From: dogar@rtsg.mot.com (Haroon H. Dogar)
Subject: Quwattay bazooay Muslim nay kiya kaam Tera.. 
Keywords: Pakistan,capital
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 15:38:39 GMT


Jawaab: Bhudsanam khaano main khushee kai Musalman gai


First,

jamalin@newton.ccs.tuns.ca (Nadeem Jamali) writes:

>You have every right to ask the people any stupid question... try asking that
>question to someone from a country with a better literacy rate... he'll laugh
>at you... It's a shame that we take our people's naivete for granted.

And then later,

>Pakistan yet has to fulfil its goals... true... but those goals are not
>what you want them to be... not even what I want them to be. The goals
>are what the people of states that joined Pakistan voted for. And that
>was a confederation of the Muslim-majority states.

Ahem, well Nadeem, which is it? Are the people too illiterate
to be trusted, or do they have a right to the type of Pakistan
that they fought and died for?


And then, you wound me with the following:

>I might just find it difficult to forgive you for making such a remark about
>my country... well, but I can hardly blame someone whose life is not linked
>with it as is mine. It is very typical of "Pakistanis" settled abroad to give
>their idea of what is good for Pakistan... there is something that makes
>them believe that they know more than those who are living there... these
>people won't have to face the consequences of the decisions they make on the
>basis of some vague ideology. For us Pakistan is more than just an area on
>the globe, a name in a book... we happen to live there... and we, and our
>future generations will have to pay the price of wrong decisions made today...
>I feel more confident with the decisions we make than those that some baboo
>sahib living in US makes who'll probably never _have to_ _live_ in Pakistan.

Not that you are incorrect in saying that I don't _have_ to
live in Pakistan [Although I am not a BABOO SAHIB [yech ptooi..] :-)].
However, all along I have been advocating listening to the will of the
people. I don't think that we're ever going to agree, because either
you believe that the people want something very different from what
I think they want, or you think that they aren't worthy of "our" 
listening to them. I disagree with both positions. 

The illiterate
claim just doesn't fly with me. [Again, I'm going to use the example
of my tribe, because it is what I see the most]. We have someone
from the family in probably all of the various camps in Pakistan.
The only one that I can't think of is someone in TNFJ. Other than that,
one uncle is a Justice of the Lahore High Court, one was a DSP of 
Police, one was an Air Commodore, there is a collection of Brigadiers,
Naval Ship Captain, and then numerous Commanders, Colnels, Majors, etc.
some are industialists, some publishers, some journalists, some lawyers,
some former Olympians, most are, of course, simple zamindars, but by no
means illiterate.

As far as affiliations go, we got Muslim leaguers, we got your Barelvis,
we got your Wahabis, we got your peepaaliyas, we got your Tableeghis,
we got your Jamaatis, we got your Ahmadis, etc.

So, even if you were to limit the question to the literate "elite,"
I believe that you would find that the majority would agree with
me. 

The question seems very simple to me. Ask most Pakistanis if they
would rather have the rule of Allah or the rule of Kufr [devoid of
any specific implementations], and I think that they will go with
Allah. The question goes to the very heart of who we are. If we
are able to filter out all of the prejudices that we have developed
and we are able to ignore the bad experiences which we have faced
from those purporting to be "religious," and we look into the 
foundations of our conviction and faith, Muslims will say yes.
Yes, given the choice, we would like to follow Allah's commands.
It was true in '47, it's true today.



Again, I would like to say that I am only advocating that you
actually listen to the WILL of the people. True, I have my own
idea of what I think is best for Pakistan, but you wound me 
when you imply that I am trying to impose my foreign will upon
the people. I am going to repost an article from Iftikharuz Zaman
[yes, again] that makes an interesting point about colonialism.
I'll title it "Iftikharuz Zaman on colonialism." Please read it and
let me know what you think. [Are you as native as you think, or are
you as much a walaiti andha as me? :-) ]

>What you and your likes are doing right now is just try to exhaust me.... to
>frustrate me by repeating things again and again.... commenting on my posting
>without quoting any part of it.... you must be real desparate....


No. Just disgusted.
I'm not trying to WIN an argument on the "open net" :-) .
As with any post, I'm just trying to present my ideas, 
hopefully make some people think, and then see how others view
the same concepts, and learn from them [numerous new data points
for my unceasing analysis]. The difference is that this particular
subject is extremely painful for me. 


-hd
pehra da vehri a mein - changay da yaaran
wadday bazoorgan lay mein - puhlan da haaran
jehra vi hans kay bohlay mein tabaydaaran
sajna da minnoo yaarau jee jee lihaazay 
rehnda harr waylay sirr tay suraj da taajay ....
[Apologies in advance for any grammatical or
 transliteration errors.  :-)]
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan