HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: s9874194@deimos.ucc.umass.edu (s9874194)
Subject: Re: I'm very disappointed in Chinese
Followup-To: soc.culture.china
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 01:42:00 GMT

In article <95146@bu.edu>, lix@thames.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li) writes...
>In article <1SEP199214572560@phobos.ucc.umass.edu< s9874194@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (s9874194) writes:
>>(deleted)
><We come from the ancient culture. We have been in this culture for years.
><By introducing Chinese culture and customs to our American friends, and
><by telling the people in our homeland the culture and customs here, 
><we can well be the window for the world to see China and China to see
><the world. I believe that would be a very important thing and yet a
><very easy thing to do for everybody.
> 
>Well, I assume the author young, so he takes thing too easy:-( We Chinese
>have tried to learn from western cultures for 130 years, but I don't think
>we have learned well.
> 
>It is important, I agree. But it is by no mean easy. So young people'd
>better to concentrate to learn. Leave the job to be the window for the
>world to see China to others (such as old guys like James:-)
> 
>The problem is, when you keep in mind that you are responsible to show
>the world what you are, you will frequently forget to learn.
>-- 
Hello, Xiaowen. 
I think you missed half of my point. If the window is colorless and 
transparent as it is in most of the cases, people from both side of the
window would be able to see each other and learn from each other. By the
special place we are sitting, --I mean we have more understanding of 
the world than 70 to 80 % of our compatriots inside the country,
it would be much easier for us to introduce the world about China while
to learn more from the world. Please read my last sentence again. What
I said was being the window for the world to see China and CHINA TO SEE
THE WORLD. I do not think that they are contradict to each other.
Learning and teaching can be coodinated at the same time. A
simple example is that most of the Chinese Grads in the US are learning
while teaching. It is one significant way to let the American 
know Chinese.
By the way, I am THIRTY-ONE YEAR OLD. I do hope that people still think
that I amyoung. Too bad hardly find many people say so. So, thanks!
c.q.
From: mimi@sybase.com (Mimi Balcom)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Info whated - travel in china
Date: 2 Sep 92 21:26:40 GMT
Reply-To: mimi@sybase.com (Mimi Balcom)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Sybase, Inc.


Hi, 

	my husband and I are planning a trip to China with our
	almost two year old baby. We like to visit a few cities in 
	china.  On top of our list, there are:

	Beijing, Guangzhou, Shanghai(and cities around Shanghia), Xian.

	We have about two weeks of vacation  and like to spend
	a week in Beijing. We will go into china either from H.K
	or Japan. 

	Does anybody have information on:

	1, How can I buy air tickets from city to city in China?
	   Is there travel restrictions on non-Chinese citizen?

	2. Once I get here, where can I stay? is there any way to
	   book the hotel in advance? and how much it will cost?

	3. Any DOs and DONTs?

	Thank you very much.


	Mimi
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: zliu@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Zhong Liu)
Subject: Re: SCC wins the contest: use of Top 10 most fashionable words in SCC
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 16:28:57 GMT

To be fair, most of netters don't use these fashionable words in s.c.c.
We should do our own statistics in a certain period of time and remind/warn 
those who have history for frequently using such words, first yellow cards, 
then red cards like a soccer game.


Z. Liu

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: mhmann@nyx.cs.du.edu (Me Mann)
Subject: Re: Anaonymous mail(DengXPing@beijing.china.etc)
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 00:43:24 GMT

In article <Btuwn6.91q@news.udel.edu> jianhua@chester.cms.udel.edu writes:
>Can you post an anaonymous message that you can get replies from readers by your anaonymous adress?
>
>Keywords: Question

Precisely. It is not much fun isn't it?  I have to agree with
"DengXPing@beijing.china.etc" though that it is difficult to
know who sent the mail or post but remember that most NNTP
or SMTP servers have logging..so it is not impossible to 
track down  originator.  Try something  criminal and I am sure you will
be behind bars.


Me Han Mann







Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
From: claudius@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: Hello from news reader in China
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 22:26:04 GMT

In article <92Aug31.172148edt.115@orasis.vis.toronto.edu> liuyh@vis.toronto.edu (Yuanhui Liu) writes:

>You can't say that Qing conquered everyone, qing basically inherited
>everything from Ming, plus the Mongolian territories under the
>Manchu-Mongol alliance, and Ming got everything from the Mongolians.  
>Qinghai like its neighboring provinces, is predominately Hui(muslim), 
>only because there are a bunch of different tribes doesn't mean
>that they were not under the Dynasties rule all along.  

But Quinhai (our point of contention) was *not* a Ming property.  In fact, it
wasn't Qing property either in the beginning.  It was in fact a part of the
Hurshut(sp) Khanate during the time of the late Ming Dynasty.  It was taken
over by the Dzungarian Khanate in the late 17th century, but became
independent again when the Dzungarian Khanate weakened early in the 18th
century.  In 1723, it aligned itself with Dzungaria again and attacked China
(Qing).  (Bad idea)  Qing then conquered it in 1724.

Ming had *nothing* to do with it, and therefore I wouldn't say that it is
really a province of China proper.  Ming's western boundaries went only as
far as eastern Gansu.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: yawei@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (~{QG9p~})
Subject: Re: The Chinese Dream for That Small Little Thing: A Vote.
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 03:27:30 GMT

>> In article <BtCHKA.6C3@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> xlli@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (xiao-lin li) writes:
>>>

"Vote" is NOT the most important thing and should never be. The
important thing is the respect for individual's rights. Individuals,
even if they are ethnic, religious or political minorities who don't 
have much chance to win in a voting process, need to have their 
rights respected and protected.

Voting is just one of many ways individuals can get involved in
government, to express their consent to be governed. Tyrants like
CCP frequently use "voting" to give themselves legitimacy. We all
have gone through one or another kind of voting in China, but did
they mean anything? No.

It's bad enough that we have been governed by tyrants all along,
but collectively we Chinese do have a mindset that do not respect
individual rights very much. We all too frequently would expect
an individual to sacrifice him/herself for the common good, and
even more frequently we would set up some social norms and expect
everyone to follow. We emphasize too much on individuals loving
their group, their community, their native province or their
"motherland". Until we are more ready to respect individual rights
and accept individual choices, we are really not ready to govern
outselves.

How sad.


  yawei
From: raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Mao
Date: 27 Aug 92 07:04:28 GMT
Distribution: soc.culture.China.,local
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson

My German colleague would say "facist" whenever Hilter is mentioned.
He would attack Hilter viciously whenever I pull his leg by
being apological for Hilter.

Of course I would not expect the PRC chauvinists here to behave
corrspondingly.
-- 
Just call me `Man'. 
"And why take ye thought for "    --   Matt. 6:28
raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: zhuh@athena.mit.edu (Hui Zhu)
Subject: Re: Shen Tong (grabbed)
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 20:08:06 GMT

In article <Btyp8s.E34@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, xlli@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (xiao-lin li) writes:
|> China is too lawful.
Yes, it has so many regulations and laws.


|> China is too lawless.
Yes, China government never obey that.
Some China people donot want to obey that.
Even worse, some Chinese tuned American (i.e. Shen Tong, etc) want to chanllege it,
protected by his Uncle Sam. :)


|> That is the problem.

It is.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: wid2@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Wheatleigh I Dunham)
Subject: Chinese Association for Science & Technology Eastern USA
Organization: Columbia University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 23:33:06 GMT
From: yangze@acf3.NYU.EDU (Ze Yang, , , )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Sources on Tibet
Date: 30 Aug 92 22:16:00 GMT
Organization: New York University

mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Libucha) writes:

>	I especially welcome contributions from the following netters:

>	Yang Ze
>	Shi Chunde
>	Brian Lin

>	Thanks a lot. I'll be glad to forward a copy of the list to anyone
>who asks for it.

>Mark Libucha (mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu)

Hello, Mr. Libucha, I am so glad that you put my name at 
the first place (I guess that's because my stringent arguments win
your trust:-)), but I am a little busy now, I cann't give 
you much help on this matter. Why don't we play something easier 
for you, your e-mail address remainds me of one speech 
made by Abraham Lincoln(Abraham Lincoln is Ex president of USA-in case
you don't know this :-)), 
if you can give me satisfactary answers about this speech, I might
give you some advise on your project. 
First, there are two versions of the speech:
 "...At what point then shall we expect approch of danger? Shall
we expect some transatlantic millitary giant to step the
ocean and crush us at a blow? Never, all the armies of Europe,
Asia and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the Earth 
and a Bonarpart as a commander, could not by force take a drink
from the OHIO or set a track on the Blue Ridge , in a
trial of a thouscand years. If destruction be our lot, we must be
its author and finisher, as a country of free men, we must
live through all time or die by suicide..."
another version:
 "..Whence shall we expect approch of danger? Shall we assume
some millitary giant to step the ocean and crush us at a blow?
Never, all the armies of Europe, Asia and Africa combined, could
not by force take a drink from the OHIO river, or set a track
on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years, if destruction be
our lot, we must be its author and finisher, as a nation
of free men, we must live for ever, or die by suicide..."

(Please ignore misspelling, that is intentionally left for Mr. Carl, 
I am sure every time he find a misspelling or grammar error, he
is excited.:-) )

First question:
1) Which is the original version (by A.L.).
2) At what year Abraham Lincoln made the speech?
(Please don't post your answers before you have more that two
answers.)
If you cannot give me a satisfactory answer, I would say "
This guy is BULLSHIT, even don't know American History,
why bother to teach him our Chinese matter."
By the way, are you sure you are not related to CIT at all?
I am really concerned about this. (My taiwanese friends' 
club once visited by CIA, CIA offered help to them, I really
cannot afford this).
Ze Yang.
From: yong@minster.york.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Hong Kong perspective 1992
Date: 1 Sep 92 10:58:12 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of York, England

Hong Kong perspective 1992

K. Y. Tang, the Hong Kong government economist, forcasts 9.5% inflation
rate and 5% GNP rate of Hong Kong in 1992.
From: zuo@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Li Zuo)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Accomodation needed in seattle (September start)
Date: 26 Aug 92 21:50:56 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada

Any information will be appreciated regarding accomodation available in Seattle
city. Please E-mail to zuo@ccu.umanitoba.ca. Thanks.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: shiaohan@cs.washington.edu (Xiaohan Qin)
Subject: test
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: seattle
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 23:24:46 GMT


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: li@sicvax.enet.dec.com (Tong-Kang Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: I'm very disappointed in Chinese
Date: 1 Sep 92 16:27:55 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1992Sep1.113239.12546@cs.mu.OZ.AU>, dht@mulga.cs.mu.oz.au (Joyous Dave) writes...
>I'm very disappointed in Chinese people.

40 years of brutal ruling by CCP has brought such bad memory to us. Many 
Chinese have become either cynical or silent towards China, particularly 
Tienanmen incident is still not far away. Who to blame?

>I want to improve China, improve its people's living standard,
>improve its productivity, improve its economy, improve its
>stand in the world.  And I asked people to contribute suggestions
>to how to improve China.

But deep down, I think most Chinese still would like to see China one day 
becomes free, democratic, and wealthy nation. Now China surrounds by Japan, 
Taiwan, S. Korea, HK, Singapore which have been economic powerhouses and 
have hugh cash reserves and technology. These can be very helpful for her 
economic development. 

I think China should stop wasting time on ideology, put it aside and full 
speed on economic development. In the meantime, loose control on her people, 
release all political prisoners and prepare for the political reform, 
multi-party systems, freedom of press, free election etc are just very basic 
things. Self-examine herself why so many people on Taiwan or other Chinese 
regions have tremendous resentments towards China and want to break away 
from her. Beijing should give more spaces to Taiwan or other Chinese regions 
and dont push them to the corner. One day, China becomes free, democratic, 
and wealthy nation, Taiwan or other Chinese regions may be happy to come 
home. Otherwise, breakup of China may be a solution.

All of these require fundamental changes which are far more important than 
just building new highways or export factories.

Tom
From: liqiang@kramden.nyu.edu (Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: What Would Lu Xun Say?
Date: 27 Aug 92 14:51:27 GMT
Organization: New York University

rsanders@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (RRobert M Sanders) writes:


>I have a hypothetical question to end the summer vacation on.  Suppose Lu Xun, 
>one of the few truly Zhong1guo2-tong1 people of this century, and one of even 
>fewer people to articulate it so well in print, were alive today, how do you 
>think he would react to the greencard and Han/Tibet threads?

>Robert Sanders

It's not obvious what Mr. Lu would react. Something similar to the greencard 
and Han/Tibet threads must have existed even in his days.

On the other hand, we are witnessing a time when the Chinese culture, after
at least 150 yrs' terrible disintegrity, is regaining integrity. This is
supposed to be an interestingly long process. Even someone not as sharp as 
Lu Xun can pick on some unpleasant threads at the dawn of this process.

I personally have deep respect for Lu Xun but I suppose I should also be fair
to everybody. I think many people understand China in their own way and I even
think quite a few of them can articulate their way in an OK manner.


Cheers,
Li, Qiang
From: exl0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (Edwin X. Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: What About Tibet? (Re: What about China done to Korea)
Date: 1 Sep 92 16:09:57 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

In article <31AUG199215243618@zeus.tamu.edu>, y0z8374@zeus.tamu.edu (ZHANG, YUEM
IN) writes:

>
>These three countries used to be independent countries. The former USSR took
>over these countries in 1940's by using force. U. S. and other westen countries

>NEVER recognized USSR's claim the sovereignty over these three countries. Three

>countries  have maintained diplomtic relationship with U. S. since 1940's.
>There embassies in U. S. have existed for long time. But in the world no
>country recognizes Tibet as an independent country in the past or now. So Tibet

>case is irrelevent to These three countries.
>
>yz
>

learn some history, you ignorant twit. those three baltic contries
was incoporated to the russian empire centries ago before they
declare independence amid the colapse of the tsarist russian. why
the western countries recognized them? because the bolshvicks took
power subsequently.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:24090 soc.culture.hongkong:10207 soc.culture.japan:7386 soc.culture.taiwan:12472
From: H.Wang@bradford.ac.uk (H WANG)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.japan,soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Zhuang Yong's `new' husband
Date: 27 Aug 92 15:06:46 GMT
Organization: University of Bradford, UK
Originator: 90908648@ccw205

Sorry, but yet another reposting:

Originator: cheung@strider.hw.stratus.com
news group: soc.culture.hongkong


>Subject: Joke ...
>Keywords: Woo La La
>Date: 25 Aug 92 19:56:58 GMT
>Organization: Cheung's Funky Shop, Co.
>Lines: 31
>
>This post is in reply to an article posted on soc.culture.china.
>Since people at soc.culture.hongkong are more fun driven, I have 
>decided to post it here.  (If you don't like jokes, press [n]).
>
>  Article 40189 of soc.culture.china:
>  From: xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu (XiaoFei Wang) wrote:
>
>  (... Zhuang Yong has a NEW husband, blah, blah, blah ...)
>
>  >Thanks Bo. I am always glad to clear up language related confusions on
>  >scc. I am surprised that this time the confusion is caused by the common
>  >word `new'. I will use examples to illustrate. 
>
>  >`I bought a new car' means the CAR is a new one, not a used one. 
>  >( That is, I bought a car from a dealer, not from Eddie ). 
>  >I might have another car before that or I might not. The sentence simply
>  >did not say anything about my driving history. 
>
>  >Similarly the adjective `new' defines `husband'. It means the HUSBAND is
>  >new, i.e. never married. It says nothing about Zhong Yong's marriage
>  >history. 
>
>Oh, I see now.  Interesting.
>
>I have a new girlfriend.  That means she has never dated anyone else.
>I have a new son.  That means my son has never been fathered before.
>I have a new teacher.  That means the old man has never taught before.
>Then what is news?  It is an S (read asS) that has never been seen before!
>
>Copyright Strictly Strictly protected.
>Cheung's Funky Shop, Co.
>
>addition:
>
>Oh, my God!  I must clean up some mess I left off.
>
>No, no, no.  Don't you guys who have a wicked mind out there think wild
>now.  Olds is simply an Oldsmobile made by GM and marketed around the 
>world.  Nothing more nothing less.
>
>Copyright Strictly Strictly protected.
>Cheung's Funky Shop, Co.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: s9874194@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (s9874194)
Subject: Re: Protection bill
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 12:39:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.203430.8595@ra.msstate.edu>, alfred@bambi.tmc.edu (Alfred Wu) writes...
>In article <1992Aug20.184452.5808@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> hl2a@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (Haiyan  Liu) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug19.172012.58274@cc.usu.edu> ma@cc.usu.edu writes:
>>>not much difference between staying in China longer and shorter than 90 days.
>>>(BTW, I just came back from China, and stayed about 40 days, well within the
>>>90 day limit). But there is a big difference between being and not being 
>>>covered by the bill. Nobody wants to be treated differently (maybe unfairly).
>>>I have this (maybe stupid) question. Is it possible now to ask the Congress
>>>to remove the number "90" ?
>>
>>Is it possible to ask the Congress to remove the date 1990 also and change into
>>all Chinese nationals in US or in China or else where in the world included in 
>>the bill since China is not a safe country to stay and anyone who can sneak
>>away from CHina, the congressmen would send some boats or planes to pick them
>>up or they would be persecuted.
> 
>Why don't you ask US Congress to issue some kinds of protection bill 
>to all the people in China (may be in the world)?
VERY VERY GOOD POINT!!!
From: s9874194@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (s9874194)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: American Election
Date: 2 Sep 92 15:23:00 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Hello, every one. Here I am again.  

What impact the presidential election here will have on Sino-US
relationship?

CW says that if CG ticket wins the election (very likely), the new
administration will be much tougher than the Bush's one. At least
Bill Cliton has been saying so.

Do you think so? I do not!

Look at the trend of the US investment in China, you may find the trend.
Boeing, MD etc. just signed huge contracts with China. Big three automakers
just sold more that $130m worth auto and auto parts to China. Those will
help the US economy a lot. Those companies will have a lot to say in
the American politics. Can CG really ignores the voice of those tycoon?
You bet.

Besides that, if you price of the goods in K-Mart or so raises 40%,
US' economy will have more trouble to come out the recession.

So, moral concern has to yield to the economic concern or so called
national interests. Capitol Hill is not going to make too much noise.
After all, it will be their president sitting in the White House (assueme
Bill Cliton wins the election and Democrats will still be the majority
in the Congress.)

Well, let's "wait and see".

c.q.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: rsanders@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (RRobert M Sanders)
Subject: Re: What Would Lu Xun Say?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 16:12:08 GMT

>>fewer people to articulate it so well in print, were alive today, how do you 
>>think he would react to the greencard and Han/Tibet threads?
>
>>Robert Sanders
>
>It's not obvious what Mr. Lu would react. Something similar to the greencard 
>and Han/Tibet threads must have existed even in his days.
>
>On the other hand, we are witnessing a time when the Chinese culture, after
>at least 150 yrs' terrible disintegrity, is regaining integrity. This is
>supposed to be an interestingly long process. Even someone not as sharp as 
>Lu Xun can pick on some unpleasant threads at the dawn of this process.
>
>I personally have deep respect for Lu Xun but I suppose I should also be fair
>to everybody. I think many people understand China in their own way and I even
>think quite a few of them can articulate their way in an OK manner.
>
>
>Cheers,
>Li, Qiang


Before netters get the wrong idea, I am not claiming that only Lu Xun, or a few
people like him are capable of knowing China or articulating it.  What I mean 
is that this ability to know one's self or one's culture requires both the 
opportunity of many varied experiences, and the ability to step outside of 
these experiences to be able to evaluate them critically.  Thus just because 
one is a native of a particular culture does not automatically guarantee that 
he/she will have as much insight into his/her own culture as Lu Xun had into 
his, nor does it guarantee that he/she can put these insights to paper with the
skill which Lu Xun did.

Robert Sanders
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: jianhua@chester.cms.udel.edu (Jianhua Ye)
Subject: Re: Anaonymous mail(DengXPing@beijing.china.etc)
Summary: Interesting
Reply-To: jianhua@chester.cms.udel.edu
Organization: Marine Studies, University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 16:33:06 GMT

Can you post an anaonymous message that you can get replies from readers by your anaonymous adress?

Keywords: Question



Newsgroups: soc.culture.china