HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rbook@swordfish.owlnet.rice.edu (Robert A. Book)
Newsgroups: alt.romance,soc.singles,soc.couples
Subject: Re: Sanctity of relationships
Date: 16 Apr 1992 22:34:20 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Rice University

In article <1992Apr14.164304.29399@cbfsb.cb.att.com>, sms@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (steven.m.stein) writes:
> In article <1992Apr13.014644.14378@rice.edu> rbook@flammulated.owlnet.rice.edu (Robert Aaron Book) writes:
> >In article <1992Apr7.005929.11543@vax5.cit.cornell.edu>, rnjx@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
> 
> >In addition to the ethical issue, there is also the practical issue:  if the
> >object of your "wooing" is responsive, then obviously he/she isn't very 
> >committed to his/her present relationship, and probably won't be committed
> >to the relationship with you, either.  Thus, he/she will probably be wooed 
> >away from you by someone else, so what's the point?
> >
> >--Robert Book
> >  rbook@rice.edu
> 
> I don't necessarily agree with this.  Even though s/he might not be
> compatible with one individual, does not necessarily mean that s/he
> would not be compatible with all other individuals.  We don't always
> know in advance that a relationship is not going to work until we are
> already involved in the relationship.
> 
> 						StEvE


So, if it doesn't work out later on, then you can approach her.  But
whether a relationship is working is for the people in it to decide, not
an outsider.  And until they decide it, you should respect that relationship.
I know someone who is in a rather unsatisfying relationships, and I sometimes
get virtual play-by-play updates.  She keeps breaking up and getting back
together with him.  Personally, I think it's not working and she probably
should break up with him altogether.  But that's not for me to decide, and
I'm not even going to tell her what I think.  If she asks, I'll say, "You
have to decide that, not me, since either way, you're the one who's going
to have to deal with the consequences of that decision.  I don't want to be 
responsible if it ends up being the wrong decision."

And I won't even think of getting involved with her unless she ends up breaking
up with him for good.


And kapa@cbnewsc.cb.att.com (k.a.perkins) writes:

> A lot of bad may
> have happened between the 2 people in the current relationship
> that weakened the relationship beyond all repair.

Maybe, but you can't make that assumption.  And even if it's true, It's
better to let the other relationship die on its own.


-Robert Book
 rbook@rice.edu
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Sunday, 12 Apr 1992 14:32:42 EDT
From: <DMB119@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Only takes a little time......

Ok....ok....so I see how everyone is writing how to be romantic with that
special someone. I'll pass my story along if you don't mind. I'm really good
friends with girl, but nothing has happened (romantically that is) between. I
write poetry and but have never given her anything I have written about her,
well some of it was written when she had a boyfriend ( they'broke up about 2
months ago). Now we are close and we do a lot of things together so I know her
pretty well. A couple of weeks ago I was gonna give her some of my poetry becau
se she wondered  (she knows I write) how come I never let her see anything I
write, and I figured well it's crash or burn time. I let her have a couple of
my better poems written about her and she flipped...( couple of cartwheels).
But since I'm not one for repeating things much ( I like trying to always
make thingsnewand fresh, mainly cuz other people love it, and therer expression
s are great) so I knew of a guy who has a 6 track studio in his house. I told
how I'd like to put my words to his music, if he'd like it. We started almost
2 weeks ago, and it's great,if you write poetry and know someone who has a
little recording track....try it you'll love it. I only wanted to record
three songs because of time....we've finished two of them ("The Promise", and
" Don't Look Back")and they sound pretty good to me. The first song is more
of a piano type song with a slow organ in it. the second has a soft drum beat
with the organ and a acoustic guitar. Oh, he does the singing in case you were
wondering, my voice is reserved for the shower. I do play harmonica on "Don't
look Back"so  I guess I do make my music debut. The third song, "loose Ends"
is almost done, has a cool slide guitar that sounds really haunting in it, and
my harmonica will probably show up again. I haven't told her about
the songs yet, I have invited her to a home cook dinner ( yes I'm going to make
it, but cooking isn't one of my strong parts)next Saturday (4/17) will play
them there for her. Hopefully things will work out like planned.....dinner not
burned, she goes crazy for the songs, and we cuddle as we watch a rented
romantic movie. So if anyone wants to know how it turns out e-mail me....oh yea
and ladies.....if there's something else that might make this night special....
please feel free to drop me a line.....the more help the better for this to fly


She's the One,
Dave                   " Yea I know I ain't nobody's bargain...
                         but hell a little touch up...
                         and a little paint"
                           - Springsteen, "Human Touch"
Xref: sparky alt.romance:6996 alt.romance.chat:9621
From: RJD118@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.romance,alt.romance.chat
Subject: Is this a common thing?
Date: 13 Apr 92 13:24:34 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

I was talking to the gf for many hours on the phone last night...and she had a
question for me that pretty much floored me. I was speechless (not a common
thing, let me tell you...) and just...well, I couldn't understand.
Here's the question: "If, in the possible occurance of an 'oops', [as in
unwanted/unexpected pregnancy] what would happen to 'us'? Would you share
the financial burden, or what?"
Okay...there is a reason for this. There was an evening last week where we...
well, 'unprotected sex' occured. I know, bad idea. She isn't pregnant (thank
God...I am not ready to be a father) and we decided that we gotta tone down
the physical aspect of the relationship for now...too much too soon, you see.
But she was worried about my reaction to it...She isn't a fan of abortion,
but sees it as a viable option...she is NOT a fan of adoption...
All this she told me while I was trying to get my brain under control.
She was afraid that, IF she got pregnant, I would help out financially,
whatever she decided to do, but the relationship would basically be over.
She says that most of the guys she knows feel this way.
I can't understand this attitude, in anybody.
I told her that "If I love you enough to make love to you, my feelings aren't
going to change because of a pregnancy. Of course I would help out financially,
it's as much my responsibility as yours, but I wouldn't otherwise abandon
you because of a problem like that."

Ladies, is this a common worry?
Guys, do you feel the way I do, or the other way around?
I just want some answers....
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I_________________________I         Redneck!    The Official Lumberjack
I\***********************/I                     and Woodgatherer of the
                                                          RFA
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.romance
From: pope@physics.su.OZ.AU (Michael Pope)
Subject: Re: What is love really about
Organization: School of Physics, University of Sydney, Australia
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 01:26:56 GMT

>In article <1992Apr8.184446.18011@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> bd427@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (David J. Babinsky) writes:
>>
>>In a recent post, Mick said:
>>
>>Hi guys, just a little drunk.  My first post to this group, and I was
>>Mick....
>>
>>
Keep them coming guys, there has been some reall inspired stuff.  Hope that I
am not the only one who has benefited by all this.

:)


Mick....
From: aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (Teresa Kline)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: For a new twist....
Date: 17 Apr 92 13:19:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: lims02.17APR199208192265
Organization: Yeah, *right* !
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Apr17.030054.10991@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>, ted5@po.CWRU.Edu (Thomas E. Davidson) writes...
>when you first start dating?

Did I miss something here?  Are you asking us when we started dating...or 
was this a personal message to someone else?
-- Teresa

		Life -- just for the FUN of it!!!!
Xref: sparky alt.romance:6710 soc.singles:10561 soc.couples:1927
From: mjln_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Mikeey J. Lin)
Newsgroups: alt.romance,soc.singles,soc.couples
Subject: Re: Sanctity of relationships
Date: 7 Apr 92 16:54:25 GMT
Distribution: world,soc
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

>In <7APR199212225785@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov> aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov
 (Teresa Kline) writes:

>>In article <1992Apr7.144714.1315@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>, mjln_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Mikeey J. Lin) writes...
>> 
>>	Hmmm... I think I know how you feel. Presently, I'm getting too
>>close with an ex-girlfriend who has a habit of telling things about her
>>present boyfriend. The good news is that we can really open up to each
>>other, the bad news is that I usually hear not so nice things about her
>>boyfriend. I personally think it is NOT right to break up a relationship
>>so I basically mentions his good points everytime she's upset about him.
>>(This occurs even if I thought he was a total jerk about the situation)
>>However, I always have second thoughts... Everyone can tell you that it
>>is NOT right to break up a friendship but it might be for the best. 

>This reminds me of a friend of mine whom I love dearly.  He is male, and 
>has never been my SO.  But he showed me once just how much he loved me and 
>how much he valued my friendship.  He did it by pointing out what an idiot 
>I was being with my current boyfriend.  He told me, in detail, how I had 
>changed for the worse while dating this guy.  He pointed out how much 
>quieter I was, and rather subservient because that was what this guy 
>expected.  
>Sure, I was angry for a while.  No one likes to have their stupidity 
>pointed out to them.  But, within a few weeks I started to think about what 
>he had done.  He was willing to risk our friendship in order to save me 
>from pain and heartache.  *That* is a friend.

>-- Teresa

>		Life -- just for the FUN of it!!!!

	
	Yeah... I can sympathize with your friend. It's difficult to be 
just a friend to someone you truly love. He's got great control, something
I feel like I'm losing. Anyone who is willing to risk a special friendship
to save another from "pain" has got to be a "true" friend. However, nice
guys tend to finish last in life here. At least that's how I feel. :(

						Mikeey
				    mjln_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu
From: sms@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (steven.m.stein)
Newsgroups: alt.romance,soc.singles,soc.couples
Subject: Re: Sanctity of relationships
Date: 10 Apr 92 15:57:21 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T

In article <1992Apr10.131827.6746@cbnewsi.cb.att.com> Brian.C.Kohn@att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality) writes:
>In article <1992Apr10.062723.24391@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> tlode@isis.cs.du.edu (trygve lode) writes:
>>In article <1992Apr9.202525.25582@cbnewse.cb.att.com>
>>            hjanssen@cbnewse.cb.att.com (hank janssen) writes:
>>>On another note, we keep on saying that it is men wooing  women  away.
>>>Is this our ego speaking. I would think it is  the  other  way  around
>>>just as much.  Am i wrong.??
>>I don't think you're wrong in this statement; I do think we can conclude
>>from this that it seems to be a significant emotional issue for a lot
>>more male contributors to soc.singles than female contributors.
>
>I think this is because some *evil* men, like Mr. Stein, *do* actively
>try to break up relationships in order to woo women, (j/k Steve! :-) )
>whereas women do not do this.  Women are much more civilized than men.
>
Being that I have never set out intentionally to break up a relationship
totally invalidates your point.  I have however been persued by women
who were dissatisfied with the relationship they were in and ended that
relationship either prior to or at the beginning of a more fullfilling
relationship with me.  (Not that I am the perfect mate, but obviously
better than the one they were in.)

I think it's time that you self persecuted people stop blaming the
"other guy" for the wrong you brought upon yourselves.

>>I get the impression that a number of men here have been burned by someone
>>pursuing someone they were interested in or, failing that, are very
>>insecure in their relationships...
>
>Not me.  Never been burned, and very secure in my relationship.

I'm not convinced.  Otherwise you would not be sooooo worried about
other guys "stealing" your SO away from you.

					Steve
>
>-- 
>Brian Charles Kohn             AT&T Bell Laboratories Quality Process Center
>ISO Certified Lead Assessor    E-MAIL: att!hoqax!bicker  (bicker@hoqax.ATT.COM)
>    'Hope, not fear, is the most positive advocate of action.' - S.R. Lawhead
>                   Stamp Out "SO": "RP" = "Romantic Partner"
Newsgroups: alt.romance
From: robd@cray.com (Robert Derrick)
Subject: Re: lying to oneself (was Re: Sanctity of relationships)
Distribution: world,soc
Date: 10 Apr 92 19:08:39 CDT

chocolate john, into the fray:
: 
: I was going to stay out of this, I really was...

I'm glad you came in, and not just because of your position...
 
: I(Angelwing) writes:
: |> robd@cray.com (Robert Derrick) writes:
: |> 
: |> >I guess I believe that people are basically good, and when they do bad
: |> >things, they will feel the 'bad', however much they tell themselves and
: |> >others that they truly believe in what they are doing.  They will feel
: |> >the pangs.
: |> 
: |> Oh man.
: 
: You know, there are a lot of Taoists whose beliefs include what Robert
: believes (this is a simplification, but a part of the belief.) It is
: enlightening for me to find that Angelwing is so wise as to have a
: deeper understanding of the way of things, so as to know that they are
: all wrong.

There is indeed, one Taoist, named Rob, whose beliefs (although I am
cautious about the use of such a strong word) are just so.  That you
recognized it is enlightening to me, because I am not a person who
is studying Tao to believe it, but I am a person for whom the Tao
has always been at my center, and I only discovered it there when
I looked.  It was as if I had always been a Taoist, but never knew
it had a name (naming it is a complete problem in and of itself, so
don't feel it necessary to jump in and explain -- I do know)

: To lie to yourself means to believe in something that is not true.  Who
: defines these truths, if not self?  Am I not good if someone thinks I
: am bad?  Am I not handsome if someone thinks I am ugly?  Am I not smart
: if someone thinks I am dumb?
: 
: Truth is subjective.  You define them for your world, and your world
: defines them for you.  Angelwing thinks Robert is lying to himself, and
: Robert thinks he is not.  To me, the truth is that they are both right.
                                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Ah!  This is like a wildflower on a spring morning, when it sees the sun
for the first time.  But even though it is there, plainly to be seen,
most people will never even notice it.

The original question has no answer, but if it did,
  this would be the answer.

: chocolate john

Thank you, chocolate john.

rob derrick

this is great!
From: rxr14@po.CWRU.Edu (Robert Richardson)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Where did the romance go?
Date: 9 Apr 92 19:45:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: usenet.1992Apr9.194522.14890
Reply-To: rxr14@po.CWRU.Edu (Robert Richardson)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)


In a previous article, schwing_g@cho006.cho.ge.com () says:

>My question and personal thoughts on all the subjects...
>
>I reaad this newsgroup originally because I thought I could find some people
>who felt like I did:
>
>Life is wonderful and sharing it with someone special is even better...
>What happened to ROMANCE here???? All I hear is bitching about ..men this,
>women that, love sucks, I'm a nerd, BOO-HOO-HOO-HOO.......Bleah!
>

No flame intended, but I really don't think you should criticize those who
complain about their romantic lot in life on the Net, sometimes it is the
easiest place for them to do so....IMHO.  

At the same time, however, I would like to say (to everyone, now..) that I 
started reading this newsgroup a few weeks ago because I thought it was
interesting.  I have been called a romantic by more than one of my female
friends and even though I've never had an SO, I haven't lost my sense of
romance (at least not yet...).  I enjoy at least thinking about nice walks
and lying on the beach at night (which I've done with various female friends
over my few years) and enjoy doing all the chivalrous stuff (opening doors,
etc.) despite the fact that I know that it usu. gets me nowhere with women.
At any rate, I find it interesting to read posts of other people (w/and w/o
SOs) who feel the same way I do.
  At the same time, the "whiners'" posts
I can also identify with and I therefore find them just as important.  I
have been known to whine about my situation once in a while....but I keep
my head up and wait patiently for the "right one" without criticizing women
or anyone else, hopefully.  I think I've even posted here a coupla times.
(Med school, unfortunately, doesn't allow for much time to attempt thinking
about finding SOs....)

So, anyway, lovers--keep on talking, poets--keep on writing, and whiners--we
can commiserate!  Isn't this what alt.romance is all about??
All this is just an opinion/state of life from a new user.....
Anyone can reply to me by post or e-mail, in fact I invite it!

---
Robert Richardson
CWRU SchoolOMed
"Dammit, Jim, I'm a doctor, not a lover!"
Xref: sparky alt.romance:7001 alt.romance.chat:9626
From: jodar@girtab.usc.edu (Nicholas Jodar)
Newsgroups: alt.romance,alt.romance.chat
Subject: Re: Is this a common thing?
Date: 13 Apr 1992 08:13:54 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: girtab.usc.edu
Summary: Don't ask me....
Keywords: Tough Questions

In article <92104.092434RJD118@psuvm.psu.edu> RJD118@psuvm.psu.edu writes:

>She was afraid that, IF she got pregnant, I would help out financially,
>whatever she decided to do, but the relationship would basically be over.

I could see that as being a legitimate fear....

>She says that most of the guys she knows feel this way.

Well, I wouldn't know, one way or the other....

>I can't understand this attitude, in anybody.

Yeah, well, it doesn't make sense to me, either.... :-)

>I told her that "If I love you enough to make love to you, my feelings aren't
>going to change because of a pregnancy. Of course I would help out financially,
>it's as much my responsibility as yours, but I wouldn't otherwise abandon
>you because of a problem like that."

Ah, but that's what you're saying NOW....  Many people talk a lot
about what they would do in a certain situation, but when it
comes up, they don't adhere to their big plans.  This happens
mostly with things that profoundly affect the person, such as
abortion, death in the family, being part of something horrific,
et cetera.

Until you've been in a similar situation, you can only guess as
to how you'd react.  Hopefully, with strong willpower and support
from others, you'll react the way you planned to.

Suffice it to say that most people don't know themselves as well
as they think....

>Ladies, is this a common worry?
>Guys, do you feel the way I do, or the other way around?

Personally, I would feel responsible for the welfare of the 
woman and any child she might have.  If the child were not mine,
it would be more complicated, but if I'm committed to a
relationship, it's a COMITTMENT.

-Nick

'Sleep....  One of the three things grad students never get enough of....'

Xref: sparky alt.romance:7210 soc.singles:11442 soc.couples:2156
From: jessica@pappus.ss.uci.edu (Jessica Hines)
Subject: Re: Sanctity of relationships
Newsgroups: alt.romance,soc.singles,soc.couples
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Distribution: usa
Date: 16 Apr 92 22:34:27 GMT

In article <1992Apr14.161955.28928@cbfsb.cb.att.com>, sms@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (steven.m.stein) writes:
|> In article <sdc2aINN9d6@agate.berkeley.edu> ronan@codon3 (Karen Ronan;161 GPBB;x2-0884) writes:
|> >Okay, someone shows a lack of respect for your relationship.
|> >So what? Why should that person be of the slightest importance?
|> >-Karen
|> >ronan@codon2.berkeley.edu
|> >
|> Finally a woman's point of view.  And I agree 100%.  Yes, the guy
|> may be an ass (or a fool) for actively trying to mess things up, but
|> he still should have no influence on the security and/or solidity
|> of the already existing relationship.
|> 
|> We rest our case.
|> 
|> 					Steve

I thought other women had posted on this issue before, but I may be wrong.
I disagree, both for abstract and concrete reasons: the concrete reasons are
that I have a friend who did just that several times, put a little pressure on
already hurting relationships and helped them break up, so he could go out with
the female in question.  After going thru a few painful breakups of relationships
which had begun that way, he said he wouldn't do that again, 'cause getting into
a relationship that way always left a little resentment in the other person's mind,
a feeling of "But maybe if he hadn't come along, that other relationship would have
worked out," which would wax and wane every time the new relationship had any 
problems.  A small sample size, admittedly, and not meant to convince the general
population.

On the abstract side, I agreed with the hammer hitting the window analogy: asking out
on a date once, sure, the other person can say no and that's that. But the original
question was actively wooing, which to me implied continued, repeated pressure.
Yes, if the relationship is strong, it can withstand such pressure; but if the
relationship is hurting anyway, you aren't helping it any, and you do end up taking
some of the blame for the eventual break up, since it was your choice to introduce
that factor... Not all of the blame, but some of it (and as my friend above noted,
you can be sure the other person is aware of that).

--jess

So.Cal. is like a movie set...
From: erc@pogo.Corp.Sun.COM (Ed Carp)
Newsgroups: alt.romance
Subject: Re: Ed and Teresa
Date: 10 Apr 92 01:24:05 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: pogo.corp.sun.com

In article <9APR199208342801@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov> aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (Teresa Kline) writes:
>In article <1992Apr9.022834.25112@leland.Stanford.EDU>, rna@leland.Stanford.EDU (Robert Ashcroft) writes...

>>Ed and Teresa flirt on the net.  Teresa finally calls Ed's bluff and
>>tells him to ask her out.  Ed wimps out.  

>That about covers it...:(

Hey!!!  Wait a minute!!!  WHEN did you ask me out on the net???????

>>Or is there something else going on here?

>No, darn it!! :(

Hmmm.....
--
Ed Carp                                      415/336-0797 (work)

++ UNIX  SysAdmin, Systems  Programming  Services,  Utilities ++
++ and Programmer Productivity Tools                          ++
Xref: sparky alt.romance:7089 soc.singles:11279 soc.couples:2127
From: jclark@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (John Clark)
Newsgroups: alt.romance,soc.singles,soc.couples
Subject: Re: Sanctity of relationships
Date: 15 Apr 92 00:55:52 GMT
Followup-To: alt.romance
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of California, San Diego

In article <1992Apr14.201036.27695@ultra.com> stcroix@ultra.com (Bill St. Croix) writes:
+
+Hey....now here's a guy that you want to be dating your daughter! :+)

Yeah, got to protect them girls from them city slickers...
Or teach your daughter karate and to do what she pleases.
-- 

John Clark
jclark@ucsd.edu