From: adams@spss.com (Steve Adams)
Subject: Re: rights and responsibilities
Organization: SPSS Inc.
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 21:37:33 GMT

eyc@acpub.duke.edu (EMIL CHUCK) writes:

>adams@spss.com (Steve Adams) writes:
>@Elizabeth Cornelia Green <eg1o+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>@>You think abortions should be used as a source of birthcontrol if
>@>necessary?!?  And that the practice of abstinence is a ridiculous
>@>solution?!?!!  Wow you're confused.  
>@Hmm...I wonder who is confused...
>@
>@>Abstinence is the only good method of birth control.  It's obviously the
>@>only 100% certain method.  
>@Wrong.  Abstinence does not protect one from rape.
>I can see that. But the majority of abortions performed in this country
>are not a result of violent crime (i.e., rape, incest) nor as a
>consequence of saving the life of the mother during childbirth.
No argument.

>I can handle this exception, but it should be shown that the woman was
>raped or required an abortion as a bona fide surgical procedure. In
>addition, the rapist should be given the stiffest penalties under the
>law.
I agree with you on the penalties for rape...

>A child is a gift that is conceived in love and committment to one
>another. You basically get children from the sexual act. If the act was
>not made under the auspices of love and mutual consent, then abortion
>should remain an option.
Pardon me, but gift from where?  If you bring God into the picture, you're
arguing something that may very well be irrelevent to the woman.

What if the women does not consent to impregnation???

>@>And making sure that the child that results from your actions is cared
>@>for is an obvious responsibility.  I strongly believe that killing that
>@>child through an abortion is not facing your responsibilities.
>@Bringing a child into the world is not always the responsible thing to do.
>Neither is it responsible to have sex just because you want to make the
>other person scream your name, or to try on some new sexual position
>that you or your partner is interested in, or to show how much you love
>your significant other.  

Who appointed you to the position of deciding what sex is for?  Among other
things, it *is* for pleasure, and love, and of course procreation.  But
just where do you get off telling me when or why I can have sex?? Hmm?

>@>Sure, sex may be fun, but be prepared to deal with all that it entails 
>@>No Sex is Safe Sex.  
>@Abortion *is* a way of dealing with it.
>How does abortion deal with sex?
It is a way of responsibly dealing with the results of sex when the woman
finds herself pregnant and does not want to be.  Abortion is a respnsible
option...

>@>Everybody knows that there isn't any condom that guarantees no pregnancy
>@>will result.  And they don't prevent the horrible diseases that can
>@>result from sex, either.
>@But they do help.  They give a level of protection.  One asseses the risks
>@and weighs the options.
>And one of the risks is the possibility of pregnancy. But when do most
>people consider abortion? Before having sex (hey, baby, we don't need to
>worry. If you get pregnant, you could get an abortion)? Usually it's
>after a pregnancy test comes in positive.

No kidding...but again, until the test comes back positive, why would she
be considering an abortion except in purely hypothetical cases?  She
wouldn't.  The point being is that if she doesn't want to be pregnant you
shouldn't force her to be.

 -Steve
--
  The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
                         -------------------
   adams@spss.com                                  Phone: (312) 329-3522
   Steve Adams        "Space-age cybernomad"       Fax:   (312) 329-3558
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,talk.religion.misc,alt.atheism