From: cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher Morton)
Subject: Re: Death Penalty, for or against?
Reply-To: cmort@ncoast.org (Christopher Morton)
Organization: North Coast Public Access *NIX, Cleveland, OH
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 20:29:13 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.african.american

As quoted from <HANS.92Oct5155640@ravn.iesd.auc.dk> by hans@iesd.auc.dk (Hans Huttel):

> 
> In article <BvGM7p.G0p@NCoast.ORG> cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher
> Morton) writes:
> 
> > 2. The question of deterrence is irrelevant.  The death penalty prevents 
> > recidivism by the perpetrator, ABSOLUTELY.
> >
> > 3. Chronically violent persons present a threat not only to society at large,
> > but to prison guards and inmates alike.  What should be done, indeed what CAN
> > be done with someone who continues to commit murder after receiving a life
> > sentence?  Curtail his icecream ration?
> 
> [ stuff deleted ]
> 
> > Make it DANGEROUS to commit crimes.  The only thing that the current
> > mania for repressive gun controls has proven is that gun control makes
> > crime safe for the criminal.
> 
> But then, surely, even shoplifters should be executed to prevent them
> from stealing again ?

The last I'd heard, shoplifting doesn't pose a threat to life and limb.  Maybe
you guys have more determined shoplifters.... :)

> On a more serious note: What is the purpose of the U.S. criminal
> system ?  Is it the prevention of recidivism ? The revenge of whoever
> makes the laws against those perceived as criminals ? As far as I, a
> naive European who has only visited the United States once, the latter
> seems to be the case. Not that we are better off on this side of the
> Atlantic (see below).

The FIRST purpose should be to protect the life and limb of the populace.  That
purpose is not served by allowing people to kill REPEATEDLY without sanction.

> I would urge anyone in favour of the death penalty to think of the
> British cases of the Guildford Four and the Birmingham Six. As we all
> know now, these 10 people were innocent and had been framed by police
> officers seeking promotion. After the appalling IRA pub bombings in
> 1974 there was widespread support for the idea of reintroducing the
> death penalty in the UK. If the death penalty had been reintroduced,
> ten innocent people would have lost their lives. It was only because
> of British TV that the truth was eventually accepted.
> 
> Is that really the sort of risk we are willing to take ?

Yes.  Of course why are YOU willing to take the risk of imprisoning an 
innocent man?  After all, he could be raped or even murdered in prison.  In
fact, the American Civil Liberties Union takes that position and opposes even
encarceration for most crimes.

> The Guildford Four and the Birmingham Six were framed because they
> happened to be Irish in the wrong place at the wrong time. What on
> earth would prevent the U.S. police from using similar tactics against
> Black people ? How do we know that it hasn't happened ?

What keeps them from doing it regarding imprisonment?  What prevents an Alton
Coleman from continuing to kill in prison?  Termination of his icecream 
ration?  What if he promises to kill one inmate or guard for each serving of
rocky road he misses?  Will you kill him then?  Or will you impose life in
solitary confinement?  Wouldn't some people consider THAT cruel too?

All of the above aside, what about when there is NO doubt?


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