HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: elkies@ramanujan.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Standing ovations? [Re: Too Polite]
Date: 15 Dec 92 21:36:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Dec15.163627.18533
Distribution: rec
Organization: Harvard Math Department

In article <1992Dec15.150531.19216@news2.cis.umn.edu>
jill@gopher.ccbr.umn.edu (Jill Hollifield) writes:
"I live in Minnesota, "Home of the Obligatory Standing Ovation" (tm).
"I have never been to a concert where there wasn't a SO, whether
"the performance was good, bad, or indifferent.
"
"So, my questions:  Does this happen anywhere else?  And what are *your*
"criteria for a standing ovation?  What has to happen to bring you
"to your feet?

What seems to happen too often is that enough people stand up in the
front rows to initiate a chain reaction wherein everybody must stand
just to see the stage...

--Noam D. Elkies
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mccomt@aix.rpi.edu (Todd Michel McComb)
Subject: Re: Requia
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 21:34:05 GMT

In article <r8ubopx@Unify.Com> Caroline E. Bryan writes:
>Can anyone recommend (with reasons) any specific requia (w/ or w/o
>particular recordings)?  I already know and enjoy
>	Durufle
>	Faure
>	Gilles (need a pointer to a CD recording of this)
>	Mozart (about the only Mozart I like -- he was over-pianoed in my
>		youth)

The top two are by Ockeghem and La Rue.

T. M. McComb

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: 910773f@ace.acadiau.ca (HEATHER LEE FYFFE)
Subject: Re: **QUICK SINEAD SURVEY PLEASE ANSWER**
Organization: Acadia University
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 21:00:25 GMT

In article <1992Dec11.170019.23289@iitmax.iit.edu> boarjas@elof.iit.edu (Jason Boardman) writes:
>*****  SIMPLE SURVEY -- PLEASE READ *****
>
>I have seen much talk about Sinead on the net lately, 
>and was wondering what the general opinion of Sinead
>was.  Please take the 20 seconds it takes to reply to
>this question and answer it.  (A simple Y or N will do).
>Please use your newsreader's reply option or regular
>email to submit votes -- do not post your answer.
>
>Question:
>Do you still support (or have a general good opinon of)
>Sinead O'Connor?


I basically often do not approve of her extremism, although I do agree with 
many of her basic concepts.

Her music, however, I find absolutely wonderful.

Buz
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: smitra@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Sami Mitra)
Subject: Re: Various _Goetterdaemmerung_s 
Keywords: Janowski, Karajan, Solti
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 20:01:23 GMT

In article <Bz3tMv.HF9@news.udel.edu> conrad@brahms.udel.edu (Jon Conrad) writes:
>In article <1992Dec10.155514.3888@osf.org> coren@speed.osf.org (Robert Coren) writes:
>
>
>>Act II: Karajan. I confess to having loaded the dice here a bit, in
>>choosing what I expected (accurately, as it happens) to be my least
>>favorite of the three recordings for my least favorite of the three
>>acts. 
>
>Really?  You don't like this act?  To each his own, I guess, but I find
>this one of my favorite Wagner acts -- tight, insightful, dramatic.
>
Since we almost never compare the musical/dramatic validity of single
acts in this fashion, I feel the urge to put in my two paise worth here.

Yes, really Robert:-). This act happens to be one of my favourite ones as
well, and it has somehow grown on me (as all Wagner does), because of
several reasons. Count in all the usual Wagnerian merits, which I won't
list down here.

But also, I find some parallel here to scenes from the great Indian
epic, Mahabharata. I am not sure how many netters are familiar with
the story...anyhow, there is this episode in the second of eighteen
acts in the text where the five brothers, the Pandavas, lose 
their wife, Draupadi, to their detested opponents as a result of
some disastrous gambling. Draupadi has to subsequently undergo some
very public humiliation, being dragged back and forth, her
garment being pulled off her, and such.

To cut a long rambling short, I find some amazing analogies between the
travails of Draupadi and Brunnhilde! And that, for me, a lover of 
the Mahabharata and Wagner, makes it just that much more fun.

>>Karajan's idea of Wagner's orchestral sound annoys me greatly. The
>>balances are basically dreadful: he seems to go in for really coarse
>>brass sound, smearing it all over everything else, so woe to any
>>orchestral detail that happens to share a bar with loud brass. I have
>>a feeling I'm not going to be listening to this one again, at least
>>not any time soon.
>
>Wow.  This makes me determined to listen again.  I didn't hear anything
>like this, and yet your description is so specific that it makes me
>think I missed something.
>
Some people have found Karajan's conducting in the Ring a little bit
too restrained and refined but this is the first time he has been
faulted for being coarse. On the other, Solti's work, though
appropriately visceral and dramatic, has been criticized for his
sometimes loud brass. I feel that Karajan almost never produces 
technically bad orchestral sound, whether one agrees with his
interpretation or not.


					Sami Mitra

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Originator: brad@buck
Organization: Viewlogic Systems, Inc.
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 19:40:36 GMT



|> In article <1gnii7INNibh@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu>, stinerkt@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Kevin T Stiner) writes:
|> >What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?
|> 
There are many, but one that comes to mind at this moment is the last
few bars of Borodin's "In the Steppes of Central Asia". I imagine the
sun setting, with the last shaft of direct sunlight evaporating into
the horizon...

- BK
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center
Date: Friday, 18 Dec 1992 10:39:44 EST
From: Spencer Means <HSMBB@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: NEWS: Pavarotti booed out of the SCALA
 <1992Dec15.145843.10810@vax.oxford.ac.uk>

In article <1992Dec15.145843.10810@vax.oxford.ac.uk>, wilcox@vax.oxford.ac.uk
says:
>
>In article <1992Dec10.015953.22595@midway.uchicago.edu>,
>jacquier@gsbux1.uchicago.edu (Eric Jacquier ) writes:
>> It happened on Dec 8, opening of the season at the SCALA
>> Conductor: Ricardo Muti
>> Pavarotti singing Don Carlo.
>> (text deleted)
>> Well, he missed a note. His voice did not make it high enough.
>> He was copiously booed and jeered by the audience.
>> A major disaster.
>(text deleted)

(Followed by a corrective based on a review in the Guardian):
(Text deleted)
>cracked a couple of notes. His soprano partner was less good: the reviewer
>seemed to me to be implying that it was more her the audience were booing, not
>him...

Well, I know several people who are wondering who the soprano was.  Anyone
know?

Spencer Means
hsmbb@cunyvm.bitnet
From: matt@physics2.berkeley.edu (Matt Austern)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Maria Callas video suggestions...?
Date: 18 Dec 92 14:52:23
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory (Theoretical Physics Group)
Reply-To: matt@physics.berkeley.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: physics2.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: carl@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu's message of Fri, 18 Dec 1992 20:52:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.205219.17962@news.columbia.edu> carl@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Carl Hansen) writes:

> I'm planning to buy a video of Maria Callas (either an opera or
> a concert recital) & would appreciate some tips on which of the many
> available videos are worth getting.  It will be part of a Christmas
> gift by the way which will also include the Callas/de Sabata
> recording of "Tosca", for someone who's kind of partial to Puccini.

Unfortunately, there are no videos of any complete operas performed by
Maria Callas.  I've heard rumors that a Norma exists on film and will
be released soon, but that's all---rumors.

What you can get, however, is a videotape of the Paris gala
performance of, if I'm remembering right, 1958.  Most of it is a
recital, but it also includes a staged performance of the second act
of Tosca.  

Unfortunately, there are a number of problems with this performance.
The chorus, in my opinion, is terrible (they made an incredible mess
out of Casta Diva), and some of the soloists are only mediocre.  With
Act II of Tosca, however, you do get Callas and Gobbi---and you get to
see, as well as hear, their performance of Tosca and Scarpia.  It is
clear just from listening to them that they were great actors as well
as great singers, but there's no substitute for seeing them on stage.
--
Matthew Austern                   Just keep yelling until you attract a
(510) 644-2618                    crowd, then a constituency, a movement, a
austern@lbl.bitnet                faction, an army!  If you don't have any
matt@physics.berkeley.edu         solutions, become a part of the problem!
From: hapka-christopher@yale.edu (Christopher Hapka)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Date: 17 Dec 1992 02:34:20 -0500
Organization: Yale University Science & Engineering UNIX(tm), New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu

>What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?

One favorite of mine that I haven't heard mentioned yet is the end
of Stauss' (R., of course!) _Tod und Verklarung_- the transfiguration
music.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: andreas@appel012.hydromech.uni-hannover.de (Andreas A. W. Dunker)
Subject: Flight of the Humblebee
Organization: University of Hannover, FRG
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 10:59:48 GMT

Hei all,

There are several version of "the Flight of the Humblebee". The best
I know is that from Bobby McFerrin and Yo-Yo Ma. And there
exists a version with a brass ensemble. Does anyone know about
further variations?

Andreas
--
______________________________________________________________________________
Andreas Dunker         andreas@appel012.hydromech.uni-hannover.de
 Institut fuer Stroemungsmechanik und elektronisches Rechnen im Bauwesen
  Universitaet Hannover, West Germany           2B  ||  ! 2B  (W. Shakespeare)
______________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Dresden was Re: One-work-composers
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 00:49:20 GMT

roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
: >In article <1992Dec14.173939.6318@spang.Camosun.BC.CA> dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker) writes:
: >>written probably at least 4 before that. The conductor Willem
: >>Mengelberg recalled an all night session spent at the house of the
: >>Weber family (descendants of the composer) in - perhaps - the 1920s,
: >>playing through the manuscripts of 4 unknown Mahler symphonies which
: >>he had entrusted to Baroness von Weber. As the family lived in Dresden
: >>it is unlikely that the manuscripts survived......
: 
: I'd just like to point out that this is a non-sequitur.  Contrary
: to popular image, Dresden as a whole was not leveled -- only the 
: central area and a few other areas.  Many residential areas, including some
: where nobility might have lived, were untouched.  The Landesbibliothek,
: among other things, remained intact (thank heavens!).
: 
: Besides, great treasures such as those scores, if they existed, would
: probably have been evacuated.

I'm relieved to hear it - or will be if they ever come to light. Can
you suggest any reason why, if they do still exist, they wouldn't have
turned up in the past few years, especially given the tremendous
interest - not to say money - they would surely attract?

--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: tony@cns.nyu.edu (Tony Movshon)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Reply-To: tony@cns.nyu.edu
Organization: New York University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 23:16:31 GMT


In article 26431@kadsma.kodak.com, pajerek@telstar.kodak.com (Don Pajerek) writes:
 
> Let me second the mention of the _Jardin feerique_. Wish I had thought
> of that one myself. I'll also jump on board with those who mentioned
> _Der Abschied_.

Ditto!

------------------------------------------------------------------------
					Tony Movshon

Internet:  movshon@nyu.edu		Howard Hughes Medical Institute
					Center for Neural Science
					New York University
Phone:	   (212) 998-7880		4 Washington Place, room 809
Fax:	   (212) 995-4183		New York, NY 10003
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: conrad@brahms.udel.edu (Jon Conrad)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Schubert
Date: 17 Dec 92 19:51:06 GMT
Organization: University of Delaware

In article <92352.125652RHASKINS@UMAB.BITNET> RHASKINS@UMAB.BITNET (Robert Haskins) writes:

>Thanks, Jon, for the info on the Hyperion set.  I confess I don't
>read as many record reviews as I probably should and didn't know
>anyone who had really had a listen to the discs.  Of the ones
>currently available, are there any must-have-right-aways?

Let's see....I'd name the following as the creme de la creme.

Anthony Rolfe Johnson (he was in sensational voice for this).
Sarah Walker (a sizzling Erlkoenig).
Brigitte Fassbaender (electric throughout).
Thomas Hampson (real fine singing, and an interesting program).

with regrets for the many good discs I'm omitting.  You didn't ask this,
but I'll also name the volumes which, to put it gently, might be left
till last to add to your collection.  One is Adrian Thompson; he just
isn't a polished enough vocalist, and while he was probably chosen
because he was willing to learn all these (only intermittently
interesting) very early songs, they are the ones that need the very best
singing.  The other miss, a more marginal one, is Marie McLaughlin; she
seems to be having problems of vocal control lately (as in her Mikado
recording).  Though they are evident here mostly in a sense that she has
to be "careful" so as not to slip, the sense of caution is doubly
unfortunate because she has more of the Good Stuff than anyone else so
far -- all the Gretchen songs (including the Spinning Wheel) and all the
Ellen songs (including Ave Maria).  But let me stress that this is a
very slight matter; many friends with good ears have heard nothing at
all wrong with her work here.

Jon Alan Conrad
From: hapka-christopher@yale.edu (Christopher Hapka)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Date: 18 Dec 1992 19:23:03 -0500
Organization: Yale University Science & Engineering UNIX(tm), New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu
Keywords: Thus, skate, serpent's, tongue


>What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?


This probably counts as cheating, but one of my favorite endings to a CD is
my recording of _A Midsummer Night's Dream_ (the play and the Mendelssohn
music) with Jaime Laredo and the Scottish Chamber Orchestra.  The combination
of Mendelssohn's music and Shakespeare's words (one of my favorite speeches
to boot) is truly powerful.  I reccomend this set (2 CD's) to anyone who likes
Mendelssohn- the music never sounds quite the same without the words.
From: paul@cgh.cgh.com (Paul Homchick)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The worst composer ever
Keywords: worst, composer
Date: 20 Dec 92 18:29:23 GMT
Organization: Chimitt Gilman Homchick, Inc.

All of the nominations for the "worst composer" suffer from the
obvious defect that we have heard of them!  Clearly, we can't judge
that a composer is worthy just because he or she is recorded and
performed in international music circles, but it would seem to filter
out the "worst."  The worst, or at least the very bad, composers are
going to be somewhat obscure.  So we come to my nomination.

When I started record collecting in earnest, I used to buy recordings
whose contents were essentially a mystery.  With impeccable adolescent
reasoning, I decided that I wasn't likely to discover anything new and
exciting by purchasing yet another Beethoven symphony.  One of these
shopping trips netted a French EDICI LP of "Symphonie Persepolis" by
Aminoullah Andre Hossein.  The music was excruciatingly banal,
uninspired, and boring to listen to.  I have kept the recording
because you can learn from everything: no matter how bad anything is,
it can at least serve as a bad example.

On occasion, I'll put it on the turntable and listen to as much as I
can put up with, pondering the magic of music and wondering what it is
that makes the music of Beethoven so great and that of Hossein exactly
the opposite.

Are any of our research-handy readers able to shed any light on the
career of Mr. Hossein?
-- 
Paul Homchick                    :UUCP     {rutgers | uunet} !cbmvax!cgh!paul
Chimitt Gilman Homchick, Inc.    :Internet                       paul@cgh.com
1111 West DeKalb Pike, Suite 101 :MCI                               PHOMCHICK
Wayne, PA  19087-2179            :GEnie                              HOMCHICK
From: herb@sybase.com (Herb Lison)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Reply to Greatest Living Pianist
Date: 17 Dec 92 23:08:01 GMT
Organization: Sybase, Inc.

It surprises me a bit to see so much bandwidth devoted to selecting
the "best" pianist.  It reminds me of a question I had on a grade
school music test about who was the "best" composer.  I picked Bach
and was told Beethoven was the right answer.

Forget about who is "best" and tell us about what you love in music
and if you can, why you love it.

Herb Lison
From: chen@cs.ucsd.edu (Jim Ron Chen)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: pianists
Date: 17 Dec 92 05:56:50 GMT

yoshi@hpjsdo.kobe.hp.com (Kazuo Yoshizaki) writes:

>Could anybody tell me when Arrau died? 

Claudio Arrau, 
Feb. 6, 1903, Chillan, Chile - June 9, 1991, Murzzuschlag, Austria 
Studied in Berlin with Martin Krause, a pupil of Liszt, from 1912 to 
1918.  Moved to US permanently in 1941.
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: Debussy, Shostakovich, and... ? 
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 16 Dec 92 17:28:17 GMT
Distribution: rec

In article <DOOM.92Dec16082623@elaine36.Stanford.EDU> doom@elaine36.Stanford.EDU (Joseph Brenner) writes:
>
>I like Debussy, 
>what else would you predict that I'd like?  

Ravel.  DeFalla, possibly "Nights in the Gardens of Spain". 
Franck, maybe his violin sonata.  Milhaud.

>I like Shostakovich, 
>what else would you predict that I'd like?  

If you like those "big" symphonies
    Mahler.  Bruckner.  Beethoven.  Brahms.  Dvorak.  Nielson.
If you like his chamber music
    Beethoven.  Bartok.  Dvorak.  Schubert.

John D.

Xref: sparky rec.music.classical:19059 rec.music.early:1802
From: rags@triples.math.mcgill.ca (Robert A. G. Seely)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,rec.music.early
Subject: Re: Christmas CD
Date: 20 Dec 92 18:12:24 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization


Last time I posted to this thread, I added (a bit tentatively - I figured
I'd be flamed for sure for going outside the definition of "classical") a
recommendation for Maddy Prior's CD - it was well received, so now I'm going
to be really bold ;-} and recommend Loreena McKennitt's old (1987) recording
"To Drive the Cold Winter Away" (here it is a Quinlan Rd Prod CD, but I have
heard rumours that Warner Bros are responsable for world distribution).  
The sound of her recordings approaches (unintentional?) early-music-crossover 
(more obvious is the celtic influence, of course).

-rags

           "Forgetting old wrongs with carols and songs  
            To drive the cold winter away."
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: The worst composer in a millenium
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 15 Dec 92 17:22:15 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.152618.10992@news.columbia.edu> rsm13@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ravi S Moorthy) writes:
>
>My main answer to that would be that music does not have any barriers
							  ^^^^^^^^^^^^
A disciple of John Cage?

>and if it was a good composition I do not think we would have such a
>big line of Messy haters.  

Where is this big line of Messeian haters anyway?  
Most people have never heard his music.  

And, come on.  The world is filled with objects of art that were
hated by many at one time.  Does that make those objects not good.  The 
obvious is the initial rejection of impressionistic art.  Art that
now fetches millions in auctions.  

In music, let's see Mahler's 1st symphony I believe almost caused
riots -- it inspired so many haters.   Beethoven's late quartets
were initially rejected.  Stravinsky's "Rite of Spring" - okay maybe
it was the ballet more than the music that caused such a fury, etc.


John D.


Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@grace.cri.nz (Roger Young)
Subject: Opera by Aulis Sallinen
Organization: Dept. of Scientific and Industrial Research, NZ.
Distribution: rec.music.classical
Date: 21 Dec 92 08:48:19

Does anyone know of an opera by the Finnish composer Aulis Sallinen
which may be entitled _The King Rides Forth_? I understand that
Sallinen's Op.52 Shadows: Prelude for Orchestra used material from
the opera. Is there a commercially available recording of the
opera? Thanks....

Roger Young
From: rags@triples.math.mcgill.ca (Robert A. G. Seely)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: EVER SO SMALL A RECOMMENDATION WANTED
Keywords: Beethoven, Bagatelle
Date: 17 Dec 92 15:02:37 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <1992Dec17.131828.6228@athena.mit.edu> davidu@space.mit.edu (David T S Um) writes:
>
>Hello,
>
>
>	I have just become enamored of Beethoven's little confection, the
>Bagatelle Op. 126 #3.  
>
>	These are the ones I have heard:
>
>	Andras Schiff in his pre-London days (perhaps Hungaroton)
>	Melvyn Tan on Beethoven's Broadwood (probably on EMI)
>	Alfred Brendel on an old VOX vinyl LP set of all LvB's piano pieces
>	Stephen Bishop-Kovacevich (sp?) on Philips Concert Classics
>

I make no comment on the type of performance you want - but I too like Tan's
recording.  Just a plug for Glenn Gould's performance, recently reissued as
part of "The Edition" (Sony) (I haven't heard the new pressing, but I assume
it is even better than the older one I own...)  A friend recently admitted
to me that although he generally can't take Gould (his loss ;-}) he admitted
that with the Bagatelles he hit the mark right on.  I agreed with the second
part of his statement.

-rags
From: Bill_P_Pearce@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Marriage of Figaro
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 21:30:18 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Dec14.153001.19177@news.columbia.edu>

     Regarding favorite versions of "The Marriage of Figaro", one of
mine, probably because it is the one I grew up with, is the old
RCA lp set of the 1955 Glyndebourne Festival production, with Sesto
Bruscantini as Figaro, Sena Jurinac as the Countess, Graziella Sciutti
as Susanna, Rise Stevens as Cherubino and Hugues Cuenod as Don Basilio
(conducted by Vittorio Gui).

    Bill Pearce
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical