HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: adamg@lemming.csd.sgi.com (Adam Ginsberg)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Maximum Interconnect Cable Lengths?
Date: 5 Jan 93 20:25:02 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

On Jan 5, 10:06am, Bob Neidorff wrote:
> Subject: Re: Maximum Interconnect Cable Lengths?
> It is mostly a function of the receiver output impedance and the
> cable capacitance.  Figure 30pF per foot of capacitance.  A filter
> with a corner frequency of 30kHz is potentially a problem.  For
> 50 feet (1500pF), that calculates:
>
> 	F = 1 / (2 pi R C)
>
> 	R = 3537 ohms.
>
> If the output resistance of your receiver is less than 3000 ohms,
> you will PROBABLY not hear enough difference to matter.  I say
> PROBABLY because there are also people who claim to hear lots of
> things that I can't hear.
>
>-- End of excerpt from Bob NeidorffHello there,

>-- Excerpt from Werner Ogiers@imec.be
> there is no DANGER in using long interconnects, but of course the sound
> may suffer a bit. When you have a good driver stage, long cables will
> work just fine (e.g. good preamp such as the Krell KBL to a power amp
> 30ft away). Tape-out plugs on receivers are normally not connected to
> a decent driver. Just try it, if the sound gets muted and derobbed of
> treble, try inserting a (home made) buffer amp based on a decent opamp
> or so...
>
> Werner
> Student computer science
>----------------------------------

Werner & Bob,

Thank you for your replies - I will look up the specifications
for both receivers and see if the output resistance is ~ 3000ohms...

I spoke to a few other technical people who confirmed there
should be no DANGER with long interconnects, but I could
get "muddy" sound.

thanks again...

adam
Keywords: 


-- 
Adam Ginsberg	internet: adamg@csd.sgi.com    phone:415/390-5228
MTS, CSD Technical Education	Silicon Graphics Computer Systems
2011 North Shoreline Blvd, 12L-170, Mountain View, CA  94039-7311
From: fmaster@ravel.udel.edu (Fred A Masterson)
Subject: Re: speakers for classical music
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 16:29:01 GMT

In article <gmaltby.55.726743096@unpcs1.cs.unp.ac.za> gmaltby@unpcs1.cs.unp.ac.za (Gavin Maltby) writes:
>In article <43291@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> wsun@jeeves.ucsd.edu (Fiberman) writes:
>
>>For all the experts out there:
>
>>If money were no object, what speakers are the best for
>>listening to classical music?
>
>>-fm
>
>Try Apogee Centaurs (Minors are very good value).  They are a hybrid
>cone/ribbon.  The ribbon is very smooth in the mid-range and treble---
>perfect for classical (and vocal too).  The familiar cone sound in the 
>bass makes an excellent impression, too.  If you want more expensive,
>then bigger Apogees (Caliper Signatures are excellent) and Duntech
>Sovereigns are brilliant.
>
>Cheers
>
>Gavin

The Apogee Centaurs are wonderful speakers, particularly for classical
and jazz.  But hell, if money is no object, why fool around?  I'd spring
for the Apogee Grands!  And one needn't worry about renting
a derrick to hoist these 650 pounds apiece monsters into the house...
I believe the $75,000 list price includes free installation by Apogee.

      Fred
   

-- 
Fred Masterson				fmaster@ravel.udel.edu
Psychology Department			Fred.Masterson@MVS.udel.edu
University of Delaware			gnm00666@udelvm.bitnet
Newark, DE 19716 USA (302 831 2575)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Learning Remotes with a touch sensitive 
From: KJeffery@kcbbs.gen.nz (Keith Jeffery)
Date: 9 Jan 93 19:45:45 GMT
Organization: Kappa Crucis Unix BBS, Auckland, New Zealand

In a message, Neil Gardner made various requests of a learning remote..
  
Have you considered the Pioneer CU-AV200?
It has an LCD screen with 8 keys and lots of other keys, including the
0-9 keypad you require for most things. As I recall, the LCD keys can be
programmed for various sequences. The LCD itself can also be completely
redefined. Each key can have up to 7 definitions etc etc.
Also, every key is fully defineable and it comes with keydefinitions for
much Japanese equipment built in. It cost me NZ$250 which should equate
to about 70-80 pounds....
regards..
From: kirk@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Kirk Lindstrom)
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 06:38:29 GMT
Subject: Re: audio amplifier book
Organization: Shredding the water of SF Bay, HP-OCD
Newsgroups: rec.audio

>Does anyone know of a book that goes into the details of audio amplifier
>design?  I've looked in book stores and libraries with no luck thus far.  
>I'm specifically interested in class B (and class AB - I don't even really 
>understand what a class AB amp is).  Maybe there's some FAQs out there too?
>
>Jeff Glover					ME?
>----------
This month's Stereophile gives a multipage bibliography or list of
technical books for almost all aspects of music reproduction.  There
were probably a dozen books listed for amps.

Kirk out
Newsgroups: rec.audio
From: "herb chong" <herb.chong@channel1.com>
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: nakamichi 700
Date: 10 Jan 93 01:17:18 EST
Reply-To: "herb chong" <herb.chong@channel1.com>
Distribution: rec
Organization: Channel 1 Communications

HL>In any case,  do you hard-core audiophiles have any advice on this 
subject.
HL>Are there newer cassette decks that will play these tapes of mine with
HL>comparable quality to the Nakamichi 700?

you need another Nak. i don't know about the newer ones, but Dragon, RX 
series, and BX series might meet your needs. you'll have to get them used 
though, except maybe the Dragon. i have a 700ZXL myself. superb deck.

the reason you need another Nak is that they actually followed the 
standard equalization curve out well beyond 20kHz while eveyr other 
cassette deck manufacturer fudged on the EQ curve to get the kind of 
response that a Nak could deliver. the net effect is that tapes made on a 
Nak sound dull on other machines and tapes made on other machines played 
on a Nak sound too bright.

Herb...

--- WinQwk 2.0 a#314
--
Channel 1 (R)   Cambridge, MA
From: andrew@alice.att.com (Andrew Hume)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: How can different digital cables sound different?
Date: 12 Jan 93 07:07:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.24593
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill NJ

In article <13814@grayt>, grayt@Software.Mitel.COM (Tom Gray) writes:
> I've designed DAC's and ADC's, I've designed Schmitt triggers, capacitive
> peaking circuits and Manchester decoders, PLL's ,jitter buffer, clock
> extracters, Manchester decoders, Manchester encoder's, clock and frame
> synchronizers.
> 
> It isn't brain surgery. 


	just the person i've been waiting for. lets pretend you are
designing an AES/EBU decoder (the receiver on the DAC side of the
digital link). how would you design the PLL, and how much jitter
does it have? keep in mind you have to cope with 32kHz, 44.1kHz
and 48kHz, and you have to capture within the 4 bit preamble.
(i'm not trying to embarress you; it would be instructive to see
what the answer is!)

		andrew hume
Newsgroups: rec.audio
From: porsche@cv.hp.com (John Milton)
Subject: Re: noise reduction
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.9 PL6]
Distribution: rec
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 02:31:25 GMT

Aamir Hafeez Qazi (qazi@csd4.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
> In article <1992Dec18.1501.14590@channel1> "herb chong" <herb.chong@channel1.com> writes:
> >WI=>What are the differences (qualitatively) between Dolby C noise
> >  =>reduction and dbx noise reduction?  I have them both on my home tape
> >  =>deck.  I'm considering buying a new car stereo, and I want to get one
> >  =>with the best noise reduction (out of the ones that my home deck
> >  =>supports.)
> >
> >i don't think you will find a car stereo with dbx has ever been made.
> >also, Dolby C car decks are few and far between. make tapes for the car
> >with Dolby B unless you have an extremely quiet car.
> 
> --It's true that you probably won't find a car stereo with dbx noise
>   reduction.  If you want one with Dolby C, get a Denon.  I had one for
>   a while, and was extremely pleased with it.

Actually, Alpine made a car deck with dbx noise reduction but that was
several years ago.

(I'll sell you mine if you'd like. ;-))

John Milton
porsche@hp-pcd.cv.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.audio
From: kega@nobeltech.se (Kent Gabrin)
Subject: Re: MiniDiscs -- What Are They?
Organization: NobelTech AB
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 13:34:02 GMT

In article <C0pB24.GB@unix.amherst.edu> ljnelson@unix.amherst.edu (LAiRD j. NeLSoN) writes:
>I guess I missed the boat on this one...
>
>Can somebody either (re)post the differences between Philips' DCC and Sony's
>MiniDisc formats, or mail me such a posting?  As I remember, DCC is 16 bit
>but 32kHz and compressed to within an inch of its life.  I *thought* MiniDisc
>was slightly more accurate, but after reading about various benchmark tests,
>it sounds like that's not the case.

   There is no fixed sampling frequency in DCC or MD. Most of the
machines should be able to use 32 kHz, 44.1kHz and 48kHz at least when
feeding them with digital input.

One major difference is that DCC has a 'compression' ratio of 1/4 and
MD has 1/5. They use different technique when they divide the signal
into frequency sub band to decide what bits, level, frequency to be
omit in the recording.

...Deleted stufff..

Regards Kent

Kent Gabrin   NobelTech Systems    ! My thinking is not as great as
S-175 88 Jaerfaella      Sweden    ! Oliver Berendinus Bumble /Will Try
KEGA@nobeltech.se ! DAT owner and is still waiting for DAB to transmit.
From: cj164@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jeff Ryan Glover)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Sony STR-790 *problems*
Date: 6 Jan 93 04:22:47 GMT
Reply-To: cj164@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jeff Ryan Glover)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, ptg2351@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Panos Tamamidis) says:

>adamg@lemming.csd.sgi.com (Adam Ginsberg) writes:
>
>>According to the salesman at a local Mid-Fi store, the standard
>>SONY line is supposed to shut down whenever the speaker impedance
>>drops down below 8 ohms.  If you wanted a SONY that could handle
>>lower impedance, then you'd have to spring for the SONY ES line.
>
> Never trust a salesman!! He/she wants you to buy a more expensive product.
> Now, since SONYs can handle two pairs of 8 ohm speakers, then two pairs of
> 8 ohms speakers connected with this receiver will be like having two 
> resistances in parallel.  This will give a total resistance of 4 ohms!!
> Which means that regular SONYs can handle impendances lower than 8 ohms.
>
>>-- 
>>Adam Ginsberg	internet: adamg@csd.sgi.com    phone:415/390-5228
>>MTS, CSD Technical Education	Silicon Graphics Computer Systems
>>2011 North Shoreline Blvd, 12L-170, Mountain View, CA  94039-7311
>
> Panos
>

Not so.... the STR receivers run the two sets of speakers in series when they 
are both on at the same time, for an impedance of 16 ohms.
-- 
----------------------
Jeff Glover					ME?
cj164@cleveland.freenet.edu                  	 P.C.?
eaeu188@orion.oac.uci.edu			    NNNOOOTTTT!!!!
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: How can different digital cables sound different?
Date: 5 Jan 93 20:42:29 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation

In article <C0Dv8v.CJM@fulcrum.co.uk> igb@fulcrum.co.uk (Ian G Batten) writes:
>
>But the error correction used by the CD drive or DAT machine has been
>done long before the bitstream is passed over an SPDIF or AEU/EBS
>interface.  There is no error correction on that link.
>
   So it DOES rely on implementors staying WELL within the
   boundaries of good design.  [Usually analog stuff the digital
   techies tend to ignore.... >:-)  ]

>More importantly, there is no clock.  The clock for the DAC is recovered
>from the SPDIF datastream.  
    
    Nothing inherently wrong with this.  Token Ring does exactly the
    same thing.  How well the receiver can recover the data depends
    on the level and rise time...and how this varies with data
    pattern.   Within the boundaries this is easily 10 -12th or
    better.
From: kludge@grissom.larc.nasa.gov (Scott Dorsey)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: MiniDiscs -- What Are They?
Date: 6 Jan 1993 03:54:56 GMT
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center and Reptile Farm
NNTP-Posting-Host: grissom.larc.nasa.gov

In article <1992Dec22.130442.13947@spider.co.uk> colint@spider.co.uk (Colin Tinto) writes:
>
>
>OK, OK, I boobed...
>
>I thought that since both MD and DCC use lossy compression algorithms they
>may have been the same.

What, you want standardization?  You have to be joking.

I currently have two DCC machines and one MD machine on the test bench.
Subjectively, the DCC units aren't half bad.  There are some artifacts,
but you have to listen for them.  The quality of the A/D stages on one of
them is dreadful, but I am using my reference converters for all
of the testing.

The MD machine is awful.  It's really bad.  It's got a noise floor that
pumps, even.  You can do better with a good cassette deck.  The numbers on
it aren't even any good: the high frequency response is flat at very high
levels, but when it drops down 1/2 MSB, everything above 10 KHz goes away.
Very strange.  I think I'll pass on this one.
--scott

I'm still hanging on to my DAT machine in the meantime.
Newsgroups: rec.audio,rec.video
From: larson@loren.net.com (Alan Larson)
Subject: Re: Selecting an LD Player
Organization: none
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 01:59:26 GMT

In article <24562@alice.att.com> andrew@alice.att.com (Andrew Hume) writes:

>	i think it has been made clear on rec.audio before,
>but let me say it again. we know digital communication either
>works or it doesn't; but almost all such devices ONLY have to
>recover the bits. DACs need to also recover an accurate clock,
>and that is something very few computer interfaces do.

  No, there is no 'clock' to recover.  The bit demodulation from
the surface of the cd must provide the clocking to recover the
bits, but it needs to match the rotation of the disc, not the
signal sent to the DAC.  That signal is buffered and sent with
the accuracy of a crystal reference.

  There is no need to probe that all transports are the same.
If they deliver the bits, at the right rate, from a stable
reference (the crystal), the results will be the same.

	Alan
From: shetline@bbn.com (Kerry Shetline)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: How can different digital cables sound different?
Followup-To: rec.audio
Date: 6 Jan 1993 16:36:11 GMT
Organization: BBN
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com

In article <1993Jan6.151540.16595W@lumina.edb.tih.no>, ketil@edb.tih.no
(Ketil Albertsen,TIH) wrote:
> Maybe you didn't hear my sarcastic voice... If the part of the signal
> chain chain following the digital cable (DAC, amp, speakers ect.) is
> not changed, the sound produced depends solely on the input. For a 
> digital signal, the input is nothing but 0s and 1s having no other
> qualities than being 0s and 1s. If the same 0s and 1s come from two
> different sources, but are the same 0s and 1s, the input to the
> DAC/amp/speakers is identical. Unless the phase of the moon has
> some effect on the electronics, the sound will be identical, too.
> At least if analyzed by neutral means. I mean, this is a fact -
> you can't argue a fact.

Well, obviously people like those you mention below do. (Sigh.)

> Then comes a certain group of audiophiles, saying like that scientist
> a while ago (I'll find a reference to the source if anyone cares!):
> "Yes, I know it is a fact, but at the moment I prefer not to take it
> into consideration".

Of course, most would not admit that they were ignoring fact, but rather
that what they think they can hear is a higher fact, and that your "merely
theoretical" arguments have little or nothing to do with the "real world".
They ignore that in the "real world" hearing is probably the most
subjective of the senses, and easily mislead by expectation -- in normal,
sane people. I know that I've heard changes in sound that were "in my head"
and not "out there". I understand why, and that admitting this is no big
blow to my ego or an admission that I'm ready for the looney bin.

Not understanding the technology makes it easier. There is much more room
for "magic" that way. But sometimes I think partial understanding is even
more dangerous. Yes, sometimes a 0 that is supposed to be 0 volts is 0.2
volts, and a 1 that is supposed to be 5 volts is only 4.7, but that does
not change the way digital devices respond to the information. Bits are
still bits. This is the kind of thing, however, that some people will try
to attribute nonsensical claims to.

-Kerry
From: rmf@bpdsun1.uucp (Rob Finley)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Lexicon CP3 crossover-digital/analog?
Date: 6 Jan 93 04:49:25 GMT
Organization: Harris Allied Broadcast Div., Quincy, IL

Lexicon:
On the CP-1, the sub channel is well done using a pair of op-amps.
(A lot of what goes on inside the CP-1 is done in analog, there
are only two single-channel D/A chips.)   Remarkably, it doesn't
detract from the overall quality of the unit.

Works for me.


The CP-3 looks interesting and unique as few (any?) decoders provide
the side channels like the Lexicon family.


Hmmm.  Anyone upgrade from a CP-1 to a CP-1plus?

Robert
Newsgroups: rec.audio
From: kolding@cs.washington.edu (Eric Koldinger)
Subject: Re: BMG 800 number?
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 93 21:23:32 GMT

In article <1993Jan1.092607.17954@netcom.com> daniel@netcom.com (Sam Daniel) writes:
>jlee@leland.Stanford.EDU (Joseph Chee-Yoon Lee) writes:
>
>>I thought I once saw a posting that said there is an 800 number for BMG.
>>Could someone please re-post?  Also, is it still possible to ask them
>>to assume that I do NOT want the monthly selection so I don't have to
>>send that silly card in every month?  Thanks in advanced,
>
>As far as I know, the 800 number has been discontinued, probably to
>save money because it got too popular.

I just got a survey from BMG, and one of the questions they asked was about 800
numbers (do you want one for customer service, rejecting/ordering disks, etc).
Now if only they'd act on what they're told.

-- 
    				|   Eric Koldinger
    Your tax dollars at play.	|   University of Washington
	 			|   Department of Computer Science
				|   kolding@cs.washington.edu
From: gmaltby@unpcs1.cs.unp.ac.za (Gavin Maltby)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: CD/LD jitter: I certainly do get it! (Was: Kerry doesn't get it...)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 11:45:43 GMT
Organization: Uni Natal
NNTP-Posting-Host: pc038.cc.unp.ac.za

In article <24545@alice.att.com> jj@alice.att.com (J. Johnston) writes:
>From: jj@alice.att.com (J. Johnston)
>Subject: Re: CD/LD jitter: I certainly do get it! (Was: Kerry doesn't get it...)
>Date: 4 Jan 93 15:39:06 GMT

>>A simple way is to use a good transport...
>Why?  The way to do it right is to use a good DAC.  As long
>as the transport gets the bits right, it shouldn't matter.
>If you find it does, it's your DAC that's responsible,
>and THAT is what you should examine.
>-- 

Hi,

I mentioned this in another post:  the Wadia X32 comes with 2 chips,
the Rok Lock chip for very high quality transports (eg, its partner
the WT3200) and a standard chip for pedestrian transports.  The former
will not tolerate timing errors in the signal---it won't even lock in 
to a number of cheaper combo players (eg NAD 5425, 5440).  
So what `bits' is the NAD getting wrong?

Cheers

Gavin
From: desmondw@merrimack.edu
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Subs : M&K, Velodyne, or Museteax?
Date: 7 Jan 93 09:49:50 GMT
Organization: Merrimack College, No. Andover, MA, USA

In article <3340359@hpcc01.corp.hp.com>, kirk@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Kirk Lindstrom) writes:
>Hi, I'm looking forsome help in choosing a good, versatile, powered
>subwoofer. The price range is in between $1000-$1500. Some models
>I've looked at so far are:
>                            1. Velodyne F-1200  ~100 watts    $1095
>                            2. Museatex(sp?) sw-12  ~250 watts $1099
>                            3. M&K (various models above $1000
>
>I haven't done a lot of listening. WhatI need to know is :
>
>                  1. How much power is enough? (everyone says Velodyne's
>                                                are underpowered)
>

> ----------
> You are buying speakers so you have to let your ears be the final judge.
> You didn't say what you wanted to listen to with them or what other
> electronics and speakers you'd be running them with.

Yeah, I guess I was a bit vague. What I meant by versatile was that I
like too listen to a lot of different types of music(rock,classical,
easy listening) as well as watching movies. I have a Technics A/V 
Reciever SAGX 710 now but plan on going the separates route soon.
The speakers are Boston Acoustics T-1030's($1000/pr). I want a sub
that will be of use if I decide on getting a THX system in the future.
Newsgroups: rec.audio
From: pcw@flutter.tv.tek.com (Patrick C. Wilkins)
Subject: NAD, company status
Organization: Tektronix TV Products
Distribution: na
Date: 4 Jan 93 11:30:08

Someone posted an article recently about a rumor that the company NAD may 
be going out of business. I had to order a service manual for a NAD product 
the other day so I asked the parts clerk about the rumor. To his knowledge, 
NAD was not going out of business, the company was well, although there 
was some restructuring over a year ago.
--

-------------------------------------------------------------------
    Pat Wilkins II
    A.K.A. Clif
    Email pcw@flutter.tv.tek.com
    Work 503-627-6525

-------------------------------------------------------------------
    Is Deja-vu real or is life just redundant???????
-------------------------------------------------------------------
From: chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com (Chris Christensen)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Surround speakers--Out of phase vs. tradit
Date: 11 Jan 93 19:49:18 GMT
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1993Jan7.180742.3596@gvl.unisys.com> garyp@rmtc.unisys.com 
(Gary Palangian [RMTC/ISP]) writes:

>The questions are particularly intriguing for those of us
> who own dipole radiator surround speakers.  All of these
>have two drivers facing away from each other with one of the
>drivers wired 'out of phase'.  So does this mean they simply swapped
>a parallel set of wires from the speaker connection plate within
>the enclosure?  Or is there some additional work (like within some
>passive electronics) to augment the speakers?

The speakers in a dipole are "simply" wired out of phase.  There is no
network needed or desired.

-- 
Chris Christensen                  The opinions I express are my own,
chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com            and sometimes they are wrong!
916-478-3419 FAX 916-478-3887      After all, I *AM* only human.
From: tbs@prcrs.prc.com (Tim Sheehy)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Compact Disc Player
Keywords: Magnavox CDB 614
Date: 5 Jan 93 22:31:52 GMT
Distribution: dc
Organization: PRC Realty Systems, McLean, VA

I have a Magnavox CDB 614 single player for sale.  The unit is 
in perfect condition with original box and manual with remote.
Asking $125.00. If interested, please call (703) 437-1195 after
7pm or anytime weekends.