HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: burden_d@oass.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1 driver list
Date: 22 Jan 93 17:20:03 GMT
Reply-To: burden_d@oass.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


>I don't know why there's no entry for 13 and 18, but I notice there wasn't a 
>13 or 18 last year either.

They skip 13 because it's considered unlucky.  I don't know why they skip 18,
unless it's to get back on odd-even car groups instead of even-odd, but
that seems like a pretty lame reason.

--
Dave Burden                                      ______--------___
Digital Equip Corp - Alpharetta, GA             /|             / |
                                     o___________|_\__________/__|
burden_d@oass.enet.dec.com          ]|___     |   |=  ||  =|___  |"
                                    //   \\   |   |___||_///   \\|"
                                    |  X  |\-------------/|  X  |\"
                                     \___/ 1924 Studebaker \___/
					Special 6 Touring Car
From: yancm@engin.umich.edu (Eugene Harold Mcnay Ii)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Hostility to Williams? (was Re: F1 driver list)
Date: 28 Jan 93 18:00:17 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor
NNTP-Posting-Host: laser.engin.umich.edu

In article <Jan.26.14.47.38.1993.10858@tastesgreat.rutgers.edu> boubez@tastesgreat.rutgers.edu (Toufic Boubez) writes:
>danjones@pyramid.COM (Dan Jones) writes:
>>I'd like to see Williams kept out for the first half of
>>the season on this technicality, then the others might have a shot.
>
>This is not meant as a follow-up to Dan in particular, but just because I
>have seen this thought echoed in several posts already. I don't understand
>the hostility to the Williams team. Don't you think they deserved to win? I
>mean, it's not like they cheated. They came up with some pretty neat
>technological advances, coupled with a very good driver (as much as I hate
>him) and won the championship fair and square.

I agree with your sentiment. Rules is rules - it is not a teams
fault if they are inventive (or rich) enough to take advantage
of them (rules).  <8-)

I grew up in Indy watching the Indy. Seems over the years the Indy
in particular and lately CART/IndyCar have really tried to concentrate
on having some matched competition to keep peoples interest. At one point
Penske was winning too many races and the show just wasn't too much fun
(when the Chevy started to win). Then things changed and suddenly
there were 10-20 cars who could run strong on a given day.

F1 on the other hand is wild. Seems the sanctioning body cares more about
preserving the technological aspect than the competition aspect. I
smile at how much the fans get caught up in the side issues of team/driver
(dis)loyalty love/hate thing. I like watching the racing!

Anyway, I sure hope Williams does race this season. They've paid
their money, they should get to ride. Wether I hate or love them,
their drivers or sponsors, has nothing to do with it.
thanx,
gene
-- 
     /^\ + "Make things as simple as possible, but no simpler."      +
    /___\ +                   -  A. Einstein                         +
   //zzz\\ + Gene McNay: University of Michigan Aerospace Structures +
  //  z  \\ +  email:      yancm@caen.engin.umich.edu                +
From: zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: F1 driver list
Date: 22 Jan 93 16:42:04 GMT
Organization: Manchester Computing Centre


 1
 2
 3 Tyrrell         Katayama
 4                 De Cesaris 
 5 Benetton        Schumacher
 6                 Patrese
 7 McLaren         Andretti
 8                 tba
 9 Footwork        Suzuki
10                 Warwick
11 Lotus           Hakkinen
12                 Herbert
13
14 Jordan          Barrichello
15                 tba
16 March           tba
17                 tba 
18 
19 Larrousse       tba
20                 tba
21 Lola            Alboreto
22                 Badoer
23 Minardi         tba
24                 tba
25 Ligier          Brundle
26                 Blundell
27 Ferrari         Alesi
28                 Berger
29 Sauber          Wendlinger
30                 Lehto

Note no entry for cars 1,2,13,18
1 and 2 should be the Williams team, but their entry was late (again?)
"Nobody seriously doubts that Prost and Hill will be on the grid in S.Africa"
...but they need ALL other teams to agree to their addition to the list, so 
may have to give concessions on some of the recently proposed rule changes.
I don't know why there's no entry for 13 and 18, but I notice there wasn't a 
13 or 18 last year either.


            All creatures will make merry   (on pain of death)
    Dave Budd, MCC, Oxford Rd, Manchester, England    (44|0)61-275-6033
From: danjones@pyramid.COM (Dan Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Lake Laguna Seca & Camping tickets
Date: 21 Jan 93 17:24:11 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View, California
NNTP-Posting-Host: xploit.eng.pyramid.com

I ran down to Laguna Seca yesterday to pick up some camping tickets
for some races this season.  I'll get to the camping tickets part
in a second.

For those of you that aren't local, in Northern California it has rained
for 16 consective days in some places, yet we are still in a draught :-(. 
Alot of places are having flooding problem and Laguna Seca is included.  
So, whose idea was it to build the expanded infield section on a dry lakebed
without any facilities for draining in the case of heavy rains?  Its not
on the track yet, but there is one section that is about two feet away from
the inside of turn two.  The worst part on the infield is still a ways from
the track, but given a few more storms, that might not be the case.  The
infield permanent restrooms are under about two feet of water.

If you want reseved camping this season, you better order now!  There are 
probably less than 10 sites (with hookups) left for the IndyCar race in
October.  Even if you want to dry camp, I wouldn't wait.  Its up to $225
this year from $150.  Those darn SCRAMP rascals.  The situation for the
Historics isn't bad yet, and I didn't bother to check about the IMSA.

What pisses me off is last year we checked with Alexandria with SCRAMP (the
person who handles ticket sales) and she told us on two separate occassions
that tickets didn't go on sale until Feb 4.  We wanted to get our prefered sites.
Tickets went on sale on Jan 4, and we ended up with a site that sucks for 
the IndyCar race.  We were able to still do well for the Historics.  I'd be
interested in hearing if anyone else was told Feb 4.

Dan Jones
From: BWF2@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: NASCAR: Harry Melling team
Date: 27 Jan 93 14:44:35 GMT
Organization: Penn State University


         Is there a Harry Melling team this year?
         Chad Little was the driver last year, right?
         And if I remember correctly, Mark Rypien
         (from some other sport) was to buy into that
         deal cause he and Chad were buddies. Any info?
         Also, I have a buddy who is a Geoff Blowdine
         fan, anyone have any testing times from him.
         Maybe he was to busy trying to bobsled around the track. :-()
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: jblewis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (John B Lewis)
Subject: Where is the track?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 06:15:06 GMT

Does anyone out there in net land know which track in the US is known as 
I.R.P.?  It is East of the Mississippi, but that's about as far as I know.

Thanks for the help!

-JBLewis
-- 
|John B. Lewis                               jblewis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu|
|Vice President Sports Car Club at Ohio State                                 |
|                                                                             |
|Dept. Geodetic Science and Surveying                The Ohio State University|
From: ecrjbruce@economics.adelaide.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Williams in strife
Date: 22 Jan 93 15:13:07 ACST
Organization: Economics, University of Adelaide
NNTP-Posting-Host: eco.economics.adelaide.edu.au

Hey guys, I just heard that Williams are in trouble for lodging their racing
application late!!  Apparently they have to get permission from all the other
teams if they want to join the circus and a couple of them have held out,
saying they want Williams advantage in technology neutralised before they
agree!

Anyone else heard anything?

Rob
From: swh0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEPHEN WILLIAM HUMINSKI)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Confirm/Disprove WC Rumor Please
Date: 25 Jan 93 03:27:52 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

I recently heard a rumor about Kodiak leaving WC action.  Thanx in advance.
-- 
                    o
                    |-}             -->           (O)   Stephen "Stew" Huminski
                   /\                                   SWH0 @Lehigh.edu
From: ensalada@cats.ucsc.edu (Kevin Charles Rubio)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: INDY 500 SIMULATION
Date: 21 Jan 1993 14:29:49 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
Reply-To: keeper@deeptht.armory.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: si.ucsc.edu



Does anyone know if the Amiga version of Microprose's `World Circuit'
recently mentioned in this thread has good mouse control?
and does it have shifting using the keyboard?

Same question for the `F1GP' mentioned by Mike Casey.  Who publishes
that, anyway?

Someone did give me a gift certificate for a software store at
Christmas, and it's about time I decide what to use it on ...

Mouse control of course is a must, since Amigas use the old Atari 2600
standard digital joysticks.  I've been spoiled on mouse control for
racing games/simulations ever since Electronic Arts brought out
`Ferrari Formula 1'.  It's rather hideous these days (although its
semiautomatic transmission was ahead of its time!), of course,
but was the first good mouse-controlled racing simulation, as far as
I know.

--
Email replies must be sent to keeper@deeptht.armory.com
From: danjones@pyramid.COM (Dan Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Team Tyrrell's successes (Was: F1 Historical Question)
Date: 22 Jan 93 00:25:16 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View, California
NNTP-Posting-Host: xploit.eng.pyramid.com

Chris Prael writes:

|> Tyrell
|> did much better as a privateer (running Matra chassis) than he has as a
|> constructor.  

I wouldn't say much better.  Team Tyrrell only ran Matra's in '68 and '69.  He
was a privateer in '68, but in '69 he pretty much took over/merged with the works
team.  In '68 Matra (points from both teams) finished 3rd in the constructors and
in '69 Matra won it.  Jackie Stewart finished 2nd and 1st in the driver's champ-
ionship in '68 and '69 respectively.

In '70 Tyrrell switched to running a private March, while working on a design
of his own.  The Tyrrell chassis ran only 3 races.

In '71 Tyrrell ran in his first full season as a constructor.  He won the constructor's
championship and Stewart won the driver's championship.  In '72 and '73, Tyrrell
finished 2nd in the constructors and Stewart finished 2nd and 1st in the driver's
championship.

After '73 Stewart was no longer with Tyrrell and he was a major ingredient to the
team's success, so it's not fair to compare later years.

OK, Chris I forgive you, it's been a long time.  :-)

Dan Jones
From: jimd@pequod.gvg.tek.com (Jim Delwiche)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Titanium
Date: 28 Jan 93 01:14:02 GMT
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1993Jan22.025503.3757@netnews.whoi.edu> ulrich@canberra.whoi.edu writes:

<Lots of good info about Titanium>

Wow!  Thanks for the info.  I stand corrected!

Jim
From: menolen@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Elena M Nolen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Winston Cup
Date: 22 Jan 1993 05:28:07 -0500
Organization: Homewood Academic Computing, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore, Md, USA
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu





         Has anyone out there heard who Bill Elliott's builder will
   be this year. I read in Winston Cup Scene that Junior Johnson mailed
   Tim Brewer a letter telling him his services weren't needed anymore,            but I haven't heard who is going to replace him. Someone I know heard
   a rumor that they were thinking about Ernie Elliott..... Any insight
   would be appreciated...

        Almost time to go racing ........

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: msorsini@eos.ncsu.edu (MARCO SALVADOR ORSINI)
Subject: Re: Indy 500, World Circuit, et al.
Originator: msorsini@c00560-1403br.eos.ncsu.edu
Reply-To: msorsini@eos.ncsu.edu (MARCO SALVADOR ORSINI)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 17:09:36 GMT


   suff deleted

|>If a steering wheel controller was available
|>for these games, would you be inclined to
|>purchase such a device.
|>
|>If the quality and features of such a device were
|>comparable to the Thrust FCS, and included such
|>items as a steering wheel-mounted "semi-automatic"
|>gear changer and a seat of brake/accelerator
|>pedals, how much would be willing to pay?
|>
|>Would you want the pedals part of the complete
|>unit or would you prefer them as an add-on? If
|>an add-on, what you be willing to pay for the
|>basic steering unit and how much extra for the
|>pedals?
|>
|>Lastly, if a "real" gearbox was available,
|>which would you prefer, the "pushbutton
|>semi-automatic" or the box? Would you be
|>willing to pay extra for a gearbox as an
|>option, and how much?
|>
|>Thanks,
|>Bob Boulanger
|>-- 

   Hey why not a seat that tilts from
  side to side.  And if you include
 a helmet, suit, gloves, and shoes
  it would almost be like driving a
   real car. 

    Just being a little goofy.

-- 

-------------------
an Alfisti                                Email: msorsini@eos.ncsu.edu
North Carolina State University; USA      Voice: (919)755-1603
Mechanical Engineering

"We are born to reproduce, work ourselves to death, and fertilize the earth"
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: thomas@datamark.co.nz (Thomas Beagle)
Subject: Re: INDY 500 SIMULATION
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 22:12:53 GMT
Organization: Datamark International Ltd.

In article <1jmc0tINN4cd@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> keeper@deeptht.armory.com writes:
>
>
>Does anyone know if the Amiga version of Microprose's `World Circuit'
>recently mentioned in this thread has good mouse control?
>and does it have shifting using the keyboard?
>
>Same question for the `F1GP' mentioned by Mike Casey.  Who publishes
>that, anyway?

World Circuit and F1GP are the same game.

BTW, it was originally programmed by Geoff Crammond - the man
responsible for Revs. This was a game available on the BBC and was
about five years ahead of its time. Classic game and in many ways F1Gp
is just an update of it.

The very, very, very bad news is that F1GP does not support mouse
control. I think I cried when I heard this. :-)

On the other hand, it does support the various *analog* joysticks that
are available for the Amiga.

IMHO, the controls in F1GP are not as good as Indy 500. They seem to
try to guide you through the corners and I hate this. On the other
hand, it is nice being able to try a few different tracks. Speed is
very good on my Amiga 3000 and a friend has enjoyed playing it a lot
on his A500. Fits on the hard disk nicely too.

I heard a rumour that the team that developed Indy 500 was working on
a Formula 1 version. We can but hope. :-)

-- 
    Thomas Beagle | thomas@datamark.co.nz           Work: 64 4 233 8186
 Technical Writer | thomas@cavebbs.welly.gen.nz     Home: 64 4 499 3832
   Wellington, NZ | Yes, I do have long ears, a black nose, and a tail.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn Padfield)
Subject: Re: Titanium
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 19:16:42 GMT

mike@lynx.msc.cornell.edu.UUCP (Mike Heisler,302 Thurston,57344,2571192) writes:

>From article <1993Jan22.025503.3757@netnews.whoi.edu>, by ulrich@canberra (Nathan Ulrich):
>> Jim Delwiche writes
>...
>>> affordable.  Perhaps titanium will become common in racing (or even
>>> street) engines soon.
>...
>> 
>Actually the Autocoast Ti-? ran in the Can-Am Series back in '70 or '71
>with a titanium tub I believe.  Great strength but hard to repair.

>Certainly some folks out there can fill in the details for us.
>-- 
>Mike Heisler		607-255-7344	    mike@msc.cornell.edu
>Materials Science Ctr.	302 Thurston Hall   Cornell Univ, Ithaca, NY 14853-1503

	AutoWeek ran an article about the Ti-22 in their Escape Road section.
Alas, I don't seem to have that issue here. I have only back as far as July 20
here with me at school, so maybe one of the other subscribers (Mark Jackson?)
or one of teh resident motorsport historians (Dan Jones?) could shed some more
light. I do remember reading about that car, but can't really recall any major
highlights. Sorry...

TOBY...
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Gurney '68 CanAm McLeagle and Penske '68 CanAm McLaren info request
From: loosli@bbs.ug.eds.com
Date: 27 Jan 93 09:16:28 GMT
Organization: TRW SAFETY SYSTEMS/MESA
Nntp-Posting-User: loosli

In article <AHE.93Jan24184741@lola.cadcam.kth.se>, ahe@cadcam.kth.se (Anders Hedborg) writes:
>>
>>   >	The Penske McLaren had custom rear bodywork.  I don't know of
>>   >	any other modifications to it.
>>
>>   I first read about this car in Mark Donohues book "The Unfair Advantage"
>>   and I seem to remember that Penske fitted it with a complete special
>>   lightweight body of their own specification.
>>
>>   Donohue used this car to win the 1968 USRRC. According to AutoSport,
>>   Sept 6, 1968, the car was sold to Jerry Hansen, and a spanking new 
>>   M6B was bought for the CanAm series that year.
>>   "With seven litres of aluminium Chevy, a subtly-modified body shape of
>>   super-light panelling and an immaculate finish culminating in wild 
>>   pinstriping, a lot of folk where betting on Mark."
>>
> 
> I'd just like to know whether the Penske McLaren M6A was indeed sold to
> Jerry Hansen after the -68 USRRC as stated by AutoSports scribe Pete Lyons
> claims in his report cited above? And, if so, was the replacement one of
> the production Trojan M6B's ?
> 
At that time, my brother-in-law was a good friend and ex-mechanic for Mark
Donohue.  He was at the Bridgehampton test session when Mark tried the new
spoiler in the bodywork.  I remember seeing the Penske Press Release package
after the test session, and it said the car was a new M6B with modified
bodywork.  As for the M6A, Hansen usually bought Penske's outdated Can-Am cars,
which is also why Jerry and Mark co-drove in the Road America USRRC races.

 +==================================================================+
 | Ben H. Loosli         |                                          |
 | CAD Designer          |    Voice: (602) 396-1960                 |
 | TRW Safety Systems    |      Fax: (602) 396-1285                 |
 | 4051 N. Higley Rd.    | Internet: loosli@bbs.ug.eds.com          |
 | Mesa, AZ 85205        |     UUCP: uunet!ug!bbs.ug.eds.com!loosli |
 +==================================================================+

was a 

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield)
Subject: Re: F1 driver list
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 01:26:29 GMT

danjones@pyramid.COM (Dan Jones) writes:

>Cory James Padfield writes:
>      my stuff deleted...

>Some building do have a 13th floor, it seems to be more common these days.  But I
>think the F1 folks still fear 13 like you say.  What I find interesting is that
>Benetton gets 5 & 6, rather than the previous champion, McLaren.  Benetton should
>have kept their numbers and Sauber probably should have been the ones to get 7 & 8. 
>So I guess that means Brabham is definitely out.  I think this is the first time
>since '74 that so many teams have changed numbers, isn't anything sacred?  And also
>if Williams does get accepted, they will be 0 & 2 with Hill getting 0 and Prost 
>getting 2.  Originally Prost was to get 0, but he refused the number, he didn't want
>to admit his was a zero.  I'd like to see Williams kept out for the first half of
>the season on this technicality, then the others might have a shot.

>Dan Jones

   I really haven't seen too many 13th floors, but it is nice to see this 
   fossil die the way it should... I really am interested in why Benetton
   changed their numbers- I agree, is NOTHING sacred? I hadn't heard the 
   thing about Williams' numbers, but I guess it doesn't surprise me. The 
   big question now is how will Williams get it? Probably a lot of con- 
   cessions..... Say Dan, try and put a few carriage returns in there :)

Cory
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 08:38:54 EST
From: <BWF2@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: NASCAR: Whitcomb racing

       I read an article in USA yesterday that
       Derrike Cope confirmed that Whitcomb racing
       had gone out of business and that they wouldn't
       be at Daytona to race. He's looking for another
       ride.

       Also, Kyle Petty's time of 190+ appears to be the
       fastest of the brands.

     Brian ' I think I can smell the rubber. Only 17 days to go' France
From: bobb@cabezon.uucp (Bob Boulanger)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: INDY 500 SIMULATION
Date: 22 Jan 93 23:51:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: cabezon.1993Jan22.235104.4639
Organization: Logic Modelling Corporation of Beaverton Oregon

In article <1993Jan20.104151.165574@dstos3.dsto.gov.au> gbf@se21.itd writes:
>In article uupcb@synapse.org, marc.gratton@synapse.org (Marc Gratton)  writes:
>
>I user the IBM version, and my fastest is 38.43 with fastest qualifying average
>of 38.66 (I also use the red car).
>
>A friend of mine has done a 38.00 on the IBM version.  Part of the problem with the 
>IBM version is that keys are used for steering instead of a mouse.
>
Would you be interested in purchasing a steering/shift/brake/accel pedal
set up if one was available? How much would you pay?

Bob Boulanger



-- 
Bob Boulanger
Logic Modeling Corporation
19500 NW Gibbs Drive
Beaverton, OR  97006
From: ashaw@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (andrew.shaw)
Subject: Re: I'll have a PBJ please.
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 18:28:11 GMT

From article <1993Jan23.061209.26866@leland.Stanford.EDU>, by tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen):
> In article <s6VqXB2w165w@major.panix.com> dos@major.panix.com (Dave O'Shea) writes:
>>Having worked for an insurance company, I can tell you in no uncertain
>>terms that private car insurance is not profitable at all; most
>>companies sell it only because it is required if they wish to sell
>>other, more profitable lines, within the same state.
> 
> question: when you say "not profitable at all, does that include
> the money they make by investing the premiums collected?
> 
Or lose through foolish investment (commercial real estate, anyone)?