From: matt@cray.com (Matthew Marchese)
Subject: Re: Gays in the Military..what nobody is talking about:
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: 18 Dec 92 02:05:33 CST

In article <1992Dec17.214825.6543@m5.harvard.edu> borden@m5.harvard.edu writes:
>In article <1992Dec17.132151.28379@news.DKRZ-Hamburg.DE> k206027@smog.DKRZ-Hamburg.DE (Bakayaroo Banzai) writes:
>>In article <1992Dec16.173213.5672@m5.harvard.edu> borden@m5.harvard.edu writes:
>>>
>>>Those who don't bathe have the ability to begin bathing; it's their choice.
>>>Homosexuals don't have the ability to become heterosexuals.  Your analogy is
>>>not valid for that reason.  Your previous analogy between homosexuals and
>>>
>>This is a very shaky argument IMO and in the opinion of many others. There
>>is simply not a great body of non-controversial scientific evidence to back
>>up this claim. It's not likely to be proven one way or another in the 
>>near future. Your fundamental assertion that gays should not be excluded
>>from the military on the basis of their sexual practices is, I think, valid
>>but not for the reason you state above. I'm amazed that people continue to
>>make this statement as if it were an absolute, fundamental law of the 
>>universe. And for the benefit of the Usenet-impaired here i'm NOT talking
>>about bathing...:) Your argument stands without having to resort to 
>>what is essentially an unprovable assertion.
>
>I regret using the assertion because it could be taken to imply that
>homosexuals should become heterosexuals if they can.  A statement with which
>I would not agree.  I think that people should choose whatever lifestyle is
>most satisfying to them.
>
I think we're finally hitting the nail square on the head here. As long
as the relationship is formed upon the basis of informed, non-coerced,
adult consent then it really doesn't matter if these people aquired
their sexual tendencies through nature or nurture.

>The impression I've gotten through conversations (not scientific proof, just
>my impression) is that most gays are as firmly gay as most straights are
>firmly straight, though perhaps not all.  You're right that it's not central
>to the issue, however.  As I've said in a previous post, I don't care if they
>choose to be gay or not.  It's not my business.
>
I've had very similar conversations (with some notable exceptions).
You may never be able to convince someone of the morality of your
behavior (morality is seldom an objective experience) but people
will eventually come to accept the fundamental rights of all 
Americans to participate fully in their society.


Exclusion will only hurt us in the long run.
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*  "Supernatural perhaps...Baloney, perhaps not!" - Bela Lugosi               *
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Matt Marchese	    The opinions expressed here are not those of my employer, *
Cray Research  	    my wife, my church, or myself...But they are the opinions *
DKRZ                of Elvis as revealed to me through the medium of my pet   *
Hamburg, Germany    hamster, Lee Harvey Oswald...                             *
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