HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bob@1776.COM (Robert Coe)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Another Waffle bug?
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 08:07:18 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: 1776 Enterprises, Sudbury MA

roy%cybrspc@cs.umn.edu (Roy M. Silvernail) writes:
> dawson@willard.UUCP writes:
> > Yes, that works.  Now try this:
> > 
> > home
> > dir c:\waffle
> > dir
> > 
> > I'll warrant you're not in Kansas (or your user directory), anymore!
> 
> Willard, how do you get these little things to happen?  I just tried this 
> sequence, and my default directory did not change.  (1.65 release version, 
> my account is level/priv 9)  I have my stuff spread over 3 drives, as well.  
> (user dirs and Waffle on C:, transfer spool on E: and news spool on G:)

I was able to reproduce Willard's result.  (In fact the "dir c:\waffle"
command produced an error message, possibly related to the fact that on my
system that directory contains no files, only the "\waffle\bin" directory.)
My configuration is similar to yours, with one (important?) difference: my
user dirs are not on the C: disk.  So the first "dir" refers to a different
disk than does the "home".  How about your system, Willard?  Are the user
directories on a disk other than C:?

   ___            _                                           -  Bob
   /__) _   /    / ) _   _
(_/__) (_)_(_)  (___(_)_(/_______________________________________ bob@1776.COM
Robert K. Coe ** 14 Churchill St, Sudbury, Massachusetts 01776 ** 508-443-3265
From: Martin Welk <mw@pandora.mei.open.de>
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: sysman... NOT!
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 05:28:45 MET
Reply-To: Martin Welk <mw@pandora.mei.open.de>
Organization: 1st OPeN site in Saxony, Germany

abolins%visavis.uucp@nyongwa.cam.org (August Abolins) writes:

() I thought 1.65 install was going to be easy.  I was moving up from 1.64
() so I had to make sure I didn't do a blatant "pkunzip -d" over the
() existing files.
()
() Anyways... most of the upgrade process went ok except SYSMAN.  It seems
() that SYSMAN is hardcoded to look for C:\WAFFLE\ADMIN !!!!!
()
()                         Grrrrrrrrrrrrr.....
()
() I was forced to create C:\WAFFLE\ADMIN and copy my PASSWORD file there.
() (My Waffle system lives in D:\WAFFLE\...)  Then, the index file was
() created fine.
()
() Questions:
()
() [1] Do I have to keep this C:\WAFFLE\ADMIN directory?  Will Waffle use
()     INDEX in the D:\WAFFLE\ADMIN directory if I copy it back there?

DEFINETLY YES ! I understand what problem you have but I can't find
the solution: I use Waffle 1.65 and everything works fine: I've
installed Waffle on F:\WAFFLE !

() [2] Does waffle access the INDEX file during the normal course of its
()     operations?

Yes.

() [3] Is Waffle smart enough to look for INDEX in my D:\WAFFLE\ADMIN?

Yes.

() Comments and help on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Check your STATIC file ! I just can imagine that you forgot some
directory setting or it's still incorrect or something like that.
Here is an extract of mine that holds all the configured directory
information. Be sure that the environment variable WAFFLE has to
point to your STATIC file - example to do this:

SET WAFFLE=D:\WAFFLE\SYSTEM\STATIC

(for me, it's F: !)

-----
BIN       : F:\WAFFLE\BIN
FILES     : F:\PUB
OUTBOX    : F:\WAFFLE\SPOOL\OUTBOX
SPOOL     : F:\WAFFLE\SPOOL
TEMPORARY : D:\TMP
UPLOADS   : F:\PUB\INCOMING
USER      : F:\WAFFLE\USER
WAFFLE    : F:\WAFFLE
-----

Check your configuration ! If it isn't a buggy Waffle version, it
should work. It works fine here :-) !

Martin
--
Martin Welk, D-O-8250 Meissen       mw@pandora.mei.open.de / mw@pandora.sax.de
This is what The K.L.F. is about,
also known as The Justified Ancients Of Mu Mu,
furthermore known as The JAMs !
From: kosta@blues.kk.sub.org (Kosta Kostis)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Latest ISO 8859-1 Patch for Waffle available
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 92 01:37:45 MET
Organization: The Blues Family

phil@miracle.com (Phil Hill) writes:

> kosta@blues.kk.sub.org (Kosta Kostis) writes:
> >Jonathan Herr <valnet!herrj@news.cs.indiana.edu> writes:
> >
> >> kosta@blues.kk.sub.org (Kosta Kostis) writes:
> >> 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER A GRAVE      : 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER A ACUTE      : 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER A CIRCUMFLEX : 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER A TILDE      : 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER A DIARESIS   : 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER A RING       : 
> >> #         LATIN SMALL LETTER N TILDE      : 
> >> # 
> >> #         COPYRIGHT SIGN                  : 
> >> 
> 
> Very strange...  I'm getting this posting correctly, i.e. the copyright looks
> like a c with a circle around it...  But I remember that the ORIGINAL posting
> at my site didn't come in through correctly.
> 
> I'm still on 1.64 using a (homegrown) WINDOWS based reader, so my code page
> is the default one (WINDOWS OEM charset), and there is no 'charset' option
> in waffle.
> 
> Anybody explain?

Windows OEM charset? Well, Windows uses ISO 8859-1.
No translation is needed for "natural" Windows programs.

        Kosta


-- 
  Kosta Kostis, Talstrasse 25, D-6074 Roedermark 3, Germany
  kosta@blues.kk.sub.org                                        (home)
  sw authors: please support ISO 8859-1!        =aeoeueAEOEUEss
Xref: sparky comp.bbs.waffle:5093 comp.mail.uucp:2295
From: djk@boombox.apana.org.au (David Keegel)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle,comp.mail.uucp
Subject: Re: Mixed format addresses
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 92 20:13:49 +1100
Reply-To: djk@boombox.apana.org.au
Organization: Private site, Melbourne, Australia.

In <Byw7M3.IxJ@cs.psu.edu> fenner@postscript.cs.psu.edu (Bill Fenner) writes:

>There is no way to register yourself as an Internet->UUCP gateway

Wouldn't:
	*.UUCP.  IN MX 500 my.host.domain.
in the DNS do this?

Apologies if this has already been answered -- my news seems to be a bit
slow (like 3-4 days) somewhere upstream.

-- 
David Keegel	Home:	<djk@boombox.apana.org.au>  Tel: +61 3 593-1460
		Work:	<djk@bby.com.au>  Fax: 614-8742   Tel: 614-8922
From: rick@ricksys.lonestar.org (Richard McCombs KB5SNF)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Can't reach mlewis@wplace.uucp
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 21:07:35 CST
Reply-To: rick@ricksys.lonestar.org (Richard McCombs KB5SNF)
Followup-To: poster
Organization: The Red Headed League; Lawton, Ok

mike@arts.com (Mike Witt) writes:

> 
> If you see this, I can't route mail to 'wplace.uucp', but
> I just wanted to thank you for the configuration tips.
> 
> -Mike

I couldn't resist, but if I didn't see this would that mean that you
can route to wplace.uucp?  Hmm I guess it's too bad I saw it.

Follow-ups to me.

Rick
--
Internet: rick@ricksys.lonestar.org,      bo836@cleveland.freenet.edu
UUCP: ...!rwsys!ricksys!rick,   {backbones}!ricksys.lonestar.org!rick
BITNET: bo836%cleveland.freenet.edu@cunyvm  Fidonet: Richard McCombs @ 1:385/6
From: dwrage@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu (David William Wrage)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Ansi & Waffle
Keywords: ansi waffle
Date: 16 Dec 92 20:34:34 GMT
Organization: Ohio University C.S. Dept, Athens

My question from yesterday was answered so quickly, I just had to post
another (and probably more later).

Is it possible to display ansi menus in Waffle?  I have no problem 
with having two seperate sets of menus that can be copied over each
other on a user-per-user basis, but so far each of my attempts to have
Waffle display the menu fails and returns me all the ansi sequences
in text mode.  Please note that I have tried the video: ANSI (or BIOS)
and it did not help.  The menus display fine from dos or from a viewer
I have, but waffle seems to be reading the menu file, analyzing it, then
spitting out this 'digested' text.  Is there a way to force Waffle to 
display an ansi file when requested to do so, without the 'digestion'
process?

Also, thank again for the answers to the editor & time limit questions.
Both solutions worked admirably.

David Wm Wrage
dwrage@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu
or
olympus!dwrage@oucsboss.cs.ohiou.edu
From: kjhoule@iowegia.uucp (Kevin Houle)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: What the *ell...!
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 92 13:18:08 CST
Distribution: world
Organization: Iowegia Public Access Usenet/UUCP, Clive IA USA.

abolins%visavis.uucp@nyongwa.cam.org (August Abolins) writes:

> I think I figured it out.... It appears that if a file by the name
> "waffle" exists in the user's directory, then Waffle tries to "execute"
> its contents like a script or something.
> 
> Is this documented?  I cannot find it.

Yes, it is documented somewhere.

--
Kevin Houle     kjhoule@iowegia.uucp
From: pdivine@unixg.ubc.ca (Patrick Divine)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Waffle Goodies..
Date: 14 Dec 1992 18:44:57 GMT
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: unixg.ubc.ca

In article <yaJqVB6w165w@iowegia.uucp> kjhoule@iowegia.uucp (Kevin Houle) writes:

>I don't get what you mean here. You talking header formats or the body
>of the message?

the idea was to have an extern program create a message that is formated a
certain way so that all messages in the newsgroup are in exactly the same
format.  essentially all that would have to be done is have a header
pasted onto a a correctly formated message.

>My nieghbor and I discussed doing the same thing a while back. I think
>Bill Fenner set up a mailing list to discuss such file sharing systems.

I've had several replies about people who are interested in a program of
this sort, and a few responses about people who have actually decided to
tackle the problem.

Does anyone have any well developed pseudo code that will mirror file
systems of neiboring UUCP sights?

>> subscribe to all the newsgroups in the subscribe file, appends the
>> newsgroups to the "join" file and deletes it from the "subscribe" file.
>
>Sounds like 1.66 will have a similar feature.

so I've heard, but I question where or not a user will be able to switch
off such a feature if they don't want to use it.  in my solution, a user
would just have to delete the line in the "waffle" file in their home
directory.



-- 
|  The Postman Pat Show                featuring  o industrial strength noise |
|  PO Box 75115                                   o clips from all of your    |
|  White Rock, BC                                   favorite tv shows!        |
|  Canada,  V4A 9M4  (send for catalog)           o Loops! & Loops! & Loops!  |
From: greg@gmp.lonestar.org (G.R. Basile)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: UAE with Windows
Date: 19 Dec 92 01:05:06 GMT
Organization: GMP Research Co., Dallas TX

Hi,

I have just read the FAQ and couldn't find the answere. I am running
waffle 1.64 with DOS 5.0 and 386MAX 6.1. 

My question:
When I try to run waffle under windows I get a UAE. Does anyone else 
have this problem. Does 1.65 fix it? I would like to have waffle running
while I use my computer for other things.

Thanks,
Greg Basile
greg@gmp.lonestar.org
From: mlewis@wplace (Mark Lewis)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Bad header
Date: 11 Dec 92 21:38:10 GMT
Reply-To: wplace!mlewis@cssnet.UUCP
Organization: The Waffle House, Waldo's Place USA


tcscs!zeta@src.honeywell.com (Gregory Youngblood) writes:
> This was worse when I moved the mouse.  Seemed IRQ3 (for Com2-mouse) would
> take priority over IRQ4 (Com1-modem).
> When I stuck in 16550afns for all i/o positions it cured it.

lower IRQ's take precedence over higher IRQ's that's one reason why i 
try to use IRQ's 8-15 whenever possible in a multitasking intensive 
environment on DOS based equipment... IRQ's 8-15 are routed to the 
system thru IRQ2 and thus get processed before IRQ's 3-7 ... it's 
just the nature of the beast -=B-)

and of course you are aware of the FIFO buffers in the 16550's and what 
their main purpose in life is, right?

)\/(ark

<--------------------------------------------------------------------------->
 Mark Lewis          * DA-CON Consultants -- Creating Solutions since 1985 *
 FIFESNet 20:0/0                     ~!duke!wolves!cssnet!wplace!mlewis UUCP
 FIDONet  1:3634/12                          mlewis@lee.cerf.fred.net USENet
 USENet->FIDONet Mark.Lewis@f12.n3634.z1.fidonet.org
                  The Company is mine... The Words are mine...
                   The Thoughts are mine... The System is mine...
Xref: sparky comp.bbs.waffle:5183 comp.mail.uucp:2325
From: morpheus <morpheus@entropy.mcds.com>
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle,comp.mail.uucp
Subject: Re: Mixed format addresses
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 09:39:00 EST
Organization: the pickle factory at Langley, Virginia

stu@valinor.mythical.com (Stu Labovitz) writes:

> _This_ is the specific reason for obtaining a FQDN in the Internet DNS and
> having an MX record.  The MX record provides the routing information for
> any Internet host to send email to your host, even if it is really a
> uucp-only system.  Get a domain from the appropriate domain-registration
> authorities (either registrar@nic.ddn.mil or cooper@isi.edu), register a
> fully-qualified domain name for your host (to include HINFO and MX records
> in the DNS database of your primary nameserver), and stop having problems!

Okay, question...  anyone know of any system willing to give me an MX record
for free?


morpheus@entropy.mcds.com ("morph")   |   A name changes toys into tools..
Obsolete diety for hire.  Cheap.      |          - Skinny Puppy
From: system@cithara.login.qc.ca (cithara)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Barf Codes
Date: 12 Dec 92 01:45:12 GMT
Organization: Organ Grinders Monkeys Union With Penguins As Mascots

Greetings Wafflers!

I have seen Waffle generate a message like:

[barf nnna5] 

What do these barf codes mean?

Happens during a failed logon.

Any thoughts, ideas, truths welcome.
-----
tagatagtagtagtagtagatatagtagtagyuoreit!
From: mlewis@wplace (Mark Lewis)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Waffle and Share.exe question?
Date: 15 Dec 92 19:05:40 GMT
Reply-To: wplace!mlewis@cssnet.UUCP
Organization: The Waffle House, Waldo's Place USA


abolins%visavis.uucp@nyongwa.cam.org (August Abolins) writes:
> mlewis@wplace.UUCP (Mark Lewis) writes:
> > you could do this....
> >
> > SHELL=COMMAND.COM /E:1024 /F /P
> >
> > in your config.sys... this is in mine... and yes, i do have a 1k
> > environment... the /F is the "important" part... it tells DOS to
> > automajikally FAIL on those messages...
> > BTW: that's with DOS 5.0... i don't know if it'll work with other flavors
> > of DOS...
> My DOS 5.0 manual does not document /F.  Maybe I missed it.  What page
> is it on?

that is correct... /F is undocumented and will probably remain so 
officially even though it is quite well documented in areas such as this 
where someone says, "i have a problem....." and others respond, "use 
this and it'll take care of....." -=B-)

)\/(ark

<--------------------------------------------------------------------------->
 Mark Lewis          * DA-CON Consultants -- Creating Solutions since 1985 *
 FIFESNet 20:0/0                     ~!duke!wolves!cssnet!wplace!mlewis UUCP
 FIDONet  1:3634/12                          mlewis@lee.cerf.fred.net USENet
 USENet->FIDONet Mark.Lewis@f12.n3634.z1.fidonet.org
                  The Company is mine... The Words are mine...
                   The Thoughts are mine... The System is mine...
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
From: fenner@snobol.cs.psu.edu (Bill Fenner)
Subject: Re: LIMIT command line arg
Organization: Penn State Computer Science
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 18:43:41 GMT

In article <8gc1VB4w165w@entropy.mcds.com> morpheus@entropy.mcds.com (morpheus) writes:
|Does Tom have any objections regarding distribution of recompiled binaries?
|                        (my guess is that he does.  ah well...)

He has told me in the past that I could redistribute some of my modifications
in binary form, so he doesn't have an absolute rule against it.

Unfortunately, I don't have straight 1.65 release source, so I can't make
this change and distribute binaries.  If someone else with the DOS source
wants to contact Tom and get permission to distribute modified binaries,
please, go ahead.

  Bill
From: dawson@hobbes.bsan.bls.com (Willard Dawson)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: WAFFLE to FIDO: Has it been done?
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 22:10:33 GMT
Organization: BellSouth Systems Integration

dinn@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael 'Moose' Dinn) writes:

>
>I run Waffle, a friend runs FIDO (actually DLG Pro).
>Can we network somehow? Anyone care to educate me, the uneducated? ;)
>
>--
> Michael Dinn, CS Student * dinn@ug.cs.dal.ca * Use your modem! (902) 461-4773
> "make lots of money",  "enjoy the work",  "operate within the law":  choose 2

Is that the same DLG/Pro that runs on the Amiga?  A fellow employee runs
that package on his Amiga, along with "Dillon UUCP," and we get along just
find.
--
 Willard Dawson, BellSouth Advanced Networks, 1100 Johnson Ferry Road, Ste. 880
 Atlanta, GA  30342, Voice: +1 404 303 2343, UUCP: gatech!vdbsan!hobbes!dawson
 Internet -> X.400:  /G=W/S=DAWSON/O=BSAN/ADMD=BELLSOUTH/C=US/@sprint.com
 Percent hack:  dawson%vdbsan@gatech.edu   ::    Standard disclaimer applies.
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle,comp.mail.uucp
From: dan@dribble.c-mols.siu.edu (Dan Ellison)
Subject: Re: Mixed format addresses
Organization: Southern Illinois University - Carbondale, IL (SIU-C)
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 13:20:41 GMT

In <lgXLrA1BBh107h@ssc60.sbwk.nj.us> tonyd@ssc60.sbwk.nj.us (Tony DeBari) writes:

>In <1gisdmINN3gf@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> trier@slc6.ins.cwru.edu (Stephen C. Trier) writes:
>>In article <e80RVB2w165w@1776.COM> bob@1776.COM (Robert Coe) writes:
>>>Suppose someone were to propose that rather than have the .UUCP notation die 
>>>out, it should be formalized as a "real" domain.  Aside from the obvious 
>>>problem that existing mail programs handle this notation in several mutually 
>>>inconsistent ways, why would it be such a bad idea?

>>It is not a bad idea at all, but it has already been done.

>>It's called .ORG, .EDU, .COM, .INT, and .<YourCountry>.

>>How would registering under .UUCP be different from registering under any
>>other domain?

>Ok, but consider my site, ssc60.sbwk.nj.us, a few-user Waffle iron owned
>and operated by a private individual (i.e. me).

>It's not an "organization" per se.
>It's not a company or other type of commercial site.
>It's not an educational institution.
>It's not international (is that what .INT is for?)

>The only real domain left is .<MyCountry> (.US), which is based on a
>geographic hierarchy.  If I move out of South BrunsWicK, NJ, I have 
>to register a new domain name.  Yes, it's free and easy, but I'd rather
>not have to do it more than once.  And I'm fortunate in that my account
>with UUNET means not having to find another forwarder.

Yes, but you still have to submit a new map entry describing you path
for receiving mail after a move.  IMHO, this is more work that sending
a piece of email to the MX record site requesting that they change 
the delivery host (when using the .us domain that is....)

>What would be wrong with a .PRI domain for unaffiliated, private sites?
>Everyone has at least an MX record in the DNS, it doesn't imply a specific
>transfer protocol like .UUCP, and there is no geographic hierarchy so a
>site can be physically moved without having to re-register its domain name.

This could easily become unmanagable.  By using the geographical domain
hierchy, you can at least get a clue as to where it is you might be
sending your packets.  Fact is, that with the methods in use today,
when you make a move, you have to let somebody know where and how to
deliver packets.  The farther the move the more things need to be
adjusted (domain, MX info, uucp neighbor etc.)  Fortunately, it's
pretty easy to do, just take a few days to be final.  Oh well, it
sure works well!

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| Dan Ellison, Network Spec 	  -    	Computing Affairs, SIU-C 	| 
| Southern Illinois University 	  - 	Carbondale, IL 62901            |   
| FAX:      (618) 453-3459        -   	PHONE:    (618) 453-6149 	|     
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle,comp.mail.uucp
From: ckd@eff.org (Christopher Davis)
Subject: Re: Mixed format addresses
Organization: Electronic Frontier Foundation Tech Central
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 16:39:45 GMT

Stu> == stu@valinor.mythical.com (Stu Labovitz) writes:
m>   == morpheus  <morpheus>

 Stu> Get a domain from the appropriate domain-registration authorities
 Stu> (either registrar@nic.ddn.mil or cooper@isi.edu), register a
 Stu> fully-qualified domain name for your host (to include HINFO and MX
 Stu> records in the DNS database of your primary nameserver), and stop
 Stu> having problems!

 m> Okay, question...  anyone know of any system willing to give me an MX
 m> record for free?

The US Domain registrar (us-domain@isi.edu, as I recall) can give you an MX
record in the "host.city.st.us" form, for free, and will even run the
nameservers for you.  It's your responsibility to find a willing site to do
the actual MXing, though if you're already getting a feed from an
Internet-connected site, that's usually easy...
--
Christopher K. Davis      | ``Usenet seems to run much like the Kif (or,
<ckd@eff.org>   EFF #14   |   for the TV generation, Klingon) high command.
System Administrator, EFF |   Whoever takes action and can be heard wins.''
+1 617 864 0665  [CKD1]   |   --Peter da Silva <peter@ferranti.com>
From: peters@bsc.guild.org (Peter Sleggs)
Newsgroups: comp.bbs.waffle
Subject: Re: Very Big Waffle bug!!
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 92 22:32:52 EST
Organization: Bellatrix Systems Corp., Mississauga, ONT Canada

dennis@pete.uucp (Dennis Peterson) writes:

> I just got thought rebuilding my hard disk for the SECOND time. And
> Waffle did it to me!.
> 
> I have been running waffle for about 2 weeks with no problems. I then
> decided to move the News directories to D: but leave the waffle system
> on C:. Every thing seemed to work well but I soon noticed my D: drive
> had some fat table error.  I rebuild with Norton disk doctor then
> everything was ok again. Well this time during the rnew procession
> of files form my feed the fat table really blew. I had just check the
> disk with norton disk doctor before I ran it and it was ok.
> 
> It appears rnews will sometime recreate a directory that already exist,
> create bad links, cross-link files, etc.  In general a real mess. I think
> it is being confused by the switching between C: and D: during the
> processing of the input files and writting the files back to the news
> directories.

I've been running the gateway machine here for weeks in a similar
config, system on C: and spool and news on D: with no problems


> I am running Norton NDOS and Norton cache but I have had No problems until
> I moved the News directory.

I'd try wirhout the cache and see if the problems go away.

> D: 100 MB SCSI on Seagate ST01 card.
Could this be the problem ? the ST01 ?



--
Bellatrix Systems Corp. Mississauga, Ontario Canada
peters@beltrix.guild.org or beltrix!peters