From: naraht@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu (Randolph J. Finder)
Newsgroups: soc.college
Subject: Re: Alpha Phi Omega (was Re: Frats)
Date: 5 Nov 92 21:19:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: drycas.1992Nov6.021929.2473
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

In article <YeyQjWC00WB40n43wo@andrew.cmu.edu>, Erik Warren Selberg <es2q+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> naraht@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu (Randolph J. Finder) writes:
>> When we went Co-ed, as part of the agreement chapters wre not forced to go
>> co-ed. However from what I understand about 70% of chapters went co-ed
>> ASAP(If not sooner ) and today 25 years later approximately 90% of our 350
>> active chaptersare co-ed. However most of the chapters at historically black
>> schools are still all-male. All new chapters or reactivations are required to
>> be co-ed.
>> 
>> Being co-ed does lead to some of the problems mentioned. For instance,
>> you haven't seen fun until you have been in a chapter where the President
>> and 1st VP were dating and had a messy breakup. However on the other
>> side of the coin, I feel that developing brotherhood with brothers
>> of both sexes has helped me in working with women.
> 
> One of the top reasons for social fraternities at CMU to exist is to
> provide an environment for its members to establish relationships with
> people outside the membership. Being an all male organization in a way
> forces us to interact with other groups (ie sororities) and
> individuals; thus we don't stagnate inside our house once rush ends.

If the only reason you don't stagnate inside your house is that you're looking
for dates, that says something about an organization. Most organizations
have a lot of reasons to work with other groups.
> 
> I do agree with both your sides of the coin; however, I think
> personally that the benefits from interacting with women as brothers
> will come to you if you're social and make an attempt at having a
> life. Which leaves the potential for very messy breakups, which could
> _easily_ tear a brotherhood apart.

By your definition you have to date to have a life, Sad. You can have that
type of breakup in an all male group if you don't have certain values
and prohibit gays. 1/2 :-) If we wanted women in our group only to date,
there is no reason to make them equals.
> 
> I head all the examples of various groups being all-male and now being
> co-ed; this I think is a good thing. However, in my honest opinion,
> fraternities and sororities are like no other organization. When
> you're initiated, it's not just that you join a club; you join a
> family. And there is nothing worse than when a family starts tearing
> itself apart.

I missed where in there you made the leap from being co-ed to being more
likely to tear itself apart.

> 
> Erik
> 
> PS - just for kicks -- Randy, you're at CMU -- what do YOU think would
> happen if the fraternities here went co-ed?
>  
Was at CMU, but drycas allows non CMU students to have accounts.

For starters, which ever fraternity did it first would be shunned both
nationally (thrown out of IFC nationally) and on the local level for a long
time.

CMU might not allow such a chapter to stay in University created fraternity
houses.
> 
> 
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-- 
(naraht@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu)	  | Leadership,Friendship, and Service
(vri_rjfin@dmis.ha.osd.mil)	  |          Alpha Phi Omega
"The service we render to others  | National (Co-ed) Service Fraternity
 the rent we pay for our room on earth" - Sir Wilfred Grenfell