HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: phil@tellabs.com (Phil Gagner)
Subject: Re: UP Trip
Organization: Tellabs, Lisle,IL
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:00:25 GMT

In article <1993Jan06.005009.2502@rose.com> rob.twilt@rose.com (rob twilt) writes:
>
>Date Entered: 01-05-93 19:41
>
>P(G>The four day New Years weekend provided the opportunity for the
>P(G>second trip of the year. Our starting point is Gwinn Michigan and
>P(G>plan a route through the east central UP. The trip starts like most -
>P(G>leave Chicago in rain or fog and arrive with plenty of lake effect.
>P(G>Gwinn greeted us with 6 to 8 inches. This was the least amount of
>P(G>snow for the whole trip with all other locations measuring around 2
>P(G>feet.
>
>Phil, it sounds like a interesting trip.  It could have been worse.  At
>least you had lots of snow and you didn't become a member of the Polar
>Bear club.
>
>You have to help your Canadian friends and tell us where UP is.  I've
>tried to think of all the states that get snow but I don't know what UP
>stands for.  What is DNR?  I thought possibly Dept. of Natural
>Resources.  Are they responsible for grooming trails throughout the
>States?
>
>                            Rob

Rob,

	The U.P. is Michigan's Upper Peninsula. This area borders
Wisconsin and extends to Lake Superior. It's a popular sledding
destination due to heavy lake effect snows produced by Superior.

Your correct about the DNR: the Dept. of Natural Resources. In Michigan,
they underwrite the expenses for grooming trails - $250 per mile
for the year. They also cover aprox 1/2 the cost of the groomers
themselves. The policy is to groom a trail twice a week, no matter
how much traffic it gets. As a result, during the hoildays, the
trails are beat, and during periods of light trafic, trails that
don't need grooming get groomed anyway. This is the policy of
Michigan and many states (Wisconsin comes to mind) have snowmobile
clubs as the principle keepers of the trails.

Phil
-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                 	   o         o
			     \	   /	     "Another 1,000,000,000,
			       \ /	        000,000,000,000,000,
			 o-----<O>-----o        000,000,000,000,000
Phil Gagner		       / \	      of these and we're
phil@tellabs.com	     /     \          talkin' serious fun!"   
!uunet!tellab5!phil	   o         o	
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: dougr@meaddata.com (Doug Ritter)
Newsgroups: alt.snowmobiles
Subject: Re: Indy XLT
Date: 12 Jan 1993 18:31:31 GMT
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: birch.meaddata.com

In article <1isqc4INNkum@ua.d.umn.edu> dspooner@ua.d.umn.edu (dave spooner) writes:
>
>Has anybody else heard that you can safely advance the timing on the XLT 6
>degrees as long as your careful about what gas you use??  I've heard that by
>doing this you can really make the XLT scream in the low end??  Any comments?
>
>Last week I was in about 6 inches of powder on a lake and outran an RXL
>(91)..  I was pretty suprised.  Although on hardpack I doubt I'd win...
>
>Dave Spooner

6 degrees sounds like an awful lot - if I had an XLT, I'd want to see it
done to *someone*else's* sled before I did it to mine! ;-)

But then, I guess once you've heard that cute little "pinging" sound that
detonation makes, you tend to be a little conservative.

Anybody heard anything else about the XCR triple yet?

--
Doug Ritter (dougr@meaddata.com)
Newsgroups: alt.snowmobiles
From: don@tellabs.com (Donald Leonard)
Subject: Re: Indy XLT
Organization: Tellabs, Lisle,IL
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:09:55 GMT

In article <1isqc4INNkum@ua.d.umn.edu> dspooner@ua.d.umn.edu (dave spooner) writes:
>
>Has anybody else heard that you can safely advance the timing on the XLT 6
>degrees as long as your careful about what gas you use??  I've heard that by
>doing this you can really make the XLT scream in the low end??  Any comments?
>
>Last week I was in about 6 inches of powder on a lake and outran an RXL
>(91)..  I was pretty suprised.  Although on hardpack I doubt I'd win...
>
>Dave Spooner
>

Nop... never heard that one. I have heard the compression ratio is
down quite a bit from the 650 though. Like say, 110 vs. 120 on the
650's. You might ask around and see about shaving the head down.

I have a buddy who rides an XLT. The sled runs strong... I've told him 
I'd wait until the end of the season then start asking around your 
local perf. shops and talk to others who have XLT's and see what 
works best. They run strong right outa the box... why mess with it???
Never satisfied!! :-)

My friend has run against other XLT's with pipes. The pipes make a
similar HP improvement that you'd find with the 650's. A piped sled
will pull him outa the hole and end up with a 5-7 sled lead. Thats 
pretty consistant with two 650's with the same configuration. Like
usual, pipes would be the best investment but again - I'd wait and
talk to a lot of people before plunking down 450.00 for a set a pipes.


don
-- 

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Donald T. Leonard	|Honda Sabre	| "Bumpy trails? 
don@tellabs.com		|		|  Don't get mad get rad!"
..!uunet!tellab5!don	|Indy 650	|
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.snowmobiles
From: pjp@cray.com (Patrick Perro)
Subject: Re: Indy XLT
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: 12 Jan 93 11:47:38 CST

Dave

I have heard nothing about the timing advance but I too have out-run a '91 RXL,
on hardpack at about 0 degrees. My buddy has this sled and we were out riding on
Gull Lake near Brainerd. I don't know if I would have beaten him if it were a
race from a stand still because of the great midrange of the RXL but we were
just out having fun and found a place where we could open them up. The XLT was a
slow walk faster with an indicated speed somewhere around 106 or 108 mph (hard
to tell when the speedo only reads to 100. One great point is that with near
equal performance between these two sleds, I was at least $1.00 cheaper at the
pumps with the XLT. What a sled!! I LOVE IT!!! 

Well, it's almost noon and it's snowing like crazy outside! 6" of new snow with
another 6 coming! I'm going home to do some riding!!



=================================================================================

Patrick J. Perro              Indy 580 XLT                 The comments listed
Cray Research Inc.             				   above are my own. Not
655F Lone Oak Dr.  					   that of my employer
Eagan, MN. 55121					   (unless specifically
pjp@fig.cray.com					   noted).

=================================================================================
From: posl@btma74.nohost.nodomain
Newsgroups: alt.news-media
Subject: jlk********
Date: 5 Jan 93 16:23:20 GMT
Reply-To: posl@btma74.nohost.nodomain ()


lklkhkjh
From: ma@igc.apc.org (Micha Peled)
Newsgroups: alt.news-media
Subject: BAY AREA Censored
Date: 6 Jan 93 19:01:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:cdp:1638300011:000:1639
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!ma    Jan  6 11:01:00 1993


For Immediate Release           For more information, contact:
January 8, 1993                         Dan Kalb at (415)
441-2559

Did We Miss Something Important?

	Media Alliance (MA), the media watchdog group, announced
the start of the fourth annual BAY AREA Censored (BAC) project --
designed to select the top underreported or ignored stories of
1992.  In considering nominations, a panel of judges will rely on
the public for submissions of BAY AREA stories that deserved
greater coverage.
	"This project allows the consumer to critique the
product," said Micha Peled, executive director of Media Alliance,
a 2,800-member Bay Area organization of investigative journalists,
freelance writers and filmmakers, and citizens interested in
improving the media.  "It enables BAY AREA readers to tell their
newspapers where they've gone wrong in a way that's constructive
and gets serious attention."
	Stories eligible for BAC may have been reported only in
a small publication or buried in the back pages of a major daily.
In all instances, however, they must be of considerable
significance to the BAY AREA.  "Bay Area Censored helps newspapers
hear from the communities they serve," explained Peled.
	Journalists are encouraged to submit their own work if it
is an important story that didn't get picked up by other news
outlets.  BAC is modeled after the national Project Censored,
which annually highlights the top ten censored stories in the
country.
	Send Bay Area Censored submissions by March 3rd to:
		Bay Area Censored -- Media Alliance Fort Mason,
		bldg. D San Francisco, CA  94123
	For more information, call (415) 441-2557.
Xref: sparky alt.news-media:1715 alt.politics.org.misc:30
From: Clinton-HQ@Campaign92.Org (Clinton/Gore '92)
Newsgroups: alt.news-media,alt.politics.org.misc
Subject: CLINTON: Clinton phone conversation with Russian President
Date: 5 Jan 1993 00:47:23 -0500
Organization: MIT Artificial Intelligence Lab
NNTP-Posting-Host: life.ai.mit.edu


Posted by the Office of the President-elect
Posted: January 04, 1993


Transcript of George Stephanopoulos Daily Press Briefing
concerning Clinton phone conversation with Russian President
Boris Yeltsin:

                         Little Rock, AR
                         January 4, 1993


President-elect Clinton had a phone conversation this morning with
President Yeltsin. It was a very good conversation. It lasted about
twenty minutes. 

He congratulated Presidents Bush and Yeltsin on their historic
achievement in the START Treaty. He also pledged to do everything
he could to get early ratification of this treaty.

They both authorized for Mr. Kozyrev and Secretary of State
designate Warren Christopher to begin discussions as soon as
possible on setting up a bilateral dialogue on START and other
issues and also on setting up plans for an early meeting between
Yeltsin and Clinton.

Yeltsin also indicated that he supported the U.S. position on
Yugoslavia.





Distribution:
  Clinton News >internet:c-news-distr@campaign92.org
  Clinton Foreign >internet:c-foreign-distr@campaign92.org
  Clinton Volunteers >internet:clinton-volunteers@campaign92.org

Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: jk@panix.com (Jim Kalb)
Subject: Re: Time to break up the US? (was: Re: apparently a dilemma)
Organization: Institute for the Human Sciences
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 20:10:56 GMT

In <1993Jan11.024218.21875@athena.mit.edu> norris@athena.mit.edu (Richard A Chonak) writes:

>Has anyone given any thought to the possibility of breaking up the US into
>several countries of more reasonable size?  

It's hard to imagine much support for this.  Abstract American
nationality is one of the few things we Americans have in common that
rise above day-to-day concerns, so people hang on to it tenaciously.

It would be odd in this newsgroup to criticize a proposal on the grounds
it is not immediately practicable, though.  Quite possibly, arguing for
such a measure would be a way of dramatizing the need for public values,
such as those you mention, that go beyond what we now have:

>Here are some possible benefits (just off the top of my head, so to speak):
>	-- each new nation would be more homogeneous in culture and values
>	-- the break-up would be an instant step toward greater subsidiarity
>	-- no more flag-worship: the new nations would identify patriotism 
>	   more with place and people, less with 'democratic' ideology

Quite possibly the proposal would seem sensible as part of an overall
program designed to advance the sorts of things you mention.  As such,
it might have the virtue (apart from any practical benefits if actually
carried out) of drawing attention to your cause.
-- 
Jim Kalb (jk@panix.com)
"We are, I know not how, double in ourselves, so that what we believe we
disbelieve, and cannot rid ourselves of what we condemn."  (Montaigne)
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (John Rickert)
Subject: Re: apparently a dilemma
Organization: Vanderbilt University Mathematics Department
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 06:56:59 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.175345.26614@panix.com> newsome@panix.com (Richard Newsome) writes8.062824.12094@news.vanderbilt.edu> rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (John Rickert) writes:
>
>Revolution against who or what? Excessive taxation and debasement of the
>currency? Political correctness in the schools? Nutty puritanical activists
>who make war on cigarette smokers and fur-wearers? Struggle with these
>forces would probably take the form of civil war rather than revolution, don't
>you think? 


   Good questions.  Please allow me to offer thanks here to the others who
replied on this topic.  If I could make an excuse, which is something 
generally to be avoided, I would say that it was pretty late at night when
I made the post, and now it is not so clear to me what prompted it.  On
the other hand, if I could try to be somewhat less vague, I would say,
in answer to the first question, revolution against television culture
(proximately) and against the French revolution (more remotely).

   Thank you for your consideration.


John Rickert
rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu

Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: jk@panix.com (Jim Kalb)
Subject: Re: apparently a dilemma
Organization: Institute for the Human Sciences
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 17:51:18 GMT

In <1993Jan8.062824.12094@news.vanderbilt.edu> rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (John Rickert) writes:

>   Being a (Burkean) conservative, I am opposed to revolution.  On the
>other hand, things seem to be approaching a condition in which revolution
>appears to be the only available recourse, given my deeper beliefs.  More
>specifically, I have little hope in the culture in the United States today,
>and it appears to have taken hold so tenaciously that the usual means will
>not be of much avail.

What sort of revolution do you have in mind?  Surely not the extralegal
seizure of power by an armed Burkean elite, followed by the forcible
implementation of their political and social program.  Pascal's comment
that tyranny is the attempt to get in one way what can only be gotten in
another is very much in point on that idea.

If don't like the way of life you see around you, my suggestion is that
you and likeminded people develop a better way of life.  It's still
possible in this country as a legal and practical matter to live
differently from the majority (consider the Mennonites, the Hasids or
the New York homosexual community).  If your beliefs about how people
should live are valid, doing so would benefit you and your family and
friends immediately; it also might possibly work as a way of beginning a
general reform of culture, which political revolution clearly would not.

Maybe your point, though, is that a radical break with your society (for
example, choosing to associate mostly with people who disagree with the
goals that are publicly accepted as authoritative, cutting your
connections with big organizations, homeschooling your children, or
whatever) seems somehow unBurkean.  It's certainly not what Burke would
have considered ideal, since he thought that man was a social animal and
he didn't like ideological factions.  On the other hand, he took facts
very seriously and recognized that necessity can sometimes justify
revolution of one kind or another.  For Burke, I think, society is the
condition of achieving the goal of human nature but it is not the goal
itself and it does not create the goal.

So I suppose my advice is to cheer up and join with other people in
living as well as you can under the conditions you have to deal with.
"Living well" may include politics, but in matters of culture it is not
primarily politics.
-- 
Jim Kalb (jk@panix.com)
"We are, I know not how, double in ourselves, so that what we believe we
disbelieve, and cannot rid ourselves of what we condemn."  (Montaigne)
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: deane@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Subject: RE: Hello!, ENR, etc
Reply-To: deane@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 16:15:47 GMT

Let me assure Andy that the ENR is not a racist plot to take over Europe.
The ENR would not disagree with any of your points regarding Christianity
and Europe. The ENR are not historians trying to resurrect a ficticious
pagan past. They are intellectuals  who believe that the West is doomed,
and who are drawing on the pagan past of Europe for inspiration, with the 
intention of creating a spiritual rejuvenation in Europe and the creation
of a new civilization. They do not believe in Christianity. Not suprising:
the majority in Europe no longer do. The look to paganism, and not to
Christianity, for the reasons I have stated. As for culture vs. racial
allegience: this is not an issue. The ENR isn't "hiding" anything. They
have made no secret of the fact that both race and culture are important
to the identity of a people. The ENR simply insists that the cultural
matters are more important, since they are, after all , philosophers.
Why do you insist on seeing a "rejection " or Christianity when most
of these writers have never "accepted" it in the first place? They also
make no secret of the fact that that they are searching for a European
faith, pure or otherwise. As to racism: the ENR sees two kinds, both of
which it rejects. The first kind consists of trying to eliminate any group
which is different from one's own. The second kind consists of the desire
to make everybody alike, or to make everybody like one's own group.
The ENR sees monotheistic religions, capitalism, socialism, and liberalism
as being potentially, and usually in practice, racist in the second sense.
Blood is usually not spilled, but cultural genocide takes place. This is
the logic of universalistic systems. The more familiar first type of 
racism is exemplified by the Nazis, and other unpleasant types of 
systems which attempt bloody genocide. As to the comparison to British
Israelism, there simply is no comparison.

could someone please give me some info on Integrims? I think I've said
all I can say about the ENR. This newsgroup is supposed to be about
Integrism after all.

David Matthew Deane
From: seth@mivax.mc.duke.edu (Judge Not)
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
Subject: Re: Integrism
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:50:00 GMT
Organization: Duke University Medical Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1ifmedINNgq6@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, bp847@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jovan Weismiller) writes...

>Nils had originally suggested nmaming it alt.integrism, but JTJ said he didn't 
>know the term. For those outside the _Catholic_ counterrevolutionary sphere,
>Integrism is an ordinary term for the ideology which places Christ the King
>at the head of society, state, culture and civilization. Thus, it stands in
>opposition to all forms of the revolution which place the people, history, 
>reason, humanism, race, etc. at the head.

Sounds like Christian Anarchy to me.
(anarchy=no government, not chaos)

If Christ is your only authority, then you wouldn't do anything the state
tells you to do (unless it coincidentally agreed with Him).

Leads to contradiction if Christ tells you to obey the gov't.
(I'm no biblical authority--what's the Word?)
From: bp847@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jovan Weismiller)
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
Subject: Integrism
Date: 6 Jan 1993 22:28:29 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: bp847@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jovan Weismiller)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Since I seem to have been the impetus behind the founding of this bbs 
(thanks to Nils, who actually got it online!! I'm such a novice, I didn't know
how to go about it!), I thought maybe I should contribute. 

Nils had originally suggested nmaming it alt.integrism, but JTJ said he didn't 
know the term. For those outside the _Catholic_ counterrevolutionary sphere,
Integrism is an ordinary term for the ideology which places Christ the King
at the head of society, state, culture and civilization. Thus, it stands in
opposition to all forms of the revolution which place the people, history, 
reason, humanism, race, etc. at the head.

Some major integrist writers include FR Denis Fahey, Charles Maurras, Rene'
de la Tour du Pin, Donoso Cortes, and Jaime Balmes. Current publications in-
clude (in English) The Remnant (USA), Apropos (Scotland) and Christian Order
(England). From an Anglican (Anglo-Catholic) point of view there are Church
and King and PRAG, both from the UK. In French, la Gazette Royale and FIL are
good and l'Alliance Chretienne unites 26 different integrist groups. I hope 
to post a mailing list of counterrevolutionary, integrist, royalist groups and 
publications.

Regards.
-- 
Jovan Weismiller           E-Mail: ae 852@yfn.ysu.edu
PO Box 1973                       Vive le Roi!     
Lawrence KS  66044            A bas la Revolution!  
913.842.7160                     Vive Louis XX!
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: drw@euclid.mit.edu (Dale R. Worley)
Subject: Re: Time to break up the US? (was: Re: apparently a dilemma)
Organization: MIT Dept. of Tetrapilotomy, Cambridge, MA, USA
	<DRW.93Jan11231637@euclid.mit.edu>
	<1993Jan12.185154.21332@news.vanderbilt.edu>
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 22:10:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.185154.21332@news.vanderbilt.edu> rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (John Rickert) writes:
   I strenuously disagree.  I think we need to get _back_ to the
   Constitution.  If anything, we have been drifting further and further
   from it for the last forty years.  We live now under a government that
   is largely judge-made in its notions and bureaucratic in its operations.  
   This is not the kind of government the Constitution establishes.

Well, what exactly would you change?  For a political advocacy group,
there's incredibly little theat passes here to tell what
"counter-revolutionaries" thing about *anything*.  All I've seen are a
lot of references to obscure European political tracts and vague
references to "undoing the French Revolution".  The best I can tell is
that you want some sort of fine-grained, hierarchical system that
resembles feudalism.

My reference for the previous post was the original subject "Time to
break up the US?", and I was noting that few people in the US would
like that.

Dale
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: jk@panix.com (Jim Kalb)
Subject: Re: me again
Organization: Institute for the Human Sciences
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 01:23:48 GMT

deane@binah.cc.brandeis.edu writes:

>I think what you arre stating is the "esoteric" side present in all
>religions. It is the "exoteric" side of religion that most people are
>familiar with. Exoteric shares Gaf! Read: Exoteric religion shares many
>common features with secular ideologies.

People have to have some sort of systematic understanding of things, at
least implicitly.  To my mind, one advantage of the religious
understanding is that it can and does include the realization that the
world transcends our understanding of it without falling into
scepticism.  (See, e.g., I Corinthians 13, viii-xii.)  The absence of
such a realization is the outstanding failing of secular ideologies.

I would agree that it is possible to adhere to a religion in the same
manner as a secular ideologue adheres to his system.
-- 
Jim Kalb (jk@panix.com)
"We are, I know not how, double in ourselves, so that what we believe we
disbelieve, and cannot rid ourselves of what we condemn."  (Montaigne)
Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter
From: rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu (John Rickert)
Subject: apparently a dilemma
Organization: Vanderbilt University Mathematics Department
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 06:28:24 GMT


   Being a (Burkean) conservative, I am opposed to revolution.  On the
other hand, things seem to be approaching a condition in which revolution
appears to be the only available recourse, given my deeper beliefs.  More
specifically, I have little hope in the culture in the United States today,
and it appears to have taken hold so tenaciously that the usual means will
not be of much avail.  Advice?


John Rickert				    Visualize whirled peas.
rickertj@athena.cas.vanderbilt.edu	       -- on some bumpersticker


Newsgroups: alt.revolution.counter