From: sl9b4@cc.usu.edu (Deep Six)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Time mechanics, healing and aiming
Date: 6 Sep 92 08:07:13 GMT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1992Sep5.094350.58655@cc.usu.edu>, slp66@cc.usu.edu writes:

> Let's say you are getting healed after a AD&D fight.  You've taken, oh, 
> 20 hit points.  Your Cleric walks up and heals 19 of them.
>
> Now, GURPS.  You are in a fire fight.  (TL7) You get hit with, say, an M-16,
> that does 2 points to you (after getting through your armor).  Your medic 
> walks up to you and does first aid.  After 5 minutes, the medic rolls a 6 
> sided dice and hey, you get 2 points back...your healed.  Now, how did that 
> happen.  You were shot and wounded.  THen, 5 minutes later....your are 
> healed.  THis wound should take at least a week to heal, maybe longer.  
> There just isn't any realism.

First of all, First Aid takes 20 minutes. Second, what is your point? You're
saying that both systems allow PCs to take damage and stay fighting. That
is a necassary evil if you want to play longer than five minute at a time.
ANY (real) person who is wounded is going to need a week to heal, but that
just isn't fun to play. Every system I know of allows PCs to take more 
damage, heal faster and do more than ordinary people. It is most certainly
true with both AD&D and GURPS.

> Ok, now, why do I think that AD&D is more realistic?  Well, it centers around
> the one minute round.  You can still move and fight.  If you get hit on, say
> the 20 second mark, you've still 40 seconds to adjust (you know, scream, whine,
> moan, complain, die, etc). As somebody in this thread has pointed out, not so
> in GURPS.  Every second you can get hit and not notice it.

So you are saying that GURPS should allow PCs to bitch and moan about their
wounds, THEN keep fighting, right? In either system you have PCs taking more
damage than any real person could take and keep smiling. In GURPS you have
people taking damage and not feeling it, but in AD&D you have people getting
hurt, taking a 40 second break, getting their bearings and then rejoining
the fight. Which is realistic? 

And let's not forget that GURPS has many more rules for ``combat shock'' 
than AD&D. For example, don't forget Matt that when your character is hit,
he/she has a penalty to hit equal to the amount of damage taken (you forgot
that because every single one of your PCs has taken High Pain Thresh). Also, 
when a character reaches 3 HT, movement is halved. There are many rules 
for stunning and knock back/down. AD&D (1st ed, anyway) doesn't have such
rules. You take your damage (many times more than you take in GURPS), take
you 40 second breather, then keep fighting. Which is realistic.


> Let's say I'm
> playing GURPS.  (TL7) I'm aiming my gun at a target say, 200 yards away.  The
> round before I shoot, I get shot.  Let's say I've got good armor and the bullet
> does no damage.  Does the impact of a piece of metal traveling at 2000 feet per
> second and impacting me with 800 foot pounds of force even affect my aim? 
> Nope.  Thats just not real.

That's not the rules. You would have to make an IQ or Will roll (can't 
remember which right now) roll to maintain that aim. Even so, you evidently 
missed the thread (and a similar one in the group sci.military) about how 
much force a bullet actually has. One person brought up a video promotion 
done by (I think) the 2nd Chance company (makers of fine body armor). The 
video showed the CEO or President of 2nd Chance (or whatever company) 
standing on one foot while wearing a bullet-proof vest. At point-blank 
range, this person was shot with an assault rifle (AK-47, if memory serves) 
and he didn't flinch, let alone fall over. Physics aside, bullets don't have 
that much energy.

And apart from that, the same thing can happen in AD&D, except you can be
hit MORE in AD&D and still function normally (boy, a 20 second break can do
wonders when you're in combat).

Again, no flames intended here. It's just that you are getting away with 
murder here in terms of unanswered arguments and faulty logic, I thought I 
would try to point some of that out for the sake of the discussion.

Okay,
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chadd VanZanten SL9B4@CC.USU.EDU + ``Charlie don't surf!'' --Big Duke in 
Francis Coppala's Apocolypse Now
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy