From: heff@ki.ch.apollo.hp.com (God of Thunder)
Subject: Re: Legalizing drugs
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 14:19:32 GMT
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: heff@ki.ch.apollo.hp.com (God of Thunder)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories


> >Apparently, heroin was a fairly common and legal drug in the 1800's
and early
> >1900's.  There was no widespread murder or crime just to obtain a drug that
> >was easily obtainable, and tended to mellow a person out in the first place.
> >
> >The real problems for society begin when the drug is illegal and expensive.
> >

To start off with, I'd like to thank you for chopping out the reference I cited
supporting my comment on heroin use.  It's nice to be able to ignore
facts, isn't it?
(The reference was the Consumers Union report on drugs:
_Licit_and_Illicit_Drugs)

> Apparently you are not a current drug user nor have you ever used drugs
> addictivly. Correct? Of course drug use is associated with crime, when
> you look at the prisons in America and see that over 90% of the guests
> are there for crimes involving drugs and alcohol (not just mere possession).
> They were using drugs and alcohol when the crimes were committed. 

Wrong.  I use alcohol regularly, and can probably be considered to be
addicted to
both nicotine and caffeine.

Yes of course drug use is associated with crime - use of certain drugs has been
defined as a crime.  Nice statistic, but it does nothing at all to refute my 
assertion that a large part of the crime problem associated with drugs
has mainly
to do with the fact that drugs are illegal, turning simple consumers of
a substance
into criminals, and making those substances problematically expensive.


> The real problems for society do not involve the cost of the drug but the
> effect on society. Drugs and alcohol are the primary causes of dysfunction
> in families. Divorce, mate abuse, child abuse, loss of job and income are
> the real crimes to society. In a real sense, we are losing people to
> addiction. Healthy, productive people that support families and households
> are being lost every day. The cost of this is much greater that of stolen
> goods.

I agree with you that these are all serious problems within our society, and we
must try our best to find a solution.  However, I don't believe that
drugs (including
alcohol) are the root _cause_ of these problems.  Do you have statistics
or reasoning
that supports your assertion that "drugs are the primary causes of dysfunction
in families" ?  It's very difficult for me to believe that, since I
would probably
say that emotional and psychological problems in parents and in the way family
members interact with each other are more likely to be primary causes.

Your next to last sentence is interesting, too.  Is this based on some
facts, or
does it come from the propaganda that the War on (Some) Drugs has been
spewing ?
I agree that there are people that develop problems with drugs, but I
believe that
providing people with the true facts about these drugs would help the
problem more
than banning them.  Along with removing the illegal stigma attached to
them, so that
counseling will become more of a viable option for otherwise law-abiding
citizens.


Jeff Oesterle

================
"No, I don't know that atheists should be consedered as citizens, 
nor should they be considered patriots.  This is one nation under God."
                                         - George Bush
<choke> <cough> Say WHAT?!?!?!?
================

(Disclaim, disclaim, disclaim.)