From: nelson@pdn.paradyne.com (Bill Nelson)
Subject: Re: Ye Great Sinners
Organization: AT&T Paradyne, Largo, Florida
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 18:45:07 GMT

In article <1992Sep27.144245.1@ulkyvx.louisville.edu> rtsumn01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu writes:
>In article <1992Sep26.162026.7098@iscsvax.uni.edu>, marshall1198@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
>> In article <15707@umd5.umd.edu>, twisted@bessel.umd.edu (Rick MacKinnon) writes:
>> 
>>> "And Bartholomew begat Shazera" (Gen. 6:14)  Does this tell you nothing of your
>> 
>> Genesis 6:14 states, "So make yourself an ark of cypress wood; make rooms in it
>> and coat it with pitch inside and out."
> 
>Uh-uh.  It was gopherwood.  You are wrong.


My bible says cypress wood, too; but neither here nor there, marshall misquoted 
Genesis when he spoke of Bartholomew and Shazera.  That is not to be found in Gen
6:14, where was it found originally?


>
>> What does this say about you fate?  I don't see how this applies.
>> 
>>> fate!  And, lo, God turned Lot's wife into a pillar of salt, and don't think
>>> He won't to the same to you!
>> 
>> Perhaps He might.
>
>God couldn't turn a turnip into a  tomato.


Too long of a debate to discuss here.


>
>> 
>>> I say this to you, not for any personal gain, but because, like Jesus, I love
>>> every one of you, and I only want the best for you.  You disdain the Bible,
>>> claiming it is not true.  But I have proof!  God says, "My words are true!"
>>> (Ecc. 5:14)  Does that not shake your souls to their roots?  But you will not
>> 
>> Ecclesiastes 5:14 states, "or wealth lost through some misfortune, so that
>> when he has a son there is nothing left for him."  
>
>Wrong again; It says: "As he came forth from his mother's womb, so again shall
>he depart, naked as he came, having nothing from his labor that he can carry in
>his hand."  You *must* have the censored version.


You are both right (sort of - at least in the same part of the bible), Ecc. 5:14 
                                                                       ^^^^^^^^^
states "or wealth lost through some misfortune, so that when he has a son there 
is nothing left for him.

Ecc 5:15 states "Naked a man comes from his mother's womb, and as he comes, so he
^^^^^^^^
departs.  He takes nothing from his labor that he can carry in his hand."

Please, if you are going to quote something, at least reference the correct verses
so we all can look it up correctly.


> 
>> This is the place in Ecclesiastes where the Preacher is saying that riches are
>> not the best this that we have.
>> 
>>> listen, for Jesus said "You cannot hear the words of God because you are not
>>> of God."  Then he told his followers "Ye are not worthy of God because you have
>>> not one mustard seed of faith."  Does this mean nobody will go to Heaven?  No!
>> 
>> Jesus said to the Twelve AND others around him, "The secret of the kingdom of
>> God has been given to you."
>> 
>> Jesus also said to his disciples, "I tell you the truth, if you have faith as
>> small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to
>> there' and it will move.  Nothing will be impossible for you."
>> 
>>> For He says "He who believes in me shall have eternal life!" (John 3:16)  Yes,
>>> even Hitler himself can walk through the pearly gates if he believes!
>> 
>> John 3:16, "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son, that
>> whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
>> 
>> At least you got one verse partly correct.
>
>However, you are in error (as usual).  The real words from It:
                                            ^^^^^^^^^^


To say one is in ERROR, assumes that both parties have the same origin of study.
It appears that marshall's translation is someone different than the one Rick (or
I) have so such an assumption is false.  Why do you say that yours are the REAL
WORDS?  Such a statement indicates that others are incorrect and yours is the
only truth.  Why is yours the correct version and all other incorrect?  It all 
lies in the translation.  


>"For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who
>believes in him might not perish but might have eternal life."
>                ^^^^^ ^^^            ^^^^^
>
>My other _The Holy Bible_ says (John 3:16):
>"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever
>believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
>                 ^^^^^^ ^^^
>
>I find it interesting how a couple words can make a great difference in how one
>is led.


I agree, but thank God that we are not to rely on the "words" in themself, but by
the Holy Spirit who leads us.


> 
>>> But you, who turn your faces from God, shall feel His holy wrath!  Hellfire
>>> shall consume you, and you will learn that you have been misled!  Turn back
>>> now before it's too late!  For surely, as God said "Suffer not a witch to
>>> live!" shall you meet your eternal fate much sooner than you'd like!
>>>
>>> Ponder these words that Jesus spake unto the masses: "And ye shall take up thy
>>> wages and earnings, denouncing them for their earthly pleasure, and ye shall
>>> give them unto your Holy Leaders, your priests, who shall hold them in My
>>> keeping." (John 4:21-24)
>> 
>> What is that crap that you have written?  
>> 
>> John 4:21-24 says, "Jesus declared, 'Believe me, a time is coming when you will
>> worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.  You Samaritans
>> worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from
>> the Jews.  Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will
>> worship the Father in spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers
>> the Father seeks.  God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and
>> in truth.'"
>
>"No" again.  The Truth:
>"Jesus said to her, 'Believe me, woman, the hour is coming where you will
>worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.  You people
>worship what you do not understand; we worship what we understand, because
>salvation is from the Jews.  But the hour is coming, and is now here, when true
>worshipers will worship the Father in Spirit and truth; and indeed the Father
>seeks such people to worship him.  God is Spirit, and those who worship him
>must worship in Spirit and truth.'"


Whats the problem? Both are quoting the same scripture, only in one, the word 
"woman" is left out in one (I think that Rick made a mistake there) and 
"Samaritans" has been interchanged with "people".  When you are referring to the 
"Truth", both verses are saying the SAME THING!  The fact remains the the original 
posting by marshall is riddled with misquotes and thus the rebuttal by Rick.


>  
>> It appears that you had no idea what you were talking about according to what
>> you say is John 4:21-24.
>
>And how many have been led astray by all the translations of _The Holy Bible_
>which were slightly "off"?  (Why, the answer is simple, Xians say:  "None; God
>would not allow His Word to be Misquoted!")  Xians are blind to the world about
>them, carving new venues in the realms of Ill-logic. . .right?  Silence will be
>interpreted as the Holy Yes.


Not true, the bible has been misquoted since the early days of its origin and has
been misquoted up to this day - see marshall's original post.  


> 
>>> Rev. John D. Baptist
>> 
>> Cute.
>> 
>>> Disclaimer: I don't believe any of this hellfire and damnation shit, why should
>>> you?
>> 
>> No wonder you do not believe in it at all.  You quote nonsense.  You should
>> believe, for it is truth.
>
>It is written:  "They who quoteth ye Bible in the name of God quoteth nonsense."


And it is written that: 

        "All scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking,
         correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God
         may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
                                                            2 Tim. 3:16, 17

> 
>> -- 
>> We'll know who's right in the end    *     Evan Marshall
>> Every knee shall bow                 *     marshall1198@iscsvax.uni.edu
>> We'll know who's right in the end    *
>> Every tongue confess                 *
>> 
>
>Know ye, God has had a profound effect on my life.  He has taught me His Way 
>for He has told Me His Secret.  The real Truth is that He was Lying all along;
>He was fabricated by Its Creators in order to control Its Worshippers. I see His
>Light and I am pleased; We are all Doomed for there is no Heaven and there is no
>Hell; we prey for Nothing:  Death itself. 
>
>--Shaitan & Semhaza--


What a light cheery thought!  :-)


My love to all of you in Christ Jesus, Amen.


--
| Bill Nelson    |                                  | Opinions expressed do not necessarily |
| AT&T Paradyne  |    This space intended blank!    | reflect those of my employer; in fact,|
| (813) 530-8696 |                                  | they may not represent mine either.   |
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