HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: drakonar@cs.montana.edu (Charles L. Stewart III)
Subject: Re: PEOPLE HELPING PEOPLE
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, MSU, Bozeman Mt 59717
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 17:12:18 GMT

In article <1524.25.uupcb@madness.network23.com> alan.neal@madness.network23.com (Alan Neal)  writes:
>  ( This is not about peoples dreams. i.e. sleeping at any rate)
>  ( but the fulfillment of their dreams)
>  Do you have enough time?
> Are you trying to achieve a goal and don't seem to have the money?
> Do you want to help your family and yourself to reach these dreams?
> If these things apply to you then I can open a door to you that can
>change your life.
>Post me Email and leave your phone ## I'd like to talk to you in person
>and help you to acheive those dreams
>                                              

Ohhh, pleeeeze!
Sounds like one of those "phychic advisor" 1-900 ads on late-night tv.

-- 
      ---=>   Charles Stewart (aka Scott) : drakonar@cs.montana.edu   <=---
	          "Oh oh.  Looks like we need another Timmie!"
			   For Dinosaurs fans only.
From: Tarzan
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: A Question to lucid dreamers
Date: 5 Nov 92 14:44:29 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research

In article <92308.190029SRK106@psuvm.psu.edu> Senthil Ramas Kumar
<SRK106@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>hi, I just have this simple question for u all pple.  while being in this
>lucid dreaming state, when u ever meet anyone else, has anyone told that
>other person in the dream "hey, do u realize that this is all a dream ?".
>if the answer is yes, then I'd like to know thier responses.
>
>thankx in advance.
>
>Kumar
>
I became lucid in a dream and my best friend was there.  I told him we were in
a dream but he didn't seem to care.
From: heard@qut.edu.au
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: An alternative theroy about dreaming
Date: 9 Nov 92 09:26:52 EST
Organization: Queensland University of Technology

Michael Turner (MT) in reply to me (RH) says --

RH>And it seems to me that Hobson et al are hung up on the 
RH>mistaken notion that randomness means meaninglessness.
RH>
RH>The ideas of Hobson I have read here (I havent read the
RH>original) seem to be guilty of the old reductionist
RH>error of explaining dreams at the lowest level, and
RH>then saying that dreams are NOTHING BUT what happens on
RH>this low level. 
MT> 
MT> Then I suggest you read Hobson, because he doesn't believe
MT> this at all.  He is only suggesting that the *source* of
MT> dreams has no intrinsic meaning, not that the dreams themselves
MT> are meaningless.  

Fine. Some people quoting Hobson here did make the
connection between explaining the origins of a dream
and explaining a dream away. If I wrote strongly it is
because I feel passionately about the subject. I was, 
however, careful to say I hadn't read the original.

MT> His leanings are more toward Jung, in fact,
MT> and away from Freud.  I think of his work as putting much
MT> of Jungian dreamwork on a more scientific foundation --
MT> something that is long overdue.
MT> 
MT> If, however, you find that putting *anything* on a scientific
MT> foundation is too "reductionist" for you, then you won't like
MT> Hobson.  He is, after all, a scientist.  Personally, I happen
MT> to like the idea of a true science of dreams, since it might
MT> lead to innovations and understanding that help in my dreamwork.

What I mean by `reductionist' is when someone explains
a phenomenon on the lowest level (such as random firing of
neurons) and then believes that is all there is to it. 

I agree with you, and also like the idea of a science 
of dreams. I am currently looking for a copy of 
Hobson's book. As you can see from my signiture quote I 
believe there is nothing incompatible between dreams 
and reason.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

Take care

Ronno
-------------------------------------------------------------
For dreams and reason, against beliefs and untested authority
Newsgroups: alt.dreams,sci.med
From: nrh@philabs.philips.com (Nikolaus R. Haus)
Subject: Re: Using naps to shorten day-cycle
Originator: nrh@lion
Reply-To: nrh@philabs.philips.com (Nikolaus R. Haus)
Organization: Philips Laboratories, Briarcliff, NY 10510
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 1992 23:23:40 GMT


In article <1992Oct30.165022.17126@midway.uchicago.edu>, jaffray@dent.uchicago.edu (Alan Jaffray) writes:
>Is sleep cumulative?  That is, if I normally require 7 hours of sleep
>per night to function properly during the day, will other combinations
>such as a 2-3 hour nap in the afternoon and 4-5 hours at night do just
>as well?  And does anyone have a good, somewhat practical reference 
>on the subject of sleep?
>
>I ask because I do my best work after midnight, but working then is
>impractical with my current schedule since I have to get up at 8AM.
>Also having my day-cycle be shorter would be nice since my schedule
>is very unstructured (nothing besides MWF classes 9:30-2:30), and endless
>hours of unbroken study time on TThSS make the day just drag on...
>having the day be shorter, a little more divided, would be very nice.
>I'm just not sure if I can get away with it.
>
>-- Alan
>

I had a friend in college try this. His method was to sleep one hour every six. (I think
he got it from leonardo- I'm not sure). He made it about a month and a half, but by then he
was such a total wreck that he had to stop.

Of course, this is the same guy who spent the entire next semester in bed, only getting
up for biological needs.

-nikkin
-- 
"... nights of heat and weirdness in which we alone are awake,
 humming with forbidden energy; nights into which we would not
 send our dogs - wild sea and wet forest and eyes and teeth ..."
From: shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan)
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: Telepathic connections in dreams
Date: 9 Nov 92 15:27:55 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

crlstu1@bnrca (Julie Beeston) writes:

>>(*) Yes, there are rumours about telepathic connections resulting in
>>meeting real people in dreams. I really would like to hear if someone
>>has evidence to confirm this. This probably would result in my theory
>>being revised in certain parts...

This just happened to me in the past few days.

People from Central Jersey might be aware that in the past few days,
a woman named Gail Shollar was carjacked and later found stabbed
to death in Piscataway, NJ.

On Thursday night, I was watching the evening news and I saw the story
about the carjacking.  They said that Gail Shollar and her 3 year old
daughter were waiting at a traffic light when a man forced his way into
the car.  The daughter was left on the front lawn of a day care center,
but the Gail, her van, and her kidnapper, had not been found.  The husband
appeared on the news with his family, crying and pleading for her return.

I went to sleep afterwards.  I dreamt that I was at work, sitting with
my co-workers at lunch and discussing this incident.  Someone told me that 
"they were found, and they are dead", then I saw two mounds of freshly
dug dirt, side by side in the woods, and I knew they were graves.

I woke up the next morning and I remembered this dream and I knew that
Gail Shollar was dead.  But then I realized that in my dream, I had
seen two graves and had been told that "they" were dead, not "she".  So
I figured I must have been dreaming about something else and I forgot 
about it.

Later that day, at lunch, I was sitting with my co-workers discussing
the kidnapping.  I looked at the newspaper on the table and it said
that in the process of searching for Gail Shollar, the police found
the body of a woman who had been kidnapped over the summer, in
Florida.  She was found buried in the woods.

I didn't make the connection with my dream, because I had written the 
dream off.  But I still had a strong feeling that Gail Shollar
was dead.  

Sunday night, I heard on the news that Gail Shollar's body was found
and she died of multiple stab wounds.  Her body was found in the woods.
I am assuming that it was buried because while the reporter was saying
that her body was found, the video footage was of police digging in the
woods.

So there were two people dead (and buried?) in the woods.  

Pretty creepy.



-- 
Susan R. Hagan (shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu) 
Publications Coordinator - User Services
Rutgers University Computing Services
From: philip@labtam.labtam.oz.au (Philip Stephens)
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: crash...
Date: 6 Nov 92 01:20:49 GMT
Organization: Labtam Australia Pty. Ltd., Melbourne, Australia

Anson Kennedy writes:

>The point is that with 5 billion people dreaming every night, 
>occasionally someone will dream of *something* which seems to
>correspond to an actual event.  If you had not heard the report
>of the actual accident, your dream would probably be quickly
>forgotten.

  These sort of arguments don't get you anywhere.  You could be having real
precognitive dreams and still dismiss them because they are "statistically
bound to happen".
  Personally, I think the invention of statistics by the scientific community
was a scam to make it easier for them to ignore the hard questions :-) :-)

-- 
| Philip Stephens, Systems Programmer. | %%%%  %     Labtam Australia Pty Ltd |
| Address:  43 Malcolm Road, Braeside, |   % % % %     "Applied Ingenuity"    |
|           Victoria, 3195, AUSTRALIA. |  %  % %  %  We make the fastest RISC |
| Internet: philip@labtam.labtam.oz.au | %%%%% %%%%% X terminals in the world |
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: <None>
From: cvadrbha@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu
Date: 9 Nov 92 16:22:21 PST
Organization: California State Polytechnic University, Pomona
Nntp-Posting-User: cvadrbha

In a way, it's a blessing.  It makes it easier to handle the situation when it
actually occurs.  I sometimes have those too.   A psychic has told me to go
take training courses, and then I will receive "good" foreknowledge too.
Just accept that you sometimes (always?) have this foreknowledge.  It's a mixed
blessing...
From: Tarzan
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: Lucidity...OBE's
Date: 5 Nov 92 15:08:41 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research

In article <30OCT199211141590@venus.tamu.edu> vbp8723@venus.tamu.edu (PEREZ,
VERONICA BEATRIX) writes:
>I've been on the verge of having OBE's for several days now...Many of you
>would probably tell me to post this in some other news group, but I consider
>OBE's a part of lucid dreams...
>
>My question concerns the fact that on several occasions, I'll actually 
>sense myself "bobbing in and out of water"... and I've concluded that what it
>is, is my astral body trying to free itself from my physical body (Hence,
>the "bobbing" sensation).  Am I subconsciously afraid of astral projection,
>explaining the reluctance to break free?  -or-  Is there anything else that 
>I should be aware of?
>
>Hints, pointers and advice are appreciated...
>
>Moongazer
>
>
You want advice?  Post to alt. Out of Body
Also next time you are bobbing, imagine yourself moving up in some fashion.
i.e. elevator, flying, driving
From: v067s2qs@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (John P Demarco)
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: test
Date: 10 Nov 92 20:28:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Summary:  
Date: 10 Nov 1992 15:18 EST  
Distribution: world
Keywords:  

In article <1992Nov10.093922.18327@gnosys.svle.ma.us>, gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us (Gary S. Trujillo) writes...
>In <1992Nov5.151145.15705@nrtpa038.bnr.ca> Tarzan writes:
> 
>> In article <1992Oct31.185353.12812@cs.uwp.edu> itzenhui@cs.uwp.edu
>>	(Steve Itzenhuiser) writes:
> 
>> >I have experienced what some term Out Of Body Experiences (OOBEs)..
> 
>> Post to alt. Out of Body
> 
>I would like to amend this suggestion a bit to suggest that people wanting
>to discuss out-of-body experiences *cross-post* their articles to the new
>"alt.out-of-body" newsgroup.  You have only to edit the "Newsgroups:" line
>of the header of your article so that it contains not only the name of the
>"alt.dreams" newsgroup, but also some other(s), in this case "alt.out-of-body":
> 
>		Newsgroups: alt.dreams,alt.out-of-body
> 
>Doing so will cause your article to simultaneously be posted to *both* news-
>groups, so that whichever of the two newsgroups some reader visits first,
>your article will be presented in that newsgroup.  Only one copy of your
>article will be transmitted through Usenet, and only one copy will be stored
>on each system receiving it - and the news software will keep track of the
>fact that the article should be presented to readers of both newsgroups, and
>it will make sure that once the article has been read in one of the news-
>groups it is removed from the list to be read in any other newsgroups in
>which it appears for that particular reader.
> 
>Thanks!!
> 
>Gary
>--
>    Gary S. Trujillo                            gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us
>Somerville, Massachusetts              {wjh12,bu.edu,spdcc,ima,cdp}!gnosys!gst
********************************************************
    sorry  
this is just a test. i've been reading alt.dreams   for a few weeks now and
find it to be very interesting.
  just out of curiosity   how do you post??? 
i tried to post my own message and i ended up right under GARY

  please excuse my non-understanding of this process- i'm just a virgin at this

    thanks i advance
      john de marco        e-mail   v067s2qs@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
From: s_titz@ira.uka.de (Olaf Titz)
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: Telepathic connections in dreams
Date: 10 Nov 1992 16:41:35 GMT
Organization: Fachschaft math/inf, Uni Karlsruhe, FRG
NNTP-Posting-Host: irau30.ira.uka.de

In article <Nov.9.10.27.54.1992.15417@gandalf.rutgers.edu> shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan) writes:
>crlstu1@bnrca (Julie Beeston) writes:
        ^^^^^^
(No, that was me :-) - thanks to a doubled quotation - but, Julie, if you
read this, note that your news software is still broken...) 

>>>>(*) Yes, there are rumours about telepathic connections resulting in
>>>meeting real people in dreams. I really would like to hear if someone
>>>has evidence to confirm this. This probably would result in my theory
>>>being revised in certain parts...
>
>This just happened to me in the past few days.
>
>People from Central Jersey might be aware that in the past few days,
>a woman named Gail Shollar was carjacked and later found stabbed
>to death in Piscataway, NJ.
>
>[and Susan heard of it being told to her in a dream]

But I don't think this is an actual *telepathic* *conversation* but
rather an experience of precognition...

Not that that makes it less notable, of course, but maybe we should
carefully avoid confusion...
-- 
| Olaf Titz - comp.sc.student  |   o     | uknf@dkauni2.bitnet | old address |
| univ. of karlsruhe - germany |  _>\ _  | s_titz@ira.uka.de   | is still    |
| +49-721-60439                | (_)<(_) | praetorius@irc      | valid       |
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
From: pally@mikejag.wimsey.bc.ca (Pally Hoffstein)
Subject: Re: night terriors
Organization: mikejag (mike) is a private system in Vancouver, BC, Canada
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 06:40:01 GMT

In article <MAD.92Nov6101208@spirit.clearpoint.com> mad@spirit.clearpoint.com (Michael Davis) writes:
>On 5 Nov 92 20:56:59 GMT, bell@vax.sonoma.edu said:
>jmb> I am looking for information on night terriors.  What purpose do
>jmb> they serve.  Can any one out there give me some good ideas of
>jmb> places to start?
>
>I occasionally get them, usually during periods of greater than normal
>stress in my personal life or at work.  Maybe they are a way of
>reminding me to slow down and relax.

I'm someone who's had a chronic history of night terrors through much of my
life. I know they're due to certain events in my life and the terrors are a
problem when I'm not dealing with them. If you're having a problem with
nightmares and bad nights look for things causing you stress in your life
right now and if the now is fine, how about the past? They're one of the ways
your body tells you something is wrong.

Pally Hoffstein
Vancouver, Canada

-- 
Television permits many millions     |   I threw bitter tears at the ocean, 
of people to share a joke and to     |   But all that came back was the tide.
still be lonely. - T.S. Eliot        | 		- Sarah McLachlan
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 12:45:43 EST
From: The Dreamer <ASG102@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: Telepathy in Dreams (The Dreamer)
 <92316.021325SRK106@psuvm.psu.edu>

In article <92316.021325SRK106@psuvm.psu.edu>, Senthil Ramas Kumar
<SRK106@psuvm.psu.edu> says:
>
>really interesting, can we as a whole group do some more experiments along
>these lines ?
>
>Kumar

     I don't see why not, but I would be unable to set up such an experiment
(although I will give suggestions if you would like).  Due to my involvement
in other groups and work, I can only participate in a limited manner although
I would be willing to be a subject of the experiment.

     Love and Peace and Not Enough Hours,
               -The Dreamer-
From: s_titz@ira.uka.de (Olaf Titz)
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: Occam's Razor, disproving precognition.
Date: 10 Nov 1992 17:06:17 GMT
Organization: Fachschaft math/inf, Uni Karlsruhe, FRG
NNTP-Posting-Host: irau30.ira.uka.de
Summary: Really? I doubt.

In article <gj156879.721082288@cunews> gj156879@alfred.carleton.ca ( gj student 156879) writes:
>Occam's razor, for those of you who don't know, is the idea that the
>most likely reason for something occuring, is the SIMPLEST
>explanation.

And by far not the only one imaginable, and I doubt that it can be
used to *disprove* anything (as suggested by the subject line).

>It's a neat little reality checker.  Someone mentioned it earlier,
>saying that using occam's razor, you can look at a case of
>precognition in a dream and say "Eh, just a coincidence".  It IS the
>simplest explanation, yes.

If physics really would rely on this kind of Occam's Razor, we would
still stick with Newton's Laws. (Note that Einstein's theories have
been dismissed by virtually the whole scientific world back then.)

A more careful application of this principle can be found in /A Brief
History of Time/.

>But you have to remember when you go about slashing things up with
>Occam's double sided gilette, that sometimes reality ain't that
>simple.  I'm sure people can think up situations where the most LIKELY
>explanation, the most PROBABLE cause is NOT the actual cause.  Life
>isn't that cut (pun intended) and dry.

Exactly ;-)

-- 
| Olaf Titz - comp.sc.student  |   o     | uknf@dkauni2.bitnet | old address |
| univ. of karlsruhe - germany |  _>\ _  | s_titz@ira.uka.de   | is still    |
| +49-721-60439                | (_)<(_) | praetorius@irc      | valid       |
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
Subject: Re: Brain Disagreement
From: mew@gacvx1.gac.edu
Date: 4 Nov 92 17:15:18 -0600
Distribution: national
Organization: Gustavus Adolphus College, St. Peter, Minnesota
Nntp-Posting-User: mew

In article <Bwyt7E.FpM@mentor.cc.purdue.edu>, halljw@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Johann Gambleputty) writes:
> Ok...I think I've got this lucid dream stuff down...but here's what happens
> every time I KNOW I'm in a dream.  I'll decide that "Ahaa!.  This is a dream.
> I'll do what I want!"  As soon as I make that decision...all hell breaks
> loose.  Nothing goes the way I plan and I wind up dying EVERY time.

This is close to the problem I have.  When I am dreaming, I almost never know
that it is only a dream (even when some obviously strange things are
happening).  Anyway, if or when I do figure out that I am dreaming I always
wake up... I can never keep dreaming.  Does anyone know what I can do to keep
myself dreaming?  Just wondering,
                                  Matt.
> 
> 
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
From: miket@hermes.tcs.com (Michael Turner nmscore Assoc.)
Subject: Re: Who do these characters get peeved?
Organization: Teknekron Communications Inc.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 04:59:57 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.104828.20417@yang.earlham.edu> connebr@yang.earlham.edu (Brandon Connerly) writes:
>In article <gj156879.721081494@cunews>, gj156879@alfred.carleton.ca ( gj student 156879) writes:
>> I have a theory as to why dream characters get annoyed when you tell
>> them they are "just" dream, and it has to do with Multiple Personality
>> Disorder (MPD for short).  Think of your standard MPDer, (the
>> stereotypical one)  many characters fighting over one body.  Now
>> consider how in a dream, you are the ego, the main dude in control,
>> and the rest of the beings around you are "lesser personalities".
>> Needless to say, when you tell them they are JUST dream, they'd get
>> pissed off, because they ARE you, or a facet of who you are.
>[...]
>> A theory.  What do you all think?
>>  
>>                                                   Nik
>
>Interesting. There is another explanation, though. If, when you dream, you
>subconsciously try to explain a lot of random input, other people would be
>likely to react in whatever way you normally expect them to. So if you tell
>someone in RL that they're part of your dream, they might be surprised,
>angry or whatever. So in dreaming, you'd subconsciously make them react 
>that way.

It doesn't square with my experience.  My two experiences are (1) grudging
acceptance, (2) a retort to the effect that I'm also only a dream character.
Both of these reaction were a surprise to me.  And it's still a surprise
that dream characters can act in such unexpected ways.

The only way to test your explanation is if you somehow could convince
someone in RL that they were in your dream, and see what they say.

I think there is some merit in the argument that the dream-characters
react the way you yourself would react if someone could prove to you
that you were only in his/her dream.  This one is sort of testable, if
you could induce a non-lucid dream (via suggestion) in which a dream
character convinced you that YOU were in HIS dream.  Hardly a controlled
experiment, but better than nothing.
---
Michael Turner
miket@tcs.com
Newsgroups: alt.dreams
From: miket@hermes.tcs.com (Michael Turner nmscore Assoc.)
Subject: Re: chatting with lucid dream characters
Organization: Teknekron Communications Inc.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 19:34:28 GMT

In article <BxJy0A.KtB@cs.psu.edu> cole@gaff.physci.psu.edu (Robert Cole) writes:
>[Excellent lucid dream account, deleted.]
>	Sometimes my lucid dreams "decay" into ordinary ones and I go on
>sleeping.  Very often, however, at some point I will just lose control
>and return to waking consciousness under protest.  Much has been said about
>inducing lucid dreams but how do they typically end?  Do many of you go
>on until you get bored and open you eyes or do you also suffer from this
>loss of control?  Are there ways to maintain control and extend the experience?

Once in a great while I have gotten bored.  The one time I remember, it must have
been about a 20-minute lucid dream, according to clock readings taken before
and after (assuming they were RL clocks -- that gets dodgy sometimes, though.)
Towards the end, I ran out of experiments, and just kind of waited around as
various mildly strange things happened, reminding myself over and over that I
was dreaming.  But I should always be so lucky!

Often I lose lucidity without realizing it, particularly if the dream gets
very active -- I'm so busy keeping up with weirdness, I forget it isn't RL.

LaBerge developed one very interesting technique for keeping lucid dreams
going as they start to fade: spin around in the air.   I've used this with
some success -- usually, you end up in another dream, one that is usually
shorter, in my experience.  He also documents some other techniques.
---
Michael Turner
miket@tcs.com
Newsgroups: alt.dreams