From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Circum.: When Parents Disagree :-(
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 17:12:09 GMT

>From article <1992Dec23.212132.22722@ntmtv>, by missy@ntmtv.UUCP (Missy Iaquinto):
>>
>   (part of article deleted)
> 
>> Now, the real issue and question.  Although I do think a person's
>> name is an important decision, I have to say I feel more strongly
>> about circumcision, I REALLY DON'T want it done to my son.  My
>> husband REALLY WANTS it done.  I REALLY WANT us to both feel
>> comfortable with whatever decision is made.  At this point, I sure
>> don't see any compromise.  Like I said, this has only come up once
>> in passing so far, and I have a feeling he just thinks I'll go along
>> with his wishes.  But with this issue, I just don't feel comfortable
>> "going along" with it.  It's not something that can be "undone."
>> 
>> My husband comes from a very traditional upbringing, and feels that
>> he should make the final decisions when it comes to a son, simply because
>> he's male.  Three years ago I would have felt comfortable with that,
>> since I'm NOT male, but now I don't feel like that's a good enough
>> reason.  I'm one of his parents, and I don't want it done.  My husband
>> is in the same boat, he's one of his parents, and he DOES want it done.
>> So who wins?  How do we decide fairly?

  Well actually, we have a thing about deferring to the parent of the
  same sex.  Remember when my son's pediatrician wanted to pull his
  foreskin back to "check" how far it would go, and I polled the net
  and the consensus was not to forcibly retract it but to let it naturally
  retract as the kid grows older?  Well my husband was in the same
  boat as the net and adamantly told me in no uncertain terms was the
  doctor going to do this procedure.  So I explained to the doctor (I
  didn't say anything about a net), and she said, "Oh yes, men are
  so sensitive about that little area.  We'll let him have his way."

  It's not a matter of who wins, because in this situation it either
  goes one way or the other.  But who would be less comfortable over
  the outcome.  And maybe I'm old-fashioned, but men are very sensitive
  about certain topics, so I'd just let him have his way.  Of course
  when it comes to girl-stuff, I'd expect to have more of a say in
  the matter.
>> 
>> There must be lots of parents out there who have disagreed on this subject
>> and resolved it ... who wanted what, and what was the outcome?  I find it
>> particularly interesting that it's very typical for the mother to be
>> against routine (male) circumcision, and the father to be for it, when
>> there's a disagreement.

  Well I never gave it a thought.  I just assumed that the hospital would
  do it routinely.  However my hospital doesn't and the insurance doesn't
  cover it.  So the hospital was anti-circumcision and so were the midwives.
  And so is my husband.  So I had no reason to go against them all.
  It just isn't such an emotional matter for me because I cannot relate
  to having a penis.  If anything I was more in favor of circumcision
  if I ever thought about it because my mom used to complain about having
  to clean under the foreskin and how if she had another boy she'd have
  it cut.  As it turned out, the rest of the kids were girls so she didn't
  have to agonize.  Also, this was back in the old days when doctors
  forcibly retracted the foreskin when the baby was a few months old
  and thus you had to retract it to clean, clean, clean.

  Of course, once everything was explained to me about the pain and the
  accidents, then I didn't see a reason to do it.  However if I had married
  someone who was adamant about doing it, I'd probably give in and let him
  decide.
>> 
>> I'm counting on you, misc.kidder's .... not to make the decision, but
>> to give some helpful advice ... NOT to debate circumcision, but to
>> relate experiences when the parents disagree strongly about it ...
>> 
>> What to do?

  I don't know, since I'm not you.  I'm more likely to just give in and
  then bitch about it to the net, gain some sympathy (or flames) and then 
  forget about it.  Of course this is an issue in which you both feel
  strongly about, so it'll be hard to have anyone give in.

  One thing you might want to do is to lay off of the vehement anti-circumcision
  agenda, because it'll probably make him madder, since he is circumcised.
  Just explain that you don't want to make the baby go through pain,
  and that these days, there is no good medical reason to do it.  Then
  take him to a hospital and have him talk to a few nurses.  I remember
  being in the maternity ward walking around looking at the babies, and
  hearing the nurses say, "Oh that poor fella's about to get cut.  Poor
  baby..."  as they wheel this innocent looking baby out of the nursery.
  Then you hear screams when the door opens again...
>> 
>> Missy Iaquinto

  I've successfully convinced my husband of things not by harping about it,
  but by my confidence that I knew I was right.  For example, my husband
  never gave a thought about spanking or not, and since he was spanked
  (as was I), he probably thought it was just the thing to do.  But as
  soon as my son was born, I would drop comments about using time-outs,
  not inflicting pain on your kids, how spanking doesn't work, etc.  Now
  he thinks he's the world's leading anti-spanker and was explaining
  time-outs to his friend last weekend.  Well I don't know if I changed his
  mind, because maybe he didn't like spanking either.  But then he's been
  on the case of naming his daughter-to-be Josephine and I've said definitely
  not and he's sort of resigned, since we agreed that I'd name the girl
  and he gets to name the boy.  So sometimes, you're back to the playground
  where you make a rule (draw the line in the sandbox) and stick to it.
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