HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: smustopo@nyx.cs.du.edu (sofjan mustopoh)
Subject: Re: RE:Himbauan buat Rekan rekan
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 18:36:25 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.025932.21144@mailhost.ocs.mq.edu.au> s8923098@macna
.mqcs.mq.oz.au (Josef WIDJAJA) writes:
>In article <1992Nov14.192726.44789@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> andri@kuhub.cc.uk
ns.edu writes:
>|Selamat Datang ke Dunia Sastera Indonesia.
>|Pramudya Ananta Toer boleh jadi penulis Indonesia yang terbaik saat
>|ini.
>|Sayang buku buku karangannya lebih mudah dijumpai disini ketimbang di
>|Indonesia.
>|Kalau saya tak salah ada enam buku yang ditulisnya setelah bebas dari
>|TP Pulau BURU. Seluruhnya sudah diterbitkan dalam Bahasa
>|Inggeris(Penguin). Karya karyanya sebelum ditahan tidak ISTIMEWA. Saya
>|sudah baca "Diah : SiManis Bergigi Emas". Biasa saja.
>|
>
>Does anyone know if there is any Indonesian edition of his books ?
>I know that they are banned in Indonesia, but maybe some foreign 
>publishers publish them. I have read the english edition of
>'Anak Segala Bangsa', it's bloody excellent!
>
>
>--
> _________Josef Widjaja____________  
>|  s8923098@mackay.mpce.mq.edu.au  |
>|  Macquarie University, Australia | 
>|__________________________________| 


  I used to browsed used books store in indonesia 
  and bought Anadya toer indonesin books.
  The book seller doen't even know it is banned. 
  so i just bought. it i read out of curiosity
  it is quite good.
   Muskie
  Sofjan Mustopoh

Newsgroups: alt.culture.indonesia
From: okidz@ccs.northeastern.edu (Oki D Zakaria)
Subject: Re: Bahasa Indonesia yang baik dan benar ?
Keywords: bahasa indonesia
Organization: Northeastern University, CCS Dept.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 00:24:33 GMT


Maaf, saya membicarakan "interpreter" dua kali. Saya kira posting yang
pertama gagal, ternyata tidak.


okidz@dworkin.ccs.northeastern.edu

Newsgroups: alt.culture.indonesia
From: isae@IASTATE.EDU (ISU Boy !!!!!)
Subject: Re: <croons>
Reply-To: isae@IASTATE.EDU (ISU Boy !!!!!)
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 22:10:40 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.125606.44880@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>,
2hujrabbi@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:

> 	BTW, can we talk about music too here ? I'm a big fan of U2,
> REM, Tears for Fears, Queen, and Midnight Oil. I'm also a big fan of
> jazz, I have many favorite jazz musicians. (I like Dave Grusin and
> Special EFX a lot)

 Since we just have one measly newsgroup, why not? :)
 Hey, I love Queen and U2. Bring back Freddy (sp?)  Freddy lives !!! :)

 Jazz? yikes! New Age is the way to go! :)

 Btw, while we are on a music topic, do we have a good heavy metal band 
 back home there? I don't mean rock, I mean heavy metal.
 Don't think so, eh?

-Rony
 isae@IASTATE.EDU
Newsgroups: alt.culture.indonesia
From: prastowo@qucis.queensu.ca (Bambang Nurcahyo Prastowo)
Subject: Re: Bahasa Indonesia/Bahasa Malaysia
Keywords: bahasa indonesia
Organization: Computing & Information Science, Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:40:07 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.020328.3070@ems.psu.edu> nor@hekla.pnge.psu.edu (Nor-Azlan Nordin) writes:
>Saya rasa Bahasa Indonesia dan Bahasa Malaysia patut digabungkan.
Usaha untuk menggabungkan dua bahasa ini sudah lama dirintis oleh
pemerintah Indonesia dan Malaysia, antara lain dengan diterbitkannya
Pedoman Ejaan Yang Disempurnakan oleh Departemen Pendidikan dan
Kebudayaan RI yang merupakan penyesuain ejaan dengan Bahasa Malaysia.
Ada baiknya Saudara Nor-Azlan menayangkan padanan kata dalam BM
dari peristilahan yang sedang kita bahas saat ini.

Salam,
Bambang Prastowo
From: s8923098@macnab.mqcs.mq.oz.au (Josef WIDJAJA)
Subject: Re: Is there a solution for East Timor?
Organization: Macquarie University, School of Mathematics, Physics, Computing and Electronics
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 00:45:30 GMT

In article <1992Nov14.152440.12152@inesc.pt> rgc@eagle.inesc.pt (Rui Gustavo Crespo) writes:

|
|Your statement that Indonesia treats ETers as indonesians makes me worry! The
|(newly apppointed) ET governor said in a interview that it may be possible that
|more than ONE THOUSAND were kiled by the indonesian army 12 Nov. last year. 
|The continuous violations of Human Rights in East Timor have no correspondence,
|I believe, to the present situation in parts of Indonesia, such as Java. Does
|it mean that your government would like to do the same in Java, Sumatra and
|other islands of Indonesia? Of course not, because they feel part of Indonesia.
|East Timor, I believe, does not and, hence, ETers are treated harshly.

The violations of Human Rights as you mentioned are not only limited to 
East Timor. The present military regime first came to power in 1965 and 
on the way masterminded the biggest massacre in the country's history, their
excuse was it was an anti-communist cleanup operation. In many parts of
the country, it was especially directed to the chinese indonesians who 
died in millions and many were  forced to go back to china eventhough they were
born in the indonesia and spoke broken chinese. In West Borneo, some army 
commanders 'guided' the local aborigines ( they used to practice cannibalism)
to go headhunting, the chinese  heads being the targets.

I do not think that the present actions by the military regime are motivated
by the thinking that they can do anything in ET because ET is somehow
not really part of Indonesia. The military government is prepared to do the
same thing in other parts of Indonesia, Java, Sumatra, etc. The only difference
those regions have with ET is that the anti-government activities are not as
open as in ET. They have done that recently in Aceh most notably and also in
Jakarta, the capital city, when a small number of Muslim rebels clashed with 
the police and army in Jakarta's harbour. 

This is my honest opinion, i do not wish to take sides. The crunch point is
the present government is a military government who are used to this type of
iron-fist rule. They are prepared to do it not only in ET but also in other
parts of Indonesia. If you say that the ETers have not been treated as
Indonesians because of these harsh actions, then very few ethnic groups
have been treated as Indonesians (you can exclude even the Javanese and 
Sumatrans). On this point I have to disagree. 


--
 _________Josef Widjaja____________  
|  s8923098@mackay.mpce.mq.edu.au  |
|  Macquarie University, Australia | 
|__________________________________|
From: hira@cme.nist.gov (Ron Hira)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: RACISM
Date: 19 Nov 92 20:01:47 GMT
Reply-To: hira@cme.nist.gov
Organization: National Institute of Standards and Technology

In article <1992Nov18.223314.22221@midway.uchicago.edu>, moh2@quads.uchicago.edu (Kateri/Mary Anne) writes:
|> From: moh2@quads.uchicago.edu (Kateri/Mary Anne)
|> Subject: Re: RACISM
|> Date: 18 Nov 92 22:33:14 GMT
|> 
|> Two things...
|> A derogatory word for white is 'honky'.  Silly, I know....but
|> seriously offensive a generation or so back.

I don't think that many whites find this very offensive. Think about
the Stones' song 'Honky Tonk Woman.' Most of the whites I know find
'whitey' a bit more offensive, but its not necessarily satisfactory 
to me. It does not carry the same kind of connotation as 'nigger.'

|> And Ron, please....if you have to swear, swear, okay?  Saying sh** and
|> f*** is so damn pointless....and just makes me want to laugh.   If
|> you're afraid of offending somebody, don't swear at all....if you
|> don't care whether you offend somebody, say it outright.
|> This isn't intended just for Ron, btw....anybody out there doing this
|> is always welcome to my advice. :-)

I really didn't think that this would become a topic of discussion,
and I don't care to heed your advice. There's a reason why newspapers
and magazines do the same thing.

Believe me, I do know my fair share of expletives (thanks Soam). Its one 
thing that I did learn living in a frat.

Ron
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: moh2@quads.uchicago.edu (Kateri/Mary Anne)
Subject: Excluding men
Reply-To: moh2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 14:04:28 GMT


Hi guys.....here's something that's been disturbing me - tell me what
you think.

I was recently invited to subscribe to a mailing list for discussing
concerns of Indian women in the US.  Ok, well and good.  It's a
moderated list, with nightly digests sent out by the moderators, who
will rotate.  I think it grew out of soc.culture.india, because the
discussions on it appear to have been going for a while.

Now, my problem with the list is that men are excluded.  In fact, now
that I think about it, I'm not even sure that you're supposed to know
it exists, but that feels far too much like secret societies and the
KKK for me to be comfortable with it.  So I'm telling you about it.

At the moment, men are not allowed to read or post to the list...nor
are we supposed to crosspost to newsgroups, although that's up for
discussion.  What do you think?   This feels to me like
discrimination, despite the practical reasons for doing so.  (Those
being:  1)  women who are shy and afraid to speak around men, 2) men
who are loud and take over the conversation, 3) the focus of the group
turning away from women's issues and becoming another s.c.i., 4)
providing a safe space for women to discuss personal lives without
fears of their husband's friends hearing about it, or possible their
husbands, etc....)

 - Amirthi (who gets a very uneasy feeling at *any* form of exclusion
or separatism)
-- 
More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads.  One
path leads to despair and utter hopelessness.  The other to total
extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly.
						 - Woody Allen
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: moh2@quads.uchicago.edu (Kateri/Mary Anne)
Subject: Re: RACISM
Reply-To: moh2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 22:33:14 GMT

Two things...

A derogatory word for white is 'honky'.  Silly, I know....but
seriously offensive a generation or so back.

And Ron, please....if you have to swear, swear, okay?  Saying sh** and
f*** is so damn pointless....and just makes me want to laugh.   If
you're afraid of offending somebody, don't swear at all....if you
don't care whether you offend somebody, say it outright.
This isn't intended just for Ron, btw....anybody out there doing this
is always welcome to my advice. :-)

A list of common Anglo-Saxon expletives for those too innocent to
understand the Ron's post:  shit, damn, fuck, hell, bitch, cunt, dick,
spic, honky, nigger, fag, dyke (previous few depending on who uses
them), etc.  Mail me if you need definitions.

 - Amirthi (feeling just a tad confrontational today...)
-- 
More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads.  One
path leads to despair and utter hopelessness.  The other to total
extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly.
						 - Woody Allen
From: hira@cme.nist.gov (Ron Hira)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: Your Duty as an IA/American
Date: 18 Nov 92 20:35:30 GMT
Reply-To: hira@cme.nist.gov
Distribution: usa
Organization: National Institute of Standards and Technology

In article <6796@news.duke.edu>, dtk@teer27.acpub.duke.edu (DEVENDRA KUMAR) writes:
|> From: dtk@teer27.acpub.duke.edu (DEVENDRA KUMAR)
|> Subject: Re: Your Duty as an IA/American
|> Date: 7 Nov 92 20:37:48 GMT
|> 
|> I think it is important for us (Indian-Americans) to get more involved in
|> politics and society here. I grew up in India and while I'll always support India
|> this to be our country, how can we blame some Americans for not treating us well?
|> If we don't show any patriotism, I can understand why Americans (I'm referring to
|> Americans as `white americans' or whatever) don't treat us like they treat
|> themselves. I know I was angry when people in Bangalore would celebrate after
|> Pakistan beat India in cricket. It's the same deal here. The truth is that the
|> vast majority of Americans will treat you just fine if you don't act like a
|> foreigner here simply to make money. If you criticize their society, their values
|> etc. and consider yourself not American, I can see them being pretty defensive.
|> My opinion is that almost all racial tension that exists in this country (with
|> the exception of blatantly racist problem groups like the KKK) is as much the
|> fault of the minority as it is that of the majority.

What the heck is going on here??? Its somehow my fault that I get called a
sand nigger??? Its somehow my fault that I get stared at when I walk into
a place with a white woman??? 

It is a two way street, and some of the onus has to be put on minorities, 
by way of mixing/educating white *and* african americans that we're just
like them in many ways. But the media and white people also have to make
some kind of concerted effort to understand us. 

Ron
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian,soc.culture.indian
From: lata@silver.cs.umanitoba.ca (Lata Narayanan)
Subject: Re: Excluding men
Organization: Computer Science, University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:18:00 GMT

Satya Prabakar says:

>        In all institutions from which the cold wind of open
>        criticism is excluded, an innocent corruption begins
>        to grow like a mushroom - for example, in senates and
>        learned societies.              - Nietzsche

Do you have any reason to believe that open criticism is excluded
from this group? I can't believe that you  think that women are not 
capable of constructive criticism and debate. Nor is it the case
that all the women on the list are likely to agree on every issue. 
As for including open criticism from _everyone_, we can't do that 
anyway, right? So I am at a loss to understand what you mean by this
gloomy prediction.

--Lata Narayanan
(lata@silver.cs.umanitoba.ca)


Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: alok@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (alok.vijayvargia)
Subject: Re: MISUNDERSTANDING
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 22:26:12 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.232750.18487@nas.nasa.gov>, raghavan@wk28.nas.nasa.gov (Venkatraman Raghavan) writes:
> Attribution:
> 
>  >   = Ron Hira
>  >|> = Me flaming Ashish Vaidya:
>        [ As we all know, I am allergic to the initials A.V. :-) 
>          Just kidding, Alok. ]

What is wrong with Venkatramans ? First it was Sridhar Venkatraman, now it 
is Venkatraman Raghavan. One engaged in destroyed SCIA, other is destroying
acuai by making it devoid of any useful discussion. I think the discussion
on Racism is going quite well. What's wrong with Ashish Vaidya. You got
to give him credit for starting this discussion.

Does it have to do with that both Venkataramans have origins in the
land of 'Shiva Bhaktas' - ? 
(Shiva - Lord of Destruction)

Just kidding, Venkat boy.

Alok
From: samaddar@siemens.com (Sumitro Samaddar)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: arranged marriages
Date: 19 Nov 92 14:50:31 GMT
Reply-To: samaddar@siemens.com
Distribution: na

sanzgiri@bombay.metaphor.com (Ajit Sanzgiri) writes:

>	It may be my imagination but it seems to me that Indian (I suppose I
>	better say II) women are often more comfortable discussing sex among
>	themselves.

I agree ie; It may be my imagination too. But my sample size is not that
large. There may be other types as well. One II married woman I know is a
doctor from India. She managed to scandalize the other II women in my (wife's)
social circle by discussing sex clinically, sometimes even in the presence of
men. Once she was overheard telling her newly married (male) cousin to use
condoms. At night, this cousin and his wife were given the only bedroom in
the apartment to sleep, while the hosts slept in the living room. Our friend
warned her cousin not to come out of the room at night as they were "trying
to have a baby".

Do I like her candor or what :-)

Sumitro
From: fina2f@rosie.uh.edu (Venkatesh, P. C.)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: NYT bashing [was Re: Linear times in Amrika]
Date: 17 Nov 92 17:15:00 GMT
Organization: University of Houston
NNTP-Posting-Host: rosie.uh.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

------------------------
Posted for Susan Chacko
------------------------

In article <1992Nov17.035252.26591@seas.gwu.edu>, sram@seas.gwu.edu (Siddharth R. Ram) writes...
> 
>I do not think that the fact that only crisis events are covered implies in any
>way that the paper is biased. The fact is that only bad news makes for good reporting, irrespective of the country being covered, and this is largely because ofour desire to read stuff which is either horrifying or at the least, upsetting
>.. All the news about germany
>in the past few weeks has either been about the money markets going crazy,
>or the extreme right wing violence. Peru was in the news only because of a Coup
>attempt. When was the last time any of you saw the headlines say "Boy scout helps granny cross road, gets a pat on the back as reward" ?.
>The popular push in America would be to pedal India as a poor nation, wiht
>poverty and misery (not that it is completly off), just as japan likes to see
>America as a country with everyone with a gun in thier hands, in a drug induced
>stupor.
>In general, though, I think that The Washington Post is better with John Anderson covering india rather than Steve Cohen.
> 

(should that be Steve Coll?)
There's a new writer called Molly Something who wrote a fairly
reasonable article in the Post today, about a school for bonded
labourers in India. A far cry from Barbara Crossette, who would
have written about the miseries of bonded labour without ever
mentioning that anyone was trying to do anything about it. She,
unfortunately, is now stationed in my current hometown, DC.

Susan.
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: hira@cme.nist.gov (Ron Hira)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: SEX
Date: 23 Nov 92 18:47:48 GMT
Reply-To: user@machine.domain
Organization: National Institute of Standards and Technology

In article <1eqtfuINNhqc@menudo.uh.edu>, mba2@Rosie.UH.EDU (Puneet_S) writes:
|> From: mba2@Rosie.UH.EDU (Puneet_S)
|> Subject: Re: SEX
|> 
|> PS	I realize it's a difficult topic to discuss, and I've noticed, as I
|> 	expected, some of the regulars as well as irregulars have not posted
|> 	on this topic.... Conclusion.... It's not a topic that people are
|> 	comfortable with....hence the problems concering this topic in our
|> 	culture are real....there is hypocrisy....

Well, I'll take the bait as a semi-irregular. :-) I just find the
topic essentially a non-issue. It seems that Indians are obsessed
with whether sex is right or wrong, moral or immoral. I never have
these types of conversations with friends. Why? Because its the
'90s and we live in america. 

Ron
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: c150-bt@po.berkeley.edu (Manish Vij)
Subject: Re: Excluding men
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:39:51 GMT

In article <1992Nov16.140428.12218@midway.uchicago.edu> moh2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>
>Now, my problem with the list is that men are excluded.  In fact, now
>that I think about it, I'm not even sure that you're supposed to know
>it exists, but that feels far too much like secret societies and the
>KKK for me to be comfortable with it.  So I'm telling you about it.

According to Uma, it was announced in various newsgroups (none of which
I subscribe to).  Maybe she should hit acuai next time, too.

>At the moment, men are not allowed to read or post to the list...nor
>are we supposed to crosspost to newsgroups, although that's up for
>discussion.  What do you think?   This feels to me like
>discrimination, despite the practical reasons for doing so.  (Those
>being:  1)  women who are shy and afraid to speak around men, 2) men
>who are loud and take over the conversation, 3) the focus of the group
>turning away from women's issues and becoming another s.c.i., 4)
>providing a safe space for women to discuss personal lives without
>fears of their husband's friends hearing about it, or possible their
>husbands, etc....)

(4) is an excellent reason for excluding men, considering how networked
the Indian community is.

It seems analogous to the rap sessions my male friends and I have.  There
are issues I feel more comfortable talking with guys about than with
women.  And if I buy Robert Bly, pound on a bongo drum and take off for
a 'wild man' weekend, that should be my prerogative :-).

Is it a safe haven, or is it a forum of serious power?  Are issues discussed,
or are conspiracies hatched?  Is it a Bohemian Club where the rich and
powerful goof off and scheme to rule the nation?  If not, by all means,
discuss.

Manish

masculist and feminist,
integrationist,
rights for all sexes (but not sex for all rights ;) )
and healthy dialogue.
   Such wild returns I make to the womb of civilization.  Three weeks
   a year in the Peleponnese, every bed booked in advance, every meal
   paid for by vouchers, cautious jaunts in hired Fiats, suitcase
   crammed with Kao-Pectate!  Such a fantastic surrender to the primitive.
From: moh2@quads.uchicago.edu (Kateri/Mary Anne)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: SEX
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:45:01 GMT
Reply-To: moh2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations

In article <1el01bINN45a@bigboote.WPI.EDU> udumudi@vanilla (u v babu srinivas) writes:
>A == Amirthi [Kateri/Mary Anne] (moh2@quads.uchicago.edu) wrote:

Thought I should answer my own questions, and the rest, so...

>A> How do you feel about:
>
>A> 8. Homosexuals? (sex with someone of the same sex)

No problem, though somewhat limited. :-)

>A> 9. Bisexuals? (people who sleep with members of both sexes)

I'm bi, so I guess I don't mind it.  (I hadn't planned to post this
info here, but it's come up on other newsgroups, and people here have
asked, so there it is.  I'm more than willing to talk about it with
anybody interested....flames will be ignored).

>A> 10. Polyamory? (simultaneous relationship with more than one person)

Assuming honesty and acceptance on the part of *all* involved, no
problem.

>A> 11. Sadism? (sexual arousal by means of inflicting pain)
>A> 12. Masochism? (sexual arousal by mean of being hurt)

Neither my thing, but two (or more) consenting adults are free to
do...etc.

>how do you feel about:
>
>13. [unmarried] having sex with a neighbour's/friend's wife?  

I assume the neighbor doesn't know about it?  In very poor taste.
What's more important to you, sex or your friends?

>14. [married] having sex with friend's/neighbour's wife?

Same as above, plus your partner should know about it.

>15. [married/unmarried] having sex with someone who you don't
>    know very well, but know that s/he is married?

Not really your responsibility....but you should encourage honesty at
all times....keeps things from getting really messy.

>
>16. with a distant relative, sex with whom is prohibited in your 
>    culture?

Distant relative?  Like third cousin twice-removed?  Assuming no risk
of birth defects, why not?

>17. within a family?

Children are off-limits.  Completely.  Falls under the non-consent
rule - they can't be informed enough to really consent.

Anything else is not my interest, but I suppose okay.

(at this point, you may be wondering if *anything* is off-limits to
me....I object strongly to non-consensual sex, therefore children,
animals, and dead people are off-limits. :-)

 - Amirthi, the depraved
-- 
More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads.  One
path leads to despair and utter hopelessness.  The other to total
extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly.
						 - Woody Allen
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian