From: dsloan@seas.gwu.edu (David M. Sloan)
Subject: Re: The Hadith about Muslims killing the Jews / Hamas vs. Sunnah
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 19:18:44 GMT

Okay... let's take these one by one...

mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar) writes:
: Harry Mamaysky writes:
: >Mazen Mokhtar writes:
: 
: >First of all, do not compare Israelis to Nazis.
:   Why not? The comparison is quite valid in this case. Both are oppressors
: who deny the rights of people; although only Israel used to deny the existance
: of the Palestinian people.
If I were truly worried that rational people would consider this analogy, I
would take a few volumes and point out (as others have done), how ludicrous and
invalid this comparison is. But, let's take a few basic points: The
Nazis were intent on exterminating the Jewish presence from a country in which
Jews were as German as other Germans, and posed absolutely no imaginable threat
to the  German state (despite bogus Nazi arguments to the contrary). On the 
other hand, the statements that you make show that there exists a threat to
the state of Israel. This means that Israel cannot offer fullest equality
to the Palestinians when those rights will be automatically used against us
in violent struggle. If you have declared your intention to shoot at me, is
it my moral responsibility to provide you with the easiest method of obtaining
a gun? This question can be brought down the line to justify most of the so-
called 'rights deprivations'.
	 I shudder to think at the can of worms that might be opened by
refuting this comparison (i.e. inviting more virulent and anti-Semetic
comparisons), but too often silence is confused with agreement, and this
kind of statement is too harsh to "let fly".

: >This is flagrantly anti-Semitic and offensive.
:   I am a semite an I am not biased against Jews. I am only an opponent of
: oppression. This position offends many, but that has not detered me.
This is a common semantic perversion. Anti-Semitism (as a term) originated
in Germany to describe the Jew-hating of the period. Whatever the meaning of
'semite', the meaning of anti-Semitism is (Webster's) hostility toward or discrimination against Jews as a religious or racial group. And as Martin Luther
King Jr. said "When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You're talking
anti-Semitism." 'nuff said.

: >Furthermore, there is absolutely NO basis for such a comparison. Israel is
: >the moral opposite of Nazi Germany in EVERY way.
:   This subject is certainly debatable. After all, both of them are based on
: the assumption that a certain nationality is "chosen" or better than the rest.
Whereas the Judaic 'chosen' refers to the obligation to follow a set of laws
the Nazi 'chosen' gave them the perogative to eliminate cruelly anyone who
did not meet their twisted standard. There is no real debate.

: >They won't, unlike Nazi trash,
: >persecute people merely because they are different.
:   They already have.
Oh have they? Guess what, this kind of racist lie does not increase in truth
content with repetition. It also detracts from teh quality of discussion on
this board, which , despite the passions on both sides, remains high.
 
: Mazen Mokhtar
	David Sloan
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast