HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bonacci@ecf.toronto.edu (BONACCI John)
Subject: Re: Trivia of interest-- Borg
Organization: University of Toronto, Engineering Computing Facility
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 04:11:01 GMT

In article <1992Sep4.153231.12823@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> clc5q@hemlock.cs.Virginia.EDU (Clark L. Coleman) writes:
>In article <Btvzs5.74J@ecf.toronto.edu> bonacci@ecf.toronto.edu (BONACCI John) writes:
>>Can anyone recall...
>>Was there much of an overlap between Borg and Lendl?  What was
>>their head-to-head record?
>
>I think Lendl did surprisingly well against Borg, considering that Borg retired
[...lots of neat tennis history showing Borg 3 Lendl 2 deleted...]
>These are the only 5 matches I can track down between the two players. 
[...]
Now that's what I call a post! :-)
That answers my question just fine.
Thank you.
JB

p.s.: considering the short history of these two, it would have been
quite ironic if Connors had beaten Lendl at the Open this year, no?
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: jeganath@leland.Stanford.EDU (Muthuveerappan Jeganathan)
Subject: speed of a serve
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 21:32:02 GMT

Hi folks, while watching the US open I found something very interesting that 
made me think, more than the game itself. It concerns the speed of the serve 
that is indicated after every serve by a box with a huge IBM logo on it. The 
question is, what speed are they really talking about - average (between what 
two points?), instantaneous (at what point?) or is it the maximum speed attained
by the ball. The second part of the question is, how is the speed measured -
simple timing between two points (how?), doppler shift (yeah right!), etc.?

No speculation please (I can make quite a few of my own, thank you). Respond 
only if you are positive. Thanks.

-- Muthu Jeganathan


Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: bonacci@ecf.toronto.edu (BONACCI John)
Subject: Re: speed of a serve
Organization: University of Toronto, Engineering Computing Facility
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:13:08 GMT

In article <1992Sep15.023603.815@wam.umd.edu> haas@wam.umd.edu (The Future Mr. Graf) writes:
>I have had press passes to a number of tennis tournaments in the last
>4 years, and the majority of the pros feel that the radar gun is VERY
>inaccurate.  Derrick Restagno says that the guns are rarely even in 
                                                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>the ballpark, and while I can't stand Derrick, I would have to agree.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^!!
>There have been too many instances where you know the serve was faster
>than was displayed.  

Um, so how would he know?  Really, though, this is just what I was trying
to say.  It is an indicator, not a closely-controlled scientific measurement.
I am confident that it is *in*accurate.  Not because it is cheap equipment,
but because there is more than one degree of freedom.  But as long as it is
not cheap equipment and it is employed consistently, it will indicate a
server's speed, albeit with some amount of error.  And I would go out on a
limb to say that the error would be biased to the low side (with readings
as low as actual * cos 15 * cos 10, where 15 is a rough upper bound to 
horizontal angle and 10 for vertical angle that the path of the ball makes 
with the line of the gun, assuming that it works along a single line and not
radial paths).  So that's about -5% just from geometric effects.
A "ballpark" should be able to accomodate at least this much.

But I can't believe anyone would actually be moved to whine about it.
That's almost as bad as whining about the height of the net.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: clc5q@hemlock.cs.Virginia.EDU (Clark L. Coleman)
Subject: Re: McEnroe doubles argument ?
Organization: University of Virginia Computer Science Department
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 14:08:32 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.230507.4960@ringer.cs.utsa.edu> mhopper@ringer.cs.utsa.edu (Mark Hopper) writes:
>
>  I heard today from a friend that John McEnroe had become involved
>  in an arguement (hard to believe) while playing a doubles match.
>  From what I heard, one of Mac's opponents became upset while 
>  McEnroe was arguing a line call with the offical.  None the less
>  some words were exchanged and after the match, Mac's opponent was 
>  irate and was yelling at McEnroe that he wanted to meet him after 
>  the match to settle things.  Also there were quite a few bleep outs
>  due to the fowl language.
>  I have been watching some coverage on USA but I have heard nothing 
>  of the incident.  I was hoping someone else had seen it as well and could
>  fill in the details.

John McEnroe and Michael Stich were playing Scott Davis and David Pate.
Doubles matches are best out of 3 sets at the U.S. Open, at least before
the last round or two, and McEnroe/Stich won the 1st and 3rd to win a
tough match.

Scott Davis' new girlfriend, Shaun Stafford, who laughed and giggled her
way through 3 sets against Martina Navratilova in the 1st round, was
laughing and giggling and shouting encouragement after points from her
box in the front of the stands.  McEnroe got upset about it and shouted
something like, "Why don't you behave like a human being?"  Davis shouted
back at McEnroe and they argued briefly at the net.  The match was over soon
afterwards.  Then Davis started arguing with McEnroe after the match, and
was shouting profanities at him and saying "maybe we should finish this in
the locker room."  McEnroe was arguing and shouting back, but was not using
any profanity.  As a result, McEnroe was not fined, but Davis was fined
$2000.

And now, back to the real tennis action ....

P.S. As for "fowl language", perhaps Davis called him a "chicken" or
something.  Or did you mean "foul language" instead?  :-)
-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is seldom that any liberty is lost all at once." David Hume
|||  clc5q@virginia.edu (Clark L. Coleman)
From: clc5q@hemlock.cs.Virginia.EDU (Clark L. Coleman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
Subject: Re: US Open SPOILERS: Men's 4R, Women's QF
Date: 9 Sep 92 14:16:42 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia Computer Science Department

In article <1992Sep9.045037.11346@iti.gov.sg> dlee@iti.gov.sg (Dennis Lee) writes:
>
>I still haven't heard the result of the much-anticipated Becker-Lendl
>4th round clash.  From the results, I think we can take it that Edberg is
>clearly *not* at his best, having to struggle through a 5-setter.  I
>still pick Becker to get past Lendl, and if he does, Edberg has another 
>acid test before reaching the semis, where he should get an easier
>opponent, *if* he makes it.

I believe your prediction about Becker getting past Lendl did not turn out
too well.  It also sounds like Edberg only has an acid test in the quarters
if he has to play Becker, not Lendl. We will see about that tomorrow. And
the semifinal opponent might be Wayne Ferreira, who is as tough as Richard
Krajicek, and has a more well rounded game with groundstrokes that were at
least equal to Emilio Sanchez's.

>
>Fernandez has never posed much of a threat to Seles, and Seles should
>be able to make the final handily.

Didn't Mary Joe beat Monica in the semis of the Australian Open a few
years ago, then lose to Graf in the final? And Seles is not the only
one who has improved since then.  This will be the first time Seles
has played against the new, aggressive Mary Joe, which might at least
add some interest to the match.
-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is seldom that any liberty is lost all at once." David Hume
|||  clc5q@virginia.edu (Clark L. Coleman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: jeganath@leland.Stanford.EDU (Muthuveerappan Jeganathan)
Subject: Re: speed of a serve
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 92 05:21:05 GMT

In article <1992Sep15.023603.815@wam.umd.edu> haas@wam.umd.edu (The Future Mr. Graf) writes:
>I have had press passes to a number of tennis tournaments in the last
>4 years, and the majority of the pros feel that the radar gun is VERY
>inaccurate.  Derrick Restagno says that the guns are rarely even in 
>the ballpark, and while I can't stand Derrick, I would have to agree.
>
>                                             Jeffrey
>
This is exactly what prompted me to post the original message. I could 
not find a simple accurate way of measuring the speed of the ball. The 
radar gun brings up another question. What ensures that the gun is 
pointed directly at the ball. If, as some one pointed out, the same 
mechanism that is used to measure the speed of cars is employed, should 
not the ball be directly moving towards or away from the gun for accurate
measurement?

Or is this issue best discussed in sci.physics or something...!?!

-- Muthu Jeganathan

Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: fish@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Eric West)
Subject: Re: US Open - early Sunday results (spoilers)
Followup-To: rec.sport.tennis
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 17:09:01 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.220427.20122@src.umd.edu> Charles C. Lin writes:

	[stuff deleted about college players doing less well
	than players who turn pro before college]
>
>
>   Anyway, there seems to be a whole spate of US college players
>that may be ready to break out.  Names such as Alex O'Brien,
>Jonathan Stark, and Jared Palmer (all of the powerhouse Stanford
>tennis team), as well as Shaun Stafford, and Lisa Raymond
>were names to look at during this first week at the Open.
>

	Don't forget MailVai Washington, who played for the University of
Michigan and was ranked #1 in the NCAA before he turned pro in either 1989
or 1990.  Seeded #14, he is definitely the most successful US college
player in recent years.

>   By the way, Martin did go the college route attending
>Northwestern where he played number one on their team.
>This was his third US Open.  He lost in the first round
>to Fleurian in 1990 (I have a US Open book from last
>year that had the draw from 1990), but seemed to have
>made the third round last year.

	As a student at Northwestern, I have a special interest in Martin.
He was named Big Ten Freshman of the Year in 1989, and the following year
he led the men's tennis team to its first Big Ten championship title in
years.  He turned pro just before his junior year, and since then his best
Grand Slam event result has been in the 1991 French Open, when he made the
round of 16 as a qualifier, losing in that round to Jim Courier (who later
won the tournament, of course).  I was sorry to see him lose to Sampras
especially after being up a set, but as his rank improves, he should be
able to enter more Grand Slam events without having to go through the
qualifying rounds or being awarded a wild-card spot.  Go Todd!
From: sunder@altair.crhc.uiuc.edu (Srinivas Sunder)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
Subject: Question
Date: 13 Sep 1992 19:25:36 GMT
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: altair.crhc.uiuc.edu

Could someone tell me what Monica Seles' nationality is? I thought
all along that she was a Czech, but was startled to read a UPI report
that said that she was from Yugoslavia (or at least the former Yugoslavia).

Please reply by e-mail to sunder@crhc.uiuc.edu. 
I don't read this newsgroup.

-- 
Srinivas Sunder                                         sunder@crhc.uiuc.edu

If my employer shares these views, I'd be most surprised.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: shun@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (shun.cheung)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
Subject: Re: SPOILER: Graf/Sanchez-Vicario
Date: 9 Sep 92 22:43:30 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <lasc9lINN6tc@news.bbn.com> adolce@bbn.com (Anne Dolce) writes:
>Women's Quarter-Finals
>----------------------
>  Sanchez-Vicario(5) d. Graf(2)  7-6, 6-3
>
>I only watched the second set, but it looked like all
>Arantxa did was keep the ball in play and watch Steffi
>commit one unforced error after another.  :-(

Unforced errors have been Steffi Graf's main problem in the last
three matches she lost: French Open final against Seles, Olympics
final against Capriati and this match. According to the newspaper,
Graf was already very unhappy with her unforced errors in the
early round matches at the US Open. I also saw her screaming
at herslef when she missed some shots during practice on Tuesday.
I was there at the US Open today and watch the Graf-Sanchez match
live. As Anne pointed out, Arantxa beat Steffi essentially the same
way she beat her the last two times: keeping the ball in play and
let Steffi beat herself. IMHO, Arantxa didn't play spectular;
just steady. Of course that turned out to be the winning strategy
once again for her.

To make things worst for herslef, Graf made several silly errors
in her many break point opportunities and also committed some double
faults at key points. The match was actually very close; IMHO Steffi
Graf only has herself to blame for not winning it. I was a little
surprised that the crowd was quite pro-Steffi and was really pulling
for her when she was down. The same thing happened to Stefan Edberg
on Tuesday. I guess the NY crowd likes their past champions.

This seems to be the US Open of upsets on the women's side. Martina,
Capriati, Sabatina and Graf all get upset at one stage or another.
Let's see what happens to Seles. On paper, it looks like nobody
can stop her now.
-- 
-- Shun Cheung,    electronic: shun.cheung@att.com    voice: (908) 615-5135
     HR 1A-304, AT&T Bell Labs, 480 Red Hill Road, Middletown, NJ, 07748 USA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: govindar@cs.rpi.edu (Ramakrishna Govindaraju)
Subject: Re: Lendl vs. Edberg ( final result )
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 21:06:46 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.203325.17478@usl.edu>, sgs@ucs.usl.edu (Sudhindranath SG) writes:
|> In article <7d7y80=@rpi.edu> govindar@cs.rpi.edu (Ramakrishna Govindaraju) writes:
|> >
|> >Edberg beat Lendl. Final score:
|> >
|> >    6-3, 6-3, 3-6, 5-7, 7-6
|>                          ^^^
|> 
|> Can someone give the tie-breaker score ? 
|> 

Lendl lost the tie breaker 7-3. They were on serve on the tie breaker until
3-3.


-Rama

Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: sbmalloc@socs.uts.edu.au (Stuart Malloch)
Subject: US Open - patch on players' shirts
Organization: Computing Sciences, Uni of Technology, Sydney.
Date: 11 Sep 92 03:37:46 GMT

I have noticed that about 80% of players at the US Open are wearing on their
shirts a round yellow patch with a red symbol on it. Can anyone tell me what
the patch is for and why so many of the players are wearing it?

Thanks
Stuart

------------------------- sbmalloc@socs.uts.edu.au ---------------------------
Stuart Malloch
University of Tecnology, Sydney
Australia
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: clin@eng.umd.edu (Charles Lin)
Subject: Re: Ivan Lendl! (Jimmy, for once why don't you quit whinning?
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 92 20:05:50 GMT
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Maryland, College Park
Originator: clin@convolution.eng.umd.edu


In article <4efrR0q00WDKQ4g20g@andrew.cmu.edu>, Vernon H Harmon <vh00+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>>
>Here's to players like Courier, Edberg, Chang, Sampras, etc... They
>might contest a shaky call but they don't loose their composure and
>professionalism!
>>
>
>oh, really. Did you happen to catch the Courier/Agassi match last night?
>At one point, Courier hit a first serve that was called out ("just out")
>by the chair ump, who happened to be sitting right above the line it
>missed. When Courier found out it was overruled by the ump, he proceeded
>to walk across the court back to the service line saying "FUCK YOU FUCK
>YOU FUCK YOU..." etc, about ten or twelve times (USA had a camera on
>him). NOW tell me these guys never lose their composure or their
>professionalism.....
>

    Well, he did say it pretty quietly, unless USA masked it out, which
it may have.   I doubt Coutrier wanted the umpire to hear that and give him
a warning.   On the whole, though, he appears better behaved than
someone like Connors, Lendl, or McEnroe, even though he used to be
much worse.  However, he is not as calm as someone like Washington,
or Chang, or Todd Martin, all of whom seemed to shrug off bad
calls, and get on with it.  Chang is possibly the worst of the
three mentioned and he doesn't get abusive, though he will question
calls.  I've only seen Washington complain once, and it was a 
friendly sort of protest (he looked at the linesman, waved his
hands as if they weren't paying attention, then went back).

    They aren't perfect, but it seems an improvement over the
older players.

--
Charles Lin
clin@eng.umd.edu



Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: Anne Bilek <anne@boombox.micro.umn.edu>
Subject: Re: US Open - General Observations
Organization: University of Minnesota
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1a2
     <BuDnFn.9rL@ecf.toronto.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 21:16:12 GMT




In article <1992Sep10.151021.1328@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> Clark L.
Coleman, clc5q@hemlock.cs.Virginia.EDU writes:

>In article <18nj0cINNh4@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>
ananth@universe.som.cwru.edu 
>(Ananth Srinivasan) writes:
>>After the Courier-Agassi encounter last night, the jokers
>>have exited and now we can watch some real tennis! It
>>should be a great Saturday/Sunday of tennis.
>
>Amen. The people who aren't really tennis fans can probably turn off
their
>TV sets and the rest of us can enjoy it.

Yeah, don't you hate it when people who have only a passing interest in
the sport watch it?  I know the fact that mere neophytes are watching
detracts from my enjoyment of the sport!  It also bugs me that public
courts exist, because then people who are don't really know anything
about advanced stroke production, strategy and the rich history and
tradition of the game are ACTUALLY ALLOWED TO PLAY.
>
>A general comment about TV sports.  The audience for big events tends to
be
>composed largely of very casual fans who outnumber the serious,
knowledgeable
>fans.  For example, I am bored to death by baseball until the playoffs
come,
>and might not even watch until the World Series.  When the World Series
is
>broadcast, ignorant fans like myself are probably in the majority. The
hard
>core baseball fan who has memorized a million statistics is probably
quite
>frustrated upon hearing the announcers explain elementary aspects of the
game,
>or explain that Joe Blow, who is now coming up to bat, was acquired in a
trade
>from the Tigers just 2 months ago, etc.  He knows all that, and it
reminds
>him that the telecast is not really oriented towards him.  When the
casual fans
>cast votes for All-Star teams in any sport, they frustrate serious fans
by
>voting in droves for fat old has-beens who can't play any more.
>
Excuse me, but I would prefer that the announcers cater to the casual
viewer rather than to the die-hard types waiting in front of their T.V.'s
with a Player's Guide to catch a mistake.  That's how people get
interested in a sport - by having the basics explained.  One of the main
problems with tennis is that it has always seemed somewhat exclusionary. 
Your post only reinforces that.
>
>That's what is so great about the Australian Open and the weekly
tournaments.
>The ignorant masses of casual American fans are not watching, so we can
talk
>about tennis between points.
>
I think it would be great if the ignorant masses would watch.  Then maybe
it would be on network television and I wouldn't have to pay for cable. 
Then I could talk about a match with actual living people instead of
having to read a newsgroup to participate in such a discussion.  I'm
sorry if tennis and television is too democratic for you.  Too bad it
can't go back to being the sport of kings.

>|||  clc5q@virginia.edu (Clark L. Coleman)
-----
anne bilek
university of minnesota
anne@boombox.micro.umn.edu
-----
From: jason@cs.uq.oz.au (Jin Song Dong)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
Subject: More for the result of Thursday night (spoilers).
Summary: More for the result of Thursday night (spoilers).
Keywords: More for the result of Thursday night (spoilers).
Date: 11 Sep 92 12:19:34 GMT
Reply-To: jason@cs.uq.oz.au

Mac and Stich lost in 5 sets in doubles.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: donna@attic.bae.bellcore.com (Donna Feliciano)
Subject: Re: US Open Final
Organization: Bellcore
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 20:59:42 GMT

In article <95943@bu.edu>, robrod@csa.bu.edu (Roberto Rodriguez) writes:
|> From: robrod@csa.bu.edu
|> Newsgroups: rec.sports.tennis
|> Subject: US Open Final
|> Summary: 
|> Followup-To: 
|> Distribution: usa
|> Organization: Computer Science Department, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA
|> Keywords: 
|> 
|> 
|> I think people have down-played Sampras's ill-condition entering the
|> final.  He started having trouble since his match with Courier.  He
|> commented after the match that he had gotten sick the night before.
|> Also, he was being troubled by his left leg (it wasn't mentioned for
|> sure which part was it).  
|> 
|> Sampras must have done his best to come out and give a good
|> performance.  He was able to mantain a good condition in the first set,
|> but in the second his condition started to act up.  By the third it was
|> clear that he wasn't moving well and not being able to chase down balls.
|> In the forth, if a ball wasn't hit directly at him, he couldn't hit it.
|> 
|> I think that if Sampras had not gotten sick he would have ended it in
|> three sets just like in '90.  I would expect something like 6-3, 6-3, 6-2.
|> 
|> It is sad when great players get unhealthy like this.  IMHO
|> Sampras would be the #1 player in the world if he could keep himself
|> healthy.  Other players like Krickstein (sp?) would be great contenders
|> if they were not so injury prone.


Part of being healthy is being in good shape.  In the past, Sampras
had not worked as much on his conditioning.  He does more now,
and has had less injury problems.  Some people are more injury
prone naturally, but (and speaking from experience!!!) sometimes
people get hurt for trying to go beyond where their body will
take them!!!

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Donna V. Feliciano                 email: donna@bae.bellcore.com
Bellcore                           Phone: (908) 699-2161
444 Hoes Lane Room RRC 4A741       FAX:   (908) 336-2828
Piscataway, NJ 08854
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis
From: faa@athena.cs.wayne.edu (Felicitas A. Atabong)
Subject: Re: Pete's current ranking.
Organization: Wayne State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:00:48 GMT

In article <MehHS2S00ioXMFTUx5@andrew.cmu.edu> Jad Nehme <jn1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Courier won the French and Australia open this year, and managed a
>semi-final in the US one.  Did he just do nothing else?  What is Edberg
>standing in the Grand-Slam tournaments this year?
>
>-Jad

Fortunately, grand slam tournaments are not the only time you can pick
up points. I'm not sure how many other tournaments Courier played, but
if Edberg is No.1, I'm sure he deserves to be.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.tennis