HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk (Leo Smith)
Subject: Re: Hungarian GP
Reply-To: shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 09:34:00 +0000

Bob Barker writes..

'...It would be interesting to know why he [Mansell] dogged it so badly at the
start...'


Well: As an armchair theorist, lets have fun speculating, and see if
we can come up with a theory conssistent with the facts, and
rumoours.


        1/. Patrese was PISSED off. James hunt said he was really
        angry. I think Frank just gave him the boot, and maybe he
        doesn't have a team to go to.

        2/. Patrese pulled out the stops - and switched off the rev
        limiter to get the drop on Nigel. He reported later 'my
        engine went sour after 20 laps' I wonder why....As Murray
        said, its the first engine failure for Renault. But Patrese
        wants to two-finger Williams, and Nigel has no axe to grind.
        So he let him go.. See the way the two Willimas are evenly
        matched for the first few yards, and then Patreses surges
        away. Looks like he held a lower gear longer to me.

        3/. Senna simply outbraked Mansell. He has nothing to lose by
        taking Nigel off. Nigel used his head and let him go.

        4/. The irrepressible Berger just followed Senna. Good for
        him. On soft tyres they had the edge into the first corner
        anyway.


I prophesy that with the championship out of the way, but few of next
years contracts signed, we are in for some amusing racing at SPA.

See you there.



From: boell@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Donald P Boell)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 18:28:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Cheap open wheel racing
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport

As an SCCA flagger since 1984 I've worked events where karting was on the
ticket.  I have seen horrible incidents involving Karting.  We are talking
serious injury here.  It may be a thrill, but you are taking a big chance.

F440 cars are fairly quick but the ride sucks.  A lot of drivers I know need
to wear special restraints (similar to the kind worn by people using jack
hammers) to keep the internal organs from flying about.  

For my $ I'd take Formula Vee.  Its a bigger market than F440 with a lot
more competitors.  As such, there are usually a lot of used cars available
at a reasonable price.  There are also some newer body designs that are
quite attractive.

************************************************
* Donald Boell - Hewlett Packard               *
*                                              *
* When you're chewing on life's gristle        *
* Don't grumble, give a whistle - Monty Python *
*                                 Life of Brian*
************************************************


Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: welty@cabot.balltown.cma.COM (richard welty)
Subject: Re: Senna & Prost to Williams. Mansell retires.
Organization: New York State Institute for Sebastian Cabot Studies
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 22:05:09 GMT

In article <15180@suns6.crosfield.co.uk> ab@crosfield.co.uk (Andrew Bradley) writes:
>I believe that Post is trying to stop Senna joining him at Williams.

>And Mansell won't work with Prost either.

>I think this only leaves Mansell and Senna as a viable option.

quite frankly, i think that Prost and Mansell will get along better
than either Prost/Senna or Mansell/Senna; especially since williams is
much less likely to play the `prefered driver' game than ferrari
(that game being most of the reason for Mansell's problems with Prost
as a teammate.)

in my estimation, we've been looking at a mild bit of posturing, which
is now being followed by a rapid arrival at contracts by Prost and Mansell,
both of whom probably figure that a Prost/Mansell team is the best deal
that either of them can hope for.  they both hate the thought of Senna as
a teammate more than anything else ...

if frank w gives them equal cars next year, then it might even be a happy
relationship for a while.

as for Patrese, we can all be quite certain that right now, his driving
is intended to attract attention, followed by a contract, from another
team.  he'll not be a `good number 2 driver' for the remainder of the year.

cheers,
  richard
-- 
richard welty                            518-393-7228
welty@cabot.balltown.cma.com
  ``if you can read this, mario, you're too close''
    -- bumper sticker seen on a CART safety truck
From: t9014143@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Sennas $0.00 offer
Date: 17 Aug 92 16:37:11 GMT
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

Can anyone confirm what James Hunt said at Hungary about Senna offering his
services to Williams next year for free.

No salary seems an unbelievable statement for an driver the calibre of Senna.
But under consideration he wants another championship badly and the records
that may come with this(most wins in a season for example).
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: martin@inferenzsysteme.informatik.th-darmstadt.de (Martin Protzen)
Subject: Re: Hungarian GP
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:16:31 GMT
	<1992Aug16.175207.14924@cabot.balltown.cma.COM>
	<bvandepe.714093885@adelphi> <1992Aug18.014812.4308@rdg.dec.com>
Organization: TH Darmstadt

In article <1992Aug18.014812.4308@rdg.dec.com> winalski@adserv.enet.dec.com (Paul S. Winalski) writes:

   bvandepe@physics.adelaide.edu.au (Ivan E. Rection) writes:

   |>>nice of the
   |>>broadcasters to pick up on _why_ michael schumacher's rear wing decided
   |>>to part ways with him.
   |>
   |>>i wonder if there were fisticuffs in the beneton pits later?
   |>
   |>Could you elaborate on this please? The BBC coverage seemed to imply that
   |>Schumacher had previously been rear-ended and had his wing damaged. Was
   |>something said on ESPN (or whatever) to suggest otherwise?

   It was Schumacher's teammate, Martin Brundle, who rear-ended him, causing the
   wing to snap off seconds later.  From the replays, it looked like the incident
   was at least partly Schumacher's fault--he moved over on Brundle unexpectedly.

I'm not sure about this. Brundle was certainly held up by Schuhmacher, who in turn
was held up by another car. But Brundle was not fast enough to pass him at this 
point of the race (there was an incident earlier in the race where Schumacher
blocked Brundle). Brundle was driving very aggressive in this race - too aggressive
in my opinion. Only a few laps after he had eliminated Schumacher he hit Berger
in the rear - this time a very obvious mistake, he almost burnt his tires.

Martin.
--
------------------------------------------------------
Martin Protzen          Department of Computer Science
                     Technical University of Darmstadt
Alexanderstr. 10             D-6100 Darmstadt, Germany
Phone: +49 6151/16-4494          Fax: +49 6151/16-5326
Net: martin@inferenzsysteme.informatik.th-darmstadt.de
From: jimd@pequod.gvg.tek.com (Jim Delwiche)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Proposal: rec.autos.formula1
Date: 20 Aug 92 23:23:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: gold.5059
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1992Aug20.170024.24654@nwra.com> mark@nwra.com (Mark) writes:
>
>So, rec.autos.formula1 is unambiguous, as would be
>rec.autos.racing.tech, if this group wants to form subgroups.

For starters, how about rec.autos.racing, to avoid the sports car confusion.

To avoid dividing the group by formula, which would lead to:

rec.autos.racing.gob
rec.autos.racing.indycars
rec.autos.racing.f1
rec.autos.racing.how_bout_the_quarter_mile_you_guys
..etc..

perhaps we could try:

rec.autos.racing.intl
rec.autos.racing.usa

This would lump F1, rallyes, WSC, etc together, leaving Indycars,
GOBs, local bullrings, NHRA, etc, in the .usa category.  I'll probably
get flamed, but I'd guess a GOBs fan would be more likely to follow
Indycars than, say the European rallye scene, or LeMans.  Those
hardcores who know what number both Nigel and Dale have on their cars
could of course subscribe to both groups.

Jim
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (David Cornutt)
Subject: More ancient history?
Organization: NASA/MSFC
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 18:06:10 GMT

While we're discussing Ontario and ancient history...

Does anyone remember that there were plans to build a superspeedway
near Ft. Walton Beach, FL?  This would have been around 1971.  I seem
to remember USAC making a big deal out of it; there was going to be
a Quadruple Crown of 500-mile races, one each at Indy, Ontario, Ft. 
Walton, and Pocono.  They were going to offer a big cash bonus, a
la the Winston Million, to anyone who won all four in the same
season.  I think I even saw a photo of the track under construction;
it looked like it was going to be similar to Pocono.

There is nothing operating down there now, as far as I know.  I've
never been to Ft. Walton myself, so I can't say.  Does anyone remember
this, or know what became of it?

-- 
David Cornutt, New Technology Inc., Huntsville, AL  (205) 461-6457
(cornutt@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov; some insane route applies)
"The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my employer,
not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary."
From: tiok_kl@tac.fi (Kari Leminen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Hungarian GP
Date: 18 Aug 92 08:26:49 +0300
Organization: City of Tampere

>In article <bvandepe.714093885@adelphi>, bvandepe@physics.adelaide.edu.au (Ivan
> E. Rection) writes:
> 
> Could you elaborate on this please? The BBC coverage seemed to imply that
> Schumacher had previously been rear-ended and had his wing damaged. Was
> something said on ESPN (or whatever) to suggest otherwise?
> --
> 
> Brenton Vandepeer, University of Adelaide, South Australia.
> 
> email: bvandepe@physics.adelaide.edu.au

-- 
         Ironically it was his team mate Brundle who re-shaped
	Schumachers spoiler. Maybe Brundles nose also suffered 
	some damages.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
tiok_kl@tac.fi       Department of information technology     
Kari Leminen                      Tampere                    
                                  Finland 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: winalski@adserv.enet.dec.com (Paul S. Winalski)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Senna, Prost & Mansell
Date: 18 Aug 92 17:33:51 GMT
Reply-To: winalski@adserv.enet.dec.com (Paul S. Winalski)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation, Nashua NH


In article <93949@bu.edu>, nicos@cs.bu.edu (Nicos Kontopoulos) writes:
|>
|>So I guess the drivers competition in 1993 will be within the Williams
|>drivers. And now for the historians: Has there been such a case in RECENT
|>years (after lets say the 70s)?

Prost and Senna at McLaren (1988, wasn't it?).

--PSW
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: dougw@grebyn.com (Doug Worthington)
Subject: Re: Cheap open wheel racing
Organization: Grebyn Timesharing
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 01:16:45 GMT

In article <a#9mxcp.esprit@netcom.com> esprit@netcom.com (Alan F. Perry) writes:
>Is there any organization or location or formula or whatever where one
>can do some cheap open wheel racing?  I have no clue about what kind of
>open wheel racing is done in the U.S.
>

	Karting is the best form of racing for the money.  Write me if
you are interested in more information

dougw
dougw@grebyn.com


Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: brims@bnkl01.astro.ucla.edu (George Brims)
Subject: F1: Hungarian GP
Organization: UCLA Dept of Astronomy
Date: 17 Aug 92 09:15:40 PDT

Does anybody know when ESPN will rerun the taped coverage?
Due to a power failure, my faithful VCR recorded several hours of static early
Sunday morning. I do recall the coming events list showed a second broadcast,
but I didn't save it. Just to complete my misery I accidentally heard the result
on the radio on the way to work this morning.    :^(

George Brims
From: Alan.Crowder@prg.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: F1 Stuff
Date: 18 Aug 92 11:44:57 GMT
X-Mailer: mail-news 2.0.3


Hi Racers

Nigel Mansell gave a press conferance at his home in the Isle of Man
this morning and stated that there were only two options he was considering
for next year.

1  To defend his world title with the Williams Team.

2  To retire as World Champ.


He will not consider racing for anyone else and apart from a couple of
small points expects to be with Williams next year. He understands
Prost will be his team mate but it will be professional relationship
only not a personal one. He regards himself as a racer and Prost as a
chaufeur (sp) although he understands there will be no direct No.1 in
the team he expects the same support as he had this year.

How they both have equal support is going to be good, imagine the expense
of taking four cars everywhere.

I personally think he will retire but that i stress is only a gut feeling
i have, not as the result of any inside info. Although the phones have
been going like crazy all week between somewhere abroad and Didcot.

More when i know.

Alan
From: danjones@pyrps5.eng.pyramid.com (Dan Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: New fuel regs. for Hungarian Grand Prix???
Keywords: fuel,Hungarian Grand Prix
Date: 12 Aug 92 19:11:30 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View

graeme@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au (Graeme) writes:

>According to this morning's "Australian", FISA has changed the fuel
>regulations, and is expected to implement the changes
>at the Hungarian Grand Prix.

There will be a significant change at Hungary.  At Magny-Cours, FISA
sampled several teams fuels and has stated that these fuels could
turn out to be illegal under the CURRENT RULES.  They don't have 
an offical ruling on this yet though.  FISA says, they will *PROBABLY* 
not take any action against those teams in France, however, if samples
taken in Hungary are later ruled to be illegal, action will be taken.

So its basically up to the teams if they care to gamble.  I think the
significiance of the *PROBABLY* means that if a team does chooses to 
use these fuels and they are later ruled illegal, FISA might go back
to France and take action at that race too.  FISA is at least leaving
the door open for this.

>The changes "ban exotic-type fuels" such as used by the V10 Renaults
>in the Williams .....

So in essence, this is not a ban, mearly a warning that these fuels could
later be ruled illegal.

>It reports Williams (as has been commented here) 
>was the only team not agreeing with this change at a recent 
>"F1 summit meeting".

This is not a rules change, its a rules clarification.

>It states FISA will impose a yet-unspecified fine on any team refusing to
>use pump fuel.
>The article concludes with a comment that it is not known if 
>Williams will conform and use pump fuel, at the risk of jeopardising their
>chances at the championship....

Williams has the most to lose of course and has stated that they plan
to use more conservative fuels.

>Does anyone know anything about this?
>Has FISA actually changed the regulations at such short notice?
>Or is it just a beat-up in the local press?

This was reported in last week's AutoSport and Andrew Henry posted to r.a.s.
some of the reactions.

>On the face of it, it seems a bit unfair to change the rules in mid-stream,
>but there again when has FISA majored in fairness....

If the fuels can be found to be illegal under current rules, I don't know
how people can expect FISA to look the other way.  But maybe FISA is bluffing
and won't make a ruling until the end of the season.  If that's the case
then I think they are wrong.

Dan Jones
From: shyguy@ocf.berkeley.edu (David S. Shy)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Flashing to Pass: An Observation
Date: 18 Aug 1992 02:57:12 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: sandstorm.berkeley.edu

In article <14098@auspex-gw.auspex.com> tpickett@auspex.com (Tom Pickett) writes:
>What I wonder is why long strings of cars collect in the left lane doing
>70 MPH when the right lane is wide open for large distances.  Seems to
>me that people ought to drive in the right lane unless the car in front

I think the reason people crowd in the left lane is because they do 
consider themselves driving fast.  Plus, they probably don't want
to feel the awesome bumpy ride one gets in the right lane.  ;)
In addition, truck usually drive in the right lane and it gets annoying
to have to move to the left constantly to pass these trucks.  The
worse case, is when one truck is passing another.  When this happens,
there is usually about a .5 mile of backlag...

Is it true that you can't go to traffic school if get a ticket for going
above 85 MPH?

David Shy
shyguy@ocf.berkeley.edu

Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: khan@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (Scott Coleman)
Subject: Re: Consequences of getting a ticket
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 14:43:09 GMT

jtchew@csa3.lbl.gov (JOSEPH T CHEW) writes:

>Speaking of which: you guys in the Normal 47, take note of the increase
>in FINES here in paradise.  You've heard of "use a gun, go to jail"?
>We're heading for "use a gas pedal, go to bankruptcy court" -- another
>artifact of our state and local budget crises.  

This reminds me of the only TV commercial that actually had me laughing out
loud in recent memory. I think it might have been a Western Union commercial.
There is a guy wearing a suit standing in a courtroom before a judge. She
bangs her gavel and says "the fine is $10 for every MPH over the speed limit."
Immediately the guy responds "but that's $300!!" to which the judge responds
"Ah, I see you can ADD fast, too!"

I had to laugh in spite of myself. ;-)

--
Scott Coleman                                                    tmkk@uiuc.edu

Free Advice: It is inadvisable to read Bush's lips at an official banquet.
From: rhaar@albert.cs.gmr.com (Bob Haar)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Illegal Acceleration?
Date: 17 Aug 92 17:50:58 GMT
Reply-To: rhaar@albert.cs.gmr.com
Organization: G.M. Research Labs

In article @rpi.edu, johnsh@aix.rpi.edu (Hugh Johnson) writes:
|>In article <1992Aug17.164537.25359@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> jrd@po.CWRU.Edu (John R. Daker) writes:
|>>
|>>I have wondered about acceleration and the law.  Could I possibly be
|>>breaking some inane law by accelerating up to, but not exceeding, the
|>>posted speed limit very rapidly?  For example, using the full 0 to 45
|>>potential of my car?  
|>
|>I know someone who was dumb enough to try this in front of a cop to find out.
|>(The moron was in a screaming red '91 Corvette) He was first in line at a stop-
|>light, and there was a patrol car behind him.  He dropped his clutch and blew
|>on up to 45, the posted speed limit, where he stopped accelerating.  The cop
|>pulled him over almost immediately.  My friend tried to argue that he wasn't
|>speeding and didn't break any laws, but the cop disagreed and gave him a ticket
|>for reckless driving.  My friend went to traffic court to further argue his
|>point, but the judge decreed that smoking tires and "excessive" acceleration
|>were grounds for a reckless driving charge.  This was in a rural-suburban type
|>area, so I don't know how much urban cops would care about this.

There are also areas that have specific laws against drag racing
on public streets. WHen I was in drivers ed in Ohio, that said that
"pealing out" was considered to be prima facie evidence of drag
racing even if no other cars were involved.

Reckless driving or driving without due regard tickets are somewhat
a matter of discretion on the part of the police officer. If you are
doing something stupid, you might get one. Making the charge stick in
court is a different matter.

In any case, the answers to this question may (probably) vary from
one location to another. The best way to get an answer is to call
your state and local police and ask them.

---
	Robert Haar               InterNet : rhaar@gmr.com 
	Computer Science Dept., G.M. Research Laboratories
DISCLAIMER: Unless indicated otherwise, everything in this note is
personal opinion, not an official statement of General Motors Corp.


Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: russotto@eng.umd.edu (Matthew T. Russotto)
Subject: Re: Illegal Acceleration?
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 01:03:29 GMT
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Maryland, College Park

In article <1992Aug17.164537.25359@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> jrd@po.CWRU.Edu (John R. Daker) writes:
>
>I have wondered about acceleration and the law.  Could I possibly be
>breaking some inane law by accelerating up to, but not exceeding, the
>posted speed limit very rapidly?  For example, using the full 0 to 45
>potential of my car?  

I don't know about other states, but unless you spin your wheels, you
can accelerate as fast as you want in MD.  Unfortunately, it gets cops
attention-- even in a wimpy car-- since most people seem to think you
ought to ease back up to the limit, you break from the pack.
-- 
Matthew T. Russotto	russotto@eng.umd.edu	russotto@wam.umd.edu
Some news readers expect "Disclaimer:" here.
Just say NO to police searches and seizures.  Make them use force.
(not responsible for bodily harm resulting from following above advice)
From: glaird@hpscit.sc.hp.com (Gordon Laird)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 23:25:03 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Copnsequences of getting a ticket
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara, CA
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving

jimf@centerline.com (Jim Frost) asks:

> My question is: if the bicycle rider is not carrying ID, and is not
> required to have a driver's license, what's to stop him from giving
> false information?  (Besides the fact that it's illegal; so was
> running the stop sign.)

   Running a stop sign is an infraction of the vehicle code.  Giving a false
id to a cop is a criminal offense.  In the people's republic of CA, who knows,
it might even be a felony.  Everything else here seems to be a felony.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen)
Subject: Re: LIDAR - A detector alone is not enough!
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 19:59:11 GMT

In article <jimf.714166065@centerline.com> jimf@centerline.com (Jim Frost) writes:
>Well, one good thing about that is the cosine error would really knock
>the wind out of your apparent speed.

can't they correct for the cosine error?
i know the angle changes as the car goes by, but if you clock it
when it's at a certain spot on the road, the change should be fairly small.

-teddy
p.s. not that i *want* them to, you understand...
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: garrem@aix.rpi.edu (Matthew Olsen Garretson)
Subject: Re: Flashing to Pass: An Observation
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 15:34:44 GMT

[discussion 'bout flashing at trucks deleted]

Don't forget that flashing the headlights is also a way to warn oncoming cars of
a speedtrap that they are approaching.

While I think flashing to pass or to let trucks pull in front of you is great,
there's one drawback: you might see flashing headlights coming the other way
and slow down (heaven forbid!) unecessarily.  Happens to me anyway. Now, I
usually assume that one or two slow flashes is for passing, and that three or
more fast flashes are for speed traps.  Anyone else? 

Of course, some people flash just to get their jollies!  :)  (There's one of
them on campus here occasionally.)

-Matt
-- 
Matt Garretson                       :-)                          garrem@rpi.edu
From: ari@viipuri.nersc.gov (Ari Ollikainen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Flashing to Pass: An Observation
Date: 18 Aug 92 03:57:57 GMT
Organization: National Energy Research Supercomputer Center, Livermore CA

In article <16pou8INNspc@agate.berkeley.edu> shyguy@ocf.berkeley.edu (David S. Shy) writes:
>
>Is it true that you can't go to traffic school if get a ticket for going
>above 85 MPH?
>

Nope. You get to go to traffic school... In fact you get ordered to *GO*
to traffic school [ at least in Alameda County ]. *BUT* the ticket still
counts as 1 point...instead of 2 points!

I pleaded nolo contendre for a ticket of 93 mph [ *NOT* my true speed :):):) ]

Ari Ollikainen

SHO NUFF