HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: morgan@ms.uky.edu (Wes Morgan)
Subject: Re: DRAFT Student Access/Use Policy
Keywords: opinions welcome.......
    <1992Apr13.92643.3006@ms.uky.edu> <1992Apr13.154330.19059@eff.org>
Organization: The Puzzle Palace, UKentucky
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 19:05:07 GMT
X-Bytes: 

kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
>Wes Morgan writes:
>
>>>}Section 3: Electronic Mail Policy
>>>}3.4   All mailing lists with more than 10 members must be registered with
>>>}      the ECC staff. [Paragraph 1.21u, CSC]
>
>These lists are already prohibited because they are illegal. Do you
>really want to take even partial responsibility for the lists that you
>do approve of? What if you give it an official University OK, and
>*then* it starts being used for credit cards?

Hmmmm......you may have a point.

>
>I'm enclosing a reference.
>
>If, however, administrators exercise
>the power of prior review, then the court will also hold them and
>their schools liable for the contents of such publications.

Well, I wouldn't be exercising "prior review".  Here's how it would
work (I've already tested this method -- it works):

	1) User asks for mailing list.

	2) I set up a pointer to an address file, WHICH IS OWNED AND
           MAINTAINED by the user.  The user is also designated as the
	   owner of the list, using the standard "maillist-owner" and 
	   "maillist-request" aliases.  If user "jbuser01" comes to me
	   and asks me to set up a mailing list named "snarf", here's
	   all I have to do (sendmail admins take note):

		In the master alias file (mine is /usr/lib/aliases):

		snarf: :include:/usr4/students/jbuser01/snarflist
		snarf-request: jbuser01
		snarf-owner: jbuser01

	   Whenever a piece of mail comes in for "snarf@engr.uky.edu",
	   the mail system consults the file "snarflist" in jbuser01's
	   directory; he owns the file, and I'm out of the loop.

	3) The user runs the list, adding and deleting members and
	   handling the distribution.

The sum total of my participation is the addition of the necessary lines
in the master alias file.  I wouldn't have any input at all to the contents
of the list.

To me, this is similar to starting a college newspaper.  I give them office
space and a means of delivery; the rest of it is theirs.  Would this consti-
tute "prior review"?  What if I eliminate the involvement of the University
Counsel and just create any mailing list upon request, using this system?
Would that eliminate any potential liability?

-- 
 morgan@ms.uky.edu    |Wes Morgan, not speaking for|     ....!ukma!ukecc!morgan
 morgan@engr.uky.edu  |the University of Kentucky's|   morgan%engr.uky.edu@UKCC
 morgan@ie.pa.uky.edu |Engineering Computing Center| morgan@wuarchive.wustl.edu
        "I was going to rip your head off, but I'm past that now."
Xref: sparky comp.admin.policy:711 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:1591
From: jka@math.ufl.edu (Jon K. Akers)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,rec.games.mud
Subject: Re: MUDS: Network menace, or just another service?
Date: 3 Apr 92 16:36:01 GMT
Article-I.D.: poincare.JKA.92Apr3113601
	<1992Mar27.202043.25852@aw2.fsl.ca.boeing.com>
	<chupchup.701957249@piggy> <1992Apr1.172238.23329@nic.umass.edu>
Organization: University of Florida Department of Mathematics

In article <1992Apr1.172238.23329@nic.umass.edu> a0s5108@titan.ucc.umass.edu (Neal and Mara Priestly) writes:

   If Joe Random User has such a problem he should address it at his site.
   Umass had the problem of actually getting a telnet port for legitimate
   system needs.  The Ops Manager looked at who was using the ports for what

The CIRCA department here at UF had this problem as well, and the
sysop basically looked at which port was being used the most and shut
it down completely, since most of the users were going to this
specific mud. (I am not going to say which one it was because I know
the implementor is not looking to advertise.)

   and determined that the problem was muds.  Myself and a friend concurred
   with his analysis *as wizes of a mud we were playtesting* and agreed with
   his solution.  Our mud is gone.  (OK, I lied, Pid has it on 2 tapes, and
   I have it on 2 tapes.)  And telnet is restricted between 8am and 5pm local.
   You can only access the 'default' ports during these hours.  A reasonable
   application of a clock-lock algorythm in response to a definable reasonable
   problem.  I would have posted said solution to JRU and told him to contact
   our OpsMan for the actual fix.
   PS:  I don't even know if the OpsMan knew we had the Diku up.  He green
   lighted it in his living room over a few Coors in a vuage hypothetical
   sense and to the best of my knowlege the mud came up n times at n<10

   -Neal

Running a mud myself, I keep an eye out for places that may be abusing
their privileges to play. If I ever have a sysop mail to me
complaining I will have no problems shutting down access from that
sight, since I am not really in this for the players benefit but
instead for the programming experience (The players are just a nice
side bonus. You can't beat being able to hack *and* being able to
associate with other people at the same time.) Fortunately they
haven't cut off telnet access in the CIRCA labs completely, but I do
have to agree with what the sysop did, since I sometimes had trouble
getting onto the system from lack of port connections.
--
###########################################################################
#  Jon Akers                      "...realize you're living in your       #
#  jka@math.ufl.edu                golden years..."                       #
#  SILVERFIRE%oak.decnet@pine.circa.ufl.edu                               #
###########################################################################
#  Try MudDog mud at mud.math.ufl.edu 2000 (128.227.168.2)	    	  #
###########################################################################
Xref: sparky comp.admin.policy:724 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:1610
From: bh@anarres.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Brian Harvey)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Re: A question of ethics
Keywords: ethics cracking law
Date: 14 Apr 92 01:26:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.sdccvINN9eq
Organization: University of California at Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: anarres.cs.berkeley.edu

miw@brolga.cc.uq.oz.au (Mark I. Williams) writes:
>This hypothetical case didn't happen in the US. It is also very unlikely
>to fall under any academic-freedom or contractual rights, because the
>object of dispute was a *game*. Now if the student can prove that he has
>some right, constitutional, contractual, or academic, to use University
>resources to play *games*, then good luck to him. In many places this is
>explicitly *forbidden*.

The question isn't about the student's right to play games, but rather
about the administrator's right to break into the student's account on
another computer.  The non-computer analogy would be rules that limit
the right of the police to search your belongings.  You are protected
by these rules even if you have committed a crime!  Certainly you are
protected when the police think you have committed a crime -- if not,
it would be silly to have such rules at all.

The argument I'm making doesn't settle the question of what rules do
limit the authority of system administrators.  All I'm arguing is that
it doesn't matter that the student may *also* have been doing something
wrong.

This follows from the well-known legal principle, "two wrongs don't
make a right"!  :-)
From: cos@lclark.edu (John Costello)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,rec.games.mud
Subject: Re: MUDS: Network menace, or just another service?
Date: 13 Apr 92 07:29:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: lclark.1992Apr13.072945.11276
Organization: Lewis & Clark College, Portland OR

In article <65278@apple.Apple.COM> richardt@Apple.COM (Richard Threadgill) writes:
>Of course, all of this discussion of the Acceptable Use Policy may very soon
>become moot, as it is now undergoing Congressional review.  Thus far, the
>reports have been mixed, but the AUP was subjected to fairly severe
>criticism in the last round of hearings and the NSF is busily pouring 
>over their justifications for the AUP.

Is it possible to obtain a copy of the AUP draft, either through ftp or by
having someone mail it to me?  I am new to this thread, and would appreciate
being caught up on it, especially by having a look at the policy which is
being proposed.

>RichardT

Thanks,

Cos
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: fxjwk@acad3.alaska.edu (Jo Knox)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy
Subject: ?: Charging $$$ for computer use
Date: 16 Apr 92 21:30:08 GMT
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks

Apologies if this is misdirected, but it seems most appropriate here.

I have been asked to look into charging (money) for computer time on our
academic mainframe (well, VAX 8800).  Computer use has increased to the point 
where this system just can't keep up with demand, so we've seen serious 
response time problems.  Some of our 4000+ users have fairly large research 
projects on this machine which might more properly be running on Crays 
somewhere or other, so I guess the intent of charging is to "encourage" those 
users to migrate...  I desperately wish to avoid charging all users, even those 
who use a fair amount of CPU time, if they're not doing funded research.

I am very interested to hear from any other University computer admins, or even 
those outside of Universities, about charging for computer use.  Does anyone
charge specifically for _funded_ computer use?  All computer use?
And how do you charge: CPU time, connect time, disk storage?

I thank you for your time
jo
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: morgan@ms.uky.edu (Wes Morgan)
Subject: Re: DRAFT Student Access/Use Policy
Keywords: opinions welcome.......
    <1992Apr13.144306.3022@ms.uky.edu> <1992Apr13.195228.24575@eff.org>
Organization: The Puzzle Palace, UKentucky
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 15:28:01 GMT
X-Bytes: 

kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
>
>>	"Any restrictions placed on your computing access must be 
>>	 directly related to the charges filed against you.  Any
>>	 restrictions must be approved by the Director of Engineering
>>	 Computing prior to their initiation."
>
>Let me make up a scenario. A user apperently sends a million lines of
>"Wow! I sure can waste paper" to the laser printer." This wastes about
>2000 pages of paper and $25 dollars worth of toner.
>
>You bring him/her up on charges. (At the very least he or she should
>have to pay for the waste and get a formal warning from the school.)

Actually, I'm laid back enough that I wouldn't even press charges on
something like this.  Of course, none of my users have ever done any-
thing this stupid.  8)

>The question is, should you also prohibit the user from using the
>printer while the case is pending? The policy as written seems to say
>yes. But to me this seems that punishment before establishing guilt.

Well, there are aspects of the disciplinary process that cannot be
adequately codified.  The determination of "adequate" restriction is possibly
the most subjective part of the entire process.  In this particular
scenario, I'd slap a page limit on the user (say, 30 pages/day).  As
an alternative, his use of dot-matrix and/or line printers could be
unrestricted, while the laser printers are made unavailable.

I would hope that the approval requirement for restrictions would 
prevent this sort of problem.

>(unless you really think the user is stupid enough to do it again
>while awaiting a University hearing.)

Well, you never know..........8)
-- 
 morgan@ms.uky.edu    |Wes Morgan, not speaking for|     ....!ukma!ukecc!morgan
 morgan@engr.uky.edu  |the University of Kentucky's|   morgan%engr.uky.edu@UKCC
 morgan@ie.pa.uky.edu |Engineering Computing Center| morgan@wuarchive.wustl.edu
        "I was going to rip your head off, but I'm past that now."
From: sean@sdg.dra.com
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy
Subject: Re: logging outgoing telnet sessions to catch 'hackers' (summary)
Date: 14 Apr 92 15:25:30 CDT
Organization: Data Research Associates, St. Louis MO

In article <vijay.703271720@cdsun.fnal.gov>, vijay@cdsun.fnal.gov (Vijay Gurbani) writes:
> I beg to differ. Getting an account on a system is not a *right*, it is a 
> *priviledge*, much like getting a driving licence. As with any priviledge,

It depends.  Maybe on your system it is a privilege, but on other systems
the account may be provided as part of a contract.

I don't expect my bank to examine my safety deposit box I lease from them (to
continue the use of poor analogies).

-- 
Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO
Domain: sean@sdg.dra.com, Voice: (Work) +1 314-432-1100
Xref: sparky comp.admin.policy:720 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:1605
From: kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Re: DRAFT Student Access/Use Policy
Keywords: opinions welcome.......
Date: 13 Apr 92 19:52:28 GMT
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
Originator: kadie@eff.org

>kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie) writes:

>>Part C is especially unclear about how the restiction "depends" on the
>>nature of the charges. A staff member could read it and this that he
>>or she is suppose to punish users before it has been determined that
>>they have volated policy.

morgan@ms.uky.edu (Wes Morgan) writes:

>Hmmmm....how about adding this?

>	"Any restrictions placed on your computing access must be 
>	 directly related to the charges filed against you.  Any
>	 restrictions must be approved by the Director of Engineering
>	 Computing prior to their initiation."
[...]

Let me make up a scenario. A user apperently sends a million lines of
"Wow! I sure can waste paper" to the laser printer." This wastes about
2000 pages of paper and $25 dollars worth of toner.

You bring him/her up on charges. (At the very least he or she should
have to pay for the waste and get a formal warning from the school.)

The question is, should you also prohibit the user from using the
printer while the case is pending? The policy as written seems to say
yes. But to me this seems that punishment before establishing guilt
(unless you really think the user is stupid enough to do it again
while awaiting a University hearing.)

- Carl
-- 
Carl Kadie -- I do not represent EFF; this is just me.
 =kadie@eff.org, kadie@cs.uiuc.edu, or (anonymous) ap.3619@layout.berkeley.edu=
Xref: sparky comp.admin.policy:715 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:1599
From: kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Re: DRAFT Student Access/Use Policy
Keywords: opinions welcome.......
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:29:30 GMT
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
Originator: kadie@eff.org

Kadie writes:

>> These lists are already prohibited because they are illegal. Do you
>> really want to take even partial responsibility for the lists that you
>> do approve of? What if you give it an official University OK, and
>> *then* it starts being used for credit cards?

edguer@ces.cwru.edu (Aydin Edguer) writes:

>Your reference has no bearing on the situation as posed.  If you read your
>own reference, it refers to "administrators ... exercis[ing] control over
>the content of student publications".
[...]

You are probably right that preapproval of mailing lists would not
increase legal libability. It might, however, increase extralegal
pressure to suppress (legal) mailing lists. ("How come you approved
*that* mailing list?").

- Carl
-- 
Carl Kadie -- I do not represent EFF; this is just me.
 =kadie@eff.org, kadie@cs.uiuc.edu, or (anonymous) ap.3619@layout.berkeley.edu=
Xref: sparky comp.admin.policy:721 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:1606
From: kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie)
Newsgroups: comp.admin.policy,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Re: DRAFT Student Access/Use Policy
Keywords: opinions welcome.......
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:04:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: eff.1992Apr13.200405.24990
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
Originator: kadie@eff.org

kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie) writes:

>These lists are already prohibited because they are illegal. Do you
>really want to take even partial responsibility for the lists that you
>do approve of? What if you give it an official University OK, and
>*then* it starts being used for credit cards?
[...]

morgan@ms.uky.edu (Wes Morgan) writes:

>Hmmmm......you may have a point.

One that I've mostly retracted.

My central concern is that some users will be less likely to create
mailing lists because of the hassle or embarrassment.

Instead of *requiring* that mailing lists be set up by you, how about
just *offering* such a set up mailing lists as a service to users?
You can also tell them about "batch" priority mail. From my
experience, as a user, the service that you offer would be welcome by
many users. With such voluntary cooperation, your problems with user
mailing list would be reduced.

- Carl
-- 
Carl Kadie -- I do not represent EFF; this is just me.
 =kadie@eff.org, kadie@cs.uiuc.edu, or (anonymous) ap.3619@layout.berkeley.edu=
Xref: sparky comp.admin.policy:728 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:1611
From: Bjarne Pohlers <ZX0013@DMSWWU1A.BITNET>
Newsgroups: comp.archives
Subject: [comp.sys.atari.st] MicroEMACS 3.11a-beta3available
Followup-To: comp.sys.atari.st
Date: 10 Apr 1992 05:55:06 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
Reply-To: Bjarne Pohlers <srb110@math.uni-muenster.de>
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
X-Original-Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
X-Original-Date: Thursday, 9 Apr 1992 10:10:40 MES

Archive-name: auto/comp.sys.atari.st/MicroEMACS-3-11a-beta3available


Sorry for posting this again, but it seems that this did not get out of
Muenster...
-                                                                             -
Now there is a beta-test version (patchlevel 3) of MicroEMACS 3.11a
available at ftp.uni-muenster.de (128.176.120.210).  There are three
versions:
o me.prg : A dirty programmed version with linea-calls (I
  would not guarantee that it will run on future versions of TOS)... But
  that does not matter, because there are two other versions:
o gemme.prg: A fine gem-based version. Each MicroEMACS-screen is
  displayed in a seperate GEM-window.
o tcme.ttp: A termcap-based version. It works under mw and should also
  work under mgr.

Please report any problems and bugs to <srb110@math.uni-muenster.de>.
--
!"$%&/);=?!-.'"[!=({\,@*~#+$['&^(/!&=]`"%$_^.|?>}`>|"/~^<$:&)*;#!;[&=#"&%$\':"[
"  Bjarne Pohlers    Fast address: <srb110@math.uni-muenster.de>              &
\                    Slow address: Asbeckweg 15 | W-4400 Muenster | Germany   \
&                    Phone number: (X49)251-866559                            "
[":'\$%&"#=&[;!#;*)&:$<^~/"|>`}>?|.^_$%"`]=&!/(^&'[$+#~*@,\{(=!["'.-!?=;)/&%$"!
From: enge@almaden.ibm.com (Roy Engehausen)
Newsgroups: comp.archives
Subject: [rec.radio.amateur.packet] AA4RE BBS Version 2.12 Available
Date: 6 Apr 92 10:37:19 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.rp9kvINN15l
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.packet
Organization: UCSD Usenet Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
X-Original-Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.packet
X-Original-Date: 3 Apr 92 18:59:44 GMT

Archive-name: auto/rec.radio.amateur.packet/AA4RE-BBS-Version-2-12-Available

AA4RE BBS version 2.12 is now available.  Lots of new features to make
your life as a SYSOP easier.

The biggies are:
  -- Overlay area now shared (no more task busy)
  -- Supports BPQHOST mode directly (BPQ v4+)
  -- Added REVIEW command
  -- Added command to display routing info
  -- Added authentication
  -- Added callbook support
  -- Lots of server support.  W1NPR writes a great bunch of servers that
     do just about anything.  Contact him for details

The software is loaded onto tomcat.gsfc.nasa.gov accessible via both
SLIP and thru the Internet.  It is also at ucsd.edu in
hamradio/packet/aa4re.  The filename in both cases is bb212.zip.

The primary advantage of BB over the MBL/RLI/BQE/CBBS....  systems is
the ability to handle multiple connects per port.  The program uses it
own multitasker and no DesqView, DoubleDos, etc is required.  On the
down side, BB has been optimized for speed and requires at least 512K
(and usually 640K) to be used productively.  Only an 8088 based
machine is required.  My two port system runs adequately on a PC-1
(the original 64K motherboard).

BB uses a "host-mode" interface so the only TNCs supported are the TNC-1
and TNC-2 (or clones) with the WA8DED (or clone) EPROMS installed, the
AEA PK-87, PK-88, PK-232, and the DRSI PC*PA TNC card.  It also runs
with any KISS TNC using the G8BPQ PC Node switch.

If you want a diskette, you can send $5 US (or equivalent) to:

  Dave Larton, N6JQJ
  766 El Cerrito Way, #D
  Gilroy, CA  95020-4149
  (408) 847-3605

  John Anderson, N7IJI
  2729 Park Road
  Charlotte, NC  28209
  (704)-333-3249

Canadians can send 5.00 CDN to:

  A.R.E.S. Group
  Att: REBBS Update
  P.O. Box 35
  St-Jean Chrysostome,
  Quebec,  Canada    G6Z 2L3

For source code, include $2 more (needs multiple diskettes).  We can
handle all formats of 5 1/4 and 3 1/2 inch diskettes.  Source
will also be available later via FTP after I package it.

The software can also be obtained by downloading from the following BBS:

   WA6RDH BBS -- 916-678-1535 -- 300-9600 V.32, V.42.bis, MNP
   WB3FFV BBS -- 410-625-0817 -- 1200&2400 Non-MNP
              -- 410-625-9482 -- 1200-9600 V.32, V.42bis, MNP
              -- 410-625-9663 -- 1200&2400 (MNP5), 9600 & 19200 (PEP)
   WB2COY     -- 914-485-3393 -- 1200-38400 (>2400 requires USRobotics HST)

The software can also be delivered via BITNET.  Send a note to ENGE at
ALMADEN for deliver over BITNET.

73,

Roy, AA4RE
From: muthu@mecad.uta.edu (S.N. Muthukrishnan)
Newsgroups: comp.archives
Subject: [sci.engr] FEM Software on public domain. Watch!
Followup-To: sci.engr,sci.engr.civil,sci.math.num-analysis
Date: 8 Apr 1992 07:13:27 GMT
Organization: University of Texas at Arlington
Distribution: world
Reply-To: muthu@mecad.uta.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
X-Original-Newsgroups: sci.engr,sci.engr.civil,sci.math.num-analysis
X-Original-Date: 6 Apr 92 21:51:12 GMT

Archive-name: auto/sci.engr/FEM-Software-on-public-domain-Watch


Hello there,

As I had written earlier, some FEM softwares are available at
me.uta.edu by anonymous ftp.
----
the address: me.uta.edu
login as   : anonymous
password   : your e-mail address

cd /pub/science
 the file is mufea*.zip
----
get these files in bin mode.

We don't have an index on this machine.  (May be we should have one 
since the traffic has increased. But the school does'nt pay for it).

Hope this helps!
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
S. N. Muthukrishnan                   muthu@mecad.uta.edu (NeXT mail)
Department of Mechanical Engineering  muthu@me.uta.edu
University of Texas at Arlington      muthu@mech.uta.edu
Arlington, TX  76019
--------------------------------------------------------------------