From: darist@bluemoon.rn.com (david stroop)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: EVIL
Date: 10 Oct 92 20:58:06 GMT
Organization: Blue Moon BBS ((614) 868-998[024])

From: rolls@cis.umassd.edu (Frank Pinto)
>
>According to theists , this is true:
>
>-------->God is omnipotent
>-------->God is omniscient
>-------->God is the creator of "EVERYTHING"
 
For the purpose of this discussion, I will accept the first two.  
But the creator of "everything?"  One thing God probably did not 
create was Himself.  Also, John 1:3 says, without Him "was not 
anything made that has been made."  This might be putting an 
unintended meaning on the passage, but it could be argued that 
there are other things which were not made (created) but just 
exist.  Also, science's law of conservation of mass and energy 
implies that the M-E of the universe has always existed.  
(Whether this is right is beside the point.) 
 
So, the statement that God created everything is a little rash. It 
is equally rash to say God created evil.  (You might not have 
been saying that, but I include this point free of charge.) 
 
>
>Question ; (A thorn for the Theists)
>
>-------->There is "evil"in the world.
>
>If this GOD exists then how does he deal with this issue?("EVIL")
>
>If this GOD exists and is apathetic about evil then he is weak. On
>the other hand if he can 't do anything about evil then is not 
>omnipotent whence he is "EVIL"
>
 
Here is an analogy.  You will no doubt find a way to use it or 
change it to prove a different point.  But the point *I* wish to 
illustrate is: God doesn't have to *do* everything He *can* do, 
at least right now. 
 
------->I have a library book which I have the *power* to return.
------->I *know* it can be returned and how to return it.
 
------->Yet, I have not returned it.
 
From the above, it can not be concluded that I must (if I exist) 
have returned it or must return it now.  Neither can it be 
concluded from the fact that the book is still checked out that I 
do not exist or that I don't have the power or knowledge to 
return it. 
 
So, neither can it be concluded, from the fact that God has not 
yet dealt with some evil, that He does not exist or that He is 
weak. 
 
Other points which are usually made on this topic are:
 
<Why doesn't God force everyone to Do Good.  -or-
<Why didn't God make us so that we couldn't do evil.  -or-
<God's knowledge of the evil results of creation makes Him evil.
 
God could have done things differently.  However, He *chose* to do 
just what He has done.  That does not make Him evil (except to 
people who *want* to see Him as evil).  The manufacturer is not
responsible for the many crimes committed with the cars he makes
even though he can know this will certainly happen. 
 
If anything, what He has done shows how powerful He is.  He can 
create a being which has the ability to choose between good and 
evil.  I submit that it is a lesser thing to create beings that 
have no choice.  If God chose to show his power by doing what He 
did, I, for one, would not have tried to prevent that or call it 
evil.  (Rom 9:22.) 
 
 
The quick answer to your Question is, "Yeah?  So?"  While I 
understand your point of view, I just don't agree with it.  Can 
you see my point of view?  (Surprise me.  Say yes.) 
 
DARIST
 
"God is not slack as some count slackness, but is patient." 
(Otherwise we all would have long ago been "zapped.")