HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: csuah@warwick.ac.uk (~WISP at CU~)
Subject: Re: Boiling lobsters (was Re: Boiling frogs)
Organization: Computing Services, Warwick University, UK
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:13:20 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.220904.9448@u.washington.edu> moe@rainier.lib.washington.edu (Joe Shippert) writes:
>In article <1992Sep12.205409.27337@athena.cs.uga.edu> bday@athena.cs.uga.edu (bday) writes:
>>Would wine, or other alcohol, really have the same kinds of affects
>>on crustaceans, or other sea creatures, as it does on humans, and other
>>mammals?  This is very interesting... What makes alcohol do the things
>>is does to us, anyway?
>
>This is the way I had it explained to me: Normally our little red blood
>cells go through our vein like poker chips. All stacked up that way you can
>get a maximum efficiency of blood cells being trandported. Alcohol causes
>the blood cells to get all shakenb up and they go through our veins any
>which way. This is MUCH less efficient and therefore less blood (and
>therefore oxygen) get to our brains and we get drunk.
>
>In order to have a similar effect on other creature they'd have to have a
>similar oxygen trasnporting system as us. I don't really know how lobsters
>or somesuch  do it.
>
>Anyone else know? If this an accurate description of the effects of alcohol?
>Am I way off?
>

I'm afraid so. What you're describing is more or less a sickle-cell crisis
(sickle cell anaemia being the condition, genetic problem with haemoglobin
found in people of African descent...).

Alcohol, as someone pointed out earlier, is a solvent, and affects the
lipid membranes around all our cells, allowing, among other things, greater
mobility for the transport proteins that transmit info and other things across
the membrane. The place that's most important is in the CNS, where
neurotransmitter response gets screwed. Another thing is that alcohol is a
weak anaesthetic, with general sedative effects...

The Wisp. [hic!]
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Chris Williams <csuah@uk.ac.warwick.csv> aka <csuah@csv.warwick.ac.uk>
"Tony Greig in the slips, legs apart, waiting for a tickle"
                                      Brian Johnson (thanks to A. Simha 8^>)
From: baylor@force.ssd.lmsc.lockheed.com
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re: Boiling lobsters (alcohol effect)
Date: 15 Sep 92 18:35:31 GMT
Reply-To: baylor@force.ssd.lmsc.lockheed.com
Organization: LMSC, Sunnyvale, California

In article <5015@calmasd.Prime.COM>, gdh@calmasd.Prime.COM (Gerald Hall) writes:
>In article <1992Sep12.205409.27337@athena.cs.uga.edu> bday@athena.cs.uga.edu (bday) writes:
>>[..] This is very interesting... What makes alcohol do the things
>>is does to us, anyway?
>>
>As strange as it may sound, alcohol produces its effects indirectly
>from its function as a solvent.  Essentially, it tends to lubricate
>the bi-lipid cell membrane structure to ease the rotation of the
>protein structures that provide active transport of substances
>across the membrane.  Many of these are neurotransmitter related
>which may be excitatory or inhibitory in function.  So what you get
>is a very complex effect with a great deal of variability between
>individuals.

Funny, I'd always heard that the effects of alcohol (well, the 
intoxication, not the hangover) were purely from depriving your
brain of oxygen. Supposedly the symptoms of anoxia are pretty
much identical to drunkenness.
From: justice@meltdown.chi.il.us (Jack Morrison)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re:  Thermodynamics (was Re: Sartre's 3 laws)
Date: 7 Sep 92 06:50:58 GMT
Organization: The Meltdown - A Team Star BBS


     Actually, the way that I heard it (off a fortune on a Unix machine at my
college) was:

     The Laws Of Thermodynamics:
   
   1) You can't get something for nothing.
 
   2) The best you can do is break even.

   3) You can only break even at absolute zero.

    
       Of course, since I'm a biologist, not a physicist, I have no idea how
accurate that is.

                      Justice (Biologist disguised as a chemist)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: rf@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns)
Subject: Re: Migratory habits of Mediterranean eels
Reply-To: rf@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns)
Organization: U of Cambridge, England
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 08:16:19 GMT


In article <Bu53yx.1oq@hatch.socal.com>, richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich
Greenberg) writes:
|> In article <1992Sep5.180730.11787@cco.caltech.edu>
carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU writes:
|> >In article <1992Sep5.020032.8439@panix.com>, carlf@panix.com (Carl
Fink) writes:
|> >>  Well, in the quote up above, I was wrong.  Lampreys DO migrate
(and, more
|> 
|> >>  And it's fairly implausible that they migrate from the Gulf the 
|> >>the Great Lakes, since they could only have developed this behavior
|> >>pattern since the opening of the Erie Canal.  I think people are 
|> >>adding up lampreys' migratory patterns, and their infestation of the
|> >>Great Lakes, into a nonexistent single event.
|> >
|> >Please take the time to do at least a little research before posting
bullshit
|> >like this.  The Saint Lawrence river has connected Lake Ontario and the
|> >Atlantic Ocean for quite a bit longer than the Erie Canal's been around.
|> 
|> True, but wouldn't the lampreys have a bit of a problem swimming UP
|> Niagara Falls?

No trouble - just slither along through the hydro power plant pipes... ;-)
--
Robin (dump Brian Kay) Fairbairns                    rf@cl.cam.ac.uk
U of Cambridge Computer Lab, Pembroke St, Cambridge  CB2 3QG, UK
[Finally back in work - what a relief!]
From: lanih@herald.Berkeley.EDU (J. Lani Herrmann)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re: The dangers in microwaved food...
Date: 9 Sep 1992 22:53:47 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization
NNTP-Posting-Host: herald.berkeley.edu
Summary: And why do ants survive in the microwave?
Keywords: ants, microwave

After that last posting I couldn't resist jumping in to the conversation.
Observation: putting ants into a microwave (actually, it was sugar mixed
with ants, and I was trying to get the critters to leave) only seems to
tickle them -- they run around a little more actively.
	My partner thinks it's because the ants are too small: their wave-   
lengths are less than the microwaves.
	Any more educated guesses out there?
	-- Lani 8-)


Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: frank@rover.uchicago.edu (Frank - Hardware Hacker - Borger)
Subject: Re: The dangers in microwaved food...
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Reply-To: frank@rover.uchicago.edu
Organization: Joint Center for Radiation Therapy
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 20:59:00 GMT

In article <sefsv1q00gpIFfTW9V@andrew.cmu.edu>, "Andrew C. Plotkin" <ap1i+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes...
>Excerpts from netnews.alt.folklore.science: 9-Sep-92 Re: The dangers in
>microwav.. J. Lani Herrmann@herald. (434)
> 
>> Observation: putting ants into a microwave (actually, it was sugar mixed
>> with ants, and I was trying to get the critters to leave) only seems to
>> tickle them -- they run around a little more actively.

	Maybe the're picking up the microwave and dancing to it.  ;-)
> 
>Ants are small and fairly wiggly. They may just have enough surface area
>to dissipate heat as fast as it's deposited.

	Dissipation would still have to be by convection to the air, until
	the body got hot enough to radiate. Probably what is more to the
	effect was that they were getting hot, but being insects, were just
	not reacting to the change in body temperature.

   Frank R. Borger - Physicist    __       Internet:  Frank@rover.uchicago.edu
Michael Reese - Univ. of Chicago |___      Phone : 312-791-8075 fax : 567-7455
  Center for Radiation Therapy   | |_) _   If I had to live my life again, I'd
                                   | \|_)  make the same mistakes, only sooner.
    "Birthplace of Softball"          |_)  Tallulah Bankhead
From: ted@isgtec.com (Ted Richards)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re: Thermodynamics (was Re: Sartre's 3 laws)
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:31:25 GMT
Organization: ISG Technologies Inc. Mississauga Ont. Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Jack Morrison (justice@meltdown.chi.il.us) wrote:
: 
:      Actually, the way that I heard it (off a fortune on a Unix machine at my
: college) was:
: 
:      The Laws Of Thermodynamics:
:    
:    1) You can't get something for nothing.
:  
:    2) The best you can do is break even.
: 
:    3) You can only break even at absolute zero.
 

The way I heard the Three Laws:

    1) You can't win.

    2) You can only break even.

    3) Who says you can break even?

--
Ted Richards            ted@isgtec.com             [...!uunet.ca!isgtec!ted]
ISG Technologies Inc.   3030 Orlando Dr. Mississauga  Ont.  Canada   L4V 1S8
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: kodak@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Jason Balicki (KodaK))
Subject: Re: Colored oils for blobby light show...
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Distribution: alt
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1992 02:01:10 GMT


If it's soluable in oil, it won't be soluable in water.  I can't think
of anything that you could use for color though...

Maybe I'm just not thinking hard enough! (* that is *NOT* an invitation to
                                             flame * :)

--Jason Balicki
kodak@mentor.cc.purdue.edu
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science,alt.paranormal,psi.general,sci.misc,sci.skeptic,soc.history
From: meyers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Bill Meyers)
Subject: Wanted: book: "Earth Radiation"
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 23:06:02 GMT
Organization: N/I

Does anyone have more information about the following book,
including where I might get a copy?

"Earth Radiation", by Kathe Bachler (Wordmaster?  British?)

Thanks!
From: JHARTLEY@cmsa.gmr.com
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Boiling frogs
Date: 11 Sep 92 14:05:04 GMT
Organization: GM Research Labs

Some independent sources have said that if you place a frog into lukewarm
water and slowly boil it, it will not jump out and will just get boiled.
I trust this comes from some sloppy notions about difference thresholds
for temperature in the frog.  But is it true?  Don't worry, I don't
plan to boil anything.  I'm just interested.  Oh, yes, and do lobsters
prefer this method of death or do they prefer to be dropped into boiling
water.  None of them will tell me.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: jdravk+@cs.cmu.edu (Jeanette Dravk)
Subject: Re: Boiling frogs
Organization: Barbie's Dream Dungeon
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 16:43:02 GMT

In article <1685F7FC0.JHARTLEY@cmsa.gmr.com> JHARTLEY@cmsa.gmr.com writes:
>Some independent sources have said that if you place a frog into lukewarm
>water and slowly boil it, it will not jump out and will just get boiled.
>I trust this comes from some sloppy notions about difference thresholds
>for temperature in the frog.  But is it true?  Don't worry, I don't
>plan to boil anything.  I'm just interested.  Oh, yes, and do lobsters
>prefer this method of death or do they prefer to be dropped into boiling
>water.  None of them will tell me.


Hard to say.  All the lobsters that know are dead.  First time seems to be
enough.  At least they never come back and ask to try the other way.


j-
Seances for crustaceans.
-- 
   "Ha! Mere flesh and blood desires mean *nothing* to Destructo-Kitty!"
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: saj@chinet.chi.il.us (Stephen Jacobs)
Subject: Re: That darn "Bug" story
Summary: The story comments on itself
Keywords: bug grace hopper mark IV
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 20:33:07 GMT


It is obvious from the glee with which the moth was discovered, and from the
way the story is told that the term 'bug' for a mysterious problem was
already in use at the time of the famous incident.

                                       Steve
From: gdh@calmasd.Prime.COM (Gerald Hall)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re: Boiling lobsters (alcohol effect)
Date: 14 Sep 92 16:49:51 GMT
Organization: Computervision, San Diego, CA

In article <1992Sep12.205409.27337@athena.cs.uga.edu> bday@athena.cs.uga.edu (bday) writes:
>[..] This is very interesting... What makes alcohol do the things
>is does to us, anyway?
>
As strange as it may sound, alcohol produces its effects indirectly
from its function as a solvent.  Essentially, it tends to lubricate
the bi-lipid cell membrane structure to ease the rotation of the
protein structures that provide active transport of substances
across the membrane.  Many of these are neurotransmitter related
which may be excitatory or inhibitory in function.  So what you get
is a very complex effect with a great deal of variability between
individuals.

-- 
   /
  /	Jerry,	CalmaSD UNIX SysAdmin,	+1 619 587 3065
 /
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: c8922369@jupiter.newcastle.edu.au (Leon James Garde)
Subject: Re: rice + beans = complete protein
Organization: Uni of Newcastle, Australia
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 16:23:28 GMT

giber@pollux.cs.uga.edu (Carolyn Giberson) writes:


>Most proteins of plant origin are not "complete proteins", meaning
>they don't possess the all of essential amino acids.  Essential amino 
>acids are those which cannot be synthesized in the body in adequate amounts
>to support life/health.  Animal proteins (meat, milk, eggs, etc.)
>are complete proteins, which means their amino acid profile matches
>human requirements pretty closely.

>If you eat only plant proteins, you need to eat complementary foods
>to be sure of getting all of the essential amino acids.  That is
>why in many cultures, dishes like beans and rice are eaten;  the
>amino acids in each of these complement the other to give a well-
>balanced set of amino acids.

>Carolyn Giberson
>giber@pollux.cs.uga.edu
>University of Georgia

Yes of course eating a variety of vegetarian foods will
ensure getting a quantity of each amino acid.
I wouldnt say eating beens and rice will supply the full range.
And I'd suggest it would be difficult to eat enough
of those amino acids and then be sure that enough protein is
produced inside the body from those quantities of amino acids.

So, the body may be capable of producing protein from amino acid,
but can it maintain a suitable production, and will that affect other
bodily processes ?  I don't know. 
What does the body need to make 'complete protein' ? just
complementary amino acids ? or would the production of sufficient protein
result in a defeciency elsewhere (eg vitamin or mineral requirements) ?

No flames please. I *know* vegetarianism isnt a good idea, so there's
no point arguing.

leon

Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: moroney@ramblr.enet.dec.com
Subject: Re: Boiling frogs
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 21:46:08 GMT

In article <1685F7FC0.JHARTLEY@cmsa.gmr.com> JHARTLEY@cmsa.gmr.com writes:
>Some independent sources have said that if you place a frog into lukewarm
>water and slowly boil it, it will not jump out and will just get boiled.
>I trust this comes from some sloppy notions about difference thresholds
>for temperature in the frog.  But is it true?  Don't worry, I don't
>plan to boil anything.  I'm just interested.  Oh, yes, and do lobsters
>prefer this method of death or do they prefer to be dropped into boiling
>water.  None of them will tell me.

I heard the reference to "boiling frogs" used as an analogy to investing/
investors.  Supposedly, according to the analogy, if you have a frog happily
swimming in a pot of water on a stove, then turn the stove on full, the frog
will notice something is wrong as the water heats up and hop out, but if you
put the stove on a low heat, the frog will happily stay in the pot and won't
do anything until it's too late and it's cooked.

The analogy applied to investing as follows, if things suddenly get bad,
small-time investors will cut their losses and get out of the stock
market/whatever, but if there is a slow decline in value the same investors
are likely to hang on until they lose most of their value.

-Mike (no idea if frogs actually do this and have no intentions of trying it)
From: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re: Migratory habits of Mediterranean eels
Date: 5 Sep 92 18:07:30 GMT
Reply-To: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera

In article <1992Sep5.020032.8439@panix.com>, carlf@panix.com (Carl Fink) writes:
>  Well, in the quote up above, I was wrong.  Lampreys DO migrate (and, more
>embarassingly, I knew that and had forgotten it when I posted).  On the
>other hand, they are NOT fish.  They lack certain distinguishing
>characteristics of fishes, like scales and backbones.  They are members
>of the phylum Chordata, to which we and fishes also belong, but they
>are not vertebrates and are not fish.

That's odd.  I thought order Hyperoartia consisted of vertabrates.

>  And it's fairly implausible that they migrate from the Gulf the 
>the Great Lakes, since they could only have developed this behavior
>pattern since the opening of the Erie Canal.  I think people are 
>adding up lampreys' migratory patterns, and their infestation of the
>Great Lakes, into a nonexistent single event.

Please take the time to do at least a little research before posting bullshit
like this.  The Saint Lawrence river has connected Lake Ontario and the
Atlantic Ocean for quite a bit longer than the Erie Canal's been around.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: CARL@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXen and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: mjg51721@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Michael James Gebis)
Subject: Re: That darn "Bug" story
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 05:07:18 GMT

YABS (Yet Another Bug Story):
In my Scheme class, the professor was showing an overhead of a procedure
to derive square roots.  Anyway, some sort of insect was attracted to the 
overhead, causing a super-size bug to be projected onto the wall.  The
professor saw this and proclaimed," My Program has a bug in it!"
He then attempted to kill the bug, but the pesky fellow kept avoiding him.
(The bug avoiding the professor, not the other way around.)  The professor
then muttered "Scheme is so damn hard to debug."

Anyway, I laughed.

Mike Gebis  m-gebis@uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Re: Boiling frogs
From: kmitche@eis.calstate.edu (Kenneth Mitchell)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 18:23:04 GMT
Organization: Calif State Univ/Electronic Information Services

Now, _I_ had always heard (not being a lobster fan) that lobsters that had
been dropped live into boiling water were a bit on the tough side, since
the meat was all tensed up when it was cooked. I read once (I've forgotten
where) that the best way is to put the lobster into a bowl of wine for
about 10 minutes before you cook it. Then the lobster DOESN'T CARE what
happens, and, supposedly, the meat is more tender. 

As I say, I haven't tried this myself.........

Ken Mitchell
kmitche@eis.calstate.edu

Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: millernw@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Neal Miller)
Subject: Re: The dangers in microwaved food...
Keywords: ants, microwave
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 00:36:19 GMT

lanih@herald.Berkeley.EDU (J. Lani Herrmann) writes:

>After that last posting I couldn't resist jumping in to the conversation.
>Observation: putting ants into a microwave (actually, it was sugar mixed
>with ants, and I was trying to get the critters to leave) only seems to
>tickle them -- they run around a little more actively.
>	My partner thinks it's because the ants are too small: their wave-   
>lengths are less than the microwaves.
>	Any more educated guesses out there?

	I asked an engineering friend of mine, and he suggested (uncertainly)
that it might have to do with the fact that microwaves vibrate the natural
frequency of water.  Ants have far less water in them (proportionately) than,
say, small dogs, or food. ;-)  Therefore they are less affected.  Oh, wait...
You wanted *educated* guesses??  Oops.  Never mind. :)


--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Neal Miller         | "Why not go mad?"  | millernw@craft.camp.clarkson.edu
 Clarkson University |     - Ford Prefect |     dark@craft.camp.clarkson.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
From: karlm@sequent.com (Karl Maerz)
Subject: Re: The dangers in microwaved food...
Keywords: ants, microwave
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 92 22:06:42 GMT

>>	My partner thinks it's because the ants are too small: their wave-   
>>lengths are less than the microwaves.
>
>So what's the wavelength of an ant, anyway?
>

There is actually a fairly simple way to measure the wavelength
of a given ant.  Place it in a small, open box which has been 
constructed of a wire mesh with a grid size of 1mm or less.  This
box must be perfectly square.  Find another ant and place it in
the box with the ant whose wavelength you are attempting to measure.
Place yourself in a position such that you can see the subject ant
clearly outlined against the opposing grid pattern.  Now, reach into
the box and remove the other ant.  As your subject ant waves goodbye
to its new little friend, visually plot the grid coordinates of the 
upper and lower extremes of the wave (be aware there is no way to 
acurately predict whether a given ant will wave with the antennae,
mandibles, or perhaps one its little feet; you may want to have an
observer stationed over the top of the box in case the wave is
performed laterally).  By measuring the length of the waving extremity 
and plotting it to the endpoints of the observed wave, you will be 
able to describe an arc, the length of which can be calculated to 
determine the ant's actual wavelength.

For added fun, you can place the wire mesh box into a microwave
oven and turn it on for a minute or two at full power.  (You may
want to have a fire extinguisher handy.)

Karl Maerz
karlm@sequent.com
From: giber@pollux.cs.uga.edu (Carolyn Giberson)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: rice + beans = complete protein
Date: 7 Sep 92 13:35:47 GMT
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Originator: giber@pollux


Most proteins of plant origin are not "complete proteins", meaning
they don't possess the all of essential amino acids.  Essential amino 
acids are those which cannot be synthesized in the body in adequate amounts
to support life/health.  Animal proteins (meat, milk, eggs, etc.)
are complete proteins, which means their amino acid profile matches
human requirements pretty closely.

If you eat only plant proteins, you need to eat complementary foods
to be sure of getting all of the essential amino acids.  That is
why in many cultures, dishes like beans and rice are eaten;  the
amino acids in each of these complement the other to give a well-
balanced set of amino acids.

Carolyn Giberson
giber@pollux.cs.uga.edu
University of Georgia
From: scifi@ccvax.ucd.ie
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science
Subject: Help!!!
Date: 4 Sep 92 13:26:32 GMT
Organization: University College Dublin

The society which I am represeting intends publishing a monthly newsletter for
the next university year.  The magazine will include technical articles as well
as short stories.  I am currently looking for articles to print.  If anyone has
any article they would like to me to consider for publication, I would be very
grateful if you could forward it to me. Pleas ote the technical articles should
be short and accurate.  Further details can be obtained at this email address. 
I would be grateful for any responses.

Public Relations Officer
Science Fiction & Fantasy Society
University College Dublin
 
Ronan Farrell
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.science