HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: davet@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Dave Tutelman)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: LP Stereo
Date: 9 Apr 92 10:57:45 GMT
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs - Lincroft, NJ

In article <RWK.92Apr8212350@taunton.crl.dec.com> rwk@crl.dec.com (Bob Kerns) writes:
>In article <D88-JWA.92Apr8110325@hemul.nada.kth.se> d88-jwa@hemul.nada.kth.se (Jon W{tte) writes:
>
>   From: d88-jwa@hemul.nada.kth.se (Jon W{tte)
>   Date: 8 Apr 92 10:03:25 GMT
>   .cs.uiuc.edu> cs318a62@ibmb2.cs.uiuc.edu (Philip M Scopes) writes:
>
>      >I don't know if this question is totally appropriate but, 
>
>      >Where do you get two tracks on an LP?  Do they really do stereo?
>
>   My vote (from disassembling my pickup, and also from knowing the
>   needle may skip on hard drum beats) is for using both right-left
>   and up-down orientations.
>
>The problem with this is that it's asymetric.  You really want
>both channels to be handled in the same way.  So take your
>approach, and simpley rotate it 45 degrees!  Instead of up-down,
>and left-right, the needle senses up-left/down-right and up-right/down-left.
>That is, the two independent direction vectors are perpendicular to
>the groove walls, instead of perpendicular to the groove bottom
>and parallel to it..
>
>      R      L
>       \    /
>        \  /
>         \/
>         /\
>        /  \
>----   /    \  ------
>    \ L      R/
>     \       /
>      \     /
>       \   /
>        \ /
>         V

Absolutely right!  This was adopted because, at the beginning of stereo
recording, there were lots of monaural phonographs around.  Their needle
moved side-to-side to generate the single audio channel.  The picture above
provides a backward-compatible system, where a side-to-side-only needle
would get equal doses of right and left channels.

One problem, though.  The monaural cartridges had no up-down compliance,
so the vertical detail on the track got bulldozed away.  This was fine
if you used the record ONLY on the first phono you played it on.  But if
you upgraded to stereo, your existing collection had become nearly-mono
(because the L-R signal had been "smoothed out").  Worse yet, if you
borrowed a record from a friend with stereo ..... :-(

And yes, I know that monaural records were also available in that time
frame. But they weren't appreciably cheaper after the novelty wore off.
In fact, after the first couple of years, most releases were ONLY in
stereo, long before my family upgraded to stereo.  Hey, we had extension
speakers all over the house, so an upgrade would have been major $$$
and rewiring hassle.

Dave
From: metlay@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu (metlay)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: Minimoog:  No PWM???
Summary: OBMX filters ARE MiniMoog filters
Date: 16 Apr 92 22:20:21 GMT
Organization: Atomic City

In article <1992Apr15.171352.8604@intacc.uucp> zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc Szabo) writes:
>Oberheim's new OB-MG professes to have SEM filters ANDMoog filters.
>It doesn't say Mini-Moog filters thoug

Yes, it DOES. There wouldn't be any point in getting analog junkies to
cough up the incredible amount of money an OBMX will cost, otherwise.
So the gang at Oberheim bent over backwards to EXACTLY reproduce the
ladder filters in the MiniMoog, even to the placement of components.

The unit is going to cost something like $2000 for a two-voice model;
exorbitant until you price a MIDIMini.

--
metlay    | 
@minerva. |                      G*R*A*S*P*!
phyast.   | 
pitt.edu  |
From: dan@cafws1.eng.UCI.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Minimoog:  No PWM???
Date: 10 Apr 92 18:28:02 GMT


	Hi everyone.  I was looking at the review of the MIDIMini in Keyboard
and trying to figure out what all the Minimoog can do.  As far as I can tell,
there is only manual pulse width modulation?!  This can't be.  Another
question I have is:  Is the wave select knob continuous or multi-position-
switch-type?  Also, do the higher end Moogs (Multi, Memory) have the same
killer filter(s) as the Mini?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Dan Harkless                | "The sore in my soul                         |
| dharkles@bonnie.ics.uci.edu |  The mark in my heart  ->  Front 242,        |
| dan@cafws1.eng.uci.edu      |  Her acid reign..."        Tragedy >For You< |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
From: ricko@ee.uts.edu.au (Rick Jelliffe)
Subject: Roland SH-3A
Organization: University of Technology, Sydney, Australia
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 08:43:59 GMT

Does anyone else have a Roland SH-3A? I think it was the first thing
Roland made (at least for international consumption), an analog mono
synth. Its main trick is that, even though it only has one VCO, this 
goes through frequency dividers so you have five sliders each mixing
a different octave in. Each of these five had three waveworms possible,
and the 8' had a "chorus" pot (some kind of pulse width modulation it
seems). 

The other interesting thing is that even when it appeared (75?), it 
did not sound like the brash US synths. Perhaps Jap synth-makers
saw synths as being add-ons to organs, or at least saw that as their
best initial market.

-ricko

Rick Jelliffe
Research Computing Centre
University of Technology, Sydney
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
From: jay@cmn8.Stanford.EDU (Jay Kadis)
Subject: Re: CD RECORDER - Cheap!, Well.....
Organization: DSG, Stanford University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 16:42:28 GMT

I did a run of 200 cassettes duplicated in real time from DAT master and  
full color J-card inserts with cassette shell printing.  The total was  
about $900.  (Of course, the next run, if there is one, will cost much  
less.)  I also recently did a CD project, which involved 1000 CDs mastered  
to PCM 1630 from DAT and simple B&W graphics.  The total cost was about  
$2600.  Even if the cassette release had been run at 1000, the cost would  
have been comparable to the CD release!  CD manufacturing costs have  
dropped considerably in the last few years.  Of course, these prices do  
not include the original recording costs, but they should be the same in  
either case.

Jay Kadis
jay@ccrma.stanford.edu
From: jgj@ssd.csd.harris.com (Jeff Jackson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: DOD 1642 Mixer vs. Alesis 1622 vs. Mackie CR 1604
Date: 15 Apr 92 14:33:20 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: I would rather be windsurfing.


There was recently a thread comparing the Alesis 1622 and the Mackie
CR 1604.  Has any one seen/used the DOD 1642.  From the ads, it looks
comperable to them and lists for the same as the Mackie ($1099 -- I
would assume street price would be around $800).

Thanx,
--
============================================================================
Jeffrey Glen Jackson  _|_Satan jeered, "You're dead meat Jesus, I'm gonna
jgj@ssd.csd.harris.com |     bust you up tonight."
x5120                  | Jesus said, "Go ahead, make my day."
                   ~~~~~~~~~ -- Carman, "The Champion"
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
From: metlay@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu (metlay)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: FOR SALE!
Summary: for the curious....
Date: 8 Apr 92 04:44:04 GMT
Organization: Atomic City

The poster of the Kawai synths and the electronic Music albums is
someone I've been waiting for on this newsgroup for approximately
five years, John Curtis, an old bandmate of mine from college. 
I've played both synths in question and they are in MINT condition,
absolutley without a scratch. A steal at this price. The CDs and
vinyl are equally cherry-- I ought to know, he let me and Rossi 
go through the pile before posting here! |->

Welcome to the Net, John. Although to keep you straight from Rossi,
I'm gonna have to call him John 3 and you John 0....

--
metlay    | "Oooo... bemahmma fluk moogie flabber nerble fremlap vimmdo
@minerva. |  "LXP-5" seegin waggy furplesmurch mibbur ig crumple bummy 
phyast.   |  "Quadraverb" ... horf, horf, horf."
pitt.edu  |                       --words to live by, from P. Robinson.
From: wayne@inmet.camb.inmet.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: Seeking weird analog synth
Date: 13 Apr 92 00:09:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:pyramid.pyramid.com:180866:inmet:15400138:000:300
Nf-From: inmet.camb.inmet.com!wayne    Apr 12 20:09:00 1992


You are probably describing an old VCS "Putney"....I think Roger Powell had
one early on...I remember reading an interview with Joe Zawinul where he said
his first exposure to a synth was a friend who he went in on a "Putney" with.

BTW the old ARP 2500's had matrices of this type also.

Not Wayne
From: eirikur@ranger.enet.dec.com (Eirikur Hallgrimsson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: OB-MX, reality thereof. (was Re: Minimoog:  No PWM???)
Date: 17 Apr 92 20:36:33 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <205025@unix.cis.pitt.edu>, metlay@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu (metlay) writes...
>The unit is going to cost something like $2000 for a two-voice model;
>exorbitant until you price a MIDIMini.

But does in really exist?  I wonder, given the pre-announcement (well maybe
they call that a real announcement, but they didn't give a hard date) of the
Alesis S4/S5 price/performance blockbuster.  I don't know that I would invest
in Oberheim stock at this point unless the OB-MX has a FAR superior user
interface to the one I have seen a picture of.

So, Mike, ye of the Oberheim contacts, are we really going to see MX's?

Eirikur Hallgrimsson   | "It *actually is* a telephone switchboard mating
eh@ranger.enet.dec.com |  with a Hammond organ.  In very slow motion.
PATHWORKS for Macintosh|  modern art, donchaknow."
From: tuan@sequent.com (Tuan Nguyen)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: WANTED: Editor/Librarian for PC.
Date: 14 Apr 92 17:10:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Apr14.171015.15378
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.


I'm in desperate need for an Editor/Librarian s/w for PC.

If you have the Midi Quest ed/lib or Dr. T ed/lib and don't
care to get rid of it then please send me some E-mail with
your price.

thanks,

tuan.          (...tuan@sequent.com)
From: campnest@lonestar.utsa.edu (Armando F. Campnest)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: Info needed on Casio CZ-1
Keywords: Casio, synth
Date: 10 Apr 92 05:19:41 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio

You should be able to pick one up for about $100 or less, for a tight
sitcho-- they make great tone banks, and gimmick rigs for roadhouse gigs.
I used to use one for just those purposes, when I was on a shoestring
budget.

A lot of players out there kinda look down on Casios. Hey that's fine if
you can afford a Kurz, or whatever. But hey, it's like my ole Lady always
sez "It's not the size, but the magic in the wand ;]
From: foster@niblick.ecn.purdue.edu (Kirk Foster)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Synth Family Trees
Keywords: Kawai+Casio
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:52:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: noose.1992Apr8.205225.12054
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network


A Kawai rep told me that Kawai and Casio have merged their synth
lines with the Kawai nameplate on the high end equipment and Casio
on the low end. This follows by several months a Kawai dealer saying
that Kawai was going under. I never mentioned the older story because
it was unconfirmed, however, I've now blurted a current unconfirmed
rumor. So, sue me. Anybody out there heard anything?

Kirk
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 10:19:53 PDT
From:         Peter Uchytil <kentrox!ktxs8!peter@UUNET.UU.NET>
Subject:      Re: CD RECORDER - Cheap!, Well.....
Comments: To: uunet!AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU!SYNTH-L@uunet.UU.NET

>
> In article <74r702nM0fdX01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> kls30@DUTS.ccc.amdahl.com
> writes:
> >You would be better off getting some pressed.  The media for the
> >the cd recording machine is $80 a pop.  For someone to cut a CD you can
> >figure on a price 2-3x the media cost.
>
> Sony's announcement 18 months ago listed the price goal at $25
> (discounted selling price) per disc for the "That's CD-R" system.  Even
> if/when prices do get that low, it's still an expensive proposition to
> use it to produce a CD demo.
.. [stuff deleted]
>
> It would sure help if some of the disc makers had a low-run package
> for people who just need a few discs, but most of the basic cost in
> creating a CD comes from the setup.
>

I read an article in our local paper recently about a lady who produces several
local bands.  She commented that more and more record companies wanted
submissions on CD.  How much *does* it cost to do a CD demo vs. a tape?  I'm
sure lots of people will say "lots", but what is "lots"?  And talking tapes,
what is the difference between a casette demo vs. a DAT demo?  Does anybody
even take DAT submissions?  Just curious.

Pete
PS. It seems that this kind of CD-R technology could be attractive to DJs
 who put out remix LPs.  Seems like this could make it affordable to do
 custom remix CDs.

--
Peter Uchytil       | Kentrox Industries | "Don't give up on desire
uunet!kentrox!peter | Portland, Oregon   |  And you will have your day"
From: nick@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Nick Rothwell)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: Problems!!!!!
Date: 6 Apr 92 12:08:01 GMT
Organization: Friends of the Salter Duck
In-reply-to: metlay@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu's message of 6 Apr 92 00:26:56 GMT

In article <204453@unix.cis.pitt.edu> metlay@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu (metlay) writes:

   >>	Je ne sais pas; mais, peut-etre si vous posez le question en anglais,
   >>il y sera plus de personnes qui peuvent repondre.

   >Nishin: Nihongo ga wakaru hito wa, hitori de mo kono guruup wo yonde iru hito
   >iru kai?

   Izvinityeh, pozhaluista, no ya dumayu shto etot razgovor ochen' glupui'!
   U nas nyet luchyie temui, kak MIDI ili kotorii K2000 lyche chem Alesis S5?

Muppapa gninng vun gddang K2000 wer "Harris-burp" gergrunt.
Muppapa de wonna donga vor Alesis S5 wer "Hrrrrr-moble-eeeble" gergrunt.

Nick.
--
Nick Rothwell, LFCS, Edinburgh | Mark X here if article is a gift .. .. .. (X)
             nick@dcs.ed.ac.uk | Il s'agit d'un cadeau
Mentation Consultancy Services | or a sample of merchandise .. .. .. .. .. ( )
   cassiel@cix.compulink.co.uk | d'un enchantillon de marchandises
From: eirikur@ranger.enet.dec.com (Eirikur Hallgrimsson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: Why I am presonally recommending the K2000 not be released as a rack..
Date: 7 Apr 92 04:15:12 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1992Mar31.232916.246331@cs.cmu.edu>, sef@sef-pmax.slisp.cs.cmu.edu writes...
>Well, as long as John Rossi has exactly the configuration he needs, it
>would obviously be stupid for Young Chang to package this technology any
>other way.
> 

Well, yeah, that's what it sounds like, but what I think it actually means is
that the K2000 is REALLY WORKING for him, and that's good news.  

Eirikur Hallgrimsson   | "Hey, what *is* that thing?  It looks like a telephone
eh@ranger.enet.dec.com |  switchboard trying to mate with a Hammond organ!"
PATHWORKS for Macintosh|
From: michael@NSMA.AriZonA.EdU (Michael S. Williams)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: ProCussion or D4?
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:40:47 GMT
Reply-To: michael@NSMA.AriZonA.EdU (Michael S. Williams)
Organization: Center for Neural Systems, Memory, and Aging

In article <1992Apr14.225614.29734@uunet.uu.net> kyle@uunet.uu.net (Kyle Jones) writes:
>Randomizer@cup.portal.com (Aron Fingers Nelson) writes:
> > > And it is around $1000. For
> > 1/3 the price (got mine for $299) the D4 has something like 500 sounds
> > that can be grouped into 16 drum kits,
> > 
> > Mine has 21 drum kits 0..20.
>
>What exactly are these `kits'?  For example on the R-8 you can
>map all the internal sounds to MIDI note numbers, which I guess
>can be considered to be just one big kit.  I can pick the sounds
>I want by assigning note numbers to the pads on my Octapad.
>
>How do the D4 kits relate to note numbers?  How many sounds can
>you fit into a kit?  Can the D4 be driven by MIDI note numbers
>instead of the triggers?

Since the D-4 has more than 128 voices/notes (500 of them), you
*can't* access all of them at one time- therefore, kits. These
kits allow you to access up to (I think) 48 voices at any one
time, assigning any voice to any MIDI note number within the
specified range.  The triggers are then assigned to specific
MIDI note numbers as well, corresponding to the voice at that
note number.

-Michael
<><-><--><---><----><-----><------><======><------><-----><----><---><--><-><>
Michael Williams, michael@nsma.arizona.edu
University of Arizona's Division of Neural Systems, Memory & Aging
344 Life Sciences Bldg, North
Tucson, AZ 85724
(602)626-2611
<><-><--><---><----><-----><------><======><------><-----><----><---><--><-><>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 10:41:14 PDT
From:         more dark than shark <DUNN@INTELLICORP.COM>
Subject:      Re: Alesis ADAT and BRC
Comments: To: synth-l%auvm.bitnet@cunyvm.cuny.edu

oops, an addendum!
the DemoBot mumbled somthing about Opcode doing
development...as well as MOTU...as well as JB Cooper.

their Fiber-Optic link to other ADATs and to the BRC is
a 8track format; patent pending. existing optic links
are 2track. the box has both EIAJ and this proprietary
multichannel connectors.  AES/EBU and SPDIF optional.

balanced inputs are avail via a funky Elco multipin dohickie.

there are (sftware) developers kits available; Alesis
is 'comitted' to an open arch.

the only problem I saw is that you'll need two to make backups.
awww. unless you drop down to 2-track (DAT) format. then, however, you
would lose that hot hot hot sync track.


casey

-------
From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: Re: PowerBooks (Best Bang for the Buck)
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:42:36 GMT
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server

Nick Rothwell should have more information soon (he just got a PB140),
but my understanding is that the power control circuitry sends
interrupts that screws up high-speed data communications in the
Power books.  Datacomm at 38Kb and even 19.2 is fouled up, so
MIDI at 31K is also going to get (occasionally) clobbered.  Good way
to get stuck notes, and doing sys-ex would be horrendous.

I was thinking of a PB-140 for my system, but decided that being
on the bleeding edge was too much.  Besides, a Classic II is cheaper.  :-)

Pete Brooks
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
From: 4065C147@kentvm.kent.edu
Subject: 4-SALE! NEW LOWER PRICES
Organization: Kent State Univ.
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 23:23:45 GMT

FOR SALE AT NEW LOWER PRICES:

- Kawai K-5 Digital Multidimentional Synthesizer Keyboard
Kawai DC-32 RAM Card, manuals, original boxes
32 banks of third party sounds on floppies in Atari Dr. T format
ask me about K-5 software editors and librarians...
now only $400
if you buy the K-5, I'll sell you a 5-tier stand for $50!
- Kawai K-5m Digital Multidimentional Synthesizer Module (rackmount)
Kawai DC-32 RAM Card, manual
32 banks of third party sounds on floppies in Atari Dr. T format
ask me about K-5 software editors and librarians...
now only $350
- C-Lab Notator MIDI Sequence & Score Edit/Printout Management System
v2.0, 2.1 for Atari ST (ask me about v3.0)
C-Lab Director Universal MIDI-Routing for C-Lab Export & Unitor
C-Lab Unitor N SMPTE/EBU Synchronizer & MIDI Expander
C-Lab ExPort MIDI Expansion Interface
manuals
plus seven 20 foot MIDI cables!
now only $450
- Atari 1040ST computer
Atari SC1224 color monitor
Atari mouse
USA Language disk
manuals and Atari-related books
WordPerfect for Atari ST
CopyIIST
now only $400

SORRY - ALL CDs and LPs now sold...

contact: John T. Curtis (4065C147 at KENTVM.KENT.EDU)
1500 Clearbrooke Drive, #119
Brunswick, Ohio  44212
(216) 273-8375
From: jamesmc@ut-emx.uucp (James McCartney)
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Subject: Re: FM on the K2000
Date: 9 Apr 92 15:26:30 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin; Austin, Texas

In article <1992Apr6.133629.623@cbnews.cb.att.com> eab@cbnews.cb.att.com (eugene.a.beer) writes:
>The K2000 will do limited FM.  The sample waveforms can be used as a MODULATOR
>of a sine, saw, or square wave as a carrier. Use Alg. 10 (I recollect) with
>XAMP as the final stage and sine/saw/square followed by GAIN in the
>intermediate DSP stages.  You can only have a single modulator-no stacks
    This would be AM, to do FM, you should do something like:
PITCH->GAIN->SW+SHP or PITCH->GAIN->SAW+->SHAPER or perhaps what you meant
was PITCH->[anything]->GAIN->SAW->!AMP [alg11]. Any of these is a form of phase
modulation, which is the only way to do FM on the K2000 (and is the way
Yamaha does it anyway -- see my previous post). You should use SAW for a true
FM sound, since that emulates the phase accumulator stage of a digital
oscillator. You are right in that the sampled wave is the modulator and
not the carrier and that what you get really has very little to do with
the timbre of the modulator. It would have been more interesting to be 
able to modulate the phase of the sample, but this is quite complex to
do because of loop point checking. I have written code to do this in 
signal processing code I have written, and it is a pain. However the timbre
of the modulator does retain its character when you are phase modulating a
low frequency (< ~8Hz) wave. Then what you get is a waveshaped tremolo of
the original. Waveshaping is equivalent to phase modulation of a 0Hz signal.
 --- james mccartney

Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
From: ruprecht@informatik.uni-freiburg.de (Nick Ruprecht)
Subject: Q: need info on external PC MIDI interfaces (Midiator)
Summary: want to buy, but dealers can't help ...
Organization: Institut fuer Informatik der Universitaet Freiburg, Deutschland
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 09:31:07 GMT


Hello,

I need a MIDI interface for my IBM compatible laptop. It doesn't have
slots, so I am looking for something to hook up to a serial or
parallel port (parallel preferred, so I can still use the mouse).

I have seen the Key Electronics Midiator been mentioned here as a MIDI
interface that can be attached to a serial port. So when my parents
decided to visit their relatives in Florida, I asked them to buy one
for me. Unfortunately, none of the dealers in Gainesville knows it or
where to get it.

So, please, could someone provide me with the complete name, address,
and telephone number of the company? (And ASAP, so I can phone my
parents before they return.)

And while I'm at it, I could also use info on the various models
available (with prices) so I can tell my parents which one to get. Are
there other brands around to provide an alternative?

Thanks a lot for your help. Please e-mail, I'll summarize if anybody
tells me s/he's interested.

So long,

--

Nick Ruprecht
Institut fuer Informatik der Universitaet Freiburg, Germany
(ruprecht@informatik.uni-freiburg.de)
From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 16:35:42 GMT
Subject: Re: Used DX7 versus used Kawaii K-1 ii recommendation needed
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth

Hmpf.  Favorite pet peeve:  someone wanting information, but not willing
to spend the effort the read the group.  Some days I'll just ignore
these posts, some times I'll comment, but I refuse to e-mail on this.

Anyway:  If you take a look at the used price list, the *asking*
price for a K1 II is 350-450.  I bought mine *new* for 495, and when
I sold it, I let it go for $325.  (I didn't have to ship it, and
avoiding the hassle was worth the $25 to me.)  As far as DX7 prices go,
this could be fair, though Guitar Showcase in San Jose had a single
new DX7 IIfd that someone unearthed from the Yamaha warehouse.  It
was going for $595, but I believe it's been sold.

I can't speak about the DX7, but the K1 II is a decent first synth.
OK (not great, not extrordinarily cheesy) sounds, tolerable effects,
so-so user interface, and a manual that has the information if you are
willing to look hard enough.  It's a good synth for $400, but not used
at $600.  (For that price, you could get a new one in Chicago, with
transportation thrown in.)

If you read the group, you will see this.  Otherwise, to hell with it.

Pete Brooks