From: dant@logos.wr.tek.com (Dan Tilque)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Miles Vorkosigan
Keywords: bujold
Date: 13 Apr 92 08:22:56 GMT
Organization: Upper Left Coast Liberation Army

emma@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Emma Pease) writes:
>With all the discussion of Miles, I decided to pin some things down.

I did the same thing.  It's kind of fun, but also frustrating.

[family tree deleted for brevity]

>From Brother in Arms and
>Barrayar it is known that the eldest son takes the paternal and
>maternal grandfathers' first names (Miles is an exception since his
>paternal grandfather refused to allow his name to be given).  Also the
>second son takes the maternal and paternal grandfathers' second names
>(in that order).   Question: Why isn't Gregor called Ezar then? 

Perhaps the Vorbarras are exempt from the rule, although this doesn't
seem likely.  There's a certain streak of equality among the Counts and
the Vorbarras have a Countship as well as the Imperium.

Also, it's possible that Gregor had an older brother who died while
very young.  I don't think that was ever ruled out.  (We'll ignore the
most likely answer--Bujold screwed up--as being outside the scope of
this discussion.)

>Inheritance: The line for the throne (allowing for inheritance through
>women) is Aral -> Miles -> Ivan.  The line for Count Vorkosigan is
>also Aral -> Miles -> Ivan; however, one would think the inheritance
>would go to blood relations of Piotr Vorkosigan not to the grandson of
>his wife's youngest sister.

Perhaps he has none or they're so distant that the relationships just
don't matter.  Cordellia notes that the only relatives of Aral are
Padma and Alys.  Of course, she failed to count the Vorbarras, but
they're more distant than the Vorpatrils.

>Also in "Shards of Honor" Ezar mentions there are 5 people with a
>better right to the throne by blood and law than him.  Aral Vorkosigan
>and Padma Vorpatril are two, but, who are the other three.  

Vordarian was one.  In _Barrayar_, there's mention of his preoccupation
with lines of inheritance, although no details were ever produced.

I think that some of the heirs not on the known family tree are from an
uncle of Dorca.  Remember, Dorca inherited through his mother and there
are probably those who do not accept Salic descent.

>In "Vor
>Game" it is mentioned that there are 6 potential heirs to the throne.  

I'm not sure that the references in Vor Game can be taken as being
completely accurate.  If I remember, they were mainly made to confuse
Cavilo with extraneous information.  A certain amount of exaggeration
might be expected in this situation.

>5. Prince Xav had at least two daughters and a son killed by Yuri.

This confused me.  Somewhere it says that Xav had only daughters.  But
it also says that Aral saw both his mother and uncle killed in the
massacre.  It could be that it was a brother of Piotr, but then one
would expect him to be buried in the Vorkosigan plot.

>7. I suspect though cannot prove that there are other children between
>Xav and Ezar. 

It certainly is possible.

>
>Time line.  I'm taking the death of Emperor Ezar as point 0.
>
>-80 - Recontact with the rest of humanity
>    - Piotr born.  Ezar mentions that he was Piotr's apprentice in the
>      Cetagandean invasion.  Elsewhere it is stated that they were
>      contemporaries.  Conclusion: they are near in age but Piotr is a
>      bit older.

Somewhere I worked out that Piotr was about eight or ten years younger
than Ezar.  Ezar was 77 when he died.  Seventeen years later, Piotr
died.  I think it said that he was in his mid eighties at death.  Ezar,
if still alive, would have been about 94.


>    - Cetagandean invasion and first war with the Cetagandean Empire.
>      Probably took place between 10 and 20 years after recontact.

I thought the war started only a few years after recontact and lasted
about 20 years.

>    - Komarr invasion

The Komarr invasion was about -4 or -5 on your timeline.

>    - 3rd Cetagandan War (When was the 2nd?)

My guess is that the 2nd was before the Komarr invasion.

---
Dan Tilque	--	dant@logos.WR.TEK.COM