HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rnoguchi@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Ryan Alexander Noguchi)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Remington 870 magazine ex
Date: 13 Oct 92 03:20:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: phoenix.9210130051.AA01424
Organization: Princeton University

In article <m0meVvB-0001PJC@rose.com> mike.federchuk@rose.com () writes:
#[...]
#What is a "ghost-ring" shotgun site? 
#[...]

It's a large aperature metallic peep rear sight.  What you do is look at
the normal front blade sight through the large circular rear sight.
Since your eye focuses on the front sight, the rear sight becomes
"ghosted out," i.e. out of focus, and your eye and brain will
automagically center the front sight within the indistinct image of the
rear sight.  It's supposed to be fast and good out to the effective
range of the slugs, but slightly inferior to the simple bead sight in
close combat shootouts.

According to Ayoob in his new book Stressfire II, they were originally
developed in the 19th century and more recently popularized by none
other than Jeff Cooper himself.

The Mossberg Ghost Ring sight is adjustable for windage and
elevation and has two "ears" to protect the sight alignment from rough
handling.
 

- Ryan                               rnoguchi@phoenix.Princeton.EDU
===================================================================
"We, too, born to freedom, and believing in freedom, are willing to 
fight to maintain freedom. We, and all others who believe as deeply
as we do, would rather die on our feet than live on our knees."-FDR
===================================================================
From: purtilo@cs.umd.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: NRA personal protection course offered
Date: 9 Oct 92 00:35:44 GMT


For Maryland area readers ...

Please feel free to contact me if you or anyone you know might be interested
in taking the NRA Personal Protection Course, which our club will offer on
24 and 31 October in Bowie.  The course will cover basics of firearm safety,
for both at the range and storage at home; the fundamentals of firing a shot;
legal issues related to owning and using a firearm; and practice issues, such
as cleaning and caring for a firearm.  We're especially happy to see students
who have not previously used a firearm and who would like to get an education
in order to make an informed decision about ownership.   But even experienced
firearm owners may find value in the discussion with our lawyer and the county
officers making presentations during the class.  The cost is $25, and we can
fill you in about details such as times and location when you contact us.

Jim

purtilo@cs.umd.edu
From: burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .40 S&W Help Sought
Date: 7 Oct 92 12:59:53 GMT
Organization: Quarterdeck Office Systems, Santa Monica CA

In article <1992Oct2.163801.11217@henson.cc.wwu.edu> n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:
#gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes:
#
##Glock semiauto pistols already incorporate three safety devices; how
##many does it take to satisfy you?  I suspect what you are asking for
##is simply an external safety lever such as found on a standard M1911A1.
##While it is needed on an M1911A1, it is not needed on a Glock; the two
##operating systems have radically different characteristics.
#
#What I don't like about the glock is the fact that you don't get a
#second chance on a misfire.
#

On my 17 (the Glock17 being built for carbine primers) the dent is
_so_ savage that I don't care.  If it didn't go off the first time - 
another shot like that won't do any good.  Wait, for safety's sake
and ditch it somewhere safe.

Bill	burge@qdeck.com
From: rboudrie@chpc.org (Rob Boudrie)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Restricted weapons in Canada
Date: 8 Oct 92 00:53:38 GMT
Organization: Center For High Perf. Computing of WPI; Marlboro Ma

In article <86N9RB3w165w@noncomf.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca> markp@noncomf.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca (Mark A. Pitcher) writes:
#
#	I have an FN-FAL, which is a restricted weapon in
#Canada (Ontario). It's fully registered, so just owning it isn't the
#problem. The problem is that I can't get a straight answer on
#whether or not I can fire it on my property. The police say I
#can't, but gun store owners say I can - as long as it stays on
#my property. Who is correct? 
#

Restricted weapons may be fired only on ranges officially approved
for such shooting.

#	Also, the rifle is selective fire, but the permit says
#it's semi-auto. Because the rifle is restricted in the first

Bzzzt.  Go to jail.  Unless this is one of the 4000 licensed full
autos registered before 1976 or so when new full autos were banned,
you are in violation.  Unlike the US, both the gun & the owner are
"grandfathered" into lawful posession - another person who is not
grandfathered in as a lawful full auto owner may NOT take posession
of the gun, even by bequest.

#place, does it matter whether it's fired full-auto or semi-auto?
#The police know (as I'm sure everyone in a three-mile radius)
#that I've been firing it full-auto, and I have even been watched
#by an unmarked car while "plinking" in the quarry - but not a
#word has been brought up about it (except from neighbors
#complaining to me about the noise). This leads me to think that
#I can do whatever I please with it on my own property.
#

I wish that were the case but...

#	Any comments from other Canadian restricted-weapon
#owners is appreciated so I can use the rifle without worrying
#about losing my "privilege" of gun ownership.
#
#
#------------------------------------------------------------------darkPARK BBS
#markp@noncomf.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca (Mark A. Pitcher)
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#


Rob Boudrie
rboudrie@chpc.org

(US citizen & resident; picked up these bits of trivia thru corespondence
with Canadian gun licensing folks, and at matches in Ontario, Canada)
From: poppg@columbia.dsu.edu (GARY POPP)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Guns for Sale
Date: 13 Oct 92 03:20:58 GMT
Organization: Dakota State University

For Sale:
	Ruger Mini-14 Ranch. .223 caliber semi-automatic rifle with rings.
I bought this new in January, it has had less than 50 rounds fired through 
it.  It is in mint condition with the box.  $375.

ALSO

	Ruger ultra-light .270 caliber rifle with rings.  It is about 2 
years old, used very little.  I had the trigger worked on to make it much 
crisper- set about 4 pounds.  It is in excellent conditon also with the 
box.  $375.

PLEASE CONTACT ME IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.

POPPG@COLUMBIA.DSU.EDU

or call Gary at (605)256-5538.
From: cramer@optilink.com (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: CCW Requirements, Ohio
Date: 10 Oct 92 13:39:29 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA


In article <1992Oct8.150946.7006@icd.ab.com>, kdw@icd.ab.com (Kenneth D. Whitehead) writes:
# Can anybody give me the lowdown on what's required to get a CCW
# in Ohio?
# 
# Thanks,
# 
# Ken Whitehead

Unless it's been recently changed (the last year or so), you can't.
There is no such thing.  There is an exemption whereby if you can
convince a jury that carrying a concealed handgun at the time and
place that you did so was necessary for self-defense, and something
that a prudent man would do, they can find you innocent.  I wouldn't
trust your fellow citizens that much.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
Lesson learned from Gov. Wilson's signing of AB 2601: if you don't get 
your way, have a riot.  Next time, Gov. Wilson will cower appropriately.
From: goguenm@ravel.udel.edu (Matthew L Goguen)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: S&W 6906 9mm, advice and book needed
Date: 15 Oct 92 23:58:57 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.199210150124.AA28782
Organization: University of Delaware

I receantly purchased a used S&W 6906 9mm. It originated
from a PD up in New England somewhere.  I had a local Police Officer show
me how to dissasemble and clean the gun.  (They use the same exact model.)
Prior to this in my ignorance i managed to break a piece of metal next to
the slide release.  This wouldn't be too bad except that it left a  nice
sharp edge that puts little slices in the fingers.  It appears to be
a leaver, but it has nothing to do with the slide release, and it has 
zero effect when raised out of the plastic grip.  Everything seems to
work fine and I have been able to fire a few boxes of rounds to get used
to the weapon.  I'd like to either replace the unknown lever, or fix it in
a way so my fingers are not inadvertantly sliced. (No blood, just annoying.)
  Also if anyone has a number so I could get a manual from S&W I'd
  be appreicative.  Thanks in advance,
     Matt Goguen
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
//  Matthew L. Goguen       // Choose this day whom ye  //   
//  Engineer to be.         // will serve as for me and //
//  goguenm@chopin.udel.edu // my house we will serve   //
//  Shadowmiester           // the LORD. Joshua 24:15   //
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
From: webdw@mvutd.att.com (Bruce D Woods)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Need tips for gun cleaning..
Date: 17 Oct 92 00:15:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbnews.1992Oct16.210634.6805
Organization: AT&T

In article <Bw2E11.MBw@news.cso.uiuc.edu> tang1613@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Tariq A. Nayfeh) writes:
#kknox@logdis1.hq.aflc.af.mil (Kevin P. Knox) writes:
#
##You recently wrote to rec.guns -
#
###I  have  a  Ruger GP-100 revolver in stainless steel.  I  follow  the
###instructions  for cleaning, but I can't seem to get it as clean as it
###should  be.  This is especially apparent where the cylinder meets the
###barrel.   I'll summarize my technique below so that more  experienced
#
#Try using FLITZ a metal polish. It seams to work great on my Redhawk.  It
#also works wonders on any other shiny metal.
#Tariq
#
#


Try Wenol, a silver paste polish in a red tube.  I used on my
Redhawk and it got the front of the cylinder almost too bright
& shiny.  Wear gloves when using though, it's a bit smelly.

BDW
From: hancock@iex.iex.com (David Hancock)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Astra vs Witness
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:23:41 GMT
Organization: IEX Corporation, Dallas

In article <9210061225.AA09837@mimsy.cs.UMD.EDU> C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob) writes:
snipsnip
#before) said she'd like to take the class.  I mentioned, half in
#jest, that we'll have to buy her a gun.
#
#A few days later I had a gun magazine out.  My wife pointed to the
#cover and said, "That's not a bad looking gun."  She was pointing
#to a Sig P228.
#
snip
#
#Hmmm, my wedding anniversary is this saturday.  I could...nah,
#better not.
#
#BTW, I know 25 year anniversary is silver.  What's the 5 year
#anniversary?  I know it's not guns...8-)
#

It's ... Aluminum!  Yeah, that's it!  Aluminum and brass!  I TOLD 'em that
was it!
-- 
David Hancock -*- IEX Corporation	       | Email: [uunet!]iex!hancock
		  1400 Preston Road, Suite 350 | Voice: (214) 612-2600
		  Plano, Texas 75093
From: JEFFD@elmer.hls.com (Dempsey, Jeff)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Pin Gun for SALE!!
Date: 10 Oct 92 13:39:16 GMT



Readers,

	It is me again.  The same person that was selling the Firestar .40 is
now selling his .45 Government model.

	A description follows:

			Base Pistol - Springfield 90 Series .45
			Quadralock Match Grade Bull Barrel
			Wilson Beavertail Grip Safety
			Wilson Extended Ambidextrous Safety
			S&A Magazine Well
			Pin Competition Sight Rib - Aristocrat
			Extended Mag. & slide release
			Chip McCormick Trigger - 3IB. pull
	
	Also comes with two magazines and a hard carry case.  He just finished
a new Blueing job on the pistol and it looks sharp.

		Asking 950.00 for everything.

	Call Jodie @ 408.370.3806 or Email Jeffd@hls.com
From: fcrary@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (Frank Crary)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Smith model 27 wear
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:15:55 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder

Since I've moved to Colorado, I seem to be getting to a range _much_
more often (100 rds/week) and my revolver is starting to show some
wear. The cylinder is getting a little loose (which I'm keeping
an eye on, but isn't too significant at the moment); but what 
puzzles me is the wear to the bluing: About 1/4" from the front
end of the cylinder, at the side edge of the grooves (I forget
what the're really called...) and in a small spot exactly between
these grooves. As far as I can tell, this part of the cylinder
never contacts _anything_, although it is under a old, empty screw hole
in the frame (from a scope mount I got rid of.) So I'm at a loss
to understand why the bluing should be wearing there and not anywhere
else...

                                              Frank Crary
                                              CU Boulder
From: ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: 12g shotgun defense ammo
Date: 14 Oct 92 21:05:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: ke4zv.1992Oct14.152719.25672
Organization: Gannett Technologies Group

In article <1992Oct12.114626.13999@email.tuwien.ac.at> holger@vmars.tuwien.ac.at (Holger Reusch (Dipl. Gerhard + Joe)) writes:
#I am in search for good defense ammo for shotguns.
#
#The guns are 12 gauge, chambered for 2.75" or 3" shotshells, with a 
#cylinder choke and a 18-25" barrel.
#
#The requirements are as follows:
#
#- Operative range < 10 yards (indoors)
#- Penetration is not an issue (walls are very solid here)
#- Optimum shot spread (That could merit another discussion, i think.)
#- High stopping power against two-legged vermin.
#
#What I'd lke to know is:  What shot size yields good spread over the
#short distance, while preserving enough penetration to stop?  Which
#shot sizes are sufficient for defense purposes?  What do you think
#about 3" vs. 2.75" cartridges?  Any other points to keep in mind with
#defense ammo for shotguns?

No cylinder bore shotgun is going to have much spread at short range,
six inches at 10 yards would be the maximum. At 10 foot range, I find
that #9 shot makes a good Glaser equivalent. It makes a hole like a
slug, but doesn't penetrate much. At longer range there's no substitute
for 00 buck or slugs. A single 00 buck pellet, 9 to the load, has a
muzzle energy of 180 ftlb. That puts each pellet in the .380 Auto
category. So a center hit with 00 buck is about like shooting the
person 9 times with a .380, not too shabby.

If you want to experiment with "spreader" loads like some of the
old Remington loadings, you'll need a source of *square* shot and
cardboard separator wads. Remington also added a *tracer* compound
to these loads. Pretty at night. With #9 square shot, these old
Remington loadings could give a pattern of nearly 24 inches at
10 yards from a cylinder bore 12 gauge. 

No one has mentioned a potentially effective shotshell yet, a
12 gauge *flare* load. Setting the victim on fire would tend
to reduce his potential for hostile action. You can also get
some nice single shot *pistols* for this load without all the
hassles of regular firearms in many areas.

Gary
From: smpod@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Stefan)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: First pistol recommendations
Date: 15 Oct 92 23:58:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: venus.15OCT199212351570
Organization: who knows

nahst6+@pitt.edu (Nathan A Horstman) writes...
# ...
#Second:  Where should I look to buy one?  Would a gun show be the best place?
#How do I find out about local gun shows (western Pennsylvania)?

a good show is the one sponsored by the Penn Gun Collector Association at the
Monroeville (burb of Pittsburg) Exhibition center.  Next show is Nov. 14/15.
(over 1000 tables)
From: btree!hale@UCSD.EDU (Bob Hale)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Distribution
Date: 14 Oct 92 21:04:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: btree.1992Oct14.190213.22097
Organization: Brooktree Corporation, San Diego

#[MODERATOR:   Note, I have recently had suggestions that 
#we also limit the "distribution" field a little, so as to not bother the
#whole net with localisms (like classes being offered.)  Unfortunately,
#news does not always handle limited distribution of *moderated* groups.
#So I hope the readership will be a little tolerant of seeing posts for
#activities not near their area, since on balance I think this is a win
#for the group.]


Yes, definitely a win.  I personally like to read about what is
going on elsewhere, even though the chances of my actually getting
there are slim.

Bob Hale                                      ...!ucsd!btree!hale
...!btree!hale@ucsd.edu                       ...!ucsd!btree!hale@uunet.uu.net
From: dlamber@andy.bgsu.edu (Don Lambert)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Dot Sights
Date: 16 Oct 92 13:17:26 GMT
Organization: BGSU University Computer Services

# Right now I am leaning towards a Laseraim Illusion dot scope and the 
# Weigan/Caspian frame mount.  

Try the RED BUFF scope monunt. It is very strong, and only need 4 holes
drilled.
And if you every decide to take the scope off only one of the holes is
exposed.
The other 3 can be covered with a new left side grip. If you order a mount
besure to sepcify caliber 9mm/38 , 40/10 or 45 ACP. each mount is
different.
 
# I heard that several target shooters use the Illusion but I do not know why; it
# may be the low price, $100.  Are the Tasco Propoint, Aimpoint, or Ultra Dot any
# better?  I would like to use a 30mm scope but from the little that I've read,
# the 30mm scope usually have large dots, i.e. 10 minutes, and I would like a dot
# not much larger than 3 minutes.  Is this impression of 30mm scopes true? 

The Propoint and Aimpoint are my favorite. Both are 30mm but you can get
3,10 and 20 minute dots.

Don Lambert
University Computer Services
Bowling Green State University
        	       	       	       	       	       	
INTERNET : dlamber@andy.bgsu.edu
From: johanneg@cs.rpi.edu (Gummi Johannesson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Wholesales(shotguns)
Date: 8 Oct 92 17:43:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: rpi.69tz#7a

Hi

Can anyone give me list of WHOLESALES that have low prices on Browning Citory
(Lightning Grade I).
A friend of mine is a dealer so he can order it for me.

Thanks in advance,
-Gummi

PS: The lowest price that I have found in a store is $ 849.
From: @fuug.fi:maxxon@swob.nullnet.fi (Mikko Kurki-Suonio)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Need advice on semi-auto rifles
Date: 9 Oct 92 00:35:13 GMT
Organization: Sweet Oblivion

bobd@marune.acs.ohio-state.edu (Bob DeBula) writes:

# #Valmet: Finnish AK-47.  Is that an accurate gun?
# #
# 
# Reputedly the most accurate and well made of the AK clones.
# AKs are not as a class noted for accuracy.

I shot the Valmet in the Finnish army. I didn't particularly like it,
even though it should be reliable - small thrash constantly entered the
gun through the slide rack slot in the receiver and it still functioned
(with practice rounds anyway).

The biggest problem with reliability are the magazines, which are often
old and in bad shape, prone to misfeed especially when full.

The stock is horrible. Might be cheap to manufacture and utilitarian,
but ergonomically horrible. I must use glasses and had the rear sight
knock my glasses several times when making fast shots.

And the receiver cover mounted rear sight (I wonder why the russian
model has it further up front...) is a real pain. You must re-sight the
gun after each cleaning (by comparison, my AR-15 had the sights just
fine when it arrived from the factory, and I still haven't had to touch
them) and after each shock or knock the gun gets. And adjusting
elevation is very imprecise - loosen the screw, knock the sight
slightly, hope for the best.

Some guns are match-grade, or something like that, but ordinary soldiers
like me weren't let near those things. They might be good.

There's a new model coming, with several new features (ambidex
safety/cocking lever, new sights etc.) It might be a good weapon, but
depression and all, I have no idea when mass production might start.


--------
maxxon@swob.nullnet.fi (Mikko Kurki-Suonio)
Sweet Oblivion (+358 0 8092678, V.32bis 8N1) Official SRP Headquarters
From: cramer@optilink.com (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Carry in public places
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:16:16 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA


In article <9210081830.AA77254@tsw>, tsw!marc@uunet.UU.NET (Marc Kilburn) writes:
# Good morning.  I have my concealed weapons permit for Washington.
# I have just bought my first gun - a Sig Sauer P228.  I have been
# reading most of the gun groups for the past few months, and plan
# to take gun classes.
# 
# Would some one outliine for Wa. state the places I should NOT
# carry concealed?  ie. Federal buildings, taverns (?)...
# 
# Marc Kilburn
# .sig P228

Not in a bar.  The City of Renton passed an ordinance prohibiting
carry in a bar, even if you aren't drinking.  The Second Amendment
Foundation pursued a lawsuit to test the limits of local regulation
in Washington State.  In _Second Amendment Foundation_ v. _City
of Renton_, 25 Wash. App. 583, 668 P.2d 596 (1983), the Washington
Court of Appeals held that this was a "reasonable regulation" of
the RKBA.  The Renton ordinance exempted restaurants that served
alcohol, and the bartender, but any place that is a bar, is off
limits.

I'm not sure if any other cities in Washington have similar rules,
but since I don't drink anyway, I just make the assumption that when
carrying in Washington, I won't enter a bar.



-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
Lesson learned from Gov. Wilson's signing of AB 2601: if you don't get 
your way, have a riot.  Next time, Gov. Wilson will cower appropriately.
From: ems@michael.apple.com (E. Michael Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: lead free primers?
Date: 14 Oct 92 21:05:06 GMT
Article-I.D.: michael.1992Oct14.201031.29771
Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA

In article <1992Oct9.234928.15394@ttinews.tti.com> hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:

#I've been useing CCI Blazer Lead Free for practice in my P226 and I'm
                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
#happy with it (just bought another case, in fact).  Unfortunately, I
#haven't seen it in any other caliber and the 9mm is getting thin on the
#ground (so to speak.  The aluminum "brass" is non-reloadable).

Is this the standard 'Blazer' brand, or a special variation of it 
labled 'Lead Free' that has to be special ordered?  I want it, but
just need to know what I'm looking for ...   

(I have a couple of boxes of Blazer 9mm and they don't say a thing about
Lead Free on them ...)

-- 

E. Michael Smith  ems@apple.COM
From: spf@hoqaa.att.com (Steven P Frysinger)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Good news for Glock owners!
Date: 15 Oct 92 23:59:28 GMT
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories

#From article <9210141507.AA00346@bigguy.eng.ufl.edu>, by glock@chip.cba.ufl.edu (Joe Granto):
# I sent a letter in to Glock, Inc., a while ago asking about what I would 
# need to do in order to get Trijicon sights.  For those who do not know, 
# Glock offers Trijicon and Meprolite sights for $110 on all glock models.  
# The reply I got was terrific!
# 
# Right now GLock is having a sale on Trijicon and Meprolite sights: $59.40!

Sounds good - I've been in the market to get nightsights to replace the
plastic adjustable I currently have (which I'm told will be ripped off in
the brush within my first three years on duty).

But how does one buy sights from Glock?  Do they have a direct sales
telephone number?

Thanks!
Steve