HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jaeger@buphy.bu.edu (Gregg Jaeger)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: humming Stockhausen
Date: 22 Nov 92 14:10:42 GMT
Organization: Boston University Physics Department

In article <1992Nov22.005054.8831@math.ucla.edu> pugh@pico.math.ucla.edu (David Pugh) writes:

>I must admit I don't know much Stockhausen. I rather liked Stimmung. The
>stuff I know are the piano pieces which I think were called Piano Pieces I,II
>etc and I don't remember anything hummable in them.

>How is Karlheinz doing with his day of the week operas?

I think they are moving along on schedule (though I don't know which day
was performed most lately). His recording of them seems to be slow,
however. ECM just released (I don't know _how_ recently however) a solo
piece derived from "Thursday..." called "Michael's Reise" which is for
trumpet and bassoon. At least Montag has been completed...


Gregg




-- 
Gregg Jaeger (jaeger@buphy)  Dept. of Physics (and Philosophy), Boston Univ.
"You see, the quantum mechanical description is in terms of knowledge" -Peierls
"One can _not_ put the psi-function... in place of the... thing" -Schroedinger
                "You may _not_ touch my monkey" -Dieter
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: art30248@nusunix1.nus.sg (NG LING LING)
Subject: Harnoncourt's Beethoven
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 02:03:07 GMT

Wow, I just burnt a MAJOR hole in my pocket in buying the Teldec
Nikolaus Harnoncourt cycle of Beethoven Symphonies with the European
Chamber Orchestra.

Two points: not a truly "period" authentic orchestra
but a very clever period-style performance with modern instruments.

It's five mid-priced CDs, the first four are 70mins each (1 & 3, 2 & 5,
6 & 8, 4 & 7) and the 9th is by itself.

I dunno, I felt that the popular ones (3,5,6,9) were run-of-the-mill
performances. (But they were really good for a `live' recording...i.e.
one take)

But just listening to No 2 and No 7!!!! Humdinger!!!! The very best.
Really.

I also got Glenn Gould's 1958 Goldberg (new re-issue on SONY), will talk
about that next time.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel)
Subject: Re: Adagio for Strings
Organization: Visual
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 12:18:02 GMT

rob lawrence dorocke writes:

>The EMI recording with the St. Louis Symphony and Leonard Slatkin is 9
>minutes long.  The sound quality is GREAT (DDD) and also includes his
>3 essays, Ov. to School for Scandal, and Medea's Dance of Vengeance.
>Highly Recommended!!

This release is an essential purchase for anyone who likes Barber.
A friend of mine who's a composer is presently studying the score for
Medea's Dance of Vengeance, and maintains that it's an underappreciated
masterpiece at evocative sexuality.  

For me, the plum is the series of Essays for Orchestra.  Each is 
different from the others, but equally rewarding.  

Slatkin's Barber First Symphony is also marvelous.

Rob



Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: finostro@renoir.die.udec.cl (Francisco Inostroza)
Subject: Re: MOZART HELP PLEASE!
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 15:01:25 GMT
Organization: Universidad de Concepcion, Concepcion - Chile
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Gabe M Wiener (gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu) wrote:
: In article <7536.382.uupcb@travel.com> brad.dekoter@travel.com (Brad Dekoter)  writes:
: > 
: >1. What year did Mozart die? 
: 
: 1791

December 5th, 1791

: >3. Who wrote the "Elvira Madigan" theme? 
: 
: I don't know the theme, so I can't help you here.
It's the 21st Mozart's Piano Concert...

------------------------------
  Francisco Inostroza M.
  Universidad de Concepcion
  finostro@renoir.die.udec.cl
  finostro@halcon.dpi.udec.cl
From: ronthal-adam@yale.edu (Adam Ronthal)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Bassoonists?
Date: 17 Nov 1992 00:35:06 -0500
Organization: Yale University Science & Engineering UNIX(tm), New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu

In article <1992Nov15.024745.23059@scott.skidmore.edu> awattenb@scott.skidmore.edu (abby wattenberg) writes:

>I feel very alone in this world where half the population has
>absolutely no idea about music other than rock and the remainder feels
>that they are experts on the orchestra but can not distinguish between
>the oboe and bassoon.  

I often feel the same way. <sigh>  And what really gets me is when people
arrive to concerts late and just barge right in with no respect for either
the performers or the other members of the audience.   However, I've recently
begun to usher a few concerts and I can now do something about this. :)
Bassoon?  I don't play that... I _do_ play french horn though.

Adam

-- 
   /|\  /|~\   Adam M. Ronthal BR'94    |    ronthal-adam@yale.edu	
  /-| \/ |_/   P.O. Box 607 Yale Stn.   |    ronthal@minerva.cis.yale.edu
 /  |    | \   New Haven, CT   06520    |    ronthal@pop.cis.yale.edu

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ss6349@tyr.albany.edu (Steven H. Schimmrich)
Subject: Question on Bach's 'Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring'...
Followup-To: rec.music.classical
Originator: ss6349@tyr.albany.edu
Keywords: J. S. Bach
Organization: Department of Geological Sciences, SUNY at Albany
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 22:36:56 GMT


   I have a few simple questions about the piece 'Jesu, Joy of Man's
Desiring' by J. S. Bach.

   1. What is the title in German?

   2. What year was it written?

   3. Where can I read more about the piece?

   I tried the University library here and checked a dozen books on Bach and
NONE of them had this piece listed in their index!  I had thought it was a 
cantata but I couldn't find it in lists of the cantatas.  Is it a section
from a larger work?  Thanks.

--
Steven H. Schimmrich     Department of Geological Sciences         "Non semper
ss6349@csc.albany.edu    State University of New York at Albany   ea sunt quae
ss6349@albnyvms.bitnet   Albany, New York 12222  (518) 442-4466   videntur."

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: hellerS@moravian.edu (sjh)
Subject: Re: Advice on Prokofiev piano sonatas?
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 09:24:04 EST

In <92322.110947MHUGHES@MIAMIU.BITNET> <MHUGHES@MIAMIU.BITNET> writes:

>I want some advice on Prokofiev piano sonatas on two fronts:1. Of all the sonatas, which are the 3 or 4 most popular or most worthy
>    of note in the repetoire?

IMHO, ALL of them, but I'm sure that's not the answer you're looking for.
The ones I've heard programmed most often are (apx. most -> least order) #3
(1 movement, fairly short, one of the least demanding performance and
listening-wise (but not that easy)), #2 (large, 4-movement work, lots of
interesting material, not as hard as some of the latter ones), #7 (3
movements (1: fast, fiendish; 2: slow, sadly lyrical, poignent;
3: electrifying toccata in 7/8 - great crowd-pleaser), #8 (one of the
really great works of the literature, should be performed more often). One
of my favorites is #6, a massive work that is probably the hardest for a
typical audience to appreciate, but has some of P.'s boldest strokes and
inspiration. And the lovely, nostalgic #9 almost never gets performed for
some reason.

> 2. Which are the most respected/recommended recordings?
 
 A lot of people like Gyorgy Sandor's recordings, but I'm not all that
 crazy about them myself. I personally recommend a set of 3 CDs by Barbara
 Nissman on Newport Classics very good overall, with intricate anaylsis and
 indexing in the extensive booklet. This set also includes "Visions
 Fugitives", "Sarcasms", the ever-popular "Toccata" and more. Of course,
 this is not the only option in recordings, but I like it.

 Steve
From: jamesc@bassclar.Eng.Sun.COM (James Langdell)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Music to calm down by
Date: 20 Nov 1992 18:26:42 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Distribution: world
Reply-To: jamesc@bassclar.Eng.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: bassclar

Deb Schwartz, das@voodoo.boeing.com writes:
>At work these days, I seem to be in a constant state of stress, and have
>been thinking that some soothing music might help greatly.  I love classical
>music, but don't have a whole lot of exposure to it.  I would greatly
>appreciate recommendations for music that has a calming effect.

There are some inexpensive classical anthologies put out by CD labels
such as LaserLight specifically for relaxation or meditation.  I've not
picked up any myself, but the selections seem pretty well conceived
for this use.  If you find any individual pieces particularly relax
you, there's more where that came from.  These discs tend to be 
available even at record stores that don't carry much in the way of
classical recordings, so they're pretty easy to obtain.  (Don't want
a difficult search for rare CDs to add to your stress level...)

There's another series of recordings, with titles such as Adagio, Andante,
Largo, of classical music selected to sustain the moods associated
with a tempo.  These are less widely distributed and more expensive.

I'd also second a recommendation of Delius's orchestral music.  There's
a single CD or tape collection on Seraphim of his music conducted
by Beecham that I've turned to for relaxation over the years.

Classical guitar recordings may also hit you right.  Avoid Flamenco
in this situation, though.

--James Langdell       jamesc@eng.sun.com
  Sun Microsystems     Mountain View, Calif.


Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: jdg+@CS.CMU.EDU (John Greiner)
Subject: Re: Pictures at an Exhibition
Organization: Carnegie Mellon University
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 17:31:38 GMT

As noted, Ravel arranged the familiar orchestral version.  However, there's
a BIS disc that had a completely different orchestral arrangement done by some
Scandanavian composer around the same time.

jg
From: gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: tonality and modern music
Date: 18 Nov 92 20:23:31 GMT
Reply-To: gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor)
Organization: Heurikon Corporation, Madison, WI

>Well, there's an Egyptian 5-equal scale, for what it's worth.  Also,
>many musics use supersets of the diatonic scale or something like
>it.  See India, for instance.

One also finds seven-equal scales in the music of Thailand.
(or sort of. I've never really discovered
whether or not the scale is derived as an aliquot system by using a
flute bored at equal intervals, or whether the origin of the system
lies elsewhere. However, there does rather seem to be some debate on
whether or not it's really an equal-seven system or not from Helmholtz
on down....



--
-The world exhausts everything except my eyes/because it is a long walk to the
world/begun before I was born. In the far corner/the dead woman bows off stage
The television/crumples into a white dot as the last/train of the evening - my
train, is announced/I lived in one place. I want to die in another 608-828-3385
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Subject: ugh, ugh, ugh.
Organization: University of Western Ontario
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 01:11:59 GMT

On the subject of my antipathy to Rachmaninoff in general, Rob Holzel 
writes "even the Symphonyic Dances." Yup, Rob--even the Symphonic Dances. 
I will say though that I harbour some respect for the Etudes 
Tableaux--great pieces. Most of the rest leaves me pretty cold. For my 
tastes too sloppy, repetitive and redundant.

Oops--it's not Symphonyic Dances. A strange Freudian slip. Can't edit 
once it's written.

r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: bseymour@encore.com (Burch Seymour)
Subject: Need Solo Vocal Music Suggestions (Bass, church)
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 18:20:13 GMT

I need to find some books of solo songs that can be used in a 
Presbyterian worship service setting. I am a bass, my best range
is in 2nd bass area. I'm just getting started as a soloist, so
I need things of moderate difficulty that I can use to build a
repetoir before I move on the more ambitious stuff. Any pointers
to books of "gerneral purpose" collections, that are worth obtaining,
would be appreciated.

E-mail replies preferred. Will post summary if there seems to be enough
interest.

Thanks,

-Burch Seymour- bseymour@encore.com
====================================================================
From: Bill_P_Pearce@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Musicians rubbishing composers !
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 92 21:44:11 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Nov20.191834.8419@newsgate.sps.mot.com>

   In article <1992Nov20.191834.8419@newsgate.sps.mot.com> David G. Wong
asks when the first performance of the Tchaikovsky Violin Concerto took
place.  The world premiere of the concerto was in Vienna on December 4,
1881, with Adolf Brodsky as soloist and Hans Richter conducting.  It
was panned by Eduard Hanslick, one of the most famous critics of the
time, who was apparently the model for Wagner's Sixtus Beckmesser in
Die Meistersinger.  Tchaikovsky semed to have had bad luck with the
people for whom he orignally wrote his concertos.  The Violin Concerto
was for Leopold Auer, who declined to perform it, and I believe he had
the same problem with Nicolai Rubinstein, for whom the 1st Piano Concerto
was written (I think von Bulow did the premiere of that one.)

      Bill Pearce
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: tait@cs.columbia.edu (Carl Tait)
Subject: Re: Advice on Prokofiev piano sonatas?
Organization: Columbia University Department of Computer Science
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 10:41:14 GMT

In article <92322.110947MHUGHES@MIAMIU.BITNET> <MHUGHES@MIAMIU.BITNET> writes:
>I want some advice on Prokofiev piano sonatas on two fronts:
> 1. Of all the sonatas, which are the 3 or 4 most popular or most worthy
>    of note in the repetoire?
> 2. Which are the most respected/recommended recordings?

I'd agree with Steve Heller than Nos. 2, 3, 6, 7, and 8 are much the
most performed.  No. 3 is very short (about 7 minutes) and audiences
like it, though it's not a particularly deep work.  No. 7 is "the"
Prokofiev Sonata for many, largely because of its famous 7/8 finale.
The very lengthy Eighth Sonata has a meandering first movement that's
hard to present intelligibly, but the finale is a sure winner.

That leaves my favorites, Nos. 2 and 6.  No. 2 is often underrated
because it doesn't holler as loudly as the Mighty 6/7/8 Triumvirate,
but it's a very rewarding piece: four well-contrasted movements,
alternately lyrical and witty.

The imposing Sixth Sonata is the best of all, IMO.  Monstrous, relentless
in its technical demands, and musically uncompromising, this sonata
might be seen as Prokofiev's "Hammerklavier."  Unlike Nos. 2, 3 and 7,
No. 6 is not immediately appealing to most people, but who cares?

Recordings: The "Big Three" are easy.  No. 6: Pogorelich on DG; one of
his best recordings.  No. 7: Pollini on DG, though Richter's classic
version would be preferable if it were available on CD.  No. 8: Richter,
DG mid-price.  (No, I don't work for DG.)

Barbara Nissman's complete set is worth having -- especially the first CD,
which contains the first five sonatas (including both versions of No. 5).
Nissman's playing leans to the percussive side, but that's bearable in
Prokofiev.

Carl Tait

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Scrtach Orchestra (Was Re: Florence Foster Jenkins)
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:52:06 GMT

In article <1ebtghINN4ej@menudo.uh.edu> chem91@Elroy.UH.EDU writes:
>>>
>>>I should recommend the Scratch Orchestra and the Portsmouth Sinfonia,
>>>who were to the symphonic reportoire what FFJ was to opera. Their Hall
>>>of the Mountain King, William Tell Overture and Hallelujiah CHorus are
>>>etched into my memory.
>>>
>[...] Cardew's experiments,
>>on the other hand, were intentionally designed to turn our perceptions of
>>"concert career" on its head, with respect to both performers and audience.
>[...]
>>-- 
>
>Are any Scratch Orchestra recordings available (on CD)? 

As far as I know the only recording the Scratch Orchestra ever made
was in February 1972 - my God, is it *really* oiver 20 years ago -
when we did Paras 2 & 7 (both severely truncated) of The Great
Learning. This was issued by DG as part of their Avant garde series
(vol  III I think) but as far as I know public demand has yet to get
it transferred to CD.

The BBC broadcast a concert we did in the Queen Elizabeth Hall in
November 1970, but who knows whether they would still have the tape?

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ca_ac@gsbacd.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Brahms Violin Concerto
Organization: 
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:14:42 GMT

In article <1ecedlINN9a@agate.berkeley.edu>, henken@ocf.berkeley.edu (Matthew J. Henken) writes:
> In article <1ecavpINNt24@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott) writes:
> 
>>The Grumiaux version of the Brahms is good too, if you can find it (I
>>have it on 78, I don't know if he's made it to CDs. 
> 
> He did:  Philips Silver Line 420 703
> 
> The Brahms is paired with Bruch's Violin Concerto 1.
> 
> Great performance and disc.
> 
> Matthew J. Henken
> henken@ocf.berkeley.edu

Grumiaux made several recordings of this concerto. I know of two, which I
mentioned in my previous posting on this subject line. Grumiaux/Van Beinum
was recording in 1958 and Grumiaux/Colin Davis was recorded in the mid-to-
late sixties (I think!). I have the first one on LP and the second one is the 
one which is released on the Philips Silver Line. So I don't think one can 
assume that the version which Diarmuid Pigott mentions is this one, especially
since he says he has it on 78's. Perhaps Mr.Pigott could clarify which
recording he means i.e. conductor, orchestra, recording date etc.
							Alak Chakravorty
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: smoliar@whitehead.iss.nus.sg (Stephen Smoliar)
Subject: Re: Considering 4'33''
Reply-To: smoliar@iss.nus.sg (Stephen Smoliar)
Organization: Institute of Systems Science, NUS, Singapore
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 02:20:11 GMT

In article <1ed3spINNriv@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid
Pigott) writes:
>
>BTW The first, and still one of the only pieces of Cage I have disliked is
>HPSCHD. For totally emotional reasons to boot. I got my exciting
>nonesuch recording (lower case on cover complete with the computer printout)
>and read that he'd done the things he did because he hated the sound of the
>harpsichord. 
>
Are you saying you dislike this work because Cage said he hated the sound of
the harpsichord?  How much time did you put into LISTENING to the performance?
Did you REALLY feel that Cage used this composition to vent that hatred?  I
feel quite the opposite.  I feel that Cage undertook to work with something
he had disliked so that his improved knowledge would cultivate a better
attitude.  HPSCHD is more CELEBRATION of the harpsichord than CONDEMNATION.
The actual event, barely conveyed by the recording, was an enormous upbeat
occasion;  and it would be hard to imagine anyone coming out with negative
feelings about harpsichords.  Don't let what you read distort what you hear!
-- 
Stephen W. Smoliar; Institute of Systems Science
National University of Singapore; Heng Mui Keng Terrace
Kent Ridge, SINGAPORE 0511
Internet:  smoliar@iss.nus.sg
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: tonality and modern music
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 05:50:09 GMT

In article <1992Nov21.002952.3662@credence.com> jeffw@or.credence.com (Jeff Winslow) writes:
>In article <1992Nov18.075010.10573@Princeton.EDU> roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig) writes:
>|In article <1992Nov18.002107.24042@credence.com> jeffw@or.credence.com (Jeff Winslow) writes:

>|>This is the only thing I really balk at. Certainly no other culture's
>|>traditional music is based on what we call "functional harmony", but
>|>I would be very surprised to find music from a non-western tradition
>|>which neither a) has a pitch center, or b) doesn't use some (probably
>|>unequal-tempered) version or subset of a diatonic scale. 

>|Well, there's an Egyptian 5-equal scale, for what it's worth.  Also,
>|many musics use supersets of the diatonic scale or something like
>|it.  See India, for instance.

>This is interesting. Does this Egyptian music have pitch centers? 

Sure.   It has a pitch hierarchy.

>In the case of India, I know b) does not apply, but I believe a) does.
>Some pitches in a raag are more important than others (and important pitches
>are often a fifth apart), so I would not classify the music as atonal. 

Of course not; non-triadic harmonic atonality is clearly a purposeful
invention of the early 20th C.  I think the discussion here was about
the variety of pitch hierarchies.

Roger

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: jeffw@or.credence.com (Jeff Winslow)
Subject: Re: Bassoonists?
Organization: Credence Systems Corp. Beaverton, OR
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 23:38:42 GMT

Isn't that the instrument that does so well at things like the beginning of 
the Rite of Spring?

Just remember, bassoonist forgiven sins are those most quickly Fagott.


						Jeff Winslow
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Subject: #1 Brahms & Wagner #2 Brahms & Rachmaninov
Organization: University of Western Ontario
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 16:47:39 GMT

Check out Brahms' lied "Das Tod, es ist die kuhle Nacht"--it is straight
  2> out of Tristan. Check that first Tristan chord.
  3>
  4> Brahms was a staggering genius. Look at a Brahms score--he is so 
subtle,
  5> so motivically tight, so tonally conrolled that it takes your breath
  6> away.
  7>
  8> #2: to whoever back there said that Brahms's piano writing isn't as
  9> sophisticated as Rachmaninov (do you really mean this???) What do 
you
 10> mean by sophistication? The piano concertos of Rachmaninov (and
 11> Tchaikowsky and their ilk) are exercises in overblown redundancy. 
The
 12> compositional power of these works is puny compared with the glories 
of
 13> Beethoven, Mozart & Brahms

r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: misrael@csi.uottawa.ca (Mark Israel)
Subject: What do these abbreviations mean?
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, University of Ottawa
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 01:50:09 GMT

   A paper I'm reading ("Learning the Harmonies of Western Tonal 
Music using Neural Networks", by Johannes Feulner of the 
Universit"at Karlsruhe in Germany) contains the following passage:


"A note s is represented as the set of harmonic functions that 
contain s, as shown below:

Fct.   T   D   S   Tp  Sp  Dp  DD  DP  TP  d   Vtp SS
   C   1   0   1   1   0   0   0   0   0   0   0   0
   D   0   1   0   0   1   0   1   0   0   1   1   1

T, D, S, Tp etc. are standard musical abbreviations to denote
harmonic functions."


   I've never seen these "standard musical abbreviations"!  Where 
do I find them?

   In the examples, he seems to use them as follows:

T	I (Tonic)
D	V (Dominant)
S	IV (Subdominant)
Tp	VI (Submediant)
Sp	II (Supertonic)
Dp	???
DD	V of V
DP	V of IV
TP	???
d	???
Vtp	???
SS	???

   Can someone please correct/complete this list for me?

misrael@csi.uottawa.ca			Mark Israel
Sunbeams brightly play, where Fancy's fair pavilion once is pight.