HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hchong@netcom.com (Hoi Chong)
Subject: Let's sucker Leica in too (Re: New Nikon camera!!!) 
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 92 03:35:23 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

From article <Bu6HrL.CsG@ecf.toronto.edu>, by chang@ecf.toronto.edu (CHANG Rong Fawn Teresa):
> In article <n+pnq#k.hchong@netcom.com> hchong@netcom.com (Hoi Chong) writes:
>>I wonder how come the Taiwanese clone don't get into making F4s (just the
>>body, lens maybe later, maybe not)?  I mean at $1500 to $2000, I am sure they
>>can make a living by selling them for less than $1000.  And then add more
>>electronic features like wired or infared (like our TV clickers) connection
>>to our laptop; CCD built-in for remote monitoring, etc, really get
>>Nikon off their asses and bring their electronics up to date...
> 
> Sure they would make a living for even such low prices.  Taiwan often makes
> good stuff and sells them at cheap rates.  Starting a new company may not be
> very easy, someone did fail, although some did succeed.
> 
>>Like they say, if Detroit has moved as fast as computer has, cars would
>>fly today.  If Nikon had moved as fast as computer has, cameras would
>>fly too!  Ok, maybe they wouldn't fly around and let you take photos
>>remotely, but they should at least be mounted on a 1'x1' golf cart that
>>moves around on batteries and let you take photos remotely, with extenable
>>neck of course to lower or heighten the camera.
> 
> This is very interesting.  However the designer would have to think about
> how to control the stability of the camera.  If the camera would fly by
> using an remote control, then there might be unnecessary to use a tripod.
> By just looking at Newton's first law, this would seem to less likely   
> happen to cameras.  It might be possible, however, in some future.

Talking about clone/cheaper cameras, seen the Leica M6/off-$300 offer 
lately?  Maybe they do this from time to time, but the feeling I get is
that possibly the Nikon F4s has bitten into the price range of the 
Leica M6, and those whom would have bought M6, are now buying Nikon F4s
instead.  I have yet to hear from any one in this group who actually
own a M6.

Now that the camera making is out of Germany in the hand of cheap(er?)
labor elsewhere, maybe Leica can said sell M6 at the price of the 
Leica Mini (ok, ok, just kidding).  I have owned and appreciated Leica
M-series (M4P with 35mm and 135mm) before, but the M6 is simply too
much with only TTL metering.  Now those Taiwanese clone makers will 
really have a field day making M6-clones and selling them at 1/10th of
the original's price!
From: pd@sics.se (Per Danielsson)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: High speed useful ? (was Re: Nikon N90 technobabble)
Date: 7 Sep 92 15:44:27 GMT
	<PHR.92Sep4102515@soda.berkeley.edu> <28773@sophia.inria.fr>
Organization: Swedish Institute of Computer Science

In article <28773@sophia.inria.fr> luong@naxos.inria.fr (Quang-Tuan Luong) writes:

>I don't understand the utility of high speed shutters. On my 8008, I think
>I have never shot beyond 1/1000s, and I cannot imagine any real situation 
>where 1/8000s would be useful. Using high speed means that you use also high
>sensibility film, and/or wide aperture, and this is known to reduce 
>significantly image quality.

Having a focal plane shutter with fast moving curtains is useful since
it allows you to have a high flash sync speed. Of course this means
that the top speed of the shutter can be increased also, giving the
camera manufacturer a marketing edge over the competition...
--
Per Danielsson				pd@sics.se
Swedish Institute of Computer Science, PO Box 1263, S-164 28 KISTA, SWEDEN
Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: hotshot@wam.umd.edu (Target Ace)
Subject: MAMIYA-SEKOR 50mm LENSES -CHEAP
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 02:34:19 GMT

 
 BRAND NEW MAMIYA-SEKOR CAMERA LENSES
 
 1) MAMIYA-SEKOR EF 50mm f/1.7 lens
    - New in box

 2) MAMIYA-SEKOR EF 50mm f/2 lens
    - New in box
       
 These are quality lenses that are made in Japan. 
 They are EF Mamiya mount.


 ASKING ONLY $35 each or $60 for both ! (buyer pays shipping)

 If you don't like the price, make me an offer (or trade) . Thanks.

 Cheers

 Rick

Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: jpglori@srv.PacBell.COM (John P. Gloria)
Subject: Re: Tilt and Shift.  How useful are they?
Organization: Pacific * Bell
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 13:50:43 GMT

In article <BuCC8z.D8D@world.std.com> dp@world.std.com (Jeff DelPapa) writes:
>
>I am fond of shift, it lets me be a little lazy, and do my final
>touchup of composition without distrurbing the camera. I don't have it
>on my field camera (except by swinging both standards), and miss it. 
>
>About the only time I don't use some tilt is shooting computer
>screens. It is essential for tabletop, I use it most of the time with
>landscape, and have used it in arch. shots. Tilt  is one of the
>reasons that I shoot decreasing amounts of 35mm... (rise is the other,
>and the reason I got into large format in the first place) Had I known
>how useful tilt was, I would have started sooner.
>
>Lenses. Most view lenses are long focus, and not telephoto. there are
>exceptions, and the exceptions do have small image circles. If I
>remember correctly, one of the osaka telephotos bareley covers 4x5
>without allowing any movements. the long focal lenses, typically have
>circles big enough for 8x10, and so most 4x5's cannot manage to move
>off the circle. The advantage to tele's is the short bellows draw
>requirements - otherwise, they are fairly inconvienent to use, with
>the nodal point far from the pivot axis, using camera movements is a
>fairly frustrating experience, involving lots of re-focussing.
>
><dp>

Just out of curiosity, are there any folks out there that have
used the Canon 35mm tilt/shift lenses.  I have read a couple of
articles and they all seem to give kudos to these lenses.  I have
been wanting to purchase one, but they are quite expensive.  Any
comments on users who have used them?

I will be the first to admit that a 35mm T/S lens cannot compare
to a view cameras capabilities, but that is not the question.
-- 
  ---------  John Gloria - jpglori@sysengr.pacbell.com	--------	
  "I have great faith in fools - self-confidence my
   friends call it."        Edgar Allan Poe
Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: glporter@zeus.calpoly.edu (Glen Porter)
Subject: Camera World of Oregins FAX is 503-222-7070
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1992 17:26:22 GMT

Someone asked me for it, but their mail bounces .

The Fax number for Camera World of Oregon, is (503)222-7070.

They have just about thereputation.  Some people complain, but generally about
the Customer service line - don't use the customer service #, use the regular
800 number instead.  

Other than that, they are about the best. 

-glen

Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: jacobson@cello.hpl.hp.com (David Jacobson)
Subject: Re: On-Camera Flash Diffusers
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 04:12:07 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories
Keywords: diffusers

In article <1992Sep10.235547.28692@pony.Ingres.COM> bbarton@Ingres.COM (Brian Barton) writes:
>
>Could someone please provide some input on the various types of on-camera
>flash diffusers that are available?

I have the LumiQuest 80-20 and the Big Bounce. 

The 80-20 workes wonderfully in its intended environment.  Yes, there
are some shadows, but they are nicely filled in with some light, so
they are not black.  And at the same time, it doesn't have the
bounce-flash look (dark eyes, shadows under the nose, no sparkle).

I use the Big Bounce mostly for macro work.  I put my Nikon SB-24
flash on the end of the cord (SC-17) and have the Big Bounce on it.
Then I hand hold it right over the subject.

  -- David Jacobson
From: psilsbee@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Peter Silsbee)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: photo shops in Austin area?
Date: 14 Sep 92 19:30:51 GMT
Reply-To: psilsbee@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Peter Silsbee)
Distribution: austin
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX
Originator: psilsbee@mickey.cc.utexas.edu


Hi folks, 
	I'm looking for recommendations for photofinishing shops
in the Austin area. Any recommendations or horror stories?

--Peter
From: hchong@netcom.com (Hoi Chong)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: Nikon Photo School: is it good?
Date: 9 Sep 92 15:09:28 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

From article <6237@transfer.stratus.com>, by savoia@sw.stratus.com (Rick Savoia):
> In article <b3rn5sn.hchong@netcom.com>, hchong@netcom.com (Hoi Chong) writes:
>> From article <wefBU=C00WBL42orBE@andrew.cmu.edu>, by Luis Abdon Cifuentes <lc0v+@andrew.cmu.edu>:
>> > Hello netters, 
>> > 
>> >  I just received a brochure about the Nikon Photo School. It will be in
>> > town this weekend, so I wanted to know if somebody has attended it and
>> > has  comments about it. Being a graduate student, I have very good uses
>> > for $75, so I want to know if the thing is worth it before trying it.
>> 
>> If nothing else, all the snobbish F4s'ers (your truly included) can get
>> togather and compare their cameras and say bad things about Canon.
>> (of course, we can also thump our noses at the 8008s'ers and F3'ers...)
>> 
>> Feeling a bit cocky today...  
> 
> 
> Of course, us 8008'ers, will be able to get to the food table
> first, because we won't be weighted down by the mega-ton F4 :)

Of course, us F4s'ers have a heavier weapon to hit with should a fight
for food ensues.
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: High speed useful ? (was Re: Nikon N90 technobabble)
From: fred-mckenzie@ksc.nasa.gov (Fred McKenzie)
Date: 9 Sep 92 12:31:24 EST
Followup-To: rec.photo
Distribution: world
Organization: NASA/Kennedy Space Center, Florida

In article <28773@sophia.inria.fr>, luong@naxos.inria.fr (Quang-Tuan Luong)
wrote:
> I don't understand the utility of high speed shutters. On my 8008, I think
> I have never shot beyond 1/1000s, and I cannot imagine any real situation 
> where 1/8000s would be useful. Using high speed means that you use also high
> sensibility film, and/or wide aperture, and this is known to reduce 
> significantly image quality.

Tuan-

For average situations, you are indeed correct.  However, there are other
situations that require the fastest shutter speed you can manage:

1.  Long focal-length lenses require at least "1 over the focal length" for
hand-holding without excessive image blur.  If you have a 2000 mm lens, you
would need 1/2000 sec to hand-hold, even though the subject isn't in
motion.

2.  Fast moving subjects obviously require fast shutter speeds.

3.  Combinations of (1) and (2).

At first, I didn't realize the importance of shutter speed while
hand-holding.  My first 35mm camera was an Argus C-3.  I would typically
use 1/30 second shutter speed at f/16, using Kodachrome ASA 25, and was
thrilled with the results.  More recently, I became aware that photos taken
at a higher shutter speed at the expense of a wider aperture, were
noticeably sharper at great enlargement, compared to  slower shutter and
small aperture.  Although smaller aperture usually increases depth of
focus, it also introduces distortion due to diffraction as you get to about
f/11.  Therefore, you may actually have two sources of image degradation
working against you with slow shutter and small aperture.

fred-mckenzie@ksc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: chang@ecf.toronto.edu (CHANG Rong Fawn Teresa)
Subject: Re: Manual for Nikon F-1 Wanted
Organization: University of Toronto, Engineering Computing Facility
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 00:01:16 GMT

In article <18gf3hINNfk8@network.ucsd.edu> bjones@weber.ucsd.edu (Bruce Jones) writes:
>The title says most of it.  I have an old Nikon F-1 that I use as a
>backup.  I bought it second hand a couple of years ago and it works [...]
>I'd be happy to buy and prepay postage for either an original manual
>for this camera or a decent aftermarket book that covers it in depth.

Always remember asking for an original manual when you buy a second hand!
Otherwise you could negotiate the price ever more.  Ask Nikon or dealers.
From: bruceb@mpd.tandem.com (Bruce Burden)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: Info on multiple flash photography
Date: 9 Sep 92 18:23:19 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Tandem Computers (MPD) Austin, TX

In article <1992Sep9.121313.22738@cs.rit.edu> kar@cs.rit.edu (Kenneth A Reek) writes:
>
>	I am getting interested in photographing birds using multiple
>flashes with my N8008s.  Nikon sells all kinds of cords to connect the
>flashes together, but they don't say very much about how the flashes
>will work together (e.g. can the exposure compensation be set
>individually on each flash unit?).
>

	I have tgought abut doing this, (with Minolta equipment) and
    have decided that the smart way to handle this is to use slave
    units to trigger the various flash units. This avoids the problems
    with tangled cords, loose connections and dangling cords contributing
    to camera shake when a breeze springs up.

	With a flash meter, it is a simple matter of determining exposure
    by triggering all of the units. However, I would think that a Nikon
    system guide would be able to tell you how the flash units could be
    tied together.



							Bruce


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Bruce Burden            bruceb@mpd.tandem.com         Tandem Computers Inc.
From: moreaux@litsun22.epfl.ch (Michel Moreaux)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: B/W film for B/W negative duplication (35mm)
Date: 11 Sep 92 12:58:56 GMT
Distribution: rec.photo
Organization: Laboratoire d'informatique technique


I know there is a film sold by Kodak but this film is only available
in 4"x5". So the duplication of B/W negatives would be highly
expensive. I am wondering if there is a manufacterer that sells a film
dedicated to the copy of B/W negatives and in 35mm format. This film
would have to be a kind of B/W positive film. This film could be
non-chromatized since the source is B/W medium.

Has someone already tried the Agfa Diadirect for B/W negatives
duplication ? I suspect that this would pose a problem since the gamma
of the Diadirect will probably make impossible the printing on a B/W
paper. But, nevertheless, if someone has already tried and wanted to
post its conclusion on the net, it would be appreciated.

-michel moreaux
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michel Moreaux,                           | "Ceux qui ne savent rien en savent
Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne  |  toujours tout autant que ceux qui
Departement d'Informatique                |  n'en savent pas plus qu'eux"
Laboratoire d'Informatique Technique      |                  P. Dac.
EL-Ecublens                               |___________________________________
CH-1015 Lausanne                           
Phone # : (21) 693-46-72,   e-mail : moreaux@litsun.epfl.ch
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: huffstatler@esvax.avnet.com
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: <None>
Date: 4 Sep 92 15:04:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: esvax.1992Sep4.080422.550
Organization: Avnet Computer - CTC Group; Culver City, CA



Has anyone used, or just have any good information, about the Minolta
waterproof 35mm???  I don't know the model # off hand, but it's the ugly
yellow one.   I'm looking for something like this to take on fishing trips
without worrying about it getting wet. There may end up being some other
uses, but for now..??,......


Any others out there that you think are worth looking into???

Thank's

Mike Huffstatler, Avnet Computer, Culver City, CA
mike@esvax.avnet.com
From: knoche@desert-rat.West.Sun.COM (Bill Knoche SUN Phoenix SE 602-275-5537 x24)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: Dewitt Jones & Canon/Outdoor Photographer
Date: 9 Sep 1992 00:37:41 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: knoche@desert-rat.West.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: desert-rat.west.sun.com

I met Dewitt Jones in Zion last spring. Since then I have seen a video of his
presentation skills. Based on those two encounters I would recommend attending. 
I have not had the chance to see his stage presence in person.

The "Art of Seeing" is a presentation he developed out his work for National
Geographic, one of his more visible clients. I think anyone who is interested
in rejuventating their creative side should find this a wonderful seminar.
If you are looking for nuts and bolts techie stuff you might be dis-appointed.
I can use reference manuals as well as the next guy; it is very refreshing
to hear someone wax eloquently on vision and seeing. Technique is extremely
important, but, without any creative vision it is nearly useless - a perfect
photograph without content is worthless. Dewitt spends time helping you
see the possibilities and encourages you to look more closely, from a 
different vantage point or in a different direction. Numerous examples will
make his approach clear.

Take the seminar and post a followup. I want to attend one of Dewitt's
seminars soon. I look forward to hearing your comments...
---
______________________________________________________
William D. Knoche		Bill.Knoche@Sun.COM
Systems Engineer
Sun Microsystems, Inc.		Phone:  602-275-4242
410 N. 44th St., Suite 140	Fax:    602-220-4453
Phoenix, Arizona 85008
______________________________________________________

Xref: sparky rec.photo:16020 rec.backcountry:7065
From: fanelli@gagme (michael fanelli)
Newsgroups: rec.photo,rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: What tripod do you use when backpacking?
Date: 11 Sep 92 17:35:46 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: GAGME - Public Access UNIX of Chicago, Illinois, USA, Earth
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

I have a Bembo Trekker and just ignore the worries of where I am putting it!
I have had it for over two years and still no problems. Ain't got no time
to clean no tripods... :-) Highly recommended, especially for macros.

		michael fanelli
		72040.2460@compuserve.com
Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: zrepachol@cc.curtin.edu.au (Paul Repacholi)
Subject: Re: New Nikon camera!!!
Organization: Curtin University of Technology
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 19:37:18 GMT

In article <13251@texsun.Central.Sun.COM>, dbernard@thewho.Central.Sun.COM (Dave Bernard) writes:
> Hmm, the N90.  Anyone have any idea when the N90"S" will be out?
> 
... or the F4S II. F4 reprogramed for D lenses...

~Paul
From: fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (steve hix)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: High speed useful ? (was Re: Nikon N90 technobabble)
Date: 10 Sep 1992 02:21:03 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: concertina

In article <1992Sep9.202214.18216@PacBell.COM> jpglori@srv.PacBell.COM (John P. Gloria) writes:
>>
>The key phrase or intent is that "most" 35mm SLR cameras fall within a
>certain flash sync speed.  

Determined by the design of the focal-plane shutter typically used...

>With the advent of newer technology, I am certain the flash speed will increase.  

As demonstrated by Olympus F280 flash some years since.

>It is funny though (to me) that
>the old leaf shutter lenses have always had flash sync equating to the highest
>shutter speed of the lenses, typically 1/500. :-)  The newer AF cameras
>are just now catching up to late 1800 and early 1900 flash sync speed.

Nothing funny about it at all. Until (at least, commercially) Olympus came out
with their F280 flash, a focal-plane shuttered camera was limited to a maximum
electronic flash speed of whatever the maximum speed the shutter allowed with
the entire frame area uncovered.  The faster the shutter curtain(s) speed, the
higher the sync speed.  At any higher speed, the frame area would be exposed
as a traveling strip, which the quick flash would light...not so useful.

A leaf-shutter, on the other hand, exposes the entire frame area during all of
its operation.  If you just wait until the shutter is fully open, the quick
electronic flash does the job.

Btw, back in old days, before electronic flash, there was no problem in
syncing your flash at whatever the top speed of your camera's focal-plane
shutter operated at.  Just don't forget to switch the flash sync from
X (electronic flash sync: fire when shutter if fully open) to FP (fire
when shutter begins to travel).  Oh yes, and use FP bulbs.

The FP bulbs worked just like the F280 flash by putting out light at a
more or less steady level for long enough to cover the focal-plane 
shutters travel time.

I don't suppose that 35mm SLRs have offered FP flash sync for some time,
though.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of making many books there is no end...  |  What's wrong with chasing 
                       -- Eccl. 12:12    |  nebulae till 3 am?  |-(
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.photo
From: jacobson@cello.hpl.hp.com (David Jacobson)
Subject: Re: Nikon N90 technobabble
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 22:02:18 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories

In article <PD.92Sep6022900@horus.sics.se> pd@sics.se (Per Danielsson) writes:
>Impressive as it may be, there is not one really new feature in the
>N90. Everything can be found in cameras already on the market. The
>difference being that the N90 is the first camera to combine all of
>the stuff mentioned in the press-releases.
>(Well, perhaps this 3D-matrix stuff is really new. I'm not quite sure
>about that).

I think the 5-segment pre-exposure and during-exposure flash metering
is new.  Canon used a pre-flash, but I'm not at all sure they had
multiple segments to see what bounced back.  Nikon apparently uses a
pre-flash and calculates the segment weighting that should used during
actualy exposure.  I'm not sure why up to 16 preflashes are sometimes
used.  

Alas, despite all this fancy stuff, there is no mention of mirror lockup.

  -- David Jacobson
From: donl@glass.esd.sgi.com (donl mathis)
Newsgroups: rec.photo
Subject: Re: View camera shades and filter holders
Date: 15 Sep 92 05:39:05 GMT
Reply-To: donl@glass.esd.sgi.com (donl mathis)
Distribution: rec
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc., Mountain View, CA, USA


In article <BuFK9u.1DH@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk>, jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack
Campin) writes:
|> bjs@uts.amdahl.com (Barry Sherman) wrote:
|> 
|> > Well there's the Compendium style if you have hundreds of dollars
|> > to spend.  I don't.
|> 
|> What might do a similar shading job but home-made: [...]

I agree.  A home-made holder seems like a good way to go.  My
(expensive) Linhof compendium shade is basically two frames that clamp
to a rail; the rail clamps to the top of the front standard.  Between
the two frames is a cloth bag; there is a circle of springy wire
running around inside the bag to keep it "puffed out."  The frames can
be slid back and forth on the rail as necessary.  The front one is
fancy; it can slide on it's clamp, so you can move it up, down, left or
right.  (This ability to move things around is important, so that you
can keep it out of the way when you use camera movements to alter the
direction of view.)  The frames also have a little lip around three
sides to hold 4" filters.

|> How do people usually fit polarizers to view cameras?

What's a polarizer?  :)

- donl mathis at Silicon Graphics Computer Systems, Mountain View, CA
donl@sgi.com