HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: heinlein@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (The tired one)
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Re: Some REALLY SERIOUS gripes about empire
Date: 13 Oct 92 10:46:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: matt.1bfcjtINN6vg
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

gt0924a@prism.gatech.EDU (Delgado,Mark March (Metallica, TheDeathAngel)) writes:

>In article <1992Oct13.154738.3991@schaefer.math.wisc.edu> duelge@schaefer.UUCP (Jason Duelge) writes:
>>In article <Bw2E5v.vH@acsu.buffalo.edu> fein@acsu.buffalo.edu (L. Fein) writes:
>>>In article <1992Oct13.110224.26310@schaefer.math.wisc.edu> duelge@schaefer.UUCP (Jason Duelge) writes:
>>>>In article <Bw1nED.DL1@acsu.buffalo.edu> fein@acsu.buffalo.edu (L. Fein) writes:

>(lots of drivel deleted, because I don't want to see it again)

>come on folks... either go email with it, or shut up.
>just a friendly note from TheDeathAngel that this isn't doing anyone any good

>-- 
>Mark Delgado   |  "I will not die... Fate I deny   | Andre Marrou...       
>TheDeathAngel  |   Outlive, Humanity, Wind & Rain  | Libertarian for President
>WREKage host   |   Earth & Sea, Outlive the Galaxy |
>WREK 91.1 fm   |   Time itself will deteriorate before me"  - O.L.D.

Well, since everyone else is using this for a *.drivel newsgroup
lately, I'll add in my two cents:

Land_of_Faa, if you read this newsgroup at all, or have ever played in
a game and read your announcements, you'll know that Jason (Temekula)
and I have problems at almost every turn.  With that said, it should
be taken as a significant fact that I happen to concur with Jason's
appraisal of Barbary_Coast's abilities... he is a very capable empire
player, and frequently we have run up against each other and he has
been the victor.  Sometimes, such as when I played the Borg, it was a
close fight, at other times, such as when I played under my normal
name of Narnia, it has been much more of a blowout... however NEVER
has he behaved in a fodderous fashion, which I cannot say the same for
you.

Now, back to the drivel:  HIYA Mark!  I didn't know that the
girlfriend still let Metallica out to play...  give me a yell
sometime, and we'll talk about ruling the world. (chuckle)

also a btw, my time has again been limited, so I've started a new
series of co-emperoring with Russ Taylor of Blackthorn... we seemed to
do pretty well, notching up a win in the recently finished Ga. Tech
game, so we will continue to play on as a pair with the country of
Protector... yes folks, this means the ever-depleting Narnian economy
is now shored up by the economic wits of Blackthorn... :)

well... that's about it for now... and for all of you who choose to
belabour this boring thread remember this:

FODDER yells the loudest when stepped on. 
(Copyright 1988, Narnia)

so, Jason, give it up... Faa is FODDER, and is prone to yelling, and
you or I can't change that. :)

this has been Mike Monthey, known to many of you as:
King Aslan of Narnia
-- 
Gee, I finally made a .sig file. Isn't it grand?
Chris Green is way cool. :)   My idols are camels.  OH! You wanted sarcasm,
well, just go read my .plan then. :)  - Mike Monthey heinlein@matt
From: alasda@nyx.cs.du.edu (Andrew Lasda)
Subject: Christmas Mods List II
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix @ U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 92 20:15:40 GMT


I forgot the most important ones!

1) Happiness should affect the pe of enlistment centers.  People aren't going
to be so anxious to enlist if they're not happy with their country's regime.
Okay, more realism... so sue me.

2) I like the idea of individual mil not being able to attack.  Instead,
mil could be organized into Corps, much like ariplanes are organized into
wings.  Individual mil could still spy and defend, but only Corps could
actually attack.  It would cost an extra maintainence fee to keep Corps on the
board or to break them up.  When a corps drops below 5 mil it ceases to be.
I also like the idea of mil being able to defend sectors in a radius around
their location.  Sort of like planes rising to intercept within their range.
If somebody attacks the sector adjacent to a fort, the mil in all surrounding
forts should be able to reinforce.  One more idea for mil I'd like to toss out
is Standing orders.  Since we can't distribute mil, perhaps we could leave
'orders' for the mil to go certain places automatically.  Ship 'em out 
right after basic.  

3) Land Units- This game needs tanks, trucks, jeeps, etc.  Why?  Because
a military unit's agility to move and attack is not dependant upon its 
surroundings, but rather its equipment.  It would also allow for non-update
blitzkriegs.  Probably impossible to code... right?

4) New Shiptype (to bue used in conjunction with garbage)- Garbage Scow!
Takes garbage off land, dumps it into water one sector off coast.

That's it for now...
Enjoy!

Andrew Lasda
From: ccoprmd@prism.gatech.EDU (Matthew DeLuca)
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Re: Christmas Mods List II
Date: 12 Oct 92 12:09:16 GMT
Organization: The Dorsai Grey Captains

In article <1992Oct9.201540.1654@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> alasda@nyx.cs.du.edu (Andrew Lasda) writes:

>3) Land Units- This game needs tanks, trucks, jeeps, etc.  Why?  Because
>a military unit's agility to move and attack is not dependant upon its 
>surroundings, but rather its equipment.  It would also allow for non-update
>blitzkriegs.  Probably impossible to code... right?

Good grief...we're playing a real-time interactive game!  If I wanted to 
play Axis and Allies, I'd not be on this group.

I think the final death of empire will come when all of these ideas have 
been coded in, and suddenly everyone discovers that they don't have the 
time or endurance to play.  Fortunately, I've still got the BSD 1.1.3 code
tucked away, so all is not yet lost.

-- 
Matthew DeLuca             "We should grant power over our affairs only to
Georgia Tech                those who are reluctant to hold it and then only
Information Technology      under conditions that increase the reluctance."
ccoprmd@prism.gatech.edu              - Coda of the Bene Gesserit
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
From: umzach18@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Robert Zacharias)
Subject: Tyro I -> Update change & Extra Info
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 04:55:33 GMT

Greetings potential empire players.  This is the final posting before
Tyro I starts (I hope!), and at the request of several players I 
thought I should clarify a few things.  First, the version of empire
that I'm using is, BSD Empire 1.1 patch level 5 (KSU distribution 1.04).
Also, the start will be mainly from a large land mass.  

IMPORTANT:  The UPDATE TIME will now be 10:00pm CST since I think that
might accomodate the majority of the players.  If that doesn't quite
agree with your timetable my apologies.  There are currently players
from 6-7 timezones all over the world so it is not possible to satisfy
everyone.

By the weekend all countries will be registered into empire and you
are invited to test out the connection then.  The game itself will not
start until OCT 12/92 at 6:00pm CST.  

Thanks.  See you all on Monday.

ROB


p.s.  Any problems with connecting to empire mail me ASAP!

Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
From: joed@mozart.cbs.umn.edu (Joe Dalsin)
Subject: Newbie games?
Keywords:  newbie
Organization: University of Minnesota
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 04:37:08 GMT

I'm new to empire and was wondering if there are any games out there
that are excepting newbies.  Thanks.

Joe Dalsin
University of Minnesota
joed@mozart.cbs.umn.edu
-- 
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
//  You can't trust big business so brew it at home.
//                                        
//  Joe Dalsin                     %_%%%______
From: fein@acsu.buffalo.edu (L. Fein)
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Re: Mods 'n Stuff
Keywords: Squash
Date: 16 Oct 92 13:43:51 GMT
Organization: Land Of Faa Bureau of the Alphabet

In article <1992Oct16.095903.19870@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> alasda@nyx.cs.du.edu (Andrew Lasda) writes:
>
>	This is a reply to everything.

	That I see :-)
>
>-Happiness effects enlistment pe. (or possibly reserve dropout rate.  As 
>someone pointed out, people are pretty likely to enlist if they have a gun to 
>their head)

	Well, your civs won't unlist now if a sector is too pissed off,
if the work is too low, etc.

	How about a "conscript" command? You move enough mil into the sector
to have military control, and "poof" the civs get enlisted.

>
>-Organize troops into Corps (just adding some management to military.  I think
>it'd help...)

	I still like The_Scum's idea of units better. But this is sort of
a superset of units, and maybe a "corps" sector could be where units 
are made? Or maybe a HQ.

>
>	Last couple of notes...
>

	Here it comes! :)

>LOF- You need not respond to anything that remotely involves you or anything
>you give a flying eggplant about.  Keep it constructive.  Replying to a post
>by quoting the entire post and interjecting your lousy play-by-play is not
>interesting and it's not helpful.  I'll look forward to deleting your flame to
>this without reading it.

	Picture me sitting at my keyboard. Picture me showing restraint
(Yes, new commodity here for the Faa King. just got it in two days ago)
:-)
*bang* *bang* *bang* Whew! There! now that I've head butted the wall a few 
times, I feel better. :-)

>
>	Someone threw up 

	Oh! Messy! 

>the comment "if you want to see a mod, why don't you
>just *code* it?" or something to that general effect.  Well, I lack the time,
>the computer space, and the coding knowledge.  Besides, If I *could* code
>this stupid stuff, don't you think I would? :)  I give the inspiration, 
>someone better qualified can put forth the perspiration.
>
>A buckfiddy worth o' typin'
>Andy Lasda
>James K. Polk

	Any relation to US of Madison? :-) (just kidding, see the smiley?)

>Co-ruler of Kryptycthsys

LOF, the unloved. Oh, sniffle :-)

P.S Better Temekula? :)
From: royalyn@trigger.ksu.ksu.edu (Royalyn S Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Re: Need advice
Date: 15 Oct 1992 18:34:13 -0500
Organization: Kansas State University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: trigger.ksu.ksu.edu


In article <6OCT199200442482@acad3.alaska.edu>, fsjjp@acad3.alaska.edu (Mud Is My Life) writes:
>        I'm playing in a local game and RL has reared it's ugly head.  I 
>        asked for and received a co-ruler from this group.  Now the DEITY
>        is telling me to get rid of the Co-Ruler, since it's a 1 player
>        1 country game.  I cannot logically get rid of the co-ruler
>        and expect to come back, from a few weeks at a remote job site,
>        to a viable country.  I can login every few days, but am expecting
>        my co-ruler to run the country.  Should I get rid of the Co-Ruler
>        or tell the DEITY to kiss off.
>
>        Correct me if I'm wrong.....but as long as your co-ruler isn't
>        playing in the same game, or HAVE played in the current game,
>        the DEITY can not justify you getting rid of the co-ruler.  
>
>        The Deity is saying that my country has too much of an advantage.
>        With 2 people running the country.  Hell, I wish 2 players were running
>        the country....I'd be at the top of the power chart.
>
>        Well, any hints would be appreciated.
>
>
>
>
>Stuart_Hall
>aka Corwin
>#include BITNET <FSJJP@ALASKA.BITNET>
>#include EMAIL <FSJJP@ACAD3.ALASKA.EDU>



Haven't we been through this before???

The Diety can do what ever he bloddy well wants to and there's not much you can
do about it.

If you don't have the time to play the game perhaps you should give up and turn
the country over to your co-ruler or quit all together.



Shadowhawke 
Supreme ruler of the Shadowlands
From: jbatka@desire.wright.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: A REALLY Serious suggestion for research
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:46:01 GMT
Article-I.D.: desire.1992Oct14.144601.4785
Organization: Wright State University

Instead of long-winded gripes,

	...how about some short-winded suggestions :)

If you want to make research useful,

I liked the idea posted about 1-2 months ago of using it to reduce your
casualties during combat.  It makes sense since research represents
a countries medical technology.  When you receive combat casualties,
have some fraction of them turned into national reserves dependent
upon your national research level.

	Your WIAs get wisked out of the combat zone to M*A*S*Hs
	When stabilized they get trasported to your national health
		system
	Upon recovery, they get discharged from the hospital back
		into military service (but as reservests ready to
		serve when needed)

not having access to a UNIX machine, I was never able to get my
hands on the Empire source code, but it seems to me to be a relatively
easy programming job.

I'd even volunteer to try to do it except for the above problem and
the fact that I am already working long hours to try to finish my
thesis.

Think about it,

-- 

   Jim Batka  | Always remember ...                        | Buckaroo
   Modemman   |    No matter where you go, there you are!  |   Bonzai
--------------+--------------------------------------------+--------------
   Ruler of   | Work Email:  BATKAJ@CCMAIL.DAYTON.SAIC.COM | Elvis is
  Gaultheria  | Home Email:  JBATKA@DESIRE.WRIGHT.EDU      |   DEAD!
--------------+--------------------------------------------+--------------
   Jim Batka  | 64 years is 33,661,440 minutes ...         | Beatles:
  The Shadow  |    and a minute is a LONG time!            |   Yellow Submarine
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Empire Babble
From: cvadrayb@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu (Dr. Strange)
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:23:24 PST
Organization: California State Polytechnic University, Pomona
Nntp-Posting-User: cvadrayb

Man is there alot of flaming going on here..

Well, Don't take this post very seriously, and if you're the type of person
who thinks unexperienced player's opinions are worth as little as the paper
they arn't printed on, just skip this message.. because I'm a very
unexperienced player, but would like to say a few things..

Empire is wierd.. I've played stratagy games like empire for years (from
SC on the Mac, Empire on Amiga, War in Europe on the Apple, and scores of
board games), but I've neve seen anything like Empire.. It seems to get
very detailed about certain things, while vertually ignoring other important
aspects entirely.. I've been reading this news group for almost a year now,
and I'm still amazed people bother posting messages complaining that Empire
is unrealistic because of so and so a reason.. My god.. Empire is so
unrealistic it's hardly worth saving.. But it is an awfully fun GAME.. I mean,
who cares if people are working for nothing or not, or that a magical limit
of 999 people per hex exists.. as long as everyone knows the rules, and they
are consistant, there shouldn't be any problem, right? 

Well.. Whatever.. Anyway, I don't know about the history of Empire, but it
looks like it is a game that started off fairly simple and got modified into
it's current chaotic form.. One advantage of that, of course, is if you keep
changing the rules, you're less likely to get bored of it.

10 years ago, I wrote a 26 player WWII war game for a BBS I ran, with turns
due every day, etc.. I guess you could call it an 'Empire like game', but it
was, of course, very different. However, I've been working on writing a,
newer, better version to run as a server, but was interested in a few things:

Firstly: What are people most interested in, in these games? Moving peices
         around in order to out-tactic you enemy,
or the economics of building up a country/ surviving in a war time economy..
etc.. What aspects of Empire draw you back to the game? I'd like to hear
a few opinions..

thanks for you time.
-Me
/ed "How come there isn't a 'Secondly' to the above paragraph?"
/spud "Hey.. my people are dieing? Are they all idiots or something? there's
       and ag center right next door!"
From: ts@chainsaw.ecn.purdue.edu (Thomas Ruschak)
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Re: Christmas Mods list...
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:35:42 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

Just a couple of minor comments:

In article <1992Oct9.131117.25608@col.hp.com> smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith) writes:
>v069myl2@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Jennifer N Manning) writes:
>> 3)  Fixed Tradeships (according to Chainsaw code)
>> 	Instead of just scuttling the tradeships in an allyharbor, why not
>> have ships be able to sail back and forth?  
>> Why bother?- once again, slightly more realistic and probably not too difficult
>> to code.

	Well, part of the point of trade ships is having them be a way of 
using lcms/hcms/work to make money, and thus make lcms/hcms worth more. Right
now, lcms/hcms become worthless after a point.

><Note: sales pitch follows...>
>
>Bill Frolik's HP-Corvallis mods have a sector "x", a "trade center".  It
>functions somewhat as a harbor and an airport.  Can't build planes or
>ships there, but you can sail in/out and fly in/out.  Trade centers can
>be "opened" to other countries, so they can sail in and buy/sell commodities
>automatically, depending on bid/sale prices/thresholds in the trade center.
>You can sail an ore ship full of iron over to your iron-starved neighbor,
>unload however much he'll buy, and see if he has any gold you'd want to
>buy.  Just keep sailing back and forth, buying and selling.  If only
>ore ships could be deleted and their function merged into the cargo
>ship, you could trade iron for lcm with the same ship...:-)

	UNfortunately, none of the commods except gold/oil are scarce enough to
be worth trading much. Oil and gold are needed by everyone, so trading there is 
limited too...

>> 4)  Sneak attack (Amendment to Slow_war in Chainsaw)
>> 	Slow_war is entertaining and all, but I think for a slightly higher
>> fee, you should be able to either a)attack immediately or b) hide your 
>> war declaration until you actually attack.

	This could be done, but it'd have to be EXPENSIVE. Say, 1/2 your 
cash? I am still unsure as to the worth of the Slow_War mod. I'm hoping that
when I poll the Chainsaw game players that I'll get more feedback. (Yes, I 
know, it's my mod... doesn't mean I'm sure it's good, tho)

>Hmm...I think I agree with Jennifer.   Hitler didn't give any 2-update
>warning to the Poles or French...

	Well, I have to disagree. The Poles had several months of knowng that
war with Germany was coming. It may not have been a 'declared' war, but it
amounts to the same thing. The French situation is different, of course.
War was declared there MONTHS before they attacked (although it was France &
GB declaring war first, with Germany just returning the favor). In empire terms,
France had at least 4 or so updates of warning.. In fact, this Franco-German
situation is where the term Sitzkrieg, used in Slow_War, comes from! :-)

Tom
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
From: gabe@rucs2.sunlab.cs.runet.edu (zodiac)
Subject:  Macintosh EMPIRE code
Organization: Radford University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 17:59:24 GMT

The subject says it all.  Can anyone E-mail me ftp sites where I can
get any Macintosh sources for EMPIRE on Macintosh (non-UNIX).  Thanks
in advance.
-- 
ZZZZZZZZ-----------|Systems Administrator--------------------------------------|
Z   ZZZ  odiac     |AberMud: muselab.ac.runet.edu 6715 ~~Radford~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
  ZZZ  Z           |CDLPMud: muselab.ac.runet.edu 3000 ~~~~University, VA~~~~~~|
ZZZZZZZZ___________|IRC:_____muselab.ac.runet.edu 6667_________________________|
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
From: fsjjp@acad3.alaska.edu (Whatya Want?  Get Screwed)
Subject: Re: TYRO I
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41.UAC
Organization: P.A.R.A.N.O.I.A
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 04:48:00 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.204133.10545@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, kpearce@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (BULLDAWG) writes...
>To the TYRO I game diety.
> 
>Since I seem to have mis-placed the adress:
> 
>	Withdraw me from the game.  I don't think that it is a good
>idead to try and have a game without the express approval / knowledge
                                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^         
>of the system Admins.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

                Hmmm, reminds of a game *I* was in, see following post by me


> 
>LSF, kpearce@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
> 
>kpearce@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
>            __	         _____      ________
>           / /\	        //  __\    / /_____/\ 
>	  / / /       //  (  |||  / /\_____\/
>         / / /         \\  \     / /_/___
>        / / /           ))  )   / /_____/\ 
>       / /_/__	         )) )  / /\_____\/
>      /______/\    |||__|| /  / / /
>       \_____\/     \\____/   \_\/  (tm)                           
> 
>where I work, not where I play.

        DISCLAIMER:  *chuckle* .. Do I need one?

        Btw, I'm just piggy backing on this .. 

Stuart_Hall
aka Corwin
#include BITNET <FSJJP@ALASKA.BITNET>
#include EMAIL <FSJJP@ACAD3.ALASKA.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.games.empire
Subject: Re: Making research meaningful
From: jfeldhouse@miavx3.mid.muohio.edu (Jim Feldhouse)
Date: 7 Oct 92 20:55:49 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: as little as possible

I suggest empire lose plague and research entirely.
How many of you can say that the possibility of
plague and making research have added to your enjoyment
of empire?
I suspect not many can answer yes.

The idea of trying to make research more useful is backwards.
You are trying to fix what I consider a bad rule with more rules.

Research was probably added to penalize those with a high tech,
and add an extra cost to running a country with a high tech in
hopes of slowing down said tech production.  If you want to make
tech production more expensive at those high levels then increase
the amount tech decreases per amount of tech per X etus.

Plague & research are redundant.
Research is just another complication that doesn't add to
empire whatsoever.

jim