From: reynard@susie.cs.scarolina.edu (John Reynard)
Subject: Re: SRUN magicalness (long)
Keywords: "Whoever you are .... I have always depended on the kindness of strangers."
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date:  9 Apr 92 22:40:46 GMT


reanor@speedy.cs.pitt.edu (Jeffrey Getzin) writes:

>In article <thornt_g.702535580@kultarr> thornt_g@cs.uwa.oz.au (Sebastian Nobwit DeLaBler) writes:
>>I would like to say something in light of all the discussion about
>>magical/astral stuff in shadowrun.
>>
>>Ahem.
>>
>>The shadowrun magic system is SILLY.
>>I HATE the way mages can learn any kind of spell that you could
>>possibly think of
>...
>>I HATE the way most magic takes no time, gestures, 
>>ingredients, preperations, or ANYTHING AT ALL that makes using 
>>magic a hassle! (I know that there is ritual magic and summoning)
>>Basically, mages in shadowrun are gods. They can do whatever they
>>like, whenever they like, and better than anyone without magic.
>>...

>It sounds to me like you hate Shadowrun magic because it's not AD&D magic.
>Almost all of your points with which you disagree refer to things you
>find in SR that you don't find in AD&D, and visa versa.

>Personally, it's been the other way around for me.   I was never satisfied
>with AD&D's magic system.   The fact that you had to pre-memorize all
>spells and that it takes at least six seconds to cast even the simplest
>spells, while gesturing and chanting like an idiot.   It just made wizards
>too pre-defined:  wizards HAD to be like a particular thing.

>I think that SR magic is the best system I've ever encountered.   You
>can cast as many spells a day as you dare, fearing only the drain.   Big spells
>can leave the caster very vulnerable.

>As a player of a mage and a GM for mages, I will testify to the balance
>of the game.   Sure, a spell can imitate cyberware but a) you've got to
>spend the karma to get the spell, b) you've got to find a way to maintain
>that spell ... the disadvantages and difficulty of which have been well-
>documented on the network, and c) you risk nasty drain for many of them.

>I mean yes, you can get a spell Increase Reaction +4 which is better
>than wired reflexes, but the drain is D4.   The odds are you will be
>so drained after casting this spell that to do anything with it is ludicrous.
>Spells locks can be easily dispelled, and to reach a rank to get the
>quickening ability requires ludicrous amounts of karma.    Elementals
>can hold it, but only temporarily, and they can be dispelled.

    Increased Reaction +4 is only a D2 spell.  Make it Personal I.Reaction
being a greedy selfish bastard and it goes down to M2.
    Mages from SRun are encouraged by this rule to be non-party players.  
In my opinion there is no balance in the system as written.  Still a fun
game with a few changes to the rules though.
>The much-feared spell-locks go both ways.  God protect the mage whose
>spell lock is taken away from him.   He'd better pray that it doesn't
>fall into the hands of a hostile mage, since such a spell lock leads
>a magical link right back to him.

>Even if the mage still has his spell lock, an astral being can use it to
>launch spells at him ... something which he couldn't normally do.

>So SR's magic is powerful indeed, but it has severe limitations no matter
>how you go about it.   Generally, mages will make mincemeat of the lesser
>encounters, but so will the samurai.  This makes sense, after all.   Aren't
>we all professionals?    However, throw a guy with a high body and willpower,
>and magic to boot, and make him play it smart, and suddenly you've got a
>guy the mage just can't zap that easily.

>			=*()*()* Jeff *()*()*=
>--
>					---
>Jeffrey Getzin
>saintdor@vms.cis.pitt.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp