HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: slssf@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Insurance for visitors in Germany
Date: 15 Dec 92 11:33:20 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

Dear Friends

Hi,  I have been reading about all the discussions about trip to Germany and it
seems like one should have a lot of money to go there, if it is so expensive. 
Is it not possible to have an Economic trip to Germany for about 10 days? . 
I would like to know the minimum approximate cost of seeing the places in the
vicinity of Frankfurt, say about 100 miles. Is it very necessary to know German
language very well?. 

I would also like to know the cost of insurance for the students in their 20's.
and the insurance companies giving such insurance for Indian students.
I would appreciate your reply.

Thanks and Bye

JYOTSNA
------- 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: barba@patty.gud.siemens.co.at (Barbara Nowak-Teufl)
Subject: Re: Dialekt / Re: wienerisch dama redn
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 12:14:15 GMT
Organization: SIEMENS Austria Corp., A-1100 Wien, Gudrunstr. 11
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Eric Silber (silber@orfeo.Eng.Sun.COM) wrote:
> 
>  Apfel         Apple  Abfall        ??? -:)
>  allemanisch   platt  ostfriesisch

EZ. Opfe (offenes O)  
MZ. Oepfi  (Umlaut O)
west-niederoesterreichisch

Abfall ist mir als kleiner Apfel bekannt (Apferl - sprich Apfeal in Wien, 
Abfall mit eingerollter Zunge beim "l"). Vielleicht sind die Aepfel in
Ostfriesland so klein?

West-Niederoesterreichisch ist auch: Noewi (Nebel), Schnoe (langes Oe, Schnee)
West-niederoesterreichisch ist entfernt mit bayrisch verwandt, wienerisch
ist mit fraenkischer Mundart verwandt. Daneben gibt es bei uns noch die 
beruehmte, aber in unserer Zeit aussterbende Ui-Mundart im Weinviertel. 

Howdii (Mistelbacher) weiss da vielleicht, wie "Abfall" dort heisst ...

Ich wuesste gerne mehr ueber den Unterschied  zwischen Platt und 
ostfriesisch. Kann jemand mehr darueber posten?

Beste Gruesse! Baerbl
--
Barbara Nowak-Teufl 		barba@patty.gud.siemens.co.at
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: laufer@math.luc.edu (Konstantin Laufer)
Subject: Re: Help needed for survey about Germ. cities
Reply-To: laufer@math.luc.edu
Organization: Loyola University Chicago
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 17:35:51 GMT

In article <ALTI.92Dec14152758@campay.dcs.ed.ac.uk>, alti@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Thorsten Altenkirch) writes:
> In article <1992Dec12.221846.2641@ucselx.sdsu.edu> maxc0125@ucselx.sdsu.edu (Dennis Rubner) writes:
> 
>    Tally so far:     Munich      Hamburg    Cologne   Weisbaden  Duesseldorf
> 		      4            3          2          3           2
> 
> 		    Heidelberg
> 		      3
> 
> Strange result. Munich is for yuppies only. Berlin, the only place
> with a sufficient supply of crazy people (in german "freaks") to make
> it interesting doesn't appear. Who would go to Heidelberg or Wiesbaden
> (yawn - you must have boring friends).

I agree!  My votes go to Berlin (most dynamic) and Freiburg (best
weather and lots of other nice things).  Heidelberg (the *original*
Euro-Disneyland), Wiesbaden, and inflated Duesseldorf aren't that
terribly interesting.

I also wonder why Germany's cultural capital (Frankfurt) doesn't even
appear.

-- 
-Konstantin     "Sollen wir Ihren alten Pass gnaedigerweise gleich dabehalten?"
[laufer@math.luc.edu]  BRD-Konsularbeamtin, NYC, nach Annahme eines Passantrags
Loyola University Chicago	 (kein Beleg erhaeltlich, Wartezeit 3.5 Monate)

Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: Re: Freedom of speech WAS Re: Lawrence Godfrey
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 22:18:53 GMT

alti@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Thorsten Altenkirch) writes:

[...]
>Certainly no OPINION should be censored. But this does not imply that
>every act which just uses language is legitimate. I.e. [...]  if you
>offend other people then this is not considered as a mere expression
>of an opinion.
[...]

At least in the U.S., there is no recognized right-not-to-be-offended.


The Supreme Court wrote:

' ... The ability of government, consistent with the Constitution, to
shut off discourse solely to protect others from hearing it is, in
other words, dependent upon the showing that substantial privacy
interest are being invaded in an essentially intolerable manner. Any
broader view of this authority would effectively empower a majority to
silence dissidents simply as a matter of personal predilections." ...

- Carl

ANNOTATED REFERENCES

(All these documents are available on-line. Access information follows.)

=================
law/cohen-v-california.1
=================
* Expression -- Offensive -- Cohen v. California -- 1

Definition of "fighting words"; why no right not to be offended

The definition of fighting words from _Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire_
and then _Cohen v. California_. Also, says quotes the Supreme Court
saying that there is no universal right to not hear offensive
expression.

=================
law/cohen-v-california.2
=================
* Expression -- Offensive -- Cohen v. California -- 2

Netnews article with reference _Cohen v. California_, "in which the
court ruled that Cohen's jacket, which stated "Fuck the Draft" was a
protected form of free speech, even though he wore it in a county
courthouse."

=================
law/cohen-v-california.3
=================
* Expression -- Offensive -- Cohen v. California -- 3

Here are excerpts from several Supreme Court decisions inclusing
_Cohen v. Calfiornia_. They say that offensive public expression is
protected if those offended can "effectively avoid further bombardment
of their sensibilities simply by averting their eyes."

=================
=================

If you have gopher, you can browse the CAF archive with the command
   gopher gopher.eff.org

These document(s) are also available by anonymous ftp (the preferred
method) and by email. To get the file(s) via ftp, do an anonymous ftp
to ftp.eff.org (192.88.144.4), and get file(s):

  pub/academic/law/cohen-v-california.1
  pub/academic/law/cohen-v-california.2
  pub/academic/law/cohen-v-california.3

To get the file(s) by email, send email to archive-server@eff.org.
Include the line(s) (be sure to include the space before the file
name):

send acad-freedom/law cohen-v-california.1
send acad-freedom/law cohen-v-california.2
send acad-freedom/law cohen-v-california.3


-- 
Carl Kadie -- I do not represent any organization; this is just me.
 = kadie@cs.uiuc.edu =
From: 6500axel@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Axel Boldt)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Mehr Nachtgedanken
Date: 11 Dec 92 20:50:20 GMT
Reply-To: 6500axel@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu
Organization: Univ of California, Santa Barbara, Dept of Mathematics

lkv@mania.RoBIN.de (Lutz Vieweg) writes:

>In article <Byp3rE.Dvy@dscomsa.desy.de>, Till Poser  -  ZEUS OFFLINE writes:

>> |>Zugegeben, nicht gerade konstruktiv, aber vielleicht wuerde ihnen das
>> |>die Augen oeffnen. Habe gestern den Film "Salaam Bombay" ueber indische
>> |>Strassenkinder auf dem TV-Kanal 1Plus gesehen. Verdammt, haben wir es
>> |>gut hier!
>> 
>> Richtig! Und um das Essay im Spiegel zu zitieren: "Die Wuerde unserer Autos
>> und Urlaubsreisen ist unantastbar!" (sarkastisches Plakat auf der Berliner
>> Demo). Es geht um Besitzstandsverteidigung, und die Debatte ist schon vor
>> Jahren, auch mit dieser Argumentation, losgetreten worden, i.e. mit Floskeln
>> wie "Wirtschafts/Scheinasylanten", "drohende Voelkerwanderung" und so
>> weiter. 

Ich bin auch der Meinung: was wir momentan erleben, ist keine
"Auslaenderfeindlichkeit", auch kein "Rassismus"; es ist einfach der
Hass auf die Armen, die etwas vom Kuchen abhaben wollen.

>Wie Du das schreibst klingt es so, als ob du die "Besitzstandsverteidigung"
>nicht als legitimes Recht einer Gesellschaft ansiehst. Natuerlich
>kann man dieser Meinung sein, aber ich hoffe Du bist Dir im klaren
>darueber, dass eine Demokratie nie etwas anderes produzieren wird
>als eine Politik, die im weitesten Sinne ihren Besitzstand verteidigt.

...solange die Demokratie nicht im Weltmassstab eingefuehrt ist.
Immerhin machen wir fetten Pfeffersaecke nur ein mageres Viertel der
Weltbevoelkerung aus und wuerden locker ueberstimmt.

>Und wer darueber lamentiert, wie laecherlich gering doch die finanziellen
>Belastungen deutscher Steuerzahler im Vergleich zur Armut in weiten
>Teilen der restlichen Welt sind, der ziehe doch bitte als erster
>die Konsequenzen daraus, und teile seinen Wohlstand mit den Armen.

Ich denke, die korrekte Konsequenz ist, hoehere Belastungen zu
fordern. Ist das nicht logisch?

Axel.



--
"Wir haben das Problem der Ueberbevoelkerung. Aber nicht in der dritten
Welt. Ein Buerger eines Industrielandes traegt durchschnittlich 60
mal soviel zur Umweltzerstoerung bei wie einer eines Entwicklungslandes."






Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: alti@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Thorsten Altenkirch)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: What about "free" speech
Date: 17 Dec 92 17:50:51 GMT
Organization: LFCS, Edinburgh

In article <Dec.16.11.24.01.1992.18352@gandalf.rutgers.edu> deatz@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Gregory H Deatz) writes:

   I'm going to go into a larger realm now because I think some people
   are a little mistaken on the notion of free speech.

This sounds a bit arrogant. Do you think you have the one and only
right interpretation ?

I recently posted some articles (e.g. 10 Dec,11 Dec "Freedom of speech
WAS Re: Lawrence Godfrey") where I stated a position different from
yours. I am not sure whether your article is a reply to this, but
anyway I don't think you refute any of my arguments. In another
posting I actually said that it may be that there is a difference in
the anglo-saxon and german understanding of 'free speech' vs.
"Meinungsfreiheit".

   What does "free speech" mean exactly? It means FREE SPEECH. If I have
   something, possibly offensive, to say, I don't expect to be
   prosecuted/persecuted for it.

This is certainly a simplification. If you tell somebody "Kill him!"
then you may be accused of murder although it is just something you
have said. Now what is, if an influential person, e.g. a religious
leader, says this person (e.g. Salman Rushdie) or this group of people
deserve to die. Is this still "free speech"? Next step: what if
somebody says "The niggers will rape your wifes" & some simpleminded
people get the idea it is better to lynch them before they have time
to do it? Where is the line? 

Words can be violence! 

--

 Thorsten Altenkirch         	And there's a hand, my trusty fiere,
 Laboratory for Foundations  	   And gie's a hand o' thine,
 of Computer Science 	      	And we'll tak a right guid-willie waught
 University of Edinburgh     	   For auld lang syne!
From: J.Theodore.Schuerzinger@dartmouth.edu (J. Theodore Schuerzinger)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Spiegel public opinion poll (long)
Date: 12 Dec 92 15:11:02 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

I believe the word 'Selbstaendige' refers to self-employed people, but
I'm not positive.

Also, since I'm not from Germany, what is the normal retirement age for
Germans?

--Ted Schuerzinger
email: .zed@Dartmouth.EDU
"I should have realized it would be bad vodka when all the label said
was 'Russian Vodka'."
From: mike@horus.ap.mchp.sni.de (Mike Hoffmann)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Minister C. Schwarz-Schilling resigns over row with Kohl****
Date: 17 Dec 1992 14:10:43 +0100
Organization: Siemens-Nixdorf AG, AP 712
NNTP-Posting-Host: horus.ap.mchp.sni.de

In article <1992Dec17.112447.26492@bernina.ethz.ch> mitrovic@tik.ethz.ch (Srdjan Mitrovic) writes:
>The political commentaries sound somewhat different. It was thought that 
>the post minister (without success) will be replaced in the next time.
>It seems that it was only a coward way to get out before he was kicked out.

You may well be right.

I newspaper and TV news analysts are right, he was indeed targeted for
replacement. And it would be understandable.

He was a standing joke among the "hackers" and "netters" in Germany:
Minister Black-Penny.

His blatant abuse of the postal services to advertise products of his
own family businesses. (People received leaflets that advertised products
of the "Sonnenschein" company, owned by the Schwarz-Schilling family, with
their phone bills. At least I did. Too bad I didn't keep them... :-)

The dismal situation of the Bundespost with his half-hearted "reforms"
and "privatization".

I personally find it tasteless to use the abominable situation in B-H
as excuse for bailing out. He had a long time to do so before. He does so
now, hoping that the gullible public will applaud him.

Just my $0.02
Mike
-- 
Mike Hoffmann - Internet Administrator, Siemens-Nixdorf AG, SNI AP 712  
INTERNET: Mike.Hoffmann@ap.mchp.sni.de
"I don't think we're in Riyadh anymore." - US-Marine in Somalia
From: godfrey@vxdesy.desy.de
Subject: Re: German troops to Somalia??? Turkish troops to Germany
Organization: (DESY, Hamburg, Germany)
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 05:01:04 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.070230.6674@arbi.Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>, Onno.Meyer@arbi.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de (Onno Meyer) writes:
> Our gouvernment wants to send 1500 troops to Somalia. They want to send
> not only transport, medical and technical units but also some infantry
> to protect them.
> 
I'd like to see Turkey sending some of its troops into Germany to protect
its citizens, as your police seem to be incapable of doing so.  Would that
be okay with you?

Laurence

Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: Allan Phillips <allanp@BNR.CA (INTERNET)>
Subject: Re: How racit are the germans?
X-Xxdate: Wed, 16 Dec 92 16:38:49 GMT
Organization: Northern Telecom
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 21:38:25 GMT

In article <1gno8tINNnbl@meaddata.meaddata.com> Kai Rudloff,
kai@meaddata.com writes:
>I'd say that some of the comments above makes you a racist yourself. By
>your actions (actually inactions), it seems as though you've changed
>your mind about the Germans and labeled them all as racists. Since
>you've concluded that they are racists you've decided to discriminate
>against the whole race, and not the actual people who cause the
>problem. I'm white and have been subjected to anti-white/western
>violence by some Arabs, but I don't hold that against the whole race of
>people, only those who have caused me the suffering.

Well bully for you!  The beauty of your humanity is only uglied by the
fact that you would rather label someone else racist, yourself pure and
deny them the opprotunity to change. Answer the question first!  Then
judge, but keep these silly commentaries silenced until you have at more
than three lines of a hastily written question to use in making
judgements.

I would also like to hear some intelligent responses to the initial
question.
Thanks in advance to all those who reply.

Allan Phillips
"Whose opinions are rarely his own but never his employers!"

"Hell, sure you can take a number, can't hurt,
  since I have no intention of talking to you anyway".
From: fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Information for trip to Germany...
Date: 12 Dec 92 16:24:21 GMT
Organization: CompuData Inc.

rschoen@laborixsai.mathematik.uni-ulm.de (Reinhard Schoen) writes:

>Autobahn-Raststaetten are for people who desperately need fuel, food,
>coffee, etc.

I thought it was for people who travel along the road and don't want to get 
off at a strange city and not find their way to anywhere just to get a quick 
pick-me-up.


> That's why the prices are that high. If you live in a city,
>you rather go to a cafe than driving to the next Autobahn.

Obviously. But I was speaking specifically about the Autobahn.

>I use to
>pay some DM 3 for a cup of coffee, DM 5 for a soup, DM 12 for a large
>pizza. What are the prices in Beverly, NJ, like?

Well, Beverly is one of the smallest cities in NJ. NJ has the highest 
population density in the US but it is called the Garden State. We have approx 
800 houses in our town. There is one Chinese restaurant and one other place 
that is hanging on. I've never been to the latter. The Chinese has coffee for 
$.60 but we always drink tee which comes in a bottomless pot and is part of 
the meal. A good full meal from the high end of the price list will be 
somewhere between $9 & $12 per person. For $6 I can get a very nice full meal. 

Actually most of the restaurants around here are along the more heavily 
travelled roads. You could not eat here without a car. :-)

BTW the pizza prices would be about the same in converted funds. Soup is 
definately cheaper here.

Fred



>I heard it is usual in USA to get your coffee cup refilled for free.
>I'd appreciate German restaurants to do so!

>REinhard
>__________________________________________________________
>    Reinhard Schoen          rschoen@mathematik.uni-ulm.de
>     Bruehlstr. 19
>      7900 Ulm 12         If at first you don't succeed,
>        GERMANY        destroy all evidence you ever tried.
-- 
W. Fred Rump 	office:	   fred@COMPU.COM     'mans feet have grown/so big 
26 Warren St.   home: fred@icdi10.compu.com  that he/forgets his littleness'
Beverly, NJ. 08010                          		Don Marquis 
609-386-6846    bang:uunet!cdin-1!icdi10!fr
From: veit@Unify.com (Veit Irtenkauf)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Autobahn-Raststaetten (Was: Information for trip to Germany...)
Date: 15 Dec 92 18:52:38 GMT
Organization: Unify Corporation (Sacramento)

In article <1992Dec12.162421.9516@compu.com>, fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home) writes:
> rschoen@laborixsai.mathematik.uni-ulm.de (Reinhard Schoen) writes:
> 
> >Autobahn-Raststaetten are for people who desperately need fuel, food,
> >coffee, etc.
> 
> I thought it was for people who travel along the road and don't want to get 
> off at a strange city and not find their way to anywhere just to get a quick 
> pick-me-up.

In the US, everybody knows that the major fast-food chains (including
Dennys aso.), gas stations and hotel / motel / inn chains are always 
located next to highways.  It's very convenient just to take an exit 
and find a whole variety of gas-stations, restaurants and motels 
(if you are into it).  They only have few Autobahn-Raststaetten in
not so populated areas.
In Germany, it's opposite, although fast food chains start to build
restaurants close to the Autobahn, and there are some cheaper gas
stations next to Autobahn exits, too.  But still, if I went for a
longer distance on the Autobahn and didn't have time to exit and
search for a restaurant, I stopped at the Autobahn-Raststaette.  I
normally drove off the highway and into a town, if I was in need for
a bed.  My normal rule was that I stayed away from the Autobahn to
search for a hotel.
Not in the US.  I remember how I once searched around in Carlsbad, CA
to find a hotel at the beach.  Impossible.  I just had to go back to
the interstate and found the usual variety of hotels.

> 
> >I heard it is usual in USA to get your coffee cup refilled for free.
> >I'd appreciate German restaurants to do so!
> 
Not only coffee.  In all Californian restaurants you get also refills,
if you drink tea or ice-tea, and in some restaurants, you get refills
for all soft-drinks, including Coke.  If you stop at fast-food
restaurants like Carl's Jr., that have "Softdrink Bars", you can
always refill your glass (actually your styrofoam cup) before you
leave the restaurant.  This is also the reason why I never order a 
large Coke there -- it's cheaper to buy a small and refill it :^)

-- Veit


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Veit Irtenkauf    Technical Marketing Manager  |  email: veit@unify.Com
Unify Corporation                              |  voice: (916) 928-6322
3901 Lennane Drive, Sacramento, CA 95834-1922  |    fax: (916) 928-6406
From: deatz@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Gregory H Deatz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: What about "free" speech
Date: 18 Dec 92 14:10:45 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

alti@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Thorsten Altenkirch) writes:

>In article <Dec.16.11.24.01.1992.18352@gandalf.rutgers.edu> deatz@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Gregory H Deatz) writes:

>   I'm going to go into a larger realm now because I think some people
>   are a little mistaken on the notion of free speech.

>This sounds a bit arrogant. Do you think you have the one and only
>right interpretation ?

>This is certainly a simplification. If you tell somebody "Kill him!"
>then you may be accused of murder although it is just something you
>have said. Now what is, if an influential person, e.g. a religious
>leader, says this person (e.g. Salman Rushdie) or this group of people
>deserve to die. Is this still "free speech"? Next step: what if
>somebody says "The niggers will rape your wifes" & some simpleminded
>people get the idea it is better to lynch them before they have time
>to do it? Where is the line? 

>Words can be violence! 

Is it a simplification? Words are not violence; only action. A command used
                                                     ^^^^^^
in the context of action IS action; however, "The niggers will rape your

wives" is something that is hate language, not necessarily action language.

NO ONE wants to see bigots riot and lynch the people they hate, but it is

UNJUST to stop their speech when it is in a peaceable context.
                                            ^^^^^^^^^
This is all I have to say to you to defend my thoughts on the matter.
You accuse me of being arrogant for having expressed my thoughts--ok, so I'm
arrogant. I won't launch a crusade against you, though; if you disagree with
me, fine, just keep your greivances with my opinions out of the name calling
range.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: olaf@tpki.toppoint.de (Olaf Schlueter)
Subject: Re: Asylrecht 
Organization: Toppoint Mailbox e.V.
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 13:18:13 GMT

dennis@metw3.met.fu-berlin.de (Dennis Schulze) writes:

>In <4286@elwood.prz.tu-berlin.de> jost@runner.prz.tu-berlin.de (Jost) writes:

>>Nachdem es sonst keiner schreibt: 
>>am sonntag haben sich die beiden grossen parteien geeinigt, den 
>>asylrechts-paragraphen zu aendern. die aenderung sieht so aus, 
>>dass niemand, der aus der EG oder einem nichtverfolgerstaat 
>>in D-land eintrifft, einen asylantrag stellen darf, sondern 
>>gleich zurueckgewiesen wird. aus dem ausland darf er dann sein 
>>asylrecht einklagen. (damit wurde die SPD gekauft, weil weiterhin
>>"individuelles asylrecht" besteht)

>Man kann es auch netter ausdruecken, was den Punkt sicherlich besser
>trift als dieses 'wurde gekauft'. Endlich haben die Parteien in 
>Deutschland bewiesen, dass sie durchaus faehig sind, Probleme zu loesen
>und dabei auch mal zusammenzuarbeiten und einen Kompromiss zu finden. 
>Dass dabei einige Punkte, die urspruenglich gefordert wurden, auf der
>Strecke bleiben, ist doch klar (sonst hiesse es ja nicht Kompromiss und
>man braeuchte gar nicht verhandeln, gell :-).

Der SPD-Parteitagsbeschluss war ein Kompromiss, die jetzt
erfolgte Einigung ist eine Realisierung der CSU-Position. Eine
wahre Glanzleistung von Engholms Klose.

>Warum stellt denn derjenige, der ueber Landweg einreist, nicht schon einen
>Antrag im ersten Land, in dem er nach der Genfer Fluechtlingskonvention etc.
>aufgenommen wird?

Dazu sollte erwaehnt werden, dass die Genfer
Fluechtlingskonvention kein Recht auf Einreise garantiert. D.
h., es werden zwar Konventionen im Umgang mit im Lande
befindlichen Fluechtlingen festgelegt, es gibt aber keinen
Rechtsanspruch eines Fluechtlings darauf, ins Land eingelassen
zu werden. Daher gibt es auch keinen "Antrag auf Anerkennung
als Fluechtling gemaess der GFK." Darueber zu entscheiden, wer
ins Land gelassen wird, das ist weiterhin dem jeweiligen
Souveraen ueberlassen.

Es war eines der wesentlichen Ziele der Regierung im
Asylstreit, eine Moeglichkeit zu erhalten, die Leute bereits an
der Grenze abweisen zu koennen. Die hat sie jetzt. Damit sind
die Grenzen dicht.

-- 
Olaf Schlueter, Sandkuhle 4-6, 2300 Kiel 1, Germany, Toppoint Mailbox e.V.
olaf@tpki.toppoint.de
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