From: anderson@allvax.enet.dec.com (Dave Anderson)
Subject: Re: Boskone Art Show (was Re: Hello Confrancisco?)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: 21 DEC 92 12:03:06 EST


(I've been rather busy recently, and am way behind on the news -- so this will
be a combined response to a bunch of postings.)

In article <1992Dec4.153933.26807@u.washington.edu>,
  rcampb@cac.washington.edu (Russ Campbell ) writes:
>show.  I'm given to understand that there were several people from the
>east coast area involved in the process and I find that troubling.  If
>this is supposed to be a west coast world con the last thing I want to see
>is any of the bullshit I've read in the rules I recently got for one of
>the 'great' east coast con art shows.  I was displeased enough with them
>to decide not to show there.  The rules are set up to discourage mail-ins
>and as an artist displaying for the first time at this particular con I'd
>only be allowed one display space (4x4 or 4x3 or something like that).  I
>don't care if I'm guaranteed to make a contact with an editor and get a
>contract out of it there's no way I'll fly across the country and put up
>with that kind of limitations.  It is my sincere hope that no such
>foolishness will be in evidence for Confrancisco's art show.

Since from later postings this is clearly referring to Boskone, I'll start
here.

Boskone does deliberately discourage (but certainly does not prohibit) mail-in
by artists.  I instituted this rule (which is that mail-in is only allowed with
prior permission from the art show) about 10 years ago after one show of about
100 4'x6' panels received *55* boxes of mail-in art.  This was an *incredible*
pain to handle; we had to do something, and restricting mail-in was a much
better idea than dropping the art show entirely.  Since then we've had one to
two dozen boxes of mail-in art each year, which we can handle with a reasonable
amount of effort.  (We're also lucky in that a lot of top artists live within a
reasonable drive of Boskone; between them and a number of artists from other
areas of the country who usually attend Boskone -- or who have someone who does
attend bring and hang their work -- we are able to have a good and varied show
without large amounts of mail-in art.)

We do limit the space that a first-time (at Boskone) artist can have, but the
limit is nowhere near as rigid as you imply.  It was imposed after we had a
number of *very* amateur first-time artists enter the show requesting all the
space they could get; we routinely waive this limit if (for example) someone
sends us slides or photos showing quality work.  (I've made a note to look over
this section of the rules to see if it can be made clearer for next year's
show, since it evidently didn't say to you what we intended it to say.)

Part of the problem here may be a conflict of styles; most of the art shows
which I've encountered have had very little in the way of published rules,
while Boskone tends to the opposite extreme.  We try to publish a comprehensive
set of rules and then adhere to them, so that even someone who's never been
near a Boskone before can tell (before they request space) exactly how the show
will be run.  For artists who are used to other shows, I suppose that this can
seem somewhat intimidating.


In article <1992Dec7.212246.23107@u.washington.edu>,
  rcampb@cac.washington.edu (Russ Campbell ) writes:
>                                                If the show is going to
>discourage mail-in, fine, it's their business, but expecting someone new
>to attend and have that low a limit on display space is rediculous. 
>Traveling from any distance to the show is an expensive proposition for
>beginning artists and to only be able to show a limited amount of their
>work (no artist displaying at a show the 1st time should expect to sell)
>isn't worth the expense.  No editor/publisher is going to get a real idea
>of what someone's body of work can encompass if there's only enough space
>to display a couple pieces.

I mostly agree with you; that's why this limit is waived for any good reason.


In article <1992Dec8.203446.7656@u.washington.edu>,
  rcampb@cac.washington.edu (Russ Campbell ) writes:
>Blessed be all volunteers, for they shall reap the reward of feeling loved
>and belonging by concoms everywhere.  8-)  I could encourage anyone
>running a con art show to establish a corps of such volunteers, ones that
>will work directly and solely on the art show, especially in the case of a
>large show.  Norwescon here has (I think) somewhere in the neighborhood of
>150 displaying artists and the only thing that gets it up and going on
>time is the same corps of returning volunteers year after year who do
>nothing but help out with the art show.  No director can do it alone and
>knowing that so-and-so and whosit and whatshername will be there to help
>every year can be a great relief.  Again, I urge those running shows to
>build a good cadre of troops you can rely on.

*Amen!*


In article <51XoVB4w165w@lunacity.com>,
  mwallis@lunacity.com (Michael Wallis) writes:
>jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann) writes:
>> [...]

>BayCon, being perennially one of the 5-10 largest cons in North America,
>isn't exactly a small con. It has handled sold out shows several times in
>the same manner that 99% of all the cons I've been to do ... Fisrt come
>forst served, with a waitinglist after that. Agreed, if Rick Sternbach
>stuff showed up inexpectedly, we'd try to arrange space for it, but
>"talent" asside, this problem has been handled many times and is SOP for
>any experienced con or art show staff. What's the problem?

>>        For many Art Shows, the show has to impose some selection
>> criteria.

>THAT's where we differ, Jim. I can see art shows imposing SPACE
>limitations, but I don't agree with imposing "selection criteria".  I
>suspect it's a fundimental issue, and one we're not likely to change the
>others mind on.

How does any show (except for those few, if any, which have so much space that
they can give some to everyone who asks) avoid imposing selection criteria? 
One can choose to accept requests in order of arrival, but that *is* a
selection criterion!  (And even that isn't quite a simple as it seems: you have
to define what you mean by 'arrives'.  Is it the first time you hear of a
request by any means, when a written request arrives, when payment arrives,
when both a written request and payment have arrived, etc., etc.)  We prefer to
do a little more pre-con work to produce (what we think is) a 'better-balanced'
show.


In article <51yoVB5w165w@lunacity.com>,
  mwallis@lunacity.com (Michael Wallis) writes:

>That's the crux of the problem. Do you restrict the art show to JUST those
>who attend. I don't think you should. Appearently you and Jim think
>otherwise.

You seem to think that 'discouraging mail-in art' means refusing to accept any
art from artists who do not attend the convention.  Even ignoring the fact that
'discouraging' is not the same as 'prohibiting', this is just not true.  As
long as the artist is willing, Boskone (and many other shows) will let someone
else bring and hang an artist's work.  In many cases this is very little extra
work for the artist, and saves quite a bit of effort on the part of the art
show staff.

>As mentioned in a post to Jim ... the criteria is "first come, first
>served" with regard to booking panels in the show.

I don't agree that this is the most (let alone only) reasonable criterion for
allocating space in an art show, though it's certainly one that can be used. 
It's up to the management of each show to decide what its goals are and to set
up criteria that help to achieve those goals.

In my opinion, there are three major purposes for an SF convention art show;
how important each is to a particular show will depend on what type of show one
wishes to run and who the convention attendees are, and will affect both which
artists are likely to want space in the show and, to some extent, who will
attend the convention.  The two most obvious purposes are to present an
interesting display and to allow artists to sell their work.  The third is to
make available the art that the attendees want to buy (and are able to afford). 

Boskone has chosen to emphasize professional art, and so makes a deliberate
effort to fill a substantial portion of the show with professional-quality
artists rather than following a strict first-come-first-served rule.  This is
certainly not appropriate for every art show, and shouldn't be taken to
extremes; we also aim for a strong representation of other regional artists. 
For as long as I've been involved in running Boskone art shows (about the past
dozen years) around 40% of the artists entered in the show have called
themselves amateurs, and despite our higher-than-most-shows sales of big-ticket
pieces something like 95% of the pieces sold go for well under $100.


In article <gycRVB2w165w@lunacity.com>,
  mwallis@lunacity.com (Michael Wallis) writes:

>[...]

>                        This all relates to Jim's posted contention that
>Art Shows don't have enough staff to handle mail-in art work and
>therefore committees, espeically worldcons, should discourage it. I tried
>to point out that this was not the case in my experience, and that such
>arbitrary imposition was not required if things were organized better.

Time for a reality check!  What Jim actually said was that large amounts of
mail-in art can be a major strain on an art show staff, and that it is
reasonable to discourage (which means 'limit', not 'prohibit') mail-in so as to
have more resources available for other tasks.  In any situation where limited
resources are available, one must decide how to allocate those resources so as
to achieve the 'best' result.  This requires first deciding what the 'best'
result is, and this decision will be different for different shows.

>[...]

>If Boskone wants to run things their way, that's fine. When Boskone starts
>telling everone that they have to change because there's a problem, when
>in fact there is not, THEN I have a problem.

If 'Boskone' were telling everyone how to run their art shows (or anything
else, for that matter), there *would* be a problem.  What I've seen in this
sequence of postings is the opposite: Jim (speaking about Boskone) has said
that we do certain things for specified reasons, and some other people have
claimed that Boskone is in the wrong for not doing things the way they like.


In article <1992Dec14.165528.24645@u.washington.edu>,
  rcampb@cac.washington.edu (Russ Campbell ) writes:
>                               One point to note is that MOST of the
>artists whose work you ever see displayed do not make a profit at the
>shows they attend due to the expense of attending a show.

True.  Note, however, that the people running the show (at least at Boskone,
where the art show is designed to break even financially) get nothing but a lot
of work (and maybe a bunch of hassles) and the ability to miss a lot of the
rest of the convention.  Not whining -- we do this of our own free will, Ghod
help us -- but simple truth.


	Dave (anderson@allvax.enet.dec.com)

Me? Speak for DEC? HA!