From: breinhar@access.digex.com (Robert B. Reinhardt)
Subject: Re: [soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.usa] Re: Americans! *smile*
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, Maryland USA
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 23:43:20 GMT

In article <20792@plains.NoDak.edu> green@plains.NoDak.edu (Brad Green) writes:
>In article <1992Sep28.140445.310@nntp.hut.fi> jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala) writes:
>      I sense that it is rooted in neither, but is rather rooted in the
>    fact that for the past quarter century, with the sole exception of the
>    Carter administration, American foreign policy has been consistently and
>    thoroughly despicable.  And it is rooted in the fact that American
>    jingoists have appropriated the idea of patriotism to support every
>    vicious, imperialist, and antidemocratic action of the United States
>    government.  When was the last time you heard any American publicly or
>    privately invoke patriotism in an appeal for support of the ideals of
>    the Declaration of Independence, the values of the Constitution, or the
>    Whitmanesque vision of America as a unique and mystical bonding of human
>    individualism and fusion?  No:  never since the day I was born has the

I try but most people never listen, they're more interested in watching
Roseanne on TV.

>    flag of patriotism in my country been run up for any causes other than
>    the suppression of progressive dissent, the enforcement of obience to
>    establishment dictates, and the furtherance of brutal and selfish
>    overseas military adventures.
>
>       In short, American patriotism in our time does not mean love of
>    country:  it has come to mean lack of commitment to the common good,
>    unquestioning obedience to the chief executive, contempt for the
>    Constitution, and a satisfied smacking of lips over the piling up of
>    third world corpses.  That kind of patriotism deserves contempt, and the
>    people of the world know it.   

That's a bit brutal, not everyone (not even patriots) feel that way,
but you point is well taken.  There is a big problem, and people
have got to wake up.  This is not the US's world, this world belongs
to everyone in it.  Most Americans would never be able to look at
true world democracy in the eye because, ASIA taken as a whole would
own it, having enough of a majority to outnumber all other people
in the world,
>
>
>This kind of drivel is just plain nonsense.  If this country is so bad, then
>why are Hatians braving the open sea in leaky boats trying to get here?

Uhh, not that I don't agree with you to some extent, but how much do
those poor Haitians really know about US and world relations anyway?
How much does the avg. American really know?

>Why do people world wide clamor to get in?  The US is the most caring, 
>powerful, and concerned with other countries country in the history of
>the world.

I agree with you on this point.  At least a lot of people perceive
us to be that way.
>
>Vicious actions?  We sent people in to throw Hussain out of Kuwait, we
>gave Panama back to the freely elected leaders of that country, we were

We did those things, but that's not all that we were doing.  Not all
of what "we" do is good.

>praised for helping the people of Granada take back their country.  We pump
>so much foreign aid into countries (some of whom don't even really care
>about us) that we are going broke doing it.  We have helped the two

This is true and we should do this better to ensure equivocal
fairness in our foreign policy (Japan vs. US trade for example).

>major countries we fought in World War II become two of the greatest
>economic powers in the world.
>
>Nope, I have no qualms about being proud to be an American!

Don't fall so easily into sterotypes that really aren't clearly
defined.

I am proud of what America originally stood for.  Inalienable rights,
the right to bear arms and fight for your freedom, the right to
preserve freedom, freedom of speech, and so on.  I am also proud
of the role the US played in stabilizing the world East vs. West during
the cold war.  But, we need to start looking at the world differently
now.

--Rob