HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: shaun@octel.com (Ein keine nichtmusik)
Subject: Re: Rights in cyberspace
Organization: Octel Communications Inc., Milpitas Ca.
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 21:06:49 GMT

In article <16kt0aINNrot@network.ucsd.edu> peykamp@weber.ucsd.edu (Paul Eykamp) writes:
>The key point to remember in all of the discussions about
>the various merits of how to deal with information of all
>kinds in all forms is to make sure what ever system you
>espouse generates enough incentive to cause people to want
>to bother to collect and distribute it in the first place,
>else all we will have are the few dozen books like 500 years 
>ago...

I disagree.  Barring some kind of global catastrophe, I think pretty much
everything will be saved, whether it has any intrinsic value or not.  With 
the information age have come information junkies (such as myself) who tend
to accumulate and propagate vast stores of information, often without
viewing most of it.  For instance, I own a bunch of CD ROMs, which include
software packages, english texts, and a huge number of images generated by
voyager.  I will never, ever directly experience even a measurable fraction 
of this information.  I've finally accepted this.  As storage media continue
to grow, it's going to be easier and easier to pack huge amounts of 
information into small spaces very cheaply.  In fact, in some cases, it's
already practically disposable.  Walnut Creek CD ROM produces a mirror of
the Simtel20 archives on CD ROM for $25.  Less, if you subscribe to the 
quarterly update service.  What are people going to do with all these 
obsolete CD ROMs?  I just can't bear to throw them away.  I don't think it's
unreasonable to state that in 2002, just ten years away, it will be possible
to put the entire contents of the library of congress onto a single medium 
which one can hold comfortably in one hand, for the price of dinner for two
at a nice restaurant.  The question, of course, is, "Will you want to?"  
Along with storage, data transmission rates are climbing.  Perhaps it will be
cheaper and *just as fast* to download only what you're interested in from 
a remote server.  

For me, though, the true metric of maturity of the information age is fast
graphics.  When popular home computers can do real time color ray tracing, 
we'll have arrived.  I think that's more than 10 years off, though.

(If you're picky, call "real time" 72 frames per second.)
-- 
shaun@octel.com  ||  They lie, lie, lie and over simplify, I can't stannum; 
                 ||  They give me the fear.
@Man:  Hey...  You look like a floating disembodied head!
Beej:  Don't we all?
From: bliss32@terapin.com (Geoff Schmidt)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: VRs
Date: 22 Aug 92 18:04:43 PST
Organization: BBS

The motorcycle game is called "16-Hour endurance" and in the SF area its $1 a
game.  Not worth it at all.

The Dactyl Terror out here at UCB is $3.5 for 1.5 minutes, also not really
worth it.  I got in for free for about 15 minutes.  The game is slow and choppy
and partially buggy (I was experimenting quite a bit since I had the time for
free).  They didnt have any of the other game set up on the though.

Its run on an Amiga 3000 with 2.0 dos I discovered after them re-booting it
twice to get it to work, very interesting effects though not quite fulled out
yet.   Has anyone discovered that you can talk to your opponent through the
head set?  I could hear very well but I could hear him.

 bliss
From: peykamp@weber.ucsd.edu (Paul Eykamp)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: Re: Rights in cyberspace
Date: 16 Aug 1992 06:35:54 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

The key point to remember in all of the discussions about
the various merits of how to deal with information of all
kinds in all forms is to make sure what ever system you
espouse generates enough incentive to cause people to want
to bother to collect and distribute it in the first place,
else all we will have are the few dozen books like 500 years 
ago...
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: besler@geop.ubc.ca (Steve Besler)
Subject: MONDO 2000 conference on the WELL
Organization: University of B.C. Geophysics & Astronomy
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 01:59:14 GMT

	
	Does anyone know how to get onto MONDO 2000's electronic
conference on the WELL?

Any info would be appreciated.

Steven Besler
besler@geop.ubc.ca

Post or email, whatever you'd like

Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: ebu@vipunen.hut.fi (Erik Bunn)
Subject: Re: Best game places
Followup-To: alt.cyberspace
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
	<1992Aug18.213043.26743@bnr.ca> <78026@ut-emx.uucp>
Date: 20 Aug 92 11:51:02


Quarters in Kirkland (Washington st.) is pretty good. It seems to have
the trendier games, but as long as that includes Virtuality, Steel
Talons, and Race Drivin', I don't mind.

What arcades are in the Disney World are? We found one in the
Contemporary Hotel (?.. the one the monorail rides through), which was
good. The one in the amusement park itself sucks =/.
From: jbs@korova.uucp (jacques)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
Subject: cybereconomics
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 01:06:32 CDT
Organization: VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783

While we're on the subject of the economics of c-space, here are a few 
othe points to consider. 

First, consider information as currency. In the material world, 
governments have a lock on issuing, taxing, and controlling the supply of 
it. Barter is illegal because it involves a transaction not monitored 
(and therefore taxed or even proscribed) by the govt. Counterfeiting is 
one of the worst crimes there is, as far as a govt is concerned, since it 
strikes at the very heart of the state's economic power. When we consider 
info as currency, we open a real can of worms. Anyone can issue it. Only 
formal exchanges of information are taxed. The govt can forget about 
controlling the amount of info (for very long, anyway). The value of 
currency is highly subjective and usually perishable (except for 
blackmail). Spreading false data would be the equivalent of 
counterfeiting. So far, there are only a few instances in which it is 
illegal to lie (among the countless opportunities to do so).

Second, consider the poor bastard who gets stuck with the job of defining 
the economics of cyberspace (for tax purposes).

--
              VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783
        "where you can find the Zeta Greys SAFEWAYING themselves
                into the WONDERBREAD *heart* of America!"
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: Josh.Adams@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Josh Adams)
Subject: Hey all
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 14:18:40 GMT

Well, I'm startin' this group, seems cool 'nuff. Anyway, I'm here in Maryland
and there aren't any really good arcades around here :(. Oh, well, maybe
someday I'll head over to Virginia and play HERO or Dactyl whatever...

Where in VA is that? As in specifics... Maybe the place in King's Dominion
is good (?). I'm planning on going soon, I'll check it out...

L8r,
JosH
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: steve.rainwater@ocitor.fidonet.org (Steve Rainwater)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet
From: mike@highlite.uucp (Mike Wiik)
Subject: Re: Hey all
Organization: Gotham Communications Research
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 00:08:44 GMT

Josh.Adams@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Josh Adams) writes:

>Well, I'm startin' this group, seems cool 'nuff. Anyway, I'm here in Maryland
>and there aren't any really good arcades around here :(. Oh, well, maybe
>someday I'll head over to Virginia and play HERO or Dactyl whatever...
>Where in VA is that? As in specifics... Maybe the place in King's Dominion
>is good (?). I'm planning on going soon, I'll check it out...

Virtuality is in Springfield Mall, near the intersection of 95 South
and the Washington Beltway. Just drive South of 95 and look for the
signs that say "Franconia".

Springfield Mall has TWO arcades, Time Out and Time Out 2. They've
been there for years whilst numerous arcades have come and gone. The
only problem is that it's usually too crowded. They do seem to get lots
of new games.

Enjoy.

	-Mike

-- 
   | o==== . : ... :  :  .     |Mail Me Neat Stuff->POB 3703 Arlington VA 22203
 --@-- . o o o ... O -O- o o : |No disclaimers needed: I actually pay for this.
   |           ... :  :        |-----------------------------------------------
mEssAGE fRoM sPAcE ARt stUdiOs |Man:TheMissingLinkBetweenApes&HigherIntelligence
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: jwilbur@iat.holonet.net (Jay Wilbur)
Subject: Re: Best game places
Organization: HoloNet (BBS: 510-704-1058)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 14:10:24 GMT

cblandy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Chris Blandy) writes:
: In article <1992Aug18.213043.26743@bnr.ca> bcash@crchh410.BNR.CA (Brian Cash) writes:
: >Coit in North Dallas.  How about a thread on everyone's favorite places
: >around the US?
: >
: >Brian /-|-\
: 
: Definitely Einstein's on the drag in Austin.  Although it's small, it's close
: to campus, has great games, and beats the pants off Le Fun down the street :)
: 
: -- 
: ---
:                  Chris Blandy        |       Computer Science major
:           cblandy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu | The University of Texas at Austin
: 
-- 
/-------------------------------------------------------------------------\
| Jay Wilbur  | jwilbur@orac.holonet.net | CIS: 72600,1333 |   Fidonet    |
| Id Software | AOL: Id Softwr           | GEnie: jjj      |  1:124/6300  |
\-------------------------------------------------------------------------/
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace,rec.games.video.arcade
From: ameyer@cbnews.cb.att.com (Andreas Meyer)
Subject: Re: HERO Game out for Virtuality
Reply-To: ahm@hoserve.att.com (Andreas Meyer)
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Holmdel NJ
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 13:01:46 GMT

whoffman@jato.jpl.nasa.gov (Walt Hoffman) writes:
> Is there a list of locations for VR machines?

...or do we have to keep calling 1-800-ILLUSION? <sigh>

And what's the deal with these locations? A bunch of us were going
to head down to the one in the Woodbridge Center Mall (NJ), but
by the time we got there, the place was locked and deserted.
(ie. the steel riot gate was down, and there were no games machines
inside anymore. However the "Virtuality" sign was still over the
door. Weird!) The place couldn't have been open for more than
a month...

Andy

    ==--
  -====---    Andreas Meyer, N2FYE                     ahm@hoserve.att.com
  --==----    AT&T Bell Laboratories, Holmdel NJ        ..!att!hoserve!ahm
    ----
Newsgroups: alt.cyberspace
From: cyberoid@milton.u.washington.edu (Robert Jacobson)
Subject: Re: MONDO 2000 conference on the WELL
Organization: WORLDESIGN, Seattle
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 20:15:43 GMT

In article <1992Aug15.015914.24214@unixg.ubc.ca> besler@geop.ubc.ca
(Steve Besler) writes:

>	Does anyone know how to get onto MONDO 2000's electronic
>conference on the WELL?

The WELL is reachable via the Internet at:

	192.132.30.2

This is a subscription service.  Costs are $2/hr plus $10/month.
The WELL is one of the premiere conferencing systems worldwide.
Very high quality chatter.  You can register online.

Bob Jacobson
Moderator
sci.virtual-worlds
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 12:03:37 GMT


Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson)
Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:14:31 GMT

In <1992Aug13.191334.19680@ntmtv> harthc@ntmtv.UUCP (Howard Hart) writes:

>Here's a simple if slightly fascist fix. Disable access to questionable
>newsgroups and permit access by user machine only. Insist on low-key,
>word of mouth subscription only (i.e. - they have to come to you as
>the news admin to get access to "fringe" newsgroups). Make it clear,
>access exists only so long as nobody raises a major stink and you'll
>be amazed how cooperative these users will be. It's not a great 
>solution, but gets you out of the business of playing morals judge
>and jury and avoids the issue of having to justify anything to those
>with different ideas on wha't proper (and what's not).

	Unfortunately, it doesn't work worth a damn.  Here at ISU,
we have a large network of Unix machines, VAXen, and one old
clunker known as Wylbur.  Since all are multi-user machines, we
pressed for any restrictions to be on a per-user basis, but this was
not allowed.  Now, you have to sign up for a full newsfeed for each
machine you are responsible for.  This means the public-access machines
are not allowed a full feed.  Wylbur is the only machine that can
work on a per-username basis, and coincidentially it has the most
primitive newsreader available.

	In short, I can't read from my terminal at home, my terminal
at work, or any of the public labs unless I telnet to wylbur and
read it there.  This doesn't stop a darn thing (I can ftp pics to
the workstation and display them there if I wish) -- all it does is
make it inconvenient.

	One thing that came to mind was to write a script on Wylbur
that mailed each and every message from the banned groups to my
unix account with the header and message number in the subject line.
I could then write a script on my unix account to organize the
messages and display them in order by subject.  I think this would
waste more bandwidth than just opening things back up, but I don't
want to get anybody angry while we are making progress in removing
these silly restrictions.

	There are ways around everything, and your policy is so
easy to circumvent it is merely a laughable attempt that only
inconveniences readers.

<Dan Sorenson, DoD #1066 |"There'll be angels on Ariels in leather>
<z1dan@exnet.iastate.edu | and chrome, Ridin' down from heaven    >
<viking@iastate.edu      | just to carry me home." -- R. Thompson >
< ISU thinks I need more education, which they provide for a fee. >

Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 09:33:16 GMT


Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: s_fuller@iastate.edu (Steve Fuller)
Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 16:59:19 GMT

In <neuhaus.713788374@vier> neuhaus@vier.informatik.uni-kl.de (Stephan Neuhaus (HiWi Mattern)) writes:

>Hi.

>I have read the ongoing discussion in this group with interest at
>first.  However, when I thought of it some more, I found that all of
>the followups seem to have ignored one central issue:

>  If a University or company offers a news feed, it is offering a
>*service*.  Usenet is not yet a right, it's a privilege.  A University
>or company has every right to control how their computers are used.
>After all, they belong to the University or company, not to the
>students or employees.  In analogy, a newsstand does not have to carry

They belong to the university IF they are a private university.
If we are talking about state funded schools, then the majority
of the equipment belongs to the state, which is purchased by tax
dollars. If I want a certain newsgroup and am denied it, am I
getting my tax dollar's and tuition money's value back in a fair
manor.

-- 
---------------------=------------------------------
Steve Fuller	     = 
s_fuller@iastate.edu =   No witty quote here yet...
---------------------=-----------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@eff.org (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: Re: Abstract of CAF-News 02.31
Originator: kadie@eff.org
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:27:37 GMT

[...]
>To Whom It May Concern,
>  I was reading CAF-news, but I cannot understand 
> what the numbers after the article are all about: i.e.

><9206250251.AA04855@nextsun.INS.CWRU.Edu>
[...]

Hi! You were reading the abstract of CAF-News. Each numbered paragraph
is a paraphrase/summary of an full article in the full CAF-News. The
numbers are the message-id's of the full articles.

You can see the full CAF-News by reading alt.comp.acad-freedom.news,
                                                               ^^^^
or by subscribing to the CAF-News email list, or by following the
instructions included with every CAF-News abstract on archive access.

- Carl

ANNOTATED REFERENCES

(All these documents are available on-line. Access information follows.)

=================
caf
=================
A description to the comp-academic-freedom-talk mailing list. It is a
free-forum for the discussion of questions such as: How should general
principles of academic freedom (such as freedom of expression, freedom
to read, due process, and privacy) be applied to university computers
and networks? How are these principles actually being applied? How can
the principles of academic freedom as applied to computers and
networks be defended?

=================
=================

These document(s) are available by anonymous ftp (the preferred
method) and by email. To get the file(s) via ftp, do an anonymous ftp
to ftp.eff.org (192.88.144.4), and get file(s):

  pub/academic/caf

To get the file(s) by email, send email to archive-server@eff.org.
Include the line(s) (be sure to include the space before the file
name):

send acad-freedom caf
-- 
Carl Kadie -- I do not represent EFF; this is just me.
 =kadie@eff.org, kadie@cs.uiuc.edu =
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: $L$LB50@LUCCPUA.bitnet (Claudia Gomez Carmona)
Subject: SAVE WOUNDED KNEE  (Copy) Wounded Knee
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 21:33:00 GMT

 ---------------------------- Text of forwarded message -----------------------
/* Written  7:11 pm  Aug  6, 1992 by peacenet in cdp:pn.alerts */
/* ---------- "Wounded Knee" ---------- */
From: <peacenet>
Subject: Wounded Knee

From eeames Thu Aug  6 09:40:22 1992
From: Elizabeth Eames <eeames>

ELDERS OF THE LAKOTA SIOUX NATION HAVE URGED CONCERNED CITIZENS TO
CONTACT CONGRESS IMMEDIATELY TO DEFEAT RESOLUTION 9285 WHICH WOULD
TAKE AWAY THE SACRED WOUNDED KNEE SITE TO MAKE A NATIONAL PARK.
THIS WOULD NO LONGER THEN BE INDIAN LAND AND WOULD GIVE MINERAL
RIGHTS TO THE GOVERNMENT. 600 SIOUX WOULD BE DISPLACED. THEIR HOMES
WOULD BE CONDEMNED. NO PROVISIONS HAVE BEEN MADE FOR RELOCATION.

FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT WALTER LITTLEMOON (AFTER 7 P.M.
CENTRAL TIME) AT (605)-288-1907 OR JOHNICE (11 AM)7 EASTERN) (704)
658-0123.. ... ...-....1200 N81N
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: CAROL%MDLIB.DECNET@VMS.HUJI.AC.IL
Subject: RE: Computers and Academic Freedom mailing list (batch edition)
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 10:59:00 GMT

     I have been trying for several weeks to get off the list but the listserv
no longer recognizes my e-mail address when I send in my cancellation - in
spite of the fact that it continues to send me mail.
     Please unsubscribe me
     Thanx,
          Carol


=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
%   Carol Fuchs-Halperin      %  BITNET%"CAROL%MDLIB.HUJI.AC.IL     %
%   Collections Development   %                                     %
%     & Systems Librarian     %  Tel: 972-2-428-8789                %
%   National Medical Library  %  P.O. Box 1172                      %
%               Jerusalem, ISRAEL  91010                            %
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 05:35:00 GMT


Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz)
Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 13:41:06 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.160445.16878@dragon.acadiau.ca> 880518l@dragon.acadiau.ca (Nelson Langille) writes:
>Yes, but isin't it true that many(mostly all) anonymous FTP sites
>contain pictures which are copyrighted?  So what's the difference.

No it is not true.

- J. Botz
From: evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk (Mark Evans)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Re: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: 17 Aug 92 08:27:21 GMT
Organization: Aston University

kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
: 
: From: wengler@ee.rochester.edu (Mikey)
: Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
: Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
: Message-ID: <1992Aug14.140516.13020@ee.rochester.edu>
: Date: 14 Aug 92 14:05:16 GMT
: 
: In article <BsxH08.GE8@mtholyoke.edu> jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:
: Aren't virtually all of the image-distribution groups violating
: copyright?  Aren't most distributing images which have been scanned in
: from copyrighted material?

Maybe I sould see if the scanned record sleeve I found is still arround.
and maybe tell the record company concerned.
The boss of it might just invite the perpertrator ballooning :-)
: 
: It is not clear to me why you single out pornographic groups for this
: charge.
: 
: SImilarly, the other image groups use similarly large proportions of
: resources.
: 
: You probably need to take a uniform policy toward all image groups on
: the basis of copyright or resource use if you don't wish to be involved
: in censorship.

But that would take an axe away from the poor censors, :-)
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Evans                                   |evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 565 1979 (Home)                     |evansmp@cs.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 359 6531 x4039 (Office)             |
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: sbrack@jupiter.cse.UTOLEDO.edu (Steven S. Brack)
Subject: NetNews as a common carrier?
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 06:01:03 GMT


	According to my understanding of common carrier status, news carriers
like UUnet would be common carriers, provided they carried *all* newsgroups.

	News sites would also qualify as common carriers, but if & only if
they did not exclude any news.  Once you start paring down the information
flow based on content, I don't believe you qualify for common carrier
protections, as you are, in a broad sense, "editing" the newsfeed.

	What do you think?


Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk