From: jreese@NeoSoft.com (Jim Reese)
Subject: Re: 430mhz band under th
Organization: NeoSoft Communications Services -- (713) 684-5900
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 20:14:18 GMT

In article <1993Jan4.143410.23979@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> whs70@dancer.cc.bellcore.com (sohl,william h) writes:

>One last item - I asked how the operator(s) of a closed system enforce
>the exclusive use of the repeater.  Other than turning it off, I havent
>seen any answer given.  So, again I pose the question, if I (or anyone)
>determines the access code (PL, etc) and use the repeater, what is
>the general practice that closed system operators follow to eliminate
>my access to that repeater?  

Well, I can't speak about other groups, but here's what the group I'm a
part of acts in that situation...

To begin with, there's no way to "eliminate" your access to the radio except
by turning it off.  It's a political thing, not a technical one.  Some groups
have used digital PL, DTMF, or other means to make access more difficult.  The
group I'm in doesn't do this.  It's just PL access.

Second, our group doesn't automatically run off anyone who isn't a member.  If
you are travelling through the area, and aren't familiar with the radio 
system, nobody is going to ask you to leave.  They will ask if you're familiar
with the system, and they will inform you that it is a closed system.  I try
to project a positive attitude towards this, i.e.  "it's a closed system, but
it's not a big deal...use it while you're in town."  If it's a local ham who
is asking, I will ask him to call me on the phone so we can discuss the 
particulars of the group without having to do it on the air.  I encourage
the users of my system to talk to new people, but just let them know that they
need to speak to one of the trustees before using the radio regularly.

If the person has an attitude about closed repeaters, however, the tone of
the conversation will change.  If the person comes on with "this is a closed
system and I don't think that's right", I will invite the person to discuss it
with me on the phone.  If they press the issue on the radio, I'll calmly say
that I will not discuss it further on the radio.  If it goes further than this,
buttons are punched and the radio disappears.

>Second question: if no action is taken
>to change the PL or whatever access coding is used, does anyone
>think they have some recourse towards someone that continues to
>use the closed repeater without paying the operator (this assumes the
>unwilling to pay user is making use of the repeater in a technically
>correct and non-interfering manner)?

In this case, the person is asked not to use the radio further without talking
to the trustees.  If the person continues to use the radio without discussing
the particulars with the trustee, the radio will be turned off.

My objective is to inform the non-member of the radio policies without being
rude about it.  I'll always give the person a chance unless they become
biligerent about it.

Keep in mind here that the paying of dues is not always the issue.  My system
is linked to many other systems throughout Texas, and therefore, when you
talk into my radio, the potential exists that the conversation is being 
repeated into 15 or 20 different cities.

There's no way anyone can "exclude" anyone from using the radio if they are
determined.  Closed repeaters are political entities, not technical ones.

Does that answer your question?

-- 
     Jim Reese, WD5IYT            | "Real Texans never refer to trouble
  jreese@sugar.neosoft.com        |  as deep doo-doo"  --Molly Ivins

Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc