Newsgroups: alt.atheism,soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Words Feminists find Demeaning!
From: minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 16:47:20 GMT
Organization: University of Cincinnati

In article <1992Jul28.081051.1618@cco.caltech.edu> bes@cco.caltech.edu (Behnam Sadeghi) writes:
>In article <1992Jul27.145700.3200@fs7.ece.cmu.edu> locklin@henry.ece.cmu.edu (Scott Locklin) writes:
>>
>>Gee I love your argument that we can't understand islam because
>>we don't speak arabic;what a great demonstration of the ethno-centrism
>>and jingoism that makes islam so repulsive to so many. 
>
>If Islam is repulsive to you, fine.  Let's see if this impression is
>based on knowledge or unfounded prejudices:
>
>>re:feminists/islam; your definitions of what constitues mistreatment of
>>women (by YOUR I mean that of the quran & islam) are certainly much
>>different than that of the rest of the world. Is it mistreatment of women to
>>allow them to clother themselves as they please, hold jobs,DRIVE CARS (that
>>means you saudi-arabia...) e Perhaps in the days of the origins of islam
>>women were indeed considered as equals, this is certainly not the case
>>in modern day islamic cultures as their lawn and customs give evidence..
>
>
>Islam allows women to hold jobs.  Islam says nothing specifically about
>driving cars.  However, at the time of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him),
>women rided camels.    To say that the law in Saudi Arabia is an indication
>of what Islam is all about is exactly like saying this:  The fact that 1/3
>of women are raped in the U.S. and 1/4 female infants are sexually abused
>in this country is a result of Chritianity's encouragement of these crimes.
>Totally illogical, of course.    Also, Saudi Arabia is the only country
>where women don't drive.  So, what you're doing is to generalize the 
>culture of a few million Muslims to one billion Muslims.  Illogical again,
>of course.  By this type of reasoning, it would no problem at all for me
>to "prove" that Americans are all murderers, theives, rapistas, pimps, and 
>prostitutes.
>
>>While the islam of countries like america,canada and europe may indeed 
>>espouse the high ideals that Sandra speaks of (probobly because of the 
>>laws in these countries...), Fundamentalist islamic countries such as
>>Saudi-Arabia and Iran are far from these ideals (in practice anyway)
>
>Let's see.... in the "fundamentalist" (whatever that word means) country 
>of Iran, you won't find 1/3 of women being sexually assaulted, as is the 
>case in the U.S.  In Iran, there are 9 women in the Parliament which is--
>both in terms of absolute and relative numbers-- greater than the number
>of women in the US Sentate.  In Iran there are women doctors, engineers,
>film-makers, managers, and politicians.  The also "fundamentalist" Islamic
>Republic of Pakistan just had a female president, while it doesn't look
>like the same will happen in the U.S. any time soon.
>
>This is not to say, of course, that women are not oppressed in Iran.  
>Unfortunately, women are oppressed in all countries.  The degree of 
>oppression is dependent on many variables, including the level of
>industrialization, urbanization, public education, prosperity, religious
>beliefs, cultural mores, etc.   Adherence to Islam is exactly what is needed
>for the liberation of Muslim women.
>
>
>One question I wondered about for some time was this:  Given the fact
>that women are opppressed in the U.S. as well (e.g. refer to statistics
>regarding rape, wife-beating, lack of equal pay for equal work, etc.), why
>is that Americans [and Westerners in general], shed rivers of crocodile
>tears for Muslim women while pushing the grave problems of women in their
>own countries under the rug?  I arrived at the conclusion that it is not
>the status of Muslim women that these people really care about.  They don't
>give a damn about Muslims, be they male or female.  All they care about
>is covering up their own problems and insecurities, easing their conscience
>about the miserable status of American (and Western) women, and making
>themselves feel better by putting down others. 
>

Salam Alaikum Behnam, may add one more thing, not only is it that they are
trying to cover up there own problems, but when it comes right down to it
these people who just moan about the plight of Muslim women, these WHITE 
people are just racist.

sincerely

zafar minhas