HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com ()
Subject: Vietnam Wall Replica
Originator: suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com
Reply-To: suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com ()
Organization: TRW Space & Defense
Distribution: la
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 23:51:37 GMT


The "Moving Wall", a half-size replica of the Vietnam War Memorial
Wall, will be across the street from TRW from Nov 23 through 27, 1992.
The exhibit is lit at night and attended by volunteers 24 hours a day.
The opening ceremony is Nov 23, 11:45 am, closing Nov 27, 4 pm.
Viewing will be avialable until Saturday at 8 am.

The first time I stood in front of this replica was a very emotional
experience.  I didn't think I was "plugged in" to the Vietnam War.  But
at some level, I was.

If you have never visited this, watch for it in your area.  I understand
that there is an East coast and a West coast replica, each traveling
around.

The wall is located at the So Cal Edison park, Marine avenue between
Inglewood Ave and Aviation Blvd.  Exit 405 freeway at Inglewood.
Proceed North to Marine.  Turn left, proceed West and the wall is on
your right shortly after you cross the RR tracks.  It's also right
across from the 11 story white building with TRW sign on the top.

What does this have to do with recovery?  IMNSHO, it's a combination of
finishing "unfinished business" (Gestalt therapy term) and not harboring
resentments.
-- 
Maurice Suhre
suhre@trwrb.dsd.trw.com
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
From: johnk@johnk.wariat.org (John M. Kroehle)
Subject: Re: Violence at AA meetings
Organization: John's super computer
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 18:10:01 GMT

Robert Hartman (hartman@informix.com) wrote:
: >In article <1992Nov19.214649.15194@informix.com> hartman@informix.com (Robert Hartman) writes:
: >>In article <1244.779.uupcb@factory.com> bruce.baer@factory.com (Bruce Baer) writes:
: >>
: >>Whew!  This is either tough love taken to an extreme, or it's
: >>insane.  I don't know which.  Rolling someone into recovery!  Well,
: >>I suppose it's better than leaving them to rot in the gutter.
: >
: >    Not.  Beating the hell out of someone and then having them taken to
: >detox hardly constitutes bringing "someone into recovery".  If I were the
: >drunk victim of this assault, I'm quite sure I wouldn't go to any lengths
: >to get what my assaulters had.  I can think of no rational reason for
: >treating a victim of alcoholism in this manner.
: 
: This is a very ugly topic.  I don't think that I could participate in
: anything like that.  But I'm not sure that I can completely condemn it
: either.  For one thing, we're talking about a victim of the disease who
: perpetrates violence in meetings (and God-knows where else).  
: 
: Nevertheless, I should hope that such drastic measures would be held in
: reserve as long as possible.  So I guess the "preferred method" comment
: put me off a little bit.  But if it's someone's third or fourth violent
: disruption and the police are too slow to be of any real help, a forceful
: ejection might be necessary.  And if it comes to that, making sure the
: person gets medical care is at least somewhat compassionate.

Beating someone into detox is an insane concept. If that were the case all
we would have to do is to beat someone up and they would get well. This
also ignores the ugly drunk who pulls a knife (or gun in NY) and stabs two
or three of the large AA'a into detox themselves. I was confronted with a
drunk with a knife at a meeting once, I could have had eight guys out there
and this drunk would have still wanted to take them all on. He was most
afraid of someone calling the police because he had a history of knife
waiving and didn't want to go back to jail.

For me the answer is to quit pretending that I'm a karate champion or a
shrink and do what is appropriate to the situation doing my best to not let
my ego take over. 

john

-- 
John M. Kroehle                 Internet Adddress: johnk@wariat.org
                    Cleveland Free-Net: at015@cleveland.freenet.edu
              Being human explains everything, but excuses nothing.
From: millman@teddy.bear.com (Phillip Millman)
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
Subject: Men's National AA Conference
Date: 23 Nov 92 16:45:31 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Will be  April 16-8, 1992 at the Lackawanna Station Hotel (717) 342-8300.
The Conference is $18 Regristration and $24 Sat. Banquet.  Send the
money to 
	6th National Men's Conference
	PO Box 3653
	Scranton, PA 18505-3653

Call Jerry @ 717-343-4945 for more info


Get your Hotel retservation now!  Rooms filling fast.

Phillip
--
Phillip Millman					millman@bear.com
The opinions expressed are those of Phillip Millman and not that of 
Bear Stearns & Co. Inc.  I think it is better that way.
From: weiss@leopard.cs.uidaho.edu (Phil Weiss)
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
Subject: Re: How to Love Unconditionally (long)
Date: 20 Nov 1992 14:42:52 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
Reply-To: weiss@leopard.cs.uidaho.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu


> Your posting, "How to Love Unconditionally; A Technical Manual,"
> inspired me to post the following, written by Louise Hay.  I found
> this years ago and it resurfaced last year when I was struggling 
> (unsuccessfully, alas) to keep my 12-Step recovery bookstore alive.  
> Hope you enjoy!
> 
> Judy

I just wanted to point out that the suggestions that were listed
aren't 12 step, at least not in the book _Alcoholics Anonymous_.

Many people who work the 12 steps use those suggestions.

Phil W (Moscow, ID)

The spiritual life is not a theory.  WE HAVE TO LIVE IT.
From: hartman@informix.com (Robert Hartman)
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
Subject: Re: Fasting Comments
Date: 23 Nov 92 20:28:16 GMT
Distribution: alt
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <1992Nov20.220336.28936@gumby.dsd.trw.com> suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com () writes:
>
>=====Begin post for Diane=====
>I need to post about the dangers of fasting since I've seen these (in my
>opinion) crazy diets being posted here.  I am quoting from an article from
>_Cooperative Extension of California Orange County_ June 1986, _From your
>home advisor_.
>
>	"The average adult now carries over five pounds or chemical
>	 toxins in his/her precious body, often along with unwanted
>	 weight.  End unneccessary suffering. . .Lose one pound daily,
>	 permanently, safely. . .Personally monitored juice fasts also
>	 detoxify, rejuvenate, break addictions."
> ...
>Prolonged fasting is unsafe, says Dr. Swenerton.  It neither cleanses nor 
>rests the body.  Instead, it mobilizes homeostatic mechanisms designed to
>go into gear when emergencies such as sickness or accident prevent normal
>eating.  Under these conditions, some body tissues are "cannibalized" in an
>attempt to keep other essential body tissues alive until the emergency is
>over.  Thus, for some individuals, even short-term fasting can carry 
>significant health risks.

Hmmm.  I just want to point out that when taking a juice fast, one
is receiving nourishment.  I don't think there's any problem with
giving one's digestive tract a break from solid food every so often.
There probably is something wrong with attributing miracles to a
practice that can be dangerous.

-r
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
From: johnk@johnk.wariat.org (John M. Kroehle)
Subject: Re: Concept of God and Losing my Ground
Followup-To: alt.recovery
Reply-To: johnk@wwariat.org (John M. Kroehle)
Organization: John's super computer
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 03:56:50 GMT

As quoted from <1992Nov16.220003.17921@netcom.com> by dhawk@netcom.com (David Hawkins):

+---------------
> stellaa@flash.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Stella Adams) writes:
> 
> >I feel that some people actually lose theirselves once in recovery.  A
> >meeting every day is someting I know many people do.  They wrap their
> >lives up in recovery so much, that reality is actually gone.  Isn't
> >getting sober and learning to live life on lifes basis our goal.  Be a
> >people among people?  Isn't it true that most people in recovery "AA"
> >usually ONLY have friends that are also in recovery and would rather
> >not deal with "NORMIES".  They don't feel comfortable with them, ie.
> >insecure?
> 
> I don't have a lot of friends outside of AA partly because I'm
> attracted to alcoholics and if I'm going to hang out with alkies, I'd
> as soon they be sober ones.  'Normies' often don't approve of my
> program since I didn't get sober through 'willpower' -- I relied on a
> program, which isn't the American way.  They seem to have their own
> insecurities.   ;-)
> 
I would just like to throw in my 2 cents. When I got sober I was spending 4
to 5 hours in the bar every single day and 8 hours on Saturday and Sunday.
For the first year I was sober I went to 10 to 14 meetings a week.
Sometimes I just went because I had time to fill in and I didn't know how
else to do it. My point is that for the first year or two I did "lose"
myself in recovery because I had lost myself completely through 25 years of
drinking and drugging. The difference is (for me, just for me) that the
program of AA encourged me slowly to get back into life. If I'm going to
get lost (in my opinion) I would rather get lost in the fellowship of AA
than in the streets.

O.D.A.A.T.

john


-- 
John M. Kroehle                 Internet Adddress: johnk@wariat.org
                    Cleveland Free-Net: at015@cleveland.freenet.edu
              Being human explains everything, but excuses nothing.
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
From: suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com (Maurice E. Suhre)
Subject: Re: Narcotics Anonymous
Organization: TRW, INC.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 22:33:16 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.180836.5319@umr.edu> nnemer@next3.cs.umr.edu (Nicole Nemer) writes:
>
>Just wondering if this newsgroup has readers that are members of Narcotics  
>Anonymous.  NA has given me a new life, and I am searching this net for  
>fellow addicts.

Nicole,

I can't seem to send mail to you.  Please send me your address.


-- 
Maurice Suhre
suhre@trwrb.dsd.trw.com
From: hartman@informix.com (Robert Hartman)
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
Subject: Re: Violence at AA meetings
Date: 19 Nov 92 21:46:49 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <1244.779.uupcb@factory.com> bruce.baer@factory.com (Bruce Baer) writes:
>
>The prefered "method" of choice (at least here in N.Y., N.Y.) is to
>quickly have a few of the larger male members escourt the indavidual
>outside where they unceramniously kick the living shit out the person
>and then call an ambulance.  [for referral to detox]

Whew!  This is either tough love taken to an extreme, or it's
insane.  I don't know which.  Rolling someone into recovery!  Well,
I suppose it's better than leaving them to rot in the gutter.

But if somebody ever did that to me, blind-drunk or not, it'd be the
last time I ever showed up at a meeting!  (But then, I'm not from NY.)

Live and let live I guess.

-r
From: lang@igc.apc.org (Andrew Lang)
Newsgroups: alt.recovery
Subject: Re: Please help, someone is following m
Date: 23 Nov 92 04:39:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:1992Nov22.005548.21297@doug.cae.:-899344637:cdp:1309900066:000:698
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!lang    Nov 22 20:39:00 1992


Chris, if you think this man is capable of harming you, shouldn't
you go to the police?

What he is doing, of course, is entirely illegal.  It's called
"stalking."  He's also guilty of criminal trespass.  You've
already got a strong case against the guy (in my opinion).

The man is very sick and needs help.  And you should always 
remember that you are not responsible for his obsessive behavior.
You have done nothing to deserve it, and you are not the guilty
party.

Others may have had personal experience in this kind of abuse
and can give you better advice.  But I hope you are freed from
harrassment soon, and I hopes your friends and family are
rallying around you!

Andy
lang@igc.apc.org
From: nsabh@bssv01.hac.com (Nael Sabha)
Newsgroups: la.general
Subject: Research Papers
Date: 15 Nov 92 23:11:05 GMT
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

Anyone know the phone number or name of the 
company that sells research papers near UCLA?

nsabha@hac2arpa.hac.com

Newsgroups: la.general
From: fod@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov (Frank O'Donnell)
Subject: Re: Santa Barbara Island
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Distribution: la
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 02:39:10 GMT

rob@xyzoom.info.com (Rob Lingelbach) writes:

>Does anyone know if it is possible to visit Santa Barbara Island,
>which is about 50 miles SW of Santa Monica, straight out to sea?  Does
>the US Navy operate on this island, as I believe they do on San
>Nicolas Island, which is another 40 miles further out?

According to a copy of "Guide to Catalina and California's
Channel Islands" I bought last year, hiking is permitted
(on six miles of established trails), and camping is
available.  Hiking permits are required, free, and
available from park headquarters in Ventura, (805)
644-8262.  Public transport is available via power and
sail boat next to park headquarters in Ventura; info is
available from Island Packers, (805) 642-1393.  The book
says there are daily boats in the summer, but winter
weather gets "rather nasty" around Santa Barbara Island,
and few trips are scheduled.

Santa Barbara Island is a part of Channel Islands
National Park, along with San Miguel, Santa Rosa, Santa
Cruz and Anacapa islands.  It looks like San Nicolas and
San Clemente are the two islands the Navy uses in target
practice.

Frank
frank@jplpost.jpl.nasa.gov
From: srt@aero.org (Scott R. Turner)
Newsgroups: la.general
Subject: Re: Santa Barbara Island
Date: 23 Nov 92 18:30:27 GMT
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
Distribution: la
NNTP-Posting-Host: sun-marino.aero.org

fod@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov (Frank O'Donnell) writes:
>Public transport is available via power and sail boat next to park
>headquarters in Ventura; info is available from Island Packers, (805)
>642-1393.

As I recall, Island Packers has a monopoly on travel to the islands.
There are limits on the number of visitors, and reservations are
required.  But you could call IP for the details.

Although I've never been there, the consensus seems to be that there
is little of interest on the Channel Islands.  The one truly
interesting thing would be to see the seals that nest on the Islands,
but I'm not sure whether many seals nest on the public islands and
whether or not visitors are permitted close to the nesting sites.  If
anyone knows for sure, I'd be interested in hearing.

					-- Scott T.
Newsgroups: la.general
From: jrk@nittany.tcs.com (John Koper)
Subject: Need 2 tickets to ND - USC game
Followup-To: la.general
Organization: Teknekron Communications Systems Inc.
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 23:43:40 GMT

I need two tickets (seats together) for the November 28
Notre Dame/USC game.  If you are selling please let me know.

john
e-mail: jrk@tcs.com
phone:  510-649-3592

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Koper				| jrk@tcs.com
Software Engineer			| 2121 Allston Way, Berkeley, CA 94704
Teknekron Communications Systems, Inc.	| (510) 649-3592
From: dank@calvin.usc.edu (Dan King)
Newsgroups: la.general
Subject: Pssst! Want an iguana?
Date: 22 Nov 1992 20:41:42 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: la
NNTP-Posting-Host: calvin.usc.edu

Howdy, y'all. As my graduation date rapidly approaches, I've begun to
wonder what to do with my pet. It looks like I'll be packing up my
belongings and driving across the country to work and I would like to
find a home in LA for Sam, my iguana.

He's your standard green iguana, maybe two feet from snout to the tip
of his tail (that sounds big, but is 75% tail...he's not really all
that large). He's friendly (he's never even tried to bite me), likes
to be petted (though he's still generally afraid of people), a
vegetarian, and a really cool pet.

I would rather not have to haul him across the country so I'd like to
find him a home here (preferably with someone who has raised an ig
before). I can throw in a (very large) cage, a hot rock, and a bunch
of sticks and stuff.

If anyone is interested, drop me a piece of email and we can arrange
something.  Thanks!

dank
(dank@usc.edu)


Newsgroups: la.general
From: strnlght@netcom.com (David Sternlight)
Subject: Re: X Premiere and the Westwood Theatre Bull-s*^@
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 17:21:49 GMT


Given some of his past inflammatory behavior, and some behavior which
has been interpreted (by some) as anti-semitic, there is, I suggest,
a growing body of people who will not attend any Spike Lee movies,
as a form of protest.

As to the attempt to lay the blame for the earlier riots at the door
of Mann Theatres, while nobody can support their refusal to honor
prepaid tickets, nor to give a refund (very odd, by the way), blaming
that for the riots is another form of the usual bleeding heart crap
that blames, say, the L.A. riots on social injustice instead of
on the criminal looters who were the cause of action.

One premise of a civilized society is that one is responsible for one's
behavior and it's DIRECT consequences. To argue indirect consequences
in defense of a direct crime is more criminal special pleading.

Though some of the special pleaders are blacks and black apologists in
the present instance, one can hear the same logic from convicted
felons of all races, creeds, and colors in any public jail. "Society,
my father, my mother, my boss, my teacher, made me do it."

I'd ordinarily give this discussion a pass, but with the new beginning
the Clinton administration provides, it's important we call things for
what they are, and tell the truth, if we are to make progress in
improving things.

-- 
David Sternlight
(pgp 2.0 and ripem public keys available on request)
From: bsaeed@usc.edu (Babar Saeed)
Newsgroups: usc.general,la.general
Subject: Berkley in the Sixties
Date: 19 Nov 1992 15:26:45 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: la
NNTP-Posting-Host: girtab.usc.edu

				   
		    The International Film Club of
		  University of Southern California
				   
			       presents
				   
			 American Feature Film
				   
	     B E R K L E Y   I N   T H E   S I X T I E S
				   
		       1990, 117 minutes, color
		       Directed by: Mark Kitchell
		             In English
				   
		    Thursday, November 19, 7:00 pm
				   
		 Taper Hall of Humanities - Room 202
				   
			   Admission: $3.00
				   
			    Sponsored by:
		   International Students' Assembly
	     Office for International Students & Scholors

				   
	   For more information, please call (213) 740-2666
From: rogers@isi.edu (Craig Milo Rogers)
Newsgroups: la.general
Subject: Re: Has Anyone Been to Harmony Before?
Date: 21 Nov 92 05:25:49 GMT
Reply-To: rogers@blips.isi.edu (Craig Milo Rogers)
Distribution: ca
Organization: USC-Information Sciences Institute

In article <lgo8gmINNg39@ai.cs.utexas.edu> you write:
>This is a shot in the dark...
>Has anyone been to a tiny, tiny (population 18) town called Harmony?
>Its closest big city is Santa Barbara

	It is actually close to San Luis Obispo, not Santa Barbara
(neither of which is a "big city" in my book).

>, and it is actually an artists'
>colony.  I'm looking for the address of the pottery shop there that
>sells porcelain jewelry (they have a tiny loft space in the store
>where they appear to do some of the porcelain work), and I'm dying to
>have this piece that I saw there when I was touring through California
>a couple months ago.

	Why not try:

	Pottery Shop
	Harmony, CA  93435

(ZIP code from the 1991 National ZIP Code Directory.)

					Craig Milo Rogers
From: marshall@sirius.usc.edu (Bob Marshall)
Newsgroups: la.general,usc.general
Subject: Improv Evening
Date: 19 Nov 1992 16:46:28 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: la,usc
NNTP-Posting-Host: sirius.usc.edu

The University of Southern California Health Science Campus, AIDS Quilt 
Display Committee is sponsoring an evening at the Improv in Santa Monica 
to benefit AIDS charities, Cares and Project Angel Food. 


   Improv
   321 Santa Monica Blvd.
   Santa Monica

   22/Nov   Sunday    8:00pm

   Ticket Price $10

   Contact: Rick Scott  213-224-5313  for information and tickets.
 

This is a good cause and they need you to buy tickets. This is a very nice 
way to help others. Think of the stress reduction here, gang. Going to the 
Improv, what could possibly be better for you and for other nice people that
From: Darren.Hanson@f271.n103.z1.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: la.general
Subject: Community College Fees for Spring
X-Sender: newtout 0.02 Nov 17 1992
Date: 22 Nov 92  20:33:00

Reply-To: darren@ofa123.fidonet.org

ostubble@agsm.ucla.edu (Otha Stubblefield III) wrote:

 > I saw this notice at West Los Angeles College, yesterday,
 > announcing the new fees structure for Spring 92.  This was
 > also reaffirmed by a bulletin for the LA Community College
 > Instructional TV Program that charges the same fees.

 > *  There is no longer a flat fee after taking a certain number of
 >    units. Before, there was a flat fee ($60) if you took 10 or
 >    more units.  This is no more.  Your fees will strictly be X * the
 >    number of units you are taking, plus special campus fees (see below).
This is part of CA's new budget.

 > *  If you DO NOT HAVE a bachelor's or higher degree, you pay $10/unit.
So is this.

 > *  If you HAVE a bachelor's or higher degree, you pay $50/unit.
And this. However, it applies to anywone with the requisit units
even if they never received a degree. Also, there are exemptions
provided for certain unemployed workers, some re-entry students
and recipients of certain types of government aid. Those eligible
for exemptions will pay the $10/unit instead.

 > *  If you are classified as a non-resident of California,you pay $123/unit.
This apparently vaires from district to district. The Coast Community College 
District in Orange County, has fees of $104 for non-Californian, American
students and $107 for non-US citizens.

 > Beginning in Spring, the LA Community Colleges (West, Southwest, City,
 > East LA, Valley, Pierce, Mission, Trade Tech and Harbor) will begin
 > charging a mandatory $7.50 health insurance fee.  The flyer that I saw
 > stated that waiving this fee would only be based on finanacial need,
 > and no mention was made about your having other coverage.  This fee is
 > already in effect at El Camino and Santa Monica (I think), and my friends
 > that go there have said they had to pay it even though the had other
 > coverage.
A "Student Health Services Fee" has also been in effect in the
CCC District for at least 8 years now. It is $7.50 and is waived
only for people who receive BOGG grants, are enrolled solely in
classes of two weeks duration or less, or who can PROVE that they
"depend solely on prayer for healing in accordance with the
teachings of a bona fide religious sect, denomination [or]
organization." After talking with the Dean of Administrations at
one of the campasus, it has been made clear that the "sect,
denomination, etc" has to FORBID use of techniques other than
prayer in healing or the fee will have to be paid anyway....

Then there is the required photo ID card and the "optional" College Services
Charge. I put "optional" in quotes because if you don't pay the fee, you can't 
preregister for classes and are effectively treated as a new student every
semester making it all but impossible to get any classes....
--
__                 __
\/  Darren Hanson  \/

Reply to "darren@ofa123.fidonet.org" if you want it to arrive!

---