From: sadhal@alhena.usc.edu (Sati Sadhal)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: Let's Use Some Hindsight
Date: 22 Dec 1992 14:12:50 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: alhena.usc.edu

In article <5578@daily-planet.concordia.ca> baskar@cs.concordia.ca (Sundararajan Baskar) writes:
>In article <1992Dec10.200229.4197@beaver.cs.washington.edu> hasan@cs.washington.edu (Shams Hasan) writes:


[This is an article Shams Hasan that I responded to earlier.
I am responding again to give Mr. Shams Hasan another chance
to prove his point, if there is any]

>
>However, religion such as the Kafirs/Hindu/Infidel of Hindustaan as it makes
>a way of life, is not changed at heart by force and neither by monetary
>consideration.
>

[..... deleted stuff....]

>Yes, Islam came to India by force. Because the Muslims beat the hell out of
>Kaafirs/Hindus/Infidels of Hindustaan, being outnumbered and facing harsh and
>unsurmountable odds out of the belief of their faith, and faith alone.
>

	And, it was Guru Nanak who opposed and resisted Babar's invasion 
	of Punjab, and he was captured and thrown in jail by Babar. 
	You have the nerve to call Guru Nanak a Kaffir/Infidel?
	By the way, He referred to Babar as a `Zaabar' (tyrant).

>But it [Islam] was not spread by force, though it must be true, that monetary consideration would play a part in gaining favor with the ruling Muslim rulers.
>
	Then how do you explain the execution of Guru Arjan Dev
	who was seated on a red hot plate and glowing hot sand
	was poured over his head?

	How do you explain the execution of Guru Teg Bahadur whom 
	the Kashmiri Pandits declared as their Guru? He was 
	beheaded for refusing to accept Islam and defending 
	the Hindus' right to practise their religion. This
	execution took place in Chandni Chowk, Delhi, where
	the Sis Ganj Gurdwara stands as a memorial. 

	How do you explain the execution of Zorawar Singh (aged 9)
	and Fateh Singh (aged 7) by being brick-walled alive for
	refusing to accept Islam? 

	There was Bhai Mati Das who was had his head sawed in half.
	At many stages of executiom, he was given the option to 
	accept Islam whereby the execution process could be stopped. 
	His faith and valor outlived him.  

	The list of such horrible forms of executions goes on...
	It was all done for these people's refusal to accept
	Islam. 

	Then, Mr. Shams, how do you explain that no force was 
	used? 

[......deleted stuff.......]

>and the native Indus civilization. Islam was embraced because of its belief
>in brotherhood, charity, and a lot of intelligence/common sense, and the
>belief in ONE GOD, not ONE THOUSAND or more. 

	Then why, in the name of Islam, monotheistic 
	(Ek-Onkar, One God) believers such
	as the above were persecuted, butchered, and killed?
	Why did they kill little children and garland their 
	mothers with the chopped up babies? This clearly 
	violated all Islamic values and is totally unrepresentative
	of Islam. However, the cruel and despotic Moghul emperors 
	used the good name of Islam to carry out these atrocities. 
	
	Clearly, One God, was not the issue at all with these
	Moghul zabars. 


Mr. Hasan: 

	You have to stop putting blasphemy on the NET.
	As a person from the subcontinent, I am ashamed of you.
	But you, nevertheless, wish to dissociate from your
	Mahenjdaro-Harrappa-Indus-Ganges heritage for whatever
	reasons. 

	What you write is offensive to the civilized world.
	You have the enormous capability of dragging the 
	name of Islam into the gutter. I hope there are
	Muslims out there who will tell me that what you
	believe and write is un-Islamic. 
	
	I hope some day, when you are a grown-up, you
	will you will stop believeing some of the 
	nonsense that you put out. If you believe 
	that another religion is wrong, and you set
	out to destroy those people, then you will
	have to accept the others' `right' to do
	the same to you. It is best to believe that
	the other religion is also acceptable, as 
	long as I can practice mine. 

	Preach tolerance, and GROW UP. Also, read
	some Moghul history. The minimum that you
	should do is apologize on the net to the
	civilized world.
	
 				----- Satwindar Singh Sadhal

>Best Regards,
>Shams Hasan

	
						

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