HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Apparently-To: catholic@american.edu
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 08:42:49 PST
From:         "John R. Covert 14-Dec-1992 1127" <covert@COVERT.ENET.DEC.COM>
Subject:      Re: Asylum (sanctuary)

>John Covert, could you tell us the name of this priest,
>and some details about this affair? Steve.

I can't find a recent article, but an article published at the
beginning of the trial names two priests, The Rev. R. Thomas Carleton,
46, of Arlington, and The Rev. Francis O. Hagerty, 76, of Boston.

I'm not sure that both were convicted, but I know that at least one
was.  The State had to show that the defendants (the two priests and
six other members of Operation Rescue, which in this area, is almost
entirely Roman Catholic in composition) were aware of the State ban
on blocking access to abortion clinics at the time they were involved
in rescues in Hyannis and Boston.

The earlier article appeared at a time when the State prosecutors had
filed a motion to prevent the priests from wearing any clothing which
would identify them as priests and which would enjoin attorneys and
witnesses from referring to them as "Father" during the trial.

The State withdrew the motion after major protests were scheduled.
It's obvious that the prosecutor's office was in some disarray over
this; news articles quoted State Attorney General Harshbarger as
saying that the motion was withdrawn because the Church and Operation
Rescue were going to start a sideshow that would detract from the
actual prosecution, but then a few days later he said that he was
going to dismiss the prosecutors who had file the motion.

I'll try to report the length of the sentence if I see it reported;
the verdict will definitely be appealed -- in fact, there was some
deliberate attempt to be sure to receive a guilty verdict so that
there could be an appeal of the ban on blocking access to clinics.

It is my opinion that violence at clinics goes too far -- that civil
disobedience in the form of chaining oneself in front of clinics is
courageous -- but that praying the rosary in front of clinics is
about as far as I'm personally willing to go.  Now, if DEC lays me
off (not currently likely, I think), then I might be more willing
to go to jail.

/john
X-Vmsmail-To: SMTP%"CATHOLIC@AMERICAN.EDU"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Date:         Wed, 16 Dec 1992 11:13:45 -0500
From:         URSIC@ASTRO.CS.HH.AB.COM
Subject:      Re: Myth exposed!!!

Karl C Schudt <kschudt@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU> writes:
>Hmmm, make up an inappropriate analogy, followed with a smiley then your
>initials, does this sound familiar to anyone? :-) - K.S.

Flattery will get you nowhere, Karl:-)

But back to the original myth, if a pope refers to something as "of hell",
wouldn't that appear to be "condemning" that something?
...or is the pope allowed to "joke" about hell:-) -J.J.
From: amanda@intercon.com (Amanda Walker)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Subject: Re: Asylum (sanctuary)
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 23:13:42 -0500
Organization: InterCon Systems Corporation
Distribution: world
Reply-To: amanda@intercon.com (Amanda Walker)
NNTP-Posting-Host: chaos.intercon.com
X-Newsreader: InterCon TCP/Connect II 1.1fc2

In article <9212172109.AA03738@trent.noname>, "Donald J. Magee" 
<djm@TRENT.ATT.COM> writes:
> To be perfectly honest, the original statement concerning a priest 
> having a allegience to a foreign power and therefore should be 
> excluded from public office, IMHO was an example of anti-catholic 
> sentiment in the US, 

Sigh.  I did not mean to suggest that this was in fact true.  It is, however, 
a sentiment I have heard expressed many times over the years.  I hadn't meant 
to get into a long discussion about papal primacy again; I just wanted to 
point out that there are those who would see a priest in public service as 
having a conflict of interest.

Personally, I do not.



Amanda Walker
InterCon Systems Corporation


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Apparently-To: catholic@american.edu
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 06:53:18 PST
From:         "John R. Covert 12-Dec-1992 0943" <covert@COVERT.ENET.DEC.COM>
Subject:      Re: electronic bible

>Hi Tom,  My suggestion for you would be to get a good study bible like
>the New Jerusalem Bible (study edition) and start by simply reading
>the lessons for each sunday, and reading the footnotes that make any
>necessary explanations.

My parish priest tells me that the NAB Catholic Study Bible is the best
single volume bible commentary.  Even with the new three-year lectionary
(which, BTW, is nearly identical for Roman Catholics and Anglicans) you'll
still miss a lot of the Bible.  But this is a good start.  If you buy a
copy of St. Joseph's Sunday Missal (about $10), you'll not only have all
the Sunday readings and other propers, you'll get a commentary on the
Mass theme and each of the three readings.

But you should still buy a study bible, and if you really want to get into
studying the bible on your own, you should also buy the Divine Office
lectionary and do some of the daily offices, such as the Office of Reading.
That should take you through the whole bible, except for long geneologies.

/john
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
From: omega@triton.unm.edu (   --==[]==--   )
Subject: COVENANT HOUSE INFO REQUEST
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 03:48:11 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque



	Hi .... I don't read this list, but I thought it would be 
relevant to ask this question here.  I recently read a book called 
"Sometimes God has a Kid's Face," by Fr. Bruce Ritter.  It was my 
first introduction to Covenant House ....

    I am 36 and have spent time on the streets talking with 
teenagers and the homeless and have often considered taking a few 
years to work with a group like Covenant House.  I have never done 
this type of work.

    I would like to know if anyone on the list has any ascii files 
or information that they can send me concerning this group.  If you 
do, please write me at 
                        omega@triton.unm.edu

Thanks ...


Charlie.


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Date:         Wed, 16 Dec 1992 03:41:00 EST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         GIVE PEAS A CHANCE <LBRYNES@CLARKU.BITNET>
Subject:      Request for BIG Project Bibli/Contacts..

Howdy...
'We' are in the midst of a major Masterplan undertaking to redo our
Musuem (c. 54,000 sq. ' now on 60 acres) and Wildlife Center (zoo).
I will be working with architects/exhibit consultants on the design/
model which will be the Center's future.

Our natural history collections, technology, interactive exhibits are to
be integrated with the wildlife... Sort of bioregion pods 'growing off"
the main building.

Point: I'd love to tellthe architects that the pods must be designed
as geodesic domes... functional, aesthetic, and a palpable signature
of our mission of environmental education (global change research).

I have a rather conservative Boardof Trustees...but if I am adequately
prepared on cost-effectiveness --as well as vision and ethics--I know
I can sell this.

Any references or contacts you can supply would be GREATLY appreciated!

Lois  (Brynes)
Associate Director
New England Science Center
Worcester, MA
internet        lbrynes@vax.clarku.edu
bitnet          lbrynes@clarku=
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic
From: dasher@well.sf.ca.us (D Anton Sherwood)
Subject: Re: Rest in Peace?
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 08:31:33 GMT

In article <GEODESIC%92120911193942@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU> Dennis R Short <SHORT@PURCCVM.BITNET> writes:
>
>An important question for domes and all non-traditional architecture is
>how much impact does the attitude of mortgage bankers and building code people
>have on restraining or blocking innovative building technologies??

I heard that some students wanted to build a dome as a class project, but
couldn't get permission from the almighty county planning agency because the
proposed structure wouldn't have studs every sixteen inches.

In "Grunch of Giants" (and probably elsewhere, I suppose), Fuller tells of
the barriers he met with the Dymaxion House.  Zoning officials wouldn't
allow it to be installed unless union plumbers and electricians were hired
to rip out all the pipes and wires and put them back in.  This, of course,
made the world safe for tradition.  Fuller concluded that capitalism has got
to go.  *sigh*  If that's capitalism, I'm Ross Perot....
-- 
Anton Sherwood                                          dasher@well.sf.ca.us
+1 415 267 0685                 1800 Market St #207, San Francisco 94102 USA
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Date:         Tue, 15 Dec 1992 13:33:19 PST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         THE END IS NIE! <RHYSLING@PHOENIX.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Inovation Where You Find it...

Mr Long: (any relation to Lazerus?)

I must agrea!   All dreams must be kept alive!   However, it is indead esey
to despair...We all have the good/bad days.

In refrence to comuenal living, I have made efforts into this avenue.
My observations and coments are as follows:
1) It is difficult, but not inpossable, to find people who both want to
 Live in a Comuenal way AND also HAVE AT LEAST SOME MONEY.

2) Of those with both of the above, a vast number of them are unexceptable to
  ME because of a fue common resones that I have come across:
   A) They wish to secead from the Union, and do not have a functional plan to
      do so.  I put them in the crazy bin...becuase they are both extream,
      and do not have two intelegent thoughts put together to make it work.
      (Extreams are OK by me, IF they WORK)

3) There is an intention to perform illegal actions which I find obhorant in
   the comeun.  Growing Dope, manufactuering speed, etc.   That is no way
   to make money...(adding to the sickness)

4) Members wish to make a totleiterian government out of the comuen, with guess
   who in controll...

Aside from the above, one must also get along with ones naighbors, this eliminat
ing, with the above, 95% of attempted comuens from my list...

Not imposable. but difficult.


ON LAND IN CALIFORNIA:

By GOD! yes, the prices are THAT BAD...I live in a piss-ant university-loging
town...you would think land would be in the glut...not so.

I have gone over maps at the accesors office, and scouted out land on foot...
I'v made offers...but if land is BUILDABLE (ie, not a cliff face) it is expensiv
ve, without exception.

I'v bben to reposesed land octions...after vueing the land..all the plots below
20,000$$ where both unbuildable...and unsold...

Why don't I move?  Say, where did you say you lived...?

(By the Way, the name of the book was Baidarka, by George Dyson, son of
 Freyman Dyson, the Physisist, creater of the Dyson Sphere)

:I

*wave*

C.R. Lefay
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic
Date:         Sun, 13 Dec 1992 20:36:21 PST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         THE END IS NIE! <RHYSLING@PHOENIX.BITNET>
Subject:      Inovation Where You Find it...

         George Dyson, in persueing the evolution of the Baidarka (Kyak,Canue),
developoed a methode for fabricating those sceleton/skin structures that I think
would prove aplicable to our friend, the dome.

Mr. Dyson Made the frame of his vehicle from aluminiem tubeing, lashed together
with nylon thread and reinforced with gussets, also of aluminiem.  He exper-
amented with several skins, from fiber-glass to nylon impregnated with
neoprean and hyperon.   The  boats he fabricated by this methode where both
strong and light.  Best of all, they required fue tools to manuefacture,
no heavy aquipment, and very simply methods (sewing and simple fabrication of
metals).

Add one more nifty idea to the dome pile.
It will not help much.

Why?  Why are domes not poping up all over?
Why have I not made one?

For me, the answer is simple: NO LAND.
I can conceptualize all day, sketch out neet dezines, make plans...
but untill I have a piece of earth to call my own, I will never make one...

Round where I live, a 50x70 ft lot runs for 65 thousand $$$, starting...
I, if I could find full time employment, at say, $5 an hour, 40 hrs a week,
in about 15 YEARS I could afford to by a lot...assueming I forsake all other
dreams...

Add in building costs...however minimal...
That dream is too distant, too far away.

I am very pore.  This may not be your case.
If you are not, I say to you:  Why are you not LIVING YOUR DREAM?
If it is making domes, DO IT!  Others will say "Neet, could I do that?"
or "By God, stand back, that thing looks dangerouse!"
Eather way, you will have done it.  If you have the means by which to
change your ideas into reality, do it.

I envy you.

If you do not, do as I must, and strive for the means to change your status,

and that of those around you.

In the meanwhile, untell I can afford a place to call Home, I keep listening
here, and keep my little dreams alive...I hope yours fair well.

C.R LeFay

***********************
Rhysling@Euclid.Humboldt.Edu
Po Box 942
Arcata,
Ca, 95521
No Phone/No home
:I
***********************
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic
From: dasher@well.sf.ca.us (D Anton Sherwood)
Subject: Re: Rest in Peace?
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 08:35:26 GMT

In article <01GS5CIYA1PC9EGJOY@splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu> Bill Long <LONGWJ@SNYPLAVA.BITNET> writes:
>
>...  Someone mentioned about banks being reluctant
>to finance archetecturally inovative homes and I agree that this is
>probably a large factor in why we don't see more domes...I know people in this
>area who've had a hard time getting financing for homes that weren't hooked
>up to public electric utilities (you know, solar or wind powered) and that
>discourages more of this type of construction.  I'm sure it's a plot by the
>banks and public utilities to keep the $$$ flowing in...maybe McElwaine
>would like to dump a large file of "evidence" to this list for us to review
>(please don't forget the :^).

Er, how does cutting themselves (the banks) out of a segment of the market
keep the money flowing in?

The banks probably just deem it a bad risk to lend on a house that can't be
built because of the wonderful Codes.

But yeah, I'll go along with putting blame on the public (i.e. monopolistic)
utilities.
-- 
Anton Sherwood                                          dasher@well.sf.ca.us
+1 415 267 0685                 1800 Market St #207, San Francisco 94102 USA
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic
Date:         Tue, 15 Dec 1992 14:07:51 PST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         THE END IS NIE! <RHYSLING@PHOENIX.BITNET>
Subject: RE: Inovation Where You Find it...

I glad it worked out for you...
By-the-way, do you have any idea how much your 7,000$ acerage, uniproved, would
sell for today?    Perhapse we all must finde our where/when to success..
Maybe Cali ain't the place...


C.R. Lefay
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic
Date:         Tue, 15 Dec 1992 15:51:56 EDT
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         Trimtab <BDAMICO@GWUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Kick Start
              14 Dec 1992 09:28:09 GMT from <mj_brewe@HONEY.UWE.AC.UK>

You are investigating what I consider to be one of Fuller's most significant, y
et least known, of Fuller's contributions to humanity, the Dymaxion Map (consta
nt zenith) projection.  I assume that this is what you mean by WGS84.

Information on this map projection which does not significantly distort the rel
ative sizes and positions of the continents can be found in Critical Path and Gr
unch of Giants by Fuller.  For the mathematical information you should see Syne
rgetics I and II and the actual patent information found in Inventions the paten
ted Works of Buckminster Fuller.

Also see The Minds Eye of Buckminster Fuller by Donald Robertson (Fuller Patent
 Attorney).
 Perhaps it is time to repost my Annotated Bibliography.  Anyone interested?
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Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 13:18:57 CST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         dosemagt@UWWVAX.UWW.EDU
Subject:      RE: Inovation Where You Find it...

I live in a rural community in south central Wisconsin. I purchased an
acre and a half of wooded land for $7,000 and built our family a 44 foot
diameter dome. I had absolutely NO problems getting a loan from from my
local banker. I had very few problems getting insurance. I did all of
this 13 years ago. We love our dome and would find it very hard to move
back into a box type home. Within 5 miles of our dome you can find 4 other
domes and to the best of my knowledge none of those people had the problems
that so many of you are talking about. I've done it. So can you. Stop making
excuses and make your dreams come true. By the way, I do have a job but I'm
far from being well off. I'm just an every day sort of guy that chased his
dream and made it a reality.

May you all have a joyous holiday season !!!!
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Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 16:36:15 EST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         leo elliott <76440.1416@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Subject:      Grunching Along!

I might add that we should not forget the insurance industry in the "Grunch
Cadre" -- perhaps there is some "insurance threshold" that marks the
beginning of "professionalism"... I recall somewhere Bucky saying he never
wanted to be considered a "professional" because that was when one became
more concerned with the opinions of one's colleagues than with what was the
right or best way of building or doing something.

I don't think it's like some conscious collusion on the part of all these
agencies/institutions, but rather the inertia of accumulated bureaucratic
fear, laziness, and ineptitude, all "conspiring" to keep domes "on the wild
side".

I live two lots down from a dome built in the mid 70s that began
deteriorating in the late 70s (when my friend moved out of it) and it then
sat idle for several years, deteriorating further, until it finally hit the
marketing level where it got sold to someone willing to be a live-in
do-it-yourselfer, which is I suppose another term for "crewmember".

By way of intro, (this is my first post to this list!) I live in
Charlottesville, VA and work as a System Admin for a wholesale
importer-distributor of linens from France; I have read most all of Bucky's
work (except the 'deep' math), and was about 15 years ago working on a
Masters Thesis on the striking conceptual symmetry between Bucky and the
Urantia Book, which writing this forum may serve to resurrect.




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Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 22:54:23 -0500
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         Ken Latta <klatta@MERIT.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Rest in Peace?
              12 Dec 92 08:35:26 GMT." <9212121520.AA10912@merit.edu>

It's not really such an elusive concept. The bank is only willing
to lend you money in order to make a profit. They assess the risk
that you might not make payments for the entire term (10, 15, 30 years)
and they'll have to take the house. The problem with any non-standard
house is their assessment of the marketability is very low, and that's
even in a locale where the building codes are friendly. If the dome
were on the fringe of an uptight neighborhood (like the ones where
neighbors sue the person with a purple paint job), they fear they'll
never resell the house.
Now I'm not for or against them, just trying to understand them.
Some other issues, utilities hookup. I believe almost every dwelling
should be connected to the utilities grid unless the cost of
connection is truly prohibitive. While I support exploratory
technology, few dwellings only ever have one owner. Re-use
requires flexibility.
Even the "bad" technologies aren't always so obviously bad. Consider
electricity. The encouragement of electric vehicles for instance
represents an increase in demand. And don't forget that one of
Fullers' goals was the world power grid which would permit the distribution
of electricity generated by the most benign sources (wind, hydro, natural
gas).

Ken Latta, Merit Network, Inc.
NSFNET Project, Internet Engineering Group
1071 Beal, Ann Arbor, MI 48109-2103
313.936.2115 voice,  313.747.3745 fax
klatta@merit.edu, USERLFQF@umichum.bitnet
Disclaimer: organization listed for identification purposes only.
"We must go forward into the future, not past into the back"--guess who

 > From: :  D Anton Sherwood <dasher@WELL.SF.CA.US>
  >In article <01GS5CIYA1PC9EGJOY@splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu> Bill Long
  >>...  Someone mentioned about banks being reluctant
  >>to finance archetecturally inovative homes and I agree that this is
  >>probably a large factor in why we don't see more domes...I know people in t
his
  >>area who've had a hard time getting financing for homes that weren't hooked
  >>up to public electric utilities (you know, solar or wind powered) and that
  >>discourages more of this type of construction.  I'm sure it's a plot by the
  >>banks and public utilities to keep the $$$ flowing in...maybe McElwaine
  >>would like to dump a large file of "evidence" to this list for us to review
  >>(please don't forget the :^).
  >
  >Er, how does cutting themselves (the banks) out of a segment of the market
  >keep the money flowing in?
  >
  >The banks probably just deem it a bad risk to lend on a house that can't be
  >built because of the wonderful Codes.
  >
  >But yeah, I'll go along with putting blame on the public (i.e. monopolistic)
  >utilities.
  >--
  >Anton Sherwood                                          dasher@well.sf.ca.us
  >+1 415 267 0685                 1800 Market St #207, San Francisco 94102 USA
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Date:         Tue, 15 Dec 1992 14:33:48 CST
              <GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET>
From:         dosemagt@UWWVAX.UWW.EDU
Subject:      RE: hurricanes and hardware

You might want to try purchasing a connector system from a dome
manufacturer. Natural Spaces in North Branch Minnesota will sell you
just a connector system. You can call 1-800-733-7107 for more
information. I'm not sure , but I think if you purchase their system
they will provide you with all of the specs to cut all of your own
panels etc. Ask them to send you their All About Domes book.