From: mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Pessimism
Date: 30 Sep 92 17:11:18 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Oracle Corporation
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <1992Sep29.190941.17892@morrow.stanford.edu> HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels) writes:
>In article <1992Sep29.170119.1020@oracle.us.oracle.com>,
>mfriedma@uucp (Michael"Stupidity Reigns" Friedman) writes:

>>>>Actually, I think the tunnle vision is on the other side.  See below...

>So black people are responsible for how you act?  Droll...

Nope.  Just incorrect.  I'm not sure what you think I wrote, but it
doesn't seem to have been what I actually wrote.  I was accused of
tunnel vision.  I replied that I thought that the person making the
accusation was suffering from tunnel vision, not me.

>>>>So how did they get this "honorary white status"?  Perhaps whites just
>>>>naturally find yellow more aesthetically pleasing than black?  Or
>>>>maybe it's something a little more complicated.

>>>Yeah, stupid. Maybe, just maybe, it's racism.

>Check this, y'all.  He wants to make it a matter of being more or
>less "aesthetically pleasing".  He wants to make it more complicated
>than it actually is.  Bullshit.

No again, Gabrielle.  The bit about being aesthetically pleasing was
sarcasm.  It was presented as an obviously incorrect hypothesis that I
suspected would be similar to the response I would receive.

>>Jeeze.  Talk about tunnel vision....

>That's nice. Black folks (me) are more racist than certain whites
>(him).  Grandiose.

Do you know what the term tunnel vision means?  It has nothing to do
with racism.  

It's kind of difficult debating with you because you don't seem to
understand half of what I have written.

>Long time ago, as I remember, Jews and blacks in New York couldn't
>get a cup of coffee downtown. 

Yup.  Things change.  Now ask how and why.  After all, you want to
make them change even more, right?  

>You wonder how people get gradations of color down?

>They'll have clauses in housing contracts.

No longer legal or enforcable.  As the people selling are leaving
anyway, they have no incentive to honor them.  There are very few
people who are racist enough to turn down a higher offer for their
house because of the color of the prospective buyer.

>They'll even say to pollsters and
>people conducting social science studies that they'd rather have the
>Irish, or the Puerto Ricans, or the Chicanos.  But not the blacks.

Yup.  As before, things change and will probably continue to change.
The important questions, which you don't seem to want to answer or
even ask is how and why.

>Asians may be the model minority.  But I know so good and well they
>hate that shit, too.  It's a double whammy.

Depends.  Some do.  Other think the ones who hate it are whiners.
After all, would you really hate a stereotype that said you are smart,
honest, and hard-working? 

>I know, too, that the Irish under Kearney in the San Francisco area
>did a  lot of rioting and lynching of Asians in the olden days...

Yup.  As before, things changed.  Why?  How?  How can they be changed more?

>Despite what you and the rest of you guys think, blacks are the last
>folks to melt in the melting pot.

True again.  I never denied this.  Now ask why.

>One last point. Toni Morrison talked about how as a little girl she
>assisted a young boy who had trouble learning in class. He was
>foreign.  As soon as he got his bearings, and learned enough English
>to get around, he pushed her aside for the white kids.  He was no
>longer "colored", he could now be an American.

So?  I fail to see the point.

>You bore me with your wild-ass suppositions.  

In particular?

>Familiarity with you
>naturally breeds contempt.

My my, aren't we pleasant today.

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Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american