From: moskowit@tronsbox.UUCP (Len Moskowitz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: On Surpassing Einstein
Date: 7 Apr 92 13:12:44 GMT
Organization: Xanadu Enterprises Inc.

In article <1992Apr6.175610.8782@cs.uoregon.edu>
pdm@sisters.cs.uoregon.edu (peter d. mark) writes:

>the above exchange illustrates perfectly the schism between traditional
>religious jewish thinking (at least as put forth by hayim) and modern
>secular thought based on rational, scientific thought:
>
>human history, according to the religious view, is the history of
>forgetting.  at the revelation at sinai, the sages knew everything
>that was/is ever possible to know, and since then we have forgotten
>more and more, until now, when we practically know nothing.  knowledge 
>and understanding are not acquired through experimentation and discovery 
>or discussion and debate, but rather obtained from the sages of old who 
>were closer to prophesy and revelation.
>
>the modern scientific/humanistic mind takes the opposite viewpoint: the 
>course of human affairs is marked by the expansion of collective knowledge 
>by a spirit of free enquiry and open debate, and the application of human
>creativity, resourcefulness, and intelligence.  according to the secular
>humanist mindset, one has an obligation to decide moral questions according 
>to the dictates of one's own conscience rather than relying on authoritative 
>pronouncements of religious leaders, past or present.
>
>to the extent that hayim's pessimististic view represents the views of 
>orthodox judaism in general (does it?), i find it troubling.

I think that you misunderstand Hayim and the religious perspective in
general.  History is most emphatically not exclusively a process of
forgetting.  Rather it is simultaneously a process of extending our
knowledge and of distancing ourselves from the first hand experience
of Revelation.

Our knowledge of Torah can grow with each generation, and not just
with application to modern problems.  Note, for example, the well
known story of Moshe Rabbeinu (Moses) and Rabbi Akiva, who lived in
different eras.  It tells us that G-d allowed Moshe to "sit" in the back
row of Rabbi Akiva's shiyur (lecture) as he expounded on the mysteries
of the Tagin (the crowns upon the Ashurit-form letters of the Torah).
Moshe is seemingly unaware of the information that Rabbi Akiva is
teaching and in humility extols Rabbi Akiva's mastery.  Yet, at the
end of the lesson, to place everything in perspective, Rabbi Akiva
states that everything he taught was passed down from Moses at Sinai.

What's going on here?  If it was passed down from Moses how come Moses
himself didn't recognize it?  One answer is that Moses did not and
could not have taught literally everything that is in the Torah
because that knowledge is infinite.  What he taught, in addition to
the specific halachic rulings of his time, were the basic texts, their
key principles, and the method of expounding and researching -- this
is what is we intend when we invoke "halacha l'Moshe mi-Seenai."
Using Torah and the methods Moses transmitted to the elders and
thenceforth down through the generations to our sages today, we are
able to expand Torah knowledge in every generation.

Now who was greater, Moshe or Akiva?  Only a secular scholar would
argue that Akiva was greater because he derived something that Moses
hadn't.  Jews say that no one was greater (or more humble) than Moshe.

That's one side of the issue.

The other side is a little paradoxical: in every generation we are, at
the same time, further from Sinai (and its revelation) yet closer to
Messiah (and its reveleation).  In each generation we must depend more
and more on our ancestors' accounts of spirit, because we are unable
to witness for ourselves the giving of the Torah, to see the Shechinah
hovering over the Mishkan (Tabernacle), to see the thread of red turn
white each Yom Kippur in the Bet HaMikdash (the Holy Temple), to
witness the remnants of the luchot (the tablets of the ten
commandments) and the mon (manna) in the aron (the ark of the law), to
smell the ketoret (the incense) that permeated Jerusalem in the time
of the Temple, to hear the G-d's word through our prophets.  Yet even
so, it is we and not previous generations who may be worthy of
bringing, through our performance of mitzvot and proper actions, a new
age of G-d's revealed presence in the world.

So are we spiritually higher or lower than our ancestors?  Is our
knowledge of Torah growing or is it diminishing?  Are we getting
closer to G-d or further from G-d?

I suppose it depends how you look at it!
-- 


Len Moskowitz
moskowit@tronsbox.xei.com