HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jpringle@den.mmc.com (James E. Pringle)
Subject: "Waxing" a chain / Disc wheel covers
Originator: jpringle@everest
Organization: Martin Marietta Astronautics, Denver
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 18:15:48 GMT


Could someone explain the advantages/disadvantages to "waxing" a chain as opposed to oiling it (I use "Tri-flow").  I realize that by using wax instead of oil, you won't get oil on everything that touches the chain.  I am more interested in performance.

Also, I have seen wheel covers advertised in magazines and catalogs for around $50 (Stealth Uni Disc).  Has anyone had any experience with these covers? Do they offer any performance improvements (decreased drag?), or are they just a scam trying to cash in on the success of true disc wheels?

I am only an average swimmer, so I am interested in any advantage I can get on the bike.

Please email your comments to me.  

Thanks,
Jim
From: ccoprbm@prism.gatech.EDU (bruce mccullough)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: Tri-Fed address
Date: 28 Jul 92 14:13:46 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

Anyone have Tri-Feds Telephone # and address? Can't seem to find my stuff
anywhere! SIGH!! POUT-POUT!!!
Thanks Gang!

-- 
Bruce Mccullough-Tech Assistant   | "The sharpest sword cannot cut itself".
Office of Information Technology  | "Look into the book of mirrors and find 
Georgia Institute of Technology   | all the knowledge you will ever need to  
Internet: ccoprbm@prism.gatech.edu| know". -    The Teacher              
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: apas614@chpc.utexas.edu (Andy Heekin)
Subject: Re: Farmers Branch Triathlon
Summary: details of the drowning
Organization: The University of Texas System CHPC
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 21:29:40 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.191142.23048@den.mmc.com>, jpringle@den.mmc.com (James E. Pringle) writes:
> 
> I heard a rumor last week that there might have been a drowning
> at the "Farmers Branch Triathlon" held July 11 (or was it 12th)
> in Farmers Branch, Texas.  Does anyone have any info on this?

I was in that triathlon.  In fact, that guy was in my wave.  There were
about 1500 participants in about 9 or 10 waves.  OUr wave was the 30-34
male which was I think the 7th wave.  I never saw the guy, but several
friends of mine who were in later waves saw what happened.  the guy
was in his first triathlon and apparently got disoriented  and/or paniced
He started swimming in semi-circles somewhere between 100 and 200 yards
out into the 1K swim.  A guy I know got the announcers attention and
kayakers were ordered over to where he was immediately.  The foulup
occurred when the race starter sent the next wave off before they
got to him.  This was a large womens wave.  Several women immediately
got into trouble and grabbed on to the responding kayakers.  In all
the confusion, they lost sight of the guy and assumed he had continued.
Only after all the bikes were gone but his, did anyone start to get
suspicious.  I think the people he came with,  though, knew something
was wrong and reported him missing.  When they  tallied up the 
results, they knew for sure that one person entered the lake, but
did not leave.  I understand that a race of this size is difficult
to put on, but this was kind of crazy.  Many first time people.  I
was weaving like crazy in and out of traffic.  I ended up with a
 broken collarbone 5 miles into the bike and was carted away in
 an ambulance.  That's the story that I heard, anyway.

					     -Andy Heekin
					      heeks@csdsun1a.arlut.utexas.edu

Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: schabert@spieden.Stanford.EDU (Vernon Schabert)
Subject: Re: Question about J-discs
Organization: Psychology Dept, Stanford Univ.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 23:02:58 GMT

In article <Brt3F0.GBv@news.cso.uiuc.edu> jmo28514@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (James Michael Ockers) writes:

>I've heard that they claim that there is no need to true the wheels because
>the wheels are prestressed (by wrenching your wheel around like a toy to 
>strain harden the spokes)  and then retrued and the spoke nipples loc-tite
>shut. 

Well, that's a little graphic, but it follows the general explanation
provided the last time this thread was discussed a few months ago.  From
what I remember, you can still true the wheels (if necessary) by taking
out the rim tape and fiddling with the tension using a flat-blade
screwdriver.  But after just seeing a friend put cracks in his rim by
overtightening his spokes (weird, I thought that he'd strip the nipple
or break the spoke first), I'd probably have a professional do it instead.

>Actually, there was an interesting post a few months ago where an ingenious
>fellow took the 3M shrink-fit window covering and cut it in a circle with a 
>cutout for the hub and then used the tape and applied it to his wheel.  Best
>thing is that it is VERY cheap and removable.  I plan to give it a try sometime
>I also remember there were a few people that were completely horrified by the
>suggestion.  

Well, it's nice to be called ingenious instead of a foolish cheapskate.
For the original poster who was interested in the price of having J-disc
mylar your own wheel, I think the numbers posted were around $140.
Someone had mentioned that he got a nice set of racing wheels built, had
the rear wheel "J-disced," and got out for about the same price as he
would have paid for a pre-built J-disc.

Vernon Schabert
schabert@psych.stanford.edu
From: sjk@strl.labs.tek.com (Steven John King)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: Re: Question about J-discs
Date: 23 Jul 92 22:38:50 GMT
Reply-To: sjk@strl.labs.tek.com (Steven King)
Followup-To: rec.sport.triathlon
Organization: Software Technology Research Lab, Tektronix, Inc.

In article <13048.2a6d2b0e@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu>, klinich@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu writes:

|> 	I'm thinking about getting a J-disc.  This seems like the best option for
|> me since I can't afford a true disc wheel.  I see that the ads
|> say that they can convert your present aero rim to a J-disc.  I already
|> have a Matrix Iso CII, which I believe the clincher J-disc are made with.  Has
|> anyone out there gone this route?  If so, how much cheaper is it?  BTW, I have
|> another set of wheels I can use to train on. 
|> 
|> P.S. How are these wheels able to be trued?

I rode a J-Disc for two seasons (about 30 races total, including some
USCF TTs) without the need for truing.  The person I sold it to has
ridden it two more seasons, and it is still in tip-top shape.  The wheels
built by Nosler are very strong, and I've heard few complaints in the PNW.

The cost to re-true the wheel and install a new cover is about $50,
according to a friend who had it done to a four year old J-Disc.  They
may charge more (or less) for a non-J-Disc.

I recommend NOT purchasing the titanium spokes.  I've seen alot of
them break, and recently saw a guy totally fold a J-Disc front wheel
at the PDX Coors Light Bi.  (The transition area was on grass.  He was
sliding his front wheel a bit because he overshot his rack.  Upon
turning his locked-up front wheel it totally folded over.  Lucky for
him it was in the transition area at the END of the ride).  I talked
to him afterwards, and it was a titanium spoked wheel.  The J-Discs
are light enough, why push things?

I've tried various wheel covers.  I didn't like them because they take
time to install, they are heavier than the glued-on mylar used on a
J-Disc, and it is tricky to get them tensioned just right.  They are
a cheap alternative, for sure.  I just hate fiddling with gear the
night before a rece.

Whatever you choose, enjoy!

Steven (sjk@strl.labs.tek.com)

"Sometimes if you have a cappuccino and then try again it will work OK."
(Dr. Brian Reid)  "Sometimes one cappuccino isn't enough." (Marcus Ranum)
"A double vanilla latte always works."  (Me)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: spesau@acs.ucalgary.ca (Shane P Esau)
Subject: Race Result: Carma Performance Triathlon
Summary: Jim Langford wins
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 18:12:46 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

Distances 1.5 km swim, 40 km bike, 10 km run (the distances are accurate)
Well, this past weekend was the fastest triathlon I have ever
been in.  Everything was fast from the swim (won in 16:50 by a
competitive swimmer) to the bike won in 51:51 by Jim Langford to
the run (won in 33:34 by Frank Clarke).

The race started out in 2 waves - the first wave was the elite
men, women, and men under 35.  The 2nd wave was the men >35 and
the women.  As I said the swim was fast (i was 5th in 18:30 - a
bit slow).  The bike was flat and FAST - lots of sub 1 hour
clockings with Langford winning in 51:51 (this includes both
transitions).  He said that he was about 50:30 for the bike.  One
thing that Langford and another top triathlete (Dave Smit) had on
where foils developed by Profile that you put on your arms.  They
decrease in width for about 12 inches (look kind of like an
airplane wing) that are strapped to the biceps.  They are suppose
to be worth about 1.5-2 min in the 40 km.  Look for them in
Cleveland.  The run was fast as well - Langford held on for the
win in 1:46:49 with Frank Clarke 2nd in 1:47.  In total, 7 were
under 1:50, and 48 were under 2:00:00.  3 women were under
2:00:00 (Sue Schlatter - winner in 1:57:40, Joanne Ritchie - 2nd
in 1:57:56, Terri Smith - 3rd in 1:58:12 - I think these times
are accurate - I don't have results yet).  So, look out in
Muskoka, we have a lot of triathletes coming up who are getting
fast.  By the way, Jim Langford is from Indiana, and from what I
hear has just broken on the seen - he is about 6'4" and slight,
with a very short hair cut.  Look for him in CLeveland, because
I'm sure he'll be there.  Well, that's about it for the results.


Shane Esau
Univ of Calgary Tri Team

P.S.  Burt Sandie of r.s.t. fame was one of the fastest runners
(placing about 4th or 5th for the run segment (not sure).  Way to
go Burt.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: hammons@buzzard.eng.hou.compaq.com (Mark Hammons)
Subject: Lake Conroe, Houston
Organization: Compaq Computer Corp.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 02:06:27 GMT


In regards to the Bud Light Triathlon which took place last
weekend in Conroe, Texas, does anyone know if it will be shown
in its entirety on TV?  Perhaps on ESPN in the early morning?

Thanks for the info, 
Anne Hammons
From: murphyc@bionette.CGRB.ORST.EDU (Chris Murphy)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: Re: Source of Wetsuits
Date: 27 Jul 92 01:22:35 GMT
Article-I.D.: talon.1992Jul27.012235.7772
Organization: Biological Computing Consortium, OSU, Corvallis, OR.

roat@rrc.chevron.com (Suzanne Roat) writes:
>[regarding a source for buying wetsuits]
>And Neoprene caps?  Charlie Lincoln insists that all triathletes wear them at
>World's Toughest.  I have a pin head.  I need a small one.  Quintana Roo makes a
>'one size fits all' cap that I could put two heads in.  It won't do at all.
>---

Try Barracuda, the same company that makes goggles--they market "The
Hothead", a neoprene swim cap.  Contact:

	     Skyline Northwest Corp.
	     0224 SW Hamilton Street
	     Portland, Oregon 97201 USA
	     1-800-547-8664

Barracuda has been a sponsor of the Oregon State U. Triathlon Club, and several
members wore Hotheads during last year's World's Toughest.  The caps were
excellent, according to all reports.

Chris Murphy  murphyc@cgrb.orst.edu
Oregon State University, Corvallis, Oregon USA
From: ccoprbm@prism.gatech.EDU (bruce mccullough)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: Atlanta Events
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:13:49 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

I will be doing that Biathlon thing soon and was wondering if anyone
else on the net would be at this event. This is not a big event. 

Date: August 9
Event: 96 Rock Spring Biathlon
Place:Atlanta,Ga.
Event Coordination: Multi Sports Marketing
                    (404)-640-1825
Events:Run 2m, Bike 12m, Run 2m

Like I said not a big evnt but a workout no less. I will be posting
events calender for Atlanta and regional events soon. I need to remember
to bring it to the office. 

OH YEA STILL LOOKING FOR OTHER PEOPLE IN THIS AREA WITH EVENTS,CLUB NAMES,
AND ANY OTHER TRI-DUAL-BIATHILON ACTIVITIES.  
-- 
Bruce Mccullough-Tech Assistant   | "The sharpest sword cannot cut itself".
Office of Information Technology  | "Look into the book of mirrors and find 
Georgia Institute of Technology   | all the knowledge you will ever need to  
Internet: ccoprbm@prism.gatech.edu| know". -    The Teacher              
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon,rec.sport.swimming
From: smith@csuvax1.murdoch.edu.au (Scott Smith)
Subject: Re: More weird swimmer's races
Organization: External Studies, Murdoch University
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 08:41:46 GMT

Congratulations!

Scott


Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: chrisl@stpaul.gov (Chris A Lyman)
Subject: Re: The Standard Bike (was Arm air foils...)
Organization: City of Saint Paul Public Works
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 14:51:06 GMT

roat@rrc.chevron.com (Suzanne Roat,Chevron,(510)242-5313) writes:

> Oh lets get this thing really fired up.  How about standardizing the bike
> used in a triathlon?  It would cost say $500.  Everybody must use the exact
> same bike in their size.  No modifications could be made.  Under this scheme,
> we would all be competing on the same turf.  The harder you train, the faster
> you will go on the standard bike.  Every 3 years the bike gets updated and we
> all have to buy a new one.  I for one would vote for no disk wheels - to heavy
> anyway, aero bars, standard bike racking feature - no more goof balls taking
> up three spaces on the bike racks, and clipless pedals... [--stuff deleted by
> someone's buggy news server--]

Somebody proposed a division for standard bikes about a year ago in Triathlon
Today.  It was to be called the 'classic bike' division: standard road bike,
700mm wheels with 32 spokes/wheel, clincher tires regular drop bars, no
'gadgets.'  I assume that the idea was greeted with universal snores; nothing
more was written about it.

I think that the idea is interesting but not practical.  Who's to say that the
plain-jane bike over there with the cheap paint job isn't really a Q-ship with
a titanium frame and Campy components with the logos burnished off?  And who'd
want to count spokes for anywhere from 100 to 4500 bikes?

> And none of this armband wing garbage or helmets with tail fins on them or any
> other crap like that.  Just you, the standard bike, a bathing suit, bike
> shorts (optional), plain old shoes, and a plain old helmet.

> What do the folks in ether land think of this idea?

My opinion: the training aspect _does_ tend to get lost in the shuffle,
especially with all the glitzy advertising promising us that we can be just
like Greg Lemond if we bolt an XYZ hootchie-fladge to our bikes (or to
ourselves :-) ).  In every race I participate in, there's always somebody who's
maxed out his/her (usually his :-) ) Visa on a well-equipped bike who's
struggling to average faster than 20mph.  It's kind of pathetic, but what can
you do?  As long as everybody's having fun, I don't see the harm.

> Asbestos underwear on - flame away.

Hey!  The closest I've come to flaming anyone in this group was when some clown
said that women were too timid to push themselves in a triathlon.  If _you_ want
to be flamed, something like that is a great example of flamebait. :-)

-- 
Chris Lyman -  a personal        /   "I belong to no organized
opinion for every occasion       /   political party.  I am a
email: chrisl@pwcs.stpaul.gov    /   Democrat." -- Will Rogers
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: kpalm@athena.qualcomm.com (Kent Palm)
Subject: Ventura's Most Excellent Triathlon - August 16, 1992
Organization: Qualcomm, Inc., San Diego, CA
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:43:47 GMT

I'm considering the "Most Excellent Triathlon" in Ventura on Sunday, August
16th.  The problem is, I have no idea as to the terrain for the bike and
run.  Also, has this been a good event in the past?  Can someone fill me
in?  Thanks in advance.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
From: roat@rrc.chevron.com (Suzanne Roat,Chevron,(510)242-5313)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: More ?'s (was Re: Donner Lake Triathlon)
Date: 23 Jul 92 20:02:41 GMT
Reply-To: roat@rrc.chevron.com
Organization: Chevron, Richmond, California


>Next race for me is World's Toughest.  What's everybody else doing?  What are the good >races to do in the Bay area and within easy driving distance?  I just spent the last 2 >years furiously writing a dissertation in Knoxville, TN so I've had my head buried in >the sand when it comes to tri's.  Also new to the area here.
>

Decided I better add some qualifications to my questions here to avoid a flood of responses.  I have been living in the Bay area for 18 months and I have discovered all the freebie tabloids such as _The Schedule_ and _City Sport_.  So I do know what races happen around here.  What I want to know is the dirt.  Which races are well organized, well run, have low entry fees, etc.?  

I despise the Bud Light CAT series type races - way too expensive for a lousy race (but we've been through this before).  Are there any non-TriFed/USA races?  Another reason for my hiatus from triathlons - I find TriFed to be a useless organization at best.  

Since I planned to do only Donner Lake and World's Toughest, I opted to pay the $12 one day license fee rather than the $36 yearly membership fee.  I have been a member of TriFed in the past just not in the last 3 years.  I still subscribe to Lew Kidder's journal _Triathlon Today_ so I have been able to keep track of TriFed's misadventures over the last few years.  Obviously things are bad if we've got other options such as TriMaryland creeping into the picture.  Does anybody have any comments on the curre

nt state of the organization - TriFed that is - good or bad?

---
Suzanne Roat				Phone:	(510) 242-5313 Voice 
Chevron Research and Technology Company		(510) 242-4647 FAX
100 Chevron Way				Email:	roat@rrc.chevron.com
Richmond, CA  94802-0627
From: arands@zodiac.rutgers.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: Arm air foils, really?
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:26:08 GMT
Organization: Rutgers University Computing Services

spesau writes...


>One thing that Langford and another top triathlete (Dave Smit) had on
>where foils developed by Profile that you put on your arms.  They
>decrease in width for about 12 inches (look kind of like an
>airplane wing) that are strapped to the biceps.  They are suppose
>to be worth about 1.5-2 min in the 40 km.  Look for them in
>Cleveland.


I mean no offense to Shane, nor do I wish to start a traditionalist versus
tri-geek flame war, but I think if we start using these types of devices, we
are starting to lose the point of triathlon.  These devices ***to me*** would
seem to be an excuse for inadequate triathlon training and conditioning.  I use
aerobars, and that's it.  No other trick components.  And yet I still finish
regularly in tri/biathlons and pure time trials (against USCF racers) with 
bike splits in the top 5% overall.  No, I am not going to win the Tour de
France next year, but I train and race on a bike very hard, and I feel that
hard work shows.  

Perhaps for the pros these kind of things have vlaue (to shave seconds where
seconds count), but to someone like me who can stand to drop 10 minutes from my
best triathlon 10K time alone, these things are not very useful ***for the
money invested.***

My advice is not to invest the money into these aero gadgets, but spend it on
more useful things, like food, spare tires, running shoes, beer, more food, a 
chiropracter, and a cheap date (just kidding).  And for God sakes, train!!!

Please direct all inquiries to me.

Rolf Arands
Department of Chemical and Biochemical Engineering
Rutgers University

arands@zodiac.rutgers.edu 
From: kruemp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (John Kruempelstaedter)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 14:36:35 GMT
Subject: Re: Question about J-discs
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon

More on the J-Disc.

I've had one for about two years and have been very happy with it.
I had mine made a little different for almost no extra cost. At the 
time they were making them with Mavic Open 4CD rims and I had themn
put on an Ultegra Cassette hub.  It's a nice wheel.  I'm pretty
rough on wheels and this one is still true.  I had to do a little
patch job on the Mylar becase I did't adjust the derailer right and 
it was really easy.

As far as the original poster's comment "I can't afford a real disc
wheel" I don't know why you would want one of them.  Some weigh 
almost twice as much as a J-Disc.  Actually, I called Nosler Research
regarding the JDF front wheel and chatted with the women on the 
phone for a little while.  She said the the top pros are starting to 
call them.  If you see the pros you may notice she is right (Mike
Pigg, Paula N-F, Karen Smyers, Kenny S, and I think Davis Phinny was
even riding a J-Disc in the ITT of the Tour du Pont).  She said thay
they don't give them away to the pros, they still have to pay.  It
makes you wonder doesn't it........

I have nothing to do with Nosler or J-Disc but I think they really
have a good product and are very nice people.  I don't know if they
were making up the pro thing but if you think about it, you get
all the benefits of a disc w/o the weight.

Anyway just my $.02

John K.

P.S.  The major draw back about the J-Disc is that you have to 
be pretty careful with it.  I may be a little paranoid about mine, but
I baby it quite a bit.  However, it's easy to fix but it's also
kinda easy to put a hole in it.
From: klinich@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: Question about J-discs
Date: 22 Jul 92 09:31:58 EDT

Hi,

	I'm thinking about getting a J-disc.  This seems like the best option for
me since I can't afford a true disc wheel.  I see that the ads
say that they can convert your present aero rim to a J-disc.  I already
have a Matrix Iso CII, which I believe the clincher J-disc are made with.  Has
anyone out there gone this route?  If so, how much cheaper is it?  BTW, I have
another set of wheels I can use to train on. 

P.S. How are these wheels able to be trued?

							Thanks,
								George
From: jpringle@den.mmc.com (James E. Pringle)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.triathlon
Subject: FAQ??
Date: 30 Jul 92 21:38:49 GMT
Organization: Martin Marietta Astronautics, Denver


I am relatively new to the system and was wondering if there is a "FAQ"
maintained in this group.  If so, where can I find it?

Thanks in advance.
Jim