Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 12:01:36 EST
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Northern Ireland
 <1992Dec15.134159.11229@dcs.qmw.ac.uk> <92350.1614262893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
 <1992Dec16.093100.24119@dcs.qmw.ac.uk>

In article <1992Dec16.093100.24119@dcs.qmw.ac.uk>, mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew
Huntbach) says:
>
>In article <92350.1614262893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> Andy
><2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>>In article <1992Dec15.134159.11229@dcs.qmw.ac.uk>, mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew
>>Huntbach) says:
>>>
>>>In article <92346.1704452893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> Andy
>>><2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>>>>Once again, this is not the information I have seen, I shall look it up
>>>>and post the stats but I believe Fermangh for example was over 80% RC as
>>>>were/are the southern portions of the province
>>>>
>>>Well, in that case how come the constituency of Fermanagh and
>>>Tyrone elects the *Unionist* MP, Ken Maginnis? Although this is
>>>partly explained by the Catholic vote being split between SDLP
>>>and Sinn Fein, it still indicates either that there is a
>>>substantial proportion of Protestants there, or a substantial
>>>proportion of the Catholic "80%" votes Unionist.
>>
>>What is the voter turnout? Also do Fermangh and Tyrone consitutencies
>>correspond precisely to the respective counties?. How many ridings have
>>nationalist/republican majorities out of the total?
>
>"Riding" is Canadian for constituency, yes? Fermanagh and South
>Tyrone is a single constituency, which I assume from the name
>contains the whole of County Fermanagh and part of County
>Tyrone*. In fact, it doesn't make much sense to think in terms
>of counties, since for all practical reasons they don't exist
>any more. Local government is carried out by "districts", and
>MPs elected by constituencies. There are 17 constituencies, I
>forget how many districts but in general they're smaller than
>counties. Fermanagh is not a heavily populated county, hence
>the fact that it doesn't even make up a single constituency.
>
>In fact, voter turnout in Northern Ireland is usually very
>high, usually higher than the mainland. Fermanagh and Tyrone
>actually held the record as the constituency with the highest
>turnout.
>
>4 out of the 17 constituencies return Nationalist MPs, Newry &
>Armagh, Down South, Belfast West and Foyle (delicately named to
>avoid the (London)Derry issue, though the neighbouring
>constituency covering the county but excluding the city is
>called Londonderry East, unlike Foyle it's predominantly
>Protestant). There may be a fifth, but I can't recall it now.
>Two other constituencies, Mid-Ulster and Fermanagh & South
>Tyrone, have Nationalist/Republican majorities, but return
>Unionist MPs because the Nationalist/Republican vote is split
>between the SDLP and Sinn Fein parties, whereas the Unionist
>parties stand a single candidate. The British government has
>introduced proportional representation in district and European
>Parliament elections to avoid this sort of split and ensure
>fair representation for all, but wouldn't do this for
>Westminster elections becuase this might encourage those (like
>myself) who want to introduce it for all Westminster elections.
>
>Matthew Huntbach
>
>* pedantic note - it is form correct to refer to Irish counties in
>this way, but not to English counties.

So four constituencies elect Nationalist MPs and a fifth has a Nationalist/
Republican majority, meaning less than a third of the province has local
Nationalist/Republican majorities. Are these areas contiguous with either
the Sea, the Republic of Ireland or constituencies that meet these two
conditions and if so, would it not make sense to allow these areas to vote
on joining the Republic? If the Republicans lose it would be a blow to
the IRA and other irridentist groups, if they win hotbeds of dissent would
be removed from the province making it more governable.

In the twenties, the Unionists argued that this would make the Province less
viable but this is only a valid argument if Northern Ireland is to become
independent, which the Unionists are against anyway. If Northern Ireland is
to remain an extension of the UK, it really doesn't matter how big it is
because there is no need for it to be self-sufficient as mother Britain
is just accross the channel. To argue otherwise is just to rationalise
as large a territory as possible and in practise, maximises the minority
population.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british