HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dfk0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (David F. Keppel)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Planet of the Apes
Date: 7 Jan 93 23:52:34 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

In article <1993Jan6.153814.4894@memstvx1.memst.edu>, mcsweinberg@memstvx1.memst
.edu (*R A Isexit) writes:
>I don't know if this is the appropriate group but I noticed an error in
>storyline in the Planet of the Apes movies and wanted to know if anyopne else
>noticed it or if I am incorrect.
>
>In Planet of the Apes... we are to believe that the Humans started a Nuclear
>War and after they destroyed each other the Apes evolved. But, In Escape from
>the Planet of the Apes, Zera tells that the apes just revolted while they were
>being treated as pets after the cats and dogs died. What happened to the4
>Nuclear War?
>
>Rai.
>
The war still occurred. Only it didn't occur right away. Seems like
immediately after all hell broke loose with the apes, the world became totally
chaotic (remember the world was in a politically unstable situation without
the apes) so its possible the "ape" situation only made it worse.

The apes themselves may have ushered in the nuclear situation. But it seems
like mankind did themselves in (as is usual in a sci-fi drama). And this was
also the attitude of key social leaders such as Dr.Zaius and the Lawgiver.

I can believe that we would blow ourselves up easier than the ridiculous
idea that Zira and Cornelius can manage to salvage Taylor's ship out
of the water, fire it up, and launch it (and pilot it successfully thru the
time warp to earth). All this with  earth "civil war "technology at hand.
-- 
    ###########################################################################
   ###        David F. Keppel -  The Computing Center -  Ext. 84019        ###
  ###        179  E.W. Fairchild/Martingdale Library Bldg. 8B             ###
 ###########################################################################
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: "Michael J. McHugh" <p00065@psilink.com>
Subject: Ticket grovel for Star Wars in Boston
Reply-To: mchugh@tivoli.com
Organization: Tivoli Systems
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:43:28 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink-DOS (3.3)

I am looking for anyone that has extra tickets to the Star Wars Trilogy 
that is playing this weekend, Jan 9,10 at the Wang Center Theater in 
Boston. 

Please contact me directly via e-mail or via the phone if you have any 
extra tickets.  I am on the road and will not be able to read the 
conference for answers.  You can leave a message at my office while I am 
away. 

Thanks,

Mike McHugh				mchugh@tivoli.com
TIVOLI Systems, Inc.			Voice: 617-621-7140
One Kendall Square, Suite 2200		Fax:   617-621-7141
Cambridge, MA 02139			Pager: 800-SKY-PAGE, PIN - 97339
					Home # 617-643-4803
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: "robert winkler" <robert.winkler@canrem.com>
Subject: spaceroots
Reply-To: "robert winkler" <robert.winkler@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 8 Jan 93 17:44:50 EST

                     * ATTENTION EVERYBODY ! *

                           Part 1 of 3  (56 lines)

The following message's a collection & summary of several
- hopefully good - ideas. It was originally born from discussions
on several conferences (such as CRS 107 & U 255), but as it's
considerably developed by now, I thought it's worth a reposting.

NOTE:
if you've read the following already in part or as a whole, PLEASE
forgive me;  I didn't intend to waste your or the NET's time, money
or hardware.
                           - - - - -

     If you're a sci-fi buff, you often wonder probably why & how
can the almighty Hollywood shove all those shitty shows down on
your throat. Personal differences in opinion notwithstanding, the
recent releases on TV of Space Rangers & DS 9 are clear evidence
for the producers' notion to go for shows that wouldn't create too
much controversy - uncomplicated characters, simple storyline, some
(often VERY cheap) special f/x, a couple of contradictions in
logic, half a dozen parascientific mambo-jambo, all spiced with the
plattitudes of trashcan phylosophy. Creativity, new & daring
thoughts & inventions seem to have died out with Asimov, Serling &
Rodenberry.

What we - & ultimately the genre - is missing, is an ALTERNATIVE
movement, not unlike that of Cyberpunk. This movement - club,
whatever you wish to call it - would provide a medium for amateur
s/f talents, let they be movie-makers, designers, writers, etc.

You think it's impossible?

Think again. There're plenty of TV stations, independent or not,
that have made & are making a hefty profit by showing series such
as `Elvira' or `the all-time worst movies' - both series being
basically collections of amateur, `C-rated' movies.

What this proposal's all about, thus, is to push for the creation
of an amateur s/f series on a public or independent TV station. The
title'd be, in lack of a better alternative, `SPACEROOTS' - an
allusion to the `grassroots' nature of the movies, but it also
carries a sort of mystical or metaphysical meaning which could be
exploited. It'd show, similarly to America's Funniest Home Videos,
s/f movies made by amateurs. The stories wouldn't necessarily take
place in the same Universe (see Twilight Zone), & there'd be no
restrictions on the stories other than the following:
1) they all have to belong to the s/f genre (fantasy & horror
   included)
2) they all have to follow their own inherent logic
3) they all have to follow the rules of their OWN Universe
4) they mustn't contain OBVIOUS or UNACCEPTED contradictions with
   known scientific laws (i.e. you OBVIOUSLY can't swim & breath in
   space; though there's no sound in space, its application IS
   accepted by the public, to enhance the understanding of the
   visual f/x such as flying & explosions)


                < CONTINUED  IN  NEXT  MESSAGE >
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Planet of the Apes..how many
From: arvidl@ancho.gac.edu (Lee Arvidson)
Date: 11 Jan 1993 23:08:54 GMT
Organization: Gustavus Adolphus College
Keywords: Blah...Blah...Blah
NNTP-Posting-Host: puya.gac.edu


So how many movies were made in the Planet of the Apes series?
(and what was the titles)

Thanks

Lee

arvidl@nic.gac.edu


-- NewsGrazer, a NeXTstep(tm) news reader, posting --
M>UQR=&8P7&%N<VE[7&9O;G1T8FQ<9C!<9FUO9&5R;B!#;W5R:65R.WT*7&UA
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M,S@T,%QT>#0X,#!<='@U-S8P7'1X-C<R,%QT>#<V.#!<='@X-C0P7'1X.38P
M,%QF,%QB,%QI,%QU;#!<9G,R-"!<"E-O(&AO=R!M86YY(&UO=FEE<R!W97)E
M(&UA9&4@:6X@=&AE(%!L86YE="!O9B!T:&4@07!E<R!S97)I97,_7`HH86YD
M('=H870@=V%S('1H92!T:71L97,I7`I<"E1H86YK<UP*7`I,965<"EP*87)V
4:61L0&YI8RYG86,N961U7`H*?0HI
`
From: ebu@snakemail.hut.fi (Erik Bunn)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Terminator
Date: 04 Jan 93 14:14:14 GMT
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Distribution: inet
	<1993Jan2.182213.1@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lk-hp-13.hut.fi
In-reply-to: cvetp036@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu's message of 3 Jan 93 02:22:13 GMT

cvetp036@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu writes:

>>>Does anyone know where the idea for the "Terminator" movies originated?
...
>>>Leonard Maltin's guide claims that the original was based on a Harlan
>>>Ellison short story.  Does anyone know of such a short story?  If so, what
>>>was the title and in what anthology might I be most likely to locate it?

>I think the name of Harlan Ellison's short story is SOLDIER. 

>It's about a soldier who someone gets zapped and sent back into time.


Another one with some similarities to Terminator: Clifford Simak's
'The [Second/Third/Fourth?] Variant'. It deals with automated
factors building mechanic killing devices and ultimately androids
that start killing the humans of. This one had a nice atmosphere..

Terminator sounds like a combination of Soldier and this story, to me.

Erik


--
Erik Bunn         //                       // full-time unrealist
Erik.Bunn@hut.fi // ebu@niksula.cs.hut.fi // ebu@vipunen.hut.fi
(358-0)455-1041 // (358-71)227-493       // (1-206)638-1002
From: BBLUM@griffin.uga.EDU (Bill Blum)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: 2001 .... A Space Odyssey (continued)
Date: 4 Jan 93 20:17:08 GMT

Continuing on the similar vain as previous posters ...
> What is is the meaning of the "colorful" trip in the movie?
The definitive books to look at are:
    2001: A Space Odyssey   -- by A.C. Clarke and S. Kubrick
    The Lost Worlds of 2001 -- by A.C. Clarke
    The Making of 2001      -- ??
Supposedly, the monolith was a Star-gate (maybe, in essence a white-hole)
which allowed a "user" of it to take a shortcut from one place in the
galaxy to another.  I suppose you could say the trip was Kubrick's vision
of the "mind-blasting" or sensory overload that a human would perceive
while he/she was in an unknown place/time/continuum.  There were periods
during the "trip" that calmness occurred (the human - Bowman, could grasp
something of what currently was happening to him because he had something
he could relate it to) and other times that were inconceivable (to the
human viewpoint - often accompanied by quick shots of Bowman's face
seriously contorted).  Any cursory examination of the original book
(predominantly by Clarke) and the movie shows that they differ most
at the end of the book.  Clarke had to finish the book, and Kubrick the
movie -- since those were their main focuses; both were working on
deadlines.  The book, however was submitted first, and was to be the
original ending.  But Kubrick did not like the ending after editing, and
reshot/used-alternative-endings of what happened to Bowman.  Some
of the possible "trips" or items Bowman was to perceive while in the
stargate, were explored by Kubrick/Clarke and Clarke wrote them down
and put them in "The Lost Worlds of 2001".  "The Making of 2001" contains
the definitive descriptions of the days before both works (movie and book)
were finalized, AND contains much philosophical/religious/anarchistic
discussion on what the movie (and principally the ending of the movie)
means.  Nobody in those discussions knew the answer to what it meant either.
There is one great synopsis, by a young woman who wrote Kubrick a letter,
postulating what the movie (as a whole) was supposed to mean - Kubrick
later stated that this letter is the closest description of what HE wanted
the movie to visualize.  Both the letter and K's comments are in "Making".

My great question is not what the "stargate-trip" was representing, but
what was happening during the period of time Bowman finds himself at
later and later stages of life after "landing" in the "house", till the
time of becoming StarChild.  (I didn't think much of "Making"'s descriptions
on this topic - I'd still like Clarke and Kubrick to explore that one!)
From: mcsweinberg@memstvx1.memst.edu (*R*A*I*)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Next Star Wars Movie?
Date: 12 Jan 93 13:06:42 -0600
Followup-To: poster
Distribution: world
Organization: Memphis State University

In article <93012.35925.L697187@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM>, L697187@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM writes:
> Does anyone really know when or if there are supposed to be any more
> Star Wars movies?  I have been hearing about the 'prequels' for years.
> Where are they?  I don't want to watch Star Trek for the rest of my
> life.

I heard a couple of months ago that it they would start production after the 
Young Indiana Chronicles was through.

Rai.

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"There's things that you guess, And things              R A I
that you know. There's boys you can trust,           Raina Weinberg
and girls that you don't, there's little       Memphis State University
things you hide, And little things that            Memphis,Tenn. USA
you show, Sometimes you think you're gonna 
get it, But you don't and that's just the
way it goes."  _George Michael_              MCSWEINBERG@MSUVX1.MEMST.EDU
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Ticket grovel for Star Wars in Boston
Date: 7 Jan 93 20:06:37 GMT
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
Organization: Stratus Computer Inc, Marlboro MA
NNTP-Posting-Host: gondolin.pubs.stratus.com

In article <2935510796.1.p00065@psilink.com> p00065@psilink.com  
(Michael J. McHugh) writes:
> I am looking for anyone that has extra tickets to the Star Wars  
Trilogy 
> that is playing this weekend, Jan 9,10 at the Wang Center Theater  
in 
> Boston. 
> 

Why?  Is it sold out in advance?  I thought they were just
selling tickets at the door.  Does anyone know differently?


--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
From: bole@hmivax.humgen.upenn.edu (Greg Bole)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Jurassic Park - DNA in blood?
Date: 6 Jan 93 16:58:02 GMT
Organization: HHMI/Human Genetics, Univ of Pa.

In article <1432@blue.cis.pitt.edu>, pjhst10+@pitt.edu (Peter   J Hill) writes:

> A previous poster said that he felt that the dinos would have no chance 
> in todays society, I think that they would pose a formidable threat since 
> the only way to be sure that you get all of them is to destroy the entire 
> rainforest in that area.  They are quite intelligent.  

Let's not get confused.  I was quoting a known and respected scientist 
who was talking about the realistic feasability of dinosaurs exisiting
in the world today.  If you talk about "Crichton's" raptors...

> You can question the science, but I felt that the book and the idea was 
> fascinating, even if it is not possible.  There are many SF novels out 
> there that are based on things that are thought not to be possible.

YES!  This is the whole point.  I agree 100%.  I just wish more people 
would realize that it is *fiction*.  Too many people read this and think
that the Molecular Genetics presented are possible, or that it expresses
the leading majority of views concerning dinosaurs.  (It does and it doesn't)

Anyway, it's a great idea and an interesting piece of fact based *fiction*.
Enjoy it as such.  I also feel it will make a really fun movie.

Greg Bole                            "We ride...to hell.  Or to glory.  
bole@hmivax.humgen.upenn.edu         It depends on your point of view."
                                Errol Flynn in _They Died With Their Boots On_
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: bole@hmivax.humgen.upenn.edu (Greg Bole)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Terminator 3: Any word?
Date: 6 Jan 93 23:02:54 GMT
Organization: HHMI/Human Genetics, Univ of Pa.

In article <93006.38672.L660315@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM>, 
L660315@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM writes:

> About eight months ago someone posted a copy of a news article dated April
> '93 headlined "Cameron, Carolco, Swartzenegger say, 'He'll be back one more
> time,'" or something like that.  In short, the article was about a press
> conference called by the trio to announce Terminator-3.  Does anyone know if
> this is on the level, and if it is has anyone heard anything else?  

It was a joke cooked up by a juvenile Yahoo at The University of Virgina.

> But now I'm starting to wonder if that posting was bogus.  I hope not.

Sorry, it was.

Cameron's mantra all through making T2 was "T3 without me".

Of course if they offer the other players enough money it might happen
someday.  I (as many have expressed) would *love* to see a T0...as in
a movie about the war in the future with sky-net.  (T0 because it would 
hopefully be before sky-net was prevented from coming into existance)

Greg Bole                            "We ride...to hell.  Or to glory.  
bole@hmivax.humgen.upenn.edu         It depends on your point of view."
                                Errol Flynn in _They Died With Their Boots On_
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Planet of the Apes
From: kgassner@vax1.umkc.edu
Date: 7 Jan 93 01:08:28 CST
Organization: University of Missouri - Kansas City
NNTP-Posting-Host: vax1.umkc.edu

> In Planet of the Apes... we are to believe that the Humans started a Nuclear
> War and after they destroyed each other the Apes evolved. But, In Escape from
> the Planet of the Apes, Zera tells that the apes just revolted while they were
> being treated as pets after the cats and dogs died. What happened to the4
> Nuclear War?

Probally just a little change in the universe on the part of some author in 
order to find room for another sequel :-)
But as far as I remember, the "Planet of the Apes" storyline isn't consistent
anyway.

Bye
	Klaus
From: ror1@ellis.uchicago.edu (Richard O. Rouse III)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: THE QUIET EARTH
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:13:33 GMT
Reply-To: ror1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago



Has any one out there seen the New Zeland film "The Quiet Earth" circa 1985?

It is aboslutely not only one of my favorite sf films, but also one of my 
favorite films all around.  But the ending is a little vague, so I was
wondering other people's thoughts on it.

In the end, is Zac supposed to be in heaven?  If not, why is Saturn appearing
immediately in the background?
At the end, why does Zac look at the tape recorder he has somehow brought with
him to wherever he is, and then toss it to the ground (at least this is what
I seem to remember seeing)?
Does Zac save the earth in the end?  
If so, are all the humans brought back to life, or does "all reality" simply
maintain itself as it was after humanity was mostly killed off?

I'm also curious to anyone else's thoughts on this *GREAT* movie.

-Richard
ror1@ellis.uchicago.edu
  
-- 
===========================================================================
Richard O. Rouse III				 Reviewer:  MacGames Digest
ror1@ellis.uchicago.edu		    Publisher/Creator: ATOMIC SEWAGE COMICS
       "Next thing you know they'll take my thoughts away" - Megadeth
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: tom@europa.lonestar.org (Tom Kimball)
Subject: Re: Planet of the Apes
Organization: Moria Mining Guild (BBS) -- Dallas, Texas, USA
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 19:05:16 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.162917.18021@linus.mitre.org> jswartz@mbunix.mitre.org (Swartz) writes:
>"Forbidden Zone").  It is not made clear when the remaining humans became
>reduced to a more primitive (and speechless) race, however at the end of
>"Battle for the Planet of the Apes", they were still intelligent, although
>living the more primitive lifestyle of the apes.

Then you missed one of the important points of the movies.  There were 2
timelines, not 1.  In the 2nd, altered timeline, the humans and apes live
together peacefully forevermore, presumeably avoiding the destruction of the 
Earth that occured in BENEATH.  The proof is the final scene of BATTLE.

You have to watch all 5 movies in order (maybe several times) to get the
"big picture".  Three key characters play a major role in the outcomes of the
two timelines.  Aldo, Caesar, and the Lawgiver.

Original Timeline (dates are approx)
PLANET and BENEATH occur in this timeline.

1992 AD - Aldo the gorilla leads the first successful Ape slave rebellion.  A
nuclear war weakens the humans shortly afterwards, allowing the rebellion to 
succeed.  Aldo is militant anti-human and his new ape society persecutes and 
kills humans.
[source - ESCAPE]

2600 AD - The Lawgiver writes the Sacred Scrolls.  The Sacred Scrolls formalized
and legitimized anti-human attitudes of the apes.  "Beware of the beast Man..."
[source - PLANET]

3952 AD - The war between the Apes and Mutants destroy the Earth.
[source - BENEATH]


Altered 2nd Timeline
ESCAPE, CONQUEST, and BATTLE occur in this timeline.

1992 AD - Caesar, the son of future intelligent chimpanzees, leads the first 
successful Ape slave rebellion.  Again, the nuclear war allows the rebellion
to succeed.  Neither Caeser nor Aldo know that Aldo was "supposed" to lead the 
rebellion.  Caesar, having been raised by humans, is more moderate than Aldo.  
After a war Caesar grants humans full equality with Apes.
[source - CONQUEST,BATTLE]

2600 AD - The Lawgiver, instead of being anti-human, preaches the importance 
of equality and harmony between the species.
[source - BATTLE (last scene)]

3952 AD - The Earth probably does not get destroyed, because the Apes no longer
have anti-human attitudes.


The grand irony is that the humans in ESCAPE and CONQUEST tried so hard to 
kill Caesar, not realizing that the Ape revolution would occur anyway, and that
the outcome would be far worse for humans without Caesar.

-- 
Tom Kimball  			tom@europa.lerctr.org    
tom@europa.lonestar.org		tom%europa@egsner.cirr.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: tom@europa.lonestar.org (Tom Kimball)
Subject: Re: Planet of the Apes
Organization: Moria Mining Guild (BBS) -- Dallas, Texas, USA
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 19:23:36 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.235234.19410@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> dfk0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (David F. Keppel) writes:
>I can believe that we would blow ourselves up easier than the ridiculous
>idea that Zira and Cornelius can manage to salvage Taylor's ship out
>of the water, fire it up, and launch it (and pilot it successfully thru the
>time warp to earth). All this with  earth "civil war "technology at hand.

Agreed that this is one of the weakest parts of the Apes movies, but its not
as weak as you think.  Dr. Milo was the brains of the outfit, he was the one
who figured out how to repair Taylor's ship and launch it.  Remember that
scientific progress was often suppressed for political reasons in Ape society.
Dr. Milo probably knew a lot more about physics than most other Apes did.
Once the ship was in orbit, the automatic homing device somehow got them
back to the ships original time (1974).

-- 
Tom Kimball  			tom@europa.lerctr.org    
tom@europa.lonestar.org		tom%europa@egsner.cirr.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: tom@europa.lonestar.org (Tom Kimball)
Subject: Re: Planet of the Apes
Organization: Moria Mining Guild (BBS) -- Dallas, Texas, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 19:12:35 GMT

In article <1993Jan07.190807.23399@mixcom.com> Ray.Chramega <Ray.Chramega@mixcom.mixcom.com> writes:
>In <1993Jan6.153814.4894@memstvx1.memst.edu> mcsweinberg@memstvx1.memst.edu (*R A Isexit) writes:
>
>>I don't know if this is the appropriate group but I noticed an error in
>>storyline in the Planet of the Apes movies and wanted to know if anyopne else
>>noticed it or if I am incorrect. 
>
> It's pretty much common knowledge that the PLANET OF THE APES series is
>filled with this sort of thing. In the first episode of the TV series the
>astronauts crash and their ship is spotted by a yong chimp who is out
>walking his dog. This doesn't jive with ESCAPE either. The cartoon series
>features the character Brent who in BENEATH comes to find Taylor. Only in
>this series Brent doesn't even know who Taylor is and is simply living out
>of his crashed spaceship in a chunk of the Forbidden Zone. Brent even says
>that he's never wandered very far from his ship in the 20 years he's been
>stranded and is surprised to hear the simians rule the world. This seems to
>prove the theory of one author in the old PLANET OF THE APES magazine that
>the apes series' seem to take place in paralel worlds to our own.


Each Apes series (the movies, the TV show, and the Animated series) takes
place in a separate universe, because they are all inconsistant with each
other.  The movies, however, are all entirely consistant with each other,
given that the movie universe contains two separate timelines of events.

-- 
Tom Kimball  			tom@europa.lerctr.org    
tom@europa.lonestar.org		tom%europa@egsner.cirr.com