From: hasn@midway.uchicago.edu (Sheheryar Hasnain)
Subject: Re: This "PC" stuff
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 14:39:41 GMT


> 
DS: 	If that verbal-type KKK member works with you, you are free to give
> >a counter-speech to him at every opportunity.  Your choice lies in either
> >listening to him, countering him, leaving, or kicking him in the gonads.
> >All are responses to the situation, though you will pay a penalty for
> >exercising the last two options.  That I used to work with a very vocal
> >vegetarian did not require my leaving.  When she waxed on about the pain
> >and suffering, racing heartbeat and slow death of the cow that comprised
> >my lunch that day I merely said, "Keep talking -- it tastes better already."
> >The next day, the same treatment.  My answer, "Look, you can eat the rabbit
> >food, and I'll eat the rabbit, and we'll get along.  Otherwise, I can see
> >where a perfectly good working relationship will end simply because I don't
> >agree with your dietary views.  If that's what you want, fine.  I don't care
> >to have that happen, but I also don't care to hear your speeches."  The
> >situation was resolved then, and we agreed to disagree.  I cannot help but
> >think that that her rights to free speech are worth more than my wish to not
> >hear countering views, and that's the heart of this discussion.
> 
> LJF: This situation worked since your coworker, although rather rude to
> begin with, behaved civilly in the end.  You agreed to disagree.
> That's how one of my officemates, who is very anti-choice, and I, who
> am very pro-choice, worked out our differences.  Of course, despite
> our political differences, we like each other, so that makes it
> simpler.  
> 
> Let's say that you're Jewish and known to be Jewish and you work with
> a member of the KKK.  S/he is not content with being known to belong
> to the KKK and do its work outside of the office.  S/he talks to you
> nearly every day about how Jews are inferior, how about Hitler did
> have the right idea, about what the US will be like when ZOG is
> removed from power and all Jews are in camps.  This person leaves KKK
> literature on your desk.  This isn't harassment?  I think it is.
> 
> It doesn't bother me if a classmate or coworker belongs to Operation
> Rescue, the KKK, Aryan Nation, the ACLU, MADD, etc.  But if I get
> repeated remarks that I'm a baby-killer, or a "mud person" or an
> "undesirable," etc., that's harassment.  That, imo, has gone way
> beyond the realm of free speech.
> 
> I see a big difference between having a discussion with someone and
> s/he says, "I think anyone who is for abortion is a baby killer."  and
> the same person repeatedly calling me a baby-killer.  The person has
> the right to her/his opinion, but not expressed to the point I'm
> feeling harassed.
> 
> 
>SH:  Seconded.  And in addition all speech isn't free regardless of the 
first amendment. For eg. treasonous (sp?) speech is illegal.  Also I tend
to distinguish between expressing an opinion and instilling hate in people
(hey, advertising works).  An opinion contributes to a discussion whereas
KKK propoganda does not.  It has nothing to contribute to society but
that of further dividing it. Some people argue that leftists also display
such hate towards capitalism and capitalists so it really isn't any different.
There is a difference.  Leftists don't go around rousing up crowds to go 
kill or beat up capitalists or republicans.  Its this hate element thats
really distructive.  Its one thing if someone starts shouting about how
much he/she hates ice cream (an opinion) but its quite a different thing for
someone to shout out about how people of color have tainted our society and
instill in people anger and hatred towards them.