HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: samlb@optilink.UUCP (Sam Bassett)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Why have the SCA, Inc.?
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:56:34 GMT
Organization: old,used Steward

In article <Bw3E1x.DvJ@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca> aryk@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca (A.J.S. Nusbacher) writes:
>And wasn't it the Stew
>and not the Board who finally dealt with that matter?

	And if there was no BoD, there would have been no Steward with
the authority & prestige to step in.  Can you say "grudge fight" three
times quickly?  How 'bout "schism" seven times slowly?

-- 
Sam'l Bassett -- System Administrator 	      (among other silly things)
Work: DSC/Optilink, 1310-C Redwood Wy, Petaluma CA 94954; 1-707-792-7253
Internet: samlb@optilink.com 		      UUCP: uunet!optilink!samlb
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: vader@meryl.csd.uu.se (]ke Eldberg)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: FRP = OOP
Date: 14 Oct 92 11:54:38 GMT
	<1992Oct13.233210.23618@PA.dec.com>
Organization: University of Uppsala, Sweden
NNTP-Posting-Host: meryl.csd.uu.se
In-reply-to: haslock@rust.zso.dec.com's message of 13 Oct 92 23:32:10 GMT

Greetings - William here.

Thanks to Fiacha for his observations redarding the relations between
the Middle Ages and the standard environment in FRP games. I would like
to add another reasom why FRP should be avoided, or ar least done only
in the privacy of pavillions or separate rooms, at events: publicity.

The SCA often have problems presenting ourselves to journalists and
other outsiders in a way that gives them the right idea. We do not
want people to come away from events or interviews with the idea that
we are a religious cult, a political movement (feudalism, monarchism)
or a sports club (only fighting). Neither do we want to be associated
with FRP -- not because there is anything wrong with it, but because
it is not US.

William
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: schuldy@progress.COM (Mark Schuldenfrei)
Subject: Re: Why have the SCA, Inc.?
Organization: Progress Software Corp.
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 17:43:45 GMT

Bertram wrote:
  The insurance issue has generated a lot of heat but very little light.
  I've been following the insurance discussion for some time, have a
  wife who speaks the language, and have a strong business background
  and as far as I can tell we're paying for a policy that protects the
  corporation, not its members (correct me if I'm wrong, folks).
  No insurance policy is going to prevent a competent attorney
  from suing possibly negligent parties as individuals as well
  as the organization they represent.  The corporation needs to
  spend some effort clarifying just *what it is* members are 
  getting for the money spent on insurance.  Once we understand
  what's going on, _then_ we can go further.

Write them, and ask.  There is an insurance booklet that the SCA
will send you, containing a copy of our policy, for $4 dollars,
I think.

Basic insurance lesson time.  Insurance is a potential source of
funds.  The Insurance that the SCA buys is like any other: under
certain circumstances, the insurance company will pay out cash
if the SCA is found liable in a court of law for monetary
damages.

One sort of insurance covers officers and directors, should they
be sued personally for failure.  Another kind is there to reassure
potential site owners that, should they need to sue us for some
reason, that there will be money available if the judge awards
it to them.  We have Workmen's Compensation insurance for the
SCA's employees, just as your work location does. We have an
equestrian policy that covers customary liabilty issues for
horses, a small amount of property insurance in case our assets
get stolen.  And we have an extra insurance rider covering foreign
insurance issues.

All of these are essentially performance contracts.  We contract
with the insurance company in a way that says "If X happens, you
pay. If not, not."

If I, as an autocrat, get sued and lose, our insurance will pay.
If a site sues the SCA, and we lose, our insurance will pay.

If Member A punches Member B in the nose, and get's sued, the
SCA insurance has nothing to do with it.

Is it time for me to repost that insurance information thing from
Hilary again?

	Tibor
--
Mark Schuldenfrei (schuldy@progress.com)
[I'm just showin' you my opinions: this ain't a gift]
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: leeu@nobeltech.se (Leif Euren)
Subject: Re: Drachenwald's future
Organization: NobelTech AB
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 08:43:31 GMT

Goodman Gerulf wrote:
> Last week the 'Drachenwald Kingdom Polling' found it's way to the
> members of the Principality.

Yes, the rumor of Drachenwald becomming a Kingdom is true.  I too have
received the poll, and answered it.  I foresee Drachenwald as kingdom
within 2 years.

	your humble servant
	Peder Klingrode


  Herr Peder Klingrode                    | Leif Euren    Stockholm, Sweden
  Holmgard, Nordmark, Drachenwald, East   | leeu@nobeltech.se

    NOTE: All opinions are my own, even if my employer claims otherwise!
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: sharons@juliet.ll.mit.EDU (Sharon Stanfill)
Subject: Parental Permissions
Organization: The Internet
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 15:01:18 GMT


On the general issue of parental permissions for under-age SCAdians....

1. If you are going to include a warning about permission slips in
	event announcements, be prepared to enforce it!  Also, be
	aware that publishing such a warning and then letting
	under-agers in anyway may well put the autocrat in a highly
	vulnerable position, legally.

2. In the case of the under-agers who showed up at the door, having
	come 100 miles... I think I might have attempted to call the
	parents - even if you couldn't get anything in writing, at
	least you would know that the parents had some idea where
	their kids were.


Nesta ferch Meriadoc Hartley
sharons@juliet.ll.mit.edu
From: rodmur@ecst.csuchico.edu (Dale Harris)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Why have the SCA, Inc.?
Date: 13 Oct 92 03:44:29 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico
NNTP-Posting-Host: caustic.ecst.csuchico.edu

In article <IeqCwKO00WB4A=xmpS@andrew.cmu.edu> David Schroeder <ds4p+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>> D: (continuing from B: I guess).  I was one of the most serious
>> Board critics in my day.  I really did investigate what it would take
>> to split a kingdom off.  The bottom line is that it doesn't really work,
>> especially if the Corporation is at all energetic about protecting the
>> use of its name and reputation.  Most scenerios end up with the SCA and
>> the splinter battling it out with most of the participants caught in the
>> middle and about ten individuals playing Death Politics ("If you play with
>> them, you can't play with us", etc.)
>
>  Sorry, but I think the ratio of adult grown-ups to adult children in
>  the SCA has changed and that a positive split and cordial continued 
>  relations are certainly possibilities, if it ever came to that.

I wouldn't count on anything, personally seeing how much bad politics and
hatred can come out of a shire trying to change something as simple as a
device, I expect a bunch of nastiness, call me cynical, but the way human
nature is and the way some people are in the SCA, I expect that things would
get bloody quick over any kind of split as major as a Kingdom leaving the SCA.


Wolfgang Rotkopf


-- 
   __        _                     Dale A. Harris  {rodmur@ecst.csuchico.edu} 
  /  )      //                           /   "There is only one Race, the     
 /  / __.  // _      , , , __.  _       /_  _  __  _  Human Race", If I 
/__/_(_/|_</_</_    (_(_/_(_/|_/_)_    / /_</_/ (_</_  quoted someone...good.
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Subject: Re: Fighter Membership
Reply-To: whheydt@PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 15:44:31 GMT

In article <9210072029.aa05443@mc.lcs.mit.edu> carole_newson-smith@net.COM (Carole Newson-Smith) writes:
>                                           10/7/92      5:10 PM
>                                       Fighter Membership
>Greetings to Hal Ravn, and also to the Rialto
>from Cordelia Toser
>
>Hal, it must have been a while since you worked
>behind the list table.  

I bow to your points about Lists tables, however, I was thinking the
general case, not the specific.

Not all combat takes place within a formal Lists.  There are challenge
fights, other forms of lists, and wars.  None of these will *have* a
Lists table--which (I presume) means the checks are done directly by
the Marshallate.

	--Hal

        Hal Ravn, Province of the Mists, West Kingdom
        Wilson H. Heydt, Jr.,  Albany, CA 94706,  510/524-8321 (home)
-- 
Hal Heydt                    |    "Boycott Time-Warner"
Analyst, Pacific*Bell        |         --J. Danforth Quayle
510-823-5447                 |    "... kill all the lawyers."
whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM    |         --William Shakespeare
From: awbaben@accucx.cc.ruu.nl (Marcel Kramer)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: One Oh
Date: 12 Oct 92 17:27:52 GMT
Reply-To: awbaben@accucx.UUCP (Marcel Kramer)
Organization: Academic Computer Centre Utrecht, The Netherlands

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject Drachenwald (was Re: One Oh)
Summary: 
Expires: 
Reply-To: awbaben@accucx.UUCP (Marcel Kramer)
Followup-To: rec.org.sca 
Distribution: 
Organization: Academic Computer Centre Utrecht, The Netherlands
Keywords: 

Greetings to the gentle readers of the list from Gerulf

No, the rumor of Drachenwald becomming a Kingdom are NOT a rumor.
Last week the 'Drachenwald Kingdom Polling' found it's way to the
members of the Principality. Afcourse the populace may decide that
they don't want to be a Kingdom after all, but this seems rather 
unlikely.
There is some time involved in doing all the proper things, so it
certainly will take some more time before it will actually happen
officially. But almost all SCA'ers I know are sure that it will
happen soon.

Yours in service,

    Gerulf
    Polderslot Pursuivant
    Drachenwald (still East KIngdom :-)


=========================================================================
=  M. Kramer, Dep. B & V, State University of Utrecht, The Netherlands  =
=  E-Mail: m.kramer@cc.ruu.nl | Phone: 31-30-533318 | Fax: 31-30-532837 =
=========================================================================
From: Beth.Appleton@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Beth Appleton)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: FRP negative stereotypes
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 16:19:22

> At events, you will see the gamers sitting/standing by themselves,
> talking games and nothing else. It seems that they get so involved
> with their gaming that they are unable to converse about other
> things. What it all boils down to is that these guys are good in
> most respects; they don't drink, scream or act offensively in any
> way, but they irritate people because they appear to be playing a
> different game than the rest of us.
> 
 b> No. You should have said that they irritate you 
 b> personally. YOU appear to 
 b> have a problem with them. I never have, nor am 
 b> likely to. I also am one.
 b> Fighters must also irritate you. As should heralds and weavers and 
 b> carpenters and politicians. Each of them talk thier own 'game' up and 
 b> play it all the time.  Tough luck. that's what life amoungst people is 
 b> like. If you can't handle something as trivial as a group of people 
 b> having a little bit of fun with their hobbies in plain view then you'd 
 b> better find a hermit's cave.
 But, fighters, heralds, weavers, carpenters, and politicians all have 
 their place within the neo-medieval world that the SCA creates.  Gamers 
 are not part of that world.  Neither are computers.  Folk with such 
 hobbies are welcome to have fun with them in public.  The SCA isn't 
 public in that wise.
     Gwenllian Cwmystwyth ferch Morfudd, former gamer, gave it up because          the real medieval world is much more interesting.

 * Origin: Herald's Point * Steppes/Ansteorra * 214-699-0057 (1:124/4229)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: The dream (tm)
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1992 19:13:00

                        *

                ON "THE DREAM (tm)"
                        -Ioseph of Locksley
      (c) copyright 1992 W.J. Bethancourt III

 Don't push your Dream at me, my lad, I've got one of my own.
 I keep it close within my heart; to very few it's shown.
 While reading as a child, I dreamed it, many years ago 
 And while watching silly movies at the downtown picture show.

    Of Robin Hood and Launcelot, of rapier blades a-gleam
    Of Richard I and Camelot, and Saladin, and Queens;
    Of Arthur and Sir Ivanhoe, of Roland and El Cid
    Of Beowulf and Cu Cuchlainn and all the deeds they did....
                              
 And, one day, I found my Dream embodied on the Earth:
 A bunch of Berkeley college kids on May Day gave it birth.
 A grand good time was had by all; they sped it on it's way:
 They took a Dream, and brought it forth; t'was called "the S.C.A."

 Don't try to kill my Dream, my lad, for Dreams will never die
 No matter how you foam and rant (and tell me it's a lie)
 I see the awe in children when they see a real-live Knight;
 I see them look, and think...and Dream...and -that's- an awesome sight!

 We didn't start with 'how it was,' but 'how it should have been,'
 The S.C.A.'s a place for -both-: You -get out- what you -put in- 
 We each can have a Dream divine; don't act so low and mean.
 You dream your Dream, and I'll dream mine: perhaps we'll meet -between-.

    Of Archery and Armored Knights, of Cavaliers and Kings
    Of Parliament and Pilgrimage, and how the Trouveres sing;
    Of Clothing and of Architects, of little children's play;
    Of how it really was back then...it's -all- the S.C.A.!
                              
                        *



... We are such stuff as Dreams are made of ............
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10

 * Origin: Herald's Point * Steppes/Ansteorra * 214-699-0057 (1:124/4229)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: corun@access.digex.com (Corun MacAnndra)
Subject: Re: The dream (tm)
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 13:44:42 GMT

In article <718672773.F00001@ocitor.fidonet> Joe.Bethancourt@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Bethancourt) writes:

[a lovely poem deleted here to save bandwidth but saved in my heart]

>... We are such stuff as Dreams are made of ............

Bravo, Ioseph. Bravo.

Corun


-- 
===========================================================================
    Corun MacAnndra    |   How much comm could a comm port port
  Dark Horde by birth  |     if a comm port could port comm?
    Moritu by choice   |
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: STEWARTL%WOO1.LEA1@leav-emh.army.MIL (LOU STEWART)
Subject: Unescorted Minorsat SCA Events
Organization: The Internet
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 15:16:35 GMT

Without exception, the teenagers and younger people I have seen have
been a welcome addition at SCA events and other gatherings.  SCA helps
to encourage study of history and culture, and to engender an increase
in courtesy in a young person.  However, in nearly all cases, the
juvenile was with parents or another adult.  Behavior should not be a
problem; as with adults, your conduct is acceptable to others in the
group or you are asked to leave.  The difficulty I see is probably a
legal matter.  If, for any reason, the young person is injured, or
needs medical attention for illness, will a doctor treat him/her with
no parental consent?  What are the legalities in the various states
concerning this?How can branches protect themselves without
discouraging these eager, fresh young individuals wanting to create a
dream with us?   Luigsech ni hIfearnain
From: pavao@cae.wisc.edu (Pavao Aaron)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Greetings, Rialto!
Date: 15 Oct 92 15:41:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: doug.1992Oct15.104102.8227
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering


	Greetings from Jararvellir!

	Before I leap full into the various discussions going on, I'd like
to know how Rialto got its name.

	Luck,

-> Shandler

(Good Luck, Raito, at Crown!)
From: Diane.Pilkington@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Diane Pilkington)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Vellum 
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 16:13:00

I am unaware of any restrictions on importing vellum into the United States.
I have an address for an Australian source of vellum; the address is six years
old, but they may still be in business.

Leo F. White, Mfg.
Rear/10 Aylesbury St., Botany, N.S.W. P.O. Box 4, Botany 2019 AUSTRALIA

I have typed here for you exactly what is on the letterhead.

As for preparation of vellum, I cannot go into great detail, as I am recovering
for surgery for carpal tunnel syndrome, and it would be inadvisable (read: 
really stupid!) for me to type that much. (Bad enough that I am the keeper of 
the Ansteorran rolls of precedence...) I recommend the following reading:

Child, Heather, ed. __The Calligrapher's Handbook__. 2nd. ed. Taplinger 
  Publishing Company: New York, 1986. p. 59-83 "Parchment & Vellum"

This is an excellent, in-depth discussion of the subject.

Good luck!

Serena Lascelles
(new to the BBS game)


 * Origin: Herald's Point * Steppes/Ansteorra * 214-699-0057 (1:124/4229)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Subject: Re: On Barons and Membership
Organization: University of Tennessee 
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 20:11:11 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.180005.12096@pbhya.PacBell.COM> whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt) writes:
> I think it appropriate to
>note that I heard a suggestion that if the BoD wants to have some
>privelege that means something, they could allow members to vote on
>BoD members...

YES!  Now THIS is a members-only privlige that I can support.

-=-=-
T. Archer  PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu
University of Tennessee
"Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking." -- Unknown
-=-=-
From: Elwyn.Halfmoon@f555.n387.z1.fidonet.org (Elwyn Halfmoon)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Mega-Dukes
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1992 16:27:00 -0500

 > James Greyhelm: 8
 > Paul of Bellatrix: 8
 > Jade of Starfall: 6 (one pending)
 > Henrik of Havn: 5 (at least)
 > Rolf the Relentless: 3 (at least--he's king now)

Here in Ansteorra, we have Duke Sir Charles Inman MacMoore, who has reigned five
times.  I don't know how many times Dutchess Sir Rowan and Duke Sir Hector have
reigned, but I believe Hector was already a Duke and Rowan was already a
dutchess when she won crown.

Is someone compiling all this and planning to repost a summary in the future? 
It would be most convienent.



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: MCKAY_MICHAEL@tandem.COM
Subject: Seneschals can give out awards!
Organization: The Internet
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 18:04:00 GMT

This has been mentioned before, but the recent messages seemed to have missed
this point.  Seneschals can give out awards.  They are just not as official as
Kingdom awards (techincally I guess they don't affect the Order of Precidence).
I don't see much difference between Baronial and Seneschal awards, except in
the matter of presentation of the award.  Niether award effects the OP, though
Antir's Baronial Seargent program seems to be an exception (this exception is
the primary reason that the West kingdom baronies have had such a hard time
starting their own Seargent programs).
    To further muddy the water, anybody can give out awards (and rewards).  How
far these are recognized depends more on social issues, than corpara or kingdom
laws.  Craidoc's bardiac awards are good example known to the Rialto.  So far
as I can see, what some people are asking for, is to make offical rules
allowing Senescahls to give out rewards (and thereby adding beauracy).  I think
it works fine now with additional laws.  Now if you want to encourage this
practice, that is a different story, but we don't need laws to do that.
    The shire of Hawks Haven (it is now a canton of Darkwood) has an award
called the "Hawks Feather", which the senescahl gives to people who have helped
the canton.  The canton of Caer Darth (also of Darkwood) had an award which
was given to people who were active in teaching at the local Dance practices.
I don't remember if it had an official name, but since the symbol was a ribbon
with a bell on it, recipients of the award became known as "jingle feet".
Obviously, these awards mean little outside of their respective areas, but I'm
proud of having my help recognized with a Hawks Feather (after helping Hawks
Haven with several of their events).  Note that I could have left "with a Hawks
Feather" off the last sentance.  But I will keep myself (by force of will) from
wandering into a discussion on awards.

Sean MacKay (aka. MCKAY_MICHAEL@tandem.com)  Caer Darth; Darkwood; Mists; West
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mittle@watson.ibm.com (Josh Mittleman)
Subject: Drachenwald's future
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 16:57:43 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

Greetings from Arval!  Tibor wrote:

>  My correspondence with members in Drachenwald, and my reading of the
> Drachenwald mailing list shows that no petion has been circulated.
> Neither the April nor July Board meeting minutes show any discussion of
> the issue...

Alan Fairfax wrote:

>   If this is a rumor, it is a particularly widespread one.  Fridrikr,
> Brigantia Principal Herald of the East, said that Drachenwald would be a
> kingdom by Pennsic XXII...  Can anyone shed some light on this?

To the best of my knowledge, as of the July Board meeting Drachenwald had
not yet polled its populace and had submitted no formal paperwork to the
Board in pursuit of kingdom status.  There has been considerable discussion
of the matter and the Board has expressed its interest in receiving a
petition.  There was informal agreement that Drachenwald could be a kingdom
by next summer, but as far as I know the formal process has not yet been
started.  Can our Drachenwalders give us an update if there have been any
new developments?

What happened at Pennsic was just schtik: It had no official meaning.

===========================================================================
Arval Benicoeur                                       mittle@watson.ibm.com
From: helm@jade.ucdavis.edu (Catie Helm)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: What is a Baron (territorial)
Date: 12 Oct 92 07:10:26 GMT
Reply-To: helm@jade.ucdavis.edu
Organization: Geology Department, University of California, Davis


Hmmmm, if you misplelled Australia and end up in Vienna by accident,
Hal....

Having lived in Vienna, mit schlag is rather appealing.  I must have
gained 5 kilos...  Alles sind schmecks in Wien, verliecht!

I got to know the American ambassador and his wife when I was in
Vienna.  When they first got there, they discovered that the state
department had shipped all their luggage to Sydney, no kidding!
It really happened!  Isn't bureuacracy fun?

On a brighter note, Robert McKlintock just offered to help me build a
new helm today  :-)  Perhaps I'll be back in armour sooner than I 
thought!  The Beaconsgate armoury has a pile of sheet metal that
Hilary donated, and we worked hard last year to get tools and anvils
and grinders.  Life looks a little less grim all of a sudden, even
with a broken foot (yes, I broke my foot this week - it never rains,
it pours...)  [Don't ask how I broke my foot - it's embarrassing...]

Twcs the Gimp
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Catie Helm, internet: helm@geology.ucdavis
Stable Isotope Lab, Geology Dept.
University of California, Davis
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca