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Approved-By:  Bill McGarry <wtm@SHELDEV.SHEL.ISC-BR.COM>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.l-hcap
Date:         Tue, 21 Jul 1992 11:15:29 EDT
Reply-To:     Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
From:         Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
Subject:      Handicap Digest # 2804
X-To:         LHCAP <l-hcap@VM1.NODAK.EDU>

                             THE HANDICAP DIGEST

                                 Issue # 2804

                            Monday, July 20, 1992

Today's Topics:


                                ******

                           Blink Talk Digest # 652

                    Blind trainees in clinical psychology
                          Braille keyboard question
                               Blind Educators
                       Re: Teaching Math to the Blind
                    Re: nfb bbs censorship?? You decide.
                             Re: "Blind Loyalty"
                          Re: Windows access maybe
                               WP Office help
                          Re: Windows access maybe
                          Speech Friendly Software


                                ******


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                              Bill McGarry (Moderator)
                              (203) 337-1518



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Subject: Blind trainees in clinical psychology
From: swartz@uctvax.uct.ac.za
Organization: University of Cape Town

[This was forwarded from the sci.med newsgroup]

We are about to consider an application for graduate training in
clinical psychology from a blind student, and we have no experience
of making the training more accessible and useful to blind
clinicians.  Could people involved in clinical training of blind
students in psychology and other disciplines point me in the
direction of useful things to read/programmes that have been used
successfully?  Please respond on email to the address below.

Thanks very much.

Lepartment of Psychology
University of Cape Town
swartz@psipsy.uct.ac.za






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Subject: Braille keyboard question
From: Lon.Barfield@cwi.nl (L. Barfield)


Hello,

I'm writing a bit about keyboards at the moment and I've heard
occasional references to a braille keyboard and I'm still not too sure
exactly what one is.

What I am trying to find out is if there is such a thing as a keyboard
based on the layout of dots in braille. Like a large braille character
with each dot replaced with a button. Keying in a particular character
would be done by chording; pressing down at the same time all the
appropriate buttons corresponding to the pattern of dots for that
character.

I am familiar with the Agenda and the microwriter these are one handed
keyboards with a button for each finger and they operate with
chording.  They use new invented finger patterns for the different
letters, but as these patterns are already inherent in braille I was
wondering if there are similar systems for braile writers that use
this idea.

Any ideas?




   -- Lon --

   Lon Barfield, CWI, Amsterdam, The Netherlands
   lon@cwi.nl                    +31 20 592 4140









------



Subject: Blind Educators
From: Phillip@hikssrv.lib.purdue.edu (Phillip)


I would like to get in touch with blind public school teachers.  A
blind student who is graduating this summer from Purdue University
needs some encouragement about the possibilities for employment in
the public schools.  She will have a Master's in English
Literature, and I would say is one of the most intelligent students
I haver known.  She tells me that she gets interviews but has been
discouraged and wonders whether she'll ever get a job in the public
schools.  So, please send any encouraging e-mail to me at
Phillip@hikssrv.lib.purdue.edu -- along with any job tips.

The student's name is Kathy Nimmer.






------



Subject: Re: Teaching Math to the Blind
From: martin@trout.nosc.mil (Douglas Martin)
Organization: Naval Ocean Systems Center, San Diego



Having read several replies to the questions about learning math as
a blind person, I have some additional ideas and experiences which
might be valuable.  I am a totally blind acoustics research
scientist; my undergrad major was physics; and, of course, I had to
study lots of math including calculus, statistics, and linear
algebra.

If Braille can be used, the task of learning math is, in my
opinion, much easier.  I paid a little extra and worked hard to get
all my calculus books transcribed into Braille Nemeth code, even
though most of the books were available on tape.  (Have you ever
listened to a tape recording of a trig table?!)  Braille affords
the ability to lay oud data in tabular form, to write equations on
several lines, and to review specific groups of symbols.  From
tape, checking the precedence of parentheses and brackets is nearly
impossible.

In much of calculus and analytic geometry, it is often necessary to
understand the graphical representation of equations.  In my
experience, teaching a blind person about coordinate systems,
graphs of functions, and spatial relations among curves is not an
impossible task.  Unfortunately, very little graphical material,
including raised-line maps, is available to the blind.  Educators
of the blind, however, give up far to easily when attempting to
teach graphics and/or spatial relationships.  I am fairly good at
using graphs, at least two-dimensional ones, although my blindness
was caused by severe RLF.  I mention two-dimensional drawings,
because I have never met a congenitally blind person who can
interpret perspective or isometric drawings.  For this reason, I
found solid geometry much more difficult than advanced calculus.  I
have no problem imaging and thinking in three dimensions, but
two-demensional tactile drawings of three-dimensional objects are
meaningless to me.

The American Foundation for the Blind used to sell a "raised-line
drawing kit", in which a ballpoint pen can create raised lines on
mylar plastic sheets on a rubber board.  It used to cost ten
dollars, and I've been using mine now for thirty years.  Some
drawings can be made using a seamstress's sewing tracing wheel on
Braille paper.  I also had the benefit of a father who made me a
nailboard lattice, 20*20 nails in a square to which I could attach
rubber bands.  This was particularly useful for doing partitioning
of irregular shapes.

I've included all this stuff about drawing graphs, because it's
absolutely essential in any advanced math.  From simple functions
that graph as straight lines, to graphs of polynomial functions
that form parabolas, to sine waves, you need graphs at every stage
of learning.  In calculus, it was helpful for me to see the area
under a curve partitioned into raised-line rectangles, to
understand basic integrals.

When using a reader instead of Braille, it is absolutely essential
that the reader states the equations very precisely.  For example,
when the phrase "one over x plus three" is read aloud, it is
impossible to tell if the 3 is in the numerator or the
denominator.  It should be read as if it contained parentheses.  A
blind man from Livermore Labs, whose name I don't remember, wrote a
really great set of guidelines for sighted readers of math.  If
anyone knows this guy, please let me know.

Anyway, these are my thoughts; hope it helps.
Regards,
Doug Martin      martin@nosc.mil






------



Subject: Re: nfb bbs censorship?? You decide.
From: mattioli@took.enet.dec.com (John R. Mattioli)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <22943@handicap.news>, David.Andrews@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
(David Andrews) writes...
>
>One thing that persists in NFB/ACB disagreements, on both sides, is
>that people say what they know to be true, whether or not it is.
>

This is not just an NFB/ACB problem.  People are always saying what
they know to be true and often it turns out that it isn't quite
true.  Anybody who reads any news article without understanding
that fact (whether the article is in the Monitor, the Forum or the
New York TImes) is only fooling themselves.  Reporters are supposed
to be impartial, but I don't buy that and haven't for ages!

This is all very interesting of course, but it doesn't answer Tim's
question.  The question is, "Did the sysop (or sysops) of the NFB
board censor this article?"  I suspect that they did, and I believe
there may be good reasons for them to do so.  Since you, David,
sent a message to Tim that I view as somewhat less then friendly,
I'm interested in why you feel this article should be censored.
You mention lies, where are there lies?  You mention enuendo, where
is this enuendo?  ...

I ask this question in all sincerity.  I don't know much about the
internals of the NFB and I'd like to because I'd like to formualte
my own oppinion of the organization.

You asked Tim why NFB should waste it's member's hard earned money
on this article?  I think there's a good reason for NFB members to
read this article.  I think it's highly instructive for members to
read what's being published about the organizations they are
members of and I think they should have the intelegence to figure
out for themselves what is true and what is not.

I can understand TSI being somewhat reluctant to publish the
Monitor article regarding their (TSI's) questionable business
practices, they never claimed to be democratic in any sense of the
word.  They're in the business of making money for their owners the
way a for proffit business should be.  NFB, on the other hand, is a
different type of organization and I believe it's members have a
right to know what's happening outside the organization.



------

----------
                                 John Mattioli
                           (Put witty repartee here)

(DEC E-NET)	TOOK::MATTIOLI
(UUCP)		{decvax, ucbvax, allegra}!decwrl!took.enet.dec.com!MATTIOLI
(ARPA)		MATTIOLI@TOOK.enet.dec.com




------



Subject: Re: "Blind Loyalty"
From: mattioli@took.enet.dec.com (John Mattioli)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <22894@handicap.news>, Jamal.Mazrui@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
(Jamal Mazrui) writes...
>
>A rather revealing article about the National Federation of the Blind
>appeared in the July 1992 issue of Baltimore Magazine.  Its title is
>"Blind Loyalty" and it is available for download from BlinkLink
>(412-766-0732) as an ASCII text file named LOYALTY.TXT.
>
Jamal,

I read the article and found it EXTREMELY interesting.  I'm
interested in why you chose not to post it here.  Is it due to it's
lenghth (about 30k) or were you censored?  I have, in the passed,
attempted to post fairly contrivercial articles here and have been
censored.  I accepted the censor (very grudgingly) because the
articles in question involved individuals.  This article, however,
is a general interest article and I truly hope it remains unposted
here due to your choice not the choice of the censor!

As far as the text of the article itself goes, let's just say that
if everything they say about the NFB is true, I'm darn glad I don't
work there.  I'd have a hard time working for a guy who's WIFE even
calls him Dr.



------

----------
                                 John Mattioli
                           (Put witty repartee here)

(DEC E-NET)	TOOK::MATTIOLI
(UUCP)		{decvax, ucbvax, allegra}!decwrl!took.enet.dec.com!MATTIOLI
(ARPA)		MATTIOLI@TOOK.enet.dec.com




------



Subject: Re: Windows access maybe
From: mattioli@took.enet.dec.com (John Mattioli)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

In article <22886@handicap.news>, Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
(Eric Bohlman) writes...
>
> BG> observations.  You could tell which way the mouse was moving by the
> BG> tones; double tones for horizontal movement, and single tone for
> BG> vertical.  If I were using it though, I would use the keyboard to
>
>Why, pray tell, would a user need to be told which way he was
>moving the mouse (it doesn't move by itself, ya know!)?
>

Actually, the mouse indicator doesn't so much tell you which way
the mouse is moving as it does tell you where the mouse is.  It
does this by making a sound at a specific pitch for each position
on the screen.  This has the effect of seeming to tell you which
way you're moving the mouse.  As you move it to the right (or up)
the pitch is raised.  If you move left (or down) the pitch goes
down.  If you have some feel for where things are on the screen
based on these pitches, you can get to them very easily.

Also, you may need to know which way you're moving the mouse.  Say,
for example, you're moving it not quite 100% horizontally.  You may
think you are, but the mouse might actually wander vertically by
several pixels.  Windows Bridge seems to indicate this sort of
unintentional motion.



------

----------
                                 John Mattioli
                           (Put witty repartee here)

(DEC E-NET)	TOOK::MATTIOLI
(UUCP)		{decvax, ucbvax, allegra}!decwrl!took.enet.dec.com!MATTIOLI
(ARPA)		MATTIOLI@TOOK.enet.dec.com




------



Subject: WP Office help
From: rbanks@uwstout.edu (Dick Banks)

July 19, 1992

Carla Campbell (Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org) writes:


> Hi, folks. I've got a friend who needs some advice that I am unable
> to give.  (since I don't know squat about Artic Business Vision).
>
> She has Artic 3.03, and the most recent versions of PC Anywhere and
> WordPerfect Office.  The idea is to use PC Anywhere to log onto the
> work machine and run WP Office from home, using ABV on thel ocal
> machine.
>
> I've had mixed results with older versions of PC Anywhere and other
> speech packages.  I know WP Office should work.
>
> The problem they are finding is that some screens in WP Office talk
> fine over this connection and others do not speak at all. The
> connection works fine, btw-- it's only once they're into WP Office
> that the seemingly random reading (or not reading) of the screen
> begins.


Hi Carla:

I have worked a great deal with Wp and various types of
speech synthesis programs.  One thing that I you didn't
mention is if you used a /nk in your command line with
WP Office.  I am fairly certain that you need to have
that in the command line just as you do with wp5.1
That is why it will speak sometimes and not others.  It
may also keep repeating the staus line and any atempt
to turn off the speech won't work.

If you have any other questions just write me
personally and I'll see if I can help you.

Dick Banks
rbanks@uwstout
BITNET
rbanks@uwstout.edu
INTERNET
yy
Hope this works for you






------



Subject: Re: Windows access maybe
From: bz920@cleveland.freenet.edu (Dick Banks)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)


Hello John and All

I have seen your posts many times on the Handicap Digest, including
this one.  Is this a clone of the Digest or what?  This Syntha-Voice
entry into the market has certainly cuased a great deal of posting.
I have some reservations about this wonder, but until a few people
have tried it, it would be unfair to pass judgement.

I have some thoughts on this Windows business which I hope those who
read this will weigh carefully.  I have used the Macintosh Speech
Interface outSPOKEN.  I really should say made for the Mac because it
is not a Macintosh product per se.  It took me awhile to catch the
difference between using the IBM compatible speech synthesis products
to that of the Mac.  The way you get around on the Mac is very visual.
That is difficult for many visually handicapped people to really grasp.
Knowing in your mind about visual access is quite different from
working with it.  At least I found it so.

Your right John, beeping direction, quite frankly, is a joke.  Whoever
designed that idea doesn't understand the needs of the blind or
visually impaired.  What is really needed is some means of marking the
screen like outSPOKEN uses.  Once you have identified folders and icons,
you use the FIND and MARK commands to naviage the screen.  In a word
processing program, you identify things like justification, line spacing
and close boxes with the Find and Mark commands, to get done what you
need done.  Becoming dependent on pull down menus to get work done is
much like riding the stage coach.  You will get there, but I can't
guarantee when or in what condition you will arrive.

I do not mean that outSPOKEN should be cloned by programmers.  I do
believe that much could be learned from working with outSPOKEN because
it was designed TO WORK with GUI right from the start.  When you consider
that outSPOKEN can be carried in your pocet and used on almost any
Mac, it is quite the program.  For those who don't know, outSPOKEN is
a software program and it fits on a DS/DD disk with room to spare.

There is no question that the world is going Windows.  Blind and
visually impaired will certainly have to learn to get around in
the product.  Minorities seem to always have to adjust to
majorities, right or wrong.  Sales people love Windows, it makes
computers easy to sell.  I haven't walked into any computer business
where they haven't had Windows on every machine.

I don't want to leave anyone with the wrong impression.  I don't
prefer Mac to IBM or compatible.  I am for empowering people
through the use of computers no matter what name is on them.  In
my business, I need to know both formats.  That is to my advantage.
Mo matter how you personally feel about GUI, it is here and it will
become the format.  It is darn close now.

Dick Banks
Adaptive Technologist
University of Wisconsin-Stout
Library Learning Center
--






------



Subject: Speech Friendly Software
From: talmy@rand.org (Shel Talmy)

I'd like to throw my 2 cents worth into this thread, as none of
the software that I use as "standards", have been mentioned.

All of the following are either freeware or shareware.

SLED-totally speech friendly and pound for pound, the best ASCII
editor available.  It's only 20K and has practically as many
features as QEDIT.

MORE AND XMORE-2 text readers ported over from UNIX, with tons of
features.

MAXFIND-easily the best string finder available.

CATDISK-an excellent floppy disk cataloger with more features
than you'll probably ever want.

All of the above are available on BBS's.

One more program I'd like to mention that is commercial, but only
around $50.00, is MEX, which stands for Modem Exchange, a
telecommunications program written by Ron Fowler, and very well
supported by him.  It is an excellent program for speech packages
and can do anything the shareware packages can do, but better
in my opinion.  The only caveat here is that it helps to know
something about your computer and DOS to use this program to its
best effect.

You can order it at 800-NITEOWL




------






                                ******

                  End of Issue # 2804 of the Handicap Digest

                                ******
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU