HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rod@cats.ucsc.edu (Rodrick Su)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Kay's Mulitverse: Tigana & Fionavar
Date: 31 Aug 92 05:01:38 GMT
Organization: Tigana Restoration Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: am.ucsc.edu


In article <9208211919.AA13210@noc2.dccs.upenn.edu> write:
>
>     I'm surprised that people are so timid in their analogies between
>Tigana and Renaissance Italy.  Kay says in the forward of _Tigana_ that he
>studied Italian history to prepare for the book.  Actually, the parallel goes
>a good deal further: Kay simply turned the globe upside down and replaced the
>boot of Italy by the glove of Tigana.  It was a particularly nice touch that
>on the map at the front of the book, the compass has South marked off
>instead of North as is customary in our world - if you replace the S by an N,
>then the geography fits that of the Mediterranean pretty well: Ygrath is
>Egypt, Khardun is Carthage (Tunis), Chiara is Sicily, and I have been trying
>to figure out where the Barbadians come from and who the Quileians (sp?) are.

	I have always thought that though geography are flipped, some remains
	the same.  I think that Barbadians are suppose to be either Byzenteen
	or Ottoman Empire.  

	On the part of Ygrath, I though that it was modeled after France,
	with its particuliar strong monarach.

	Quileians could be either the Swiss or the Germans.  I have a leaning
	for the Germans, for its long years of disunity, sort of like the
	rules of the High Priestess.

>The Barbadians could be Iberian (Spanish), though that seems to be something
>of a stretch.  What I'd like to know is whether there is a clear parallel
>between the various city-states of Italy and the sections of Tigana.

>     On another note, I think people haven't paid enough attention to why
>Brandin invaded Tigana in the first place: he invaded to provide his son
>with a kingdom of his own to rule.  Brandin clearly loved his (older) son
								^^^
						Correction, younger son,
				whom, he would love to give the throne to,
				but couldn't due to the custom.  Thus, he 					goes and carved out another kingdom for his
				younger son


-- 
[ Rodrick Su           ]-----------------------------------------------------] 
[----------------------[ A bomb lives only as it is falling.		     ] 
[ rod@cats.ucsc.edu    ]------------------------[ ``Use of Weapons''         ] 
[ rod@ucscb.ucsc.edu   ]------------------------[   Iain M. Banks            ]
-- 
[ Rodrick Su           ]-----------------------------------------------------] 
[----------------------[ A bomb lives only as it is falling.		     ] 
[ rod@cats.ucsc.edu    ]------------------------[ ``Use of Weapons''         ] 
[ rod@ucscb.ucsc.edu   ]------------------------[   Iain M. Banks            ]
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:11697 rec.arts.sf.misc:2791
From: ecl@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Evelyn C. Leeper)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Prometheus Award Winners Wanted
Date: 2 Sep 92 16:48:45 GMT
Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.misc
Organization: AT&T

Could someone tell me what won the Prometheus Award in 1988 and 1990
(regular award and Hall of Fame)?  This is an award given out by the
Libertarians, and I'm trying to get a complete list for the SFL
archives.

E-mail to me would be best (since I will be on vacation for the next
couple of weeks).  I will post the complete list of winners to the Net
when I get back.

Evelyn C. Leeper  |  +1 908 957 2070  |  att!mtgzy!ecl or  ecl@mtgzy.att.com
--
"IQ describes how big your gas tank is, but it doesn't tell if you're
running on empty." -- Harvey Newstrom (hnewstro@x102c.ess.harris.com)
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:11741 rec.arts.sf.science:2809
From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (jerry cullingford)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.science
Subject: Re: Are the Moties us?
Date: 4 Sep 92 12:48:22 GMT
Organization: Crosfield Electronics, Hemel Hempstead, United Kingdom.

In article <BtyCK2.JtD@newcastle.ac.uk> A.J.Gunn@newcastle.ac.uk (A. Gunn) writes:
>Hi
>
>Actually there is a remarkably high prevalence of myopia in the general
>population; so high in fact that it seems to me that it is unlikely to
>have arisen only since industrial grade civilisation. Moreover it is
>potently correlated with intelligence.... count how many of your collegues
>wear glasses.
>        Three hypotheses spring to mind, all unproven:
>1. the opthalomologist's  view: bright kids read too much & screw up their
>vision.

Hmm.. how about

(4) Short sighted kids don't do as well in games, since they don't have as
clear a view of what's going on, and so are more likely to concentrate on
shorter-range activities (like reading), and therefore do better academically?

OTOH, I'm not sure that looking at your colleagues is a valid sampling
technique :-) :-)


-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------+     |
| Jerry Cullingford  #include <std.disclaimer> +44 442 230000 x3868|   ,-|--
| jc@crosfield.co.uk (jc@cel.uucp) or jc@selune.demon.co.uk        |   \_|__
+-----(Work)---------------------------------(home)----------------+ \___/
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig)
Subject: Doris Egan: Guilt-Edged Ivory
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 92 07:20:03 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

I had fun reading this book.  This is the third book in the adventures 
of an outlander trying to adapt to a society where it's good manners
to eat some of a guest's food -- to show that you haven't poisoned it.
The best thing about the book, as with its predecessors, is the droll
and engaging narration.

I consider Egan's first book "Gate of Ivory", to be her best, but 
"Guilt-Edged Ivory" is almost as good.  It's worth giving one of them
a try.

-----
Dani Zweig
dani@netcom.com

   'T is with our judgements as our watches, none
   Go alike, yet each believes his own
		--Alexander Pope
From: sieler@cup.portal.com (stanley richard sieler)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Magic in "our" world
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 92 23:07:44 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: na

Hi...does anyone have a list of stories dealing with magic in the
otherwise real world?  I know there is a Poul Anderson story (whose
title I would like to remember), Leiber's Conjure Wife, RAH's Magic, Inc,
and others... I am not interested in modern horror, but the somewhat
softer works like those above.

email to:  sieler@allegro.com    would be appreciated.  I'll post a
summary after MagicCon (appropriate, eh?)

thanks,
stan sieler
sieler@allegro.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (Jim Puckett)
Subject: Octavia Butler question
Organization: NASA/MSFC
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 12:42:14 GMT


Yes, another one of those 'What is the name of...'

What is the name of the Octavia Butler sequel to _Dawn_? I read it
a couple of years ago, not knowing that it was a sequel (now _that_'s
a well done sequel !8-)...you remember, the alien critters who forced
genetic trades in response for saving the world? (No, that is _not_ aa
spoiler - the cover blurb says as much!)

(email please - folks are jealous of bandwidth!)
puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov

thanks,
jim p.

-- 
Jim Puckett    NTI    puckett@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov     
Huntsville,AL (205)461-4922  
This life is a test. It is only a test. If it had been a real life, you 
would have been given instructions....
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: curtis@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Curtis Yarvin)
Subject: Re: Bland Prejudice (was Re: Wolvertons "On My Way to Paradise)
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 22:04:38 GMT

In article <17geo7INN8m5@agate.berkeley.edu> cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu () writes:
>In article <1992Aug25.215445.23279@pbhyc.PacBell.COM> djdaneh@PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes) writes:
>>
>>Is there any particular reason for avoiding them -- other than "Ooooh, they 
>>took money from Scientology, they must be in Scientology's pocket?"  Gimme a 
>>fuckin' break.  Look at the list of judges for any given volume.  Are you
>>really convinced that (e.g.) Fredrik Pohl, Gene Wolfe, Anne McCaffrey, 
>>Ramsey Campbell, Niven, Pournelle, Norton et al., are *all* Scientology dupes?
>
>No.  Only that they are willing to share space with a name I wouldn't be
>willing to share space with.

Good lord!  Not only are you unwilling to "share space" with 'that
name,' you even do verbal jukes around _mentioning_ it.  What's the
fear?  Is the "Great Leader" even now hovering in Theta Space,
waiting for unwary Gentiles to utter the Name that Must Not Be
Said so he can swoop down to Earth, squat on your keyboard,
and intone "Clear Macht Frei" in messianic tones as He hoses
your brain down with Drano?

>>Or perhaps entering the contest means you're a talentless dweeb?
>
>No.  Only that you're willing to share space with ... (see above).

Come on, now, be reasonable.  "Share space?"  Okay, Bridge
Publications are scum.  But are they that much worse than 
your average publishing company?  Perhaps - but do you worry
about the latter?  Have you checked the Wall Street records
to see if Bantam is secretly controlled by a cabal of Satanists?
Are there suspicious numbers of Mormons in the upper stories\
of Random House?  Is Doubleday a Christian front?  If you
haven't wondered, don't go bawling about Bridge.

Scientology scares me.  It scares any reasonable person.
But burying your head in the sand is no answer at all.

c
From: slg7m@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Books on Magic vs Science 
Date: 27 Aug 92 21:51:10 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <27AUG199216475984@reg.triumf.ca>, advax@reg.triumf.ca (A.Daviel) writes:
> Re. The Flying Sorcerers, by Niven and someone else (maybe Brin), Shoogar the 
						       ~~~~~~~~~~
							David Gerrold

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: bobm@Ingres.COM (Bob McQueer)
Subject: Re: Gormenghast
Distribution: na
Date: 2 Sep 92 21:10:32 GMT

In <71911@apple.Apple.COM>,
	dated 2 Sep 92 04:30:23 GMT,
	stef@Apple.COM (Stef Jones) writes:

> Yes, I felt the same way about Gormenghast. I thought I was the only person
> who had ever read it, though. :-)
 
> However, I was not able to finish the third book. Did anyone finish it, and
> did it finish well? I heard (OK, so I did meet one other person who read
> it) that the third book sort of trailed off into proto-schizoid musings
> (this person said Peake went bonkers by the end, dunno if it is true but I
> wouldn't be surprised).

Fairly good description.  When I hand out reccomendations for Gormenghast
I always say to read it as a two book series and not bother with the third
volume.  The second book has a very satisfactory climax and ending for the
series.  Of course, most of us who liked the first two will be curious
enough to go on to the third - but don't say you weren't warned.

Peake manages some of the richest descriptive language I've ever read.  By
modern standards, the story may be a bit slow moving and a trifle "gothic",
but Peake's incredible descriptions and internal dialogues make it worth it
for me.  I'm not sure whether Peake's setting is so bizarre and original,
or whether his richly textured language makes it seem so.
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:11531 rec.org.sca:12295
From: Robert.Turner@brunel.ac.uk (Robert Turner)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: COVINGTON CROSS
Date: 27 Aug 92 06:52:34 GMT
Organization: Brunel University, West London, UK

schrey@prc.unisys.com writes:=
%In article <BtLoD5.M1t@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca>, aryk@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca (A.J.S. Nusbacher) writes:
%|> 
%|> Now that seems awfully uncharitable.  What did you expect from American
%|> television?  Oh, and you missed the main obvious comparison:  90210.
%|> 
%   Covington Cross is actually made in Britain, albeit for the American market.

It is made in Britain, with a British cast, but BY an american company -
therefore it is made entirely to american standards. However, it is
being shown over here on monday (a bank holiday) and the article in our
TV guide says that the writer was more interested in making good
television rather than accurate television.

Rob

-- 
 _________________________________________________________________________
/                            |                                            \
|   Rob Turner, PC Support   |     email : Robert.Turner@brunel.ac.uk     |
|   Brunel University        |                                            |
|   London, England          | .... where no man has gone before (again). |
\____________________________|____________________________________________/
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: nickh@CS.CMU.EDU (Nick Haines)
Subject: Re: Jack Vance Bibliography
Originator: nickh@VOILA.VENARI.CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:40:57 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.113447.19886@cs.ruu.nl> jjverkui@cs.ruu.nl (Hans Verkuil) writes:

[...]

   Vance, Jack [/John] [Holbrook] [U.S.A., 8/28/1916- ]

[...]

	   Servants of the Wankh [1969] [aka "Wankh"]      0-934438-22-6 U-M
							   0-87997-467-2 DAW

... published under another title in the UK, of course. :-)

[...]

Nick
From: whit@milton.u.washington.edu (John Whitmore)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: What are the best fantasy books involving dragons?
Date: 25 Aug 92 22:47:42 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle


	You should consider _Grendel_ by John Gardner (the good
John Gardner, not the Fleming facsimile).  
	When asked (by Grendel) how to be happy, the dragon
replies (quite sensibly)

	"Get lots of gold and jewels and sit on them.  But, not
MY gold and jewels."

	John Whitmore
From: joak@ocf.berkeley.edu (Jonathan A. Kung)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Continuing Time Potential Movie
Date: 29 Aug 1992 05:05:33 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: tsunami.berkeley.edu
Keywords: Continuing Time Trent Long Run NeveractuallygottoreadEmeraldEyes

Wonder if such a movie would be live-action (might be hokey), or
animated (might actually live up to the book(s) - dunno about EE,
since I haven't found it anywhere yet).  I prefer animated,
mostly so people won't get into lengthy debates as to who would
be best suited to playing which character.

-Jon Kung, no longer the silent minority!
From: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Blind Prejudice
Date: 27 Aug 92 16:12:53 GMT
Reply-To: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Organization: The Wistar Institute of Anatomy and Biology
In-reply-to: dac@prolix.pub.uu.oz.au (Andrew Clayton)

No, not blind.  It's wide open prejudice.  I don't have time to read
everybody, so I make liberal use of KILL files, both on and off USENET.
On a hair trigger setting, deliberately.

Given the right evidence that it's worthwhile, I'll reconsider.  I
refused to read Baen Books for years, on the strength of their self
promotion as dependably unoriginal, but finally read some V Vinge
and G R R Martin.
-- 
-Matthew P Wiener (weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu)
From: mcirvin@husc8.harvard.edu (Mcirvin)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Retro-optimist depression (was Re: Vinge's singularity)
Date: 31 Aug 92 00:31:28 GMT

mwasson@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Michael Wasson) writes:

>  In fact, I was just reading a [science] book about space travel written
>in 1954? 55? A year or so pre-Sputnik. It's full of statements like 
>"within our lifetimes--perhaps within 20 years--Mars will have been
>colonized" and "the first step will be a permanently manned space station
>with ferries to and from Luna." I got depressed reading it! Such optimism
>and so little of it has come to pass...

I just got the same feeling reading James Blish's _Cities in Flight_
series, the first book (published in 1957) in particular.  A
couple of characters are having a conversation in the year 2013,
and they're very depressed.  It seems that space travel is practically
moribund; there hasn't been any fundamental progress in space 
exploration since the permanently manned station on Titan started 
operation in the 1980s. 

What Blish clearly sees as a less than optimal scenario is actually
beyond our current wildest dreams.  And Blish is certainly not
starry-eyed in general.  He portrays an America increasingly
dominated by religious fundamentalists and the FBI, becoming
"Sovietized" in response to a Cold War that continues into the
twenty-first century, leading inexorably to Communist domination
of the planet.  The West's only recourse is escape into space. 

Blish is great anyway.
-- 
Matt McIrvin, Cambridge, Massachusetts, USA 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: ndj20710@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Nathan D. Johnson)
Subject: Re: Continuing Time
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:32:43 GMT

etroup@robin.rp.csiro.au (Euan Troup, AT Parkes.) writes:
>        There _is_ a problem with this scenario - There's a quote from Melissa
>        duBois in the  'Exodus Bible' which says:
>                "It happened as you have heard it.
>                "I was there."

>        So the PKF really do think Trent walks through walls. And they're the
>ones who'd try to find any plausible explanation. The quote is at the beginning
>of chapter 15 of the section called 'The Wall - 2069-2070 Gregorian'. (Hey -
>I've just noticed a quote here which says that miracles occur only among people
>disposed to believe in miracles - and the PKF are mostly Catholic - make of it
>what you will, but I know that this is one of the reasons why I enjoyed this
>book a lot, and I'm desperate to read the new ones. I may even consider buying
>the hardcovers and bugger the balance of payments.


>>The two big problems that I have with the hologram of Trent problem, which I
>>will need answers to before I can consider your solution, are:
>>1  Where is Trent after he leaves the elevator?
>>2  Why does he make the comment about how far it is from the meeting room to
>>the airlock?
>>I would look at these in context more, to see if I could find a solution, but
>>I don't have my copy.
>>       Nate.
>>

>Euan Troup,     etroup@atnf.csiro.au
>..mostly harmless                      Disclaimer: I frame no hypotheses.
Well, since Daniel Keys Moran himself has said it is wrong, and since I did
not recall the quote by Ms. duBois, I will, concede that I was wrong, and, as
promised shut up.
Nate

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: areid@mary.fordham.edu (Darin Reid)
Subject: John Norman's "Gor" novels
Organization: Fordham University
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 18:48:00 GMT
X-Posted-From: mary.fordham.edu
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

I picked up Some of the Gor novels at a buck apiece some time ago,  I just 
started reading them and like them alot.  I have vols. 1-4,6-8,10, and 18.

What I would like some kind soul to tell me is: How many Gor novels are there?
If possible I'd like the amount, their titles listed (in volume order if 
you're feeling nice), and hey why not shoot for the Moon, a brief synopsis of
them all.  BTW, I've read vols. 1-3 already.

Thanks for any help at all!

- Darin
____________________________________________________________________________
Areid@Mary.Fordham.Edu || Dreid@Nyx.Cs.Du.Edu || Bz809@Cleveland.Freenet.Edu

Bitnet:areid@fordmulc.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: disaacs@pietrzak.carleton.ca (Dave Isaacs)
Subject: Re: Fourth Giants book out
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 21:12:44 GMT

In <Bu0CsM.6us@helios.physics.utoronto.ca> neufeld@helios.physics.utoronto.ca (Christopher Neufeld) writes:

>   A few weeks ago I posted a message that the fourth Giants book,
>_Entoverse_, by James P. Hogan was scheduled to be out in paperback in
>October, at least in Canada. Well, it's on the shelves now.
>   What did I remember seeing just this week about how books are released
>a month before they are scheduled?

I don't know what you saw, but regarding Entoverse, I saw it appear in
the bookstores in Ottawa November 1991, so I don't see how it could be
released in October.

-- 
__________________________________________________________________________
 ____  ____  __  David Paul Isaacs ________________________________________
 _____ _____ __  Department of Mechanical and Aerospace Engineering ________
 _____ ____  __  Carleton University ________________________________________
 ____  __    __  Ottawa, Ontario ___________________________________________
_________________disaacs@ccs.carleton.ca __________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.science
From: richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin)
Subject: Re: Are the Moties us?
Organization: Carp Systems International, Kanata, ON
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 19:24:18 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.010817.9369@oracle.us.oracle.com> mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
>In article <1992Aug21.210952.29951@csi.on.ca> richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug20.171010.14926@oracle.us.oracle.com> mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
>>>In article <42gy7qm@rpi.edu> kasprj@rpi.edu writes:
>>>This statement is frankly ludicrous.
>
>>>Are you going to suggest that intelligence is not genetic?  If it
>>>isn't then please explain why proper upbringing can't turn a horse
>>>into a savant.
>
>>This is a ridiculous comparison.  Intelligence is *not* genetic.
>
>If so, then how did proto-humans evolve greater intelligence?
>
>>Very, very few reputable psychologists or geneticists would suggest
>>this.  It is a laughable proposition.  Why can't proper upbringing
>>turn a horse into a savant?  Ah ha ha ha!  Oh ho ho ho!
>>Sheesh!
>>Perhaps, maybe just perhaps, because a horse is not a human 
>
>Once again, may I respectfully point out that the differences between
>a horse and a human are genetic?
>
>>Ok, a slight admission.  The genetic make up of an individual *may*
>>have some *slight* influence on the intelligence of that individual.
>
>May?  Are you seriously suggesting that there is even the slightest
>chance that it may not?
>
Ok, I'm sorry if tempers are flaring here.  Yes intelligence is genetic.
But...
Differences in intelligence amongst humans can hardly be attributed to
genetic traits.  (Yes, some cases of (what is the PC term nowadays?)
developmentally challenged humans are due to genetic defects.  This is
generally due to chromosomal problems--crossing of chromosomes, failure
to separate during meiosis, etc.  As I said before, I don't think you 
can be born a genius.)  As to the "may" comment.  I am not certain of
these things--I am not a doctor, not a true student of genetics, nor
a psychologist.  But I believe that the greatest portion of the
development of a human being (including intelligence) may be attributed
to environmental factors.  If otherwise, surely we would be much, much
more intelligent today than we were even a millenium ago.  We're not
evolving that quickly.  (Invalid argument--not discussing whether
evolving or not; discussing whether intelligence is genetic trait.)
No argument:  intelligence is genetic.
But:  in humans, environmental factors play greater part in making
differences twixt individuals.
Richard.
-- 
Richard Martin               	richard@csi.on.ca
If I had anything witty to say, I wouldn't put it here.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: dave@cs.sfu.ca (Dave Peters)
Subject: Re: Tarot sf and fantasy
Summary: Charles Williams' "The Greater Trumps"
Keywords: williams,tarot
Organization: CSS, Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 22:20:40 GMT

 Another book that should be considered for addition to the list of
books-regarding-the-tarot is Charles Williams' "The Greater Trumps".
A little hard perhaps, for those used to reading Anthony :-), but 
an interesting work nonetheless.
 d

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.org.sca