HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rbusch@watarts.uwaterloo.ca (Robert Busch)
Subject: Re: Trispokes
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 14:23:14 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.122807.10232@waikato.ac.nz> jrdodd@waikato.ac.nz writes:
>	I love it!  Has the states become saturated with Oakely paraphanalia
>too?  In  New Zealand they're beaten only by hype for Reebok and 501's.
>I saw a good sticker on a car a while back that read "Gee I wish I could have
>an Oakley sticker like all you other f***wits".

A cycling buddy of mine was visiting friends in London, Ontario a
few months ago. One of his friends has a car that's decked out in 
all the Oakley propoganda (window visor, bumper stickers, etc.). When
this guy saw my friend's sunglasses -- Oakley Blades -- he freaked.

"Your sunglasses say 'Oakley'!"

My friend: "Um, yeah."

"Wow! That's so cool! How'd you get the name on the arm?"

My friend: "Well, they kinda came like that."

"Huh?"

My friend: "They ARE Oakleys, you know."

"You mean Oakley makes sunglasses?"

This guy didn't know what Oakley was. He was totally amazed to find
out that they make sunglasses.

I'd love to know what he thought "Oakley" meant -- and why it's so cool
to cover your car in its stickers.

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: bob@astph (Bob Ford)
Subject: Steve Roberts / BEHEMOTH: interview on NPR
Organization: Philadelphia Phillies
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 18:48:46 GMT

Great article on BEHEMOTH!  It must be a wild thing to see.  Does 
anyone have Steve Robert's email address?  I would like to invite
him to come to State College.  Please respond via email.  Thanks.
-- 
Bob Ford                           (814) 234-8592x36
INTERNET: astph!bob@attmail.com     UUCP: attmail.com!astph!bob
Philadelphia Phillies
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: adr5@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Alex D Rodriguez)
Subject: Re: Another Clipless Pedal ?
Reply-To: adr5@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Alex D Rodriguez)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 13:35:12 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.024504.1930@beaver.cs.washington.edu> pardo@cs.washington.edu (David Keppel) writes:
>stecko@cntrol.enet.dec.com () writes:
>>[Comparison of clipless pedals.]
>
>Hey!  You forgot the trusty rusty Aerolite!
>
>
>>Model           Double-sided    Degrees   Weight        Cornering       Retail
>>                Entry           of Float  grams/pr      Lean Angle      Price
>Aerolite	Yes*		0	   140(?)	35+		?
>
>
>The Aerolite is one of the earliest of the current generation of
>clipless pedals.  The `pedal' is basically the outside surface of a
>roller bearing.  A round stub tube.  The cleat is humongously tall,
>with a tube running parallel to the pedal axle, and a slot on the
>bottom.  The cleat is screwed on to holes drilled in the shoe.
>
>* Basically, the pedal has no ``sides'', so it doesn't make sense to
>speak of not being able to get in from one side.
>
>The system allows *no* rotation.
>
>I believe the steel version is 140g/pr including cleats, the Ti version
>another 20g lighter.
>
>I don't imagine the lean angle is any worse than the Byrne/Speedplay's
>37 degrees.  I scrape pedals pretty frequently and I never scraped when
>I was riding with Aerolites.
>
>I don't know how much they cost, but I think the steel version is a bit
>over $100.
>
>The big disadvantes of the Aerolites are (many):
>
>- You mount the cleats by drilling holes in the shoe sole.  The Look
>adapter plate adds 1/4" to your height and adds weight.
>
>- Short-term cleat wear makes it hard to get in to the pedals.
>Long-term wear makes it easier to get in.
>
>- The cleats are twice as tall as any others.  Walking is  a pain.
>
>- Clipping in requires too much force.  I started getting knee pain
>that I attribute to the *slam* when my foot landed, clipping in.
>Decreasing the clip-in tension also decreases the pull-out tension.
>
>- No foot rotation.
>
>Advantages:
>
>+ Lighter than anything else
>
>+ Simple
>
>+ Lighter than anything else
>
>+ Simple...
>
>
>I don't reccomend the Aerolites unless you really need to save the
>weight.  I do wish some of the other pedal designers had thought a bit
>longer before building their pedals (I think the Byrne Speedplay is on
>the right track).
>
>		;-D on  ( Aero, shmaro )  Pardo

If anyone is interested in a pair of the steel aerolites I have a pair I
will sell cheap.  I have the look adapter plate but no cleats.
-----------------
Alex Rodriguez
Columbia University
New York City
From: aviator@athena.mit.edu (Joakim Karlsson)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Bicycle Paths
Date: 12 Aug 92 14:47:24 GMT
Organization: Flight Transportation Associates, Cambridge, MA

>@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com> caseb@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com writes:
>>
>>The original post sugested that a network of bicycle paths should be
>>built, supported by a big gasoline tax making it too expensive to 
>>operate a motor vehicle.  My objection is simply that the original 
>>authors seemed to ignore the obvious disadvantages of such a plan, 
>>namely inflation and unemployment.
>>Brian Case

I just want to say this: In most European countries, gasoline prices
are on the order of 3-4 times as expensive as they are in the U.S.
Part of this is due to much higher national (read "federal") taxes on
gasoline.

The European experience may not be directly applicable to the U.S.,
but I don't think inflation and unemployment are running rampant in
Europe.  Also, while this may not be directly related, my experience
shows that generally speaking European countries do a much better job
at public transportation and bicycle access than is done in the U.S.

...Joakim
--
Joakim Karlsson            | aviator@athena.mit.edu
Flying Fanatic in Training | Air: PP-ASEL  CAP: Freedom 110 Mobile  FCC: N1JHW
                 "Oh, I have slipped the surly bonds of earth
                And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings"
From: blodgett@bvc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Cowhorn style aero bars??
Date: 17 Aug 92 11:38:49 CDT
Organization: Buena Vista College, Storm Lake, IA

I have been considering purchasing a cowhorn style areo handlebar. The 
Profile Areo III is on sale from Nashbar for $32.88. Has anyone had either 
a good or bad experience with cowhorn style bars? I'm trying to maximize 
available hand positions because my hands get very numb when I ride. I'd 
appreciate information from persons in-the-know.  Thanks.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: My Bicycle Helmet Experience
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 21:11:36 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1992Aug11.213506.9401@src.dec.com> sclafani@src.dec.com (Michael Sclafani) writes:
>I'd agree with you if I had the freedom to choose not to pay for the costs of
>injured, helmetless cyclists.  Those costs include direct medical costs,
>medical insurance, unemployment, lawyers, court costs, and liability insurance
>for clubs, race sponsors, and bike shops.  Your freedom to choose not to wear
>a helmet ends at my wallet.

Oh, good, you have some actual facts about the number of bicyclists that
have become wards of the government because they are too badly
injured in bicycle caused accidents to pay their own bills?

Or is this just another one of those posts suggesting that
the public tax pocket is bottomless and that we should add
still further regualtion and responsibility to the public docket?

From: mjs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Marc Sabatella)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 16:57:00 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Avocet 50 altitude errors (was Re: RAMROD altitude gain)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles

In rec.bicycles, rfloyd@cs.duke.edu (Rick Floyd) writes:

> In article <6000026@hplsla.hp.com> garyw@hplsla.hp.com (Gary Wong) writes:
>    ...
>    If the units can be off by 8% then why did Avocet suggeset a 1% error in the
>    manual?  I hate false and misleading information.  Maybe Avocet will offer
> 
> This is the same manual that claims that "weather changes can affect
> readings by as much as 200 feet" (I've seen greater than 500 foot
> changes), and that rates the battery life as "1.5-2 year" (my first
> set lasted less than 9 months, even though I bought it the same day it
> came into the store, within weeks of when Avocet first started
> shipping the 50).

One thing I'm suspicious of is the part about the altimeter shutting itself
off if there is no rotational or button input for a few hours.  I should pay
more attention, but I swear the altitude reads different on my dormant MTB
every morning.  Maybe this shutoff feature is not working, and draining the
battery faster than expected?  The batteries that came with it lasted only
6 months, but the replacements are in their 8th so far, as are batteries in the
one on my touring bike.

As for the altitude errors, it has already been observed that the "accumulated
climb" numbers will almost always be underrepresented because of the 30 ft
minimum that can make rolling hills show up as flat.  I understand the
rationale here, so I won't quibble.

As for the absolutle altitude, and the effect of weather, let's do a little
back-of-the-envelope calculation here.

Average barometric pressure at sea level is ~30.5 inches of mercury.
Reasonable range is 29 - 32, or 5% around the mean.  The manual observes that
each 7000 ft climb represents a 25% drop.  This seems to mean that at elevation
X, the pressure is .75**(x/7000) what it was at sea level.  At this rate, a
passing storm at 29" mercury (from 30.5) would look like a climb of 1250 ft.
That is probably an upper bound.  I'm not sure it makes sense to talk about
percent error - since the true elevation is 0, any discrepancy is an infinite
percent error.  Conversely, a 200 ft elevetion change corresponds to a 1%
change in pressure at sea level, or around .3"; I'd bet the majority of days
have less than this amount of variation.

--------------
Marc Sabatella
marc@fc.hp.com
From: jtchew@csa3.lbl.gov (JOSEPH T CHEW)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Looking for advice on purchase of TOURING bikes
Date: 21 Aug 92 16:00:10 GMT
Reply-To: jtchew@csa3.lbl.gov
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory - Berkeley, CA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.254.198
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4

Are other towns of similar size [Fort Collins, CO, pop. 80,000] different 
in this respect?

Yeah -- in my sporadic and anecdotal experience, most of them wouldn't 
have "four major bike shops." My summer in Fort Collins several years
ago left me with the impression that it is an unusually bike-conscious 
place in all respects.

As for your actual question -- whether it's common to have a 1:1 mapping
of brands and shops -- well, I dunno.  Most of the bike shops I see 
hereabouts carry two or three brands.  But when you start permuting more 
than a few brands, models, and sizes, you end up with either a really 
spotty selection or lots of $quare footage.  Remember, also, that two
entire classes of bikes which barely existed several years ago -- MTBs
and hybrids -- are in widespread demand.  One brand today is like three
in the old days, plus you have to have salesmen who understand both
road and mountain bikes.

I can't help envisioning a local shop that tries to carry four brands in 
touring, racing, mountain, hybrid, and kid's BMX varieties.  They rely 
heavily on outdoor display so that the customers can move around, and 
only M.C. Escher could do justice to the way they close up for the night.
Nice people, good prices, convenient location, high pandemonium. Their 
selection, parts inventory, and general ability to deal with it all 
appear to limit their customer base to rec cyclists like Yours Fatty
who come in a reasonably standard size.  If I needed something out of 
the ordinary, I'd look for a shop with less breadth and more depth.

--Joe
"Just another personal opinion from the People's Republic of Berkeley"
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: caseb@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Running as crosstraining for cycling
Date: 13 Aug 92 13:53:21 EST

How useful is running as part of a training program for cycling?
Running seems like a good way to improve cardiovascular fitness,
but what are the disadvantages?
  
I run out of energy while running much quicker than when cycling, 
so running seems like it could be a good substitute for a long 
bike ride on days when I don't have a lot of time.  I'm just
wondering whether running is worth my time, if my only goal is
to improve my cycling performence.

Brian Case
From: lib@cbnews.cb.att.com (Lib)
Subject: Rollerblading
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:54:55 GMT

   
I'm interested in trying roller-blading, kind of as an adjunct to
cycling, just to do something different that's still good exerecise.
   
Well anyway I've been trying to get some info on roller-blading so
far without success. None of the women I work out with seem to know
anything about it. I tried rec.fitness (no answers) and looked for
a roller-blading bulletin board and couldn't find one so I thought I'd
try here. Maybe somebody here's tried it.
   
Can anyone give me some advice on how much a decent set of roller-blades
should cost? What type of store to go to? (E.g a sporting goods store
or will Zayre's do it?). What type if any of protective gear should I
buy? (E.g. knee pads, elbow pads, a helmet? Do you wear a helmet-why
not use my cycle helmet?)
   
Where do you go to do it? Do you just find a not too busy stretch of
road?
  
Is there a bulletin board for this?
  
Anything else I should know? Thanks for any help.
From: shiba@riffnique.csd.sgi.com (Rich Shiba)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Mtn Klein 4 sale
Date: 17 Aug 92 22:56:31 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc., Mountain View, CA


	FOR SALE
	--------
	20" Mountain Klein
	Shimano 600 headset
	Klein sealed bottom bracket
	Never raced

	I'd like to sell it in one of the following configs :

		Frameset only w/CrMo unicrown fork	$350
		Frameset only w/Scott suspension fork	$425
			(fork is ~1 year old)
		Complete bike w/Scott fork and		$500
			Suntour XC gruppo

	Give me a call or drop me some email if you have
	questions/interest.

			Rich Shiba
			shiba@csd.sgi.com
			(415)390-1856
From: willo@youcon.Central.Sun.COM (Doug Willoughby  Area SE  - Midwest Area )
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Austin USCF Sanctioned Events
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:30:45 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems - Southfield, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: youcon.central.sun.com


Sorry to waste the bandwidth...but would anyone
know if there's a USCF sanctioned event scheduled
for Austin, Texas around labor day weekend? (Look
to ship my bike for free!)

Thanks,

Doug
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: Carbon frame life, Kestrel, and warranties
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 00:26:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Distribution: na
Keywords: Kestrel, carbon fiber, warranty

In article <71191@apple.Apple.COM> ehouse@Apple.COM (Eric House) writes:
>People were wondering about the longevity of carbon fiber bikes a while back,
>and about whether they can be repaired.  Well, one of the guys I ride with
>has a Kestrel and recently had a bad experience with it.  He doesn't have access
>to the net, but I asked him if he'd write it up.  Here's his response.

>Draw your own conclusions.  Mine are that either 1) Kestrels are so
>difficult to repair once crashed that even the manufacturer can't do
>a competent job of it (and won't admit it); or 2) the frames self
>destruct after a fairly minimal amount of riding (though that amount
>is in excess of the 5000 miles I once heard a Kestrel employee estimate
>the typical owner puts on his bike.)  In either case it doesn't seem
>that Kestrel is honoring its commitments to this particular owner
>(though that particular problem wouldn't be likely to apply to Trek's
>bikes, as Trek has an excellent reputation for warranty service.)

My opinion is that Kestrel must be having lots of trouble with these bikes
and that is why the warranty policy is so bad. When you aren't having 
problems you fix anything just to keep a good reputation.

The oringial Trek 5000 was pretty bad in this respect but Trek
tried to do their best for the customers.

I have serious doubts about the latest Trek 5500 because there are
sections of the frame that are so thin and the frames aren't
repairable except by Trek. Invariably they will have problems and
not enough service personnel to handle the claims. But I'm sure that
what they will do is offer their other frames in trade.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Tour de Parks, KY
From: <PWRIGHT@MIAMIU.BITNET>
Date: Thursday, 13 Aug 1992 16:36:08 EDT
Organization: Miami University - Academic Computer Service

Does anyone out there have any information on the Tour de Parks race in
Louisville, KY ? I saw it listed in Cycling USA but there was no contact person
or address. It is not listed in VeloNews either. So basically I have the date
but no other info. like where in Louisville it is, what time the races start,
etc. I did it last year and it is a really cool course. That is of course, if
the course is the same this year.  Any info will be appreciated.
 
                                                                 Thanks,
                                                                  Paul
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: ZOOM products????
From: <U3C@psuvm.psu.edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 08:57:48 EDT
Organization: Penn State University

I've been thinking of getting a intagrated bar/bar-end and had planned to
get a scott a2-lf or a3-lf until I saw a mail-order add for the zoom bar.
It weighs in at approx 230-240 grams (less than the a3lf but more than the
a2lf(195g))) and cost only $26!!!!!!  Their cromoly stem cost about $29
and weighs in at less than a answer A-tac.  I know weight isnt everything
so here is my question is....is this stuff junk???? Is it poorly made,
weak, bad at absorbing shock or what....or is it just another product
of good quality being made cheaply in Taiwan??????

Steve litvin....u3c@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer)
Subject: Re: Gas Taxes R Us 
Reply-To: byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer)
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 20:33:07 GMT

Thomas H. Kunich writes

>>How about balancing the costs versus the benefits so that
>>there are no hidden costs and the user can properly
>>determine which benefits them most?  That's not using
>>force.  It's simply fair.

> isn't this the same thing as saying that those of us that
> don't use the education system shouldn't pay for it?

If there is somebody who recieves *no* benefit from the
educational system, then, no, they shouldn't pay anything
into it.  But, just as you pointed out for the highway
system, there are indirect benefits.  Some people benefit
more, some less.  Those that benefit more should pay more
- and all I was saying was that the costs must be exposed
in order that that may happen.

> Or those of us that can stand to live under other regimes
> shouldn't have to pay for the military? Or welfare?

Same thing.  There is nobody who recieves the full benefit
of anything; likewise, there is nobody who recieves no
benefit from something.  Whenever possible, expose the
costs in a way that reflects recieved benefits.  When
not possible, this is (sort of) a democracy, and there
are ways of dealing with that.

> Your basic premise is that something that is good for
> the United States but not you personally sholdn't be a
> burden on your pocketbook. As a nation we do not share
> that belief.

Couldn't be further from the truth.  My basic premise is
that an efficient economy raises the standard of living
and benefits everyone on the nation.  Shortening the
distance between cost and benefit increases the efficiency
of working capital, and the economy.

You may not want a higher standard of living, but I do
- and I think most of this nation does.

Scott Byer                                   NeXTMail: byer@adobe.com
Adobe Systems Incorporated               These are *my* opinions, and  
1585 Charleston Road, P.O. Box 7900        do not necessarily reflect
Mountain View, CA 94039-7900             the opinions of my employer.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: MEDELMA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Michael Edelman)
Subject: Re: Debugging a possible drivetrain problem
Organization: Wayne State University, C&IT
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 12:07:58 GMT

In article <1992Aug7.033819.14649@cactus.org>
chevrie@cactus.org (Rickey E. Chevrie) writes:
 
>
>I recently bought an ATB at a police auction.  It is a Raleigh Technium
>Chill aluminum frame with what I assume to be upgraded Shimano Deore XT
>components.  The chain rings are Shimano Biopace II, the freewheel is
>a Shimano SIS, the chain is a new Sedisport ATB.
>
>The bike runs great on the level, but under pressure, such as climbing
>an incline, the chain jumps off the middle chain ring.  Sometimes it
>lands on the small ring, but it usually land in the "chain suck" area.
>It is very frustrating.
>
 [...]
Two things: Buy a Shimano "Shark Fin" or similar device to lessen damage
when chain suck does occur. Second, lose those Biopace rings. I can't
say for sure if there's a connection, but I had a lot of chain suck with
my Biopace equipped Peugot Canyon Cruiser, and *none* with my Diamond Back
Apex. Even if it's not the answer, you'll find spinning round chainrings
much easier ;-)
                    --mike
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: sridar@nil.mni.mcgill.ca (Sridar Narayanan)
Subject: Re: What cold weather bike shoe?
Organization: NeuroImaging Laboratory, Montreal Neurological Institute
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 20:53:01 GMT


Hmm...  A thought just occurred to me.  How about using cross-country
ski boots with extra long toe-clips.  You could probably get an old
pair that went with the old 3-prong bindings at a garage sale for
next to nothing.  A lot of people have upgraded to the newer bindings.
Then you could try attaching cleats to the bottoms.

As for me, I find that my mountain bike shoes (Specialized, non-SPD)
suit me fine to below 0 C.  But then, my friends do call me an Eskimo
(Inuit).

Sridar
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: rlewis@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca (Robert Lewis)
Subject: Wheel strength
Summary: Are 26" (MTB type) wheels really stronger? (AOTBE)
Keywords: 26" vs 700c wheels, spokes, wheels
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Distribution: rec
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 04:12:02 GMT

I have had problems with spoke breakage on a tour on a loaded tandem 
(all on good paved roads, this was in England, not North America, where
such exist).  The bike has 26" wheels, wide flange hubs, 36 spoke (14
guage), cross-four lacing, Sun Mistral rims (not a direct factor IMO), 
and Specialized Fat Boys (1.5") inflated to 100-120 lbs/sq. inch.

Now my question:  it is often stated that 26" wheels are stronger, all
other things being equel (I assume), than 700c or 27" wheels as a result
of their having shorter spokes (again I assume, if they are claming that
it is due to stronger rims then, my knowledge of wheels would tell me, 
they are talking so much phooey).  Now is such actually true, and if
true to what extent is it such (i.e., are they significantly stronger
rather than simply theoretically stronger).

Would a 700c rim with 40 or 48 spokes be significantly stronger than 26"
wheels with 36" spokes (they now have 13/14 single butted spokes, cross
three on the rear wheel where most, but not all, of the breakage took
place)?  I am asking this as the builder is offering to build us another
tandem at no extra cost, in exchange, and I am wondering whether it 
would be better to go with 700c wheels.

A less important point is whether 700c wheels would make a faster tandem
than a similar one with 26", MTB style, wheels (assuming, reasonable 
now, that the tires are of equel width) 

Thanks to all in advance.

Robert M. Lewis
Department of Sociology
University of Alberta
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada