HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mhall@netcom.com (Michael Hall)
Subject: Re: Red Eyed Tree Frogs
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: ba
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 21:15:42 GMT

tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer) writes:

>In article <1i0bv5INN7ul@pith.uoregon.edu> tenny@euclid.uucp (Nathan Tenny) writes:
>>In article <simonb.725759377@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU> simonb@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (Simon Blomberg) writes:
>>>Forgive my ignorance, but _what_ are red-eyed tree frogs (Genus, species:
>>
>>The editorial column in _The Vivarium_ a few months back said that they used
>>to be available cheaply and in large numbers, that no one did much work with
>>them, and now they're "virtually unobtainable."  (Glades had a few of them
>>for $85 each last month, though.)
>>

>I was in S.F. about a month ago and toodled down to the East Bay Vivarium
>just to see if they had anything interesting.  I'm fairly certain they had
>red-eyed tree frogs (though I didn't check price since I'm not an
>"amphibian person").

Yes, in the San Francisco Bay Area, the East Bay Vivarium has red-eyed
tree frogs for about $90 each, and I saw some somewhere else (maybe
Dolphin Pet Village) for about $120 each, and also I heard that a
"herp broker" will be getting in some this week for $40 each.  These are
all adults.  I don't know if they were captive-bred.

-- 
Michael Hall   \ 
personal account\Big Brother knows if you picked up those tickets off the floor
mhall@netcom.com \
From: at15+@andrew.cmu.edu (Andrew Lewis Tepper)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: What do Anoles eat?
Date: 4 Jan 93 19:20:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.AfGFePC00WB7ESlNod
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Fluffy, my savannah monitor was refusing to eat for almost 4 weeks. He
always used to love mice, but lately hadn't touched them. The pet store
suggested I try a variety of foods, so I bought a rat, two anoles, and a
couple dozen crickets. The good news is that he went _wild_ for the
crickets, and gobbled them up. He didn't eat the anoles, and they are
now living in his cage. (Ever hear of a savannah monitor sharing a cage
with anoles?!?) In case fluffy dosen't eat them, what should I give them
to eat?

Andy
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: christ@sci.ccny.cuny.edu (Chris Thompson)
Subject: Color vision in snakes?
Reply-To: christ@sci.ccny.cuny.edu (Chris Thompson)
Organization: City College of New York - Science Computing Facility
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 16:54:36 GMT

A while back, during the thread discussing various snakes' gustatory
preferences, several people asserted that snakes posessed color
vision, as evidenced by the fact that they would only eat certain
colored prey.  I checked this out with a herpetologist friend of mine,
and also received confirmation on a snake special on The Discovery 
Channel the other night.  While snakes do not posess color vision
at all, they can PROBABLY detect shade differences by the varying
amount of heat that different colored fur or hair emits.  Snakes
have very limited vision as we define it, and rely much more upon
the data gathered by the vomeronasal organ, which senses heat only.
They can (obviously) also detect ground vibrations from quite a ways
off.

Chris Thompson

-- 
(Help!  I've fallen and I can't reach my beer!)
From: tmohler+@cs.cmu.edu (Tim Mohler)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Keywords: This article printed on 100% recycled electrons
Date: 6 Jan 93 17:21:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C0G076.M3A.1
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

In article <1993Jan5.230138.12940@Csli.Stanford.EDU> kyle@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Kyle Wohlmut) writes:
>O, and need we mention Gerbils are illegal in California anyway?
>Can't get hide nor hair of them here, in stores or in the wild.  Might
>be a nice solution for the rest of you, though...

Whyever for? More CA froo-froo?

Tim
From: tenny@euclid.uucp (Nathan Tenny)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Ball Phythons
Date: 6 Jan 1993 18:25:03 GMT
Organization: Department of Mathematics, University of Oregon
NNTP-Posting-Host: euclid.uoregon.edu


Wild-caught ball pythons are notoriously picky eaters, though there is now a
pretty well-developed art of getting them to eat.  The problem doesn't seem
to exist with captive-raised animals...mine will eat just about anything.

They're beautiful snakes, very handlable, but they do tend to hide a lot.  I
find myself wishing I'd given them a less effective hide box...

	NT
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: tjfeue@bb1t.monsanto.com
Subject: Snake regurgitation problem
Organization: Monsanto Company, St. Louis, MO
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 17:54:09 GMT

My Black Rat Snake has trouble keeping food down.  He eats a mouse
and after 1-2 days regurgitates it.  It is barely digested.  I found
him on a road trying to sun and attacking the bottoms of passing 
cars about 3 months ago.  I'm getting worried since he's starting to
have a noticable weight loss.  Any ideas?

Ted Feuerbach - Scientific Systems Consultant
Disclaimer:     Monsanto didn't say this, I did!
From: mwaldvog@ent1.ent.ncsu.edu (Michael Waldvogel)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: NO PEST STRIPS
Date: 11 Jan 93 23:47:33 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Entomology - NCSU, Raleigh, NC
Originator: mwaldvog@ent1.ent.ncsu.edu

A reader inquired about No-Pest Strips (I lost the article).
In the U.S.A., they will be available shortly.  The product is still
under review by the EPA for certain types of exposure to the chemical.  
One thing to note, the product label now states that the strip should 
not be used in rooms where individuals are likely to have frequent exposure 
(e.g., someone who is bedridden).

Take that for what it's worth.

Mike Waldvogel

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
| Michael Waldvogel, NCSU-Entomology, Box 7613, Raleigh NC 27695-7613   |
|=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=|
| Voice: (919) 515-2703      |  INTERNET: waldvogel@ent.ncsu.edu        |
| FAX:   (919) 515-7746      |  USDA-FTSMAIL: a348capsranc@attmail.com  |
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

-- 
| Michael Waldvogel  - waldvogel@ent.ncsu.edu |
| Dept. of Entomology, N.C. State University  |
| Raleigh, North Carolina  27695-7613         |
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center
Date: Thursday, 7 Jan 1993 01:36:53 EST
From: <CBTCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Color vision in snakes?
 <1993Jan6.184846.17128@midway.uchicago.edu>

WHEW!!  This is Chris Thompson again (same as the original poster).
I evidently didn't get my facts srtaight before posting, or I was misled.
Or I wasn't clear.  What I DO know is this: when I asked a herpetologist
straight out "Do snakes have color vision?", he said "No".  Now I am told that
snakes have rods & cones, in high enough proportions that they would have
effective color vision.  I also read a moderately involved post about the
neural pathways in snakes (GLAD I took neuro, although I fought every minute!).

I will check things out again, as soon as my herp pal gets back from
teaching/vacation (he's teaching a field class in Jamaica, the BUM!).

To all who replied, thanks.  To the person who was worried about his post
sounding like a super-flame (PMB?) no problem.  I'd rather get my facts
straight (I'm supposed to TEACH this stuff!  But I'm also an ornithologist!)


Chris
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: fields@news.cis.ohio-state.edu (jonathan david fields)
Subject: two baby igs for sale
Organization: The Ohio State University Department of Computer and Information Science
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 22:30:33 GMT

 
 I have two baby (about 6 months old) green iguanas for sale.  Both have their
 own 30 gallon tanks with lids and many extras.  Please leave me mail if
 you are interested in one or both.  Thanks,
 
 Jeff Rosen (Rosen@CIS@ohio-state.edu)
From: tenny@euclid.uucp (Nathan Tenny)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Ball Pythons II: eating (or not)
Date: 10 Jan 93 19:45:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: pith.1ipubvINNsan
Reply-To: tenny@euclid.uoregon.edu
Organization: Department of Mathematics, University of Oregon
NNTP-Posting-Host: euclid.uoregon.edu

First off, Rule #1 in ball python care is to get Philippe de Vosjoli's book on
them, which costs about $5-$10 and is published by the Herpetocultural Library.

In article <1993Jan10.035324.24216@athena.mit.edu> remcat@athena.mit.edu (Rachel Emily Molenaar) writes:
>Right now, I am planning on trying gerbils, since she has refused mice, but I
>would like confirmation first on whether or not this is likely to work. 

Gerbils are natural ball python prey items; mice aren't.  So gerbils are a good
approach.  Here are Philippe's suggestions on getting reluctant balls to eat:
	1. Make sure she has a shelter, ideally one in which she can hide
	without being pestered by her dinner until she decides to come forth
	and eat it.
	2. Make sure the temperature is 85 degrees, with some areas a little
	warmer.  (Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are only at about 82 degrees,
	with probably an 87-88 degree warm area, and seem to be fine---but
	they're captive-bred and good eaters to start.)
	3. At night, offer two rat fuzzies.
	4. Failing that, try a prekilled gerbil (and do kill it first; gerbils
	are aggressive).
	5. Repeat 3 and 4 a couple of times a week for a few weeks; try just-
	weaned rats, a live unweaned gerbil, prekilled mice...
If all this fails, try putting Madison in a grocery bag (with air holes) with
a dead gerbil, in the vivarium, overnight (the bag is supposed to be stapled
shut).

And don't panic; imported ball pythons (which Madison probably is) are *all*
supposed to be problem eaters.  They can fast for months and months without
ill effects.

>PROBLEM THREE:
>Could someone once-and-for-all tell me how hot her cage should be? I've got a

See above.  Something you didn't ask about, but which might be helping to put
her off-feed, is the humidity; it ought to be *high* (but not a greenhouse).
Adding an aerated water source is probably a good idea.  (I use a Mason jar
of water, with an aquarium heater and an airstone, the heater at about 94
degrees; simultaneous heat and humidity.)  Anyway, 85 is a good target
temperature.

>PROBLEM FOUR:
>I recently found (ICK!) little ticks under some of her scales

This is what makes me think Madison is imported; ticks are omnipresent in
imports and almost nonexistent in captive-bred snakes (unless they've been
kept with someone who has ticks).  Anyway, Philippe basically says you did
the right thing and not to worry.

When you find a good vet, BTW, you should have her checked for other
parasites---mites and internal guys.

Good luck,

	NT
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri)
Subject: Re: Wanted creature to add with fish
Organization: Siemens Corporate Research, Princeton (Plainsboro), NJ
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:10:03 GMT


>Hi I have a 20gallon high aquarium with a bunch of various sized fish.
                      ^^^^ tsk tsk

>of adding something else.  For instance I added an
>"underwater frog".  He was gone the next morning, either
>eaten or broke out.

I had a pair of "dwarf African frogs" in my 20L for over a year, and they did
just fine.  There are a couple of different species sold in aquarium stores,
though, so be careful.  Avoid the "floating frog", as it may not eat.  Watch
for ones with serious claws as well.  The ones I got were about .5" snout to
vent, gray, and with a cornmeal-like texture.  They were up to about 1"
stv when I moved and had to give them away.

Are you sure that yours aren't just hiding?  Look everywhere -- in the plants,
behing any ugf towers, on top of the thermo-meter...
-- 

======================================================================8--<
Xref: sparky rec.pets.herp:4407 sci.bio:4819
From: kyle@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Kyle Wohlmut)
Subject: Re: are chameleons (very) difficult?
Followup-To: rec.pets.herp
Summary: It's not 'coz I shouldn't, it's not 'coz I wouldn't...
Keywords: This article printed on 100% recycled electrons
Organization: The Beast Fable Society
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 22:50:37 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.222103.13820@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu>
jwg0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (JOHN WALTER "TWO-SHEDS" GEWARTOWSKI) writes:

>I don't think this should be a valid reason for not getting a chameleon.
>One could always line the tank with one-way mirror, or such similar material,
>so that the lizard in question has no idea you're even peering in on him.

I'm not much of a lizard person, but I understand that some lizards
will get pretty pissed off at their own reflections.  I'm not sure if
African Chameleons fall into this category, but I presume they do
(don't most iguanids?  Perhaps some specialist can enlighten us).  I
guess there are some non-reflective one-way materials you could use,
but the Chameleon would still probably hear you, and the word coming
down the pike is that they are indeed stress basket-cases that are
phenomenally hard to care for.

/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/
                       /               
/'''   Kyle Wohlmut    -  'Heute back ich, morgen brau ich, und       
c-OO                   /   uebermorgen hol ich mir der Koenigin ihr      
   \   Rocking Pig     -   Kind.  Ach, wie gut dass niemand weiss,
  -     Enterprises    /   dass ich kyle@csli.stanford.EDU heiss.'    
                       -                                              
-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: remcat@athena.mit.edu (Rachel Emily Molenaar)
Subject: Ball Pythons II: eating (or not)
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 03:53:24 GMT

PROBLEM ONE:
Gee, uh, I've had Madison since October and I am starting to feel like a real
fool/evil bad snake person 'cause poor Madison STILL WON'T EAT!!! She may or may
not be captive bred, so this may be part of the problem, or not. She is supposed
to be three years old, so she probably isn't in any danger of starving to death.
HOWEVER it is disturbing as hell to a regularly-eating mammal like myself when
her pet doesn't eat AT ALL. 

Right now, I am planning on trying gerbils, since she has refused mice, but I
would like confirmation first on whether or not this is likely to work. 
(Transporting rodents back and forth from the pet store isn't exactly my idea of
"fun.") Specifically it would be nice to have stories from people who managed to
successfully feed their Balls. Size-wise Madison is about four feet long, under
two inches diameter at biggest.

PROBLEM TWO:
Could someone reccommend a good, preferably moderately-priced snake vet in
the Boston area? I want to be a responsible pet owner and do the check-up
thing. Near Cambridge/Brookline is preferable, but I have
transportation available if necessary.

PROBLEM THREE:
Could someone once-and-for-all tell me how hot her cage should be? I've got a
heating pad under the cage, and she seems all right, but I can easily make it
lots, lots warmer by turning on a lightbulb above her cage. However, when I have,
the cage just seems way too hot.

PROBLEM FOUR:
I recently found (ICK!) little ticks under some of her scales after reading about
such parasites in a otherwise fairly useless snake book. The book didn't give any
suggestions on what to do, so I used tweezers to dislodge the gross little things
and them crushed them. There are no signs of infection or anything, but it would
be nice to do the proper thing (in general) and also to know where they came from
and how to prevent recurrances.

Thanks much in advance; what a great newsgroup!

P.S. Does anyone know what kind of electrical plug outlets they have in Iceland?
Just asking... (My college band is going on tour there.)

bye bye bye!
                                          ___               ____
  -\ /-   ||  |\  /|  -----  -----       /  / /   /| |   / /
   0-0    ||  | \/ |    |      |        /__  /   / | |  / /___
    o     ||  |    |    |      |          / /   /__| | / /
   ---    ||  |    |  -----    |      /__/ /__ /   | |/ /___
From: bell-peter@yale.edu (vineland expatriate)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Color vision in snakes?
Date: 7 Jan 1993 16:31:46 -0500
Organization: Yale University Science & Engineering UNIX(tm), New Haven, CT 06520-2158
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu

In article <1993Jan7.132950.4922@memstvx1.memst.edu> nvonstein@memstvx1.memst.edu writes:
>

>Does anyone know if the King cobra has binocular vision?
>
>Nancy


Almost all animals have at least some binocular vision;  the question is 
how much....  for example, in turtles there is a strip of visual space 
over the animals' heads where the ocular fields converge;  on the retina,
the region subtending that area is densely packed with photoreceptors, 
primarily cones.  This 'visual streak' is analagous to our fovea.  The bit
about humans and other primates, along with raccoons and a few other animals,
that is unique is that the vast majority of the visual field is or can be 
binocular, rather than only a bit of it.

So, I don't know;  I don't know if anyone has studied the visual system in 
the king cobra to be sure, but I would be very surprised if there was not 
at least some binocular visual space.

Peter
bell@minerva.cis.yale.edu


Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: mds5597@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Subject: Ball Phythons
Reply-To: mds5597@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:07:02 GMT

	Hello all. I left for vacation for a little while(2 weeks) and I was
worried about Tabatha cause she was not going to eat. Well people kept telling
me not to worry and that she would be fine. I guess in the back of my head I
thought the worse. They were right, she is perfectly fine...she was very hungry
when I got home...but fine.  I still have her in a large aquarium (29 g) and
she is not using very much of it. I just talked to a person and he is going to
make me a cage that can be a little more heat conservative and have places for
two snakes. Now that I am a little more experienced I am going to take some of
my friend's (JC=Mike Herman) encouragements (no JC, I am not getting a Boa :) )
and get a second snake. The last meeting I attended was about Ball phytons.
They were real interesting and are the size that I am looking for. I thought I
read somewhere that they are difficult to feed somethimes. Someone told me that
if you get a hatchling you wont have a problem....is this true? Is there any
other snakes that are in the general size catagory that I should look into? I
thought about getting another Corn so I can breed them...but to be honest there
are other snakes that also fasinate me as well and maybe I shold look at them
before jumping into breeding plans. 
		Anyone....
                                               
                                                      Treky and Tabatha
							    N8VFZ

P.S.
----
Live long and prosper.                   

P.S.
----
Think we should have memorial services for JC's pets?
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: pholland@iastate.edu (Paul J Hollander)
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 16:52:49 GMT

In article <C0725H.MoE.1@cs.cmu.edu> tmohler+@cs.cmu.edu (Tim Mohler) writes:
>In article <1993Jan1.023453.18349@siemens.com> aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri) writes:
>
>>Any advice on finding a rodent breeder?  I can't find anything in the local YP.
>
>Caveat: I know some snakes will not eat gerbils - you should test it on
>a gerbil before raising them.
>
>I don't know about rodent breeders, but since that snake is 7 ft, it will
>eat largish rodents - gerbils at least, surely smaller rats, and 
>probably a decent-sized rat.

My Burmese were eating 1-3 full grown rats (.75 pound or bigger) every week 
at that size.  Another couple of feet longer, and they will be eating
rabbits and chickens.  They are already big enough to eat pigeons.
>
>I have raised mice and gerbils. I ditched the mice - they STANK. The
>gerbils, though, do not stink. I don't know why that is. I have been
>told that rats do not stink as badly as mice, but I have no personal
>experience.

Among other things, gerbils require little water and produce little urine.
An adaptation to their desert homeland, I believe.  I've kept both rats and 
mice.  One cage of mice stinks worse than 12 cages of rats.  Gerbils smell
less than rats, at least mine did. However, the gerbils were realatively
monogamous and didn't produce babies as fast or as often as the rats.
Possibly a bigger cage would have helped; they were in mouse-sized, not
rat-sized cages.
>
>(deleted)
From: tenny@euclid.uucp (Nathan Tenny)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Sexing Ball Pythons (was Re: Weighting down cage tops...)
Date: 5 Jan 93 18:38:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: pith.1ickifINN5o5
Organization: Department of Mathematics, University of Oregon
NNTP-Posting-Host: euclid.uoregon.edu

In article <1993Jan5.065126.14297@athena.mit.edu> remcat@athena.mit.edu (Rachel Emily Molenaar) writes:
>since I figured out where that sore on her nose was coming from. Also, anyone
>have an easy way to tell whether Madison is male or female?

Philippe de Vosjoli's ball python book says there's no way to sex an adult
ball python without probing (he gives numbers for probing, but I don't
remember them).  In juveniles, you can attempt to evert the hemipenes, but
they have to be pretty young for this to work.  (It didn't seem to work on
my 5-month-olds; but maybe they're both female...)
From: zenpk@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (stephen kunc)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Rodents [was Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...]
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 93 15:37:39 -05
Distribution: world
Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec

dlb5404@tamsun.tamu.edu (Daryl Biberdorf) writes:

> a problem with the parents eating the babies.  Pretty gross stuff, too,
> finding a half-eaten gerbil baby in a corner of the cage.  Yuck.
> 
> Daryl
> -- 
> Daryl Biberdorf  N5GJM    d-biberdorf@tamu.edu or  dlb5404@tamsun.tamu.edu
> 

The unfortunate reality about raising rodents is that they are less 
likely to eat their offspring the worse you keep them. The scent of 
their own urine makes them more secure, so clean cages are, sadly, the 
worst environment for raising litters. Mine have their own closet, so I 
can afford to keep them a little degenerate, and they're all vicious 
bastards but I never have an empty litter pile and they never harm the 
youngsters.

Steve

--
stephen kunc, zenpk@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada 
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: gerard@progress.COM (Gerard Bras)
Subject: Re: Snake Quarantine
Organization: Progress Software Corp.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 16:33:15 GMT

nathan@charles.ucdavis.edu (Nathan Rollins) writes:


> Thanks for all the help abotu keeping Burmese and boa together, and the
>suggestion to quarantine. Now, how long should I keep the Boa in 
>quarantine? I bought him from a local person here who had had him about
>nine months. He shared a cage with a ball python before and apparently
>has no eating problems. He looks healthy thus far (no visible mites, no
>obvious respiratory problems, great muscle tone and skin. I'd like

...del

> The one book I have reccomends 4 weeks, but is referring to imports... any
>more input from the wise and wonderful herp world?

This is strictly a judgement call.  If you were quarantining against a disease with
a known incubation period you could come up with a fixed number.  Since you're not,
you'll have to balance security and convenience.  My opinion is that four weeks is the
bare minimum.  I'd go two or three times that.  

If you want to spend the dough, you can do an OP culture and stool analysis to see
what your new aquisition is bringing with him.  I would only do this if I had
reason to suspect disease or parasites though.

cheers,
gerard