HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling)
Subject: Re: World of CBM, Pasadena
Organization: North Carolina State University
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 01:39:52 GMT

kjohnson@castor.cs.uga.edu (Kristopher Johnson) writes:
>In article <1992Aug29.201821.18666@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jyoung@nyx.cs.du.edu (Jeff Young) writes:
>>[various stuff deleted]
>
>Look, Jeff!  I'm an Atari user and don't really like the Amiga, but I think 
>you're going a little overboard here.  [...]
>[...]   I'm not telling you to stop saying 
>what you're saying, just asking you to lighten up a little.

"Lighten up"?  Others may be tired of his posts, but I haven't laughed
so much in years!   Heck, after he accused me of getting rumors from
CALL-A-PSYCHIC, I was rolling on the floor :-)

And the piece about the business types asking Commodore to leave a keypad
off the A600 was priceless, IMO.   I'll miss him when he's gone to school.

>By the way, what nationality are you?

He's obviously from the land of rabid computer fanatics, which describes
way too many of us on this group.  He's a lesson to us all, to not take
any of this junk too seriously :-)

<still laughing>  kevin <kdarling@catt.ncsu.edu>
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:22246 comp.sys.amiga.misc:12996
From: jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: User-friendly Arexx?  How about some user-friendly compillers?
Date: 23 Aug 92 15:12:00 CDT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

> 
>    You still have to have a good knowledge of ARexx to make use of it.  I am
> talking about usability for complete novices, which is something that Amiga
> multimedia does not provide.  

What needs to be programmed is a hypercardish interface that will
compile arexx scripts for people who don't programm.  I had thought
there was something like that out already?  

>>No, but it does take more preparation than it should.  It doesn't take
>>a genius to interface a few applicatons through ARexx, obviously. 

I seem to recal a similar remark from a UNIX proffessor for awk, sed,
and perl.  But the point is most people who buy a computer don't buy
it so they  can totally configure it themselves though sometimes
simple sometimes complex scripts.  Hey, we're talking about some high
level OS tweaking in some cases which _REALLY_ intimidates the casual
computer user.  I have to concur with Marc that although IMO Arexx is
GREAT for us elitists (and anyoneelse too...) one shouldn't need
programming knowledge or expertice to run a simple multimedia
presentation.  Does RexxTools c. provide for assembling scripts for
from some easy to use intuition interface?

>    Computer elitism.  ARexx is a much more difficult programming environment
> than you make it out to be.  In an industry where the trends are toward more
> and more user-friendliness, the user should not have to do any programming
> to get some simple task done, like use a CD-ROM disc.  If Commodore
>and third- 
> parties do not improve the situation, which is currently causing the Amiga
> to buck completely against the rest of the computer industry, it will never
> survive.
>

I concur.
 
>     You cannot be coputer novice, either.  The fact is, the requirement of
> having to know anything about ARexx locks the Amiga out of 99% of potential
> buyers.  
>

I'm president of a users-group and can say from experience that ARexx
proves to be too intimindating for a majority of users of our club
anyway and much of our membership is composed of students.

The point to be made is yes the guts of Arexx should be easily
approachable by those who demand it, but my wife, the business man
and his kids, or the busy college student shouldn't have to learn yet
another programming language to use his computer.
 > 
>>(: (: (: (: Have you overdosed on smileys today?  Why NOT!?! :) :) :) :) :)
>>(: "...and here's Clinton giving the correct spelling of bong-resin..."  :)
>>(:	gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu			Gregory R. Block         :)
>>(: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
> 
> ---
> | Marc Barrett -MB-  |  email: barrett@iastate.edu
> --------------------------------------------------
>      "Beware the ides of September..."
-- 
jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
James Miller

_chicchai .sig no ho ga ichiban iin janai ka..._
             Life Happens?
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams)
Subject: Re: OS/2 vs. AmigaOS
Organization: James Cook University
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 03:59:11 GMT

In article <17thoiINNdm0@matt.ksu.ksu.edu> ovrskeek@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (I am the OVER-skeek!) writes:
>>But most of my multithreading experience is on transputers, which 
>>offer both approaches.
>
>Multithreading has nothing to do with what kind of message passing is used.

Please don't give me a lecture on multithreading when I've spent the
last 6 months working on a multithreaded application and have a
very good idea what it is.

The fact is that when you have a multithreaded application, you must 
have some mechanism for communication, and I just was stating my opinion 
that the Amiga doesn't offer enough IPC options.

>ovrskeek@matt.ksu.ksu.edu

-- 
Colin Adams       Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland
  "And if I seem a little strange, well that's because I am." - The Smiths 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: tsarna@endicor.com (Ty Sarna)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: OS/2 vs. AmigaOS
Date: 31 Aug 92 04:22:31 GMT
Organization: Endicor Technologies, Inc., San Antonio, Texas

In article <1992Aug31.033347.17131@marlin.jcu.edu.au> cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams) writes:
> In article <1992Aug29.003212.13913@endicor.com> tsarna@endicor.com (Ty Sarna) writes:
> The Amiga is lacking in IPC mechanisms.  It doesn't have enough

Agreed, though as I pointed out, you CAN roll your own. Wether that's
good or bad dep[ends on what you want to do.

> support for multi-threaded applications, which is probably why we
> haven't seen too many of them.

Actually, I think the Amiga is superb for multithreading, since shared
code and memory are so easy (the only choice, really). I think the
reason there aren't more multithreaded apps (on any platform; I really
don't know as proportionally there are many more such aps on other
platforms either) is that programmers in general (myself included) tend
to be lazy about such things. It's so tempting to make do with "good
enough".

> I don't like the argument much.  Any decent programmer can
> run through a list of function calls and find the one they want.

Yeah, I agree that's a weak argument, but the trend towards thicker and
thicker OS manuals is somewhat disturbing to me. AmigaOS has this
problem to an extent too, though efforts like BOOPSI are helping in that
area. Consider older unix systems, with maybe 40-60 systems calls, while
newer systems have 3-4 times as many. I think OO OSes will help out in
this area, at least as far as providing a more natural organization for
the information if not consolodating it as well.

--
Ty Sarna				           tsarna@endicor.com

	"Staring faces, set in celluloid,
		Welcome to the late show, starring null and void"
From: ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene)
Subject: Re: Shakeout in PC Industry Continues 
Organization: University of New Hampshire  -  Durham, NH
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 16:15:05 GMT

>Computerworld (August 10, 1992)
>
>Everex, Zeos try to hang on as PC market shakeout nears (p. 93)
>
>      "The other shoe has finally begun to drop in the personal computer
>industry price wars, as the ravaged bottom lines of several second- and
>third-tier vendors attest to. According to analysts, this is just the
>beginning of a much predicted shakeout in the PC arena, and the trend should
>continue throughout the year...
>      One of the worst hit is Everex Systems, Inc, which has announced that
>it does not expect to be profitable for the quarter just ended... The company
>last week said it is cutting costs by terminating 10% of its work force,
>currently at about 2,450 employees, and pruning the number of products
>available in each of its PC families..."
>      "Also cutting back is Zeos International Ltd., which last week laid off
>93 employees in the wake of an $11.1 million loss for the second quarter of
>1992, after posting a $1.9 million first-quarter deficit... Zeos is also
>facing a cash crisis: The company's line of credit has been halved to
>$8 million, and Zeos said its bank will not renew the credit line, set to
>expire in December. The company said that while it had $748,000 in short-term
>debt, its long-term ledger is debt-free."
>

	Did they say anything about Gateway 2000?  I've got one, so I'm kind
   of concerned.  Last I knew it seemed they were doing very well.

							G.Greene


> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> = Mark Rickan                         ...!uunet!utai!utgpu!maccs!rickan = 
> = DCSS, McMaster University               rickan@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca = 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: copes@pride.cs.curtin.edu.au (Simon Cope)
Subject: SCSI Vs. IDE?
Summary: Re: SCSI Vs. IDE Debate
Keywords: SCSI IDE
Organization: Curtin University of Technology
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 09:05:37 GMT


Do you REALLY think C= is going to throw away a blisteringly fast SCSI 
controller in favour of an IDE one?  Especially when it consists of only 2 
chips, one of which they make themselves?  In favour of a completely new one,
which they would have to design from scratch?

I don't know about HDisk prices in the US, but down here a Quantum SCSI drive
is around A$50 CHEAPER than the equivalent size Quantum IDE.  Seems el cheepo
clones makers opt for cheaper IDE drives than Quantum's, thus forcing their
price up due to low demand.

BTW, last week I read a comparison test between 14 486/50's.  They all ran 
around 400-500k sec on the Hdisk tests, the only one that ran significantly
faster had a DMA SCSI ADAPTER on an ESIA card with a SeaGate 300+ megger.  It
pulled 1.9 Megs sec.  In comparison, my A3000 25/50 pulls 930k sec using
DiskSpeed4.1, and its only a 52 meg drive.  A 240 meg Quantum should run at 
around 1.3-1.6 megs sec.  As you can see, non DMA IDE drives are a bit slower.
Not really worth it, when you consider that the main cost of SCSI over IDE
is the controller, and C= already has one of their own.  I know the A600 has an
IDE drive, but they had to make a 16 bit controller anyway, so might as well 
make a cheap one combined into Gayle.

--
copes@cs.curtin.edu.au

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams)
Subject: Re: A Windows API for Amiga OS?
Organization: James Cook University
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 03:43:52 GMT

In article <1992Aug31.001139.13995@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au> davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn) writes:
>>[Actually, I wonder how far MS Windows- and OS/2- compatible Application
>>Program Interfaces could help in making it easier for developers to port to
>>the Amiga.]
>
>For OS/2, I don't know.  But the Windows API?  Ugh...  Windows expects it's
>apps to "cooperatively multitask" - not the Amiga way.  Any software doing
>that on the Amiga would be a kludge, and an ugly one at that.

The Windows API is okay.  Most applications don't need to even know
that it is non-preemtive.  But it would be difficult to add a Windows API
on top of the Amiga OS as many parts of Windows would be difficult to
interface with the Amiga.

>David Meiklejohn                  | Internet : davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au

-- 
Colin Adams       Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland
  "And if I seem a little strange, well that's because I am." - The Smiths 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
From: skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls)
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Organization: University of Mississippi, Dept. of Computer Science
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 15:32:07 GMT

In article <mykes.0dar@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG> mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes:
>In article <1992Aug30.175116.4493@ra.msstate.edu> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
>> In article <Yk5Ar*LT0@caleb.UUCP> jdp@caleb.UUCP (Jim Pritchett) writes:
>> >In article <1992Aug22.042013.16635@kas.helios.mn.org>, Rob Healey writes:
>> >
>> >> 	The 3000T '040 ad in byte this month was sad because it showed
>> >> 	how far behind the times Amiga really is. On one page you
>> >> 	had the 3000T '040 for $5998.00. 5 pages later you have a DELL
>> >> 	33Mhz 486 system that can do more for $2699.00. It's sad really
>> >
>> >I think that the 040 is faster than the 486.  What do you mean by "do more?"
>> More apps, more expansion boards, more colors, more pixels, more HD,
>> more RAM, more...
>
>Since that Dell comes with Win 3.1 and DOS 5 factory installed, more means
>the standard windows applications/accessories that come with - including term
>program, audio digitizing software, midi player, prowrite caliber WP program,
>etc.
>
>What can you do with an Amiga right out of the box?  Not much.  You can
>edit text files with andy finkel's EMacs (if it's still part of the OS
>distribution)...

Hang on there a second.  You can also type "say" at the shell prompt and
have the Amiga talk to you.  You can change the colors, fonts, screen modes,
pointer, printer drivers, etc.  You can format a floppy, copy a disk, change
the date and time, edit an icon, render some new fonts, start bunches of
clocks, and all sorts of other neat things.  Who could ask for anything
more?  :-)

>> Skip Sauls
>> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
>--
>Amiga programmer of: GRn, MailMinder, Budokan, Beyond Dark Castle, Dark Castle
>Sega Genesis programmer of: Dick Tracy and Marble Madness.
>Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
>1124 Fremont Ave.
>Los Altos, CA 94024

Skip Sauls
skip@tacky.cs.olemis.edu



Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: Evan Torrie <torrie@cs.stanford.edu>
Subject: Re: No Figs in the Apple Newton
Organization: Stanford University
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1
     <root.02cx@rkamiga.UUCP>
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 92 16:53:38 GMT

In article <64783@cup.portal.com> Tom R Krotchko, TomK@cup.portal.com
writes:

>This happens all the time. Beretta is the name of what 2 famous product?
The
>gun manufacturer sued Chevy a few years back. Do you think many people
went
>into the gun dealer and walked out with a Chevy by mistake?
>
>Sony sued a restaurant in Baltimore about a year back with the name of
"Sony"
>(pronounced "sonny"). The retaurant had that name for a long time, and
the
>nickname of the owner was "Sony". I wonder how many people walked in to
>get some lasagna and came out with a 20 inch portable instead?

  Did these law actions succeed though?

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Embrace rationalism, reject superstition	  Break away from the past
Evan Torrie				Stanford University		torrie@cs.stanford.edu
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:23033 comp.sys.amiga.misc:13414
From: sacke@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Elizabeth E Sack)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Date: 3 Sep 92 17:22:15 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <1992Sep3.153207.13284@ra.msstate.edu> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
>In article <mykes.0dar@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG> mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug30.175116.4493@ra.msstate.edu> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
>>> In article <Yk5Ar*LT0@caleb.UUCP> jdp@caleb.UUCP (Jim Pritchett) writes:
>>> >In article <1992Aug22.042013.16635@kas.helios.mn.org>, Rob Healey writes:
>>> >
>>> >> 	The 3000T '040 ad in byte this month was sad because it showed
>>> >> 	how far behind the times Amiga really is. On one page you
>>> >> 	had the 3000T '040 for $5998.00. 5 pages later you have a DELL
>>> >> 	33Mhz 486 system that can do more for $2699.00. It's sad really
>>> >
>>> >I think that the 040 is faster than the 486.  What do you mean by "do more?"
>>> More apps, more expansion boards, more colors, more pixels, more HD,
>>> more RAM, more...
>>
>>Since that Dell comes with Win 3.1 and DOS 5 factory installed, more means
>>the standard windows applications/accessories that come with - including term
>>program, audio digitizing software, midi player, prowrite caliber WP program,
>>etc.
>>
>>What can you do with an Amiga right out of the box?  Not much.  You can
>>edit text files with andy finkel's EMacs (if it's still part of the OS
>>distribution)...
>
>Hang on there a second.  You can also type "say" at the shell prompt and
>have the Amiga talk to you.  You can change the colors, fonts, screen modes,
>pointer, printer drivers, etc.  You can format a floppy, copy a disk, change
>the date and time, edit an icon, render some new fonts, start bunches of
>clocks, and all sorts of other neat things.  Who could ask for anything
>more?  :-)
>
>>> Skip Sauls
>>> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
>>--
>>Amiga programmer of: GRn, MailMinder, Budokan, Beyond Dark Castle, Dark Castle
>>Sega Genesis programmer of: Dick Tracy and Marble Madness.
>>Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
>>1124 Fremont Ave.
>>Los Altos, CA 94024
>
>Skip Sauls
>skip@tacky.cs.olemis.edu


Yeah, and if you own Workbench 2.05 you can run CARDPREP!!!! Of course this
does absolutely nothing unless you have a 600 :)  If you have a 3000 you can
run Ramsey and completely trash your memory (and sometimes your HD too!)


But seriously,  as for the price performance thing, you are comparing apples
to oranges--when you should be comparing Apples to Amigas :)

PC prices will *ALWAYS* be lower!  That is because everybody and their half
brother is building clones these days.  That drives the prices down.  Since
Amigas are only made by Commodore, the profit margin/R&D/etc factors will
keep the machine at a price more than that of a PC.  It is the same deal with
Apple.  Although they just plain charge *WAY* too much for their machines.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: phsjs@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Stephen J.Smith)
Subject: Re: "Chomping at the bit..." - Again
Organization: James Cook University
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 92 07:23:20 GMT

In <kkrebs.015p@amilink.UUCP> kkrebs@amilink.UUCP (Ken Krebs) writes:


>Just to let Skip Sauls know - Amiga news has published his "story" on the
>front page of their August newsletter.  The title of the article is "The
>A4000 - The Scoop on Commodore's Newest!" and they have "by Anon" where the
>author's name should be.

>Congrats, Skip.  You've conquered yet another magazine/newsletter.

The latest Australian Megadisk has this article  with the heading :
"NEW AMIGAS IN THE PIPELINE - by a US developer"

The editor has an insert saying - "This piece came off the international
networks, and seems to be authentic, as it tallies with what I've heard
from other sources."

Well, Skip, I had a phone call from some people who were really excited
by this news...:) I had to convince them otherwise.......

>--
>*********** NewOrderDepecheModeUltravoxViolentFemmesKillingJoke |Amiga 3000|
>*Ken Krebs* SkinnyPuppyLaTourBauhausBookOfLoveModernEnglishB52s |25Mhz/6Meg|
>*********** FishBoneBigCountryJoyDivisonSiouxsie&TheBansheesXTC |Multitask!|
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>       UUCP: uunet!csusac.ecs.csus.edu!citrus!amilink!kkrebs
>   InterNet: amilink!kkrebs@citrus.sac.ca.us or: kkrebs@citrus.sac.ca.us
-- 
Stephen J. Smith	Technical Officer	phsjs@marlin.jcu.edu.au
Physics Department
James Cook University
Townsville QLD 4811
From: thompson@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: PC multitasking...y
Date: 28 Aug 92 02:54:42 CDT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

In article <1992Aug28.041212.24766@marlin.jcu.edu.au>, cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams) writes:
> In article <jbickers.0dzq@templar.actrix.gen.nz> jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz (John Bickers) writes:
>>Quoted from <1992Aug27.161036.384@ctr.columbia.edu> by jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel):
>>> Never tried it.  Have you?  Didn't think so.
>>
>>    Some combinations I have tried on the Amiga with no editor
>>    degradation are:
>>
>>    Editor + 19.2kb file transfer + MOD player
> 
> I should have pointed out before that when I saw the SoundBlaster
> modules being played on a 486/33 under Windows 3.1, the sound quality 
> might have been comparable to the Amiga, but Windows was incredibly slow, 
> nearly frozen, with the modules playing.  I doubt it could have handled 
> a download at the same time.   
> 

Well, I played mods through my PAS-16 in Windows 3.1, and Windows was
fine.  In fact, I am playing a mod right now.  No slowdown in this 
editor.  If I start up a bunch of other stuff, then there is a slowdown,
but not a big one.

> I don't know how OS/2 would fare.
> 

OS/2 would fare better.  I haven't tried it (with mods), but from 
using it for other multitasking tasks, it would play mods and perform 
better than Windows.

>>> | Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
>>*** John Bickers, TAP, NZAmigaUG.        jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz ***
> 
> -- 
> Colin Adams       Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Charles A. Thompson               |  thompson@ukanvm.cc.ukans.edu         |
|  University of Kansas              |  thompson@ukanvax.cc.ukans.edu        |
|  _Avid_ SkiBum                     |  OS/2 2.0 is for YOU!!!               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Look for Recipe Pro(tm), an interactive recipe database, coming soon...   |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block)
Subject: Re: No Figs in the Apple Newton
Organization: University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 08:21:54 GMT

kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling) writes:
: I believe that ATT and someone else is coming up with a line of PDAs
: to compete with Apple's Newton... only theirs are called "Hobbits"!
: Wonder if they'll have to pay for that name?

It would have been better that they called them "Kenders".  After all,
it's likely that they'll leave their users frustrated and quite
taunted by them.  ;)

Greg

--
(: (: (: (: Have you overdosed on smileys today?  Why NOT!?! :) :) :) :) :)
(: "...and here's Clinton giving the correct spelling of bong-resin..."  :)
(:	gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu			Gregory R. Block         :)
(: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: danaf@aix.rpi.edu (Frank R. Dana Jr.)
Subject: Re: POLL : NEW MACHINE according to .advocacy 
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 03:36:26 GMT


Whoops - sorry about that Denise thing, that was just a slip of the fingers. The
Amiga sound chip is, of course, Paula. (These cutesy names can get annoying...)

As for "really" knowing what's going on in Commodore, I never claimed to be an
official source for anythin. I never signed a NDA, hell, I never MET anyone that
works for Comodore in the flesh! I prefaced the entire message as what "I think"
is coming out in September... that's what the survey was! It was not a factual
statement of any kind. However, from what I HAVE seem of the new machines, 
nothing's ready. The new 3.0 O/S is closest, we may see that this year.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy