Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: liuyh@vis.toronto.edu (Yuanhui Liu)
Subject: Re: Japanese Imperial Army Was Invited by CCP?
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 8 Sep 92 19:45:50 GMT

In article <15297@umd5.umd.edu> yunson@lpf.umd.edu (Yunson Du) writes:
>Dave McLane posted his followup in scj. Please reply
>to scj in order to be effective.
>
>============================================================
>Article: 18002 of soc.culture.japan
>From: davidg@aegis.or.jp (Dave McLane)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan
>Subject: Followup: Chinese communists & Japanese Imperial Army
>Message-ID: <2551@aegis.or.jp>
>Date: 3 Sep 92 02:04:38 GMT
>Organization: Aegis Society, Kyoto Japan
>Lines: 57
>
>Last week I made mention of how some people in the discussion groups
>I lead said that the original entry of the JIA into China was at the
>request of the then rebel, now current communistic government in
>order to defeat the nationalists. Followup's asked for sources of
>their idea so I asked them for details this week.
>
>First off, the two people with the most definite informaiton said I
>was mistaken in using 'invited'; 'tricked would be a better word.
>Sorry about that. 
>
>As I think I may have mentioned before, one woman was born in Manchu
>and came to Japan when she was 14. She said that IHE people tend to
>forget that China was a very poor place before the war and she felt
>that Japan was helping the economics situation by taking over
>Manchu. This is not to say that the militaristics JIA didn't get out

Yes, yes, we have to really thank Japan for monopolizing opium
sail in the Northeast China("Manchukuo" if you prefer it), that
really generated so much wealth for the people there!  We also
have to thank all that weapon factories they built there, which
Stalin's red Army shipped to Siberia at the end of '45. 
Let's face it, it was a poor relatively place before and after 
the Japanese invasion, the only people who got reach was
the Japanese invaders and their family, taking gold & silver
and raw materials to finance Japan's conquest elsewhere.  

 
>of hand and so terrible things, but only that it wasn't always
>Japan's intention. But she had to hard information to present, just

True, the JIA's intention was to fuck everyone and then kill them,
some soldiers did got out of hand and killed people without
fucking them first.  

>her personal rememberances of living as child of an administrator
>in Manchu.

Why a Japanese adminstrator?  I thought Japan told every one that
"Manchukuo" was an independent country ruled by an Manchurian Emperor
-- all except his secretary is a Japanese General and Japanese MPs
guard his palace, and his heir will be a half-Japanese nephrew of
his, and the Japanese army will kill all his unloyal subjects for him,
and run his army, police, railway, bank, and mines for him.  

>
>The other person is now about 55 and was thus 10 at the time: he
>remembers begging chewing gum from American G.I.'s in the streets of

He didn't know any chinese kids chewing grass roots after the Japanese
army finished with their village and their mothers, did he?

>Osaka. He said that a few years ago NHK had a special TV documentary
>on the infamous Marco Polo brigde incident in which it was claimed
>that after some shots were fired, the local commander looked around

Let's see, the Japanese was the one that was staging a military exercise
on the night of July 7th, 1937 -- And they don't have any LASER simulation
gadgets there, you are telling me they have a soundless exercise?  And
the KMT and CCP are the only ones fired shots?  How pathetic!  

>and found 2 or 3 of his men missing. While actually they had gone to

Gee, they did this before, didn't they?  2 or 3 man missing and fear
dead, assisnated by chinese troops, after all, isn't that the same
story on the night of September 18, 1931?  where the Japanese
Army attacked the Chinese Army with the same reason, and led to
the Occuptation of 3 Chinese provinces.  Now, were there any CCP
tricksters there on Sept. 18, 1931 in the city of ShenYang?  
It's idiotic to use the same lie a couple of times, and the lie
was a really lousy one too, but the Japanese generals didn't really
care, did they?


>take a piss (always a good idea under stress :-), he reported them
>missing to his commander and the commander ordered him to open fire.

>The Chinese nationalists claimed that no shots had been fired, but
>later, according to a secret document, it was shown that the Chinese

Which document?  an NHK document?  a JIA document cooked up at the time?
we all know all true those are -- the JIA was always the innocent lamb
that is being attacked by much inferior and ill-prepared enemy?  
And of course, whenever attacked, the JIA always happened to be
totally prepared, ammunititions issued, air-planes standing by, 
artilleries in supporting positions, communications between 
divisions are surperb, warships off Chinese coast.  My God, they
are truly the master race!  On the Chinese side, the attacking
armies were still sleeping, -- we deserved to be conquered.   

>communists had fired the shots to bring the JIA into their war
>against the nationalists. He says further evidence can be found in
>//Sekimatsu Kara Mita Daitoa Senso// (loosely translated as "The
>Great East Asia War: Views from the End of the Century") and

His view is pretty blurry, and distorted.  
After Dec. 1936, the communists and nationalists decided to ease
fighting, develop a joint anti-agression policy, and would not
back down to anymore Japanese provocations and threats, and that really
enraged the Japanese, and really TRICKED them into attacking china.  

>contains a collection of articles by various professors at Japanese
>universities. 
>
>Both these people feel the current Japanese government doesn't owe
>the current Chinese government an apology. They feel that an apology
>is owed to the Chinese people but they don't see any way of this
>happening as the current Japanese government is controlled by
>(paid) politicians and there is no way for them to express themselves.
>
>[In another group there is a woman who is now 71 and remembers well
>the sound of the planes firebombing Osaka/Kobe but this is too
>painful for her to talk about and the other members of that group
>respect her aversion to discussing the matter in any detail.]

well, my external grandmother remembered dressed up like a man
in hiding and in horror from the JIA for many month, that her kid brother 
& cousins machine-gunned down by Japanese gun boats for playing near river 
bank...on my father's side the entire family remembers the
Japanese air-raids of then War Time Capital ChongQing, I am glad the
Japanese didn't invent the B-29, the communists would trick them
to fire-bomb chinese cities too, thank god.   

Remind them why Japan was fire-bombed, perhaps the American trickery of
inviting the Imperial Japanese Navy to a cruise in Pearl Harbor
should ring a bell.  

>
>Again, please note: This is not my opinion. I am only reporting
>what people told me. My part is to ask them questions. 
>
>Dave
>
>--
>Dave McLane 
>JUNET: davidg@aegis.or.jp (ONLY within Japan: post otherwise)
>Nagaokakyoshi, Kyoto Japan Tel: +81-75-951-1168 Fax: +81-75-957-1087
>
>==================================================================
>
>Yunson Du
>University of Maryland
>College Park, MD