HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jmh@guinevere.pubserv.com (Jeff Helgesen)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Miles' best work
Date: 18 Aug 92 16:57:43 GMT

In <1992Aug17.013007.1227@guvax.georgetown.edu>, mchenry@guvax... writes:

> If you like BIG BAND music, then there are several classic to recommend:
> 
> Birth of the Cool
> Miles Ahead
> Porgy and Bess
> Sketches of Spain
> 
> [...]
> These four are all exceptionally beautiful albums and contain exquisite 
> examples of Miles the ballad player, Miles of the tone that sounded like a 
> man walking of eggshells, etc.

Don't forget the Carnegie Hall concert albums.

If you like big band music, you MIGHT like some of this stuff, though I
would quickly point out that these albums, in terms both of
instrumentation and orchestration, rarely utilize the styles commonly
associated with "big band" music.

If you're interested in big band music, I'd be more apt to suggest
picking up either "Facets" or "The Michele Legrand Big Band Featugin
Miles Davis"; there are 4 or 5 tunes where Miles plays, though this is
certainly not his best work.  Miles also appears in Charlie Parker's
big band on two cuts from a date where the trumpet section is Miles,
Dizzy Gillespie, and Fats Navarro (everyone's trying out-Diz Diz)...

							Jeff
______________________________________________________________________________

   \_  \_    \_         Jeff Helgesen           email: jmh@morgana.pubserv.com
    \_  \_    \_        Publication Services    Champaign, IL
     \_  \_\_\_\_
      \_  \_    \_      "I think I'll just go home and shake myself to sleep."
 \_\_\_    \_    \_                              		-B. Wilke
______________________________________________________________________________
From: gerry@seq1.keele.ac.uk (G.D.Pratt)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: BLUES: Son House quits the blues...
Date: 20 Aug 92 10:41:39 GMT
Organization: University of Keele, England

880139h@dragon.acadiau.ca (Rob Hutten) writes:
> deadhead@beyond.ugcs.caltech.edu (stephen thompson) writes:
> 
> >I was reading the other day that at some point the great blues
> >guitarist Son House quit playing the blues to become a porter.
> >Does anyone know more of this story?  Why would such a genius
> >give up his area of expertise?  There must have been a reason
> >behind his career move.
> 
> According to the liner notes of the `Death Letter' album, House quit
> playing for years when the popularity of swing dance music made him
> feel that there was no longer an audience for his style of music.  He
> was `rediscovered' by this Library of Congress guy in the sixties who
> fortunately got a number of tracks recorded before House died.
> 
There is a recent Columbia 2 CD set called "The Complete 1964 Sessions" 
which is the "Death Letter" album plus all the outtakes. Also Sequel(UK) is
bringing out the 1970 London(UK) "John The Revelator" live set on CD which
is very good. But my all time favourite Son House album is "The Real
Delta Blues" which is performances after his 1963 "re-discovery" and
before the 1964 CBS sessions - it is really brilliantly edited, has a
wonderful sound but is only available on vinyl from Blue Goose as far as
I know. This a real cracker album which demonstrates the power of just
one performer with a guitar - it just comes right out of the speakers.
> 
> A guy I know saw House playing live at a blues festival shortly before
> he died.  Apparantly he could hardly play a thing; his singing was off
> and he couldn't tune his guitar.  It's sad to hear of such a powerful
> performer weakened by age to the point where he can no longer get his
> music out.  
> 
This has got to be wrong since Son House became too ill in the early '70s
to continue with his performances but he lived till late 1988. Some of
the members of his family thought he was over 100 years old when he died -
there being the usual confusion about birthdate. What is true is the
later live performances, like the one on Blue Moon in the UK, show this
decline. 

The recent "Guitar Player" special Deep Blues issue has some good 
articles on Son House and related topics. It claims that Son House
quit music in the early '50s when his friend Willy Brown (of Johnson's
Crossroad fame) died. So he was only out of music for 10 years.

Also there is Yazoo video of Son House performing in the mid 60s in
front of some blues appreciation society - his performance is totally
mesmerising. He shares the video with Bukka White who guitar playing looks
amazingly physical. At one point he puts the guitar flat across his
knees, whips out what looks like a metal comb to use as a slide and rips 
into "Poor Boy" like his life depended on it - great stuff.

gerry
-- 
gerry pratt  --  workstation support  --  university of keele
email:  gerry@seq1.keele.ac.uk   *   telephone :  0782 583072
"these opinions are mine, mine, Mine.....ALL MINE I TELL YOU!"
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: anton@HQ.Ileaf.COM (steve norton)
Subject: Re: concert review journalism
Reply-To: anton@HQ.Ileaf.COM (steve norton)
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 15:47:18 GMT

In some article, gidi@Hilbert.Stanford.EDU (Gidi Avrahami) writes:
>
> Steve, please be specific.  Do you think that magazines should not take
> free tickets and records for reviews?  Or do you only think that they
> shouldn't take airline tickets (which I don't think they do)?  Or maybe
> that they should print an expense account along with every review?

based on my understanding of the story from vince, it was travelling
expenses that that had me a little surprised.  (kevin did say "pay
their way".  what's that mean exactly?  to me, that's airfare,
lodging, meals...)  for some reason tickets and records don't bother
me as much.  perhaps its the orders of magnitude of difference in
cost, or perhaps i drawing a stupid line here...
 
> >or do i have this all wrong?
> 
> Yes, that would be my guess.  Looks like you don't have a clue as to how
> the real world operates.

well, i didn't have a clue that magazine reviewers might get free
travel expenses, if that's what you mean.  but it seems like a pretty
big leap from there to "real world".


-- 

/steve
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: smehta@kwela.nynexst.Com (Sandeep Mehta)
Subject: Re: Ohnedaruth
Reply-To: smehta@nynexst.com
Organization: Speech Technology, AI Lab, NYNEX S&T Inc, White Plains, NY
	<1992Aug17.225800.24716@vestek.com>
	<RABIN.92Aug17230116@epic.CS.Yale.Edu>
	<Aug.18.18.50.17.1992.15916@ruhets.rutgers.edu>
Date: 19 Aug 92 13:00:59


> bweiner@ruhets.rutgers.edu (Benjamin Weiner) writes:

> "Ohnedaruth" is on the Art Ensemble live at the Ann Arbor Jazz & Blues
> Festival in the early 70s.  The tunes all have possibly-African names
> including "Odwalla" which is their usual closer and is on other live
> albums as well.  I don't know if this is the recording Jeff was
> thinking of ... but a great album.

Yes, Odwalla is the AEC "theme". My fave version comes off URBAN
BUSHMEN (ECM).

To remove any ambiguity on the Ann Arbor date:

Art Ensemble of Chicago, The                              Atlantic SD 1639 (LP)
Title: Bap-Tizum                                                               
Recorded: 9/9/1972 at Ann Arbor Blues and Jazz Festval, Otis Spann Memorial
          Field, Ann Arbor, MI.                                                
Released: 1973
With: Lester Bowie, trumpet, fluegelhorn, kelphorn, bass drum, percussion,
                    vocals                                                     
      Roscoe Mitchell, soprano sax, alto sax, tenor sax, bass sax, clarinet,
                       drums, percussion, vocals etc.                          
      Joseph Jarman, sopranino, soprano, alto, tenor, bass sax, alto flute,
                     conga drums, vibes, percussion, vocals, etc.              
      Malachi Favors, bass, electric bass, gong, log drums, whistles, vocals
                      etc.                                                     
      Don Moye, drums, conga drums, bass marimba, gongs, log drums, whistles,
                percussion, vocals etc.                                        
Contents: 1) Introduction by John Sinclair                             ( 00:35)
          2) Nfamoudou-Boudougou (Moye)                                ( 04:18)
          3) Immm (Favors)                                             ( 05:20)
          4) Unaka (Mitchell)                                          ( 11:23)
          5) Oouffnoon (Mitchell)                                      ( 03:35)
          6) Ohnedaruth (Jarman)                                       ( 14:56)
          7) Odwalla (Mitchell)                                        ( 05:00)
          Total:                                                       ( 45:07)
Purchased: 1991
Comments: Prod. by Michael Cuscuna, Jimmy Douglas, Tunc Erim.                  

I think the Indian word Ohnedaruth is misspelled (as if there is a
right spelling :-)) and is a self-acquired title that Coltrane used
like Alice Coltrane's Turiya. Both names are probably related to the
Hindu mysticism they were involved with.

/sandeep
--
smehta@nynexst.com
--
"An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs."
	-- Edgard Varese
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: qb7g6@fel.tno.nl (Maarten Landzaat)
Subject: SUMMARY(not yet): Porcaro died;let's make record list
Organization: TNO Physics and Electronics Laboratory
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 13:42:55 GMT

Hi, I started this thread. Thanks to everybody who reacted so far.
As soon as the flow of postings/mails has stopped, I will post a
summary. Since many people answered, this might take some time.

I didn't know Jeff Porcaro recorded so many albums.

If anybody knows on which records he played (besides the toto ones)
please mail me or post!
-- 
Maarten J. Landzaat (analyst/programmer, bass player, Atari/midi freak)
BSO/Aerospace & Systems			Mail: Spuistraat 97
Email: maarten.landzaat@fel.tno.nl	      1012 SV  Amsterdam
Phone: +31 20 6266098			      The Netherlands
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: mcgonig@eeserv.ee.umanitoba.ca (Gordon McGonigal)
Subject: Re: Miles and "commercialism" (was: Keith Jarrett in Sun [8/16] NYT)
Organization: Dept. of Elect. & Comp. Engineering, U of Manitoba
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 04:57:46 GMT

jbart@oakhill.sps.mot.com (John Bartholomew) writes:
>First, Davis was a complex character.  The man's accomplishments and 
>contributions are beyond dispute, as is his insistence on dignified treatment
>of black artists.  However, he clearly *was* interested in making his music
>more palatable to the "wider audience" (whiter audience?) and for proof one
>has merely to read the man's own words.  

[Details of "The Cool" sessions deleted for brevity]

>...............................................  Davis puts an interesting
>perspective on the foundations of this record and the reasons for its success.

[Miles' quotes explaining why The Cool recordings became so popular deleted]

>The question is not, I submit, whether or not configuring ones art to appeal
>to a wider audience makes it somehow "tainted," but rather whether or not the
>end result (the music) stands critical scrutiny on its own merits.
>
>John Bartholomew

The quotes cited do not give any indication that Miles created The Cool with
any intention of finding a wider (or "whiter" as you say) audience.   I find
such a notion hard to believe.  I find it even harder to believe that Miles
would admit it if it were his intention.   With respect to the time
just a few years after those sessions Miles says:
  Most white record producers just wanted to always make the shit sound
  whiter, and so in order to keep it black, you had to fight them every
  step of the way.
In his autobiography Miles also talks about wanting to "get to young black
kids with my music", but that is another time and story.
--
                                   * * *
Gord McGonigal                                  mcgonig@eeserv.ee.UManitoba.ca
Dept. of Electrical & Computer Engineering
University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, CANADA (R3T 2N2)       phone: (204) 474-6295
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: avi@Warren.MENTORG.COM (Avi Ziv)
Subject: Jeff Procaro
Organization: Mentor Graphics, Silicon Design Division
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 16:58:48 GMT

I just got some info about Jeff Procaro's death from my brother who is studying
drums with Jeff's father at the Musicians Institute in LA. Most of the school 
went to the funeral. 
It turns out that Jeff's arteries have been severely weakened by drug use 
and so it wasn't a surprise that a serious reaction to chemicals would cause 
them to collapse.

Jeff was a termendous drummer and we shall miss him


Avi Ziv

 
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: jkiparsk@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Jonathan Kiparsky)
Subject: Re: What is ``Modern Blues?''
Organization: Stanford University CSLI
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 08:26:38 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.165733.17153@dragon.acadiau.ca> 880139h@dragon.acadiau.ca (Rob Hutten) writes:
>I'm not trying to say that modern blues is any less meaningful because
>it's not performed by illiterate farmers.  I'm just wondering if anyone
>else would dare call performers like Ice-T and Chuck D ``bluesman.''

Well, the music is completely different, but both blues and hiphop are/were 
fundamentally means for blacks to express their views of their lives- which
is and was almost impossible in other ways- in music. The fact that the subject
matter- poverty, unemployment, racism, and so forth(let's not leave out sex)-
should suggest something to people who don't think we live in a racist
society. Not to get political or anything...
-jon
(by the way, I can't stand rap/hiphop music, and I'm a big blues fanatic- but
that doesn't mean that there aren't connections to be made...)
From: milo@cbnews.cb.att.com (guy.f.klose)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Curtis Fuller (was Re: Several artists...)
Date: 19 Aug 92 13:02:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbnews.1992Aug19.130241.15554
Organization: AT&T

In article <17570374@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM>, mjs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Marc Sabatella) writes:
> Fuller's main
> claim to fame these days is his appearance on Coltrane's "Blue Train"; a
> trombonist friend of mine says that that was miles above anything else she's
> ever heard from him.

Granted Curtis Fuller only has a handful of albums under his own name (I
think I've got about five of them), but: "main claim to fame...?"  Try a
long tenure with the Jazz Messengers, which I think as a body of work far
outshines his early work on "Blue Train".  I can't even guess how many
Jazz Messengers albums he's appeared on, but some that spring to mind
are "Caravan", "Three Blind Mice", "Ugetsu", "Kyoto", and "Free For All".
When outshined by others like Cedar Walton, Lee Morgan, Wayne Shorter,
Bobby Timmons, and Freddie Hubbard, I'd see how easy it would be to miss
Curtis Fuller, but your trombonist friend should really check out some
Jazz Messengers albums.  His work on "Caravan" alone is beyond belief.

Guy
-- 
Guy Klose
milo@mvuxi.att.com
From: mjs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Marc Sabatella)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 17:28:26 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Playing diff trpts (was Wynton's horn)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote

In rec.music.bluenote, david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) writes:

> A cheap instrument doesn't mean it is out of tune.  The
> 1st chair trumpet of the Chicago Symphony promoted a student model
> Bundy trumpet for years.  Any trumpet in good working order provides
> all anyone would need to learn how to play and any claims that they
> would be damaged by playing such an instrument is foolish.

This may be true of trumpets, but it is most definitely not so of most woodwind
instruments.  The embouchre that got the best sound on my old student model
clarinet sounded horrible on a nice Buffet or LeBlanc; I had definitely
developed some bad habits (this is a mouthpiece difference, really - something
trumpet players can more likely relate to).  In any case, it's not just the bad
habits you develop that concerns me.  It is frustrating to play a cheap plastic
clarinet and wonder why you can't get a good sound out of it - and also, offend
the ears of everyone who hears you play it.

I certaily don't advocate every student buying an expensive professional model
instrument when he is first starting out.  But your posts seemed to imply there
was no relationship between quality of the instrument and sound produced by
it, which is most certainly not true, even for trumpet.  Normally, it is around
the junior year of high school when I'd consider recommending someone move up
instrument-wise if they intend to become more serious on it.

> The point is that it's the musician and not the equipment.  Any trumpet
> in good working order including student horns is going to be fine
> and would not handicap anyone.

I can't believe you are saying Wynton, or Maynard, or the first chair Chicago
Symphony guy, would sound just as good with a student model horn as with their
current horns.  They'd play as well, but unless student model trumpets are an
order of magnitude better than student model clarinets, they will simply not be
able to get as good a tone.

> A higher priced
> horn will not make you sound good if you don't have something to start
> with.  As Quincy Jones says, "you can't poolish do-do.".

Agreed.  But once you are beyond doo-doo in your playing, you can be helped by
a better horn.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marc Sabatella           Winner, 1992 First Annual Bill Evans Lookalike Contest
marc@fc.hp.com
From: rshapiro@bbn.com (Richard Shapiro)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Miles boots, 1960-1975 (was: Miles' best work?)
Date: 19 Aug 92 23:13:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: kariba.RSHAPIRO.92Aug19161304
	<RSHAPIRO.92Aug18103623@pilsner.bbn.com>
	<RSHAPIRO.92Aug18230243@kariba.bbn.com>
	<1992Aug19.192252.18843@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu>
Organization: BBN, Cambridge MA
NNTP-Posting-Host: kariba.bbn.com
In-reply-to: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu's message of Wed, 19 Aug 1992 19:22:52 GMT


In article <1992Aug19.192252.18843@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer) writes:
   I just procurred a boot called Paraphanalia, from 1969 in Paris.
   Different than Gemini/Double Image, it has the same lineup
   as G/DI:  Miles, Wayne, Chick, Dave, and Jack.


Do you have label/cat# info for this item? Does Cadence carry it?
From: ejohnso@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Eric Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: 'Round Midnight collection ?
Date: 17 Aug 92 15:18:47 GMT
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada

On the same track of covering Monk's stuff, take a listen to "That's the
Way I Feel Now".  Many musicians, including some pop figures, do covers
of a wide variety of tunes.  It's been a while since I last played it,
but there are a couple of gems.  I always laugh out loud at John Zorn's
piece, in which he puts a sampling of a starting motorcycle to good use.
Look for it in cut-out sections.
-- 
	Eric Johnson	         |  Commit random acts of kindness
	ejohnso@ccu.umanitoba.ca |        	and
	BITNET:ejohnso@UOFMCC    |        senseless beauty.
	
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer)
Subject: Re: Naked City and Nike?!
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 13:18:01 GMT

In article <1992Aug17.045136.27674@athena.mit.edu> eprice@sql.sybase.com writes:
>I just saw a Nike ("Just Do It") ad on TV that used Naked City's
>"Batman".
>
>It was something of a shock!
>
>What's next, Cecil Taylor on MTV??  (Well, maybe not, I guess Naked
>City *is* more "accessible"...)

You know something, several years ago, Nike used The Invisible from
"Something Else", Ornette's first album on Contemporary.  If I remember
correctly, it contained part of the head, and part of Ornette's solo.

There were no words in the commercial at all, they might have shown
someone running through the city, with the music, and then a graphic
suggesting Nike.  This would have been 1989, and I only saw the
commercial once, during a Saturday Night Live.

I was riding the remote control last night, flipping the channels,
and there was a movie on that was using Archie Shepp's duet album with
Horace Parlan, one of the ones with blues and spirituals.  But it was
just a scene in a night club, no other significance.

Jeff
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: shashaan@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Ali Shashaani)
Subject: Re: T-bone Walker, Lightning Hopkins, Son House.
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 15:43:13 GMT

In article <Bss5HI.B7x@rice.edu> preston@dawn.cs.rice.edu (Preston Briggs) writes:
>shashaan@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Ali Shashaani) writes:
>
>>	o  "Lightning Hopkins" on Smithsonian
>>	   An old Folkways reissue of Lightning's first recording after 
>>	   comming out of jail in the late 50's.
>
>A good album; but jail?  I don't recall this from the liner notes.
>Is it true?
>
>Preston Briggs

	What I've read is that Lightning was in prison for a few years in
the mid-50's.  This seems to be true as I've notices that he has four 
inactive years in his discography from 1955 to 1959.

	--Ali
From: bragg@pecan.cns.udel.edu (Aquatic Joe)
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
Subject: Re: Miles' best work?
Keywords: Cool
Date: 17 Aug 92 03:03:24 GMT
Organization: The Green Circle of Vengence

In article <1992Aug14.045210.7565@seas.smu.edu> quaglia@seas.smu.edu (Bruce Quaglia) writes:
>In article <1992Aug13.104708.1@cc.helsinki.fi> mlindholm@cc.helsinki.fi writes:
>>
>>    I was thinking of byuing some Miles Davis records.
>>    Which ones would you recommend?
>
	But the best early Miles stuff you might enjoy are Kind of Blue and the
Birth of the Cool.  Two of his greatest and greatest of all time!e
-- 
Adam Bragg                  |  Tick: Hand Grenade Man? What's your super power??
bragg@freezer.cns.udel.edu  |  HGM: Super powers? Bah who needs them? I have
darkwing@ravel.udel.edu     |        HAND GRENADES!
                          SPOON!
Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote
From: gidi@Hilbert.Stanford.EDU (Gidi Avrahami)
Subject: Re: concert review journalism
Organization: Brotherhood Of Breath
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 18:35:37 GMT

vek@spacsun.rice.edu (Vincent E. Kargatis) writes:
> [...] Kevin Whitehead told me over the phone. I'd called him to find out if
> any magazines/journals he wrote for subsidized trips for concert reviews
> and/or interviews

I doubt that any magazine except the very rich can afford such a thing.

Downbeat seems to rely on having "correspondents" in various cities
and countries.

> it's the festivals that always pay for the reviewer's way, despite "the
> obvious conflict of interest".

Do you think that movie and theater critics buy their own tickets, or
that their magazines pay for them?  How about book reviewers?  They
all get free, advance copies.  As do record reviewers, of course.  Do
you have a problem with those, too?

And when you say "pay for the reviewer's way", are you telling me that
they fly reviewers from NY to LA or to Europe?  I'd be very surprised
if that were the case.  Again, my impression from Downbeat was that
its reviewers rarely cover anything out of their hometown.

> Thoughts on the matter? Or does that surprise no one? :/

It doesn't surprise me to hear baseless whining from RMB readers.


anton@HQ.Ileaf.COM (steve norton) writes:
>
>does anyone here think that the journals should have to disclose this
>type of deal when they run these articles?  this really strikes me as
>some kind of cover-up.  

Steve, please be specific.  Do you think that magazines should not take
free tickets and records for reviews?  Or do you only think that they
shouldn't take airline tickets (which I don't think they do)?  Or maybe
that they should print an expense account along with every review?

>or do i have this all wrong?

Yes, that would be my guess.  Looks like you don't have a clue as to how
the real world operates.


--Gidi

Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote