HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tll6551@zeus.tamu.edu (Scholar and Fool)
Subject: Re: What is industrial music?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Fool's Gold Enterprises
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 02:48:00 GMT

schouten@sp95.csrd.uiuc.edu (Dale Schouten) writes...
>Which leads one to a question of venue.
>I mean, like, I've heard a recording or 2 of Industrial Music, but
>like there Industrial Concerts and stuff?  Or is it mostly just
>something people record and listen to recordings of.  (It's just that
>every time I envision an idustrial `battle of the bands' I get a
>mental picture similar to something out of Terminator :-)

well, yes, there are industrial concerts and stuff. But it tends to 
usually be slightly to quite different than the studio recording. This
is because it is boring for most people to watch one or two guys up on
a stage sit there and hit a couple of keys every once and a while. In
most cases, industrial bands will try to do some type of show with their
concert, not just play. Some will add musicians, like guitarists and
live drummers to make it more interesting on stage. Because a lot of
industrial tends to be sequenced. 

Note: this doesn't describe all industrial bands. It ranges from what
instruments are used and who plays them and how many band members there
are, and on and on. 

I'd personally some day like to do a wide-ranging synth program with a 
multi-media stage concert. Stuff like video, slides, props, costumes, 
etc. along with the music. (I always wanted to wear one of those big
suits like David Byrne in _Stop Making Sense_ :) Of course, this tends 
to require money. But maybe one of these days......


AlbSLyujwqNSpwnbgSOnaS  #$^$#%*&#$#%@!%#^#$%&$#^&*@^%@!#$^$#%&$#%&^@$%^@$%^$
WwmPTnsOpbAHosTwnOQloL $          Terry Leifeste, Scholar and Fool          )
GpqNWtrWwoJRhekugAMcyX ^      TLL6551@ZEUS.TAMU.EDU    TLL6551@TAMZEUS      &
OwbEKqkTktRTYKDTVWQosI @----------------------------------------------------%
WjeCMephgyGBzybhahsobJ *    "Who do you think started Christian rock? I     *
PnsWOPBHWPBNAHEAJBNbyW !   did!" -Lew Siffer ("Green Angels" Chick Tract)   @
XwqZOJbypanenbabshabwD  #$%^&$%^*#$^!#$&^$#*%$^&!#%&^(V4.0)%*$#$@%^@@#$^@#%^
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: burtp@aix.rpi.edu (Philip Nason Burt)
Subject: Re: 77's new album
Keywords: 77's
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 04:54:48 GMT

77's new album?

different!
different!
different!

I personaly was put off at first by "woody".  It was just too zepplinish for
my tastes.  My favorites include "phony eyes" and "the rain kept falling in
love".  I think that censoring the title was definitely a cop out.  After
listening to "Pray Naked", however, it was an awfull lot shallower than I
thought it was going to be.  :(

I think that these guys have some mainstream potential.  They are missing
3/4 of their potential market by sticking with a under-distributed Christian
label.

later,
phil
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: crow@coos.dartmouth.edu (Preston F. Crow)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: TANGENT (Re: What do you do when your child ...)
Date: 18 Nov 92 19:39:34 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In <1992Nov17.180359.21314@gtech.com> caw@gtech.com (Christopher A. White) writes:

>In article <97987@netnews.upenn.edu> crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford) writes:
>>In article <1992Nov16.234434.27507@gtech.com> caw@gtech.com (Christopher A. White) writes:
>>>Therefore, since Shakespear
>>>doesn't translate well and requires a bit of effort to understand, it
>>>needs to be *that much better* to be considered on par with something 
>>>that does. 
>>
>>Like, say, "Beverly Hills 90120"?

>I think the comparrisons fall down a little when you understand that
>universality is only one factor of many. There are many issues involved,
>including quality, cohesiveness, originality, etc. When all something has
>to offer is universality, it isn't art. What Tolstoy was saying is that
>it takes more artistic ability to create something that is brilliant in
>more than one context than it does to create something that is brilliant
>in only one context. Another way of looking at it is that something
>which looses much of it's brilliance in translation to another context
>(language, culture, medium) is not as artistic as something that retains
>it's brilliance when moved to another context. Something such as 90210,
>which doesn't have a whole lot of brilliance to begin with, doesn't have
>much to lose when it is moved; it is still out-shined, however, by 
>something that may have lost a good deal of it's brilliance in the move
>between contexts, but which was so brilliant that it had brialliance to
>spare. It, in turn, is out-shined which has lost little of it's 
>original brilliance in a move in context; something to which it may
>have been on par with in one context it is well behind in the scope
>of all contexts.

So if we want an objective rating, we could graph the brilliance on the
vertical axis and the inter-context portability on the horizontal axis.
Then, by taking the integral of the curve produced, you determine the
area under the curve and, hence, an overall rating of the art.
[:-) for the _Dead_Poets'_Society_ impared.]

Yes, beauty (and therefore art) is in the eye of the beholder.  But we
need some basis for discussing quality.  So I guess I'm not really
saying much new in this post.  Sorry.

--PC

[Topher:  See ya on Wednesday--1 week!]
--
Only be careful, and watch yourselves closely so that you do not forget the
things your eyes have seen or let them slip from your heart as long as you
live.  Teach them to your children and to their children after them.
Remember the day you stood before the Lord your God...       --Deut 4:9-10a
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: What do you do when....
From: jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu (jason 'Think!' steiner)
Date: 16 Nov 92 15:55:11 EST
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

markc@eomer.hw.stratus.com (Mark Christensen) writes:
>
> [lots deleted, the main points follow below.]
> 
> Most Christian rock music, takes the music part (melody, 
> instrumentation, etc) and look (how the performers dress, act on 
> stage, etc) from this worldly rock and changes the lyrics, hoping 
> to appeal to all those who want what the world offers but with a 
> different message.

this statement is false. not all performers have the same motives, and
it is impossible for you to rightly make generalizations about performers
who happen to fall under the "Christian" label.

> When non-believers look at these "conforming" Christians, they 
> don't really see any difference.

another false premise.

> They aren't pointed to Jesus Christ, the savior.  They are not 
> brought to a position of repentance, belief, and desire for 
> salvation.

yet another one.

> No, instead they find the music and "look" appealing because it is 
> exactly what they had.  They don't have to give up anything to 
> follow Christ.

more...

> "Hey, I can follow Christ and be just like I was before!"  if they 
> even see Christ at all.

and another.

this is the basis of your article, and it is all false. while i would
be the last person to challenge your personal convictions, i must 
protest when such patently false premises are used to damn something 
that has had an edifying effect on many.

> I was convicted by the Holy Spirit through God's word on this subject.  

this sounds suspiciously like a certain Steve Taylor song...

Turn on your radio to a down home drawl
Hear a Brylcreem prophet with a message for y'all
"Well Ah have found a new utensil in the devil's toolbox
And heads are gonna roll if Jesus rocks!
God's music should be divine!
Try buying records like mine!
Avoid temptation."

Guilty by association

..You've got no choice,
'Cause you heard a revelation from a still small voice (GUESS WHO!)
if the Bible doesn't back it then it seems quite clear:
Perhaps it was the DEVIL who whispered in your ear!

Guilty by association


jason 'Ah only drink milk from a Christian cow!' steiner

--
"Nine out of ten men, women & children enjoy a cold beverage." - Letterman
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,` jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu ,`,`,`
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: iba@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Wayne Iba)
Subject: Re: What do you do when your child thinks Metallica is cool?
Organization: NASA/ARC Information Sciences Division
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 20:27:33 GMT


 (andrew.j.whitman) writes:

>>You seem to feel that Christianity and Philosophy are polar opposites.

and (Noel Estabrook) writes:

>No, not really.  In fact, in the truest sense, Christianity IS a 
>philosophy.  It's just that any philosophy besides Christianity is 
>inconsistent.

[This is not strictly in the spirit of the thread from which the above
is taken and it has nothing to do with r.m.c, but tough.]

I strongly disagree with this statement Noel.  In fact, I believe
that it is closely related to much of the damage and trouble the
church has seen in the guise of religion.

Christianity is _not_ a philosophy, but rather a relationship with a
person Who created the universe, and died so that I might live.
Totally different.

But _as_a_philosophy_, chrisitanity is just as inconsistent (or more
so) as any other world-view that abounds.

Just wanted to clear any potential misconceptions resulting from the
above. 

--wayne (iba@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov)
From: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt - K31)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: What do you do when one of your own
Keywords: makes Metallica look good?
Date: 16 Nov 92 20:04:19 GMT
Reply-To: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil
Organization: Naval Surface Warfare Center


Mark Christensen writes:
>By 'full' do you mean an unsanctified, "do what I want to do" life or
>do you mean sanctified and obedient?  I attempt to live the latter
>and find my life quite "full". 

Hmmm sanctified.... that means something like holy right?
Holy because you listen to the right christian music as opposed
to the wrong christian music?  

I think I've been had, and its not even April 1.  Let me see, this
is starting to sound a lot like:
	- shouldn't eat meat at all
	- shouldn't eat meat sacrificed to idols
	- have to be circumcised
or more temporally
	- shouldn't have instrumental music in church
	- gifts of the Holy Spirit died out with apostles
	- shouldn't serve wine instead of grape juice or vis versa
And now re-introducing
	- christian rock is bad

Anybody know any real good songs about legalism?

Reminds me of the Church of Christ joke (and yes I was one :-)
Guy gets to heaven, St. Peter showing him around, in this
room are the baptists, having a great time fellowshiping and praising,
here the methodists, and so forth as they walk down  a great hall
in a great mansion.... at the end of the hall signs everywhere:
SSHHHHHH
QUIET
No Talking

what is all this about, he asks St. Peter
That's the Church of Christ, they think they are the only ones here.

		Peace!
		Stephen

Hey Casey, did I do a better job this time?  :-)
Xref: sparky rec.music.christian:8437 alt.rock-n-roll.metal:11934 alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy:4410 alt.thrash:1881 alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive:290 rec.mag:262 alt.zines:227 rec.music.industrial:13410
From: Phil.Powell@launchpad.unc.edu (Phil Powell)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian,alt.rock-n-roll.metal,alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy,alt.thrash,alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive,rec.mag,alt.zines,rec.music.industrial,rec.music.hardcore
Subject: Intermosh Update - CONTEST WINNER!!!
Date: 15 Nov 92 23:12:15 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service


** WE HAVE A WINNER **

In October we ran a New Name contest for my magazine (formerly Cephas
Magazine) with prizes going to the winner..

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN: We got one!

Thanx for everyone who replied.. the winner is ** STEVE DREES ** (please
email me with mailing address) with the name

SCREAMS OF ABEL

Steve will receive (lovely assistant Clarkette models):

Issues #1,2 and 3 of Teeth Magazine
Issues #4 and 5 of Cephas Magazine
Issue #1 of Cephas/Teeth Magazine
One autographed Sacrament photo
One issue of People of Destiny Magazine 

Thanx again to everyone who entered and look for the debut of SCREAMS OF
ABEL Magazine by the end of November...

** Also **

Veni Domine Update: I heard them, they're AWESOME! Total gothic metal in
the vein of Dream Theater and Crimson Glory.. they're apparently from
Sweden (or wherever Sultasunna is), a 4-piece and are working with
ex-Seventh Angel bassist Simon Bibby.. 

**********

BTW does anyone know Midnight (Crimson Glory)'s real name?

Thanx

Phil
Editor, SOA (formerly Cephas)

End of an era, beginning of the Exciting New One!

PS: I forgot to mention almost, Veni Domine's lyrics are taken quite
literally from the Book of Revelation..


--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: paiz@Ingres.COM (Hide the beer, the pastor is here!)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Out of the Grey
Date: 19 Nov 92 21:34:16 GMT
Organization: ASK Computer Systems, Ingres Product Division
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1

In article <1992Nov19.185101.2674@wdl.loral.com>, trw@spl1.spl.loral.com (Tim R Witort)            writes...
>Several people have sort of mentioned OotG in passing
>lately but no one has said what needs to be said.....
>They are an *outstanding* duo! IMHO, their debut album
>is one of my favorite of 1992. It is sharp, inventive,
>very poetic, and packs a good rock wallop! 

I saw Out of the Grey a few months ago while they were opening for Charlie 
Peacock and thought they were really good. She can really sing and the guy 
is a very talented guitar player. We bought their CD a couple of weeks later
and were dissapointed by it. Not only does it not convey the energy of the 
group, but it is overproduced. I like Charlie Peacock alot, but I think that 
lately he has been overproducing his material. All of this is of course IMHO.


>I highly,
>HIGHLY, *HIGHLY* recommend giving them a serious 
>listen. If they keep up this kind of work, they'll
>quickly become my (and many others) favorite group.
> 

I think that if they could simplify the production of their next records, then
they will become quite popular. 


>-- Tim
> 
>`````````````````````````````````````````````````````
>``  He is not silent; He is not whispering;        ``
>``  We are not quiet; we are not listening.        ``
>``  He sends a lifeline.                           ``
>``  We keep resisting Him.                         ``
>``  He is not silent; we are not listening.        ``
>``                                                 ``
>``                  -- "He is not Silent"          ``
>``                     Out of the Grey             ``
>``                                                 ``
>`````````````````````````````````````````````````````

This is my favorite of their songs, especially live.


erwin 

paiz@ingres.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: harling@miki.pictel.com (Dan Harling)
Subject: Re: TANGENT: "Christian" as an adjective
Organization: PictureTel Corporation
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 17:16:33 GMT

In article <1992Nov16.205718.5493@kronos.arc.nasa.gov> iba@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Wayne Iba) writes:
>crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford) writes:
>
>>In light of the current (ongoing?) discussion about "Christian" vs.
>>"non-Christian" music, I'm reminded of what somebody somewhere said about
>>the use of the word "Christian" as an adjective rather than as a noun. 
>>That individual (can't remember who it is) said that he didn't think it
>>should ever be used as such, that Christians have created a culture and
>>filled it with certain things that they then define as being "Christian." 
>>Is anyone else familiar with this thinking?  
>
>I've said this before and I'll say it again (although I don't think
>I originated it).

I think it was C.S. Lewis who pointed out the problems with using
"Christian" as an adjective, perhaps in _Mere Christianity_.  It is
also one of my pet peeves, as I am a Christian and a musician, but not
a "Christian musician".


>>How would you define something as being "Christian"?  
>
>As having made the choice to lay down its life, take up its cross, and
>follow Jesus, thankfully receiving the forgiveness offered and
>obediently loving its fellow things as equally worthy of God's grace
>as itself.

Anything else, and "Christian" defines a set of approved objects and
behaviors (much like the Pharisees did), not a person and his
relationship to his Savior.  How utterly destructive!
____________________________________________________________________________
Daniel A. Harling                        (harling@pictel.com)
PictureTel Corp.             Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of
Peabody, MA  01960                    PictureTel Corp. (so there)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: cwf50862@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (The Last Bard)
Subject: Re: I Still Believe (Russ Taff's version)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 20:29:13 GMT
Keywords: Russ Taff Call

trw@spl1.spl.loral.com (Tim R Witort) writes:

>In article <1992Nov16.161540.23160@olaf.wellesley.edu>, kwolters@fred.wellesley.edu (Keith Wolters) writes:
>|> Hi,
>|> 
>|> I am a big fan of The Call and when I heard that Russ Taff had done a
>|> cover of their song "I Still Believe" I was interested in hearing it.
>|> I have not yet heard it although I recently purchased another of Russ
>|> Taff's CDs and really enjoy it.  Is there anyone who has heard both
>|> versions of "I Still Believe" (and the version from the soundtrack of
>|> "The Lost Boys" movie for that matter) and can comment on which they
>|> like best?

>   I've heard The Call's rendition and Russ Taff's. I prefer
>Russ' version because his voice seems to match the song better
>and the instrumentation he used had a little more of an edge
>that I thought the song needed.
>   BTW Russ sings the song on his self-titled album "Russ Taff."
>It is, IMHO, his best album by FAR... GET IT!!!!

>-- Tim

I first heard "I still believe" when it was sung by the Call, and I like it
best.  To me Russ Taff's version misses some of the feeling and rythm of the
original.  But I do say if you have to hear it...listen to Russ before you 
listen to the Lost Boys version, which has got to be one of the worst cover
songs I have ever heard.

chip

Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: belville@athena.mit.edu (Sharon Belville)
Subject: Re: hymns
Keywords: TANGENT virus at bottom of post BEWARE
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:16:49 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.175124.24348@relay.nswc.navy.mil> snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil writes:
>An obscure question:
>From the same dim memories of my past, I remember our hymn books
>having angular musical notes, quarternotes were diamonds for
>instance, does anyone have any idea why this was done????

Ah -- you're remembering "shape notes".  It wasn't the value of the note that
determined the shape, it was the pitch in the scale, i.e., "do" (C in the key
of C, G in the key of G) was always a triangle shape, "sol" (a fifth above
"do" -- G in the key of C, F in the key of B flat) was always a circle, etc:

 do == triangle pointing up
 re == kettledrum (flat on top, curved on bottom)
 me == diamond
 fa == pennant (triangle pointing left, or maybe pointing away from the stem)
 sol == circle
 la == square
 ti == ice cream cone (curved on top of "v" shape)

This was for folks who couldn't read music -- to whom key signatures meant
nothing, but they could/would learn the intervals, then you would just have to
give a "do" on a pitch pipe or the like and all 4 parts could find their
starting note.  The songleader in my parents' church at home "reads" music
like this -- their song books have shape notes.

When I took a music class in which we learned how to sight sing, we learned
the intervals with numbers -- doing drills like 1-3-5-3-1 (do-me-sol-me-do) --
I brought in a shape note song book and shared the same technique w/the class
:-)  

A bit of trivia -- enjoy!

Take care,

--
Sharon Belville
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: musicman@camelot.bradley.edu (Michael Rebholz)
Subject: Re: Amy Grant's Old Xmas Album--Question
Organization: Bradley University
Date: 23 Nov 92 22:42:14 GMT

In <ktrgovac.6.722550571@fireworm.watstar.uwaterloo.ca> ktrgovac@fireworm.watstar.uwaterloo.ca (Karin Trgovac) writes:

>Does anyone know if Amy Grant's Old Christmas Album was released on CD??
>I have looked all over and cannot find it.  Is there a mail order or
>something.  Maybe the problem is that I'm in Canada.

I am holding the cd in my hand.  I got it from BMG.  If you wanted to try
that avenue, contact me and I'll give you the address of how to get it.  

It does exist.  The title is Amy Grant: A Christmas Album  copyrighted by
Word in 1983.  It is put out by A&M records.

--
	        	/\/\usicman  aka: Michael Rebholz
	                   musicman@camelot.bradley.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: rhine@cwis.unomaha.edu (Dan J. Richters)
Subject: cornerston reminicing
Summary: blah
Keywords: c stone
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 06:31:33 GMT

 
	networkland hello.

i went to c stone 92 and due to my strange concept of time, it seems like
only yesterday. ide like to hear some other's expperiences there, even
though i wont provide a shining example right now.

impressions i have of cston 92:

	phenomenal music
	spectacular light shows (provided by God Himself)
	lovely mud
	wonderfully warm rain
	lovely  mud
	mud squshing between my toes
	all the seminars i didnt go to but would like to hear about
	phenomenal music right up to the ever amazing and annointed 
	violet burning
	phenomenal music
	mud
	tents
	mud in tents
	tents collapsing in mud
	phenomenal music
	ect.



--
?
From: schouten@sp95.csrd.uiuc.edu (Dale Schouten)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: What is industrial music?
Date: 16 Nov 92 20:01:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: sp95.SCHOUTEN.92Nov16120155
Organization: Center for Supercomputing R & D

In article <Bxs4r6.2Hn@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cb23209@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Christopher Buchholz ) writes:
> bye the way, if you're looking for good christian industrial 
> check out global wave syste

Which leads one to a question of venue.
I mean, like, I've heard a recording or 2 of Industrial Music, but
like there Industrial Concerts and stuff?  Or is it mostly just
something people record and listen to recordings of.  (It's just that
every time I envision an idustrial `battle of the bands' I get a
mental picture similar to something out of Terminator :-)

Furthermore, for us local to that music-mecca, Champaign-Urbana IL
(still doing penance for releasing REO Speedwagon to the civilized
world :-) where/how can we hear/see g***** w*v* s**t*m? [common sensoring]

Dale Schouten
schouten@uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: jmrg9881@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Reid)
Subject: Re: CCM Urban Legend? "A mighty Fortress" evolved a from drinking song
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 22:12:34 GMT

anderson@cs.rose-hulman.edu. (Claude W. Anderson) writes:

>I used to believe the famous Jimi Hendrix quote about Phil Keaggy

Heh, I heard that it was Ted Nugent.  The story changes with the times, I
guess... I wonder who it is now?
-- 
Jon Reid    j-reid@uiuc.edu    GEnie: THE.REIDS
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose."