From: Bill.Carlson@p0.f18.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Bill Carlson)
Newsgroups: alt.messianic
Subject: Were It Not For The Veil . . .
Date: 25 Jan 93 18:14:02 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/18.0 - Midrash, Denver CO

To: kjh@pollux.usc.edu

 KJH> Date: 22 Jan 93 18:21:32 GMT
 KJH> Organization: EE-Systems, USC, Los Angeles
 KJH> Message-ID: <1jpdvcINNjp0@pollux.usc.edu>
 KJH> Newsgroups: alt.messianic
 KJH> 
 KJH> In article <142034.2B5F54C8@paranet.FIDONET.ORG>
 KJH> Bill.Carlson@p0.f18.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Bill Carlson) writes: >    
 KJH> Second, of course Rabbinic Jews ARE CAPABLE of "seeing and/or >    
 KJH> understanding the truth"!  Think about it a second..., most/many>
 KJH> of the Messianic Jews on here were "Rabbinic" Jews before >    
 KJH> becoming Messianic :-) 
 KJH> Rabbinic Jews are not capable of seeing the truth, *until* HaShem
 KJH> removes the veil from their eyes--*until* HaShem calls them and
 KJH> draws them to Himself--*until* HaShem takes away their heart of
 KJH> stone and gives them a heart of flesh--*until* HaShem circumcizes
 KJH> their heart--*until* HaShem breathes spiritual life into those
 KJH> who are spiritually dead.  After HaShem does this, *then* they
 KJH> see and repent and believe.

Of course, now you clarified it.  The statement in the article I
responded to, was not clarified.  It could have been taken as <-(and
note I said "could" - I recognise that this is not what you were
suggesting), that like some "false-Christians" have been quoted as
saying: ...Jews are Christ-killers, and incapable of belief, being
saved, seeing the truth, ect...[SIC -(and I do mean SIC!)]  Also,
that must have been the way that you were taken (somewhat) by the
person who replied to you, as he stated -> then why are you bothering
to talk to me?!  Plus, the statement itself (when UNqualified) sounds
as bad as if you had been saying: ...all Mexicans are not capable of
seeing or understanding the truth!  See how that sounds?  Also, you
might then say, well..., it was qualified it by saying: "Rabbinic".
But then, most Jews by default are "Rabbinic", as even most Mexicans
are born into Catholic families.  So..., let's try your statement
adding that to it:  ...all Catholic Mexicans are not capable of seeing
or understanding the truth.   NOPE!  Still doesn't work.  The reason I
answered the person, (who obviously was having as much difficulty
knowing what you were saying), was to avoid confusion on his part - and
so you putting up (unknowing on your part) a statement that could
become yet a further stumbling-block to his perception of what "we"
were saying.

Of course, according to Scripture, (if you'll permit me a targum/
paraphrase on the Prophets of Tanakh): Scripture has concluded all
under sin: that those who see become not seeing; and this that those
who see not, might become seeing - and then in turn the seeing have
mercy on those who see not! [of course, Sha'ul/Paul puts that better
than I do].  BUT... NO ONE, Jew, Mexican, Iraqi whatever, can come to a
knowledge of the Truth, without the Ruach HaKodesh - The Spirit of
Truth.

What saddens me however, is that though I tried to clear up one persons
misunderstanding; you rather choose to accuse...

 KJH> Scripture references available upon request.  Or maybe you don't
 KJH> believe the plain language of HaShem in His word?

... 012 Am Israel Chai! 210  
--  
Bill Carlson - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Bill.Carlson@p0.f18.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
Xref: sparky alt.messianic:4144 talk.religion.misc:27487