HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Steinar.Haug@delab.sintef.no (Steinar Haug)
Subject: Re: ISO specs.
Organization: SINTEF DELAB, Trondheim, Norway.
	<23360A@erik.naggum.no>
Date: 27 Sep 92 12:44:00

In article <23360A@erik.naggum.no> Erik Naggum <enag@ifi.uio.no> writes:
> That depends.  OSI is spreading faster than Internet protocols did with
> the same distribution.  The Internet growth is approaching linear
> growth, while we're only in the early exponential phase of OSI
> protocols, still.  That means Internet protocols have a pure time

It would be interesting to see your sources for these two claims (Internet
growth is approaching linear & OSI is exponential)...

Steinar Haug, system/networks administrator
SINTEF DELAB, University of Trondheim, NORWAY
Email: Steinar.Haug@delab.sintef.no, 
	sthaug@idt.unit.no, steinar@tosca.er.sintef.no
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
From: u913592@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au (Jalauddin Ishak)
Subject: OSI Network Management
Summary: Need info
Keywords: CMIP Message,ROSEapdu
Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 05:08:49 GMT

i
 
   
y
 
Can anyone tell me what is the typical size of CMIP message(get_request,get_response,set_request,set_response,action_request,action_response,etc.
implemented anywhere.Can you tell me about the MIB.How different is it from the SNMP MIB?.Where can I get details on this info?
Regards
J.Ishak


Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
From: peterd@pjd.dev.cdx.mot.com (Peter Desnoyers)
Subject: Re: ISO specs.
Organization: Motorola Codex, Canton, Massachusetts
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 13:27:54 GMT

Erik Naggum <enag@ifi.uio.no> writes:

>Phil Royse <proyse@peeras.demon.co.uk> writes:
>|
>|   I AM NOT WHINING....

>I'm sorry.  I inadvertently grouped you with all the "Mommy! ISO won't
>let me have their standards" folks.  I'm happy to see the exceptions.

>|   But, Erik the fact that you and I can afford to pay ISO (& BSI's)
>|   prices does not justify their decision to prevent them from being
>|   available via a lower cost, easy-to-disseminate route such as FTPing
>|   over the internet.

>They don't need to justify their decision.  As long as ISO can make the
>money they think they need to make by their present policies, and as
>long as there are people who're willing to pay for the ISO specs, ISO
>has no incentive to change their policies.

I'm far from a hard-core capitalist, but I have to believe that there 
are consequences to the fact that OSI, CCITT, and ANSI get paid when
someone buys copies of their standards, but not when they implement 
them, sell implementations, or use them.

Contrast this with many of the recent industry consortia - e.g. Frame
Relay Implementer's Forum, ATM Forum, or farther afield things like
the QIC-40 people. In most of these cases the groups involved make 
money by selling the technology itself (or hope to, in the future) and
often not only give their standards away free, but even pay for the
shipping.

>I think this discussion would benefit from regarding ISO as the
>publisher it is, and refrain from taking the consumer side, that ISO's
>in the business to benefit the readers of their publications.

ISO is in the business of defining voluntary, non-proprietary
standards. In this activity it is in competition with a lot of other
organizations, including private companies, industry consortia, and
individual national standards bodies. Its success can be measured by
how widely its standards are adopted by users and implementers.

I don't want to see the telecom and computer industries abandon the
public standardization process in preference for proprietary standards
developed behind closed doors. However, if proprietary standards
become more widespread, well-supported, and robust than open
standards, then customers are going to want them and I am going to
be providing them. 

If ISO acts as a publisher, restricting standards distribution to the
profitable end of the demand curve, then they aren't helping their
position as a standards organization. Unfortunately, as Erik notes,
if they abandon this position as a publisher, currently they will go
broke.

				Peter Desnoyers

--
From: martinea@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Alain Martineau)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: TP4-CONS-X.25 package for PC ?
Date: 30 Sep 92 12:12:57 GMT
Organization: Hydro Quebec

I am looking for a TP4-CONS-X.25 package running on PCs, commercial or public.
Thanks for any pointer.

Alain Martineau
martineau@macmartineau.ccr.hydro.qc.ca
Hydro Quebec
11th floor, East Tower, Complexe Dejardins
PO Box 10000
Montreal, Quebec, Canada, H5B 1H7
514-289-4484
From: shri@unreal.cs.umass.edu (H.Shrikumar)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Re: ISO specs.
Date: 27 Sep 92 14:36:10 GMT
Reply-To: shri@unreal.cs.umass.edu (H.Shrikumar)
Organization: UMass, Amherst, MA + Temporal Sys & Comp Net, Bombay, India

In article <23360A@erik.naggum.no> Erik Naggum <enag@ifi.uio.no> writes:
> That depends.  OSI is spreading faster than Internet protocols did with
> the same distribution.  The Internet growth is approaching linear
> growth, while we're only in the early exponential phase of OSI
> protocols, still.  

    What ?? ??? :-) Whence the conclusion ?

    Or, is some interesting normalisation being done, as indicated 
in "did with the same distribution". :-)

-- shrikumar ( shri@legato.cs.umass.edu, shri@iucaa.ernet.in )
From: roseberry@taney.uscghq.uscg.mil
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: GOSIP specs
Date: 28 Sep 92 05:54:57 EST
Organization: United States Coast Guard


	Even though the ISO specifications are sold for operating costs,
	are the US government's GOSIP specifications available via FTP
	anywhere ?

	Thanks.

	- Bert Roseberry
	  US Coast Guard
	  roseberry@taney.uscghq.uscg.mil
From: ses@cmns-sun.think.com (Simon Edward Spero)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Re: ISO specs.
Date: 27 Sep 92 11:32:43
Organization: What's your clearance, citizen?
	<qx!py-n.rlglende@netcom.com> <23357B@erik.naggum.no>
	<SES.92Sep26213956@cmns-sun.think.com> <54016@dime.cs.umass.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cmns-sun.think.com
In-reply-to: shri@unreal.cs.umass.edu's message of 27 Sep 92 14:31:42 GMT

In article <54016@dime.cs.umass.edu> shri@unreal.cs.umass.edu (H.Shrikumar) writes:

   IMHO, Rewriting in any significantly different form, in a different
   language (such as some other formal language) etc. might just consume
   so much effort that it would not not be affordable, unless pooling of
   resources via USENET happens. And that is not easy to organise.

   It takes so much time and effort to just wade thru the stuff, so it
   stands to reason that paraphrasing it in some other tongue would take
   just as much time, and would  have to go thru some years of draft and
   approval to make sure it means the same thing as the original.

The big trouble when reading the specs is working out what the hell the spec
is going on about. Once the ECU drops, it ought to be relatively simple to
write the English translation

   [Note: most CCITT docs are on-line already(one way of the other ;-).]

      I am not aware of any significant diffs (besides a small one about
   object ids, and the EXTENSIONS macro) between ISO and CCITT versions
   of BER. Would not X.208, X.209 do very well ?

Of course, there are no CCITT standards available online now. :-) However,
even when they were available, the only versions of X.208 and X.209 I saw
were each about 2k long (the guts were completely missing).

Simon

--
-----
Guest account at TMC 	|	Just Another  WAIS Hacker | DOD# 0612
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
From: ag129@cus.cam.ac.uk (Alasdair Grant)
Subject: Re: ISO specs.
Organization: U of Cambridge, England
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 12:28:44 GMT

In article <SES.92Sep26220024@cmns-sun.think.com> ses@cmns-sun.think.com (Simon Edward Spero) writes:
>about the OSI growth patterns; however the moral loss of the Janet community
>to JIPS ought to have sent things into a bit of a slide. Since Janet
>was supposed to be an OSI flagship, and since people are only using the OSI
>side of things when they are forced to at budget-point, this is a major
>climbdown. Negative exponential is still exponential though.

There is no sense in which JANET is converting to IP. JIPS is an IP
service _on top of_ JANET, i.e. X.25, as an alternative to the Coloured
Book protocols. JANET has never been an 'OSI flagship', except in the
sense that it has always stated its intention to move to OSI eventually.
FYI, for every real person who wants IP on JANET, there are probably
at least 10 who want Novell IPX or AppleTalk on JANET.

Erik Naggum writes:
> CCITT (and IBM) are not that liberal.

SAA is based on three protocol suites: SNA, OSI and TCP/IP. I don't notice
many other vendors making strategic commitments to OSI.
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: pwilson@world.std.com (Pete Wilson)
Subject: New Product: Universal SNMP Agent
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 12:23:03 GMT

Of possible interest: Paul Freeman Assoc. announces the Universal SNMP Agent: 
a portable, compact, cost-effective, fully-compliant, multi-MIB Agent for 
installation under any modern OS on any platform. For a product description, 
send e-mail to pwilson@world.std.com or call 508-692-4436.

Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: jeffj@ultra.com (Jeff Johnson)
Subject: Re: SNMP Mail Group
Reply-To: jeffj@ultra.com (Jeff Johnson)
Organization: Ultra Network Technologies
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 17:32:03 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.135842.10377@sctc.com> hoffmann@sctc.com (Teri Hoffmann) writes:
=>ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan) writes:
=>
=>>Does someone out there know the name of the SNMP mail group?  If the administrator is
=>>listening, please add me to the group.
=>
=>yes, it is snmp@uu.psi.com.  Put 'help' as the subject line
=>and you will receive a message on how the discussion group works.

Actually, the request should be addressed to snmp-request@uu.psi.com
All you need is a message withsomething like "subscribe me" and you'll
be placed on the list.

DO NOT SEND SUBSCRIPTION REQUESTS TO snmp@uu.psi.com

(I've limited distribution to "ba" since other corrections are being sent
out by other people in other distribution areas)
-- 
    Jeff Johnson    | Ultra Network Technologies | voice: (408) 922-0100 x284
  jeffj@ultra.com   |     101 Daggett Drive      |   fax: (408) 433-9287
...ames!ultra!jeffj |    San Jose, CA  95134     |   sex: (900) 976-4825
 The difference between ignorance and apathy?  I don't know and I don't care
From: hoffmann@sctc.com (Teri Hoffmann)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: Re: SNMP Mail Group
Date: 1 Oct 92 13:58:42 GMT
Organization: SCTC

ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan) writes:

>Does someone out there know the name of the SNMP mail group?  If the administrator is
>listening, please add me to the group.

yes, it is snmp@uu.psi.com.  Put 'help' as the subject line
and you will receive a message on how the discussion group works.
From: ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: Re: SNMP in a Voice/Data Environment
Date: 5 Oct 92 14:12:47 GMT
Reply-To: ty@desktalk.com
Organization: Desktalk Systems Inc.

In article 17509@europa.asd.contel.com, mmoore@bagels.eng.gtefsd.com (Mike Moore) writes:

>Hello networkers,
>We are interested in providing SNMP network management in an integrated voice
>and data environment.  There is already a proprietary network management scheme
>in place on the voice (telephone) network with its own DBMS.  We have HP Open-
>view on the data network.  Are there standards for this kind of integration, 
>rfc's or drafts?  
>

Yes.  In fact there are several applicable RFCs:

 rfc1232   - DS1/DS3  
 rfc1304   - SMDS Interface Protocol
 draft mib - draft-ietf-snmp-t1mib-07.txt

Also, I read last week in Communications Week, that MCI announced SNMP management 
services for their Frame-Relay offerings, and AT&T made similar calims.  

I don't know much about voice stuff, though, although some of the mibs mentioned
above are probably applicable in some areas for voice.

---
Ty Kostan					EMail: ty@desktalk.com
Senior Staff Engineer				Voice: (310) 323-5998
DeskTalk Systems, Inc.				FAX:   (310) 323-6197
19401 S. Vermont Ave #F100
Torrance CA 90502
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan)
Subject: RRe: RMON specs?
Keywords: RMON SNMP
Reply-To: ty@desktalk.com
Organization: Desktalk Systems Inc.
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1992 14:38:11 GMT

The RMON spec for ethernet is RFC number 1271.  It IS a valid RFC, and is currently
under implementation by many (in fact, many implementations may currently be
purchased).  

The RMON spec for Token Ring is NOT yet out of draft state.

|> 
|> Anyone know where I can ftp the RMON specs.  I assume there is an
|> RFC, but I don't know the number.
|> 
|> Thanks,
|> Art

>As far as I know, the RMON MIB isn't an RFC yet. The draft version of the 
>MIB is available for ftp access on certain ftp servers (I don't remember which 
>ones). If you use archie to search for 'rmon' you should come up with the draft
>document. Hope this helps.



Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: XDAT14@maccvm.corp.mot.com (Jeff Turuc)
Subject: to xdat10 xdat26
Organization: Motorola
Date: 2 Oct 1992 09:04:38 CDT

fyi
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan)
Subject: SNMP Mail Group
Reply-To: ty@desktalk.com
Organization: Desktalk Systems Inc.
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 14:25:35 GMT

Does someone out there know the name of the SNMP mail group?  If the administrator is
listening, please add me to the group.

---
Ty Kostan					EMail: ty@desktalk.com
Senior Staff Engineer				Voice: (310) 323-5998
DeskTalk Systems, Inc.				FAX:   (310) 323-6197
19401 S. Vermont Ave #F100
Torrance CA 90502
From: cullerot@ctron.com (Dave Cullerot)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: Re: HELP MESSAGES TO SNMP@PSI.COM
Date: 2 Oct 92 03:46:10 GMT
Reply-To: cullerot@olympus.ctron.com (Dave Cullerot)
Distribution: comp.protocols.snmp
Organization: Cabletron Systems INc.

Attached are directions to obtain the SNMP Newsletter -- "The Simple
Times" and directions describing how to obtain RFCs, drafts, etc.
for RMON, SMP, SNMP Secure, etc...

------------------------------------------------------------------------

     ``The Simple Times'' is available via electronic-mail in two forms:
     PostScript and MIME (the multi-media 822 mail format).

     List maintenance is automatic.  Send messages to

	st-subscriptions@simple-times.org

     and put a directive in the "Subject" line.  The "From" line of your
     message will be used accordingly.

	directive		action
	---------		------
	subscribe "format"	adds you to the list, for either
				"postscript" or "mime" distribution

	unsubscribe		removes you from the list

	index			returns an index of past issues

	backorder "issue"	returns a copy of issue, see index for list

	help			returns this message


     For example, a message sent with

	To: st-subscriptions@simple-times.org
	From: local@domain
	Subject: subscribe postscript

      will create a subscription for mailbox "local@domain" in the postscript 
      format .

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

FTP to any one of the sites listed below and type
"anonymous" at the username prompt with "guest" or your
mail address as the password.

Internet-Drafts directories are located at:	
	                                                
     o  East Coast (US)                          
        Address:  nnsc.nsf.net (128.89.1.178)	
	                                                
     o  West Coast (US)                          
        Address:  ftp.nisc.sri.com (192.33.33.22)
							
     o  Pacific Rim                              
        Address:  munnari.oz.au (128.250.1.21)	
	                                                
     o  Europe                                   
        Address:  nic.nordu.net (192.36.148.17)	
	                                                
Internet-Drafts are also available by mail.	
	                                                
Send a message to:  mail-server@nisc.sri.com. In the body type: 
     "SEND draft-ietf-mimemhs-harpoon-00.txt".

----------------------------------------------------------------

I hope this information helps those who are interested.

Dave Cullerot
Cabletron Systems, Inc.
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: arnoff@vax.ftp.com  (Michael S. Greenberg)
Subject: INTEGER vs. TIMETICKS types
Nntp-Software: PC/TCP NNTP
Reply-To: arnoff
Organization: FTP Software, Inc., Wakefield, MA
Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1992 17:53:22

Here is a question regarding the encoding of ASN.1 INTEGER vs. the
encoding of ASN.1 TIMETICKS.  I have an implemenation that encodes
INTEGERs according to the ISO spec, prepending a 0 byte if the number
is positive and the highest bit is set.  I do not do this for
TIMETICKS because the SMI specifies that type as "non-negative"
(section 3.2.3.5), and, since I assume that there is no negative
time, I don't prepend the 0 byte if the high bit is set.

Unfortunately, my implementation seems to adversely effect CMU code
derived agents, who are more than happy to set their time negative.
I imagine I will have the same problem with GAUGE and COUNTER types,
since the INTEGER is the only one that I prepend the 0 byte to.  I
could treat all these types like I do an INTEGER if I have to but is
this correct?

Also, which way is the correct encoding of a TIMETICKS variable
(prpending 0 for high bit set, or not)?

Thanks in advance!
	Mike
--
Michael Greenberg				      Internet: arnoff@ftp.com

Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: u913592@tasman.cc.utas.edu.au (Jalauddin Ishak)
Subject: polling freq
Summary: bandwith utilization
Keywords: bandwith,polling
Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 03:45:33 GMT

i
  Can the internet Guru tell me what is the implemented polling frequency and whether the requirement differ to size of network.Also tell me what is the average size of snmp messages.
Regards
J.Ishak

:wq


Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: mmoore@bagels.eng.gtefsd.com (Mike Moore)
Subject: SNMP in a Voice/Data Environment
Summary: Standards?
Organization: GTE Federal Systems Division, Chantilly VA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 20:45:19 GMT

Hello networkers,
We are interested in providing SNMP network management in an integrated voice
and data environment.  There is already a proprietary network management scheme
in place on the voice (telephone) network with its own DBMS.  We have HP Open-
view on the data network.  Are there standards for this kind of integration, 
rfc's or drafts?  

TIA,
Michael Moore
GTE Government Systems
mmoore@europa.asd.contel.com
From: dtaylor@ems.cdc.com (Dave Taylor)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: Re: SNMP Mail Group
Date: 2 Oct 92 13:29:23 GMT
Reply-To: dtaylor@ems.cdc.com
Organization: Empros Systems International, a division of CDC

In article <1992Oct1.135842.10377@sctc.com>, hoffmann@sctc.com (Teri Hoffmann) writes:
|> ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan) writes:
|> 
|> >Does someone out there know the name of the SNMP mail group?  If the administrator is
|> >listening, please add me to the group.
|> 
|> yes, it is snmp@uu.psi.com.  Put 'help' as the subject line
|> and you will receive a message on how the discussion group works.

WRONG!!!   WRONG!!!   WRONG!!!

Doing this simply broadcasts the mail to everyone on the list (causing
great irritation; there have been dozens of messages in the last day) and
probably doesn't even reach the person who manages the list.

The correct procedure is to send mail to the address:
    snmp-request@uu.psi.com
asking to be added to the discussion list.  

-- 
David K. Taylor                       dtaylor@ems.cdc.com
From: cullerot@ctron.com (Dave Cullerot)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: HELP MESSAGES TO SNMP@PSI.COM
Date: 2 Oct 92 03:15:19 GMT
Reply-To: cullerot@olympus.ctron.com (Dave Cullerot)
Distribution: comp.protocols.snmp
Organization: Cabletron Systems INc.

In a previous message regarding obtaining help from the IETF
SNMP mail list, a mistake was made by the poster.  If you
wish to join the IETF SNMP mail list, you MUST send a mail
message to snmp-request@psi.com with ADD in Subject header.

In fact, if you wish to subscribe to any IETF mail list, you
should send your request for subscription to using the
-request suffix in the mail address.

If you wish to be removed from a mail list also send your
mail message to snmp-request@psi.com (for example) and
place REMOVE in the Subject header.  These are the standard
methods for beginning communication with these groups.

There is a SNMP Newsletter written by the inventors of SNMP
also available via mail.  I will check the mail address for
subscription and post it here.

Also, for those interested in RFCs, drafts documents etc. there
are several repositories.  I will post the names of the sites
that you may ftp to for these documents.

Please remember to use the -request in your subscription ADD and
REMOVE message, the veteran subcribers on the lists tend to get
annoyed by ADD/REMOVE messages which are sent directly to the
mail list.

Thanks, 
Dave Cullerot
Cabletron Systems
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
From: ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan)
Subject: SNMP Mail Groups.
Reply-To: ty@desktalk.com
Organization: Desktalk Systems Inc.
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 15:51:00 GMT

Sorry, 

It was too late for me, and apparently for others.  Many submissions were made 
yesterday to snmp@uu.psi.com.  Just to reiterate, the internet standard is typically
(but NOT always) to send mail to the administrator through: 

      <groupname>-request@<mailaddress>

To get on the list, place "help" in the subject fields.

For the SNMP group it is:

	snmp-request@uu.psi.com

For the SNMP version 2 group, it is:

	snmp2-request@thumper.bellcore.com

Hope this sets things straight, and helps redeem my name in the SNMP group!
From: atkinson@itd.nrl.navy.mil (Randall Atkinson)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: Status of newsgroup & SNMP mailing list
Date: 5 Oct 92 00:46:05 GMT
Followup-To: comp.protocols.snmp
Distribution: na
Organization: Naval Research Laboratory, DC

In article <3575@creatures.cs.vt.edu> ramakris@csgrad.cs.vt.edu (S.Ramakrishnan) writes:
>
>How is the SNMP Mail Grp different from comp.protocols.snmp ?
>Is that a mail interface to c.p.s just as the xpert list is the
>mail interface to comp.windows.x ?

  As the main person behind the creation of comp.protocols.snmp, I
think I can speak with some accuracy.  The INTENT all along was that
there would be a one-way gateway from the snmp@uu.psi.com mailing list
into the newsgroup comp.protocols.snmp.

  In fact that did exist for some period of time.  At some point the
snmp mailing list admin folks disconnected the one-way gateway.  Said
list maintainers have steadfastly ignored my inquiries about why the
gateway was removed.  If someone else wanted to setup a one-way gate
from the list into the newsgroup, I wouldn't complain (two gateways
would not be A Good Thing though :-).  If no gateway appears soon, we
should probably propose promoting the newsgroup to an unmoderated
USENET newsgroup (it is officially just an INET group at the moment).

Ran
atkinson@itd.nrl.navy.mil
From: cullerot@ctron.com (Dave Cullerot)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.snmp
Subject: Re: SNMP Mail Group
Date: 2 Oct 92 13:33:37 GMT
Reply-To: cullerot@olympus.ctron.com (Dave Cullerot)
Organization: Cabletron Systems INc.

In article <1992Oct1.135842.10377@sctc.com> hoffmann@sctc.com (Teri Hoffmann) writes:
>ty@desktalk.com (Tyson M. Kostan) writes:
>
>>Does someone out there know the name of the SNMP mail group?  If the administrator is
>>listening, please add me to the group.
>
>yes, it is snmp@uu.psi.com.  Put 'help' as the subject line
>and you will receive a message on how the discussion group works.


Please do not send HELP messages to snmp@uu.psi.com!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Send your request for subscription messages to snmp-request@uu.psi.com.

The folks on snmp@uu.psi.com get VERY UPSET when request for subscription
message go to the main list.

I repeat.....snmp-request@uu.psi.com

Thank you,

Dave

PS See previous messages for more info.