HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ees1in@ee.surrey.ac.uk (Ivailo Nedelchev)
Newsgroups: alt.cad,comp.lsi.cad
Subject: libs for cadence wanted
Keywords: es2 libs prefered
Date: 17 Nov 92 19:46:03 GMT
Organization: University of Surrey, Guildford, England


hi cadence users,

i am doing some research in asynchronous circuits
and i really need some libs for cadence edge
which with i can simulate my devices under hspice/spice.
i have mietec 2.4u and es2 1.5u from ral.
mietec 2.4u works fine with all stages
of the technology : schematic -> layout -> place & route.
but i need something less than 1.5u for digital design.
es2 libs from ral are quite misconfigured.
these es2 libs are not supported by ES2,
and whats more important - i can NOT do simulation
using hspice/spice for any design.
these libs havent got any info for simulation except for
simulation at logical level like with silos/verilog.

initially i have to simulate all basic cells so i can 
establish what the delays are for my library cells and the behaviour
in generally of their outputs.
these cells are different from nands nors xors etc etc.
i have to produce layout and place&route then.

any ideas: where from can i find such libs?
i prefer ES2 supported libs but any 
other references are welcome.

many thanx,
ivailo

-- 

 _   /|
 \`0.o'
 =(_|_)=- 
    V
From: eesshlgb@gdr.bath.ac.uk (S H L G Bisson)
Newsgroups: alt.cad
Subject: Contact address for CADKEY required.
Date: 19 Nov 92 17:38:37 GMT
Organization: School of Electrical Engineering, University of Bath, UK

Currently we are using CADKEY Light. We've just acquired a new PC for it, and
are having trouble in contacting CADKEY here in the UK in order to obtain
screendrivers that will allow us to use the higher resolution display.

Does anyone have a current address/fax number for CADKEY, either in the UK
or the US, or know of an FTP site where we can find CADKEY drivers for Tseng
ET4000 SVGA chipsets.

Simon Bisson : Applied Electromagnetics Research Centre
Newsgroups: alt.cad,alt.cad.autocad
From: jjimenez@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Joel A Jimenez)
Subject: Attention Employed Electrical & Mechanical Engineers
Summary: Help out a college student
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 21:08:13 GMT


  Please help out a guy with a paper due Monday.

For a University College assignment I am required to interview someone in my 
intended major area: electical or mechanical engineering.
I kind of procrastinated in finding someone to interview, so, I'm turning to 
the usenet.  If anyone could help me out by answering the following questions 
and e-mailing them to me as soon as possible, I'd be very happy.  The only 
requirements are that you are currently employed, but not employed by Ohio 
State University.

1) Who do you work for?

2) What is your title?

3) What is your name, address, daytime phone #?

4) What degree(s) do you hold? From where?

5) What does your job involve?

6) What have been the high/low points in your career?

7) Compare college life and career life.

8) Why did you decide to be an engineer?

9) Where (geographically) are most engineering jobs?

10) Is your employer a small or large business?

11) Did you participate in a co-op program? Helpful?

12) Did you later need more education?

13) Were most/all of your college courses relevant?

14) What changes have you noticed in engineering since you started?

15) How many times have you changed jobs and why?

16) Anything else you'd like to add?


      Thanks in advance.

                 - Joel A. Jimenez

jjimenez@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: alt.cad
From: englehar@src.honeywell.com (Matt Englehart)
Subject: professional cad packages
Organization: Honeywell Systems & Research Center
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:06:58 GMT

I have been instructed by my boss to quickly provide a summary of the major
software packages available for mechanical, thermal, and electrical design
and analysis.  The sort of capabilities we're interested include, but are
not limited to:

1.  Thermal gradiant analysis
2.  Mechanical interference anaysis (analysis of how/when physical components
    will fit inside a container of fixed size)
3.  Printed circuit board layout
4.  Simulation of (analog and digital) circuit functionality and layout

I am interested in any information regarding functionality and cost of
these sort of packages.  Is there any document, journal article, or catalog
that presents a suite of software packages of this type?

Please email to englehar@src.honeywell.com

Thanks,

Matthew J. Englehart                      Voice: (612)-951-7635
Honeywell Systems and Research Center     FAX:   (612)-951-7438
3660 Technology Dr.   MS:MN65-2500        Inet: englehar@src.honeywell.com
Minneapolis, MN 55418

Newsgroups: alt.cad,alt.cad.autocad,comp.cad.cadence
From: ctornow@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Carina E Tornow)
Subject: Convert DesignCAD output into TIFF or PCX
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 20:48:43 GMT


I hope someone can help me.  My advisor wants a program that can convert 
DesignCAD outfiles into TIFF or PCX which is what his word processor uses.
DesignCAD output files can be of the formats: DesignCAD 2D or 3D, IGES, GEM,
or DXF.  If anyone can give me a name of a program that can do this or can
direct me to another source, I would be very grateful.

Please send me any information by email.

Thank you,
Carina
Newsgroups: alt.cad
From: orion@leo.unm.edu (Tim Guerrette)
Subject: RE: CAD Packages or Books
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 01:08:46 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

To those people who are looking for AutoCAD, MicroStation, etc. book, I have rceived catalogs in the past from CAD News Bookstore and they have many of the titles and software I was looking for. If you are interested, their number is 1-800-CAD-NEWS.

Thanks,

-- Tim

===============================================================================
Timothy Guerrette	    		Internet: orion@polaris.unm.edu
University of New Mexico
Albuquerque, NM
    "Yesterday is history, tomorrow is the future, today is just a bitch!"
===============================================================================
Newsgroups: alt.cad
Subject: Re: Contact address for CADKEY required.
From: vseaman@calstatela.edu (Virgil Seaman 12-07-90)
Date: 23 Nov 92 15:18:15 PST
Reply-To: vseaman@calstatela.edu
Distribution: world
Organization: Cal State University, Los Angeles


Here is the Technical Support Hotline for CADKEY in the U.S.  They recently moved into a new building.  (203) 298-8888 = phone    (203) 298-6404 = FAX
Note: you might want to upgrade to CADKEY 5.02 now that it is out.  No more need for pattern files etc.  3D geometry is created and using Design, Layout, Instances you can then select from 120 possible views to select to display the geometry.

Virgil Seaman
Department of Technology
California State University, Los Angeles
5151 State University Drive
Los Angeles, CA  91801

We are users of CADKEY on the PC's and on Sun Sparc.  Would be interested in any information on the products you design etc. with CADKEY. 
Thanks,
Virgil
Newsgroups: alt.cad
From: puerile@wam.umd.edu (Mohan R. Ramanathan)
Subject: Microstation 4.0 question
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:24:51 GMT

Hi netland,
	I'm using Microstation 4.0.3, and one of the technicians
	I work with wanted to use it to plot out on E-size paper
	a database he created in Q&A. Is there a simple way to do
	this in Microstation, or is it possible using AutoCAD11 or
	even HPGL? Any help would be appreciated.
	Additionally, last year, I saw an application for Microstation
	that would allow the user to develop a model of an injection
	mold, and then run an analysis to see where you would run into
	cavities etc. when the fluid was actually injected. Does anyone
	know anything about this product or anything similar for either
	Microstation or AutoCAD? 
					Thanks,
						Mohan  
Newsgroups: alt.cad
From: gialhu@giau01.gia.ch (Lukas Huesler)
Subject: Looking for an Engineering System 
Originator: gialhu@giau01
Reply-To: gialhu@giau01.gia.ch (Lukas Huesler)
Organization: Grapha Informatik AG
Distribution: eunet
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 15:55:32 GMT




Hy there

We are looking for an engineering System including the following items

- Cam mechanisms
- Coupler curves of linages
- Mechanism synthesis
- Mechanism analysis
- Mechanism simulation

The Engineering System should:

- Work on VAXstations 3100 (DEC/VMS)
- be connectable to CAD (MEDUSA from CV), a.e. via DXF interface

Is there anybody who nows about such a product or who even has some 
experience

Please answer by E-Mail (We haven't subscribed for this newsgroup)

Lukas



-- 
Lukas Huesler  	      --------------GRAPHA-Informatik AG---------------
gialhu@gia.ch	     / / ----------------------------------------------
--------------------/ / /  			   +41-62-997280 (work)
---------------------/-/   Peyermattstr. 3, 4665 Oftringen, Switzerland
From: psmedsha@ecst.csuchico.edu (Paul Smedshammer)
Newsgroups: alt.cad
Subject: Deskjet 500C Drivers For AutoCAD
Date: 16 Nov 1992 07:04:49 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico
NNTP-Posting-Host: cscihp.ecst.csuchico.edu
Keywords: AutoCAD, Deskjet 500C

A while back I saw a post about Deskjet 500C drivers for AutoCAD that would
allow the Deskjet to act as a plotter and use different colors for different
lines.  Could somebody tell me were this driver is located(ftp)?  I'm trying
to print out some thesis work and it would be much clearer in color.  Thanks.

Paul

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
psmedsha@ecst.csuchico.edu (Paul Smedshammer)

Graduate Student in Mechanical Engineering
California State University at Chico
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
From: ieong@fraser.sfu.ca (Kim Ieong)
Subject: CRC in AutoCAD .DWG files
Keywords: CRC,AutoCAD,ACAD
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 01:04:40 GMT

Does anyone know what CRC algorithm is used in AutoCAD Release 11 and 12?

Any info will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Kim Ieong

Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
From: ice@skynet.uucp (Ice)
Subject: Re: DWG to BMP
Organization: Industrial Cybernetics
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 18:13:52 GMT

In article <AUTOCAD%92111317183668@OHSTVMA.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU> "David G. Booth" <COM1BOOT@UCSBVM.BITNET> writes:
>Does anyone have or know of a utility to convert .dwg files to
>.bmp files? tks...
>
>David Booth
>University of California
>Santa Barbara, Ca
>com1boot@ucsbvma.bitnet

This is going to be very crude, but if no one else responds, you can
do this:

1) save file.dwg as a DXF with dxfout => file.dxf
2) import file.dxf into designer 3.1.
3. export as file.bmp...

Alternatively you could just print it out and
scan it @ 300 dpi and scanner settings on _line art_
and save it to a bmp file.

Hope this helps.

Ice()	ice@skynet.{uucp|tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca}
{
/* Ice's Hypermedia Sig */ #include <cyberpunk.h> #include <industrial.h> 
Hardware required: biological neural net with _unsupervised_learning_
Audio() Burning Inside by Ministry; "The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste" 
Visual() Sarah Connor's flesh on fire blasted away leaving screaming skeleton 
}
From: tchild@autodesk.com (Timothy Child)
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Subject: Re: CRC in AutoCAD .DWG files
Date: 18 Nov 92 17:38:44 GMT
Reply-To: tchild@autodesk.com
Organization: Autodesk, Inc.

In article LtB@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu, varkki@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Varkki George) writes:
> what, pray, is a CRC?
> 
> R. Varkki George
> -- 
> Department of Urban and Regional Planning  | E-mail: varkki@uiuc.edu
> University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign | Tel:    217.244.7059


  CRC stands for cyclic redundancy check, it is a sophisticated form of
  checksum.  CRC's are used in the .dwg file to verify that the
  information read from disk matches what was written. CRC's provide
  AutoCAD with a way of detecting but not preventing corrupt
  .dwg files.

  -Tim Child.

  Autodesk Inc.



Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Via: uk.ac.de-montfort; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 09:25:30 +0000
Organisation: De Montfort University
Department: IT Services - Cad Support Team
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Date:         Wed, 18 Nov 1992 09:25:13 GMT
Reply-To:     iah@de-montfort.ac.uk
From:         Andy Humberston <iah@DE-MONTFORT.AC.UK>
Subject:      Message to list admin

Hi,

I've worked out why I am not receiving mail, could the list manager
contact me so that I can explain the situation.

Cheers

 ------------------------------------------------------------------
|     Andy Humberston, IT Services, De Montfort University, UK     |
|  Tel: +44 533 577159  Fax: +44 533 577170  EMail: iah@uk.ac.dmu  |
 ------------------------------------------------------------------
From: beelewm@wkuvx1.bitnet
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Subject: AutoCAD .DWG conversions
Date: 19 Nov 92 12:19:36 CST
Organization: Western Kentucky University, Bowling Green, KY

I realize that this may have been asked earlier, but I do not have an
FAQ to refer to.  QUESTION:  How do you convert a .DWG file to a .DXF
file?  I have AMIpro for windows that will import .DXF files do use in
documents, only thing is, my drawings are saved in the .DWG format.
Any help would be great.

Thanks...

Marc Beeler ------------- Beelewm@wkuvx1.bitnet

Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Date:         Tue, 17 Nov 1992 22:48:25 EST
From:         Kevin Hodgson <SBLY@CORNELLC.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: INFO on Importing files from Autocad files.

I think that the Canvas application would be a lot happier with a TIFF
or PICT format. If you can generate a Unix TIFF file from your .DXF, you
could ftp that to the Mac, and convert it to Mac format (with the
approproate resource forks being added) by using Imagery 1.8 (available
form sumex-aim.stanford.edu) on the Mac. Better yet, if you can generate
a ppm file on your unix, Imagery will digest that even better (will then
generate your choice of Mac TIFF or PICT2). Your probably better off
using the PICT on the Mac, as a 1024X1024 image with 8 bit depth will
take about 3 megs in TIFF, less than a quarter of a meg in PICT. Hope
this helps.

      Kevin Hodgson
      sbly@cornellc.cit.cornell.edu
From: wm@isr.harvard.edu (William J. Mahoney)
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Subject: AutoCad problem opening files
Date: 19 Nov 92 20:48:18 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, MA

We are running AutoCad 12, with SunOs (4.1.2), OW3.0, the license
manager version.  Recently the "Drawing Modification" panel ("The
current drawing has been changed." etc...) began to appear whenever
a user attempts to open a drawing file.  This is immediately upon
startup of AutoCad, before a drawing has been opened.  This occurs
from any workstation capable of accessing AutoCad, for any user of
AutoCad.  It occurs when a user is the only one acessing AutoCad at
a particular time.  I've removed all extraneous temp files from every
location I can think of.  I've gone through the AutoCad server directory,
comparing the file structure with a standalone copy of AutoCad which works
fine.  No answers.  This problem is not as innocuous as it may sound as
it possible to trash an already existing drawing by providing the
right/wrong answers to this needless startup dialogue.  I've tried
my technical support person, who is stumped and who has been trying for
almost two days to get through to AutoDesk.  Anyone have any ideas?  

Thanks,
Bill Mahoney
wmahoney@gsd.harvard.edu
From: wolf@Autodesk.COM (Wolf Herda)
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Subject: Re: S3 driver for Acad r 12 ???
Date: 19 Nov 92 17:45:46 GMT
Organization: Autodesk Inc., Sausalito CA, USA

lejon@thn.htu.se (Mats Lejon) writes:
<> Does anyone know if a supervga driver with support for S3 graphics has 
<> been released yet? The supervga driver we got had the S3 support disabled
<> due to som problem. Does anyone know anything about this?
<> 
<> 				thanks in advance
<> 				
<> 				Mats Lejon
<> 				University College of Trollhaettan, Sweden

There are several vendors who supply ADI drivers with S3 support.  The
only one that I know off the top of my head is Panacea (800 729-7420).
Ideally try to get an ADI 4.2 driver, 4.1 drivers will work but won't be
able to make use of some of the 4.2 features.



Wolf Herda
wolf@autodesk.com
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
From: John Austin <jea1@cornell.edu>
Subject: Re: AutoCAD .DWG conversions
X-Xxdate: Fri, 20 Nov 92 16: 50:10 GMT
Nntp-Posting-User: jea1@cornell.edu
Organization: BTI
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d9
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:44:37 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.121936.4095@wkuvx1.bitnet> , beelewm@wkuvx1.bitnet
writes:
>I realize that this may have been asked earlier, but I do not have an
>FAQ to refer to.  QUESTION:  How do you convert a .DWG file to a .DXF
>file?  I have AMIpro for windows that will import .DXF files do use in
>documents, only thing is, my drawings are saved in the .DWG format.
>Any help would be great.


I assume you still have access to AutoCAD.  Check out the DXFOUT command.



.  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
John Austin (jea1@cornell.edu)                                                 
Grafix 'R Us                                                this space for rent
Boyce Thompson Institute for Plant Research                                    
123456789112345678921234.sig *still* under construction...961234567897123456789
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: AUTOCAD@OHSTVMA.BITNET
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MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Date:         Fri, 20 Nov 1992 12:24:14 -0500
From:         IETYANG@EKU.BITNET
Subject:      Re: slow autocad

If you use DOS 5.0, the problem could be the incompatibility between
AutoCAD R11 and DOS 5.0.  The solution is fully described in the printout
README.DOC (dated July 12, 1991), which comes with AutoCAD R11 package.

Hope this help.

Biwu Yang
ietyang@eku.bitnet
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
From: bpbp@sequent.com (Bob Poulsen)
Subject: AutoCAD on a Laptop
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 20:05:41 GMT


Well, I've been thinking...

Now that Laptop/Notebook color screens are becoming cheap and
acceptably crisp (just barely) has anyone been using AutoCAD
on a DOS-based Laptop Computer?  I'm interested to see if this
works well, what model and configuration laptop, which pointing
device (!) and what tasks are best suited for portable computing.

Also, has anyone sucesccfully used a battery-powered printer
for AutoCAD ouptut, and if so which one?


Thanks in advance...

-Bob
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
From: vish@nd.edu (Vishwamber Yelsangikar)
Subject: INFO on Importing files from Autocad files.
Followup-To: alt.cad.autocad
Organization: Uni or Notre Dame
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 15:22:22 GMT

I use Autocad 11 on Sun workstation.  I want to export some files to Mac
platform so that the same files can be used using Canvas software.  Is
there any way I can do this?  I tried to export the file in the .DXF format
and when I tried to open it on my Mac using Canvas it does not open.  Am I
doing it right or is there some other way of doing this.  Please repond.
My address is vish@nd.edu
Thanks..

Vish Yelsangikar
Network Engineer.
Notre Dame.

Go Bills!!!!
Go Irish!!!!
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Date:         Wed, 18 Nov 1992 11:47:41 -0500
Reply-To:     Robert Stalder <rxs14@po.CWRU.Edu>
From:         Robert Stalder <rxs14@PO.CWRU.EDU>
Subject:      [pmckee@uafhp.uark.edu: Re: AutoCAD on a Laptop]

    ================= Begin forwarded message =================

    From: pmckee@uafhp.uark.edu (Patrick McKee)
    To: rxs14@po.CWRU.Edu (Robert Stalder)
    Subject: Re: AutoCAD on a Laptop
    Date: Tue, 17 Nov


    Hey sorry about sending this direct to you but I can't seem to get
    to the list today. Could you please forward this.  If not it may answer
    some of what you were wondering. ;)

    Thanks.....


    On Mon, 16 Nov 1992, Bob Poulsen wrote:

    > Well, I've been thinking...
    >
    > Now that Laptop/Notebook color screens are becoming cheap and
    > acceptably crisp (just barely) has anyone been using AutoCAD
    > on a DOS-based Laptop Computer?  I'm interested to see if this
    > works well, what model and configuration laptop, which pointing
    > device (!) and what tasks are best suited for portable computing.

    I have a good friend who is an Architect in Florida who uses his notebook
    as a traveling office.  He says it works just great.  Standard MS mouse
    for a pointer with a modified menu for selecting symbol libraries w/out
    the pad.  He has also had great success in using this a field tool.  We
    use to lug the standard desktop with us on field measuring trips and
    this notebook has greatly reduced our load.  If you think we are crazy
    for taking a CAD station into the field you are wrong - we were able to
    set up a portable office on site that saved a lot of travel time and
    money - not to mention the fact that we turned out field verified
    drawings in half the time, thereby pleasing the client (and impressing)
    greatly. :)  The laptop should be to at least a 386/33 expandable to 16
    megs with a 100meg HD.  Try it you will like it!


    >
    > Also, has anyone sucesccfully used a battery-powered printer
    > for AutoCAD ouptut, and if so which one?
    >

    Nope, all plots were done at the office.  But I have heard that there
    is a printer driver to use with the Canon BJ-10ex and 20 series printers
    that emulates a BJ-130e.  There is software available for the BJ-130e
    that enables HP emulation, I think it is called Print-Plot.  Canon would
    know.  I have used it to print drawings (A & B size only) and it worked
    great.  Although you would probably be limited to A size.  Hope this
    helps........


    ***********************************************************************
    * Patrick James McKee            Internet: pmckee@uafhp.uark.edu      *
    * Computer Lab Consultant        Bitnet:   pmckee@uafhp               *
    * University of Arkansas         Fishnet:  nylon - casting            *
    ***********************************************************************







--
Rob Stalder                           "To know me ... is to beer me"
rxs14@po.CWRU.Edu
stalder@SCL.CWRU.Edu
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
From: hayesj@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (HAYES JAMES MICHAEL JR)
Subject: ACAD/CADKey conversion
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 22:52:17 GMT


Planning on taking an engineering drawing class, intro level.  They use
CAD Key, version ?, w/ hardware key protection.
Have two years light experience w/ ACAD 10 for technical drawings.

Commute to the university, have daycare expenses, etc.

Will DXF conversion serve me well, so that I can work near home on
assignments?  I have access to ACAD10 in the neighborhood.  Is there
an easier solution, i.e. does anyone have conversion batch programs
in AutoLisp and or CADKey macros or whatever?  I'd appreciate any help
or access.

Thanks in advance.

-- 
  Mike Hayes             |"Knowledge is good."  - Faber College Motto
  WWW                    |"Knowledge and Thoroughness" -Rensselear Poly Motto
  Unemployed Tech,       |"No, thank YOU!"  -Groucho Marx, 'A Day at the Races'
  Driven to banging my head against engineering physics for 4 years.
From: blu@cellar.org (Dan Reed)
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad
Subject: Looking For A Hatch Pattern..
Date: 23 Nov 92 20:32:05 GMT
Organization: The Cellar BBS and public access system

I was wondering if anyone could mail (or post) me a hatch pattern.  Im 
looking for a pattern that is a random fill, for an elevation of a tree, or 
shrub.  If you have anything CLOSE to this pattern, please let me know.  

I really could use one..

--
Dan Reed AKA Blu Max - blu@cellar.org - AnalCADGeek! - Industrial Music Maker
    68' Cougar XR-7, 89' VW Golf, 74' Honda CL360t, Vextrex Unit Lover
Newsgroups: alt.cad.autocad