HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fehr@ms.uky.edu (Jeff Davis)
Subject: Re: Recent Reading
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 15:59:51 GMT
Organization: Loose Affiliation of Millionaires and Billionaires and Baby

In article <1992Jul31.150017.12617@morrow.stanford.edu> francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir) writes:
>Jeff Davis writes:
>
>	While _Utz_ can be read straight up, the fact that Chatwin thought
>	he was dying of a rare and exotic bone disease which he contracted
>	in China turns the elegant, chilly themes of _Utz_ into something
>	a little more Purgatorial. 
>
>Did Chatwin think he was dying of a rare and exotic bone disease, or did he
>just say he was, or thought he was, dying of a rare and exotic bone disease?

Well, he died from a fungal disease of the bone marrow which he contracted
in China. Some say this was an offshoot of AIDS. I don't know. The
diagnosis was somewhat long in coming. For awhile he thought he had
malaria. There were remissions and relapses, it seems through the
last years of his life: he says that he wrote his previous book
_The Songlines_ sure that he was dying. So, I imagine that by the time
he wrote _Utz_ that his outlook was fairly bleak.

There is an amazing piece in _What Am I Doing Here_ about his friendship
with the film director Werner Herzog. He visited Herzog on location
in Africa to watch the shooting of Herzog's adaptation of Chatwin's
_The Viceroy of Ouidah_. Chatwin was so weak that he was carried around 
on a litter. Chatwin is often so dry and detached that even when he's
being polemical it's hard to react to him or hard to find out what
he wants you to react to. In the Herzog piece the comedy and pain
come through so clearly, that the one piece is worth the price of the
book. 
-- 
Jeff Davis <davis@keats.ca.uky.edu> Repeat after me:
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu (Roger Squires)
Subject: Re: Ahasuerus
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 00:30:42 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <9235@emory.mathcs.emory.edu> mworley@mathcs.emory.edu (Meg Worley) writes:
>In article <1992Jul26.170855.11833@athena.mit.edu>, kamorgan@athena.mit.edu (Keith Morgan) writes:
>
>> >Who is Ahasuerus?  There is no entry in 
>> >the Smaller Classical Dictionary, nor in the
>> >back of the Webster's Unabridged, so 
>> >I'm confident someone here will know.
> 
>> 	Check the Bible, i.e. Book of Esther. 
> 
>...there was another Ahasuerus as well, in the Book 
>of Daniel (obviously not Doctorow's), who was the son of Darius
>the Mede.  No doubt DLS was on intimate terms with him as well.
>

	As Mr. Siemon has pointed out to me (and see any book on the OT)
	Ahasuerus apparently is a Hebrew version of ArtaXerxes.
	The book I looked at identifies Ester's Ahasuerus with
	Xerxes I, which will ring a bell with all fans of Herodotus.
	And with this info it should be plain as the nose on your
	face :) who this 'other' Ahasuerus is...

> Meg Worley 				Internet:  mworley@mathcs.emory.edu		
Roger Squires
rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu
Xref: sparky rec.arts.books:13270 rec.arts.sf.misc:2258 rec.humor:24714 alt.folklore.urban:19950 alt.religion.kibology:3242
From: csquared@coos.dartmouth.edu (Christopher M. Cohen)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,rec.arts.sf.misc,rec.humor,alt.folklore.urban,alt.religion.kibology
Subject: Re: who was Sam Walton ( was When did Isaac Asimov die?)
Date: 28 Jul 92 16:27:17 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <Bs3vrE.52F@acsu.buffalo.edu> riawelch@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (K. W. WELCH) writes:
>In article <1992Jul27.055402.21928@nezsdc.icl.co.nz>, derek@nezsdc.icl.co.nz (Derek Tearne) writes...
>>In article <1992Jul23.210523.23111@sci34hub.sci.com> gary@sci34hub.sci.com (Gary Heston) writes:
>>>
>>>The saddest part about his death, though, is that he died the same weekend
>>>as Sam Walton, and $am got allmost all the press coverage. Wonder which one
>>>will be better known in 50 years?
>>>
>> 
>>OK who was Sam Walton?  Whoever he was I saw no coverage of his death.
>
>Sam Walton founded Walmart, the chain of discount department stores, and was at
>his death one of the wealthiest individuals in America.

Wow, he was actually AT his death!!
No kidding.

C Squared

--
I wanna be, I wanna be, Like KIBO!!!
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: gere@umunhum.stanford.edu (Susan Gere)
Subject: Re: C.S. Lewis  (Re: Jumping to conclusions in r.a.b, etc.)
Organization: Stanford University CSL
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 18:56:43 GMT

James Alexander Chokey writes:
>
  [ X_ian allegory analysis of LotR deleted to spare the innocent ]
>
  What you say is probably true, and I am going to willfully forget it
this minute.  I do prefer to take such reflection of authors' beliefs
in their works as emanating from some deeper part of the human psyche,
and add or form my own interpretations of the Meaning of Life unencumbered
by existing dogma whenever possible.  Tolkien thankfully does allow this.

>
> (Don't forget that Gimli becomes the first Dwarf ever to 
>journey westward into the Undying lands--  and it's said specifically that
>it is because of his love of Galadriel that he is able to make that journey.)
>

  Really-- and I would have said it was for his love of Legolas. But 
that opens up a whole 'nother realm of interpretation which I would
not be held responsible for.

:-)
From: galeana@nauvax.ucc.nau.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: STARWARS: The third volume  PLEASE
Date: 29 Jul 92 00:03:40 GMT
Organization: Northern Arizona University

I have read the first and the second volumes of the next starwars saga
Heir to the Empire, and Dark Force Rising.  Does anybody know when the third one
is coming out.  I've tried to call Bantam Books.  Someone gave me this number
1-800-223-6834, it rang 20 times and no answer.  Does somebody know any other
telephone numbers.
From: wnoe@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Bill Noe)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Upton Sinclair's _The Jungle_
Date: 23 Jul 92 04:24:53 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

regan1016@bestsd.sdsu.edu (T. ELIZABETH HARVEY) writes:

>Very true ... the scales are too heavily tipped.  When Juris's wife (I 
>forget her name) left him and became a prostitute, I felt someone should 
>either shoot the man, or put him back on the boat to Lithuinia (sic), 
>because his life had turned into an utter farce ...


This discussion of melodrama calls to mind my senior year of high school.  Our
English class read and discussed _The Book of Job_.  This was melodrama at its
finest (and also, from my experience, very troublesome for Christians...)  I
have not yet read _The Jungle_, though it has been recently added to my reading
list, but I suspect that its melodrama sha'n't compare to that of _Job_.

Any comments?


...B

-- 
wnoe@ecn.purdue.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"What a man thinks of himself, that it is which determines, or rather
indicates, his fate."					--Henry David Thoreau
From: jat@edsr.eds.com (Jon A. Turner)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: "Great" last sentences--The Lovecraft Connection
Keywords: fiction endings
Date: 23 Jul 92 15:19:28 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: EDS Research, Dallas, TX 75230

In response to my unspeakable blatherings, mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin) writes:

>You omitted my two favorites: Cyclopean and non-Euclidean.

It's worse than that--I forgot "unclean."

JT
From: agathos@ccs.northeastern.edu (Michael W Wojcik)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Young Adult Books
Date: 23 Jul 92 13:13:40 GMT
Organization: Comp. Sci. @ NU

In article <9207230224.AA12373@lib.uwo.ca> gardiner@lib.uwo.ca (Margaret Martin Gardiner) writes:
>Recently I read a book by Robert Westall called the Blitz Cat which is
>about the adventures of a cat, Lord Gort, during the the Second World
>War.  ...
>The Westall books are really interesting and 
>certainly pose a lot of questions on serious issues for a young
>person.  It is quite different from the pap I read when twelve years
>old.  Most of his books have won awards.  For anyone who is interested
>titles are:
>...
>	The Wind Eye

I found _The Wind Eye_ in the Children's section of Marblehead's public
library when I was 9 or so.  It was extremely impressive -- the character
development alone was outstanding.  What's more, the plot -- a monkey's-paw
about a family that finds a boat that travels through time -- was far more
intricate than most of the F/SF published for adults.  I never could
deduce what prompted the "Young Adult" (or "Children") label.  By the same
token, I first read a number of Patricia McKillip's books in the Children's
section, and some of the ones I own now claim to be YA, including the
Riddle-Master series.  I know I'm not alone in thinking of that trilogy
as adult fiction; it received quite positive reviews from Baird Searles in
_Isaac Asimov's Science Fiction Magazine_.  Actually, I've felt for a
number of years that the whole age-classification system was completely
bogus.


Michael Wojcik
-----------------
"Another chapter in my life is closed," said Anne aloud, as she locked her
desk.  She really felt very sad over it; but the romance in the idea of that
"closed chapter" did comfort her a little.
				-- L. M. Montgomery, _Anne of Avonlea_
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re:  Agnostics and Athiests
From: liam@durie.amigans.gen.nz (Liam Greenwood)
Date: 26 Jul 92 19:56:07 GMT+12
 <1992Jul24.062039.5500@cco.caltech.edu> <1992Jul24.163223.10400@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>
Distribution: world
Organization: It's Home, really...

In article <1992Jul24.163223.10400@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> spg@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Stephen P. Guthrie) writes:
>In article <1992Jul24.062039.5500@cco.caltech.edu> lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU writes:
>>
>>There's a big difference between not believing there is a god and believing
>>that there is no god.
>
>Well the predicate logic equations would be different, I can see that,
>but what is the practical difference? Seems the same to me.
>
    First case is  I'm unsure of the presence of a G(g)od, do you have some
    information which may help me decide.

    Second case is  There is NO God.

    The second case is the same as belief in God, opposite case ie there is
    NO doubt in the believers' minds.

    Me? I answer N/A to all religious questions on forms.
--
 Liam Greenwood ------ liam@durie.amigans.gen.nz ------ Wanganui, N.Z.
                Don't tell my Mother I'm a programmer,
              she thinks I'm a piano player in a brothel

Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
Subject: Re: help please, when did Isaac Asimov die?
Followup-To: rec.arts.books
Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
	<Brun1F.I7o@world.std.com> <BrupK8.82@ecf.toronto.edu>
	<1992Jul25.164740.13967@pony.Ingres.COM>
	<MICHAEL.92Jul26154203@paul.bu.edu>
Date: 26 Jul 92 14:18:00

I believe Asimov taught during his early years at Boston University
but relatively soon stopped being paid, because he switched entirely
to literature.
--
John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
*
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.

Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto)
Subject: Re: Jumping to conclusions in r.a.b (was Re: Revisited Classics &c.)
Organization: Yale CS Mail/News Gateway
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 16:19:27 GMT



Francis Muir writes:

        Susan Gere writes:

                As a new reader who was attacked by one of those mentioned
                in a manner similar to that explicated some time back, I
                award M. Taranto a standing ovation for his daring and
                incisive analysis:

                 C C  C C  C C  C C  C C  C C  C C  C C  C C  C C  C C
                  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l  l l
                   a a  a a  a a  a a  a a  a a  a a  a a  a a  a a  a a
                    p p  p p  p p  p p  p p  p p  p p  p p  p p  p p  p p !!

        Giving Mark the claps may not be his idea of fun...

But is is far better than giving aid to someone who is crabby.

The applause, as always, is greatly appreciated.

THE WATER-METHOD MAN by John Irving has a very funny scene involving the
clap.  It is also the best send-up of academia since LUCKY JIM.


Mark
From: kamorgan@athena.mit.edu (Keith Morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Saltgirl: Pulling a fast one
Date: 28 Jul 92 17:09:15 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

In article <1992Jul28.093755.21336@specialix.co.uk> kamal@specialix.co.uk (Kamal Mortoza) writes:
>I think there is just too much emphasis on performance, for instance, I very 
>often like to make my partner cum without actually having an orgasm myself,
>but this can be dangerous - because many women seem to have the attitude that
>you have to ejaculate in order to complete the act - so I find myself
>pretending (hard if you're a guy - but wearing a condom helps) just so she
>will let me off of her. So - you see - it cuts both ways.
>
>Kamal

Let's see - books - ah, Robert Ringer: _Winning through intimidation_
or _Looking out for number one_. Or, the novelization thread: _Dr
Strangelove_ with General Jack D. Ripper denying women his precious
bodily fluids. Or the Isaac Asimov thread: _Lucky Star & the oceans of
Venus_, or the agnostic/atheist thread: Nietzsche _The Will to Power_, or
(my favorite) the spoilers thread, no, no, this is inspired by Roger
Squires inquiries on the Conquest, right Kamal?


--Keith
From: kbrooks@ut-emx.uucp (kevin brooks)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Upton Sinclair's _The Jungle_
Summary: rhetoric of free thinking
Date: 23 Jul 92 23:38:17 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin, Texas

In article <1992Jul20.121313.9659@linus.mitre.org>, jartz@bassoon.mitre.org (John Artz) writes:
> In article <rauser.711422749@sfu.ca>, rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
> |>     Anybody who hasn't read this book, I highly recommend it as a fascinating
> |> study of propaganda. Sinclair was a radical socialist and his novel about
> |> a Lithuanian immigrant is so moving and so downright depressing that you
> |> find yourself thinking socialism _must_ be the answer...until you realize
> |> how unrealistic the novel is, and how your emotions are being manipulated.
> |> It is _very_ interesting to see this effect on yourself...
> 
> I read The Jungle in college and thought it was the most powerful novel
> I had ever read (and still do).  I didn't think socialism was the answer, but
> I definately felt that labor unions were, after reading the book.  Now I have
> to wonder whether or not I was just dupped by some slick propaganda.
> I can see how my emotions were being manipulated, but that was because
> I thought that the story was at least plausible, if not based on actual case
> studies.  Was the whole story just an improbable fabrication ??
> 
> 						John M. Artz, Ph.D.
> 						jartz@mitre.org

To the extent that Sinclair's book presses an issue it may indeed be perceived
as propaganda.  but, then, we may begin to label almost anything of substance
as propaganda.  thus, losing definition of the word.  

the point is that your indignation about Sinclair's manipulation of your
thoughts and emotions through his rhetoric is really quite meaningless since
anything you read will affect you in those ways.  ask yourself how you formed
"your" current opinions.  did you acquire them from "experience" as opposed to
reading them?  


                                                           
                                
regards,

kevin brooks



                                              
                                                 
                                          
                                          
                                                       
                            
                              
 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: trm@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Tara R. Marchand)
Subject: Re: Great last sentences
Keywords: fiction endings
Organization: Sacramento Public Access Unix, Sacramento, Ca.
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 92 23:42:23 GMT

In article <l+bm!6.troach@netcom.com> troach@netcom.com (Tom Roach) writes:
>I would like to know other reader's opinions on the most memorable
>last sentences in books, short stories, or whatever they've read.

Fumiko Enchi - _The Waiting Years_
"The shock was enough to split his arrogant ego in two."

-- 
 |-----------------------| "I've had days, and some were better, |------------|
 |     Tara Marchand     |         And some were worse,          | |--------| |
 | trm@sactoh0.sac.ca.us |      And some just like today."       | |--------| |
 |-----------------------|    -Two Nice Girls, "Only Today"-     |------------|
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: buckmr@marcus.its.rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire)
Subject: 1992 4th Annual Lambda Literary Awards
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 03:37:35 GMT



The results of the 1992 Lambda Literary Awards (4th Annual) follow:

Fiction
WHAT THE DEAD REMEMBER by Harlan Greene
THE GILDA STORIES by Jewelle Gomez
THE REVOLUTION OF LITTLE GIRLS by Blanche Boyd

Anthology
CHICANA LESBIANS: THE GIRLS OUR MOTHERS WARNED US ABOUT, Edited By Carla 
Trujillo
BROTHER TO BROTHER: New Writings by Black Gay Men, Edited By Essex Hemphill

Mystery
MURDER BY TRADITION by Kathleen Forrest
A COUNTRY OF OLD MEN by Joseph Hansen

Nonfiction
THE ZUNI MAN-WOMAN by Will Roscoe
CANCER IN TWO VOICES by Sandra Butler/Barbara Rosenblum

Poetry
AN ATLAS OF THE DIFFICULT WORLD by Adrienne Rich
THE ROAD BEFOE US: 100 Gay Black Poets, Edited By Assoto Saint

Science Fiction/Fantasy
THE DARK BEYOND THE STARS by Frank M. Robinson
THE GILDA STORIES by Jewelle Gomez

Gay and Lesbian Humor
PUTTING ON THE RITZ by Joe Keenan

Gay and Lesbian Small Press Award
GAY ROOTS: TWENTY YEARS OF GAY SUNSHINE, Edited by Winston Leyland

Gregory Kolovakos Award for AIDS Writing
TO THE FRIEND WHO DID NOT SAVE MY LIFE by Herve' Guilbert

Ferry-Grumley Foundation winners
THE REVOLUTION OF LITTLE GIRLS by Blanche McCrary Boyd
VANISHING ROOMS by Melvin Dixon






-- 
RON BUCKMIRE, 54 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735  ``D.C., April 25 1993''
uunet!rpi.edu!buckmr||buckmr@rpitsmts.bitnet||buckmr@rpi.edu||+1 518 276 8919
"No-one can make you feel inferior without your consent."--Eleanor Roosevelt.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,talk.religion.misc,sci.skeptic
From: rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu (Roger Squires)
Subject: Re: Spoilers - continuing discussion
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 03:39:18 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <BrrAEE.yz@watserv1.waterloo.edu> msmorris@watsci.waterloo.edu (Mike Morris) writes:
[...]
>Why should virginity be preferred to knowledge?
>

	A very good post.  I enjoyed reading it.

>
>Right now, I'm in the middle of Bernal Diaz del Castillo's
>history of the conquest of New Spain. This after having read Prescott,
>and Cortes' letters.
>

	I wish you would say more about these.  I'm reading a short
	history of Mexico right now, and while all these authors are 
	mentioned as being interesting, I'm wondering just *how* interesting,
	since apparently they are each composed of multiple volumes.
	Do you have time to post short reviews?
	
>            Mike Morris
>      (msmorris@watsci.uwaterloo.ca)

Roger Squires
rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: kj@nwu.edu (Kathy Johnson)
Subject: Re: Recommendations wanted for M.F.K.Fisher's books
Followup-To: rec.arts.books
Organization: Info Services, Northwestern Univ.
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 13:22:37 GMT

In article <4336@nttica.ntt.JP>, waynelui@nttica.ntt.jp (Wayne Lui) wrote:
> 
> From an article in a recent issue of Newsweek, it was mentioned
> that M.F.K.Fisher, who was a consummate writer on food, passed
> away recently.  It's a shame that I've never heard of her until
> that article.
> 
> I'd like to know more about her work.  As a starter, wonder which 
> book is considered to be her most representative work, and which 
> is the most well-known etc.  Would most appreciate the info.

I've recently read her _Long Ago in France_ about her days in Dijon in the
1920s when she was newly married to her first husband and setting up
housekeeping for the first time.  It's a short little book which almost
left me smelling and tasting the food and wine of Dijon.
 
Kathy Bates Johnson
Office of Information Services
Northwestern University
kj@nwu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir)
Subject: Re: Anglophily reigns at the new New Yorker
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:19:11 GMT

Joann Zimmerman writes:

	Francis Muir writes:

		I think that Tina from the Tatler must now be in command 
		at the NYer.  The veddy British cartoonist Ronald Searle 
		has done the cover for the July 27 issue. Gawd, it looks 
		like a reincarnation of Punch.

	Tina Brown is not due to officially take over at the New Yorker
	until October, according to the NYT.

Then the peasants must be practising sucking up.

	The New Yorker has run a number of Roland Searle covers in the
	past. Can one be currently adorning my fridge?

Searle tout seul I hope.

						Fido
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: kamorgan@athena.mit.edu (Keith Morgan)
Subject: Re: Spoilers - continuing discussion
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:51:42 GMT

Mike Morris writes:

>>Right now, I'm in the middle of Bernal Diaz del Castillo's
>>history of the conquest of New Spain. This after having read Prescott,
>>and Cortes' letters.

Roger Squires writes:
>
>	I wish you would say more about these.  I'm reading a short
>	history of Mexico right now, and while all these authors are 
>	mentioned as being interesting, I'm wondering just *how* interesting,
>	since apparently they are each composed of multiple volumes.
>	Do you have time to post short reviews?

	
I'm sure Mike will post some informative reviews: however, I will add
a quick and enthusiastic recommendation for Diaz del Castillo. I consider
this to be one of the great histories of all time. It took my breath
away. The descriptions of the march from the coast to Tenochtitlan, the
capture of Montezuma, and the sordid aftermath are wonderfully done.
No matter where one's sympathies are on the Conquest, Cortez still
accomplished an amazing feat of arms, diplomacy, chicanery and fraud.

What I love about Prescott is that despite his affinity for the
liberal notions of progress and civilization, there is a point in his
history of Mexico where the question of who the barbarians are becomes
quite ambiguous.

Finally, another interesting book is _The Broken Spears: the Aztec
Account of the Conquest of Mexico_ ed.by Miguel Leon Portilla. This is
a brief account, translated from Nahuatl, illustrated with scenes from
the codices, of the Aztec version of events. 
--
Keith Morgan		      | Just because your voice reaches half-
MIT Libraries                 | way around the world doesn't mean
kamorgan@athena.mit.edu	      | you are wiser than when it reached 
                              | only to the end of the bar. Ed Murrow