From: alvalent@husc9.harvard.edu (Alvin Valentine)
Newsgroups: alt.magic
Subject: Re: On discussing how tricks are done
Date: 14 Sep 92 00:33:05 GMT
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

Pete Baker writes:
Easy!  they need to show that they have passed into stage 2 and are making an at
tempt to learn how to do it for themselves.
I have people ask me "how'd you do that?" all the time.  But every once in a whi
le I'll have someone come up to me and say "I saw you do such-n-such effect and
I have been working on it.. is this how you did it ?"(and they show me what they
 are working on).    Tell me Lee, who would you be more inclined to help?


Good point.  I've run into so many bloody magicians in my life, that if I
say, well done, looks like a double lift effect or a second deal. Couldn't
tell, 'cause you did it so smoothly.  Where'd you learn it?  Which of the
two methods did you use, because I followed you all the way up until the end,
but wasn't really expecting that card you dealt to be my card.  I was too
busy admiring your flourishes.  Which method did you use, and how do you
do the cover for it, 'cause it was pretty darn flawless.

Here's their response.  Well, kid, you see, it was magic.  Naw, really.
I could duplicate your effect all the way through. Heck I even know how you
did the end routine.  I just asked you which end method you used and why.

I don't say this back to them but I think it.  I think that with pet effects,
you give the man some leeway, but if we're talking an effect our of Bobo's
or Hugard's Expert, or any other required reading text, and you are asking
about simple methodology that you obviously have a grasp on anyway, it's 
kind of offensive to treat another magician like he's some stupid twerp.
Also, if it's a store bought effect and you want to know whether it can be
performed with a deck of your own creation, if a deck is rigged, and thus
unusable for other effects, etc., I think people in a magic shop should
answer you if you're clearly a magician.  Gosh, that's the equivalent of
asking how that jeep is gonna handle curves when you clearly of considering
buying it, and you get "Well buy it and find out."  

Some commentary to newbies here gets a little hot and heavy sometimes.  Usually
we get "Can you keep a secret?  Good so can I."  I'd rather see, well how
do you think it's done?  Have you read any books on the subject?  You might
consider looking at this series of texts.  If they're not really looking
for magic, but rather "HOW'D HE DO THAT!!", then you've not insulted him
and turned him into a person who'll heckle every performer he sees for the
rest of his days.  If he's a real wanna be, then he'll take up your suggestion,
go through some work, and learn the Art.  Heck, it's no sin to tell someone
to look in Bill Tarr's book for a how to on sleight of hand.  They'll have to
go to a magic shop to buy it anyway.  They could ask there.  We just make
sure they don't get scammed.  Guy at a magic shop the other day tried to
sell me Mark Wilson's course for $30-$40 bucks.  I told him I was looking
for a book with some nice sleight of hand routines, and he presented me with
this.  A good book, but I've known those tricks since I was 10.  Come on!
A newbie might get scammed or might come across someone with no clue.  A 
quick suggestion to them and we may inspire them, showing them that somebody
cares, as well as protecting our secrets and upholding the spirit of the Art.

I liked your ranking system of the 3 phases.  You're right about me sometimes
combining phase 1 and 3.  Best way to be.  I do it unconsciously as I 
explained at another posting.  I do it with movies too.  Other people complain
about predictability and I was suprised and entertained by movie X.  As
an afterthought, I will realize, that I half saw it coming all along, but
wouldn't let myself consciously realize it until after the movie was over.
Pick up some pointers on performance.  Think about new methodologies, but
also , put your brain into neutral and enjoy.
As for others.

You said:
they need to show that they have passed into stage 2

Not necessarily.  If you keep what you tell them limited to possible places
they can check they'll weed themselves out.  Laymen will stay laymen,
and would be magicians will try to join the fold.  Telling them "Well,
it's magic." Is ok for random losers who most obviously don't care, but
if you're not really sure of their motives,  I think that this is kind
of a condescending response.  I'm a student of magic and I get it often from
folks in magic shops.  I know what magic's about, and know there are good
magician's and bad magician's and I don't let it affect my love for the Art.
A person who feels that magicians generally creat an "Us vs. Them" mentality
will have it strengthened.  My suggestion to all my audiences (which rarely
number more than 5) is not to bother discussin the tricks or seeing if they
can catch me.  It's not a me vs. them.  Just turn those brains into neutral
and enjoy.  If I'm a magician and I know it works for me, I know it'll work
for others.  That way you capture the magic of the magic (if you know what
I mean) while it's there, so you don't miss that once in a lifetime moment.
They have their whole lives to try to figure out how the trick was done.

On that note (I know this strays from how we should approach would be magicians,
but this is so key that I've gotta tell you).

I was performing my favorite one ahead mind reading card stunt.  The audience
had been badgering each other and me about how things were done.  One
heckler nailed me once.  I did this baby, though, and the last card
the audience member picked in the card trick was the one that's key for the
effect if you know what I mean, the one that's my responsability.  Didn't
even have to touch the cards to end the effect.  Turned them over and
the girl said "Diablo!"  (I'm in Puerto Rico)  That's the equivalent to
"Daaamn!"  Blew their minds.  They each tried it once and couldn't manage
it.  Entertained, brains firmly in neutral, we proceded.  

 

 
Later,
 
Lee Valentine
Newsgroups: alt.magic