HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jgostin@mal-s1.gatech.edu (Jill Gostin)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: vinegar pie
Date: 19 Nov 92 13:52:32 GMT
Organization: Georgia Tech Res. Inst., Modeling & Analysis Lab

>>In article <1992Nov18.183026.28056@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> 
>lrellick@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Lorraine M Rellick) writes:
>
>>>Dear Netters, while reading "Little House in the Big Woods" (L.I. Wilder)
>>>to my children, we came across a reference to "vinegar pie".  Anyone
>>>have a clue what this might be?


Go to a bookstore and get "The Little House Cookbook". It's
a cookbook containing recipes for many of the foods mentioned
in the L.I. Wilder books.

The recipes tried to stay "authentic" to the time period, but
they also make recommendations for substitutions with readily
available products.

It's a neat book, you're kids will like it.

Jill

-- 
Jill Butterfield Gostin                EMAIL: jgostin@mal-s1.gatech.edu
Georgia Institute of Technology, GTRI Modeling and Analysis Lab
"Happiness is excitement that has found a settling down place..."
-E.L. Konigsburg, _From the Mixed-up Files of Mrs. Basil E. Frankweiler_
From: jane@soave.swdc.stratus.com (Jane Beckman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: 'Pioneer sugar'?
Date: 20 Nov 92 00:36:03 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc., San Jose, CA


>|There is a sweetener out there
>|which is called 'pioneer sugar,' and was evidently made by the early
>|pioneers in their treks across the great 'wilderness.' What is it? The
>|package doesn't say, and I've got a soy- and corn-intolerant friend
>|who's wondering if she has to worry about eating the stuff.

This confuses me a bit.  "Made" by pioneers "during" their
treks?  Harvested, I can believe, but "made" is something
entirely different, especially considering the effort required
in refining the raw materials enough to get something
sugarlike.  Which pioneers?  What wilderness?

I gather this is a commercial product, and all of the above
are package claims.  I would be highly suspicious.  Sounds
like it might be either a fancy way of saying "maple sugar" or
skewed enough to have beet sugar or sorghum qualify.

I sort of doubt that it's the sugar that most of the exploring
parties used, in the early Western expeditions.  That was PINE
sugar.  You've heard of sugar pines?  If you tap the inner
bark, you get a resinous sugar, which also forms up in
globules on the tree, due to insect damage and various
injuries.  Both the natives and early expeditions used it.  It
was mentioned in the journals of the Emmons Party, an outrider
party with the Wilkes Geological Expedition, who crossed the
Siskyous from Oregon to California in 1841, coming down the
upper Sacramento Valley to Sutter's Fort and thence to the
coast (where they rendezvoused with the shipboard contingent
of the Wilkes Expedition).  They mentioned that due to the
resins in the sugar, it made a pretty weird coffee sweetening.


--
  Jilara   [jane@swdc.stratus.com]

"The field of pseudo-science hasn't progressed much in ten
years, except to gain access to the net." --from ca.earthquakes
From: jsanders@phys.ksu.edu (Justin M. Sanders)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: 'Pioneer sugar'?
Date: 17 Nov 1992 22:39:11 GMT
Organization: Department of Physics, Kansas State University, Manhattan KS, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: bohr.phys.ksu.edu

In article <1992Nov17.111602.23330@hemlock.cray.com> dadams@cray.com writes:

[Speculating on what might be meant by "pioneer sugar"]
>
>Let me venture a guess:
>
>	sourgum?

This is not a spelling flame, but rather an attempt at clarification:

Do you mean "sorghum"?  Or is there really something sweet called 
"sourgum"?

--
Justin M. Sanders    
Dept. of Physics     "I could not fail to disagree with you less."
Kansas State Univ.                           -- Gabriel Weinreich
From: jane@soave.swdc.stratus.com (Jane Beckman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: HERBALISM (sort of, maybe): Vodka
Keywords: hic!
Date: 17 Nov 92 01:40:00 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc., San Jose, CA

Whiskey in a spoon, like cough syrup?  So what's so quaintly
'30's about that?  I was raised on cough syrup of whiskey
mixed 50/50 with honey.  Seemed to do pretty well.

On the other hand, there were folks who drank strange things
for the alcohol, back during Prohibition.  According to my
mother, vanilla extract was really popular.  By the bottle,
not by the spoonful!

Anyone want to start Prohibition stories?
--
  Jilara   [jane@swdc.stratus.com]

"The field of pseudo-science hasn't progressed much in ten
years, except to gain access to the net." --from ca.earthquakes
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: bobw@csg.uwaterloo.ca (Bob Wildfong)
Subject: Re: Victorian kitchen
Keywords: oysters kitchens 
Organization: Computer Systems Group, University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 18:10:06 GMT

In article <BxtpA2.JzD@sdf.lonestar.org> jtrimble@sdf.lonestar.org (John Trimble) writes:
>Seeking reccomendations of books on English kitchen practices and cooking
>with information that would have been current from about 1850 to 1900.
>We are interested in class distinctions, foods, hygiene, layout of 
>kitchen, utensils, everything that was likely to be found or to occur
>in a kitchen of that time in London.  We are particularly interested
>in the treatment of oysters and ordinary to sophisticated knowledge of 
>them at that time. 
>Many thanks.
>jtrimble@sdf.lonestar.org
>

The BBC produced an excellent series of documentaries last year (?) called
"The Victorian Kitchen".  This series has been shown on Ontario public TV,
and will probably show up on PBS, if it hasn't already.

My spider-sense tells me that there just might be a companion book by the
same name.  If so, it's likely just the thing.


Bob Wildfong                                       bobw@csg.uwaterloo.ca
Waterloo, Ontario                                  bobw@csg.waterloo.edu
From: jane@soave.swdc.stratus.com (Jane Beckman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: HERBALISM:  Horehound
Date: 18 Nov 92 01:40:32 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc., San Jose, CA

Horehound candy is an acquired taste.  I love the stuff, but
then, I'm a little weird.  I kind of like tansy in omlets,
too.  Hauntingly horrible stuff...

Remember that horehound is medicinal, and medicine is
*supposed* to taste bad!  ;-)  However, also remember that one
often needs a LOT of sugar/honey/sweetening added to make some
herbs even vaguely palatable.  

Friend had awful sinus problems, once.  I steered her to my
favorite (very effective) remedy: yerba santa tea.  I'm not
sure if she ever forgave me.  "But it DID clear your
sinuses..." I pointed out.  "Yes, but it was like drinking
Vick's Vap-o-rub!"  Sheesh, some folks want everything...
--
  Jilara   [jane@swdc.stratus.com]

"The field of pseudo-science hasn't progressed much in ten
years, except to gain access to the net." --from ca.earthquakes
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: dadams@cray.com (David Adams)
Subject: Re: "Cole" flour
Reply-To: dadams@cray.com
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 23 Nov 92 14:46:05 CST


 claird@NeoSoft.com (Cameron Laird) writes:

|
|I've simplified the story.  There are co-factors in
|the absorption of niacin, there's a sub-plot about
|the protein quality of corn, there is research on the
|chemistry that remains to be done, and there's plenty
|of social history.  If we decide to discuss this more,
|we probably should cross-post to sci.bio or some other
|appropriate groups.
|-- 


Yes!  Please discuss this some more!  Also include any more
information on ash washing.  I harvested a good bit of Astec
corn this year and am wondering how to process it.  I ground
some to flour and it didn't tast right.  Are there any safty
considerations I need to worry about with ash washing?

---
--David C. Adams  Statistician  Cray Research Inc.  dadams@cray.com
___________________________________________________________________
       Old Sourdoughs never die.  They just ferment away.
From: msr7@po.CWRU.Edu (Mark S. Rzeszotarski)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Trenchers
Date: 22 Nov 1992 05:03:31 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


        I am looking for information about "trenchers",
a flat bread popular in medieval times.  Any references,
history or recipes would be appreciated.
-- 
Mark S. Rzeszotarski, Ph.D. (msr7@po.cwru.edu) CWRU Biomed. Eng.
Medical Physicist, The Mt. Sinai Medical Center, Cleveland, OH, USA
"So long and thanks for all the Saccharomyces Exiguus!"
From: tip@lead.aichem.arizona.edu (Tom Perigrin)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Trenchers
Date: 24 Nov 92 03:15:12 GMT
Distribution: usa, world
Organization: University of Arizona UNIX Users Group


>>         I am looking for information about "trenchers",
>> a flat bread popular in medieval times.  Any references,

Try finding the book "Dining with William Shakespear"  The book talks
about the different classes of breads, from Manchet to Trenchers.  I know
it has recipies for manchet, I _think_ it has trencher recipies.

On a different topic, we were discussing native american foods at dinner
tonight, and the topic of cooked lizard came up (as nearly did one sensitive
diners dinner, but thats another topic again).   Anybody have any
good recipies for lizard?  Are all lizards edible?  Do the species taste 
more  or less the same?  We have thousands of Chuckawalla on our property
(in the summer).  Anybody got a recipie for "chuck steak" ??
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: sbloch@silver.cs.umanitoba.ca (Stephen Bloch)
Subject: Re: HERBALISM (sort of, maybe):  Vodka
Keywords: hic!
Organization: Computer Science Dept., University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:18:33 GMT

julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas) writes:
> many people I talked to swore about drinking vodka to stop a cold.  
> The story is that as soon as you feel yourself coming down with a 
> cold, you should drink a small amount of vodka (about a medium shot 
> glass' worth) and you won't catch the cold.
> 
> Anyone else hear about alchohol being used this way?  I would think
> that in order to get a high enough concentration of alchohol in 
> your bloodstream to kill the bacteria you would pretty well do
> yourself in too...

Hold it.  A cold is viral, not bacterial, which actually has something to
do with why this (and Epsom salts, and chicken soup) work.
My highschool Chemistry teacher always told us the reason people gargled
with Epsom salts and drank salty chicken soup for colds is because the
salt concentration dehydrates and kills the surface layer of cells in your
throat by osmosis, and that's where the viruses live.  I would expect
highly-concentrated alcohol to have exactly the same effect.

Disclaimer: I'm not medically trained, nor have I even taken Chemistry
since that particular class eleven years ago.

Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: georgerj@rtsg.mot.com (Richard J. George)
Subject: Re: HERBALISM (sort of, maybe): Vodka
Keywords: hic!
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Distribution: general
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 07:50:01 GMT

julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas) writes:


>Well, I know that herbalism is covered under the guidelines, but
>what about medicinal uses of vodka?

When I was a student we use to drink vodka and fresh orange juice or
Scotch, honey and lemon warm to cure colds (honest - nothing at all 
to do with getting drunk so you wouldn't notice you were ill!)

Regards, Richard
From: hwt@bcarh11a.BNR.CA (Henry Troup)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Date: 17 Nov 92 13:53:36 GMT
Reply-To: Henry.Troup@BNR.CA
Distribution: world
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada

In article <92314.175420SCG107@psuvm.psu.edu>, SCG107@psuvm.psu.edu writes:

|>My guess is that because trees growing in the city are already
stressed because
|>of the less than ideal growing conditions, tapping them would hurt them too
|>much (it is hard on the tree, after all.)

|>Perhaps because in the Northern Hemisphere the south side gets the most
|>sunlight and is warmest, so the sap is flowing better?? (And the north side
|>is coolest, so the moss grows best there. :-) )

Absolutely!  (Not a botanist, but I can tell a maple from an ironwood.)

Aside: there's an ironwood (hornbeam) in our sugar bush.  Every now and
again - about every third year - someone will try to tap it.  It's very
hard wood.  Usually they give up...
                             
Henry Troup - H.Troup@BNR.CA (Canada) - BNR owns but does not share my opinions
	     Only twelve more shopping days 'till St. Andrew's Day!
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: rferris@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Rebecca R Ferris)
Subject: Re: 'Pioneer sugar'?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 13:51:33 GMT

i know there is a sugar manufactturer here in Ohio whose name is
Pioneer Sugar.  it's product is  beet sugar.  and the bag has (i think)
a little pioneer-type wagon on i it!  can you doubt its authenticity?
From: ubacw00@ucl.ac.uk (Mick Farmer)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: London - Last Days of the Raj
Date: 18 Nov 92 18:18:54 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Bloomsbury Computing Consortium

Hi,

This restaurant is still going.  It's in Drury Lane opposite
the New London Theatre and, yes, Cats is still playing!

Regards,

Mick
From: jpt@telecaster.think.com (James P. Taylor)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: Recommendations for Boston
Date: 19 Nov 92 09:23:38
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: telecaster.think.com
In-reply-to: ellis@genoa.osf.org's message of Wed, 18 Nov 1992 20:45:26 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.204526.883@osf.org> ellis@genoa.osf.org (Ellis S. Cohen) writes:


   I like the Blue Room for eclectic grilled food at 1 Kendall
   Square in Cambridge.  A little pricey, but wonderful unusual
   lunches and dinners.  They often sell beer made next door
   by the Cambridge Brewing Company; last week I had Pumpkin
   Beer!

I agree, the Blue Room IS creative and successful.  Lunch is much less
pricey and, while there is less variety, very representative of their
cuisine.

jim taylor  Thinking Machines Corp  Cambridge MA
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: igj@amy13.stanford.edu (Ian Glen Jacobs)
Subject: Re: where are good restaurants in N.Y.C.?
Organization: DSO, Stanford University
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 00:08:32 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.183108.813@blurt.oswego.edu> beatty@blurt.oswego.edu  
writes:
> I would like to know where there are good places to eat in New York  
City.
> I am going there for the first time on the first week of December and I 
> don't know much about the area.  So if you know any good restaurants  
(all
> types of food) please let me know before December 3rd. Thanks!!!!


For a little bit of a grungy - but "authentic" and yummy- Eastern European  
deli/basics kind of place - try Kiev at 2nd and 7th. THeir Challah French  
Toast fills you up and keeps you warm, even in December. It is also an  
interesting place to people watch.
From: souchay@CAM.ORG (Francois Souchay)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: Recommendations for Boston
Keywords: Boston
Date: 20 Nov 92 00:35:30 GMT
Organization: Communications Accessibles Montreal, Quebec Canada

I remember a coupe of places:

Larry's on Mass Ave has some good szechuan , but the real attraction
is a little bowl of soup called : suan loo chow chow (phonetic).
Something like wontons floating in a spicy broth poured over tasty
veggies and a dark sauce. mmmmmmmmmm.

Sol Azteca in Brookline has an interesting menu. I like the thin pork
cut with chipotle peppers and orange suace. Sounds odd, but....

Comments?
Francois.
Xref: sparky rec.food.restaurants:2291 alt.restaurants:80
From: ak441@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John Suter)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants,alt.restaurants
Subject: Re: Where to eat in Santa Fe, NM
Date: 17 Nov 1992 22:15:44 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: ak441@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John Suter)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc4.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, anshu@bass.bu.edu (Anshu Aggarwal) says:

>My sister and brother-in-law were thinking of going to Santa Fe
>in the first week of December for a couple of days. Do people have
>any suggestions for places to eat that they recommend very highly?
>Also, what is the weather generally like there at that time of 
>the year? Thanks.
>
>
>
>--
>						   - Anshu Aggarwal
>						     (anshu@bass.bu.edu)
>"Morality is the herd-instinct in the individual."
>				      	- Friedrich Nietzsche
>

I forgot the name of the restaurant, but it is located close to the
Rail Road station.  When you go in there is a board with different 
degrees of hot chilies depicted and you are advised to request a sample
if you are not familar with the word HOT.

Food was good, not great, atmosphere very charged and staff courteous.
Enjoy.
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: FPY00WDS@UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU (Bill Siegfried)
Subject: Re: e: Where to eat in Santa Fe, NM
Organization: UNC Charlotte
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 13:10:43 GMT

Two suggestions:  The Coyote Cafe and the Santa Cafe.  I tried both of
them a couple of years ago and thought they were great!  I talked to a
friend who  was at the Coyote recently and he said that it is still very
good.
 
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: faiman@cs.uiuc.edu
Subject: Re: French restaurants in Carmel
Organization: Dept. of Computer Sci - University of Illinois
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:48:30 GMT


La Bohe\me?

.
From: azari@ksr.com (Nasser Azari)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: Best Paris Restaurant?
Date: 22 Nov 92 18:27:15 EST
Organization: Kendall Square Research Corp.

Can someone give me info about cool places to visit in the DENVER srea.
I will spend the Thanksgiving holiday there.
Any places within a few hours drive from DENVER or a weekend trip?  
Any good eateries (preferably ethnic, not too expensive)?  
Any good ski resort? How to get discount lift tickets? A reasonable place to
stay? (not too expensive).
Any nice clubs?  
Any bands that would be playing there around that time?  

Please send me mail at azari@ksr.com

Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: dowling@hubcap.clemson.edu (Drew Dowling)
Subject: Re: New Orleans
Organization: Clemson University
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 02:46:06 GMT

anshu@guinness.bu.edu (Anshu Aggarwal) writes:

>Any recommendations for places to eat in New Orleans? Is there already
>a compilations somewhere that I can get a hold of? Thank you.


Jeeze, there are so many.  I would definitly go to Ralf and Cackons (bad sp)
Nawleans is really a place you can go and walk in anywhere and get great food.
I don't think you can go wrong in the quarter or anywhere on St Charles.
-- 
My submissions are not necessarily those of my employer, but the ought to be.
Drew Dowling                        CLEMSON UNIVERSITY 
dowling@hubcap.clemson.edu                  SC                                69
From: lake@cwjcc.INS.CWRU.Edu (Dr. Robin Lake)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: Restaurant Management software
Date: 16 Nov 1992 15:13:45 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve Univ. Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Reply-To: lake@po.CWRU.Edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: cwjcc.ins.cwru.edu

In article <1dj8jcINNiol@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> lake@po.CWRU.Edu writes:
>In article <69080@cup.portal.com> Ken_J_Siegel@cup.portal.com writes:
>>Well Eric, there are not too many people on the net who work in restaurants.
>I don't work in a restaurant, but do notice what software they are using.
>The most frequently used comes out of Canada, complete with terminals, remote
>printers in the kitchen, etc.  Can't get the name of it for a week, but
>please send e-mail to:  lake@rcwcl1.dnet.bp.com  so I can more easily reply
>when I do get the name.  I'll also keep my eye out for what's going on in
>the Bay Area this week, as I'll be eating out there for a week.
>
>Rob Lake
>BP Research
>lake@rcwcl1.dnet.bp.com
>
>PS. Our Truckstops of America chain is said to run on a Unix-based package.
>Next time I contact them, I'll check.


The specialized restaurant package most in use seems to bear the name
"MICROS".  That's the Canadian one.

Rob Lake
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: wkm1@nestor.cc.bellcore.com (messer,wendy k)
Subject: restaurants in boynton beach, fl.
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 14:17:23 GMT
Keywords: boynton beach

i am visiting my parents in boynton beach, fl. next week,
and would like to take them out to dinner (one that doesn't do
early birds!)

they like seafood, italian, and poultry, mostly, and i'd like to take them
to a really nice place....


please let me know what's available!

thanks in advance,
wendy
From: lester@bestsd.sdsu.edu (THE ONLY MISTAKES ARE HUMAN MISTAKES)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Les Cafes Artistes
Date: 18 Nov 92 06:12:00 GMT
Organization: San Diego State University - Dept. of Redundancy Dept.
NNTP-Posting-Host: bestsd.sdsu.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1


Does the Cafes Artistes still exist in NYC? Is George Lang still involved?
If the answer to these two questions is yes, can you please post the address
and phone number?

Thanks molto in advance.

Lester   (lester@bestsd.sdsu.edu)
From: kasdan@cs.columbia.edu (John Kasdan)
Subject: French restaurants in Carmel
Organization: Columbia University Department of Computer Science
Distribution: us
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 00:38:49 GMT

Every once in awhile someone posts the name of a French restaurant in
Carmel (I think on or near Dolores).  The posting is always a rave,
and yet I keep forgetting the name.  I will be there sometime next
week and want to check it out.  Can someone refresh my (leaky) memory?

Thanks.

/JK
From: dsk@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Daniel Katz)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: Minneapolis/St. Paul Restaurants
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:42:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.1992Nov16.174202.10083
Reply-To: dsk@nwu.edu
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, IL, USA

In article <davem.65.721725085@county.lmt.mn.org> davem@county.lmt.mn.org (David Mackmiller) writes:
>If you aren't grossed out by the Mall of America, aka t The 
>MegaMall aka the SmegmaMall, there's a good italian place there called 
>"Tutti [something-or-other]".

It's Tucci Benuc(sp?), it's owned by Lettuce Entertain You from Chicago, and
while it's not bad and beats Ciatti's by a mile, it's not as good as Figlio.

Dan

-- 
Dan Katz                                                       dsk@nwu.edu
Dept. of Electrical Engineering                             1(708)491-8887
Northwestern University, Evanston, IL, 60208                E pur si muove
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: veitch@vxcrna.cern.ch (Liz Veitch)
Subject: Recommendations for Boston
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:36:00 GMT

Hi,

Does anyone over there have any favourite restaurants in Boston
they could recommend?  I will be going there for the first time 
next week .... 


Thanks!
Liz
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: pw@cubmol.bio.columbia.edu (Paul Wakenight)
Subject: Re: Restaurants near U. of Chicago
Keywords: Chicago University
Organization: Columbia University, Dept. of Biological Sciences.
Distribution: rec.food.restaurants
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 23:29:47 GMT






Eduardo's is to stuffed pizza what McDonalds is to hamburgers.  Giordana's
used to provide the 12" in diameter and 10lb. pie, but since they have been
opening up lots of new rest., they have switched to pies that are still
2" on the sides, but the pie inself is barely thicker than some normal thin
pies.  Valois See Your Food is the place.  The food is consistently avg. or
below avg. (suppers),  but early in the morning, you can get eggs and great
biscuits and coffee for very cheap.