HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: William.J..Vital@f430.n107.z1.fidonet.org (William J. Vital)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Afa training..
Date: 8 Nov 92 05:43:00 GMT


         Kevin Agard sent

  >>good. What do you guys think? Should I get the AFA and then get more
  >>training, or go right to further training? And, is the Red Cross
Prehospital medicine has evolved dramatically over the past 20 years.
AFA was, in it's time, the standard of care. This was at a time when
ambulance crews basically ran "scope and swoop" operations. Although If
you do want to help others the answer to your question should be
obvious. Ask yourself this: If you were lying in the street critically
injured, who would you want taking care of you, someone with 40 hours of
training (AFA), or someone with triple that training (EMT).

I kinda agree with Kevin...More training is required than Red Cross AFA.
I suggest you check with the First Aid/Rescue Squad where you are. Most
states/localities require the AFA prior to joining and the Emergency
Medical Technician-Ambulance (EMT-A) certificate obtained within the
first year. Well that's New Jersey anyway. Different areas are
different. Federal regulations mandate the EMT training (Federally
recognized EMT training). In the 23+ years I've been on our local
FA/Rescue Squad, we've gone from "Scoop and run" to "Treat, Stablize,
THEN Transport." Now tramatic Shock injury is MUCH less than it was 20
years ago and patient care is exponentially better. Good luck and I hope
to hear from you again...There's probably quite a few of us out here
who'd like to know how you're making out. L8R Bill EMT-A (NJ)
===
 * TLX v1.55* Don't ask me--I'm making this up as I go!


 * Origin: The Shadowlands BBS (1:107/430.0)
From: deglop@dewey.EEAP.CWRU.Edu (Jacob DeGlopper)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Re: Hazard Lights on Emergency Vehicles
Summary: Wild subjective claims debunked?
Keywords: beacon strobe siren CHP
Date: 7 Nov 92 00:55:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: usenet.1df45kINN4dm
Organization: Dept. of Electrical Engineering, CWRU, Cleve. OH
NNTP-Posting-Host: dewey.eeap.cwru.edu

In article <01GQTSTKRAIA96WI06@ritvax.isc.rit.edu> TRAUMA JUNKIE <JAT8419@RITVAX.BITNET> writes:

>TOO many lights are dangerous.  Studies showed that red and blue lights draw
>fatigued and drunk drivers directly at your vehicle.  I was shown pictures and

>        Strobes are hopefully on the way out.  Studies show that they can cause
>seizures in the epileptic pt.

>driver has his window closed and normal car noise like light music your siren
>range is as follows....
 
>Wail   200 ft.
>Yelp 150 ft
>Electronic air horn  6 ft
>Phaser 100 ft.

I'd be _extremly_ interested in seeing any references you can provide to
support these last two claims.  I have attempted to do research in this
field, and there has been very little if any serious study in this branch
of applied optics in the last 20 years.  The researchers responsible for
the NBS's "Emergency Vehicle Warning Lights: State of the Art", which was
published in 1973, have long since retired.  There have been many, many
_subjective_ articles in Firehouse, Emergency!, and now JEMS -- none of
these have used any controlled techniques to study the problem in question. 

I am aware of the CHP study concerning the "draw" of beacons on a vehicle
parked on the side of the road; I do not recall a correlation between color
and attractiveness. 

Strobes (and rotators) on emergency vehicles generally fire 1-3 times a
second; the frequencies that initiate photic seizures are closer
to the 8-13 Hz of the alpha waves.  The Swedish strobe study showed some
difficulty placing the location of a strobe system due to the extreme
ratio of time on to time off, and some disorientation of those working
right next to a multiple strobe system, but no seizures.

I have never seen a scientific study that quotes distances sirens may be
audible.  I do not understand why changing the speed of the cycles would
change the distance it would be audible.  How do you account for the
differences in power between various siren configurations, various speaker
mounting locations, speaker designs, ambient noise, and variations in car
design? 

> There is no safe was to cross an intersection but to STOP and make eye
> contact and proceed slowly.  Don't put your life in the hands of a
> machine. 

I agree with your conclusions.  Warning devices do not grant you the
right of way; they request it.
-- 
         Jacob DeGlopper, EMT-A, Wheaton (MD) Volunteer Rescue Squad
            -- CWRU Biomedical Engineering - jrd5@po.cwru.edu --
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Date:         Sat, 7 Nov 1992 22:17:00 GMT
From:         Daniel Burstein <0001964967@MCIMAIL.COM>
Subject:      to:WB7TPY via emerg-l (w/apolog to all others)

apologies for taking up the bandwith, but I'm trying
to respond to the person in this msg, and can't
seem to get through directly

(We've all had this problem once or twice...)
<dburstein@mcimail.com

Date:     Sat Nov 07, 1992 10:05 pm  GMT
Source-Date: Sat, 7 Nov 92 23:54 EET
From:     uucp
          EMS: INTERNET / MCI ID: 376-5414
          MBX: uucp@kudu.ru.ac.za

TO:       Daniel Burstein / MCI ID: 196-4967
TO:       0001964967
          EMS: INTERNET / MCI ID: 376-5414
          MBX: kudu!mcimail.com!0001964967@kudu.ru.ac.za
Subject:  Undeliverable Mail
Message-Id: 70921107220507/0003765414NA1EM
Source-Msg-Id: <m0mny6b-000Mh1C@kudu.ru.ac.za>

This mail message is undeliverable.
(Probably to or from system 'namibia')
It was sent to you or by you.
Sorry for the inconvenience.

	Sincerely,
	kudu!uucp

#############################################
##### Data File: ############################
From mcimail.com!0001964967 Sat Oct 31 11:07:26 1992 remote from kudu
Received: from MCIGATEWAY.MCIMail.com by kudu.ru.ac.za with smtp
	(Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0mlEma-000MgbC; Sat, 31 Oct 92 11:06 EET
Received: from mcimail.com by MCIGATEWAY.MCIMail.com id aa27272;
          31 Oct 92 8:59 GMT
Date: Sat, 31 Oct 92 09:03 GMT
From: Daniel Burstein <0001964967@mcimail.com>
To: ham-test <wb7tpy@wb7pty.az.usa.na>
Subject: test msg
Message-Id: <10921031090301/0001964967NA3EM@mcimail.com>

Good day. caught your post to Emerg-L about
st. Josephs Med Ctr.  Noticed that you're
on ham packet.  So thought I'd see if this
could gateway across.
  Pls advise if this gets to you.
thanks
danny  <dburstein@mcimail.com>
   Paramedic, trouble maker, and KB2ddy
From: Karl.Kurtz@f50.n308.z1.fidonet.org (Karl Kurtz)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Re: Mace/tear gas
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1992 11:30:58 -0800

 -=> Quoting Kirk Smith to All <=-

 KS> I'm looking for distributors of chemical Mace tear-gas weapons.  I

Try looking in a current copy of SHOT GUN NEWS (Available at you news
stand)
There is a multitude of vendors throughout the country.

			Karl.


... Nobody notices when things go right.
 * Origin: Jet Blast BBS (1:308/50.0)
From: Cary.Eastwood@f17.n275.z1.fidonet.org (Cary Eastwood)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: About the program: j
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1992 05:09:00 -0800

WC>I think that they were trying to get kids to remember to call 9-1-1
if
WC>there is an emergency.  I think I read something about it.

WC>Anyway, while we're on the subject of realism, what does anyone
think
WC>about Code 3, or On Scene - Emergency Response?
WC>---
WC> * TNet 2.2  FIRENET * Wake EMS BBS * Raleigh * NC * (919) 856-6023
WC> * PCRelay:TANDY: RaceNet: TandyLand 803-875-2093/ 803-875-2019
It is like somebody else was talking about on a Law Enforecemt
conference on another net, It shows what is going on, but they cut out
the slow stuff just to get to the real exciting stuff.  They out to
ballance the exciting stuff with the slow stuff  You cannot exprence
what goes on unless you are a cop or like me and EMT. The exciement and
stuff.  I've heard that all cops fire fighters and EMT/Paramedics to a
smaller extent are adrealin junkies.  I do it because I want to help.
 * OLX 2.1 TD * I'm in shape ... round's a shape isn't it?
 * RaceNet: Nasty Old Lady BBS * 805-528-7341 USR D/S * Los Osos, CA

PCRelay:CAROLINA -> #480 RaceNet (tm)
4.11                RaceNet: (803) 871-9771 HST / 875-2019 DS v32

 * Origin: The Computer Forum Va Beach, VA (804) 471-0736 (1:275/17)

Xref: sparky misc.emerg-services:4248 rec.ham-radio:59
From: steve@vulture.ksc.nasa.gov (Steve Schindler)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services,rec.ham-radio
Subject: Re: ARES/RACES Winter Emergency Class
Date: 5 Nov 92 15:51:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: titan.1992Nov5.105118.4013
Organization: Voice Systems Branch, NASA - Kennedy Space Center

Here are some items from our RACES checklist, plus a few more as a result of
lessons learned from Hurricane Andrew. Obviously, a lot of this stuff is geared
to a warm weather climate, but there may be others on the net who live in
warmer areas. 

Please feel free to add to the list.

Radio Equipment:
Two meter HT with extra bateries, ac adapter, charger, microphone
Adapters for various power sources- cigarette ligter, locally agreed upon
  standard connector, etc.
External antenna- ground plane, small beam
Extra coax cable
Antenna mast- wood, pvc
110 volt extension cord and 2 prong to 3 prong adapter
110 volt to 12 volt DC power supply
spare fuses
RF adapters- BNC to UHF, etc.
110 volt generator and extra gas

Operating and Personal Supplies
Tools
Officail identification
Cash, credit cards
Portable broadcast receiver and extra batteries
Toilet articles- shaver, toothbrush, toothpaste, soap, feminine products,
  toilet paper, etc
Rain gear
Flashlight
Matches/lighter
Tarp or plastic sheeting
Rope
Insect repellent
Medications- perscription and OTC
Local maps
Clipboard or notebook
Folding table
Portable television
Camera
Sleeping bag and a sheet and/or blanket, pillow
Earplugs
Sunglasses
Sunscreen
Hat
Change(s) of clothes
Gloves
Towels
First aid kit
List of important phone numbers
Pens and/or pencils
Folding chair
Potable water
Food
Eating utensils
Can opener


If you are going to be operating from a shelter or a widespread disaster area
and you won't be able to go to "civilization" to sleep and eat, prepare to
live in a shelter.

More information is available in the RACES archive on ucsd.edu in the 
hamradio/races directory.

Steve
Brevard County RACES

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Schindler                      steve@vulture.ksc.nasa.gov
Voice Systems Branch                 steve@testeng.ksc.nasa.gov
NASA - Kennedy Space Center
From: Christopher.Baker@f14.n374.z1.fidonet.org (Christopher Baker)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: ZONE 3 FEED
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1992 03:01:00 -0800

has changed from 3:632/404 to 3:632/387.
 
there were some mixed signals that have now been straightened out and
they will be receiving a rescan of what i have in this area.
 
TTFN.
Chris

 * Origin: Rights On!-Fire Communications Retired-Titusville_FL_USA
(1:374/14)
From: Dean.Tabor@f709.n7301.z8.fidonet.org (Dean Tabor)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Re: Cisd
Date: 10 Nov 92 09:59:01 GMT
Article-I.D.: remote.721525017.F00039

-=> -unknown- said something about Cisd to All   <=-

 -u> From: -Unknown-@medsys.gold.sub.org (-Unknown-)

 -u> I reccomend that anyone who is involved in an incident which starts
up
 -u> the CISD team to attend the debriefing.  I didn't feel the need
much
 -u> for myself, but I'm really happy with the perspective I took out of
the
 -u> meeting. 

I know that a lot of people tend to scoff CISD as being "wimpy" and
"I don't need that head-shrinker stuff"- shoot, I used to be one of
them.  I figured that with a BA in Psychology there was nothing that
CISD could offer me- I can deal with my own problems...

The thing is that CISD is not only to help you deal with any problems
you might have, but also helping others deal with their problems.  
A lot of stress concerning an event can be alleviated by just knowing
that other people are a) having the same thoughts and feelings and 
b) willing to listen to your thoughts and feelings.

In our department, CISD sessions are one step short of mandatory if you
were involved in a "critical" situation... I have to agree with that
policy.  If not for you, for your fellow members.


~Dean Tabor
~FF/EMT-3/Etc
~
... [Insert jarring piano chord here]
 * Origin: Peachtree City,GA FD VIA The Command Post 404-487-1376
(8:7301/709)
From: Darrin.Culver@f53.n272.z1.fidonet.org (Darrin Culver)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: What is policy for drivin
Date: 6 Nov 92 00:41:00 GMT

JM>Just wondering what the policy is for Volunteers driving to the
station to
JM>respond to their alarm?

        I don't know quite what your asking, If you could post a
        specific question or a list of questions I'll do my best to
        answer for you.

                                                        Later;

                                                        Baby Huey


 * OLX 2.1 TD * Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic


 * Origin: BEAR HEAVEN BBS (914) 677-6948 MILLBROOK NY (1:272/53)
From: Bob.Upson@f333.n142.z1.fidonet.org (Bob Upson)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Re: Photographers On Scene
Date: 7 Nov 92 16:58:00 GMT

MK> You know all this bad attitude toward  photographers is
MK> interesting. And just plain the wrong attitude to have.
MK> And anyone who would put a photographer  at risk for injury
MK> should consider legal terms like WILLFULL INJURY & BLATUNT
DISREGARD
MK> before soaking someone or knowingly allowing them to be injured.
MK> Because I wouldn't hesitate to sue your  @#&*! for a stunt like
MK> that.
 
There's a simple solution for that.  Photographers and other press
vultures should simply stay out of places they don't belong.  That way
they won't risk getting wet, injured, or seperated from thier precious
cameras.
 
The photographers that stay with the rest of the civilians behind the
barricades or participate in escorted press tours *when it is safe to
run them* don't face these little inconveniences.

 * Origin: The Dragons' Lair * 203/621-3461 * HST 14.4 V42bis
(1:142/333)
From: Dale.Lamont@f321.n632.z3.fidonet.org (Dale Lamont)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Re: T-Shirts.
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 1992 12:40:00 -0800

    Rick it is great to hear from you, my mailing Address is 80 Haywood
Street Morwell, Victoria, Australia the post code is 3840.

     Please let me know the cost and I will get ir back to you as soon
as possible.

     I am a volunteer and like you are trying to make a career out of it
and am having the same economic problems resulting in the lact of
recruiting.
 I am in a place called Traralgon which is about 150 kms east of
Melbourne, the mailing address is my mothers as I am moving to some
where in the Trarlgon area but don't have much idea when, this way
things will be ok.

  I will see what I can arrange in the way of a shirt for you from our
Training Acadamy, so besure to leave me your mailing address.

     Catch ya later.............

 * Origin: Aust. Searchlight BBS Sales/Support - (051) 761571 -
(3:632/321)
From: Eddie.Ferguson@f709.n7301.z8.fidonet.org (Eddie Ferguson)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: What is policy for driving
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 12:55:00 -0800

 > Thankyou, This is what I was wondering. Not so much
 > the lights, but what do you do upon coming to a Red
 > light, Even in a green light you go with caution, but
 > should you wait at the Red? items like that...

While the law does not state that we must stop before proceeding though
a red signal, our department does require this of both volunteers in POV
and for responding apparatus. This is especially important when there
are many cars at the intersection. Personally, I stop and wait long
enough until I feel sure that every vehicle has heard my siren and has
seen my lights and then I slowly proceed. Even then you can't really be
sure. But, by using this procedure, you give people a better change to
see you and gives you more time to see each of them.

Take care!
           Eddie

 * Origin: Peachtree City Fire and Rescue 404-487-1376 (8:7301/709)

Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: emerg-l@marist.bitnet
X-VMS-To: IN%"emerg-l@marist.bitnet"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Date:         Thu, 5 Nov 1992 11:40:40 -0400
From:         KEN <KAK6279@RITVAX.BITNET>
Subject:      Photographer's on scene.

        Actually, the original post, for you quoters out there, was "What are
the rights of a photographer (both press and non press implied) on a scene?"
Many people out here seem to think that all reporters are just out there to get
in your way.  Or think the first post was "what do you do when a journalist
starts beating up your patient?"  Anyway, to give the thread a new direction
(before it all goes to 200 proof flames...)  What are the conditions in which
an EMT or can have a reporter legally (forcefully if nescessary (by a cop))
removed?  What kind of rights, could I, John Q. Public taking pictures expect
on a scene, providing I am not directly interfering with the scene?

Ciao for now.

My .2 cents worth!                                  FireMAN
            --------------------------------------------------------
Ken Kirchoff                         | "I save lives... What do you do?"
KAK6279@VAXA.ISC.RIT.EDU             |             "FireMAN"
From: Christopher.Baker@f14.n374.z1.fidonet.org (Christopher Baker)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: EListing
Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1992 13:45:33 -0800

FIRENET is listed as dropped in this month's EList report.
 
better get an update in! [grin]
 
TTFN.
Chris

 * Origin: Rights On!-Fire Communications Retired-Titusville_FL_USA
(1:374/14)

Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: emerg-l@marist.bitnet
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Date:         Sun, 8 Nov 1992 14:41:18 -0500
From:         "(Michael P. Rolfes)" <usr2879a@TSO.UC.EDU>
Subject:      Indiana Volunteer Laws

> I think it varies from state to state,  but in Indiana a Volunteer
> Fireman may exhibit his/her blue light when responding to
> emergencies.  All traffic laws must be obeyed and the blue light is
> only a courtesy light to REQUEST the right of way.  This applies
> when you are either responding to the station OR when responding
> directly to the incident scene.
>
>                        -=Bob=-


May volunteers have sirens in the POV's in Indiana?  I live close to the
Ohio/Indiana state line and have seen POV's in Indiana with sirens going also.

I believe that NTSB needs to set a national guidline for use of lights and
sirens as in color and requirements....

There is a problem with conflicts with some states....  For example, in the
state of Ohio, police vehicles are the only one which may display blue lights.

On the Ohio side (Harrison) and Indiana side (Bright, IN) of the same street,
some volunteers for Bright's dept live on the Ohio side --thus being a
member of the Indiana dept requires a blue light --thus illegal on the Ohio
side.  I happen to be related to the mayor of Harrison and obtained
permission from the State Attorney General to allow those who volunteer in
Indiana to use the blue lights while in Ohio to respond into Bright.

In Ohio, red lights are used thus if someone should volunteer in Ohio also....
they need another light... and a siren.  Ohio Law requires the use of both.
On the Indiana side, the light is only courtesy....  Ohio you MUST yield and
give right-of-way to all volunteers....

This causes for dangerous conditions for volunteers....

Please e-mail me at usr2879a@tso.uc.edu

If anyone wishes to discuss this....


Michael P. Rolfes  OVR Unit #43, usr2879a@tso.uc.edu
*****************************************************
Ohio Valley REACT Inc.  #2601, CB channel 9 KHY-1303.
                               VHF  151.625 Mhz.

Hamilton County Disaster and Emergency Services
American Red Cross --Standard First Aid
American Heart Association -- Basic Life Support Certified.
**********************************************************
From: Doug.Plaza@f413.n107.z1.fidonet.org (Doug Plaza)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Volunteer vs. Paid
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1992 10:10:46 -0800

I think the paid vs. volunteer issue can be debated without end.  I
thin
you can get professionals and non-professionals in both catagories.  I
h
worked as a paid MICU paramedic for the past 6+ years, prior to which I
a volunteer EMT on a local first aid squad; both times I considered
myse
"professional".  Personal mindset and organizational policy create the
"professional", not the fact that one receives a paycheck.  New Jersey
s
relies on volunteer first aid squads or EMS for most of the states BLS
coverage.  Unfortunately I have seen the decline of many "good"
voluntee
services over the years.  I blame much of the problems in EMS in this
st
on the government and politicians.  I live close to a town that spends
o
$5 million to supplement an all volunteer fire department while giving
u
a tenth of that amount to the volunteer first aid squads that cover the
area.  The first aid squads probably answer 20 times the number of
calls
probably answer hundreds of times more "life threatening" emergencies.
first aid squads are having real problems keeping qualified personnel
an
have personaly waited over 30 minutes for a BLS ambulance when there
are
first aid squads within minutes of my location.  It has become so bad
th
majority of first aid squads in this particular town tried to get the
township to provide paid EMS crews during the day but the town refused.
the amount of money spent on the volunteer fire department, they could
provide paid EMS and Fire services 24 hours a day!  Don't get me wrong,
definitely believe that the fire department deserves its share of money
I think it should be a more equitable share with EMS.  By the way I was
volunteer fire fighter for a number of years, so yes I do know what I'm
talking about.
     On the subject of training,  I believe there should be the same
minumum standard of EMT met for all volunteer first aid squads as any
pa
emergency medical service has to meet.  First aid squads are public
serv
not clubs, and I believe that if a person calls for an ambulance they
sh
be able to expect a qualified professional regardless of pay.  The
excus
too little time or too little money is not sufficient.  If you go to
the
doctor you expect him to be fully qualified, you don't expect him to
say
didn't have time for that class.


 * Origin: THE THIEVE'S GUILD BBS  Multi-Gig & Node (1:107/413)
(9(1:107
From: Paul.Vallone@f233.n321.z1.fidonet.org (Paul Vallone)
Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services
Subject: Patches++
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 10:39:00 -0800

GV> Paul,
GV>         What is the number of your board (xxx-yyy-zzzz).  Where
would
GV> that file be located?  Thanks again.
GV>
GV>
GV>               George
GV>
GV> PS: What is a good FidoNet to write to YOU.  I have to start using
GV> private nodes when on these subjects (got into some trouble). 
Thanks..
Hi George:
There's two ways of doing it through the mailer and by human calling..
My regular number is 1-(413)448-6292  FidoNet 1:321/233 .
If you request it through the mailer it won't take long..Just request
Whistle.Arj..

                       Later..
                       Paul..  
 
 * Origin: Whistle Stop BBS {Berkshire County Fire Board} (1:321/233.0)

Newsgroups: misc.emerg-services,ne.forsale,rec.radio.swap,rec.ham-radio.swap