HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
Subject: Tiruvoymoli (thiruvaaymozhi) of Nammalwar (nammaazhvaar)1.1.5
Date: 28 Aug 92 13:47:27 GMT
Reply-To: srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (K.Srinivasan)
Organization: IREQ, Hydro-Quebec, QC, Canada
Originator: srini@acr

\(TAMIL) thiruvaay mozhi 1.1.5
avaravar thamathamadhu aRivu aRi vagai vagai
avaravar iRaiyavar ena adi adaivargaL
avaravar iRaiyavar kuRaivu ilar iRaiyavar
avaravar vidhivazhi adaiya ninRanarE

\J \(ROMAN) Different people (avaravar) worship (ena adi adaivargaL),
their own (avaravar) gods (iRaiyavar), based what they learned (aRi)
with their repective (thamathamadhu) intelligence (aRivu)
in different ways (vagai vagai).

The different (avaravar) gods (iRaiyavar)
are capable of granting grace (iRai) to them (avar)
without any flaws (kuRaivu ilar).

'The Lord' has manifested (ninRanarE) himself through all the forms, to
grace (adaiya) everybody through their own (avaravar) methods (vidhivazhi).\j

(The Parama Atma expresses himself through all the forms)

K. Srinivasan  srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca
From: vigneswa@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: y? ask why!
Date: 26 Aug 92 11:43:14 GMT

Sundara Pandian writes:
(follow-up for Kathiravan's posting)

>    I am not sure whether the above verse is in the correct
>  form. The one I remember is
>   [ In Adhami transliteration scheme ]
> 
>            Thiruppugazh
>           -------------
>    yErumayil yERi viLaiyaadum mugam onRE
>      eesanudan gnaana mozhi pEsum mugam onRE .....
> 
>    yErumayil yEri viLaiyaadum mugam onRE
>      - This line refers to Pazhamudhir chOlai ( Madurai )

Refer to yERu......

	I observed the use of letter "y" in front of 'uyir ezuththukkaL' 
(consonants) in some SCTamil postings. In their way, 'uyir ezhuththkkaL'
would have  been 'yuyir yezhuththkkaL'.  Why do few  people tend to use 
"y" there?   [y? ask why?]

ADAMI.....

	What does ADAMI suggest?  In my view, 'yERumayil' is wrong.  It
must  be 'ERumayil', right?  If  both are  same for ADAMI, how  does it  
differentiate 'yannal', yAnai', 'yuham', 'yoothar', 'yEsu'... etc?

	Also, in  the above 'thiruppukazh', those first two  words must
have "R", not "r".

Vicky:
UMass, Aug 26
From: prem@cs.montana.edu (M.P.Premkumar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: A reply to Prem kumar on reservation
Date: 26 Aug 92 16:34:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: coe.1992Aug26.163444.2792
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, MSU, Bozeman Mt 59717

In article <1992Aug25.135316.27348@engage.pko.dec.com> thiyagarajan@mims.enet.dec.com (RT) writes:
>
>In one of replies to this issue Mr Prem Kumar asked for evidence when I told
>about reservation. Anyway I want to let the netters know that I have sent him
>all details about my personal experience (it involves some personal data, that
>is why I did not post in sct). Anyone who wants can get the confirmation from
>Prem Kumar.

Yes.

>
>Prem Kumar also wrote than since netters did not follow up his article he
>assumes that it is widely accepted. 

Yes again. I wrote an article way back in ACT about reservations. And I wrote
(supporting certain aspects and opposing some) several articles on reservations
in the last ten days or so in the midst of some useless fighting. Nobody 
refuted or challenged or argued against my views in the net(Mr. Thiyagarajan 
sent me e-mail about his experience and Mr. Muthukrishnana also sent e-mail
regarding this). So I take it that everybody read it and accepted it. Or atleast
the people who were a part of the discussions(Mr. Thiyagarajan, Mr. Kathiravan,
Mr. Karthikeyan, Mr. Muthukrishnan, Mr. Raghu, Mr. Kumar......).

If they did not agree then I take it that they are not interested in discussing
decently about reservations and are only willing to fight it out with little
reasoning and personal attacks.

>I think this may not be true. Many may
>simply pass-over articles without taking time to express their views. So if
>some one do not follow up my article with a different view I will not assume
>that it is accepted
>
>I will write a response to Mr Prem Kumars posting when I have time
>
>RT
>

Sincerely yours,
M.P.Premkumar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tamil
From: sp2@cec1.wustl.edu (Sundara Pandian)
Subject: R.Thiagarajan Vs Niroshan Perera
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 17:49:10 GMT

[ Posted for : M.P.Krishna Raj ( raj@cs.odu.edu ) ]

----------- M.P.Krishna Raj's article ---------------------------- 
In article <9208202105.AA15560@ni.umd.edu> reuss@ni.umd.edu writes:
>> In article <1992Aug20.134023.27704@engage.pko.dec.com> you write:

>> I am sorry that Thiyagarajan was the target of hatemail.  As you rightly

>
>12 minutes after reveiving your message I received a message from
>niro@wam.umd.edu stating that someone had broken into his account and
>deleted all of his files.  The timing of him message tends to make
>me very suspicious.  
>
>I believe niro@wam.umd.edu is Niroshan Perera, an undergraduate
>student.  I have not yet attempted to contact him. I will dig
>through log files and try to gather more evidence.
>
>
>-Karl Reuss
> Computer Science Center     
> University of Maryland, College Park MD 20742-2411   /   (301) 405-2995

Dear Mr.R.Thyagarajan,

You accused Tamils for the email you received.
It is Niroshan Perera, Mr.Thyagarajan.
      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What are you going to do?

Without thinking twice you incited everybody for the  email
you received and as a result I also got insulting email.

Think about your hasty action condemning Ceylon Tamils
studying in U.of.Waterloo. Many believed your assertion
as true and so many articles followed.

"The self-proclaimed commanders of the net like Mr. Sundara Pandian, Mr Krishna
Raj will not condemn this. They condemn only if you write against Mr Vishnu's
views. What a double standard?

By the way I notice too many terrorist tigers in waterloo? Is it just a
coincedence or a qualification to enter?

Whoever this surya is, he is a real coward

RT"

What is this? You are exited and questioned my integrity.
You are working for DEC and you can clearly see the message is
from umd.

>>% Received: from wam.umd.edu by surya.waterloo.edu.bedinet (4.1/SMI-4.1)id AA29998; Wed, 19 Aug 92 12:05:15 EST

Instead of finding the truth calmly you created flutter in SCT.
 
Why should I jump into the bandwagon ?I suspected that it
was the work of someone in U.of. Maryland. It has been proved beyond
any doubt now. 

You have blind hatred against island tamils. Your tirade
against them and has spoiled their reputation until now. 

          They are really great.


M.P.Krishna Raj

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:1869 alt.culture.tamil:1264 soc.culture.indian:30140
From: mani@sabotage.Berkeley.EDU (Mani Varadarajan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: Buddha on animal sacrifices in vedic rituals
Date: 2 Sep 92 13:01:32
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
Reply-To: mani@sprite.Berkeley.EDU
NNTP-Posting-Host: sabotage.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: sp2@cec1.wustl.edu's message of Wed, 2 Sep 1992 04:38:57 GMT


The Mahabharata contains a passage similar in essence to the
point made by Buddha.  In the Mokshadharma portion of the
Shanti Parva, the brahmin Tuladhara is convinced of his
righteousness, and proclaims his own greatness with great pomp
and ceremony. However, first a few animals and then a voice
from the heavens tell him that his righteousness is nowhere
near that of the trader Jajali, and that even Jajali cannot
call himself righteous.

Tuladhara, a man of great austerity, becomes intensely curious
and goes to meet Jajali to discover the secret of his
greatness.  Jajali, an ordinary businessman with extraordinary
values, instructs Tuladhara on the highest ethic, that of
noninjury and nonviolence.  He argues that those who really
know the Vedas and who desire to know Brahman reject sacrifices
of animals and harm and instead perform the allegorical
sacrifice of the soul.  It is in this dialogue that we get the
famous dictum, "ahimsa paramo dharma" ("noninjury is the
highest law").

The dialogue itself is very forceful in its argumentation, and
is only one in a series of parables told to Yudhisthira by
Bhishma.  Most of the stories in this section are concerned
with nonviolence and proper ethics; in fact, it contains a
condemnation of capital punishment and slavery among other
things with very profound argumentation.  Similar arguments I
have nowhere else found spelt out in such detail.

I can post a rough translation if anyone is interested.

Yours in peace,
Mani

P.S. There may be those who will argue that these uplifting and
humanistic passages are interpolations; I do not really care to
argue that point, since the only thing we can say for sure is
that they are a part of the epic as we have it today, and in
that sense, reflected a prominent view of Vedic/Vedantic
culture at some point in our history.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian.telugu,soc.culture.tamil
From: rags@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Raghavan Jayaraman)
Subject: Re: Similarity between Telugu and Tamil
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 20:54:03 GMT

In article <Qxh-VM@engin.umich.edu> srini@engin.umich.edu (Srinivasan Pichumani) writes:
>In article <BtJxBC.ID9@ireq.hydro.qc.ca> srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (Srinivasan K.) writes:
>>
>>Irrespective of the acceptance of my points and views, I can not understand,
>>why dis-association with Tamil is all that important for some.
>
>This is a very interesting observation. You can ascribe a few reasons to 
>this phenomenon :
>
>1. A certain wish, conscious or unconscious, to be part of the pan-Indian,
>Sanskritic, "hochkultur" (high-culture) tradition; since their language is
>the source for this world-view, it would do not very much good to be 
>associated with a "regional" language like Tamil, or stress its associations
>with Tamil.
>
>2. Another reason is the stridency with which linguistic chauvinists in this
>century have staked their language's claims to a distinct identity, hoary
>antiquity, and originality. In this process, all links, associations, and
>assimilations have to be denied, exorcised, or revised. In the case of Tamil,
>this has occured vis-a-vis Sanskrit. In the case of other Indian languages,
>this process has occured if the link is not with a
>"deva-bhAshA", but with a "pAmara-bhAshA" or a prAkrit
>or a apabrahmsha.
>

With respect to denial of association of tamil with sanskrit, shouldn't we
consider the social movements and their influence on perspective [for ex.
aryan influence]?. If we accept this probably we can explain the acceptance
of link with the deva-basha, for lack of such movements, in other regions
under discussion.


>3. Another reason is maybe the "oversell" that has been going on in this
>century by the zealous proponents of Tamil. While these people would like
>to embrace the other South Indian languages, and gain "strength" from such
>an exercise, the other language proponents probably consider such inclusion
>unwelcome, "suffocating", and retrogressive.
>
>--Srini.
>
>ps: Actually, the vehemence with which some Kannadigas deny their language's
>links with Tamil more intriguing than the present debate.

Suppose one calls the tamil to be oldest language. Then he/she also
implies [tries to embrace]
some connexion between tamil and other langauge eg. kannada. So one can
deduce this in two ways. [1] Kannada as old as tamil [2] Kannada to be
dated after tamil. Probably some opted [2].

raghavan

Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: bs@wucs1.wustl.edu (Bala SWAMINATHAN)
Subject: Re: Tirupur and volley Ball
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 20:03:19 GMT

In article <2A9A7679.13925@orion.oac.uci.edu> sundar@indigo1.hsis.uci.edu (M. Sundaramoorthy) writes:
>
>	The US Olymics Volley Ball team caught head lines, otherwise dominated
>	by the basket ball 'Dream Team', when they shaved off their heads 
>	en masse in support of their team mate, baldy Bob Samuelson.

As soon as I heard this through NBC, I called my friend and said that
``jappaan volley ball team American team-ai mottai adichchiduchchu''
... Oh. Well, I thought
it was funny.

S_Bala
From: narayan@carina.unm.edu (C.R.Narayanan)
Subject: Results of Vote!
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 21:34:59 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

Hi to everyone!

	I had asked people to send me their responses to the following 
questions.......

	1) Will you let your children use the reservation to their 
advantage, considering that you are educated and probably OK economically?

	2) Do you think everybody has the right to become a priest if they
want to?

	The questions here are not exactly the same, but are similar to the
ones asked. Only 9 people responded. Since I didn't mention it in my 
previous mail, I'll not post their IDs, but I was happy that they at least
took the time to respond to my request. It's a start!

The answers were unanimous, 

	1) All of them said that they would NOT make use of the reservation
policy to help their children!

	2) All of them agreed that EVERYONE had the right to become a priest
if they chose to!

Very sane responses, so maybe there is some prospect of constructive
networking at least. To me it indicated that even if some other netter
expressed a view not quite acceptable to me, I should think twice before
saying anything, for in all probability, the other person follows the
same principles that I do, but has a different perspective. It definitely
was an eye-opener. I would like to thank all of you who responded, and be
assured that I will read your every post with a little more care! :-)!
Take care! 

CRN
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
C.R.Narayanan			!  Internet:     narayan@carina.unm.edu		
Dept. of Chemical Engineering	!	 Ph:     (505) 277-7752 (o)
Univ. of New Mexico		!		 (505) 246-8219 (r)
Albuquerque, NM 87131		!	FAX:     (505) 277-0813
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: sp2@cec1.wustl.edu (Sundara Pandian)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Which kuRal is right?
Date: 30 Aug 1992 22:16:20 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

sundar@golf.cis.ohio-state.edu (N Sundar) writes :


> I have a question about a kuRaL. Sometime ago, I read in this newsgroup:

>	epporuL ethhthanmaiththu Ayinum apporuL
>	meipporuL kAnbadhu aRivu. 

> However, I remember this as:
>	epporuL yAr yAr vAi kaetpinum apporuL	
>	meipporuL kAnbadhu aRivu.

  In K.Srinivasan's ADAMI transliteration scheme, the above kuRaLs read as
    `epporuL eththanmaith thaayinum apporuL
     meypporuL kaanbadhu aRivu (*) '
 and 
    `epporuL yaaryaarvaayk kEtpinum apporuL
     meypporuL kaanbathu aRivu (**) '.    

> Which is right? 
    Both are right. (*) is kuRaL # 355 and (**) is kuRaL # 423.
   
> I don't think the difference is trivial.
   (*) is from `meyyuNardhal' and (**) is from `aRivudaimai'. 
`meyyuNardhal' is `Realization of truth' and `aRivadaimai' is
`learning'. The difference is `Raj Sharma material'.
>------------------------------------------------------------------
>N. S. Sundar          |    I am ardently against all awkward, affected
>GTA, CIS, OSU         |    and artificial alliteration.
>Off. ph: 292-4029     |
>____________________________________________________________________
                                                     

                                                          S.Pandian
                                                  sp2@cec1.WUSTL.edu
_________________________________________________________________________

                        \"/                                \"/
  |      | |"""|"  /""" /"\""/"\""| |        |      |  /""" /"\""|
  |      | |   |  | \  |   ||   | | |  /\    |  /\  | | \  |   | | 
  |______| |   |   \_/  \_/  \_/  | |_/__\__ |_/  \_|  \_/  \_/  |
                                         |       

_________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tamil
From: mvishnu@morse.uwaterloo.ca (m vishnu)
Subject: Annadurai, Part 1
Originator: mvishnu@morse.uwaterloo.ca
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 01:15:53 GMT



On C.N.Annadurai  from the PhD thesis of Charles Ryerson, "Regionalism and
Religion, The Tamil Renaissance and Popular Hinduism".


Annadurai's maiden speech to the Rajya Sabha in 1962:

"I belong to Dravidian stock.  I am proud to call myself Dravidian.
That does not mean I am against a Bengali or Maharashtrian or a 
Gujarati... The Dravidians have got something different to 
offer the world at large... I am pleading for separation of 
Dravidanad not because of any antagonism but because if it is
separated, it become a small nation, compact, homogeneous
and united wherein sections of people in the whole area can 
have a community of sentiment.  I am pleading for a national
cause, not for parochialism..."

Annadurai's definition of Brahmanism:

"...representing the particular system and practice of life preached
by the Bramins...based on irrational beliefs and superstitions.  It is
not pecular to Bramins as these practices have permeated over centuries
to all castes.  Some feature of Brahmanism can be said to be a division 
of society into castes and elaborate ritual..."

Nehru attacked DMK as follows:

"I believe one of the major demands of communal parties here is to 
kick out Bramins... It is comic to any understanding person--that
anyone should say these foolish things.  It is tragic because many 
people are led away by these foolish cries... to paths of violence"

P. Balasubramaniam of DMK responded as follows:

"Our creed is that we accept no man as inferior because of accident
of birth.  All men are treated alike which cannot be considered...
as a communal creed.  Further, we are not here to kick out the 
Bramins or anyone from this land; but we are of the view that
those who do not treat others as equals...have no place 
in Dravidanad..From the cradle to the crematoriam the orthodox
Bramin consider himself a separate person...He wants people to
consider him as a representative of God on earth.  This idea
is really barbaric and repungent to any civilized person and I 
consider our Prime Minister as a very highly civilized person
who has discarded...the barbaric ideology of separateness of
Brahmanism"

(to be continued...)

Meenan Vishnu
From: chemsn@emory.edu (Sreehari Nimmala)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Tirupur and volley Ball
Date: 25 Aug 92 19:46:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: emoryu1.928
Organization: Emory University, Atlanta, GA
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

sundar@indigo1.hsis.uci.edu (M. Sundaramoorthy) writes:
: 
: 	Tirupur is also a center of Volley Ball tournaments. Another place
: 	in TN where Volley ball is popular is Tirunelveli, I suppose.
: 	(Nellai friends' club)
: 
: 	Volley ball is popular only Kerala, like foot ball is in West Bengal.
: 
: 	The undeserved popularity of cricket undermines all other sports
: 	in India and so in TN.
: 
: 	The US Olymics Volley Ball team caught head lines, otherwise dominated
: 	by the basket ball 'Dream Team', when they shaved off their heads 
: 	en masse in support of their team mate, baldy Bob Samuelson.
: 
: 	Most of the US team players are from California, including, Steve
: 	Timmons, where I live now :-).
: 
: 	Any information about volley ball in TN, be it from Tirupur or
: 	Nellai or some other place, will be appreciated, at least by me.
: 
: a volley ball fan,
: M. Sundaramoorthy
: sundar@indigo1.hsis.uci.edu
: sundar@esv1.hsis.uci.edu 

Its "Tirupur Textiles" team that is very famous in India.
There was a guy named Sreedharan(captain of TT) who led
India in mid 80's in International tournaments. I have
seen him playing for india and I liked him. He was a very
good setter. I think he played for a club in Italy too.
Ofcourse, Kerala has produced very good players, including
legendary Jimmy George. Haryana has been a very good team in
India. You might have heard names like Ballu(Balwinder Singh, above
7 feet) and Sukhpal Singh. Abdul Basith was from A.P. and he too led
India. 

Volleyball is definitely is a very thrilling game. But in India,
as you said, undeserved game of cricket undermines other
games and sports. 

---Sree
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tamil
From: mvishnu@morse.uwaterloo.ca (m vishnu)
Subject: Annadurai Part 2
Originator: mvishnu@morse.uwaterloo.ca
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 01:16:38 GMT



On C.N.Annadurai  from the PhD thesis of Charles Ryerson, "Regionalism and
Religion, The Tamil Renaissance and Popular Hinduism".


His [Annadurai's] most portentous monment came in 1937 when he met EVR
at the Sengunthar Youth Conference in Tirupur.  He was soon asked by 
Periyar to come to Erode to help edit the newspapers Kudi Arasu
and Viduthalai.  By now the Justice Party was slipping badly. In 1937 the 
congress agreed to take power with Rajagopalachari as the Chief Minister. 
Soon after came Rajaji's abortive attempt to introduce Hindi as a 
compulsory subject in the presidency.  Periyar started his famous anit-
Hindi agitation and was sent to jail for four months.  While still in 
jail, Naicker was named head of the Justice Party.  Annadurai became
his disciple and a leading organizer.  When the Congress Ministry 
resigned as part of Gandhi's to Britain's taking India into World
War II, the Justice Party was asked by the British to form a new
government.  Annadurai led the battle against this, and while many
old leaders disapproved, Periyar approved with Anna.  In 1941, Anna
accompanied Periyar on his Northern tour, translating for him
in his meetings with Ambedkar and Jinnah.  Annadura was later to comment
humorously on how he and Periyar, the latter with saffron shawl and
flowing beard, was often taken in the North for a holy man and his
disciple.  In 1942 Anna founded the Tamil weekly Dravida Nadu whose style
and content made a powerful appeal to educated Tamil youth. During his
lifetime, Anna was to become editor of founder of many Tamil and English
journals and newspaers, including Kanci, Nam Nadu, Homeland and Home Rule.


It was the 1944 Justice meeting in Salem that saw Anna emerge as a leading
member of  of DK.  That was the conference where the Justice Party was 
transformed into mass-based Dravida Kazhagam.  Annadurai not only suggested
the name change but alsoe presented a resolution calling for the renunciation
of all British titles by party members and of the abandoning of 
caste suffixes after names.  Much of the older Justice leadership
opposed him, but Periyar was for the change and they were adopted.
Over fifty thousand new members joined the DK after Salem.


(to be continued ...)

Meenan Vishnu
From: rk@nms.hls.com (S Ramakrishnan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Silk Smitha (Re: India Today - Pay for Top actors)
Date: 1 Sep 92 01:35:22 GMT
Organization: Hughes LAN Systems Inc., Mountain View, Ca
Originator: ramakris@csgrad.cs.vt.edu

In article <42199@ogicse.ogi.edu> partha@mse.ogi.edu (R. Parthasarathy) writes:

  ...
  >According to India Today Rajanikant is the highest paid Tamil actor now 
  >(Rs. 1Crore per movie).  (...)

Could some kind soul tell me how much Silk Smitha gets paid ? I bet
its much more than any of these mediocre actors/actresses do.

  >Though [Kamal] is a great actor,I get the feeling that he doesn't have 
  >such a following in TN as Rajani does. 

And I bet Rajani can't claim more than a small fraction of the fan-following 
Silk used to. Just consider at the size of San Francisco Bay area Silukku
Rasigar Manram ! I started 2 days ago and I already have 50 members.

  >NB: Thalaivar Rajanikant Vaazhga! (Just kidding..)

Puratchaith Thalaivi Silukku Vaazhga !
Silukku Rasigargal Thondu Thodarga !!  (No kidding !)


---
S Ramakrishnan, Hughes LAN Systems Inc., Mountain View, Ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil