HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nicanet@nyxfer.UUCP
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Salvador News Update 1/3/93
Date: 4 Jan 93 22:23:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:HDcVwB2w165w@nyxfer.uucp:-1674816749:000:2850
Nf-From: nyxfer.uucp!nicanet    Jan  4 14:23:00 1993


Subject: Salvador News Update 1/3/93
From: nyxfer!nicanet (NicaNet NY)


Via NY Transfer News Collective * All the News that Doesn't Fit

excerpted from...

         Nicaragua Solidarity Network of Greater New York
       339 Lafayette St., New York, NY 10012 (212) 674-9499

             Weekly News Update #153, January 3, 1993


MINIMAL SALVADORAN ARMY PURGE ANNOUNCED

On Jan. 1, Salvadoran President Alfredo Cristiani released the
long-awaited order of restructuring of the country's armed
forces, which unexpectedly left the entire top military command
intact, in violation of the peace accords. The Farabundo Marti
Front for National Liberation (FMLN), the rebel group which
recently laid down its arms and became a legal political party,
is to meet with Cristiani on Jan. 4 to discuss the matter. 
 
In a brief statement issued from Geneva, UN Secretary General
Boutros Boutros-Ghali said that the restructuring moves described
in the order "do not conform to the recommendations of the Ad Hoc
Commission on the purification of the armed forces for the
discharge or transfer of a specific list of officers which
President Cristiani agreed to carry out in full." That list is
known only to Boutros-Ghali, Cristiani and the three members of
the Ad Hoc Commission, but it is thought to include 110 army
officers ranked lieutenant colonel and higher. The list Cristiani
released on Jan. 1 only included changes in five army posts and
two important brigades; the heads of these units have been
promoted to other posts in the army, three colonels will pass
into foreign service and three soldiers who are being tried in
the courts will be dismissed. Cristiani is thought to be trying
to delay the purging process, fearing military unrest. [New York
Times 1/2/93; ED-LP 1/3/93 from AP]
 
Meanwhile, a US citizen reportedly named Randall Blackburn Cash
was murdered on Dec. 25 in a park on the outskirts of San
Salvador. Neither the police nor the US Embassy had any details
on the incident. [La Jornada (Mexico) 12/27/92 from AFP & EFE]


                               -30-

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From: aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas)
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 21:07:55 GMT

In article <2B489E16.25476@news.service.uci.edu> rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:
>In article <1993Jan2.224634.9804@wam.umd.edu> aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) writes:
>>In article <20671@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu writes:
>
>>
>>I, for one, would be interested to know who are those "anybody who could tell
>>you" that jews lived in homes during WWII.
>>Most of my family lived and died in concentration camps. Those who survived
>>would not call those concentration camps "homes". 
>
> Do you mean that your family was born and raised in concentration camps?

If you read what is written above, you will see that it says: DURING WWII.


> They never had a home before that? 

During is not the same as before. So, your question is irrelevant.


> Are you sure you're not exagerating a bit
> here? 

No, I am not. During WWII, they were taken to concentration camps.


> It seems to me that Jews in Germany and other European countries were
> pretty well off (in general) before Hitler did what he did, no?

Some were and some were not. 
However, it does not change how they were DURING WWII.
Mr. Salas said that Jews lived in homes during WWII. I say that he is
wrong. Maybe the Cuban-Americans and their friends can also show that
the Jews were living in homes during WWII, or that they were taken tp
concentration camps because of Fidel Castro.



      __   __  ___
     /  \ /  \|   \
    |____|____|___/
    |    |    |
    aap@wam.umd.edu





Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: anibal@ee470.ee.mcgill.ca (Anibal Jodorcovsky)
Subject: Re: Olvida mi nombre
Organization: EE Lab, McGill University EE Lab, Montreal
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 01:39:01 GMT

>In <9301121701.AA00530@physics.Berkeley.EDU> wombat@physics.Berkeley.EDU (Gene P. Ledbetter) writes:
>
>>Aquellas palabras, "Olvida mi nombre," son las principales de una 
>>cancion de dos argentinos fantasticos, hermano y hermana, cuyo 
>>nombre, lastimamente, !me olvide!  En sus canciones son siempre 
>>amantes que no son de acuerdo en nada.  Como pareja de cancionistas 
>>tienen el nombre de un flor muy raro.  ?Hay algun lector que sabe
>>quienes son?
>
>>Gene Ledbetter/wombat@physics.berkeley.edu

El grupo se llama: Pimpinela
El nombre de ellos no los recuerdo.

-Anibal


Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas)
Subject: Re: Homophobia: US vs. CUBA
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:24:48 GMT

In article <2B4C706C.23805@news.service.uci.edu> rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:
>
> Last night on "Nighline" they talked about the Colorado boycott, etc.
> Martina was one of the guess. One of the things she insisted on was on their
> "right" to adopt children. Now, I don't think it's in the best interest of
> a child to be raised by a homosexual couple ....

Can you explain why?


> 
> In adoption procedings most government agencies and most black citizens even
> oppose adoption of black children by white couples, so adoption of children
> by gays seems to me would be more of a traumatic experience than being raised
> by couples of another race.....
>

Can you explain why?

>
>--
>Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million
>Office of Academic Computing. Cubans who look around us in terror"
>UC, Irvine.                 from the open letter to Castro by M.E. Cruz-Varela
>

See, you and Castro have some points in common after all!


AAP
From: rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo)
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 4 Jan 93 20:29:10 GMT

In article <1993Jan2.224634.9804@wam.umd.edu> aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) writes:
>In article <20671@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu writes:

>
>I, for one, would be interested to know who are those "anybody who could tell
>you" that jews lived in homes during WWII.
>Most of my family lived and died in concentration camps. Those who survived
>would not call those concentration camps "homes". 

 Do you mean that your family was born and raised in concentration camps?
 They never had a home before that? Are you sure you're not exagerating a bit
 here? It seems to me that Jews in Germany and other European countries were
 pretty well off (in general) before Hitler did what he did, no?

--
Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million
Office of Academic Computing. Cubans who look around us in terror"
UC, Irvine.                 from the open letter to Castro by M.E. Cruz-Varela
From: robarr@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Robert O'Barr)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human rights in the USA.
Keywords: USA
Date: 8 Jan 93 05:28:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: sdcc12.43169
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of California, San Diego

Edelmiro asks the question:

 >>        4) Why do Haitian risk their lives going to Miami instead of fleeing
 >>            to socialist Cuba?
 >> 

In article <104002@netnews.upenn.edu> julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez) writes:
 
 >	A republican I know always asks me why don't they go to 
 >	Latinoamerica. I haven't read about Haitians going to 
 >	Mexico for instance neither to the Dominican Republic.
 >	I think theirs is the same reason of the majority of
 >	emigrants coming to the USA. The economy is much better
 >	here. I think this is the wealthiest country on Earth,
 >	am I wrong ?

Julio, let me see if I understand your explanation. You think Haitians
risk their very lives coming to the US because they seek wealth?
This is the official position of the Bush administration; that since
they are economic immigrants, they have no right to any special
considerations (i.e. they must apply and be placed on a waiting list
just like the mexicans, chileans, argentines, etc.)

Those who would differ with your opinion (such as Edelmiro) believe
that the motivation is not economic but political.  They come to
Miami because they fear for their lives in Haiti.

Robert
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas)
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 00:10:39 GMT

In article <2B4A1DE6.9975@news.service.uci.edu> rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:
>
> No es lo mismo, tu desden hacia los cubano-americanos es constante. Nunca has
> dicho nada a nuestro favor pero muy a menudo indirectamente defiendes a Castro
> y su politica "socialista" con la cual te identificas.

Seria interesante que demuestres que yo me identifco con Castro y su 
politica "socialista".
Esta es una acusacion sin fundamento, y, como dicen por ahi, es buscar la
descalificacion del otro por medio de la culpabilidad por asociacion.
Decia un tipo hace mucho que si uno repite una mentira mucho la gente la va
a tomar como verdad, y que es mas facil ensuciar que limpiar.
Asi es que pareciera que basta que me acuses (vos o Salas), de ser comunista
o amigo de Castro, para que ya uno tenga que empezar a demostrar lo contrario.
En todo caso, que yo muestre desden hacia los cubanos-americanos no indica en
lo mas minimo que pienso de Castro o su politica.


> 
> Es verdad que la mayoria de nosotros somos conservadores y eminentemente
> anti-comunistas pero aunque sea tenemos una buena excusa al ver a nuestro
> pais destruido por el comunismo.
> 
> Lo que no entiendo es tu posicion, todavia crees que el comunismo va a hacer
> a todos "iguales", ateos y/o anti-cristianos? 

No creo nada de eso. En una epoca creia que lo que iba a hacer igual a la
gente era el acceso a la educacion. Que cuanto mas educada estaba la gente 
mejor iba a actuar y mas conciencia de sus actos iba a tener. Hoy dia ya no 
lo creo mas.


 
> Si no eres comunista o simpatizante entonces cual es tu "chispa" en contra
> de nosotros? Talvez sea que no usamos el "vos"? Tomamos cafe' y no el mate?
> Oye, pero tenemos una soda derivada del mate (Materva) que nos gusta mucho!

Yo tampoco tomo mate! Tomo cafe', y quizas demasiado.
Lo otro que no tomo es te, que siempre me parecio estar ligado a 
enfermedades, ya que cuando era chico y me resfriaba o me enfermaba 
me daban te.
Ya una vez te explique en privado cual era mi vision sobre Fidel Castro y 
sobre los cubanos, de alla o de aca. Por ahi, creo, tengo una copia.


>--
>Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million

Besos,
AAP
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: lazaro@garfield.cs.mun.ca (Lazaro Nunez)
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Organization: CS Dept., Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 20:02:26 GMT

julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez) writes:

>    Anybody knows which are the constitutional powers of Fidel ?

El titulo oficial de Castro es "Primer Secretario del Comite Central del Partido
Comunista de Cuba y Presidente de los Consejos de Estado y de Ministros." Es
decir, Castro es el Dios de Cuba que enmienda la constitucion cuando le venga
en gana (para que no lo acusen de que actua fuera de la ley) sin que nadie
pueda llevarle la contraria.

>    This is absolutely preposterous. To be nationalist and socalist does not
>   mean to be national-socialist or nazi.  

Tienes razon.

>   Don't forget many followers of
>   marxists ideas are liberal jews. Are you telling me that Cuba's constitution
>   institutes hatred against minorities ?  

?Cuantas constituciones existen en el mundo en las que se puedan leer leyes 
que aboguen por el odio contra las minorias raciales? Y sin embargo, adonde
sea que mires podras ver ese odio, muchas veces enmascarado pero latente.
Y Cuba no es una excepcion. Claro que la constitucion no dice "odien al negro,
odien al chino, etc." pero muchas de las acciones del Estado lo manifiestan.
Un ejemplo sencillo seria cuando en los an~os en que el afro estaba de moda
como peinado el gobierno cubano no permitia su uso a la poblacion negra, y
aquellos que usaban el afro eran vistos como "lumpen". Parece un ejemplo
trivial pero que si se mira de fondo nos muestra el odio hacia la cultura
africana.

>   Does it discriminate against homosexual individuals ?

Si, ningun homosexual en Cuba puede ejercer cargos donde tenga influencia
sobre otros individuos. Por ejemplo, los entendidos no pueden ser ni maestros,
ni artistas. Claro que los hay pero tienen que estar en el closet. 
Tambien esta escrito en ley que todo aquel que sea sorprendido en "actos
homosexuales" no tendra derecho a recivir ningun tipo de educacion. Todo
esto esta escrito en algo llamado "Codigo de la nin~ez y la juventud" o
algo parecido. Ademas, creo que es del conocimiento de todos los campos
de concentracion para homosexuales de los an~os sesenta y setenta.

-- 
| Lazaro Nun~ez Figueiral         ||  !Lloran sobre el Mar de Cuba	     |
| Memorial University of Nfld.    ||  enormes flores bermejas;	             |
| St. John's, Terranova, Canada.  ||  sobre la isla perdida	   	     |
| lazaro@garfield.cs.mun.ca       ||  el aire amarillo tiembla! - F.G. Lorca |
From: ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Date: 6 Jan 93 17:55:28 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Julio Gonzalez writes:

>In article <1993Jan4.210755.15487@wam.umd.edu>, aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto 
>Adolfo Pinkas) writes:

>>     Maybe the Cuban-Americans and their friends can also show that
>> the Jews were living in homes during WWII, or that they were taken tp
>> concentration camps because of Fidel Castro.
>>

>        Not only that, they can prove Castro read "Mine Kaft" rather
>        "Das Capital", comprende sen~or ? ( apologies for mispellings,
>        I lost my e-dictionary).

Well, I don't have a dictionary but I know the spelling "Mein Kampf".  
However, if your interested in Castro's early readings, while he was studying 
with Jesuits as a priviliged petitte bourgeoise, he happend to be the leader of 
the Debate Club and an avid fan of the speeches given by Benito Mussolini, a 
pal of Adolf Hitler.  Comparisons between Benito's non verbal communicative 
skills and those of Castro were shown recently in an excellent Frontline 
documentary on PBS.  So, Cuban Americans don't have to prove much on this topic.

Auf wiedersehen,

Edelmiro
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: cortes@enuxva.eas.asu.edu (Enrique Cortes-Rello)
Subject: Re: Human rights in the USA.
Keywords: USA
Organization: Arizona State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 17:03:54 GMT

In article <21144@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu>, ez000281@othello.ucdavis.edu writes:
> Enrique Cortes-Rello writes:
> 
> >>
> >> Well Julio if your right, then our policy towards keeping the Haitians out
> >> is entirely justified.  There simply economic refugees who should stay in
> >> Haiti and pick a number like everyone else.  We open our doors to political
> >> refugees who are fleeing persecution for their political views, we don't 
> >> welcom
> >> people who wan't to come here simply to make a buck.  I hopee your wrong
>    **************************************************
> >             like Edelmiro? :) :)
> 
> No Enrique, you are totally mistaken, you should have written "like myself" 
> for as you know Puerto Ricans are not inmigrants in this country and we don't 
> have to seek for any political assylum or anything esle.  We don't even "come 
> here" since we've never left the United States.  Haven't you noted that were 
> Americans (in the exclusive sense of the word)?
> 
> Edelmiro

[1]. how do you know that I am not an american citizen? 
     because of my name?

[2]. Well ... guess what? I am not ! I came here to 
     get advanced education and I am planning to go
     back to my country ASAP and do some good there.
     So, no fast buck for me (unless I win the lotto)
     (WHich country? letsee ... it is in America,
     it is in North America, the native language is
     Spanish ...)

[3]. I am also AMERICAN. I was born in america and 
     raised in america (the continent). So, we have 
     something in common.

[4]. I see that my comment bothered you. Why? You are
     here for economic reasons, aren't you? Why aren't
     you in San Juan or Guam or the Ozarks? 
     To move to a better place for economic reasons is
     one of the basis of capitalism. Just look at all
     the wealth created by south east Asia immigrants
     in California (yes, many of them were "economic
     refugees").

[5]. I know perfectly well that Puerto Ricans are citizens
     of the US. Unfortunately, many of your "mainland"
     compatriots do not know this fact and treat your people
     (and MINE) like the scum of the earth.I strongly feel
     that the following analogy holds: " Puerto Ricans are
     to the U.S. what NorthAfricans are to France". Sad but
     true. FIX IT!

[6]. I have the utmost respect for the Puerto Ricans that
     I have met. They are hard workers with a strong
     sense of decency and strong "family values" [in the
     good sense, not in the ultrarightwing sense]. I feel
     exactly the same about the Haitians. What about you?
     Where is your compassion? 

cheers compadre ! You are taking life way too seriously.

Si vivieras mas cerca de Arizona, te invitaria a tomar unas
buenas cervecitas Mexicanas para platicar y convencerte de que
todos los Latinoamericanos somos hermanos (incluyendo los
Puertorriquen~os).

ENRIQUE
From: markrose@spss.com (Mark Rosenfelder)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: MIM's banished from ...
Date: 12 Jan 93 17:48:40 GMT
Organization: SPSS Inc.

In article <oyarce.8.726855028@slab.unt.edu> oyarce@slab.unt.edu 
(GUILLERMO OYARCE) writes:
>It is a sorry action taken by the mentioned individuals agains the MIM.
>If democracy is to be defended, democracy must be maintained.
>Silencing opposing voices is not democracy but something else.

Yes, that "something else" in this case is called a "moderated newsgroup".
"Moderation" means (to put it bluntly) censorship, with a view to reducing
bandwidth, irrelevancy, offensiveness, or whatever.  I don't know why
misc.activism.progressive is moderated, but if its readers are happy with
it, its moderators can censor anyone they like.

>But MIM must be allowed to continue to voice the opinion of its members.

MIM can certainly continue its pro-terrorist postings in *unmoderated*
newsgroups, such as this one.  I kind of hope they do; a good MIM-Edelmiro
fight could be worth watching.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: oyarce@slab.unt.edu (GUILLERMO OYARCE)
Subject: MIM's banished from ...
Organization: School of Library & Info Sci, UNT
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 16:10:28 GMT


It is a sorry action taken by the mentioned individuals agains the MIM.
If democracy is to be defended, democracy must be maintained.
Silencing opposing voices is not democracy but something else.

Although the context of science... was not the appropiate forum for 
political exchange.  I don't know.

But MIM must be allowed to continue to voice the opinion of its members.

I do not agree --AT ALL-- with MIM's positions. More so about Sendero
Luminoso.  But it is arrogant to assume that no one else can contribute
even though the contribution is done, as the MIM so often does, within
a very biased perspective.

	G.

	
Xref: sparky soc.culture.latin-america:5410 soc.culture.italian:5775 soc.culture.mexican:7770
From: jbarth@ep.ieee.org (Jeremy Barth)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human rights in the USA.
Date: 6 Jan 93 17:08:28 GMT
Reply-To: jbarth@ep.ieee.org
Organization: IEEE, New York, NY


>	As to stimulate a new field of analysis I propose the
>	topic of "the different treatment of Haitians compared
>	to Cubans". Here is a piece of news for The Philadelphia
>	Inquirer.

Don't forget the HIV+ Haitians who are currently being held
by US authorities in a jail on the Guantanamo base in Cuba.
The military refused even to let reporters in until a lawsuit
brought by some independent journalists and the NY Times, among
others, forced the US government to permit access a few weeks
ago.

While Cuba's AIDS detention policy can reasonably be questioned,
at least the patients in their so-called "AIDS jails" receive
pretty darn good care, as opposed to AIDS victims on the
streets of US cities who are homeless and have no medical
insurance.  And as opposed to the Haitians being held on
Guantanamo for no reason other than that they're HIV+.  How
the US can say anything about the morality of Cuba's treatment
of AIDS victims, given its treatment of the Haitians and its
very own citizens, is beyond me.

Jeremy
From: ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Date: 6 Jan 93 17:53:20 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Julio Gonzalez writes:

>> >>            ... for opression doesn't
>> >>necesarilly take on an economic character, unless of course you happen to
>> >>be a Marxist and believe in material determinism.

>        Don't say this to one of your "american" friends. For the relation
>        good economy--freedom is well entrenched in this country. No
>        means means no freedom. Remember they just voted out a great
>        "freedom fighter" because "The Economy Stupid!"

Julio,

I thought they were teaching more philosophy these days in Ivy League schools, 
but perhaps I'm mistaken.  It just so happens to be that there are many upper 
class philosphers and ideologues who are material determinists but are not 
marxists (e.g., Voltaire).  So, I wouldn't be surprised if our intelligence 
analysts in CIA are also material determinists (who knows, maybe they are 
marxists!).  As for Mr. Bush, we didn't vote him out because of his lack of 
guaranteeing freedom, we voted him out because of the economy, stupid!  In 
fact, if Mr. Clinton would have had the foreign policy record of Bush it would 
have been no contest out from the start.  As a typical Democrat, I feel proud 
of the major accomplisments of the Bush Administration in Foreign policy, 
albeit I have strong differences with the role he has played with Haiti and 
China.  The rest deserves a AAA rating.

Edelmiro
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america