HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: wmcfadde@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu (William McFadden)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Date: 30 Sep 92 14:52:31 GMT
Organization: Ohio University CS Dept,. Athens

Another reason FWD cars are gaining popularity is that
a car of a given exterior size can have more interior volume, because
the transmission and driveshaft aren't extended back below the
passenger compartment. Compare a Pinto or Chevette to any front
drive econo-box, and see how little floor space the RWD cars have 
compared to the FWD cars. Thus, a car can be small enough and light
enough to get decent fuel economy, and light enough to have decent
performance with today's smaller engines, and still have very impressive
interior space.

Eric.
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
Date: Tuesday, 29 Sep 1992 13:14:48 PST
From: George F. Maclin <GEORGE@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject:    92 BMW 525 Prices (AT & all options)

A friend of mine is considering replacing his 84 BMW with a new one.  The
dealer still has lots of 92 BMW 525s, so my friend is being pressured to
by one of these.  The problem is, my friend doesnt know what a 92 BMW 525,
with an automatic transmission and all of the options, should sell for this
late in the model year.  Does anyone out there have any idea what my friend
can expect to pay for a 92 BMW 525 when purchsed from one of the local BMW
dealerships?  He has been quoted $34200, but he think this is too much for
a 92.  :-)

These are my thoughts and no one else's.
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
From: c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Date: 2 Oct 92 18:45:07 GMT
Organization: Delco Electronics Corp.

In article <1992Oct1.235700.5745@neocad.com> carl@neocad.com (Carl Stern) writes:
>smith@ctron.com (Larry Smith) writes:
>
>>Rear Wheel Drive _cars_ for sale in the USA, 1992:

>>Did I miss any this time?

> there are definitely more:
>
> : : :
>Cadillac Allante
> : : :

The Allante is front wheel drive. In fact, with the Northstar engine
it's the most powerful front wheel drive car in production, I think
around 295hp or so.

The Seville and Eldorado are also FWD. The bigger, more traditional
Caddy (what's'it's'name) I think is rear wheel drive.

Spiros
-- 
Spiros Triantafyllopoulos                    c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com
Software Technology, Delco Electronics       striantafyll@kosds1.gm.hac.com
GM Hughes Electronics, Kokomo, IN 46904      [A Different Kind of Disclaimer]
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: atovorni@engr.UVic.CA (Andreas  Tovornik)
Subject: Re: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Reply-To: atovorni@engr.UVic.CA
Organization: University of Victoria, Victoria, BC, Canada
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 02:16:36 GMT

In article 24208@cbnewsm.cb.att.com, newark@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (antonio.cruz) writes:

>Handling might be the other factor. FWD handles better in the snow because
>of the weight from the engine and transaxle on the front end. RWD seem to
>handle badly in the snow because of less weight in the trunk area.
>RWD usual have one turning power wheel (posi has two). FWD has two turning
>wheels.

FWD is only better for getting the car moving. When it comes to slowing down
on snow, the forward weight bias makes it easier for the rear brakes to lock
up, and the car swaps ends. I have had experiences where I felt perfectly safe
with FWD and a split second later was spinning into a ditch. Lose that rear and
you'll never get it back. RWD is at least predictable on snow.

Andy.
From: rlm@wyvern.twuug.com (Robert Mohrmann)
Subject: Removing spots on instrument panel.
Organization: Tidewater UNIX Users Group
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 17:22:59 GMT

Please forgive me if this is in a FAQ but I dont read this group
much.

I have some spots that look like water spots on my instrument
panel on the plexiglass.

Normal glass cleaner does'nt seem to remove them.

Does anyone have any ideas.

Thanks in advance.
-- 
**-- rlm@wyvern.twuug.com --***********************************************
|    Robert Lee -SAURIAN- Mohrmann  |    Exodus 4:1-5    Numbers 21:5-9   |
***************************************************************************
From: newark@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (antonio.cruz)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Date: 28 Sep 92 23:35:37 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T

>Anyone have any comments/arguments on whether Front Wheel Drive (FWD) or
>Rear Wheel Drive (RWD) is better for handling?  Obviously this is a very broad
>subject but I have a friend that says FWD is best and I do not agree.  Anyone
>have some proof of either?
 

Cost might be a factor in which is better. Excessive wearing of front
tires (engine weight), ripped CV boots (salt deposits), or expensive
alignment repairs on the FWD. RWD, differential gears damaged or damaged
axle from crash. Remember, new technology (FWD) seems to cost more than 
old (RWD) to repair.

Handling might be the other factor. FWD handles better in the snow because
of the weight from the engine and transaxle on the front end. RWD seem to
handle badly in the snow because of less weight in the trunk area.
RWD usual have one turning power wheel (posi has two). FWD has two turning
wheels.

++++
Tony
++++
From: fitch@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: CRX Questions
Date: 6 Oct 92 12:59:00 -0500
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

I am looking at an '87 Honda CRX (standard model) as a replacement for my vw
jetta.  The car looks clean, has 64K miles plus standard options (AC, Honda
AM/FM cassette) and is priced at $6,300 (retail book is $4,900).  Is this car
worth pursuing (after knocking the price down)?  Are there any particulars
about this CRX I should know of?

Thanks in advance,

Ron Fitch 
University of Northern Iowa
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: stxtnt@rs733.GSFC.NASA.Gov (Nigel Tzeng)
Subject: Re: Opinion on 1992 Acura Integra wanted
Organization: Goddard Space Flight Center, Greenbelt, Md, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 17:00:57 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.004248.459@udel.edu> shridhar@dewey.udel.edu (Kartik Shridhar) writes:


   I am looking for a 92 Acura Integra LS
		      4 Dr with Air Conditioner

   Could any one give me a good price for this. Including
   invoice + dealer profit.
    How much should I take off from the price if
   they can give me a demo model with about 1500 miles on it.

My girlfriend just bought a 92 integra LS.  She paid $15500 for it and
it had AC, mudguards and alarm.  She got $500 for a worthless trade in
(bought sight unseen) so they must have had at least $500 worth of cushion
on the $15500 price.

After reading the arious books we figured tey made maybe $1000 on the
list price and really brought the money in with the dealer installed
stuff (like the $1200 price tag for AC).  We figure they made $500 on
the car.

   Thanks Kartik 

Nigel Tzeng
--
Nigel Tzeng
.sig under construction
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: welty@cabot.balltown.cma.COM (richard welty)
Subject: Re: ALLOY WHEELS - why?
Organization: New York State Institute for Sebastian Cabot Studies
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 16:55:56 GMT

In article <25860@oasys.dt.navy.mil> bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense) writes:
>In rec.autos, ebergman@phaedrus.East.Sun.COM (Eric Bergman) writes:
>>I know zilch about alloy wheels.  What do they do for you?
>>What are the pro's and con's of alloy wheels?

>Let's see, where to start?
>1) They're lighter.

they can be lighter; sometimes they are heavier.  depends on the
manufacturer.

>2) They're generally stiffer, if you get a performance based wheel.

again, this is generally true, but there are some steel wheels that
are quite good (Borianis, to name one top notch steel wheel.)

mostly i agree with ron, though.

cheers,
  richard
-- 
richard welty                            518-393-7228
welty@cabot.balltown.cma.com
  ``if you can read this, mario, you're too close''
    -- bumper sticker seen on a CART safety truck
From: prm@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (paul.r.mount)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Need recommendation Tires for Mazda 323 sedan
Keywords: traction, durability, quality
Date: 29 Sep 92 22:19:38 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbnewsl.1992Sep29.221938.1372
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories


	My 89 Mazda 323 4door sedan seems ready for new tires. (The
original equipment GT Special 351 tires have 74K on them and squeal
when I go around corners anymore).

	I'm looking for recommendations from Mazda owners what's a 
good tire.  Some of the qualities and considerations:

	Good traction in rain and snow
	at least aB temperature rating
	Designed to last as long as possible.  As I'm planning to keep
this car as long as possible, I don't want a 30,000 mile tire.
	
	The current tires are 175/70SR13.	I guess these are as wide
as will fit the car (don't see any "65" in ads in the sports section).

	Are the "real" tire ads to be found in Car & Driver rather
than in the Sports section of the news paper?  Or just better prices?

	Finally, any experience with the Eurotire chain (I know there
are two out here in Fairfield and Paramus NJ)?

	Thanks
From: sly9y@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: SHO Engine
Date: 2 Oct 92 11:19:38 MDT
Distribution: na
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1992Sep29.194929.17077@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>, awds_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (ClarkKent) writes:
> -another word on the Taurus SHO v6-
> 
> I got my Ford Motorsports catalogue recently:-)  
> You can BUY a complete SHO engine, including the acc. pulleys,
> a/c compressor, wiring harness, and computer.  The price?  
> Gee, they didn't list any prices in the catalogue.  Call Lou
> Fusz wholesale parts, they usually carry parts at about 20% less
> than Ford retail, maybe more if you give them a number from the
> Motorsports catalogue.  I'm sure we'd all love to hear from someone
> who successfully installs one of these in a Probe!
                                              ^^^^^^
Better yet, in a Pinto wagon with a paxton supercharger, a t-5 overdrive,
and good tires on back.  Think of the look on Camaro/firebird owners when
they get roasted by a baby-blue wood paneled PINTO!!!!!!!!
:-)

Pete
sly9y@cc.usu.edu
> 
> 		Adam Edwards
> awds_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu
From: eliot@lanmola.engr.washington.edu (eliot)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: downforce and cornering g's (was which car handles the best?
Date: 28 Sep 92 09:35:37 GMT
Article-I.D.: engr.Sep28.090631.19006
Organization: clearer than blir

In article <1992Sep27.193822.23582@koko.csustan.edu> james@koko.csustan.edu (Jonas Grumpy) writes:

>> when the japanese
>>jump aboard with the NSX III or the 300 ZX VII or the RX7 V, don't be
>>too surprised to see 2g's.  remember, you heard it here first.  :-)

>You mean in a few years the Japanese are going to be jumping on the band
>wagon the Ferrari F40 started 5! years ago(Yup thats right folks, the F40
>is FIVE years old). Wow!1 Leave it to the japanese to take something to
>the extreme level of sillyness. We will be lucky if we can still drive
>internal combustion engines by the time the japanese get to the NSX 3. 

[etc]

I see that I have pushed one of your hot buttons.  Allow me to clarify
my position a little more..  First of all, I still have great
affection and appreciation for Italian cars, having owned one myself
in the distant past (what do you drive, btw?) and having a cousin who
is the ultimate italian car freak.  My point about the Japanese
jumping on the bandwagon and going all out on the downforce thing is
based not on having any great love for that country's products.
rather, it is based on history.  time and time again we have seen
american and european manufacturers come up with revolutionary ideas,
[alfa having variable valve timing way before honda did, for example]
but developing it only to 85% of its potential, leaving the japanese
to come in to do the last 15% and then making mucho bucks out of it.
european ceo's admit this, and i don't think you will find much
disagreement with this if you go talk to anyone in the car industry.

once again with positive downforce we see that it is a european maker
that is introducing the concept.  it remains to be seen what will
happen eventually, but my prediction would be history repeating
itself.

about positive downforce itself, how many cars do you know of now that
is currently artificially limited to 155 mph?  i can think of several
bmws, benzes, the nsx (?) and a couple of other hot rod japanese cars.
sooner or later they are going to realize that rather than to chop off
power and not use the engine to its full potential, it is probably
better to turn that excess horsepower/top speed into downforce.  it
would be the logical thing to do.  it would also be the practical
thing to do.  quite honestly, how many opportunities are there to
drive at 160 or 190 mph, even in germany?  i submit to you that a 180
or 190 mph top speed is becoming quite irrelevant.  on the other hand,
doing 2g's at 55 mph sounds like a much more inviting proposition.
i applaud the ford engineers for making a bold and brave move.

it would be hilarious if 10 years down the road the lawmakers decide
to impose cornering g limits on curves and introduce a lateral g radar
guns  :-) 


eliot
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: ayers@adobe.com (Robert Ayers)
Subject: Good/Bad Mazda Dealers?
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Distribution: ba
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 00:43:09 GMT

I'm interested in opinions, war-stories, experiences, good or bad, 
about the sales and service departments of the nearby south-bay 
Mazda dealers:

    Sunnyvale Mazda
    Peninsula Mazda (redwood city)
    Putnam Mazda (burlingame)
    
eMail, rather than posting, preferred.

Bob
From: jfox@hooksett.East.Sun.COM (John Fox - SunExpress IR)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Why not a Taurus SHO Wagon??
Date: 6 Oct 92 20:54:30 GMT
Reply-To: jfox@hooksett.East.Sun.COM
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: hooksett.east.sun.com

In article 1344@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com, sharen@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (Sharen A. Rund) writes:
> In article <1asf6lINNgq7@seven-up.East.Sun.COM> jfox@hooksett.East.Sun.COM writes:
> >In article 110118WJT101@psuvm.psu.edu, <WJT101@psuvm.psu.edu> () writes:
> >> Hello,
> >> I was wondering why Ford hasn't offered the SHO engine on the Taurus
> >>  Wagon.  Especially now that the Taurus SHO is available with an automatic
> >>  transmission, I would think many "30-something"  wagon buyers would be
> >>  interested in this type of setup.  Is there some engineering reason why the
> >>  SHO powertrain can't be placed in the wagon??
> >> 
> >> 
> >> --RICK
> >
> >I remember a thread kicking around dec's carbuffs notesfile in reference
> >to an SHO wagon. I think it turned out to be a Ford exec who had it built...
> >
> >My feeling on it is that it would hurt the overall SHO image. For the same
> >reasons you don't take the Mustang 5.0 platform and make a wagon out of it,
> >or put the M5 motor in the 5 series wagon, you don't want to spread the
> >SHO name in cars whose purposes generally stray from the hi-po sedan
> >market.
> >
> don't know about hurting the SHOs image or not, but I wish the SHO 
> would have been available when I bought my Taurus wagon - and,
> yes, I'm in the 30-something... group, but my car is the wagon that
> came with everything, 3.8 engine, all black and in the process of
> being made to look _go-o-o-d_, e.g., front roof rack is off (back
> one almost reminds you of a spoiler) - the grey on the bottom's
> going next - it'll be black, then tinting on all the windows that
> can be tinted (legally in CA), there's a lowering kit to lower it 
> a bit in front for better handling on curves & turns - and, if
> you've ever seen Thom Taylors black Chevy wagon, I'll have the Taurus
> equivalent.....then let any one say that the wagon takes away
> from the SHOs status, etc.....B-)
> 
> -- 
> ________________       __        ________________   "They that can give up
> \_________      \     /_ \      /      _________/  essential liberty to 
>  \_________      \_____/  \____/      _________/  obtain temporary safety
>   \___________________      __________________/  deserve neither liberty 
>                      /______\                   nor safety."  
> ALL disclaimers apply ....                           --Benjamin Franklin
> 	  


One person does not a market segment make. I'm sure there are a few that
would like an SHO wagon, but there might be more potential SHO sedan
buyers who would be turned off if the hot engine wasn't so exclusive.
Plus the fact that Ford is in the volume car building business. I'm sure
there are a few execs at Ford who wish they never made the SHO. Imagine
if they tried that with the wagon?



John
From: summ50@cse.unl.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: FWD vs. RWD, Which is best.
Date: 29 Sep 92 18:00:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: unlinfo.1992Sep29.180036.1908
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln

dbernard@thewho.Central.Sun.COM (Dave Bernard) writes:


>>Handling might be the other factor. FWD handles better in the snow because
>>of the weight from the engine and transaxle on the front end. RWD seem to
>>handle badly in the snow because of less weight in the trunk area.
>>RWD usual have one turning power wheel (posi has two). FWD has two turning
>>wheels.


>But couldn't a RWD neutralize the snow advantage simply by stacking a couple
>hundred pounts of sand bags in the trunk (over the rear wheels)?

>	Dave


	Or by driving a Corvair.   :)


                                                                   __
/-----------------------------+---------------+-------------------///-------\  
|    ___  __   ___  __   __   |               | Multitasking __  ///        |
|   |    |  | |    |__   __|  |  Unsafe at    | my life      \\\///  Amiga  |
|   |___ |__| |     __| |__|  |  any speed... | away !!!      \XX/   3000   |
|-----------------------------+---------------+-----------------------------| 
|    Eric Elliott            summ50@cse.unl.edu         GEnie: E.ELLIOTT7   |
\---------------------------------------------------------------------------/


--
 
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: quadrun@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Jason G Velasco)
Subject: Re: 10 Re: SURVEY: which car handles the best?
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 10:24:28 GMT

In article <1992Sep21.205759.21829@schbbs.mot.com> W10572@maccvm.corp.mot.com (Timothy Palka) writes:
>
>Well everything I read, and my recent test drive of the new RX7 make this car
>the closet thing to having a race car for the street. The above mention cars
>certainly offer alot more ease to the kidneys but if we are talking handling
>here folks the RX7 wins big time and not just in the 30k range. Not to many
>street cars out there that can give you 1g cornering power.
>
>Of course there is the awd eagle talon that will out corner the rx7, out
>run the bmw m5 and priced well below anything in this price/performance
>range. as for maintainance all I've had to do to mine over the last three
>seasons is change oil.
>
>timp---

Sorry.  When I test-drove the Talon the suspension seemed too soft and the
car handled sloppily.  The steering doesn't offer that much feel...

I was more impressed back in '88 with my friend's (current, back then) RX-7.

This reinforced my belief that Car & Driver will ignore flaws in a car
provided that it does 0-60 in less than seven seconds.  I'm pretty sure
I wouldn't be that impressed with a Stealth / 3000GT either.

I think I'm biased towards European cars.  Hmm...  Well, I like the way the
G20 handles...  it feels better in an off ramp than the Talon.  Then again,
the guy who engineered the G20's suspension lived in Germany long enough
to speak German better than English.  (He's Japanese).  Someone made a
reference here of what the G20 is trying to be...  Was it a Peugeot?

Then again, you did say "out corner".  Ok...  Doesn't the Celica GT-S
pull .85 g's?  Doesn't the Saturn SC pull around .84g?  

What I'm trying to say is that you cannot judge a car on raw data alone.
The title of the original post DOES say "which car handles best?" 

Jason
-- 
Jason Velasco                                      quadrun@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: jlysagh@hubcap.clemson.edu (james joseph lysaght)
Subject: Re: Saturn, Honda, and Japan
Organization: Clemson University
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 16:54:03 GMT

>In Consumer Electronics/Cameras there'd be no US sales either.  Our
>domestic electronics (TVs/VCRs/Stereo/etc) industry is virtually non-
>existent.
 
For whoever mentioned this... I would be interested in discussing this
further (but on short term) because I have several products in the
TV/VCR/Stereo/etc class that are american made and were purchased
because they were far better than the japenese equivalent.  Lets take it
to E-Mail though as it has little to do with cars.  My E-Mail address is
FALCON@HUBCAP.CLEMSON.EDU

Jim
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: joso@vega.math.ualberta.ca (Joseph_So)
Subject: Re: Wanna be disgusted?
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 03:36:32 GMT

seymour@bnr.ca (Jeffrey Seymour) writes:

>Hello Networld.  Here is some trully agravating info 4 U. 

>Those of us in Canada have been getting reamed with taxes lately- especially if you reside in Ontario.  Starting October 1st Ontario is not going to believe you when you try to get a second hand car registered - with respect to the purchase price.  On this date new legislation goes into affect whereby the tax paid on licencing will be computed on the sales agreement price or a value in some bullshit book -which ever is more.  I'm serious.

>I think thats enough for me. Time to start looking into that transfer to the U.S..

>bitch bitch bitch

Here in Alberta, there is no provincial sales tax (at
least not yet). As for GST, there is no GST on used cars
if it is done privately (my wife bought a 90 Corolla from
her brother for 1 buck - no GST). However, I believe somebody
has to pay GST if it is done through the dealer. 


--------------------------------
Joseph So
Mathematics, U of Alberta, Edmonton
joseph@hyper.math.ualberta.ca
Xref: sparky rec.autos:23170 rec.autos.tech:13424 rec.autos.sport:10808 alt.autos.antique:1879
From: sharen@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (Sharen A. Rund)
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech,rec.autos.sport,alt.autos.antique,hotrod@dixie.com
Subject: von dutch
Keywords: autos
Date: 2 Oct 92 14:34:49 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Lockheed Missiles and Space Co.

For all of you out there who have enjoyed looking at flames, pinstriping,
graphics, etc on cars - I found out the following last night:

von dutch - one of the original pinstripers,
died last week after battling a liver infection for over two years
(possibly caused by the amount of lead in the paints he used for his
work) 

known for his eyeballs (flying and whatever), pinstriping with a 
steady hand while talking and looking around without missing a 
stroke and line perfect everytime, gag photos (portrait with paint
brushes coming out of his ears, or a siplled bucket of paint with
him coming out of it, etc) - his uniqueness, talent, flair and 
love of life will be missed in the world of cars


-- 
________________       __        ________________   "They that can give up
\_________      \     /_ \      /      _________/  essential liberty to 
 \_________      \_____/  \____/      _________/  obtain temporary safety
  \___________________      __________________/  deserve neither liberty 
                     /______\                   nor safety."  
ALL disclaimers apply ....                           --Benjamin Franklin
	  
Newsgroups: rec.autos