HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pkrause@triton.unm.edu (Paul Krause CIRT)
Subject: Re: HOUSE FOR SALE TO INVESTOR - BLOOMINGDALE, IL
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 22:51:45 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Distribution: misc
Keywords: house investor

In article <1992Aug25.180522.1959@rtsg.mot.com> escue@snoopy2.rtsg.mot.com (Marilyn R. Escue) writes:
>House for sale to investor only in Bloomingdale, IL.  Current owners want
>to sell and rent same house back while building a new house for one to two
>years.  (Too many of our friends building houses had their backs against
>

So how does the investor make money on this deal?

Paul
From: adam@sw.stratus.com (Mark Adam)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: Need help with rental depreciation
Date: 27 Aug 92 20:33:00 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <1992Aug24.175244.8908@nb.rockwell.com>, guthrie@nb.rockwell.com (Karen Guthrie) writes:
> 
> Go get a good book like JK Lassers tax guide. There is a set number 
> of years that you depreciate the property over ( I think it is 15 or 30)
> for real estate.  Any rental property will qualify and yes you end up
> filling out a form which takes it off of your gross income.  The rent
> is income and the interest that you pay on a loan on the property is
> tax deductable.  Depriciation is only a problem when you go to sell.
> For instance if you buy a property for $100k and depreciate it by
> $40k over the time that you have it and then sell it for $200k your 
> taxable gain on that property will be $200k - $60k or $140k.  Thus 
> you end up paying tax on the money you got to deduct later when you
> sell it.  Depreciation is usually front weighted and therefore the 
> first full year that you own something you will take the largest 
> amount of depeciation.
> 
> Hope that this helps,
> 
> Karen

the depreciation is straight-line over 27.5 years. this works out to 3.636% of
the value of the house (not the land) per year. the amount you end up deducting
is the same for all the in between years and less for the first and last. the IRS
has some publications on rental property that will help with this.

the easiest way to answer "is it a good thing to depreciate my property?" is to
ask youself if you want to pay the taxes now or later? the taxes WILL be paid
eventually.

-- 

mark ----------------------------
(adam@paix.sw.stratus.com)
		"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers that smell bad."
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: ajg@controls.ccd.harris.com (Arnold Goldberg)
Subject: Re: "Passivity" of Income/Loss (was Re: Need help with rental depreciation)
Organization: Harris Controls and Compositions
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 15:35:12 GMT

>>>>> On 2 Sep 1992 21:57:11 GMT, bd670@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Russell I. Dyreng) said:
	Russell> NNTP-Posting-Host: slc5.ins.cwru.edu


	Russell> asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk) writes:
>Written in article <1992Aug28.163444.14498@berlioz.nsc.com>
>by worden@bouncer.nsc.com (Dennis Worden):
>
>: Between 100K and 150K there is a
>: phaseout of deductibility for "passive losses" which do 
>: apply to rental property.
>
>I may be mistaken, but I've heard there are methods whereby the 
>"passive" can be redefined into "active," thereby fully 
>restoring all deductability.
>
>Things such as handling ALL the paperwork and management 
>yourself, vs.hiring a property management company.
>
>Anyone know for certain?
>
>--
>The Chipmunk.

	Russell> The IRS defines passive as essentially to mean that you 
	Russell> contribute nothing but money to the operation.  This passive rule
	Russell> usually deals with things like real estate limited partnerships.

	Russell> When you hire a property manager yourself to manage your property
	Russell> you are still making all of the decisions and calling the shots.
	Russell> This makes you an active participant for tax purposes.

I don't know for sure on that one.  I remember reading something to the
contrary.  Check with a tax adviser and please inform us.

I might check that out also, I'll let you know.


arnold

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Arnold Goldberg                            Email:  ajg@ccd.harris.com
Phone: (407)242-5051                       Snail:  Harris Corporation
Fax  : (407)242-4262                               407 John Rodes Blvd.
                                                   Melbourne, FL 32905
The opinions expressed are my own and do not in any way represent Harris 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ajg@controls.ccd.harris.com (Arnold Goldberg)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: Help! New landlord to be
Date: 4 Sep 92 19:44:17 GMT
Organization: Harris Controls and Compositions

>>>>> On Fri, 4 Sep 1992 10:33:08 GMT, TDOPER35@ysub.ysu.edu (Dogger) said:
Dogger> I am thinking about buying my mom's condo (it is paid off). Then renting it bac
Dogger> k to her for the rest of her life. she would make rent payments with the gain o
Dogger> n the house (she is 66) and would use her one time tax exclusion. we would sign
Dogger> a lease so that she has a right to stay there until she passes on.  I would mak
Dogger> e the mortgage with the rent. i could deduct interest, repairs, deprec. & taxes
Dogger> . Is this a good idea?  do i want to break even or have a neg. or pos. cash flo
Dogger> w? Also can i tell the bank that i already gave her the down payment, so i don'
Dogger> t have to put up any money? Or will they require me to put the down payment dow
Dogger> n?  Thanks for your help??

First of all, you might want to try putting newlines in your articles 
from now on.

Second, as far as I can tell, it's a good idea (caveat emptor :) ).

Things to remember:

the tax exclusion is (125,000) I think.

The IRS looks very closely at these family deals, so make sure you're not
giving her any breaks and vise versa that you would not give to another
person off the street.
Otherwise the IRS can tax that.

If you haven't bought a house before, just don't tell the bank you're intending
to rent it out.  Buy it owner-occupied and "change your mind" a week or two
later.

She can give the money to you, but I think it's not allowed to be a loan 
(for the down payment).  The best thing to do is get the money from her
3-4 months before you do this and put it in your saving account.  That way
you don't even have to explain it once you apply for your mortgage.
Bank only want to see the last three months worth of bank statements (usually).

Of course you want a positive cash flow :)

good luck


arnold

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Arnold Goldberg                            Email:  ajg@ccd.harris.com
Phone: (407)242-5051                       Snail:  Harris Corporation
Fax  : (407)242-4262                               407 John Rodes Blvd.
                                                   Melbourne, FL 32905
The opinions expressed are my own and do not in any way represent Harris 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: gcopmse@state.systems.sa.gov.au
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: re:15 yr loan in australia
Date: 26 Aug 92 13:23:56 GMT
Organization: State Systems, South Australia

some one discussed in this news group about investing the 'other' half of your
loan into another investment account as it pays more is this true in the states ? as in
australia you cannot  as the home loan variable rate for a first home buyer is
around 8.5-10% at the moment 26/08/92 while a bank will only give you around 
6% we do have an 'offset account which you can put money into this is about 5%
 and therfore the money you have in this account say 10,000 is payed at the
difference between the rate you borrowed at and the 5% therefore on a 100k loan
you will pay say 9% on 90k and about 4% on10k .this is good aswell because you
dont pay tax on the intrest earnt on the 10k if it was in the bank.i hope that
wasnt confusing !  i woul like to learn more about finance in america it may
help me reduce my loan . 


 regards
 mike emery
  adelaide
  australia
Xref: sparky misc.invest.real-estate:640 misc.consumers.house:11800
From: pickel@mcnc.org (Lisa C. Pickel)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.consumers.house
Subject: Buying Undeveloped Land
Keywords: The land Scarlett, it's the only thing....
Date: 3 Sep 92 16:43:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: mcnc.1992Sep3.164304.18115
Distribution: usa
Organization: MCNC Center for Microelectronics, RTP, NC

Would those of you who have bought raw land recently mind relating
your experiences?  What stipulations do you make in the offer (must
perk for such-and-such size house.... what else?).  Did you have a
builder and/or soil expert come out and take a look?

I've already researched the current proposed landfill sites and have
a good idea which roads in the area are likely to become unbearable
smog-producers within the next ten years.  What else would you look out
for?

I'm looking at 7 - 10 acre parcels (preferably not in subdivisions) 
somewhat outside the currently in-demand areas with a view towards 
perhaps building a house or maybe just reselling it later.  Therefore, 
this should be considered a long-term investment, in case I never build.

Lisa.
pickel@mcnc.org
From: johne@vcd.hp.com (John Eaton)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: Real Estate News Summary, Part 115
Date: 30 Aug 92 16:09:40 GMT
Article-I.D.: vcd.Btt0w5.704
Distribution: usa
Organization: Hewlett-Packard VCD
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Gordon Hamachi (hamachi@adobe.com) wrote:
: Real Estate News Summary, Part 115, July 1992
: 
: 
:903. In Southern California, Bekins Moving and Storage reports 3 trucks leaving
:      for every loaded truck coming in.  To meet demand, firms deadhead trucks
:      into the state, and offer low rates to incoming clients.  U-Haul says the
:      first half of July, saw an 18% rise over last year in outbound traffic
:      from Southern California.  California has been an "outbound" market for
:      over 2 years, say Atlas Van Lines and others.  Ryder says residents are
:      exiting the state more than ever before.  Big destination states include
:      Washington, Texas, Arizona, Oregon and Colorado.  [Wall Street Journal]
-------------
According to the local paper a 24 ft truck from Portland to LA would cost you
$300, go the other way and pay $3600. Some people were flying from LA to
Portland, renting a truck and driving it down to LA and back. They were 
saving about $600 by doing it that way.

At the peak of the moving season one company had a $10 special. If you picked
the truck up in Portand and dropped it in LA you only paid $10 (plus perhaps
gas).

The times they are a changing.

John Eaton
!hp-vcd!johne
From: asylvain@felix.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: "Passivity" of Income/Loss (was Re: Need help with rental depreciation)
Date: 31 Aug 92 23:26:38 GMT
            <1992Aug24.175244.8908@nb.rockwell.com>
            <1992Aug28.163444.14498@berlioz.nsc.com>
Reply-To: asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Organization: Foundation for the Increased Wealth of Chipmunks

Written in article <1992Aug28.163444.14498@berlioz.nsc.com>
 by worden@bouncer.nsc.com (Dennis Worden):

: Between 100K and 150K there is a
: phaseout of deductibility for "passive losses" which do apply to rental
: property.

I may be mistaken, but I've heard there are methods whereby the "passive"
can be redefined into "active," thereby fully restoring all deductability.

Things such as handling ALL the paperwork and management yourself, vs. 
hiring a property management company.

Anyone know for certain?

-- 
The Chipmunk.
Opinions are mine, void where prohibited, taxed, licensed or regulated.
Unquestionably, there is progress.  The average American now pays out
twice as much in taxes as he formerly got in wages.
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Closing cost tax deductibility.
From: smith@navajo.rc.arizona.edu (dennis smith)
Date: 25 Aug 92 11:13:11 MST
Distribution: na,local
Organization: University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721

Recently I refinnace my mortgage and it cost me around $2200. I did not
pay any points (except for %1 origination fee, which is very common here
in Arizona). My question is this,
which expenses are tax deductable for 1992 and years after, if any ?
(origination fee, appraisal fee, title insurance and guarantee, title
search, termit inspection and termit treatment, etc.). I actualy had to
treat my home since there was some sign of termit infestation. By the
way I included most of the costs in the new mortgage. Does it make any
difference. Thanks a lot.

Dennis.
From: jyl@burgess.eng.sun.com (Jacob Levy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Foreclosures in Bay Area
Date: 26 Aug 92 17:17:50
Organization: State Retirement Home for Retarded Slugs
Reply-To: jyl@toss.eng.sun.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: burgess

Hello. I'm interested in obtaining information on foreclosure properties in
the PA-Menlo Park-Los Altos-Mountain View area. How are these properties
disposed of and where could I get a list? Is there a local RTC office? FHA?
VA? IRS auctions? State Franchise Board? Anything?

Thanks for any and all information BY PRIVATE EMAIL,

--JYL
From: tanm@seneca.bst.rochester.edu (Martin Tanner)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: refinancing rates
Date: 27 Aug 92 15:32:31 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

Hi,

Someone in our department is planning to refinance.  They are
interested in thoughts on various plans, as well as information
on rates.

Please respond to 

judy@metro.cc.rochester.edu

Thank you,
Martin
From: duanej@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Duane Jacobson)
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 18:52:03 GMT
Subject: Re: Buy-Rent-Hold as an investment?
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate

>I am in the bay area and it seems that locally the numbers do not work out
>to allow this form of investment. The numbers:
>
>Average Single Family Home:		$250000 (?)
>Payment on $250000 Mortgage @ 8%:	$1834.5 per month
>Average Rent on Single Family Home:	$1300 per month
>
>Are these numbers especially bad because of high housing costs in the Bay
>Area? Is your area better? I can't see how this could be a good business.
>Am I missing something absolutely basic and obvious, or is my analysis
>right?

There are a few more things to consider.  First, you pay income tax on any
rent $$ that you receive, but you also get to deduct the interest and
property tax part of your payment.  For a rental property, you also get to
depreciate the value of the home.  With the numbers you give above, I have
to bet that this investment is a losing proposition.
Xref: sparky misc.invest.real-estate:652 misc.consumers.house:11870
From: champlin@pa.dec.com (Virgil Champlin)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Buying Undeveloped Land
Date: 4 Sep 92 20:35:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: virgil.CHAMPLIN.92Sep4133503
Distribution: usa
Organization: DEC Network Systems Laboratory

There is a reasonably informative book on this subject:

	Finding and Buying Your Place In The Country
			by
		Les Scher and Carol Scher

In particular, it discusses various ways of financing and their
pitfalls.  -virgil
--
    Virgil Champlin			champlin@pa.dec.com
					Palo Alto, CA
	I like satire.  I'm just not very good at it.
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: pkrause@triton.unm.edu (Paul Krause CIRT)
Subject: Re: Buy-Rent-Hold as an investment?
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 15:40:48 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <JYL.92Aug28143243@burgess.eng.sun.com> jyl@toss.eng.sun.com writes:
>Hi
>
>I am in the bay area and it seems that locally the numbers do not work out
>to allow this form of investment. The numbers:
>
>Average Single Family Home:		$250000 (?)
>Payment on $250000 Mortgage @ 8%:	$1834.5 per month
>Average Rent on Single Family Home:	$1300 per month
>
In Albuquerque you can buy a nice 3 br, 1 3/4 ba, garage for $80,000
It would rent for $725-750.  That is up from $650 a year ago and rentals
are still in short supply.  It's still negative, but there is hope that will
change in a couple of years.

Paul


Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: bobk@sequent.com (Bob Krull)
Subject: Re: "Passivity" of Income/Loss (was Re: Need help with rental depreciation)
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 16:58:23 GMT

In article <183dbnINNdmj@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> bd670@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Russell I. Dyreng) writes:
>
>asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk) writes:
>>Written in article <1992Aug28.163444.14498@berlioz.nsc.com>
>>by worden@bouncer.nsc.com (Dennis Worden):
>>
>>: Between 100K and 150K there is a
>>: phaseout of deductibility for "passive losses" which do 
>>: apply to rental property.
>>
>>I may be mistaken, but I've heard there are methods whereby the 
>>"passive" can be redefined into "active," thereby fully 
>>restoring all deductability.
>>
>>Things such as handling ALL the paperwork and management 
>>yourself, vs.hiring a property management company.
>>
>>Anyone know for certain?
>>
>>--
>>The Chipmunk.
>
>The IRS defines passive as essentially to mean that you 
>contribute nothing but money to the operation.  This passive rule
>usually deals with things like real estate limited partnerships.
>
>When you hire a property manager yourself to manage your property
>you are still making all of the decisions and calling the shots.
>This makes you an active participant for tax purposes.
>
>Short and simple.

And, according to my tax advisor, wrong.  This looks like yet another
area where armchair accountants disagree.  Pay for some professional advice.

Bob Krull

Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: pkrause@triton.unm.edu (Paul Krause CIRT)
Subject: Re: Real-estate prices & U.S. economy
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92 18:09:02 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <tki.22.0@atk.tpo.fi> tki@atk.tpo.fi (Tuukka Kirveskoski) writes:
>
>Do the different regional markets in the U.S. have a common trend? In which
>regional market can the change first be seen? Our markets change first
>in the capital area of Helsinki and after a delay the rest of the country
>walks on those footsteps. Is there in the States some area where the mar-
>ket trend is continuously up nowadays? I'm trying to mirror it all to 
>our local markets. We haven't reach the bottom, yet, and it may be wiser
>to rent than to buy now (the prices have come down about 40% since the
>end of '89.).
>
I don't think there are really answers to these questions.  Real estate is
such an individual activity that depends on the individual, the region and
the country.  It also depends on the kind of property.  Around here,
homes and apartments are doing well and commercial property is a disaster.

I find that I spend less time these days worrying about the big picture
and more on making sure the particular deal makes good sense.  This
may or may not be a good strategy.  I do know that as soon as there was
the slighest reason for optimism, apartment prices went up to their old
levels rapidly.  To get good price and terms you had to be willing to
buy when no one thought there was any hope.
Paul


Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: bobk@sequent.com (Bob Krull)
Subject: Re: Closing cost tax deductibility.
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Distribution: na,local
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 18:58:07 GMT

In article <CHET.92Aug25181102@spock.retix.com> chet@spock.retix.com (Chet Mazur) writes:
>I believe refi costs are deductable but need to amortized over the
>life of the new note..
>--
>
>Chet Mazur (chet-mazur@retix.com)
>
>-- 
>
>Chet Mazur (chet-mazur@retix.com)
>


Well, you have conflicting opinions here.  Like I said, consult
your accountant!

Bob Krull
From: jyl@burgess.eng.sun.com (Jacob Levy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Mortgaging Out
Date: 26 Aug 92 17:20:31
Organization: State Retirement Home for Retarded Slugs
Reply-To: jyl@toss.eng.sun.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: burgess

Hi again. I've read repeatedly about people who take over properties and
then take away money from the mortgage, AKA "money in fist". Some
questions:

1. How does (if it does) this work?
2. This money is taxable, right?

Thanks for any and all information BY PRIVATE EMAIL. I will summarize if I
get enough info.

--JYL
From: facemire@Software.ORG (Jeffrey Facemire)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: House for sale in Plano, Texas ***LOWERED PRICE***
Date: 2 Sep 92 14:04:07 GMT
Reply-To: facemire@Software.ORG
Distribution: usa
Organization: Software Productivity Consortium, Herndon, Virginia

******************************************************************
                     LOWERED PRICE !!!!!!!!!!!!!
******************************************************************

I have a house in Plano, Texas (located about 20 Northeast of Dallas)
for sale.  Here are the particulars:

  o 3 bedroom, 2 bath, 2-car garage, formal living and dining rooms,
      game room
  o Approx. 1700 sq. ft. (without the garage, I think)
  o Ranch-style (one level), all brick (except for one side of garage)
  o Located on a corner lot with a fenced back yard
  o Built in 1986.
  o Located within 5 minutes of elementary school, intermediate
      school, high school, and country club (with golf course)
  o Located within 10 minutes of Rt. 75 (a major feeder highway
      to Dallas)

Asking $88,900.  If interested, please contact Jeff or Val in Virginia
at (703) 444-5364.

Thanks.

Jeff Facemire
facemire@software.org
From: eroth@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (elizabeth.s.roth)
Subject: Re: 15 year vs. 30 year loans
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 15:50:48 GMT


Wow!  After all the postings here and the letters I received e-mail,
I have to say UNCLE.  Wish we had gone through all this before I closed
on my 15-year refinance last month.    :-(

Better late than never, though.  I'm using all the new info to estimate
what my company savings plan will be worth by the time I retire.  The 
figures look lots better than they used to.   ;-)



-- 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>=<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
> Education never helped morals ... the    -- WILL           (all the usual   <
> smarter the guy, the bigger the rascal.  -- ROGERS          disclaimers)    <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>=<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
From: jyl@burgess.eng.sun.com (Jacob Levy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: POLL: RTC listings to Usenet?
Date: 1 Sep 92 19:00:32 GMT
Reply-To: jyl@toss.eng.sun.com
Organization: State Retirement Home for Retarded Slugs
NNTP-Posting-Host: burgess

This is a poll. I'm interested in hearing your reactions to this thought.

Would readers of this newsgroup be interested in having periodical listings
of RTC properties for sale to be sent to the group? Would this help move
these properties faster? I'm guessing, without having checked with the RTC,
that this would cause no objection from the RTC. Am I wrong?

Incidentally, the RTC is offering a network service called RTCNet which
allows you to browse property listings on-line. However, they ask $36.95
for a one time setup fee and then $16.80 or so for monthly connect charges.
I believe they would do much more business with this network service if
they would make it free of charge. The number to call to obtain access to
the service is 1-800-431-0600. Ask for a number to call to give them your
opinion about whether they should charge for this service.

--JYL
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate