HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ttyytt@mixcom.com (Adam Costello)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Supra Fax Modem, The Company And Their Services
Date: 18 Aug 92 15:23:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: mixcom.1992Aug18.152332.9223
Organization: Milwaukee Internet Xchange BBS, Milwaukee, WI U.S.A.

In article <64193@cup.portal.com> DBQ@cup.portal.com (DONN FREDRICK DUBUQUE) writes:
>I thought you might be interested in some 'real world' tests of three
>of the more popular modem types:  USR HST/DS(14.4k), SupraFax 14.4K,
>and the ZyXel U-1496e Faxmodem.
>
>Both the USR and ZyXel were far more tolerant of line noise and distortion
>than the Supra.  The USR and ZyXel used the proper V.32/v.32b train 
>sequence.  50% of all connect attempts between the USR and Supra resulted
>in a 'lost' call, another 25% were downsped to 12K.  Out of over 100 calls,
>the ZyXel failed to connect with the USR once.  
>
>I'd go with a ZyXel the next time out
>
>However, the ZyXel is upgradable to v.fast also, and in fact the v.32b/extende
>16.8K will be released within the next few weeks.  Designed like Supras,
>that rely upon a non-programmable DSP chipset won't be able to upgrade
>without extensive modification.  
>
>BTW, I've also owned 3 older Supras, two 2400's and one 2400+/v.42b, and
>all of them have had various lockup problems now and again.  In over 16 months
>of continuous operation the USR has never had a problem.  Over 10 months of
>operation and neither has the ZyXel.

This is very interesting.  Do you know whether an Amiga user with a ZyXel
Faxmodem can find software to let him/her send and receive faxes?  I know
Supra sells such software, but only with their Faxmodems.

Thanks,
AMC
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.hardware:13979 comp.sys.amiga.tech:48
From: sjeyasin@axion.bt.co.uk (Swaraj Jeyasingh)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.tech
Subject: Can this be done ?
Date: 12 Aug 92 15:17:08 GMT
Reply-To: sjeyasin@axion.bt.co.uk
Organization: British Telecom Labs
Organisation: BT Laboratories, Martlesham Heath, IPSWICH UK

Can any one tell me if I can connect a A500 to a MFM type Hard Disk.

I have a A590 already connected and I was given the MFM HD off a PC.

Any suggestions.

thanks.

Swaraj Jeyasingh		sjeyasin@axion.bt.co.uk
BT Labs
Ipswich
England

Swaraj Jeyasingh                sjeyasin@axion.bt.co.uk
BT Labs                         Tel: 0473 646082
Ipswich
UK
From: rbabel@babylon.rmt.sub.org (Ralph Babel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Minor Annoyances with SyQuest drive
Date: 13 Aug 92 06:01:17 GMT
Reply-To: cbmvax.cbm.commodore.com!cbmehq!babylon!rbabel (Ralph Babel)

John Davis wrote in
<1992Aug12.172021.300@csc.canterbury.ac.nz>:

> we've got an old st277n and an archive 60Mb streamer hung
> off our local usenet system on a GVP combo - both the
> seagate and the tape take a while to come ready on boot,
> meaning that the GVP software tends to make them
> disappear. A warm boot fixes the seagate, unfortunately
> the time for the tape to reset means it's nigh on
> impossible to get it to appear.

GvpScsiCtrl -r

Ralph
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.misc
From: paws@spam.cray.com (Daniel Baehr)
Subject: Re: I've fallen and I can't get UPGRADED!!!
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 12 Aug 92 10:56:08 CDT


In article <BstxtL.sq@news.udel.edu>, jeremym@ravel.udel.edu (Jeremy A Moskowitz) writes:
> Hey Amigaaticks.
> 
> Where do you mount a drive when you have no more room!??
> 
> I have a 2000 with two internal floppies, an internal tape drive, and
> a Q105 HD mounted on my Trumpcard.
> 
> I'm just about to get another 105MB HD. I have NO ROOM! ACK!
> 
> Help me. How can I mount this internally?! I'm outta space!
> 
   Sell the two 105 Megers and buy a 200+ meg drive....?

   If the drive is 3.5 in .5 height you could remove one of your floppies
 and put it in place of the floppy drive?  You might not be able to get
 it flush with the front of the case but it might work.

   Or, you may have to go to an external case.  I would not recomend you 
 try to "lay" it inside somewere.  The drive could short out some traces 
 on the mother board or it could slide against one of your other internal
 cards and do some damage there.

   If you have a friend that is good at mechanical things you MIGHT be
 able to make some kind of holder so you could "suspend" it inside some
 how but that is risky also.  An external case is your safest bet.  Grab
 a Computer Shopper magazine.  You should be able to find yourself an
 external case there.  I bought an I*M compatable case with 7 drive bays
 and a 200 W power supply. It works great.  Its full, but it works great.
 :)  I bought it for $60 at a Ham Fest.

> Thanks Amigafanatics.
> -- 
>      // Email: jeremym@brahms.udel.edu------\  Monitor of---------------\
>     //  Registered Commodore Amiga Developer|  Comp.sys.amiga.EMULATIONS| 
> \\ //                    This is the Nineties Hamton - -
>  \X/            Go get a bank loan, and buy yourself a clue!


   P.S.  Make sure you have the LUN set right....:) :) :) :) :)!!!!!

    Daniel Baehr
--
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Daniel Baehr Work: paws@spam.cray.com  Home: daniel_baehr@bearsden.UUCP|
| These OPINIONS are mine and mine alone.                                |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: tw5232@albnyvms.bitnet (Teddy Wang)
Subject: AMAX vs. Emplant??????
Reply-To: tw5232@albnyvms.bitnet
Organization: University of NY at Albany
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 10:00:00 GMT

Does anybody know the status of Emplant????  After some heated arguements on 
whether or not the merchandise is VAPORWARE, most discussion of the subject has
been dropped.  Does anybody have any more info about it?  Has anybody compared
it to AMAX or AMAX plus???

Teddy

     ////////  
       //                                             twang@thor.albany.edu
      //                                              TWANG@ALBNYVMS.BITNET
     //  eddy Wang                                    TW5232@ALBNYVMS.BITNET
    //   Computer Art and Animation at SUNY Albany
         New Illusions      Albany, NY                  "Increase the Peace..."
From: Jeff.Fitzsimons@f601.n105.z1.therose.pdx.com (Jeff Fitzsimons)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Subject: XT Bridgeboard & 720K fl
Date: 14 Aug 92 23:22:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: therose.714404269.F00002

To: uteca036@unibi.uni-bielefeld.de (Ruediger Kaatz) 
 On 08-14-92 Ruediger Kaatz wrote to All... 
 
(Hopefully the person you replied to will see this) 
 
 RK> >adding the line "drivparm=/d:0/f:2" in my config.sys file but it 
 
Drivparm doesn't seem to work...  My BB gives me an unrecognized line
error...   
 
 RK> Hi! just wanted to say it`s possible to connect a 720k drive. I
did  RK> its so long ago I forgot how. The second prob the PCPrefs will
 
I found that the drive could be read and written to, but programs (such
as format, PCTools) refused to recognize it as 720K.  DEVICE=DRIVER.SYS
works, but the drive has to be called D: or higher (E:, etc.) to work. 
 
 
... OFFLINE 1.36 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: 8939527@hydra.maths.unsw.EDU.AU ()
Subject: Re: using Amax with drive and no roms
Keywords: I have been trying for a while ago to get info on how I can replace 
Organization: school of Mathematics UNSW
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 02:27:24 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.020230.8145@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU> temp@spectrum.cs.unsw.oz.au (Temporary Account) writes:
>In article <1992Aug8.134056.6270@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU> temp@spectrum.cs.unsw.oz.au (Temporary Account) writes:
>>the mac roms in the cartridge so that I can get Amax to read the diskdrive
>>The answer I go from one netter was that If I repla the roms with empty Eproms
>>then I could use the drive given I had the rom image on disk !! Well yesterday
>>I managed to secure the EPRoms (Cost me $40 AUS) and they didn't work. Some say
>>sucked in ? :-) Well I noticed that there was a trace cut on the board and 
>>when I joined the trace THE DRIVE WAS FULLY RECOGNISED !!!!! To bad for the roms
>>Doesn't matter. It seems that the cartridge was set up that way from the factory
>>ie. like a suttle hint. Oh for those who feal like they want to flame don't bother I wont get this message it's a temporary account, but their is the info and thanks to all that helped. I now have a fully working mac, stuff apple, to buy 
>>their roms I had to submit my faulty board so they can replace it. It was the only option. I had to take an alternative path.
>>	CYAZ
>>		ME
>>
>
>>
>
>WHAT A LOAD OF SHIT !
>There is no way in which the Amax cartrage will work without the ROM chips
>reguardless of the fact that you have the rom image on disk!!!!!!
>The roms are needed to complete the circiut ...... in order for the external mac drive 
>to work..
>Readsoft themselves state this in the manual .
>
	OK it seems that you mailed this message from this
Uni. Howz about we settla a little bet ? And a note Redysoft wont give
you the official truth let alone would they mention
the existance on roms on disk. A note to make you can complete
the circuit using empty Eproms. Yet there are no Eproms in the
cartridge. When I tried the cartridge with the Eproms the Amiga
got confused and when I placed a disk in the Amiga drive both
Amiga and mac drive lights would go on. Making it impossible yo
use the Amiga drive. After I took them out it worked great.
I might have blown a CIA chip but I have noticed no affect
tho the rest of the computer.
	CYA soon
		George


Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.emulations:3524 comp.sys.amiga.misc:12604
From: tine@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: 386 Bridgeboard Janus problem
Date: 13 Aug 92 16:23:52 GMT


>>>Hello, I am having a small problem with my 386 bridgeboard in a 3000.  I keep
>>>getting an "Cant open Janus.library" when I run the software.  Janus.library
>>>is in the libs: directory.  Is there anything else I could be doing wrong?

I had a similar problem, the solution was...simply plugging the bridgeboard
more firmly in its slot...

Stefano
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: crystal@glia.biostr.washington.edu (Crystal)
Subject: Re: XT Bridgeboard: File transfer to amiga - doesnt...
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 05:32:40 GMT


OK, I have found AREAD and AWRITE.  They are executables on my GWBASIC
disk (I had deleted the BASIC directory when I got the Amiga because I 
have no use for such a horrid language wasting my space)
I loaded everything from my BASIC original, everything from my MSDOS
original and put it all in the root directory so nobody has to go looking
in any other directory (*GADS* that's ugly file management!)

Ok...

So I do the AWRITE a:tinyfile df0:tinyfile 

And I get no error - but my cursor hops down to the next line, blinks at
me and gives me no C> at all. :<   ^C will not kill the job.  There is
disk activity on my a: drive, none on my df0:   I am forced to reboot
the machine if I wish to continue playing with MS-DOG...
 
Well, at least I'm getting closer...but apparently I'm still missing
something somewhere...(and yes, I had clicked on PCDISK before issuing
the AWRITE command)

I *WILL* get this figured out! 

Crystal
  ;>
   ?
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: harley@tt.com (Scott Drysdale)
Subject: Re: Janus 2.1 on ftp?
Organization: Telecommunications Techniques Corporation, Germantown MD
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 16:58:35 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.205915.4927@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> bobby@selenium.cchem.berkeley.edu.UUCP (The Bobster) writes:
>Is there an FTP site that has the "amouse.drv" file from
>Janus 2.1? 

the amouse3.drv file from janus 2.1 will not work with janus 2.0 software.
you need the whole kit and kaboodle.

>	  - Bobby

  --Scotty
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
scott drysdale (harley@tt.com, ...!uunet!debbie!harley), software mercenary.
formerly mr. bridgeboard @ cbm.  soon to be a seaman recruit in the us navy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: tstark@netcom.com (Timothy Stark)
Subject: Re: ATOnce (ancient model) and WB 2.04
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 00:51:32 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

ldtaylor@tbag.tscs.com (Lance Taylor) writes:

>Okay, here's the sitch:
>   I AM currently trying to run my A500 in 'Wienie' mode - i.e., no accelerators, some memory, and WB2.04.  I am ALSO trying to get my ATonce to work with it... but the old ATOnce doesn't WORK with 2.04... so, I bought a ROM switcher...

>It all worked fine until I got my Agnus upgraded to a Fat (8372a) model... now, it boots normal-like, but locks up RIGHT AFTER accessing drive A: for the boot disk.

>Any suggestions as to why this is doing such, or even better, HOW to fix it?  The A530 is looking more and more distant, and I am not buying a Series II if the A530 is out... so, should I forget about it and just use my school's IBMs?

>--- Via UCI v1.02 (C-Net Amiga)

Hello Everyone:
    You can contact Vortex in Germany to get new software for 2.04. ATOnce
Emulation version 2.33 or above will with OS 2.04 without requiring
ROM switcher. I have it now. 

    Warning!! Telecom software will not work properly on ATOnce as
Prodigy, Qmodem, etc. I tried to access modem but entire AT mode
locks up!

-- Tim Stark

-- 
Timothy Stark               Internet: tstark@netcom.com
837 North Van Dorn St       GENIE: T.STARK1
Alexandria, Va. 22304-2723  TDD Phone Number: (703) 212-9731
"Washington, DC is the most deaf population!! -- Gallaudet University"
From: Jim_Drew@cryo.rain.com (Jim Drew)
Subject: Re: Emplant IBM
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: BBX-UMB 0.16 7/17/92 (Beta)
Date: 14 Aug 92 01:02:28 PDT
Organization: Cryogenic Software - Portland, OR

>  JD> What?  First of all, there is no new "chip-set" to replace the
>  JD> existing
>  JD> chip-set.  The new CBM machines function fine with EMPLANT.
> 
> There is a chipset coming out soon (will be announced end of September)
> that is widely being called the Double-A chipset. It offers double the
> bandwidth of the current chipset. This means 8 bit hires, and hires 64
> register HAM mode.
> 
> You gotta keep up with things there, Jim. The new machines being announced
> soon do not have this new chipset in them. They are just new faces on old
> products, and one new product that has stuff in it that you can put
> together yourself (the 040 tower, which replaces the 3000T).
> 
> If you are not a registered Commodore developer, then I suggest that you
> become one, and you would find this information out.
> 
> -- Via DLG Pro v0.995
> 
Well, obviously you are *not* a registered developer or you would not be
spatting your mouth off...

Jim Drew - Vice President, Utilities Unlimited, Inc.
           jdrew@cryo.rain.com
   1641 McCulloch Blvd. Suite #25-124    Lake Havasu City, AZ  86403
 
 (602) 680-9004 {office}      (602) 680-9006 {FAX}    (602) 453-9767 {BBS}
From: slbfn@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Subject: Emplant IBM and Bridgeboard Slots
Date: 15 Aug 92 01:46:47 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

Just a quick question on Emplant:

Will the IBM version be able to access cards in the BridgeBoard slots?
A see that some sort of connector must be "hacked", but it would be 
really nice to see SVGA graphics while running OS/2 2.0 on a multi-function
SVGA - I/O - 8MB RAM card.

							--Travis Carter
							  slbfn@cc.usu.edu

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: harley@tt.com (Scott Drysdale)
Subject: Re: Emplant IBM
Organization: Telecommunications Techniques Corporation, Germantown MD
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 17:12:43 GMT

In article <16ajlhINNhq1@network.ucsd.edu> simon@ivem.uucp (Simon Lee) writes:
>In article <James_Hastings-Trew.0i8q@telepro.UUCP> James_Hastings-Trew@telepro.UUCP (James Hastings-Trew) writes:

... misc doodoo about non-disclosure agreements deleted ...

>>And to Commodore - let's quit acting like old ladies crying, "Who's been
>>peeking under my skirts," ok? Let's just get the darn product out there!
>
>Put yourself in your company's shoes.  You have a new product that is
>revolutionary.  Now one of your employees leaks this to the general public.
>Two things happen.  1. People rejoice.  2. People steal idea and clone.
>Now #2 won't happen (maybe), but in CBM's case, sales on older models would
>drop, if there are changes to the design, people would be misled, CBM would
>look stupid (like it does now), and things wouldn't look good for the
>computer's future.  This is purely IMHO, but to me NDA is "does not exist" in
>my opinion.  When I see it, then that's when it exists.

#3 - people stop buying the existing product and wait for the "new, improved"
product to come out.  sales are lost.  customers get pissed as the rumored
product gets later and later.

>And I agree.  CBM better come out with something new and exciting.  I'm bored.

well...

  --Scotty
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
scott drysdale (harley@tt.com, ...!uunet!debbie!harley), software mercenary.
formerly mr. bridgeboard @ cbm.  soon to be a seaman recruit in the us navy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: mrubino@csws2.ic.sunysb.edu (Michael N Rubino)
Subject: Re: Were is SYS 6.05 ?
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 22:00:20 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.070133.1813@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU> 8939527@hydra.maths.unsw.EDU.AU () writes:
>	Were can I find System 6.05 ? I have found sys 6.07 at the 
>apple archives but it crashes on my A3000. Has anybody managed to get
>6.07 working with Amax II, what are the software upgrades from Amax II -> 
>Amax II+ or even Amax I -> Amax II+ ?

6.0.5 is noon Apple's FTP site.  Try your local Mac dealer.

Sounds like you're running A-MaxII v2.0x.  You must be running v2.5x in order
to use any system newer than 6.0.5.  The upgrade to v2.5 is $50.

>	All info appreciated.
>		George

-- 

- Mike
  mrubino%csws1.ic.sunysb.edu@sunysb.edu <--- use this address for email.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Subject: Re: XT Bridgeboard & 720K floppies??
From: fheitkamp@desire.wright.edu
Date: 16 Aug 92 21:31:17 EST
Organization: Wright State University 

In article <1992Aug14.121911.3180@unibi.uni-bielefeld.de>, uteca036@unibi.uni-bielefeld.de (Ruediger Kaatz) writes:
>>
>>Eric Edmonds
>>UMASS at Lowell
>>Dept of Nuclear Engineering
>>
> Hi! just wanted to say it`s possible to connect a 720k drive. I did it but
> its so long ago I forgot how. The second prob the PCPrefs will always crasch
> until you get Janus 2.1 that one works again.
> 
> bye rudy!

	Where are you people getting Janus 2.1?  Everytime I go into my
	Commodore dealer and ask about it, they say it's not available.
	They also say the 386sx BB is only available bundled with the 
	3000.

	Fred Heitkamp

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: crystal@glia.biostr.washington.edu (Crystal)
Subject: Re: XT Bridgeboard: File transfer to amiga - doesnt...
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:18:37 GMT

In <1992Aug19.061738.3596@desire.wright.edu> fheitkamp@desire.wright.edu writes:

>In article <crystal.714162279@glia>, crystal@glia.biostr.washington.edu (Crystal) writes:
>> In <crystal.714083927@glia> crystal@glia.biostr.washington.edu (Crystal) writes:
>> 
>>>Can anyone help?
>> 
>>>Thank you,
>>>Crystal
>>>  :>
>> 
>> ----------------
>> 
>>
>	There should be a disk for the PC side labeled Janus utility disk.
>	I made a directory on my PC side labeled Janus and put these files
>	there.  

>	Make sure the PC path goes to the janus directory.   You must also
>	have PCdisk running on the Amiga side.  I think you can put the command
>	run >nil: PCDisk in your startup-sequence (or user-startup, if
>	you have 2.04).  This is all there is to it.  You must have, of
>	course, janus.library in your expansion drawer.

>	Hope I've helped.

>	Fred Heitkamp,  ** Not an organization ***


Yes, you have helped IMMENSELY!!!

There is NO Janus utility disk in the stuff that she gave me.  I have only
2 5.25 floppies: MSDOS 3.2 and GWBASIC 3.2.  I have searched all manuals
for a "hidden" floppy that might have gotten misplaced.  I called her at
work and she says she has given me everything.

How do I get a hold of the missing files on that PC Janus disk???

THANK YOU!!! 

Crystal
  ;>
From: johnw@bobcat (John F. Wiederhirn)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Subject: Re: Emplant speed...
Date: 18 Aug 92 18:18:44 GMT
Organization: Commodore Applications and Technical Support

bell@comute.enet.dec.com (Shane L. Bell) writes:
> 
> I do know that at least with the 8086(88) you can't move data from on memory
> location to another in one instruction which only takes one instruction on a
> 68000 so therefore I'm sure that the problem of needing more than on
> instruction to map a single instruction would only be a problem in the other
> direction.
> 

Don't be so sure.  There are 80x86 instructions like the string operations
which simply have no direct 680x0 counterparts.  The same is true in terms
of addressing modes and instructions.

For many of the instructions, there are not 1:1 680x0 counterparts, and at
that point hardware decoding of instructions becomes a non-trivial exercise.
I wish Mr. Drew the best of luck, but remain skeptical that a CPU like the
386 or 486 can be emulated with any semblance of speed.
-- 
==========================================================================
       John Wiederhirn - Commodore Applications & Technical Support
         {uunet,rutgers}!cbmvax!johnw  johnw@cbmvax.commodore.com
From: 01ksdavis@bsu-ucs.uucp
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Subject: Re: Where to get sytem disks
Date: 18 Aug 92 13:57:15 GMT

]In article <CONSP03.92Aug17195247@bingsunn.cc.binghamton.edu>, consp03@bingsuns.cc.binghamton.edu (Kriston J. Rehberg) writes:
> In article <jdrew.0hnj@cryo.rain.com> jdrew@cryo.rain.com (Jim Drew) writes:
> 
>>(Lloyd Sumpter) writes:
>>>I'm kina confused here. Are we talking about the Mac's Operating System
>>>disks? Aren't they copyright Apple Corp? (i.e. you gotta BUY them!)
>>>
>>>--
>>>
>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<semi-YAHOO>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>                    Lloyd_Sumpter@mindlink.bc.ca
>>>             "Amiga made it - Commodore screwed it up"
>>
>>Actually, the MAC OS is given away (yes FREE) by the MAC dealers in
>>Oregon, California, and Washington.  I do not know if this is common
>>practice in the rest of the U.S.  I do know that according to Apple's
>>System 7 documentation, you are allowed to actually loan out your system
>>disks to anyone.
> 
> The agreement states that you must own a real Apple Macintosh computer
> in order to use the system software.
> 
> Kris
> --
> Kriston J. Rehberg, POD Consultant          consp03@bingsuns.cc.binghamton.edu
> Binghamton University Computing Services    CONSP03@BINGVAXA.BITNet
> #include <stddisclaimer.h>                  "Labra lege:  Hackito ergo sum"
> "Your lack of common decency reminds me of a computer" - emacs M-x flame
	If that is indeed what we are talking about, you can FTP them from
several places for free with no legal questions.  I think the only thing Apple
claims to have a copywright on, other than the MacRoms and the ever popular
"Look and Feel"  (anyone else remember that boondoggle:) is the names of their
computers themselves.

	When you FTP, they do not check for identification other than your
email address.  The catcher here is you have to have access to a Mac that is
preferably connected to your local area network (FTPing at 19.2K is a LOT
faster than 2400!) and the according software, not to mention four blank disks.

	Kyle