HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SINL playoffs
Date: 14 Aug 92 18:59:11 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Originator: spot@HOPELESS.MESS.CS.CMU.EDU

>>>>> On 14 Aug 92 06:24:14 GMT, tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) said:

Tom>  12 AM, Team Rankscum, and Team Crackpot all ended  the season at
Tom> 3-1.   12 AM wins  the tie-breaker because   they are an at-large
Tom> team, so they are the third seed.


this is utter bullshit.  Crackpot played 12AM and creamed them.
-- 
			consume
Scott Draves		be silent
spot@cs.cmu.edu		die
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: rjones@itchy.dsd.es.com (Ray Jones - Perp)
Subject: Re: inl server problem?
Organization: Design Systems Division, Evans & Sutherland, SLC, UT
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 17:56:35 GMT

In article <713882394.18638.0@borman.res.andrew.cmu.edu> Rick <stimpy+@cmu.edu> writes:
>Has anyone else had a problem with the "logfile"?  I seem to miss
>a significant percentage of the "Leaving" messages. At the end of
>tonights game, the logfile only recorded 10 of the 16 players
>"Leaving" stats. Even in testing the server, I would sometimes lose
>the "Leaving" message when I was the only player in the game. Is this
>a known problem or just a problem with my executable? Any ideas what
>could be causing the problem?

At first glance, it appears to be a synchronization problem... The daemon
kills everyone off in a very short time, and each of the ntserv processes
tries to put an netry in the log file at that time... I'm not sure what the
effect of this is, but I imagine it can cause an entry to be lost.  I'll
look at putting in some sort of locking mechanism in the next release.

>--Rick

Ray



--
                                          Ray Jones
                                          rjones@dsd.es.com
Organization: Sophomore, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 21:55:25 -0400 
From: "Joseph E. Beck" <jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: At Large Teams
	<15AUG199211422377@zeus.tamu.edu>

>>1) All games involving an at-large team should be played at a
>>nuetral site (to minimize lag differences).

>   This seems completely reasonable to me, would anyone (probably from
>   CMU) care to point out why this would not be fair.  And please don't
>   post that with UDP this is not needed, you still get lag with UPD.  
>   If you don't believe me send me mail and we'll dogfight on my local 
>   server. 

This seems fair.  Just make sure it is in fact a neutral site.  "Oh,
it's a west coast team?  I know this server is northern Maine we can
use.  We're playing CMU?  Great! We'll play them at flint. etc."  If 
it is a neutral site, this sounds like a good suggestion.  I'd go so
far as to say all inl games be played at a neutral site, but the
problems of determining how fair it is to both teams is very difficult. 

> 
>>2) In an at-large vs. school game, the at-large team should get
>>first choice of race.  There's no good way to totally make up for not 
>>having your team in the same room, but this would help some.


>   This part isn't as critical as the your first point, besides  school teams
>   (read CMU) will whine enough over the first point.


Grow up.  Not all CMU people are alike, and not all school teams hate at
large teams.  Most people agree at large teams should get some
advantage, the question is how much (and after this year's playoffs my
feeling is the current system is favorable).  

Giving first choice of race?  Sure, for the next netrek season at
least this seems resaonable. 

I think more people would prefer playing at large teams at neutral
sites, and giving them first selection of race than having them win
all tie breakers.  

	joe
	Purple haze
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Unhappy
Date: 16 Aug 1992 08:37:03 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <8eXUChW00VpNEQHmJG@andrew.cmu.edu> "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
)
)1) From the perspective of a team sport, it makes sense to have only one
)team from each school.  From the perspective of having a lot of good
)games it makes more sense to allow multiple teams from schools which
)want them and can field them.  If the INL chooses not to serve players
)who want to play in quality games, then it will be time to replace it.

I didn't say there would be only one team from each school (although 
this is the solution I prefer, it's reasonably certain the INL Council
will not agree with me).  I do *not* want to see more than one CMU
team in the playoffs, and there are many ways of accomplishing this
(the method that makes the most sense to me would be to have a
divisional playoff between the CMU teams to choose their INL playoff
representative).

This allows the CMU teams equal opportunity to play, but denies them
the ability to say, at any point, "we're not going to play anymore"; 
if they do, they can now be disqualified out of hand, as any team
from any other school would be if they refused to play.

)2) AA and RS chose not to play, not because they wanted to share in the
)AllEncompassingGloryOfCMUExcelence (TM) but because it would have been a
)BAD game.  The real game would have consisted of Rob, Greg, and myself
)searching for CMU players who hadn't been on an INL team who could sub
)for our players who were working, out of town, or sick (Val Ckurai had
)to come in and play sick last night so that GBO would not out-number RS
)8-7).  So, yes, the game could have been played, but it would not have
)been a good game.

And I said that it was OK to postpone the championship game if both
captains agreed to it; if this would have been more acceptable, you 
could have done it.  Certainly the way it was handled was horrible.
 -Tom
From: jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Joseph E. Beck)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Mucus... how good is he? (was Re: I will assault MUCUS(and he will not respond))
Date: 14 Aug 92 02:19:24 GMT
	<1992Aug12.203717.5544@dsd.es.com>
Organization: Sophomore, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


>        spaceace, amazing, ginger lynn, duck dodgers, freekill, hector,
>red shirt, mergatroid, videodrome, zznewguy, gadfly, mojo, wreck,
>mr. wizard, quodavis, sandia, spaceman spiff, eek, yea boy!!!,
>washout, ayeser, d'spayre, drewskii, luri, mind crime, rjones, 
>darkhorse, fillintheblank, old nick, icarus, bav, spaceghost, beck,
>balton, helix, sunscreamer, and myself.

>        That's 35.

Geez, I think *I'm* better than some of these people and I know I'm
not as good as MUCUS (from watching him play).

ZZnew guy and I looked at the list and found 9 players we thought were
"around 9" players on the list who were better than MUCUS.  No, he
isn't in the top 5 players, probably not even in the top 10 but he is
still very good.

> I always have to watch him  but his ogging is
>way overrated and even I can out-dogfight him. 

Ah yes...the best criteria-dogfighting.  Yes his ogging *is* way
overrated, he probably only earns a 9 out of 10.  

> Or haven't you heard the saying, "You don't kick a man when he's
>down."?

Yes, MUCUS harasses people but I've seen 3 major results from this:
1.  People want to know how they screwed up.  I spent a few
    minutes explaining to a newbie why MUCUS was screaming at
    them.  They probably won't shoot torps over their army carriers
    when there are oggers nearby anymore.

2.  People are very happy when MUCUS sends them a compliment.  I know
    I'm very happy when our team gets congratulated for cooperating
    well or if I get a "good job" message.  If *he* was happy with how
    well you did it must have been spectacular. :-)

3.  People who don't read the MOTD get upset and quit out.  If they
    don't know to read the MOTD I don't consider them a big loss.
    If you don't want to listen to him, there's this ignore status you
    can set (on bronco servers).


     joe
     Purple haze
     Who just got a large ego boost when he heard he's better than MUCUS
Organization: Sophomore, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 21:05:41 -0400 
From: "Joseph E. Beck" <jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: SINL PLAYOFF UNOFFICIAL RANKING
	<1992Aug15.062814.7945@dsd.es.com>

 
>              The 12 Angry Men deserved to play in the tournament far more
>than team Crack-in-the-ass.  And if you can't see that, you're clearly from 
>CMU.

Sorry, I thought the purpose of the playoffs was to get the BEST
teams possible involved.  In close cases at large teams should be
given benefit of the doubt.  But in a 4 game schedule, when the at
large team *loses* to a team, and has the same record, there is no way
they should make the playoffs.  If you don't see this you're clear on
the 12 Angry Men.

	joe
	Purple haze
From: bathurst@noaapmel.gov (Bill Bathurst)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: The BEST in the WORLD!!!
Date: 21 Aug 92 20:49:06 GMT
Article-I.D.: felix.BATHURST.92Aug21124906
Organization: NOAA/PMEL, Sand Point Way, Seattle, WA


From my observations from playing a lot at Berkeley and CMU servers:


  * Best planet-taker

        No clear winner here in my opinion

  * Best dog-fighter

	Spaceace!	

	Spaceace has impressed me the most as of late.  The name is
	appropriate.  He can dominate you if you let up one bit.  If I see
	him on the other side I know I have to order a double-tall latte to
	keep up with him.

  * Best SB

        Luri  

	He is good at sending out messages, handling ogg waves one after
        another, and keeping an uneven side in contention.

  * Best SC bomber

        Suzka

	There is nothing worse than the wrath of a woman.  Suzka hates
	your armies.  They *will* die (:

  * Best ogger

        Duck Dodgers

	I think he is the best ogger around.  He has it down to a science (:
	He is always active sharking carriers and he has a *exceptional* 
	success rate at ogging.

  * Best overall player

	Too many *excellent* overall players.  I would have to say the vast
	amount of them do come from CMU.  Too close of a call if you ask me.
	Then again, there was that *sneaker* guy... (:

  * Best vocabulary

	MUCAS PIG

	Must be a relative of E.Honda - Oinnk!

  * Best place to play netrek

	At laggU!!  We have all the babes.  What we lose in skill, we easily
	makeup in the total array of babes cheering us on.  Hehe (:   Heck, 
	Panther almost has to fight them off.  Now he doesn't show up for 
	most of the games because the babes.  Our team was thinking of charging
	Panther stud fees so we could afford more x-terminals.  Ah well..

--
Bill Bathurst				Internet:	bathurst@noaapmel.gov 
NOAA/PMEL				Phone:		(206) 526-6765
From: osyjm@cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: NOTES ON THE SINL FINAL>>> (was Re: SINL finals)
Date: 16 Aug 92 22:17:07 GMT
Organization: CS


Just some notes and my thoughts on the subjects...

1)  The INL council has nothing to do with the Summer INL.  Any decisions
are made by Tom.  You don't like something he says, take it up with him, but
don't blame the council for anything regarding this summer's fun and games.

2)  The INL council has looked at several options for games.  Ladders,
status quo, etc.  Some decisions have been made/voted on, I will leave it
to Tom to post those decisions, it's his job...    (I think)

3)  The INL is a new concept, there are bound to be problems.  It's
only been 2 seasons, don't call it broke yet, the INL council is trying to
address issues that have been brought up as defects in the current system.
Right now, we're kind of stuck, as some members are gone, so things are in
limbo...  at least until school starts.

4)  I think it would've been more appropriate for RS and AA to talk it over
with Tom before declaring a co-championship...  On the other hand, I'm not
against waiting 2 weeks to see the game...

5)  The first mistake was probably giving RS an extension.  That kind of
pushed things up against the wall for timeliness.  This shouldn't be
a problem in the fall INL, the council has voted a "potential" solution into
place that should address this problem.

6)  I don't agree with Tom's assertion that there should only be one CMU
team in the playoffs, I think it's a mistake.  If the talent is at CMU, then
multiple CMU teams should be in the playoffs.  Besides, a Berkeley team did
make it to the playoffs, so what's the big deal?

7)  I personally prefer to see as many teams as possible in the INL, and as
many CMU teams as possible in, for 2 reasons (a) it dilutes the talent, and
(b) what possible difference does it make?  The more teams, the merrier.

8)  I thought the INL council had discussed the "# of Teams" issue already,
but I don't recall a formal vote, but it seemed like it was running in favor
of no limit on teams... I could be mistaken.
-- 
 Jaye Mathisen, COE Systems Manager                (406) 994-4780
 410 Roberts Hall,Dept. of Computer Science
 Montana State University,Bozeman MT 59717	osyjm@cs.montana.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: btd@iastate.edu (Benjamin T Dehner)
Subject: .xtrekrc question
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 18:14:34 GMT

	I have a real quick question.  Is there a way to specify in the
.xtrekrc file the position/size/etc. of the 'wait queue' window?  Since I
occaisionally play on a DecWindows station telneted to an Xwindows station
which is running the client, unless things are specified exactly, I won't
get it.

thanks

Ben
Cthulhu

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Benjamin T. Dehner          Department of Physics and Astronomy 
btd@iastate.edu             Iowa State University 
                            Ames, IA 50011

Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 17:32:17 -0400 
From: "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: SINL playoffs

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 14-Aug-92 SINL playoffs Tom
Holub@soda.berkeley. (1636)

>  The rules for the playoffs will be the same as the season rules, except
> the rule regarding substituting players from other INL teams will be
> extended to include defunct INL teams (i.e., no, you cannot ask
> Grand Admiral Hell Peacock to be on your team).


	I would like to make a special request, as acting co-captain of AA.  I
would like to ask that any team who we play against who wants to may add
Grand Admiral Hell "I'm an Admiral, so shut up." Peacock to their team
as a replacement for ANY other player on their team.  While I have not
talked to him about this subject, I am absolutely certain that Rob
"Spaceace" Hill, the other acting co-captain of AA, will also accept
this term.

ZZnew guy
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: shafto@aristotle.ils.nwu.edu (Eric Shafto)
Subject: Re: 3rd space planet taking
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 04:27:46 GMT

ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig) writes:
: There seems to be a lot of people who think that this is too easy.  There also
: have been some valid points on why it can be useful.  Thus, rather than just
: totally turning off 3rd space taking, how about just making it a little more
: difficult.  Here are some ideas :
: 
: 1) Make war status permanent.

No biggie, if you are intending to genocide them.

: 
: 2) Make more intellegent gaurdians.  There are some good robots out there now
: with tactical sense as well as dogfighting abilities - use them.
: 
: 3) Make neutral armies shoot bombers twice as fast.
: 
: 4) The neutral race gets ticked, and some planets join the non-offending team
: for protection (this is what would happen in a real political situation).

Ooh, I like this one.

: 
: If some/all of these changes were added, then it would be ensured that 3rd
: space scumming would be a seldom-used but still available tactic, that would be
: harder to pull off.  Also, things like declaring war in order to give HAL the
: kill would still be viable.

--
*Eric Shafto             * The excursion is the same when you go looking  *
*Institute for the       * for your sorrow as when you go looking for     *
*    Learning Sciences   * your joy.                                      *
*Northwestern University *                Eudora Welty, The Wide Net      *
From: horde@reed.edu (Mr. Heiji Horde)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Unhappy
Date: 16 Aug 92 16:38:48 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Aug16.163848.25725
Organization: Twisted Genius Rehabilitation Center, a Division of MHE

In article <1992Aug16.062004.27060@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu (Chris Siebenmann) writes:
>rone@girtab.usc.edu (Ron Echeverri) writes:
>| One thing, tho, is taking people from other schools.  I heard that USC took
>| players from CalTech and (ugh) UCLA and incorporated them into Team `SC.
>| Should this be allowed?
>
> One presumes so, or teams from schools without enough people are in
>deep trouble. Just look at the Commanders for another example

I certainly hope it will be allowed. Here's another example, where we have
  the people and the machines, but real internet connection.

In the spring, Reed College was able to get a team together for the INL.
  They called themselves 300ms+ because that's what ping times of 64byte
  packets got up to when 8 people played netrek. But everyone had fun and
  that was the point of getting them all together.

Anyhow, this year due to an increased strain on our 56kb, we aren't even
  going to try to field one (we did get 15 color xterminals though).
  Hopefully, some of our players will find at-large teams to play with.

trost (that scum) is leaving us to go to a grad school that has a T1. *sniff*

	-KreelScum

-- 
===========================================================================
 Mr. Heiji Horde    (Non NeXT mail only please)     e-mail: horde@reed.edu
   All insane acts are done in affiliation with Madd Hacker Enterprises
    "Don't explode in front of my parents, it wouldn't look good." - M.H.
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig)
Subject: Re: Ok Ok Ok!  By popular demand I give you my .xtrekrc file.
Organization: Indiana University Astrophysics, Bloomington, IN
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 14:35:57 GMT

In article <170331INN4p8@agate.berkeley.edu> jjudy@argon.berkeley.edu (Jack W. Judy) writes:
># This is a sample default file for netrek.
># Specify this file with:
>#   netrek -r defaults
>#
># If you do not specify a file, then .xtrekrc from your home directory
>#   is used (if it exists).
>
>color.white:		white
>color.black:		black
>color.red:		red
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>color.green:		green
>color.yellow:		yellow
>color.cyan:		cyan
>color.light grey:	light grey

I've found the default red color doesn't show up really well against the dark
background.  This makes it darn hard to avoid Romulan torps.  Thus, I've
changed this line to :

color.red:		OrangeRed

It looks about the same, but has much better contrast.

	Entropy

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves)
Subject: Re: CFD anyone?
Originator: spot@FORTRAN.FOX.CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 06:21:14 GMT

>>>>> On Tue, 18 Aug 1992 00:53:13 GMT, cmlee@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Tom Chen-Ming Lee) said:

Iolo> 	1)  Just create rec.games.netrek.programmer
Iolo> 	2)  Split r.g.n into r.g.n.play and r.g.n.programmer like the
Iolo> 	    xtank dudes.


i suggest

r.g.n.programmer
r.g.n.play
r.g.n.borgs
r.g.n.hockey
r.g.n.league.inl  (moderated?)

-- 
			consume
Scott Draves		be silent
spot@cs.cmu.edu		die
From: jiangwu@sickdog.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Jiang Wu)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Very Very Unhappy
Keywords: SINL
Date: 17 Aug 92 19:40:02 GMT
Followup-To: SINL final
Organization: University of California, Berkeley

After coming back from vacation and catching up on the rec.games.netrek news
articles, I am very unhappy about this SINL final business.

WHAT IS THIS CRAP ABOUT DELAYING THE GAME INDEFINITELY!!!

I don't mind teams delay their games for a few days because they couldn't get
their players together at certain times.  But delaying it indefinitely???
There is no excuse for that!  So what if there some key players missing from
your team?  Get your subs! If you don't have them, play short or forfeit the
title.

The rules says everyone has to play their game before certain day.  When you
join the SINL to play, you are agreeing to these rules.  If everyone can
change them, why have these rules and schedules in the first place?

If you say that you can't play because key players are missing, I can say
that as a key player of the GBO, I only played 1 official game (against GBO)
and was not present at the semi-finals.  I also know many other GBO key
players to couldn't make to any of the games.  So the GBO could have said,
"well, our key players are missing so lets not play the game.  We will call
you when our players come back from vacation".  But we didn't, we tried our
best to schedule games within the SINL schedules and used subs when
necessary.

I think most of the other SINL teams did the same thing.  I remember the
game with GB a few weeks back.  The GB didn't have 1/2 of their key players
present at the time, they still played with GBO.  They even drafted a newbie
from the lab as a sub for them.  Maybe the GB and the GBO should have made
an agreement to not to play until later, "indefinitely later".

In my opinion, the non-CMU teams have shown good grace trying to meet SINL
schedules and follow the rules.  So, either play the final game or forfeit
your team out of the SINL.

-- R. Daneel
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: rjones@dsd.es.com (Ray Jones - Perp)
Subject: Re: YAR.C (yet another reserved.c)
Reply-To: rjones@dsd.es.com
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 20:22:12 GMT

In article <1992Aug14.192015.18401@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>, adc@tardis.msu.edu (Alan D. Cabrera) writes:
>Let's cut the false bravado and get down to a serious discussion that
>includes our friends outside our borders.  Please!

(excuse me, but isn't this newsgroup explicitly *for* false bravado?)

This is the way I see it:

RSA is the most elegant solution to the problems with reserved.c to come
forward, to date.  You've said it's bad to use, since it's patented, but
you haven't proposed an equally viable solution, or a course of action for
getting permission from RSA to use the algorithm (or one like it, such as
RSA-REF).  Propose a better way, and I'll listen to it.  Until then, what
options do I have?  I will not balk at a solution staring me in the face.  

Anyone that knows how to contact RSA (so I can ask about RSA-REF)?  

>---
>Alan Cabrera				internet:  adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu

-- 
                                          Ray Jones
                                          rjones@dsd.es.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: wansari@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Waheed A Ansari)
Subject: Re: XSG and Final Bronco Release
Organization: The Ohio State University, Geological Sciences Computing Lab.
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 13:58:22 GMT

The player structure in struct.h of the final Bronco sources has indeed
been changed slightly.  At the very end of the structure is added:

#ifdef FULL_HOSTNAMES
    char p_full_hostname[32];	/* full hostname 4/13/92 TC */
#endif

Needless to say, the difference only has an effect if the server was
compiled with the -DFULL_HOSTNAMES flag.  In the XSG Makefile, this flag
should be added to CFLAGS in this case.  XSG seems to be working fine
on geo1s with changes.

- Waheed