HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (jerry cullingford)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Sexual Politics and Diane Duane (was re Diane Duane, _D into Fire_)
Keywords: viewpoint
Date: 12 Oct 92 12:53:03 GMT
Organization: Crosfield Electronics, Hemel Hempstead, United Kingdom.

[Minor spoilers for "The Door Into Fire" ahead..]

In article <9OCT199218414808@elroy.uh.edu> st1rk@elroy.uh.edu (Maxwell, Darin) writes:
>In article <15583@suns7.crosfield.co.uk>, jc@crosfield.co.uk (jerry cullingford)
>writes...
>>(Or, more significantly perhaps, the feeling that the storyline wouldn't have
>>been much changed without that part of the background).

>It is important to the storyline though. It gives the reason for Herewiss
>to save Freelorn at the beginning, and the reason why they stay together.
>I do agree that Duane was less developed as a writer when she wrote this,
>and you can tell it especially in how she deals with the concept of same-
>sex lovers. But I think it is important enough that it is an integral part
>of the background.

Suppose Herewiss and Freelorn had just been very close friends instead of
lovers? That wouldn't have changed the _plot_ of TDIF all that much..
Although it would probably have changed the _feel_ significantly....

>As a matter of absolute fact, the books by Duane were given to me by my 
>very good friend with one hand and he was taking the Last Herald mage series
>from me with the other hand. I like Lackey's books much more than Duane's,
>but that may be because I lived with them more. I waited for books to appear.

I know the feeling.. I'm still waiting for the second Magewinds book to arrive
over here :-) OTOH, I wasn't too upset by the several years it took between
the first and second "door" books.. The acid test is that I'd probably buy
Misty's books in hardback and wait for the paperbacks of Duane's.. (Books,
especially hardbacks, are very expensive over here compared to the US).

>My friend,BTW, was very surprised to discover a third ["door"] book exists
>and is chomping at the bit to get it(he works at Waldenbooks and usually
>knows this sort of thing before I do).

Very unusual - I got it in paperback some [months?]time ago in the UK;
normally they appear in the states much earlier than the UK.



-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------+     |
| Jerry Cullingford  #include <std.disclaimer> +44 442 230000 x3868|   ,-|--
| jc@crosfield.co.uk (jc@cel.uucp) or jc@selune.demon.co.uk        |   \_|__
+-----(Work)---------------------------------(home)----------------+ \___/
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: jfreund@mindvox.phantom.com (Jim Freund)
Subject: Re: Heinlein reference in Sturgeons "The Golden Helix"
Organization: [Phantom Access] / the MindVox system
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 01:36:54 GMT

ca572@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark L. Stackpole) writes:

> 
> Mike Norman writes:
> 	>Arson MacDonald WAS one of R.A.H.'s pseudonums...the 
> 	>editorial staff found out and asked him not to do this
> 	>anymore...
> Actually, John W Campbell was more than happy to get his hands on
> as much fiction Heinlein was able to produce: he needed a steady
> source to fill his magazine every month.
> The reason Campbell published some of Heinlien's fiction under
> the name Arson MacDonald was that everything under the Heinlein
> byline was part of the "Future History" series. 
> This wasn't a secret. I think Campbell said as much when he
> printed in Astounding Heinlein's Future History timeline/chart.

A couple of points:

The pseudonym was Anson McDonald, not Arson.  His proper name was Robert
Anson Heinlein.

Second, the name Anson McDonald was used more in Astounding for
non-fiction than anything else.  It's not only true that Campbell not only
allowed its use, but in fact he usually created the pseudonyms.  The
economics of the pulp era dictated the need for this -- Campbell had a
standard stable of writers, and often had to resort to using a writer
several times in one issue.  If a writer had 2 stories and a book review
in one issue, then he would be assigned three names.  Campbell didn't have
permission from too many writers to do this, so he depended on his stable
to let him do this.  Often enough he created the names himself (such as
Rene Lafayette for L. Ron Hubbard, or Don Stuart for himself).

Occasionally the writer would begin to use the name in other markets --
Heinlein had at least one screenplay (I don't recall which) as Anson
McDonald.

--                                                               --
                     WBAI -- 99.5 FM  /  ZiffNet
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Zelazny (was Re: _Lord of Light_)
Date: 9 Oct 92 12:22:01 GMT
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com

In article <1992Oct8.203012.11185@pbhyc.PacBell.COM>  
djdaneh@pbhyc.PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes) writes:
> In article <199210081709.AA04225@aerospace.aero.org>  
obrien@AERO.ORG writes:
> 
> >Certainly _Lord of Light_ was both a Hugo and a Nebula winner the  
year
> >it appeared (I'm certain of the Hugo, less certain of the Nebula).   
As
> >I recall there was pretty stiff competition that year, too.
> 
> Yep. . . DUNE, which won both Hugo and Nebula. LoL tied for won,  
seconded the
> other.

Lord of Light didn't tie for the Hugo. It won flat out.  
It was This Immortal (Call Me Conrad) that tied for the Hugo.

> 
> >I, too, have been disappointed in Zelazny's more recent output.   
He does
> >still occasionally pull off flashes, such as "27 Views of Mt.  
Fuji...",
> >but the days of _Lord of Light_ seem to be just about over.  Too  
bad.
> 
> The solution is simple:  don't bother with Zelazny's novels any  
more.  His
> short stories are generally as good as ever.
> 

True.  I sometimes think he's writing all that tripe so
he can afford to keep writing good short stories.  On the
other hand, every now and then he writes a novel that at
least TRIES to rise above the level of the Amber stuff. He
just doesn't succeed as well as he did in the late sixties and
early seventies.


--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.books
From: jean@noao.edu (Jean Nowakowski)
Subject: BOOK SEARCH
Followup-To: poster
Keywords: search
Organization: National Optical Astronomy Observatories, Tucson, AZ, USA
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1992 03:33:01 GMT



Hi, folks!

I am looking for a book now out of print. It is _Drink Down
The Moon_, by Charles DeLint, the (supposed) sequel to _Jack
The Giant Killer_.

Rumor has it a friend of a friend of a friend in LA has it, so
I think it was actually on the market sometime during the last
two years. I never saw it on the shelves, and I've looked
everywhere.

If you have it, and wouldn't be averse to selling it, drop me
an e-note.

Thanks,

jean
From: jpesonen@viikki.Helsinki.FI (JORMA JUHANI PESONEN (EKT))
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Author/Name of this story...
Summary: All the time in the world???
Date: 15 Oct 92 10:51:40 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki, Fac.Agric.For.


I recently remembered this story which I have read about three to five years 
ago. I remember that it was written around 1950-1970 and the author was 
American.
The Story: A art thief meets a man with a job: to gather all the most 
valuable art pieces to the man (or was it only one piece?!). The man tells 
that he is from the future of another race, and gives the thief a device, 
which slows the time to other people. So the thief can act freely, as no-one 
can see him.
At the end all is revealed: the scientists have experimented with a bomb (M-
bomb or smthng like that) and the explosion will destroy the world. Thh 
thief is left to the scene with all the time in the world (as I remember the 
name of the story to be...)
So if this rings any bells, please help...;-)

	Jozma	:-)

    JPESONEN@viikki.helsinki.fi  ///
                                ///   "Is all that we see or seem,
    There are realities        ///     But a Dream within a Dream?"
    Within realities, but     ///      Edgar Allan Poe
                     THERE ARE NO ABSOLUTES
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: mycroft@dorsai.com (Keith Kushner)
Subject: Re: Heinlein reference in Sturgeons "The Golden Helix"
Organization: The Dorsai Embassy +1.718.729.5018
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 17:36:59 GMT

rorschak@daimi.aau.dk (Jesper Lauridsen) writes:
:   Some 22 pages into the short story "The Golden Helix" by
: Theodore Sturgeon I read the following lines: 
: 
:   "Then an old, old tale tale flashed into his mind, an early thing
: from the ancient Amerenglish, by Hynlen (Henlyne, was it? no matter)
: about a man who tried to convey to humanity a description of the
: superbeings who had captured him, with only his body as a tablet and
: his nails as a stylus. Perhaps he was mad at the time he finished, 
: but his message was clear at least to him: 'Creation took eight 
: days'. ".
: 
:   This clearly a Heinlein reference but where is it from?
:  
: -- 
"Goldfish Bowl"- Astounding SF March '42.


Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.movies
From: daves@techmpc.csg.mot.com (Dave Schmitt)
Subject: Re: Next Eddings's Ellenium novel is out in U.K.
Organization: Motorola Cellular Subscriber Group MIS
Distribution: rec
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 09:46:56 GMT

In article <digdug.719089127@vincent2.iastate.edu> digdug@iastate.edu (Doug V Tran) writes:
>BTW: has Edding released any follow up books to the "Ellenium" yet?

I was in Scotland this past week and the next Ellenium book is out.  I don't
remember the title, but it was set in the Tamul (Tamuli?) empire, with
the mighty Sparhawk called on for help when supernatural forces threaten.

(I would have bought it, but with exchange rates it worked out to US$ 30
for the hardcover, so I can wait).

I also noticed that book five of the Douglas Adam's Hitchiker Trilogy is out.
-- 
David Schmitt, Database/Systems Administrator	Voice: (708)632-5562
Cellular Subscriber Group MIS			FAX:   (708)632-4421
Motorola, Inc., Room S356			Email: daves@csg.mot.com
1475 W. Shure Dr., Arlington Hts, IL 60004	
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: dstein@gayley.math.ucla.edu (David Stein)
Subject: Re: Ian McDonald's _The Broken Land_: review
Reply-To: dstein@gayley.math.ucla.edu (David Stein)
Organization: UCLA Mathematics Department
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 06:30:52 GMT

In article <1bf15mINNaii@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>,
ca572@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark L. Stackpole) writes:
|> 
|> Don't flame me before I'm finished, but I found McDonald's
|> "Fragments of an Analysis of a Case of Hysteria" very moving...BUT
|> it was moving not by any quality of the writing or story but 
|> because is was about the Holocaust. 
|> 	The best way I can describe it is to point out the movie
|> "Testimony" as a similar case. That biopic of Shostokovich was
|> emotionally powerful because during the last reel footage was
|> shown of Concentration camp victims and bodies being bulldozed.
|> The picture was moving because that footage by itself was moving
|> and "Testimony" expropriated that emotion - without it, the movie
|> was negligible.
|> 	The same way with "Fragments...". Invoking an ethnic group
|> irrationally persecuted, rounded up, thrown by the hundreds into
|> a box car to be executed at a death camp masqurading as a relocation
|> center makes the mind sick just to consider such inhumanity. 
|> McDonald in his story just says "remember the Holocaust" every
|> page and uses the emotions and memories brought up in the reader
|> to carry his bad writing along.
|> 	I was angry at the end because McDonald stole emotions and
|> used a horrific event for cheap imact. He used the Holocaust the
|> same way a TV show uses an exploding car: a quick thrill.

   Fortunately, McDonald's writing already seemed so disconnected from
   reality by the time it became clear that the Holocaust is here only 
   as a prop, that I had no sympathy left for the story.  So I was not 
   angry in the end, only sad.

   But the missuse of the Holocaust topic is hardly my only objection
   to this story.  "Ubermensch!" by Kim Newman gave a questionable treatment
   to the Holocaust as well, but the story was nowhere as badly written as
   McDonald's.

 - David

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I'm not a native speaker of English, so I'm not sure what I wrote.
Flames will be ignored unless you post them in perfect Czech.
================================ - David (the metamathician) - ===
From: riawelch@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Mad City Blues)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Heinlein reference in Sturgeons "The Golden Helix"
Date: 7 Oct 92 19:13:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1av5jjINNlpd@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, ca572@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark L. Stackpole) writes...
> 
>Mike Norman writes:
>	>Arson MacDonald WAS one of R.A.H.'s pseudonums...the 
>	>editorial staff found out and asked him not to do this
>	>anymore...
>Actually, John W Campbell was more than happy to get his hands on
>as much fiction Heinlein was able to produce: he needed a steady
>source to fill his magazine every month.

In Grumbles from the Grave, there is an interesting letter from Heinlein to
Campbell dated September 6, 1941.  Heinlein offers to sell his future work at
the rate of one cent a word under the name "Lyle Monroe," one and a quarter
cent a word under the name "Caleb Saunders," and one and a half cents a word
under the "Robert Heinlein" and "Anson McDonald" names.  

"Lyle Monroe" was a name Heinlein used to sell stories he considered sub-par to
editors he didn't particularly like.  Campbell never published any Monroe
stories and only one Saunders story ("Elsewhen"), according to the bibliography
in the back of Grumbles.

Heinlein also used the pseudonyms "John Riverside" for the Unpleasant Profession
of Jonathon Hoag, and "Simon York" for a mystery story he published in 1947.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin W. Welch  riawelch@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu   

Some other places were not so good but maybe we were not so good when
we were in them.--Ernest Hemingway
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: ecl@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Evelyn C. Leeper)
Subject: Re: The Year's Best SCIENCE FICTION
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 12:28:12 GMT
Keywords: Dozoi's 9th collection

In article <73196@apple.Apple.COM> chuq@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
> dstein@oak.math.ucla.edu (David Stein) writes:
> 
> >  The Gallery of his Dreams
> >  Kristine Kathryn Rusch
> >  I- E- W- C-
> 
> >    Technically science-fiction,
> 
> Like I noted, not a big alternate history buff...

Of course, this isn't alternate history.  It's time travel.

Evelyn C. Leeper  |  +1 908 957 2070  |  att!mtgzy!ecl or  ecl@mtgzy.att.com
--
"God does not play dice with the universe."  --Alfred Einstein
"Not only does God play dice with the universe, but sometimes
        He throws them where they cannot be seen."  --Stephen Hawking
From: sej5g@curry.edschool.Virginia.EDU (Susie Juroff)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Prince of Chaos the conclusion??
Date: 16 Oct 92 03:53:54 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia

He's only saying he'll write another 'cos he knows he'll get
lynched if he swears off now. Ohpleaseohpleaseohplease...just
one more! Someone recommeded the series to me around 1989 or
'90, so I picked up Nine Princes and got addicted, thinking it
was a finished series. Did the remaining 7 books in 2 days, was down to
the last 2 pages thinking "I don't think this is leading up to
a conclusion... " Had to learn to wait a few years... I hate
waiting. So many questions are still unanswered!Idon't
care if he doesn't write another book, just as long as he
answers my damn questions. And anyway, one book isn't enough to
wrap up Merlin's kingship and the spikard and what happened to
Frakir? Is she gone, dead or disabled? Is he being controlled?
Are we going to get stuck with Happily Ever After? And did you
ever think that maybe the Roger Zelazny who writes Amber is a
completely different person than the other one? The styles &
concepts - so different!
--
From: WRT@CORNELLC.CIT.CORNELL.EDU (Bill Turner - Cornell University Library)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Wild Cards #11
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:17:21 GMT

I just read WildCards #11 (Dealer's Choice), and enjoyed it.

I was a bit surprised to find how much I DID enjoy it. As with other
posters, my enthusiasm for the series had waned. I particularly disliked
that the evil aces/jokers were always stronger than the good ones, so
anyone I liked tended to die rather quickly. I found #10 quite boring, and
might not have read #11 had I not forgotten about having the series on
standing order.

Yes, many of the characters I'd like to read more about have moved offstage
for some reason, but one of the best - the Turtle - has a major role in this
book. And for once, the characters seem to make some real progress!

Over the series, the charge of perversity is justified, I'm afraid, but
not in this particular book.
From: ajl@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Lewis AJ)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Roger Zelazny & Prince of Chaos
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:32:40 GMT

Does anyone have any idea of just when this book is coming out in the
UK? (Or is it out already & I just can't find it?)

Cheers,

Andy
-- 
Andy Lewis  (ajl@ecs.soton.ac.uk)
Department of Electronics and Computer Science
University of Southampton
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:13648 rec.arts.books:18178
From: tarl@sw.stratus.com (Tarl Neustaedter)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Ian McDonald's _The Broken Land_: review
Date: 12 Oct 92 11:44:19 GMT
Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.written
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <1992Oct01.081600.22174@sco.COM>, charless@sco.COM (AutoPope) writes:
> Before you
> can understand The Broken Lands (published in the UK as Hearts,
> Hands and Voices) you need to surrender to it. Like life itself,
> it's plotless but full of feeling.

I'm reminded of a friend who insisted I read Dahlgren. After doing so,
I expressed my frustration at not having found anything between the
covers. He convinced me I had missed something, so I went back and
re-read it. I don't think he has stopped laughing since.

Thanks for the warning.
-- 
         Tarl Neustaedter	tarl@sw.stratus.com
         Marlboro, Mass.	Stratus Computer
Disclaimer: My employer is not responsible for my opinions.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: doug@cdc.hp.com (Doug Sojourner)
Subject: Re: CJ Cherryh
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 20:54:59 GMT
Reply-To: dsojourner@cdc.hp.com
Organization: HP California Design Center, Santa Clara, CA
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

slp66@cc.usu.edu wrote:
: 
: Cherryh has a really good plot in all these books.  I just wish she'd quit
: writing her hard fantasy stuff.
: 
Well, I'm one of the people who keeps buying it (and thus encouraging
her in her "vice").  I find I like most everything she's written.


Doug Sojourner
dsojourner@cdc.hp.com
From: jim@rand.org (Jim Gillogly)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: "A Fire Upon The Deep" by Vernor Vinge
Date: 14 Oct 92 00:56:58 GMT
Organization: Banzai Institute

In article <1992Oct13.181911.19455@infodev.cam.ac.uk> gdr11@cl.cam.ac.uk (G.D. Rees) writes:
>The evidence is pretty convincing:  Vinge reads Usenet.  But does he
>contribute?  Perhaps more knowledgable posters than myself can answer
>this question.

Yes, his galaxy-wide expansion of Usenet was devastatingly recognizable:
the newbies were captured perfectly, the very occasional almost-perfectly-
accurate Boyajian-types, and the mass of self-serving or wrong-headed
idiots... you know who they are.  Still, both here and in AFUTD it's
possible for a discerning reader to find Truth... or enough of it to work
with.

Yes, he has contributed in the past to comp.unix.wizards and comp.lang.c++,
enough to demonstrate that he knew what he was talking about.  I haven't
seen him on the net in the last 3 years, though, but then I haven't been
watching those groups carefully.

-- 
	Jim Gillogly
	jim@rand.org
From: curtis@cs.berkeley.edu (Curtis Yarvin)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: a random quote to brighten your day
Date: 7 Oct 1992 22:21:29 GMT
Organization: UC Berkeley CS Dept.
NNTP-Posting-Host: snake.cs.berkeley.edu

The graduate Peon Lab here has a small, and mostly
execrable, library of SF; today, bored, I picked
up a book and opened it to a random page.

The first sentence I saw was as follows:

'"Yes,  but - no - wait!" for Alyx sprung to her feet
and fetched from his stool the pillow on which he
had been sitting, the purpose of which he did not
at first seem to comprehend, but then his eyes went
wide with horror, for she had got the pillow in order
to smother him, and that is just what she did.'

Can anyone guess the author?

The answer will be posted tomorrow.

c
From: nroworth@nl.oracle.com (Nick Roworth)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Canticle for Leibowitz by Walter Miller
Date: 15 Oct 92 10:29:13 GMT
Organization: Oracle Europe

In article <1992Oct14.081105.12702@bnr.uk>, agc@bmdhh286.bnr.ca (Alan Carter) writes:
|> 
|> Last summer the BBC broadcast a radio adaptation of _Canticle_ on 
|> Radio 4, on Saturday afternoons.  It was quite as good as others 
|> they have done, such as _Lord Of The Rings_, _The Chrysalids_ and 
|> _Flowers For Algernon_. Very moody. Sometimes they put the productions 
|> out on tape afterwards, but I don't know about that one. Not seen it yet.

The Saturday Afternoon play I heard only did the first two parts, did they also 
do the last part?

In the late sixties they produced Asimov's Foundation (then a Trilogy) and more
recently have done a play version of 'The Caves of Steel'.

I have also heard Harry Harrison's 'Technicolour Time Machine' as a play, and
'Bill the Galactic Hero' serialised as about five 15 minute readings.

Last Christmas they also repeated 'The Hobbit'.

All the book's they adapt either as readings or plays tend to be very well done,
as are there original Series like Earthsearch I and II, Hitch Hikers Guide to the
Galaxy and Hordes of the Thing.

-- 
Nick Roworth, ORACLE Europe             "Bugs Mr. Rico! Zillions of 'em!"
Rijnzathe 6, NL-3454 PV De Meern        Starship Troopers - Robert A. Heinlein
Phone: +31-3406-94211                     
nroworth@nl.oracle.com
From: mab@buphy.bu.edu (Michael Burstein)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Isaac Asimov tributes
Date: 16 Oct 92 21:24:39 GMT
Organization: Boston University Physics Department


	The Fall 1992 issue of The Skeptical Inquirer has
 a series of tributes to Isaac Asimov, entitled "A
Celebration of Isaac Asimov: A Man for the Universe." The tributes are
by Kendrick Frazier, Arthur C. Clarke, Frederik Pohl, Harlan Ellison, L.
Sprauge de Camp, Carl Sagan, Strphen Jay Gould, Martin Gardner, Paul
Kurtz, Donald Goldsmith, James Randi, and E.C. Krupp.  It goes for 18
pages and is sprinkled with Asimov quotations. The magazine costs $6.25,
which might be a bit much for those of you only interested in the Asimov
pages, but if you want a copy you can order one by calling the magazine
at (800) 634-1610. Or write to them: The Skeptical Inquirer, Box 703,
Buffalo, NY 14226-0703, and include $6.25 for the magazine and $1.25 for
postage. 

	The issue also has an article on a movement to get Asimov's
visage put on a stamp in 2002, the earliest that it would be permitted
by law. If you are interested in pushing for such a thing, write to
Norma Arroyo, Citizens Stamp Advisory Committee, 475 L'Enfant Plaza SW,
Room 4474-3, Washington, DC 20260-6753.

-- 
Michael A. Burstein
Physics Department, Boston University         mab@buphy.bu.edu
590 Commonwealth Ave.                         (617) 353-9437 (o)
Boston, MA 02215                              (617) 735-9433 (h)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written