HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: eijkhout@cupid.cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Re: computer-modern: spam of typefaces?
Date: 28 Sep 92 01:42:27 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee, Knoxville - Department of Computer Science
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: eijkhout@cupid.cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout)
NNTP-Posting-Host: cupid.cs.utk.edu
Keywords: I know I shouldn't get involved in this!

In article <Sep26.164105.16514@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>, deutsch@lagrange (jesse deutsch  ) writes:
|> What about using some of the other fonts that come with TeX
|> like sans serif, or the tt fonts, etc.  Or is it the unfortunate
|> case that this has already been tried?

The unfortunate case is that most other fonts that come with TeX are
not really usable for running text. Tt fonts are good for code
examples, but not for text, and cmss is extremely idiosyncratic.
I really like it for an occasional header (over a table, or in a letter head)
but it cannot be used for ordinary text.

On the other hand, cmfib looks quite interesting.

But basically, the whole CM family has *modern* written all over it.
There is no way to generate a transitional or antiqua face with it.
Even though the big K himself suggests setting parameters to
get a Computer Modern Oldstyle.

|> Jesse

Victor.
From: smith@gramian.harvard.edu (Steven Smith)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Re: line breaking woes with font eufm, why?
Date: 2 Oct 92 21:41:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: gramian.SMITH.92Oct2164144
	<1ai6nfINN4ol@function.mps.ohio-state.edu>
Organization: Harvard Robotics Lab, Harvard University

edgar@function.mps.ohio-state.edu (Gerald Edgar) writes:
> godden@stein.u.washington.edu (Jeff Godden) writes:
> >I blundered into an interesting font, "eufm", which is reminiscent
> >of old German font that I had heard called fraktu\"r.  However, no
> >matter what I do I get warnings about overfull or underfull hboxes;
> >even if I set \tolerance = 10000.  I have tested this on a couple 
> >of different implementations of TeX, all with the same unhappy
> >result.
> 
> The is "Euler Fraktur Medium" from the AMS.  It is intended to be used
> as mathematical symbols.  So it has no glue!  Thus, it is not intended
> for typesetting text.  You would have the same problem if you try
> to set text using cmmi10, for example.

However, there is a beautiful German Fraktur and Gothic family
designed for text by H. Yaramboulis (sp).  They are called yfrak,
ygoth, yswab, and yinit.  Unfortunately, I don't know these are
available.  Perhaps someone else can help.

Steven Smith
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: sp_pm@space.alcbel.be (Paul Moore)
Subject: Where can I get TeX in the form of a compressed tar file?
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 10:15:43 +0100
X-Received: by usenet.pa.dec.com; id AA00338; Tue, 29 Sep 92 08:28:54 -0700
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X-To: comp.text.tex.usenet

Hello,

I would like to get hold of Tex to install on our Sun SPARCstation IPCs at
work. Unfortunately, I don't have FTP access, except via ftpmail at decwrl,
so I can't easily copy the sources kept on gatekeeper. 

Is TeX available as one of two compressed tar files, either source or binary
format? Also, is dvi2ps part of this standard TeX kit, or must it be obtained 
separately?

Thanks in advance, Paul
From: csansa@uta.fi (Anssi Saari)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Re: FTP site for FAQ?
Date: 6 Oct 92 22:28:18 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Tampere, Finland

In <BuLrvq.BEM@cs.psu.edu> dna@math.psu.edu (Douglas N. Arnold) writes:

>>> Could someone tell me where I could ftp the faq for this group from?

>The TeX FAQ (from Bobby Bodenheimer) and the periodic posting of supplementary
>TeX information (from Guoying Chen) are available at ftp.math.psu.edu
>in pub/FAQ.

Pretty much any usenet FAQ list can also be found @rtfm.mit.edu

Anssi
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: tvz@zandtwerk.Princeton.EDU (Timothy Van Zandt)
Subject: How to check for scriptstyle, scriptscriptstyle?
Originator: tvz@zandtwerk.Princeton.EDU
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 17:08:48 GMT


In a macro, how can one differentiate between textstyle math
mode and, e.g., scriptstyle math mode?

Tim
-- 
Timothy Van Zandt   (609)258-4050  tvz@Princeton.EDU (NeXTMail)
Dept. of Economics,  Princeton University,  Princeton, NJ 08544
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: lansd@csri.toronto.edu (Robert Lansdale)
Subject: Two problems: Boxit{} style, and font changing within verbatim{}
Organization: CSRI, University of Toronto
Distribution: na
Date: 5 Oct 92 18:45:26 GMT

I've encountered two problems that I can't solve myself. I'm using LaTeX
under EmTex:

1) The width of the box put around text using the boxit{} macro is always
   the width of the paragraph and not the text alone. The test file I used
   to verify this is:

	\documentstyle[boxit]{report}
	\begin{document}
	\begin{boxit}
	Some example text
	\end{boxit}
	\end{document}

Instead of a nice tight box around "Some example text" (as a \fbox{} would
do) I'm getting a paragraph-wide box. The problem still occurs if I enclose
the text in a verbatim environment. Any suggestions?

2) I would like to use bold face type within a verbatim environment instead
   of the typewriter font. I'm able to do this with the 'alltt' alternate
   verbatim environment but underscores and angle bracket characters are 
   not printed correctly. I assume the answer to this problem is: you
   can't do it, but I would nevertheless like to know why.

Thanks for any pointers.

--> Rob Lansdale

-- 
Robert Lansdale - (416) 978-6619       Dynamic Graphics Project	
Internet: lansd@dgp.toronto.edu        Computer Systems Research Institute
UUCP:   ..!uunet!dgp.toronto.edu!lansd University of Toronto
Bitnet:	  lansd@dgp.utoronto           Toronto, Ontario M5S 1A4, CANADA
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: Tim Larkin <tsl1@cornell.edu>
Subject: Re: What does n-up mean?
X-Xxdate: Mon, 5 Oct 92 19: 19:48 GMT
Nntp-Posting-User: tsl1@cornell.edu
Organization: Cornell University
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d7
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 18:12:48 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.005707.57@dymaxion.ns.ca> , bg@dymaxion.ns.ca writes:
>usage, I would say that in general, it refers to how many columns there
are on
>a page.  Hence, a two-column document is a "2-up" document, etc.

Actually, I believe it refers to how many >pages< a single sheet of paper 
holds. For instance, if you print the left and right hand pages of an 
article on a single side of a sheet of paper, then you have "two up".

Tim Larkin
Federal Nutrition Laboratory
Tower Road
Ithaca, New York
tsl1@cornell.edu
607-255-7008
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: knappen@obelix.kph.uni-mainz.de (Joerg Knappen)
Subject: Re: so TeX wants some TFM's that I don't have and I can't find--what to do?!
Reply-To: knappen@obelix.kph.Uni-Mainz.DE
Organization: ONO (Organisation der Nicht-Organisierten)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 11:59:17 GMT

P.S. To generate single bold symbols under the nfss, the best solution is to
include the option [amsbsy] from AMS-LaTeX and then to use the command
\boldsymbol{\gamma}.

Yours, J"org Knappen.
From: john@amc.com (John Sambrook)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Really long start-up times for (web2c) TeX ...
Summary: Web2c version of TeX takes (seemingly forever) to get started.
Date: 3 Oct 92 07:02:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: amc.1992Oct3.070223.17256
Organization: Applied Microsystems, Redmond, WA

I've recently installed the web2c version (5.851c) of TeX.  As far as
I can tell I did everything correctly.  And indeed, the package seems
to work properly.  However, it takes a very long time to start up.  I
have noticed that it takes, on average, one minute before it even 
prints the start-up banner.

The systems involved are Sun-4 systems in your average mid-sized
engineering environment.  All files are being accessed via NFS.  The
network load is not excessive; other applications such as Codecenter,
FrameMaker, Valid, etc., work fine.

On a hunch I ran trace(1) and noticed that the tex binary is accessing
every file in our fonts directory /usr/local/lib/tex/fonts (315 files), 
as well as every file in our macros directory, /usr/local/lib/tex/macros
(198 files).

Here is a sample of the trace(1) output:

    stat ("/usr/local/lib/tex/macros/manmac".., 0xf7fff640) = 0
    stat ("/usr/local/lib/tex/macros/manmac".., 0xf7fff6b0) = 0
    open ("/usr/local/lib/tex/macros/manmac".., 0, 016313600000) = 4
    fstat (4, 0xf7fff6c0) = 0
    close (4) = 0

The section above is repeated at least 500 times in the trace(1) output
I have.

So, my question is, have I made a grievous error or is this the 
correct behavior?  How long does your (web2c) version of TeX take 
to start up?  Is there anything I can do?

Thanks in advance,

-- 
John Sambrook                             DNS: john@amc.com
Applied Microsystems Corporation	 UUCP: amc-gw!john
Redmond, Washington  98073               Dial: (206) 882-2000 ext. 630
Xref: sparky comp.text.tex:11960 news.answers:3315
From: Hal.Varian@umich.edu
Subject: Re: Underlining in TeX.
Reply-To: Hal.Varian@umich.edu
Organization: University of Michigan Math Dept
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 21:07:30 GMT

In article <29SEP199213353348@msr.triumf.ca> asnd@msr.triumf.ca (Donald  
Arseneau) writes:
> In article <1992Sep29.161101.16243@athena.mit.edu>, lasmith@athena.mit.edu  
(Lones A Smith) writes...
> > 
> >I'd be interested in a macro package that would not underline any letters
> >that extend below the line (q,p,g,j,y for instance) --- does this exist??
> >(Or is it easy to construct?)
> 
> It is *possible* to construct such a macro package, but it still wouldn't
> do what you *really* want, and that is to interrupt the underline at the
> stems of descenders, but still underline the bowls.  For that you need 
> to make underlined versions of the fonts.  I am surprised that nobody has
> done this with cm since DEK mentions it in the TeXbook, and it is probably
> *The easiest* metafont exercise.
> 
> Donald
> 
> (This non-sequitur is a self-referential gratuitous plug for ulem.sty.)

I want to be able to underline math for fill-in-the-blank questions.  

I write:

\Exercise The square of $x$ is \Ans{x^2}.

TeX prints out:

Exercise 1. The square of x is ___________.

OR
                        
Exercise 1. The square of x is _____x^2______.

depending on whether some flag is set.

I've hacked together a solution for a workbook + solution manual that I do, but  
it would be nice to have it done right.

If anybody has some suggestions, please let me know.
--
Hal.Varian@umich.edu    Hal Varian
voice: 313-764-2364     Dept of Economics
fax:   313-764-2364     Univ of Michigan
                        Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1220
From: gbol@rglnext.geol.vt.edu (Gregory B. Lampshire)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Re: can someone send me some bold math fonts......or lend some help? (SOLVED)
Date: 30 Sep 92 18:36:10 GMT
Reply-To: gbol@rglnext.geol.vt.edu

In article <1992Sep29.231422.17700@cs.aukuni.ac.nz> jeremy@cs.aukuni.ac.nz  
(Jeremy Gibbons) writes:
> In <7537@vtserf.cc.vt.edu> gbol@rglnext.geol.vt.edu (Gregory B.  
Lampshire) writes:
> 
> >I tried for hours over a couple of days to get the sauter stuff to  
produce  
> > Good grief. How much is your time worth? I don't know the US prices,  
but I
> > guess the hardback MF book is about US$30, and the paperback cheaper.  
How
> > many hours do you need to waste before it becomes worthwhile buying  
the
> > book? $30 for a piece of high-quality software like Metafont would be
> > considered a bargain; why the reluctance to pay the same for a  
high-quality
> > manual to accompany a public domain piece of software?
> > 
> > Your address is an academic one; does your library not have a copy?
> > 
> 

Within the first hour of fooling with MF I was able to produce .tfm files  
using the sauter .mf files.  What I fooled around with for the ``hours''  
is getting TeX to find them when it needed them.  I do have the TeX book  
which I am now quite familiar with :-).  It seems that even when I name  
the file cmmbit7.tfm it still can't find it (7 was the size that TeX and  
NFSS was requesting).  It is almost as if NFSS is requesting this font but  
using a secret name for the .tfm file when it tries to find it or it is  
lacking some other information.  I therefore assumed it was my use of  
metafont in some way since I had played around with TeX for awhile.  And  
remember that when one says ``hours'' it doesn't mean ``days.''


And no, our library doesn't carry the METAFONT book, but it does have the  
TeX book and a few others by Knuth.


I tried the ams stuff also.  It requests the same exact font which it  
cannot find even with the ams tfm files installed.


Someone did respond:
>
> Abd of course, don't forget to customise your fontdef.local...
>   <5>cmbsy5%   was: <5>1cmsy5%
>
> Yours, J"org Knappen.
>

Which made me realize that it was a LaTeX fontloading problem.  This clue  
made me realize that I must load fontdef.max from the nfss distribution  
instead of fondef.ori in order for the correct fontname to be used and the  
correct pk generated.  I quickly rebuilt lplain.fmt with nfss and the  
correct fontdef and it worked! (It scales cmmib10 down to the size  
needed).


Thanks to all that responded---problem solved.





--
Gregory Lampshire 
Virginia Tech 
Bradley Department of Electrical Engineering
gbol@rglnext.geol.vt.edu (NeXTmail welcome)
------------------------
My opinions are my very own and do not reflect the opinions of any  
employer
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: lones@lones.mit.edu (Lones Smith)
Subject: LATEX CHANGES ITS MIND MID-DOCUMENT!! 
Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 23:29:11 GMT


Hello!
     Why must this always happen to me? Trailblazing doesn't suit me. But ...
Observe that in the following easy to LaTeX document, the defined symbols are  
first printed out okay, and then totally messed up!  But nothing has changed?   
My only guess is that this is a NeXT-specific 
dvips problem (I don't have dvips 5.47.)

Please tell me if you get a messed-up symbol too, and if it's not dvips at  
fault, what is it????

\documentstyle[12pt]{article}

\begin{document}

\def\gl{\mathrel{\vcenter{\hbox{$>$}\kern-9pt\hbox{$<$}}}}
\def\lg{\mathrel{\vcenter{\hbox{$<$}\kern-9pt\hbox{$>$}}}}

$\gl$   $\lg$

\[ V(\theta,\alpha) = v(x+\alpha \theta) \Longrightarrow \left\{
\begin{array}{ccll}
V_{\theta}(\theta,\alpha) &=& \alpha v^{\prime}(x+\alpha \theta) > 0 & {\rm  
for}
\ \alpha > 0 \\
V_{\alpha \alpha}(\theta,\alpha) &=& \theta^{2}v^{\prime\prime}(x+\alpha
\theta) < 0 & \\
\textstyle V_{\alpha}(\theta,\alpha) &\gl & 0 & {\rm for} \ \theta \lg 0 \equiv
\overline{\theta}
\end{array}
\right. \]

\end{document}



--
Lones A. Smith
Department of Economics
MIT E52-252C
(617) 253-0914
From: 12100z@d1.dartmouth.edu (Tom Buskey)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Re: Printing DVIPS output on QMS PS printer on MAC
Date: 28 Sep 92 02:56:04 GMT
Organization: School of Indiscriminate Grappling
Newsreader: MS Windows WinVN

In article <1992Sep22.023748.25522@cs.tulane.edu>, nayakcp@convex1.tcs.tulane.edu (Chiraprakash Nayak) says:
>I am running TeX on a VAX/VMS-cluster and my final output is a
>postscript file (from DVIPS). I want to print it on a QMS-810 ps
>printer hooked up to a mac-ii. (I don't have TeX on Mac). Is there a
>printer driver/uitility that would allow me to print this file on that
>printer? 
>
--
hiraprakash Nayak               ! Ph.:    (504)865-5897 (O); (504)866-3715 (R)
>Dept. Of Biomedical Engg.        ! E-mail: nayakcp@convex1.tcs.tulane.edu
>Tulane University                !         chiraprakash@mv3600.bmen.tulane.edu
>New Orleans, LA 70118-5665 (USA) !         bm2gebg@vm.tcs.tulane.edu

There is a program for the Macintosh called Apple Laserwriter Utilities (from apple) that
will dump/upload a postscript file directly to a printer.  Once you get the program on the mac,
this program will work.  If you're not running System 7 on the mac, there's a program from
Adobe that'll do the trick.  I forgot the name but it's somethingPS.
 
If you want to get TeX on the mac, there's OzTeX.  It will choke on things that need the
GNU project's Texinfo, but it works well on smaller documents.
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: njw@cs.city.ac.uk (Nick Williams)
Subject: SUMMARY: Reinforced concrete fonts
Organization: Systems Architecture Research Centre, City University
Date: 29 Sep 92 10:50:07


I asked: "There isn't a ccbx font, what do people do about not having
a bold version of the concrete font"

A precis of the replies:

	1) Hack up a ccbx?.mf file by tweaking.  This gives you
consistent fonts throughout your document, but rememeber, the fonts
are hacked up.
	-Wolfram Schlickenrieder <schli@cs.tu-berlin.de>
	-<stevea@vast.unsw.edu.au>

	2) Don't use bold in your documents.
"Actually, you might want to try working without bold for a while.
It's a different look, but I think a good one (and there are
designers who agree with me, notably Douglas Martin)."
	-Don Hosek <DHOSEK@HMCVAX.CLAREMONT.EDU>

	3) Do as Knuth Does.... In Concrete Mathematics, Knuth uses
concrete as the body font, and Computer Modern Bold Extended as his bold font.
It works, and the book publishers went for it.  A variation of this,
which follows on a bit from the discussion on the "Spam" of typefaces
in this group, is to use a sans serif bold font.
	-michael lawley <lawley@kurango.cit.gu.edu.au>
	-Frank Jensen <fj@iesd.auc.dk>

My personal opinion following this? I really do want access to bold
*occasionally*. I have tried using documents typeset in concrete
without a bold font. They work, yes, and do look very clean compared
to many documents I've seen splattered with ink (a bold font).
However, for the odd description environment, or to make the section
headers stand out a bit more in some documents, you do need a bold.

I tried the versions of ccbx that were kindly forwarded to me by
Wolfram and Steve, but I believe they didn't look that good. I don't
think concrete translates well into a bold font.

So my personal preference is to use one of the pre-existing bold
fonts: either cmbx or a sans serif bold font. I'll experiment with
these and see which I like.

Nick
--
Nick Williams                          E-mail: njw@cs.city.ac.uk (MIME and ATK)
Systems Architecture Research Centre,  Tel: +44 71 477 8551
London, EC1V 0HB                       Fax: +44 71 477 8587
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: dak@messua.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (David Kastrup)
Subject: Re: line breaking woes with font eufm, why?
Keywords: TeX, font, problems
Organization: Rechnerbetrieb Informatik  /  RWTH Aachen
Date:  7 Oct 92 01:09:32 GMT

godden@stein.u.washington.edu (Jeff Godden) writes:

>Greetings TeX mavins,

>I blundered into an interesting font, "eufm", which is reminiscent
>of old German font that I had heard called fraktu\"r.  However, no
>matter what I do I get warnings about overfull or underfull hboxes;
>even if I set \tolerance = 10000.  I have tested this on a couple 
>of different implementations of TeX, all with the same unhappy
>result.

>What am I doing wrong?

This font is not thought for setting of text. Get the excellent
old-german fonts from Yannis Harambolous (gothic, Schwabacher,
Fraktur and initials). If you fail to find them in States archives,
thay are in (I believe) /soft/tex/fonts/metafont/old-german
at ftp.uni-stuttgart.de
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: rob@dragon.acadiau.ca (Rob Hutten)
Subject: Printer driver for C.Itoh 5000
Organization: Acadia University
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 13:42:18 GMT


[Sorry if this appears twice; we're having flakey news problems]

Hi.  We're trying to print TeX files to out C.Itoh 5000 printer here,
but we don't have the required driver.  Is there some FTP site
where these babies can be found?  I'm sure this is a FAQ, but I
couldn't find the FAQ list floating around out site.

Oh, the 5000 will emulate IBM Proprinter, DEC LA210 & LA75 as well
as Epson FX-286e printers, so drivers for any of these would be
nifty too...

Thanks.
-Rob

-- 
Rob Hutten, Unix guy  
Acadia University Computer Centre, Wolfville, NS.
rob@dragon.acadiau.ca OR rob.hutten@acadiau.ca
Standard disclaimers apply.  
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
From: spel@hippo.ru.ac.za (Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse)
Subject: Re: Registered trademark symbol in LaTeX?
Organization: Katatura State Hospital, Windhoek, Namibia
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 18:58:55 GMT

In <9209211324.AA00578@minnie.nic.kingston.ibm.com> djk@minnie.nic.kingston.ibm.com (David Klepacki) writes:

>  How does one get a registered trademark symbol in LaTeX?
>There is a \copyright command in LaTeX, but not a trademark
>symbol?  Is there a font somewhere (via the internet) where
>I can obtain such a symbol?
Bad form actually,

it is quite easy, look into latex.tex and roll it yourself
taking \copyright as a model.


Anyway, here is what I use:

\def\regmark{{\ooalign{\hfil\raise.07ex\hbox{\rm\tiny R}\hfil\crcr
                    {\scriptsize\mathhexbox20D}}}}
\newcommand{\regTM}{$^{\regmark}$}
\def\leftregmark{{\ooalign{\hfil\raise.07ex\hbox{\rm\tiny L}\hfil\crcr
                    {\scriptsize\mathhexbox20D}}}}
\newcommand{\copyleft}{$^{\leftregmark}$}


greetings, el
-- 
Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse    \          /                   (spel@hippo.ru.ac.ZA)
Katatura State Hospital   \        |                            (el@lisse.NA)
Dept of Obstetrics & Gyn   \ *    /                         Private Bag 13215
Windhoek, Namibia           ;____/ (postmaster@uonamib.NA) Postmaster NAmibia
From: yeonwook@hardy.u.washington.edu (Mark Choi)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: Installing DVIPS (questions)
Date: 29 Sep 92 03:33:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Sep29.033344.5145
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle



Hello. I have just finished unzipping the two DVIPS .zip files, one
containing the software, the other containing the postscript fonts.
However, I do not know what environment variables I must enter. I know
that there must be an environment variable for the location of the 
virtual fonts which is in directory c:\texfonts\vf, however, I do not 
know what the dvips program recognizes as the variable. I am also 
wondering if there are any virtual fonts available for the cm bitmap
.pk fonts, since I would just like to make a clean conversion from
a .pcl to .ps file using similar fonts.

Thanks
-- 
    .  .      +---------------------------------+
  --|--|      | Mark Yeon Wook Choi             |
   /.\ |      | yeonwook@hardy.u.washington.edu |
  --|--|      +---------------------------------+
From: ky04@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (KUN YU)
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex
Subject: How to \input{whole-latex-file}
Date: 2 Oct 92 00:02:54 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

We would usually need to input a complete latex file, containing 
lines \documentstyle{}, \begin{document}, \end{document}, which we have 
latex'ed to check the syntax. 
When we \input, those command lines will cause trouble.
How to ask latex to ignore those lines in the input-file? 
Assuming we don't like to re-edit the input-files to delete those lines.
I guess a style could do it.
-- 



                                                          _                  
ky04@lehigh.edu                                         / _ \
KYu, BioProcessing Institute                          /\ _|_ /\
111 Lehigh University                                    /|\
Newsgroups: comp.text.tex