From: schuck@fraser.sfu.ca (Bruce Jonathan Schuck)
Subject: Re: Plan S -- Quebec separation
Reply-To: Bruce_Schuck@sfu.ca
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:25:39 GMT

> (Gerry Gryschuk) writes:
>> Bruce Schuck (me) writes:


>> It would be years before a change in the FTA would be possible.
>> Remember, if we open up the FTA, then all the special interest groups
>> in the US would demand concessions from us for sponsoring it and from
>> Quebec for wanting to join. There is very little benefit for the US in
>> allowing such a small market into the FTA.
>> 

>Such a small market? Fully 1/4 of Canada's current population resides
>within the current borders of Quebec. Even with seperation and a smaller
>Quebec their population would be large enough to legitimately be included
>in any FTA. Furthermore it wouldn't take a reopening of negotiations, all
>it requires is an acknowledgement that Quebec recognizes the same agreement
>as everyone else, basically a signature and a handshake.

If you read the news today you will see that the US is prepared to
start a trade war with all of Europe to stop subsidies. Quebec's
economy is subsidy based and the US would be very, very tough.

As for "a signature and a handshake" to allow Quebec into the FTA,
you are hoplessly naive.

>> Ha ha ha ha ha. Ontario is in a post-industrial slump from which it
>> may never recover. Toronto leads the country in unemployment.
>> The provincial deficit soars above 10 billion [I admit out NDP gov't
>> may try to catch up :( ]

>Sure and their industrial base is probably still the largest in Canada. If
>they decide to seperate it would probably be to join the US since most of
>their trading links are below the border it would be practically automatic.

Why would the US want them? They would just be another rust belt state
with high unemployment and a massive deficit.


>> Nonsense. I am a firm believer in the EEE Senate. Equal treatment for
>> all provinces. If I wanted BC to have the best deal I would be a
>> supporter of the 5 region Senate where all regions are equal and BC is
>> a region and gets 20% of the seats. That would be unfair.

>Well since your being so fair minded why can't you see that a fair treatment
>of seperation would be a peaceful negotiation rather than provoked violence?

A negotiation can be tough *and* peaceful.

Being tough ahead of time *may* forestall secession.
Proclaiming how peaceful and easy secession will be only can speed up
the day secession occurs.

>> That sure is switch. Ontario and Quebec preferred captive markets in
>> the Maritimes and West and high tariff barriers to protect them from
>> competition. What you forget is that BC has been buying manufactured
>> goods from Central Canada for decades at inflated prices. We can buy
>> them cheaper from the Pacific Rim.

>I didn't forget a thing. I said it was the best thing for Canada not what
>we currently have. If BC can buy the goods cheaper from the Pacific Rim
>they should be allowed to, this would of course force the eastern provinces
>to become competitive, at the same time as maybe opening up better trading
>patterns throughout Canada.
>> 
>> If Canada had free trade with Japan, it would be -- Bye bye Ontario. :)
>> Their manufacturing industry would never recover.

>Oh bull. It would force it to become more efficient, competitive and
>cost effective a difficult task maybe but not impossible.

The FTA has *not* forced Ontario to become effiecient, competitive and
cost effective. The number on the news today was 600,000 jobs gone in
this recession -- I'm sure many directly attributal to Free Trade.

Emigration from Ontario to BC among professionals is at an all time high.

*Nobody* in Ottawa is doing *anything* to make Canada more competitive.

Canada has just wasted 5 years on Meech and the CA, which means we
lost 5 years of preparation for competing under the FTA.

-- 
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"We've got to get bigger guns" -- Dick Durkin                  schuck@sfu.ca
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Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada,can.general