HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: marti@inf.ethz.ch (Robert Marti)
Subject: Re: AutoWeek on Patrese's crash
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 19:46:36 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.141647.29566@aa.cad.slb.com>
wilson@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (David Wilson) writes:
>The account [in AutoSport]
>also stated that Berger knew before exiting the previous corner that
>he was going to pit.  He claimed that the g-forces made it impossible
>to raise his arm to warn Patrese.  [ ... ]
>As it was taught to me at driving school, raising one's
>hand before deliberately slowing is basic etiquette in all racing series.

I agree with that, but ...

>While I am generally inclined to look at situations with an eye to the
>complications facing the drivers, rather than assuming them wrong, this
>is one case where I could agree with some sort of sanction against
>Berger.  He admitted that slowing to pit was deliberate and planned.
>He admitted he didn't signal in any way.  The excuse why doesn't cut it.
>By the time of the contact the corner was long since completed -- the
>g-forces had subsided.  If the pit entrance WAS too close to the
>corner's exit to permit time for a signal (and reaction time for the
>following driver), he was obligated to signal earlier if necessary.
>
>Guilty.

Have you ever driven an F1 car at speed at Estoril?  What is your personal
record?

In any case, Karl Wendlinger said that he does not know of a single
instance of an F1 driver raising his arm before entering the pits
this season.  Neither do I.


-- 
Robert Marti                        Phone:    +41 1 254 72 60
Institut fur Informationssysteme
ETH-Zentrum                         Internet: marti@inf.ethz.ch
CH-8092 Zurich, Switzerland         UUCP:     ...uunet!mcvax!ethz!marti
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Denny Hulme: Address&Fax
From: ljw@nacjack.gen.nz (Lawrence Wilkinson)
Date: 6 Oct 92 21:49:30 GMT
Organization: Malleus Maleficarum - Nil Mortifi Sine Lucre


Messages and cards, etc., for the family of Denny Hulme can be
sent to:

P O Box 8829
Symonds St
Auckland
NEW ZEALAND

or faxed to:
+64 9 309-1559

There is to be a Memorial Service, tentatively scheduled for November
10th (two days after the Australian GP), in Auckland.


============== ljw@nacjack.gen.nz ============== CI$ 72070,3440 ==============
There's nothing so simple that works so well that it can't    --o--      F-Atl
be made to work better by making it more complicated.       []=(_)=[]   TTAGGG
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: tlm1@Ra.MsState.Edu (Terry Matula)
Subject: Re: Davey Allison, Salesman
Organization: Mississippi State University
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 22:36:20 GMT

okay, race drivers spotted on the HOME SHOPPING CLUB...

Davey Allison
Darrell Waltrip
Dale Earnhardt
Kyle Petty
Benny Parsons

(Benny and Kyle were on together and were pushing Kyle & Richard Petty stuff)

--
Terry Matula
tlm1@ra.msstate.edu
matula@ee.msstate.edu
From: bspahh@gdr.bath.ac.uk (Andrew Henry)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: F1: Re: Notes from Portugal
Date: 7 Oct 92 19:09:14 GMT
Organization: School of Biological Sciences, University of Bath, UK

In the referenced article, tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn Padfield) writes:

Most of these rumours are from the Motoring News ...

>Michele Alboreto might leave Footwork, maybe going to Scuderia 
>Italia Lola. It is said that he and Suzuki don't get along.

Not least because Suzuki gets paid more than Alboreto and has
been on pretty lacklustre form recently.

>March will definitely compete in '93, maybe with backing in the
>form of a buyout from Franz Konrad.  

They might also get some sponsorship for 1993 from Liqui Moly
through their new signing, Heinz-Harald Frentzen.

>Luca Badoer has signed a contract to possibly drive for Scuderia 
>Italia next year.

Unfortunately his chances have taken a dive after the Estoril test.
The gearbox broke on his first run, when he did a 1m 24.83s on 1993
rubber.  Then on the Wednesday, his best was a 1m 20.03s until his
engine broke, which left him slowest of the serious runners  (Diogo
Castro Santos's best being 1m 46s).

Luca Badoer has had a pretty swift rise - he went straight from karting
to Italian F3, followed by this season in F3000, where he is currently
at the head of the points table.  However, some people from Ferrari
said that they didn't think that he was up to F1, and a spokesman for
the Scuderia Italia team was quoted in the Italian press as saying that
they would not take up their option on his services for '93.  Ivan
Capelli, Pierluigi Martini, Mark Blundell and Roberto Moreno are also
possibles for the second seat.

Things don't look good for Al Unser Jnr getting a seat in F1 next
year.  He has said that he only wants to drive for a team that takes
him on for his driving, and not for his sponsorship.  This may be a
reference to McDonald's who might have signed as a major associate
sponsor for a team if Junior was driving.  

According to a "highly reliable" source, McLaren top brass were
talking to Vickers early last week, still relentlessly trying to
persuade Ford and Cosworth to supply them with HB V8s in 1993 to a 
similar specification to Benetton's.

A rumour from the weekend at Nazareth was that Mansell's contract
at Newman/Haas would be bought out by a Formula One team (Williams
or Ferrari ?).  Another Indycar team has apparently offered Ayrton
Senna the same deal as Mansell has at Newman/Haas !


			Andrew  Henry
Sempre  Gilles					bspahh@gdr.bath.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: rmwise@mcigate.apdev.mci.com (Bob_Wise)
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 19:19:15 GMT
Organization: MCI

In article <1992Oct15.172120.27168@cbnewsh.cb.att.com> fwk@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (f.w.kerfoot..iii) writes:
>From article <61173@mimsy.umd.edu>, by jsw@umiacs.umd.edu (Jeff Webber):
>> In article <14OCT199214501623@utarlg.uta.edu> b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley) writes:
>>>Oh, but wait, you guys will love this one:
>>>
>>>Track       Motorcycle Lap Record  (91)   91 Nascar Pole Time
>>>
>>>Watkins Glen   1:32.340                      1:11.851
>>>Sears Point    1:42.000                      1:40.095
>> 
>> Watkins Glen has different lengths depending on how it is set up.
>> Were they both using the same course length??
>
>Nascar only runs the short course, and in any case the lap time of 
>about 1:12 for 3.37 miles (the long course) would be about 170 MPH
>average, which, if you have driven it, is entirely unrealistic.

At Watkins Glen:

I also recall that the SCCA Trans-Am cars have better lap times than
the Nascar Winston cup cars.  This is mostly due to much lighter
weights and much wider tires.

Also by comparison, the Firehawk 944s run in the low 2 minute times.
I seem to recall about a 2:04.  The SCCA GT1 cars do a little better.

All of these figures are for the long course.   I don't know how the
new back stretch kink has affected lap times.

-Bob
-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Bob Wise          | INET:622-1322 | MCIMail:rmwise | Pager:719-577-1928 |
| Unix Consultant   |-----------------------------------------------------|
| Consultant to MCI | Phone:719-592-1322 | Internet:rmwise@apdev.mci.com  |
From: William.A.Hall.Jr.@dartmouth.edu (William A. Hall Jr.)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Top Five (US) drivers; forget the tracks ....
Date: 11 Oct 92 18:22:33 GMT
Article-I.D.: dartvax.1992Oct11.182233.5249
 <1992Oct11.045318.15094@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

In article <1992Oct11.045318.15094@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>
unglenie@ford.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert J Unglenieks) writes:

> Being a GREAT fan of the Dutch Boy, I'd be REALLY interested in how you
> arrived at this conclusion.

I'm not a big fan of IndyCar, but it seems that every time I turn on an
IndyCar race, Arie either crashes, spins, misses his pits, or his
engine blows. Maybe it's just coincidence. 8)

Bill

P.S. It probably just is coincidence, judging from your response. 8)
From: dlhpfm.uucp!dlh@ab.com (daniel lance herrick)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Tires : Slicks vs. Treaded: Help Pleas
Date: Wed, 07 Oct 92 16:35:02 EDT
Organization: dlh Performance Marketing

andyw@meaddata.com (Andy Welter) writes:

> I believe that a bigger tire does tend to have greater rolling resistance tha
> smaller one, this may slow down a slick versus a grooved tire and cut into it
> fuel economy, but if this was enough to make a difference, you wouldn't see r
> cars universally using slicks in the dry. (except for those rally and off roa
> crazies :-) )

Answers in this thread, thus far, have not noted that when a car is
going 200 miles per hour the tops of the tyres are going 400 miles per
hour.  This makes a noticeable increase in drag for an open wheel car
and there will be more drag for treaded tyres than for slicks.

dan  of dlh Performance Marketing  POBox 1419  Mentor Ohio 44061
         NCoast.org!dlhpfm!dlh or ab.com!dlhpfm.uucp!dlh 

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: fireman@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Tracy L. Brooks)
Subject: Re: NASCAR & Mickey D's
Organization: Computer and Technologies Theme Program, NCSU, Raleigh
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 14:17:39 GMT

In article <393@rehab1.UUCP> dans@rehab1.UUCP (Dan Schein) writes:
>
>  McDonalds is so concerned about the Bud sponser that Jr is building a new
> shop for the #27. It will not be aside or across the street from the #11,
> but quite a bit farther away.
>
> -Dan

Your right in that the McDonald's car will be #27.  They have already
took pictures of this car on the racetrack. The #27 shop is going to be
located about 5-10 miles from the #11 shop.  I don't think that McDonald's
is the sole reason Jr. is building a new garage.  He has some 'personal
problems' that I would rather not say on the net.  Anyway his new shop
is located on US 421 near I-77 in Yadkin County, NC. 
 
later,

Tracy B.

/---------------------------------------------------------------------\
|     Tracy Lee Brooks                     fireman@catt.ncsu.edu      |
|     FF/1st Responder                     tlbrook@eos.ncsu.edu       |
|---------------------------------------------------------------------|
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: miller@convex.com (Ken Miller)
Subject: NASCAR tidbits
Organization: CONVEX Computer Corporation, Billsburg, Va., USA
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 16:44:17 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

Bobby Hillins 15th place finish in sundays race was disallowed when inspectors
found illegal components in his chevy engine. The paper wasn't specific.
Hillin was moved to last place in the 40 car rundown, everyone finishing behind
15th place was awarded a spot and 3 points. Earlier inspectors fined Hendricks
motorsports 5,000 bucks because the 5th place Rudd Chevy was an 1/8 inch to low
during post race inspection. Officials admitted the car probably settled through
normal wear and tear, they said they had no choice but to impose the penalty.

SECOND THOUGHTS...the month old deal between Junie Dunlevy and Jimmy Spencer
appears to be in jepordy after Spencer gave Allison a 4th place finish.
Spencer is reportedly wondering if he shouldn't drive for Bobby next year.
Allison said Spencers run was an audition for next year and Donlavey said he
wouldn't mind if jimmy backed out of their deal.

KENDALL IS OUT... Recent signs point to someone else other then road racer
tommy kendall fielding the pettymobile next year. Once thought a done deal
Petty reportedly has changed his tune after kendalls less then spectacular
recent test session and N.Wilkesboro. Now that Terry Labonte has re-signed
with billy hagen, former winston cup driver Rick Wilson and busch series star
Robert Pressley have emerged as candidates for pettys ride.

Kelloggs Inc. will leave the larry hendrick team and sponser the billy hagen/
Terry labonte team
the stavola brothers will replace dick trickle with stelin marlin in the #8
ford
Royal appliance Dirt Devil will sponser the new felix sabates/kenny wallace
winston cup team. Interestingly, the team wanted to use #44 car but switched
to 40 when richard petty asked sabates to leave #44 available.
Maxwell House said the intend to stay in racing through 93 but haven't decided
how. reportedly they might sponser the rick hendrick/ken schrader car or
perhaps the Bill Davis/Bobby Labonte winston cup team.

LOUDON IS IN...The New Hampshire International Speedway at Loudon has
scheduled a press conferance in Boston Wednesday to announce what track offcials
called a major addition to our 93 schedule. The announcement will confirm a
july 11 1993 date for a 500km winston cup race at the 1 mile track

MORE SCHEDULING...Bill France was at Indy last month to iron out details for
a July 31st 1994 500 mile event . In addition officials are looking at sites
other than Sears POint International for it's annual west coast road race.
Road courses at Laguna Seca, Willow Springs and Delmar are being considered
for 1994. Next years race at sears point will be may 16th, almost a month
earlier then usual.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: I Hate Phoenicians!
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 20:21:40 GMT

Read the subject line.  You've got NASCAR, you've got IndyCars,
you've now got IMSA (maybe under the lights next year), you've
got NHRA (Firebird), you've got a bullring like Manzanita......

You've also got a great track owner/promoter - Buddy Jobe

You HAD F1 (but we won't count that against you :-)

How many times have I kicked myself for turning down that transfer
to Chandler back in '87?!

Obviously, I'm really envious

-cball-
From: GR743@uacsc2.albany.edu (Greg Rickes)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: %Brakes - technology - F1
Date: 16 Oct 92 19:45:40 GMT
Article-I.D.: uacsc2.16882DDA6.GR743
Organization: University at Albany, Albany NY 12222

>size if wheel diameter.  So move the brakes closer to the center of the
>axle out of the wheel area?  This would help the center of balance yes,
>but now you have unsprung weight, right?  How significant is it?
>And if you might try this idea on a F1 car I would think the rotors
>would get in the way of the uprights and pushrod, plus add drag.
>But they would stay cooler.
 
Um, been there, done that. Lotus 72 F1 car, circa, what 1974 ?
Inboard brakes were all the rage for awhile as I recall, but
it was awhile ago.
 
Greg Rickes
 
 
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: mclellan@maximillion.mcc.com (David McLellan)
Subject: Re: NASCAR & Mickey D's
Followup-To: rec.autos.sport
Summary: Coke already does...
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords: Coke, Pepsi
Organization: MCC Corporate Computing
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 13:43:00 GMT

I also think I recall seeing last year either a WC or BGN car 
sponsered by Taco Bell, another member of the Pepsi family of 
businesses.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: fwk@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (f.w.kerfoot..iii)
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison
Organization: AT&T
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 17:21:20 GMT

From article <61173@mimsy.umd.edu>, by jsw@umiacs.umd.edu (Jeff Webber):
> In article <14OCT199214501623@utarlg.uta.edu> b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley) writes:
>>Oh, but wait, you guys will love this one:
>>
>>Track       Motorcycle Lap Record  (91)   91 Nascar Pole Time
>>
>>Watkins Glen   1:32.340                      1:11.851
>>Sears Point    1:42.000                      1:40.095
> 
> Watkins Glen has different lengths depending on how it is set up.
> Were they both using the same course length??

Nascar only runs the short course, and in any case the lap time of 
about 1:12 for 3.37 miles (the long course) would be about 170 MPH
average, which, if you have driven it, is entirely unrealistic.

The motorcycle lap time shown would be an average speed of about 132 MPH
for the long course, which is less unrealistic, but still sounds
on the fast side. However, it sounds slow for the short course, which
I recollect to be about 2 miles (78 MPH) and is relatively fast.
I suspect therefore that the motorcycle time is in fact for the long
course.  F1 cars used the long circuit when they ran there (up until 
the early '80s). Does anyone remember the record? I would expect that
modern F1 cars would be significantly faster, so this may not yield
a good comparison.

In any case, there seem to be lots of valid comparisons at other tracks.

Frank Kerfoot
fwk@homxc.att.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport,rec.autos.tech
From: bassek@lesti.hut.fi (Basse Kankkonen)
Subject: Re: Tires : Slicks vs. Treaded: Help Please
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date:  7 Oct 92 09:44:01 GMT

In <BvpsB1.Gp6@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield) writes:

>white@watsci.uwaterloo.ca (Brad White) writes:

>>Hellom
>>My friend and I are having a debate.  Consider that it is a clear and sunny
>>day. Which tire would give you more traction?  A slick or a treaded tire?
>>He is arguing that a treaded (!!) tire has more effective surface area on the raod
>>i
>>than a slick. Race car drivers use slicks
>>because they have better fuel mileage to maintain a given speed than treaded tires.  Is this right?  I
>>always thought that on a *dry* surface, slicks had more rubber in contact
>>with the road which would result in better tractionk, but also would
>>increase the rolling firction and therefore reduce gas mileage.  That is the
>>trade off between infinitely wide slicks and the ones that they use.
>>Thanks
>>Brad


>     You are right, your friend is very mistaken. A slick has one hundred
>percent rubber on the road- how can you get more surface area than that? A 
>slick is faster, and I would think that it is less fuel efficient as well.

>Cory

It ocurred to me that the formula of friction is F=u*m*g
(u=constant of friction,m=mass,g=acc. 9.81m/s^2)
This means that the traction is not depending on the area.
BUT the constant u is depending on the temperature, and a tire with less
area heats up faster and it will decrease the lifetime of the tire and the 
grip of course.
(Thats why cars don't use bicycle wheels!!!)

Basse
--
From: Alan.Crowder@prg.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: F1 Stuff
Date: 15 Oct 92 09:43:27 GMT
X-Mailer: mail-news 2.0.3


Hi Racers

Whoops!!!!!  I did say ages ago that Prosty would be joined by Martin
Brundle and now i hear that he is not going there. Well i have just
got of the phone and "the staff" at Williams are confused all over.
Martin had a contract, all agreed, no worries by anyone and it seems
there has been one very large spanner thrown into the system. By whom
i cant yet find out as "the staff" have no idea. It seems that Frankie
and Ratprick have kept this one to themselves. Martin has phoned and
asked why after all the talks have gone on has he been dropped, no
explanation was given to him or anyone else. He like us are baffled.
He was asked to race for Willaims straight after the Hungarian GP so
its not as if its all new stuff.

Well i shall keep digging around and as i'm due at the Williams conference
centre on saturday i will ask about.

More when i know.

Alan
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: koopman@fys.ruu.nl (Rob Koopman)
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison -anyone?
Organization: Physics Department, University of Utrecht, The Netherlands
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 19:06:24 GMT

Working from memory is not always may strongest point, but I recall that
somewhere in the early eighties, during 500cc motorcyle qualifying
for the South African GP (or was it the race itself), someone managed to
beat the F1 pole time that was set earlier that year.
Can anyone confirm this??????
From: koopman@fys.ruu.nl (Rob Koopman)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Update: Tires - Slick vs. Treaded
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:30:32 GMT
Organization: Physics Department, University of Utrecht, The Netherlands

Maybe the comment below has been made before, so let me first apologize
for sending a contribution without having read all related articles.

If I recall correctly, in one of the 'tyre mails' there was a remark 
about the friction coefficient and the related formula for
friction. The expression that I recall to have seen was for
*dynamical* friction. This formula can be applied on wheels only in 
special cases:
a) The wheel is locked up under braking
b) the wheel spins excessively under acceleration (v is not v_car)
When the wheels are rolling (zero slippage) one is dealing with *static*
friction. A drifting car (under acceleration, cornering and heavy braking) 
is in the transition regime (unless the driver exaggerates).

Rob Koopman
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Subject: Re: F1 Drivers
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 17:35:00 GMT

In article <1992Oct8.134738.11707@aa.cad.slb.com>, wilson@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (David Wilson) writes...
>In article <97176@bu.edu>, nicos@cs.bu.edu (Nicos Kontopoulos) writes...
>> 
>>- Why do ESPN commentators refer to Mansell as the "most popular F1 driver?"
>> 
>Could it possibly be because the commentators are actually present at the
>races, and get to observe the reactions of the spectators?
> 
On a related side note, check out the announcers of Sportscenter after a
race and find out what the US press at large thinks about F1. It's always
funny to hear Dan Patrick pronounce Mansell as two distinct words,
i.e. Man + cell. I don't think I've ever heard them get any F1 drivers
name right. 

George.

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: agwiii@fang.att.com (Grayson Walker (660-7949)(12/92))
Subject: Re: Motorsports vs. Traditional Sports
Organization: AT&T Tax Systems Development, Maitland FL
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:10:53 GMT

C-ball:

I think it's a GREAT idea.  I remember some articles back in the 60's or 
70's appearing in Road & Track. They had attendance and viewing figures by sport
and by type of racing.  The combined attendance/viewing numbers showed
that Autoracing was the number 1 sport on the planet.  R&T speculated as
to why so little attention was being paid to the sport by other than the
specialized press.

It would be very interesting to see today's viewing/attendance figures.

I hope you pursue the idea.  Wish I could be more helpful.

-- 
Grayson Walker                                           CHC, Maitland, Florida 
Forza!                                            Internet: agwiii@fang.att.com
Voice: 407 660 7949               ". . . big brown river . . ." Tuli Kupferberg
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport