From: jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak)
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Reply-To: jpak@manute.sps.mot.com (The Devil)
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:09:59 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.053314.20774@panix.com> sieh@panix.com (Twinkie Chinkie) writes:
>>Lui, are you ever going to stop with this?  Granted what Judy wrote to you
>>was mean, but it's not like she hasn't gotten some back from you and others,
>>and besides, it's been *THREE WEEKS* now.  
>
>Ah ha, and finally the devil speaks.

Thanks for the label, "TC."  Look!!  I like it so much, I've adopted it!!
See above?  Thanks!!  I like it myself.  It makes me look *LESS* like a
victim, unlike little boys who try to win sympathy by calling themselves
"Twinkie Chinkie."  Poor little Twinkie Chinkie, gets beat up by those Big
Bad Asian American girls.  Poor, poor, TC...

>You know Jim, I've been just waiting for you to address this.

Well, I'm oh-so-glad you didn't have to wait too long.

>In your "discussions" with your good pal JJ, I
>remember very distinctly that you and he both had agreed to vocalize your
>displeasures with people who spewed racist remarks.

Which article was that?  I don't recall making any "agreements" with JJ on
anything.  I *did* note that he doesn't bash those who make *specific* anti-
Asian stereotypes, only those who make anti-white or WM stereotypes, although
he claimed to be consistent in hating all stereotypes.  I'm sure he probably
threw the same accusation back in my face.  But where was the "agreement" for
future posts?  Huh, Lui?  Huh, Mr. "Nobody Ever Reads My Posts Correctly But
of Course I Always Read Theirs Right" Sieh?

>I was eagerly waiting to see you make good on that "promise"

What "promise"??  What "agreement"??

>since perhaps your "new" outlook gave me some hope that perhaps you're
>getting a little maturer in your articles.  
>Looks like I'll have to wait and see if this "new" Jim Pak is for real or not.
>But I won't hold my breath.  I like to continue living.

Please, next time, do yourself a favor.  Hold your breath longer.  I'm sure
you'll agree your new blue face will be a big improvement over that damned
shade of yellow we both have.

>>And you keep mentioning it again and again in post after post after post.
>>Enough already!!  What do you want, an engraved apology from her?
>
>Ya know, that would be rather nice ... Not.  The reason why I have brought
>this up is not because I have a personal vendetta against Judy (she's not
>worth the effort) but because she and her posts are excellent illustrations
>of what I am against.

So why don't you mention *that* instead of your whining?  Oh, poor little me,
poor little Twinkie Chinkie, got beat up by BIG BAD JUDY TSENG three weeks
ago, I still gotta talk about that, poor, poor me.

Who else cries like you do over a flame in USENET?  Andy gets physically
threatened by a loony Rambo wanna-be, I don't see him crying over it.  (Oh,
and btw, where were *you* then?  Did I hear you speak out for him then?  Did
I miss that post of yours?)  Dwight gets nailed left and right in ways you
never could stomach, and I don't see him EVER getting much annoyed over it,
much less crying about it.  JJ and I have thrown countless insults at each
other over the past few months.  Believe it or not, we still sometimes
converse in e-mail, in a normal, civil voice.

You ever stop and try to *talk* to those people who "savage" you, after you
both have the chance to calm down, Mr. "I Like to Build Alliances With People
of All Kinds of Diverse Outlooks"?  Or do you still hold stupid net.grudges
months and months after the fact?

>Her views are very much the antithesis of mine and so I use it.

Then why don't you attack her views WITHOUT harping on how poor little you
got "attacked" and "bashed" by Big Bad Judy? 

>If there were more "fodder" elsewhere, you can be sure that I will
>not hesitate to employ it.  But the case happens that nothing better has
>come up to use as a foil.  In any event, she's going through what every new
>USENET poster goes through.  I went through the same things...kinda like an
>initiation of sorts.

Gee, and when she got some flames back from others, including a line-by-line
flame from Mike "I'm a Know-It-All" Fester, I didn't see her subsequently
crying about it three weeks after the fact.  She took her lumps quite well.
You, who's been around for God-knows-how-long, how did you take your ONE
flame from her?  You still cry over it!!

Quit crying, little boy!!

>>You know, in a previous article, you wrote:
>>
>>     For myself, I have a serious difficulty with the idea of portraying
>>     myself as a victim.  [<1992Aug22.190240.25334@panix.com>]
>>           
>>Really?  Is that so?  Could have fooled me.
>
>This is so laughable.  Learn to read huh.  Or better yet, learn reading 
>*comprehension*?

You're right, this *is* so laughable.  You accusing me of poor reading comp-
rehension, that is.  Lui, you, MORE THAN ANYBODY IN SCAA I KNOW OF, manage
to twist the meaning of what other people write into convoluted off-shoots
nobody else can understand.  How you do it is beyond me.  Remember how you
took Woody's very short comment about complaining patterns and twisted it
into your multiple "deductions" about him?  Remember this from a year back?

    <1991May21.023447.19470@cs.wayne.edu>
    To the person seeking enlightenment, Lui Shieh (sorry for the spelling):
    puhleeeeezz learn some English, I have never seen such a gross
    misinterpretation of what I had written by anyone.  You almost
    led me to think you were a white red-neck.  So you disagree with my
    points, explain why.

Or this from earlier this month? 

    <BsBD5o.3JC@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>
    The reason I am saying this is that I think you missed some of the
    jist of her message in your response. Not that I'm criticizing you,
    I just noticed that you seemed to interpret her words differently
    than I did, meaning you rebutted points that I didn't even think
    she made.

Do you know how to comprehend other people's posts yourself?  For all your
bragging about CMU's English department, you must have not taken much
advantage of what you had there.

>hehe...Naturally, this looks like you got me here.  Only problem is that
>you took it out of context Jim.

You are about to walk into a pit of double-standards even you won't be able
to squirm out of.  But continue...

>But I'm not surprised.  I said that to your face several
>months ago in May too.  Boy, didn't that get your dander up :-).  You 
>haven't changed at all.  

And you have???  How have *you* changed, Lui me-boy?

>Oh, btw, that article dealt with being a victim of *WHITE* discrimination 
>and repression.

OK, so let me see how this works.  When dealing with *WHITE* discrimination,
you have severe difficulties with the idea of portraying yourself as a victim.
Hey, I'll bet it's really easy to deny it ever happened!!  Yippee, why not?
They were white, they couldn't have *REALLY* meant it.

On the other hand, in dealing with Asian discrimination, you harp on it on and
on, talk about how you were the victim of a "tirade," how you were savaged,
"attacked," and "bashed."  You call yourself Twinkie Chinkie, and have been
using that label to refer to yourself for god-knows how many posts now.  Poor
little Lui, getting called the "T" word by other Asian Americans.  Getting
beat up by Big Bad Judy and her cohort The Devil.

That is the *most* pathetic example of a double-standard I've ever heard of.
That takes the cake.

Let me ask you, Lui, why do you have such difficulties thinking of yourself as
a victim when it's a white person discriminating against you, and yet overdo
it by a factor of 5 when it's an Asian?  Got any good answers there?

I won't hold my own breath.

>As for being a victim of Asian American discrimination?  
>Well, you have a point here.  At points in my life, I've had more AsAms 
>against me and wishing me harm than Whites.

I have a sneaking suspicion that if I were to hold views that got *me*
confused with being a white redneck, I'd probably hear similar things from
AsAms on occasion.

>And certainly I've never had to hear from a "White", "I'm chinkier than you"
>accompanied by the appropriate facial expression.

How many times have you been called a "Chink", "Gook", or "Jap" from an Asian
person?  Go ahead, if you got called that even once, I'm sure it's permanently
etched in your brain by now, whereas the many times you got it from whites
has all but been erased from your memory bank.  Uh huh...  That's right,
let's forget about "those comments."  Don't make ourselves the victim!!!
But if *ONE* Asian person calls you the t-word, by God, I'll remind the
readers of scaa over and over and over until, until... until I turn blue!!

You ever call a white person who called you [C/G/J] The Devil?  I'll bet not.
Wonder why...

>I should be grateful for some small favors in life I suppose.

I know.  So do yourself a favor and go door-to-door to all the White people
in America who have never called you a Chink...and plant a big rosy one on
their behind for me.

The Devil
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american