From: rjung@girtab.usc.edu (Robert A. Jung)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.tiny-toon
Subject: Re: a.t.tv.tiny-toon flame war???
Date: 13 Apr 1992 20:29:05 -0700
Organization: Southern California Lynx Enthusiasts
NNTP-Posting-Host: girtab.usc.edu

In article <a9wj!0m@lynx.unm.edu> synth@deepthought.unm.edu (Synth F. Oberheim) writes:
>This is one of the friendlies and closest-knit newgroups on Usenet (rather
>bizarre phenomenon, really. :-)  Perhaps he was using the word "flame-war"
>wrongly, and instead referring to how this group as a whole seems to be
>very anti-Disney.  This would dovetail with a reference made recently on
>rec.arts.animation about how a.t.t-t doesn't give other cartoons the time
>of day, particularly Disney cartoons.  Personally I give other works much
>credit (REN & STIMPY! REN & STIMPY!) but this IS a Tiny Toons newsgroup,
>after all, and discussions of other animation are not generally encouraged.
>Perhaps people misinterpret this as bashing?

  I really can't see why, myself. I mean, people don't talk about IBM PCs on
the comp.sys.mac.* groups, for example. I myself get a big kick out of THE
SIMPSONS (lots of intelligent social satire, IMO), but bringing that stuff
here would be a major annoyance to the other members of this group. As for
REN & STIMPY, I have to get around to seeing it sometime, though from what
I've heard, I think it may be a little too far off the deep end for my own
preferences.

>As for Disney, outsiders may not realize that the show itself like to stab
>at Disney in jest, and us toonsters are just following suit -- it's not meant
>to be taken quite so seriously.

  Didn't some of the earlier Warner Bros. Looney Tunes work also made fun of
Disney? If so, we're just carrying on tradition here...  B-)

>Still, there are some toonsters around here
>who do vocally spit on anything and everything Disney, so his argument might
>have some foundation ...

  Why, Synth, I do believe you're talking about littl' ol' me.  B-)

#define OPINION 1

  Other postings from me to the contrary, I am not a rabid, mouth-foaming
Disney basher. I'll be the first to admit that some of the best animation ever
created was from Disney, for instance. I do have gripes, though, with two
things.

  First pet peeve is the fact that all of Disney's stories are oh-so-neatly
packaged and sugary sweet. It's all personal preference, naturally, but I just
don't have a taste for that kind of storytelling. Similarly, Disney could
never do HOW I SPENT MY VACATION -- all of the jokes in Plucky's road trip,
the chainsaw maniac, Fowlmouth's date, all that stuff is not "prim and proper"
for Disney: it's just not their style.

  Second (and biggest) pet peeve is the attitude many folks have that the Walt
Disney Company is not held to the same standards of criticism that other
studios and animators are held to. Disney Co. under Walt was a sincere, happy
place -- a little too perfect for my taste, but Uncle Walt just told his
stories and let people who were interested go for them. In contrast, Disney
Co. in the '90s (especially under Mike Eisner) is 100% geared torwards making
mucho bucks, and cashing in on that innocent-and-friendly image that Walt
built up. Did you know, for instance, that any new ideas dreamed up by a
Disney employee are automatically property of the Walt Disney Co.? It's true
-- some of the most anti-Disney stuff I ever heard came from former employees.
You really believe that the upcoming "Fantasiatastic" attraction opening this
summer is _not_ a direct tie-in to the overhyped release of FANTASIA on video?
If Universal or Paramount were doing similar stuff, most consumer groups would
jump on them for crass commercialization -- but since this is Disney, "well,
that's _different_..."

  This is all IMO, of course, and does not necessarily reflect the attitude of
the rest of alt.tv.tiny-toon. Heck, I share an office with a very big Disney
fan (and a good friend of mine), and we don't go jumping down each other's
throats every morning... 

#define OPINION 0

>Personally I have no problem with this -- everyone
>is entitled to their opinion!

  Right on! (or is that "Get liberal"?)

                                                --R.J.
                                                B-)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      Plucky: "Right and wrong have no place here -- This is Hollywood."
~~~~~~~~~~~ These opinions are all mine, but you're welcome to 'em. ~~~~~~~~~~
Stay Tiny Tooned!                     Send assorted silliness to rjung@usc.edu