From: kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: [eff.mail.com-priv]  The AUP, Common Sense, and the Emperor's Clothes
Date: 24 Mar 92 16:06:57 GMT
Article-I.D.: eff.199203250206.AA22899
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Originator: kadie@eff.org


Newsgroups: eff.mail.com-priv
From: bzs@world.std.com (Barry Shein)
Subject:  The AUP, Common Sense, and the Emperor's Clothes
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1992 13:10:53 GMT


>From experience here I'll add to your list of likely applications of
the internet by businesses and then make some points:

	1. Catalogs, programs to view the catalogs either
	directly or downloaded. Quantum Books does that here.

	2. On-line ordering, particularly of small-ticket items.
	Methods will be established to make this reasonably secure,
	it's not that hard (e.g. establish an account with a charge
	card or PO number by some ordinary means, phone/fax/mail.)

	3. Software patch files from computer vendors and
	other product updates and info (hints etc.) See,
	for example, what ftp.apple.com keeps on line.

	4. Discussion forums, BBS-like programs devoted to
	particular products. These already exist in the POTS
	sphere (e.g. PC-Pursuit's BBS at 1-800-546-1000.)

	5. Re-selling of various information products (e.g. access
	to patent databases, the sort of info discussed in GOVDOC-L,
	postscript of tax forms, etc.)

	I once counted over 13,000 information vendors in my copy
	of DataPro's On-Line Services.

	6. Various publishing activities (e.g. send us your XYZ
	file and we'll return it as 35mm slides for $X/per.) I know
	of one vendor (Pageworks) who has a 56Kb netlink and does
	this right now.

I could name a dozen other activities that I don't know any examples
of but don't see why they wouldn't appear (e.g. bid/asked RFP
broadcast brokering for easier company purchases like: "We need 50
#207 Steelcase desks and #4451 chairs -- XYZ, Inc., Purchasing Dept.,
please send responses to purchasing@xyz.com".)

And, yes, I think you're on the mark about donation solicitation.

I wonder if charitables aren't independent of AUP? I don't think I'd
want to face that question in a courtroom equal-access suit.

I'd guess someone like United Way could make quite an argument for
access to solicit or perform other activities given the real nature of
usage rather than the hypothetical.

Let's face it, we've built a world-wide postal system with basically
flat per-year rates which only really constrains the common citizen of
modest means (and even that's breaking down thank to people like me
:-), but is wide open and cheap cheap cheap for organizations (e.g.
under $20K/year for unlimited communications access to millions, I'll
guess that UW spends more than that per day on communications.)

It's a brave new world.

I don't think laws or regulations per se (like AUP) are quite the
right head-on approach, they should exist to cover the periphery of
activity only, restricting that which is truly undesireable under all
conditions.

I'd like to see harder thinking about installing the time-honored
feedback loop: $$$. Works for the post office and phone company...

        -Barry Shein

Software Tool & Die    | bzs@world.std.com          | uunet!world!bzs
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-- 
Carl Kadie -- I do not represent EFF; this is just me.
 =kadie@eff.org, kadie@cs.uiuc.edu, or (anonymous) ap.3619@layout.berkeley.edu=