HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: A1000 connector specs for passthru (Dave?)
From: rayz@koko.csustan.edu (Ray Zarling)
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 92 17:59:37 GMT
Organization: CSU Stanislaus

In article <3445@tronsbox.xei.com> tron1@tronsbox.xei.com (Kenneth Jamieson) writes:
>
>	Ok, a week or so ago I posted about the C.LTD passthrou I had.
>It is just a card (about 3/4 inch wide) that is a copy of the A1000
>connector card edge. It has NO chips. Just a straight trace for every
>line on the bus.

Not quite true.  I used to have one, and it had the power lines tied
together.  At the time I bought it, someone at CLtd told me it was
carefully engineered, a 4 layer (!) board.  It was really a tricky
part, to reduce bus noise problems.  Personally, I could not tell from
looking at it if it were 4 layer or not, but it seemed like one of
those marketing "exagerations" to me (he was trying to explain why
they were charging $20 for it).  But I could easily see that all the
+5 and Gnd lines were tied together with traces and vias.

>	I received almost >50< requests for it!
>
>	Now, I only had one, but it seems that maybe a lot of folks
>could be helped if someone in authority (Dave H. or someone with
>specs) could give a little how to on how to etch a homebrew one of
>these (with that r-shack etch kit maybe?).

Well, I don't have any "authority" other than as a user.  I no longer
have the "real" CLtd pass-through, but I still have the controller.
I am now using a makeshift pass-through, which is just a piece of
pc fingers, 43 contacts per side, .1 inch spacing, that I cut off an
old pc board.  It connects my CLd controller to an Alegra expansion,
and works exactly as well as the old "real" one did (near as I can
tell).

--Ray Zarling
  rayz@csustan.edu
From: hennes@blade.stack.urc.tue.nl (Hennes Passmann)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: MFM HD controller
Date: 14 Apr 92 17:55:20 GMT
Organization: MCGV Stack, Eindhoven University of Technology, the Netherlands.

Here in MCCV STACK we have two harddisks with an ONTI-controller runnung on an
Amiga 500.   They are not powered by the A500 powersupply(!!!).
Performance is relatively low but adequate.

Note that an ONTI-controller is >>HARD<< to get, other controllers might work
but at least one not-omti does not.

If you find any controllers other than the omti that do work please mail us
    
                                Succes.. H.passm.
  

  
 !!500 a500

 ------
From: dfisk@level10.UUCP (David Fisk)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Orientation of A2000?
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: Amiga GRn V1.28 2/25/92 (Beta) by Mike Schwartz
Date: 13 Apr 92 22:47:39 EST
Organization: Dave's Amiga

In article <XJk2iB1w164w@satori.equinox.gen.nz> geoff@satori.equinox.gen.nz (Geoff McCaughan) writes:
>jtillema@cs.arizona.edu (John E. Tillema) writes:
>
>> > The official advice is though to low-level format a harddrive when 
>> > changing its orientation.
>> 
>However the "official advice" above is bogus. You can reorient hard
>drives any which way you want. There is not need to low or high level
>format them.
>
Well, before I moved up to a 3000, my old 2000 had a Seagate 277N that would
return read errors if I moved the case from normal to standing on its side
without low-level formatting. This was with an original GVP controller. At
the time I was carting it back and forth to school between semesters, at
school I used it laying flat and at home I had it tower style. It worked
flawlessly if I re-formatted it (low level, not just AmigaDOS) after moving
it. Of course it helped to back it up first. 8-). BTW the Seagate install
guide (mostly PC info) recommended doing this.

Dave...
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
  David Fisk - dfisk%level10@merk.com          ...uunet!merk!level10!dfisk
From: ericb@athertn.Atherton.COM (Eric Black)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Will the Blitter become redundant?
Date: 8 Apr 92 00:58:39 GMT
Reply-To: ericb@Atherton.COM (Eric Black)
Organization: Atherton Technology, Sunnyvale, CA

In article <3417@tronsbox.UUCP> tron1@tronsbox.UUCP (Kenneth Jamieson) writes:
>	Here's that ignorance thing again. This is EXACTLY the stuff
>.advocacy IS for.

True enough.  Which is why the complaints about it in .hardware, which
is where it does NOT belong.

So now I not only have to have my kill file look for articles posted by
Marc Barrett, in all his reincarnations and different userids, but also
now a large number of articles *about* Marc Barrett.

Sigh.  Signal 1, noise 5.  Postgame wrap-up at 11.

-- 
Eric Black	"Garbage in, Gospel out"
Atherton Technology, 1333 Bordeaux Dr., Sunnyvale, CA, 94089  USA
  Email: ericb@Atherton.COM    Voice: +1 408 734 9822   FAX:  +1.408.744.1607
From: dsg6397@cs.rit.edu (David S Greenberg)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: LXT-100
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:15:30 GMT
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology, Rochester, NY

In article <4643@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil> rovero@oc.nps.navy.mil (Josh Rovero) writes:
>Now that we are talking maxtor lxt-100s drives I've got a couple of 
>observations and questions too.
>
>My manual for the lxt-100S says that it uses 3 of the regular 220/330 ohm
>terminator packs.  The drive only has room for two 11-pin packs, or
>maybe 10 pin packs with some special jumpers.  I've *never* seen an 11-pin
>pack, but the sockets are labelled from pin1 to pin 11 AND the outline
>for the "rp" goes from pin 2 to pin 11.  Maybe I have a very early
>drive, but it sure doesn't match the manual.
	
	My manual doesn't say much about termination...just "Terminate
the SCSI bus on both ends" type of stuff. No detailed diagrams of the
PCB (Well, there is a diagram, but it is not detailed enough)

>
>Also, the number of cylinders reported by the drive (756) is more than
>that listed in the manual (733).
>
	I just checked my old lxt 100 drive parameter file (saved by
the Hardframe RDprep program) and it says the drive reported 733 Cyls.


>I haven't been able to get the drive to work terminated (internal in an
>A3000) but it works pretty well as the first drive (unterminated) with
>the Quantum 52 second.  The Maxtor does seem to develop read errors
>on very large files.  The errors are consistent, so maybe you'd better
>say write errors on large files that don't get detected until subsequent
>reads are performed.

	I had mine "kind of" on the end of the scsi bus (my tape drive
was hanging off the end of the Maxtor (which was the second drive in the
system) and the Maxtor was Terminated, the tape drive was not..(it was not
powered on all the time.)
	I never had a read/write error on the Maxtor...big or small files.

	But I did have some Tape drive problems..(I had a Cipher 540 SCSI)
	Since I got an Archive 2150S, (w/termination) everything works
	flawlessly. I have the 213SY (terminated) mounted on the SCSI
	card, and the Archive powered on all the time (Mounted internally
	in the 5.25" bay (also terminated). 

						Dave
From: raymondu@terapin.com (Raymond Ulibarri)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Okidata Ol-400 driver
Date: 6 Apr 92 23:53:37 PST
Organization: Not an Organization

   The Okidata OL400 emulates the Hewlett Packard LaserJet Series II laser
printer.  Pull that printer driver into your devs:printers drawer and you're
set.
   
   Raymond Ulibarri
   VP, MultiCon
   Multimedia Concepts
   (510)261-1001
From: mx8@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: A2065/AS225 works fine with Slingshot!
Date: 13 Apr 92 23:00:22 EDT
Distribution: comp
Organization: Cornell University



      The A2065/AS225 Ethernet system from Commodore works just dandy on an
A500 with Slingshot, a low-cost single-slot A2000 adapter.  It also works 
when plugged into the bus-pass through of the Supra 500XP.

      Many thanks to Micro R&D and Industrial Color Labs for making this test
possible.

      Eric Beyer, Cornell University

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: jas54553@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jerry A. Segler Jr.)
Subject: Re: C=64 files to AMIGA
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 20:59:43 GMT

>Does anyone know how to copy files from the C=64 to the Amiga?
>I know it's possible using a 0-modem cable..
>But I want to disectly connect the 1541/1581 to the Amiga, and then simply copy
>the files..
>How can I do this ???

I believe (saw this but don't know if true) that a64v2 (64 emulator) on ab20
says that if you register, the author sends you a little hardware dongle that
allows you to connect c64 devices to the parallel port... It wouldn't be that
hard to do actually and probably works fine.... Look into it and see what's
up...

-Jerry
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.hardware:8844 comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:12593
From: janin@v785.stanley.co.jp
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Atari Falcon (wasn't: Amiga Falcon)
Date: 15 Apr 92 08:49:11 GMT
Reply-To: janin@v785.stanley.co.jp ()
Organization: Stanley Electric Co., Ltd. R&D

In article <1992Apr14.001701.546@imada.ou.dk> micro@imada.ou.dk (Klaus Pedersen) writes:
>
>daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes:
>
[about Atari TT]
>>Does it have a Blitter ?
>
>No need for one.  The reason for the Blitter is to remove instruction-
>fetch overhead from memory operations, and with the 68030 on-chip
>cache, the TT does just fine without it.

100% sucked CPU time does just fine for such monotask machines.
Not for our Amiga.
That's why we have a Blitter.

P-chan. Hestet Killer Forever.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: peterk@public.sub.org (Peter Kittel)
Subject: Re: Orientation of A2000?
Organization: Public News & Mailserver, Commodore Germany PM UNIX, Frankfurt
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 92 16:01:49 GMT

jtillema@cs.arizona.edu (John E. Tillema) writes:

>In article <1992Apr06.095850.23924@public.sub.org>, peterk@public.sub.org (Peter Kittel) writes:
>> d87mt@efd.lth.se (Magnus Thelander) writes:
>> 
>> >Would it be harmful to use an A2000 with a hardcard, when it's
>> >standing on its short side?
>> 
>> No. I had it working for years like that. Then I rearranged my desk and
>> now have the same A2000 (with PC-side hardcard) sitting normally again.
>> No problems.
>> 
>> The official advice is though to low-level format a harddrive when 
>> changing its orientation.

>Okay, sounds easy enough, but how do you do a low level format?  When I
>got my 2000HD, there was no low level format program on the install
>disk.  

Well, err, I must confess that the hardcard in the above mentioned A2000
(still) sits in a PC slot, and those PC hardcards have a low-level format
command in their BIOS. So I can invoke DEBUG (under MS-DOS) and jump to
that C800:0005 (or near that). Can't tell you any trick for low-level
formatting of an Amiga-side HD.

-- 
Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to  \\  Only my personal opinions... 
Commodore Frankfurt, Germany  \X/ {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmger!peterk
From: ee23042f@vttcf.cc.vt.edu (Zaphod Beeblebrox)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: A3000/Toaster
Date: 14 Apr 92 03:25:46 GMT


  What exactly does the modification entail?  Is it just widening the slot
  opening to accomodate a BNC connector?  I'm having some trouble picturing
  this, since I haven't actually seen the Toaster card.

  Also, there was some mention of having an Amiga dealer do this.  If I could
  find one that would, would it still invalidate my warranty?

  Thanks in advance!

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% ;-) %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Brian Wentz     
Virginia Tech                          wentz@csugrad.cs.vt.edu          
703-232-2300                 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: skipper@motaus.sps.mot.com (Skipper Smith)
Subject: Re: A2320
Organization: Motorola Semiconductor, Austin, Texas
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 16:41:20 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.163750.25042@motaus.sps.mot.com> skipper@motaus.sps.mot.com (Skipper Smith) writes:
>I am having a problem with my SECOND A2320 (I sent the first one back with
>similar problems, so I am beginning to doubt that the problem is actually in
>the A2320).  
>First, my setup-
>   Amiga 2000
>   GVP 40 MHz '030 accelerator (with 4 MB RAM installed)
>   GVP Series II controller (also with 4 MB of RAM installed)
>   100 MB hard drive and 150 MB tape hooked up to the Series II so I can use
>them even if the accelerator is disabled)
>   A2320 (properly grounded according to my meter)
>   ADOS 1.3 (cause I have been too lazy to upgrade, though I have 2.0)
>   lastly  1 MB Agnus, new Denise

Oh yeah, if it matters, I am using a Princeton Ultra 1400 monitor (NTSC to
1024x768) with the factory supplied cables.



-- 
Skipper Smith                             | skipper@wmtowdc.sps.mot.com
Motorola Technical Training               | 8945 Guilford Rd  Ste 145  
All opinions are my own, not my employers | Columbia, MD 21046
From: barrett@astro.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: A3000T power problem
Keywords: A3000T
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:28:33 GMT
Reply-To: barrett@astro.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett)
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst

>woofie@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (the real woof) writes:
>>I've had my A3000T for just 5 days, and I'm already suffering problems.
>>[hardware problem deleted]

In article <mac1.702783643@Ra.MsState.Edu> mac1@Ra.MsState.Edu (Mubashir Cheema) writes:
> I wonder how come you didn't call Commodore. Their reputation on 
> warranty repairs is *EXCELLENT*...

	Commodore can't do anything for you until your Gold Service
application is processed.  This takes 1-2 weeks after they receive the
application.  Before this time, your dealer is responsible for DOA and
warrantee stuff.

                                                        Dan

 //////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
| Dan Barrett -- Dept of Computer Science, Lederle Graduate Research Center |
| University of Massachusetts, Amherst, MA  01003  --  barrett@cs.umass.edu |
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\/////////////////////////////////////
From: tdenbo@dwp.la.ca.us (Tom Denbo)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Hand Scanners
Date: 10 Apr 92 14:21:48 GMT

Does anyone have any experience with hand scanners?  I'm thinking about
getting one for scanning research papers and using the new Migraph OCR
software to convert the scan to text.  This could save me much time, plus
give me whole articles instead of partial quotes.  

What I'd REALLY like to have to complete the set is a portable Amiga!
Has CBM come to an agreement with guys proposing the Model 10?
--
       //     Tom Denbo                   111 No. Hope St.  Rm 732
      //      PD&C Workstation Support    Dept. of Water and Power
    \X/       (213) 481-3376              Los Angeles,  CA   90051   
===================== INTERNET: tdenbo@dwp.la.ca.us  =====================
From: Scott.Maxwell@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Scott Maxwell)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Death of Pirating
Summary: Hoax. Gotta be a hoax. Gotta be a hoax. Gotta be a hoax....
Date: 12 Apr 92 11:32:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: samba.1992Apr12.113249.17688
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service

In article <1992Apr9.005213.4701@cheshire.oxy.edu> leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt) writes:
>Crossposted:
>Summary: Special hardware to stop piracy, using the AFD-technique
>Keywords: chip, piracy, AFD, Gail
>Message-ID: <1203@lysator.liu.se>
>Date: 8 Apr 92 09:36:51 GMT
>Sender: news@isy.liu.se (Lord of the News)
>Organization: Lysator Computer Club, Linkoping University, Sweden
>Lines: 31
>
>One use of the Gail-chip I have not heared someone on the net mention yet, is
>that it incorperates the AFD-technique.
>The first time you use a new Amiga you have to enter a personal code, wich then
>gets burnt into the Gail chip. Then each time you use new commercial software,
>this code is transfered to the disk (even if it's write-protected).
>Each time you use the disk after that, it compares the two codes, and if they
>don't match, the computer will be permanently blocked, and only CBM service
>people, will be able to reset it, and they are told to notify the police
>immediately, if an blocked amiga arrives.
>You could try to copy the disks before the code is transfered, but Gail will
>sense it and erase the disks.

Gee, what a good idea. So you can't buy software second-hand and use it on your
machine, you can't borrow a friend's disks to test-drive software, you can't
buy a new Amiga and still use your old software (unless you take your Gail
chip with you -- what a pain in the ass), and you can't use the same software
on more than one machine in your home, even if you abide by the law and never
use more than one copy at one time.

CBM is *almost* stupid enough to do this ... but not quite. This had better
be a joke.

--
Scott Maxwell (CSMAXWEL@ECUVM1.BITNET or Scott.Maxwell@bbs.oit.unc.edu)

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: asl00@ccc.amdahl.com (Andrew Lee)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: A2091 controller plus two scsi drives
Date: 17 Apr 92 00:06:15 GMT
Reply-To: asl00@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com (Andrew Lee)
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1992Apr16.193722.4399@sarah.albany.edu> hibrown@vidar.albany.edu (Herb Brown) writes:
>I have an A2500/30 with an A2091 controller and two Quantum hard drives. One is
>the original 40 meg and the second is a 105 meg which I added about a year ago.
>Everything has been OK. My friend also has an AS2500/30 with the A2091 controller
>and a 40 meg drive and wanted to add a Quantum 120 meg. He has been unable to do
>this without problems. Does the 120 cause difficulties that anyone is aware of?
>I would appreciate any e-mail responses.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Herb
>
>-- 
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Herb Brown  Math Dept  The Univ at Albany  Albany, NY 12222  (518) 442-4640
>hibrown@sarah.albany.edu or hibrown@thor.albany.edu or hibrown@bst.albany.edu
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Make sure the A2091 has rev 6.6 roms.  I remember reading that pre v6.6
roms had problems moving data between multiple SCSI devices.  Should
cost about $20 for the two rom set.


Andy
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Lee                             
<asl00@juts.ccc.amdahl.com>
(408)746-8561
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jtillema@cs.arizona.edu (John E. Tillema)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Orientation of A2000?
Summary: Okay, how do you do a low level format?
Date: 6 Apr 92 17:31:15 GMT
Organization: U of Arizona CS Dept, Tucson

In article <1992Apr06.095850.23924@public.sub.org>, peterk@public.sub.org (Peter Kittel) writes:
> d87mt@efd.lth.se (Magnus Thelander) writes:
> 
> >Would it be harmful to use an A2000 with a hardcard, when it's
> >standing on its short side?
> 
> No. I had it working for years like that. Then I rearranged my desk and
> now have the same A2000 (with PC-side hardcard) sitting normally again.
> No problems.
> 
> The official advice is though to low-level format a harddrive when 
> changing its orientation.

Okay, sounds easy enough, but how do you do a low level format?  When I
got my 2000HD, there was no low level format program on the install
disk.  I could use hdtoolbox (and would _love_ to be able to), except
it doesn't work with the 2090a controller.  So the only format I can
do is the normal Amiga format command.  Any clues as to how to do this
low level format?  (And if I did it on a PC using fdisk, would
that work/count as a low level format? I have 2 ST-506 drives attached)

Thanks,
John
jtillema@caslon.cs.arizona.edu
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.hardware:8425 comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:11907
From: genoa@athena.mit.edu (Jack Holt)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Will the Blitter become redundant?
Date: 6 Apr 92 11:13:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: athena.1992Apr6.111317.6927
Organization: Massachusetts Correctional Institute of Technology

In article <29964@cbmvax.commodore.com> daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes:
>
>Chip improvements, however, track Motorola CPU improvements pretty closely in
>transistor count, which is a reasonable measure of complexity.  The original
>chipset contains more transistors than the 68000, and even a moderately
>improved version would come close to the complexity of a 68030.  If we were to
>do one that does everything you and everyone else seems to want (not that have
>any illusions you would actually buy a new computer), we could very easily get
>to 68040-level complexities.  Even Motorola has trouble with that level of
>design complexity.  Obviouly an Amiga chipset doesn't need to cram 300,000 or
>1,000,000+ transistors into one package, but that's not to say such a design
>is simplified by a multi-package implementation.  

Hmmm.  All this talk has me daydreaming.  You could cram a lot of the
Amiga chipset into one package, pop it on a board with a 680x0, some ROM
and RAM, and have a great little toy.  You could put it in a case the
size of a book, and call it a PowerBo.... no, I guess not.

Well, I know it's not all that easy, but conceptually it's just so
appealing....
From: jdrew@nesbbx.UUCP (Jim Drew)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: VXL-30
X-Organization: NES BBX +1 503 640 9337
Date: 14 Apr 92 00:12:08 PST
Organization: NESBBX Bulletin Board System

.>  How much does a thermoelectric cooler cost and where can I get one? I am
>heavily overspec'ing a 68881 and if it was possible to get my hands on one
>of them for less than I fear it might cost, I just might...
>
>  How cool can it make a small package get anyways? I think 20 US degrees
>is about -6 in the rest of the world isn't it? That's decent...

 bought a box of the thermoelectric coolers for $25 each..they retail for
bout $40.  I will them for $25 plus postage (about .29 cents!)  :-)

---
.************************************************************************* 
*    Jim Drew - Vice President | Utilities Unlimited of Arizona, Inc.   *
*                                1641 McCulloch Blvd. Suite #25-124     *
*                                Lake Havasu City, AZ  86403            *
*   Support BBS: (602) 453-9767  Office: (602) 680-9004                 *
************************************************************************* 

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: rhhageme@eos.ncsu.edu
Subject: 2000 problem
Reply-To: rhhageme@eos.ncsu.edu
Organization: NCSU
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 04:21:38 GMT

I have a problem...Whenever I attempt to power up my amiga 2000, The computer
locks up and I have to reboot.  I have determined that the time of lockup
occurs when the rom attempts to access the floppy drives.  Often, when a disk
is in one of the drives, the disk will spin and the light will come on, but 
nothing else will happen.  I am booting off a hard drive, and I have not found
a way around this problem.  Often, after many reboots, I can get through to my
computer, but I will still not be able to access my floppies. 
HELP...Any ideas?



						Thanx,
						Rich Hagemeyer

------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
Rich Hagemeyer                  		INTERNET: rhhageme@eos.ncsu.edu
North Carolina State University 		

All thoughts here and above are to be considered my own; Heck, no one
else wants
them!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------