From: srinivas@vision.crd.ge.com (Chukka Srinivas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.indian.telugu
Subject: Re: ...... Hyderabadi muslims ........
Date: 16 Dec 92 23:46:04 GMT
Organization: GE Corp. Research & Development, Schenectady, NY

In article <1992Dec15.183019.28236@cs.wayne.edu> uds@trace.eng.wayne.edu (Seetamraju Udaybhaskar) writes:
>
>narain@bass.bu.edu gave a very good account of what he saw and explained
>quite clearly the reasons for his disgust the hyderabadi muslim's behaviour.
>
>whatever the other people's response is to it : I have something to say too.
>
>
>My personal experience is identical.  having lived in many parts of india,
>I venture to state this : the hyderabadi muslims are the most
                             
>agressive and the most unpatriotic muslims in the subcontinent (going by
                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>the definition of the concepts of Nationnality and Citizenship).


Sir, can you please explain this statement. 
And how many Hyd. muslims did you interact with?
or talk to?

First of all, maybe we shouldn't make a big deal of our
middle class perceptions about patroitism and should stop
giving this partriotic litmus test to people, be they of any
religious background.

And maybe, we have to question why and how anybody starts to 
identify with this abstract notion of belonging to one nation.

Let's see.
How much does the nation really care for an ordinary
person, in a feudal society like ours, for him or her
to place national loyality above other loyalities.
(for example, religious and regional loyalities).

Don't you think your middle class status in the society
has also something to do with your perceptions about
what constitutes patriotism and why it is so important?
Doesn't it has to do with what class, caste, tribe, region
and religion you belong to? 
Do you think that our perceptions about patriotism
are eternal and absolute? 

And don't you think as people who left thier motherland
for greener pastures should be more cautious before
talking patriotic loyalties of whole populations? 


>
>Lastly, they are more proud of their heritage than the lukhnowi muslims
>are : infact, I had such a discussion with a couple of muslims long
               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>ago on the Hyderabad express (from Hyd via kazipet).  They pooh-pooh
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>north indian muslims, and claim themselves to be `better' than all
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>other muslims in india.  Clearly, no other region in india has been
>under muslim rule without break, like it has been in HYD.  The nizam-iyat
>(?-naizaam) of Hyd was a island of autonomy even during british rule...
>

I do not know what are you trying to say. 
I do not know whether you are factually correct.
There are many people who feel that thier tribe, thier caste,
thier language, thier region, thier culture is better than others..
And, how does that imply being more patriotic to Pakistan?
and less to India?

>U may be able to get a dog's tail straight, or have the sun rise in the
>west, but getting the Hyd muslim will not accept india, is impossible.

     What is this supposed to mean? Applying similar logic and using
     same or similar type of arguements like yours, I can make a
     equally stupid comment like
     'Hyd. Hindus will not accept muslims as part of India'.
     Where does this take us all?

>
>Incidentally, the `11yr old ameena girl' who was married to the geezer
>from saudi arabia, was from Hyd.  All my sources tell me that 40% of all
                                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>muslim girls are married to muslims all over arabia and even egypt.
>


Can you please quote your sources?
>
>Seetamraju Udaya Bhaskar Sarma
>(email : seetam @ ece7 . eng . wayne . edu)

-srinivas.