HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar)
Subject: Re: What is HAMAS
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 16:04:17 GMT

Assalamu `alaykum,

>Can any body give me some detail about "HAMAS". I have heard this name
>for the first time. Are they Shi'a or Duruz?.

  Hamas stands for "Harakat al Muqawamat il Islamiyyah", which means, the
Islamic resistance movement. It was founded by Sheikh Ahmad Yassin three
or four years ago. It represents the Muslim Bretheren in Palestine. The
founder is sunni. The organization is an Islamic organization whose aims
include providing an Islamic support organization for Palestinians, resisting
Israeli occupation, the liberation of all of Palestine and the establishment
of an Islamic state.


Assalamu `alaykum,

Mazen Mokhtar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: What is HAMAS
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 01:28:02 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.003406.5445@massey.ac.nz>, A.Qadir@massey.ac.nz (A. Qadir) writes:
|> Dear Ali
|> Assalamu alaikum,
|> Believe me or not I was totally unawear about HAMAS untill recently as some one
|> send me information about it, so I came to know. I am from Pakistan and 
|> Alhamdulillah
|> MUSLIM. Yes, being a Muslim I consider myself a bad Muslim. If we were not
|> stupid definately these dirty Jews would not have upper hand on us. More 
|> importantly, we would not have these stupid muslim and arab leaders, which is
|> major cause of our down fall. Look at bastared Fahad, stupid Al-Sabah etc etc.
|> We need to hold Islamic principals firmly, we should pray five times a day
|> and abide by all the Islamic principals and should not follows enemies of
|> Allah and his prophet s.a.w.
|> 
|> Sincerely
|> Altaf Qadir

The Islamic world fell down more than a thousand years ago, way before
those present leaders were even born. Was life better when the Islamic empire
became divided and was in constant struggle among its various parts?. Was life
better when the Islamic world was dominated by the Ottomans?. However, it is
much easier to balme the problems on the present system, colonialism, and
those rulers. Iran had initiated a revolution, is Iran better socially and
economically now or back then?.

A.Faris
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: An Article
Date: 28 Dec 92 19:30:31 GMT
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host

>MUSLIMS AWAKE
>
>Islamic states  are in confusion, unable  to act as an  'umma' or
>concerted Muslim  nation. The war  in Bosnia is  highlighting the
>powerlessness of Islam to respond  to a conflict that threatens a
>whole  Muslim  community. So,  despite  strident  calls for  arms
>shipments to be sent to  the Bosnian Muslims, despite the appeals
>for a 'jihad', no Arab leader ventures close to Sarajevo.

Perhaps, when they learn of Israel's assistance to Yugoslavia, the
arab states will finally act to counter the evil zionist imperialism,
and help other Muslims.  

I hope you've all been to and helped plan rallies against the Serbian
scum raping and killing Muslim women, as I have.

I thought so...

...
From: hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Re: The vanquished always want to imitate the victor (Ibn Khaldun)
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:11:44 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.arabic
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <1h7fvsINNldr@function.mps.ohio-state.edu> hermi@function.mps.ohio-state.edu (Lotfi Hermi) writes:

> [22 ] The vanquished always want to imitate the victor
> in his distinctive mark(s), his dress, his occupa-
> tion, and all his other conditions and customs.

Lotfi, do us a favor.  Would you please write out in Arabic
and give a translation of the phrase that every Muslim must
repeat many times in his lifetime--the part at the end of
prayer when he says something like this; "O God, if you had
really loved me you would have made me a Semite (i.e. a descendant
of Abraham)". 

I think you know what part. Do us a favor. Give us the exact
translation tell me why my interpretion is not correct.


And after that, please read Ibn Khaldun above.

And explain to  us how North Africa and Egypt became Arabized.

And explain to us, (again using Ibn Khaldun) how the Ottomans
almost completely forgot Turkish and started using Arabic and
Farsi.

And explain to us how and why it's necessary for everyone to learn
Arabic to really understand the Koran. And why the translation of
the Koran is not the Koran, only the Arabic version can be called
the Koran.

Explain to us why all the conservative-religious folk in Turkey
insist on using Arabic words constantly, and explain to us
why this is not cultural imperialism and using Latin-based
words in Turkish is cultural imperialism. Explain to us why
Turks using Turkish words instead of Arabic words are just being
funny trying to make up new words.

And why is it that Arabic names such as Slave-of-Allah (Abdullah)
is Ok for a Turk but not Allah-in-Kulu is a strange name noone
would use ?

Explain why a Turk could repeat ; "God please treat us like
the great descendants of Abraham" without feeling degraded (after
all you can't pick your ancestors), but "Ne mutlu Turkum diyene" is
a degradation for Kurds ???

Explain how all these things are not cultural imperialism.

Explain to us why all the people had messengers sent to them but
the only ones were apparently Semites (Babylonians, Arameans, Judeans,
Arabs)--no Turks, no Russians, no Frenchmen.

I can go on for a long time but I'll stop here.
-- 

	mark	

   hubey@amiga.montclair.edu         hubey@apollo.montclair.edu
   hubey@pilot.njin.net               ...!rutgers!pilot!hubey
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Does the PLO Represent the Palestinian Arabs?
Date: 21 Dec 1992 20:07:46 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu



 droth@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (David Roth) writes:

>Grow up!  You've obviously never considered how much damage a rock can
>do.  These aren't pebbles we're talking about.  The only difference
>between a stone and a gun is that a stone is more likely to bring
>unwarranted sympathy.  A stone is a deadly weapon (as are Molotov
>cocktails...).  Besides, you aren't trying to tell us that Hamas
>is using stones??

If the stone used by some kid is considered by some jews to be a deadly
weapon and make jews very annoyed and restless, I wonder what if real weapons
are used.  It will be disastarous to them.  The latest was Israel Hysteria
caused by some untrained Hamases.  Deporting 418 people indicate that the
hit from Hamas was very very painful to Israel.  Some jews argue that they
have to give up Gaza.  The best is yet to come!

Is Israel "here to stay?"  I doubt it!

-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
From: gwydion@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Mercenary Programmer)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re:  The Question of Culture
Date: 27 Dec 1992 14:41:54 GMT
Organization: Free Software Foundation
NNTP-Posting-Host: spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu

In article <Dec.26.23.14.35.1992.18028@pilot.njin.net> hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey) writes:
>One interpretation says 'people' of Mohammad and Ibrahim. Another
>offered 'family'.  I now challenge you to explain what business
>Ibrahim has in these prayers.  Where is Jesus and where is Moses?
>
>I now challenge you  to give YOUR INTERPRETATION--obviously
>the only correct one--from which you seem to refrain.

Someone should explain to this twit what "People of Mohammad"
and "People of Ibrahim" means.  He obviously has no clue.

Basalat Ali Raja.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: Peace
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 21:30:32 GMT

kal@mars.dgrc.doc.ca (ali baba) writes:

>To the arabs & the jews, if we do not negotiate a just peace now, the
extremist on both sides will win and more innocent people will be
lost. Let us try to stop the hatered and the bloodshed so our children
can have a more peacful life than the one we had. Let us work for our
"akhira".

Israel continues to hold out its hand in peace to its neighbors, as it
has since its reestablishment in 1948.  As always, all it takes for a
just and peaceful settlement is for the Arabs to decide it's time to
accept the fact that there's a non-Arab, non-Muslim nation in the vast
Arab Middle East.
-- 
Alan H. Stein                     astein@israel.nysernet.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Subject: Re: What is  H a m a s  ??
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 00:50:02 GMT

cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza Hitler Salah) writes:
>
>The most dangerous thing is to talk about something that you
>don't know about.


Now you're learnin', Hammie.


carasso "Tomorrow's lesson:  Practicing What You Preach"

...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar)
Subject: Re: The vanquished always want to imitate the victor (Ibn Khaldun)
Organization: AT&T
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 15:49:49 GMT

In article <Dec.22.15.11.44.1992.10738@pilot.njin.net> hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey) writes:
>the part at the end of prayer when he says something like this; "O God, if
>you had really loved me you would have made me a Semite (i.e. a descendant
>of Abraham)". 

  You got the text wrong. It is:

  "Allahumma Salli `ala MuHammas wa `ala aali MuHammad kama sallayta `ala aali
   Ibraheem; wa baarik `ala MuHammad wa `ala aali MuHammad kama baarakta `ala
   aali Ibraheem"

  "God, bestow your praise on Muhammad and on the people of Muhammad like you
   have bestowed your praise on the people of Ibrahim; and bless Muhammad
   and the people of Muhammad like you have blessed the people of Ibrahim"

  You see, Islam is not a racist religion.

>I think you know what part. Do us a favor. Give us the exact
>translation tell me why my interpretion is not correct.

  Maybe it's because your translation was off the mark. Whoever told you
about God loving semites is misinformed or ill-intentioned. If you want
to learn about Islam, I urge you to seek good Muslims and as them.

>And explain to us, (again using Ibn Khaldun) how the Ottomans
>almost completely forgot Turkish and started using Arabic and Farsi.

  Do you realise that one of the complaints against the Ottomans was that
they did not give enough attention to Arabic?

  You obviously have a few misconceptions about Islam.

  First of all, not all Messengers (PBUT) were semite, because the Qur'an
teaches us that to every nation God sent a Messenger and that Muhammad is
the one Messenger sent to all of humanity.

  Secondly, the reason why the Qur'an is only the Arabic text is that this
was the language of revelation. Since the Qur'an is the word of God, and
the lasting miracle, the linguistic impact of the original is unmatched
by any translation. You can read a translation and understand the main
meanings of the Qur'an, but you cannot say you read the original. A similar
concept applies to a French translation of Poe's works for example.

  Thirdly, Islam does not make it mandatory for Muslims to learn Arabic,
but when people truly love God, they want to learn and understand His
revelation, and thus they learn Arabic. Their love for God was greater than
their xenophobic nationalism. I for one, as an Egyptian, am grateful that my
ancestors adopted the Arabic language, it allowed Egypt to abandon the
unIslamic ways more easily and allowed Egyptians to gain a greater
understanding of Islam. This has benefited me and others a great deal.

  Finally, Islam is not a national or racist religion. It is the Guidance from
God to all of humanity. Every human, including you, is invited to inspect it,
study it, find the truth in it, and follow it as a guiding light for a
meaningful life followed by an everlasting reward in the afterlife. Without
that, I ask you, what will your life have meant a few decades from now when
you are weak, ill and on your death bead?

  May God guide us both.


Regards,

Mazen Mokhtar
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: What is HAMAS
Date: 30 Dec 1992 20:45:39 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, A.Qadir@massey.ac.nz (A. Qadir) says:

>
>>From: kal@mars (ali baba)
>>you are either a stupid or acting like one. Most likely you are a jew who is
>>trying to make problems with this kind of question.
>
>>by the way stupid this is a muslim movement that isreal will not be able to 
>>control.
>
>>cheers,
>
>Dear Ali
>Assalamu alaikum,
>Believe me or not I was totally unawear about HAMAS untill recently as some one
>send me information about it, so I came to know. I am from Pakistan and 
>Alhamdulillah
>MUSLIM. Yes, being a Muslim I consider myself a bad Muslim. If we were not
>stupid definately these dirty Jews would not have upper hand on us. More 
>importantly, we would not have these stupid muslim and arab leaders, which is
>major cause of our down fall. Look at bastared Fahad, stupid Al-Sabah etc etc.
>We need to hold Islamic principals firmly, we should pray five times a day
>and abide by all the Islamic principals and should not follows enemies of
>Allah and his prophet s.a.w.
>
>Sincerely
>Altaf Qadir
>
>

Well Said brother Altaf....
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.jewish
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Subject: Re: News:Resistance Grows to Pales.Expu
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 20:26:37 GMT

ww@nyxfer.UUCP writes:

>As a result, the economy has been completely shut down. Thirty 
>thousand Palestinians who would normally travel to Israel for 
>work have lost nearly $2.7 million in income.

Do palestinians really believe they have any god given right to enter
israel and be given a job?  Many are hostile to Israel.  Unofficially
the U.S. allows mexican workers to come into the U.S.  to work in the
fields.  Do the mexican have any Right to work in the U.S.?

>Israel's Dec. 17 expulsion of the West Bank and Gaza Palestinians
>was the largest ouster of Palestinians in 25 years.

I am very understanding of the motivation for the deportations, but I
actually don't agree.  If people are providing the infastructure for a
terrorist organization, and that is a threat Israel, I'd much rather
prefer passing a law Prohibiting Association with Organizations Whose
Goal in the Destruction of Israel.  Similar to the U.S. laws against
being a member of the Communist Party (many of which are still on the
books).

carasso
From: malek@pi.titech.ac.jp (Zidouri Abdelmalek 03/95)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: HAMAS STABS 13 YEAR OLD BOYS
Date: 25 Dec 92 02:08:32 GMT
Organization: Tokyo Institute of Tech., Precision and Intelligence Lab., Japan

>>>>> On 18 Dec 92 22:39:29 GMT, carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso) said:


	Roger> Palestinian Stabs 13 Year-Old Boy in the Center of Jerusalem
 Read the title again.
	Roger> Israel Radio, KOL YISRAEL, reports this afternoon that a 13 year	       Roger> old boy, Yaniv Shahar, was stabbed in the shoulder by a
	Roger> Palestinian. The stabbing occurred in a parking lot near the Klal 
Read the title again.
	Roger> Building in the center of Jerusalem. Civilians on the scene caught
	Roger> the stabber and started beating him. A woman passerby then sat on
Read the title again.
	
	Roger> boy, Yaniv Shahar, will be released and sent home before the end of
	Roger> the day.

GO HOME TO : alt.fan.roger.david.carasso! alt.sex.carasso.snuggles!
 alt.sex.carasso!

Malek.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: The Hadith about Muslims killing the J
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 21:27:27 GMT

kal@mars.dgrc.doc.ca (ali baba) writes:

>>It was the Jews who accepted the second partition of Palestine in
>>1948, the Arabs who rejected it in order to destroy the Jewish state.

>Who gave the english or the french the right to partition palestine?
>the arabs rejected the partition and they should always reject it.
The arabs and their arabizim did nothing to liberate palestine, but
the time will come when islam will liberate the land.

What, in particular, do you plan to do with the people living there,
pray tell?
>"EX: please respond to this example,

>	let us suppose that we have x & y and each one lives in his house. One day x said I'm stronger than y, I can take over his house and if he is nice enough I'll give him a room. Should the court in the U.S.A "or in any civilized country " accept this partition? I do not think so. Let us suppose the court decided in the favour of Mr. x, I'm sure if you were Mr. y & I'm Mr. x you will not accept this partition and you would fight all your life for your right.

>"
>>>First of all, do not compare Israelis to Nazis.

>>  Why not? The comparison is quite valid in this case.

>The israelis are worst than Nazis.

Glad to see that we're debating with sensible fanatics here.

>I'm sorry that some of the good jews ...

Are those the ones who bow deeply whenever a Muslim passes by, and
make sure that their homes are shorter than the shortest home of any
Muslim in the vicinity?

-- 
Alan H. Stein                     astein@israel.nysernet.org
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6180 soc.religion.islam:2120 talk.politics.mideast:24581
From: zmbenhal@netcom.com (Zeyd M. Ben-Halim)
Subject: Looking for book
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 07:24:23 GMT

Sorry to divert everybodies attention from arguments about whose more evil,
Israel or HAMAS, by discussing CULTURE on this newsgroup.

I'm wondering if anybody knows of an English translation of "Resaletu
Alghofran" (Letter of Forgiveness) by Aba Al'alaa Alma'arry.
A friend of mine is interested in the comparison between it and Dante's
"Inferno".
While on the subject, what would you consider as prime examples of early/middle
Arabic/Islamic writings?
I'm thinking of stuff that can me made accessible to western readers. Short of
that may be a book that covers such writings.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programs (sorry flames :-)

Happy New Year to all,
Zeyd
From: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar)
Subject: Re: Islamic vs Secular Societies (Re: Civiliza
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 15:45:24 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.152711.29589@mlb.semi.harris.com> dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com writes:

> I am not a follower of Islam, but I have read parts of the
>Quran and I recognize the Manifestation of God who was Mohammed, as I
>recognize all of the major Prophets, because I am a Baha'i.

  Muhammad (PBUH) is not a manifestation of God. God is the Eternal, the
Absolute, and Muhammad (PBUH) is His humble servant and Messenger.

  Muhammad himself repeatedly stressed that there is only one God, and that
He does not incarnate. He repeatedly stressed that he, Muhammad, is only a
human who was charged with delivering a message. To claim that Muhammad
was a manifestation of God is to adopt the type of beliefs which Muhammad
spent a lifetime combatting. May God's peace and blessing be on Muhammad
and on those who follow his Message.


Mazen Mokhtar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com (David Head)
Subject: Re: Islamic vs Secular Societies (Re: Civiliza
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:27:11 GMT
Reply-To: dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com
Organization: Harris Corporation, Government Aerospace Systems Division

In article 8xq@newsflash.concordia.ca, ilyess@ECE.Concordia.CA (Ilyess Bdira) writes:
>In article <1992Dec22.035722.5502@trl.oz.au> a.Faris@trl.oz.au  writes:
>>In article <BzM58M.tr@newsflash.concordia.ca>, ilyess@ECE.Concordia.CA (Ilyess Bdira) writes:
>>|> 
>>In an Islamic government, a Non-Muslim cannot even dream of having a poitical
>>career. God made vines and grapes, wine is only natural. The fact that Arabia
>
>That is not my type of Islamic government.
>
>>did not have grapes to make wine is not the fault of the Non-Muslims. Besides
>>wine is good for humans; medically. Interest now kills people, I wonder when
>>that bandit interest will be arrested and cast into hell.
>
>Sorry but wine was the dominant drink in preIslamic Arabia. Islam does not
>only forbid wine it forbids all intoxicants and harmful products.
>That includes drugs, liquor, and Tobacco. Medical necessities are exceptions,
				  ^^^^^^^

Are you sure?  I am not a follower of Islam, but I have read parts of the Quran
and I recognize the Manifestation of God who was Mohammed, as I recognize all of
the major Prophets, because I am a Baha'i.  But I didn't think Islam expressly
forbade tobacco.  Just curious.

D. Head
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: hypocrisy of zionism (was Re: 7642)
Date: 2 Jan 93 03:27:52 GMT
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host

minhaszt@ucbeh.san.uc.edu writes:
>carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso) writes:
>> 
>> Jews are not a race, Jews are a People.
>> You can be born a Jew, or Convert.
>
)which brings me back to my original point. the religious definition of
)a jew is one who believes in the religion and practices mosaic law.

The Jewish Religious Halakek (Legal) definition of a Jew is *not* what
you said.  In the Torah, you are a Jew if your mother is Jewish or you
convert.  There is no requirement of belief or practice.  Period.  You
are Jewish then.

)if that is the case, then you can not even say that half the people in
)israel can be allowed citizenship.

Further, a jew who converts to another religion is really still a jew.
However after many generations of non-practice, and marrying others, a
rabbi will usually require the descendent to convert before being
declare jewish again, if at the very least because the authenticity of
the descendents jewishness is in question.

Hope this helps.
From: hermi@function.mps.ohio-state.edu (Lotfi Hermi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Turfa ( Hajjaj Ibn Yusuf al-Thaqafi)
Date: 22 Dec 1992 11:34:06 -0500
Organization: Department of Mathematics, The Ohio State University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: function.mps.ohio-state.edu


'Abd-al-Malik ( ibn Marwan) asked one Arab who had come to him on
an embassy about al-Hajjaj. He wanted him to praise al-Hajjaj for 
his good political leadership (for the benefit of) civilization. 
But the Arab said: "When I left him, he was acting unjustly all 
by himself."  He was preventing the Arabs from practicing their 
cheriched lawlessness, and he alone was responsible for the 
oppressive rule of law. A closely related story is found in 
Ibn 'Abd Rabih, al-'Iqd (al-farid), II, p77.
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Subject: Re: information needed: Amman
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 21:10:56 GMT

kaygee@hardy.u.washington.edu (Kevin Giansante) writes:
>
>I have never lived anywhere in the Arab world.  

It's fun, fun, fun. 

>Any opinions about Amman as a place to live? 

Amman is covered with gold.  It's streets are wide with a highly
educated sophisticated population.  Most can read *AND* write.

>How does it compare with western cities?

In western cities you have to work in the city you live in.  In Jordan
you get to work in foreign lands, like Israel, for instance.

Bon Voyage...

Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic