HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hde+@cs.cmu.edu (Herbert Enderton)
Subject: Re: This has gone too far.....
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 00:19:15 GMT

In article <YfBYIBW00Vp6I7G0wV@andrew.cmu.edu> "Joseph E. Beck" <jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen) writes:
>> gee, i learned to play netrek with CA.  i switched to DD because
>> all these people were flying DD and i read somewhere (the FAQ?)
>> that it was the best ship for ogging, taking planets, etc.
>Best for ogging and planet taking?   Hmmm....  In low clue games the
>AS is probably best for planet taking (you don't have to go home as
>often since you pick up 20 armies at once :-).  In top quality play
>the SC or the AS is probably the best.  Since you probably don't have
>more than 2 free armies at once (so you use a SC), or you've saved
>your armies and are going to crash a planet (and want something
>durable that will survive the clearing, so an AS is used).  The DD is
>just....there.  I want even comment on using 1 for ogging.  I love it
>when people use them for that.  That means I can take planets in a SC
>or an AS with no interference.  
>
>> and now you guys are telling me it's not.  maybe i should fly BB next.
>No, stick with CA's and SC's for most stuff.  
>
>	joe
>	Purple haze
>	Lamb, Leg Of
>

This thread started out interesting, and I liked Joe's argument that
a SC should win a dogfight with a DD because the SC's torpedos are
faster.  I disagree, but I liked the argument.  If we define what a
"dogfight" is a little more carefully, e.g. say it's a game of King
of El Nath (you win if you can orbit El Nath for a couple seconds),
then the hypothesis is largely testable.  Personally I'd expect the
DD's stronger phasers and larger fuel tank to prevail.

But Joe and Tim seem to have gone off the deep end with their
extrapolations.  Even if the SC does win a King of El Nath fight,
that doesn't mean the DD is a weaker fighter in other situations.
Its longer range torpedos are great for getting kills from twinks and
wounded ships, and also for plinking starbases and orbiters.  When
ogging it can deliver more damage than a scout (including a larger
explosion), and also hover cloaked longer (against bad odds you
sometimes want to stay cloaked near the target planet until the
victim orbits).  Also it can phaser a cloaker to death in situations
where a scout would run out of fuel.

The DD is a damn fine ogging ship, but this year the best oggers use
a CA instead (except for Akira).  The DD is undeniably the fastest
ship that can carry 5 armies, and I've seen it used for that purpose
more and more in tournament games (one used to see more AS and CA
carriers).  The balance among all the ship-types is very even, so I'd
say use whatever strikes your fancy.

  -- Red Shirt
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 14:31:38 -0500 
From: Jeff Rosenfeld <jdr+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Frequently Offered Clever Suggestions
	<1h8ao1INN5lo@agate.berkeley.edu>

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 23-Dec-92 Re: Frequently Offered
Clev.. Scott Drellishak@soda.be (2207)

> Oh, by the way, I've been playing on bronco quite a bit recently,
> solely in DD's (except for the occasional starbase ogg or LPS take,
> and usually not even then).  Even with cross-continent lag, and over a
> 56kbaud line from work, my ratio is 1.28, my defense is 0.72, and my
> offense is *1.97*, and I've made Captain (the character's name is Gray
> Lensman).  Now, what was it you were saying about DD's?  I regularly
> kill players of all ship types (although I like to have help with BB's
> when I'm trying to survive the encounter).  Those of you who are
> convinced that DD's are wimpy are invited to teach me the error of my
> ways -- one at a time, please.
> -- 

	Wow!  I use mostly CAs and SCs locally.  For some reason my ratio seems
to hang arround the .90 range.  In recent games, it's rare that my
session defense is more than .5.  I guess those DDs just must be better.
 Yup.

ZZnew guy
From: mummert+@AUK.WARP.CS.CMU.EDU (Todd Mummert)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Coaches (again).
Date: 24 Dec 92 06:59:05 GMT
Reply-To: mummert+@CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: Carnegie Mellon


> For those of you who missed the original posts, or the follow-up or
> follow-follow-up posts, I proposed that we add a ninth player to INL
> games, called the coach.  He would not have a ship, but would be able to
> see the galactic that his team sees, and the tactical of any of his
> team's ships.  He would preferably have a menu with each ship number next
> to it in which he would type in messages and switch via the mouse, or
> some other straightforward manner in which to expedite team/individual
> messaging.
> 

exodus>   i know all the isu clue (all 5 of us) support this.....it'd be a
exodus> good addition to the game.......


While I was initially for this idea...I'm now against it.  I think it 
is adding something to INL games that is not netrek.  Therefore, INL
games will no longer be a yardstick of how good a netrek team can be..
but rather a metric for some game that is fundamentally different in
a very appreciable way.  No longer do individual players have to 
think both strategically and tactically to the same degree, instead we
introduce a meta-player that diminishes the complexity on the individual
level.

Borgeoisie Pig
From: chris@castlab.uucp (Christian)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Base practice server seems to be malfunctioning.
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:16:51 GMT
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering

In article <1h7eopINNnfv@gizmo.usc.edu> kimd@gizmo.usc.edu (Kim Daugherty) writes:
>
>In article <1992Dec21.042025.14885@doug.cae.wisc.edu>, chris@castlab.uucp (Christian) writes:
>|> 
>|>In case you haven't tried it yet, give inconel.engr.wisc.edu a try (RSA,
>|> port 2592, UDP)... if I get any feed back as to how well its working, I'll
>|> officially dedicate the server to the public, but right now only I and a
>|> few friends have tested it. To encourage the sprit of testing out the
>|> server, I'm sticking the thing into CHAOS mode, and setting SB rank to
>|> ensign. I'll keep it that way until I've decided everything is hunky-dory. 
>
>Please post the IP address of this server.  I couldn't access it by name.  Thanks.
>

inconel.engr.wisc.edu  144.92.60.141
RSA bronco/amdahl server, UDP, 5pm-8am wk days, all day wk ends.
Currently in CHAOS mode with SB-rank = ensign.


If you have suggestions/questions about the server, your feed back is very
much appreciated. Mail chris@castlab.engr.wisc.edu.

-Chris
From: mehlhaff@soda.berkeley.edu (ERic MeHlHaFf)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Who has the best bitmaps (was Re: This has gone too far.....)
Date: 21 Dec 1992 20:05:56 GMT
Organization: The Dis-Orginization
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <kfB5z0a00VB602h380@andrew.cmu.edu> "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 20-Dec-92 Re: This has gone too
>far..... exodus@IASTATE.EDU (360)
>>  Just out of curiousity, why is this topic being argued? Seems
>> about as silly as arguing which side has the best looking
>> bitmaps....
>

I agree -- the independent team's bitmaps, in general really suck.

Let's not forget the GA bitmaps -- I think the orion's GA bitmap is pretty
cool.


BTW, a 'feature' I left in the Berkeley client was one where you could  change
whiich bitmap was used for your own ship.  It could rotate through all of the
teams and types, and it was in the options menu in the 'silly features' page.



-ERic
-- 
ERic mehlhaff					   mehlhaff@soda.Berzerkeley.EDU
mehlhaff@ocf.berkeley.EDU         "Life? Don't talk to me about life..." -Marvin
From: v119matc@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Claus Schwinge)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Crazy lag...
Date: 22 Dec 92 00:52:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

I was having a tough time getting into any game today because when the username 
screen came up and I entered my name, the thing would lock up.  I know that 
this is because of the huge loss I was getting (~ 100/200/2000, 76% loss!)
BUT, I finally got into the hockey server, got switched over to UDP, and played
for a short while.  Then I died, and it took over a minute to get back in, I
get a whole bunch of messages like   

K0->All  a, do you read?
O9->O7    Are you new to the game?

And, While I am getting decent update speed, I cannot react.
                              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
                              Why can I see the action fine, but not get
anything through to the server?

-Halfdane

P.S.  Apologies to the hockey team I was playing with, I'm not THAT clueless
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: This has gone too far.....
Date: 22 Dec 92 02:02:03 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <88dh033Lc57r00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com) fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden) writes:
)
)In an attempt to change the subject even slightly, Andy McFadden (fadden@amdahl.com) writes:
)
)Suppose you have to go up against TWO SCs or TWO DDs.  Which would you rather
)fight against?  (Suppose you are defending a planet, and one or both carry.)

the Two DDs.  I dont' have to worry about the SCs screaming buy me to take
another planet.  The DDs, both carrying, will run away, since neither scum
will escort the other.  I'll kill the closest one and either repair and 
kill the other or come in a brand new SC to finish the other.

)fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
)[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]

Justin
(I really DO regret getting into this)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: farrow@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (J. Scott Farrow)
Subject: Re: What does Mucus Pig look like?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:01:22 GMT

mdm@hadrosaur.cis.ohio-state.edu (Michael Moore) writes:

>	At least Mucus has class and plays from a color sun4.  Real men
>play netrek in color.  The rest of you are deprived. :-)

>	-Michael )Ged(

>PS - I got my color hp700 back, so bring on the scouts. :-)

>-- 
>|\  Michael  Delbert  Moore     _   /|     Home   : (614) 471-1937         /|
>| \ OSU Student  Programmer     \`o_O'     Office : (614) 292-7161        / |
>| / Undergraduate CIS major       ( )      Email  : mdm@cis.ohio-state.edu\ |
>|/-------------------------        U       --------------------------------\|


This man is colorblind and can barely see the red on the screen.
Makes it mighty hard to dodge torps.

Monochrome is the real challenge. Everybody looks the same and you have to
use your brain when you play.

Necron

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
J. Scott Farrow-Student SysAdmin/Programmer, University of Colorado at Boulder
Computing & Network Services, Boulder, Colorado, USA, phone: (303) 492-4428
Internet: farrow@spot.colorado.edu, farrow@cs.colorado.edu
From: feng-thomas@cs.yale.edu (Thomas Zuwei Feng)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Restricting Multi-login scumming (was Re: What one reads at 2am ...
Date: 21 Dec 1992 23:45:50 -0500
Organization: Yale University Computer Science Dept., New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: giraffe.zoo.cs.yale.edu

Josh Hayes writes:

>And you get the fun of repeatedly toasting an Admiral, though
>there's no point in ogging an admiral[*].
>
>[*] ObPonyBoy!
>

Boy now you have clue.


R0 ->ALL  Rear Adm. Pony Boy! joining as R0 (tfeng@zoo.cs.yale.edu)
R1 ->ALL  Ensign Hoser joining as R1 (Robot@Nowhere)
GOD->ALL Pony Boy! (R0) was kill 1.00 for Hoser (R1)
GOD->ALL Pony Boy! (R0) was kill 2.00 for Hoser (R1)
R1 -> R0  You stupid humans just never give up, eh?
GOD->ALL Pony Boy! (R0) was kill 3.00 for Hoser (R1)
R0 ->ALL  Rear Adm. Pony Boy! (R0) leaving the game (tfeng@zoo.cs.yale.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: pcp2g@karma.astro.Virginia.EDU (Gilligan)
Subject: Window border size
Reply-To: pcp2g@karma.astro.Virginia.EDU (Gilligan)
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 18:33:10 GMT

Hey all you Xwindows people:

I need to make the borderwidth of my netrek window smaller, because
right now it doesn't fit on the screen. All the x windows people
here are gone for break. I have an xtrekrc, but it isn't obvious how
to change the border. 

Thanks!

Stimpson

--
* Phil Plait                 pcp2g@virginia.edu 
*
* "To escape from our own island, we must each metaphorically
*  kill our own Gilligan..." 

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jrichard@cs.cs (John 'MacGyver' Richardson)
Subject: Re: ntserv
Organization: /usr/ug/1993/jrichard/.organization
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 05:31:11 GMT

In article <Bzq7LL.JA5@cs.bham.ac.uk> jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James Hawtin) writes:


>
>  take most of the time is ntserv or rather the swopping/contex switch of 16 of them.  Why is this forked perhaps it could be written as a single process? I know this is
>

Ok, not to beat a dead dog, but I've been working on this for a while now.
It was pretty easy to come up with multiplexed I/O for logging in.  HOWEVER,
the big problems are: 

	o scheduling becomes a disaster!  However, I'm trying reading 
	  one packet from whoever's ready and going on to the next slot.
	  Updates taken care of by the daemon now get taken care of by
	  a signal handler.

	o reading and writing becomes a disaster!  If you use TCP you have
	  to deal with partial reads and writes of packets because you have
	  to use nonblocking I/O.  If you want to write code, you have to
	  have states for everything in the universe (so to speak).  The
	  solution?  Use UDP only.  But that requires a TCP like protocol
	  to get those packets that absolutely have to get there (like a 
	  login name).  Feel like re-inventing the wheel?  I sure feel 
	  like I am now.  :)  

Despite the above, it's kinda fun, so I'm keeping at it.  I had a shot with
writing the server in C++, but virtual functions and shared memory ogged me
(so to speak again) as they don't work well together.  Ah... too bad. :(
It would be cool to do.

(Also, I'm probably be the only person still left working on this)  If anyone
has any ideas about the protocol problem (I've got some stuff from rjones (any-
one have any more?))  Feel free to send me mail!  

BTW:  what happened the the netrek hackers mailing list?   If it's 
gone is anyone interested in making a new one?

John Richardson       
jrichard@cs.ulowell.edu
From: adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu (Alan D. Cabrera)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Frequently Offered Clever Suggestions
Date: 28 Dec 92 16:08:11 GMT
Reply-To: adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu
Organization: Michigan State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: tardis.cl.msu.edu

In article ccN5031tc5yH00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com, fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden) writes:
>In article <1h7j3rINNcr2@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu writes:
>>Has anyone suggested a mod whereby ships that blowup with more fuel do
>>more dammage than ships that have little fuel?
>
>This was done on bezier for a little while (along with the "shrapnel" mod?)
>Not sure how popular it was.  It puts a dent in ogging.
>
>Remember: Netrek isn't reality.  A BB with a full tank doing the same amount
>as a DD with an empty tank is perfectly normal in Netrek Reality.  If you
>absolutly must impose some sense of reality on it, think of it as an exploding
>engine which uses non-explosive fuel, or maybe the ship just has a really
>big battery in it which explodes without any relation to the state of charge.
>

What I was thinking was that it would be nice to reward any ogger that was 
wile enough to get to a base with full tanks as opposed to someone who
went full-speed straight at a base and got there with no fuel left.


---
Alan Cabrera				internet:  adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu
Computer Laboratory			phone:     (517) 353-3027
Michigan State University		fax:       (517) 353-9847
514 Computer Center			bitnet:    CABRERA@MSU
East Lansing, MI 48824
From: fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: This has gone too far.....
Date: 21 Dec 92 21:07:35 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <62961@mimsy.umd.edu> leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens) writes:
>ZZnew guy writes:
>>If there are no good DD dogfighters, then there surely MUST be a reason.
>
>(a) The DD was truly the Ship of Loose, due to its propensity to

AAAAAAAAAARGH!!

(1) It's "lose", not "loose"
(2) IT'S NOT EVEN "LOSE"!!
(3) It doesn't make sense!  STOP!
(4) Aiiiiiigh!
(5) This is past the point of being an intelligent thread, so who cares

>(c) This leaves bombing and scumming as the main roles DD pilots can
>hope to succeed at.  Neither of these is famed for its need for
>dogfighting.

>-Wreck

In an attempt to change the subject even slightly, Andy McFadden (fadden@amdahl.com) writes:

Suppose you have to go up against TWO SCs or TWO DDs.  Which would you rather
fight against?  (Suppose you are defending a planet, and one or both carry.)

-- 
fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]
From: jeffw@cs.tamu.edu (Jeffrey A Waller)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: All UDP: why not? (was  Re: Frequently Offered Clever Suggestions)
Date: 22 Dec 1992 03:47:34 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept., Texas A&M University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: sparc49.cs.tamu.edu


Some idle thoughts about the following:

>13) Combine all of the server processes into one.
>Proposal:
>Merge all the ntserv processes into one, and maybe even combine them with
>daemonII, so instead of the Server Union we'd have the Unified Process.
>Why Not:
>Ray Jones is working on this.  There are advantages and disadvantages to
>doing this, not the least of which is that it requires a complete rewrite

***************************************************************************
***************************************************************************
>of the server, a partial to full rewrite of the client, and will work best
>as a strictly UDP implementation (which requires a whole new protocol).
***************************************************************************
***************************************************************************


Consider the following (possible?) way to beat any one time check for 
'blessedness.'

Dude logs into his favorite no-borgs-allowed server (via UDP) using some
blessed client, promptly kills the client and starts his non-blessed 
client sending and receiving packets on the port the previous client
opened (after creating a new socket and rebinding of course).

				
							-Jeff



Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: deklee@uncc.edu (Dennis K Lee)
Subject: Re: Netrek Idiot of the week
Reply-To: deklee@uncc.edu
Organization: University of NC at Charlotte
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 01:18:11 GMT

no, He did not do it by accident...the tractoring was intentional....
If "I like to die" did not want to play I wish he would just leave...


SpaceGhost
From: v119matc@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Claus Schwinge)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Dogfight Size wars
Date: 21 Dec 92 19:02:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <lyodav.724899627@vincent2.iastate.edu>, lyodav@iastate.edu (Sun God) writes...
>In <1gul34INN36t@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> tvangod@ecst.csuchico.edu (Skud the Great) writes:
>   If this is useless, I'd like to see what useful players do. Contrary to 
>popular belief, the DD is the most versatile ship.
> 
>   Ogging   Bombing   Planets
>1) CA       SC        DD
>2) DD       DD        AS
>3) SC       AS        SC

Ummm...I've tried to stay out of this one, but there is so much here that is 
wrong...it's more like:

    Ogging    Bombing    Planets   Getting a kill and living
1)    CA        AS         AS                 BB
2)    DD        SC         DD                 CA
3)    BB        DD         CA                 SC
					     ^^^^ this is the important one
						  if you want to carry armies
    				    		  ie, get a chance at a planet

I've recently started playing a BB more, and they are great except that 
they can't be in enough places because they are so slow, so I'll usually only
play them on defence or if our team can't keep the other teams ships out of our
space. CA's can get places almost as fast as a DD (yes, they can fly at warp 9)
and have as much fuel left as a DD, with better offence and defence.  (IMHO DD 
should have 7500 fuel to make them par with the rest)

>   The CA only appears once in the above chart...duh, guys, why do you play
>them? Scouts are possibly as useful as DDs, but certainly CAs aren't. The above
>chart is arguable, but in any case the CA is not one of the top 3 bombing or 
>planet taking ships.

Actually it's best for someone who wants a kill or two so he can take a planet,
or ogging.  I usually get a kill or two, refit to SC or AS then take.  If I
have to bomb, I use an AS or SC.

>--Dave/WeenieBlaster

-Halfdane
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: sherod@newton.Colorado.EDU (Scott Herod)
Subject: Re: atd stuck again?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 04:08:53 GMT

In article <82Ur032Kc6vE00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com> fadden@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden) writes:
>
>                                                 Mins
>Server Host                             Port     Ago  Status            Flags
>--------------------------------------- -------- ---- ----------------- -------
>-h netrek.atd.ucar.edu                  -p 2592    9  Wait queue: 8     T
>-h calvin.usc.edu                       -p 2592    3  OPEN: 5 players   T
>-h hockey.ksu.edu                       -p 2592    7  OPEN: 1 player
>-h bigdog.cs.berkeley.edu               -p 2592    9  Nobody playing
>[...]
>
>The only player on hockey.ksu.edu is "puck".  Four of the five guys on calvin
>are from ksu.  But there's a wait queue on atd.
>
>fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
>[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]

I wonder about those ksu guys.  Friday I noticed the same thing except
two players on sturgeon.  Of course one of the ships had many kills
and the other had a really bad ratio.  I wish I could have seen his face
when I toasted both his ships.

Mad (yes I was logged on the day after Christmas) DDogg
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: vic@fajita (V. Martinez 6463)
Subject: Client for Dec 3000 ALPHA
Organization: SAIC
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 16:33:25 GMT

Hey is there a client for the Dec Flamingo with a 150mhz ALPHA cpu. 
I dont mean to brag, but I have a 100+ mips machine with
a 20" color monitor that is begging me to play netrek on.

Victor Martinez
vic@fajita.saic.com

balrog
From: el0g+@andrew.cmu.edu (Erik Lauer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Dogfight Size wars
Date: 22 Dec 92 05:21:36 GMT
	<1gul34INN36t@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu>
	<lyodav.724899627@vincent2.iastate.edu>
	<JIVE.92Dec21124815@spanky.ssc.gov>
Organization: Doctoral student, Mathematics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

jive@spanky.ssc.gov (Jim Ivey) {FillInTheBlank} writes:

>>   Ogging   Bombing   Planets
>>1) CA       SC        DD
>>2) DD       DD        AS
>>3) SC       AS        SC
>
>     Well, your chart seems reasonable, though I'd fault it in a couple of
>areas.
>
>    Ogging   Bombing   Planets
>1)  CA       SC        SC
>2)  SC       DD        CA
>3)  DD       AS        AS

Wait!  If everyone takes in SC, why is CA the best ogger (ogging means
ogging carriers, right)?  How about this chart:

    Ogging   Bombing   Planets
1)  SC        SC        SC
2)  CA        AS        AS
3)  DD        DD        DD

People often fly CA.  Going home to refit usually wastes too much time. 
Hence CA is better for taking planets than this chart indicates
[probably right after SC].  


Erik
---=