HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu (XiaoFei Wang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Chinese characters and sorting, collating, etc.
Date: 19 Nov 92 22:56:32 GMT
Organization: UB

/* kemnitz@netcom.com (Greg Kemnitz) wrote */:
* I have some questions about Chinese characters from a database weenie's
* perspective :-)  

Hi, weenie!

* In most alphabetic languages, there is a well-defined scheme for ordering
* the characters which define less-than, greater-than, and equality properties
* for characters - ie 'A' < 'B' < 'C' ... < 'Z' in English.  I've talked with
* several Chinese friends about this problem and it seems that there are several
*"dictionary orderings" in Chinese, all of which require "reading" the character
* to get the number of strokes, etc.
* 
* Also, while one could just assign an arbitrary ordering for indexing purposes,
* "human useful" sorting would require conversion functions to generate the
* numbers for useful sorting.

I do not see ordering chars as a problem. 
In hz a Chinese char is represented by two ascii chars. 
There is not problem to sort the ascii chars
why should be a problem sorting chinese chars? 

For example, 

0! --> a1 ( ~{0!~} the sound you utter when a doctor check your throat )
2i --> cha2 ( ~{2i~} check )
3G --> cheng2 ( ~{3G~} city )
4s --> da4 ( ~{4s~}big ) 


crl.nmsu.edu:/pub/chinese/hanzi-table.readme and reference therein. 
-- 
xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu | Subscribe Chinese Poem Exchange and Discussion List 
mail LISTSERV@UBVM.BITNET with "SUB CHPOEM-L 1st LastName" in the MESSAGE BODY
InterNet Address: UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU | Posting in UUENCODED GB and BIG5
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: echeng@phys.psu.edu (Eddie Cheng)
Subject: Re: Hong Kong and GATT questions
Organization: Penn State, Department of Physics
Distribution: US
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:19:30 GMT

In article <Bxvr90.CFq@ccu.umanitoba.ca> etaylor@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Euan R. Taylor) writes:
>
>what do chinese people a) think and b) feel (please note the distinction)
>about the current discussions / squabbling over the return of Hong Kong to
>the PRC.?

	Well, I don't know what "Chinese people" feel.  I myself feel like
watching two bad guys bullying each other and worrying that someone may 
suddenly pop in to ask me to take a side...  :-)

	BTW, the dispute was not about HK's return, but what to do with 
HK's election system before its return.

	CCP/CG is bad, that goes without saying, at least in this group.  :-)
BG is equally bad.  For a century they governed HK, they had used every
effort to deny democracy in HK.  And now, a couple of years before HK
is being returned, they want to install "democracy"?  

	And I feel sorry for the real d-fighters in HK.  They had done a
great job before.  But now they are caught in a deadly trap.  For 
morality and consistency, they had to side with their former enemy
who is going to abandon them real soon...

>question 2 
>Is china involved in the GATT discussions, if so how does this mesh with
>a largely state run indusatry and subsidies?

	The GATT commision doesn't seem to mind that too much.  China's
exports are not particularly heavily subsided compared to Japan and
Europe.


	 Eddie
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 13:42:44 EST
From: <XXX100@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Deng = Angel?

Deng is still alive.
Now you guys begin  30% off or
40% off  to close  coffin and make
judgement of him.
Lin MeiMei had  a couple good verses to describe
this sorta situation while she was
burrying flowers.

Deng would be happy to see so many
people looking at him and doing
complicated calculations in hearts.
And he might do sth wonderful for
their exercises.

X Xu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.asian.american
From: michaelk@netcom.com (Michael Kronstadt)
Subject: Re: mail-order bride
Organization: Abbott Critical Care Systems, Mountain View CA
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:38:18 GMT

Jude Narita's incredibly powerful and moving one-woman show (which I
recommend to anyone who has the chance to see it) includes a piece 
on the subject which makes it very clear that the shame does not belong
on the woman's side.

-- 
Michael Kronstadt         michaelk@netcom.com                       __o
Abbott Critical Care Systems       ____    "Ride the bike,        _`\<,_
Mountain View, CA                  \  /      ride the bike,      (*)/ (*)
(my opinions, not Abbott's)         \/        ride the bike." -- Fausto Coppi
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 22:00:40 EST
From: <XXW101@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Best Deal to Fly from New York to Shanghai

    Could anyone please provide me some information about the most economic

  price for an air ticket from New York to Shanghai. The Departure date is

  on Dec.15, and return on Jan. 12, 93.   Please send me an e-mail.

   Thank you very much in advance!


   Xinli Wu @PennState
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: zzuo@iastate.edu (Zhiqi Zuo)
Subject: Re: CFMN?
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:40:14 GMT

In article <BxsGxI.755@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> xlli@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (xiao-lin li) writes:
>In article <Bxq77G.HJ1@news.iastate.edu> zzuo@iastate.edu (Zhiqi Zuo) writes:
...
>Why do you think we should let them live a rich life while they
>still enjoy killing and jailing ordinary Chinese people? That is
>too unfair.

I am confused by your question, not knowing where it came from.
From: gaojeng@durras.anu.edu.au (J. Gao)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Zhou En-lai and his characters
Date: 21 Nov 92 01:09:23 GMT
Organization: Australian National University
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.22.8

lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li) writes:

>In article <gaojeng.722259262@durras> gaojeng@durras.anu.edu.au (J. Gao) writes:
>>lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li) writes:
>>(deleted)
>>>The SOS China Education Fund is a non-political, non-profit and independent
>>
>>What kind of boat is this then? :-) :-)

>This is a volunteer-boat, no rules such as "Qi Si Mie Zhu, 3 knife 6 holes",
>...

I sure knew of this SOS from its very inception :-) and didn't really exepect
such a warm, public personal invitation. :-)

OK, I think I'll stay in the "sea" for a while and see if there are other
options. :-)  But plain sailing to you...

Gao Jie

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: "micky wong" <micky.wong@canrem.com>
Subject: china's economic struct..
Reply-To: "micky wong" <micky.wong@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: soc
Date: 23 Nov 92 00:46:58 EST

In article: <RON.92Nov16051251@wc07.yorku.ca>
   Subject: China's economic struct... an analysis
      From: ron@wc07.yorku.ca (Ron Sheese) writes:


RS> Why people here thing the 1989 movement was totally for democracy and
RS> every people there was fighting for democracy.  That was a media lead
RS> from west.  The leading force of the west society wanted to tell
RS> people around that Chinese was up for democracy.

Just like the western media had romantic notions of Chinese revolution
towards CCP's earlier victory in the 1940's, it is possible, the media
emphasized on the demand for democracy. On the other hand, I had this
vivid image of a group of courageous and remarkable people from the
"People's daily", marched with a big banner saying "DO NOT FORCE US TO
LIE".  This is an unrefutable proof, that people are indeed demand for
democracy.

RS> Actually, I THINK, the majority of people at that time is up for two
RS> reasons: great unsatisfaction towards goverment reaction and worrying
RS> of their life due to the unforseeable future at that time.  I don't
RS> think the living was much worsen which made people unbearable then.

For any movement, there could be many underline reasons, you missed most
important one, which is people, not only students, there were
intellectuals, workers, city forks who were "Ge4 Ti3 Hu4" (free
enterprisers) all went to the streets of Beijing, there were even some
soldiers of the PLA, and people from government departments joined the
movement at times. What people want is: *Eradicate the corruption of the
CCP!*
People's living standard were affected by the high inflation at that
time. since you mentioned the view of the western media, I'm posting
some article from Time's magazine around the 6.4 time frame.
These are indeed the views from the west, I let the new arrivals from
China to have a chance to read them and make your their judgement.
---
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: PXW10@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Clinton's tougher line
Date: 20 Nov 92 16:45:17 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

In article <00963DF4.2027EB40@Msu.oscs.montana.edu>,
uphhswh@Msu.oscs.montana.edu says:
>
>Clinton said he will show "tougher line" toward China. In fact, chinese
>goverment can play japan's card or some other cards.  Such "tougher line" will
>only hurt chinese people and also american people.
>

What he said was just part of the campain, I think. For American's good
he (and/or his advisors) should know it is better to keep a good relation with
China.

Peter
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: hchiu@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Hsu-Ju Chiu)
Subject: dating a guy from China
Summary: question
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 00:36:10 GMT

Hi, there:
I am a student from Taiwan and I was dating a guy from China before.
It seemed he liked me but he was afraid of falling in love with me.
I was lost.
would anyone give me a hint or any suggestions?
Thanks!
please email me:hchiu@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
From: stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Zhou En-lai and his characters
Date: 16 Nov 1992 18:43:31 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: stevelin

In article <1e8cg5INNrm6@cat.cis.Brown.EDU> (Xiang Zhou) writes:
>In article <1992Nov15.061943.20594@news.acns.nwu.edu>  (ZhongDong Lin) writes:

>|> >> I would like to know something more about Zhou. I am impressed by the fact 
>|> >> that he was loved by so many people. Even Mao did not achieved this. When
>|> >> Zhou died in 1976, I was a child. I was curious why so many person wept for
>|> >> his death. 

Long time in my curious, I found that Chow was not in the KMT list of "must hunt
down" like Mao and Chu. I was curious why Mao and Chow both died in 1976.

Yes, I found it. Chow was the most skillful man in CCP politics. He played a roll
that KMT hated him but didn't want him died. He made a big mistake to put aside
the border problem that let India took a big land (30 times bigger than Taiwan)
into Indian territory. He made a big mistake to promote Mao as a CCP leader.
Though Chow had many arguements with Mao, he yielded for Mao. He made a big
mistake to pay indifference of cultural revolution. By then, Mao was incapable
doing things, but not Chow. However, he let it go.



Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.asian.american
From: smp@sun4.ee.ncku.edu.tw (Shine-Ming.Prong)
Subject: Re: When was lantern (Deng1 Long3) invented?
Keywords: some options
Organization: N.C.K.U. E.E. COMPUTER GROUP
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 07:48:58 GMT

In article <1992Nov16.070640.15060@news.columbia.edu> hyx1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Harry Y Xu) writes:

>A question for the historian:  When was lantern (Deng1 Long3) invented?
>    I recently noticed that candles (Zhu2) were used even outdoors at night
>    in literatures written in the Han4 and Tang2 Dynasties.  I assume it
>    must be invented after Tang2 Dynasty then.

>Examples:   (Ping-in with word-for-word translation below to assist reading)

>1.     Ri4 Duan3     Ku3      Ye4 Chang2,   He2 Bu4  Bing3   Zhu2   You2.
>        |    |       /\        |     |       |   |     |     |       |
>       Day short sour(suffer) night long,   why not hold-up candle travel.

>2.     Ri4 Mu4     Han4            Gong1 Chuan2 La4 Zhu,
>        |   |      /  \              |     |      \ /
>       Day dusk Han4 (the dynasty) palace pass   candle

>       Qing1 Yan1    San4   Ru4  Wu3   Hou2   Jia1.
>         |     |       |     |    |     |      |
>       Light smoke disperse into five marquis home.

>Tnx & cheers,
>--
>Harry Xu (KB2LHA)      "Hell has no terrors for pagans."  --Arthur Rimbau d
     	The lantern was invented in ancient China.I don't assue the time.
But in Taiwan has many shops which take it to adorn,such as restaurant
,teashop.They still have Tang2 	dynasty fashion.In Taiwan or China has
many holidays take lantern to celebrate.The chinese lunation in 15 January
(called lantern holiday in Taiwan) and in whole July do that.


Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:30521 talk.politics.china:2707 soc.culture.taiwan:15359
From: mte152s@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china,soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: NEWS: China overseas policy change
Date: 16 Nov 92 11:17:21 +1100
Organization: Computer Centre, Monash University, Australia

================================================================================
"China lifts foreign ban but cuts sponsorship", By Geoffrey Parkins of
Sources: HIGHER EDUCATION (British).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Chinese leadership in Beijing is set to liberalise its policy on
overseas study by allowing all students to study overseas, and to permit
all returning students to leave and enter the country when they wish.

China maintained strict quotas and selection procedures on overseas
study, and very few citizens had the right to leave and enter the
country.  But now Li Tieying, minister in charge of the State Education
Commission has said that China would issue passports to all students
accepted by foreign universities.  And government would "respect their
freedom of travel" on their return to Chine after graduation.

But China intends phasing out state sponsoring of students going abroad.
The salaries of university professors are to be raised from the current
average of &37(400 yuan) to about &93(1,000 yuan) per month.

Chinese universities will also be permitted to set up joint programmes,
new departments and even institutions with foreign universities.

Mr Li said that while students would be encouraged to study overseas,
the authorities clearly hoped most would return on completing their
courses, emphasising again that no student would be made to stay in
China.

The Chinese government wants to improve graduates' knowledge and skills
in international trading, and business and marketing.  China is also to
lift its controls on set up programmes, departments or institutions
jointly run with foreign universities.  Also proposed is the idea of
permitting the creation of wholly foreign funded institutions of higher
education, including branches of foreign universities.
================================================================================
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:30557 talk.politics.china:2724 soc.culture.taiwan:15385
From: yding+@pitt.edu (Yijun Ding)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china,soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: NEWS: China overseas policy change
Date: 16 Nov 92 15:41:17 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.china
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1e877eINN9p3@apache.dtcc.edu> wang@apache.dtcc.edu (Wang Gang) writes:
>Does this mean that I spent 5000 yuan, and gave up my Fudan diploma to enter
>a community college in US, is just a WASTE OF TIME ?????!!!!
>
>If I find it true, I will NEVER go back to China.

Will you go back to China, if it is NOT true?

-- 
//Yijun Ding, Pittsburgh //Go your way, be happy.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china
From: be549@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Robin Coose)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,talk.politics.china
Subject: Re: NEWS: China overseas policy change
Date: 18 Nov 1992 06:47:07 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu




good point !!!

Rob

-- 
=============================================================
||   I have gone out to look for myself.  If I should      ||
||   return before I get back, hold me until I get here.   ||
=============================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: xlli@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (xiao-lin li)
Subject: Re: CFMN?
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 04:33:01 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.024111.20981@marlin.jcu.edu.au> phsj@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Su Jianfeng) writes:

>not.  Thus, I make a suggestion here that if there are someones to
>formally push the CMFN bill, we use whatever way, which is convenient
>(newspapers, letters to university students in China), to tell the names
							^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>and behavours of those persons to people in China and suggest the people,
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>who are interested in, to make a judgement on that whether those CMFN
>promoters are political prostitutes or democratic fighters.   The
>answers are suggested to be sent to the USA embassy or any newsgroups
>they want.  Thus, if they are considered to be democratic fighters, they
>will be well known in China.  But if they are considered to be political
>prostitutes, they will be kicked away both in China and USA.

I am in favor of an open debate on whatever issue about China in the
Chinese media. In fact that is the purpose of democracy. But the
rule has to be fair. You have to let both sides to debate in the way we 
do here. We can take, for example, the format of US Presidential debate.
The debate should allow both sides to say anything they want to
say (including the the facts of 6/4, pictures, evidence, video).
The debator should not be persecuted by the government forces. We
can allocate, for example, equal time for both sides. If you can
arrange such event, you have my respect. If I dare not go to such
debate, I am not Li Xiaolin :-).

I have underlined some words which I think you are making the game
unfair. Before you can set the rule even, I have to assume that you
are making a blacklist which is against the law of this country.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:30936 soc.culture.taiwan:15500 alt.chinese.text:804
From: lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,alt.chinese.text
Subject: Re: Chinese character simplification, is it now necessary?
Date: 21 Nov 92 14:09:51 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.china
Organization: Boston University

In article <PWU.92Nov20224816@blackjack.ai.mit.edu> pwu@ai.mit.edu (Peng Wu) writes:
<
<    From: joe@athena.mit.edu (Joseph C Wang)
<(deleted)    
<    Could you post a reference to that study?  It goes against my personal
<    experience.  In high school, I took Latin and German, but it wasn't
<    until I entered college that I started to learn to write in Chinese
<    (even though I had spoken it at home since age five).  The characters
<    didn't make Chinese much harder.
<    
<I will keep it in mind and will post it when I find it.
<(deleted)

In Joseph C Wang's personal experience, the two are not comparable: learning
a foreign language and learn to write one's mother's tongue. Just a reminder.

-- 
The SOS China Education Fund is a non-political, non-profit and independent
organization to raise money promoting the education in rural China. All donations
are tax-deductable. Make checks or money orders payable to: "SOS China Education
Fund"; c/o Jie KANG, 2610 E. 5th Pl, Apt. 1, Tulsa, OK74104, USA.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: sichao@bnr.ca (Sichao Wang)
Subject: The right-to-die 
Keywords: respirator, medical treatment etc.
Reply-To: sichao@bnr.ca (Sichao Wang)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 18:15:34 GMT

Dear netters,

A friend of mine is working on a survey. He would like to have all opinions
from different aspects of the society, in order to conduct further research
on the issue. The results of the survey will be available to those interested
individuals upon request.

Thank you,
Sichao Wang

<---------------------<-------------------------->---------------------->

CASE:

  In November 1991, Nancy B. was lying in a Quebec City hospital. She was
  physically paralysed and totally dependent on a respirator. Her 25 year-old
  young life was hopeless, and her parents, relatives and friends were
  feeling extremelly sad for her sufferring. Her doctors ran out all their
  talents for saving her but nothing much they can do.

  Nancy wants to die. But the doctors, being pressed by their medical ethics,
  prefer to keep her alive. Nacy's parents agreed with Nancy and insist the
  hospital to remove her respirator to end her life. So this debate was put
  on court of Quebec City.

References:

   Quebec Health Act says:
         "Everyone has the equal right to receive medical
          treatment to remain alive ...... but, the treatments
          must be cosistent with the hospital's resources, i.e.,
          there have limits to the actions doctors are required to take".

   Quebec Civil Code says:
         "The competent person or the next of kin is allowed to
          refuse medical treatment."  (Note that according to the judge
          on a similar appeal in a US court, the use of respirator is
          considered as a "treatment".)

Questions:
          - What do you think the court should judge this appeal ?

          - How to improve the Quebec law so that the appealed case be
            covered ?

          - What is your opinions on this debate if you were a Christian or
            Catholic or other religious background ?

          - How to cope with Humanitarianism and the right-to-die in
            this case?

          - Do you think it is a waste of medical resources to save a
            "hopeless" (undefined term) human with tens of thousands of
             dollars, which could be used to treat more "recoverable"
             patients ?


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china
From: xlli@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (xiao-lin li)
Subject: Re: What do we Chinese celebrate? (Re: Chinese, Are You Jealous?)
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 21:46:45 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.144014.12003@ms.uky.edu> gang@ms.uky.edu (Gang Li) writes:
>>>
>>>Each progress reported on People's Daily and/or any other medium is done 
>>>by many plain Chinese people like us, who worked 20hr per day, sending their
>>>kids to the grandma, staying the post with illness-excuse in pocket. 
>
>>My sympathy to you. But I think it is not right to send your kids to
>>your grandma. Kids need to stay with their immediate parents unless
>>the parents are not qualified. You should demand for 20hr pay as well.
>>You should demand the pay that matches your work. When you are ill,
>>you should not put the illness-excuse in your pocket. You are entitled
>>to have vacation when you are ill, or even you are not ill.
>
>I don't think you are qualified to be a US citizen now, ask those older
>soldiers in the middle east if they brought their child with them.
>I can understand the reason you look down the working people, because
>you want to tell people what your democracy means.

I don't know what you are talking about. I think working people deserve
to have 8 hours per day, 5 (or at most six) days per week. They deserve
to have sick leave. They deserve to have time playing with kids. Those
who do not respect working people demand 20 hours per day work. I think
it is criminal to do that. You mean your 20 hr work demand is to respect
the working people?

The 8 hour working schedule has been fought by working people for so
many generations. It is now the law of many countries. Those kids who
do not receive care and love from their immediate parents will have 
all kind of problems. Why do you think your scientific project, your
prestige, your ego, and your political ambition are more important than 
your children? What has this to do with any citizenship? Citizenship
is only important when you go for voting.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china