HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: augi@cbmvax.commodore.com (Joe Augenbraun)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Buy, hold, or sell???
Date: 29 Jul 92 22:06:57 GMT
Reply-To: augi@cbmvax.commodore.com (Joe Augenbraun)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

OK, misc.invest.real-estate folk, do you think right now is a buy, hold, or
sell time for real estate?

I think the answer to that question depends on home prices.  If home prices
are going up, right now is a good time to buy or hold, if they're going down
now is a time to sell.  I think home prices depend on interest rates (as they
fall it puts upward pressure on prices), demographics (baby boomers are
moving out of starter homes, causing a relative glut?), and inflation (high
inflation is good for the investment, as you are highly leveraged).  My vieew
is that interest rates have to go up (downward pressure on prices), the
demographics for the type of house I'm talking about forces downward pressure,
but that inflation has to rise over the next few years as the federal
government tries to inflate away the national debt (causing upward pressure).

In addition, housing prices probably have some pendulam momentum to them, and
as they've come down over the last couple of years they're likely to continue
going down until they are way too low, when they will rise sharply.  So, where
are we on that cycle???

A complicating factor is that interest rates are so low right now that monthly
payments on any given house are vastly lower than they're likely to be for a
long time to come.

So, given all of these conflicting indicators, is right now a buy, hold, or
sell??

(The reason I'm posting this is that I own a house in PA, and am relocating
to NJ.  My new job is just a little too far away to commute from my present
home to.  I bought my house FHA, so basically have no equity in it.  If I
sold it I would be somewhere between breaking even and losing $10k.  So I need
to decide if I should rent or sell my current house, and if I should buy or
rent in NJ.  I'm leaning heavily towards selling my current house and buying
in NJ, but I want to see if anyone sees the underlying factors differently
than I do).


							Joe
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is the sort of thing that people who like this sort of thing really like
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Joe "Augi" Augenbraun                   ucp: {uunet|ihnp4|rutgers}!cbmvax!augi
System Engineering                     	arpa: cbmvax!augi@uunet.uu.net
Commodore Business Machines		Phone: 215-431-9332
From: ben@bailey.UUCP (Ben Bailey)
Subject: Re: Monthly Mortgage vs. Biweekly Mortgage
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Date: 24 Jul 92 00:08:26 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Ben Bailey's Home..Tampa Fl.

duanej@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Duane Jacobson) writes:
> >I read somewhere that biweekly mortgages save money compared to 
> >monthly mortgages.  I did some quick calculations with a simple example
> >(shown below,) and found the saving is so marginal, I am not sure if
> >biweekly plan has any advantage over monthly plan.
> 
> I looked at a semi-montly payment schedule, divide your payment in half and
> pay twice per month.  Lots of people get paid twice per month, so this makes
> some sense.
> 
> Anyway, I also found the gain to be very marginal.  After factoring in
> my time and extra postage, it was an easy decision not to do it.
> 
> On the other hand, making small overpayments each month can make a dramatic
> difference.  As an example, paying an extra $32/month on a $100,000 mortgage
> at 10% will reduce the term of the load from 30 years to 25 years.

Well, I have to disagree with your conclusion regarding biweekly payments not
being worth the postage.
  
The following will show the payment schedule for two notes; one a 30yr 10% 
$100K loan payed in 12 monthly payments per year (360 payments), the other the 
same schedule payed in  26 payments per year.  The second note payment will be
1/2 of the first note payment per payment period.

N       I       PV              PMT     |              NOTES
________________________________________|____________________________________

360     10%     $100,000.00     $877.57	| 12 pmt's/year; 360/12    = 30yrs
                                        | Total: 360 x $877.57 = $315,925.20

544.93  10%     $100,000.00     $438.79 | 26 pmt's/year; 544.93/26 = 20.96yrs
                                        | Total: 544.93 x $438.79 = $239,107.54

                                        | Total interest savings:
                                         $215,925.20 - $139,107.54 = $76,817.66

This was calculated using the HP 18C Business Consultant calculator.  A
reduction of 10 years is not 'marginal' on MY wallet, although who knows
what our postage cost will be in 20 years! :-)

Ben
--
Ben Bailey                 ben@bailey.uucp -- bailey!ben@uunet.uu.net
12210 Shady Forest Dr.     ben@bailey.tscs.com
Riverview, Fl. 33569       -- A programmer without his computer is like a 
813-677-5021                  boy without his dog.
From: mikeq@aspen.CNA.TEK.COM (Mike Quigley)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: Call me in a decade
Date: 31 Jul 92 15:33:02 GMT
Distribution: misc
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Redmond,  OR.

?I keep seeing this statement over and over. This makes it sound like, you
?can just stop paying your mortgage and not suffer any. I thought that if
?the bank forclosed on your house, they would auction it off, probably for
?less than you owe on it, and then sue you for the rest. Is this true? If
?so, it doesn't sound like you are just walking away, because it will follow
?you.


Along the same lines, I heard that if a bank forecloses on your home and
sells it, the IRS treats the difference between the sales price and what
you bought the home for as capital gains!!  Correct me if this is wrong.

Mike
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.consumers,misc.consumers.house,misc.legal
From: harrism@aquila.rtp.dg.com (Mike Harris)
Subject: Re: Repost question about refinancing
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 13:52:53 GMT
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: harrism@dg-rtp.dg.com
Organization: Data General Corp., Research Triangle Park, NC

In article <736@tdat.teradata.COM>, txl@dbs42.teradata.com writes:
|> I am sorry for the previous post; the lines were too long and were truncated.
|> Thanks for the responses so far.
|> 
|> I am in the process of refinancing my 1st and 2nd mortgages.  The loan broker 
|> I am dealing with was referred by my credit union.  I have always had good
|> experience with the C.U.; that good feeling spilled over to this loan broker
|> when I started dealing with them.  At first the good faith estimate was at 
|> about $5100 for total closing cost.  In the process, I paid $325 for credit 
|> check and appraisal.  Now, we are very closed to the end; this broker sends 
|> me a final estimate for closing.  Lo and behold, so many new charges appears 
|> and so many previous estimates are raised with some item up to 100%.  The 
|> total estimated closing cost is now at $6500 excluding the fees I already 
|> paid.  I am really confused now and don't know what to do.
|> 
|> My question is that is it usual for a broker to raise closing cost between the
|> "good faith" and the final up to 33%?  The credit union is American Electronic
|> Association and the broker is Pacific Shoreline.
|> 
|> Any inputs about my question and any feedback about this loan broker?  I'm
|> almost certain that there are many AEACU member out there and some might have
|> dealt with this broker before.  Many thanks for your inputs.
|> 
|> Tuan

	Perhaps you should offer hime a tip?

	The thing to do is go to several other companies with the estimates.
	Ask them if the charges are reasonable and tell them that you'll
	do business with them if they beat them. Remember - these people
	are in business selling a product. Often they'll negotiate with
	you (especially if they know they've got competition) because once 
	you close they've got you for life.

	Keep in mind that you may have to pay a bit more with a company
	that offers professional loan servicing. This money you want to pay.

	regards, Mike
From: asylvain@felix.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: Difference between broker and sales agent
Date: 25 Jul 92 21:01:11 GMT
Reply-To: asylvain@fritz.filenet.com (The Chipmunk)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Foundation for the Increased Wealth of Chipmunks

Written in article <1992Jul23.174356.22952@tellab5.tellabs.com>
 by jstein@tellab1.tellabs.com (Jeff Steinhauer):

: What is the difference between a real-estate broker and a
: real-estate agent? Is there any?

In California, the agent works for the broker.

The Department of Real Estate has somewhat stricter rules for becoming a
broker than an agent.  Brokers are assumed to be more experienced than
agents.  (The rules are that you either need a college degree in _some-
thing,_ or 2 years experience as an agent.)

Sometimes the broker does nothing but charge a monthly to agents, who do
ALL the work.  More frequently, the broker acts as a sort of "central
control" to his employee-agents, coordinating activities, buying
services (such as memberships in local MLS's), advertising, etc.  In
exchange, he'll take a good chunk of the agent's commission, often
50/50, but like everything else, it depends and it's negotiable.

If this were a *.politics.* newsgroup, I'd say the broker is the
capitalist, and the agent is the laborer.  B-{)

-- 
The Chipmunk.
Opinions are mine, batteries not included, void where prohibited.
If only God would give me some clear sign!  Like making a large deposit
in my name at a Swiss bank.  -- Woody Allen, "Without Feathers"
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: ett@mangaia.island.COM ()
Subject: New Lender- Am I lucky?
Originator: ett@mangaia
Organization: Island Graphics Corp.
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 15:32:01 GMT

My mortgage (only 1 year old) just got purchased by a new outfit (GMAC Mort.).
The original interest was 5.99% variable. This new lender sends me a notice
welcoming me, etc. I call them up to ask them a general question and the
customer service clerk tells me my interest rate is fixed! My question is this:
Say they don't catch this for a year- can they come back and demand retroactive
payment? Isn't it up to the lender when to raise the interest in a variable
scenario? If they can raise it after 1 year and they don't notify you then
it's status quo?

Thanks for any enlightenment...



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ed Tabachini           "There is no room for bigotry in the Republican Party!"
ett@island.com          However, if you'd like to get on the waiting list...
Island Graphics Corp
San Rafael, CA
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Xref: sparky misc.invest.real-estate:275 misc.consumers:14397 misc.consumers.house:9729 misc.legal:14739
From: txl@dbs42.teradata.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.consumers,misc.consumers.house,misc.legal
Subject: Questions about Refinancing
Date: 24 Jul 92 00:10:38 GMT
Reply-To: txl@dbs42.teradata.com ()
Distribution: world
Organization: ATT/NCR Teradata Business Unit
Originator: txl@dbs42

I am in the process of refinancing my 1st and 2nd mortgages.  The loan broker I am dealing with was referred by my credit union.  I have always had good        experience with the C.U.; that good feeling spilled over to this loan broker    when I started dealing with them.  At first the good faith estimate was at about $5100 for total closing cost.  In the process, I paid $325 for credit check and appraisal.  Now, we are very closed to the end; this broker sends me a final    estimate for closing.  Lo and 


behold, so many new charges appears and so many   previous estimates are raised with some item up to 100%.  The total estimated   closing cost is now at $6500 excluding the fees I already paid.  I am really    confused now and don't know what to do.

My question is that is it usual for a broker to raise closing cost between the  "good faith" and the final up to 33%?  The credit union is American Electronic
Association and the broker is Pacific Shoreline.

Any inputs about my question and any feedback about this loan broker?  I'm      almost certain that there are many AEACU member out there and some might have
dealt with this broker before.  Many thanks for your inputs.

Tuan
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: daniels_d@apollo.HP.COM (Dave Daniels)
Subject: Help needed with Rental property
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:59:43 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Chelmsford, MA



 I am looking for some help with my particular situation.
 I presently own a condo with a loan of 68,000 on it and there
 are currently several units within the same complex selling for
 29,000 - 34,000. As you probably know the Condo market in New England
 is in a major slump and there probably is now chance of a full recover.
 We were planning on buying a house in about 6 months to a year and renting
 the condo, where There would be a negative cash flow of about $300 a month.
 
 What I am thinking is, if we were to invest in another condo and financed
 20,000 for 15 years, we would be looking at about $350 a month including 
 taxes, and condo fees. We could then easily rent it for $600 a month with a 
 positive cash flow of $250 a month. The idea is, this would offset the other
 condo and we would have a much easier time recovering when the market picks up
 (we hope). 

 When the market does pick-up :-) in 3-5 years we could sell both rental  
 properties and hopefully break even.

 I am afraid if I don't do something and we purchase a house we well never 
 recover what we owe on the condo and we will get screwed.

 Does any of this make sense, or am I missing something in the overall picture.
 I am fairly new to this Real-estate stuff and would really appreciate any   
 feedback I can get.

 -Dave   

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave Daniels                           | 
daniels_d@apollo.hp.com                | "Life is a highway, and I wan't  
Hewlett Packard, Inc.                  |  to ride it all night long...."
(603) 772-1500
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: swarren@convex.com (Steve Warren)
Subject: Re: HUD homes (types)
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 21:39:31 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In article <143530002@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> duanej@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Duane Jacobson) writes:
>Anyway, I found the HUD listings to be pretty useless (today) in my search
>for a house.

Well, don't give up so easily!  Do you think great deals on great property
will just fall into your lap?   ;^)

New HUD listings come out every week.  We waited three months before any
homes in the area we were interested in came up.  It was worth the wait.

>The VA also handles properties in a vaguely similar way to HUD (for defaulted
>VA loans).  I did look at a few nice VA homes.  These usually have low
>down payments and low-interest-rate loans.  It can be quite a bargain if
>you happen to find one that you like.

Yes, but I have found that there is a lot wider selection available for HUD
than there is for VA.  I was told by my realtor that VA has more lenient
terms for investors than HUD does, so investors might do better in VA.
-- 
            _.
--Steve   ._||__    Welcome to the World's First GaAs Supercomputer
  Warren   v\ *|    -----------------------------------------------
             V
From: douglis@MITL.COM (Fred Douglis)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: mortgage interest rates
Date: 23 Jul 92 19:20:56 GMT
Organization: Matsushita Information Technology Laboratory

scotty@flash.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Scott Griffin) writes:


>The way that a mortgage broker explained the locking of interest rates is
>the very shortest lock is for 10 or 15 days.  This is very close to the 
>current rate.  If you wish to lock for a longer period you will have to pay
>a premium over the current rate.  You pay the premium because the bank takes 
>risk that the rates will rise after you lock in your rate.  So one shouldn't 
>expect to get the competitive current rate for a 30 or 60 day lock-in.  

I've seen lots of places that will let you lock in the same rate today
for 60 days that you'd get if you closed today.  No premium.
-- 
Fred Douglis
Matsushita Information Technology Laboratory  | Email: douglis@mitl.com
182 Nassau Street			      | Phone: +1 609 497-4600
Princeton, NJ 08542 USA 		      | Fax:   +1 609 497-4013
From: fisk@netcom.com (Benjamin Fisk)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: One Man's Survey of Recent San Francisco Home Prices
Summary: Field of Dreams
Date: 27 Jul 92 23:55:34 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <64465@hydra.gatech.EDU>, jbutterf@mal-s1.gatech.edu (Jill Butterfield) writes:
...
> professional here at Georgia Tech for 7 years. The average salary for
> co-workers in my rank is about $50k. So, if I were in CA, would I be
> earning $150k????
> 
> No wonder so many people are leaving CA! 
> 
And when you lose your job, due to federal spending cut backs, 
you can always fall back on picking spuds to make ends meet :)

We farm high tech out here in these here fields.

-- 
Ben Fisk : fisk@netcom.COM
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: mary@uicsl.csl.uiuc.edu (Mary E. Allison)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.consumers.house
Subject: What to look for when buying a house
Date: 28 Jul 1992 15:26:52 GMT
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: uicsl.csl.uiuc.edu
Summary: Is there anything we're missing here??
Keywords: HELP

     I don't normally read these groups so I hope my question isn't an
FAQ.  I do love the net because it gives me the opportunity to learn
from someone ELSE'S mistakes (I make enough of my own already thank
you).   

** What does one look for when buying a house? **

     I think we've got all the "big things" covered: size, price,
location, current and future needs, etc.  However, what ELSE should
one remember to look for.  

     Maybe a better question would be 

** What do you know now that you WISH you knew then? **

     Please post or email responses and I will post a summary to
misc.invest.real-estate and misc.consumers.house.

THANKS


--
I woke up this morning and couldn't find my socks, so I called 
information.  She said they were behind the couch.  She was 
right.
  -- Steven Wright

    Mary Allison (mary@uicsl.csl.uiuc.edu) Urbana, Illinois
Catx2 Owned, Square Dancer, Leaper, Ballroom Dancer in training 
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: bobk@sequent.com (Bob Krull)
Subject: Need property inspector
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Distribution: or
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 23:32:28 GMT

Can anyone recommend a good property inspector in the Portland area
for old (100yr) remodelled property and multiunit property?

Bob Krull

PS please let me know if this slips beyond the PDX area.  I've tried to
limit the distribution...
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: gnreddy@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (G.Narotham Reddy)
Subject: A FAQ on interest
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:20:17 GMT

While skimming through the Real Estate section, I was paying close
attention to the 'fine' print which says "You have to pay $7.92 /month
per 1k borrowed".  

Can some one explain this in detail.

Narotham Reddy
From: jstein@tellab1.tellabs.com (Jeff Steinhauer)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Difference between broker and sales agent
Date: 23 Jul 92 17:43:56 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tellabs, Inc. Lisle IL


What is the difference between a real-estate broker and a
real-estate agent? Is there any?
From: duanej@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Duane Jacobson)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 21:25:14 GMT
Subject: Re: HUD homes (types)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate


It's my understanding that HUD handles properties resulting from defaults
on federally-insured loans (usually FHA loans).  I've noticed that most
of the HUD properties are condos and cheaper homes.  I'm not sure why this
is, but there must surely be defaults on more expensive FHA-financed loans.
Anyway, I found the HUD listings to be pretty useless (today) in my search
for a house.

The VA also handles properties in a vaguely similar way to HUD (for defaulted
VA loans).  I did look at a few nice VA homes.  These usually have low
down payments and low-interest-rate loans.  It can be quite a bargain if
you happen to find one that you like.
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: 18971@rhodes.aero.org
Subject: Re: Questions on rental properties???
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA. USA
Date: 23 Jul 92 13:26:24 PDT

In article <1992Jul21.215238.40723@introl.introl.com>, ed@introl.introl.com (Ed Zhong) writes:
> First I like to thank for the replies of my previous question about 
> how to offer on a house.
> 
> I want to start something by myself and still keep my full time job,
> the first thing popped out in my mind is to buy a rental property. I
> will buy a 4-family house with positive cash flow. However, I have never
> owned house nor manage a building before, so I don't know what is the 
> potential problems I will have to face, please feel free to comment 
> on anything which is related.(especially form landlords and ex-landlords)
> 
> I will buy a cheaper house which might need some work to realize the cash 
> flow. I am ready to put money and time on it.  I don't know what location 
> I want my house to be yet. I have to alternatives, either close to a 
> university or a resident area (but not in downtown area). I think that it is 
> easier to rent around universities, but the tenents are not stable... 
> usually students move every year... and sometimes they demage
> the house; in a resident area, the tenents usually live there for several
> years, but may be it is hard  for me to find a renter. 
> 
> Please tell me that how taugh to be a landlord.
> 
> --ed
> 
> -- 
I recommend a good book called "Landlording" by Leigh Robinson. Read it
carefully then honestly ask yourself if you want to do all that work 
for the potential return, which is very uncertain at this time.
If the answer is YES then the next step is to set your objective or
expected return within a definite time frame. Have it checked by someone
who knows reality and who does not have a conflict of interest in giving
an advice. A broker friend may be the one if that person does not
try to sell you something you are not sure is in your interest.

A golden rule of thumb is : high return requires high risk, low return
requires high risk, i.e. all returns requires high risk. Another rule
for real estate investment is high income and high appreciation do not
go together. Gang territory properties have high rental income but no
appreciation. Exclusive neighborhood being so expensive, net rental income
is negative but potential appreciation is high.

I hope it's worth more than what you paid for.
Quan
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: rogerv@sco.COM (Roger Vortman)
Subject: Re: Books/Mags on home repairing
Organization: The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 17:54:20 GMT


The best magazine on house repair and maintenance that I have seen is
"The Practical Homeowner", put out by Rodale Press.  Unfortunately, they
have gone from 9 issues a year to just 6, but it is still a good value
in my opinion.

-Roger
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.entrepreneurs