From: "mike vanier" <mike.vanier@canrem.com>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: paranoia and relevanc
Date: 3 Sep 92 06:25:07 EST
Reply-To: "mike vanier" <mike.vanier@canrem.com>
Distribution: soc
Organization: Canada Remote Systems

subject:  paranoia and relevance


-> >Erland Sommarskog - ENEA Data, Stockholm - sommar@enea.se
-> >Apparently you are so completely lost in your phobia of what
-> >theoretcially could happen, that you don't understand what is
-> >being said. The point is exactly that Germany will not make any
-> >territorial demands on France. Am I getting through?

-> From: efstse@epsilon.eecs.nwu.edu
-> Sure honey! You see, the German do not bent down from the French to
-> be called `French'! While, the Skopje government goes comes to the
-> Macedonians and begs:
-> Skopje, X-Yugo...> Please, please, let us be called `Macedonians'....
-> please,                 we beg you, oh, please, we have no other name
-> to choose to
->                  describe us...
->
-> Macedonia, Greece> Why, do you want to use our name?
->
-> Skopje, X-Yugo...> Dear Macedonians, we like your name, yes we do!!!!
->                 It has such a great gravity, importance, and besides
->                  we can revive some of the past plans to Great the
->                  `Great Macedonia' divide Greece and Bulgaria, cause
->                  instability in the Southern Balkans, THE WORK! REAL
-> FUN!
->                  Besides this Bulgarian like new `Macedonian' culture
->                  and language that we have devised is KOOLER! Come
-> on,
->                  what do you say guys?

There is nothing new about the Macedonian culture, language or identity
existing and being different than that of the Greek.  Despite intense
efforts by Greece and Bulgaria to eliminate the identity of the
Macedonians, in the parts of Macedonian which they now occupy,
the Macedonian language and culture are alive and well thank you.
There are those who beleive that the Macedonian identity was
"invented" by Tito the Yugoslav dictator in order to make claims upon
northern Greece.  Then there are those who claim that the Macedonians
are just Bulgarians that have forgotten who they are.  When they forgot
varies with the claimant.
I think everyone should have enemies as bright as this.

Tito is gone, communism is gone and Yugoslavia as we knew it is also
gone.  Given that there have been enormous geopolitical changes and
given that the Second World War ended decades ago, perhaps the Greeks
should come up with a new and improved explanation as to why the
Macedonians are clamouring about northern Greece and the "non-existant"
Macedonian minority living there.   Furthermore, the Macedonians are not
begging Greece or anyone else for permission to call themselves by their
historic name; Macedonians.     It was Greece, via Mitsotakis via his
minister, that "proposed", the name Slavo-Macedonia for that part of
Macedonia which is liberated and Greek-Macedonian for that part which is
occupied by Greece.  Greece is going to extremes to ensure that their
Greek-Macedonia is perceived as different than the Macedonian region
that has formed a democratic state yet until 1913 they were one and the
same.  The border which seperates free Macedonia from the Macedonia
occupied by Greece, (which miraculously has no Macedonians in it),
runs right through the village I was born in.

The state of Greece, as it stands now, has only existed since 1913.
Your country and the identity that goes along with it are only eighty
years old.  Your propagandists are attempting to link you to the ancient
Hellenic tribes and at the same time are trying to link the ancient
Hellenic tribes with ancient Macedonia of two and three millenia ago.
You Greeks use the Roman term "Greece", not Macedonia, to describe your
state.  Internally you call it Ellada.   Make up your minds.
Are you Greece, Ellada or Macedonia?  Unless you are a state of
schizophrenics, I suggest you pick one name and stick with it.

As Lincoln aptly put it;  ".......You can't fool all of the people all
of the time."

-> "This government [F.D. Roosevelt] considers any talk of a Macedonian
-> `nation', Macedonian `Fatherland' or Macedonian `national
-> consciousness' [in Yugoslavia] to be unjustified demagoguery
-> representing no ethnic or political reality ... a possible cloak for
-> aggressive intentions against Greece".
->
->           - Edward R. Stettinius, U.S. Secretary of State, December
-> 26, 1944

Welcome to 1992.  Watch your step.
Macedonia has already been recognized by Bosnia-Hercegovina, Croatia
Slovenia, (Serbia-Montenegro made announcement), Philippenes, Bulgaria
Turkey and Russia.  The European Community voted 11-1 in favour of
recognizing the independace of Macedonia but were persistently blocked
by Greece.
Unlike your postscript, this has the advantage of being both relevant
and current.

-> Macedonia, Greece> Fuck off!
                              Same to you.....HONEY!

                    Lubi
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