HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Eye strain among programmers
Date: 30 Aug 92 03:39:46 GMT
	<LAUB.92Aug25194952@laub.Software.Mitel.COM>
	<mark.714965455@bruce.cs.monash.edu.au>
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.
In-reply-to: mark@cs.monash.edu.au's message of 28 Aug 92 01:30:55 GMT

>>>>> On 28 Aug 92 01:30:55 GMT, mark@cs.monash.edu.au (Mark Goodwin) said:
Mark> laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau) writes:
Mark> >Does anyone have a medical explanation on why fluorescent light
Mark> >gives headache?

Mark> I have long suspected that 50(or60)Hz fluorescents somehow
				 ^^^^^^^^^^
Mark> strobe with the refresh rate of the display monitor. 60 Vrs. 72
Mark> Hz refresh on your monitor *does* seem to make a difference
Mark> (72Hz is better). Monitors with 60Hz refresh rate under
Mark> fluorescents at 50Hz seem to flicker.  (note: in Australia our
Mark> mains power is 50Hz).

>>>>> On 29 Aug 92 05:54:34 GMT, nelsonm@leela.cs.orst.edu (Michael Nelson) said:
Michael> In <LAUB.92Aug25194952@laub.Software.Mitel.COM> laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau) writes:

Michael> >Does anyone have a medical explanation on why fluorescent
Michael> >light gives headache?

Michael> I think my pen test may provide insight.  Try wave a pen or
Michael> similar item in from of the minitor.  In many cases I notce
Michael> that there is a definite strobe affect.  My dad also noticed
Michael> that the early mac screen sometimes appeared to flicker when
Michael> seen through peripheral vision (better at detecting motion).

Michael> I believe the problem may have a lot to do with the screen
Michael> refresh rate, and the flourescent lights mixing and producing
Michael> a low frequency (10hz?) light fluctiation that is detectable
	   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Michael> enough to cause strain.  Of course I could be wrong.
	 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The explanations are plausible - monitors with low refresh rate always
irritate my eyes.
--
Boniface Lau    (613) 592-2122 ext. 3042    Boniface_Lau@Mitel.COM
Mitel Corp.  				    
350 Legget Drive, Kanata
Ontario, Canada, K2K 1X3
From: nelsonm@leela.cs.orst.edu (Michael Nelson)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Eye strain among programmers
Date: 29 Aug 92 05:54:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: leela.1992Aug29.055434.7834
Distribution: usa
Organization: Computer Science Outreach Services - Oregon State University

In <LAUB.92Aug25194952@laub.Software.Mitel.COM> laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau) writes:

>Does anyone have a medical explanation on why fluorescent light gives
>headache? 

I think my pen test may provide insight.  Try wave a pen or similar
item in from of the minitor.  In many cases I notce that there is
a definite strobe affect.  My dad also noticed that the early mac
screen sometimes appeared to flicker when seen through peripheral
vision (better at detecting motion).  

I believe the problem may have a lot to do with the screen refresh
rate, and the flourescent lights mixing and producing a low frequency
(10hz?) light fluctiation that is detectable enough to cause strain.
Of course I could be wrong.

PS. Anyone bothered by the high pitched wines that many manitors seem
to produce.  

>--
>Boniface Lau    (613) 592-2122 ext. 3042    Boniface_Lau@Mitel.COM
>Mitel Corp.  				    
>350 Legget Drive, Kanata
>Ontario, Canada, K2K 1X3
--
Michael Nelson
From: laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Eye strain among programmers
Date: 25 Aug 92 23:49:52 GMT
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.
In-reply-to: tower@raisin-nut.ai.mit.edu's message of 23 Aug 92 18:19:49 GMT

>>>>> On 23 Aug 92 18:19:49 GMT, tower@raisin-nut.ai.mit.edu (Leonard H. Tower Jr.) said:

Leonard> In article <tertium.714333371@milton> tertium@milton.u.washington.edu (l boyd) writes:
Leonard> |Anyone els have a problem with eye strain?  A few weeks ago,
Leonard> |a light went out in my office, which, btw, is a 10x10 former
Leonard> |closet with *8* flourescent lights in the office.

Leonard> Turn the fluorescent off.

Many people, myself included, found working under fluorescent light
gives eye strain and headache. However, none of the architectural
lighting books mention this about fluorescent light.

Does anyone have a medical explanation on why fluorescent light gives
headache? 
--
Boniface Lau    (613) 592-2122 ext. 3042    Boniface_Lau@Mitel.COM
Mitel Corp.  				    
350 Legget Drive, Kanata
Ontario, Canada, K2K 1X3
From: tower@raisin-nut.ai.mit.edu (Leonard H. Tower Jr.)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Typing Injuries - Cubital Tunnel Syndrome
Keywords: Cubital, Ulnar, Nerve, Keyboard
Date: 25 Aug 92 20:04:05 GMT
Organization: Humanity

In article <1992Aug25.003315.24420@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> ematias@dgp.toronto.edu (Edgar Matias) writes:
|
|In article <1992Aug24.193001.1187@ryn.mro4.dec.com>
|fortmiller@danger.enet.dec.com (Ed Fortmiller) writes:
|>  For example:  Control Lock A S D F G H J K L ; ' \ Return.
|>
| 
|Believe it or not, that is the ISO standard (the right side at least).
|I HATE ISO keyboards with a passion!  If I had a dime for every time I
|hit \ instead of Return...  (...I could probably afford to hire someone
|to hit that key for me. :-)

Standardizing keyboards layouts is absurd, as there is no standard for
the human beings who use them.

I wish that instead of trying to standardize keyboard layouts, they
would standardize the connectors between keyboards and display, and
between tracking devices (e.g. a mouse) and the display, so that any
keyboard (or tracking device) would work with any display.

That would allow us all to find and use the input devices that work
best for each of us.  We could take our own personal input devices
from job to job.

It also be a big boon to the disabled.

enjoy -len

Member of the League for Programming Freedom.
Ask <league@prep.ai.mit.edu> via e-mail for information. 
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: pcalvert@nyx.cs.du.edu (P. Calvert)
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 15:00:30 GMT

In article <35100001@hpuplca.nsr.hp.com> jeff@hpuplca.nsr.hp.com (     Je
f Gruszynski) writes:
>>In sci.med.occupational, jdc3538@ultb.isc.rit.edu (J.D. Cronin ) writes

>>
>>    Have any of you folks noticed progressively worse nearsightness
>>    working on CRT's?  
>>
>>    Jim
>
>Absolutely!  Before I got deeply into computers I had 20/40 and 20/60.
>It got progressively worse with time.  I also suffered from eye strain
>and headaches following long stints.  I saw an ophthalmologist and was
>prescribed a second, weaker correcting pair of glasses for "up-close"
>work including computing.  Since then I've been pretty stable (5+ years)

>with only some minor astigmatism rotation, which may well be measurement
>noise.  BTW I'm 20/100 and 20/200 now.
>
>Jeff



Actually, people with good vision that is starting to deteriorate (e.g.
mild myopia) can reduce the stress of close-up work by wearing a weak pairr
of reading glasses.  These can be purchased in most drugstores for $10-12.
Sometimes I wear a pair of these over my contact lenses when I have to do
a lot of reading.  I told my optometrist that I do this and he said that
it's a good idea.
From: fms@sw.stratus.com (Faith Senie)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:51:53 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <14299@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, pburch@roc.mbcr.bcm.tmc.edu (Paula Burch)
writes:
> 
> If you are myopic enough to wear corrective lenses, there's a simple 
> solution to the problem of worsening vision--get hard contact lenses. 
> They are supposed to prevent your vision from continuing to worsen. 
> (Is this really true?)
> 
> Gas-permeable hard lenses are supposed to be more comfortable than the 
> old-style hard lenses, which I found intolerable, and I've heard they 
> can accomplish the same sort of prevention. Doesn't this mean that
> we should put our children in these, instead of glasses, when they
> first develop problems? (Gosh, if my parents could have done this for 
> me when I was eight, maybe I'd be able to see SOMETHING without 
> corrective lenses now!)

I think I'd rather stay myopic -- I tried gas-permeable lenses for a couple
of months, but had to stop wearing them because they made my eyes itch something
fierce.  Sort of like a pollen itch, only more so.  They also cost four
times what my most expensive pair of glasses has ever cost me.  I just figured
it wasn't worth the money to pay for the extra aggravation, and even had someone
told me that they might keep my vision from worsening, I would still have given
up on them...


-- 
Faith M. Senie            InterNet: fms@vos.stratus.com
Stratus Computer, Inc.    InterNet: fms@hoop.sw.stratus.com
55 Fairbanks Blvd.       Pkt Radio: n1jit@ka1srd.ma.usa.na
Marlboro, MA 01752           Phone: (508)460-2632

"I'm afraid I don't know very much about Romulan Disruptor settings" --Spock
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: gcody@gandalf.ca (Gord Cody)
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Organization: Gandalf Data Ltd.
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 13:57:09 GMT

In <tertium.715390214@milton> tertium@milton.u.washington.edu (l boyd) writes:

>pcalvert@nyx.cs.du.edu (P. Calvert) writes:

     [stuff deleted about weak $10 glasses (shudder)]

>Sorry I missed this strain -- is there a consensus among programmers about
>progressive myopia?  I was *stunned* the other day when my 2nd exam in a row
>showed progressive myopia.  I am well over 20 (the age when myopia progression
>slows) and have always enjoyed super-normal vision.  

>The opthamologist said that this is an ongoing debate in opthamology.  Pity.
>If I am required to work in conditions that are going to affect my long-term
>health, the I think I ought to get some compensation.  As it is now, eye-strain
>and myopia are not allowed by worker's comp.

>lauren

We don't debate this. We are sure of it. Many people I know that had 20-20 
vision or better into their mid 20s, needing glasses after working with
computers all day for a 3-6 years. Those that had previously worn glasses
found themselves needing still stronger pairs (me included) after years
of almost no change.

At least our corporate health plan helps pay for new specs. Some people
aren't so lucky.

Gord Cody - all opinions are MINE,MINE,MINE #$@%^#!##:^)  gcody@gandalf.ca
Gandalf Mobile Systems Inc. - the company has its own     613-723-6500 x 8817
2 Gurdwara Rd. Nepean Ont. Can.  #define  th_th_th_thats_all_folks  }
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: beal@paladin.owego.ny.us (Alan Beal)
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Organization: The Design Committee
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 1992 04:29:28 GMT

tertium@milton.u.washington.edu (l boyd) writes:

>pcalvert@nyx.cs.du.edu (P. Calvert) writes:

>>Actually, people with good vision that is starting to deteriorate (e.g.
>>mild myopia) can reduce the stress of close-up work by wearing a weak pairr
>>of reading glasses.

>Sorry I missed this strain -- is there a consensus among programmers about
>progressive myopia?  I was *stunned* the other day when my 2nd exam in a row
>showed progressive myopia.  I am well over 20 (the age when myopia progression
>slows) and have always enjoyed super-normal vision.  

I am over 30 and my myopia has progressed ever since I started working with
computers over 9 years ago.  About 5 years ago, my eye doctor recommended
using a weaker pair.  Although my myopia is still getting worse, I am less
tired after wearing the weaker glasses all day.


-- 
Alan Beal
Internet: beal@paladin.Owego.NY.US
USENET:   {uunet,uunet!bywater!scifi}!paladin!beal
From: tsf@CS.CMU.EDU (Timothy Freeman)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Date: 23 Aug 92 18:30:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: U.TSF.92Aug23133045
	<Aug.22.22.15.47.1992.21783@pilot.njin.net>
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Originator: tsf@U.ERGO.CS.CMU.EDU

In article <Aug.22.22.15.47.1992.21783@pilot.njin.net> birchall@pilot.njin.net (Shag) writes:
   In theory, brown letters on white strain your eyes the least.  

Whose theory?  It seems to me that all colors of light get focused by
the same mechanism in the eye, so I find the idea that some colors are
less straining than others hard to swallow.
--
Tim Freeman <tsf@cs.cmu.edu>    CompuServe ID 71045,2267 checked occasionally.
When they took the fourth amendment, I was silent because I don't deal drugs.
When they took the sixth amendment, I kept quiet because I know I'm innocent.
When they took the second amendment, I said nothing because I don't own a gun.
Now they've come for the first amendment, and I can't say anything at all.
From: laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Date: 25 Aug 92 23:56:35 GMT
	<Aug.22.22.15.47.1992.21783@pilot.njin.net>
	<TSF.92Aug23133045@U.ERGO.CS.CMU.EDU>
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.
In-reply-to: tsf@CS.CMU.EDU's message of 23 Aug 92 18:30:45 GMT

>>>>> On 23 Aug 92 18:30:45 GMT, tsf@CS.CMU.EDU (Timothy Freeman) said:
Timothy> In article <Aug.22.22.15.47.1992.21783@pilot.njin.net> birchall@pilot.njin.net (Shag) writes:
Timothy>    In theory, brown letters on white strain your eyes the least.  

Timothy> Whose theory?  It seems to me that all colors of light get
Timothy> focused by the same mechanism in the eye, so I find the idea
Timothy> that some colors are less straining than others hard to
Timothy> swallow.

I am surprised to hear that - try this: turn the contrast and the
brightness to the highest level, then look at a black characters on
white background display and compare that with a white characters on
black background display. I believe you will feel the difference on eye
strain. 

--
Boniface Lau    (613) 592-2122 ext. 3042    Boniface_Lau@Mitel.COM
Mitel Corp.  				    
350 Legget Drive, Kanata
Ontario, Canada, K2K 1X3
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: schwartz@nynexst.com (S. H. Schwartz)
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Reply-To: schwartz@nynexst.com
Organization: Expert Systems Lab., NYNEX Sci. and Tech., White Plains NY
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 22:10:00 GMT

In article 1887@apgea.army.mil, ahgrabow@apgea.army.mil (Alexander H. Grabowski <ahgrabow>) writes:
>In article <1992Aug24.113954.23377@meiko.com> mike@meiko.com (Mike Stok) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug23.215542.29511@spss.com> stuart@spss.com (Stuart Schmukler) writes:
>>>All of the colors in the spectum _do_not_ focus at the same point.  I
>>>think they call it chromatic abrevation *sic*.  An Optical Physics
>>>text could explain it in detail.
>
>Only that it's called *aberration*, not abrevation!

It's certainly aggravation, any way you spell it!
---
Steven H. Schwartz		Expert Systems Laboratory
schwartz@nynexst.com		NYNEX Science and Technology Center
PROFS: SCHWARTZ@UNIX		500 Westchester Avenue
914-644-2960			White Plains NY 10604
From: ahgrabow@apgea.army.mil (Alexander H. Grabowski <ahgrabow>)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Date: 26 Aug 92 19:40:49 GMT
Organization: ATE1 S7=255 S11=55 V1 X1 S0=0

In article <1992Aug24.113954.23377@meiko.com> mike@meiko.com (Mike Stok) writes:
>In article <1992Aug23.215542.29511@spss.com> stuart@spss.com (Stuart Schmukler) writes:
>>All of the colors in the spectum _do_not_ focus at the same point.  I
>>think they call it chromatic abrevation *sic*.  An Optical Physics
>>text could explain it in detail.

Only that it's called *aberration*, not abrevation!

(latin, aberrare= to go the wrong way, to leave the former way).
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: mark@cs.monash.edu.au (Mark Goodwin)
Subject: Re: Eye strain among programmers
Organization: Computer Science, Monash University, Australia
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 01:30:55 GMT

laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau) writes:

>Many people, myself included, found working under fluorescent light
>gives eye strain and headache. However, none of the architectural
>lighting books mention this about fluorescent light.

>Does anyone have a medical explanation on why fluorescent light gives
>headache? 

I have long suspected that 50(or60)Hz fluorescents somehow strobe with
the refresh rate of the display monitor. 60 Vrs. 72 Hz refresh on your
monitor *does* seem to make a difference (72Hz is better). Monitors
with 60Hz refresh rate under fluorescents at 50Hz seem to flicker.
(note: in Australia our mains power is 50Hz).

People come into my office and ask why it's always so dark!

Mark.
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: tertium@milton.u.washington.edu (l boyd)
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 23:30:14 GMT

pcalvert@nyx.cs.du.edu (P. Calvert) writes:

>Actually, people with good vision that is starting to deteriorate (e.g.
>mild myopia) can reduce the stress of close-up work by wearing a weak pairr
>of reading glasses.  These can be purchased in most drugstores for $10-12.
>Sometimes I wear a pair of these over my contact lenses when I have to do
>a lot of reading.  I told my optometrist that I do this and he said that
>it's a good idea.

Trouble is that the weakest pair of over the counter glasses is +1.25 D glasses
and that's too much for some. 

Sorry I missed this strain -- is there a consensus among programmers about
progressive myopia?  I was *stunned* the other day when my 2nd exam in a row
showed progressive myopia.  I am well over 20 (the age when myopia progression
slows) and have always enjoyed super-normal vision.  

The opthamologist said that this is an ongoing debate in opthamology.  Pity.
If I am required to work in conditions that are going to affect my long-term
health, the I think I ought to get some compensation.  As it is now, eye-strain
and myopia are not allowed by worker's comp.

lauren
From: acm@Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Typing Injuries - Carpal Tunnel Syndrome
Date: 26 Aug 1992 00:54:40 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mountain View CA
Distribution: world
Reply-To: acm@Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae)
NNTP-Posting-Host: grendal.corp.sun.com
Keywords: Cubital, Ulnar, Nerve, Keyboard

In article <27184@life.ai.mit.edu>, tower@raisin-nut.ai.mit.edu (Leonard H. Tower Jr.) writes:
 > Standardizing keyboards layouts is absurd, as there is no standard for
 > the human beings who use them.
  
 > I wish that instead of trying to standardize keyboard layouts, they
 > would standardize the connectors between keyboards and display, and
 > between tracking devices (e.g. a mouse) and the display, so that any
 > keyboard (or tracking device) would work with any display.
 > 
 > That would allow us all to find and use the input devices that work
 > best for each of us.  We could take our own personal input devices
 > from job to job.
 > 
 > It also be a big boon to the disabled.


Check out something called the Access Bus.  It is an attempt to create
a standard interconnect between user I/O devices.  It was designed by
DEC using existing Philips components.  It allows multiple devices (up
to 125?) to be daisy-chained on one shielded cable.  It also allows
hot connect and dis-connect of devices without rebooting the computer.

Wouldn't it be nice to be able to have more than one keyboard and pointing
device on your machine and to be able to take those devices and plug them
into any computer?  <sigh>

						Andrew MacRae
From: stuart@spss.com (Stuart Schmukler)
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
Subject: Re: Progressive nearsightness from CRT use
Date: 23 Aug 92 21:55:42 GMT
Organization: SPSS Inc.


All of the colors in the spectum _do_not_ focus at the same point.  I
think they call it chromatic abrevation *sic*.  An Optical Physics
text could explain it in detail.

Stuart
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational
From: jensen@unlinfo.unl.edu (michael jensen)
Subject: Re: Eye strain among programmers
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 18:22:50 GMT

nelsonm@leela.cs.orst.edu (Michael Nelson) writes:

>In <LAUB.92Aug25194952@laub.Software.Mitel.COM> laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau) writes:

>>Does anyone have a medical explanation on why fluorescent light gives
>>headache? 

>I think my pen test may provide insight.  Try wave a pen or similar
>item in from of the minitor.  In many cases I notce that there is
>a definite strobe affect.  My dad also noticed that the early mac
>screen sometimes appeared to flicker when seen through peripheral
>vision (better at detecting motion).  

>I believe the problem may have a lot to do with the screen refresh
>rate, and the flourescent lights mixing and producing a low frequency
>(10hz?) light fluctiation that is detectable enough to cause strain.
>Of course I could be wrong.

Some study somewhere found that under fluorescent lights, many 
people's iris subtly contract and expand, responding to the flicker of
the lights. This seems on the face or it absurd, given the lack of 
perceivable flicker, but since the rods&cones have "persistence of 
vision" effects, while the iris doesn't, it may make some sense. How 
the iris "perceives" light density I don't know, but that may have 
something to do with eyestrain/headaches under fluorescents. I hate 
'em, and turn them off whenever I can. The biggest reason for 
fluorescent lights being so universal is that they use 10% of the 
power of indandescents. Now that the new long-lasting non-fluorescent 
low-power bulbs are on the market, that may change again.

>PS. Anyone bothered by the high pitched wines that many manitors seem
>to produce.  

There was a study done by (I think) the NIH that showed that women in 
particular are affected by the high-pitched whine, and that their 
responsivity to that frequency varied depending on their point in 
their cycle. No joke here, though various ones could be created. There
is great variability between individuals on frequency response, as the
responses in this group on this point indicate.

>>--
>>Boniface Lau    (613) 592-2122 ext. 3042    Boniface_Lau@Mitel.COM
>>Mitel Corp.  				    
>>350 Legget Drive, Kanata
>>Ontario, Canada, K2K 1X3
>--
>Michael Nelson

Michael Jensen
Electronic Media Manager
University of Nebraska Press
jensen@unlinfo.unl.edu
standard disclaimers in effect
Newsgroups: sci.med.occupational