From: eln314m@monu1.cc.monash.edu.au (Ms ML Hong)
Subject: Re: An open letter to Emperor Akihito of Japan
Organization: Monash University, Australia.
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 02:10:26 GMT

In article <1992Aug23.190113.29895@leland.Stanford.EDU>, underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
> In article <1992Aug23.051439.24237@monu1.cc.monash.edu.au>
> eln314m@monu1.cc.monash.edu.au (Ms ML Hong) writes:
> >In article <1992Aug23.014604.729@leland.Stanford.EDU>,
> >underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
> >> A Nazi or a Chinese-cu deserves no respect from me.
> >... On the same note, I
> >do not think existing jungle tribes practising canabalism, head hunting
> >etc should be treated as lesser beings and could be thus justifiably
> >hunted down and destroyed.
> 
> Then, I would suggest that those junglemen stay away from 
> Western nations and Japan.  Those junglemen should not post
> to newsgroups like s.c.a.a., seeking support for demanding an
> apology from Japanese people who were not responsible for WWII.
> 
> Note that a person who commits cannabalism in a Western nation &
> Japan would be "hunted down" by the police.  In certain states in
> the USA, that person would then be convicted and "destroyed"
> by capital punishment.
> 
   
   The point I am trying to make is that you can't brand a person as
babaric based on his actions if he is brought up in society where 
ignorance and superstition result in such practices being common. The 
only help you can render is education, not contempt.

> >  
> >  By your token and your rules of classifications, I deserve no respect from
> >you just because I ...  don't steal, rob or perform or condone 
> >atrocities on any living being (I'm against animal testing too), am law 
> >abiding, honest, compassionate, etc. 
> 
> This doesn't sound very Chinese-cu to me.
> 

  So you are saying Chinese-cu comprises a large part if not ALL the 
unsavories in the world. How would you then class someone who is insensitive, 
uncompassionate, intolerant, impolite, unforgiving, who feels that people who 
are misinformed or ignorant deserve contempt, etc ?

> I suppose that you do deserve some respect.
> 
> >> It is no less ridiculous than Chinese-cu twits asking for an apology
> >> from an emperor who is not guilty of committing any atrocity.  If 
> >> the current Japanese gov't must apologize for the activities of
> >> individuals who are already dead, then the Chinese-cu gov't should
> >> do similarly.
> >  Probably the demand of an apology from the Japanese government/emperor
> >is not practical in view of the fact that those responsible may be dead,
> >although in the Western World, WWII Nazis were still being tracked down,
> >put on trial and jailed if found guilty irrespective of their age.
> 
> Note that the persons actually guilty of an atrocity or ordering an
> atrocity is being "tracked down, put on trial and jailed if found
> guilty irrespective of their age."  I have no problem with that.
> This is different from what the Chinese-cu savages are doing.  They
> are demanding an apology from people who had no responsibility for
> the war.
> 
> Please.  Don't compare hunting for Nazis with the bitching of Chinese-cu
> savages.

   If you think that some netters are being childish and impractical, say so. 
There is no need for the strong language you have been using. 

> 
> Similarly, I have no problem with tracking down each and every
> Chinese-cu savage who, around 1949, participated in the massacre
> of Taiwanese-ge when the Chinese-cu savages invaded the island.
> But do you know what?  Ms. Hong, this won't happen.  The Chinese-cu
> won't do it.  (The same applies to each and every Chinese-cu
> savage who massacred a Tibetan.)
> 
> >The demand of the country to face its past and not to distort history
> >and lie to her younger generation is however justifiable.
> 
> As I have said numerous times, the Japanese are wrong to distort
> their "history" books.  We agree completely on this.
> 
> >> [stuff on who should apologise to whom deleted.]
> 
> But the point is that _if_ the Chinese-cu twits demand an
> apology from the the Japanese-ge and their gov't, then we
> Americans (and Asian-Americans) should demand that the Chinese-cu
> twits demand an apology from the Chinese-ge and their gov'ts
> --all 3 of them.
> 
  
  During WWII, when Europe was ravaged by Germany and Italy, there were
civilian casualties, we all agree. Most of them were killed in bomb raids
and in gun battle between the resisting and invading armies. The Jews were
the one unfortunate people who were hunted down and methodically killed.
The French, etc were pretty much left alone.

  This is not true in China and SE Asia when Japan invaded. In my heated
state I could almost claim that the Japanese army treated the killing
fields like their school playgrounds. If not how could they, being humans
too, bayoneted Chinese babies for fun? How could they cut up pregnant Chinese
women and forced other Chinese and Korean women of all ages to be their sex 
toys? What was indoctrinated in them before they were set loose upon the 
Chinese? Was it something similar to what you are claiming all the time, 
that Chinese are beneath contempt and are no better than animals?
  
> >> I fully understand the prejudice that the average Japanese-ge
> >> has against the Chinese-ge in so far as WWII is concerned.  Japan
> >> has apologized for its participation.  _But_ the Chinese-ge demand
> >> recognition from the Japan about specific dates, events, and numbers
> >> that died.  These numbers are in dispute.  Case in point is Nanjing.
> >> The Chinese-ge bitch 200,000.  The Japanese and the Americans
> >> in Japan at the end of the war noted only 20,000.
> >
> >  How much truth is there in everything the Western World have said?
> 
> There's more truth than what the Chinese-cu are capable of.
> 20,000 is closer to the truth than 200,000.
> 
> Speaking of truth, did you know that the Chinese gov'ts on both
> China and the Republic of Taiwan send student spies, masquerading
> as real students, to the USA.  These spies post on newsgroups and
> monitor the activities and opinions pertaining to China and the
> Republic of Taiwan.
> 
> > If you study
> >history carefully and with an open mind, you'll find that many Western
> >countries foreign policies only value the lives of their own people and
> >the people in the countries they are meddling in are of no importance.
> >And the lies they put up to justify their actions .....
> 
> Ms. Hong, you needn't remind me of this.  I did very well in my
> history courses.
> 
> I should expand what you've said.  There are countries, like China,
> where use lies "to justify their actions".  These involve actions
> against one's own citizens.  As I've said many times before, the
> underclass Chinese after the Maoist revolution were viciously angry
> at the upperclass, which had raped the lives of the underclass.
> Do you know what?  Many in the upperclass, after the revolution,
> accused the Commies of destroying China and used lies to justify
> the greatness of China before the revolution.
> 
> The true "greatness" was an annual death toll of at least 1 million,
> caused by famine, disease, and infanticide.  This doesn't include
> those killed by marauding gangs of Chinese thugs.  You know.  Like
> the Chinese gangs in Northern California.  It turns out that those
> parts of China under foreign occupation--US, European, etc.--
> were actually far more prosperous and far better places to live
> (where laws and trial by jury actually existed due to Western
> "demands") than in any place controlled by the Chinese upperclass.
> Shanghai is a good example.
> 

  You probably would also know that Chinese were treated with contempt
then too, in Shanghai. There were clubs and parks which would not allow 
Chinese and dogs to enter. What about the Opium War? Do you take pride 
in knowing that the Western countries used their mights to force the
dumping of opium into China? Have you asked yourself why China closed
its doors to the Western world after the Communist took power? Why was
there anti-west sentiments? Who helped China during Japan's eight years 
of invasion? Europe was too busy defending themselves but what did America 
do? The country who symbolises human rights and democracy?

  We know that the governments of some countries are totalitarian and the 
people there do not enjoy the priviledges such as freedom of speech, rights 
to information, free media, etc which you, as an American, enjoy. So the 
people there are misinformed. But you, educated and well informed, instead 
of making use of your priviledges to inform the misinformed, educated the 
uneducated, decided to abuse the priviledges bestowed on you to belittle
the unpriviledged and resort to name callings.

> >> At the same time, the Chinese gov'ts have never apologized for what
> >> the Chinese-ge did, let alone even acknowledge the 100 million
> >> that died.  The 100 million figure can be verified by Western sources.
> >> I empathize with the Japanese-ge prejudice against the Chinese-ge.
> >  I wonder how someone who values human lives so much can publicly express
> >and support prejudice against a race of people. Unless in his ideology,
> >there are different classes of humans and the values of their lives thus vary.
> 
> I also empathize with the prejudice of the Americans (against the Japanese)
> who fought against the Japanese in WWII.  So what?
> 
> I fail to see how this indicates that I "I support prejudice against 
> a race of people".  I only said that I understand why the Japanese-ge
> and the Americans have their prejudices.  When a Japanese-ge sees
> the hypocrisy and mental incapacitation inherent in a Chinese-cu demand for 
> an apology from Japanese people who had no responsibility for the war
> (many of the not even having been born yet), I don't blame the Japanese-ge
> for their prejudice, resulting from Chinese-cu narrowmindedness.
> 
> I understand it.  I empathize with it.
> 
  
  I am sorry I have misunderstood you. It is just that the impression 
conveyed was that you showed intolerance to people who, according to you, 
harped on things you think they shouldn't be harping on. Your disagreemnt
could have been the start of a constructive discussion if you had used more
moderate tones and wordings. Your phrases of Japanese which one netter
kindly translated for us seemed to suggest you as a racist, since you wish
Chinese culture (the culture or Chinese-cu, the people?) were dead.

> >
> >P.S. I'm sorry Dwight, I can't treat you with kid gloves anymore. You know
> >     what I'm referring to.
> 
> By the way, the Chinese-ge are not a "race of people".  Only narrow-minded
> Chinese-cu twits actually believe that the Chinese-ge are a "race of 
> people" as distinct from the Koreans and the Japanese.
> 
> Given the behavior of Chinese-cu twits, one might be surprised that
> the Chinese-ge and the Koreans-ge actually belong to the same race.
> But it's true.
> 
   If we go back far enough, I could be your cousin 200,000 times removed
:-).


Mun Li

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> Copyright 1992.                                        | San Jose, California.
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