HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: boardbreaking and quantam physics
Date: 23 Jul 92 04:43:40 GMT
Organization: Cray Computer Corporation

In article <1992Jul22.191631.7251@walter.cray.com> radner@cray.com (Lauren Radner) writes:
>In article <1992Jul22.173404.1232@craycos.com> sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi) writes:
>>In article <Brsont.Bnu@helios.physics.utoronto.ca> butscher@helios.physics.utoronto.ca (Adrian Butscher) writes:
>>>Hmmm...
>>>
>>>The Quantum Mechanics of board breaking?  I'm not too sure if that's the way
>>
>>OK, OK, OK...let's get a board, some cyanide, a karate-ka in a cat suit, and
>>a BIG airtight box...
>>
>>This is, of course, the famous Schrodinger's Tameshiwari thought experiment.
>>
>>The cat suit is *not* optional.
>>
>>Steve
>
>
>..... all you guys are gonna want Michelle Pfeiffer for this, aren't you...
>

Nope, it *has* to be Kathy Long. The experiment won't work unless the
subject is a Real Martial Artist (tm).

Unless, of course, you're volunteering ;-).

Steve
From: bae@Auspex.COM (Brian Ehrmantraut)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Mail Order Knives
Date: 29 Jul 92 00:10:18 GMT

In article <154l71INNgdm@agate.berkeley.edu>, robinson@cogsci.Berkeley.EDU (Michael Robinson) writes:
> 
> Yes, but how do you sharpen that funky Spyderco edge?
> 
	
	With the Spyderco tri-angle sharpener.  Clever racket, eh?

			bae
-- 
		Brian A. Ehrmantraut

BELL:   voice:(408) 492-0900  fax: (408) 492-0909  
USnail:	Auspex Systems, 2952 Bunker Hill Lane, Santa Clara, CA 95054  
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: rtang@sunee.waterloo.edu (The One Your Mother Warned You About!)
Subject: Re: years for black belt
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 12:07:33 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.152210.20460@craycos.com> sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi) writes:
>In article <l6urdoINNpis@nunki.usc.edu> silverma@nunki.usc.edu (David Silverman) writes:
>>How many times does it gnerally take to pass the black belt test?
>>Someone earlier said they passed on the third try, in the art I'm
>>studying you get only one chance (of course they're pretty sure you'll
>>pass if they let you take it).
>
>What happens if you flunk? Do they use you for tameshigiri or something?
>
>Steve
The way things work conserning obtaining a BB at the dojo I go to. Is
In general, it USUALLY takes one try to pass the test. Although they
are pretty sure you can pass before you try for it.  I have seen the
occasional person who fails a BB test, they basically have to wait
another 6 months or more to try again.  How ready you really are, depends
on the particular branch and intructor of the school.  The first 
instructor I had, the way thing always seems to work out (and for all belts)
is that when you basically stop thinking about going for THAT next belt
and becoming "comfortable" with the belt you have, THEN he lets you
go for a grading.        

RT
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: dpipes@spica.srg (Dave Pipes x4552)
Subject: Re: Dog Techniques
Organization: just me
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 16:16:10 GMT
Followup-To: rec.martial-arts

In article <1992Jul27.220514.2534@pages.com> kevin@pages (Kevin Sven Berg) writes:
<Most of the article subjected to exsanguination>
>
>ps. I've found that attitude toward the animal counts for
>a lot. For instance, I stopped the second attack by (unconsciously)
>yelling the command "STOP", and pointing; at which point the dog
>obeyed. I've used the command attitude successfully since. 
>I suppose it wouldn't count too much in the case of true 
>attack dogs, though ;-)

When I lived in Chicago, one guy in the building had a monster Rottweiler,
which would sit and salivate whenever someone walked by as it waited for
its master outside a store.  After a few passes, it became obvious that the
beast was attack trained.  Then one day I followed the guy down to the 
supermarket.  He turned to the dog and told it, in German, to stay (bleib' hier).

I speak German.  Every time I saw him after that, I always smiled, because I
knew I could get the dog to obey me, if needed.  What, you say?  How did I
know that it would disobey its' master if needed?

Because every command he gave it, in German, was preceeded by the word
"strawberry" - in German.  Stuck out like a sore thumb.  Seems like the
old problem of security through obscurity applies to training animals, too.

		David Pipes

And the dog's name?  "Hercules"...sheesh...

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: jmeyers@ecst.csuchico.edu (Jeff Meyers)
Subject: Re: When is one experienced enough to teach?
Organization: California State University, Chico
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 05:08:10 GMT

In my sytle (Dan Zan Ryu Jujitsu) it is basically accepted that
"instructors" are at least first Dan.  I think for a school to
be officially recognized by the AJJF (the entity that preserves 
and promotes our style) this is a requirement.  At brown-belt
levels, a student may be considered a "junior instructor" and so
help with classes, teach beginners, hold open mat sessions, etc.

As a general idea, we believe in allowing everyone to help teach.
That is, once you have learned some techniques (or the essentials of)
you help teach those that are new to those techniques.  Teaching an
art really helps you solidify it in your mind!

-- 
============================================================================
| Jeff Meyers      |  jmeyers@ecst.csuchico.edu      | 39 43'N - 121 48'W  |
| Chico, Ca 95926  |  KD6DIS@KE6LW.#NOCAL.CA.USA.NA  | Grid: CN80-CM99 ??  |
============================================================================
From: heller@teucer.think.com (Steve Heller)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: associations
Date: 21 Jul 92 19:13:50 GMT
Distribution: rec.martial-arts
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: teucer.think.com


   From: chang@ADELPHI-ASSB01.ARMY.MIL (Forrest Chang)
   Subject: Re: TKD Forms
   Date: 30 Jun 92 19:55:14 GMT
   
   <big snip>
   
   	So, there are lots of organizations in the U.S. alone (I can
   only really speak for the U.S. and Korea) that call themselves tkd,
   theres the USTU (US WTF branch), USTF( US ITF branch), ATA, ATF (two
   of these in fact) Duk Song Son's organization (Sorry dunno the name
   world something or another).  
   
   <more snippage>
   
Mr. Son's organization is the World Tae Kwon Do Association, the WTA; I'm a
member.  I think it's pretty big in absolute terms, but I have no idea in
relative terms.  I've met people from, I'd guess, close to a hundred
schools, and I understand that there are three to four hundred schools in
all.  The organization is most concentrated in the north-east of the US,
especially New York --- Mr. Son teaches at the HQ school in NYC, and there
are WTA clubs in pockets through the mid-west (near other WTA masters),
in other parts of the US, and there are some international clubs.

-steve

(Steve Heller --- heller@Think.COM)
From: hahn@plugh.network.com (Peter Hahn)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: years for black belt
Keywords: black belt time
Date: 23 Jul 92 18:38:21 GMT
Organization: Network Systems Corporation

In article <seah.711850080@sfu.ca> seah@fraser.sfu.ca (Simon Seah) writes:
>Okay.  Another potentially silly and flammable question

Heck, I'm starting to look forward to your posts.

>                                                        from the ignorant
>one who plays role-playing games that are so cinematic as to be miles from
>the truth.

You should fit in just fine around here, then.

>How many years does it take to become a belt belt in a martial art?
>Assuming the first possible level of black belt (as, I am told, high levels
>sometimes involve non-martial arts activities), and continuous, dedicated,
>training.

I will attempt to give a literal answer to your question, without
interposing any editorial comments.  You'll have to judge for yourself
whether such an answer is truly responsive to your question.

An average, at least here in the U.S., would probably work out to around
four or five years, assuming that you trained a couple of hours a nite,
maybe two, three, nights a week, and rather more than that towards the
end.  Traditional and/or non-commercial schools would probably be a
bit more than that.  Some schools cut the above time in half, or more --
this is a subject of much contentious debate in martial arts circles.

Just to muddy the waters even more, several well-known and widely
respected martial arts teachers earned their first black belts in
very short times -- sometimes even less than a year.  This was
under fairly exceptional circumstances -- they were young, athletic
servicemen, stationed in Okinawa or Korea, and with nothing better
to do than train seven or eight hours a day, seven days a week.

>-Yes, I still have my asbestos suit on.

Glad to hear it.  Say, while you still have it on, don't you
want to ask us what a black belt really means?

Go ahead, I dare you ;-).

-- 
Peter Hahn           |hahn@network.com|"...In Peking, he told me, there lived a
7600 Boone Ave. N    |+1 612 424-4888 |famous boxer who dropped down from three
Brooklyn Park, MN USA|                |stories onto an interior courtyard
55428                |                |without making a sound when he landed."
From: roberts@pogo.wv.tek.com (Robert Stroud)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Kendo in Seattle
Date: 24 Jul 92 19:11:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: pogo.13210
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Tektronix Inc., Beaverton, Or.

I would like the person who sent me email about 
kendo in Seattle to plese try again.  My new system
administrator has successfully destroyed all traces
of your email.  Sorry.
-- 
Robert Stroud
Obukan Kendo Club
Portland Oregon USA
roberts@pogo.wv.tek.com
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: stark@dwovax.enet.dec.com (Todd I. Stark)
Subject: Re: Gatorade vs. Water vs. Anything Else
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Distribution: rec
Date: 29 JUL 92 12:43:32    


>>  I've heard some people say that regardless of what Gatorade makes you
>>think, water is all you really need after a hard workout.  Anyone know
>>if Gatorade is really that good, and why?  
> 

My opinion follows.

Water is your best bet, or experimenting carefully with recovery
drinks if you have greater needs than met by water.   If you are really
working at a level of intensity or heat that you need something more
than water, then Gatorade is probably not the best choice, imo.

It depends on your type of training, your point in the training cycle,
and your personal needs.  Most people are fine with water.  Some endurance
athletes need to replenish electrolytes.  Gatorade is potentially
good for that purpose, but also potentially dangerous, because you
get too much of the electrolytes for most people's needs, not to mention
the sugar, as Stephen said.   Definitely cut it (dilute it) if you slurp massive
quantities to replace fluids and aren't sure about your electrolyte needs.

There are other drinks, like glucose polymers (carbo drinks), and recovery
ergogenic aids that help many hard training athletes keep up blood sugar,
heal tissue breakdown, and scavenge free radicals, which are more likely
the kinds of needs serious athletes have than those addressed by Gatorade.
The advantage of a glucose polymer over the sugar in Gatorade is that
The polymers are absorbed much more slowly into the blood, giving a more even
energy level.  And you can get different polymers that are absorbed at
different rates to match your needs by experimentation.  Assuming you are 
replacing fluids gradually during training (as you should be in most cases), 
rather than drinking all at once after a workout.

I seem to remember a fairly good discussion of this in the Haas
sports nutrition books, and in Hatfield's 'Ultimate Performance
Nutrition.'

						kind regards,

						todd
From: garth@dojo.West.Sun.COM (Garth)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Starting back...
Date: 23 Jul 1992 20:31:44 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Distribution: world
Reply-To: garth@dojo.West.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: dojo.west.sun.com

In article 24101@castle.ed.ac.uk, jamesh@castle.ed.ac.uk (James Hammerton) writes:
>There is a complicating factor.
>Due to my hip problem, my back is quite sensitive(the muscles are
>readjusting to me being back to normal again) and I was wondering what
>advise you guys might give me for my initial training? 
>
>Also I am thinking of taking up either Ju Jitsu or Aikido as well. Would
>this be a good idea? Are throws liable to do my back in? 

People with back problems should avoid arts that teach throws...one of
the first things they try to teach you is how to fall, which will work
great on a healthy back (after you learn to do it right), but will
be very bad on a bad back.

-Garth
               




			= = = = = = =
  | Garth R. Doverspike		Sun Microsystems, S.E. Seattle |
  | garth.doverspike@west.sun.com			       |

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: radner@cray.com (Lauren Radner)
Subject: Re: East Coast MA gathering
Keywords: Need 1 -2 more instructors please
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 22 Jul 92 00:37:40 CDT

In article <1992Jul21.155111.25378@relay.nswc.navy.mil> snorthc@nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt) writes:
>
>			East Coast Martial Arts Gathering
>Proposed DRAFT schedule, comments welcome.

>AUG 9 Program
>8:30 - 10:00 A.M. Continental breakfast
>***** relocate to river *********
>10:00 - 12:00	T5:  Water training/Gun techniques?????
                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 ... I think you're missing a bet here, Stephen. You could 
combine these two and practice water-gun techniques... 

-Lauren
From: browne@Apple.COM (Sean Browne)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Kadena de Mano seminar
Keywords: Inayan Center and Mike Inay
Date: 28 Jul 92 21:46:39 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

I attended the Kadena de Mano seminar at the Inayan
center recently and would like to give my thoughts
on it. I really enjoyed it. It was my first time at
the Inayan center. The people were very friendly and
helpful. 

Mike began the class with a little information on himself
and some history on the Phillipino fighting arts. He 
outlined the three ranges of Kadena de Mano which are
Asessing, Crashing, and Grappling. We did several exercises
on deflecting punches and then moving in to disable an arm
hitting nerves with strikes and then following it into a 
lock that set up a throw or takedown. We worked on several
drills that were increasingly realistic. Finally we were 
drilling where both hands are in the attack and you must 
grapple to lock out both the opponents arms/hands to set
up the attack. We also did drills in Ducking, Bobbing, and
weaving to avoid knife strikes. The knife training also 
involved knife disarms. 

We learned a lot of really useful moves. Mostly I learned 
how there were many ways to accomplish the goal and you need
to just move with the opponents energy and be able to change
your plan as the action is taking place. I want to learn more
about this kind of infighting. I am definitely going to attend
the sinawali seminar on the 6th of August and encourage others
in this area to attend. I hope this has been an accurate 
summary of what we learned. I didn't attempt to outline actual
techniques. Perhaps Danny can correct any mistakes. -Sean.
From: sworking@unixg.ubc.ca (Scott Workinger)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Starting back...
Date: 23 Jul 92 17:23:15 GMT
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada

In article <24101@castle.ed.ac.uk> jamesh@castle.ed.ac.uk (James Hammerton) writes:
>Due to my hip problem, my back is quite sensitive(the muscles are
>readjusting to me being back to normal again) and I was wondering what
>advise you guys might give me for my initial training? 

Try looking up your local Shaolin school and make arrangements to learn
the Muscle Sinew Washing Classic.  It is a combination stretching/warmup/
chi kung set which is very good for muscle conditioning.  It uses a sort of
wringing motion in many of the execrcises which is very good for
conditioning the muscles and tendons.  (You might also be able to learn
this from a Zen or Ch'an Buddhist.)  Many of the exercises work on the
hips and lower back.  It will definitely help with the kind of problem
you describe.  

Also try learning a good set of exercises for building up the abdominal
muscles.  When your abs are weak you will tend to have lower back troubles.
(A good set for your abs has a lot of types of exercises.  It's more than
just situps.)  Ask your osteopath to determine if your psoas muscles are 
out of balance.  This is common in the type of injury you describe. 
If this is part of your problem, ask him to show you a stretch for the
side that's shortening.

>
>Also I am thinking of taking up either Ju Jitsu or Aikido as well. Would
>this be a good idea? Are throws liable to do my back in? 

You might want to build yourself up a bit first.  Some exercise
physiologists suggest that people should not take up these practices 
after they turn 30.  (If you're already practicing them, they 
recommend special care after that age.)  These practice tend to be very
hard on joints.  Since you have a hip problem, you should know that you 
are more vulnerable to knee injuries than other people.  If you're not
ready to slow down, go into a good conditioning program that makes you
both very strong and very flexible.  Get yourself into the best condition
of your life, then go for it.

Good luck!
From: cmc@cs.utexas.edu (Chi Ming Cheung)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Some general questions...
Date: 24 Jul 1992 14:41:34 -0500
Organization: CS Dept, University of Texas at Austin
NNTP-Posting-Host: grit.cs.utexas.edu
Summary: Shotokan & Aikido in UT (Austin)
Keywords: judo, akido, shotokan

In article <1992Jul23.185700.27627@awdprime.austin.ibm.com>, guest@jaws1.austin.ibm.com writes:
> 	
	[deleted]

> 	1) judo is a taxing sport demanding strength, ability, and stamina. But is it
>            (as it is taught in the usa) a viable martial art usable for
> self-defense
>             in the street?

The judo practitioners I know can *definitely* defend themselves.

> 
> 	2) akido is also very athletic, but again, how useful could it be in 
>            a street situation? 

If self-defense is an *immediate* concern, Aikido may not be for you.
Techniques in Aikido are usually very subtle and require a long time to
become competent.
> 
> 	3) are striking techniques taught in either judo or akido?

Not in our Aikido club.
> 
> 	4) does the practice of shotokan tend to injure joints? Is that why 
>            practitioners of such hard styles seem to retire in their 30's and
>            early fourties?
> 
I believe that you can practice Shotokan without excessive damage to your
joints.  You have to be patient and make sure that you are in condition
to execute a technique.  E.g. if you try to execute a roundhouse kick
without strong hip and abdominal muscles, you are asking for a knee
injury.

> thank you for any help you can give me!!!  
> 
> P.S.  I'm ibm internal, so don't e-mail me (I won't get it).  Please, just post
>       here, on the net.

Since we are both in the same city, why don't you give me a call and we
can talk about it some more and perhaps work together. 471-9709.

--Ming

Xref: sparky rec.martial-arts:10436 soc.men:13854
From: wrat@unisql.UUCP (wharfie)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts,soc.men
Subject: women, training, && violence
Date: 29 Jul 92 15:39:58 GMT
Reply-To: wrat@unisql.UUCP (wharfie)
Followup-To: rec.martial-arts
Organization: UniSQL, Inc., Austin, Texas, USA


	(Please note that this is cross-posted and edit your headers
accordingly...)

	I've often wondered why you don't see more female martial
artists, especially given that one of the main concerns I've heard
women voice is fear of assault.  I've often wondered why when you do get 
them into a dojo (martial arts training place) they seem to leave at a 
higher rate than students of that other sex...

	Let's take my own dear Sugar Magnolia as an example:  Anita is a big
strong girl, and could be an effective fighter with some training, yet she
won't even come to a tournament that I'll be fighting in (not that I compete
anymore...) because she gets really upset when I get choked out or whatever.
I tried to get her to come to aikido with me, but she stopped coming after
a few classes because it was too violent (!!!).  (Aikido looks more like
dancing than boxing)  Yet we've been in situations where I had to fight for
both of us (we've been jumped in New York City) or where I could have used
someone at my back...  

	So, my questions are "What can be done to help people, and female
people in particular, get over this mental block of hypertrophied pacifism
so that they can benefit from learning to deal with violence, and is my
perception that women are more subject to this...confining...point of
view accurate or colored by my personal experience, and does anyone agree 
that the first step to taking back the night might be to stop having to be
afraid of every half-assed punk with a gleam in his eye" ?

	No to mention the fact that if _she_ trained too I might get to more
than twice a week myself... :-)  ("You're going to the gym again?  But..." :-)

	Caveat to followups:  esoteric technical discussions probably don't
belong in .men, and "Can't live with 'em..." philosophicalities probably
don't belong in .martial-arts.
							the wharf rat
From: rleroux1@sol.UVic.CA (Roger Leroux)
Subject: Re: years for black belt
Keywords: black belt time
Organization: University of Victoria
Distribution: na
Date: 23 Jul 92 06:14:12 GMT

In <seah.711850080@sfu.ca> seah@fraser.sfu.ca (Simon Seah) writes:
>How many years does it take to become a belt belt in a martial art?
>Assuming the first possible level of black belt (as, I am told, high levels
>sometimes involve non-martial arts activities), and continuous, dedicated,
>training.

To be totally lame, it takes as long as it takes. If you're a driven
competetive type who's only concerned with how high a belt you can get, you
could probably get it within 5 years. If you're like me, more interested in
playing with what I've been taught and not worrying about belt tests and what 
"rank" I am, it could be forever.

Roger

-- 
Roger Leroux          | "Climate is what we expect; weather is what we get." Me
rleroux1@sol.uvic.ca  |	"Everybody lies about sex." Lazarus Long
----------------------+ "Six of one, half a dozen of the other." Number 2.
rec.motorcycles DoD#43| Be seeing you...
From: toman@darkwing.uoregon.edu (Joseph Toman)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Shaolin Monks Tour:  Postscript?
Keywords: unimportant humor
Date: 23 Jul 92 22:10:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: nntp.1992Jul23.221050.18894
Organization: University of Oregon Network Services

In article <24798@dog.ee.lbl.gov> TWChan@lbl.gov (Terry Chan) writes:
>[Looks like my last post didn't make it, apologies for any repeats]
>
>I have just seen a Chinese language newspaper which had a message
>from Master Chan Pui.  Apparently, two of the monks from the Shaolin
>Temple group that toured the U.S. have vanished/defected/left without
>a trace.
>
>The message goes on to ask their return to the temple with no 
>retribution and exhorts all U.S. and Canadian martial artists to
>assist in finding them.

I WANT THE MOVIE RIGHTS !! Just think think of it ! " Alone, in a
foreign land, with only the skill in their fists and the longing
for freedom in their hearts against a horde of mercenary karate killers!
No dojang is safe, no sifu a friend,  they were : 'Shaolin Rebel Buddies vs. 
The Chinese Connection' ! In Sensaround (tm) !!



If it's true, I hope these guys make out okay.

						J. Toman