From: georgew@hspice.portal.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: What is real racism? (Re: Was: Why rish asians should vote Republican)
Organization: Meta - Software
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 02:30:33 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.051915.8473@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>In article <1992Nov17.022400.2558@hspice.portal.com> georgew@hspice.portal.com (George Wu) writes:

>>You hate based upon upbringing.

>I've never met Mr. Wu and have never revealed virtually nothing about
>my background on this network.  Or does Mr. Wu, like many other Chinese-cu,
>claim to be endowed with the ability to read minds?

     I claim nothing of the sort.  One need only read your posts to see
you hate Chinese people.  You've repeatedly and publicly attack Chinese
culture, and you call for the wholesale destruction of Chinese culture.

>>Others hate based upon skin color.  Who cares why, you're both
>>guilty of raw bigotry.

>First off, I never said that I hate Chinese-ge (people who are genetically
>Chinese).  Second, the only thing that I've said is that I condemned Chinese-cu
>(i.e. culturally Chinese sense) culture.

     Chinese-ge/cu terminology aside (perhaps I should have been clearer,
but you've made the distinction often enough I thought it obvious), this is
a perfect example.  Here you explicitly condemn those raise in Chinese
society, a group of people which numbers over a billion.

>Culture is behavior.  Condemnation of behavior is justified if that 
>behavior is morally reprehensible.  Mr. Danielle T. Wei condemns on the
>basis of skin color.  There is a significant difference.

     Let me pose a hypothetical situation: you are introduced to a man.  The
man is introduced as a cultural Chinese, a man raised in Chinese society.
From that alone, what do you believe of this man?  Do you immediately condemn
him because he's been raised Chinese?  Do you automatically believe he's a
racist and he abuses children?  These are both characteristics you have
attributed to Chinese culture in the past.  By implication, you believe a man
raised in such a culture is most likely to exhibit the same behaviors.

     Chinese culture is *not* defined as the behaviors you attribute to
"Chinese-cu."  A very broad term indeed, one such definition might include
that group of people speaking a particular language or set of languages.
Find a single dictionary, reputable news account, or academic paper which
states a definitive aspect of Chinese society is racism or child abuse.
You have made this claims previously on many occaisions.

>>How can you despise a man you've never even met, conversed, or even observed?
>
>And then, Mr. Wu translates my condemnation of Chinese culture into
>"hating a man without knowing him".

     It seems quite logical to me.  You have condemned an extremely large
group of people.  You can't possibly have met every person who holds that
cultures' values.

>>     China Airlines does not represent the whole of China, or even a
>>significant segment thereof.

>In the United States, if American Airlines implemented the same
>bigotted policy as China Airlines, most Americans would vehemently
>condemn American Airlines, possibly resulting in the resignation of
>the chairman of American Airlines.

>Even though China Airlines, run by Chinese-cu folks, has implemented
>the policy of only hiring flight attendants (1) who are virgins and
>(2) whose skin is not too dark (i.e. no blacks need apply), there has
>been _no_ uproar of condemnation anywhere in Asia.  I take this
>as very good indication that those people think it's fine and dandy
>to discriminate in this way.

     There is no uproar against Blockbuster Video's hiring requirements.
There is no uproar against Coors Brewing Company's policies.  Additionally,
China is not a society in which people are necessarily free to speak their
minds.  Dissent from goverment positions might have direct consequences.
(It should be unnecessary to point out that such a government is not
necessarily supported by the people, and in fact, such a government might
use oppression because they aren't supported by the people.)

>>     Hatred of a genetic group, a cultural group, or even a poltical group,
>>are all the same.  You don't know every member of the group.  You don't
>>understand each one.  You just hate them.

>Let's apply Mr. Wu's reasoning to Nazism, a virulent subculture of
>Western society, and the Khmer Rouge, a political group.

>Then, Mr. Wu basically says, "Hatred of African-Americans, Nazis, or even
>the Khmer Rouge are all the same.  You don't know every member of the group.
>You just hate them all."

     Some of the intrinsic policies of the Nazi Party include anti-Semitism
and genocide.  By definition, a Nazi believes in killing Jews.  What
comparable belief is intrinsic to one raised in Chinese society?  Chinese
culture may be difficult to define, as any culture is, but you're the only
person I've ever heard attempt to ascribe child abuse as an intrinsic belief
of all members of Chinese society.  (I beg off describing the Khymer Rouge's
beliefs due to my own ignorance on the topic.)

>Condemning a horribly misguided culture is not
>bigotry.

     Condemning a culture based upon attributes which aren't elements of
it's composition is.  Falsely attributing crimes to an entire society
composed of over a billion people can only be racism.

							George


-- 
----
George J Wu,  georgew@hspice.portal.com or georgew@metasw.com
Meta-Software,  1300 White Oaks Road,  Campbell, CA 95008,  (408) 369-5400
Never be the first to believe.  Never be the last to deceive.  ---  Chess
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american