HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rks@kastle (Ramesh Sitaraman)
Subject: Questions about TREADMILLS
Organization: Princeton University, Dept. of Computer Science
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 02:48:44 GMT



Hi folks !!

I train about one day a week on a treadmill (brand name:challenger)
usually for doing long interval-type work outs. I have noticed that
I can run much faster on it than I actually can outside. For example,
I can keep up a 6.40 pace for around 15 minutes and i cant even 
dream of doing that outside ! Is it due to the fact that there is 
no wind-resistance ? Also are there any significant disadvantages
to training on treadmills ? The thing I like about treadmills is
the fact that I can keep an accurate record of what I am running
(like pace and time of each interval etc). Also it seems a little
easy on my knees as compared to running on hard roads. I would
love to hear from people who use treadmills and i would also
like to hear some of the  TRAINING ROUTINES that you have found
very effective.  I didnt find the in-built routines in the treadmill
very interesting however. Thanks very much.....

		regards, 

			Ramesh
From: atb@gserv1.dl.ac.uk (A.M.T. Bell,G2,3123,homephone)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: test
Date: 7 Sep 92 13:11:47 GMT
Reply-To: atb@gserv1.dl.ac.uk
Organization: Daresbury Laboratory, UK


this is a test
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Subject: Re: Blood In Urine after running
Organization: Unocal Corporation
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 15:14:26 GMT

It is a common and annoying condition.
I had several episodes the first year of serious running, but then it didn't
recurr since then.  I went to the doctor and had several tests like kidney xrays
and a bladder examination.  They really didn't find anything, except some possible
bladder irritation.
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Tendonitus question
From: wds!schmitz@nuts.almanac.bc.ca  (Wayne Schmitz)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 92 15:58:11 PDT
Organization: Wayne's World -- Duncan, BC Waffle Site
Keywords: tendonitis

fred@dip3.ee.uct.ac.za (Fred Hoare) writes:
> 
> The questions I have are the following:
> 
> 1. Is it really necessary to give up running?
> 2. What is the best treatment for this kind of injury?
>       (My doctor said it would heal by itself but I 
>        can still feel it seven weeks later)
> 3. Does anyone know what would cause this injury:
> 	incorrect shoes?
> 	bad running style?
> 	something else?
> 

I think the best advice is to go to a sports medicine or a doctor that
runs. Some doctors are just against running all together.

The problem could be shoes, it could be the way you run, it could be
your body just can't take running, or you injured yourself because of
overuse. Hard to say without knowing a lot more.

I have had a few running injuries but with proper shoe inserts for my
less than graceful feet and a good training plan things went a lot
better.

        Wayne
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: seeley@cerl.uiuc.edu (Joseph Seeley)
Subject: Re: Questions about TREADMILLS
Organization: UIUC Computer-based Education Research Lab
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:45:57 GMT

I don't rely on the guages for speed and distance on my treadmill (Sport-
Tech).  In my case, the speed seems too slow (9-minute miles usually don't
leave me winded, so I assume I'm not really running 9-minute miles.)  I
use my pulse to guage my effort.  Like the original poster, I find treadmill
running gentler on my legs.

Joseph Seeley	| seeley@cerl.uiuc.edu
		| seeley / cca / cerl
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: mrb@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (m..bruncati)
Subject: Re: The Bible of running ...?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 16:41:21 GMT
Summary: Where to find the Bible of Running

In article <842@jgaltstl.UUCP>, terry@jgaltstl.UUCP (terry linhardt) writes:
> In article <5700030@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com>, smay@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com (Scott Smay) writes:
> > Are you sure it wasn't "the Lore of Running" by Tim Noakes (Ithink). It
> > seems like the closest thing to the bible of running to me.
> > 
> > scott 
> 
> Amen to that.
> -- 
>   Terry Linhardt                ...!wupost!jgaltstl!terry 
>                                 terry%jgaltstl.uucp@wupost.wustl.edu  





I saw a book called "The Bible of Running" at Walden books
by a guy named Mark Bloom - I'll get the publisher's name if 
you want - it is a rather thin book - I also saw the "Lore of
Running" which just by size looks like it has a lot more info.



Michael
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: heel cups
From: wds!schmitz@nuts.almanac.bc.ca  (Wayne Schmitz)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 92 17:56:53 PDT
Organization: Wayne's World -- Duncan, BC Waffle Site

chelsea@oneb2.almanac.bc.ca writes:

>  I have rolled in ankles or somthing like that,where my feet sort of 
> roll inwords from the ankle.  The docter says that I could get heel cups 
> to try and straiten it out. I really hope that it works because it
> makes my knees hurt when I run.  Anyway,I can't run in the normal
> heel cups because they are to hard. I would have to get other ones
> just for running.(the ones for running are leather instead of plastic.)
> I was wondering if any one else has these and if so do they make a 
> difference?

I wouldn't recommend heel cups at all. You may find they work for awhile
but they are just too unstable. You are much better off with orthodics.
You probably have more than an unstable heel counter and the orthodics
will assist greatly.

Based on your address I know of a person who makes very good orthodics
if you wish to see if they would help. If so please contact me via
netmail.

Wayne
From: daleg@hammersmith.Eng.Sun.COM (Dale Greenley)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Knee injury -- any ideas?
Date: 10 Sep 1992 18:10:15 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: daleg@hammersmith.Eng.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: hammersmith


I'm training for a marathon in December and have just experienced a
curious new injury. I was playing indoor soccer (carpet over concrete)
about 2 weeks ago and landed hard on the inside of my left knee.  I've
had several knee (right and left) operations over the years for
meniscus and ligament tears, but this seems completely different. I
bruised up pretty badly and it's still painful. I ran about 20 miles
(6,7,7) during the week immediately after the injury (I average 40-45),
but have been hesitant to do any more since. I do a lot of trail work
and level or uphill running is tolerable, but even a slight downhill
hurts a lot. The pain has been very erratic since the injury: one day
improvement, 3 days of steady decline, etc. This wouldn't appear to be
a common injury among runners, but I thought somebody might have an
insight.

Thanks,

-- Dale G.
 

Newsgroups: rec.running
From: waldnerm@rtsg.mot.com (Matthew R. Waldner)
Subject: Asics Epcris replacement
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 13:25:47 GMT

I am on my last pair of Asics Epcris.
What is the replacement model for them.

Matt
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: kd
From: moreno@vax.sonoma.edu
Date: 15 Sep 92 11:17:49 -0800
Organization: Sonoma State University

	I been running for approximately four years.   I like running at 
moderate speed and for long distace.  I find this ejoyable.  But when 
I do my speed workouts is something different.  Every time I do more 
than three 400 meters with three minutes of rest in between, my rear 
end muscle tights up.  Obviously on my next 400 meter I slow down my 
pace.  I hate this.  I warm up as best as I can and as effective as 
can too, but it seems that it does not work. I strech my lower body 
as good as can too.  When I feel this muscle 
tight up, I feel that I'm just dragging my leggs to the finish line.
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: heel cups
From: chelsea@oneb2.almanac.bc.ca
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 92 10:54:48 PDT
Organization: The Old Coot's (Spare) Almanac

Hi.
 I have rolled in ankles or somthing like that,where my feet sort of 
roll inwords from the ankle.  The docter says that I could get heel cups 
to try and straiten it out. I really hope that it works because it
makes my knees hurt when I run.  Anyway,I can't run in the normal
heel cups because they are to hard. I would have to get other ones
just for running.(the ones for running are leather instead of plastic.)
I was wondering if any one else has these and if so do they make a 
difference?


thanks,CHELSEA


chelsea@oneb2.almanac.bc.ca (Chelsea Graham)
                  The Old Coot's Almanac
               Vancouver Island, British Columbia, Canada
                    Courtesy the old coot hisse'f!
From: leino@rat.vtt.fi (Tapio Leino)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Training question.
Date: 8 Sep 1992 10:50:53 GMT
Organization: VTT / Lab. of Structural Engineering
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: rat.vtt.fi


Hi you all 5000- m runners,

I would like to ask your opinion and advice about training.

In my opinion the successful performance in a race depends on several
things and details (besides one's health of course) like:
- the running condition (more like the VO2max capability)
- weather conditions and how you have accustomized yourself to them
- the shoes (laces) and clothes and their material and condition
- preparations just before the race (WC, concentration etc.)
- preparations on the preceding days (blood sugar etc.)
- your alertness and spirit during the race
- etc.
The thing which is not included in the list above is the ability to meet
the attacks of other runners, when the running speed is changed all the
time. In fact the speed changes quite randomly or unpredictably. This also
is one of the reasons why in important races there are surprise winners.

The common method of preparing yourself for this is to train the intervals.
For example 10 times 400m with 1-2 minutes rest in between. But this way
you always know when to start and to finish. In my opinion this really has
very little to do with preparing yourself for a race and its surprises.

How do you prepare yourself for such random events during a race?

How do you prepare yourself for the situation where one or several other
runners increase the speed after they just decreased it? or do it many
times?

-- 
Tapio Leino               email: Tapio.Leino@vtt.fi
VTT / Laboratory of Structural Engineering
PL 26, SF-02151 ESPOO, Finland
tel. -358-0-456 6683  telefax  -456 7003
From: paulf@igloo.mips.com (Paul French)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Galloway's Marathon Schedule
Date: 9 Sep 92 01:16:34 GMT
Reply-To: paulf@igloo.mips.com (Paul French)
Organization: MIPS Computer Systems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: igloo.mips.com

|> Has anyone followed Jeff Galloway's marathon training
|> schedule and successfully run a marathon?  ...
|> 
|> His plan calls for long runs on alternate Sundays that
|> increase in mileage up to marathon distance.  ...
|> 
|> ... I'm not
|> sure it provides enough overall mileage for a successful
|> marathon.
|>
|> Terry Dickinson  

My experience is that I can run under control in the marathon for a distance
equal to the distance of my longest training run, and that I can hang on for a
time equal to the time of my longest training run. With training runs of max
18 miles and 2 hours, I would struggle from 18 miles until I hit 2 hours, then
die.  For my last effort, I upped my longest run to 21 miles, and longest time
to 2:15. This time I strarted to struggle at 21, and crashed at 23.5 miles,
right around 2:15.  Of course, this might just mean that I try to race faster than
I'm able.  ;-)

If I'm foolish enough to ever try another marathon, I'll at minimum do a
training run of 2:30 (goal race time), and probably attempt a 25 to 26 miler
also.  Your mileage may vary.

-paulf
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: lorenzo@spot.Colorado.EDU (Eric J. Lorenzo)
Subject: DMG
Followup-To: poster
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 03:27:39 GMT

I've seen a discussion on DMG(DiMethylGlycine) on this group before and the
general conensus was that it doesn't do what is claims to.  My question is
what is it supposed to do?

Thanks in advance
-Eric


-- 
'You can fly high as a kite if you want to.              /  Eric J. Lorenzo \
     Faster then light if you want to.                   \AKA: Rico and Spam/
     Speeding through the universe...               /lorenzo@Spot.Colorado.EDU\
   Thinking is the best way to travel' -Moody Blues \ also: @UCSU and @Tramp  /
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: re:heel cups
From: chelsea@oneb2.almanac.bc.ca
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 92 11:05:44 PDT
Organization: The Old Coot's (Spare) Almanac

please email any responses.
thanks, CHELSEA

chelsea@oneb2.almanac.bc.ca (Chelsea Graham)
                  The Old Coot's Almanac
               Vancouver Island, British Columbia, Canada
                    Courtesy the old coot hisse'f!
From: tmr@faceplnt.dr.att.com (54626-RebmanTM(DR1867)000)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Medical Advice Sought
Keywords: pain beer
Date: 15 Sep 92 20:49:19 GMT
Reply-To: tmr@drutx.att.com
Followup-To: rec.running
Organization: Bell Labs, DCTT, Denver, Co.

I have two medical related questions that I hope some netters might have
some experience with.  

First, I recently (last Friday) got a cast 
removed from my right ankle after breaking it (tip of fibula) and having
it screwed back together.  The reason I had the screws put in is not because
it was such a bad break, but because I told the doctor that I run and he
subsequently recommended screws.  As of today, it has been 6 weeks
since breaking it.  What I would like to know is how to go about getting
back to running.  It is still swollen and stiff, so I don't think I'm
ready yet, but I'd like to know (preferably from someone with experience)
when to start running again, how to get back to old milage (~20 miles/week)
, etc...  

Second, I seem to be having problems recently (last 6-7 months) of a
painful (achy type of pain) in my lower legs (calf region) occasionally.
It only happens maybe once or twice a month, and seems to last all day.
Ibuprophen (sp) helps, but I'd like to know what is causing it.  It does
not appear to be correlated in any way with running or any other physical
activity.  The only way I know to make it happen with *certainty* is to
drink 4 or 5 beers the preceding night -- although this brings it on, 
sometimes it just happens with no beers the night before.  I thought it
might be related to dehydration, but I dunno... as I said, it sometimes
happens and I don't think that I'm normally dehydrated.  Any other ideas
out there??  Anything else in beer that would cause this type of reaction??

Thanks for any info on either of these in advance.

-- Tom Rebman (tmr@drutx.att.com)
From: spaceman@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: rec.kites
Subject: Engineering involved in Kite Making?
Date: 9 Sep 92 00:41:32 CDT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

I have a question for those people who design and construct their own kites-

How much of the process involved in your kite making involves calculations
(estimations) of aerodynamic/structural properties, i.e. location of center of
pressure, the amount of camber, and the frame members spec's to get 
specific pull (light flight or power- considering the strength-to-weight
ratio)?

!I know that there is an "artwork" aspect to it (who wants an ugly kite?),
 but how much 'engineering' goes into it?

A curious aerospace engineering student-
paul

Newsgroups: rec.kites
From: steveth@netcom.com (Steve Thomas)
Subject: Re: Kite reviews for this newsgroup
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 92 04:15:31 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article <1992Sep16.010142.8765@clsi.COM> kevin@clsi.COM (Kevin Cameron) writes:
>
>What's a Hawain Chevron like ?
>
>Kev.
>-- 

Right now, I'd say your average Hawiian Chevron is probably not a very
pleasent place to be.  I mean, good gas and all, but probably not a good
place to just hang out.  You'd probably be better off at a Shell station
or a 76... :-)

Now seriously, the Team Hawiian, by Top of the Line was the original kite
that came out by TOTL and is largely "what started it all" in high-performance
sport kites.  Particularly team flying.

While the Team Kite is still a great kite for team flying--at least at the
novice level--it is certainly an old design, and has since been surplanted
by TOTL's North Shore Radical.

Flying Impressions: The team kite is really, really sssssslllllooooowwww.
It does not spin very tight (further out than the wing-tip), it tracks real
straight, and corners very precisely.  Light wind performance is less than
optimal.  It lacks many capabilities that many more modern designs have.

------
Note that I expected that people would mail me rather than RE this post... 
This way, however, other people are free to add other comments to my
evaluation.  Perhaps the subject line should have read: "Has anybody
flown...".


Steve Thomas
steveth@rossinc.com
From: puc@aber.ac.uk (Paul Crowley)
Newsgroups: rec.kites
Subject: Re: Kite Tail Tales (Was: Re: Kite Tails)
Date: 8 Sep 92 08:20:52 GMT
Organization: University of Wales, Aberystwyth

In article <67649@hydra.gatech.EDU> sc5@prism.gatech.EDU (CSEPLO,STEPHEN P) writes:
>In article <DAVE.92Sep4191320@pipi.iis.u-tokyo.ac.jp> dave@pipi.iis.u-tokyo.ac.jp (David Wuertele) write>
>Hey, anybody remeber the cup kite where you cut styrofoam cups in half
>and then put them on a frame, curved side down, and it would fly?
>
>
>
>-- 
>
>The Mad Hata  
>
>"Hey, Mon....Tako Kichi!"

Maxwell Eden's book "kiteworks" has plans for this, apparently only
Macdonalds cups will do.

aul
From: north@egr.msu.edu (PUT YOUR NAME HERE)
Newsgroups: rec.kites
Subject: Re: logo
Date: 10 Sep 92 13:47:40 GMT
Reply-To: north@egr.msu.edu (PUT YOUR NAME HERE)
Organization: Michigan State University
Originator: north@frith.egr.msu.edu

Ok the r.k logo is fine but how about using brighter colors then red and
black? Something like Hot Pink and Blue? Or any of the neon colors. 
I think they would stand out better!

George        
Newsgroups: rec.kites
From: jdawson@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Jonathan A Dawson)
Subject: Re: Engineering involved in Kite Making?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 15:42:23 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.212428.4569@gordian.com> steve@gordian.com (Steve Thomas) writes:
>In article <1992Sep9.004133.42857@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> spaceman@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>>
>>How much of the process involved in your kite making involves calculations
>>(estimations) of aerodynamic/structural properties, i.e. location of center of
>>pressure, the amount of camber, and the frame members spec's to get 
>>specific pull (light flight or power- considering the strength-to-weight
>>ratio)?
>>
>>A curious aerospace engineering student-
>>paul
>>
>
>
>It's "engineering" for sure (George was a bricklayer by trade), but there's
>not much written in the academic sphere of aerodynamics that applies
>specifically to kites.  There are the obvious prinicples, but nothing beyond
>what one might learn in a high school course.
>
>Steve Thomas
>-- 

Well, there's a really good reason why there is not much aerodynamic
principles applied to kitemaking and the reason is that the problem
itself is one nasty item.  Consider that most of the models studied
in wind tunnels, the planes in the air, cars, etc. are are rigid bodies.
Studies and projections made with these models are difficult enough, but
it is nearly impossible to consider all of the variations that can occur
with a deformable body.  There is some literature that is devoted to parachutes
and this is not very extensive from what I have seen.

One might even say, well, why not use computer programs to model the
kites flying through the air, and again the problem is that the body
is deformable to a LARGE extent.  In order to resolve the small scales
necessary to solve a turbulence problem on a RIGID body can take many
many MANY CPU HOURS on a Cray.  There are some approximations that can
reduce this time, but not anywhere nearly to an extent that would make
a full-blown simulation of a very flexible body.

Well, I don't have time to write all day, but if anybody has any 
particular questions, gimme a yell.

Jonathan
jdawson@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu


Newsgroups: rec.kites
From: danr@crash.cts.com (Dan Rubesh)
Subject: QuadriFoil Kite instructions update
Organization: CTS Network Services (crash, ctsnet), El Cajon, CA
Date: 13 Sep 92 10:24:17 PDT

For any QuadriFoil flyers on the net:

I just got some updated instructions for the QuadriFoil and I wanted
to pass along one point that I don't recall was covered in previous
instructions.. 

"Once you have mastered flying the Quadrifoil 25 you can improve the
performance a little by cutting the spreader line in the center. (see
drawing) [ (text in lieu of drawing) This is the line that goes
between the left and right sides of the main bridle-to-line attachment
points..] This allows the kite to spread out alot more, improving the
light wind, turning performance."  

I haven't tried it as yet on my Q-foil 25 but will probably do so over
the weekend. I also think I'll leave enough tail on the ends of the
spreader to put a stopper knot on so I can larkshead a spreader line
back on if I wish to..  

Also, FWIW, I tied stopper knots on the bitter ends of the lower bridle/bag
attachment points to larkshead a pair of 60' ripstop tails to the Q-25
for some added visuals. 

Ob. Disclaimer:

I am a stunt kite dealer and carry some of the above mentioned
product(s). As such, my opinions may tend to be somewhat subjective.

Good Winds and Tight Lines!!

                               Wind Wizard

Purveyor of High Quality, High Performance Stunt Kites and Accessories
From: scottie@sequent.com (Scott Thurston)
Newsgroups: rec.kites
Subject: Re: Low Cost Stunt Kites
Date: 9 Sep 92 20:54:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Sep9.205436.26139
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.

In article <1992Sep8.160619.10104@walter.cray.com> treptau@romulus.cray.com writes:
% Has anyone flown a few different low cost stunt kites (~$50 or below) such as 
% the TotL Snap or the Spectra Sports Rocket, and could offer a comparison 
% (forward speed, wind range, turning radius, etc) to the Cheetah?

My first stunter was (is) a Skynasaur F36.  It cost around $35.00 when I
bought it a couple of years ago.  

It's a pretty fast kite when the wind is good.  It doesn't have a very broad
wind range; I need a good, stiff breeze to get it to fly well.  Note that
newer versions of the kite have an arc of fiberglas that extends from the T
connection to each wingtip, thereby curving the sail.  They work sort of
like standoffs.  I have no idea how that improves the kite's low-wind
performance.

The kite is fairly responsive in a good wind, especially when you consider I
was usually flying on the cotton line provided with the kite.  I don't have
a lot of experience with other kites, but I think the F36 has a fair amount
of oversteer (or I'm not skilled enough, which is just as likely).

Not long after I bought my first F36, I added a second F36 to the first.
It's a pretty nice stack, and I don't mind crashing them the way I'd mind
crashing something more expensive.
-- 
Scott Thurston		       scottie@sequent.com
Sequent Computer Systems, Inc  ...!{uunet,ogicse,tektronix}!sequent!scottie
Beaverton, OR		       Disclaimer: I used to be sane, but I got better.
SPAM! SPAM! SPAM! SPAM! SPAM! ...   No one expects the Spamish Repetition!