HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 15:11:35 EST
From: <SXS30@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Living costs in China
 <1993Jan22.154641.12935@news.acns.nwu.edu>

In article <1993Jan22.154641.12935@news.acns.nwu.edu>, carl_@nwu.edu says:
>
>In article <1993Jan21.223324.26191@gn.ecn.purdue.edu>
>tianshan@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Tianshan Hu) writes:
>> >
>> > This is actually a problem in current China. A taxi driver can earn
>$20,000
>a
>> > year while most teachers can only make $200-$300 a year.
>> >
>> > Carl
>>
>> You probably needs to add a zero t your figures, carl.I, however,
>> do agree it is a problem.
>
>I don't think so. I don't think a teacher in China makes 2000 dollars a year.
>(yes, Mr. Zuo was also talking about dollars.)
>
>Carl

It   depends on which  kind of teacher are you talking about. 2000 dollor
is definitely too high to imangin.  A high shcool teacher probably can
make 400-500$/yr for salary. It is said some University give their
faculty high wage. One news use to be given that Huadong Institute of
Technology (Nanjing) has an estimated income for about 1000 yuan/month.

============================== ========****=============================
SXS30@PSUVM.PSU.EDU(S.Sun)    |      *      *     Democracy is a
410, ACADEMIC ACTIVETY BLDG.  |   |\* (0)(0) */|  government where you
PENN-STATE UNIV.. PA16802     |   |/*   /\   *\|  can say what you think
TEL:814-867-0247              |      *.\__/.*     even if you don't think
============================== ========****============================
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:35118 soc.culture.hongkong:17438
From: abs0@coos.dartmouth.edu (Kelvin Leung)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: "Ruterning to Hong Kong" document
Date: 24 Jan 93 17:10:15 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

machang@llewella.uchicago.edu (Andrew C. Chang) writes:

>Can anyone tell me where I can find the "Returing to Hong Kong" documents.  
>I remembered it was at ahkcus.org. But I couldn't find it. Any comments  
>and suggestion? Thanks a lot.

>Andy

Oops!  I noticed the same thing... I wonder what happened to it.

But Anyhow, I have _almost_ finished updating HKEG.2 (I have yet gotten a 
chance to update HKEG.4... but since HKEG.4 mostly contains trivial information,
I might just skip it. :)

I will upload them ASAP.

Thanks for reminding me.

Yours Sincerely,
Kelvin  (who is still waiting for Samson's **ahem** reply regarding setting
         up the e-mail server).

e-mail: abs0@coos.dartmouth.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: an5823@anon.penet.fi (scorpion)
Subject: HAPPY NEW YEAR
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: soc.culture.china
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 05:55:25 GMT


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
To find out more about the anon service, send mail to help@anon.penet.fi.
Due to the double-blind system, any replies to this message will be anonymized,
and an anonymous id will be allocated automatically. You have been warned.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)
Subject: "free technology and cheap labour" 
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 02:51:39 GMT


In article <1993Jan26.223756.4293@arizona.edu> raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu
(
Raymond Man) writes:
>the competitors could be beaten with low cost satellites from free
                                                               *****
>technology and cheap labour. Hughes may have been outsmarted this time.
***************************
>
People sometime shamelessly get into self-serving, self indulgence. I am not
talking about Mr.Raymond Man in specific. I am talking about U.S. in gerneral.
He brought up the subject, I like to give proper response.
"free technology", I am not sure what he exactly mean. my two guesses:
1. "Patriot Missle" in one of his posting.
Patriot missle, as a populace coceived as an anti-missle, is an out-right
hoax. It was designed for anti-aircraft, specifically explode near incoming
air craft, not direct impact. If you remember TV footage during Gulf WAr, the
bomb shell from Patriots is half of a Chiken egg. It is engough to penetrate
an aircraft. It is not engouh to do any damage to a thinck metal missle.
In practical sense, Patriots did more damage to those it claiimed to protect,
becasue they have to take the rain of Patriots debris. But it did fool iraqis
and gave "ally" side false confidence, in that sense it is succeful, no more.
IN technical sense, it is only an anti-aircraft missle.
2. IN General term. China is probabaly the least able to access U.S.'s
technology, becasue we are big and any technological advance will stir up
Sinophobia among Westeners. As for technological espenage, I do not think
China is no more guilty than U.S. U.S. robbed Nazi German's nuclear
technology,
rocket tehcnology, Jet engine, super high way. Those are among the most
important technologies for the twenth centry.

"Cheap labor" is a coded word for Americans to express excuse for their
over-pay
ed, under-educated, under-worked labor force. what is wrong with working hard,
consuming less! I see it as merit!
Oh, you may present me, "U.S. has most productive labor", of course, your
timber workers are more productvie than japan's, The Japan's have to buy
timber
from outside, you just cut it down, got the idea. Plus the figure was
calculated from the 80s, during which time 3 trillin dollar foreign money
pumped in, that sure inflated and distorted the real productivity.

I do not want to get into how U.S. is doing unless it is relevent. I will read
your response and cease fire unless new and interesting subject coming up.

Take it easy.

chunde

Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:35250 soc.culture.taiwan:17574 soc.culture.hongkong:17508
From: wang@astro.ocis.temple.edu (Gang Wang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: 100th birthday of Madam Sun
Date: 27 Jan 93 15:03:29 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Organization: Temple University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Great Era (b073766@hp9000.csc.cuhk.hk) wrote:

: Today is the 100th birthday of Madam Sun (Sun, Soong Ching Ling).


: Great Era.

Great lady.
From: qliu@draco.rutgers.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: do you know?
Date: 25 Jan 93 18:47:57 GMT
Organization: Rutgers University RUCS-Newark



  does any one know where i can find a place to buy or sell
  stamps in 
            NYC or NJ area ?

 thanks in advance !


    have a nice day!



    from qliu@draco.rutgers.edu
 
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:35158 soc.culture.hongkong:17462 soc.culture.taiwan:17503 talk.politics.china:3758
From: gang@ms.uky.edu (Gang Li)
Subject: Re: Living costs in China
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 21:11:10 GMT

zzuo@iastate.edu (Zhiqi Zuo) writes:

>Few days ago, a taxi driver in Shanghai told me that he eraned about 
>$20,000/yr. "I will retire in a few years, after I gain enough money.
>". He is only in his 30s(I guess from his appearance).

Oh, my GOD, how could you ...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: liuyh@vis.toronto.edu (Yuanhui Liu)
Subject: Re: Living costs in China
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Distribution: na 
Date: 22 Jan 93 19:29:45 GMT

In article <1993Jan22.191544.17074@news.acns.nwu.edu> carl_@nwu.edu  writes:
>In article <C19Lt4.IH7@ucunix.san.uc.edu> wanz@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zhangyong  
>Wan) writes:
>> >I don't think so. I don't think a teacher in China makes 2000 dollars a  
>year.
>> >(yes, Mr. Zuo was also talking about dollars.)
>> >
>> >Carl
>> 
>> A simple arithmetic will tell that a taxi driver can NOT make 20,000 US 
>> dollars a year.  The current rate of taxi is 1.60 RMB/km with 14.40 RMB
>> minimum (9 km's), which is approximately $2.  To make $20,000 a year, he or 
>> she has to make $60 a day, and so has to carry 30 passengers or drive 
>> 250 km a day, without even mentioning the expense for gas and maintenance 
>> of the vehicle.  It is even not that easy to make $60 a day in this 
>> country if you don't have a regular job.
>
>Well, ask Mr. Zhiqi Zuo. He said he met a Taxi driver who makes $20,000 per  
>year.
>
hmmm, maybe this guy holds a second job as black market currency exchanger
...     ;->  
>Carl


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.pakistan
From: yawei@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (~{QG9p~})
Subject: Re: L.S.U. Professor says Indians Suck !!
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 04:21:41 GMT

In article <ROTEN.93Jan26182544@cuba.gsfc.nasa.gov> roten@cuba.gsfc.nasa.gov (Charles Roten) writes:

>You want to know where the 'blame' for the increasingly foreign-
>dominated graduate programs should go ?  I'll tell you where ..  

Thanks to Charles for sharing the departmental political inside
stories.

I think it would be a good idea for a lot of the graduate programs
to scale down. (They can hire some "permanent TAs" to replace the
graduate students.)  That way those who goes through the programs
will at least have a chance. 


   Ya-Gui Wei


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: baochen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Baosheng Chen)
Subject: Travelling to China
Summary: Documents, Addresses 
Keywords: Help Needed
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 19:14:18 GMT

Hi,

	My one year old daughter was born in US, and we are planning to send 
her back to China. Since we are still students, I am wondering she may need 
to apply for a passport from China.  If anyone has such experience, please 
give us a help. Particularly, we need information regarding:

	(1) If she needs to apply a passport, how long it usually will take
to get one from Consulate General in NYC ?
	(2) If a passport is not necessary, what kinds of documents she will 
need ? (We know that she may not be able to get a visa by using US passport)
	(2) What is the address and phone number of Consulate General in NYC?
	(3) What is the mailing address and phone number of Consulate General
of United States in Shanghai ?

	Please send response to:  chen.44@osu.edu

	All helps are appreciated,
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Unification of Taiwan and Mainland
From: ykhsu@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (yung-kao.hsu)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 14:30:06 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <C185A4.Jto@bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au> e2liuzhe@brolga.cc.uq.oz.au (Zhen Liu) writes:
>Some one may fool some people all the time, some one may fool all the people 
>all the time, but no one can fool all the people all the time. No matter KMT
>or CCP, they are changing, they must!! CCP gave up the policy to attack Taiwan
>ten years ago, KMT gave up a couple of years. they have no other choice. now 
>KMT is a little bit stubborn on mainland's policy, actually stubborn like
>donkey. KMT just want to save its face. Considering this, I rather choose CCP
>which know when it should change.


	Looking at the "happenings" you mentioned, I think some one is still
	being fooled by some one at this point.

	If CCP gave up the policy to attack Taiwan ten years ago, well, she
	has forgotten to tell her leaders and everyone else (look like
	you are the only one who get informed of this policy change :-)

	KMT may not have changed herself, at least, the environment she
	is in have changed; she no longer can enjoy the political power
	she once had. People tells KMT what she can do no matter KMT like
	it or not in Taiwan.

	I am happy to say that mainland Chinese will be able to enjoy
	the political power in the near future if you forget about this
	CCP .vs. KMT trap. You are your own boss and don't let CCP or
	KMT pretend they are the boss.

Yung-Kao Hsu
From: pang@titan.ucs.umass.edu (H.K. Pang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: CHINESE WORD PROCESSING
Date: 24 Jan 1993 00:04:58 -0500
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
NNTP-Posting-Host: titan.ucs.umass.edu
Keywords: IBM, CHINESE, WORDPROCESSING

In article <2335@blue.cis.pitt.edu> yding+@pitt.edu (Yijun Ding) writes:
>In article <1993Jan22.030313.26597@massey.ac.nz> ARyan@massey.ac.nz (A.M. Ryan) writes:
>>processing in simplified characters.  I need a system which has 10,000
>>to 20,000 characters, can mix English and Chinese and preferably will
>>fit on a lap-top.
>
>You may check the one in the signature of mine below.  You can find
>some others in ifscc.org? archive site.
>
>-- 
>Want to write in Chinese on PC?  Get dngdng12.zip from 130.49.2.61 in
>directory /pub/incoming.  With it, you can post in Chinese too.

well, i must say i was dissapointed by your program....
what exactly were you trying to offer to the world of chinese word processing?


-- 
KO|+   pang@titan.ucc.umass.edu
```

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: wshi@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Weiping Shi)
Subject: Re: Existence of God
Keywords: Existence of God
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 21:06:22 GMT

>belal@cochin.engin.umich.edu (Belal) writes:



>      		      ********************	
>		      *	EXISTENCE OF GOD *
>		      ********************

In the book "A brief history of time", the author
(a physics and mathematics professor holding a position
used to be hold by Newton and many Nobel-prize winner physics
in Cambridge University) mentioned some consulting work he
did with Pop.  He mentioned Pop wants to know how to modify
their theory so not to contradict with the modern physics.
From: zl02@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (ZHIHONG LI)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Looking for Yu(2) Yan(4) Qiang(2)
Date: 25 Jan 93 18:17:33 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University


Yu, Yan Qiang was my classmate in the No.1 Middle School of Changsha, Hunan
Province. I was told that he came to the states in 1990 after graduation from
the Hua Nan Institute of Technology in Guang Zhou. But I know nothing more
than that. Anybody who knows where he is right now or anything about him,
please send an E-mail to my address : zl02@lehigh.edu.
My name is Li, Zhi Hong.
Thanks a lot.
From: yding+@pitt.edu (Yijun Ding)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: CHINESE ROCKET SHROUD BREAKUP CAUSED LONG MARCH FAILURE
Date: 27 Jan 93 19:12:17 GMT
Distribution: world,local
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1993Jan27.112046.4299@arizona.edu> raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man) writes:
>yding+@pitt.edu (Yijun Ding) excerpted from <1993Jan26.151447.4290@arizona.edu>
>as if I, raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man), wrote it and that
>is incorrect and confusing.

I didn't say you wrote it.  You obviously is not the author of the
quoted article.

>exactly what AW&ST has printed and this fact is readily verifiable. I did
>not write from memory nor interjected anything on the subject in
><1993Jan26.151447.4290@arizona.edu> and, that, I believe is very different

I said you quoted exactly from an article, and I quoted from a newspaper
from memory.  You said that "love to, but cannot claim...", I said " I
am not technically able to conclude...", if you think this is very
different...  Maybe, since

>"Things must be differentiated, only then can knowledge be acquired"
>                                   -- The Great Learning (Da Xue) --

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: echeng@phys.psu.edu (Eddie Cheng)
Subject: Re: Living costs in China
Organization: Penn State, Department of Physics
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 21:06:59 GMT

In article <1993Jan23.160328.4516@midway.uchicago.edu> shi6@midway.uchicago.edu writes:

>I can't agree with you. "Nao Ti Dao Gua" is still a problem.

	The question is why "Nao Ti Dao Gua" has to be a problem.  The
argument that "people who work with brains should earn more than those
who work with their bodies" resides, I suspect, from Marx's theory of
"the value of 'complicated' labor is the multiples of 'simple' labor".
Since "working with brains" is perceived as more complicated than 
"working with bodies", they should be paid more.

	However, in a market economy, the price is more decided by demand,
not the nature of the labor itself.  If you make the most complicated
efforts and produce something that nobody wants, you don't expect to
get paid (although some still do, in reality).

	In this country, we all know that professors are not very well
paid, if you just compare the salaries among different professions.
Middle school teachers are much worse.  The reason they are being paid
is that there is a decent demand for research and education from the
society.  (If you insist on "brain" and "body", any football or
basketball star can easily diminish any Nobel-prize-winning professors
here.)

	China is current going through a "boom" period in which the
demand for education and basic research is way overshadowed by the
economic development and prosperity.  It is small wonder that the
profession of teaching and researching has to suffer, regardless
whether they work with brains or not.  If you can't accept that,
change your profession or go to a country where your profession is
more valued.

	Of course, the government is supposed to take care of these
kinds of things that is being left out of the market force.  Unfortunately
China is going through the exact route that the government force
should be cut down for the market.  It would be impossible for it
to come up with the money to subside the huge industry of basic
scientific research (which does not help the society so much any
way).

	Things will be getting better after the "boom" period when the
society starts to mature and education becomes more valuable.  Hopefully
it will care more about elementary research as well.


	 Eddie

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: 90908648@bradford.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Help on English translation of...
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 15:38:44 GMT


yding+@pitt.edu (Yijun Ding) writes:


>Nobody in the world, but us created this product.
>Nobody in the world, but us makes this product.

What about:

Nobody in the world, but US created this product.
Nobody in the world, but US makes this product.

We must be talking about the PATRIOTS!!

>:-)
From: hay36859@dcl-nxt09.cso.uiuc.edu (Haidong Anthony Ye)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Living costs in China
Date: 22 Jan 93 16:39:21 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

In article <lltvkrINN513@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM  
(Steven Lin) writes:
> In article <SOSC1058.93Jan20152032@wc08.yorku.ca> sosc1058@wc08.yorku.ca  
(Ming He) writes:
> >I had heard some inaccurate data (sorry for the inaccutate) of Beijing
> >area.  The average income is 300 yuans.  A shirt is 20.  A pair of
> 
> I have to laugh loud for this piece of information. A junior medical
> doctor makes less than RMB 200 a month, a middle position of MD makes
> RMB 200 and a popular MD/professor makes RMB 300. If the average income
> of Beijing is RMB 300, the doctors in Beijing may be below the average.
> I have to find out home folks in Hai-dian to see what they say.
> 

Don't know about other people, but I just went back to Beijing couple
weeks ago, and most profs and teachers in the university I know of can 
make RMB 600-800, and engineers makes even more, perhaps RMB 1,000/month
Of course, most of the money comes from "the second profession", the
standard salary is still around RMB 200/month

> >year's income.  A car is a dream.  An apartment -- most of people
> >living in one with 10 yuans/month.

This piece of info is some how outdated in Beijing.  I know many 
university profs and engineers have savings from RMB 50,000-100,000
some have cars already, and others plan to buy one in the near future,
especially those living in uptown.  Buying houses are not as popular
in Beijing, but it is becoming more and more popular, even though most
people buy their own apartment which was rent previously, so the house
is somewhat obselete anyway.

-Anthony
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:35064 soc.culture.europe:11347 soc.culture.indian:45197 soc.culture.pakistan:19800
From: kefeng@epas.utoronto.ca (KFK Ke(rr))
Subject: info reg. Mr. Cheng Mai\yue\, MPA of Princeton, intern of World Bank DC
Organization: University of Toronto - EPAS
Distribution: soc.culture.china, soc.culture.taiwan, soc.culture.hongkong
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 23:42:10 GMT
Summary: want to know his whereabout, anybody with info please help


I want to find my friend Mr. Cheng Maiyue through this metwork if
possible, anybody who know his whereabout and how to contact him
please help, your time and effort will be deeply appreciated.

info about Mr. Cheng\/ Mai\ Yue\:
from Nanjing
Undergraduate Univ: Fu Dan University / major International Relations
Graduate school: Beijing Institute of International Relations
School in U.S.:   Princeton University  /major: MPA

additional info:  he has worked summer time in Washington DC in World Bank

please reply to this address if you have any info on him:


kefeng@epas.utoronto.ca

============================================================================


=============================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: dapeng@cdfx5.mit.edu (XU, DAPENG)
Subject: Test
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: MIT Lab for Nuclear Science
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 01:25:00 GMT

  Nothing has yet been said that has not been said before.

                          ---Terence

         ----This is a test----
From: shi6@quads.uchicago.edu (Sheldon Shi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Living costs in China
Date: 22 Jan 93 18:51:40 GMT
Reply-To: shi6@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago

In article <lltvkrINN513@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin) writes:
>
>I have to laugh loud for this piece of information. A junior medical
>doctor makes less than RMB 200 a month, a middle position of MD makes
>RMB 200 and a popular MD/professor makes RMB 300. If the average income
>of Beijing is RMB 300, the doctors in Beijing may be below the average.
>I have to find out home folks in Hai-dian to see what they say.

Of course you can laugh as loud as you can, even with your stomach broken,
but the phenomenum that a doctor earns less than average has existed in
mainland for ten years. It seems you must have been mixed up for quite
some time.

>
>A pair of leather shoes is 40, oh that is good and accurate. Last September
>I saw many sneaker shoes along Wang-fu-jin cost 100, but look so bad. When 
>the Addies and Rebok are there, this pair of shoes look like a product of 
>fle-market. The Addies and Rebok cost more than RMB 500. The same shoes
>cost 2000NT in Taiwan, and they are MIT products. 
>
>I wonder why many people in Beijing like the Addies and Rebok when they
>have to save two month salary to buy a pair of sneaker. Yes, many can
>afford it, especially the students. But, how many can afford it?
>
>>year's income.  A car is a dream.  An apartment -- most of people
>>living in one with 10 yuans/month.
>>
>
The sneaker shoes may sell faster if they are labelled RMB 100 instead of 10.

Sheldon
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: kay@zen.uta.edu
Subject: Wanted: fitness instructors in japan
Organization: Univ. Texas at Arlington, Arlington, Texas
Distribution: soc
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 17:29:47 GMT


A company in Japan is looking for part time Chinese fitness
instructors for a newly established program in the renowned
educational institution in Osaka, Japan.

Please contact me if you or your friends meet the following 
qualifications:

 o Speaking ability of the Japanese language

 o Graduate certification from Chinese Medical schools

 o Experience of teaching Chinese massage, Qi-gong and other
traditional fitness techniques

 o Expected time of starting: April, 1993

Details are negotiable. The program is expected to be expanded and 
the position should be very challenging.

Thank you.

Kay Sekio
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,comp.sources.wanted