HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu)
Subject: Re: Montel Williams Show (Re: Hoyt Sze will be on TV!
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 00:00:53 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.143915.14405@midway.uchicago.edu> shou@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <2186@usna.NAVY.MIL> wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.MIL (Wm. Douglas Withers -- math  FACULTY <wdw@sma.usna.navy.mil>) writes:
	[Els Withers's polite question about resentment of interracial
	 relationships deleted.]
>
>I'd like to second these sentiments, except I won't be so diplomatic
>as to use the term "enlighten" here.  This is the 20th century.  These
>are the 90's.  Anyone can date or marry anyone they damn well feel like.

	Sure, as long as the person being dated or married agrees.
	And, as long as that agreement is based on reality and not
	deception.  And as long as it's a healthy relationship and
	both parties are happy.  Gosh, if I were Dwight, I think I'd
	be tempted to accuse you of identifying with Chinese-cu!  :-)

>The fact that there are more interracial relationships is a good thing.
>It means that the significance of racial and ethnic boundaries is
>breaking down.

	A reasonable and positive interpretation...

		  Is is possible that much of the opposition to such 
>relationships comes from people who can't get a date?  

	Possible, yeah, but not very likely if you actually look
	around.  More likely the opposition comes from racists of
	all colors and genders; the products of racist and sexist
	societies around the world, including our wonderful US of A...
>
>-- 
>Roger Shouse
>The University of Chicago 		Email: shou@midway.uchicago.edu
>

						--Alan Hu
From: kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go)
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating FAQ (was Re: Montel Williams Show)
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, Rice University
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 04:33:00 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.230900.16949@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>...
>>However, this objection is enormously over-played, simply because
>>the generally-accepted racist myth in the US is that anyone who's
>>"Oriental-looking" is a foreigner or recent immigrant who clings to
>>some mystic notion of "Oriental culture" ...
>
>What is bizzare is that there is common ground among Chinese-cu,
>rednecks, Klansmen, and Nazis.

Why is this bizarre?  There is common ground between *any* two people.
Realizing this may inject some compassion into some people.  Even Klansmen
love their families...and probably have many of the same concerns we all
do.  So say a prayer for a Chinese-cu, too.

>They believe that ethnicity (genetics) determines culture (behavior);
>for example, when they see a Japanese(-ge)-American, they expect 
>that he/she should/will do the Japanese-cu "thing".  In other words,
>they believe that it is "natural" for a Japanese-American to do the
>Japanese "thing" but that it is not "natural" for a Japanese-American
>to do otherwise.

I hate to tell you this, but I don't think this is a uniquely Chinese-cu
trait.  But you probably already know that.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: dtwei@acsu.buffalo.edu (Danielle T Wei)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating FAQ (was Re: Montel Williams Show)
Date: 2 Oct 92 17:40:20 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: UB

In article <1992Oct1.231654.26523@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu) writes:
>	Yes, perhaps they are different.  But considering that this
>	group is soc.culture.asian.*american*, and considering my
>	opening remarks about talking about Asian *Americans*, not
>	Asians in Asia, I don't think extended discussion of Asian
>	mating practices is appropriate for this group.

Wait a minute!! Mr. Hu perhaps you should realize that outside of
California a big portion of Asian AMERICANS were not borne in America
Personally, I've lived in China long enough to speak the language fluently
but I've also lived in the U.S. long enough to become "Americanized"

On the same token, many Chinese from Chinatown are probably more
Asian-cu than American-cu, would you not consider them Asian American?

NW
From: wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu (Peter Wung)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Hoyt Sze on Montel
Date: 29 Sep 92 19:05:59 GMT
Reply-To: wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu
Organization: Sun Microsystems

I went home for lunch today and saw some of the tape of the Montel
Williams Show.  Let me tell you, Hoyt is a real normal guy compared 
the other guy on there.  This fellow, Yoshua Barak, really pissed
off a ton of people, and old Hoyt looked tame compared to this guy.  
The third guy was kind of weak, although I only saw a little of the 
broadcast.

********************************************************************
*Peter Wung			Email:wung@ee.gatech.edu	   * 
*Electric Power Laboratory	Snail mail: 33787 Ga. Tech Station * 
*School of Electrical Engineering	    Atlanta, GA 30332      *
*Georgia Institute of Technology			    	   *
*Atlanta, Georgia						   *
*   	"Pass, Set, CRUSH!"...					   * 
*  	Well, 2 out of 3 ain't bad for a short, fat guy. 	   *
*								   *
********************************************************************
From: hirota@tigger.sdsc.edu (Bryan Hirota)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: SAT Scores
Date: 28 Sep 1992 20:00:57 GMT
Organization: San Diego Supercomputer Center
NNTP-Posting-Host: tigger.sdsc.edu
Keywords: y'all come back now, ya here

In article <66542@cup.portal.com> Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com writes:
>.. stuff on SAT ..
>
> [stuff deleted for brevity]
>
>Also - Asian women score the same as white males (surprised?)
	^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Why should this be surprising?  It must be all the 'studying', that
they do together.

(Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

============================================================================
Bryan Hirota						     hirota@sdsc.edu
Hug a Tree, for me					    bhirota@ucsd.edu
============================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating FAQ (was Re: Montel Williams Show)
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 23:09:00 GMT

>...
>However, this objection is enormously over-played, simply because
>the generally-accepted racist myth in the US is that anyone who's
>"Oriental-looking" is a foreigner or recent immigrant who clings to
>some mystic notion of "Oriental culture" ...

What is bizzare is that there is common ground among Chinese-cu,
rednecks, Klansmen, and Nazis.

They believe that ethnicity (genetics) determines culture (behavior);
for example, when they see a Japanese(-ge)-American, they expect 
that he/she should/will do the Japanese-cu "thing".  In other words,
they believe that it is "natural" for a Japanese-American to do the
Japanese "thing" but that it is not "natural" for a Japanese-American
to do otherwise.

Two proponents of such bigotry are Mr. Yong Wee Dennis Lee
(yongwee@leland.stanford.edu) and Mr. Wilbur Pan (u58402@uicvm.uic.edu).

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seikatsu no imi wa nan desu ka.            \|  |`      | Don't buy from Toyota;
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.          | -+-      | especially, don't buy
                                           /| / \      | from Capitol Toyota in
Copyright 1992.                 Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3 | San Jose, California.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,soc.culture.asean,soc.culture.korean
From: gwu@nujoizey.tcs.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: Have no need to fear ... was Re: Freedom of Speech
Organization: Teknekron Communications Systems Inc.
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 02:18:53 GMT

In article <1992Sep28.205957.15097@leland.Stanford.EDU>, underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
> In article <lcedbuINN19k@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM>
> melindac@thedarktower.Corp.Sun.COM (Calling Dr. Nordstrom ...) writes:
> >	underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) :
> >	> As Mr. James Pak (jpak@oakhill.mot.sps.com) pointed out, a 
> >	> behavior or action does not need to be exercised by everyone in 
> >	> a particular cultural group in order for that behavior to be 
> >	> considered part of that cultural group. "whipping with a belt" or 
> >	> equivalent actions is everyday ordinary behavior in Chinese-cu 
> >	> society.
> >You have yet to prove that it is "everyday ordinary behavior in Chinese-cu
> >society."
> 
> You have yet to prove that it isn't.
> 
> >I contend that it is not. 
> >	Melinda
> 
> I contend that it is.

     Guilty until proven innocent, eh?  Is this your idea of "American-cu"
thinking?

						George

----
George J Wu, Software Engineer         | gwu@tcs.com or uunet!tcs!gwu
Teknekron Communications Systems, Inc. | (510) 649-3700
2121 Allston Way, Berkeley, CA, 94704  | Never be the first to believe . . .
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin)
Subject: Re: "Asians changing names to help job prospects"
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 00:58:21 GMT

In article <MDAY.92Oct4121039@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu> mday@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu (Mark Day) writes:
>When I was in London I clipped the following article from The
>Independent, one of the daily newspapers there.  Although the article
> ...
>Research by the Policy Studies Institute shows that one-third of all
>employers surveyed rejected applications on the basis of name alone.
> ...
>The department's Employment Gazette said: "People of ethnic minority
>origin were more likely to be unemployed than whites from the same age
>and sex groups.  The highest unemployment was among the Pakistani,
>Bangladeshi, and West Indian community."

Does that mean that blatant discrimination based on one's ethnicity is
'tolerated' in Great Britain?  A third of all employers surveyed ...
Obviously those are bad guys, not the silent and peaceful and faceless
crowd ;) 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: S.C.A.A. Readership Statistics
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 92 19:33:53 GMT

In article <1992Oct5.152213.15631@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu
Ayala) writes:
>  Thought you might be interested in knowing that our s.c.a.a. is
>  #263 out of 1577 newsgroups in readership.  There are an estimated
>  25000 people worldwide who read this group, with 69% of the
>  sites receiving this group.

I too checked news.lists--in fact, last month.  Ms. Ayala might be
incorrect about the "25,000" figure; I noted a figure of "55,000"
based on a sample size of about ~1200.

In any event, my previous assertions that thousands of people read
this newsgroup, most being silent, seems to be consistent with the
facts.

>  Recent traffic (sept) shows about
>  498 messages per month with an 18% crossposting percentage.
>  [Where will we be without Dwight???]

I _introduce_ crosspostings very rarely.  However, if I respond to a post
that is _already_ cross-posted, then I rarely change the newsgroup
listings.

>  And an estimated 1.8% of all newsreaders read this group.
>  To give you a perspective, we're right around sci.math.num-analysis
>  at #261 and sci.math.symbolic at #264.  The other s.c.a.a. (african)
>  is at #499, and soc.culture.usa at #373.  Of course we can't hope to
>  compete with soc.culture.china at #68 and soc.culture.indian at #24.
>  soc.culture.japan is at #147, soc.culture.asean at #384, 
>  soc.culture.korean at #445, soc.culture.filipino at #804, 
>  and soc.culture.thai at #856

Comparing soc.culture.china and soc.culture.japan, one should note that
volume does not indicate quality; this is particularly true for soc.culture.
china.  There, (1) personal attacks, (2) support for the state invading
people's private lives, (3) support for the invasion of Taiwan,
(4) support for virginity as a pre-employment criterion, etc. seems to
be the usual order of the day.  What's truly amazing is that most of
the posts originate from sites in Western countries; in other words,
the authors have been exposed to Western thought but still do the above
crap.

>
>  See news.lists for more on the rankings.  Arthur, is this enough
>  statistics???

Regardless of whether you, Ms. Ayala, agree or disagree with Mr. Arthur
Hu, he deserves credit for avoiding personal attacks and e-mail harrassment
games.  His articles are well-written although I disagree with the views
in a number of them.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seikatsu no imi wa nan desu ka.            \|  |`      | Don't buy from Toyota;
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.          | -+-      | especially, don't buy
                                           /| / \      | from Capitol Toyota in
Copyright 1992.                 Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3 | San Jose, California.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: achin@math.tamu.edu (Andrew Chin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Hoyt on Montel (was Re: Hoyt Sze will be on TV!)
Date: 29 Sep 92 19:50:59 GMT
Reply-To: achin@math.tamu.edu
Organization: Dept of Mathematics, Texas A&M University

SPOILERS



Re:  Hoyt Sze's appearance on the Montel Williams show, Tuesday 9/29

Hoyt seemed to be caught off-guard by the show's format.  He was presented
by Montel as "an Amerasian (sic) tired of Asian (sic) and Amerasian (sic)
women dating white men."  But Hoyt never got the opportunity to state his
case, that the AA struggle for equal rights and AA intermarriage may be
competing interests.

The audience was mostly African-American and wasn't all that interested 
in what Hoyt had to say, and Montel wouldn't let Hoyt speak more than 
four sentences at a time.  In fact, Hoyt was never properly introduced
as anything other than a random "Amerasian" off the street.  Hoyt should 
have sat down and worked out some sound bites before going on.  The audience 
was left with the impression that Hoyt opposed interracial dating for 
AAs because he was a cultural segregationist, interested in preserving
old-world Asian culture here in America.  But Hoyt's argument has a 
modicum of complexity to it, and it certainly wouldn't have reached the 
mentality of Montel's audience even if he had the whole hour.

And how did that twerpy AA woman (Montel's sister-in-law) ever get to be
president of anything?  What is the Ameri-Asian Actor's League anyway?
She has about as much insight into AA issues as the average Texas A&M
student!  It's good to know the interests of AA actors are so well
protected.

Andrew sez:  Don't bother.  Watch Whoopi instead.
---
Andrew Chin    Dept. of Math.    Texas A&M U.    College Station, TX 77843
achin@math.tamu.edu   Probably not TAMU's exact opinions.   (409) 845-0261
                * Fighting racism is not a special interest *
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: kyee@bnlux1.bnl.gov (kenton yee)
Subject: Vulcans and "Asian-Americans..."
Organization: Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, NY 11973
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 05:21:49 GMT

In article <yuan1.717340395@husc10> yuan1@husc10.harvard.edu (Nina Yuan) writes:
>underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>In article <lc1ccgINNior@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM>
>>melindac@thedarktower.Corp.Sun.COM (Melinda Cheung) writes:
>>>I doubt Gene Roddenbury purposely conjured up the Romulans = Chinese and
>>>Vulcans = Japanese.
  funny, I've always thought of the Klingons as chinese because
 there was one episode where the federation nearly went to war
 with the klingons due to an "incident at sea" reminiscent of
 the Korean conflict.  


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go)
Subject: Re: Genetic question misunderstood
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, Rice University
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 23:17:02 GMT

In article <MDAY.92Sep28232709@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu> mday@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu (Mark Day) writes:
>
>When we observe that men are generally taller than women, it doesn't
>mean that every individual man is taller than every individual woman,
>and it doesn't mean that a sensible way of determining gender is to
>decide that everyone above a certain height is male and everyone below
>that height is female.
>
>No matter how many "*equations*" are involved. :-)

Nowadays, due to sex changes, you can't even say that the presence of a
Y chromosome determines gender.  Or, alternatively, you can't necessarily
say that primary sex characteristics determine gender.  :-)
From: hassan@cup.portal.com (hassan monu alam)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Can we just ignore Dwight Joe's postings?
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 22:09:13 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: na

Amen. If we ignore him he should get tired of talking to himself :-).

Hassan
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: Michael F. Kamprath <kamprath@space-grant.sprl.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: extended character sets
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 92 10:43:43 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan, Aerospace Engineering
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d9
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A6EC92DE2A01C4FC@sprl-mac2016.sprl.umich.edu>
X-Xxdate: Mon, 28 Sep 92 10:45:50 GMT

In article <RKOU.92Sep28011023@mintaka.ucs> Roger H. Kou, rkou@mintaka.ucs writes:
>
>has anyone wrote any program(e.g. text editor/word processor) 
>that can be localized(i.e. display/edit 2-bit, aka extended
>character sets, like Japanese or Chinese)? how do you do it?
>I have an idea with Mac's environment? but have absolutely
>no clue in MVS or VM environment. 
>
>BTW: localized is a term I saw in Apple's literature. From
>my understanding, a program, if written with proper care :-)
>can be change/customized to run in a different language's 
>environment. has anyone done that? 
>

Yeah, they are written for the Mac.  What the deal is you must have several
sets of system extension in the system folder (obviusely you must buy them)
and they change the "language."  You then must use combinations of keystrokes
on a (normal American) keyboard to produce desired chracters.  I have seen
the Korean version and it types, edits, and prints from Microsoft Word
like a normal word processor.  I have not seen the Japanese or Chinese, but I
have no doubt they exist (considering market forces).  

Probaly your best place to get specific information is to post your question
again to comp.sys.mac.system

========================================================================
| Michael F. Kamprath                   | The University of Michigan   |
|   kamprath@space-grant.sprl.umich.edu |      Aerospace Engineering   |
|   kamprath@engin.umich.edu            |                              |
|---------------------------------------+------------------------------+
| Never, never, never drink two 40-ouncers of St. Ides in one night    |
|                                   --Michael Kamprath                 |
========================================================================
From: wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.MIL (Wm. Douglas Withers -- math  FACULTY <wdw@sma.usna.navy.mil>)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Montel Williams Show (Re: Hoyt Sze will be on TV!
Date: 5 Oct 92 17:03:06 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: U.S. Naval Academy

In article <BvJ337.2A6@rice.edu> kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go) writes:

>>In article <2186@usna.NAVY.MIL> wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.MIL (Wm. Douglas
>>Withers -- math  FACULTY <wdw@sma.usna.navy.mil>) writes:
>
>Why do you stress that you are a *faculty* member?  Are we supposed to give
>your opinions more weight because you're a faculty member?

All right, folks.  I don't choose how my name appears in the password file.

Besides, you're missing a golden opportunity.  Every bit of personal
information that slips out provides valuable ammunition for ad hominem
attacks, thing like `You faculty slugs turn my stomach.' :-)
-- 
Els Withers                   email: wdw@math2.sma.usna.navy.mil
Department of Mathematics     phone: (410)267-3192 / fax: (410)267-4883
United States Naval Academy
Annapolis, MD  21402-5002     Senri no tabi mo ippo yori...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: gwu@nujoizey.tcs.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: September issue of _Transpacific_
Organization: Teknekron Communications Systems Inc.
Distribution: soc
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 02:48:38 GMT

In article <SHAW.92Sep28214330@au-bon-pain.lcs.mit.edu>, shaw@au-bon-pain.lcs.mit.edu (Andy Shaw) writes:
> 
> [ A fairly accurate depiction of how bad Transpacific Magazine is. ]
> 
> Is "A." magazing actually off the ground now?

     I bought the last issue of both A. Magazine and Transpacific.  The
two are *not* in the same genre.  As Andy described, Transpacific writes
alot of worthless fluff, sort of a tabloid.  Personally, I don't care
how some Asian-American magazine editor dresses and what kind of car she
drives.  The *only* article I found worthwhile was the description of
Koreans coping with the riots, pulling together.  The article itself
didn't add any insights.  I remember the quotes of Korean-Americans
there at the time.

     A. Magazine is another sort of beast entirely.  It's thoughful
and intellectual.  Unfortunately, I chose to read the wrong one first,
so I haven't finished the last issue.  Articles in this issue include
the piecemeal efforts of Asian-American activism around the country,
the state of AA studies, profiles of some AA news anchors, and the
sexual abuse of Phillipina women by the military personnel based abroad.
(There are several other articles and topics, but that's just a short
summary.)

     Transpacific is, I believe, published every other month out of
Los Angeles.  It's slick, and targets the rich AA.  A. Magazine is
published quarterly in New York, has something of a liberal outlook, and
is targetted towards the intellectual.

     I don't plan on buying Transpacific regularly.  I plan to subscribe
to A. Magazine.

							George

----
George J Wu, Software Engineer         | gwu@tcs.com or uunet!tcs!gwu
Teknekron Communications Systems, Inc. | (510) 649-3700
2121 Allston Way, Berkeley, CA, 94704  | Never be the first to believe . . .
From: joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Genetic question misunderstood
Date: 2 Oct 92 18:17:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: ut-emx.80940
Organization: McDonald Observatory, University of Texas @ Austin

In article <1992Sep27.195527.14789@seas.gwu.edu> claypool@seas.gwu.edu (Hyok H. Lee) writes:
>What you seem to be saying is that races do not actually exist.
>Scientifically, racial categories do exist.  

Stephen J. Gould disagrees with you.

In his various books, he points out that "race" is a social construct
that has little scientific justification.  The basic problem with the
concept of "race" is that human beings don't fit into distinct
categories.  There's been a lot of interbreeding in the past thousand
years, with the result that one population "merges" gradually into
another.

I'd like to see some justification for your statement that race is a
scientifically useful statement.  A quote from any recent biology or
anthropology text book would be fine.

>Race is a valuable tool in tracking
>human history, migration patterns and genetic history.

One reason that race is a bad tool in those things is that, there's
been so much interbreeding among humans that it's impossible to
separate people into distinct categories based solely on ancestry.
For example, most Americans who consider themselves "black" have
ancestors who are European.

>Now these closet racist attempt to hide themselves by denying any
>differences between races.

I assert that the concept of race is more of a social construct than a
biological one.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american