HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: andrew@frip.WV.TEK.COM (Andrew Klossner)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: LH test-drive results (by a buyer)
Date: 30 Dec 92 20:36:03 GMT
Reply-To: andrew@frip.wv.tek.com
Organization: Tektronix Color Printers, Wilsonville, Oregon

I just ordered a Dodge Intrepid ES, loaded (package '26M'), for $192
over factory invoice.  (This is too low, there must be additional
factory-to-dealer compensation.)  I was quoted a delivery time eight
weeks in the future.  Chrysler is having no trouble selling these
puppies, but for some reason the factory took a long holiday shutdown.

The two big factors in our decision were safety and features, in that
order.  Safety: the car is more massy than the Japanese competition and
so will prevail in a momentum battle; it's long, plenty of crumple
space; and it has two airbags, anti-lock brakes, and traction control
-- good for getting out of the way in a hurry.

	"[Acceleration]: Above average to Good. Able to throw the
	driver to his seat ..."

This would be one of those drivers who operates the car in a standing
position?

	"I cannot see nor feel any significant difference in the amount
	space that the cab-forward design gave to the front seats."

The extra space for rear passengers is substantial.  And the amenities
for rear passengers are outstanding.  The two rear heater/AC vents were
a part of our decision.  It's a good family car.

	"The glove compartment is pretty small considering the size of
	the car. Is it due to the passenger-side air-bag competing for
	space?"

Yes.  I was surprised that the glove box is as big as it is.  The
Taurus/Sable has the same constraint and their glove box is much punier.

	"[Stingy dealer]: May be I was expecting too much, but I was
	only allowed to test-drive in an area that was less than 3
	blocks!"

I would certainly avoid that dealer.

	"The car is so new, so we don't have records ... about the cost
	of maintenance, repairs and quality control."

Yes, this is version 1.0 of the product and it's a real wildcard.  I
hope it lives up to its hype.

  -=- Andrew Klossner  (andrew@frip.wv.tek.com)
                       (uunet!tektronix!frip.WV.TEK!andrew)
From: naidu@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (naidu.gandham)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Subaru Legacy: Opinions Wanted
Keywords: Legacy, Sedan, L+, Opinions
Date: 28 Dec 92 15:37:32 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T

Hello netters,

I'm looking for opinions on the Subaru Legacy sedan with the
L+ option package.  How does this car compare to other cars in
its class?  It seemed to be priced lower than others, but I was
wondering why this is so.  Do you have other recommendations?
What would be a fair price for a Legacy L+ with ABS and/or Air Bag?

Also, how are the insurance rates on this car? 

Thanks, I will summarize responses if there is interest.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                                    |           Naidu Gandham
.CleverStuff under renovation...    |        naidu@lzusp.att.com
                                    |            908 576 2062
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: essbaum@rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Alexander Essbaum)
Subject: Re: Car phones
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 18:27:03 GMT
Distribution: usa
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM Rochester

In article <1992Dec22.163427.18691@dg-rtp.dg.com>, goudreau@batman.rtp.dg.com (Bob Goudreau) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec22.122412.28101@mips2.ma30.bull.com> K.Buck@ma30.bull.com writes:
|> >>doesn't require the use of hands to use - 
|> >
|> > i'm all in favor of that, but let's add "PLEASE make sure its a model
|> > that doesn't require the use of a BRAIN to use"...
|> > in my opinion, phone conversations risk devoting too much attention
|> > from the task of driving, even with hands-free operation.
|> 
|> So I trust that you also never engage in driver-passenger conversation
|> while in a moving vehicle?  And if you do, please explain the
|> fundamental difference between that and hands-free phone use.
|> 
|> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
|> Bob Goudreau			Data General Corporation
|> goudreau@dg-rtp.dg.com		62 Alexander Drive	
|> +1 919 248 6231			Research Triangle Park, NC  27709, USA

yes, i agree.  i personally have trouble talking to passengers about
anything that requires much thinking.  i generally pay a lot of attention
while driving and talking much distracts me enough to make me uncomfortable.
especially if there's traffic.

i can listen to the radio ok (but nobody gets pissed if i mentally tune
that out while i watch what other cars/bikes/peds are doing).

car phones are worse because the guy at the other end doesn't see what
you're dealing with, but i think a lot of drivers still get distracted
by passengers.

axel
From: heiser@acs.bu.edu (William Heiser)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Saturn SL2: the REAL test drive..
Date: 3 Jan 93 18:25:03 GMT
Organization: Boston University, Boston, MA, USA

In article <1993Jan3.075101.7673@athena.mit.edu> boo@athena.mit.edu (Christopher J Foley) writes:
>105 mph indicated top speed.
>cause I was actually dissapointed in that figure. 124Hp, 2600 pounds, very

Everything I've heard about the Saturns tells me they were designed to be
economical generic "family" cars,  Not sports cars...  Even more sporty-
oriented cars like the Probe don't do much better than that, maybe 115 or
120 or soemthing -- but how often can you realy drive that fast anyway? :-)



Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: matmcinn@nuscc.nus.sg (Brett McInnes)
Subject: Re: Honda Del Sol
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 04:43:18 GMT

rjwade@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert J. Wade) writes:
: but...then they just bury you in the car which is roughly the size of a 
: casket.
What's wrong with that?
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: asper@sbctri.sbc.com (Alan E. Asper)
Subject: 1993 MX-6 and Del Sol invoice prices provided
Organization: Southwestern Bell Technology Resources, St.Louis, MO
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 92 21:00:53 GMT

I called Road & Track magazine's 1-900 number to get the dealer invoice
prices for the 1993 Mazda MX-6 LS and the Honda Del Sol si. The call cost me
eight bucks, but I'll provide the info here, free to my net-friends...

              Dealer Invoice   MSRP

MX-6 LS       16,325           18,925

accessories:
Leather Pkg    800              1,000

A/C            680              850

ABS            680              800

CD Player      560              700

Floor Mats      49               70

Power Sunroof  448              560

Spoiler        300              375

Auto Trans.    696              800

--------------------------------------------
Honda Civic Del Sol si

             13,060           15,310

No accessory information was available for the Del Sol. The figure here
does not include A/C or a stereo.

Remember, "tax, title, dealer prep, dealer advertising, current rebates and
after-factory charges are not included."
I hope this is of help to somebody out there.

Alan
From: hm002b@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (PRIMUS SUCKS!)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Car phones
Date: 23 Dec 92 23:43:31 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <1992Dec23.212118.13189@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> sharen@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (Sharen A. Rund) writes:
>In article <1992Dec23.153633.6384@dg-rtp.dg.com> goudreau@batman.rtp.dg.com (Bob Goudreau) writes:
>>In article <92358.114600SROWELL@ESOC.BITNET> <SROWELL@ESOC.BITNET> writes:
>>> In the UK, use of a car phone while driving is illegal. The law may
>>> be an ass, but in this case it's a sensible one!
>>
>>At first glance, this would appear obvious.  However a while ago I
>>recall reading a newspaper story describing a recent study (done by
>>the US DOT, or some such federal agency, I believe) on the use of
>>car phones in the US.  The people running the study were surprised
>>to discover no statistically significant difference between the
>>accident rates of drivers using phones and those not using them.
>>
>
>your article's statistics may or may not be right, and you may be a
>good-to-excellent driver who can anticipate a problem and/or
>recognize one immediately and respond to it (even if your passenger
>doesn't know whats happening till after the fact) BUT there are _so-o-o_
>many people out there (that shouldn't be driving cars in the first place)
>that have phones clamped to their ears that are creating a nuisance,
>especially during rush hour time-frames - I beg to differ with your
>article, and stand by my feeling that if someone insists on having a
>car phone, they should either use it only when parked by the side of
>the road or have a hands-free one

I disagree I find that using the handset is much easier then using my stupid
handsfree system. To use the handsfree system I have to press a slew of
buttons to activate it. With the handset I just pick it up and place it
under my right ear and viola all set. If I have to dial out I just pick up
the phone and hit one button it usually only requires a split second of
time. Equivilent to using the stereo or setting the proper heat. I think
they should make one button dialing a REQUIRED feature on all phones it
greatly reduces the amount of "attention" that the phone needs. I had to pay
a few bucks extra for it but it was well worth the cost. I guess the
situation would be VERY different if my car was a manual transmission but it
isn't and I really never have had a problem delegating my priorities while
driving and talking on the phone. It would be foolish to punish the many
good drivers, for no apparent reason other than a little paranoia. One of
the main points of having a cellular phone is to get stuff done while
driving which is otherwise "dead" time. If you make people use the phone
while parked you are eliminating a major "feature" of cellular phones.
PS
From: bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ron Bense)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Emblems, names and meanings...
Date: 22 Dec 92 16:14:21 GMT
Reply-To: bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense)
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In rec.autos, tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen) writes:
>acura's symbol is a stylized A that resembles a pair of calipers,
>and it first appeared on the 1991 acuras.  i guess acura decided
>to jump on the symbol bandwagon.

>what does it represent?  calipers, of course.

How about a squashed 'H' for Honda? (After all, in other markets besides
the US one, Acuras are sold under the Honda badge.)

Ron
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: rajagopa@sdf.lonestar.org (Hari Rajagopal)
Subject: ******** Car for Sale (Dallas) ******
Organization: sdf public access Unix, Dallas -- 214-436-3281
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 20:26:49 GMT

From letni!seas!SWMED.EDU!RAJAGOPA Sat Jan  2 00:00:55 1993
Return-Path: <letni!seas!SWMED.EDU!RAJAGOPA>
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Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1993 16:32:17 -0600 (CST)
From:    RAJAGOPA@SWMED.EDU
Message-Id: <930101163217.24601c86@SWMED.EDU>
To:      rajagopa@sdf.lonestar.org
X-Vmsmail-To: SMTP%"rajagopa@sdf.lonestar.org"
Status: O



	*******	Car for Sale *************				


	1985 Mazda 626 LX

	2.0 engine

	98,000 miles

	Power -    Windows
		   Locks
		   Mirror

	Manual Transmission

	Carburetted

	Excellent stereo system and speakers

	Red interior

	Body in excellent shape (White with Black striping)

	Electrics all good



The car belongs to a friend of mine who was taken for a ride,	by the 
seller. 
				   
the car has a bad carb which needs to be rebuilt and is causing the 
engine to shudder and cut out intermittently. The exhaust shows smoke 
which bodes ill for the engine unless the carb is rebuilt soon, but he 
cant afford to do that now. He wants to get rid of the car . Iam sure 
it would run fine if it has a carb rebuild. He was milked of $2200 for 
the car and is disgusted with himself. He will be happy if he gets a 
fair price (my guess is, around 1200). 

	Email him at :

	lalgudi@utsw.swmed.utexas.edu

or call :
	(214)-520-3217 (Dallas)
From: rkushner@sycom.mi.org (Ronald Kushner)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Chain Driven "New" Cars?
Distribution: world
X-BBS-Software: EXCELSIOR! V0.975
Date: 2 Jan 93 16:31:52 EST
Organization: Michigan Information eXchange

In an article, ce423@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Josh Lackey III) writes:

>  I'm wondering what the reliability of this design will be after say,
>50,000 miles, and am wondering if any other recent model front wheel driven
>cars have chains in the drive trains?  If so, how realiable have they
>been?

Toyota had a simular design in the early 80's... My Uncle has 230,000 miles on 
his Toyota and has not had a problem...


Ronald Kushner               rkushner@sycom.mi.org | sycom!rkushner@msen.com

Sycom Design Software                       VOICE:    (313) 268-5117
P.O. Box 353                                BBS:      (313) 939-6666
Sterling Heights, MI  48311-0353
From: hagger@cs.umd.edu (Paul Hagger)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Four wheel drive Autos
Date: 23 Dec 92 18:12:58 GMT
Organization: U of Maryland, Dept. of Computer Science, Coll. Pk., MD 20742

In article <28889@oasys.dt.navy.mil> bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense) writes:
>
>>Most (all?) Subaru's have 4WD
>
>Subarus are truly 4wds, and should not be driven on dry pavement in 4wd.
>
>Ron  

Not true.  The Subaru SVX and Legacy are AWD.  They may be driven on dry
pavement in AWD mode, which is useful as it cannot be turned off.

-hagger
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: bpita@ctp.com (Bob Pitas)
Subject: Re: FWD patrol cars (once Re: CHP Beretta(!) sighted)
Organization: Cambridge Technology Partners
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 16:14:25 GMT


In article <2400077@hpsad.sad.hp.com> eric@hpsad.sad.hp.com (Eric Lucas) writes:
>In rec.autos, kist@acsu.buffalo.edu (james e kist) writes:
>
>    In article <1992Dec7.160322.27875@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> LJ09735@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM (Jeff Schaefer) writes:
>
>    >On a related note, my cubemate got pulled over this weekend on I-280 near
>    >San Francisco this weekend by the latest CHP pursuit car....a Camaro w/Corvette
>    >engine.  Cop claimed it is being used for chasing the crotch-rocket motorcycles
>    >that frequently use that hwy for a racetrack.  Whether or not he was boasting
>    >we do not know, but the cop claimed the car has a tested top end of 157 mph.
>
>    Well, the crotch-rockets have top speeds of 185 mph and up,so what good
>    would that car do against a bike thatis much more manueverable?
>
>
>-----
>
>Well, it certainly can't outrun a radio.
>
>Eric

Especially if it's one of those new sequencial-twin-turbocharged radios... 
I hear they can do 200mph with a tailwind...

You know, I always thought this expression "you can't outrun a radio" was one
of the stupidest sayings ever...  What, is there a radio that can somehow
know where the bike is even though the pig is sitting in a dustcloud, 5
miles back?  Can the radio make the other pigs creating the roadblock know
which way the bike is going without someone keeping up to him to *see* where
he's going?  It would seem to me that once you get out of the direct sight
of the persuing pig, you could take any one of dozens of different routes, 
and the pigs couldn't possibly have the time or resources to cover them all.
Organization: Central Michigan University
Date: Friday, 25 Dec 1992 13:51:04 EST
From: Christopher Khoury <34I2NYW@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Should I buy a Nissan Maxima??

   Hi, I am looking at cars, and I found a 1991 Nissan Maxima,
with 8,000 miles, it is a GXE model, with the Luxery Package,
it does not hav ABS brakes, or an air bag though. The dealer
will take around $14,500 for it. IT is in mint condition
(it was a showroom car). Do you think this is a good deal?

How reliable are Maxima's? I drove one, and was happy, but
I don't know much else about them. Thank you!

pleas respond soon , as I hav eto make a decision quick!

-chris
---------------------------
    CHRISTOPHER KHOURY
34I2NYW@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU
---------------------------
From: ph279sw@prism.gatech.EDU (FR Siqing WEI)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Car Phones
Date: 23 Dec 92 20:34:44 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article 91468,  Goudreau wrote:

|In any case, do you *never* look away from the road when driving, even
|for an instant?  If never, then how do you deal with, say, turning on
|the defroster in an unfamiliar car (borrowed, rented, etc.)?
|

Now wait a second, the way to argue a point is not to try:

I got away once, hence I can get away ALWAYS!

Using your logic, can we say this:

Some people manage to put their make-up while driving, 
hence it is a safe practice to put make-up while driving?!
(or you prefer, read newspaper, or whatever your favorate
activities).

The point is: permitting more distractions to the driver is
(and will never) be a safe practice!

Wei
From: hhelanto@vipunen.hut.fi (Henri R Helanto)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Want info/opinions on '92 Toyota MR2 Turbo
Keywords: MR2 Turbo Opinions
Date: 27 Dec 92 04:04:05 GMT
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland

In <1992Dec22.223955.7193@u.washington.edu> goble@hardy.u.washington.edu (Brian Goble) writes:

>There is something about the MR2 Turbo that has really peaked my interest.
>I just have this "picture" of driving down the Coast on some twisty road
>with my SO to a quiet little bed-and-breakfast.

	There was a test in a finnish car magazine about a year ago
	(it was a 'normal' MR2, without turbo). They said that it
	was noisy, handles adequately if driver knows his job and
	has very little room for anything but two passengers.

>The car sounds like it is VERY fun to drive (I've never been in one or
>driven one) and the '92 sounds like it has some good suspension
>improvements as well as faster 0-60 times.
>
>I'm 5' 10.5" so I don't think the small cabin would be a problem for
>me.  Can you still use the car to go to the grocery store and bring back
>3 (how 'bout 4) bags of groceries?

	It _is_ fun to drive. It's a very short car and therefore
	it turns on a dime if neccessary. Small cabin is not a 
	problem, I'm 6'2" and there was plenty of room. Packing
	a couple of bags of groceries is a whole another ballgame.
	(Having the passenger seat full of bags and driving a bit
	too fast to a right-hand turn isn't an experience I would
	want to have...)

>Even though I love my '88 Supra Turbo, there is something about the little
>MR2 that has me thinking about getting one a lot lately.  (specifically
>a white one, 5spd, turbo).

	By all means, go for it! It's a lot more fun than Supra (hmm,
	'more fun' doesn't mean 'faster', just more fun) and it looks
	a lot better than it used to a couple of years ago, not so
	boxy anymore... :-)

-Henri
-- 
Henri Helanto - SysOp
hhelanto@vipunen.hut.fi m40176m@puukko.hut.fi
Call MyBBS (+358-0-485067/485068/485968/485918/488139, 24h) !
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: sharen@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (Sharen A. Rund)
Subject: Re: FORD TAURUS taillight RIPOFF!
Organization: Lockheed Missiles and Space Co.
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 21:47:37 GMT

In article <Bz9Avz.90L@mail.boi.hp.com> wesf@boi.hp.com (Wes Fujii) writes:
>John De Armond (jgd@dixie.com) wrote:
>
>: An average house does NOT cost $100k anywhere except the left coast
>: and some areas in the NE.  I can assure you that nice houses can be had
>
>Sorry, our average house in Boise (according to our realtors around here) 
>is over $100K now (and closer to $106 I believe).  We live in the same 
>Rocky Mountain inland area that you do...
>
>Wes Fujii
>

silly me, I thought John lived near Huntsville, Ala ((jgd@dixie.com), when
did Ala get close enough to Idaho so they're both in the same Rocky
Mountain inland area????    B-)

BTW - my house (overlooking the ocean (actually Monterey Bay from Santa
Cruz to Monterey) was recently appraised at over 600K (on 2.5 acres) after 
applying the sale price of our former home to the purchase price of this
one, we really only paid 100K - a lot of people here start with a smaller
home then either remodel/add on or buy-up 

the average home in the greater San Jose (Silicon Valley) area is over 250K

-- 
________________       __        ________________   "They that can give up
\_________      \     /_ \      /      _________/  essential liberty to 
 \_________      \_____/  \____/      _________/  obtain temporary safety
  \___________________      __________________/  deserve neither liberty 
                     /______\                   nor safety."  
ALL disclaimers apply ....                           --Benjamin Franklin
	  
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: sharen@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (Sharen A. Rund)
Subject: Re: Car phones
Organization: Lockheed Missiles and Space Co.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 21:09:29 GMT

In article <102651@netnews.upenn.edu> tony@scotty.dccs.upenn.edu (Anthony Olejnik) writes:
>My wife wants a car phone for Christmas.
>Is there a FAQ on these?
>Is there a more appropriate newsgroup then this one?
>I really don`t know where to start on this one (and its
>late as it is).
>
>Any help would be *GREATLY* appreciated.
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>--tony

whatever model you finally decide on, PLEASE make sure its a model that
doesn't require the use of hands to use - there are some available, may be 
a bit more expensive, but the driver can keep _both_ hands on the wheel
and _drive_ while talking - there's nothing worse than seeing some of these
people today with their car phones, pushed up against their face trying to
talk and drive and hold onto the phone all at the same time - they loose 
some of theri attention that should be concentrating on driving to 
handling that bloody thing ...

-- 
________________       __        ________________   "They that can give up
\_________      \     /_ \      /      _________/  essential liberty to 
 \_________      \_____/  \____/      _________/  obtain temporary safety
  \___________________      __________________/  deserve neither liberty 
                     /______\                   nor safety."  
ALL disclaimers apply ....                           --Benjamin Franklin
	  
Newsgroups: rec.autos