HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: TW.FY4@isumvs.iastate.edu (Timothy I Miller)
Subject: Re: A Suggestion to IBM Management (sorta long)
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 02:27:06 GMT

In article <0wl-8Y@engin.umich.edu>,
spexet@math.lsa.umich.edu (D. Robert Spexet II) writes:
>
>While IBM promotes the OS/2 base operating system in the popular advertising,
>there appears to be absolutely no mention whatsoever of the fact that IBM
>produces an entire line of database, networking, and multimedia products
>(namely Extended Services with DBM, the LAN Server and TCP/IP products, and
>the OS/2 Multimedia Extensions) that are designed to work, and work well, in
>concert with the OS/2 operating system.
>

  Actually, you're right.  I haven't heard hardly anything about
these options, except what's written in this newsgroup.  Although I
don't have a need for any of these features (I'm just a 'hobbiest'),
I would like to know more about the multimedia products.  For
instance, what hardware do you need to run them?  Will I need to get
Soundblaster drivers from Creative Labs (which are rumored to be in
the works...)?  If anybody has any info on this, I'd be happy to
listen.
From: ADUNSMUI@TOROLAB6.VNET.IBM.COM (Al Dunsmuir)
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 09:04:33 EDT
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs OS/2 features (was Re: Misinformation about os2-dos HW access)
Organization: IBM Canada Laboratory Ltd, Toronto, CANADA
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not those of IBM
News-Software: UReply 3.0
            <1992Sep01.010548.11230@microsoft.com>

In <1992Sep01.010548.11230@microsoft.com> Phil Lafornara writes:
>     C++ is a non-trivial language to support - if IBM is just
>starting now, don't expect to see anything from them for a while.
>--
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Phil Lafornara                             1 Microsoft Way
>philipla@microsoft.com                Redmond, WA 98052-6399
>Note:  Microsoft doesn't even _know_ that these are my opinions. So there.
>

Phil,

  Check out Ian Ameline's previous postings re C++ for OS/2 from the
C-Set/2 folks.  Why think that IBM is just starting now?  It wouldn't
be the Toronto Lab's first C++ comppiler - consider that the RISC/6000
AIX XL C++ (a real C++ 3.0 compiler - no cfront) was announced in January
and has been shipping since 2Q92.  Consider also that the C-Set/2 folks
and the RISC/6000 C++ folks are physically and organizationally close
together...

Al Dunsmuir                       Internet: adunsmui@torolab6.vnet.ibm.com
CODE Development II + TEAM OS/2      Voice: (416) 448-3315
IBM Canada Laboratory Ltd, Toronto, CANADA

OS/2 V2: Why settle for anything less?
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: neves@chimay.cs.colorado.edu (NEVES RICHARD K)
Subject: Re: Brian, your bias is showing ( was Re: OS/2 vs NT features
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 16:54:56 GMT

In article <1806blINNil3@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> dab6@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas A. Bell) writes:
>Windows NT currently doesn't have any features because it is not released.
>While NT is not vapourware, it is certainly not a shipping product.  Not
>even in the sense that os/2 LA was.  It isn't a product because it has 
>not got a fixed feature set and noone uses it yet.  Perhaps it should
>be called phantom ware.  There certainly is something out there but it
>hasn't taken shape yet.  Or maybe it could be called rainbow ware.  
>Just over the next hill is leprechaun Bill and his pot of gold.

I think you are missing the point of Brian's attempt at characterizing
the differences between the two products.  I think his is a very
useful "list-o-differences".  I want information and that is all
Brian is trying to do. 

You're basically saying Brian is not "politically correct".  This polemic 
is a wast of time.
From: dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: Misinformation about os2-dos HW access
Date: 31 Aug 92 05:16:45 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <1992Aug29.185859.16477@hellgate.utah.edu> brian%jaguar.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Brian Sturgill) writes:

>Question, why do people expect that Microsoft should have an OS, not yet
>released, go through a many-month certification process.
>Would it not make more sense for them to do so after the OS is generally
>available?  Or am I just missing something?

Because MS claims that their system offers a "C2-level" of security.
This implies that they actually did some kind of testing.  The didn't.
Their claim is misleading.  Whether they have security that could
attain C2-level is irrelevant.  If they tested even ONE machine, their
claims would be much more legitimate.

Without testing, you can claim anything.  It doesn't mean much, except
to the uninformed.



-- 
   |)  David Charlap           "I don't even represent myself
  /|_  dic5340@hertz.njit.edu   sometimes so NJIT is right out!.
 ((|,)
  ~|~  Hi! I am a .signature virus, copy me into your .signature file.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: brian%jaguar.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Brian Sturgill)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: Non-IBM experiences with OS/2?
Date: 3 Sep 92 19:36:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: hellgate.1992Sep3.133622.2811
Organization: University of Utah CS Dept

In article <1992Sep3.184213.351@umr.edu> ckincy@mcs213c.cs.umr.edu (Charles Kincy) writes:
>In article <1992Sep02.183914.28059@microsoft.com> philipla@microsoft.com (Phil Lafornara) writes:
>>In article <1992Sep1.135325.7248@dhw68k.cts.com> david@dhw68k.cts.com (David H. Wolfskill) writes:
>>>
>>>One individual -- the only one who works for my manager who has
>>>undergone such a transition -- found (much to his chagrin) that his
>>>migration to OS/2 required relocation of the printer that he & a few
>>>others shared, since apparently the upper limit on printer cable
>>>lengths in OS/2 is lower than the corresponding limit in DOS.

Why not just buy a lline booster?  Dalco [(800) 445-5342]
sells one for 29.80 that doubles the distance. 
There's another one for 85.75 that goes to 300 feet.
There is also one for 159.50 that works up to 7,000 feet.
(And they're often not the cheapest place to get such a thing.)

Brian
-- 
C. Brian Sturgill                       *** OS/2 2.0 is for YOU! ***
University of Utah                  Microsoft needs some competition, but
Center for Software Science        -I- want to be one of the many using NT.
brian@cs.utah.edu; CIS: 70363,1373           :-) :-) :-)
From: sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: nt goes "late beta" i
Date: 25 Aug 92 15:27:44 GMT
Reply-To: sip1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Dept. of Econ., Univ. of Chicago

In article <19920824.185202.202@almaden.ibm.com> ameline@vnet.ibm.com (Ian Ameline) writes:
>>GUI testing program
>>Microsoft sells this as an add-on for $200.
>   Don't know if something like this is in the works -- I'll check
>around.

It already exists, though -- the TINF application guide, available via
anonymous ftp from ftp-os2.nmsu.edu, lists more than half a dozen such
tools.

Oh, as for the assembler, I understand MASM 6.0 works quite well.

Unless you don't want to buy from third parties.  But everyone has a
favorite editor that isn't necessarily from the company that writes
the compiler, and so forth.

-- 
Timothy F. Sipples      | The OS/2 FREQ. ASKED QUESTIONS LIST is avail. from
sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu | 128.123.35.151, anonymous ftp, in /pub/os2/all/faq.
Dept. of Econ., Univ.   | Or from LISTSERV@BLEKUL11.BITNET (send "HELP").
Chicago, 60637          | Hey GOP: The Economy, Stupid!
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: jeffc@netcom.com (Jeff Cohen)
Subject: Re: what crash...
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 02:47:50 GMT
Organization: Hacker's Anonymous
Distribution: comp

In article <weinkam.714774964@sfu.ca> weinkam@fraser.sfu.ca (James Lawrence Weinkam) writes:
>"bill dehaan" <bill.dehaan@canrem.com> writes:
>
>>In message <7167#lib.tmc.edu>, jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay
>>Maynard) writes:
>
>>JM>Ever heard of RUNWORKPLACE=CMD.EXE?
>
>>Sure. If you don't want to run any PM or Windows apps. Which we do.
>
>By changing the RUNWORKPLACE to CMD.EXE you can still use PM apps
>since the PMSHELL is still running.  A different line in the config sys
>is used to disable the PMSHELL.  I know this since I have tried
>both changes, and was still able to run PULSE.EXE after having changed
>RUNWORKPLACE to CMD.EXE.  I am not sure of windows apps, but would
>assume that since PMSHELL is running that dos & windows support is
>possible.
> 

It is.  Dos/Windows/PM applications can all be launched from a command
line session with the START command.  Mr. Dehaan does not have his
facts straight.
-- 

==============================================================================
Jeff Cohen         | Standard disclaimer:  My views are my own and may or may
jeffc@netcom.com   |                       not represent the views of IBM.
==============================================================================
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: philipla@microsoft.com (Phil Lafornara)
Subject: Re: NT goes "late Beta" in 8 weeks! (was Re: Windows NT 'Alpha')
Date: 24 Aug 92 20:09:38 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <1992Aug21.181514.4337@njitgw.njit.edu> dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) writes:
>
>MS, on the other hand, enjoys dropping products.  They won't support
>the MS-OS/2 packages they sold - they just tell you to "wait for NT".
>They won't support Windows 3.0 - they tell you to upgrade to 3.1, etc.
>It's not very nice to customers to be told to wait for the next
>version of a product when you have a problem.

    Hmmm... like "wait for the CSD", or "wait for the manufacturers
to come up with SVGA drivers"?  Unless you're dealing with a
private consultant, you usually don't get everything that you
want in a product immediately.
    Please - in your haste to bash Microsoft (and you usually do
it quite well), you've come up with one of the most ludicrous
statements I've yet seen posted to this board, and I've seen
some real doozies.

					-Phil
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phil Lafornara         				1 Microsoft Way         
philipla@microsoft.com				Redmond, WA 98052-6399 
Note:  Microsoft doesn't even _know_ that these are my opinions. So there.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: ckincy@mcs213c.cs.umr.edu (Charles Kincy)
Subject: Re: MS Gave Up (Was Re: pc week and nt)
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 02:55:36 GMT
Organization: University of Missouri - Rolla

In article <1992Aug27.030717.9986@microsoft.com> gordonl@microsoft.com (Gordon Letwin) writes:
>In article <1992Aug24.170037.362@njitgw.njit.edu> dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) writes:
>>>
>>>      For the same reason Microsoft doesn't make applications for
>>>the TRS-80.  The market was too small.
>>
>>But MS never had any TRS-80 apps.  
>
>Another authorative posting from someone whose ignorance is awesome.  I
>note the ".edu" in Mr Charlap's address.  Any bets as to whether this

Oh, great, you're getting onto the '.edu' sites again?!  C'mon, Gordon.
This is what people do when the undergraduates start getting under
their skin.  What a cop-out.

What's this I hear about you retiring?  I hope you'll still continue
to add your valuable insight to this and other newsgroups, as always.

Have a good one!  =)

cpk
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: ohrd!nbadie@cs.toronto.edu (Navid Badie)
Subject: Re: IS IBM UK STILL IN THE STONE AGE???
Organization: "Ontario Hydro - Research Division"
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 20:51:39 GMT

sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples) writes:
 
: No, Phil.  Just yesterday IBM air expressed a private patch to me to
: see if it would fix some minor video problems I had reported (after at
: least three phone calls from the developer responsible for that
: section of OS/2 code, who went through everything step-by-step).  The
: diskette was hand labelled and included the IBMer's direct telephone
: number.

It is nice to hear of such a positive experience, and there is little
doubt in my mind that IBM intends to provide good support for OS/2
users, but there is a very big obstacle on the road to adequate
support for OS/2, and that is: 

: (I do still have some criticisms on IBM's support, notably that
: sometimes it is a bit too difficult to work through the front line
: bureaucracy.)

If in your case it is sometimes, in my case it is every single time.
(4 out of 4 support calls.) I call the support number, get a reference
number for my call, and receive a return phone call within a short
time. (Showing that they really do intend to help me fix my problem.)

BUT, the support person is invariably not very knowledgeable (i.e.
I have not yet received one suggestion which I had not already tried
before calling), sometimes does not know some fundamental stuff
(obviously they do not read comp.os.os2.*), and WILL NOT let me talk
to someone more knowledgeable. 

I have heard of people getting by the front line to more competent 
people, but when I asked a colleague how he got such fast response
from IBM (it was about getting the NOVELL requestor to work with
his Western Digital card) he said he threatened IBM that he would
switch back to Windows! Do we really have to get down and dirty like
that to get some response?
 
: Timothy F. Sipples      | The OS/2 FREQ. ASKED QUESTIONS LIST is avail. from
: sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu | 128.123.35.151, anonymous ftp, in /pub/os2/all/faq.
: Dept. of Econ., Univ.   | Or from LISTSERV@BLEKUL11.BITNET (send "HELP").
: Chicago, 60637          | Hey GOP: The Economy, Stupid!

Cheers,
Navid Badie
==========================
ohrd!nbadie@cs.toronto.edu --- voice (416) 231-4111 x6675  fax (416) 231-3748
To state the obvious:
Any opinions expressed in the above are mine, not my employer's.
From: shabby@Athena.MIT.EDU (Chris Shabsin)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: OS/2 vs NT features list, Revision 1.2
Date: 2 Sep 92 06:58:52 GMT
	<1992Sep1.000214.29640@hellgate.utah.edu>
	<1992Sep1.184637.17449@hemlock.cray.com>
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

gsfg
--
-Chris Shabsin
-sig under construction
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: nevries@accucx.cc.ruu.nl (Nico E de Vries)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: OS/2 vs NT features list, Revision 1.4
Date: 3 Sep 92 06:43:52 GMT
Followup-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Organization: Academic Computer Centre Utrecht

Let me start with stating this is becoming an interesting list and I
have learned a lot from it. I do have some problems with it however.

It contains a mix of facts, opinions (of the author) and plans for
the future. The distinction between those is not made very clear. I
noticed in the discussionss of Brian with others he often ignores
comment from others on his list. I don't say he is not allowed to
be opiniated but I think he should make that much more clear. If
some of his points is clearly doubted he should at least make a note
of that in his list. This would make it much more easier to differentiate
between the different kinds of information in the list.

Nico E. de Vries
_ _
O O  USENET nevries@cc.ruu.nl  FIDO 2:281/708.1  COMPUSERVE "soon" ???? 
 o   This text reflects MY opinions, not that of my employer BITECH.      
\_/  This text is supplied 'AS IS', no waranties of any kind apply.      
     Don't waste your time on complaining about my hopeless typostyle.

"I would admit my mistakes, if I had any ..."  (Bumper Sticker)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: xtifr@netcom.com (Chris Waters)
Subject: Death to Hercules!!  :-)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92 05:56:25 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 


Ok, so I've been thinkin' about it, see?  And the way I see it is:

1. IBM supports current standards (VGA, XGA, 8514).
2. IBM supports obsolete standards which they've created (CGA, EGA).
3. IBM does not support other vendor's obsolete standards (HGA).
   (I don't even think that Hercules supports HGA any more).

I don't see anything wrong with this, as long as they *do* support any
_current_standards_.  Offerings from single vendors don't count as
standards, obsolete systems like Herc don't count as current.

As for me, I ran Herc a few years back.  I gave up on it *cause nobody
supported it*!!  I got sick of whining at vendors, and decided to submit
to the obvious.  HGA is dead.
-- 
Chris Waters    | the insane don't | NOBODY for President!
xtifr@netcom.COM| need disclaimers | Because Nobody's perfect!!
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.os2.misc
From: wer5@ellis.uchicago.edu (Will E. Rose)
Subject: Re: Win-OS/2 performance tweaks
Reply-To: wer5@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 22:56:14 GMT

In article <1992Aug31.171344.42686@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> thompson@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>
>To tweak your Win-OS/2, set the following DOS settings of your
>Win-OS/2 program object:
>
>DOS Full Screen enabled
>DPMI_MEMORY_LIMIT:  3
>EMS_MEMORY_LIMIT:  0
>VIDEO_RETRACE_EMULATION:  OFF
>XMS_MEMORY_LIMIT:  64
>VIDEO_SWITCH_NOTIFICATION:  ON
>IDLE_SENSITIVITY:  100
>IDLE_SECONDS:  10
>HW_ROM_TO_RAM:  ON
>DOS_UMB:  ON
>VIDEO_8514A_XGA_IOTRAP (if available):  OFF
>
I have run WINOS2 with these settings from the day I installed OS/2, and it
takes WINOS2 35 seconds to load on my 386/33 with 16MB whereas it takes
Win3.1 32 seconds on a 386/25 with 4MB.

Taking the advantages of HPFS, more memory, and processor speed into 
consideration, this implies that Win3.1 loads much faster on equivilent
hardware.


-- 
_______________________________________________________________________________ Will E. Rose                                   GSB-CS: wer5@gsbsun.uchicago.edu
GSB Computing Services                         UCCO:   wer5@midway.uchicago.edu
------------The University of Chicago - Graduate School of Business------------
From: ADUNSMUI@TOROLAB6.VNET.IBM.COM (Al Dunsmuir)
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 12:04:27 EDT
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: OS/2 Advocacy
Organization: IBM Canada Laboratory Ltd, Toronto, CANADA
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not those of IBM
News-Software: UReply 3.0
Supercedes: <19920828.062212.429@almaden.ibm.com>

  This posting has been superceded by a subsequent item.

Al Dunsmuir                       Internet: adunsmui@torolab6.vnet.ibm.com
CODE Development II + TEAM OS/2      Voice: (416) 448-3315
IBM Canada Laboratory Ltd, Toronto, CANADA

OS/2 V2: Why settle for anything less?
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples)
Subject: Re: What and how I'd like to see c.o.o.a advocate.
Reply-To: sip1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Dept. of Econ., Univ. of Chicago
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:53:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.135329.147@weyrich.UUCP> tnet.com!weyrich!orville writes:
>>>>>IBM Direct could have a bundle of 2 software sets and 2 ethernet
>>>>>cards like Novell does with NetWare Lite. 
>>>>If nobody sues them for unfair competition, it would be a great idea.
>>>If IBM uses a similar pricing structure, how could anybody successfully
>>>sue them?
>>Because, even though they don't have a majority of the market, they
>>are seen as a powerful force (and they are in some areas).  If they
>>appear to favor one brand of ethernet hardware (even their own), it
>>could cause problems.  The other board vendors will accuse them of
>>stealing away the market.
>There is a long road from an accusation to a SUCCESSFUL law suit. In any
>event, the ideal would be for IBM to make the software available to any/
>all board manufacturers that wanted to do such a bundle.

IBM is sort of sliding into this position (of increased bundling of
network products).  For example, many PS/2s come in "LS" models (i.e.
with TokenRing adapters, preinstalled).  The next step is bundling the
network software with the base operating system.

-- 
Timothy F. Sipples      | The OS/2 FREQ. ASKED QUESTIONS LIST is avail. from
sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu | 128.123.35.151, anonymous ftp, in /pub/os2/all/faq.
Dept. of Econ., Univ.   | Or from LISTSERV@BLEKUL11.BITNET (send "HELP").
Chicago, 60637          | Hey GOP: The Economy, Stupid!
From: ADUNSMUI@TOROLAB6.VNET.IBM.COM (Al Dunsmuir)
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 09:59:16 EDT
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: OS/2 Advocacy
Organization: IBM Canada Laboratory Ltd, Toronto, CANADA
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not those of IBM
News-Software: UReply 3.0
            <1992Aug27.174238.11420@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>

In <1992Aug27.174238.11420@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> Douglas A. Bell writes:
>In a previous article, jim@tct.com (Jim Kunzman) says:
>
>>Now that the OS religious wars have settled down, this group needs
>>to have some life put back into it.  Since the topic is supposed to
>>be advocacy, I would like to see some advocacy for new features
>>for OS/2 posted here.  I would be happy to collect messages and
>>periodically summarize requests.  Since IBM representatives monitor
>>usenet's OS/2 groups, this might be a good place to provide feedback.
>>
.... lots of useful comments omitted for brevity....

Jim and Douglas,

   Thank you _very_ much for your suggestions and comments regarding new
features for follow-on releases to OS/2 V2.0.  Your comments have made
their way to the OS/2 product planning team (via John Soyring).

   You indicated that you would be gathering additional messages and
periodically summarizing requests.  This is very valuable information,
since it reflects the desires of people who are _using_ OS/2.  To ensure
that each new summary is also passed on to the planners, please send me
a copy directly, and I'll ensure that it gets forwarded it to the right
people.

Al Dunsmuir                       Internet: adunsmui@torolab6.vnet.ibm.com

*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
|                                                                         |
|  Please ignore my previous posting... instead of flooding John's mail   |
|  with messages, it's _much_ better to send them to me, and I can pass   |
|  them on to the appropriate people.  My apologies for the confusion,    |
|  and any inconvenience it may have caused you or John.                  |
|                                                                         |
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
CODE Development II + TEAM OS/2      Voice: (416) 448-3315
IBM Canada Laboratory Ltd, Toronto, CANADA

OS/2 V2: Why settle for anything less?
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: philipla@microsoft.com (Phil Lafornara)
Subject: Re: Non-IBM experiences with OS/2?
Date: 02 Sep 92 18:39:14 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <1992Sep1.135325.7248@dhw68k.cts.com> david@dhw68k.cts.com (David H. Wolfskill) writes:
>
>One individual -- the only one who works for my manager who has
>undergone such a transition -- found (much to his chagrin) that his
>migration to OS/2 required relocation of the printer that he & a few
>others shared, since apparently the upper limit on printer cable
>lengths in OS/2 is lower than the corresponding limit in DOS.
>

     I won't comment on the rest of your post, since I would 
certainly be accused of bias and trying to sway your company away
from OS/2, but the above paragraph sounds like a crock to me.
It reminds me of the story of the knot-in-the-power-cord.

					-Phil
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phil Lafornara         				1 Microsoft Way         
philipla@microsoft.com				Redmond, WA 98052-6399 
Note:  Microsoft doesn't even _know_ that these are my opinions. So there.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy