From: grayt@Software.Mitel.COM (Tom Gray)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Denied access to English schools?
Date: 2 Sep 92 15:01:41 GMT
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.

In article <Btx6Ey.DBH@ireq.hydro.qc.ca> beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard) writes:
|VERY but very debattable arguments...
|
|Anyway, I already said that in a title...
|
|In article <12720@grayt> grayt@Software.Mitel.COM (Tom Gray) writes:
|>In article <Btnv6o.Hw4@ireq.hydro.qc.ca> beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard) writes:
|>>
|>>This is one part of the problem : if Canada was that generous with francos,
|>>why is the west almost unilingual anglo?  Why does it take one century
|>>to change the illegal law in Manitoba that make it unilingual?
|>>Just look some historical books and you'll see that a lot of people
|>
|>Well Denis, the answer that you are looking for is people just like you.
|>There has long been a tension in Canada between those who can allow
|>the cultural groups to cooperate and those (like you) who can
|>only see releationships in terms of domination.
|>
|>The loss of French schools in Manitoba was the result of the foeud
|>between the Orangemen of Dalton Maccarthy and the ultramontanists
|>of Honore Mercier. Maccarthy saw any accommodation with the French
|>Canadian as an example of French domination. Mercier attempted to
|>turn Quebec into a clerical state.
|>
|>During the battles on the Jesuit Estates bill, Maccarthy (
|>and his ultramontane opponents) stirred up a great deal of
|>religious and ethnic resentment across the country. 
|>Part of this religious rage spilled over into Manitoba
|>which attempted to eliminate the religious schools which
|>had received religious support during the period 
|>1870-1890.
|>
|>
|>Eventually the forces of toleration prevailed (as they always
|>do in Canada) and the ultramontanists and the Orangemen were
|>forgotten.
|
|The forces of toleration prevailed one century later!  
|Otherwise, YOU talked about francophones working for their
|religion and anglophones fighting francophones.  You see the
|picture : one group against the francophones in west and they
|won, one group in favor of church in Quebec and they won too.
|You missed probably something...
|

No Denis. I did not miss anything. What I perceived that enmity and
attempted domination are self-defeating. I saw that culture is very
important to people and that they can easily be insited by racist
demogogues to attack their neighbours. However I saw that people
are basically tolerant and will learn to live together despite
the bletherings of racists like Maccarthy or Mercier.

Thus I saw that Canada has a history of tensions between ethnic and
linguistic groups but just as much a history of tolerance between
such groups. Tolerance will prevail, Denis because intolerance is
impractical. You cannot base a society on domination without
damaging your own culture. The racist and xenophobic forces of
Duplessis were defeated. Francophones are gaining recognition of their`
rights across the west (despite the efforts of Quebec nationalists).

No Denis - your side is losing and will always lose.

|>
|>However Denis, if you wonder how the rights of the francophone 
|>were damaged in Manitoba, it was because of peoplle like you.
|>People who could (and can) only see relationships is terms
|>of domination of one group over another.
|
|Because I tried to give a realistic portray of Quebec?  
|Where's the smiley?

There is no smiley Denis. Like all of us, you give only a portrait
of yourself in your postings.
 
|
|I MADE AN EFFORT TO UNDERSTAND YOU.  I LEARNED ENGLISH.
|WHEN WILL YOU LEARN ENOUGH
|FRENCH TO UNDERSTAND FRENCH-SPEAKINGS????   YOU ARE RACIST, and

Why on earth do you think I don't make an effort to understand
posts written in French. Complicated constructions and literary
conventions do make it difficult for me to entirely sure of
the true intentions of the writer. I therefore hesitiate to reply
but only attempt to place the post in context. I have two French/English
dictionaries at my terminal to assist me.

As for the RACIST charge, I grew up in the 1960's. The philosophy
of Martin Luther King overwhelmed me. Through him, I learned that
racism can be expressed in soft words by eloquent people. I remember
Sam Eastland - Senator from Mississippi. Eastland was a very intelligent
, very literate, very eloquent and very refined man. He was also
a flaming segragationist bigot. His soft words of concern for the
established culture were created by a mind which was determined to
maintain a society based on domination. Through King, I learned that
there should be no toleration for such ideas. They should be exposed
to the light in all their ugliness. With exposure, these ideas will be
rejected. That is all I am doing Denis and that is all I am going to
continue to do. 

|your posting did not changed that.

No my posting has had little effect. I have few illusions that they will.

|
|>In short Denis, your side is again on the defensive.
|
|I don't see why.  You just said that anglo manitoban fighted
|francophones and won and did not won.  Even your arguments are
|not logical!  But, where are the smileys?

I did not say that Franco and Anglo Manitobans faught each other.
I said that cultural enmity was stirred up by bigots but as
always in Canada such enmity will fail against the natural tolerance
of the people.





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Newsgroups: can.politics