HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
Subject: Re: Good of ticking [please read]
From: jmangold@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 17 Dec 92 18:38:25 EST
 <BzDx46.8E2@news.cso.uiuc.edu> <1992Dec17.043803.2816@mercury.unt.edu>
Organization: Wesleyan University

In article <1992Dec17.043803.2816@mercury.unt.edu>, jbw@ponder.csci.unt.edu (WEST JASON BRUCE) writes:
> Here is why ticking is necessary, and having house rules against it are
> stupid:
> 
> I used to play in Austin, when I went to UT.  The competition there was 
> fairly good and ticking abounded.  Counter-ticking, etc were just a part
> of my strategy and reaction skills.
> 
>   I then moved here, Denton (a hole from hell), where there are some really
> good comboers and master no-throwers.  I got used to it.  I actually just
> crouch block sometimes.  Two people will be crouched to close to do anything.
> You slap yourself and throw the guy - everyne murmers.  So you decide, hell
> I'll play their way.
>   3rd round, tight match, 15 seconds left.  Short throw boom your dead.
> It started to catch me off guard - I got worried.  I now play as completely
> cheap as possible.  Not only is it infintely more fun and interesting than
> the normal boring mathes of Ryu/Ryu etc etc - but it improves your skills.
> And next time that shmo tries that crap at the last second you will be
> ready.
> 
> 
> All you master no-throwers....you better start playing cheap and getting into
> "throwing matches".  If you don't you will be destined to lose to true
> masters of the game - forever your words of "cheap" ringing in your own
> ears.
> 

Well, I must admit that I'm a former no-thrower player that used to cry "cheap"
at every tick, however, I'm now a master (some think so :-) ) (no-)thrower who
still hates ticking but I can now counter throw and get the "ooo"s and "ahhs"
from the audience.  I just have to disagree with two points you made:  
	First of all, I don't believe that the "true" masters of the game have
to win by ticking.  During the course of a match, I'd give my opponent one
freebee tick per match, and if I'm feeling good that day, per round.  After
that, the entire match deteriorates if s/he continues to do so, and the match
just becomes less fun/interesting.  As far as I'm concerned, when someone
"cheaps" me, I just get more anxious to beat the piss out of him using
"legitimate" moves and combos.  It's not that hard, really.  After the first
tick, I'll agree that you're definitely put on your guard.  From that point on,
you just watch for simple warning signs: ie jumping jab ticks, crouching ticks,
etc. and throw when appropriate.
	Besides, who wants to win a match by ticking anyway?  Everyone knows
that winning isn't everything....it's looking good while playing that matters
:-).  Gotta love those style points...


						the "doctor"
   
> 
> Ciao...
> 
> 
>                                                        - Jason
> 
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: el27166@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (This Space for Rent)
Subject: Blanka's headbutt in Classic
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 22:12:07 GMT

I was playing Guile in SF2-Classic the other day.  I was magic throwing
the computer opponents left and right.  So I decided to try the opponent
freeze (handcuffs).  Well, I waited for Blanka to get close to me so I
coul do it.  When he was close to me, he did the headbutt to me while I
was blocking and I heard the strangest sound!

It was the sound that Blanka makes when he loses the round!  He did the
headbutt which went *tick* *tick* and as he did it, I heard the      
"Oooo... ahhhh!" sound when Blanka loses the round.  He did the headbutt
again, and the same sound came out.  I was amused.

Later, I played a new game as Guile.  I got to the Blanka stage, and
Blanka did a headbutt again.  This time, it wasn't the "Oooo... Ahhhh!"
sound, but the shrieking elephants from Dhalsim's stage!  He kept doing
it to me while I was blocking and I could barely see the screen because
I was laughing so hard.  So Blanka was doing elephant noises as he did
his headbutt--- weird!

Since I this happened to me two games in a row, I assume this bug is
reproducible.  Has this happened to anyone else?  I don't remember this
happening to me before.  If I can figure out the joystick motions to
do the weird Blanka voices, I'll certainly post them!

have fun,
Ming
-- 
Eu-Ming Lee (aka CyberGeek)                      el27166@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Guys with long sigs are just trying to compensate for something...
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: loverde@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (AstralWolf)
Subject: Re: True Z combos
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 17:16:37 GMT

In <Bz0oAI.IGB@news.cso.uiuc.edu> skillian@ux4.cso.uiuc.edu (Seth James Killian) writes:
>
>	On a more practical note, I still think Ken/Ryu are invulnerable 
>	after the HK.  The way I incorporate the fact that you CAN be
     Ken invulnerable?  Is this just an oversite, or do you think Ken is
invulnerable?  Personally I don't think so.  I have never seen anyone go 
through Ken's HK when he comes down like I have with Ryu.  do you know
something I don't about this?

>	I am currently of the opinion that an SF2 ecological niche
>	has developed to accomodate the "purely slam-boy" Vega at UIUC>
>	The slightly different nature of Vega ticks has opened a place
>	for a relatively skilless style of play to win more often than
>	it should.  I think we need to practice purely anti Vega ticking 
>	for a while. IMHO this could be the final skill standing between
>	UIUC and a "higher plane" of Street Fighting.  With a working
>	Vega counter tick operating at from 50-100% success, I think
>	we will have a completely well rounded out set of skills.
>	Anyway, not to worry about those guy's... they aren't very good
>	at even countering Ken/Ryu!...hehehe...
>
     A higher plane of street fighting?  But I already wander the Astral
Plane.  Perhaps I have not yet located this plane.  I shall research
this more ;)  Anyway, yeah the various ticks of different characters
all require different timing.  Right now I have problems with the Bison
one jab then throw tick.  I am fairly good at countering Vega's ticks
though.  

-- 
   /|        /              / |      /       /  /-/  Can be reached on the
  / |  /--/ --- |/-/ /-\|  |  |  ^  /  /-\  |  |/    Astral Planes known as:
 /--|  \-\   |  |   |   |  |  | /| /  |  |  |  |      loverde@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu
/   | \--/  /  /    \--/| /   |/ |/   \-/  /   /      jvl45017@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: poon@andromeda.rutgers.edu (Mark Poon)
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
Subject: SFA (Street Fighter Anonymous)
Date: 18 Dec 92 21:06:56 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.


	I seem to suffer from SFS (Street Fighter Sydrome): that is I can't
resist the temptation of playing that damn game.  I feel that I'm ok and all
but I can get better.  Ending the game is no problem.  If I had save up all
the quarters that I've used for that game I could of bought the coin-op itself!

Sweet Addictions!

-- 
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Mark~Poon~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| Poon@andromeda.rutgers.edu     |     Mxp6259@hertz.njit.edu	              |
|__________________________Rutgers~University_________________________________|
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: cw21219@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Crying Freeman)
Subject: Re: Ken's 4-Hit Touch of Death (and Bison's scissor...)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 17:06:09 GMT

Hey Jason,

 Our arguments are getting rather ridiculous. Anyways, it's pretty
sad arguing which character is more unbalanced than another because
every character has at least one other character that gives them
serious trouble. Since we were arguing about Bison and Ken/Ryu.

Here's my opinion: (Of course we are talking about masters)
Bison: His killers are Ryu and Guile.
Ryu: Characters that have advantages over him are Sagat, Blanka (if played
	right)
Ken: Blanka, Guile, Sagat, Zangief, and Dhalsim all can give him serious
	problems.

That's why I don't feel Ken is unbalanced. He has too many weaknesses to
make up for his "touch of death". I feel Ryu/Ken players play Ken mainly
because the lure of the Ken combos.

Ciao (heh) 
-- 
 Kenneth C. Wang	| University Of Illinois Champaign-Urbana	
 			| Internet: c-wang@uiuc.edu			
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: loverde@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (AstralWolf)
Subject: Re: Ken's 4-Hit Touch of Death
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 09:12:16 GMT

In <1992Dec12.233122.45593@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> lerner@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>
>> 'Pedo:  Hits a possible 6+ times when blocked.  Each hit does as much
>>         damage as the second hit from the DP.  So blocking the torpedo
>>         does as much damage as if you had jumped into 6+ fierce DP's,
>>         assuming Ken didn't hit you with the 'hurting part' of the DP.
>>         Bison is not vulnerable after his torpedo is blocked.  He can
>>         very easily throw you as he comes out of it.
>
>Are you sure?  This worked for a while, but now it seems pretty easy
>to throw Bison after he torpedos.  Are we doing something wrong with
>Bison?
>
     Based upon my experience, after the torpedo, there is a short period of
time in which you are still recovering from the block, and Bison can move.
He can not throw you since you are recovering from the block (It is not
possible to throw someone till after they recover...easy example Guile
following the boom...have to wait til they recover or you punch instead of 
throw...same concept here)  However, he can move to throw, or instead can move
and attempt to kick you or something like that.  So basically, if you
try to throw and he doesn't, you get hit by him, and if you just block,
he can toss you....so you have to guess....I personally alternate between
block and throw...kind of flip a coin in my head....
-- 
   /|        /              / |      /       /  /-/  Can be reached on the
  / |  /--/ --- |/-/ /-\|  |  |  ^  /  /-\  |  |/    Astral Planes known as:
 /--|  \-\   |  |   |   |  |  | /| /  |  |  |  |      loverde@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu
/   | \--/  /  /    \--/| /   |/ |/   \-/  /   /      jvl45017@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: happe@rei.com (Kevin Happe)
Subject: Blanka Move
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 15:54:25 GMT
Organization: Recognition Equipment, Inc.

I was playing Blanka this weekend, I did something I had not done before
and I have not had the time to go back and retry it.  I was playing against
another blanka.  I did a head butt and then straight to electricty, the other
Blanka was at half power. The combo took the other Blanka out and killed him.
Any body with experience at this move, can you tell me more about it.

-- 
HAPPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPEHAPPE
Kevin Happe
Recognition Equipment Inc.       All It Takes Is JUST A Little Software
happe!rei2!uunet
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: cw21219@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Crying Freeman)
Subject: SF2 worldwide.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 07:19:10 GMT

So, has anyone travelled the world in search of SF2 battles?
If so, where is the greatest level of competition?

It's funny, cause 2 summers ago, I played SF2 quite a bit
in Taiwan. I picked up some stuff I hadn't seen before, and
when I came back to school, I figured I'd be hot stuff with
the Guile standing short kick ticks (I know, lame, but this
was cutting edge fighting techniques at the time.) When
I walked into the arcade there was this dude wearing a Fido
Dido T-shirt (the latest fashion in Taiwan that summer...)
Anyways, I jokingly said "Uh oh, this guys been training in
Taiwan too." 

We watched him play for awhile, and he was brutal. He would win
every round as Chun Li with four midair or ground throws. Most
matches would last about 10 seconds. I came in once and, not
surprisingly was slaughtered.... That was the first time I
played the dreaded Cybergeek...

For the longest time after that, we (me and 2 of my friends who
were also SF2 addicts) were terrified of Cybergeek's Chun Li.
(We also thought he was the biggest jerk... the guy had NO mercy.
He would strong throw tick newbies to death. We weren't newbies
really, but he'd throw us to death ruthlessly too.)

However, in retrospect, the whole reason that the SF2 skill level
is so high here is probably due in a large part to Cybergeek and
his ruthless, merciless ticking... 

I remember at the beginning of this semester (2 years later) when
he would tick people. I remember even Seth and Caine would complain
about the throwing, but now, they are both far superior players
because of the ruthless play that is largely due to our buddy
Cybergeek... 

I remember once he was playing a scrub (actually the guy was ok.)
and he finished him off by ticking him with the short kick-throw
(as Ryu) The scrub said "You didn't have to throw me, you could've
beaten me without it." He just said "I know." 

Anyways, the point is, asshole players (no offense Ming :)) are the
key factor for providing a proper breeding ground for true masters...
 
Another key factor I would say is the college environment... Where
else do you have the time and freedom to have a collective group of
ruthless players together to "train" with... 

Since I live here in Urbana (as my permanent residence, I know, horrible
isn't it?), I get to see what kind of SF2 competition comes out
when the regulars disappear... It's truly sad...

-- 
 Kenneth C. Wang	| University Of Illinois Champaign-Urbana	
 			| Internet: c-wang@uiuc.edu			
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: Zoid@mindlink.bc.ca (Dave Kirsch)
Subject: Re: Zangief and his throw combo
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 01:27:38 GMT

> Noah Hanna writes:
>
> While we're on the topic of the best way to SPD, whats the easiest way to
> do it
> on the SNES,(gezundheit)? I tried all of the methods here and only seemed
> to be
> able to get the full circle to work 1 out of 15 times for some reason,
> first
> time I tried the full circle I got it but had problems after that.
> Suggestions?Comments?Complaints?Compliments?...

I do it by placing my thumb centered on the little pad thing, then pushing
forward and doing a very _small_ roll motion that's like this:

 -0 \  |  / 0- -0
     0 0 0

I find that works and I can do it consistently.
--
/// Dave 'Zoid' Kirsch         | Surrey, BC |Internet:              __
MIND LINK! Communications Corp.|   CANADA   |  zoid@mindlink.bc.ca  \/
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: skillian@ux4.cso.uiuc.edu (Seth James Killian)
Subject: Re: SFII-CE Match-UPs and Ratings
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 01:21:33 GMT

bodom@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Brian Odom) writes:

>In <#4j2lq+@rpi.edu> petitc@nuge115.its.rpi.edu (Christopher Jon Petit) writes:

>>tmorris@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au (Tim Morris) writes:

>>>>Honda believe it or not is quite effective vs. Bison...

>>>I'm curious... as a non Honda player, what can he do to stop the torpedo
>>>from close in?  As I see it, Honda has to press the attack on Bison, but
>>>once you land on the ground, what's to stop Bison just torpedoing straight
>>>away?  (I'm assuming Bison can slide under the hands to knock Honda over).

>>  Did you try Honda's down + forward kick (the extend foot kick)?  Or does
>>the cheesepedo have priority?

>Knowing the cheese, Bison will win the exchange.  My question is which will
>win, the 1000 hand slap or the cheese?  If Bison wins this exchange, Honda
>can just give it up.

	OK.  Not to say for a second that Honda is worth his weight in brine
	shrimp as a character in general, but he fares alright against Bison.
	I have not seen the forward kick used with any great success, but the
	crouching strong is very effective.  Try it and see.  The 1000 hand
	slap can (is capable of) beating the cheese, but only if Bison is   
	unlucky enough to connect when one of the 1000 hands is in the position
	of the strong punch (ie straight ahead).  Needless to say this does
	not happen very often, much the same as Chun Li's lihtning kick.
	Using this crouching strong punch as a ground based counter to the
	cheese, Honda becomes more than capable against your average Bison.

		Seth Killian

>-- 
>Brian T Odom

>"We are all manufacturers -- some make good, others make trouble, and still
>others make excuses."
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: kchchang@remus.rutgers.edu (kai chang)
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
Subject: Re: Best Home Street Fighter II
Date: 18 Dec 92 06:33:09 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

>This isn't too good, considering Guile has over 40 _normal_ moves....
	What are you guys talking about?  home entrtinment system?
	I 'm thinking about buyina  Super Nentendo just for SF2....  Is there alternative?
From: epasls@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
Subject: Damage explanation (was  Kens 4hitter)
Date: 13 Dec 92 00:33:28 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

>        
>     Do you understand how the damage works?  I used to think it just
> depended on how much time was left in the match, but that doesn't seem
> to be true.

Each pixel is not the same,  Pixels towards the end represent
more strength then pixels towards the center.  Say there are
100 pixels(dont know exactly, someone wanna count?).  If a move
takes x pixels when y pixels are remaining then that formula will
always hold true.  Basicially the pixels represent more damage the
closer they are to the end.  for instance a blocked sonic will always
take 1 pixel from a certain point but will take more at the beginning.

Barf.... I hope people understood this, I know my point but am unabel
to express it well.

Later...



/----------------------------------------------------------------\
|    DMC@Planet.Pinball=epasls@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu                |
|    RYU=de stud boy                                             |
|    Guile=de style boy                                          |
|    Vega=cheese                                                 |
|    Cindy Crawford=GODDESS                                      |
|    Pain=Happiness=Sadness=Pleasure                             |
|                   War is Peace                                 |
|                Freedom is Slavery                              |
|               Ignorance is Strength                            |  
|    And remember-"Big Brother is Watching you."                 |
\----------------------------------------------------------------/














Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: dphantom@triton.unm.edu (darlene an  92sep02 lawry)
Subject: Re: Ken
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 92 09:44:47 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

>
>You can, you just have to jump before they throw the fireball.  Chun Li
>can still do some devastating damage with her combos.
>

Ok, lemme rephrase that.  I never do the jumpin in combos w/ anybody
that's good.  Quite frankly, I'm no psychic, and most any Ken player
that's good won't make they're fireballs so obvoius that I can reliably
tell *before* they get it off.  and the DP gets such a high priority,
my fist/foot can already be IN THEIR FACE, but gosh, it's not hitting
them...and about the time I'm wondering how this can be I see Ken's
fist plowing up into me.  Done correctly, it's flawless (ie you use
the correct power for the DP)...so it's not worth trying in hopes that
they'll screw up.

---Phantom
From: dphantom@triton.unm.edu (darlene an  92sep02 lawry)
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
Subject: Re: Best Opening Moves
Keywords: Best Opening Moves
Date: 17 Dec 92 02:17:07 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

>>	in some cases, the whole round.  More specifically, what is a good
>>	opening move against Bison?  Or Ryu/Ken vs. Guile?  Just interested
>>	in opinions in general here, but please try to support them by saying
>>	"DP at the very beginning, because if so and so does this then you
>>	can just do that to counter..." or give some sort of reasoning.
>>	Any thoughts?
>>
>>		Seth Killian
>>

Most interesting question.  Against Bison, I almost always jump forward.  In
fact, he's the only character I do this with...and namely because most people
around here open Bison with a scissor kick...which means they'll either miss
me, or I'll hit them first.  His lack of a good upper attack also makes it
a pretty safe opening.

With Chun vs Ken, I usually walk foward and do a middle kick/sweep.  Even if
they throw a fireball immediately, we'll trade damage (about evenly), and
I've never had them get off a DP in time (once they see you're not jumping
in, they usually don't think to do this in time at the very beginning).

Other than that I usually wait and see what my opponent does...and just
be ready to counter or at least see how good they are before I determine
a plan of action.  Once I see that, I may decide to do a specific opening
at the beginning of the next round (especially if they're the type that
always does a move at the very beginning, instead of also waiting to see
what I do).

Urp.
---Phantom
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
From: skillian@ux4.cso.uiuc.edu (Seth James Killian)
Subject: Re: Chun Li's lightning kick combo
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 05:19:29 GMT

el27166@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (This Space for Rent) writes:

>dphantom@triton.unm.edu (darlene an  92sep02 lawry) writes:

>>Ming:  I guess the above statment ^ confused me.  Are you saying that Chun's
>>wind kick can be truely combo'ed?  If so, I must still disagree.  I will
>>grant you that her palm push + wind kick is much more reliable, but that
>>seems to be only because the former *pushes* your opponent away, making
>>DP's and other moves either outta range or very difficult (because a
>>character is in motion, thus timing is, well, intersting, not to mention
>>the lasting effect of the palm push as far as animation execution time).
>>I dunno, maybe the combonation of all that is enough to make it uncounterable,
>>but I don't think so.  A simple sweeping roundhouse might still reach...but
>>I'll have to experiment some...I know it'll still reach with any jumping in
>>wind kick combo you try, because Chun's still too close.

>No, what I am saying is that Chun Li's fierce palm press is interrupted
>by the lightning kick.  It sounds like:  "WHAM WHAM" one right after
>another just like a Ken combo.  The lightning kick cannot be blocked if
>the fierce punch hits.  It's hard for me to do this combo, but the trick
>in doing it is to tap fierce and roundhouse with fierce slightly before
>roundhouse.  If you're lucky, the fierce/lightning kick combo comes out.
>If you're not, just the lightning kick comes out, and then it's not a
>true combo.

>>BTW, why is it so difficult to do correctly?  I can do the palm push no
>>problem...and considering howlong it takes to execute I should think
>>buffering the wind kick would be no problem....?

>The problem is that you need the lightning kick to become active RIGHT
>after the fierce punch comes out, not before, and not too long after
>otherwise it ruins the 'true' combo definition.  If it were a special
>move like the razor kick or dragon punch it could be done easily.  It's
>a special move which requires tapping the buttons, which has unpredictible
>results, and hence can't be relied upon consistently.

>When it does hit, it's a 4-hit dizzying combo which takes off quite a
>bit of energy.

	Although I have seen the four hit Chun Li combo, for those of you
	doubting Thomas' (or doubting Darlenes) try the similiar Chun Li 
	three hit combo:
		Jump in with a fierce punch, follow with palm push,       
	and interrupt the push with roundhouse lightning kick.  This
	combo is significantly easier to actually pull off.  I can do 
	this one with a fair degree of regularity (I only play Chun Li 
	on "off" days), but I have never pulled off the four hit (I only
	even saw it done twice).  Like Eu-Ming says, the tricky bit is
	managing to pound the roundhouse button to buffer the lightning
	kick while actually getting fierce punches to come out.  Tough
	combo.

		Seth Killian

>--
 

>Eu-Ming Lee (aka CyberGeek)                      el27166@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
>Guys with long sigs are just trying to compensate for something...