HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jmf@endor.harvard.edu ( ghost )
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Vinge's singularity
Keywords: videophones, memory, learning
Date: 12 Sep 92 00:03:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: das.1992Sep12.000345.29839
Organization: DAS Purchasing, Harvard University

In article <1992Sep04.081151.15194@sco.COM> charless@sco.COM (charles stross) writes:
>As I understand it, as far back as the early 60's AT&T tested a 
>prototype videophone. The thing that killed it wasn't cost or
>technology -- it was the sheer lack of imagination of the
>researchers, who figured that the only reasonable market for such
>a device (which had no business applications, right?) consisted
>of housewives. So they rounded up a sample of housewives and
>discovered, to their astonishment, that people who don't work for
>a living and (then maybe more than now) put great store on
>appearances _didn't_ want just anybody to be able to phone up 
>and see them without their make-up and unprepared for public
>appearances.

The Museum of Science & Industry in Chicago Illinois had a working
videophone on exhibit during the late '60s.  I saw it & used it then.
I've always read that sending a clear enough video signal via the phone
lines with '60s switching/sending technology used up too much of the 
available line space to make it commercially viable.  I'd never heard
this 'housewives' business before...
>
stuff deleted, then
>
>This is an interesting point. Suppose that it becomes possible to
>patch external neural networks into your brain directly; not
>simply to give you access to cyberspace or whatever at a
>perceptual level, but to actually augment the skills and
>`learned' behaviour you have access to. What will it be like when
>your black-belt judo reflexes are rented from the dojo, or your
>doctorate in computer science is leased from IBM? Who _are_ you,
>anyway? Are you simply the product of some neural network
>annealing processes, that can be patched onto in software, or are
>you something more? 

Presuming this were ever to work (I say it never would or could),
the skills would be yours once you used them, because the use of them
would become part of your memory...in the same way a video or book
returned to the library is part of you right now, for knowledge, & in
a far more 'real' way as well.
As to IBM cancelling the lease...you can presume 'memory wipers' for
fictional purposes, but memory storage in fact is far more analogous
to holographic storage (the whole brain is involved, memories can be
reconstructed even when many of the 'storage areas' are injured)
while memory retrieval seems to use the hippocampal region
of the temporal lobe, and any interference there leads to global, 
not subject-specific, impairment.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: djdaneh@pbhyc.PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Subject: Re: Heinlein stories ?
Reply-To: djdaneh@PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 16:34:59 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.025827.9894@colorado.edu> robertm@alumni.cs.colorado.edu (MONTGOMERY ROBERT PH) writes:

>1. "Window to the Stars"

Hard to say -- the most probable would be TUNNEL IN THE SKY, but that's
pushing it a little.  Perhaps there's something I'm forgetting.


>2. "4-D House"

"And He Built a Crooked House," variously anthologized, and included in one
of RAH's collections -- I *think* it's THE UNPLEASANT PROFESSION OF JONATHAN
HOAG (a/k/a 6XH), but I can't swear to it.

		The Pavlov dog and the Schroedinger cat
		Side by side in my forebrain sat
		With Shakespeare's monkeys crowding in behind. . .
		. . . it's all in your mind.
			-- Visual Purple

Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, Net.Roach
My opinions do NOT represent Pacific Bell,
Professional Development, or anyone else.
But I'm willing to share.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: rcj@engin.umich.edu (R o d Johnson)
Subject: Re: Carve the Sky, by Alexander Jablokov
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 92 23:01:34 EDT
Organization: Lost Tribes of Gazebo

In article <18rc1kINN5mn@agate.berkeley.edu> curtis@cs.berkeley.edu (Curtis Yarvin) writes:

>_Carve The Sky_ is one convincing refutation to that bloke who
>was arguing that Bujold keeps winning the Hugo because she
>really is the best writer around, and all the lit people are
>just degenerate pomo trash.  
>
>If you like clear, plain writing in sf, read Jablokov; it's
>been done better, but not often.

I agree.  I was amazed at this book when I finally read it (kept
passing it up in the store for some reason).  It's literate,
well-observed, witty (the characters are intelligent people who
actually talk and act like intelligent people) and thoughtful.  It's
also recognizably a first novel--Jablokov gives in somewhat to his
adventure conventions toward the end, whereas up to that point he'd
been keeping a respectful distance (so the theretofore smart heroine
decides to get herself in a pickle she has to be rescued from, etc.),
and the Nature of Life talk is a little too much at the smart
undergraduate level.  These are small flaws, though; Jablokov has a
level of skill and sensibility you don't see often (I think of Ian
McDonald as one recent example).

-- 
       Rod Johnson  *  rcj@caen.engin.umich.edu  *  (313) 764-3103
    
                "What I do doesn't happen in a warehouse"
                                          --Jim Dickinson
From: chuq@gallant.apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: morbid thoughts (was Re: RIP Fritz Leiber)
Date: 10 Sep 92 20:08:35 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc.

gamiddle@math.uwaterloo.ca (Guy Middleton) writes:
>In article <Bu8342.5K3@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> ericg@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Eric Chris Garrison) writes:
>> Now Asimov, Heinlein and Leiber are gone.  Who will be next of
>> the old greats to go?  Clarke?

Also Reginold Bretnor (aka Grendel Briarton) and Alan Nourse.

FWIW, you can never tell for sure about anything when it comes to life and
death, but last time I got a letter from Clarke, he said he was doing quite
well. A recent issue of Locus had a picture of him scuba diving, which was
the first time in years he'd felt able to do so, and unless things fall
apart again, he doesn't have to worry about rebels blowing up his house any
time soon.

Thinking about it, I can't think of anyone that I think in any particular
danger. Clarke, Fred Pohl, Andre Norton, and Jack Williamson all seem to be
doing well. MZB has her health problems under control. I have great hopes
that it'll be a while before we have to have this conversation again.

>I'm going to be *really* upset when it's Jack Vance's turn.

I'm upset whenever someone I know or respect dies. Fortunately, I can always
pull them off a shelf for an evening and renew the friendship.

-- 
Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= Member, SFWA
  chuq@apple.com | GEnie: MAC.BIGOT | ALink:CHUQ =+= Editor, OtherRealms
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: cmeadows@nyx.cs.du.edu (Chris Meadows)
Subject: Is there a Deathworld IV?
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix @ U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 92 23:20:30 GMT


I have read Harry Harrison's Deathworld books 1, 2, and 3, as well as
a short story about Jason dinAlt, Meta, and their son attempting to crack
into a mothballed spaceship, that supposedly came from Deathworld IV, or
V, or something.

 
I really loved Deathworld 1, 2, and 3, so I would like to know: Is there
a Deathworld IV?  Please e-mail.

Thanks.

---Chris Meadows
From: jonathan@comp.lancs.ac.uk (Mr J J Trevor)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: David Gemmel
Date: 9 Sep 92 07:54:53 GMT
Organization: Department of Computing at Lancaster University, UK.

In article <bphillip.6.716007852@massey.ac.nz> news@massey.ac.nz (USENET News System) writes:
>In article <1992Sep8.231308.23523@menudo.uh.edu> barrus@oak.egr.uh.edu (Karl L. Barrus) writes:
>>\-----------------------------------/
>Get "Legend" - it combines the first 3 Drenai (sp?) books in chronological 
>order plus it includes a previously unpublished short story about how Druss 
>became the Legend.
>
>Brenden

Legend is only the first book by Gemmel (also known as Against the
Hordes)

The anthology you are referring to is "Drenai (sp?) Tales"

Oh yeh, Gemmel is amazingly good! (although Dark prince was a disapointment)


-- 
___________
  |onathan   Phone: +44 524 65201 x3793 Address:Department of Computing
'-'________    Fax: +44 524 381707              Lancaster University
            E-mail: jonathan@comp.lancs.ac.uk   Lancaster, Lancashire
From: robertm@alumni.cs.colorado.edu (MONTGOMERY ROBERT PH)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Heinlein stories ?
Date: 10 Sep 92 02:58:27 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder

Would someone please provide pointers to the following,
*supposedly* by Heinlein, e.g., a book the short story is in.

1. "Window to the Stars"

2. "4-D House"

Thanks,

Rob
From: dpn2@po.CWRU.Edu (Damien P. Neil)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: C.J. Cherryh's _Hellburner_
Date: 12 Sep 1992 05:20:52 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: dpn2@po.CWRU.Edu (Damien P. Neil)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, mjb@doc.ic.ac.uk (Matthew Jude Brown) says:

>
>If you haven't read much recent Cherryh, I don't think it's the
>perfect introduction to her books. Read _Downbelow Station_ first;
>it's not of the quality of her later works (mainly IMHO because it
>tries to pack too much into a single book) but it's a good beginning.
>_Cyteen_ too is an okay starting point, esp. since there is quite a
>bit of background there.
>

I have read only one Cherryh book. Fantasy, don't remember the title, and I
wasn't impressed. Anyway, I wouldn't mind trying some of her sf. Do you
have a timeline of her books, to give me an idea of the order I want to
read them in. (My school bookstore has some of her stuff, so I can get them
easily.)

Thanks in advance.
-- 
+-------------+------------------+
| Damien Neil | dpn2@po.cwru.edu | 
+-------------+------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: clc@kepler.unh.edu (Christian L Claiborn)
Subject: Re: What is good writing? (was Re: Piers Anthony)
Organization: University of New Hampshire  -  Durham, NH
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 17:22:51 GMT

In article <wilder.716572854@mik.uky.edu> wilder@mik.uky.edu (jeff wilder) writes:
>What I can't figure out is this "If lotsa people buy it, it *must* be good!"
>idea.  I disagree with it in PA's case, and I disagree with it when some
>dork tries to explain to me how good Nirvana is.
>
>I mean, if that definition were applied to McDonald's, McDonald's would
>have to be the best food in existence.
>
>I don't remember who said this:  "It is impossible to underestimate
>the taste of the American public."  No kidding.  McDonald's is going
>to be around for a looooong time, and it has nothing to do with the
>quality (or non-) of their food.  PA is going to be around for a long time,
>also, and again, that fact has nothing to do with the quality (or non-)
>of his writing.
>
Actually, McDonalds and PA have a lot in common:
	You can count on similar, mediocre products each time you purchase.
	You know a lot of people who patronize both, and aren't proud of 
		either.
	They are both especially attractive to a Jr. High school student.
	You could [work there, write one like it] too, if you didn't mind
		the loss of dignity.
	Other, better [restaurants, writers] constantly ridicule them, but
		can't seem to rid themselves of them and their patrons.
	They both might have been good once, but now are victims of their
		own ridiculous monetary greed.
	There is one in Florida.

				clc

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "I like the girls I go out with to have a head on their shoulders." | Wasted|
| "I hate necks."        -- Steve Martin                              | Space |
|------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| Maintainer of Snake for kepler@unh.edu, brilliant BNF parser, fun dude.     |
|        clc@kepler.unh.edu/clc@gloin.unh.edu/C_CLAIBORN@unhh.unh.edu         |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (Jim Puckett)
Subject: Re: Ya can't keep 'em down!
Keywords: Heinlein, Conspiracies, JFK, Armenians, Atlantis
Organization: NASA/MSFC
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 12:59:52 GMT

clc@kepler.unh.edu (Christian L Claiborn) writes:

>_Let There Be Light,_ I think.  I was home this weekend and picked it up.
>Lots of men dragging women around by their hair and squirmy fuzzy girls who
>just wanna settle down, get married and do Heinleinesque things.

now wait just a doggone minute! 8-)
You mean the story written in the early forties, where the heroine has a 
PhD in Biology and walks around the lab naked, making coffee in a Erlenmeyer
flask that minutes before was full of snake venom? "I rinsed it out!" she
said...

...yeah, that's _my_ idea of a pink fuzzy girl!

jim p.
-- 
Jim Puckett    NTI    puckett@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov     
Huntsville,AL (205)461-4922  
i need to ask myself.....
***********         Would I rather be right, or happy?         ***********
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: clc@kepler.unh.edu (Christian L Claiborn)
Subject: Re: Dreamer Fithp
Keywords: scientists, SF writers
Organization: University of New Hampshire  -  Durham, NH
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 17:34:03 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.011743.5134@afterlife.ncsc.mil> jfzeigl@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Jon Zeigler) writes:
>Hmmmmmm. . .Mayhap Brin (the astrophysicist), Benford (the physicist), and
>Asimov (the biochemist) would take a little umbrage at this one.  I seem to
>recall that Bear is a practicing scientist as well, although I wouldn't stake
>my life on it.
>
>Science fiction has come a *long* way since "Doc" Smith earned it a sliver of
>respectability by being the only major writer with a doctorate. . .
>
>My nominations. . .Vernor Vinge might be a decent choice -- as a computer
>scientist he might have something to contribute by way of information theory.
>And then there's Paul Hogan, if the nature of the "Threat" would allow the
>government to overlook his "alien" origins. . .:-)

You know, I happen to remember reading something in N-Space by Niven about
a group advising NASA on space-travel plans for the future that included
Larry, Asimov, and I think Del Rey?  Could this be what he's alluding to?

					clc

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Christian Longshore Claiborn | clc@kepler.unh.edu | Friend of the Great     |
| Chuck Woolery's Protege      | clc@gloin.unh.edu  | Eater of Souls          |
| Future UNH Sysadmin          | clc@bifur.unh.edu  | Ask about group rates!  |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|"It was all very well to say 'Drink Me,' but the wise little Alice wasn't    |
| going to do THAT in a hurry."  -- The Reverend Charles Dodgson              |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:11884 rec.arts.books:15901
From: branwen@cerebus.ccc.amdahl.com (Karen Williams)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Joan Aiken
Date: 9 Sep 92 19:14:44 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <BuBLHJ.AJ9@news.cso.uiuc.edu> levine@symcom.math.uiuc.edu (Lenore Levine) writes:
>Does anyone else like her Dido Twite books? 

I *love* her Dido Twite books! (I still remember the counting rhyme from
"The Cuckoo Tree.") 

The books I know from the series are "The Wolves of Willoughby Chase,"
"Black Hearts in Battersea," <I don't remember the third one>, and "The
Cuckoo Tree." They're great. 

--
                                          Karen Williams
                                          branwen@cerebus.ras.amdahl.com
"Don't whine. Warrior women speak in a husky whisper."
  -- Brat Pack #3
From: djdaneh@pbhyc.PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Terry Brooks (was Re: Piers Anthony)
Date: 14 Sep 92 21:16:02 GMT
Reply-To: djdaneh@PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA

In article <1992Sep14.194240.24731@newshost.unh.edu> ss1@kepler.unh.edu (The Rink) writes:
>
>This whole Piers Anthony thread has been extremely amusing to watch, but let's
>get one thing straight.  Terry Brooks is *WAY* different that Anthony is.
>It's almost blasphemy to classify them in the same category.  IMNSHO.

You're quite right.

Piers Anthony is a dreadful hack, but he deserves at least the dignity of the
term "creative typist" -- that is, what he types, he creates.

Terry Brooks, by contrast, is a very clever plagiarist, having discerned the
bare minimum of serial-filing-off required to avoid his theft becoming actually
actionable:  as _viz_ THE SWORD OF SHA-NA-NA, from which a charcter-to-character
and damn near incident-to-incident correspondence can be drawn two its original,
THE LORD OF THE RINGS.

It may be that the sequels, or his other effusions, may actually be original
work; I neither know nor care.  In a just world, he would have had all his
typing fingers amputated and inserted into various bodily orifices for that
first offense (and those fingers left over would have been inserted into the
orifices of Lester del Rey, who should have known better than to publish such
a thing).


		The Pavlov dog and the Schroedinger cat
		Side by side in my forebrain sat
		With Shakespeare's monkeys crowding in behind. . .
		. . . it's all in your mind.
			-- Visual Purple

Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, Net.Roach
My opinions do NOT represent Pacific Bell,
Professional Development, or anyone else.
But I'm willing to share.
From: mweinste@pearl.tufts.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Piers Anthony Comments
Date: 15 Sep 92 15:34:09 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA

In article <1992Sep14.035830.18164@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca>, aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey) writes:
> 
> <sigh>  This is the kind of thing that inspired the post that started a brief
> flamewar through misinterpretation a while ago.  This kind of response to those
> who honestly like Anthony's work, or whoever else's, is why I recommended that
> those people be directed swiftly to the alt.fan newsgroups rather than face the
> kind of superior attitude they'll find here.
> 
> Dammit!  I >like< Piers Anthony!  I like a hell of a lot of stuff, and I must
> say that periodic "Anthony writes nothing but drek" comments, usually inserted
> as snide asides, still annoy me.  I don't consider him the best writer out
> there, but he's far from the worst.  I can see that there's probably a lot of
> resentment of the readership he seems to have stolen away from more "worthy"
> books.  I personally don't think that many people who read Anthony are really
> prepared to read more "worthy" books, because it's not their type of book.  It
> all depends on what you're looking for.  I consider reading Anthony and Eddings
> and Brooks and whatever else to be better than not reading any SF at all--maybe
> a few of them will progress upwards to McCaffrey and Bradley, or Asimov and
> Heinlein, and thence wherever.
> 
> I will hereby declare intent to flame mercilessly all those who make more snide
> anti-Anthony comments in response to that earlier post.  Those who have not yet
> read this post >not< excluded.
> 
> You have been warned.
> 

Thank you for writing this... the point is that whether or not you like an
author, you do not have to attack, mock, or criticize those who hold a
differing opinion.  It is rude and pretentious to comment in this manner
on someone's individual taste.  In addition, no one is really interested in
your opinion if you respond in this manner.  Thanks again, Aaron.

-----------> Max Weinstein (mweinste@pearl.tufts.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: higgins@fnalo.fnal.gov (Bill Higgins-- Beam Jockey)
Subject: Military SF thinktank (was Re: Dreamer Fithp)
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:11:39 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnalo.fnal.gov
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <kaa.716031001@heawk1>, kaa@heawk1.gsfc.nasa.gov (Keith Arnaud) writes:
> To answer the question that started this thread : I remember seeing ~1 year
> ago a note in the Economist that the DoD had run a meeting to try and predict
> weapon design and that a number of SF authors had attended. The article used
> Footfall as a hook but did not name any names.

Chicago author Roland Green (a sometime Pournelle collaborator) was
part of this group.  I don't recall others, but it was covered in a
story in *Locus* two or three years ago.

Bill Higgins, Beam Jockey              | The restaurant's architect
Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory  | said every effort had been
Bitnet:           HIGGINS@FNAL.BITNET  | made to build McDonald's
Internet:       HIGGINS@FNAL.FNAL.GOV  | 15th outlet in Italy 
SPAN/Hepnet:           43011::HIGGINS  | in harmony with Pompeii.
                                       | --Reuters story in *Chicago 
                                       |  Sun-Times*, 18 June 92
From: as018b@uhura.cc.rochester.edu ( aaron russell sher)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: SNOW CRASH by Neal Stephenson
Date: 14 Sep 92 16:05:35 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

Anybody want to talk about _Snow Crash_?  It is sorta the topic, and all...
It's also an incredibly awesome book, though I can't quite pin it to a
genre.  I have only one question about it, which is this:  Did Stephenson
change his mind after about the first chapter of the book?  All the stuff
with the Deliverator is completely different in "feel" from the rest.  

The Phrix
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: What is good writing? (was Re: Piers Anthony)
Date: 15 Sep 92 17:17:53 GMT
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com

In article <wilder.716572854@mik.uky.edu> wilder@mik.uky.edu (jeff  
wilder) writes:
> Of course, I eat McDonald's, occasionally.  After forcing myself  
through
> five Xanth books, a couple of Incarnations, and (the food poisoning  
epi-
> sode, you might say) Bio of a Space Tyrant, I will never read PA  
again.
> 

I agree, though you may want to give Anthony's early works a shot.
One of the saddest things about all the tripe he turns out is that
early in his career he showed promise. Cthor, which I believe was
his first novel, was pretty good, as were Omnivore, Macroscope,
and Orn.  On the humorous side, his stories about an interstellar
dentist were funnier than any of the Xanth stuff (except perhaps
the first Xanth novel, which was reasonable; he should have stopped
there).

--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com