HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gavrila@imhfhp16.epfl.ch (GAVRILAKIS Spyros IMHEF DME EPFL)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: SORRY FOLKS
Date: 16 Apr 92 07:58:53 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne



I received two e-mail messages from the US from people being unhappy
about unfavourable news items on the Greek economy. I suspect this will
bother others who did not feel inclined to respond. So :
 1) I am very sorry to have upset u. I hoped to jolt those that thought
    everything will be ok. I do not suppose that many Greeks know what
    "stage 2 of EMU" is. It will probably results in that, circa 1996,
    Greece will be distanced from the EC decision making and possibly
    irreversibly isolated. Thus, criticism is not lack of concern but
    can be evidence of it.
 2) News media I quoted are long-established, widely-respected, read by
    all missions and goverments and available all over Europe. Even if
    one could prove bias -not possible for a layperson- they still merit
    attention as they reflect current opinion (right or wrong) of those
    that posses power. One ignores them at his own peril.

The folloing quote by some Greek -whose name escapes me - may be relevant :
"People must be able to change or they are doomed"

Still yrs, Spyros Gav. EPFL, Switzerland.
From: gavrila@imhfhp16.epfl.ch (GAVRILAKIS Spyros IMHEF DME EPFL)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: ERM : GREECE STILL OUT
Date: 6 Apr 92 15:55:34 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne




Last week Portugal applied to join the the EEC Exchange-Rate Mechanism (ERM).
They hope that the Escudo will be admitted in the wider band (6%) group
of currencies.

'Joining the ERM is meant to tie Portugal closer to the EC. Mr. Cavaco Silva
(the Prime Minister) called it a "fundamental decision so Portugal can keep on
the path to European economic and monetary union." '

The request leaves GREECE the only EC member ouside the ERM.

Source: the IHT(Europe).
Spyros Gav.
EPFL, Switzerland.

(Note : When Portugal joined the EC in the mid-80s, it was classed
 the poorest member. This position is now occupied by Greece. )
~
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.bulgaria,soc.culture.turkish
From: gd8f@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (Gregory  Dandulakis)
Subject: If Against Turkey? Then it is a lie.
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 22:57:33 GMT


                ___> Tax Based on Blood (or Race) Discrimination w.r.t.
               /                      WHO Pays It.
"Blood Tax"= --
               \___> Tax Requiring Blood (Boys) Payment (Instead Of Goods)
                                 w.r.t WHAT Someone Pays.




Obviousely Mr. Parabliek chooses the first interpretation and fails to
understand the second one.

Even the first interpretation, substituting the word Race with Religion,
justifies the word "Blood Tax".

He makes the immensely STUPID parallelism of modern military draft
with the Jannissary (Devsirme...) system. He again fails to see that
the former PROMOTES the ties of the new generation with its ancestral one,
while the latter ALIENATES the new generation from its ancestral, tranform-
ing them into CRUEL persecutors of their natural relatives.

Finally he almost tries to justify this into the Medieval context,
failing again to realize the "pioneer" work of the Ottomans in 
Social Engineering, even under Medieval Age criteria. Not to mention
that these "novel" cruelties hardly justify the selfclaiming "progressive"
nature of the Ottomans. Exactly the opposite, they nicely explain the modern
racial composition of the Turkified ex-christians of Turkey etc.

Three policies:

              1. 1 out of 4 children (in families with 8-10 of them in
                 average) were forcefully brainwashed to Ottoman muslims.

              2. Methodically isolated; by breaking them in time and space;
                 by avoiding homogenous population areas with forcefull 
                 em(im)migrations; and most importantly by leading the poor
                 countrymen slums, the core of potential rebelion's army, to 
                 slow exhaustion from a heavily discriminatory taxation system
                 (christian vs. muslim).
                 (Direct and continous brutal force would have resulted
                 in an immediate overturn of the minority's rule).

              3. By giving privileges to the ambitious and experienced economic
                 and religious leaders of the subjects, they were able to 
                 weaken the necessary leadership for the liberation of
                 the subjects.

made possible the creation of a numerous new people from an extreme
minority and conquering one.

(No parallel of the bulk Islamization with the bulk Christianization holds.
The christians were for more than 3 centuries the underground growing spi-
ritual force, persecuted by the then Roman empire. When Konstantinos, a fierce
ex christian-killer emperor was transformed to christianity just hours before
his death, finally the christian spiritual momentum broke free to conquer the
hearts of the people).

And for those people who WITHSTOOD this gradual cultural conversion-
extermination for 500 years is DESERVED far more ADMIRATION than for 
those who GAVE UP.


Gregory Dandulakis
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
From: skevos@seas.smu.edu (Paraskevas Evripidou)
Subject: e-mail address for the University of Cyprus?
Organization: School of Engineering and Applied Science
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 22:53:08 GMT

Does  anyone  know if  the   University  of  Cyprus   has  an internet
connection or any other type  of connection that  can be reached  from
the internet.  In their leaflet they mentioned that they are connected
to EARN.   What    is EARN? They   list    their   e-mail  address  as
UNICYP%CYEARN (actually they don't  use "%" instead they use something
like the paragraph symbol that does not exist in my keyboard !!).  Our
systems people couldn't find such an  address in their databases.  You
can e-mail your response directly to me post to the net.

Thanks 

Skevos Evripidou
skevos@seas.smu.edu
Xref: sparky soc.culture.greek:3179 soc.culture.bulgaria:584
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wednesday, 8 Apr 1992 05:12:58 EDT
From: <PXP111@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.bulgaria
Subject: Thanks to the Bulgarian Media

Please sent many thanks to the Bulgarian Media for their Broadcasts in Greek. w
e can reseive Sofia at the U.S.A. and have the chance of knowing what is going
on in that country & how people there feel. It is important for communication
between the neighboring nations. I don't know if there is a broadcast in Englis
h. Perhaps there is but I am still searching. Happy Orthodox Easter!
                                                  "Andronikos Romanos"
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Thursday, 9 Apr 1992 02:15:50 CDT
From: <U21729@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: LOOKIN' FOR LOVE

HI FELLLOW GREEKS.  YOU KNOW I HAVE A FRIEND NAMED GREG DEMOS, WHO'S HALF GREEK
 AND HE'S LOOKING FOR A NICE GREEK GIRL, BETWEEN 5'2" AND 5'8", 21-27 YEARS OF
AGE, AND EDUCATIONAL LEVEL DOESN'T MATTER.  ANYWAY, GREG IS CURRENTLY UNEMPLOYE
D, AND HE IS RECEIVING $700 A MONTH FROM "UNCLE SAM."  HE'S A PRETTY GOOD-LOOKI
NG GUY, STANDING 6' AND WEIGHING 170 LBS.  SO ANYONE INTERESTED, PLEASE CALL
HIM ANY TIME IN HIS HOME TOWN, JOLIET AT (815)744-1738.

P.S. NEAY!!!!  MATH IS JUST A TOOL.
From: cc433336@LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Constantinos A. Caroutas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Re: Continued comparisons of economies
Date: 7 Apr 92 02:21:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: yuma.1992Apr07.022139.38903
Organization: Colorado State U. Engineering College

In article <9204070130.AA11881@kocrsw06.delcoelect.com>,
c23st@KOCRSV01.DELCOELECT.COM (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos) writes:
>
>> 9. Crude birth rate per thousand population: 30
>
>Nothing to be proud of. Not that Greece's 2 per 1000 is
>any prouder either.... 

Greece's crude birth rate is 11-12 per 1000. It's the population growth
rate that's 0.2%.

>> 12. Urban population as a share of total population: 47%
>
>Hmmm. Same as in Greece. Nothing to be proud of.

Why not? Colorado's is above 60% and they are proud...

Constantinos A. Caroutas
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.turkish
From: 89u1569@csdvax.csd.unsw.edu.au
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Re: degrees
Date: 6 Apr 92 15:08:09 +1000
Organization: University of New South Wales

In article <1992Apr4.020631.7578@aeras.uucp>, kotinis@aeras.uucp (John Kotinis) writes:
> In article <1992Apr2.223932.1693@csdvax.csd.unsw.edu.au> 89u1569@csdvax.csd.unsw.edu.au writes:
>>
> .....................(he said)
>>	Ofcourse the question is who is the better Engineer. That is a question
>         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>for those in the know. Oh don't flame I am studying in Australia a combined
>>degree. Mechanical engineering and computer Science. ie Two courses that share
>>subjects. There is a program that you can take together and complete both in 5
>>years (One is a Three year and the other a four) How do you tell Dikatsa to
>>rcognise both (Or either) ? I will end up with two degrees but will it be
>>recognised ?

	I was misinterpreted and it's prob my fault. What I mean is that the
one to be employed would be the better engineer (for the case of engineering
degrees) The question is what is the level of engineering in Greece ? I think
it's quite high considering the gear they have but how does it compair with the
rest of the world. (This is just a question as i don't know)


>>
>>	And onother note. Somebody I new finished Uni in Greece as an Architech
>         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>I think you will find him in omonia now ... inside a periptero !!! Well they
>>say it's got better pay, look at all the mags he get's to read.
>>	George T.
>>
> 
> The fact that this person is somewhere in omonoia, and ....inside a periptero!!
> doesn't mean that he is not a good engineer. 
> If Greece needs 1000 architects, and there are more than 2000, then
> some of them have to find another job.

	That's my point. There are so many of them Greece is trying to protect
it's own. I mean if one students makes it into a Greek uni and does 5 years
of work and another les sucsesful one doesn't and goes overseas and finishes in
4 years ... it might not sound fair. 

> But, this doesn't give us any information, doesn't answer the question
> if they are good engineers or not.
> 

	Definately not. In Greece it's a function of How good you are, how
stuborn you are, how much you love the country, and finaly and most times more
importantly who you know !

> And one more note. Somebody I know, has a degree from a technical university
> (electrical engineer), and I'm sure you'll find him, doing what?
> He is a security guard in the company i work for. (to paizei fylakas)
> So what? 

	Well we should be worried because if eg. I'll spend 5 years at Uni and
then another year at the army. Then I want to start my career. Many cases it's
also a year or two to learn the language in the new country and 18 months of
army in Greece. That woulds amount to a decade. Add a masters ...
	We would like to start living a normal life in Greece.
                                                              
> Yannis Kotinis
> e-mail aeras!kotinis@sun.com 

> George T.



Xref: sparky soc.culture.greek:3168 soc.culture.turkish:4019
From: ko@cns.umist.ac.uk (Kutluk Ozguven)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.turkish
Subject: GREECE: HARASSMENT AGAINST TURKISH MINORITY
Date: 7 Apr 92 15:20:10 GMT
Organization: UMIST, Manchester, England.

Subject: GREECE: HARASSMENT AGAINST TURKISH MINORITY

Copyright Hinter Press Service 1992, all rights reserved.  Permission to re-
print within 7 days of original date only with permission from 'newsdesk'.

Title: GREECE: HARASSMENT AGAINST TURKISH MINORITY ALLEGED


washington, mar 30 (hps) -- the turkish minority in greece is
harassed by police, discriminated against in education and
religion, and denied free expression and even the right to control
its own charitable institutions, according to 'helsinki watch,' a
major u.s. human rights organisation.

only 102,500 turkish greeks remain in the country, down from about
210,000 in 1923, according to the human rights group's report.

the decline is due to ''an appalling history of pogroms and
expulsions suffered at the hands of the greek government,'' the
report says.

the report was issued amid rapidly rising tensions 
between the government of prime minister mitsotakis
and the macedonian minority in the north, and could be
expected to further damage greece's human-rights image.

helsinki watch urged the mitsotakis government to grant to the
turkish community all civil and political rights enjoyed by other
greek citizens, to end degrading treatment of the turkish
minority, and to accord turks the freedom to establish, manage
and control turkish schools and charitable institutions.

and it asked the administration of president george bush to
condemn greece's abuse of the turkish minority -- something which
washington has steadfastly refused to do in the case of the 
macedonians.

turks in greece told helsinki watch, whose findings were based
on a recent mission there, of being called in by police and
threatened with expulsion or violence if they did not cease
participation on turkish charitable boards.

others were warned not to speak badly of greece while abroad,
according to helsinki watch.

it also said that turkish children are not permitted to study
turkish history, while students are discouraged from speaking turkish.
(more/hps)

greece: harassment (2)

in addition, the turkish minority has been denied the right to
control its religious institutions in spite of guarantees
contained in international agreements.

in particular, the elected muftu of the muslim turkish community
is moved from his office by force last year, and elections have not
beed permitted since then. (end/hps/92)
From: UCNICK@UMUC.BitNet (Nick Gavrielatos)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: What makes krugman unimpartial
Date: 16 Apr 92 03:36:11 GMT

>Well, the problem is that we are not talking about trained eyes.
 
Mutlu>What makes 'Krugman' 'un-impartial,' 'zavalli.' The fact that
Mutlu>that you disagree with him?
 
Not exactly you turkish hemorroidal discharge, not exactly...
 
What makes krugman unimpartial is not that he disagrees with him,
but YOU agree with him, you stinky ass lying bastard!!!!
 
Nick Gavrielatos
To Sixameno Plasma
UCNICK@UMUC
 
/********************************************************************/
/* You are a liar mutlu-malak, you are one big allah-damn liar      */
/* BANANA REPUBLIC TERKIYEKI CHICKEN                                */
/********************************************************************/
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
From: jon@lindy.Stanford.EDU (Jon Corelis)
Subject: "Ideal" restaurant in Athens
Organization: DSG, Stanford University
Date: 11 Apr 92 16:36:14 GMT

   I've heard that the "Ideal" restaurant, one of the oldest and most
popular restaurants in central Athens, has been closed because of
fire.  Does anyone know if it's opened again yet?  I hope to be in
Athens soon and would like to go back there -- if it still exists.
Thanks for any information,

                                     Jon Corelis 
--


Jon Corelis               jon@lindy.stanford.edu
Stanford University       BITNET:  BA.JYC@RLG.STANFORD.EDU
From: c23st@KOCRSV01.DELCOELECT.COM (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: House demolitions (does he ever know what he's talking 'bout?)
Date: 7 Apr 92 13:44:06 GMT

Hasan quotes some source:

> "Greece's Housing Policies Worry Western Thrace Turks"
> 
> . ...Newly built houses belonging to members of the minority
> community in Dedeagac province, had, he said, been destroyed
> by Evros province public works department on Dec. 4.

Would be interesting to notice that in Greece any house built without
the proper paperwork is subject to, and often the victim of, demolition.

Illegal building (a popular Greek sport) is one of the main reasons so
many places in Greece look "random" (true Hellenic feel there),
without proper connections to utilities, city planning, etc. Turks or
Martians or Greeks, many many times, the bulldozers get them.

I realize it is unfortunate but I can think of many cases that houses
have illegally been built in the middle of right-of-way of streets,
on flood plains, on sites subject to mud-slides, etc. At any of these
cases the results are predictably tragic. 

Building not only means new houses but unplanned additions or
alterations to existing houses. Most of the victims of an early 80's
earthquake were because of two extra floors (illegal) in a 
multi-storey (flat?) building and removal of various structural
elements of the same building to facilitate a restaurant in the
basement. Illegal? yes. Would you rather bulldoze it with people
dead after the earthquake or before with no people?

40 houses in a large province over 5 years are not all that many. 
That comes to 8 a year. I can think of cases of people complaining
of 8 demolitions a week in the province I used to live. None of them
were Turks. In fact, in some of Athens' less famous suburbs, populated
mainly with Greeks of Anatolia (anadolu ? :-)) suffered from very 
acute bulldozer-itis. Agioi Anargyroi, Nea Philadelphia, Sourmena,
etc etc. 

> Sungar added that they had received harsh treatment by the
> security forces during the demolition.

Some of said Greeks even tried to tie themselves onto their homes to
save them. They were removed by force as well.

Maybe bulldozing homes is a stupid idea, but have you ever seen American
style subdivisions pop up overnignt in burned out forests?

'Spiros' (undistinguished Alumnus of ATEI Piraias, Civil Eng. Technology)
--
'Spiros' 'Triantafyllopoulos'                c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com
Software Technology, Delco Electronics       c23st@deaes.uucp 
GM Hughes Electronics, Kokomo, IN 46904      [A Different Kind of Disclaimer]
From: pef@dcs.qmw.ac.uk (Panayotis Fouliras)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Re: " Akousate ... Akousate"
Date: 13 Apr 92 14:25:38 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, QMW, University of London

Peri tinos prokeitai Levon? Me sygxwreis alla den katalaba.
Epi pleon exe yp' opsin ta eksis:

Eite ta Skopia, allaksoun onoma eite oxi, tha itan anoisia na
thewrithei oti ksemperthepsame me dautous.

Apo o,ti fainetai syntoma tha tous anagnwrisoun me to onoma
Makedonia, ektos (isws) an deiksoume oti eimaste apofasismenoi
na min tous anagnwrisoume me to onoma Makedonia. Alla, akoma (i
xeiroteri periptwsi) anagnwristoun, tipote den xathike.

1. Ef oson i Ellada den tous anagnwrizei, episima oute kai i
EOK tous anagnwrizei

2. Synergasia gia ta dikaia twn Ellinwn meionotikwn ekei pera
tha apotelouse moxlo piesis (estw kai ean stin pragmatikotita
mono mia elliniki oikogeneia yparxei ekei). Allwste, ean
Makedones einai monon oi Ellines, to na anagnwristoun ta Skopia
me to onoma auto, simainei gia emas oti exoun anagnwristei
diethnws Ellinika dikaiwmata ekei (toulaxiston auto mporouse na
einai mia emmesi, plin safis propaganda mas).

3. Ypostiriksi kai twn Albanwn gia aneksartiti/autonomi
"Ilyria", kai den symmazeutai...

Tipote den xathike. Antitheta, isws einai kai kalytera giati
etsi oi Ellines enwnontai kai oi politikoi mas ksupnane (?).

Bale Armenia, Gewrgia, Persia, Syria, Kourdous (kai isws
Boulgarous) kai etoimazetai xontro panigyri... Arkei na mas
fygei kai to komplex tou oti eimaste mikri xwra kai i yperopsia
tou xouligkanikou typou: "Tha tous fame". Isxuri oikonomia,
propaganda, enisxusi antipalwn kai statheri "Byzantini" politiki.

--
UUCP:      pef@qmw-dcs.uucp  | Computer Science Dept    |
Internet:  pef@dcs.qmw.ac.uk | QMW University of London |
JANET:     pef@uk.ac.qmw.dcs | Mile End Road            |
Voice:     +44 71 975 5220   | London E1 4NS            |
FAX:       +44 81 980 6533   |                          |
Cellphone: To be fitted soon
Xref: sparky soc.culture.greek:3396 soc.culture.turkish:4327
From: lsuki@ikaria.ntua.gr (Levon H. Sukissian)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: " Akousate ... Akousate"
Date: 13 Apr 92 11:10:05 GMT
Organization: National Technical University of Athens


Kai den einai monon auto kalopaida. To idio arthro, tou idiou zwou, pithanon
bebaia mexri twra naxei megalwsei (kalutera to megalo zwo skotwnetai polu pio
eukola, egine ekpomph ston Sky (prwhn Koskwto-kanalo kai nun Alafouzo-kanalo)
apo ton Kakaounakh. Ekei na deis plaka me ta thlefwnhmata twn akroatwn. To pws
eftase sta xeria tou den mas to eipe, to mono pou kseroume einai oti eftase me
fax, alla fax xwris to thlefwno tou apostolea (;), kommataki duskolo.

-- 

+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+
|                                                                     |
|                   M A K E D O N I A   ksakousth                     |
|                                                                     |
|               tou   A L E K S A N D R O Y   h xwra                  |
|                                                                     |
+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+


                                                Levon the Macedonian


Y.G. Na thumaste th dwdekath mera tou Mah, ekei tha metrhsoume GIA MIA AKOMA
fora exthrous kai filous.


						O idios ki aparallaxtos
From: tpd1@cec2.wustl.edu (Theodore P. David)
Subject: Re: Caroutas, the Enosis supporter, is seeing the truth, finally!
Keywords: Taksim, Enosis, Peace Operation, Caroutas
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 22:42:01 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.213633.3766@en.ecn.purdue.edu> baysan@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Okan Baysan) writes:
>
>The Turkish
>Peace troops are present there even now, because WE want them to stay there
>because WE ask them to stay there. It's out of your control, so  don't even
>mention about it anymore. Just note that, when the UN troops pull out of
>Cyprus by the end of the year, it will be the Turkish Peace Troops who will
>preserve the peace for years to come! And it may be hard to swallow this 
>     

Preserving Peace by occupying other people's homes and land? 
And in the worst case, why do 18% of the population having 40% of the country?
What are you? Golden people and you want double share?

On the other hand. Why don't we leave it as Turkey does with Kurds. They are
part of the population (20%), but (to my knowledge) the constitution
of Turkey doesn't say anything about having (the Kurds) 30% in the Turkish
governement! Those who worth it and those who get elected , make it to
the governement and the parliament. 
>>
>
>O. Baysan
>baysan@ecn.purdue.edu

Theodore David.
From: gavrila@imhfhp16.epfl.ch (GAVRILAKIS Spyros IMHEF DME EPFL)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: FT on EC-MEETING
Date: 7 Apr 92 15:41:09 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne



The following in an EXTRACT from the Financial Times (Europe) on the recent
EC meeting on the Yugoslavian republics:

EC to recognise Bosnia and lift Serbia sanctions.

'Macedonia's quest for recognision is still stuck on the nomenclature dispute
with Greece. Mr Pinheiro (foreign minister of Portugal) said he hoped soon to
be able to announce a formula easing Greece's worries about recognising
Macedonia under that name.
'Lobbying for Macedonia yesterday in the corridors of the Luxembourg Council
building was Mr Robert Macfarlane, President Reagan's national security
adviser who resigned over the Iran-Contra affair. He said that Macedonia,
whose name in itself hardly constituted claims on Greece was ready to sign
non-aggression pacts with its neighbours, once it was independent and able
to do so'

FT (Europe) 7-April-92
Spyros Gav. EPFL Switzerland.
~
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek