HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: The Finns of Sweden
Organization: Ericsson Telecom, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:11:36 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.054933.14217@jyu.fi> ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti) writes:
>
>Would you like to enlighten me which kind institutions the State of Sweden
>organized for this minority during centuries,
>for instance in the field of Finnish speaking
>education? Some examples only, you need not explain all. Are there for instance
>still remnants of Finnish schools in W{rmland? Can you point out places?
>
 He he, you would be glad if you could find *any* kind of school up in
 Finnskogen! The money that the country side (in this case V{rmland)
 received from the government for education couldn't even cover maintenance
 of schools that taught basic education such as math, geography, swedish etc.
 Hey, this means that the people of V{rmland (V{rml{nningar) also have been
 victims of genocide! :-)

 You are saying that just because the Swedish government didn't support
 the Finns with *special* education etc, they actually *murdered* them?!

 But Jarmo, I'm still very interested to hear your answer to my original 
 question. Please answer the question this time, it's a simple Yes/No question.

 1. Do you still claim it was a complete genocide (=folkmord) of the
    Finns in northern V{rmland? Did the Swedish government kill every
    single Finn that lived in Finnskogen?

 If you answer Yes to question 1, then:

    2. How can I be alive today? Are you calling me a liar because I
       say that I have roots from the Finns of Finnskogen?
       Or maybe some aliens have been around to re-write all the
       parish registers (kyrk-b|cker)?!

 If you answer No to question 1, then:

    2. I think you owe us a public apology.
 
>Jarmo
>

 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| contact for Swedish hockey  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti)
Subject: Terveisi{ Karjalasta
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 07:54:02 GMT


N{iss{ verkoissa on ilmeisesti atk-alan ihmisi{ liikkeell{. Liikun tuolla
naapurin puolella id{ss{ jonkin verran ja tuomisina tulee kaikenlaisia
toimeksiantoja. Tapaan sik{l{isi{ yritysten johtajia jne. yksityisten ett{
valtion.

Olisi t{ll{inen ongelma:

Yritys x kysyy Suomesta k{ytettyj{ tietokoneita ja diskettej{ sek{ konttori-
koneita. Onko langoilla henkil|it{, joita asia kiinnostaisi. Minlata
saa l{hempi{ tietoja ja osoitteita, yrityksess{ ei ole spostia.
Yrityksess{ on 56 ty|ntekij{{, dipl. ins.. Etsiv{t suomesta my|s asiantuntija-
apua ja tarjoavat ty|t{ kahdelle henkil|lle, palkka ruplissa ja t{ys yl|spito.
Sopisi seikkailunhaluiselle sieluille hyvin. Paikka [{nislinna eli Petroskoi.
T{m{ firma yksityistet{{n piakkoin, siihen p{{sisi osakkaaksi my|s jos haluaa.


Toinen firma kysyy samoin k{ytettyj{ atk-laitteita.
 Samoin esim. elintarvikkeita.

Kolmas yritys j{rjest{{ mm. kalastusmatkoja, mets{stysmatkoja, mutta heill{ 
on my|s atk-alan bisnest{. Heille on s{hk|postiosoite.

Nelj{s yritys, johon minulla on my|s s{hk|postiyhteys on yksityinen kaapeli-
televisioyritys ja tarjoutuvat tekem{{n esim. yritysvideoita, todella halvalla.


Osa n{ist{ olen tavannu usemman kerran. Pari henkil|kohtaisesti vain kerran.

Muutama peruss{{nt| n{iss{ Ven{j{-operaatioista.
1. Kaikki sopimukset kirjallisesti, ei esim. faksitse (v{{rennysmahd.)
2. Kaikki mik{ menee rajan yli j{{ sinne my|s
3. Suoritukset Suomessa k{teisell{ ennen tavaran luovutusta tai suomalaiseen
pankkiin Suomessa.

He tarjoavat my|s ruplakauppaa, jolloin sen voi toisella puolella vaihtaa
valuutaksi ja ostaa sill{ tuotavaa Suomeen (vientilisenssit)

4. Atk-kama on Cocom-s{{nn|sten alaista oli se k{ytetty{ tai ei, esim.
486 prosessorilla varustettuja pc-laitteita ei saa vied{.

No miksi en rupea itse? No minun bisnes ei kohdistu tavaraan, mutta jos
jonkun kohdistuu niin ottakaa yhteytt{, kerron lis{{.

K{ytetyt kielet: ven{j{ ja suomi tai englanti. Periaatteessa  tuossa
Suomen rajan pinnassa p{rj{{ suomella, suomenkielisi{ tuntuu olevan
monessa firmassa. Ongelma vain siin{, ett{ heid{n suomi on vanhaa, eik{
oikein taivu kaupallis-teknisiin tarkoituksiin.

Muitakin projekteja olisi tarjolla: tulitikkujen valmistus, huonekalujen
alihankinta, j{{tel|n valmistus, k{ytettyjen autojen ostoa.

Myyntipuolella: huonekalut, jalometallit, matkamuistao"kr{{s{{"
,valonvahvistimia on, my|s siis pime{kiikareita.

Jos kiinnostaa niin v{lit{n yhteyksi{ ensisijaisesti suomalaisille, ruotsa-
laiset p{rj{tk||n sill{ niin hirve{n t{rke{ll{ ruotsin kielell{{n jota 
kaikki kuulema osaa joka paikassa sitten muualla.
Terveisin,
jarmo
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Moms on top of import duty
Date: 17 Nov 92 09:05:24 GMT
Organization: Chalmers Tekniska Lekskola, G|teborg, G|taland

In article <sgrenander-161192165105@mac4.jpl.nasa.gov> sgrenander@NASAMAIL.JPL.NASA.GOV (Sven U. Grenander) writes:
>Does anyone know which institution I should contact to get the real story
>about my Moms obligation ?

  Tullen?

  My recollection is that you don't have to pay moms (or import duty) if
you have used the item during your stay abroad?

>-Sven

-bertil-
--
"Ack! Phht!" - Bill the Prez
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: suopanki@stekt5.oulu.fi (Heikki T. Suopanki)
Subject: Re: Nordic languages
Reply-To: suopanki@phoenix.oulu.fi
Organization: University of Oulu, Dept. of EE, Finland
Distribution: soc.culture.nordic
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 18:25:10 GMT

>>>>> On Mon, 23 Nov 1992 16:09:04 GMT, ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti) said:

jarmo> Soeren L. Buhl (slb@iesd.auc.dk) wrote:
: According to CIA (1990) World Facts the populations are:
: Finland:  4977325
: Denmark:  5131217

jarmo> Just a shy note, Finnish is spoken outside Finland too, not only
jarmo> in Finland. 

And not everybody living in Finland speaks Finnish.

jarmo> I would not take  from
jarmo> the population of a country so direct conclusions as you do.
jarmo> There is estimated being c. 500 000 finnish speakers in Sweden alone.

I've heard 300000.

jarmo> I just like to remark  a fact that finnish is the second most
jarmo> spoken language in the Nordic countries. 

It is not so obvious that it is a fact.

-Heikki




Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik )
Subject: Re: What's wrong with Finnish? (WAS: Pakko
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 03:44:36 GMT
Organization: Apple
Followup-To: soc.culture.nordic

In article <1992Nov23.131320.26892@nntp.hut.fi>, jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki
Kuoppala) wrote:
> 
> In article <ksand-221192175001@wintermute.apple.com>, ksand@apple (Kent Sandvik ) writes:
> >Not only that, I'm from 'Pohojanmaa' and it was quite hard to follow
> >this Finnish dialect, is it 'Savon murretta'? :-).
> 
> Ei sinne p{inkh{{n.  Et sie vissiin tosihaan tainu juuri mith{{n
> ymm{rt{{ ko et sie ees sit{ hoksanu mit{ kielt{ mie koitin kirjottaa.
> Vaikka emm{ met senth{{n joka paikhaan ruukaa hootakhaan panna nii jo
> vain niit{ki sen verran oli ett{ pit{s siitt{ki jotaki hoksata.  Olet
> sie vissiin jo aika kauan ollu siel{ ameriikoissa ja muuala kulkumassa
> ko sie suomen it{rannikostaki poriset.

Funny how staying abroad opens one's mind! I apologize about using
the East Coast term, it's actually hilarious in the case of Finland.
As for Jyrki, you could try to write Finnish that all Finns also understand
:-).

Cheers,
Kent
-------------------
Kent Sandvik (UUCP: ....!apple!ksand; INTERNET: ksand@apple.com)
DISCLAIMER: Private activities on the Net.
From: tomas_e@LINK.Physchem.KTH.SE (Tomas Eriksson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Gothenburg Revisionist Mathematics (was Re: Alcoholism...)
Date: 15 Nov 92 16:35:49 GMT
Reply-To: tomas_e@LINK.Physchem.KTH.SE
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm

In article <BxpJ5K.D8o@news.chalmers.se>, d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell) writes:
>In article <1992Nov13.140258.16955@eua.ericsson.se> euafri@eua.ericsson.se writes:
>>Now, the Swedish governmental alcohol policy is focused only on
>>statistics, so its no wonder they look "good".
>
>  According to the way the alcohol problem is measured in Sweden, it would
>be regarded as being better if 2% of the population drank 15 glasses of wine
>per day than if 100% of the population drank 1 glass of wine per day.
>
>  In the first case the total consumption is only 75% of what it is in the
>latter case.

What kind of mathematics do they teach at the carpenting school of 
Gothenburg, also known as Chalmers University of Technology? :-)

I would usually say that 30 glasses of wine is 30%, not 75%, of 100 
glasses of wine. At least if the smaller number of glasses was of the 
same size as the larger number of glasses, and provided that I had not 
been drinking 30 glasses of wine just before I was asked to make the 
calculation... :-)

The Swedish parliament has set the goal to reduce the alcohol 
consumption by 30% from the year <a few years ago> to the year <in ten 
year's time?>. The methods proposed: higher alcohol tax, worse service 
at Systembolaget. They can probably make those who aren't harmed by 
their very moderate alcohol consumption drink even less, but instead 
illegal brewing will increase, I think. I don't think further reinforcing 
the state's Big Brother attitude towards alcohol consumption in general 
in Sweden is going to have any positive effects on the national health 
situation, even if they probably could lower Systembolaget's sales by 
30% and congratulate themselves on having achieved the goal. 

Unfortunately, I have no fool-proof solution of my own to offer. A
Swedish cartoon character, the infamous Arne Anka ("Arne Duck") has said 
something like: "Do they think that people drink just to be a nuisance 
to physicians and social workers? Or because they're too stupid to 
realise they should be happy about the way their lives are?" As usual, 
there's much truth in what he says...

Tomas
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tomas Eriksson                                          tomas_e@physchem.kth.se
            Surface Force Group, Department of Physical Chemistry,
               Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

"These latter-day practitioners of surface chemistry reflect a lingering of the
adventurous spirit of the Enlightment" -- Charles Tanford
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: Thomas Bjorkman <Thomas_Bjorkman@cornell.edu>
Subject: Re: Glo"gg recipe!!
X-Xxdate: Mon, 23 Nov 92 13: 50:50 GMT
Nntp-Posting-User: tnb1@cornell.edu
Organization: Cornell University
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d7
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 18:46:59 GMT

In article <1992Nov21.185320.1@acad3.alaska.edu> , fthp@acad3.alaska.edu
writes:
>Does anybody out there have a good recipe for glo"gg? 

Start with a bottle of dry, full, nondescript Califronia red wine (like
Gallo Burgundy) and some Marsala.  (I use about 2 parts red wine to  1
part marsala) Warm these and add orange peel, cinnamon sticks and whole
cloves.  Pull the spices after 10 min to 2 hours--whenever it tastes
right.  Add a little brown sugar if you must.  Ditto brandy.  Serve hot
with rainsins and blanched almonds.

Becasue the incredients are not standardized, it is impossible to give
exact times and proportions.  It is essential to keep adjusting and
tasting!  =)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: euafri@eua.ericsson.se (Fredrik stman)
Subject: Stockholmers rule! (Was: More Danes...)
Reply-To: euafri@eua.ericsson.se
Organization: Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 16:55:51 GMT


Subject says it all.

---
         ______                     _~
        (_/_ _  _  _/) _  . /)     / ) , _/)     _
       __/ _/(_(/_(/__/(_/_/Z_    (_/_/)_/__/))_(I_/)_

Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: hberg@polisci.umn.edu (Bob Hammarberg)
Subject: Re: Alcoholism in Scandinavia.....
Organization: Department of Political Science, University of Minnesota
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 19:28:44 GMT

In article <kjell-131192152548@g0-mac2.ekti.chalmers.se> kjell@emke.chalmers.se (Kjell Siimon) writes:


> I don't say that they [the Danes]
>don't have any drinking problems but they certainly not go out in the
>streets shouting -"Heeeeaaaaghhhh Hu Hu Hu"!!! after a couple of glases.
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Translation, please?
From: dgolber@aero.org (Dave Golber)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: International Language Education (WAS: Pakkoruotsi...)
Date: 23 Nov 1992 18:51:57 GMT
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation
NNTP-Posting-Host: midnight.aero.org


>The point is that often the level 
>of education reached by a person is based on his/her own
>level of desire to learn, not on the system.  

I believe this attitude is part of our problem.
In most countries, including the USA, education
is compulsory.  Why?  Because the country needs people
to be educated.  As a matter of public policy, we REQUIRE
children to go to school.  If the person's "level of desire 
to learn" was third grade ... well, that's called truancy,
and is illegal.

>Also, there
>is no "US system."  Each school system is governed by the
>local authorities, under state laws (not federal). 

Again, this is part of our problem:  In a country in which 
you can move from state to state in hours for a few hundred
dollars, we continue to pretend that all sorts of things
are "local" matters.  The statement that 'there is no "US system"'
is in fact a description of the US system!

In comparision, I understand that policy on many areas ...
such as education, is more country-wide in many places,
including the nordic countries.

Any comments?

Dave Golber
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: torkel@sics.se (Torkel Franzen)
Subject: Re: What's wrong with Finnish? (WAS: Pakko
Organization: Swedish Institute of Computer Science, Kista
	<TORKEL.92Nov20115405@isis.sics.se> <1992Nov22.162708.10459@cs.hut.fi>
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 21:22:50 GMT

In article <1992Nov22.162708.10459@cs.hut.fi> linnan@silver-surfer.cs.hut.fi 
(Matti Linnanvuori) writes:

   >"F|rest{llningen att tornedalingarna {r finnar". The Tornedal Finns
   >are Finns.

  Obviously it has never occurred to you to ask the people we are talking about
whether they are Finns. Try it and see how they react.
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: What's wrong with Finnish? (WAS: Pakkoruotsi Suomen kouluissa)
Date: 20 Nov 92 07:07:33 GMT
Organization: Chalmers Tekniska Lekskola, G|teborg, G|taland

In article <1992Nov19.073439.3662@jyu.fi> ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti) writes:
>Bertil Jonell (d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se) wrote:
>: In article <WALVER.92Nov13084010@kielo.uta.fi> walver@uta.fi (Ville Walveranta) writes:
>: >	I think it's all right to have the message threads
>: >        in Swedish in soc.culture.nordic, but so should it be all right
>: >        to have the threads in Finnish as well.
>: 
>:   Sure, but note that I've responded in English to the posts in Swedish, just
>: because a large part of the readership here don't speak Swedish.
>
>Yeah, I have started using recently swedish in this group and I am called
>a swedefobe

  So what? Many people who hate the US write in English.

  It is what you say, not how (in which language) you say it.

>Nordic group
>should use swedish, norwegian, finnish, danish,icelandic, saami etc.
>and those who cannot understand should blame themselves  and start learning
>languages.

  Over on soc.culture.african there is a person who wants to restrict posting
priviliges on the basis of color. He claims that a person is only allowed to
comment on his or her own culture and that their culture should concern nobody
else who isn't part of it.

  To me it seems like you are suggesting to restrict posting priviliges on the
basis of language. Is that the "illuminated language policies" you want 
Sweden to adopt?
 
>And I just like
>to point out to our american friends that finnish is after swedish most
>spoken language in the Nordic countries.

  One of our american friends, Cindy Kandolf, claims that Swedish, Danish and
Norwegian are so alike as to be one language. But even if they are a single
language, Finnish will still be the second most spoken language in the
Nordic countries:)

>Regards,

  I still dare you to post your defacto claim that the Nazis wasn't worse
than the Swedes to talk.politics.middle-east and soc.culture.jewish.

  Or for that matter your similar claim that the situation of the Black 
slaves in the US wasn't worse than the situation of Finnish-speakers in
Sweden to soc.culture.african.american.

>jarmo

-bertil-
--
"Ack! Phht!" - Bill the Prez
From: hyvarine@cs.Helsinki.FI (Ilkka Hyvarinen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: The Finns of Sweden
Date: 22 Nov 92 13:03:53 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: University of Helsinki, Finland

In <SUOPANKI.92Nov20170239@stekt5.oulu.fi> suopanki@stekt5.oulu.fi (Heikki T. Suopanki) writes:

>>>>>> On Fri, 20 Nov 1992 05:49:33 GMT, ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti) said:

>> You also may explain why forest-burning was banned in W{rmland on Finnish
>> areas and what followed when the Finns did not obey. You may know if
>> you are an expert on the issue.

>I may be wrong, but I think forest burning is illegal in Finland too.
>Why should have it been legal in Sweden?

>-heikki

Since you are a finn, you may have heard the words 'kaski' or
'kaskeaminen'. If not, what they mean is a controlled burning of a piece of
forest in order to grow rye or barley on that area afterwards. This was the
standard way of farming in Finland a few centuries ago. It most
certainly was not illegal. People were few and forests plenty in those
days, so there was no real danger to the forests either.

The phrase 'burning the forests' used in this discussion can very easily give
you an impression like we were talking about arson or something similar.
This is however not the case. We're talking about people growing bread
to themselves and their families.

Ilkka Hyvarinen
hyvarine@cs.Helsinki.Fi
From: pkokkone@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Pellervo Kokkonen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: What's wrong with Finnish? (WAS: Pakko
Date: 23 Nov 1992 21:22:32 GMT
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Distribution: global
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4

In article <TORKEL.92Nov23185543@bast.sics.se> torkel@sics.se (Torkel Franzen) writes:

>
>  No doubt. My point is only this, that calling these people "Finns"
>in ignorance of what they would call themselves is at best misleading.


	Your hyper-pcness is getting really annoying. No matter what
	you say, people have been and continue to be referred to in
	terms of ethno-linguistic categories. If you told me that you
	are Swiss, that would not make you any less Swede for the purpose
	here of describing the ethnic composition of the Swedish (as a 
	state)	nation.
	
	Do all Swedes always insist on this emphatic obscure subjectivi-
	zation of language?

	Pellervo Kokkonen


Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: torkel@sics.se (Torkel Franzen)
Subject: Re: What's wrong with Finnish? (WAS: Pakko
Organization: Swedish Institute of Computer Science, Kista
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 10:54:05 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.164625.15931@eua.ericsson.se> osstlm@eua.ericsson.se 
(Tomas Lundstrom) writes:

   >Can you tell us what your motives are for doing all these postings ?

   Jag fr}gar mig ist{llet vad det finns f|r motiv att g} i svarom}l
mot Jarmo Ryyti. Han sj{lv kan givetvis inte |vertygas om n}gonting.
Att han {r en stolle {r heller inte n}got som beh|ver s{gas fler
g}nger. Varf|r inte helt enkelt |nska honom lycka och v{lg}ng i livet
och ist{llet ta upp eventuella fr}gor om svenskan och finskan i mer
meningsfulla sammanhang?

   Vilka {r f|rresten dessa fr}gor? Jag har sett tre:

   1) Den obligatoriska skolsvenskan i Finland. Detta {r en helt
intern fr}ga f|r Finland och ingenting som vi i Sverige har n}gon
anledning att ha n}gon }sikt om.

   2) Det faktum att finskan inte {r officiellt spr}k i Sverige.
Detta {r f|rvisso en fr}ga som kan diskuteras mellan finnar och
svenskar.

   3) Tornedalsfinskans st{llning. Detta {r ocks} en meningsfull
fr}ga, men en fr}ga som bara ang}r svenskarna. Tyv{rr blandas den
ihop med diverse finska nationalistiska tankeg}ngar som {r
helt verklighetsfr{mmande och irrelevanta i sammanhanget,
och som bland annat visat sig i f|rest{llningen att tornedalingarna
{r finnar.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: slb@iesd.auc.dk (Soeren L. Buhl)
Subject: Nordic languages
Organization: Mathematics and Computer Science, Aalborg University
Distribution: soc.culture.nordic
Date: 23 Nov 92 16:12:30

There is a point I want enlightenment on.
Several letters in this group have stated that Finnish is the
second most spoken among the Nordic languages.
Is this true?  Facts, please!
According to CIA (1990) World Facts the populations are:
Finland:  4977325
Denmark:  5131217
I only want facts, not that Finns or Danes are better,
due to their number or anything else.

I think it was first stated by Jarmo Ryyti, but no one has
contradicted him, although I do not consider him to
be a reliable source.
As for Danes, most Finns are gentle and sensible persons, but
both af us have crackpots.
Unfortunately, there is one Finnish crackpot on the net.

Sren Buhl (for those with only 7 bits S{\o}ren)
Aalborg, Denmark
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik )
Subject: Re: The Finns of Sweden
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 20:19:11 GMT
Organization: Apple
Followup-To: soc.culture.nordic

In article <1992Nov17.131414.6904@cs.hut.fi>, f33012l@puukko.hut.fi (Janne
Kivel{) wrote:
> ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik ) writes:
> >...maybe they wanted to become Swedes :-).
> 
> Just like the Swedish-speakers in Ostrobothnia. Some of them are more
> Swedish than Swedes themselves. They are definitely very sensitive about
> their language and they are more interested in what is happening on
> the other side of the gulf than what's going on in Finland.

I actually agree (grew up in this region), Swedish dance bands rule
(sigh, Vikingarna, my favourite hate object). And if you would ask
some of the people if they would rather belong to Sweden than Finland,
they would agree.

However it does *not* reflect the majority of the Swedish speaking
part of Finland. Most of us realize that we are part of the Finnish
culture, and we belong to Finland, not Sweden.

I just wanted to clarify this issue, because we will always
have persons that complain about languages and cultures, but those
are a minority in both countries, and a rather small one actually.
Unfortunately they are loud as hell.

Kent
-------------------
Kent Sandvik (UUCP: ....!apple!ksand; INTERNET: ksand@apple.com)
DISCLAIMER: Private activities on the Net.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: sgrenander@NASAMAIL.JPL.NASA.GOV (Sven U. Grenander)
Subject: Re: Moms on top of import duty
Followup-To: soc.culture.nordic
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:54:40 GMT

In article <BxyHvL.CII@news.chalmers.se>, d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil
Jonell) wrote:
> 
> In article <Bxurx0.Ks6@news.chalmers.se> d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell) writes:
> >  My recollection is that you don't have to pay moms (or import duty) if
> >you have used the item during your stay abroad?
> 
>   Imagine my culture chock when I went to the US and saw the customs form that
> US citizens have to fill in after travelling abroad.
> 
>   It demanded that they listed every single bloody item they had bought
> outside the US and the exact value of each, and said that the customs would
> then deduct the free amount ($100 I think) and tell them how much they have to
> pay!
> 
>   If Swedish customs started behaving in that way there would be a 
> revolution.
> 
> -bertil-
> --
> "Ack! Phht!" - Bill the Prez

You're quite right, except I think it is more like $400/person and it is
not just citizens but all US residents. It's always a real pain to try to
remember everything when you are sitting on the plane trying to fill out
the little form. 

"Let's see, how much was that osthyvel ?" ... " So, that's another $2.35
..."


-Sven