From: jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak)
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Reply-To: jpak@manute.sps.mot.com
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 07:27:17 GMT

In article <24808@dog.ee.lbl.gov> kevin@daffy.ee.lbl.gov (Kevin Gong) writes:
>>(2) In asking, "Where are you from?" rather than asking his ethnicity
>>directly, he was implying that people who look Asian are not Americans.
>>If you ask a Caucasian, "Where are you from?" and he says, "Cincinnati,"
>>you would accept his answer rather than looking for an answer such as
>>"Poland" or "Switzerland."
>
>I just read "Dear Abby" today.  I'm tempted to write a letter, too.  I'm
>thinking, however, that it would stand a better chance of getting printed if
>it sounded official.  So, I'm wondering what people on s.c.a.a. feel about
>writing a joint letter to Dear Abigail and signing it SCAA.
>
>Knowing this newsgroup, I'm sure people will have a hard time agreeing on
>saying any one thing, but if you like the general ideas Kerry is presenting,
>maybe we can do this.

Oh boy, you might be surprised to hear this coming from *me*, and I may be
flip-flopping from a stance I took on this a long time ago (I don't recall
which stance I took then, to be honest), but why didn't the guy simply
deflect the original question like this?

   2 women (to me):  Excuse me, sir, but we have a bet going on.  Could you
                     tell me where you're from?

   (I know what they're driving at; most likely, they mean my ethnicity, not
    an answer like "California.")

   Me:  I'm ethnically Korean, but I'm from California.  (Smile.)

Well, how painful can that be?  :-)

I really feel that a lot of times, the question "Where are you from?" directed
to an AA person is just a lazy way of asking "What's your ethnicity?"  OK,
so those people who ask aren't the most semantically correct people in the
world?  So what?  If they ask *POLITELY*, why not tell them our ethnicity?
Should we give that complete stranger a lecture instead on their "racist" ways?
Seems kind of pointless to me.  If the thought of mentioning your ethnicity
to a curious stranger is truly offensive to you, then just simply say, "I'd
rather not discuss my ethnicity."  Then, if they really meant where you came
from rather than your ethnicity, the stranger will simply say something like,
"Oh, I didn't mean your ethnicity; I really wanted to know where you came
from", and then you can tell them (unless you don't want to tell them that,
either).  But to be purposefully coy doesn't serve much purpose, IMO.

You know, I was going over the archives a few days ago and I ran into this
very same subject then.  I found this article below that I'm enclosing and
I really liked it.  I hope Huy doesn't mind my re-posting it here, because
I think it's worth saying again.

[Note: ***PLEASE*** don't flame Huy for this.  If you have to flame, flame
       ME for posting this again over a year later.  At least I'm here to
       defend myself.]

============================================================================
From: cao@oahu.cs.ucla.edu (Huy Cao)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: what to say
Date: 30 Apr 91 23:39:37 GMT
Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department

I've met European descended Americans with accents to whom I've asked, 
"Where are you from originally?"  Thereupon, an interesting conversation 
flowed (since the white person never felt the urge to get defensive).

   Isn't all of this largely a communication problem?  A sample 
conversation between Amy (white American) and Andy (Asian-American):

   Amy:   (Observing that Andy could be from another country, asks)  
      So, where are you from?

   Andy:   (Looking into Amy's eyes and knowing what she wants to 
       hear -- possibly with some racist implication -- decides 
       to frustrate her by replying)  I'm from the Midwest, as 
       a matter of fact.

   Amy:   (Still has in mind her original intent in asking the 
      question, presses with) No, I mean, where are you 
      originally from?

   Andy:   [Here, the reply depends on Andy's temperament and mood.]

My friends, you say you want understanding between people of different 
ethnicities.  You say you want those thousands of prejudices to dissolve 
away.  Well then, isn't conversation the best means to overcoming 
misconceptions?  How will you ever communicate effectively with somebody 
if you mind-read too much, if you assign intentions to them which they 
may only very vaguely possess?  Let us not read minds.  Let us practice 
the art of polite conversation.

Let's catch Andy when he's in a good mood:

   Amy:   So, where are you from?

   Andy:   Well, as a matter of fact, my parents were from 
      China, so I'm a second-generation Chinese-American.  
      I've been in good ol' California for two years, and 
      before that, I was on the farm in Iowa.

   Amy:   Oh, it must have been fun raising the pigs!

   Andy:   Listen, I'll never forget the day of the county fair 
      with us trying to catch those slippery pigs . . .

Oh well, have a nice week, y'all.

               Huy

============================================================================

Hell, if you ask me, the Andy in the first example is an idiot not to use
that as an opportunity to get to know Amy better.  :-) :-)

OK, a few more comments.  Yes, I know a "typical" white or black person who
doesn't have a "foreign" accent doesn't get asked that question with the
hidden meaning attached to it.  But so what?  Maybe I'm just getting older
and mellower (doubtful), but among life's inconveniences caused by race,
this one's pretty low on my scale.  Actually, like Huy said, it can be a
nice conversation opener.  And why assume (unless they ask it like an asshole,
in which case they deserve to get nailed by you) that non-Asians think you're
not Real Americans[tm], rather than the simpler assumption that they know
you're American too and meant to ask about your ethnicity but were simply too
careless to phrase the question precisely?

And in fact, this exact situation happened to me just last winter.  I was
in a taxicab, the driver was White/Hispanic-looking and spoke with a thick
accent, and he asked me where I was from.  I simply answered that I'm from
Texas, but that I was born in South Korea.  And a nice little conversation
ensued, during which I got to ask *his* ethnicity (Argentine).  And since
neither he nor I got defensive about it, we probably learned a heck of a
lot more about each other than if I had gotten coy or angry in the beginning.

Same thing happened in reverse earlier this month.  Was at a Chinese restau-
rant, and the waitress was kind of "unique-looking," looked mostly Caucasian
but just a little bit different from the "norm" (pardon that term), and so
a few of us got curious as to her ethnicity.  Not because we wanted to be
mean or anything, just curious.  And although I didn't have the nerve to ask
her, somebody else did, and she answered in the most graceful way that she
was "Chinese-American," and that her mother was originally from Taiwan.  OK,
she didn't get asked where she was from; she got asked point-blank about her
ethnicity.  But the point is, a more "conventional-looking" Caucasian person
would not have been asked that question in the first place; for that reason
alone, she could have gotten upset and snapped at us.  But she didn't; she was
extremely gracious, and I think she handled it the best way she could have
under the circumstances.  I don't know; maybe I don't get asked this question
that much anymore, so I'm less sensitive to it, but that's the way I feel.
I feel bad for the AAs out there who get asked this question all the time.
If you do, then disregard what I said, because I know anything can get
annoying if you get asked it all the time.

But if you don't, like Huy said, why not be polite instead of coy?  You're
not ashamed of your ethnicity, are you?  :-)

Jim
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american