HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: My new Saturn in the shop for new transmission
Keywords: Saturn reliability
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 02:04:05 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.011448.11730@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> clee@praha.jpl.nasa.gov (Chang Lee)
writes:
>Two weeks ago, I put down 15K at the dealer for a new SL2.  500 miles and a 
>week later, the car's back at the dealer for a new transmission.  Obviously,
>I'm unhappy about the situation.  I bought the car partly because of claims
>of quality and reliability, but this episode has me deeply worried.  So,
>I'd appreciate feedback from Saturn owners regarding the reliability of their
>car (or should I get a refund and buy a Civic?)

I should slap Mr. Lee for this.

Mr. Lee could spend 15K, and he bought a Saturn?  Buy Saturn if you are pressed
for money, but 15K doesn't sound like Mr. Lee is pressed for money.

My advice, if Mr. Lee doesn't mind buying 100% Japanese (but I personally would
have second thoughts because I'm an American), then buy an Acura Integra.
It's a much better car than the Saturn.

On the other hand if he wants to buy American-ish, then I would suggest
a Honda Civic.  Again, it's a much better car than the Saturn.  Since you
are obviously willing to pay the $1700 worth of pure profit (to the dealer)
for the Saturn, I'm sure that you won't mind paying MSRP for the Civic or
the Integra.

------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
Jinsei no imi wa nan desu ka.                Sister, can you      |   \|  |`
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.           spare a coin?        |    | -+-
                                                                  |   /| / \
Copyright 1992.  Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3                           |
------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
From: hacker@cco.caltech.edu (Jonathan Bruce Hacker)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Mech ABS retrofit (ABS-TRAX)
Date: 23 Nov 1992 04:21:18 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: punisher.caltech.edu

rick@posms.cactus.org (Rick Kirchhof) writes:

>In article <53060095@hpsgm2.sgp.hp.com> leonglaw@hpsgm2.sgp.hp.com (Lawrence LEONG) writes:
>>I've just seen a mechanical ABS retrofit.  Its called "ABS-TRAX" and is
>>supposed to be derived from aircraft systems.  Have you heard of it, and if
>>so, any data-points or anecdotes?
>>
>>The system consists of a small pressurised chamber which fastens (one per 
>>brake circuit) onto the master cylinder output, somewhat like a reserviour.
>>The chamber contains a pressurised Nitrogen chamber and diagphram; when the
>>brake fluid hits a pre-set pressure (supposed to be within 5-10% of lockup),
>>a valve will actuate to relieve the pressure and keep the wheels on the 
>>threshold of skidding (somewhat similar to threshold braking).  Under normal
>>braking, it is supposed to not activate.
>>
>>There is no speed sensor like the electronic versions.  Since this device 
>>works on a principle similar to threshold braking (I think), it appears to
>>be better than electronic ABS, no?
>>

How does this system compensate for variations in tire traction due to
local conditions such as water, ice, snow on the road?  Seems to me it
is only useful for dry conditions, and even then it would be unable to
modulate braking force on a particular wheel that may, say, be on top
of loose sand at the side of a road (for example) and hence have
significantly different traction than the wheels on the other side of
the car.

Save your money.

-- 
Jon Hacker
Caltech, Pasadena CA
hacker@tumbler-ridge.caltech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
From: cka52397@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Slartibartfast)
Subject: Re: How To Drive the RIGHT way!
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 05:24:04 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.002420.4123@memstvx1.memst.edu> ujmli@memstvx1.memst.edu writes:
>In article <Zyg4TB4w164w@cellar.org>, blu@cellar.org (Dan Reed) writes:
>> 
>>                    High Speed driving Tips, by Dan Reed
>>                                  (Humor)
>>   This file will help you be a better driver on the great road spans in
>> the US.  If you follow these simple rules, you will be a safer driver,
>> and other drivers will thank you for it.
>>  
>>  

	How about this for #11?
	

	11)  If a car is merging into your lane from an highway offramp, NEVER
EVER let it in.  If there is no car in the lane to your left, don't be a 
pushover and move over, hell, you pay your taxes, if the car wants to come 
onto the roadway, IT can take the left lane.  Just continue along at 55mph, 
without so much as a glance to your left to check for an open lane.  Hell,
what gives them the right to want to enter YOUR highway...

	And #12?


	12)  When merging onto a highway STOP in the middle of the merge lane.

If I include stuff that's already been mentioned, sorry...


-- 
"The Clergy Dazzle us with Heaven or they Damn us into Hell"  Billy Bragg!!!!!
IIIII  L    L    IIIII NNNNN IIIII   Chintan Amin c-amin1@uiuc.edu DEPT of E.E.
  I    L    L      I   N   N   I   RUSH	YES FLOYD METALLICA PEARLJAM REM PG
IIIII  LLLL LLLL IIIII N   N IIIII   GO TARHEELS  GO CAPITALS GO COWBOYS
From: rane+@cs.cmu.edu (Aaron Hughes)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Rec's on bying used sport coupe
Date: 23 Nov 92 18:32:45 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Well, with the coming of ugly weather and our newspaper strike,
I figured now may be a good time to visit a few car dealerships
and check out a coupla cars (used).  The two that I have
my eye on are are post '88 Honda Preludes and post '89 Nissan
240sx's - preferably the coupe over the hatchback.  Are there
any other cars I should Keep my eyes open for? I'd like to 
spend around 10,000$ ,whoops - should have said, would like to
keep it under 10,000.  Suggestions?

Thanks,

Aaron
-- 
Aaron Hughes        DoD#0482   		The Freedom Junkie	
rane+@pulsar.fac.cs.cmu.edu		Bad cop. No donut.
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: philg@zurich.ai.mit.edu (Philip Greenspun)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Help! Ford service disaster!!!
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:52:24
Organization: M.I.T. Artificial Intelligence Lab.
	<By0vro.FpA@ssesco.com>
Reply-To: philg@martigny.ai.mit.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: zug.ai.mit.edu
In-reply-to: nau@ssesco.com's message of Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:14:12 GMT


In article <By0vro.FpA@ssesco.com> nau@ssesco.com (William Nau) writes:

   Forget form letters.  Even calling them, they refused to release any
   information.  I explained to them that they were required to by state
   law.  They accused me of making that up.

This is a good point.  Federal and (most) State law requires car
companies to disclose known defects to owners of their cars (15 USC
1402 -- 15th volume of the United States Code, page 1402, in any law
library).

Ford apparently does not believe in this law (they've acknowledged 192
problems with Scorpios to the NHTSA, but none to me, an owner of which
they are aware).


--

      -- Philip Greenspun

-------------------------------------------------------------
MIT Department of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
545 Technology Square, Rm 433, Cambridge, MA 02139
(617) 253-8574
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Whining about buying American cars
Date: 17 Nov 92 02:25:35 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <BxqMzH.51M@acsu.buffalo.edu> v064mcqs@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (NEIL GANDLER) writes:
>
> Hold on a minute buddy. You seem to be knocking American cars, making
>them alot worse then they really are. Yes in the late seventies and 
>the Eighties, American cars were mostly shit. But Americans #1, have more
>experience than the japanese in making cars. 2nd, you are forgetting about
>the engineers. I am an electrical engineering student. All japanese cars
>are designed in Japan. 
   
   From that stupid statement, it's pretty obvious you're NOT a
   student of anything remotely related to automotive design.

   Care to bet bucks on how many Japanese cars are designed in the
   US?   

   Even the 240Z was designed elsewhere than Japan....

   Yeesh.  Go burn a cross or some other activity suitable to your
   jingoistic intellect.

>American cars get the same mileage as Japanese cars, there is little difference.
    Care to post some CAFE numbers to back up your mis-information?

>American cars are much improved over the years. And quality these days is
>quite close. And American cars are cheaper and are less expensive to fix.
   American cars are close to quality?

   Cheaper and less expensive to fix?  

   There are some really fine American cars...but none of them is
   particularly cheap to fix. And how often a car NEEDS fixing is a
   factor in service costs.

>      Examples of American accomplishments in the auto industry:
>		1. GM's Saturn division. A complete sucess. Making the
>       Japanese wet their pants.
 
    More like snoring.  There ARE some American cars that have hurt
    the Japanese, but Saturn is below the price range the Japanese
    are moving into for competition.  


>                2. Chrysler minivans are superior to their japanese counterparts

  One correct.  You win $5.00..... 

>                3. The new Cadillac Northstar Engine. Superior that any 
>of the v8's japan can ship out.

    Not familiar with Ford's twin-cammer?   Maybe the Northstar is
    the equal of the Japanese V-8's.  Call us back in 150K miles and
    see if it hangs together that long.  Some of us would-be Caddy
    buyers know someone stupid enough to buy an Eldorado.
    Perpetual maintenance that a Lotus would be proud of.

    BTW, the American V-8's, low tech tho some are, have just about
    ALWAYS beaten the foreign competition for longevity.  You really
    have to try to hurt the typical 5 liter Ford or Chev engine.
From: mjc5@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael J. Cavotta)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Probe in the Snow?
Date: 21 Nov 1992 01:27:44 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: mjc5@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael J. Cavotta)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc5.ins.cwru.edu


	Anyone out there who has had any winter-weather experience with the
93 Probe, could you please share any input as to the car's viability in
inclement conditions.  I'm thinking about buying one, but am concerned
about the stock tires and their all-season ability.


Thanks for the input...
-- 
Michael J. Cavotta

"You either ride the steam-roller, or you stand there whining and die..."
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (John F Nielsen)
Subject: Re: CONSUMER REPORTS
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 04:41:00 GMT

With regards to the Navajho and Explorer, the reliability is identical
in 15 out of the 17 catagories. 

The single catagory where the Explorer was different was probably
enough to knock it down one level. Which also means the Navajho(sp) is
probably borderline average.


In other words, in a sample you should get very similar results.
And this is very similar.

Too bad they dont display the numbers.

john
-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------
John Nielsen   MAGNUS Consultant            ______   ______   __  __	
jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu         /\  __ \ /\  ___\ /\ \/\ \
                                           \ \ \/\ \\ \___  \\ \ \_\ \
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: cka52397@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Slartibartfast)
Subject: Re: MBZ 190E - when did headlights change to aero look?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 05:26:12 GMT

In article <921117.225309.amiller@almaden.ibm.com> amiller@almaden.ibm.com (Alex Miller) writes:
>The 1984 and 1985 Mercedes 190E cars have standard 5 x 7" headlights.
>What year did Mercedes switch to aero headlights?
>
>Alex
>amiller@almaden.ibm.com


	1986, when the US gvt finally came to it's senses...


-- 
"The Clergy Dazzle us with Heaven or they Damn us into Hell"  Billy Bragg!!!!!
IIIII  L    L    IIIII NNNNN IIIII   Chintan Amin c-amin1@uiuc.edu DEPT of E.E.
  I    L    L      I   N   N   I   RUSH	YES FLOYD METALLICA PEARLJAM REM PG
IIIII  LLLL LLLL IIIII N   N IIIII   GO TARHEELS  GO CAPITALS GO COWBOYS 
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: rg9538@ehsn2.cen.uiuc.edu (Ronald E Garnett)
Subject: Re: Gatorback tires
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 21:58:58 GMT

ggg@hpsad.sad.hp.com (Gary Goodlund) writes:


>  I have an '85 Dodge Daytona Turbo that came with Goodyear Eagle GTs which
>also are very good tires just not quite as high a speed rating as the Good-
>year Gatorbacks.  They also seemed a bit expensive to replace so I tried
>the Dunlop Qualifiers instead and have been very pleased with them.  If you
>aren't inclined toward maniacal flailing of the car, these are worth      
>considering.  Their handling is quite good, they aren't especially noisey, 
>and the price is around $100 each depending upon where you shop. 

From the postings and E-Mail I got, snow tires are a must for a Gatorbaxk
tire owner!  If I do get snow tires, then the gators will last me quite
a while longer since they since they will be off for a few months.

>  I think they have about 42K miles on them and they're about due for 
>replacement now--but then again the car is for sale so why bother?  Do you
>know anyone in the North Bay Area (San Francisco) that needs a fun car-cheap?!
>I just bought another car and three is one too many so the Dodge goes...



I don't know too many people in that area, and the one that I do know can't
afford the insurance for a fun car.  Three cars, you probably pay enough in
insurance each year to buy another car!


Ron Garnett

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: rrusk@ssd.csd.harris.com (Bob Rusk)
Subject: Re: Experiences with Pickups
Reply-To: rrusk@ssd.csd.harris.com
Organization: Harris Computer Systems Division
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 19:54:22 GMT
	<1992Nov18.173731.18010@spdc.ti.com>

On Wed, 18 Nov 1992 17:37:31 GMT, serafin@epcot.spdc.ti.com (Mike Serafin) wrote:
>In article <1992Nov17.210851.7324@medtron.medtronic.com> barham@medtronic.COM writes:
>>I am planning to buy a used full-size pickup.  I am thinking about going with
>>a diesel engine.  I would like to here about good and bad experiences with
>>full-size pickups, gas and diesel.
>>

>I had a 1983 full size Blazer diesel.  Not quite a pick-up but close.  I was
>satisfied with the Detroit Diesel that GM is using in their trucks.

I think that you're stretching a bit to call the GM 6.2L diesel a "Detroit
Diesel", but I may be wrong.  It doesn't have much in common with any
Detroit I've ever seen.

>Performance was close to the 350 gas engine and fuel mileage was much better.
>In town I generally averaged 19 mpg, while on the road it was about 23 mpg.
>Big problem was the new overdrive tranny that they used in '83.  The truck ate
>3 of them between Dec 85 and Jan 87, when I sold it.  I think if I were buying
>another diesel I'd go with either the Dodge or the Ford.  

I've heard this a lot.  I've worked some on both the Chevy and the
Ford and must agree that the Ford diesel is superior to the Chevy
diesel.  In particular, the GM engine seems to have many more
electrical problems.  And I know of several that needed major internal
work in the first 70K miles.  The Dodge's Cummins engine is supposed
to be better yet.  As a non-lover of 'Twin I Beam', that would be my
choice.

>If you do buy a
>diesel, make sure that it has a water seperator installed.  The fuel injection
>systems die a rather nasty death once they ingest enough water. 

Ditto.

--
--
 Bob Rusk
 rrusk@ssd.csd.harris.com
 My thoughts, probably not Harris'.

Xref: sparky rec.autos:27660 rec.autos.tech:15735
From: rtoth@athos.rutgers.edu (Robert Toth)
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech
Subject: I need your feedback
Date: 23 Nov 92 15:28:33 GMT
Followup-To: rec.autos
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.


My girlfried is looking to buy a used 86-89 Couger/T-Bird with V6.
Most of the ones that I have seen all have about 55k-65k miles.  I was
wondering what peoples impressions are of these cars. Good/Bad/What to
look for/Major problems to occur soon/etc/etc.

I am pretty good with mechanics and stuff so minor things like
exhaust/shocks/tune ups/brakes no problem.

Mail all response directly to me and I would appreciate quick response
as we are going out this week to start to look at them.


Thanks


...rob
-- 



**************************************************************************
*Robert Toth					rtoth@cs.rutgers.edu     *
*Telecommunications Technician						 *
*LCSR Computing Fac.			   !rutgers!cs.rutgers.edu!rtoth *
*CoRE Bldg Busch Campus							 *
*P.O. Box 879								 *
*Piscataway, N.J. 08855							 *
**************************************************************************
From: awds_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Clarkkent)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Ford lemons
Date: 20 Nov 92 04:49:23 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

In <1992Nov19.222623.3290@sura.net> nunn@sura.net (Deborah Nunn) writes:

>I, too, used to drive a Ford.  It gives me the greatest pleasure in the
>world to say, when I hear "Have you driven a Ford lately"  **NO!  Hah!
>Got a Saturn instead!"

>Deborah Nunn
>nunn@sura.net

I test drove a Saturn last spring when shopping for my car-
I bought a used Ford instead of the Saturn.  No offense,
I think Saturn makes little better quality cars than the
rest of GM divisions, what makes the company so special
is the way they treat customers.  Maybe they'll set
an example for the rest of Big Three?
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: marshall@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca (Jim Marshall - DCS)
Subject: Re: Cruise Control w/ Manual Transmission
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 19:18:20 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.180052.25805@unocal.com>, stsshol@st.unocal.COM (Herb Lam) writes:
> 
> I have a '91 Mazda 626 with manual transmission along with cruise
> control.  I have only tried the cruise control to see how it operates
> but don't use it because I usually drive in fairly heavy traffic.
> 
> Out of curiosity, what happens if the cruise control is on and I
> change gears?  Does it do any harm to the engine or the cruise control?
> 


As soon as you depress your clutch the cruise control cuts off.

**************************************************************************

Jim Marshall

Dept.of Computing Services
University of Waterloo
Waterloo, Ontario
Canada

**************************************************************************
From: basiji@stein.u.washington.edu (David Basiji)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: $10K Sport Sedan
Date: 22 Nov 92 02:43:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Nov22.024345.2449
Organization: University of Washington

"Andreas G. Yankopolus" <ay0i+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>I have about $10,000 to spend and am looking for a sport sedan (Jetta
>GLI, Protege', etc..).  Any suggestions?
>Thanks.
>Andreas Yankopolus
>Carnegie-Mellon University
>Junior, Electrical Engineering
^^^^^^^^^

A junior with $10K, huh?  Well, life just ain't fair.
;o)
I had a 1980 preproduction prototype of the Jetta with the engine they
eventually put in the GTI.  It had good sporty tires and Bilstein shocks
at all four corners.  Nothing in its price range could touch it for
handling and quickness (quickness != speed).  Of course, the reliability
left a little to be desired, but once I put about $500 into the electrical
system, all was well.  

VW engines really purr but are truly a pain in the ass to work on.  I'd say
that if you plan on getting rid of the car after 5 years or so, the VW is
a good way to go.  After 5 years, you need to start working on the engine
and tranny (clutch) and it's just not worth it.

David Basiji
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: cyg1431@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (I'm done)
Subject: Honda Accord LX price
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:00:18 GMT

I'm in the market for the above mentioned car, and would like 
to know what people paid for it in the Bay area.  1993 model.
if you have recently bought one, please send me email, and i'll
tell you later how much the crooks took me for.
Thanks!
Chris
From: crpresto@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Charlie Preston)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Uninsured Motorist Insurance
Date: 20 Nov 92 22:14:50 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Illinois State University

In article <1992Nov20.193751.25894@b30.ingr.com> satish@kumar.b30.ingr.com (Satish Ramaswamy) writes:
>
>Maybe this is a dumb question... My employer provides me the medical
>coverage. If the Uninsured Motorist coverage  covers only the medical
>expenses I guess I dont have to take it at all ...
>
>My insurance agent told  me that if the other person doesnt
>have insurance the uninsured motorist coverage pays for the
>damage to my car if I meet with an accident !!!!!!!!!
>
>Is it true ? Am I paying for something that I dont need at all ?
>
The example I gave examined only the medical portion of uninsured/underinsured
motorists coverage.  Property damage is also part of liability and uninsured/
underinsured coverage.  It works in the same way.
-- 
Chas                         DoD #7769

"Oh, how can you be in two places at once when you're not anywhere at all?"
                                               - Firesign Theatre
Xref: sparky rec.autos:27397 rec.autos.driving:6727
From: jcao@rnd.GBA.NYU.EDU (Jingbin Cao ~{2\>01r~})
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: How To Drive the RIGHT way!
Date: 20 Nov 92 03:04:42 GMT
Followup-To: rec.autos
Organization: NYU Stern School of Business

When you are approaching a car which is waiting for you at a stop
sign, bark. Make it certain you cannot tolorate the slightest chance
for an accident.

If this has been mentioned, my apologies. Btw, can someone make a list
summarizing the net wisdom on right-way driving? Thanks.

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: alavigne@bmerh930.bnr.ca (Andrew Lavigne)
Subject: Re: Fast Japanese Sports Cars
Organization: Bell Northern Research
	<1992Nov23.182017.16252@borland.com>
Distribution: rec
Date: 23 Nov 92 15:51:57


(Slartibartfast) writes:
>etc.... I'd still rather get a NSX, but I wouldn't mind waiting for
>the VTEC version out next year! :-)

Already is VTEC.

Andrew
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech
From: champlin@pa.dec.com (Virgil Champlin)
Subject: Re: extended warranty & security system
Organization: DEC Network Systems Laboratory
	<1992Nov19.192845.12008@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>
Distribution: usa
Date: 20 Nov 92 17:42:33


>(3) Should I buy sunscreen glass or not? And How wise is it to
>    get winows sunscreened later on if needed to do it? My wife
>    wants clear glass now.     

I have found the sunscreened glass to be marvelous.  It really does make
a car much cooler, protects the interior fabric, and makes long trips in
the daylight much more relaxing.  -virgil
--
    Virgil Champlin			champlin@pa.dec.com
					Palo Alto, CA
	I like satire.  I'm just not very good at it.
Newsgroups: rec.autos