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Date:         Mon, 28 Sep 1992 10:01:25 -0400
Reply-To:     ewanco@mlo.dec.com
From:         Eric James Ewanco <eje@IRENAEUS.MLO.DEC.COM>
Subject:      Re: That P' word again

Excerpts from christia: 28-Sep-92 Re: That P' word again Jesse
Carnes@LSUVM.BITNE (915)

> 2 Cor.2 says that only the Spiritual man can receive the things of God,
> because they are spiritually discerned.  The unregenerate man cannot
> receive things without the presence of the Holy Spirit and the text
> makes that clear deliniation ... the man WITH the Spirit and the man
> WITHOUT. Such is a regenerate versus unregenerate man.

I think you mean 1 Cor 2:14.  The verse does not say that the
unregenerate man cannot RECEIVE "things" while unregenerate -- it says
"The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from
the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot
understand them."  This is in the middle of a discourse on how the
message of the Gospel is foolishness to man.  Paul is saying that a man
"without the Spirit" rejects the Gospel, because it is foolishness to
him.  He is not making a theological statement about the inability of
the unregenerate man to turn toward God and receive grace.  I should
also point out that the text does not refer to unregenerate and
regenerate, but the man "without the Spirit of God."  For God can send
His Spirit to even the unregenerate, enabling them to  believe the
foolishness of the Cross.  Without God's Spirit, we can do nothing, and
we cannot believe.  But with the Spirit of God, even before
regeneration, we can receive grace and believe.

> So, putting the horse in FRONT of the cart, we must be MADE alive by the
> Lord before we can choose to be converted ... that is have a change of
> mind
> toward. The desire to change is subsequent to God making a person alive
> and that is subsequent to hearing or reading then understanding then
> believing the Gospel.

This is not what this verse says, and not what Scripture teaches, IMO.
It is not necessary to be regenerated -- made fully alive -- before we
are able to turn towards God at all and have a change of mind, it takes
only the grace of God.  God can enable us to believe before he
regenerates us.  True, our eyes are not fully opened and we do not have
full life and Spirit before regeneration, but I do not believe Scripture
requires regeneration before belief.

The Predestination argument appears to me to be too binary; either you
are entirely rejected by God and receive no grace whatsoever, or you are
regenerate, saved, and have the full grace of God.  I don't think
Scripture suggests this.  I think that an unregenerate man receives
grace from God enabling him to believe, without regenerating him.  God
desires all men to be saved, and he gives each of them in His time the
grace that enables them to turn around and believe.  Belief, then, is
certainly dependent on God's grace, and man is unable to believe on his
own.  But belief does not require regeneration first; regeneration is
the result of our responding to the grace of God and believing.

Eric
ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU