HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
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Date:         Tue, 22 Dec 1992 13:04:53 -0500
From:         Russ Gelinas <R_GELINAS@UNHH.UNH.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Lenster and the Big Guy

>But suppose another artist depicted a photo, drawing, or sculpture of, say,
>Malcolm X in a jar of urine, with a nice, inoffensive title like "Piss
>Malcolm"? Would those who condemned Helms now rise up in support of this
>artist and his work? Ha, ha, ha. Hell, no, they wouldn't.

Perhaps not.  There are certainly knee-jerk liberals, just as there are
knee-jerk conservatives.  Neither are notable for their in-depth grasp
of the social issues they are condemning/defending.  But, to say that
those who fought Helms' censorship of "Piss Christ" would not fight him
in the case of a "Piss Malcolm", is to dismiss the arts community out of
hand as a collection of nothing more than PC knee-jerks.  If that's what
you believe, ok, fine, but I do not agree.  If anything, I've found that
group of people to be among the most insiteful wrt. social issues.

In any event, we are lucky to have the ACLU, which has never show anything
close to "political correctness".  They'll defend even the most heinous
expression of free speech.  I'm glad they do.

Russ
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 09:59:59 CST
From:         Dave <USTS060@RUST1.DPO.UAB.EDU>
Subject:      Re: piss metal

 From:          Leonard Watkins <ISTS024%UABDPO.BITNET@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU>
 Subject:       Re: piss metal

> I don't really care what an artist does, i object to gov't funding for stuff
> that is not art....pure and simple Mapplethorpe's work is not art a bottle of
> piss is not art......it's not art...........L.W.

    Having started my academic career in the field of art (I was an
artfag in high school and started out as an art major, before moving
on to a more lucrative history major) I afraid I'm gonna have to
answer this.

    What "art" is is extremely subjective.  Some people consider oil
paintings of Elvis on black velvet art.  I do not.  The best
definition of art that I can come up with is that art is a
representation of an individual's thoughts or perceptions about the
world around him or her.  By this defintion Serrano's "Piss Christ",
Mapplethorpe's homo erotic photo essays and Michealangelo's
painting on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel are all art.  Concepts
of taste or good form are not included.

    Personally I think one of art's major functions is to provoke
thought in the mind of the viewer, something Serrano and Mapplethorpe
seem very adept at.



======================================================================
Rev. Dave Hall                |  "It's not the voting that's
usts060@rust1.dpo.uab.edu     |   democracy, it's the counting.
                              |     -- Tom Stoppard
======================================================================
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Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 13:03:08 EST
From:         Sonia Kovitz <skovitz@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Sonia's secret
              "crispen" at Dec 21, 92 9:33 am

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> So it's Doctor Sonia, eh?  Damn, this list is entirely too high class.

 Yeah Rev--them mail-order degrees are a trip, ain't they?

 You save my soul and I'll teach ya a thing or two.

> Sonia, let me quote my hero Winston Churchill when asked by an
> American high school student for advice: "Never give up.  Never, never
> never.  Never give up."  Tell you what.  You've already heard half
> of a tape of my crap.  How could your music be worse?  Plug in your mic
> and wail and send it out to a couple of us and we'll tell you whether
> or not to give up.
>

NO WAY!!!!!!!!  All I have to do is turn a microphone on and instantly a
creeping paralysis and idiot-fog seep into my brain and fingers.
Self-consciousness, the bane of the over-intellectual hot-shot.  And if I DID
send it out and you DID tell me to give up, I'd be floored because I don't
really want to give up.  I "played along" with John Hammond last night...
Sonia's version of "singing along with Mitch" (puke)

> through.  "Too Many Dirty Dishes" is absolutely electrifying.
If you're
 > judging your playing against him, you're being unfair to yourself.

Are you kidding, kind sir?  I may be dumb but I ain't stupid.  I'm not
measuring myself against any REAL guitarists... I just can't seem to truly
enjoy my own playing and that's the problem.  Anyway, sorry about the boring
self-preoccupied post.

Mike somebody (who posted about Astrud--thanks for the correction--I've had her
name all wrong for years obviously) mentioned Booker T and the MGs on
amphetamines as acid jazz.  Booker T has been one of my favorites since Green
Onions came out and made my hair stand on end.

I'm going to be signing off ALLMUSIC later this afternoon so if ya'll have
something you think I might like, send it to me by private e-mail.

Happy Hanukah and Merry Christmas and a Good Winter Solstice to ALLMUSIC--
I'll miss ya... Back in a week.

Sonia
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Date:         Mon, 28 Dec 1992 11:37:00 CDT
From:         MEDIA MAVEN S_SWANK <S_SWANK@TWU.BITNET>
Subject:      re: CD's in wrong package

I remember a story from a few years back, when the soundtrack to the
movie "Sid and Nancy" came out.  It was on the same label as a
Lawrence Welk polka compilation CD, and somehow they shipped out several
thousand Sid and Nancy CDs in the Lawrence Welk covers and vice versa.
So the polka fans were getting the Clash and what have you, and the
Sid worshippers were getting " ah one-a and a two-a anda one-two-three..."
One of Welk's publicists commented that the LW fans were probably quite
shocked...but not as shocked as the Sid Vicious fans probably were.
Oh well...later.
Sallie
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Date:         Sat, 2 Jan 1993 14:08:12 CST
From:         El Chahuistli <U33963@UICVM.BITNET>
Subject:      1992 Allmusic Awards Nominations

It's time for nominations of Allmusic's 1992 awards.  Here are categories.

1. Rising star or revelation of the year.

2. Wittiest poster.  (Rolling on the Floor Laughing Prize)

3. Most consistent initiator & promoter of dialogue. (Threadmaker Award)

4. Funkiest poster.

5. Nastiest poster (Painful Plague Prize)

6. Friendliest and kindest Allmusicker.

7. Clueless poster award. (Frippie Prize)

8. Grossest musical mistake in a post.  (Ignoramus Prize, aka Renato Barahona
Award for misattribution of _Ionisation_)

9. Most original review of a tape, album or CD.

10. Sexiest poster.  (Libby Doe Prize)

11. Most playful poster.

12. Best Allmusic flamer.

13. Most astonishing confession or personal revelation.

14. Strangest Allmusic post.

15. Classiest Allmusicker.

16. Most dazzling all-around poster.

17. Keeper of the Allmusic flame award.  (To the person who epitomizes
the spirit & ideals -- whatever they might be -- of the list.  This is the
highest honor that can be accorded an Allmusicker.)

Well, that's it folks.  Have fun.  See you around.  It's been a hell of magical
 musical tour with all of you.

Peace & love,

-Renato (Proud to see his kid sister, Maria Blanco, quoted in today's NY Times
         in an article on bias against pregnant women in the work place)
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Date:         Tue, 22 Dec 1992 23:50:57 EST
From:         Tim Johnson <ST402711@BROWNVM.BITNET>
Subject:      re: Epistemelogy 'R Us

>Easier smeasier. What's that got to do with the price of [insert your favorite
>thing 'in' your favorite place, here]? The metal list is not much different
>than the ALLMUSIC list. With both you have a bunch of people that like
>different types of music. There are many types of heavy metal. You got
>Progressive (Fates Warning, Queensryche), Thrash (Pantera, Metallica,
>Megadeth), Industrial (Ministry), Death (Entombed, Possessed, Napalm Death),
>Black (Venom, Celtic Frost), Pop [aka poseur glam crap] (Poison,
>Warrant, Bon Jovi, ad nauseam), and then there's Hard Rock (Trouble, Tesla,
>Great White) etc.

>It's not much different with ALLMUSIC. You have Country, Jazz, Rock, Reggae,
>New Age, etc.

  Whoa!  Gary, don't take this personally, but the difference between
Poison and Queensryche isn't nearly as great as the difference between
Beer Jazz and Marsha A Capella.  Or Prokofiev and Madonna.  Are you
sure that going from bon jovi for 5 minutes to tesla for 5 minutes is
the same as going from a 5 minute motorhead to a 100 minute mahler?

  Still, if you want to organize it, it can be your baby.  I think
Carol got the last one going - you can contact her for the details
on just how much a drag it is.

                                     -Tim
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Date:         Wed, 30 Dec 1992 07:35:10 EST
From:         Sonia Kovitz <skovitz@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>
Subject:      Keyboard Man from Russia

Hey Allmusickdom, I'm back.  While in Calif. I met a new arrival from Russia
who is a keyboard man (hard rock) who is looking for a band or at any rate,
some people to play with.  I told him to go to guitar/music stores and look at
the announcement board and put up his own notice, but I also thought maybe some
of youse out there might have some contacts.  His name is Misha--he lives in
San Bernardino.  If you have some ideas, send me a private e-mail and I'll give
you a phone number.  Really nice guy, nuts about music, also has a good singing
voice.  He's only been here a month and is kind of lost.

Buckethead: I have that on order and CAN'T WAIT to hear it... Maybe I'll even
do an infamous review.

Hm, stumping the Bloom... that shouldn't be hard... just pick some old-timey
50s gospel group... but I guess that's not fair, right?  Is the deal to pick
something he hasn't heard but knowing him, he SHOULD have heard?  that he
MIGHT have heard but didn't hear?  that he ALMOST heard but couldn't quite
hear? that he ONCE heard but wasn't listening?

Awaiting clarification...

Sonia the Sick Stickler
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Date:         Mon, 28 Dec 1992 14:30:00 EST
From:         gmgettie@THAMA1.APGEA.ARMY.MIL
Subject:      Please read this!

Marco said a few days ago:

>        More: if the thing start, I am ready to become the European re-distri-
>butor of the thing (which implied making copies and all that).

OK, folks, I'm willing to make the ALLMUSIC compilation master tape(s). I need
someone else to copy and distribute tapes for the United States. If you are
interested, e-mail me privately and we can talk.

Seeya,                                          gmgettie@thama1.apgea.army.mil
Gary
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Date:         Thu, 31 Dec 1992 07:18:19 CST
From:         Leonard Watkins <ISTS024@UABDPO.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Sharrock
              31 Dec 1992 00:32:09 GMT from <ujwb@UXA.ECN.BGU.EDU>

On Thu, 31 Dec 1992 00:32:09 GMT Jeff Beer said:
>Free improvisation means that you play with nothing planned in advance.
>Often improvisation is based on a form, in terms of number of measures,
>keys, and chord progession.  You know the 12 bar blues.
>
>In free improvisation, nothing is given in advance.  It is not so much
>that there is no form,  but that the form comes freely.  i.e.  You might
>go into G minor, but nobody planned to, and the bass player is free to
>be in another key if desired.  You are free to solo, or play background,
>or shift roles whenever you want.

That's a problem i have with it , i was listening to "Ask The Ages" and
on some tunes they seem to be in different keys, there was no structure
I'm sure i didn't give it enuff of a chance, but i really couldn't take
it long. I'm into improvisation, but i'm not sure about that type of
"free-form" because there seemed to be no structure, no rules....etc.
I'm by no means knocking Sharrock, I've heard too many good things about
him, I guess i'm so accustomed to structure that something like that is
not appealing to me. BTW the CD I put in after I tried to listen to Sharrock
was Hound Dog Taylor, I'm sure most of you feel that was a helluva change,
but we do what we have to do. I got some Michelle Shocked y'day and the
muscians she has one it are impressive, Albert Lee and Bernie Leadon to
name a couple.........L. W.

OSC: Alabama will be national champs, come Friday night.......L.W.
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Date:         Sun, 3 Jan 1993 11:07:29 EST
From:         Sonia Kovitz <skovitz@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>
Subject:      1992 Allmusic Awards Nominations

Wittiest: tie between Rick and Scott "Quotes" Hammer
   (I'm saving Adam for another award below
    though he deserves this one as well)
Threadmaker: the Cool Ice-Cubed Michael M. Masuda
   (what does that initial stand
   for anyway?  Moves? Mahogany? Malibu? Monster?)
Funkiest: Walt Keller
Nastiest: Ben the Sunywert-rat
Friendliest: Marsha of the Yiddishe Al Kopfella
Clueless: the whole gang--we've ALL been clueless at some time or other; let's
   share the honor and the infamy
Grossest musical mistake: damn, got to nominate myself since Tim had to go
   REMIND everybody of what I had hoped was long forgotten (but as long
   my son never finds out, I'm still OK)
Most original review: McIntyre (along with Creator of Most Original Music)
Sexiest: no contest here... it's the high-priestess-bag-pipestress Carol
   "Death to All Who Don't Blow"
Most playful: Renato "Now You See Him Now You Don't" Barahona
Best flamer: Adam (best combination of wit/heat/knowledge) (also you've done
   some great reviews, Adam, but I can't nominate you for EVERYTHING)
Most astonishing confession: the Incredible Timsky for his wedding tale and
   Hari Krishna memoir
Strangest: the two Revs, Bob Bob and Dave Hall, will have to share the award
Classiest: Chuckrateeze doesn't post very often but when he does it's ALWAYS
   la creme de la creme...."on the money"
Most dazzling all-around poster: Again, I hate to do this, but Marco and
   Bloomdodo-bird are going to have to share the honors
Keeper of the Flame: hands down this is David Malbuff: he's not just witty and
   overflowing with knowledge, but he also brings a wise and generous voice to
   discussions that had gotten bogged down in miscommunication, misinformation
   and just plain ugliness.

The first category... rising star/revelation or something like that...
I'll think I'll put Ilia up for that one.

Sonia "Moussorgsky wrote Peter and the Wolf right after he finished the Volga
Boat Song"
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 10:59:14 EST
From:         Ilia <CC29@IONA.BITNET>
Subject:      Is this a foreign language or what?

Marco writes:

> Matte Kudasai
> Thela Hun Jingeet
>
>         Does anyone know what this means? I suspect Matte Kudasai might be
> a name, but I have no hint about the other one. Maybe Bloomster has a clue,
> this time :)...

       Nope, Matte Kudasai means 'please wait' in Japanese. Good luck
finding the other one. :)
                                          Ilia.
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 09:40:23 CST
From:         Dave <USTS060@RUST1.DPO.UAB.EDU>
Subject:      Re: piss metal

 From:          Tim Johnson <ST402711%BROWNVM.BITNET@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU>
 Subject:       piss metal
>
> It may seem a subtle distinction, but it is an important
> one.  Freedom of speech means freedom to oppose ideas, too.
>
> Okay?
>
>               -Tim

    I've never believed otherwise.  I'm sorry if I was unclear.

OMC, I found a Sony walkman in the gutter on the way to work!
(Seeing as someone decided yesterday to relieve me of my car, I'm now
walking.)  The walkman was useless but the head phones are excellent.


======================================================================
Rev. Dave Hall                |  "It's not the voting that's
usts060@rust1.dpo.uab.edu     |   democracy, it's the counting.
                              |     -- Tom Stoppard
======================================================================
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
From: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer)
Subject: Re: Sharrock
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 00:32:09 GMT

In article <ALLMUSIC%92123014585265@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU> Leonard Watkins <ISTS024@UABDPO.BITNET> writes:
>I finally heard some Sonny Sharrock, i've heard the group talk about him
>alot and i've read about him in guitar mags..Is that kinda thang called
>"free improvisation" and what exactly does that mean.....L.W.

It is when you play a gig and don't get paid :)

Free improvisation means that you play with nothing planned in advance.
Often improvisation is based on a form, in terms of number of measures,
keys, and chord progession.  You know the 12 bar blues.

In free improvisation, nothing is given in advance.  It is not so much
that there is no form,  but that the form comes freely.  i.e.  You might
go into G minor, but nobody planned to, and the bass player is free to
be in another key if desired.  You are free to solo, or play background,
or shift roles whenever you want.

Jeff


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From: mjferzig@MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Subject: Allmusic boxed set / catalog?????
Date: 3 Jan 93 17:08:21 GMT
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Tim writes - toungue in cheek....

>  The solution to the comp tape problem.
>
>  The ALLMUSIC Boxed Set.
>
>  (Gotta move with the times, guys)


Tim may be on to something, folks. Many of us, myself included, have
created some sort of compilation of our favorite types of music. To name a
few - Sonia's "Blues Roots" set, my a cappella set, Bob Turnbull's "Canuck"
tape.....I'm sure that there are many more that I don't know about. While
many of these have been traded around, many have not. I would be willing to
put together a list of all these compilations, if people want to copy them
for people - kind of a catalog. If you want to submit a compilation tape
description, please send the following information - by private e-mail:

Name of tape(s) and how many in the set
"Type" of music
Short description
Full name of submitter
E-mail address of submitter
Price of tapes including sending them, if person wants to pay instead of
trade.

This will not put an obligation on anyone to send their tapes, but merely
provide a central forum to browse for neato cool stuff. Later, we might
include peoples own recordings of their bands....etc, etc....

Anyone think this is a good idea?

Marsha
mjferzig@midway.uchicago.edu


Marsha J. Ferziger
University of Chicago School of Law
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Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 09:56:33 CST
From:         El chahuistli <U33963@UICVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Zappa birthday

OK, so today's is Frank's 52nd.  How're you going to celebrate it on the list?
(BTW, it's also Jane Fonda's b-day, though I've lost count).

OMC: Picked up a copy of Tower Records/Video's _Pulse_ (December, 1992, no. 111
). It's one gigantic magazine billboard though it has interesting stuff.  Witne
ss p. 17 with a long list of independent labels (with addresses and blurbs).  I
t's apparently an update to the September issue (which I missed), that also inc
luded a listing of such.  Check it out!  It's free.

Renato (Mud Shark) Barahona
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 08:56:00 EDT
From:         Another message from Rosemary! <RWARREN@TOPAZ.CONCORDIA.CA>
Subject:      beat it, just beat it

compliments of the season to allmusic readers.

today is my last working day before the holidays.  for that reason, i will be
shutting off the allmusic feeds in a couple of hours.  i have not decided yet
if i shall return in the new year, as i am literally drowning in e-mail and i
need some time to get it under control (no pun intended).

since i am staff here, my account will not be de-activated -- anyone who wants
to yak about pop's Royal Family or send me "good riddance" msgs is more than
welcome to use the e-mail drop below.

"The Jackson Five wanna wish everybody
Our personal Merry Christmas, and a groovy New Year!"
        The Jackson Five, "We Wish You a Merry Christmas"

Rosemary Warren         rwarren@topaz.concordia.ca
Montreal's Favorite Jacksonmaniac !!!
(live and in person until the 23rd, return engagement begins Jan 4th)
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Date:         Mon, 28 Dec 1992 13:54:56 EST
From:         The Chrome-Plated Megaphone of Destiny <test4@TOPCAT.BSC.MASS.EDU>
Subject:      Bye for awhile

Well, it appears with all the christmas cheer being spread around, that my
accounts were deleted. I'm sending this message from a generic account, so
please don't reply to this address. I'm just posting this to say that I'll be
off of AllMusic for awhile. I have an account on Cleveland Freenet which you
can reach me at. The address is cd632@cleveland.freenet.edu. I'm not sure
how much mailbox space they give you and I don't know how often I'll be
able to logon, so I'm kind of hesitant about subscribing to AllMusic through
there. Hopefully when I get down to North Carolina in a couple of weeks, I'll
be able to get an account and resume the fun. Until then, you have my
permission to discuss Kenny G., Madonna, Prince and Michael Jackson all you
want. 8)

-Adam

P.S. How am I going to know where to blow all my money now! 8(
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 07:27:28 PDT
From:         David Malbuff <SPGDAM@UCCVMA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: piss metal

On Tue, 22 Dec 1992 17:01:20 EST Tim said:
>
>David (it was david, wasn't it?) seemed to confuse this with
>censorship.  If I protest or picket or launch into a tirade
>over Danzig, that isn't censorship.  If I gather up the LPs
>and burn them, that isn't censorship.  If I ask the govt. to
>do that, it is.
>

No, my mention of censorship (viz. Helms) was parenthetical. I shouldn't even
have used the word. It had nothing to do with what I was talking about.

What I meant to say (and obviously did a poor job of saying) was that it is
hypocritical to stand up and piously invoke the First Amendment in defense
of art that you like, but not to do the same for art that you dislike. And
it was (and is) my contention that many of our most vocal public critics of
Helms et. al. are selective in what they will defend. Ergo, they are
hypocrites (excepting the ACLU, as Russ mentioned; they will defend
almost anybody). It's not a question of "like" or "dislike"; it's the
degree of self-righteousness inherent in many of those who set themselves
up as defenders of "free speech".


David
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Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 11:16:57 EST
Comments:     Package Item - re: Zappa's Birthday
From:         Mick Jeffries <MICK.JEFFRIES@UKWANG.UKY.EDU>
Subject:      re: Zappa's Birthday

Renado, just having the "Mud Shark" around is celebration enough;

Betcha don't have a bottle of Dr. Brown's Cel-Ray handy  ;)


                                         Mick
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