HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: apj6796@tamsun.tamu.edu (Albert Paul Jimenez III)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Rolemaster
Date: 28 Jan 1993 08:35:47 -0600
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station, TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: tamsun.tamu.edu

In article <C1JBJF.1I8@cck.coventry.ac.uk> esi102@cck.coventry.ac.uk (The Magician) writes:
>Hello .. I am glad to see someone from inside ICE on the Net..
>
>I've been using ICE stuff for a long time now, and i do enjoy the products
>alot...
>anyway, my only real gripe is that a gm's screen would be very nice,
>including a set of plastic covered attack & critical tables so that they 
>dont get F***ked up during play.

Do what I did: photocopy every important table, chart, etc. that you use and
put them all in those plastic page covers you can get at an office supply
store... the ones that are holed for 3ring binders... then put all the copies
(you probably want to put 2 pages back to back in each plastic page) in one
binder, and walla walla: You now have the complete, all-in-one-place
near-impervious-to-coke-&-potato-chip-dip-spills useful binder. Beats looking
thru what? 10 or so books for the right attack table/crit chart etc..

--Paul

>
>Tim.
>The Magician.
>esi102@cck.cov.ac.uk
>'Dreams fade, but nightmares last forever'
> 


-- 
   Reachable As:     | Advice, help, or hints taken are done so | Friends don't
SilverEagle@tamu.edu | at your own risk and may reflect poorly  |  let friends
 (aka Paul Jimenez)  | on your better judgement. --The Mgmt.    |    use VMS.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: reljr@css1.UUCP (Robert Lee)
Subject: RE: GURPS Paranoia
Followup-To: <1993Jan25.062557.6923@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU>
Keywords: GURPS
Organization: Unimportant People Nobody Cares About
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 20:24:51 GMT

In Article <1993Jan25.062557.6923@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU>
barnett@mummy.agsm.unsw.OZ.AU (Glen Barnett) writes:
>1st edition Paranoia was very good, but hardly perfect.
>
>2nd edition  Paranoia was a substantial weakening of the
>initial 'clean' feel. It has been all down hill from there.
>I think they peaked around the time of Acute Paranoia.
>
>Many of the Paranoia rules aren't all that simple, but
>all the good GM's just ignore the inconvenient ones (and
>soon cease to notice they are doing it.)
>
>If you don't like the idea of GURPS Paranoia (which sounds like it
>will never come to be), then don't buy it! To claim a rule system
>is perfect is just silly (and probably belongs on advocacy, where
>we should take the discussion if it goes any further). You 
>either like it or you don't. All the rest is mere rationalisation.
>
>Glen

I wonder that the individual you oppose, namely, (Jason D Corley )
was joking. "Communism", "perfect", "safe" are all buzz words used by
Paranoia. I don't this was serious, and if it was... well, what's
the point of arguing with the "friendly" computer, it's an idiot. 

-- reljr

Xref: sparky rec.games.frp.misc:11641 rec.games.frp.advocacy:3863
From: gharris@jade.tufts.edu (George W. Harris)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Random Rolls
Date: 24 Jan 93 17:19:41 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA

In article <1993Jan22.220046.1900@news.vanderbilt.edu> talbert@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (Robert Talbert) writes:
>In article <1993Jan22.163503.7783@news.tufts.edu> gharris@jade.tufts.edu (George W. Harris) writes:
>>
>>	Appealing to real life is a bad idea if you're trying to justify
>>the way GURPS `balances' advantages (using the term here to mean *anything*
>>that helps the character) and disadvantages.  In real life, someone who gets
>>a college degree, or makes friends with the mayors daughter, doesn't suddenly
>>find herself saddled with a phobia or an allergy to milk.  It *doesn't* work
>>that way in real life.
>
>It's not the way it works in GURPS, either. Generally, if you don't start 
>out with something like what you mentioned, there has to be some effort 
>put forth to attain it, right? Ergo, the character point. Said points are
>spent to get those things. And besides, even if you do take a disad to 
>counter your newfound advantage, it needn't be inane; you make friends 
>with the mayor's daughter, but little do you know she has an enemy or a 
>psycho stalking her and her friends... cheezy example, but you see the 
>point, right? 

	Yes, there has to be some effort made to improve, but character points
are not a good way of measuring this effort.  For instance, suppose our Group of
Hardy Adventurers (tm) is setting out on an Adventure (tm).  Now, one of these
Hardy Adventurers has taken the Poor disadvantage.  When our group returns from
their adventure, they have each gained 6 million zorkmids, and some small number
of character points.  Now, while everyone else is using their character points 
to improve their skills, our poor Poor friend must use his to buy off his dis-
advantage.  So, he can't learn any skills because he used to be poor?

	Much more sensible is a method whereby skills improve through use or
training, and if a character does something to get rid of a disadvantage, like,
say, our poor Poor friend above, or a cripple who gives 10,000 Semolyans to a
healer to cast a regrow limb spell, then the disadvantage simply *goes away*.
Just like, as some are wont to say, in real life.
 
>Robert N. Talbert    		  | "I saw what cannot be seen
>talbert@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu |   See what you'll see.' " --- King's X
--
gharris@jade.tufts.edu          
George W. Harris              	"He'd kill us if he had the chance."  
Dept. of Mathematics            
Tufts University              			The Conversation  
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: goodin@fraser.sfu.ca (Charles Frederick Goodin)
Subject: Licensed or Unlicensed?
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 19:15:33 GMT

     This is one of those informal survey type things.  I'm mostly
doing this for my own interest.  The question is:  do people out
there prefer to play games based on licensed properties (e.g. DC
Heroes, Marvel, Dr. Who, Star Trek/Wars, etc.) or games with
settings developed for the game (e.g. D&D, Paranoia, Vampire:TM, etc.)?
     Answers can either be posted, or e-mailed to me at:
		goodin@fraser.sfu.ca
     I will post a summary of all the responses I get.  Eventually.
From: b_kondalski@trwvssi.vssi.trw.com (Brian J. Kondalski)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: RQ: River of Cradles (Possible Spoilers)
Date: 26 Jan 1993 13:39:17 GMT
Organization: TRW Vehicle Safety Systems, Inc.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: trwvssi.vssi.trw.com

In article <1k1d35INNj0a@beethoven.cs.unc.edu>, bell@cs.unc.edu (Andrew Bell) writes:
 
> Nope. They are merely prevented from training in combat skills other than
> dodge.  My Chalana Arroy ran around for years with a blunt shortsword, and
> once hit a gorp with a torch. 

I thought the the Chalana Arroy cult weapon was the large shield parry :-)

-- 
Brian J. Kondalski      b_kondalski@vssi.trw.com
TRW V.S.S.I.            Voice: (313) 781-7382           "The guaranteed eternal
4505 West 26 Mile Road  Fax: (313) 786-7702              sanctuary man."
Washington, MI  48094   Views expressed here are MINE!
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: davis@cwis.unomaha.edu (James J Davis)
Subject: Re: SR II PA'S SAMS the works!!!!!
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 06:26:18 GMT

Try it you'll like it! writes:

>I read in an  earlier article that you should play your characters role.
...
>Look having two Sams going toe to toe is pretty stupid also.  How 
>many times do you see people standing face to face trading shots at
>one another.  It is the same way in Shadowrun.  I must admit it is
>pretty cool to have your Sam taking on another and just trading shots
>and to have yours come out on top is really cool.  But that is the 
>most idiotic way of playing your character.

I'm a SR *novice*, so I have to form a basic concept of 'how to play'
from somewhere.  How about from the story in the front of the book?
What happens there?  Two characters fight *toe to toe*.  I think the
SR authors are saying that this *is* in genre.

Also, note it was a PA fighting a sammi.  Just a point to the poster
that said PAs and sammis shouldn't fight.  They are huge archaetypes,
and will regularly find enemies of one sort or another.  Just as the
story reads, it's feasable for PAs and sammis to come to blows.

And, in said story, the PA is depicted as a primo combatant.  Dangerous.
I think it is interesting that the sammi won.  I guess the authors have
prejudices that show even in literature.  This supports a previous
poster's comment on PA role: they are made to look like primo combatants
but fail to perform.

-james
From: Mark.J.Zohn@dartmouth.edu (Mark J. Zohn)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SRII: Threat Dice
Date: 25 Jan 93 20:04:23 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

Here are some untested possibilities-

I figure that the Threat Rating is a measure of just how dangerous
these people would be, even without an additional die pool, and so I
have written a little system to try and measure that (except for Toxic
and Insect shamans, whose rules are in the GII)I have tried and make
these generally for inherent skills and fairly permanent features,
rather than for having access to powerful equipment (such as a Panzer,
a Panther assault cannon and such) I was also thinking that this would
be simpler if calculated as if they were at maximum potential threat
(ie. Riggers would always have dice, not just when driving) Finally, I
am not familiar enough with Deckers to work them out.

NPC's
Give Threat Rating points for:
+1 if magically active (either Spellcaster or PA abilities)
+1 if has bonded focuses
+1 per bound Elemental
+1 per Initiate level
+1 if receives Totem bonuses for Combat (or Damaging Manipulation)
Spells

+1 per Combat Skill above 6
+1 if has Combat enhancing Cyberware or Bioware
+1 per additional Initiative die (including those for Riggers)

Critters
Give Threat Rating Points for:
+1 per 2 points armor
+1 if Strength above 8
+1 if Body above 8
+1 per Initiative die more than 1 (see page 282 SRII for some examples
of Intiative for Critters)
+1 per Innate power (for magically active Critters use the NPC
descriptions above)
+1 if uses advanced weapons (ie guns, steel combat equipment, etc)

I hope that this helps, and if you tinker with it, that's fine with me!

Mark
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: mwlucas@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Michael W. Lucas)
Subject: META:  Un-powered characters
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester MI.
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 13:07:58 GMT


Hello, world!

What are people's opinions on playing characters without "unnatural" 
powers?  Do most gamers require that they have the ability to create a
character with psi, magic, cybernetics, or whatever, to make their 
character more than human?  Has anyone out there run a game with just
normal humans, setting their skills against the universe?  If so, how well
did it run?


-- 
Michael Lucas			mwlucas@vela.acs.oakland.edu
Buy Gatecrasher, the new high-tech high-fantasy RPG from Hot Tub Dragon Games!
Don't buy SST records; they like suing their bands.
Organization: Freshman, CIT general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 22:52:50 -0500 
From: Robert Everett Brunskill <rb6t+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: WHAT THE HELL ARE NERPS???? -Shadowrun-

Just curious, but, um,  WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY?????
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cdr@kpc.com (Carl Rigney)
Subject: Re: SRII Combat System: Bugs, Mr. Rico!
Summary: grenades
Organization: Kubota Pacific Computer Inc, Santa Clara, CA
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 11:07:54 GMT

In article <1993Jan22.163243.570@otago.ac.nz> wintermute@otago.ac.nz writes:
>>lot of munchkins running around lobbing grenades everywhere.
>
>Isn't that what they do a lot of the time in old war movies. I thought greandes
>were prtty damned effective in real life (just a bit loud for those stealth
>ops).

In "real life" grenades have very low lethality rates; on the order of
a few percent.  There are even people who've thrown themselves on
grenades (a.k.a.  instant medal of honor) and lived; I believe one of
them is in the U.S. Congress.

FASA also mixed up offensive & defensive grenades.  Offensive grenades'
power should fall off more rapidly than defensive, so that you don't
run into the blast.  Defensive grenades can be more powerful because
you can be behind cover or in a foxhole when you throw it.  Grenades
are terrific night weapons because you can't follow the muzzle flash,
and you don't have to expose your head and arm to use one.  (Of course,
you don't have to expose your head if you're doing blind suppressive
fire or have an advanced smartlink, but that's another topic.)

FASA's grenades are cinematic, like in the movies where you throw one into
a room and everyone comes flying out the doors.  That's OK, Shadowrun is
a cinematic game.

At least SR2 has decent rules for grenades in small rooms.

There are lots of fun things you can do with smart grenades, as Earl and Trip
have pointed out in the past.

--
Carl Rigney
cdr@kpc.com

"I am a 30 second bomb.  I am a 30 second bomb.  29... 28..."
From: gorilla@cats.ucsc.edu (Christopher John Arnold)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Ars Magica: The Maleficium
Date: 22 Jan 93 03:31:57 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: am.ucsc.edu


Quoth eschneid@sparc8.tamu.edu (Erich R Schneider) not too long ago...
>In article <1993Jan21.193329.2106@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca> flindholm@mta.ca writes:
>
>>What exactly is the Maleficium about. I know it's a kind of demon hand
>>book But I havn't managed to find it anywhere to get a look at it. 
>>Also, if the party is big on demon hunting is it a must or can you easily
>>live without it.
>
>Isn't it supposed to be a handbook on the Infernal realm and
>associated regions and inhabitants? This means it would describe areas
>influenced by Infernal auras, all about Satan, his servants and his
>works, etc. I would assume it would go into great detail on the demons,
>especially their recurrent attempts to sway mages to their sides, and the
>resulting diabolists.

I just picked this little jewel up today and read it all in almost one
sitting. i got up to refill my Coke bottle once or twice. Anyway,
the Maleficium is a sourcebook for Ars Magica having to do with the infernal
realm. It describes the nature of all things evil, and how they got to
be that way. It also describes summoning rules for demons, and how to
be a Diabolist (called a Goetic Mage). I'll bring the book up to 
Campus tomorrow, and I'll write all about it then if nobody beats me
to it. 

Costs 18 $US BTW. 

As to whether or not the party is very intersted in Infernal things and
the according value of the book, Of course if the GM and the players 
really don't want to play with demons and things, then you may not
need this. However it is a very well done, if somewhat complex tome, 
and is essential for any GM who even tries to run a campaign in the
infernal realm, or a player with an infernal bent.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Arnold	gorilla@cats.ucsc.edu 	
"What the hell I'll add a confidence die to it." 
"OOPS......"
From: hin9@quads.uchicago.edu (T. Rev)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Chalana Arroy and weapons use
Date: 28 Jan 93 07:33:50 GMT
Reply-To: hin9@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: The Harlequinade


   About Chalana Arroy healers and weapons.  One point that seems to have
been left out is that Chalana Arroy has NO COMPUNCTIONS AT ALL about whomping
the hell out of undead.  While a lot of Healers would certainly avoid the
matter entirely, I can easily imagine a Healer who had built up a fairly
decent weapon attack skill helping her Storm Bull buddies tear up, er,
bring final rest to some zombies.

-- 
'Ever since the time I was laid up sick with nothing to read but the Carson
of Venus series by Edgar Rice Burroughs--well, let's just say it left a stain
on the ice-cream suit of my aesthetics.  The dry cleaners can't remove that
stain, if you get my meaning, but I gotta wear *something* in public.'
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cbekar@fraser.sfu.ca (Clifford Bekar)
Subject: SRII Pricing Problems
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 23:38:03 GMT

While recently preparing a rigger for an upcoming
campaign I ran across some pretty serious typos in
the price lists of both the RBB and the SRII sourcebook.
Any comments on how others have handled this or what you
think the 'proper' prices should be would be appreciated.

Problems I've noticed (not an exhaustive list I'm sure!):
(i) Vehicle control rig: In the main text the prices are
given as 12,000 (L1), 1,60,000 (L2)(?),2,300,00 (L3) [where
L=level]-->now in the tables we have 12,000 (L1), 60,000 (L2),
300,000 (L3). 

Note: much better prices from my riggers point of view.

(ii) Wired Reflexes: Same pages, 55,000 (L1), 165,000(L2),
2,500,000 (L3)-->in the tables, same except 500,000 (L3)

In RBB,

(iii) Suzuki Watersport: 1,200,000(!) compare this with a
motor yacht which costs 50,000.

Well, I'm not going to flame FASA since typos happen, and
these aren't all that seriou.  They sure tend to be 
confusing though...(I'll say I'm not going to flame them, I
have enough of them in my messages!)

Cliff Bekar
Simon Fraser University

Organization: Freshman, CIT general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 22:49:21 -0500 
From: Robert Everett Brunskill <rb6t+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: SRII: PhysAds vs Sams vs Deckers!

>>>>>[Lots of those Sams and Fizzies think they're hot cause they can
pound a Westwind into a Rapier.  What they usually don't have is the
smarts to open an umbrella in the rain.  On the streets smarts will keep
you alive longer than bullet-proof skin.  We decks know about mortality.
 We know that any shot could be our last.  Those pumped-up pretty boys
get to thinking they're imortal, then BANG they get proved wrong.
     Take my last run.  We get caught in a round of Bar Wars during a
meet.  Our Sam stands right up and starts firing away.  Needless to say
he gets more lead in him than the water fountains in Kobe Terrace Park
in summer.  The Fizz just disappears from view and later takes the guys
from behind.  Me?  I'm no vathead.  I flipped a table and took cover
before they even glanced my way.  I kept my head down, kept my gun warm,
and came out of there without a scratch.
     Mind you the one time I did try to play it Sam-style I got shot in
the shoulder, leg, and drug a couple of blocks by an Americar.  I won't
be trying that again.
     And then there was the time I saved both the Sam's and the Fizz's
ass from a good geek.  But that's another story.]<<<<<

     -Phantom (22:51:58/1-27-53)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cweir@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Corey Weir)
Subject: A Newbie with Questions...
Summary: Looking for games...
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 20:28:45 GMT

          Some of you out there may have heard of me before, but never
on this particular newsgroup. The name's Nomad, and I am looking for
people who discuss various superhero roleplaying games, like Marvel, DC,
Villains & Vigilantes, Champions, etc. If you have an ongoing game and
are looking for a new player...or if you know of someone who is, drop
the Nomad a line at his below address. See you around the Edge...I am...

                                                                 Nomad
From: IK20001@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (Solipsist@Large)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Burn, GURPS, BURN!
Date: 22 Jan 93 01:11:16 GMT
 <20JAN93.23287310.0073@VM1.MCGILL.CA> <2266@blue.cis.pitt.edu>
 <1993Jan21.183707.22968@rchland.ibm.com>
Organization: University of Maine System
Followups-to: rec.games.frp.advocacy

All very nice and good...and the very stuff I don't read Advocacy to
avoid.  You'll find plenty of people who like GURPS, Ars Magica, etc.,
and plenty who don't, and none of them want to read this stuff.

Followups to blah blah blah
--
Eric Alfred Burns                        "Life is full of decisions
Solipsist at Large                        but you never get to make any."
"It's all in your mind"
IK20001@maine.maine.edu                           --Linus Van Pelt
From: bhchan@soda.berkeley.edu (Billy H. Chan)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: GURPS Paranoia
Date: 25 Jan 1993 08:46:54 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1993Jan25.011419.9411@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu> corleyj@helium.gas.uug.arizona.edu (Jason D Corley ) writes:
 >1st Edition Paranoia was perfect.  2nd Edition Paranoia was also perfect,
 >much more so than 1st Edition Paranoia.
 >
 >GURPS is not perfect.  GURPS is a complicated, point-filled, Communist
 >mishmash of many different not-fun rules.
 >
complicated Communist mishmash?  Sounds like AlphaComplex :-P
(btw, rule #1 in any game system: You don't have to follow these rules) 

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------
Billy H. Chan <bhchan@soda.berkeley.edu> <bhchan@ocf.berkeley.edu>
~{3B:FH;~}     What is all this `~{6+Nw~}` stuff?    It's zW/HZ'ed
"It's all in the point of view." ~{UfJBTZQ[G0~}          Hanzi.
From: jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: What Fantasy RPG to buy?
Date: 27 Jan 93 22:19:17 GMT
Reply-To: jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim)
Organization: Columbia University

loren@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu (Loren Miller) writes:
>d90ba@efd.lth.se (Bjoern Andersson) writes:
>>The following games have been on our mind, but we know little about them:
>>* AMBER
>>* Mythos (Gygax New)
>>* GURPS (with some modules)
>
>In your shoes I'd go for Amber. And there's another bonus. Let the players 
>read the Amber series by Roger Zelazny and they'll understand how to get 
>into character and into the world, and it's more fun than the usual rpg 
>player guide reading.

	A caveat to Loren's recommendation. Only do this if you have a 
GM whom you really trust to be unbiased. Many GM faults are vastly 
amplified when using the Amber 'system', and some others are actively 
encouraged by the Amber book. Amber, as a system, is very little more 
than a recommendation for the GM to use his judgement, with no help in 
quantification. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Kim                    | "You're on the cutting room floor, Chaplin.
jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu | Not a good place to be."
Columbia University         |                  (from the movie 'Chaplin')