HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: engfish@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (LYDIA FISH)
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
Subject: Jobs
Date: 8 Jan 93 02:44:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Forwarded from VWAR-L@UBVM

**********************************************************************

With the help of VWarrior David Valley, I have created a new list FEDJOBS
for distribution of Federal job opening announcements of particular interest
to veterans.  Job listings are uploaded to LISTSERV@DARTCMS1 by David
weekly.  You may get a copy of the list of available files by sending
mail to LISTSERV@DARTCMS1 with the command INDEX FEDJOBS.  You don't need
to be a subscriber to FEDJOBS to request an openings list.   However,
you may subscribe to FEDJOBS by sending mail to LISTSERV@DARTCMS1 containing
the command SUB FEDJOBS "your name".  The mailing list is moderated, so the
noise level should be low.  It will contain postings of individual openings
not included in the BB uploads and other relevant mailings.  The postings
will be archived, and you need not subscribe to obtain a copy of the archive
files.   To post to the list, mail your item to FEDJOBS@DARTCMS1.

For those on the internet, the files are also available by anonymous FTP
from DARTCMS1.DARTMOUTH.EDU in directory FEDJOBS.

Putting job posting info on a dedicated list should move those announcements
off of the general VWAR-L list and give better service both to employed
VWAR-L subscribers and veterans needing a job.  Feel free to tell others
about FEDJOBS.

   David Avery #26
   david@dartcms1.dartmouth.edu
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Call for an end to the flame-war
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 22:17:16 GMT

In article <1993Jan10.102100.12914@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux,
just drieux) writes:
>ps: yes David, we ARE out to get you....

I am tempted to ask, "Why?", but I suspect I already know the reason.

In any case, I will cease posting replies to insults and slander against
me, misquotations of my statements, and misrepresentations of my opinions,
as soon as others stop posting the insults, slander, misquotations, and
misrepresentations.  This flame-war is quite pointless, and has rendered
alt.war.vietnam useless for whatever purpose it was originally intended to
serve.
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Re: ignorance
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:18:09 GMT


In article <C0FwEL.89L@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu
(Larry Jewell) writes:
>In article <C0AxH4.4y6@cs.uiuc.edu> drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:
>>In article 702 of alt.war.vietnam jmjones@sdf.lonestar.org (Jon Mahler)
>>writes:
>>>hey, right now I'm so pissed the most civil thing that I can find to say
>>>to you is FUCK YOU
>
>>Then the appropriate thing to do is not to post at all.
>
>Quite right, "Shut up and sit down!"
>
>Larry J

Are you accusing me of some kind of censorship, Larry?

There are very good reasons not to direct pure obscenities and outright
condemnations at other participants in a USENET discussion.  Some of us
have better things to do than take part in an on-line shouting match.
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Re: ignorance
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 01:12:04 GMT


In article <1ihu8nINNok4@gaia.ucs.orst.edu> Monte Olsen
<olsenm@ucs.orst.edu> writes:
>Judging by the previous post, it's fairly obvious to me that the mindless
>appelation should fall on your shoulders, not Drieux's. 

If my postings are "mindless", why don't you show me some factual or
logical errors or some other kind of "mindlessness" in them to make your
point?

>Isn't it interesting that each time he asks you to think beyond the
>boundaries you seem to have established for your own, narrow, little mind,
>you take umbrage.

I "take umbrage" at drieux's cowardly, unsubstantiated, childish
accusations, such as this one:

	ps: not that I would EVER suggest that there are Historical
	Revisionists in our midst.

which he doesn't even take the trouble to back up.

Now if I were to post an equally cowardly and puerile insult, such as:

	Not that I would EVER suggest that there are Killers of Vietnamese
	Babies in our midst.

as a hateful indirect reference to the VN Vets who read this newsgroup,
would you "take umbrage" at that?  (I am only putting this forth as an
example, and do *not* mean it to be taken seriously at all.) 

I also "take umbrage" at people who hurl insults ("narrow, little mind"),
as you have just done.

On top of that, I pointed out serious, obvious logical errors in drieux's
posting (they are usually riddled with them).  Do you have a problem with
this?  Do you think it's reasonable to silently accept a statement by
drieux which is obviously wrong?

>Why don't you grow up, mature a little or shut up.
>
>Monte

"Grow up" and "mature a little"?  Why don't you point out what is so
immature about my posting?  Are you willing to say the same to people like
drieux who preface their postings with infantile idiocies such as:

	Ok Happy Kampfers....

As for "shut up", that sounds to me like outright censorship.
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu (Larry Jewell)
Subject: Re: ignorance
Organization: Purdue University
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:59:08 GMT

In article <C0AxH4.4y6@cs.uiuc.edu> drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:

>In article 702 of alt.war.vietnam jmjones@sdf.lonestar.org (Jon Mahler)
>writes:
>>[I write:]
>>> The POW/MIA situation is overpublicized

>> hey, right now I'm so pissed the most civil thing that I can find to say
>> to you is FUCK YOU

>Then the appropriate thing to do is not to post at all.


Quite right, "Shut up and sit down!"

Larry J

-- 
#L.W. Jewell Moderator at the Veterans Information Site (veteran@cc.purdue.edu)#
#& WWII-L Listowner: "Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange,#
#sudden and wholly unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all   #
#phases of life." "Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41  #
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Re: helpful clue for david
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 20:06:01 GMT


In article <1993Jan11.100657.15324@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux,
just drieux) writes:
>look honey
>[...]
>I will NOT stop defending freedom
>[...]
>
>ciao
>drieux

Umm, sweety, which "freedom" is this?  That of all the political
"detainees" of Uncle Diem?  That of the South Vietnamese students tortured
and killed during Operation Phoenix?  The freedom of GVN officials to
siphon off USAID?
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Subject: helpful clue for david
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 10:06:57 GMT


look honey, I love the email,
but just as a minor point, 
if I will NOT stop defending freedom
merely because the Secret Police are
after me, and have detained and tortured
members of the team....

do you think a little harrassing email
will hit in like an air strike?

ciao
drieux

round down range....


-- 
MajorModernDayProblems: 

"Lets Get Tactical, I want to Get Tactical...."
		Olivia Newton PanzerGruppen
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Backing up notions
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 04:22:36 GMT


This is what really truly pisses me off about drieux's trash:

In article <1993Jan9.215834.9930@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux,
just drieux) writes:
>David Kohr has presented it, knowing as he does, the True Interpretation
>of the Correct Party Line, being a Valiant member of the Van Guard Party
>[...]
>he says that I do not back up my notions .....
>
>ciao
>drieux

I put forth one or two interpretations of the war with which drieux does
not agree, and I am pinned as a Communist agent.  Perhaps to avoid the
rebuttal which would follow should he attempt to buttress this absurdity
with supporting evidence, he merely repeats it _ad nauseam_ without the
slightest effort to "back up his notions".

drieux is acting like a reactionary McCarthy-ist fabricator of the highest
degree.  (And *this* claim is substantiated by the excerpt above, and the
utter lack of evidence to back it.)
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Re: ignorance
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 00:52:17 GMT


In article <C0HEou.GDu@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu
(Larry Jewell) writes:
>In article <C0G2u9.9ou@cs.uiuc.edu> drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:
> > Are you accusing me of some kind of censorship, Larry?
>
> Certainly not!  Just because you want to dictate what should and should
> not be discussed concerning the MIA/POW issue and you wish to limit the
> amount of coverage given to the issue doesn't make me thing you wish to
> censor anyone.

I take that as a sarcastic "yes".

Now when have I dictated "what should and should not be discussed
concerning the MIA/POW issue"?  Show me the posting, don't make some kind
of vague bullshit accusation.

As for saying I think the MIA/POW issue gets more attention in the press
than it deserves (compared to other things going on in the world), that's
far from being censorship.  You had better have a look at a dictionary.

> The original poster of "ignorance" expressed a lot of honest anger, not
> directed at you specifically, but at the people who follow the "party
> line" and want to just forget about the men left behind.

This is simply wrong.  Here is what Jon Mahler wrote:

> Article: 702 of alt.war.vietnam
> Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
> From: jmjones@sdf.lonestar.org (Jon Mahler)
> Subject: ignorance
> Message-ID: <BznJ9w.IGD@sdf.lonestar.org>
> Organization: sdf full-shell Public Access Unix - Dallas, TX - 214/436-3281
> Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 08:22:42 GMT
> Lines: 15
> 
> [...]
> hey, right now I'm so pissed the most civil thing that I can find to say to
> you is FUCK YOU and as larry said I hope that the same courtesy that you
> are    extending to the POW/MIAs in Vietnam is given to you by St. Peter at
> the Pearly Gates.
> [...]

This is very clearly directed specifically *at me*, not at anybody else.

> You may profess to a concern for those men, but you are urging that less
> the the maximum effort be made to try and get them back.

What is "the maximum effort"?  If there are very good reasons to believe
that there are no live American MIA/POW's left in Vietnam (as I have
pointed out many times in the past), why should a "maximal effort" be
expended to try to retrieve them?

> What I don't understand is why you are even reading this group?

Because it has in the past contained useful information, despite the
flame-wars.

> Got a little Rambo-complex?
>
> Larry J

What are you trying to say?
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Subject: Looking for old friends
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 10:17:13 GMT


looking for folks who were on 'the ward' up
at tripler army hospital in the summer of '67.

For Laughs and Grins guys, if you are out there,
my son wound up being born there....

ciao
drieux

ps: still coming home....



-- 
MajorModernDayProblems: 

"Lets Get Tactical, I want to Get Tactical...."
		Olivia Newton PanzerGruppen
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam,talk.politics.misc
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Subject: Technical Correction
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 22:06:55 GMT

Monte Olsen <olsenm@ucs.orst.edu> writes:
] In article <C0IGo5.C15@cs.uiuc.edu> David Kohr, drk@cs.uiuc.edu writes:
] >
] >	Ok Happy Kampfers....
] >
] >As for "shut up", that sounds to me like outright censorship.
] 
] BTW, I was called a baby killer before. Your use of the term here is cute
] but it doesn't anger me anymore. By calling someone's words cowardly and
] puerile, you are, in my opinion, calling them the same thing. Drieux, to
] the best of my knowledge, has never responded in kind to you.

Point of Correction here:

When David Went off on his 'anti communist ad hominien' attack
of one of the vietnamese brothers here who was expressing his
personal sentiment that the current Communist Regime in Vietnam
go the way of Communist Regimes in other Main Line Communist Countries...

I did point out that David was jumping in bed with the
traditional main line party followers.... and presented
him with the classic 'quid pro quo' that IF he wishes
to use that type of trendoid of the left ad hominien
attack, that I would take the liberty of calling him
on it, and calling him what he was....

So Yes, I have Called him a WimpLiberalStoogeOfHisKremlinMasters....

which if you will recall, lead to the major confusion,
given as the Kremlin is now in the hands of the CapitalistRoaders....

Which means.....


HUM.... I think I can see why David is getting into the loop
of circular logic....


ciao
drieux

ps: How Many times do I have to tell you, the term is:

	WarMongerBabyKiller[tm]!!!!

Unless you are using an X windowed distributed solution
then it is:

	XWarMongerBabyKiller[tm]

PLEASE!!!!!!!

some discipline in the ranks....


ObHappiness: hearing that one of one's 'contacts' made it out
of afghanistan alive! And did wind up marrying the cute guy in
Amsterdam after all.... { but who wants to talk about women in combat.}


-- 
MajorModernDayProblems: "Olivia Newton-John is the grand-daughter 
of Nobel Prize-winning physicist Sir Edmund Newton-John." --Frank

Clear Proof Of Genetic Superiority, eh No????
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Re: Do you feel persecuted
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 22:05:18 GMT


In article <1993Jan10.102100.12914@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux,
just drieux) writes:
> pps: But what I really Want to be able to do is grow up and be a big real
> HeMan College Grad Student...

Flattery will get you nowhere :-) .

Nor will mockery.

> and point out that People who hate communism are Bad People...

Of course, drieux knows that it is a bald-faced lie that I ever said any
such thing, but he cannot let truth be an obstacle as he proceeds on his
mission of character assassination.

> and that by attacking them rather than what they say it is not an Ad
> hominien....

One might be tempted to ask how saying "Take Kim's self-admitted biases
into account when you interpret what he says" constitutes an "attack"
against Kim, but apparently not drieux.  And it is also apparent that
drieux has still not consulted a dictionary to find out what _ad hominem_
actually means.
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Call for an end to the flame-war
Date: 11 Jan 93 08:28:53 GMT
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper

drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:

] In article <1993Jan10.102100.12914@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux,
] just drieux) writes:
] >ps: yes David, we ARE out to get you....
] 
] I am tempted to ask, "Why?", but I suspect I already know the reason.


All you have to do is apologize for trying to play
the trendy game of "well he's anti_communist, hence
what he has to say is clearly suspect."

Honey, when you have been detained by the secrect police
for being pro_democracy, and consider a 'red', you might
understand a little why that sort of Ad Homnien attack
offends me....

Also when you learn to be a little more 'cultrually
sensitive' to my family you may also find that I will
be less likely to take you at strictly comic value.

You keep talking about infantile, and I think
you mean my dad: CIB, bronze & silver star, Italy '44; WPPA '48.

I'm the Naive one, USN, CV-67, RAF Brawdy and other spots.

ciao
drieux

ps: sub_humour in all of this, you seem to have not noticed
in the 'cross_posts' that I took on a VVet's position
that women in combat was not an option... But I guess that
sort of 'cross post in' was not the sort that worries you
as you could NOT find a way to presume it was a direct
attack on you.

SubNote: I will, from now on, understand that when you say
'a great many' that you are using traditional Boatswain'smate
Mathmatics: " one, two, another one...."


-- 
MajorModernDayProblems: "Olivia Newton-John is the grand-daughter 
of Nobel Prize-winning physicist Sir Edmund Newton-John." --Frank

Clear Proof Of Genetic Superiority, eh No????
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Subject: Re: Call for an end to the flame-war
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 10:19:26 GMT


while we are down this way again:
do you understand the notion of 'email harrasment'
or is that beyond your understanding of netequette?

ciao
drieux


-- 
MajorModernDayProblems: 
Just because you are a homicidal maniac
doesn't mean you don't have a sense of humor.
		- Barry Sadler
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: jarthur@bnr.ca (John Thompson)
Subject: Re: More charges of Historical Revisionism by drieux
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 02:33:22 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Richardson, Tx.

In article <C0M3z2.9yx@cs.uiuc.edu> drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:

>                   "One either has none or not enough."

Having had enough, I elect to have none.  Another asshole who attempts to
dominate a newsgroup added to the kill files (mail and news)!  Sorry I won't
see the reply which is sure to be full of whines.

John Thompson
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Subject: And so what is your point/
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 22:14:23 GMT

drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:
] In article <1iki4uINNfd3@gaia.ucs.orst.edu> Monte Olsen
] <olsenm@ucs.orst.edu> writes:
] 
] >Drieux, to the best of my knowledge, has never responded in kind to you.
] 
] Your memory has failed you.  This is a typical drieuxism, from a thread a
] while ago:
] 
] 	You are NOT upset that I call You a
] 	LimpWristedPinkoStoogeOfTheInternationalCommunistConspiracy


So?

Besides consistently maintianing the party line,
what else have you added into the discussion....

and it is a PART of Maintaining that Party Line,
BLINDLY that is MORALLY OFFENSIVE far beyond a
mere :

	Fuck You

can ever be.

To You, as you have presented it, POW/MIA are
mere WarMongerBabyKillers[tm] who should just
be forgotten about....

How about if We asked you to take a hike over to
your pet favorite progressive republic and make
a lifestyle choice?????

That still would NOT amount to the same level of
INSULTING BEHAVIOR! 

Maybe you come from a dysfunctional family and therefore
can NOT comprehend the nature of what it is like to
lose people who are close to you.....

But try to get to the small understanding that a team
is like a well working family, and losing one of them
is a moment of grief....

Hearing PinHeads rant on as you have about family is
the moral equivolent of saying:

	"So why worry about your mother,
	after they arrest her for prostitution
	she will no longer be a mere street walker."

But that also presumes that you have some respect for
your mother, a point also not clearly in evidence.

Since we are so concerned about evidence and all....


ciao
drieux


-- 
MajorModernDayProblems: "Olivia Newton-John is the grand-daughter 
of Nobel Prize-winning physicist Sir Edmund Newton-John." --Frank

Clear Proof Of Genetic Superiority, eh No????
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam,talk.politics.misc
From: drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux)
Subject: AntiGerman RACISM!!!!
Organization: Castle WetWare Philosopher and Sniper
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 10:12:00 GMT

drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr) writes:
] 
] "Grow up" and "mature a little"?  Why don't you point out what is so
] immature about my posting?  Are you willing to say the same to people like
] drieux who preface their postings with infantile idiocies such as:
] 
] 	Ok Happy Kampfers....
] 
] As for "shut up", that sounds to me like outright censorship.


Do I detect the Ugly Rearing Head of the RASCIST
Coming up here?????

Can you not see the connection between the
german word 'kampf' and a play on an
american expression?

But I guess when one has no respect for cultural
diversity, it is hard to accept that sometimes
WarMongerBabyKillers[tm] may be real people
with a real sense of humour.


ciao
drieux


-- 

This is Not a .sigfile addendum to the Post.
You are just reading beyond the edge.

Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
From: drk@cs.uiuc.edu (David Kohr)
Subject: Re: helpful clue for david
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Comp Sci, Urbana, IL
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:58:20 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.100657.15324@wetware.com> drieux@wetware.com (drieux,
just drieux) writes:
>look honey, I love the email, but just as a minor point
>[...]
>do you think a little harrassing email will hit in like an air strike?

Well sweety if you're charging me with "harassment" why don't you post the
"harassment" to let us judge?

Or might that give away your little game?
-- 
Dave Kohr     CS Graduate Student     Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Work: 3244 DCL, (217)333-6561  Home: (217)359-9350  E-mail: drk@cs.uiuc.edu
                   "One either has none or not enough."
From: engfish@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (LYDIA FISH)
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam
Subject: bitnet access
Date: 8 Jan 93 02:38:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Does anyone out there know if it is possible to post to this newsgroup via
bitnet?  The connection at the Peoples' Republik of Berkeley seems to have
been terminated.

Lydia Fish (fishlm@snybufva)
Listowner vwar-l 
Newsgroups: alt.war.vietnam