HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: smlacke@isrc.sandia.gov (Scott M Lackey)
Subject: Re: Number of jumps
Organization: Sandia National Labs, Org. 1600, Albq., NM
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 23:01:00 GMT

From article <BvE7ty.I6I@virtech.uucp>, by mark@virtech.uucp (Mark Smith):
> 
>              rounds                  squares                 aad
>         #jumps     #mal         #jumps      #mal       saves      #mal
> Mark	  10        0              450        1          0         2
> Pete       0        0             1300        0
> Philip    50        1             1200        8
> Pierre    45        0             1200        0
> Vilhuber   0        0              115        0
> 
	[etc...]
	I don't mean to put a damper on this, but how significant can this
total be?  I mean, to be stastically valid, the data needs to be
representative of the jumping population.  There's got to be a highly
negative correlation between malfunctions and still being around to
talk about it on the net.

P.S.        rounds
		  #jumps     #mal
  Scott     1          0

  I'd like to see numbers less significant that that!

Scott Lackey
From: fsbgf@acad3.alaska.edu
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Number of jumps
Date: 2 Oct 92 19:12:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: acad3.1992Oct2.111217.1
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks

In article <1ahvafINN8q5@pollux.usc.edu>, suhler@pollux.usc.edu (Paul A. Suhler) writes:
> In article <1992Oct2.140606.22835@news.ysu.edu> joe@avs.com (Joe Peterson) writes:
>                 rounds              squares             aad
>             #jumps   #mal      #jumps    #mal      saves    #mal
> Mark          10       0          450      1         0       2
> Pete           0       0         1300      0
> Philip        50       1         1200      8
> Pierre        45       0         1200      0
> Vilhuber       0       0          115      0
> Gerhard        0       0           82      0
> H. Wain       36       0         1200      1
> Hector         0       0          260      0
> Jan            0       0          115      0
> Tim            0       0          175      0
> Charlie     1500       3          750      3
> Bob V!        60       0         2000      2
> Joe            0       0          630      1
> Paul           0       0          431      1
> 
  Brandon	 0	 0	      8	     0

Don't laugh that's all I could afford this summer!! I'll do better next season.

Brandon France
University of Alaska, Fairbanks
fsbgf@alaska
fsbgf@acad3.alaska.edu
From: pvf@alantec.com (Paul Fries)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: malfunction stats (oops, repost)
Date: 1 Oct 92 01:02:01 GMT
Distribution: na

OK, let's try this again...
 
I am interested in the actual malfunction rates as we experience
them.
 
Personally, I don't see a lot of round mains anymore, so I feel
that stats on them would not help the signal to noise ratio.
Anybody have any "religious" objections to this?
 
There seems to be a great deal of mixed feeling about
differentiating between "gear failure" vs "pilot error", so
let's make some simple rules, and report both.
 
Everybody knows how many malfunction he/she has had.  Please
report that number.
 
Let's define "avoidable" malfunctions as situations where you,
the jumper, CLEARY screwed-up;  where, aside from your mistake,
the malfunction wouldn't have happened.  This would include, but
not be limited to, things like twisted belly-bands or leg
straps.  I can't think of what else goes into this category, but
you get the idea.  If the malfunction was CLEARLY under your
control and avoidable, count it in this category.
 
If you don't know how to classify your malfunctions, no
problem.  Split the count however you are comfortable.  Maybe
you and your friend disagree about a particular malfunction
being avoidable.  It doesn't really matter, report it the way
you see it.
 
The bottom line is that we get three numbers:
 
    total square jumps, total square malfunctions, and avoidable
    square malfunctions.
 
I know that there may be some skewing of the data as a result of
the subjective nature of the input.  That is not important right
now.  If we find something really startling in the stats, we can
discuss that later.  For now, I just want to get some numbers to
talk about.
 
To make my life easier, please give me the information in the
following format:
 
<jumps><whitespace><malfunctions><whitespace><avoidable><whitespace><address>
 
where <jumps>, <malfunctions> and <avoidable> are numbers, and
<whitespace> is one or more <tab> or <space> characters.
 
For example, my input would be:
 
500 1 0 pvf@alantec.com
 
I ask for a specific format so that the data can be processed
automatically.  I will probably throw out anything that doesn't
fit, after all, it is not a very difficult format to follow.

>	OOPS, I FORGOT TO SAY...
>
>	EMAIL the information to me at "pvf@alantec.com".
>	I am not going to mess around with sorting out the
>	news.  So, please, EMAIL it so I can process it
>	easily.

Anyway, in a week or so, I will post the results.

			(as the Bartles and James folks used to say...)

			Thank you for your support,
			Paul Fries
			pvf@alantec.com
From: yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Number of jumps
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:47:56 GMT
Organization: Chevron Oil Field Research, La Habra, CA.

In article <1992Oct1.132150.23347@aio.jsc.nasa.gov> horn@tegan.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark Horn) writes:
>In article <1992Sep30.223945.1@ntc02.tele.nokia.fi> nironen@ntc02.tele.nokia.fi (Pasi Nironen , OH2BKX) writes:
>>> 		rounds					squares
>>> 	#jumps		#mal			#jumps		#mal
>>   Pasi   1              0                       470              0
>>
>> Last 50 jmps studying CRW, knocking on wood...
>
>I guess you don't count CRW wraps as malfunctions, right?  So what are we
>counting here:  reserve rides or malfunctions?  I think it would be much 
>easier to count reserve rides.  It's easier to define when you've had one.
>For example, do you count a lost throw-out as a malfunction?  Why, the gear
>didn't fail - the user did.  Personally, I wouldn't count that as a
>malfunction.  So I suggest that we start counting reserve rides and not
>malfunctions - simply because it's easier to define the former than the latter.
>Hey, Philip, you started this.  What were you intending?
>
>Anyway, no reserve rides after 50 CRW jumps?  Now THAT is saying something!

A malfunction, in my dictionary, is when you had to deploy your reserve.
Hence, if you failed to find your pod and had to open your reserve, this
is a malfunction. If you lost your altitude awareness and opened your
reserve without bothering with your main because you were too low, this
is also a malfunction, etc...

-- 
  Philip Yzarn de Louraille                 Internet: yzarn@chevron.com
  Research Support Division                 Unix & Open Systems
  Chevron Information & Technology Co.      Tel: (310) 694-9232
  P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446     Fax: (310) 694-7709
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: jmills@cass.ma02.bull.com (John Luke Mills)
Subject: Double Horny Gorilla
Organization: Bull World Wide Information Systems Inc.
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 21:25:32 GMT


I have been trying to think of something special to do for my 500th
jump.  Recently I saw a video of 8 people (possibly the Golden Nights)
do what I immediately called a Double Horny Gorilla.  Since I really
like single 3 and 4 way HG's this seems perfect.  Unfortunately I
don't remember exactly how this went, but this is my best guess.

The base was a regular 4-way star.  Each of the outer 4 people seemed
to take a main lift web grip on 2 of the base people.  The outer 4
kicked into the center with everyone keeping their grips.  After this
the base people dropped grips and kicked into the center.

I don't what video this is on.  I saw this on one of the numerous
tapes at Pepperell Skydiving Center.  Does anyone know what tape this
might be on?  Does anyone have any specific ideas on the best way to
do something like this?

John Luke Mills
-- 




Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: mark@virtech.uucp (Mark Smith)
Subject: Re: malfunctions (not gear failure)
Reply-To: mark@vti.com
Organization: Virtual Technologies, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 23:28:56 GMT

Paul Fries (pvf@alantec.com) wrote:
: I volunteer to collect, format, post, if you EMAIL your
: input to me.  Please use your email address instead of your
: name (or nickname, as some use).  That way, people can
: email back to you if they want to.

Good.  I have a few which other people have email me directly;
I was going to volunteer to do this until I saw your posting.
I'll send along the other info that I have.
-- 
      /_\   Virtual                  Mark Smith          USPA D-13761
    /-~_  \    Technologies          mark@vti.com
  /      ~-_\     Incorporated       703-430-9247,   FAX 703-450-4560
/_____________\      46030 Manekin Plaza, Suite 160, Dulles, VA 20166
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: jvilhube@diana.cair.du.edu (Jan Vilhuber)
Subject: Re: Number of jumps
Organization: University of Denver, Denver, Colorado
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 92 03:10:43 GMT

In article <15864@mindlink.bc.ca> Charlie_Gibbs@mindlink.bc.ca (Charlie Gibbs) writes:
>In article <BvE7ty.I6I@virtech.uucp> mark@virtech.uucp (Mark Smith)
>writes:
>>Vilhuber       0       0          115      0
>
> Jan            0       0          115      0
>
Look! Jan and Vilhuber have the same number of jumps. What a coincidence..
Wait! They're both ME!

Whew.. for a second there I thought I was going schizo;)
-- 
 Jan Vilhuber            | Internet: jvilhube@du.edu or jvilhube@[130.253.1.4]
 (The skydivin' Bass)      | Bitnet  : jvilhube@DUCAIR
--------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: horn@tegan.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark Horn)
Subject: Re: You're dead -- unless you pull (was Re: Tiny Broadwick
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Center
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:37:14 GMT

In article <7120@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com> yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille) writes:
>		rounds					squares
>	#jumps		#mal			#jumps		#mal
>
>Philip	50		1			1200		8

Sparkie 0               0                       650             0
                                                                ^
                                                               knock on wood!

Unfortunately, until I can afford differently, my first round jump will be a
reserve ride.

- sparkie
horn@mickey.jsc.nasa.gov
From: fbm@ptcburp.ptcbu.oz.au (Farrell McKay)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Number of jumps
Date: 2 Oct 92 01:03:07 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation

>>In article <7120@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com>,
>> (Philip Yzarn de Louraille) writes:
>>
>> Just for kicks and concerning malfunction rates of main parachutes, why
>> don't we all write the number of jumps we have and the number of main
>> malfunctions we got so far......

                rounds              squares             aad
            #jumps   #mal      #jumps    #mal      saves    #mal
  Me        ~40       0        ~1925      1,3(*)    n/a     n/a

Sorry gang, I missed the original posting to this thread.
Here is my $0.02 worth anyway...

(*)  Note: what are we measuring?  If it is the no. of times our main
canopies have failed to deploy properly and thus forced a cutaway, then
my count is 1.  If it is the number of times we have landed under reserve
for whatever reason, then my count is 3.

And what is the goal of the exercise?  If the aim is to come up with
a figure so that we can say, "The chances of having a mal are 1 in XXX",
then I would be very suspicious of the figure.  "The chances of you needing
to use your reserve are 1 in XXX", would be a more relevant but also
debatable yardstick.  Lies, damn lies, and statistics!  What about wraps
during CRW?  Do total malfunctions count too?  What about mals which were
not cutaways?  And what about time in the sport or currency level as a factor?
And don't forget that you cannot measure something without influencing it.
(which is absolutely weird if you ask me).

Anyway, the thread looks like it is turning into a bit of a census.
Fantastic.  Something like this has been too long in coming.  It is
interesting, if only to get a profile of the group's readership.
How about absolutely everybody sending in a reply to this survey?
There are a few absent names that I can think of.  We could get a roll
call together based on the last N months of postings to rec.skydiving,
from the archive on skydive.eng.ufl.edu.

Farrell.
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: mark@virtech.uucp (Mark Smith)
Subject: Skydiving with the Russians.
Summary: Air & Space, October/November issue.
Reply-To: mark@vti.com
Organization: Virtual Technologies, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 18:25:30 GMT

If anyone out there gets "Air & Space Magazine", you might want
to take a gander and the article entitled "Leap of Faith." It's
an short story about learning how to skydive with the russian
paratroopers south of Moscow.  There are some neat shots of the
Antonov An-2, jumpship.
-- 
      /_\   Virtual                  Mark Smith          USPA D-13761
    /-~_  \    Technologies          mark@vti.com
  /      ~-_\     Incorporated       703-430-9247,   FAX 703-450-4560
/_____________\      46030 Manekin Plaza, Suite 160, Dulles, VA 20166
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: wain@decoy.uucp (25498-greenhalgh)
Subject: Re: Parachutist
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 92 13:29:56 GMT

In article <1992Oct4.052433.6064@mercury.cair.du.edu> jvilhube@diana.cair.du.edu (Jan Vilhuber) writes:
>Just two thoughts on this month's issue of Parachutist:
>One: Congrats Art for your Gold Wings and 12-Hour..
>
>Two: Was reading the advertisement for Dytter. It seems they introduced
>	a new feature: an LED that blinks when the alarm goes off. 
>	Now correct me if I'm wrong (I don't own a dytter), but most
>	people wouldn't mount the thing somewhere in from of they're face,
>	would they? I mean, unless they ship fiberoptical cable with it, to route
>	the light close to the eye, a blinding flash of light or something...
>	*I* don't think so!
>	What the hell good would an LED do?!
>

There are two reasons for the LED on a dytter.  The main reason is to check
or set the dytter in the plan on the way up you do not have to hold it next
to your ear, you can simply watch the LED.  Also there is a simple device that
can be taped to the LED and allows you to mount another LED where you can
see it.  There is even a new camera sight with 2 LEDs in it.  One is
connected to you record indicator on your camera and the other is connected
to this new dytter so that in you sight you will be able to see the dytter.



H. Wain Greenhalgh
wain@decoy.cc.bellcore.com
BELLCORE
Piscataway, NJ
From: drf40@cd.amdahl.com (Daryl Fortney)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: New Gear
Date: 28 Sep 92 16:30:48 GMT
Reply-To: drf40@cd.amdahl.com
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale, CA


	Okay, now that I just graduated, I am looking into buying some gear,
and was wondering if anyone had any recommendations.  What kind of
altimeter: digital or analog, and what brands and models? What kinds of
goggles? Hard helmet or soft? Ditter or No Ditter? Anything new and
exciting?  I weigh 135 and am about 5'6" and was wondering if anyone had
any used gear, or a main or anything.  Well, thanks in advance, and blue
skies...
	-df

-- 
Daryl Fortney						drf40@cd.amdahl.com
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Date: Thu,  1 Oct 1992 01:45:14 -0400 
From: "Danny A. Rossi" <dr25+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Pilot chutes.

Somebody mentioned they sucked their pilot chute into a center cell and thought 
about cutting it away.  I doubt it would cause too much trouble in the center.
I sucked my pilot chute in an end-cell once.  Landed the bitch but I 
was using three quarter breaks on one toggle to keep it straight.

Blue Skies
Dan Rossi
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: dbriggs@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Daniel Briggs)
Subject: Re: DZ altitude
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Socorro NM
Distribution: rec
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 92 06:46:40 GMT

In article <SHIBUYA.92Oct5192458@chute.mailhost.bl.cad.slb.com>
  shibuya@mailhost.bl.cad.slb.com writes:
>I just learned today that Eloy is like 2,500 ASL.
>...
>Also, are there any other major famous DZ any higher than Eloy?

Gee, Tim.  I dunno about you, but I've always thought of Eloy as quite
*low*.  Wow!  Look how much air there is down here -- you can plane out
forever!  I guess I'll agree with Hiroto that Belen and Loveland do not
constitute "major famous DZs".  We're at 5200 MSL in Belen.  How high is
Loveland?  For that matter, which netter can take the prize for highest
home DZ?  (A dubious honor at best.  Given the choice, I'll take sea level!
;)

BSBD!

-- 
| Daniel Briggs  (dbriggs@nrao.edu)                      |        USPA B-14993
| New Mexico Tech / National Radio Astronomy Observatory |            DoD #387
| P.O. Box O / Socorro, NM 87801   (505) 835-7391        |
Support the League for Programming Freedom  (info from league@prep.ai.mit.edu)
From: pvf@alantec.com (Paul Fries)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: malfunction stats
Date: 1 Oct 92 16:02:26 GMT
Distribution: na


Two things...

one response in the survey had the following comment:

>   if I were you, I would describe the third number above as
>   reserve rides.  If the second number is malfunctions, and
>   the third number is reserve rides, then you can do simple
>   subtraction to determine "avoidable malfunctions" and you
>   don't have to do any extra defining.

Well, I meant the first number to be the number of reserve
rides.  Silly me... I wasn't thinking about non-reserve ride
malfunctions.

So, with this in mind, the input fields contain:

    1) total square jumps
    2) total reserve rides when the main was a square
    3) number of <input #2> that were, in your opinion, avoidable.
    4) your email address

If this is different from what you sent me, please send again.

================================================================

Secondly, due to a death in the family, I will be unavailable
for an unknown period of time, probably about a couple of
weeks.  I will, no doubt, post the survey results at that time.
Sorry for the delay.

Should someone else like to proceed, feel free.

				Paul Fries
				pvf@alantec.com
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: tjreynol@zephyr.cair.du.edu (The Jumpin Dude)
Subject: Human mals - desc.
Organization: University of Denver
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 92 01:08:13 GMT

I thought someone wanted descriptions of mals, but I can't find the 
article; mals I've had but didn't need to cutaway from include:

knotted front left line group, slider stuck. rental gear packed
by who knows. was going to cut away after the last pump, which worked.
probably could have landed it.

steerling toggle came loose on opening, my pack job on Jan's rig.
fastest spin I've ever been in. so fast i almost could not reach
the other toggle. i now am *very* careful about making sure the 
toggle is securely through the line and tight against the ring.
probably would have died landing it.

when my main was assembled by wannabee riggers, they routed a steering
line around the line group. the rigger didn't catch it, but i did, 
correctd that myself, but didn't feed the line back through the ring.
it came loose on my first new gear jump. it didn't spin, i just couldn't 
find it. the slider finally brought it down as i was about to chop it.
probably could have landed it.

I was sure there was another, but I can't remember it. Oh, twice could 
not find the thrpw out handle on rental gear. Had my hand on the silver
handle one of those times.

Last weekend my pilot chute got very close to getting into nose of the 
center cell. I've seen two people land these. I seem to recall the opinion
here was cut that away (?), is that generally a good idea? I was a bit
concerned about it, because I couldn't get it to move for awhile, and I
didn't want it to get in there at 1,000' and cause a problem. I finally 
got it to go away by sahaying somewhat vigorously. Is there a better way?

Tim
From: MORET@eldi.epfl.ch (Pierre Moret)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: CYPRES: worked one more time...
Date: 28 Sep 92 08:04:50 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne, Dpt d'informatique
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.22


A jumper was saved by his CYPRES, last Saturday (26th of Oct), in Sitterdorf,
Switzerland. After a RW jump, he had some problems and was unable to pull
the reserve handle which was out of the velcro. We saw him falling absolutely 
stable, but without trying to do something. Then the CYPRES fired, reserve
came out very quick, he made a 15-20 sec flight and landed.

The height of opening seemed us to be low, but CYPRES saved one life more.
(no more details before official ones.)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: gjh@galen.med.Virginia.EDU (Galen J. Hekhuis)
Subject: Re: Re: You're dead -- unless you pull (was Re: Tiny Broadwick
Organization: University of Virginia Health Sciences Center
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 18:20:38 GMT

In article <5250003@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com> glenb@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Glen Baker) writes:
}             rounds                                  squares
}       #jumps          #mal                    #jumps          #mal
}
}Glen      0             0                         1             0
Galen      1             0                         0             0

}<grin>
<older grin>

--
       hang gliding mailing list: hang-gliding-request@virginia.edu 
     Galen Hekhuis  UVa Health Sci Ctr (804)982-1646 gjh@virginia.edu
               A man's screech should exceed his gasp...
From: yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: malfunctions (not gear failure)
Date: 30 Sep 92 18:27:25 GMT
Organization: Chevron Oil Field Research, La Habra, CA.

In article <pvf.717872253@diablo> pvf@alantec.com (Paul Fries) writes:
>Here is the collected list as I have seen it.
>
>
>                      rounds                          squares
>              #jumps          #mal            #jumps          #mal
> 
>Philip            50             1              1200             8
>Tim                0             0               175             0
>Hector             0             0               260             0
>pvf@alantec.com    2             0               500             0
>
>BTW - I have had 1 reserve ride that was "gear failure"
>(broken lines).  Maybe we could add this data to the list.
>I volunteer to collect, format, post, if you EMAIL your
>input to me.  Please use your email address instead of your
>name (or nickname, as some use).  That way, people can
>email back to you if they want to.
>

I do not think that detailling the malfunction is going to be useful as we
will spread the stats even further giving no chance to get something
statistically significant.

-- 
  Philip Yzarn de Louraille                 Internet: yzarn@chevron.com
  Research Support Division                 Unix & Open Systems
  Chevron Information & Technology Co.      Tel: (310) 694-9232
  P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446     Fax: (310) 694-7709
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving