HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hhenderson@vax.clarku.edu
Subject: RE: excellent reading!
Organization: Clark University
Date: 12 DEC 92 02:37:02 GMT

twain@milton.u.washington.edu (Barbara Hlavin) writes:

>In article <1gajmlINN5j8@morrow.stanford.edu> francis@oas.stanford.edu
>(Francis Muir) writes:
>>Barbara Hlavin writes:
>>
>>   My own assumption was that Tom was suggesting that there was a 
>>   piece of information about the book that might be of interest 
>>   to the person recommending it. 
>>
>>Somewhat disingenuous Barbara. If McDogsnot really believed that, why
>>did he not just publish the factoid?
>
>Well, you see, Francis, I thought it the kind of humorous observation 
>one person might make to a group of friends who had just spent ten hours 
>discussing the merits of, say, _Atlas Shrugged_ when a new person 
>enters the room and says brightly, "Say, has anyone ever heard of 
>Ayn Rand?"  -The equivalent of a wry exchange of glances in a family 
>gathering. 

Funny, this contradicts what you said in your previous post -- but never
mind.

>Not particularly indulgent to the new-comer, perhaps, but essentially
>good-natured, and entirely devoid of malice, unlike the recent 
>contributions of Heather the Hun, however highly valued her bon mots 
>may be by select members of the group. 

Hey, I bear no malice toward any of you folks, even after being told to "fuck
off and die".  I just think you're an amusingly self-absorbed little clique. 
You, Barbara, may know Mr. Maddox well enough to detect the essential good-
naturedness in his remark, but remember that the "newcomer" will probably see
only the snottiness.  

If that's what you want, then that's your choice, but it's rather a "small"
way to behave, isn't it?

Heather
HHENDERSON@vax.clarku.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: isc10192@nusunix1.nus.sg (KOH KHANG WEE)
Subject: WANTED : Battletech books
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 08:39:43 GMT


i am looking for the following Battletech novels which are not available
in my country, if someone is willing to sell them or know where i can
mail order from, or is willing to help me get them, please email me or
post a followup article. the list is as follows :-

Decision at Thunder Rift
Mecenary's Star
The price of glory
by : william h. keith, jr.

The sword and the dagger
by : ardath Mayhar

wolves on the border
by : Robert Charrette

heir to the dragon
by : robert charette

lost destiny
by : michael a stackpole

I have the rest and currently needs the above, please help me find them.
Thanks in advance.
--
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
	Jerry Koh 	a.k.a. 		FLAT^^TOP
		 isc10192@nusunix.nus.sg
	     national university of singapore
	     D.     I. 	    S.	    C.	   S.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: kieran@world.std.com (Aaron L Dickey)
Subject: Re: Making notations in your books?
Keywords: books notations 
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 14:16:48 GMT

burgin@ecsvax.uncecs.edu (Robert Burgin) writes:

>	isn't you.  (By the way, your concern about resale
>	value puzzles me somewhat.  Do you restrict your
>	reading to books that you think have a potential
>	"financial value"?  Obviously, one would think
>	twice before annotating or highlighting a rare
>	first edition.)

Well, I didn't mean financial value in terms of "I wanna read my books,
then turn around and re-sell the worthless things."  I just meant it more
in terms of, "What if 50 years from now this autographed first edition of
<insert name here> ends up being worth twenty times the price I paid for
it, and I screw it up by highlighting the hell out of it as a foolish
youth?"  When you get right down to it, I'm most worried about this: Often
when I but a book, I think not only of the enjoyment I'll get out of it,
but also any possible enjoyment my kid (or kids) may someday be able to
receive from the same books.  I'm just afraid that by marking them up, my
kids won't want to bother trying to wade through the mess, and the books
will be destined to spend eternity gathering dust on the shelves of my heirs.

--Aaron
From: rhogan@aludra.usc.edu (Ron Hogan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Historical Figures was Re: It fills us...
Date: 14 Dec 1992 01:27:20 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

Case in point:

Stephen Sondheim's ASSASSINS

Ok, so it's a musical, not a book.  It's still powerful stuff,
and the communion of the assassins is rather intense in some spots.

All in all, it has some interesting psychological and cultural
insights into the assassin, in particular a connection the Balladeer
(sort of the equivalent of Our Town's Stage Manager) makes between
Lee Harvey Oswald and Willy Loman.

Ron Hogan
Attention must be paid.
From: margot@disuns2.epfl.ch (Joel Margot)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Boris VIAN books (looking for)
Date: 14 Dec 92 11:05:58 GMT
Reply-To: margot@disuns2.epfl.ch (Joel Margot)
Distribution: rec.arts.books,misc.wanted
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne

Hello friends,

A friend of mine is collecting books by the french author Boris VIAN. He 
is looking to get translated books of his. If you're living in one of these
country and would agree to sell me books by VIAN in your national language,
*please* do contact me. The countries he is interested in are:

- All countries in Europe (except french-speaking countries, of course)
- Japan
- All countries in southern America
- USA
- USSR (or ex-USSR to be precise)

If our price is correct, the deal is made! 

Thanks in advance for any offer.

Joel Margot
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
Subject: Re: Making a virtue of complacency
Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
	<1992Dec13.121550.18454@husc3.harvard.edu>
	<1992Dec14.153150.26361@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Date: 14 Dec 92 09:58:13

In article <1992Dec14.153150.26361@athena.cs.uga.edu> fuller@athena.cs.uga.edu (James P. H. Fuller) writes:

   References: <1992Dec10.013400.18340@husc3.harvard.edu> <1992Dec10.173005.4176@spdcc.com> <1992Dec13.121550.18454@husc3.harvard.edu>
   Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 15:31:50 GMT
   Lines: 14

   zeleny@husc10.harvard.edu (Michael Zeleny) writes:

   >hurts the willing participants.  Should you try to seek refuge in the
   >hospitable lap of that profligate liberal nanny, Tolerance, I would
   >remind you that, by your own lights, you have no ground for appealing to
   >that whore of dead white heterosexual males, while rejecting the rest of
   >their baggage.  


	Ah there, Michael.  No, they just *can't* seem to grasp that if they
   believe in Tolerance they have to tolerate toads like us.

						   -- jf

There is tolerance and there is tolerance.

     You ought certainly to forgive them as a christian, but
     never to admit them in your sight, or allow their names to
     be mentioned in your hearing. - Pride and Prejudice
--
John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
*
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.

Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: jacob@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Tom Jacob)
Subject: Re: Making notations in your books?
Organization: University of North Texas, Denton
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 02:48:45 GMT

> What are your feelings about making notes, highlighting, etc., in the
> books that you own?  Although I wish I could do so in my books (it does

I like annotated books for much the same reason others have advanced: the
annotations are often fascinating (and sometimes better than the text).
Given a clean copy and a well annotated one, I will buy the annotated one.

I hate underlining and highlighting.  These invariably spoil the book for me,
so much so that I will not buy these books.

Tom Jacob
Department of Computer Science
University of North Texas
From: fehr@ms.uky.edu (Jeff Davis)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: decline in SAT scores very little genetic
Date: 17 Dec 92 17:58:18 GMT
Organization: Austerlitz, Gershovitz, and Carmichael

Chuck Smythe writes:
>jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU writes:
>>Reading "What's really behind the SAT-score decline?" by Charles Murray

       [Chuck offers among other things]

1) the decline of reading
2) the ascent of TV
3) the apathy of parents

Yes on all three. 
Since snatching away the USAs electronic fix is unlikely -- scotching
1 and 2 -- and the apathy of parents is beyond any known remedy, there
are a number of things that baffled educators have proposed (many
of which positively boost learning....amazingly enough):

1) Professional administrators at the primary level: no more
   coaches! Reward good teachers by making teacher pay scales
   commensurate with administrative pay scales.

2) Local school based decision making. Democracy in action. Even
   if the parents don't get involved -- although lots still do --
   letting the teachers have a say in what they do...works!

3) Small schools. There is one constant across the divide
   between good scores and bad scores on these tests: kids from small
   schools do better. And that's across economic and racial lines as well. 
   Then there's the added bonus: there's been no cost analysis that shows 
   an economy of scale for big schools.

4) Recess: increase it. Kids do not learn well w/ their noses
   to the grindstone. Mens sana...quoth Bertie W.

5) Keep kids close to home so they know their peers well...
   closely allied to #3.

6) Don't track younger kids. Let the smart ones go off in
   a corner to help the slower ones. Knowing a subject well
   enough to teach it to a peer increases mastery waaaay
   beyond the usual level needed to pass a test, so putting a 
   smart kid in with a slower one doesn't have to hold back the
   smarter one.

7) Keep the early years gradeless so that mastery of material
   is emphasized rather than going up a success/failure
   route of grades. People grow at radically different
   rates with the largest swings among the youngest kids.
   The stigma of failure is tough to shake, though, at
   any age.

Note a hidden benefit here: none of this includes computers,
high tech gizmos, costs money (except for #1), or picks a dog in 
the liberal/conservative subject matter fight. 
-- 
Jeff Davis <davis@keats.ca.uky.edu> Don't be a stranger.
Xref: sparky rec.arts.books:22718 misc.books.technical:1784 alt.internet.services:2037 comp.org.eff.talk:7777
From: dsew@troi.cc.rochester.edu (David Sewell)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,misc.books.technical,alt.internet.services,comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: The Online BookStore Announcement: The Internet Companion
Date: 18 Dec 92 06:05:06 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

In <BzFIoy.I7q@cs.uiuc.edu> tthiel@cs.uiuc.edu (Terry Thiel) writes:

>How can it be a best selling book when it just came out?  Ed Krol's Whole
>Internet looks much better anyway.

Krol's book is a lot more thorough.  But I think LaQuey's might be a
better intro book for someone clueless about the Internet as persuasion
to get them onto it.  It has the Gore intro, a low proportion of techie
stuff (it's great that Krol tells you all about the perils of tn3270
emulation, but it's a little much for an absolute beginner), and a
division of Internet resources into function rather than just program
name.  Good stocking stuffer for new Netters--they'll go out and buy the
Krol on their own later.

-- 
David Sewell, English Dept, U of Rochester   |  "Grammarians without any
  dsew@troi.cc.rochester.edu                 |  character at all lecture
  dsewell@violet.ccit.arizona.edu            |  us upon that of Homer."
  (On leave in Tucson, Arizona, '92-'93)     |     --Diogenes the Cynic
From: sheilah@wam.umd.edu (Danny-Boy)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: excellent reading!
Summary: well, I do make an obbooks paragraph.
Date: 12 Dec 92 19:09:31 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park

callahan@biffvm.cs.jhu.edu (Paul Callahan) writes:
>fi@grebyn.com (Fiona Webster) writes:
>>Heather Henderson writes:
>>>...I just think you're an amusingly self-absorbed little clique. 

>>Ahh, now we're getting somewhere...would you care to elaborate on those
>>feelings, Ms. Henderson?

>This is an issue of facts rather than feelings.  The in-crowd of rec.arts.books
>is unquestionably a self-absorbed little clique.  Granted, whether or not 
>one finds this amusing is an issue of feelings.
>Paul Callahan
>callahan@cs.jhu.edu




A nice approach to reality is to ignore it.
but - This tends towards losing your keys.

(assuming clickery is a part of your reality.)

(revolt. assume an absurdity. deal with the consequences. haha, make
the absurd consistant make the consistant absurd. Have fun.)


(silly typical sophormoric responce, but I will defend myself by claiming that
i actually am a sophomore.)


obbooks? Peebles is making a new release of some cosmology book.
	 Rebbecca told me to check out "The triggering town" by Richard
	 Hugo, and it is wonderful. collection of essays on writing
	 and poetry.
	 I just started reading "Dhalgren" and he is beautiful. struck
	 with imagery. mantra, beautiful beautiful beautiful. the stones
	 licked his feet, a throat losenge of light (not the exact word
	 but i cant remember) forthwith I apologize for delaying this
	 book so long! (this after only twenty seven pages last night.
	 I do overreact)



ps. I would like to point out that I am being well-behaved and that
I did not edit the subject line, so tat if this subject is anyone
killfile ...
-- 
I am always wrong. Don't believe me ever.
stark raving sane  sheilah@wam.umd.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: fuller@athena.cs.uga.edu (James P. H. Fuller)
Subject: Re: Making a virtue of complacency
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 15:11:10 GMT

<HERSCH@auvm.american.edu> (Herschel Browne) writes:

> ... he seeks to deny, and perhaps really doesn't understand, 
> that expressions of contempt for classes of persons have con-
> sequences that fall within the realm of morals, and that in 
> most people's moral lexicons would be called "evil"--most 
> would agree that torturing and killing people who have done 
> no one any harm is evil, would they not?  If "evil" has any 
> meaning at all, surely it is a category to which we would as-
> sign Adolf Hitler, is it not? And surely it was the language 
> of Nazism that licensed its crimes--the language of inferiority 
> and moral degeneracy that licenced Auschwitz and Treblinka, was 
> it not? What higher life-form would disagree?


     I'll cheerfully agree, as long as you don't take the step I
think you're leading up to -- something on the order of "Surely we
must deny to evil people the right to use language that licenses
such crimes."  In fact it is precisely the language you like least
and fear most that you must tolerate if you have any interest in 
protecting your *own* freedom of speech.

     Suppose the day comes that some troglodyte like me acquires
political power over you and defines any mention of Hitler and Naziism
as criminal hate speech?  Just write a line like "Reagan was a homophobe
Nazi" on the net or in the Advocate and whoops, here come the troopers
to take you away.  Having blown large holes in the right to say things
that those in power object to, where will you hide when a new flavor
of Correctness police come through those selfsame holes to round *you*
up?  ("Oh," I hear him laugh, "that could never happen here....")

     You must simply have the courage to endure speech you don't like,
even if that speech "contributes to a climate" in which actions you don't
like might occur.  Anyone without this minimum level of courage is just
too timid to live.



fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) writes:

> Much more practically: should the _current_ german government have taken/take
> a harder line against the Neo-Nazis?  My answer: yes.  First, it is speech,
> and then when the critical mass is reached, it is action.  After it is 
> crossed, the way back is hard, if impossible.
>
> And, by analogy, any other type of hate speech.

     And then, by slight extension, any other type of critical speech.  And
then, by slight extension, any other type of government-disapproved speech.
And then, by slight extension....

     Great Ghu, how the suckers trust the government.  What on earth will
they do, having handed the government wide speech-limiting powers, on the
morning they wake up and find that the *government* is now Neo-Nazi?

                                            -- just asking,

                                                      jf
From: jim@rand.org (Jim Gillogly)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Esquimaux Nell
Date: 14 Dec 92 17:54:22 GMT
Organization: Banzai Institute

In article <1992Dec14.152313.25908@athena.cs.uga.edu> fuller@athena.cs.uga.edu (James P. H. Fuller) writes:
>ercn72@festival.ed.ac.uk (R.J.Hare) writes:
>
>>Kipling, of course wrote the much better known 'Eskimo Nell' first published
>>in 'Plain Tales from the Locker Room'.
>
>     Hope makes me ask for improbabilities.  Does the Ballad of Eskimo Nell
>actually exist?

If it didn't previously, Robert W. Service would have had to have written it, so it
must exist now, by <<some>> author.
-- 
	Jim Gillogly
	U.S. National Debt: $4,169,645,963,592
	Your Share: $16,291
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: lew@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (lewis.h.mammel..jr)
Subject: Re: Is a bimbo the modern name for hussy?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 00:17:30 GMT
Summary: Earth to Professor McCarthy

In article <JMC.92Dec17134101@SAIL.Stanford.EDU>, jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy) writes:
> I should begin with a confession of having led a sheltered life.  I
> have never heard one human refer to another as either a bimbo or
> as a hussy.  Having just bought _Bimbos of the Death Sun_ and having
> read a posting from one of the ladies of the group referring to
> herself as a hussy, I wondered if the terms are equivalent, bimbo
> being much more recent.

Good God, no. In sexual terms, a hussy is agressive and dangerous;
a bimbo is compliant and uncritical. Eve was a hussy. Delilah was
certainly a hussy. Barbie is a bimbo.

> My literary experience suggests that the word hussy was used only
> by women whereas bimbo is used by both sexes today.  Is this impression
> correct?  .....................................................

To a degree, I think. ( Usually in the phrase "shameless hussy". )
Its use by women reflects envy as much as condemnation.

> ........  Would the lady who referred to herself as a hussy, in
> jest I assume, be equally inclined to refer to herself as a bimbo?

Absolutely not. Rebellion, daring, and unconformity are being
invoked. Actual sexual adventurism may or may not be implied.


True story: In Sears at Oakbrook, IL during a snowstorm maybe
five years ago. Two big guys come in and stand in front of some
snow shovels.

First Guy ( Picks up a shovel with a wooden haft and a red plastic
	handle and blade. ): How about this one ?

Second Guy:  Nah, that's a bimbo shovel.

First Guy: Yeah, that's for bimbos ( puts it back )

( exit, both guys )

Lew Mammel, Jr.
From: kassover@rumsey.crd.ge.com (David Kassover)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Making notations in your books?
Date: 19 Dec 92 20:04:41 GMT
Organization: nope

In article <9212181601.AA04042@cfdev1.shearson.com> mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto) writes:
> 
>I make notes in my books, but I put them on the inside of the back cover.
> 
>Of course, I wouldn't do that with a Guttenberg Bible.

Ah, I thought it was a Gideon Bible you shouldn't put notes in...

P.S. to mark:

Shortly before your announcement of impending change of location,
I got some email to you returned, marked "user unknown"

The intervening mailers between here and shearson.com still
believe this to be the case.


-- 
David Kassover             "Proper technique helps protect you against
uupsi!khazad!kassover	          sharp weapons and dull judges."
kassover@aule-tek.com                   F. Collins
kassover@ra.crd.ge.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto)
Subject: Re: Foul and to the point (Was:  Git)
Organization: Yale CS Mail/News Gateway
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 06:00:31 GMT


gwr@hedonist-1.lanl.gov (Graham W. Redgrave) writes:
 
> Mark Taranto writes:
 
>> I've found that "foul" language is most common among those who value
>> language the least, and those who value it the most.  For the former,
>> it is indeed from laziness and lack of imagination.  For the latter,
>> they are simply words which can be used to punctuate and accentuate.
 
> Well said, sir!  Examples from literature?  I can think of John Parlabane,
> but that's about it... I think my head has dried up and might blow away.

Thank you.

I was actually thinking of my first wife.  God she loves language, but I
heard things from her that I never heard from my father -- and my father
was a sailor.
 
I remember her telling me about having lunch at a fast food restaurant with
a friend who was a linguist, and was the head of a large writing program.
Her friend was "fucking" this, and "fucking" that when she noticed that
the other people waiting for food were moving away from them.  She
wondered what they would think if they knew that he was making decisions
regarding the literacy of their children.
 
 
Mark

Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: kucera@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (Therese Kucera)
Subject: Silverlock (Was Re: Quotes, quotes, quotes)
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 00:59:12 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.215759.20860@leland.Stanford.EDU> jbaxter@leland.Stanford.EDU (Joel Kent Baxter) writes:
>I can't place the quotes, but this post reminded me of a book I read several
>years ago that was practically a continuous allusion to a smorgasbord of 
>mythology, fairy tales, "classic" fiction, etc.  The book is <Silverlock>, by
>(I think) John Meyers Meyers (sp?).  Although not on the same "literary plane"
>as many of the books bandied about in this group, it was fun to wade through;
>obvious allusions to things like the <Odyssey> were mixed in with references
>to Russian folklore and Kipling.  As I recall, it got a warm reception from the
>speculative-fiction group of writers and readers.  Anybody out there read this,
>or know of some similar books?  Just curious...
>
>					JB
Yes, I read Silverlock and agree it was a lot of fun. It brings up a question
that I had been meaning to post here. A friend of mine and I have been
wondering about one of those Silverlock references in particular:

Can anybody tell me the source of the Lucus (Lucias?) Gil Jones
subplot, about the man who is turned into a donkey? I don't think it is
a reference to Pinocio or MidSummer Night's Dream. But I do think it
might be from the same source as the opera in Robertson Davies
_A_Mixture_of_Frailties_. ("The Golden Ass", if I remember correctly.
Can anyone tell me anything about the literary source for that?
						tak
					    	kucera@ucsu.colorado.edu


Newsgroups: rec.arts.books