HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kimmel@cortex.sai.vtt.fi     (Jyrki Kimmel)
Subject: Re: Re^2: Some questions...
Organization: Technical Research Centre of Finland (VTT/SAI)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 05:25:57 GMT

In article <rhatch.3@sdsu.edu> rhatch@sdsu.edu (Richard Hatch) writes:
>In article <4071@novavax.UUCP> vest@novavax.UUCP (Steven Vest) writes:
>>    I'm going open myself up to mega flames here by giving you advice that 
>may>go against the grain of many of the regular posters here.  My advice is 
>to not>let them talk you into getting too elaborate with your first setup.  
>
>Let me second the advice.  In thirty years of diddling with tropical fish, 
>the one maxim that seems consistent is that the less I do to the tank, the 
>healthier the fish are.

What may work for you, may not work for others. While I agree with your
view as to minimum maintenance of tanks, I would not raise the principle
to be a 'maxim'.

>
>To enable that approach, you have to start with certain preconditions.  
>First, get a tank larger than you thought you wanted.  Twice as big is half 
>as hard to keep going.  Second, spend about half your budgeted money on 
>filtration.  A big filter makes up for many other faults.  Third, age the 
>water/gravel setup for a very long time before you put fish in.  (This one's 
>the hardest, and I seldom actually do it, but then I usually replace the 
>first batch of fish, too.) Fourth, buy about 1/3 the number of fish you 
>think you should.
>

All this is true, given you have no limit on money to spend on a tank.
Finding the optimum is the challenge. Budget your time to whatever
care you need to give to your tank, then decide what degree of
filtration you must get.

IMHO, a tank with too many and too large fish is ugly, too!

Jyrki


-- 
Jyrki Kimmel, VTT Medical Engineering Laboratory kimmel@cortex.sai.vtt.fi
signature in proposal in peer review phase (PPRP). Proposed motto:
"El{m{ on kivaa!" ("Life is fun!")  -Kaisa-Maria, age 3
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
From: wkb@cbnews.cb.att.com (wm.keith.brummett)
Subject: Re: [M] Feeding a flame angel
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 19:33:11 GMT
Followup-To: alt.aquaria


    In article <1992Sep09.131354.29612@bnr.ca>, brunner@crchh447.bnr.ca
    (James Brunner) writes:
    > Two days ago, I bought a small (2 inch) flame angel.  He is swimming
    > actively and looks healthy.  However, he hasn't eaten anything yet.
    > I've tried mantis [brine?] shrimp which the fish store recommended and
    > the angel just looked at it.  I've tried marine flake food which I had
    > handy.  And I've just put in some romaine lettuce - the fish doesn't
    > even look at it.
    > 
    > What's up?  It's only been two days, should I be worried yet?  Or just
    > wait until he gets hungry.


    I have a flame and a lemon peel in my fish-only marine tank.  I feed
    mostly O.S.I. marine flake food.  Whenever I add a fish, it usually
    takes a few days for it to "learn" how to eat.  The local shops seem to
    feed mostly brine shrimp, and I make sure the fish will eat that before
    I buy it.  At home, new fish usually hide at feeding time for the first
    couple of days (the damsels streaking about at warp 9 seem to be the
    reason).  Once a new fish gets hungry enough, it comes out.  I remember
    that it took the flame a while to learn how to take a flake off of the
    surface.  At first it would cruise just under the surface, sucking up
    pieces dropping due to the actions of the other fish.

    I've never had any luck with lettuce.  The two angels I have will spend
    a lot of time pecking at algae and stuff on the rocks.  They ate all
    the macro-algae I once had growing in the tank.

    -- Keith

-- 
    | (614) 860-3187         Copyright (C) 1992, by       AT&T, Room 3B202 |
    | att!cblph!wkb  or,     W.K. Brummett and AT&T      6200 E. Broad St. |
    | wkb@cblph.att.com       All rights reserved.      Columbus, OH 43213 |
    `----------------------------------------------------------------------'
From: wkb@cbnews.cb.att.com (wm.keith.brummett)
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
Subject: (M) Urchins in fish-only tanks?
Keywords: urchins
Date: 9 Sep 92 19:40:25 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T


    I've noticed a couple of posting about algae-eating urchins in reef-type
    tanks.  I have a fish-only tank with lots of micro-algae.  I don't mind
    it on the rocks, but it's a constant chore to keep it off the front and
    side glass.  Can urchins climb the glass?  Can they put up with the
    higher nitate levels in a fish tank, or do they need ultra-pure water
    like other inverts?  How about the latter concerning turbo snails? I got
    one a year or two ago, but it died after a month or so.

    Thanks.  -- Keith

-- 
    | (614) 860-3187         Copyright (C) 1992, by       AT&T, Room 3B202 |
    | att!cblph!wkb  or,     W.K. Brummett and AT&T      6200 E. Broad St. |
    | wkb@cblph.att.com       All rights reserved.      Columbus, OH 43213 |
    `----------------------------------------------------------------------'
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Monday, 7 Sep 1992 23:30:06 MST
From: Bryan Schreiber <IDBXS@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
Subject: Re: Hair Algae

Thanks for the reply

I tried using snails, however after about 2-3weeks they all die. I don't
know why? The fish store owner told me that maybe my water conditions are
bad or they were eating to much. I have had my water checked and it is fine, so
I don't know what kills them. Also in Arizona saltwater snails are extremely
difficult to find.
Thanks again
          Bryan
Xref: sparky alt.aquaria:4918 sci.aquaria:1333
From: holly@sybase.com (Innocent Bystander)
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,sci.aquaria
Subject: (M) Cleaner shrimp question
Date: 4 Sep 92 14:55:06 GMT
Reply-To: holly@sybase.com (Innocent Bystander)
Distribution: na
Organization: Sybase, Inc.




Hi y'all.
	To everyone who suggested that cleaner shrimp are community critters,
congratulations and thanks.  I took your advice and got a second shrimp.  
The original shrimp is now preggers (within a week... talk about bunnies!).
Is there any chance that the eggs will hatch, and if they do, that they 
can be raised to shrimp-hood?  I guess it's pretty normal for captive (common
true cleaner) shrimps to carry eggs, but does anyone know details about
raising the shrimplettes?  The shrimp in question is in a 55 gallon
reef, no fish, but lots of filter feeders and 3 anemones, so that probably
cuts their chances down... the filtration is a large protein skimmer
and a wet/dry, which also is no help to larvae.  If they hatch, should they be
removed to a quarantine tank without filtration?  But, then there's no reefy
food available. Argh.  What do the larvae eat...  rotifers? All suggestions,
thoughts and (of course) smart remarks are welcome... 
(i know, i know, don't count on shrimp salad anytime soon).  
Thanks!
hml
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
holly@sybase.com 			   *Who else would want this opinion?*
Soff^H^H^HophH^H^H^Hoftwea^H^H^aer Enj^H^H^HEngn^H^H^H^H, uh, Programmer
Sybase, Inc.
Xref: sparky alt.aquaria:4971 rec.aquaria:7321
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: (F) What do you feed a LOBSTER and CRAYFISH...
From: Nelson Broat <NMBCU@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Monday, 14 Sep 1992 12:21:34 EDT
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

In article <1992Sep14.140427.24257@wam.umd.edu>, faith@wam.umd.edu (Jay) says:
>
>In article <92255.214340NMBCU@CUNYVM.BITNET> Nelson Broat <NMBCU@CUNYVM.BITNET>
>writes:
>>
>>I guess they eat frozen or dried KRILL. Is there anything else they eat?
>Nelson, CrayFish are scavengers. They will eat any other dead fish.
>I used to buy feeder fish, put them in the freezer, and then thaw them out one
>at a time when I was ready to feed my CrayFish. I know...cruel way to go.

Not true. Not cruel at all. There are places which sell frozen feeders for
those who enjoy fishicles :), so don't be too hard on yourself. And I may
just try something like that if other venues don't work out. So thanks for
the suggestion.

>Jerome!

Nelson
Xref: sparky alt.aquaria:4956 rec.aquaria:7291
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
Subject: (F) What do you feed a LOBSTER and CRAYFISH...
From: Nelson Broat <NMBCU@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Friday, 11 Sep 1992 21:43:40 EDT
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

Bought two small CRAYFISH and a 3 inch light blue (neon blue it looks
like) LOBSTER.

I guess they eat frozen or dried KRILL. Is there anything else they eat?
Will they go for live brine shrimp? Also, they won't go after the fish once    I
I restock will they? I'm looking to get Angels and Discus. The tank has been
running for a while with feeder goldfish which are now gone. I just bought a
few more feeders and some plants, didn't mean to buy anything else for at least
one more week even though every test comes up 0ppm, but I just couldn't resist
that cute looking LOBSTER.

The tank is 65g.

Any tips on how to help these three thrive and survive? I've never tried this
before. Always fun to experiment though.

Any and all help is appreciated. Thanks.

                                                         Nelson Broat

                                         On Bitnet: nmbcu@cunyvm
                                         On Internet: nmbcu@cunyvm.cuny.edu
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
From: rg@atoll.cray.com (Rich Garrett)
Subject: Re: RO water
Reply-To: rg@atoll.cray.com (Rich Garrett)
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 14:44:02 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-12483]: atoll.navo.navy.mil

in art 2990 hort@ui2.ems.cdc.com (Mark Hortman) says
>I am building a house and am going to install a system of automatic water
>changing.  The only problem is how do I put it in with an 25 GPD RO unit.
>I was thinking about letting the RO unit fill up a rubber trash can with
>the water, and then pumping that water to my tank.  Does anyone know if that
>water in the trash can will go bad, and if so, how do I keep it fresher?

This is exactly what I did. I built an automatic cutoff switch for
my RO filter.  I used a modified boat bilge pump switch and a lawn sprinkler
electric valve to cut off water to the RO when the holding tank got full.
This prevents overflow, and also lots of waste water down the drain.

Neither I or my apisto's ever had any problems with the water quality in the holding tank.  
I suppose you could get algae, but my fish room is kinda dark.  I used the
water daily for coffee, and had no problems.


rich garrett
rg@atoll.navo.navy.mil
Xref: sparky alt.aquaria:4933 rec.aquaria:7208
From: hort@ui2.ems.cdc.com (Mark Hortman)
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: [M][R] Reef tanks and removing micro algae (from the glass)
Date: 9 Sep 92 13:50:15 GMT
Followup-To: alt.aquaria
Organization: Empros Systems International, a division of Control Data

I have found a great way of scraping algea!!! It deosn't work around
the rocks or corners but it is great.  I use an ice scraper from my
car, you can find them flat and about three inches.  Seem to take algea
off very effertlessly!

Mark Hortman

In article <tom.716005514@dynamo.ecn.purdue.edu> tom@dynamo.ecn.purdue.edu (Tom McCain) writes:
>
>Does anyone have any good techniques for keeping the micro algae off
>of the glass where pieces of rock come close to the glass.  Algae
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
From: romanr@bcarhed.bnr.ca (Roman Romaniuk)
Subject: Re: Basement filtration
Organization: Bell Northern Research Ltd.
Date: 10 Sep 92 13:24:47

In article <1992Sep9.190815.28320@uwm.edu> drallen@convex.csd.uwm.edu (Derek R Allen) writes:

>    The question, of course, is does the 350 have enough power
>to lift water the 10' or so that would be necessary from the basement?

The height shouldn't matter, because the actual 'head' height of the
water will be pretty much zero. The only actual 'height' that the
350 will 'see' is the difference between the height of the actual
inlet and outlet (which typically isn't more than a few inches). The
fact that the water has to go 'up' 10 feet is negated by the fact that
it has gone 'down' 10 feet and the system is closed. If the canister
was open to the atmosphere then all bets are off.

I'd recommend getting the double disconnect valves for the magnum.
The canister will be pressurized when you disconnect it and you may
end up squirting some water around. The doubles make it very easy to
close off both ends and then cart the canister to a sink and open the
values up there. No muss, no fuss.

A more important question would be can the 350 stand up to 10' of water? The
one I've got at home has a simple O-ring seal around the top. It works
well in my case (~5 feet) but I don't know if it will stand up to 10.

I'd be interested in finding out how well it works it you do try it.
I'd like to set up something like this myself.

Regards,

Roman

--
Roman Romaniuk        DMS Test Tools Design         Email: romanr@bnr.ca
Bell Northern Research Ltd.                         Phone: (613)763-9678
MS 269, PO Box 3511, Station C, Ottawa, ON K1S 4H7  Fax:   (613)765-4018 
BNR may or may not share my opinions.               ESN:        393-9678
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
From: crusso@cs.ulowell.edu (Christopher Russo)
Subject: Re: (Ammonia removal re-charge)
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 16:05:14 GMT

Just a quick note from my own experience on Ammonia.

Ammonia is consumed by a bacteria (name slips my mind).  The more ammonia
that is present, the more there is to eat, so this bacteria multiplies.

If there are ever more bacteria than needed by the present bacteria, some
of the bacteria dies.  This is similar to the deer/food/population theory.

SO... the point is that once your tank has been fully established, as long
as you do not overfeed, you do your water changes and you do not introduce
too many new creatures at any one given time you should not need any further
ammonia removers.

If you really DO feel you need one, I would very much like to know why,
because you may be doing something interesting that I am not aware of.

-- 
                                              Christopher M. Russo
                                              Customer Relations
                                              Triumph Software
			
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
From: howardr@col.hp.com (Howard Rebel)
Subject: Goldfish water quality was (Re: Ammonia removal re-charge)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 16:31:09 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division

In article <1992Sep15.062820.1193@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> thester@nyx.cs.du.edu (Uncle Fester) writes:
> stuff about recharging removed
>Goldfish are a very good reason for Ammo-chips.
>I have to keep two power filters in my 20 gal high, with just 4 goldfish.
>One power filter has the normal carbon/floss cartridge.  The other has a
>filter cartridge _and_ about 1/2 cup of ammo-chips.  I also have UGF with
>a powerhead.  If I did not use the ammonia removing resin, I would
>probably have to change the water more than once a week as I still have to
>now.  And no, I am not overfeeding either. 

You may not be overfeeding but something is very wrong.  You should not
be having this type of problem.  

What size and type of goldfish (length from nose to base of tail)?
Did this tank ever cycle?  
Is the UGF filled with decomposing waste? (how often and how do you clean it)
Why do you have to change the water: Cloudy, Ammonia, Nitrites?
What are the ammonia and nitrite levels after a week?
What, how much, and how often do you feed?
Is there a youngster dumping food into the tank?

You tanks filtration is not well suited to Goldfish but could be made to
work as is if properly maintained.  I would make a few changes if it
were mine.

First toss out that UGF or convert it to a reverse flow UGF with a very
good filter on the input to the UGF.  At any rate
unless these are large fish (in which case the tank is too small) you do
not need it anyway.  You are better off without gravel on the bottom of
the tank but if you require it then it must be vacuumed at least once a
week.  Two power filter pads with floss (and possibly carbon) should be 
sufficient  to filter this tank.  The pads should be rinsed in water 
from the tank once a week and returned to service.  Water changes would
be about 25% per week over and above evaporation losses.
-- 
Howard Rebel hpcsos.col.hp.com 

Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
From: robin@fisher.bio.uci.edu (Robin Bush)
Subject: Re: Rare & exotic plecos
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
Reply-To: robin@fisher.bio.uci.edu
Date: 13 Sep 92 16:17:19 GMT

In article <1992Sep9.010153.12695@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu>  writes:
> I just bought a magazine that had an article about rare and exotic  
plecos. (deleted stuff)
> 
 Are there any special conditions I'd need to know about to make these  
plecos ultra happy and healthy?
> (ie: DH, pH, dissolved O2 levels, etc...etc...)
>  
> advTHANKSance,
> --Dennis
>   ^^^^^^new pleco freak


We just got a fancy pleco  (sorry - not only do I not know it's Latin  
name, and I forgot what they called it at the store).  It is a pretty  
reddish brown with black dots.  They also had what they called a zebra  
pleco, black and white stripes, but it was $60 so we went with the cheap  
one.  

This little guy has done a wonderful job on our algae-infested 10-gallon  
that we keep in the fireplace. It just has a couple of leopard danios and  
some plants.  The danios harassed the pleco for a couple of days, but  
apparently have gotten bored with that. Everything is crystal clear now.

The visual effect of this tank glowing from behind glass fireplace doors  
is really quite beautiful, especially at night. It lends a weird and new  
dimension to the room.  If you have got a fireplace you don't use, I'd  
recommend it.  

----------------------------------------------------------
Robin	
Organization: Graduate School of Industrial Administr., Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 08:49:20 -0400 
From: Christian David Lehr <cl2s+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: [F] Frogs


Is there anyone out there in netland who knows anything about frogs?  My
brother was given two frogs about a year ago, and has kept them in a 10g
tank.  The tank wasn't heated, and he only had an undergravel filter
running.
The frogs are a dark green on top, with a greenish-yellow belly.  One is
approx. 5 1/2" (mouth to foot), and the other is about 3".  I don't know
what they are at all, but I was told that they could be African frogs. 
I'm asking because I want to move them into my 55g tank, and I don't
want to kill them.
If there is anyone who could tell me what they are, or a better idea of
what they are, I would appreciate it.  Also, I would like to know what
other fish I could keep in the tank with them, and what temperature they
would be best suited for.  Thanks in advance.

Chris Lehr  cl2s@andrew.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
From: hellmann@cs.scarolina.edu (Douglas R Hellmann)
Subject: Re: Whisper 1 Power Filter
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:02:01 GMT

<BDH113@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:

>Hi. I just hooked up a Whisper 1 power filter to my 20gal high tank. After read
>ing how I should have gotten something else, I was wondering about the bio-filt
>ration as it pertains to fresh water. Why not just cut a chunk of the old filte
>r bag material off, and stuff it into the new one, thus retaining some of the b
>acteria in the process?

Sounds like it would work to me! All I can say is, wait until the filter pad gets 
gross enough that you need to change it, then decide whether you want to
handle it a lot! :-)

Doug Hellmann
hellmann@cs.scarolina.edu

Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
From: kevins@eng.auburn.edu (Kevin Sullivan)
Subject: Re: (M) Urchins in fish-only tanks?
Keywords: urchins
Organization: Auburn University Engineering
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 17:09:06 GMT

I had an urchin in my reef tank for a while but when he cleared all 
the zooanthids off a prized piece of rock, out he went.  I didn't 
"flush" him, but put him into my quarentine tank to keep the filter 
going.

In summary, *some* urchins may do *some* types of damage in a reef tank.
From: bclarke@coco.Rational.COM (Bruce Clarke)
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
Subject: Re: Hair Algae
Date: 8 Sep 92 20:37:47 GMT
Organization: Rational

Be a bit careful with urchins to solve this problem.  I put a "pencil" urchin
in my 20G semi-reef tank to take care of this problem.  Not only did it
eat all the hair algae, it also was constantly knocking live-rock down
which was somewhat precariously balanced, ate all the interesting little
rock anemones and duster worms which populated the live-rock, and attacked
my Hawaiian Featherduster.  This last relegated it to the main "fish"
tank where it continues to thrive on other algaes.

So just be forewarned that urchins can sometimes do more than you bargain
for if you get them for algae control.

--
Bruce Clarke			| Director - Ada Customer Support
Email: bclarke@rational.com	| Rational
Phone: 408-496-3898		| Santa Clara, CA  95054-3197
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria
From: lee@coredump.npac.syr.edu (Lee C Brink)
Subject: Re: CRAYIFSH
In-reply-to: bovine@engin.umich.edu's message of Thu, 10 Sep 92 15:17:12 EDT
Organization: Northeast Parallel Architectures Center (NPAC)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 07:45:19 EDT

In article <+Vr-JxB@engin.umich.edu> bovine@engin.umich.edu (Mitchell Rohde) writes:



     I have been keeping lab crayfish for a while.. Cambarus Clarkii...
     I was wondering, what do people typically feed crayfish?
     I have been feeding them goldfish and lentils, with mixed success...
      any further food suggestions appreciatewd...

  I feed mine TabiMin.  Between that, and the scraps of food (Frozen & flake)
that hit the bottom, they seem to do fine.
  Now if I can just train them to stop eating the sponge filter.

      Lee

--
+---------------------------+----------------------------------------------+
| Lee C Brink	            | Office Support Co-ordinator at NPAC	   |
| lee@nova.npac.syr.edu     | Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 |
|			    | 315-443-1722				   |
+---------------------------+----------------------------------------------+
Xref: sparky alt.aquaria:4939 rec.aquaria:7218
From: steve@celia.UUCP (Steve Tyree)
Newsgroups: alt.aquaria,rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: [M] Feeding a flame angel
Date: 9 Sep 92 17:24:06 GMT
Reply-To: celia!steve@usc.edu (Steve Tyree)
Organization: Rhythm & Hues, Inc., Hollywood

In article <1992Sep09.131354.29612@bnr.ca> brunner@crchh447.bnr.ca (James Brunner) writes:
>Two days ago, I bought a small (2 inch) flame angel.  He is swimming actively
>and looks healthy.  However, he hasn't ate anything yet.  I've tried mantis
>shrimp which the fish store recommended and the angel just looked at it.  I've
>tried marine flake food which I had handy.  And I've just put in some romaine
>lettuce - the fish doesn't even look at it.

 By mantis shrimp do you mean, brine shrimp ? Try purchasing some live brine
shrimp. Does the flame mouth the shrimp and then spit it out ? They can be
very picky with live foods. The brine should be in real good shape. Flames
are mainly omnivores (meat eaters) however they do eat spirulina flakes and
also nip at hair algae. Did you ask to see if the fish was feeding before
purchasing ?

 Steve Tyree - Reef Breeder