HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ameiba@reed.edu (Keith Steiger)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: special clue server
Summary: What about the rest of us?
Date: 10 Apr 92 03:56:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Apr10.035605.17320
Organization: Reed College, Portland OR

In article <73540@netnews.upenn.edu> paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Brian Paulsen ) writes:
>I've noticed that many of the games on bronco are only decided by which team
>has more clue.  Actually, it's which team has fewer clueless boneheads...  Todd
>Mummert once said that getting rid of the non-CMU'ers would do wonders.  As
>you remember, I wasn't hot on the idea.  I'm still not ecstatic about a CMU-
>only server.  The only reason is that I wouldn't be able to enjoy high clue
>games.
>
>Anyways, is there any way we could get a high clue server going that is 
>invitation only.  Perhaps the invitation system could be made such that anybody
>who is Flt. Capt. or higher on bronco AND would make Flt. Capt. with only a
>2.0 planet rating could be invited.  Or it could just be up to the server god
>who is allowed to play.

I have a couple of problems with this.  First of all, I'm convinced rank is
solely determined by what you're willing to do to get it.  The only game
effect it has is determining who can SB, and that's only up to Commander--
and I know several players who gave up on rank once they reached Commander.

Secondly, who are the rest of us going to learn from?  If you take every
truly good player out of circulation, then all the ensigns will have nothing
but Galaxy weenies as role models, and you'll never get a new batch of
Admirals.

Third, you don't want to encourage people to scum for rank.  If there is an
"elite" server that is determined by rank, and people can scum to get
an invitation onto it, they will.  And there's enough of that as it is.
Guarding planets is a crucially important part of most games, but nobody does
it because it doesn't get them DI.  I've never really wanted to change the
DI rules, but then again, I've never cared much about rank.  Making an
invitation-only server would change my opinions about that rather quickly.


Personally, I would like to see the server have greater leniency in allowing
people to change from the winning team to the losing team.  Then, hopefully,
high-clue players would filter over and even things out.  I'd also like to
see the teams thoroughly shuffled after a genocide, although perhaps not as
rudely as they are after the galaxy is conquered.

	Keith Steiger
	ameiba@reed.edu
	"I'd have more clue if it weren't for that famous... 300ms+ LAG!"
-- 
 Keith Steiger--ameiba@reed.edu--"I am what you see.  I cannot be otherwise."
  Disclaimer: Reed College tries very hard to ignore its students' opinions.
From: horde@reed.edu (Mr. Heiji Horde)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Ogging for the wrong reasons
Date: 9 Apr 92 18:04:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Apr9.180443.20964
Organization: Twisted Genius Rehabilitation Center, a Division of MHE

In article <1992Apr9.035303.4337@reed.edu> schamber@envy.Reed.Edu (Seth Chamberlin) writes:
>have noticed over the past year that the ogging has increased.  Why?
>I understand ogging a planet taker or a sb, but why someone with no kills.

I've often been in games where my team is on the defensive and no one on the
  other team has kills. I'll try and ogg the closest enemy if I am sure that
  I can take the person out. Surviving is not a factor here, although it is
  nice to have the kill to take a planet later. Either that or to be able to
  shuttle armies to/from the SB.

>                            I run on a 56 line which makes kiling oggers a  
>real pain and just don't see why someone would get pleasure from killing  
>someone who gets updates every 1.5 seconds.

No, Seth, I think you need a bit more practice watching those little `??'
  symbols on your galactic map. It does take practice, but you'll get the
  hang of it someday.
Besides, if you're only getting an update every 1.5 seconds, then I think
  someone if FTPing over your 56kb.

>Ogging does take practice and skill, especially if your updates suck.  Go  
>ahead ogg the carriers and sbs, but give the ensign or lag runner a break.

I wouldn't say that the updates suck, I'd say that the 56kb line sucked.
I don't see why you should give lagged players a break. If you need kills to
  take a planet, why not just target the closest ship?
And remember, ensigns are not always who they seem...

>schamber@reed.edu
>Ensign Bowanna/ Commander Khan

	-KreelScum
	 horde@reed.edu
-- 
===========================================================================
 Mr. Heiji Horde    (Non NeXT mail only please)     e-mail: horde@reed.edu
   All insane acts are done in affiliation with Madd Hacker Enterprises
              "I am not a economics major. I am a human being"
From: tom@ocf.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: The Horsemen.
Date: 10 Apr 1992 05:16:09 GMT
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: monsoon.berkeley.edu

In article <YdtFtaK00awg4Cn0dr@andrew.cmu.edu> Donald Alan Sutton <ds50+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
)
)Admiral Quar  -- Apocalypse!
)
)(and that's a bronco admiral - the 5th or 6th character to make admiral
)anywhere I think...)

No.  The Sequent database as it was given to Bronco contained only
characters who were active at the time Terence asked for it.  There
are a number of Admirals who had stopped playing for one reason
or another long before then; Pink Puppy, tengu, and Toxic Avenger come
to mind.  
 -Mojo
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Udp for Dec3100....
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:53:46 GMT
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <jgdvdt8@twilight.wpd.sgi.com> mikey@sgi.com (Mike Yang) writes:
>For some reason, "ls" in the ~ftp/incoming directory on
>pittslug.sug.org shows nothing, but you can still do "get
>dec3100.udp."

Let's hear it for weird permissions on incoming directories! :)

>A more difficult problem is that this binary isn't linked with the
>YP/NIS library, so anyone running YP on their machine will get a core
>dump after they enter their player name.

yeah. There's another client floating around somewhere, I think in
that same directory, called udp_client.v1.0.bronco.dec3100 that works
better for me. It's what I play with. Stripped, it is 413696 bytes
long. Running "sum" on it, I get
09699   404
whatever that means.

But neither of these do MIT-MAGIC-COOKIE-1, a more secure protection
scheme than xhost. To play, I have to xhost in the machine I'm on to
subvert the magic cookie authorization.

I'm curious how someone is linking X executables and not getting the
magic cookie stuff in. It's been there by default since X11R4. Maybe
the executables are being linked with the DEC fucked up Xlib?

I'm willing to compile a DEC executable that'll work with magic cookie
*if* someone gives me bronco blessed sources that'll compile just when
I type "make". I don't want to munge around with a compile.

Dream Voyager
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/    The look in his eyes when it hit - Kid, it was tasty...
From: labc-3ae@e260-1e.berkeley.edu (Superman)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: RE: Darkhorse vs WIZ
Date: 7 Apr 1992 22:37:12 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: e260-1e.berkeley.edu
Originator: labc-3ae@e260-1e.berkeley.edu


Can someone from Darkhorse or Wizard post a 
more detailed synopsis of their game?

thanks.

Neon
From: cm5m+@andrew.cmu.edu (Ceri Alun Morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Do people blink on the galactic map when beaming?
Date: 17 Apr 92 03:48:57 GMT
Organization: Freshman, Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

As well as when beaming up armies, it was also my understanding that
when you repair on a planet, you blink. Can someone confirm/reject this?

-Ceri
ryche
Fear!
Moooooooo!
From: sfd@bezier.berkeley.edu (Scott Drellishak)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: New HOREMAN OF THE APOCALYPSE....
Date: 15 Apr 92 13:34:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: bezier.SFD.92Apr15083441
Organization: First Church of "Bob", Proctologist
NNTP-Posting-Host: bezier.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: zog@strawberry.udel.edu's message of 15 Apr 92 15:14:17 GMT

In article <1992Apr15.151417.27981@udel.edu> zog@strawberry.udel.edu (Zo(schwa)) writes:

	   I think the next HORSEMAN... should be...

			   Schwing!

							   -dan/zog

Funny...I never knew "shwing" was a Yiddish word.

Scott
From: hde+@CS.CMU.EDU (Herbert Enderton)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Scout Bombing and Other Stuff
Date: 13 Apr 92 18:17:56 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon University

In article <1992Apr13.071055.21901@u.washington.edu>, skaven@milton.u.washington.edu (William Gilliland) writes:
|> 
|> My question is this.  Even when we were down to LPS, I kept on scoutbombing.
|> Should I have stopped to help defend in the LPS?  If so, when should I have
|> stopped -- when we were down to 4 planets, or what?
|> 

Opinions differ, but I think it's reasonable to keep scout bombing right
up until genocide.  You can't be everywhere, so if you set yourself a duty
like this, be content to stick to it even while your team loses.

However, keep in mind the real goal of bombing in such circumstances:  to
help prevent them from taking your last planet(s).  They will probably always
have a few armies (i.e. enough to genocide you) no matter what you do, so
the main idea is to make sure that they have to travel a long ways to
pick them up after they get a kill.  So your priority should be to flatten
the fuel and repair planets between the two home worlds, because those are the
most convenient places for them to pick up armies.  It's less important to bomb
the far reaches where nobody goes anyway (although this is a highly suitable
role when you have serious net lag).  Also, you want to reduce the number
of enemy ships with kills, not increase it.  Bombing is my favorite way
to og; I just bomb until somebody with a kill comes to try to stop me,
then I go for mutual destruction.  It's not worth giving up a kill just to bomb
a couple armies, unless you think you can keep ALL of their planets flat.
If you find yourself giving up kills, adjust your style so you're running
away more; even if you get no bombing done, you'll distract some enemies
sometimes, and you enable your team to see enemies on the galactic map
that are near you.

Another consideration is how capable a fighter you are, compared to your
teammates, and this is partly dependent on lag.  I guess the most crucial
roles, the ones that you want good fighters to be handling, are (1) ogging
and (2) protecting/using the few armies that your planet produces.  Also
you want a clueful defender to stay near the planet, someone that will
reliably phaser a cloaker.  If your team isn't filling these roles,
then maybe you'd better stop bombing and do one of them, and hope that
you can hold out long enough to get some new teammates.

  -- Red Shirt
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: mikey@eukanuba.wpd.sgi.com (Mike Yang)
Subject: SGI netrek package updated
Reply-To: mikey@sgi.com
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 92 19:27:22 GMT

The SGI-ready sources for a galaxy/udp client and server are available as:

	sgi.com:~ftp/pub/mikey/netrek-sgi.tar.Z

A blessed galaxy/udp client for Irix 4.0 or later is available as:

	sgi.com:~ftp/pub/mikey/netrek.sgi4.0

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
                 Mike Yang        Silicon Graphics, Inc.
               mikey@sgi.com           415/335-1786
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jecoleb@eos.ncsu.edu (have clue, will travel)
Subject: Re: Proposal: New news group in the rec.games.netrek hierarchy
Keywords: bagels
Reply-To: jecoleb@eos.ncsu.edu
Organization: The Ghost Of Christmas Past Society
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 18:15:11 GMT

peyote@umiacs.umd.edu (Gary W. Flake) writes:
>With the enormous volume that this news group has generated so far
>I believe we need a new newsgroup to handle much of the slack.
                                                         ^^^^^
There already IS an alt.slack. 

Or are you suggesting rec.games.netrek.BoB?

>I move that we form:	
>+ rec.games.netrek.assholes: This would be for anyone who wishes to
>                             post anything with sentences such as "We
>                             can to kill you guys!", "Can Not!", "Can
>                             to!", ad nauseum...
>+ rec.games.netrek.streaker: This is if you want to post exclusively
>                             about yourself.
And, coming soon to a USENET feed near you:

rec.games.netrek.borg.weenie.whine.whine.whine:  
   This is for people who play on rwd4 with blessed clients during 
  CLEARLY LABELED borg hours and proceed to whine that (a) there's too many
  borgs, (b) anyone who uses a borg is scum, (c) anyone who uses a borg
  is completely incompetent without one, (d) borgs caused the Spanish
  Inquisition, or (e) borgs grow hair on your palms to the ALL board.

rec.games.netrek.if.it's.not.CMU.IT'S.CRAP
   The true repository for the Horsemen-UPenn flame war. ;)

rec.games.netrek.scummers
   Discussion forum for how to get that planet rating over 5.0, as well as
  scheduled lessons by speakers from the Val Ckurai School of Ogging.

rec.games.netrek.oink!
    Enough said. 

                                            --Video Sex Pope.
--
----------jeff the wonder llama, jecoleb@eos.ncsu.edu
------"I am a penis. Worship me."--lead singer of rock band Bicycle Face,
     vainly attempting to gain attention of the crowd at the Cat's Cradle 
     in Chapel Hill, while opening for Mojo Nixon & The Toad Liquors
From: sfd@bezier.berkeley.edu (Scott Drellishak)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: sfop vs. the world
Date: 14 Apr 92 00:56:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: bezier.SFD.92Apr13195632
Organization: First Church of "Bob", Proctologist
NNTP-Posting-Host: bezier.berkeley.edu

sfop vs. the world, tonight, bezier, 23:00 PDT or so.  Be there or don't.

Scott
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: goldm@sage4a.its.rpi.edu (Mitchell E. Gold)
Subject: Re: "bomb out of t-mode" ?
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy NY
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 19:59:56 GMT

Couldn't this be a very simple server hack to check if it's tournament mode,
and if it isn't execute procedure 'bombnotTmode which either prints unfriendly
message: "Why that would be an act of war!" or launches unfriendly terminator
ship in response to the attempt?
--
 Mitchell Gold    |\  Can't you feel them circling, honey? Can't you feel 'em
 sundance@rpi.edu | \  schooling around? You've got fins to the left, fins to
------------------+--`  the right, and you're the only bait in town.
                  |            RPI anthem -- Fins, Jimmy Buffett
From: tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu (Timothy C. Worsley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Fed Ex that case of beer! (Was Re: "bomb out of t-mode" ?)
Date: 7 Apr 92 02:25:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.YdsEU3m00VokQ3SngI
	<72806@netnews.upenn.edu>
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

>However, I've bombed after the message, and before the 't' went away
>without causing a Guardian...

	The planet-gauding robots don't always apear instantly as you bomb. 
Lumchan and I were trying to get one to come out once, and had to bomb
down three planets before he showed up.  There was definitely no t-mode
at the time.

ZZnew guy
From: tom@ocf.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: CMU Netrek
Date: 16 Apr 92 09:15:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.sjgkfINN3gb
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: lightning.berkeley.edu

In article <74219@netnews.upenn.edu> paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Commodore FreeKill) writes:
)
)2) Out of the people on the game, many have clue.  Sure, some are fairly
)   clueless, but in general a Captain on bronco could make almost ANY rank on
)   another server.  (There are definite exceptions here in servers - some do
)   have a lot of clue)
)
)3) The server god, Terence, keeps adding new hacks that really improve the
)   game.  UDP is an obvious one.  The ability to find game stats is another.
)   HK also comes to mind.  Now we also have the attacking Guardians and
)   cloaking iggys.  Also, iggy dets torps...

Terence has made a lot of great mods.  I would *not* count Iggy as one
of them.  If I wanted to fight robots, I would go to an empty server
and bomb Klingus.  I find Iggy to be quite monotonus and irritating.
Other than that, I agree that his mods are good (although the last-
planet stand timer should be only for robot games).
 -Mojo
Xref: sparky rec.games.netrek:604 alt.games.xtrek:3734
From: sjsmith@cs.umd.edu (Stephen Joseph Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek,alt.games.xtrek
Subject: Masters of the Universe at Team Testudo: Post-Game Show
Date: 12 Apr 92 20:50:37 GMT
Followup-To: rec.games.netrek
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, University of Maryland at College Park

Kudos to Masters, who were all logged in (as were we) by about 15
minutes *before* game time.  The game started about 5 minutes early.

The Masters began with an interesting opening: SB/BB/2 SC/4 AS.  The
two scouts sprinted out to bomb and die, returning about the time that
our team was attempting to get the core planets.  They thereby managed
to create lots of kills for an initial bombing surge, quickly taking
our front.  They then ogged our base in two waves, and reduced the
army advantage we briefly had.

Our attempts to move armies, when we had them, were met with superb
multi-player oggs.  We only managed to take 4 planets in the course of
the game.

After a point, it became obvious that the planet-taking bottleneck in
the game would be their ability to get and keep kills.  Up to a point
our ogging was extremely successful and planet taking virtually
ceased.  Then they started to go after kills deliberately, in pairs.
It became much harder to ogg the targets presented.

Once they had kills, they moved armies pretty well.  We never went for
the ogg on their base, as we possibly should have, so they had a
haven.  Our planet defense was reasonable, but eventually overcome by
repetition.

The flow of the game seemed to be: 10 planets for us at the beginning,
then briefly 5 and back up to 7 (scratching 8 momentarily), then down
to 5, then down to 3 when they took Rom and Sir.  We stayed with these
3 (Dra-Tau-Eri) for about half an hour.  We had about three real
opportunities to re-take Rom, two which were ogged, and one where the
AS bomb only went down to 3 (from 5.)

Finally Dra was independent, and soon after an all-out attack by
Masters took out Tau and Eri virtually simultaneously.  Game ended
with about 1 hour elapsed, by genocide.

Our MVP selection for this game is Amazing.  He had kills all the damn
time.

Thanks again to Masters, who played a good game, and thanks to my
team, who played much better than they did in our prior ignominious
defeat.

As for our remaining games, we have Akira scheduled Saturday at 10 am
EDT, and Duke appears to just be too afraid of us.  (Hint Hint: We'd
really like to schedule a game.)

- Flt. Capt. Austere with Flt. Capt. Wreck
  Captain, Team Testudo
  <sjsmith@cs.umd.edu>
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Do people blink on the galactic map when beaming?
Date: 16 Apr 92 22:23:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Apr16.222341.17453
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

For a long time now I've thought the standard bronco client (at least
in monochrome) when playing on bronco will make ships blink on the
galactic map when they are beaming up or down, and/or bombing.

Am I hallucinating? It seems to work.
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/    The look in his eyes when it hit - Kid, it was tasty...
From: fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: UDP v1.0 README addendum
Date: 9 Apr 92 18:42:28 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1992Apr9.064426.7989@wuecl.wustl.edu> qarl@wucs1.wustl.edu (Karl Stiefvater) writes:
>It seems reasonable that the blessed clients should have SEVERAL
>authentication routines, one for each major server; where each server
>only has the source code to ONE.  This way, if a server god decides to
>create a blessed borg, it will only work on his server.

We had a fairly long discussion on this once upon a time.  The measures which
would be reasonably effective are also rather inconvenient for server admins.
There will always be weak-minded dishonest people who will go to great lengths
to play a cyborg on a human-only server; stopping them simply isn't worth
the pain involved.

Best thing to do is to figure out who they are and notify the server admin
with pseudonym, login, and date/time, as well as a description of why you
think that person is a borg.  The server diety can check the log files for
various information, and can keep track of reports.

>- Karl

-- 
fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]
From: spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Borg and Robot algorithms
Date: 16 Apr 92 21:08:19 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Originator: spot@FORTRAN.FOX.CS.CMU.EDU

>>>> In article <74232@netnews.upenn.edu> paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Commodore FreeKill) writes:

FreeKill> Basically, how do people decide who is an army carrier when
FreeKill> they watch armies being beamed up?  Please try to be as
FreeKill> descriptive as possible.  This makes it much easier to
FreeKill> program.

i see who has kills and is a likely carrier, then i wait and see which
such player enters "visible" space from that direction.  if i am close
enough and not too busy, i will fly towards the planet, hoping to make
it clear who picked up.

-- 
			conform
scott draves		deform
spot@cs.cmu.edu		explode
From: tom@ocf.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Play-offs (was Re: UDP and regions)
Keywords: INL playoffs
Date: 9 Apr 92 03:21:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.s0d8gINNq2d
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: monsoon.berkeley.edu

In article <52784@mimsy.umd.edu> sjsmith@cs.umd.edu (Stephen Joseph Smith) writes:
)In article <rtr2kINNh19@agate.berkeley.edu> 
)tom@ocf.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) writes [re the play-offs]:
)>...The
)>bottom four will be wild cards and play each other in the first round;
)>the division winners will get a bye and play the winner of the wildcard
)>game.  At least, that's the system I've worked out...any objections?
)
)I have no problem about this, except that it would be nice if we [the INL
)captains] had found out about the play-offs being increased from 4 teams to 6 
)teams?  Like through e-mail rather than our addictive reading of
)rec.games.netrek?  Just a minor grumble.

I hadn't (and still haven't) decided on it; I'm soliciting opinions.

)Call the division I teams with the best three records at the end of the season
)IA, IB, IC in descending order, and the division II teams IIA, IIB, IIC.
)
)Playoffs should then be:
)IIC at IB
)IC at IIB
)winner of IIC at IB, at IIA
)winner of IIB at IC, at IA
)championship
)
)Like this suggestion?  This should basically be standard play-off methods,
)i.e., matching the expected worst team against the expected best team, and
)mixing up the divisions as much as possible.

Sounds like it would work; the other possibility is always pairing the
best remaining team against the worst remaining team (the way the NBA
playoffs work).  No big difference, most likely.
 -Mojo