HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Subject: Re: Look out guys - Mensan denies evolution
Originator: cjdcosta@c00100-100lez.eos.ncsu.edu
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 16:58:48 GMT


zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd) writes:
>This guy sets out to rubbish evolution.  The dangers here are:
>The creationists may notice and say 'a Mensan is on our side' or even 'Mensa 
>agrees with us'

I must point out that the former observation would be completely true. 
The latter may be an unwarranted generalisation, but it's no worse than 
your own, in assuming that Mensa or r.o.m. as a group has any opinions
on this subject, one way or the other.

>The evolutionists may notice and write us off.

If anyone "writes us off" because of an article in the magazine of one of 
our national groups, I doubt many people would care. I personally would not.

>Claims (from an article in UK Mensa magazine):
>Geochronometry using radioactive dating has been shown to be deeply flawed 
>and unrelaible.
>Earliest fossil dating = date surface water first appeared.  Hole-in-1 very 
>unlikely.
>Where is the helium from decaying uranium?
>Sedimentary layers should take millions of years to form but contain eg 
>whole trees in vertical positions.
>Usual stuff about horrendous gaps in fossil record.
>No sign of missing link - all hominids are human or ape.
>
>I expect most of these problems are well known to the evolutionists, who can 
>no doubt explain them or are working on them,

If this is true, then let the evolutionists refute these points. I think these
are valid discrepencies in the evolution theory. 

Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: phz@cadence.com (Pete Zakel)
Subject: Re: IQ vs. Faith
Organization: Cadence Design Systems
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 22:16:42 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.013351.22336@cs.mcgill.ca> mingmar@cs.mcgill.ca (Ming MAR) writes:
>One of the questions in modern cosmology is how much mass is
>there in the universe.  If a little, then the universe will
>continue to expand, grow cold, and die.  If a lot, then
>eventually the gravitational pull will create another massive
>primordial singularity and a subsequent big bang.

The lack of enough gravity to result in a Gnab Gib (the opposite of the Big
Bang -- sometimes known as the Big Crunch) doesn't mean that there cannot be
another Big Bang.

There is at least one physicist who claims that a singularity can form at
random out of the background fabric of the universe if the universe is
sufficiently quiescent.  The probability of a singularity with enough mass
to result in a universe similar to ours is vanishingly small, but in infinite
time even vanishingly small probabilities are very likely to occur, eventually.

So even if the current universe expands for eternity, once a sufficient
vacuum is formed for quantum events to become the major events, another
singularity resulting in another Big Bang will probably occur ... eventually.

Our own universe may be the result of just such a singularity, or may be
the result of a previous Gnab Gib.  Note that since it is impossible to see
further back in time than a few microseconds after the Big Bang we have no
way of knowing whether our current universe resulted from a quantum event or
from a Gnab Gib (and whether, if it was a Gnab Gib, *that* event resulted
from a singularity or a Gnab Gib, and so ad infinitum...).  Given an infinite
amount of time in an infinite universe, all things are possible.

-Pete Zakel
 (phz@cadence.com or ..!uunet!cadence!phz)

"In every country and every age, the priest has been hostile to Liberty."
 - Thomas Jefferson
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Subject: Re: student membership
Organization: The Cat Factory
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 23:00:49 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.071356.2761@news.Hawaii.Edu> macknik@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Elizabeth A. Macknik) writes:

} VG: My question is,"Is there any special rates for students' membership ?".
}
} NDM:   There is a 50% discount for students under 25.  ...

[...]

}As a student, I cannot afford to join Mensa ...
}... I currently earn $7000 a year as a technician for the
}college while earning my engineering degree.  ...
}... since I am over 25, I don't qualify for the student discount.  I do feel
}that it is a rather arbitrary limitation.  ...
}... Comments?!

Mensa also makes provision for hardship cases.  In your case I think
you could reasonably petition to have the entire dues amount waived.

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@polymath.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                   Turn the rascals out!
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483     No incumbents in '92!
Santa Monica, CA  90405 {rutgers|pyramid|philabs|psivax}!ttidca!hollombe
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: BEACH-BABES
Date: 27 Jul 92 19:07:07 GMT

In article <1992Jul25.193842.7807@cbnewse.cb.att.com>, gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart) writes:
> 
> In article <1992Jul25.184225.19217@ugle.unit.no>, mortenaa@Lise.Unit.NO (Morten Aagaard) writes:
> > Most humans are attracted to the beach when the sun glows hot, is anybody
> > capable of some good explaination?
> 
> Humans have a region in the brain similar to that of pigeons and many
> other birds that is extremely iron-rich.  It helps birds navigate and
> prompts humans to remove clothing and search for large bodies of
> electrically-neutral water when solar activity is high and the
> angle of incident light is more nearly vertical.  It sometimes
> forces them to find brightly-colored, low mass spheres to strike
> as a norepinephrine releasing activity.

There is a flaw in your theory, Gil.  The water at a beach is not
electrically neutral.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: sonic@cray.com (Curtis L. Swanson)
Subject: Re: Killfiles
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:32:23 CDT

I don't know how to forge an address but it is doable.  There's even a 
newsgroup (rec.forgery) where it's discussed (along with a lot of flames
and 'trace this email, ya dweebs!' messages).

***  Curt Swanson  ***  sonic@romulus.cray.com  ***  IOTTMCO  *********
HOME:n - That mythical place where you can go and relax.......
I'd rather be in a coma.........
From: jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re:  Mensa national versus local, New York City
Date: 22 Jul 92 15:13:13 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia

Here is a suggestion:  if one of your members works at
or has access to the University of New Hampshire (or other
state university), you possibly have access to a copy 
center that charges less than any commercial copy 
center around.  Here at the University of Virginia,
our Printing Services dept. provides "personal"
copying services at 2/3rds the cost of Kinko's.
Last month, we printed 250 copies of our local group
newsletter for less than $40.  

We also have a third class mailing permit.  There are
grants available from the Publications Officer for
local groups that wish to change from first or third
class mailing permits to second class permits, which are
supposedly cheaper. You might look into that.

Yes, it would certainly be cheaper in terms of rent
to move the national office out of Brooklyn.  On the
other hand, no one has really decided what they want
the national office to DO, so how can we decide where
to move it?  Do we want to keep mailing complete
membership lists to officers every month?  Everytime
the AMC suggests that stopping this would save money, 
there is a big outcry against it.  No other organization
that I belong to provides this service (I'm talking both
cheap organizations like the Society for Creative Ana-
chronism whose dues are $25/year and the Special
Libraries Association whose dues are $100/year.).
We have to decide what we want from the national
office before we can decide where or how they will
produce it.
--
Jean L. Cooper    (BITNET: JLC5F@virginia.edu   CIS: 70253,1114)
"The true University of these days is a Collection of Books." 
                                           --Carlyle                        
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: ehp@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU ("Didi Pancake")
Subject: Re: Why mammal lips?
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 15:59:04 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.123158.8144@cs.mcgill.ca> mingmar@cs.mcgill.ca (Ming MAR) writes:
>Why are most mammals lipped?  Is this a result of random
>evolution or is there any particular reason for not being
>duck-billed?


Because crocodiles don't chew their food 20 times beore swallowing.
--
|  Didi Pancake         |     ESTJs know the answer...                   |
|  ehp@virginia.edu     |              ...the question is irrelevant.    |
|------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|  All the usual disclaimers about the origins of these opinions apply.  |
From: Craig.Wagner@p2.f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Craig Wagner)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Daylenth
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 10:50:50 -0500

  CS> From: sonic@artgate.cray.com (Curtis Swanson) 
  CS> 
  CS> 
  EP> From: gpowell@ent1.ent.ncsu.edu (Eugene Powell) Newsgroups: ... We
  EP> didn't even get into changes in spinrate of earth that might allow
  EP> vast sums for human ages, or constant knee problems for volleyball
  EP> players, since slowing down has increased gravity?
  EP> 
  > Gravity is independent of spin, is it not?
  > 
  CS> Yes, but the spin of the earth partially counteracts the force of
  CS> gravity.  Not significant if I remember right but measurable.

and

  MM> From: moroney@ramblr.enet.dec.com
  MM> 
  MM> There is a very slight decrease in the apparent force of gravity 
  MM> at the equator compared to the poles due to centrifugal force of 
  MM> the earth's rotation.
  MM> -Mike

But force from the earth's spinning is independent of gravity.  Perhaps this was
just a semantic "thing" <trying hard to avoid the word "problem"> in the
original poster's msg.
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Mensa national versus local, New York City
Date: 27 Jul 92 23:29:46 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <1992Jul27.125637.1759@nntpd.lkg.dec.com>, edp@math.zko.dec.com (Eric Postpischil) writes:
> In article <1992Jul24.191433.8577@ttinews.tti.com>,
> hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:
> 
> >GLAAM manages to print and distribute thousands of copies of a 32 - 40
> >page newsletter every month with available funds.

I've been putting off reading this thread because I wanted to
save for last what looked to me to be the battle of the century.  But
now I see it's quite a different topic than I thought.  Never mind.

GMS
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: Is the Bible really what the authors wrote?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 17:47:11 GMT

In article <1992Jul31.115043.21184@eskimo.celestial.com>, ericj@eskimo.celestial.com (Eric Jorgensen) writes:
> ericj@eskimo.celestial.com (Eric Jorgensen) writes:
> > (Oh, well...I guess I've made it pretty obvious that there are no crosses (a
> > symbol of death) hanging around anywhere nearby where *I* live.)
> 
> Actually...before I get flamed for this (I know you're out there, -grin-)
> I'll set my argument for this down, too...
> 
> ---> AS I SEE IT:
>                   Jesus was put to death on a cross, as was thousands of others
>                      throughout history.  The cross was, at the time, a means
>                      of murder - aka. a device specifically designed for murder.
>                   *I* see a crucifix (a cross) as a symbol of death.
> 
>   BTW...I still stand by my question of why the Bible is seen as 'truth' and
> others are seen as 'fiction'.  (eg. What about Japanese, Chinese, Celtic, or
> Hindu gods/godesses?)
> 

Well, I was once poked in both eyes by one of the Stooges, so I see
the "peace" sign as a sign of aggression.

Good post, BTW.

GMS
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: jswthomp@milton.u.washington.edu (James Thompson)
Subject: Re: speed of light and age of the universe
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 18:20:00 GMT

In article <712598411.F00003@blkcat.UUCP> Craig.Wagner@p2.f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Craig Wagner) writes:
>  RW> From: werme@alliant.com (Ric Werme) 
>  RW> 
>  RW> 7) Earthquakes shift the position of the Earth's axis.  6) & 7) have
>  RW> been measured and I believe they are responsible for leap seconds
>  RW> being declared at unpredictable times.
>
>This doesn't mean to imply that we #7 might otherwise be responsible for taking
>away an occasional leap second, does it?  Would an earthquake shift ever be
>responsible for speeding up the earth's rotation?

Yes!  Assuming that the earth's mass is not uniform, any movement that moved
higher-density matter closer to the center and lower-density matter closer
to the surface will change the moment of inertia in such a way that the
earth would have to speed up to preserve angular momentum.

Jim Thompson (jswthomp@u.washington.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: gpowell@ent1.ent.ncsu.edu (Eugene Powell)
Subject: Daylenth
Originator: gpowell@ent1.ent.ncsu.edu
Organization: Dept. of Entomology - NCSU, Raleigh, NC
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:45:56 GMT


  When Herodotus (historical accuracy questionable) asked Egyptian
 scribes about the age of the civilized human race, he was rebuked
 and admonished for his "hubris". He was told the Greeks were foolish
 to think they had such an ancient lineage, and that the ages of
 'intelligent' man that had already transpired were so numerous that
 no 'modern' rationality could conceive of them.
  He was also told that twice the sun had risen where it now sets, and
 twice it had set where it now rises. Given this is even possible
 whether it actually occurred or not, are there scientific theories
 that would allow an event of this kind on earth to be explained?
 Would anyone be left to record such an event, or would we fly off
 the planet as it jerked to a halt to reverse, or would a gradual
 slowing to a halt be required? Would the drifting of a landmass in
 the proper direction give the appearance of the sun standing still
 or the rotation of a landmass give the appearance of retrograde
 movement of the sun?
  To a dumb hick from the blessed south the small movement of the sun
 in arctic regions would appear over the course of the modern diel cycle
 ( or day as variously described from generous contributors to this
 newsgroup) to be small, and I might get away with telling cohorts
 that 'it ain't moved at all since last I looked'.
  We didn't even get into changes in spinrate of earth that might allow
 vast sums for human ages, or constant knee problems for volleyball
 players, since slowing down has increased gravity? And I did not
 attempt to address other issues of vast importance frequently ment-
 ioned in this realm. Alas, if not too singed by rhetorical whimsey or
 bludgeoned by chance, I welcome a forum to inspire criticism or dis-
 course on issues lofty and worthy of this group.
  BTW, GMS, weird is one of the exceptions to the i before e rule.
 That's wierd, isn't it!
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: T/ Re: T: To All MENSA Members...
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:18:08 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.023005.19909@ncsu.edu>, scott@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott A Tai) writes:
> 
> 
> In article <1992Jul27.122010.7439@klaava.Helsinki.FI>, widenius@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Risto Widenius) writes:
> |>>sat@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Andrew Tai) writes:
> |>[blah blah..]
> |>>     The problem with MENSA is the 2% rule, and it should be dropped.
> |>>
> |>>     I have felt for some time that MENSA members can be roughly
> |>>categorized into one of two groups.  Group A consists of those people
> |>[..blah blah]
> |>
> |>HOLD IT!
> |>
> |>Don't respond to this. It is not written by Scott, but by the gmc-
> |>semiconductor-fraud some months ago. Then again, it may very well
> |>be the same person.
> 
> Yes--you're right.  I'm everyone who posts provocative articles to
> rec.org.mensa.  

No, but you are everyone who posts lies from bogus addresses to
rec.org.mensa.
From: cegtitd@prism.gatech.EDU (Tim Dodd)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: IQ vs. Faith
Date: 29 Jul 92 13:47:53 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article <BkS-phB@engin.umich.edu> willism@engin.umich.edu (Mark Benjamin Willis) writes:
>In article 5243 Matthew Harper (matth@progress.COM) asks:
>>  Can you give me a biblical event that cannot be resolved with a scientific
>> answer?  I've been trying, but I think I'm at a disadvantage since I
>> feel most (all) such things *can* be explained.
>
>The clearest and (incidentally) most important example of such an event is
>the resurrection of Christ.  The Bible claims that Jesus died, was buried for
>3 days (fri-sun) and then was resurrected.  (Not as in ghost, but as in a real,
>live person who could be touched, and who ate and spent time with over 500
>people.)
>
>Obviously this is a biblical event that cannot be resolved with a scientific
>answer.

There have been other postings purporting to explain the resurrection by
asserting that Christ was not really dead.  I think it's much simpler if
we assume that the whole resurrection story was made up!

In fact, the New Testament's oldest account of the crucifiction of Christ,
the Gospel of Mark, says absolutely nothing about any resurrection.  According
to Mark, the tomb was found empty, and that was that.  The account ends right
there, with an empty tomb.  It is only in the later accounts, written many
years later (Matthew, Luke, John), that we find Christ rising from the dead.
These later accounts also have more & more elaborate stories about the origin
of Christ, conflicting genealogies, etc.

Consider this!

Tim
-- 
"It is still an unending source of surprise for me to see how a few
scribbles on a blackboard or on a sheet of paper could change the
course of human affairs."   -- Stanislaw Ulam
Tim Dodd, Research Scientist, Georgia Tech  cegtitd@prism.gatech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: scott@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott A Tai)
Subject: T/ PUT TAI IN THE FAQ (was:Re: T=What Correlation?)
Reply-To: tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 03:04:19 GMT


In article <29Jul92040915@miracle.com>, phil@miracle.com (Phil Hill) writes:
|>You know... I suddenly became aware today.  I know what this Tai thing really
|>is.  He is a AI program designed to thwart kill-files.  He has the ability
|>to mutate and get around the best kill scripts in the world.

(define not (bool) (if bool 0 1))

:)

-- Scott Tai
   tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: sonic@artgate.cray.com (Curtis Swanson)
Subject: Re: IQ vs. Faith
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 27 Jul 92 11:16:31 CDT


In article <1992Jul25.172727.4948@cbnewse.cb.att.com> gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart) writes:

>Wasn't it Oral Roberts that saw a 300-foot Jesus or something?

I heard he saw one 900 ft tall.  I have a videotape of a commedian who made
a whole routine about it.  I'll post his name and where it came from if 
there's interest......
--
***  Curt Swanson  ***  sonic@romulus.cray.com  ***  IOTTMCO  *********
HOME:n - That mythical place where you can go and relax.......
I'd rather be in a coma.........
From: jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Restricted meetings
Date: 31 Jul 92 17:38:41 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia

The question of whether Mensans can/should sponsor
men/women/children only events is a serious one that
I've been concerned about for some time.  I haven't 
rally come to any conclusions either.  I can see
the motivation for women or men (or Young Mensans,
for that matter) to want, on occasion, to exchange
ideas with persons of their own sex or age.  On 
the other hand, it certainly does give the impression
of "exclusivity."

As a female, I know that there are sometimes that
it's fun to go out and "pal around" with the
girls.  It doesn't bother me that men might want
to do the same thing.  I'm curious to hear some of
the men's opinions on this topic.  Do you want to
be able to be present at a women-only event?  Why?
Women--would you like to be able to be present at
a men-only event?  Would it make a difference if
the event was simply eating pizza at someone's
house, or going to a concert, or a political
meeting?
--
Jean L. Cooper    (BITNET: JLC5F@virginia.edu   CIS: 70253,1114)
"The true University of these days is a Collection of Books." 
                                           --Carlyle
From: eab@uh.msc.edu (Edward Bertsch)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: FAQ for rec.org.mensa - old copy
Date: 22 Jul 92 00:54:28 GMT
Organization: Minnesota Supercomputer Center

someone asked for the FAQ file - here it is.  I haven't seen it posted
lately, so I suspect we don't have anyone who is posting it or updating
it at a regular interval.  NOTE: I am not volunteering to do this.

Anyone who would like to do this, please, go right ahead!


Article: 4168 of rec.org.mensa
From: pmailman@genesis.nred.ma.us (Paul Mailman)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: speed of light and age of the universe -- NOT
Date: 22 Jul 92 17:55:14 GMT
Organization: Genesis Public Access Minix  +1 508 664 0149

In article <711788422.F00013@blkcat.UUCP> Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson) writes:
>
>Seen recently in Keshernet:
>
> Jews: God is 1!  Atheists: God is I!
>
Q: How many Christians does it take to change a light bulb?

A: Three.  But it's really one.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: scott@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott A Tai)
Subject: T/ T. MENSA vs Intelligence
Reply-To: tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 02:19:49 GMT


In article <HNVHoB3w164w@cellar.org>, atrw0176@cellar.org (Atrw93) writes:
|>Since the requirement for Mensa is solely the top two percent
|>
|>on the test, Mensa gets two percent of the population. This includes
|> 
|>two percent of the socially inept, of the flakes, &c..........

As I pointed out in an earlier post, estimates go as high as 20% as
to what percent actually manages to qualify.

-- Scott Tai
   tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: mingmar@cs.mcgill.ca (Ming MAR)
Subject: Why mammal lips?
Organization: SOCS - Mcgill University, Montreal, Canada
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 12:31:58 GMT

Why are most mammals lipped?  Is this a result of random
evolution or is there any particular reason for not being
duck-billed?
From: lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Speaker-to-Minerals)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: IQ vs. Faith
Date: 24 Jul 92 02:25:42 GMT
Reply-To: lydick@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera

In article <3349@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>, nick+@pitt.edu (Nick C De Mello) writes:
>  Religious beliefs are models of the way the world behaves.  Models
>that have been proved are called science, those that are disproved are
>labeled fiction.  Those we think can be proved, but aren't, are theories
>and those that we think can not be proved, but are believed, become
>religion and mysticism.

No.  Science is NOT "models that have been proved."  Science is models that are
potentially disprovable but haven't been disproven.