HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mephron@tronsbox.xei.com (Mephron)
Subject: Re: Mr. Fantastic in Champions
Organization: Xanadu Enterprises Inc.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 05:31:43 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.212807.29202@afterlife.ncsc.mil> acadams@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Arthur C. Adams) writes:
>In article <1992Jul28.181500.27754@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> aq061@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Scott Devine) writes:
>>
>>I have been trying to convert my favorite Marvel characters into the more
>>detailed game of Champions but I ran into some trouble with Mr. Fantastic
>>and his unstable molecules.  I don't know how I should set it up, if any
>>of you know a way please post or send me mail.  Thank you.
>
>Stretching is obvious.
>
>I'd also buy Desolidification, to simulate slipping through cracks and holes.
>I'd limit it as follows: -1/2 to keep him from going through completely
>solid objects. (That's from the rules, though you might want to increase it
>more to simulate the fact a reasonable hole is required.) I'd also allow
>being affected by attacks, that should be worth a minus two. The power
>should be pretty cheap then. 

Go with the -1/2.  We've seen him slip through some PRETTY SMALL holes.  (Go
look at the one where they confront Psycho-Man after dealing with the
Hate-Monger he made.  He slipped through an air-hole that he apparently
couldn't even see.  THAT'S small.

>I'd also add some shape-shifting, to allow stretching the body into simple
>objects. This would be limited also, since he still resembles himself. In
>other words, its not a disguise technique.

And another small BZZT!  He's used his stretching on his face to change the 
appearance sufficiently that he wasn't recognized.  (This is when Reed
and Sue were in Connecticut.)

Pulling out my TSR Marvel Super Heroes "Fantastic Four Compendium" (I bought
it when I was young and stupid), IT says the following about Mr. F:

Elongation (he can stretch)
Plasticity (can distort body.  Includes:  MAking a ball, gliding, looking
like any other man with his hair and skin tone, the ability to flow through
openings, shapeshift into any other shape he can imagine (but stays to poly-
gonal solids), and make himself as flat as paper or small enough to go
through the eye of a needle)
Hyper-Intelligence (Like Arthur said, an INT of disgusting proportions with
skills out the wazoo)
Hyper-Invention (he can build a bomb out of a bottle of aspirin and a digital
watch (a joke from an issue of the FF))

Start here.  Just on a quick try, I can't figure how to do it on 250 points.
I may call in a friend on this one....
>-- 
>The world is not analog. The world is digital,
>with an incredible number of bits.
>Arthur C. Adams (not the comic-book artist)                        <fnord>
>E-Mail acadams@afterlife.ncsc.mil

Too bad.  I was going to ask you when the new LONGSHOT would be out!  |-)

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: durrell@chop.isca.uiowa.edu (Bryant Durrell)
Subject: Re: Genres
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 15:56:58 GMT
Organization: University of Iowa

In article <3651@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> hummell+@pitt.edu (Andrew G Hummell) writes:
>Giant humanoid robots...would have advantages such as...more armor, 
>more firepower...

Why?  I'd grant your other points, with a caveat to be stated in the
next paragraph, but I don't see why one shape automatically has more
armor or firepower than another.

Re:  getting over more terrain -- granted.  But you can bet that
we're going to see more multi-legged insectoid robots than humanish
ones.  More stable, easier to engineer, and probably better at 
getting around.  Maybe faster.

However, there's no point in these arguments.  People don't like
your battlemechs?  Are you having fun?  Then you don't need any more
arguments.  Battlemechs are unlikely as all hell, but you shouldn't
need them to be likely to enjoy playing them.  It's Just A Game.

Bryant ".sigless" Durrell
Remember, the only *sure* protection against .sig viruses is not to use
a .sig.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: joshua salter <jsalter@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Champions
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 13:48:09 GMT


	This weekend I was considering buying Champions, it looks good to me...
Is it a good investment? Flaws, Exceptional Parts?
				Anyone?

								-jsalter

			"Run away, run away!" - Monty Python, The Quest for 
						the Holy Grail
From: mkkuhner@phylo.genetics.washington.edu (Mary K. Kuhner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: GURPS: Alien races -- Too powerful?
Keywords: GURPS Aliens Space
Date: 31 Jul 92 20:19:52 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

jdale@cats.ucsc.edu (Jonathan Dale) writes:

>In article <1992Jul30.223415.13928@oz.plymouth.edu> sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan) writes:

>>4) For those games where *all* the PCs will be far from the human norm,
>>I adjust them closer to average stats.  This is exactly the way GURPS
>>Bunnies & Burrows works:  the average rabbit has ST 10, DX 10, IQ 10
>>and HT 10, and humans have vastly different stats. 

>How is this superior to making all the characters play "bunnies" worth -60
>points (guessing wildly) and then giving players only 40 points to make
>characters?  Ie, using racial rules but changing the number of points so
>they have the equivalent of 100 points instead of really 100 points.  This
>maintains compatibility.

The problem is that GURPS rules don't work well for characters with
stats in the range of 2-4, which is where a bunny's ST, for example,
should probably be.  You'd be rolling dice all day to get any successes
at ST tests, unless the GM imposed huge modifiers on each and every
roll, which gets tedious.

Bell curve rules work best when most of the characters are fairly close
to the middle of the curve, not all clumped up at one end or the other.

The number of points given will also change the flavor of the
characters; it affects the relative utility of spending on stats versus
spending on skills.  If one likes the standard 100-point GURPS
characters, it's probably better to slide the system around to do
100-point bunnies, rather than trying to do 40-point bunnies (whose
stats, for example, will all be *very* close to the bunny mean).

Mary Kuhner mkkuhner@genetics.washington.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly)
Subject: Re: Military Mechs?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 08:52:54 GMT

jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim) writes:

>Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow) writes:
>>
>>Those "mechs" simply don't make sense. Technologically they are possible, but
>>economically and militarily they are idiotic.  Their only reason for existence
>>in games or stories is in being "cool". If you accept that, you can enjoy your
>>game.  However, there's no point in trying to justify their existence to
>>others.

>	I don't see how you can conclude they are economically idiotic. Mechs 
>rely on a different type of motor than tanks do - how do you know how 
>expensive that will be in an interstellar economy? And if its cheap enough, 
>then it makes sense militarily because you can build enough of them. 

>	Technology is extremely difficult to predict - and future 
>technologies can produce alot of interesting results depending on 
>what discoveries you postulate. 

Well, the big problem I have with future tanks being big robots is that they
would just be too damn easy to hit. Missles are already very effective if 
used against modern tanks correctly. Most of the big robots in the games
can't move very fast and are as big as a house. I'd say it would be damn
easy to slam missles into those robots all day long from fast hover vehicles.
Future combat means either missles or a very good explanation why no one
uses them. 

Axly

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly)
Subject: Re: Military Mechs? Hexapod
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 02:23:39 GMT

ratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri/Stainless Steel Rat) writes:


>Show me a tracked tank that can get past a trench cut into the ground like
>this:

>      _______________
>             ^^^^^^  |
>            Mines    |       <---Tank
>                     |     ____________
>                     |    |
>                     |____|

>where the deep section is just wide and deep enough to really mess up a
>tracked tank. Pretty standard desert anti-tank setup. The hexapod can
>(hopefully) just step over it, two legs at a time so it's never unbalanced.

>--Rat

Well, if you add mines to the picture, and some tanks on overwatch to shoot
anything that comes over the berm, I'd say that the hexapod would be
just as vulnerable coming over that as a tank. The tank wouldn't make it
and the tank commander by now knows where his tank can and can't go. 
The underside of the hexapod would be exposed to all kinds of nasty
explosives, guns and infantry fired anti-hexapod missles when they
play leap the ditch. 

Not that I'm saying hexapods wouldn't be real neat looking doing it,
but let's not forget all the other combat arms get involved in a war.
The best way to beat a dug-in position is to sweep around it (Gee,
does that sound familiar, Norm? ) and send the Marines through the
worst area (Gee, now that REALLY sounds familiar!) to demine the area.

Axly
From: mancinis@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Steven Mancini)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SRUN: Player Conception & Min/Maxing
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:26:01 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center

In article <54707@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> phi@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Steven Mancini) writes:
>mancinis@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Minotaur)
>But, if the character is so good in this area, doesn't he have any
>weaknesses in other areas?  Or is he just an all-around-god type char?
>
	Yes, but to expose them wold result in a dangerous situation.
	I take no pleasure out of killing the character because I have
	resort to his weakness.

>What about making the game fun for That char/player?  

	What about the Group? That is my concern. It is amazing how 
	useless people with stealth scores of 5/6 feel. Five or Six
	skill scores are not useless, but they feel they are. The game
	is about enjoyment for all, not just That character. If it comes
	to the personal enjoyment of one person, or the group, then that
	person loses... no two ways about it.

> Since he spent so
>much of his Magic on the autos, doesn't he deserve his time in the sun?

HIS TIME IN THE SUN? No, this is a group game, and honestly I find it
tedious when I have to waste exuberant amounts of time on what sometimes
comes across to the other players as showing off...

I always thought the idea was to be CHALLENGED. How challenging is it
for some guy with 5 autos in armed to clobber the average SR schmuck
who can only have an Armed of 5?!! (Sarcasm included)

>I think it may be a little unfair to do this to him. 

	True, but he has begun to expand his magical skill repetoire. 
	And I only employ this tactic when he slows the game down. I fully
	concede there have been times when his autos have pulled hit fat
	out of the fryer, as well as the team. I just see no point in
	expending a great deal of time on someone with 14 successes
	against joe-smoe-corp-guard, unless of course, the corp guard
	has a motion detector... :)

> If you deal with it this way, why did you allow the character in the 
> first place?

	Because the player wished to try it. And it is not MY game, it is
	OUR game. It has not been that big of a disbalancing force and the
	player likes (liked?) the character immensely.

	I like to let our players expand from the basics, try things not
	covered, but that are within the realm of fairness to the other
	characters.

	In some cases, they come out weaker than imagined, in others 
	they come out stronger. It is all part of learning the game I
	guess.

	Besides, since it is OUR game, not my game, shouldn't you be asking:

		Why did he select this path?


	Sheesh! Answer a simple question and get stuck defending your game. :)

								-Minotaur
From: eeb1@panix.com (Elizabeth Bartley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Amber (Campaign Beginnings)
Date: 30 Jul 92 23:59:00 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix & Internet, NYC

In article <1992Jul27.133406.5276@orionsci>
goodwin@orionsci.uucp (Ben Goodwin) writes:

[Young Amberites being sent after a monster in Arden that Julian's
forces could easily handle in order to prove themselves....]

Julian is likely to be displeased with this....

>Also, this may have been asked before, but how have you managed to bring
>these groups together?  It seems that the Second generation Amberites
>tend to protect their children by not letting anyone know that the
>kid exists.  I'm trying to bring these people together into two groups.
>But right now I can't think of a believable way to do it.

Well, we had two small groups: one raised in Amber (required some
retconning, but only to insert some gossip; they were inexperienced
enough during the Patternfall war to be sent out of the way), and one
from Shadow Earth that simply wound up together.

Some miscellaneous ideas: Amberites do have some tendency to cluster
around the same Shadows.  If there were a bunch of kids in one Shadow,
they might very well wind up knowing each other, especially if they
were all rather old chronologically without being old physically.
(Alternatively, someone with Advanced Pattern Imprint could have
scanned the Shadow for anything real and found the kids.)  Or a single
Amberite could have had several children who were raised together, or
allied Amberites (Corwin and Dierdre, Fiona and Bleys) could have
raised their children knowing each other.  Or, Random could have
gotten cranky when Merlin ascended the throne of Chaos because he'd
forgotten to ask Merlin to swear allegiance and insisted that people
bring in their children and have them do so.  Or Finndo/Osric/Dalt/
Rinaldo/any Amberite not at court could cause trouble, causing
Random to make it a crime to help someone walk the Pattern for the
first time without his permission / without informing him / unless
the person has sworn allegiance, causing a slow influx of next-
generation Amberites into Court (variant: Random could insist that
everyone who *has* sworn allegiance help round up everyone they know
of who hasn't, and at least make them swear never to *attack* Amber.).
Or Dworkin or the Unicorn could round them up.

--
E. Elizabeth Bartley, a distant shadow of

Llarana of Amber and Rebma, possessor of 10 points of Good Stuff.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: ahankin1@cc.swarthmore.edu (A. Luke Hankins)
Subject: RM/MERP initiative -- what do you do?
Organization: Swarthmore College
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 21:56:51 GMT

bitbug@netcom.com (James Buster) writes:

 [ ... among other things ... ]
>	If an initiative system is used, two-handed weapons take longer to
>	    draw and swing
>-- 
>				James Buster
>			     bitbug@netcom.com

this reminds me of something i keep meaning to ask:

 does Rolemaster have an initiative system that is not in the MERP rules?

background: i play a MERP variant with my friends [not set in ME, with a
few skills that aren't in the MERP rules..]. the only Rolemaster supplement
i use is Spell Law. since i try keep the empahasis off of fighting, i don't
think i need the rest of the RM system. nonetheless fights happen and i was
just wondering if the RM rules advocate "hero(es) get(s) first attack
oppurtunity" with alternating attacks (pcs/npcs/pcs....), or possibly if it
should be left _totally_ up to the situation, or if theres an initiative
system in MERP that i've just been missing.

{4 lines for one senetence...not bad :)}

From Babble-on...
-- 
______________________________________________________________________
===Starman-* 		|	ahankin1@cc.swarthmore.edu
			|	tnx luke
________________________|______________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cjudd@esk (Craig Thomas Judd)
Subject: Re: Genres
Organization: University of Tasmania at Launceston
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 07:45:29 GMT

In article <13703@mindlink.bc.ca>, a481@mindlink.bc.ca (J.D. Frazer) writes:
>
>> If you can't bring yourself to beleive that giant robots are a *possibility*,
>> how can you play *any* science fiction game?  FTL travel is no more unlikely
>> that giant robots.  Sentient robots/androids/computers are no more unlikely
>> than giant robots.  The same goes for any other type of fantasy as well.
>
>I don't think *possibilities* are being questioned here, just *sensibilities*.
>A giant, lumbering 'mech doesn't make any military or economic sense. It's too
>big a target, no doubt very expensive, and far far less efficient than a
>company of tanks. Heck, a flight of A-10s could probably shred it in seconds.
>
>In case you're wondering what I'm talking about, consider this: Given that you
>have an average 'mech, what mission could it fulfill that other military
>elements couldn't?

One advantage of a well-built mecha is the interface. If it works like an
extended exoskeleton then it is much easier and faster to pilot than a tank, 
as someone with hand-to-hand training could run it. Of course, if we're talking
about a joystick-and-footpedal approach, then you might as well be running a
tank anyway. Mecha are somewhat more versatile than tanks, and - as seen in
Robotech, can serve multiple branches of an army (Veritechs were used by the 
Air Force, but are also ground, underwater and space troops). Granted, a well
fitted-out tank could do the same things, so the advantage really lies with
interface.

Yours mechaniacally;

-- 
   \/\ "Abide by the contract of blood and inherit me!" Grossporina, SM2 /\/
====\/\"Shit, it's that skinhead again!" Kaneda about Col., AKIRA Book 3/\/====
=====\/\      *** WANT ANY MANGA ARTWORK DONE? Just email me! ***      /\/=====
      \/\   cjudd@esk.compserv.utas.edu.au      a.k.a. Kuroto Shiro   /\/
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: alan@nabeth.enet.dec.com (Alan Rollow - Alan's Home for Wayward Tumbleweeds.)
Subject: Re: New Name for Flesh Golem wanted!
Reply-To: alan@nabeth.enet.dec.com (Alan Rollow - Alan's Home for Wayward Tumbleweeds.)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 22:59:29 GMT


In article <1992Jul25.043223.546@njitgw.njit.edu>, cxc4107@hertz.njit.edu (Christopher Lee Cavender) writes:
> [ New Name for Flesh Golem wanted! ]
>

The process of making such a thing is called in some texts, "The Secret of
Life and Death".  A possible name of one would then be, "A Creation of the
Secret of Life and Death".  The typical mad wizard might simply reduce
this to "My Creation".

>
--
Alan Rollow				alan@nabeth.cxo.dec.com
From: Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Military Mechs?
Date: 29 Jul 92 05:46:51 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

jwadsley@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au writes:

> Anyway a comment on energy conversion:
>    ....
>      heat to electrical - not possible as far as I know

It's possible, and being used.  Space probes usually use thermionic generators,
which use heat to directly drive a current flow.  Thermal photons can be
converted by solar cells or even tiny rectennas.  There are undoubtedly other
methods.

--

Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: ins894r@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (Aaron Wigley [Wigs])
Subject: Re: SRUN: New Matrix Programs-
Organization: Monash University
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 01:43:36 GMT

cpbeaure@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) writes:
: Keith wrote:
: >   Smokescreen I       Sensor Program          MP = <Rating^2> X 2
: >   Smokescreen II      Sensor Program         MP = <Rating^2> X 3
: >   Smoke Filter I      Utilities Program     MP = <Rating^2> X 4
: >   Compressor IV       Utilities Program     MP = <Rating^2> X 5
: 
: Keith, don't you have any icons for these things?
: 
: I can see the one for Smoke Filter - An industrial strength vacuum
: cleaner...

Compressor would be some guy with a sledge hammer and a box to cram 
stuff into:)

: Chris Beauregard                                cpbeaure@cayley.waterloo.edu

The Wigs of Oz,
Aaron Wigley
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 10:56:54 -0400 
From: "Mark A. Baxter" <mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re:Rifts

   I'd just like to chime in at this point and say that I too thought
that Rifts had a world of great coolness and I also thought that it had
one of the worst systems of all time, well, it's still better than V&V
(heh,heh).  My answer to this was to simply adapt it to Gurps (with
copious use of supers rules)  but I was never able to get the campaign
going (college time crunch) now I intend to adapt it to Hero instead, at
approximately 75+75 level.  Why dont I like Palladium?  A few things, I
really hate Mega-Damage, it irks me no end.  I also don't like the
character generation system, where most of the skill rolls are really
low.  I couldn't see running anyone in power armor along side mages or
psionics, the game is combat oriented and the power armor guys would
nuke everything while the others were dicking around with their 2d6 &
4d6 MD.  The possible characters were too limited (particularly compared
with Hero; "Walking Tree Character?  No prob.  Four-foot Poisonous
Butterfly?  No biggie.  Pure Strain Human with tech?  Sure.)  And I just
like Hero.  I'll admit that Hero lacks some of the flavor of Rifts but
thats not a big concern for me.  
                    Hugs and kisses.  Mark    
Mark Baxter              |One is for sorrow,
<mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu>   |Two is for joy,
ext #4690                |Three for a girl,
                         |Four a boy,
         I               |Five is for silver,
       Have              |Six is for gold,
         A               |And Seven's a secret
      Secret             |Never to be told.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: covin@tartarus.uchicago.edu (David Covin)
Subject: Re: Champions
Organization: University of Chicago Computer Science
	<1992Jul27.163832.22832@sco.COM>
	<1992Jul28.161159.13382@news.columbia.edu>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 18:42:27 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.161159.13382@news.columbia.edu> jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim) writes:

	   First of all, an incredibly bright character should not neccessarily 
   have a high Hero INT stat. INT supposedly represents how fast you can think 
   on your feet, not how overall smart you are. 


Bullshit.  That is what the explanation of INT in the rules states;
however, since as noted there are many INT-based skills which should
be based on how smart you are, and buying up your INT flat-out makes
you better at them, INT must represent how smart you are.


	   Second, the legality of buying down your perception rolls is 
   questionable at best. Admittedly, you can buy down your running, but that 
   is not a very strong precedent. I wouldn't allow it, anyhow. (Any more than 
   I'd allow buying down one's smell perception roll to 3- for 16 points.)


Irrelevant, actually.  If I can buy +1 to all INT-based skills for 5
points, or buy +5 INT for 5 points which will give me +1 to all
INT-based skills *and* +1 perception, and +1 perception costs 3 points
otherwise, then I'm ahead 3 points if I buy the INT.  If I didn't want
to have that high a perception roll, and the GM won't let me buy it
down, it's somewhat less efficient than it could be, but unless I'm 
playing in a hero-level campaign where there are characteristic
maxima, *there's never any good reason to buy 5-pt levels with
INT-based skills*.  They're just not as good as buying INT.

--
David Covin                           covin@despair.uchicago.edu