Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: kbalasub@sparcle.oracle.com (Kris Balasubramanian)
Subject: Re: Ancient Indian History
Reply-To: kbalasub@sparcle.oracle.com
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 18:48:57 GMT
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In article 8s4@cs.psu.edu, narayana@psuvax1.cs.psu.edu (Kuram T Narayana) writes:
>In article <Bx6oJr.KqK@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> selvakum@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca (C.R.Selvakumar - Electrical Engineering) writes:
>>
>>
>>In article <1992Nov2.180230.10130@oracorp.com>, narayana@oracorp.com (K. T. Narayana) writes:
>>> In article <100052@bu.edu> narain@csa.bu.edu (narain attili) writes:
>>> >In article <1992Oct27.180814.8147@oracorp.com: narayana@oracorp.com (K. T. Narayana) writes:
>>> >:In article <Bwn6tB.7I6@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca: selvakum@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca (C.R.Selvakumar - Electrical Engineering) writes:
>>> >::In article <8eu3F6u00iQCE3NUwL@andrew.cmu.edu:, "Arun K. Gupta" <ag3l+@andrew.cmu.edu: writes:
>>> >::: 
>>> >: K.T.Narayana writes:
>>> >:Having read this column for a considerable length, I have to comment
>>> >:on some disturbing aspects of the threads!
>>> >:
>>> >:Selvakumar has not offered a shred of concrete evidence that the 
>>> >:Indus Valley people were Aboriginals (or more specifically Dravidonoids
>>> >:as he would like to call).
>>> >:
>>> >: (stuff removed)
>>> 
>>> >:Selvakumar's discourse has so many gaps for it to be believed. 
>>> >:...kt
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >Well, I'd rather say that what Selva Kumar believes is what can
>>> >be described as "conventional theory of aryans and dravidians".
>>> >
>>    Narain writes: 
>>
>>> >Salient points in these beliefs:
>>> >
>>> >1. Aryans and Dravidians were enemies.
>>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>> >
>>>  K.T. Narayana writes:
>>> Difficult it may be to believe, there is always a cultural schism
>>> and the notion of acceptance of a different culture. The first and
>>> foremost things is to determine if Dravidians were inhabitants of
>>> the larger parts of India (in addition to the south) and further
>>> whether they had any significant metaphysical ideas. Even if they
>>> had, did they articulate that thought in order to propagate the
>>> same among the people? What is the structure of the society that
>>> they believed in? None is evident.
>>                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>     *could* have been enemies some 3500 years ago and subsequently
>>
>
>Again read my previous post. I would specifically like to know if
>35000 years ago the dravidianoids as a race has any metaphysics that
>I can know about. If you can answer that it is fine with me. Can you
>atleast give me some evidence of metaphyscial development to even
>the date assigned to Rg Veda. Please don't tell me that Rg veda
>was made up by dravidianoids.
>
>>     In the above you (K.T.Narayana) mention that there is 
>>     no evidence for dravidian
>>     culture and structure of society. Please read the Sangam Age poems
>>     where some 150 different poets have sung about various kings and
>>     others numbering 130 people , then you can infer a lot about
>>     Tamil society and culture that existed around 200 B.C - 200 A.D
>>     If you read 'ThirukkuRaL' by ThiruvaLLuvan and Manu Smrithi and
>>     earlier Smrithis by Yagnavalkya et al you can compare the ideal
>>     morals Tamil/dravidians were striving for and Sanskrit/aryanoids
>>     were striving for. The Tamil and Sanskrit cultures are very
>>     different in many ways. But later on especailly just about Kalidasa's
>>     time for poetics and later on after Bhakthi movements on philosophical
>>      matters ( > 700 A.D) sanskrit works significantly absorbed
>>      native dravidian features. Kuram Narayana, much of metaphysics 
>>     in Sanskrit is from Dravidaacharyas and so it is futile to claim
>>     that dravidians were cultureless. Sanskrit Kala comes from tamil (-;
>>       
>
>No I did not say that dravidians are cultureless! you seem to have a
>distinct way of understanding English. I said that dravidian racists
>(ala EVR and his brand of cronies) are cultureless scums.

Dont degenerate to a scum. When you start calling names that shows only your weakness. that shows that you have no substance. Why is EVR a scum, because he
did not agree with you ? I would equate EVR to Bertrand Russell. EVR's problem
was that he was not very articulate and polished, ( Ross Perot like). The Educated
idiots in India or TN did not make use of him very well. Annadurai did a little bit
but mellowed after becoming CM. Later that movement died.  We Indians have
a bad habit of annihilating everything that does not conform. 
	We need a movement like EVR's to get ride of the religious fanatics
and superstitions. Otherwise there is no hope. When educated people cannot 
understand and give a proper perspective to epics what will the commoner do?