HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pharvey@mipos3.intel.com (Paul Harvey)
Subject: Re: Huge green bugs eating my tomatoe
Organization: Intel Corporation, Santa Clara, CA USA
	<2413@cronos.metaphor.com> <1992Aug11.235444.6044@news.mentorg.com> 
	<2425@cronos.metaphor.com> <1992Aug18.003256.23037@news.mentorg.com>
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 17:33:54 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.003256.23037@news.mentorg.com> 
archiel@sun_archielcom (Archie Lachner) writes:
>I doubt your actions will have much effect in preserving either species.  
>A better way is to preserve some of the habitat in which both naturally 
>occur.  Have you ever heard of the Nature Conservancy?  You might find that 
>it interests you.  I am a member, but I'm still going to keep spraying the 
>bugs in my garden with reasonably safe stuff that's doing minimal, if any, 
>harm in the grand scheme of things.

The Nature Conservancy, (TNC), is doing great things, however don't be 
fooled into thinking that two of every species is going to fit on that ark.
It may pay to try some conservancy at home, instead of just sending some
money to someone else to take care of it. Also, TNC's approach is to lock
up land away from humans, this approach may not be sustainable in our
coming over-populated future. The only sustainable approach may be what you
can accomplish in your own back yard and in your own neighborhood and the
habits and techniques you pass down to your children and other's children.
From: eisaksso@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Eva Isaksson)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: worms on brocoli
Date: 18 Aug 92 11:29:34 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

The only reliable way to keep worms from your broccoli heads is 
to cover the plants with thin acrylic gauze. It is *really*
difficult to guard the gauze all summer long, as the growing
broccoli plants tend to become bigger than you'd anticipate
when measuring a suitable piece of gauze in the spring.
But the wormless heads are worth the trouble, if you really
like broccoli! You have to bury the ends of the gauze securely
in the ground so that there is not one little hole for
insects to get through.

When I hadn't yet discovered gauze, I used to remove the worms
after steaming the broccoli heads in a special steam kettle.
Broccoli turns bright green when steamed, while the worms
turn pale yellow, so that you can pick them off.

Eva Isaksson
eisaksson@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: phcalama@dial.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Calamai)
Subject: advice sought -- dividing peonies and irises
Keywords: peonies and irises
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 23:34:54 GMT

My peonies didn't bloom this year and my guess is that they
need dividing.  When should this be done and what should I
do to prepare the soil for replanting?  

I also have to divide some irises....is the procedure for
dividing them identical?

One more thing, I've had conflicting advice regarding the pruning
of liliac trees.  One suggestion involved removing some of the
branches and the other did not.  Which is correct and, if branches
are to be removed, when should this be done and how does one select
the branches to cut?

Thanks.


-- 
Professor Paul H. Calamai		email: phcalamai@dial.uwaterloo.ca
Dept. of Systems Design Engineering	phone: (519)885-1211 ext. 3182
University of Waterloo			fax  : (519)746-4791
Waterloo, Ont. CANADA N2L 3G1		telex: 069-55259
From: Ecology Center Fund <ecologycntr@igc.org>
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Date: 13 Aug 92 17:46 PDT
Subject: Re: HELP ME! California Sierra Redwood 
Nf-ID: #R:olivea.atc.olivetti.com:55684:cdp:1453300072:000:219
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!ecologycntr    Aug 13 17:46:00 1992


Dawn Redwood is known botanically as Metasequoia glyptostroboides.
It's a beautiful tree, differing from the Redwood and the Big Tree
(as we call them here in CA) in being deciduous and having much
flared roots.

chris

Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: cheryl@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (cheryl.rothlisberger)
Subject: slug slime
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 17:39:04 GMT

Does anyone out there have any ideas on how we can get the slime trails from
slugs off the side of our house?  We've tried scrubbing with soapy water
without any luck. We just repainted two months ago, so we don't want to 
use anything that will ruin the finish.  We didn't even know that we had 
these giant slugs until a few weeks ago when their slime trails appeared on 
the lawn. 

I know, I know, this is message leaves a disgusting image.

Cheryl

BTW - We keep jar lids filled with Coors Lite or Keystone beer in our gardens. 
Every morning the lids are filled with slugs, and the plants are healthy.
From: charlesv@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Charles Van Duren)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: ORGANIC lawn care???
Date: 18 Aug 92 15:26:00 GMT

sh4d+@andrew.cmu.edu (Sandra J. Harris) writes:

>Does anyone know of an organic treatment for lawns?  My grass is in dire
>need of treatment - it's full of clover, dandelions, lots of
>unidentified weeds, and some grass.....

Hey, if my lawn DIDN'T have clover and dandelions, it wouldn't be green
at all!

Why eradicate something that produces beautiful colours early in spring?

CvD
From: lamunyj@jacobs.CS.ORST.EDU (James Lamunyon)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: horseradish
Keywords: horseradish
Date: 15 Aug 92 16:38:17 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Outreach Services - Oregon State University

In article <77654@ut-emx.uucp> ccel001@shallot.ots.utexas.edu writes:
>Anyone out there (where are all of you anyway?) grow horseradish? I'm  
>trying to find horseradish plants to put in my garden and am having no  
>luck.
>Does anyone know where to get some?
>Does anybody out there grow horseradish? 
>Is it hard/easy to grow?
> 
>Thanks,  Gene Titus.   

     Nichols caries Horse-radish Maliner Kreb starter roots.  8/$6.65 or
16/$10.95 Spring shipment only.  Write and ask for their 1993 catalog.

	Nichols Garden Nursury
	1190 North Pacific Hwy.
	Albany, OR 97321-4598



			-James
From: vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu (Vince Summers)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Older african violets
Date: 14 Aug 92 13:22:18 GMT
Distribution: rec.gardens
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory


     Varieties of A.V. become prettier all the time (if you buy from 
greenhouses and not the usual Optimara at grocery stores), but isn't
so often true that we can lose track of the simpler beauty and durability
of the parent stock plants?  If I were going to sink more money into 
violets, I would write to that company in New England (I forget who)
and obtain the ancesters.  What do you think?

Vince Summers
vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu
From: vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu (Vince Summers)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Huge green bugs eating my tomatoes
Date: 20 Aug 92 17:35:50 GMT
	<1992Aug20.153620.20836@ucsu.Colorado.EDU>
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory


     I haven't mentioned something that happened to me as a child that
perhaps I should have mentioned on rec.gardens.  As a child, I picked
a tomato hornworm off a tomato plant.  I developed a severe swelling on
that hand that necessitated the sawing off of my gold and sardonyx ring.
     It might be the smart thing then to mention : use a pair of gloves
or at least a glove when handling the tomato hornworm.
     Now as to grasshoppers---I have a skillion zillion of the buggers
in my herb/flower garden and they've left skeletons only of some plants.
My solution will be DON'T PLANT THE SAME PLANTS as the ones that were
eaten next year.  Surely this must seem a sensible solution to a pest
problem.  Unless you must, or intensely desire to plant the same thing,
why not plant something different, all you out there?  What do you 
think?

Vince Summers
vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: steveh@or.credence.com (Steve Holder)
Subject: Starting Hemerocallis From Seeds
Organization: Credence Systems Corp. Beaverton, OR
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 03:05:00 GMT


  Recently on one of my strolls throught the garden I noticed some ripe
  seed pods on a couple of my Hemerocallis (daylilies).  I gleened about
  a half dozen seeds out of them.  

  I phoned a nursery about how to start them.  The guy there said that
  the seeds need a dormant period and need to be stored moist.  He
  suggested that I place them in a ziplock bag with a damp paper towel
  and place the bag in the fridge for the winter.  

  After checking them periodically for mold the gentleman said that
  around Febuary to start them under my halide light.  He said that the
  seeds are not photo sensitive and that they are not particular about
  how they are germinated.

  I realize that I am unlikely to get any thing remarkable out of these
  seeds, but what the hay...

  What is the net consensus?  Sound like good advice?  Any caveats that
  I should know about?

  
  Thanks,

  Steve


-- 
"Well I carry a BIGGA STICK, and I USE it too. 'WHAM'" - Y. Sam to B. Bunny

*********   steveh@or.credence.com   ********
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu (Vince Summers)
Subject: Re: Evergreens and Bag Worms
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory
	<maoh.714422098@phyast.nhn.uoknor.edu>
Distribution: rec.gardens
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 20:59:32 GMT

     Thanks for a good and thorough reply.  I knew I had seen them on some
non-pine evergreen, which is why I used the term evergreen instead of pine.
I hope others out there become aware of the problem as you've so well
described it !

Vince
vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: harlan@crchh347.bnr.ca (Bruce Harlan)
Subject: Re: Improving clay soil
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Richardson, Tx
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 19:09:02 GMT

Wouldn't getting in touch with the local Agricultural Extension Agency
(or the local equivalent) be an informative project? I would think that they	
would be well informed about the local soils and how to improve them.

Just my 2cents worth.
From: pharvey@mipos3.intel.com (Paul Harvey)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Seed starting FAQ
Date: 17 Aug 92 21:53:01 GMT
Organization: Intel Corporation, Santa Clara, CA USA

Some more ideas, not a critique. (Overall the FAQ is high quality)
Do with these comments as you see fit:


In article <1992Aug17.150940.6090@iscsvax.uni.edu> 
klier@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
>From:	IN%"ceci@lysator.liu.se" 13-AUG-1992 14:51:06.75
>Subj:	FAQ Starting Seeds Indoors
>STARTING PLANTS INDOORS FAQL			August 13, 1992
>Written by Ceci Henningsson, ceci@lysator.liu.se. Sources are various
>Swedish gardening books and catalogues. Lists over seeds which are
>started indoors in other countries and climates would be nice.
>Contributions and criticism are both very welcome!
>I. REASON
>The reason for starting plants indoors is to prolong the cultivation

Yes, in the north, but it works in the south too. Why? You can provide ideal
sprouting conditions which can not be obtained in the ground. Ideal conditions
includes everything, from warmth and water and air and freedom from soil
disease and even snails. I garden in a 300 day growing season and yes, I
start most of my plants indoors. I get much better and predicatable results.

>II. GOAL

And to get germination and strong growing plants with vigor. For example,
many "warm-season" plants sprouted in cold soils tend to be always weak.

>III. METHOD
>Sow seeds in soil in a container indoors.

Or soiless mix? Like equal parts ground-peat/vermiculite/perlite?
You kind of mention this later.

>   B. SOWING
>      3. Water the soil. The soil should be damp but not wet.

Wet mix first to avoid moving seed position or washing away seed?

>      4. Put the pots in a light place, preferrably in a window or
>         under plant lights. Too much heat from below or not enough
>         light both produce leggy plants.

Humidity must remain constant, maybe use some type of plastic cover?
Again, you cover this later.

>   E. FERTILIZER 
>DON'T FERTILIZE AT ALL, until the seedlings are rooted in their beds
>in the garden. That takes about 1 month from planting time.

Good starting point for most vegetables. However there are some plants,
mostly small seeded like Chenopodiums, that need nurients as soon as they
sprout. Maybe this is too complex to discuss. If the seedling does not
progress beyond the cotyledon stage or looks anemic, nutrients are probably
needed, only a very little is required, recommend seed-meal/rock-phosphate/
ground-kelp or slow release chemical. Moderation is called for, it is easy
to kill a seedling with fertilizer. Most commercial starting mixes contain
fertilizer and more is not needed.

>If you use plastic or
>clay pots, make sure they have a draining hole and toss in some
>pebbles before filling up soil.

This is a matter of religion that has been around for sometime, that is
"what does one put in the bottom of the pot?", broken pieces of pot, sand,
rocks ... From the tests that I have seen, it is best to put only soil or
mix in the pot. All these other things cause problems.
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: ahill@boi.hp.com (Andy Hill)
Subject: Proper lighting for houseplants?
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 19:05:55 GMT
Reply-To: ahill@boi.hp.com
Organization: LaserJets by Bill & Dave
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

Well, this isn't quite a gardening question, but it came down to either
rec.gardens or misc.consumers.house, and since this group is where the
goddess of gardening (hi Kay!) hangs out...

We're in the process of building a house, and have, in the plans, a plant
shelf around the kitchen on top of a 8' partial wall with a vaulted ceiling
above it.  All plants will be somewhat hardy (pothos, ivy, etc.)

My problem is that I can't figure out how we're going to be able to get
enough light to the plants to keep them happy (I'd rather not have to hassle
with a 'rotate to windows' schedule).  The only two possibilities I've been
able to come up with are: (1) lots of incandescent (ugh!) lights above the
plants, or (2) strips of grow or cool+warm fluorescents along the base of
the shelf (hidden from view), essentially lighting the plants from below.

I'm looking for any ideas, book references, or anecdotes that you can
supply.  Feel free to recommend any plants (except plastic) that you
think might work out well in this environment.

Post or email, I'll try to summarize if this generates sufficient interest.

Thanks!

Andy
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: lenny@bmerh187.BNR.CA (Len DePalma)
Subject: Ponds and Sump Pumps (was Re: Pond Building
Reply-To: lenny@x400gate.bnr.ca
Organization: BNR Ottawa, Fiber Systems Development
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 20:06:09 GMT


In article <1992Aug18.152205.8529@javelin.sim.es.com>,
krogers@javelin.sim.es.com (K. Rogers) writes:
|> sjane@bmers248.bnr.ca (sjs) writes:
|> >>PVC is out and EPDM is in.
|> >Argh.  What does EPDM stand for?  And why is it "in"?  I thought butyl
|> You should be aware the EPDM is controversially "in".  You have to

Well, the acronyms are flying so the experts must be out.   :)

Are there any obvious reasons *not* to run the output from a household
sump pump into a fish pond?  This is just an idea of mine, I haven't
actually tried it yet... but it seems to have lots of positives such
as reduced filtering requirements, constant fresh water supply to the
pond inhabitants - and the aethestics of a pond sure beat the heck out
of a drainage ditch. :)

Any comments folks?  I'll summarize if the email warrants.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
INTERNET: lenny@bnr.ca                 Any opinions expressed are mine.

"You get the most noise from the emptiest barrels."  (Burton Cummings)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: bednarek@picard.med.ge.com (Dennis Bednarek Mfg 4-6971)
Subject: Re: NEED ->>FAQ list of nurseries that sell trees (5 to 8 feet)
Organization: GE Medical Systems, Magnetic Resonance
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 08:19:14 GMT


guestion  is there a listing on sources of trees?
I have several acres that I want to plant with both decorative and fruit
trees, but cannot afford 200 trees at $20.00 plus per tree costing over
$4000.00. I also don't want to wait 10 years for apples. 
Any suggestions appreciated.--

  
###############################################################################
### What were the Raven's last imortal words????????????????????????????????###
###############################################################################
   Please note that any comments are not my employeers or even mine at times.
From: pinky@milton.u.washington.edu (Robert Burbank)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: TOMATOES eaten by SQUIRRELS!?!?!
Date: 15 Aug 92 15:40:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: milton.pinky.713893243
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Washington

spread some blood meal around, that seams to keep away the little
buggers.  a ok source of N too.
From: Deborah.R.Kozlowski@dartmouth.edu (Deborah R. Kozlowski)
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
Subject: Re: Crushed eggshells/calcium/tomatoes/blossom end rot cure?
Date: 13 Aug 92 18:34:16 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH


  I routinely put crused eggshells in potting soil for all kinds of
plants, including tomato seedlings, and don't have much problem with
blossom-end rot, but I think the reason is that the plants are heavilly
mulched.
  Calcium deficient soil can contribute to blossom-end rot, but the
more common cause is a drought followed by a heavy rain. The drought
damages the root hairs and impairs their ability to absorb calcium,
then when the plants get enough water, the calcium in their tissues
becomes diluted.
  A _light_ application of lime, not enough to make the soil alkaline,
probably wouldn't hurt. Gypsum (or even crushed old plaster or
sheetrock) would be a little better, as it is less alkaline. However,
the real solution is to keep the soil from drying out. Acomplish this
by enriching it with organic matter, mulching, and watering when
needed.

Deb Kozlowski
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: archiel@sun_archielcom (Archie Lachner)
Subject: Re: Huge green bugs eating my tomatoe
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 00:32:56 GMT
Organization: mentor
Keywords: 
Followup-To: 

In article <2425@cronos.metaphor.com>, lienhard@daydreamer.metaphor.com (Steve Lienhard) writes:
|> >The premise being put forth is that, if we all spray BT on our tomatos, then the
|> >orchid is history.  Given this line of reasoning, if we all skipped growing
|> >tomatos for a summer or two, then the moth and the orchid are doomed.  Do you
|> >really belive that?  I certainly don't.
|> 
|> Neither do I.
|> 
|> >I'm all in favor of people doing pretty much as they please in their gardens, as
|> >long as they don't damage the environment.  Trying to convince people not to use
|> >botanical or biological controls for insect pests, based on a questionable premise
|> >of species endangerment, doesn't seem to me to fit into that philosophy.
|> 
|> I agree.
|> 
|> But I'm sure I will be reminded of the Western Prarie White Fringed
|> Orchid if I came across one of these 'pests' again.  And with such a vision
|> in mind, I would find it difficult to kill it if I thought I could rescue the
|> tomatoes some other way.  Hopelessly romantic?  Perhaps.  Illogical?  Maybe.
|> Being human, we have the capacity to admire nature's beauty.  With a little
|> understanding, that admiration can transcend the superficial, and a huge green
|> worm on steroids that's devouring our prized tomatoes may itself become
|> something worth preserving.

I doubt your actions will have much effect in preserving either species.  A better
way is to preserve some of the habitat in which both naturally occur.  Have you
ever heard of the Nature Conservancy?  You might find that it interests you.  I
am a member, but I'm still going to keep spraying the bugs in my garden with
reasonably safe stuff that's doing minimal, if any, harm in the grand scheme of
things.
-- 
Archie Lachner
Mentor Graphics Corporation
Wilsonville, Oregon
archie_lachner@mentorg.com
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: bednarek@picard.med.ge.com (Dennis Bednarek Mfg 4-6971)
Subject: Re: Pond Building
Organization: GE Medical Systems, Magnetic Resonance
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 10:43:54 GMT

Everyone is saying butal linerrs are the best  but most expensive.  Could
someone give me an idea on cost?  I'm concidering a 50' x 18' pond in my 
yard and would love to get an idea on cost.  Maybe I can think bigger, or
maybe I'm thinking way over my budget.

--

  
###############################################################################
###NEVER - NEVERMORE###########################################################
###############################################################################
####################################What are the contents of the oblong box?##
###############################################################################
  The usual disclaimer of self and employer applies to all above comments.
#
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Subject: rob bernardo
Followup-To: rec.gardens
Summary: in memoriam
Organization: out in linguistics, linguistic society of america, etc.
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 02:47:32 GMT

this is to inform you that rob bernardo, of concord, california, a
poster to this newsgroup (most recently on the construction of his
drip irrigation system), died of hiv disease (his preferred term) last
thursday afternoon (13 august 1992) in mt. diablo hospital.  he was 40
years old (much too young, much too young).

rob was a dear friend of mine, and of several other posters to
this newsgroup.  on soc.motss, where we first became friends, he
was for over six years one of the voices that *made* the tone of
the group.

he was a linguist - that's how i first met him, in 1979 - a horseman
(the future of his mare, oriana spadix, is still something of a
issue), or more accurately a "cowboy" (sometimes he said "gentleman
farmer"), and a computer systems designer.  he was also a passionate
advocate for gay rights.  and a mensch.

i hope some of you will remember his voice here, and miss it.

   arnold

Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: edmund@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Ed Rucker)
Subject: bee balm and botrytis
Reply-To: edmund@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Ed Rucker)
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 19:09:22 GMT

I planted a big patch of Monarda `Cambridge Scarlet' last fall
and this summer it bloomed very nicely.  BUT now a month later,
the foliage is a mildewed mess and the plants are almost completely
defoliated.  Is there an effective preventive treatment?  (I am
guessing NOT.)  What about the new variety `Gardenview Scarlet',
is it a more resistant variety?

-Ed

edmund@ileaf.com
Edmund Rucker, Interleaf, Inc., 9 Hillside Ave., Waltham, MA 02154


Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: vittallo@ssd.comm.mot.com (John Vittallo)
Subject: when do harvest garlic
Organization: Motorola
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 14:48:51 GMT

I planted garlic this year for the first time.  They have thin grass like
leaves. They have been in the ground for about 4 months.  How do I know when `
to pick them.
Newsgroups: rec.gardens
From: mrh@centerline.com (Mike Huben)
Subject: Re: Huge green bugs eating my tomatoes
Organization: CenterLine Software, Inc.
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 18:00:17 GMT

In article <VSUMMERS.92Aug20123550@polaris.cv.nrao.edu> vsummers@polaris.cv.nrao.edu (Vince Summers) writes:
>
>     I haven't mentioned something that happened to me as a child that
>perhaps I should have mentioned on rec.gardens.  As a child, I picked
>a tomato hornworm off a tomato plant.  I developed a severe swelling on
>that hand that necessitated the sawing off of my gold and sardonyx ring.
>     It might be the smart thing then to mention : use a pair of gloves
>or at least a glove when handling the tomato hornworm.

The tomato hornworm probably wasn't the cause of your swelling: I've never
read of reactions to any but the widely known poisonous caterpillers in the
US: io moth, pus moth, saddleback prominant, buck moth, etc.  All these are
noticeably hairy or spiny.  Tomato hornworms are smooth.

Perhaps you have a rare allergy or you reacted to something else, such as an
ant or bee sting that you didn't notice.  I've handled hornworms numerous
times, without ill effect.

Mike Huben
Newsgroups: rec.gardens