HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: higgins@fnalc.fnal.gov (Bill Higgins-- Beam Jockey)
Subject: Cryptobiosis for Hogu (was Re: Joe Haldeman:  Worlds Enough And Time)
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 23:22:06 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnalc.fnal.gov
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <1992Aug07.090152.28518@clarinet.com>, brad@clarinet.com (Brad Templeton) writes:
> I really like Haldeman myself, but there were two things that really
> bothered me about Worlds Enough and Time.

I'm surprised you didn't mention the "information disaster" that hit
the entire manuscript of the book.

Aboard the starship they have facilities for freezing people and
reviving them.

Throughout the book this is referred to with the words "cryptobiosis"
and "cryptobiology."

I had heard of "cryptobiology" but had thought it was a coined word
for the study of Bigfoot and the Loch Ness Monster.  It was
disconcerting to see it referring to low temperatures.  And I found it
jarring again and again as I encountered these words throughout the
book.

Is it too late to nominate for the Hogu Awards?  I think a Hogu should
be given to the person who substituted "crypto-" for "cryo-" in a
global search-and-destroy, er, search-and-replace.

(No, I don't think it was Joe.  Sure, he was guilty of the "bevawatt
laser" goof in his youth, but he wouldn't make a mistake like this
today... would he?  It's probably some innocent young copy editor
making last-minute changes.)

     O~~*           /_) ' / /   /_/ '  ,   ,  ' ,_  _           \|/
   - ~ -~~~~~~~~~~~/_) / / /   / / / (_) (_) / / / _\~~~~~~~~~~~zap!
 /       \                          (_) (_)                    / | \
 |       |     Bill Higgins   Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory
 \       /     Bitnet:     HIGGINS@FNAL.BITNET
   -   -       Internet:  HIGGINS@FNAL.FNAL.GOV
     ~         SPAN/Hepnet:      43011::HIGGINS
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: >>>>SEX<<<< and Tolkien
From: demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man)
Date: 14 Aug 92 13:09:18 EST
Organization: Demonic Possesions, Inc.
Summary: :) There, that should attract some attention!

In article <15129@suns6.crosfield.co.uk>, jc@crosfield.co.uk (jerry cullingford) writes:
> In article <1992Aug7.163218.18158@csi.on.ca> richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin) writes:
>>P.S.  Ever notice the distinct lack of sex in Tolkien's work?
> 
> Not all that surprising, since:
> 
> (1) The Hobbit, at least, was originally a story for children.
> 
> (2) When were they published? I think most of the LOTR stuff was published
> beack in the days when sex wasn't one of the normal ingredients.
> 
> (3) Sex isn't particularly essential to the plot.. Tolkein's stuff is good
> enough to sell without it..

	3) is the best reason.  Tolkien wanted to create a mythological type of
realm.  When was the last time you read something like: "Thor took the mortal
woman in his arms and pumped her full of molten lava..."

	Except in Larry Niven's "Man of Steel: Woman of Kleenex" :).

Brett                                                      
_______________________________________________________________________________
Proconsul Computer Consulting                                        CHA-CHING!
Better, Cheaper, Faster					       (Pick any two :)
Disclaimer:								   NOT!
From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (jerry cullingford)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Tolkien's characterizations (was Re: BOOKS BY DAVID EDDINGS
Date: 13 Aug 92 12:39:02 GMT
Organization: Crosfield Electronics, Hemel Hempstead, United Kingdom.

In article <1992Aug7.163218.18158@csi.on.ca> richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin) writes:
>P.S.  Ever notice the distinct lack of sex in Tolkien's work?

Not all that surprising, since:

(1) The Hobbit, at least, was originally a story for children.

(2) When were they published? I think most of the LOTR stuff was published
beack in the days when sex wasn't one of the normal ingredients.

(3) Sex isn't particularly essential to the plot.. Tolkein's stuff is good
enough to sell without it..

Interestingly enough, "Bored of the Rings" opens with a teaser scene
with an elf maiden that doesn't actually appear in the rest of the book.
Unfortunately, that's one of the few good bits of the parody :-(
(I wonder how many extra sales it created?).

[Yes, I _Know_ Tolkein didn't write BOTR. :-) ]

-- 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------+     |
| Jerry Cullingford  #include <std.disclaimer>     +44 442 230000 |   ,-|--
| jc@crosfield.co.uk (was jc@cel.co.uk) or jc@cel.uucp      x3868 |   \_|__
+-----------------------------------------------------------------+ \___/
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:11129 rec.arts.sf.science:2507
From: rolf@geoserv (Rolf Wilson)
Subject: Re: Bester & Banks
Reply-To: rolf@geoserv.isgs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 20:02:13 GMT

dac@prolix.pub.uu.oz.au (Andrew Clayton) writes:

>You may as well juxtapose _The Cat In The Hat_ and _Wuthering
>Heights_.

Get Harlan Ellison to write it, and I will buy it sight unseen...
-- 
Rolf Wilson     Illinois State Geological Survey    rolf@geoserv.isgs.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: mcconnel@Chaos.mcs.kent.edu (Mike McConnell)
Subject: Ron Goulart
Organization: Kent State University
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 18:25:24 GMT

For about eight years now, since I read the collection _Whatever Happened
to Screwloose_, I have been a fan of Ron Goulart.  He is a very quirky writer,
and his characters are often two dimensional at best, but on the other hand 
he seems to carry a consistent theme of alienation and a dark (never subtle)
humor.  I was wondering what other people thought about his work.

Also, if you can suggest similar writers, please e-mail to 
			mcconnel@mcs.kent.edu

Thanks

Mike McConnell
Department of Mathematics
Kent State University
From: u9161910@cs.uow.edu.au (Gareth William Omeara)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: HELP
Date: 18 Aug 92 03:37:36 GMT
Organization: Dept of Computer Science, Wollongong University, Australia

duvaljc@ere.umontreal.ca (Duval Jean-Carl) writes:

>HELP
>HELP

Thank you for this deep & meaningful contribution.I'm sure all readers
like me have had their dull and tedious lives enriched beyond comp-
rehension by you.

Gareth.



P.S. Hope Jean-Carl Duval doesn't take offence to my comments.
     I'm just being a smart-arse as usual.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: tedk@jpl.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Ted Ko)
Subject: Re: Recommendation on Fantasy Novels
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 17:49:03 GMT

In article <13226@texsun.Central.Sun.COM>, singh@tangerine_dream.Central.Sun.COM (Bhupinder Khanna Sun Cleveland) writes:

|> Some other books that are also good are:
|> 
|> 	Terry Brooks 5+ set:
|> 		Sword of Shanara
|> 		ElfStones of Shanara
|> 		Wishsong of
|> 		Druid of
|> 		Elf Queen of
|>

Don't forget Scions of Shannara.  That goes in between Wishsong and Druid.
IMHO, Brooks improved his writing and made the second bunch a lot more interesting than the first 3.  But I seem to remember something in the FAQ
about Shannara threads being played out so I won't start anything....

 

|> 
|> Janny Wurts/Raymond Feist also wrote a few books set in the Riftwar universe:
|> 		Servant, Daughter, and Mistress of the Empire.
|> 
|> If you would like any more detailed info, let me know and I can post it.
|> 
|> Singh
|

BTW, Daughter comes before Servant and it really helps to read those in order.
Reading Servant first sorta messed up Daughter for me....Definitely on my 
"read and read again" list, though.


-- 
Ted "Theodore" Ko  			E-Mail: ted@athena.mit.edu
						tedk@ctt.bellcore.com
From: ddb@tdkt.kksys.com (David Dyer-Bennet)
Sender: FredGate@tdkt.kksys.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Diane Duane-door Into Sunset
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 11:26:06 -0600

 Ci> Does Door into Sunset comes immediately
 Ci> after Door Into Shadow, or are there
 Ci> any books between the two?  I noticed
 Ci> that Door Into Shadow was (c) 1983, so
 Ci> there must be some books that I missed out.

There are no books in that series that you've missed.  However, if
you haven't read _So You Want to be a Wizard_, _Deep Wizardry_, and
_High Wizardry_ (which came out in that gap) then you've certainly
missed out.  

 * Origin: This tagline not to be removed under penalty of law (1:282/341.0)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: holger@vmars.tuwien.ac.at (Holger Reusch (Dipl. Gerhard + Joe))
Subject: Re: Author Polls -- Cordwainer Smith
Organization: Technical University Vienna, Dept. for Realtime Systems, AUSTRIA
Distribution: intergalactic
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 15:12:00 GMT

In <1992Aug12.180847.11023@highlite.uucp> yarvin@highlite.uucp (Curtis Yarvin) writes:
>When discussion comes round to the Golden Age, I often find myself
>wondering if I'm living in the same consensus reality as the
>rest of you blokes.  I haven't read much by Smith - an anthology
>or two - but everything I've seen has been, if an improvement on
>E.E. Doc, mindbogglingly awful.  Without exception.

>I wish I did like Cordwainer, really.  It'd be so pleasant being
>able to claim that the entire genre is going downhill without a
>paddle, not a decent jot written since 1953, overrun by decadent
>hacks, corrupted by capitalism & soiled by socialism, etc, etc -
>with a straight face.

>How do you all do it?  Perhaps I could convince myself through
>practice, devotion, and forced multiple rereadings of _The Skylark
>Of Space_?  Would a subscription to _Analog_ help?

Which Smith are you talking about?  There couldn't be two authors
more different than E. E. "Doc" Smith and Cordwainer Smith.  He
(Cordwainer Smith) was definitely not part of the Golden Age of SF.
I doubt that you read novels by him; maybe you got the name wrong?

-- 
| Holger Reusch                             |
| Technical University of Vienna, Austria <-+--- No kangaroos here,
| Dept. for Real-Time Systems               |    sorry!
| holger@vmars.tuwien.ac.at                 |
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman)
Subject: Re: Mote in God's Eye [SPOILER]
Organization: Oracle Corporation
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 23:25:22 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <1992Aug12.193637.14209@spss.com> markrose@spss.com (Mark Rosenfelder) writes:
>In article <1992Aug11.170046.16278@oracle.us.oracle.com> mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
>>Imagine a population of animals.  These animals have one natural
>>enemy - a small parasite that lives on the back of their necks.  If
>>the parasite is on their neck for too long they die.  They can't
>>remove parasites from their own necks because of the location so they
>>need others to do it for them.   Removing a parasite from another
>>animal's neck is safer than having it on your own neck, but there is
>>substantial risk of infection.  There are two varieties of this
>>species - altruists and nasties.  Altruists will remove parasites from
>>anyone's neck.  Nasties will not remove parasites from anyone's neck.

>>In this population Nasties will quickly eliminate the Altruists.
>>Then, depending on the virulence of the parasite, they too may become
>>extinct.  If evolution operated for the good of the species Altruists
>>would eliminate Nasties and the parasites would be exterminated.

>[Much irrelevancy deleted]

The part of the post which you deleted made it clear that I was not
talking about the prisoner's dilemma or about infanticide, but that I
was responding to someone who seemed to have the bizarre idea that
traits evolve depending on how good they are for the species.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am not an official Oracle spokesman.  I speak for myself and no one else.
From: coolidge@speaker.wpd.sgi.com (Don Coolidge)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Andre Norton's _Beastmaster_ (the book, not the (ugh) movie)
Date: 21 Aug 92 17:27:10 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

In article <jcmorris.714410358@mwunix>, jcmorris@mwunix.mitre.org (Joe Morris) writes:
|> In cleaning out my parents' house last week I ran across my original
|> Ace Double copy of _Beastmaster_ from the early 50s.  What I hadn't
|> remembered was that the cover clearly identifies it as "abridged".
|> 
|> Can anyone on the net tell me what parts of the story were left 
|> out when it was cut down to fit the Ace Double format?

Not really story parts, just additional scenes. It's been too
long for me to remember exactly which ones...

The version that's currently in print is unabridged, by the way.
I'd been looking for it for years; my first version was unabridged,
but was destroyed in an apartment flood in the late '60s. All that
was available to replace it at the time was the abridged version
(and in a single, not double, format). Happily, I now have them both.

Don Coolidge
coolidge@speaker.wpd.sgi.com
From: lgs57@cas.org ()
Subject:  Katherine Kerr's Polar City Blues
Organization: Chemical Abstracts Service, Columbus, Ohio
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 20:05:26 GMT

I recently read Katherine Kerr's Polar City Blues.  I enjoyed it very much.  I
especially liked the treatment of aliens and psychics.  Did anyone else read
it and what did you think?  Would you call it a suspense SF novel?
________________________________________________________
Linda Siemsen
All opinions expressed therein are solely my own and not those of my employer.
Current Book:  You Just Don't Understand: Women and Men in Conversation



Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: wang@ibma1.cs.uiuc.edu (Eric Wang)
Subject: Re: David Brin - What is he up to?
Reply-To: wang@ibma0.cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 20:27:11 GMT

jjfink@skcla.monsanto.com writes:

>The next Uplift book is called "Sooners" or "Souters" or something like
>that, and concerns colonists who start staking claims on a planet
>before the official land grab begins.  The title is supposed to reflect
>similar situations in the Oklahoma homesteaders.

No, Brin's next book, "Souters", concerns judges who start voting on
Supreme Court decisions before their official Congressional confirmation
hearings begin.  :-) :-)

(Sorry, this was just too tempting.)

Eric Wang
wang@ibma0.cs.uiuc.edu

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Go to alt.fan...we don't want you(was Re: rec.arts.sf.written FAQ)
Reply-To: aaron@space.ualberta.ca
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 17:24:02 GMT

dac@prolix.pub.uu.oz.au (Andrew Clayton) writes:
: In article <Bt8voI.Dz0@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, Eric Chris Garrison writes:
: 
: > In article <1992Aug19.181500.545@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca> aaron@space.ualberta.ca writes:
: > >Perhaps something that should be added to the FAQ is something akin to the
: > >following:
: > >
: > >"Many popular authors are not held in high esteem by most of the r.a.sf.w
: > >crowd.  In particular, coming out with positive comments about Piers Anthony,
: > >Anne McCaffrey, or David Eddings is likely to stimulate responses on the order
: > 
: > Look, this is a PUBLIC forum for discussing written science fiction
: > and fantasy.  Not just "real" SF.  Not just "classic" SF.  Not
: > just YOUR idea of what is good, not just what is MY idea of what 
: > is good.  I think it is awfully pompous of you to presume to 
: > decide what is not _real_ SF.  Why don't you create a newsgroup
: 
: Please, feel free to wax lyrical on your very special subject
: "Why I think Piers Anthony deserves to win every literary prize
: in existence, and then some." Or perhaps compose a heartfelt
: admission to the effect that you consider the _Gor_ series to be
: the most wonderfully accurate, true to life, 'SCIFI', that
: you've ever encountered.

I won't concede that(yes, I know I'm not Eric, but I >did< start this thread)
Anthony should win literary awards, but I don't think he's at the bottom of
the slime-bucket either.  And I found the first nine or ten Gor books mostly
readable...

: Admit to a fetish for Jack L. Chalker's never ending
: shape-changing series. 

I admit it.  I love Jack L. Chalker.  I have all his books.  I especially love
his Well World books, although the Quintara Marathon seems quite good from the
first book, at least.

: Go whole hog and put up in LARGE FRIENDLY LETTERS how WONDERFULLY
: INNOVATIVE you find Douglas Adams' work, especially the bits
: where he said he really liked using a Macintrash. [Whilst you're
: at it, you might put icing on the cake by admitting to owning a
: Mac :-)]

Douglas Adams' work >was< innovative when it first came out.  How much >light<
SF was being published when HHGTG was first published?

: I'll watch the collective r.a.sf.written reaction from a safe
: distance.
: 
: What Aaron stated is mostly true - formula authors are generally
: dismissed.

I'm not condoning the fact, just stating it as a sad truth.  Or, rather, there
are many popular authors who, rightly or wrongly, are dismissed as formula
authors.  Often, in r.a.sf.written, this is done in stronger language than
necessary.

--
---Alfvaen(a.k.a. Nysinra, rot13 Psycho)
"So you found a girl who thinks really deep thoughts
 what's so amazing about really deep thoughts"  -- Tori Amos
Current Album--Moody Blues:The Other Side of Life
Current Read--Henry David Thoreau:Walden and Other Writings
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: djdaneh@pbhyc.PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Subject: Dozois (was Re: Rating the Hugo Nominees)
Reply-To: djdaneh@PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 18:25:42 GMT

In article <1992Aug11.214448.4262@clarinet.com> brad@clarinet.com (Brad Templeton) writes:
>. . .Dozois, the man in many ways responsible for the
>trend away from hard SF. . .

A base canard, which should not go undisputed.  Gardner Dozois publishes a fair 
amount of (what I would call) hard SF:  that is, SF with strong speculative 
content and intelligently worked-out ramifications of the central conceit/idea
/whatever.  

What he does not publish much of is "traditional" hard SF -- that is, the sort 
of thing where character, plot, etc., all take back seat to the *I*D*E*A* and 
the gadgetry.

But then, there's no real reason for him to print it; ASIMOV'S's sister
magazine, ANALOG, still publishes a full magazine of this crud\d\u\r\c each and 
every frimping month.

		My baby is a Martian,
		What can I do?
		I'm in love with a giant insect,
		I got them Exoskeletal Blues
			-- Visual Purple

Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, Net.Roach
My opinions do NOT represent Pacific Bell,
Professional Development, or anyone else.
But I'm willing to share.
From: warda@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Bester Graphic Novel (Was Re: Bester & Banks)
Date: 13 Aug 92 17:29:23 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

> Due to recent discussion on the net, I picked up Bester's _The Stars
> My Destination_ the other day when I saw it at the library.  It was an
> interesting read, and does indeed hold its age well.
> 
> Comments?  Additions?  Arguments?

I once read a critic's comment to the effect that TSMD was effectively a 
"Jacobean revenge tragedy".  OK - what's a Jacobean revenge tragedy?

As an aside, a graphic novel version of TSMD has just been published.  This is 
the complete version (the first half was published some years ago, 
apparently).  Although the text has been judiciously pruned to fit, the 
graphics do seem to enhance the story, and I'm quite enjoying it.

   Bill Bennett                           JANET: warda@uk.ac.oxford.vax    
   CRC Growth Factors Research Group   Internet: warda%vax.oxford.ac.uk
From: ceg@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Chris Galas)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: What are the best fantasy books involving dragons?
Date: 16 Aug 92 05:25:07 GMT
Organization: People-Net [pnet51], Minneapolis, MN.

kwilliam@maclab01.seas.ucla.edu (William Kuan) writes:
>
>       Any recommendations on fantasy books involving dragons?

The books by Anne McCaffrey, such as _Dragonflight_, _Dragonquest_
and _The White Dragon_ are a very good starting point if your
interested in dragon novels.

Also _A Flight of Dragons_ (the author's name escapes me now) adds
a mechanical theory to why (some) dragons can fly.
 
Chris Galas
CEG@PNet51.Orb.MN.Org
From: ukiyo@mcl.ucsb.edu (Kiyose Ryu)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: What is Lackeys connection to Ren Faire?
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:42:13 GMT

I just finished reading her collaboration Knight_of_ghosts_and_shadows
In it she describes the Southern Renassaince Pleasure faire of a couple of
years ago here in the LA area.  I was wondering what connection to it she
had and wheither or not she still is interested in it since it moved to san
bernadino.  I work there as an actor and was hoping that she might still
go.

Dan sabath
ukiyo@mcl.mcl.ucsb.edu

All the Faire is a Stage
From: hachiman@milton.u.washington.edu (Matt Downer)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Epic fantasy novels
Date: 17 Aug 92 01:16:55 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <14213@mindlink.bc.ca> Crawford_Kilian@mindlink.bc.ca (Crawford Kilian) writes:
>I strongly recommend, to anyone with a taste for epic fantasy, going back to
>earlier work--pre-Tolkien, that is. For example, Lord Dunsany's fantasy short
>stories and vignettes (I still recall a lovely tale called "Lazy Days on the
>Yan," about a journey down a highly mythical river). Or Eddison's The Worm
>Ouroboros, with prose so purple as to fade into the ultraviolet. A Voyage to
>Arcturus, author forgotten, was nonetheless highly memorable.
>          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

	Um... David Lindsey????

matt
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: H. Beam Piper's "Fuzzies"
From: taia_a@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 04:52:41 GMT
Organization: Welligton City Council, Public Access.



 I have recently acquired some of H. Beam Piper's "Fuzzy" books.

 Notably "Little Fuzzy"
         "Fuzzy Spaiens (sp?)"
         "Fuzzy Bones"
         "Fuzzy People"
     and "Fuzzy Odysesy (sp?)".

 The last three are by other authors. Are there any others?

Thanks for your attention and possible assistance.

Tony Taia
 tai-shu@akeake.vuw.ac.nz, or TAIA_A@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: ogorman@unix1.tcd.ie (Lucifuge)
Subject: Re: What are the best fantasy books involving dragons?
Organization: Trinity College, Dublin
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 21:31:25 GMT

Ursula LeGuin's Earthsea. Incomparable. Especially the chapter in 'A
Wizard of Earthsea', "Pendor".

Ollie...

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written