From: nadja@jetsun.weitek.COM (Nadja Adolf)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Guns & self defense
Date: 18 Nov 92 22:43:52 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: WEITEK Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1240@abb-sc.abb-sc.COM> ksm@abb-sc.abb-sc.com (Ashley) writes:
>
>In article <1992Nov17.100728.7415@csus.edu>, gharlane@nextnet.csus.edu (Gharlane of Eddore) writes...
>
>
>> Don't count on it.   On at least a couple occasions in my life, I
>> stayed alive solely because I happened to be carrying a semi-automatic 
>> pistol and be competent in its use.  When you're faced with a GROUP
>> of armed scum, unless you're as fast as greased lightning, a 
>> revolver simply won't do the job.   If I hadn't been carrying a 
>> nice old Model 1911A-1 Colt, I'd have gotten killed. 

>	You have made a very effective argument for being armed, but I noticed 
>something that was missing. Most of the situations you describe are avoidable. 
>The psychotic ex-whatever turning up armed at the door is an exception, but 
>Camille Paglia was correct in her example that you don't walk down a dark 
>alleyway alone if you don't want to get assulted. 

Nice, but not always practical. Not everyone can afford to live in a nice
neighborhood, keep a nine to five schedule, or have their own vehicle. 
Criminals also prey on nice neighborhoods too; or is it the woman's fault 
if some freak climbs in her window at night? What about people in wheelchairs?
Some criminals prefer to prey on the handicapped because they are less able
to physically resist.

My father's girlfriend was returning home to the Portland area from Corvallis
one night. She stopped for a traffic light in Albany, Oregon, where a man
forced her locked door, and climbed into her truck cab,  and threatened her 
with a knife.

I don't know what would have happened to her, but she did have a handgun,
and she did pull it out, and he left without her having to fire a shot.
From what he said to her while he was threatening her, he had rape and more
on his mind.

Should she have stayed home after dark? Is imprisoning women the solution?
I hope not.
 
>	I'm *not* saying that this is what you did, but it is true and knowing 
>how *not* to get into a voilent situation is the first thing they teach you in 
>many marshal arts and self-defense classes. I have found this to be very 
>usefull and cannot imagine putting myself in a situation where I was going to 
>be surrounded by gun toting thugs. 

Try driving your car to a car wash in San Jose. At least one attempted car-
jacking and assault has occurred in a nice neighborhood at a nice car wash.

>	The other thing I'm noticing about a number of the posts here is the 
>chest thumping. I'm *not* talking about anyone in particular, I don't want to 
>point any statements out, but I have noticed a lot of the descriptions and 
>diatribes being posted remind me of adolecent males talking about their dicks. 
>Handguns, rifles, machine guns, all described with loving joy. These are 
>weapons for killing people we are talking about! Just keep that in mind. It's 
>starting to sound as bad as my trip to the gunshop where a greasy man fondled 
>the barrel of a gun he wanted to sell me and talked about how fast it could 
>"spurt" bullets. Not as "potent" as his gun of course, but it can really 
>"spew out the lead". Just sick.

Handguns, rifles, and machine guns are not for killing people.
I enjoy target shooting and hunting. If the government ever becomes 
totalitarian, or in case of civil disorder, or criminal attack, I'll consider
shooting a person. But not before.

Hunting? It's part of my spiritual walk. To hunt in the way that is proper
for the People requires knowledge of self and of the way. And the understanding
that I, too am part of the way, and that the People are neither more nor less
than the other, but merely different. And to give an animal a good death, that
its spirit is honored and that others will be willing to have me kill them
since they know my respect for them and their spirits is meaningful. Thus
it has been, and thus it will be. We diminish the other when we decide that
we and they are the same. Ever has it been the same. Some throw garbage and
move into wild places and let the animals that have walked with humans 
run around and terrorize the other. This is far less respectful than to hunt
and to eat. The blood of an animal killed by some person's free roaming pet
dog or cat has not been treated with respect, nor has the other been given
a good death. Death is a part of life, and should never be invoked lightly.


>
>
>			- Ashley 
>		(probably out of my depth, but I don't care)



-- 
The Earth Pig Bourne....

nadja@node.com (prefered email address)
nadja@weitek.com