From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: Re: Bo Gritz vs Chip Berlet
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:05:03 GMT

In article <1irjn2INN549@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs) writes:
>I think you may be right, Ted, but I just don't know.  I'd like a little
>more to go on than your say-so.  Where did you get this information?

Public knowledge.  Look it up.  Do a database search.  It's not hidden;
a newspaper or three will do an article on Gritz fairly often.

>Except for some pretty solid stuff that I've received from Chip Berlet
>establishing that he's associated with some pretty seedy characters a
>while back, I've found verifiable information about Gritz pretty hard to
>come by.

There was a recent good book published about MIA-con-men in general,
part of it was excerpted in the January 1991 _Atlantic_.

>Calling someone a villian doesn't make him one unless he's actually done
>or said something wrong.  Ideology alone doesn't make someone a villian.

I disagree with the latter statement.  At what point did Hitler become
a villian?  Do we have to wait for the first Jews to enter the camps?

>How can we know for sure that Gritz is a liar?  How can we know for sure
>that he is a anti-Semitic white racist?  To be sure, we need more than
>just a lot of people saying he is these things.  Rumors and gossip
>aren't evidence.
>
>I understand that he once wrote that some of the families that own the
>Federal Reserve are Jewish.  Is saying this anti-Semitic?  

Yes.  Why?

1) It's false.  The Federal Reserve is owned and fully controlled 
   by the United States government.  

2) It's a clear appeal to anti-Semites to join him, guised in such
   language so that people like you are willing to dismiss charges
   of anti-Semitism.  The idea of a conspiracy being led by "Jewish
   bankers" is over a century old, and has been told by anti-Semites
   on at least four or five different continents.  And never has it 
   been true.

3) Let's assume counterfactually for a second that the FRB *was*
   controlled by Jews.  What purpose does it serve to note that 
   some government officials happen to be of a particular religion?  
   Of what relevance is it, if not to cast aspersions on them for 
   their religion?

>It seems to
>me that such would be the case only if he said these Jews were evil
>BECAUSE they are Jewish or if it's not true.  If a bank is owned by a
>Mormon family, does saying so make one an anti-Mormon?  Some people
>define anti-Semitism so broadly that almost nobody can escape the
>appellation unless he is Jewish.

Gritz is making a false claim that Jews have control over the 
world that they don't.  Once again -- what is the relevance of it?
Why build a campaign plank against it?  Why accept support from
*overt* blatant anti-Semites like Willis Carto?  Why banking,
if not to appeal to the old canards of the International Jewish
Banking Conspiracy?

>If anyone can produce SUBSTANTIAL evidence that Bo Gritz is either
>anti-Semitic or white racist as I define those terms, I will turn away
>from him in total disgust.
>
>Afterall my wife and three children are mestizo and I have Jewish
>ancestry that I am very proud of.  I detest anti-Semites and white
>racists.
>
>Oddly enough, I have never seen convincing evidence that Bo Gritz is
>either.

I'm sorry you feel that way.  What evidence would you require, aside
from a willingness to be on the same ticket as David Duke, accepting
funding from Willis Carto, and making false accusations reminiscent of
"The Protocols of the Elders of Zion"?  David Duke never stands up and
says "I hate blacks," and Bo Gritz is never going to stand up and
say "I hate Jews" -- he's always going to phrase his anti-Semitism in 
terms of supporting groups that think the Holocaust is a hoax and
in campaign literature where he speaks of the need to stop "Jewish bankers." 

I hope, for your sake, if Gritz does come to power, that your Jewish
ancestry dates back more than three generations.
-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
standard disclaimers          | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
never shout movie in a crowded firestation
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:13743 alt.politics.usa.constitution:1378 alt.activism:20067 talk.religion.misc:25213