HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tarkkone@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Lauri Tarkkonen)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Best forwards ever?
Date: 12 Sep 92 18:56:48 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In <1992Sep12.161248.26921@phx.mcd.mot.com> gjl@phx.mcd.mot.com (George Lloyd) writes:


>Lauri

>True there was no draft in the 50's.  
>True teams had their own junior teams to develop players.

I believe it was good for hockey. This system of draft is just 
giving the price to the ignorant.

>What I think you are uninformed of are the rules that required all
>"francophones" to pass through Montreal's junior teams.

>If you were born in the province of Quebec (and parts of other provinces
>if I remember right) Montreal had to release you before you could play
>junior hockey for another organization.

I understand that there was an agreement about this. I do not think that
Montreal made this clause with the help of mafia or some other power.

>These rules were in effect for a long time and could be very confusing.
>They not only affected the Montreal but also players like Gordy Howe
>(He signed to play with a junior team, Gulph I think, but was not allowed
>to compete beacues he was from a different geographic location.)

Gordie Howe was born in Floral Saskatchewan (March 31 1928) and if there
was some rule restricting his movement, then there has been some rules
restrictin the Canadiens raiding the talent of other provinces than 
Quebec.

By the way Gordie went to the RAngers training camp at the age of 
fifteen, but came back home. Next fall he was invited to the Red
Wings training camp and he made the team.

>These rules were rarely published and seldom spoken of by the NHL.  I will try
>to dig through my research notes and cite some sources for you.  I think you
>will find it very inteweresting.

Do you really think that all the best players in Canada were francophones
and this gives Montreal the priority to all quality players? Could it not
happen that they just made more of what they got than their opposition?

If I remember it right Rejean Houle was the last drafted player, whom
Montreal got by the francophone rule. After that they have won about
five Stanley Cups. Not bad. 

If the owners would not mess upp the things and lost the services of
Sammy Pollock prematurely and if they would not go trhough a period
of really bad management they might still be as succesfull as earlier,
but now the Canadiens are more or les ordinary team in the NHL. :-(.

- Lauri Tarkkonen
Organization: Freshman, CIT general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:36:49 -0400 
From: Gary James Patalsky <gp2f+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Must be fun being a Bruins fan!!!
	<1992Sep14.200551.3530@bmerh85.bnr.ca>


Ugliest uniforms in hockey?  That title belongs to the Washington Capitals.
Dummest fans in hockey?  Not even close.  The Bruins fans that visit the
Civic        
    Arena know their hockey.  You must have forgot about the N.Y. fans who 
    cheered when Mario Lemieux was intentionally injured by Adam Graves.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: KINGS: Pat Conacher
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date:  8 Sep 1992 11:54 EDT  

In article <2AA78423.2070@news.service.uci.edu>, assist@orion.oac.uci.edu (ASSIST Coordination Site) writes...
> 
>The Kings just made a deal with the NJ Devils for Pat "Bucky" Conacher
>for future considerations.  Does anyone have any background information
>on this player?

I don't know anything about the guy, but it's a good bet he's an
ex-Oiler.

Ron
From: Joel_Murray@mindlink.bc.ca (Joel Murray)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Canucks Fantasy Camp '92
Date: 14 Sep 92 06:35:55 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada

My brother and I were flipping through the channels today when we came upon a
local cable-tv access channel showing the first annual Canucks Fantasy Camp
game.

In a nutshell, recreational hockey players can pay some money and train for one
week with the Canucks.  At the end of the week, there is a game between the
"Whites" and the "Blacks."  Current Canucks (this year, Greg Adams, Geoff
Courtnall, Troy Gamble and others) and past Canucks (Gary Lupul, John Garrett,
and a few others) also play in the game.

The recreational players were just yer average rec league ice hockey players:
a doctor, an actor (Jackson Davies, actually), a fisherman (who played in goal
and played really well!), an architect, a plumber, etc.  All these guys had
big, big grins on their faces throughout the game.  They looked as if they were
really having fun.

I think it would be great to do something like this.  I know that Fantasy Camps
are popular in other cities and in other leagues.  I have a question, though:
does anyone have any idea how much it would cost to train with a pro hockey
team?  By the way, the announcers of the Canucks Fantasy Camp game (Jim Robson
and a local radio personality) mentioned that the money went to charity.
--

       Joel Murray / Vancouver, British Columbia  /  Canada, Eh?
       Joel_Murray@mindlink.bc.ca               CIS:  73200,3117

Ligneous and petrous projectiles can potentially fracture my osseous structure,
but pejorative appellations will forever remain innocuous.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Pens coaching situation
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 21:02:46 GMT

In article <2976@mdavcr.mda.ca> hp@mdavcr.mda.ca (Hossein Parandeh) writes:

>   - Bowman is demanding $375,000 a year, Pens are offering $300,000

If this is true, then Scotty raised his own figure since last month.  At that
time, he was quoted as asking for $350,000.

>   - Eddie Johnson is out of the picture as described in Gary's message

Yes, but the sticking point is not just salary.  The Whalers want the Pens
to take back Pietrangelo, and the Pens are refusing to.

>   - Bowman thinks (so do I) that compared to the salary of other coaches
>     of his ability, achievement and experience he is not asking for too much

I agree with this.

>   - Mario is going to sign a $24,000,000 contract and doesn't like Bowman

The only coaches Mario has ever liked were Bob Berry, EJ & Bob Johnson.  As
for the other players, Tom Barrasso was asked about this when he signed his
contract.  He said that during the regular season, the assistant coaches 
ran practices and coached the team. Bowman went home to Buffalo a lot during
regular season, and he showed no interest in the team until the playoffs.
Barrasso went on to say that was fine with him, he had no problem with it.
But other players, especially the younger players, felt that Bowman should
have made more of an effort to be there in the regular season.

>   - Pens have offered Bowman his old job plus the freedom to take another
>     job with another organization, which is fine with Bowman, however, he
>     wants it in writing. He has had talks with Ottawa and wants to be sure
>     that he can in fact move if he signs with the Pens.

Actually, Bowman had the "free to take another job" clause in his old 
contract, and it has been reported here that Bowman has already signed the
five year deal.  I don't know when the phone interview took place, but the
local media reported this contract signing last week.
From: knox@monster.umd.edu (Garry Knox)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Top 10 Reasons to Watch the Caps This Year
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:18:57 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland

In article <arbogastw.12.0@vaxb.gbus.virginia.edu> arbogastw@vaxb.gbus.virginia.edu (Warren Arbogast) writes:
>
>and the NUMBER ONE REASON to come and see the Caps this year.....
>
> 1. See Dino Ciccarelli's "debut" 
>
>Please add your reasons here:
>

 I thought it was the free pizza we get everytime the Captials score 6 goals?

-garry
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 22:32:01 EDT
From: <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Penguins '92-'93
 <92253.193831RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
 <1992Sep10.191606.27333@philabs.philips.com>

Hey John,
   A lot of nerve you have - do I detect some jealousy here because our
Penguins swept your Bruins not once but TWICE in the Wales Conferences Finals
 the past two years?!!!!  Well, I'm looking forward to it happening again in
 May.  Some things just never change - It's A Burgh Thing!!!!!
               P.S. EVERY TEAM in the Patrick Division is more powerful than
                    the Bruins this year!!!!!!!
                                --Mike Lange fan
From: stanm@comm.mot.com (Stan Macasieb)
Subject: Hawks-Habs Post Mortem
Reply-To: stanm@comm.mot.com
Organization: Motorola
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 18:15:13 GMT


In this morning's _Chicago Tribune_ we find Hawks GM Mike Keenan gushing over
Christian Ruuttu's performance over the weekend in back-to-back preseason
games against the Montreal Canadians in London. 

Also, the planned experiment of taking Jeremy Roenick off the same line
w/ Steve Larmer was executed with apparently little incident. And Jimmy
Waite got a much-needed boost of confidence in his appearances this weekend,
considering he became Ed Belfour's #1 backup after the Dominik Hasek
trade. This according to Hawks coach Darryl Sutter.

Only major bangup is the oft-injured Stephane Matteau, an ankle I think.

And, with a previous poster's description of the shootout finish to the
Molson Cup exhibition, a playoff-type atmosphere was a big part of this
weekend. Maybe we should eliminate overtime periods and go to shootouts.
Like baseball games should be determined by a homerun-hitting contest
after a tie in nine innings! :)

Next up for the Blackhawks: The North Stars at Chicago Stadium. BTW,
tickets for all three exhibition games here and the first three 
regular season home games are already on sale. Call TicketMaster
(312) 559-1212. Other Info (312) 733-5300.

Dat's all for now...

******************************************************************************
--Stan Macasieb (stanm@comm.mot.com)              | It's Savard's turn. Takes
--Motorola, Land Mobile Products Sector           | it up...Fires...And the
--Schaumburg, IL (just another suburb of Chicago) | save by Waite!
--------------------------------------------------|
~~The opinion expressed in this post is not       | Goulet picks it up, coming
~~necessarily those of this corporation.          | to Roy, puts a move, back-
~~Copyright 1992, all rights reserved.            | hand, fires, HE SCOORES!
******************************************************************************

Organization: H&SS Dean's Office, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 10:03:38 -0400 
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: ESPN announcers


John Curcio writes:

>Hey Mom-- what's wrong with JD?  I like to see him doing the MSG
>broadcasts, but then again he works well with Sam Rosen.  He may not be
>as good a Clement, but he's a close second.  It could be worse-- we
>could have to put up with Peter McNab or Eddie Westfall (ugh!).

I get to see MSG broadcasts a few times a year when I visit New York
City.  I find JD to be a pompous know-it-all (maybe he is?) and I don't
like his views on fighting.  But you make an excellent point -- Eddie
Westfall is much worse.  And then there's always Derek Sanderson...:(

>As for Thorne, GREAT!  He is one of the most exciting hockey
>announcers, since he nearly achieves orgasm every time a great play
>occurs.  He blows Pencil-neck Emrick.

This is one of best blunders ever.  Wouldn't this be a simultaneous
orgasm?  Sorry, couldn't resist this one. :)  Seriously, maybe
it's the poet in my heart but I think Mike Emrick is wonderful.  And
as much as I like Bill Clement, I have to rate him right up there with
Tim McGarver for the Diarrhea Mouth of the Year Award.  Didn't know there
was such a thing, huh?

Mom.
From: inthalw@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (Magnus)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: ESPN announcers
Date: 14 Sep 92 18:53:00 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Closed Boxes
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Sep10.145649.1764@cbnewsh.cb.att.com>, seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes...
>In article <Qefal9e00Uh7Q6nKgb@andrew.cmu.edu>, Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 
>Well, I said it last year and got blasted, but I'll say it again. Mike Emrick
>is the best play by play man in the business (not restricted to hockey).

>pete clark - r.s.h FLYERS contact
> 
Well, I don't know about the whole business. But I have to agree that 
Emerick is the best play-by-play man I've ever heard in hockey.

Note: I'm not a Flyers fan either.

Magnus
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: arbogastw@vaxb.gbus.virginia.edu (Warren Arbogast)
Subject: Let Them Eat Pizza
Organization: Darden Center, University of Virginia
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 20:55:48 GMT


Gee, all summer long I thought the biggest drama unfurling with the Caps was 
the stitching of the Miller names on the backs of their sweaters.  Now comes 
the pizza question.  So, would the odds have been better that paying Caps 
fans get "free" pizza this year with Dino or the odds improved now 
that Bobby C. is in town?


Will there even be the "pizza thing" this year.

Hockey in DC, we're drifting from the issues like family values and Murphy 
Brown, but we're having fun and paying top dollar for it!

And, hey, the pizza's "free."

Warren
From: moakler@romulus.rutgers.edu (bam!)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Announcing the Sixth Annual USENET Hockey Draft
Date: 11 Sep 92 18:41:19 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:


>are not likely to be played till they drop, and they are probably the
>two best new Europeans.  Kovalev in the Rangers has Amonte and Gartner
>ahead of him on right wing and a defensive boring coach in Nielson
>who'll likely give Tie Domi more icetime than him.  (Kamensky already

	I'm pretty sure that Kovalev is a left-wing.  Anyway, the
point is moot since I don't think that he will be coming over to play
until January. No matter what side he plays on, I'm having trouble
fitting him into a line on the Rangers lineup. They have too many fwds as
it is, even not counting any new players. Neil will either have to
make a big trade or let some players go (My money is on Kocur and/or
Ogrodnick getting the boot). I think that Kovalev will end up on a
line with Nemchinov, since they played so well together in last year's
preseason, or that Nielson should take Turcotte off the checking line
and put him and a checking winger with Kovalev to form a 3rd scoring
line.


>Gerald

Bill Moakler
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Lindros and Rheaume notes
Date: 15 Sep 92 13:05:52 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T


Eric Lindros will not play Sunday in Quebec. The FLYERS fear a bad
fan reaction and have decided that he will stay in Philly. The morning
guys on the local all-sports radio shows were chuckling over the
possibility that this was being done to hurt ticket sales in Quebec
for that game as a slap in the face to Aubut (knowing the net, I
guess I should explicitly point out that they were probably not serious).

BTW Al Morganti, who writes a column for the Hockey News, is one of the
morning guys...

They showed some clips of Manon Rheaume on our local ABC affiliate,
(one of which was a press conference...I know why Playboy offered her
some money now...Al and the boys were commenting on that as well)
and it's been announced that she will play against Minnesota this
weekend. Go get 'em Manon!

Pete Clark Jr - r.s.h FLYERS contact (and closet Lightning fan...before
Rheaume was around, I have witnesses)

att!hos1cad!seth
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: Cory Houston
Subject: Re: Fickle Edmonton Fans(Was Re: Damphouse)
Organization: bnr.ca
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 19:20:47 GMT


>In article <1992Aug30.012100.29625@access.usask.ca> gerry@skatter.usask.ca
writes:
>
>>By biggest reason for disliking the Oiler franchise(rather than the players
or
>>team) is the fickleness of their fans. It really grinds on me that a city
with
>>so many people can't get 17000 (~7-10% of the *adult* pop.) out to their
>>games. If fans in Edmonton don't want a team that only occasionnally wins a
>>SC but plays well enough to always be in the hunt, well that's fine by me
>>they can just send it East about 4 hours, Saskatoon will show them what fan
>>support means. 
>>
>>Edmontonians have shown their fickleness with the Eskimos and now its coming
>>out with the Oilers. It isn't surprising at all to me that their attendance
>>is down, I expected it to happen once the team became only good rather than
>>great.
>>
>>City of Champions == City of Chumps.
>>
>>Go Habs!!!
>

If this stubble jumper from Toon-town new anything about what was going on in
Edmonton, he would realize that the people are not boycotting the Oilers, but
rather their selfish, egotistical owner Peter Pocklington. He lost a lot of
popularity when he traded away Gretzky (it all started when he traded away Paul
Coffey, but the ignorant fans blamed Coffey), but in the last few years the
problem has compounded by letting other players go because he is too *cheap* to
pay their salaries.Trading Messier for a whiner in Nicholls was the final
straw, and now the Oiler dressing room is starting to sound like the Leafs
(with one exception: they still win!!!)

Let us not talk about the loyalty of the Montreal fans - the only sport this
city of 2+ million occupants   is hockey. Football and baseball are dying
sports there.....


Cory
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: looking for c help for nhl.c
Date: 14 Sep 92 13:26:39 GMT
Organization: UB

At present I have no way to distinguish the games held at neutral
sites from the usual games.  I'm referring to the ones held in 
Cleveland, Hamilton, etc. that are during the regular season.  Much to
my (and now your) dismay, I can't come up with a way of doing this.
Part of the problem is that I can't program for anything.  If anyone
knows c and thinks they have an idea, go ahead and propose it to me in
mail.  Otherwise it's coming out this week without any sign that these
games are being played anywhere other than usual.  If you see Buffalo
at Vancouver, it might be in Hamilton.  Kind of shoddy.  :-P

Thanks again and please bear with me.  (Hey!  I finally get to see my
doctor on Friday!  I can get a diagnosis from a familiar physician and
maybe some medicine to get the swelling down in my hands....the motrin
ran out after a week. )


-- 
Valerie Hammerl               	Underemployed technical writer seeks
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu        job in North America.  Willing to 
v085pwpz@ubvms.bitnet           relocate.  Can begin any time.
SUNY at Buffalo ASCIT Consultant for yet another semester (sigh). 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: mrice@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Michael Rice)
Subject: Re: Red Wings
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 02:49:17 GMT

In article <168626B6E.SGLENN@cmsa.gmr.com> SGLENN@cmsa.gmr.com writes:
>
>
>After my first posting about the Wings Training Camp, a new player
>showed up in camp....John Ogrodnick.  After being released by the Rangers,
>he is looking to catch on with a team and is hoping to earn a spot on the
>team.
>
>Ogrodnick started his career in Detroit, and once held the team record
>for most goals (55).  He was also the last Red Wing to be named to the
>1st Team All-Stars.
>

At training camp Sunday in Flint, Ogrodnick scored 2 goals in the 
scrimmage.  He looked pretty good.  Wouldn't mind seeing him play for
the Wings this year if he'll sign for a reasonable amount...

-- 
Michael Rice (mrice@eecs.umich.edu)
From: tcronin@ocf.berkeley.edu (Tom Cronin)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Really fat goalie?
Date: 10 Sep 1992 21:18:57 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: sandstorm.berkeley.edu

          Has any team ever used a really fat goalie to totally
   eclipse the goal?  (For example, a sumo wrestler lying on his
   side in front of the goal)  He wouldn't even need padding!  Is
   there some rule about goalie girth that would prevent such a thing?
   Just the right solution for a lagging defense!

			    Tom
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: peter@scorpio.ic.cmc.ca (Peter Ellis)
Subject: Re: Best Forwards Ever
Organization: Canadian Microelectronics Corporation
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 18:05:19 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.144424.15966@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> 91287041@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
> ...
>If we are talking about the best players (and not just forwards) there
>are clearly two who stand above the rest.  Orr and Gretzky.  Each of them
>revolutionized the game.  Gordie Howe was just a dirty player who hung
>in for a long long time.

I heard a recent interview with Bobby Orr and, when he was asked "who's
the greatest hockey player you've ever seen?", he answered without hesitation
"Gordie Howe".  Gretzky's statements indicating Howe was/is his idol are
also well known.  Just a dirty player ... come on!  Gordie wasn't above the
odd cheap shot, but his scoring and leadership abilities should still rank
him among the all-time greats in anyone's book.

Peter
Organization: H&SS Dean's Office, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 08:56:35 -0400 
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Pens training camp ?'s


I got a few email messages with some questions about the Pens training
camp, so here goes...

*Who were the coaches?
Lemieux's team: Phil Russell
Errey's team: Barry Smith
Francis' team: Rick Paterson
Jagr's team: Rick Kehoe

*Who were the officials?
Local guys.  I recognized one of them from amateur summer league hockey
games I attended.

*Did they really call penalties?
Very few.  One per game, I think.  Instead of power plays they did
penalty shots.  (There was a lot of holding going on -- holding sticks,
holding players -- really blatant stuff.  Even some of the players were
yelling about it from the bench.)

*Did they play full 60-minute games?
Yes.  They didn't always stop the clock, though.  They stopped it only
when the goalie froze the puck, after a goal, or when someone got hurt.
(Paul Laus took a nasty accidental hit and was down for a while, but he
was back on the ice for the next shift.)  They cleaned the ice (if that's
what you want to call it) only between the 2nd and 3rd periods.  (Hey
Tom, does all this sound familiar? :)

*Did the "big guys" play alot?
Yes.  Just like a "real" game.  Like I said yesterday, it was pretty
competitive.  I've been going to these things for several years and this
by far was the best I've seen.

I think that covers it.

Mom.
From: terry@btree.uucp (Terry Whalen)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Best forwards ever?
Date: 14 Sep 92 17:41:58 GMT
Organization: Brooktree Corporation

In article <RICH.92Sep10115058@quik.clearpoint.com> rich@jasmine.clearpoint.com writes:
>In article <1992Sep10.114146.7568@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
>
>  
>
>   Stan continues: "Conclusion: Over a five-year period no one can match the
>   consistency and arsenal of the 1956-60 Canadiens. Given time, though,
>   Pittsburgh just might."
>
>  
>Please remember the UNFAIR French Canadian rule which brought these players
>to Montreal. Because of this rule, the Canadiens had the most unfair
>advantage in hockey history when it came to drafting players. There is a
>great book on this subject "Don't Remember the Title" that tells of all
>the players they drafted through this rule, and all the players they would
>have had if the rule was still active. It's scary seeing the players in the
>league today who would have been Montreal property. At least the Penguins
>have picked up their arsenal the correct way. They didn't have the deck
>stacked in their favor. 
>
>Rich

AAAHHHHHHH, the good ole days.