HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: steph@cs.uchicago.edu (Stephen Wilson Bailey)
Subject: Instrument Tech (was: Re: Recomend good LORAN ???)
Organization: University of Chicago Computer Science
	<STEPH.92Aug31160435@candide.uchicago.edu>
	<1992Sep1.125629.27756@phri.nyu.edu>
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 16:39:21 GMT

Actually, I'd like to have it do like you suggest the Occam does,
divide the distance by the your speed times the cosine of the angle
between your course and the course to the mark (speed made good).

Either that or just display some pleasingly low number, like 0:42 so
you may reassure non-nautical types on your boat that you're almost
there.  I guess the Apelco's number is a dynamic approximation of
this.

Apropos of instruments, does anyone know how difficult it is
(technically) to make a typical 200 KHz transponder give depth?  How
much power must you provide for the ping?  Are there any funny
requirements on the waveform, or can it just be a sinusoid of some
particular duration, every so often.  Then, is the naive distance =
(velocity * time) / 2 computation accurate enough?

Steph

Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: dlucy@sandr.COM (Douglas Lucy)
Subject: Re: Chesapeake Bay Net Gathering
Organization: S&R Software, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 00:49:52 GMT

Hey! For those of you planning your own water-based net gathering,
try to snag a picture while you're at it. I'll be snapping some
electronic frames (I hope to get Bob dropping his cellular overboard
_again_) and doing the conversion-to-PBM and the like for geeks like
me who want to SEE how it went and what kind of folks are on the
other end of the Ether...

-- 
[ W. Douglas Lucy, VP Technical Services, S and R Software, Inc. ]
[ dlucy@sandr.COM                                                ]
From: m043117@muvms3.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: unleaded gasoline
Date: 1 Sep 92 12:25:16 GMT
Organization: Marshall University

I have a simple question for boat mechanics or persons with knowledge
on Evinrude motors. Is it okay to use unleaded gasoline in 1976 Evinrude
3 cylinder 75 hp. motors? Thanks in advance for any and all replys..

Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: billp@voyager.chm.clarkson.edu (Bill Plunkett)
Subject: Re: streching a tarp (was Re: re: Winter Boat Storage)
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 17:37:52 GMT

From article <140@cherise.UUCP>, by bobp@cherise.UUCP (Robert Parkinson):
> In article <1992Aug28.182110.26793@news.clarkson.edu> billp@voyager.chm.clarkson.edu (Bill Plunkett) writes:
>>Instead, weights were
>>hung (gallon plastic milk jugs filled with water) from the eyelets
>>along each side of the tarp.
>>(who >cares if they freeze) and you don't need a place to hook 
>>the other end.
>>-billp
> 
> This is the proper solution, I think. However, if you fill the jugs
> with water, and they freeze, burst the jug, then thaw, the water will
> leak out, and the tarp will blow around. So, maybe we fill them with

I often freeze plastic containers full of water to put in my ice
chest.  The plastic bulges a little, but doesn't burst.  (It's much
neater than just a block, or even a bag of ice melting - you don't
find the margarine and some soggy chicken floating aroung in there
when you lift the cover.)  Maybe a winter of repeated freezing and
thawing would cause the plastic to fatigue and fail.  Not sure.

-billp

Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: sglickma@hopi.intel.com (Steve Glickman)
Subject: Boat US 800 number
Organization: Intel Corporation
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 20:33:05 GMT

Does anyone have the 800# for Boat us insurance?
                             thank
--
Steve Glickman | " I don't think Don King deserves a holiday in Arizona."|     /\  / \ 
Intel Corp.    |                               Tom & Tom                 |    /\/\/   \/\o
Chandler,Az    |                              In Living Color            |   /    \    \_ 
               |                                                         |  /      \    \
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------






                                                   
                     
                                              






Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: goldberg@cs.ubc.ca (Murray W. Goldberg)
Subject: Re: Bayliner myths: a challenge
Organization: Computer Science, University of B.C., Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 19:08:40 GMT

[argument that speed != immaturity deleted]

>> As long as a person handles a fast boat SAFELY, then you should
>> have no problem with it. ......

[to which heon@cbnewsg.att.com replies...]
>Very well said.  ......
[and goes on to say....]
> ....  I must admit it's [the ferry's] wake is
> very large (broke an arm of a passenger jumping it myself),
>
>* heon@cbnewsg.att.com       Holmdel, NJ *

Am I the only one who sees an inconsistency here? Hmmmmm..., all this makes 
me glad I live on the *other* coast (though I suspect we have our share of 
such "safe boat handlers" here too). I can't think of any situation where
"jumping" a ferry's wake could be anything short of reckless. Forgive me if
I judge too quickly or harshly, I just hate to see the potential for harm to
innocent people.

-----
Murray W. Goldberg       | UUCP:     {alberta,uw-beaver,uunet}!ubc-cs!goldberg
Dept. of Computer Science| Internet: goldberg@cs.ubc.ca
Univ. of British Columbia|           (cs.ubc.ca=137.82.8.5)
Vancouver, B.C. V6T 1Z2  | Phone:    (604) 822-3123
From: pavlov@niktow.canisius.edu (Greg Pavlov)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Flares (was: Re: snow goose)
Date: 3 Sep 92 13:20:03 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208

In article <1992Aug31.125335.8324@phri.nyu.edu>, roy@alanine.phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith) writes:
>
> ..... Recently, I've noticed that every new H/P laser printer tonor
> cartridge I buy comes with a pre-paid UPS shipping label to send the empty
> back to H/P for recycling.  Perhaps that's what needs to be done with
> flares.


  I like HP as a company.  But to cast a few aspersions on them (after all,
  this is usenet...), the motivation here may be to keep the used cartridges
  out of the maverick refillers' hands.  We sell our cartridges to refillers,
  even though we use new ones.  There's quite a market out there for spent
  toner cartridges.

  greg pavlov
  pavlov@fstrf.org
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: dean@MorningStar.Com (Dean Schell)
Subject: Re: Electronics (too much is never enough) 
Organization: Morning Star Technologies
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 12:56:52 GMT

gt@hpfcbig.SDE.HP.COM (George Tatge) writes:

>If you are ever called on the carpet to explain why you could
>possibly need all that electronic gadgetry on such a small boat,
>check out this months edition of "Trailer Boats."  There's an
>article about a guy with a 22' open bow Cobalt.  "Look dear, you
>think I'm getting carried away, check out this guy."
>
>He's got:
>* all the normal gauges, plus some
>* 2- compasses
>* VHF
>* Cellular Phone
>* Loran
>* GPS
>* Auto Pilot!
>* Radar!

What, no weather fax, depth sounder, or fish finder? :-)

-dean
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: stefan@leland.Stanford.EDU (Stefan Michalowski)
Subject: Re: Awesome sailing last weekend, huh?
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 17:16:22 GMT

In article <la9lthINN2ls@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> dudley@treefort.Corp.Sun.COM (Dudley Gaman) writes:
>Several Right Coasters write:
>
>...[various raves about the wind last weekend removed]...
>
>It's funny you had such good wind last weekend.  Here, in San Francisco Bay, the
>wind was unusually light.  It didn't get over about 25 knots all weekend and it
>even rained on Saturday....

It was light on the ocean, too. I was crewing on a Beneteau 42 in the 
overnight Drake's Bay race. It took us 7 hours, and innumerable sail
changes, to make the 20 miles to Point Reyes. We took a first, natch, 
beating all the Express 37s at their own game. On Sunday, the course 
was 50 miles - including the Southeast Farallon to port!

One thing about light-air ocean races is that you get to observe the
wildlife which is usually obscured by the turbulent water. We saw
huge jellyfish with long brown tentacles, several sharks, dolphins
and lots of birds. As we slowly rounded the island, we had a great view
of the sea lion colony. There must have been 500 barking brown bodies,
tightly packed on a small flat area. In the very center of this mass,
a giant black male lording it over all. 

As the wind continued to die, we saw our competition motor past us
one by one. Finally, it was clear that we wouldn't be able to 
finish before the midnight time limit, so we cranked up the diesel.
Life is good.


Stefan Michalowski
stefan@sunrise.stanford.edu
From: zielke@FOZZIE.NRL.NAVY.MIL (David Zielke)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Bayliner myths: a challenge
Date: 3 Sep 92 13:26:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: fozzie.9209031326.AA28007
Distribution: na


alan@km4ba.uucp writes:

>But wood decks and stringers *will* rot, even if encapsulated in glass.
>(flex = hairline cracks.) Then your non 100% bailing cheap craft is building
>it's own problems. (I believe this was a bayliner issue.)

As a sailor having worked with foam, balsa, and plywood decks which have
been encapsulated in glass I would make a couple of observations.  

First: cored decks are often done as a weight saving process more than a
money saving process.  While this might not be the case for inexpensive
boats, it would mean that cored decks would go away on expensive boats and
they do not.

Second: I find that the primary reason for decks getting soft is improper
maintance.  I just helped a friend of mine rebuild the fordeck on an Irwin
28 because some bozo in the boats history had installed a couple of cleats
on the fordeck with no calk at all!!!  Deck hardware must be rebedded 
periodically, especially those which take high loads which change direction.

I would hazzard to guess that minor crazing or hairline cracks don't go all
the way into the core in most cases are not the primary cause of deck rot.


David Zielke
'Botany Bay'
Cal 35 Hull 006

zielke@fozzie.nrl.navy.mil
From: olson30@netcom.com (John Sully)
Subject: Rule 39 question...
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 92 05:09:16 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Summary: We beat 'em anyway
Keywords: Reach 39 slow boat


Hi,

While racing this weekend we had a little contretemps at
mark 'L' on a windward/leeward course.  

The race started with light winds in "stormy" conditions,
weak squalls coming through with shifty winds; when the
red flag flew the wind was about four knots and blowing
from about 200 deg.  During the downwind leg the wind
shifted to about 0 deg., thus turning the final beat 
into a reach.

At the rounding we (J/24) we closing quickly on a 
Santana 22 (different fleet), but were unable to establish
an overlap outside of the circle.  We both approached the
mark on a close reach, port tack, no overlap.

                  XT(hem)
                    U(s)
                  
 wind -->   
            next mark
               \/

We had too much speed to tack and duck behind them immediately
after the rounding, and they continued close reaching on port
tack for some distance after the rounding with us overlapped
to leeward, but without luffing rights.  

             U
             T  O(ther J/24 promising beer to "T")
 wind -->        X

          next mark
             \/

So, the question here is "did T violate rule 39's prohibition
on sailing below proper course?".  It was clear that the proper
course to the next mark was a reach on *starboard* tack and that
T was not obstructed or otherwise unable to assume proper 
course after the rounding.

By the time T tacked away to assume proper course to the mark 
O had passed us by virtue of being able to round and tack
immediately after the rounding.  BTW, this is all academic
because we were able to pass O once they decided that they
wanted to stage a luffing contest with us, if it hadn't been
for that I would be much more upset about this whole 
incident.

John
From: pavlov@niktow.canisius.edu (Greg Pavlov)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Bayliner Boats
Date: 28 Aug 92 20:24:21 GMT
Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208

In article <1992Aug19.025924.6577@phx.mcd.mot.com>, dbk@phx.mcd.mot.com (Dave Kinzer) writes:
> 
> He mentioned that I should have no problems with the hull,
> as his, a 21 foot Sea Ray, has up to eight inches of layed up fiberglass
> in stratigic areas.

  I think that either he was mixed up or that he saw a wood section encapsul-
  ated in glass.  The layup time required to produce an 8" cross section has
  to be phenomenal.  As far as I know, there is also no practical reason to
  do something like this anyway.  Why bother ?  


  pavlov@fstrf.org
From: zielke@FOZZIE.NRL.NAVY.MIL (David Zielke)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Jib furling systems
Date: 1 Sep 92 20:00:06 GMT

>The only reason I have seen not to get a furler is on my brother's boat (San
>Juan 24), which has two tracks in the front so you can raise two fore-sails at
>once (raise the storm/genoa, drop the genoa/storm) which is good of you are in
>a race, which he frequently is.  I don't know how you could rig a furler with
>that feature.

Actually most if not all large boat furling systems incorporate or have as
an option this feature.  Some even allow removal of the furling gear leaving
the foil available for racing without the extra deck clutter of the furling
gear.

>Anybody seen a boat that has a furler that doesn't get wrapped around the
>forestay?  I have thought about taking the forestay down, but that makes me
>nervous (don't ask me why).  Getting tired of bungying the forestay to the
>pulpit to pull it out of the way.

Again, the large boat (25' and up) furling systems normally have the
headstay inside the extrusion removing the problems of systems which 
are run on a seperate wire of their own.


David Zielke
'Botany Bay'
Cal 35 Hull 006

zielke@fozzie.nrl.navy.mil
From: heon@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (garry.j.heon)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Is transom exhaust worth while?
Keywords: transom exhaust ski power
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:55:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbfsb.1992Aug25.175529.15182
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

In article <1992Aug24.214739.2676@lgc.com>, rap@zycor.lgc.com (Robert Poldervaart) writes:
> I'd like to get some feedback on transom exhaust.  I've got a 205hp V6
> on a 19' V-hull boat.  I have some friends that can put transom 
> exhaust on it for relatively cheap (~$120).  I'm into performance 
> cars and know that free exhaust is better and I'm wondering how much it
> could help on a boat.  I like the sound of the V8's with the transom
> exhaust on the ski boats and bigger boats.  What do you think it would
> sound like with a V6.  I have the 4.3 liter Chevy motor with a 4brl carb
> and intake.  If you think it will help, where will it help? Hole Shot,
> mid range or top end?
> 
> I'm just always wanting more as far as performance.  My boat is ok now
> but I'd always like more.  This weekend I had 5 people (~750 lbs) in the
> boat and pulled up one slalom skier at 210 lbs.  I did have some
> help in that the skier was experienced and drank a little water
> getting up.  I had my 19" prop on.  
> 

Here's my experience with through transom exhaust.  I have Merc silent choice
on my 28' Baja whick allows me to choose between through transom (no mufflers)
and through prop.  This is a must in NJ since noise limits are enforced in my
area.  The boat is a 28' Baja with twin 502's spinning 27" props and I had the
dove tails removed from the lifting strakes.  The boat runs 4800 rpm with the
exhaust through the prop. If I hit the switch and bring the exhaust through
the transom (four pipes 10" long 4" diameter) the rpms climb to 5100.  In my
opinion I would not opt for only through transom exhaust unless you install
mufflers.  I don't know how much back pressure the mufflers would add and
change the results I've seen.  If you go without mufflers it will be loud
and annoying when you just want to take a "booze cruise" and talk with a couple
of friends.  Then again that's why the have hailers.........


******************************************
* MY OPINIONS.............AT&T's NETWORK *
* Garry Heon                     AT&T    *
* heon@cbnewsg.att.com       Holmdel, NJ *
******************************************
From: paulh@tekcae.cax.tek.com (Paul Hammer)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Depth Sounders
Date: 2 Sep 92 17:06:32 GMT
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

>The only problem i see with a transom mount depth sounder, is that it measures
>the depth of the bottom which you have just passed over.. Much like the QEII
>you might find out that there is a big hump that your boat will not clear,
>as your hull is being ground into the bottom....

Yes, but since the transducer is mounted to the boat someplace
you will not know about that lump until that part of the boat
is over it already anyway.

Still, the further forward the transducer is mounted, the more
you'll know about where you're going rather than where
you've been.

But for wanting to know whether you're in about 4 feet of water
or about 20 feet, etc., transom mounted ought to work fine.

-rcf
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: bennett@erich.triumf.ca (P.Bennett)
Subject: Re: unusual incident (was Re: Lobster Pot)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: TRIUMF: Tri-University Meson Facility
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 19:35:00 GMT

In article <STEPH.92Sep1112150@candide.uchicago.edu>, steph@cs.uchicago.edu (Stephen Wilson Bailey) writes...
>My understanding is the partners (why is it plural?) is where the mast
>meets the deck.  Does this only apply to keel stepped masts?  I get

In the olden days there were only keel-stepped masts, and the partners would be
the two deck beams fore an aft of the deck opening where the mast passes
through.

>I find it amusing how these four terms, pintles, gudgeons, partners
>and hounds, are frequently used in introductory sailing books yet
>never defined.  They are first rate examples of nautical gibberish
>words.
> 
>Steph
> 
> 
The CYA coastal cruising course discusses pintles and gudgeons, and there is
even an exam question on them!  The school I taught for used Cal-20's which
have outboard rudders using the aforementioned fittings, so we could point them
out to our students.

Peter Bennett VE7CEI                | Vessels shall be deemed to be in sight
Internet: bennett@erich.triumf.ca   | of one another only when one can be
Bitnet:   bennett@triumfer          | observed visually from the other
TRIUMF, Vancouver, B.C., Canada     |                          ColRegs 3(k)
From: steph@cs.uchicago.edu (Stephen Wilson Bailey)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Awesome sailing last weekend, huh?
Date: 3 Sep 92 20:42:32 GMT
	<1992Sep2.132426.18049@panix.com>
Organization: University of Chicago Computer Science

> Saturday. We also discovered that our heavy air jib is slower than a
> blown-out light air jib (even sailing short-handed) in 25 knots. Sorta

Don't take this as an insult, but have you really worked with the trim
of your new, heavier air sail?

I've found on Airwaves that we're really used to trimming in light to
moderate breeze, with our AP 1.  Earlier in the season, we've gotten
hammered whenever it was time for the #3, prompting excuses like
``This boat's just too heavy in the ends to do well in this stuff'' or
``That #3 is a dog, well, hey, it's 6 years old...''

Two problems we've found with heavy air trim, is that we've been way
oversheeting the #3, so there's absolutely no groove.  Our AP 1 gets
sheeted all the way to the fairlead (the clew's very low), so that's
gotten us into the habit of going ape with the sheet.  Second, when
we've got the smaller jib, we should have been able to really let the
main down, except that we hadn't been putting enough backstay (mast
bend) to really flatten the main.

Anyhow, we had pretty good speed in a blow this weekend, so I think
some of the tweaking we did helped, and maybe if you play with your
sails a bit more you can find a fast setup with the new sail.

Steph
From: jrm@gnv.ifas.ufl.edu
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Recomend good LORAN ???
Date: 27 Aug 92 03:21:42 GMT

Help ... I need to get a decent LORAN unit for someone as a gift, but
I am not especially familiar with the ones on the market. Their old
SITEX finally crapped-out after many years of good service - but is
that brand still worth the money ?

Anyway, I can blow $300-$400 (have discount place nearby) ... so can
someone give me an idea of what models yeild the biggest 'bang' for
the buck these days ? 

-- Jim Mason 
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: garnham@convex.csd.uwm.edu (David C Garnham)
Subject: winter storage
Originator: garnham@convex.csd.uwm.edu
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 10:44:30 GMT


I'd appreciate advice on proper storage of a new 17' I/O.  Should I pay $100
extra for inside storage, or settle for shrink wrapped outside storage with
separate battery storage?  Remember, this is Wisconsin where winters are
real.  Thanks.
-- 
| David Garnham                Internet: garnham@convex.csd.uwm.edu          |
| Political Science Dept.      Bitnet  : garnham%convex.csd.uwm.edu@INTERBIT |
| University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee      (414) 229-4392/4221                 |
| P.O. Box 413, Milwaukee, WI 53201 U.S.A.                                   |
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: jfh@cs.brown.edu (John F. Hughes)
Subject: Re: FAQ WANTED
Keywords: FAQ?
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 15:22:49 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.140509.23751@cbnews.cb.att.com> jbs@cbnews.cb.att.com (john.b.skiendziel) writes:
>
>		I was wondering if there exists a FAQ for rec.boats.
>	If there is a FAQ available, could someone please forward it
>	to me.  I'm particularly looking for mail order info and
>	sailing info, but all info is appreciated.

   I propose, with some diffidence, to become the maintainer of an FAQ for
rec.boats.  I know that I've annoyed some people over the years with my
slightly opinionated :-) postings, but I believe that I have some good basic
facts lying around, and I am always eager for more. As regulars know, about
once or twice a year I post my listing of boat suppliers anyhow...
   So....if someone else wants to maintain the list, let him/her step
forward---I'll happily step back. If no one else wants to do it, then I will.
If people generally think that an FAQ is a bad idea, I'll blow it off
completely. 
   And most important: if you have information that you think should be part of
an FAQ, please send it to me at jfh@cs.brown.edu. 
   Right now the info I plan to include is simply a list of suppliers of things
related to boating (principally sailing). I'd like to include other stuff like:

   Addresses of mailing lists (e.g. the Laser list)
   Addresses of class associations (Wayne knows the Catalina 27 one. Others?)

   Basic answers to questions like "Why stainless props are better/worse"
				   "Should I get a Doel Fin?"
				   "What's a good first boat for XXX?"
				   "What's it cost to own a boat?"

   A reading list---books about boating, books involving boating (e.g., good
novels), books about topics related to boating (e.g., the Pipefitter's
Handbook, beginning carpentry books, etc.), and magazines relating to boating.

   Information about taking up sailboat racing.

   Information about how to get a crew position on a racing boat

   Information about sailboat racing rating systems (PHRF, time-on-time,
time-on-distance).

   Information that motor-boaters want.


   I can handle a lot of the sailboat stuff myself. I know very little about
power boats. If someone who knows his/her stuff would be willing to help out
here, it'd be great. 

   Comments? 

   -John Hughes