HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: esrma@warwick.ac.uk (Mr P M Jones)
Subject: Re: RE: Galloway's Marathon Schedule
Organization: Computing Services, Warwick University, UK
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 08:19:01 GMT

Personally, I think that you can over-exert your body in preparation
for a marathon, it is better to save that "big one" for the race itself
and work on overall speed and stamina at lower distances to get
yourself fit without damage or injury.  For my last marathon I only
ran over 13 miles once, and that was a gentle 3 hour jog over the
South Downs just to get the feel of moving continuously for a long
period, but I trained hard at the shorter distances ( 34 minute 10k
,57 minute 10 mile, 77 minute halfs ) so that when the big race came
it felt very easy because it was slow, so 65 minutes for the first 10
miles did not do much harm, then I was left with only 16 miles to go
which is a lot easier to get to grips with, which I did in 1 hour 45
for a finish time of 2 hours 50.

I always take a marathon to bits mentally as above, after the first 13 miles
it is only a half marathon, then a ten miler, 10 k etc.  This way as it
gets physically harder, it gets mantally easier, and this fits in with my
training schedule cause it does get hard at the end.
From: mvm@caesun6.harris-atd.com (Matt Mahoney)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Training question.
Date: 8 Sep 92 20:25:19 GMT
Reply-To: mvm@epg.harris.com (Matt Mahoney)
Organization: CAE Design Center, Harris Corp., Melbourne, Fl.

leino@rat.vtt.fi (Tapio Leino) writes:

>How do you prepare yourself for the situation where one or several other
>runners increase the speed after they just decreased it? or do it many
>times?

Unless there is a strong headwind, I run as fast as I can at a steady
pace, and don't worry about what other runners are doing.

If there is a headwind, you can draft behind other runners, and the
strategy can be complex, like a bicycle race.  You can form temporary
alliances and pace lines, with attacks and a sprint at the finish.
It gets even more complicated when you run on a track and have a
headwind on only one side.

You should not run so hard that you go into oxygen debt, except in
the last 45 seconds.  For training, try running intervals over a wide
range of distances and speeds.

--------------------------------        _\/_
Matt Mahoney, mvm@epg.harris.com       |(TV)|  Drug of the Nation
#include <disclaimer.h>                |____|
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: yphotons@athena.mit.edu (Yonson Serrano)
Subject: small FAQ delay
Organization: guy
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 17:52:47 GMT

As you may remember, I was/am in the process of setting up an account at
a new site. This has taken considerably longer than I expected. I should
have access to the Usenet at my new site within the week, at which time I will
be able to post the updated FAQ.

Your patience well be well rewarded.

Thank You,
Yonson Serrano
From: tbont@ep.ieee.org
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: marathon first-timer seeks advice
Date: 9 Sep 92 17:40:45 GMT
Organization: IEEE, New York, NY

I'm a not-so-experienced runner training for his first marathon (New York,
November 1). I have no time goals whatsoever, only survival, and I've
latched on to Galloway's book. I picked up the thread on this topic
rather late. Rather than opening it all up again, I'll just ask a couple
of questions:

1) With under two months to go, my long run (Sept 7) was the New Haven
   20K, which I finished comfortably and without residual soreness. My 
   weekly mileage is just over 20. Is the marathon out of the question?

2) A friend of mine--an experienced runner--cautioned me against running
   the marathon, in view of the wall at ~30K. He said that regardless of
   how far I had gone to date, all bets were off at that distance. What
   had attracted me most about Galloway's book was his revised thinking
   about the wall and the idea that one must acclimate one's body to the
   sheer distance of the marathon. On the other hand, I've seen posts to  
   this group warning against overtraining. Is Galloway's premise, however
   attractive to the novice, just a bunch of hooey?

3) The marathon experiences I'm interested in, needless to say, are *first*
   ones. Any posts about your first marathons and how you would have run them
   differently if you had it to do over would be warmly received.

Thanks to everyone,

Tom
New York
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: duane@anasazi.com (Duane Morse)
Subject: Request for "rules of thumb" - altitude, humidity, temperature
Organization: Anasazi Inc, Phoenix AZ USA
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 13:46:07 GMT

A few weeks ago, I ran in the America's Finest City Half Marathon (San Diego).
The humidity at the start of the race was 87%, there was little cloud cover,
and not much of a breeze.  At the end of the race, lots of folks said their
finishing times were 10 minutes slower than usual.

Yesterday I ran a half marathon in the northeastern part of Arizona, altitude
5600 feet; I normally run at 1200 feet.  I haven't had a decent half marathon
time in quite a while, so I don't have a clue on how much the altitude
affected my pace.

Are there any "rules of thumb" for how such factors as altitude, humidity,
and temperature affect one's pace in long distance running?  Are there any
scientific measurements along those lines?
-- 

Duane Morse	e-mail: duane@anasazi.com
(602) 861-7609
From: ai065@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Thomas Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: NOTICE:"Bigfoot/Sasquatch" Sightings Request
Date: 14 Sep 1992 03:08:24 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


   Our research group is currently investigating reports and sightings of the
animal known as "Bigfoot" or "Sasquatch". If you or somebody you know has had
such a sighting, or come across what may be evidence supporting the existance
of such an animal, please get in contact with us in one of the following
formats:
 
o Leave a private message in electronic mail.
o Call Thomas Hill at 216-362-6529.
o Or write:
 
  Thomas E. Hill
  16124 Richard Dr.
  Brook Park, OH 44142
 
 Contact with us can be totally anonymous if you wish. We are especially
interested in Ohio sightings but are by no means limited to investigations in
that state. Please, serious responses only.
-- 
"A large creature about 7 1/2 to 8 foot tall. It was greyish black in color,
and as it went away from me I seen the backside of it walking as a man would
walk on it's hind legs."- Former Sheriff Oliver Potter, Vancouver, Washington
The Cryptozoology Information Network. Want on our Email mailing list? Amiga!
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: MARATHON REQUEST
From: jwebb@oread.cc.ukans.edu
Date: 14 Sep 92 23:11:56 CDT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Serces

Does anyone have information on marathons that will be in the February to 
April/May time slot?  I'm looking for a first time marathon course (not 
Boston, then, obviously) in a larger city.  I'm also looking for something 
in the Midwest or on the East coast.  If you have info, please email me the 
person or organization that I need to contact.  Thanks.

-- 


Jeffery D. Webb

JWEBB@OREAD.CC.UKANS.EDU
University Of Kansas


Do you choose what I choose?  More alternatives
Energy derives from both the plus and negative
	--Metallica

Anytime that the nine wanna leave, I got a .38 hidden up the sleave,
And it's ready to go to war, 'cause that's what it's here for
It took down a million niggaz and'll shoot one more.
And that's a million and one that couldn't hand with the appetite
Cause they wasn't rappin right
So I had to destroy, whoever was standing in my prescense
And fucking with the escense:  Appetite For Desruction.
	--N.W.A
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: tachaimov@hou.amoco.com (Tom Chaimov)
Subject: Re: New Balance for Fall?
Reply-To: tachaimov@hou.amoco.com (Tom Chaimov)
Organization: Amoco Production Company
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 12:02:13 GMT

Wouldn't you know, as soon as I post asking about the new
New Balance shoes coming out I get my Oct. RW.  So now
my question is:  I've always run in combination lasted shoes.
What differences will I notice if I change to slip lasted?
This question stems from the fact that NB is replacing their
850 & 900 shoes with the slip lasted 860 this Fall.

Tom
From: tachaimov@hou.amoco.com (Tom Chaimov)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: New Balance for Fall?
Date: 9 Sep 92 11:14:19 GMT
Reply-To: tachaimov@hou.amoco.com (Tom Chaimov)
Organization: Amoco Production Company

While I wait for my October RW...

Anybody know what New Balance has in store to
replace their 850's and 900's?  For that matter,
anybody know what other new shoes we can expect?
Nikes?  Sauconies?  etc.
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: behanna@phoenix.syl.nj.nec.com (Chris BeHanna)
Subject: Re: Training question.
Organization: NEC Systems Laboratory, Inc.
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 92 15:05:41 GMT

In article <18i0idINNpj5@vttux1.vtt.fi> leino@rat.vtt.fi (Tapio Leino) writes:
>
>Hi you all 5000- m runners,
>The thing which is not included in the list above is the ability to meet
>the attacks of other runners, when the running speed is changed all the
>time. In fact the speed changes quite randomly or unpredictably. This also
>is one of the reasons why in important races there are surprise winners.
>
>How do you prepare yourself for such random events during a race?
>
>How do you prepare yourself for the situation where one or several other
>runners increase the speed after they just decreased it? or do it many
>times?

	I haven't run a 5000 in a few years, and I was never very good, so
factor that in to any advice I give.

	Anyway, a training method that my high school cross-country coach used
to use is called "Indian Sprints."  A line of runners (usually 5-7) are
circling the track at a good clip.  The guy in back rushes to the lead and
settles in.  Just as he takes the lead, the new backmarker rushes to the lead,
and so on and so forth.  It is very demanding, but it produces results.
Problem is that you have to find a couple of runners who are willing to work
out with you, which is not always available.

Looking forward to my knee healing,
-- 
Chris BeHanna	DoD# 114  KotHLF    1983 H-D FXWG Wide Glide (She lives!)
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com	            (I need another bike for this space!)

Disclaimer:  Now why would NEC agree with any of this anyway?
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: caracuzz@convex.com (Terry Caracuzzo)
Subject: Re: Asics Epcris replacement
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 20:05:50 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

waldnerm@rtsg.mot.com (Matthew R. Waldner) writes:

>I am on my last pair of Asics Epcris.
>What is the replacement model for them.

>Matt

you mean Epirus?  the latest Gel-Exult model is quite similar to the
original (yellow) Epirus).  i recall seeing something in Runners' World
a couple of months ago mentioning this.

Terry
From: 2pereira_f@spcvxb.spc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Tranning ADVICE PLEASE!!!!!!!
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:48:56 GMT
Organization: St. Peter's College, US

Hi all you runners out there!

First Time Posting in this group!(just found out about it)

I am a runner..or at least I was... during high school and freshman year
in college....I ran the 3200 meters , 5000 meters and 800 meters on 
the track and posted times of 9:15, 15:16, and 1:53 respectively...
but stopped running for 3 year now....I now decided ( 3 months ago) to
start running and get back into racing shape....I have been practacing for 
2months on and off because of my right knee???? It seems that everytime 
I go for a run ( after streching and warming up ) My knee hurts.....
Is it because I am tryin to hard to get into shape quickly?
I have tryied to stop and rest for 3-5 days and it always hurts when I start 
running...The funny thing is it only hurts at a paste of 8: min if I go at a
paste of6 or faster it dosent bother me!
Any advice!
Should I take it easy for a while and start over?
I ran a race last week 5000 meters and ran 16:47...and don't relly wanna start
all over....
HELP!!!
see ya,
Felix
From: ian@lassen.wpd.sgi.com (Ian Clements)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: ASICS and mail order
Keywords: Road Runner
Date: 10 Sep 92 21:35:20 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA


 In a recent Road Runner catalog, there was a note thanking everyone for
their support of mail order with respect to Asics.  

 Does anyone know what this is about?  Is Asic trying to get away from 
discount schedules that most mail order companies usually seem to provide?

 As I find most running shoes overpriced, I've come to rely on mail order
as a source of shoes.  Most provide decent discounts and have liberal 
return polices which make it worth the extra hassle.  It would be a shame
to see the brand I like unavailable through the mail.
--

--
Ian Clements, 			| 
ian@sgi.com, 415/390-3410 	| Towards the beans! Towards the beans!
From: dguerrer@lyra.cel.scg.hac.com (Dan Guerrero)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: New York running scene
Date: 8 Sep 92 17:44:48 GMT
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Colorado Engineering Labs

In article <1992Sep4.134447.5497@merlin.comlab.ox.ac.uk> naapw@comlab.ox.ac.uk (Andrew Weir) writes:
>I will be working in New York for a couple of months from October.
>Could anyone tell me if there is a cross country scene over there
>and possibly give me any contacts for running clubs and stuff..
>
>
>	cheers in advance
>			Andy Weir


try the New York Road Runners Club.  I think it is on E89th St off
5th Ave.  It is the biggest and probably most well-known running
club in NY City.  You didn't specify where is New York you will 
be working, but I assume it will be in NYC.

--
Dan Guerrero : dguerrer@rigel.hac.com    Hughes Aircraft Co. Denver,CO
==========================================================================
The only possible interpretation of any research whatever in the 
"social sciences" is: some do, some don't.  -Ernest Rutherford
From: mastor@gmuvax.gmu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Asics Epcris replacement
Date: 14 Sep 92 15:48:34 -0500
Organization: George Mason University, Fairfax, VA.

In article <waldnerm.716131547@blau9>, waldnerm@rtsg.mot.com (Matthew R. Waldner) writes:
> I am on my last pair of Asics Epcris.
> What is the replacement model for them.
> 
> Matt


According to the chart on p.36 of the Spring/Summer 92 Road Runner Catalog,
the replacement shoe for the GEL Epirus will be the GEL Exult.

Xref: sparky rec.running:2541 misc.fitness:7254
From: preston@dawn.cs.rice.edu (Preston Briggs)
Newsgroups: rec.running,misc.fitness
Subject: Re: how long should soreness last?
Date: 12 Sep 1992 18:23:26 GMT
Organization: Rice University, Houston

n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:

>   Recently I have been running twice a week, but a co-worker has
>advised me that skipping more than one day between workouts negates
>much progress.   Some reading confirmed that it is best to not wait
>longer than ~60 hrs between runs.
>
>   In response, I would like to up it to 4 days a week, except that I
>am frequently still very sore for 2+ days after I run.
>
>   For example, on Monday, I ran 8 x 100yds, followed by 4 x 440.  All
>at a slow (1.55 min for the 440s, similar pace for the 100s) comfortable
>pace.  On Tuesday I felt fine, but Tuesday night my calves started to hurt.
>...

Make gradual changes in your training.  You're talking about going
from 2 workouts a week (what sort of workouts?) to 4.  You'll want to
creep up on it -- not do it all in a week.

Furthermore, don't do 4 speed workouts in a week.  If you're only
running 4 times a week, you might make one of them a speed workout and
the rest some sort of longer run.

Get a coach or buy a couple of books as a guide.
There's no reason to ignore other people's (painfully earned)
experience.  You'll save yourself lots of pain and perhaps injury.

Preston Briggs
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Soda Pop
From: tim@normal.cosc.georgetown.edu (Tim Snyder)
Date: 5 Sep 92 01:16:20 -0400
Followup-To: tim@normal.georgetown.edu,rec.running
Distribution: na,world
Organization: Georgetown University, Washington DC

Oops, here is what makes virutually every person with diabetes bristle:
MYTHS of diabetes!

Not to flame Jay, but diabetics can (and do) eat as much sugar, drink
as much booze, and run as many marathons as anybody else.  The challenge
is that they must manage the delicate balance between insulin (which 
lowers blood sugar), food (which raises it), and exercise (which, because
it stokes up the metabolism and makes the insulin "rage") lowers blood
sugar.  Timing is important, and sometimes, due to the millions of factors
that are at play (and _not_ due to negligence), the blood sugar will go
too high or too low.

Before a run, a person with diabetes (nobody in the know calls them
"diabetics" any more) must make sure that the blood sugar is somewhat
higher than normal.  This gives a "pad" so that exercise does not result
in a low-sugar crisis.  Often the runner will take less insulin the day of the
run.  Before (and for long runs, during) the run some food must be
eaten.  For short runs, carbos will do, but proteins and fats are also
necessary for the longer hauls.

For a marathon, one must take some sort of food during the run.  A high-
carbo source like a soda works well, for the sugar is taken up immediately
and, since the beverage is concentrated, it is easily digested (relative 
to, say, the caloric equivalent in whole wheat : ).

So the runner friend is mowing colas during the 'thons to keep his sugar
up where it should be.

Sugar does absolutely _no_ harm to the person with diabetes (provided,
they do not ignore insulin requirements).  That's right: 
The person could knock off twelve sodas, an entire chocolate
cake, and a bag of M&Ms, and be as "fine" as anybody else (quotes
intended---yuk!).

While I am at it, here are a couple of other myth corrections:
There is no clear evidence that diabetes is hereditary.
Diabetes has _nothing_ to do with how much sugar the person ate before
acquiring the condition.
People with diabetes can (and do) drink as much alcohol as anybody else.
(Alcohol lowers the blood sugar a tiny bit, so one must be careful
to not forget to eat [and too many cocktails tend to...].)

There are thousands of other myths.  

Hope this helps.  Oh, by the way, NO, the taste of something sweet 
does not cause the release of insulin (save a possible [and rare]
placebo effect).

Turn the earth,
 Timothy Law Snyder
 Department of Computer Science
 Reiss 225
 Georgetown University
 Washington, DC 20057

tim@normal.georgetown.edu
(202) 687-6208
Xref: sparky rec.running:2540 misc.fitness:7244
From: n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio)
Newsgroups: rec.running,misc.fitness
Subject: how long should soreness last?
Date: 11 Sep 92 22:30:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: henson.1992Sep11.223043.18340
Organization: Western Washington University


   Recently I have been running twice a week, but a co-worker has
advised me that skipping more than one day between workouts negates
much progress.   Some reading confirmed that it is best to not wait
longer than ~60 hrs between runs.

   In response, I would like to up it to 4 days a week, except that I
am frequently still very sore for 2+ days after I run.

   For example, on Monday, I ran 8 x 100yds, followed by 4 x 440.  All
at a slow (1.55 min for the 440s, similar pace for the 100s) comfortable
pace.  On Tuesday I felt fine, but Tuesday night my calves started to hurt.

   On Wed afternoon I went out intending to sprint 12 100s then run some
slow 440s.  After just 4 sprints I was limping during my walking rests.
My calves hurt quite a bit, not a tendon pain, but like a muscle pain.

(Re pain:  A near yelling "God damn this!" kind of pain, but not an "I've 
sprained my ankle and I can't get up" kind of pain, (which I had done 
running several years ago ).  It, for a few minutes anyway, was close to 
the "I don't care if anyone stabs me, because it can't hurt any more 
than it does now" pain level, but not fully there.  8^)

   15 mins later they still hurt, even sitting down, so I decided to skip
it.   About an hour later, they didn't seem to hurt at all, so I walked
a few miles and started to jog.  Gak!  After maybe 200 yards my lower
legs started hurting just like before, so I slowed to a limp.

   I don't know it was cramping or what, because the pain only started
when I started running, and seemed to mostly go away after 20 min or so.  
It felt a little like the muscles were oxygen starved (?), but I have no
idea really.   There is also a nasty ache still in my calves that seemed 
to peak on Thurs and made me feel like I was moving at half speed at work.

   Anyway, the point is that it is Friday and I am still sore from Monday.
How common is this?  Does it change?  If not, does one simply ignore the
pain and run every other day regardless?    When I used to run the mile
as a teen  I don't remember ever getting this sore after training or races,
but I must have.  Then again, I weighted much less and may have been 
running differently. 


Jim Del Vecchio
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: mvm@caesun6.harris-atd.com (Matt Mahoney)
Subject: Re: marathon first-timer seeks advice
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 15:34:01 GMT
Reply-To: mvm@epg.harris.com (Matt Mahoney)
Organization: CAE Design Center, Harris Corp., Melbourne, Fl.

In article <1992Sep9.174045.28948@zeus.ieee.org> tbont@ep.ieee.org writes:
>
>1) With under two months to go, my long run (Sept 7) was the New Haven
>   20K, which I finished comfortably and without residual soreness. My 
>   weekly mileage is just over 20. Is the marathon out of the question?

I ran my first marathon 3 years ago.  At the time, I was training 30 miles
per week and had a long run of 20 miles.  I was practicing Galloway's
technique of increasing the long run by one mile per week up to 12,
then 2 miles every 2 weeks.

I ran the marathon at an 8:30/mile pace for the first 20, until my
quads and calves hurt to the point that running was impossible.  I
walked the last 10K in 88 minutes and finished in 4:24.  My legs
hurt for several days afterwards.

Two months later I ran another marathon in 3:43, with little additional
training and no long runs.  This time, I ran 8:00/mile and only had
to walk intermittently at the end for about 1.5 miles total.

I now train 15 miles per week.  My most recent marathon was Grandfather's
Mountain in 3:32, a hilly course that normally adds about 30 minutes
to your time.  My legs were still sore for a few days afterwards.

I find that the effects of a long run last 2 or 3 months.  I did a
marathon 5 months before, a 20 mile training run about 6 weeks before,
and nothing else over 13 miles.  The rest of my running is speedwork
and racing.  I cross train (bike and swim) for aerobic endurance, and
lift weights.

To answer your question, yes you can run the marathon.  But don't exceed
Galloway's 1 mile/week long run rule, don't go much over your current
weekly mileage, and plan to walk the last few miles of the race.

--------------------------------        _\/_
Matt Mahoney, mvm@epg.harris.com       |(TV)|  Drug of the Nation
#include <disclaimer.h>                |____|

Newsgroups: rec.running