HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gdavis@griffin.uvm.edu (Gary Davis)
Subject: Re: Physician's Incomes
Keywords: income
Organization: University of Vermont -- Division of EMBA Computer Facility
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 00:16:54 GMT

The paper was attempting to determine why Americans pay so much for
health care and get either less or same as other countries.

120K is ofcourse,not entirely unreasonable when one considers the long
and exhaustive training American MDS must persue,but is all this training
really in the public's interest or can quality be maintained with a
lower number of years spent in obtaining qualification.

Ofcourse there are so many special interests and vested interests 
tangled with this question,it may never be discussed.

I have always considered lawyers parasistic upon both medical
practitioners and the general public. I'm curious how much health
care bills could be reduced by decoupling these vulchers from the system.

Again.. too many powerful and yes greedy interests here for this subject
to even see the light of day.

Medicine is not an exact science,nor can it be. MDs are only human
and those can err. Need the public pay millions in a malpractice
mess that in reality was nothing more than a patient's unrealistic
expectation. (well I digress)

But.. 120K is not a bad salary. The president of our U.. makes in this
range! He is considered to be reasonably compensated!

--
                       Gary E. Davis /WQ1F/
              Dpt. Electrical Engineering and Com Sciences
              University of Vermont @ Burlington
From: rind@binoc.bih.harvard.edu (David Rind)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Peter Breggin, _Toxic Psychiatry_ (Q)
Date: 14 Dec 92 17:53:57 GMT
Organization: Beth Israel Hospital, Harvard Medical School, Boston Mass., USA

In article <Bz9B1v.5nn@unx.sas.com> sasghm@theseus.unx.sas.com
 (Gary Merrill) writes:
>The issue here is whether there is a
>mental disease (say schizophrenia) in the same sense that there is a
>physical disease (say scarlet fever)].

I've been trying to stay out of this thread, but you really just don't
get it.  I am virtually certain that you have never talked with
anyone during a psychotic break due to schizophrenia, because you
would not then be writing these things.  Certainly other diseases
can be mistaken for schizophrenia (as TSS can be mistaken for
scarlet fever), but there clearly are people whom schizophrenia
"strikes" just like cancer.  And like many other chronic diseases,
schizophrenia can often be successfully treated.

The reason you have been getting the responses you've gotten is
that you are truly posting out of ignorance.  Why don't you see if
you can get a tour of your local state psychiatric institute and
try to find people who you think are being held against their
will just because they don't fit some psychiatrist's view of
"normal".
-- 
David Rind
rind@binoc.bih.harvard.edu
From: pwageman@visual.spk.wa.us (Peggy Wageman)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Raynaud's Syndrome
Date: 15 Dec 92 10:31:15 GMT
Organization: The Visual Market - Spokane, WA

Could somebody describe the symptoms of Raynauds Syndrome, and also what
causes it.  Also, I read that its a disorder that may only last for a brief 
period of time, is that true?  Any information on this would be appreciated.
Thanks,  Peggy Wageman
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: russ@pmafire.inel.gov (Russ Brown)
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 19:33:25 GMT
Organization: WINCO
Subject: Re: AIDS, Cancer Cured by Hyperoxygenation
Summary: 
Followup-To: 
Organization: WINCO
Keywords: 

In article <des.59@helix.nih.gov> des@helix.nih.gov (David E. Scheim) writes:
>In article <71468@cup.portal.com> Don_-_Showen@cup.portal.com writes:
>
>>AIDS, Cancer Cured by Hyperoxygenation
>
>>Reprinted from the June 1988 issue of Health Freedom News
>
>>by Waves Forest
>>  
>>  Several dozen AIDS patients have not only reversed their death
>>sentences, but are now back at work, completely free of the disease.  They
>>destroyed the virus in their blood by hyperoxygenation, known in various
>>forms as oxygen therapy, bio-oxydative therapy or auto-hemotherapy.  This
>
>If there's a possibility, however small, that the principles you mentioned 
>could have some efficacy for AIDS, I think they deserve at least a round of 
>critical scrutiny.  Here are some questions:
>
>First, a claim that you reported that seems easy to validate.  You mentioned 
>that the oxygen content of air in some cities is as low as 10%?  Sources?  
>Does anyone have any knowledge concerning this?  Can humans survive in air 
>with oxygen at this level  -- what is the minimum content required?
>

Good question.  A partial pressure of 0.48 atmospheres (approx. 10%) of
oxygen is equivalent to the partial pressure at 19,000 feet altitude.

If this situation existed, the residents would be dropping like flies
from altitude sickness, pulmonary edema, etc.  They would last long
enough to get or die of aids.  

The reference article is a giant quack attack.  It must be a put-on. 

-----------------------

"The most costly of all follies is to believe passionately in the
palpably not true; it is the chief occupation of mankind."

						-Henry Louis Mencken-
From: bsmith@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (ROBERT SMITH)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Need Allergy Control Products
Date: 18 Dec 92 19:51:02 GMT
Reply-To: bsmith@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (ROBERT SMITH)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Stakeholder Relations, NCR Corp in Dayton,OH

Apologies if this is not the appropriate newsgroup, or if this is FAQ ...

I am allergic to DUST (actually, the excrement of those little dust mites). 
The MD advised me to make some environmental changes, such as enclosing the
mattress and box springs in allergy proof covers and spraying the carpet with
some spray (it's not possible for me to remove carpeting).

Does anyone know of a source for allergy control products.  The allergist
provided me with some literature from one company, but the prices are
outrageous.  For example, they charge $126 for an electrostatic furnace
filter.  I just bought one at Builders Sqare for $17; the most expensive one
they sold was about $40.  There must be a more reasonably priced source for
these products.

Thanks in advance for any advice.  E-mail is preferred.
-- 
Bob Smith
E-mail => Robert.D.Smith@daytonoh.ncr.com
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: robert@unlv.edu (Robert Cray)
Subject: Re: Physician's Incomes
Organization: University of Nevada, Las Vegas
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 00:57:46 GMT

In article <24418@alice.att.com>, ark@alice.att.com (Andrew Koenig) says:
>        1. How much of that salary do they get to keep?  In this
>           country, physicians pay through the nose for malpractice
>           insurance; is that true elsewhere?

Do most doctors pay their own malpractice ins.?  I've heard that around
here the competition between hospitals is so great that the hospitals
will pay the doctors malpractice (at least for internists and other
specialists.)  I've also heard of a few orthopods who pay no rent
for their office space which is owned by the hospital, this as an incentive
to do their surgery at that hospital.  Of course this wouldn't help
MDs not associated with a hospital, and Nevada is a little weird when
it comes to medical care, but I'm curious how much typical malpractice
insurance is, and who pays.

					--robert
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: gdavis@griffin.uvm.edu (Gary Davis)
Subject: Re: Is circumizing barbaric?
Organization: University of Vermont -- Division of EMBA Computer Facility
Distribution: default
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 21:03:26 GMT

In <17794@pitt.UUCP> geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks) writes:

>In article <1992Dec7.232642.24175@sequent.com> petel@sequent.com (Pete Lancashire) writes:

>>
>>READ almost any american medical book/guide on the great disease of, 'Oh my
>>god my son does what ?' MASTURBATION !!.... yes my friends, it will cure
>>you son from this dreadful disease...
>>
>>actually, if it wasn't so true, it would be kind of funny, just read what
>>some of the 'experts' had to say and other 'texts', you may have to go to
>>a dusty old used book store. I've got quite a collection from Garage Sales
>>and other places.
>>

>Actually, I've seen this only in old books on morality and such.
>I've never seen it in any of the reputable text books like
>Osler's textbook, etc.  What reputable doctors of the time
>advocated it to prevent masturbation?





 Perhaps that is a sign of the culture? We don't see many medical
texts today dealing with the right to life issue or right to die.
That does not mean these issues didn't exist and influence public
and medical opinion.
For example Ben Spock advocated circumcision in the fifties saying it
made a boy "regular". Now, he regrets the error and received a
humanitarian award from the organization NOCIRC.
Can we compare him with the 19th century physician who as one
respondent suggests, "was hung up with masturbation"?
By the way many parents today are equally worried with the prospect
of their sons masturbating.

MDs tend to do what parents want, right or wrong. The high circ levels
in the USA would tend,I believe,to bare this out.

--
                       Gary E. Davis /WQ1F/
              Dpt. Electrical Engineering and Com Sciences
              University of Vermont @ Burlington
From: king@reasoning.com (Dick King)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: EMF worries: are they silly?
Date: 14 Dec 92 23:48:21 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Reasoning Systems, Inc., Palo Alto, CA

In article <=2f1Hq-9cb@atlantis.psu.edu> jwm3@vivaldi.psu.edu (James Walter Martin) writes:
>Michael Covington writes:
>:In article <+2c1H!v?bb@atlantis.psu.edu> jwm3@vivaldi.psu.edu (James Walter Martin) writes:
>:No.  Although it is still unclear whether they have any effect on the human
>:body, the electromagnetic fields from electrical equipment are quite different
>:from anything naturally present in the environment, because they are 
>:oscillating at a frequency of typically 60 Hz, and have electrical as
>:well as magnetic components.
> 
> if the difference is due to oscillation, wouldn't i then be in the same 
> amount of danger if i spun around in circles with the same frequency?  

A lot more danger.

Spinning at 60 hz, if you barely fit inside a 50 cm cylinder, you get
3422500* cm/sec/sec centrifugal acceleration in some parts of your body.  This
is 3400 G.  There would be nothing left of you but organic goo.


-dk


* (* 25 370 370) [60 hz is 370 radians per second]
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: PKJAMES@UKCC.UKY.EDU
Subject: Re: a question on prozac
    <1992Dec10.005609.3972@nmt.edu>
Organization: University of Kentucky
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 09:14:51 GMT

In article <1992Dec10.005609.3972@nmt.edu>
msnyder@nmt.edu (Mary Snyder) writes:
 
>
>How long do the psychological effects of prozac last after one stops taking it?
>
>        -Rebecca
PAUL JAMES   (PKJAMES@UKCC.UKY.EDU)
 
If you've never felt "normal" as I never did until Prozacm then the effects are
just like anything else guaged.  I feel very good while on it and by the beging
ing of 3 weeks I start to feel like a toad again.  Part of prozacs "work" is th
at flourine molecule that is very hard to pop off.
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 17:58:16 EST
From: <DGS4@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Physician's Incomes
Distribution: usa
 <BzBrD5.D5x@news.cso.uiuc.edu> <1992Dec16.173258.28366@cbfsb.cb.att.com>
 <gdavis.724551414@griffin>

In article <gdavis.724551414@griffin>, gdavis@griffin.uvm.edu (Gary Davis) says:
>
>The paper was attempting to determine why Americans pay so much for
>health care and get either less or same as other countries.
>
>120K is ofcourse,not entirely unreasonable when one considers the long
>and exhaustive training American MDS must persue,but is all this training
>really in the public's interest or can quality be maintained with a
>lower number of years spent in obtaining qualification.
>
>Ofcourse there are so many special interests and vested interests
>tangled with this question,it may never be discussed.
>
>I have always considered lawyers parasistic upon both medical
>practitioners and the general public. I'm curious how much health
>care bills could be reduced by decoupling these vulchers from the system.

Not much.  Malpractice premiums represent only about 15% of total costs
for the average physician, though they are much higher for OBGYN, surgeons,
anesthiologists, etc.  Premiums have been dropping about 10 to 15 percent
per year in recent years with no discernible effect on costs.
Several estimates of the total costs of malpractice, including defensive
medicine put it at 20 to 30 billion.  While it is important to reform
the system because it does a lousy job of deterring negligence, it is
unlikely to result in a big drop in health care costs.

>
>Again.. too many powerful and yes greedy interests here for this subject
>to even see the light of day.
>
>Medicine is not an exact science,nor can it be. MDs are only human
>and those can err. Need the public pay millions in a malpractice
>mess that in reality was nothing more than a patient's unrealistic
>expectation. (well I digress)
>
>But.. 120K is not a bad salary. The president of our U.. makes in this
>range! He is considered to be reasonably compensated!

120K is the average for all physicians.  Several specialties have averages
over 200K and a few have averages over 300K.


Dennis G. Shea, Penn State
<<DISCLAIMER>>
Ain't nobody's bizness but my own. I'll be happy to accept all
the credit for anything I've written.  It's funny, however, how
employers only acknowledge the profitable ideas.
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Occasional "brownouts".
From: RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Ruth Ginzberg)
Date: 14 Dec 92 14:02:17 EDT
Distribution: world
Organization: Philosophy Dept., Wesleyan University
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20In-Reply-To: RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu's message of 11 Dec 92 11:15:01 EDTLines: 35

> In article <2314@snap> paj@uk.co.gec-mrc (Paul Johnson) writes:
> > (stuff omitted)
> >As far as I know there is no history of epilepsy or other mental
> >illness in the family.                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>  ^^^^^^^                                             ^^^^^
In response to which <1992Dec11.111503.518@news.wesleyan.edu> I wrote: 
> This would seem to imply that epilepsy is a mental illness.  Epilepsy is not a
> mental illness, though it is a brain disease (or neurological illness).
<deleted>
> (Ah, that ol' Mind/Brain distinction strikes again...)

Since then I have been in e-mail correspondence with someone who'd hoped to get
me to retract this statement.  I do not agree to retract the statement because
I am not yet convinced that that which is "mental", of or pertaining to the
*mind*, is one-and-the-same with that which is of or pertaining to the *brain*.

However, I DO agree with my correspondent that there is a *POLITICAL* danger in
trying to distinguish sharply between "mental" & "physical" *illness*, because
it allows old patterns of prejudice toward "mental"
illness to remain unchallenged.  I do not agree that the appropriate course of
action is to try to blur the distinction between "brain" events and "mental"
events.  I believe that the proper course of action is to work toward reducing
myth and prejudice about mental illness, and discrimination toward those who
suffer from it.

I suspect that followups ought to go to:
	sci.philosophy.meta	- for discussion of mind/body distinction
	talk.politics.medicine	- for discussion of prejudice re mental illness
				  and the folks who struggle with it
	alt.support		- for folks who suffer from prejudice toward
				  people with mental illness, & need support

------------------------
Ruth Ginzberg <rginzberg@eagle.wesleyan.edu>
Philosophy Department;Wesleyan University;USA
From: laura@TASVAX.NSWSES.NAVY.MIL
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Hismanal and Humibid DM
Date: 16 Dec 92 20:09:16 GMT
Reply-To: laura@TASVAX.NSWSES.NAVY.MIL
Organization: Naval Surface Warfare Center, Port Hueneme Division

Greetings (seasonal and otherwise),

My doctor just prescribed Hismanal (10 mg daily) and Humibid (2 tabs twice 
daily).

I started taking them yesterday.  I took the hismanal just after I woke up, 
and I took the Humibid at 9:30am and 10pm, with a full glass of water.

I had trouble yesterday with having to urinate more frequently and more
urgently (I figured it was the extra water).  Last night I had a little
trouble getting back to sleep after getting up to go to the bathroom.
This morning, I felt like I stayed up all night drinking coffee (reminded
me of my college days).  I got a pretty good night's sleep last night, since
my husband took care of our daughter all night.  My throat is also *very*
dry.  Every time I try to drink water to make my throat feel better, I just
have to go to the bathroom.

I called my doctor's office, and I left a message telling him I felt like
I was up all night drinking coffee, and asking which of the above meds
might be the culprit.  His assistant called me back and told me that
neither one should cause this type of reation, but the hismanal was the
most likely.  She said my body would get used to it.

Add to this a similar reaction a few years ago to Nyquil.  24-36 hours after
my last dose, I felt this same way, but my heart was beating too fast, and 
my pupils were dialated.  My doctor at the time told me to use Triaminic
instead.

Has anyone (esp. doctors) heard of such a reaction?  Any suggestions?
Any personal experiences?

By the way, here is a list of the other medications I am on:
Loestrin Fe 1/20
Vancenase AQ (2 sprays ea. nostril twice daily)
Beclovent (inhale twice, 2-3 times daily)
Ceclor (250mg 3/day for a sinus infection - also started yesterday)
Nizoral creme (I'm not sure if it's absorbed, so I included it)

Thanks for any information,

Laura
laura@tasvax.nswses.navy.mil                      I speak only for myself.
Mom to Maryrose Nadine McGovern - born 8-5-92
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: goshorn@CS.ColoState.EDU (michael goshorn)
Subject: Re: New Migraine Drug???
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 17:05:37 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University

	Sorry to jump in on this discussion but I am looking for info
including patient experience with medication for treatment of cluster
headaches.

	Currently using verapamil & ergotamine - not terribly effective.

goshorn@cs.colostate.edu
:
From: km@ky3b (Ken Mitchum)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Uncontrollable Laughter
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:58:29 GMT
Organization: KY3B-Vax Pittsburgh, PA

In article <1992Dec9.224029.20660@netcom.com> lindae@netcom.com writes:

>Probably not a real "Medical" question, but nonetheless, here it is:
>Has anyone ever had the experience of uncontrollable laughter at
>inappropriate times?

>
>I guess my question is two-fold.  Has anyone ever experienced this and
>if so, how have you managed to get it under control?
>
>(ha,ha,ha,ha, hee,hee,hee,hee....giggle,giggle,giggle... )

1)Usually while reading sci.med.

2)Going out and seeing some patients usually solves it.

 -km
From: turpin@cs.utexas.edu (Russell Turpin)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Non-physician bashing
Date: 19 Dec 1992 12:26:36 -0600
Organization: CS Dept, University of Texas at Austin
NNTP-Posting-Host: im4u.cs.utexas.edu
Summary: Conspiracy implies more intent than this.

-*----
In article <1992Dec18.095951.12166@vms.eurokom.ie> mdebuitlear@vms.eurokom.ie writes:
> But you [Ken Mitchum] also assume that anyone 'unqualified' 
> who 'challenges' you is part of this conspiracy of people
> who 'embrace every quack theory that is out there, and who
> believe that physicians are all part of some gigantic 
> conspiracy to rob everyone blind while killing them as a 
> sidelight.'

Those who embrace quack theories (including most conspiracy
theories) are not themselves a conspiracy; they are merely less
than well educated or lacking in the skills for critical thought
in the area concerned.  A conspiracy implies some level of
coordinated intent and understanding of purpose.  Quack theories
are merely memes that appeal to those who are susceptible.  

I don't think Ken Mitchum was implying a conspiracy among those
who embrace quack theories.

Russell
From: klier@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: <None>
Date: 11 Dec 92 12:50:23 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

Mary Schafer:
> 
>>>> Has anyone gotten rid of a pet because of being allergic to them?  How
>>>> long does it take before you notice substantial relief?

Kay Klier
>>> According to what vets and allergists tell me, more people are allergic
>>> to cats than dogs, but most people with non-severe cat allergies (i.e.,
>>> does not provoke severe asthma or anaphylaxis) can get substantial relief
>>> from washing the cat once a week.  Even going over the cat's coat with a
>>> very wet cloth helps reduce the allergen load. 

Jon Noring writes:
> Anyway, it seems that many (if not all) allergies to cats, are caused by two
> proteins that originate in the saliva.  They are called feline protein A and
> feline protein B.  People can be allergic to either one or both of these
> proteins.
Jon, your allergist and mine must have studied together!  ;-)  A friend 
finds she is allergic to some cats and not to others.  Interestingly,
her allergist is allergic to the cats she does not react to, and does not
react to the cats that cause my friend much misery...
...
> cells every second?  Thank heavens for those little mites that eat our skin
> cells!  :^)  

Personally, no.  I'm not allergic to cats.  I'm very allergic to those
$%^!@ mites! ;-)

...
> Thus, it is most intriguing to breed a cat where the natural levels of
> the feline proteins in the saliva are greatly reduced or eliminated
> entirely (if that is possible).  I'm sure there would be a big market for
> such a "hypoallergenic" cat.  Of course, if I were in charge of the breeding,
> I'd also try to breed out the aloofness and stubborness that *most* cats
> possess.  :^)  Why people get turned on by this "deficiency" in cat
> behavior is beyond me.  double :^)

Many people who are otherwise allergic to cats can tolerate the curly-coated
breeds like Rex, or the nearly hairless Sphynx....  From your remarks on
cat personality "deficiencies", I conclude that you're either a fan of big
ol' slobbery dogs, and/or you've never tried to persuade a horse to do
something... or a terrier... [double ;-)]

Kay Klier  Biology Dept  UNI
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: mdkline@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Mark D. Kline)
Subject: Re: Peter Breggin, _Toxic Psychiatry_ (Q)
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 17:43:14 EST

In article <Bz9B1v.5nn@unx.sas.com> sasghm@theseus.unx.sas.com (Gary Merrill) writes:
>I am surprised at the claim that the disease model is firmly grounded
>for schizophrenia since on the basis of my own readings (yes, I do
>read) it appears to me that this area is one of the shakiest.  True,
>there are a lot of *hopes*.  But compare to the situation in internal
>medicine where one can *independently* discuss symptoms, causes, and

Symptoms, causes, natural histories, etc. can all be *independently* 
discussed in psychiatry.  To assert otherwise is absurd and naive.
There are controversies about the validity of some psychiatric 
diagnoses; but this in itself demonstrates that it is possible to
independently discuss psychiatric disorders. 

Mr. Merrill and other interested netters might consider taking a look
at the current issue of the Archives of General Psychiatry, which presents
several, methodologically very sound studies of drug-naive (that is,
never treated) patients with schizophrenia, describing abnormalities
of brain morphology and function (generally confirming the hypothesis
of "hypofrontality" in schizophrenia).


================================================================= 
mark kline                              mdkline@rodan.acs.syr.edu
suny health science center, syracuse    voice: (315) 422-1050
================ courtesy of syracuse university ================