HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: stevesi@microsoft.com (Steven Sinofsky)
Subject: Re: borland c++ and microsoft c/c++
Date: 12 Aug 92 19:39:16 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <pathak-100892175041@virtual.mitre.org> pathak@mitre.org (Heeren Pathak) writes:
>In article <1992Aug10.171802.18367@nntpd.lkg.dec.com>,
>feldman@toklas.enet.dec.com (Gary Feldman) wrote:
>> 
>> I'm just starting to look at compilers and windows programming (for myself).
>> One thing that struck me was that Borland appears to have added a non-standard 
>> C++ extension, to bind messages to member functions (the "= [WM_FIRST + mesage]"
>> construct).  It seems like a nifty idea, but if you use it, doesn't it lock
>> you into buying compilers from Borland?  
>> 
>
>From what I understand, Borland's extensions are being debated by the ANSI
>committee and may actually become part of the standard.

To the best of my knowledge and after checking with several representatives
on the ANSI XJ316 (the C++) committee, the Borland extension has not been
proposed, let alone debated by the XJ316 folks.


>
>> As I said, I'm just getting started, and it's difficult making my way through
>> all the documentation.  So it's possible I've got this wrong.
>> 
>
>Microsoft uses a different non-standard mechanism.  Granted, their
>mechanism is handled by a preprocessor but it is still non-standard.  In
>reality, I don't see a big difference either way.

Microsoft does not use a language extension, everything that is used
for the message routing is standard ANSI C++.  MFC will compile with
BCC 3.1.

>
>Personally, I have had very good experiences as a Borland customer and no
>so good experiences as a Microsoft customer.  However from what I have read
>recently, the Microsoft complier has improved considerably (I haven't used
>a Microsoft complier for several years now).  
>
>Comparing class libraries, I prefer the Borland class library.  While it
>doesn't cover the entire Windows API, the sections it does cover contain a
>much higher level of abstraction the Microsoft Foundation Classes.  When I
>looked at the MFC a month or two ago, I wasn't impressed.  Most of the MFC
>seems to be a wrapper around Windows function calls.  While this is great
>for those who already know Windows and are porting their code, I am
>doubtful that the MFC will provide the flexiblity that a well designed
>Object-Oriented Application Framework provides.  
>

OWL and MFC provide nearly identical functionality in almost every
area.  MFC provides substantial abstraction in the areas of OLE, custom
controls, object persistance (that is much more automatic than OWL's).
OWL has 54 classes and MFC has 87, and the classes that the two have
in common are essentially identical, except that MFC is substantially
more complete.  Often at first look, people consider MFC less "abstract"
than OWL only because it uses the same names as Windows APIs and has
all the functionality of Windows.  


-- 
Steven Sinofsky
stevesi@microsoft.com
Disclaimer: I don't speak for Microsoft, BillG does that.
From: krishnan@ra.csc.ti.com (Srinivasan Krishnan)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Why is SHARE needed?
Date: 20 Aug 92 23:00:13 GMT
Organization: Texas Instruments


I am using my frined's PC. He has installed SHARE in his
PC.  Why is this needed?  

Thanks in advance.

Chris
From: dekock@shannon.ee.wits.ac.za (Nick de Kock)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools,comp.windows.ms.programmer
Subject: Questions on NT and TPW
Date: 20 Aug 92 12:30:31 GMT
Article-I.D.: shannon.dekock.714313831
Organization: Electrical Engineering, University of the Witwatersrand

First of all I've never noticed the comp.os.ms-windows hierarchy before.
Why are there two distinct hierarchies dealing with essentially the
same thing?

Anyway - Does anyone know whether Borland intends to produce a Win32
API for TPW? If so, when?

-- 
Nick de Kock, High Voltage Group        | Internet dekock@odie.ee.wits.ac.za    
Electrical Engineering, Wits University |                 or
Johannesburg, South Africa              |      dekock@shannon.ee.wits.ac.za
....Another Churchill quote pending...........
From: Steve_Goyette@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Goyette)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Re: Dbase libraries for Windows
Date: 18 Aug 92 09:40:00 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

Hi,

        As the person who origionally mentioned VxBase, I guess I should
probably give a little more info.  The best way to get the software (In your
situation) is to call them directly.  They have a BBS that they could probably
let you download from.  Anyway, their Voice number is (403) 489-5994 (CANADA)
and the person to whom you should speak is Terry.

        Hope this helps,


B.T.W., There fax line is at (403) 486-4335


--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Goyette                    |       Email : Steve_Goyette@MindLink.BC.CA
Software Engineer                |       Phone : (604) 421-8864
Abstract Automation Limited      |       Fax   : (604) 421-7722
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: mills@athena.lkg.dec.com (George Mills)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Re: Has anyone seen this OWL problem?
Date: 12 Aug 92 18:00:22 GMT

kmh@leland.Stanford.EDU (khanhmy hoang) writes:


>	My program using Borland's OWL (statically linked) worked perfectly
>	in Windows 3.0 and 3.1 when built using BC++ 3.0.
>	When built using BC++ 3.1, the program crashes in Windows 3.0 but
>	still works fine in Windows 3.1.

>	I did define WIN30 during compilation, and this should give me backward
>	compatibility. But this is not what I get.

>	Specifically, the Attr data member of a TListBox control has valid
>	values in Windows 3.1 but has 0's in Windows 3.0 (as watched in TDW).
>	Apparently Attr has an invalid address in 3.0 and this gives me the UAE.

>	Your help is much appreciated.

I've been having weirdness with TC++ 3.1 for 3.0 windows but not on the
TListBox. All works perfectly well on 3.1 windows. Some MetaFile calls
and some BitBlt's just unexplainably UAE. The problem is more releated to
3.0 being less robust than 3.1. I suspect perhaps in both yours and my case
that there is a minor bug in our code (or windows 3.0) that is floating around
and a different compiler can hide or show it up.
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: steve@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au (Steve Balogh (+61 3 565 4747))
Subject: Re: Help! Borland Help Compiler error
Organization: Monash University, Melbourne, AUSTRALIA
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 23:18:00 GMT

In article <SRA.92Aug18184717@nansen.ecs.soton.ac.uk> sra@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Stephen Adams) writes:
>I have just tried to use the help compiler (HC) that comes
>with BC++ 3.0.  I tried to use it on the example (HELPEX).
>I edited HELPEX.RTF using MS WORD 2.0, and I did very little
>editing on the screen that has the bitmaps by reference.
>Then HC gave me the error
>
>Error R2055: File HELPEX.RTF is not a usable RTF topic file
>
>This error will not go away....

This reminds me of the troubles I had interfacing the WP4W RTF output with the
help compiler. Lots of errors, and no positive results.

My solution has been to create and edit the actual RTF files themselves. I have
had no problems since.

My Method:

1. Create a template of an empty help page, but containing any RTF stuff needed
   for the page. Also include any font, and font size controls for headings.

2. Copy this template to a new file for each new help page required.

3. Fill in the blanks. You may need a reference card for the more common RTF
   commands. You would be surprised how few you actually need.

4. Use make to concatenate all of the individual RTF files and compile the 
   merged RTF file. I also include a program which generates various cross-
   reference and consistancy reports to help make sure that all hypertext
   links reference real help pages, browse sequences are in a logical order,etc.

Benefits:

1. The help compiler no longer complains.

2. You have initimate control over what is placed into the RTF files. You can
   eliminate lots of RTF stuff inserted by WP4W but apparently not required.

3. It's easy to create additional utilities to generate cross reference reports.

4. You can use any editor to create or modify your RTF files. You are not
   restricted to a particular editor running under Windows. I can continue to
   work on the help files on a PC which is not running Windows.

5. You can easily re-use help pages for other applications.

Disadvantages:

1. You have to learn the basics of the RTF format and some commands.

2. Ummmm? You tell me.


Regards,
    Steve

----_--_-_-_--_-__-_------_-__---_-___-_----_-____-_-_--__-_--_--___-_-_-_--__-_
Steve Balogh  VK3YMY   (Maths G.14)   | steve@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au
Monash University, Clayton Campus     |      37 54'38.8"S  145 07'47.1"E ...ICBM
Wellington Road, Clayton.  	      |      +61 3 565 4747 Voice (Office)
Melbourne, AUSTRALIA. 3168	      |      +61 3 565 4746 Fax
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: gregde@microsoft.com (Greg Demichillie)
Subject: Re: MFC under BCC?
Date: 14 Aug 92 17:23:01 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <1992Aug13.211344.10040@odi.com> ed@odi.com (Ed Schwalenberg) writes:
>In article <1992Aug11.020925.18514@microsoft.com> johnkal@microsoft.com (John Kallen) writes:
>
> With luck, a standard DOS/Win/OS-2 name-mangling will evolve. Until
> then, one will have to have sources to libraries, or compiler-vendor-dependent
> .LIB files (bleargh...)
>
>Let's assume that a standard name-mangling exists.  You're still in the soup
>unless object layout (alignment rules, location of vptrs, size of vtbls, etc)
>is identical and calling conventions are identical.

The fact the different vendors use different name mangling schemes is a
good thing precisely because of the point you make.  If we all had the
same mangling you would get strange run-time behavior instead of
link errors.  

-Greg

-- 
Greg DeMichillie          
gregde@microsoft.com      -- All opinions are mine, not Microsoft's --
From: dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Re: WINHELP.EXE replacement: summary and comments
Date: 18 Aug 92 18:03:46 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <_89m9t-.garyd@netcom.com> garyd@netcom.com (Gary Dietz) writes:
>F)  What is TPW?

Turbo Pascal for Windows - one of the best Windows development tools
I've ever used.  If you like Pascal, that is.

It's the Turbo Pascal 6.0 language, with the TurboVision libraries
replaced by ObjectWindows libraries - object classes designed to make
Windows programming less painful.
-- 
   |)  David Charlap           "I don't even represent myself
  /|_  dic5340@hertz.njit.edu   sometimes so NJIT is right out!.
 ((|,)
  ~|~  Hi! I am a .signature virus, copy me into your .signature file.
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: ed@odi.com (Ed Schwalenberg)
Subject: Re: MFC under BCC?
Organization: Object Design, Inc.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 21:13:44 GMT

In article <1992Aug11.020925.18514@microsoft.com> johnkal@microsoft.com (John Kallen) writes:

  Borland and Microsoft have chosen two different name-mangling schemes for
  symbols. As you mention, this is unfortunate as it makes linking to .LIB
  libraries (as opposed to libraries where the source is provided) impossible
  if the library was built with the "wrong" version.

  With luck, a standard DOS/Win/OS-2 name-mangling will evolve. Until
  then, one will have to have sources to libraries, or compiler-vendor-dependent
  .LIB files (bleargh...)

Let's assume that a standard name-mangling exists.  You're still in the soup
unless object layout (alignment rules, location of vptrs, size of vtbls, etc)
is identical and calling conventions are identical.
From: tabitha@vms.huji.ac.il
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Re: Dbase libraries for Windows
Date: 14 Aug 92 18:17:26 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem

In article <1992Aug13.103920.4927@shrike.und.ac.za>, bernstei@shrike.und.ac.za (Simon Bernstein) writes:
> Hi.  I am DESPARATELY trying to get hold of the VXBASE libraries that are being mentioned here.  I have no access to CompuServe, b
>
> Your answering this mayday call is appreciated !
>
>   - Simon
>
> Simon Bernstein
> University of Natal, Durban
> bernstei@shrike.und.ac.za
>
I'm in the same boat, with no access to the commercial stores of shareware.
Does anybody know where we can ftp vxbase?  In my case, i'd also like to find
wfw.zip.  thanks

tabitha hofland
hebrew university
tabitha@hujivms
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: johnkal@microsoft.com (John Kallen)
Subject: Re: MFC under BCC?
Date: 11 Aug 92 02:09:25 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Applications Division (WGA)

In article <59800002@otter.hpl.hp.com> slo@otter.hpl.hp.com (Steve Loughran) writes:
:
:However compilation ain't enough : I can't link to the library due to bad
:object file records in SAFXCW.LIB.
:A comparison of object files produced by MSC and BCC seems to indicate that
:they are using different name mangling conventions.
:
:I wouldn't be suprised if I'm going to have to recompile the entire 
:foundation class library to have a hope of getting a simple MFC app to
:work. I also get the sneaking suspicion that from now on sharing .obj files
:from MSC to BCC isnt going to be as easy as it was when I was just importing
:C functions.
:
:	-Steve

Borland and Microsoft have chosen two different name-mangling schemes for
symbols. As you mention, this is unfortunate as it makes linking to .LIB
libraries (as opposed to libraries where the source is provided) impossible
if the library was built with the "wrong" version.

With luck, a standard DOS/Win/OS-2 name-mangling will evolve. Until
then, one will have to have sources to libraries, or compiler-vendor-dependent
.LIB files (bleargh...)
_______________________________________________________________________________
 | |   |   |    |\ ||  /|\ |    "Stonehenge is very nutritious" - Migato Gami
 | |\ \|/ \|  * |/ ||/| |  |  
 | |\ /|\  |\ * |\ |  | |  |    Microsoft couldn't care less about what I say.
_|_|___|___|____|_\|__|_|__|____johnkal@microsoft.com__________________________



Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools,comp.os.ms-windows.misc,comp.os.os2.programmer
From: greg@thirdi.uucp (Greg Holmberg)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools,comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.misc,comp.software-eng,comp.os.ms-windows.misc,comp.os.msdos.programmer,comp.programming
Subject: Re: Robust Config Mgmt system wanted for MSwindows&UNIX
Date: 14 Aug 92 21:56:18 GMT
Reply-To: greg@thirdi.UUCP (Greg Holmberg)
Organization: Third Eye Software, Menlo Park, CA

I also forgot this Unix CM company:

	TeamNet
	TeamOne
	Santa Clara, CA
	408 area code

This product, like ClearCase, uses its own Unix filesystem.
From: sra@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Stephen Adams)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Help! Borland Help Compiler error
Date: 18 Aug 92 17:47:17 GMT
Organization: Southampton University Computer Science

I have just tried to use the help compiler (HC) that comes
with BC++ 3.0.  I tried to use it on the example (HELPEX).
I edited HELPEX.RTF using MS WORD 2.0, and I did very little
editing on the screen that has the bitmaps by reference.
Then HC gave me the error

Error R2055: File HELPEX.RTF is not a usable RTF topic file

This error will not go away.  I subsequently deleted that
help page in desperation but it still will not go away.
About half of the cross-references no longer come up green
and underlined like they used to, even on pages that I have
never touched.

How do I find out what is wrong?
--
Stephen Adams                           Email: S.R.Adams@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Electronics and Computer Science        Tel: 0703 593649
University of Southampton               Fax: 0703 593045 
Southampton  SO9 5NH,  UK
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer,comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: ricardo@colombo.puug.pt (Ricardo Nuno Silva)
Subject: Windows front-end for rn archiver
Originator: ricardo@colombo
Organization: PUUG - Grupo Portugues de Utilizadores de Sistemas UNIX(tm)
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 14:29:42 GMT

I'm building an ARCHIVER FOR USENET NEWS ARTICLES and I'm LOOKING
FOR someone interested in developing a front-end in TURBO PASCAL
FOR WINDOWS (preferably) or VISUAL BASIC.

IT CAN BE USED BY 'rn' USERS (and 'trn' too, I suppose) because this is
the reader I use.
However if anyone out there wants to send me some demo files (i.e. saved
articles) so I can see the headers structure I could think of future 
versions...

It goes like this: you save a bunch of the daily news into a single file.
You transfer this file into your PC and THE ARCHIVING PROCESS begins:
the articles file is exploded into single files and these are archived
according to its subject. Log files are created for every newsgroup
referred in the articles to SHOW DISCUSSION THREADS. These logs will
also ease the process of conducting a SUBJECT SEARCH.

I'm using Turbo Pascal V6.0 to create small UNIX-like tools that 
work sequencially on the data in a pipeline-fashion.
I'm also using some of DOS 5.0 commands like SORT (on the assumption that
those boys at Microsoft worked hard on optimizing the sorting algorithm ;-).

The archiver will be distributed as PUBLIC DOMAIN SOFTWARE.


Please E-MAIL YOUR REPLY (or any comment/question you have) to the address
below as I usually don't read this group.

Thanks in advance.

Ricardo.
========================================================================
Ricardo Nuno Silva                     | e-mail: ricardo@colombo.puug.pt
Fac. Ciencias da Univ. Lisboa          |
Portugal                               | May the Net be with you ;-)
From: venkataraman@misvax.mis.arizona.edu (Remesh Venkataraman)
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
Subject: Visual Basic - Paradox Engine, Any Experiences ?
Date: 17 Aug 92 05:54:00 GMT
Distribution: usa,local
Organization: University of Arizona MIS Department
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Any experiences with accessing the PXENGINE DLL's from Visual Basic ?. 

-ramesh
========================================================================
Standard Disclaimers Apply
University of Arizona			
Management Information Systems

E-mail:
venkataraman@misvax.mis.ariona.edu       
Sprint:
(602)-621-2748
========================================================================
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools,comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.misc,comp.software-eng,comp.os.ms-windows.misc,comp.os.msdos.programmer,comp.programming
From: ash@netcom.com (Ashvin Patel)
Subject: Re: Robust Config Mgmt system wanted for MSwindows&UNIX
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 20:54:38 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

>I also forgot this Unix CM company:
> 
>        TeamNet
>        TeamOne
>        Santa Clara, CA
>        408 area code
> 
>This product, like ClearCase, uses its own Unix filesystem.


    It just so happens that I have been looking into TeamNet and ClearCase.

    The Product is called TeamNet, the company's name is "TeamOne Systems".

    The correct address is;

    710 Lakeway Drive,
    Suit 100
    Sunnyvale, CA 94086

    Tel: 408-730-3500

    TeamNet as been around for over five years now, and is being used
    extensively by many large corporations. From what I understand about
    ClearCase, they have only been around for about 18 months and
    are they have only just finished beta testing on the Sun and HP platforms.

    As to the use of filesystems, TeamNet seems to have a more transparent
    and easier to use filesystem than ClearCase. ClearCase requires greater
    effort to setup and use. The method of setting up source baselines
    and workareas for TeamNet was just far easier and required less thought
    than ClearCase. This doesn't mean that TeamNet lacks functionality.
    TeamNet seemed to be a more "natural" way of working, and more
    intuitive.

    Lastly, TeamNet's architecture seems to be more mature and better
    tought out, there seems to be alot of growing room designed into
    the product. The underlying system is built on top of an OODB, which
    a future product called the "Process Automation Kit" will capitalize on.
    ClearCase to me seemed like a DSEE clone, that just wont scale in large
    environments and wont grow with a company. The underlying architure
    would probably need to change drastically for tha product to grow and
    change over the years, especially there DB, which is based on a
    relational database that just does not seem suited to handle the type
    of meta-data required for a CM system.

    (Whoops, I didn't mean this to sound like a comparison, I got slightly
     carried away).


Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: John E Salter <salter@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: unsigned long for VBASIC
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 22:15:13 GMT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]



How can one handle the problem of not having an the "unsigned integer"
type in visual basic?  I am calling a functions in a DLL which returns
a unsigned long value.  I need to store this value in a structure and
pass the structure as a parameter in another DLL function call.
my failure to this is because Visual Basic doesn't support the unsigned
type.  Is there a way around this problem?
Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools
From: mariusk@idt.unit.no (Marius Kjeldahl)
Subject: Re: Has anyone seen this OWL problem?
Reply-To: mariusk@idt.unit.no (Marius Kjeldahl)
Organization: Div. of CS & Telematics, Norwegian Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 06:42:53 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.193337.13958@centerline.com>, cparker@centerline.com (Charles Parker) writes:
|> In article 28348@leland.Stanford.EDU, kmh@leland.Stanford.EDU (khanhmy hoang) writes:
|> >	My program using Borland's OWL (statically linked) worked perfectly
|> >	in Windows 3.0 and 3.1 when built using BC++ 3.0.
|> >	When built using BC++ 3.1, the program crashes in Windows 3.0 but
|> >	still works fine in Windows 3.1.
|> >
|> >	I did define WIN30 during compilation, and this should give me backward
|> >	compatibility. But this is not what I get.
|> >

You are probably sending some wrong parameters (like an invalid handle
or NULL pointer) to the Windows kernel. Windows 3.1 has more checking
for validy of parameters than 3.0. You should try to obtain a program
that logs and displays these errors to the kernel. I've seen one that
comes with the Microsoft compiler 7.0, called DBWin, it`s great for
detecting such errors...

Marius

Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.tools