HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: Re: NL East analysis.k
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 03:00:10 GMT

In article <1992Dec17.000708.17351@cc.umontreal.ca> iacurtop@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Iacurto Paul) writes:
>POSITION BY POSITION RATINGS
>Best player: 10 pts
>2 nd.......   9 pts
>3 rd.......   8 pts
>4 th.......   7 pts
>5 th.......   6 pts
>6 th.......   5 pts
>(Florida Marlins excluded)

I'm curious -- what's the point of 10,9,8,7,6,5?  Why not 6 through 1,
and then add 36 points to all the teams? :)

>Tim Wallach     - Expos    537    .223    .296     9      59     2
>Kevin Young     - Pirates    7    .571    .667     0       4     0
>
>5 - Tim Wallach          6
>6 - Kevin Young          5

Why so down on Kevin Young?  Wallach is a proven liability.

>Ratings:
>1 - Bernard Gilkey        10
>2 - Vince Coleman          9
>3 - Moises Alou            8

I'd put Alou over Coleman.

>CENTER FIELD                AB      BA     OBA     HR      RBI     SB
>Rick Wilkins    - Cubs      244     .270   .344     8       22      0
>Marquis Grissom - Expos     653     .276   .322    14       66     78
>Andy Van Slyke  - Pirates   614     .324   .381    14       89     12
>Ray Lankford    - Cards     598     .293   .371    20       86     42
>
>Ratings:
>1 - Ray Lankford       10
>2 - Marquis Grissom     9
>3 - Andy Van Slyke      8
>5 - Rick Wilkins        6

Here's where I find a problem with your system -- is the difference
between Rick Wilkins and Andy Van Slyke worth the same as the difference
between Ray Lankford and Andy Van Slyke?  I don't think so.

Van Slyke should be ahead of Grissom.
-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
standard disclaimers          | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: paula@koufax.cv.hp.com (Paul Andresen)
Subject: Re: Roger Angell on women sportswriters
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:40:32 GMT

In article <1992Dec11.180027.7812@panix.com>, spira@panix.com (Greg "Sarcasm Is A Way Of Life" Spira) writes:

|> Not that this even began to make up for all of Dick Young's garbage.
|> His biggest crime was driving Tom Seaver out of New York, but there
|> were many, many others.

I thought that Dick The Creep finally got his, though. He used to love to rail
at players for their lack of loyalty they way they jumped teams all the time.
Of course, then he went and jumped his contract at one paper to join another.
The same rules didn't apply to him, I guess. He got roundly roasted, which
was the least he deserved.

Young was never anything more than a mouthpiece for the owners.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
              If you're really hip, the passing years will show.
                                           ......Tower Of Power

  paula@koufax.cv.hp.com   Paul Andresen  Hewlett-Packard  (503)-750-3511

    home: 3006 NW McKinley    Corvallis, OR 97330       (503)-752-8424
                            A SABR member since 1979
From: dkeisen@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dave Eisen)
Subject: Re: I will, forever, truly hate the Toronto Blue Jays
Organization: Sequoia Peripherals, Inc.
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 20:17:14 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.191935.5412@sni.ca> dave@snitor.sni.ca (Dave Till) writes:
>I have been watching Toddles, man and boy, for many years, and
>frankly, I still can't figure him out.  4 starts out of 5, he pitches
>like a kid making his first major league start:  trying to throw perfect
>breaking pitches and missing, then sending a batting practice fastball
>down the chute.  But, just when you've given up on him, he goes out
>and pitches like Roger Clemens.  (The 1-hitter he threw this year was
>mindboggling:  he was overwhelming.)

The Phillies had a pitcher like that a few years ago: Charles Hudson.
Every time he went out there you might see a 2 hitter with 10 SOs;
then again you might see him get shelled and forced to leave the
game after one and a third. And like Stottlemyre, he was bad a lot
more often than he was good. Hudson never did straighten it out and
pitch consistently adequate baseball; I see no reason to think that
Stottlemyre will either.



-- 
Dave Eisen                               Sequoia Peripherals: (415) 967-5644
dkeisen@leland.Stanford.EDU              Home:                (415) 321-5154
       There's something in my library to offend everybody. 
          --- Washington Coalition Against Censorship
From: oz@hpkslx.mayfield.HP.COM (Kent Ostby)
Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1992 09:19:24 GMT
Subject: Re: Bonds to Giants?  Now what?
Organization: HP Response Center Lab
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball

Under the "now what" category for the Giants, rumors are flying around the
SF Bay Area that Dave Martinez will be signed to lead off and play outfield.

Oz
From: demers@cs.ucsd.edu (David DeMers)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: EXPOS :TEAM TO BEAT IN THE EAST
Date: 21 Dec 92 05:13:56 GMT
Organization: =CSE Dept., U.C. San Diego

In article <1020@blue.cis.pitt.edu> genetic+@pitt.edu (Dr. Dave) writes:
>Thus spake B7XS@MUSICT.MCGILL.CA (B7XS000):

>Stick around, Jonathon.  I know a lot of stat-drunk comp nerds (myself
>included) who think the Expos are the class of major league baseball for
>the foreseeable future. 

Yo, me too.  I picked them last season - got 50-1 on a division
title.  After Atlanta in '91, guess you can't win them all...

> I couldn't believe it when I heard that they'd
>acquired Tim Spehr somehow (how did that happen?).  

what's Spehr's story? I've never heard of him...

>That gives them a starting in-the-field lineup of 


>	1B	sign a free agent

Colbrunn should be adequate, though his plate discipline is
poor.  He hits the ball pretty often pretty hard, which is
nice to have around as a 1B hitting about 7th in the lineup.
 
>	3B	Stairs?
Hope so, but rumor is his defense isn't good.  But he
was at 2B until this year, wasn't he?


>>The Expos are deffinetly the team to beat in '93. 

>No argument here...

Yup, but watch out for them Phillies.

-- 
Dave DeMers			 ddemers@UCSD   demers@cs.ucsd.edu
Computer Science & Engineering	C-014		demers%cs@ucsd.bitnet
UC San Diego					...!ucsd!cs!demers
La Jolla, CA 92093-0114	(619) 534-0688, or -8187, FAX: (619) 534-7029
From: chuq@Apple.COM (Eeyore's Evil Twin)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Willie Mays statement
Date: 19 Dec 92 07:00:44 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Pooh Corner Country Club -- A Planned Community

erics@sco.COM (eric smith) writes:

>So, did he just forget about Frank Robinson? Or am I misunderstanding
>the point he was making?

The thing I find about Willie is that the more he talked the less sense he
makes. Why they keep trotting him out instead of McCovey, who lives local
and is a good spokesperson is beyond me.

-- 
            Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX)
                      Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms
                chuq@apple.com | GEnie: MAC.BIGOT | ALink:CHUQ 

                       Sterling Holloway: We'll miss you.
From: psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Who are these new Pirates ?
Date: 16 Dec 92 15:13:20 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <BzByJ3.Du4@acsu.buffalo.edu> v085f2wd@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Theodore J Kury) writes:
>
>Since the Pirates seem to be missing a cleanup hitter, these players all
>hit 4th in this many games for the Bisons:
>
>Brian Dorsett        104
>Dave Clark            23
>Jose Tolentino         5
>Tom Prince             2
>Don Slaught            2
>Jeff King              1   

Just for the record, Brian Dorsett is no longer a Pirate.  I'm not sure
of the circumstances surrounding his departure (and I'm pretty disgusted
that he's gone) but I'm nearly 100% sure I saw that the Marlins had signed 
him last week.

PSG
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Is Yankees just a bargaining chip ?
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 19:08:54 GMT

In article <1g88a3INNkfg@transfer.stratus.com> jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com writes:
>Some players may not like really big cities. I can sympathize.
>I wouldn't work in New York City for double my current salary,
>because it is too big and too crowded for my tastes. Other players,
>on the other hand, go to New York or LA because they prefer the
>big cities to Cincinnati or Pittsburgh or Kansas City.

Which is part of why the talent hasn't concentrated in the big cities, as
the anti-free agency forces predicted in the mid-seventies.

I've found the recent free agency activity very interesting.  It has been
confined to a handful of teams, but it's not the handful of teams that I
think most people would have predicted.  It's not restricted to large
market teams; in fact, most of the large market teams have been fairly
quiet.  I'm not sure what conclusions, if any, to draw from this, but I do
think it's interesting.

The other observation, having watched some of the teams throw around lots
of money without improving the team a lot, is that perhaps one reason why
free agency hasn't resulted in concentrating talent in a few teams is that
maybe it's a bad thing for a GM not to have limited resources.  If a GM has
limited resources, he's forced to think about how he spends his money,
instead of throwing it at big name, old warm bodies.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com


Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: gaf5@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (Gail A. Fullman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: All-Time Phillies
Date: 14 Dec 92 14:07:38 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University


>RP Tug McGraw
>   Without knocking the two Phillies relievers who single-handedly
>   won pennants for the Phillies, Jim Konstanty and Al Holland,
>   the tugger gave the Phillies more good years than anyone else.
>   Besides, who can forget the scene of McGraw jumping into the
>   air after he saved the game that gave the Phillies their only
>   world championship?
>
This is my 10-year old nephew's favorite imitation.  He plays Schmidt jumping
into the Tugger's arms (me).
-- 

------------------------
|   Gail A. Fullman    |
|   Manager - ADMO     |
|   Ext. 83113         |
------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: dae@cbnews.cb.att.com (david.a.elliott)
Subject: Re: My picks, AL/NL East
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 13:35:58 GMT

In article <Dec.17.22.27.04.1992.23983@pilot.njin.net> gajarsky@pilot.njin.net (Bob Gajarsky - Hobokenite) writes:
>lws@eembox.ncku.edu.tw (WenHsiang Lin) writes:
>
>>> Orestes Destrade will pop 270 with 20 homers.   
>
>>    Is it very difficult to hit home run in Marlins' home ground?
>>Orestes Destrade consistantly hits around 40 homers for every 130-game
>>season in Japan. I expect him to have more than 20 homers for Marlins
>>in next season.

>well, first off - japanese baseball, from all that we can tell,
> is roughly similar to AAA baseball - so he'd have a dropoff based
> simply on that.  It might even be lower than that, but I'm not sure.

Destrade played in the Yankee organization for a while, and got stuck behind
Mattingly.  He has never had a chance to prove himself in the majors.  On
the other hand, he has no major league track record (unlike Fielder did
before he went to Japan), and I don't remember him putting up anywhere near
these numbers when he was in Columbus.  He's no more of a sure thing than
Jeff Conine is.

>none of us *know* how miami will be for hitters.  however, the best
> hitting parks tend to be in those cities that are at higher altitudes.
> miami is reasonably close to sea level.  also, the miami minor
> league team, in its league, had the 3rd (out of 10 teams) lowest number
> of runs scored/against, which would lead me to believe that miami
> will be more of a picher's park than all nl parks other than houston
> and los angeles.

That's probably irrelevant since they won't play in the same stadium.

Altitude can be a major factor, but it's only one of the things that can
turn a park into a hitter's park.  Humidity, outfield dimensions, hitting
background, prevailing winds, and foul territory area also all contribute.
Miami definitely has the humidity, and if it has enough of the other
characteristics it will be a hitter's park.


Dave Elliott
From: dxf12@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas Fowler)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: All-Time A's Team
Date: 16 Dec 1992 21:26:25 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: dxf12@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas Fowler)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc12.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, zurawski@cbnewse.cb.att.com (lawrence.w.zurawski) says:

>
>	I haven't seen an All-Time A's team yet, so here goes:
>
>	1B Foxx
>	2B Collins
>	3B Baker
>	SS Campaneris
>	OF Henderson
     Do you bat him or Collins leadoff, though?  It's close.

>	OF Jackson
     Maybe Canseco and he would platoon, but I'm tempted to think he'd win
the regular job.  Jose would start a few, though.

>	OF Simmons
>	C  Cochrane
>
>	SP Grove
>	SP Waddell
>	SP Plank
>	SP Hunter
     5th starter: Dave Stewart, who seemed to up his performance about 10
notches in crunch time.

>
>	RP Fingers
>	RP Eckersley
>
>	Manager Mack
>
>	This team stacks up pretty well alongside the other All-Time teams.
     Amazing how few good shortstops they've had, though.s
-- 
Doug Fowler: dxf12@po.CWRU.edu  : Me, age 4 & now: "Mommys and Daddys & other
    Ever wonder if, after Casey : relatives have to give lots of hugs & love
missed the 3rd strike in the poem: & support, 'cause Heaven is just a great
he ran to first and made it?     : big hug that lasts forever and ever!!!"
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: yankees@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu (Kenneth M Gelfand)
Subject: Wade Boggs in pinstripes
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: The Johns Hopkins University - HCF
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 06:11:00 GMT


	It's official....the Yanks have signed Wade Boggs to a 3-year deal.
Here's their lineup:

C: Nokes/Stanley
1B: Mattingly
2B: P Kelly, but watch your back!
SS: Spike (ouch)
3B: Boggs
LF: O'Neill/ either Gerald Williams or Bam Bam...depends on spring.
CF: Bernie Williams
RF: Danny Tartabull
DH: Maas/Leyritz/Bam Bam/Gerald Williams ....can anyone out there hit?

Back-up infielders: Stankiewicz, Gallego, Velarde (maybe an excess?)

SP: Abbott
SP: Melido
SP: Key
SP: Militello
SP: Kamienicki/Hitchcock

RP: Farr
RP: Monteleone
RP: Howe
RP: Habyan (if healthy)
RP: Wickman 




	Not exactly the 1927 or 1961 group, but certainly not the 1990
bunch either.  Given a few breaks, they could make some noise in the 
East.  I certainly hope so...1981 seems so far away....



							Kenny G
							Not Yankee woofing, but
							not hissing either.
From: rickert@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (John H. Rickert)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Trivia Question
Date: 15 Dec 1992 19:48:12 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department at Rose-Hulman
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: rickert@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (John H. Rickert)
NNTP-Posting-Host: g215a-1.nextwork.rose-hulman.edu

In article <15DEC199213241654@mary.fordham.edu> nissim@mary.fordham.edu  
(Leonard J. Nissim) writes:
> In article <BzB8Mw.27x@mach1.wlu.ca>, 
> lars4752@mach1.wlu.ca (Bradley Larsen u) writes...
> >Name the eight ways by which a batter can reach first base.
> There are at least twelve ways:  
> 
> single
> double 
> triple
> home run
> walk
> hit by pitch
> error
> fielder's choice
> wild pitch on swinging 3rd strike 
> passed ball on swinging 3rd strike 
> catcher's interference
> double play (e.g. 1-2-5 DP with bases loaded, 0 out; batter is on first  
base,
>              another runner on second base with 2 outs.)
> 
> and a thirteenth if you are willing to count it:  
> 
> triple play (e.g. 1-2-5-4 triple play with bases loaded, 0 out--batter 
>                   reaches first base and is left on first base, inning  
over.)
> 
> Any more?
	Well, as a foolwup to #13
groundout to 3b,SS,2b,1b,P
fly out to LF, CF, RF, ... etc.
He could reach on a popout too, 
but many players don't actually get to first, 
they start toward the dugout before the get to the base.
I suppose there are several other variations where
the batter reaches first, but not safely...

john rickert
rickert@nextwork.rose-hulman.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: The best All-Time Team?  Indians
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 17:47:46 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.213731.11702@midway.uchicago.edu> thf2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <1992Dec15.103611.1@csusb> jimbo@csusb writes:
>>OF   Tris Speaker
>>OF   Joe Jackson (If only he'd stayed in Erie Town)
>>OF   Earl Averill

>I'd put Brett Butler ahead of Averill.

I wouldn't.  Butler only had 4 years there, to Averill's 10; and 
Averill had four years (none back-to-back) that were superior to
any of Butler's.  Five years with OBP >400, seven with SLG >500;
yes, it was the 30's, but that was good by 30's standards, too. 
And 1936 (378/438/627) was good by *any* standards.

>It's hard to believe that not one of the players in the last
>twenty years for the Indians merits a spot on their all-time
>team -- they've had Franco, Butler... Joe Carter also, though
>he clearly isn't one of their best three outfielders.

Well, Cleveland can't *keep* players, that's all.  Lots of good
ones have passed through.

>>            The Bench
>>
>>C    Ray Fosse
>>IF   Ken Keltner
>>IF   Joe Sewell
>>OF   Rocky Colavito (I know others may be better, but he still is
>>                     an icon in Cleveland)

>Certainly Franco deserves a spot...

Perhaps.  But remember that he only started hitting well his last 
two years in Cle., and that his best years were in Tex.

Roger
From: tkevans@eplrx7.es.duPont.com (Tim Evans)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: All-Time A's Team
Date: 17 Dec 92 16:59:05 GMT
Reply-To: tkevans@eplrx7.es.dupont.com
Organization: DuPont Engineering Physics Laboratory

dxf12@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas Fowler) writes:

>>	OF Henderson
>     Do you bat him or Collins leadoff, though?  It's close.

>>	OF Jackson
>     Maybe Canseco and he would platoon, but I'm tempted to think he'd win
>the regular job.  Jose would start a few, though.

>>	OF Simmons

I haven't see Big Gus Zernial here.  Hit 50+ homers at least one year, and
20+ for several more, the latter being a major disappointment to Philly
fans after the former, even though Gus had some major injuries in the
last couple of years before the A's moved to KC.
-- 
Tim Evans                     |    E.I. du Pont de Nemours & Co.
tkevans@eplrx7.es.dupont.com  |    Experimental Station
(302) 695-9353/7395           |    P.O. Box 80357
EVANSTK AT A1 AT ESVAX        |    Wilmington, Delaware 19880-0357
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Statheads and park effects
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 07:15:16 GMT

In article <1992Dec20.034702.1492@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> akamholz@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Andrew E Kamholz) writes:
>Perhaps Boggs just doesn't hit well of the road- like on road trips.
>(Maybe he is too busy with other pursuits!) So maybe settling in Yankee
>Stadium, he will hit like he is home. Let's all remember that it's not
>necessarily the park- it could be the state of mind.

Do you consider this likely?  What's YOUR best guess as to Boggs' performance
next year?

Roger

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: akamholz@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Andrew E Kamholz)
Subject: Re: Brian Dorsett (was Re: Who are these new Pirates ?)
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 00:10:45 GMT

I saw Dorsett when he was still with the Yanks. I don't thnk he could
possibly be 31.


Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: drw3l@delmarva.evsc.Virginia.EDU (David Robert Walker)
Subject: Re: Stupidest rule in baseball (perhaps a new one)
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 15:02:04 GMT

In article <1992Dec13.092848.370@walter.cray.com> mb@cray.com (Maynard Brandt) writes:
>My apologies if this replicates an earlier post.  To me the dumbest rule
>has always been:
>
>With 0 or 1 strikes on a batter, a foul ball is a strike.  However, except
>for a bunt, a foul ball with 2 strikes on a batter is *NOT* a strike.
>
>If it isn't a strike the last time, why should a foul ball ever be included
>in the ball-strike count?
>
>I remember someone commenting on a TV broadcast that at one time foul
>balls weren't included in the ball-strike count.  Does anyone on the
>net know if this is true or false and, if it is true, when the rule
>changed?
>
>If it was true during Babe Ruth's or Walter Johnson's time, it just may
>change some net opinions concerning Ruth's hitting ability or Johnson's
>strikeout total when making comparisons to current players.
>
>Thank you.
>-- 
>Regards,
>
>Maynard Brandt
>Cray Research, Inc.

The foul-strike rule was adopted by the National League in 1901 and by
the American League in 1903. It was the primary reason why strikeouts
jumped by 55% in the AL from 1902 to 1903, and by 58% in the NL
between 1900 and 1901. The only well-known 20th century stat that has
to be qualified is Lajoie's BA in 1901.

It was adopted because a few players (John McGraw and Roy Thomas among
them) had gotten extremely proficient and deliberately fouling pitches
off, and working a pitcher for a walk. In 1899, McGraw drew 124 walks
with only 399 atbats (batting .391: a .547 OBA, second best in
history.)

The idea was to speed up the game; with all the walks, games were
supposedly taking too long. (Sound familiar?) They amended the rule
later so that deliberately hitting a foul was considered a strike,
even if you already had two. Didn't stop Thomas from drawing 100+
walks for the next five years.

Clay D.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione)
Subject: Colorful r.s.bb expressions
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 01:03:28 GMT

Well, maybe they aren't all that colorful, but I think if Ross Perot
would have read this group, he would have had alot more phrases.  My
favorite Perot-ism:

...End of story.

In this group, we also have:

...Feh (most frequent user unknown.  Dave Tate maybe?)
...Wrong, but thanks for playing. (Gary Huckabay)
...Chyeah.  (just saw this one in a Ted Frank posting)

and of course:

...duh. (the immortal bob vesterman)

John Franjione
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball