HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: ca.environment
Subject: Re: Cobb Mt. to be LOGGED!
From: prusso@vax.sonoma.edu
Date: 4 Sep 92 07:29:22 -0800
Organization: Sonoma State University

In article <5101@gold.gvg.tek.com>, mikea@zorba.gvg.tek.com (Michael P. Anderson) writes:
> Nevada City just witnessed a similar logging/raping operation brought to
> you by the lovely CDF. There are so many private land timber plans being
> submitted at the moment that these folks are basically rubber-stamping
> everything that crosses their desk. The reason for this is probably
> because greedy and ethics-deprived landowners know that once Clinton/Gore
> are elected, the logging zeitgeist in this country is going to dramatically
> shift to more conservative land use.
> 
> Your only hope is to throw everything you have at them. First, organize.
> Then contact lots of lawyers, find someone who is willing to go to bat
> for you. Start filing for extensions to the plan. Contact the CDF, fax
> them letters, call them, visit their offices, make it so they can't get
> any other work done. Blanket your community with leaflets. Organize
> protests, and get the media involved. We did all of these things, but
> after a few extensions the logs fell anyway. If this happens to you,
> the next step is to get your county supervisors to ammend their general
> plan so that all future logging operations must be approved by the
> county gov't. Then elect supervisors who are sympathetic to your views
> so this won't happen again.
> 
> The main thing is, it's time to lay down the gauntlet. This will polarize
> your community, but denial is no option either. Those of us believe that
> the western forests are disappearing at an alarming rate must act now.
> For those of you who don't, take an airplane ride up the coast. Look
> down at the destruction. Then we'll talk.
> 
> 								MPA
Newsgroups: ca.environment,sci.engr.mech,rec.autos.tech
From: tylerh@cco.caltech.edu (Tyler R. Holcomb)
Subject: Subscribing to electrive vehicles mailing list
Summary: how to subscribe to electric vehicles mailing list
Keywords: EV mailing list
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 17:40:21 GMT

A mailing list discussing electric vehicles exists  here in
Southern California.  While current usage is very low
(a handful of messages a month), it is used by many people who
are actually using Electric Vehicles for their personal
(read "Freeway") transportation.  Also, there is a steady 
stream of posts about the emerging products from manufacturers
(big and large) for both makers of EVs and those who
convert "standard" cars to EV's.


If you want to subscribe to INFO-EV, send a mail message
to MAILSERV@YMIR.CLAREMONT.EDU with the TEXT of the message consisting of the
line:

SUBSCRIBE INFO-EV



-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyler Holcomb   *   "Remember, one treats others with courtesy and repsect *
tylerh@juliet   *   not because they are gentlemen or gentlewomen, but     *
  caltech.edu   *   because you are."  - paraphrased from Garth Henrichs   *
Newsgroups: ca.environment
From: frankm@resonex.com (Frank Muennemann)
Subject: Re: Diapers and Baby's
Keywords: the BOTTOM line
Organization: Resonex Inc., Sunnyvale CA
Distribution: ca
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 16:15:52 GMT

In article <1992Sep2.180546.25393@cco.caltech.edu> tylerh@cco.caltech.edu (Tyler R. Holcomb) writes:
>
>My understanding is that the answer to the "diaper question" is
>"it depends."  In a place like New York, where the water supply
>is plentiful (for the time being, anyway) and landfill space is
>limited, cloth diapers have a clear advantage.  In drought-ridden
>smoggy Los Angelese, the method that consumes considerable
>water and appreciable amounts of fossil fuels loses.  
>
>I am sorry I don't have more facts at my fingertips; however, I vaguely
>recall this being discussed in Science about 6 months ago.
>
I also vaguely remember  that discussion, but it just doesn't 
wash (if you'll parden the pun):  It seems to me very unlikely
that the amount of wash water used per diaper on average is hugely 
greater than the amount of flush water used per toilet flush.  The
only added resources used are the heat of the wash water and 
whatever detergents are put in it.  Compare that to the paper and
plastic products which go into the disposables.  Also keep in mind
that most cloth diaper users have a diaper service, which uses
water more efficiently than a home washing machine.

If putting human waste into plastic containers and landfilling 
it is so environmentally effective, why don't we *all* put our 
feces in baggies and pop them in the garbage to conserve water
(;-)!
Newsgroups: ca.environment,sci.engr.mech,rec.autos.tech
From: jym@mica.berkeley.edu (Jym Dyer)
Newsgroups: ca.environment,sci.engr.mech,rec.autos.tech
Subject: Re: Battery Technology for EVs
Date: 31 Aug 92 09:26:37
Organization: The Naughty Peahen Party Line
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: tylerh@cco.caltech.edu's message of Fri, 28 Aug 1992 18:53:22 GMT

=o= Are there drawbacks in using Nickel Hydride batteries
for EVs?
    <_Jym_>
From: tylerh@cco.caltech.edu (Tyler R. Holcomb)
Subject: Re: Diapers and Baby's
Keywords: the BOTTOM line
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
Distribution: ca
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:05:46 GMT

frankm@resonex.com (Frank Muennemann) writes:

>In article <37536@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> tcritchl@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Tod Critchlow) writes:
>>                      ... we are trying to make
>>the diaper decision...
>>	From the things I have read
>>it seems like there really isn't any consensus.
>>Although most of the information that is pro-disposable 
>>comes from the diaper companies...

>There IS a consensus: Paper diapers ARE a major component of
>landfill bulk.  If you kid has gastrointestinal infections,
>the microbes wind up being stored in/near the landfill.
>They are NOT environmentally sound.  If you care about the 
>environment, call your local diaper service and ask them for 
>their literature.
Perhaps not a perfectly unbiased source, either.

My understanding is that the answer to the "diaper question" is
"it depends."  In a place like New York, where the water supply
is plentiful (for the time being, anyway) and landfill space is
limited, cloth diapers have a clear advantage.  In drought-ridden
smoggy Los Angelese, the method that consumes considerable
water and appreciable amounts of fossil fuels loses.  

I am sorry I don't have more facts at my fingertips; however, I vaguely
recall this being discussed in Science about 6 months ago.

>The disposable makers say you should remove the liner from the
>plastic cover and flush it so that human waste doesn't enter
>the landfill and spread disease: I've NEVER heard of ANYONE
>doing that!

So other people are lazy -  is that any reason to indict Frank Muennemann?
After all, I know peole who *do* dispose of their childrens disposable
diapers correctly.

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyler Holcomb   *   "Remember, one treats others with courtesy and repsect *
tylerh@juliet   *   not because they are gentlemen or gentlewomen, but     *
  caltech.edu   *   because you are."  - paraphrased from Garth Henrichs   *
Newsgroups: ca.environment,sci.engr.mech,rec.autos.tech
From: tylerh@cco.caltech.edu (Tyler R. Holcomb)
Subject: Re: Battery Technology for EVs
Keywords: Batteries electric vehicles
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 23:13:02 GMT


From eev@ymir.claremont.edu Fri Aug 28 13:56:54 1992

From: jws@mlb.semi.harris.com (James W. Swonger)
Subject: RE:  Battery Catalyst for Lead-Acid Batteries

 There was apparently some discussion on the Usenet rec.motorcycles newsgroup
about the use of EDTA (a commonly used preservative) to prevent sulfation in
motorcycle batteries. So this sort of claim is not without parallel. In fact
there may be -significant- or even total similarity.

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyler Holcomb   *   "Remember, one treats others with courtesy and repsect *
tylerh@juliet   *   not because they are gentlemen or gentlewomen, but     *
  caltech.edu   *   because you are."  - paraphrased from Garth Henrichs   *
From: asylvain@felix.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Newsgroups: ca.environment
Subject: Re: "Ecofascists" In Action
Date: 3 Sep 92 23:58:56 GMT
Reply-To: asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Organization: Foundation for the Increased Wealth of Chipmunks

Written in article <21861@suned1.Nswses.Navy.MIL>
 by slb@suned1.UUCP (Shari L Brooks):

: In article <19739@fritz.filenet.com> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com
:    (The Chipmunk) writes:
:
:> There exist ecofacists who would be happy to kill to save the planet, 
:> their justification being the choice of the lesser evil.  The mere lack 
:> of necessity of such extremes sometimes doesn't soak into these skulls.
:
: I am wondering where you get this information.  Who has been killed?
: If not, what makes you assert this with such authority?  Just because
: some corporations could care less about endangered lives *doesn't*
: necessarily mean the other side doesn't either.

Well, I must admit that I have no authority whatsoever.  That's why the
disclaimer says the "opinions" are mine.  When I have facts, I state
them.  Remember, everything you read on Usenet is subject to independent
verification ... no one has a staff of research gophers.

I never said anyone had actually been killed, I merely said that some
would be happy to do so.  I've heard many post to this very newsgroup,
altho whether they're merely shooting off their mouths is impossible to
say.  Obviously, no one swears and oath to tell the truth before logging
in to the Net.

As to the subject of "ecofacists" and killing:

Folks from or associated with Earth First! and other groups have posted
here and in talk.environment about the various ways of spiking a tree.
There's been plenty of controversy surrounding this practice, including
media talk-shows featuring these radical environmentalists.  Logging
companies claim this can kill an unwary logger.

The spikers have since countered that they always warn the companies of
which grove has been spiked, but without telling which particular tree.
Their claim is, and I _have_ heard this on the radio, that it's then the
logging companies fault if someone is killed.

That's like sprinkling tacks on a mountain highway and posting a warning
sign.  If someone blows out a tire and goes over the edge, they can be
killed.  Claiming its the victim's fault for ignoring the sign is a
rationalization of *_enormous_* proportions.

I call that being willing to kill.

:> Me
: Shari L Brooks

-- 
The Chipmunk.
Opinions are mine, void where prohibited, taxed, licensed or regulated.
Everybody wants improvement, but nobody wants change.
From: afitz@next.com (Alex Fitz)
Newsgroups: ca.environment
Subject: Keeping ants away
Keywords: Ants
Date: 24 Aug 92 20:09:16 GMT

Does anyone know of an effective, environmentally safe way to keep ants  
from coming in your house?

Thank you in advance, and please hurry!

alex@next.com
Newsgroups: ca.environment,rec.autos.tech,sci.engr.mech
Newsgroups: ca.environment
Subject: Subscribing to electrive vehicles mailing list
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:49:20 -0800

 -=> Quoting Tyler R. Holcomb to All <=-

 TRH> A mailing list discussing electric vehicles exists  here in
 TRH> Southern California.  While current usage is very low
 TRH> (a handful of messages a month), it is used by many people who
 TRH> are actually using Electric Vehicles for their personal
 TRH> (read "Freeway") transportation.  Also, there is a steady 
 TRH> stream of posts about the emerging products from manufacturers
 TRH> (big and large) for both makers of EVs and those who
 TRH> convert "standard" cars to EV's.

This was my first attempt at a subscription via Internet and it failed.
I then gave it another try and so far nothing has come back.  Whether 
or not this is good or bad only time will tell. :-)
 
 * Origin: ONE WORLD Los Angeles 310/372-0987 HS (1:102/129.0)
From: slb@suned1.nswses.navy.MIL (Shari L Brooks)
Newsgroups: ca.environment
Subject: Re: "Ecofascists" In Action
Date: 27 Aug 92 01:38:35 GMT
Reply-To: slb@suned1.UUCP (Shari L Brooks)
Organization: Naval Satellite Operations Center, Point Mugu, CA, USA

In article <19739@fritz.filenet.com> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk) 
writes:

>There exist ecofacists who would be happy to kill to save the planet, 
>their justification being the choice of the lesser evil.  The mere lack 
>of necessity of such extremes sometimes doesn't soak into these skulls.

I am wondering where you get this information.  Who has been killed?
If not, what makes you assert this with such authority?  Just because
some corporations could care less about endangered lives *doesn't*
necessarily mean the other side doesn't either.

-- 
  Shari L Brooks                   |   slb%suned1.nswses.navy.mil@nosc.mil
  NAVSOC code NSOC323D             |   shari@caspar.nosc.mil
  NAWS Pt Mugu, CA 93042-5013      |   
--> All statements/opinions above are mine and mine only, not the US Navy's.
Newsgroups: ca.environment,sci.engr.mech,rec.autos.tech
From: jesperse@nas.nasa.gov (Dennis Jespersen)
Subject: Private ownership of resources: not a panacea
Organization: Computational Fluid Dynamics Branch, NASA Ames Research Center
Date: 28 Aug 92 11:05:42
Distribution: ca


Some people claim private ownership of natural resources is a panacea
for wasteful use of public resources.  I used to feel this way myself,
but things are more complex.  Consider the following very simplified
example.  Suppose you own some land which contains some trees.  These
trees don't grow very fast, suppose you can sustainably harvest 2.5%
of the standing timber each year and make $10000 profit.  I emphasize
this is sustainable, so if you do this you can be guaranteed of $10000
profit per year indefinitely.  However, if you cut down all the trees
immediately you can make $400000 (10000 x 40) profit which you can
then invest at (say), 5% interest, giving yourself $20000 per year
income.  If you are the sole owner of this resource and are guided by
only economic considerations, the rational course is to immediately
cut down all the trees.

Obviously this example is tremendously simplified.  But can we learn
anything from it?  Well, it suggests things might be a little bit more
complicated than simply than simply "The sole owner of a resource has
a motive to preserve it."  In fact, the sole owner of a resource has a
tendency to see it as capital which must return a sufficient yield to
make its maintenance worthwhile.  

For much more information on this subject, I heartily recommend Colin
Clark's book "Mathematical Bioeconomics".  My example is essentially
borrowed from the introduction to (the first edition of) that book.
--
Dennis Jespersen                Voice: (415) 604-6742                      
MS 202A-1		        FAX:   (415) 604-1095                      
NASA Ames Research Center       email: jesperse@rft28.nas.nasa.gov         
Moffett Field, CA 94035-1000    We have met the enemy and he is us. -- Pogo
Newsgroups: ca.environment
From: dodeca!clyde@jarthur.Claremont.EDU
Organization: Ameritec Corporation
Reply-To: cvisser@ucrmath.ucr.edu ("Clyde R. Visser, KD6GWN")
Subject:   Electric Vehicle mailing list anouncement
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 12:38:00 PDT
X-Received: by usenet.pa.dec.com; id AA00346; Sat, 29 Aug 92 12:41:47 -0700
X-Received: by inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com; id AA24414; Sat, 29 Aug 92 12:41:12 -0700
X-Received:  by dodeca.UUCP (UUPC/extended 1.11q);           Sat, 29 Aug 1992 12:38:03 PDT
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EV on LISTSERV@sjsuvm1.sjsu.edu -  EV Electric Vehicle Discussion
                                   Mailing List

The  EV Electric Vehicle Discussion Mailing List is  intended  to 
provide  a  forum  to discuss the current state of  the  art  and 
future  direction of electric vehicles.  It is *not* intended  to 
discuss  either  EV  appropriateness or  comparisons  with  other 
transportation primary drive modes such as the venerable internal 
combustion engine.  Those "discussions" are best relegated to the 
appropriate usenet newsgroup.

An  electric vehicle is any vehicle which uses an electric  motor 
as  the primary or sole motive force.  The energy storage  device 
used  to drive said motor can use any technology  including,  but 
not  limited  to,  solar  electric,  electric  battery,  internal 
combustion  engine  coupled  with a electric  generator,  or  any 
combination of these.  Production electric vehicles are currently 
available.  Internal combustion engine vehicles can be  converted 
to electric.  There exist a number of companies who perform this
conversion.  There is also a number of manufacturers of equipment 
allowing you to do-it-yourself. 

To  subscribe,  send the following  command  to  LISTSERV@SJSUVM1 
(bitnet) or LISTSERV@SJSUVM1.SJSU.EDU:

SUBSCRIBE EV firstname lastname

After  subscribing, messages may be sent to the list  by  sending 
to: EV@SJSUVM1 (bitnet) or ev@sjsuvm1.sjsu.edu.

Owner:  Clyde R. Visser, KD6GWN <cvisser@ucrmath.ucr.edu>

Xref: sparky ca.environment:826 rec.autos.tech:11765 sci.engr.mech:222
From: tylerh@cco.caltech.edu (Tyler R. Holcomb)
Newsgroups: ca.environment,rec.autos.tech,sci.engr.mech
Subject: Nickel-Iron Batteries
Summary: discussion of electric vehicle nickel batteries
Keywords: nickel batters electric vehicles
Date: 26 Aug 92 18:55:09 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena



     Thought that you all might be interested in this response from Rich Pinder 
about Nickel-Iron batteries.

				-- Chris

>From:	IN%"rpinder@phad.hsc.usc.edu"  "Rich Pinder"   26-AUG-1992 09:30:16.32
To:	IN%"CHRIS@HMCVAX.CLAREMONT.EDU"  "Chris Yoder"
CC:	
Subj:	RE: ev info

thanks for your help....

spoke with Darrell Ideker, who is plant manager for the new production plant
for nickel-iron batteries at Eagle-Pilcher (417 623-8333).  He was very nice
and willing to talk - their 6 volt nickel-iron batteries are in production,
but it's labor intensive assembly (not production line yet) so each 6v 200
a/h battery is about $1300! He says that Chrysler is the big user, putting
them in their mini-van.  Says watering on charge is a big issue with these
type batteries, and that chrysler has a wild-fangled resevoir system to keep
the cells watered.

I told him I'd have to save my lunch money, then call him back!  He was
interested in ev information himself, so I told him i'd mail him a copy of
your very helpful list.

rich


-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tyler Holcomb   *   "Remember, one treats others with courtesy and repsect *
tylerh@juliet   *   not because they are gentlemen or gentlewomen, but     *
  caltech.edu   *   because you are."  - paraphrased from Garth Henrichs   *
Newsgroups: ca.environment,sci.engr.mech,rec.autos.mech
From: Ed.Evans@ofa123.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Subject: Questions asked on Echo
X-Sender: newtout 0.02 Aug 21 1992
Date: 29 Aug 92  08:29:04

Someone thoughtfully posted the most often asked questions on this echo,
and I dutifully saved them.  Unfortunately, I had to format my hard
drive last night and lost everything.

I promise to print to paper such information, if someone would be kind
enough to reproduce it in full or part on this echo.
___
 X SLMR 2.0 #1708 X No Freedom without Wilderness!

--- Maximus 2.00
Xref: sparky ca.driving:2069 rec.autos.driving:5243
From: asylvain@felix.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: A Gaggle of Lexi
Date: 3 Sep 92 00:05:24 GMT
            <1992Aug31.101025.1217@informix.com>
Reply-To: asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Distribution: ca
Organization: Foundation for the Increased Wealth of Chipmunks

Written in article <1992Aug31.101025.1217@informix.com>
 by aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic):

: In article <19717@fritz.filenet.com> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The 
:    Chipmunk) writes:
:>
:> Suppose you buy a Lexus, and you really like it.  So, you buy another
:> one for your wife.  Now you have two.
:>
:> Does this mean you have two "Lexuses," or "Lexi?"
:
: It means you have (had) too much spending money.                 [-:

I disagree.

10 or 12 of 'em, now, maybe ... B-{)

-- 
The Chipmunk.
Opinions are mine, void where prohibited, taxed, licensed or regulated.
While money doesn't buy love, it puts you in a great bargaining position.
From: levine@liege.ics.uci.edu (David Levine)
Subject: Re: No Proof of Insurance?
Newsgroups: ca.driving
Date: 2 Sep 92 02:59:11 GMT
Distribution: ca

bchen@diva.Berkeley.EDU (Benjamin Chen) writes:

>My insurance agent told me that CHP can no longer ask for proof of
>insurance when they pull you over for a ticket.

True.  The law that permitted a peace officer to request proof of
insurance expired some time ago, I think at the beginning of last
year.

to accept the universal responsibility of doing | David L. Levine
good to all sentient beings, and if that is not | Internet: levine@ics.uci.edu
possible, to do no harm                         | UUCP: ...!uunet!ucivax!levine
  -- paraphrased from the Fourteenth Dalai Lama | BITNET: levine@uci
Newsgroups: ca.driving,rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
From: battan@sequent.com (Jim Battan)
Subject: Re: A Gaggle of Lexi
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 92 16:45:36 GMT

In article <19717@fritz.filenet.com> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk) writes:
>Suppose you buy a Lexus, and you really like it.

That's not hard, I do really like it.

>So, you buy another one for your wife.  Now you have two.

Actually, we were considering this, but they don't make a car we'd let
our dog in the back of.

>Does this mean you have two "Lexuses," or "Lexi?"

Click and Clack just answered this question on Car Talk.  They
recommend "Lexi", which I like too.

-- 
Jim Battan - Sequent Computer Systems, Beaverton, OR
battan@sequent.com or uunet!sequent!battan
+1 503 578 5129
Newsgroups: ca.driving
From: dman@netcom.com (Dallman Ross)
Subject: Re: No Proof of Insurance?
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92 05:08:25 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: ca
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

I've been led to believe the same thing.  I believe him, having read
about it when they changed the law.  No source to give you offhand, though.

--
 __D_a l_l m a_n  _ R o_s s _ |dman@netcom.com  /or/  |"You sound like a man|
 l  \\ l\\   /l  /\\  l\\   l |dross@well.sf.ca.us    |with a rubber nose." |
 l   >)l \\ /ll /  \\ l \\  l |vox/fax: 1.510.645.1883| -- One-Lung Bill    |
 l  // l  \X ll/--- \\l  \\ l |350 Perkins St., #108  |     Remmer (deceased)
_l//______________________\\l_|Oakland,_CA__94610-3422|_____________________|_
Newsgroups: ca.driving
From: seligman@CS.Stanford.EDU (Scott Seligman)
Subject: Re: Speed trap - Embarcadero&El Camino, PA
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: ba
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 23:35:43 GMT

In article <134686@lll-winken.LLNL.GOV> ari@viipuri.nersc.gov (Ari Ollikainen) writes:
> 
> In article <1992Aug27.190753.15436@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> rfrench@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Robert S. French) writes:
>>The Palo Alto Revenue Officers are at it again.  One guy with a radar
>>gun on the Alma overpass, and a whole gaggle of cops next to
>>Town&Country pulling over everyone in sight.
> 
> Huh?? Unless school is in session (That's a school zone, for the unobservant)
> a radar ticket on Embarcadero would lose in court! The PAPD can *only* radar
> enforce the segments of Embarcadero which qualify as School Zones. 


The limitation on using radar on Embarcadero does not apply West of
the overpass.  It doesn't matter if school is in session.  What matters
is the 85th percentile speed as measured in the latest traffic survey.


Scott Seligman

Internet:  seligman@CS.Stanford.EDU
UUCP:      {uunet,decwrl,sun}!cs.stanford.edu!seligman