HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bharrell@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Ben Harrell)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: Re: Northern Telecom Q.931 spec
Keywords: Do you know of one?
Date: 16 Nov 92 15:20:42 GMT
Reply-To: cmebh01@nt.com (Ben Harrell)
Organization: Computers and Technologies Theme Program-NCSU-NC

rte@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (ralph.t.edwards) writes:

>Does NTI publish an equivalent of AT&Ts 41449 & 41459 specs which are
>parallel to the CCITT Q.931 spec, and detail which CCITT pargraphs
>are supported by AT&T?  If so could you send me the NTI document title
>and name and perhaps a telephone number where the document can be
>ordered?

I don't know the document number, but we do have one.  You can call
1-800-NORTHERN and ask for NT's ISDN Technical Specification, and they
should be able to help.

>If their BRI and PRI Q.931 specs are separate, send both names.

I think they are one and the same, but not sure.

Ben Harrell                            *    My choice for 1992
cmebh01@nt.com ...........<business>   *    presidential ticket:
bharrell@catt.ncsu.edu ...<pleasure>   *      Picard/Riker'92
From: p00136@psilink.com (Bob Larribeau)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: Re: Connect two Ethernet LAN's by ISDN ?
Date: 16 Nov 92 23:04:52 GMT
Organization: Consultant
X-Mailer: PSILink-DOS (3.3)

I did not intend to burden everybody with a message that I thought could 
be handled with personal mail.  However, I cannot send mail to La Monte, 
the message I get back says it would require 19 hops and I am only 
allowed 17.  :-)Gee, so much hassle over two little hops!

I believed that Gandalf introduced a new product that supports 128 kbps 
transfers.  Their previous product was 64 kbps plus voice.  Digiboard 
has a product that will support transfers of 256 kbps if you connect two 
ISDN lines into it.

All of these boxes are ISDN/Ethernet bridges, i.e., they operate at 
Layer 2 and IP runs above them.  They will support any network protocol.

		Bob


>DATE:   Mon, 16 Nov 92 17:23:51 EST
>FROM:   La Monte Yarroll <piggy@noether.maths.utas.edu.au>
>
>Gandalf Inc. has a box which connects two Ethernets over a BRI.  They
>were supposed to come out with a new version in October, but I haven't
>kept up.  I don't remember if it was TCP/IP only, or pure Ethernet.
>
>In comp.dcom.isdn you write:
>
>>Combinet (408)522-9020, Gandalf-Premier (708)517-3615, and Digiboard 
>>(612)943-9020 all make Ethernet ISDN bridges in the U.S.
>
>>	Bob Larribeau
>>	San Francisco
>
>>>DATE:   Thu, 12 Nov 1992 17:35:55 GMT
>>>FROM:   Ernst Kloecker <ernst@opal.cs.tu-berlin.de>
>>>
>>>Hi,
>>>
>>>we would like two connect two Ethernet LAN's via ISDN. Ideally, IPX/SPX (Novell)
>>>as well as TCP/IP (Unix) packets should be routed over the same ISDN
>>>connection. Has anybody done anything like that before ?
>>>
>>>Which products provide that kind of connection ? I would really like the
>>>idea of a box with two connections, one ISDN, the other one thin ethernet.
>>>Does anything like this exist ???
>>>
>>>Thanks for any info, Ernst.
>>>--
>>>
>>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>Ernst Kloecker      phone: ++49-30-6181635      e-mail: ernst@cs.tu-berlin.de
>>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>-- 
>La Monte H. Yarroll	Home:		piggy@baqaqi.chi.il.us
>   Work:		piggy@hilbert.maths.utas.edu.au
>   AKA:			piggy@gargoyle.uchicago.edu
>   Once upon a time:	postmaster@clout.chi.il.us
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: vadim@cix.compulink.co.uk (Vadim Lebedev)
Subject: ISDN Standards
Reply-To: vadim@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 00:03:00 +0000


Hello,

I'm a ISDN neofit, and looking for information on 
international standards for interconnecting ISDN and NON-ISDN equipement.
I've heard that there are CCITT standard dealing with the issue, but
i don't know which one?

Any help please?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Vadim Lebedev                      |   Kortex International
vadim@cix.compulink.co.uk          |   139-147 av. Paul-Vaillant Couturier
                                   |   93126 La Courneuve - CEDEX, France





Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: elmo@netcom.com (Eliot Moore)
Subject: Need cheap X.25 PAD for D-channel
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 02:35:34 GMT

I don't have service installed as yet, but plan on replacing several
low-speed dialups and private lines with packet access via a "D" channel
on Centrex/IS service.

Can anyone point me to a source for inexpensive PADs ($1Kish) for this
purpose?  Is there software available to have an MSDOS system act as a
PAD for serially-attached devices?

elmo


-- 
Eliot Moore - elmo@netcom.com, POB 1431 Santa Monica CA 90406
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: james@cs.UAlberta.CA (James Borynec; AGT Researcher)
Subject: Re: PacBell ISDN?
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:49:03 GMT

kph@cisco.com (Kevin Paul Herbert) writes:

>I am served by an ISDN-capable 5E switch, but am served remotely (I live in
>the mountains and a 5E switch serves the entire valley that I live in). PacBell offers ISDN for the wire center in which the switch is physically located, but not in any of the remote wire centers.

>My account executive speculates that this may be because they'd have to devote an entire channel bank to ISDN lines, and they wouldn't want to devote this much of their bandwidth unless I got 8 BRI lines. All I want is 2...

>Does anybody know if this is the correct reason, or if there really is a technical reason that they can't put ISLUs in the remote wire center?

Some remotes cannot support ISDN line cards.  Thus they can't offer
ISDN services from those remotes.  PacBell may not want to forklift
upgrade those remotes.

j.b.
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis)
Subject: Re: Open market versus monopoly, was Re: Obtaining ISDN
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 17:21:58 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.160614.10428@telebit.com> bjork@telebit.com (Steven Bjork) writes:
>There is *no* effective competition in either the telco local loop
>or the cable tv local loop.
>
>This is why telephone charges are so outrageous, not to mention the
>plundering done by cable tv systems.
>
>AT&T is so cash rich they have nothing better to do than buy
>computer companies and pay off lawyers. I'd much rather see that
>money go towards fiber to the demarc, or not taken in the first
>place (ie, rate reductions).

Uh, excuse me, but in case you weren't paying attention, AT&T hasn't been in
the local exchange business for about 9 years now.  The only demarc we can
run fiber to is the demarc with the local exchange carrier.

David G Lewis                              AT&T Bell Laboratories
david.g.lewis@att.com or !att!goofy!deej     Switching & ISDN Implementation
From: tjh+@CMU.EDU (Tom Holodnik)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: FAQ for this group?
Date: 16 Nov 92 05:52:37 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.Mf1wD5_00WCo8YpnAG
Organization: Data Communications, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


Is there an FAQ for this newsgroup?  Is there an archive site? 

Thanks in advance,
-tom
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: "Bob Larribeau" <p00136@psilink.com>
Subject: Re: X.25 ofer the D channel
Organization: Consultant
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 21:33:45 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink-DOS (3.3)

>I understand that it is possible to run X.25 of the D channel of ISDN? 
>Anyone have any idea how popular this is?  What are the applications for
>this?                  Bill


Most implementations include a PAD in the TA rather than giving direct 
access to the X.25.  It is used for asynch terminal or PC 
communications, such as host access or PC file transfer.  I have seen 
file transfers at 12 kbps or better achieved on the D channel.  There 
are also specialized applications such as credit card authorization 
being implemented for this service.

		Bob Larribeau
		San Francisco
From: curt@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Curt Welch)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: Re: PacBell ISDN?READ/NEW/FOLLOWUP
Date: 17 Nov 92 18:40:26 GMT
Reply-To: curt@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Curt Welch)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

billp@Syntex.COM (Bill Putney) writes:
> I asked about a flat rate residential ISDN and the story I get is that
> since an ISDN TA isn't line powered they can't offer ISDN as a residential
> service.  The problem (they say) is that if the power was off a person
> couldn't call 911.  This seems to me to be a very poor excuse.

In comp.dcom.isdn, imhw400@indyvax.iupui.edu writes:
>To me, too.  Gee, I thought that the telcos had all heard about float-charged
>batteries.

This is just what they are telling you now.  I'm sure that one day there
will be residental ISDN without a requirement for a POTS line. 

The reason we don't have residental service now isn't because it's unsafe.
It's just not time yet.

It's common (and wise) marketing to offer new services (and products)
at higher initial prices.  It allows the company to more quickly boot-strap
the new service, and to measure the true market demands.

All the ISDN services I've seen talked about now Centrex options
today.  Soon we will have single line business ISDN lines, and not to
long after that (within a few years), we will see residential ISDN
(maybe with a battery backup requirement).  But don't ever expect to
get ISDN for the same reducd price you get residential POTS service
for.

Curt
From: "chris strawser" <chris.strawser@channel1.com>
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: bri lengths
Date: 21 Nov 92 01:44:10 EST
Reply-To: "chris strawser" <chris.strawser@channel1.com>
Distribution: comp
Organization: Channel 1 Communications

I understand that the maximum distance an ISDN U-interface can
be run is 6 kilometers.  If this is so, how do you run a BRI
over longer distances?  Just for fun, let's say my local telco
wants to supply ISDN to all who ask for it.  If I want a BRI
to my house, and the CO is 10 kilometers away, how does it
happen?  Is there another interface that's good for longer
distances, or does the telco have to plant repeaters all
over the place?
--
Channel 1 (R)   Cambridge, MA

Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: vulture@imperial.ac.uk (Thomas Sippel - Dau)
Subject: Re: Open market versus monopoly, was Re: Obtaining ISDN
Reply-To: cmaae47@imperial.ac.uk
Organization: Imperial College of Science, Technology and Medicine
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 19:46:35 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.160614.10428@telebit.com>, bjork@telebit.com (Steven Bjork) writes:
- 
- This is why telephone charges are so outrageous, not to mention the
- plundering done by cable tv systems.
- 
- For an example of serious rate discrimination, it costs me as much
- money to call across the San Francisco bay as it does to call
- Montana.
- 

And it would cost me more than twice as much to phone Ciudad Juarez
than to call El Paso. Not much of a difference when seen from Europe ....

                                      Thomas
-- 
*** This is the operative statement, all previous statements are inoperative.
*   email: cmaae47 @ ic.ac.uk (Thomas Sippel - Dau) (uk.ac.ic on Janet)
*   voice: +44 71 589 5111 x4937 or 4934 (day), or +44 71 823 9497 (fax)
*   snail: Imperial College of Science, Technology and Medicine
*   The Center for Computing Services, Kensington SW7 2BX, Great Britain
From: stpierre@sw.stratus.com (Mark StPierre)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: X.25 over ISDN Addressing
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:11:26 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: alpha.sw.stratus.com

Can someone explain a few X.25 over ISDN addressing question. Are 2 numbers
required to establish an X.25 call, first number to get to the PPDN and a
second to get across the PPDN to the remote DTE? In the case where X.121
(data numbering plan) is supported, can the X.121 address be used to setup
the ISDN call and the X.25 call? I have heard this works in Germany.

Any information or pointers on X.25 ISDN internetworking would be appreciated.

-- 
========================================================
Mark St. Pierre		   stpierre@alpha.sw.stratus.com
Stratus Computer, Inc.     Mark_StPierre@vos.stratus.com
M3-2-COM			     
55 Fairbanks Boulevard	              TEL (508) 490-6509
Marlboro, MA 01752-1298               FAX (508) 624-7488
========================================================
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: huntting@advtech.uswest.com (Brad Huntting)
Subject: Re: Obtaining ISDN
Organization: U S WEST Advanced Technologies
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:54:27 GMT

In article <1992Nov13.154757.28389@bmerh85.bnr.ca> coghlan@bnr.ca (Patrick Coghlan) writes:
>[With ISDN at home] you would have:

>- a 64 k/bit data line which does not interfere with your use of the 
>  telephone

As opposed to a 14.4Kb/s real throughput on a single POTS line.  For us
realistic folks it's really more like ~35Kb/s when you include V.42bis
compression.  Of course now I'll be flamed by the half of the group for
comparring apples and oranges again, but in the real world it's
perfectly reasonable to compare these because you cant buy ISDN with
compression.  (Or did I miss something?)

>- use of the X.25 protocol over this data line which can be used to
>  set up multiple sessions simultaneously

Has anyone tested this in the real world?  Can your local switch deal
with X.25 traffic at a reasonable rate (if at all)?  How many virtual
X.25 connections can you multiplex on one B channel?

>- access to any X.25 device hooked up to the ISDN network or other public 
>  packet switching networks (most ISDN switches have an X.75 trunk to 
>  PPSNs)

But both of them are probably banks and will refuse talk to you...

>- the ability to run data intensive protocols such as X to access
>  your office workstation from home

Without having to multiplex your network trafic over several POTS
lines.

>In summary, it's fairly fast (compared to 9600 modems) and it doesn't 
>tie up your telephone.

U S WEST has been offering second phone lines for $17/mo.

> It should also be much cheaper to dial-up over long-distance than using
> telephones and modems since the charges for holding time on packet
> networks are much less than for voice...  I think.

Really?  Could some of the folks who work for interLATA carier's
comment on this creative billing mechanism?  This is the first I've
heard of it.  I find it hard to believe that an ISDN call could be
anything but more expencive than an POTS call.  But if you were being
billed by the packet then it could make sence.

Of course this presuposes that your local RBOC and your longdistance
carrier can pass ISDN traffic...  I dont honestly know if U S WEST has
that capability with any longdistance provider yet.  What would it
take?  SS7?

IDSN offers speed, but requires outragously high priced customer
premise equipment.  So you can get either 35Kb/s out of a second phone
line for $17/mo with a $300 modem, or 64Kb/s (mabey 128Kb/s) out of an
ISDN line which you also use as your primary telephone for $X/mo with
about $2000+ worth of equipment (unless you have a NeXT, a Sparc10 at
home).

Now how if you are going to shell out that extra $1700+ for the
hardware to use ISDN (on both ends of the connection probably!), then
what do you suppose X would have to be to make up for it?


brad
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: "Bob Larribeau" <p00136@psilink.com>
Subject: re: COMBINET PROBLEM
Organization: Consultant
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:20:53 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink-DOS (3.3)

The following is a message that I am posting at the request of Combinet 
in response tothe message from David E. Martin.  Im not associated with 
Combinet.  If you have any questions, please contact Combinet directly 
at (408)522-9020.

		Bob Larribeau
		San Francisco



 
>If your network has more than 1500 ethernet devices, you are
>susceptible to this problem. A quick fix is to set the aging time
>to a small value (like 60 sec).  Combinet is working on a fix. 
>  
>   
>David E. Martin
>National HEPnet Management                      ||    Phone: +1 708 840-8275
>Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory           ||    FAX: +1 708 840-8463
>P.O. Box 500, MS 368; Batavia, IL 60510  USA   /  \   E-Mail: dem@hep.net
>


To Combinet Interchange Users:

This note applies to users of the Combinet INTERCHANGE(tm)
Bridge, Software version 2.11 or below:

For large networks (over 1500 Ethernet addresses), it is
important that the Combinet Interchange be configured as
described below.

If a small remote workgroup (less than 250 Ethernet addresses) is
being bridged to an enterprise LAN, the two Interchanges should
be configured as follows:

     1) The Interchange which is connected to the enterprise LAN
     should be set as follows:

          SEt MOde ONly

     2) The remote LAN Interchange should be set as follows:

          SEt MOde ANy
          SEt AGe 1200

If two large networks are being bridged, both Interchange units
should be set up as follows:

          SEt MOde ANy
          SEt AGe 1200*

* The aging time parameter (1200 in the example) is network
dependent.  The aging time should be set such that the address
table will not exceed 1500 addresses.

There is a new release of Interchange software (2.15) which
ensures correct operation of the units independent of
configuration.  This is currently available by calling Combinet
technical support.

Note:  The address aging feature is not available in software
versions below 2.02.  In this case, it is recommended that units
be upgraded to release 2.15.
From: 6500joe@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Joseph Ballantyne)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: Info on National ISDN spec wanted
Keywords: ISDN, NISDN-1
Date: 24 Nov 92 01:04:56 GMT
Distribution: comp.dcom.isdn



I would like to get the N-ISDN1 specification - the national ISDN
standard for the USA.  Where can I get a copy of it.  I would 
prefer an ftpable copy, but information
on where to buy a printed copy would be appreciated as well.

Thanks

Joe Ballantyne
6500joe@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu

Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: "Bob Larribeau" <p00136@psilink.com>
Subject: Re: ISDN in USA and Germany
Organization: Consultant
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 21:30:23 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink-DOS (3.3)

>Sorry if this is a FAQ, but are the ISDNs from Germany and USA
>"compatible" ? So, may I call from an ISDN-site here right away over
>the big pond and get all the ISDN-features? 
>
>Ottmar Roehrig
>
>Zerberus: O.ROEHRIG@LINK-HH.ZER | UUCP: ottmar@ajberl.adsp.sub.org
>                                  DE: O.ROEHRIG@LINK-HH.COMLINK.DE

The first question is what does "compatible" mean.  You can make a voice 
call from an ISDN set in Germany to an ISDN set in the U.S.  Given the 
state of SS7 deployment, I would be very surprised if you can get your 
signalling information sent end-to-end for voice calls.

AT&T says that they will support switched digital service between the 
U.S. and Germany at 56 kbps or 64 kbps.  That implies that there is 
enough SS7 involved for these data calls to support a 64 kbps call.  The 
cost from the U.S. to Germany is $2.35 per minute.

Packet connections can be made assuming that the ISDN networks on both 
end have X.75 connections into public packet networks.  Many RBOCs in 
the U.S. do not have packet connections into public packet networks today.

What this means is that you can achieve connectivity, depending on the 
end points, but you will probably not have the signalling information 
transmitted across the networks.

		Bob Larribeau
		San Francisco
From: dunham@bonehead.esd.sgi.com (William Dunham)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
Subject: X.25 ofer the D channel
Date: 21 Nov 92 01:08:18 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

I understand that it is possible to run X.25 of the D channel of ISDN? 
Anyone have any idea how popular this is?  What are the applications for
this?                  Bill
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis)
Subject: Re: PacBell ISDN?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 15:22:19 GMT

In article <1e9lnpINNboe@roche.csl.sri.com> kph@cisco.com (Kevin Paul Herbert) writes:
>I am served by an ISDN-capable 5E switch, but am served remotely (I live in
>the mountains and a 5E switch serves the entire valley that I live in).
>PacBell offers ISDN for the wire center in which the switch is physically
>located, but not in any of the remote wire centers.
>
>My account executive speculates that this may be because they'd have to 
>devote an entire channel bank to ISDN lines, and they wouldn't want to devote
>this much of their bandwidth unless I got 8 BRI lines. All I want is 2...
>
>Does anybody know if this is the correct reason, or if there really is a 
>technical reason that they can't put ISLUs in the remote wire center?

No technical reason, but the same economic reason (except more so).
(Disclaimer: I don't do 5ESS switch stuff at AT&T; the following is
information I gained trying to figure out ways to do remote ISDN off 5Es at
Teleport Communications.  I may be missing things.)

Remoting ISDN via SLCs/D4s gets you 8 BRIs per DS1.  The more BRIs you
serve, the more economical it is.  At TCG, I could justify 8 BRIs and 48
POTS lines off a SLC-5, but nothing less (two years ago, anyway).  2 BRIs
didn't cut it.

If you're currently served by a remote 5ESS Switch Module (SM) (usually
called an RSM, Remote Switch Module, or ORM, Optical Remote Module), that SM
can be upgraded to support ISDN.  However, economics again enters the
picture; if the SM serves 3000 lines, and the need is for two BRIs, it's
hard to cost-justify.

It's also possible to colocate an ISDN Line Unit (ISLU), "homed" to an ISDN
SM in the home CO, with the existing ORM.  Again, though, deploying a RISLU
that is capable of 640 BRIs, to serve two BRIs, is tough to cost-justify.

If the remote office is just channel banks or SLCs, the same constraints
apply.

David G Lewis                              AT&T Bell Laboratories
david.g.lewis@att.com or !att!goofy!deej     Switching & ISDN Implementation
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn
From: goldstein@carafe.enet.dec.com (Fred R. Goldstein)
Subject: Re: bri lengths
Organization: Digital Equipment Corp., Littleton MA USA
Distribution: comp
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 05:49:28 GMT


In article <1992Nov21.2070.618@channel1>, "chris strawser" <chris.strawser@channel1.com> writes...
>I understand that the maximum distance an ISDN U-interface can
>be run is 6 kilometers.  If this is so, how do you run a BRI
>over longer distances?  Just for fun, let's say my local telco
>wants to supply ISDN to all who ask for it.  If I want a BRI
>to my house, and the CO is 10 kilometers away, how does it
>happen?  Is there another interface that's good for longer
>distances, or does the telco have to plant repeaters all
>over the place?

A ha, a fellow New Englander!  We seem to be plagued by long loops.

ISDN was designed for the worldwide market, where 18 kf (about 
6 km) seemed adequate, as it picked up over 90% of loops.  But
not necessarily in New England.  In many areas, including many
parts of the USA, the telephone company normally runs T-carrier
to the neighborhood, and then ha a pedestal-mounted mux. AT&T's
SLC-96 is a common version.  These can be upgraded to ISDN.

But if you're in an area served by long loops (say, almost all
of Lincoln, MA, for instance, among other places), then you're
stuck.  Either the phone company puts in a repeater (over $1k
apiece, so don't hold your breath) or you don't get BRI. Sorry.
---
Fred R. Goldstein   goldstein@carafe.tay2.dec.com 
k1io             or goldstein@delni.enet.dec.com   voice:+1 508 952 3274
Standard Disclaimer:  Opinions are mine alone; sharing requires permission.
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.isdn