Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 30 Sep 1992 11:01:11 -0700
From:         Vicki Brown <vlb@MAGIC.AUX.APPLE.COM>
Subject:      Re: Second-stage problems in conversation

>Chris Lehfeldt (cxlnvd@ritvax) writes:
>I find that 90% of conversations between hearing people are just "blab,
>blab" (no offense to those here) and I consider them just "space fillers"
>and I think that's probably because hearing people want to avoid 'pregnant
>silences.'  ;)

Do you mean all the "Um hm", "Yes", "Uh hu", stuff (sort of the hearie
equivalent of keeping eye contact and nodding) or actual sentences?

> I see a lot of interaction between (when as an observer with an oral/sign
> interpreter present) hearing people in general, so I think those 'boring'
> conversations are just >idle gossip, to make one's presence in the room
> comfortable, non-threatening as possible.

Most hearies are uncomfortable with long stretches of silence with nothing
going on.  Somebody has to "break the ice"  "get people talking".  What amazes
me is when I am sitting in a hotel lobby reading a book and someone sits down
next to me and wants to have a conversation.  I don't really know this person
well and for me it is not a case of "nothing going on" - *I* am reading.

Now I have a question, though...If 2 or more [Dd]eaf people people are
together, wouldn't they also talk?  Engage in idle gossip perhaps?  They won't
just sit and stare at each other, will they?  What I mean is, I have trouble
believing that the phenomenon of "most conversation isn't deeply meaningful" is
limited to hearing people.

>When I find myself in an elevator going up or down longways, and there is
>a hearing person together with me in the same elevator/lift, I wonder if
>I am supposed to say something innocuous like "nice weather we are having,
>aren't we?" just to 'kill the space.'

Ah, but here the rules change.  In an elevator, hearing people all stand facing
the door and No-one talks to anybody.  Sometimes a few people will get on and
continue a conversation but they sort of huddle together and lower their
voices.  If you say something to the other person in the elevator you'll
probably be looked at funny :-)

>>2. Even when I can follow a conversation, I miss those signals which
>>   human beings seem to be using to allow someone else to say something
>>   AND to listen to him...
>Interesting, I think those 'signals' occur when the person listening to
>the other person... let me call them A and B.  From my perspective, and
>from reading linguistic texts, there is an imperciptible 'question' stress
>towards the end of the words that A is saying, and person B senses this
>as a conversational "say something to tell me that you're with me so far"
>and B can say "hmm-mmmm" or "I see, yeah, go on.."

>I find this phenomenon in my deaf oral friends.  It is considered OK (in
>hearing culture terms, that is) to 'interrupt' the other in talking

Well, not considered OK, exactly, just common practice :-).  Some of us are
just rude (sigh) and some of us are skilled at multi-processing (I have 2
friends at work with whom I carry on simultaneous conversations - I say
something to A, he says something else to me, I respond to him and he to me but
it is *2 different topics* and the third friend is following both discussions.
Other people around us, needless to say, are very "weirded out" by this.
In contrast, my spouse needs to "have the floor".  If he thinks he's been
interrupted he just stops talking till he can see a gap, which may not occur
for a long time in some conversations.

Things like "Um hm" and "I see" aren't considered real conversation or
interruption.  More the verbal equivalent of nodding, or the ASL sign glossed
as THAT (Y hand "nods up and down" similar to YES).  Hopping in to tell about
*Your* experience is interrupting, and is technically rude.

  Vicki Brown
  A/UX Development Group            Apple Computer, Inc., Cupertino, CA
  Internet: vlb@apple.com           AppleLink: VICKI.BROWN
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