From: boyiny@noether.mit.edu (Professor Who?)
Subject: Offshape doubles and free bids
Summary: Bidding after takeout double is not _SUPPORT_
Keywords: double, support.
Organization: Ayatollah's Correct Bidding Lessons
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 93 15:52:06 GMT
Old_subject: Re: Assess the blame

Bob Silverman (Bob:) responds to S. Myerson (SM:)

[About the now infamous 4-4-1-4 19-count, and partner's 1-2-6-4 2-count
that ended in disaster after (1H)-X-(2H)-3D; 3N-4D; 4S-5C-(X).]

Bob is still advised not to read this for his own health, even though I am
_REALLY_ not trying to annoy him on purpose.

SM: ... first bad bid was 3D, East just doesn't have enough ...
[Bob's insult at SM deleted.]  

Bob: East ... is showing playing strength in support of partner.  [Uses
Bob: example from SJ Simon: the beginning of that auction was (1D)-(2C)-3C]
Bob: partner said something like "How am I to bid on only blah blah at the
Bob: 4 level" and the answer was: "... You're supporting me.  ..."

I have to disagree on a basic point of bidding theory.  While take-out bids
in an auction like (1H)-(1S)-X or (1C)-(1S)-1NT (if that was not NAT) has
always been described as "showing the _unbid_suits_", the takeout double
against _ONLY_ONE_ suit has always been treated as "showing SUPPORT for the
unbid suits" and not "showing the unbid suits", and in common usage 3 cards
is not really regarded as a suit, either.

Bob: I suggest you run [don't walk] and get yourself a copy of Woolsey's
Bob: "Matchpoints".  ...

It is ironical to observe that the same illustrious author, when commenting
on defensive agreements (while you are at it, buy Woolsey's "Partnership
Defense", IMHO a _MUST_ for all aspiring players) suggests that after the
auction 1C-P-1H-X; 2C-2D-3C-all pass, a diamond lead and subsequent signals
be treated in the same fashion as if the doubler had actually BID diamonds
with the advancer SUPPORTING (i.e. a two-suited takeout bid actually SHOWS
the suits) while in a situation like 1C-X-1S-2H; 2S all pass, hearts should
be treated as the ADVANCER's suit with the doubler supporting!!

Bob: The East hand has a very GOOD 3D bid.  Total tricks says the opponents
Bob: have 9 hearts and can probably make 3H.  You have at least 9 diamonds
Bob: and should easily make 3 diamonds, ...

But in that case (a) one opponent or the other will venture (at least) 3H
and (b) we should have been in 4D at least anyway.

Bob: Try constructing some normal takeout doubles for partner.  .... See
Bob: how 3D plays.  [Insults deleted]

I would wager that with any of those "normal" takeout doubles 3D would not
be the final contract.  If it is played at 3D, it would be doubled!  [Give
partner S:KQJx H:xx D:Axx C:QJxx and there is a 500 looming on the horizon
against the nonvul game-- a contrived example, but you get the point.]

Bob: 3D may also be necessary to:
Bob: (a) suggest a lead to partner

Against what?  Against a heart contract you want partner to cash the ace of
spades or otherwise find the spade ruff, not easy when you bid diamonds.
As for no-trumps, does anyone really believes that?

Bob: (b) allow partner to decide intelligently whether to sack/defend
Bob:     if they bid again.

You mean that 3D shows negative defense and a 6-card suit and it is standard?
What is much more likely to happen is that partner doubles and now there is
a dilemma and possibly a How-would-you-rule problem.

Bob: (c) allow partner to compete to 4D if they stop in 3H.

Partner will not play for a 6-card suit, so any 4D would have to come from
this side anyway-- that, or the opponents are missing something HEAVY.

Bob: (d) keep the opponents from stealing the hand. They may stop in
Bob:     2 or 3 hearts and partner may not be able to bid again.

And if s/he can't bid again I will be happy to sell out to TWO hearts as
they are in all likelihood cold for game....

Bob: One can easily construct hands for partner where game is cold for
Bob: you and him. You will never find them if you pass.

I am more worried about THEIR games.  If partner can't take voluntary
action I'd wager that we are not the ones missing game.

Bob: 3D is COMPETITIVE in this auction and shows PLAYING STRENGTH in
Bob: support of partner's TAKEOUT double. It does not promise high cards.

Not a lot of high cards, true, but negative defense??

SM: 3N was certainly reasonable given East's encouraging response.
Bob: 3NT was HOPELESS. ...