HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: Greatest living conductors
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 21 Dec 92 01:36:05 GMT

In article <60020002@hpgrla.gr.hp.com> rms@hpgrla.gr.hp.com (Rick Scherer) writes:
>>Who do you think are the greatest living (or recently died) 
>>conductors?
>
>I nominate Mackerras.  If you judge by his recordings, he can do nothing
>that is not first-rate.  He has superb technical skills, good taste, and
>best of all, he really respects the score and doesn't try to have his own
>sound.
>

I agree Mackerra is in the same league as the other great conductors
(Giulini, Solti).  He has led good performances in a wide variety of
repertoire:  20th Century English Works, Janacek's orchestral works and
operas, Mozart symphonies, etc.  

I'm also tempted to nominate the Trevor Pinnock.  His interpretations of
Baroque and earlier material are typically wonderful.  (Although, I've 
never heard him do anything from the Romanitic era.)

And, just to get flamed, I nominate Andre Previn.  His Mendelssohn
"Midsummer Nights", Carmina Burana, Planets, Gershwin are all at the 
top of available interpretations.  

John D.
From: gr@st-andrews.ac.uk (Gavin Ramsay)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: INFORMATION WANTED: Pilgrim's Progess
Date: 15 Dec 92 15:50:20 GMT
Organization: St. Andrews University, Scotland.

In article <1992Dec12.232355.29450@athena.mit.edu> davidu@space.mit.edu (David) writes:
>
>Dear Classical Music Authority,
>
>	I would love to hear from those knowledgeable people on this newsgroup 
>who have any information about a disc set I saw at Tower the other week.  It
>was called The Pilgrim's Progress and it was composed by Vaughan-Williams, if
>my memory is correct.  If not, then it was composed by a fellow Brit, as it
>was in the EMI British Composers series.  I assume that it is somewhat based
>on the Bunyan work, but there is little else to go on...
>	I thank you in advance for any help.
>
>
>
>							Sincerely,
>
>							Dave
>
Yes it was composed by Vaughan Williams (no - by the way). It was an opera
baseD ON THE allegory by John Bunyan of the same name. It hasn't been staged 
much unfortunatley. He used sections of it in his 5th symphony -ie the romanza.
if you like his other music you'll probably like this as it recieves a great
all round performance with boult on top form.
gavin ramsay

based on John Bunyans allegory o
From: rags@triples.math.mcgill.ca (Robert A. G. Seely)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Pachelbel, Beethoven, and Mel Gibson
Date: 17 Dec 92 14:57:06 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <105123@bu.edu> spacefox@acs.bu.edu (Godfrey Degamo) writes:
>
>Hey the holidays are fast approaching!  Happy Holidays everyone.
>
>I decided to post this humorous article.  I hope you guys don't mind
>the waste in bandwidth.  
*******[quote deleted]*********
>[Alright, this is intended to be humorous, no insults intended.  Respond if 
>you like!]
>
>

There is just no accounting for taste - 'nuff said...
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg)
Subject: Re: The worst composer in a millenium
Originator: brad@buck
Organization: Viewlogic Systems, Inc.
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 21:01:22 GMT


|> In article <BzA6wJ.AqM@cs.columbia.edu> tait@cs.columbia.edu (Carl Tait) writes:
|> >In article <1992Dec12.165335.17469@news.columbia.edu>
|> >rsm13@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ravi S Moorthy) writes:
|> >>I had the misfortune of buying Oliver Messiaen's "Turangalila Symphony"
|> >>conducted by Rattle.  To give credit where it is due, it is the worst
|> >>music I have ever heard.  Pardon me Messiaen lovers, but I cannot make
|> >>any sense of his mumbling mystecism or the interminable bird calls.
|> >
|> >Since your statement will undoubtedly ignite a flame fest,
|> >let me risk jumping on the funeral pyre with you.  Of all
|> >the composers I've ever heard, I'd be hard-pressed to name
|> >one whose music is as downright repulsive as Messiaen's.
|> >There are any number of composers I dislike, but Messiaen
|> >has the unique honor of making me feel physical revulsion,
|> >as if I were being forced to swim in a large unflushed toilet.
|> >
|> >I was in Tower Records last month, and they were playing some
|> >organ music in the classical department.  As I looked though
|> >CDs, the music's relentless odium became more and more unbearable,
|> >until I finally yelled to one of the clerks, "Who wrote this goddamn
|> >piece of shit?!"  It was ... well, you can probably guess.
|> >
I know! I know! Liszt! Right?

- BK
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: It's called "Deploration sur la morte d'Ockeghem"
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 23:50:17 GMT

In article <1992Dec13.210300.21670@sifon.cc.mcgill.ca> rags@triples.math.mcgill.ca (Robert A. G. Seely) writes:

>The above-named piece by Joaquin desPrez is high on my personal favorites
>list - one of the most moving tributes of a collegue by any musician.  Not a
>requiem in any standard sense, but a worthy addition to the current list of
>such on this group.  

Actually, it *is* a requiem, because the tenor sings the Introitus to 
the Requiem Mass.

>Personal favorite performances:  The Deller Consort and the Hilliard
>Ensemble.  (The former is probably impossible to find these days - my copy
>is an old Vanguard recording.  The latter is on EMI.)

And both use the corrupt text of 1550 -- the Hilliards (don't know about 
Deller) are slavish enough to sing the obvious typo in m.69 (a ninth)
and not to transpose the end of the tenor part up an octave so as to
avoid a 6-4 chord about 6 mm. from the end.  Pro Cantione Antiqua do this,
too; and both the Hilliard and PCA recordings were made long after the 
Medici Codex was published.  

Does *anyone* know of a recording with the right notes?  I've sung it
several times, incl. once from facsimile, and the erors just leap from 
the page if you sing the bad version.

Roger
>
>BTW - my apologies in typing (repeatedly) "requium" the other day - either
>my brain or my fingers were on strike that day...
From: dave@stl.panasonic.COM (Dave LaDelfa)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Virtuoso composers
Date: 16 Dec 92 22:37:51 GMT
Organization: /usr/lib/news/organization

In article <F8BNVB1w164w@hub.parallan.com> Richard Walter writes:
>As so virtuoso composers, I've heard it said that Vaugn Williams wrote
>a concerto for every instrument in the orchestra (IMHO, his Tuba
>concerto is a really great piece of music.) and that he could play the
>solo part for all of them......
>

Perhaps you're confusing him with Paul Hindemith, who did indeed write
a sonata for virtually every instrument in the orchestra, and 
I have it on the authority of a professor of mine who knew Hindemith 
when he taught at Yale that the man could play each and every one of the
sonatas at a concert-quality level of proficiency. 

Hindemith was a professional violist but could also play all the brass 
instruments, single- and double-reeds, piano, harp, and organ, and was
apparently a pretty competent baritone. 

-- 
Dave LaDelfa                            Speech Technology Laboratory
dave%stl-sb@uunet.uu.net                Santa Barbara, CA
dave@stl.panasonic.com			A Nice Place to Live
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ashley@oasis.gtefsd.com (Bob Ashley)
Subject: When to Initiate a Standing OHHHH ...
Reply-To: ashley@oasis.gtefsd.com
Organization: GTE Federal Systems Division
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 15:21:49 GMT

In article 19216@news2.cis.umn.edu,  jill@gopher.ccbr.umn.edu (Jill Hollifield) writes:

>So, my questions:  Does this happen anywhere else?  And what are *your*
>criteria for a standing ovation?  What has to happen to bring you
>to your feet?
>
>Jill

I have attended some National Symphony Orchestra concerts during the summer
season at Wolf Trap Farm Park, and they usually receive a standing ovation
as well.  Just this past summer, I had the opportunity to see the Boston Pops
there as well.  They deserved ... and received one.   :-)

I will provide one answer to the last two questions ... the music, IMHO, should
be played with emotion and conviction.  I saw the NSO perform Beethoven's Ninth
Symphony, and the soloists were outstanding.  You could feel it, from the
soloists and chorus, right through the entire orchestra, during the final
movement ("Ode to Joy").

Just my thoughts ...


Bob - long awaiting the start of the new summer season   :-)

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bob Ashley                        Internet:  Bob.Ashley@oasis.gtefsd.com

Member, Technical Staff            | Winter Bowling Leagues 1992-1993
   GTE Federal Systems Division    |    GTE FSD Mixed Secretary: Thu 17:45
   15000 Conference Center Drive   |    Thursday Mixups:         Thu 20:30
   Chantilly, VA   22021-3808      |    NFL Mixed Secretary:     Mon 21:00
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Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel)
Subject: RE: Ruinous endings
Organization: Visual
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 13:16:16 GMT

Tony Brokenborough writes about Bruckner's Fourth:

>>The ending is exactly like the rest of the meaningless noise in the score....
>>BORING !!!!!!!!!

Deryk Barker replies:

>Now is this a comment on this particular symphony - which I agree is
>Bruckner's weakest - or another attempt to run down his genius?

I've run into a bit of Bruckner-bashing myself lately.  A friend who's
otherwise very knowledgable about music was looking over my CD collection
one day, and noticed the number of Bruckner CDs.  He commented about
how awful he thinks Bruckner is.   Turned out he had never listened to
anything by Bruckner other than his Fourth and Seventh Symphonies --
not the Eighth, not the Ninth.  I told him to give them a spin sometime,
*then* come back with an updated opinion.  

I'll take the opportunity to mention that the Prokofiev Seventh Symphony 
has a "quiet-ending" option that can be quite disappointing, given the
wit and sparkle that has preceded it.   I wish Jarvi hadn't opted for
this.  

Rob
From: chem91@Elroy.UH.EDU ("Bill Harrison (713)-743-2789")
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Date: 16 Dec 1992 23:48:20 GMT
Organization: University of Houston
Reply-To: chem91@Elroy.UH.EDU
NNTP-Posting-Host: elroy.uh.edu

[...]
>>
>>What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?
>>

1) The third movement of 4'33" 
2) The second movement of 4'33" 
3) The first movement of 4'33"              ;=)


+ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\               /~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+
| Bill Harrison,            \             /       "Be as radical as... |
| University of Houston, TX  >-----------<         reality itself"     |
| CHEM91@JETSON.BITNET      /             \                V. I. Lenin |
+ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~/               \~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: bjh42543@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Brian J. Haag)
Subject: Greatest Conductors:  Why?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 06:39:42 GMT

Now that we have all thrown out the names of our favorite conductors, and
some of their best work, I would like to hear _why_ people think the way
they do.  I'll be happy to start:

Although I agree with someone's earlier remark about him sometimes being
somewhat frustrating (and he can _definitely_ go too slow sometimes), I would
say that Bernstein ranks as one of my favorite conductors for those moments
when he creates an incredible electricity.  Witness his live recording of
Shostakovitch Symphonies 1 and 7 with Chicago on (of course) DG.  I'm not
saying that all of the playing is the best.  But I don't think that I know
of any recording that carries the sheer power or weight that the finale of #7
does under his baton.

All IMHOs apply.

-- 
______________________________________________________________________________
Brian J. Haag                                    Senior, Department of Finance
bjh42543@uiuc.edu                                       University of Illinois 
       "Remember:  No matter where you go, there you are." -- Anonymous
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: i323859@phceaa20.cad-sg.ce.philips.nl ( HENK MEULENDIJKS     )
Subject: Schubert
Keywords: Dieskau/Moore
Organization: Philips Consumer Electronics, Eindhoven
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 12:52:23 GMT

Let you know that ther are two CD boxes each 9 CD's with all the Schubert-songs available by DG 
This is no Import box 
I haven't heart them yet but surely going to buy them.
From: gpalo@digi.lonestar.org (Gerry Palo)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Pianists
Date: 15 Dec 92 17:49:37 GMT
Organization: DSC Communications Corp, Plano, TX

In article <1992Dec14.154114.21194@holos0.uucp> lbr@holos0.uucp (Len Reed) writes:
>In article <Bz3sAr.Mnz@unix.amherst.edu> mbfeld@unix.amherst.edu (A waste of bandwidth originating) writes:
>>
>>Personally, I think the culprit is TV.
>
>TV?  Gee, I guess now every problem since 1950 is attributable to the
>boob tube.

Just about.

Gerry Palo (73237.2006@compuserve.com)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Subject: the worst composer in a m
Reply-To: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 16 Dec 92 11:21:20 EST

CT>Since your statement will undoubtedly ignite a flame fest,
  >let me risk jumping on the funeral pyre with you.  Of all
  >the composers I've ever heard, I'd be hard-pressed to name
  >one whose music is as downright repulsive as Messiaen's.
  >There are any number of composers I dislike, but Messiaen
  >has the unique honor of making me feel physical revulsion,
  >as if I were being forced to swim in a large unflushed toilet.

CT>I was in Tower Records last month, and they were playing some
  >organ music in the classical department.  As I looked though
  >CDs, the music's relentless odium became more and more unbearable,
  >until I finally yelled to one of the clerks, "Who wrote this goddamn
  >piece of shit?!"  It was ... well, you can probably guess.

I've a musician friend who adores Messiaen. He's a chap of fine
taste; outstanding taste, I'd say -- he agrees with my musical
thoughts almost all the time <g>! We have decided to let Messiaen
be a line of demarcation, however: Is there room for one more on
that pyre? I have tried to absorb whatever it is that Messiaen
has to say -- and I dare say I shall continue to "have a go" in
the future -- but my heart isn't it!

Alexander Inglis  |  InterNet: alexander.inglis@canrem.com
Toronto,  Canada  |  CompuServe: 70307,20     BIX: ainglis
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: smitra@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Sami Mitra)
Subject: Re: QUERY ABOUT NEW OPERA
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 01:15:07 GMT

In article <1992Dec16.222910.3090@fid.morgan.com> apter@fid.morgan.com (Steve Apter) writes:
>In article <BzDGGC.5LA@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> smitra@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Sami Mitra) writes:
>>
>>This week, last night here, George Jellineck introduced a new Finnish
>>opera in his program The Vocal Scene. I caught snatches of it and
>>didn't get the name of the composer (a Swedish friend wondered if it
>>was Sallinen). He played excerpts from a performance given in LA,
>>earlier this year I think, but I don't remember the name of the
>>conductor either (it was not Esa Pekka Salonen). Most of the cast was
>>Finnish, but the only name I recognized was Matti Salminen's.
>>
>>Anyhow, the opera is called KOULLERVO(sp?) and is based on the
>>Finnish mythical figure of that name. It is to be performed at the
>>opening of the new opera house in Helsinki late next year.
>>
>>Does anyone know where I can get more information about this work?
>>Presumably a recording exists, Jellineck had it from some source
>>after all. Does anyone know anything of this broadcast recording or
>>any other recording? I shall, in the meantime, try to get these
>>answers from other sources as well.
>>
>>Thanks.
>>
>>				Sami Mitra
>
>
>
>
>Sallinen's _Kullervo_ appeared on the Finlandia label a few months ago.  
>You liked what you heard?
>
	Yes, I did quite like the excerpts I
heard. This was somewhat late in the evening
and the broadcast didn't have my full attention,
and I wish I had taped the stuff. But I was
rather impressed by the closeness of the music
to Russian works (in the vein of the vocal
writing of Shostakovich) and the somewhat
Germanic feel. I am sure that is a consequence
of the work being in Finnish, and the fact that
I am not familiar with Finnish vocal music. I
need to listen to the work, in its entirety, a
few more times, but I must say the first
impression was definitely very positive!
	Do you have any other specific
information about this Finlandia release you've
mentioned? The local record store is fairly
efficient here but one needs to spell out all the
details. Has the opera been released in the US.
What's the orchestra and the conductor?
	Do you like the opera?


				Sami Mitra
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: pkbockus@gsbphd.uchicago.edu (Keith Bockus)
Subject: Re: Requia, pass 2
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 17:26:55 GMT

dbrus.Unify.Com.ceb@unify.uucp (Caroline E. Bryan) writes:

>Someone asked which recording of Mozart's Requiem I have, so I thought I'd
>bring all the CD's in and just list them.  Also I repeat my question of
>other requiems that netters have enjoyed!

I mentioned this piece a while back, but it probably bears a
second recommendation.  Sandro Gorli's Requeim is fantastic.
Gorli is a 20th century composer, but the piece is
appropriately coupled with some Gesualdo on French Harmonia
Mundi.  Very scary music, you'll love it!

Keith Bockus
From: gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The worst composer in a millenium
Date: 15 Dec 92 22:25:21 GMT
Reply-To: gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor)
Organization: Heurikon Corporation, Madison, WI

rsm13@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ravi S Moorthy) writes:
>I had the misfortune of buying Oliver Messiaen's "Turangalila Symphony"
>conducted by Rattle.  To give credit where it is due, it is the worst
>music I have ever heard.  Pardon me Messiaen lovers, but I cannot make
>any sense of his mumbling mystecism or the interminable bird calls.

Hey - funny thing. I used to have the same problem with the liner notes
that came with the occasional devotional Carnatic tapes my friends 
loaned me. You're forgiven, of course, for having Messaien be rough
sledding. Perhaps some of his organ music ("The Celestial Banquet",
perhaps) might be a bit easier to get into.

But if the bird calls do, indeed, disturb you, by all means avoid
his "Catalogue d'Oiseaux," for obvious reasons!

Gregory (not a partisan, but an O.M. admirer) Taylor
--
The law moves quickly in the rain/and chokes the world with memorials./The
courts accept the lowest superstition/into evidence. And we embrace quickly in
the rain,/conceiving a hale infant with hands to wrinkle/the bedsheets toward
it, wave by trough by wave./Gregory Taylor/Heurikon /Madison, WI/608-828-3385
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: k22164@kyyppari.hkkk.fi (Mikko Reinikainen)
Subject: Re: St. Matthew Passion
Date: 17 Dec 92 16:18:07 GMT
Organization: Helsinki School of Economics, Finland

In <BzCxJp.K42@cmcl2.nyu.edu> tony@cns.nyu.edu (Tony Movshon) writes:

>One of the most memorable musical experiences of my life was an Easter
>performance of the Matthew Passion in Munich in 1973 under Karl Richter.
>Last night I picked up the corresponding DGG/Archive CD set ($21 at the
>Tower Annex in the Village, if you're interested), and I'm very taken
>with it. But I'd be interested in others' views on this piece and this
>performance, and on other recommendable issues.


That is the recording I grew up with... Today some people laugh at
Richter's "slow" tempos, as they don't understand Richter was a
renewer himself - his approach is much less romantic than was still in
fashion in 1970's.

Richter was lucky/witty with his performers, too: Schreier is by far
the best Evangelist I've ever heard, Fischer-Dieskau is an impressive
Jesus. The Bach-Choir and -Orchestra are quite good, too. Yet the best
in the recording is the atmospehere: warm but fresh!

Of the more recent recordings I admire J.E.Gardiner's rrecording
(Archiv) a lot. The Monteverdi Choir is beyond this world!

Many prefer Herrewege (harmonia Mundi), but the recording let me
untouched somehow... The singers are perhaps too "light" and the
overall impression isn't assuring. Just may view, of course.


	Mikko Reinikainen
	Finland


	

--
Mikko Reinikainen
k22164@kyyppari.hkkk.fi
Helsinki School Of Economics and Business Administration
Helsinki University/Faculty Of Law
From: thomas@McRCIM.McGill.EDU (Thomas Jelonek)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Rachmaninoff's "VESPERS"
Date: 21 Dec 92 05:19:58 GMT
Organization: McGill Research Centre for  Intelligent Machines


In article <18750@mindlink.bc.ca>, Nation@mindlink.bc.ca (Brian Nation) writes:
|> Several years ago I heard a recording of Vespers that was absolutely
|> astounding. I don't recall the performers, but I believe it was a Russian
|> chorus. I've been looking for a CD and recently have noticed several versions
|> available. Any recommendations?
|> 
|> Also, I don't know Rachmaninoff's other choral works. How do they compare?

I have a recording of choral music by Rachmaninov that is entitled `All Night
Vigil' that is very beautiful (it includes a morning vespers). It is 
performed by a Russian chorus and the cd itself is from a Russian label.
Unfortunately, that is all I remember right now.

Thomas
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener)
Subject: Re: Requia
Reply-To: gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 07:13:38 GMT

In article <CB.92Dec14105132@tamarack13.timbuk> cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster) writes:
>
>I didn't study Latin but my wife did.  We agreed that more than one
>kleenex would be several kleenices, and she informed me that more than
>one thermos would be several thermores.  I want to get these things
>right.

	One blouse, two blice.
	One fax, two faxen.
	One sheriff, two sheriffim.
	One xerox, two xeroces.
	One EMACS process, two EMACES.
	One UNIX machine, two UNICES.


--
Gabe Wiener - Columbia Univ.     "This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings 
gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu       to be seriously considered as a means of 
N2GPZ in ham radio circles        communication. The device is inherently of
72355,1226 on CI$                 no value to us." -Western Union memo, 1877
From: elpysh@nuscc.nus.sg (Yeoh Saw Heng (Ms))
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Greatest living pianist
Date: 11 Dec 92 08:00:42 GMT
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith) writes:
: Not really sensible to say any one pianist is the "best" but I'd like to 
: nominate Murray Perahia as a strong candidate.
: 
: r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
: Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

I'll second that!

Ysh
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical