From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Prejudice vs Preference
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 22:35:49 GMT


In article <vanyel.715280262@camelot>
vanyel@camelot.bradley.edu (Alan Williams) writes:

I've started a new thread here, arising from on-going debate
with Alan.  I'm including some earlier remarks, but basically
I'm making a fresh start.

I take as my starting text something Alan said in an ealier
posting, <vanyel.715024092@camelot>:

>Personally, I don't like "nelly" or "macho" behavior.  My
>*reason* is because the kind of people I've encountered who
>utilize these behaviors have struck me as vain, superficial,
>and out to attract as much attention as possible.

I'll simplify this remark to:

>I don't like nelly people because all the ones I've met are
>vain.

(His other quotes below are from <vanyel.715280262@camelot>.)

A lot turns on whether this is a class statement or an
instance.

I claim it is a class statement.  It says: nelly people are
vain.

It's no different from "I don't like Blacks because they are
lazy" or "I don't like Jews because they're pushy" or "I
don't like girls [sic] because they're silly."

Just as those hypothetical remarks are, respectively,
racist, anti-Semitic, and sexist, the preceding remark is
homophobic.

Alan maintains it isn't prejudice, but rather just personal
preference.  But that's a canard, leading away from the
truth.  

A corresponding general statement of preference would be: "I
don't like vain, lazy, pushy, or silly people, no matter
what their sexuality, race, religion, or gender."  A specific
instance would be: "I don't like Joe, because he's vain."

>You seem bent on proving that my personal dislikes are
>little more than prejudice.  I consider that an attempt to
>force me to think like you.

I'm sure that's backwards.  You think I'm trying to force
you, *hence* you read me as bent on proving your personal
dislikes are prejudices.

I don't care about your preferences one bit.  They're yours,
enjoy them in good health.  I'm not trying to force you (how
could I?).  Hence, what you're doing is avoiding the issues.

>I've seen nothing here to convince me that you aren't simply
>calling "prejudice" a dislike of mine with which you don't
>agree.

I don't doubt you're not convinced.  I believe you're so
committed to not being convinced that you'll go to very
considerable lengths to show that there's a difference
between *your* saying "I don't like nelly people because
they're vain" and some bozo who says "women are silly."
Why not spare yourself and others, because those *are*
both prejudices.

My dislike of prejudice has nothing at all to do with you,
except as you instance it; I object to it even more
vehemently when I find it in myself (and I do, because I'm
actively looking for it, not trying to avoid seeing it
there.).  I dislike it wherever I find it.

Far from trying to *force* you to do anything (the prejudice
is already proved, nothing you can do about that now except
work to get rid of it), I'm trying to show you something
useful, something you can do about it.  Use it or not, as
you like.

p.s.  Alan, please set your Distribution: to world; people
      overseas are writing me they're missing your side of
      the discussion.

<> We are healed of suffering only by experiencing it to the full.
<> -- Marcel Proust
-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
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