From: jcho@nmsu.EDU (CHO)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: ND vs FSU vs Michigan
Date: 12 Sep 92 21:45:17 GMT
	<BILLMS.92Sep11083217@z.eecs.umich.edu> <10699@sun13.scri.fsu.edu>
	<BILLMS.92Sep11165356@z.eecs.umich.edu>
Distribution: usa
Organization: New Mexico State University, Las Cruces, NM

In article <BILLMS.92Sep11165356@z.eecs.umich.edu> billms@eecs.umich.edu (William Mangione-Smith) writes:

    Ok, I'd agree that Michigan is still a powerful team, but they (along with
    the rest of the Big-10) have lost something over that past five years
    (recent times?).  There is a new group of powerhouses in college football
    (e.g., FSU, Miami, Washington, Florida).  Because of Michigan's
    playing style, they can't surprise any of these top teams in the BIG games.
    Smashmouth football is passe.

> Well, you've got a point here.  Pounding up the middle with Desmond and
> Tyrone Wheatly won't get us past Washington.  And while Elvis is fantastic
> running off tackle (hey, that is why he was selected america's favorite qb
> last year, right?), he can't pass worth shit.

Hmmm...don't you have it wrong here... I always considered Elvis to
be shoddy when he is on the move and easily sacked when not properly
defended... But I do believe he has a fine arm.

> Take a look at the team before you start talking like an expert.  What do you
> know: they even use the no huddle!  Is that also a cornerstone to smashmouth
> football? 

> Anybody know the average standing in the recent past, but longer than last
> 2-3 years?  How about last 5?  Mark M?  I'd bet you'd be surprised Jonathan
> by the by where the finished.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I fail to understand this sentence.

Average standing of what? Michigan vs. FSU over 5 years?
I think I am willing to bet FSU over Michigan by quite a bit....

>>      >The reason FSU came to Michigan in recent times is that the games were
>>      >scheduled 10-15 years back when FSU sucked and needed 
>>      >	A) the cash
>>      >	B) the exposure of playing a top school

      FSU played for the national championship in the Orange Bowl in 1981 (11
      years ago, hmmm).

> Michigan played them last year.  Hmmm... just lost ~10% of your time frame.
> I said 10-15 years was the typical scheduling lead time (I don't think this
> is the case anymore).  You've managed to hit the outside.  I'm still pretty
> convinced your wrong about the percieved FSU quality when the games were
> scheduled, but the only way to find out would be to have somebody call up and
> find out when those games were scheduled.  You wanna volunteer?  I've got
> better things to do.

>>Take a look at recent (i.e. last 10 years) Miami games.  Neither of these two
>>schools had any leverage 15 years ago.  Now, if the games were scheduled,
>>things would be different. 

      The agreement with ND happened less than 2 years ago.  I think FSU was
      pretty good then...

>   What are you talking about?  Michigan and ND schedules go back much longer
>   than 2 years.  Or did you mean ND vs. FSU?  Maybe it wasn't clear: I don't
>   know whats going on with the Irish and was only talking about michigan.  

>   I've still gotta wonder why you think somebody is scared to come to play at
>   FSU.  The real issue is: does FSU want them to come play there, and do they
>   have the clout to make it happen? Sounds to me, based solely on what you've
>   been saying, that they don't. 

Well, I think its pretty certain that a number of teams are indeed 
apprehensive toward playing the Noles... Isn't it true for all teams
with top 10 status... Downplaying FSU simply on account that it doesn't
possess the tradition of Michigan and ND is nothing more than empty words.
FSU like all other majorly competitive teams plays both sides of the 
bargaining table...most people call this..."making your own schedule."
It is a luxury that is not easily given... I think FSU carries plenty
of "clout" to make just about any deal...except play at the Rose Bowl...
which as we all know is strictly exclusive to the now stagnate Big-10
and now over-rated Pac-10 (both which I might add do still even today 
possess good teams)... No one will argue that Michigan is strong...
probably one of the best running teams this year... And, who will
argue that FSU has one of the best defenses this year as well? 
But as the Big10 and Pac10 continue to stick their noses in the air
and pick tradition over competition...you are going to see a downfall
in quality....with no one within the stagnating group realizing it.
This, I might point out, is true for all the football conferences.
Fortunately the majority of the conferences have chosen to lift the
game of college football up a notch by trying to get the best possible
matchups in the bowls...with all these bowl alliances and the like.
I can appreciate this a great deal... But, anyone from the Big10 who
starts yapping about FSU as this bumbling wolfling who deserves no respect
and is just a fluke team with no real influence anywhere despite the
stunning loss last year to FSU at home...needs to grab a pop (as they
say in the mid-west) kick back and relax. 

   Bill

   --
   -------------------------------
	   Bill Mangione-Smith
	   billms@eecs.umich.edu

						JCHO@nmsu.edu