HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Date: 15 Jan 93 15:11:24 GMT
From: hartman@ulogic.UUCP (Richard M. Hartman)
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject: Re: The UPS clipboard
Organization: negligable
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 009, Message 6 of 10


In article <comp-privacy2.6.2@pica.army.mil> roy@cybrspc.uucp (Roy M. Silvernail) writes:
>Jarrod Staffen <uswnvg!uswnvg.com!jstaffe@uunet.uu.net> writes:
>
>> BTW, UPS is not ignoring security risks.  They just ignore people
>> who ask about safety risks.  They know what is possible.
>
>Doesn't that strike you as extremely arrogant?

Not necessarily.  It could be a security measure...

>> IMO, though, I think they should do something more to ensure the
>> safety of their electronic data.
>
>And IMO, they should be a little more forthcoming to their customers
>about the precautions they do take (if, in fact, they take any at all...
>I'm still not very convinced).

If they made a habit of disclosing their security measures to
every TD&H who asked, then it would not be secure for very long.
As long as the measures are unknown, the means to defeat them
remain unspecified.  Once you know a security measure, you can
begin working on the means to defeat it.

I have to side w/ UPS policy on disclosure on this one.

After all, they have a right to their privacy, don't they?	<g>

>As a computer professional, I was
>not exactly enthralled to be summarily dismissed by a marketing droid
>who obviously had no grasp of the technical issues I raised.

Don't raise technical issues with marketing droids.



=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
And the men who hold high places	|
must be the ones who start		|	-Richard Hartman	
to mold a new reality			|	hartman@uLogic.COM
closer to the heart!			|
Date: 15 Jan 1993 19:53:33 GMT
From: Jim Haynes <haynes@cats.ucsc.edu>
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject: FTC Charges Credit Reporting Company
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 011, Message 2 of 11

 
I posted this to comp.privacy, then realized that comp.society.privacy
is where the action is...

A little item in today's newspaper says the Federal Trade Commission
has charged Trans Union Corp. with using sensitive, federally protected
credit information from its consumer database to compile mailing lists
it sold to telemarketers and direct mail operations, "for purposes not
permitted under the law."

Then there was a piece in the next day's news about, as I recall, TRW
voluntarily ceasing some similar wrongdoing.  -- haynes@cats.ucsc.edu
haynes@cats.bitnet

"Ya can talk all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was!" "No it
aint!  But ya gotta know the territory!"
	Meredith Willson: "The Music Man"
From: ead@netcom.com (Eric De Mund)
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject: refused store charge card when i declined to provide ssn
Date: 25 Jan 93 17:48:28 GMT
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 010, Message 9 of 11

[originally posted to misc.consumers, misc.legal. -ead]

comp.society.privacy, alt.privacy people,

at robinson's of santa barbara, i was offered a store charge card and a
10% discount on my purchase. the register clerk made this offer when i
was about to pay with my mc. all he needed to see were my ca driver's
license and a major credit card. oh, and halfway through the
application, my ssn.

i politely refused, and he informed me that the credit bureau/reporting
agency that he was about to call (*) would unconditionally deny my
application without an ssn. i decided to purchase the items with my mc
and skip the 10% discount.

after re-reading the ssn-privacy faq's "lenders and borrowers" section,
in which it states:

     Banks and credit card issuers and various others are required by the
     IRS to report the SSNs of account holders to whom they pay interest
     or when they charge interest and report it to the IRS.

i wondered whether store charge card issuers also fell under this
rubric. i don't recall being asked for my ssn as part of the application
for my mervyn's card. is such a practice legal (especially in
conjunction with a 10% discount)?

eric de mund <ead@netcom.com>

(*) or whomever he was about to call for an immediate answer to the
question, "should we offer this guy a card?"
From: usviking@slepnir.linet.org (usviking)
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject: Re: Op-ed piece on telephone Caller ID
Date: 21 Jan 93 20:10:56 GMT
Organization: Society for the Elimination of Forgetfulness and... umm...
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 010, Message 5 of 11


Terry.Parks@launchpad.unc.edu (Terry Parks) writes:

> we are already on. We also, of course, in the absence of Caller ID never
> give out information to businesses on the phone:
> 
> 	"Hello, Pete's Pest Control"
> 	"I'm overrun with ants, please come soon."
> 	"Well, what's your name and address."
> 	"I'm not going to tell you, it's my privacy."
> 	"Click...."

Bad example. Ordered a pizza by phone lately? Called for a taxi? To
check movie times? To order tickets? I pay to keep my number unlisted,
thankyouverymuch. I'd rather choose who has access to that information.

-- [TANSTAAFL] --- USViking@slepnir.linet.org --- 1:107/236.1 Fight-O-Net ---
"Destruction of the empty spaces is my one and only crime."  -  Black Sabbath
JR / POB 179 / Greenlawn NY 11740 USA | Free Cyberia | Visualize Whirled Peas
From: palmer@icat.larc.nasa.gov (Michael T. Palmer)
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject: Re: Anti-privacy is Anti-Caller ID)
Date: 26 Jan 93 12:49:17 GMT
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, VA  USA
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 010, Message 1 of 11

Terry.Parks@launchpad.unc.edu (Terry Parks) writes:

>>Most of the other people who read this group are using "privacy" to
>>refer to their right to keep to themselves any and all information
>>which they consider to be nobody else's business.

>You have this right regardless of Caller ID. If you wish to remain private,
>simply choose not to call me, period!

Please, Terry, please.  We pay for our phones for other purposes besides
calling *you*.  We need to use them to call *potential* business contacts
to check on services and prices, and we don't feel that we need to surrender
our privacy to do so.

Stop trying to cast CNID as only applicable to calling individuals.  YOU
probably do not collect names and addresses and sell them to telemarketers,
so you don't represent the problem the rest of us are trying to avoid with
CNID.  Besides, how would CNID be of less use to you if the rest of us could
have our blocking?  You won't answer the call regardless, so your privacy
is preserved.  And businesses won't be able to collect our names and numbers,
cross-reference them with our addresses, and sell them to telemarketers to
harrass us while we're trying to eat dinner: INVADING OUR PRIVACY.

And please don't tell me not to call the businesses.  Businesses aren't
required to advertise which of them use CNID, so we don't have the information
we need to make an informed decision about which ones we should even bother
calling... and it's to THEIR BENEFIT that we call them in the first place;
they exist to serve us, not the other way around.

-- 
Michael T. Palmer         |  "A man is crazy who writes a secret in any
m.t.palmer@larc.nasa.gov  |   other way than one which will conceal it
RIPEM key on server       |   from the vulgar." - Roger Bacon
Date:  15 Jan 93 08:59:48 CST
From:  Jonathan Gentry  501 543-7185 <JGENTRY@efs.nctnet.gov>
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject:  Re: SSN
Organization: Computer Privacy Digest
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 011, Message 1 of 11

In Message-ID: <comp-privacy2.7.4@pica.army.mil>, From Rick Tait
<R.Tait@bnr.co.uk>, the moderator writes:
 
> [Moderator's Note:  PGP signature validation was deleted by me.
 ._dennis
> ]
 
Why was this done?
 
[Moderator's Note:  The Jester "<ygoland@edison.seas.ucla.edu>" also
asked why.  The moderation process changes the message enough so that
the PGP signature validation becomes meaningless. ._dennis ]
Date: 27 Jan 93 19:36:17 GMT
From: mvario@inode.com
Newsgroups: comp.society.privacy
Subject: OP-ED PIECE ON TELEPH
Organization: inode BBS, NYC's Best Usenet Access (212-679-9146)
X-Submissions-To: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil
X-Administrivia-To: comp-privacy-request@pica.army.mil
X-Computer-Privacy-Digest: Volume 2, Issue 011, Message 7 of 11



 Sy> I consider myself PRO-PRIVACY and a libertarian.  I oppose caller
 Sy> ID because the GOVERNMENT can abuse it to compile lists of 
 Sy> undesirables---political dissidents, "perpetrators" of victimless
 Sy> crimes, people with unpopular attititudes, etc.

 Sy> I *might* re-consider if free blocking were offered whenever caller-ID
 Sy> was in a given region.  Then, if you don't like me not identifying
 Sy> myself, DON'T ANSWER IT WHEN YOU SEE THAT IT'S BLOCKED.

I don't think CallerID opens any new avenues for governmental
abuse.  First off, with the System7 switching software in place
the caller information is there, whether CallerID is made
available or not.  CallerID just makes that information available
to the called party.

Secondly, at least in my area (NYNEX), local legislation has
mandated that we have the option of per-call blocking *or* all
calls blocked (upon request) and per-call unblocking.

Corporations with 800 numbers have had access to ANI info for
years, and the governemt has had acces to our phone calls for
even longer (see: INSIDE THE PUZZLE PALACE re the NSA).  Call
CallerID does is place some of that power in the hands of the
users.

-Misha

 
 .. RSA proved you could patent math, whats next? Fire?
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
#! rnews 1

Newsgroups: comp.society.cu-digest
From: furio@uiuc.edu (furio ercolessi)
Subject: Re: Patch and Sample Editors for Ensoniq KS-32
Reply-To: furio@uiuc.edu (furio ercolessi)
Organization: MRL - UIUC
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 23:25:17 GMT

In article <C1A5MF.I5t@unx.sas.com>, saswlb@spruce.unx.sas.com (Bill Brideson) writes:
|>   I'm under the impression that the synth engine in the KS-32 is the
|>same one that's in the SQ-1, SQ-2, and SQ-R.  Is that correct?

i think so (i have a KS-32).  Maybe the KS-32 is a superset in
some areas (more waves?).

|>   It seems to me that if that's true, I should be able to assume that
|>any patch or sample editor that says it works with an SQ synth should
|>do fine with a KS-32.  Am I missing something?

i loaded some patches from SQ-1/SQ-2 cards.  They work. 
sometimes you run across some that do not cover the extremes
of the keyboard, that is assume a 61-keys keyboard.
These are probably old SQ-1 patches.

furio
--
furio ercolessi    <furio@uiuc.edu>*    <furio@sissa.it>+
* materials research lab, uni illinois at urbana-champaign
+ intl school for advanced studies, trieste, italy   

"Change nothing and continue with immaculate consistency"
                                      [ Brian Eno, "Oblique Strategies" ]
Newsgroups: comp.music
From: iani@ai.rcast.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Zannos Iannis)
Subject: Re: Singing SYnthesis
Organization: RCAST, Univ. of Tokyo, Japan
Distribution: eunet
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 04:30:18 GMT


  "c92kl@comlab.ox.ac.uk (Kenneth Lomax)" :
>SINGING SYNTHESIS - I am planning to design a S/W based singing
>synthesiser for my research.  If you know of any recent research /
>contacts/ programs that would be of help PLEASE could you tell me.
>Also if you know of any PhDs or DPhils in this area please let me
>know.

	What do you mean by "S/W based singing synthesizer".  Do you
refer to the timbre (using samples of singing voices, emulating the
sound of the human voice by synthesis?) or do you mean also/rather the
expressive flexibility of human singing?
	Anyway, here are some references of people who did research in
singin voice synthesis:

Rodet, Xavier; Potard, Yves & Barriere, Jean-Baptiste. "The CHANT
project: from the synthesis of the singing voice to s;ynthesis in
general." Computer Music Journal 8(3) (Fall 1984).  

Sundberg, Johan. "Synthesizing Singing." In Giovanni De Poli, Aldo
Piccialli & Curtis Roads eds. Representations of Musical Signals.
Cambridge, Massachussets: MIT Press, 1991.
From: jlawson@inode.com
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: ATTENTION ALL KORG O1
Date: 27 Jan 93 19:43:57 GMT
Reply-To: jlawson@inode.com
Organization: inode BBS, NYC's Best Usenet Access (212-679-9146)


 -=> Quoting Fischer1ATTENTION all KORG O1/W utudent.msu.edu to News <=-

 Fi> The ultimate sound and software support group for Korg O1/W series
 Fi> keyboard users is being organized through myself to serve the Internet
 Fi> community of Korg O1/W series keyboard users.

 Fi> The primary purpose of the Korg O1/W User Sound and Software Support
 Fi> Group (Korg O1/W USSSG) will be the exchanging of Program and
 Fi> Combination Sound Sets.  As a result, all Korg O1/W series users with
 Fi> Internet access will, theoretically, be able to aquire hundreds of
 Fi> high-quality sounds, and more importantly, establish contacts with
 Fi> other users of this state of the art keyboard.

 Fi> If you use Korg O1/W series keyboards and are interested (it is well
 Fi> worth your while to be) please send E-Mail to myself at the following
 Fi> Internet address:

 hi fischer,
        I am new to the internet but I have a korg 03R/W and I would love to
        exchange sound patches. I think the combi and programs are the same
        for the rack mount and the keyboard. Also is there a way to transmit
        the file in binary over the net to my address. Seing we only can down load
        and upload messages every day.
                                      Thanks for responding in advance
                                      jim lawson 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 Fi> 1) The computer system & software you currently
 Fi> use (if any) for working with MIDI data
 
       
       
       
       Ibm and any sysex like cakewalk or getit..

 
 
 
 Fi> 2) What kind of computers you have access to for
 Fi> Internet related services (Macintosh, NeXT, etc.)

 
 
 
 Fi> 3) WHAT SPECIFIC PROGRAM/COMBINATION SOUND CARDS/DISKS
 Fi> YOU CURRENTLY POSSESS (if any)

  The best of M & T..
 
 
 
 Fi> 4) Your MOST RELIABLE Internet-wide E-Mail address

        Jlawson@inode.com
 
 
 
 Fi> 5) Lastly, a way OTHER than the Internet that you
 Fi> can be contacted.
   
   
   At the bbs 1-212-679-9146 were I am cosysop.



 Fi> Thankyou, and with your support, all Korg O1/W series keyboard users
 Fi> will benefit greatly.

 Fi> Take care, and MOST IMPORTANTLY -- Spread the word!



... JIM LAWSON JLAWSON@INODE.COM Where MIDI and Graphics come together!!
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
#! rnews 5
From: dce@smsc.sony.com (David Elliott)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: Re: Computer scored music
Date: 21 Jan 93 23:44:38 GMT
Organization: Sony Microsystems, San Jose, CA


In article <2236@blue.cis.pitt.edu>, wbdst+@pitt.edu (William B Dwinnell) writes:
|> 
|> Does anyone have software that will write music- I don't mean just 
|> let a user write it, but the software itself write the music?
|> I heard some stuff by EMI, which emulates Mozart, and it was
|> amazing! Anyone got anything like this?

This may not be the answer you wanted, but...
We implanted transistors in the brains of some students in Detroit,
and now their computers tell them what to do and when to do it.
They just carry out commands; flip a few switches, turn a few
knobs--voila! Instant music!
 
I better go now.

Seriously, you should get in touch with the folks at ICMA.  There's
lots of work going on in algorithmic composition.  I suspect a lot of
these people can be contacted via email.

Also, it depends on your computer platform.  There are lots of things
on the Mac, especially with things like MAX and HyperMIDI to make it
easy to write the software.

-- 
...Glimpo Fleezebax Wa
...wag@medical.ship1732.aliens.com
...(408732987)9443204-40738626
..."Do you sing like Olive Oyl on purpose?"
Newsgroups: comp.music,rec.music.synth
From: redmill@kalman.eng.ohio-state.edu (Keith A. Redmill)
Subject: SoundBlaster midi interface
Organization: The Ohio State University Dept of Electrical Engineering
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 02:47:24 GMT

I've been looking at the SoundBlaster (Creative Labs) and Sound FX
(Reveal Computer Products) series of cards for MSDOS machines, and I
have two questions concerning the midi interfaces.

1. Connections:

    These low end cards have a DB15 (I think) connector on the card, 
and they want you to buy a $60 interface box to get the needed
Din plugs.  I'm betting that the only thing in that box is wiring
between the plugs.  Could someone send me the pinouts/etc?

2. Compatibility:

    The last time I looked into midi for MSDOS machines (1988) the
defacto standard was the Roland MPU-401.  Do soundblaster compatible
cards adhere to that standard, is there a more modern standard to
which they adhere, or is every board doing its own thing?


For your information, my major interest is the midi connection to
a keyboard. Sampling and synthesizing on the card is nice, but
secondary.

Please reply to: redmill@ee.eng.ohio-state.edu
Thanks.
-- 
Keith A. Redmill     (redmill@ee.eng.ohio-state.edu)
    The opinions expressed above are well reasoned and insightful.  Needless to
    say, they are not those of OSU, its faculty, or lackeys.  Anyone who says
    otherwise is itching for a fight.  -- Whad'ya Know? 
Newsgroups: comp.music
From: pef@dcs.qmw.ac.uk (Panayotis Fouliras; TA PhD)
Subject: CUBASIC QUESTION
Organization: Computer Science Dept, QMW, University of London
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 14:39:34 GMT

Does anyone know where we can buy CUBASE ver 3.0 for
ATARI 1040 and how much it cost. (in UK)

Please e-mail:

stavros@dcs.qmw.ac.uk

Thanks in advance.

--
UUCP:      pef@qmw-dcs.uucp  | Computer Science Dept    | "H Rwmania
Internet:  pef@dcs.qmw.ac.uk | QMW University of London |  kai an
JANET:     pef@uk.ac.qmw.dcs | Mile End Road            |  eperasen,
Voice:     +44 71 975 5220   | London E1 4NS            |  anthei kai
FAX:       +44 81 980 6533   |                          |  ferei kai
Cellphone: Too expensive to fit                            allon"
From: Geoff.Peters@p10.f861.n800.z3.fidonet.org (Geoff Peters)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: Yamaha CX5, CX5M & CX7M ?
Date: 22 Jan 93 07:29:03 GMT

Re: Yamaha CX-5, CX-5M & CX-7M

 > Are there any users of any of these computers?

I have a CX-5M which I find indispensable - the notation-based sequencer is the
_only_ MIDI program I've found that'll let me change time signatures for each
bar, and run multiple time signatures across all parts.

 > Is there a list on that?

If you find out, let me know.


Geoff


 * Origin: No! Not that! Not the Minimoog! (3:800/861.10)
From: Luis.E.Scheker@dartmouth.edu (Luis E. Scheker)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: Re: 88-Key Weighted Keyboards - Which?
Date: 27 Jan 93 05:51:41 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0b1@newshost.dartmouth.edu


     You are in the best postition to decide which controller is right
for you.  If you don't need multiple programmable transmission zones,
user- definable program change tables, or other long-winded
non-essential features, then DON'T pay for them.  Unless you're touring
with Genesis or are a session pro, sophisticated MIDI controllers
represent an investment in features you just won't use.  Keyboard feel
is HIGHLY SUBJECTIVE, so while a lot of people might tell you that the
Yamaha KX88 and the Ensoniq KS-32 are great feeling keyboards (I happen
to agree), you may find them too hard, or too soft.  Play a lot of
different keyboards before you decide to buy.  As far as digital pianos
go, be very certain that the unit's piano samples are smooth and even
from one end of the keyboard the other.  Certain digital pianos suffer
from uneven sound levels and a dull mid-range (cough, FP-8, cough,
cough).  Buy a controller or piano that has a good feel and sound to
YOU, with no more features than you really need.
From: Jay_Tobias@taligent.com (Jay Tobias)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: MIDI FTP Sites
Date: 26 Jan 93 20:08:44 GMT
Followup-To: comp.music
Organization: Taligent

Has anybody compiled a list of the availabe FTP sites for MIDI software and
information?  A simple listing of name, domain adress, and breif contents
would be helpful to the community. Every once in a while somebody says,
"try this site xxx for yyy".

Jay Tobias
email: Jay_Tobias@Taligent.com
Newsgroups: comp.music
From: thomasd@tps.COM (Thomas W. Day)
Subject: Roland GR-50 Editor (DOS)
Organization: Telectronics Pacing Systems
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 20:12:25 GMT

Does anyone know of (and have experience with) a DOS-based Roland GR-50 
editor?  

Thanks for your help,
Tom Day
From: hnyberg@wolverine.cs.hut.fi (Henrik Rickard Sebastian Nyberg)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: Kawai K1-II note plays forever HELP!!!
Date: 25 Jan 1993 12:47:11 GMT
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, CS lab
Distribution: inet
NNTP-Posting-Host: wolverine.cs.hut.fi

I recently bought a K1-II and have encountered a small problem. Sometimes
when I play a midi file from my PC (via my PAS 16 midi interface), a note
just continues playing. This is very annoying. Is there any way I can avoid
this? And what is the problem?Is it the synth, the interface or the sequencer?
Thanx in advance.





--
Baseman
Helsinki University of Technology     
hnyberg@niksula.hut.fi                            Sound_Scape Engineer
-
From: ya22+@andrew.cmu.edu (Yat-Pang Au)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: PC Programs?
Date: 24 Jan 93 18:36:26 GMT
Organization: Masters student, Information Networking Institute, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

I just got a Casio CT630 to hook up with my 486 PC with a Soundblaster
Pro Card.  Does anyone know of a good sequencer program or any other
music composer
program for the PC?  I already have SPJr (a sequencer program from
Soundblaster) and would like a program that I could actually enter a
score of
music into.  Also, has anyone heard of Cakewalk Pro and know where I can
get a copy of it?

Thanks,
Yat-Pang
From: baker@foxtrot.ccmrc.ucsb.edu (Charlie Baker)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: Re: Computer scored music
Date: 23 Jan 93 22:21:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: ucsbcsl.7462

In article <2236@blue.cis.pitt.edu> wbdst+@pitt.edu (William B Dwinnell)  
writes:
> 
> Does anyone have software that will write music- I don't mean just 
> let a user write it, but the software itself write the music?
> I heard some stuff by EMI, which emulates Mozart, and it was
> amazing! Anyone got anything like this?
The EMI programs were written in Common Lisp by David Cope , who is at the
University of California at Santa Cruz.They use the standard  
A.I.techniques of pattern matching and generative grammar. The best  
introduction to the programs is Cope's book "Computers and Musical Style"
published by A-R Editions. I picked up a copy of his source code at the  
last International Computer Music Conference (SanJose)..."major fun", as  
they say here in California! Really not much use to you unless you have a  
CommonLisp interpreter though, or are foolishly dedicated to porting  
software that SHOULD be in Lisp to some other language paradigm! 
Charlie
--
*_________________________________________________________* 
Charlie Baker
Center for Computer Music Research and Composition
University of California at Santa Barbara
baker@waltz.ccmrc.ucsb.edu 
*_________________________________________________________*