From: bertsche@llnl.gov (Kirk Bertsche)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian
Subject: Re: dealin w/atheist
Date: 13 Apr 92 05:28:23 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory

In article <Apr.8.04.31.48.1992.27847@dumas.rutgers.edu> 
superc@sam.ksu.ksu.edu (Shawn E Chase) writes:
> hi, i'm new to this newsgroup. i have been a christian since mid 1989, 
and
> lately, i have comeupopn a person who has presented me with some rather
> subversive questions dealing with god. and i dont have the answers for 
some of
> them, those of which i'm listing here:

Two of the things you were asked were questions about 1) pain and 
suffering in the world, and 2) the fate of those who haven't heard the 
gospel.  If I remember correctly, these are the two most commonly asked 
question by non-Christians.

I thought your answers to the first question were pretty good.  Pain and 
suffering are a result of sin, hence due to Satan and/or to sinful man.

For the second question, I would not necessarily tell an atheist my own 
convictions about this.  [While I suppose God MAY save some who have not 
heard of Jesus, I see no biblical assurance that He WILL do so.  The New 
Testament gives no hope of salvation apart from faith in Jesus.  My own 
view is that God will see to it that anyone who is interested in 
spiritual truth will be given further revelation of Jesus.]  I like the 
approach of Cliffe Knechtle, who says something like, "I don't know what 
will happen to those who haven't heard the gospel.  I know that God is 
just and that He will do what is right.  But I also know that whatever the 
answer to this question is, it does not apply to you.  You HAVE heard the 
gospel, and now you must either accept it or reject it."

I would recommend some very good books which specifically address these 
and other common questions:
Cliffe Knechtle, _Give Me an Answer_, IVP
Paul Little, _Know Why you Believe_, IVP
Paul Little, _Know What you Believe_ IVP

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kirk Bertsche    (bertsche@llnl.gov)    (510) 422-8139
Center for Accelerator Mass Spectrometry
Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
P.O. Box 808, L-397, Livermore, CA 94551

[While I'm not objecting to your general approach -- with which I
think I agree -- the specific advice you quote from Cliffe Knechtle
still has at least 2 possible objections.  (1) that the person
speaking has made a competent presentation of the Gospel -- I've seen
some presentations that are probably worse than nothing at all, and
(2) it takes a pretty objective view of what it means to have heard
of Jesus.  Do we make allowances for a person's experiences and
religious background?

To give an extreme example, consider a Jew in a community that is
being persecuted by Christians.  In a certain external sense, he has
heard the Gospel.  But is this enough to hold him responsible?  I've
always felt that in such a situation, God might well expect faithful
people to remain with their community.  Indeed I've speculated that
this might be a situation in which one could actually be damned by
becoming a Christian.  Now hopefully Christians will see to it that
such situations don't happen again.  But there may be less extreme
situations in which Christ as presented by Christians doesn't very
accurately represent God.

--clh]