Newsgroups: misc.headlines,alt.activism,talk.politics.misc
From: mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman)
Subject: Re: Intellectuals and totalitarianism (was Re: WORLD GOVERNMENT)
Organization: Oracle Corporation
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 15:17:06 GMT
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In article <1992Aug19.202256.28603@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca> bunker@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Alex Bunker) writes:
>In article <1992Aug19.170820.12325@ncar.ucar.edu> gary@isis.cgd.ucar.edu (Gary Strand) writes:
>>ab> Alex Bunker
>>gs> Gary Strand

>>ab> And that explains why your average Joe blue-collar steelworker is a
>>ab> socialist
>>ab> and votes NDP in Canada, Labour in the UK, SDP in Germany, socialist in
>>ab> France, liberal-democrat in the US etc..  

>>  Also, not quite. Recall hearing about "Reagan Democrats"? The Democratic
>>  party of the late '70s had gotten too far left for too many people, inclu-
>>  ding blue-collar workers, and they showed their dissatisfaction by voting
>>  for Reagan and Republicans in 1980 and 1984. Besides, you were bemoaning
>>  the fact that (in your view) there wasn't a really Left party in the US.
>>  Either the Democratic party is (to support this argument) or there isn't,
>>  (to support your older argument.) Which is it?

>Isolated incident in general blue collar workers and lefty intellectuals
>belong to the same political party and have the same voting habits
>I am talking about a global average here.

I hardly think you can call tens of millions of people an isolated incident.


>>  In any case, your average lefty intellectual is so far removed from
>>  basic theories on government power, economics, and monetary policies, that
>>  it's no wonder that wherever and whenever their ideas have been tried,
>>  (at best) the society as a whole has remained stuck, or has declined. I
>>  am including Sweden, Norway, Germany, France, and so on here too.

>this is very funny. you just mentioned a set of countries EVERY one of which 
>has a healthier economy than the US as well as being more socially advanced.
>how are these societies stuck or declining. AND THE USA IS NOT !?!?!?!?!

Mind explaining your definition of a 'healthier' economy?  It must be
something pretty weird if Sweden, France, and Germany have healthier
economies than us.  (Germany, at least, has an excuse - East Germany -
but the others don't.)

>Luckily (for Americans)
>YOU are in the minority
>and the majority of americans realize this and are about to elect
>Bill Clinton as the next president who will invoke an industrial
>policy.

I've bumped into a lot of dummycrats who make this claim.  So far the
only one whose been willing to put any money on it is my boss.

So let me ask you... if it really matters, if it will hit you in your
pocket book... how sure are you?  How much money at what odds?

>>  It isn't on the side of the socialist intellectuals, I can tell you that.

>last time I checked he is (In most countries)

But not in the country with the highest productivity, highest GNP per
capita, and highest standard of living.   I wonder which is the cause
and which is the effect.
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