From: wfinnert@larry.shearson.com (Warren Finnerty)
Subject: Re: syslogs
Organization: Lehman Brothers
	<1993Jan22.180412.8847@odin.corp.sgi.com>
	<1993Jan22.192334.16373@sunova.ssc.gov>
	<1993Jan23.000958.26732@odin.corp.sgi.com>
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 17:27:04 GMT

In article <1993Jan23.000958.26732@odin.corp.sgi.com> lmcgee@bondo.corp.sgi.com (Lee McGee) writes:

>   In article <1993Jan22.192334.16373@sunova.ssc.gov>, jbaron@higgs.ssc.gov (Jeff Baron) writes:
>
>   (Re:  the topic, what's in a syslog...)
>
>   |> Oh sure.  Do we think that the log is a valuable part of the Sybase
>   |> product?  Do we think that Sybase itself has some vested interest in
>   |> protecting its product?  Do *other* companies give out data structure
>   |> definitions (and source code?) for their products?
>
>
>   Yes. Yes.  and Yes.  Check Apple Macintosh.  Unix.  Open systems in general.
>
>
>   So give us poor DBAs a break!  We're just doing a job here!  When tech support,
>   or a sales technical rep, reads us a script or command on the telephone, or 
>   performs it in front of our eyes in the process of solving a problem for us, 
>   then surely they must realize that the "inside information" has _just_ become 
>   public knowledge.  And that it has been written down or recorded on the users' 
>   systems for later use.  Lots of users have this information.  We have seen 
>   "dbcc log (param, param,...param)" run.  We have seen its output.  We know 
>   what is possible.  
>
>   While that might arguably be a Sybase internal security, or
>   trade secret, problem, should it be our concern as users of the product?  
>   If the contract says something to that effect, then yes, I stand corrected 
>   and chastised.  Yet, I think not.  And I've never felt a need to "not repeat" 
>   something learned from a Sybase technical rep in the process of solving a 
>   problem or making a system run better.  After all, Sybase, when tuned right, 
>   has some of be the fastest and most consistent performance out there in the DBMS 
>   marketplace and that is the true trade secret.  
>
>   Some "insider information" has even appeared in this newsgroup from time to time 
>   (not from here, from other sources!), and we have learned heretofore unimaginable 
>   techniques from our other colleagues who post to the newsgroups.  

I suspect that the reason that there is no documentation on these commands 
mostly revolves around not wanting to use the resources to upgrade/cleanup/improve
these commands to the point where they can be supported. Additionally since
persons would be writing software using the command they would have to be
ported to new versions of the server. These commands *can* crash your server
if you make even a small mistake. I would rather SYBASE concentrate on working
on future improvements ( monitor server, etc ) rather than handing out 
dangerous commands to novice users and wasting tech support time fixing
the problems that are created by that. I you do enough heavy-duty server
work you *will* come across these commands much as you have stated.

NB: Most SYBASE guru types have signed 10 billion non-disclosures
and are unlikely to post such internal details.

Happy hunting


 
>   -- 
>   Your Data Base Administrator:  LEE MCGEE
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warren finnerty      | 388 Greenwich St.
Lehman Brothers      | NYC NY 10013
"Back off man!"      | wfinnert@shearson.com