From: edw@caligula.cts.com (Ed Watkeys)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple2
Subject: Re: Piraccy via BBSs (was: Re: Apple Awards)
Date: 15 Apr 92 22:35:54 GMT
Reply-To: edw@caligula.cts.com (Ed Watkeys)
Organization: Guerrilla Networking Project
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v4


In article <w9Z9iB1w164w@bluemoon.rn.com> (comp.sys.apple2), flav@bluemoon.rn.com (Jason Jones) writes:
> edw@caligula.cts.com (Ed Watkeys) writes:
> 
> > 
> > In my area, there are about five BBSs which don't steal software (I think
> > "pirating" implies a degree of Romanticism absent from most of the stealing
> > that goes on...), and about twenty that do. Now, I asked my friend what makes
> > a "pirate" board worth calling, and he said, "ZModem, of course!"
> 
>   WHAT?  That is pretty funny!  Most boards that I call for software 
> <pirated or not> have only x,ymodem!  20 boards that have pirated exfers?  
> Come on!  You must not be talking -just apple- bbs's..
> 
He has a Macintosh, but that isn't the point. ZModem was just coming
into vogue when I left the Apple II pirate scene, and at that point, it
was a major 'selling point.' YMODEM is acceptable for piracy, but
XMODEM is almost totally worthless. Morgan not having Y or ZMODEM in
ProLine makes it worthless for piracy.

Yes, *twenty* pirate boards -- I'm at Drexel University right now, and
*everyone* here has a Macintosh, and they steal software left and
right.

> 
> > The fact is that Morgan is right. The "best" pirate BBSs have message section
> > too, but they often revolve around ninth-graders calling eachother names and
> > requests to upload the latest WAREZ. I know, I used to be one of them.
> 
>   Well, I just happen to be a ninth grader, and from what I see, many 
> people my age are the main posters on apple bbs's, and in some cases the 
> only callers.  You also make it sound like we are sitting around, typing 
> posts in all uppercase saying 'Gimme some warez!  I need the following 
> games...'.  Give me a break!  The sysops let us do what we want, and the 
> people who want to post, post, and the ones who want to transfer, 
> transfer.  I really think your statement about ninth graders in 
> exxagerated!
> 

I'm sorry -- you don't have to be a ninth grader to be an infantile
little schmuck who thinks that by stealing software you're setting the
world free from the Evil Software Developers who'd like to make a
living writing programs, but is does help. Don't give me the "Your
[sic] making a judgement about ninth graders -- that's
closed-minded!!!!!" stuff -- I could call up some of the boards I used
to frequent, capture some of the messages and post them here and allow
people to make a judgement on their maturity. I'm also curious about
what gets into adults who call these boards, and even moreso interested
in the adults that run some of these things.

Do you call pirate boards for the software, or do you just like to talk
to the people who steal software? In either case, that kind of board is
totally unacceptable if you want to be on the internet. The internet
does not need people who think that software is there for the stealing,
that if the sysops leave them alone, everything would be k00l...

> > 
> > Any schmuck kid can start a BBS with some stolen software and get a transfer
> > section up. Personally, I don't think that these schmucks would choose ProLin
> > because it is a little too invloved for their needs... They used to just get
> > a copy of GBBS, (V1.3 if I recall...), get the SuperTac external, make all
> > of the menus k-Rad k00l, and put all of the stuff they've stolen on a HD.
> > Of coursde, back then, *the* thing was YMODEM...
> 
>   Yeah... I see so many kids that have all this hardware and software to 
> designate to a bbs.  All they do is go out and spend $2000 on some 
> hardware, and then pay for another line, monthly, just to give other peope 
>   You make it sound like us kids are the ones with the boards set up, and 
> that we are just like drones or something..
> 
It takes a lot less than you imply. When my mother got a Macintosh, the
IIc went to me, and it was essentially mine. A phone line can cost as
little as $15 a month, so I don't think your argument holds much water.
I helped about four different people set up Apple II pirate BBSs. I
don't think many parents think of stealig software as wrong, and are
more likely than one would think to 'help them out' when it comes to
costs....not that parents want to be busted by the FBI or anything...

There's a little slimeball around here who has two lines and is 14
years old. He has the balls to ask for donation to keep his BBS full of
stolen software up! Also, I can run a BBS on my computer (a Mac IIsi)
without it affecting me much by having it run in the background. In
fact, I *was* running a BBS, put I took it down after no one but sleazy
software-criminals called.

I won't even start about handles and how stupid *they* are... I'm sure
you appeciate that, Flav, right?

How about you give me the numbers of a few of the pirate BBSs you're
on? Let's call them up and see what the people talk about -- let's see
what kind of messages you post. Or are you one of those two-faced
people who steal software, and then act like Mr. Ethics when the
situation demands it? I can afford the calls -- I have PC Pursuit (or
do they only accept 9600bps callers?).

> 
> Internet:Flav@bluemoon           | What is it with all these disclaimers?

Ed

--
Ed Watkeys (Drexel U. Comp Sci)  "Moral judgement and condemnation is
edw@caligula.cts.com              the favorite form of revenge for the
edw%caligula@phlpa.pha.pa.us      spiritually limited on those who are
ls.com!phlpa!caligula!edw         less so...." -- Friedrich Nietzsche