after the 1st, otherwise about 1 days
rent.
From: eeng@tc.fluke.COM (Ed Eng)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Sound insulation for ceiling/floor:  ideas?
Keywords: sound insulation fibreglass
Date: 3 Sep 92 13:50:47 GMT
Article-I.D.: tc.1992Sep3.135047.14450
Distribution: na
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA

In article <1992Sep1.173720.7671@terminator.cc.umich.edu> vln@icpsr.umich.edu (Victoria Neff) writes:
>You can buy pieces of stiffish wire that are just barely too big to fit
>between the joists, and use them to hold up the batts.  I bought several
>hundred of them at the lumberyard a few years ago (and haven't yet insulated
>the family room floor...).  I can't remember what they were called, but this
>was their intended use.

There called insulation stays (surprise!).
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: patter@dasher.uucp (24224-guthrie)
Subject: Re: painting problems: coverage of dark red, black spraypaint and bare
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 17:11:26 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.130432.27036@athena.mit.edu> harris@athena.mit.edu (Jonathan G Harris) writes:

>Our living room wall is painted with a dark red latex. We want it to be an
>off white. What is the best way to cover it:
>       Two coats of top quality paint.
>       One coat of primer/sealer designed for covering stains and smoke damage
>                   (e.g. BIZ or BIN or a Parks primer/sealer product.
>                followed by one coat of paint.
>       Someone insists that two coats of good paint will work. Most painting
>guides recommend a coat of primer underneath. People at the paint stores said
>that somepeople have problems with colors bleeding through multiple coats of paint
>unless the colored area is coated with a primer/sealer.

It's really not an issue. You can buy Glidden primer/sealer for less per
gallon than they want for Spred-Satin, so you can do the job right and
save money at the same time.

>We also have to cover a black spray paint
>grid left underneath mirror tiles. Will primer or paint adhere well to it or
>should a was the wall with acetone to remove most of it.

I'd take it off. I've had varying luck putting latex over spray paints. I
think that any lacquer based ones give problems, but I really don't know.

>Do I really have to use an oil base primer on bare plaster, or will a latex primer
>work. A can of "drywall primer" claims it will work on plain plaster.

Latex works fine for me. I usually use any good reputation paint (Glidden,
Lucite, etc.) that happens to be on sale. I just make sure it says
"primer/sealer". The only one I didn't care for was Dutch Masters. Given
a choice at the same price, I prefer Lucite.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
                    | If you take a dog which is starving and feed him
George Patterson -  | and make him prosperous, that dog will not bite
                    | you. This is the primary difference between a dog
                    | and a man.             Samuel Clemens
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: grande@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (brad.l.grande)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Kitchen remodeling, s/w
Date: 26 Aug 92 18:19:08 GMT
Organization: AT&T

Greetings,

We are planning to remodel our kitchen (total gut, move doorways, different
counter layout, etc.) and I am looking for a recommendation of a software
tool that will help us try different layouts.

I have seen in building supply stores programs provided by cabinet vendors
that help out in this area.

I am looking for a simple drafting tool that maybe has common fiures for
standard cabinet sizes, ranges, fridges, etc.  Or just a simple to use CAD
program would be OK.  I don't need a planning and materials capable tool.

Oh ya, this is for a PC.

Thanks in advance,


Brad Grande	WB0OYX
Another bike riding beer brewing kite flying amateur radio operator who
	still likes CD's!

AT&T Bell Labs
Naperville Illinausea
PLEASE SEND RESPONSES TO:	grande@iwtil.att.com
att!iwtil!grande
(708)-979-7853
From: jmcooper@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (janet.m.cooper)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Kitchen cabinets and appliances available
Keywords: New Jersey
Date: 27 Aug 92 15:14:50 GMT
Distribution: nj
Organization: AT&T


We will be gutting our kitchen soon, and removing our current
cabinets.  Although we would like to save some portion of the
cabinets,  there will be enough remaining for at least a small
kitchen. (Current lengths are around 20', 4' and a 6' island).   

The cabinets are solid oak (doors and shelves!), with features
such as pot/pan drawer pullouts and  book shelves.   
They are excellent quality and in great condition- 
we would have kept them except that they have
a dark stain (not depressingly dark, just not natural oak color).
The counter is a lovely (NOT!) yellow color- actually, if you 
like yellow it's ideal.  Anyway, the formica is in good
condition.

Make us an offer- price depends on what fraction you would want.

Also available- range hood - FREE! (white, light, vent, 42" wide)
		range - solid element, self cleaning oven,
			less than 5 years old, $180/bo 

Holmdel area
(908) 671-6377 (h)
(908) 949-1902 (w)
From: tan@bronson.uucp (Tan Bronson)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Spray Foam Follies
Date: 30 Aug 92 21:34:01 GMT
Organization: Microvation Consultants 20 Sperry Rd Madison, Ct 04663

In article <1965@wdi.COM> pestes@wdi.COM (Laurin Pestes x82570) writes:
>I tried some of the aerosol expanding foam insulation 
>around a prehung door I installed recently. It filled 
>up the gaps too well, oozing out of the gap, although
>it was easily trimmed off later. The real greif came 
>later when I tried to close the door again. The door 
>wouldn't close, but ran into the jamb instead.
> 
>The moral of the story: Save the spray foam for places
>where it's well isolated from anything with close
>tolerances, unnecessary to clean up, and remember it
>keeps on expanding for an hour or two until it sets up. 
    The real moral should have been that there are two types of
foam:
    - expanding foam which is what you have
    - non-expanding foam (meant for windows & doors).

    I recently build a post & beam house (from a 150 year old frame)
and used 'Winter Panel' skins for it. I used the non-expanding foam
for all windows & doors, and only one window is a bit too tight.

    I've never seen the non-expanding foam in a store, but it may be
available by special order. If you can not find it locally call Winter Panel
in Brattleburo, Vt. You may have to buy a case of it, but you'll
discover that non-expanding foam does not cover as much (since it
does not expand).
    The cans of foam sold by Winter Panel are also quite a bit larger
than the small cans I've seen Home Depot...
-- 
Tan Bronson		tan@Microvation.COM (or tan@bronson.UUCP)
Microvation Consultants 20 Sperry Road 		Madison, CT 06443
			Voice: (203)-421-5061	Fax: (203)-421-5292
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: mguyott@eriador.prime.com (M. Guyott)
Subject: Re: Possible gas leak?
Organization: /etc/organization
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 14:38:18 GMT


So here is what happened.  I called the gas company to check on the leak.
They immediately noticed that there was no tag (i.e. no town inspection) on
the new work the plumber had done (i.e. replaced water heater and moved
dryer).  I unwittingly told them that this had been done recently.  I did
not realize that a permit was required (I know, pretty niave hunh?  But I
thought a licensced plumber would do things by the book... Besides, I'm a
first time home buyer.  {-8 ).  They immediately shut off and locked my gas
main.  They left me with this bright red tag saying I had to have the city
inspect the changes.

The next morning, still being very niave, I went down to town hall to have the
plumbing inspector inspect the changes.  He asked me for the permits.  I said,
"What permits?".  And the plumbing inspector become very upset.  I then called
the plumber who had to go to the town hall and get permits (after the fact),
and pay fines, and get generally chewed out.  He was not overly thrilled!
The building inspector then said he would come by the house between 4 and 5
PM to check the work.  I met the plumber at 3:30 and he started testing
everything.  It turned out that all the work he had done was perfectly fine
(the plumbing inspector agreed when he arrived).  But the plumber found the
gas leak, it was in the gas valve for the furnace.  The plumbing inspector
also found three code violations related to the furnace.  The furnace is the
original, 26 year old furnace that was installed with the house.  The plumber
the capped off the line going to the furnace, the plumbing inspecter gave me
a tag for the hot water heater and dryer and I called the gas company.
A little over 24 hours later the gas was turned back on.  Now I just have
to get the furnace repaired or replaced.

So, after much inconvenience on many peoples part, we found the gas leak.
Now I know that a permit is necessary to do all or any gas/plumbing work
(at least in Reading, MA).  And I need a new furnace.  Sigh.

Thanks to everyone for their most excellent advice.  It may cost me money
to get a new furnace (we needed one anyway) but at least I now have peace
of mind knowing that my house is not going to blow sky high due to a
natural gas leak.

Marc
----
Two of the worst things we teach our children are that a knowledge of science
is nice but not necessary, and a knowledge of sex is necessary but not nice.

Marc Guyott              Constellation Software, Inc.          (508) 620-2800
                         Framingham, Mass. 01701 USA                Ext. 3135
mguyott@primerd.prime.com       ...!{uunet, decwrl}!primerd.prime.com!mguyott
mguyott@eriador.prime.com       ...!{uunet, decwrl}!eriador.prime.com!mguyott
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: drevik@utkvx4.utk.edu (Drevik, Steve)
Subject: Re: suggested weapons (was: Killing burglars.)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Tennessee Computing Center
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 18:26:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.153201.28039@henson.cc.wwu.edu>, n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes...
>n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:
> 
>>	A pellet of 00 buck (.36" diameter) is still potentialy very 
>>lethal after 100 yards of air (or several sheetrock walls) according
> 
>	Typo.  Make that .33" diameter.
> 
>>Magnum loads are in the 
>>neighborhood of 2.4 oz of shot at about 1200 fps.   (Rem has a 12 ga
>>3" mag load with 15 pellets of 00 buck).
> 
>	And make that 1.9 oz at about 1200 fps.

He's armed...he's dangerous...and he's very annyoing....

  it's...

      A N A L - R E T E N T I V E  G U N  O W N E R ! ! !

Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: macrakis@osf.org (Stavros Macrakis)
Subject: Re: Anything before siding??
Organization: OSF Research Institute
Date: 3 Sep 92 11:24:27

In article <1992Sep3.090715.3558@wvnvms.wvnet.edu> un026217@wvnvms.wvnet.edu writes:

   We just bought a old house and I like to put up siding
   before the weather gets cold.

I find that old houses look much much better with their original
wooden siding (which is what I assume you have?) rather than with
imitation clapboard in vinyl or aluminum.  One of the big problems
with imitation clapboard is that the edges can never butt directly
against existing trim, so you have to do something about the trim,
too.  You end up completely destroying any trace of character the
house ever had.  Even very simple houses lose a lot.

Repairing and repainting the wooden clapboard will be much cheaper and
faster than re-siding, and will look much better.  If you have
existing asphalt or asbestos shingle over the wooden siding, removing
it is, I will admit, a big project (since you'll have to do a goodly
amount of repair afterwards) -- and it should be done in the spring,
to let the house dry out over the summer.  But putting another layer
on top won't do any good for the house, either.

Also note that siding has essentially NO insulation value.  Many
people put up rigid insulation under the siding, but this is very bad
for the house in the long run: it keeps moisture in, and encourages
rot.

I would urge you to reconsider putting up imitation clapboard, and
keeping the original siding.

	-s
From: oman@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com (Diane at Allen-Bradley in Cleveland)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: It looks like carpenter ants...
Date: 27 Aug 92 09:44:54 EST


In article <1992Aug26.160604.16479@primerd.prime.com>, 
mguyott@eriador.prime.com (M. Guyott) writes:

> The exterminating company I
> just called said that carpenter ants will have pinchers and hair under
> their middle section.  I guess the hair under the middle section is the
> real give away as this is unique to carpenter ants (or so the exterminator
> said).

When we got our quotes from Terminix and Orkin - they detemined they were
carpenter ants.  


> 
> At this point I am pretty confident that they are carpenter ants.  My next
> question is how to treat for them?
> 

The exterminator can probably tell you what chemicals they use.  The key is
to get the chemical back to their colony to kill that darned queen - she's
just a producing fool!  The quick-kill bug sprays won't get the poison back
to the colony, but they do bring immediate gratification - which is what
most of us want.

If the chemicals are commercially (sp?) available - I don't know why you
couldn't do it yourself.  In our area - specifically Painesville Township
Ohio - the cost for 1 year is $499.  We feel that's a drop in the bucket
to protect our brand new $130K house.

The other key is to continue treatment over the gestation period of the eggs
(up to 10 months) - since there is no chemical known to man that can penetrate
that egg shell.  (So the exterminator says..)

Orkin says when they drill: every 16 inches (because you want to get between
all of the studs which are typically 16 inches apart, a 1/8 inch hole just 
above the baseboard.  They then inject a powder which I think the ants injest
and it gets activated when they injest it and it gets wet.  

Hey Marc - did you get my e-mail?

Hope this helps...
Di


From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 17:24:57 GMT
Subject: Re: what to do about hideous tub
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house

Assuming the basic tub is OK in looks, you should be able to get rid
of the lime deposits safely.  It the ceramic (cain't spell porcelean
today :-) is intact, a decent delimer will not penetrate.  You might
want to protect the chrome, (maybe with petroleum jelly?), though.

I've used a product designed for deliming sprinkler heads.  It seems
to be a local brand, Ed-Fred (found at OSH in the San Jose area), but it
contains a pretty high concentration of phosphoric acid, and not much
(if anything) else.  No really foul smell, other than the phosphoric.
It works slowly, but it doesn't take much work.  You brush it on, and
let it sit a *very* long time.  (I've used it with a stainless water 
still, and left it overnight.  Eventually, it will attack the stainless,
but it leaves ceramics alone.)  You will want to brush it occasionally
to keep it wet, and eventually the acid will have dissolved as much
lime as it can handle.  At which point, rinse and start again.  This
stuff *will* attach grout, but it works quite slowly, and is much
safer than stronger acids like swimming pool HCl or such.  (HCl can
give you stains if minerals in your water react with iron.  Fe is really
bad.)

BTW, a 40-year old tub will probably feel better than anything other than
a premium cast-iron replacement.  If it's salvageable, go for it!

All bets are off if the ceramic is chipped or cracked, though.

Pete Brooks
From: mkb@cs.cmu.edu (Mike Blackwell)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Debugging noisy phone lines
Date: 28 Aug 92 21:34:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.BtpqKq.HAB.2
Reply-To: mkb@cs.cmu.edu
Organization: Field Robotics Center, CMU


I have a lot of trouble using modems on my home phone line - lots of
noise or hangups (results depend on the particular modem and speed).
Regular voice connections seem reasonably clear.

Is there some way to look at the lines (with a scope maybe) and see
what's going on, and where the problem might be? There's some dubious
phone wiring in the house, so I'd like to look at the end of the
extension in the office (where I use the modem), and then at the TNI,
to see if the problem is in the house wiring.

If the problem isn't in the house wiring, what's the best way to get
results from the phone company? Particular level of person to talk to,
or buzz words to drop, or suggested actions...?

Thanks. I'll summarize if I get any good replies.

		Mike Blackwell		mkb@cs.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: kls4344@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Person in flux)
Subject: Re: It looks like carpenter ants...
Reply-To: kls4344@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 00:37:22 GMT

In article <DRAND.92Aug26183833@spinner.osf.org>, drand@spinner.osf.org 
(Douglas Rand) writes:

>If you kill the queen,  the nest is finished.  So don't worry
>about the pest control people's scare tactics.  You only have to kill
>one very important ant.

But be warned that often you may have more than one nest of carpenter ants and
therefore more than one queen.  Don't think that just because you saw and
killed a queen that you've gotten all the "important" ants.

Katie
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: mguyott@eriador.prime.com (M. Guyott)
Subject: Re: Replacing Vinyl Flooring
Keywords: flooring 
Organization: /etc/organization
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 16:33:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.212507.6964@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> patter@dasher.uucp (24224-guthrie) writes:
>In article <1992Aug25.163621.2216@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> kent@lightnin.Columbia.NCR.COM (Kent Richardson) writes:
>
>>	    floor. I was told asbestos used to be used in the glue but my 
>>	    house is only 6 yr. old so I didn't think this would be a concern?
>
>I also think you misunderstood one thing. They used to use asbestos in the
>tile. I don't believe it was ever used in the glue.

They did use asbestos in the glue for floor tiles.  I just had some tiling
in my basement tested and BOTH the tiles and the mastic (glue) contained
10% asbestos particles.  The asbestos is not "friable" and the tiles are not
considered an asbestos hazard.  I was told to dispose of them at a
"construction" waste site.

Marc
----
Two of the worst things we teach our children are that a knowledge of science
is nice but not necessary, and a knowledge of sex is necessary but not nice.

Marc Guyott              Constellation Software, Inc.          (508) 620-2800
                         Framingham, Mass. 01701 USA                Ext. 3135
mguyott@primerd.prime.com       ...!{uunet, decwrl}!primerd.prime.com!mguyott
mguyott@eriador.prime.com       ...!{uunet, decwrl}!eriador.prime.com!mguyott
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: IANR009@UNLVM.UNL.EDU (D. Kirk Darnell)
Subject: removing water stain from paneling??
Organization: University of Nebraska
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 92 08:15:35 CST

We recently moved into a home which had previously had water damage in the
basement.  The bottom half of the basement walls are finished with light oak,
rough cut paneling.  A few places around the room have stains from the water
that was in the basement.  Is there any possibility of removing these stains?
There not incredibly obvious but once you notice them, it becomes a bother (one
of those imperfections).  Thanks for any advice...
 
**********************************************************************
*D. KIRK DARNELL, COMPUTER SYSTEMS ANALYST                           *
*AGRICULTURAL ECONOMICS                                              *
*UNIVERSITY OF NEBRASKA                                              *
*IANR009@UNLVM.UNL.EDU                                               *
*                                                                    *
* "YOUR ARE THE ONLY ONE IN THE WORLD THAT CAN USE YOUR POTENTIAL!"  *
*                            -ZIG ZIGLAR-                            *
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Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house