HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jef@netcom.com (Jef Poskanzer)
Subject: Re: SDSC Image Tools and PBM Plus
X-Face: uPIE),q]+zmF49L%(pdE;nX/8$/J22&&&C@_)8BouYx42Y--?*,\]*MIeTY#mCM(x>FyD@+0D-Jm]S_8lxop(Q-$L#~b8!ha;eF[b+GOLyu<]4$">NeVymJ@F#M?1O`ue4,h4`2S^KGjmP%no(d,:<Ur:+f6W8$J:'t9BxH
Reply-To: Jef Poskanzer <jef@netcom.com>
Organization: Paratheo-Anametamystikhood Of Eris Esoteric
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 19:48:28 GMT

dansmith@Autodesk.COM (Daniel Smith):
}	I too plowed through Dave Nadeau's posting, and found myself
}really objecting to the tone before I got to the end of it.

Yeah, there were a lot of unfair comparisons and even outright
falsehoods.  But you have to understand where Dave is coming from.  He
has this huge project with huge government grants, and yet everyone is
saying that one guy with a rickety old Sun 3/50 produced something
that's just as good.  A congresscritter with an axe to grind could have
a lot of fun with that come budget-hearing time.  So he *has* to dis
pbmplus.  It's not personal, it's just business.  He's probably a nice
guy in person.  Maybe he even understands what the congresscritter
wouldn't: that the one guy and his 3/50 are backed up by the combined
debugging and programming talent of tens of thousands of net people.
There's no way he can honestly compete with that, so he has to use
other methods.

I do wish he'd learn about cross-posting, though.
---
Jef

           Jef Poskanzer  jef@netcom.com  jef@well.sf.ca.us
              "Too bad it's backwards." -- Captain Happy
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
From: mccauley@ecn.purdue.edu (Darrell McCauley)
Subject: histogram equalization code
Followup-To: poster
Organization: Ag Engineering Dept, Purdue University 
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 17:56:20 GMT

Where's the quickest place to find a histogram equalization routine in C?
-- 
James Darrell McCauley                Dept of Ag Engineering, Purdue Univ
internet: mccauley@ecn.purdue.edu     West Lafayette, Indiana 47907-1146, USA
bitnet: mccauley%ecn@purccvm          UUCP: pur-ee!mccauley
From: nadeau@sdsc.edu (Dave Nadeau,,45062)
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
Subject: Re: SDSC Image Tools and PBM Plus
Date: 7 Jan 1993 20:56:25 GMT
Organization: San Diego Supercomputer Center @UCSD.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: nadeau@sdsc.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: dudley.sdsc.edu

In article 726425982@lisa, mrd@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Mark Dobie) writes:
>In <1ifp9tINN2ov@network.ucsd.edu> nadeau@sdsc.edu (Dave Nadeau,,45062) writes:

>The two packages have different philosophies about how things are done.
>I personally like the pbmplus approach which allows the user to control
>(on the command line or in scripts) what goes on, but I can see for
>common operations an integrated approach is much better. Of course,
>"common" all depends on what you do... Oh yes, pbmplus does use
>libraries as well.  :-)

1.  Control over file format output variants is available in the SDSC Image Tools
    using "-outXXX" arguments to the various tools, where "XXX" is one of a
    variety of format controls.  Output file format compression schemes can be
    selected, output image depths can be controlled, and so on.  These options
    are all documented in the manual page for "imconv", included in the release.

    All such options are available on all Image Tools.  All Image Tools are
    command-line tools suitable for invokation via shell scripts.

2.  PBMplus libraries are limited to file I/O for the PBM formats.  They do not
    include other file format intelligence, nor most of the image manipulation
    functionality.  The SDSC Image Tools library, however, includes all file
    format knowledge and all image manipulation knowledge.



---
Dave Nadeau						nadeau@sdsc.edu
Advanced Scientific Visualization Laboratory		(619) 534-5062
San Diego Supercomputer Center
P.O. Box 85608   San Diego, CA   92186-9784
From: rjwaring@hou.amoco.com (Bob Waring)
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
Subject: Re: CGM validater needed ASAP (read yesterday)
Date: 7 Jan 93 20:29:48 GMT
Reply-To: rjwaring@hou.amoco.com
Organization: Amoco

In article 4D5@bcstec.ca.boeing.com, vanzwol@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Ted Van Zwol) writes:
>Immediate need for a CGM validator.  If you have any knowledge that could
>lead us to obtaining such an item, PLEASE e-mail me ASAP.
>
>We need a tool that will read a CGM file and determine if it conforms to
>the ANSI spec.  As a last resort, if we could find a couple utilities that
>simply read and manipulate CGM files, this could almost work for us.
>
>Any information, greatly appreciated.
>
>-tcvz
>
>
>
>-----
>
>-- 
>Ted C Van Zwol                           |    Genius does what it must,
>uucp:      {...!}uunet!bcstec!vanzwol    |    Talent does what it can.
>internet:  vanzwol@bcstec.ca.boeing.com  |                  -Emerson
>                         ^^^^ new...

There is a very good CGM comformance tester *NOT* public domain from CGM Technology Software
called Metachek.  If you can afford to pay for it, it is very useful in determining if the CGM file
is bad, or the interperter has a bug.  Well worth the money.

I can't remember how to contact the company, but if you have interest, let me know, I will find that	
info.


-------------------
Bob Waring               Amoco Production
rjwaring@hou.amoco.com   Exploration Systems
-------------------
"Well, if you can't believe what you read in a comic book,
What *can* you believe?!"  -- Bullwinkle J. Moose <Jay Ward>
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
From: aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri)
Subject: Re: SDSC Image Tools source code
Organization: Siemens Corporate Research, Princeton (Plainsboro), NJ
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 01:48:21 GMT

>    Any support choice that offers a bug fixing service on "your source"
>    takes a lot of human resources, disk space, and a wide variety of hardware
>    and OS configurations available for the support people.

When the source is available, though, the "support people" are all over the
world.  The net supports its own sources.

>5.  One of the most common reasons users site for why they need source
>    to the SDSC Image Tools is a desire to add additional image file formats.

How's about non-availability of binaries for their architectures and os's?/
-- 

======================================================================8--<
From: brazier@ph.und.ac.za
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
Subject: BOCA SuperX VGA
Date: 12 Jan 93 06:05:34 GMT
Organization: University Of Natal (Durban)
NNTP-Posting-Host: pc25.ph.und.ac.za

Hi

I hope this is the right place...  Does anyone know where one can get info 
on programming the BOCA SuperX VGA in 64K, 32K and 16.8M colour modes?

thanks in advance
Tom Brazier
From: hee@cs.columbia.edu (Edward Hee)
Subject: dcview21.zip -- ColorView for DOS JPEG Viewer
Keywords: JPEG JFIF GIF BMP Viewer Converter
Organization: Columbia University Department of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 02:45:01 GMT



The latest version of ColorView for DOS, version 2.1, a fast JPEG/JFIF,
GIF, Windows BMP viewer/converter/editor has been posted as dcview21.zip
on alt.binaries.pictures.utilities.  VESA graphics drivers for
ColorView for DOS have also been posted as vesadrv2.zip on the same
group.

The .zip files are also available at wuarchive.wustl.edu in the
/pub/MSDOS_UPLOADS directory.

			   ColorView for DOS
	  Copyright (c) 1992 Millennium Technologies Corporation
			   All Rights Reserved

			      Version 2.1


ColorView is a color image viewer/converter/editor for the DOS environment.

Changes in version 2.1:
	o  Improved support for all Windows BMP image formats
	o  Support for monochrome JPEG images
	o  Text-mode batch image conversion and scaling from the command
	   line.

In this version, ColorView supports reading and writing the following
graphics file formats:

	o  JPEG (JFIF subset)  JPEG is a highly compressed 24 bit "true 
	   color" picture file format which has more colors and a smaller 
	   file size than GIF files.
	o  GIF'87, GIF'89 including animations
	o  Windows BMP files (4, 8 and 24 bit, including 8 bit RLE)


ColorView provides: 
	o  Floyd-Steinberg dithering
	o  Heckbert color reduction
	o  Gamma correction, Hue, Saturation, and Brightness controls
	o  Sharpening, Smoothing, Embossing, Edge Tracing and other 
	   image filters
	o  Copy and Paste operations between all supported image formats
	o  New Image creation and text drawing functions
	o  Adjustable Image Transparency Effects
	o  "Blue Screen" effects
	o  Image Rotation and Mirroring functions
	o  Intuitive graphical user interface, with or without a mouse
	o  Slideshow mode for uninterrupted image viewing
	o  Fast and extremely accurate Image Scaling for reducing and
	   enlarging pictures
	o  GIF Animation support
	o  Ability to switch graphics modes while viewing an image
	o  And much more!


ColorView will work with:
	o  Any Text mode display (Batch File Conversion)
	o  Standard VGA 320x200 video mode
	o  8 bit, 256 color display boards with a VESA driver 
	o  15 bit, 32768 color display boards with a VESA driver
	o  16 bit, 65356 color display boards with a VESA driver
	o  24 bit color display boards with a VESA driver
	o  DOS 2.x, 3.x, 4.x, 5.x
	o  640 K or more of physical memory
		(expanded and extended memory will automatically be used)
	o  a hard disk
		(automatically used if not enough physical memory)
	o  80286, 80386-SX, 80386, 80486, Pentium processors
	o  Microsoft-compatible mouse

ColorView for DOS (CVIEW.EXE) will run on '286 processors and will
automatically take advantage of a '386 or better processor if one
is available.

Enjoy!
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils,comp.graphics,alt.binaries.pictures.utilities
From: ens@cs.sfu.ca (John Ens)
Subject: Halftoning algorithm (C code) needed
Keywords: Halftoning
Organization: CSS, Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 22:41:55 GMT

My apologies if this is a FAQ ....

Could some kind soul point me to a halftoning algorithm (C code if
possible) for transforming a gray-scale image to a halftoned binary
bit map.  Since I'm working with my own image format, I don't need
any I/O code.

I currently have an algorithm which uses pre-defined dot patterns,
but I'm not satisfied with the results.  I'm interested in an adaptive
scheme where the dots are produced randomly, based on the input gray-scale
image and errors from neighbouring pixels.

Thanks in advance.

John Ens
ens@cs.sfu.ca
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
From: mcastle@cs.umr.edu (Michael R Castle)
Subject: Re: File Formats for Texture
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:36:29 GMT
Organization: University of Missouri - Rolla, Rolla, MO
Keywords: Texture, Formats

In article <29898@castle.ed.ac.uk> asm@festival.ed.ac.uk (M Smyth) writes:
>what i want is a file format thats 24bit colour and
>dead simple(not tiff)!  it could be a bog standard one or one
>with which i can go:
>
>nice, standard    ---->  your personal  -->  my weird, proprietry 
>file format		 file format         texture format
>
>anyone got any suggestions/help?

dead simple?  Try ppm format (from the ppmplus distribution)

P6
640 480
256
binarydatahere

P6 magic header followed by one whitespace
width followed by one whitespace
height followed by one whitespace
colordepth followed by one whitespace
raw binary data

Plus, lotsa library support in the pbmplus package.


A smaller format could be the RLE format from the UTAH Raster Toolkit.
Bit more complex, but again, a lot of library support so you shouldn't 
have to write anything yourself.

mrc

-- 
Mike Castle .-=NEXUS=-.  Life is like a clock:  You can work constantly
  mcastle@cs.umr.edu     and be right all the time, or not work at all
S087891@UMRVMA.UMR.EDU   and be right at least twice a day.  -- mrc
    We are all of us living in the shadow of Manhattan.  -- Watchmen
From: slack@boi.hp.com (David Slack)
Subject: GL Viewer, Plz Post!
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 20:00:06 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard / Boise, Idaho
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]

	Somebody please post a GL viewer (grasprt.exe? (sp)) or email to
me.     

Thanks
Dave


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
   |_/_/_/  _/       _/      _/_/  _/  _/ | David H. Slack                  |
   |_/      _/      _/_/    _/     _/ _/  | Boise Surface Mount Center      |
   |_/_/_/  _/     _/  _/   _/     _/_/   | email: slack@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com |
   |    _/  _/    _/_/_/_/  _/     _/ _/  | telnet: 323 4019                |
   |_/_/_/  _/_/ _/      _   _/_/  _/  _/ | phone: (208) 323 4019           |
   |------------------------------------------------------------------------|
   | Hewlett-Packard, 11213 Chinden Blvd., Boise Idaho 83714-1023, M/S #625 |
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: mrd@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Mark Dobie)
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
Subject: Re: SDSC Image Tools and PBM Plus
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:59:42 GMT

In <1ifp9tINN2ov@network.ucsd.edu> nadeau@sdsc.edu (Dave Nadeau,,45062) writes:

>In response to the SDSC Image Tools release posting, Jeff Hanson wrote:

>	>>While I agree completely about the usefulness of source and would love
>	>>to have for these tools in particular, do not pass up the opportunity
>	>>to have the best single program conversion tool, imconv.

>To which Steve Lamont replied:

>	>Don't forget pbmplus *is* available in source code and does 99 percent
>	>of what imconv does (and often does it faster!).  It's available with
>	>the X11 distribution in the contrib directory or from your favorite
>	>FTP site (wuarchive.uwstl.edu comes to mind).

>As the authors of the SDSC Image Tools, we feel we must respond to this
>posting to help clear up any misconceptions.  The SDSC Image Tools differ
>in significant ways from the PBMPlus package.  The following rather long
>message details some of these ways.

I diligently ploughed through this posting as I had never heard of the
SDSC Image Tools. They sound very impressive. I thought some of the points
in here were a little hard on pbmplus, given the nature of its development.

The two packages have different philosophies about how things are done.
I personally like the pbmplus approach which allows the user to control
(on the command line or in scripts) what goes on, but I can see for
common operations an integrated approach is much better. Of course,
"common" all depends on what you do... Oh yes, pbmplus does use
libraries as well.  :-)

Anyway, I got to the interesting part (the ftp address) and I think I
found the right directory (I'm not familiar with the system there) but
there isn't a directory for my machine running linux :-( So I guess I
have to pass up the opportunity of trying imconv... and I do a lot of
image manipulation too. Never mind, maybe it will get ported one day.

I have to support the idea of source releases. My whole operating system
and everything in it comes from source releases! If there's no source
its just not as "available".

				Mark.

--
Mark Dobie                              M.R.Dobie@uk.ac.soton.ecs (JANET)
University of Southampton		M.R.Dobie@ecs.soton.ac.uk (The World)
From: ajeans@hplred.HPL.HP.COM (Albert Jeans)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:25:13 GMT
Subject: Wanted: GIF index program
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories, Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils

Does anyone have a Unix based program which can make an index/contact sheet
from a bunch of GIF files?
From: jderyck@engn.uwindsor.ca (John De Ryckere)
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
Subject: Re: SunRaster / Tiff to Pict conv
Date: 4 Jan 1993 17:42:52 GMT
Reply-To: jderyck@engn.uwindsor.ca
Organization: VLSI Research Group - University of Windsor

Hi Paul.  I've gotten it to work thought not in one step.  What I do is take the Sun
Raster File and convert it to Tiff using a public domain program called xv under UNIX 
(the author is John Bradley bradley@cis.upenn.edu) (I use version 2.21).  I then use a
program called Adobe PhotoShop to convert from TIFF to PICT on the Macintosh.  I'm
sure that there is a PD tool that will do it out their, in fact I think I've seen it
on image 1.47 or imagine (check Archie for image...)

Hope this helped!

John
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
From: palm@nb.rockwell.com (Steve [kiwin] Palm)
Subject: Gerber / GEM file specification ?
Organization: Rockwell International, Digital Communications Division, JEDC
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 18:16:18 GMT
Return-Receipt-To: palm@nb.rockwell.com


I would like to find the file format specifications for GERBER files
and also GEM files.  Online documentation would be great...
but I am also happy with pointers to physical documents.

thanks, kiwin
--
-----
Stephen [kiwin] Palm                                     TEL: +81-3-3265-8850
Rockwell International - Digital Communications Division     COMNET: 930-8862
Japan Engineering Design Center                          FAX: +81-3-3263-0639
      palm@nb.rockwell.com       palm@cs.cmu.edu           NIHON::PALM
From: rns@deakin.OZ.AU (Robert Sturrock)
Newsgroups: alt.graphics.pixutils
Subject: color -> monochrome *without* dithering
Date: 5 Jan 1993 16:22:02 +1100
Organization: Deakin University
NNTP-Posting-Host: rastaban.cc.deakin.oz.au

Hi,

I'm trying to convert a colour (AutoCAD "slide" format) file into
a *monochrome* sun rasterfile.  I can use PBMplus to do the job thus:

	bash$ sldtoppm -adjust file.sld |
	      ppmtopgm |
	      pgmtopbm |
	      pbmtorast > file.ras

The above works, but it appears that the process involves *dithering*
the colour image (I suppose "pgmtopbm" does this).  I really don't want
dithering, since the final image comes out looking too grainy.  My
original colour images contain only *six* colours (they are simple plan
diagrams of buildings and campuses).  What I would like to do is
translate anything that is not black from the original into white.
Something like:

	INPUT		   OUTPUT
	black (0)	-> black (0)
	non-black (1-?)	-> white (1)

This way, the output should sharper.  All I want is for the walls
of buildings and roads to show up clearly.  Is there some alternative way of
performing the conversion, so that no dithering is involved?


Thanks


Rob Sturrock
<rns@deakin.EDU.AU>
Computing Services, Deakin University
From: vanzwol@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Ted Van Zwol)
Subject: CGM validater needed ASAP (read yesterday)
Organization: Boeing
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:26:39 GMT

Immediate need for a CGM validator.  If you have any knowledge that could
lead us to obtaining such an item, PLEASE e-mail me ASAP.

We need a tool that will read a CGM file and determine if it conforms to
the ANSI spec.  As a last resort, if we could find a couple utilities that
simply read and manipulate CGM files, this could almost work for us.

Any information, greatly appreciated.

-tcvz



-----

-- 
Ted C Van Zwol                           |    Genius does what it must,
uucp:      {...!}uunet!bcstec!vanzwol    |    Talent does what it can.
internet:  vanzwol@bcstec.ca.boeing.com  |                  -Emerson
                         ^^^^ new...
Xref: sparky alt.graphics:438 alt.graphics.pixutils:2828 triangle.graphics:26
From: Shujaat.Ali@launchpad.unc.edu (Shujaat Ali)
Newsgroups: alt.graphics,alt.graphics.pixutils,triangle.graphics
Subject: Need name of a package to convert IBM PSEG file to other format.
Date: 6 Jan 93 04:50:33 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service

Hi, I am looking for a software package that can convert IBM PSEG art  files
into pcx, tiff, gif or bmp format.  I would appreciate if anybody would
provide me with some information on this.

						Shujaat.




internet: shujaat@vnet.ibm.com
	  

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: alt.privacy
From: tenney@netcom.com (Glenn S. Tenney)
Subject: Re: Social Security Number FAQ
Keywords: Social Security Number, SSN, privacy
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 01:54:10 GMT

John gives some good examples of how multiple people end up with the same SSN.
I was *not* suggesting that anyone was doing a poor job -- on the contrary,
I think that the vast majority of SSA folks are doing a great job.  I was
only stating that unless you can preclude duplicates and unless you
can have built in checks, the ssn should NOT be used in the manner
companies and local/state agencies use it -- as if it were a valid
universal ID.



-- 
Glenn Tenney
voice: (415) 574-3420      fax: (415) 574-0546
tenney@netcom.com          Ham radio: AA6ER
Newsgroups: alt.privacy
Subject: Sallie Mae net address?
From: glazier@isr.harvard.edu (Andrew Baker Glazier)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 93 21:23:40 GMT
Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, MA

See subject. I want to write to them to complain about their use of my SS#
as an account number, and failing that to flame the living hell out of a
representative...
-- 
"A horse! A horse! Somebody give me a horse, man, because|glazier@ 
I come to bury this dirtball, not to praise him. Whaddya |harvard.isr.edu
think I am? Whether it's nobler for the mind to make people suffer with all
these totally outrageous arrows arrows for a fortune, or what!" -- D.R.
Newsgroups: alt.privacy
From: dvsg0223@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (David Salamon)
Subject: Re: Social Security Number FAQ
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 19:20:30 GMT
Keywords: Social Security Number, SSN, privacy

tenney@netcom.com (Glenn S. Tenney) writes:

>First, the SSN is (a) not unique, and (b) technically an incorrect
>identifier.  There are multiple people with the same ssn, and without
>any check digit, there is no built-in way to verify that the number is
>correct.

How do multiple people end up with the same SSN?  I understand the problem
of check digits, because people can simply make up a number that is fake
and there is no way to tell.  But what about multiple people with the same
number?  Is this just due to fraud?

David
Newsgroups: alt.privacy
From: niebuhr@bnlux1.bnl.gov (david niebuhr)
Subject: Re: Sallie Mae net address?
Organization: Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, NY 11973
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 01:12:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan4.212340.12974@burrhus.harvard.edu> glazier@isr.harvard.edu (Andrew Baker Glazier) writes:
>See subject. I want to write to them to complain about their use of my SS#
>as an account number, and failing that to flame the living hell out of a
>representative...
>-- 

I wouldn't mind this also since I've written to them and asked them to
change my account number.  From the literature they sent me, they are
barely in bounds when it comes to using the SSN as an account number.

However, it does not condone their cavaier attitude of "tough".

Dave

-- 
Dave Niebuhr      Internet: niebuhr@bnl.gov / Bitnet: niebuhr@bnl
Brookhaven National Laboratory Upton, NY 11973  (516)-282-3093
Newsgroups: alt.privacy
From: alien@boi.hp.com (Tom von Alten)
Subject: Re: Censorship vs. Boycott
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 05:52:39 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard / Boise, Idaho
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.7 PL6]

Dances with Drums (williamt@athena.Eng.Sun.COM) wrote:
:
: 	A boycott can be a means, and is in this case, to censor unpopular
: thoughts or opinions.  Anyway you cut it, it is censorship.  To argue
: otherwise is to try to create new meanings of words to suit one's
: purposes.

This is an interesting rhetoric device.  You are trying to equate to
different terms, and defend your argument by accusing opponents of creating
new meanings of words.

Boycotting is a different means of coercion than censorship.  Your own
post spells this out pretty well.

What I read in your postings is that one person making a decision about
what to read/watch/listen to, is "ok," but as soon as one (tries to)
persuade another to make the same decision, that is a form of censorship
and therefor reprehensible.  Is this really what you mean to say?
_____________
Tom von Alten
From: memco@cns.nyu.edu (Matthew Merkelson)
Newsgroups: alt.privacy
Subject: Test
Date: 5 Jan 93 23:32:54 GMT
Reply-To: memco@cns.nyu.edu
Organization: New York University

Please ignore. 
Checking problems with poster.
Newsgroups: alt.privacy