HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lm89@ecs.soton.ac.uk (McIlhoney L)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Franks Brain?
Date: 27 Jul 92 11:05:31 GMT

In <1992Jul24.184226.11997@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>
ira2p@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Iain Robert Asplin) writes:

>In article <1992Jul24.033620.8347@news.iastate.edu> trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy) writes:
>>
>>Parallel time-line? I didn't think it was possible, but you've been watching
>>too MUCH Dr. Who. I am hearby reading these last few and putting this thread
>>AND the Christainity thread in my kill file. I don't have time to respond to
>>everything, and I want reading news to be enjoyable, not a drudgeary. I am NOT
>>giving up. I still hold firm to my beliefs, but I'm tired of these threads.
>>
>>Frank Trumpy
>>trump@iastate.edu

>Good deal, Frank.  We're all tired of your thread-bare brain.

Oh, don't be such a misery, Iain!!!  He's been the most truly inventive
disputant so far, claiming that we have shown time travel to be impossible,
rewriting the history of a major religion, and everything.

This is NOT the work of a threadbare brain.  He's clearly got an
excellent imagination!  :-)

Seriously though, I truly believe that Frank's arrival has been one
of the more stimulating things to happen to this BB so far.

Lawrence.

Jelly baby anyone?
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: dennis@citr.uq.oz.au (Dennis Remmer)
Subject: Re: As easy as Pi
Keywords: 5Drs, Pi, Chess
Organization: Prentice Centre, University of Queensland
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 03:33:19 GMT

Hi again,

My original post gathered some interesting responses, particularly from 
Jeff Wojtalewicz (Wojo) in Oakland. The following is the transcript of
our discussion so far (my comments are prefixed '>').
Your comments are welcome. Thanx to Jeff.

>Greetings,
>
>Here's something that's been bothering me for ages.
>
>Is their ANY actual relevance to the use of Pi in the chess-board security
>sequence in the 5 Doctors. If so please explain the events of this
>extract a little more clearly than they are portrayed in the show.
>

How the trap worked was that it would activate when you touch a certain row, it
would activate.  Every time it went off, it would choose another row.  The
pattern itself is Pi, or more importantly, 3.1415927.  So the doctor figured
out the order of position it was in, and skipped over it.

> 
> When you say the pattern itself is Pi, what are you on about?
> 
> Are you saying every 3.14... rows (cyclic) after a 'live' row becomes the
> next 'live' row? I don't recall either the Doctor or the Master skipping
> over a complete row.
>

Since Pi is an number with no end to it, the trap is never going to run out
of numbers.  I assure you, the Master did jump over the squares.  First he
ran over it, jumping over a few row of squares, then he walked over it, turned
before stepping on the next square, then turned around and stepped over it.

the Number Pi is 3.1415927... The doctor threw a coin on row four and the trap
went off.  Then I think a cyberman hit the first block and got destroyed.  Then
the Master walked over, skipping the 5th row, to prove the trap was off.  But 
the Cybermen stepped on row 5 and got destroyed.  The doctor then figured out
the sequence and knowing the exact number of Pi and what rows were set, he knew
row 9 is set.  So after the trap is set off again, the next number in Pi will
be the row, in this case, row 2.


>Aah, now I see.
>
> At what point do you think the cycle returns to the head 3? Who's to say
> (excuse the pun) that when the Master or Doctor arrived (I can't remember
> which arrived first) that the sequence wasn't somewhere in the fractions?
> Where they the first ones there? I suspect not due to the other figures
> on Rassilon's casket.

Good question.  It must have been resetted for that to happen.  Unless the 
Doctor and the Master are very smart, it seems impossible to figure out the
position.  

--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
       Dennis Remmer - dennis@citr.uq.oz.au - DennisR@syacus.acus.oz
    Australian Centre for Unisys Software, Brisbane Queensland Australia
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: mrmuon@next06pg2.wam.umd.edu (Eli John Hawkins)
Subject: Re: Doctors Memery from the 2 Doctors
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 20:38:37 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.231601.4877@mercury.cair.du.edu>  
mwasserm@diana.cair.du.edu (MARC Y. WASSERMAN) writes:
> Besides, part of the Two Doctors was innacruate too, as far as I
> can tell.  Jamie never traveled solo with the Doctor--he was always
> with Zoe or Victoria.  I may be missing something there though.

   I thought this untill I watched the beggining again a few days ago.  
They say something about having dropped Victoria off somewhere, and that  
they're going to pick her up later. I breathed a sigh of continuity  
relief.
From: dcpiii@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (pawlak dan)
Subject: Re: As easy as Pi
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:16:07 GMT
Keywords: 5Drs, Pi, Chess

Dan Pawlak dcpiii@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu writes:

>In article trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy) writes:

>(incidentialy: the calculation of the portion of Pi the Doctor mentions is
>WRONG. He says: 3.1415269, and the first few digidts is: 3.1415927)

Actually, (and I hate to nitpick, but you DID say the DOCTOR was WRONG???!!),
the numbers he utters are "3.14159265" which if you round up is what you gave.
Sorry but I had to do it...

"...what do ya think, sirs???"     "BITE ME...it's fun!!!"
	-MST3K
Dan Pawlak

Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: ppugliese@pimacc.pima.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: References of Christianity
Date: 23 Jul 92 05:17:36 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.201321.8632@wam.umd.edu>, mrmuon@next08pg2.wam.umd.edu (Eli John Hawkins) writes:
> In article <1992Jul22.002418.6808@pimacc.pima.edu>  
> ppugliese@pimacc.pima.edu writes:
>  >    The library of Alexandria was a great place of learning before  
>> > Christianity; then the Christians came along and burned it down. The  
>> > Christian places of learning were established for teaching  
> Christianity.
>> 
>> According to an encyclopedia I just checked the Library was burned four
>> times since Julius Caesar. The first time was in 47BC when Julius was
>> besieged there by followers of Pompey. The next 3 times are described
>> as "according to legend"; 272AD (by order of the Roman Emperor Lucius
>> Domitius Aurelian), 391AD (under the Roman Emperor Theodosius I) &  
> lastly,
>> in 640AD (by Muslims under the Caliph Omar I). I believe that there was
>> also at least one other fire that predated 47BC. I think that if anyone
>> looks it up they'll find that the final destruction of the Library came
>> by Muslim conquest & not christian zealotry.
>> 
>> PHIL
> 
>    391AD would be in the Christian dominated era and must be the incident  
> I was thinking of. The two previous incidents must not have been teribly  
> significant because the library was still going fine when a Christian mob  
> decided to include it as another pagan thing that had to go. They burned  
> the library and all the books. They grabbed the librarian and mutilated  
> her to death.
>    I have heard the claim that the library was burned by muslims. It  
> wasn't. This is simply a lie made up by Christians to pass the blame on to  
> others. The real library did not exist in 640AD.
>    Incidentaly I think there was something in "Timewyrm" about the Doctor  
> rescuing some scrolls (plays I think) just before the library was burned.

On the contrary, the 391AD incident was probably a minor one since the li-
brary was still going strong until it disappeared from historical mention
after the Muslim conquest. This fact is well documented. Try looking it up.
The fabrication you've presented is simply a lie made up by anti-christians
to justify their antipathy. 

PHIL
From: ekho.bbs@cybernet.cse.fau.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: re: Doctor's Memory from the 2 Doctors
Date: 27 Jul 92 14:17:49 GMT
Organization: Florida Atlantic University, Boca Raton


  I have two thoughts on the poser that Yadallee posted... 

  1)  I agree that the Spectrox could well have wiped some memory... 
      Don't forget that in the first place, the regenerations into the 
      5th and 6th Doctors were particularly nasty... That could have 
      helped, as well.

  2)  Perhaps the Doctor was just keeping the recognition of Peri to 
      himself;  if Peri were to know certain things, a paradox (or is 
      that paradoc? :-) ) could occur!

  I'm getting the feeling in my bones that we have another debate 
developing here ;-)  Stay Safe!


      Yours in Time and Space,


         Ekho (Kiler Queen, Dynamite with a Laser Beam)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy)
Subject: Re: "SHADA" Video
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 22:57:23 GMT

In article <62850@cup.portal.com> TheMadDoctor@cup.portal.com (Shane Derek Killian) writes:
>>Well, as I understand it, the workers went on strike or something and they
>>didn't have the manpower to show it. Yes, Addams is a great writer, but he
>>carries his ideas around with him (the Time Machine in Cambridge, and the
>>Chesterfield. The Dead Planet(?_)was *identical* to DGHDI. Oh, well. After
>>I found out about this, I suddenly had a lower view of Addams, as you might

>Well, why shouldn't he? Shada was apparently a no-go, so he presumably felt
>it was too good a story to go to waste.

You've it the wrong way round. HHGG came FIRST, then he some stuff to Shada,
and the Dirk Gently-Dead Planet thing is just so obvious, I was flabbergasted.
It's REALLY pitiful that someone would do that, even under a pseudonym (David
Agnew).



>
>TheMadDoctor@cup.portal.com | "The more complex the mind, the greater the
>(Shane Derek Killian)       | need for the simplicity of play." --Jim Kirk
>                            | --------------------------------------------
>FIDO: Shane Killian         | "People say I watch too many cartoons.
>      1:151/2308            | ...Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhh, could be!!!!!"
>                            |                              --Mark McCollum


Frank Trumpy
trump@iastate.edu





Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: pealbers@laplace.waterloo.edu (Paul E. Albers)
Subject: Re: References of Christianity
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 19:08:39 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.151342.7377@news.iastate.edu> trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy) writes:
>Please note that I'm doing this editing by HAND so I can't really quote without
>quoting huge articles. 
>
>	A previous writed wrote:
>
>> Why don't YOU try to find out what YOU'RE talking about? Historians
>> have been writing for years about how contemporary Romans
>> considered Christians to be a bad influence on the Empire.
>> I believe that Gibbon addresses this in his writings. The
>> attitude was present before any systematic persecu- tion
>> began & probably facilitated the persecution. The fact remains
>> that Christians *were* persecuted for centuries in any case.
>
>And good for the Romans! The Romans were one of the first advanced 
>scientific cultures(I can imagine the flames from Chinese and Greeks), 
>and infecting their culture with a dominating religion. The multi-god
>religion of the Romans encourged advancements in ALL fields of science.
>(The Pope once told Stephen Hawking to cease his investigation into the
>beginning of the Universe) The Roman's might have created myths to 
>understand things, but when science uncovered the REAL reason, the people
>believed it without question.
>	Oh, God...Are the Christians whining about being persecuted again?
>1 word for you, buddy...1 word...'Inquisition'. Think about it. Thousands
>upon thousands of people killed. How about a 3 words acronym, too? Ok then...
>'BSA'. Boy Scouts of America. When I was young, I was refused from BSA
>because I was an Athiest. Want another word? 'Jews'. In Mideval England,
>Jews were treated like second class scum. 
>
>	Dont whine about being persecuted, BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT.
>

There is a world of difference between the beliefs and actions of Christians
in the day of Christ and in the beliefs and actions of the organization(s) that
are guilty of the dark ages etc.  The intense persecution of the early Chuch
left them without leaders.  Eventually Rome 'adopted' Christianity and
started to dump it's pagan supersticians(sp?) into the doctrine that
Christ taught and in a short period of time, the Roman Empire had turned
itself from a political organization to an organization that *called* itself 
a Christian Church.  Please don't heap blame on all Christian Churches
for the misdeed of others in the past, there is no fairness in that.

Also, just because something can be corrupted by men doesn't mean that
is was worthless to start with, be open to the posibility that original
Christianity has validity and that it may still be around today.

Paul
From: lm89@ecs.soton.ac.uk (McIlhoney L)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: References of Christianity
Date: 24 Jul 92 20:13:08 GMT

In <1992Jul23.173356.12134@news.iastate.edu> trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy) writes:

>Well, now we end up in a philosphical issue...There is no fairness in not
>allowing me to join BSA because I'm an athiest either. I don't think ANY
>religion has or HAD any validity because all religions dictate things to
>people that I, frankly, would rather descide for myself.

Yeah, but the only difference with Christianity is that most Christians
HAVE actively decided (either by logic or some stunning experience)
that the things taught by Christianity are true.  If they decide they
are not true, they are free to say so, and forget the whole issue!

(Oh grud, why me Lord?)

The Christian God is semi-unique in that he refuses to dictate anything
to anyone.  He just lays out his cards and ...

Tell me, why are we still arguing about this here and now?  Isn't
Doctor Who interesting enough anymore?

Lawrence
From: brown@vidiot.UUCP (Vidiot)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: Resurrection of the Daleks w/o sound effects?
Keywords: Resurrection Daleks
Date: 22 Jul 92 17:32:36 GMT
Reply-To: brown@vidiot.UUCP (Vidiot)
Organization: Vidiot's Hangout

In article <83958@netnews.upenn.edu> jneff@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Joseph D. Neff) writes:
<
<	I just saw Resurrection (for those like me who get confused about
<R* of the Daleks, this was the Davison story) taped from Saturday's showing
<on NJN.  I noticed a lack of sound effects for ray-guns, explosions, and
<the TARDIS door.  Also, no incidental music.  Though it seemed rather
<strange at the time, at least we got some insight into what the actors
<really hear on the set.  Anyone know what happened to the distribution of
<this story?

Back when BBC Enterprises first released this story, they grabbed the wrong
set of tapes.  The last two parts were without sound effects and music.

After this was brought to JN-T's attention, many moons ago, he said that he
would get it corrected.  It was eventually corrected.  But, it was up to the
local station to request a new tape.  Our local station did, but obviously
NJN hasn't.

I have both versions (movie) on my shelf.  The one without effects is kind-of
a collector's edition.
-- 
      harvard\     att!nicmad\          spool.cs.wisc.edu!astroatc!vidiot!brown
Vidiot  ucbvax!uwvax..........!astroatc!vidiot!brown
      rutgers/            INTERNET:vidiot!brown%astroatc.UUCP@spool.cs.wisc.edu
                                   brown@wi.extrel.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy)
Subject: Re: References of Christianity
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 15:13:42 GMT

Please note that I'm doing this editing by HAND so I can't really quote without
quoting huge articles. 

	A previous writed wrote:

> Why don't YOU try to find out what YOU'RE talking about? Historians
> have been writing for years about how contemporary Romans
> considered Christians to be a bad influence on the Empire.
> I believe that Gibbon addresses this in his writings. The
> attitude was present before any systematic persecu- tion
> began & probably facilitated the persecution. The fact remains
> that Christians *were* persecuted for centuries in any case.

And good for the Romans! The Romans were one of the first advanced 
scientific cultures(I can imagine the flames from Chinese and Greeks), 
and infecting their culture with a dominating religion. The multi-god
religion of the Romans encourged advancements in ALL fields of science.
(The Pope once told Stephen Hawking to cease his investigation into the
beginning of the Universe) The Roman's might have created myths to 
understand things, but when science uncovered the REAL reason, the people
believed it without question.
	Oh, God...Are the Christians whining about being persecuted again?
1 word for you, buddy...1 word...'Inquisition'. Think about it. Thousands
upon thousands of people killed. How about a 3 words acronym, too? Ok then...
'BSA'. Boy Scouts of America. When I was young, I was refused from BSA
because I was an Athiest. Want another word? 'Jews'. In Mideval England,
Jews were treated like second class scum. 

	Dont whine about being persecuted, BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT.

Frank 'The Atheist From Hell' Trumpy
trump@iastate.edu


Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: pealbers@leibniz.waterloo.edu (Paul E. Albers)
Subject: Re: References of Christianity
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 14:55:25 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.173356.12134@news.iastate.edu> trump@iastate.edu (Jennifer M Trumpy) writes:
>Some chap name Paul said:
  (among other things that are delete...)
>> Please don't
>> heap blame on all Christian Churches for the misdeed of
>> others in the past, there is no fairness in that.
>> 
>> Also, just because something can be corrupted by men doesn't
>> mean that is was worthless to start with, be open to the
>> posibility that original Christianity has validity and that
>> it may still be around today.
>> 
>> Paul
>
>
>Well, now we end up in a philosphical issue...There is no fairness in not
>allowing me to join BSA because I'm an athiest either.

I'll agree with you there.  The BSA however is not a Church or claim to be
one.

>I don't think ANY
>religion has or HAD any validity because all religions dictate things to
>people that I, frankly, would rather descide for myself.


All religions are not like that, just the one's you are familliar with.  In
the Church I attend we do not want people to have this kind of blind faith.
There are promises in the scriptures that we can find out if something
is true of not ourselves and so members are only informed of the different
teachings etc. and then it is their responsibility to find out for
themselves the truth of what was said and then live according to what they
know is true.  The dogmatic, oppesive forcing of beliefs on people that
we see today can not be seen in the scriptures.  You are free to make your
own choices but if you want to find out if you choice is correct or not,
there is a way.

Paul
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: mwasserm@diana.cair.du.edu (MARC Y. WASSERMAN)
Subject: Re: Two Doctors No-Prizes (*SPOILERS for 2Drs*)
Organization: University of Denver, Denver, Colorado
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 00:58:14 GMT

In article <14661@umd5.umd.edu> jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog here...) writes:
>In a way, it also makes sense that they'd take the second Doctor as their
>pawn for this mission.  The first scene has Troughton saying that this
>mission might mark a turning point in his relationship with the High Council,
>and later he tells Dastari that he's "a bit of an exile" from the Time Lords.
>The future Time Lords might have chosen the second Doctor because he was
>from a time before Pertwee's pardon, and they could bribe him with dropping
>whatever charges got him exiled originally (before the series started).
>Hartnell would be too much of a stiff-necked old coot to make such a deal.

Yet it would have made alot more sense for the Time Lords to choose
Pertwee.  Troughton hadn't really bothered them that much until
"War Games".  If they wanted to test a Doctor, and reward him with
soemthing (a la Pertwee in Three Doctors) why choose Troughton?
Also, Troughton passed the "test" of the Two Doctors, I guess, which
would meen that Pertwee would never be exiled and Troughton wouldn't
change appearance until later.  It doesn't click.
you're right, Hartnell wouldn't have ever made that deal. 


>In fact, to answer my own post, here's a possibility.  The Time Lords who
>took the Doctor out of time were from the sixth Doctor's era.  The attack
>on the second Doctor was transmitted to him because he was the "current"
>Doctor in the Time Lords' life-stream... or perhaps it was some bizarre
>Time Lord way of attracting his attention.  Their first-choice pawn had
>gotten into a jam, so they'd set a pawn to catch a pawn.  How's that?

Not bad.  

Marc Wasserman
mwasserm@diana.cair.du.edu

-- 
"So you're choosing to run from your own people in a rackety old TARDIS?"
		     D  O  C  T  O  R     W  H  O
				30 Years
"Why not?  After all, that's how it all started!"
From: yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Dave Shariff Yadallee)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: Exit the 7th Doctor (?)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 06:42:31 MDT
Organization: Edmonton Remote Systems #2, Edmonton, AB, Canada

ira2p@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Iain Robert Asplin) writes:

> In article <DLTgoB1w164w@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca> yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca
> >From DreamWatch Bulletin 103?:  Sylvester McCoy is not to be referred as the
> >ex-DOctor. This comes from BBC Enterprises.
> >
> >Speculation:  The BBC is soon ready t give DOctor Who to an independent
> >company.
> >
> >Can anyone confirm that this is the case in the U.K.: MAtthew Farwell, Chris
> >Whitehead, Graeme Natress, IAn collier, Gareth Suddess, Brian Buttersworth?
> >Phil Crabtree, Ian Palmer?  Anyone in the UK?
> >
> >Hopefully the above is just misspeculation, or a delayed April's Fools joke.
> >
> >If not, the BBC should give the rights to the show to ITN.  It seems to me t
> >the old idea of having a Doctor for 120 episodes went out the door for a Doc
> >for 120 weeks.
> >
> >Sylvester McCoy is not a bad actor; it was simply a cse of bad production an
> >script-writing, i.e keep McCoy, dump Turner and Cartmel!!
> >
> >COuld we get confirmation from the U.K. before moving on to debate on this o
> >
>
> No, we can't, becuase Sylvester isan excellent Doctor!  :)
> Actually, I'm just reposting this to doubly be sure the UKers get a chance
> to answer, though with all the Christian arguments lately, I doubt they'e
> looking these days.
>
  I do agree Iain.  Sylvester and Sophie should return, and JNT and AC such be
PERMINENTLY pink-slipped.

  No Iain, pull up seat, and order up your favourite draught.

Cheers, Mate.




Dave Shariff Yadallee
yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca, userLIBE@mts.ucs.ualberta.ca
God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!
yankee: (n) a person with long, yankable hair
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho