From: unglenie@ford.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert J Unglenieks)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.animals
Subject: Re: Animal Cult Backtracks on Dog Show Attacks
Date: 13 Sep 92 23:56:04 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

Scott Wood writes:
>unglenie@ford.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert J Unglenieks) writes:
>'The stigma
>`that is perpetrated by many who claim "unpure" dogs are inferior directly
>`results in not adopting these loving, caring, feeling beings......
>
>Let me try to give an example here to refute this.  
>
>Now let me compare this to something else of tangible value, say jewelry.
>Pure gold and pure gemstones cost more.  Costume jewelry costs less.
>That does not mean that real (pure) jewelry takes away from the sales
>of costume jewelry.  It comes down to a matter of what you can afford
>or what you are willing to pay for.

The costume jewelry sits in a case and is unsold if all people want is real
jewelry.  The costume will be continually produced and sit on a shelf unsold.
"Garbage" dogs will, unfortunately, continue to be produced and will DIE.
If you equate a life to an inanimate object.......

>If you have the money and want to get "your money's worth" in a pet,
>why not?  Those that don't have the money, or don't particularly care
>if there pet is worth more than the personal value of a companion are
>more than welcome to go to the pound and get a "mutt."  I prefer to
>get proof the dog is what I want - I prefer a pure-bred with papers.

But there is a social stigma with owning a purebred.  How many times have YOU 
asked, "what kind of dog is it?"  Does it have to be a certain kind in order to 
just be?  It is like asking an asian-american or a native american what their
origin is.  Aren't they all just people?

>`For every show dog bought, at least one "common" dog is not adopted
>`to become functioning members of that home.......
>
>So what?  Maybe the buyer wanted or preffered a show dog.  A pure dog!

So what?  Animals are dying needlessly in the name of vanity......

>"Sure [some] people are letting animals loose to breed and end up in pounds,
>but these [AR extremist] people applaud loosed animals."

First, there is no proof that any AR groups are releasing animals.  Second,
if there are, they are not doing it to in order to let them "breed and end
up in pounds".

>`So are you saying that your motivation for "purchasing" a dog is to
>`enhance your ego by having one that can be a "good" show dog or hunter?
>
>When I hunt, I prefer to succeed.  I enjoy the sport, and though I do not
>have to kill to enjoy myself, anything an everything I can do to improve
>my chances of not only being successful, but making it as humane as
>possible, I will do.  This has nothing to do with "ego" or "machoism".
>A good dog is part of that.  

Why won't a pound animal work?  Many of the film/TV animals are pound animals
and appear to do quite well.

>A $100+ dollar dog can be just as caring as a $$-less mutt (sort of the
>opposite of your arguement eh?) and I can be sure that it will also
>serve other functions to help me with my sport or my dinner table.

Can you really be sure?

>`>  A worthless dog (fiscally) is not
>`>worth enough to me with companionship alone.  I am not going to spend
>`>tons of my money to feed a dog that licks my face once a day and sleeps
>`>and wants to go potty all the time.
>
>`I guess a significant other is out of the question for you too.....   :-)
>`So what if you have a loved one who becomes incapable of feeding, cleaning,
>`or caring for him/herself?  Will you not spend money on him/her?
>
>You now get into the area of capabilities.  Watch what you say.  I would
>personally not become SO with someone if they did not help me along in
>some way.  

How about companionship and love?  Do you exclude these?

>And this does not exclude those incapable of feeding, cleaning,
>or caring for herself.  For example, much can be learned on this computer
>network by typing back-and-forth to people to whom I have no idea whether
>or not they are able to feed, clean or care for themselves, and I can find
>it quite mentally stimulating.  Talking with my dog is not quite the same.

But do you not get any mental stimulation from interacting with an animal?
I do.  One problem you might have is from to much inbreeding with yours.  :-)

>`>If the dog won't fetch a duck, point a bird, trail a rabbit (or otherwise
>`>help put food on the table) - or in the case of show dogs actually help
>`>make money (both in showing and breeding) then I don't want it.  
>
>`We have a Border Collie mix that does well herding our horses.  
>
>Yes, but if someone has a mixed dog, how can they prove that it will do
>what the traits of either of the parents may do.

But if you have a purebred dog, how can you be sure?  A friend of my dad's 
breeds and trains retrievers.  Sometimes he gets dogs that just don't
work out.  Just because it has a pedigree doesn't mean it will do well.  How
many millions have been spent on breeding racehorses with great bloodlines
and have them turn out to be duds?

Doesn't all the talk of pure bloodlines and superior breeding sound a little
too familiar and scary?

>I just think that there are more ligitimate ways (especially in a free
>speech democracy) to get things done than by terrorizing, threatening
>and destroying property of legitimate citizens making a living or enjoying
>their lives.  (who by the way - for the most part - are doing so within
>the constraints of the law)
>swood

I almost entirely agree with your statement above.  Let's change a few words 
and see what we get:

I just think that there are more legitimate ways (especially in a free speech
democracy) to get things done than by terrorizing, threatening and destroying
property of legitimate living creatures making a living or enjoying their lives.
(who, by the way, for the most part, are doing so within the constraints of
the law).

I like it.....

Rob U, how human does something have to be to be considered a human?
--
-       Rob Unglenieks             REAL race cars DON'T wear BOWTIES       -
-     "Our task must be to free ourselves by widening our circle           -
-      of compassion to embrace all living creatures."                     -
-                           -  Albert Einstein                             -
Newsgroups: talk.politics.animals