HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: stcmille@panix.com (Steve Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Who came up with the idea...
Date: 6 Jan 93 15:11:04 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC


I'd just like to point out that the story of the fellow who watched
animals get wired by eating coffee sounds just as apocryphal as the
emperor who had the leaves fall in his hot water to make tea.

It's hard to believe that people would have lived around coffee plants
for thousands of years without discovering they wake you up in the
morning.  I would bet its kind of like this old New Yorker cartoon
showing a white explorer standing in front of a huge waterfall with his
black guide.  The guide says to the explorer: "Yes, it is spectacular,
isn't it?  I always hoped someone would discover it."


-- 

__________________________________________________________
Steve Miller				stcmille@panix.com
		A Famous Rock Star!
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: dadams@cray.com (David Adams)
Subject: Re: Who came up with the idea...
Reply-To: dadams@cray.com
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 7 Jan 93 09:16:30 CST

 julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas) writes:

|Many plants labelled as posionous, such as nightshade, were
|used as medicine (and posion) in the past.  I believe that
|digitalis was originally found in nightshade.  But it had
                                   ^^^^^^^^^^

Uh, isn't that foxglove?


|to be synthesized because the amount of the drug varies
|from plant to plant and a small overdose is lethal.



---
--David C. Adams  Statistician  Cray Research Inc.  dadams@cray.com
___________________________________________________________________
       Old Sourdoughs never die.  They just ferment away.
From: cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Who came up with the idea...
Date: 7 Jan 1993 23:02:14 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

In article <1993Jan7.203513.14279@llyene.jpl.nasa.gov> julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas) writes:

>....  Does any one have references on how 
>often mediveal people drank beer or water?  

Well, there's the oft-quoted remark by some Frenchman in about the fifteenth
century, contrasting how well the average Englishman lived in comparison
to the average Frenchman: "In England, no one ever drinks water except
for penance."

I don't remember who said it nor by how much he was exaggerating, but...


Dorothy J. Heydt
UC Berkeley
cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu

Disclaimer:  UCB and the Cozzarelli lab are not responsible for my
opinions, and in fact I don't think they know I have any.
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas)
Subject: Re: Who came up with the idea...
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:23:46 GMT

In article <BZS.93Jan6025846@world.std.com> bzs@world.std.com (Barry Shein) writes:
>
>>We know now that boiled water is healthier than non-boiled water, 
>>and we know why, but it wouldn't be known a priori, especially when 
>>people did not know the causes of disease.  (What!  Little bugs I can't 
>>see in my water!  Lock this madman up!! :)
>
>Although people did not know the reason (and often made up reasons)
>they frequently did do things like this simply because they stumbled
>across the benefits. For a great book on this sort of thing I
>recommend "Plagues and Peoples" by William Hardy McNeill, it's a good
>swath of human history re-examined through the eyes of an
>epidemiologist and very readable.

Maybe I didn't say things clearly enough.  I think people very
quickly picked up connections between a process or an ingredient
and the fact that it prevents a disease.  But this connection
was made after the fact.  That is, no one sat down and said
"I'll be the first person ever to boil water.  This will keep
me healthy."  People were boiling water for some other reason
and quickly noticed that it kept you healthy.

>
>Sometimes people got it right, oftentimes of course they didn't. But,
>as another example, just because they didn't understand the germ
>theory of disease doesn't mean no one figured out contagiousness. The
>Bible (OT) details that it was pretty clearly understood when the
>Bible was written, read Leviticus* for dozens of prohibitions on
>sleeping in a sick person's bed or wearing his or her clothes (and
>advice to burn same.)

Science News had an interesting report some months back on the
ideas people have about contagion.  It seems that there are deep
rooted ideas about avoiding belongings of "unclean" or bad 
people.  Questions were asked of people and no one would consider
wearing a sweater that had previously been worn by Hitler.
No one would drink water that a dead sterilized cockroach 
had been dipped in.  Very few would take clothes from someone who
had a terminal illness, even if the clothes had been completely 
sterilized.   There were several other examples too.  It seems
to be almost an instinct that's developed to help prevent 
illness.
>
>Much of what we associate with "witchcraft" and "magick" was just
>people seeking out things like this, but not being able to explain
>those techniques which worked, so it was attributed to manipulating
>demons or spirits and often called evil even if the effect was
>positive. But c'mon, you knew that, they couldn't tell you what
>salicylic acid was, but they could tell you that willow bark tea would
>cure your headache (to wrap it all back to the beginning of this
>story.)

Yes, but I think the original question was like a chicken and egg
type thing.  People knew willow bark tea would cure headaches.  But
the first person to try willow bark tea didn't do it to cure his
or her headache.

Julie
DISCLAIMER:  All opinions here belong to my cat and no one else
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: bzs@world.std.com (Barry Shein)
Subject: Re: Who came up with the idea...
Organization: The World
	<BZS.93Jan6162239@world.std.com>
	<1993Jan6.215419.24761@llyene.jpl.nasa.gov>
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 02:51:36 GMT


From: julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas)
>Many plants labelled as posionous, such as nightshade, were
>used as medicine (and posion) in the past.  I believe that
>digitalis was originally found in nightshade.  But it had
>to be synthesized because the amount of the drug varies
>from plant to plant and a small overdose is lethal.

Digitalis comes from the foxglove plant (I notice they sell foxglove
in Burpee's catalog and indeed the latin name is digitalis
somethingorother.)

The story on digitalis was that some African prince was at school at
Oxford or Cambridge (UK.) He had some sort of condition but it never
came up. One day (perhaps he ran out of his foxglove stash) he began
ailing and getting very sick. He pleaded with the local doctors to
contact his tribal "doctor" to get him some herb he needed. They
scoffed but seeing as he was likely to die indulged him eventually.
He got the herb and did whatever he did with it and was up on his feet
in no time. So the doctors got interested.

Nightshade, btw, is a member of the belladona family (I forget the
chemical name of the drug but something so awfully obvious I'm afraid
I will get it wrong, strychnine??) as are potatos, tomatos and
eggplants, tho the latter don't produce the drug (potatos do in their
green portions, both meat and tops.) Contact cold pills used to
contain belladona, not sure if they do anymore.

-- 
        -Barry Shein

Software Tool & Die    | bzs@world.std.com          | uunet!world!bzs
Purveyors to the Trade | Voice: 617-739-0202        | Login: 617-739-WRLD
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas)
Subject: Re: Yeast: Re: Who came up with the idea...
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 18:31:11 GMT

In article <C0Hw6B.B7K@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> hrubin@pop.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin) writes:
>In article <1993Jan6.215419.24761@llyene.jpl.nasa.gov> julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas) writes:
>>In article <BZS.93Jan6162239@world.std.com> bzs@world.std.com (Barry Shein) writes:
>
>			...................
>
>>I agree too :)  Like people keeping a small amount of bread from
>>the last baking for the next baking.  Without it, the bread may not
>>rise.  Or brewers using a small amount of finished beer to 
>>innoculate the new batch.  We know now that about yeast but that 
>>didn't stop people from using it in the past.  
>
>As I understand it, the rising of bread was discovered in Egypt in
>antiquity, and the use of a small amount to speed up the rising was
>known to do nothing more than that.  Similarly for fermentation; 
>even now, the regulations for some French wines require that no
>yeast other than what is found on the grapes can be used.

Add old dough or brew does speed up fermentation but it also
ensures that you'll have (at least close to) the same culture
as you did previously.  There really is more to it than just
speeding things up.  In brewing this is important as you need
to get the yeast going before obnoxious organisms (including
non-desirable yeast) take over.  In bread, if you have a good
yeast captured and it has adapted itself to the bread, you don't
want it to be taken over by 'hostiles'.  There is also no quarantee
that leaving the dough out will get you the same yeast you got
20 years ago.  Or it may be the same yeast, but your 20 year old
one is better adapted to bread baking.  Quite often people
report that freshly caught yeast cultures don't rise well
but over time they perform better and better.


About the wines:  can the makers use a portion of previously 
fermented put unbottled wine in the new batch?  If so, they're
getting a healthy portion of yeast.  Many beer brewers do this.
But one beer style , Lambic, is brewed using airborne 
yeast (that are found in one area only), but may also they help it along
with older beer.  (If you're interested, this is a truly bizarre
brew, more like a primordial soup than a beer.  There are several 
kinds of yeast and bacteria and various species gain dominance and 
then subside at different points in the fermentation.  The complete 
mechanisms are not known but the brewers know what works.  In addition 
to exposing the beer to air, they will add older beer to it at 
certain times.  They also are careful to use old oaken casks, 
which presumably contain lots of yeast spores of the proper kind.  
New casks don't work as well.  Of course, the yeast don't always 
cooperate and they end up with a weird tasting soup.)

Julie
DISCLAIMER:  All opinions here belong to my cat and no one else
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: dadams@cray.com (David Adams)
Subject: Herbalism.  (Was: Who came up with the idea...)
Reply-To: dadams@cray.com
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 7 Jan 93 09:26:27 CST

In article 93Jan6215136@world.std.com, bzs@world.std.com (Barry Shein) writes:
|
|The story on digitalis was that some African prince was at school at
|Oxford or Cambridge (UK.) He had some sort of condition but it never
|came up. One day (perhaps he ran out of his foxglove stash) he began
|ailing and getting very sick. He pleaded with the local doctors to
|contact his tribal "doctor" to get him some herb he needed. They
|scoffed but seeing as he was likely to die indulged him eventually.
|He got the herb and did whatever he did with it and was up on his feet
|in no time. So the doctors got interested.

I read quite a different story in "Rhodales Encyclopedia of Herbs", but
I would have to go look it up to recall it.  (That isn't to say that more
than one story can't be true.)  Would the African version of the foxglove 
be the same plant?

|Nightshade, btw, is a member of the belladona family (I forget the
|chemical name of the drug but something so awfully obvious I'm afraid
|I will get it wrong, strychnine??) as are potatos, tomatos and
|eggplants, tho the latter don't produce the drug (potatos do in their
|green portions, both meat and tops.) Contact cold pills used to
|contain belladona, not sure if they do anymore.

Isn't solanine the alkaloid in potatoes & tomatoes etc?  (I have the notion that
there are several alkaloids in the nightshade family--but I doubt that 
strychnine is one of them.)



---
--David C. Adams  Statistician  Cray Research Inc.  dadams@cray.com
___________________________________________________________________
       Old Sourdoughs never die.  They just ferment away.



Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: "thomas hague" <thomas.hague@canrem.com>
Subject: who came up with the
Reply-To: "thomas hague" <thomas.hague@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 10 Jan 93 17:42:09 EST

BS>Nightshade, btw, is a member of the belladona family (I forget the
BS>chemical name of the drug but something so awfully obvious I'm afraid
BS>I will get it wrong, strychnine??) as are potatos, tomatos and
BS>eggplants, tho the latter don't produce the drug (potatos do in their
BS>green portions, both meat and tops.) Contact cold pills used to
BS>contain belladona, not sure if they do anymore.

Potato and Nightshade are members of the genus Solanum
The variety DEADLY Nightshade is the belladonna producer.
Atropa belladona a poisonous plant.
Active principle of atropine.
Used only in prescriptions. 
Primary use is to curtail the actions of some involuntary muscles.(stomach)
To diminish the flow of gastric juices in ulcer type therapy.
To stop the ciliary muscles in the eye to allow a thorough examination.
et al  

Better living through good gardening.
Tom

TWH
---
  DeLuxe 1.26b #1565  
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: maven@lerc.nasa.gov (Larry Fishbach)
Subject: Re: D.C. Restaurants
Reply-To: maven@hercules.lerc.nasa.gov
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center, Cleveland, OH
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:51:22 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.190607.21209@walter.bellcore.com>, dfw@thumper..bellcore.com (Doris Woods) writes:
>  I'm heading out to D.C. in a couple of weeks. Does anyone know if
> Marakesh is still open. It's a morroccan restaurant on Philidelphia ave
> I was there about 2 and a half years ago. 
> 
> If not any suggestions for the following:
> 
> Morrocan
> Spanish or Portuguese
> Good Italian (Not touristy)
> Chinese or Thai
> 
> 
> Thanks
>  Doris
> 
> 
  I have collected from previous posts the following list
  
  
From eagle!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!ames!haven.umd.edu!uunet!timbuk.cray.com!hemlock.cray.com!jsy Thu Oct  8 08:52:49 1992
Article: 3786 of rec.food.restaurants
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: jsy@media04.cray.com (Jeff Young)
Subject: Re: Washington DC and environs
Originator: jsy@media04
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 6 Oct 92 06:42:41 CDT



There are a couple of good restaurants in the DC area which I frequent when business
travels take me there:

1) Crisfields (Georgia Ave in Silver Spring, MD) - GREAT stuffed flounder with crab meat.
   (The seafood bisque is very good also).  There are now 2 Crisfields, but I still like
   the original one.
2) Chesapeake Bay Seafood House (restaurant chain - many locations) - all you can eat
   seafood.  This is a quantity place (as opposed to Crisfields which is a quality place.),
   but you can still get steamed crab legs and spiced shrimp.  (Most of the menu is deep
   fried.)
3) Dragon Inn (MD 175, approximately 1 mile east of the BWParkway - in the mall) - This
   place has 2 appetizers which I find to be very pleasing: Szechuan noodles and Crispy
   beef on stick.  The noodles are basically spaghetti with a spicy meat sauce.  They
   also have a good rendition of General Chou's (sp) Chicken.



Have fun,
Jeff Young
jsy@cray.com


From eagle!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!linus!linus.mitre.org!m14430 Thu Oct  8 08:54:00 1992
Article: 3790 of rec.food.restaurants
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: m14430@mwunix.mitre.org (Lawrence Larson)
Subject: Re: Washington D.C. and environs
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 92 10:32:41 EDT

lmmst24+@pitt.edu (Lisa M Maslak) writes:

>I just spent the summer living with my grandparents in Alexandria,
>and Old Town has a great seafood restaurant on King Street, which is
>I think called the Fish Market- no, it's not one of the chain you
>find in CA.  In any case, it is on the left side of King Street as
>you head down towards the water.  If I come up with the exact name
>I will let you know.  The food was great.

Sorry, I must disagree here. I live in Old Town, and the Fish Market has
fresh seafood (over)cooked in the least imaginative ways, served with
dishwater beer and diluted lemonade. The tea is OK, fries and veggies
are pathetic. Good music upstairs at times. and nice outdoor tables on
the second story balcony. In short, it is about the worst food on or
near King Street. The quality of preparation cannot even approach the
Chart House, a chain restaurant about a block away.

If you want the best fresh local seafood enjoyed in an authentic local
environment, it is well worth a side trip to Cantler's in Annapolis.
Local shellfish and Norfolk-style preparation are worth sampling. The 
fact that Cantler's is on the water gives it a big edge over DC places
like Crisfield for atmosphere, and I think Cantler's has much better food.

-- Larry



From eagle!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!gatech!emory!wupost!cs.uiuc.edu!hal.cs.uiuc.edu!faiman Mon Nov 30 13:15:21 1992
Article: 3961 of rec.food.restaurants
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: faiman@cs.uiuc.edu
Subject: DC & NY
Organization: Dept. of Computer Sci - University of Illinois
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 92 11:18:41 EDT


Ate at the following over Thanksgiving week.  All moderately priced and
recommended.

DC -

Cafe La Ruche, 1039 31st St NW (Georgetown) - bistro
Cheesecake Factory - CA yuppie
Sushi Taro, approx 17th & P
Lebanese Taverna, 2641 CT Av
Brickskeller, approx 22nd & P - beer from everywhere

NY -

Siam Inn, 8th Av & approx 50th
Ten Pell - Hunan (name = address!)

.


From eagle!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!princeton!crux!roger Thu Dec 17 09:19:08 1992
Article: 3999 of rec.food.restaurants
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Good food in Washington DC
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 19:50:54 EDT

In article <92351.091252U30633@uicvm.uic.edu> <U30633@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
>Can anyone recommend some good places to go eat in Washington DC?  What
>is Washington known for in terms of cuisine?  I'm not looking for
>anything fancy, just an informal place.

Good ethnic scene in general.  Chinese, Viet, Thai, Iranian.  

Many of the best places are in the 'burbs.  Will you have a car?  What 
area are you going to be staying in?  

A few tips:
Kolbeh (Iranian) at 1645 Wisconsin, NW (upper Georgetown).

The Iranian place across the street from Kolbeh.

Dona Flor (Brazilian) at 44xx Wisconsin, NW (Tenleytown)

The Dancing Crab (Maryland-style crab house) next door to Dona Flor.

These last two are close to the Red Line.                 

Roger



-- 
*******************************************************************************
maven@hercules.lerc.nasa.gov   Larry Fishbach @ NASA Lewis Cleveland Ohio
"Everything here is my own opinion"   Quoth the Maven "Evermore"
*******************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: jms@vision.sarnoff.com (Jerry Shapiro x2420)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: Romantic Boston Restaurant?
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:07:52 GMT
Reply-To: jms@vision.sarnoff.com
Organization: David Sarnoff Research Center

Cappaccino's in Coolidge Corner is worth the trip to Brookline

Just my two cents

Jerry Shapiro
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: NYC: Good Italian Food
From: rx84335@mcvax2.d48.lilly.com (BENVENGA MARK J)
Date: 5 Jan 1993 08:35 EST  
Distribution: world,local
Organization: Lilly Research Laboratories
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    Lines: 20

If anyone is interested in good Italian food (and lots of it
at a reasonable price), and doesn't want to deal with NYC
traffic, etc., I suggest The Lighthouse in West New York, NJ.
This restaurant is located right on the Hudson river, across
from 60th street.  The view of NYC while dining can be 
spectacular, even if you don't like the food.

TThe food is good, but don't eat lunch before you go there.
An appetizer can be eaten as a meal for many (I suggest the
calamari, it's lightly fried and never rubbery).  Dinner for
two with wine can be had for $75, and you will definitely have
to bring home a doggie bag.  

Easiest access is through the Lincoln tunnel, down the Boulevard
in Weehawken to river road in West New York.

Cheers,

Mark
From: ebrown@corpurch.Corp.Sun.COM (Eric Brown)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: RE:  D.C. Restaurants
Date: 7 Jan 1993 01:25:38 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: ebrown@corpurch.Corp.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: corpurch.corp.sun.com

Try the Evan's Farm Inn.  I think it is in Vienna, VA just
off the Beltway.

I haven't been there in a while, but I remember
that it had good food in an attractive setting.

Good luck.

Eric


Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
From: jchu@gloin.cis.udel.edu (Jennifer Chu)
Subject: Re: Here are my Philly choices. . .
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 17:29:00 GMT

In article <1451100001@igc.apc.org> Andrew Perrin <aperrin@igc.apc.org> writes:

>Also, for sort of upscale Chinese you can try Susanna Foo's; all my friends
>think it's out of this world but in my opinion Chinatown offers simila
>quality at 1/3 price...

I strongly recommend Susanna Foo's, but I disagree that Chinatown
offers similar quality. They are a bit on the more expensive side, but
their food is _much_ better than anything I've ever had in Chinatowns
in a number of cities. They do not serve the kind of _traditional_
Chinese food you'll expect at any Chinese restaurant -- they are
different, and they are very good! In fact, my boyfriend claims that
it's the _best_ Chinese food he's ever had! :-)

Jennifer
From: gkn@ucsd.edu (Gerard K. Newman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.restaurants
Subject: Re: San Diego Restaurants?
Summary: anonymous FTP ftp.sdsc.edu
Keywords: San Diego
Date: 13 Jan 93 01:15:22 GMT
Organization: TGV, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: ucsd.edu

>In article <C0r60n.5Mt@cs.mcgill.ca> maclean@cs.mcgill.ca (Matthew SAMS) writes:

>	As I will be travelling to San Diego for my first time
>in a few weeks, I am looking for decent (ie non-fast food) restaurants.
>I'll be staying at the Town and Country Hotel on Hotel Circle North
>in San Diego.  My daily food budget is $40US.  Since I will be
>travelling alone, romantic restaurants may prove to be too lonely :-)
>Unfortunately, I won't have a car.

Anoymous FTP to ftp.sdsc.edu, and get the file SD.EATS.

>	Also, is there Sunday shopping in San Diego and is it limited
>to certain types of stores?

Most everything is open on sundays in southern CA.  Near the Town & Country
are two large shopping malls (Mission Valley Center and Fashion Valley).
Further south in downtown is Horton Plaza and Seaport Village.


Cheers,


-- 
Gerard K. Newman,  TGV, Inc.  603 Mission St.  Santa Cruz, CA  95060
gkn@tgv.com | 619.591.4717 (voice+fax) | 800.TGV.3440 | 408.427.4366