From: sbo@vlsi.polymtl.ca (Stephane Boucher)
Newsgroups: can.general,can.politics,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: When do we stop being outsiders? (WAS Re: The Journal on ...)
Date: 8 Apr 92 23:51:21 GMT
	<9643@s3.ireq.hydro.qc.ca> <1992Apr1.173245.6854@cattnts>
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique de Montreal, Canada

In article <1992Apr1.173245.6854@cattnts> craig@cattnts (Craig Campbell) writes:

   In article <9643@s3.ireq.hydro.qc.ca> beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard) writes:

   >1917 : Ontario Rule XVII : no school in French

   I'm sorry, but I have some trouble worrying or feeling guilty about things
   that happened when my grandparents were young (May they rest in piece) or
   before they were born.  It is ancient history.  Interesting, perhaps, but 
   of little relevance.

So, I guess you don't think that the natives should get any special
arrangement in Canada?

   >1950's : censuses of Quebec are microfilmed.  Location names are only
   >documented in English.

   What, a name is not a name?  What is the english name for Quebec city?
   If every location was actually given a name both in french and english, then
   this is government sillyness at a real high!!  (I have to admit, I would be
   annoyed if the government tried to change my name.)
               ,
Do you write Quebec or Quebec?

   >Until 1976 and law 101 : a French-speaking could not get higher than
   >a subaltern job in many English-directed companies in Quebec

   "could not get higher"?  That is an interesting phrase.  Why could a "French-
   speaking" [person] not get higher?  Inability to communicate with the parrent
   company?  Board of directors?  Or was it a vicious nasty plot? :-)

What do you think?

   It has been my observation that companies are most interested in the bottom
   line ($$$$), and that there is a deafening indeference to other matters
   (for example culture).  If you can do the job, then generally, you have as
   likely a chance as anyone else.

Prove me your last sentence.

   >1992 : Canadian opinion is still against any special power for Quebec.

   Canadian opinion (as far as I can see it) is against special power for anyone!
   We are all equal.  Why should any one specific group be given special power
   which is denied to all the other groups?

Well, English Canada can certainly get the same power that Quebec could
get. We would then have a decentralised country. But what happens is that
English Canada wants a strong central government. Then English Canada says:
we don't want those powers so you won't have them.

   >Francos are some 5-6 millions in a see of 250 millions
   >of English-speaking and they can challenge the 250 millions language!
   >Are we that powerful?

   I don't believe that anyone wishes to erradicate the french language or
   culture.  I do suspect that some groups are fostering that fear for their
   own personal gains.  

Regardless of whether you are right or wrong, I'm curious: What is your
tought of the past.

   Why don't other cultures in canada also have this fear.  I have some personal
   experience with German, Italian, and some Oriental cultures and have never
   detected any fear of their culture dieing.

What would be your reaction if tomorrow morning Canada would become
officialy unilingual francophone?

   >Almost no calendar published by an Anglo-Canadian company say that 
   >June 24 is Quebec National Day.  This includes many calendars 
   >distributed inside Quebec.

   Well, for one Quebec is not a nation.  For another, the calendar's already
   have John the Baptist (St. Jean de Baptiste Day (Quebec) ) on the calendar.
   (My office calendar has the French spelling.)

Maybe its time to do a little study. Check about 100 calendar and count the
number of calendar that contain a mention of "Ma fete Nationale".

   >Federal forbids any publishing of documents proving that Quebec
   >secession can be done economically.  Last year, C.D.Howe institute
   >got a blame for such a document.

   Perhaps because it can't be done economically.  I don't know.  But if Quebec
   did leave, they could definitely take their share of the national debt with
   them.

Maybe, but what's with the opposition of a statement that it could be
economically good to seperate? Why do you care? Why do people in English
Canada care?

   >Recently, a Ottawa university published a work demonstrating that 
   >Native were better treated in Quebec than in TROC.  Why the impression
   >of opposite shown by canadian press?

   Perhaps there were other studdies, done by other reputable organizations
   concluding the opposite.  It is not uncommon for various studies to 
   contradict each other.  Especially about things that are subjective, such as
   "How well you are treated".

Then why don't your press show both sides of the studdies?

   Nothing, including Canada is perfect.  

Especially not Canada!!! Maybe Quebec is the exception that confirm the rule.

   I have no support for national multilingualism.  Provide services in 
   languages appropriate to the area/region.  (You know, if there is a demand,
   then make a supply.  Not this supply whether there is a demand or not.)
   This applies to english as well.  If there is no english presence, then 
   why waste money by doing stuff in english?

How do you define demand? Where do you draw the line to decide whether or
not you provide a given service?

So far I have asked a zillion times to the people who use "where nubmer
warrants" or "where there's demand" what this means exactly. I'm still
waiting for the answer.
 
   What ever happened to people just being nice to each other?  You know
   "neighbourly, friendly, tolerant"?  Perhaps it was just an urban legend.
   Too bad.  Sigh...

I don't know. Ask that question to your neigbhours.

Pendant que j'y suis, Gerald, je ne t'ai pas oublie. J'attend toujours la
signification du P dans Gerald P Heckman. Au cas ou tu aurais perdu mon
adresse de courrier electronique, regarde la fin de ce message.
--
  ,                          ,                           ,
Stephane Boucher, ing. jr. | Ecole Polytechnique de Montreal
sbo@vlsi.polymtl.ca        | 
sbo@info.polymtl.ca        | (514)340-5950
Newsgroups: can.general,can.politics,soc.culture.canada