HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
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Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 09:52:11 -0800
Comments:     Warning -- original Sender: tag was msyverso@UCSD.EDU
From:         "(Peg Syverson)" <msyverson@UCSD.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Multimedia and hypermedia

> But if you think about it, students could create their
>own hypermedia/multimedia "papers" like that, just like Collette Diaute talks
>about in her _Language Arts_ article on Multimedia Composing. Granted, the
>end result of the Ulysses is "smooth as buttah" but that is the nature of the
>demo. I showed it to my students to illustrate what "could" be done with an
>multimedia system through an authoring program that doesn't require knowing
>a computer language. Obviously they have to start from the ground up to be
>able to even create semi-intelligent programmed instruction. But they were
>excited, and willing to start from that ground level. It's just kinda hard
>when you don't have the equipment...but we make do.


Wendy-

Thought you might be interested in my recent experience in this area.
While I use the computer primarily as a fancy word processor, my
twelve-year-old son sees it as an environment, an electronic construction
site. He recently turned in a social studies paper on Inca art and culture,
done on his Mac.  He created drawings of Inca pottery in a 3-d drawing
program, drew the geometric decorations in MacPaint and "wrapped" them
around the 3-d drawings, then rotated the drawing, creating an animation
sequence that he transferred into Quicktime.  He also imported sounds (the
rainforest, gunfire from the Spanish conquerors, South American indigenous
flute music).  He wrote the text and laid out the pages in MS Word,
embedded in the report the video clips showing the pottery rotating in 3
dimensions, and also embedded the sound effects.  The final report is a
multimedia production which does not simply drop in gee-whiz effects, but
interweaves text, animation, and sound in a rather sophisticated
presentation.  Although he turned in the print version, I had to take his
computer to school in order to present it properly. He has had his Mac six
months.
This is not a futuristic fantasy.  This is now.  The nature of rhetoric and
composition has already changed.  We are going to need to deal with
audiovisual argumentation, multimedia expression, hypertext, and electronic
communication and we will have to teach students the languages of images,
video, sound, and text as they interact in new and surprising ways.  What a
world!
Peg Syverson, msyverso@ucsd.edu
Dimensions of Culture, 0525, UCSD, La Jolla, CA 92093
(619) 558-1514
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Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 11:51:34 -0500
From:         R_CONNORS@UNHH.UNH.EDU
Subject:      RE: query

Catherine, you might check out a book on nature writers--I can't come up
with the title right now--edited by Owen Grumbling.  The men's movement
literature, esp. Sam Keen's *Fire in the Belly* as well as a lot of the
mythopoetic men's stuff--see the Wingspan anthology that just came out--
talks about men's relationships with nature and how men have mostly accepted
the old Mother Earth/Father Sky dichotomy that's so destructive.

SOunds fascinating.  Good luck with it.

Bob C.
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Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:16:57 CST
From:         ellis <nse2@RA.MSSTATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: stretch and jumbo comp classes

Jim, I've put in an interlibrary loan request for the Shaughnessy
book.
Nancy
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Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:11:02 CST
From:         Irvin Peckham <peckham@CWIS.UNOMAHA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: love letter
              92 4:30 pm

Stan:
What to do about the conversation:  I'm having something of the
same problem.  I'm becoming a fast reading and expert with the
d button.  I would appreciate more strategies that would help
me save my marriage.
Irv
--
Irvin Peckham
Internet: peckham@unomaha.edu
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Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 21:35:16 MST
From:         "David E. Schwalm" <IACDES@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Clinton/Gore

From: David E. Schwalm
It will be really interesting to have a president whose views of world affairs
were shaped by Viet Nam rather than WWII. It's also nice to have a president
who is younger than I am and who probably can boogie without looking like an
old dork.  There's a deficit of dancin'...

-- David E. Schwalm, Assoc. Provost for Academic Programs
___Arizona State University West
___4701 West Thunderbird Rd.
___Phoenix, AZ 85069-7100___(602) 543-4500
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Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 08:36:00 CST
From:         SLATIN@UTXVM.BITNET
Subject: is this the end of paper (long

Several years ago, in my first attempt to write about hypertext, I proposed
that hypertext was a natural environment (though I don't think I used that
word) for the liberal arts and for university education generally: my argument
was that we want our students to discover the complex interconnections both
within specific disciplines and among them, and that hypertext is designed for
precisely such purposes.  (BTW, I'm answering the long unsigned posting from
WPWP@PITTVM).  That's also the premise, I think, underlying Brown University's
Intermedia, which so far as I know remains the most ambitious attempt to date
to implement hypertext as a multidisciplinary environment for learning at a
university.  George Landow, in _Hypertext: The Convergence of Contemporary
Critical Theory and Technology_ (Johns Hopkins UP, 1992), is quite good on
this subject; his stuff is more fully worked out than mine was (I had never
used HT in a classroom when I wrote that first paper).  The citation for my
paper, if anyone's interested, is "Hypertext and the Teaching of Writing," in
_Text, Context, and HyperText_, ed. Edwrd Barrett (Cambridge: MIT Press,
1988).


John Slatin
UT Austin
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Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 09:11:06 CST
From:         Ellen Redding Kaler <KALER@UKANVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: is the end of "the paper" in sight?

If we're nervous about readers missing important links in hypertexts or
not reading enough, not reading it all,   aren't we fooling ourselves to
imagine that students currently read all or enough of the linear print texts an
d read actively enough to pick up conceptual links that may be embedded.  As  I
 understand HT, it makes those conceptual schemes more visible.  Readers contro
l more choice about what to follow. Similarly we never get to say it ALL in cla
ss discussions, but synch and asynch electronic discussions allow a richer mix
of participation.  Both forms of reading and writing level out power (control A
ND responsibility) to producers and receivers of texts, that is active readers
and reading writers.
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Date:         Thu, 5 Nov 1992 18:57:27 -0500
From:         Nick.Carbone@WRITING.UMASS.EDU
Subject:      Reply to Clinton/Gore

Of the candidates on Tuesday I prefered Clinton, but he troubles me.  I recall
when in the primaries there was a photo of him playing golf at a restricted
country club.  His response to the flak, at least as he was quoted in the
a.p. wire story I read, was something like, 'I shouldn't have done it, it didn't
look right.'   Further, reports from Arkansas were that he promised when running
for governor that he would not seek a higher office while serving.  This I read
in the Christian Science Monitor, or maybe NY Times, in an article that intervie
wed reporters who have covered Clinton.  In that article they asserted that
his assertion in the debate that he muffed his explanation of the draft
because he hadn't thought about it in all those years, but in reality it
has come up in every gubernatorial election he's run in.
   Now Bush of course had no bearings at all as far as the truth goes--he
got caught denying he had ever used the term voodoo economics, according to an
article in UTNE Reader by NBC.  He denied it and immediately after they played
a clip of him saying it.  So it goes.
     What niggles at my relief and abeys full blown hope most is the first
instance I sighted on Clinton--appears wrong?, didn't look right?--is a moral
stance based on what he can get away with?  But at least he can speak in
a complete sentence.
Nick.Carbone@writing.umass.edu
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Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 14:33:10 -1812
From:         rselfe@MTU.EDU
Subject:      Re: Foreign Languages?

>She can comment on people's use of the language
>immediately and she saves the transcript to review how people are doing
>with the language.  Ann Green

Ann, could I/we get a description of a class session or a transcript to
pass along to colleagues.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Dickie Selfe              rselfe@mtu.edu
Humanities Dept.          906-487-3225
Michigan Technological U.
Houghton, MI   49931
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Date:         Sat, 7 Nov 1992 19:53:12 EST
From:         Ann Green <USERTFSH@UMICHUM.BITNET>
Subject:      Does anyone know any of these folks?

Dickie, Carrie Regenstein heads up the Learning Technologies Program at
Cornell and has worked closely with Daryl Weiner from Apple to get this
program up and running.  Their first year consisted of workshops which
they wanted to gear toward teachers.  These lasted 2-3 days.  I attended
one on collaborative writing that Nancy Kaplan and Stuart Moulthrop
formed an important part of.  Ann/JCC
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Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 23:05:52 MST
From:         "David E. Schwalm" <IACDES@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Multimedia and hypermedia

From: David E. Schwalm
You don't necessarily have to cave in on TV. We didn't let our kids watch TV
when they were small. It's not that we had anything in particular against TV.
It's just that there were so many other neat things they could do instead of
sitting in front of the tube watching passively. They handle TV just fine,
nowadays. They can take it or leave it. They watch a favorite show and then
turn it off. Our son (17) the other day said that he didn't think much of our
TV rules at the time but now he was glad that we had them. Surprised the hell
out of me.

-- David E. Schwalm, Assoc. Provost for Academic Programs
___Arizona State University West
___4701 West Thunderbird Rd.
___Phoenix, AZ 85069-7100___(602) 543-4500
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Organization: Samford University Writing Programs
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Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:33:32 CST
From:         "David H. Roberts" <DHROBERT@SAMFORD.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: doctorial programs
              11 Nov 1992 09:33:59 -0600 from <tmmyers@IASTATE.EDU>

Tim Myers:
A number of good programs exist.  My suggestion is that you look into
Indiana University of Pennsylvania and Purdue programs.
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Date:         Sun, 8 Nov 1992 20:48:11 MST
From:         "David E. Schwalm" <IACDES@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Yankee Trader Needs Info

From: David E. Schwalm
Or, if you can't get rid of the word "remedial" on your campus, spread it
around a little. Since most students had Chemistry in high school, the intro
chemistry course is "remedial," as are the intro physics and biology courses.
The intro political science course and U. S. History are also remedial (kids
have had that material over and over again in high school), and let's not
forget intro to lit or the surveys--all "remedial." It seems unfair to me that
students who don't come in to college writing like college grads should be
dubbed in need of remediation when rehashing U. S. history or the basics of
chemistry is "real" college stuff. Rubbish.

-- David E. Schwalm, Assoc. Provost for Academic Programs
___Arizona State University West
___4701 West Thunderbird Rd.
___Phoenix, AZ 85069-7100___(602) 543-4500
From: NKAPLAN@UTDALLAS.BITNET
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Subject: Re: Multimedia and hypermedia
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:44:17 GMT
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>This is not a futuristic fantasy.  This is now.  The nature of rhetoric and
>composition has already changed.  We are going to need to deal with
>audiovisual argumentation, multimedia expression, hypertext, and electronic
>communication and we will have to teach students the languages of images,
>video, sound, and text as they interact in new and surprising ways.  What a
>world!
>Peg Syverson, msyverso@ucsd.edu
>Dimensions of Culture, 0525, UCSD, La Jolla, CA 92093
>(619) 558-1514

Just so, Peg, and so some of us have been arguing for a couple of years
now.  But we also need to come to terms with some differences here and with
our own (or at least my own) essential muteness in the face of the images.
If we could say what they are we wouldn't need to have them represented
graphically or in 3-D or whatever. So it seems to go without saying, to me
at least, that pictures and sounds are integral parts of the meaning-making
that goes on in everyday life. Yet, academe seems to value the word
primarily, to see illustration and sound effects as ancillary and
decorative (your son, after all, turned in a printed version, presumably
because that is what his teacher would know how to evalutate, but surely
the words in their singular stream could only be an impoverished subset of
his meaning). I think we need to examine carefully what roles and values we
(as teachers of composition) are willing to accord the tactile, the iconic,
the aural in the complex process of explaning something or arguing
something or constructing any other kind of discourse.

(When I gave a talk on hypermedia composing at a university in California 4
or 5 years ago, the teachers of business writing who were the majority of
my audience were uniformally disdainful of sounds and sights embedded in
"serious" work.)


Nancy Kaplan
University of Texas at Dallas
Box 830688
Richardson, TX  75083-0688

(214) 690-2071
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Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 00:52:58 EST
From:         "(Gary Beason)" <bubba@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Multimedia and hypermedia
              92 8:15 am

> But I found your message a fascinating one, Gary: I don't remember another
> occasion (on MBU) when students have been reported as defending text as a
> primary carrier of "truth."

John,

"Visual" is a very loose term; I've included page design as part of
visualization of a document.  I explain that the first point of
persuasion is that the audience considers the document readable, and
students, especially those who've worked in industry, back me up on
this point--dense pages are too formidable and violate, at least in
terms of impressions, the value of conciseness.

But then they see design as form only, and some students grudgingly
work on design, thinking that if the audience would just take the time
to read . . . .

I don't know, John, if your tech writing students also run this line
of thought by you--you do your work and put together your thoughts
before writing them.  That whole form/content thing.  But I use a
crude analogy:  the size and shape of the glass determine how much
beverage you get.

Their attitudes towards visuals in general are fuzzy to me, though.
For example, students conduct usability tests on documents and hear
that the users want more visuals.  But the writers continue to
emphasize the text.  Because they worked harder on the text?  Because
they see the text as more focused?  Visuals, particularly
illustrations, graphs, etc., are not immediately propositional
although they can be rendered into propositions.   But as presented,
do visuals seem to say too much?  Are they not as focused as text
(i.e., are visuals more ambiguous than text)?

I think their suspicion is more complex than that, perhaps even
contradictory.


BTW, John, how are the blues on 6th Street these days?  And is the
hype for the upcoming Cattle vs. Aggies game loud and unbearable yet?


-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
|
|   Gary Beason
|   Purdue University
|   bubba@mace.cc.purdue.edu
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Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 15:12:43 CST
From:         Irvin Peckham <peckham@CWIS.UNOMAHA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: synch/asynch
              92 7:52 am

John Slatin:
Your post electoral explosion gave me a nice feel for the
use of asynch communication (which, as a non-user, I have
at times thought overrated), folding it into a sequence
or writing activities that will help our students respond
with to some of the more backward writing situations that
they tend to meet elsewhere (both outside and inside the
academic environment).
--
Irvin Peckham
Internet: peckham@unomaha.edu
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 09:18:07 CST
From:         Wes Chapman <WESCHAP@VMD.CSO.UIUC.EDU>
Subject:      lists on feminism?

Does anyone out there know of any lists devoted to feminism or gender studies?
Apologies to those who see this query on other lists.
Thank you,
Wes Chapman
Illinois Wesleyan University
weschap@uiucvmd
weschap@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 11:05:00 EST
From:         "Rhoda Carroll, Vermont College,
              Montpelier" <RHODA%MUNIN@NORWICH.BITNET>
Subject:      Lurking and Voting

Patty, you're right, when vocal MBU-ers started renaming the quiet
ones among us, the quiet ones came on strong!  I know I risk an electromegadeath
flame here for daring to mention the election again, but isn't it
interesting to note one parallel:

There is some point beyond which even the most patient and silent among us
will no longer remain quiet.  Something about that point connects back
to the long discussion about the social construction of reality. Did
our lurkers (I still love the term) find their voices because
several people tried to rename (and thereby reconstruct) their reality
for them?

And didn't the same thing happen on November 3?  A whole lot of
previously silent voices spoke.

--Rhoda (still jazzed from the election and foundering in
  analogies.  Forgive me).


Rhoda Carroll*Vermont College of Norwich University*Rhoda@Norwich.Bitnet
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Date:         Wed, 11 Nov 1992 22:44:32 EST
From:         Ann Green <USERTFSH@UMICHUM.BITNET>
Subject:      at risk students

David, I agree with you about the U's responsibility to at-risk students they
want/need to attract now, now that their traditional student base is shrinking
.
This is an area where community colleges can and should lead.  We were the
original open-door institutions which became, without support programs for
underprepared students, the revolving door.  In the last decade developmental
programs in the ole 3 R's with a strong component of tutoring and intrusive
counseling has moved to stop the door from revolving.  There is a place in
higher ed for these programs but they must not ghetto-ize students and must
work to move them into mainstream courses immediately or as soon as possible.
There are lots of sticky issues here and they arise always in times of
scarce resources, where we are now.  I was reacting to the implication that
we need to draw the line and kick out the ones who always get kicked out if
we have to make choices.  As we all know, those are all too often the
minorities and the women, traditionally, and now will be the ESL students too
if I were to guess.  Ann/JCC
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Date:         Wed, 11 Nov 1992 13:15:01 CST
From:         Ellen Redding Kaler <KALER@UKANVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Donald Stewart
              10 Nov 1992 18:39:41 MST from <dawn@RAMBLER.ENGLISH.COLOSTATE.EDU>

It's a recent Journal of Advanced Composition that published the
Stewart Tribute.
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Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 12:40:00 EST
From:         WPWP@PITTVMS.BITNET
Subject:      Forgot to sign my message

Sorry MBUers,
        I forgot to sign my message.  I wrote the long hypertext note on
Michael, Irv, and John's thoughts on hypertext.
jeff galin
galin@vms.cis.pitt.edu
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Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 07:58:09 EST
From:         Fred McFarland <WWN@CORNELLC.BITNET>
Subject:      subscribe

I would like to subscribe to your list - comp in comp. Fred McFarland
Fred McFarland (WWN@cornellc.cit.cornell.edu)
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Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 11:01:27 MST
From:         "David E. Schwalm" <IACDES@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Subject:      Reply to open admission concerns

From: David E. Schwalm
What Nick says is true of all institutions, not just open admissions schools.
ASU has relatively high admissions standards for a state university--top 25%
of high school class OR high school GPA of 3.00 or higher OR ACT/SAT
composites of 22/930. But in this population there are some very weak writers
who are not really prepared for ENG 101. Yet the institution resists offering
the coursework, esp. in math and English, that many of our fully admitted
students need. We also admit a cadre of students "conditionally"; they are
students who do not quite meet our current admissions standards (who, in fact,
fall in the gray area between the old standards and the new). But again, we do
nothing to address the "conditions." Several of my colleagues are adamantly
opposed to offering any "pre-college" courses (although they don't really
define what they mean by that), even tho' this is not an open admissions
university. I say that courses needed by students admitted to your college
are, by definition, college courses.

-- David E. Schwalm, Assoc. Provost for Academic Programs
___Arizona State University West
___4701 West Thunderbird Rd.
___Phoenix, AZ 85069-7100___(602) 543-4500
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 01:02:43 -1000
From:         James Shimabukuro <JAMESS@UHUNIX.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: software

On Sun, 1 Nov 1992, David H. Roberts wrote:

> I will give Jim S. flack for not liking PC Write, though.  It's not
> easy to learn, but compared with Word Perfect and Wordstar (ugh) it
> is child's play.  And it's basically free.  Although we've moved beyond
> PCWrite in the past several years, at another university we used to
> provide PCWrite for any student who wanted a copy.  We used PCWrite in

Many of our students from a few years back would, too.  :)   Consider it
sour grapes.  I could never learn to use the darn thing.

Jim S.
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Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 19:42:29 CST
From:         Bob Whipple <whippl@PARROT.CREIGHTON.EDU>
Subject: Re: Yankee Trader Needs Info

try Helen Schwartz's SEEN tutorials for critical writing and reading.
Available from Conduit at the U. of Iowa.
[A[KFrom Conduit at U. of Iowa.
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