From: kevink@fugitive.soac.bellcore.com (Kevin Klinge)
Subject: Re: Heisman
Organization: Bell Communications Research
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 22:06:58 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.203919.27834@lgc.com>, mbs@zycor.lgc.com (Matt Shostak) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec14.190633.19069@walter.bellcore.com> kevink@fugitive.soac.bellcore.com (Kevin Klinge) writes:
|> >
|> >I don't know why, although I certainly remember it being used as a measuring 
|> >stick back in 1989 when Tony Rice of Notre Dame was being touted as "Heisman
|> >material" by the sportscasters (esp. Musburger, Beano, et. al) because "he 
|> >has led his team to an undefeated record".  All this talk was going on while 
|> >he was having average to above- average stats for a QB that year (nowhere 
|> >near to Andre Ware's numbers).  
|> >
|> >Fortunately, when Notre Dame finally lost a game that season in 1989 (they 
|> >were defending National Champs from 1988 which is where all of Rice's heisman
|> >talk originated), Rice's Heisman chances went down the tubes.  
|> 
|> I don't remember Rice being hyped too much.  I never considered him a serious
|> contender, even when they were on that tremendous winning streak.  

Maybe, but I do remember him being hyped, at least by the TV media. 

|> Rice had a lot more to do with his team's wins, however (IMO), 
|> than Torretta does with his.
|> Although Rice's supporting cast was good, he (nearly always)
|> came through when the game was on the line.  In Torretta's case, someone
|> else comes through most of the time in the clutch, and he is along for the
|> ride.  This is not to say I think Rice should have won the Heisman.
|> But he was the epitome of the clutch player.

Well, as an example I clearly remember, it was another player on that 1989 
Notre Dame team had more to do with Notre Dame's victory over Michigan in
in Ann Arbor when #1 and #2 met than Tony Rice.  Rice didn't impress me that 
much at all during that game, at least not enough to consider him a heisman 
candidate.  Yet I distinctly remember him being mentioned until ND lost that 
year.  Beano and Brent specifically listed Rice's attributes as "hasn't lost
a game quarterbacking ND".  That, in my book, doesn't equal heisman material,
especially if the numbers are lacking (which Rice's were compared to Ware).

|> >I'm for that.  Which is why I question why Toretta won the award.  I could
|> >buy it if people said they voted for him because he was the best player
|> >rather than idiots like Lee Corso saying Toretta should get it because Miami
|> >is undefeated.  Hell, if that's how this award is determined, let Toretta
|> >and Alabama's and Texas A&M's QBs all share the award.
|> 
|> Exactly.  They certainly can't be implying that he is a clutch player, just
|> because his team wins.  So then they are only giving the award because the
|> team has a good record.  Makes no sense.

Well, we definately agree on that point.  But I guess you didn't get a ballot
in the mail either...

|> >Kevin H. Klinge

|> Matthew B. Shostak              Landmark/Zycor

-- 

Kevin H. Klinge
Bell Communications Research
kevink@soac.bellcore.com

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