HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ss@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Scott Stuart)
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject: colloquialisms (Was: strange Appalachian sayings)
Date: 25 Jul 92 10:40:35 GMT
Reply-To: ss@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Scott Stuart)
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh

As the last sentence explains, I received this in the mail, and so I'm
sending it along to everyone.

}My maternal grandparents are from Georgia.  My grandfather's from Blakely
}and nana's from Statesboro.  They and my mom (born in Canal Point, Fla.)
}almost always responded "Fair to middlin'" when asked "How ya doin'?"
}I've always taken it to mean "pretty good" or "as well as can be expected."
} 
}Around Burnsville, NC, the folks ask "Y'all right?"
} 
}In Cruso, NC (Ten miles of friendly people and one old grouch, near Canton)
}customers shopping in my friend's store ask you to put their purchases in
}a "poke".
} 
}Another customer used to ask me to give him some "lipulated sugar" (a kiss)
}to go with his coffee.
} 
}Sorry, I can't post this.. I've done something to my account that keeps me
}from doing so,   Kristie Butler  azklb@asuacad

The 'lipulated sugar' is a new on to me.  The burning question, though:
Did you comply, Kristie? :-)

scott
From: buckley@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (BUCKLEY  CHARLES RAY)
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject: Re: Deliverance revisited - (was REAL Appalachia
Date: 21 Jul 92 09:15:53 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder

In article <92198.195211LNF@psuvm.psu.edu> <LNF@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>I was always an outsider "just visiting" West Virginia.  We spent a lot of time
>at Cheat and Tygart Lakes, backpacking  Dolly Sods, Otter Creek,etc.,skiing
>Snowshoe, partying with the nurses in Morgantown,...   You get the picture -
>a true outsider.  I avoided the rural bars (clubs?) after concluding that the
>primary reason for these establishments was brawling.  I've seen places
>that people brought in their own booze and sat around drinking until they
>managed to get a riot going.
>
>I think my worst encounter with the locals was the time about 15 years ago
>that we were kayaking the Cheat River.  We put in at Albright (I think) and
>took out at the last road above the Cheat Lake.  We were met at the take-out
>by 2 gentlemen, one had a rifle, the other a shotgun.  They were requesting
>a toll for crossing over land that belonged to the power company.  Luckily,
>we convinced them that we kayaked without wallets (true!) and couldn't
>pay the toll.  Naturally, they let us pass with a warning to come
>better prepared next time.
>
>A couple of phone calls to the police and power company apparently fixed
>the problem, but it scared the hell out of me at the time.
>
>Admittedly, all of the people didn't possess these unique qualities.  We
>finished a rafting trip at the same location and got a ride to the first
>town up the road.  One person hitched a ride back to the put-in to get
>the car and 3 of us went into the local tavern.  I went up to the bar and
>explained that we wanted to "establish a line of credit" until our money
>showed up in the car.  They started a tab, opened the pool table for free play
>and even gave us a few pitchers of beer.  Couldn't beat the hospitality.
>
>Larry

Next time please don't have Penn State bumper stickers. Also ditch
the plates, they might think you're from Pittsburgh.

Charles Buckley
From: ss@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Scott Stuart)
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject: Re: Going by Middle Name
Date: 28 Jul 92 10:46:48 GMT
Reply-To: ss@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Scott Stuart)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U

In article <1992Jul26.141325.14494@vela.acs.oakland.edu> wchaga@vela.acs.oakland.edu (William C. Haga) writes:
>
>Do your friends refer to you by your first or middle name? 
>So..., is this a regional custom for parts of Appalachia?  Have any
>of you alt.a readers experienced this?


I have always been called by my middle name, but that is only because my
mother wanted to call me Scott, and my father wanted to have my initials
the same as his and my grandfather's: JSS.  It is a real pain trying to
explain to people how your name isn't the same as you've written it.  It
is even worse now that I'm been in Scotland, because everyone assumes that
Stuart, my last name, is my first name, and that Scott, my middle name,
by which I am called, is my surname!

scott
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: ljones@utkvx3.utk.edu (Jones, Leslie Lamont)
Subject: Comb Graves
Organization: University of Tennessee Computing Center
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 20:38:00 GMT

Wonderful sub, this!

I am an East Tennessee native and currently the summer naturalist at 
Cumberland Mountain State Park, near Crossville. During in-service training
at Standing Stone State Park, near Livingston, TN, I saw comb graves for the
first time. This is a grave in which the burial site is covered by two slabs
of stone leaning together to form a prism. The ends of the prism are sealed 
with triangular pieces of stone. This was apparently a fashion on the 
Cumberland Plateau during the earlier part of this century. I am told it
was also practiced in northern Alabama and parts of Kentucky.

I thought you all might be interested in this and that someone might have
additional information about comb graves, such as the period of their
popularity. Also, can anyone confirm that they are so-called because they 
form a ridge, or comb?

Leslie Jones
Maryville, TN
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Tuesday, 28 Jul 1992 15:33:26 MST
From: <AQMPH@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject:    RE: middle names

Growing up, in southern West Virginia, we were always called by both our first
and middle names.  What's really interesting is that some people are called by
a name which has absolutely no resemblance to their given name.  I don't mean
a nickname.  Such as Jo Ann may actually be called Betty or Barbara Sue may be
called Alice.  That's a custom I have found anywhere else but in the south and
only in certain subgroups at that.

Mary
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: benner@triton.unm.edu ()
Subject: Re: Going by Middle Name
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 16:29:04 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <40078@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk> ss@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Scott Stuart) writes:
>In article <1992Jul26.141325.14494@vela.acs.oakland.edu> wchaga@vela.acs.oakland.edu (William C. Haga) writes:
>>
>>Do your friends refer to you by your first or middle name? 
>>So..., is this a regional custom for parts of Appalachia?  Have any
>>of you alt.a readers experienced this?
>
>
>I have always been called by my middle name, but that is only because my
>mother wanted to call me Scott, and my father wanted to have my initials
>the same as his and my grandfather's: JSS.  It is a real pain trying to
>explain to people how your name isn't the same as you've written it.  It
>is even worse now that I'm been in Scotland, because everyone assumes that
>Stuart, my last name, is my first name, and that Scott, my middle name,
>by which I am called, is my surname!
>
>scott

Yes, middle names were commonly used when I was in WV, but even more
common was the use of first AND middle names, i.e Kelly Ann, Laura Jane,
John Curtis, David Edward, etc.

I assume the same is true of other parts of appalachia?

John

Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: csjan@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jan Faires)
Subject: Re: strange appalachian sayings
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 14:02:25 GMT

When we lived in Kentucky and Tennessee (6 wonderful years a looong
time ago), people we were visiting would say, "Stay with us" when we
got ready to leave.  Being yankee-born, we thought they meant spend
the night!

Among Southern Presbyterians there was a saying that when Southern
Presbyterians die, they don't go to Heaven, they go to Montreat, NC.
After I saw the Ashville-Mars Hill are of NC, I understood what they
meant!  Please, God, if I'm good, can I end my days in North Carolina?


Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: trev@hubcap.clemson.edu (Trevor Bauknight)
Subject: Re: Bele Chere (long)
Organization: Jes Grew Carriers -- Metaphysical Bunko Squad 
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 04:47:44 GMT

streeter@cs.unca.edu (Tom Streeter) writes:

>This weekend (July 24-26) in Asheville, downtown closes down to host the

Sure wish I didn't have to work...

>FRIDAY:

>Ex-Presidents

One wild bunch from here in Greenville...will they keep their clothes on?

>Southern Culture on the Skids (also Sat.)

Excellent rockabilly band from somewhere up in eastern North Carolina...

>Thomas Mapfumo and the Blacks Unlimited ($10)

Should be a great show...

>SATURDAY

>The Brother Boys

Great acoustic duo from Johnson City.  Their demo was incredible...some
really great songs, including a cover of the Louvin Brothers' "Are You
Ready for the Great Atomic Power?"  I think these guys run the Down
Home pickin' parlor up there.
 
>Samba Ngo

Hmmm...good show.

>Los Lobos/Marty Brown ($5.00)

Wow!

Nothing on Sunday?  I don't have to work then...

Thanks for the info!

 
Trevor Bauknight         trev@hubcap.clemson.edu    ...gatech!hubcap!trev
 
                                                     +-----------+
                                                     | _> ###    |
                  go gamecocks                       |     |     |
                                                     +-----------+
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: r0mill01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu (Robert Delius Royar)
Subject: Re: Strange Appalachian sayings
Reply-To: r0mill01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu
Organization: University of Louisville
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 14:28:09 GMT

In article <1992Jul26.132150.994@ibmpcug.co.uk>, gtoal@ibmpcug.co.uk (Graham Toal) writes:
>In article <1992Jul26.061421.11060@samba.oit.unc.edu> Fred.Homan@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Fred Homan) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul25.212902.5253@ibmpcug.co.uk> gtoal@ibmpcug.co.uk (Graham Toal) writes:
>>>A 'poke' for a paper bag is standard Scots idiom too.  (Someone mentioned
>>>the word in another posting)
>>
>>	From which we get the more-than-Appalachian-used phrase "Pig in a
>>Poke".  Though why anyone would put a pig in a paper bag instead of something
>>stronger is beyond me.  I've never heard people in West Virginia use poke in
>
>Errr... that's the point.  If you buy a pig that can fit in a paper
>bag, it can't be much of a pig, right?
>
>G
>(Say, would folks consider xposting articles about language usage
>to alt.usage.english?)
>-- 
A poke is now a paper bag, but a poke is actually any bag (perhaps of 
burlap, canvas or jute-cloth).  A pig in a poke is hidden from view, so you 
cannot see what you are getting.

BTW middling is found all the way back to the 12thc in Scotts and first 
used by Ben Jonson in the Southern areas (ENGLAND) in the 17thc.  I has 
been so entwined with two root words that it carries mixed meanings:
  anywhere between to states
  in the middle
  pretty good
  mediocre
  the middle part of a pig
These are just a few.  There are a fair to middling number more
in the OED.

r. royar (not from anywhere actually)
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: lwv26@cas.org (Larry W. Virden)
Subject: Re: Going by Middle Name
Followup-To: alt.appalachian
Reply-To: lvirden@cas.org (Larry W. Virden)
Organization: Nedriv Software and Shoe Shiners, Uninc.
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 15:24:33 GMT

In article <synm9!n@lynx.unm.edu> benner@triton.unm.edu () writes:
:>In article <1992Jul26.141325.14494@vela.acs.oakland.edu> wchaga@vela.acs.oakland.edu (William C. Haga) writes:
:>>
:>>Do your friends refer to you by your first or middle name? 
:>>So..., is this a regional custom for parts of Appalachia?  Have any
:>>of you alt.a readers experienced this?


:Yes, middle names were commonly used when I was in WV, but even more
:common was the use of first AND middle names, i.e Kelly Ann, Laura Jane,
:John Curtis, David Edward, etc.
:
:I assume the same is true of other parts of appalachia?
:

0. Background note: childhood - Tyler/Wetzel Counties, WV, 1955-1973.

1. The only time _I_ was called Larry Wayne was when I was in
trouble.  I don't ever remember my brother being called by his middle
name - but then, he is a Jr and was called Little Donnie.  My sister
was almost always Teresa Kay.

2. While we don't live in WV any longer, I call my eldest by a nickname
(Ben rather than Benjamin Andrew) except when there's trouble a brewin',
my daughter by full name many times (Laura Jeanne), and the babies by
nicknames (Danny Jo instead of Daniel Joseph and Jon or Jonnie or JoJo
instead of Jonathan David).  

I don't remember a lot of middle name uses, except for my mom's dad -
his name was Andrew Jackson Duncan but everyone in the family
and close friends calls him Jack and the folks he worked with always called
him Andy!

Mom changed her first name and didnt use the middle much at all - Dad's
middle name was his dad's first name (Elmer) and so didnt get called by
it much.
-- 
Larry W. Virden                 UUCP: osu-cis!chemabs!lvirden
Same Mbox: BITNET: lvirden@cas  INET: lvirden@cas.org
Personal: 674 Falls Place,   Reynoldsburg, OH 43068-1614
America Online: lvirden@aol.com
From: nestorm@fedc04.fed.ornl.gov
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject: Retirement
Date: 31 Jul 92 15:16:53 GMT
Organization: MIT PLASMA FUSION CENTER

Almost anywhere in East Tennessee/Western North Carolina would be a nice
place to retire, and lots of people have done it. It depends on what level
of "cultural" you want. I know people who have moved to the Chapel Hill
area of North Carolina for that reason. I'm a near-native of East Tennessee
myself, and I think we've got a very nice mix in the Oak Ridge area, but
then my cultural standards may not be that high (insert smiley-face here).
We haven't had any snow worth mentioning in the last several years, much
to my children's discontent, and while July and August tend to be hot and
muggy, even my transplanted-Yankee husband says he wouldn't go back to
Ohio or Connecticut (where he lived before moving here).
You might consider the Cumberland Plateau (Crossville area) -- it's usually
5 to 10 degrees cooler there than in Knoxville, and the mountains are nice.
(Also an outstanding theatre, Cumberland County Playhouse, and you're
between Knoxville and Nashville.)

Bonnie Nestor
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Tuesday, 28 Jul 1992 15:37:39 MST
From: <AQMPH@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject:    RE:strange appalachian sayings


A few more sayings which appear to be confined to the appalachian region
(judging by my experience and please correct me if I'm wrong):

-"Someone got peached" - meaning you got a very close haircut

-"No use to rush off" - which is used at all times - someone could be at our
home for hours and my family always insisted (in fact my mother told me it's
rude not to say this) no use to rush off, come back when you can stay longer.

-"Hinton's up the river" - this is limited to those areas down the river from
Hinton, WV.  This is very popular in southern West Virginia meaning stop hintin
g because you're not going to get it.
A couple of silly ones where the meanings are obvious include:

-Stretch a mile if I didn't have to walk back.

-Colder than a coal miners ass (or lunch bucket).

-Look what the cat drug in and the dog forgot to eat.

Mary
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: r0mill01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu (Robert Delius Royar)
Subject: Re: violence etc.
Reply-To: r0mill01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu
Organization: University of Louisville
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 08:23:38 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.234107.22371@ms.uky.edu>, uk09365@nx06.mik.uky.edu (robert i kesten) writes:
>I am currently taking a graduate English course in creative
>writing and storytelling.  The focus is on Appalachian
>storytelling and folklore from both a traditional
>and a post-modern view.  The instructor is Gurney
>Norman.  Perhaps you have heard of him?  He authored
>DEVINE RIGHT'S TRIP, "Fat Monroe" (made into a short

I just completed teaching a course in Fiction where our books were
 *Kinfolks: The Wilgus Stories* by Norman
 *People of Gumption and Other Stories* by Fran Lehr (from the Benton/
  Murray area of western Ky)
 *My Life in the Bush of Ghosts* by Amos Tutuola (from Nigeria)

My students liked the Wilgus Stories best of all and many asked about 
recent fiction by Mr. Norman.  Is there any?  Where can they find it?

Robert Royar, Department of English, New York Institute of Technology

Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: Fred.Homan@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Fred Homan)
Subject: Re: Strange Appalachian sayings
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 07:30:02 GMT

In article <39457@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk> ss@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Scott Stuart) writes:
>>>but they (and now I) always say 'fair to middlin' when asked how we are
>
>I'm from Southwest Virginia, and I have also heard that saying many times.
>I have always interpreted the middlin' to be something like in the middle,
>i.e. so-so or OK, and fair to mean good.  Thus, the phrase means 
>good to OK.  Does that make sense to anyone else?

	I'm from southern West Virginia (Beckley) and heard it quite a lot. My
understanding is the same as yours.  Middlin' always meant "around the middle"
as far as I could tell.  About equivalent in my mind to "Fine, but not great."

Fred Op

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: gtoal@ibmpcug.co.uk (Graham Toal)
Subject: Re: Strange Appalachian sayings
Organization: The IBM PC User Group, UK.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 21:29:02 GMT

In article <1992Jul25.073337.20459@samba.oit.unc.edu> Fred.Homan@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Fred Homan) writes:
:	Considering the number of Scottish immigrants who settled Appalachia
:(Southern West Virginia is littered with Glen XXXX and Radford, Virginia
:celebrates Scottish Highland Days) it would not surprise me if the saying is
:handed down from them.
:
:Fred Op

A 'poke' for a paper bag is standard Scots idiom too.  (Someone mentioned
the word in another posting)

G
--
From: rcj@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (R.C. Jones)
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject: Re: strange appalachian sayings
Date: 29 Jul 92 17:16:18 GMT
Organization: Chevron Oil Field Research, La Habra, CA.


 My wife and I currently live in Orange county (California) and
have a country place in Julian which is in the mountains north east
of San Diego (elevation ~ 4000 ft.).
 This December we plan to drive east to hunt around for a possible
area to retire to in a few years. Currently, we are thinking about
western North Carolina in the hopes of finding a balance of climate
that is not too cold and not too hot in summer. We hope to find a
comfortable place which is not too far from a college or some
access to the cultural.
 Can any of you who have knowledge or experience in the above give
us advice on how we might improve our search or why it's not a good
idea? We have lived previously in the far east,London, Houston, and
Pittsburgh. 
Thanks for any help.
-- 
        |______________________________________________________________| 
||||||||| Dik Jones, Advanced Systems        Internet: rcj@Chevron.com |
        | Chevron Oil Field Research Co.           Tel: (310) 694-7056 | 
        | La Habra, California 90633-0446          Fax: (310) 694-7063 |  
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: Fred.Homan@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Fred Homan)
Subject: Re: Strange Appalachian sayings
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 07:33:37 GMT

In article <39826@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk> dch@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Dave Hamilton) writes:
>
>>>>but they (and now I) always say 'fair to middlin' when asked how we are
>
>
>This is a standard reply here in Scotland as well, meaning (as Scott mentioned)
>good to ok.

	Considering the number of Scottish immigrants who settled Appalachia
(Southern West Virginia is littered with Glen XXXX and Radford, Virginia
celebrates Scottish Highland Days) it would not surprise me if the saying is
handed down from them.

Fred Op

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: mullens@jamsun.ic.ornl.gov (James A. Mullens)
Subject: Re: violence etc.
Organization: Oak Ridge National Laboratory
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 16:52:09 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.234107.22371@ms.uky.edu>, uk09365@nx06.mik.uky.edu (robert i kesten) writes:
|> Please relate personal experiences with, or family incidents,
|> histories or accounts of violence and feuding in the
|> Appalachian area.  If it is not too personal and/or difficult,
|> please discuss feuds in which your ancestors were involved.

Macabre, but I'll bite.

As well as I can remember the story...  About 100 years ago, in West Virginia,
my great-great-grandfather owned a farm with the usual collection of horses.
He also had a nephew who had fallen in with the "wrong crowd".  One day he
stumbled onto this group trying to steal his horses.  He shot and managed to
hit one of them -- his nephew.  His nephew said "You've killed me uncle"
(which was true) and he replied "I warned you not to run with that bunch".
...end of story.

In next week's class we'll cover the topic of cannibalism in coal mines :-)

jim mullens
jcm@ornl.gov (128.219.128.17) -or- mullens@jamsun.ic.ornl.gov (128.219.64.31)
voice: 615-574-5564
From: dch@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Dave Hamilton)
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
Subject: Re: Strange Appalachian sayings
Date: 24 Jul 92 12:17:37 GMT
Reply-To: dch@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Dave Hamilton)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U


>>>but they (and now I) always say 'fair to middlin' when asked how we are


This is a standard reply here in Scotland as well, meaning (as Scott mentioned)
good to ok.

Dave
dch@uk.ac.ed.dcs
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: buckley@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (BUCKLEY  CHARLES RAY)
Subject: Re: Going by Middle Name
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 08:37:48 GMT

Perhaps my family picked up some furrin influences from Ohio, but the only time
I heard my middle name was when I was in trouble. However, to this day I have
no idea what half my greatuncle's names were because of their nicknames.

Charles Buckley

Newsgroups: alt.appalachian
From: burke@tss.com (Jim Burke)
Subject: Placed for retirement (was Re: strange appalachian sayings)
Reply-To: burke@tss.com (Jim Burke)
Organization: Teknekron Software Systems. Inc.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 21:28:18 GMT

In article <5520@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com>, rcj@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (R.C. Jones) writes:

|>  This December we plan to drive east to hunt around for a possible
|> area to retire to in a few years. Currently, we are thinking about
|> western North Carolina in the hopes of finding a balance of climate
|> that is not too cold and not too hot in summer. We hope to find a
|> comfortable place which is not too far from a college or some
|> access to the cultural.

Make sure you pass through Asheville, NC.  Asheville is on the edge of
the Smokey Mountains.  Three of four years ago (maybe five) it was
rated as the best place to live in America by Rand-McNalley.  It has a
nice balance of climate, culture, and rural-ness to be a very attractive
place.

-- 

	Jim Burke	"Life is uncertain - eat dessert first!"
	Teknekron Software Systems		... burke@tss.com
  	phone:(415) 617-2432			... uunet!tekbspa!burke
Newsgroups: alt.appalachian