HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: apb.4819@nd.edu (voluptua love)
Subject: Re: profane abuses
Organization: University of Notre Dame
Distribution: alt.conspiracy, alt.angst
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 03:09:30 GMT

In article <1992Dec27.064528.12023@fuug.fi> an3286@anon.penet.fi (Aleph Null) writes:
>From: an3286@anon.penet.fi (Aleph Null)
>Subject: profane abuses
>Date: 27 Dec 92 06:39:00 GMT

>While in a state of darkness, the widow's son has seen profane 
>abuses of the Association, which deeply troubles him.  How may 
>he free himself from his condition? 

>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>To find out more about the anon service, send mail to help@anon.penet.fi.
>Due to the double-blind system, any replies to this message will be anonymized,
>and an anonymous id will be allocated automatically. You have been warned.

the widow's son needs to relax his body and focus his mind, with special 
attention to those two things whenever he senses a profane abuse on the 
horizon.  in particular, he needs to focus on observing his own response to 
each abuse.  in time, he will come to take note of his own role in the 
abuses, and then and only then will it be possible for him to take steps to 
end them.

*yours for voluptua, who had trouble logging on*
 
------------------------------------------
Stephen H. Voss
University of Notre Dame
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:13433 talk.politics.misc:65391 sci.space.shuttle:3030 sci.space:18254 sci.astro:13432
From: simon@dcs.warwick.ac.uk (Simon Clippingdale)
Subject: Re: "A nation chosen by GOD"?
Organization: Department of Computer Science, Warwick University, England
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 19:39:42 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.182807.12212@cs.ucla.edu> pierce@lanai.cs.ucla.edu (Brad Pierce) writes:

> [forwarded drivel from Stephen The Chosen One, including gems like:]

>> So no one other than -*GOD*- can save us now, economically or otherwise.

>> So this is the way out, the only way -- through GOD. Not because you want
>> yourself saved (shallow self-preservation) -- but because you want to truly
>> know and love GOD. The overflowing of such will set all else right.

>> So let's bury the ghost of America. And turn to welcome the birth of the
>> nation of NEW-ISRAEL in our land. A nation chosen by GOD and saved by GOD.


> [followed by Brad's own editorial drivel, such as:]

> Thank you, Stephen, for saying what needed to be said.  Our economic
> problems are indeed so great that the only way out is the way you suggest.


Please do not post this or any other kind of infantile drooling hogwash to
alt.atheism unless it is clearly labelled as having humorous intent.

Thanks.

Simon

-- 
Simon Clippingdale                simon@dcs.warwick.ac.uk
Department of Computer Science    Tel (+44) 203 523296
University of Warwick             FAX (+44) 203 525714
Coventry CV4 7AL, U.K.
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc,alt.activism.d,misc.legal,alt.politics.bush,alt.president.clinton
From: doel@bae.bellcore.com (Michael Doel)
Subject: Re: Weinberger's Pardon
Organization: Bell Communications Research
	<1992Dec30.214831.28941@vexcel.com> <bhayden.725782011@teal>
	<1992Dec31.190521.26189@unet.net.com>
Date: 31 Dec 92 15:42:34


Steve Nelson writes:

> In article <bhayden.725782011@teal> bhayden@teal.csn.org (Bruce Hayden) writes:
> >Lying to Congress has a long history. Presidents of both parties have
> >done it as a matter of course. If you criminalize that, 
> >you would have
> >to put FDR, JFK, and LBJ at the head of the list. 
> >
> 
> Please provide specific information, including the name of any
> administration officials, the date of occurrences, the person or persons
> to whom the information was provided, the text of the information provided, 
> the sources you referenced, and evidence to prove that the information 
> given was incorrect and was knowingly provided with the deliberate intent 
> to deceive, which indicates that any senior official in the FDR, JFK, or 
> LBJ, administrations or that the president himself ever lied (knowingly 
> provided incorrect information with the deliberate intent to deceive) under 
> oath, in a court of law, during a deposition, or to Congress.

Shall he prove Fermat's last theorem while he's at it?


[delete thousands of questions and requirements Steve needs before he'll
believe that Democratic presidents had ever lied to Congress]

I'm beginning to see how Weinberger & co. could leave out a few things when
Walsh says "gimme all you got".

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Doel				<doel@bae.bellcore.com>
444 Hoes Lane RRC 1B-209
Piscataway, NJ 08854

"For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat
 and wrong." - H.L. Mencken
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: kde@boi.hp.com (Keith Emmen)
Subject: Re: Paul
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 22:18:22 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard / Boise, Idaho
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1scd1 PL4

> 	Does anyone here really believe Paul is dead?
> 
Paul who?
From: ingria@bbn.com (Bob Ingria)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Scientists & inventions
Followup-To: /dev/null/
Date: 24 Dec 1992 00:25:51 GMT
Reply-To: ingria@BBN.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com
In-reply-to: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk's message of 14 Dec 92 18:31:04 GMT

In article <Bz9I3t.8p7@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk> jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin) writes:

   What keeps urban legends like this alive is the popular ignorance of the
   interconnectedness of science and technology.  Most people just don't see
   bicycle pumps, refrigerators, weather systems and gasoline engines as
   falling under the same general abstraction and accordingly think that each
   is a separate phenomenon with its own autonomous laws.  If people realized
   that the weather forecasts they use every day or the design of wings to
   lift planes off the ground depended on a unifying theory that ruled out
   magic gas-saving gadgets, they might be bit more skeptical about the
   latter.

So, they finally got to you, too, didn't they?
--
-30-
Bob Ingria
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:13647 alt.atheism:24789 talk.religion.misc:24964
From: muttiah@thistle.ecn.purdue.edu (Ranjan S Muttiah)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.atheism,talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: _Jesus: A Life_ by A.N. Wilson
Date: 3 Jan 93 02:00:47 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <adams.726020083@spssig> adams@spss.com (Steve Adams) writes:
>>I agree that Mark being written somewhere in 64-70 AD is possible.
>>I suspect the first version must have been pretty unadultrated since Mark 
>>was in Rome and he could have checked most of the story with the
>>official Roman documents (the Romans were notorious for writing everything
>>down; ex., every legion had a writer/historian).
>Mark is said to best represent what is thought to be Peter's position.

Well, I think Peter was in Rome for sometime as well, so it is again
only possible that Mark was influenced by Peter (but it raises the question
of where Mark got the information about what the various disciplies were
doing before and after the crucifiction).  I don't see many other
reasons for believing otherwise since the differences among the disciples
(their positions) were written about later in the Acts.

>Whether he actually used any of the Roman sources is up for grabs.  One
>thing to note is that the enmity between Jesus and the Jewish authorities
>is not as pronounced as it is in Matthew & Luke.

That is the trouble (about believing even the account in Mark).  I don't think
it would have been difficult for Mark to get his hands on the official documents
(as per it related to the trial, the Roman treaties with the Sanhedrin etc).
The question is why doesn't he emphasize that he has checked his story with
the documents ?  I think he had some sort of contact through the wife of a
high ranking Roman official (can't remember my source :-().  Additionally,
I think there were means of petitioning the Roman courts to get any document
to be put on public display.  Remember that the Romans were big fans of playing
by the rules.

About the diferences, I think this again can be partly explained by the
sack of the Temple.  The differences only got pronounced after this; it was
there all along, however.  One was the establishment (only priests could
enter the Temple) and other against the establishment (anyone should enter
the Temple).

>While the events would have an effect, since the early dates are possible, 
>and tradition supports them (from the early Fathers) assigning motives is 
>kinda tough.  Of course, we can speculate...

We agree then that it was more than (or really much less than :-) divine 
inspiration that drove these people to write their accounts.  They must have
been writing against or for someone or something.
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: astlc@acad2.alaska.edu (Tom Claydon)
Subject: alt.conspiracy archive site?
Organization: Anarchy Incorporated
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 20:41:25 GMT

 Is there an alt.conspiracy archive FTP site around somewhere? If so, could
someone point me to where it might be? Thanks!

-- 
Tom Claydon, Electronics Tech.
University of Alaska Anchorage
BITNET: astlc@alaska.bitnet
INTERNET: astlc@acad2.alaska.edu
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: gtoal@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal)
Subject: Re: Weinberger's Pardon
Organization: Cuddlehogs Anonymous
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 21:56:53 GMT

In article <C038Hw.8ut@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cole@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Sandra Stewart-Cole) writes:
:let him off. It's a sad commentary on the morals of our politician that in the
:end the most prominent conviction of this whole thing may be that of the great
:proponent of family values and morality being convicted of decieving Congress 
:and misleading a criminal investigation. 


Do you guys still have the death penalty for treason? :-)

G
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:13437 alt.angst:4998
From: spl@ivem.ucsd.edu (Steve Lamont)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.angst
Subject: Re: profane abuses
Date: 27 Dec 1992 14:22:18 GMT
Organization: University of Calif., San Diego/Microscopy and Imaging Resource
NNTP-Posting-Host: ivem.ucsd.edu

In article <1992Dec27.064528.12023@fuug.fi> an3286@anon.penet.fi (Aleph Null) writes:
>While in a state of darkness, the widow's son has seen profane 
>abuses of the Association, which deeply troubles him.  How may 
>he free himself from his condition? 

I suggest pressing the 'U' key.

							spl
-- 
Steve Lamont, SciViGuy -- (619) 534-7968 -- spl@szechuan.ucsd.edu
UCSD Microscopy and Imaging Resource/UCSD Med School/La Jolla, CA 92093-0608
Where is the summer, the unimaginable
Zero summer?                 - T.S. Eliot, "Little Gidding"
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:13665 talk.politics.misc:66113
From: kar5@po.CWRU.Edu (Kevin A. Roll)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Reply to Marc Talbot #2
Date: 4 Jan 1993 03:45:20 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: kar5@po.CWRU.Edu (Kevin A. Roll)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc12.ins.cwru.edu


The simple question in my mind is this:

Dr. Beter claims to have inside knowledge of a world full of particle
beam weapons, floating spheres, biological replicas of people, and so on.
Monthly he claims to reveal vast plans that would have made Machiavelli
jealous. Indeed, according to him, world leaders have been murdered and
replaced at a frightening rate.

So why the hell didn't they kill HIM to shut him up???

-- 
AMIGA///|  / |/  | | | | | \ /  |\ | | |\ |\ \ / | Intel 80586    = Pentium
    /// |  \S| K |I|\|N|\|  |Y  |/P| |U|/P|/P | Y| Motorola 68060 = Sextium?
\\\///  |  / |\  | | | | |  |   |  |_| |  |   |  | -------------------------
 \XX/   |  got to keep the camera alive tell the world what's going on here
From: jac54@cas.org ()
Subject: Re: "Moonraker" -- fact or fiction?
Organization: Chemical Abstracts Service, Columbus, Ohio
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 15:30:20 GMT

In article <1hjhhgINN7q0@news.cerf.net> eidetics@nic.cerf.net (Eidetics Int'l) writes:
>
>   In writing his stories, Ian Fleming was drawing upon his own
>secret weapon.  That weapon was knowledge.  Fleming had been a
>high-ranking officer of Britain's crack Intelligence agency
>called MI-5.

	This is, in fact, nonsense.  Flemings contribution to
	intelligence was to act as a paper-pusher for Stephensons'
	BSC in New York.  He had no training in, and never was, an
	intelligence officer of any form.  He was, by all accounts,
	an irritating little intel.-groupie.

	The rest of this post is nonsense that even Munchhausen would
	be ashamed to come up with.

	Alec Chambers
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: mam@jcnpc.cmhnet.org (Mike A. McAngus)
Subject: Re: _Jesus: A Life_ by A.N. Wilson
Organization: Homebrew Virtual Reality Labs
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 1993 04:22:24 GMT

Thomas Price (tp0x+@cs.cmu.edu) wrote:
: >Some quotes from Larry Stammer, ``Not the Stuff of Sermons'', Los
: >Angeles Times Book Review, Sunday, December 20, 1992, pp. 2,4. The
: >article is a review of the book _Jesus: A Life_ by A.N. Wilson (W.W.
: >Norton: $22.95; 256 pp.).

[all except the following deleted]

: >   "+ Jesus' prayer in the Garden of Gethsemane, asking God to spare
: >      him from the cup of death but nonetheless bowing to God's will,
: >      is a literary creation. If Jesus prayed while his disciples
: >      slept, who jotted down a transcript of the conversation?"
:
: An alternative explanation is divine inspiration, which is supposedly the
: method of composition of the book. Consequently, this observation is
: not independently significant: it is subordinate to the result of inquiry
: about inspiration, and can add nothing nor take anything away from
: that debate.

Ah yes, devine inspiration.  The method where people can expound with authority
concerning events about which they know nothing.  The NT is full of them.
-- 
Mike McAngus                    |You are a fluke of the Universe.  You have no 
mam@jcnpc.cmhnet.org            |right to be here, and whether you can hear it
The Truth is still the Truth    |or not the Universe is laughing behind your 
Even if you choose to ignore it.|back.  -- National Lampoon, Deteriorata
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: kasprj@jec310.its.rpi.edu (Jim Kasprzak)
Subject: Re: _Jesus: A Life_ by A.N. Wilson
Reply-To: kasprj@rpi.edu
Organization: The Big Wedge 
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 19:02:44 GMT

In article <1992Dec31.181009.17808@newsgate.sps.mot.com>, cottle@prism1 (Rick Cottle) writes:
|> In article <63119@mimsy.umd.edu> mangoe@cs.umd.edu (Charley Wingate)  
|> writes:
|> > Albert Schweitzer had these books pegged years before they were written.
|> > There is no historical Jesus-- at least, there is no Jesus which a  
|> historian
|> > can reconstruct.  Only the Jesus of religion has been left to us.
|> 
|> I don't follow.  Are you saying that there was no Jesus, or that
|> Jesus Is Not whom religion says He is, or that Jesus IS whom
|> religion says He is?
 
 I believe he's saying that the religious version of Jesus is the only one
we have a clear picture of. There's very little historical data about Jesus
outside of the religious literature. 
------------------------------------------------------------------
     __  Live from Capitaland, heart of the Empire State...
 ___/  | Jim Kasprzak, computer operator @ RPI, Troy, NY, USA
/____ *|          he who refuses to do nonsense  
     \_|          is doomed to talk arithmetic.
      ====  e-mail: kasprj@rpi.edu or kasprzak@mts.rpi.edu 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.atheism,talk.politics.misc
From: muttiah@thistle.ecn.purdue.edu (Ranjan S Muttiah)
Subject: Re: _Jesus: A Life_ by A.N. Wilson
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 23:39:14 GMT

In article <adams.725991192@spssig> adams@spss.com (Steve Adams) writes:
>muttiah@thistle.ecn.purdue.edu (Ranjan S Muttiah) writes:
>>>adams@spss.com:
>>>Gospel/Acts dates:
>>>    Mark.................50-70AD
>>>    Matthew..............55-75AD
>>>    Luke.................59-75AD
>>>    John.................53-85AD
>>>    Acts.................63-70AD*
>>>* Could be much later than 70, and no earlier than 'Luke'
>>Interesting.  I would be a little hesitant about dates earlier than 68-70AD
>>when the Jerusalem Temple was "attacked" by the Roman army, after which
>>everyone was feverishly trying to blame one another (i.e., the reason for
>>rise of Xtianity).  But I would be interested in knowing your source.

>It (being fairly 'liberal') gives 70AD as the most likely time for Mark,
>while stating that tradition holds 64AD as the date.  More 'conservative'
>scholars (ie fundamentalists & some evengelicals) give earlier dates.

I agree that Mark being written somewhere in 64-70 AD is possible.
I suspect the first version must have been pretty unadultrated since Mark 
was in Rome and he could have checked most of the story with the
official Roman documents (the Romans were notorious for writing everything
down; ex., every legion had a writer/historian).

>For Matthew, it gives even later possible dates, as late as 80AD.  For
>Luke/Acts, 80AD to as late as 100AD, and for John, 80-100AD.
>
>The big question is who wrote them.  If you assign the traditional
>authorship, late dates are tough, because of the advanced age of the
>authors.  If you are willing to reject traditional authorship, then 
>the dates open up quite a bit.

I guess the big question could be answered by considering whether there was
a sequence in which the books appeared or whether they were written in different
geo. locations by different authors.  Far more probable that Mark came first
and then interpolations and additions followed.

>As for the sack of Jerusalem, that particular event would have little
>effect on the Gospels dating, except in a textual-historical way (ie,
>references or suppositions of the destruction of the temple).  Mark was
>most likely written in Rome, Matthew likely in Anthioch, Luke most likely
>NOT in Palestine (because of negative evidence - lack of knowledge of
>geography), and John unknonwn (no theories in either reference).

I think it is important to consider the events as well.  There must have been
a reason behind the motivation of these writers.  Recall that ca. 64AD James 
(the brother of Jesus) was stoned to death in the vicinity of the Temple...  
showing that the early Christians had an axe to grind after the Temple was 
"attacked."
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.revisionism
From: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: New World Order/CFR/Trilateral Commission
Date: 1 Jan 1993 05:28:43 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


I am trying to make a compete list of organizations that subscribe to
the doctrine that the CFR and Trilateral Commission are sinister
organizations trying to set up a global dictatorship under the United
Nations and referred to by the catch phrase "New World Order."
I am already aware of the following:

1) The John Birch Society
2) Liberty Lobby
3) Lyndon Larouche (What is the name of his organization?)
4) The Christic Institue
5) Bo Gritz (What is the name of his organization?)

If anyone can help me add to this list or correct this list, please send
me email.  I'd look up this information at the public library, but I
don't think I'd find anything in the standard references.
-- 
--------- All my opinions are tentative pending further data. ---------
--------------- John W. Redelfs, ksjwr@acad1.alaska.edu ---------------
----------- "Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect -----------
-------------------- that God is just." (Jefferson) -------------------
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: bill@cognet.ucla.edu (William M. Eldridge)
Subject: Re: Weinberger's Pardon
Organization: UCLA Cognitive Science Research Program
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 00:25:41 GMT

sarfatti@well.sf.ca.us (Jack Sarfatti) writes:

>Prosecuter Walsh is a dangerous fanatic right out of the Spanish
>Inquisition and should be relieved of his duties.

You have a penchant for hyperbole.  Prosecuter Walsh has
essentially done his job, and probably feels quite irritated
at finding out just how badly Bush and Weinberger shucked and
jived him all this time.

Not that he didn't suspect.

So since all the other possibilities are gone from his
initial task, he is left with only one remaining chore
to accomplish in his agenda:  find out what Bush's 
involvement in Iran-contra and its cover-up was, and
if there's something to prosecute still, prosecute.

Walsh did not make up this agenda, and he certainly
didn't create the Iran-contra scandal.  If you think
$30 million is expensive, think of 1) the more than
$1 billion the government paid to nab Noriega and the
several million to get the DEA murder suspects from
Mexico, and 2) how much less it would have cost if
Bush and Weinberger had turned over their notes 7
years ago.

And 3) how much better off we would have been if Reagan
had simply fought the Boland Amendment outright, and
claimed all responsibility for ordering the Iran-contra
shipments/funding?

No, Reagan was a dickless wonder, and people still think
the Boland Amendment is illegal.  Look guys, if it's
illegal, challenge it in the Supreme Court - you have
8 Republican nominees there - if you can't win it, you 
were just wrooooong.

-- 
{{{{ bill eldridge           310-206-3960                x                }}}}
{{{{ bill@cognet.ucla.edu    310-206-3987 fax           xxx              }}}}
{{{{ ~more, ~better, ~faster [80's motto]                x              }}}}
{{{{ ~hot, ~toxic, and ~shallow [90's motto]                              }}}}
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc,sci.space.shuttle,sci.space,sci.astro
From: aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer)
Subject: Re: "Moonraker" -- fact or fiction?
Organization: Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 14:36:41 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.103655.11722@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> dnadams@nyx.cs.du.edu (Dean Adams) writes:

>But I would
>not put it past your Dr. Beter to imagine Fleming having some "inside"
>MI-5/SIS information on the "Space Shuttle conspiracy", even though it
>was back in the 1960s. (what does time matter to people who know? :)

Just shows what you know! Remember that TV show back in the 60's called
"The Time Tunnel" created by Irwin Allen? Well, Mr. Allen was working
for the SSA (I can't tell you what that stands for or they will kill me)
and was responsible for announcing to the public the time travel technology
which MJ-12 received from the aliens.

The show flopped so SSA decided that the public wasn't ready to know
about the newly acquired time travel technology (much less the source).
However, Flemming managed to use the system (he was the MI-5/SSA liaison)
to travel to the present day and uncover the conspiracy. To protect HIS
sources he wrote Moonraker under a false name and arranged for it not
to be published until after his death.

That is how it was done. Pretty obvious when you think about it.

  Allen

PS: (just in case) :-)

-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Allen W. Sherzer | "A great man is one who does nothing but leaves        |
|  aws@iti.org     |  nothing undone"                                       |
+----------------------117 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,pa.general,phl.misc