HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: samaddar@siemens.com (Sumitro Samaddar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: ISLAMIC WORLD NEWS (21st)
Date: 23 Jul 92 02:47:17 GMT
Reply-To: samaddar@siemens.com

onf@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (omar.farooq) writes:

>My family is originally from Jhullunder (Indian Punjab) and the 
>village they were in was predominantly Muslim.  Upon the time of 
>partition, most of the village was destroyed and the two Mosques
>there(Jamia masjid and masjid-ulmomin) were gurdwaras when I visited
                                             ^^^^^^^^^
>that area 3 years ago.  And many people there told us of similar
>incidents elsewhere.

I may be nit-picking here, but have you seen any mandir built on a
destroyed mosque. Sikhs are/were a militant community. In India, I
have heard many hindus say that Sikhs were responsible for protecting
many hindus during the partition killings. I guess, some of this
protection extended further.

Again, this is just for my curiosity. If I learn of hindu destruction
of mosques, it will make me humbler.

Sumitro
From: g9220348@cc.uow.edu.au (adil shaikh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Why Do We Propagate Our ReligionS
Date: 23 Jul 92 08:04:18 GMT
Organization: University Of Wollongong

umnoor@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Nasir Ahmed Noor) writes:

>(As usual :-)) I was thinking and noted a phenomenon which I find very
>interesting (now).

>Why do we so strongly propagate our religion?
>It seems to be the man's nature to propagate his religion. There are other
>beliefs that one has regarding different aspects of life and society and
>culture and most often no body messes with you and you dont mess with
>somebody, but as for as religious beliefs are concerned, most people are
>ready to "go to the war" at any time. Don't know WHY?

>just a thought!

>--nasir
>umnoor@ccu.umanitoba.ca


Sorry 

You are in the wrong news group.

This country was created on the base of religion. 

It is not worth descussing here.

I support you on your new stand, a wise stand.

bye
adil
From: memon@acsu.buffalo.edu (Naveed Siraj Memon)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Top ten list. another pathetic attempt at humour
Date: 21 Jul 92 23:35:50 GMT
Organization: UB





A year ago we had a heated debate about reasons not to return to Pakistan.
At that time I felt that advocating one's belief on s.c.p was more or less
invasion of the reader's privacy especially since the advocates were 
writing from *.com accounts :)

So here are a few reasons that I came up with, some reasons to return to
Pakistan. These are just wierd and funny and lame reasons of course not
serious ones 'cause I never believed that s.c.p was meant to solve any
issues and even one-timers who pop up out of nowhere saying that they
read s.c.p for the first time and they were truly disappointed to see all the
debates whereas they thought that soc.culture.pakistan should be discussing
about 'hum mulk kee kiss tarha madad kar saktay hain', these one-timers
always crack me up.

All the Letterman fans can imagine the drum-roll from the world's ugliest
band, no not the Rolling uglies but some imaginary bleeding hearts club
band :) Wow too many rock references for desis to relate to or comprehend:)

Paul can we have some music


10) gunnay ka ras topped with lemon slices and house-flies
09) fly kites in summer and piss off the cheelz and the kavaz by aiming 
    for their heads.
08) Watch the Olympic and get a better coverege for all sports events. Have
    some international sense of the world. And it is best of both worlds
    In case if we have the satellite dish, I can always turn to NFL games
    after watching channel 9 coverage of WC 96 when Inzamam ul Haq shows
    off the trophy to the world :)  and then see yet another loss by Buffalo
    in the Super Bowl.
07) Aunties and kakiz at Tariq Road.
06) In hot humid nights of Karachi, put on a towel and lay on the rooftop
    bayThain rahaiN tasavur e janaN keyay hoyay
05) people will not shy away from a hug on Eid like the homophobic undergrads
    pakistanis do in the US
04) laughing my ass off on Eid remembering everyone on s.c.p who post lame
    ascii files containing lame greeting messages revealing their lame student
    lives :)   
03) pani puri at Tariq Road, lassi at Burns Road and Pistachio Icecream at
    Baluch at Clifton
02) The frenzied dance of the first monsoon rains, and pakoRa and dahi BaRa
    and GuRh-chaval
01) waking up to kisses, not alarm clocks :)


I think number 01 is chaya paRa :)
Wow that felt gooood! :) after so much bullshit about regional politics.
What will you guys do without me once I am gone. S.c.p is going to suck :)




Naveed
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: hasan@vxcrna.cern.ch 
Subject: Re: Urdu/Punjabi word
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 17:24:00 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.121502.1719@cbfsb.cb.att.com>, onf@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (omar.farooq) writes...
>-------------------------
>>Unless you consult an extensive English-Urdu lughat, I can onyl think of
>>KhudaHafiz, or perhaps Ruqsat-ul-khair (more like Arabic style phrasing)
>>                   or Ruqsat-e-khair (Persian phrasing).
> 
>If you place more faith on the fancy inscriptions on trucks in
>Pakistan, then a popular one is "khair naal ja, tey khair naal aa."
> 
>Usman
>-------------------------
> 
>wah bhaee wah, kee marya, thay kee chadiaa
>Yes those truck and van drivers sure have a way with words!
> 
>Omar

Sure, and if you think of it, it is almost exactly the
equivalent of a famous line of Persian verse, "besalaamat
ravi o baaz aaiy" which is considered to be a high-brow
literary expression. Just ponder at the hierarchy of
languages in our society!

Khairee Naal!
-Hasan  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: jamalin@newton.ccs.tuns.ca (Nadeem Jamali)
Subject: Re: fatwa for today
Organization: Technical University of Nova Scotia, Halifax, N.S.
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 03:58:35 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.114939.15463@doug.cae.wisc.edu> ahasan@cae.wisc.edu (Ali Hasan) writes:

.......... (stuff deleted)

>>
>>	What about sunny women... ;-) 
>>
>>Nadeem
>>
>	Are you one ;-) ?
>	If you are then I am at your service. Being blonde would 
>	be an added advantage ;-)             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
So you're _the_ blonde ;-) 

>
>					--ali [always helpful]
>-- 

Nadeem

-- 
Nadeem Jamali                                     jamalin@newton.ccs.tuns.ca
						 
School of Computer Science			  
Technical University of Nova Scotia		  (902)420-7882  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: mmasood@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mohammed A Masood)
Subject: In search of Book by Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomenei
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 15:23:28 GMT

Salaam, could anyone on the net help me out in finding a book by
Khomenei (spelling?).  The book is called:

	Islamic Government
		by
	Ruhollah Khomenei (late).  It was published in 1979.

I need the English translation of it.
I really want a copy or two of this book.  IS there anyone on the net
who could email me the address of the bookstore which carries this book
or mail me a copy of the book if he has an extra one.
Wassalaam

Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: mughal@iago.caltech.edu (ASIM M MUGHAL)
Subject: Re: Hockey News Anybody?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords: Olympic Event
Organization: California Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 08:17:00 GMT

In article <2428@bsu-cs.bsu.edu>, waseemak@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Waseem M. A. Khan) writes...
>Would any kind soul please post the news of Hockey matches in Barcelona.
>Who is Pakistan playing with in their pool? And if anybody knows, would

:-)

>you please post the other qualifying countries? Has India made it to the
> Olyimpics this time? I think they have, anybody? 

:-)
> 
>Thanx in advance
>Ciao,
>Waseem m. Khan
> 

     If you can wait a few hours, I am putting it in the next newsletter
     of Pakistan News Service. 

     Asim Mughal
     [Standard Disclaimer]
From: khan@davidsys.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Formative years: Ruthless Bullshit!
Date: 25 Jul 92 17:20:57 PST
Organization: DAVID Systems Inc, Sunnyvale CA

  In Ruth Ditucci's post ridiculing a Pakistani
man brought up in a poor environment, I fail
to understand why she considers being poor
and not having enought to eat when one is
growing up to be a kind of sin, and hateful
thing. This attitude is typical of 
some very rich people [like in Santa Barbara, 
where they beat and have killed homeless people]
who have lost contact with reality.
From: st1dh@judy.uh.edu (Arslan Siddiq)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Latest olymics hockey status
Date: 30 Jul 92 22:41:00 GMT
Distribution: soc.culture.pakistan
Organization: University of Houston
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <ZAFAR.92Jul30151929@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu>, zafar@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Syed Zafar Kazmi) writes...
> 
>Pakistan was scheduled to play with unified team, some time last night 
>(US time), Does anybody has the scores?
> 
>Zafar Kazmi


		Pakistan won that match by the score of 6-2.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: alam@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (ALAM AFSHAN)
Subject: lurker in the mist, er midst again : )
Summary: the Colorado catharsis works wonders: )
Keywords: poems,my own: )
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 01:19:46 GMT

Living in the mountain air of Colorado has made me a poet!
And have posted the poems in rec.arts.poems. You are
welcome to read them there if you like. They are 
actually truly awful but hey what's a bit of awfulness
among friends (and yes I do use the term loosely.heh).
Just be thankful that I can't post the sketches I've
made since coming here.

Afshan. There's just something about Colorado:-) 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan)
Subject: JAIB BHERNAA
Organization: Computer Engineering and Science, Case Western Reserve University
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 19:43:12 GMT


>Sindh province was selected because the middle class was mainly constituted
>by Hindus... rest of it is clear from what has been quoted from Dr. Agha's
>posting. Karachi was selected because it was the most major city of Sindh.
>In a public speech in one of the Hindu-majority states of India, Liaqat
>Ali Khan has been quoted to have said something like: "Pakistan chalo...
>jaibain bhar jaa'ai(n) gee(n). I'll leave finding the references to someone

Oh Sure, and when this Liaqat Ali Khan Was shot to death, he had only
few rupees in the Bank and did not own a house in Pakistan. And ofcourse this 
navab and cambridge educated successful lawyer of Lucknow had nothing better to
say at that meeting during Pakistan Movement. Let's see what
sons of soil pakistanis did. Ayub's son Gauhar Ayub was one of the 
most corrupt person in Pakistan's history. sort of Mr. 10+% of 1960s. 
and well Pakistan rewards crooks. This Crook is speaker of Pakistan's national
assembly. 
Mr. Bhutto, shining example of corruption. Or how else
his son is fooling around in Damascus. What is his source of income.
Money stolen from Pakistan,and illegaly transferred out of pakistan.
Mr. Zia. Oh Oh, how did his sons become directors of all these companies.
Mr. Zardari, well every body knows about him being a smart 10%.
Mr. Navaz Sharif: the honest owner of Ittefaq industires. How did
he make money for this ittefaq?

I think when Liaqat ali was talking about "Jaibai'n bharna", he
had people like Ayub, Gauhar Ayub, Bhutto, and Navaz Sharif in mind.
He was smart enough to know that he will lose whatever he had in new India.
Give him  some credit for his intelligence.



>else. I don't have specific references and admit this. I know that someone
>will take this as an opportunity to make it the focal point of this posting
>and put everything else in the background... just like Mr. Nadeem Malik 
>did with my response to Dr. Shafqat's remarks.

>Nadeem


Mansoor Khan
Cleveland.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: nadeem@igpho (Nadeem Malik)
Subject: Re: The fate of these wretched muhajirs.
Organization: Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 13:20:49 GMT

shafqat@neuro.duke.edu (Saad Shafqat) writes:
: 
: Nadeem Jamali puts forward one of the best arguments against quotas in
: recent memory and then jumps on me for bringing up the issue.  And he
: doesn't stop there, he goes on to slander urdu-speaking Pakistanis in
: a series of vitriolic generalizations, some baseless, some not.  I don't
: know if Nadeem Jamali is representative of the Sindhi people of Pakistan.
: Let us suppose that he is.  What happens next ?
: 
: The acceptable outcomes, from Nadeem's statement, seem to be only one
: of three:
: 
: (1) The urdu-speaking of Sindh are exterminated in a well-planned
:     genocide.
: 
: (2) The urdu-speaking of Sindh are expelled from Karachi and the
:     rest of Sindh.
: 
: (3) The urdu-speaking of Sindh are culturally and economically
:     subjugated by the native sons of Sind.
: 
: 
: There are precedents for each and any one may happen.  Native Americans
: were the victims of a genocide, so that has happened before.  In medieval
: Spain, the muslim population was thrown out after as much as 800 years
: of domination, so that has happened before.  As for the third option,
: the best example is the British Raj.  If Nadeem Jamali is representative
: of Sindh today, the conflict has firmly locked itself into intransigence.
: I used to dream I will return to Pakistan for a busy career in academic
: medicine.  After listening to Nadeem, I am beginning to entertain the
: possibility that I am returning to Pakistan for an early grave.


This is undoubtedly the most serious implication of the vitriolic out-
bursts of Nadeem Jamali (NJ). I mean that it puts off people returning
to Pakistan at a time when qualified people are deparately needed.

On the positive side though, NJ is an enigma --- I have not noticed any
other Pakistanis freely airing the views that he advocates. One must
remember that there is undoubtedly a foreign influence agitating the
mohajir vs. sindhi troubles. In reality, I do not believe that these
two communities are really so irreconsilable. 


Nadeem Malik
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: usman@leland.Stanford.EDU (Usman Hameed)
Subject: NATION OF COMPLAINERS (was JAIB BHERNAA)
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 21:21:05 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.194312.8945@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan) writes:

>sons of soil pakistanis did. Ayub's son Gauhar Ayub was one of the 
>most corrupt person in Pakistan's history. sort of Mr. 10+% of 1960s. 
>and well Pakistan rewards crooks. This Crook is speaker of Pakistan's national
>Mr. Bhutto, shining example of corruption. Or how else
>his son is fooling around in Damascus. What is his source of income.
>Money stolen from Pakistan,and illegaly transferred out of pakistan.
>Mr. Zia. Oh Oh, how did his sons become directors of all these companies.
>Mr. Zardari, well every body knows about him being a smart 10%.
>Mr. Navaz Sharif: the honest owner of Ittefaq industires. How did
>he make money for this ittefaq?


[My purpose is not to criticize Mansoor.]

We are a nation of complainers.  We have to bitch about whichever
government is in power.  Never does one of us take upon him or herself
to consider some way in which to personally contribute to the 
electoral process; if that in fact is the point of contention.
Its always the government's fault if there are no high tech jobs, or 
salaries are too low compared to the US.  Face it, the only reason 
you want to go back is that you miss home.  Save the "build our
nation" platitudes for people who fall for them.  Its a convenient
rationalization for giving up the comforts of living here,  but its 
not the real reason.  If all these rascals are ripping off the
treasury then discuss how we can establish institutions to bifurcate
executive power, so the next govt. doesn't have another Mr. 10%.
Undertake projects in primary education or health provision if you 
really are interested in Pakistan's development.  If you can't relocate
back there right now, suggest ideas for inexpensive housing or potable
water to depressed areas.  Don't assume that the bureaucrats have the
best ideas, or that they won't listen to you.  If you are really
interested in Pakistan's development, you will go invest your time in 
a concerted manner and make them listen to you.  It has been done.
Having the government provide jobs for us foreign educated brats
is not a measure of progress.  If you're fortunate enough to be educated
here, don't gripe.  If the education hasn't expanded your mind 
sufficiently for you to make constructive suggestions, then we as
a nation are truly reemed!

Usman
From: waseems@sco.COM (Waseem Siddiqi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Tamerlane
Date: 27 Jul 92 18:57:37 GMT
Organization: SCO Canada, Inc.


Comments: Originally-From: Janis Ernest Svilpis <jsvilpis@ACS.UCALGARY.CA>

  - - The original note follows - -

I am an English professor woing on 17th- and 18th-centuryry
literary orientalism, especially in England, though to some
extent in France as well.  I have recently been looking at
documents reflecting 17th-century English attitudes towards
Tamerlane (Timur the Great, 1336-1405).  Among several puzzles
involved in this is one that I hope members of ISLAM-L can help
me with.  A _Histoire du grand Tamerlan_, attributed by the US
Library of Congress to a "Sieur de Sainctyon, fl. 1690," was
several times translated into English during my period, and many
of the editions in both French and English claim that it is
"tiree des monumens antiques des arabes" or "tiree des memoires
d'Alhacent."  "Alhacent" or "Alhacen" (the Library of Congress
version of the name) seems to be a pseudonym, and the history
seems very unlikely to be based on Islamic sources.  Does anyone
know of an Arabian historian by this name?  The text claims that
he was a companion of Timur.  Indeed, does anyone know of any
Arabic histories of Timur, particularly ones available in English
or French translation?

Thank you for your help.

Janis Svilpis




-- 
Waseem A. Siddiqi                                 Tel:    (416) 922 1937 
SCO Canada                                        email: waseems@sco.com 
Toronto, Canada                                        uunet!sco!waseems
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: ahasan@cae.wisc.edu (Ali Hasan)
Subject: Re: fatwa for today
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering
Date: 21 Jul 92 10:40:29 CDT

In article <1992Jul21.062422.18946@leland.Stanford.EDU> arkay@leland.Stanford.EDU (Abdur Khan) writes:
>
>	after the tensions in peshawar.
>	all religious tension between shia's and sunni's must cease.
>	therefore i ask my followers and brothers and bhabi's
>
>		all sunni men should marry shia women
>		and all shia women should marry sunni men.
>								17:6:92
>
>sahibzada rafay khan[the world for a .........]

	Hey!! You left out shia men :-(
	Does that mean we don't get married ?
	Or are we allowed to run after blondes now ?

					--ali ;-)
-- 
**********************************************************************
* Ali Hasan			Computer Aided Engineering	     *
* ahasan@cae.wisc.edu		UW-Madison.			     *
**********************************************************************
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: raza@surya.ccs.uwo.ca (Mr. Raza Syed)
Subject: Re: Pakistani Olympic Athletes
Organization: University of Western Ontario, London
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 13:27:20 GMT

In article <1992Jul29.120123.26287@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umnoor@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Nasir Ahmed Noor) writes:
>
>I would beg to differ....
>A Paksitani did win a medal in wrestling. I remember this guy with a beard
>apprearing on talk shows and "Nilaam Gha'r". Year I am not sure about. It was
>either 84 or 88.
>Pakistan did win medal in sailing. It was a guy a Karachi. I am 97% sure it
>was in olympics.
>
>--nasir

You mean Byram D Avari (sp)? he won gold medal in two cosecutive Asian games
78 &82 and also got second position in some world championship in Canada
way back in early 80`s but he never ever won *any* medal in olympics,
i think he never participated in olympics ( I think ). Pakistan boycotted(sp)
1980 games in Moscow and he retired before 84 games in los angeles (i think).

S.R.Raza.
From: Eric_S_Klien@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Electronic Matchmaker
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 20:56:46 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world

Women, I am about to launch a free electronic matching service on 
Usenet.  Unfortunately, more guys than gals have expressed an 
interest so far.  If you would like to see the fourth draft of my 
questionnaire so we can alter it to also fit women's needs as well as 
men's, either send me mail or look at the copy I posted in 
alt.personals.
 
This service is serious and I already have 119 men and 86 women signed
up so far.  The site of the service has already been selected and
programmers are being lined up for the construction of the listserver.
 
I should point out that this questionnaire really, really, really, 
needs some more input on CULTURES.  I need some questions to make sure
that matches are compatible culturally.
 
                                                            Eric Klien
From: zafar@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Syed Zafar Kazmi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Test
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:45:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: splinter.ZAFAR.92Jul30164528
Distribution: soc.culture.pakistan
Organization: College of Engineering, Northeastern University


This is just a test.

Zafar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: mmasood@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mohammed A Masood)
Subject: Hockey news
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 15:08:24 GMT

Date: Wednesday, 29 Jul 1992 15:38:07 MST
From: Nauman Mysorewala. <PAKEDITR@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey.field
Subject: July 28th results plus standing table


Pakistan News Service

           Summer Olympics '92
            Mens Field Hockey

              Point Table

Pool A          M  W  L  T  G AG Pts

Australia       2  2  0  0 12  1  4
Germany         2  2  0  0  5  0  4
Britian         2  1  1  0  2  2  2
India           2  1  1  0  1  3  2
Egypt           2  0  2  0  1  7  0
Argentina       2  0  2  0  0  8  0


Pool B          M  W  L  T  G AG Pts

Pakistan        2  2  0  0  5  1  4
Netherlands     2  2  0  0  8  4  4
Unified         2  1  1  0  8  2  2
Spain           2  1  1  0  5  3  2
New Zealand     2  0  2  0  0  2  0
Malaysia        2  0  2  0  4 11  0


Game Results

July 26th

Won          G    Los          G

Pool A
Australia    7    Argentina    0
Britian      2    Egypt        0
Germany      3    India        0

Pool B
Netherlands  5    Unified      2
Pakistan     4    Malaysia     1
Spain        3    New Zealand  0


July 28th

Won          G    Los          G

Pool A
Australia    5    Egypt        1
Germany      2    Britian      0
India        1    Argentina    0

Pool B
Netherlands  3    Spain        2
Pakistan     1    New Zealand  0
Unified      7    Malaysia     3


By Nauman K. Mysorewala
Coordinator Pakistan News Service
Coordinator Muslims News Network


Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: raza@engrg.uwo.ca (Mr. Raza Syed)
Subject: Pakistan's performance in Olympiads....
Organization: University of Western Ontario, London
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 20:12:40 GMT


Following is an article from rec.sport.olympics which should clear
doubts about pakistan's performance in olympiads.
Pakistan's all three gold medals are in Hockey, years 1960,68 &84
All three silver medals are also in Hockey, years 1952,56 &72.
Of two bronze medals one is in Hockey 1976 and one is in boxing 1988.

Here is the complete list:

S.R.Raza

-----------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroups: rec.sport.olympics