HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: marcs@slc.com (Marc San Soucie)
Subject: Re: beginner century questions
Organization: Servio Corp, Beaverton Oregon, US
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 02:44:30 GMT

Eric Pearson (ericp@VNET.IBM.COM) writes:

> I would appreciate some advice about my first century. I'm not too afraid of
> the metric C in September, but kind of worried about the 100M in October.
> Currently I ride 3-5x a week, 20-35 mi a ride with a 50 every month or so.
> Pace is 16-20mph depending on terrain & wind. Last 50 was 17mph. How much
> should I slow down for the longer distances?

Not a lot. Start out at what feels like a comfortable pace, legs spinning
easily, not really exerting yourself. Pick it up a bit as your legs warm
up, say 5-10 miles along, but don't go so fast that you're straining.
Somewhere in there is a pace that you can probably keep up for hours if you
stop occasionally to rest, eat some food, and can handle the saddle.


> Do people really take in solid food on a ride without hurling? If so,
> what is safe and how soon should I start? 

It comes easier with practice, and is different for everyone. I do fine on
centuries with a bottle of apple juice, a couple of bananas, some cookies,
and a sandwich or muffin or something. After the previous night's good
dinner and this morning's breakfast, of course. A big breakfast is one way 
to force yourself to start out moderately. Personally, I can ride with a 
butter-grilled breaded trout swimming around down there, but some folks 
wouldn't be able to do that.


> Pace for the 62&100 - Should I start out at normal speed and slow down
> if I feel bad, or start slower (how much) than normal and speed up later
> if I *don't* feel bad?

See above. There should be no such thing as 'normal' speed anyway. There's 
'warming up' speed, 'easy cruising' speed, 'century' speed, 'racing' speed, 
'long-distance training' speed, etc. Pick 'century' speed, which is 
probably less then your 'pushing a bit' speed.


> Do I need to do a ride longer than the metric C before trying 100 Mi?

No, but it does help. Failing that, do the 50 mile rides a little more
often. If you can do 50 miles two days in a row, you can probably do 100
the next weekend if you pace yourself.

    Marc San Soucie
    Portland, Oregon
    marcs@slc.com
From: stuart@lorelei.ece.drexel.edu (Peter Toich)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Pedals
Date: 1 Sep 92 13:50:38 GMT
Organization: Drexel U.- CCD-E4

Hi,
	not sure if this is the right bike group to post but bear with me.  About
three weeks ago I bought clips for my bike pedals.  Since then I have been
doing alot of riding (training for the MS 150) and I have been getting a pain
in my left foot on the outside edge where foot curves out.

			[[[[  - toes
    here - [[[[[
		    [[[   - left foot
			[[[
			[[[ 
	
Could this be caused by the clips?  Perhaps because of the new foot position. 
Are there differences in clips that change the foot position?  Any suggestions
including types of clips that would be better would be appreciated. 

Thanxs is advance.

Pete Toich
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
email stuart@lorelei.ece.drexel.edu

"If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice."  -  Rush
_________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: miket@unislc.uucp (Michael Thompson)
Subject: Info on FAQ needed
Reply-To: miket@unislc.UUCP (Michael Thompson,B2C04,4560)
Organization: Unisys, Salt Lake City
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 21:29:23 GMT


Being relatively new to the rec.bicycles.* newsgroups I would appreciate
info on how to access the FAQ for these newsgroups.

Thanks in advance


Mike Thompson
unislc!miket
miket@unislc.slc.unisys.com
From: bhilden@bigriver.Eng.Sun.COM (Bruce Hildenbrand)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Table of Grades of Selected Roads in the Santa Cruz Mtns
Date: 4 Sep 92 17:21:51 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: bigriver

In article <9209011720.AA20878@hplomg.hpl.hp.com> BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM writes:
>
>As far as I can tell, the gradients listed in that book are computed from
>maps and do not represent actual gradients on sections of road.  The point
>of measuring gradients on the ground was to verify what the steepest places
>are.

OK.  So now we have an admission that the table represents the steepest
sections of some of south Bay Area's climbs.

>This gets back to the problem of the average gradients of the TdF routes
>not representing the difficulty of the climb because it ignores locally
>steep sections and descents within a climb, averaging it all into a
>smooth number.

Again, I don't understand what is being said here.  If a climb has a
long steep section that is way out of character with the rest of the
average gradient of the climb then I think the numbers for the steep
section are appropriate.  This information is particularily useful
for climbs that are stair-stepped, the classic example in the
south bay area being Page Mill Road.

However, for roads that have a rather constant gradient, like King's
Mountain or Old LaHonda, I do not see these figure's being very useful.
Certainly, everyone who has ridden King's Mountain will agree that it
is not an 11% climb.  It is more like a 7-8% climb.  The fact that there
may be one short stretch of 100 INCHES that measures 11% does not change
how I ride the climb one bit.

However, if that same 11% section were say, 1/2 mile long, I would
definitely have to consider it's difficulty on a climb and potentially
hold back a bit because of the upcoming effort.

I think Grant Peterson's book "Roads to Ride" is much more helpful
in determining the difficulty of climbs than this table that takes
measurement in 100 INCH(that's i-n-c-h) sections.

Possibly, this is an attempt to inflate one's ego by saying, "I rode
an 11% climb", when all they did was ride up King's Mountain.

Bruce
From: wade@hobbes.ucsd.edu (Wade Blomgren)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Tandem mailing list created
Date: 28 Aug 92 23:34:45 GMT

I've created an experimental mailing list for tandem bicycle enthusiasts.
To subscribe, send a message to "listserv@hobbes.ucsd.edu" with the phrase 
"subscribe tandem firstname lastname" in the message body, where 
<firstname lastname> is your own name.  The list server will deduce 
your email address.  Once subscribed, send messages to the list at
"tandem@hobbes.ucsd.edu".

Assuming there is sufficient interest to sustain the list, suitable topics 
might include questions and answers related to tandem componentry, riding 
technique, brands and equipment selection, prices, clubs, rides and other 
activities, cooperating on a section on tandems for the rec.bicycles.* FAQ, 
etc.

This list is not intended to subvert the various rec.bicycles newsgroups,
rather to supplement them - items of general interest should be posted to 
the newsgroups.  Faster response to specific questions, a slightly more
private forum in which opinions can be expressed with reduced fear of 
repercussion, and (mainly) a place to carry on about tandems far beyond 
what might be considered "polite" in the general purpose newsgroups are 
some anticipated benefits.

Wade Blomgren
wade@hobbes.ucsd.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: david@postman.gr.osf.org (David George)
Subject: Re: Gas Taxes R Us
Organization: OSF RI Grenoble
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:15:59 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.103815.1247@sun.pcl.ac.uk>, marcus@sun.pcl.ac.uk (Marcus Harvey) writes:

|> BTW, the only reason I'm learning to drive is so I can get me, my friends,
|> and our mountain bikes out to the countryside!

Thin end of the wedge, ol' boy.  Before you know it you'll be sitting in the jams with the rest of them.  Anyway, what ever happened to British Rail ?

David.

Make a stand, return your driving licence today !
From: jdr40@ccc.amdahl.com (John Ritter)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Shimano Bottom Bracket-UN50
Date: 3 Sep 92 13:35:48 GMT
Reply-To: jdr40@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com (John Ritter)
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <92245.124233TOM@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> TOM@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU writes:
>I'm think about buying one, has anyone installed one, and if so, are they
>any good?
>                                                Tom


I have a Shimano UN-70 installed on one bike. i'm not sure of the
difference between the UN-50 and UN-70. Anyway, the UN-70 is okay, not
a Phil Woods sealed unit for sure but it works okay. I am not thrilled
with the plastic cups and had to wrap the threads with teflon tape and
grease the cartridge where it fits in the plastic cup to stop creaking.
I also think it is ugly, but it spins smooth and is supposedly maintenance
free. We'll see how it goes. I thin if I had it to do over again, I would
get a good conventional BB instead.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: WORLD TRACK : Pro 5km pursuit quarter-finals
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 92 22:12:42 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

It would be better if Wallace and his Lotus was up against
McCarthy and a Zipp -- then we would see some action.

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: arpepper@math.uwaterloo.ca (Adrian Pepper)
Subject: Re: Why does this group still exist?
Organization: University of Waterloo Math Faculty Computing Facility, Ontario.
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 15:52:37 GMT

In article <92248.21863.J105270@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM> J105270@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM writes:
>If this group did not exist then I would have no articles to plow through.
>My menu still reads to old way and I do not really have an administrator to
>correct the situation. I even miss the "for sale" ads.
Many sites will have a newgroup named "junk".  If you subscribe to
that, you can look for articles containing "rec.bicycles" in the
header, and find the many articles you have been missing.

Adrian.
arpepper@math.uwaterloo.ca
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Trispokes
Date: 26 Aug 92 22:23:25 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <16190399@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> khe@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Keith Erskine) writes:
>What I'm curious about is the Tioga tensioned disk wheel.  Ned Overend
>is now using one.  I've been told that they absorb a noticeable amount
>of shock, can anyone confirm that?

The test of the tensioned disk mentioned that they broke alot of the
little nipples/attachment points. While on the Slick Rock Trail in
Utah, I ran into John Tomac and asked him about his. He indicated
that he had to replace them all of the time, but that it wasn't any
big deal. Hmm.

I would bet that Dedly Nedly uses the tensioned disk because he
is being paid to use it.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: miket@unislc.uucp (Michael Thompson)
Subject: Re: Info on Carpel Tunnel Syndrome
Reply-To: miket@unislc.UUCP (Michael Thompson,B2C04,4560)
Organization: Unisys, Salt Lake City
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 22:50:29 GMT

In article <3YLPB7P3@cc.swarthmore.edu> stauffer@cc.swarthmore.edu (Glenn Stauffer) writes:
>In article <1992Aug25.150008.19038@unislc.uucp> Michael Thompson,
>miket@unislc.uucp writes:
>>The problem I have experienced has been a sharp, rather short duration
>(10
>>seconds), pain which seems to radiate from my wrist on the little finger 
>>side up to almost my elbow.  It's only been the past six months or so
>that 
>>I have noticed this pain which just happens to coincide with an increase
>in 
>>my riding, ~100 miles per week.  Likewise it is my right arm.  I have not
>>seen a physician about this but have wondered if this sounds like CTS.
>>Any comments from others out there who may be experiencing similar
>symptoms?
>>
>
>I read that symptoms include the "numb" hand syndrome that some riders
>experience. 
>A recent article in Bicycle Magazine stated that correct handle bar width
>had alot to
>do with this problem for bike riders.  The idea is to keep the wrists as
>straight as
>possible when riding.

That's confusing. I have occasional numbness in the left hand while riding 
which goes away with repositioning my hand.  However, the random pain I 
experience is in my right arm but I've never felt this while riding.  
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: eldred@rrunner.jpl.nasa.gov (Dan Eldred)
Subject: Re: Wheel truing I need advice
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 18:33:16 GMT

In article <BtuzH7.IIM@cs.psu.edu> melvin@math.psu.edu writes:
>I have experienced a new problem with wheel truing. On a new wheel
>with new Wheelsmith spokes and nipples, I am having extreme difficulty
>adjusting the spokes. When I turn the nipple, all I get is wind-up, the
>spoke turns with the nipple.  I have tried pressing the back of a wooden
>spoon into the spoke with my left thumb as I use the spoke wrench with
>my right hand, but this is not all that effective, and very hard on my
>hand.
>
>Does anyone have any suggettions?

Make sure you have the right nipples!

	- Dan
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.bicycles.soc
From: kevin@rodin.wustl.edu (Kevin Ruland)
Subject: Re: Pickup Truck Gets Revenge in a Civilized Fashion
Organization: Center for Optimization and Semantic Control, Washington University
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 15:00:25 GMT


In all honesty I cannot categorize your story as an `incident'.  There
were no incorrect judgments, no split-second reactions, no risk of major
injury.  Remember, always analyze events as if you were in a car - and
ask yourself "would the other driver have done anything differently?"
It seems that, as long as the driver of the truck had enough time to
turn onto the main road safely, he had every right to do so, then
whatever faster vehicles where behind him would pass when safe.

Now, there is one "biker's-rule-of-the-road" I hold to pretty dearly.
That is: never make drivers pass you (again).  This rule is for both
safety and politeness.  First off, it is always dangerous for
1 ton+ chunks of steel to go flying past you.  Secondly, if the cars
have already queued up behind you once and waited to pass, they should
not, if possible, be forced to again.  This rule is particularly important
in the city, where I see bikers zipping up the shoulder/sidewalk/centerline
to the front of the stoplight.  (I'm not claiming to be beyond reproach
here :)  How this affects the story here is, depending on how well you
know the road, maybe you should not have passed the truck!!  If you had known
about the uphill, and could not have gotten far enough ahead of the
truck before it would catch you, you should not have passed him.  It would
have been dangerous indeed to be passed by such a rickety setup!

Just my two cents.

Kevin Ruland
kevin@rodin.wustl.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: ampe@cbnews.cb.att.com (john.e.ampe)
Subject: Re: VO2 max (was Re: Heart Rate Survey: Results)
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 17:19:43 GMT

In article <1992Aug24.224946.20527@colorado.edu> jac@bjerknes.colorado.edu (Julia Collins) writes:
>In article <1992Aug24.183226.21674@cbnews.cb.att.com> ampe@cbnews.cb.att.com (john.e.ampe) writes:
>>In article <BtHMJz.CqK@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> praetzel@marconi.uwaterloo.ca (Eric Praetzel) writes:
>>>Ok time to clear up a few more things about VO2 max.
>>>  VO2 max is the maximum volume of oxygen that you can inhale per min. 
>>
>>As long as we're trying to clear things up, let's be a little more precise.
>>VO2 max is the maximum volume of oxygen that you can inhale per minute,
>>_divided by your mass_.
>
>As long as we're REALLY trying to clear things up:
>	VO2 = Volume of O2 *consumed*, expressed as a rate measurement, 
>	      i.e., over time
>
>VO2 may be expressed in absolute terms (liters/min) or in relative terms
>(ml/kg/min). It is a measurement of O2 consumption (the amount of O2 
>used by cellular processes), not necessarily the amount of O2 inhaled. 

If this is true, I am mystified.  How can we possibly talk about VO2
max if we can't agree on a single definition of it?  Part of my
problem with Eric's post was that he was switching between the
two definitions without any clear indication of which one he was
talking about.  

>>>  When comparing people it is best to use ml/min because the amount of lean
>>>muscle mass is unknown.  ie someone could loose 20 lb of fat and have the same
>>>ml/min rating but would have a radically different ml/min/kg
>>
>>So you are advocating using a different metric, namely oxygen uptake
>>rather than uptake divided by mass.  
>>
>
>You can worry about expressing VO2 in terms of lean body mass if you 
>want, but the fact is that you have to haul *all* of your mass around.

No.  In cycling your mass gets hauled around for free (unless you are
climbing).  The only major force you are working against is air drag,
which is roughly proportional to the two-thirds power of body mass
(plus a constant for drag created by the bicycle).  However,
positioning on the bike also plays a major role here.  That this
difference is significant is obvious to anyone who can outclimb much
stronger time-trialers.

>Just express it as ml/kg of body weight/min and this way you can make
>more direct comparisons between individuals. If you express it as ml/min,
>as you suggest, then a larger male will always outgun a fit female in
>the VO2max department. But if you express it relative to body weight,
>then you get a better feeling for what each person can do per unit of
>body mass.  

Yes, it is exactly because of the difference that you describe that we
need a different name for the two quantities.  You can draw vastly
different conclusions depending on which value you consider.  If what
you say is true and the medical community uses the terms
interchangeably then I'll give up right now trying to figure out
what the heck they're talking about.

John_Ampe@att.com
From: ehouse@Apple.COM (Eric House)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: My Bicycle Helmet Experience
Date: 27 Aug 92 18:01:19 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

In article <1726@grivel.une.edu.au> drobinso@mendel.une.edu.au (D.Robinson) writes:
>
>
>In article <1652@grivel.une.edu.au> drobinso@mendel.une.oz.au writes:
>>> In article <Bsu5ot.BEo@well.sf.ca.us>, marquis@well.sf.ca.us (Roger Marquis) writes:
>>
>>>I partly agree.  But if a cyclist, helmeted or not, is injured through no
>>>fault of his own, by a car driver slamming into him, that motorist, or his
>>>insurance should be responsible for ALL these costs.  Think of the 
>>>implications of the alternative.
>>>
>>The law requires construction workers to wear hard hats in construction
>>areas.  If a worker drops a bolt and injures someone who is not wearing
>>a hard hat, do you think that worker should be responsible for the injuries?
>
>Good question!  I think it might depend on the circumstances.
>    If the worker who dropped the bolt had reasonably expected that all 
>workers underneath him were wearing hard hats - because this was a site 
>regulation, then he might not be entirely to blame.
>[deleted for the sake of brevity]

I'd say the analogy isn't all that great.  There's a difference between
a motorist hitting a cyclist and a construction worker dropping a bolt.  Bolts
getting dropped are part of construction work, which is one of the reasons
there's a law requiring hard hats on job sites.  There isn't any law that
I'm aware of against dropping bolts.  On the other hand, there are laws against
hitting other vehicles with a car -- and since we're talking about "accidents"
where the motorist is at fault we're also dealing exclusively with those
cases where the motorist has broken a law in hitting the cyclist.  I'd be
very nervous about a law that said a cyclist, for having failed to wear his
helmet, was in some way responsible for getting injured in an accident.  That
would be like blaming the construction worker without a hard hat for getting
a girder dropped on his head.
-- 
****************************************************************************
Eric House			"My employer doesn't share its opinions with
			   	 me, so I can share only mine with you"
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.bicycles.racing
From: shawn@tsd.arlut.utexas.edu (Shawn Furgason)
Subject: Trittico Veneto & World 5k pursuit results
Organization: Applied Research Laboratories, University of Texas at Austin
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 13:10:41 GMT





Copied from the Sep 2 edition of the "Austin American-Statesman":





		Cyclist Armstrong Wins Trittico Veneto Race



Associated Press



MAROSTICA, Italy - Cyclist Lance Armstrong, who trained in Austin for the Sum-
mer Olympics, won the Trittico Veneto Tuesday, covering the 114 miles in four hours 
and 21 minutes at an average speed of 26.224 mph.



Most of the riders used the race as a warmup for the world road championships in 
Spain on Sunday. But Armstrong is passing up that event for the Tour of Avenir, an 11-
day French race starting Sept. 8.



Also Tuesday, Mike McCarthy became the first American ever to win a gold medal in 
the 5-kilometer professional pursuit at the World Cycling Championships when he 
beat Briton Shaun Wallace and his wind-resistant Lotus superbike in Valencia, Spain.



McCarthy was timed in five minutes, 45.076 seconds, and Wallace in 5:46:805. Wal-
lace also finished second in last year's world championships. 



McCarthy, who won the amateur world title in pursuit in 1990,advanced to the final by 
winning his semifinal race over Frances's Francis Moreau, the defending world cham-
pion in the event.



The victory in the week-long world championships marked a major breakthrough for 
the Americans who had never reached the finals in the pursuit event - much less won 
it. It was also a letdown for Wallace and the Lotus bike.



The bike, an aerodynamically designed machine with a carbon-fiber frame. gained 
wide coverage in the Barcelona Olympics when amateur Chris Boardman rode it to 
Britain's first cycling gold medal in 72 years. The bike is produced by Norwich, 
England -based Lotus Engineering, better known for its sports cars and racing teams.



Designer Chris Burrows maintains the bike offers ad edge of about 10 seconds over 
the 5-kilometer distance.
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------
Shawn Furgason                    |  Homey the Clown and
shawn@titan.tsd.arlut.utexas.edu  |  Bill the Cat in '92
----------------------------------------------------------------
From: ecc@hpspdla.spd.HP.COM (Ed Cirimele)
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:14:44 GMT
Subject: Sierra to the Sea '93
Organization: HP Stanford Park - Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles

                     SIERRA TO THE SEA '93

Sierra   to   the  Sea  is  a  scenic  and  challenging  7-day
bicycle/camping tour, from Northern California's Gold  Country
to San Francisco's Golden Gate.

It begins in the historic Mother Load Country on June 19th and
will visit our state  capitol,  Sacramento  Valley,  the  Napa
Valley,  the  Russian  River,  the  Sanoma  Coast,  and  after
crossing the Golden Gate Bridge, will finish in San  Francisco
on June 29th.

Sponsored   by   Almaden  Cycle  Touring  Club  in  San  Jose,
California. This will be the sixth year  for  this  non-profit
cross state adventure.

Approximately  425 miles long, the tour will average around 60
miles a day.  The  route  is  challenging  and  designed  with
experienced riders in mind.

The  cost is $285 and includes transportation from San Jose to
the start of the ride in Columbia and from  San  Francisco  to
San  Jose  at  the end of the tour, plus all camping fees, six
dinners and two breakfasts, sag support, gear  transportation,
a souvenir water bottle and a T-shirt.

The  tour is limited to 100 cyclists. Entries will be excepted
on a first-come, first-served basis.

        For a brochure and registration form call:
                         408/629-2852
        or write to:
                      Sierra to the Sea
                       483 Madison Drive
                  San Jose, California 95123
           1993 brochures will be mailed in January