Approved-By:  Public-Access Computer Systems Forum <LIBPACS@UHUPVM1.BITNET>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.pacs-l
Date:         Thu, 30 Jul 1992 11:19:57 CDT
From:         Dan Lester <ALILESTE@IDBSU.BITNET>
Subject:      Zen II and "exploiting the market"

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
On Tue, 28 Jul 1992 09:59:53 CDT Peter Graham, Rutgers U., (908) 932-2741 said:
>Those of us concerned with the rising costs of materials and their usefulness
>should seriously consider whether responding to Meckler is in libraries' and
>their patrons' best interests.  The best and most timely guides to dial-in

   Yes, each library and each individual should make its own decision.
Many of us will make different decisions from each other.  Reviews are
always appreciated, including the reviewer's comments on the cost relative
to the value.

>access are available through the online services now on the Internet; the
>publication from Meckler will be inevitably erroneous due to timeliness, and
>will cost libraries monies better applied elsewhere.

   Potential purchasers should also, of course, consider alternative
sources of the same or similar information, and the costs of those
alternatives.  Yes, any print source will be dated quickly.  That is also
true of any "net available" source as well.  I don't know of ANY net-
available source that isn't always at least a little bit behind.  We seem
to be hung up on having the "very latest" of everything, when we usually
haven't even used a small fraction of the stuff we already have.

>I submit to Meckler that they should reconsider publishing this item, or face
>the possibility that they will be considered as among those publishers whose
>interest is wholly in exploiting the market rather than in providing needed
>services at reasonable cost.

   It is perhaps obvious that ALL commercial publishers are interested in
"exploiting the market", at least if that means to publish items that will
sell and to make a profit while doing so.  That IS what they are in business
for, isn't it?  It seems common for we librarians get too hung up with
altruistic BS that has NOTHING to do with our jobs of providing information to
people and/or helping them learn to find information on their own.  Since we
operate in a free-market economy, the market will determine whether or not
Meckler or any other vendor is "exploiting us" or not.

   I understand that the item has already been published and that some
customers already have copies in hand.  Obviously, any "reconsideration"
possibilities are past.  Of course if no one buys this edition, then there
probably won't be another.

   I have not seen Zen II, but I am one of many who found Zen I to be a
useful tool for novices, its intended audience.  We should be careful
not to brand Meckler or other commercial publishers too quickly.  NorthwestNet
has a fine User Services Internet Resource Guide that they sell for $20.
At least one other commercial publisher has sent me ads for a new series
of Internet guides at prices in the $35 range.  The folks at Project
Gutenberg are also working on a novice guide, they say.  There will probably
be dozens of similar efforts for a while, just like the dozens of books
on Lotus or WP5.1, etc.  Some survive, some die out.  Some make money, some
lose it.  Such is life.

The NWNet guide is "thicker" and perhaps "better" than Zen, and at a
slightly lower cost,  but....the training classes I have given show that it
is too intimidating for real novices.  In fact, I water down "real novice"
training to only small parts of what is in Zen I/II, and then customize
that, of course, for the local system and environment.

   And, having a "novice tool" available ONLY on the networks is back to
being a "chicken or egg" kind of problem.  If you don't know how to get
it because you haven't read it yet....etc....

   I imagine that Zen II will sell fairly well, but it is not my problem.
I find it useful to have things available in various formats.  Who knows,
real novices  may find  Zen II in their local Bookstar or Waldenbooks,
purchase it, and be sending you messages next week, without you ever
having to do anything.  I am NOT hung up on the idea that only we
"initiated few" have the answers, the training methods, etc.  After all,
many of "us" are self-taught hackers.

dan

*****************************************************************************
* Dan Lester                          Bitnet:   alileste@idbsu              *
* Associate University Librarian      Internet: alileste@idbsu.idbsu.edu    *
* Boise State University                                                    *
* Boise, Idaho  83725                 BSU and I have a deal: I don't speak  *
* 208-385-1234                        for them and they don't speak for me. *
*****************************************************************************
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