HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tjfeue@bb1t.monsanto.com
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Where indeed *WAS* Mr. Altar???  ;-)
Date: 3 Nov 92 13:36:09 CST
Organization: Monsanto Company, St. Louis, MO

Recently, in the heat of a flame war, a regular poster who had been gone
for quite a while came quietly sneaking back into this forum.  This
man is none other than...   Ted Altar, aka THE OTHER TED, my evil
nemesis!  

Now this may seem of little concern to us, however I submit this
for your consideration...  Where has Ted been all this time?  
Do you realize that while he was gone, thousands of homes were
burglarized and that hundreds of rapes and murders have taken place 
in the US alone?  That Republican dirty tricks abounded?  That
several typhoons have hit the innocent people of Guam?  That
drought and famine have swept parts of the continent of Africa? 
That the very tectonic plates of the Earth shifted causing
untold suffering in Egypt?  That (according to The National 
Enquirer) UFO people have come to Earth?  ...AND *HE* claims 
to be a Vegan (you know, from around the star Vega)!

Yes folks, where indeed *HAS* Mr. Altar been!  And, how much of 
this is his doing?????    

I rest my case.

Mr. Altar, your very character is in question!  What *DO* you have
to say for yourself?

Welcome back Ted...  You've just been "Bushed".  ;-) 

Ted Feuerbach - Scientific Systems Consultant
Disclaimer:  Monsanto didn't say this, I did!
From: dlc659@huxley.anu.edu.au (Drew L Corrigan)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Congratulations and Metrication
Date: 12 Nov 92 03:47:12 GMT
Organization: Australian National University
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.2.12

dmclaren@neumann.une.edu.au (Debra.) writes:
>There's a problem though... I'd like to know what
>is a good amount for me to lose a week *in kilograms*
>I don't understand pounds without a conversion chart
>which I don't have access to at the moment...

Debra, a kilogram is about 2.2 pounds. Or 1 pound is about 450g. From
that you should be able to work out how many kilos you need/want to
lose.

I must say that I am impressed with the way one's body tends to "find
its own weight" on a (low-fat) vegetarian diet. Both my wife and I have
lost some weight, and now are steady and feeling quite comfortable at
our new weights. In contrast, some of our omnivorous friends are constantly
going through struggles and ups and downs with their weights, and are
always on this diet or that. We didn't even thinking of "dieting" as
such - just dropped animal products, cut right back on fat intake, and
increased our complex carbohydrates - and achieved what our friends
would like to have but never seem to attain. They cannot or will not
make the paradigm shift to a little or no animal product diet which is
a pity (for their sakes I mean).

Drew.
From: zeke@reed.edu (Zeke Koch)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Recipie: Basic Grain Soup
Date: 9 Nov 92 01:40:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Nov9.014022.8528
Organization: Reed College, Portland OR

I've been making this for a while now.  

Zeke's Easy Soup

1/2 cup green split peas
1/2 cup yellow split peas
1/2 cup barley
1/2 cup lentils
(anything else your heart desires)

1 potato (diced small)
8 cups water/veggie stock (I use water and 1 1/2 Knorr veggie bouillon cubes)

Put everything in a pot and simmer for an hour.

It's easy and great tasting...

Zeke



-- 
                           zeke@reed.edu 
"NeXT has made it possible for Tiny Tim to over-extend himself and buy
a Ferrari for the price of a Hundai and now Tiny Tim is pissed because
the gas station attendant won't sell him gas for 3 cents a gallon."
From: das@voodoo.boeing.com (Deb Schwartz)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: TVP
Date: 11 Nov 92 05:24:31 GMT
Organization: Yet Another Graphics Project, Bellevue, WA

In article <BxI9wt.M4o@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> xmpp@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Melody Paul) writes:
>What about the MSG in these porducts, someone told me that ADM has MSG.  How
>about Morningstar, Heartline and others?
>-- 
Perhaps some of ADM's prepared add-water-and-cook mixes that contain TVP
also contain MSG, but plain old TVP does not contain MSG.
------
Debbie Schwartz // das@voodoo.ca.boeing.com  // or uunet!bcstec!voodoo!das 
                             ^^^^ please note addition to address 
                 "Hatred is not a family value"
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: olin@sics.se (Peter Olin)
Subject: Re: Godhead or Meathead?
Organization: Swedish Institute of Computer Science, Kista
	<Hinding.1-031192115543@archmacconsultant.architecture.lab.nd.edu>
	<1992Nov3.191212.4099@umbc3.umbc.edu>
	<OLIN.92Nov4103907@obelisk.sics.se> <altar.720900520@sfu.ca>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 09:47:16 GMT


In article <altar.720900520@sfu.ca> altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar) writes:


   ...                        What has been said is that
   vegetarianism is more ecologically efficient and has
   less of an impact upon the environment that that of the
   more wasteful and destructive practice of raising and killing
   animals for food.  I don't think there is any disagreement
   here.
---

	Well, what I actually was arguing about was the claimed fact
	that vegetarianism has less of an impact upon the environment
	than raising and killing animals for food.

	Yes, most meat production *today* is wasteful and destructive.
	But that does not mean that production of meat in combination
	with growing crops need to be wasteful or destructive, I would
	say the contrary. Animals can help increase production of
	crops and also be fed with rest products from the crop
	farming. Thus giving more food per unit of land, and
	consequently needs less space which leads to less impact on
	the environment.

	Maybe I'm talking too much "production" here. What I mean is
	that animals and crops belong together and make eachother
	happy. It would not be *wasteful* to keep down the population of
	animals on the farm by killing and eating them. 

	Depending on your point of view, it might be unethical,
	destructive, murder or simply natural to kill the animals for
	food.

					Peter
--
Peter Olin                            ! Email: olin@sics.se
Swedish Institute of Computer Science ! Tel: +46 8 752 1557 (direct)
Box 1263                              !  or: +46 8 752 1500
S-164 28 KISTA, SWEDEN                ! Fax: +46 8 751 7230

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: halka@mpx1.lampf.lanl.gov (Halka, Monica H.)
Subject: Re: Cravings
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: LAMPF Data Analysis Center, Los Alamos, New Mexico
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 17:45:00 GMT

In article <NSINGH.92Nov7204616@hqsun5.oracle>, nsingh@hqsun5.oracle (Naunihal Singh) writes...
>I would like to second some of the things I've seen here.
>The best way to combat these cravings is to diversify your diet.

I find that if I have a craving for chocolate, eating a few raw cashews or
almonds stops the craving.  Maybe it's the lecithin or maybe it's the fat?

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: artemis@netcom.com (Michelle Dick)
Subject: Carob Recipes
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 04:09:55 GMT

More info from the Carob Primer:

I'm not sure the book is still in print, but the ISBN is
0-916870-60-X.

Basic guidelines for using carob in chocolate recipes:

1. use an equal amount of carob powder when cocoa is called for.  But
since carob is sweeter than cocoa you will need to reduce the
sweeteners used by at least 1/4.  Or you can add instant coffee to
carob to make it more bitter.

2. if the recipe calls for unsweetened baking chocolate use 3T carob
powder, 1T water and a few drops of vanilla for each ounce of baking
chocolate. 

3. use carob chips exactly as chocolate chips

4. to replace milk chocolate use sweetened carob chips and add 2T
powdered milk for each 4 ounces of milk chocolate.

Some carob recipes:

BROWN RICE PUDDING

	1/4 cup brown rice
	1 	egg
	2 cups	milk or soymilk
	1/4 cup honey
	1 Tbsp	butter or margarine
	1/3 cup	carob chips

1. preheat oven to 300 deg.
2. wash rice
3. mix milk, honey, and rice in greased 1-quart casserole. add beaten egg
4. cover and bake for 1-1.5 hours depending on desired consistency

TOFU CAROB PUDDING

	16 oz.	soft tofu
	1/3 cup carob powder
	1/4 cup	honey
	1/3 cup	peanut butter
	1/2 tsp	vanilla
	1/4 to 1/2 cup milk or soymilk

1. drain tofu and mash with fork
2. blend tofu, carob powder, honey, peanut butter, and vanilla in
blender, adding milk little by little
3. put mixture into small bowls and chill

JONNY-CAROB CAKES

	1 cup	cornmeal
	1/4 cup carob powder
	1/2 tsp	salt
	1 1/2 cups boiling water
	1/3 cup thick cream, yogurt, soft tofu, or sour cream
	oil for frying

1. mix together cornmeal, salt, and carob
2. add boiling water slowly, beat for 3-4 minutes (mixture should be
thicker than pancake batter).
3. spoon batter onto greased skillet and brown on both sides.

SILKEN PIE

	1 tbsp	unflavored gelatin
	3/4 cup	cold water
	1 cup	milk
	1 cup	carob chips
	1/4 tsp	salt (optional)
	1/3 cup	butter
	3	egg yolks
	2 tsp	vanilla
	1/2 tsp almond extract
	1 tbsp	malt powder or 1 tsp instant coffee
	3 egg	whites
	1/2 cup whipping cream

	1 pre-baked pie crust

1. soak gelatin in the water, set aside
2. mix together milk, carob chips, salt, and honey in heavy pan
3. bring mixture to a boil, stirring constantly
4. remove from heat, add yolks one by one, mixing in well
5. heat mixture again, stirring until thick, but do not boil
6. remove from heat again, add gelatin and butter, and stir till
well-mixed, then add vanilla, almond extract, and malt (or coffee)
7. strain mixture into bowl and refrigerate till set
8. beat egg whites till stiff
9. beat whipping cream
10. beat cooled carob mixture till light
11. fold whipped cream and egg whites into carob mixture.
12. spoon into (cooled) crust and refrigerate for several hours.
13. alternatively, spoon into dessert cups, chill, and serve as mousse.

enjoy,
--
Michelle Dick
artemis@netcom.com
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: abulsari@aton.abo.fi
Subject: Re: veget. beyond food (medicine)
Organization: Abo Akademi University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 06:02:21 GMT

In article <1992Nov12.1006.1520@ALMAC> jeffrey.burrows@almac.co.uk writes:

>Anyhow, the other issue which recently came to mind was the use of
>animal products in medicine. I know people have different attitudes
>towards leather shoes, and I'd like to hear anyone's opinions on the
>latter - I've formed no definite ones of my own yet.

I once posted a query about this matter.   I  found that many (perhaps
most) medicines (and  vaccinations, etc.) contain animals, and on  top
of  that, they  are  tested on animals.  There are various alternative
systems of  medicine which work  and  don't  use animals. In fact, the
common western system is becoming more and  more questionable. Much of
what the mainstream physicians say has limited credibility.

With regards,

Abhay Bulsari
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: AR Prisoners in need of your written support
Date: 6 Nov 1992 18:10:47 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley -- ERL
NNTP-Posting-Host: zion.berkeley.edu

In article <30053@nntp_server.ems.cdc.com> jsemrad@ems.cdc.com writes:

>Is every person who uses a weapon on an animal a hunter in your eyes?  

Yes, of course.

> If so there is no hope for you, you've been totally taken in by AR propaganda.

(another loonie...)

>No, poaching is not a form of hunting.  Poaching is a criminal activity.
>Hunting involves the taking of certain game animals by certain methods
>and during regulated seasons in a sporting manner.  There are limits in
>effect, licences to be bought, etc.  Poaching is the taking of any protected
>species in violation of the above laws.  Hunting is legal, poaching is not.

What you mean by "Hunting" would more accurately be called
"legal hunting".  Hunting is a more general term that
includes "poaching"

>That's why there are two different words.  I don't mean to sound 
> condescending,

You don't sound condescending, only ignorant.

Steve
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: A Quick Breakfast
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 09:08:03 GMT

sorsha@wam.umd.edu (Laurie Beth Brunner) writes:


>Um, Ted, just wondering...how does that breakfast actually taste? :-)

Sweet but savory, juicy but grainy, . . .  Just great!  Especially
if you use quality apple juice.  You might try only filling
your glass to 1/4 or 1/3 the way up with the dry mixture before
trying it in its' full thickness  ;-)

Well, of the three friends who have tried my nutritional hemlock,
2 actually liked it enough to now be having it for breakFAST
themselves on a regular basis, but the one other simply can't
stand the stuff.  I, of course, being the proud inventor of this
oddity, really like.  The wheat germ is certainly a great
source of vitamin E, the bran provides for some zinc and 
folic acid, the nutritional yeast gives us some protein and
the B complex, and then we also have some vitamin C and
minerals from the apple juice.  One other benefit is that
it really helps to motivate those bowels  ;-)   What better way
to start the day, without the whey, as they say.   :-)

Happy vegetarian feating,

                                        ted
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: why vegetarianism?
Date: 13 Nov 92 19:44:59 GMT
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)

aspandia@unix.amherst.edu (ANAND SANKAR PANDIAN) writes:
>
>An open question: Does anyone out there have any theories of vegetarian
>ethics that don't rest on the "badness" of killing animals? It seems as
>though death is a part (integral part) of the life cycle, and an ecologically
>conscious ehtics of vegetarianism would take that into account. Any ideas?

     Death may be an integral part of the life cycle, but that doesn't,
for example, justify murder. The "naturalness" of death doesn't give us
the right to speed up the process.

===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@cs.umd.edu  |  "Born to die"   |   Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
                     Keep your values off my family.
     "In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to
      a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and
      district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which
      district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be
      informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be
      confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory
      process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the
      Assistance of Counsel for his defence."
      -- The Constitution of the United States of America
From: deatz@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Gregory H Deatz)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: substitute for eggs
Date: 8 Nov 92 22:05:33 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

Eggs are such wonderful things -- Only thing is, they're eggs and they're real bad for you.

Does anybody know of an *inexpensive* non-egg *substitute* for eggs?

When I say *substitute* I truly mean substitute. Like, one could use it in cakes to help them set. In veggie burgers to hold them together. In mousses and the like to help them fluff up.

Maybe each of these purposes is a separate job for different foods, but I'm really looking for something that behaves almost just like eggs. Maybe impossible, but hey, food science is bound to have an answer.

Thanks
From: dsouza@hplredHPL.HP.COM (Roy D'Souza)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1992 20:31:29 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Stupid fast food employee tricks......
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg



>Not to mention that in places like Madras, unless things have changed
>recently, a "restaurant" means a "vegetarian restaurant". Places that
>serve non-vegetarian food would call themselves "military restaurants" :-).
>I am not talking about the upscale places though.

Except that many restaurants in Madras are Moslem.
If you can guess from the name that it is Hindu, there is a good chance that
it is vegetarian. (Unless it is labelled "military" )

If the restaurant has one of the following words in it's name, there is 
most probably vegetarian:

"udupi" "ganesh" "mahal" "vilas" "ramakrishna" "chandra" "bhavan" 

R.
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Hiking boots.....
Keywords: Come one come allllllllll
Date: 10 Nov 92 18:47:43 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)

begonias@wam.umd.edu (Jeremy Ritzer) writes:
>
>Come one come all, but someone must be wearing nonleather hiking boots
>	as they read this.  Siomeone.......?????  So, what do you
>	recommend?

     From the Leather Alternatives FAQ (available via ftp from flubber.cs.
umd.edu, directory other/tms/veg):

     (from Nike) Hiking/Outdoor: Air Revaderchi, Air Deschutz

     Hi-Tec Sierra Sneaker: All canvas hiking boot. Available from 
Heartland or REI.

     Rugged Outback: Leatherlike hiking sneakers. Available at Payless Shoe 
Source.

     Aesop and Heartland both carry leather-like hiking boots.

     Heartland Products Ltd., Box 218, Dakota City, IA 50529, (515) 
332-3087.

     Aesop Unlimited, P.O. Box 315, N. Cambridge, MA 02140, (617) 
628-8030. (was: 923-1704.)


===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@cs.umd.edu  |  "Born to die"   |   Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
                     Keep your values off my family.
     "[I will never have] another Jimmy Carter grain embargo, Jimmy,
      Jimmy Carter, Jimmy Carter grain embargo, Jimmy Carter grain embargo."
      -- Vice President Dan Quayle during the Bentson debate
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: Where indeed *WAS* Mr. Altar??? ;-)
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 15:05:36 GMT


Ted Feurerbach writes:
>Recently, in the heat of a flame war, a regular poster who had been gone
>for quite a while came quietly sneaking back into this forum.  This
>man is none other than...   Ted Altar, aka THE OTHER TED, my evil
>nemesis!  

>Now this may seem of little concern to us, however I submit this
>for your consideration...  Where has Ted been all this time?  
>Do you realize that while he was gone, thousands of homes were
>burglarized and that hundreds of rapes and murders have taken place 
>in the US alone? 

[other heinous crimes here omitted]

>Yes folks, where indeed *HAS* Mr. Altar been!  And, how much of 
>this is his doing?????    

>I rest my case.

>Mr. Altar, your very character is in question!  What *DO* you have
>to say for yourself?

Once again the irrecusible logic of `post hoc ergo propter
hoc' as exposed and strip me down to my unsaturated,
nefarious self.   What can I say?  Ok, I confess!  Devil
incarnate here I stand. You do, however, generously  give me
too much credit.  After Michael Traub and other star-system
Vegan, computer-chair potatoes are still out there :-)
 
Now, this reminds me of another `non causa pro causa'
case of causal attribution:
 
     The story is told of Wendell Phillips, the
     abilitionist, whon one day found himself on the same
     train with a group of Southern clergymen on their way
     to a conference.  When the Southerners discoved
     Phillips presence, they decided to give him a bad time.
     One of them approached and asked,
          "Are you Wendell Phillips?
          "Yes, I am", came the reply.
          "Are you then the `great' abolitionist?"
          "I am not great, but I am an abolitionist"
          "You are then the one who makes speeches in Boston
               and New York against slavery?"
          "Yes, I am".
          "Why is it that you don't go to Kentucky and make
               speeches there?"
          Phillips paused, looked at his questioner and
               asked in turn, "Are you a clergyman?"
          "Yes I am", replied the other.
          "Are you trying to save souls from hell?"
          "Yes, of course!"
          "Well--why don't you go there??"   :-)

Please observe that I only post to r.f.v.  I have
no interest in descending into hell or Kentucky.  ;-)
          
Now, it is indeed a compliment to be welcomed back by my
upper case doppleganger, TED, who as been my worthy and
sometimes fierce opponent on some issues.  There is no
better compliment to be welcome back by one's occasional
adversaries  ;-)   Thanks TED.
 
                             ted
 
 
 
 

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: abulsari@aton.abo.fi (A. Bulsari)
Subject: Trivia : How much of rain forest is destroyed by one hamburger ?
Organization: Abo Akademi University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 09:22:17 GMT


How much of rain forest is destroyed by one hamburger ?


Answer : About 55 sq ft for a quarter pound one.


If you are new to vegetarianism, perhaps you would like to know more -
why and how.

With regards,

A. Bulsari
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT)
Subject: Why vegetarianism ?
Organization: Abo Akademi University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 11:24:56 GMT

In article <BxMs8A.Guw@unix.amherst.edu> aspandia@unix.amherst.edu (ANAND SANKAR PANDIAN) writes:
>
>An open question: Does anyone out there have any theories of vegetarian
>ethics that don't rest on the "badness" of killing animals? It seems as
>though death is a part (integral part) of the life cycle, and an ecologically
>conscious ehtics of vegetarianism would take that into account. Any ideas?

Most theories talk about other aspects :

pain and torture

animal breeding practices

animals not being our property

destructiveness, etc.


Start reading this newsgroup and you will see a lot of good reasons
for vegetarianism : 

ethical reasons

health reasons

environmental reasons

religious reasons


With regards,

Abhay Bulsari
From: proberts@informix.com (Paul Roberts)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: AR Prisoners in need of your written support
Date: 12 Nov 92 06:46:49 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <148940012@hpindda.cup.hp.com> gph@hpindda.cup.hp.com (Paul Houtz) writes:
>
>Could someone please tell me why we are having a discussion about gun
>legislation in rec.food.veg?

It seems to be some sort of law of nature that once the subject of guns
comes up in any shape or form, a lot of people feel an irrestistable urge
to post a lot of stuff about how no-one is going to take away their
Stinger missles, rifles, handguns, semi-automatics, tactical nukes, flame
throwers, etc, not ever, until they pry them from their dead cold fingers,
etc. It is clear that the pro-gun lobby watch a lot of very bad movies.

Paul
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: TDOPER35@ysub.ysu.edu (Dogger)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Need vegetarian ideas for thanksgiving
Date: 7 Nov 92 01:04:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: ysub.1689711A33.TDOPER35
Organization: Youngstown State University

I need suggestions for a vegetarian thanksgiving. Thanks for your help.
 
DOGGER
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg