HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: csk@wdl50.wdl.loral.com (Chuck Kuczaj)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Hardy's - Very Good German Cuisine
Date: 12 Jan 93 17:20:41 GMT
Organization: Loral Western Development Labs

Located on Evelyn Ave. at Sunnyvale Ave. in Sunnyvale, Hardy's offers
some of the most authentic German food I have had since leaving Germany
in 1981.  The atmosphere, is warm, clean and friendly.  Service is
competent and friendly, although not extraordinarily fast, although
this never posed a problem.

Recommendations:

Begin with a tall glass of Franziskaner Weiss Beer.  Slightly cloudy
from residual yeast, this beer is immensely refreshing when given a
little squeeze of lemon.  It definitely tastes like real German beer,
unlike the Becks/St.Pauli Girl/etc. imports, which don't resemble their
European counterparts.

Although entrees include soup, salad and dessert, I generally start off
with an appetizer.  The smoked trout with lingonberries and horseradish
is one of my favorites.  If you have a group, get both the smoked trout
and the baked brie with garlic.  They go very well together.

The bread is outstanding and authentic.  None of this soft stuff
Americans are accustomed to!  Served with a very-mildly-salted butter,
I could eat this as a meal with the beer mentioned above.

Salad is either a mixed-green with delicate vinaigrette, or pickled
celery root with a dill mayonnaise.  The latter is most interesting if
you've never had it before.

My favorite entrees include:

Rack of lamb in an herb crust.  I order it medium rare.  Although it
isn't a huge amount of meat, every piece is tender and mouthwatering.

Ziguenerschnitzel (Gypsy Schnitzel).  This was a special one time I
went there and had the most outstanding spicy paprika pepper sauce I
have ever had.

Desserts:

They normally have around 5 or so to choose from.  You just can't go
wrong here, although I must admit I lean toward the chocolate raspberry
torte when its available.

Prices:

Around $16 - $18 for entree which includes soup, salad, and dessert.  I
normally add on a couple of beers and split an appetizer, though, and wind
up spending around $30.  Not cheap, but worth it.  You'd better be
hungry if you go!
From: dan@BofA.com (Dan Brockman)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: China Moon
Date: 13 Jan 93 01:53:54 GMT
Organization: Bank of America, Capital Products, RMTG #5906

In article <ll3bhpINNstp@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> paular@kubiki.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>Has anyone eaten at this place? I believe it's in San Francisco. 
>

I ate there about 4 years ago.  It's one of those tony joints that serves
microscopic portions on a big beautiful plate.  The food was delish, and
the service was fine, and the atmo was high-tone, and the prices were fairly
pricey.  Twas a big hit when it opened.  The chef spun off from that 
exquisite mother of all fine restaurants in bezerkley as I recall.

-- 
 Daniel Brockman             tel 415-953-0406, fax 415-622-2892
 Bank of America, Dept 5906, 555 Calif St
 San Francisco 94104 USA    email uunet!odinba!dan dan@bofa.com
Newsgroups: ba.food
From: dkeisen@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dave Eisen)
Subject: Hong Kong East Ocean (was Re: Hong Kong FLower Lounge)
Organization: Sequoia Peripherals, Inc.
Distribution: ba
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 93 17:10:03 GMT

In article <73099@cup.portal.com> DeadHead@cup.portal.com (Bruce M Ong) writes:
>	
>	I just rediscovered a great place -- Hong Kong East Ocean in 
>Emeryville. Went there a couple of years ago for dinner and was very fond
>of the place. Then later on  I heard they changed owner or something, so 
>I kind of erased that name from my list. Last sunday morning for dim sum
>I went there with friends who were visiting me in the city, and we were all 
>totally amazed by the quality of the food, and the atomsphere of the place. 
>It's well worth the trip across the bay bridge.

Really? I was disappointed when I tried it a few weeks ago.

The view was wonderful (we got a table in an alcove right by
the window --- if it hadn't been foggy, the view would have
been *spectacular*.) The menu was the among the most varied I'd
seen, containing things like Chilled Chicken Paws Marinated with
Chinese Vegetable, Marinated Pig's Knuckle and Jelly Fish Combo,
Beef Organ, Steamed Shark's Fin Dumpling with Boullon, and Steamed
Beef Tripes with Ginger Scallion Sauce. Although I suppose it
is possible that other dim sum restaurants have a similar selection
and you just don't see these things if you're white. And the
food was all good. And the Wok-Charred Calamari with Chinese 
Five Spices was exceptional.

But every single dish we got that I have also gotten at Ming's
Villa was worse at HKEO than at Ming's. Every single one. That
includes the Stuffed Sweet Rice Wrapped with Lotus Leave, Deep
Fried Taro Root with Chive and Meat, Pan Fried Daikon Cake, and
Steamed Barbecue Pork Buns. Maybe I've been spoiled by learning
to eat dim sum at Ming's, but nowhere I've been on either coast
can compare.

I was also a little disappointed that we ordered from a menu
rather that doing the usual push cart thing. I like to see
what I'm getting before I order it. But my girlfriend said
it was just as well because back when they used carts at HKEO,
the aisles were too narrow to easily accomadate the carts and
there was all kinds of trouble getting the food around the 
restaurant. In particular, if you happened to be sitting far
from the kitchen, a lot of the carts didn't make it out your
way at all.

Overall, I give Hong Kong East Ocean around a B+. It was
very good and a very pleasant place to eat dim sum. But
it's no Ming's Villa.



-- 
Dave Eisen                               Sequoia Peripherals: (415) 967-5644
dkeisen@leland.Stanford.EDU              Home:                (415) 321-5154
       There's something in my library to offend everybody. 
          --- Washington Coalition Against Censorship
From: karl@uts.amdahl.com (Karl Rowley)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: whole fish wanted
Keywords: fish
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:03:05 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

Try National Foods in Santa Clara.  They are at the northeast corner of 
Lawrence and El Camino.  Besides lots of fish, they also have great produce.


-- 
 _______________________________________________________________________
| Karl Rowley      		|	karl@uts.amdahl.com		|
| Amdahl Corporation		|	{sun,ames}!amdahl!karl		|
| Santa Clara, California	|					|
|_______________________________|_______________________________________|
 [Any viewpoints expressed are my own, and do not necessarily reflect 
  those of Amdahl Corporation.]
From: jjh00@diag.amdahl.com (Joel Hanes)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: Culture for cheese.
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:01:52 GMT
Reply-To: jjh00@diag.amdahl.com
Organization: Amdahl Corporation  Sunnyvale California

>>RAJA@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU writes:
>
>>>A question a vegetarian friend asked me recently was about the cultures 
>>>used to make cheese. Is it made from extracts from intestines of calves? 
>>>I would appreciate an answer from the cognoscenti.


>wallich@ncd.com (Ken Wallich) writes:
>
>>Looking through my references, rennin is the actual substance that
>>causes the coagulation or 'culturing'.  Rennin is the chemical agent
>>found in rennet, and rennet is traditionally extracted from a calves'
>>stomach.


rchilder@us.oracle.com (Richard Childers) writes:
>
>I think it's a biological procedure, not a chemical procedure. When one
>says "culture", one is usually referring to a bacteriological colony of
>some sort.
>
>Probably a form of fungi ... a spore which may make its home in the
>stomach of cows, but which assuredly can be cultivated elsewhere.
>
>This is more analogous to making bread, or brewing ale, or culturing
>yogurt, I think.

Ken is absolutely correct --
Richard has conflated the curdling and ageing processes.

Curdling, the process of making semi-solid curds from
liquid milk, uses rennin.
It's a chemical process.
I don't know whether modern cheese makers use rennin derived
from animals.  Only the tiniest bit is required -- my frontier
husbandry books speak of making hundreds of pounds of cheese
with the rennet from a small piece of calf stomach.

After the curds are produced, they're pressed and aged.
The bacterial or fungal cultures introduced and grown during ageing
account for much of the individuality of various kinds of
cheeses -- they're the "blue" in Roquefort and blue cheese,
and give Camembert, Brie, etc much of their flavor.

---
Joel Hanes
From: sievertl@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Lisa Sieverts)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 17:33:25 GMT
Subject: Re: SQUAW BREAD - HELP
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: ba.food

Trader Joe's sells a product called Squaw Bread.  TJ's is in 
Menlo Park and San Rafael, and perhaps other locations.
From: josephs@msen.com (Joseph Stroup)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Bread Machines
Date: 10 Jan 1993 22:18:16 -0500
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com

 Anyone ever hear of a bread machine called the Zoji Model S-15.
 Its one of those home units. My wife has heard great things about
 it and I wanted some feedback. E-mail would be great.

 Thanks all.
-- 
Joseph Stroup  
Newsgroups: ba.food
From: georgew@hspice.portal.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: Hong Kong FLower Lounge
Organization: Meta - Software
Distribution: ba
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 00:26:30 GMT

In article <73099@cup.portal.com> DeadHead@cup.portal.com (Bruce M Ong) writes:

>	I just rediscovered a great place -- Hong Kong East Ocean in 
>Emeryville. Went there a couple of years ago for dinner and was very fond
>of the place. Then later on  I heard they changed owner or something, so 
>I kind of erased that name from my list. Last sunday morning for dim sum
>I went there with friends who were visiting me in the city, and we were all 
>totally amazed by the quality of the food, and the atomsphere of the place. 
>It's well worth the trip across the bay bridge.
>
>	I havent been back there for dinner in a couple of years, does anybody
>know if their dinner is just as good as their dim sum on weekends?

     This explains the variations I've seen at East Ocean.  I first tried
them a couple of years ago.  The dim sum started out as pretty good (especially
for East Bay Chinese), but declined to mediocre.  Service started out from bad
and became unbearable.

     About a year ago, I decided to try them out again when my kid brother was
visiting.  Instead of the usual roving patrols, they had a small form to check
off the number of items one wished of the various types.  I prefer the
traditional serving method, but in light of past service problems, I guess this
is acceptable.  The food had changed enough to pleasantly surpise me.  I went
away happy.

     Alas, despite my newly formed opinions, my usual dim sum crowd prefer we
go to the uniformly mediocre Lantern in Oakland's Chinatown.  I haven't been
back to East Ocean in sum time.  To make matters worse, now I've moved to the
South Bay.

     Highlights: excellent view, elegant dining room, good food, long wait for
a table.  Sorry, I haven't tried them for dinner.

							George


-- 
----
George J Wu,  Superior Maker of Technical Snafus,  georgew@metasw.com
Meta-Software,  1300 White Oaks Road,  Campbell, CA 95008,  (408) 369-5400
Never be the first to believe.  Never be the last to deceive.  ---  Chess
From: spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: Real Donuts[tm] Like They Make Back East
Date: 8 Jan 1993 06:45:18 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley -- ERL
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: zion.berkeley.edu

In article <C0IBrt.5L2@specialix.com> jim@specialix.com (Jim Maurer) writes:
>spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope) writes:
|
|>Part of the problem is there are no Dunkin' Donuts franchises
|>out here in California (except for one in I believe 
|>Inglewood).
|
|There is a Dunkin' Donuts on Camden Ave. in San Jose.  I think
|it's at Camden and Union.

Yeah, I knew it was somewhere in southern California.

Steve
From: hfg@physics11.berkeley.edu (H.F. (Rick) Goldstein)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: Need Wedding Cake Maker Recommendation
Date: 12 Jan 93 20:21:28 GMT
Organization: UC Berkeley Department of Physics
NNTP-Posting-Host: physics11.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: shannah@netcom.com's message of Tue, 12 Jan 1993 01:04:15 GMT


In article <1993Jan12.010415.1589@netcom.com> shannah@netcom.com (Teri Miller) writes:
   In article <colleen-110193101617@90.1.3.28> colleen@apple.com (Colleen Delgadillo) writes:
   >I am getting married in San Francisco on July 3rd and am for
   >recommendations on who to go to for wedding cakes. ...

   ...
   We got our wedding cake from Cocolat, and were absolutely delighted
   with it.  We dealt with the Cocolat at Stanford Shopping Center.  It 
   was really easy - we just looked through a book of frosting designs,
   told them what we wanted inside (chocolate cake with raspberry filling)
   decided on the size of cake, and that was it.  Our cake had ivory icing
   with white chocolate ruffles, and fresh red roses on it - lovely!

   I know there are a lot of bakeries out there that do a good job, but
   I felt Cocolat's designs were more unique than the designs I'd seen
   at bakeries.  YMMV, of course.
   ...

I must heartily second this recommendation for Cocolat.  Our wedding
cake was the Tri-color Mousse cake with fresh flowers decorating it.
Since this is not an iced cake, the visual effect is quite
spectacular, if somewhat nontraditional.  If you're looking for a more
'cakey' cake, they do a fabulous job with those as well.  My
sister-in-law just got married in December, and they chose the chocolate
cake with white chocolate icing, and again fresh flowers for
decoration.  Looked great and tasted better.  As you can see, our
family doesn't go in for white-on-white cakes, so I have a personal
bias for any place specializing in chocolate stuff.  Joe Bob says
check them out.

Incidentally, when we went there to look at cakes they were quite
generous with the free tastes :-) Also their Triple Chocolate Almonds
are to die for.

Rick (hfg@physics.berkeley.edu)
From: paul.moor@ggcs.org (Paul Moor) 
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: The Decline of the West
Date: 3 Jan 93 22:26:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Golden Gate Computer Society BBS - Marin, CA - 415-927-1216
Reply-To: paul.moor@ggcs.org (Paul Moor) 

[The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation broadcast this from the
annual week-long Salon de l'Agriculture, France's biggest agricul-
tural food fair, which attracts farmers from all over France.]

   . . . A large part of France's distinctiveness is on display
here, in the cheeses, the Champagnes, and the p.t.s the visitor
can sample at his leisure.  The people here have never had much
sympathy for the bureaucrats in Paris, but they fear even more the
[European Commission] ones in Brussels, who are now defining the
new rules of agricultural production.
   For this woman selling .foie gras., the new health-&-hygiene
standards being considered by Brussels could change the way things
have been done for generations.  Her finest p.t. is only half-
cooked; the EC could decide that only fully cooked .foie gras. can
be exported.
   The European standards aren't the only thing threatening French
.foie gras..  Here, at the "Quick" fast-food restaurant on the
Champs-Elys.es, business is brisk.  The English-only menu offers a
Big Tom 'amburGER, a Big Tom with baCON, and a kingfishburGER.
The French are turning more and more to fast and frozen foods.
   Sales of traditional foods have dropped so much that one cheese
a month is disappearing, due to lack of interest from the consum-
er.
   [Last time I checked, France had only about 365 different kinds
of cheese to lose.  - P. M.]
   This has the French government worried enough that it's commis-
sioned an inventory of traditional foods.  As well, the French
government has launched a program in schools to re.ducate chil-
dren's sense of taste:
   [With heavy French accent:] "First we explain them how to
taste, we give them the alphabet of tasting.  Then we tell them
that the milk doesn't come from the supermarket, as they think,
but that it comes from the cow - that the fish are not square,
like frozen fish, but that the fish come from the sea.  You might
laugh about that, but it's true that people's urban children have
no .chance. to see a cow, or to see a real fish."
   The man in charge of re.ducating the French palate is Alexandre
Lazaref, the flamboyant director of the National Council of
Culinary Arts: "We can't blame it on others.  We can't blame it on
Brussels, we can't blame it on industry.  If macdoNALD's or Burger
King are such a success in France, it's because the children and
the public want this kind of easy food.
   "There .is. a room for macdoNALD's.  I will make here a confes-
sion.  When I go to the movie, when I don't have much, I prefer to
go to macdoNALD's than to go to a French caf.!  It may sound
shocking, but a good macdoNALD's 'amburGER is better than a bad
.croque-monsieur.  Besides that, it happens to me once a month.
All the other times, when I want to have a proper meal, when I
cook myself, I want to .choose. what I have.  What we want to live
is the choice, and that is essential. . . ."

---
 . OLX 2.2 . Will consult for food.
From: jreece@sousa.intel.com (John Reece)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Chez Nous Hama (Was: South Bay Food)
Date: 12 Jan 93 17:39:35 GMT
Reply-To: jreece@sousa.intel.com
Distribution: ca
Organization: Intel - Information Technologies

In article <73385@cup.portal.com>, DeadHead@cup.portal.com (Bruce M Ong) writes:

> 	I would like to add <<Chez nous hama>> to the list for consideration.
> It's a rather quirky style -- california/french/japanese. Was there for the
> first time friday night, and altho everything wasnt *perfect* the food is
> close enough to rival Zuni's in SF.

Back when this was still "Hama Sushi" it got a certain amount of bad
press in the SJMN for clip-joint practices in their karaoke bar.   People 
would wander into the bar for a drink or two while waiting for their table.
Upon being called to their table they would be presented with a bar tab
that included a whopping cover charge.  My memory is a little fuzzy, but
it was at least $20 per person, and may have been as high as $50 per 
person.  I remember reading about this after taking someone there on a
first date and feeling quite relieved we hadn't dropped into the bar,
since quite an ugly scene would have ensued.  The food was pretty good.

This is third, evermore elegant incarnation of the same restaurant. 

-- 
John Reece			"This lifeboat is full"	
Not an Intel spokesman
From: jane@soave.swdc.stratus.com (Jane Beckman)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: Peninsula lunch lace to take a friend visiting from Japan?
Date: 9 Jan 93 01:24:16 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc., San Jose, CA

Light bulb comes on, as the Properly Elegant Place suddenly
comes to mind.  ;-)

The Lion and Compass, in Palo Alto(?).  (It's on the bayward
side of 101, near Lockheed.)  It's kind of yuppie, but I think
the way it exhudes Essence of Stockbroker kind of fits the
desired atmosphere, and I would describe the cuisine as
"California Novelle" without anything too outre.
--
  Jilara   [jane@swdc.stratus.com]

"Every now and then, a big rock falls out of the sky, and everyone has 
a *very bad* day."  --from the PBS "Dinosaurs" special.
Newsgroups: ba.food
From: jchokey@leland.Stanford.EDU (James Alexander Chokey)
Subject: Eiswein and Champagne for sale
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Distribution: ba
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 93 04:11:14 GMT

	I know that this is not a "for sale" group, but I thought I 
might get more response to this here than in ba.market.misc.  I apologize
in advance to all those who are upset by this violation of netiquette.


	I'm in a rather sticky financial situation right now and I'm 
hoping to sell some of my "wine collection" to help get me out of it. 

	I'm selling a demi-bouteille (i.e. 375 ml) of a 1985 Dr. Pauly 
Bergweiler Riesling Eiswein and a recent bottle of Veuve Clicquot Ponsardin
Champagne.  Both have been stored on their sides in a cool dark place and 
should be perfectly fine. 

	 I'd like to sell the Eiswein for $75 and the Champagne for $28 
(or $100 on the nose if you want them both).  This is slightly less than what 
I paid for each of them (I'm losing some money on this) and it should less 
than you can find them for in stores.  (If you can find either one of these
for less in stores, please let me know and I'll drop my asking price
accordingly.)

	If you're interested in buying one or both of these, or if you have 
further questions, please send an e-mail message to 
jchokey@leland.stanford.edu or call me at (415) 497-1398.

	--  Jim C. <jchokey@leland.stanford.edu>		
	


From: wentao@hpindda.cup.hp.com (Wentao Shu)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:53:44 GMT
Subject: SQUAW BREAD - HELP
Organization: HP Information Networks, Cupertino, CA
Newsgroups: ba.food

If you know of any place selling Squaw Bread, please drop me a note.  I have
been looking for it all over and still can not find it.  Thank you.

Wentao
From: HF.JGW@forsythe.stanford.edu (Weitz, Janet)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: whole fish wanted
Date: 3 Jan 1993 23:22:01 -0800
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: morrow.stanford.edu

In article <1992Dec30.011721.16211@lucid.com>,
sap@lucid.com (Synthia Petroka) writes:
>I'm looking for a fish market between San Jose and Menlo Park that sells whole
>fish.  I've been to a few and they mostly carry fillets or whole trout.  I'd
>like something a little more interesting than trout.  Big scales and fancy
>fins are a plus!
>

Have you looked at Cook's seafood in Menlo Park on El Camino?  I
guess they are mostly "filet" folks - but I would guess they could
do anything you like - and I haven't seen better quality in the
immediate area.

JW
From: haynes@fivenine.apple.com (Charles Haynes)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: Peninsula lunch lace to take a friend visiting from Japan?
Date: 6 Jan 93 20:14:15 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Apple Computer Inc.

In article <1993Jan6.185502.22530@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> paulf@umunhum.stanford.edu (Paul Flaherty) writes:
>In article <1993Jan6.075544.902@netcom.com> tenney@netcom.com (Glenn S. Tenney) writes:
>>So, I'm looking for some suggestions please.

>Some place American, eh?  My suggestion would be a good bar and grill; around
>Stanford, in order, try:

>1. The Dutch Goose
>2. Pudley's
>3. The Oasis

>If the bar aspect bothers you, try Kirk's (about 1.2 on the above scale).

Given that Glenn was treated to a full sushi dinner, taking his guest to
the Goose seems, "inappropriate" at least. (Don't get me wrong, I love
the Goose, I'm a regular there, but it's just not comparable.)

I would recommend the Flea Street Cafe, right across the street from the
Goose. I would characterize it as "fancy California Cuisine" others might
call it "pretentious yuppy food." The atmosphere is quiet and elegant, the
presentation is impeccable, the ingredients are fresh and local, the
recipes are original, innovative, and characteristically Californian; best
of all the food is very good.

Another alternative would be a good steak. Not being a big steak fan I can't
provide any suggestions myself, but I've heard good things about MacArthur
Park.

	-- Charles
From: lazzaro@boom.CS.Berkeley.EDU (John Lazzaro)
Newsgroups: ba.food
Subject: Re: Where to eat near Bill Graham Civic Auditorium?
Date: 8 Jan 1993 21:11:11 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: boom.cs.berkeley.edu

In article <42043@unix.SRI.COM> maslak@unix.SRI.COM (Valerie Maslak) writes:
>In article <1ikjft$5mn@agate.berkeley.edu> bedk@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (Brian E.D. Kingsbury) writes:
>>|> 2) A little further away on Hayes, the famous, expensive and good
>>|>    "Hayes Street Grill"
>The food it good, but you HAVE to have a reservation, in my
>experience.

I was pretty unimpressed with "Hayes Street Grill" on my only visit,
I've had better-prepared swordfish at places which don't even
specialize in seafood ... maybe it was a bad day ... or maybe its
not a place for someone who's seafood-heaven restaurant is Gladstone's
in Malibu.