From: erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp)
Subject: Re: monthly APS announcement
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 21:23:55 GMT

anon-admin@twwells.com wrote:

: Mr. Carp, your announcement has a number of factual errors and
: unjustifiable implications. Here are the corrections.

I doubt it, Bill.

: > There are three main differences between this service and the APS at
: > twwells.com:
: >
: >         1.      Email send to khijol!anonasar@saturn.upl.com is
: >                 stripped of headers and .sig stuff, then forwarded
: >                 to alt-sexual-abuse-recovery@ucbvax.berkeley.edu.
: >                 Mail is never posted directly to the net.
: 
: This is supposed to be a meaningful difference? With your system,
: e-mail goes to khijol, is stripped of identifying info, forwarded
: to alt-sexual-abuse-recovery@ucbvax.berkeley.edu and then posted.
: In mine, the only difference is that the posting is done directly
: at twwells.com; there is no forwarding step. In *neither* system
: is e-mail posted directly to the net.
: 
: >         2.      Since all email is going through a common mailbox
: >                 on khijol, it is impossible for anonymous posters
: >                 to receive email through this service.  This is
: >                 considered an additional safety feature.
: 
: Passive voice is wonderful for obscuring the fact that not
: everyone agrees with you. You and some others may consider this a
: safety feature; however, the reality is that it makes no material
: difference given the existence of the several other anonymous
: e-mail services around. (Never mind the highly debatable point of
: whether the existence of anonymous e-mail results in a decrease
: in safety, say, in comparison with using the net in the first
: place.)

As in most sites that have a domain of something-other-than-UUCP,
the assumption can be made that .com sites are on the net.

As for your personal attacks on the veracity of the service offered,
it in no way obscures the fact that this is a service that people can
use independently of yours.  In fact, the fact that khijol (like twwells)
is being used for anonymous postings is irrelevent - with the posting of
the software, *anyone* can set themselves up as an anonymous posting
site.

: On twwells.com, BTW, when you first use the system, e-mail will
: not be forwarded to you. Unlike the khijol service, you can
: change that.

I have had numerous discussions regarding the security implications of
that.  I had not added that feature into the software, because most people
I had spoken to expressed a desire (because of your indiscretions) to have
an additional anonymous vehicle to post.  Not only do I provide that service,
I also provide the software, so that others may provide the same service.

: >         3.      Since khijol is not directly reachable from the
: >                 Internet, and is not available via dialup lines,
: >                 this makes it virtually immune to attack from
: >                 unauthorized access.  Khijol has successfully
: >                 survived a concerted attack by "crackers" intent
: >                 on gaining access to the proprietary software base
: >                 stored there, as well as the well-known "Morris
: >                 worm" incident, and has been in more-or-less continuous
: >                 service (via uucp access) for more than three years.
: 
: You put this paragraph in a list of differences, with the
: implication that twwells.com is on the Internet and so subject to
: unauthorized access. In fact, twwells.com is, like khijol, a uucp
: only site. Twwells.com has never, in its four year existence,
: suffered any kind of breach. This status is maintained by access
: software written by me and by constant monitoring.

Like I said before, most .com sites are directly on the Internet.  This isn't
a requirement; it's just simply "what is".

: However, there is one difference between the two sites that is of
: interest to the truly paranoid. :-) When you post through either
: service, the e-mail that will become the posting is routed
: through your local network, probably through the Internet, and
: then through the uucp network. During all this time, your e-mail
: address remains attached to your posting; it doesn't get removed
: until the e-mail hits khijol or twwells.com. Rather obviously,
: the fewer the sites involved in transferring the e-mail to the
: posting service, the better. Also, the more secure and
: trustworthy the intervening sites, the better.
: 
: My site is directly connected (via uucp) to two Internet sites.
: These two sites are decwrl and uunet, both of which get high
: marks for trustworthiness and security. (Even better: both have
: such a high volume of e-mail passing through them that their
: system administrators aren't likely to spot your e-mail, even if
: they happen to be looking in the right place. :-) Your e-mail to
: twwells.com will go directly from your local network or system to
: the Internet and then directly to mine. However, khijol does not
: appear to be so closely connected to the Internet; e-mail goes
: through at least one other system before getting there. It is my
: hope that Mr. Carp has taken care to see that all of the sites
: that handle his incoming e-mail are trustworthy. Provided that he
: has, both systems should be approximately equally secure.

If you had bothered to look in the uucp maps, you would have noticed that
khijol is also one hop away from the net.  Khijol is connected via uucp
to apple.com and saturn.upl.com, which are directly connected to the
Internet.  I can guarantee the safety and security of email routed through
both sites, since I know both J. R. Westmoreland (the sysadmin of saturn)
and Eric Fair (the sysadmin of apple) personally.

Like I said before, this whole thing smells like a personal attack.  My
one question is: Why?
-- 
Ed Carp, N7EKG     erc@apple.com                801/538-0177
"This is the final task I will ever give you, and it  goes  on  forever.   Act
happy, feel happy, be happy, without a reason in the world. Then you can love,
and do what you will."           -- Dan Millman, "Way Of The Peaceful Warrior"
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery