From: gross@eric10.rtp.dg.com (Gene Gross)
Subject: Re: Anti-religious fanatics (Was Re: School Choice )
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 92 17:45:58 GMT
Organization: Data General Corporation, RTP, NC.

In article <1992Sep3.230545.718@midway.uchicago.edu> wag5@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <1992Sep2.130051.2455@dg-rtp.dg.com> gross@eric10.rtp.dg.com (Gene Gross) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug28.205043.28773@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>>>In article <1992Aug27.124245.14530@dg-rtp.dg.com> gross@eric10.rtp.dg.com (Gene Gross) writes:
>>>>>The deaths by neglect are atleast 10's of millions (maybe someone could
>>>>>explain the role of the church in the medival plagues). This may climb
>>>>>to 100 million in the next 10 years since Christianity has fought all
>>>>>attempts to cure or control HIV transmission.
>>>>
>>>>What proof have you to offer that "Christianity has fought all attempts
>>>>to cure or control HIV transmission"?  As nearly as I can tell from
>>>>research that I've done for the past two years, the CDC and the Gay and
>>>>AIDS Lobbies have done more harm than any other group or organization
>>>>put together.
>>>
>>>People like to say this, however they ignore the fact that Gay groups
>>>with no government assistance (Helms Admendment) have managed to slow
>>>the spread of AIDS among homosexuals, while it continues to rise in
>>>virtually all other segments of the population.
>>
>>The drop in HIV cases among homosexual males has more to do with the
>>fact that the population is dying off than a change in behavior
>>patterns.  Several homosexual authors (whose names escape me at the
>>moment but I will look them up) also have taken the Gay and AIDS Lobbies
>>to task over this same issue.  Further, they point out that when the
>>public bathhouses were finally closed, the homosexual community turned
>>right around and opened private bathhouses continuing a major source of
>>transmission.
>>
>>The Gay Lobby has incredible funding from within its own community and
>>from those who are sympathetic to their cause.  I know for a fact that
>>the former mayor of Durham, NC, provided funding as did the State
>>legislature to the Gay cause.
>>
>>Much of the rise in other parts of the population at large has to do
>>with other variables.  Chief among them is Blood transfusions.  We still
>>do not have a safe blood supply.  Saying that a person only has a risk
>>of 1 in 250 chances of contracting HIV from a blood transfusion is
>>ludicrous at best.  There should be no chance of contracting HIV through
>>a blood transfusion.
>>
>>>>Clearly the only answer to HIV transmission is to use standard medical
>>>>practices that have been used with all communicable diseases, and have
>>>>been proven effective in controlling the spread of communicable
>>>>diseases.  HIV is the only communicable disease which has civil rights
>>>>status and political status.  Why!?  Syphilis doesn't; gonorreha
>>>>doesn't; TB doesn't; hepatitis doesn't; etc., for roughly several
>>>>hundred.  
>>>
>>>For example? What "special rights" do AIDS patients have that these
>>>others don't? 
>>
>>The right to refuse to be tested.  The right to have medical insurance
>>when they know that they are infected -- the insurance companies are not
>>allowed to know the HIV status of those seeking insurance coverage.
>>However, insurance companies are permitted to know if you have, or have
>>had, any of the other communicable diseases.
>>
>>You do not have the right to know if your medical or dental provider has
>>HIV, or if any of the staff that will be working with you has HIV.  Nor
>>do they have the right to know if you have HIV.  However, routine
>>testing is done to determine your status for any number of other
>>communicable diseases -- VDRL, check it out the next time your committed
>>to the hospital.
>>
>>HIV will transmit through blood splashes on skin, and this has happened
>>more than once.  I can transmit through needle sticks, again, this has
>>happened more than once.  There is now evidence that the HIV virus can
>>be aerosolized through certain surgical procedures and the coughing
>>done by AIDS patients.  The research was done by qualified medical
>>researchers in California using their own funds because the CDC refused
>>to fund it (their comment was, "It simply can't be transmitted that way
>>or we are all in serious trouble.")
>>
>>We now know that the HIV retrovirus is not nearly as fragile as once
>>stated.  It can survive in dry conditions outside the body for at least
>>seven days and still be highly infectious.  It can survive longer under
>>wet conditions.  And buried among some of the CDC's original work is the
>>little tidbit that the HIV retrovirus can survive and be infectious up
>>to 48 hours later inside a mosquitoe!!
>>
>>This is not scare tactics, and I'm not saying that we will get it from
>>mosquitoes (something for which there is not research -- CDC cut off
>>funding shortly after discovering that the virus could remain alive
>>inside the bug).  The fact remains that this is a disease with political
>>and legal clout.
>>
>>Routine testing and contact tracing works, and we know this because it
>>has been used time and again to stem the outbreaks of other infectious
>>and communicable diseases.  The evidence is in the Public Health
>>records, if you would care to take a look.  If not, then merely doubting
>>it only buries your head deeper in the sand.
>>
>>HIV is, as far as we know now, 100 percent lethal.  As the T4 helper
>>cells are taken over, and the immune system compromised, more and more
>>opportunistic diseases overwhelm the infected person's immune system.
>>Eventually, all major organs come under attack, this includes the brain.
>>Some evidence now exists that the brain may be one of the earliest
>>organs affected by the HIV virus.  I'm still working on gathering that
>>information.
>>
>>The point is this, since I am a Christian, and I am working my buns off
>>trying to help find a means to control this bugger, what proof positive
>>is there that Christians are responsible for the lack of effort and the
>>spread of this fatal disease.  Sounds like Nero's charges that we set
>>Rome ablaze!
>>
>>Fact is that I'm not the only Christian thus involved.  There are those
>>on the front lines working with and helping AIDS patients, working in
>>labs around the world to try to find a cure (or at least some means of
>>prolonging life).  And then there are others like me, a writer, who are
>>researching this disease and the available information so that we can
>>present it to the public.  At ever turn I have bumped into those who do
>>not want some of the information released.  Invariably they are part of
>>the Gay Lobby, the AIDS Lobby, the ACLU, or the CDC.  The party line is
>>we need education and condoms with virucides.  Sorry, but this tact has
>>not proven effective in the least.  Next!!
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Gene 
>
>	So what should we do in the meantime? Discriminate against
>people with AIDS?

Absolutely not!!  What I do suggest is that this epidemic, which never
should have happened in the first place, be treated like other medical
epidemics.  This is a disease people -- nothing more or less.  It is, as
far as we know to date, 100 percent lethal, but a disease nonetheless.

Routine testing and contact tracing works for other communicable
diseases.  It will work for HIV -- Colorado is one of the states that
currently has routine testing and contact tracing for HIV.  They also
collect and report statistics on HIV and not just AIDS.

Further, there must be some serious alteration to American sexual
behaviors.  The promiscuity of both the heterosexual and homosexual
communities is no longer a viable option with HIV infection running
rampant.  The use of condoms is at best Russian Roulette with a loaded
gun.

I also believe that health care workers have the right to know if their
patients have HIV -- they know if the patients test positive for other
diseases, why is HIV different?  Also, patients have the right to know
if any health care providers have HIV, particularly if that provider is
going to be doing anything where the risk of transmission is high
(surgery or dental work are examples).  Some time back, my wife and I
ate a local fast food joint.  It had a good reputation and good food.
We were notified about three days later that the cook had contracted
hepatitis and had been cooking and handling food while infected.  This
enabled us to take the GG shots needed to help prevent becoming infected
ourselves.  However, if that cook had HIV, we would have no way of
knowing or protecting ourselves.  Even the Public Health services can do
nothing about it.  That person (cook) will cut himself on average of
several dozen times a day, and the blood enters into the food stuffs
being handled.  We have no way of knowing for sure that HIV transmits in
this manner, but we do know for a fact that there are receptor cells in
the mucosa that attracts the HIV virus like iron filings to a magnet.
Transmission of HIV through oral sex and deep passionate kissing is now
known to have happened.  Do you get the point!!?

We, the citizens of the United States, have the right to be protected
against undue risks of infection by HIV.  To give HIV political status
and legal status puts our rights and health in great jeopardy, and in
some cases, has in fact compromised our lives.

I have no problem with HIV positive patients continuing to work for as
long as they are able, and provided that work will not represent a
threat to the lives of others.  I also oppose insurance companies when
they dump an HIV patient because of the long term medical payments, for
the same reasons that I oppose it when done to cancer patients, or
others with chronic, often terminal, illnesses.  Having worked around at
least one HIV positive person, I don't worry about casual contact being
a vector.  But that person was doing nothing that risked spreading the
disease in the workplace.

HIV is not merely a gay disease, or merely an IV drug user's disease.
HIV can be spread through heterosexual sex, through blood transfusions
or receiving contaminated blood products.  It can be transmitted through
the prick of a contaminated needle, or through a blood splash on the
skin (the myth of intact skin is just that -- a myth).  HIV is a major
problem for the world, but it isn't going to be solved by merely telling
people to wear condoms and to become educated about safe (or safer) sex.
This has been the attack for the past decade and it simply is not
working.

Currently, the most conservative estimate I've seen says that some 3
million Americans are now infected with HIV.  Better than 90 percent of
them do not even know that they are infected.  But one thing is for
sure, they will die slow, agonizing deaths, and probably will have
unwittingly spread the disease to others for many years before the first
AIDS indicators appear.  The last time I checked the average cost to
treat an AIDS patient for one year was $177,000.  Multiply that times 3
million -- not to mention the thousands who already have AIDS.  Quite a
sum.

OBTW, add the costs of caring for AIDS patients to the already enormous
Federal debt and guess what.... (1000 points off if you miss that one
people ;-)).

I don't mean to ever make light of this epidemic.  For me it isn't a
light topic.  But I refuse to give in to views of certain groups who
have a hidden agenda or who are responding out of fear.  Fear is the
killer here because it is preventing the proper steps from being taken
to end this epidemic.

Regards,

Gene 

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