HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: Getting Japanese citizenship (was: finger....)
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 07:34:01 GMT

In article <1ehtv2INNl3m@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> keis@psy.uwa.oz.au (Keis Ohtsuka)
writes:
>... To my knowledge, the Japanese government has not admitted the fact that
>they were brought to Japan against their will

This is extremely regrettable, but I thought that someone uncovered Japanese
military records proving that the women were forced into prostitution.
Yes, I agree that this too should be recorded in Japanese history books
taught to school children in Japan.

>let alone the payment of compensation for their ordeals.

I disagree with this.  The compensation was given in the form of
the multi-billion dollar grant (in 1993 dollars) given to Korea in the
'60s as part of the normalization of relations.

Japan did do a proper and moral gesture in the context of its culture
and the rest of East Asian culture.  Any compensation owed the
women should be obtained from the compensatory grant given to the
S. Korean gov't.

If Northeast Asians should miraculously believe that individualism
and not groupism is the proper conduit of behavior at the time
that Japan and N. Korea normalize relations in the future, then
it's multi-billion dollar compensation should _not_ be given to
the N. Korean gov't but should be dispersed among the survivors and
children of the victims of WWII.

>[interesting comments deleted]
>Even countries that define the citizenship by a place of birth (jus solis)
>such as UK or USA do grant a citizenship derived by a blood if an applicant
>proves that he or she was born with a parent that holds the citizenship.
>If Korea defines the citizenship based on a blood line (jus sanguinus) like
>Japan or Germany do, an applicant with a Korean parent should have easier
>time than an applicant with no Korean parent. DJ's criticism of "preferential"
>treatment should be extended to all countries that define citizenship by 
>jus sanguinus, which by the way includes Japan and Germany.

No, my criticism should not be extended to the USA and Japan.  Germany, yes.
USA, no.

The children of Koreans who were themselves born in the USA and who
_never_ _once_ held Korean citizenship (are called Korean-Americans) are
given priority in becoming Korean citizens over Japanese-Americans,
Thai-Americans, etc.  That's the way in which the Korean immigration
laws are written.  Ethnicity, not prior citizenship of the parents,
is what counts.

That really is discrimination on purely racial and ethnic grounds.

------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
Jinsei no imi wa nan desu ka.                Sister, can you      |   \|  |`
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.           spare a coin?        |    | -+-
                                                                  |   /| / \
Copyright 1992.  Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3                           |
------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: andrew@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Andrew Sung Hyun Kim)
Subject: Re: Getting Japanese citizenship (was: finger....)
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 23:02:13 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.140907.25025@udel.edu> shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin) writes:
>In article <1992Nov20.073401.27656@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>Japan did do a proper and moral gesture in the context of its culture
>>and the rest of East Asian culture.  Any compensation owed the
>>women should be obtained from the compensatory grant given to the
>>S. Korean gov't.
>
>Second statement is what Japanese government says.  First statement is
>fabrication of Dwight Joe.

When the accord for compensation was arrived, the matter such as "comfort
women" was never discussed.  How could it have been, since such was only
acknowledged after incontestable facts were presented but a few years ago?
I believe the compensation talk was carried out by Kim Jong-Pil and then
Japanese prime minister in 1964.

What about the compensation for the Koreans who were brought into Japan
during the colonial period against their will?  How were they compensated
for?  If "proper and moral gesture" is denial of citizenship and
forced finger printing, then I have nothing more to say.

Andrew Kim
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: masuda@fcs280b.ncifcrf.gov (Michiaki Masuda)
Subject: Re: Who started all this gaijin myth?! (was Re: Genitals in Japan)
Organization: Frederick Cancer Research and Development Center
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 05:28:39 GMT

In article <MS-C.722493658.1103527590.mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin) writes:
.....
>     Do you know the word ``Jap'' or the word ``Nip''?  Both words are
>contractions meaning ``Japanese person''.  However, both words are ``warui
>kotoba'' in English.
          ^^^^^^^^^^
   Your argument concerning the English expressions is not necessarily able 
to be extrapolated to the Japanese language. In addition, the large difference
is that "gaijin" is not "warui kotoba."
 
>     ``Japs'' and ``Nips'' are sneaky.  They are dishonest.  They are tricky.
>They are liars.  They commit ``harry-carry'' (hara-kiri) if you defeat them.
>In spite of their sneakiness and cleverness, they are rather stupid.

   I wonder if these words had existed before the concept that Japanese are
sneaky, dishonest, etc.

>     ``Gaijin'' are big, noisy, and stupid.  They all have AIDS.  All they
>think about is sex with rather plain-looking Japanese women.  They are lazy.
>They are dirty and smell bad.  They walk on tatami in their shoes and even lay
>their wet clothes to dry on the tatami.

   The history of the word "gaijin" is definitley longer than the history of
AIDS.
   
>     We find that pretty offensive, which is why we hate to be called
>``gaijin''.

   So, how do you want us to call "gaijin"? We cannot call them "Nippon-jin",
can we? 
 
--Michiaki
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: masuda@fcs280b.ncifcrf.gov (Michiaki Masuda)
Subject: Re: Banana Republic (Re: US vs. Japan (was: Try it again - ...)
Organization: Frederick Cancer Research and Development Center
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 02:54:32 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.020416.21968@til.til.com> tanaka@til.til.com (Yokichi Tanaka) writes:
.....
>  From what I hear, the Gap was the "in" store for
>the [Japanese] tourists until about last year.  Now, I guess it's BR.

   I heard that Gap and BR are under the same management. Maybe, the 
manager knows how to attract Japanese's attention and gain popularity.

   Wouldn't it be a good idea for Ford to export "Escort - Banana Republic 
Version" with the logo and some nice picture on it? 8-)

--Michiaki
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Lawyer wanted! Immediately! 
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:54:35 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.045848.1000626@sue.cc.uregina.ca> guohsu@mercury.cs.uregina.ca (Allen Guo-Ching Hsu) writes:
>In article <SMITTIE.92Nov16115941@tui.csulb.edu> smittie@beach.csulb.edu (Smittie) writes:
>>>>                             Tada mono de ha nai
>>                                            ^
>>>Yes! You are...--->                        W
>>
>>
>>I realize that the sound here is 'wa' and not 'ha.' However, the hiranga
>>character is "ha" and I prefer to remain true to the hiragana. I just didn't
>>want you all to think it was a mistake.
>>
>>smittie
>>--
>>                             Tada mono de ha nai
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>  What you are showing here are not hiragana characters but just approximate
>  pronunciations, unless you display them in Japanese characters. You do make
>  a mistake. Besides, admit your mistake wouldn't damage your image, but may
>  make it shinny.
>  
>  Ask an educated(elementary level is more than enough) Japanese to help you.

Geez, not another war on the "proper" Romanization of Japanese. 

No, it is NOT wrong to use 'ha' instead of 'wa'. Nor is it "wrong" to do it
the other way around. Both are in (relatively) comomon usage, similar in 
general to "kanzi" or "kanji". You will see BOTH, on occasion, even in Japan.

I would assume that publishers of the books that those romanizations appeared
in have the requisite "elementary level" education.

Also, you will see 'ha' used in some introductory level Japanese language
text here in the US. As they are generally written by Japanese with PhDs, I
will have to assume that they, too, have finished their "elementary level"
education.

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - I'm only doing what the little voices tell me to do. 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Movie "Rikyu" 
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 18:15:48 GMT

In article <MS-C.721951600.1103527590.mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> Mark Crispin <mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> writes:

>After Hideyoshi died, Tokugawa Ieyasu seized absolute power in the
>wake of the battle of Sekigahara in 1600 and liquidated Hideyoshi's
>young heir a few years later.  One of Ieyasu's first acts was to
>completely withdraw from Korea.  Presently, Japan's doors were closed
>to the outside world as were Korea's.

An interesting aside: Japan and Korea maintained diplomatic ties throughout
this period. Thus Korea and the Netherlands were Japan's only contact with 
the outside world.

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - I'm only doing what the little voices tell me to do. 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan,talk.politics.guns
From: justin@nx30.mik.uky.edu (justin sullivan)
Subject: Re: Yoshi Hattori
    <1992Nov16.204716.14181@adobe.com> <BD.92Nov18133022@fluent.UUCP> 
    <1992Nov19.195755.24555@jetsun.weitek.COM>
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences
X-Path: nx30.mik.uky.edu!justin
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 04:08:32 GMT
Distribution: usa

In <1992Nov19.195755.24555@jetsun.weitek.COM> nadja@jetsun.weitek.COM (Nadja Adolf) writes:

>What makes you think there aren't Asian criminals. Ever heard of the
>Vietnamese gangs? They are sort of a problem in some places.

I have a friend who is from Saigon, who's family left when the government 
threw them out. I understand that the biggest criminals are the government,
whom NOBODY can trust.
From: shah@orange.tutee.tut.ac.jp (Q. H. Shah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
Subject: Re: I WANT TO WORK IN JAPAN : Need help
Date: 19 Nov 92 00:58:24 GMT
	<92323.080701RSAYLC@rohvm1.rohmhaas.com>
Organization: Kanto Lab., Dept. Ener. Eng., Toyohashi Univ. Tech.

Native speakers of English can teach English in Japan but it is difficult
though not impossible to find other jobs too.
It is because Japanese people can do everything perfectly in Japan other
than teaching English but some are even good at that.
Another alternative is to work as a translator which is really like
killing yourself. At least never go for it. Moreover if you speak
Japanese quite good then your chances of success diminish as an English
teacher. Because people like to associate with real GAIJINS who do not
speak Japanese at all or if they do then they do it with a distorted
pronunciation which is considered very cute. One more important thing
is to have blonde hair if not at least dyed in red ( not intended
for flaming anyone), this is the reality and before coming here one
should be sure about how he/she is going to be treated. One more
important thing for the male teachers is to avoid any out of class
contacts with girl students which could bring a disastor to their
employment. This is one of the most important aspect of Japanese
society. If you socialize with one of your girl students then other
girls will be very angry and complain to the school and you are out.
This is one thing which westerners do not understand and always get into
troubles here. 
Moreover when somebody promises you a job or makes a contract, it is not
necessary that this word of mouth will be respected. Japanese people's
mood can fluctuate according to the situation. Foreigners could be hired
and fired anytime and it is very difficult to take the cases to the courts.
So one have to be very careful as well as keep himself ready to face
something unexpected. If people wouldn't like you to keep, they will
tell you in a very indirect and polite manner, no ifs and buts do work.
Once something is wrong , forget it.
--

         Shah


         Every time I did it, I thought I wouldn't do it again.
From: kenji@rcac.astem.or.jp (Kenji Rikitake)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
Subject: Re: Who started all this gaijin myth?! (was Re: Genitals in Japan)
Date: 24 Nov 92 02:16:03 GMT
Organization: RCAC Project, ASTEM RI, Kyoto, Japan
In-reply-to: mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU's message of 23 Nov 92 08:04:27 GMT

In article <MS-C.722505867.1103527590.mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin) writes:
>   > So, how do you want us to call "gaijin"? We cannot call them "Nippon-jin",
>   >can we?

>   Answer: how about ``hito'', ``o-kyaku-san'', etc.?

Hito sounds OK, but Okyakusan sounds equally offensive as Gaijin to
me. Are all non-Japanese residents or visitors in Japan "guests"? I
guess most of them want to be treated equal as a human being. The word
Okyakusan implies something foreign, not equal.

>   You can argue all you want that there is no racist intent behind the word
>   ``gaijin''.  That argument is not valid:
>    1) you should have enough common sense to know that people do not enjoy being
>       singled out by race.
>    2) you should have enough courtesy to stop doing it after you have been told
>       that some people find it offensive.

Your argument is surely valid, but I'm not sure how many of offensive
and notorious Japanese who still intentionally or subconsciously uses
the word Gaijin will be conviced.

>   White Americans learned in the 1960's that identifying black Americans by
>   their race was offensive to blacks.  We don't say ``that negro'' or ``that
>   black'' any more.  We say ``that person''.  Japanese people need to learn the
>   same type of courtesy.

100% agreed. The word gaijin is discriminative.

// Kenji
From: mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
Subject: ore no baka (was: please no holy romanization wars)
Date: 18 Nov 92 07:33:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: Tomobiki.MS-C.722072019.1147902781.mrc
Organization: University of Washington
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Mime-Version: 1.0

Before I get flamed, yes, I know, I should have written `huzi-san'
instead of `fuzi-san' in the kunrei-shiki (first two) examples.

It does prove my other argument about mixed usage of romanization
though.  In typing in the corrections I typed `shasin' once, which
mixes kunrei-shiki and Hepburn in the same word.  However, such a
mixture would not trouble a native Japanese or an experienced student
at all.  Mixed system romanization is very common in Japan.  My
favorite are `jya', `jyu', `jyo' which are not in any system but which
can be immediately understood.

Here's the corrected form:
 1) sensei ha, huzi-san he itte, syasin wo totte imasita.
 2) sensee wa, huzi-san e itte, syasin o totte imasita.
 3) sensei ha, fuji-san he itte, shashin wo totte imashita.
 4) sensei wa, fuji-san e itte, shashin o totte imashita.

[Translation: a rather stiff way of saying ``The teacher went to Mt
 Fuji and took a photo.'']
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Fusion (was RE:  Plutonium)
Keywords: cold fusion?
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:43:59 GMT

In article <1e9nfeINNfq2@agate.berkeley.edu> jcliu@four-lab4.Berkeley.EDU (James C. Liu) writes:
>Cold fusion, if true, would more than likely through out some pretty
>fundamental theories we have on materials thermodynamics, nuclear
>physics, fusion confinement, etc.  These have been tested over and over
>and verified by countless experiments and they are consistent with our
>present knowledge of the physical world.

>I am skeptical of cold fusion because there is a huge amount of data
>which backs up our present theories about physics...remember, this is
>objective scientific data and not something like Sociology stats.  
>However, there are a host of plausible reasons why you might observe
>something like cold fusion.  The 3 I can think of right away are:
>  1) uncalibrated neutron detectors (Georgia Tech snafu)
>  2) uncertainty in calorimetric data (Stanford snafu)
>  3) tritium tainted palladium source (half of all experiments in world)

Just curious here, but what "present theories" would need to be modified to 
account for cold fusion? As I understand it, to get to suitable nuclei to fuse,
you need to get them into a certain close proximity for a certain minimum time.
For atoms, (eg, H or D) the first problem is overcoming electron-electron
repulsion. Assuming that you are operating on a catalytic surface, the 
electrons can be effectively stripped off. You are now left with nuclear 
repulsions. This can be in part masked by the metallic catalyst. The questions,
as I understand it, are then a) what is the critical minimum distance for 
fusion? b) can catalytic surfaces be sufficient to bring appropriate nuclei
to within this critical distance? After that, of course, there's a practical
question of whether or not this can be done on a larger scale, but if the 
first two, and perhaps other, questions can be answered, this is a matter of
engineering. 

So, if the problem is NOT as I describe it above, what am I missing here?

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - I'm only doing what the little voices tell me to do.
From: shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
Subject: Re: Fingerprinting Gaijin
Date: 18 Nov 92 14:05:05 GMT
Organization: University of Delaware

In article <1992Nov18.060308.27770@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>Most Koreans have made a huge issue out of fingerprinting and
>citizenship.  For years (and very loudly) they have complained and whined
>about how the Japanese gov't is discriminating against them specifically.
>That was and continues to be a lie.  Koreans who do not have Japanese
>citizenship are treated in just the same way that other foreigners have
>been treated.

Damn fucking Dwight Joe, don't dare to say those Koreans and descendents
are whining regarding treatment they receive from Japanese government/
society. As usual Dwight Joe comes with tape recorder like this, but the 
case of those Koreans and descendents and others taken to Japan in similar
circumstances is completely different than any other aliens in Japan.
god damn Dwight Joe cu lover never quits so neither do I 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: ikeda@vxcrna.cern.ch (IKEDA,M./EP)
Subject: Re: Fingerprinting Gaijin
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 16:19:00 GMT

In article <Bxw8Ip.8zr@world.std.com>, cmr@world.std.com (Charles M Richmond) writes...
> 
>	TOKYO (UPI) -- Japan's Supreme Court on Monday upheld the government's
>authority to fingerprint alien residents of Japan in a case that has
>kept an American woman living in the nation from traveling abroad for
>10n years.
>	The court rejected the appeal of Kathleen Morikawa, 42, a columnist
>who had demanded the justice ministry's decision denying her a re-entry
>permit because she refused to allow the fingerprinting be declared null
>and void.
..
>	Morikawa, a U.S. citizen, has lived in Japan since 1973. In September
>1982, she refused to allow officials to take her fingerprints in
>accordance with the Alien Registration Law.
..
>	All foreign residents over the age of 16 who stay in Japan for more
>than one year are required to have their a print taken of their left
>index finger when applying for registration certificates.
>	A new law which will take effect in January will eliminate
>fingerprinting for South Koreans, Taiwanese and other foreigners with
>permanent resident status.

Discussions on fingerprinting has gone through scj before, but I am still
a bit mystified by Ms. Morikawa (and other Americans) who think that
fingerprinting is so horrible.  In fact it seems incredibly hypocritical.
The US requires fingerprints of *permanent residents* of the US and not
only of one index finger, but of *all* fingers left and right.  And then
the silly thing is that the US requires all these fingerprints *again*
when one applies for citizenship.

I am very glad that the new law in Japan no longer requires fingerprinting
of permanent residents though.

-- Makoto
From: tobac@ub-tky.UBSPD.CO.JP (Bach Frederic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
Subject: Re: Sumo - Kyushu Basho (Day 2)
Date: 16 Nov 92 06:24:25 GMT
Organization: UBS Phillips & Drew Int'l Ltd., Tokyo

In article <1dv56rINNc95@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> keis@psy.uwa.oz.au (Keis Ohtsuka) writes:

[]   I don't appreciate calling two Ozekis, Akebono and
[]Konishiki, and one Komusubi, Musashimaru, Hawaiians.

The only reason I sometimes use Hawaiians is because there are only a limited
number of words for wrestlers, fighters, sekitori, sumotori, grapplers, etc.
The purpose is only to introduce variety. If Hoshiandesu, from Argentina makes
it to makunouchi, I will refer to him (sometimes) as the Argentinian.

Concerning the Sumo vocabulary, I publish the banzuke (ranking) before each
tournament. A regular reader of s.c.j. can always refer to it. If you wish,
I will mail a list of often used terms before next tournament. Note that 
I often give the explanation of the technical terms I use between
parentheses. Since your question was specific, here's a brief recap :

Makunouchi : Top Division

Yokozuna : Grand Champion
Ozeki : Champion
Sekiwake : Junior Champion (1st level)
Komusubi : Junior Champion (2nd level)

(You might not agree with these translations, but I have seen them used).

Juryo : Second Division

Sekitori : A wrestler in one of the top two divisions.
Other more general words : sumotori, deshi (student, pupil), O-sumo san,
but most generally used in Japanese is rikishi (~ wrestler ; lit. strong man).

Makushita : third division
Sandanme  : fourth division (third from bottom, hence 'san')
Jonidan   : fifth division  (same with 'ni')
Jonokuchi : sixth and bottom division.

Hope this helps.
-- 
    __  _    
** ||_ /_| **   Fred "I'll be" Bach               (tobac@ub-tky.UBSPD.CO.JP) 
** || /__| **   [Je suis athee, Dieu merci.]          Tel. 813-3597-1595

Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
From: pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai)
Subject: Re: Japanese exchange student killed in Louisiana...
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 06:31:13 GMT

In article <6311@pdxgate.UUCP> kelly@rigel.cs.pdx.edu (Kelly Mismash) writes:
>This guy was probably just
>a little pairnoid and probably did not have sufficent 
>training in the proper use of his gun.

Of course, that's why the police arrested him right away, because
the evidence of wrong doing was so obvious that even a person
who has never been trained in tactics can see it.

-- 
My opinions are my own.
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 13:49:25 -0500 
From: Rikiya Asano <ra01+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Germany tweaks Japan

Freinds,

            NO, no, no, and no. Ego is like a drug. The Germany ego is
tremendeous. Why should we be Mr. Bailout. And , that him! Ah! Michio
Wantanabe.
I thiought Yukio or Fumio. It's no wonder that he is weak when it comes
to the Caucasian. President Yeltsin made you look like a pompous ass.
Now, to save face 
you'll brown nose it________!  Mr. Watanabe! Please, resign! Before you
embarrass us even more.