HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: norlin@midway.ecn.uoknor.edu (Norman Lin)
Subject: Concrete questions on music reading
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 04:09:10 GMT
Organization: Engineering Computer Network, University of Oklahoma, Norman, OK, USA
Keywords: music, reading

After seeing the discussion on rec.music.synth about the "Miracle" system
and approaches to reading music, I have a few concrete questions to ask
on the subject.  First, some background about myself.  About 3 years ago,
I became interested in music and started playing on the piano and guitar.
I have never had any formal lessons, but had a one-semester introductory
theory course.  At this stage, I'm relatively comfortable forming basic
open/barre chords on the guitar (major, minor, 7th, major 7th, minor 7th;
the usual important ones) and can hop around reasonably deftly among 
various chords/inversions in the key of C on the keyboard.

I can't read music, at least not in my sense of the word "read."  By
agonizingly scrutinizing the sheet music note by note, using all of those
silly acronyms (Every Good Boy Does Fine, F-A-C-E) for the notes on the
staff, I can slowly make out single notes.  By then working out the
rhythm separately, or by relying on my knowledge of how the song sounds,
I then can piece together the song.

My general, umbrella question is:  How should I 'look at' sheet music to
sight read it?  I don't want to lock myself into looking at things the
"wrong" way, hindering myself later.  Here are some specific questions:

(1)  Do sight readers "see" in sheet music:
     a.  Absolute notes, i.e., "D, F, A, C, D"
     b.  Relative positions within a scale, i.e., "2 4 6 1 2"
     c.  Intervals between notes, i.e., "D, up a minor 3rd, up a major 3rd..."
     d.  Logical groupings of melodic notes (movites)
     e.  Progressions of chords/parts of chords
     e.  Combinations of the above (and if so, when for which?)
     f.  Other?

(2)  What is the best way to learn sight reading?  Just "practice" doesn't
     seem to do it.  Perhaps I am just lacking in discipline, but I suspect
     I am lacking in direction also.  I cannot seem to make progress simply
     by slowly staring down a sheet of music until, note by grueling note,
     the tune emerges.  For learning 2/3/4 part music, the process becomes
     exponentially slower (which leads to the next question).

(3)  How do people read 2/3/4/more parts at once, keeping track of
     all the various rhythms, etc?  I can barely do this if I don't
     already know how the piece is supposed to sound.

I guess I'm just an aspiring amateur, annoyed by this seeming impasse of
reading -- truly "reading" -- music.  What does one "see" in the music?
With written words, people don't see each letter and punctuation mark
individually; they see words, phrases, sentences, swallowing whole chunks
at once.  From what I've read, it seems that this is what true musical
reading should be as well, BUT I have no idea how to embark upon the
road to such "proper" reading of music.

Help!
-- 
Norman Lin | norlin@mailhost.ecn.uoknor.edu   (preferred)   
           | nlin@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu (alternate 1) 
           | narc@obelisk.pillar.com          (alternate 2)
From: paisley@asc.slb.com (Gary Paisley)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Floor Monitors
Date: 11 Jan 93 15:35:09 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Schlumberger Austin Systems Center
NNTP-Posting-Host: mars.asc.slb.com


	I play in a church folk group, comprising from 1 to 
5 acoustic guitar players, bass, accordian, etc, depending on who
makes it to the service. We play in a medium sized church,
which seats about 400 people, and have come to depend on 
microphones and a sound man to be heard ( ah the joy of
acoustic instruments ;)) Now the problem is that we can't seem
to hear each other - it seems the further one is from the leader, the
more likely one is behind the beat. I think/hope it is because they
are hearing the bounce of the PA off the back wall, and not because they
aren't paying attention....


	Anyway, we suspect we need a floor monitor. Since I'm 
responsible for buying, the question is, how much power in an
amplifier is adequate ? I'm thinking of a 30 watt TOA PA amp, and
hooking it up to a floor box with a horn. 

I hate to experiment with this and get it wrong, so I'm asking the
net for the collective wisdom.

thanks
Gary
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: young_dick@macmail2.rtsg.mot.com (Dick Young)
Subject: Info on Mic
Organization: Motorola, Inc. (Cellular Infrastructure)
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:02:22 GMT

I bought a few things as a package deal the other day, and was wondering
about the specifics of a mic which was included.
It's an ElectroVoice N/D257:  I can find an N/D257B in the Musician's Friend
catalog, with a list price of $170.00 and a notation to "call for sale price".
The descriptive blurb touts the 257B as having higher output than (some 
reference...) at an affordable price.

Is the mic I got an EARLIER version and the 257B an improvement ?  Does anyone
have a fix on what the N/D257 (no "B") listed for new ?  Would any kind soul
with an identical unit be willing to post or e-mail me the critical specs off
of their data sheet ?

Thanks in advance for all inputs.
Dick Young
Motorola, Inc.  (Who doesn't have anything to do with my opinions: They're all
                 my own fault.)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.audio.pro
From: beng@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Ben Gullette)
Subject: Plans for PA cabinets
Summary: need plans for PA speaker enclosures
Keywords: PA speakers
Organization: Motorola Inc., Austin, Texas
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 16:45:21 GMT

Can anyone references/pointers to plans for building small
PA speaker enclosures? Possibly Thiel (sp?) designs,
2-way or 3-way, using 12-15" woofers.

Also, recommendations for a good mail-order source of transducers
and cross-overs would be appreciated. Thanks.
-- 

Ben Gullette  (512) 891-2198
uunet!oakhill.sps.mot.com!beng
Motorola RISC Development
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Subject: Re: Mandolin info requested on instrument style and price negotiatin
Reply-To: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette)
Organization: Yale University, Department of Computer Science, New Haven, CT
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 04:55:52 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.000006.3726@mel.dit.csiro.au> brian@mel.dit.csiro.au  
(Brian May) writes:

> I went to some Mandolin festival concerts this weekend in Melbourne. All
> of the above were played there. The mando basses I saw had _8_, yes  
EIGHT
> pairs of strings - a formidable instrument.

That's curious, the picture I have of a mando bass shows it to be
a four string instrument - no double string courses like the other
three (main) members of the family.  Perhaps they were mando cellos?

--
Nathan Janette
PPP link from hilbert.csb.yale.edu

Please reply to: nathan@laplace.csb.yale.edu (NeXT)
From: paisley@asc.slb.com (Gary Paisley)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Floor Monitors
Date: 11 Jan 93 09:52:04
Organization: Schlumberger Austin Systems Center
Distribution: rec
NNTP-Posting-Host: mars.asc.slb.com


	I play in a church folk group, comprising from 1 to 
5 acoustic guitar players, bass, accordian, etc, depending on who
makes it to the service. We play in a medium sized church,
which seats about 400 people, and have come to depend on 
microphones and a sound man to be heard ( ah the joy of
acoustic instruments ;)) Now the problem is that we can't seem
to hear each other - it seems the further one is from the leader, the
more likely one is behind the beat. I think/hope it is because they
are hearing the bounce of the PA off the back wall, and not because they
aren't paying attention....


	Anyway, we suspect we need a floor monitor. Since I'm 
responsible for buying, the question is, how much power in an
amplifier is adequate ? I'm thinking of a 30 watt TOA PA amp, and
hooking it up to a floor box with a horn. 

I hate to experiment with this and get it wrong, so I'm asking the
net for the collective wisdom.

thanks
Gary
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: ianf@novell.com (Ian Finlay)
Subject: Bassman problem - help please!
Organization: Novell, Inc.
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 14:39:20 GMT


Help! I have a '58 Bassman (the 4x10 model) with a bit of a strange problem.
Occasionally, like last Saturday night during a soundcheck (!), the amd hums
very loudly and seems to be unaffected by the volume controls. It also has 
the normal channel go dead (the bright channel is unaffected).

When it did this on Saturday, I opened it up, checked the valves (which were
all new and lit up), swapped the 12AX7s which had no affect, and blew the dust 
out. No change - stll one dead channel.

Then it worked again. For no reason. I did the whole gig fine, and another gig last night (Sunday). The only thing I can think of is that there is a dry joint somewhere, but how do I find it?

Any ideas?
Thanks

Ian
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Ian Finlay @ Novell UK - My mail address is : ifinlay @ sjfsmtp.novell.com
  Disclaimer : No. No way. Not me. Not my employer. It was HIM ....       
  "What are you rebelling against, Johnny ?"....."Whaddaya got ?" 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: rfries@sceng.ub.com (Robert Fries)
Subject: more 8 track info needed
Organization: Ungermann Bass
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 18:35:29 GMT

Well, I've gotten some info about 8 track cassette studios.

Summary:

	One guy says he suffers from tape dropout on his 4 track.
	Another says the dbx on his Tascam 238 is noisy.

I want 8 tracks, let's talk about reel-to-reel.

Are there any 1/4" 8 track recorders? If so, are there any users there who'
d care to comment on their performance?

I know Tascam makes TSR-8 (1/2"), but at $2375 without a board, I'd like to 
consider something less expensive, if it's an improvement over cassette.

Enough rambling...

Any suggestions for 8 track home recording deck and board, cassette or
reel-to-reel ?

Thanks,
Robert

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Robert Fries
Ungermann-Bass Inc.

DISCLAIMER:
    Opinions contained herein are my own, and are not necessarily those
    of Ungermann-Bass.
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:11689 rec.music.synth:19731 rec.music.makers.synth:1007
From: zdenek@ksr.com (Zdenek Radouch)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.music.synth,rec.music.makers.synth
Subject: Re: Resistance Summing/Mixer Circuit
Date: 4 Jan 93 20:14:04 EST
Organization: Kendall Square Research Corp.

->Well.  If my memory serves me correctly, this circuit should work.
-> 
->In 1  o---/\/\/----+---/\/\/----+
->                   |            |
->In 2  o---/\/\/----+   |\       |
->                   |   | \      |
->                   +---|- \     |
->                       |   |----+-------o Summed Out
->                       |  /
->                   +---|+/
->                   |   |/
->                   \
->                   /
->                   \
->                   |
->                Ground
->
->All squiggleys (horizontal /\/\/ and the vertical ones) are 100K 1/4w 
->resistors, that should be matched as closely as possible.
-
No, it is not necessary that the resistors are closely matched, in fact
they shouldn't be. Let's label the resistors: two input resistors R1, R2
feedback resistor R3, and the resistor between the (+) input and GND is R4.

Then:

   Vout = -(V1 * R3 / R1 + V2 * R3 / R2)

   So, for stereo signal R1 and R2 should be the same, R3 determines
   the gain of the circuit so for gain -1 it could be the same as R1 and R2
   but there's no reason to struggle closely matching them.

   I'm not going to go into details as to why the R4 is in the circuit,
   I'll just tell you that you can put just about any resistor there,
   or you can drop it completely (short). The best practical value would
   be R1 || R2 || R3, i.e., (1/(1/R1 + 1/R2 + 1/R3)).

   If you want something REAL CHEAP, then just drop the op amp and R4.

-Z
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.music.synth,alt.guitar,rec.music.makers.guitar,rec.music.makers.synth
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: MCSF address??
From: mccalld@vax.sonoma.edu
Date: 4 Jan 93 06:48:35 -0800
Organization: Sonoma State University

Hey,

anyone got the mailing address of nashvilles 'Music City Song 
Festival' ??
I believe it's a yearly event where song writers submit their
work...
thanks ahead of time
david
mccalld@sonoma.edu

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: johndu@world.std.com (John F Duesenberry)
Subject: Musenet CD-- what happened to it?
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 19:19:54 GMT

Does anybody know whatever happened to the MUSENET CD project?
From: robg@citr.uq.oz.au (Rob Geraghty)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Re: 808 and 303 sounds, composing on the Sun
Date: 5 Jan 93 03:04:54 GMT
Organization: Prentice Centre, University of Queensland

bryanc@stargate.jpl.nasa.gov (Bryan S. Campbell) writes:

>In article <C0CnBF.4u2@nit.pactel.com>, eric@nit.pactel.com (Eric Pederson)
>wrote:
>> 
>>1) What are the recommendations of the readers on generating 303 bass
>>  and 808 drum sounds from *available* MIDI-ready equipment.  303's and 808's
>>  are pretty much out of circulation these days.


>   Well, I've been fervently searching for synth's capable of reproducing
>that unique 303 bass for about 6 months now.  808's are easy...  just buy a
>DR-660, and you'll get all of the good instruments from the 808 AND the 909
>(the 909 is a bit more dancier, and has a harder kick, more realistic
>cymbols, fatter snare).  There's a card out for the R-8 (which I have) that
>has 26 sounds from the 909/808/CR-76/TB303 (don't get excited...  there's
>only one 303 sound, and it's not very tweakable, considering it's a
>sample).  

Another alternative as I've mentioned elsewhere is the Roland Sound
Canvas which seems to have the same percussion ROM as the DR660.  That
way you get the drums *and* a 16 voice multi-timbral synth into the
bargain...

Anyone local with a sampler who wants to try sampling my TB303?  I'd be
interested to see if it *is* possible to get a decent sample of it.
Then we could always distribute the samples through the net.

Rob

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rob Geraghty               | 3 things are important to me 
robg@durian.citr.oz.au     | The gift of love, the joy of life
CITR                       | And the making of music in all its forms
From: jonb@Ingres.COM (Jon Berger)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Re: Where Should I Post This?
Date: 8 Jan 93 19:26:01 GMT
Reply-To: jonb@ingres.com
Organization: Ingres, an ASK Company

In article <1993Jan8.042024.23145@nezsdc.icl.co.nz>, derek@nezsdc.icl.co.nz (Derek Tearne) writes:
>In article <1ihb9mINNfo3@faatcrl.Faa.Gov> frankc@tgf.tc.faa.gov (Frank Coffman) writes:
>>jeffp@hot100.EBay.Sun.COM (Jeff Pfeiffer) writes:
>>
>>
>>>I'm looking to join a working Band in the South Bay area of San Francisco.
>>
>>To answer the question of your subject line, you should limit your
>>distribution to the bay area.  Why am I reading this in New Jersey?
>
>You think you've got problems!  At least you are on the same continent.
>I am trying to start a band but I think San Francisco is a bit of a long 
>way to go for practices!
>
>>(Hint - Don't say distribution: world)
>
>Good hint!

Bad hint.  The "Distribution:" header does, for all practical purposes,
nothing.  I have no idea why this is, but constantly repeated empirical
evidence suggests that it's very close to completely useless.
This wouldn't be such a problem, because the "wasted bandwidth"
associated with a single local-interest ad that goes astray is fairly
negligible, but what invariably happens is that such an ad is followed
up by a million people saying witty stuff like "Hey, I can't make it to
rehearsal in San Francisco, but maybe we could meet halfway in Ohio?".
_That's_ what wastes the bandwidth.

There was recently a big flap on rec.pets.cats where someone innocently
posted an article about a lost ferret -- with a perfectly reasonable
distribution restriction, BTW -- and it fetched up a few continents away,
and everybody had to get in their wise-ass remark.  The thread went on
for a couple of weeks, wasted all kinds of time and resources, and the
poor woman who started it all, who just wanted to be reunited with her
beloved ferret, probably felt terrible.

Some people don't know about the "Distribution:" header.  Some people
do know about it, use it properly, and the article gets spread all
over the place anyway.  Some people know all this but really want to
post something that's of local interest anyway, because they think it's
important.  All of these people deserve some slack, because, bottom line,
the feature just plain doesn't work, and there doesn't seem to be a damn
thing anyone can do about it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
   -__ __ /_   Jon Berger              "If you push something hard enough,
  //_// //_/   jonb@ingres.com          it will fall over."
_/ ---------                              - Fudd's First Law of Opposition
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: birkelan@atelm.sps.mot.com (Joel Birkeland)
Subject: Flatiron problems?
Reply-To: birkelan@atelm.sps.mot.com (Joel Birkeland)
Organization: Motorola SPS
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 22:52:26 GMT


Does anyone know what happened to the Flatiron factory in Montana?
Starting about a year ago, their products seem to have gotten
hard to find.

Joel Birkeland
birkelan@cs1.sps.mot.com
Xref: sparky rec.music.makers:11712 rec.music.makers.synth:1045
From: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers,rec.music.makers.synth
Subject: Anyone got a Roland R8 ROM SN-R8-10 Dance for sale?
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 93 22:33:22 EST
Organization: DAVID A. ROTH MUSIC
Reply-To: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth)
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v4


Anyone got a Roland R8 ROM SN-R8-10 Dance for sale?  Or does anyone
have a suggestion as which dealer might have on in stock?

Please reply by e-mail.

Thanks in advance!

David
david@roth-music.com
From: basinski@biosci.arizona.edu (Mark Basinski)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Re: Concrete questions on music reading
Date: 12 Jan 93 23:47:48 GMT
Followup-To: rec.music.makers,rec.music.synth,alt.guitar,rec.music.makers.guitar,rec.music.makers.synth
Organization: Univ. of Arizona

In article <james.726859233@wrs.com>, james@wrs.com (James Moore) wrote:
> 
> jonb@Ingres.COM (Jon Berger) writes:
> 
> >To this day, unless I concentrate fairly hard,
> >when I see, say, a note on the second-from-bottom line of the staff,
> >I tend to see "third finger on the D string", not "G".
> 
> My question is, why do you think this is a handicap? 

	Ideally, music reading (pattern recognition) should map to higher musical
meaning. This is why (as others have mentioned) most european concervatory
students study solfge - I did some graduate study in Spain, and I was
appalled (and embarressed) to discover that the conservatory I was in
required 7 years of solfege (I wasn't required to do that as a
"foreigner").
Others have also mentioned the usefulness if you're going to play many
instruments, or read many clefs. In the most advanced case, one would
like to be able to see written music and really hear it, and vice versa,
hear music and be able to write it down - perhaps only very few people
really achieve this level of internalization of music - Mozart heard
performances of 8 voice choral works at the Vatican as a teenager, went
home and wrote it all out from memory, and brought the manuscript back the
next day to ask them if he could check it; Paganini supposedly was once 
handed some hideous sheet of music and challenged to sight-read it, so
he looked it over, handed it back to the person and then went across the
room, got his violin out and played it from memory!

  Perhaps it is not right to say it is a "handicap" to read and make that
a fingering, but it is certainly a lower form of music reading...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Basinski      Internet: basinski@biosci.arizona.edu
From: connelly@panthera.key.amdahl.com (John Connelly)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: DAT & Studio Equipment for sale
Date: 8 Jan 93 17:13:28 GMT
Reply-To: connelly@panthera.key.amdahl.com
Distribution: world
Organization: Amdahl Corporation


        Studio Equipment For Sale:

   o Tascam DA-30 Digital Audio Tape deck
      - Full industial unit: 32, 44.1, 48KHz record/play
      - AES/EBU, coaxial digital ins/outs
      - XLR, RCA Analog ins/outs
      - No copy protection using AES/EBU digital
      - Wired remote control
      - 6 Months old, like new
      - $1000+ retail, will sell for $700

   o Peavey 12 channel mixer
      - XLR and line level inputs on all 12 channels
      - gain, 3 band EQ, 4 aux sends per channel
      - like new condition
      - $250

   o Various mics, cables, etc.
      - Shure SM58s $60
      - Shure SM57s $50
      - 20' XLR cables $3 ea

   San Jose CA Area. I'd prefer not to ship the larger items but
   will if necessary.

   email connelly@key.amdahl.com
   phone (510) 623-2153 days
         (408) 926-9264 eves ask for John



Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: irmurray@math.uwaterloo.ca (Ian Murray)
Subject: Beltone amp
Organization: University of Waterloo
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:18:53 GMT

Hey...

Anybody ever heard of Beltone amps?

I saw one recently at a flea market, and was just wondering if it mighta
been some cool relic from the 50s/60s/whatever.

Later, Ian.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ian Murray                    | Overweight gypsies lack
Dept. of Applied Math., U.W.  | colour denomination   
irmurray@math.waterloo.edu    | and goggles.             -- the Tribe of Scribe
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
From: srfergu@rufus.erenj.com (Scott Ferguson)
Subject: Re: ==> +30db GAIN Circuit for Your Guitar: $25 <==
Organization: Exxon Research & Engineering Co.
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 14:33:47 GMT

In article <TILL.92Dec30234559@acid-rain.lucid.com>, till@acid-rain.lucid.com (Don Tillman) writes:
|> 					      Are you assuming that someone 
|>    can create an artificial ground with a 9V battery and use +/- 4.5 volt
|>    "supplies"?   How well would this work?
|> 
|> Yep, for this application the single supply is not a big deal.  It's far
|> more important that you have an amp with low noise, low distortion, and
|> is stable.  

Let's say you do the 1/2 voltage divider to make an isolated ground and 
+/- 4.5. What's a good choice of resistors? You don't want to pull too much
battery current straight down the resistors so obviously a pair of 1-ohm'ers
would be a bad idea. I did it once with two 100K resistors and it worked OK, 
but I wondered how high can you go before The circuit won't work anymore?
I guess beyond 100K the DC current gets pretty negligible anyway.
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Scott Ferguson                        Exxon Research & Engineering Co.
Project Engineer                      New Jersey
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Always bark at a dog."
From: wozniak@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Kevin Thomas Wozniak)
Newsgroups: rec.music.makers
Subject: Looking for a band
Date: 7 Jan 1993 16:36:01 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4

Well,

 	It's been about a month since my group disbanded, and now it's time for myself to move on and find another band.  I am a singer/songwriter with limited guitar abilities.  If you have the band (or are looking to form one), I have your vocals and lyrics.  

Kevin Woz

Newsgroups: rec.music.makers