From: ksm@abb-sc.abb-sc.com (Ashley)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Annoying, cloying "wann-be"s
Summary: Trying to keep perspective and decorum....
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:28:55 GMT
Organization: Kaos Laboratories


In article <gm51TB2w165w@ailanth.UUCP>, ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes...
>ksm@abb-sc.abb-sc.com (Ashley) writes:
> 
>>    What an absolutly perfect example of why people have trouble with
>> sci-fi/fantasy fans! You are starting to sound just like the people I
>> problems with! Being so over-defensive is NOT something that is going
>> your cause. Also, not everybody *wants* to submerge themselves in "mai
>> sci-fi/fantasy fandom so as to get a good view of it. So much of the g
>> is so badly written, (we have already gone over the fact that there is
>> stuff there too, don't jump on this one) it's no wonder people like An
>> have trouble associating such dreck with thinking people above age 11.
>> may have run into some sexist crap too, more than enough of that out t
>> be offended by!
>>
>"people" have trouble with "sci-fi/fantasy fans".  how nice.  we fans
>are not people.  how nice.  fantasy/SF literature has no greater
>percentage of sexist bullshit that any other genre, if you actually
>cared to look insteaad of blather.

Wow, look what you can construe if you decide to define someones words to mean 
somthing else! I was telling mark off for blowing up, NOT saying that 
sci-fi/fantasy fans are not people. Seems you are LOOKING for something to be 
upset about! "Not people". Great Goddess, you're desparate for something aren't 
you?

	As for sexism in the sci-fi/fantasy genre, go to the store and lok and 
read something other than your favorites. You will see that the BULK of the 
writing is trash geared towards the lowest intelligence on the planet. I've 
said it before, I'll say it again, the dumbest buy the most-est, and that 
drives the market down to their level. So, unfortuantely, the bulk of books 
published and sold are shit. 



>>    If you want to be taken seriously and not written off as a child wi
>> an ultra-thin skin, PLEASE don't blow up like this!!! You do us all a
>> dis-service when you do. And just think for a moment, if you blew up l
>> this at someone who had been misinformed by a fundie about Witchcraft
>> think you would enlighten or alienate them? My point.
>>
>written off as a child by whom?  you?  why should he care?  mark has
>been around for a while.  we know him.  those of us who respect him,
>respect him.  if you choose not to, that is your problem.


Don't get the picture do you? Blowing up like mark did does not facitiate 
making his point. It only makes him look like an asshole an turns off the 
people who he could have made his point to. Whether he is an asshole or not 
remains to be seen, I don't think he is, I think this is a simple emotional 
outburst and no harm done, mark seems intelligent enough, just a little over 
defensive. You on the other hand seem to want to jump down my throat for 
trying to keep things from elevating. What is your problem?


>>    And a lot of people here being sci-fi/fantasy fans? I'm getting
>> fan-mail as well as hate-mail now. It seems to be about equal or sleig
>> more twards anti-"fanboy" if you count those who are just venting frus
>> with the types of idiots I discussed in my first posts. But some peopl
>> have a *lot* harsher words for sci-fi/fantasy fans than I do. (Don't w
>> folks, I'm not going to post your messages or "out" you to the net, I'
>> counting numbers and replying!)
>>
>well, i did a poll a few months back and got tons of responses from
>people who are SF-fans/RPGers/comic book collectors.  there's a LOT of
>overlap.  live with it.

Don't need to tell me there's a lot of overlap. I know already, and have known 
all along. You didn't read any of the previous posts did you? We have been 
differentiating between people who read the genre and people who are OBSESSED. 
Those who enjoy it but don't live by it are not the people who are a problem. 
Those who are perpetually living in their own little world filled with 
juvenile immature fantasies and who try to impose that inner world upon those 
of us who don't want it are the problem. THAT is what we have been trying to 
discuss! 

There are plenty of people on the net who are frusterated with the sho-pagans 
and Sci-Fi Dweeb Wizards. If you LIKE people who act like 5 year olds and claim 
to be dark elves and high priests of Cthulu in your circle, that's your 
problem. I prefer to keep that kind of crap out of the circle.

> 
>>    As for e-mail, I got a string of garbage, maybe from you?, no words
>> just static. Something wrong with your port or modem?
>>
>>
>ashley, you are a fuckhead.


Saying that I did not recieve an e-mail from mark results in such an insult 
from you? You really do have a problem don't you?


> 
> 
>                                             -ailsa
> 
>p.s. anybody want to start a thread on pagan elements in Swamp Thing?
>*grin*

I was dissapointed when DC pulled the shit on Rick Veich. That was chickenshit.
Transition was rough, but things are better now. The Mardi Gras issue was 
really nice. I wish they'd do something more creative than bringing back Arcane 
though. That's really typical and feels like a cop-out.

	NOW ARE YOU GETTING THE PICTURE?


		- Ashley