From: mattb@ctron.com (Matthew E. Brown)
Newsgroups: rec.music.gdead
Subject: Re: harvesting wind
Date: 19 Nov 92 20:14:48 GMT
Reply-To: mattb@olympus.ctron.com (Matthew E. Brown)
Organization: Cabletron Systems INc.

Let me start by saying that although I posted a plea to let the healing
begin, I wasn't naive enough to think that everyone would agree or that
healing is a pain-free exprience, with no setbacks. Nor am
I planning to let mud slung from either side go uncontested. My point
remains: we can stand toe-to-toe and insult each other, and/or we can try
to rebuild. I am fine with either or both. One way or the other, we need
to get this poison out of our system. I thought Joe was talking the right
course - admitting his bad feelings, acknowledging his own shortcomings, 
and trying to move on. I know that approach isn't for everyone; certainly
not for the author of "harvesting wind". Fine. If throwing stones is what
you want to do, let's throw some, get it over with, and then move on.

long lost r.m.gd personality IWS%ssmic@cdfq.ssd.ray.com writes:
>wreck dot gdead personality Joe Doheny writes:

>| chorous went "Put a little love in your heart, and the world
>| will be a better place for you, and me".  I remember it from
>| when I was a kid, and it gives me hope today :-)

>When times are tough, the warmths of childhood ARE a good place to
>escape to...

Too bad it took something as bitter as this to induce you to favor us 
with your presence, Ihor. I haven't seen anything from you since my
digest days a couple years ago.  Not even a new discography for a 
while. Been busy someplace else?

>| I have lost a number of friends out of this.  Some, they
>| burnt the bridge down, some I.  All I can say to those who I
>| have lost friendship, those who retain it, and those involved
>| that I don't even know is: "Put a little Love into your
>| heart".
>
>I say, 'if you plant ice, you're gonna harvest wind'.  Sounds
>like your ice is ready to be harvested.

Actually, from your quote and comments, it looks like the "wind" was what
is being harvested. I don't think it was Joe who did the planting, either.
If I was going to try to allude to Franklin's Tower, I'd say
"God save the child who rings that bell" with Joe in mind.

>| I'm no longer looking to define who is responsible for what
>| bad feelings that exist here.  Sisters and Brothers it's time
>| to stop, realize that the person you are fighting was once
>| your friend.  Once your brother or sister.  It took me a while
>| to realize that, and I display shame for that.

>First you start a flame fest and now you're offering the olive branch
>of peace.  You speak with forked tongue ---<=

So he should just keep it going instead, huh? Maybe he should get personal,
email some lies about his friends, post some holier-than-thou "I'm leaving
the net because you folks aren't good enough" diatribe, etc. You'd feel
more at home then, eh?

Or did you really not read what Joe said, admitting that he had let his 
anger get the best of him? Talking about mutual forgiveness? 

Or do you contend that the wheelies are blameless in this? Good luck 
convincing people. 

>| Lets pick the pieces of this world up and make ourselves
>| better for doing so.  Let's learn not from how others dealt
>| with the situation from what happened.  But let's deal with
>| how you yourself felt, when you were dealing with the
>| situation.  I know I felt some pretty bad feelings directed
>| towards others who at one point in my life I would have
>| refered to as a friend.  Let's 'put a little love back into
>| our hearts'.  It is a choice you *CAN* make.  Its a choice I
>| have made.  And I think our world will be a better place, for
>| you, and me.  I'm not talking about the subject any more.  This
>| discussion has led nowhere good.

>You ought to email the folks on the wheel and tell them you didn't
>mean it and you want to come back.

Oh, I see. Joe should beg them for forgiveness. Good idea!

While we are handing out suggestions, maybe you should either put this
behind you as Joe suggests, or slink back and gossip with your cohorts.
The more light we shine under that rock, the slimier it looks down there.

>| I'm done talking about the subject.  Lets try to change
>| conversation uinversally to happier things.  This one is destroying
>| *ALL* of us.

>Isn't that what you wanted?  Destroy it all?  Bravo Zulu, Joe.  
>Mission accomplished.

If you build something with a self-destruct button like "let's keep this
a secret to the point of lying to our friends", guess what? Somebody might
push the button!

>| Peace out,
>| Joe Doheny

>About the only thing you know about peace is how to spell the word.

You could learn from him, in my opinion.

Your recent posts, to me, reveal more about the nature of the wheel and 
its inhabitants than perhaps you intended. Your attitude, as reflected here,
seems to support what I have heard on the negative side, and undercut some
of the things I have heard from other wheel members. Not that my
opinion, or anyone else's, need matter to you or the others. It is your own
souls and consciences you must come to terms with. If you can, then nothing 
Joe has done, or has been accused of doing, can destroy any of it. 

I am sorry if I have been insulting, but I am very disappointed that you have
chosen to re-appear slinging insults. I had really hoped we could
move on, but all I have heard so far is denials and insults from the wheel
side. The pity is that some of the alleged members have been, in the past,
among the most noteworthy contributors to this forum. You, Ihor, are 
certainly capable of much better than snide shots at a peace-post, however
shallow you consider Joe's plea. Why not do something to convince us
that he was wrong, rather than unintentionally supporting his indictments.

Matt