HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 12:28:10 CST
From:         CXKJP%UTXDP.bitnet@UTXVM.CC.UTEXAS.EDU
Subject:      RE:question of the day

Andrew--

 My Scofield (sp?) says that the two different accounts of
creation are different genres of literature. One of them--I
cant remember which-- is written in the genre used by Herews
to denote legend or myth, and it rhymes. I will look it up
tonight.(Unless someone else has a Scofield on hand.)

 Kim
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Date:         Fri, 10 Apr 1992 10:53:30 EST
From:         John Ross <ROSSJB@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Punishment for committing abortion
              9 Apr 1992 12:33:39 EST from <iwilliam@AU.ORACLE.COM>

>I am honestly sick to death of hearing the woefull chant "my body, my choice".
>Its not only their body, but their babies body as well..
>"my body, my choice not to get pregnant"....

Don't you know you are not your own?  You were bought for a price...

John
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Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 11:24:28 EDT
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From:         Brenda Curry-White <BSCURR01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Innocent Suffering (Was: No Subject)

Urban Research Institute
Phone: 502-588-6626

>Since she has suffered for such a long time, and for no apparent reason,
>and is still a strong and wonderful Christian, what does this say about
>Christianity, when most people would react with, "Christianity can't be
>true, for if it were, God wouldn't let me suffer so unjustly!".  Her
>continued faith in God is a powerful testimony, IMO (cf Job).
>
>(Brenda, I hope you don't in any way find anything offensive in what I've
>written.  I feel compassion and admiration for your sister.)

No, no, no.  I find nothing offensive in what you've written.  In fact, I
totally agree (miracles do happen!! :-).  She is a wonderful testimony to
faith in God.  I wish she hadn't had to go through what she has (and
continues to), and there were times when I was so angry that God would
not just cure her that I yelled and screamed and cried.  And I still
wish she could be whole, and that she didn't have to constantly worry
about her bilirubin count, or about getting leukemia (90% of patients
who survive Hodgkin's Disease for 10 years contract non-Hodgkin's
lymphoma or leukemia at some later point).  But I still see that God
knew best all along.  She would not be the person she is with the strength
and good humor that she has without her experiences.  And she is the first
to always say that God is the most important thing in her life.  It
always amazes me, and I often wonder if I could say that if I'd walked in
her shoes.

Thank you for noticing that about her.

Brenda
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Original_cc:  MARCHIBOLD
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 10 Apr 1992 11:57:00 MDT
From:         MARCHIBOLD@MSCD.BITNET
Subject:      Prayer request

Please pray for my 21 year old daughter who seems to be depressed.
We haven't talked in depth yet so I don't know what pressures are
weighing on her, but she is greatly troubled.  Please pray for guidance
for her, for a reassurance of God
s oops of God's mercy and love and forgiveness.  Thank you all.
In His blessed name - Jesus
Molly Archibold
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 15:04:00 CST
From:         "Darryl (The Other Brother) Johnson" <DJOHNSON@TCUCVMS.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Truth

From: Marty Helgesen <MNHCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
There is no such thing a different truths.  There are different
perceptions of the truth, or different beliefs about the truth, but
that's not the same thing.  That may be what you meant, but there are
people who seriously claim that a statement can be "true for you but
not true for me".  This is nonsense, but they seriously maintain it
and (somewhat contradictorily) argue that it is true.
----------------------------------------------------------------
I am a Protestant.
You are a Catholic.

Which one is a lie?  By your arguments, one of the above MUST be
false, as what is true for me MUST be true for you, and vice versa.

If such simple statements can be true for one, but not the other,
is it such a far reach of the imagination to conceive of belief
structures that are right for me, but not for you, and vice
versa?

----------------------------------------------------------------
What does it mean to say that a Truth is "valid"?  Or, to adopt the
wording I prefer, what does it mean to say that a perception of the
truth is "valid"?
----------------------------------------------------------------
I recall your posts on the meaning of "valid".
When I use the word valid, I mean that the belief system is
internally consistent, i.e. by itself (excluding any external
evidence), it makes sense.  I don't believe that valid equals
true.  Valid means barely reasonable, tolerable, when I use it.
You may have another meaning for the word.

I\ /\ I\ I\ \/ I   Texas         "Treat the other man's faith
I/ )( I( I( /  I..  Christian      gently; it is all he has to believe
 DJohnson@tcucvms    University     with.  His mind was created for
 DJohnson@gamma.is.tcu.edu         his own thoughts, not yours or
  Big Ugly Signature (tm)         mine" -- Henry S. Haskins
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Date:         Tue, 7 Apr 1992 08:53:01 EDT
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From:         Brenda Curry-White <BSCURR01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU>
Subject:      rally

Urban Research Institute
Phone: 502-588-6626

I heard on the news last night that the estimate of 500,000 came from the
National Parks Service--NOT from the media.  Keep in mind that the Parks
Service is part of the conservative, pro-life administration.
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Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 01:55:49 EDT
From:         Marty Helgesen <MNHCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Jesus is the Center of Our Faith

Allen,

I suggest you tell your friends that the Christian faith does not
depend on preachers or priests or popes, but on Jesus Christ.  Some
clergymen may be great sinners.  At least they may be flagrant sin-
ners.  Whether their sins are worse in the eyes of God than my more
quiet sins is something only God can judge.  It doesn't matter,
except for the state of their souls.  Jesus is the center of our
faith.  And Jesus predicted that some of His followers would give
scandal by their sins:  "Woe unto the world because of scandals.  For
it must needs be that scandals come: but nevertheless woe to that man
by whom the scandal cometh." Matthew 18:7 (Douai Version; the King
James has "offenses" where Douai has "scandals")

     If Jesus was God incarnate, as we believe Him to be, that is a
fact of history.  It was true in the first century, so it must be
true forever.  No action of sinful Christians in later centuries can
change the past and make Jesus not be God incarnate.

     Everyone has to answer Christ's question in Matthew 16:15 "Whom
do you say that I am?"  Some answer it explicitly and some answer it
implicitly by ignoring Him, but everyone has to answer it.  The
following verse tells us the correct answer.

Marty Helgesen
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Date:         Tue, 7 Apr 1992 09:02:00 MDT
From:         ERNESTOM@EPCC.BITNET
Subject:      Re: EITHER AND/OR: A BAPTISIMAL INQUIRY

Peace of Christ,


Baptismal in the name of Jesus Christ Acts 2:38.

Read the book of Acts and in that *** name *** they were baptize.

Not in the Name of The Father,the Son,and Holy Espirit.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 6 Apr 1992 14:15:39 EDT
From:         JEK@NIHCU.BITNET
Subject:      Monday 06 April 1992
X-To:         CHRISTIA@ASUACAD.BITNET, BSTUDY-L@UTARLVM1.BITNET,
              IVCF-L@UBVM.BITNET

MONDAY BEFORE PALM SUNDAY

Be gracious to thy people, we beseech thee, O Lord, that
they, repenting day by day of the things that displease thee,
may be more and more filled with love of thee and of thy
commandments; and, being suported by thy grace in this
life, may come to the full enjoyment of eternal life in thine
everlasting kingdom; through Jesus Christ our Lord, who
liveth and reigneth with thee and the Holy Spirit, one God,
for ever and ever.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 15 Apr 1992 10:24:00 EDT
From:         Jeff Shirton <SHIRTON@MCMASTER.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Safe Sex #2

Darryl,

I am becoming more and more confused at the position you seem to be
taking (I suspect others are, as well), I wonder if you'd like to
clarify exactly where you're coming from).

The situation under discussion seems to be the use of condoms to prevent
(primarily) sexually transmitted diseases.  IMO, this is primarily about
extramarital sexual encounters, since the incidence of STD's among
monogamous married couples is negligable, to my knowledge.

This being the case, is your position a defence of extramarital sexual
relations (a sin, considering this is a Christian list and discussion),
or is there some other position that we're completely missing?

Hopefully, you can more clearly explain your position, so that further
communication will be more effective.  Thank you.

In Christ,
.------------------------v----------------------------------------------------.
| Jeff Shirton           | "Now it is God that has...given us the Spirit as a |
| shirton@McMaster.CA    |  deposit, guaranteeing what is to come."  2Cor.5:5 |
`------------------------^----------------------------------------------------'
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Date:         Mon, 6 Apr 1992 11:10:42 CDT
From:         Lonnie Schubert <S096556@UMRVMA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Apostle's Creed as Common Ground

quick point JUST for clearity.
Please don't use "Lon" to refer to me, as "Lon" Mendelsohn (sp?) was a
quite active poster on the list for some time, and he will likely be
back.  I don't mind "Lon" for me, or much of anything else, I just think
the potential for confusion is sufficient to use my full name "Lonnie".
  :-) :-) :-) :-0 ;-) :-)
    Lonnie Schubert
PS last I checked (a while back) there was another "Lonnie" on the list.
So, Hi Lonnie!  I'd love to hear from you.
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Date:         Mon, 6 Apr 1992 16:45:00 EDT
From:         The List Minor <VCHAI@SMITH.BITNET>
Subject:      Abortion

    Basic question:  Do we have the right to take another human life?
    Complication:  What is defined as "human"?

    I think we can all argue (I mean, discuss this lovingly and non-
    heatedly, and biblically) till the cows come home, it's not going
    to change many things.  While I agree that it's important to talk
    about it, it's also important to *do* something about it.

    To all Christians out there, if you believe that abortion should not
    be a choice, then you must also realize that sometimes abortion is
    the *only* option open to the women who consider it.  Why?  Because
    a better option is not open to them, either for lack of publicity,
    or simply because it does not exist!

    What will *you* do about it?  Get involved, and I don't just mean
    returning solicitations for donations from Planned Parenthood back
    to them filled with thought-provoking statements (or not-so-nice
    -stuff), or taking part in polls and surveys (though they all
    serve a purpose, of some sort, of course).  Get involved in
    organizations (or provide monetary support of some kind) that *do*
    try to help women with unwanted pregnancies.  Get your church
    involved(!!!) in providing some material, financial(!!!), emotional
    and spiritual support to these women so that they can _have_ their
    babies.

    This is love in action.

    In Christ,
    Vicky
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Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 22:41:00 EDT
From:         NWILSON@SMITH.BITNET
Subject:      Purgatory?

Marty,
        I will indeed be looking forward to your post on purgatory, particularly
   the Biblical foundation for the belief in it. (Especially since I don't think
there is one!)
                        Nicole
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Date:         Tue, 7 Apr 1992 20:26:00 EDT
From:         ALICE LOO <LOOT@SNYSYRV1.BITNET>
Subject:      prayer request

Hi all,
        I just got back from a vacation ("Spring Break") at home
and had the most wonderful time. It was great to be pampered by
parents and also to enjoy the love and company of old friends.
Thank God for a truly blessed week!
        When I got back to Syracuse, though, things don't seem
to be going too well. One of my professors died of a heart attack.
(Right after I had a class with him the day before I left :|) His
name is Dr. Herb Wright. Please pray for his family.
        Also a friend of mine decided to drop out of the program
and quitted school. She had been complaining about not likely it
for a while so it wasn't too surprising. I talked with her today
and it seems like she's having a hard time deciding what to do.
Also she's having problems with her boyfriend, amongst another
pile of health problems and hospital bills. So please pray that
God would give her peace and guide her thru. And more importantly,
that she'd know God's love for her.
        Lastly, please pray for me. I, like my friend, am trying
to decide what to do about my future career. I am in a neuroscience
graduate program right now, but I feel that I'm not scientist material
and doing research in a laboratory for life doesn't really appeal to
me. I'm contemplating going to medical school, but it seems that
my chance of getting in is very slim, and I'm not sure if I can
handle the pressure of being a physician either. All these have
been very frustrating and bothering for a long time. I've prayed
about it but I found myself not having enough faith to do what
I think God has shown me to do. Please pray for God's guidance
in this matter, and that I'll have faith to follow.
        Thank you, and God bless.

Alice
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Date:         Wed, 8 Apr 1992 19:05:31 CDT
From:         Lonnie Schubert <S096556@UMRVMA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: re-pro-choice

Darryl,
Children are a blessing of the Lord.  No exceptions.
    Lonnie Schubert
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Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 11:33:47 EST
From:         Evelyn Duncan <R3EJD@AKRONVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Guided imagery

On Tue, 14 Apr 1992 15:51:07 GMT Matthias Radke said:
>In article <9204130957.AA12310@a-hp.au.oracle.com>, iwilliam@AU.ORACLE.COM (Ian
>Williams) says:
>>Note that I am vehemently against church butterflies...
>Are church *caterpillars* to be preferred? :-) Matthias

How about silkworms for the materials?  :)

Evelyn
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Date:         Sun, 12 Apr 1992 20:40:58 CDT
From:         NU021927@NDSUVM1.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Perfection (was: Re: Planets and matter)
              11 Apr 1992 23:09:00 EST from <BSC92SPA18@RCNVMS.RCN.MASS.EDU>

On Sat, 11 Apr 1992 23:09:00 EST Jeff Sinatra said:
>#1 is correct: We are perfect; God made us perfect.
>However, in number 2, you mixed imperfection with perfection, which is not
>possible.  The man of God creating could never think itself to be imperfect.
>imperfection is a mortal invention, not a divine creation.  Imperfection is
>derived from mortality--or human, erring consciousness, not God's man.  I would
>change #2 to: mortals think they are imperfect because they have no cognisance
>of perfection, and this mortal dissapears to the degree in which immortality
>becomes apparent.  Jesus ascended (disappeared to human consciousness) when
>his mortal thought fully yielded to immortality--the law of God. "For the law
>of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and
>death."(Rom. 8:2)
>
>				love,
>				  Jeff Sinatra
Jeff,
    You appear (to me, at least) to be talking in circles.  And you've
gotten nowhere near (again to me, at least) solving the dilemma
you just presented.
     You've stated: We are perfect, God made us that way.
     Then you say: We think we are imperfect (never mind why right now).
The paradox is (to me) obvious.  If we are perfect, then we
_by definition_ cannot make the mistake of thinking we are imperfect.

     I also disagree with something you have asserted elsewhere:
that that which is perfect _cannot_ be made imperfect.

     Finally, the Scripture you cited doesn't support the claim
you made regarding the nature of Christ's ascention.  Can you clear up
_any_ of the above?

ttfn

Roy M. Jacobsen                | "Progress does not create
North Dakota State University  |            victims."
Voice: 701-237-8641            |              -Marty Strange
BITNET: NU021927@NDSUVM1       |
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Date:         Fri, 10 Apr 1992 13:57:20 CDT
From:         JRALLS@TRINITY.EDU
Subject:      help with prayer

        Hi to all,
    I'm new to this list, and to e-mail as well.  I would like some
assistance with prayer.
    I used to wonder (and not so long ago, either) how people managed
to spend so much time in prayer.  Now that I've grown a bit spiritually
however, I find myself wondering how to find time to pray for the
seemingly endless number of people the Holy Spirit brings to my mind.
    I have a long commute to and from work every day.  It's not a hectic
drive so I use that time for quick prayers.  I can also find time for
brief prayers during the day.
    I do feel that I am surely not getting all of the benefits and
power of prayer available to me because I don't pray enough--that is,
in addition to all the quick prayers I should have a longer prayer
time.  But there is so much and so many people to pray for--how do I
keep track of it all?  Would lists help?  What about a notebook?
I'd really be interested in any suggestions that those of you who
choose to respond could give me.  Thanks,

                                  JoEllen
Jralls@trinity.edu
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Date:         Thu, 16 Apr 1992 10:09:00 EST
From:         jstone@PROPERTY.COURIER.GATECH.EDU
Subject:      Ankerberg posts

I have enjoyed the Ankerberg post too.  I was able to see 2 of the shows so
far. I find that the information in the media is full of policitical
correctness. That is, if you do not agree with the "party line", you will not
get any press.

In Christ.

John Stone
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Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 08:27:33 BST
From:         "Jonathan Wheeler" <JFW1@IBM-B.RUTHERFORD.AC.UK>
Subject:      Re: Great Britain not England

On Wed, 8 Apr 1992 09:29:00 CDT <MB09@EARN.SWTEXAS> said:
>
>Hi Jonathan,
>
>Thanks for clarifying the fact about Great Britian.  Since I lived in England
>for three years, I knew about this already.  I was only sharing information
>from my source and it didn't say G.B.  It said England and nothing about
>Scottland or Wales, so I didn't include that in the information.  It did say
>that in Ireland abortion is illegal.  So I don't know if the authors meant
         -------
>Great Britain instead of England or not.
>
>Michelle

Note that in this case Ireland must refer to the Republic of Ireland, also
known as Eire.  This is distinct from the province of Northern Ireland, which
consists of the six counties which elected to remain in the United Kingdom.

Yours sincerely

Jonathan Wheeler
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Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 10:17:47 EST
From:         Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Spiritual and physical death
              14 Apr 1992 09:41:00 EST from <BSC92SPA18@RCNVMS.RCN.MASS.EDU>

Jeff:
I fail to understand the value or necessity of the incarnation according to
your theology.  If, as you say, Jesus neither was alive nor died, what
precisely is the point?  If he did not incarnate as a fully human being,
to suffer, live, and die as one of us, then His death was neither
difficult nor a sacrifice, and it should impress us as nothing more than
the act of an immensely powerful being to show off that power.  In such
an act, there is no compassion, no love, and no sacrifice.

Jesus lived and died as a human being, very man and very God, and His
sacrifice was _real_, not a parlor trick; otherwise, Christianity is nothing
more than a philosophy based on a cheap magic trick by a capricious god.
                                           Love INC,
                                                    ---Kerry
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