HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sjsmith@cs.umd.edu (Stephen Joseph Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: INL play - PLEASE READ (esp INL reps)
Date: 28 Sep 92 19:18:29 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, University of Maryland at College Park

paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (FreeKill) writes:
>I have a couple problems with the INL

>A) I was very astonished on saturday when the server allowed my sunborg in
>	without a problem.  This seems very bad, especially since I don't
>	respond to any pig calls.  I can turn off the obvious features,
>	and still have a distinct advantage over other players.

I'm not a server guy, but it is my impression that adding reserved.c to the
INL server is an easy step for server gods... if they have it.  Anyone more
knowledgeable want to comment?


>B) Side Salad seemed very definite on their statement that they can use
>	whatever names they please during an INL tourney.

They were wrong.


> I seem to remember the rules stating specifically that the most
> well-known name must be used.

This has changed.


> I think the games should have more to do with skill than trying to
> guess who a person is.

Three word sentences.


> I also remember that last year, we were told in no uncertain terms
> that if we changed our names for a game, that we should consider that
> game a forfeit.

When was this?


>  Strange that CMU doesn't have to abide by the rules...

Yes they do.


INL rulebook is about to come out with the incredibly simple ruling
of: if a team says you have to play under your own names, you do; if
not, you're free to pick any "reasonable" set of aliases.  Sure, teams
can "cheat" by changing names (I play as Mr. Boffo and vice versa),
but we can't stop that.

>C) I would also like to have some assurance that teams like CMU don't get
>	other people to watch their games.  Last year, I and several other
>	players were forbidden from watching other teams play.  My even
>	considering it was called cheating.  CMU even has a recorder set
>	up so that they can watch games later in the day.  Again, odd that
>	CMU doesn't have to abide by the rules....   Another problem with
>	the bystander is that he can tell others who has picked up, and 
>	what not.  This is definitely unfair, yet occurs regularly at CMU :(

Well, there's no INL rule about this, I don't see why it's unfair, go ahead
and watch games if you like...

- Gamera
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: osyjm@cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen)
Subject: Re: Official INL 3.0 Binaries
Organization: CS
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 22:26:30 GMT

In article <1a8odgINNqnn@agate.berkeley.edu> tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) writes:
>In article <+#+pr+a.genie@netcom.com> genie@netcom.com (Gene Choi) writes:
>Jaye, did you do any more work on this?

Kind of.  I asked Ray how hard it would be to add support for a NETREK
environment variable, so that people could just say:

% setenv NETREKDIR $HOME
% ./startd

Or something veddy similar.  However, Ray's a busy boy, so I haven't pursued
it.  I suspect it's trivial to add, I might snarf up the INL 3.0 server
source and take a gander at it.

In fact, I'll do it this evening, and assuming it works, send the patches
to Ray for his approval, and possible incorporation into 3.1.

Watch this space for details.
-- 
 Jaye Mathisen, COE Systems Manager                (406) 994-4780
 410 Roberts Hall,Dept. of Computer Science
 Montana State University,Bozeman MT 59717	osyjm@cs.montana.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: exodus@IASTATE.EDU
Subject: Re: ENPN Coaches' Poll!
Reply-To: exodus@IASTATE.EDU
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 21:51:40 GMT





 What? We're ranked 16th, and Armchair Admirals 8th and we genocided them?

Hmmm......that's interesting. We also defeated JOA and they are ranked ahead

of us. Is it just because of my spacing? ;)




						Exodus
From: cm5m+@andrew.cmu.edu (Ceri Alun Morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Side-Salad vs GB
Date: 6 Oct 92 01:08:40 GMT
Organization: Sophomore, Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

On 05-Oct-92 in Side-Salad vs GB             
user Jaime Garcia Reza@ocf.be writes:
> 
>SIDE-SALAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
>We are now the Ultimate Power in the Universe!!!!!!!!!
> 
>*both arms raised in clenched fist*
> 
>No-one can stop us now!!!!!
> 
>*pointing finger*
> 
>Not even Mojo's Pitiful band of rebel scum.
> 
>*points to head*
> 
>When I was in Gb, OH!!!!! I remember quite clearly..
>the lack of respect my team had for me.
> 
>*clenched fist*
> 
>Now.. I have the chance for you GB.. too feel
>the true power of the Duck. Pyro Joe will go up
>in flames, the audience will yawn at Amazing,
>There'll be SIDE-SALAD with a side of Mojo Pototoes.
> 
>Soon you will understand and Fear the power of ogging
>as I will ogg your dreams of victory away.
> 
>*flexes his huge chest and arms* 
> 
>Da Duckster

I don't know about the Golden Gummi Bears, but you sure have me scared...

-Egg Slice Boy
SIDE SALAD!!
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Where are the studs playing?
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:48:35 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Michael Moore writes
> 
> 	Okay, I've been operating under the assumption that the
> best place to look for high-clue games is rwd4.  I've seen
> Yea Boy!!! and Spiffy there, but not really anyone else, and I
> just want to make sure you netrek studs aren't playing somewhere 
> else.
> 
> 	Also, what is up with bronco?  I grieved, mourned, and
> then buried my dead.  And now it is resurrected?  I feel as though


Bronco is back.  Bronco is the the LAST bastian of clue in the universe.   
It is a constant battle between cluelessness and cluefulness there.   
Bronco at 5 is still probably the best time to play...I just rarely make  
it on anymore.  Gawd, i sucked tonight.

Rob
aka Spaceace!
From: surge@cqs.washington.edu (Jonathan Sari)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Donald Tsang's secret life - REVEALED!
Keywords: munch, urp, *belch*
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:25:10 GMT
Organization: University of Washington

josh@cqs.washington.edu (Josh Hayes) writes:

>This proves that some other netrek personalities do, in fact,
>exist. Although there are a number of players here in Seattle,
>I only know a handful, so imagine my surprise when I walk into
>Shultzy's Sausage for a quick lunch and see:

>DONALD TSANG, SPEED EATING CHAMPION! 

>FIVE SAUSAGES IN SIX MINUTES!

Let's not forget Wolfe "ender" Maykut, an 8 sausage eater, and
player for the self-proclaimed worst team in the league: Lagg U!
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: isae@IASTATE.EDU 
Subject: Re: Official INL 3.0 Binaries
Reply-To: isae@IASTATE.EDU 
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 07:29:17 GMT

In article <+#+pr+a.genie@netcom.com>, genie@netcom.com (Gene Choi) writes:
> 
> There's been some accusations lately that Iastate used some
> sort of borg when scrimmaging some other team.  Maybe they
> did, maybe they didn't....
> 
> The problem was that the official INL server code did
> not contain the "blessing code" reserved.c (not that it
> matters anyway since a lot of people have it nowadays).

  Err, I did compile the server code with the "blessing code" reserved.c
  Btw, I am one of the doorstop server admins. I was officially granted
  access to reserved.c by Terence with standard disclaimer applied --
  I must NOT redistribute the code in any form for any purpose; I will not.

  As far as I know, only 2 persons here at ISU have reserved.c :
  Tbird server god (Mike Graff) and me. I myself have been able to keep
  it *safe* from outside world and NEVER abused it for making a borg, etc.
  And I know for sure Mike will *not* do such thing, either.

  _Unless_ some guy here at ISU has gotten reserved.c from outside, and
  managed to make a blessed borg, the last game between ISU and JOA
  was *free* of borgs. period.

  Don't ask me the chance of such a blessed borg exists here around ISU,
  I don't know and It's not my responsibility.

  The only reason I'm writing this is because I ran the server and hence
  want to make it clear that :
  - The server is blessed with the binary verification turned ON.
  - Unless there is a blessed borg (you figure out the chance, I've no clue),
    there was NO borg in the last game.


> My suggestion (a futile one probably) is that a hacker
> under INL council authority create some blessed binary
> INL servers available for ftp for some of the more popular
> workstations (decs, sparcs, hp, etc).  I found that
> the Official INL 2.0 server was approx 350k in size when
> stripped.  Very small.  Compress it and approx 200-250k.
> Not a tremendous size.
> 
> Gene
> aka Ginger etc.

  Not bad suggestion, but will not work if people use blessed borgs.

  
PS : I am *really* glad that Ray is currently working on RSA-reserved.c;
     Loooking forwad to it. This issue (borgs & reserved.c floating around) 
     has been talked endlessly. :(((((


-Rony aka Gajah Mada
 isae@IASTATE.EDU
From: paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (FreeKill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: I've lost all respect for Rob
Date: 6 Oct 92 23:59:42 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

>> I'm surprised you included Wreck.  he's not from CMU.  He can't be as good
>> a base (or better) than Balton, Balinor, Tortoise, Videodrome, or yourself.

I've seen Balton in a base only twice.  Once was last weekend when he was
undoubtedly rusty, so that doesn't give me an indication of his true skill.
The other time, I was on his team, and he did everything that you expect a
base to do.  He even did some other nice things like helping me dodge torps.

Balinor has always seemed overrated as a base, but again I've only seen
him play rarely.

Tortoise is only good at surviving.  He doesn't hand out kills, and rarely
dets for you.  I've never seen him help someone dodge torps.

Videodrome has gotten much better.  He literally sucked torps last year, but
now he's a force to be reckoned with.  I hate to say that, too, because I
like to think of him as an inferior player.  To do so now, though, would be
deluding myself.

Rob was a good base.  Don't know if he still is.

Players you didn't mention:
Yea Boy - his phaser locking ability keeps him very alive.  More in the
Tortoise category, i.e. can survive, but not very helpful in a base.

Stilleto - saw him this weekend.  I was very impressed.  Could have been an
isolated incident of greatness, but I doubt it.

To be truthful, there are actually few bases (on bronco) who are good that
aren't from CMU.  In a base, it helps a LOT not to be lagged.  If you don't
believe it, then just ask yourself why you rarely see CMU players basing
on bigdog, and also rarely see berkeley base players on bronco.

The only non-CMU/non-Berkeley players I've seen base well are Wreck, Quovadis,
and Ged.  All 3 are very good at surviving, and pretty decent at helping
teammates.

From the one time I've had Balton on the same team as me, I would venture
to say that he was probably the best.  Next would come Videodrome and Stilleto.

BTW: I would list Berkeley base players, but it's been a long time since I've
been on bezier or bigdog.  Because of this, I'm don't really remember who
the good berkeley bases are.

>ZZnew guy
>Ringman -- Official loudmouth of Xgolems

>FreeKill
Official Rob Hill punching bag
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Clued Game? (Re: Mucus)
Date: 2 Oct 92 02:58:22 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Oct1.225325.1202@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU) wk5w@mtaac.bme.Virginia.EDU (William Thang Katz) writes:
)
)I must admit you were a very good ogger and we never had escort
)until the end when taking KLI space.  In an INL game, you would
)have been targeted specifically. 

Who was a very good ogger.  It couldn't have been Rick.  Must have been
Ceri.  Really, Rick is an excellent base, but he couldn't ogg an etemped
scout.

)
)|) --Rick
)|) "Bronco Netrek Server. You will never find a more wretched hive of
)|) scum and villainy." -- Admiral Kenobi (aka Terence Chang)
)
)-Vorpal Gandhi
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Subject: Re: MucusPig, DWDP, *The* Plan 
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 19:51:17 GMT

Michael Moore writes
> In article <1992Oct1.163657.3033@fs7.ece.cmu.edu>  
george@fornax.ECE.CMU.EDU (George Cebulka) writes:
> >
> [... bronco stuff deleted ...]
> >
> >        George 
> 
> 
> 	Is this Mucuspig or someone else?  I am sorry to bother 


This is NOT the great MUCUS PIG.  George is MUCH too nice to be MUCUS.   
You would KNOW if MUCUS posted here.  We are not worthy of his attention.

George is the bronco server god.  He plays gunner.  MUCUS PIG is  
completely different person....

167000?  Open a dedicated netrek center in ohio.  :-)

Rob
From: exodus@IASTATE.EDU 
Subject: Re: INL proposal.. long.. possible reprint
Reply-To: exodus@IASTATE.EDU
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 11:53:55 GMT




  Yeah! We been pushing for this at ISU for some time now, but we haven't
been able to spark any interest there. We thought we'd try to incorporate
a theatre commander position that would be able to follow the game like
a server god and perhaps possess an advanced messaging system of some
sort, but not fly a ship. The idea didn't go over well there, but I'm
thrilled to see interest in it here. It would help so much to offset the
advantage held by teams who have all their players in one room. 



						Exodus
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Possible changed in the "E" message:
Date: 26 Sep 92 13:56:43 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1a1md1INNt7q@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu) mcn@b62103.student.cwru.edu writes:
)In article <Bv6n1r.K9@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu) ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu  
)(Alec Habig) writes:
))In article <1a19frINNhtr@agate.berkeley.edu) jjudy@argon.berkeley.edu (Jack W.  
)Judy) writes:
)))1234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890
)))F0-)FED  HELP! F0 near Ear: 0% dam, 100% shld, 100% fuel, 0 armies!
)))			^-- (Nearest planet)         ^-- Gotta have this!
))
))It seems feasable, and is already EXTRA COOL!  Let's do it!
)
)  What's this "let's" stuff, white man. You want it, you write it. And if  
)you're that much of a neophyte to the code that that "seems feasable", then why  
)are you consulting us on what features to add? 

chill, the code for fuel is already in a lot of borgs.  The code is written.
But it is not blessed.  Sure, I could all the features I want in a client.
But, I play on human-only servers, so unless the features were blessed,
then I would have no use for them.  And, before they can be blessed (added
into the NBR), they have to be voted upon, which requires first being
posted here.

So shut the hell up.  Jack, repost this article with subject Official Proposal:
Distress Signal Modification.

Oh, and (I think you should) add WE flags, and get rid of the nearest planet
(people will bitch too much about this one that it probably won't get passed
if you leav it in)

))PS - The "Killed by" addition to the kill messages from god is a lot of fun,
))it'd be nice to see that implemented in more places.  It's good to see things
))like :
))
))"R2(bb) was kill 1.20 for F5(sc) <phaser)"
)
)  If you're that enthralled by kill messages that you actually have time to  
)make sense out of garbage like that, you need to spend a little more time at  
)maxwarp, and a lot more time looking at your tactical.

Not, but R2(bb+6 armies) was kill xxx..xx for ....

Then R0-)ROM  R2, why the hell did you go for Earth in a bb, and without
distressing

It's also very useful for generating INL stats which are very useful for
post game evaluation
)
)-Mike, aka "Gee I like that west division..."

The AFC analogy is great.  No matter who wins, you know they'll get
*smeared* by an NFC team (probably from the EAST, too.... The Eagles
-Dallas game will feature the two teams most likely to win the 
superbowl.  And it's on a Monday Night.  Gotta love the hype).

Justin

Moral:  It sucks to be Buffalo and Denver.  They always make the superbowl,
and always get their ass kicked.  How about the Patriots.  Bet they're
really glad they played the Bears.
From: jmt@legend.cma.fr (Jean-Marc Tanzi)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Need blessed client for HP700
Keywords: blessed, client
Date: 30 Sep 92 15:20:13 GMT
Reply-To: jmt@legend.cma.fr (Jean-Marc Tanzi)
Organization: INRIA Sophia Antipolis, France

Does anyone has a blessed client for the HP700 serie? The only place in the
xtrek FTP list that *could* have one (under the term "HP Apollo"), is ocf.berkeley.edu.
I've tried for several days to connect there without success. 

-- 
=============================================================================
Jean-Marc Tanzi  |  Millions of years to make oil and forests,
jmt@cma.cma.fr   |  a century to burn them. Mankind versus Nature: 100000 to 1.
                 |  Will Mankind find a tougher planetary opponent?
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: alt.games.xtrek
Date: 26 Sep 1992 23:10:50 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <Bv7HpL.9xx@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig) writes:
)There's been a few confused souls posting to alt.games.xtrek for help of late.
)With this newsgroup being effectively dead, what can be done to make it
)officially dead?  This would minimize confusion.

I'm going to send out an rmgroup message with instructions to alias
alt.games.xtrek to rec.games.netrek Real Soon Now; I asked this very
question on news.admin just a couple days ago.
 -Tom
Organization: Doctoral student, Mathematics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 05:04:46 -0400 
From: Erik Lauer <el0g+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: BOGUS CHARACTERS ALLOW SCUMMING :(((

Vorpal Gandhi writes:

>botelle@upenn (...) should be banned from the INL.  I saw what I think is the
>most flagrant violation of netrek "etiquette", namely the logging in of what
>seems to be 3+ dummy "slot scum" characters which did nothing but orbit a
>3rd party homeworld.  When I got into the game, I was ROM and suddenly found

At sturgeon I saw much more bizzarre behavior.  People would log in as
two characters (one on each side), and control both with the intention
of one killing the other, to give kills (presumably for upgrades).  It
looked really odd to see two ships fly up the edge of the screen towards
each other again and again!

woof

Erik
---=
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jive@grumpy.ssc.gov (Jim Ivey)
Subject: Re: INL Victory Condition Proposal
Organization: SSC Laboratory, Dallas, TX
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 00:21:32 GMT


In article <oelVpmy00VAvAGdkgf@andrew.cmu.edu> Craig Boas <cb39+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>   Problems:
>	   The current INL victory conditions allow a team which is
>   temporarily up by a small margin to win a close game which they may have
>   been losing the majority of.  Also, unbalanced games drag on into
>   useless LPS's.

>   [ stuff deleted ]

>   planets bounce back and forth, the team that held the advantage most of
>   the time will win (as they should).  This eliminates the last minute
>   push, overtime, and other artificial things induced by the timer.  This
>   is also a much more accurate indicator of actual winning.

     This is your opinion.  That whichever team holds the number of planets
for most of the game is the better team.  I disagree.  Your proposal favors
teams that are quick on the early attack and take a few planets with their
initial armies, instead of the teams that can guard their pops and force
their way to the win by taking one planet on a time.  It's a debatable
point which is the better team.  But it will definitely become the strategy
to grab planets as quick as possible at the beginning.  This would hurt the
game, I think.

>	   Other advantages to counting score this way is that games can be
>   compared between different teams more easily (ie: at your 100% victory,
>   was the enemy team at 30%, 50% or 98%?).  In addition, this would make

     I disagree for the same reasons stated above.  This is an interesting
stat, but it doesn't prove who the better team is.

>   unbalanced games which degenerate into long LPS's get over with much
>   quicker (since after a little over an hour of owning 19 planets) the
>   game would end.

     A nice side effect, but not worth the change I think.  It sounds like
a good idea, but I really think it would hurt the game.

     Jim
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: tsang@cs.washington.edu (Donald Tsang)
Subject: Re: The problem with Sturgeon
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 92 08:29:48 GMT

In article <2579@cronos.metaphor.com> polk@Metaphor.COM (Ben Polk) writes:
> I've been playing at Sturgeon quite a bit lately, and having a lot of
> fun there.  It may be a scum pond, but it's a fun scum pond.
> Unfortuanatly, there is a serious flaw in the whole "use kills to
> upgrade your ship" idea.  No, it's not that it encourages all sorts of
> evil scummy activity (I need to modify my ten scum-mandments to include
> "play at Sturgeon".)

heh.  Gee, thanks.  Move all the scum to _my_ pond, huh?


> The problem is that this is tbe netrek version of a pyramid scam.  Only
> the good players that can get kills and contiue to upgrade their ships
> have fun on this server.  I truely pity the new players that come on
> and face 400 hour bronco/bezier admirals flying warp 12 cruisers with
> 200 shields.  There has to be a continual source of kills for people to
> get these kinds of upgrades, and the people that are providing them are
> probably not having much fun.  Of course, as long as they want to stay
> and die, I'll do my best to help them out...

As Scott Hauck already pointed out, this is the same problem as on
normal servers (my stock DD regularly pastes dozens of newbies in
a row), but amplified.  Of course, Scott should talk... he had over
a hundred kills on one ship last week!

This is basically the same scam as "Street Fighter II" had.  I would
have been temped to play the silly game, had it not been so popular
(I've seen people walk up confidently, challenge the "champion", and
get beaten in literally ten seconds).

Over the next [insert random time period here], I'll try to make this
less of a problem.  Anyone with suggestions should mail me.  An
obvious solution is to back-calculate how many "upgrades" a stock
ship is worth.  Ten sounds like a reasonable first-cut estimate.
Then the number of kills you receive for killing someone can be:

(his hull)             (10.0)
-----------  X  ---------------------- + 0.1 (armies + kills) + 0.15 (his upg)
(your hull)     (10.0 + your upgrades)

If you've spent 10 kills on upgrades, you'll get half what a stock ship
would get.  In fact, due to the strange time warps around here, this has
already been implemented!  :-)


[side note: is it mere coincedence that most of the University of
Washington's best grad student players are from... Berkeley?]


> Remember the Sturgeon motto: "pelt, run, upgrade".

That's _Ben Polk's_ motto on Sturgeon...

Mine is, "as soon as they learn all the rules... change the rules!"

-- 
Donald Tsang                    "Ho!  Haha!  Guard!  Turn!  Parry!  Dodge!
tsang@june.cs.washington.edu     Spin!  Ha!  Thrust!"
..!uw-beaver!june!tsang                       -- Robin Hood Daffy