HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mcochran@nyx.cs.du.edu (Mark A. Cochran)
Subject: Re: A few facts about circumcision
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: None worth mentioning.
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 93 20:12:42 GMT

In article <markg.78.725733783@county.lmt.mn.org> markg@county.lmt.mn.org (Mark Gilbert) writes:
>In article <1992Dec27.173429.5492@newstand.syr.edu> kgatling@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Keith E Gatling) writes:
>
>stuff deleted
>
>>Someone mentioned that there is some very small, but non-zero, number of
>>circs that end up in mutilation or death, and that's their reason for not
>>doing it.  Fine.
>
Actually, I think they were claiming that some % will end up as
emasculations. Personally, I wouldn't give any real credance to this
claim until I see a citation to back it up. There's plenty of circs
done in the NICU I work in, and I've never seen or heard of anything
of the sort. The techniques used in the procedure make it physically
imposible to emasculate the infant. There is a metal or hard plastic
bell clamped between the foreskin and the penis, and all cutting is
done against this.
I suppose it is theoretically possible for an infant with hemophelia
to bleed to death from the circ, but highly unlikely. Infants in risk
groups for inheriting it are tested. And in the extremely unlikly case
of an infant not being detected, it's still not a major problem. The
administration of clotting factors or cautery solves it pretty
handily.
Note that I'm not taking a stance either way wrt circs, I'm just not a
fan of misinformation being spread. :)

>.. stuff deleted
>
>All circumcision is mutiliation.  When some African culture that we don't 
>understand takes a ceremonial knife to the human body, we appropriately call 
>it "ritual mutilation."  Why not use the same words for our own rituals?
>
Tell me Mark, have you ever had an SO with pierced ears? And if so,
did you refer to them as "mutilated"? 
By the logic you post above, I'm certain you should have....

--
                  Mark Cochran          merlin@eddie.ee.vt.edu
These are the views of my employer. They also represent the views of
your employer, your government, the Church of your choice, and the
Ghost of Elvis. So there.
Date: Friday, 8 January 1993 09:22:36 MST
X-Mailer: TMail version 1.16R
From: "D. C. Sessions" <dcs@witsend.tnet.com>
Organization: Nobody but me -- really
Subject: Re: circ on older baby
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Distribution: world

In <1993Jan7.191629.8139@ttinews.tti.com>, reid@metis.tti.com (Reid Kneeland)  wrote:
# Some babies do scream at being circumcized, others barely blink.  No
# one knows exactly why, but the blanket statement that they don't feel
# it is absurd (I've never heard a mohel claim this - has anyone else?).
# I would also vote for a mohel over a pediatrician.  They do more of
# them, and the techniques they use are less prone to accident (they do
# not cauterize, for example).  I don't know if most mohels will do a
# non-jewish circumcision, though.  Does anyone know if there's a
# Halachic (Jewish Law) issue which would prevent it?

  A lot of mohelim are also MDs.  Our pediatrician a few years back
  was an Orthodox mohel, and told us that when he trained for brit
  milah they cut him no slack for his medical background.
  (I gathered that it was, if anything, a liability.)

  SO -- non-Jews can certainly find out if the MD they've chosen
  is also a certified mohel; being one doesn't preclude doing
  circs on goyim.  OTOH, I doubt that a mohel who wasn't a
  State-certified MD would dare to circ anyone but a Jew.

--- D. C. Sessions                            Speaking for myself ---
--- Note new network address:                dcs@witsend.tnet.com ---
--- Author (and everything else!) of TMail  (DOS mail/news shell) ---
From: lindsay@sesame.lbl.gov (Lindsay Schachinger)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Preventive Antibiotics (Long)
Date: 4 Jan 1993 22:15:43 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, Berkeley CA
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.254.22

In article <5034@crl.LABS.TEK.COM> sjk@strl.labs.tek.com (Steven King) writes:

>He still suffers from some environmental allergies.  They are controlled
>with an in-room air filter (Amway brand) and a hudifier heat register.  If
>we discontinue either of these Patrick with cough all night and have bags
>under his eyes in the morning.  Thank God we can control them!

First, Steve, thanks for the information. I'm just starting with
this business. My son David is 11 months and has had one ear
infection after the other for the past two months. I'm starting
to wonder if our pediatrician (who just keeps prescribing
Augmentin) is paying attention. 

I was wondering about what you said above about Patrick having
bags under his eyes in the morning. We find that sometimes when
David has a cold, he wakes up in the morning with his eyes all
swollen and puffy. Sometimes one is almost closed. It takes till
the afternoon for the swelling to go down. His pediatrician just
seems puzzled by this. Is this what you meant by "bags under his
eyes?" Has anyone else out there experienced this, or know what
it means?	

Lindsay
-- 

   Lindsay Schachinger			lindsay@sesame.lbl.gov
   Exploratory Studies Group		ucbvax!sesame.lbl.gov!lindsay
   Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory		(510) 486-5009
From: ellenb@diva.Berkeley.EDU (Ellen Boyle)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: That high-pitched killer shrill
Date: 12 Jan 1993 18:42:33 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: diva.berkeley.edu

I have found that some kids are screamers, some aren't.
I never had alot of patience with ear-splitting screams,
it just bugs me.  So this is what I would do -- 

If I was holding the child at the time, I would 
immediately put her down.  Then say, "I don't like
it when you scream, it hurts my/our ears, Please
stop."  Of course, this won't do it but it helps
clear the air and gets out some of the anger you feel.
Then firmly take the child and place her in the next room
(if its safe) or out of ear-splitting distance.  When she 
stops screaming, go and repeat a version of the above
statement - no lectures.  Then maybe an understanding
statement such as, "I know it is upsetting when someone
takes a toy you are playing with."  Then, maybe a 
diversion - "Hey, look at this fun thing."

Treat it as you would treat a punch or hit.  Even if her
anger or frustration is justified, her method for expressing
it is not.  You can reinforce a new behavior by giving
her an alternative such as, "Tell your brother: NO - don't
take my toy."  Negotiate the ownership of the toy after
tempers are dispersed.

-Ellen
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: brett@sr.hp.com ()
Subject: Re: Chicken Pox
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 19:40:19 GMT
Organization: HP Sonoma County (SRSD/MWTD/MID)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8.1]

Laura Floom (lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov) wrote:
> Regarding purposely exposing children to something as prevalent as chicken
> pox, it just doesnt seem worth it. Kids are going to be exposed numerous
> times as they are growing up.

True, but it would be easier if all your kids got it at once (all exposed at
the same time) than one kid getting it, then ~10 days later the other(s)
getting it from the first.  This doubles the length of time you spend dealing
with it, and also doubles the length of your quarantine (if don't wish to
keep spreading it around).

I just wish our third (due in March) was already here so we wouldn't get to
do it all again sometime in the future.		:-)

--

							Brett Carver
							(707) 577-4344
							brett@sr.hp.com
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: AMY.UHRBACH@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("Amy Uhrbach")
Subject: re: I love you forever
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 21:59:30 GMT

Well, that book did make me cry at first.  But a year later, my HUSBAND still
can't read it without completely breaking down!  As Christine Lavin sang
"Sensitive new age guys..." :-).

We also love another of Munsch's books, about Brigid coloring things with
markers.  The title is something like "Purple, green, yellow, blue.."  For
older kids (3+).  I must admit, my MIL hates this book.  She read it to Alex
the first time (I was trying to get her to interact with him, which she really
doesn't do).  She kept telling him what an awful book it was.  So it took me 4
months to get him to read it again with me!  Now he loves it!  Boy, was I
pissed at my MIL.  For someone who's a mother, she has no sense of what to say
or not to say with kids!  Can you tell, this still steams me...:-(
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: suresh@nls2.nlm.nih.gov (Suresh Srinivasan)
Subject: Request for Toilet training FAQ
Organization: Management Systems Designers Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 93 12:59:56 GMT


Could someone please mail me a copy of the
toilet training FAQ.  The keeper of this FAQ
(joanne@hpcc01.corp.hp.com) does not respond.
Perhaps she's on vacation.  Thanks in advance.

--Suresh (suresh@nlm.nih.gov)

-- 
National Library of Medicine		Bldg 38A, 9N-915
Management Systems Designers, Inc.	8600 Rockville Pike
(301) 496-9300				Bethesda, MD 20894
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: M18611@MBVM.Mitre.Org (Kathy Wilk)
Subject: Re: New Sleep Question: Please Help
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford MA 01730
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 16:27:16 GMT

In article <3496@ncr-mpd.FtCollinsCO.NCR.COM>
chrisw@chopin.FtCollins.NCR.com (Chris Whitley) writes:
>My 25 month old has acquired a new habit in the last couple of
>months.  She wakes up somewhere between 0 and 4 times per night
>and cries for her Mommy.  If I get up immediately, go into her
>room, rearrange her pillows and animals back to "tuck in" position
>and recover her with her blankies, she instantly returns to sleep...
>whole process taking about 2 minutes in entirety.  I have never
>picked her up, nor does she ask me to.  I do not talk with her,
>except to say that "Mommy was sleeping, and does not want to wake
>up.  Please do not wake her up again!  You are okay."  I do say
>"Night Night" upon my exit, and blow her a kiss.
>     ...
  I had a similar problem but my child didn't want to sleep in his bed.
  I have a 25-month-old son who has never liked sleeping in his bed, and
I never minded it that he wanted to sleep with my husband and me.  However,
my husband minded!
  My son could crawl out of his crib - so we took the side off the crib and
gave him a railing and a little stool (One Step Ahead catalog, or Right
Start, I can't remember which sells this set-up); then he really could get
in and out of the crib easily so I just moved over to let him get in bed
with us.  I don't have any problems with the family bed but we don't even
have a king-size bed.
  The good news:  he slept the past week in his bed, through the night.  He
still falls asleep next to Dad or Mom but we put him in his bed and he sleeps
soundly there.  I gave him a pillow and blankets under and over him so that
it feels as soft and cozy as our bed.
  Eventually, I think he will like his bed.  And then, when he is a little
older, he can pick out a new bed (and we can get rid of the crib).
  His problem is a bit different from your daughter's - at least she stays
in her bed.  But, without Ferber, my son has passed through this phase and
that is what I hoped would happen.  He shares a room with his sister who is
3.5 yrs old.
  I agree that parents need their sleep - that's why I let him sleep with
us when he came in our room in his pajamas and wanted to sleep with us ( one
of his earliest sentences was 'Move Over!').  When he has been sick, he
threw up on OUR bed and yet, I was kind of worried about him so I was glad
that he was sleeping next to me.
 
 
                        K. Wilk
                        M18611@MBVM.MITRE.ORG
 
            <--********************************-->
 'Thrusting my nose firmly between his teeth, I threw him to the ground
  on top of me.' - Mark Twain
            <--********************************-->
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: M18611@MBVM.Mitre.Org (Kathy Wilk)
Subject: Re: The Mouse and the Motorcycle
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford MA 01730
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:08:22 GMT

In article <1993Jan4.203012.12089@samba.oit.unc.edu>
cew@med.unc.edu (Cathryn W. Chiesa) writes:
>About a month ago the Disney channel ran a movie entitled
>The Mouse and the Motorcycle.  We had to eat dinner before
>it was over so se taped the last ten minutes.  My soon to
>be three year old son wathces those last ten minutes
>repeatedly.  I wish I had taped the whole thing.  It
>really is a cute movie.  Has anyone ever seen it for
>sale???  I would love to buy a copy.  I keep scanning
>the Disney Channel Magazine for future showings, but
>so far there have not been any.
>
>Cathryn W. Chiesa
>cew@med.unc.edu
>
  I bought the 'Mouse and the Motorcycle' from Time Warner's Video
catalog.  I will post the address/phone number of the company if
there is interest (I will send the address/phone number to C. Chiesa).
My daughter was watching it with her Dad and (I missed this because I
was in another room) got very frightened when the mouse was sucked up
by a vacuum cleaner.  So I guess we'll have to wait to watch it again.
My daughter is 3.5 years old and recently was frightened by the giant
of the story 'Abba Yoyo' by Pete Seeger (we don't have cable but I tape
the stories of 'Reading Rainbow').
 
                        K. Wilk
                        M18611@MBVM.MITRE.ORG
 
            <--********************************-->
 'Thrusting my nose firmly between his teeth, I threw him to the ground
  on top of me.' - Mark Twain
            <--********************************-->
From: bweiss@cs.arizona.edu (Beth Weiss)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: The Schoo Didn't Fit
Date: 8 Jan 93 18:28:45 GMT
Organization: U of Arizona, CS Dept, Tucson

nance@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (nancy.l.colucci) writes:
|> 
|> Since this story got nationwide (and probably worldwide) coverage,
|> does anyone have any thoughts about what defense a couple could
|> come up with for leaving their 9 and 4 year-old at home without
|> supervision while they vacationed out of the country?
|> 
|> It is getting so much coverage from the media (especially right here
|> in the area) that every stone they upturn makes the front page.

I was in the Chicago area when the case was first discovered, and
there certainly was a lot of media coverage, perhaps even too much.
Parading the Schoos through O'Hare in handcuffs certainly wasn't
called for.

However, I can't think of any defense for leaving a 9 year old and
a 4 year old alone for more than an hour (and that would be pushing
it), let alone for over a week while they vacationed out of the
country.

We (my brothers and I) were latchkey kids, and I suspect my mother
left us alone too much and too long, but never overnight.  

One thing I did want to mention is that there are alternatives
other than relatives for staying with children when the parents
need to be gone.  It is possible to hire a teacher, grad student,
or other person to _stay_ with the child.  My mother hired a
theology graduate student to stay with us when she was in the
hospital for surgery.  Lots of people seem to think that if the
grandparents can't do it, then noone can, but there really are
other possibilities.

--Beth Weiss
bweiss@cs.arizona.edu
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: elise@ticipa.pac.sc.ti.com (Elise Wade)
Subject: Re: Disposables question
Organization: Texas Instruments
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:02:45 GMT

In article <CINDY.93Jan10201034@solan10.solan.unit.no> cindy@solan10.solan.unit.no (Cynthia Kandolf) writes:
>Beth Weiss writes:
>>There are four ways I use:
>>   --slip hand on top of diaper.  If it's warm, it's newly wet.
>>   --slip finger in diaper.  Feel diaper
>>   --feel diaper--if it feels bulky and full, it's wet
>>   --for pooper diapers, I can often smell them, or can see the
>>     poopers at the edge of the leg, just waiting to ooze out and get
>>     everything dirty.    (don't ask why we have 'pooper' diapers and
>>     not 'poopy' diapers at our house :-)--
>
>Well, when Sunniva started fussing shortly after she finished her
>bottle, i tried sticking my finger in to check the diaper.  It felt
>dry.  But rocking wasn't soothing her, and her toys weren't soothing
>her, so i checked to see if maybe the diaper was too tight or
>something.  When i opened it up the inside was bright yellow.  Don't
>remember if it felt warm or not, but it weighed a ton.  Next time i'm
>watching Sunny i guess i'll try the other two 8-).  (The diaper was
>just wet so smell wouldn't have helped much...)
>
>Thanks for the help!
>-Cindy Kandolf
> cindy@solan.unit.no
> Trondheim, Norway
>

Of course, Melinda is too easy -- I can tell if her diaper needs
changing because she fusses.  However, I can tell (if I'm not certain
what she's fussing about) by smell.  I can detect urine smell just
fine.  Otherwise, if you're using the ultra trims, you could tell 
anyway because the diaper changes size/shape when it gets wet.

Elise.
From: adculha@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Andrew Culhane)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Circum.: When Parents Disagree :-(
Date: 4 Jan 93 17:33:57 GMT
Organization: The Great Beyond

In article <1992Dec23.212132.22722@ntmtv> missy@ntmtv.UUCP (Missy Iaquinto) writes:
>
>I know alot of folks are getting tired of all the circumcision
>discussions, and hope they excercise their right to skip this
>article ;-).

 ... lots of stuff deleted about how he wants their son circum-
     cised and she doesn't, and how are they going to compromise?

>I'm counting on you, misc.kidder's .... not to make the decision, but
>to give some helpful advice ... NOT to debate circumcision, but to
>relate experiences when the parents disagree strongly about it ...

My generic advice is that you are getting yet another lesson in just
how much compromise there is in a marriage.  One of you is going to
give in on something he/she feels strongly about.  This is like
discussions we had about religion (we have significantly different
beliefs about what our children should be taught).  I ultimately
gave in on that one, reasoning that her upbringing couldn't have
been too terrible, if it produced a woman whom I wanted to spend my
life with.

We also differed strongly on circumcision, but in our case, we were
the reverse of you and your husband.  I was against (although I am
circumcised), and she was for.  In the end, our son was circumcised,
because he was born with only one kidney, and we felt that anything
that reduced his chances of urinary infection was a good idea.

My two cents.
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom)
Subject: Re: Childproofing (NOT!)
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 17:35:09 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.223008.14297@umiami.ir.miami.edu> ahelmers@umiami.ir.miami.edu writes:
>In article <glen.726360791@cs.wisc.edu>, glen@slate.cs.wisc.edu (Glen Ecklund) writes:
>> 
>> In case anyone is unaware of them, you can get doorknob covers which make it
>> hard for a one-year-old to open most doors.  They don't impede as well if
>> the doorknob is not smooth.  They don't impede adults much.  I think Toys R Us
>                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> has them.
>
>
>Hmmm, I dunno about that.  I find that when child-free adult friends are in
>my house, which has been pretty much childproofed after 4 years and 2 kids, I
>have to follow THEM around to help them open doors, gates, etc.

I used to have fun with the child lock on the toilet. >:-> (that is supposed
to be an evil grin). It was fun seeing how long it took people to figure it 
out, or gave up and came looking for me. The record was held by best friend,
also a mom - though she had never seen that particular lock. My neighbor,
the architect gave up and asked. My boyfriend (now husband) took surprisingly
long for an engineer. 

I cant wait to put it back on in a year or so >;->

Laura Floom
Xref: sparky misc.kids:31426 soc.men:22110 alt.atheism:24884 alt.sex.wizards:4205
From: yasu@ll.mit.edu (Alan Yasutovich)
Newsgroups: misc.kids,soc.men,alt.atheism,alt.sex.wizards
Subject: Re: A few facts about circumcision
Date: 4 Jan 93 17:20:58 GMT
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory

In article <1992Dec31.145255.3618@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jcopelan@nyx.cs.du.edu (The One and Only) writes:
>Reason is based partially on experience, but not limited to it.  I am asking
>what reason you use to justify infant circumcision.  If your response is to
>say "well, I like it so my son will therefore like it too", I'll say you have
>no reason to believe this statement, and ask why you think so.  So far, I
>have yet to see a satisfactory response and I would claim this is because
>you can't know that an infant would desire to be cut or not.  This is where
>human rights comes in.  If you can't determine the wishes of the infant then
>(barring medical emergencies) when it comes to circumcision, the decision
>should be left to the infant when he grows up.
>
>What basis do you use to justify making this decision for the infant?  In
>answering this question, I would caution you not to use false analogies
>like comparing the circumcision decision to immunizations or any other 
>decision that parents make for children.  With circumcision we are talking
>about a medically unnecessary procedure, that if done to an unconsenting
>adult would result in legal action against those involved.
>
>Jim Copeland
>--
>Have you washed your brain today?

	
	You are obviously the exact type of bleeding heart liberal
	who would continually keep our courts tied up in knots if
	allowed to.

	Parents are there to make decisions for their kids because
	kids are incapable of making good ones.  If that, to you,
	means that "the kids have no rights", then I'll have to
	say it that way.  They have basic human rights.  That's
	all.

	Maybe they should vote, too!  Oh, I'm sorry, they are not
	old enough to have that "right" yet.

	Oh ooooooooohhhh!  Now I've done it.  Now he'll be after
	the feds claiming discrimination of rights for kids.

	See!  Age and certain rights *ARE* intertwined.

-- 
	Alan Yasutovich
	"inquiring  (and nosey) minds WANT TO KNOW!!!"
	I can remember when "safe sex" meant having a padded headboard!!
	Tick Tock.....Tick Tock......Tick Tock .....Tick Tock......
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: srb@aretha.jax.org (Susan Dewey)
Subject: Re: water breaking
Followup-To: misc.kids
Organization: The Jackson Laboratory
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 18:11:10 GMT

In article <1833@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu>, psybc806@emory.edu (Elise G.
Jacobs) wrote:
> 
> 
> I am absolutely convinced that I won't know when my water breaks.  Between
> my leaking bladder (especially when I cough) and swimming, I can't imagine
> how I will distinguish anything.  Anyone else with this fear?
> 
> Elise

Me, too. I'm now 2 days past anyone's guess at my due date. Baby is still
moving
happily, especially after meals, but is tramping hard on my bladder. I'm
changing my underwear 3 times a day. The doctor broke my water for my
first,
and I did recognize it then, but who can tell what all this slow leaking is
coming from?

Susan
Newsgroups: misc.kids