From: dsholtsi@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger)
Subject: Re: Christian Pro-Choicers (was Re: An Abortion Argument that has nothing to do with OT and NT)
Followup-To: talk.abortion
Reply-To: dsholtsi@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger)
Organization: North Carolina State University
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 19:58:57 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.045542.6022@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> 
wendymas@gnu.ai.mit.edu (hell here) writes:

> once again, i feel i must correct something which is seriously amiss.
> the claim was made that Roe v Wade allowed abortions up until the 9th month.

This claim is correct; Roe v. Wade is unrestricted abortion-on-demand
all the way up to the point of birth.  Under Roe, the states are
prevented from restricting third-trimester abortions performed for 
broadly defined ``health'' reasons, including emotional and psychological
health. 

> please, people, get a clue !!! or, at least, consult a lawbook before you
> go around quoting the law very incorrectly. 

Perhaps you should take your own advice; your summary of
the Roe v. Wade decision is grossly inaccurate. 

> Ever heard of the trimester?
> That's the primary set-up that Roe V Wade established that had never 
> previously before been set by law regarding abortions. It goes like this:
>
> 1 - first three months: mother gets to decide. neither state nor doctor have
> a 'fetal' interest. 
> 
> 2 - second three months: state and doctor 'fetal' interest increases, mother
> must have a more valid reason - usually medically motivated - to have an
> abortion.

Wrong, the woman can get an abortion for any reason during the
second trimester.  This quote is from the talk.abortion FAQ on Roe:

         "(b) For the stage subsequent to approximately the end of
     the first trimester, the State, in promoting its interest in the
     health of the mother, may, if it chooses, regulate the abortion
     procedure in ways that are reasonably related to maternal health."

> 3 - state 'fetal' interest is greater than the mothers: maybe under health
> risks could she get an abortion. 

The woman can get an abortion for virtually any reason during the
third trimester:

  "The final stage of pregnancy under Roe v. Wade occurs after the
   fetus becomes viable[4]. After viability, the state could regulate
   or prohibit abortions unless they were ``necessary, in appropriate
   medical judgement'', to preserve the life or health of the woman.
   This standard must be read, however, in light of the Court's
   decision the same day in Doe v. Bolton, that clinical judgement
   ``may be exercised in light of all factors -- physical, emotional,
   psychological, familial, and the woman's age -- relevant to the
   well-being of the patient[5]. Thus, the Court nominally allowed
   the state to prohibit post-viability abortions except in apparently
   limited cases, but it actually defined the limitation in a way
   that bars the state from prohibiting such abortions if physicians
   are willing to perform them."

   [4] 410 U.S. at 163-164
   [5] 410 U.S. 179 (1973)

   Mark Tushnet, "The Supreme Court on Abortion: A Survey",
   Abortion, Medicine, and the Law, Third Edition, 1986, 
   pp. 162

I have several more sources which show that Roe v. Wade is
essentially unrestricted abortion-on-demand throughout
pregnancy.


Doug Holtsinger

Newsgroups: talk.abortion