HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sherwani@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Naveed Sherwani)
Subject: Re: liberals in Pakistan
Summary: US is tilting right, does not mean world is tilting right
Organization: Western Michigan Univ. Comp. Sci. Dept.
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 18:51:53 GMT

In article <Bt15uJ.7ux@acsu.buffalo.edu>, memon@acsu.buffalo.edu (Naveed Siraj Memon) writes:
> From: sherwani@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Naveed Sherwani)
> Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.pakistan
> 
> >Liberalism died in Pakistan in late seventies. For some reason,
> >which I dont understand, Pakistan is increasingly becoming
> >conservative. When the whole world is waking up and joining
> >the global village, Pakistan is going back into a shell.
> 
> The world is waking up to join the Right my dear sir. There was no substantial 
> change by the declaration that a New World Order will re-unite the people to
> fight injustice. Somalian drought, Ethnic cleansing, appointment of conservative
> supreme court judges, hey I see the entire world going to the right.
> 

Dear Chota Naveed Bhai:

I agree that US is tilting right, but we have basic freedoms here
and these freedoms are being increasing granted to citizens 
all over the world. I was talking about basic rights.
Hopefully Clinton (if elected, I do hope so), will change some
of the tilt.

> 
> >Now Pakistan has no place for its liberal citizens. Freedom
> >of expression is limited by religious considerations and freedom
> >of thought is limited by vision which does not go beyond our national religion. 
> 
> And who will change the status quo. That is a more relevant question. My plane
> leaves September 6 btw.:) Survival takes a higher priority than calling for
> social justice in Pakistan, otherwise don't tell me that you and I and our
> army of liberals could not have achieved any thing in Pakistan. Oh well, 
> maybe another lifetime.
> 
> 

The first step would be to speak out and try to convince people
around you about the rights of humans. This process has to be
at grass roots and has to go on for a long time, before any national
level change will happen.

Just make sure that your family, your kids and your wife (to be) will
treat jamadars as humans, treat your servants as equals, etc. Also
make sure that not to judge people on their religion, nationality,
race, gender, language, (mohajar, punjabi,  sindhi or not), among other things.
Remind them that we are all human first, before we are Pakistanis or muslims.

THAT WOULD BE A START.

Since I know that you intend to do all these things anyway, I am writing
these ideas just to remind others what a start should be.

I know it would be difficult, for in Pakistan our expressions are
restricted, but a fundamantalistic Pakistan is too horrible a thought
that we must do something about it. Even if it is a trivial start as
mentioned above.

regards,

-Naveed

PS: Good luck in Pakistan, I hope to see you there in december.
    I hope that you come back one day to complete a Phd. 
    I know you will do a great job at that too.
From: r3po@spectrx.saigon.com (r3po)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: showing of wealth and honda acuras
Keywords: spending
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 03:04:32 PDT
Organization: SPECTROX SYSTEMS (408)252-1005 Silicon Valley, Ca

ahasan@cae.wisc.edu (Ali Hasan) writes:

> 	I just bought new shoes.
> 	Joggers, Reeboks, not Reebok Pump, but I'm still proud of them.
> 	Figured as long as are talking about worldly possesions, I'd
> 	bring mine in ;-)
> 
> 						--ali[big spender!]

big spender.... a la shirley beasey (sp?), i wonder?

------------------------------------
"I will pass you in an Acura (which for the uninitiated, is a luxury
line by Honda) in the stormy waters... and if I am not too busy 'will
call 911 from my very expensive hightech cellular car phone...."

PS: is anyone interested in wasting time reading my ramblings that
    I call "my trip to Pakistan"  (also know as "hawaii-jahaaz ka safar")


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
r3po@spectrx.saigon.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: mmasood@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mohammed A Masood)
Subject: Bosnia
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 13:40:11 GMT

               Plight of Muslim Ummah: BOSNIA a new front
               -------------------------------------------

        An APPEAL TO ALL MUSLIMS FOR THE SUPPORT OF BOSNIANS BROHTERS
        -------------------------------------------------------------


      " Why should you, then, not fight in the way of Allah for the
        sake of those helpless men, women and children who, being
        weak, have been oppressed, and are crying out, "Our Lord,
        deliver us from this habitation whose inhabitants are unjust 
        oppressors, and raise a protector for us by Thy grace and a
        helper from Thyself." Those who follow the way of Faith, fight
        in the way of Allah, and those who follow the way of disbelief
        fight in the way of taghut. So fight against the helpers of
        Satan with this conviction that Satan's crafty schemes are in
        fact very weak."      (Al-Nissa 75-76)


       I am sorry for being so late to post this appeal. I was
       encouraged by a posting from Br. Achjar Riadi, Abu d'Arqom
       about practical steps to help our Muslim Brothers in Bosnia.
       I am ready to organize this effort. Let all those who are
       sincere, get together at some place and do somthing before it is
       too late. I suggest that we should assemble at 

           MASJID UMAR Al-KHATTAB
           580 RIVER VIEW DRIVE
           COLUMBUS, OHIO 43202

       on Saturday, 15 th August, 1992. We can sit and chalk out our
       future program to take practical steps in that direction. 
         JAZAK ALLAH 

              Strangers' gathering at Columbus
              -------------------------------
       Prophet (saw) said:
         " Islam started as strange, very soon it will become strange
           and there is glad tidings for those strangers."

       Insha Allah we will start the meeting after Asr Prayer (5:40 PM
       local time). So the new schedule is:

           6:00 PM, August 15, 1992

           MASJID UMAR Al-KHATTAB
           580 RIVER VIEW DRIVE
           COLUMBUS, OHIO 43202

           Telephone: (614) 262-1310 (Masjid Phone #)

       We will welcome any brother who wants to come earlier. Please 
       feel about the plight of our Ummah. We have to think about the
       roots of the problems. It is the chain of events which started
       500 years back from the downfall of Muslim Spain. Palestine,
       Kashmir, Iraq, Gulf ....... are the parts of the same story.
       Because:

        " If Allah helps you than there in none who can overpower you,
          but if HE wants to humiliate you then who can come to your
          rescue after that."

       Please think about "ACTION PLAN". By the help of Almighty Allah
       we hope that this meeting will become an excuse to earn His
       Pleasure on the Day of Judgement.

       Wassalam
From: ashai@usc.edu (EHTISHAM AHMED ASHAI)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Waynes World, Party Time, Excellent
Date: 18 Aug 1992 15:10:13 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: sal-sun68.usc.edu


Its hot here in Los Angeles. The heat is piercing in to my bdy but it
does not imply it has affected my brain or other cells/tissues/organs
etc.

Today/Tonight I shall be telling you a story that has been never told
before, the fronteirs wher only the pathans live and even the sheep in
that area are scared. It is not the land of La but its waynes world.
Excellent, party on Azhar party on Irfan. Why these names have a
familiar sound, I don't know but it is coincidence.


In the back ground I can hear Queen moaning or crying but doing
something and the story begins:


There was a guy named ashai a grtequely pathetic moron who survived on
a fiction which was nothing less than art.His life was full of
adventures and fun and unfortunatel, incidently or accidently he had
no girl friend. In short a miserable little frustrated Pakistani
creature just like all of you. Life without a  girlfried NOT: 

LIFE IS A BITCH THEN YOU DIE.


Well so Mr. tightend up his lungoat and started out htis neverending
journey for the quest of a blonde bimbo, a busty brunette or a desi
ulhar dosheezia. He starts from the south central Los angels where all
the fun begins. The hot babes of USC, wow I am having fun.


WHY DOESN`T THIS ARTCLE MAKE SENSE I DO NOT KNOW.

There must be a mystry or a mistry in it. This article is just like
our lives. Nothing in it. Lets do somehting and be something to make
our lives worth while. AFTER ALL YOU DON'T LIVE TWICE.


Ehtisham Ashai
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: nadeem@igpho (Nadeem Malik)
Subject: Re: Polygamy and Polyandry
Organization: Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 16:46:52 GMT

ag3l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Arun K. Gupta) writes:
: 
: I believe, in British India, a woman could seek divorce on the
: grounds that her husband was taking a second wife (even though
: polygamy might have been legal for him.) I think that rule still
: holds in India today. How about Pakistan ?

I think that in Pakistan officially men can marry another woman only
with permission from first wife. This may have changed with the
recent supposedly (laugh!) Islamic orientated governments.
: 
: -arun gupta

-Nadeem Malik
Xref: sparky soc.culture.pakistan:13626 soc.culture.indian:28032 sci.environment:10652
From: aq0@engr.uark.edu (Amer Qureshi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.indian,sci.environment
Subject: REMOTE SENSING with CHEMICAL SENSORS...
         NOT WITH SATTELITE...
Date: 13 Aug 92 21:03:42 GMT
Article-I.D.: engr.1992Aug13.210342.29866
Organization: University of Arkansas

i am doing my MS thesis on Application of remote sensing in]
environmental engg.

can any one refer to any thesis on the same subject.

my topic deals with remote sensing on the ground with
sensors, not with satellite...

would prefer if i can have the title, author, call number
and location for inter lib. loan...

amer qureshi
aq0@engr.uark.edu
From: charisma@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: RE: Asma Jehangir:Human Right Activist
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:38:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: ut-emx.78022
Reply-To: charisma@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu ()
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX
Originator: charisma@bashful.cc.utexas.edu




	Asma Jilani didn't just use the word "illiterate" for ummi
about the Holy Prophet(PBUH),what she actually said was that Islam
is a 1400 year old religion and it was revealed on a person who was
illiterate and thus the injunctions of Islam are no longer practical 
in this modern age.

	It was because of these remarks that she even received death threats
and had to leave Pakistan.It was only after this incident that a law was
against those who commit tauheen-i-risalaat.It was only after Benazir
Bhuttos's coming to power that she was able to come back.

	It is a pity that there is no longer any Ghazi Alimudin(shaheed)
in Pakistan to teach such people a lesson. 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: nadeem@igpho (Nadeem Malik)
Subject: Re: PAKISTAN AND INDIA
Organization: Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 16:48:12 GMT

ag3l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Arun K. Gupta) writes:
: 
: Pakistan will never make a complete break with India.
: After all their cricket team needs somebody to beat :-):-)


But does any Pakistani wnat a clean break with Indian (subcontinent)?

I think not.

: -arun

-Nadeem Malik
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: arkay@leland.Stanford.EDU (Abdur Khan)
Subject: Northern Californian Gazzette
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 00:39:41 GMT

Here we go again on some more back patting etc. The Northern california
scpians are well known to talk to the whole world about there great 
exploits ... what else do you expect from computer science majors.

		Pakistan News

yesterday a man was arrested for marrying fives wives(all blondes) in Tando
Adam Jam. He said he lost count, he had been rolling his marriages for the 
last five years, divorcing and marrying but due to tthe leap year his 
calculations went astray.

Maulana Abdul Quddos has requested the goverment to follow the muslim calendar
so this fiasco does not happen again.

		New found wealth of SCPians in America

Suddenly a large number of SCPians have been phoning in, and describing
there material possessions. Honda acuras, jaguars, reeboks, textile mills
etc. This sudden activity may be caused by the recent increase of
pakistani female SCPinas on the net

		Cricket News

Farrukh zafar in his last match in Northern california finally came
good, with a great catch and a run out after been hit for three consecutive
sixes and innumerable fours.
Other highlights was tremendous catch on the boundary by your humble servant.

		Departure of Farrukh Zafar and Naveed siraj Memon

Two stalwarts will not be with us next month Farrukh and Naveed. according 
to reliable sources Farrukh first stop will be the famous hair stylist
"Tariq Amin" while Naveed will hit Buns road for a cup of "REAL TEA"

		Seminar on Nudity by Dr. Abid Kemal

World renown Dr. Abid Kemal will meet Pakistani at the Santa Clara Convention 
centre to discuss Nudity and the use of Apparel " a conspiracy by the Rich
and Famous".

Letters to the editors are encouraged but that does not mean that they will
be published.
For article to be published send e-mail to arkay@leland.stanford.edu
From: akumar@pollux.usc.edu (Anant Kumar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: SpicMacay:Indian Dance(ODISSI):LEC-DEM:AUG 19:FREE
Date: 12 Aug 1992 15:31:13 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: ca
NNTP-Posting-Host: pollux.usc.edu


  Society for Promotion of Indian Classical Music And Culture Amongst Youth
                                (SPIC-MACAY)

                                 presents

                   An evening (Lecture-Demonstration) with

           	 One of the foremost Indian Classical Dancers
			  The Great Odissi Exponent


                             SANJUKTA PANIGRAHI



                        Wednesday Aug. 19, 1992, 7:30 pm.
			
 		       Titan pavilion A, University Center
			  California State University
                                   Fullerton

			**ALSO AT:
			  Peterson Hall, Room 103
			  UC, SAN DIEGO. August 20th, 7:30 pm.
			  Call (619) 291 9377 for more Info.
			**

                        ADMISSION FREE AND OPEN TO ALL.
	     (First Come First Served, limited by hall capacity)

		For CARPOOL and other info, contact:
                           USC, Los Angeles (213) 748-6353 (Kartik)
                           UC, Irvine       (714) 856-3589 (Sanjiv)
                           UC, Los Angeles  (310) 312-1644 (Munira)
			   CSU, Fullerton   (714) 992-5875 (Subha)

                or e-mail: ananthan@usc.edu   (Kartik)

Lecture-Demonstration: 
---------------------
The artist explains the art form and its intricacies. She illustrates
her explanations with demonstrations of each action (mudra) even as she
talks.

The audience will be sitting on the floor, close to the artist. It might be
a good idea to get your own cushions.

Directions and Parking:
----------------------
From 91 Freeway
Take 57 N. (Pomona), Exit Nutwood Avenue. Take left at exit (lights)
right on State College Blvd.
First Right on Dorothy Lane
Immediate Left and go on to Parking Lots A & B.

parking Fee is $2 per car.

---
from 60 Freeway.
Take 57 South, Exit Nutwood. Right at exit and follow above directions.
--------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: asiddiqu@leland.Stanford.EDU (Ali Siddiqui)
Subject: Re: Pakistan has fired 687 police officers.
Keywords: Hydrocarbons.
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 02:05:41 GMT


>zabdi@bucknell.edu (zakir abdi GR) writes:
>       "Pakistan has fired 687 police officers in Sind province, citing their
>       ties to criminals, the government said. The action followed a recent

If the government ever cracks down on corrupt officials, Pakistan will
need to have a new PM, infact we would end up getting rid of most of the NA.

Well does not sound too bad :-).

Ali.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: mghayalo@uceng.UC.EDU (Manoj Ghayalod)
Subject: Re: Correction for posting# 18845
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Cincinnati
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 01:43:22 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.200919.5019@gw.wmich.edu> 771maqbool@gw.wmich.edu writes:
>This is a correction to the posting no. 18845(pakistan ka matlub kaya????).
>The figures indicated about muslim population of India and Pakistan were wrong.
>Please note the following corrections:
>	
>	The muslim population of India was 140 million( approx.) and the
>population of Pakistan was 70 million. 
>	
>	The point I was trying to make was that the partition of India did not
>leave up to its expectations. The idea of separating Hindus and Muslims was a
>flop. More than half the muslim population of India still remain under 
>dominance of Hindus. 
>
Whose expectations?  I do not think India wanted to lose all it's muslims,
it would have been a great loss.  I do not think Hindus dominate in India
there are Muslims, Parsis, and Christians who are in powerful posts in
India.
	
>	I pray that the blunder I made about the number of muslims in India and 
>Pakistan might become a  reality in future.(AMEN).
>
>Tariq
You obviously don't believe in family planning.  


Manoj

Xref: sparky soc.culture.pakistan:13671 soc.culture.bangladesh:4487 soc.culture.indian:28176 soc.culture.arabic:3267
From: reddy@mips.com (T.S. Reddy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: DESI BOYS & ARAB WOMEN
Date: 14 Aug 1992 18:04:55 GMT
Organization: MIPS Computer Systems, Sunnyvale, California
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: dish.mips.com

In article <1992Aug14.163105.4623@digi.lonestar.org> msardar@digi.lonestar.org (Mohammed Tariq Sardar) writes:
>
>Dear Friends,
>	Recently a met a friend who had spent number of years in Saudia Arabia,
>he told me some alarming stories, how DESI's(people from the Indian 
>subcontinent) are treated by the Arabs. A particular story which i found 
>disturbing  was treatment of young DESI servants by ARAB women. These young 
>servants are forced in to sexual relationship with elder women against 
>their wishes.
>Can some one confirm these stories( i'm not asking for personnel experience) .
>						Tariq Sardar

Here is a story from the San Jose Mercury News (08/14/92)

                 Kuwaiti Bbosses abuse Asian women, groups say
		-----------------------------------------------

MANILA, Phillippines (AP) - Thousands of Asian women have been raped and 
abused by Kuwaiti employers, and the government restored by U.S.-led forces
has done little to stop it, U.S. human rights groups charged Thursday.

     In a 44-page report, the New York-based Middle East Watch and the 
affiliated Women's Rights Project said nearly 2,000 Filipino, Bangladeshi,
Sri-Lankan and other Asian domenstics had fled their abusive employers since
Kuwait was liberated in March 1991.

     "Yet no more than a handful of emplyers have ever been investigated
or prosecuted," the groups said. "Instead, the Kuwaiti government has 
foreclosed opportunities for redress at every turn."

     The report said Kuwaiti employers often prevent women from reporting 
abuse to the police, who show little interest in investigating and 
prosecuting their cases.

     Some women who did manage to reach the police reported that they were
sexually abused by the  officerrs, the report said.

     The report said the U.S. Embasssy in Kuwait was aware of the problem
but had refused to use its influence with the Kuwaiti government to remedy
the problem.

     The report urged the Kuwaiti government to enforce its laws, remove
restrictions on freedom of association by expatriate workers, and amend
it's constitution to prohibit discrimination by sex.


-- 
T.S.Reddy (e-mail: reddy@mips.com)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: obaidr@ecf.toronto.edu (OBAID ARIF)
Subject: Re: PAKISTAN AND INDIA
Organization: University of Toronto, Engineering Computing Facility
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 02:16:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug16.160657.3041@memstvx1.memst.edu> self writes:
>In article <Bt2Bw3.MED@ecf.toronto.edu>, obaidr@ecf.toronto.edu (OBAID ARIF) writes:
>> In article <8eXP2O600VogAF4Wpz@andrew.cmu.edu> ag3l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Arun K. Gupta) writes:
>>>
>>>Pakistan will never make a complete break with India.
>>>After all their cricket team needs somebody to beat :-):-)
>>>-arun
>> 
>> 	C'mon Arun! You know better than that. Pak. does not need a 
>> cricket TEAM to beat India.....Wasim and Waqar are enough. :-) :-)
>> 
>> Arif
>> 
>       Trying to be modest, eh? You very well know that it takes just
>  ONE Paki umpire to do the job.
>
>  Patri Rao

	Take it easy, Patri! I was referring to sending W&W to India to
play against Azhar & Co. :-) :-)

	Heck, in Pakistan, Galee(street) cricketers are enough for the Indian
cricket team.:-) :-) :-)

Arif
From: hyder@cs.utexas.edu (Syed Irfan Hyder)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Arindam Ghosh
Date: 13 Aug 1992 12:53:43 -0500
Organization: U Texas Dept of Computer Sciences, Austin TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: pageboy.cs.utexas.edu

In article <1992Aug10.222457.670@sol.cs.wmich.edu> sherwani@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Naveed Sherwani) writes:
>
>You are shaking the base of logic. Then it would be difficult to
>have any discussion, because, we will be taking away the process
>of LOGICAL deduction. In fact, the entire idea of discussion 
>would have to scraped.

Not necessarily. I was only pointing out the limitations of one
of the tools of analysis __ "logic". I was pointing out that
there are some greater faculties which also need to be combined
with "logic" __ for instance "common sense"!!

If I remember correctly, it was asserted that "logically" speaking
having one invisible "deity" is equivalent to multiple deities
in the form of "idols". I was endevoring to point out that
at time "logic" can be ridiculous. For instance when to a logician
a "false" value becomes equal to "true" value in "negative logic"
_ a concept fine in the world of logic. But utterly futile in the
real common sensical world where one asserts that a lamp "on" is
equivalent in some sense to the lamp "off".

Or for instance, when the father gets away with the only "real"
egg and the son is left with the "hypothetical" one to satiate
his hunger.


>Well logically speaking, the prophet of one religion is really a
>crook from another religion's point of view. I can understand
>Christian's point of view of calling a person a crook, if that
>person claims that their religion is not valid and they BETTER
>accept the new religion.

Here we are again back to square one. That is back to the old
conflict, that just because an American has not tasted a 
good mango, does not mean that all mangoes are same and
good, delicious and wonderful mangoes do not exist!


Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan