From: reb@amc.com (Bob Brunjes)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Top Man Stoppers???
Date: 20 Aug 92 13:07:19 GMT
Organization: Applied Microsystems, Redmond, WA

In article <1992Aug18.142622.17433@CERIS.Purdue.EDU> jheath@fieldofdreams.npirs.purdue.edu (Jim Heath) writes:
##From article <1992Aug17.141754.11124@email.tuwien.ac.at>, by holger@vmars.tuwien.ac.at (Holger Reusch (Dipl. Gerhard + Joe)):
## In <1992Aug12.153118.25855@amc.com> reb@amc.com (Bob Brunjes) writes:
## #In article <1992Aug11.084948.9679@email.tuwien.ac.at> holger@vmars.tuwien.ac.at (Holger Reusch (Dipl. ALF in spe)) writes:
## #Although I live in a rural area, and could care less about the dreaded
## #"over-penetration", I hear lack of overpenetration being used a positive
## #factor in "stopping power".  In truth, the shootee does not care if the
## #bullet overpenetrates after he is stopped, nor does he care if the
## #he was shot by a gun that carried nicely.  He cares only that he was
## #hit by a well-place energetic bullet.  
##
#
#Hmmmm, I should have thought that the shootee who is shot well
#enough to stop him has probably ceased to care about much of
#anything in a majority of cases ;-{).  He as assumed room
#temperature.  The world has found someone else to revolve
#around...  BTW, did Marshal happen to mention in his book what %
#of one shot stops were fatal?
# 
## Still, I uphold my reservation on excessive calibers.  Statistics
## show (Here I mean Marshall's, whatever you think about them.  So far, I
## haven't seen anything better.) that above .357 Magnum, stopping power
## actually decreases.  I understand the reason for this (less energy
## dumped in the target due to quick penetration), but I understand, too,
## that this is merely a hypothesis.  If anybody demonstrates tomorrow that
## a .50 Win.Mag. is a more effective manstopper than a .357, I'm the last
## one to grieve over that.
##
#
#How about a .45 LC, .44 spl, .44 mag. etc. with a very light
#bullet?  What would be the approximate equivalent of the 110 gr.
#and 125 gr. .357 mag bullets?  Did Marshall have any data on such
#rounds, presuming they exist. 

In .44 Special and Magnum, 180-grain bullets are a good analog to
the 110-grain 9mm bullet.  With H-110 in a .44 Mag, the 180-grain
bullet can be moved safely at about 1800 fps, and the +P+ 9mm
loads move a 110-grain (I'm guessing here, a bit) about 1300 fps..

Without concerning myself with the value of K, the .44 is
(1800ee2)(180)K=583.2(10ee6)K and the 9mm is
(1300ee2)(110)K=185.9(10ee6)K.  This makes the .44 about pi
times (well _about_) more energetic than the 9mm.  Or, you
could say that such a .44 load could retain 2/3 of its
energy while penetrating (over?) a target and _still_
exceed the absolute maximun possible energy transfer of
a 9mm +P+.

In addition, a given hollow-point design expands _much_ more
reliably with an additional 500 fps velocity.  Certainly
my experiences hunting with the old Super-Vel 180-grainer
demonstrated wonderful expansion in coyote/bobcat-sized
targets. 

As a bonus, I get accuracy from my Ruger Super Blackhawk
sufficient to compete in metallic silhouette matches.  Ah,
well, ya pays yer money and ya takes yer pick.

#-- 
#"Land of song, said the warrior bard,           Jim Heath
#Though all the world betrays thee.
#One sword, at least, thy rights shall guard, (The Minstrel Boy)
#One faithful harp will praise thee."         (Thomas Moore)
#


Bob Brunjes		Applied Microsystems Corp
			Redmond, WA
			reb@amc.com