HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bilgeoid@milton.u.washington.edu (Patricia Henry)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Advice wanted:  Holster for woman
Date: 18 Dec 92 13:35:42 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

I am wondering what sort of holster I should buy and I need
some advice.  Putting it in a purse is not acceptable to me
because I don't think it will be accessible.

I'm thinking about buying a Glock pistol.  I have already
tried several automatics and revolvers and it seems to be
the one that I am most comfortable with.

I am a woman who usually dresses casually, stretch pants, t-
shirts, sweatshirts, etc. as I am a student right now, but
after graduation in 3 months (yeehaa!), I may have to dress
more professionally.

Thanks in advance.

Patricia Henry
bilgeoid@u.washington.edu
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Movies/media and guns vs. reality
Date: 15 Dec 92 03:42:10 GMT
Organization: The Cat Factory


I hate to rain on your idea, but the fact is the studios already have
expert technical consultants coming out of their ears.  One company was
even written up in last Sunday's L.A.  Times Magazine.  They're called
"Call the Cops" and are really a bunch of LAPD SWAT officers getting in a
little moonlighting.  Several crime shows have one of their consultants on
the set at all times.

I fear we must resign ourselves to the fact that aesthetics and artistic
license take precedence over factual reality in the entertainment biz.  In
fact, many plots hinge on points that simply wouldn't occur in the real
world (see my previous post about "Columbo," e.g.).  Heck, the whole
premise of "Die Hard" assumed an act of stupidity on the part of the vault
designers. (Would _you_ design a super-secure vault lock to automatically
_open_ on power failure?)

TV and movie audiences don't want to think.  The people who depend on them
for income aren't about to force them to do so.

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@polymath.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                Do not meddle in the affairs of
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483  dragons, for you are crunchy
Santa Monica, CA  90405                        and go well with ketchup.
From: gmk@falstaff.MAE.CWRU.EDU (Geoff Kotzar)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Storage of primers
Date: 12 Dec 92 00:22:53 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <1992Dec1.055142.4656@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> fist@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Richard Pierson) writes:
#In article <HOLLEN.92Nov29080526@peg.megatek.UUCP>,
#megatek!hollen@uunet.UU.NET (Dion Hollenbeck) writes:
#|> #>>>> On 27 Nov 92 22:20:36 GMT, dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu (Donald R.
#|> Newcomb) said:
#|> 
#|> Don> I would like to find out how other people living in humid
#|> climates
#|> Don> store their primers. Tupperware? Cookie jar?
#|> 


#|> These bags are stored in a wooden shed which is
#|> NOT attached to the house.  This shed also contains my gunpowder
#|> stash.  When you go into gun stores, their powder safes are always
#|> wooden.  


#The main reason they are wooden are to eliminate explosions
#in the event of fire. Put 300lbs of smokeless in a steel safe
#and you have a 300+ lb bomb, it would take a pretty good
#safe to hold that in. 

#Richard Pierson E06584 vnet: [908] 699-6063

If you use a wooden enclosure that is too stoutly constructed you will also
wind up with a bomb. The enclosure must be designed to pop open at very
low pressure. According to one of the Material Science professors who
consulted on the design of the shaped charge anti-tank projectiles in
days long past, wood is used for two reasons in these applications. First,
it acts as a great insulator; with 1800 F temperatures on one side of
the char layer, the temperature on the other side of the char layer is
only 350 F. Second, for most reasonably dense woods the char layer will
only advance at a rate of 1mm per minute. For a magazine with one inch
thick walls you buy yourself almost half an hour before internal temper-
atures reach a danger level.

geoff kotzar          gmk@falstaff.mae.cwru.edu
From: ctk@well.sf.ca.us (Cassandra T. Kamuchey)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: 9mm Question
Date: 16 Dec 92 14:34:31 GMT
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link


	I am a first time gun buyer and need some suggestions.  First, the
handgun I purchase is intended for home defense.  Second, I have tried
various "ladies model" guns and have found the recoil too strong and the
grips too unstable. (My SO who may also need to use the gun naturally found
the grip too small for his hands. It was a Ladysmith Wesson .38).

	We both tried a SIG 9mm which we liked a lot.  The only problem was
that the grip was too large for me, although the recoil was quite
manageable.  My question is:  Are there any smaller 9mm which people
would be willing to recommend (i.e., have a good track record, few
mechanical/jamming problems).  Please e-mail your suggestions to
<ctk@well.sf.ca.usa>  Thx.
From: DENNIS_@ncsu.edu (DGA)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Match, Wheel, Flint Locks
Date: 15 Dec 92 00:53:47 GMT
Organization: North Carolina State University

In article <Bz6n7t.LJo@news.cso.uiuc.edu> irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine) writes:
#From: irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine)
#Subject: Match, Wheel, Flint Locks
#Date: 13 Dec 92 15:46:34 GMT
#Does anyone know what the difference between these
#types of actions?
#
#Jus' curious...
#
#

Match:  Generally, a serpentine arm on the side of the weapon held a slow-
burning fuse in the end above the weapon, with the lower arm prutruding 
below the weapen in the fashion of a crude trigger.  To fire the 
weapon the trigger arm was rotated in a manner which pulled (or pushed) the 
upper arm down, thus bringing the burning fuse into contact with priming 
powder which ignited and subsequently, through a "touch-hole", ignited the 
main charge.

Wheel:  An action very much like a "Zippo" lighter was used to create a 
shower of sparks which fell into the priming powder and caused the 
ignition.  The flint was held in place and the metal wheel turned.  The 
wheel was driven by a spring which was wound before firing, often with the 
aid of a special wrench (spanner).  

Flint Lock:  This method of ignition uses a cock (similar to a modern 
hammer), holding a piece of flint.  When the trigger is pulled the flint 
moves forward and down striking a metal "frizzen" and creating a shower of 
sparks which falls into a priming pan filled with powder, which ignites.  
The frizzen also acts as a lever to open the usually covered priming pan.

Very basic, I know.  Almost any library will have a book or two on the 
history of firearms or weapons that will explain better and give 
illustrations.

DGA
From: dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu (Donald R. Newcomb)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: dealing with a police officer
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:17:25 GMT
Organization: University of Southern Mississippi

Isn't it about time for this thread to move to t.p.g or another group
having to do with citizen/police interaction?
-- 

Donald R. Newcomb                * Life only admits two states: 
dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu        * growing and dying. So what,
newcomb@usmcp6.bitnet            * if I've put on a little weight?

[MODERATOR:  Seems like.  In so far as your next posts deal with aspects
of traffic stops etc w.r.t. firearms, then here is fine, else take it to,
say, t.p.g....]
From: ctk@well.sf.ca.us (Cassandra T. Kamuchey)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Thanks (Again) For The 9mm Answers
Date: 19 Dec 92 15:20:55 GMT
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link


	We wanted to thank all those who responded to our 9mm question.
The next step is to visit some more rental facilities (after the holidays)
and at least know how to spell some of the names they (sales clerks) keep
throwing about. As one person stated: "asking which 9mm to buy is a lot
like asking which church to join."  Thx again.
From: fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (steve hix)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: More newbie questions
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:19:09 GMT
Organization: Sun

In article <1992Dec15.195829.18377@igor.tamri.com> donb@igor.tamri.com (Don Baldwin) writes:
#
#For folks with kids, I was wondering how they handle the toy gun debate.
#I'm definitely going to take my kids to the range, as soon as they show
#interest in shooting but I'm not sure how I feel about toy guns.  Part of me
#thinks that (my) kids should not have any (that they should have no slightest
#indication that guns are toys), part of me thinks it's a non-issue.  What
#do other people out there think?

Toy guns not permitted at our house.  (Friends of my son, who is 9, get to check
theirs in at the door.  They think he's a crank on the issue, but they're getting
introduced to gun safety by him. His idea.)

All three kids were introduced to shooting with air rifle.  We have an
air rifle range set up in the garage with a silent pellet trap and
backstop.  Regular matches during bad weather season.

#From there, they went to smallbore rifle and pistol shooting (after attending a
local NRA firearm safety course).  They each have their own particular interests,
ranging from 9mm/.45 pistol shooting, to benchrest smallbore, to .45-70 singleshot
booming.  Blackpowder shooting is next on the list.

But no toy guns.  Toy guns are out.  Guns are not toys.  (Well...they are, but not
in an undisciplined runaroundbangbangyou'redead sense.  :} )

Safety first. Makes the following fun more fun.

--
-------------------------------------------------------
| Some things are too important not to give away      |
| to everybody else and have none left for yourself.  |
|------------------------ Dieter the car salesman-----|
From: mccon@ssdd475a.erim.org (Joe McConnell)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Match, Wheel, Flint Locks
Date: 18 Dec 92 13:35:23 GMT
Organization: Environmental Research Institute of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan

Get a copy of Pollard's History of Firearms (Ed Claude Blair, Macmillan)
or Stone's Glossary.  Look up blunderbuss.
--
Joe McConnell  | Opinions expressed are the   | Don't blame me!  I voted for
mccon@erim.org | author's, not the employer's.| Stephen Maturin!
From: jmd@cube.handheld.com (Jim De Arras)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: BANG BANG YOUR DEAD
Date: 13 Dec 92 23:12:17 GMT
Organization: Hand Held Products, Inc.

Sorry, as a new gun owner, I follow this group as a lurky, mostly, but the  
horrible misuse of "your" when you mean "you're" is so prevalent here as to  
make the group look like a bunch of ignorant backwoods folks at times!  And I  
know that is not the case.  

Please try to use "you're" as the contraction for "you are", not the possessive  
pronoun "your"!  Don't re-enforce the anti-gun force's stereotype of gun  
owners.

Jim

--
Jim De Arras            | The opinions expressed herein are
Hand Held Products, Inc.| not necessarily those of Hand 
804.784.3090 voice      | Held Products, Inc., and may not 
804.784.3147 FAX        | even be mine. Use at your own risk
From: mje@pookie.pass.wayne.edu (Michael J. Edelman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Airguns for Sale
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:19:18 GMT
Organization: Wayne State University

A friend and I have a number of airguns for sale. First, Tom's guns:

Beeman/HW R7 .177 rifle. Accurized. Postpaid, $125.
Beeman/Feinwerkbau 124D. Accurized. Postpaid, $250

For those guns, call Tom Ciemiega at 1-313-544-0771, between 5 and 10pm EST.

I have a number of new and old airguns in various conditions, some working 
perfectly and some needing work. The main ones for sale now:

Crosman 101 and 102 pneumatic rifles. Both are in .22cal, and both
need new seals- they won't hold air. The 101 is in so-so condition,
and is $35 postpaid. The 102 is a magazine feeding version and is in very
good cosmetic condition. $45ppd. 

Crosman 700. A 60s era CO2 rifle in .22 with a simple slab stock. Hard hitting
and in perfect working order- $45 ppd. Enough power to hunt for cheap.

Crosman Backpacker. Neat pump-type pneumatic. Sells for about $55; yours for
$35ppd.

Benjamin pneumatic pistol. Fairly new, .177 cal. Lists for about $70; $45ppd.
I can't sell this in Michigan without a purchase permit, but I can sell to another
state. Weird, but that's the law.

Offers considered; trades solicited as well. I'm interested in Daisy Model 25 
rifles (the pump-type that we all had as kids), some older archery equipment,
musical instruments, who knows...? I just need to thin out my collection. Too
much stuff! If you're in the Detroit area, I'll cut some good deals since I
won't have to ship.

mike edelman   mje@pookie.pass.wayne.edu 313-577-0742 (office) 313-543-6437 (home)
From: snguyen@orion.oac.uci.edu (Desperately Seeking Sarah!)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Timberland Ultralite hunting boots forsale
Date: 15 Dec 92 23:33:38 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine

In article <199212142056.AA18998@news.service.uci.edu> snguyen@orion.oac.uci.edu (Desperately Seeking Sarah!) writes:
#I have a brand new pair of Timberland Ultralite size 10 forsale.
#It's black leather and waterproof. Bought it last year for $150 
#(plus tax) and never used it.  
#
#Please email with offer if you're interested.

This is bad; correcting my own post ...

But last night, I checked on the boots, and they're not what I 
advertised.  The truth is...

1 pair of Timberland 10" Super Boot, size 9 M.  Bought at $140 (+ tax).
The parts I did get right are that they're waterproof, comes with
a bottle of silicon solution to treat the leather, they're *almost*
black, and never used, in the original box.

Sorry 'bout that,

Son Nguyen
snguyen@uci.edu
From: C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Time Restriction on Gun Sales?
Date: 14 Dec 92 14:15:21 GMT


Is there any law on the federal level that specifies a time period
between the purchase of a gun and the selling of it?

For example, let's say I bought a gun and a week later I want to
sell it.  Can I legally make a private sale, or do I have to hold
on to the gun for a month or so before selling it?


Rob

[MODERATOR:  Probably only restrictions on local level, what do
you think folks?   Also depends upon whether or not you are a dealer.
For example, here in MD a dealer who buys a used firearm *may not*
resell the firearm for a short period (two weeks? I forget), and may
in fact be required to look up the serno in a state database.]
From: cramer@optilink.com (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: SMLE scope base wanted
Date: 16 Dec 92 14:34:06 GMT

Who makes them for No. 2, Mk IV?  Something to take standard Weaver rings.
From: post@hpfcso.fc.hp.com (David Post)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Gun blast noise in a car?
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:26:42 GMT

Gary writes:
 >a later. Note, however, that shooting through the windshield is usually
 >a dumb idea. If the perp is standing in front of your car, hit him with
 >the 4,000 pound bullet, it's more effective.

If you are fearing for your life ( and you have forgotten where you put the
keys :-) and you must fire through the windshield from inside, please
remember to aim a few inches low ( yes, low ) on the center of mass.

Four inches is about right for a violent criminal a foot or two in front of
your hood.  This would be for 9mm, 115 gr JHP  or 45 acp, 200-230 gr JHP.  A
jacketed RN, TC or FMJ-FP will deflect a bit less.  As will a lead bullet.

I'm told this even works for a 380, but can't vouch for that.

It is an interesting phenomena.  The glass produces so much friction that
it strips the steel jacket off the HPs and sometimes a FMJ.

Always fire at least twice because your groups will be terrible.  :-)  This
also means that a foot or two in front of your hood is nearly extreme range.

David Post  davep@hpfcpp.fc.hp.com  hplabs!hpfcla!post
From: bdboyle@erenj.com (Bryan D. Boyle)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Hi there
Date: 12 Dec 92 00:21:59 GMT
Organization: Exxon Research and Engineering, NJ

Hi all,

I have seen in pictures the shorter version of the M16, and I
think I've seen it referenced as the CAR, but I'm not sure.
Does anyone have any information on this rifle? I'm interested
in when it was first made, by whom, what service(s) used it
and if it is still manufactured today.

Thanks in advance!

mike

===================================================================
Mike Crumrine
Exxon Research and Engineering
Annandale,  NJ 08801
(908) 730-2237
crumrine@erenj.com
===================================================================



-- 
Bryan D. Boyle     |Opinions are mine, not Exxon's...
Senior Engineer    |PVT/ASEL/IA
bdboyle@erenj.com  |(908) 730 3338
From: erico@squirrel.pen.tek.com (Eric Oosterhof;627-4329;47-786;tekig1.pen;)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: dealing with a police officer
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:18:32 GMT
Organization: tektronix



When I was in college is Corvallis, I was out one night after a midnight movie.  One the way home, I got pulled over; supposedly for a burned out tail-light, I think she was looking for somebody drunk. I pulled over, opened the window, and she asked for my license, registration, etc.  I reached into my jacket, got my wallet, gave her my license, reached for the glove box, and stopped.  I had a cap gun, just a cap gun mind you, and figured that I should tell her.  I said, "There is a realistic looking but p


lastic cap gun in my glove box on top of the papers."  She asked that I slowly hand it to her, using my fingertips and holding it away from my body, where she could see it.  She looked at it, decided it wasn't threatening, and KEPT it.  No ticket that night, and I felt good about how the gun was dealt with.  Were it a real gun, I would have responded the same way; except that I would have made sure it was returned.


-- 
Eric Oosterhof                "Divorce is a bad joke, with
erico@tekig1.PEN.TEK.COM      no punch line!"  - Sherrod Mohr
(503) 627-4329                
"Choosy mothers choose .gif"  Anthony C. Zable
From: mje@pookie.pass.wayne.edu (Michael J. Edelman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Airguns for sale - Update
Date: 19 Dec 92 00:24:22 GMT
Organization: Wayne State University

The Feinwerkbau and the R7 have been sold; the other stuff is still available, but
there's interest in the Benjamin....

       --mike
From: fist@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Richard Pierson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: dealing with a police officer
Date: 15 Dec 92 23:34:45 GMT
Organization: Bell Communications Research (Bellcore)

Don't do it in NJ. Stay in your car (they will tell you to
stay in if you start to get out over the pa). As I am pulling
over [60 in a 55, here they give you a ticket for going that
slow :-) ] I open my glove box and pull out the paper work
in one small folder then close the box. I also pop my wallet
onto the dash (with military ID showing :-), roll down the
window and wait. That's state police, towns are a different
matter, were talking revenue there, you're on your own.
-- 
##########################################################
There are only two types of ships in the NAVY; SUBMARINES 
                 and TARGETS !!!
#1/XS1100LH	#2/10/10/92
Richard Pierson E06584 vnet: [908] 699-6063
Internet: fist@iscp.bellcore.com,|| UUNET:uunet!bcr!fist  
#include <std.disclaimer> My opinions are my own!!!
I Don't shop in malls, I BUY my jeans, jackets and ammo
in the same store.
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Glock thanks!
Date: 12 Dec 92 00:21:56 GMT
Organization: Chalmers Tekniska Lekskola, G|teborg, G|taland


  I'd just like to thank everybody who posted and mailed.

-bertil-
--
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."
From: purtilo@cs.umd.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: aimpoint on rifle?
Date: 13 Dec 92 23:12:07 GMT

Anyone have experience putting an Aimpoint (such as the 3000) on a rifle
(say, AR15 or Mini-14)?  Is it recommended? Useful?  Helpful in low-light
conditions? Does it survive the extra pounding?  I had an informal debate
recently, where I mentioned interest in things like Trijicon sights on a
long gun for low light assist, though complained that it is generally only
good for the first shot (big flash subsequently blows night adaptation.)
My colleague pointed out that the night sights are things you cannot turn
off... and may be visible to one's opponent when one least wanted it.  If
you needed to hide, then you needed to hide the sights too, though he made
no claim (as I have heard some make) that Trijicon's would be bright enough
to illuminate you to the opponent.  An argument in favor of Aimpoints (or
the like) would be one could turn it on/off, and also have a brighter aiming
point; down side is potential for poorer target ID (you DO have to look
through a tube and optics, which of course cuts things down a little), and
the extra "stuff" on a housing would block more of your lateral vision in a
fast shooting scenario.  Anyway, thanks for anything you can share along
these lines!

Jim
From: cramer@optilink.com (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: M1911 operation
Date: 19 Dec 92 15:20:04 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA


In article <9212171146.aa06373@claudius.pica.army.mil>, erudnick@pica.army.mil (FSAC-SID) writes:
# So to satisfy my curiosity more than anything else, how do you drop the
# hammer on a loaded chamber with one hand with an M1911? Or can't it be
# done? I realize that this is not a common requirement, but I'm just
# curious. Thanks in advance.
# 
# Ed Rudnicki     erudnick@pica.army.mil     All disclaimers apply

Carefully.  Very, very carefully.  Actually, I don't ever do this 
one handed with a chambered round, though it seems to work.  

I have done it with the Colt Government Model .380, but very, very
rarely one handed.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
C++ is to C, as lung cancer is to lung.
From: callison@essex.ecn.uoknor.edu (James P. Callison)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Stainless and WD40
Date: 20 Dec 92 15:33:34 GMT
Organization: Engineering Computer Network, University of Oklahoma, Norman, OK, USA

In article <8dzg02JJ2fbI01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> efk00@cd.amdahl.com (Eddie Kieger) writes:
#
#In article <1992Dec18.025846.5287@ttinews.tti.com>,
#hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:
##My understanding is WD-40 was originally developed for use on Titan
##missiles.  What does the military use Break-Free for?
#
#Everything.

No kidding. That stuff's the "wonder gunk that works wonders" (with
apologies to Bayer ;-)

#seriously, in my unit it is the ONLY thing used to clean guns. No 
#bore leaner, just CLP (the military "nickname" for breakfree - look 
#at a bottle, it'll say CLP - Cleaner Lubricant Protector. Ya'll know 
#how much we LOVE those acronyms....... :-).

Actually, the name is BreakFree-CLP. Says so right on the bottle. 

#Used for everything from mortars to 40mm Grenade launchers (the belt 
#fed kind) to .50 cal BMGs, to SIG-226s to .... you get the point :-).

It's not just limited to weapons; the first bottle I got of BreakFree
was from a Sgt.Major who works in the OK Nat'l Guard motor pool. They
use that stuff on everything--I found it to be _extremely_ useful when
rebuilding the engine in my car a couple of years ago (a '66 Galaxie 500;
4bbl 390, bored over, 330+hp; man, but that car can haul some serious 
@$$ :-). It's a penetrating lubricant, really good for busting those
nuts loose on the exhaust manifold (you know, the ones that get welded
on there by the heat?).
I'd use it on my pistols, but I personally think it's a bit thick; I
have Hoppes #9 for cleaning and Buck Gun Oil (with Teflon) for oiling,
so I save the BreakFree for mechanic-type work.

				James

James P. Callison       Microcomputer Coordinator        OU Law Library 
Callison@aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu   /\    Callison@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu
	constellation!biglaw!callison@mailhost.ecn.uoknor.edu
DISCLAIMER: I'm not an engineer, but I play one at work...
	Your self esteem is enhanced by remaining an ignoramus?
	Please! Let's call it "informationally impaired."
		--Hobbes and Calvin, "Calvin and Hobbes"