HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jjohnson@ccscola.Columbia.NCR.COM (Jeffrey H. Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: GURPS: Alien races -- Too powerful?
Keywords: GURPS Aliens Space
Date: 29 Jul 92 12:33:44 GMT
Organization: NCR CCSD Columbia SC

In article <1992Jul28.063307.25962@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu> gil@smtc21.engr.scarolina.edu (Gil Young) writes:
>   It has occured to me that perhaps GURPS Aliens (and Fantasy Races,
>for that matter) have an edge over normal humans:  "What is that?"
>you ask.  Attrubutes and Disads.  Let me give an example of how 
>useful this could be:
>  I decide to make a Gerodian with ST 8, DX 13, IQ 16, and HT 9.
>Gerodians receive a -1 to ST, +3 to IQ, and -1 to HT, as well as
>Eidetic Memory/1, and it costs 10 points to play one.  It costs
>another 50 points to get the attributes I want, and I've spent 
>60 points on a really good set of stats and have another 40 points,
>plus 45 in disads and quirks.  If I wanted to be a human with those
>stats and Eidetic Memory/1, It would cost me (-15+30+80-10+30=115)
>points.  Now admittedly, the Gerodian point cost is moderated by
>35 points in disads and a couple of skills I may not want, but I'm
>sure you get the picture:  What I've done is gotten a point break
>on stats and an extra 35 points in disads.  What do you GURPS players
>think about this?

The first and most obvious (to me) solution would be to eliminate the
attribute modifications altogether, or (to achieve the same effect)
apply the modification first and have players buy levels from that (e.g.,
to bring your character from the Gerodian norm of IQ 13 to IQ 16 would cost
45 pts instead of 30).  

>   Before you start thinking I'm just dumping this in your lap, I'll
>tell you my thoughts on the matter:
>  First and most obvious is to limit the number of points in personal
>disads the alien character can have.  One way is to reduce the points
>in disads by the amount saved on stats.  For instance, Gerodian man
>saved 25 points on stats, so he could only have (40-25=) 15 points
>in personal disads.  The other way is by an arbitrary, GM-set amount.
>I'm sure this list is far from exhaustive.  What do y'all think?

Another approach is the unlimited disad approach (which I noticed in one
of Stefan O'Sullivan's posts, but was attributed to someone else).  In
this method, the player gets 145 pts to buy attributes, advantages and
skills.  He is free to take (or not to take) whatever disads and quirks
he likes.  As an extension to this logic, playing a race costs the total
of that race's attribute modifications, advantages, and inherent skills.
The disadvantages do not affect the racial cost.

>
>Thanks in advance,
>	Gil Young
>	gil@smtc21.engr.scarolina.edu

You're welcome,
Jeff
--
Jeffrey H. Johnson
jjohnson@ccscola.columbiasc.ncr.com

		"More human than human is our motto."
			-- Dr. Eldon Tyrell
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim)
Subject: Re: Champions
Reply-To: jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 17:57:19 GMT

wwallace@ucrengr.ucr.edu (wayne wallace) writes:
[cc Hero doing reality]
>FORBID RESISTANT DEFENSE. If no one has any defense against killing attacks,
>which all swords and guns are, the average 2d6 killing attack does 7
>body, and for an avg. 10 body character (body is hit points for bleeding.
>another characteristic, stun, takes care of consciousness), he's looking
>bad. 
...
>
>HERO does realism just fine. And if your characters have fantasy or science
>fiction armor, of course, the damage will be lessened a bit. Of course,
>due to encumbrance, the armor usually won't cover ALL of the body so it
>could be ignored if someone has enough plusses to hit to call a shot to
>an unarmored area. 

	I am highly in favor of the Hero system, and I have used it for a 
realistic game with superpowers - but there are a number of points where 
realism breaks down, because of the emphasis on heroic activity. 

There are only a few points in the mechanics which I consider inherently 
unrealistic:
1) Humans have an unrealistically large amount of body compared to inanimate 
   objects. 
2) DCV has an unrealistically large effect on missle weapons - i.e. someone 
   who has a 90% chance to hit a human-sized target (DCV 0) at a given range 
   would have only a 2% chance of hitting a dodging DEX20 character (DCV10). 
3) And human range characteristics are not distinguished very much, i.e. 
   there is no real functional difference between a 13 and a 14 INT.
4) Damage is scaled with the log of energy, generally. So an attack eight 
   times as powerful is 3 Damage Classes more. Overwhelmingly large attacks 
   might not be as overwhelming as they should be. 

	These are not that important. What is more important for running a 
realistic game is not being influenced by the flavor and campaign advice in 
the rulebooks. 
	If you do this, Hero can be quite playable and reasonably realistic 
in comparison to other games. It is not as detailed or exactingly researched 
as some games, but it works and it's fun. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Kim                    | "Remember: a running man may slit a thousand
jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu | throats in a single night."
Columbia University         |                            - Klingon proverb
From: paul@sco.COM (Paul Jackson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Gurps Supers is still broken
Date: 29 Jul 92 19:56:20 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: SCO Canada, Inc.

In article <1992Jul26.193644.246@ccsvax.sfasu.edu> a_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu writes:
>	This [system supports only deadly campaigns] is bad? :-)
>	As written, without optional rules, GURPS Supers *is* geared for a
>gritty street-level campaign. Are you complaining because they were successful
>at what they were trying to do? :-)

Yes, I guess that I am. The book certainly does not make obvious the fact
that most characters created under its rules will have the life expectency of
a rich Orc. Given the large amount of time and effort required to build a
SuperHero in GURPS I certainly don't like regularly killing characters.

Ok, I'll slightly alter my original statement to:

Gurps Supers still has many numerical flaws, some of which are glaringly
obvious and some of which aren't. It also has systemic features that make it
useable only in a limited set of superheroic campaign types (deadly ones or
ones where high tech armour is winning the arms race against high tech
weaponry). If you're willing to expend the time and energy to fix the former
and want to run one of the restricted set of campaign types then it is
probably useable. But, as written, it is still an incredibly poorly balanced
game.
From: djohnson@cs.ucsd.edu (Darin Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: New Name for Flesh Golem wanted!
Date: 26 Jul 92 17:51:10 GMT
Reply-To: djohnson@ucsd.edu (Darin Johnson)
Organization: =CSE Dept., U.C. San Diego

>>> Okay all you creative net-types! I need a new name for Flesh Golems!

Do you really need a name?  If the players have never seen one before
(and most likely, won't see another for another eon) it won't matter.
Villagers, if questioned, will just call it "monster", or in medieval
times, some might call it "demon".

-- 
Darin Johnson
djohnson@ucsd.edu
    "Only Nixon could go to China"  -- Vulcan proverb
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: nexus@ylum.cgd.ucar.edu (Jeff Berry)
Subject: Re: Throw away your greatsword! ( Big vs. Small Weapons )
Organization: Climate and Global Dynamics Division/NCAR, Boulder, CO
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:47:58 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.160111.17594@colorado.edu> juola@bruno.cs.colorado.edu (Patrick Juola) writes:
>SCA fighting isn't a good example; they have the infamous 90 degree rule
>(no swing can be through more than 90 degrees), exactly to prevent this
>sort of blow, since no armor that people would be willing to wear can
>stand up to this sort of punishment.  (The same rules applies to pole
>arms, btw.)
>Most of the time, in a 1 on 1 combat, a greatsword fighter will try to keep
>his weapon in front of her (between her and the opponent).  In any sort

Well, the 90 degree rule doesn't actually apply to Greatswords, my weapon
style of choice, but is limited to pole-weapons.

The crucial point, as mentioned is the level of abstraction invloved.
As long as a single enemy is 5 or 6 feet away, then the weapon is likley to
be held extended, with the striking done at the end.  When the range closes,
the weapon tends to be choked up on the ricasso, the striking surface moves
down about 3 feet on the blade, and one had better have some room to move it
to the left and the right.


badger                                      Don Alexandre Lerot d'Avigne
Jeff Berry                                  Seneschal of Caer Galen, Outlands
               nexus@ncar.ucar.edu
NCAR doesn't tell me what to think, and I return the favor.
"You're a notch and I'm a legend"-------Alice Cooper
"You're still doing the things that I gave up years ago.."-----Lou Reed
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: PCHEM14@Zeus.unomaha.edu (FALL88)
Subject: Re: Champions
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 17:22:26 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.11

joshua writes:

> 
> 	This weekend I was considering buying Champions, it looks good to me...
> Is it a good investment? Flaws, Exceptional Parts?
> 				Anyone?

If I could sum up Champions in as few words as possible, I'd say:
(1) It's greatest strength is that it gives you the basic mechanical
    components of the game, letting you create almost anything on your
    own without having to enslave yourself to 'sourcebooks' and the 
    like.
(2) It's greatest flaw is that the same full control over the game
    can lead to abuses of the game by certian players.  This is a big
    problem when not all the players do this (when you have rules-
    rapists and normal players, the normals are 'underpowered'.)

-james
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
From: doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Genres
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:10:59 GMT
Reply-To: doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu
Organization: Department of Chemistry, UCLA

You're missing the point.  What differs about the walking rhythm is the
FREQUENCY of steps.  If you have a computer that can scale TIME as it happens,
what do you need a silly mech for?

-Doug Gibson
 doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu

Neither UCLA nor the National Science Foundation has a clue what I am doing.
They just pay me to do it.

"We have to tear you to shreds because we care." - EAC
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: schrey@oak.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Timothy M. Schreyer)
Subject: Re: New Name for Flesh Golem wanted!
Organization: Paramax Systems
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 22:03:11 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.212631.11770@unislc.uucp>, stv@unislc.uucp (Steve Spencer) writes:
|> ericg@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (E. Chris Garrison) writes:
|> : 
|> : As far as I know, your bit about the legend is correct, but "Gollum"
|> : from J.R.R. Tolkien has nothing to do with it, he was just a wizened,
|> : Ring-warped old Hobbit-kin.
|> : 

|> Nope, nope nope. The origin of the creature called a Golem is from the mideast.
|> The are legends about a Golem created out of clay. There are some fairly
|> good books about it at your local library. Also, contrary to what many
|> people might think, Tolkien did not come up with orcs simply out of his own
|> imagination. In fact, other than hobbit (and there are people who have
|> proff that he didn't even make up that one), none of those were really
|> straight out of his imagination.
|> 
   Yes, yes, yes.  It is true that Tolkien's monster races' names were
   already around.  Orcs come from the same root as Orca the killer whale.
   An orc is a monster, usually a sea monster.

   Gollum, however, is the creature's name not the race's.  In _The_Hobbit_
   it says explicitly that Gollum was named by the sound he made when he
   swallowed.  It was a big, gulping, swallowing sound.  We learn elsewhere
   in Tolkien's works that Gollum's original name was Smeagol and that he
   was a member of a small race related to hobbits.

   Gollum has nothing to do with golems from the ancient mideast.

-- 
 Timothy M. Schreyer                         schrey@prc.unisys.com
 Center for Advanced Information Technology  (215) 648-2475 
 Paramax Systems Corporation                 FAX: (215) 648-2288
 PO Box 517, Paoli, PA 19301
From: v131p9t3@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Ninstar Cybermage - Back Again from the Mists!)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Military Mechs? Hexapod
Date: 29 Jul 92 19:39:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

>A walking tank has the benefit of being able to step over obstacles that
>would stop a tracked tank.

Few though those may be.  Keep in mind that if a tank doesn't go over it it 
goes THROUGH it.  Still a Mech can step over those few obstacles that can stop
a tank.  And can possibly climb them if necessary.  Do that with a standard 
tank track!

(Here it comes...The rumble of many feet of people to tell me about specially
equipped treads)

James Shank           	#		v131p9t3@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
AKA: Ninstar Cybermage  #	or	shank@acsu.buffalo.edu
###############################################################################
"Ten thousand years old...He could be trouble." -Vampire Hunter D
"Every night I say a prayer, in the hope that there's a heaven..."-Styx
"How do you make ammends for a god's sins?"-Forgotten Realms
##############################################################################
Sneaky Types,Inc.:Clandestine operations for the common man.
	"Don't call us.  We'll just bill you when it's done."
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: phatch@storm.slc.mentorg.com (Phill Hatch (CONTRACTOR Documentation))
Subject: Re: Magic system idea
Followup-To: Magic system idea
Organization: Mentor Graphics Corp.,  Murray, Utah
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 15:53:31 GMT

An acquaintance of mine in High School did a similar thing twelve years ago.  He called it
magical fritction.  The caster accumulated a charge that attracted other magical effects
towards the caster, tended to interfere with the casters next spells at higher charge levels,
modified saving throws negatively and so on.

Magic items also created magical friction when employed.  The party's paladin with the
Holy Avenger had his share of difficulties with Magical friction as well.  

I know the friction concept affected magical creatures too, but I don't know the specifics.
We kept hearing about a certain lich though....

Phil
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Military Mechs?
From: a_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Date: 26 Jul 92 16:49:42 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

In article <UeQRWRi00VpE0jzuUh@andrew.cmu.edu>, William Henry Timmins <wt0b+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 	<1992Jul25.002200.1503@news.columbia.edu>
> Lines: 10
> 
> Mechs rely on a different motor than tanks, which are better??
> 
> WHY? If mech motors are better, why not build a tank using it?

	This is one of those game kludges that BT uses to make the mechs
inherently superior to other vehicles without giving any justification.
Supposedly, a tank (for example) has to increase the mass of its reactor
by 50% to properly shield it. Does this mean that mechs have *unshielded*
reactors? Also, I completely disagree with the doubling of engine mass for an
ICE: I tried to build a tank the weight and speed of an M-1A1 --  and the
engine weighed about *10* times what it does in reality!!! Even counting
transmission, fuel, and peripherals, this is rediculous. 
	Also, VTOLs have *pathetic* speed.

	Face it, the people at FASA did absolutley no research before putting
the system out...

Brandon Cope
From: u9035281@cs.uow.edu.au (Paul John Davis)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: SURVEY: Magazine
Date: 23 Jul 92 03:09:47 GMT
Organization: Dept of Computer Science, Wollongong University, Australia




	To complete this survey, just press 'r'.
	Before sending this survey, remember to save it so I don't get a blank
copy.
	The range of answers is from 1 [none/bad] to 10 [yesyes/really 
excellent].
	Thank you for your help.

   	Paul Davis, [RENEGADE]	u9035281@wraith.cs.uow.edu.au
	University of Wollongong Simulation Games Secretary

THINGS YOU WISH TO SEE IN A MAGAZINE FOR GAMING!

Magazine- content:

Games to see articles/scenerios on:
	[Note: before slash is for articles. After slash is for scenerios]


	AD&D [2nd edition]:	/
	Twilight 2000	:	/
	Cyberpunk 2020	:	/
	Shadowrun	:	/
	Vampire		:	/
	Hero System	:	/
	MERP/Rolemaster	:	/
	Call of Chuthlu	:	/
	Chill		:	/
	Warhammer 40k	:	/
	Warhammer FRPG	:	/
	Warhammer Epic	:	/
	Paranoia	:	/
	Tales of the Floating
		Vagabond:	/
	GURPS		:	/
	MegaTraveller	:	/
	Battletech	:	/
	Others[please name]
			:	/
			:	/

General areas for articles:

	Joint articles [eg Scenerios for more than one system.]:
	Miniatures	:
	Reviews		:
	Interviews	:
	What's new	:
	Books		:
	Comics[review]	:
	Comics[in mag]	:        type[serious/funny etc]:
	Atmosphere	:
	Helpful hints	:
	PBM		:
	Live Roleplay	:
	Freeforms	:
	Clubs list	:
	Con list	:
	Theme issues	:

	Others
			:
			:


	Thanks again

-- 
   	Paul Davis, [RENEGADE]	u9035281@wraith.cs.uow.edu.au
	University of Wollongong Simulation Games Secretary
	"You can't be dead. 		Yet.
	 I've still got more bullets left."	 Maverick in Xmen 11
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: ins769v@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au (Veltyen)
Subject: Re: Genres
Organization: Monash University
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 12:40:56 GMT

JLOCK00@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU (Joseph L. Lockett) writes:
:      That's still a kludge -- you'd get timing problems right and left.
: By the time you've changed the pilot's sensory inputs enough so that the
: sensory feedback (which seems to be the ONLY possible justification given
: for mech vs. tank) matches what he'd expect -- okay, I've raised my left
: leg. Okay, I feel that. Okay, that jives with what I see outside the
: cockpit window -- haven't you spent enough and crammed in enough delicate
: hardware that it's just plain simpler to use a tank?
:  
: Joseph L. Lockett
: jlock00@ricevm1.rice.edu

Hmmm try an alternative idea.
Steal the idea from "adeptus titanicus"
(more giant robots)
Seems that the robots are sentient with various animal "personalities"
running the titan (mech equivalent).
They also have gunners for all the weapons and pilots who tell
the bear, wolf, etc persolalities what to do.
Means the sentient part of the titan is slowed down to more appropriate
speeds.



*****************************************************************************
*Veltyen   ....GM from Hell        *" As a child I always wanted a puppy,   *
*ins769v@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au *  then again, we were starving anything *
*ins769v@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au   *  with meat on it would have done."     *
*veltyen@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au	   *      Captain Vimes, City Watch         *
*****************************************************************************
From: mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu (Mark A. Baxter)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re:Mythus of GDW
Date: 30 Jul 92 16:58:08 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


   Reviews of mythus can be found in rec.games.frp.advocacy for those
who wish to get the scoop before plunking down their money.  They've
been going on for about a week now so they could be rotated out soon.  A
public service announcement

Mark Baxter              |One is for sorrow,
<mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu>   |Two is for joy,
ext #4690                |Three for a girl,
                         |Four a boy,
         I               |Five is for silver,
       Have              |Six is for gold,
         A               |And Seven's a secret
      Secret             |Never to be told.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly)
Subject: Re: SR: Blood 'n guts games
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 03:37:07 GMT

"Mark A. Baxter" <mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>and the non-fighting types, with each pushing for the spotlight.  This
>is one thing D&D WAS able to avoid by giving everyone combat abilities. 
>SR, by contrast, has characters like deckers, the rocker(!?), the ganger
>and others, who were not specifically designed for combat and therefore
>are left behind when combat starts.  My last GM, who had GMed shadowrun
>for a long time, said that in his last campaign they'd had only mages
>and hadn't missed the difference.  He would simply have a decker NPC to
>work for them.  Now admittedly this edges toward munchkinism.  My point
>is, players shouldn't have to sit on their hands while one character
>gets to deck, or go astral scouting, or FIREFIGHT.  

The major kink I see in the SR system is how fast the wiz's can go.
They already can nuke any character not a mage due to their magic
pool, focuses, and totem dice (I think that while these are a neat
roleplaying idea, they are the most abused item in SR. I hate seeing
people playing Shaman's for the dice and not bothering to roleplay.
If you can't roleplay well, play a hermetic.) If the mages go at 
a reasonable time (say Imp Reaction +1), there aren't more than
2 samurai in the group, this is when I have seen that the system
works well. I played for a while last year and the highest Reaction
boost was Wired Reflexes 2. I've already posted about the quicksilver
style my current campaign has. I liked it the other way IMHO. One PC
going for 3 actions isn't that bad. Yes, I like the samurai to be 
slightly faster than the mages, it just gives a "tech" feel to things.
In these circumstances, the slower characters will get a chance to make 
a legitimate contribution to the combat. Combat will also last longer
than 1 turn, and mages will be able to make a good contribution without
blowing every other character type of the water.

I would suggest for beginning GM's that you restrict mages to Increase
Reaction +1 and beginning Samurai to Wired Reflexes 2. Also, PA's should
be kept to Increase Reaction +2 (I think it's quite a ripoff that they
get Increased Reaction +3 for only 4 magic points -way too cheap.)

Axly
From: sl9b4@cc.usu.edu (Deep Six)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Genres
Date: 21 Jul 92 11:45:24 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

I'm glad I'm not the only one that thinks this battle tech stuff is 
kinda hokey. While I haven't played any of the associated rpgs, I've 
seen most of the movies which portray the battle tech concept. I just
never understood why these machines had to have human features. What's
wrong with tank tech? How come the battle tech machines have to 
walk up to each other to fight? Haven't they heard of projo's or 
ballistic missiles? It looks like a fun game to play, I have to admit,
but I don't think I'd be able to play without constantly questioning
the concept. Too many holes.

Okay,
--                                              __  __   ______   __  __ 
Chadd  L. VanZanten  SL9B4@CC.USU.EDU   +   /\ \/\ \ /\  ___\ /\ \/\ \
``Gentlemen!  You  can't  fight in here,   +   \ \ \_\ \\ \___  \\ \ \_\ \
this is the War Room!''                    +    \ \_____\\/\_____\\ \_____\
     --Stanley Kubrick's Dr. Strangelove   +     \/_____/ \/_____/ \/_____/ 
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc