HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: research on the gay male voice
Date: 22 Aug 92 17:25:05 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison


In article <15840@star.cs.vu.nl> fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!)
writes:

>anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:

>>Speaking of, these machines [NeXT] seem to have curried quite a lot
>>of favor with fashion-following fags.  It's a very gay
>>computer, I think.

>there are a couple of things you can do with it you can't
>do with another computer, people's first impressions of it
>always fall into extremes, and it costs megabucks to buy it
>peripherals that'll keep it happy.

>Come to think of it, in a lot of ways, it's like having me
>on your desk.

Now let me see if I can figure this out, for sure.  Having
you on my desk (please don't feel bad, you would not be the
first), would mean there are a couple things I could do with
you that I couldn't do with any other good-looking Dutch
young man (I'm prepared, based on, um, reports, to believe
that), my first impression of you might tend to extremes
(*this* I gotta see!), and it costs megabucks to buy you
accessories to keep you happy (flinging florins flagrantly
far and wide, my workspace would soon be strewn with
FJ-addons (did I spell that correctly?), and the lot of them
would soon ditch me for someone with a better offer).

Well, all things taken together (no offense intended):

NeXT!!
:-)

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
From: coren@osf.org (Robert Coren)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: One's own voice (was: redefining masculinity)
Date: 17 Aug 92 21:43:50 GMT
Organization: Open Software Foundation

In article <1992Aug17.072014.5557@wam.umd.edu>, jns@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:
> when I hear my own
> whiney, nasal voice on tape it *grates* on my nerves.

I don't think I've ever known anyone who wasn't appalled by the sound
of their own voice on tape. The way we hear our own voices is entirely
different from the way others hear them, inasmuch as the sound is
carried to the ear largely through the jaw, and resonates in the skull
in ways that external voices rarely get an opportunity to. (Hmmm, it
can be nice when they do, though... that is *not* what I was going to
talk about.)

I don't know that I find my taped voice "whiny" or "nasal", but
certainly sounds (to me) sillier than what I normally "hear". And I
don't think I have, particularly, "TheVoice", although I might be
wrong. (It's not just a matter of pitch, but also of intonation and
manner of speech; I'm not going to try to describe it.)

(Then again, somebody who has heard my speaking voice many times
somehow came to the conclusion that I was a tenor; I can't understand
that at all.)

I've taken to taping my singing lessons, and listening to the tapes
before I practice. This serves two purposes: it reminds me what
exercises my teacher has recommended, and it enables me to hear the
differences she tells me about when I change the way I produce the
tone. Having done this over a period of years, I've gotten to be able
to stand the sound of my singing voice, and can actually detect
improvement. :-)

But my speech still sounds silly to me on tape. Go figure.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com (Jake Coughlin)
Subject: Re: Gay Homophobia (was Re: Too straight looking to be gay???) 
Originator: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 92 16:01:46 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson):
> [Sarver] must be one o' those Reagan Republicans: running
> full-speed into the past, too dumb to know you're stuck in
> reverse.

of course sarver's republican, who else could believe in
the divinity of being white, male, and butch...
-- 
Jason Coughlin ( jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com )
Queer Without A Cause!
"I find myself suddenly in the world, and I recognize that I have one
right alone: that of demanding human behavior of the other." -- Fanon
From: fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Whizzzzzzz ( was Re: Introduction)
Date: 16 Aug 92 12:32:22 GMT

(A written introduction to me? No way, I always let somebody else
introduce me to people I don't know.)

adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
>As long as we're on this Cole Porter kick, I'll close with 
>his French lyrics to "Find Me a Primitive Man" 

This line is so...

>   Pour regeler mon chauffage centrale.

cheezy. I mean, gawd, 'for my central heating' ! It's almost painful.


								FJ!!
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: research on the gay male voice
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 92 10:15:06 GMT


In article <22603@sybase.sybase.com> black@lester.sybase.com
(Christina Black) writes:

>If linguists identify, define, and quantify the "gay male voice", does
>that mean we can program speech synthesizers to use different voices?
>I want a gay male toaster, a bulldyke pickup truck, a lesbian thearapist
>workstation.

Suddenly I feel left behind by the juggernaut of progress
because my toaster doesn't talk.

"Yoo hoo, girlfriend!  I've finished Miss Muffin to the
*absolute apex* of perfection, just for you, you big butch
thing, you."

On the other hand, NeXTer that I am, my workstation *does*
talk.  It says just about anything that pops into its smooth
black body to say, sing or play.  <system beep>, which I
created myself, is its most usual remark.

Speaking of, these machines seem to have curried quite a lot
of favor with fashion-following fags.  It's a very gay
computer, I think.

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: tdbear@tandon.com (Tom Barrett)
Subject: Re: Sarcasm
Organization: Tandon Corporation, Moorpark, CA
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 22:07:23 GMT

In article <14509@borg.cs.unc.edu> harris@bodie.cs.unc.edu (Trey Harris) writes:

>This is always the way, isn't it?  Every lesbigay I know is at one
>extreme or the other on sarcasm.  I, like many of my friends, view
>sarcasm as a high art form.  Yet, some (less I believe than the other
>group) never get sarcasm, period.
>
>Has anyone else out there noticed this?  

No I haven't, and I would thank you to keep your bigotted
remarks to yourself.  We are all not grouped together at any
extreme of the "scale" like a bunch of scared children or
rats.  We come in all shapes, forms, and colors, so why
wouldn't we have varied levels of sarcasm...

-- 
Tom Barrett (TDBear)    tdbear@tandon.com                 voice 805-378-6207
Tandon Corporation      tdbear@p6.f1006.n102.z1.fidonet.org fax 805-529-8895
Sr. HW Design Engineer  "War is Peace, No is Yes, And We're All Free!" 
[The views expressed herein may not be shared by the organization of origin]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: ry@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (ryerson.schwark)
Subject: Re: Snaps (no, not *that* kind, Elizabeth) (was Re: New queer terminology) (was Re: The media, again)
Organization: UNIX System Laboratories, Summit, NJ
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 01:11:59 GMT

In article <l8vsg4INNt8n@mizar.usc.edu> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
>
>So where do the snaps come from?  

Who cares?

Ry Schwark
ry@usl.com
From: dblakele@acpub.duke.edu (Dean Blakeley MD)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: in the deanery
Date: 15 Aug 92 10:00:50 GMT
Organization: Duke University; Durham, N.C.

In article <1992Aug14.181520.11992@cis.ohio-state.edu> amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:
>recent e-mail suggests that confusion has been sown by the appearance
>of several postings in which my name is linked to someone named dean.
>there are TWO, count them TWO, distinct dean-tokens here:

Sorry about that Arnold!

>dean-sub-2, my new e-friend dean, whose posting i am following up
>  on here.  you haven't heard anything about him here from me.
>  he is the m.dean (again, the dot is silent: em-dean) and, as
>  you can see from his posting, the bisexual one.  dean blakeley, 
>  dblakele@acpub.duke.edu.

Er, ah, ahem.  Sorry about that confusion folks.  I guess I have
inadvertantly de-muffined myself.

>arnold (the swiss, not the chinese, arnold)

And such a dear he is.


-- 
| Dean D Blakeley, MD            |  This ain't no party.  This ain't no disco |
| Ambulatory Care Service (11C)  |  This ain't no fooling around.             |
| Durham VA Medical Center       |  - David Byrne                             |
| Durham NC 27705                |  NeXTMail accepted                         |
From: tittle@ics.uci.edu (Cindy Tittle Moore)
Subject: Re: net queen??
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Reply-To: tittle@ics.uci.edu (Cindy Tittle Moore)
Organization: ICS Dept., UC Irvine
Keywords: brutal passion
Date: 20 Aug 92 01:37:38 GMT

In <1992Aug19.232300.855@beaver.cs.washington.edu> wendyt@cs.washington.edu (Wendy Thrash) writes:

>In article <1992Aug18.022135.13801@cis.ohio-state.edu> amz@cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:

>>melinda shore is currently reigning as Motss Harpy.

>Most attractive Harpy I've ever met.  Hideous in her own way, I suppose,
>but all in all not _that_ monstrous.

Ah, but the sting of her posts!  Most sharp, and they draw blood: not
the sloppy drippy kind from any old whacking, but the thin sharp
paper-cut kind.  Qualifies as Motss Harpy, in my book!

>>the position of Motss Great Dyke has gone unfilled for years because
>>of an almost even balance between the chorus for amelia smith and
>>the one for wendy thrash.

>Amelia!  Amelia!  I'm happy to settle for Motss Vice Dyke.  (Boy, write
>one little pome for Arnold and he promotes me!)

I thought Amelia was the Motss Father Dyke?

Either way, though we don't get nearly enough of either the Motss
Great Dyke OR the Motss Vice Dyke!! (I am, like Mara, turning my head
carefully away from the double entendres.)  More, more!!

--Cindy
--

*  I would rather that a bigot thought I was a lesbian than that a
*  lesbian thought I was a bigot.        -- Tovah Hollander
From: stevenso@Apple.COM (David Stevenson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Mud-wrestling (was sex with gay and bi men (part 3))
Date: 12 Aug 92 15:38:39 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) opines (probably wide-eyed):
>What *is* a dancebelt? I'm guessing a jockstrap, but then I'd think
>it's be really painful to try to remove a jock by pulling *up*
>(rather than down) on it...
>
I wouldn't know, since I've never lost a mud-wrestling match.
I try to avoid being a sore loser.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: lisbon@vpnet.chi.il.us (Gerry Swetsky)
Subject: Re: Rob Bernardo
Organization: Vpnet Public Access
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 04:22:01 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.232434.4838@rmtc.Central.Sun.COM> bartlett@rmtc.Central.Sun.COM (Terry Bartlett) writes:
>I'm sorry to report that Rob passed away about an hour ago.  I think
>many of us knew that he'd been ill for a few weeks.

    I didn't.  Please accept sympathy from all of us here at vpnet
    who read and enjoyed his posts over the years.  I feel terrible.

--
============================================================================
|                                                            Gerry Swetsky |
|                                                                          |
|                                                   lisbon@vpnet.chi.il.us |
============================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jns@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer)
Subject: Re: sweaty sex
Organization: Militant Homosexual Lobby, Gay Lifestyle, Inc.
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 03:46:28 GMT

sweaty arne (adolphso@mizar.usc.edu) wrote:
 
> jns@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:
> > dear, pristine arne adolphson (adolphso@mizar.usc.edu) wrote:
> 
> *Pristine*?  

Okay, lathered and euphonious.

> And I did find it *steamy*.  (But how can people breathe
> in steam rooms and saunas?  I've always felt that I was
> suffocating.)

You need something to divert your attention.
In saunas, always use the buddy system.

> Put me outside on a warm day and before you know it
> I'm as lathered as a pack mule.

oo la la!  I *knew* you had hidden charms.

> >                 Which is fortunate, or vice versa,
> > since I agree with arnold on...matters of taste.
> > Which is also fortunate because it thereby saves
> > my having to retype his article.
> 
> Heavens, are you talking about *that* article?  The one
> that kept me awake last night for *hours*?

Are you sure it wasn't *just* the *heat*?

--jns
From: fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Babs Bush
Date: 22 Aug 92 13:34:59 GMT

dh0a@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (DONALD L. HARDY) writes:
>I don't know if it was a good or pathetic:  Barbara Bush was wearing the red
>ribbon at the convention last night.  Why don't we bump the bozo and elect
>the Babs?  Makes nore sense.

Certainly does. She couldn't be dummer than the VP, and she probably knows more
about good housekeeping than her husband, she's got frump written all over her.

Besides, I just heard that she's got higher aproval ratings than her hubby.

							FJ!!
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jns@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer)
Subject: Re: Too straight looking to be gay??? (was re: UNGAY GAY)
Organization: Militant Homosexual Lobby, Gay Lifestyle, Inc.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 10:21:29 GMT

Jess Anderson (anderson@macc.wisc.edu) wrote:
 
> So I think straight boyz (and straight-identified gay boyz)
> are mostly bottoms.  It's us queens on top.  Ride 'em, slam
> 'em to the stars!  Oh Baby!

Ahem.  That's "Deeper, Master!  Take it, Bitch!"

[I am *so* grateful to Jack Hamilton for that.]

I really don't see the contradiction here anyway.
No doubt the mind that can manage being both gay
and ungay would have no trouble thinking top while
being on bottom.

--jns
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: oneil@cwis.unomaha.edu (Sharon O'Neil)
Subject: Re: RNC: Buchanan's speech
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 05:58:25 GMT

jcav@quads.uchicago.edu (JohnC) writes:

>In article <eyewash@vadier.gr.osf.org> emcmanus@gr.osf.org (Eamonn McManus) writes:
>>jcav@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>>>Buchanan smiled his horrifying Irish Catholic smile.  The audience roared
>>>with laughter.  I felt like I was going to throw up.

You're not the only one who nearly tossed cookies Monday.

>>Normally it doesn't bother me if people say Irish when they mean
>>Irish-American.  But here I really must protest.  While in Ireland we
>>have our fair share of fascist arch-Catholics, none of them comes
>>anywhere near Buchanan either in polished hypocrisy or in dangerous
>>power.  There's nobody Irish that is as horrifying as Buchanan.

Ronald Reagan?  

>I pondered for a good while before I decided not to remove "Irish Catholic"
>from my article.  I did _not_ intend to imply that Buchanan's extraordinary
>internal and external darkness are inherent in Irish, Irish-Americans or
>Catholics in general.  I should have been more restrained in my choice of
>language, but Buchanan makes me SO ANGRY!  I guess what disturbs me most is
>how he spouts his joyful hatred in such jokey terms -- phrases like "Israel's
>Amen-corner in the Congress", etc.  And that _smile_ of his...  <shiver>
>I apologize to Eamonn and to any others who were offended by my words.

I'm Irish-American (with a name like O'Neil, fancy that!)  I'm also Catholic
(at least I went to Catholic school for 12 years, anyway.)  But I wasn't
really offended.  There's plenty of bigotry against gay people in the
Catholic Church.  And there's plenty of bigotry among Western European-
Americans, Irish-Americans included.  You'd think Irish-Americans would
know better: Irish Americans were vilified and the lowest of the low in
the late 1800s.  

Sigh.  Don't worry.  Pat Buchanan and Pat Robertson are enough to make
quite a few of us who aren't gay pretty damn mad at the Republican Party.
But then, The Two Evil Pats are fascists.  I know what happened during
WWII, when ultra-right dictators like Adolf Hitler put Jews and gypsies
and gay men and women into death camps.  I won't even /consider/ voting
for a party that embraces such utter *hatred*.


Sharon
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: GOOD editorial on queers & Judaism
Date: 14 Aug 1992 10:55:23 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Aug10.021540.15246@wixer.cactus.org> 
lazarus@wixer.cactus.org (Michael Lax) writes:

[I've deleted Michael Lerner's editorial]

> TIKKUN MAGAZINE HAS BEEN UNDER SEVERE ATTACK FOR ITS SUPPORT OF GAY AND   *
> LESBIAN RIGHTS, AND THIS EDITORIAL HAS PROVOKED SOME OF ITS SUBSCRIBERS   *
> TO CANCEL THEIR SUBSCRIPTIONS.                                            *

I'm *very* glad to see Tikkun support gl rights.  If you remember, 
Tikkun saw itself from its inception as a left/progressive response
to Commentary's crypto-fascist, right wing, hate-filled demagoguery.
(How many of *you* remember Midge Dector's breathtakingly homophobic 
"The Boys on the Beach", not to mention articles by others such as 
"Are Homosexuals Gay", assorted revisionist pieces on AIDS, and Norman 
Podhoretz's attacks on Gore Vidal?)  Anyway, I bought the first two
issues of Tikkun and noticed that gls were mentioned once, and then
only in a list.  There were pro-choice pieces, feminist editorials, 
support expressed for undocumented aliens, etc. etc. etc., but nothing
about gls, nothing about HIV/AIDS.  So I wrote Michael Lerner a letter
and asked him about it.  If his motivation in launching Tikkun was
indeed to counter Commentary, I wrote, then I simply did not understand
his silence wrt gls.  I reminded him of Norman Podhoretz's and Irving 
Kristol's hatemongering.  I pointed out a dozen or so homophobic articles 
in recent issues of Commentary (this was 1986-87).  Lerner never
replied to me directly, but in the next issue there was a tiny little
editorial, five, maybe six sentences long, in which Lerner expressed
lukewarm support for gay men and lesbians.  That's when I decided
that I *wouldn't* subscribe, and I returned a solicitation I'd just
received from them with a short note explaining why I wouldn't
subscribe.  Tikkun has come a long way since then.  

Arne
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: sexual attraction
Date: 14 Aug 92 18:45:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Aug14.184543.8787
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

(I was going to change the Subject: header, but then I realized just how
general "sexual attraction" is.)

In article <1992Aug14.020214.17310@cis.ohio-state.edu> amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:
>  [1 the prime directive:] people i love nonsexually are attractive to
>me sexually;

Isn't this inconvenient?

I noticed this myself recently. I figured it out when I fell for about
the fourth straight male friend of mine. I also realized that I wish I
weren't so homosexual so that I would enjoy being sexual with a female
friend of mine.

So what does this mean? Does it mean that I make friends with people
who are sexually attractive, or is it that I tend to be sexually
attracted to friends of mine? I don't know. What does one do when the
inevitable problems occur?

I'm also glad that I tend to love (nonsexually) people who I am
sexually attracted to. I know people who like to have sex with one
sort of person, but they are not capable of being friends with these
people. I am happy that I am not this way.
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                   There is absolutely no other possibility
From: robertl@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Robert Lodenkamper)
Subject: Re: Utopia
Organization: Stanford University
	<1992Aug14.043153.27273@macc.wisc.edu>
	<1992Aug14.170005.7011@riacs.edu>
	<ROBERTL.92Aug15152928@luciano.Stanford.EDU>
	<1992Aug16.131609.26048@macc.wisc.edu>
Date: 16 Aug 92 19:48:23

In article <1992Aug16.131609.26048@macc.wisc.edu> anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:

   [...]

   *Are* they [aggressiveness, altruism, hatred and love] "human
   attributes," really?  I'd call 'em social or cultural attributes.
   By calling them human attributes, it seems to me we suggest they're
   ineluctable, whereas I don't think they are.  That would be the
   fiction "human nature" by another name.

I should have said human behavior instead of human nature, since I
don't know where on the nature/nurture spectrum these traits fall, and
don't even think that they lie on the same point of that continuum.

I suspect we disagree on the nature/nurture question, but for me that
question is a question of faith and hence inappropriate for usenet
debate.  :-)

   Rather, they're just things that exist.  [...]  ... I don't think
   we gain anything (and I think we do lose something) if we create
   something called human nature (by any name) to contain the
   qualities we're discussing.

I agree, since "human nature" inappropriately suggests that human
behavior is (predominantly) innate.

   [...]

   My point is that in trying to come to grips with ourselves
   and the world as it is, we too often avail ourselves of many
   convenient but essentially misleading or confusing ideas
   like love and hate.  The more I think about these things,
   the more persuaded I am that rather than associate so many
   lofty, idealized, abstracted, etc. categories with the
   varieties of our experience, we can do more for ourselves by
   cultivating a rather keen sense of paradox, of irony, in the
   way things are, accept that at face value (hard to do, I
   know), and go from there.

I agree that trying to pigeonhole one's life and experiences into neat
conceptual categories is futile.  One of the few things worse than
doing that to yourself is somebody else doing it to you, and we've all
been on the receiving end of that load of tripe --- the latest example
here is that dreadful "Gay is a lifestyle" abomination.

However, conceptual terms like "love" and "hate" (and many, many
others) are necessary for (verbal) communication, so I would prefer to
label them "confusing" rather than "essentially misleading".

- Bob
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: Introduction
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 18:52:39 GMT


In article <l928ovINNe3n@mizar.usc.edu>
adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

>There are many different kinds of bitchy, as you well know, Jess.
>In any case, when overgrown boyscouts come crashing onto the scene 
>with suggestions we play party games, I can't help it if I snap
>back.  

"No thank you" being out of fashion, one assumes.

>And I haven't noticed *your* introduction, Jess, dear.

Not needed, sent in private rather a long time back.

>>Despite the resemblance, you're not Joan
>>Crawford.

>There isn't even much resemblance: I don't have freckles and 
>buck teeth.

Porcelana and braces?

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888