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Approved-By:  Bill McGarry <wtm@SHELDEV.SHEL.ISC-BR.COM>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.l-hcap
Date:         Tue, 7 Apr 1992 17:16:19 EDT
Reply-To:     Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
From:         Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
Subject:      Handicap Digest # 2564
X-To:         LHCAP <l-hcap@VM1.NODAK.EDU>

                          THE HANDICAP DIGEST

                               Issue # 2564

                           Tuesday, April 07, 1992

Today's Topics:


                                ******


                              Re: Deaf Culture
                                SIGN LANGUAGE
                                   HONESTY
                                    HELLO
                                w/c bathrooms
                                What a mess!
                          Re: Pain Vs. Perspiration
                               Spinal Network
                                     SCS
                                 car rental


                                ******


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                              Bill McGarry (Moderator)
                              (203) 337-1518



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Subject: Re: Deaf Culture
From: Wayne.Silsbee@p1.f222.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Wayne Silsbee)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:105/222.1 - N.W. Family History, Oregon City OR


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

> Ack, ptui, and you-gotta-be-kidding!  ASL is just as
> structured as any other language, and has been proven so
> linguistically!

Whoa! Hold your horses.

 o I did not intend to say that ASL has *no* structure
 o I did not say, nor did I imply, that ASL is not a language
 o Are you actually saying that ASL is as structured as English?

ASL has *some* rules, hence *some* structure. However, it gives the
person *far* more leeway than does English. What I was saying was
that because of this lack of (sorry -- maybe should have used the
word "minimal") structure, people who have used ASL tend to bend
(I'm being nice here) the rules of English when English is being
signed.

> That is NOT what I said at all, and you've twisted it
> incomprehensibly!  In this hypothetical Spanished-English
> (vs. Signed English) let's suppose that native Spanish
> speaking people are taught English grammar by taking the
> Spanish words (that they already know) and placing them in
> English word order, and making up the words that English has
> that Spanish doesn't.  Now, unless a person is *really*
> committed to doing this, they are going to fall out of the
> habit of using the made up parts, and the student will not
> really learn English grammar, but a pidgin version of it.

Why would one try to use English grammar with Spanish words? Is
there a sign that uses English grammar with ASL signs? Ah, yes --
SEE. But SEE is not Englishized ASL, SEE is, in my view, a truly
signed English. True, it does have some of its basis from ASL, but
when you are trying to bridge two cultures linguistically, it seems
proper to have *some* continuity when making a truly signed
English. But of course we all know how well SEE went over!

> Would you say that the existence of Spanish is eroding the
> ability to have a truly Spanished English?  Should we keep
> anyone who uses Spanish as their main method of
> communication with other Spanish speaking individuals from
> doing so?  (I am assuming, of course, that you accept
> Spanish as a language.)

Having an Englishized Spanish is absurd to the extreme. Are you
saying that you believe that having a truly signed English is
equally ridiculous?

> What does that have to do with anything?  Gestures are not
> part of spoken languages' grammar.

No, they are not part of a spoken language, but it seems that many
people prefer the use of visual examples rather than go through the
hassle of explaining it verbally.

> You can write down what a person has said, and not lose meaning by not
> transcribing the gestures she made while saying it.

"I had a fish on the line today -- and it was *THIS BIG*!"   Now,
would you care to tell me just how big the fish was that was
described? Ah, you mean you lost the meaning when I didn't
transcribe the gestures? :)

It really seems that, to you, the question of whether there can be
a signed English is rather moot as there is no need for such a
beast to exist. Yet this whole topic began when you complained that
sign in schools wasn't even English -- it was pidgin English. IS
there room for signed English? Is there a NEED for signed English?
We've been discussing whether it's possible to have one, and in
mid-stream you seem to have dismissed the the whole idea as a
ridiculous venture. Care to expand on *your* theories?

TTYL

Wayne

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!105!222.1!Wayne.Silsbee
Internet: Wayne.Silsbee@p1.f222.n105.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: SIGN LANGUAGE
From: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org (Laurel Gealt)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:273/201 - US Telematics, Yardley PA


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

That is interesting about signing with one hand.  I was jjust
discussing that in the last message I answered.  So I will ask you
now.  Like "friend" is one forefinger laid on top of the other
forefinger.  Could you try to explain to me what that would look
like one-handed?  I was not born deaf.  Twenty five years ago, when
I was in my twenties, I was in an automobile accident.  I had a
wound that got infected, and they gave me a heavy dose of an
antibiotic called "neomycin."  It turns outt that neomycin is what
they call "ototoxic", which means it destroys your hearing.  That
is the whole point about these people telling me that I am not
"accepting" my deafness -- They say I still want to think of myself
as a hearing persom.

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!273!201!Laurel.Gealt
Internet: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: HONESTY
From: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org (Laurel Gealt)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:273/201 - US Telematics, Yardley PA


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

Karen, people are coming up with all kinds of solutions to inner
ear hearing losses.  One I read about has to do with transmitting
sound thru an organ in the ear called the "saccule".  It is very
complicated, and I don't understand it well enough to describe it.
Also, they are looking for a drug that will cause the little hairs
in the inner ear to grow back again.  They think they may be able
to do this because, in birds, when the little hairs are destroyed
they grow back again.  And they think if they can fibd the chemical
that the bird's body produces to grow the hairs, they can make it
into a medicine and give it to people.  So I am keeping my hopes up
that something will happen before I die of old age.

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!273!201!Laurel.Gealt
Internet: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: HELLO
From: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org (Laurel Gealt)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:273/201 - US Telematics, Yardley PA


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

I think I would have thhe implant if I had to decide again.  I
would not say that "I don't like it.

'Excuse  me -- I didn't mean to start a new line.   I would not say
that "I don't like it"  It is not perfect, but it is better than
nothing.  Before I had the implant, I carried a little note pad
around with me, and people wrote messages to me on it.  Lip reading
was not enough for me to understand.  But now, combining lip
reading with theinput from the implant, I can converse fairly
easily with most people.  I have not had to have another operation
to improve the implant.  But about a year ago I received a new
"processor"  -- that is what they call the external part of the
implant. -- It looks like a doctor's beeper.   Thhe new one is
smaller and lighter, and so it is much more convenient.  Also the
quality of the sound is better.

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!273!201!Laurel.Gealt
Internet: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: w/c bathrooms
From: John.Nagle@f4.n382.z1.fidonet.org (John Nagle)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:382/4 - River City MailBox, Austin TX


[This is from the Spinal Injury Conference]

Steve,
I remember seeing a post a while back about someone who wanted to
redo their bathroom and I think you answered but I don't remember
the name or the ECHO.
I came across this, which might help, It is a publication that is free
for the asking:
     WHEELCHAIR IN THE BATHROOM (1984)
      Paralyzed Veterans of America
      801 18th Street Northwest
      Washington, DC 20006

also
    WHEELCHAIR IN THE KITCHEN
    (SAME ADDRESS)
single copies are free.

If you remember who wanted this info please pass it on.

Later, John

 Jerry Brown is not related to James Brown!!

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!382!4!John.Nagle
Internet: John.Nagle@f4.n382.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: What a mess!
From: Ambrose.Moore@f24.n3602.z1.fidonet.org (Ambrose Moore)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3602/24 - ADAnet One (tm) Net, Pinson AL


[This is from the Spinal Injury Conference]

    * Reply to message [3401] of 03-2292
    * Reply created 03-25-92 at 09:31
    * Original message from: JOHN DESANTIS
    * Original message to:   AMBROSE MOORE

                      From the Mouthstick of Ambrose Moore:

 JOHN DESANTIS

 AM>catheters, leg bags and what not.  Seems I'm having one heck
 of a time AM>with my indwelling foley.  Blood lots of blood
 around the catheter, AM>(by-passing), through the catheter etc.

 Using that giant syringe and the saline water I had to flush my
 bladder by filling the syringe with 50cc's squirting it in my
 catheter then sucking it back out with syringe until all blood
 and blood clots cleared up took around ten attempts.

 My urologist explained until I cleared out the blood clots odds
 were that the catheter would keep cloging and scab like area
 would just continue to bleed. It worked perfect for me. But I was
 one scared qaud.....grin.

 John
 ---
 * DeLuxe 1.21 #189s * Now using Qmail DeLuxe...and loving it!
 * QNet3 * ADAnet * WPGS * Adelanto, CA * (619) 246-5166

Hi John!

Thanks for your reply.  Sounds like the "Irrigation" routine
that I go through about twice a month.  The only thing
different about it seems that when my nurse tried to suck...
..(ick!) the solution out, the catheter seemed to get plugged
each time and it would collapse from the suction of the
syringe.  Well, I was in so much pain with the sweats and the
constant driving of a sledge-hammer on my neck that I just
told her to replace it.  When she did, (and this is a *real*
bonus), she somehow managed to rip a section of my urethera.

She called 911 for an ambulance and explained that there was
nothing else she could do, sheez!  (I still have a cut on my
tongue, for holding back what I really felt like saying!)
I'm on ampicillin now, with no sign of blood, (knock on head).

When I have bouts like these I always wonder how my body is
going to take the high blood pressure when I'm, say, 50 years
old?  The thought of a stroke terrifies me.  TTYL

Regards,
>From the G.W.N.
Ambrose Moore

 * ACCESS/MAIL 1.00 #0307 * Bad Command!  Bad...Whoa! Sit..heel!
 * QNet3 * <ADANET> Canada Remote Systems - Toronto, Ontario - (416)798-4713

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!3602!24!Ambrose.Moore
Internet: Ambrose.Moore@f24.n3602.z1.fidonet.org




------



Subject: Re: Pain Vs. Perspiration
From: Steve.Smith@f102.n3815.z1.fidonet.org (Steve Smith)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3815/102 - The Bat Cave BBS!!, Bartlesville OK


[This is from the Spinal Injury Conference]

Hello Ambrose,

>I just returned to Urocare bags after a couple of years.  Cost?  $64.76 thats
>without fancy attachments, or velcro straps--$25.50.  By God, anything that's
>got to do with medical supplies in Canada, seems outrageously over-priced.

It does seem a bit higher priced in Canada than here. About 20 to 30
dollars more for the bags and about 10 to 15 more for the straps. But
then, you could always use the straps that come with the bag. I don't
use the straps that come with the bag cuase, their thin and I think
would cut off circulation. I pay around 15 or 16 dollars for the velcro
straps and think they are worth it. They last 2 to 3 years and they are
machine washable. When the elastic starts wearing out after about a
year, just cut a piece off and then sew it back together. You don't have
to be a professional seamstress for that. It's not like it's a shirt or
something that everyone would see.

Just Another Okie

Steve

 * OLX 2.2 * I Like That Old Time ROCK "N" ROLL

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!3815!102!Steve.Smith
Internet: Steve.Smith@f102.n3815.z1.fidonet.org




------



Subject: Spinal Network
From: Joe.Chamberlain@p1.f175.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:150/175.1 - Busted Flush BBS, New Castle DE


[This is from the Spinal Injury Conference]

 JD-  Hi joe, Until hooking up with ADAnet my involvment in PwDs
 JD-  magizines or networks involving PwDs has been nill. What is Spinal
 JD-  Network?

SPINAL NETWORK is a quarterly magazine for the spiinal cord
injuried and is available for $15 for a years subscription.  Call
1-800-338-5412.

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!150!175.1!Joe.Chamberlain
Internet: Joe.Chamberlain@p1.f175.n150.z1.fidonet.org




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Subject: SCS
From: Joe.Chamberlain@p1.f175.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:150/175.1 - Busted Flush BBS, New Castle DE


[This is from the Spinal Injury Conference]

 AH> What is SCS, you ask?  Well, it's Sweaty Crotch Syndrome <tm>,

     I wash with lots of suds from Shield soap.  Dry completely.  Use a VERY
 VERY thin coating of corn starch.  I dip my hand into a ziplock bag of
 cornstarch, shake off any that clings to my hand, and then rub my crotch.  I do
 this each morning and each night until the redness disappears.

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!150!175.1!Joe.Chamberlain
Internet: Joe.Chamberlain@p1.f175.n150.z1.fidonet.org




------



Subject: car rental
From: Joe.Chamberlain@p1.f175.n150.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Chamberlain)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:150/175.1 - Busted Flush BBS, New Castle DE


[This is from the Spinal Injury Conference]

 BF> I hope someone can help enlighten me on how these problems can be
 BF> solved? Perhaps I should have been more cranky and demanded some help,
 BF> but I was truly afraid that they'd say something cute like, "If you
 BF> aren't man enough to handle 75 pounds of baggage, we don't want you

If you make your needs known they will help.  I rented a car in
Philadelphia several years ago and they took my bags to the car,
brought the car from the lot, and helped my attendent store the
chair in the trunk.  Some advance warning is nice and you can even
arrange it ahead of time with the airline and the car rental.  At
Philly, arriving from Orlando on Delta, Delta handled our bags to
the car rental clerk, who in turn had our reservations and a man
from the storage lot waiting for us.

--
Uucp: ..!{decvax,oliveb}!bunker!hcap!hnews!150!175.1!Joe.Chamberlain
Internet: Joe.Chamberlain@p1.f175.n150.z1.fidonet.org




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                                ******

             End of Issue # 2564 of the Handicap Digest

                                ******
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU