From: comfrank@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Frank Tutzauer)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.brewing
Subject: newbie questions
Date: 20 Aug 92 22:35:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Several different permutations of the address bounced, so I'll
post.  It's of reasonable interest anyways...

In article <1992Aug17.163342.3774@brtph560.bnr.ca>, you write...
>
>I hope y'all aren't tired of hearing from us newbies, but I've been
>reading this group attentively for the past couple of weeks and I've
>decided to take the plunge.
>
>So far, I've bought Charlie's book and read significant portions of it,
>bought a large (3 gallon) enamel on steel pot from K-mart for $12.50,
>and visited my local brew shop to have a look-see.  I have about six
>cases of the old squat Canadian returnables (from before they got the
>marketing itch to do twist-offs) to use as bottles.

Before you actually get down to bottling, try capping a couple of the
empties to make sure they'll work.  I don't know precisely the
bottles you are talking about, but I once tried to use Red Stripe
stubbies, and my capper wouldn't take them.  Fortunately, I drink
enough that I had a bazillion other bottles around, so it was no
big deal, but if that's all you've got, check it out first.

>However, I still
>have some questions:
>
>Question #1:  I have the addresses of several mail-order places from
>the net, and I intend to write and get catalogues.  I thought in the
>interest of time, though (I really would like to get started) someone
>could give me an idea as to whether this "starter" kit from my local
>shop is a good deal:

>For $44.00, you get:
>7 Gallon plastic pail fermenter with gasketed lid and drilled for
>stopper.  Bottling spigot attached.
>3 feet of bottling tubing
>Three piece fermentation (air) lock & #2 drilled stopper
>delux double level bottle capper w/caps
>Bottle cleaning brush
>Automatic bottle filler (glass tube with valve at bottom)
>Triple scale hydrometer
>"Brewing Quality Beers" book (I think the author is Byrun?)

This will certainly be sufficient.   And by all means, get
that carboy.  .....   A couple of things you might
want to add:  a funnel with a strainer, for times when you want
to rack from kettle to carboy; a carboy brush (necessary for
cleaning the shoulders of the carboy); a racking tube (this is a big
cane shaped tube, with a little deal on the bottom that makes
it sit up about a quarter inch so you don't pick up crud from
the bottom of the kettle--siphoning from the kettle is preferable
to pouring because there's less splashing involved).

I would also buy about an extra 5 feet of syphon tubing.  That
way you can syphon from something high (like your stove or
counter top) to something low (like a fermenter or bottling
bucket on the floor).

The Byron Burch "Brewing Quality Beers" is a good one.

$44 sounds like a good price.

>Question #2:  I've heard a lot about 1 and 2 stage fermenting, and
>I'm still foggy on one thing - if I were to do a 2 stage fermentation
>and use a pail (as in the above kit) for my first stage, would I still
>attach the fermentation lock for that stage?  If not, do I plug up the
>hole?  I was thinking that I'd buy the kit above and buy an
>additional glass carboy for the second fermentation.

Until you get a second vessel (carboy or another bucket), you're
obviously stuck with single stage.  (But you're going to buy
that carboy, aren't you?  :-)   When you switch to two-stage,
yes, you still put the fermentation lock on the bucket during
the primary (first stage).  If you plug it up, the CO2 will have
no place to go.  Some will dissolve back into the beer, but you
might pop a lid, too.  Just put the fermentation lock on, and
you won't have any probs.

>Question #3:  I assumed that I only needed a wort chiller if I was
>doing all-grain brews, since you need to boil all of your wort, rather
>than just part of it.  Am I right?  I know that it is important to cool
>the wort quickly, but Charlie suggests that you just pour it into the
>cool water in the fermenter and wait (he also says not to use ice in
>the water - is there a reason for this?).

All-grain brewers definitely need a wort-chiller, but extract brewers
can profit from it too.  You can boil the whole volume, giving you
better hop extraction.  Also, you get a better cold break.  But
don't sweat it if you don't have one yet.  I just built mine for
batch #20 and #21.  Batches 1-19 didn't use a chiller, and turned
out fine.

As far as Charlie's suggestion of pouring it into cold water, that
will work, but it promotes splashing a bit too much.  (Splashing
of HOT wort promotes oxidation.  Splashing of COLD wort is
necessary to aerate it for the yeastie boys' reproduction phase.)

I used to cool my wort in the kettle.  What I often did was to freeze
a two gallon ice block several days before brewing.  I would
then boil about three gallons of wort.  (Of course, with a three
gallon kettle, you'll only be able to boild 2, maybe 2 and 1/2
gallons.  So your wort will be even easier to chill.)  When done, I
plunked the ice block into the wort (be careful--that wort is HOT).
In an hour or two, the wort was cool.  I then swirled the wort
vigorously so that the hop crud and break material collected
in the center of the kettle.  I would then rack off the crud,
add the yeast, and top up to five gallons.

The problem you face, though, is your pot is only three gallons.
I was lucky.  I had an eight gallon stock pot before it even
occurred to me that I would brew my own beer.  Perhaps you
could rack into your bucket and add the ice to that.  Or maybe
just a cold-water bath.

I don't remember Charlie ever saying anything about using or not using
ice.  But I'm forgetful.  Maybe he meant don't use ice straight out of the
freezer (contamination probs).  I used a sanitized tupperware container
for my ice.  Sanitized milk cartons would work, too.

>Question #4:  I planned to do my first batch from a kit, but it seems
>easy to use non-hopped extract and add the hops yourself.  Should I
>try it on my first time out?

Yes.  The only bad batch I ever had was my first, where I followed
Charlie's advice to use a hopped extract.  Hopped extracts are
notoriously low on hops.  Mine turned out so sweet it was undrinkable.
Even now, over a year later, it's too sweet to drink.  I have
since made other beers from hopped extracts, and they have turned
out ok, although still a little sweet for my tastes.  But as a
beginner, unless you have someone recommending a particular
hopped extract for you, it's just a crap shoot, and you may
crap out, like I did, which is a real bummer for your first batch.
So.  My advice is use unhopped extract, and add your own hops.
It's really no harder.  You just boil longer (60 min. vs 15),
and have to choose a variety and quantity of hops, but there
are plenty of recipes to guide your decision.

>Question #5:  My brew shop suggests adding priming sugar in each
>bottle, but Charlie suggests batch priming by adding the sweetener in
>a pail (I thought I could use my first stage fermenter) and siphoning
>the wort into it.  The reasons I was given for the bottle method was
>risk of oxidation of transferring the beer.  Should I be concerned?

Most people recommend against bottle priming, because you can't
put the same amount in each bottle and you therefore end up with incon-
sistent carbonation.  Plus, I would think it would be a pain, although
I've never tried it.  What I do is dissolve three-quarters cup
of corn sugar in about 2 cups of water, boil fifteen minutes,
cool, and put it into my bucket (what you're using for your
primary).  I then rack into the bucket, stirring gently with
my sanitized spoon.  Very little oxidation.  Now until you
get a second container, your bottle bucket IS your fermenter.
Maybe you could just stir the sugar syrup straight into it.
You'll need to get a thorough mixing, but don't stir too
violently or you'll churn up all the yeast/crud on the bottom.
I bet it'll work, though.

But you're going to get that carboy for a secondary, aren't
you.  Then just rack into the bottling bucket as above.

>Thanks for any input.  I've tried to do my homework, but there's
>nothing like the voice of experience.

Amen.

--frank