From: jd5f+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jeffrey Dunkle)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.owning
Subject: Re: Aircraft Owner Maintenance
Date: 15 Oct 92 19:48:28 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

I'll add my two cents to this thread of discussion.  Though not an
"owner" per se, I am president of a 36 member flying club which owns 3
Cessna singles, instrument rated, and an A&P....though I never practiced
the craft professionally.  I don't have my FAR's here at my office so I
don't want to profess accuracy to the following, but to get an A&P you
need the following:

1. An apprenticeship signed by an I/A (I believe, perhaps just an A&P)
stating that you've had 18 months apprenticeship in airframe maintenance
or 18 months apprenticeship in engine maintenance, or 30 months as both
(I'm not remembering exactly the number of months...these are close).

or

Graduated from an approved school.

2.  With either of those requirements met you must then take a written
exam to which there are about 7 sections.  You retest only failed
sections, not the whole exam.  (again, i forget the exact number of
sections but they cover airframe, engine, systems, theory and repair,
etc).  By the way, King Schools has produces what's supposed to be an
excellent A&P video course for the written exam.

3. Take an airframe and and engine "practical" administered by a
designated examiner.

A&P schools obviously have facilities and designated examiners on their
staffs, mostly for their graduates.  There are some professional
school/services that will prep you for your written and pratcticals in a
week long crash course provided, of course, that you have the
apprenticeship or training documentation.  In my case I was a Viet Nam
era maintenance specialist in the Air FOrce before going to graduate
school.  (molecular biology)  On graduation with an MS I couldn't find a
job right away and taught sciences at a local A&P school.  My Air FOrce
service documentation was the equivalent of an apprenticeship according
to the local FAA office, so I boned up, took the writtens, and the
school staff gave me my practicals (to which they were disposed to pass
me, of course...but i did legitimately pass the writtens)

What does all this mean for the enthusiast.  I understand that some
people have worked with an I/A to "supervise" the restoration of an old
plane, engine and all, which is a great learning experience, and the I/A
singed apprentice documentation.  Studying for the written is not easy,
and I suspect several months of study would be required) but that could
be taken.  A commercial prep course could be used for the practical
(these are often advertised in Trade-A-Plane for example).

As for currency requirements, I've not seen any NPRMs or new FARs yet on
that, though it would be good idea, as aren't required to keep logs on
their work independent of the log entries on the aircraft books.  FARs
on currency are interpreted as you must have worked in the field in the
last two years or must retake your practical or be recertified by an FAA
examiner (which has no structure, it could be a pracitcal test, or just
an interview).  In reality this is usually interpreted that you must
have signed a log book returnining an aircraft to service within the
last two years.

I/As have more stringent requirements and do have certification
maintenance requirements somewhat similar to flight
instructors....weekend seminars are often used by I/As to fulfill this
requirement.

Hope this helps a bit.  It "is" possible for someone to get an
A&P...but...as long as you know an A&P willing to sign off the work you
do, its perfectly legal for you to work on your plane under his/her
"supervision"...which interprets, if he's willing to sign for it...you
can do it.  Its his license at risk so these signatures aren't given
capreciously, but A&Ps will work with you in this regard.  I don't do
much maintenance for my club, as I have a full time job and fly only for
fun, but I will sign off simple jobs done by mechanically adept club
members after inspecting the work.  And it is perfectly legal to do so.

Hope this helps a bit.
From: myshatyn@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Mike Myshatyn)
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 15:49:09 GMT
Subject: Re: Insurance Compaines
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA