HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bq099@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Juan C. Aguirre)
Subject: 386sl compatible w/ windows NT??
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 06:00:58 GMT


Does anyone know if the upcoming Windows NT will run on a 386sl
dispite its 16 bit data access??    Juan
From: phr@soda.berkeley.edu (Paul Rubin)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
Subject: Re: 486DX2-66 systems are available now!
Date: 12 Aug 92 23:03:37
Organization: CSUA/UCB
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: S_JUFFA@iravcl.ira.uka.de's message of 12 Aug 1992 13:09:10 GMT

486dx2/66's have been available here for at least a couple of
weeks.  The cpu chip is about $600.  They are not exactly plentiful,
but you can get them.
From: mslater@mpr.com (Michael Slater)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
Subject: Re: Intel MPEG hardware boards
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 11:01:03 PST
Organization: Microprocessor Report
Reply-To: mslater@mpr.com
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.6v1

In article <1992Aug14.043214.6792@trl.oz.au> (comp.sys.intel), pettitt@titan.trl.OZ.AU (Martin Pettitt) writes:
> Although this isn't directly a processor question it has to do with
> Intel hardware. I'm trying to find out the cost and hardware details of
> MPEG video encoder/decoder boards that I understand Intel produce. Can
> anyone help with further information?
> 
I don't think Intel has any chips or boards yet that implement
MPEG. They do have DVI chips and boards, which implement
Intel's proprietary compression algorithms, which are based on
vector quantization rather than DCT. A new generation DVI chip
(code named V3) has been promised by Intel for this year that
is supposed to implement MPEG as well, but the rumor is that
the new chips are late and won't ship this year.

Michael Slater, Microprocessor Report              mslater@mpr.com
P.O. Box 2438, Sebastopol CA 95473  707/823-4004  fax 707/823-0504
From: davidsen@ariel.crd.GE.COM (william E Davidsen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
Subject: Re: Flash Cards
Date: 19 Aug 92 13:33:02 GMT
Reply-To: davidsen@crd.ge.com (bill davidsen)
Organization: GE Corporate R&D Center, Schenectady NY

In article <1992Aug17.102539.8782@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au>, rda758g@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au (A.J. Kleinert) writes:
| The "new" intel flash cards were one of the features of a local computer
| show here recently ... one of the Sales guys advised me that they
| weren't actually for sale yet, but when they will be around
| the US$800.00 mark for a 20 Mb card.  Isn't this is a little expensive for
| a solid state device?  Were 3.5 inch floppy disks anything like this price
| when they first came out?

  20MB hard drives were more than that when they came out. Are you
looking at this as a checp 20MB hard drive, or memeory which stays
around when you power off, or what? My reading is that this fills the
spot which was occupied by bubble memory, for a relatively large stable
memory /which is not vibration sensitive/ in industrial applications.
They also don't take in air to float the heads, since clean air is often
not availbale in industrial situations.

  Unless the figure for number of writes has improved I don't think I
want to use it for a general purpose hard drive, for sure.

| Any comments on these pricing policies?

  Looks fair to me, we will probably use them for a number of
applications where even the best little hard drives tend to fail.
-- 
bill davidsen, GE Corp. R&D Center; Box 8; Schenectady NY 12345
    I admit that when I was in school I wrote COBOL. But I didn't compile.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: 32616@brahms.udel.edu (Alexander Ti Schwarm)
Subject: Cyrix 486DLC
Organization: University of Delaware
                                           Thanks,
                                           Alexander Schwarm
                                           32616@brahms.udel.edu
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 13:37:46 GMT


Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: jon@alpha.ee.ufl.edu (Jon Mellott)
Subject: Re: Help - Cyrix processors, anyone know for sure?
Organization: EE Dept at UF
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 14:04:38 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.132542.2667@crd.ge.com>, davidsen@ariel.crd.GE.COM (william E Davidsen) writes:
|> In article <16rb6gINNt38@iraul1.ira.uka.de>, S_JUFFA@iravcl.ira.uka.de (|S| Norbert Juffa) writes:
|> 
|> | The cache is definitely the main source of the 486DLC's performance
|> | gain over the 80386. This can be easily deduced from the performance
|> | of Intel's RapidCAD chip which is basically a 486 without the cache
|> | and with a 386 pin out. While the RapidCAD offers roughly twice the
|> | floating point performance of the Intel 387DX, my benchmarks showed
|> | it to be at most 25% faster than the 80386. Typical performance gain
|> | for integer applications is more like 15% though. This definitely
|> 
|>   Whoa! Is this chip OEM only or available to real people. I have a app
|> running on old (1986) 386-16s with 287 math chips. If the rapidCAD chip
|> is a drop in I could probably get an order of magnitude boost in the FP
|> performance.
|> 
|>   Motherboard upgrade is not available for this application.

The RapidCAD part is actually two devices -- one which must go into the 
386 socket and one which must go into the 387 socket. I presume that you 
don't have a 387 socket on your old motherboard so this is probably not 
an option. BTW, I have seen it advertised so I'd assume that it is available 
to real people. BTW, as I understand it, the current 287 rev has the current 
387 core and thus performs much better than the 287 did, so you might see 
a performance gain by moving to current 287s (esp. since I think that 
RapidCAD or 387s are not an option for you). 

The device which goes in the 387 socket from the RapidCAD chipset only has 
a "couple of hundred gates" which are used to ensure that certain signals 
relating to FP exceptions are handled correctly. The FP unit is on board 
the "386" part of the RapidCAD chipset. 

Jon Mellott
High Speed Digital Architecture Laboratory
University of Florida
(jon@alpha.ee.ufl.edu)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: mike@meiko.com (Mike Stok)
Subject: FTPable Press Releases
Organization: Meiko Scientific Corp.
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 18:05:31 GMT

Is there any archive where Intel press releases (to do with scientific
supercomputers & processors) are archived where I would be able to get
at them by anon. ftp or some mail server?

Thanks in advance,

Mike
--
The "usual disclaimers" apply.    | ... many were weak and confused, succumbing
Mike Stok                         | to drink or drugs whenever possible ...
mike@meiko.com                    |
Meiko tel: (617) 890 7676         |                          Hunter S. Thompson
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: lfm@pgroup.com (Larry Meadows)
Subject: Re: i860/i960 swaping?
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 22:50:56 GMT
Organization: The Portland Group, Portland, OR

In article <1992Aug18.165919.1@sscvx1.ssc.gov> schludermann@sscvx1.ssc.gov writes:
>
>   I'm considering buying a computer from hauppauge computer works that has
>the i860 and 486 cpu's. The question is, can the 860 be upgraded to the 960
>at a later date?

Well, I'm not sure I'd call it upgrading, since they are completely different
CPUs. Anyway the answer is absolutely not.  The chips aren't anything alike.
It is possible that Hauppauge might come out with a new motherboard that would
allow you to use the newer i860-XP, but it would be a completely new board
rather than just a chip swap.

No, I don't work for Hauppauge and could be completely wrong.
-- 
Larry Meadows		The Portland Group
lfm@pgroup.com
From: mash@mips.com (John Mashey)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
Subject: Re: Successor to i860XP???
Date: 15 Aug 1992 06:59:51 GMT
Organization: MIPS Computer Systems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: winchester.mips.com

In article <Bt0AKM.4zz@pix.com> hsu@pix.com (Dagwood Splits the Atom) writes:

>All is not lost, though.  The 860's floating point unit is widely rumored
>to have been adapted for the P5 (egads...an x86 with enough guts to do
>some serious DSP!).

At Hot Chips was given an architectural description of the P5's floating
point unit.  It is *possible* that it was derived from the i860s;
certainly it is a mostly-hardware FPU, and possibly some work was brought over
(nothing to this effect was said at the conference).

On the other hand:

The i860 executes RISC-like operations (i.e., no sin. cos, etc), usng
64-bit registers, of which there are certainly more than 8, arranged as
a regular register file.

The P5 does the X86 FP set (including sin, cos, etc) using 80-bit
registers, of which there are 8, arranged in a stack, and whose design
goes to great lengths to parallel-handle an operation that
normally leaves reslt on top of stack together with an FXCHG that
moves the result somewhere else, i.e., to avoid the stack-top
bottleneck.

Perhaps, underneath, some circuits were brought over, but on the surface,
the 2 FPUs sound about *as different as they could be* and still be little-
endian CPUs that do IEEE floating point...
-- 
-john mashey	DISCLAIMER: <generic disclaimer, I speak for me only, etc>
UUCP: 	 mash@mips.com [soon to be mash@sgi.com, but not quite moved yet].
DDD:  	408-524-7015,  or 524-8253
USPS:	(soon) Silicon Graphics, 2011 N. Shoreline Blvd, Mountain View, CA 94043
From: YOUNG@tattoo.cs.widener.edu (Rob Young)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
Subject: Re: 486 / 586(P5) Upgrade
Date: 22 Aug 1992 18:12:14 GMT
Organization: Widener University Department of Computer Science, Chester PA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: tattoo.cs.widener.edu
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <1992Aug20.195630.5993@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> wjc@guardian.austin.ibm.com writes:

> I have been shopping around for 486/EISA system for the past week
> or so (primarily inteneded for OS/2 development work). Some of the 
> vendors I have encountered have claimed that
> their EISA systems will be "upgradeable" to the 586/P5 processor
> sometime next spring. I had thought that the 586 was to be a
> completely different chip architecture, and that compatibility
> with existing motherboards would therefore be unlikely. What is
> the net.opinion on this subject? Will it be possible to upgrade a 486
> system to a 586, or is this just vendor hype? Please post
> responses to the net, as I guarantee that you will have trouble
> reaching me via E-mail.
> 

Well I believe Digital is doing something with EISA.

                  NT enthusiasm spurs details on Alpha PC's
                            Digital Review 7/27/92

The PC servers, claimed to be five times faster than those based on Intel's 
50Mhz 80486 processor, will be configured with either Windows NT, Open VMS or
OSF/1 and will support existing EISA bus peripherals.

...

  "The [Alpha] subsystem will go in the same box as the 450 ST.  You could
upgrade by swapping out the insides of the 450.  It will use the same monitor,
same EISA controllers and peripherals.  But you're not going to throw away a
450 ST," said Jeffrey Schriesheim, group manager for Windows NT systems
software at DEC.
  The system, based on the EV-4 version of the Alpha 21064 processor, will be
priced between $6,000 and $7,000 with 256MB of main memory and five EISA slots,
he said.
  NT will be the primary operating system, said Robert Supnik, DEC's vice
president of advanced VAX/VMS systems engineering.

...

  "We will use the PCI-to-EISA bridge in future systems.  It's just that it
won't be available for a few months," Schriesheim said.  "We're working with
Intel on it.  This time next year PCI will be the right solution."

			Rob


                                                     young@tattoo.cs.widener.edu
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not 
  become a monster.  And when you look long into an abyss, the abyss also looks
     into you."  --Nietzsche             
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: jerryg@ssd.intel.com (Jerry Gaiser)
Subject: Re: Intel's i960 series.
Organization: Supercomputer Systems Division, Intel Corp.
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 16:43:34 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.132031.2538@gandalf.ca> dcarr@gandalf.ca (Dave Carr) writes:
>In <MKAHN.92Aug11144804@hopi.sedona.intel.com> mkahn@hopi.sedona.intel.com (Mitch Kahn) writes:
>
>
>>Only military i960(TM)
>
>> processors have an MMU: The 80960MC (1kbyte I-cache). 
>
>And hand-picked KA chips.  After all, the KA/KB/MC are all the same die
>aren't they Mitch :-)  

Don't bet your design on it..

I don't speak for Intel
-- 
Jerry Gaiser
         Usenet: jerryg@ssd.intel.com
        Fidonet: 1:105/380
           PBBS: n7pwf@n7pwf.or.usa.na
From: payner@netcom.com (Rich Payne)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.palmtops
Subject: Re: Flash Cards
Date: 23 Aug 92 14:10:48 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)


 In article <1992Aug23.050415.14904@uwm.edu> anthony@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Anthony J Stieber) writes:
[...]
>In addition, although the Kittyhawk is very durable for a hard drive
>(100g operating shocks) a solid state device could probably take
>several times that.  Flash EPROM devices take much less power to run,
>have very fast consistant read access times, and are immune to magnetic
>fields.  

Wait a sec...  How can you say both this, and...

[...]
 
>The Microsoft Flash File System is supposed to fix some of the problems
>with writes.  One is that it takes seconds to erase a sector, where a
>sector might be 256KB or more.

This? Flash EPROM sounds interesting, but it still seems to me that
the voltage and power requirements to -write- to it are far above the
power requirements for a small drive. It would not seem that the present
FLASH EPROM would be a replacement for current small HD's. But I think
it still would be usefull. 

Then again, I have not actually seen a spec sheet or anything, so I
am probably misinformed some ways.
 
><-:(= Anthony Stieber	anthony@csd4.csd.uwm.edu   uwm!uwmcsd4!anthony

Rich

payner@netcom.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: wbeebe@bilver.uucp (Bill Beebe)
Subject: Re: Flash Cards
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 18:47:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug17.102539.8782@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> rda758g@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au (A.J. Kleinert) writes:
>The "new" intel flash cards were one of the features of a local computer
>show here recently ... one of the Sales guys advised me that they
>weren't actually for sale yet, but when they will be around
>the US$800.00 mark for a 20 Mb card.  Isn't this is a little expensive for
>a solid state device?  Were 3.5 inch floppy disks anything like this price
>when they first came out?

Well, look at it this way. HP is selling their Kittyhawk 1.8" disk drive
for $250 in OEM quantities (10,000, I think). It's about the size of a
box of matches, and HP is working on a PCMCIA (is that the right acronym?)
version. I think Intel is a little lost on this one. Not only are the sectors
huge, but it's a lot more difficult to use as a disk drive replacement
software-wise.

>I also enquired into the price of the Overdrive processor - about US$800
>also!!  (I commented that I could purchase a brand new 486DX33 motherboard
>for about this price - he commented that this is new wonderful technology  
>that is bound to go down in price once the market settles down, just as
>the 387's did).  Hmmm.

Well, here in Central Florida I have been quoted US$209 (yes, US$209) for
a 25MHz 486SX motherboard w/o memory, and US$350 for the DX version. While
it's not the same speed rating, it should give you some feel for MBs. FWIW,
these MBs are Taiwanese, _NO_ cache, interleaved memory, ISA bus MBs. And
when I say _NO_ cache, that's no _EXTERNAL_ cache. A good interleaved memory
system doesn't need an external cache, as I discovered some time back with
25MHz 386DX processors.

-- 
William H. Beebe, Jr. - wbeebe@bilver.UUCP
                 UUCP - {ucf-cs,peora,uunet}!tarpit!bilver!wbeebe
                      - bilver Public Access Unix, Orlando FL
                      - (407)644-8327  2400/9600  24 hours  8N1
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware
From: clark%asylum.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Charles Clark)
Subject: Re: Help - Cyrix processors, anyone know for sure?
Date: 22 Aug 92 23:54:48 MDT
Followup-To: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware,comp.sys.intel
Summary: Cache invalidation cycles?
Keywords: Intel, P5, Cyrix, 486DLC, i386, Gomez
Organization: University of Utah, CS Dept

In article <1992Aug21.170154.23076@tandon.com> tdbear@tandon.com (Tom Barrett) writes:
>
>The external cache controller doesn't need to be aware of the
>Cyrix internal cache because they did something smart... as
>long as the 386 socket has a real HOLD signal going to it, the
>Cyrix can be programmed to flush it's internal write-through
>cache on each DMA.

All this talk of flushing, I've got to ask...

Why aren't cache line invalidations used?  Obviously, something is missing
or they wouldn't resort to flushing the entire cache...  What is it about
386 based systems that make this impossible?

Thanks,

	--Charles
Newsgroups: comp.sys.intel
From: dcarr@gandalf.ca (Dave Carr)
Subject: Re: Intel's i960 series.
Organization: Gandalf Data Ltd.
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 13:20:31 GMT

In <MKAHN.92Aug11144804@hopi.sedona.intel.com> mkahn@hopi.sedona.intel.com (Mitch Kahn) writes:


>Only military i960(TM)

> processors have an MMU: The 80960MC (1kbyte I-cache). 

And hand-picked KA chips.  After all, the KA/KB/MC are all the same die
aren't they Mitch :-)  
-- 
Dave Carr               | dcarr@gandalf.ca       | It's what you learn, 
Principal Designer      | TEL (613) 723-6500     | after you know it all,
Gandalf Data Limited    | FAX (613) 226-1717     | that counts.
From: lfm@pgroup.com (Larry Meadows)
Subject: Re: Successor to i860XP???
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:24:01 GMT
Organization: The Portland Group, Portland, OR

In article <1992Aug18.123732.16517@nstn.ns.ca> maceache@fox.nstn.ns.ca (Tim Maceachern) writes:
>
>I hope that Intel can fix the 860 FP unit before incorporating it into
>P5.  The paranoia FP test suite has some disparaging things to say about
>the i860s in an Alliant I worked on...
>
>*******************************************************************
>*         Tim MacEachern         * Tim_MacEachern@hawk.nstn.ns.ca *
>*     Software Kinetics Ltd.     *  or maceache@hawk.nstn.ns.ca   *

This isn't really the i860's fault but rather the Alliant's trap
handler.  Like many (most?) newer chips, the i860 doesn't handle IEEE
exceptions in hardware.  Also, the state-save and restore of the i860
is extraordinarly complex, so many implementors choose to punt on the
trap handler.  Also, the overhead of handling denormalized numbers
(which are essential for paranoia) is quite high on the i860, so many
compilers (including Alliant's) choose to set a mode where denorms
flush to zero.  The i860 doesn't have an IEEE-conforming divide
instruction, so an (expensive) IEEE-conforming divide routine is
required.  Finally, the quality of the exponentiation routine is
critical to paranoia, and this is a software-only issue.

Anyway, many compilers provide an ieee-conforming option that will
allow paranoia to pass.

The lack of the divide instruction is probably the most serious defect
in the i860 implementation (but remember, it does division the same way
as the Cray-1).  It would be nice if the chip handled Nan and Inf in
hardware.  Many users don't care about denorms, paranoia & Dr. Kahan
non-withstanding.
-- 
Larry Meadows		The Portland Group
lfm@pgroup.com
From: galanter@nyu.edu (Philip Galanter)
Newsgroups: comp.graphics
Subject: Re: SigGraph, Chicago, and Unions
Date: 19 Aug 92 19:23:22 GMT
Reply-To: galanter@nyu.edu (Philip Galanter)
Organization: New York University

Since I started this thread as a response to other various posts, and  
since it has now run its length I would ask (again) that this discussion  
be taken elsewhere...e-mail or whatever..

My basic point was that unions are, at most, one minority component in the  
economic challanges this country faces.  Over the past years unions have  
lost power and the economy has only eroded further.  It is not at all  
clear that regions of the country where unions are weak have a stronger  
economy than where they are strong...in fact I suspect the reverse is  
true.  As long as the US has the largest exec/worker pay ratio in the  
west, I will find arguments that American workers are overpaid a bit hard  
to take.  

In article <Bt8Gnv.BIA@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> broehl@sunee.uwaterloo.ca  
(Bernie Roehl) writes:
|In article <1992Aug14.015500.25529@cmcl2.nyu.edu> galanter@nyu.edu  
(Philip Galanter) writes:
|>Yes, unions are _sometimes_ corrupt, wasteful, and/or  
counter-productive.
|>So are the government, banks, Fortune 500 companies, and computer  
industry  
|>standards committees.
|
|So you're defending union corruption on the basis that other people are
|corrupt too?
|

Out of context it might seem that way...my point was that unions are held  
by some to a higher moral standard than they are willing to apply to their  
peers...

|I wasn't at SIGGRAPH, but I know of companies that have refused to  
exhibit
|at shows in Chicago because of the union situation there.  They, too,  
used
|the word "extortion".
|

And when politicians and corp. exec's are tough at the bargaining table  
they are admired as being strong leaders...

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Philip Galanter         New York University    phone:    212-998-3041
Research Associate      251 Mercer             fax:      212-995-4120
Academic Computing      New York, NY 10012     internet: galanter@nyu.edu
 
   O f f i c e   o f   A r t s   &   M e d i a   T e c h n o l o g i e s
Newsgroups: comp.graphics
From: thinman@netcom.com (Technically Sweet)
Subject: Re: Shoemake quaternion typos
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 17:43:03 GMT
Organization: International Foundation for Internal Freedom

spworley@netcom.com (Steven) writes:

>I've been implementing a quaternion camera model, and have been making
>some routines for quick conversion of quaternions to matrix to Euler,
>etc. Most of this is very nicely done in the '85 SIGGRAPH paper from
>Shoemake. One thing I've added was a conversion from a "lookat" and
>"up" vector to a quaternion orientation.

GG I has a quaternion viewpointer, GG II has some quaternion thing,
and GG III source (available from princeton.edu:pub/Graphics/GraphicsGems)
has a spherical interpolator.  Maybe these writeups are more useful?
There's code in each article.
-- 

Lance Norskog

Data is not information is not knowledge is not wisdom.
Newsgroups: comp.graphics
From: klein@sunrise.huji.ac.il
Subject: MAC Photoshop equivalent for PC's
Reply-To: klein@sunrise.huji.ac.il ()
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem
Date: 16 Aug 92 10:36:04 GMT

Does anyone know of a software package for PC's that has as much functionality
as the MAC PhotoShop package ? 

I want to be able to scan in color images and manipulate them.

  Thanks,

     David Klein
     KLEIN@SUNRISE.HUJI.AC.IL
From: rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu (Jeff Bytof)
Newsgroups: comp.graphics
Subject: Re: Computer Animation
Date: 21 Aug 1992 17:35:09 GMT
Organization: sio
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: lutherlab.ucsd.edu
Keywords: animation


>        I am looking to get into computer animation and was wondering if anyone
>out there could suggest any film schools, preferably ones on the east coast,
>but any suggestions would be welcome.

     Vancouver Film School
     #400-1168 Hamilton St.
     Vancouver, B.C. Canada V6B 2S2

     (604) 685-5808

----
Jeff Bytof
rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu
u1452@sluggo.sdsc.edu




Newsgroups: comp.graphics