HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: INL plague code (was: Re: INL pop code)
Date: 7 Jan 93 20:06:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C0I2In.5I0.1
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Originator: spot@HOPELESS.MESS.CS.CMU.EDU

>>>>> On 7 Jan 93 17:30:38 GMT, leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens) said:

Leonard> We should consider the idea of totally removing plagues from
Leonard> the INL

yes, we should consider it.


Leonard> As it stands the plague code essentially limits the good a
Leonard> team can do for itself defensively in the opening.

"limit" isn't the right word.  "effect" is better.  it introduces a
risk to the obvious strategy of piling everything on the homeworld.  i
think this is good.  it's a tradeoff.  in fact, increase it the chance
of plague!


Leonard> I don't consider this a "big problem" though.  Even in the
Leonard> game where TWNN lost some 40 armies to a homeworld plague,
Leonard> eventually the game boiled down to a midfield slugfest with
Leonard> the winner decided by who could control that space and move
Leonard> armies into it most effectively.

yes, currently the mid-game lasts so long that the opening has little
impact on the outcome of the match.  i don't like this.  i think INL
matches should be shorter, more like 60 minutes.  that's short enough
(i think) to actually hurt the team that screws up the opening.
currently, a team can dick around for 30 minutes, lose all but their
core, and still win if they are the better team.  why play those first
30 minutes if they don't matter?  i think adding emphasis to the
opening will add a new level of variety and strategy to the game.

besides, a 60 minute games means that you can play two instead of one
(home and away with the second game waved a la bert's suggestion), or
just make the scheduling easier.
-- 
				orgasm
Scott Draves			nitrous
spot@cs.cmu.edu			death
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: artc@iplmail.orl.mmc.com (Art)
Subject: CLUE people ONLY!! ( MUST READ! )
Organization: MMC
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:14:18 GMT


I  was wondering if the formula for the
GPA VS. DI(RANK) is still the same

please answer the following questions:



1.  what's your highest RANK ( please don't answer if it's below capt )
 
    ___________________

2. What is your highest DI??

    ___________________

3. What year are you in??? (Working,  Phd, Grad, Sr, Jr....)


    ___________________


4. what is your current major????


    ___________________
 

5. What is your current GPA???????

   
    ___________________

6. How many hours do you play per week???


    ___________________

7. Do you have a girlfriend??? ( if yes, how many hours do you 
                                 spend on <or on top of> her?? )


   ____________________



I will post the result, and revised the formula based on the 
information collected!



Thanks
Cool

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

	"Officer, I know I was going faster than 55MPH, but I wasn't
	going to be on the road an hour."

                                               Opppppps......
 -------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: chris@inconel.uucp (Christian)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Changing the alignment of an altar???
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:34:24 GMT
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering

In article <ewing-040193164024@usrv13L> ewing@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu (Rick Ewing) writes:
>I've heard that it is possible not only to change your character's
>alignment during a game, but it is also possible to change an altar's
>alignment (not without consequences, I suspect).  is it indeed possible,
>and if so, an clues on how to accomplish this?
>
>--Rick Ewing
>  Vanderbilt University

Hee hee! This is a good one. <Tries to keep from rolling on the floor in mirth>

Ok, AHEM! What you need, Sir, is rec.games.netHACK. This is a fine distinction,
I know (heck, I've tried many a time to change the aligment of a planet in an
LPS... (it is possible, ya know)) but I do believe you want the nethack group.

-Chris "Hack/Trek" Net  
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jive@spanky.ssc.gov (Jim Ivey)
Subject: Re: Netrek 358: Starbase Theory & Concept 
Organization: SSC Laboratory, Dallas, TX
	<1993Jan10.161251.8428@cis.ohio-state.edu>
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 22:50:40 GMT


> 	Anyway, these are just my feelings.  And remember, you too
> can hold your own with Balton and Wreck.  Mail me for details.  

     P.S.  Wreck is the best base currently playing.  Please insert his
name wherever you see 'Balton', with regards to 'best base' :)

     Jamie / FillInTheBlank
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: mccoy@ils.nwu.edu (Jim Mccoy)
Subject: Re: Scattered Pops in INL
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:57:34 GMT

In article <63202@mimsy.umd.edu> sjsmith@cs.umd.edu (Stephen Joseph Smith) writes:
> [regarding scattered pops in next season's INL code...]
>
>Additionally, I'd like to know everyone's opinions on:
>	Do scattered pops make netrek more, or less, strategically rich?
>	*Why* is a 10-second or 1-second or 100-millisecond granularity
>	better than a 40-second granularity?

What can you do in 1 second?  In 10 seconds?  In 40 seconds?  In 40 seconds
I can go from one core to another and back again.  The fact that one has
_certain_ knowledge that a planet is not going to pop for a set interval
gives you an advantage in decision-making regarding the two most important
strategic decisions you make during a game: when to drop and when to be in
position to bomb.  The question this issue raises is "how long should you
have to act upon this information?"

I guess I am of the opinion that shorter periods of this certainty would
make the game better.  I think that the biggest factor influencing my
opinion is that I am of the opinion that it should be next to impossible to
take an agri alone (sans bombing) with one kill (e.g. drop two and then
grab another two and drop them before it pops.)  Considering how much you
can do in 40 seconds, does anyone have any good reasons why planet popping
should be this predictable and at this frequency? "That's the way it has
always been." seems a pretty weak reason, BTW.


Clausewitz, "On Pops".

-- 
Jim McCoy          |  PGP 2.0 Key md5 hash:
j-mccoy@nwu.edu    |  61323c49024cb089337c78a05aafe8c6
mccoy@ils.nwu.edu  |  finger mccoy@ils.nwu.edu for public key

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: piperno@mars.Colorado.EDU (Serge Piperno)
Subject: Re: Was that the real PIG BOY?
Reply-To: piperno@boulder.Colorado.EDU
Organization: University of Colorado at Boulder
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 19:26:58 GMT

In article <1ijhr5INN1ma@magna.ksu.ksu.edu>, camelsho@magna.ksu.ksu.edu (   James A Seymour) writes:
J.A.Seymour|>    There was a Mucus Pig on bronco this evening.
J.A.Seymour|>    I am just curious if he was the real Pig Boy.
J.A.Seymour|>    At one point, he told me he was Lord Bug Ass,
J.A.Seymour|>    or some such.

J.A.Seymour|>    Was he real, or just memorex?

J.A.Seymour|>    camel

I propose a new(?) logging in procedure:

1. The player writes his name.
2. All invisible characters are replaced by a space ' '.
3. All series of 1 or more spaces are then replaced by one space ' '.
4. Follow the rest of the current procedure.

We may get rid of unwanted "aliases"...

Pipo.
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Netrek 358: Starbase Theory & Concept
Date: 10 Jan 93 15:46:53 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <C0nn5t.HoD.1@cs.cmu.edu>, hde+@cs.cmu.edu (Herbert Enderton) writes:
> In article <1993Jan10.161251.8428@cis.ohio-state.edu> mdm@stegosaur.cis.ohio-state.edu (Michael Moore) writes:
> It's hard to be sure about strategic questions like this, but I think
> Ged is right on the money here.  Recently I've started coming in as a
> starbase every time it becomes available, even though it's not my
> forte.  I hustle on up to the middle of the front, not going out of my
> way to pick up armies, and I make a nuisance of myself until the enemy
> team oggs me to death.  When they og, I don't distress, and I don't
> retreat so far that the enemy might give up ogging me, but I do try to
> dodge as well as I can.  On average I guess my bases last about five
> minutes, and my teammates usually say I'm a clueless twink, but what do
> they know?  This is the only way I've found to be useful in a starbase
> (except in the opening), and it's the best way I've found to prevent a
> teammate from taking the starbase himself and becoming a serious
> liability, which is what 99% of the bases out there are, because
> they're not willing to die, they stay in their own space, and because
> most players tend to escort wounded SBs instead of going into enemy
> space to bomb, escort, or take.

	True, I have found that I like fighting in a SB better, when my
teammates are NOT close around me (too chaotic).  I think if you have *one*
good teammate who can act as escort for a base (preferrabley in a BB) that is
all I need, and really all I want, even during an ogg.  (during some nasty
oggs, such as the entire team zeroing in on me, then it would be nice to have
some more players taking out people, before they reach me...).  However, I do
beleive that they can be a great drain on a team, and I rarely distress, unless
I am carrying some valuble armies.  If the other team wants to kill you, they
will, why make it tax your team?
	I realized this in one game, where a few of the roms continued to ogg
the enemy base.  He obviously continued to distress, because it was a heated
battle for over 30 minutes.  However, during that 30 minutes the other team
lost all but 3 of their planets to two of our players, they were too busy
trying to defend the base, to defend planets...

			-Lynx
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: osyjm@cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen)
Subject: Note to potential INLC nomin{ees,ators}
Organization: CS
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 22:40:42 GMT


I don't speak as a rep here, just myself.

These are just some notes that you as a INLC nominator or nominee
should be aware of...

1)  Time.  Being a rep is not a huge investment, but at the beginning
of the season, it's imperative that you be easily accessible via email,
discussions take place fast and furious, with 19 things being discussed
at once.  Figure that for the first few weeks, there will be several messages
a day, some requiring votes, some just your opinions, some just FYI's

2)  'tude.  If you can't stand to lose an argument, don't sign up.  There's
a few pretty strong-willed people on the INLC, tempers flare up.  If that
bothers you, you may not like serving on the INLC.  Mail is occasionally
caustic, and I think that a fair amount of time, things are said that wouldn't
be said face to face, like any usenet group.

3)  Flame resistance.  'nuff said.

4)  Flexibility/compromise.  This is probably the singlemost quality that's
needed (in quantity).  The balance of the "goal" of the INL, vs personal
vendetta's, vs rampant public opinion, vs "is it possible" vs "here's what
I'd like to see" vs "is it Netrek?" vs all the other crap.
-- 
 Jaye Mathisen, COE Systems Manager                (406) 994-4780
 410 Roberts Hall,Dept. of Computer Science
 Montana State University,Bozeman MT 59717	osyjm@cs.montana.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: colles@vccnw04.its.rpi.edu (Grey Knight (Shawn Collenburg))
Subject: sturgeon "jumpy"
Summary: Sturgeon seems unplayable
Keywords: sturgeon, server
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 21:48:09 GMT

I tried playing on sturgeon, but my local window would take forever
to update, and half the screen would stay invisable - including the
cursor. It's not the client - just a while before I'd been playing
on bronco w/out problem.

Grey Knight
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: sherod@newton.Colorado.EDU (Scott Herod)
Subject: Re: Changing the alignment of an altar???
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 23:19:43 GMT

In article <1inr0mINNee8@phakt.usc.edu> echeverr@scf.usc.edu (5150) writes:
>In article <ewing-040193164024@usrv13L> ewing@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu (Rick Ewing) writes:
>>I've heard that it is possible not only to change your character's
>>alignment during a game, but it is also possible to change an altar's
>>alignment (not without consequences, I suspect).  is it indeed possible,
>>and if so, an clues on how to accomplish this?
>
>Yes.  You ogg the altar.  Be sure to use a ship of different alignment than
>the altar, though.  If you're in chaos mode, you may ogg a same-alignment
                                                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>altar if you make sure to declare war with your own team, and you may also
>change your own alignment in this case if you chung yourself.
>
>5150
>quite welcome

I think you are mistaken here.  I checked the source.  To ogg a same-
alignment alter you must have a Helm of Change Alignment.  However, you
must check that it is responding.

Mad DDogg
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Servers sharing player databases
Date: 5 Jan 93 15:54:51 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1993Jan4.212224.62453@cc.usu.edu>, sl7sg@cc.usu.edu writes:
> 
> 	When thinking of ways for servers to share databases, I thought of a
> way, that would be feasable, and easy.  If this has already been discussed,
> sorry.
> 	Anyhow, what I was thinking, is to have a server call up all other
> servers on its list (not for the game, a different connection).  When the
> server is connected, it simply downloads the stats of all of the players who
> have played since it last connected.  Now, the database would somehow have to
> be modified, so the server calling would get only the updates to the stats, but
> not their complete stats. 
> 	Perhaps the second server could have two separate lists?
> 	After the server has called all of the other servers on its list, it
> could compare the players with players on its list.  If that player is on its
> list, it takes all of the updates, and figures them together, giving a newer DI
> etc.
> 	Oh, yea, it would also be nice, to have a toggle that the player could
> use, where it tells the server to not figure its stats with those of other
> servers...?

	If anything, It would be nice to have some of the bigger servers open
their player databases so that they can be downloaded.  Through ftp or
telnet...?  That is all the other server would have to do, then the other
server compares databases.
	When it compares databases, it would only look at players who are on
its list.  Furthermore, it would hack off and only use the new stats, by
comparing the two, and using the difference.  This is not exaclty accurate, but
it is better than nothing...
	Technically, you would only need 1 server doing this, but not all
servers want to share databases from others (such as chaos vs normal).

		Ah, well

			-Lynx


	(reason I ask, is because I am working on a server, but I cannot have
it up all the time, so it would have to be a pirate server.  I would just like
to share databases, to get players...)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: wang@db.toronto.edu (Huaiqing Wang)
Subject: Re: CLUE GAME site
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 12 Jan 93 15:49:10 GMT

In article <1itdpbINNclv@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> dtabb@ecst.csuchico.edu (Don Tabb) writes:
>MY NET sucks.  I was just told that it ok to have the
>game here but most people will have about 20% packet 
>loss.   sh*t.  ok.   NOW we have people, we have a time.
>we have no server.   any SERVER GODS want to help out?
>

Doorstop? Gajah? :) :) :)
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: INL plague code
Date: 11 Jan 93 03:20:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C0o6Lq.8A7.2
Reply-To: hill@norman.vi.ri.cmu.edu
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon


My biggest fear of INL plague code is this:

A third or fourth space planet plagues to 4.  One team then takes the  
planet (I think you can take a neutral planet, just not bomb it) then the  
other team may be completely unaware of it.  

This could certainly change the outcome of the game...the other team  
thinking you needed a full other planet for the win....

I hope the pop code is removed, or the server is changed so that third  
space planets can't be taken at all.   Of course, maybe it IS that way and  
i'm just dumb :)

Rob
aka Spaceace!
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: hucka@engin.umich.edu (Michael Hucka)
Subject: Apologies to doorstop users
Reply-To: hucka@engin.umich.edu
Organization: University of Michigan AI Lab
Distribution: rec
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 06:27:34 GMT

I'm a fairly new netrek player and I would like to apologize to the more
experienced players that were on doorstop about a half-hour ago (EST).  I
played using a public server address given to me by a friend, not realizing
the address was that of doorstop.design.iastate.edu.

Upon logging in on doorstop, I followed the instructions about sending myself
the clue message, but it wasn't until just now when catching up on news
postings in rec.games.netrek that I realized out the *real* purpose of that.

I'm sure it's annoying for experienced players to have clueless people play
in like I did.  An egg on my face.

I'm still learning about "clue"ness :-(.
  
"Huck".
--
-- Mike
_____________________________________________________________________________
Mike Hucka                     | Internet: hucka@engin.umich.edu    
University of Michigan AI Lab  | 1101 Beal Ave., Ann Arbor, MI 48109-2110
From: fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: ntserv
Date: 8 Jan 93 21:55:29 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1ii9k2INNdpq@tamsun.tamu.edu> jeffw@cs.tamu.edu (Jeffrey A Waller) writes:
>This is what I was driving at;  verification using one-time checks can be 
>gotten around by killing and rebinding to the old client port.  Come to
>think of it, exactly how does the server reestablish a connection after
>a ghostbust?  The server attempts the connection doesn't it?  

The client and server agree on a port to use in the event of a ghostbust
(it's one of the very first things they send).  When the connection fries,
they try to reestablish it on the other port.  This is done because sometimes
the port can take a while to clear up.  It does make it harder to recover
from a ghostbust when playing through trekhopd.

And yes, the verification is done again, which prevents you from Ctrl-Cing
a blessed client and running a borg on the new port.

Going back to an earlier message, you can't stuff borg UDP packets out with
the standard UDP client because the receiver checks the sender's port address
when the sockets are connected.  If you don't use connected sockets (i.e.
using sendto() and recvfrom() instead of read() and write()), then you have
a security problem unless you check it yourself.

Unfortunately, I suspect connected sockets may have something to do with the
"I can send messages and other TCP stuff, but I can't move my ship!" problem.
(The one that gets cured if you close and reopen the UDP channel.)

-- 
fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Cluechecking on servers - get the twinks!
Date: 7 Jan 93 15:55:55 MDT
Organization: Utah State University


	Well, another idea popped up in my muddled brain and I thought I would
see what some people have to say.  To start out, Some freinds of mine, and I,
are working on a new server, with nifty mods.  Along with this, we are making a
patch, for the client (this patch primarily contains ship bitmaps, which are
re-designed to be more on par with next generation)...(actually, that was my
excuse, I just cannot stand how some of the ships look, like the clothesclip
ori scout, the tie fighter rom scout...etc).  It will also have a few more
things, so it can work with our server, with galactic servers, as well as a
normal server.

	On to what I was going to say, we were thinking of ways to make
clueless people read, yet still be entertaining to the other players (I LOOVE
it when they are nuked at doorstop).  What we are going to do, is give them a
chance to read (same as doorstop) the first time they don't read, they are
killed, the second time, they are placed into a special ship.

	Now, for those of you who are into startrek, I need to know the name of
this race.  They are extrememly stupid (with a childlike mentality) they have
no technology, other than that which they have scavenged.  In the episode where
they were, they captured Jordi, and made him fix their newly aquired Photon
torpedoes.  He managed too fool them, by saying that the enterprise had spread
red dust, and they could't fire the torpedoes because of this.

	Yes, this is the race the clueless twinks will be forced into.  It will
be neutral, and only have 1 bitmap.  They will only be able to fire 1 torp at
a time (snicker, snicker).  They will also be at war with *all* other people,
irreversible.
	
	While these clueless twinks fumble around trying to figure out what
happened, they will be (unbeknownst to them, if they don't read) sending
messaged to all, such as (in a nasal voice);

	"You are smart, you have photon torpedoes"
	"You are powerful"
	"You are strong, we are not"

	etc.  They will mostlikely give up in frustration, and leave, but at
least those cluefull ones will get a kick out of it.  Also, this will at *all*
times, even out of t, unless there is a waiting list.  If there is a waiting
list, they will be ejected instead.

		Comments?


			-Lynx
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: g2chen@cdf.toronto.edu
Subject: Re: New INL season
Followup-To: g2chen@cdf.toronto.edu 
Keywords: Montana 3, Young 0 
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 12 Jan 93 15:47:29 GMT

Well, after some consideration. I decided to go freelance style. Due
to my busy schedule, I can't really join a INL team. So, I would like
to announce myself as a free-agent sub. :) Price to be negotiated,
usually a donut or two would do the trick. I ain't MUCUS PIG or Barry
Bonds. :) :) :)

Well, if your team need a sub, mail me. Well, that is if you think I 
fit into your plans. :) :)

	-- Paper Boy!, Play Boy!
           ( g2chen@cdf.toronto.edu
             chen@ie.toronto.edu )

Ps: Maybe somebody would like to field a pick up team against TWNN
    this Sat.?

GO 49ERS!!!!!!!!!!!
From: srt@aero.org (Scott Turner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Netrek 358: Starbase Theory & Concept
Date: 11 Jan 93 19:20:49 GMT
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: sun-dimas.aero.org

paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Brian Paulsen) writes:
>Bases are good for 3 occasions:
>A) LPS (your own)...
>B) Beginning of game...
>C) Any time during the game that your side gets an unusually large pop...

Another good and I think overlooked use of a base is as a gas station.
I've seen pretty good teams get stalled by a lack of fuel/repair
planets in the front line.  If the defensive team can repair and fuel
where the fighting is, and you can't, you're at a major disadvantage.
Running a base up to just behind this line can help even things out.

In a pickup game where the other side is clue enough to keep you
scout-bombed flat, a base can be very helpful.  While the entire team
must be semi-clued to stop good scout bombers without a base, one or
two clue players can stop scout bombers with a base.

						-- Scott T.
From: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James Hawtin)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: NetrekBiff
Date: 9 Jan 93 01:03:04 GMT
Reply-To: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk
Organization: School of Computer Science, The University of Birmingham, UK

Well as I was a bit bored I used open-look to write one, as there were on replies for
a while. It telnets to port -1 and gets the info from there. It uses the icon to 
display the number of real players (not robots) if the t-mode threshold is broken
it changes to that also does a wait queue and down icon. Who the application is
opened it list the players on the game in the window, and as you would expect it is
undated from time to time. 

Anyone interested?


				James.