From: tracy@scoraz.resp-sci.arizona.edu (Tracy Scheinkman)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: re: Trakehner decision
Date: 8 Jan 93 07:14:51 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ

In Article 10845 in rec.equestrian:
From: joi@cbnewsc.cb.att.com (JMM)

>Now that my gelding has navicular and can only be used for light riding, I've 
>been looking around for another horse.  I had originally set my price limit to 
>about $1500-$2000, but frankly haven't seen an awful lot in this area (around 
>Denver) that has impressed me. 

	It is very difficult, though not impossible, to find a good horse for
that price range.  Most good horses that are sound, young, and trained,
especially in jumping,  will go for more. 

>stock of Trakehners.  Just for the heck of it, I went to look.  I fell in
>love with a 2-year-old grey filly, and her price, though more than I 
>originally intended to pay for a horse, sounded pretty good to me ($3375).
>A knowledgeable friend who went with me thought the price was very good
>and the filly would do nicely for what I wanted (jumping).  She's a lovely
>mover, springy, lots of impulsion, and a wonderful disposition.  
>Her sire, Erzsand, was a very big jumper, but the breeder
>doesn't really know of any of his get that are being used as jumpers.

	The fact that her sire was a good jumper is important, that his
get are being used mostly as dressage horses reflects more on the growing
sport of dressage and the popularity of Trakehners in dressage than on
his ability as a jumper sire.  The price is good, not too high, not too
low (lower would indicate a poor quality horse).  I bought my Arabian
mare in 1989 when the prices were a bit higher than now for $4500, she
was pregnant (though no guarantee) with my filly then.  When I purchased
her she was going through an awkward growth phase where she seemed kind
of not to know where all her parts were, yet I thought her quite lovely.
I saw something in her that others, including her breeder, missed.  Within
6 months she started discovering her body, and a few months after that
she had my filly.  Since then her breeder who I have kept in touch with
has called her one of the best broodmares from his herd, because of her
filly, and he looks with great wonder at how beautiful she has grown,
she's a late bloomer.  So just because she is not a top-priced filly
this Trakehner you have found may turn out to be a Very good horse,
breeders can only guess at this age, they don't know for sure.
	Look at her mother and her father if available and at as many of
her close relatives as you can you may see echos of what she'll be like
as an adult or what kind of foal she could produce as a broodmare.  That's
what I did before I bought my mare.

>They're such nice movers, that dressage people like them and buy them.
>However, she says she'll put the filly over a few free jumps in the next
>week and see what her attitude is, and I can make up my mind then.

	This is very good of the owner to do, because a horse that shows
talent and a liking for jumping free is likely to be good with a rider,
thus the owner preserves the reputation of the stable for honesty and
for producing good horses in the disciplines the buyers want.

>This is a rather lengthy intro, but I like this filly so well that I don't
>know if I'm being detached enough about this.  Another friend that I talked
>to (who lives in Illinois) thought the price was very high for an unproven
>2 year old--but in the same breath told me about a Holsteiner she was 
>looking at for $6700, that had won a halter division for 2-year-olds.

	Detachment is important to a certain extent but you must also buy
a horse who touches you inside if you want the relationship to be a lasting
one.  Cachet did that to me, I knew she was the horse I wanted, even though
she wasn't for sale when I first saw her.
	This is not too high a price for a good quality 2-year-old, your
friend obviously knows that or else she or he would not be looking at a
more pricey one.  As for halter divisions at shows, they are wonderful
fun, and feel great when you do well, but don't take them too seriously.
There are a lot of horses that are never shown at halter would beat the
saddle off the halter champions when shown side-by-side, and there
are plenty of halter champions that can't jump and a lot of horses that
are conformationally poor that can.  (I'm not advocating getting a 
conformationally poor horse I'm just saying that a lot of athleticism
is heart.)

>How do Trakehners compare to other warmbloods?  How are they in general as
>jumpers?  Does this price seem reasonable?  (Yes, I understand that the
>stock that's being sold are the "culls", but those culls are better movers
>than anything I've ever ridden.)  

	Trakehners are supposed to be very good jumpers in general, but it
depends on the individual, some like it some don't.  The person to ask about
this is fellow netter Kyle Karnosh (how about it Kyle?).  If you are looking
for a hunter and not a jumper you would probably be wiser sticking to those
breeds the judges like seeing, mostly Thoroughbreds, as some breed prejudice
exists (but that ain't stopping me and it doesn't have to stop you IF you
know what you are getting into).  However in jumpers it doesn't matter what
the horse's breed just so long as it can clear those fences and remain
sound!  And the situation with hunters is gradually changing.
	You are doing well by getting a vet check and testing the filly over 
free jumps.
	Again my mare was a cull, now the breeder is wishing he never sold
her.  In a good quality breeding program the "culls" are often so close
to the "keepers" in quality that a half inch in height or a minor difference
in facial qualities is all that separates a $3000 horse from a $20,000 horse.
Also the breeder may be selecting for what their breeding needs are, perhaps
they have 3 daughters by that mare already so they put one or two of them
up for sale.
	Good luck, hope she works out.

					Tracy and Bruce (beautiful man) and
					Cachet (8 year old Arabian dressage
					mare) and Mithril (3 year old Arabian
					filly) and half-owned sweet Zama 
					(9 month old arthritic Arabian
					filly) and The Cats
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian