HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Libucha)
Subject: Re: Demonstrate on Foreign Land Against Their Country
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 12:50:49 GMT

In article <4NOV199210564104@utkvx2.utk.edu> xic@utkvx2.utk.edu writes:
>I have this question to George Bush for a long time, but I did not post
>it since the compaign was still going on until last night.  It was not 
>fair to raise the question then, since I am not a US citizen.  Right now,
>it is over, so that I can post it. 
>
>During the compaign, George Bush told news media a number of times that he
>was not feeling comfortable if an American demonstrated in the foreign land
>against his country.  He said that if you like, you can do it in the front
>of the White House. Everyone knows that he was talking about Bill Clinton
>who demonstrated in England back in 1969 against Vietnam War.  From the
>result of the Election yesterday, it can be seen that most of the American
>do not care about it, and most vertern voted for Bill Clinton.
>
>My question is  what does Goerge Bush think about the demonstration of
>the Chinese Student in USA which is against the Chinese Government.  What
>is called a demonstration against a country.  I know there are some 
>difference between the demonstrations Bill Clinton participated and ours.
>But, somethings were common.  1. The government was wrong. Vietnam war
>was a bitter memory for most of American, and I know your feeling about the
>Beijing government.  2. The safty of the demonstration inside the country
>was not guaranteed.   Nobody will forget TianAnMen Square, and most people
>still remember what happened at the Kent University, Ohio.  
>
>I am not a politician, so that I can not find a good explaination to it.
>I would like to hear your idea.   
>

I posted this opinion before, so I'll try to be brief. Since this was raised
as a campaign issue in the U.S., I think "you" and "your country" mean
Americans and the U.S. So, I don't think Bush has any problem with the
Chinese demonstrating against the CCP in the U.S., just like Deng Xiaoping 
wouldn't have any problem with Americans demonstrating against the U.S. 
government in China.

Even if Bush did intend for his statement to be interpreted universally, I
think he's wrong. Is there a right and wrong place to protest mass murder?
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 10:02:34 EST
From: <XXX100@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Shame on you, godless Chinese!

 >From: gong@cs.uq.oz.au (Ming Gong)
 >Subject: Re: Shame on you, godless Chinese!
 >Date: 12 Nov 92 00:33:43 GMT
 >
 >In <1992Nov11.044613.13109@wam.umd.edu> shicheng@wam.umd.edu (Shicheng Jiang)
writes:
 >
 >>Shame on you, godless Chinese!
 >
 >>When you do NOT have God in your heart,
 >
 >>       you think blah blah your God;
 >
 >   It is better than thinking Juses Christ your God, who was a lier.
 >   He called himself the son of the God, but he was a man with some
 >   special abilities which were interpreted by himself as power
 >   authorited by God. This is the biggest lie in the history, today
 >   many people show the same abilities, like masters of Qi Gong (sort
 >   of martial art).
 >
 >   One more proof is that God creating mankind is nonsense. The Bible
 >   said that God created a man modeling himself. So God has all the
 >   organs a man has, but what his organs for, fucking air?
 >
 >   IF THERE WERE A GOD, HE SHOULD HAVE NO FORM!


                   I don't remember any organs of God mentioned in
                   Holy Bible.My poor memory.

                   No form is a form. Form is a no form.
                   I suppose you know a chinese proverb:
                   Wu2 Zhong1 Sheng1 You3,and
                   You3 Zhong1 Sheng1 Wu2.

                   In Holy Bible, human flesh was from mud.
                   The spirit was from the mighty's breath.

                   Just because of the breath, we have
                   free wills, which bring us to wherever
                   they want to be.


 >
 >>Shame on you, godless Chinese!
 >
 >   Sorry for you, who are taken in!
 >
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Libucha)
Subject: Re: Anniversary for the Halloween Tragedy in University of Iowa
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 12:30:54 GMT

In article <1992Nov09.005020.296305@sue.cc.uregina.ca> yan@mercury.cs.uregina.ca (Yongfei Yan) writes:
>>      2).  Mr. Liu's Article is extremely biased and distorted the truth.
>
>I understand that it hurts for you guys to even mention the incident,
>let alone write about it. However, I do think that the English media
>tried to distort ( at least hide ) facts and mislead the public a year
>ago. The implication of last year's English coverage is that we Chinese 
>student are inner-fighters who could turn out to be terrorists by an
>insignificant mishap. This stereotype is certainly not fair to us, and
>we should reveal the truth behind the unhappy incident to clear our
>name. Unfortunately, the only people who can clear our image are Chinese
>students in IU. 
>

I disagree that the Chinese students in the US have been stereotyped
as all potential "terrorists". The American public is so used to these
types of tragedies that the fact that that time it was a Chinese student is
largely irrelevant. I think you're being a little paranoid. I bet if you
did a survey thruout the whole country, more than 80% of Americans would
be totally ignorant of the entire incident, never mind recall the fact
that the murderer/suicide was from the PRC.

Mark

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: wshi@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Weiping Shi)
Subject: Re: [ answer ] How is IFCSS's president elected?
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 20:41:04 GMT

In <BxHB42.1IG@acsu.buffalo.edu> xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu (XiaoFei Wang) writes:

>The election precedure of the IFCSS president is VERY similar to 
>the US president election. 

I see. So an IFCSS-like structure
is what you guys want for future China.
From: hlu@eecs.wsu.edu (H.J. Lu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Chinese, Are you Jealous?
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:37:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: serval.1992Nov6.193758.12476
Distribution: usa
Organization: School of EECS, Washington State University

In article <1992Nov6.172540.4717@athena.cs.uga.edu>, fang@athena.cs.uga.edu (Yi Fang) writes:
|> Referring to the famous term 'Rubber Stamp'
|> We have to admitted that in china, there is no true voting right for
|> the people.
|> Problem is wether the voting right so admirable. 
|> If you have right to vote, others also, you are not in an advantage
|> position to others.
|> If you don't have, others either, all people are still equal.
|> If voting system so good, we could accept it in the future when the time comes.
|> If not, we could be proud of ourself from now on.
|> In China, if you follow the trends, I think you have enough opportunity to
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That is why China has some many tragedies. Unfortunately, I am among those
who just don't know how and like to just follow the trends. I'd like to
follow my heart.

|> succeed in the society, everybodyelse also, that's equality. Ofcourse

That is a shame.

|> one's family backgroud is also important in China, but in USA also.
|> 
|> 
|> Yi Fang

H.J.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: s9874203@titan.ucc.umass.edu (s9874203)
Subject: Re: Lu's Tragedy 
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 15:31:52 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.183309.1@iowa.physics.uiowa.edu> wnf_222@iowa.physics.uiowa.edu writes:
>In article <1992Nov11.152801.504747@sue.cc.uregina.ca>, yan@mercury.cs.uregina.ca (Yongfei Yan) writes:

[some argument exchanged between Yan and Feng deleted]

It seems to me that this topic is becoming another inner fight. We
Chinese students are not strong. Inner fights make us weaker. Unite,
fellows. Please.

H. Yang
From: XXX100@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Questions, History lovers
Date: 5 Nov 92 06:10:05 GMT
Organization: Penn State University


 >From: Tuya@ccmail.uoregon.edu(Tuya)
 >Subject: Questions, History lovers
 >
 > (deleted)
 >          2.  Li3 Bai2 writes:
 >
 >              1 qi2 hong2 chen2 fei1 zi3 xiao4
 >              wu2 ren2 zhi1 shi4 li4 zhi1 lai2
 >
 >              ( A pi3 fu1 rides in red dusts and the emperor's wife
 >                   smiles,
 >                No one knows the lichi is coming)
 >
 >              Who is the wife, the emperor, the pi3 fu1, and where is
 >              the lichi from?
 >


                         Here wu2 ren2 means wu3 ren2 (person called
                         wu3, actually Ms. wu3 ze2 tian1).
                         The poet hesitated to call Ms. Wu3 directly.

                         So it should be " None but Ms. Wu3 knows
                         .....". That's why Fei1 Zi3 smiles.


                         The verses were unlikely by LiBai.

                         Hard to find this kind of verses in LiBai's.
                         Completely different style.

                         In a TV show, LiBai had affare with Ms. Wu,
                         though.
                         It's just funny.
                         Some say that's true.
                         So I feel more fun of "Guei4 Fei1
                         Zui4 Jiu3". The wine must have been some
                         like "Tai4 Bai1 Jiu3"(James mentioned
                         in his post a few days ago).

                         James mentioned a verse " Jiu3 Bei1 Yao1
                         Ming1 Yue4" by LiBai.
                         I'm afraid that if the affare was true,
                         the Ming1 Yue4(bright moon) should be
                         Ms.Ming Yue, actually Ms. Yu4 Huan2.
                         ......


                          X Xu
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 11:41:36 EST
From: <PXW10@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: What a joke! (Re: Chinese, Are You Jealous?)
 <1992Nov13.041004.15246@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca>

In article <1992Nov13.041004.15246@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca>,
yu@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Fan Yu) says:
>
>In article <BxMp65.8ML@Novell.COM> Cheng_Yang@Novell.COM (Cheng Yang) writes:
>>I was reading the following article and found it was very amusing.
>>Is this a typical example of American education?  Let's count how many
>>grammar errors there are.  Who's stupid, anyway?
>
>This is more like a random sequence of letters created by a computer
>than a post written by an American with access to internet.
>
>Fan

That guy could be a new immigrant.

I just hope it is not that he thinks most readers in this group could only
read/write such English articles.

Peter

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: chen@caen.engin.umich.edu (Jian Chen)
Subject: Schedule for Chinese Government Delegation Visit
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 92 10:34:26 EST
Organization: Department of Chemistry, University of Michigan, Ann Arbor
Distribution: usa


                    Schedule for Chinese Government Delegation
                    Visit at University of Michigan, Ann Arbor


=====================================================================
12:00pm, Nov. 8, Sunday

   Arrive at Ann Arbor. 

12:00pm --- 3:00pm, Nov. 8, Sunday

   Lunch and rest.

3:00pm --- 6:00pm, Nov. 8, Sunday

   Meeting with Chinese Students. 

   Location:        Lee Laccoca Hall
                    G. G. Brown Building
                    North Campus
                    University of Michigan
                    Ann Arbor, Michigan

6:00pm --- 8:00pm, Nov. 8, Sunday

   Dinner

8:00pm --- 11:00pm, Nov. 8, Sunday

   Movie: Qing1(Clean) Liang2(Cool)  Shi4(Temple) 
          de Zhong1(Bell) Sheng1(Sound)

   Location:       Lee Laccoca Hall
                   G. G. Brown Building
                   North Campus
                   Univerisity of Michigan
                   Ann Arbor, Michigan

   The delegation will be Waiting for Chinese 
   Students visit in their hotel.

   Location:        Hampton Inn
                    Green Road near Plymouth Road
                    Ann Arbor, Michigan

=================================================================
          
Morning, Nov. 9, Monday

    Meeting with Vice President of University of Michigan
    and director of International Center. Visit Central Campus
    and North Campus.

Afternoon, Nov. 9, Monday

    Visit Ford Motor Corp. 

Evening, Nov. 9, Monday

    Dinner at UM Chinese Students home.

=================================================================

10:00pm, Nov. 10, Tuesday

    Leave Ann Arbor.

=================================================================


                                           Jian Chen

                                         On behalf of
                                      Chinese Student Union
                                     University of Michigan
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
From: ron@wc18.yorku.ca (Ron Sheese)
Subject: Re: China's economic struct... an analysis
Followup-To: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Organization: /writer/wcfac/ron/.organization
	<1992Nov10.203955.22943@eng.ufl.edu>
	<1992Nov11.055119.8605@athena.mit.edu>
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 05:25:29 GMT

Good discussion.  Some of my own points...  And number of paragraphes
are deleted for shortness.

### On Wed, 11 Nov 1992 05:51:19 GMT, joe@athena.mit.edu (Joseph C Wang) said:

JOE% That's the irony of the TAM demonstrations.  There was a working
JOE% coalition between intellectuals who thought that the reforms were not
JOE% far enough and the workers and low-level party officials who thought
JOE% they had gone too far.  Meanwhile, the people (mostly farmers) who
JOE% thought that the reforms were just right, sat back and did nothing.

	The intellectuals were wanting more political liberty which is
the ruler's fear that China may lose control and stable.  The
intellectuals thought that was a real chance to bring China into
democracy and prosperity.  And I don't think the workers thought the
reform had gone too far.  They just hardly endure the really bad
side-effect of reform (which came from mysterioty ;-) and any greatman
can solve it?) and need a remedy.  As for farmers, ha ha, you are
right, I believe.

JOE% If the government had not intervened, the TAM movement may have likely
JOE% fallen apart within a year, because it was a coalition of people with
JOE% fundamentally different interests.  The problem is that the government
JOE% overreacted, and instantly destroyed its own credibility and
JOE% legitimacy.  There is nothing that the student movement did in the two
JOE% month it existed that justified sending in tanks and killing people.

	From the example of ex-Soviet,  I have to think if TAM
movement had been successful, would China be like current 15
republices?  The chinese government at that time was dominated by
stupidity.  They might be scared and running to their final resorts.

JOE% I think you are forgetting something about economic reform.  A lot of
JOE% people lose from it.  This not only includes high government
JOE% officials, but also includes common industrial workers, who are scared
JOE% of losing their lifetime jobs and facing a new world of possible
JOE% unemployment and inflation.

JOE% While economic reform benefits China as a whole, we have to look
JOE% carefully at the costs of reform and have sympathy for those common
JOE% people who are hurt by it.  If we don't do this, we run the risk of
JOE% adopting an economic policy which is not connected to reality and
JOE% having a repeat of the Great Leap Forward.

Right.  Part of the reasons why TAM movement was so prevalent with
workers is it did concern the worker's interests.

Sigh...Chinese reform is such a great and difficult balance.

Glory to China,

--ming
--
This a non-colourful .sig like me.  people hate to be usual.
ming he		ron@reader.yorku.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)
Subject: Re: A joke (in ping2ying2)
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 01:50:38 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.223405.24273@news.acns.nwu.edu> Carl__@nwu.edu writes:
>In article <Bx9Dvy.FF4@ulowell.ulowell.edu> cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)  
>writes:
>> 2000 Nian2, Zhai4 Yi1 Ge4 Gie1Shen1Shi3 Li3, Ye1 Ge4 Mei3Li4de Mei3Guo2 Yin1
>> Er Lai2Dao4 Ren2Gian1. Tu1 Ran Da4 Ku1 Qi3 Lai2: Fan4 Xia4 Wo3, Shong4 Wo3
>> Hui2 Qiu4. Wo3 Bu4 Xiang3 Huan2 Guo2 Zhai4!
>
>Why don't you use English. Let me translate it for you (my English is not very  
>good though).
>
>In the year 2000, a beautiful American baby comes to the world. Suddenly,  
>she/he cries loudly: Let me go back! Put me back in! I don't want to pay the  
                      Put me down! Send me back!
>national debt!
>
>Carl
>
>P.S. Mr. Shi, if you don't like American, you don't have to be so "implicit".
No! Just a little privacy. Want no flames!
From: lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Good Good Study, Day Day Up!
Date: 10 Nov 92 01:29:28 GMT
Organization: Boston University

In article <BxH7A0.MK2@acsu.buffalo.edu> xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu (XiaoFei Wang) writes:
>(deleted)
>From your poor translation, I can see that your English is 
>horse horse tiger tiger. 

Your English is shave shave - scream, be careful, XiaoFei:-) BTW, I have
invited you to serve as English tutor on line, how about that?

--
From: cf379@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (J. Alan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Interested in Homosexuality in China
Date: 10 Nov 1992 05:52:30 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


I'm doing research on this subject.  I would be interested
to receive views from a wide variety of people on this subject.
 
I promise not to reveal any information about anyone who
responds (no matter what your views or experiences).
 
Thank you for your cooperation.

J. Alan
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re:Some questions.(Re: Be a respectable chinese....)
From: <XXX100@psuvm.psu.edu>
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 23:00:37 EST
Organization: Penn State University

 >From: yu@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Fan Yu)
 >Subject: Re: Some questions. (Re: Be a respectable Chinese. Zi Zun, Zi Ai.)
 >Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 15:51:19 GMT
 >
 >In article <1992Nov6.182922.1371@src.umd.edu> jsxie@eng.umd.edu (Jingshong
Xie) writes:
 >>>  (deleted)
 >>
 >>BTW,human brain is a bio-super-parallel-computer which basicly consists of
 >>about 1 trillions neutrons,maybe the most complex thing in this universe .
 >                   ^^^^^^^^
 >       1 trillion  neurons
 >       >10^(23)    neutrons

              10**23 neutrons?
              No, not large enough.
              10**23 neutrons weigh about 1/6 grams.
              Maybe their energies are high enough to
              make up the needed.

              X Xu
From: cheng@cisa1.cis.uab.edu (Wai-Fong Cheng)
Subject: Asia Cup Results
Originator: cheng@cisa1
Organization: University of Alabama at Birmingham
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 17:17:58 GMT

Any info. regarding to the latest results of Asia Cup is 
very encouraged to be posted!

Have Fun!

###########################
# A fan in Heart of Dixie #
###########################
From: gao@griffon.bu.edu (Yong Gao)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: IBM's Hiring Policy, Info needed
Date: 12 Nov 92 14:49:26 GMT
Organization: Boston University

Hi,
        Does anyone know IBM's hiring policy for foreign nationals, especially
those from mainland China? One of IBM's department wants to hire me, but
the personnel people are not sure whether they can hire me because my student
visa status. I heard that some Chinese students did get hired by IBM, but I
don't know any specific case.  Any advice and/or information will be greatly
appreciated!

        Yong Gao
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:29799 talk.politics.china:2540
From: lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china
Subject: Re: Chinese, Are You Jealous?
Date: 6 Nov 92 20:53:35 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.china
Organization: Boston University

In article <BxAwMF.679@cs.psu.edu> echeng@phys.psu.edu (Eddie Cheng) writes:
>In article <100796@bu.edu> lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li) writes:
>(deleted)
>	Now you may have touched an interesting concept: "experimental
>voting right", but I am not sure what it meant.  :-(

Instead of an accurate definition, let me give an example I mentioned in
my post, the one in 1966. 1) It was granted by higher authority. "16 Tiao"
called for Paris' Commune style of free election. 2) It can be revoked
by higher authority. Jiang Qing said "Lenin said 'Truth is frequently in
hands of the minority'". Then the results of such elections were gone with
wind - in fact not wind, but fire and blood.

The key problem I identified in that election, is the loser in election
did not respect the results. So Jiang Qing and her gang could easily
use them to make another movement.
>(deleted)
>National election has to be built on a
>matured system and electorate at local level.  I doubt it
>would do China much good if we suddenly have the right to
>directly elect President today, except for psychological ones.
>But if we could have wide interest and participation in
>all the local level elections, things may change fast.

Agreed. Democracy is not only a slogan for power struggle, people
need to get used to it, respect the result no matter one likes or not.

By my understanding, Xiaolin Li's point is our voting system is far
from desired. Eddie's point is we need to practice, learn and upgrade
it graduately. I take both and hope more:-)
-- 
The SOS China Education Fund is a non-political, non-profit and independent
organization to raise money promoting the education in rural China. All donations
are tax-deductable. Make checks or money orders payable to: "SOS China Education
Fund"; c/o Jie KANG, 2610 E. 5th Pl, Apt. 1, Tulsa, OK74104, USA.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: shicheng@wam.umd.edu (Shicheng Jiang)
Subject: Re: Be a respectable Chinese.  Zi Zun, Zi Ai.
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 00:43:51 GMT

In article <BxBHqy.6z9@nic.umass.edu> usys@titan.ucc.umass.edu (CLARENCE J MAZIARZ JR) writes:
>
>
>      #        ##########          #   
>       #       #        #          #   **
>        #      #        #     ############
>   #     #     #   #    #          #
>    #     #    #   #    #          #
>     #         #   #    #          #
>      #        #   #    #     ############ 
>       #       #   #    #          #
>        #      #   #    #          #
>                  # #              #
>       #         #   #        ############
>      #         #     #            #    
>     #         #       #            #
>    #         #         #            #   
>   #         #           #            # 
>  #         #             #            ###
>
>
>
Poor Boy, do you know more things than this character? If not, it is really
for you, because you don't what're your rights, you only know obeying your
your master. I feel ashame that you are human being too.

--Shicheng
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china