HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: clewis@cs.cornell.edu (Craig Lewis)
Subject: Re: big snake bites?
Organization: Cornell University, CS Dept., Ithaca, NY
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:36:52 GMT

>>As far as alcohol working, trust me on this.  I speak from direct experience.  
>>Toxicity is not the issue.  The irritation of oral mucosa is what (I think) 
>>gets the job done.  Really, you're not offering snooky a single malt scotch,
>>I was thinking more like rubbing alcohol.  Jack Daniels *does* work though.
><

>Good point... in the one & only Burmese feeding bite I've survived, I
>ried poteen (Irish 'moonshine' potato(e) whiskey), and apart from
>burning a few holes in my floor, it seemed to have no effect.  Almost
>like the little devil -liked- it or something...

                       /               
>/'''   Kyle Wohlmut    -  'Heute back ich, morgen brau ich, und       
>>-OO                   /   uebermorgen hol ich mir der Koenigin ihr      
>   \   Rocking Pig     -   Kind.  Ach, wie gut dass niemand weiss,
>  -     Enterprises    /   dass ich kyle@csli.stanford.EDU heiss.'    
 
What does this say about the bite you *didn't survive?

Craig Lewis
                      -                                              
.


Organization: Senior, Biology, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Date: Sun,  4 Oct 1992 20:40:13 -0400 
From: Alexander Bernard Brands <ab3n+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Smell of Savanahs vs iguanas

Well, I've had my Savannah Monitor for about a month now,
and I have realized that his droppings smell much worse/stronger
than those of my iguana.  Is this normal?  With just the iguana,
I never smelled anything, but with the monitor, unless I have a
fan blowing out the window, I can smell it as soon as I come in 
the room.  I had been feeding him mostly hard boiled eggs, but I 
just changed to chicken and beef, thinking the eggs may be the
culprit.  Any thoughts on this?
By the way, the iguana is about 9.5" snout vent and the monitor
is about 7" snout vent, and the ig eats more volume than the 
monitor, so it not just the amount of droppings being produced.
I have also smelled their droppings individually (yuck!), and it is 
definitely the monitor causing the smell.
     -Alex
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: datri@egsner.cirr.com (Anthony Datri)
Subject: Re: Snow Corn
Organization: Central Iowa (Model) Railroad, Dallas, Tx.
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 03:45:33 GMT

>		29 gal tank with good lighting and lid(I'm not yet happy with
>                    the lid....need a better one)

Plenty of room for a Corn.  My amelanistic has been so sweet that I recommend
Corns as well.

>                2 dry heating elements

My Corn likes to be cool.  Her tank has an adhesive heater on its underside
at one end, and she usually avoids that end.  Make sure that you only heat
one end of the tank so that there's a temperature gradient along which the
snake can move at will.

>		Fake plastic grass material for ground

I'd go with newspaper.  It's cheap and easily replaceable.

>		Various rocks and stones for hiding and such

Use an opaque box so that the snake can hide completely.  I've been using
boxes that DAT tapes are packaged in.  Another idea is to use a commercial
hideout -- these are basically inverted plastic bowls with an entryway.


Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: dhaynes@lonestar.utsa.edu (David . Haynes)
Subject: Texas Herp Society Meeting
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 14:02:41 GMT

Good Morning,

The Texas Herpetological Society will hold its annual fall symposium in the
auditorium of the New Science Building at Southwest Texas State University
in San Marcos on Saturday 31 October.

Registration begins at 0900, the morning session will deal with the problems
herps are having with environmental degredation and the afternoon session
will explore the evolving nature of herpetology as an avocation.

Exact speakers are not completely firmed up yet, nor are social events or
costs--but previous meetings have been in the $10-15 range.

All interested persons are encouraged to attend.  For membership information,
please contact me via any of the methods listed below.


-- 
David Haynes, Institute of Texan Cultures, PO Box 1226, San Antonio TX 78294
Voice: 512/226-7651, FAX: 512/222-8564, InterNet: dhaynes@lonestar.utsa.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: young@serum.kodak.com
Subject: Re: Raising crickets, ig meets bug
Originator: young@sasquatch
Reply-To: young@serum.kodak.com
Organization: Clinical Diagnostics Division, Eastman Kodak Company
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 16:42:08 GMT

In article <1992Sep28.235747.29841@u.washington.edu> stevep@wrq.com (Steve Poole) writes:

[...]

>On a related note, I observed interesting behavior in my green
>iguana the other day.  I've read now and then that young iguanas
>may eat crickets, but I've never given Shep insects before.  He's
>about 28" end to end, and I dropped him into a tank with a single
>medium sized cricket.  He completely ignored it until it hopped right
>past his nose.  Completely unused to such creatures, he made a mad 
>dash in the opposite direction!  It was interesting to note his absolute
>lack of any predatory instinct or even a clue as to what the bug
>might be good for, after having seen the Savannah stalk and catch
>crickets like a reptilian Terminator.

	On the other hand, I know of an iguana that eats the little suckers
	so fast that his(her?) anole companion has trouble getting any.  I
	think it's only young ones that eat crickets, and this one is 
	about 12 inches long...but is growing MUCH faster than its fellow
	iguana which doesn't eat crickets (but which lives in the same
	cage).

	As for cricket husbandry, my friend (who actually HAS all these
	creatures) informs me that the iguana/anole cage is literally
	awash in crickets which range in size from barely visible to
	"normal"....apparently the result of some type of interaction
	between one or more escapees from the iguana/anole "marauders".
	Unfortunately, they seem to hide under the cage fixtures and
	the reptilian residents either can't get at them or simply don't
	notice them; I moved the water dish once and there must have been
	50 of 'em runnin' fer cover!


-Rich Young (These are not Kodak's opinions.)
From: dlb5404@tamsun.tamu.edu (Daryl Biberdorf)
Subject: Substrates (was Iguana digging)
Keywords: digging substrates
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 15:53:54 GMT

In article <tbh1.717804157@Isis.MsState.Edu> tbh1@ra.msstate.edu (Tracy B. Henley) writes:
>I just read several postings on iguana digging and taming.  A couple of notes.
>First, soil is not a good substrated ofor iguanas (or most snakes or
>other herps).  It carries too many kinds of bacteria, can be ingested with 
>food and cause intestinal problems, etc. etc.  Sand is just as bad.  Something
>removable and cleanable, like artificial turf or paper is much safer.  Also,
>igs may eat a lot of soil, wit (oops) sh  which isn't good for them either.

I'm curious about something.  Why is there so much concern about using
sand or soil as substrates for herps, especially those that natively *live*
on such substrates?

I had a local pet dealer tell me that sand was bad for my leopard geckos,
but both deVosjoli and the Glades Herp people indicate that clean, sterile
sand is a fine substrate for my geckos.  Glades Herp specifically indicated
that sandbox sand (for kids) is just fine; it's what I use (at $3.00 per 
40 or 50 lb bag, it's certainly inexpensive).

It seems that some snakes should do just fine on sand as well.  After all,
many snakes are desert creatures -- all those documentary films show
desert herps moving around just fine on sand.  I realize this isn't true
for all snakes, but don't many snakes live on soil as well?

Why do *I* use sand?  I want a vivarium with leopard geckos in it, not just
a leopard gecko cage.  I'll be adding two haworthia plants (succulents
with raised white bumps all over them) to my vivarium soon, and these plants
won't grow on astroturf.  I'll be using a layer of gravel, topped by a layer
of soil (where the plants actually grow), topped by sand.

Comments?  I'm really curious about this.

Daryl
-- 
Daryl Biberdorf  N5GJM    d-biberdorf@tamu.edu or  dlb5404@tamsun.tamu.edu
From: delaney@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Dennis Delaney)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Crickets Bulk?
Date: 29 Sep 92 18:04:45 GMT
Reply-To: delaney@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Dennis Delaney)
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.

Anyone know of a mailorder co that has crickets in bulk?  Also anyone know of a good MailOrder Co for herp suplies in general??  Let me know

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
|Dennis S. Delaney		Internet:	delaney@hq.ileaf.com  |
|Interleaf, Inc.		UUCP:		uunet!leafusa!delaney |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: msgctr@calmasd.Prime.COM (Message Center)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Posting Distribution & Herp Show this weekend
Date: 1 Oct 92 16:14:38 GMT
Organization: Computervision, San Diego, CA


I'd like to pipe up here just for a second to request that when 
you're posting to this newsgroup that you post either world or
na for North America.. I've been really lost on a few followups
to postings I've never seen... The followups I suppose are na or
world but the original postings I've no idea where or when I 
missed them :(  Gary Sullivan replied about a gruesome Bullsnake
feeding and I can't remember seeing the posting, sadly I was
wanting to know the gruesome details Gary edited out for the
sake of saving bandwidth :)

So please :) if you remember, there are a lot of us here 
spread out all over the world reading even all the way down
here in San DIego  :) 

Thanks Everyone!

********
Just a reminder to those who will be in San Diego this 
weekend, there is the 1st Annual Reptile Breeders Show and
Sale here Sat & Sun Oct 3rd & 4th at the San Diego Community
Concourse, Plaza Hall at 3rd & B Street in Downtown San Diego.
the admission is $ 5.50 for Adults and children 10 & under are 
$3.50. (sounds almost like a feeder price :) 

Sat 10/3 9a-6p Exhibits open to public for show and sale
         7pm-11pm Ice Breaker at Howard Johnsons Harborview
                   1430 7th Ave (619)696-0911
Talks and slide shows with:  Bob Applegate - Private Breeder
Dave Phillips - Herps of Southwest, John Tashjian - Renowned Herp
Photographer, David Blair - Clyclura Breeding Foundation

Sun 10/4 10am-5pm Exhibits open to public for show and sale.
         4pm  Door prize drawing

-- 
Birny Baker bxb@calmasd.prime.com
From: Jack.Honeycutt@f52.n105.z1.therose.pdx.com (Jack Honeycutt)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Herpetology Network Help!
Date: 28 Sep 92 22:39:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: therose.717905798.F00003

Hello John!

26 Sep 92, John D Turnipseed writes to All:

 JDT> In article <20722@plains.NoDak.edu>, eide@plains.NoDak.edu (Jason Eide)
 JDT> writes:

 >> I recently came accross a ad for the
 >> Herpetology Network
 >> 215-464-3562 Modem
 >> POB 52261, PHILA, PA 19115
 >> Reptile/Amphibian info and Databases

 JDT>     I don't normally follow up posts by including the original text,
 JDT> but in this case

 JDT> I think it's important to get HERP-NET's number out as
 JDT> often as posible.

So true.  HerpNet is a great BBS for all herp people.

As well as this news group, there is also a new Fido Network herp echo on the
backbone feed.  The tage name is CHAMELEON.  Ask your local Fido BBS to request
it.

CHAMELEON and well as this REC.PETS.HERP news group are on my BBS, The Garden
Pond BBS in Portland Oregon at 1-503-735-3074.  HST, V.32 bis, 16.8K.

The Garden Pond BBS is a support BBS for garden ponds and aquatic plants.
All are welcome, no pre valadation to down load on your first visit, a FREE
BBS.

Jack
Jack
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: cosper@seq.uncwil.edu (Kit Cosper)
Subject: Re: Bitis gabonica bites
Organization: Univ. of North Carolina @ Wilmington
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 13:42:45 GMT

br105@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jeffrey A. Del Col) writes:


>	Anybody who wants to keep Gaboon Vipers ought to read Raymond
>Ditmars' account of what happened to Marlin Perkins when he was struck by
>one fang on the back of his left index finger.  

	I'd also recommend reading _Snake_Venom_Poisoning_ by Dr.
	Findlay Russell.  This is a good book for ANYONE thinking
	about dealing with hot snakes, the pictures will make you
	think about it for a while.

>From what I have read, 
>once a Gaboon Viper gets riled, it stays angry for a long time, gaping and 
>striking reapeatedly.  

	However, Gaboons do have a tendency to let you know WELL in 
	advance that they don't like what you are doing.  Anyone
	who chooses to ignore their hissing probably doesn't have
	any business keeping one anyway.

>	There's some fellow in Florida who breeds Gaboons; he's a braver man
>than I'll ever be.  The person who posted the query about king cobras and 
>Gaboons ought to get in touch with him first.   Maybe someone on the net
>can supply his address?  

	He is Eugene Bessette, Ophiological Services, in Archer Florida.
	Eugene takes his snake business VERY seriously, and will NOT
	sell Gaboons, Rhinos, or "Raboons" (Rhino X Gaboon) to Joe
	Public.  He must either know you and have confidence in
	your abilities, or someone he trusts must be able to vouch for
	you.  He also breeds several species of python ( Burmese, Green
	Tree, Carpet X Diamonds) Dumeril's Boas, and quite a few
	colubrids.  As far as keeping King Cobras, Wayne Hill
	(Treasurer of Central Florida Herp Society and Editor of the
	League of Florida Herp societie's newsletter) has a few.
	He may be able to offer insight as well.

-- 
   Kit Cosper                        cosper@seq.uncwil.edu         
   PP-ASEL-IA                        AMA 31022
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: mds5597@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Subject: Sexing
Reply-To: mds5597@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 14:33:49 GMT



	Well I got her! An albino Corn. I had not asked what sex the snake is 
though... I looked in this book I have and apparently it's a girl. The tail 
tappers sharply from about the mid section. How accurate is this way of 
figuring out the sex?
                                               
                                                      Treky and Tabatha
							    N8VFZ

P.S.
----
Live long and prosper.                   

Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: kyle@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Kyle Wohlmut)
Subject: Re: big snake bites?
Followup-To: rec.pets.herp
Organization: Rocking Pig Enterprises
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 18:06:05 GMT

In article <1992Sep25.160600.6671@progress.com> gerard@progress.COM
(Gerard "Why Pay More" Bras) writes:

>As far as alcohol working, trust me on this.  I speak from direct experience.  
>Toxicity is not the issue.  The irritation of oral mucosa is what (I think) 
>gets the job done.  Really, you're not offering snooky a single malt scotch,
>I was thinking more like rubbing alcohol.  Jack Daniels *does* work though.
>

Good point... in the one & only Burmese feeding bite I've survived, I
tried poteen (Irish 'moonshine' potato(e) whiskey), and apart from
burning a few holes in my floor, it seemed to have no effect.  Almost
like the little devil -liked- it or something...

                       /               
/'''   Kyle Wohlmut    -  'Heute back ich, morgen brau ich, und       
c-OO                   /   uebermorgen hol ich mir der Koenigin ihr      
   \   Rocking Pig     -   Kind.  Ach, wie gut dass niemand weiss,
  -     Enterprises    /   dass ich kyle@csli.stanford.EDU heiss.'    
                       -
From: bzandrew@bbs1984.chi.il.us (Bill Zandrew)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Feeding baby lizards
Date: 3 Oct 92 03:59:37 GMT
Organization: Not an Organization

Hmmm....  baby anoles...  If you raise your own meal worms, you will be able to
find ones the right size.  Fruit flies, spiders, moths are all o.k.  There is a
place in Lombard that specializes in lizards.  They may be able to supply some
stuff.  Let me know if you need any particulars on them.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: dboldt@dsdbqvarsa (David Boldt (x5679))
Subject: Re: Substrates (was Iguana digging)
Keywords: digging substrates
Organization: United States Geological Survey
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 20:55:59 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.170429.690@u.washington.edu> tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer) writes:

>My Kenyan Sand Boas live on (or rather in) sand.  One must be careful
>though when buying sand for desert reptiles to live in.  Silica sand is
>definitely no good (and this is the sand that is usually cheapest to buy).
> It is the functional equivalent of ground glass, and if ingested, will
>cause severe and sometimes fatal scarring of the gastrointestinal system. 
>Be sure to buy sand that is NOT silica-based.  This is commonly available
>in garden supply stores.

Silica is SiO2.  Glass is silica, sand is silica.  Almost any naturally
occuring sand is silica;  the most notable exception being carbonate sands 
from places such as shallow reefs in areas of Florida.  Natually occuring 
sand is going to be very smooth, not sharp edged.  The environments that 
create sand, such as beaches, are very tough on edges.  Beach sand is what 
happens when rocks grind away on each other until the grains are so small 
that the viscosity of water no longer lets them touch each other.
-- 
                           -- david boldt   dboldt@qvarsa.er.usgs.gov
                                            US Geological Survey
                                            Water Resources Division
                                            Reston, VA    (703 648-5679)
From: bzandrew@bbs1984.chi.il.us (Bill Zandrew)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Need tips for water turtles (THANKS!)
Date: 30 Sep 92 06:54:18 GMT
Organization: Not an Organization

I'd be very careful with that heater.  I've had problems with them in the past.
 You may get turtle soup!
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: kyle@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Kyle Wohlmut)
Subject: Re: Another question about mice:
Followup-To: rec.pets.herp
Organization: Rocking Pig Enterprises
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 18:59:39 GMT

In article <17848@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> nathan@charles.ucdavis.edu
(Nathan "Balls" Rollins) writes:

>	Has anyone tried a commercial snap-type mousetrap for
>dispatching them? My Burmese is growing fast, and soon she'll be
>onto adult rats, which may be a bit harder for me to kill; would a
>spring-type rat-trap be an answer?
>

Here's a much easier solution, trust me: Take the rat in a paper bag,
the one you got from the store will probably do; wad up the open end
in your hand (like a sack lunch), swing the bag club-like onto the
nearest table, countertop, floor, or whatever, hard.  Instant dead
rat, no blood, no messy trap.  Just empty the bag into snake's feeding
area.  Taa-daaah!

/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/
                       /               
/'''   Kyle Wohlmut    -  'Heute back ich, morgen brau ich, und       
c-OO                   /   uebermorgen hol ich mir der Koenigin ihr      
   \   Rocking Pig     -   Kind.  Ach, wie gut dass niemand weiss,
  -     Enterprises    /   dass ich kyle@csli.stanford.EDU heiss.'    
                       -                                              
-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-
From: AHACC@ASUACAD.BITNET
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Skinks Wanted & For Trade
Date: 27 Sep 92 10:06:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: ASUACAD.92271.030612AHACC
Organization: Arizona State University


     A friend of mine is looking to buy or trade for a few
reptiles and asked me to post a note for her.

     My friend has an expectant blue-tongue skink that
should be giving birth in December.  She is interested in
trading the juveniles for a shingleback skink female
(juvenile preferred) or a rhinoceros iguana (cyclura
cornuta) female juvenile.  She would also consider
purchasing either of these and would like a price in U.S.
dollars.  She would prefer to get them from someone who has
them in the U.S. already to avoid customs holdups.

     If you are interested, please send me private e-mail
and I'll put you in contact with my friend.  Please note
that I don't read the herp group regularly and probably
won't see a reply posted here.

     Thanks!

                         -Andrew
                         <AHACC@ASUACAD.BITNET>
                         <AHACC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: pholland@iastate.edu (Paul J Hollander)
Subject: Re: Cause of Bullsnakes demise?
Keywords: Bullsnakes demise
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 21:54:24 GMT

In article <Bv4sos.GFF@egsner.cirr.com> datri@egsner.cirr.com (Anthony Datri) writes:
> (Deleted)
>
>There has been a lot of controversy over that here.  I've never tried, but
>I can't quite figure out how one would manage to de-fang a fully live-and-
>squirming mouse or rate.  I find them hard enough even to pick up.
>
> (Deleted)

Warning: gruesome description follows.

To defang a mouse you need side cutters.  Hold the mouse's tail in the right 
hand and take the scruff of the mouse's neck between the thumb and first 
finger of the left hand.  Pick up the mouse and turn it upside down, looping 
the tail between the ring and last fingers of the left hand.  The mouse is 
now reasonably immobilized.  Clip the incisor teeth with the side cutters and 
throw the mouse to a snake.  All of my snakes will take dead food, so I 
generally find it easier to kill the mouse instead.

Paul Hollander    pholland@iastate.edu
Behold the tortoise: he makes no progress unless he sticks his neck out.

Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: jthomaso@nmsu.edu (THOMASON)
Subject: venom injections...
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
Distribution: rec
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 23:16:30 GMT


	I would be interested in knowing about building up resistance
to neurotoxic venoms by means of subcutaneous or subepidermal
injection. I know about Bill Haast doing it succesfully but there is
little or no research available on it here at our school. Anyone
knowing names of papers or people to contact please reply to me
directly or by posting on this board.
	

						J.Thomason
						NMSU



Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer)
Subject: Re: Substrates (was Iguana digging)
Keywords: digging substrates
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 21:39:24 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.205559.21209@rsg1.er.usgs.gov> dboldt@dsdbqvarsa (David Boldt (x5679)) writes:
>In article <1992Oct1.170429.690@u.washington.edu> tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer) writes:
>
>Silica is SiO2.  Glass is silica, sand is silica.  Almost any naturally
>occuring sand is silica;  the most notable exception being carbonate sands 
>from places such as shallow reefs in areas of Florida.  Natually occuring 
>sand is going to be very smooth, not sharp edged.  The environments that 
>create sand, such as beaches, are very tough on edges.  Beach sand is what 
>happens when rocks grind away on each other until the grains are so small 
>that the viscosity of water no longer lets them touch each other.
>-- 
>                           -- david boldt   dboldt@qvarsa.er.usgs.gov
>                                            US Geological Survey
>                                            Water Resources Division
>                                            Reston, VA    (703 648-5679)

Your point is well taken.  I think the problem is simply one of
nomenclature.  The non-silica based "sand" that is sold may not in fact be
"sand" (I think it's more like finely ground gravel), but the package that
it comes in IS labelled sand.  Also despite the fact that most true sand
is not sharp to the touch (there is an experiment going on now in one part
of Washington where they're paving the roads with a mixture of asphalt and
ground-up glass) nevertheless, it has definitely been shown that standard
sand can cause potentially fatal scarring of the intestinal tract in reptiles.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp