From: exukjb@exu.ericsson.se (ken bell)
Subject: Re: Bush interview as quoted in Alt.Atheism FAQ
Organization: Ericsson Network Systems, Inc.
Distribution: world,local
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 15:38:04 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.200020.19398@bmerh85.bnr.ca> dgraham@bmers30.bnr.ca (Douglas Graham) writes:
>From: dgraham@bmers30.bnr.ca (Douglas Graham)
>Subject: Re: Bush interview as quoted in Alt.Atheism FAQ
>Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 20:00:20 GMT

>In article <24JUL199211250314@skyblu.ccit.arizona.edu> lippard@skyblu.ccit.arizona.edu (James J. Lippard) writes:

>>As I have pointed out once before, and as Jim Perry has also pointed out,
>>the original version posted to the net did *NOT* have the words "Mr. President"
>>in it.  I also cited a published version of the transcript (in the Fall 1988
>>issue of _Free Inquiry_) which also lacks those words.  I previously asked
>>if anyone has ever seen a published, printed transcript which *does*
>>contain the words "Mr. President," and got no response.  I would be most
>>interested in knowing how those words got into the alt.atheism FAQ in the
>>first place--whose posting to alt.atheism contained those words, and where
>>did they get the transcript?

>Here's the first reference I saw to it.  It sounds like somebody was
>guessing from memory:

>} From: jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
>} Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,soc.culture.usa,alt.atheism,talk.religion.misc,alt.individualism,alt.society.civil-liberty
>} Subject: Re: Bush & atheists
>} Message-ID: <1991Nov18.094352.29079@nntp.hut.fi>
>} Date: 18 Nov 91 09:43:52 GMT
>} References: <1991Nov18.014518.26579@cco.caltech.edu>
>} Sender: usenet@nntp.hut.fi (Usenet pseudouser id)
>} Reply-To: jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
>} Followup-To: talk.politics.misc
>} Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
>} Lines: 72
>} In-Reply-To: dicely@cco.caltech.edu
>} Nntp-Posting-Host: sauna.cs.hut.fi
>} 
>} In article <1991Nov18.014518.26579@cco.caltech.edu>, dicely@cco writes:
>} >
>} >Could someone provide a reference for the Bush quote regarding atheists in my  
>} >..sig, I snagged the quote out of an article here and lost the source...
>} 
>} This is becoming a FAQ.  Here are the sources I've seen:
>} 
>} From: dougm@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
>} Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,misc.legal
>} Subject: Re: Bush quote
>} Date: 16 Oct 91 13:21:52 GMT
>} 
>} The reference to that quote, seen again below, is Free Enquiry
>} magazine, Fall 1988.
>} 
>} [ .. ]
>} "I don't know that athiests should be considered citizens, nor
>} should they be considered patriots.  This is one nation under God."
>}                                       Pres. George Bush
>} 
>} [ .. ]
>} 
>} From: eck@panix.com (Mark Eckenwiler)
>} Subject: Re: Bush quote
>} Organization: The Witherspoon Excludables
>} 
>} [ .. ]
>} I ran a Nexis search and found support.  UPI reported on May 8, 1989
>} that various atheist organizations were still angry over the remarks
>} above (quoted accurately, I note).  Bush made the comments during a
>} campaign stop on August 27, 1988 at (ironically) O'Hare airport in an
>} exchange with Robert Sherman, chief spokesman for American Atheists.
>} 
>} [ .. ]
>} From: constant@helios.ecn.purdue.edu (Tino)
>} Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.drugs,talk.politics.misc
>} Subject: Re: Drug war samaritans
>} 
>} [ .. ]
>} >  Is this quote for real????????!!!!!!
>} 
>} [ .. ]
>} 
>} Unfortunately, yes. I have a transcript of the interview at home, but it went
>} something like this: (It took place during Bush's 88 campaign, at a press
>} conference at O'Hare Airport)
>} 
>} Reporter for the American Athiest magazine, Rob Sherman: "Mr. President,
>}      what will you do to gain the votes of American citizens who are
>}      Athiests?"
>} George Bush: "Well, I don't really have a strong interest in Athiests. Faith
>}      in god is pretty important to me."
>} RS: "But you do believe that Athiests should have the same rights as other
>}      citizens?"
>} GB: "I don't know that Athiests should be considered citizens, nor should
>}      they be considered patriots. This is one nation under god."
>} 
>} After this quote was made, many attempts by American Athiests (the 
>} organization that lobbies for church-state separation) and other (non)citizens
>} were made to allow the White House to retract this statement. Apparently this
>} IS the Administration's policy on Athiests.
>} 
>} ....The Land of the Free, and the Home of the Brave...
>} 
>} Tino
>} --
>} "We don't see much of Charlie Brown anymore.
>}  He went to jail for killing Lucy, that whore.    
>}  Linus is drunk, Schroeder's a punk,               --Beefsteak,
>}  And Sally gets paid swallowing spunk!"              "Charlie Brown Stain"
>} 
>} (followups to talk.politics.misc)
>--
>Doug Graham         dgraham@bnr.ca         My opinions are my own.

I think we should be careful not to identify atheists with ethical 
nihilists, or even god-haters. The debate between theists and non-theists is 
too important to allow the word 'atheism' to take on logically irrelevant 
emotive connotations.  An atheist, simply as such, is someone who denies 
that the proposition 'God exists' is a true proposition.  
						-- K.B.
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