From: massoud@chemteca.sdsu.edu (Massoud Ajami)
Subject: Re: Physics-1A Question 2/*
Organization: San Diego State University
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:31:33 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.073350.14796@netcom.com> bavafa@netcom.com (Hooshyar Naraghi) writes:
>From: bavafa@netcom.com (Hooshyar Naraghi)
>Subject: Re: Physics-1A Question
>Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 07:33:50 GMT
>In article <massoud.120.717782103@chemteca.sdsu.edu> massoud@chemteca.sdsu.edu (Massoud Ajami) writes:
>>>
>
>Understood.  It's a convention, right?  So am I correct to say we cannot 
>measure temperature directly?  We can only measure the effect of the 
>temperature - or more accurately the effect of heat - on a substance.  We
>could use another liquid besides water, but in either case we need a medium
>to operate on.  So could we discuss about temperature without even referring
>to matter?
>
>Now temperature is considered a property of matter.  If we cannot prove
>temperature without matter (remember this is not a _claim_, I am only raising
>the question), then how can we be sure that matter itself exists?  but, we
>KNOW that matter exists, right?
>
>It seems to me that from the effect of a property of the matter on matter
>itself we conclude or learn that matter exists.  It's a conclusion without
>actually proving that or showing that matter existed.  Is this line of 
>reasoning making sense?  Again, I am raising a question.  I have not made
>any declarations or statements, at least not yet.  :-)
>
OK, let's see, there is nothing as TEMPERATURE, it is HEAT. Temperature and 
heat are used interchangeably, but one is unit measurment of the other. When 
I said if you look at temperature as energy, I meant the heat [this may 
answers ROMIN too]. Energy comes in different unit of measurment, from 
electron volt to kenetic temperature, and so on.

About matter; we are about 10 E-14 solid, means if you take known universe 
and take the empty space out, you get a sphere with about 1 km diameter of 
matters.(note of consciouness: the sensibility of soul or spirit sees this 
"hoax" as solid!). The heat is the attribute of the interaction of matter 
and energy; of matter and matter, and by measuring those attributes the 
existance of matter can be known (photons, the energy packets, do not 
interact with each other).

You can not measure energy by itself unless it interacts with matter, for 
example you can not even prove the existance of light, unless it reacts with 
you detector, then you can say there is light. So claim that without matter, 
you can not measure heat("temperature").

>>>Perhaps I should have asked can we prove the concept of 
>>temperature as an absolute property of matter?
>>>
>>If you look at temperature as an energy (which is), then every thing falls
>>in its place.
>
>I lost you here.  I thought temperature measures the _degree_ of heat, or as
>I said above it measures the effect of heat on a substance.  Can you elaborate
>a little more as how things fall in their places?  Obvisouly I am the one who
>did not understand you here.
>
Well there is a difference between property and attribute, heat is not an 
absolute property of matter while it may change its property. Take a piece 
of metal, it has a property at room temperature, drop it into liquid 
nitrogen, still is the same metal (I should mention that I should not 
generalize this for our picky friends, aluminum becomes supper conductor at 
4 degree K.). By adding energy to a substance, its property and attribute 
may change. Sending energy (high velocity electrons) into a sheet of gold, 
you get X ray (same property, but different attribute), and shut off 
cooling system, you will get molten gold (different property, but still 
gold) and no more X ray.

As you see, you don't need to put the gold into an oven to melt it, rather 
electron with its energy will do it for you. So E=vh, the energy of 
electron interacted with substance will raise the temperature of metal to 
the point of melting or vaporization. Nothing in the universe happens 
unless the exchange og energy is associated with it. 

>
>Regards,
>Hooshyar F. Naraghi
>bavafa@netcom.com
>(415) 322-8056

ps. bandeh masou'le An nakhAham bood!

Peace and Prosperity!
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