HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: motto@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (mary.rita.otto)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: Letter Got Wrong Results!
Date: 5 Jan 93 17:37:08 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

To: wey@cbnewsb.cb.att.com
I was going to email this, but thought that by posting it might help
others who are going through similar stuff but not posting.


Bill,

You have done a brave thing in writing the letter to your father.
Now you must be even brave and face the anger that will follow.

Your parents will deny everything.  They have never accepted that
there was anything wrong, and they won't want to now.  You must
stick to the truth no matter what.  Don't apologize for telling the
truth -- don't deny or back down on the truth of what you have
said.  But you can apologize for the hurt that the truth has caused,
and that may provide an opening for negotiation.

I once was being verbally abused by my father, and he kept asking me
"Why did you do that?  Why?  Why?"  until I finally snapped back,
"Because I'm an asshole, I take after you!"  He then sprang from
his chair in a fury and smashed me into a door jam.  But it was
worth it.  

My dad is still and asshole, 18 years later.  I couldn't change him.
But he knows that I know he's an asshole.  It takes away a lot of his
power to know that I don't view his as respectable, admirable, etc.
So, if he wants to be treated with respect he has to earn it.

This sounds like where you want to be with your father.  You want
him to earn his respect rather than expect it as a right.  You want
him to treat you and your family better.  You've taken an important
step with your "emperor's new clothes" letter.  Now you have to let
him know which specific behaviors are acceptable and which are not.
You'll have to show him;  cut your visits short with a brisk "We're
leaving because I don't like the way you are acting toward my wife,
and I'm just not going to tolerate this."  Then leave.  Don't ever
threaten and not follow through -- really do it.  Then wait a while
before you find an excuse to come back.  My husband and I used this
behavior training on both sets of parents, and it really worked for
us.  Even if we had just gotten there, if he started any of his BS
we just packed up and left, explaining that we simply do not tolerate
treatment like that.  This worked so well, that now, after 11 years
of using the"behavior correction" tactic, we not only haven't had to
leave early in the past 3 years, but even get apologies for minor
infractions as sort of his insurance that we won't be pissed off at
something and not come over.

It is sometimes amusing to see him still pull stuff on my siblings
but watch him stop short when it would be "my turn".

I know this will be a hard time for you, so try to rally as much support
around yourself as possible.  And remember, the goal is to create
a new, greatly improved relationship, not to destroy one.  It will
take time but will be worth the effort.  Good luck.

Peace,
Mary Otto
From: JSeymour@acorn.co.uk (Jenny Seymour)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Weight Watchers vs. ?
Date: 11 Jan 93 17:07:09 GMT
Organization: Acorn Computers Ltd, Cambridge, England


I heard many horror stories about Weight Watchers before I joined, these
included the 'Leader' making you stand in the corner with a pink pig if you
put on weight---Ugggh!!!!!!

Weight Watchers is working for me (I say for me because it doesn't work for
everyone) it gives you loads of variety where food is concerned and if you
want to go out for a meal you can - just be careful!  The people are really
friendly and they understand if you don't lose weight.  They also give out a
file-o-fax thingy which is added to every week (it is full of great ideas).

The best thing at the moment is that it is free to join (normal cost M-#9.00)

I joined 9/11/92 and have lost 11lb since I joined - not brilliant but
better than losing 4 pounds per week and putting double on the next week.
From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 20:59:45 GMT
Subject: Re: Weight Watchers vs. ?
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet

Re: the pink pig.  Many years (circa 30) my mother was going to TOPS (stands
for Take off Pounds Sensibly...) and they had some variant of the pig.
There was a pig floating around, and it could be 'won' each week.  Don't know
if TOPS is still around, but it was pretty informal back then, and not terribly
well suited to my mother's needs.  For what it's worth, she found WW to be
too inflexible, but Jenny Craig is working quite well for her.  She's
maintaining pretty well so far.

Saw that pig several times in my mother's possession...

Pete Brooks (what fun, obesity/overweight runs on both sides of my family)

Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan)
Subject: Re: I survived the holidays
Organization: Titan Linkabit Corporation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:55:28 GMT


I guess I survived...  I only gained 4 pounds.  :(  But hey, the
nat'l average for weight gain over the holidays is 6 pounds, so
I'm 2 pounds better off than the average.

I actually did really well until about the week before xmas.  My
boss started bring in goodies, then everyone else caught onto the
idea and brought in goodies.  And something happened to my usual
aloofness to goodies, it disappeared.  So then I went on kind of
a sugar/fat binge.  I felt so overfed the entire time, it was truly
an unpleasant feeling.  The good news is that I pushed myself
mercilessly on the Nordic Track, and that helped a lot.  It wasn't
until I had to stop skiing (because I moved over the holidays and 
had to pack it away) that I started gaining.

After all the relatives left, and the holidays were over I'm still 
left with cravings for sweets and fatty things, but I'm getting it 
under control.  And I've nearly got enough room in my new apartment
cleared of boxes, that I can set up the Nordic track again.  My
backache from moving is healing too, so no more excuses about not
exercising. 

Well, here's to a fairly successful year folks!
--
Nancy P. Milligan 				npm@dale.cts.com
Titan Linkabit					cts!dale!npm
		  Gravity is no laughing matter.
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: mazur@bluefin.camb.inmet.com (Beth Mazur)
Subject: Re: getting back on track
Organization: Intermetrics, Inc.
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 15:07:35 GMT

In article <> jfrawley@mothra.syr.EDU (Judy Frawley) writes:
>In article <1342@blue.cis.pitt.edu> jsl+@pitt.edu (John S Lundberg) writes:
>>The Thanksgiving-New Years period was not the highlight of my
>>diet/exercise program.  I suppose I could call forth all kinds of
>>explanations but none really hide the truth: I slipped, and 
>>badly; the question is whether I'll fall or be able to get back
>>on track.  I have to wonder if I had really learned what I thought
>>I'd learned or if I was just kidding myself.  I thought I'd turned
>>a corner but I guess motivational geometry has a few wrinkles I
>>haven't yet mastered.
>
>Keep up the good work.  It's not easy..I have tried and failed so
>many times, but I feel strongly about it this time and have finally
>realized that there is no quick solution to anything.  

I like this quote by Calvin Coolidge--I think it helps to keep this in
mind when dealing with the ups and downs of the dieting process:

	"Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence.
	 Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful
	 men with talent.  Genius will not; unrewarded genius is
	 almost a proverb.  Education will not; the world is full
	 of educated derilicts.  Persistence and determination 
	 alone are omnipotent."

Or perhaps you might like this one attributed to Confucius:

	"Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising
	 every time we fall."

I also like this one by Sophia Loren (!):

	"Mistakes are the dues one pays for living a full life."

In other words, the only real failure is the one that happens when
you give up.  All your perceived "failures"--like gaining over the
holidays (like I did)--are simply experiences you can learn from. 

Beth Mazur                   "...life is more than a vision.  The sweetest
mazur@inmet.inmet.com         part is acting after making a decision."
...!uunet!inmet!mazur                                  -- The Indigo Girls

Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: charlene@boston.sinet.slb.com (Charlene Glatkowski)
Subject: Re: a question or two.
Reply-To: charlene@boston.sinet.slb.com (Charlene Glatkowski)
Organization: Schlumberger Technologies CAD/CAM Division
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:30:00 GMT

In article <1992Dec31.133902.22842@newstand.syr.edu>, mprisco@puma.cat.syr.edu () writes:


|> > Also, anyone have any suggestions for a really good exercise video?  The
|> >very thought of spending an hour a day with Jane Fonda makes me want to 
|> >gag

Agreed.

I'm partial to Victoria Johnson's videos - she's fun & has a good work-out
in about 30 min. Her workout is low-impact with hand-weights, and hits all the 
major problem areas - hips, abs, butt, arms ( I have the "H.A.B.I.T. WORKOUT"). The music is funky and not corny (like Jane's - :) IMHO) 

I've also started taking step & aerobics classes at a health club for extra
motivation. I like working out with other people.


Much luck!

PS exercise is a natural appetite supressant as long if you give yourself
a healthy amount of carbs (pasta, bread, fruit, cereal...)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: I survived the holidays
From: parks_typ@med.wcc.govt.nz
Date: 13 Jan 1993 03:39:19 GMT
Reply-To: parks_typ@med.wcc.govt.nz
Organization: Wellington City Council, Wgtn, NZ
NNTP-Posting-Host: blade.wcc.govt.nz

In article <1993Jan4.163608.8600@chpc.utexas.edu>, jbyrd@chpc.utexas.edu (Jan Byrd) writes:
>Spent 8 days after Christmas with my older sister who has finally gotten 
>control of her weight (for about the last 2-3 years).  Much as I admire how 
>great she looks now and how she's keeping it off, I kept feeling like she 
>was trying to control what and how much *I* ate during the visit.  Maybe I'm 
>just feeling paranoid about it (because I'm heavier than she is these days), 
>but I found myself feeling sort of oppressed and deprived during the visit 
>and sort of contrary and perverse now that it's over, like, "I'll eat a lot
>now to make up for it".

I'd feel exactly the same if I were in that situation.  As it is, my father
tries to help (I think) by saying things like "eating again?!" or staring and
frowning when he sees me eating, which just pisses me off and makes me paranoid
about eating, so I go and hide somewhere to eat.  

I have quite a problem eating in public, maybe because of this or maybe it's
natural guilt because I'm overweight.  I feel like if someone sees a fat person
eating they think "no wonder he/she's fat"

Anyway, my point was I don't think you're unjustified in being annoyed at your
sister's controlling of your food intake.  She should have asked if that suited
you.




Rachel                           "Supergoof!"
                                    -  -
                                    O  O
                                      >
                                     \_/
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: jessica@wrs.com (Jessica Hart)
Subject: Re: Exercise Problem - Advice Needed
Organization: Wind River Systems, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:39:16 GMT

In article <Jan.5.13.34.39.1993.13156@gandalf.rutgers.edu> shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan) writes:
>
>Is it really difficult to use a rowing machine with only one leg?  It
>seems to me that you would loose balance.
>
>


I have a bad back and, if I were going to keep one leg relaxed,
I would keep the other one relaxed too. I would suggest using
both legs or neither.
Using just one leg might put a little twist into your form.


jessica@wrs.com
From: shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Exercise Problem - Advice Needed
Date: 6 Jan 93 15:49:12 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

Thanks for the suggestions.  Even though I have access to the pool,
it looks like I'm not much good at dragging my ass over there after 
work.  I prefer to go home, have dinner, relax, and then work out.

So thats what I do.  For the past two nights I've been doing a 
short low impact aerobics routine, but I haven't been moving my feet.
I keep my feet still and bounce up and down and just do the arm
things.  I alternate the bouncing with knee lifts, but no moving
from side to side or backwards and forwards, and definately no
turning.  I haveto keep it short because it gets really boring
after a while when you can't move.

I have to wear wrist weights to work up a sweat though.  Then I do
some work with weights - actually quite a bit.  I keep the 1 pound
weights on my wrists and use 3 pound dumbells and do a lot of different
arm exercises.   Then I do my lower body.  I do a series of leg, butt, and
abdominal exercises.  Then a cool down routine.

This whole thing manages to increase my heart rate a bit and make
me sweat a little.  I definately feel like I've burned some calories
afterward because I am ravenous for carbs and water.

I've got to make sure I vary the routine so I don't get bored, but
it seems to be working so far.

It says on my tape that you should only work with weights every other
day.  Can I do my upper body two days in a row if I do different 
exercises?

Does doing an aerobic routine wearing wrist weights count as working
out with weights?

-- 
Susan R. Hagan (shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu) 
Publications Coordinator - User Services
Rutgers University Computing Services
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: annie@whoville.manassas.ibm.com ()
Subject: Re: Weight Watchers vs. ?
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 12:19:48 GMT
Reply-To: kehleyr@vnet.ibm.com
Organization: IBM, Federal Systems Company

I just joined WW last weekend - our local group has free registration
until end of Jan (I think) - and it's $12/week.

I think that it's a lot of work to get started - YOU have to figure out
what you're going to eat and plan it and everything.  BUT I think
that once I get going, this plan will work much better than Nutri-System
did (at least for me).  Nutri-System took off the weight, but once I reached 
maintenance, I gained it back (well not all of it - I had lost 26, and 
gained 19 back).  But WW is kind of like Nutri-System's maintenance from the 
start.  I assume once I reach WW maintenance - the only difference will maybe be
that I can eat slightly more - I won't have to switch from pre-packaged
no-brainer food to figuring out what I'm supposed to eat.

I'm lucky - my husband wants to do this too (but he doesn't want to actually
go - just eat the meals I plan).  At least I don't have to cook 
different things for each of us.  (Ha - as if I would.  We're both
working people and each have just as much "spare" time as the other - 
I'd make him cook his own stupid meal if he didn't want what I was making :-)

Thanks for listening to my blatherings.  Wish me luck on my first week! :-)

Thanks,
Brenda J. Molina                                     kehleyr@vnet.ibm.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"What must I do to convince you people?"		 "Die."
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan)
Subject: Re: skin
Organization: Titan Linkabit Corporation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 19:05:40 GMT

mprisco@lynx.cat.syr.edu wrote:
> 
> Now for today's gross subject:  Skin.  What a difference it
> makes losing 80lbs when you're 16 and losing it when you're 34!
> Will my skin ever catch up?  Seriously, most of the goo on my
> upper arms is just skin, will this tighten up?  Anyone have
> any advice/experience?  Thanks!

Yeah, age makes a BIG difference.  I'm 34 too and I've got droopy
skin around my knees, on my thighs and my boobs.  I hate it.  I think
it *may* be getting better.  It's been about 1.5 years since I've
lost 60 pounds.  I'm glad I didn't wait until I was any older to lose 
weight.

I did read about an older man, in his 50's or 60's, who had 7 pounds
of skin removed from his stomach after he lost 100's of pounds.  

--
Nancy P. Milligan 				npm@dale.cts.com
Titan Linkabit		San Diego, CA		cts!dale!npm
		  Gravity is no laughing matter.
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: sjryan@iastate.edu (S. J. Ryan)
Subject: Re: Weight Watchers vs. ?
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 07:13:11 GMT


Susan,

	The local weight-loss group you mention sounds good, but be sure
you check out the diet they recommend.  If it's a good, low-fat,
balanced diet, it should be okay.  Weight Watchers, at least when
I attended, didn't have you do any charting.  Sometimes that can be
helpful.  Sometimes it's a pain!  Anyway, WW is planned by a Registered
Dietitian, which makes it a good plan, but your lecturer makes a lot of
difference, and there is the cost to consider.  It is not interrupted
every few weeks to start a new session, though.  Also, at least
here in Iowa there are breaks on registration right now.  I assume
that's nationwide.  They do that frequently when they introduce a new
portion of the program at the beginning of the year.  The program is
constantly being improved.

	One thing I particularly like about WW, although it can also be a
problem is that, to a large extent, you are made responsible for food
choices.  You can have chocolate, etc.  You don't "give up" certain
foods.  I like that, because it's a more normal way of eating.  But it
doesn't work for everyone.

	Hope this helps.

Sandi


Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: dabay@morse.cns.vt.edu (Marian Dabay)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Step Aerobics (Was Re: a question or two.)
Date: 12 Jan 93 14:48:58 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech, Blacksburg, VA

In article <63620133@hpcc01.corp.hp.com> zornow@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Claudia Zornow) writes:
>mazur@bluefin.camb.inmet.com (Beth Mazur) writes:
>
>> This month's Shape has a pretty comprehensive review of new videotapes,
>> broken down into strength training, step, aerobics, and stretching 
>> categories.  

>Beth, would it be possible for you to mention a
>few of their top-rated videos, at least in the step category?

Ditto above, could you please post the top two or three for
each category.  I love doing aerobics and would like to start
doing step aerobics, but I hate paying for videos and then 
finding out that they're junk.   The video stores around here
don't carry very many videos to rent, so it's hard to know
which ones are good before buying them.

Thanks,
Marian Dabay
dabay@morse.cns.vt.edu


Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: jfrawley@mothra.syr.EDU (Judy Frawley)
Subject: Keeping My Resolutions!
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 16:53:43 EST

Well, awhile back (just after New Year's), I sent a note to this
group stating that I had resolved before New Year's to get into
action and get 30 minutes of activity each day.  I have been 
doing it!  It's not everyday that I can actually "exercise", but
when I can't go out for a walk, I get up off the couch and clean
my apartment, being sure to include scrubbing the bathtub, sink,
and toilet and vaccuuming.  When I'm feeling sort of yucky at
work, I put on my coat and walk four times around the outside
of the quad.  Boy, what a difference!

I have been fortunate enough to visit the gym my sister works 
at in Cooperstown and take advantage of their pool and walking
track (once, but a trip is planned for this weekend, too).  I've
done my aerobics tapes (Charlene Prickett is my personal favorite)
and can now exercise *through* the commercial breaks and not die
of exhaustion.  

In short, I'm trying to vary my exercise activities as much as
possible.  I feel really good.  Despite the fact that I am now
suffering from a miserable head cold, my spirits are up.

Oh, yes, one other amazing thing - I put on a belt this morning
that I have not been able to get on for a few years, and it 
actually went around me!  I could only get it to the first 
notch, but I consider this a major victory! ! ! And, I've
lost 4 pounds!

The eating habits are changing now that I am exercising.  It
sure is a motivator. Suddenly, I don't really want the french fries.
I am feeling better about myself and am
recovering from the very painful breakup with my boyfriend and
adjusting to life alone again.

I appreciate all the wonderful email messages I got from my
original post. Baby steps are better than no steps at all.  

Judy Frawley

------
From: shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Exercise Problem - Advice Needed
Date: 5 Jan 93 18:34:39 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

mazur@bluefin.camb.inmet.com (Beth Mazur) writes:

>In article <Jan.4.11.19.27.1993.15638@gandalf.rutgers.edu> shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan) writes:

>Rowing might work (if you had access to a good rowing machine).  It
>is *very* aerobic, a good total-body workout, and very easy on the
>joints since most of your weight is on your butt.  If the injury is 
>really severe, you can actually row "one-legged"--don't strap your bad
>foot into the machine and don't use it to push off.

I would have to do it that way since I can't put any unnecessary pressure
on my ankle.  My father might have a rowing machine (he has all kinds of
things like that - he collects exercise gadgets but rarely uses them).

Is it really difficult to use a rowing machine with only one leg?  It
seems to me that you would loose balance.

I've received a lot of suggestions via e-mail.  Most of them suggested
a water aerobics program of some kind.  Unfortunately, the local pool
is on a limited schedule for Winter break, which makes it tough to work
it into my school schedule.

It was also suggested that I do floor work, only that I do it as fast as
I can in order to increase my heart rate.  The person who said this 
called it a type of "circuit" training.  I'm not sure what circuit training
is, but what she described seemed ackward to me, although I might give it
a try.

I played it safe last night and did my Jane Fonda Lower Body Solution
tape.  The first half is aerobics, but the second half is all floor work,
concentrating on the lower body.  It was all sit ups and leg lifts.  I
did the second half only.  I'll keep trying.  I think the most important
thing is to get myself into a routine, no matter what I actually do.  I
just have to get into the habit of doing something on a regular basis.
Then, when I can do more, I will.  I was really worried about loosing 
my motivation because I can't do much.

Thanks for your help.


-- 
Susan R. Hagan (shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu) 
Publications Coordinator - User Services
Rutgers University Computing Services
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet