HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:40:53 GMT

In article <4465@dove.nist.gov> hira@cme.nist.gov writes:
>My first post to this newsgroup, with encouragement from Clare.
>
>Well, some of you have made references to the experiences you've had
>about being asked your nationality. So I'll add my $0.02 worth.
>
>I had just finished my hour long presentation and answered questions, and 
>the next thing to do was to meet with the chief. The first question that
>came out of his mouth was, "Are you a US citizen?" I was pretty taken
>aback, but didn't retort anything (something I regret). I'm an asian 
>indian who was born and raised in the US, and shit like this pisses me
>off, but white friends shrug it off like its his job to ask me that 
>question. Who wants to bet that he *never* asks white applicants that 
>question? 

Happens all the time. I was asked if *I* was a US citizen before I took my
last couple jobs (and no, they were not defense related). Had to show proof
of it as well. No big deal. Happened to friends of mine at Hughes as well.
For the record, I'm blond/brown hair color, blue eyes, no accent. My friends
at Hughes were Dk brown hair, green eyes, red hair, blues eyes, and black 
and black (the last one was born in Taiwan). All American citizens. And it 
*is* someone's job to ask if you're a US citizen. Most cases, *your* (or
my) job to prove it.

Mike
-- 
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Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: ikeda@vxcrna.cern.ch (IKEDA,M./EP)
Subject: Re: FOBs/Oreos/Twinkies/etc.
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 10:30:00 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.194855.18235@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com>, lam@popeye.comm.mot.com (Dan Lam) writes...
>In article <1992Jul20.091459.8893@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> c60a-zg@volga.Berkeley.EDU (Martin Guerrero-LabA) writes:
>>
>>How "bad" is the conflict between the American born Asians and the
>>Asian Immigrants?  Is the use of FOBs/Oreos/Twinkies etc. generally speaking,
>>going up or down?
>>
> 
>I have both Am. born Asian friends as well as foreign born ones.  I have
>not really sense any conflict between the two groups.  Have not heard of
>Oreos or Twinkies used before.  Actually I did not know what they mean
>until I started to read scaa few weeks ago.
> 
>I once heard the term "FOB" used but it came from a foreign born person
>herself (in a non-derogatory sense).  And once heard my Am. born friend
>using the 3-letter word ABC himself when I asked him where he is from.
>(I meant to ask him what town in Illinois he is from).
> 
>Any way you seem to imply that the conflict exists.  Is it based on you
>experience at Berkely?  For the 4 years I spent at U. of Illinois at
>Urbana,  the A/AA ther did not really make a big deal about whether some
>one is foreign or Am. born.  Well may be things have changed.  It would
>be interesting to hear from you guys out there.
> 
..

Certainly some tensions exist.  In LA there was a conflict between the
old Japanese-American community and the new Japanese immigrants/investors
with beaucoup de yen.  As for anecdotes, I had a Chinese-American friend
who made a lot of fun of the new immigrants from Hong Kong and Taiwan.
And even for me, I was the termed the "FOB" of our scout troop (which
consisted of 2nd and 3rd generation Japanese-Americans).  But this is
just name-calling so it is not serious.

-- Makoto
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak)
Subject: Re: S.C.A.A Party -- August 6
Reply-To: jpak@manute.sps.mot.com (the Happy Twinkie)
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 21:23:18 GMT

In article <Brt0t1.F17@cs.columbia.edu> htn@cs.columbia.edu (Hoa T Nguyen) writes:
>In article E7A@acsu.buffalo.edu, ningwang@acsu.buffalo.edu (Ning Wang) writes:
>>Pak: [...]  It is because of them, that we goodlooking 5th generation Asian
>>Americans, not to be confused with Asians, are losing popularity with our
>>Caucassian Female goddesses!!
>
>OK, I admit this is the first time I have wandered on to this newsgroup but I 
>just want to know is the above (^) statement for real?????

Absolutely!!!  And I should know, since I'm the aforementioned "Pak" in the
above quote!!  Ain't that bitchin'!!!!

>Just because you so-proclaimed "goodlooking 5th generation Asian Americans"
>can't get any from "Caucassian Female goddesses" or I suspect from anybody
>else for that matter,

Like, ohmahgawd, who would actually *WANT* anyone else when they can have
themselves a BEAUUUTIFUL, INCREEEEDIBLE, Caucassian(sic) Female Goddess(tm)!!!!
That's CFG(tm) to you 1st-generation losers out there!!  Geez, get to know
the 5th-generation lingo, are you all lame-o's or what??  Sheesh...

And I can get any CFG(tm) I want!!!  The other day I got asked for the time
from this babe, and like she actually almost looked like Shannen Doherty, at
least hair-wise!!!  So eat your heart out, nyahh....

>don't be blaming it on immigrant Asians.

But in this case it really is their fault!!!!  I keep getting mistaken for
those 1st-generation losers when all those CFGs(tm) should know that I'm
**SO MUCH DIFFERENT AND BETTER**!!  I'm FIFTH-GENERATION *PURE* AMERICAN(tm)!!!
In fact, I was about *this close* (put thumb and forefinger a cm apart) to
bagging that CFG(tm) before Ning spilled the beans.  Then she read scaa and
found out I'm only 4.5 gen.  Bad Ning, bad boy!!  Bad 1st-generation boy!!

>And who said immigrant Asians aren't studs and goddesses in their own right...

EEEEEEUUUUUUWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!  Gross!!!!  Puhleeze...

>Hoa.

Jim (the Happy Twinkie, aka 5th generation AA stud)


p.s. Hoa, all that above is a joke.  Including the article you responded to
     (not Andrew's article, but Ning's).  Just teasin' the new kid a little
     bit.  :-)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu)
Subject: Security Clearances (was Re: Asking someone his "nationality")
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 23:22:19 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.184521.15733@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>
>  Naturalized citizens are harder to "clear".  If they can't be
>  "cleared" then they can't be assigned to classified work.
>  Since the company can't fire someone for being "unclearable"
>  this person ends up as deadwood.

Just as a public service, there's been an ad running recently; I've seen
it in IEEE Spectrum.  Apparently, for several years defense constractors
were unconstitutionally denying security clearances to people who were
born in (or lived in for a significant length of time) a whole slew of
countries (many in Asia), pursuant to a DoD regulation that's been thrown
out by the courts.  If you've been denied a security clearance and are
from (or lived for a long time in) a foreign country, look up these ads
and see if you're affected.
						--Alan Hu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin)
Subject: Re: Korean Views on Race (Re: LA Times. 7-13-92 [long])
Organization: University of Delaware
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 18:08:58 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.020203.27515@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>
>>(Mr. Fester (fester@island.com) ought to read the inside of his
>>passport, concerning dual citizenship, before he posts again.)
>
>Once again, I'd like to direct Mr. Joe and others' attention to my
>article based on information posted by Rich Wales at UCLA CS and some
>of my own research for my own "peculiar" situation ... a passport
>cannot fully explain a telephone-book sized tome of laws, and because
>of INS's border-check philosophy anybody with a U.S. passport should
>use it when entering the United States.  

Since Gary didn't give ftp address to Dwight Joe or anyone interested,
here it goes.  Look at valeria.cs.ucla.edu:~ftp/pub/faq.dualcit (assuming
they didn't change it).
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: jj@alice.att.com (jj@alice.att.com, curmudgeon)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Keeping in mind that this is AmeriKKKa
Date: 22 Jul 92 15:05:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.23276
Reply-To: jj@alice.UUCP (jj@alice.att.com, curmudgeon)
Organization: NJ State Home for Bewildered Terminals

In article <1992Jul21.184201.13503@ichips.intel.com> sedayao@chopin.intel.com writes:
>In article <14fq65INNj0p@agate.berkeley.edu>, judyy@ocf.berkeley.edu (Judy Y. Tseng) writes:



>> 4. There exists prejudice in the mainstream political, legal, academic systems
>>     and the media, a prejudice often only White people can escape.
>
>I would agree here.
Actually, I disagree.  I think you mean "rich White people can escape".
One thing I do not see in these articles is the understanding of
what economic power/powerlessness does to a person of any race,
including white.  Claiming that white people can escape prejudice
in the lega, political, and academic systems is plain wrong,
and the news in front of you every day shows that.  It DOES show
that RICH white people can escape the system.  That's a big difference.

I'm doing my best to ignore the rest of this "down-with-honky" thread.

While Judy's rhetoric is undoubtedly satisfying, because it sounds
good, it feels good to say all that stuff, and it's PC to beat up
on the good ol' white menace, it misses the simple point that the
ONLY real effect it has is offending whites, instead of making
them sympathetic.  It ignores the fact that most whites married to
asians are very much concerned with the rights of asians (both
their spouses and children).  It ignores the fact that
most whites are in exactly the same position as asians,
because of economic power issues, rather than race issues, and
that economic power is becoming the new method of discrimination
in this society, one that should be nipped in the bud.

It's the same old story, beat it into them, don't even think
about something more subtle.  I think this is just a human trait,
to love war more than peace.  Sigh.
-- 
 Bush    *Copyright alice!jj 1992, all rights reserved, except transmission
   vs       *by USENET and like free facilities granted. Said permission is
 Clinton  --    *granted only for complete copies that include this notice.
 Just Say !NO!       *Use on pay-for-read services specifically disallowed.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.asian.american:7340 soc.culture.african.american:8429 ca.politics:6161
From: c60a-zg@volga.Berkeley.EDU (Martin Guerrero-LabA)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,soc.culture.african.american,ca.politics
Subject: Pencil Twirling continued
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:45:24 GMT
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley

Well, since we are on the subject...

  Of the people you've seen pencil twirl, what are the types of twirling?
  Some just do it in the clockwise direction in one hand.  Others do it
  in another direction.  Some do it both ways!  Some can even twirl it around
  just about every finger.  Some twirl it around just about every finger
  both ways!  Canthey do it with both the left, and right hand</
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Perfect Families
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 92 12:38:52 GMT

[stuff about Asian-Indians not telling anyone their
 problems deleted]

  For an example of an Asian-Indian sounding name,
  airing problems on the net, look in soc.women. 
  There is a posting about a problem with
  a wife who is father fixated.

  I don't think it's ethical to re-post it here
  but the guy does need some advice.
From: edhall@rand.org (Ed Hall)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: A hot market (was: History of family name)
Date: 27 Jul 92 16:17:46 GMT
Organization: RAND Corporation.

>In article <HIEBELER.92Jul26213329@passion.think.com> hiebeler@think.com (Dave Hiebeler) writes:
>>  The other day I did notice an AT&T commercial showing a couple of AA
>>women talking (no AA men, of course) mixed in with the various clips.

I saw the same commercial.  There was another bias present as well.  Most
of the people shown talking were women, or were adult children talking
with their parents.

It seems that women are more likely to attempt to maintain friendships
when distance intercedes.  This tendency is not just limited to American
cultures.  One can only speculate on the reasons...

Of course, when the phone company is targeting businesses and not
consumers in an ad, the sex ratio shifts predictably.

There is a dearth of Asian men in advertising--no doubt about it.  Even
here on the West Coast, where Asians make a formidable market segment,
I can count on one hand all the Asian men I've seen in advertising.  Most
of these were in the past year or so, so things are probably getting
better, ever so slowly.

		-Ed Hall
		edhall@rand.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: gwu@nujoizey.tcs.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Organization: Teknekron Communications Systems Inc.
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 20:45:01 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.202036.19814@rice.edu>, kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go) writes:
> 
> I cannot think of a good ending, though.  If anyone has suggestions on how
> to improve this, please tell me.  Thanks in advance.

     Well, there's always the flippant response.  Below are some of my
stock questions and answers.  Substitute the appropriate country or
nationality according to the person's most obvious characteritic.  If
you don't want to be too rude, a smile and some friendly laughter to
show you're used to the question will help defuse the tension.


Q: What nationality are you?

A: American.

A: I grew up in Atlantis.


Q: Where are you from?

A: Pittsburgh.  And you?

A: Pittsburgh.  You speak English pretty well for a Scandanavian . . .
   Oh, I'm sorry.  I saw your blonde hair, and assumed you came from
   Scandanavia.

A: Pittsburgh.  How long has it been since you left Ireland? . . .  Oh,
   I'm sorry.  I looked at your red hair and assummed you were a
   foreigner.

A: Antartica.


Q: You speak English very well.

A: Thank you.  It's required of all Japanese/Chinese/Soviet/Nordic
   espionage agents.

A: Thanks, so do you.  Is English very difficult to learn for an Italian?
   . . .


     As you can tell, I sometimes consider a sledgehammer too subtle and
proceed to dynamite.  :-)  What other stpuid questions have I forgotten?

							George



----
George J Wu, Software Engineer         | gwu@tcs.com or uunet!tcs!gwu
Teknekron Communications Systems, Inc. | (510) 649-3700
2121 Allston Way, Berkeley, CA, 94704  | Never be the first to believe . . .
From: dharma@verdix.com (Manjeri Dharmarajan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Perfect Families
Summary: let's not be modest - we all know who's right!
Date: 31 Jul 92 06:47:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: verdix.4585
Reply-To: dharma@VERDIX.COM (Manjeri Dharmarajan)
Followup-To: soc.culture.asian.american
Organization: Verdix Western Operations; Aloha, OR

In article <1992Jul30.203542.16715@midway.uchicago.edu> moh2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>
>I'm sorry, but I strongly disagree.  It's possible, I suppose, that
>you have not met any Indian families with problems.  I'm amazed, but
>it's possible.  But I'd like to provide evidence to the contrary,
>without naming names or causing embarassment to my family and their
>friends.
>

[ list of "problem families" deleted ]

>Sorry if I got a little agitated, but the implication that we *are*
>perfect really, really frustrates me.  We're human, dammit.  We make
>mistakes, just like everybody else.  Our way of life is no better than
>anybody else's, and it may be a good deal worse.
>
> - Amirthi

  This is similar to the "all religions are equally valid" theory, which is
propagated more to keep the peace than because it is true.

  Isn't it possible that some lifestyles are better than others? That some
societies (or sub-societies) are more "successful" than others?

  We are all humans, but it would be incredible coincidence that, among the
thousands of candidates, no way of life is better than the rest.

  I come from a large extended family. We have a lot of problems, but they
are trivial compared to the problems in oter families. There are no alcoholics,
violence, abuse, neglect or divorce. All of them have steady incomes, and all
the children were brought up with TLC. Of course, they were brought up in
narrow well-defined roles, and didn't get a chance to "find themselves" or
"experiment." I'm not convinced that's all bad.

  Oh, to ward off flames, I'm here for the money. :-) And to catch the mother 
of all prizes - a white wife. :-) :-)

	Dharmarajan

ps: [the voice inside my head] "Now would be a good time to unsubscribe."
From: kevin@daffy.ee.lbl.gov (Kevin Gong)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: More on Dating
Date: 21 Jul 92 16:54:21 GMT
Reply-To: kevin@daffy.ee.lbl.gov (Kevin Gong)
Distribution: na
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.112.42

In article <14fkgsINN4hr@network.ucsd.edu> hirota@sluggo.sdsc.edu (Bryan Hirota) writes:
>Since much of the traffic on this group pertains to interracial
>dating and such - I thought I'd post the personal section from
>the same Transpacific where my previous post was copied from.
>[July/Agust 92]  (since there were only 5 personals listed, I figured
>it wouldn't be that big a deal) 
>
>It's not very scientific and any conclusions you draw from this
>will most likely cause people to flame, but I thought the personals
>might reflect society *somewhat* and provide some new info on who's
>looking for who.

Well, I think you have to remember what magazine you took this out of.  It
only gives you a narrow picture.  I think you'd be better off grabbing the
personals section of your local newspaper and analyzing that.

>Sucessful Educated Caucasian Executive, 40, non-smoker, attractive,
>looking for AsiAm, 22-32 to share culture, travel and serious relationship/
>marriage. Letter with photo please. C511

Is it just me, or is there no reference to gender in this personal?  One
might infer from the ages that this person is male.  I still consider it a
glaring omission (unless the person is bisexual, which I doubt).  I suspect
"he" equates "Executive" with "male."


 - kevin
From: hiebeler@think.com (Dave Hiebeler)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: movies
Date: 24 Jul 92 01:21:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: passion.HIEBELER.92Jul23182128
	<HIEBELER.92Jul15222851@passion.think.com>
	<2A6857F9.14666@noiro.acs.uci.edu>
	<1992Jul20.045006.26765@u.washington.edu>
	<1992Jul21.231604.14797@tcsi.com>
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation
NNTP-Posting-Host: passion.think.com
In-reply-to: gwu@nujoizey.tcs.com's message of Tue, 21 Jul 1992 23:16:04 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.231604.14797@tcsi.com> gwu@nujoizey.tcs.com (George Wu) writes:

> The San Francisco Examiner (one of two mainstream dailies in this
> town), strongly implied Gong Li and Zhang Yi Mou are romantically
> involved.  Zhang's wife refused his request for a divorce, and the
> two are separated.  Gong and Zhang refuse all questions as to the
> nature of the relationship between them.

  Yes, some of my Chinese friends have kind of a bad feeling about
Gong Li because of those rumors, even though they like her as an
actress.

  I guess even China has those tabloid-style rumors about celebrities
(I don't know if they are more likely to be true in China than in the
US).

--
Dave Hiebeler                  | Internet: hiebeler@think.com
Thinking Machines Corporation  | UUCP: {uunet,harvard}!think!hiebeler
245 First Street               | Bitnet: hiebeler%think.com@mitvma.bitnet
Cambridge, MA 02142  USA       | Phone:  (617) 234-4070 (work)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Keeping in mind that this is AmeriKKKa
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 20:54:36 GMT

In article <7508@public.BTR.COM> timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee) writes:
>ikeda@vxcrna.cern.ch (IKEDA,M./EP) writes:

>Also note that the existence of people of mixed ancestry breaks down
>the race classification ideas that form the basis of racial prejudice
>and discrimination.  That's why racially prejudiced people are often
>extremely offended by interracial marriage, even though they may tolerate
>different-race co-workers or whatever.

>A person who can "easily melt into the pot of White America" may be
>in a better position to detect prejudices that tend to remain hidden.
>Few will tell an obviously asian looking person that they don't like
>asian people, but may mention it to someone who appears non-asian, and
>get a surprise reply that they just insulted the person's family.

This is a good point and reminds me of a recent occurence (I can tell you're
all thrilled). I took my mother-in-law back to the airport recently (SFO) and
on this particular day it was CROWDED. We decided to wait in in different lines
for the ticketing, so my wife and her mother (with my two daughters) waited in
one line, and I waited in another. While waiting, the (white) woman in front of
me complained about "all these Orientals" in the airport, and how slow the
line was because of them. I started talking to her, and got her to admit that
other airports without "Orientals" were often crowded and that this was always
a problem, not the "average" race of the group. I then got her to admit that
"Orientals" were probably as polite as anyone else, and there was really no
reason to be insulting, etc. Just then my daughter came up to me, the woman 
looked at her and apologized profusely, complimented my daughter, etc and
overall seemed in a much better mood.

Had I immediately lambasted her for her "racist" remarks, no doubt she would
have denied any racist intent at all, become very defensive, thought privately
(and no doubt told her friends) that people were too "sensitive" these days,
etc. As it was, perhaps she left a little less likely to make such remarks in
the future, and my rather low-key response made a more positive impression than
any hard lecture ever would.

Mike

-- 
Disclaimer - These opiini^H^H damn! ^H^H ^Q ^[ .... :w  :q  :wq  :wq! ^d  X ^?
exit X Q  ^C ^? :quitbye  CtrlAltDel   ~~q  :~q  logout  save/quit :!QUIT
^[zz ^[ZZZZZZ ^H  man vi ^@  ^L  ^[c  ^# ^E ^X ^I ^T ? help  helpquit ^D  ^d 
man help ^C ^c help exit ?Quit ?q CtrlShftDel "Hey, what does this button d..."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Cheese
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 14:23:30 GMT

In article <MDAY.92Jul23175848@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu> mday@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu (Mark Day) writes:
>
>   e199-ac@fornax (Alexander Lee) writes:
>   I hate both cheese and milk.  It's too WHITE.
>
>   I prefer chocolate.
>
>Chocolate is fine (except white chocolate, of course), but surely the
>most politically correct food would be cornbread, yellow all the way
>through.  We all know that twinkies and bananas are incorrect, because
>they're white on the inside.  
>
>BTW, you should go to a store with a wider selection of cheese.  There
>are lots of good yellow cheeses.
>

  Bacon is great for some folks who forget to turn over.
  Especially with that big ozone hole!
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american