From: malenovi@plains.NoDak.edu (Nikola V. Malenovic )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: Emigrants and their political role in f
Date: 16 Apr 92 19:49:33 GMT
Article-I.D.: plains.16878
Distribution: na
Organization: North Dakota State University, Fargo, ND

In article <92106.010738BUAD5070@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> BUAD5070@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca writes:
>In article <16782@plains.NoDak.edu>, malenovi@plains.NoDak.edu (Nikola V.
>Malenovic ) says:
>> <vintage postings deleted>


oh please watch your finger, mala maca ce ti pojesti jezik kao sto je
ucinila Andreju ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)




*) *) if I tell you that if I consider my self a "Chetnik" I do not thik it is bad
*) *) at all, actually I think it is an honor, what would you think?
*) *) I bet you'd think I am a killer or something, right?
*) 
*) If that's an honor for you, so be it. I did not realize the Chetniks were
*) the 'good guys' in WWII - (that was sarcasim, for the sarcastically impaired.)


well for your HISTORIC IGNORANCE (not sarcasm, since you are defiently
ignorant on history, unlike your president), let me inform you about several
facts. CHetnik is a person who served in military units (police/army etc.)
and was loyal to the king, before WWII. Under such definiton, my grandfather
was a Chetnik, since he was "zandarm" - i.e. an police officer (though he
wassome higher rank). And if you ever say my grandfather was "killer" or
"criminal", you and I will have to talk "u cetri oka".

BTW, my grandfather saved a bunch of lives, and becuase of him, our "loza"
(i.e. family) was one of the most respected in the village. besides his
loyalty to the king (as a servant to the people, he was swarn to the king
too) he was fighting for peoples good. He realized that only partizans will
get the country out of s*it Serbia was in those days, so he helped them - he
saved many lives, by taking the "evidence" of their "anti-Nazi" work away,
so they could not be found by germans, and in our house the local resistance
group held their meetings (I mean Germans would not search the house of a
police officer (yes he "worked" for Germans, but actually helped partizans
and people of Serbia)).

so, when you say Chetnik, please take away words like "killer" and "beard",
since they are not arbitrary. words like "loyal to the king" and "servant to
the people" should come to your mind. of course, I do not expect you to
believe this, since you "communist" education got into your mind.

please also note, that I do not recognize Sheshelj's "Chetniks", since they
are not even close to what Chetniks are, for one they do not serve people,
but for example we have them attacking Serbian people. (yes I know some will
freak out becuase of this....)



And one more : there were "Chetniks" in Lika region back in WWII, and yes I
agree, they were sort of a "gang" and "killers", but under no circumstances
you should say that real Chetniks are killers/barbarians, since they were
not.


*) *) well then my friend, you do not know what word "Chetnik" represents, nor you
*) *) know the history well. All you see is bunch of drunk assholes who call
*) *) themselves "Chetnik" (though they do not deserve "CH" out of the whole
*) *) wording) and are serious criminals. Now, when you get willing to listen to
*) *) my explanation what word "Chetnik" means, and a small history explanation, I
*) *) hope you will write cetNik without any malicious implications.
*) 
*) This has long surpassed the point of stupidity, but I could tell you the
*) literal meaning of an 'ustasa' - it's one who rises up, who revolts -
*) but I won't get into it. Why? Because I'm too much of a realist to get
*) into stupid arguements to prove stupid points.


Ustasha - a person who served to NDH government in WWII, was trained to
kill,specially Jews and Serbs, and was supported by Church and the state.

Chetnik - Military loyal to the King, who was servant to the people sworn to
the King.

Chetnik (KPJ definition) - a killer, barbarian, slaughter who was loyal to
that damn stupid King, and against our cause.

I see you favor third one.

I hope you understand what Ustasha "means" and what Ustasha WAS!
I hope for your own good.(idilic - brother Serb, cares about health of
brother Croat....... ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)


*) *) -*) I'm at a loss to see how you've attributted me the Ustasha label -
*) *) -*) because I'm of the type not to want to give up soil from my homeland? I
*) *) -*) guess I'm not one of those 'standard-run-of-the-mill-citizens-of-ANYPLACE-
*) *) -*) country' who freely distributes land masses to anyone who asks?
*) *) -*) 
*) *) -*) You're arguement really sucks this time.
*) *) NO, my argument is that you acknowledged the wording "za dom spremni".
*) *) let me remind you :
*) *) Dragan*)  You forgot "za dom spremni"
*) *) Tomislav*)  you are very good at adressing the issue
*) *) Nik*)  so Ustashe are well alive?
*) *) Tomislav*)  your argument sucks!
*) *) you acknowleded "za dom spremni" which is one of the most common
*) *) "distinguishing" factors for Ustasha movement, and when I add your hate
*) *) toward Serbs (no no, you do not hate ethnic Serbs who are shooting in
*) *) Croatia, you shifted that hate to every Serb in general - that is why I
*) *) dislike your postings!), then we get the whole picture, right?
*) 
*) I have not acknowledged anything. How did I acknowledge it? When I said
*) 'You are very good at addressing the issue, Dragan' I meant that the
*) issue being addressed was Krajina joining Serbia - Dragan took that posting
*) and based on my sig (which says 'We're not giving up any piece of
*) Croatian land') and told me that I'd forgotten to append 'Za dom spremni'
*) (meaning 'For the homeland') and we're now debating who-said-what whereas
*) it all started with Milan saying that Krajina will one day join Serbia!
*) 
*) This whole thing is really, really ridiculous and assinine.

?????????

I am sorry UGrgo, but whoever supports Paraga/Tudjman ideas of pure state
etcand whoever denies what Ustashe did, is an Ustasha to me. Ustasha is the
one who believe what Ustashe in WWII believed you know, you do not have to
bea killer to be one, but you have to be :

a) a Croat and "good" Catholic
b) a pro-Nazi
c) for genocide over Serbs
d) for pure Greater Croatia

if a),b),c) and d) all apply to you, you are Ustasha.
if only b),c) and d) applies to you, then you are pro-Ustasha
otherwise you are neither Ustasha nor pro-Ustasha.

QED.

*) Tom Grgic


Nik
--
Deep in Engineering down where mortals seldom go,
A manager and customer come looking for a show,
They pass amused among us and they sign in on the log,
They've come to see our pony, and they've come to see our dog.
--