HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: judson@watserv.ucr.edu (Mike Judson)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Disc/Disk (was Re: Presently)
Date: 26 Jan 93 02:24:24 GMT
Reply-To: judson@watserv.ucr.edu

In article <3066@eram.esi.COM.AU> dave@eram.esi.COM.AU (Dave Horsfall) writes:
> In article <1993Jan18.043428.13684@news.columbia.edu>,
>     gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener) writes:
> 
> | The specification calls them compact discs, the audio industry calls them
> | compact discs, and the New York Times calls them compact disks, and I don't
> | know why, but it annoys everyone in the audio industry.

I think the New York Times is in error.  A Compact Disc (though I can't
cite it) is (I think) a patented name, whereas compact disk is not.
Whoever designed the compact disc wanted it to be distinguished from
a regular disk and hence spelled it with a "c."

--
You know what would make a good story?  Something about a clown 
who makes people happy, but inside he's real sad.  Also, he has 
severe diarrhea.

                         Jack Handy

judson@watserv.ucr.edu
From: au500@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Linda Zinn)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Learning the ropes of "Ins and Outs"
Date: 23 Jan 1993 18:39:03 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: au500@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Linda Zinn)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc4.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, ca831@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Steven John Peterson) says:

>
>Please, help!!!!!!!
>
>I had a disagreement with a fellow co-worker over how the
>phrase "ins and outs" should appear on a photo caption.
>
>My preferred choice was "in's and out's," while he 
>argued that since the words were neither possesive nor
>contractions the phrase should read "ins and outs."
>
>I couldn't argue with his logic, but to me, the words
>ins and outs look very strange.  Which is correct and
>why?  (*sigh* I think I already know the answer....)

Sorry, but your coworker was correct. "Ins" and "outs"
are simply plurals of "in" and "out," so there's no 
need for an apostrophe.

We often think a certain punctuation, spelling, etc., is 
correct because a) we have habitually punctuated or spelled 
something incorrectly, b) we have often seen (or heard) 
an incorrect usage, or c) because someone changed the doggone
rules after we finished school (this one's a bear, but it seems to 
provide plenty of topics for discussion on this newsgroup).

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
* Linda Zinn                    When you point a finger at someone,    *
* au500@cleveland.freenet.edu   you're pointing three back at yourself *
* ******Wanted: Books by E.D.E.N. Southworth; cattail dinnerware****** *
Newsgroups: alt.tasteless.jokes,alt.usage.english
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: The word FUCK
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1993 22:38:37 GMT

In article <C16A6L.HAu@ecf.toronto.edu> pelton@ecf.toronto.edu (PELTON MATTHEW ALAN) writes:
>  More folk etymology.  Somebody once told me that, in Old English,
>"fuck" meant to poke a hole in the ground for the purpose of planting
>seeds, using a long stick.  The jump is obvious...
>

According to AHD3, it's not found in Old English.  The first written 
instance (in code, no less!) is in a poem called "Flen flyys".  There,
it means "fuck."  

It has cognates in other Germanic languages; in those, it means "fuck,"
too.

Roger
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Have to
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1993 16:40:59 GMT

In article <1993Jan20.135433.8397@pixel.kodak.com> john@liebnitz.ssd.kodak.com (John Hall) writes:
>Do you pronounce the word "have" differently in the following
>statements?

>	I have two apples.

>	I have to leave.

>Here in western New York I hear the first as "hav", but the second as
>"haf".

>Has anyone else observed this?  Can you explain it?

Sure.  The key is the vowel sound in "two/to."  There's hardly ever a 
stress on the infinitive "to," so it winds up being more or less a
schwa sound.  (That is, it almost disappears/gets swallowed.)  "Two"
in the first sentence is stressed (why else mention the number; if the
number isn't important, you say "I have apples."  If you split them
with a knife, you say, "I halve apples," with yet another pronunciation,
but that's getting out of our range.); that gives one the 
necessary time to voice the 'v'.

Or something like that.

Roger
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: gtoal@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal)
Subject: Re: Hi Fi etc
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 17:53:22 +0000

	>Uh?  To me finance is /fei-nans/, and always has been.  My dictionary
	>agrees with me.  Or is this a bizarre joke?

	Now I'm getting confused.

	My dictionary lists the following pronunciations for "finance":
	/f@ 'n&n(t)s/, /'faI n&n(t)s/, and /faI 'n&n(t)s/.  The most common
	American pronunciation (which I use) is the second, generally without
	the /t/.  I was under the impression that the British tend to use the
	first.  /fei nans/ (or, more probably, /feI n&ns/) would have the
	first syllable rhyme with "May" and "They".

	Is this really what you meant, and (if so) where is it common?

oops.  Teach me to ask for the Ascii-IPA chart then not read it properly.
I meant to say /faI-nans/ - to rhyme with cry or try... as opposed to
the pronunciation I'm used to which rhymes with Finnan Haddie :-)

G
Newsgroups: alt.tasteless.jokes,alt.usage.english
From: dreese@willamette.edu (Daniel L. Reese)
Subject: Re: The word FUCK
Organization: Willamette University, Salem OR
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 02:20:31 GMT

>	I've heard from an artsie friend that the original inhabitants of Britain 
>(the Angles and Saxons) used the word FUCK as a normal part of their language. When the 
>Normans came over and conquered, English went underground and was spoken only in the fields, 
>with French in the castles and palaces.  therefore, Fuck became LOW class. 

By the way, the Angles, Saxons, and Jutes, invaded Britain and drove at
the Celts. Yes, that means that the Angles, et al. were not the original
inhabitants.  And the Celts drove out the Pics (I think.) or some other
neolithic tribe.

					-Dan

Just say "Woa."
	-Randy of the Redwoods
From: hayesstw@risc1.unisa.ac.za (Steve Hayes)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: toward or towards
Date: 28 Jan 93 05:46:28 GMT
Organization: University of South Africa
NNTP-Posting-Host: pchayest.unisa.ac.za

In article <106864@netnews.upenn.edu> crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford) writes:

>>You use "toward" when you are west of the Atlantic and east of the Pacific, 
>>and "towards" when you're anywhere else.
>
>*BUZZZ*.  Wrong.  Lots of folks in "anywhere else" use "toward."  I used
>to work for a city magazine that routinely lopped off that pesky "s."

I assume you mean "city" as in "the City", where distant relatives are 
"something in the City" ...

============================================================
Steve Hayes, Department of Missiology & Editorial Department
Univ. of South Africa, P.O. Box 392, Pretoria, 0001 South Africa
Internet: hayesstw@risc1.unisa.ac.za
          steve.hayes@p5.f22.n7101.z5.fidonet.org
          stephen.hayes@f20.n7101.z5.fidonet.org
From: pdc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Paul Crowley)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Words that are Opposites...
Date: 27 Jan 93 18:35:41 GMT
Reply-To: pdc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Paul Crowley)
Organization: Edinburgh University

Quoting scotty@netcom.com (J Scott Peter) in article <1993Jan26.101708.11988@netcom.com>:
>Also, the phrase `in general' means both `always' (particularly in
>mathematical texts) and `not always'.

Actually, a precise definition of what "in general" means in
mathematical texts would be much appreciated by me, since I often find
myself using context and severe subtlety to extract the meaning.  It
doesn't seem to mean always, it seems you're allowed a few exceptions.
"This is in general impossible" means that it's impossible for most
problem instances.

I think.
  __                                  _____
\/ o\ Paul Crowley   pdc@dcs.ed.ac.uk \\ //
/\__/ Trust me. I know what I'm doing. \X/
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: emcoop@bnr.ca (hume smith)
Subject: Re: Canadian English
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Ottawa, Canada
	<hayesstw.206.727443527@risc1.unisa.ac.za> <C14CLD.MwG@ecf.toronto.edu>
	<1993Jan21.114734.1@wombat.newcastle.edu.au>
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 17:41:16 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.114734.1@wombat.newcastle.edu.au> eepjm@wombat.newcastle.edu.au (Peter Moylan) writes:

   >   P.S.  Canadians think in Centrigrade.  I have to do a mental conversion
   > every time I hear a Farenheit temperature.

   Interesting ... Australians think in Celsius.  For some reason we
   tend to think of "Centigrade" as an old-fashioned term.

that's probably because centigrade is incorrect by SI.  the temperature
unit is Celsius, capitalised.  the closest centigrade gets to
recognition is as 1/100th of a German grade, an angle measure, 400 grades per
full turn.  they're that funny third unit on your calculator, after
degrees and radians.

so australians are the only ones thinking correctly :-).

speaking as a Canadian, i hover between thinking in Celsius (not centigrade!)
and Fahrenheit, probably meaning i'm just not quite young enough to have been
fully converted.

   As for other units: we use a mixture of metric and Imperial units.
   It would not be unusual to hear something like "Turn left three
   kilometres ahead, and then it's a few miles down the side road."
   Or "He's not quite six foot tall; I'd say about 175 cm."  I think
   we tend to use metric for exact figures, and the older units
   for hand-waving rough approximations. 

agreed.  i find the old units roll off the toungue better than the new, making them
appropriate for the rough stuff and turns of phrase.  it's smoother, to me, to
say "oh, but that's miles away, too far for me" rather than use kilometres.
--
Hume Smith                                Honour sick and davey cris-cross
hume.smith@acadiau.ca                     McTruloff sentimie
emcoop@bnr.ca                             A parsnip inner pair threes.
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: hypes@boi.hp.com (Gary Hypes)
Subject: Re: Is it proper to use CONTRACTIONS in letters,resumes,etc.? 
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 21:20:40 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard / Boise, Idaho
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]

Call me a traditionalist, but no, contractions aren't permissible in
formal technical communications.

- Gary Hypes -
From: au500@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Linda Zinn)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Learning the ropes of "Ins and Outs"
Date: 25 Jan 1993 21:21:44 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: au500@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Linda Zinn)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, baron@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Dennis Baron) says:

lz:
>>Sorry, but your coworker was correct. "Ins" and "outs"
>>are simply plurals of "in" and "out," so there's no 
>>need for an apostrophe.

db:
>So what do you do with do's and don'ts

I'd do just what you have done. Two of three dictionaries I checked give
"do's" as the preferred plural over "dos." The third only lists "do's."
I wonder whether that's because the Spanish _dos_ is so familiar to English
speakers or because "do's" simply looks better beside "don'ts."
-- 
________________________________________________________________________
* Linda Zinn                    When you point a finger at someone,    *
* au500@cleveland.freenet.edu   you're pointing three back at yourself *
* ******Wanted: Books by E.D.E.N. Southworth; cattail dinnerware****** *
From: crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: toward or towards
Date: 27 Jan 93 18:46:37 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <hayesstw.233.728150319@risc1.unisa.ac.za> hayesstw@risc1.unisa.ac.za (Steve Hayes) writes:

>>When do you use toward and towards?

>You use "toward" when you are west of the Atlantic and east of the Pacific, 
>and "towards" when you're anywhere else.

*BUZZZ*.  Wrong.  Lots of folks in "anywhere else" use "toward."  I used
to work for a city magazine that routinely lopped off that pesky "s."



-- 
I can identify with steelworkers.  I can identify with workers that have
had a difficult time.      -- Former Vice-President Danforth Quayle
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lauren Crawford  //  crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: davisre@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Robert Davis)
Subject: Re: Anyways
Keywords: Lemurs
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 19:40:45 GMT

In article <1993Jan20.004246.19552@Cadence.COM> vince@gda.cadence.com (Vince Gibboni) writes:
>
>    [...] Anyway, just to see what they had to say (and hoping to see
>    some really nasty comments), I looked up "anyways" in
>    Merriams-Webster's, and was surprised to find it labelled
>    "chiefly dial".

	AHD2 reports "Nonstandard."


Rob
-- 
| Robert Davis                                    davis@sonata.cc.purdue.edu
| "Look up, Hannah.  Look up."                            NeXT Mail accepted
--
From: prh@essence.demon.co.uk ("Peter R. Humphrey")
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Plurals
Date: 27 Jan 93 23:01:15 GMT
Reply-To: prh@essence.demon.co.uk
Distribution: alt
Organization: Organization?  What organization?
X-Mailer: cppnews $Revision: 1.30 $

In article <C1IKCv.KIq@newcastle.ac.uk> G.M.Suddes@newcastle.ac.uk (Gareth Suddes) writes:

> Something I noticed the other day.
> Why is it we often refer to 'nothing' as a plural?

Because it isn't singular.  Only one thing can be singular, if you see 
what I mean...

-- 
Rgds

Peter Humphrey  |  prh@essence.demon.co.uk         | Voice 0932-343158
Woking, UK.     |  unionjack@cix.compulink.co.uk   | Data  0932-353948
From: briand@tekig5.pen.tek.com (Brian D Diehm)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Presently
Date: 18 Jan 93 18:24:40 GMT
Reply-To: briand@tekig5.PEN.TEK.COM
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

In article <C0xvJy.v6@demon.co.uk> gtoal@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal) writes:
>In article <8292@tekig7.PEN.TEK.COM> briand@tekig5.PEN.TEK.COM writes:
>:I thought Britishers used presently in the ironic sense, as in "I'll be with
>:you presently" means "I'll be with you eventually, but not in your present
>:lifetime."
>
>You're doing it *again*!  You ascribe to us far too much dry humour than
>is necessary to explain the differences.  The words have simply diverged.

Sorry. Being American, I can't help but exaggerate.

My excuse was that I had just come from reading alt.fan.dave_barry, and so
it was natural to carry any concept to excess.

Mea culpa, mea culpa. Oh, woe is me!

--
Brian Diehm
Tektronix, Inc.                (503) 627-3437         briand@tekig5.PEN.TEK.COM
P.O. Box 500, M/S 19-286
Beaverton, OR   97077
From: dave@eram.esi.COM.AU (Dave Horsfall)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Canadian English
Date: 27 Jan 93 01:46:03 GMT
Organization: Pacific ESI, Sydney, AUSTRALIA
X-Disclaimer: "Me, speak for us?"
X-Witty-Saying: "Mobius strip - see other side for instructions"

| >>>>"I'm not too fussy about hamburgers,"
| >>>"I'm not too *picky* about hamburgers.
| >>"I'm not too *finicky* about
| >"I'm not too *crazy* about burgers."

Isn't it easier to say "I don't like hamburgers." ?  :-)

-- 
Dave Horsfall (VK2KFU)         VK2KFU @ VK2RWI.NSW.AUS.OC
dave@esi.COM.AU                ...munnari!esi.COM.AU!dave
From: benha@castle.ed.ac.uk (Ben Hambidge)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: 3 guesses
Date: 25 Jan 93 11:48:21 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University


Does anyone know the origin of 'three' in the phrase 'I'll give
you three guesses'?

Ben.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Hambidge    |                       |Bread is the staff of life; Toast is
4 Merchiston Ave| benha@castle.ed.ac.uk |a decadent capitalist luxury.
EDINBURGH       |-----------------------|------------------------------------ 
EH10 4NX        |Tel: +44 31 447 4047   |Smile they said, life could be worse.
U.K.            |                       |So I did, and it was.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rcosby@bcm.tmc.edu (Randy C. Cosby)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Anyways
Date: 22 Jan 1993 20:33:26 GMT
Organization: Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Tx
NNTP-Posting-Host: bcm.tmc.edu
Summary: Re: anyways
Keywords: Lemurs

In article <1993Jan20.004246.19552@Cadence.COM>, vince@gda.cadence.com (Vince Gibboni) writes:
>         
>         For years I've (secretly) interpreted the use of the word "anyways"
>     by anyone over the age of about five as a sure sign that they were 
>     either the victim of severe head injury or - to be kind - just not all 
>     that bright.  (I would have put it in same the class as, say, "p'sghetti"). 
>     Recently, however, I seem to hear this word being used quite a bit by 
>     people whose brains' seem to be otherwise damage-free (even by those who
>     generally take some care to use language correctly). I've even run 

Vince,

First of all, do you really judge people by the way they speak?  This
is close to true prejudice.  I cannot believe that a person posting to
this newsgroup would not consider that a person is subjected to the
pronunciations of the morons teaching him/her, and then allow them to
prove themselves!....

Sorry, just had to flame a little. I am from Texas, and even thought I
have had voice and diction training, I still retain the accent, and 
can only rid myself of it on stage.

My ex-wife and her family all used "anyways".  She is definitely moronic
but I feel that the usage stems from her parents upbringing in Brooklyn.
I could be wrong, I married her didn't I?

Coz
From: mckeonj@ul.ie
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Unbalanced pairs?
Date: 21 Jan 93 09:45:28 GMT
Organization: University of Limerick, Ireland

In article <16B579C97.ALI00BAW@UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU>, ALI00BAW@UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU writes:
>>        WORD                   NOT A WORD
>> -----------------------------------------------------
>>        alms                   alm
>>        ides                   ide
>>        inept                  ept
>>        inert                  ert
>>        inoculate              oculate
>>        mathematics            mathematic
>>        nonplussed             plussed
>>        rebuttal               buttal
>>        refrain                frain
>>        regurgitate            gurgitate
>>        reimburse              imburse
>>        ruthless               ruth
> The opposets may be RARE, but they are THERE.  E.G.:
>  
> "Ept" is a variant of "apt."
>  
> "Ruth" means hesitation or scruple.
>  
> "Bursa" in Latin means "pocket, bag, pouch, or purse"; to "imburse"
> someone means "to give money for a specific purpose."  E.g. if I
> In Greek, if I remember correctly "mathetemai" means "I learn" or "I am
> taught."  Mathematics originally meant ALL formal study.
My favourites are:
couth, kempt, and gainly
I wish I were!
-- 
"Ich am of Irlonde" (medieval fragment used by Yeats)
-------------------------------------------------------------------
John McKeon, Material Science Dept. University of Limerick, Ireland
From: ssims@mala.bc.ca
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: <None>
Date: 24 Jan 93 21:56:32 -0700
Organization: Malaspina College

I travelled around India a few years ago and was delighted with the English
usage demonstrated there. A standard greeting was: "Hello.What is your good
name. You are coming from?" They were the most literate people I ever met, in a
Victorian sense.
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center
Date: Thursday, 21 Jan 1993 14:46:43 EST
From: <AAYCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: novice search for novel

I'm looking for a group that discusses novels from the 18th, 19th, and
20th centuries. Specifically, I'd like to discuss the work of Conrad.

Can anyone help?
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: gtoal@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal)
Subject: Re: Back from the UK
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 11:07:22 +0000

:In article <C184s6.G6J@demon.co.uk> gtoal@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal) writes:
:>In article <1993Jan21.170629.31421@watson.ibm.com> yozzo@watson.ibm.com (Ralph Yozzo) writes:
:>:(or the British "How do you do?") 
:>
:>I trust our American readers are aware that the correct response to 'how do
:>you do.' is another 'how do you you do.'  It's not a question, and anyone
:>who answers 'very well thank you' is immediately marked as beyond the pale.
:>
:>G

:If, indeed, it is not a question, then would it not be simpler to merely
:say "hello"?
:(Forgive me, if "hello" and "hi" are uniquely American idiosyncrasies. :-))

Simpler, yes, but it would immediately mark you as 'not one of *us*'...

Social marking is the function of most British formula expressions.

G
(Hellawrerrpal, hoositgawn?)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
From: emcoop@bnr.ca (hume smith)
Subject: Re: gurgitate
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Ottawa, Canada
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:14:58 GMT

In article <glen.727115709@cs.wisc.edu> glen@slate.cs.wisc.edu (Glen Ecklund) writes:

   And then there's (there're?)
	    inflammable            flammable
   except that, as I understand it, flammable became a word (in the US, at least),
   because many people misunderstood inflammable, which was dangerous.

i saw non-inflammable on a plastic protractor when i was a child.  confused
the hell out of me.
--
Hume Smith                                Honour sick and davey cris-cross
hume.smith@acadiau.ca                     McTruloff sentimie
emcoop@bnr.ca                             A parsnip inner pair threes.
From: au500@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Linda Zinn)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: Chinese Restaurants (was Re: Collecting Funny Mistranslations
Date: 24 Jan 1993 14:01:23 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: au500@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Linda Zinn)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc4.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, djb6@ellis.uchicago.edu (Dennis Brennan) says:

>A gem I found on the wrapper of a pair of chopsticks from an Oriental
>restaurant here in Chicago:
>
>"Welcome to Chinese Restaurant.  Please try Nice Chinese Food with 
>chopsticks, the traditional and glorious typical of Chinese history
>and culture!"

I have that one in my files, too, along with my favorite fortune
cookie message:
        
      "You will receive good news of a pleasant nature."

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
* Linda Zinn                    When you point a finger at someone,    *
* au500@cleveland.freenet.edu   you're pointing three back at yourself *
* ******Wanted: Books by E.D.E.N. Southworth; cattail dinnerware****** *
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english