HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: "robert radford" <robert.radford@canrem.com>
Subject: benedikt's cyberspace
Reply-To: "robert radford" <robert.radford@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: alt
Date: 11 Jan 93 21:08:02 EST

 PCM> (I picture a globe (or infinite plane) with representations of all 
 PCM> the data on internet and all of the interconnections, with major 
 PCM> sites (like wuarchive or ab20) represented by huge, bright objects, 
 PCM> which, of course are made up of smaller objects, and so on down to 
 PCM> where you can access individual pieces of data.

The difficulty with this picture is that relationships would not map one 
to one with real world physical relationships so that a site with some 
dedicated lines might be closer logically to another site yet a sight 
physically in between might be logically farther because of the paths to 
reach it. Where all sites were interconnected but with differing 
complexities, you would have a difficult time finding the shortest path 
and nearness to something would depend on where you were coming from not 
how far away you are.

---
 * Freddie 1.2 * Genie: R.L.Radford  Compuserve: 76354,535                  Other: Robert.Radford@canrem.com   
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: dragon@angus.mi.org (John Lussmyer)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: Re: benedikt's cyberspace
Date: 12 Jan 93 14:23:23 GMT
Reply-To: dragon@angus.mi.org
Organization: North Star BBS

"robert radford" <robert.radford@canrem.com> writes:

>  PCM> (I picture a globe (or infinite plane) with representations of all 
>  PCM> the data on internet and all of the interconnections, with major 
>  PCM> sites (like wuarchive or ab20) represented by huge, bright objects, 
>  PCM> which, of course are made up of smaller objects, and so on down to 
>  PCM> where you can access individual pieces of data.
> 
> The difficulty with this picture is that relationships would not map one 
> to one with real world physical relationships so that a site with some 
> dedicated lines might be closer logically to another site yet a sight 
> physically in between might be logically farther because of the paths to 
> reach it. Where all sites were interconnected but with differing 
> complexities, you would have a difficult time finding the shortest path 
> and nearness to something would depend on where you were coming from not 
> how far away you are.

 
Why would you bother using Geographical position as part of the mapping?
The only thing that matters in such a mapping is the relative 
net-location.  The physical location of the computer is irrelevant.  
The systems that would be "close" to you would be the ones you are
directly connected to.  I could see the net as a vast 3 dimensional
web of interconnected nodes.  Each node might define how they "look" 
to a cyberspace user.  That could get really interesting...
(Has anyone else read and enjoyed the book "True Names" by Vernor Vinge?)

--
John Lussmyer (dragon@angus.mi.org)
North Star BBS, Royal Oak, MI --------------------------------------------+-
From: srl@terminus.ericsson.se (Steve Langstaff)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: Re: Definition of Cyberspace
Date: 8 Jan 93 09:35:02 GMT
Reply-To: srl@terminus.ericsson.se
Distribution: world
Organization: Camtec Electronics (Ericsson), Leicester, England

In article 93Jan7222056@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu, redline@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Bullet in the Head) writes:
|> In article <1993Jan7.232537.4673@csus.edu> arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu (Arthur Chandler) writes:
[snip]

|> >     3) Is a disk full of information a part of cyberspace even if it
                              ^^^^^^^^^^^
|> >   sitting on the shelf, unconnected to a computer?
                             ^^^^^^^^^^^
|> 
|> Once again, I don't believe so.  It's all 1's and 0's until you do
|> something with it.  A disk full of information is just that: a bunch
|> of information.

I don't know if it is a formal definition, but I thought that if you don't do
anything with the 1's and 0's then the disk is full of *data*. If only becomes
*information* when you interpret it (so you connect it to a computer...). 

|>                  Cyberspace involves *live* information, stuff you can
|> shuffle and alter at will.
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

What if you don't own the information? Attempting to alter the stuff may result
in serious repercussions, if Gibson's *black ICE* actually exists.

[snip]


---

| Steve Langstaff - Ericsson CAMTEC |
From: lm011@rrz.Uni-Koeln.DE (Alexander Tuchacek)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: VRship Hamburg: Participate
Date: 11 Jan 1993 12:39:26 GMT
Organization: Regional Computing Center, University of Cologne
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: rs1.rrz.uni-koeln.de
Keywords: Send Sounds

Call for international participation in new art/science project.
KNOWBOTIC RESEARCH
Simulation Room -Mosaic of Mobile Sound Data
Hamburg, 5.2 - 20.2.93
We will be showing a VR installation in February at
the MEDIALE93 - Festival for Media Arts and Media Future - in
Hamburg, Germany. The installation, housed in the freight ship Cap
San Diego in Hamburg - harbour, has three main areas.
Section one is a sophisticated, walk - in data - base  utilising a
collection of sound samples from around the world, which will be
used to produce a virtual 'sound room'.  The sound data will
correspond to the second section,  a physical room, where visitors
will be able to navigate through the space with the aid of a mobile
ultrasonic sensor and an artificial eye display and activate the data 
to a realtime-concert.
The action of the visitors, within  this 'virtual organism,' will be
displayedon a video screen shown in a control room area (the third
area).
We welcome your participation for the international sound - data -
base: To participate in this international project we need from you a
6 second long sound sample, a cultural statement, reflecting
your personal attitude towards the "world". Please send this via
email or ftp. (aiff, wave, next formats)
All participants and institutions will be credited in a publicly
displayed database during the exhibition.
For more information by email from: kr+cf@khm.uni-koeln.de
Thank you for your support - KNOWBOTIC RESEARCH
From: ares@terapin.com (Ted Mazzoli)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: OMNI interview- Robert E. Kahn
Date: 8 Jan 93 23:08:45 PST
Organization: BBS

Has anyone here read the recent interview in Omni with Robert E. Kahn?
He is supposed to be in charge of 5 test beds of an actual computer net, funded
by the government
they call it a Gigabit network or something
it seems a lot like the net described in David Brins Earth
the Omni issue was Dec. 1992
From: mustang@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Paul Christopher Miranda (I love Cheese))
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: Re: Benedikt's Cyberspace
Date: 9 Jan 93 23:10:48 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <8415@news.duke.edu> tcamp@acpub.duke.edu (Ted A. Campbell) writes:
>
>But (Benedikt is right on this point) the case for a widespread 
>network of cyberspace depends on just this sort of interposition.
>I suspect that it's an unnecessary interposition, and that 
>machines will (and presently can) connect almost instantaneously
>throughout the world. If this is true, though, then cyberspace
>falls more in the area of art (nothing wrong with that) than
>technology. 

>Ted A. Campbell
>Duke Divinity School
>tcamp@acpub.duke.edu

hmm.... I think that a time delay when moving from point to point in C-space 
is not the issue, but awareness of motion through C-space.. if you want to
be able to navigate unknown territory in the real world or C-space, you must
be aware of your movements or you will become "lost".. there are tools to
figure out where you are (street signs and login messages), but virually 
prevents any intuitive sense of your surroundings, and, I think that C-space
should be as intuitive as possible.. of course, once you know certain areas
you start to take shortcuts, but for early, general use, a sense of movement
is essential to the kind of data interface I have in mind. (I picture a 
globe (or infinite plane) with representations of all the data on internet
and all of the interconnections, with major sites (like wuarchive or ab20) 
represented by huge, bright objects, which, of course are made up of smaller
objects, and so on down to where you can access individual pieces of data.
I see gopher and ftp as crude beginnings towards this..)

oh well, enough rambling (ever notice that discussions of C-space turn people's
 verbosity up about 5 notches ?)


-- 
"I have feelings too, I just choose to  | Paul Miranda  likes cheese 
 to hide them underneath bitter denial" | mustang@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
-- Ms. Musso on "Parker Lewis" (FOX TV) | -- THIS SPACE FOR RENT -- 
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: noir@netcom.com (Noel Ang)
Subject: Re: Cyberpunk Stories
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 09:44:44 GMT

In article <JBrandt-050193081741@aaa.uoregon.edu> JBrandt@AAA.UOregon.EDU
(Argus) writes:

>Hi Chris,
>Have you read Bruce Sterling's new print book "The Hacker Crackdown"? Yeah,
>its print rather than text files, and you have to pay for it, but if
>stories about hackers and phreaks interest you, especially as related to
>their run-in's with the law, this books just what you want. The whole

The numbers for "The Hacker Crackdown" are 055308058-X.  I've got mine on
order at the local Waldenbooks.

---

  noel ang        |"Exercise Two:
  noir@netcom.com | There is a field of grain, each stalk perfect, which is
                  | a field of men.  There is that which is perfect in all
                  | men, common to all, and to find that thing and touch it
                  | is to transform all men.  Now ask: is perfection
                  | certainty, and are we only perfect when we are dead?"
                  |             --from "Queen of Angels", Greg Bear
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: sosc1033@wc17.writer.yorku.ca (Stefan Myrskog)
Subject: VR in Usenet
Keywords: How possible is it?
Organization: York University
Distribution: on
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 18:51:31 GMT



	In the VR environment, what are the possibilities of integrating  
VR with Usenet?  Although this would take massive amount of data space,  
does anyone think we will ever reach that level of data storage techniques  
to make this possible?  
	What would a VR Usenet be like?  What are some possible  
advantages? 
	Using it as an incredible extension to video phones,  we could   
conduct entire meetings through such a network and even be able to show  
off new designs within the VR without ever having to build any components.
	
	There could be some obvious disadvantages.  As other people have  
expressed their concerns, it would be possible for gamers to create a VR  
D&D dungeon, for multi users.  HOW's that for an extension for MUD's!  But  
wouldn't this create an even bigger danger of falling into the trap of  
beleiving the VR world to be more real than the physical world.
	
...

	
	
Newsgroups: alt.pets.chia,rec.humor
From: kristyn@netcom.com (Kristyn Geenwood)
Subject: chia anxiety
Keywords: chia pets humor
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 19:07:41 GMT


FROM:	Ch-International

Regarding your recent request for information from our organization regarding psychological services provided for Chias, the following is a list of common anxieties suffered by a majority of these loveable pets.  If gone unchecked, these anxieties can result in permanent damage to the Chia's psyche.  Look for change in the Chia's coat (color and density) as well as demeanor.  Most Chia's are well adjusted and will never need our services.  If, however, your pet becomes despondent, please contact us immedia




tely to schedule an initial consultation.  Our rates are on a sliding scale, so they are considerably chiap.  

Top Ten Worries of Chia Pets:

10.	Underwatering (dehydration)

 9.	Living with cats (any cats, ever)

 8.	Being mistaken for mold

 7.	Living in close proximity to the  microwave

 6.	Being mistaken for a toilet bowl brush

 5.	Petting (never pet a Chia)

 4.	Being used as a large herbal tea bag

 3.	Embarrassment of a thin coat/bad Chia hair cut

 2.	Terra Cotta rot

 1.	Being mistaken for bean sprouts and squished inside a pita.

This list was compiled by Dr. Verde Greenthumb, LMFCC, President, ChiaUbiquitous, Inc.



===============================================================================
Disclaimer: My boss thinks Im hard at work.....dont tell him
From: w2lee@argo.acs.oakland.edu (Lorraine Lee)
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
Subject: Re: Well, I'm back
Date: 8 Jan 93 03:02:01 GMT
Reply-To: w2lee@argo.acs.oakland.edu
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester, MI

In article <929006@sundown.mil.wi.us>, wendy@sundown.mil.wi.us (Wendy) writes:

>I see my sister Celeste has been dubed the local guru. She's quite
>knowledgeable on the subject and is a really wonderful person. I'm
>sure she appreciates the gesture.

Yah I'm curious where she heard/read about the Roman emperor with some 2
millenia of technological foresight.  And about a zillion other interesting
facts and factoids she posts.

>For those that are new, I'm a pre-op TS. I have been part of a gender
>transition program for about 3 months and have a ways to go before I
>live full time. I will probable start on hormones in a couple of months.
>I have been a TS since as far back as I can remember (about 7) and I'm
>44 now.

Pleaze keep us posted, or keep me posted if its not stuff appropriate for
"broadcasting".  I'm curious as to what I'm in for.

>For those confused by the sister reference, Celeste and I are adopted
>sisters of each other. It's really nice having a caring sister like her.
>Personally, I think each TS should have another TS sister. You know, a
>sister is one with whom you can share your secrets!!!

A "big sister/little sister" program would probably help in ways clinical
facilities can't begin to.  Unfortunately gender congruity tends to be a
process of elimination, so there would probably be 19 little sisters for every
alumna.  I did have an opportunity to meet one of our TRANSGEN (mailing list)
sisters in person over the hollidays.  No substitute for Real hugs!

...
>Love to you all,
>
>Wendy

Love to you too, sis

Lorraine
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
From: cdukes@nyx.cs.du.edu (Chris Dukes)
Subject: Re: Bogus theories... (Discovery, Jan '93)
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 93 04:14:16 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.121024.15610@maths.tcd.ie> thomas@maths.tcd.ie (Thomas Bridge) writes:
>Talking of Bogus theories,  I heard on the radio yesterday that researchers in
>British Colombia, Canada have "proved" that left handed people are more likely
Why can't they ever say what it really is.  Ie "We have found a statisticaql
correlation between"....)
>to have a sex change than right handed people.  Do any of the pre or post op

Chris/Kristine
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
From: an2166@anon.penet.fi (Michelle)
Subject: followups: a tip
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: alt.transgendered
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:28:00 GMT

This information may be of use to anyone who wants to post a followup
article anonymously.

To post a followup article, most newsreaders support some version of
the "F" command, that calls a news posting program and includes some
of the header information from the original article.  It is not easy
to use this command and have the article posted anonymously--from my
site, outgoing news passes through a select few other sites and then
is propagated ever more widely, and none of these sites has a way of 
making the article anonymous.

So if you want to post a followup that is tracked by many of the
current threaded-type newsreaders, use the anonymous server as you
always do (mail to alt.transgendered@anon.penet.fi, for example) and
just edit in a "References: <message-id>" header line that contains
the message id(s) of the article(s) you're following up.

The result will be, for those who have threaded news readers, a
discussion more easily followed.

Michelle
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
To find out more about the anon service, send mail to help@anon.penet.fi.
Due to the double-blind system, any replies to this message will be anonymized,
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From: russw@cs.utexas.edu (Russ Williams)
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
Subject: Re: Teaching a Psych of Gender class- looking for YOUR help!
Date: 5 Jan 1993 20:03:05 -0600
Organization: Great Northern Hotel
NNTP-Posting-Host: im4u.cs.utexas.edu

In article <celeste-050193134224@128.158.16.248> celeste%express@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov (Celeste) writes:
>Oh, best first person narrative on dyslexia is in
>"The Motion of Light In Water" by Sammuel R. Delany
>Pages 213 to 217.
>The rest of the book is about his (sex) life.
>Warning! Delany is a left handed, black, middle class, genious,
>homosexual married to a white woman poet that makes a living
>writting scienc fiction! So his life if a little weird!

Samuel Delany is one of my favorite sf authors.  A recently posted
transgendered fiction list mentioned his Triton, which I recommend.
It actually has the plot element of relatively easy sex changes.
He also wrote the Neveryon series, ostensibly sword-&-sorcery but
really quite literary and almost absurdly pretentious & academic
at times but worth reading if you're into semiotics weirdness and
nonstandard sex stuff (and who isn't? :-)...

On his dyslexia: I read once that his book manuscripts are typo-riddled
and must be corrected by the publisher or some editor, and that the
title Dhalgren is spelled nonstandardly because he simply misspelled it!
(That's another good book!  But long!)

Also, I believe he and his wife Marilyn Hacker split years ago.

I met him at a con a few years ago, and he's a real nice guy.

Russ
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
From: an2967@anon.penet.fi (Tierney Dhewitrei)
Subject: You're not alone, was - Re: Hi again...
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: alt.transgendered
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:26:00 GMT

an2881@anon.penet.fi (Shannon) wrote:

>       I guess I just rambled, but has anyone around my age (34) gone to a
>       psy(ch(either one) and discussed CDing with any conclusions? Has it

I would be interested in this answer also.  As I am Shannon's elder at 37,
(you young thing you), and have never pursued 'assistance' from a pro.



part of celeste%express@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov (Celeste) response was:

> there are days I am always near tears. Many a night I cry myself to sleep!

As you know, you are not alone.  We cry together.  A quote for you, I know
not who owns it:

	Friends divide the pain and double the joy.


We all have friends here.  Thank you Celeste for your strength and courage.

Hugs
Tierney

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Due to the double-blind system, any replies to this message will be anonymized,
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From: w.p.coyne@newcastle.ac.uk
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
Subject: Re: Teaching a Psych of Gender class- looking for YOUR help!
Date: 6 Jan 93 12:57:41 GMT
Reply-To: w.p.coyne@newcastle.ac.uk
Organization: Chemical & Process Engineering Dept, University of Newcastle, UK.

celeste%express@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov (Celeste) writes:

>In article <C0Dx5s.GG7@acsu.buffalo.edu>, v065hjku@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu
>(Jason Osborne) wrote:
>> 
>[stuff deleted]
>> What I am looking for is stories by
>> people who feel more natural posing as the opposite sex than as their
>> 'anatomical' or 'genetic' sex.  I would like to know how it feels to
>> or what it is like to feel you belong to a different sex.  Do you feel
>> alienated?  Do you feel like you fit in better with the opposite sex
>> better than your own?  Do you feel equally comfortable with either?  
>> Well, this is not getting any clearer, so I will appreciate anything
>> anybody sends me, and will of course keep it entirely confidential.
>> 
>[stuff deleted
>> Jason Osborne
>> State University of New York at Buffalo
>> v065hjku@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu

>I suggest the following books:

  In the book "Accounting for transsexualism and transhomosexuality"
by Dr Brian Tully a psychologist, he describes some of 200 cases
he dealt with during 8 years of work at Charing Cross Hospital in 
the Gender Identity Clinic.  

  It is an interesting book and as the jacket says "It is hoped 
this book will be of use to anyone who needs to cope with this unusal
form of human despair, whether they encounter it within themselves
or someone close to them, or in a professional capacity"

   He wrote that a very large proportion of the male patients wanting
TS treatment also suffered from various mental illnesses.
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
From: scg@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Kelly Martin)
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
Subject: Re: You're not alone, was - Re: Hi again...
Date: 7 Jan 93 05:01:04 GMT
Reply-To: scg@mentor.cc.purdue.edu
Organization: Gender Anarchists United

an2967@anon.penet.fi (Tierney Dhewitrei) writes:

>I would be interested in this answer also.  As I am Shannon's elder
>at 37, (you young thing you), and have never pursued 'assistance'
>from a pro.

that's fine for TVs, but us TSes HAVE to pursue professional
assistance if we are to have any hopes of getting 'things'
straightened out.. :(
--
I believe we are on an irreversible trend toward more freedom and
democracy - but that could change.
		-- Vice President Dan Quayle
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
From: devin@colorado.edu (No one in particular)
Subject: Waxing (was Re: Ross & My other post...)
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:45:46 GMT

Ross Cochrane (uad1149@dircon.co.uk) wrote:
: On the subject of leg shaving - by the way, I'm also
: told I have nice legs and that women would kill for
: legs like mine - I wish someone just invented a cream
: that you could use and the hair would go away for a few
: months, but I suppose it's not a priority amongst the
: makeup manufacturers.

Go get your legs professionally waxed.  It costs around $20 for a full leg
wax, and while it takes a little gritting of teeth, it works really well.

			-Deb

--
Deborah Parks (RP90)  (SotM 7/91)  DoD #0034  deb@boulder.colorado.edu   ------
"It's being both that's a bitch."                                      --\--- /
"I wanted to take my brain to hell and back and see what I had left."  \  \ //
"This howling in the distance, it's a captivating sound.                \  \/
        Can't tell if it's ecstasy or pain..."  -DW                      \/
From: russw@cs.utexas.edu (Russ Williams)
Newsgroups: alt.transgendered
Subject: Re: Ross & My other post...
Date: 8 Jan 1993 15:33:39 -0600
Organization: Great Northern Hotel
NNTP-Posting-Host: im4u.cs.utexas.edu

In article <C0Joz0.EuC@dircon.co.uk> uad1149@dircon.co.uk (Ross Cochrane) writes:
>  Anyway, I should be interested to know
>if there are other musicians here who do gigs en-dress.

(Hi, Christina!)

Well, if I could play an instrument, I'd try it in drag, but I
can't so it's a moot point. :-)

I've seen the band Cracker twice this year (oops, last year!) and
both times their bass player was in drag.  He's a big guy with funky
dyed hair, too.  They put on a great fun high energy show, by the way.

Russ