HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dil@mace.cc.purdue.edu (Perry G Ramsey)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Full Course Yellows in F1 , plus a bonus flame of NASCAR
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:47:32 GMT
Organization: Purdue University, Department of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences

In article <kdsQice00Uh702oKsP@andrew.cmu.edu> cl3d+@andrew.cmu.edu (Carl D. Lovejoy) writes:
>			Andrew  Henry writes:
>[Why he thinks full course yellows should be used in F1]
>
>Local yellows are just fine, we don't need no stinkin' full course yellows!  

They're about the only thing interesting about F1.  Contrary to widely
held belief, the real race fan doens't need split second finishes to find
the race interesting.  Often the full course yellow kills what is shaping
up to be a good race by giving a car coming on at the end a free pass to
the front.  Instead of seeing #2 charging hard and #1 struggling to hang
on, we see #2 dash ahead after the yellow and stay out front.

I would rather see a close race than a 30 second interval, but I want to
see drivers EARN the right to stand in the winner's circle, not have it
handed to them by the technical committe or track officials.  (Ala Bill
Elliot at Atlanta.  Full course cautions as a gimick to make the
competition more interesting are a double edged sword.) The full
course yellow's purpose is to allow the track workers to clear a hazard in
safety.  The way it's used in NASCAR doesn't give the workers a chance
because there's always somebody trying to catch up with the pack after
spending 40 seconds in the pits banging on sheet metal, after which he'll
return to the pits for 40 more seconds.  Yellows also encourage the
nonsense that Mario Andretti pulled at Indy last year in order to get
Michael back to the front after he'd been waxed fair and square.

Rather than just whining, let me make some suggestions:

1.  Making the cars hold position and interval was tried at Indy at one
time, and it didn't work because it was too easy to cheat.  Perhaps with
electronic scoring, it could be made to work now.

2.  Two pace cars, that pick up the field at the leader and one-half lap
back.  That way, a driver would only get 1/2 a free lap per caution.  Or,
the cars could pick up the field at a particular point without regard to
who was leading.  For instance, the first car and the twentieth (or half
the field) to cross Start/Finish after the yellow goes out would be 
picked up by a pace car.  It really gripes me to see a good car work for
lap after lap to put someone down, only to have it reversed by a full
course caution.

Nomex undies installed.
-- 
Perry G. Ramsey         Department of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences
dil@mace.cc.purdue.edu  Purdue University, West Lafayette, IN USA
perryr@purccvm          This signature gives you specific legal rights.  You
N9LFF                   might have other rights that vary from state to state.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield)
Subject: Ford HB and Indy Cars
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 15:37:37 GMT

About the HB and the Ford Indycar engine:
     No, the engines are not the same; actually, they are quite different.
     The HB, only an F1 and WSC engine, is a 3.5 litre atmospheric engine
     while the XB, the Indycar engine, is a 2.66 litre turbo. The only
     similarities, I suppose, would be Cosworth engineering, and Ford money
     and electronics. Hope this helps you.
From: SASTZH@vm.sas.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: GOB Pick6 Future Plans
Date: 15 Apr 92 17:25:50 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.

Well folks, it appears that Dave Cornutt's SGI has cut a tar', blowed a engine,
and smacked the wall all at the same time! ;-)  The GOB Pick 6 is limping
along under a yellow flag, but we plan on going back to green in just a couple
laps. I've agreed to take over as driver of the Preparation-H, Pepto-Bismol,
GOB Pick 6 Ford Lumina. 8-)  The good news is that I have all the info/stats
from the first 4 races, the bad news is that Darlington and Bristol are
history. Dave has already forwarded the picks from North Wilkesboro and I      t
expect to have things up and running within a week.  Once I get the code
written and debugged I will post the results for N. Wilkesboro to RAS along
with a report showing the current standings after 5 races. This overall report
will contain the names of everyone who has entered at least one race. If anyone
doesn't want to participate anymore, and they don't want their name appearing
on this report on a weekly basis, please send me a message and I'll take care
of it. The format will remain unchanged, and the longshot list is the same for
the race at Martinsville on April 26th. I'll post my picks before qualifying
just like Dave did in the past.
Dave and I apppreciate everyone's patience and I hope y'all continue to
participate. If you have any questions please send a message to the following
e-mail address:
                  <sastzh@vm.sas.com>

P.S. This is the address where the picks should be send at well, thanks...

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Thomas Hahl           |           .------.         |
<sastzh@vm.sas.com>   |      ....'....!...'----/   | "People with tact have
"It's my opinion,     |    /'      12 raybestos:   |     less to retract"
 mine, mine, mine!"   |   :--( )------..-( )---    |      -Arnold H. Glasow
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: gbr@bisco.kodak.com (Bruce Rodgers)
Subject: Re: NASCAR: Chad Little released [ & Yarborough TRIVIA!]
Organization: Eastman Kodak
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 15:06:59 GMT

mclellan@maximillion.cp.mcc.com (David McLellan) writes:

>My Local newspaper carried a brief (two sentence item) stating that Cale 
>Yarborough had release Chad Little as his driver.  If anyone can confirm 
>or add any additional information to this, I would be interested.  I 
>think Bob Kehoe mentioned that Chad's father was also serving in some 
>capacity with this team.

After I posted my explanation as I knew it, David McLellan proposed a 
trivia question:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who are the "8 drivers including himself" (according to Bob Kehoe) that Cale
Yarborough has had since '88?

Bonus points for the sponsor at that time and the driver's longevity ("days" if
appropriate... :-)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Personal editorials....
No wonder most of the Racing Champions die-cast TropArtics have the name
"Cale Yarborough" on them...(except for this year and Chad's new colors)

Geez, Cale, it's not _exactly_ like calling a substitute teacher in for the 
day, y'know!!


We got all but 2 or 3 of the drivers, in the following trivia SPOILER:




Bruce's guesses:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, if so, here are the ones I know of (not exactly sure of order):

1. Cale Yarborough  (Hardees) '88 season  (partial)
2.
3.
4.
5. Lake Speed  (TropArtic)    '90? season
6. Dick Trickle  (TropArtic)  '91? season 
7. Randy LaJoie  (TropArtic)  end of '91 season (2 races?)
8. Chad Little  (TropArtic)   "only" 6 races  (boo, hiss)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

David's additions:
>
> I thought Dorsey Schroeder drove one race for him last year, but I'm not
> positive about that.  Or maybe even Chuck Bown.  I seem to recall the
> driver of the week for a few weeks before settling on Randy Lajoie.
> After Sunday, Bobby Hillin can be added to the list.  He is set to be
> Cale's next driver.

I guessed at Schroeder, but wouldn't have bet my next paycheck on it... -Bruce 

Cheers,
Bruce

   ***  If the From: line says nobody@kodak.com, don't believe it.  ***
                  ________                      
              , 'ChadLittle` .                     G.Bruce Rodgers
    ,\----- '                 `---- ____           Eastman Kodak Company
   / ?????????       ??       goodyear  <\         Rochester, NY 14653-5425
  |`____      ________________       _ ,- |        gbr@bisco.kodak.com
  ` ----`.__.'-----------------`.__.'-----'        rodgers@kodak.com

  "(-: The opinions, signatures, and pictures expressed herein are mine! :-)"
From: ldahlmey@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Lothar Dahlmeyer)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: First Union 400 (N.Wilkesboro NASCAR) results (short, SPOILER)
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:13:20 GMT
Article-I.D.: zia.1992Apr13.171320.1988
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Socorro NM

In article <12APR199215530201@zeus.tamu.edu> pmh2962@zeus.tamu.edu (Pat Hayes) writes:
>In article <12APR199215282202@zeus.tamu.edu>, pmh2962@zeus.tamu.edu (Pat Hayes) writes...
>>Howdy!
>....
>	<results follow>
>
>....
>>	Gant took over 2nd place in points thanks to Elliot's 20th.
>>Labonte continued his top-10 streak; I think he's third in points.
>                                                   ^^^^^ nope, 4th!
>>Kulwicki is fifth; forgot who's fourth?
>                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^....Labonte.
>
>Ha, sorry!  Forgot about BE -- a 20th doesn't drop him THAT far!
>WC Standings after today....
>	1.	Allison		**1129**
>	2.	Gant		**1043**
>	3.	Elliott		**1026**
>	4.	Labonte		**1013**
>	5.	Kulwicki	**1006**
>> 
>>	Later .....
>
>P.S. -- maybe Labonte will keep his GM mount <*g*>.
>
>Pat Hayes--Meteorology--TAMU  INT: pmh@tamu.edu  BIT: pmh2962@tamzeus *whoop*
>************************ standard disclaimer applies ************************


-- 
            /MMMMMMMMMMM\             | ldahlmey@zia.aoc.nrao.edu 
          {|  /\  ~  /\  |}           | Lothar Dahlmeyer  
______nnnn_|_|_@|   |_@|_|_nnnn_______| National Radio Astronomy Observatory
      UUUU       \_/       UUUU       | Socorro, New Mexico, 87801
From: wilson@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (David Wilson)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Winning and !winning (was Re: F1: Piquet)
Date: 15 Apr 92 17:37:35 GMT
Organization: Schlumberger CAD/CAM; Ann Arbor, Michigan (USA)

>Wrong again, the World Championship is the pinnacle, they only run races
>so they can crown a world champion. Back before Mansell started driving,
>Moss was known as the British driver who won the most races without 
>winning a championship - not exactley a positive thing to be known as. The
>problem with him and many other 'racers' is that when the car starts to
>degrade because of the flogging they have administered to it, they just
>keep driving as fast as they were like nothing was wrong. This
>both endangers themself as well as anybody who happens to be near them 
>when the motor blows and spills oil all over the track. A real racer
>would either pull over or try to nurse the car to the finish. In other
>words your definition of a racer is someone who wants to die a racer.
>
>George.

This discussion is getting a bit strange.  When you start referring to
Moss as being so stupid as to be a danger to anyone who happens to be
near, well...

My knowledge of Moss is only from books and bits of old film, as he
terminated his career five years before I started paying attention to
racing, but I certainly haven't gained the impression that he was an 
idiot who flogged cars until they broke.  I always took the fact that
he was the "uncrowned world champion" as the final proof that how many
championships a driver collects is very dependent on (1) who he is
racing against (e.g. Moss against Fangio), (2) the ever present racing
luck, and (3) making the right (in hindsight) choices of career moves.

Also, am I the only one frequently struck by how peculiar it is for
all of us, who spend our time with our butts parked in front of
computer screens, to be flaming even the lowliest of the guys with
the balls to be out there DOING it??

Just a thought.  Flame away.

Dave Wilson
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: deanb@pecan10.cray.com (Dean Barker)
Subject: NASCAR WC schedule
Originator: deanb@pecan10
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 14 Apr 92 12:46:58 CDT



		1992 NASCAR Winston Cup Schedule

DATE	SITE			WINNER/TV		PTS. LEADER
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2/8	Busch Clash (Daytona)	G. Bodine		-----------
2/16 	Daytona, FL		D. Allison		D. Allison (+10)
3/1	Rockingham, NC		B. Elliott		D. Allison (+56)
3/8	Richmond, VA		B. Elliott		D. Allison (+63)
3/15	Atlanta, GA		B. Elliott		D. Allison (+58)
3/29	Darlington, SC		B. Elliott		D. Allison (+48)
4/5	Bristol, TN		A. Kulwicki		D. Allison (+29)
4/12	North Wilkesboro, NC	D. Allison		D. Allison (+86)
4/26	Martinsville, VA	ESPN-TD
5/3	Talladega, AL		ESPN-L
5/16	The Winston (Charlotte)	TNN-L
5/24	Charlotte, NC		TBS-L
5/31	Dover, DE		TNN-L
6/7	Sears Point, CA		ESPN-L
6/14	Pocono, PA		ESPN-L
6/21	Brooklyn, MI		CBS-L
7/4	Daytona, FL		ESPN-L
7/19	Pocono, PA		ESPN-L
7/26	Talladega, AL		CBS-L
8/9	Watkins Glen, NY	ESPN-L
8/16	Brooklyn, MI		ESPN-L
8/29	Bristol, TN		ESPN-L
9/6	Darlington, SC		ESPN-L	
9/12	Richmond, VA		TBS-L
9/20	Dover, DE		TNN-L
9/27	Martinsville, VA	ESPN-L
10/4	North Wilkesboro, NC	ESPN-L
10/11	Charlotte, NC		TBS-L
10/25	Rockingham, NC		TNN-L
11/1	Phoenix, AZ		TNN-L
11/15	Atlanta, GA		ESPN-L
From: donb@pdx.csd.mot.com (Don Bolton)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: SCCA flagging, whites
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:12:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: pdxvme.1108
Reply-To: donb@pdx.csd.mot.com (Don Bolton)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Motorola CSD, Beaverton, OR

In article <1992Apr8.180705.8631@cabot.balltown.cma.COM> welty@balltown.cma.com (richard welty) writes:
>i'm planning to start working corners at some SCCA events this summer,
>as a way of being involved while i'm putting an ITB project together.
>anyway, i have no idea what a good source of proper clothing for corner
>working is; can any of the flaggers out there give me a pointer?
>
Most folk roun dese parts wear some white pants and tee-shirts. Me, I'm
weird, so I wear coveralls, they allow for layering (hooded jersey sweat-
shirts for those cold driver schools) underneath. Repel most of the water
from Oregon's native sunshine condition. THeir disadvantage is when one
has to go SIT in one of them there non-sani cans :-( best to leave em out-
side by the door:-)

Uniform supply houses usually carry them, get the 100% cotton ones and
remember they SHRINK to fit. THe cotton poly blends are OK until you get
in a fire situation. Synthetic fabrics melt to a dripping ooze that you
in NO way want on your skin. It really helps to be aware of the flammable
state of the items you are wearing. Not an everyday requirement, but....

Coveralls do give you lots of pocket space, a 12 to 16 oz beer mug slides
in the back pocket real fine. saves a balancing act when in the afore
mentioned un-sani can.:-)

Other tips.. A whistle, hey we've tried going without one but its damn
hard to keep that little ball in your mouth. Replace the lanyard with
someting that teminates on a clip (like a company security pass clip) that
way if it gets caught up in a car that takes off it goes with, and leaves
your neck intact. I just clip mine to my collar.

Annother usefull item is a 5 gal plastic bucket with lid. Makes a great
field seat, and waterproof storage for additional clothing, etc. These
are best gotten from a bakery as they have been filled with pie filling
and smell nice. The ones from the burger joints take months to get rid
of the pickle smell.

Make your choice of shoes something you can tolerate standing ALL DAY in.
Hi-top tennies are my preference, the ankle support can be helpful.

A hat that keeps the sun off your ears and neck is nice too, I have one
of those solar fan, pith helmets thats been the ONLY thing I'll wear in
the summer, ball caps = sunburn, (your mileage may vary).


Don "neato, cars that go <CRUNCH>" Bolton
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: Tim Dudley
Subject: Eurosport's Mystery Voice
Organization: Bell-Northern Research
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 12:21:41 GMT

Had a look at the Brazilian GP tape again last night, to try to
find out who John Watson's cohort is - couldn't quite get the
name, but it sounds like Allard Kalp ? Alec Kalf?

This ring a bell with anyone?

Tim
From: hulda@anasaz (Hulda R. Dent)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Long Beach IndyCar comments
Date: 14 Apr 92 22:18:17 GMT
Organization: Anasazi, Inc. Phoenix, AZ, USA

In article <johnl.2231@amiganet.chi.il.us>, johnl@amiganet.chi.il.us (John Liskey) writes:
> Good to see Danny win again.

  Yeah...but not at the expense of Little Al!  I too would like
  to know what comments were made back at the pits after the race...
  These two guys are class acts, however, and wouldn't stoop to
  the Mario level by blaming someone else.

  Speaking of Mario and his first lap (which oddly enough looked
  like other scenes from his past), is his eyesight going....
  What a jerk!

  Hubba (no .sig yet)
From: dafuller@sequent.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Full Course Yellows in F1 Was Re: Mclaren Throttle/Ron Dennis
Keywords: RON DENNIS BITES DOBERMAN
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:26:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Apr7.182613.26802
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.

Don't forget that one of the reasons the IndyCars go full course quickly
is due to the Andretti axis, where Mario plowed into a safety truck and
Micheal crashed soon thereafter.  Even though the yellow was displayed and
the corner workers motioning INSIDE, INSIDE.  Fittipaldi, Sullivan, et al
didn't seem to have any problems negotiating the incident; so now IndyCar
goes full course at the drop of a hat.

-- 
Dave Fuller		 	All opinions expressed are my own and not
Sequent Computer Systems	those of Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
dafuller@sequent.com
From: thos@suite.sw.oz.au (Thomas Cohen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Senna bashing
Date: 10 Apr 92 01:14:40 GMT
Organization: Softway Pty Ltd

In <1992Apr6.220854.23166@sequent.com> dafuller@sequent.com writes:

>In article <34978@nntpd.lkg.dec.com> mcculley@racy.zko.dec.com (Bruce McCulley) writes:
>>
>>In article <mferrare.702533571@adelphi>,
>> mferrare@physics.adelaide.edu.au (Mark Ferraretto) writes:
>> 
>>|> As we all bitch about the greatest driver of all time - how about the 
>>|> greatest team of all time?  
>>

>The greatest teams of all time are probably the pre-war Auto Union team,
>who completely blew everyone away with their cars and technology, and the
>post-war Mercedes team which was similarly spectacular.  The Auto Union
>supercharged V16s were rear drive and they turned amazing revs.
			     ^^^^^
Actually they all were rear drive, but the Auto Unions were mid-engined
(wheels behind engine, rather than rear-engined, with engine behind
rear wheels) which was unusual.

The Silver Arrows, notably the Auto Unions, didn't really turn
amazing revs. And in fact by even immediately post-war standards
their power/capacity was not that high - witness,

W125 - 5.6 litre straight eight, supercharged,
running on benzene/methanol ~640bhp @ 6000 rpm

Auto Union C (?) type, 6 litre+ V12, about 520-560 bhp.

Sure they were way ahead of the competition, and trying to
control that sort of power on 6" pre-war rubber was, perhaps,
futile, but in absolute engineering terms they aren't that
hot.

On the balance of things between the teams, I would have given 
the guernsey to the Mercedes team, who won most years
apart from dropping the ball in 1935.

>Dave Fuller		 	All opinions expressed are my own and not
-- 
thos cohen  				       |Softway Pty Ltd
 The best way to make a Japanese engineer wince|ACSnet:         thos@softway.oz
 is (when talking about an NSX) to say slowly  |UUCP: ...!uunet!softway.oz!thos
 'but its _not a Ferrari_ is it?' R.Bulgin, CAR|Internet:    thos@softway.oz.au
From: usatoday@daimi.aau.dk (Peter Dalsgaard)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Ford HB V8 and Indy Cars
Date: 13 Apr 92 08:42:39 GMT
Organization: DAIMI: Computer Science Department, Aarhus University, Denmark

Hi !

I just wondered. Is it the Ford HB V8 engine that Michael
and Mario are using in their Lolas this season ??. If so,
is it the same as the Benetton Teams, or is it modified ??.

--
   *** Peter Dalsgaard               ***  
   *** usatoday@daimi.aau.dk         *** 
   *** University of Aarhus, Denmark ***
   *** Only Amiga makes it possible  ***
From: roberto@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Roberto S. M. Barros)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Senna bashing
Date: 9 Apr 92 13:09:47 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.
X-Mailer: mail-news 2.0.5

Thomas Cohen writes:

| Personally, I think you've got this arse-about. Mansell and Senna
| would be toe to toe, and Prost, Berger & Schumacher would be very
| close behind (actually, maybe Schumacher would be with Mansell and
| Senna.)

My intention was to talk about winning the championship not races.
Mansell is very fast but, when under pressure, makes many mistakes 
and breaks his car more than the other top drivers.

| There is certainly no way that Piquet would be faster than Mansell,
| remember when they were at Williams together? Mansell was faster &
| won more GPs, which was a bit of a shock to Piquet.

Yes, he won more GPs than all the others in 86 and 87. 
But, Prost was the champion in 86 (with inferior equipment) and Piquet
in 87 (with the same equipment), even though they could discard the 
5 worst results. If you use today's rules, the difference would be 
much bigger.

| When the red mist descends, Mansell always seems to be able to gain on
| anyone, even in not-quite-competitive machinery. (remember his 2nd place
| in the Williams-Judd at Silverstone 1988?).
 
Remember. But this race was in his home circuit and in rainy conditions. 
In this cases the differences between different equipments tend to be 
reduced to very little. Remember Monaco 84? 

If one race only is enough to claim a whole truth, then I could claim 
Piquet beat Mansell, Prost and Berger using an inferior Benetton in 
the 1990 Australian GP! 

| Actually, as you think about it, Piquet has never really shone in a
| team with a fast team-mate. At Brabham he was virtually alone for
| many years, and thus the focus of the team's effort. At Williams he
| was shown up by Mansell, at Benetton he was OK, but as soon as
| Schumacher came along he was shown up again. Apart from his glory
| days with Brabham-BMW (not forgetting that he had a couple of hundred
| Hp more than anyone else), he really hasn't shown up that highly.

I don't think you are being fair here. Although Piquet did not have 
a competitive team mate in his Brabham days, his car was never the 
best either.

In 81, the best car was the Williams of Jones and Reutmann. But the team 
failed to decide which of the drivers would be n.1 (as in 86) and lost 
the championship. 

In 83, the championship was very very close between 3 teams and was only 
decided in the last race. More than that, the most powerful engine was 
Prost's Renault (the only turbo), remember? 

Finally, don't forget last year, when Mansell had the best car for at 
least 2/3 of the season and (paraphrasing James Hunt) a team-mate one 
"usually can only dream of", but failed to win the championship again. 

| --
| thos cohen   

Roberto Barros