From: danielg@med.unc.edu (Daniel G. Sinclair)
Subject: Re: Returning to secular music
Organization: UNC-CH School of Medicine
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 19:02:05 GMT

In article <nestabro.724347804@nova> nestabro@nova.gmi.edu (Noel Estabrook) writes:
>danielg@med.unc.edu (Daniel G. Sinclair) writes:
>
>>In article <1992Dec11.173416.25963@galileo.physics.arizona.edu> krueger@galileo.physics.arizona.edu (Ted Krueger) writes:

>Hmmm, prudish.  Be holy just as I am Holy, says the Lord.  If that's 
>being legalistic and prudish, so be it.

I guess my beef is that too often, holiness means dress nice and conform
to the acceptible activities (acceptable to Christian culture as opposed
to biblical truth).  And if you don't fit that mold?  Well, probably you
are not holy, but if you change those outer things, you'll be on your way.

>It always amazes me that (although
>they condemn people who practice a more "button-down" Christianity as 
>being legalistic and prudish) many of the non-button-down type do the 
>exact same thing to those who follow a different path.

Actually, there are lots of button down types in my church who are totally
sold out for God, relatively unlegalistic, and have no problem with my
dress or my hair.  However, many churches just seem resistant to any other
type of Christian. 
>
>Also, what is being free from "rules and regs" supposed to be.  I heard a
>saying once (in fact, I'm gonna put it in my sig for a while) that 
>freedom isn't the ability to do what you want, it's the responsibility to
>do what you ought. 

>John MacArthur had a wonderful tape series on this
>back in the severnties that I just listened to a couple of weeks ago.  He
>has an insight into the word that is amazing.
>
Well, I respect John MacArthur for his anointing and ability to teach, and
would be willing to listen to him, but I don't really trust him since he's
so anti-charismatic.  I've read some of his stuff and really believe he is
partially in error.

>However, if the leadership came to me
>and said they thought I should look a little better to teach, I would
>obey their request because they have authority over me.

I would as well, within reason.  I just hate the 'let's dress up for
sunday' culture thing which is alien to me world.  How many people put on
a good heart on sundays?  Man sees the outside, but God is lookin at my
heart.  I just figure that I want to go to church being who I am, not who
I am supposed to be, or who I am supposed to look like.

>consider them stale just because they wear suits.  You talk about 
>judgmental...
>
Sorry, I did not mean to imply that suit wearers are stale ;-).  However,
I did mean to say that just because I don't dress like the normal WMC
Christian doesn't mean I am not holy, conformed in some measure to His
image, or loving God.  Just consider me from another culture :-).

>>	2. what activities should leadership refrain from?
>
>Anything that would cause believers under that leadership to stumble.
>In a large congregation, there could be significant amount of believers
>who stumble over many things (secular music, drinking, etc).  As a 
>leader accountable for the training of those believers, we are under
>obligation to remove those things from our life that may cause others
>to stumble, not out of legalism or begrudgement, but, as Paul says, "so
>that I may win more to Christ".  Once they've been won, then let the
>Spirit lead them, but don't give them something to stumble over before
>they're mature enough to handle it.
>
I agree, but I think that this truth has been overapplied, past the
balance of truth in the scriptures.  At what point do I have no freedoms
because I'm afraid someone will stumble at my freedom?  The answer, in
part, is that I ought to refrain from doing it in their presence.
However, many people have a twisted view of Christianity, that it is all
restrictions.  And so we keep up their idea by outwardly conforming to a
standard that is not in us, living hypocrites living fake lives and
teaching others to do the same.  Ok, so I am a little bitter about this,
and don't have enough time to address this fully (I'm at work).

One of my favorite stories that may have bearing is that told of the great
evangelist and teacher Charles Spurgeon.  One day he found some of his
students smoking pipes, and he said to them 'doesn't your conscience
condemn you?'  They all snuffed out their pipes and put them away,
embarassed.  However, later on, one of those students found Spurgeon
smoking a pipe, so he asked him 'Professor, doesn't your conscience
condemn you?', to which Spurgeon replied 'No'.

My rendering is from memory, and is not inerrant :).  However, you get the
idea.  I am not using grace as a licence for vice, but as a bold
procomation of the freedom I have in Christ.  And any holiness you *do*
see is because I have actually been changed on the inside!  Now *that*
gives glory to God.  And any holiness you see lacking, God hasn't gotten
there yet, but until he does, I am not gonna fake it, and, like it or not,
His blood covers my as yet unsanctified, untransformed parts.  Hurray for
grace!  No wonder I can love God. 

I have much more I would like to say (I am learing these things from the
*bible* and it has been life changing), but anyway, back to rmc :-).
Check out 2Cor 9:7.  If I don't want to give (my money, my life), God
doesn't want me to until my motive is right.  So I quit faking it.  Now I
have a real chance to grow in God.

Respectfully,

danielg

-- 
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* " When our humanity is in danger, the artistic spirit suddenly lives." *
*     -Leland Ryken from _The Liberated Imagination_                     *
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