From: boserj@netcom.com (Jeffrey Boser)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: This group. (long babbling reply)
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:43:08 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (Teresa Kline) writes:
>boserj@netcom.com (Jeffrey Boser) writes...
>Not a flame, Jeff.  Just some things that *I* have thought about...
> 
>>Also, I am not convinced that uncomfortableness and
>>the lack of a warm, pleasant, safe environment is a
>>good thing.  
>
>I think you've got some double negatives in here.  You're right 
>uncomfortableness *is* a bad thing.  But I don't think that's what you 
>meant to say.

Er, yeah.  I meant to say that I think uncomfortableness is a good thing.
Its like pain, tells us to pay attention, something needs to be dealt
with.  Uncomfortableness isnt bad, though its cause may indeed be.

>In order to heal, we all must push the boundaries a little.  A LITTLE.  As 
>they say in CTH go to where you're comfortable and ONE step more...not 
>twenty.  Some people have done that and can go no further.  

Thats similar to a 'no pain no gain' philosophy, and I do not agree with
it.  People gain because there is pain, and they want to get away from
it.  In fact, most major changes in life come when someone just cant
take it anymore.  When its change or death...  And thats a pretty
undirected process.  More like 'oops, gonna crash, hit the brakes and turn'.
To direct it, we slow it down..  but that hardly ever works.  Just look
at diets.  We only change when we *need* to.  And going that extra 20
steps may be the only thing that can save your mind..  by biting the
bullet and getting the job done.

>Rather than seeing some of the implications I've seen in some posts (and I 
>read a little of it in yours) that people are not pushing themselves enough 
>to heal, why don't we admit that each of us is in a different place in our 
>healing.  No two of us have the same things to heal from.  Anger is 
>difficult for me...maybe not for you.  Some people cannot accept hugs...
>others crave them.  
>If some people in this group feel threatened by what is going on, it is 
>their prerogative, and perhaps the best thing for them at this time, to 
>cease communication in asar.  That *may* be what is best for *them*.  I've 
>certainly curtailed my posting.

I did imply that..  but I meant much more as well.  I have never been
comfortable with the 'healing' paradigm.  It doesnt apply well to
emotional problems.  You dont have a wound, it gets all better, and
you go on...  it doesnt work like that.  You are gonna face your problems
*every* *single* *minute* for rest of your life.  There aint no
touchdown dance here.  And no finally 'getting on with your life'..
What I want to show here, is that when you got a problem, you ride
out the storm, throw yourself back in to correct course if you have
to, then do it again and again and again...  There is no 'solution'.
You are never, ever, 'healed'.  Its a part of you.  And that 'wound'
is gonna bleed forever.  Depressing, right?  Nope.  Its pretty simple.
You just stop treating your life as something that needs to be fixed.
You figure out who you are, and use a rudder and steer a bit.  You
grow until you can ride out the rough spots.

And thats what I like..  growth.  And it comes in spurts..  it
never comes slow and steady.  It comes when you have the need and
means.  And if you arent spurting, you are stagnating.  And I
see alot of that here.  Relkie and Prisoner..  their story contains
nothing new, and you have read or heard of it all before.  But...
they are both at the bottom, and got no place else to go but up.
other than out, that is.  Perhaps you can find a way to follow.

Psychologists love to go on and on about stages of healing..  denial,
repression..  Your mind is trying to deal with something, so it
starts rearranging the scenery, to find some way of see straight
again..  and it eventually learns you cant..  so it drags your
emotions through a storm, getting worse and worse and worse until
you *have* to change.  The storm is there so you can learn about
the problem and learn about ourself..  (we would all bleed to
death if we didnt feel any pain.  and our minds give us strong
signals about whats going on, we just got to learn how to read
them).

I guess thats why stern and selfish love turns out the best..  it
forces the loved one to go through the storm and come out, instead
of managing to coast around it and letting it grow.  Saying 'yes,
I love you, but you gotta do what you gotta do.'  Thats also why
I regard suicide as the ultimate in personal power.  The ability
to decide if living is worth it, and to decide to stop.

Its called growing.  Becoming more yourself because there is more
of yourself to be.  Being able to get through those storms is the
first tool we need, the second is an awareness of the storms,
of the sea and how it lies, the third is the ability to steer
a bit.

And I see so many people inside the storm of their own mind,
and they cant see the end, and they are overwhelmed by the
power of the feelings and emotions..  and the finally start
riding the storm, and then give up, and start trying to
outrun it.  run away from it.  Like Relkie and Prisoner.
Both angry and hurt and completely out of control.  They cant
even step back and think.  All they are is feeling.  Again and
again, running in circles.  I guess thats what I was hoping
others would see.  The fact that the conflict is making the
storm rougher, and making their circles real precarious.  Why
do they keep coming back?  Why do they keep feeding their pain?
Why do they want our sympathy or support or anger?  Who are
they are shoving away?  Who are they pulling close?  Why are
we taking sides?  Why cant we see in anything but right and wrong?
Why are our own storms starting to rise and threatening to
overwhelm us?

If you are still reading, im surprised.  I have not written
to be supporting, and have managed to insult the healing process
and objectives of almost everybody.  But if you are still
reading this...  think about this:

If you stop reading asar, stop sharing the pain, the pain has won,
and you might as well surrender.



.....jeff

>-- Teresa

ps, er, sorry for the long reply..  sheesh, the things I cook up when
I am tired.  but I mean most of it, please try to ignore the little
inconsistancies (I aint perfect, am about as far from perfect as
possible)..  but I would like to hear what other people think about
these ideas.  Exactly what is 'healing'?  Exactly what is the 'support'
we need?  These, I think, are legitemate questions..  with very different
answers for each of us.
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery