HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: maverick@fir.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Vance Maverick)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Manfred Kleins
Date: 6 Oct 1992 17:27:38 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: fir.cs.berkeley.edu

In article <5OCT199215525783@portal.lasc.lockheed.com>, le01167@portal.lasc.lockheed.com (Ron Nadel) writes:
|> Has anyone heard of Manfred Kleins?  I understand that
|> he is a scientist doing extensive research into the
|> emotional effects of music?  I believe he was in
|> Australia for the last 10 years or so doing some
|> work.  

His last name is spelled "Clynes", and his research is a crock. 
(He's a jerk, too, but you didn't ask.)  Even more than most
music-perception research, his relies on massive assumptions --
the bit about associating various curves with emotions, for
example, never questioned that such associations exist (or that,
if they did, they would work equally well as curves of pitch and
loudness); it was only a matter of sorting out which gesture went
with grief and which with sex.  And the other well-known tack of
his research, that of figuring out the correct way of playing the
classics by isolating the characteristic "pulses" of the
composers, never used any data but his intuition for deriving the
pulses.  Bruno Repp, who tried to check up on the listening data
which was supposed to support the pulse thing (using software I
helped write) couldn't confirm it, and Clynes fought back rather
angrily (see _Music Perception_ for a few years back).

Refreshed in crankiness,
	Vance
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cp78047@csie.nctu.edu.tw ()
Subject: BEST Mendelssohn flat E major Octet ?
Organization: National Chiao Tung University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 14:04:30 GMT

Please tell me what is the BEst Buy CD for The Masterpiece:
Mendelssohn : STring Octet in E flat Major.?
 THanks.               Jack Chou      University of Chou Ton ,Taiwan.
                       
          



cp78047@ccsun5.csie.nctu.edu.tw
From: inr@zardoz.caltech.edu (I. Neill Reid)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: re: London Philharmonic Orchestra
Date: 1 Oct 1992 15:57 PST
Organization: California Institute of Technology
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: zardoz.caltech.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

 I think this orchestra has just signed up as the resident orchestra
at the Royal Festival Hall - with the intention of establishing a
world-class orchestra to go with John Major's world-class grey suits,
and David Mellor's world-class Ugandan Affaires department. There
was a write-up on the various London orchestras in the New York Times
this monday (I think), with the Philharmonia's managing director
muttering imprecations against the LPO and Franz Worse-than-Most (his
expression) and claiming that the Philharmonia would actually play more
concerts at the RFH than the LPO. 

 The LSO is not the LPO - although many members may play in both - I
think there's only a limited number of players retained full-time by each 
orchestra, with the remainder essentially free-lance musicians. And
I think the LSO is the only self-governing London orchestra.

 Neill Reid

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: wells@cdsmn.mn.org (Rich Wells)
Subject: melody in Rachmaninoff's 2nd Symphony
Organization: Dicomed, Inc
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 20:58:29 GMT

The third movement of Rachmaninoff's Symphony #2 begins with a
melody that I know has been used by some pop/country tune.  I
think the name of the tune is "I'm Never Gonna Fall In Love
Again" or some such.  It may be from the mid-70's or so; I don't
think it is any older than that, but it may be newer.

Anyway, my wife, a friend of ours, and I heard the Minnesota
Orchestra perform this last night, and the exact identity of
this melody has been bothering us since then.  So I told my
wife and friend that I would consult the collective wisdom
of the net.  Anybody able to answer this one?

(BTW, I did check the FAQ; it isn't there.  In fact, there is no
section for melodies from classical music used in contemporary
popular music.  Should there be?)

-- 

Richard Wells  wells@cdsmn.mn.org  or  ...!tcnet!cdsmn!wells
From: mbh@sdphu1.ucsd.edu (Matt Harrington)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Need source for posters with classical music themes
Date: 1 Oct 92 04:32:34 GMT
Organization: Physics Department, UCSD
NNTP-Posting-Host: sdphu1.ucsd.edu

I'd like to get some posters to decorate my apartment with.  I can't
find any with classical music topics at the local poster store.  I'm
particually interested in a sketch of Beethoven's profile which I've
seen on a T-shirt.  Anyone know where I can get something like this?
Please send a copy of your response to me via email in case I miss it on
the net.  Thanks in advance.

					Regards,

					Matt Harrington
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mtp@oregon.uoregon.edu (Matthias Pohl)
Subject: Re: Question about BMG
Organization: Dep. of Chemistry
Distribution: rec
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 15:26:38 GMT

In article <1992Sep28.170256.6403@math.utexas.edu>, ssyun@iso.ma.utexas.edu (SungSik Yun) writes:
> 
> Hi?
> I am buying many classical CD from BMG Compact Disc Club.
> Now I am thinking if the qualities of CD from BMG is different 
> from others?
> Do you have any info?
> Thanks.
> 
..well, if you buy so many CDs from them you should be able to judge for yourself :)

/Matthias
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: haydn symphony recommendations
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 01:34:02 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.171005.42112@bas-a.bcc.ac.uk> ucap22w@ucl.ac.uk (Martin S T Watts) writes:
>inr@eccles.caltech.edu (I. Neill Reid) writes:
>
>> yes, it's the Haydn backlash. Sorry, Asbed Bedrossian, but
>>I agree completely with Deryck Barker - Haydn was the finer
>>symphonist than Mozart (the piano concerti are another matter).
>
>But what do you and Deryck mean by finer symphonist? In his time, Haydn was
>probably the more innovative in developing the form, but surely Mozart was the
>more imaginative of the two in terms of what he used the form for, as he was
>in most other genres. I'm fond of Haydn myself, but not to the extent of going
>overboard in comparing his efforts to Mozart's.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I find Haydn's symphonies to be
consitently more thematically interesting, more structurally
interesting (althoug I claim no special knowledge or insight here) and
just plain more satisfying than Mozart's. Mozart's best symphonies are
the ones with piano. :-)

>One genre where I *do* think Haydn superior to Mozart, though, is choral music.
>Haydn seems here to have been much more consistently inspired than Mozart, and
>I can't for the life of me see why the latter's masses have achieved such
>popularity. The fact that his most famous, the Requiem and C-minor, both
>remain  unfinished seems unsurprising (admittedly more so in the case of the
>Requiem!). Some of Mozart's fugal writing is positively mind-numbing and if
>anybody can explain to me why on earth the Requiem is so popular, without
>mentioning the film 'Amadeus', I might be a happier man.

And I was thinking I was the only person who finds the Requiem
tedious. It's one of the few works I didn't even enjoy singing that
much.

Now let's all lay into Handel's bloody Messiah.

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Help on buying Beethoven's 5th and 9th
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 17:12:41 GMT

In article <1ar61bINN8dq@agate.berkeley.edu> jkonghsu@ocf.berkeley.edu (James Kong Hsu) writes:
>
>I am planning to get beethoven's 5th and 9th on CD. Does anyone have
>any suggestions on which conductors are the best for each?

Some time ago I did a survey of numerous (but by no means all)
recordings of all 9. This is about to be available for anonymous FTP
as BEETHOVEN.TXT under the [.MISC] directory (this *is* VMS I'm
afraid) on camins.camosun.bc.ca Maybe this will help some, although
you'll never get more than a few people to agree on a *single* best
version.

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: AH.PBL@forsythe.stanford.edu (Mark)
Subject: Re: melody in Rachmaninoff's 2nd Symphony
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 22:20:55 GMT

In article <BvGnLI.MrK@cdsmn.mn.org>,
wells@cdsmn.mn.org (Rich Wells) writes:
>The third movement of Rachmaninoff's Symphony #2 begins with a
>melody that I know has been used by some pop/country tune.  I
>think the name of the tune is "I'm Never Gonna Fall In Love
>Again" or some such.  It may be from the mid-70's or so; I don't
>think it is any older than that, but it may be newer.
>
  The title of the song is "All By Myself".  I don't know
who wrote/sang it, though.  Eric something...?

  "All by myself, I don't wanna be...all by myself...
blah, blah, blah..."

-- Mark

--------------------------------------------------------------------
"We make progress at night, when the politicians sleep."
- Brazilian proverb.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: A8411DAG@vm.univie.ac.at (Werner Friedl)
Subject: Fax or phone number of Haverstick&Ballyk
Organization: University of Vienna
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 10:29:28 GMT

I would like to order CDs from the phone order company Haverstick&Ballyk.
They only have an 800 number on their catalogue, and I am now outside the US.
Does anybody know their fax or a regular phone number, which can be called
from outside the US? Their toll free number is (800) 222 6872.



Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: DAVID.CASHMORE@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("David Cashmore")
Subject: re: haydn symphony recommendations
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: 30 Sep 92 17:26:22 EST

Neill Reid writes "Yes, it's the Haydn backlash".  I too love Haydn's
symphonies and have never managed to adjust to Mozart in the same way.  Maybe
if my budget was larger I would have the opportunity!   My 5 year old daughter
would recommend No. 60 (Il distratto).  When I had a tape of it out of the
library she said to me "Can I listen to the music that goes soft then loud?"

Also... after reading something about the man and his life you get the
impression that he was actually likeable!!!

David
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: steve@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter)
Subject: Re: Anyone heard of this piece?
Organization: Morgan Stanley & Co., New York, NY
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 15:51:20 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.161216.17403@fid.morgan.com> steve@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter) writes:
>In article <icking.717859517@gmd.de> icking@gmd.de (Werner Icking) writes:
>>In <1992Sep22.223549.1596@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com> lms@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com (Max Stern 310-524-6152) writes:
>>
>>>In article <15180@mindlink.bc.ca> Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike
>>>Quigley) writes:
>>>>[...]
>>>>Didn't Ernst Toch write something like this? I think he did a piece called the
>>>>Geographical Fugue which had excerpts from a road map...
>>
>>>The Geographical Fugue is a piece for six (if I remember correctly)
>>                                       four (standard SATB)
>>>voices, who recite (in German) the names of various geographical
>>>locations like "der Fluss Mississippi," Brindisi, etc.  It is entirely
>>>spoken, so the main musical elements are rhythm, counterpoint,
>>>dynamics, and form.
>>
>>I have an LP which contains: "Fuge (aus?) der Geographie". It's a set
>>of two LPs from the Lockenhaus 1982 Festival which is organized by
>>Gidon Kraemer et.al. The B-side of the 2nd LP contains a lot of musical
>>jokes, the last of them is Toch's Fuge.
>>
>>The best piece is "Meditation" (JSB & Gounod) played by Franz Xaver
>>Ohnesorg (Luftpumpe - bicycle pump?) and Oleg Maisenberg (Piano).
>>I do not understand how FXO was able to continue playing while the
>>audience was shaked from laughing (you understand my english?).
>
>There is a new Philips CD of Lockenhaus Encores (called, I believe,
>just that) which may contain several of these pieces.  It may, in
>fact, be identical to the set you describe.
>
>>
>>Werner
>>--
>>Werner Icking           icking@gmd.de            (+49 2241) 14-2443     __o
>>GMD - Gesellschaft fuer Mathematik und Datenverarbeitung mbH          _`\<,_
>>Schloss Birlinghoven, P.O.Box 1316, D-5205 Sankt Augustin, Germany   (_)/ (_)
>>                             "Der Dativ ist dem Genitiv sein Tod." ~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>


Nope.  I was mistaken.  Here are the contents of

	Encore!
	Gidon Kremer & Friends
	Philips 432 252 2

	Professor Bor:		Double Concerto for Swing Trio
	Leopold Mozart:		Musikalische Schlittenfahrt
	Werner Thomas: 		Haydn's Saltensprung
	Fritz Kreisler: 	Liebeslied
	Arvo Part: 		Quintettino
	John Cage: 		Mysterious Adventure
	Dimitri Shostakovich: 	Polka
	Ladislav Kupkovic: 	Souvenir
	Bohuslav Martinu: 	Charleston
	Leonid Caishyk: 	Improvisation

Perhaps the forthcoming 10 CD set of Lockenhaus material will
contain some of the pieces you mention.

Steve
From: lampson@software.pulse.com (Dave Lampson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: rec.music.classical Biographical Compendium - Call For Submissions
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:41:07 GMT


Earlier this year, the rec.music.classical Biographical Compendium was
created to act as a central repository of biographical information about
readers of, and contributors to, the rec.music.classical newsgroup.  The
purpose of these biograpies is simply to increase the members awareness
of the background of the individuals they converse with on the net and
to possibly find information about common interests.  Information of a
sensitive or personal nature is not solicited, and there are no length,
style or content requirements.  So far, the compendium contains 48
biographies for the participants in and/or readers of rec.music.classical
(see list below).

The time has come for the periodic posting of the biographies, and I
have not received any new biographis since the last posting in August.  
Therefore, I'd like to encourage anyone who has been planning on submitting
something and putting it off, or would otherwise like to be represented
in the compendium, to send their submissions to me at the address given
below.  The bios are most interesting if they include some information as
to general background, musical background, and any special and/or current
musical interests.

          Deryk G.R. Barker
          Anthony Becker
          Hector Bellmann
          John Bodnar
          David Brooks
          Deborah Burton
          Jon Alan Conrad
          Kyle Dawkins
          Jonathan Delatizky
          Rob Dobson
          James Nathan Duquette
          Houston Dunleavy
          Victor Eijkhout
          Dave Frederick
          Mike Garrahan
          Fred Goldrich
          Curtis Heisey
          James G. Henderson
          Karl Prescott Henning
          Jill Hollifield
          Michael Hughes
          Werner Icking
          Bill Johnson
          Chris Johnson
          Bob Kosovsky
          Winslowe Lacesso
          Lawrence David Lampson
          Maarten van Loon
          Vance Maverick
          Tony Movshon
          Iain Neill Reid
          Bruce Rodean
          Henry D. Shapiro
          Greg Skinner
          Harold Smoliar
          Stephen Smoliar
          Max Stern
          Carl Tait
          Timothy Takahashi
          Gregory Taylor
          Michael Thorn
          Jennifer Turney
          Raymond S. Tuttle
          Francois R. Velde
          Gabe M. Wiener
          Richard Wilmer
          Ellis Workman
          Carol Gee Zarbock

If you have any questions, please let me know.

Dave
lampson@pulse.com    [NOTE NEW EMAIL ADDRESS]
From: asbed@sol.usc.edu (Asbed Bedrossian)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Haydn symphony recommendations?
Date: 27 Sep 1992 01:17:14 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.usc.edu

In article <dube.717575530@milton> dube@milton.u.washington.edu (Ric Dube) writes:
>     I have just recently started listening to classical music and have
>determined that a lot of music from the late 1700's appeals to me.  I
>especially like Haydn's "La Poule".  Would anyone be able to recommend
>any of his other symphonies which may have a similar feel?  I'm not
>really looking for any recordings in particular, but just his symphonies
>which are generally considered his best compositions.   

At the expense of inflaming all my serious friend here on r.m.c ...

If you're looking for something with a similar feel, symphonies 1 through
106 might please you.

But if you're _really_ looking for excellent Haydn, get some Mozart. I
especially love his G-minor symphonies (25 & 40). (This is not to put down
papa Haydn, as I, too, love him dearly.)

A little more seriously now: I think you might recognize and enjoy parts of
the "Surprise" (94 in G) Symphony, although it is a later one and not
necessarily fully comparable to the "Hen" (La Poule).

>Dan-O

:ll
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: djd33237@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (anon)
Subject: Re: Berceuse?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 01:28:49 GMT

Ken,

	Stravinsky's Berceuse I believe comes from the Firebird Suite.

Denny d'Alelio
Sinfonia!
gumbo@uiuc.edu
From: 00hfstahlke@bsu-ucs.uucp
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Why switch to CD?
Date: 5 Oct 92 13:41:01 GMT

I think I'm one of the last non-CD owners.  And I'm finding that state a little
frustrating but the thought of changing it not attractive enough outweigh the
frustration.

The problem is that recordings I'd like to own I can't buy because I don't have
a CD player.  I could correct that by buying one, but every time I think of
doing so I compare the prices of CDs and cassettes and decide that I still
don't really want to do that.    (I'm probably not as poor as I am tight.)  

The question is, "What are the advantages of getting into the CD market?

As I see it, there are two advantages:

1.  CD sound quality is better than tape or LP.

2.  An increasing number of good recordings will be available only on CD.
 
I find #1 probably true but largely irrelevant.  The difference in sound
quality will show up best with high quality equipment.  I do most of my
listening in a car with typically dead acoustics and road noise, in my office,
occasionally, where, at best, I have to keep it soft, and at home, where I live
with two teenagers whose production values are clearly more analog than 
digital.  Also, remember that I confess to being tight.

#2 bothers me a bit, because I don't believe in piracy, and so I won't borrow 
and copy CDs to tape on my son's system.  Also, once I've gotten past the
initial costs, I then face the longterm cost of converting a large collection
of records and tapes to CD, a significant investment I don't see the point
of--and probably would not be compelled to make.
          
I'm sure others of you have struggled with the same question.  If I can find
convincing reason to do so, I'll bite the CD.  Can anyone provide such reasons?

Herb Stahlke  
Ball State University
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: altizer@figaro (Robert Altizer)
Subject: Munich area opera schedule wanted
Reply-To: altizer@chdasic.sps.mot.com
Organization: Motorola SPS
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 15:36:28 GMT

I may be travelling to the Munich area from November 14-20, and would like
information on opera performances scheduled in that time frame.  I am totally
unfamiliar with any companies or houses in the area, so if you reply, please
be specific.  You can post or send email.

Thanks in advance,
Bob

---
#----------------------------------------------------------------------#
#      Robert Altizer - Motorola ASIC Software Quality Assurance       #
#  1300 North Alma School Road, M/S CH240, Chandler AZ 85224-8517 USA  #
#             Voice: (602) 821-4249 -- FAX: (602) 821-4167             #
# Internet: altizer@chdasic.sps.mot.com -- X.400: R10908@email.mot.com #
#----------------------------------------------------------------------#
#   Nature has neither kernel nor shell, she is everything at once.    #
#                                   -- Goethe                          #
#----------------------------------------------------------------------#

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Michael J Valinis)
Subject: Re: switching to CD's
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 22:22:21 GMT

I have another reason for switching from cassettes to CD's that nobody seems to
have mentioned yet: cassettes are an electromagnetic medium and will degrade 
with time, much as floppy disks will.  I have probably a thousand cassettes, 
and I've recently noticed that the oldest of these (perhaps 15 years old) are 
starting to show their age.  In spite of careful use and storage, several of 
them exhibit loss of higher frequencies and a decreased signal to noise ratio.
I expect that in another 10 -15 years a large part of my collection will be 
virtually unplayable.  I have several reel-to-reel tapes from about 20 years 
ago that are totally unacceptable now.

Concerning LP's, a decent programmable, linear tracking turntable can be found 
in the $130.00 to $150.00 range.  Linear tracking greatly reduces the noise 
ration on older worn recordings.  Many worn recordings which I could barely 
stand listening to sound much better with linear tracking, so keep the old LP's
and invest in a good turntable, but be prepared to eventually kiss your 
cassettes goodbye!
-- 
=>   Michael J. Valinis   -=+{*}+=-   mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   <=
+>=>   * * *     "Learning music by reading about it is like     * * *   <=<+
=>+>=>   * * *      making love by mail."   - Isaac Stern      * * *   <=<+<=
+>=>+>=>+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+<=<+<=<+
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel)
Subject: Re: Zander/Beethoven 9
Organization: Visual
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 92 19:05:09 GMT

Rob Brooks writes:

>I recently read an interesting Gramophone review of the just-issued
>recording of Beethoven's 9th with Benjamin Zander conducting the Boston
>Philharmonic (a semi-professional Boston-based group, *not* the BSO). 

If you happen to be back in Boston on October 29, the BPO is doing
the Saint-Saens Third in Symphony Hall that night, using the newly-
restored organ.

This would be an awesome piece to hear live.

Rob
From: mgresham@dscatl.UUCP (Mark Gresham)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Music for Ectoplasmodium
Date: 28 Sep 92 16:11:30 GMT
Reply-To: mgresham@dscatl.UUCP (Mark Gresham)
Organization: Digital Systems Co,  Atlanta, Ga

In article <1992Sep23.232049.10788@fid.morgan.com> steve@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter) writes:
>Recent mention of Cyril Scott caused me to wonder about
>musicians who were interested in the occult.  Scott, for
>example, was either a Blavatskyite or a member of the Order
>of the Golden Dawn.  Who else?

Scriabin.  Check out the radical differences between the first
half of his piano sonata and the second half, BTW.


Cheers,

--Mark Gresham

dscatl!mgresham@gatech.edu

==========================
From: Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Speaking of leitmotifs
Date: 26 Sep 92 22:33:08 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

There is a sweeping, dramatic theme, if not leitmotif in Die Walkure which
reappears during Brunnhilde's Immolation aria that's always struck me for some
reason. But I can't see what is the connection, if there is any. The Die
Walkure one is heard just before Sieglinde takes off from Brunnhilde and the
Valkyries, it's on CD #3 at 2:27 of track 10, while the Gotterdammerung one is
on CD #4 at 2:36 of track 15. Does anyone have any idea if there's supposed to
be some secret symbolic meaning to this? It doesn't seem like there is any in
the text.

(I'm referring to the Solti Ring here.)