HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: evansg@uproar.enet.dec.com (Gwyn Evans @ IME)
Subject: VNS: Mon  5-Oct-1992
Keywords: VNS,news
Reply-To: evansg@uproar.enet.dec.com (Gwyn Evans @ IME)
Organization: Digital Equipment Service Industries Solutions Company Ltd
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 09:14:32 GMT


[ Well, I'm back from honeymoon. Thanks to Craig for posting the news ]
[ while I've been away.]

<><><><><><><><>  T h e   V O G O N   N e w s   S e r v i c e  <><><><><><><><>

 Edition : 2676               Monday  5-Oct-1992            Circulation :  7739

        VNS MAIN NEWS .....................................   43 Lines


VNS MAIN NEWS:                                    [Tom Povey, VNS UK News Desk]
==============                                    [Reading, England           ]

     Here is the News at 07:00 BST on Monday 5-October-1992
     ------------------------------------------------------

     UK News
     -------
     {no financial numbers today, my source is temporarily unavailable}

     The cabinet committee meets again today to consider further cutbacks in
     public expenditure.

     The Conservative party conference begins tomorrow.

     Two of the largest teaching unions say they oppose the introduction of
     performance-related pay in schools. Such stong oposition will make it
     hard for the government to introduce the scheme.

     The entertainer Leslie Crowther, remains in a critical condition in
     hospital after his car went out of control on the M5 on Saturday.

     European News
     -------------

     Yesterday evening, an Israeli cargo plane, a converted 747, crashed into
     two blocks of flats in an Amsterdam suburb. At least some 150 people are
     feared killed, including the 3 crew and 1 passenger. Sabotage is not
     suspected. The pilot had reported two engines on fire and was attempting
     to return to the airport.

     EC foreign ministers meet today to consider how to make the Maastricht
     treaty more paletable.

     International News
     ------------------

     Voting begins today in the first elections in Kuwait since the end of the
     Gulf War. Only 1 in 7 of the population are allowed to vote.

     {News courtesy of the BBC}

     Local Weather
     -------------

     A cloudy start, staying dry. High 14C/57F.


<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
<><><><><><><>   VNS Edition : 2676      Monday  5-Oct-1992   <><><><><><><><>
--
+======================================================================+
| Gwyn Evans  | evansg@uproar.enet.dec.com |  Uxbridge, Middlesex, UK  |
| DESISCo - Digital Equipment Service Industries Solutions Company Ltd |
|  Views expressed and statements made are mine and not those of DEC   |
+======================================================================+
Xref: sparky soc.culture.british:13209 rec.arts.books:17155
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british,rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Enforced Shakespeare?
Date: 29 Sep 1992 15:53:56 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Sep29.212802.4550@epas.toronto.edu> 
sfysh@epas.utoronto.ca (Stephanie Moskal Fysh) writes:
| In article <1992Sep29.062354.18381@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> 
| baker@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Andrew Baker) writes:

[...]
| >Why is this bonkers?  It sounds like an excellent idea (although it might
| >be better to require more than one play).
|
| It's bonkers because Shakespeare's English is now 375 or so years old.

Way excellent point.

| Why should we be expecting 14-year-olds to comprehend it?  It's no
| wonder so many people dislike reading, and never go to the theatre.

Y'know, mathematics is *much* *much* older.  Why should we be
expecting 14-year-olds to comprehend *it*?  It's no wonder
so many people dislike balancing their checkbooks.

| Personally, I'd be quite happy to see Shakespeare completely taken out
| of high school curricula, except for advanced (special) classes and -
| perhaps - university-qualification level senior classes.

I couldn't agree with you more.  Smash the elitist snobs
who want to force Johnny and Missy to read Shakespeare!
We should devise new curricula for today's new, with-it
kiddies!  In our new curricula, books written before, say,
1985 shall be banned.  Only *new* ideas expressed in today's
*new* language shall be required.  Care to write a book 
with me on this, Steph?

Arne


Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: david@postman.gr.osf.org (David George)
Subject: Re: Know someone at Triumph or Norton???
Organization: OSF RI Grenoble
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 09:40:46 GMT

Norton still exist.  They sell motobikes to the Police and Army.  I believe
they hold/held joint patent rights with Mazda on the Wankel rotary engine.

David.
From: proberts@informix.com (Paul Roberts)
Newsgroups: uk.politics,soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Government discovers new censorship method
Date: 3 Oct 92 17:33:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: informix.1992Oct3.173336.18611
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <BvI4rM.1uC@newcastle.ac.uk> w.p.coyne@newcastle.ac.uk writes:
>
>  In recent years the Government has tried to use the courts to keep 
>things secret, but this has not always worked.   They are maybe now
>adopting a different approach - call it by a different name so
>nobody realises what it is.
>
>   The thing I am referring to is the "Treaty on European Union" which
>the Gov and media seem to be reluctant to use, instead they say the
>"Maastricht Treaty".
>
>   Normally (?) this form of censorship doesn't work because the papers/TV 
>would reveal it, but this time the media are going along with the 
>Government.
>--------------------------------------------------------------------

Goodness, is the Maastricht Treaty something to do with European Union?
I never would have guessed it from Government statements and media
coverage! 

If this is a conspiracy, it is a pretty leaky one.
From: riaedwards@halls1.cc.monash.edu.au (AUDREY EDWARDS)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: VNS, Wed 30-Sep-1992
Date: 6 Oct 92 02:50:26 GMT
Organization: Halls of Residence, Monash University

In article <1992Oct5.152306.1952@Princeton.EDU> bvaughan@lotka.Princeton.EDU (Barbara Vaughan) writes:
>From: bvaughan@lotka.Princeton.EDU (Barbara Vaughan)
>Subject: Re: VNS, Wed 30-Sep-1992
>Date: 5 Oct 92 15:23:06 GMT

>In article <riaedwards.1.717995319@halls1.cc.monash.edu.au> riaedwards@halls1.cc.monash.edu.au (AUDREY EDWARDS) writes:
>>... 'Purgery' is actually giving evidence which you know to be untrue.

>I think purgery is giving a laxative, which may or may not be criminal. 
>Perjury is giving false evidence.

Sorry about that. I'd noticed the error just after I'd sent it, and the 
trouble with Internet, unlike sending postal mail, is that you cannot dash 
after the postman, and retrieve the offending article!!

Audrey.
From: martin.baines@uk.sun.com (Martin Baines - Sun UK - SE Manager Cambridge)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Accents (was Re: Abuse a Brit)
Date: 2 Oct 1992 10:28:07 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Ltd
Distribution: world
Reply-To: martin.baines@uk.sun.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: bottomdog.uk.sun.com

In article KrD@acsu.buffalo.edu, v064myby@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Christophe J Quaranta) writes:
>	PS How many Brits can tell the difference between a Canadian &
>an American?

Easy eh?

---
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You might say that, but I couldn't possibly comment"

Martin Baines, Sales Support Manager,
Sun Microsystems Ltd, 306 Science Park, Cambridge, CB4 4WG, UK
Phone: +44 223 420421                 Fax: +44 223 420257
JANET:     Martin.Baines@uk.co.sun    Other UK:  Martin.Baines@sun.co.uk
Internet:  Martin.Baines@UK.sun.com
X.400:     g=martin s=baines prmd=sunir admd=mci c=us

Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: frank2@underdog.ee.wits.ac.za (FRANK D N)
Subject: Re: Words: American vs English (UK type)
Organization: Wits Electrical Engineering (Undergrads).
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 12:52:54 GMT

It could have been Churchill who observed that Britain and the USA were two 
countries separated by the same language ;)

--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
David Frank                       {} "I imagined that Ted Turner had been  
<frank2@underdog.ee.wits.ac.za>   {}  offered the post of World President -
University of the Witwatersrand   {}  but had rejected it, because he didn't
Johannesburg                      {}  want to give up power" Arthur C. Clarke
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
ps:	If you send me a picture postcard to the following address, I'll 
	send one right back to you.

			David Frank
			91 Mowbray Road
			Johannesburg
			2193
			South Africa
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
From: cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Enforced Shakespeare?
Date: 30 Sep 92 14:24:49 GMT
	<1992Sep29.123926.12123@sei.cmu.edu> <26413@castle.ed.ac.uk>
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

In article <26413@castle.ed.ac.uk> jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (JHenderson) writes:
   =>In article <1992Sep29.070708.11757@rdg.dec.com> cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn) writes:
   =>>I saw this year's exam papers in Scotland, and there was Shakespeare,
   =>>but no Robert Burns, probably the world's best known poet.

   Best known, possibly. Most over-rated, certainly.

Suffer at school, did we?  Many of his poems make much more sense when you
treat them as song lyrics; he wrote some wonderful songs.  Of course, it's
just as possible for terrible teachers to murder songs as poetry, I
suppose... 
--
	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)
From: reese@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: London Penpal
Date: 4 Oct 92 12:15:37 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <1992Oct1.130020.20@newton.hartwick.edu>, wendtr@newton.hartwick.edu writes:
> 
>  I just got accepted into the London Semester at London Polytechnic through
                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Beaver College. I will be in London from early January to late June (possibly
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> later). It would be great to hear from some people in that area, and maybe
> start a penpal thing going. Please respond or e- mail me at 
> Wendtr@Hartwick.edu. I will be eternally grateful.
> 

What do these things mean? I don't recognise anything here ...

Jason

> Thanks in advance,
> Rachel
From: apm@hpopd.pwd.hp.com (Andrew Merritt)
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 08:32:51 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: London Penpal
Organization: Hewlett-Packard ISG-SBU-PWD, UK.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british

livesey@solntze.esd.sgi.com (Jon Livesey) writes
>I think that some candidate for President in 1988 (was it Pat
>Robertson?) boasted of having gone to Oxford and they dug up
>that he'd actually spent six weeks there one Summer.

Sounds like what Jeffrey Archer claimed, too.  The man has a tremendous gift
for story-telling; it's a pity he doesn't use it in his books.

Andrew
From: sandee@Think.COM (Daan Sandee)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Words: American vs English (UK type)
Date: 2 Oct 1992 13:32:01 GMT
Organization: TMC
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: telecaster.think.com

In article <26432@castle.ed.ac.uk>, cam@castle.ed.ac.uk (Chris Malcolm) writes:
|> In article <BvEwtB.D5F@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> cscdc@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Dan Carpenter) writes:
|> > I would like to have a list, If anyone has one, where in a America we
|> >call something by one name and in England it is called by another.
|> 
|> >Truck vs. Lory
|> 
|> Ok. In English a Lory is a large Australasian parrot with a brushlike
|> tongue. What is it called in America? I thought in America a truck was
|> a large goods vehicle?
|> -- 
|> Chris Malcolm    cam@uk.ac.ed.aifh          +44 (0)31 650 3085
|> Department of Artificial Intelligence,    Edinburgh University
|> 5 Forrest Hill, Edinburgh, EH1 2QL, UK                DoD #205

Uh, Chris, the man asked what's it called IN ENGLAND. So he wouldn't be
interested in opinions out of Edinburgh. 
On the other hand, I can affirm that in this country a truck is a road
vehicle for the transportation of goods - it doesn't have to be large,
the midgets driven by death-defying rednecks are officially
called "light trucks". The dictionary gives 18 other meanings for the
noun, and an Australasian parrot is not one of them.

Daan Sandee                                           sandee@think.com
Thinking Machines Corporation
Cambridge, Mass 02142                                 (617) 234-5044
From: gray@rz-berlin.mpg.de
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Abuse A Brit
Date: 29 Sep 92 17:54:14 +0100
Organization: Rechenzentrum MPG Berlin

In article <1992Sep28.181734.4500@bnr.uk>,
agc@bmdhh298.bnr.ca (Alan Carter) writes:
 
> Can anyone think of a derogatory term used by other nations (that the
> British can understand to be insulted by it), to refer to the British
> (or in my case the English)?

  Various colonials and continentals of my acquaintance have employed
the following poor attempts at construction of a derogatory noun for the
British and/or their demesne:

  Wingeing Poms
  Das Land ohne Musik
  Les hooligans

  but we all know that Britain simply *is* better, so there's no need to
worry that they are serious.


Struan
From: roy@willow.ccsf.caltech.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: My wife's gon to the West Indies
Date: 1 Oct 1992 19:30:58 GMT
Organization: CCSF Caltech, Pasadena, CA
Distribution: world
Reply-To: roy@willow.ccsf.caltech.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: willow.ccsf.caltech.edu
Keywords: joke

I wonder if there are any jokesmiths out there? I'm sure everyone has heard the
old music hall jokes:

	My wife's gone to the West Indies.
	Oh really? Jamaica?
	No, she wanted to go !

	My wife's gone to Indonesia.
	Oh really? Jakarta?
	No, in an airplane !

Can anyone think of any more of these? How about Cuba, Durban, Djibouti?

Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: dj@ekcolor.ssd.kodak.com (Dave Jones)
Subject: Re: Is Clinton Wilson?
Organization: :noitazinagrO
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 13:49:05 GMT

Charles E Thorne (cthorne@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu) wrote:
: In article <BvGEyy.7M8@apollo.hp.com> johnf@apollo.hp.com (John Francis) writes:
: >    1)  I have seen these sort of "4 to 5 times" figures bandied about, but
: >        have yet to see any statistics provided to back them up.  
: 
: I don't have an exact quote, the the information came from a 1989 issue of
: The Economist.  There statement (in comparing U.S., Canadian and U.K. health
: care systems) was that the total cost (at that time) was about $500 billion
: of which approx. $100 billion (paid by companies for their employees) covered
: approx. 125 million people (a cost of less than $1,000 per person per year)
: while the government cost of approx. $400 billion (paid by the taxpayers)
: covered a much smaller group (certainly less than 75 million)--thus at a
: cost of more than $4,000 per person per year.
: 
And were these other people mostly the elderly, or a cross-section of
society?  It's easy to insure healthy people, expensive to take care of
those who get sick a lot.  In 1989 30 million US residents were in the
65 or older category, and therefore probably using the Medicare program.
Govt programs also cover children in poor families, people too sick to
make a living etc.  All this costs money.  If insurance companies had
to include anyone who asked for coverage, they'd have similar costs.

--
||)) There is no truth to the rumor that:)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))|
||)) Lotus are suing Apple for copying the look and feel of their lawsuits )|
||))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))|
||Dave Jones (dj@ekcolor.ssd.kodak.com) | Eastman Kodak Co. Rochester, NY   |
From: ian@hpopd.pwd.hp.com (Ian Watson)
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 10:30:58 GMT
Subject: First Direct vs. High St. banking
Organization: Hewlett-Packard ISG-SBU-PWD, UK.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british


I'm tempted to open a current account with First Direct, but would like to get
advice first.  I'm currently a Midland Bank customer, so things like paying in
cash would be no more hassle than it is at present.

First Direct obviously talk only about the things that you can do just as
easily with them as with a High Street bank.  Are they omitting to mention any
services that they cannot provide, or which are more hassle ?

From their literature, I can't see any disadvantages, except perhaps that you
deal with someone on the phone rather than seeing them face-to-face.  Does
anyone have any experiences, good or bad, with First Direct  ?  Are there any
catches to banking with them ?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ian Watson, HP Pinewood Information Systems Division, England.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: livesey@solntze.esd.sgi.com (Jon Livesey)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Currency Problems
Date: 7 Oct 92 00:13:55 GMT
Organization: sgi

In article <1992Oct6.090555.5483@nuscc.nus.sg>, hiscrp@nuscc.nus.sg (C R Pennell) writes:
|> livesey@solntze.esd.sgi.com (Jon Livesey) writes:
|> : 
|> : And the difference is <drum roll> the new car industry in Britain
|> : is allowed to get on with the job of building cars any way it
|> : wants, buying its parts from any supplier it wants, using whatever
|> : labour it wants, at the lowest cost it can get, instead of being 
|> : used as a fancy scheme to prop up uneconomic coal mines and steel 
|> : mills.
|> : 
|> : Ironic, isn't it, that having run British owned firms into the
|> : ground by over-control, we now have to offer foreigners the
|> : right to run their businesses on a rational basis to get them
|> : to invest in the UK.    We couldn't offer ourselves that right,
|> : Oooooh no.
|> 
|>   I think this really is a bit nieve. Are you suggesting that Imperial
|> typewriters, the firm whose mamagement decided NOT to produce electirc
|> typwriters all those years ago (on the grounds that there was no market
|> for them) or Triumph motorbikes which decided NOT to mass produce small
|> Vesta-like machines, and later big machines with indicator lights (on
|> the grounds that that was not what THEIR market wanted) or the firm I
|> worked for in the 1970s one vacation which wholesaled mass-produced
|> furniture but refused to repair its roof on the grounds that it could
|> claim for damage on insurance (an anyway it was none of the business of
|> the workers to meddle in these things) - ALL OF WHICH WENT OUT OF
|> BUSINESS - are you suggesting that all this was due to them propping up
|> uneconomic coal-mines and steel mills? Six years ago (6 YEARS) the
|> ability to open the car boot (trunk for US readers) from INSIDE the car
|> was standard on the cheapest SUZUKI on the market. There wasn't a car
|> made in Europe below the mid-luxury range which had that device. The
|> famed VW POLO (one of which I hired to see if I should buy it) came
|> without a sun visor as standard on the passenger side. How can these
|> design/management decisions be blamed on "expensive" British labour (Yes
|> I know VW is German) - and expensive British labour is another myth - or
|> job-coddling. 

(Or perhaps it was just the run-on sentence that was to blame.)

Decoding what you "write"[1], I think you are asking if I believe
that subsidizing coal mines and steel mills was solely responsible 
for various bad business decisions people have made over the years.

Answer: No, I don't.   Next?

jon.

"That's not writing, dear boy, that's typing" - Truman Capote.
From: smee@bristol.ac.uk (Paul Smee)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Is Clinton Wilson?
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:54:40 GMT
Reply-To: P.Smee@bristol.ac.uk (Paul Smee)
Organization: University of Bristol

In article <1992Oct1.135017.27650@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> cthorne@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Charles E Thorne) writes:
>For example, in the U.S. at the present time, Government health care programs
>cost about 4 or 5 times per person what comparable private programs cost and 
>yet we are constantly bombarded by people who want the government to do more.

Figures I've seen suggest differently.  Other figures I've seen suggest
that, if you compare treatment for treatment, a reasonably well
constituted government health service (e.g. Britain or Sweden) will get
you a lot more treatment for your money, because a large amount of the
US costs go towards the extra administration which is required in a
fee-paying system.

For all that, your number might be correct, depending on how you
perform your comparisons.  Patient for patient, I could well believe
it.  Why?  Because private programs have little disclaimers in their
fine print, which basically say that (though in slightly more weaselly
form) that you you get something which is expensive to treat, they
won't touch you.  When my father (in Pittsburgh -- I only LIVE here)
came down with Alzheimers, his insurance company basically disowned
him, for example.  The expensive diseases get passed on by the private
providers to the public sector.

Similarly, people who don't have insurance, and who rely on the public
sector, are also the people who are more likely to get conditions with
added complications.  Again, more expensive to treat.  It is painfully
and patently obvious that an organisation which will only treat cheap
cases is going to have a smaller per-patient cost than an organisation
which will handle expensive ones as well.  If you compare by treatment,
rather than by patient, you will find that the US private health system
is one of the biggest rip-offs going, by comparison with most of the
rest of the world (and by comparison with the US public health system),
in terms of how much treatment you get for how many dollars.

-- 
Paul Smee, Computing Service, University of Bristol, Bristol BS8 1UD, UK
 P.Smee@bristol.ac.uk - ..!uunet!uknet!bsmail!p.smee - Tel +44 272 303132
Xref: sparky soc.culture.british:13302 talk.religion.misc:17488 soc.culture.europe:8729