HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: prj@gamba.lcs.mit.edu (Paul R. Johnson)
Subject: Cassette Decks for Recording from DAT
Organization: lcs.mit.edu
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 13:56:09 GMT

I've started recording concerts for friends on my new DAT machine and
want to make cassette copies for them.  My current cassette deck doesn't
cut it.

Does anyone have recommendations of cassette decks for this purpose?
Accuracy of the copy is primary importance (probably using Dolby B as
that's the most likely noise reduction system that others will have),
convenience would be nice.  I'm willing to spend up to around $400
unless there's some good reason to go higher.

I also may want to make multiple copies of a concert.  I'm distrustful of
dual, "dubbing" decks, but are there any that make good copies at high speed?

---Paul Johnson
From: henry@ginger.sri.com (Henry A. Pasternack)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Nonlinearity vs. non-flat frequency response.
Date: 13 Apr 92 21:44:21 GMT
Reply-To: henry@ginger.sri.com (Henry A. Pasternack)
Organization: SRI International


   Gary Coffman writes:

>My dictionary defines distortion as a deviation from the orginal signal
>waveform. It doesn't define "muddy" in any useful way. When you get the
>same signal out of a recording that was put into it originally, that's
>no distortion. A machine with .03% total distortion is over 200 times
>more faithful to the orginal recording than a system with 7% distortion.

   What does it mean to be "200 times more faithful?"  Please consider
the following:  A machine with 7% distortion is 93% "faithful", yes?  A
machine with .03% distortion is 99.97% "faithful".  Therefore the machine
with .03% distortion is 99.97/93 = 1.07 times more "faithful".

   Unconvinced?  Consider two machines, one having 10E-10% distortion
and one having 10E-110% distortion.  All other things being equal, these
machines will have IDENTICAL sonic performance (we assume 10E-10% distortion
is below the threshold of audibility).  Yet you would say the second machine
is ten-to-the-tenth times more "faithful"?

   It's this kind of shady logic that typifies the mass-market hype
mentality.  "My machine is over A MILLION TIMES more faithful that your
machine -- Check the specs!"

>Whatever "muddy" means, it has to show up in the total distortion figure,
>or you are describing the orginal signal, and there's no helping that.

   "Distortion", in the sense of "harmonic" or "intermodulation" refers
to the generation of frequency components that are not present in the
source signal.  It is different from "non-flat frequency response", which
is the variation in the emphasis (gain or attentuation factor) of signal
components at different frequencies.  Distortion is caused by component 
nonlinearity; non-flat frequency response is not.  This seems to be a 
common source of confusion, such as the article that referred to the change
in speaker system response due to series resistance as "nonlinearity."

   "Muddiness", to complete the thought, is often used to describe ill-defined,
bloated, or underdamped midbass that obscures pitch discrimination at low 
frequencies.  It is a consequence of non-flat frequency response in the bottom
octaves, not distortion.

   While I agree that a "muddy" sound is "unfaithful", I would not equate
"muddiness" and "distortion."

-Henry
From: sp3u+@andrew.cmu.edu (Shiv Swarup Pathak)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: WIERD CD PLAYER
Date: 13 Apr 92 19:24:09 GMT
Organization: Freshman, H&SS general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


I'm looking in to buying the Pioneer 7700 CD player.  It has an unusual
design which accepts the CD upside down (music side up).  Pioneer says
that this eliminates skipping and improves bass and transparency.  Has
anyone heard it?  Does anyone have it.  The usual sale price at
Crutchfield it $350, but there is a special sale for $229.  Is it good? 
Is it worth getting.  Thanks in advance.

-Shiv
From: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Imped. Matching w/ Resistors?!
Date: 9 Apr 92 00:07:21 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <1380@frf.omron.co.jp> andrew@lsa.ncl.omron.co.jp (Andrew Walduck) writes:
>
>Actually the resistors will always be linear...and will always present
>a constant impedance to the amplifier of 2 ohms, unlike the reactive speaker,
>the impedance of which will vary widely depending on the frequency.
>(unless...the resistors are wire-wound...but that's another story...;-)
>
    The only truly linear resistors I have ever seen were zig-zag
    lines on a physics lecture blackboard.  In the electronics
    classes the non-linear nature of REAL resistors were noted.

    Of course that is just being picky...even a wirewound would have
    less frequency-dependent impedance changes than just about any
    speaker.

>Perhaps his speakers drop to a particularly low impedance...(say 1 ohm)
>and perhaps his amp has trouble driving low resistance loads (perhaps
>anything below 2 ohms), so then adding the 2 ohm resistors brings this
>bottom resistance up from 1 ohm to 3 ohms, and the amp is happier...
>and the sound improves (as the amp isn't over-exerting itself...)

    Usually what happens is the resistors drop the damping factor
    and the bass cones become a bit floppy in the old breeze.  Nice
    tight bass goes out the window, but the loose floppy bass that
    results from the drastic reduction in damping gives the
    impression of "better" bass because it usually results in a bass
    boost...particularly with infinite baffle type speakers.
From: Davie_Harris@gateway.qm.apple.com (Davie C. Harris)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Advent Heritage Speaker Opinions?
Date: 14 Apr 92 13:44:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: goofy.23015
Organization: Apple Computer Inc.

In article <1992Apr8.183621.12536@aplcen.apl.jhu.edu>, artis@aplcomm.jhuapl.edu (David A. Artis) writes:
> 
> Any opinions on Advent's Heritage speakers?

<Disclaimer  #1>  I'm very opinionated about what qualities of sound are most 
appreciated by my Calibrated Sonic Sensing Units* (most folks just call 'em 
ears)

<Disclaimer #2>  Take all of what I'm going to say with a grain of salt because
you've already said you like what you have (and that's what's most important).

I owned a pair of Advent 1's some time ago, and really liked them.  When I 
heard that Advent had the Legacy and Heritage speakers out I thought I'd go
take a test listen.  

My test listen involved bringing to the store three CD's that I was very 
familiar with and a pair of AKG K-240 headphones that I *adore*.  I listened 
to a track that demonstrated a particular area of sonic performance (acapella
voices; tenor sax; and _deep_ bass with piano, drums and synth) first thru 
the AKG's to give me a mental sonic benchmark and then thru the speakers in
question.

Generally, I thought the Heritage speakers were a good choice for their price
range.  I found their high frequency response wasn't as extended as I prefer.
I also thought they had a loose, boomy bass response even with tone controls
off and no "bass EQ" or "loudness" on.  They seemed pretty sweet on voices 
and the tenor sax seemed nice and warm.  The listening room wasn't really 
set up well and so I didn't feel I could draw any conclusions about imaging.

My $.02.

Mr. Bear
From: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Listening
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:45:01 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <1992Apr9.160834.1@lure.latrobe.edu.au> matgbb@lure.latrobe.edu.au writes:
>The great divide in Rec.Audio probably comes down to the following:
>
>2. If you think you can hear something unexpected, FORCE the engineers to take
>you seriously by being able to say 'I could tell the difference blindfold'.
    You might also suggest that if you are not technically
    knowledgeable, it is best to avoid proposing factoids to 
    explain WHY you hear something.

    I really don't know too many engineers who meet your straw man
    profile of refusing to listen to people who say they hear
    something.  In fact, of the real engineers on this board, I
    would be very surprised if you could produce a posting of this
    type.  

    But when the golden ears start making up factoids to explain the
    reasons for what they are hearing--as opposed to merely trying
    to describe WHAT they hear--then yes, most folks with a modicum
    of technical knowledge get a bit nauseated and "let the flames
    begin" results.
From: ledzep@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (carl.w.muhlhausen)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Analog vs. Digital / Recording vs. Consumer
Date: 16 Apr 92 17:37:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbnewsh.1992Apr16.173734.18067
Organization: AT&T

>At least, that was my experience.  What was yours?
>

I recently added a turntable (Rega Planar 3 w Sumiko Blue Point) to
my system as a complementary source to my CD player (Denon 1560).
My system is not high-end, but I'm happy.

I was surprised that my old vinyl once given a good cleaning at times
could approach the dynamics, detail, and clarity of CDs. I'd never
heard this with my older systems.

However, the surface noise, ticks and pops destroys any magic for me.
Even my best cared for records, lovingly cared for and cleaned still
have annoying noise that intrudes on "the musical experience".
It's like a live concert sitting next to a cougher. When's the next
time he's going to cough (when's the next pop coming).

My turntable's not for sale. There's a lot of good music and memories
on those old albums. But for me vinyl will never be "high-fidelity".
And the answer is not to buy an even more expensive system.


Carl Muhlhausen		"(Searching for a snazzy quote)"
att!honet9!ledzep
From: jj@alice.att.com (jj, just the same old jj)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: A Golden-Ear perspective on CD players.
Keywords: flame bait, CD accuracy
Date: 8 Apr 92 15:23:37 GMT
Reply-To: jj@alice.UUCP (jj, just the same old jj)
Organization: NJ State Home for Bewildered Terminals

In article <1992Apr7.222913.16264@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> reha@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Reha Elci) writes:
>The CD sampling rate is at 44Khz. Why hasn't anybody pointed out that this 
>sampling rate is not really sufficient to reproduce accurate high frequency
>signals? If the sampling rate was, say, 1Mhz or something, I would have
>believed fairly accurate reproduction of signals but just 2x the sampling
>rate of the frequency you are trying to quantify does not seem sufficient.
Oh please.  Every six months, somebody comes up with another attack
on the Sampling Theorem.  Yes, 2X is enough, and it's simple enough
to prove.  I'm not going to go through that here again. Please go
pick up a basic book on communication theory, and start learning.
PLEASE!

>Can interpolation and extrapolation, no matter how clever, really reproduce
>the correct shape of a 20 microsecond period signal?
Interpolation has nothing to do with it.  If you have a signal with
one 20 microsecond peak, CONSIDER ITS BANDWIDTH before you worry
about the sampling theorem.

>dynamic range (is this how it is calculated??). This also seems somewhat
>low if you are interested in accurate and detailed sound quantification.
Come again?  What's wrong with 90dB.  It's far more than LP, tape,
or any other media provides?  Yes, it woudl maybe be nice to have more,
but how much?  Why?  When the LP, with much less than 90dB SNR or
dynamic range, and circa 40dB distortion characteristics in the
best of times, is touted as "good" by the "experts", what are
we to do with more than 90 dB?
-- 
Mars ain't *Copyright alice!jj 1992, all rights reserved, except transmission
the kind      *by USENET and like free facilities granted. Said permission is
of place to       *granted only for complete copies that include this notice.
raise the kids.        *Use on pay-for-read services specifically disallowed.
From: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: A Golden-Ear perspective on CD players.
Date: 7 Apr 92 21:42:27 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <3512@rosie.NeXT.COM> pbern@next.com writes:
>
>I really wish the people that go on these open-loop flame throwing rampages  
>whenever anyone even mentions anything about audiophile would just go and  
>LISTEN. Take a few hours and go to a high end store and check out the  
>differences yourself. 
>
>Otherwise, please, just shut your trap and leave the subject alone.  Or at  
>least have a MATURE discussion.  By trying to degrade others you only end up  
>degrading yourself.
>
>
     "shut your trap" ?.  Sounds REAL mature to me, Phil.
Newsgroups: rec.audio,rec.audio.car
From: bremmer@stsci.edu (Marc H. Bremmer)
Subject: FOCAL, ETON and JBL pro drivers for sale
Followup-To: poster
Keywords: speakers
Organization: Space Telescope Science Institute
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 17:58:11 GMT

It's me again..   the other drivers are all sold..
but here are a few more for sale

One pair Focal 5K013l Kevlar sandwich cone 5.25" mid bass
Fs 45hz Qts 0.25 Vas 14l (measured) Xmax 3.5mm linear one way, 8ohm
good response to 7K, great midbass driver. Cast frame, neoprene
surround, very linear suspension. SOTA midrange suprising bass

New Condition 

$95/pair  you pay shipping

One Eton 11/580-52 HEX Kevlar/nomex honeycomb cone, unbelievably rigid.
Massive cast frame 2inch edgewound voicecoil, rubber surround, large
vented magnet with machined pole pieces. Very Very low distortion
best used in a three way. This is the bass driver used in the Avalon
Ascent  Fs 23Hz Qts 0.30 Vas 180l Xmax 4mm linear one way. nominal 
diameter is 11" Very smooth to 1000Hz 8ohm

$140 sorry only one.... a new one will set you back $280

One pair JBL 2226H 15" professional bass driver. The best 15 in the business
This is a serious professoinal driver not a cheapo sloppy 15inch Sanyo or 
the like.
  4inch edgewound voice coil, massive cast frame, magnet assembly has
a symmetric field in the gap and has a short circuting ring to prevnent
flux modulation in the pole piece. cone is fiberglass renforced long fiber
paper the response is very flat.. to 1500Hz

Fs 40hz Qts 0.31 Vas 275l Xmax 7.8mm one way linear 600 watts RMS
97db 1watt one meter 8ohm

$160each or $300/pair Firm 

    
Contact Marc Bremmer@ (410)235-9568 eve
or send me Email
Xref: sparky rec.audio:7092 sci.electronics:8187
From: phr@soda.berkeley.edu (Paul H. Rubin)
Newsgroups: rec.audio,sci.electronics
Subject: Help!! Good portable CD cable needed!
Date: 8 Apr 92 05:32:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: soda.PHR.92Apr8003259
Organization: CSUA/UCB
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

I have one of those cheap portable CD players plugged into my
stereo receiver, using an adapter cable with a 1/8" stereo
plug at the CD end and RCA plugs at the receiver end.  I'm on
my third such cable (the first came with the CD player, the
second was a random off-brand, the third is made by Sony),
and they *all* have an intermittent connection at the 1/8"
plug so often one channel will go out and I have to wiggle
the plug around to re-establish the connection.  The cables
are definitely flaky---holding the plug stationary and wiggling
the wire makes the usual scratchy noises come out of the speaker---
though the internal socket is likely also not too great.

Does everyone have this problem?  Are these cables all just no good?
Can someone recommend a good brand?  Is there one with a gold-plated
1/8" plug that doesn't cost a fortune (I don't want fancy audiophile cable,
just a reliable electrical connection)?  I ask about gold-plated
connectors because this *did* fix a similar problem with corroded
RCA sockets on an old tube amp I had once...  Am I likely to have
better luck if I cannibalize the cable from a cheap Walkmanoid headphone
and solder on some RCA plugs, or are those headphones unreliable too?

Thanks much, as usual I'll summarize e-mailed replies.
(I still owe the net summaries to my last couple questions and
will do them soon, really!)
From: chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com (Chris Christensen)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: DCC/MD comparisons (was Re: New LP-CD flame material)
Date: 8 Apr 92 00:00:25 GMT
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <51270005@hpscit.sc.hp.com> rkarlqu@hpscit.sc.hp.com 
(Rick Karlquist) writes:
>/ hpscit:rec.audio / jgardner@convex.com (John B. Gardner) / 10:45 am  Apr  2, 1992 /
>
>> I really enjoy Neil Young's work.  He massages the distortion of a
>> guitar bent on overload into pure sonic art, I love it.  I can also
>> easily see how the inherent distortion of LP reproduction would be
>> near to his heart, it's a part of his art.

In my opinion the art comes first.  And I would only be speculating
but I believe that Neil would disagree that he would *like* the
"distortions" of LP records!

>I'll second that.  I love Neil Young's work, artistically.  But from     
>an audiophile viewpoint, a lot of it is terrible.  For example,
>"Harvest" (great album, artistically) has extremely muddy sound 
>whether on LP or CD.  When I used to listen to it on LP, I always 
>had an uncontrollable urge to want to get up and clean the stylus!  
>Alas, the distortion is on the master tape, because the CD sounds 
>just as bad.  Anyway, Neil Young has pretty much disqualified
>himself from commenting on audio engineering.

I really like the Harvest album. I believe that the sound that was
captured was that of a band playing in a barn.  Something that people
haven't done for years.  The whole band playing together, in one room,
that live "artistic" feeling.

The production is not a polished recording but I wouldn't be suprised
if that was just what he wanted!

My thoughts.

-- 
Chris Christensen                  The opinions I express are my own,
chrisc@gold.gvg.tek.com            and sometimes they are wrong!
916-478-3419 FAX 916-478-3887      After all, I AM only human.
Xref: sparky rec.audio:7566 misc.forsale:14179
From: snguyen@orion.oac.uci.edu (Son Nguyen)
Subject: Mod Squad line drive forsale
Newsgroups: rec.audio,misc.forsale
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 17 Apr 92 16:09:28 GMT

Hi,

I have a Mod Squad line drive, not deluxe nor agt, forsale (actually,
I'm selling for a friend who doesn't have net access).  The price
is $220 + shipping; the owner has no manuals or box.  Email me if
you're interested.  

Son Nguyen
snguyen@orion.oac.uci.edu
(714)856-8415
From: jj@alice.att.com (that old grouch jj)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Analog vs. Digital / Recording vs. Consumer
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:53:57 GMT
Reply-To: jj@alice.UUCP (that old grouch jj)
Organization: NJ State Home for Bewildered Terminals

In article <1992Apr16.073445.2317@csccat.cs.com> larry@csccat.cs.com (Larry Spence) writes:
(to Kur tStrain)
>Yes, you'd think so.  But we all know you'd crawl over broken glass into a
>vinegar-filled swimming pool before you'd admit that, so don't worry about
>it and just carry on.  Tell us about how the hand-applied patina on the shell
>of the Koetsu adds to the dulcet liquidity of the tone...

Oh, lay off.  Can't we stick to refuting the things that are wrong,
and/or objectionable?  What are you going to accomplish by making Kurt
unhappier because you are picking on him?

Can it, OK?
-- 
Vote for    *Copyright alice!jj 1992, all rights reserved, except transmission
President 1992 *by USENET and like free facilities granted. Said permission is
___________________*granted only for complete copies that include this notice.
Just Say !!!NO!!!       *Use on pay-for-read services specifically disallowed.
From: myers@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Bob Myers)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: FORSALE Speakers and CABLES
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:23:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: hpfcso.7490153
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA

> 		NBS Speaker Cables, 2 pr., 8ft., $300./pr. or $550 for
> 		both pair.
> 
>  		NBS Serpent Interconnects, 2 sets, 4 ft., $550./set.
> 

Good LORD!  Well, at least we can assume they're "broken in!" :-)



Bob Myers  KC0EW   Hewlett-Packard Co.      |Opinions expressed here are not
                   User Interface Tech. Div.|those of my employer or any other
myers@fc.hp.com    Fort Collins, Colorado   |sentient life-form on this planet.
From: shell@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Steve Sheldon)
Newsgroups: rec.audio
Subject: Re: Minimus 7s for Surround Speakers?
Date: 11 Apr 92 02:25:01 GMT
Organization: People-Net [pnet51], Minneapolis, MN.


 
 Regarding the Minimus 77's and the Minimus 7's.
 
 I was working in a Radio Shack(Rat Shaft) store over the x-mas season, and
had many chances to listen to the M7's and M77's.
 
 The M7 has a 4" paper cone woofer w/rubber surround, and a 1" soft dome
tweeter, all in a sturdy metal case.
 The M77 instead uses a 5" paper cone woofer w/foam surround.
 
 In my listening, the M77 does have a little more bass extension.  But I
didn't think that it was as precise in vocals.  It's not a bad little speaker,
but I think the M7 is a better buy.
 
 Especially if you're going to use them as a surround speaker, where bass
isn't necessary.  (I sold quite a few of these for this application)
 
 There were also a number of modifications published in Speaker Builder to
"improve" the surround of the M7's.  I believe these consisted of modifying
the crossover, currently it just uses a capacitor on the tweeter.
 
 Oh, the M77 was on sale at $50/eac, whereas the M7 goes on sale for $30/ea.
 
 Another one you might consider is the RS 2-way wall speaker.  It's list price
is $50/ea, and I don't know when/if it will go on sale.  From what I saw, it
is essentially the insides of a M77, minus the metal housing.
 
 That is about the extent of my recommendations for Radio Shack products,
although their test meters aren't bad at sale price.
 

UUCP: {kksys, crash}!orbit!pnet51!shell
ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!shell@nosc.mil
INET: shell@pnet51.orb.mn.org
Newsgroups: rec.audio
From: carton@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (John C Carton)
Subject: Analog vs. Digital
Organization: Johns Hopkins University - Homewood Academic Computing
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 22:35:01 GMT

	Well, since no one from this newsgroup bothered to advise me on
some components, I am now going to ask some questions of what the salesman
said. He talked about Yamaha Receivers as the only ones in modest price range
that has digital surround sound. It that true ? Also, that if I want DSP,
then I have buy a unit with Pro-Logic, which is basically my budget for
components. Realizing that DSP is going to cost alot, I decided to get a
good amp and a simple cd-player. Could someone e-mail of brands to look at ?

John Charles Carton

ps. Don't waste any bandwidth flaming this, instead please answer my questions.