From: lewchuk@cs.UAlberta.CA (Michael Lewchuk)
Subject: Re: Eowyn 
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 20:31:26 GMT

jchokey@leland.Stanford.EDU (James Alexander Chokey) writes:
> <comment about Eowyn giving up fighting for more domestic tasks>
>	Because she's the only character in all of LOTR who actively 
>challenges the domestic role given to women in Middle-earth.

So?  Women were domestic, even in Tolkien's time.  In feudal times, in
which LOTR is set, women WERE VERY MUCH SO domestic.  Very few women, other
than nuns and ruling queens, actually did play major leadership roles outside
of the house.  Even men were primarily "domestic": farmers, ranchers, herdsmen,
tailors, "tinkers" (blacksmiths)...  remember, in that age, there was no such
concept as "business".

>	Galadriel is the third significant female character in LOTR.
> One first encounters her sitting next to her husband Celeborn
>Celeborn is the one who speaks first

and Galadriel holds each in her gaze and tests their integrity.

>more powerful than her husband, she defers to him in social settings; she lets
>him conduct the audience and chimes in only to provide information or
>to defuse the tension between him and Gimli.

To me, she seems to be portrayed as much wiser than Celeborn, who is
sometimes rash concerning his beliefs.  Galadriel seems to portray much more
"universal love" than Celeborn does.

As for the amount of convo, it's quality rather than quantity that impresses
me.  Galadriel only spoke when it was necessary.  I was *much* more impressed
with her than with Celeborn.  In fact, I got the impression that Galadriel
was really "the head of the household".

> <Entwives=gardeners vs. Ents>

Don't forget the Ents tended their trees, but the Entwives were very fussy
about the aesthetics of trees + gardens.  Sort of like "which dress should I
wear, this one or this one?".  Both are domestic, but one is exclusively
feminine, it seems.

>	What makes Eowyn so interesting, IMHO, is that she is the sole
>female character who rejects the domestic role that she is expected to assume.

Wrongo.  She seems to have been most happy at considering being Aragorn's
wife, which was as "domestic" as being Theoden's daughter or Faramir's wife.
She seemed like she wanted to say "Aragorn take me away from all this", sort
of like those Calgon bubble bath commercials.  If they would've had Calgon
back then, I'm sure Eowyn would've been using a box a week due to tension.

The rumors and castle gossip about the king's cowardice, plus Wormtongue
wanting to get his greedy paws on her, would probably make any woman want to
get away from that place as fast as possible.  Think of it this way: you're
serving a coward controlled by an even bigger physically and morally disgusting
coward who wants to rape you and turn your entire kingdom over to a wizard
bent on enslaving your people. What kind of woman would want to stay in
this kind of environment?

According to Faramir's statement (which Eowyn and Aragorn seem to accept),
Eowyn didn't fight for the joy of battle.  She just wanted to commit suicide
in an "honorable" way.  If this was ancient Japan, she'd have disemboweled
herself.  But it wasn't so she had to die in battle to die "honorably".

>her what it is that she is afraid of (since she said that she did not fear
>death in battle), her response is: "A cage. To stay behind bars, until use
>and old age accept them."  Quite simply, Eowyn is not content with the same
>stay-at-home domestic role that she is being asked to play.

No, I would think she was discontent to stay at home since in her eyes her
task was not "honorable", that is, nobody appreciated her or what she did.
Theoden was a coward, her brother was always off fighting in spite of
Theoden's protests, and here she was unable even to give Theoden the kick in
the balls that he deserved.

She wasn't afraid of doing household tasks, she was afraid that by doing
them she would be "old and cowardly" like Theoden.  The key word here is
"afraid".  She had no interest in battle, she was just too scared of being
perceived as a "wimp" (read: without honor) she just HAD to go and fight.
She also wanted to be respected, but discovered that you don't have to go
out and kill a Nazgul to get people to love and respet you.

>	And, as we know, she openly challenges that role.  Disguising herself
>as a man, she rides off to Gondor with the other Rohirrim, where she 
>certainly distinguishes herself on the battlefield, proving that she is indeed
>as competent as any man.  

Which she does not because she likes war, but because she is afraid of dying
helpless.  Note: Faramir has no such fear of being helpless.  When in the
Healers Houses of Gondor, Faramir accepts that he cannot fight, while Eowyn
demands to ride out to battle and DEATH.  Not to FIGHT but to DIE.  Reread
the chapter.  Tolkien explicitly states she sought DEATH in battle, not to
prove that "she can do it".  If she wanted to prove she was "as good as any
Rider of the Mark", she did it with the Witch-king.  But she just wanted to
ride away to DEATH, not to GLORY.

>	But in the end, she changes her mind.  She renounces her desires to
>go out to battle, to travel, and to do all of the things that female 
>characters just don't do in LOTR.  Instead, she decides that she'd be
>quite content simply to do what all the other women in Middle-earth do--
>get married, stay at home, and take care of domestic affairs.

Since when did Eowyn want to travel?  Did she mention Hawaii, Bermuda, the
calm shores of the Grey Havens?  Did she mention wading in the Great River?
Did she even pack her toothbrush?  The hobbits at least packed their pipes
when they were travelling...

You know, you have a really large division between "domestic" and "not
domestic" lives.  Even "king of Gondor and Arnor" is a domestic task: you
sit on a throne all day making judgments and sending couriers to distant
lands to inform them of your decisions, and meet with ambassadors.  The
"War of the Ring" was the most undomestic, adventurous task that Aragorn
and Eomer ever were involved in.

>  By having
>Eowyn, the only character who mounts a challenge to the ideology of female
>domesticity in LOTR, renounce that challenge and happily accept the status
>of a married stay-at-home, Tolkien is effectively saying that her initial 
>discontent with that status was a youthful mistake.  I stand by what I said 

A few points:
1.  Tolkien wrote it so that this was a psychological condition (mistake):
    depression caused by perceived helplessness leading to suicidal tendencies.
    Aragorn states that "unless she receives other help, her spirit will die
    even though her body may be healing".  In other words, even though she
    was a valiant berserker, her spirit was dying because her soul really
    wasn't being nourished by it.  Theoden on the other hand, rose to battle
    and his spirit was nourished by it.
2.  Tolkien was under no obligation to live up to your expectations for a
    positive-feminist piece of literature.  I would agree that it isn't
    something I would read if I wanted to promote independent feminist thought.
    I would disagree that it is something I would NOT want to read if I wanted
    to promote independent feminist thought.  There are many positive female
    archetypes here, not only the domesticated Goldberry but the domestic
    empowered Galadriel.

>	--  Jim C. <jchokey@leland.stanford.edu>

					Michael Lewchuk
					lewchuk@cs.UAlberta.CA
Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien