HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fb78@sol.acs.unt.edu (Ganesh Gopalakrishnan)
Subject: Re: TN NEWS : Jaya vows to curb secessionist forces
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 16:35:27 GMT

srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (Srinivasan K.) writes:

>In article <9209300435.AA19106@cec1.wustl.edu> sp2@cec1.wustl.edu
> (Sundara Pandian) writes:
>>
>> Source : The Times of India
>> Dated  : Sep 23, 1992
>>
>>  MADRAS, September 1992.
>> .............
>>He claimed that the  auro-
>>rickshaw  driver who had brought the gunman near the refugee
>>camp at Koodalnagar in Madurai belonged to the DMK.
>>........                       ^^^^^^^^^^^
>>                          *  *  *  *

>This idea of 'belonging' is it the term used by the news reporter!
>I thought, people vote, support different parties at election times.
>Other times they may agree with views of a certain leader etc.

>But belonging looks like a life long commitment to a political party,
>in good times and bad times, in health and sickness etc...

>Anyway, here(in Quebec, not USA), separation, independence etc.
>are common vocabulary and people talk about just like the weather
>since 20 years. There was one referendum on it a few years ago,
>it did not win. Now there is one again, with a totally confusing
>question, which nobody understands. All we know is 'Yes' means,
>Quebec will not separate within 10 years (unless they hold another
>referendum to ask the same question in a couple of years). 'No',
>means Yes did not win. This does not necessarily mean separation.
>Separatists claim 'No' means independence from Canada but not
>separation from Canada.

>The few good thing these referendums have done is, keep the
>prisons free (unlike in many countries); removed the need for any
>violence based independence movement. It also gave the politicians
>political scientists and news reporters things to discuss,
>without having to run after separatist criminals. 

My humble opinion is that polls on controversial aspects will
lead to violence in Tamil Nadu. The magazine that publishes
the article, the writer, the researcher and the printing
press will all be "fair game" for the goon squads operated
by the various political parties. Highly inflammatory
speeches will be "thundered" from platforms urging such
violence. A mature democracy tolerates dissent and its
open expression. Ideas, however controversial can be freely
aired in such a place. TN, in my opinion, is not such a place.
I was there this summer. A weekly magazine's office was
ransacked and couple of employees were flung to their death
from the upper floors of the building in retaliation for
something that was written in it. Swift justice indeed! - ganesh

>KS
Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:2510 soc.culture.indian:32345 soc.culture.sri-lanka:1091
From: vigneswa@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.sri-lanka
Subject: The First Printed Book..... 
Date: 28 Sep 92 11:33:24 GMT

	Thanks for the responses to Athavan's note from the Suvadukal.
The July '92 issue of the Suvadukal  carries a note. (acknowledged: K 
Ganesh @ Sri Lanka and S Sivapathasundaram @ London)

*	The first book in Tamil was printed in Lisban (Portugal) in 1554.

*	The book "Doktrines of Christianty" was printed in India in 1578.
	This was the first book to be printed in India. This was a Tamil
	book and the Tamil name of it was "thampiraan vaNakkam".  

*	Ziegenbalg (a Danish, mentioned by Athavan) translated the Bible 
	in Tamil.  It was the first translation of the Bible in an Asian
	language.

	The Suvadukal presents  the cover page of the  book Doktrines of
Christianty.  The cover says......  DOCTRINA CHRISTAM on Lingua  Malauar
Tamul. Also in Tamil [with no 'dots' for consonents ('mey')] the name of
the book ('thampiraan vaNakkam') and the person who wrote it. 
	
Vicky:
UMass, Sep 28






Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:2571 soc.culture.indian:32658
From: banerj@sundagger.lerc.nasa.gov ()
Subject: Re: Expansions for IIT and IISc
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:05:05 GMT

In article <fb78.717790472@sol> fb78@sol.acs.unt.edu (Ganesh Gopalakrishnan) writes:
>srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (Srinivasan K.) writes:
>
>>Continuing with expansions for BHEL etc.. Here are two more:
>
>>IIT(M)   Institute for Idli and ThOsai (Masala)
>>IISc     Institute for Idli, Sambaar and Chutney

I can attest that all three were excellent when I was there, at least in
B and C messes:-)

Amitava

Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu (Affable)
Subject: Thaalaattu paadalgal
Reply-To: Venkatachalam Aruna <aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu>
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 23:19:42 GMT


 My mother used to sing these "Thalaattu" for my niece and nephew
when they were young.

 (1) aaraaraaro......
     yaar adithaar
     nee azhukinraai
     yaarum adikkavillai
     ai viralum pathiyavillai (?)
     thane azhukinraan/l
     thambi thunai vEndumenRu (Reason for population increase ?)
     ...................        (Neither complete nor verbatim.)

 (2)  aaraaraaro......
     yaar adithaar
     nee azhukinraai
     ammaa adiththaalO
     alli pooch chendaalE
     maman adiththaanO
     malligai pooch chendaalE
     aththai adiththalO
     arali pooch chendaalE
     thatha adithorO
     thaazhambu chendaalE
      ....................             ( - ditto - )

 Is anybody aware of these "thaalaattu paadalgal" ? I heard most
 of the "thaalaattu" are very meaningful. Can anybody post a 
 meaningful one?

Venkat

kocuru: My mother knows only these two songs. I used to tease her:
"Emma, intha irandu thaalaatu thavira vEredaavathu unakku theriuma?".
Immediately she would start singing "sivapuraanam - namachchivaaya
vaazhga..".
--
venkat@jetson.uh.edu                | If you love something,set it free.
venkat@menudo.uh.edu                | If it comes back, it is yours.
venkat@uhupvm1.uh.edu               | If it does not, it never was.
aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu(NeXT mails OK)| 
(713)225-6426(h) & (713)743-4250(w) |
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:2549 soc.culture.indian:32516 soc.culture.sri-lanka:1096
From: vigneswa@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.sri-lanka
Subject: Sinhala script.....
Date: 29 Sep 92 18:07:42 GMT

Kathiravan Krishnamurthi writes:>>

>>The school system teaches that Buddha gave Srilanka to Sinhalese. 
>>But the real history is Vijaya, a king of Orissa came, mixed with 
>>the tribes and the Sinhalese language uses the same script as bengaali.

	I am not sure what school system Kathiravan talks about.  About
Vijaya, as far as I remember, Kathiravan is close. Vijaya was a naughty
prince and was left in the sea with his 700 friends by his grand father.
Vijaya  married to a tribal  princess and crowned.  Later  he drew  her 
away and married to a princess from Pandya kingdom. Also there were 700
other girls from Pandya kingdom sailed to the island for Vijaya's group.
(This from a translated Mahavamsa story).  The Sinhala race is not from
a tribal origin, but a royal one. (Well, I do not know whether Vijaya's
friends and Pandya girls from royal families).  There is a tribal group 
in Sri Lanka, by name Veddhas. They are still in jungles and live there
in the "old" style.  They are "dark-skinned" people.

	I was told that Sinhala language is a mix of Sanskrit and  Pali. 	
That may  be the reason why Pali is popular among buddhist monks.  Palm
leaf scripts in  Pali are maintained in Sri Lankan archives  and in the
Temple of Tooth.  Kathiravan is wrong in his comment about  the scripts.
Scripts of Bengali and Sinhala  scripts have nothing in  common, if not
related for some experts in that field.

K Srinivasan writes: >
>Sinhalese script is very similar to Kannada and Telugu scripts,
>which are Dravidian scripts of south India. Any Indian outside
>the southern region can not distinguish Sinhalese script from
>Telugu/kannada script. The script similarity has nothing to do with
>language similarities.

	Sinhala scripts are "round" in shape.  That may be a reason for
one to come to the conclusion  that Sinhala scripts are VERY similar to
some South Indian scripts (they are somewhat similar though).  This may
be as good as concluding on the similarity between Chinese/Japanese and
Korean  scripts.  Sinhala is an  Indo-European language, whereas  South
Indian languages are  Dravidian.   Tamil fonts (such as 'pa', 'da' etc)
have straight (box) edges too.  Maybe, an informed reader could explain
these differences in origin and similarity in scripts.  BTW, did anyone
in the net see the Thai scripts?  Similarities....!

	Any Indian outside the southern region can not distinguish Sin-
hala from  Telugu/Kannada scripts?  Well, most(?) of  them still  think 
that people in the south speak "madharasi", right?  Ignorance...

Vicky:
UMass,
Sept 29
From: cen466p@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au (S. Parthasarhathy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: How many Tamil Actresses are from Tamil Naadu?
Date: 30 Sep 92 10:11:15 +1000
Distribution: world
Organization: Dept. of Chem. Engg., Monash University, Australia

In article <43194@ogicse.ogi.edu>, partha@mse.ogi.edu (R. Parthasarathy) writes:
> I was talking to a friend of mine when the talk turned on Tamil
> actresses. Invariably, most of the top actresses have been from outside
> Tamil Naadu. See this list below:
> 
> 	KR Vijaya - Kerala
> 	Padmini   - Kerala
> 	Saradha   - AP
> 	Bhanumathi- AP
> 	Savithri  - AP
> 	Sridevi   - AP
> 	Radha     - Kerala
> 	Ambika    - Kerala
> 	Saritha   - AP
> 	Rathi     - Punjab

 	Khushboo  -  I think Karnataka/Maharastra

> 	Vanisree  - ??
> 	Jayapradha- AP
> 	Amala     - Bengal

	Saroja Devi - Karnataka
        Manjula     - AP/KAR
> 
> There are exceptions of course,
> 
> 	Jayalalitha, Manorama, Vijayakumari etc..
> 
> What's the reason for this trend? Is it because Tamil girls are
> conservative about acting in movies? Or lack of interest in Tamil
> girls with good looks for movies?
> 
> Most of our famous background singers have been Non-Tamils too -
> Gantasaala, PB Srinivas, P Susheela, SPB, Jesudoss etc.
> 

You forgot TMS -- Sowrashtra (but ancesters settled in Madurai)

> Partha sarathy
-- 

Paarthaa
ChemEngg

Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:2566 soc.culture.sri-lanka:1101 soc.culture.indian:32602
From: rs6x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Ranjith Ravindiran Suresh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.sri-lanka
Subject: Re: News from Reuters
Date: 6 Oct 92 10:48:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.keoRxue00iV3M4IpY1
Organization: Senior, Civil Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

According to a 'source,' the haul includes 2 military vehicles w/1
having an officer's communication gear fixed to it. Also the rounds of
ammunition are about 300,000. The government has ordered an
investigation into this matter-will involve the officers in charge. 

My assumption is that the 3 machine guns(if there are only 3) must be of
heavy calibre. Or the number & types of rifles is very different from
what the government is willing to admit. After all, the $ must add up to
atleast $1 million.


thambi  
Organization: Senior, Civil Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 17:13:20 -0400 
From: Ranjith Ravindiran Suresh <rs6x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: The Truth behind the Indian generosity

There's a saying in Tamil: gurukkal kusu viTtaal, kurtam iLlai.
(meaning that if the Gurus release 'gases' its not a crime, but it is so
for commoners)

> 5. According to Shri K.Chandrasekar's definition: "LTTE kills people.  
   > Therefore it is a terrorist organization. And the people who sympathize 
   > with it also terrorists." If it is true what about the people who did 
   > provide  the arms to the terrorists?  What about the people who
trained the
   > terrorists? Late Indira Ghandi and Rajiv Ghandi supported the Sri Lankan
   > tamil "terrorists".  What about them?

I am frequently a receiving point for all these and and other names for
I sympathize with LTTE. But, it doesn't bother me at all. Because if I'm
to be bothered, then it is fair to call many prominent Indian
politicians 'terrorists.'(by the same logic) Even the infamous
Jeyalalitha can be labelled a terrorist for she was a supporter of LTTE
during MGR's time. 

> 1. Don't you think that India has committed a CRIME by encouraging Sri Lankan
    youths to fight against their government?

Yes it did. By playing her geopolitical game in what was to be a genuine
military struggle. India put together and fostered numerous militant
groups and had them under its sway(LTTE wasn't one of them. It's already
existing). Later this 'little game' visited upon us through the deeds of
IPKF in even more of a tragic turn. And got what it wanted(neutralized
hostile foreign interests in SL in addition to making Trincomalee a
'neutral' port). All along, we played the parts of 'dispensable people.'
Or atleast that's what Indira Gandhi's foreign policy envisioned. First
it was that bloody SL regime and later another monster from Delhi
cloaked in 'savior' costume. Then something terribly went wrong in their
master plan. LTTE refused to become another in history. Eelam Tamils
struck back. This is what I mean when I write, 'What goes around comes
around.' 

No flame mails, please.

-thambi
September 26 was Lt. Crnl Thileepan's 5th yr anniversary(memorial). It
was marked accordingly in Queen's Pillayar Kovil(NY) with due respects.
In his death stands India's shame!


Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: sivasamy@ifi.uio.no (Sivasamy Premraj)
Subject: The Truth behind the Indian generosity
Organization: Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 13:14:06 GMT
Originator: sivasamy@valfar.ifi.uio.no


 



I have a few questions to the honorable Indian citizens like 
Shri K.Chandrasekar, Shri R.Thiagarajan, Shri R.Raman and Shri B.Kannan.

    India provided arms and training to the SL tamil militants.  I believe         you do not have any doubt about it. These militants are separatists, 
    and their goal is dividing Sri Lanka, a close neighbor to India.  
    Unlike Pakistan,   China, and Bangladesh, Sri Lanka is a very friendly 
    country to India. She never had a serious dispute with India.  Sri Lanka 
    never involved in India's internal affairs.  It did not train the Punjab 
    militants, it did   not arm the JKLF, it did not finance the ULFA. But
    India, the world largest democratic nation, trained Sri Lankan citizen
    to fight against their government.
 
 1. Don't you think that India has committed a CRIME by encouraging Sri Lankan
    youths to fight against their government?
 
 2. Don't you think that India had BETRAYED its friendly neighbor country
    by supporting the separatists who want to divide Sri Lanka?

 3. India, originated from the non-violence struggle, taught Sri Lankan youth 
    to use guns to solve their problem.  What do you think about it?
 
 4. India always accuse Pakistan for supporting KLF (Kalistan Liberation Front)
    and JKLF.  But India supported Sri Lankan separatists and lied about  
    its association with Sri Lankan separatists when it was asked.
    How do you explain it?

 5. According to Shri K.Chandrasekar's definition: "LTTE kills people.  
    Therefore it is a terrorist organization. And the people who sympathize 
    with it also terrorists." If it is true what about the people who did 
    provide  the arms to the terrorists?  What about the people who trained the
    terrorists? Late Indira Ghandi and Rajiv Ghandi supported the Sri Lankan
    tamil "terrorists".  What about them?

I have no intention to resume the "netwar" again. But I would like to discuss
some important issues with the honorable Indian citizens.  Since I try my 
best to be decent in my postings I hope people like Shri K.Chandrasekar 
will refrain from using word like "assholes".

I want to continue my discussion on the responses I receive from above 
gentlemen.
 
    
-Prem.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: jsg9939@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (J. Sreedhar )
Subject: Re: School Inspection
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 04:33:59 GMT

Guntur N Balaji <gb29+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:


>I am reminded of this story about a school inspector.  That it has
>to be fiction is beyond doubt.  But that it might have occured
>cannot be precluded.

>One fine day a school was visited by the DEO - the district educational
>officer.  The Headmaster took him around for rounds.  In one particular
>class, a teacher was teaching Ramayana to the students.  Our DEO entered
>the class, and asked an innocent looking chap - " Who broke Janaka's Bow ? "

>This student was till then sorta dozing away and he was alarmed by this
>accusation.  He said quite vehemently, "  Not me, sir ! ".  The DEO was
>quite taken aback and demanded an explanation from the teacher.

>The teacher was now in a quandry.  He said quite meekly "  No sir, selvam
>is a very quite boy.  He may not have done it.  It might be that class
>bully Babu.  He is very notorious for breaking glass panes and such..."

>Well, the DEO was furious.  He stromed out of the class.  The Headmaster
>ran behind him and apologized.  The DEO asked the headmaster, "  What are
>you going to do about it ?  "  The headmaster said,  "  Well sir, at this
>stage ( with entropy always increasing and etc..) all we can do is to
>replace the broken bow with a new bow from the school funds.   The DEO was
>shivering in rage.  He said he was going to send a memo and take some
>action and went back home totally out of mood.
>His dharma pathni sensing he was not in mood asked him what was wrong.
>The DEO related to her his experience at the school.  His wife shook her
>head from side to side, put her hand to her chin and said in a rather
>sad tone,  "  Didn't they know that it was Muthu who broke it in
>last week's Therukkutthu ? ".    What could the DEO do now ?

>G  N  Balaji/...

One variant is that the DEO goes home in a rage and tells his
wife,"None of the fools at that school know anything about Ramayanam."
The wife asks,"What happened?" 

And the DEO replies,"Why? They didn't even know that it was
Laxmana who broke Janaka's bow!"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: Veeramany.Sthanumurthy@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Veeramany Sthanumurthy)
Subject: Book suggestions (was: bisi bELe huLi annaa and puLi kaaychchal)
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 18:30:42 GMT

[The title reference is in the PS]

In article <BvCJ1r.Dt2@ireq.hydro.qc.ca> srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (K.Srinivasan) writes:
>In response to Revathi Narasaimhan's request, the recipes are
>coming up soon.

Next to the stuff Nagarajan and Jayaraman were going to type up
to post on SCT this is the most promised item on SCT.

:-) :-)

Sthan.

PS. Could Sundaramoorthy/Nagarajan/Sundara Pandian suggest some
bookstores to browse in Madras - Jayaraman too - and a list
of authors/books? (A useful list will get a gift - you can
name a book - I will (try to) get it.)

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: partha@mse.ogi.edu (R. Parthasarathy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Old Tamil Song recordings needed
Date: 1 Oct 92 02:22:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.43475
Distribution: na
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute, Material Science & Engineering


Does anyone have the recordings of the following songs? These are
quite old and I haven't been successful in getting them recorded
in Madras.

(1) Vasantha Kaalam Varumo, Nilai Maarumo ... - P Susheela, Jesudoss

(2) Unnai Enni Ennai Maranthen .............. - P Susheela

(3) Naan Unnai Serntha Selvam, Nee Ennai Aalum Deivam - PB Srinivas

(4) Nejathile Nee Netru Vanthaai............. - P Susheela

If some one has either one or all of these songs, I'd like
to have a copy for me. I'll send the tape and pay for the postage.

Pl. contact me at partha@mse.ogi.edu

Partha sarathy
From: srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: bisi bELe huLi annaa and puLi kaaychchal
Date: 29 Sep 92 15:29:51 GMT
Reply-To: srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (K.Srinivasan)
Organization: IREQ, Hydro-Quebec, QC, Canada
Originator: srini@acr

In response to Revathi Narasaimhan's request, the recipes are
coming up soon.

In response to some one who wondered what b.b.h.a was, here is
the etymological recipe.

bisi : Mapping 'b' to 'v' and 's' to 'y'. 
       'bisil' in kannada is 'veyyil'. 'bisi' in kannada is 'viyarppu'.
       It means 'hot' in kannada.

bELe : Means 'paruppu' in kannada. I do not know if there is a
       word 'vEzhai' to which it could be related??

huLi : Mapping 'h' to 'p' (standard). It is puLi (tamarind).

annaa : is of course 'rice'.

There is also a preparation called 'kadhambam' in Tamil Nadu, which
is close to b.b.h.a.

K. Srinivasan   srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: mvishnu@bcr3.uwaterloo.ca (Meenan Vishnu)
Subject: Re: School Inspection
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 13:47:26 GMT

In article <Bv7zCo.HKB@news.cso.uiuc.edu> jsg9939@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (J. Sreedhar ) writes:
>Guntur N Balaji <gb29+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>
>>I am reminded of this story about a school inspector.  That it has
>>to be fiction is beyond doubt.  But that it might have occured
>>cannot be precluded.
>
>>One fine day a school was visited by the DEO - the district educational
>>officer.  The Headmaster took him around for rounds.  In one particular
>>class, a teacher was teaching Ramayana to the students.  Our DEO entered
>>the class, and asked an innocent looking chap - " Who broke Janaka's Bow ? "
>
>>This student was till then sorta dozing away and he was alarmed by this
>>accusation.  He said quite vehemently, "  Not me, sir ! ".  The DEO was
>>quite taken aback and demanded an explanation from the teacher.
>
>>The teacher was now in a quandry.  He said quite meekly "  No sir, selvam
>>is a very quite boy.  He may not have done it.  It might be that class
>>bully Babu.  He is very notorious for breaking glass panes and such..."
>
>>Well, the DEO was furious.  He stromed out of the class.  The Headmaster
>>ran behind him and apologized.  The DEO asked the headmaster, "  What are
>>you going to do about it ?  "  The headmaster said,  "  Well sir, at this
>>stage ( with entropy always increasing and etc..) all we can do is to
>>replace the broken bow with a new bow from the school funds.   The DEO was
>>shivering in rage.  He said he was going to send a memo and take some
>>action and went back home totally out of mood.
>>His dharma pathni sensing he was not in mood asked him what was wrong.
>>The DEO related to her his experience at the school.  His wife shook her
>>head from side to side, put her hand to her chin and said in a rather
>>sad tone,  "  Didn't they know that it was Muthu who broke it in
>>last week's Therukkutthu ? ".    What could the DEO do now ?
>
>>G  N  Balaji/...
>


I have heard a Tamil version of this story.  Once a new teacher to the
school picked one student and asked "thirukkuRaLai ezuthiyathu yaar ?"
(who wrote the thirukkuraL ?) The student replied "saththiyama naan
ezuthEllE saar". (truly, I didn't write it sir)  The teacher
called the student's father and told the incident, to which the father
said, "ivanukku cuvarila ezuthira pazakkamirukku, ivan thaan ithayum
ezuthiyiruppaan aiyya" (My son has a habit of writing on walls,
most probably he might have written this one also sir).  The new teacher
got mad and took the student and father to the headmaster and related the
incident.  The headmaster asked the student "thirukkuRaL thiru<gn>aanacambanthar
thaanE ezuthinathu,  ithu kooda thiriyEllaiyO unakku ?" (TK was written
by cambanthar, didn't know even this?")

teacher: #$$$#$!!!**!#

Meenan Vishnu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian,alt.sex