HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
X-VMS-To: IN::"libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Sun, 8 Nov 1992 21:05:02 EDT
From:         Dennis Warren x2659
              <DENNISW%VAX7.cc.monash.edu.au@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      Availability of Educational Tests
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
From:	VAX7::DENNISW      "Dennis Warren x2659"  6-NOV-1992 15:32
To:	IN::"mdumont@kentvm.kent.au",DENNISW
Subj:	Availability of Tests

I would like to be able to obtain copies of the Iowa Problem Solving Project
Test and the California Assessment Program Survey of Basic Skills for
Grades 6 and 8, on inter-library loan or by purchase. Single copies,
initially. I have checked Tests in Print III and the BRS file Educational
Testing Service Test Collection (ETSF) database, without success.
Does anyone have any ideas. Any suggestions will be gratefully received.


Dennis Warren,
Monash University,
VICTORIA,
AUSTRALIA
Dennis.WARREN@lib.monash.edu.au
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
From: BROSENCM%DUVM.OCS.DREXEL.EDU@Kentvm.Kent.edu (Pat)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Subject: IRS CUMULITVE BULLETIN 1984-3 VOLS 1-2
Date: 5 Nov 92 15:38:14 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
My first attempt at using the list.
I have a patron who wants to purchase The INTERNAL REVENUE CUMULATIVE
BULLETIN 1984-3  VOLS 1 AND 2.

He has tried the US GOVT. PRINTING OFFICE and has been told that they are out
of print?

Any idea of where copies might be purchased?

Thank you.
Pat Brosenne   Drexel Univeristy
brosencm@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Organization: Idaho State University
Priority:     normal
X-Mailer:     Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 12:53:15 EDT
Reply-To:     zuckjoel%ux1.isu.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu
From:         Joel <ZUCKJOEL%ol.isu.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      Re: Public Librarians
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
this all started because someone said that academic librarians
have 'tough' research questions and do BI while public library
ref types do "easy" ready reference type questions, right?...
what an elitist attitude...I've been in academic libraries all my
professional career, but I'm pretty sure public lib types have it
*tougher* because of the diversity of the clientele they must serve,
the real problem patrons they put up with, the really precarious state
of their funding....I'd hate to lose their perspective on Libref-L
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+  Joel Zucker                      +
+  Head of Government Publications  +
+  Eli M. Oboler Library            +
+  Idaho State University           +
+  Pocatello  ID  83209-8089        +
+  208 236-3045                     +
+  zuckjoel@isu.edu                 +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From: EMERSON%GENESEO.BITNET@Kentvm.Kent.edu
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Subject: Re: No Reference Desk
Date: 9 Nov 92 23:37:59 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: LIBREF-L@KENTVM.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"LIBREF-L@KENTVM.BITNET"
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------

At Monroe Community College, we still have the "traditional" set-up, but
one thing we've tried is to have the librarian on reference duty "roam"
around the floor several times during his/her shift.  We noticed, as
I'm sure others have, that when we get up to hela patr we're often
asked several further questions as we work our way back to the reference
desk.  Students seem to feel more comforatble approaching us when we're
already out walking around, as opposed to "interrupting" us wleul
we're sitting at the desk.  Actually during these busy periods in the
semester we don't need to make the effort to get up and roam - we're
always up on our feet anyway.  But students definitele will approach
when we're walking by or helping someone else, but won't come up to
the desk.  Having the desk in placis handy for our librarians
during the quieter periods, when we have a chance to get some reading
or paperwork done while on duty.  It also serves as a focal point, so
that when students ask for assistance at the "wrong" place (the circ
desk, for example), the staff can point them in the right direction
by saying "over there at the reference desk", or something like that.

Debby Emerson
Monroe Community College
emerson@geneseo
From: DKFITCH%SAMFORD.BITNET@Kentvm.Kent.edu (Donna K. Fitch)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Subject: No Reference Desk
Date: 6 Nov 92 18:10:50 GMT
Organization: Samford University
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I have been doing some reading lately on innovative alternatives to
the reference desk.  Many people advocate doing away with the actual
reference desk, but no one seems to have any concrete alternatives.
Is there anyone out there who has done something along these lines?
The major article sparking my interest is "Reference beyond (and
without) the Reference Desk" by Barbara J. Ford in the Sept. 1986
issue of C & RL.

I don't really want to debate theoretical pros & cons; just
information about or from anyone's who's tried this.  The current
system we have (typical--reference desk staffed most hours, BI
program, etc.) is okay, but I'm looking for even better ways to
improve service.  Even if you have an alternative idea that you
haven't been able to try out, let me know.

Thanks!

Donna K. Fitch                    |  "Pure insanity: To keep doing
Reference Unit Coordinator        |   the same things and expect
Samford University Library        |   something different to happen."
Birmingham, AL  35229             |              -- Author unknown
dkfitch@samford.bitnet            |
From: dfuller%eis.CalState.EDU@Kentvm.Kent.edu (David Fuller)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Subject: Public LIbrarians ???
Date: 6 Nov 92 17:15:44 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
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Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I guess I really started something with my roll call for public
librarians. So far I have counted about ten on this list, including
myself. I had no intention to encourage factionalism or to suggest that
public and academic librarians had nothing to share with one another.

I have also had experience in both academic and public libraries and do
continue to believe that there are significant differences between them.
The difference lies primarily with the population that is served and the
interaction between patron and librarian. I continue to be astounded that,
excluding "school reports", about 90% of the information requested in a
public library is in some way related to the making, saving, spending, or
avoidance of spending money.

I was originally interested in getting responses from public librarians
regarding OCLC's FirstSearch. I felt that a service like this was more
suited for an academic environment where the population is more
"mobilized" and perhaps more familiar with abstractions such as
"database", "document delivery", etc.

I am not trying to be disruptive but I do reserve the right to
query public librarians since we are so few on this list and often
invisible. I love you all.

David Fuller      dfuller@eis.calstate.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:59:46 EDT
From:         Jackie Borin <jackie_borin%csusm.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      Library Bill of Rights in S
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
                      Library Bill of Rights in Spanish
Does anyone either have a copy of, or know where I can obtain one, of the
Library Bill
of Rights and the Freedom to Read statement in Spanish. I have tried ALA,
Reforma and local
sources without any luck. Please reply directly to me and if possible if you
have such an
animal, mail or fax to me at the address below. Thanks.

__________________________________________________________________
Jackie Borin, Reference Librarian         California State University, San
Marcos
                                                             San Marcos, CA
92096-0001
Bitnet: JACKIE_BORIN@CSUSM.EDU      Voice: 619-752-4336    Fax: 619-471-6494

__________________________________________________________________
From: MTYGETT%CMSUVMA.BITNET@Kentvm.Kent.edu (Mary Tygett)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Subject: Reference Performance Evaluations
Date: 6 Nov 92 18:07:57 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Beginning next semester, we hope to initiate a process whereby reference
workers will be evaluated by their co-workers.  I've got a copy of "Ensuring
Quality Reference Desk Service: The Introduction of a Peer Process," by Jane
P. Kleiner from the Spring 1991 edition of RQ.  I've also got a copy of the
SPEC Kit 139 -- Performance Evaluation in Reference Services in ARL Libraries.

Between these two, I've made a good start.  I would like to see what other
libraries may be doing.  If anyone would care to share evaluation forms which
they use, I'd love to see them.

Thanks,

Mary Tygett
Business Librarian
Central Missouri State University
Warrensburg, MO  64093
Bitnet Address  MTYGETT@CMSUVMA
From: SIMMONS%UMBC.BITNET@Kentvm.Kent.edu
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Subject: Re: Public Librarians???
Date: 5 Nov 92 22:18:37 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"LIBREF-L@KENTVM.BITNET"
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I want to preface my comment by giving a paraphrase of an old cliche--
if you give a man a fish, he will eat for a day, if you teach him to fish
he will eat forever????  As an academic, I find we need to teach users
certain basics so that they can operate in any library environment, whether
it be an academic or public.   Frequently we ask users if they know how to
use a particular index and the retort is I have never been to this library..
many users use this as a mechanism to cover up embarrassment but many do
not understand there is standarization of indexes, abstracts, etc. and
that if they learn certain basic skills, they are transferrable.  Whether
we are academic librarians or public librarians, I feel we all have the
the same mission to educate our users so that he or she can acquire
certain basic "library survival skills."    Simmona E. Simmons-Ho
OOps  that last name is Simmons-Hodo, UMBC
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:47:40 EDT
From:         "Michael S. Hart" <HART%vmd.cso.uiuc.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      Re: Lurkers
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
re:  Suzanne's note about trying to reply when you read from newsreaders.

If you keep your direct subscription (or create one) and send listserv
the "set listname nomail" command, you will still be able to submit by
direct methods, as any other member does.

More about this later, if detailed advice is needed.


=====================================================

Thank you for your interest,

Michael S. Hart, Professor of Electronic Text
Executive Director of Project Gutenberg Etext
Illinois Benedictine College, Lisle, IL 60532
No official connection to U of Illinois--UIUC
hart @uiucvmd.bitnet or hart@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
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Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 15:06:55 EDT
From:         Esther Grassian <ECZ5ESG%MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      BIS Task Force Wants Input
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------

This message has been cross-posted to BI-L.

The Bibliographic Instruction Section (BIS) of ACRL has established a
Task Force on Strategic Options for Professional Education.  The Task
Force's charge is:

   To investigate and identify strategic options, such as
   certification, which may influence and/or encourage
   library schools and employers to offer and develop
   education and continuing education for bibliographic
   instruction; to make recommendations to the BIS
   Executive Committee on their facility and political
   usefulness for the Section in influencing library
   schools and employers; and to recommend a process of
   implementation within the Section.

The BIS Executive Committee has given us one year to investigate options
and write a report.  We want your ideas and comments on what these options
should be.  To this end, we invite list members and any others interested
to email ideas and comments to the list so that we can begin to identify
and discuss a variety of means for achieving these goals.

We also invite you to attend an open forum at Midwinter in Denver to
discuss this issue further.  The forum will be held on Saturday, January
23d, from 11a.m. to 12:30 p.m., during the BIS Advisory Council meeting.
You will be able to find the meeting location in the Midwinter program
by looking for the BIS Advisory Council meeting, 9:30a.m. - 12:30 p.m.
on Saturday, January 23d.  We will report back to the list on draft
options after Midwinter, and again ask for your input before coming up
with a final report.

If you would prefer, you may email, phone or snailmail your comments
and ideas to me:

     Esther Grassian
     Chair
     BIS Task Force on Strategic Options
       for Professional Education
     College Library Reference
     121A Towell
     UCLA
     L.A., CA  90024-1450

     Phone:  (310) 825-2138

     Email:  ECZ5ESG@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU

Thank you for you help.
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Wed, 11 Nov 1992 21:27:56 EDT
From:         Adrienne Franco <AXF1%IONA.BITNET@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      ref. standards reply revised
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
In a previous reply regarding "reference standards", one of the
suggestions I made was that if a librarian colleague giving out
incorrect or incomplete information to a patron was especially
sensitive, that one could ask the patron to return for help if
they did not find what they wanted, and then speak privately with
the colleague librarian.

I would like to withdraw this suggestion.  It is better to risk the
unhappiness of the reference colleague than to knowingly allow false
information to be given out.   I stand by the other suggestions I
made, however, which basically advise on the most tactful way of
correction.  If done tactfully and with respect, no librarian should
mind valid correction.

If a librarian continues to give out incorrect or incomplete information
this may indicate either a problem with staff training, or a problem
with the particular individual.  Private conference(s) with the
individual and perhaps some sort of reassignment of duties might be
appropriate.

Adrienne Franco
Bitnet: axf1@iona.bitnet
Internet: axf1%iona.bitnet@cunyvm.cuny.edu

Iona College, New Rochelle, New York
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Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 18:53:57 EDT
From:         Molly Warren <warren%alexia.lis.uiuc.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      UMI newspaper indexes
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu
Comments: cc: warren@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------

Help!

My school library is faced with the following dilemma.  We have
had the UMI cdrom program that indexes the NY Times, CSM, and the
Chicago Tribune--which is exactly what we want.  It matches our
microfilm collection.  Now UMI is saying they can no longer offer
that package.  They tell us we must buy the cdrom that indexes
lots of newpapers, and we only have the three mentioned on
microfilm.  The kids would be constantly asking for newspapers
we don't have.  Does anyone know of another cdrom vendor that
indexes these newspapers?

I would really appreciate hearing your input.

Thanks,

Molly Warren(warren@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
.
elp!
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Return-Path: <walther%a1.relay.upenn.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Msg-Class: ALL-IN-1 V2.3 BL8-4 Rev. AAC 20-Dec-1988
Approved-By:  walther%a1.relay.upenn.edu@KENTVM.KENT.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 15:04:37 EDT
Comments:     Warning -- original Sender: tag was
              walther%a1.relay.upenn.edu@KENTVM.KENT.EDU
From:         Robert Walther <walther%a1.relay.upenn.edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      "Encyclopedic Discourse"
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

----------------------------Original message----------------------------

Reference librarians have always had a special relationship with
encyclopedias.  For many of us, they epitomize what attracted us to the
job in the first place.  With this in mind I would like to recommend a
recent article in the journal Sub-stance by Hilary Clark entitled
"Encyclopedic Discourse" (#67, 1992, pp 95-110).
    As the title indicates, Clark attempts to analyze the specific
nature of "encyclopedic" writing using current notions of textuality
and discourse theory.  The article may be a stretch for librarians
unfamiliar with recent critical theory, but on the other hand, it may
prove illuminating to readers skeptical that discourse theory could have
anything substantive to say to Reference librarians about their own
role in the larger world of knowledge.

Bob Walther
Reference Dept.
Univ. of Penn.
walther@a1.upenn.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 18:54:20 EDT
From:         Suzy Turner <sjt1%Ra.MsState.Edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      Re: your mail
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu
              92 8:55 pm

----------------------------Original message----------------------------

>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Received: from KENTVM.BITNET by KENTVM.BITNET (Mailer R2.08) with BSMTP id
>  2360; Tue, 03 Nov 92 20:39:51 EDT
> :MSG:FROM: DBISHOP --TULSAJC  TO: LIBREF-L--KENTVM            11/02/92
 16:13:03
>  From: DBishop@Tulsajc.Bitnet
>  Subject: Media
>  I realize that this may not be the perfect group to bring
>  up this discussion, but based on the groups that I belong
>  to, it is about as close as I can get.  I am the Assistant
>  to the Coordinator/Head of Public Service at a multi-campus
>  junior college.  At TJC, our Media department is a component
>  of the LRC, but really operates independently.
>
>  I have some strong concerns related to how involved the
>  professional librarians should be in media operations.  That
>  is how involved should we be in making purchase decisions
>  for hardware and software, how knowledgeable should we be
>  as far as operation of various hardware formats.  My concerns
>  continue  to grow with every new form of media that comes out,
>  such as interactive formats.  This concern may be unique for
>  my institution, in that we have people with technical backgrounds
>  opposed to librarian backgrounds running the everyday operations
>  in media, and being instrumental in long range media decisions.
>  I would really appreciate any input on the above.  Thanks.
>
>
At our university library we have a systems coordinator that also handles
the CD-ROMS, etc. She does all the negotiating with suppliers, publishers,
or whoever puts out the media.  She constantly consults with the refernce
staff about what we want or asks us if we would like to preview some new
thing that she has discovered.  This has worked fine for us. We get to help
make the decisions about what we want to buy and she does all the hard
work.
Suzy Turner
sjt1@Ra.msstate.edu




>
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Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:23:17 EDT
From:         RTURNERJ%cc.curtin.edu.au@Kentvm.Kent.edu
Subject:      Re: Last comments on lurkers
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu

absolutely the last word that will be posted... Diane Editor-Right-Now

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
If I'm going to be called a ghost, I'd prefer Spirit, as I am spirited
and wish I was more spiritual.

JulieT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Approved-By:  Diane Kovacs <DKOVACS@KENTVM.KENT.EDU>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.libref-l
Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:14:03 EDT
From:         Rosemary Thorne <THORNE%SJSUVM1.BITNET@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Subject:      Re: FURNITURE
Comments: To: libref-l@kentvm.kent.edu
              10 Nov 1992 23:10:02 EDT from
              <sjt1%Ra.MsState.Edu@Kentvm.Kent.edu>

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
In regard to the counter v. desk height service point:  When we moved
into our new building in 1981, we planned for 2 service points at
counter height and 1 at desk, especially for disabled patrons.  We
found that patrons would walk right past the desk and go to the counter.
Librarians also disliked talking to patrons who seldom sat down and
found they ended up standing.  We had few disabled in wheelchairs at that
ime.  Our 3 reference points now are counter height, but no farther than
2 or 3 feet from a break - librarians constantly and esaily flow from
the service counter into the rest of the rooom.  It's not unusual for
all three libns to be away from the desk helping people.  Thank goodness
for our directions desk, for phone answering and traffic directing, as
well as their informational and directional functions.

Rosemary Thorne, San Jose State U.  thorne@sjsuvm1