HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Mon, 17 Aug 1992 05:57:38 PDT
From:         ChesterBear <CHESTER%UCSBVM.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: Gleanings (55)

On Mon, 3 Aug 1992 15:27:00 JST Akio Tanaka said:
>14) Sheepdog trial
Hi!
   A late Gleanings response, if I may.  I did not see any response to
the gleaning of Sheepdog Trial, so I would like to give it a go.  I am
not the only canine Wordsler, but I believe that I am the only sheeper
actively posting to the list, so I guess I am qualified to respond.

   Sheepdog Trials are an exhibition of the herding talents of a stock
dog and its human.  The team (one human and one or more sheepers) run
through an exercise involving herding a flock of sheep through a series
of activities in a given time.  These activities usually consist of:

   GATHERING - This involves the OUTRUN, a long oblique run from the
               human around the back of the sheep (300 to 500 yards);
               the LIFT, forming the sheep into a flock and moving them
               as a unit; and the FETCH, moving the flock back to the
               human.
   DRIVING   - Moving the flock through a series of gates.
   SHEDDING  - Separating a number of sheep, designated by the human,
               from the main flock and keeping them under control
               within the shedding ring (a circle marked in the field).
   PENNING   - Moving the flock into an enclosure, and out again.

   I'm sure that most of the humans on the list have attended at least
one of these trials; I can't imagine a reason for not doing so.  If not,
the above are just the facts, without the excitement and romance.

      Keep your nose cold, your coat glossy,
         and celebrate every day you awaken.

               Chester (the Bear)
               Grand Master of the Outrun (ret.)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Mon, 10 Aug 1992 22:04:00 EDT
From:         "PLOTKIN, ALEC DAVID" <185422285@UCIS.VILL.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Marty, Are you back?
Comments: To: words-l <words-l@uga.cc.uga.edu>

>I find I have no choice, no choice whatsoever (and that's exactly how much
>choice women will have 2 or three years down the road if George and his
>moron compadre Dan get re-elected.

>Marty

Amen and welcome back to the meat grinder called WORDS-L

later


alec
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 10:03:28 EDT
From:         Rita Marie Rouvalis <rita@EFF.ORG>
Subject:      RE: On Gender and Such
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu
              92 10:13 pm

	You know, I wuz gonna get into this particular debate, but then
I realized that I've done the gender issue at least a half dozen times
on the net, and I know how it is going to resolve itself.  Blah!

Czarina
I feel old, I feel old, and my pants is rolled..
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-To: PO%"WORDS-L@UGA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Thu, 20 Aug 1992 17:46:36 EST
From:         Entropy Warrior <AUSBROOK@UCS.INDIANA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: List wars

>long day.  That was an attempt on my part to forestall the list from
>launching into a topic that was debated ad nauseum recently ... just
>doing my conscientious citizen bit.  whatever.
>
>rashmi

Oh--a citizen's arrest.

-Mka
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Thu, 13 Aug 1992 19:57:27 -0500
From:         Doris Smith <dorisann@TENET.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Taking Names and Kicking Butts
Comments: To: English Language Discussion Group <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Comments: cc: Multiple recipients of list WORDS-L <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>

Hi, Don, it's good to see you are back.  The lateness of my welcome does
not diminish its sincerity in the least, it is just that I had to *go back to
work* today and no longer get to login until evening.  School starts
earlier and earlier every year, it seems.

Doris
From: AUSBROOK@UCS.INDIANA.EDU (Entropy Warrior)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Subject: Re: List wars
Date: 21 Aug 92 00:52:21 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-To: PO%"WORDS-L@UGA.BITNET"

>face.  The suggestion to -abh to get on it was *supposed* to refer to your

Yeah--but I thought I was 'it'--especially when you suggested the
mail for What's-his-name ought to come to me.  It sounded a
little like "How about a little fire, Scarecrow."

I'll collect on the gestures next time I'm in Southeast Texas.

Thanks,

-Mka
From: haycock@marley.think.com (Anne Haycock)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Subject: Re: What do you call...
Date: 18 Aug 92 08:59:44
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: marley.think.com
In-reply-to: mcmahan@cs.unca.edu's message of 15 Aug 92 19:04:16 GMT

Scott queries:

   What do you call yourself *between* semesters? If one was a 
   sophomore last spring semester, and will be a junior next semester,
   whe people ask you during the summer what you are, what is the
   correct answer? :)


Well, how many credits have you completed?  Enough to call yourself a
junior?  If you've got outstanding credits then, sorry Charlie, yer still a
plebe til ya complete'em.  

'Course, you could be like me and not pay any attention to nomenclature and
just distinguish yourself by the number of years you've been enrolled ;-).
It took me 5 years to get two degrees including going overseas for a year
just for fun.

//anne, who swore she'd never go back, did anyway, and is now overeducated
and underemployed...maybe I should go back for a Ph.D. in Philosophy...//
From: karsten@netcom.com (karsten)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Subject: Re: The sole of a new machine
Date: 20 Aug 92 22:04:56 GMT
Organization: Karsten's Bit Bucket
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

mjg@NWU.EDU (Michael J Graven) writes:
> Well, yes, but most of us at AT&T use the Korn shell (/bin/ksh) instead
> of the csh, as ksh was Invented Here, while csh was invented At Berkeley.
> Also, for those of us who are vi-literate, the command-line editor in
> vi mode is faster than csh bangs.

I'm not going to start shell wars, but if you like csh and want
command-line editing (emacs and vi bindings user-selectable) and
some other handy features you might consider using tcsh.

--karsten

If you put your ear next to the processor do you hear the ocean?
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 16:55:52 CDT
From:         Bandwidth Pig <aharwell@PANAM1.PANAM.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Yes, I'm an e-wimp
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

>confrontation between   pb  and abh/bwp.....that would be worth paying
>a LOT to see....

don't get mer started, I already vented that spleen today in privatemail and
believe me you don't want it on the list

-abh
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Wed, 12 Aug 1992 18:31:39 -0500
From:         Doris Smith <dorisann@TENET.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Net Access?????
Comments: To: English Language Discussion Group <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Comments: cc: Multiple recipients of list WORDS-L <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>

  You *know* I would
> never even think of looking at it during the course of a school day.  :-)
> Yeah, right!

Sure. Have you checked your nose lately?
Doris (who got unlucky last year when the English department moved into
the brand spanking new wing of the newly renovated building and wound up
with a room much smaller than her old one and no bookcases, but the same
number of books and desks. I at one time considered trying out for the
Olympics in the hurdles and high jump, as I've grown quite proficient at
both in my attempts to reach each student in the room)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 21:52:02 EDT
From:         Karen Kay <LL23%NEMOMUS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: Is Elaine a Bimbo??
Comments: To: words-l@uga.cc.uga.edu

> Posted on 17 Aug 1992 at 20:55:35 by Dan Lester
> It is possibel to be a nonbimbo and still have
> a fling, isn't it.                                                    d

I won't have net access tomorrow (major MUSIC upgrade tomorrow! whoopee-
pickles), and I wanted to make sure that I answered this. The answer is,
of course, a resounding yes!

Karen
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Mon, 17 Aug 1992 07:18:17 MST
From:         Dan Lester <ALILESTE@IDBSU.IDBSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Today's Trivia
Comments: To: English Language Discussion Group <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
              15 Aug 1992 22:36:00 EDT from <N567126@NCSUADM.ACS.NCSU.EDU>

On Sat, 15 Aug 1992 22:36:00 EDT Gilbert Smith said:
>I *never* stopped being a <chile> (that's English Southern, not
>Spanish)....
                           ^^^^^^^   naaaahhhhh.....its spanish because you're
                                                      such hot stuff......
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Wed, 19 Aug 1992 05:03:21 CDT
From:         "Natalie Maynor" <maynor@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: 1/0
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

> Interesting....don't think I've ever seen a computer printer, whether
> chain, drum, dotmatrix, daisywheel, laser, etc, that did NOT so distinguish.
> I WILL admit that some of them are much less distnictive than MY old eyes
> would like...of course that doesn't mean that such don't exist in the
> backwoods of MS......        8-)

They seem to be in the majority around here -- or at least those not
distinguishing between 0 and O.  (Most make at least a feeble attempt
to distinguish between 1 and l -- but without much success in some
cases -- I remember having to write a pen and ink note on a letter I
had printed a while back pointing out that the userid nm1 was nm1 and
not nml since it was impossible to tell on the printed copy.)  Of the
various printers I use at home and office, I think only one distinguishes
between 0 and O -- the one I almost never use.  I just double-checked
the syllabi sitting on my desk right now.  Yep.  September 30 says
September 3O.
   --Natalie (maynor@ra.msstate.edu)
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X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Thu, 20 Aug 1992 18:11:37 -0400
From:         Agnes Kruchio <kruchio@EPAS.UTORONTO.CA>
Subject:      Re: List wars
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu
              at Aug 20, 92 5:49 pm

>
> > EFF
> >
> > 		==??
>
> 	Oh, Agnes.  I mean, it is understandable that you don't clue in
> on my sense of humor, but really.  (Look at my e-mail address).
>
> ************************************************************************
>       General Information about the Electronic Frontier Foundation
[...del...]


Whew...sorry I asked...it looks interesting but I cannot hope to
digest it any time soon...

I have to go through a few conniptions to get a sender's e-mail
address - my system doesn't readily show it *BTW* - no need to get HH
Agnes
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X-Vmsmail-To: SMTP%"WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Fri, 21 Aug 1992 22:48:41 -0700
From:         MGARBER@DHVX20.CSUDH.EDU
Subject:      RE: The Evidence
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

my mother is a member of this list
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X-Prolog:     University Computing Services/Student Data Systems
X-Prolog:     University of South Florida
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Mon, 17 Aug 1992 07:04:41 GMT
Comments:     Converted from OfficeVision to RFC822 by PUMP V2.2X
From:         "Don Moore (813) 974-4078 S/C 574-4078"
 <DBFABAK%CFRVM.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Good Morning

From one of my guests yesterday, short poem to get the week (weak?)
started:

           Roses are red
           Violets are blue
           I'm a schizophrenic
           And so am I.

Hope this is a great day for all of you ...and for me too when people
start signing on and discovering all the changes this weekend that
Cathey and I made ....*think* all went well.

                            Peace,
                                  Don
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Fri, 14 Aug 1992 19:19:13 CDT
From:         "Natalie Maynor" <maynor@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>
Subject: RE: Gender
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

> I didn't say it makes the argument less important.  It just means
> that it's nonsense to say that sexism is "embedded" (certain
> possibilities there) in the language, as if the language exists
> "out there" someplace objectively for sexism or anything else to
> be embedded in.

I'm having trouble understanding why things can't be embedded in
language (not that that was my word choice, btw).

>  The language isn't sexist.  Your and others'
> reactions to the language--its conventions--make it (arguably)
> sexist--for you, anyway.

Isn't reaction a part of language?  How can language work in a vacuum?

> about a draw--except for the push in professional-speak to do
> shit like alternate chapters with generic he/him and she/her.

See Frank and Treichler's -Language, Gender, and Professional Writing-
(MLA 1989) for some much better suggestions for handling the problem
and for some pretty good explanations of sexist language.

>      Now come folk saying that that is sexist, that it excludes women.
> It didn't when I read it.  News to me.  My consciousness has not
> been raised by the observation.  It makes me think that those

But you said that native speakers automatically know when words like
"man" are being used to include women.  If that is the case, how can
native speakers be in disagreement about some of the examples?

> around for holes in the whole, as the Poles say.  Would you say
> that because "person" in the Constitution did not include black
> people that it is now racist to use person in connection with
> someone who is black?

Sorry.  This analogy just won't work.

> FBI is not part of the rules of tennis.  When one person proposes
> that he get FBI and the other agrees, the rules have been changed
> and the second person's consciousness has been raised with
> respect to FBI--especially if he did not even know about the
> possibility.  And a perfectly legitimate reaction is, "sorry,
> that's not how the game is played."

And I'm still not quite sure about this one.
   --Natalie (maynor@ra.msstate.edu)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Thu, 13 Aug 1992 03:09:19 EDT
From:         BGRISSOM@UKCC.UKY.EDU
Subject:      RE: Gender
              13 Aug 1992 01:08:10 EST from <AUSBROOK@UCS.INDIANA.EDU>

"Girls in Kraut" -- wasn't that Klaus Kinski's last movie?

brad
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Wed, 12 Aug 1992 23:13:01 +0200
From:         torkel@SICS.SE
Subject:      Re: Acronyms/Gender
Comments: To: English Language Discussion Group <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
              12 Aug 92 16:10:42 -0400. <9208122016.AA07597@sics.se>

 >I think Japanese has "I" masculine and feminine.

 Japanese personal pronouns are rather peculiar. To quote Makino and Tsutsui,
"One of the peculiarities of Japanese personal pronouns is that there is more
than one pronoun for the first and second person and that traditionally
there have been no third person pronouns." It is not always possible to
determine the sex of the speaker from the term chosen, particularly not
in present day Japan. The formal "watakushi" (male or female use) has
a number of contractions, explained as follows by Makino and Tsutsui:

  watashi  (formal)

  atakushi  (formal, female)

  atashi  (informal, female)

  atai (very informal/vulgar, female)

  washi (informal, older male)

  asshi (very informal, adult male of the Bay area of Tokyo)


  There are more terms for "I". Mizutani and Mizutani remark that
"before the war a dozen different terms - watakushi, atakushi, atashi, atai,
ore, washi, wagahai, temae, shoosee, kochitora, etc - were used to refer to
oneself, but now just a few terms, such as watashi, boku, and ore, are
used in most cases".

  Japanese is fun!
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Original_To:  JNET%"words-l@uga"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:43:00 MST
From:         "JOHN WHAT'S-THE-M-FOR? WILLIAMS"
 <WILLIAMS%MC.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: Let's try this again, shall we?

>The ministerv for fun (Davil Mllor) is for real.

>G
        That's as may be, but whaddee doo, whaddee doo???  The tabs didn't say.

-jmw
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Original_To:  BITNET%"words-l@uga"
Original_cc:  AUSBROOK
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Wed, 19 Aug 1992 10:11:00 EST
From:         Entropy Warrior <AUSBROOK%IUBACS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Geekefaction

>Karen
>what is a geek anyway?
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Is this another example of sexist language; only the males are important
>enough to label?  Or is it another kind of sexism?
>
>JAG

Hey--the bimbos had their time on the list.  A female geek is
probably a librarian.

And I propose a moratorium on the witch (warlock) hunt for signs
of creeping sexism.

-Mka
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Sun, 16 Aug 1992 08:58:38 CDT
From:         "Natalie Maynor" <maynor@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>
Subject:      re: good evening to you all
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

> > >who sometimes feels like Weezie in Steel Magnolias.
> > Gee, hope that makes it out on video soon so i can see it.
> > dan
>
> Was this supposed to be sarcasm?  It's been out on video for a
> kazillion years.
> Karen

I wondered the same thing.  My first reaction was to reply "It's been
out on video for ages."  Then I thought, "Hmmm.  Obviously, there's
some kind of joke here that I'm not catching."
   --Natalie (maynor@ra.msstate.edu)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:10:22 MST
From:         Dan Lester <ALILESTE@IDBSU.IDBSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: O.2% Solution
Comments: To: English Language Discussion Group <WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
              18 Aug 1992 13:19:19 CDT from <maynor@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>

On Tue, 18 Aug 1992 13:19:19 CDT Natalie Maynor said:
>O.  That's interesting.  Because I'm used to printers that don't make
>a distinction between O and 0, I had never noticed before that e-mail
>does maintain the distinction.  But does it maintain a distinction
>between 1 and l?

Well, the computer ALWAYS cares about these differences.  Just as you
care about the difference between an a and a b.

Try addressing something to a1i1este@idbsu.idbsu.edu and see what
happens......

computers ALWAYS care.....computers always care.....computers always......

dan
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Wed, 12 Aug 1992 10:28:01 CDT
From:         "Natalie Maynor" <maynor@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Wait up!
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

>I'm walking down the street and I see a friend walking in the same direction
>a block ahead.  I would yell "Hey John...John, wait up," and then I would trot
>or walk quickly to where he was.

I would say "Hey John... John, wait."  I've never said "wait up," altho
I've heard it (from Yankees).
   --Natalie (maynor@ra.msstate.edu)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
From: ap290@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ruth M. Hanschka)
Subject: Re: List wars
Reply-To: ap290@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ruth M. Hanschka)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 01:12:41 GMT


In a previous article, "Don Moore  974-4078 S/C 574-4078" (813) says:

>as soon leave the subject buryied.  I feel all fences have been mended,
>and no one bears ill will to me, as I bear no ill will to anyone on this
>list.  If I'm wrong, zap me by private mail ....I'll try not to zap you
>back :-)
	Just as long as the lightning doesn't zap your machine first....

>PS.  just broke replacement keyboard, now using borrowed keyboard ...I
>     must learn to type softer ...have only been typing for about 45
>     years now...and still bang the keys too hard!
This is a common problem among those old enough to have been raised on 
manual typewriters and teletypes....  That old sledge hammer technique
does lighten up in time, but it never really goes away.  Of course, you
might have just gotten a junk keyboard that only looked nice and new.<grin>>

I wonder if there's a lemon law for keyboards in Florida...
	<tosses lemons at Don>  

-- 
It's Ruth the NetHead, back from the [virtual] dead
	- ap290@cleveland.freenet.edu
fighting for truth, justice and static-free lines
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Sat, 22 Aug 1992 17:13:00 EDT
From:         Gilbert Smith <N567126@NCSUADM.ACS.NCSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Old machines
Comments: To: English Language Discussion Group <WORDS-L@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU>

> My questions was more on the mark than I realized - you *have* been
> working with old machines.  *Why* do you have so many cars?
>
> The sharing of your story and Don's sharing of his story are what make
> this list seem so much like a family. Peace to both of you.
>
> And remember, some of those old machines are made much better than the new
> ones and function better, so, bruther, that was a compliment. :-)
> Doris

Well, *I* certainly function better than I did when I was <new>, I'm
sure of that.  I have so many cars because neither I nor my tc can
bear to give them up.  But we are cleaning out our lives these days
and probably will sell the '74 Olds Cutlass, the '74 Cadillac Eldorado,
the '73 Porsche 914, and maybe even the '74 VW Bus, which I use as a
trash/lumber hauling truck (if we keep the Voyager after acquiring the
'85 Jaguar).  That would then be only 3 cars.  Not bad for us.
.
As always, doris sis, you are a real honey and an important part of
this family.
--ggs
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.words-l
Date:         Thu, 13 Aug 1992 17:49:13 CDT
From:         "Natalie Maynor" <maynor@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Taking Names and Kicking Butts
Comments: To: WORDS-L@uga.cc.uga.edu

> Natalie, you don't pay much attention sometimes!
> I'm in Amsterdam.

I never claimed to read all list mail.  I wish I could, but I can't.
How much of it I read and how carefully I read it varies according to
other stuff in my life at the time.  When I win PCH Sweepstakes and
retire, I plan to read every word of list mail!
   --Natalie (maynor@ra.msstate.edu)
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