HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lallo@stsci.edu (Matthew D. Lallo,622,4577)
Subject: (NO SPOILER) Re: F1 standings after 10 
Reply-To: lallo@stsci.edu
Organization: Space Telescope Science Institute, Baltimore MD
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 14:52:14 GMT

In article 114808JFS10@psuvm.psu.edu, Jonathan Swaby <JFS10@psuvm.psu.edu> () writes:

> Here are the standing in F1 after 10 races. One thing I would like
> to make a comment on is Frank Williams attidude about Patreses incident.
> Williams did not seem upset when Nigel got over anxious in Canada.
> Patrese I am sure was trying to impress other teams with his skills and
> score well for his current team. He knows he is on the way out, but
> he is still trying to do well.
> 
> Jonathan Swaby


I for one agree and am REALLY curious if anyone else out there thinks that
Frank Williams has been peeing all over Riccardo for the whole season?
Does anyone know what is going on that I am missing? Even when Riccardo 
finishes second behind Mansell (as he has done many times this season) Frank
can barely muster a decent thing to say about him. And Frank's reaction at
Hockenheim really took the cake. I mean his team has already effectively if
not actually clinched the constructors championship so to make a few points
out to be the most precious things he could imagine, when a gamble was made 
for more is ridiculous and in my opinion just makes Frank look really shitty
as a person. Patrese is a decent, experienced driver that can more than get 
the job done at Williams. I'll be sorry to see him leave Williams but happy 
to see him with a new ride where he might get a mere hint of respect.

Forza Riccardo!

Matt
From: ab@crosfield.co.uk (Andrew Bradley)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Boo Boo Senna (German GP minor spoiler)
Date: 30 Jul 92 09:47:17 GMT
Organization: Crosfield Electronics, Hemel Hempstead, United Kingdom.

In article <honson-270792151406@dido.ccs.yorku.ca> honson@orion.yorku.ca (Honson Kan) writes:
>
>I think that he is talking about when Mansell tried to pass Senna and
>nearly
>crashed the car.  After Mansell came out from the pit,  he was behind
>Senna.
>He then was trying to pass Senna.  Senna fought him back.  He was all over
>Senna.  He nearly crashed.  After that,  Senna just let him through.  Maybe
>Senna didn't want to lose such a "good friend" :-)
>
>Honson Kan


If you replay the incident where Mansell's lost the corner you will see that
Senna was completely on his limit. The backend ran very very wide with
Senna struggling to hold it. I think Mansell thought that Senna was going
to spin a 180 and hit him and thats why Mansell left it too late.

Senna waved Mansell by because he knew he could not hold Mansell back
without damaging his tyres and needing to pit for a new set. Thus
losing second as well.

Regards Andrew
From: leres@ace.ee.lbl.gov (Craig Leres)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: WC Mfg's Points & Talladega Controversy
Date: 28 Jul 92 05:48:47 GMT
Reply-To: leres@ee.lbl.gov (ucbvax!leres for uucp weenies)
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.112.6

Terry Matula writes:
> About Sunday's Talladega race...(spoilers ahead)

> I just saw a local news report showing that Sterling Marlin and his
> crew chief Mike Beam were very angry about Ricky Rudd's drafting of
> Ernie Irvan at the end of the race.  Their contention was that Rudd should
> have moved aside and let Marlin by to challenge for the win (Rudd was
> a lap down to the leaders).  A quick sound bite from Rudd was "<big grin>,
> No comment."  

Consider that Rudd and Elliott were on the same lap; by letting Marlin
by, Rudd would have made it easlier for Bill to take a shot at him.

>                                                       Rusty Wallace was the
> leader but almost out of fuel.  Mark Martin was second.  Dale Earnhardt was
> a lap down between Wallace and Martin.  Rusty shut his engine off and 
> Earnhardt pushed his around a couple of laps.  On the last lap Rusty fired
> up his engine drove it powered across the finish line.

According to the rules, you must run the final lap under your own
power. Getting pushed up to the white flag is legal.

>                                                         Rusty later admitted
> that he would have probably run out of gas had it not been for Earnhardt's
> aid.  I would have been pretty pissed if I was in Mark Martin's shoes.

Actually, I thought Dale was being a sport by helping Rusty out. I'm
pretty sure the race finished under the yellow flag; what I can't
remember is how Dale could be laps down and be allowed to push Rusty.
Seems like he would have supposed to be in line somewhere else during
the caution laps.

		Craig
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: GR743@uacsc2.albany.edu (Greg Rickes)
Subject: Re: Magazines/papers for IndyCar
Organization: University at Albany, Albany NY 12222
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 11:34:59 EDT

Though covering more than just Indy, OnTrack devotes
quite afew pages to Indy car events and developments.
A growing number of national bookstores like Walden
and B.Dalton seem to carry this now. It is published
every two weeks, a little slower than NSSN, but I
think it has al little more depth and background.
 
Subscritpion was something like $40/yr, I think.
email to me if yoy want address or other info.
From: wilson@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (David Wilson)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1 93 predictions
Date: 27 Jul 92 16:24:01 GMT
Organization: Schlumberger CAD/CAM; Ann Arbor, Michigan (USA)

In article <1992Jul25.020438.11148@DIALix.oz.au> mah@DIALix.oz.au (Marcus Hayes) writes:
>These are my predictions for some of next years F1 lineup :
>
>Williams-Renault
>	Mansell
>	Prost
> ...

Next year is shaping up to be GREAT!!  If we can't have competitive
equality between teams on the track, we can at least get some spectator
appeal out of the intra-team bloodletting!  Let's see now, we get old
buddies Mansell and Prost in a team using a French engine.  We had
a rumor of Ron Dennis talking to Schumacher, so if Senna will just stay
put we could have those two new-found best friends together.  Now all
we need is Michael Andretti in a car good enough to hassle with 
Schumacher.

FISA is really missing the boat here, thinking that tire widths and
wing sizes are the key to improving audience interest.  What they
really need to do is augment the in-car cameras with mandatory in-pit
and in-motorhome cameras and microphones.  Think of the juicy stuff.

Intrigue, violence, ... we just need a little love interest and we'll
have the makings of a hit prime-time miniseries.

Dave Wilson
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: gwishon@afit.af.mil (Gordon Wishon)
Subject: Re: F1:  What did Frank Williams say to Andrew Marriot re: Patrese
Organization: Air Force Institute of Technology
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:48:13 GMT

In article <Jul28.073332.18323@engr.washington.edu> eliot@engr.washington.edu (eliot) writes:


>Several people have talked about how rotten FW was towards his drivers.  I
>couldn't for the life of me make out his words with all that background
>noise.  Would some kind soul tell me what exactly he said?  I'm referring
>to the comments he made to Andrew Marriot right after the end of the race
>when he was asked about Patrese.

>Thanks!!

>eliot


As I recall (but I'd have to review the tape to be absolutely sure), he said,

"Four useful Championship points, and a podium finish, lost."

Cold, indeed.


Gordon
From: joel@upchrch.UUCP (Joel Upchurch  )
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Deer Claims Another; Thoughts
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 01:38:39 EDT
Organization: Upchurch Computer Consulting, Orlando FL

ron@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Ron Miller) writes:

> When you reject the "cost to society" argument, please remember that you
> are also spitting in the face of suddenly involved strangers who will be 
> inconvenienced by your decision. They cannot spit back at you as you lie 
> unconscious and bleeding on (or off) the road.

If you want to use the cost to society arguement about helmets, then I'd
have to say that riding a motorcycle at all creates a unacceptable cost
to society. I did some figures one time and concluded that motorcycle
riders were twenty times as likely to get killed as automobile passengers
on a passenger mile basis.

I recognize that such behavior has a social cost, but I regard it as part
of the price we pay for living in a free society and I'm willing to live
with it.

(If your mail bounces use the address below.)
Joel Upchurch/Upchurch Computer Consulting/718 Galsworthy/Orlando, FL 32809
joel@peora.ccur.com {uiucuxc,hoptoad,petsd,ucf-cs}!peora!joel (407) 859-0982
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: dan@Ingres.COM (Daniel J. Dick)
Subject: Re: Men and Women drivers :-)
Organization: Representing myself and not my company here
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Distribution: usa
Date: 27 Jul 92 19:43:51 GMT

ashaw@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (andrew.shaw) writes:
: From article <1992Jul20.181647.3237@pony.Ingres.COM>, by dan@Ingres.COM (Daniel J. Dick):
: > 
: 
: What fun!  I bet all the other drivers cheered you on too!  Have you
: considered a career in professional racing?  Then other drivers who
: weren't aware of your little tricks wouldn't be forced to share the
: road with you.
: 

It "felt real good" for a little while to put that idiot driver in his
place and give him what he deserved.  However, the fun was spoiled by
a sense of guilt followed by a resolve not to continue that practice,
which you will notice if you read to the end of my first message.

I feel no sympathy for anyone put in their place in this manner.  But,
pumping up their adrenalin in this way would more likely make him buy
a faster car than to become a safer more respectful driver.

Our streets are not race-ways.  They are not to be confused with race-ways.
In Nashville, you find folks that know what a turn-signal means.  They
use it and know what it means when someone else uses it.  Here in California
where folks do not know the difference between rights and wrongs, many
drive like pigs eat--there's a turn signal "SQUEEEEEE"--cut him off quick!
I'm comfortable, so I'll walk slow and wallow around in everybody's way.
Get outta my way, I stuck my snout in there first...SQUEEEE, SNORT, SNORT...
Sorta makes me wonder what Californian's are snorting anyway.  Same goes for
New York.

The point is, it "don't take brains to press a gas pedal", and "it don't
take lotsa skill" to go faster--only a bigger engine.  If you want respect
and status as a driver, then drive with dignity.  Respect turn signals.
Use turn signals.  Drive at a reasonable speed--not too fast or too slow,
and do not stop frozen in your own lane for half an hour waiting for the
ideal hole to open up in the next lane--make your lane changes early.
Be the best driver and not the worst driver on the street.  Use brains.

In short, hold your dignity and respect for others and let the others
snort and squeee.  Mocking a pig by acting like one will not make the pig
any more or less of a pig.
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis
Date:         Thu, 23 Jul 92 15:33:28 CST
From:         JMARTIN@WUVMD
To:           NETNEWS@WUVMD
Subject:         Z Car vs. M3
Newsgroups:   rec.autos.driving

I am in the market for a "new to me" car.

I presently drive a '83 Toyota Celica GTS, it is time for it's retire-
ment.  I put 120K on it in 4 yrs.

Questions: 1) Which car is the better value / driving fun?:
           2) Which car is easier to maintain; which has less mechan.
              problems?


1990 - 91 Nissan 300Z or  1988 - 87  BMW M3


I like the outside appeal and styling of both , I just want the most
fun and value for my $$.

In my area, both can be picked up in the 17.5k thru 22k price range.

joe martin
jmartin@wuvmd.wustl.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: bq434@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Michael A. Chance)
Subject: Re: What does GT mean in all these sports models ?
Reply-To: bq434@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Michael A. Chance)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 21:23:18 GMT


The initials "GT" originally meant "Grand Touring", indicating that the
automobile was design to transport 2 people and 2-4 weeks of luggage in
relative comfort on long-distance cross-country journeys.

Today, it means that the manufacturer has added some schmalzy detailing,
some gee-whix gizmos and gauges, and $1500-5000 to the price.

Michael A. Chance
St. Louis, MO
From: kk@mcnc.org (Krzysztof A. Kozminski)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Loaded pickup on a race track (was Re: Men and Women drivers)
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:09:47 GMT
Organization: MCNC Center for Microelectronics, RTP, NC

In article <1992Jul21.154505.7044@pony.Ingres.COM> dan@Ingres.COM (Daniel J. Dick) writes:
>
>After all, I've never
>seen a loaded pickup traveling along the Indianapolis race track, so why
>should I expect to travel 120+ over the freeway?

Presuming that you've never seen a loaded pickup traveling along the
Nurnburngring (sp?) race track, perhaps you also wonder why should
Germans expect to travel 120+ over the autobahn ?

Returning to the question: maybe because you (a generic 'you', not
'you in person'):

- may happen to know that the road was designed to handle military convoys
  going upward of 80mph (somebody said 100mph ?)

- may happen to have a car that is capable of doing 120+ mph on a road
  that heavy trucks can negotiate at 80 mph

- may happen to have appropriate skills to drive at 120+ mph on such a road

- expect that other users of the road look in their %^#@!!ng rear-view
  mirrors before changing lanes and keep in the righmost lane appropriate
  for their speed

OOPS, I see, how incredibly naive of me to expect that others would have
upward of one brain cell and that posession of such an unusualy developed
cerebrum would compel them to observe *basic* rules of driving ... :-):-)

>: Chris "drive safely, but in the vicinity of the speed limit" Kuner.
>: 00124961@ysub.ysu.edu
>
>Yeah!!!

Bleah.  Love those unconditional endorsements.  Really toughtful.
What if 'safe' and "in the vicinity of the speed limit" are
mutually incompatible?  As, e.g., on a slippery road.

K "drive safely no matter what the posted limit is" K
-- 
"Limit congressmen to two terms.  One in office.  One in jail."
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: khan@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (Scott Coleman)
Subject: Re: Who gets to buy a sports car?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: rec
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 13:55:21 GMT

zdem0a@hgo7.hou.amoco.com (Donna Martz) writes:

>>anything, it was obvious.   

>Reminds me of when my '90 Z car was new (5/89) - I enjoyed "testing"
>it out on the Waugh cloverleaf and generally horsin' around, when a 
>Mustang pulled up next to me at a traffic light and started to revin'.
>I turned to my friend, said "I'm not gonna race this jerk", and felt 
>quite self-satisfied as I watched the Ford peel away from the light, 
>followed by the cop that appeared from nowhere, with lights flashing. 

Some people have all the luck. I can't even count the number of times some
jerk has pulled a stupid stunt, and how I WISHED a cop would see it and ticket
the bastard, but I've never seen it happpen. :-(

--
Scott Coleman                                                    tmkk@uiuc.edu

Free Advice: It is inadvisable to read Bush's lips at an official banquet.
From: aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Officers breaking the law (was Re: Another lying police incedent)
Date: 21 Jul 92 05:14:13 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: The Hellen Keller-Bondurant High Performance Driving School for the Blind

In article <1992Jul20.133823.7274@sura.net> nunn@sura.net (Deborah Nunn) writes:
>In article <1992Jul18.034029.8065@informix.com> aland@informix.com (Colonel Panic) writes:
>>You said you were doing 70 within plain view of a cop (I don't understand why
>>you were trying to make an issue of his being in front of you; ask long as s/he
>>has a clear view, it doesn't matter).  You were cited for 70.  What exactly
>>is the problem?
>
>The "problem" is that the police officer was also speeding, and did not
>get a speeding citation.  I have changed the subject heading for this
>post, since it wasn't a "lying police incident" in actuality.  Yes, I 
>was speeding, and I got a ticket.  That's not the problem.
>
>The reason why I was making "an issue of his being in front of" me was
>because he was *speeing himself*.  ...

If he was clocking you from behind, he would likewise be "speeding, himself".
I still don't see how his being in front of you is relevant.

If you really got your apparent wish, RADAR, LIDAR, and VASCAR would rule.
Is this really preferable?

--
Alan Denney      aland@informix.com      {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland

"They've taken Bill Clinton back into the 'smoke-filled room', and this
 time they're making him inhale!"
      -- LNWDL 1992 Democratic Convention correspondent Larry 'Bud' Melman
From: twc@svcs1.UUCP (Ted Chan)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Z Car vs. M3
Date: 25 Jul 92 23:44:18 GMT
Organization: Silicon Valley Computer Society, Sunnyvale, CA

From article <92205.153323JMARTIN@wuvmd.wustl.edu>, by JMARTIN@WUVMD:
> I am in the market for a "new to me" car.
> 
> I presently drive a '83 Toyota Celica GTS, it is time for it's retire-
> ment.  I put 120K on it in 4 yrs.
> 
> Questions: 1) Which car is the better value / driving fun?:
>            2) Which car is easier to maintain; which has less mechan.
>               problems?
> 
> 
> 1990 - 91 Nissan 300Z or  1988 - 87  BMW M3

I'd vote for the beamer.  The naturally aspirated 300Z's are kinda doggy.
Good luxury/sports touring cars, but not very quick.  The beamer is a luxury
sedan that is zippy (for a sedan) and is a more convenient bike hauler/
grocery getter.  The latter car is definitely more practical.

--twc@legal.uucp

P.S.  By "not very quick" I mean that my ancient 2.9 litre '70 240z will
      smoke a 300Z EVERY time...  (280 block, valves, 240 head, 2mm overbore)
From: tomevans@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com
Subject: Re: Officers breaking the law (was Re: Another lying police incedent)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 12:54:12 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

In  <1992Jul30.062137.5189@ITcorp.com>  geoff@ITcorp.com (Geoff Kuenning) writes:
> In article <1992Jul28.172525.13679@porthos.cc.bellcore.com>
> whs70@dancer.UUCP () writes:
>
> > Well Tom, I'm an elected official in my home town and as far as
> > I'm concerned the cops should only exceed the speed limit if they
> > have the appropriate lights and sirens going.  Being a cop does NOT
> > give them an unlimited license to drive any speed they want.
>
> I have to agree in general, but I must note that (at least in
> California) there is one important exception to this rule, which is
> when the Highway Patrol is clocking a speeder.  Turning on the lights
> in this case would be counterproductive.  On the other hand, there's
> nothing (except CHP procedure) to keep them from turning on their rear
> flashing-yellow light which is invisible from the front.
>
If cops are allowed to beat people senseless, proven in court a while back,
I'm sure they are allowed to speed. I don't care what the written law states,
the unwritten law is they get to speed any time they feel like it.
Tom
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: jeq@i88.isc.com (Jonathan E. Quist)
Subject: Re: Deer Claims Another; Thoughts
Organization: INTERACTIVE Systems Corporation, Naperville, IL
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:58:48 GMT

In article <24757@dog.ee.lbl.gov> jtchew@csa3.lbl.gov writes:
>Use good sense. No extra points for lighting off a gas leak with
>a flare. (As always, size up the scene before doing anything.  Those
>few seconds up front can save a lot of grief later on.)  This is an 
>advantage to those reflective triangles, which also don't burn out. 
>They don't seem to get the same amount of attention as flares, 
>though, especially in daytime and/or fog.

In fact, the triangles, in IL at least, are legally the same as flares
for vehicles required to carry them.

>I'd suggest keeping the [reflective]vest under the front seat so you can put 

One of the first applications of my Conspicuity sticker kit was to
put large patches on the back edge of our car doors.  If you car didn't
come with reflectors already there, the stickers are cheap visibility.

--
Jonathan E. Quist                              INTERACTIVE Systems Corporation
jeq@i88.isc.com                                        Naperville, IL
'71 CL450-K4 "Gleep"  -   "Worth Reposession"
DoD #094,  PBF #03  "I'm not mad; just terribly, terribly hurt."  HDM #007
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Officers breaking speed laws
From: dreuben@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 30 Jul 92 05:12:24 EDT
Organization: Wesleyan University


In article <1992Jul23.161106.19731@watson.ibm.com> tomevans@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com writes:

>SO WHAT? Cops (when on duty) are allowed to speed in the performance of their
>duty, whether in marked or unmarked cars. 

Nope...at least not in the states that I have lived in. As an example, in CT,
the CGSA, Title 14 specifically calls for the use of "emergency lights" on any
police, fire, or other emergency vehicle if it is going to exceed the speed
limit, or violate any other (significant?) aspect of the CT Motor Vehicle Code. 
(I'm not going to type the actual text it - if you go to the library it is easy
enough to find...the CGSA are medium sized blue books, about 15 volumes, with
the titles listed under the volumes.)

The trooper or whatever can NOT speed unless he has his lights on. I'm not
going to get into the merits of the case which prompted these posts, but saying
that they are allowed to speed "in performance of their duties" is too vague
and inaccurate a description of the very specific conditions which an officer
has to meet before he can legally speed. 

(There may be certain limited exceptions to this, ie, when the lights would
seriously impede the performance of the emergency or police vehicle's duty [ie,
approaching a burglarly in progress or something], but these are generally not
available for "cruising" on highways...there must be a good cause.)

This is not to say that they don't: On July 19th, at about 3AM on the NJ Tpke
(not the I-95 section, south of that, the "Temp I-95" area, near NJ-18), I was
passed by two northbound state troopers - one on the left, the other on the
right, going at over 110 MPH. I was doing about 75 or 80 (standard for the NJT
for most sensible traffic), and they passed me *incredibly* quickly...
They may have been even doing 120 or faster. No lights, no siren, nothing...
I sped up tp 90, so I could see them over the hill they had passed, and they
were just racing each other, switching lanes without signalling, and apparently
trying to beat the other to the exit at NJ-18 (Exit 9?) where the police
station is (it is visible from the road....they must have hit the exit ramp at
100 mph, but they didn't seem to care...So they get away with it all the time,
although legally they can not do this and can be issued a summons just as
regular motorists get. (There would also likely be some administrative action
if this happend too often...)

-Doug

dreuben@eagle.wesleyan.edu
dreuben@wesleyan.bitnet