HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dleland@dante.nmsu.edu (LELAND)
Subject: Re: Why I hate Santa.
Organization: New Mexico State University, Las Cruces, NM
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 17:03:25 GMT

Dear me Walter, you certainly are a perhaps overly serious one aren't you. Jeez,
"Why I hate Santa?" Yech..... Well anyway, I've consulted a few elves on
this one, and I have been told it's a COMMON MISCONCEPTION that all presents
that end up under the tree on CHristmas morning are Santa's presents. Certain
affluent parents may forge his signature (ask them what they got in their
stockings, and ask them to tell you the truth!) and say to their spoiled kids
"This Ferarri is from Santa," but it isn't. Ask the poor child with nothing who
brought him the basketball. He'll tell you. 

Jeez Walter, ease up!


Darrell Leland
dleland@nmsu.edu


PS: in some eastern countries right now the BEG Santa to leave coal in
their stockings: it's cold!!! 
Newsgroups: alt.religion.santaism
From: ddresp@dante.nmsu.edu (DRESP)
Subject: i love god
Organization: New Mexico State University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1993 04:10:28 GMT

 what more can I say.

    Yes love him,and serve him.
	This is god speaking to you now.
From: jef@netcom.com (Jef Poskanzer)
Newsgroups: alt.religion.santaism
Subject: Oh boy!
Date: 25 Dec 92 00:00:05 GMT
Reply-To: Jef Poskanzer <jef@netcom.com>
Organization: Paratheo-Anametamystikhood Of Eris Esoteric
X-Face: uPIE),q]+zmF49L%(pdE;nX/8$/J22&&&C@_)8BouYx42Y--?*,\]*MIeTY#mCM(x>FyD@+0D-Jm]S_8lxop(Q-$L#~b8!ha;eF[b+GOLyu<]4$">NeVymJ@F#M?1O`ue4,h4`2S^KGjmP%no(d,:<Ur:+f6W8$J:'t9BxH

It's midnight in Greenwich!  He's on his way!
---
Jef

           Jef Poskanzer  jef@netcom.com  jef@well.sf.ca.us
                         Use only as directed.
From: arb@presto.ig.com (Dan Arbios)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Somalia
Date: 29 Dec 92 21:12:28 GMT
Organization: IntelliGenetics Inc., Mtn. View, Ca.


Regardless of whether the U.S. is out to rule the world,
who else thinks George Bush is trying to create a U.S. Republican
policy before he leaves office!
He's all of a sudden ready to send troops now to Bosnia .

Clinton can only half-support these issues since he's an 'American"
but deep down doesn't want to get involved in this war...

Any thoughts from the Rush Limbaugh crowd....by the way , my DAD
bought himself his book for x-mas and I found it quite funny

Only when and if he runs for office will we have to extract him from
life's fruitfulness.....;0)   

-a dissident



    
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia,alt.politics.org.un,alt.president.clinton,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.bush
From: geff@iastate.edu (Geff Underwood)
Subject: Re: Somalia
Organization: none for me, thanks, I'm trying to cut down
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 17:20:15 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.035734.24397@news.columbia.edu> egl1@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Elizabeth G. Levy) writes:
>In article <1h5vnrINN9f2@CATHY.NA.CS.YALE.EDU> yarvin@cs.yale.edu (Norman Yarvin) writes:
>>egl1@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Elizabeth G. Levy) writes:
>>
>>>I don't think we should remove all arms by force.  This risks shifting
>>>Somali public opinion against us.  What may happen is an offer of
>>>food/money for guns.  We'll have to see.
>>
>>Money for guns?  Hahaha.  They will sell you only their old and useless guns.
>>Just look at what happened to various money-for-guns programs in the US.
>>And the Somalians need their guns a lot more than US citizens do.
>
>True, though it's arguable that the fewer guns there are in the
>street, the better.

Then argue it.  I'm sure that everyone will agree that it would be good
to get the guns away from the murderers and thieves, but just grabbing
guns from anybody you can reach is quite different.  My fear is that,
just as it happened in our own nation's capitol, disarmament will hit
the innocent far more than the guilty.

Taking guns away from innocent people is, in the best possible case,
pointless.  If the guilty still have their guns, disarming the innocent
is signing their death warrants.

>>Food for guns?  The people with guns have not had a problem getting food.
>
>I thought this was the problem.

Not precisely -- the problem is that some people are starving, not that
others aren't.  A nit, perhaps, but I do tend to read things literally.

Anyway, his objection is valid.  Why would a thief give you his only gun
for some food, when he knows that he can make people give him food for
nothing?  I can understand somebody making that trade if they are
unwilling to steal, but what's the point?

There is another reason for us not to try to disarm Somalia.  If we let
others expand our mission, when will the mission end?  We shouldn't have
sent troops in the first place, not without public debate; adding
another task only compounds the error.

--
Geff Underwood
geff@iastate.edu
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
From: kirby@xerox.com (Mike Kirby)
Subject: Re: WHAT?!?!?!
Reply-To: kirby@xerox.com
Organization: Xerox Corporation, Webster NY
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 16:28:18 GMT

In article 4714@news.columbia.edu, egl1@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Elizabeth G. Levy) writes:
>In article <1992Dec22.182540.5282@sunova.ssc.gov> rocko@ireland.ssc.gov (Rick O'Leary) writes:
>>
>>Andy, 
>>
>>Are you watching U.S. T.V.???????  Are you blind?
>>
>>U.S.T.V. is the most LEFT_WING liberal loony bin in all the fruited planes.
>>
>>If the U.S. hadn't done something you LEFT_WING NUTS would be screaming for
>>
>>help.
>>
>>Get a grip.
>
>TV is left-wing?  No, pardon, LEFT_WING?
>
>Oh, joy, another one of those insightful critiques of the media from
>the Right!  'Tis the season....
>
>
>
>--
>"What does not kill me only makes me stronger, right?"
>	"Ooooh, no. You're weak as a kitten!"


Actually, It is widely accepted that the national media tends to lean toward
the left, and local media tends to lean toward the right (on the average).

Since most americans get their news (local & national & international) from the
local channels, it stands to reason that the majority of what americans hear is
slightly biased to the right.

I would not consider either local or national media to be very far to the left or
the right on the average.  There are special exceptions.

Mike Kirby
Xerox Corp
E-mail: kirby.roch803@xerox.com
From: ck442@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Floyd Low)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Re: Canadians and a bit of an apology
Date: 30 Dec 1992 05:55:29 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


see message 534, this is very accurate info but you should note we have announced our intention to pull out of cyprus in summer 1993 after being there since 1964. all told this is timely info and i hope i get a UN GONG (medal) in 1993...ps, in my opinion 
peacekeeping is the way of the future for full time military
forces (I'm a reserve army logistics supply captain flying a desk
(modern day term is flying a workstation) and we are now into
low intensity warfare i.e there is no such thing as peace where
mom bakes apple pie ad infinitum...and...if i may gaze into my 
crystal ball which doubles as the internet i think that the rise
of the work smart north americans i.e Canada/USA vis a vis Pres
Clinton's desired direction for education and the workforce means
that as north america  tries to draw back a piece of the economic
action in high tech industry for high paying voters etc we can look
forward to more of global peacekeeping....can anyone spell turmoil?
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
From: chrisb@seachg.uucp (Chris Blask)
Subject: Re: somalia
Keywords: no reply
Reply-To: chrisb@seachg.UUCP (Chris Blask)
Organization: Me, Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 15:52:51 GMT

>WE MUST CONTINUE TO SPEAK OUT AGAINST THE US ARMY OCCUPATION
>OF SOMALIA, and the horrifying hi-tech killing machines they
>use to impose their control on all parts of the world.
>
>  For those of you that realize this, let's hear from you!!
>Don't let these gratuitous right-wing ideologues dominate
>the net the way they dominate the mass media!!!!!
>
>                                   andy wells
>          ///\\\         awells@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu

Has this world gone ENTIRELY SCHIZOPHRENIC?  I won't repeat the postings
pointing out that folks like the above (^) were screaming, just recently,
that we were all scum for not rushing out and saving some lives, and now
we're scum because we are!  So the US motives aren't virgin-white, WHO
CARES?!  Do you fools live in such a world of absolutes that you won't eat
if your food isn't 100% ALL NATURAL, your napkins 100% CHLORINE FREE and
your dishes 100% (lead-free) CRYSTAL?  In an imperfect world we will take
what we can, even if it's George Bush's shot at personal immortality, to
move good things in good directions.  We will watch the players like hawks,
cry "Foul!" when we see hands in the wrong pockets, but we will NOT defeat
the purpose by screaming like spoiled brats and refusing to play if things
aren't EXACTLY the way we want them!

Mr. Wells, of Northeatern University, I don't know how you ever arrived at
a statement that could call ME a 'gratuitous right-wing idealogue', I have
taken enough crap defending my idealist beliefs and trying to achieve some
REAL good, however small.  Come back to the real world, and join the
program.  If you want the world to handle situations like this in a manner
more to your liking, you should probably invest your time in calling for an
effective world body (oh, gee, the UN isn't perfect either!  WORK ON IT!).

To the rest of the fanatics out there, BUY A VOWEL!  Get some focus!  If
you want to work against something, use sharp sticks, NOT NUKES!  If you
are careful and don't randomly thrash around, you can ditch the bathwater
without throwing out the baby!

sermon mode off

-chris blask

*******************************************************************************

Gratuitous Right-Wing Idealogues Handbook - ch. 6, pg 75

	"...and no long-haired, misty-eyed idealists will be allowed
		to attend meetings or functions or..."

		see?  buggers wouldn't even let me join!
From: yarvin@cs.yale.edu (Norman Yarvin)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Re: Survival of the fittest...
Date: 22 Dec 1992 15:10:11 -0500
Organization: Yale Computer Science Department
NNTP-Posting-Host: cathy.na.cs.yale.edu

goykhman@apollo.hp.com (Alexander S. Goykhman) writes:
>    Why are you so sure the Somalis want us to rebuild their infrastructure?
>    Yesterday, CNN ran a story on this subject:  it turns out that Somalis
>    spent the last couple of years annihilating whatever infrastructure
>    British, Soviets, and American had left behind.  For example, they
>    ripped electrical wires off the poles, undug water pipes, took apart
>    the phone system and dismantled their factories.  Apparently, the Somalis
>    do not want no Western-style infrastructure in their country.

It wasn't just looting?

>    As every other people on this planet, Somalis want to preserve their
>    way of life, and just because we think that ours is a superior one 
>    does not give us a right to shove it down other people's throats.

More likely they want the benefits of civilization but are not ready to bear
its burdens.  Or are you really going to argue that they want to die of all
sorts of diseases we know how to cure?





--
Norman Yarvin						yarvin@cs.yale.edu
From: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Re: Somalia
Date: 31 Dec 1992 05:25:02 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) says:

>>You don't judge a proposal on its own merits; you judge
>>by comparing it to what you already have.  What other
>>peace proposal do you have?
>
>How about the tried and true "one person, one vote?"  

Less government is the path to peace.  One man one vote has
given us nothing but more government.  The whole world's in
a recession, but the public sector just keeps on growing.
Think again.
-- 
=======================
"Endeavor to persevere"
=======================
From: dmorse@igc.apc.org (Dorothy Morse)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Re: WHAT?!?!?!
Date: 28 Dec 92 16:27:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:1992Dec22.182540.5282@sunova.ssc:-966260219:cdp:1766500007:000:772
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!dmorse    Dec 28 08:27:00 1992


I berli  believe you just described the fundamental orientatio of  the press
in your attempt to refute what I had said.  Pardon my sloppy typing,
I'm on an office computer with no erase function.

You can't simulataneously maintain that the press is silent about third
wpo wpo world disaster because it doen doesn't sell papers and that the
press had no political orei orientation.  We are in a real world. If your
motive is to make money no matter what yoy do or don't do, you have a
political orientation, and you are the willoing servant of power.


There's a lot of stuff that would sell papers, by the way, that doesn't
make it because ti would be prej harmful to power--more money to be made
by keeoubh keeping quite quiet about it than by ws selling news about it.
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia,talk.politics.mideast
From: ilyess@ECE.Concordia.CA (Ilyess Bdira)
Subject: Re: Somalia: The REAL U.S. mission
Organization: ECE - Concordia University
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 17:04:57 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.200943.16033@colorado.edu> perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) writes:
>
>Natural resources (of various kinds) are always convenient excuses.
>However, one reason why they were a persuasive reason for our
Uranium is not just any kind of natural resource.
>
>>**Note:  strategic location on Horn of Africa along southern approaches
>>to Bab el Mandeb and route through Red Sea and Suez Canal.  [also
>>Somalia is good location for a military base to launch air strikes
>>against independant countries like Libya and Yemen and protect US
>>colonies like Saudi Arabia.]
>
>This last line shows just how far out in the ozone whoever wrote this
>piece was.  Saudi Arabia is hardly a US colony.  Indeed, it's

the last line was a comment from the poster I think.

...
>They'll have to do better than this.  Orders of magnitude better, I
>should add.

How about the recent article by UPI about the influence of
Islamic fundamentalism in Somalia (which mentioned that in areas
where they dominated looting and crime was eliminated which gave
them more and more influence and popularity)
How about the fact that the CIA is engaging in a covert war against
Sudan and Yemen both very close to Somalia and that it did not want Somalia
to eventually fall under independent fundamentalists?
How  about the fact that the CIA needed a base to threaten both Sudan
and Yemen and Somalia is just the right place?


Either the CIA is very lucky or it is creating its own "good luck."

They should know however that they have limited resources and that they
cannot control every single Arab nation in the same time (remember they had
to forget about Sudan a little bit in 1990 when they were preparing for
the downsizingn of the Iraqi military). So if all people of those countries
work hard in the same time to gain their real independence, they will
defeat the CIA and minimize the effect of foreign interference.

Don't make me laugh and say the the U.S.A went there for humanitarian
reasons, maybe that is a byproduct (or a cost of transaction), but not
a goal.. That is not in the agenda of the CIA.

=============================================================
Modified Murphy's first law of realistic probability:
If it can happen, it will happen...
Unless of course "it" is a good thing.
::::::::::::::********************************:::::::::::::::
Ilyess Ben Ali Bdira    Montreal Quebec  Canada
E-mail ilyess@ECE.concordia.CA, benali@alcor.concordia.CA
::::::::::::::********************************:::::::::::::::
Xref: sparky alt.current-events.somalia:763 talk.politics.mideast:24452 alt.conspiracy:13578
From: kwp@wag.caltech.edu (Kevin W. Plaxco)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia,talk.politics.mideast,alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Somalia: The REAL U.S. mission
Date: 31 Dec 1992 17:40:18 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: sgi1.wag.caltech.edu

In article <92364.133649U38026@uicvm.uic.edu> <U38026@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
>I happen to locate some interesting information on Somalia.  I think
>most people would find this most interesting in light of the so called
>"humanitarian" mission, Restore Hope. 

Yes, that's it exactly.  You have it exactly right.  Congratulations.

Of course, now we're going to have to kill you.

-Kevin

Xref: sparky alt.current-events.somalia:773 talk.politics.mideast:24605
From: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Re: Somalia
Date: 4 Jan 1993 04:53:46 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc4.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at (Markus Stumptner) says:

>Let's see.....Did I get that right?

What is your plan for peace, Markus?
-- 
=======================
"Endeavor to persevere"
=======================
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
From: perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman)
Subject: Re: Somalia
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 16:09:28 GMT

In article <1hrcqcINNp4v@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka) writes:
>
>In a previous article, perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) says:
>
>>>The votes should be weighted according to how much income tax
>>>the voter pays.  The way it is now, the have-nots vote to pick
>>>the pockets of the haves.  We'll NEVER have peace that way.
>>
>>By this logic, people like Donald Trump or Michael Jackson have
>>thousands of times as many votes as the average schmoe on the street.
>>That's not what democracy means.  Nor is it fair.
>
>You don't judge a proposal on its own merits; you judge
>by comparing it to what you already have.  What other
>peace proposal do you have?

How about the tried and true "one person, one vote?"  I am judging your
proposal on its merits:  it's a prescription for dictatorship, not a
better future.

-- 
"How sad to see/A model of decorum and tranquillity/become like any other sport
A battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee." -Tim Rice,"Chess"
     Eric S. Perlman 				 <perlman@qso.colorado.edu> 
  Center for Astrophysics and Space Astronomy, University of Colorado, Boulder
From: kirby@xerox.com (Mike Kirby)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
Subject: Re: Somalia
Date: 31 Dec 92 16:20:06 GMT
Reply-To: kirby@xerox.com
Organization: Xerox Corporation, Webster NY

In article 1hu0n5INNhrv@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu, al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka) writes:
>
>In a previous article, kirby@xerox.com (Mike Kirby) says:
>
>>By and large we already have vote weighting by income group.  Since the more
>>wealthy people tend to participate more in the political process, (and vote)
>>while the poorer people tend to ignore it.  The concerns of the wealthy are
>>taken into account much more than those of the poor.  
>
>I'm not after vote weighting for its own sake--I'm for less
>government.  One man one vote isn't working to this end--
>we should try something else.
>-- 
>=======================
>"Endeavor to persevere"
>=======================

I would be willing to bet that you are for better government, not necessarily less.
Less government was the savings and loan crisis.  They deregulated the industry (which
isn't necessarily bad) but then decided that because there were less regulations,
they would need less regulators.  Unfortunately that is not usually true.  If you
have less regulations you need more regulators to make sure that the regulations
still existing are carried out.

But this digresses slightly from the somoli discussion.

Mike Kirby
Xerox Corp
E-mail: kirby.roch803@xerox.com
Xref: sparky alt.current-events.somalia:731 alt.politics.org.un:212 alt.president.clinton:1254 talk.politics.misc:65279 alt.politics.bush:14893
From: randall@informix.com (Randall Rhea)
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia,alt.politics.org.un,alt.president.clinton,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.bush
Subject: Re: Somalia Question
Date: 18 Dec 92 02:23:57 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

gtao@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Greg ) writes:

>m23364@mwunix (James Meritt) writes:

>I was wondering what all you people who are worried about the possibility
>of the situation in Somalia deteriorating from our standpoint are
>worried about?

>Maybe I just don't know all that much about the Somalia situation, but
>there just doesn't seem to be that much threat to US troops there.


The worry is that troops will need to be stationed there for months
if not years, and that gradually, some of them will be coming home
in pine boxes as teenage AK-47-wielding drug-stoned snipers pick them
off.  The other worry is that we seem to have no clear objective in
Somalia, other than to deliver food.  That is a noble objective, but
how long will we be doing it?  Unless a strong government is established
there, forever.  Are we going to try to install a government?  I am not
clear as to what we are doing there.



-- 

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Randall Rhea                                        Informix Software, Inc. 
Project Manager, MIS Sales/Marketing Systems    uunet!pyramid!infmx!randall
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.somalia
From: m23364@mwunix (James Meritt)
Subject: Re: Survival of the fittest...
Organization: MITRE Corporation, McLean VA
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 13:43:23 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.222052.16813@usl.edu> tlb2665@usl.edu (Burleigh Thomas L) writes:
}>}In article @byu.edu, jensen@baloo.ee.byu.edu (Curtis Jensen) writes:
}>}>Are we really HELPING these people, or are we just prolonging their
}>}>suffering and starvation?  Just GIVING these people food will
}>}>cause the somalians to do what they do best ... make MORE starving children.
}
} This reminds me of that old saying about giving a man a fish verus
}teaching him how to fish.  (He'll be hungry again or he need never be
}hungry again, respectively.)
} I'm just wondering what we are doing to help the Somalis become more
}self-sufficient in their own food production.  Are there any such education
}programs for the Somalis as part of Restore Hope? (Or any civilian relief
}efforts?)

Insufficient.  Did you notice the references on the national network (tv)
news last night, forecasting a larger starvation next year?

Its christmas time, and the cattle are not lowing, they are starving.
And the crops are not being augmented due to the inability to get to
the sites.

No crops or herds, no food.  Next year will be bad...