From: booth@mdd.comm.mot.com (Greg Booth)
Subject: Re: lioness method
Organization: Motorola - Mobile Data Division; Richmond, BC
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 19:03:20 GMT

In <1992Aug18.230322.9688@news.columbia.edu> dan@cubmol.bio.columbia.edu (Daniel Zabetakis) writes:

>In article <1992Aug18.201544.17053@mdd.comm.mot.com> booth@mdd.comm.mot.com (Greg Booth) writes:
>>In <1992Aug10.193208.91631@cs.cmu.edu> garvin+@cs.cmu.edu (Susan Garvin) writes:
>>
>>>In article <1992Aug10.165152.18662@news.columbia.edu> dan@cubmol.bio.columbia.edu (Daniel Zabetakis) writes:
>>>#In article <1992Aug7.222313.19298@mdd.comm.mot.com> booth@mdd.comm.mot.com (Greg Booth) writes:

>>>##[about rape] When it ends, you will be dead; or alive, but physically
>>>##and emotionally shattered, probably permanently.
>>>#
>>>#    I'm not entirely sure this is what we want to say to young women
>>>I agree.  The last time someone posted this particular article, I
>>
>>You both seem to be missing the point, "RAPE IS A BAD THING!"
>>and one should do whatever is necessary to avoid it.

>    The point is that you can never be completely safe from rape. As I said
>in my article, I support efforts at self defense, but I do not support
>any effort to _define_ rape as necessarily the worst experience of your
>life.

Sure one can never be completely safe from anything, all one can to
is be aware of the danger, and know methods that will reduce the
odds against you.

>    The lioness article said "When it ends, you will be dead [semicolon]"
>If somhow you escape death, it tells us, your life will almost certainly
>be ruined permanently. You will definately be emotionally destroyed.
>   What do you say to a person who is unfourtunately raped, but isn't badly
>hurt, and isn't emotionally devestated? Do you tell them that they are a slut
>and probably wanted it?

OF COURSE NOT! I would offer as much support as I can. I would never
"blame the victim". The article said "probably" not "definitely" emotionally
shattered, the many women who have recovered fully from the attack
of such a predator is not a sign of the lack of seriousness of rape, but
instead its a sign of how many women are attacked. If 25% (a randomly
chosen number) recover fully, that still means that 75% of the
survivors will have problems. 75% chance of having permanent problems 
suggests that one will "probably" have permanent problems.

I am sure that somebody out there can provide numbers from a
properly done study on this issue.
 

>>
>>Would the line in question be more accurate if it said
>>"When it ends,.... emotionally shattered, possibly permanently"?
>>                                          ^^^^^^^^

>    First, you would have to remove the dead part. Very few rape victims
>are murdered. I would then say that when it is over, you can begin to
>heal emotionally and physically. It may take a long time.

The "probably permanently" referred to "physically or emotionally
shattered", otherwise a victim would be "probably permanently dead".
As opposed to "probably temporarily dead" I suppose.

>   Did you _read_ the lioness article? It was paranoid drivel dressed up
>like a self-help book.

Let's see, I typed it in from the original paper and posted it, yup
I read it. Remember, it is only a 4 page article, don't expect
all the answers and all the exceptions to every situation.

27% of Canadian women will be sexually assaulted sometime in their
lifetime, in the US I have heard the number is 31%.

In Canada the "reported" sexual assault rate is about 100/100,000.

"Paranoid"? From what you are saying (typing) you seem to feel that
women don't have to worry about being attacked, and if they are,
they don't have to worry about lasting effects. 

"Drivel"? Gee, its reads to me like a frank and technical description
of the most effective methods of self defense. Did YOU read the
entire article?

If any past victim of rape reads the Lioness Method and feels
that she is being blamed for being a victim because she did
not know about self defense methods, well, that can't be helped.
You could say the same thing about any discussion on self-defense.
I hope Susan, and any other survivor, did NOT feel that they were
being told "You shoulda done this, if you didn't do it, then you
got what you deserved". 

Hopefully the Lioness Method will help past victims from
being victimized again, and women from being victimized the first time.


-- 
Greg Booth BSc                        | Diligentia-Vis-Celeritas
BCAA-PCDHF-BCWF-NFA-NRA-IPSC-BCFSS    |  	Incolumitas
Motorola Mobile Data Division         | 
booth@mdd.comm.mot.com cgb003@email.comm.mot.com
Organization: Senior, IM - H&SS Track, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA