HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk (Leo Smith)
Subject: Re: close
Reply-To: shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 21:17:00 +0000

ron_s@verifone.com writes..

>I am still waiting to see a color photo of an alien
>and/or an alien spaceship.  All of the ones I have seen,
>(and that is a lot), are all rather grey,fuzzy, and
>ambiguous. I noticed that the recent post about a woman
>who was abducted by 3 aliens described them as "grey".
>We have to tell these aliens to dress better, and show
>some color, or people are going to forget all about them.

>The alien spaceships are dull and grey too, and invariably
>shaped like saucers (of course), garbage can lids, metal
>footballs, hot dogs, or barbells. What is needed is a
>better variety of shapes - like pyramids,tetrahedrons,
>icosahedrons, cornucopias -- with more colors and better
>lights....

>aloha


Dear Ron. I am an amateur photographer and know how to put color film
in my camera. If you could be so kind as to supply full details of
what you think the well-dressed alien is wearing including cosmetics
and jewellry, as well as the type and style of tail-fins and flashing
lights he/she/it is likely to have on its interstellar buggy, as well
as the general shape and outline of the buggy, I will do my very best
to provide you with a full colour GIF derived from fine grain
Kodachrome 25 or Fuji Velvia within about 9 months.


But do you think the world needs another 'Aliens steal Reagan's
brain' type story?

I suppose, with an election looming, and disaffected youth roaming
the streets looking for an Answer To Life (or at least A Good F***)
and rampant economic stagnation, the answer is probably:-

Yes we do need another full color UFO picture to distract everybody
from reality (such as it may be).

Oh well. Back to the CIA.

Beam me up Ronald
From: echyatt@eos.ncsu.edu (EDWARD CRAIG HYATT)
Subject: Re: OBE (?)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 23:05:23 GMT

In article <24265@castle.ed.ac.uk> fofp@castle.ed.ac.uk (M Holmes) writes:
>tordm@vana (Tord Malmgren) writes:
>
>
>> last weekend I got a bit much to drink, and when I went to bed it was
>>alright, but when I closed my eyes I felt like I was tilting, like I
>>was on a ship on the ocean, but when I open my eyes I'm all still.. is
>>this an OBE or not??
>
>No, this is called "being drunk". It is a preliminary stage to more
>interesting things. If you drink a little more and then lie down and
> (edited)
>FoFP

Yep.  My ex-wife used to call
this "the bed spins."  Thanks
for the pleasant memory.  :-)

-Craig

-- 
--------------------
Craig Hyatt
NCSU@Raleigh, NC USA
echyatt@eos.ncsu.edu
--------------------
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: johnm@cajal.uoregon.edu (John Martin)
Subject: RE: John Duplicate
Reply-To: johnm@cajal.uoregon.edu
Organization: Institute of Neuroscience, University of Oregon
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 92 18:16:52 GMT


To the person who wrote me about his brother with my name:

	You letter got mangled and lost!  I will be happy to fulfill
your request, but please write me again w/the info!


-- 
John Martin                                        johnm@cajal.uoregon.edu
Institute of Neuroscience,   University of Oregon,    Eugene, OR,    97402
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: tzf@csl.biosci.arizona.edu (Theron Friedman)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: how to have an OBE (was: Re: OBE tests that prove it DOESNT occur)
Date: 23 Jul 92 07:06:37 GMT
Reply-To: tzf@csl.biosci.arizona.edu
Organization: U of Arizona, CS Dept, Tucson

In article <1992Jul22.205529.16934@m.cs.uiuc.edu>, mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath) writes:
|> In article , mchalmer@mcs213a.cs.umr.edu (Matthew Chalmers) writes in part:
|> |> I don't really
|> |> care at this point if OBEs are proven, fact, fiction, imagination, or
|> |> whatnot -- I just want to ask if anyone can post instructions on how to
|> |> induce one.
|> 
......
|> Seriously, I have found no information about how to induce and OBE
|> on demand..........

(Disappointing Robert. I expected you to be better read than this.)

Well, maybe not "on demand", but the appendix to Robert Monroe's first book,
"Journeys out of the Body" (I hope I have that right) has fairly extensive
instructions about how to try to have an OBE. I no longer have a copy so I
can't post the instructions, but the book is still in print.
	As far as I can remember the trick was to catch yourself just as
you were about to fall asleep, then try to "roll out" of your body. My
paraphrase, which may not be quite right .... go read the source before
you post flames. Monroe's instructions were more extensive. But it took
time & work to reach the OBE state.

	After writing this book Monroe started playing around with pacing
brain activity using controlled sound frequencies, presenting different
frequencies to the right & left ears & thereby presumably inducing
different activities in the right & left hemispheres of the brain. He put
together the inevitable weekend course to teach people to have OBEs
using this technique, called something like "Gateway ...". It may still
be around. Other people offered cassette tapes for home use based on
the same principles - I used to see them advertised in New Age magazine
(aka New Age Journal - I'm not sure what name they're using or even if
they're still publishing these days)
	I've seen other books besides Monroe's which have instructions
on how to induce an OBE. Matthew: if the purpose of your post was to
learn the techniques & try to have an OBE for yourself, go find a "new
age" or "aquarian" bookstore & see if they have anything on the subject. Or
get a copy of the abovementioned New Age (Journal) & scan the ads.

	terry friedman
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: yen@prpa.philips.com (Yen C. Lee)
Subject: Re: Lucidity Institute / OBE newsgroup
Organization: Philips Research Palo Alto
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 17:48:35 GMT

gst@spdcc.com (Gary S. Trujillo) writes:

>Oops.  I confused Bob Monroe's "Monroe Institute" with Stephen LaBerge's
>"Lucidity Institute."  Sorry about that.  The Lucidity Institute is
>primarily devoted to exploring and helping people experience lucid
>dreams, which are quite different than out-of-body experiences.  However,
>you might still find the articles in their newsletter on the OBE subject
>interesting:

how are lucid dreams and oobe "quite different"?

for me personally they are very much related ...

>-- 
>    Gary S. Trujillo                             gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us
>Somerville, Massachusetts               {wjh12,bu.edu,spdcc,ima,cdp}!gnosys!gst

Yen Lee, yen@prpa.philips.com                 (all standard disclaimers apply)
P.S. sorry, I'm new to this group ...
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: adwright@iastate.edu ()
Subject: post to OBE correspondent
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 18:16:03 GMT

I received a E message from a person who had OBE. This person did not want
 identity revealed and asked me not to post. I just want to know from
this person is it ok for me to E-mail you? I thought it would be but I 
want to make sure. In any case, please E mail me and let me know. If it 
is not ok to E mail, let me have another way of contacting you. 
Thanks
Allen
From: gen5006@husky1.stmarys.ca
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: OBE tests that prove it DOESNT occur
Date: 25 Jul 92 20:59:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: husky1.1992Jul25.165928.1
Organization: St. Mary's University, Halifax, N.S., Canada

[edited]
>         And where are these instances? Most of the ones I've heard about 
> didn't happen under controlled conditions.
> 
>         The cases I've heard about fall into the anecdote category, for the 
> most part-- the person _insists_ that they couldn't have known about stuyff 
> they saw while in an OBE. Since I have only the person's word on the 
> subject-- and that the person tends to want to believe in the OBE-- I 
> certain'y can't take that as evidence. 
> 
>         As far as tests under _controlled_ conditions go, the evidence 
> becomes far more equivocal. There are questions as to whether some unknown 
> cue tipped the traveller off (say, the faint car horn from outside and the 
> person reporting a near-accident at the nearby intersection), or whether the 
> person might've been cheating. (I've seen magicians do a stunt similar to the 
> protocol described above.)
> 
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Brian "Rev. P-K" Siano                                  revpk@cellar.org
> "Best Reason Not to Vote for Perot-- If he wins, it might encourage Bill 
> Gates to run." 


         I guess the important question here is "Is there a conspiracy between
people that have never met to create a fraudulent 'phenomena' just to give
bored people something to talk about?"  I mean i get the impression that you
think everyone that has ever claimed to have had the experience is either an
idiot or a liar.  You don't believe the many account of people not under
controlled conditions even when many of the people that report them didn't
even believe until it happened to them.  And as for the ones under more 
controlled conditions you try to point out that some obscure 'tip' clued them
into their accounts. Somehow i don't think hearing a car horn would make me
have a detailed vision of the accident itself.  Another thing you seem to
dismiss out of hand is the fact that the experiences are damn hard to control.
You may *want* to do something but stray thoughts can mess it up pretty damn
fast.

Bill.
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: OBE (?)
From: jtulli@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 30 Jul 92 19:12:22 EDT
Organization: Wesleyan University

> In article <1992Jul29.121913.16868@kth.se> tordm@vana (Tord Malmgren) writes:
 
> last weekend I got a bit much to drink, and when I went to bed it was
>alright, but when I closed my eyes I felt like I was tilting, like I
>was on a ship on the ocean, but when I open my eyes I'm all still.. is
>this an OBE or not??

it may have been an indication that the connection between the physical and
second bodies was looser than usual.  dizziness *can* help induce an obe.
From: Roy.Phillips@dustbin.omahug.org (Roy Phillips)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: OBE tests that prove
Date: 23 Jul 92 03:26:00 CST
Reply-To: roy.phillips@dustbin.omahug.org
Organization: Atomic Dustbin, Bellevue, NE
Followup-To: alt.paranormal

RMD->They lied, hyperbole, the persons invonlev were mistaken, etc.
RMD->It doesn't count unless it's under controlled conditions. So far, I
RMD->haven't heard of ANYONE who's managed to give consistant, positive
RMD->results on such a test.

Then again...if someone COULD do it...for instance...me, I DEFINITELY
would not come forward with such an ability.  Then, I'd be looked upon
as different, in league with the Devil (by some), or just plain too
dangerous to exist.  I beleive in the abilities, but I seriously don't
beleive I've ever seen one on television, or as a performer, or in a
shop regarding such phenomena, or as someone who is trying to read your
palm for $50.00 us funds.

 ~ OLX 2.1 TD ~ Press "+" to see another tagline.


Xref: sparky alt.paranormal:1967 talk.religion.newage:3548
From: ed_l1@verifone.com
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: alt.consciousness (followup) Energy balls.
Date: 28 Jul 92 11:22:07 -1000
Organization: VeriFone Inc., Honolulu HI

In article <1992Jul26.162525.12451@yenta.alb.nm.us>, karenm@yenta.alb.nm.us (Karen Millar) writes:
> 
> glenne@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Neuromancer ) writes: [...]
>> usual I felt this tingling sensation.  But also I saw through
>>a window in the trees a fuzzy greenish blue ball of light.  I
>>passed this off as my eyes playing tricks on me.
>> [...]
>>this I thought I saw this ball of white light come flying toward
[...]
> 	NO......... you are not imagining these feelings... I have 
> had them and I know NUMEROUSs people who have had them. In the 
> reference frame I have, they have been called thought forms.

I have also seen things, very clear, like soap bubbles (but they
cannot be seen directly, only in the peripheral vision - by me,
at least) in pastel colors; they move with their own volition.

I figured they were spirits of a sort, and got independent confirmation.
I guess they were the energy forms of the spirit guides of the person
to whom I was talking. -- when I asked her, "Do you have spirit guides
that you work with," she looked at the exact space (beside me) where I
saw the "bubbles.

> -- 
>     Love is the answer...

Love to you, Karen.

-- 
 //=====================================================================\\
|| Ed L'Esperance - P.O. Box 4635, Kane`ohe, Hawai`i 96744  U.S.A. Earth ||
|| Anthropologist, Writer, Editor, Earth Native       Ed_L1@VeriFone.Com ||
|| * Opinions Copyright (c) 1992 Ed L'Esperance.  All Rights Reserved. * ||
 \\=====================================================================//
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic
From: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Carl J Lydick)
Subject: Re: Test that proves OBEs DONT occur
Reply-To: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 11:30:31 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.182326.12284@random.ccs.northeastern.edu>, rogue@ccs.northeastern.edu (Rogue Agent) writes:
>In article <1992Jul21.145521.526@m.cs.uiuc.edu> mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu writes:
>>
>>--How do we account for the normal "In the Body Experience"?  How
>>is the OBE related to the IBE?  (This point is due to Susan Blackmore.)
>>[I have no idea, but it's a really interesting question!]
>
>	Richard Feynman, in his autobiography, 'Surely You're Joking, Mr.
>Feynman!', describes some fascinating experiments on IBE/OBE.  Not very
>controlled, but it was pretty cool to read about how he moved his 'sense of
>self' to different parts of his body, and even outside his body.  This is a
>man I'm very sorry I never got to meet.

Anybody want to hear about James Randi's OBE?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: CARL@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXen and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: OBE tests that prove it DOESNT occur
From: bruce@stanton.UUCP (Gordon Bruce)
Date: 28 Jul 92 04:39:14 GMT
Organization: Stanton Public Domain Systems, Stanton, Ca.
Summary: OOBE experiences

In article <5507@umriscc.isc.umr.edu>, mchalmer@mcs213a.cs.umr.edu (Matthew Chalmers) writes:
> 
> Darn. I kinda figured that somebody out there in alt.paranormal land
> would either have had experienced an OBE or know someone who has or
> had heard of someone who has, etc., and could tell me either how he/she
> did it or how he/she heard it was done. It would seem pointless for all
> the readers of this group to discuss OBEs in so much detail if NOBODY
> reading/posting believes that they can occur. 
> 



I have an ex girlfriend who has experienced OOBEs.  She does not induce them 
at will,  but experiences them during times of stress.  When she first 
described her experiences to me, she was somewhat frightened (when she saw 
herself laying in her bed while she was standing beside it, she thought she 
had died).

What made me think she might be having an OOBE, rather than a dream, was her 
saying that the next morning she saw evidence of some activity that she had 
watched from her apartment during the experience.

Over the next couple of years, she described numerous other OOBE experiences 
to me.  On a few occasions she described physical conditions that she should 
not have been aware of.

Her narratives do not constitute proof that OOBES are an actuality, not even 
to me who received her descriptions first hand.  I think this note may answer 
your request though.

You also might like to know that I have Robert Monroe's book (and a couple of 
others I think) on out of body experiences.  If there is a reference or two 
you would like to have verified, I will look in my library and see if I can 
find them for you.

Gordon

-- 
===============================================================================
| Gordon Bruce; DataComm Consultant |  The opinions expressed here are mine   |
| bruce@stanton.cts.com             |  and are not necessarily the opinions   |
| stanton!bruce                     |  of my clients or employers.            |
===============================================================================
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: sad@dasher.uucp (22430s-downie)
Subject: Re: Angels
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 15:34:51 GMT
Summary: Angels

In article <harris.712213560@drvax3>, harris@drvax3.msfc.nasa.gov (Mitch Harris) writes:
> I tried to post this once before, without any apparent luck. If it shows
> up as a repeat, sorry!
> What I was wondering was this: has anyone read "A Book of Angels"? If
> so, do you believe in them? And lastly, has anyone had contact with what
> they might consider to be an angel?
> 
>                (posted for Beverly H.)
> 

Beverly:  I believe in Angels.  When I was a little girl I had problems
with my feet and was constantly falling.  My parents didn't have much
money and were angry at me because my pants or other clothing constantly
had to be replaced.  As a result I was punished for falling.  (I did 
wear braces, but my parents felt that I also needed to be more careful.)
I was about 6 years old and playing in the basement when I started to
fall. I can remember the terror I felt at the thought of being punished
again and my mother not talking to me for a week.  All of a sudden in
this dark basement an illumination appeared, caught me, and put me
on my feet.  I remember It was another little girl who looked like
she was in a communion dress and veil,but she had these little wings. 
Immediately I thought of an angel because it was something I was learning
in Sunday school.  I thought at that time angels were like St. Michael
or the Virgin Mary and had a hard time relating that this little girl
was an angel.  Now that I am an adult I think of this little angel as
my friend and am appreciative that she rescued me.

Sharon Serene
.
From: bbs.techie@tsoft.sf-bay.org (Robert Mc Daniel)
Subject: Re: OBE tests that prove it DOESNT occur
Organization: The TSoft BBS and Public Access Unix, +1 415 969 8238
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 10:55:06 GMT

> 	A very simple test that HAS been done (by the 'Amazing Randi') 
> to see if OBE's happen was this: A six digit number is written on a 
> card and placed in another room. The person who says they have or can
> induce OBEs does not know what this number is. When the OBE occurs the
> person goes to the card, reads the number and goes right back to 
> his/her body and rattles off the number. There is no time limit and 
> the experiment can run for as long as you need to induce or experience
> an OBE. It has NEVER been successful. Of course you can say that 
> something happens to the mind when having an OBE that prevents you 
> from remembering a sequence of numbers, but that is such an obvious
> and blatant cop out that it would instantly ruin your credibility to
> suggest it.
 
The solution to this is to present a variety of objects. For instance: a 
photograph, a number sequence, a coffee cup, and a poem. If the person 
in question can describe ONE of these will go towards proving OBEs 
happen. (But of course, they won't be able to.)


--
Robert Mc Daniel (bbs.techie@tsoft.sf-bay.org)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath)
Subject: Re: Lucidity Institute / OBE newsgroup
Reply-To: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 16:10:33 GMT

In article <1992Jul29.174835.11440@prpa.philips.com>, yen@prpa.philips.com (Yen C. Lee) writes in part:
|> gst@spdcc.com (Gary S. Trujillo) writes:
|> 
|> >Oops.  I confused Bob Monroe's "Monroe Institute" with Stephen LaBerge's
|> >"Lucidity Institute."  Sorry about that.  The Lucidity Institute is
|> >primarily devoted to exploring and helping people experience lucid
|> >dreams, which are quite different than out-of-body experiences.  However,
|> >you might still find the articles in their newsletter on the OBE subject
|> >interesting:
|> 
|> how are lucid dreams and oobe "quite different"?
|> 
|> for me personally they are very much related ...

Severl key things:

1.  Much is know about what happens as people dream.  Some is known
about what happens when people dream lucidly.  Very little is known
about what is going on when people experience OBE's.

2.  People have reported OBE's when they are wide awake.  Lucid
dreaming, by definition, is a specific case of dreaming while asleep.

3.  There are plenty of "altered states" of consciousness, and they
may resemble each other, but this does not mean that they are "the
same thing".  Drug induced hallucinations may resemble dreams, but 
they are not really "the same thing", in the sense that we can discern 
differences in how the happen.

Overall, the physiological correlates of OBE's are not well understood, 
so it is not clear exactly how OBE's relate to common dreaming or to unusual 
forms of dreaming.  They MAY be very similar to dreaming, but they might
be something completely different.

-- 
  Robert E. McGrath
  Urbana Illinois
  mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
From: jarkell@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca (Jonathan Arkell)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: out-of-body-experiences
Date: 20 Jul 92 22:14:10 GMT
Organization: The Nucleus 16 Lines 403-531-9353 -CNet Amiga-

In article <adwright.711568206@vincent1.iastate.edu>, adwright@iastate.edu ()
writes:
>In <jarkell.05gw@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca> jarkell@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca (Jonathan
Arkell) 
>writes:
>
>>Actually there is something that does provide evidence about something
leaving
>>the body during an OBE, some scients put someone on a super hyper precise
scale
>
>>bed, that way they could weigh him during the obe, well it turns out that the
>>time the obe started, a few grams were taken off the weight of the bed and
>>person.  A similar experiment happened with people who were dying, when they
>>eventually died, the same results, 3 grams off the weight.
>
>Can you supply us with a reference to this research? I suppose it should also
>work on animals as well?
>
a reference? i read it from a book with teh name of "An OBE workbook" or
something to that degree,its published by a company which also publishes
workbooks on other "occultic" topics.
From: urbina@novax.llnl.gov
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: HELP
Date: 29 Jul 92 06:41:01 GMT





Newsgroups: alt.paranormal