HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jrjj@moscom.com (Jad Jordan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Justice Society #7
Date: 9 Jan 93 13:39:35 GMT
Organization: Moscom Corporation, Pittsford NY

In article <1993Jan8.222757.8256@netcom.com> dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:
>The letters page finally addresses the cancellation of JSA after issue 10.
>At the center of the explanation is the statement that "although the first
>book did considerably well, sales of subsequent issues began to fall
>substantially."  Word on the net was that the title was cancelled before
>anyone ever saw sales figures for the first issue.  If that is the case,
>then either the title was cancelled because dealers ordered fewer copies
>of issues two and three than they did of issue one, when the orders were
>solicited -- or the implication that the cancellation was motivated by
>poor sales is dishonest.
>
>I'd certainly keep reading this title...
>
>Next issue the Halls make a strange discovery in an Egyptian tomb.  What
>I'd like it to be is a picture of their grandson consorting with gargoyles.
>
You mean like Fury and Silver Scarab/Sandman's son? Cool. But, I was browsing
through this latest issue at the store and caught a female in a suit similar
to Johnny Quick. I thought she was to be the new Liberty Belle (I only read
the first issue.) The JSA's WhosWho page showed a male Johnny Quick, but made
no reference to him (and made reference to Starman, but didn't show him.) Can
you give me a little background info? THanks.

Jad R. J. Jordan	MOSCOM Corporation	Pittsford, NY	jrjj@moscom.com

	"I know you all remember Rick's predecessor Dave.  He fell asleep on a
glacier and froze to death.  But before Dave there was Glenn, and Glenn and his
Volvo took a wrong turn and ended up on a missile test range. And then there was
Bruce--victim of a terrible fishing acident. And then there was Harry. Remember
Harry?  He died when he was out ... uh ... um ... how was it?"
	"Picnic.  At a picnic."
	"Picnic.  Right.  Potato salad."

			The Curse of Maggie O'Connell. 
 	     Rick's eulogy after he was curshed by a satellite.
			     Northern Exposure
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: lsmith@deci.cs.umn.edu (Lance "Squiddie" Smith)
Subject: Re: Bill & Ted's Excellent Comic (was Da Big Slurp)
Organization: The Little Squids of the Poor
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 06:56:46 GMT

In article <+4zrs6#@lynx.unm.edu> lazlo@triton.unm.edu (Lazlo Nibble) writes:
>maguire@zappa.jpl.nasa.gov (Kevin Maguire) writes:
>
>> I can't comment on whether or not he got the Santos references right,  
>> since I don't have any idea who or what Santos is.  Help!
>
>It's not "Santos", it's *Santo*.  The silver-masked One True God of Mexican 
>Wrestling.  I'm not sure I'd trust Dan's assertion that Dorkin gets "gets 
>all his Santos [sic] references wrong", since Dan doesn't even know how the 
>guy spelled his name . . .

From the few Dorkin interviews that I have read, it seems like he does follow
wrestling, at least casually. Dunno how well he knows the Mexican stuff.
(I was raised on the AWA myself.) I'm not sure if this is a good or bad
thing.

So what was the movie where Santo fought some criminals who were using robots 
to rob banks? That was him, wasn't it?

---------------------------
 Lance "Cr2O3.2H2O" Smith | "Only as the screams and scratching slowly faded
   (lsmith@cs.umn.edu)    |  did we realize the horrible truth. The peanut had 
   If looks could kill    |  not been dead! We had accidentally vacuum-packed
   they probably will     |  him alive!"   _The Fall of the House of Planter_
From: lsmith@myria.cs.umn.edu (Lance "Squiddie" Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: SANDMAN: Collections and a FAQ List
Date: 12 Jan 93 20:19:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: myria.lsmith.726869976
Organization: University of Minnesota

Just to rehash some stuff that has been covered. The various story groups
are:

Partly stolen from Sandman #41

1-8 Preludes and Nocturnes (collected)
8-16 The Doll's House (collected)
17-20 Dream Country (collected)
21-28 Season of Mists (collected. Available in both TPB and Hardcover)
29-31 Distant Mirrors
32-37 A Game of You
38-40 Convergences
41-49 Brief Lives
50 (The long lost Distant Mirrors story)

Issues 29-31, 38-40, maybe 50 and maybe the Sandman Special will be collected. 
the working title is now Fables and Reflections. (Sounds a bit like Fables of
the Reconstruction/Reconstruction of the Fables, doesn't it?)

A collection of A Game of You is also in the works. I think the schedule of
collections is Game, Fables and then Brief Lives eventually. Plus there's
a TPB of Books of Magic due out in a couple of weeks. 

I was also talking to ElMorro National Monument and he suggested a Sandman
FAQ list. I can probably produce such a list and it might help to reduce some
of the Sandman/Gaiman clutter. Before I plow ahead, I'd like your opinions
on what to include. This is what I'm presently considering:

1) A list of issues, the people involved and the collection they do or will
   appear in. Also some info about what to expect in upcoming stories.

2) A pointer to the The Annotated Sandman and where they are archived.

3) Appearances by Sandman characters in other books.

4) A description of the previous three DC Sandman characters and the  
   connection to Dream/Morpheus.

5) A quick explanation of the origin of some of the recurring characters.
   I'd probably include: Matthew, Lucien, Cain and Abel, and some of the
   other Dream Support Staff. 

6) Something about Neil Gaiman's work outside of the series.

Any other suggestions? You can e-mail or post your suggestions. Try not
to suggest too much. I don't really want this to grow without bounds.

-----------------------------
  Lance "Cr2O3.2H2O" Smith  | "SandPeanut? HellGoober? Peanut Patrol? Is this
    (lsmith@cs.umn.edu)     |  some kind of a joke? I'm calling security! 
  Innovative!   Dangerous!  |  No, I have a better idea. You're going out the 
  Provocative!      Dizzy!  |  window!"         _Mr Peanut meets Karen Berger_
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: Andrew.Brooks@launchpad.unc.edu (Andrew Brooks)
Subject: Re: Best Death? (Was Re: Random thoughts on Supes)
Organization: UNC Office of Information Technology
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 02:07:55 GMT

In article <86376@ut-emx.uucp> cwagner@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Christian Wagner) writes:
>In article <1993Jan8.114128.13553@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jelmore@nyx.cs.du.edu (John Elmore) writes:
>>I'd have to say that Cypher's death in NEW MUTANTS was the best for two
>>reasons:
>>a) It wasn't a noble sacrifice or had any "special meaning". He got shot,
>>and died. Like that.
>>b) It's one of the few Marvel deaths THAT HAS STAYED #@!#$ING PERMANENT!
>
>And he was killed off for no good reason. I'm sorry, but the death of a major
>character should be for a -reason-, for dramatic purpose or to further a plot.
>Saying that him dying just 'like that' is a -good thing- is ridiculous on the
>face of it. 

People die, and most of the time it's not for any special reason.  That's
life.  Sure, a comic book ain't life, but having a character die for
no special polybagged reason adds realism.  That's one thing I like
about The 'Nam - it doesn't matter whether they're a fan fave or not,
sometimes people get killed - it's sad, but it's life.

Zoz

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: jjfink@skcla.monsanto.com
Subject: Re: Tempus Fugitive (was Re: The Big Marvel Slurp)
Organization: Searle, Skokie, IL
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 09:00:36 GMT

In article <5568@disuns2.epfl.ch>, SATELLITE@eldi.epfl.ch (Uncle Alias) writes:
> In <6060@comton.airs.com> ian@airs.com writes:
> 
>> jcowling@masque.UVic.CA (Scowling Jim Cowling) writes:
>> 
>> >On the other hand, I
>> >thought that TEMPUS FUGITIVE was CRAP CRAP CRAP.
>> 
>> Really?  I rather liked it.  I don't particularly like airplanes, but
>> Ken Steacy must like them a lot, and it was fun looking at him
>> enjoying himself.  The art was right out of The Gernsback Continuum.
> 
> 	I second you on that, Ian. Tempus Fugitive was IMHO a very good
> mini-serie, fast-paced and funny and all.
              ^^^^^^^^^^
> 	Of course, you had to like planes. And purple.

Fast paced?  Oh, the story, not the publishing schedule!
I'm surprised I forgot to list Ken Steacy in my fave artists when it was being
surveyed last year.

While I haven't liked his work on standard superheroes much (he gave Iron Man
corners -- ouch ouch ouch), his airbrushing is innovative and refreshing.  The
only other artist out today to use the airbrush to such a degree and show his
own distinctive style (in comics, that is) is Richard Corben.

Joel
-- 
jjfink@skcla.monsanto.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I want peace on earth, and goodwill towards man."
"We don't do that kind of thing, we're the United States Government!"
  -- from _Sneakers_
From: maguire@zappa.jpl.nasa.gov (Kevin Maguire)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: 7 Jan 93 22:53:55 GMT
Followup-To: rec.arts.comics.misc
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory

In article <1993Jan7.214412.5155@cc.umontreal.ca>, royd@ERE.UMontreal.CA
(Roy Daniel) wrote:
> 
> Wait! The Marvel Sandman already exists!
> 
> What do you make of Nightmare?!
> 
> He is white, skinny, and is the ruler of the dream dimension. Well, right,
> I know that Nightmare existed for far longer than Dream, but I very much doubt
> it was a ripoff from Gaiman.
> Even then, I would call it a major improvement, and I am understating.
> 

Let us all join hands and pray that Marvel's lawyers haven't seen this 
post, and are not at this very moment warming up their "best there is
at what we do" copyright-infringement squad.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Maguire                       No, not THAT Kevin Maguire
maguire@zappa.jpl.nasa.gov          I'm a rocket scientist, not an artist
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: cornwall@bach.udel.edu (Ray J Cornwall)
Subject: Re: Why Vertigo? Was: Marvel copies DC... again
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 21:48:35 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.145905.13727@schbbs.mot.com> Chagnon_A@msm.cdx.mot.com (Andrew Chagnon) writes:
>
>Given the discussion that last month Sandman was ranked #75 in sales and
>Hellblazer wasn't in the top 100, why is DC creating the Vertigo line?
>
>There doesn't seem to be a sound business reason to do it from my viewpoint.
>Are there a large number of 'mature audience' readers out there that DC is
>tapping into, or are they hoping to create a new market of Vertigo readers?
>
>Judging from the sales stats, it seems that market does not exist, and DC is
>hoping to create one. 
>
>Any thoughts?
Well, yeah...
I think your last point is dead-on. DC is trying to create this new
market. Why shouldn't they? Go to your local comic store. It's a
mostly male-dominated place. I still get a shock when I see a (gasp)
GIRL in the store (the last part of A Game Of You comes to mind).
Statistics show that comic readers are mostly young males. With DC's
Vertigo line, 100% testosterone-free, we may (hopefully) see a broader
market (no bad pun intended...). 
To further this point, I bring the example of my store. The Vertigo
preview was free to any female (guys still had to pay 75 cents...I
wasn't happy, but that's another tale). I asked the store owner, and
he said,"We need more women in this store." Point blank from a
somewhat successful comic store owner...
Ray
U of D

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: tyg@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Tom Galloway)
Subject: Re: Changes in the Atom (was re:JSA #7)
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 22:00:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.005151.10063@ac.dal.ca> ibanez@ac.dal.ca writes:
>1.When did the Atom get this 'atomic punch' or whatever power? He didn't have
>it in All Star Squadron when I was reading it. Did this happen in the later
>issues?

Yes and no. Circa 1946, Atom suddenly changed his costume and started 
exhibiting super-strength. Roy Thomas retconned an explanation for this
in All-Star Squadron by having Atom exposed to Cyclotron's radiation.
Presumably the radiation led to the super-strength four years later,
and Atom changed his costume to resemble Cyclotron's in appreciation.
Note that Cyclotron was a Thomas created character.

The atomic punch thing is one of the several "huh?"s in the book, along
with (off the top of my head), Starman's changing his cowl's color,
Badhnesians somehow all being totally absorbed into other cultures in
five years, Alan & Molly Scott's tv station relocating from LA to Gotham, 
etc. While I like the book a lot more than I expected to (and I do like it),
there's a somewhat sloppy feel to the fine details. On the plus side, it
does appear the Len S. paid attention to the near unanimous feeling on
Comics-L that the JSAers' supporting cast and family be seen and that
some indication of mourning for members who died while they were gone be
shown.

>2. When did he become a physicist? I always thought he was just an average
>joe who trained hard to become, essentially, another version of Wildcat.

He started his career as the Atom as a college student, and I don't know
if the Golden Age stories specified a major or not. However, probably
for parity with the Ray Palmer physicist Atom, in the team-ups with Ray
it was established that he was a physicist.

"Also, Mon-El can do pre-Byrne stunts like toss around stars, travel through
time, and generally defy physics even more than your usual comic character"
--Laura Burchard
tyg   tyg@hq.ileaf.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: jimh@pacdata.com (Jim Harkins)
Subject: CBG #1000
Organization: Pacific Data Products
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:31:51 GMT

So does anyone have a CBG #1000 I can read?  I put mine into an oversized mylar
bag, then sealed it into a nitrogen filled lead lined vault I built into my
basement.  I figure when I retire it will be worth more than my social security.
Hmm, kidding aside that mouldy old hunk of newsprint probably will be worth
more than social security by the time I retire :-(

jim

-- 
Plumbers Motto:  A flush beats a full house.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Harkins                         [ucsd|uunet]!pacdata!jim
Pacific Data Products               jim@pacdata.com
--------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: moriarty@tc.fluke.COM (The Napoleon of Crime)
Subject: Look for the Limey on the label (was: What if...)
Reply-To: moriarty@tc.fluke.COM (The Napoleon of Crime)
Organization: The Institute for Criminal Science, Gizmonics Control
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 07:03:15 GMT

In <1iero9INNdsa@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu> albert@chain.ssctr.bcm.tmc.edu (Rick Jones) writes:

>	According to rumors, spread by
>Neil G. himself that Marvel was ready to make a Sandman-ish comic, with
>a real Brit writer and stuff...

Which brings up the subject: supplies of authentic British comix writers
(or, at least, scribes from the U.K.) must be getting a bit strained,
particularly after all those Vertigo titles were concieved.  Just not enough
to go around, and DC had to make do with grisly substitutes at points (e.g.,
Ann Nocenti (sp?)).  Next thing you know, they'll be a controlled substance,
or be escorted by U.N. forces.

Well, I'm set at any rate; all my friends are anglophiles.

                           "Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are
                            subtle and will piss on your computer."
                                           -- Elisabeth Riba
----
                                        Moriarty, aka Jeff Meyer
INTERNET:     moriarty@tc.fluke.COM
Manual UUCP:  {uunet, uw-beaver, sun, microsoft}!fluke!moriarty
CREDO:        You gotta be Cruel to be Kind...
                 **>> Keep circulating the tapes <<**
From: jrd@frame.com (James Drew)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: DC: President at Superman's Funeral
Date: 7 Jan 1993 13:31:06 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

John Switzer (jrs@netcom.com) writes:

>What a collector's item those pages would be! I forgot to mention that the
>AP news story said that this issue was the first time since JFK's 
>administration that a living President was featured in a Superman comic book. 

That's just because when Kennedy showed up, Superman told him his secret
identity.  The President was assassinated the same month, *proving* that
knowledge of Superman's ID is dangerous information.

------------------------------
                             |     "What's that noise?" I asked Val.  "Sounds
Jim Drew                     | like an electric razor."
jrd@frame.com                |     "Ron's shaving," I was told.
(Furry: Randy Puritan)       |     "Shaving?  Ron?  The guy who thinks everyone
"Innocent, but not naive."   | would look better with a beard, even Madonna?"
B(2)h t c k s g+(p) rv p e   |     "Who said anything about shaving his
S8/5 g l+ y+ o+ a+ u++- j++  | *beard?*" Val said, and scratched idly at his
{opinions: mine != frame's}  | chest.
                             |		- Marc Lynx, "Awl's Fare"
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: dvandom@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dave Van Domelen)
Subject: Re: Marvel copies DC... again
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 15:31:23 GMT

In article <1ib71cINNb4i@matt.ksu.ksu.edu> lazarus@matt.ksu.ksu.edu writes:
>Marvel is CONTINUOUSLY introducing new chracters (as is DC), and not just
>in the annuals.  Speaking of annuals, current faves like Speedball, Psylocke
>(First US appearance), the New Warriors as a team... all were introduced
>in Marvel's annuals in the past, only without much fanfare.

BZZZT!  New Warriors was introed in a two part story in the good DeFalco issues
of Thor (#406 I think).  And yes, DeFalco did some great work on Thor, but he 
should have quit around #410 when he was ahead.
     Dave Van Domelen, 5/200 on a final isn't too good, is it?
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: jcowling@masque.UVic.CA (Scowling Jim Cowling)
Subject: Re: The Big Marvel Slurp (Was Re: Marvel Implosion Imminent?)
Organization: University of Victoria, Victoria, BC, Canada
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 93 08:04:28 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.073245.3315@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jelmore@nyx.cs.du.edu (John Elmore) writes:

>I wish Marvel would take its older readers more seriously; the only series
>I can think of that could truly be considered a "mature" title is
>CLIVE BARKER'S HELLRAISER. I think DC's mature titles is the one definite
>advantage it has over Marvel. That, and its willingness to publish things
>that are outside of the DC Universe (GRIFFIN and TEMPUS FUGITIVE are
>two good examples) that aren't striaght schlock--REN & STIMPY, KID-N-PLAY,
>CAPTAIN PLANET, and BILL AND TED'S EXCELLENT COMIC BOOK are examples of
>what I call schlock, REN & STIMPY's popularity notwithstanding.

Hmm.  Personally, I thought that BILL & TED'S was an incredible book, with much
of the flavour and insanity of Dorkin's other stuff.  On the other hand, I
thought that TEMPUS FUGITIVE was CRAP CRAP CRAP.

-------
Scowling Jim Cowling, Professional Evil Person
Creative Writing Department, University of Victoria (opinions disassociated)

GEnie:  J.COWLING	Internet:  jcowling@ophelia.UVic.CA
-------
From: Jason_Mulligan@camelot.apana.org.au (Jason Mulligan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Test
Distribution: world
Date: 30 Dec 92 15:15:32 EST
Organization: The TOWER BBS



 -- AEd V1.36f/EvaA

-- Via DLG Pro v0.992

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: Chagnon_A@msm.cdx.mot.com  (Andrew Chagnon)
Subject: Re: Why Vertigo? 
Organization: Motorola_Codex
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:09:07 GMT

>Beyond that, the mature titles may have more room for growth.  They
>are more likely to appeal to an older (30 something, baby boomers,
>etc.) crowd than the superhero dreck.  There is less competition
>for this market from the other major comics manufacturers.
>
Does anyone have any idea how big the market is? The fact that there is less
competition could mean that no one else thinks it's worth going after.

>I'm curious about sales on the Sandman TPB's.  The Science Fiction
>Book Club currently offers one of them (as well as several other
>DC TPBs).  I wonder if this indicates that a non-comics audience
>is showing some interest in such stuff.
>

Didn't one of the Sandman arcs win a Hugo award? (hence the tie-in) 

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: panda@Micor.OCUnix.on.ca (Elizabeth Holden)
Subject: Fantastic Four
Organization: M.B. Cormier INC.
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 93 07:54:05 EST

I think we are agreed that Tom DeFalco is doing an awful job writing the 
FF, with no end in sight.  

As an excercise in optimistic fantasy, who do you think should be writing 
it?  I woudl suggest:

(a) Peter David, who potentially has the right touch with 
characterization and whimsy that is so suited to the FF.  ANd just plain 
humour and sense of adventure.

(b) John Byrne.  He did it once.... *not* it greatest moments, but a darn 
sight better than anything we've seen since.

(c) Jim Owsley.  Is he just editing these days?

(d) William Messner-Loebs, who at his best is a superb writer.

(e) Jan Strnad, for the same reasons I cited Peter David.  What has 
happened to him, anyway?

(f) Tom & Mary Bierbaum.  I await flamethrowers.  (Susan, put up your 
force field!)

Namaste,
Elizabeth



Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: law10005@nusunix1.nus.sg (DEVINDRAN JEYATHURAI)
Subject: Re: Is IMAGE worth reading?
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 02:42:03 GMT

You actually like Dragon? The series with the admittedly goofy
fin-headed 7-foot tall hairy lizard playing a cross between Wolverine
and Punisher? Why? The three issue mini-series was no good - no coherent
plot, and it didn't seem to be anything but an extended setup for the
continuing series - I feel cheated. If it's a mini-series, it should be
able to be read by itself, and not merely be filler to force the reader
to buy the continuing series.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig)
Subject: Re: Cerebus
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 09:04:37 GMT

hinrichs@next.santafe.edu (bRant Hinrichs):
>although i really appreciate being able to catch up on Cerebus through the
>totally (in my opinion) cheap (price, not quality) reprints of the phone 
>books...i miss not having the covers reprinted as well

It's not that expensive:  You can get most of the biweekly reprints
at under cover price (typically fifty cents or a dollar, if you look),
and they have the covers reprinted -- though not full size.  That takes
you up to issue #80.  From #81 on, you can find most of the comics for
about a dollar each.  They certainly take up a lot more room than the
phonebooks, though...

-----
Dani Zweig
dani@netcom.com

   Aphorism is better than none.



Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc