HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: FOR SALE: Long Beach House
Date: 9 Sep 92 23:42:04 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Colorado State University, Computer Science Department

In article <STEINMAN.92Sep9170153@hawk.is.morgan.com> steinman@is.morgan.com (Jan Steinman) writes:
>In article <1992Sep9.172023.298@tfs.com> tab@tfs.com (Theresa Breckon) writes:
>
>   Custom 4000 sq ft. 3 Bdrm, 2.5 BA
>   pool, spa, patio
>   Park Estates
>   Long Beach, California  $945K
>
>   Betsy, Denny Steen  310 597-7149
>
>Yup, I've always considered Long Beach to be backcountry, as in rec.backcountry!
>                                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I think they've confused rec.backcountry with WRECK.backcountry, as in real
estate development.

-- 

-Wayne Trzyna
 trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU
From: cheu@neptune.its.uci.edu (Kelvin Cheu)
Subject: Recom. Wanted For Tents, Packs and Sleeping Bags
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Reply-To: cheu@neptune.its.uci.edu (Kelvin Cheu)
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 8 Sep 92 23:41:33 GMT


Hi I'm new to rec.backcountry and I'm serious about backpacking.
I'm doing my homework about what equipment to buy etc...will be
taking a backpacking class with A16 in October.  Based on
various sources I have (Backpacker Magazine buying guide, REI,
North Face, Campor catalog...) I've narrowed my choice to the 
follwoings.  I'm thinking about backpacking in high Sierra,
Southern Utah areas in Summer, and perhaps trekking in Nepal
in the future.  Can anybody please give me some comments of the 
following equipment, and perhaps suggest alternatives ?

Tents:	Euraka Cirrus-3
	my main consideration is space for 2 and weight
	What about North Face Tadpole, Firefly and Bigfrog and 
	Sierra Design Clip Flashlight-3 ?

Sleeping bag:	North Face Blue Kazoo
		What is the temperature of a sleeping bag for ?

Boots:	Tenica Tascony

Backpack:	Jansport Rainer

Thanks in advance.



Kelvin Cheu



Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: ted@nmsu.edu (Ted Dunning)
Subject: Re: Cows at 12,000 Feet.
Reply-To: ted@nmsu.edu
Organization: Computing Research Lab
	<1992Sep8.151529.367@news.media.mit.edu>
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 20:11:37 GMT



another data point is that apparently there were over 100,000 head of
sheep grazing in the wind river when the various wilderness areas
there were instituted.  there are now less than 6,000 in the entire
range.  (of course, these 6,000 have a nasty knack for being where you
would like to be).

--

REALLY, instead of hyping low impact soles, I think what we need
are more low impact souls.
					Greg Jahn
From: ajs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Alan Silverstein)
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 22:58:50 GMT
Subject: Re: water storage for emergencies
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry

> You should probably change the water every 6 months or so to prevent
> bacteria build up.

Dubious.  I have many gallon jugs in my basement that are ten years old
and look fine.  Nothing in them but tap water with a healthy dose of
bleach added (more than eight drops!).  They were sterile when sealed so
I suspect they are still safe.  Of course I don't intend to drink them
except in a dire emergency.
From: xtkmg@trentu.ca (Kate Gregory)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Outback Oven - A Review
Date: 13 Sep 92 20:43:36 GMT
Organization: Trent University, Ontario


I, too, am rather taken with the idea of baking while camping
and have been thinking about the Outback Oven. I'm really pleased
that people are posting impressions here.

BUT, why is it always pizza? You can make pizza in any old frying
pan. I do so every single canoe camping trip and most car
camping trips. Just use a plate or a chopping board or a paddle
blade :-) or some such as a lid. No problem. So I'm not
impressed that this frying-pan-with-heat-diffuser-and-fancy-lid
can make a pizza. So can my ordinary frying pan with no diffuser
and a plate for a lid.

Please, someone, spin me tales of banana bread, of chocolate
cake, of pilaf, anything that really really needs an oven.
I have this cookbook which I bought because it has wanigan
plans, and this woman has a reflector oven. Every night
after dinner while the others do the dishes, she bakes a 
loaf or two of something: usually a quick bread. The just-before-bedtime
hot chocolate round the fire is supplemented with a *warm* slice
of whatever she just baked; that takes care of half a loaf
or so. The rest goes into the wanigan (rigid sided food pack)
and forms the basis of the next day's lunch. Mmmm that sounds
like a great way to travel. But can this Outback Oven do that?

Kate
From: ed@titipu.meta.com (Edward Reid)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: water purification methods
Date: 6 Sep 92 19:14:16 GMT
Reply-To: ed@titipu.meta.com (Edward Reid)
Organization: Accuracy, Ltd.
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.6v0

tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill) writes:
> I feel that the Pur filter-plus-iodine technology is the
> wave of the future.  ...  the First Need
> does not protect against all bacteria without adding some iodine.
> Why not have the filter do this automatically? 

It's a good idea.  The only problem is that we don't seem to have any evidence
that it works.  Assumptions are dangerous.  Remember, most of us thought that
one Potable Aqua tablet in a liter of water for ten minutes killed Giardia --
until we read the research in AJPH showing that such treatment doesn't protect
against Giardia at all.  I'd love to find out that a simple method works, but I
won't trust it until I see the scientifically run study demonstrating the
effectiveness.

I asked recently whether anyone needs a dissertation topic.  One email responder
suggested that the challenge should be posed to sci.bio.  Sounds like a good
idea, but I don't like posting to a group that I don't have available to check
the appropriateness of the posting.  Anyone care to take up the banner?

Still another useful approach might be to ask the authors of the AJPH article if
they know of any ongoing research.  The lead and contact author is Jerry E.
Ongerth, PhD, PE, Assistant professor, Department of Environmental Health,
SB-75, University of Washington, School of Public Health and Community
Medicine, Seattle, WA 98195.  Is anyone reading this near there?  Can find out
his email address, if any?  Or at least tell me the domain name for the U of W?

Edward Reid  (8*}>
  eel:   ed@titipu.meta.com  or  nosc.mil!titipu.meta.com!ed
  snail: PO Box 378/Greensboro FL 32330
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: tab@tfs.com (Theresa Breckon)
Subject: Re:  FOR SALE: Long Beach House.... APOLOGY
Organization: TRW Financial Systems
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 21:26:45 GMT

Please forgive this posting. I accidentally 'f'd an article with
the cross-posting to bicycles and backcountry.

For all of those people who sent humorous reminders not to cross
post; thanks, and I'll be more careful in the future.

For all of those people who were upset enough to send
nasty mail; I apologize and hope
your week isn't going as bad as it sounds. BTW, I tried to 'C'ancel
and it told me I can't cancel a letter posted by another person!

Oh well. Sorry again.
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: chris@engineer.mrg.uswest.com (Chris Fedde)
Subject: Re: Unleaded stoves ??
Organization: USWEST Marketing Resources
NntpPostingHost: engineer.mrg.uswest.com
Date: 14 Sep 92 05:47:27 GMT

In article <18v6opINNdat@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> au109@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Craig Williams) writes:
>
>My vacations are frequently bike touring trips requiring air
>transportation to and from my home to the biking areas.  I
[...]
>of this and other unleaded fuel stoves?
>

I used unleaded in an old optomus 8R for years.  Winter and Summer.
Only problem was with the ruber gasket in the stove fuel tank lid.
Apparently some additive in automotive gas attacks the ruber.  I haven't
been brave enough to try unleaded in my whisperlite for fear of loosing
all the gaskets and seals.

	chris
 
Chris Fedde, USWEST MRG, chris@mrg.uswest.com, voice 3037842823
From: johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Cows at 12,000 Feet.
Date: 9 Sep 92 21:59:47 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Inc.

In article <1992Sep9.031056.7565@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> rbw3q@helga9.acc.Virginia.EDU (Robert B. Whitehurst) writes:
 
|	Much as I love the Great Western Spaces, I gotta admit,
|moo-less trails are one nice feature here in the east (not to dismiss
|some other problems...).   

I was just looking at some topo maps and found a place in the west looks
like it might be cowless.  It's  just below Hetch Hetchy Reservoir.  It's
called Poopenaut Valley.

-- 
+==========================================================================+
| John Fereira     | Auspex Systems | "Auspex does not share my opinions.  |
| johnf@auspex.com | Santa Clara CA |  So Why am I still working here?"    |
+==========================================================================+
From: David.T.Greenfield@dartmouth.edu (David T. Greenfield)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Floating through a forest fire
Date: 15 Sep 92 14:31:16 GMT
 <14594@auspex-gw.auspex.com> 
 <Sep14.153540.68180@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>  
 <14624@auspex-gw.auspex.com>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

In article <14624@auspex-gw.auspex.com>
johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:

> I have a book that has
> a really good chart for identifying trout.  Perhaps this topic would
> be more appropriate for rec.outdoors.fishing (although the book was 
> written by Ralph Cutter) but if there is interest I'd be happy to post
> the diagram.

I, for one, would love to see the diagram.  Also, what is the name of
the book in which it appears?

David
david.t.greenfield@dartmouth.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: kehoe@netcom.com (Thomas David Kehoe)
Subject: Re: water purification methods
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 92 04:24:43 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

I just posted about chlorine treatment, and left out two points.
First, thyroid diseases are widespread.  8% of the population
has what I have (Hashimoto's thyroiditis, a hypothyroid condition).
It usually doesn't have any symptoms.  It's easy to test for
and simple to treat.  I would suggest that anyone using iodine
water treatment go to a hospital lab and get blood drawn for
a thyroid function test (ask to have your TSH and T4 measured).
Maybe not for a weekend trip, but if you're planning a long
trip.  Shouldn't take more than 5 minutes and your insurance
should cover it.  If you have a thyroid problem, use chlorine
instead of iodine.

Second, someone asked for the address of the company that made
my chlorine treatment kit.  It's the Sierra Water Purifier, from

4 in 1 Water Systems Company
2801 Rodeo Road Suite B518
Santa Fe, NM  87505

You could make the
kit yourself: it's Calcium Hypochlorite crystals and a bottle of 30%
hydrogen peroxide.  I'll e-mail the instructions if you can get the
ingredients somewhere.
-- 
"Why my thoughts are my own, when they are in, but when they are out
they are another's." - Susannah Martin, hanged for witchcraft, 1692.
Thomas David Kehoe          kehoe@netcom.com         (408) 354-5926
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: carnes@ico.isc.com (Steve Carnes)
Subject: Re: Floating through a forest fire
Organization: Interactive Systems Corp., Boulder CO
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:35:23 GMT

	ilana@kiowa.scd.ucar.edu (Ilana Stern) writes:
>felt that we were privileged to have seen the fires, and lucky to have been
>untouched by them.

Interesting story, Ilana.  However, the question remains, did you see
any burned cows?
-- 
Steve Carnes       carnes@ico.isc.com        uucp: {ncar,nbires}!ico!carnes
   "Rock gives reality to the otherwise abstract notion of transhuman
    time." - Edward Abbey
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: kehoe@netcom.com (Thomas David Kehoe)
Subject: Re: Hiking/backpacking references wanted for Colorado Rockies
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 92 17:59:27 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

>> Can anyone recommend a good guide to hiking in Colorado?

My favorite hike in Colorado is around the Maroon Bells, near
Aspen.  It's about a 5 day hike.  I wouldn't recommend it until
you're acclimated, as it goes over 4 or 5 passes over 12,500 feet.

I also liked a 2-3 day hike in the Indian Peaks, just west of
Boulder.  You hike up one valley (King Lake, I think), then
along the Continental Divide in the morning (not in the afternoon,
because of lightning) and down to Devil's Thumb Lake.

The Flat Tops (near Glenwood Canyon) are enjoyable, especially
if you like fishing.  I haven't really explored them though.

Generally I've found the Colorado Rockies not as spectacular
as the Canadian Rockies.  Plus the altitude makes it a poor
vacation choice for people from low altitudes.  

I just got back from a couple overnights in southern Utah,
in Canyonlands and the Capital Reef.  Awesome.  Especially
for backpacking, because the desert becomes almost magical
after sunset, the colors richening, the sense of solitude.
I felt sorry for the day hikers who just saw the canyons
in the glare and heat of midday.

Also, I was amazed at the people carrying minimal water.
I carried 2-3 gallons per day.  I met one couple at a backcountry
campsite who'd hiked twice as far as I had, and carried one
gallon for both of them, for two days.  They were in bad
shape, so I offered them so of my water.  The man said they'd
appreciate a quart.  I gave them 3 quarts.  The next day I
gave a quart to a dehydrated day hiker.  Someone could work
their way through college packing water into the backcountry
and selling it for $20/gallon.
-- 
"Why my thoughts are my own, when they are in, but when they are out
they are another's." - Susannah Martin, hanged for witchcraft, 1692.
Thomas David Kehoe          kehoe@netcom.com         (408) 354-5926
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: heycke@sumex-aim.stanford.edu (Torsten Heycke)
Subject: Re: Desolation Wilderness Questions
Followup-To: rec.backcountry
Organization: Stanford U. Knowledge Systems Lab
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 20:59:45 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.060604.10506@nas.nasa.gov>,
eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya) wrote:
> 
> >>One of
> >>the ways they determine how much money a Wilderness area gets is by use,
> 
> Nonsense.
> This is not how budgeting is determined.

I don't wish to disseminate inaccurate information, but my source was, in
fact, one of the rangers in Desolation Wilderness, Mike Lannoy. He could be
wrong or I could have misconstrued the info.

Torsten

"A horse may walk to water, but a pencil must be led."
From: hall@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Hal F Lillywhite)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Moving to California
Date: 10 Sep 92 18:25:25 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tektronix Inc., Beaverton, Or.

In article <1992Sep10.165938.18191@eos.arc.nasa.gov> dencisco@eos.arc.nasa.gov (David Paul Encisco) writes:

>Why California? ...

>Why not try Oregon or Washington. Tell them a Californian sent you 

Right, Oregon where there is a perpetual drive to recall the
governor, where the timber industry would like to invite everybody
to a spotted owl barbeque and the tax limitations are drying up
school funding.  Besides the "James G. Blaine Society" border
patrol.  Of course most of this is grinding to a halt due to the
current drought.  No snow to ski on and without ice to stablize
things the mountains drop rocks on your head.

Actually we already have too many Californians here. A certain
segment of the Calif. populace is moving to Oregon and it's lowering
the average intelligence of both states.  :-)

>(whoa am I going to get hell):-)

Right!  May you be at ground zero next time one of your rockets
blows up!  :-)  (Well, _maybe_ a smiley)
From: jeschke@wobbegong.cs.indiana.edu (Eric Jeschke)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: What tripod do you use when backpacking?
Date: 15 Sep 92 01:09:53 GMT
Organization: Indiana University, Bloomington

In article <1992Sep9.164016.3988@odin.corp.sgi.com> psturm@sailor.esd.sgi.com (Peter Sturm) writes:
|I have a Cullman tripod.   It weighs less than a lb, yet is full size

The 2101.  I've used this one.  It's OK, but _way_ to flimsy for a
400mm.



-- 
Eric Jeschke                      |          Indiana University
jeschke@cs.indiana.edu            |     Computer Science Department
From: mwalters@news.uwyo.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Canada camping
Date: 15 Sep 92 16:32:11 MST
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Wyoming - Laramie, WY

My wife and I will be traveling to Canada to the Baniff and
Jasper areas.  We will be there the last two weeks in
September.

Any suggestions on campgrounds for tent camping, temperatures at
night, safety issues and must places to see would be appreciated.

We will not be backpacking this trip - just camping out.

Michael Walters
MWalters@corral.uwyo.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: water treatment -- some first hand info
From: meredithd@gtephx.UUCP (Douglas Meredith)
Date: 4 Sep 92 18:13:39 GMT
Organization: gte
Keywords: water filter

Well, time for my input on this latest water filter thread.  I was in
the Chicago Basin area of the San Jauns of Colorado for a week in mid-August.
I filtered my water meticulously with my First Need.  About a week ago I began 
to feel...uncomfortable in my abdomen shall we say?  Went to the doc and the 
verdict is "probable giardia".

Several interesting points to mention:

 -- It was the doctor's opinion that testing for it wasn't worth the effort.
    Fecal samples only give 50% accuracy and the other test involves swallowing
    one end of a string and waiting for it to sink into you upper intestine at
    which point it is pulled back out.  He prescribed Flagyl which is a 
    broad-spectrum antibiotic for abdominal critters, reasoning that if it wasn't
    actually giardia this would kill whatever it was.

 -- I haven't noticed any side-effects of the Flagyl (other than that I'm not 
    supposed to drink any beer while on it, aarrgh!).  Where did these myths
    come from?

 -- If this is truly giardia, it's not that bad.  Just mild cramping with occasional
    more urgent... uh... calls of nature.

 -- What the heck happened with the First Need?  I figure there are three possibilities:
       1)  The filter element is cracked internally (although I didn't notice it
           being any easier to pump).
       2)  Somehow I splashed and contaminated the clean water.
       3)  I shouldn't have dunked my head after that long, hot hike.
    Whatever the case, I think I'll start shopping for a new filter before my next trip
    for good measure.

-- 
| Doug Meredith                                                    |
| UUCP: {ncar!noao!asuvax | uunet!zardoz!hrc}!gtephx!meredithd     |
| Inet: gtephx!meredithd@asuvax.eas.asu.edu                        |
| AG Communication Systems (Formerly GTE), Phoenix, AZ             |
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: dlw@unislc.uucp (David Williams)
Subject: Re: Unleaded stoves ??
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 17:39:50 GMT

From article <1686114C5E.ST21519@VM.CC.LATECH.EDU>, by ST21519@VM.CC.LATECH.EDU:
>>What about the multi-fuel stoves?  I originally thought they would
>>be ideal, but no of the product information that I've seen states
>>that unleaded auto gas can be used, just white gas, kerosene, etc.
>  
> I purchased a Coleman Peak 1 multifuel stove a couple of years back and posed
> this very question to them.  They stated that UNleaded gas would be fine, but
> that I should expect a BIG reduction in the life of the generator since the
> UNleaded gas is not as pure as their fuel.  I believe they have a 1-800
> number if you wish to contact them....1-800-555-1212 to find out for sure.
>  
> Eddie Rowe FidoNet#1:19/124.0

So, Eddie, how has the Peak 1 multifuel worked for you?
Have you notice any problem leading to the shorter life of the generator?
As in reduced flow or clogging?

Thanks

Dave Williams
-- 
 David Williams 
 Unisys Corp.
 dlw@unislc.slc.unisys.com 
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: REI Water Filters Comparison Chart
Date: 4 Sep 1992 19:06:19 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: cairo

						Timber	Basic
	      Katadyn	MSR	PUR	1stNeed	line	Designs
min pore size	.2	.1	1 + I	.4	2	1
dry weight	23 oz	19 oz	21 oz	14 oz	6 oz	12 oz
seconds/qt	120	90	60	90	70	grav-	(when new)
seconds/qt	120	180	60	180	140	 ity	(after usage)
filter life	1000	500	500	100	100	1000	(in gallons)
cost/gallon	$.25	$.28	$.24	$.37	$.30	$.07
retail price	$225	$140	$130	$ 38	$ 30	$ 65
replacement	$ 89	$ 50	$ 40	$ 24	n/a	$ 40	(filter cost)
# elements	2	4	3	1	1	2
elements	screen	foam	screen	carbon	polypro	carbon
		ceramic	screen	glassfiber		ceramic
			carbon	iodine
			paper

Notes: 1st Need, Timberline, and Basic Designs require iodine to treat
bacteria and viruses.  Katadyn and MSR require iodine to treat viruses.
Only PUR requires no additional iodine.  With carbon elements, only MSR,
1st Need, and Basic Designs remove harmful chemicals.


Newsgroups: rec.backcountry,rec.bicycles.rides
From: allen%asylum.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Allen Sanderson)
Subject: Re: FOR SALE: Long Beach House
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:15:23 MDT
Organization: University of Utah CS Dept
Distribution: usa

>>>Custom 4000 sq ft. 3 Bdrm, 2.5 BA
>>>pool, spa, patio
>>>Park Estates
>>>Long Beach, California  $945K
>>>
>>>Betsy, Denny Steen  310 597-7149

kevin@rodin.wustl.edu (Kevin Ruland) writes:
>>What components are on it and how easy is it to pedal!


miket@unislc.UUCP (Michael Thompson,B2C04,4560) writes:
>I suppose these people figured that trying to "pedal" a house in
>rec.bicycles.* is enough to justify posting in this newsgroup

I was thinking a long the same lines - having lived in the LA before,
I know that it is a urban wilderness where one must be aware of the
creatures of the night.  So I guess it okay to post to rec.backcountry


Mean while back at the ranch (house) ...

Allen
From: rhaar@albert.cs.gmr.com (Bob Haar)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: What tripod do you use when backpackin
Date: 9 Sep 92 20:34:34 GMT
Reply-To: rhaar@albert.cs.gmr.com
Organization: G.M. Research Labs

In article 21617@crd.ge.com, halvers@procyon.crd.ge.com (Pete Halverson) writes:
|>In article <1992Sep8.194041.9468@cs.rit.edu> kar@cs.rit.edu (Kenneth A Reek) writes:
|>>In article <lapv16INN9u2@almaak.usc.edu> ajayshah@almaak.usc.edu (Ajay Shah) writes:
|>>>What is a good tradeoff between weight and stability?
|>>
|>>	Of course it depends on what type of pictures you'll be taking, but
|>>you might want to consider a monopod.  The backpackers I've seen already 
|>>huge packs; if you're going to be carrying that load very far (not to 
|>>mention your photo gear), the weight difference between a monopod and a
|>>tripod might be enough to justify its reduced functionality.
|>
|>Plus a monopod makes a great collapsible hiking staff, especially if you
|>wrap it with some grip tape at the appropriate height!  You probably
|>shouldn't leave a camera mounted on it, though :-)
|>

Or a good hiking staff with a camera screw adaptor makes a great
monopod.


---
	Robert Haar               InterNet : rhaar@gmr.com 
	Computer Science Dept., G.M. Research Laboratories
DISCLAIMER: Unless indicated otherwise, everything in this note is
personal opinion, not an official statement of General Motors Corp.