HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sc1u+@andrew.cmu.edu (Stephen Chan)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: If these postings are a representative sample of the arts...
Date: 17 Apr 92 01:57:21 GMT
	<1992Apr16.141427.1@gallua>
Organization: Comp & Comm - Telecommunications, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


	Beware, levity zone ahead...

CADS_COLE@GALLUA.BITNET (Kevin Cole; Washington DC) writes:
> What I got, for most of the two-hundred postings I read, was a far cry from 
> anything resembling information for a beginner.

	Well...you could always ask for the the FAQ.

>  Most of it appeared to revolve 
> around: "Oh yeah?  Well, I studied thus-and-such, and I'll whup your
> pansy ass any day!" or "What do you mean, philosophy?  I'm doing
> this because it's a war zone outside my door.  Kill or be killed."
> or "Bruce is the greatest", "No he snot", "Yes he is", "I came here
> for an argument".

	Even dedicated martial artists, who strive for physical
perfection, spiritual cultivation and universal benevolence should be
allowed to be goofy and immature now and then.
	It just so happens that, as Zen wannabes, we live in the
present, so we're always goofy and immature.

> I'm sorry if I offended any of you, but that's honestly the impression I got 
> from the majority of postings I read yesterday.  That was the first time that
> I 
> had checked out the newsgroup, although I've been a long-time regular on some 
> of the professional interest lists.
> 

	Oh YEAH! Well OUR newsgroup can beat up ANY of those other
weenie newsgroups!

> Granted, there were postings on technique (Faced with situation X, would you 
> use kick Y, kick Z or punch A?)  But to a beginner, there's not much help 
> there.
> 
	Most of the beginner questions are answered on the FAQ. That's
it's raison d'etre.
	What kind of basic stuff are you interested in? Basic
techniques? If you are a beginner, then odds are that you won't be
able to learn much technique from someone's news article.
	There are billions of details which go into the most basic
technique. You have to learn how to stand correctly, how to position
your feet, how to move your feet efficiently and safely. How to
coordinate the movements of the upper & lower body...
	I'm not being condescending (honest!).
	The only way to learn that stuff is from an experienced teacher.

> Since my posting yesterday, I've seen several replies which lead me
> In any case, I think I will follow the advice given by several
> people here, and ignore this newsgroup to go find some *REAL*
> students and teachers. -- 
> 

	See?? If you hadn't posted something to the group, those nice
people wouldn't have sent you mail!
	While most of the stuff on the newsgroup is silliness, if you
post a question, odds are that someone will respond, either privately
or publicly.

Stephen Y. Chan		Programmer Analyst	CMU Telecommunications
stevec+@cmu.edu		(412)268-5115 [me] 	(412)268-4987 [FAX]
From: enute1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Eric J. Nute)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: good movies
Summary: Please tell what the best movies are
Keywords: advice, movies
Date: 6 Apr 92 18:52:40 GMT
Reply-To: enute1@cc.swarthmore.edu
Organization: Swarthmore College

Greetings fellow martial arts film lovers,
	My friends and I are planning a small martial arts film fest, but our actual
knowledge of film titles and quality are small.  Would you please help me!  
Would you recommend the best Jackie Chan movie and the best Bruce Lee movie. 
Winning two movies in each category will be selected.  Please sent me email
replies.  If anyone wants to see the results of this little informal survey, I
could post them, but right now we just want to get this underway.  Thank you
very much for your time.

Sincerely,
Eric J. Nute <enute1@cc.swarthmore.edu> 
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: cynthia@ll.mit.edu (Cynthia Eldridge)
Subject: Re: novice to master of basics to novice
Originator: cynthia@ll.mit.edu (Cynthia Eldridge)
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory, Lexington MA
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 19:43:51 GMT


In article <MARY.92Apr8100922@martinique.Cayman.COM>, mary@Cayman.COM (Mary Malmros) writes:
|> 
|> In article <1992Apr7.060352.997@craycos.com> sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi) writes:
|> 
|>    In article <1992Apr6.110713.1525@brandonu.ca> lampij@brandonu.ca writes:
|> 
|>    Hmmm, then how does he hold his uwagi ("jacket") together? More to the
|>    point, how does *she*...
|> 
|> That is why Jigoro Kano invented the Jogbra.  ;-)
|> 
|> Seriously...we wear belts at all ranks, but it's pretty common for
|> the top to come undone, start falling off the shoulders, etc. during
|> a vigorous workout (or even a not-so-vigorous workout...mass-produced
|> jammies aren't known for their good fit).  Some women wear t-shirts, 
|> but most of us just wear a jogbra or something like that and let it
|> all hang out.  I've never heard the guys comment, so I assume they're
|> all either oblivious, blase, polite, or intimidated.  ;-)
|> 
|> Oh, Yiiiiiiiiilllllmaaaaaaaazzzzzz????  Care to comment?
|> --
|> 
|> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|>  Mary Malmros    | Cayman Systems Inc, 26 Landsdowne St, Cambridge, MA 02139
|>  mary@cayman.com | Phone 617-494-1999  Fax 617-494-5167  AppleLink CAYMAN.TECH
|> 

How about sewing extra ties in the chest area on your uniform top?  It 
helps keeps the top orderly and out of the way.  It also can help prevent 
other students from being distracted (a jogbra isn't very concealing,
after all).

Some of the male members of my club have told me in private that they 
were quite distracted by one woman's top that kept opening.  They were
too embarrassed to speak to her themselves.  It may be true in your club,
too.

I kind of wish that men would put extra ties on their tops.  Seeing some
of those chests distracts me!

--

Cynthia
cynthia@ll.mit.edu
From: mary@Cayman.COM (Mary Malmros)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Fashions (was: Black Belt)
Date: 6 Apr 92 13:25:36 GMT
Organization: Cayman Systems Inc., Cambridge, MA
In-reply-to: acharya@HYDRA.ROSE-HULMAN.EDU's message of 5 Apr 92 00:33:58 GMT


In article <1992Apr5.003358.12464@cs.rose-hulman.edu> acharya@HYDRA.ROSE-HULMAN.EDU writes:

   In article <1992Apr4.033720.22277@alw.nih.gov>, drury@helix.nih.gov (Richard Drury) writes:

   >So tell me folks, am I the only one who doesn't iron?  I pressed a
   >dobok once (truthfully, just talked my SO into pressing it for me)...

OOOOOH!  Richard doesn't iron!  I'm gonna TELL!!!

My doboks are cotton, so they don't go in the dryer, so I gotta iron them.

	   speaking of which, has anyone ironed/drycleaned a hakama? "don't, or
   the pleats will go!" shrieked a black belt when i asked him. "never
   have...ever" is the other comment i have heard. 

   so what do i do...dryclean/wash&iron or just wear it till it falls to pieces?

My sensei washes his and throws it in the dryer, then pulls it out and 
folds it immediately.  He claims this works because it's permanent 
press, and that as mine is also permanent press, I can do the same.
My personal opinion is that he secretly spent about 20 years practicing
origami-do, and that I'm more likely to end up, as Stephen Chan once
said, "wearing a big black amoeba."  I think, when it becomes necessary, 
I'll either look for the best dry-cleaner in town, or summon my 
courage and try the washer-dryer-permanent-press method. 
--


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Mary Malmros     | Cayman Systems Inc, 26 Landsdowne St, Cambridge, MA 02139
 mary@cayman.com  | Phone 617-494-1999  Fax 617-494-5167  AppleLink CAYMAN.TECH
From: mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Real Martial Artists
Date: 13 Apr 92 21:46:28 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

In article <1992Apr11.183634.28400@cs.rose-hulman.edu> acharya@HYDRA.ROSE-HULMAN.EDU writes:
>
>	what is a "thorick chow tape"? was it a tai chi tape that was
>mentioned a while (month or two) ago?

Thorick made a videotape that showed some basic illustrations
of martial aspects of T'ai Chi Chuan. Dave Smythe and I
were fortunate enough to enjoy a viewing when Thorick
consented to visit us a couple of weeks ago. Not only is the
videotape enlightening and entertaining, I can say the
same things about Thorick himself, who is a delightful
person.
From: mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Taekwondo
Date: 10 Apr 92 21:45:12 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA


Mary:

>  >>I agree re: TKD Times, but I read the first issue of Inside Taekwondo and
>  >>thought it was solid Cheez Whiz (Velveeta?).  Jumping turning side kick
>  >>to the head as a counter to a reverse punch, INDEED!  
>  >

Lauren:

>  >   .... too simple for ya, right, Mary?
>  >
>  >-Lauren

Mary:

>Exactly!  What's wrong with a 360 roundhouse followed by a jumping axe kick?

My embryonic sensitivity to chi detects an opportunity
arising: HHHMMMZZZZZZZZZZZ....

 Time for a new thread! Counters That Are Not Too Simple!

Countering a reverse punch:

Evade outside the punch, touching the outside of the
arm lightly to cause the opponent to slightly overbalance.
As she compensates by shifting her weight, fake a sweep
to the leading leg. When she shifts her weight backward
and lifts her front foot to evade the sweep, pretend to
shove her over backwards. Of course, she'll try to
prevent the shove with a straight punch to your face,
so forward flip over her head, alighting behind her.
Now pivot and cause a burst of chi to explode from your
outstretched hand, knocking her on her face.

Once you've got that down, we can try something a
little more complex.
From: mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: 2 questions. Please read.
Date: 10 Apr 92 16:36:03 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

In article <cdsqbSy00Uh7E8M5lW@andrew.cmu.edu> jm50+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jason Piers McDonald) writes:
>Aaron Cammarata writes,
>>1)
>>	In the unfortunate event that you're attacked, say on the street
>somewhere, an
>>d you're not stretched out, as you would be before and during training,
>how do 
>>you deal with it?  Obviously, kicks aren't going to be as high,
>>and the danger of a sprain or tear is much higher.  How do you cope? 

A fellow student was just recently assaulted in a bar by
three other patrons. They used the time-honored-in-the-movies
technique of two people holding his arms while the third
punched him.

His solution was to ride with and slip the punches while
simulating great pain and discomfort. (The practice of
slipping and rolling with punches is not to be underestimated).
He said his thought was that if he appeared helpless his
attackers would eventually get careless. In fact, he was
right. The puncher took a straight step in leaving
his groin open, and the student kicked him hard. As he
doubled over, the student kicked him in the face.

That left two people holding him. He said he lifted his 
legs to simulate a sudden collapse. As the assailants
'helped' him to his feet he got his legs behind them and 
threw them. One got up to continue the attack; he
used an attack straight out of our beginning tiger
form, but modifying the rip across the face to a slap
so that it merely jarred the fellow instead of scarring
him.

After that they left him alone.
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Friday, 10 Apr 1992 17:11:14 CDT
From: Yvonne A. McLean <U58294@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Ouch! Groin kick
 <PITARO.92Apr8151518@sneezy.sanders.lockheed.com> <52883@mimsy.umd.edu>

Guys, the funniest is real life.  Some of the best laugh I get is watching guys
 reactions to a groin hit.  I once accidentally hit my boyfriend in the groin,
he hit the wall, rolled from one end of a king size bed to the end, hit the flo
or.  I did not stop laughing for the entire night.
From: sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: novice to master of basics to novice
Date: 7 Apr 92 06:03:52 GMT
Organization: Cray Computer Corporation

In article <1992Apr6.110713.1525@brandonu.ca> lampij@brandonu.ca writes:
>
>
>The karate belt/rank system...
>
>	There has been a lot of interest here on the rank of black
>	belt and its significance.  I have heard some interesting tales

Oh, no! Not again!!!!

>
>	The beginner is given the white belt...  This is withheld in some clubs
>	until the begginer has successfully completed a given number of classes

Hmmm, then how does he hold his uwagi ("jacket") together? More to the
point, how does *she*...

<rest of fable deleted, since it's been posted about 3000 times already>

>	I hope someone finds this of interest.  If you have a version of 
>	this or any other explanation about the belt/rank system of your
>	style, let us all know!!!

Well, gosh...there's this terminally ill kid in the UK who'd *love*
to have you write this on a get-well card so he can get in the Guiness
book...unless, of course, one of those blind, albino alligators swam
up from the sewers and ate him. May I suggest the creation of
"alt.folklore.martial"...;-)

Actually, the origin of the rank system is pretty well documented. Pick
up a good history book on the Japanese martial arts, turn to the index,
look up the name "Kano, Jigoro", and read what it has to say. 

Steve
From: gevel@kub.nl (A.J.W. van de Gevel)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Training weekend Shito-ryu in The Netherlands
Keywords: Shito-ryu
Date: 6 Apr 92 10:11:39 GMT
Organization: Tilburg University, Tilburg, The Netherlands


	Dear Networkers,

	I would like your attention for a karate training camp in The
Netherlands. It is being held in Tilburg on 25th and 26th of april. The
style is Shito-ryu and sensei Nakahashi will teach various techniques:
the training camp is open for all styles, but most of the techniques
will be indigenous to Shito-ryu. The schedule:

Saturday 25th april:
	10:00 - 12:00 am
	14:00 - 16:00 pm

Saturday Evening: social program: A GREAT PARTY

Sunday 26th april:

	10:00 - 12:00 am
	14:00 - 16:00 pm

Free lodgings in the dojo are available.

For more information e-mail to: gevel@kub.nl or rutger@kub.nl
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: State of mind (chan)
Date: 17 Apr 92 17:32:18 GMT
Organization: Software Engineering Institute

>	The other night I was going down a flight of stairs in the
>dark. I was going down them very quickly and easily, then I looked
>down and thought to myself "Hey, I can't see the stairs, where do I
>put my foot next?"
>	I immediately lost the rhythm and tottered around for a second
>or two before telling myself "I think too much."

When I was practicing violin consistently, this would often take the form of
thinking about the complex actions that my fingers were performing.  Suddenly
I couldn't play at all.  It reminds me of the story spiritualists like to 
cite about the 1000-legger who started thinking about how to walk.
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Funakoshi
Date: 10 Apr 92 20:21:03 GMT

>>simply never taught by the Chinese (Funakoshi developed his art directly from
                                     ^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^ ^^^ ^^^ ^^^^^^^^ ^^^^
>>the Chinese), have in essence eviscerated the form.  
 ^^^ ^^^^^^^
>>


> Where on God's green Earth did you come up with THAT?

Actually, someone on this very bboard, a karateka no less, posted a rather
lengthy history of Shotokan, including Funakoshi's original attribution to the
source art.  I believe the translation of karate as a character incidentally
can carry two meanings, one meaning is China, the other "open."  In any case,
there are far more qualified historians on this bb than I.  But, as I
understand it, it was some Japanese official who intervened to force Funakoshi
to "de-Chinafy" the name of his art to mean "open hand."  If you make me go
to the work, I will dig up the sources, although I am sure I can find them--
so many others on this bboard have posted this stuff before.
From: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Bully seminar, outline
Date: 7 Apr 92 13:11:37 GMT
Reply-To: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt)
Organization: Naval Surface Warfare Center

Thank you for all the help in devloping the bully seminar.  I
will include the outline that I am proposing to my Master tomorrow
night.  Suggestions are welcome.  If you find this useful in part
or whole feel free to use it in your own classes.

			Bully Seminar
			Stephen Northcutt
			Target Audience 7 - 11 yr olds

Premise:
Something is different when you are growing up and have studied
MA for a couple years and have to deal with a bully, because
(as a first resort anyway) you can't use the vast majority of
the techniques you have practiced.

MA is not just front snap kicks and single whips it is also 
about mental disciple and self control.

References:
	Double Edged Sword
	Rec.Martial-Arts

Begin seminar with a good warmup and some of the practice techniques
listed in the techniques section so burn off some of their energy.

Seminar Outline:

	The "Center"
		Self Control
		Balance
		Meditation and the MA

	Bullies and Victims
		What is a bully?

		What is a victim?


	Strategies
		Your Goal: Realize your self worth.
			  You are a special person.
			  You are able to study MA. 
			  You are a good student.

		ROUNDTABLE: what makes you special?

		So, if a bully says something mean to you:
		"your ugly"  that doesn't make it true.
		You should be able to laugh that off, because
		you KNOW you are special.  Hold fast to your
		center.
			
		MA teaches mental discipline and this is the
		most important thing in dealing with a bully.
		A bully needs for you to feel scared or hurt.

		When a bully says something mean, try:

			Change the subject
			Try humor
			Direct reasoning (what is wrong here?)
			Appeal to authority
			Face trouble now or later
			Give ONE worning
			Defend yourself

	Stories: ROUNDTABLE: Does anyone have a story about a
			     bully they will share?
			     (take notes)

	Discussion: Choose a couple of the stories.  What might
		    XXX have done differntly?  What else might
		    have happened?

	Role Playing: Act out a couple of the stories, let XXX
		      be the bully, switch roles.


	BREAK

	MA Techniques

		A word about targets:
			Blood and AIDS
			Try not to leave a mark
			One good punch may do it

		A word about techniques:
			As you practice so will you fight

		Blocks and slipping punches

		Straight punch to stomach 
		(The straight punch is a HUGE technical advantage)
			Horseback riding stance
			fighting stance

		Front snap kick to stomach.

		Roundhouse kick to thigh

		Step on foot and push

		Front snap kick or knee to groin

		Headlock escape

		Grabbing techniues


	Review

===================================================================
   ** my dream: voice, video, data, 3 services, 1 network **
===================================================================

Stephen Northcutt (snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil)     Networks Program Manager
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: david@xlnt.com (David Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Jow Ga
Date: 8 Apr 92 17:04:00 GMT
Organization: XLNT Designs, Inc (XDI)

In article <Mds8UFe00iU4EBXqZ6@andrew.cmu.edu>, sc1u+@andrew.cmu.edu (Stephen Chan) writes:
|> 
|> 	A friend of mine saw an ad in Inside Kung-Fu for Jow Ga
|> Kung-Fu. He's seriously considering running off for 3 years to study
|> Jow Ga.
|> 	Does anyone out there know anything about this school (it's in
|> or around Washington, DC)? They're advertising for live-in students
|> who are willing to devote 3 years of their life to learning the system
|> & spreading it around, in return for free instruction and free room
|> and board. But they have to train 7 days a week.
|> 
|> 	(hey, a 3 year black belt program!)

I would like to know how they can afford to do this.  I wonder what kind of
financial commitment after "graduating" the students have.  The instructor
must and should be compensated in some way.

If that is really their program, those 3 years are probably equivalent to a part
time program (the ones most people have) for 12 or more years.

-- 
David Johnson
XLNT Designs, Inc. (XDI)
david@xlnt.com
the hapa haole
(or more precisely the hakka haole)
(or even more precisely, the hapa hakka hapa haole, or h^4)
From: mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: 2 questions. Please read.
Date: 10 Apr 92 16:45:07 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

In article <22592@dog.ee.lbl.gov> jtchew@csa3.lbl.gov writes:
>So what about those situations when you have to fight while not
>at your best?  Worth thinking about, and I'm not just talking
>about doing a jump spinning back kick in a street brawl to impress
>the girls without having stretched. :)  Some scenarios:

[...]

>* Coming out of a restaurant, you're stuffed and maybe just a
>  little unsteady.  Hello, Mr. Mugger...

[...]

One of the peculiarities of Chinese martial arts in
general and shaolin styles in particular is that
there are all these weird styles. I mean, monkey?
white eyebrow? golden centipede? drunken?

Grandmaster The' says you have to be 'twice sober'
to do drunken style well, but I've often wondered
if one purpose of the style isn't to train you
to cope well with being momentarily off-balance
or otherwise indisposed. The forms have lots
of staggering, falling, rolling, and whirling
movements. It has occurred to me that one consequence
of this is that when you trip or stumble, your
body recognizes the sensation and recovers quickly;
stumbling isn't an emergency, it's just another
way of walking.

I could be reading too much into the styles, but,
as I say, I often wonder if those monks were
intentionally trying to teach students how to
move well from *any* random position or movement.
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: tac@cs.brown.edu (Ted A. Camus)
Subject: Re: Meaning???
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1992 19:19:06 GMT


> Dakin Burdick <burdickd@copper.ucs.indiana.edu> writes:
>>ngqtuan@milton.u.washington.edu (Tuan Nguyen) writes:

>>we have to sit down on our feet & rest our hands
>>on the knees with palm facing up, back straight ..., 

>instead went straight from a kneeling position to a cross-legged
>meditation pose (back upright, breath in through nose, down through
>spine, up the throat and out the nose).

  
   I've found that I tend to slouch a lot in the cross-legged position.
   Lovret mentions in TW&TP that monks who sit cross-legged often sit 
   on a pillow to help keep their backs straight --

   -- Ted --

==========================================================
  Ted Camus                          Box 1910 CS Dept 
  tac@cs.brown.edu                   Brown University
  tac@browncs.BITNET                 Providence, RI 02912
From: lampij@brandonu.ca
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Choosing a martial art - effectiveness?
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:55:17 GMT
Organization: Brandon University, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

In article <31037@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk>, tk@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Tommy Kelly) writes:
> Like another poster, I am trying to choose a martial art.  Some of you
> will have heard from me before - when I was looking for input on sel-training
> in karate.
> 
> Well I now find myself with some time to train, but rather than just settle
> with shotokan karate, I thought I'd consider a wider range.
> 
> MY PRIMARY REQUIREMENT is an effective self-defence skill.  I understand that
> some of you may feel that that is a lesser requirement, and I respect your
> opinion - but for me, self-defence is number one.
> 
> I AM interested in mental discipline - but I don't require that from martial
> art training.
> 
> I AM interested in physical fitness - but again, if a particular martial art
> doesnt provide that (and instead demands supplementary fitness work) thats fine.
> 
> I am NOT interested in meditation, zen, pseudo- (or actual-) religious
> philosophies.  
> 
> I want to learn an effective method of unarmed self-defence - period.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So any thoughts on this?
> 
> 
> 
> tommy


		Try boxing.


douglas lampi

lampij@brandonu.ca