HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tbarnes@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas wrentmore barnes)
Subject: Re: Another Pennsic tip
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 15:29:50 GMT

Good Gentles All, 

Here are a few other sad but neccessary Pennsic tips. 

1. Last year my lady got her pouch ripped off when she went to the
bathroom in the shower house by the barn. She left it on the bench
outside the bathroom stalls under a cloak and when she came out it was
gone. Working at herald's point I heard of several other thefts of
unattended objects.

Moral: Don't leave your goods unattended, in public areas.
       Don't leave your campsite completely unattended. (As a herald
crying the camp, I was amazed at how few people would be in a huge
encampment in the middle of the day.)
	Don't cut through strange campsites, esp. at night.
	If you must cut through, or enter, a strange campsite, announce
your presence by calling or walking up to someone and stating your
business.

2. Even though a woman's chances of being blitz-raped by a stranger at
Pennsic are probably pretty low given the population density and the
 thiness of tent walls, women should still follow the more elementary
safety precautions especially at night or if they are in isolated areas.
Date rape is probably a more common problem at Pennsic, given the amount
of alcohol which flows and the party atmosphere of some encampments.
    At Pennsic the phrase "would you like to go back to my tent?" often
carries the wieght the phrase "Would you like to go back to my bed?"
would elsewhere. Obviously "No" means no irregardless of circumstances,
 but bad misundersandings might be prevented by this warning.  

Moral: Don't walk alone in deserted places, especially at night.
	Be aware of your surroundings.
	If you feel you are being followed, get to someplace where there
are people and/or light. (The collary for gentlemen is don't follow a
lady to closely in a deserted place at night. Don't ask to escort her
either, unless you know her. Just stay back and make your presence
known.)
	If you are attacked scream. (This isn't always a good idea, but
at Pennsic, a real, scared scream will probably draw the attention of
someone. I would like to think most men and women in the SCA have always
wanted to rescue a lady in distress. If you know of a better technique,
or if I am totally off base, please tell people. Please don't flame me,
I'm just trying to be useful).
	Stay in places where there are people and/or light.
	Alcohol impairs judgement and perception of danger, be careful
using it.
	No means no.
	Don't go back to someone's tent after you've been necking with
them around a campfire all evening, if you wouldn't go back to their bed
at home.

        I dearly home that my advice is unneccessary, but my experience
with human nature, makes me believe otherwise.

	Reluctantly,
	
	Lothar von Katzenellenbogen \|/
                                     0

 
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr)
Subject: Rattan
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 19:50:58 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

Someone recently posted an article containing the address
of "illusions Armouries" or something similar, which sells
rattan...

I have lost the file containing that address, and need it
desparately.  Could someone repost and/or email it to me?

Carolus Mediocris Malvoix
-- 
Within the span of the last few weeks I have heard elements of
separate threads which, in that they have been conjoined in time,
struck together to form a new chord within my hollow and echoing
gourd. --Unknown net.person
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: graydon@micor.ocunix.on.ca (Graydon)
Subject: Re: Violence, and the use thereof in self defense.
Organization: M.B. Cormier INC.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 13:32:00 EDT

archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:

> In article <XR1DoB2w162w@micor.ocunix.on.ca> graydon@micor.ocunix.on.ca (Gray
> 
> >archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:
> 
> [my own post about the statistical effectiveness of self-defense deleted]
> 
> >Vidarr help me, I'm about to make a post about the chiefest of my
> >pet peeves - the general resemblence of the majority of the population
> >to someone having the tactical sense of a newborn dik-dik.
> 
> Gentle Lord,
> I thank thee for thy kind response and remonstrance regarding my words, as 
> by your missive it is clear that my humble ability to carry out meaningful 
> discourse has failed me.
> 

Probably not; you just hit a button about discussing these things
in the abstract.  Like sex, violence is not a subject about which
the abstract has a lot of personal relevance.

You're being a model of courtesy and tact, which can't hurt you
when it comes to communicating.

> 
> >The short form is it only works if you will do you damndest to kill
>                                                                 ^^^^
> I only take issue with thine words here.  While intent should not change 
> your action, the spiritual cost of "attempting to kill" is too much for 
> many peole to bear.  Far better to "do one's damndest to STOP and 
> assaultor."  It that results in the villian's demise, so be it.

Hmmm... maybe a better way to put this is that a small person with
limited training is going to have to do things, if they are going
to stop a real assault, that are going to run a large chance of 
killing the assaultor.  I'd much rather people thought about this
ahead of time; it makes them more careful, if I may be permitted
the generalization.

Under the circumstances, 'stop' strikes me as euphemistic.

> 
> Post Scriptum:
> 
> My friends call me Archer, and we are all friends here.  If you choose, omit 
> the honorific.
> -=-=-
> T. Archer  PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu
> University of Tennessee
> "Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking." -- Unknown
> -=-=-


        Graydon the Curious         /graydon@micor.ocunix.on.ca
  Skraeling Althing, EAldormere, MK / "Nihil est quin obsisti possit"
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Subject: Re: Moderation (was pentagrams)
Organization: University of Tennessee Division of Continuing Education
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 17:29:59 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.151311.25198@pbhya.PacBell.COM> whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt) writes:

>Please permit me a gentle correction, m'lord . . .

>Don't worry about such lotus-eaters as there are in Caid.  While great
>epics (and many not-so-great epics) come from there, the ones not far
>from the Great Western Ocean to be concerned about are those located
>in the Shire of Cloondara and their influence upon certain bodies of
>lawgivers in the Province of Golden Rivers.  Both of these locals are
>within the West. . .

I cry 'pardon,' milord.  I indulged myself in a little hyperbole and wound 
up over-generalizing again.
-=-=-
T. Archer  PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu
University of Tennessee
"Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking." -- Unknown
-=-=-
From: archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Royals and Weather
Date: 31 Jul 92 12:38:00 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee Division of Continuing Education

In article <159dl5INN9jm@agate.berkeley.edu> cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu () writes:

>Reminds me of the story of the time they had a heat wave in London and
>the paper said, "75 DEGREES AGAIN TODAY--NO RELIEF IN SIGHT!" --which
>is probably funnier in most other kingdoms than in the West or An Tir.

Reminds me of a tale I heard when Charles and Diana came to Charleston, SC.  
They got of the plane and were almost flattened by the 101+ temprature and 
98% humidity.  According to all reports, the expressions on their faces when 
they were told, "Don't worry, it goes down to 80 at night,"  were priceless.
-=-=-
T. Archer  PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu
University of Tennessee
"Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking." -- Unknown
-=-=-
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: Suze.Hammond@f56.n105.z1.therose.pdx.com (Suze Hammond)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Why not pentacles:
Date: 24 Jul 92 06:26:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: therose.712043902.F00010

AN>  From: aryk@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca (A.J.S. Nusbacher)
AN>  Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
AN>
AN>  On the subject of weird religious associations in heraldry:
AN>
AN>  Ever see the arms of Tomas de Torquemada, Grand Inquisitor of Spain?
AN>
AN>  A mullet of six points looks a lot like a filled-in Star of David.

Was he the one who was a converted Jew?

Moreach NicMaolain
trifid@agora.rain.com
From: Suze.Hammond@f56.n105.z1.therose.pdx.com (Suze Hammond)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Gundesrup Cauldron
Date: 27 Jul 92 22:08:00 GMT

-U>  From: cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
-U>  Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
-U>
-U>  >Now I don't know for sure, but would the Gundesrup Cauldron fit both
-U>  >cultures? It is sort of Celtic, but was found in Demark.
-U>
-U>  But it was made in India--there was an article on it in the
-U>  Scientific
-U>  American a year or so ago.
-U>

Ok...since India was also in the same cultural group at that (prehistoric) 
time, can't we assume it will do for either culture? Evidently there was 
trade of some sort that far away for both groups. (And silk brocade was 
found under undisturbed Pictish ruins...seemingly from China!) We tend to 
refuse to believe that commerce was so broad in neolithic times, despite the 
evidence.

Having seen many pictures of the cauldron, the symbols seem pretty universal 
and certainly nothing like modern India!  :-)

Moreach NicMaolain
trifid@agora.rain.com 
 
From: Stephen.Whitis@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Stephen Whitis)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Regarding cameras at SCA
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 01:43:20

I (Stephen) wrote...

>Video cameras are often used to film fighters at major tournaments.
>Some of these tapes are then used to train other fighters.

Storytime:

Some time back, Sir Gunther entered crown tourney. After the
pairings for one of the earlier rounds, he happened to be passing a
pavilion and overheard a part of a conversation. "Remember, Gunther
is the one with that quick spin shot.  Watch out for it!"  (This
advice being given to his opponent, who lived in a barony wherein
fighters often use the video-tapes as training tools.)

When the fight started, Gunther stepped into range and threw a few
blows, none of which were intended to win the fight.  (Feeling out
the opponent.)  Then he threw a slow, sloppy spin shot, which was
expected and easily blocked.  When he came out of it, he saw the
other fighters eyes as the guy thought "That's not so bad.  I can
block that!"

Soon after, Gunther threw two quick blows, and then a *quick* spin
shot.  BAMM!  Right over the kidney-belt on the sword side!   :^)

Stephen of the Grove
Steppes/Ansteorra        FIDO 1:124/4229
___
 X MegaMail 2.10 #0:CRUSADE CRUSADE CRUSADE!!!!

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Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mjc+@cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio)
Subject: Re: Advice for Pennsic
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 05:51:59 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Keywords: Pennsic, Camping, linen

>When I went camping recently I noticed the fact that the sleeping bags and
>the pillows we used quickly became damp - by the second day we were resigned
>to it.  

I've slept in nylon tents that have acquired interior condensation overnight.
Mostly it's on interior walls, but sometimes the outside of the sleeping 
bag has been damp, too.  (It's never soaked through in my experience.)
Leaving the tent open for part of the day has never failed to fix this
for me.

Ellisif
From: Stephen.Whitis@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Stephen Whitis)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Basic Courtesy
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 23:09:06

>Given the amount of blunt speech on the Rialto, I hope that people
>can see why only this _particular_ post garnered my criticism.
>It crossed a line.  Perhaps that line is difficult to fully
>articulate.  Certainly, a "cheap shot" is not "just" one that
>is flip and lacks specificity.  Does anyone else care to offer
>_their_ definition of "cheap shot," to add to the debate?

I think putting words into anothers mouth, and then flaming them
for those words, as you have done, qualifies as a cheap shot.

I think putting words in anothers mouth, and then saying "Shove it
up your Mule" qualifies as a cheap shot.

I think instigating a flame war qualifies as a cheap shot.

Stephen of the Grove
Steppes/Ansteorra        FIDO 1:124/4229
Stephen.Whitis@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org
___
 X MegaMail 2.10 #0:CRUSADE CRUSADE CRUSADE!!!!

 * Origin: Herald's Point * Steppes/Ansteorra * 214-699-0057 (1:124/4229)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: graydon@micor.ocunix.on.ca (Graydon)
Subject: Re: Why not pentacles:
Organization: M.B. Cormier INC.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 13:24:52 EDT

trifid@agora.uucp (Roadster Racewerks) writes:

> 
> 
> Since we can *prove* that the pentacle is really a *Christian* symbol in peri
> wouldn't it be more useful to explain to pagan submitters that it doesn't
> represent what they want anyway? It seems to me that a pagan using a pentacle
> is in violation of the Rules of Submission in regards to use of *modern*
> symbolism if it isn't  pagan within period. 
> 
> If I were pagan, I would be quite distressed to find out I was carrying a 
> Judeo-Christian mystic symbol around... And surely there are other symbols th
> pagans can use beside Thor's hammer. There are any number of pagan legends th
> the early Christians "hijacked" that convey important religious ideas that
> were bowdlerized for Christian ends. I would think they could be "rehabilitat
> for use by non-Christians. 
> 
> Maybe we just need to be more creative?
> 
> Moreach NicMaolain
> trifid@agora.rain.com
> 

Oh, Freya's _Cats_, Moreach - people who want to be loud about their
religious beliefs aren't going to believe the Gawain poet - there are
scholarly arguments that most of the Gawain ledgend is pre-Christian
in substance, after all.

Symbolism is a lot more complicated than that - crosses are perfectly
good pagan symbols, too...

People are going to want the symbols they already identify with;
the heralds have *enough* trouble getting people to look at some
secondary sources *before* picking a design or a name without 
trying to alter their perception of a central symbol of their religion.

Graydon

        Graydon the Curious         /graydon@micor.ocunix.on.ca
  Skraeling Althing, EAldormere, MK / "Nihil est quin obsisti possit"
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: WHITE@duvm.ocs.drexel.EDU (Avid Reader - Fledgling Writer)
Subject: Re: Basic Courtesy
Organization: The Internet
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 14:53:09 GMT

>From: Tim <Tim@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org>
>    Leonard wrote:
>
>    LE> Even if the filk is "offensive" to many here, that does *not*
>    LE> justify a response belittles the poster. A polite comment letting
>    LE> him know that it is not considered appropriate is one thing,
>    LE> "Thanks, this will make a great example of why filks don't belong
>    LE> here" is not.
>
> I find this confusing. How could the above-referenced comment possibly
> have been phrased that was more "polite"? In what respect does it
> "belittle the poster", since it doesn't reference the "quality" of the
> referent at all? If anything, it holds the cited filk up as a pure type --
> hardly a "belitting" for someone who writes (or performs) filk. Pray bear
> in mind that this was pursuant to an ongoing discussion, in which regard
> "here's an example" ought to have been sufficient reference for anyone
> following it.
>
>    Tadhg
>

     It seems to me that the phrase quoted (which was, as I recall,
Stephen's only comment to the posted filk) would seem to say that "This
filk is *so* bad that everyone, even those who like filk, will be able to
see my point about not liking filk."  That's certainly what I got from
it.  It really doesn't reply to the subject of whether or not filk is
a bad thing (I don't believe it is) - it replies directly to the poem
posted, relating its merits to the merits of filk in general.  Had I been
the one to post something that was commented on in such a rude and
authoritative manner, I would be at least very hurt, and at worst
thoroughly insulted.  I feel very sorry for Christian.

          Dafydd

PS  It also seems to me that those who are trying to defend Stephen's
'bluntness' (which is this case is a synonym for rudeness) are going out
of their way to ignore both context, and referents.  How many times have
you heard something like, "That's a perfect example of why <x> shouldn't
be allowed?"  It doesn't relate to the good attributes of the thing
being used as an example - it relates to everything *bad* about it, and
applies those bad things directly to the category being abused.  Stop
fooling yourselves, folks.

PPS  The existence of a thing on the Rialto doesn't imply its existence
at an SCA event.  If it is Stephen's (or *ANYONE'S*) allegation that
someone creating filk (for the entertainment of people, for their own
personal gratification, for completely non-SCA purposes) is wrong, then
I think that they should go shove it up their mule.  What a person does
with their creative energy is none of your business.  If that person
displays the results in an inappropriate place, then you have a valid
argument with that person.  The Rialto is *NOT!* an innapropriate place
for filk - its not an event, nor is it even slightly an official function
of the SCa.  Get off your high horses, please.  Thank you.
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: donna@envy.kwantlen.bc.ca (Donna Hrynkiw)
Subject: Tablet/Card Weaving Question
Organization: The Internet
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1992 19:22:00 GMT

Greetings to the Rialto. (This message was originally sent last week but
hasn't shown up in the digests yet. This is a re-send; my apologies if it
passes before your eyes more than once.)

I'm looking for people who would like to talk about tablet-/card-weaving.
Seems to me that is is one of the few crafts whose patterns are not hindered
by ASCII terminals.

Thora Sharptooth and Stephen of the Grove - you've both mentioned card-weaving
in your postings, would you like to talk?

On my last vacation I spent an enjoyable afternoon figuring out how to
do double-face card weaving (ie. producing letters and patterns from graphed
designs). While I was mostly satisfied by the results, it seemed to me
that my designs were significantly more elongated than the examples I
was trying to reproduce.  I tried using a finer weft and while that helped,
it didn't help enough.

Any suggestions? I've been using fairly heavy crochet cotton for
experimentation and I'm beginning to think a finer *warp* as well as a
weft might be called for. I've seen lovely projects (not double-faced)
done in perl cotton, but my soul is crying out for (oh so expensive) linen.

Has anybody seen Egon Hansen's _Tablet_Weaving:_History,_Techniques,_
_Colours,_Patterns_? Is it worth the $55 as listed in Unicorn Books'
catalogue? I'm also desperately looking for my own copy of Collingwood's
_Techniques_of_Tablet_Weaving_. If you find one available, *please* let me
know. (I don't think anyone takes it out of the local library but me.)

Yours (two forward, one back) truly (one forward, two back)

Elizabeth (two forward, two back) Braidwood (two forward, one back)

==================

Elizabeth "E.B." Braidwood                Donna Hrynkiw
Lions Gate, An Tir                        Kwantlen College
donna@envy.kwantlen.bc.ca                 Surrey, B.C.

Per bend sinister Or and vert, two bendlets enhanced above two holly leaves
all counterchanged.
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: Leonard.Erickson@f56.n105.z1.therose.pdx.com (Leonard Erickson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Period vs. Filk (was Basic Courtesy)
Date: 29 Jul 92 09:23:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: therose.712477960.F00001

> Esmeralda asks about definitions of filk.
>
> The definition I work from is very broad:
> any words put to a non-original tune.
>
> This includes everything from the Calontir Hampster
> Song to many, many hymns. (Lutherns and Baptists don't
> sing the same tunes)

Alas, in fandom (where the term "filk" originated), it *also* applies 
oringal words and tunes *about* Fandom.

So I have to say that original songs *about* the SCA are filk. This ranges 
from "Burden of the Crown", to some pretty silly stuff. 
 
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mfactor@taronga.com (Marco Landin)
Subject: Re: Moderation (was pentagrams)
Summary: Camouflaged heirophants and the people who love them...
	 vs. the vociferous ninnies who claim the unclaimable.
	 Join us today, on JJJJJJJHeraldo...
Organization: Taronga Park BBS
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 18:39:03 GMT

> 
> You have to realize that not only are there pagans and witches like yourself 
> out there, but there are also some *seriously* disturbed people who *claim* 
> to be witches.
	
	Y'know, as a person who's also studied much about the philosophy AND the
art of the Craft, I find it quite impressive that so many people "play at"
being witches.  Now, I've been called a witch before, but I quickly
dismiss that misnomer by explaining that I'm more of an historian and
chronicler of Craft knowledge, not a practicioner thereof.
	
	A sizeable posrtion of my friends are Neo-Pagan (there's very few Pagans
still around) and that's a big pet peeve, is how much negative exposure
thay get because some bowheaded teenage pod people got a hold of an old
Buckland book or maybe just played too much D&D for their own good (I was
at a place in Houston called the Magic Cauldron when this kid ACTUALLY
walks in the door, with his eyes shifting viciously around, and eventually
claims -to the OWNER mind you- that he's a 7th level black witch! 
Boasting left and right of these amazing powers, finally the owner
interrupts him and says "SO, do you play much D&D?"  The other 3 or 4 of
us in the store could not stop laughing!)
	
	It goes deeper than that, of course.  It gets downright dangerous to
claim you're a witch if you're not.  And conversely, it's dangerous to
admit being of the Arts when you are.  
	Me, I'm just a Taoist Spaniard :)
	
	A sus ordenes,
	Marcos Maria Montenegro Del Diablo
-- 
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