From: wattsww@ntmtv.UUCP (Warren Watts)
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Racist Mo Fo's
Reply-To: wattsww@ntmtv.UUCP (Warren Watts)
Organization: Northern Telecom Inc, Mountain View, CA
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 22:41:46 GMT

In article <Bx4L5u.JvD@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> dwarner@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (David J.) writes:
>In article <1992Nov2.192224.2330@ntmtv> wattsww@ntmtv.UUCP (Warren Watts) writes:
>>In article gumby@hpopd.pwd.hp.com (Grim Reaper) writes:
>>> 
>>> So you are saying you agree with Cube and the other brothers that you are
>>> the Devil ????, you have got to be a thick as shit!, someone is taking
>>> the piss out of you and you still get down to the music, i agree it has
>>> some dope beats on it but some of those lyrics is WAY out of line.
>>> Open your eyes and turn up your hearing aid...Da Lench Mob are laughing at
>>> YOU!
>>
>>Damn, are you responding to what I said? Please quote cause from what
>>you wrote I cant see where you even read what I said. I DON'T BELIEVE
>>THAT THE SONG "BUCK THA DEVIL" IS AGAINST ALL WHITE PEOPLE. Did you
>>hear me that time? To quote to the best of my recollection:
>>"See the cop with the flat top
>> slammin' niggers down on the black top
>> that shits gotta stop"
>>
>>YES, Yes I agree with that, yes I think that racist cops deserve to be
>>called devils, yes I beleive that anyone who practice racism has
>>earned the title of "Devil".
>
>How 'bout all those suckers that go for self without thinking about anyone
>else?  They're devils, too.  "The devil is anti-human, who the hell are you?"
>- KRS-ONE from "Build and Destroy"
>
>>It's true that some of the rest of the album is hard on whites,
>>prejudiced even, but after 500 years of abuse the chickens come home
>>to roost, I am not suprised and I don't take it PERSONALLY. You simply
>>can't or won't understand what the hell rap is about and won't even
>>make a serious attempt to understand. 
>
>Oh, isn't this a load of chicken shit!  The man misunderstands one LP, and
>now he doesn't know what rap is about.

This is not about misunderstanding one LP this is about completely
ignoring my two previous posts on this subject in which I tried to
educate him, which I gave him the opportunity to say that he was fighting
racism. Which he made some offhand comment to with out addressing the
real issues I was trying to discuss. That's what I mean by cant or
won't understand.

>I think a history lesson is in order here.  Yes, hip hop was created by black
>and will most often be fueled by black, but does this mean everyone else gets
>the shaft???  Hip hop was not created out of violence or racism or buckin' 
>devils or none of that.  Maybe KRS said it best:
>
>"Rap music is a culture,
> and everyone outside that culture is a vulture.
> The vulture makes money off the culture.
> Understand I ain't tryin' to insult ya."
>						- from "How Not To Get Jerked"
>
>Nobody here is making any money from alt.rap, so there are no vultures.

I would say that deriving your musical enjoyment out of the rage and
frustration of racism with out trying to do something about it is
being a vulture. KRS-ONE also said that rap is revolutionary music and
anyone who is not a revolutionary doesn't understand it.

>That being the case, how can anyone say that another will never know 
>what rap is about just because they take exception to a lyric or two?

I have no problem with taking exception to Da Lench Mob lyrics, but
throwing a tantrum and saying you are now as oppressed as a black
person when you hear the album, that I do take exception to.

>Are all blacks and/or hispanics going to tell everyone else to piss off 
>when they have a problem with something?  

I guess you will have to ask them, as I said in my previous posts, I
am white. This has nothing to do with skin color on my part it has to
do with attitudes and opinions.

>Are we as active members in a hip hop culture not 
>going to show them instead what time it really is here?  Isn't that why this 
>board is HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE???
>
>So he thinks an album is racist.  So he doesn't like the idea of blacks
>adovcating the killing of whites.  If somebody advocated my assassination,
>I wouldn't be too happy either.  Hell, people should be taking exception to
>advocating **killing**.  This is one of the main problems I have with gangsta
>rap in the first place.  If they aren't going to make some sense or drop some
>knowledge on a track, a la Ice-T or Ice Cube or Scarface, then what's the
>point of dropping the track in the first place?  I don't want to listen to
>some pseudo-gangster brag about how he shot some Crip in an alleyway or how
>he "don't give a fuck about a bitch," or any of that.  Tracks like that gotta
>speak the truth, or we're stuck with a pack of vultures attacking hip hop.
>
>But I digress.  The point here is that Warren wants to completely dismiss
>Gumby for saying an album is racist without telling him why.  Why don't you
>make the point that Da Lench Mob is frustrated with the way things are in
>a "White AmeriKKA", and they simply want to lash out at them for hundreds of
>years of black frustration? 

I did in a previous post.

>Why don't you ask Gumby why he hasn't been so
>vocal about black-on-black crime in hip hop records?  

I did in a previous post, and I included sexism, seeing as he does
like NWA.

>Why don't you tell him that the oppression of black people goes way 
>beyond what the LM might ever say on one record?  

I did in a previous post.

>Why don't you tell him that LM's views may not be aimed
>at him if he's down for equality, but instead aimed at a white majority that
>sends out its own subliminal messages to destroy the black people?  

I did in a previous post.

>Why don't you tell him that understanding history and whatever differences 
>we have as people is the first step to understanding an album like this?

I did in a previous post. This is my fourth post on this subject, and
that was my third, apparently you only read the third in the series.

>I saw none of this, Warren.  Instead, I saw a senseless, derogatory remark
>that kicked all white people out of hip hop and served to widen the gap
>between races even further.  No knowledge, no history, no nothing - just
>"get out the kitchen, honkey, 'cause ya know it's too hot for ya."  This is
>just the type of infighting that is bringing hip hop down, and it's time for
>that shit to get gone.

Just because you missed my first two posts on the subject doesn't mean
they don't exist. Basically I get tired of dropping over a hundred
lines of post containing knowledge and having it summed up and
misrepresented without quoting me directly which is what Gumby did.
Like I said before I am white, I don't want white people out of rap, I
want white people in rap to appreciate what they have, and understand
what it is about. I never told Gumby to get out, I told him that
catching flack because he is into hip-hop is not the same as catching
flack because you are black because he has the OPTION to get out.
He chose to misrepresent this by saying I told him to get out which is
why I wrote this response to him.

>We're all here because we love rap music and we want to see hip hop grow and
>prosper as a culture and as an art.  Telling each other to fuck off only
>breaks it down further.  Remember that the next time you think you know
>everything about a subject.
>
Try and read my previous posts next time you think you know everything
about the conversation. 

Peace,
	  Warren Watts


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