From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Jews For Germans
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 04:49:33 GMT

In article <1993Jan10.034935.3034@wam.umd.edu> mstern@wam.umd.edu (Michael Stern) writes:
>In article <46250@unlisys.in-berlin.de> stingray@unlisys.in-berlin.de (Christian Lampl) writes:
>>mstern@wam.umd.edu (Michael Stern) writes:
>>So if you say that the germans should never be forgiven that they
>>thought the jews had the responsibility for their problems
>>the americans (for example) shouldn't never be forgiven that
>>there was a time where they thought the newcomers from europe
>>were responsible for their problems or that they thought whites were
>>better than blacks.

>To a certain extent that is true.  I would imagine that the blacks of
>today have a hard time forgiving the whites for the crimes that were
>once perpertrated on them.  However, the majority of whites in the US
>have given up those outdated views, whereas a significant proportion of
>the Germans still favour the Nazi ideas.

Horseshit.  All evidence ponts to the contrary.  Neo-Nazis make up a 
tiny minority of Germans.  On the other hand, take a visit to the 
Southwest Side of Chicago for some old-fashioned stereotyping of
blacks by whites.

> In fact then no country in the world could have
>>been forgiven then.
>>Judging the question if the youth has learned from it by looking
>>to the skins is just judging america by looking on the Ku-Klux-Klan.
>>Many germans have problems to understand and accept different
>>cultures like americans have problems to understand and accept 
>>the culture of the foreigners who come to their land and like
>>many people from israel have problems to understand and accept
>>arab culture. art
>>The biggest part who has sympathies to the right wingers is just afraid for 
>>their jobs and their existence. I wouldn't call them rasistic, just egoistic.
>>That is no excuse, but trying to out that people would not solve
>>the problem.

>Does it surprise you that people who were once subject to mass
>extermination (that is Jews) still hold a grudge against the 
>former exterminators (that be the Germans), some of which have
>led a comfortable existance in post-WW2 Germanies.  When I was 

Make up your mind: are you talking about all the Germans, or a
number of the actual oppressors?  Why should a Jew such as myself,
the son of refugees, hold a grudge against a german aged 3 or 33?

>a child my grandfather used to tell me bedtime stories of how 
>he and a band of Russian partisans would fight the German 
>occupants by blowing up the tracks on which trains carrying the
>Jews condemned to death camps would travel.  What do former 
>German soldiers tell their grandchildren - how they would torture
>and rape Jewish women maybe?  Or maybe about how they would tear
>the newborn Jewish babies limb from limb in front of their 
>mothers?  Nice legacy.

You know, it would help if you actually learned a bit about 
Germany and Germans before mouthing off like that.  In the whole
of WW II, most German soldiers never came into contact with any
Jews at all, and most of the ones who did did not behave as you
suggest.  

And those who did aren't stupid enough to talk about it, in the 
main.  Any more than American soldiers who raped in WW II speak
of it to *their* grandchildren.

Germany, however many atrocities it may haver perpetrated, did not
invent atrocity.  Rape existed before 1939.

Roger
>>
>>Bye,
>>  Christian
>>n
>>-- 
>>"Die Demokratie ist ein Verfahren, das garantiert, dass wir nicht
>> besser regiert werden, als wir es verdienen."
>>- G. B. Shaw
>>Christian Lampl - stingray@unlisys.in-berlin.de - aka Ray at the IRC
>
>
>Michael Stern	mstern@wam.umd.edu	UMCP...USDA-ARS
>
>


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