HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: al@qiclab.scn.rain.com (Alan Peterman)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Sport Sedans (was Re: Corrado SLC or 325is?)
Date: 16 Oct 92 22:32:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: qiclab.1992Oct16.223226.12683
Distribution: usa
Organization: SCN Research/Qic Laboratories of Tigard, Oregon.

In article <26447@oasys.dt.navy.mil> odell@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Bernard O'Dell) writes:
>
>Apparently, the 325Is, the 500s,   and probably the new Jetta GLX V6er, will be
>the only true "sports sedans" available. There are many "pretenders"
>out there, but when you compare the specs, they fall out.

Well I disagree that "specs" are the way to select a sports sedan.  There
is the overall balance and driver feel that tells you it is (or isn't)
a "sport" vehicle.  For me, the specs help give an idea, but the driving
feel is the true test.  Frankly, this is why I suspect the Corrado would
not please me as much as the 325 - I really dislike FWD cars "feel" and it
is pretty unavoidable since the steering IS hooked up to the powered axle.

My wife had a Prelude, and now has an Integra - she finds the "feel" of
the my 325 to be much more conducive to positive control, and I have to
agree.  Of course there is more to a "sports" car than RWD, it's a matter
of balanced performance.  But a couple of weeks ago as we watched the Audi
ahead of us spin off the wet road and negotiated the same corner at a bit
higher speed (we were gaining on them) the balanced handling of the BMW
felt awfully good.  Luckily the Audi folks were unhurt (though the same
can't be said for their car), and I suspect some of their problem was due
to poor driving skills.  

My Dad once told his class that a sports car depended on the sport you
wanted to participate in..which is why the Rambler with the fold down
seats was a "sports" car for Friday night dates...


-- 
Alan L. Peterman                                 (503)-684-1984 hm & work
                       al@qiclab.scn.rain.com
It's odd how as I get older, the days are longer, but the years are shorter!
From: andyc@hplsla.hp.com (Andy Cassino)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: SAAB love (was Re: Saab 900i Problems)
Date: 14 Oct 92 23:49:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: hplsla.147520026
Organization: HP Lake Stevens, WA

strollo@ssd.kodak.com (Larry Strollo) writes:

> I'm getting ready to buy my third SAAB, a 93 9000CS - your mission is doomed.

and darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling) writes:

> Agreed; I've just bought my second.  I guess that Larry and I have been
> suckered into believing that outstanding quality of construction,
> reliability, and superior performance and design aesthetics somehow carry
> more weight than [... remainder deleted in the interests of flame reduction]

I've already posted my favorable experience with Saab. I'll now add that,
largely at my recommendation, my mother recently purchased a new 9000S. 
And I plan to purchase the new 900 model in a couple of years, when my 
current one has about 180K on the clock.

    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
    % Andy Cassino                                       %
    % Hewlett-Packard - Lake Stevens Instrument Division %
    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: jburney@seamis1.gsfc.nasa.gov (Jeff Burney)
Subject: Re: about to buy '85 MR2. Good or bad move?
Organization: Goddard Space Flight Center
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 16:51:05 GMT

ekdug@b56vxg.kodak.com (Linda Stustman) writes:

Previous stuff about crash-related problems and high dealer prices deleted.

>and labor. Another problem that drove me bananas was a bad oxigen sensor.
>The car was stalling. Toyota could not diagnose this in 6 tries (3 different 

My '86 MR2's O2 sensor also went bad at approx. 58kmiles but the computer
caught it and flashed the dashboard warning (see manual for details).

>The front brakes are slightly warped (common), needs new rotors, warpage is
>due to the assholes with impact wranches doing the tires (keep lug nuts at
>Now, really finally:-) Mr2's are known for bizzare front end shimmy, uncurable
>by any tire balance or anything of this Universe. Annoying, but I live with it.

I've never heard of rotor warpage on MR2's but the overtightened and poorly
tightened (non-uniform) will cause a front end shimmy.  I have no problem
with mine when I tighten them carefully and evenly.

>76 lb-ft). I had all 4 struts changed (yep 4 McPhearsons all around in MR2)
>Not cheap, $300 for mediocre Monroe struts. (they're OK for street, but they're
>no Koni's).

I changed all 4 with Tokiko non-adjustables and Tokiko springs for a total
parts cost of $440 (US).  They are an excellent compromise between
handling and street "comfort".

> And finally, the car burns a bit of oil (1qt/1000mi), and lifters
>are very loud, even with 93.5 octane gas used.

Very true. Maybe our cars were ragged by their former owners.

>Oh, BTW, '85 is the best-handling year of the bunch, due to rear anti-sway bar
>and also seems to be best-equipped.

From what the Toyota parts dealer told me, there was a rear bar in '85,
it was dropped for '86 (and maybe '87) then was brought back.  I installed
Suspension Techniques adjustable front and rear bars on my '86 and they
are excellent.

Just MHO,
Jeff
--
Jeff Burney                     SES, Inc.  301-439-6617        
jburney@seamis1.gsfc.nasa.gov   NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center 
jburney@argos.nodc.noaa.gov	NOAA/National Oceanographic Data Center
From: aas7@po.CWRU.Edu (Andrew A. Spencer)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: GEO METRO
Date: 16 Oct 1992 23:28:07 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc12.ins.cwru.edu


#1:no such thing as a v3 big guy..think on it..
#2: no car sold in the US has a v4..only motorcycles..and not all 
that many of those..I3 and I4..6,8,10,12 are the only #'s sold in 
v configs...some 16's in the days of old...think onit..
DREW
-- 
So my last quote was way off...i screwed it up.. i'll come up with 
a new one sometime soon....
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: W10572@maccvm.corp.mot.com (Timothy Palka)
Subject: Re: 33 Chevy Kicks Fords Ass Again!
Organization: Motorola
Date: 7 Oct 1992 12:49:24 CDT

------------------------- Original Article -------------------------
I see that Chevy has come out with the new Camaro and Firebird / (Z28 and T/A).

Both are nice cars...for some reason the Firebird looks nicer then the Camaro
           Marshal Perlman <> Florida Institute of Technology
                    ***** perlman@zach.fit.edu *****
               Private Pilot - Airplane Single-Engine Land
________________________ IN REPLY_______________________________________



Since When did chevy ever make a firebird? IF you are going to insult
some one at least get your fact straight.


timp-----
From: wrat@unisql.UUCP (wharfie)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Saab 900i Problems?
Date: 14 Oct 92 18:34:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: unisql.3962
Organization: UniSQL, Inc., Austin, Texas, USA

In article <3731@key.COM> srj@key.COM (Scott R. Johnson) writes:
>If I'm getting 12 to 1 buy versus don't buy ratio, that's pretty telling

	Ever think that it might mean that 8.33% of their cars are lemons?

	Everyone, from Consumer Reports on, says that Saabs have more
than their share of problems and are amongst the most expensive cars to
keep on the road.  
								wr
From: ward@m.cs.uiuc.edu (Christ Ward)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Corrado SLC or 325is?
Date: 14 Oct 92 22:18:47 GMT
Article-I.D.: m.1992Oct14.221847.23047
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL

humpty@tartarus.uwa.edu.au (Daniel Ong) writes:

>eliot@stalfos.engr.washington.edu (eliot) writes:

>>In article <12110060@nmitd4.sr.hp.com> jcf@nmitd4.sr.hp.com (Jim Fuller) writes:
>>>   Let's see... The VW is faster, handles better, is more distinctive and
>>>   costs $10,000 less.  I don't see where there's much of a choice.  Buy
>>>   the Corrado.

>>Today I saw what I thought was a 4 door maroon colored BMW 325i.  It
>>wasn't until I came up close that I realized it was the latest Honda
>>Civic.  This is the side view that I'm talking about.  Has this
>>happened to anybody else?


>>eliot

>Hey Elliot,
>        wake up and smell the coffee! It occured to me that a 4-dr BMW
>looks like a 2-dr BMW, but a civic to a BMW, GET REAL! Not anyone from
>Australia or even Germany would beleive you that or is it some eye
>problem? ASK FOR A GOOD DOCTOR! YOU NEED A GOOD ONE! 

I don't think eliot need's a doctor.  I also think the new civic's look
like a down sized version of the new Bimmer.  I couldn't believe it, after
seeing the new bimmer, I see this civic ad: very similar IMHO.  I also 
would opt for the VW Corrado in this case and if I wanted more room I'd
go for a Passat.  Still it's your bucks (and lots of them), so forget 
what we say and go drive both (plus others) then let us know what you did
and why.

Oh and I was smelling the coffee I was drinking as I wrote this...

ward 
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mark@wdcwdc.sps.mot.com (Mark Shaw)
Subject: Re: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Organization: Motorola Western MCU Design Center, Chandler Arizona
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 22:25:35 GMT

In article <1bkt9vINN3eo@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, aas7@po.CWRU.Edu (Andrew A. Spencer) writes:
|> 
|> Ok..no editor to quote with, so bear along..i am referring to the
|> article in which someone named vikas quotes someone named stephan
|> john..the article number on my system is 71445.  hope you all can
|> follow this..
|> 
|> V states that S's method was unreliable, using a stopwatch..i'd 
|> not argue with that, though sometimes it's the only way some of
|> us even have a chance to get an educated guess..however, this is 
|> not the part to which i wish to gain a response..i wish to ask 
|> about his reasoning instead..V states that he thinks that speedos
|> tend to lag under acceleration.  V says to try it out on some 
|> REAL cars...that you should accelerate to a given (read) speed 
|> according to the speedo..then pop it into neutral and watch the
|> speedo rise above the indicated stopping point, his arguement
|> (reasoning, should i have called it..sorry if i stepped on toes)
|> being that when the car is shifted into neutral, it will no longer
|> accelerate.  Now, i'm not necessarily qualified in these fields, but
|> i would like to place a counter argument..I would draw an analogy
|> to a person jumping off of the ground.  The time the person leaves
|> the ground, the only accleratory force acting on hime is gravity.
|> This is the limiting factor of height of a vertical jump.  Thus,
|> the moment of leaving the ground= shifting into neutral.  Now, 
|> as i have stated above, the force of gravity is what causes a vert
|> jump velocity to reach zero.  However, gravity does not (in ideal
|> physics..forgive me for a moment) play any part in horizontal 
|> motion. 

Well, this is interesting.  It is true that the speedo lags the true
speed of the car in most vehicles (especially those with cable-driven
mechanical types).  The test of popping the car into neutral may be
a little value in showing this.  The real phenomenom is due to the 
drag cup in the speedo trying to follow the every increasing rotation
of the magnet on the speedo cable.  It just doesn't follow exactly.
Part of this is desired so that the speedo will average out cable
speed variations and give a smooth action.  Speedo cable actually
"whip" in a torsional mode since they are like long springs.

The electronic speedos which sense actual transmission speeds will
also lag due to designed in filtering to average out pulse variations
and possible electrical transients.

Despite these lags, if you use a stop watch and the same car with the
same speedo, you can pretty accurately measure variations in acceleration
rates.  This is not too valid between different cars (even of same 
manufacture.

mark
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: ehawrysh@bnr.ca (Evan Hawrysh)
Subject: Re: Mustang GT vs. Mustang LX 5.0
Reply-To: ehawrysh@bnr.ca
Organization: Bell Northern Research Ltd
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 12:51:34 GMT

In article 12683@philabs.philips.com, sew@philabs.philips.com (Scott E. Wakeman) writes:
> 
>   An 85 GT and a 88 LX are one in the same other than the 88 have more torque and
>  
>  HP. The 88 also has mass air sensors and stock 3.08 gears. I think the 85 had
> 
>  mid 2 gearing. 
> 
> 
>   -----
>   scott

Not all '88s have the mass air flow sensors, at least mine doesn't. I thought
it was introduced on the '89s. Can someone confirm this?

Evan

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mbeaving@bnr.ca (Michael Beavington)
Subject: Re: Exotic Cars
Reply-To: MBEAVING@BNR.CA
Organization: BNR Ottawa, DMS Software Design
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 00:35:48 GMT

In article <39480@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>, dlou@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Dennis Lou) writes:
|> Lambo Diablo.  I've seen Countachs (judging by the valve clatter, it was
|> probably the 48 valve), Testarossas, Daytonas, tons of 308/328/348, etc.  Heck, I 

I see a Countach almost every day when my neighbour pulls out of his
driveway. I swear that car is so low to the ground, he just slides
it under the garage doors.

Actually the height was a real benefit a last year when
some teens managed to get their hands on a gun and took a couple 
of shots into his garage.  The aim was perfect, striking the second
panel of the garage door...fortunately that was about 1 inch above the 
roof of the car.  He was pretty worried since the deductable was $25,000!


=============================================================================
= The Beav |Mike Beavington|BellNorthernResearch Ottawa,Ont,Canada| Dod:9733=
= Seca 400->Seca 400->RZ350->Seca750->Suzuki550->Seca650turbo->V65Sabre     =
= (-> 1994 GTS1000 ...can't afford the '93) |  mbeaving@bnr.ca              =
= Parking spaces? We don't need no steenkin' parking spaces!                =
=============================================================================
From: sontakke@helix.enet.dec.com (Vikas Sontakke)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Good/Bad Mazda Dealers?
Date: 9 Oct 92 17:02:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: engage.1992Oct9.160619.21210
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <2620056@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM>, lea00@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Larry Akers) writes...
> 
>    NO MO MADZA'z in my family EVER...  MADZA if you're listening
>

Let me get this.  Mazda corporation would not stand behind their products, so
out you went and bought a

			Ford

The paragon of customer satisfaction, NOT.

Vikas Sontakke		Digital Equipment Corporation, Maynard MA.
Internet:		sontakke@helix.enet.dec.com
    uucp:		{decvax,ucbvax,allegra}!decwrl!helix.enet!sontakke
			sontakke%helix.enet@decwrl.dec.com
From: tmkk@uiuc.edu (Khan)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: PC's vs. Mac's... was: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Date: 8 Oct 92 19:49:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.BvtJ27.LK4
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana


In article <1992Oct8.102732.1@camins.camosun.bc.ca> comptec91025@camins.camosun.bc.ca writes:
>In article <1211@xlnt.COM>, david@xlnt.com (David Johnson) writes:
>> bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ron Bense) writes:
>> way they drive on dry pavement. RWD is fine, and with a little knowledge/
>> preperation (such as adding a 50# bag of sand in the rear) they will
>               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>DON'T EVER DO THIS!!!!  If you are driving down the street with a 50 pound
>sack in your trunk, and hit the brakes hard, that 50 pound sack is going
>to fly right through the back seat into the occupants of the car!!

Perhaps - if your rear seat is made out of rice paper!

I left some kitty litter in the rear of my car (hatchback) because I was
too lazy to carry it upstairs with my hands full of groceries. It's gone
through at least one hard stop without flying anywhere. If I had a sedan
(with enclosed trunk) there would be even less chance of this happening.

Relax, people do this all the time, it's not a big life threatener. ;-)
From: wizard@bigwpi.WPI.EDU (Ajay Khanna)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Brakes--HELP!!!
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:58:16 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: bigwpi.wpi.edu

I'm a very depressed car owner.  Midas just told me they want 633.80 +
tax to fix my brakes.  Says me, "633 DOLLARS???"  Can anyone suggest a
more reasonable way to get brakes fixed?  I'm just out of college and
struggling to repay debts and really and truly cannot afford this.
I'm even willing to try to fix them myself.  The car is a Nissan
Sentra '81.  Apparently Midas wanted to fix front and rear brakes...

Any advice would be very much appeciated.  

kris
(borrowing the account of wizard@wpi.wpi.edu)
From: david.bonds@cutting.hou.tx.us (David Bonds) 
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Exotic Cars
Date: 14 Oct 92 14:25:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Cutting Edge - Houston, TX - 713-466-1525
Reply-To: david.bonds@cutting.hou.tx.us (David Bonds) 

  >
  >    Once saw an F40 while driving in Houston--no joke--it was real.
  >

I've seen a few NSXs, a Testarossa, and assorted "lesser" exotics, but
an F40?  Are those things even street legal?!?


- Dave Bonds 
- Internet : David.Bonds@cutting.hou.tx.us
---
 . KingQWK 2.00 .6 # 145 . Is your computer possessed?  Use DEVICE=EXOR.SYS
From: allen@cco.caltech.edu (Scott R. Allen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Volvo P1800 -- what's a good price?
Date: 8 Oct 1992 14:16:42 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: sandman.caltech.edu

In article <Oct.7.20.22.24.1992.19791@cesl.rutgers.edu> boubez@cesl.rutgers.edu (Toufic Boubez) writes:
>
>Hi There. I have the opportunity to acquire a 1965 P1800. I've always
>wanted one, but I never actually looked around actively for it, so I'm not
>sure about the current prices. It needs some body work (mainly surface
>rust, on first inspection). The owner claims the engine has been rebuilt,
>but only the carbs need to be synchronised. The interior is kinda in bad
>shape, but not _really_ bad (ie the seats steering wheel and major
>instruments are there, but the dashboard is a mess). How much would be a
>good offer? Thanks.

First of all, things to look for:  Rust.  Look for rust all over the
place.  Look inside the rim of the trunk lid.  Look inside the trunk
at the rear wheel wells.  Look on the side/bottom of the fender
just behind the front wheel.  Beneith the hinges for the front door
(along that bottom piece that runs along each side) their should 
be a place where the front fender is welded to the side piece -- 
in rust repair this is usually covered with bondo.  You SHOULD see
a line under the door hinges where two pieces join.  If you don't,
it has been repaired.  I would be curious why someone would rebuild
the engine and not "synch the carbs".  It should have two SU's which
assumedly aren't rebuilt.  They get pretty bad after a number of years
-- part of the problem is that when they get rebuilt most people don't
have the throttle shafts rebuilt.  The best solution is a weber kit
from IPD or other sources.  Unless you really like SU's, then you can
have them rebushed.  How much of a mess is the dash board?  Guages
and stuff like that are available.  Dash pads are a real problem to
get.  Arm rests for the doors are impossible to get (in good condition).
Seats, steering wheels, stuff like that is easy.  

If the car is NOT rusty it is worth about $2000 or so if it is complete.
BUT  finicially you would be much better off buying an 1800 that 
doesn't need paint and interior for maybe $3500/$4000 or so.  

I looked at about 15 1800's before finding a suitable replacement for
the one that got totaled in a car accident.  Finally found a really
good one for $3300.00.  No rust.  Good but old paint, good interior.
Plus I have a new dash pad that I am saving for the day when I have
the windshield replaced or the car repainted...

If you have questions, feel free to send me mail.

Scott
allen@cco.caltech.edu

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton)
Subject: Re: Im going to be sick...
Reply-To: dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 16:56:25 GMT

In article <DP00RB4w164w@cellar.org>, blu@cellar.org (Dan Reed) writes:
|> In (todays) USA today (Oct, 7th) on page 3A, there is a small article, "No 
|> Foreign Cars".
|> 
|> Drivers of foreign-made cars in the Flint. Mich., beware.  Begeining Monday 
|> only US made cars will be allowed in the City Hall Basement garage.  Flint 
|> Mayor Woodrow Stanley said he issued the order to send a message to buy 
|> American.  And he says he might designate other city lots for US only cars.  
|> General Motors is the city's largest employer with 50,000 local workers, 
|> whose taxes, Satnley says, help pay city workers' salaries.
|> 
|> (reprinted without perm.  All typos-gram errors be mine.)
|> 
|> As I said... I feel sick.. is THIS what it has come to?  How long before I 
|> get beat up for driving my VW to work?  Or my mother, grandmother, and 
|> friends who *all* drive "Non US Made cars"?  This is really sick, and has 
|> gone too far.  The American people are NOT to blame for lacking US auto 
|> sales, but rather the US Automakers, who *still* refuse to get the picture of 
|> what a *good* car is.

Time for a MAJOR flame...

Doesn't the U.S. have a Constitution guaranteeing individual rights?  Tell me,
can you park a Dodge Stealth but not a Mitsibushi RT?  How about all the Honda
Civics and Accords built in Canada/U.S.?  What about Geos?  How about the Asuna
(from Japan/Russia)?  How about all those Chysler Minivans built in Canada?
Man, and I thougt Canada had some really stupid politicians!

When is your government going to get it through their thick skulls that your
country also exports things!  You ban us (or Japan/Germany/whatever) - we ban
you (most of those 'Japanese' attacks strike at Canada, not Japan, because we
build most of it - and we are your biggest export destination).

This just proves that the Canada/U.S. and Canada/U.S./Mexico free trade 
agreements aren't worth the paper that the U.S. government signed.  I sincerily
hope that Canada moves more of it's trade to Europe/Asia/where-ever so that
we can stop dealing with your politicians/culture.

And people call me a read-neck because I'm from Alberta.  BTW, this post is
not an attack on you or any other U.S. citizen - just your politicians and
the culture that feeds them.

Even dumber than the head of the KKK running for office!

Don Clayton
a.k.a. Rear-Adm. Maverick, DM of the Drow
My brain, my thoughts, my words.
If I had a million dollars, I'd buy you a K-car (a nice reliant automobile),