HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rdc30@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil (LCDR Michael E. Dobson)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: What's the role of the Pack Committee Chair vs. Cubmaster
Date: 31 Aug 92 20:59:40 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Naval Medical Research & Development Command

In article <1992Aug31.133921.4792@linus.mitre.org> edelheit@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit) writes:
>I am curious how different packs split the work between the committee
>chair and the cubmaster.  I was just "promoted" to cubmaster, and the
>formerly ineffective cubmaster has moved into committee chair as a
>"temporary".  
>
>My first concern is to rebuild pack leadership.  This is especially
>important as the pack has not recovered from the loss of the old pack
>leadership of 1.5 yrs ago and I'll be moving up to Boy Scouts in
>March.  I'd hate to see the pack fall apart.
>
One thing I've always been taught in Leaders Training is that the Cubmaster
and Den Leaders work for the Committee and thus the Committee Chairman is
probably the most important position in the Pack.  You will notice on the
Leaders Applications that it is the Committee Chairman along with the
Chartered Institution Representative that approves all unit leaders.  Thus
it should be the Chairman's job to recruit new leaders.  The Cubmaster
along with the Den Leaders is responsible for planning the program while
the Committee and Chairman is responsible for the execution.  The Cubmaster
is the MC at Pack Meetings while the Chairman presides at Committee
meetings.

The above was taken from a listing of Pack Leader Responsibilities provided by
our council as part of their recruitment literature.  I don't have it with
me but can get it if you'd like more details of the various leader
respobsibilities as defined by my council.

Mike
Eagle Scout
Cubmaster Pack 1071, Rockville, MD.
-- 
LCDR Mike Dobson, Sys Admin for | Internet: rdc30@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil
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Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: jce@cs.scarolina.edu (James C. Evans)
Subject: Re: Okay, rec.scouting take two...
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date:  3 Sep 92 14:10:13 GMT

philipla@microsoft.com (Phil Lafornara) writes:

>In article <1992Sep1.071516.12618@alf.uib.no> buboo@alf.uib.no (Ove Ruben R Olsen) writes:
>>[stuff that I felt like commenting on deleted for the sake of brevity]
>>
>>Good idea, but I would rather prefer:
>>    rec.scouting.policy.bsa	- BSA, and BSA only.
>>    rec.scouting.policy.misc	- Others. Minimal BSA stuff.
>>    rec.scouting.wisdom		- Non political.

>      When we really get down to it, there isn't enough traffic
>on this group to warrant even a single new newsgroup, much less
>three.
>     I still think 'wisdom' is a poor choice of name, as well.

>					-Phil
I have opposed splitting this newsgroup in the past because many of the
postings requesting a split have amounted to an attempt to suppress
free speech.  Danny Schwender (I hope I got the spelling right)
who founded this newsgroup and Carl Kadie, who has been an active
poster re policy, have both suggested a simple split
of the group into rec.scouting.policy and rec.scouting.wisdom.
Because of the neutrality of this approach, 
I would support that two-way split, but I'd like to suggest
rec.scouting.methods rather than ".wisdom," although "methods"
is still not a perfect word.  (Nor are "function" and "activities.")

I oppose:
  (1) moving the policy discussion alone off rec.scouting, especially
      to an "alt." forum; e.g, rec.scouting/rec.scouting.policy
  (2) giving some negative name to the policy discussion; e.g.,
      rec.scouting.flames

Why not do the two-way split, and if and when there is enough non-BSA traffic
on .policy, create a BSA-specific board? 

Chris Evans
jce@ocean.geol.scarolina.edu
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: ry@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (ryerson.schwark)
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Organization: UNIX System Laboratories, Summit, NJ
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 20:33:47 GMT


For those who don't think the analogies between Judaism and being gay hold,
I will quote from Rob Bernardo, thanks to a friend whose archives are
better than mine....


> Contra Costa Times
> P. O. Box 5088
> Walnut Creek CA 94596
> 
> Editor:
> 
> As a Jew, the Fundamentalist arguments for denying gay people equal
> civil rights frighten me, because the exact same logic and reasoning
> could be used to deny Jews equal civil rights.
> 
> Now they say, "Gays don't deserve equal civil rights because they're
> immoral and don't follow the word of God." Later they'll say, "Jews
> don't deserve equal civil rights because they're immoral and don't
> follow the word of Jesus Christ."
> 
> Now they say, "Gays don't deserve equal civil rights since homosexuality
> is a behavior." Later they'll say, "Jews don't deserve equal civil
> rights because practicing Judaism is a behavior."
> 
> Now they say, "Gays don't deserve equal civil rights since they all
> have high incomes." Later they'll say, "Jews don't deserve equal civil
> rights since they are all doctors and lawyers and control the banking
> system."
> 
> Now they say, "Gays don't deserve equal civil rights because they
> brought AIDS into our community." Later they'll say, "Jews don't deserve
> equal civil rights because they killed Jesus Christ."
> 
> Now they say, "Gays don't deserve equal civil rights because they're
> obnoxious with their protests." Later they'll say, "Jews don't deserve
> equal civil rights because they're obnoxious all the time."
> 
> Hatred and Christian Fundamentalism in public policy is simply
> anti-American.  Vote no on measure M.  Don't vote for Zapalik or
> Peterson.
> 
> Sincerely,
> Rob Bernardo
From: poli2031@waikato.ac.nz
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Scouting paraphernalia in Australia, NZ
Date: 3 Sep 92 23:11:52 GMT
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

In article <1992Aug31.170752.21657@stiatl.salestech.com>, klb@stiatl.salestech.com (Kathy Ball) writes:
> My step-father (with no access to the Net) is a Scoutmaster
> (he lives and breathes Scouting).  He is planning
> a trip to Australia and New Zealand in Nov. and Dec., and would
> like to find a Scout store where he might find a pin
> or patch with some local Scout flavor.  He collects them.
> 
> 
> Auckland to Hamilton, NZ, from 2 Dec. to 4 Dec.
>   I think they're renting a car here, so anywhere between
>   Auckland and Hamilton, or even reasonably nearby, would be
>   fine.
> 
> If anyone knows of a place he could pick up pins or patches, 
> I would really like to hear about it.  Location, a phone#
> would be helpful or operating hours, any details you know.

Hamilton - countrylife outdoor centre 592 Victoria Street ph: 839 5574.
Hours: 9.00 am to 5.00 pm weekdays.  There may be late hours on Friday
evening.  Sat: 9.00 to 1.00. 
Victoria Street is the main street and the shop is just a short distance
north of main centre (post office), three sets of traffic lights.  Next
to Public Trust Office and on the same block as the Automobile Association
office.  Meter parking along Victoria Street.



> Please e-mail and I'll summarize to the net if anyone's interested.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Kathy Ball for Jerry Hurd-Smith of Atlanta, Georgia.
> 
> klb@salestech.com
>   or
> uupsi!stiatl!klb
> 
> -- 
> Kathy Ball                                             uupsi!stiatl!klb
> Sales Technologies, Inc
> 3399 Peachtree Rd, NE
> Atlanta, GA  (404) 841-4159
From: daveh@ka3uzr.UUCP (Dave Hultberg  )
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Je
Keywords: story sounds fishy
Date: 31 Aug 92 22:56:13 GMT
Organization: Hams Do It With High Frequency

jkusters@zeus.calpoly.edu (Chrome Jester) writes:

> Here's a true life story, something that happened to a dear friend of mine
> last week.  (I shan't use his name, since he doesn't know I'm posting this
> and I have yet to get his permission to use his name.)
> 
> My friend, who I'll call Bob, has been involved in Scouting for many years,
> starting (I belive) in cubs, and gone through the entire program.  He
> eventually turned 18 and then joined the adult leaders.  He'a 18 now, and
> until last week, considered to be one of the most dependable, trusted,
> respected, and loyal adult leaders in his area.  A couple of weeks ago,
> however, a couple of parents discovered he is gay.  Now, instead of asking
> him politely to leave BSA, they chose a route which I consider to be
> completely inconsistent with the stated aims and goals of BSA: they framed
> him.  He was "visited" by some members of OA (who also happened to be
> law-enforcement officials), forcibly invited to attend a hearing, and
> charged with making improper sexual advances towards minors.  The members of
> the council produced documents supposedly confirming the charge.  Then,
> without a chance to defend himself, my friend was summarily kicked out of
> BSA, and forbidden ever to return to BSA or associate in any way with
> members of BSA.
> 
> Scouting has been a part of Bob's life since before he turned 10.  He saw it
> as the most important thing he could be doing with his life.  Now they do
> this to him.  What a wonderful bunch of people...
> Is it just me?  Or is there something wrong here?
I think there is something wrong with your story here.  The Order of the 
Arrow is an honor camping society and absolutely nothing to do with 
disciplining scouts or scouters.  Even Law Enforcement Explorer Posts are 
forbidden to participate in detaining anyone.  I also don't see how your 
friend could be forced to attend any hearing.  The unit committee or the 
council could invite him to the meeting, but they have no legal powers to 
compell anyone to attend.  Having said that, being a leader in the BSA is 
not a right.  You serve at the pleasure of your chartering organization and 
the BSA organization.  A decision of the local council can also be appealed 
to the national council.  If you friend is gay there isn't much chance that 
national would reinstate him.  I'm sorry for the pain that this has caused 
him, but I also think you have the story at least a little mixed up.

Dave Hultberg, Cubmaster Pack 196, Keystone Area Council, Eagle Scout '67

    73 de Dave KA3UZR  Twisted Pair: 717-766-3553  Fidonet: 1:270/101.28  
    Packet: KA3UZR @ K3WKK.PA.USA.NA  UUCP: daveh@ka3uzr.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination,chi.general,alt.atheism,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: owen@autodesk.com (D. Owen Rowley)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Date: 26 Aug 92 17:28:27 GMT
Followup-To: alt.politics.homosexuality

In article <1992Aug24.160224@wsl.dec.com>, gnn@wsl.dec.com (George Neville-Neil) writes:
>> achenbac@epcot.spdc.ti.com (Jeff Achenbach) divulges:
>->If they are openly homosexual, then they
>->are definitely not qualified to be role models for young boys. I have yet to
>->meet the parent who openly hopes their child will grow up to be homosexual.
 
> I happen to have a straight friend at work who is looking forward
> to bringing his newborn son up to the Castro so he can take him to
> his favorite burger joint.  Hot N Hunky burgers and fries on
> 18th St. near Castro (heart of one of the Gay Neighborhoods in SF).
> I was amused and asked him jokingly if he was trying to convert him
> at such young age.  We both had a good laugh about this.
> I'm always happy when I see well adjusted people having kids, instead
> of bigots.

I also know a couple with two boys who are not bigoted like Jeff A.
My friends have stated clearly that if their boys are homosexual
they would want them to grow up free of the bigotry that pervades our
society now. 

By the way, it should not go un-noticed that in many Native American
tribes, a boy who was homosexual was a source of pride for his family.
this was taken as a sign of special favor from the great spirit, and the boy
was then trained in the shamans ways, in order to become a holy man
for the tribe. It was not unusual for the bravest and strongest warriors
to become partners ( as in sex partners) of these men, their position
in their society was very high. Of course once these people had to 
fight for their lives and endure the genocide and cultural extirpation
of good chritian ssettlers and their armys, these traditions were
lost along with many other Native ways.


LUX ./. owen

--
D. Owen Rowley {uunet,fernwood,sun}!autodesk!owen

  " It will be a cold March 17th that I celebrate the imposition of
	Romes rule, on Pagan Ireland. Erin go ppphhhhhttttttt! "
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: kadie@herodotus.cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: Re: What's the use in having this group???
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 19:53:26 GMT

wjh0265@tamsun.tamu.edu (William Hobson) writes:

>I thought that this group might get useful after the BSA flame wars died down.
>This week my KILL file has left me with nothing to read - everything posted
>was stuff I already put in my KILL file.

What about these?

American Flag Disposal
Song
HELP- History of Scout Promise
Scout Oath/Promise & Scout Law - Multinational!
History of Scout Promise & Law
BSAvoting structure
Ideas on Council Taskmaster Corp

- Carl
--
Carl Kadie -- kadie@cs.uiuc.edu -- University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination
From: kadie@herodotus.cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 14:29:11 GMT


In Eric Zorn's column in the August 16, 1992 Chicago Tribune the BSA
is said to say:

"Our values are not for sale."

But asked why it doesn't decline money offered by organizations that
prohibit the BSA's exclusionary practicies, it says:

"It would be wonderful to be that wealthy." 
   [Chicago Council spokeswoman Susan Tepinski]

- Carl
--
Carl Kadie -- kadie@cs.uiuc.edu -- University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: oakes@rtsg.mot.com (Ronald Oakes)
Subject: Re: VENTURE CREW INFORMATION WANTED
Reply-To: oakes@rtsg.mot.com
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 19:19:45 GMT

In article <1992Aug31.143835.4182@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, mayne@pipe.cs.fsu.edu (William Mayne) writes:
|> In article <24333@oasys.dt.navy.mil> ford@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Harry Ford) writes:
|> >
|> >     Our scout troop is looking into the possibility of creating a Venture
|> >Crew. Anybody out there with some experience or words of wisdom about
|> >how well this has worked? Thanks for any help
|> 
|> I haven't got a clue. Pardon me if this is a stupid question, but just
|> what is a Venture Crew? I realize anyone who could answer your question
|> would already know, but perhaps you'll take a moment to enlighten the
|> rest of us anyway. I'd be interested in a short explanation.
|> 
|> Bill Mayne

As part of the new program established in 1988-1990, the BSA established programs
for the older scouts.  These are the Venture and Varsity programs.  The Varsity
program is based on team sports, and the Venture program is based on "High 
Adventure."  Both of these program award scouts with letters (A V that can
go on the merit badge sash -- I believe) for various activities.  The requirements
for a letter (each activity is actually a pin for the letter, just like in high
school) are the same regardless of the event or activity.  The Scout is encouraged
to continue working on advancement, and to help with the younger Scouts.

These programs were introduced to help keep the 14-17 year old Scout, who will
often drop out because the Troop is doing the same things they have done for the
last 2-3 years, and they are getting other intersts.

These programs also allow girls to participate -- but not a registered scouts --
provided that there is a female chapperon.

I have never been witness to a succusfull Venture or Varsity program, but they
do exist.  I believe a strong New Scout and Regular Scout program is required,
to get the scouts ready.  Seperate Teams and Crews can be chartered, if desired.

Ronald B. Oakes
 Scoutmaster, Troop 91
 Palatine, IL
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: dauber@sgi.com (Jeff Dauber)
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 21:18:22 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.202556.13205@spdc.ti.com> achenbac@epcot.spdc.ti.com (Jeff Achenbach) writes:

>I have a little hard time believing this(born gay). If there was a gay gene, 
>wouldn't it have been lost somewhere along the way?

Many mammal tend to exhibit exclusively homosexual behavior.  There seems
to be evidence of homosexuality in every species of mammal.

Also, being genetic and not being a matter of choice are not the only
options.  I did not choose to be a homosexual.  Whether or not it is genetic,
this is true.



> Basically, I have no desire to go where I'm not
>welcome.

What if you are there and have been there for 10 years.  Then, they discover
some aspect of your personality and kick you out.  Do you have a desire to
go there?


FWA

Xref: sparky rec.scouting:2792 alt.politics.homosexuality:5672
From: awerling@nmsu.edu (WERLING)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: Crossposting articles with rec.scouting (was Re: BofA and UW ...)
Date: 3 Sep 92 22:23:03 GMT
	<1992Aug27.162412.1797@midway.uchicago.edu>
	<1992Aug27.193624.19749@m.cs.uiuc.edu>
	<1992Sep2.134418.6124@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu>
Organization: NMSU Computer Science

In article <1992Sep2.134418.6124@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> mycroft@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Charles Hannum) writes:

>   In article <1992Aug27.193624.19749@m.cs.uiuc.edu>
>   kadie@herodotus.cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
   >
> > Maybe rec.scouting should be split into several unmoderated
> > newsgroups.

> I must strongly object.  First you (as a group) invade their newsgroup,
> then rather than buggering off when asked, you propose to *split* it so
> you can keep posting to it?  This is completely inappropriate.

> I have yet to hear someone from rec.scouting actually indicate that
> they want to read this tripe.


It has to do with scouting, therefore it's appropriate for the group.

>   -- 
>    \   Charles Hannum, mycroft@ai.mit.edu
>    /\  White heterosexual atheist male (WHAM) pride!
         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Grow up!

--
Andrew Werling    awerling@nmsu.edu    yip@acca.nmsu.edu
Xref: sparky rec.scouting:2649 alt.discrimination:4027 chi.general:888 alt.atheism:16109 alt.politics.homosexuality:5577
From: anthropo@carina.unm.edu (Dominick V. Zurlo)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination,chi.general,alt.atheism,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Date: 28 Aug 92 17:30:00 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <1992Aug28.163733.330@wam.umd.edu> aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) writes:
>In article <1992Aug28.153206.24023@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> ecl@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Evelyn C. Leeper) writes:
>>Using simple substitution on Stan Krieger's remarks, I get:
>>
>{substituted paragraphs deleted}
>>
>>(end of substitution)
>>
>>Would someone like to explain how this differs in any logical fashion
>>from Stan's argument?  It's clearly as persuasive--millions died from
>>such rhetoric, and Jews above all others should recognize it as the
>>hate-mongering that it is.
>>
>
>This differs from his argument just because he was not saying it. 
>He has used a particular forM of exprerssion to show his point. It does
>not mean that he would use the same kind of expression to show another
>point. So, you should refer to what he is saying and prove that wrong and
>not chage what he is saying, because you do not know if that is what he is
>trying to say.
>In this particular case, the flaw in the logic is clear: He is talking about
>homosexuality which is not a religion, and you are talking about Judaism,
>which is a religion. And, the difference in logic is given by the different v
>views that society has about religion and homosexuality.
>What he IS showing here is a particular point of view that some members of our
>society have about homosexuality, which is in no way related to their view
>about religion. 
>
 Except that Judaism is more than a religion, it is also a cuture, and there
are many different sects and differences and communities.  And so it is with 
the Lesbigay communities.  The argument is the same.  The difference is that 
it's ok to discriminate against lesbigays n our culture, and it's not quite
so ok to discriminate against Jews.  But it happens.  Discrimination on any
basis is wrong, and nature or choice is not an excuse. Plain and simple. 
Humanity for all, equality included.  
 But just as a question to stir the pot a bit, what would you then say 
about a Hermaphrodite being a scout?  that's natural, and to change s/him
by surgery would be unnatural?  Just a thought.
WWW
Dominick V. ZUrlo
these are my opinions, and mine only.  There Mine Mine Mine, all Mine.
>
>
Xref: sparky rec.scouting:2782 alt.atheism:16464
From: bobb@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Robert Beauchaine)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.atheism
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Date: 3 Sep 92 18:40:48 GMT
Followup-To: rec.scouting
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

In article <hill.715462676@galena12> hill@rtsg.mot.com (Karen Hill) writes:
>
>Certainly true. Any behavior can be learned or unlearned. Homosexuality is
>a behavior and can be unlearned as well as learned. 

  Let's assume for a minute, Karen, that you dislike Brocolli.
  Please explain to me, in no unclear terms, how you could learn to
  like Brocolli.  Once you have accomplished this, you may extend
  your argument to homosexuality.  

  Until you can show me how to change your preferences at will, get
  off the "behaviour" argument and start accepting people as people,
  not as deviants.

>Let us not forget that what the gay/lesbian movement is asking is for
>rights based on their behavior and not their humanity.

  Interesting.  I thought most homophobes didn't classify
  homosexuals under the term humanity.  

>
>-Karen Hill


/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ 

Bob Beauchaine bobb@vice.ICO.TEK.COM 

"If I have to resurrect you, I'll resurrect you, whether you like it
or not!"
	 Paul to Jesus, _The_Last_Temptation_of_Christ_

"For dying is not to be feared--it is the final comfort.  As we all
learn, eventually."

  --Robert Heinlein
Newsgroups: rec.scouting,alt.discrimination,alt.atheism,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: awerling@nmsu.edu (WERLING)
Subject: Re: BofA and UW can now support discrimination against blacks and Jews
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
	<1992Aug28.180542.29698@cbnewsj.cb.att.com>
	<1992Aug29.145536.3961@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
	<RLK.92Aug29203214@underprize.think.com>
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 00:12:17 GMT

In article <RLK.92Aug29203214@underprize.think.com> rlk@underprize.think.com (Robert Krawitz) writes:

>   Whoa!

>   Does a mental "preference" of sexual partners of the same sex constitute
>   immoral "behavior"?  Why is a "preference" (as opposed to actions)
>   considered immoral?  What about a gay person who is controlling his or
>   her behavior (presumably abstaining)?
 
What about them?  What *is* immoral about homosexual actions?

--
Andrew Werling   awerling@nmsu.edu   yip@acca.nmsu.edu
"now we find sodom strange take it out put it in your mouth how do you like
gomorrah now a taste of this swallow that feel the fish hide the hat ezekial
where's your wheel you better grease it GREASE GREASE GREASE GREASE! ROCK!!!"
       --Chainsaw Kittens, "Ezekial Walks Through Sodom and Gomorrah"
Newsgroups: rec.scouting