HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sunder@grusin.crhc.uiuc.edu (Srinivas Sunder)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Zoe Baird should step aside
Date: 21 Jan 93 18:33:01 GMT
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
NNTP-Posting-Host: grusin.crhc.uiuc.edu

Sewnators Hank Brown (R-CO) and Larry Craig (R-ID) have both indicated that
they will vote against confirming Zoe Baird. Bill Cohen (R-ME) said something
about Attys. Gen. having to be held to a higher standard than the rest of the
public; looks like he will also vote against. 

"Say Noe to Zoe"-fever isn't exactly catching on Capitol Hill, but it might.
Revenge for John Tower at last?

-- 
Srinivas Sunder                                         sunder@crhc.uiuc.edu

If my employer shares these views, I'd be most surprised.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: era@csn.org (Ed Arnold)
Subject: REQUEST FOR ASSISTANCE
Originator: era@teal.csn.org
Keywords: Extremists, Christian Right, Amendment 2
Reply-To: era@csn.org (Ed Arnold)
Organization: Citizens Project; Colorado Springs, CO
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 01:47:47 GMT

We of the Citizens Project (Colorado Springs, CO) are looking for people
who could assist us in re-distributing the Citizens Project Newsletter
to non-Internet computer services.  If you have an account on any such
services (CompuServe, FidoNet, Genie, Prodigy, America Online, and others)
and are willing to help us, please let us know via return email to
era@ncar.ucar.edu.

The Citizens Project is a Colorado Springs, CO - based group of volunteers
who seek to prevent extremists from eliminating our fundamental freedoms,
in the face of growing political and religious intolerance in Colorado.
--
Ed Arnold * Boulder, CO * 303-497-1253(voice,weekday) * 303-494-6949(voice)
internet: era@csn.org * compuserve: internet:era@csn.org * bitnet: era@ncario
-- 
Ed Arnold * Boulder, CO * 303-497-1253(voice,weekday) * 303-494-6949(voice)
internet: era@csn.org * compuserve: internet:era@csn.org * bitnet: era@ncario
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:69456 alt.activism:21257 alt.conspiracy:14537 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:13627
From: an030@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Broward Horne)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.activism,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Privatization
Date: 23 Jan 1993 22:31:16 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: an030@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Broward Horne)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:

>an030@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Broward Horne) writes:
>>egl1@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Elizabeth G. Levy) says:
>>>
>>>Good plumbing.  Toilets outside of the US just suck.
>>
>>      Exactly the attitude that will kill the U.S.
>>
>>     Uruguay has a climate that would probably be conducive to solar.
>
>A cautionary note about Uruguay ... a friend here at Columbia (not Liz
>(-;) is from Uruguay and her EC/Italian passport just came through


        Unless you're rich, Italy is bad now.

        Besides, I don't mind working.  I mind not getting paid 
        for it.  And, in the final analysis, assuming the U.S.
        goes boom ( which I sure can't see NOT happening ), I suspect
        that several places will look good, no matter what.


        Don't worry.  I'm checking out others, too.  :)
>(via the legacy route, as it was her grandfather who emigrated from
>Milan) ... there are five guys who are bidding to marry her so that
>she can get them out and over to Europe ...  all five come from some
>of the top elite families without legacy connections to Europe ...
>Lucia even likes a couple of them, too ...
>
>gld
>--
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Gary L. Dare
>> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.EDU 		Carnaval de Quebec (City)
>> gld@cunixc.BITNET			February 4 - 14
>

Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:69179 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:13462
From: dos@major.panix.com (Dave O'Shea)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Debt Not Necessarily Bad
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 08:56:23 EST
Organization: Department of Redundancy Department

eck@panix.com (Mark Eckenwiler) writes:

> In <C1472D.1or@unix.portal.com>, mykes@shell.portal.com sez:
> >
> >Monopolies can be good, too.  In the case of AT&T, phone service to the
> >majority of the US was cheaper than it has been since deregulation/split
> >up of AT&T.
> 
> Wrong.  It was cheaper for home users, while business customers paid a
> disproportionate share of the costs.  Rate adjustments since then have
> brought customer costs at the two levels more into line with reality.

Actually, the costs have gone down for virtually everyone. Business
customers - especially the larger ones - can now set up their own
private network - AT&T, MCI, or WilTel will sell them sufficient
bandwidth for the job.

The private telecom user also has the option of hundreds of phones and
accessories, rather than having to lease a plain 'ol phone for heavily
inflated prices. Long-distance costs have gone down, both in real
dollars, and much more in constant dollars.

The only part that still remains high is the RBOC's, since they still
have a virtual monopoly over all but the very largest users.


--
"To call something 'Public' is to define it as filthy, inefficient and
dangerous. The public toilet is the epitome of social spending."
                                                 - P.J. O'Rourke

Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.clinton
From: blh@uiboise.idbsu.edu (Broward L. Horne)
Subject: Come ON, Wild Bill Taxcut!
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 17:06:45 MST
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X-To: talk.politics.misc.usenet
X-Cc: alt.politics.clinton.usenet
X-Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.25]



	Okay, I'm clear, Bill!!!

	Go ahead and nuke the nation from orbit!


Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.medicine,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.african.american,sci.med
From: bai@msiadmin.cit.cornell.edu (Dov Bai-MSI Visitor)
Subject: Re: Statement of President Clinton on Health Care Reform Task Force
Organization: /usr/local/lib/news/organization
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 22:38:07 GMT

In article <C1Kz0v.LxB@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> hrubin@pop.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin) writes:
>In article <1993Jan28.152106.9294@tc.cornell.edu> bai@msiadmin.cit.cornell.edu (Dov Bai-MSI Visitor) writes:

>>Difference in what context ? If you are talking about a guidance
>>for _action_ ( i.e. should I go and steal penicllin now from some
>>innocent person ? ) the answer is no. The other person does not owe
>>me anyting. However, if someone comes and _asks_ me for a loan
>>or a gift to buy penicillin I would be more inclined to help him/her.
>
>I see little difference.  

You dont see the difference between a _voluntary_ action to
help someone and stealing your money ?

If you donate money to an organization that you think is important,
is it the same as if the head of the organization comes to you
with a gun commanding you to "donate" ?

Dov
From: sunder@grusin.crhc.uiuc.edu (Srinivas Sunder)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: NO! President Bill, 72% of Americans are NOT lawyers!
Date: 26 Jan 1993 02:41:24 GMT
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: grusin.crhc.uiuc.edu


For those who thought that Clinton's search for "diversity" wouldn't
compromise the quality of appointees, check out this week's TIME. It
says quite pointedly that possibly the reason why Clinton's first choice 
for AG, Patricia Wald (Chief Judge on US Court of Appeals for DC), took 
herself out of contention for the post was the leaking by Clinton's aides
of the fact that the AG`s position was going to be merely a sacrificial
offering at the altar of "diversity", i.e. an affirmative action slot.
And that the excuse of age + judicial pension was just that - an excuse.
You see, it seems that sometimes the targets of such paternalism resent 
being treated as mere stats. 

Now, post-Zoe, after it is clear that Clinton no longer considers "diversity"
as THE qualification that he desires most in his AG, Pat Wald is back in 
the reckoning for the job.


-- 
Srinivas Sunder                                         sunder@crhc.uiuc.edu

If my employer shares these views, I'd be most surprised.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Family Leave Bill
Date: 26 Jan 1993 13:36:30 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer Inc, Marlboro MA
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: gondolin.pubs.stratus.com

In article <44048@zygot.ati.com> john@zygot.ati.com (John Higdon)  
writes:
> In article <9301222329.AA29961@client.its.rpi.edu> buckmr@rpi.edu  
(Ron Buckmire) writes:
> 
> >        The family leave bill would establish a national policy  
for Millions
> >of working families. The bill... which would affect businesses  
with 50
> >employees or more... would allow a worker to take up to 12 weeks  
of
> >UNpaid leave per year for the birth or adoption of a child... or  
to
> >attend to a seriously ill family member.
> >
>> 
> And even beyond that, why do only people who work for large  
companies
> get to play? There are millions out there who work for small, Ma  
and Pa
> operations. Are they less needing of family leave? And if the size  
of
> the company is involved, why is this less of a problem for larger
> companies than smaller ones? Key people are key people; or is the
> premise that large companies are inherently overstocked with  
personel?
> 

It only works for big companies because they have the resources
to fill in for some one for a couple of months.  If a company has
500 employees and one goes on leave, that leaves 499 (and they've
only lost .2 percent of their work force.  If the corner store
employs 5 people and 1 goes on leave, they've lost 20% of their
work force. That's much harder to compensate for.

--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  

Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.clinton
From: Dr. Norman J. LaFave <lafave@ial4.jsc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Re: AMERICA, Prepare to FLAME ON!!!!
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A78C040EC004192A@42.25.154.146.in-addr.arpa>
X-Xxdate: Wed, 27 Jan 93 09:19:10 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Engineering & Sciences Company
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d15
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 15:23:06 GMT

In article <9301270208.AA10365@inet-gw-2.pa.dec.com> Broward L. Horne,
blh@uiboise.idbsu.edu writes:
>       For you, Doc Norman, I say the same thing I told Savin, Litton,
>       and Teradyne...
> 
>       Join together and rebuild America????
> 
> 	  Eat me!  I'm done.

another patriotic american sacrificing for the good of all.....  :-/

Don't let the door hit you in the *** on the way out , Broward.

Norman

Dr. Norman J. LaFave
Senior Engineer
Lockheed Engineering and Sciences Company




When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro
                               Hunter Thompson
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:69130 ca.politics:10629 misc.legal:23085
From: cramer@optilink.COM (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,ca.politics,misc.legal
Subject: The Failure of Gun Control in New York City *Jails*
Date: 20 Jan 93 17:21:20 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA


The following item appeared in the Santa Rosa Press-Democrat, 1/20/93, p. A5:

	NEW YORK -- It's a new twist on the old insurance scam:
	inmates shooting themselves, or each other, with an eye
	toward the almighty dollar -- the taxpayer's dollar, that
	is.

	According to the city's Department of Investigation, it
	works like this: An inmate or an accomplice fires a gun
	through a pillow or towel, causing a minor leg wound.  As
	fast as you can say "lawsuit," he's demanding up to $8.5
	million in damages for inadequate protection by jail
	officials.

	The Department of Investigation believes that about 10
	inmates in the last three years have had themselves
	shot so they could sue or demand lower bail or cushier
	digs.

If gun control in its most extreme form -- gun prohibition -- can't
be made to work in a JAIL, where you have strip searches of incoming
prisoners; where you are subject to arbitrary search and seizure at
ANY time; where people on the outside have only limited and controlled 
contact with the prisoners; where the guards who must be bribed to
get a weapon smuggled in have a VERY direct interest in not arming
the prisoners -- if you can't make it work in THAT environment, what
makes you think you can make it work in any milder form on the outside?

Of course, the gun prohibitionists will have a solution -- make the
outside more like a jail.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
"When freedom destroys order, order will destroy freedom." -- Eric Hoffer
Not a goal, just a statement of reality.
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:70085 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:13974
From: tip@lead.aichem.arizona.edu (Tom Perigrin)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Rush wants strict obedience
Date: 26 Jan 93 20:48:59 GMT
Organization: University of Arizona UNIX Users Group


>Let's see if we've got this right.  The man says he has a political
>position, screens his calls so they make him look good and is there to
>make money and we're not supposed to take him at his word?


Today I heard Rush hang up in seeming disgust on a Ex Marine Captain who didn't
say EXACTLY what Rush eanted to hear.   The topic was Gays in the Military.
The fellow started off by complementing Rush, and he was talking about
leading men, etc...   Rush kept trying to lead him around to something,
and the guy was taking his time on getting there... finally Rush hung up
on him (or was it visa versa?), and he then read off of the screen
what the guy had told Bo Snerdley... all two or three lines of it.
He then told callers to make make sure that they repeated EXACTLY what
they told the call screener, and told Bo to make sure that the people
understood that they weren't supposed to deviate from what Rush sees on
his screen.

Lately Rush has been hanging up on people a lot more often than he did
two years ago when I started to listen.  Maybe he's starting to beleive
himself as the epitome of truth, etc... and doesn't need the little guy?

Amusingly enough, when I first tuned in Rush was looking for something on
his desk. He had lost it in his papers.   One hour later, he was saying;
"Executing my appointed tasks flawlessly with ZERO mistakes."
I wonder who appoiinted him to lose that paper?
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:70337 misc.legal:23474 alt.politics.usa.constitution:1577
From: mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM (Mark Wilson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,misc.legal,alt.politics.usa.constitution
Subject: Re: Necessary and Proper
Date: 28 Jan 93 17:11:37 GMT
Organization: NCR Engineering and Manufacturing Atlanta -- Atlanta, GA

In <C1Jt8D.MJA@panix.com> lkk@panix.com (Larry Kolodney) writes:

|In <1993Jan27.220454.3621@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> dev@barley.ecn.purdue.edu (Larry Weeks) writes:

|>The U.S. Constitution means what the words say. Nothing more, nothing
|>less. As principal author of the document, I consider Madison a very
|>reputable authority on that meaning. I do not consider subsequent
|>"interpretations" which go against Madison's explanations to be
|>valid. I know you disagree with me, and in fact, most modern legal
|>"experts" do as well. So be it.

|Madison is obviously an authority on what *he* meant by the various clauses
|contained in the Constitution.  He may even represent the majority
|view of what the delegates at the constitutional convention believed
|the words meant.

If you don't like the way the constitution reads, then amend it.

If the constitution merely means whatever we want it to mean, then
why bother having one at all.
-- 
Mob rule isn't any prettier merely because the mob calls itself a government
It ain't charity if you are using someone else's money.
Wilson's theory of relativity: If you go back far enough, we're all related.
Mark.Wilson@AtlantaGA.NCR.com
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: era@csn.org (Ed Arnold)
Subject: REQUEST FOR ASSISTANCE
Originator: era@teal.csn.org
Keywords: Extremists, Christian Right, Amendment 2
Reply-To: era@csn.org (Ed Arnold)
Organization: Citizens Project; Colorado Springs, CO
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 01:47:57 GMT

We of the Citizens Project (Colorado Springs, CO) are looking for people
who could assist us in re-distributing the Citizens Project Newsletter
to non-Internet computer services.  If you have an account on any such
services (CompuServe, FidoNet, Genie, Prodigy, America Online, and others)
and are willing to help us, please let us know via return email to
era@ncar.ucar.edu.

The Citizens Project is a Colorado Springs, CO - based group of volunteers
who seek to prevent extremists from eliminating our fundamental freedoms,
in the face of growing political and religious intolerance in Colorado.
--
Ed Arnold * Boulder, CO * 303-497-1253(voice,weekday) * 303-494-6949(voice)
internet: era@csn.org * compuserve: internet:era@csn.org * bitnet: era@ncario
-- 
Ed Arnold * Boulder, CO * 303-497-1253(voice,weekday) * 303-494-6949(voice)
internet: era@csn.org * compuserve: internet:era@csn.org * bitnet: era@ncario
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: GCTHORNE@idbsu.idbsu.edu ("Broward "YeehaaaWW!!!" Horne")
Subject:      Re: RIGHT ON, CLINTON-DUDE!
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 20:24:34 MST
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 7916; Tue, 26 Jan 93 20:28:07 MST
X-To: talk.politics.misc.usenet

From: tonyd@lclark.edu (Anthony Davis)
Subject: Re: Money Supply (Re: WELLLLL! IT'S DAY ONE)
Organization: Lewis & Clark College, Portland OR

In article <1k25h9INNb4@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> an030@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Browar
>as if a government could ever set you free...
>Clinton will not save you... Bush couldn't save you...

            Exactly what I'm betting on.

            I was willing to give Perot a chance, but
            now it's scalping time.

            I KNEW Bill had it in him to dick the middle class!  :)

            Come on, Bill baby, Tax Hike City, here we come!
            William "Deflationary Spiral" Clinton!  YES!

>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>"Duff Beer for me, Duff Beer for you"
>>>     "I'll have a Duff's, you have one, too...."
>>>
>>
>>
>

bonzai,
tonyd
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:69372 misc.legal:23159
From: cramer@optilink.COM (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,misc.legal
Subject: Re: A 4th branch of government?
Date: 22 Jan 93 18:50:20 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA

In article <1993Jan21.044432.7570@ucsu.Colorado.EDU>, fcrary@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (Frank Crary) writes:
> In article <26jP02Ps33LY01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> tjc50@juts.ccc.amdahl.com (Terry Carroll) writes:
> >No, but it supports the establishment of agencies necessary and proper to 
> >administer the laws.
> 
> Providing that no provisions of the Constitution are violated. The
> Tenth Amendment specifically states that the federal government has
> no powers except those granted by the Constitution. Article One

And why was it added?  To deal with Antifederalist concerns that
the Federal Government's power might be arbitrarily expanded by 
exactly the sort of "necessary and proper" arguing that is being
done in this news group.  For example, Federalists arguing for
ratification without amendment sought to parody Antifederalist
arguments by pointing out that nothing in the Constitution protected
the right of the people to eat, or to be buried.  This was an
especially poor example, because English law had, at various times,
required people to be buried in woolen clothing (to protect the
interests of the wool industry.)  Does anyone doubt that if the
Congress passed a law today requiring the dead to be buried in
wool, as a measure to protect our strategic wool industry, that
the courts would uphold such a law as a "necessary and proper"
extension to the "general welfare" clause, or the requirements to
defend the country?

>                                                             Frank Crary



-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
"When freedom destroys order, order will destroy freedom." -- Eric Hoffer
Not a goal, just a statement of reality.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.reform
From: leecr@microsoft.com (Lee Crocker)
Subject: Re: Libertarians and Labor Unions
Date: 26 Jan 93 02:33:11 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

> The Libertarian party has money: do you think a truly progressive party
> would ever get the kind of financial support the Libertarian Party gets?

Man, I almost fell out of my chair laughing at that one.  If we have
these massive gobs of money, how come we had to run 30-second spots
at 2 AM on CNN instead of pimetime network?  How come Tamara Clark is
begging for cash to support our electoral fraud investigation in
Nevada, and is about to give it up for lack of funds?

Believe me, I would like nothing more than for your accusation of
wealth to be true--but it isn't.  Next time, look up the numbers
before making wild assumptions.
-- 
Lee Daniel Crocker    | Free minds; free bodies; free trade.
leecr@microsoft.com   | Libertarian Party  1-800-682-1776