HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: geirs@cs.hw.ac.uk (Geir Solvang)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: HELMETS
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:27:30 GMT
Organization: Dept of Computing & Electrical Engineering, Heriot-Watt University, Scotland

In article uoVguB1w165w@ziggys.cts.com Ron Lee writes:

>The thing that pisses a lot of us off (and I admit, I'm taking quite a 
>liberty to speak for many whose opinions I haven't gathered) is that IT 
>DIDN'T HAVE TO BE A DOGMATIC "DO IT OR DON'T RIDE AT ALL" type of 
>dictatorial paternalistic attitude which fails to treat motorcyclers as 
>Human Beings with abilities to make such judgements for themselves.

I partially agree with you. Without going into details of that (and risking to 
be called everything from faschist to mr. wise guy) I just repeat myself:
>If you can't take care of yourself, perhaps you don't deserve others to do it
>for you!

Geir

| Geir Solvang
| Email: geirs@cee.hw.ac.uk
From: joe@rider.cactus.org (Joe Senner)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: ZX-11 front brake.
Date: 20 Nov 92 04:59:24 GMT
Reply-To: joe@rider.cactus.org
Distribution: world
Organization: NOT

cantrell@seqp4.sequoia.com (Paul Cantrell) writes:
]Randy sounds pretty surprised, and although I have a ZX-10 instead of an -11,
]I'm also a little surprised. I would think that our brakes are pretty similar,
]and the front brake on my -10 is very capable. It has enough braking power to
]lock the front wheel without incredible effort, but enough feel so I can avoid
]locking. No squishiness at all.
]Can you be more specific about what needs to be improved? In what way was the
]CBR900RR superior? Are you sure you're talking brakes, not tires?

if the 900RR's brakes are even close to what the goof2's brakes are like
then yes, the 900RR's brakes are FAR superior. compared to the ZX-11 the goof2
has much more stopping power, better feedback to the lever, and this is for
both front and (especially) the rear. the weight difference no doubt accounts
for the stopping power difference, but the feel of the brakes at the levers
on the honda can't be matched by the kawasaki. pressure changes at the lever
on the honda result in much more positive/precise changes at the calipers.

many times when grabbing a handful of brake on the wife's goof2 I said
to myself, "geez, I wish my ZX-11 had brakes like this".

(and yes randy, this applies to the stock pads and not the EBC's).

--
Joe Senner                                                 joe@rider.cactus.org

    'When I asked Unix to make the witches burn I got:
         mcad.dunham-frodo[ 10 ]%make witches\ burn
         Make:  Don't know how to make witches burn.  Stop.
     Ergo, it must be the wizards.' -- Jerry Dunham
From: marrevola@iris-dcp.es
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: fucking BDI motorcycle drivers
Date: 17 Nov 92 14:59:50 +0100
Organization: REDIRIS, Red Nacional de I+D

In article <1992Nov17.003307.22269@microunity.com>, ericm@microunity.com (Eric Murray) writes:
> In article <1e9bk3INN8tn@roche.csl.sri.com> mhunt@csl.sri.com (Mike Hunt) writes:
>>
>>I have a method that drives tailgaters nuts, but is not

Who is nuts, you or the tailgater?

> 
> If you really must annoy them before you use your superior
> hp/weight ratio to escape, adjust your back brake's brakelight
> switch so that it turns on the brake light with just a slight
> movement of the lever before the brake comes on.  Then use it
> to turn on the brake light and make them THINK you're slowing down
> without actually putting yourself in danger.
>  

I felt like to do this things many times, and when I was younger I did it, but
Don't you think that you are playing with fire? I just ignore tailgaters (it is
not allways easy).

manolo@taf.fundesco.es
ZX-11
DR-600-S
DoD #1033
From: spencer@hailwood.asd.sgi.com (Paul Spencer)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: best tires for wet
Date: 19 Nov 1992 19:39:21 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: hailwood.asd.sgi.com
Keywords: street vs dp

steve@presto.ig.com (Steve Barnhouse) says:
> 
> Which tire is best for wet slippery paved roads?

Metzeler is the best rain tire maker, by far. 

> I'm thinking of putting a
> Metzler ME 88 on the rear and leaving the Pirelli dp tire on the
> front.

Don't worry about rear traction; the front is your big concern. Losing the
back end is exciting; losing the front end hurts.

I wouldn't mix DP and street tires, and I know little about their traction
on pavement relative to a street tire; but a ME33/ME55 or ME33/ME88 com-
bination works VERY well in the wet.

....paul

-- 
Paul Spencer                 Silicon Graphics Advanced Graphics Division
spencer@sgi.com                                Mountain View, California
Xref: sparky rec.motorcycles:40003 ba.motorcycles:917
From: aas7@po.CWRU.Edu (Andrew A. Spencer)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles,ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: WHAT WAS IT?
Date: 21 Nov 1992 23:51:48 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: aas7@po.CWRU.Edu (Andrew A. Spencer)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc5.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, lestat@wixer.cactus.org (Lyle J. Mackey) says:

>In article <1dpv8sINNfhm@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> aas7@po.CWRU.Edu (Andrew A. Spencer) writes:
>>paint job..looke somewhat akin to the yamaha maxim(is that right?..
>>the one with the ram-air scoop on the side..and a big, powerful
>>four?)..at any rate..as i got closer(didn't have my glasses on :-)
>
>The big, powerful four with the ram-air scoop is the Yamaha V-Max.

yeah..that ol' experience lack i mentioned....


>
>>i saw that it was driven by a large belt, on the left side(from the rear)
>>of the wheel...i thought this odd..as most of them(i thought) were driven
>>on the right of the wheel..at any rate..i thought "harley of some sort"
>
>Most drive systems are on the left side of the rear wheel.
once again...oh well..dunno where i dreamed up that this was unusual, as i
began to notice that they are, in fact, quite common..oh well..



>
>> <description of ~600cc single deleted>
>
>Suzuki Savage, belt-driven 600 single, marketed as an "entry-level" cruiser.
>Relatively inexpensive, commercial failure, only made for a couple of years.

thanx
DREW
-- 
??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
?????????????????????????????????-----whatever!
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: fist@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Richard Pierson)
Subject: Re: Rainsuit Recommendations -- Belstaff suits
Reply-To: fist@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Richard Pierson)
Organization: Bell Communications Research (Bellcore)
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 16:21:26 GMT

In article <BxxqAv.5x2@SSD.intel.com>, earlb@ssd.intel.com (Earl
Brabandt) writes:
|> Could anyone tell me where I can get a waxed cotton Belstaff suit? 
|> At
|> least I think that's what they were called.  Yamaha imported them 
|> years ago, but they've stopped.  I may need to order one from the
|> U.K.  
|> Possibly some netters in the U.K. might suggest a business contact 
|> that carries the suit?
|
Barbour international markets them under their own name.
I know, I have one in black and it is nice, plenty of
pockets and rolls up nice and small if the liner is not
in. It is English and as usual they have it backwards
as far as the zipper goes. But at least it does "zip"
from the bottom.
-- 
-- 
##########################################################
There are only two types of ships in the NAVY; SUBMARINES 
                 and TARGETS !!!
#1/XS1100LH	#2/10/10/92
Richard Pierson E06584 vnet: [908] 699-6063
Internet: fist@iscp.bellcore.com,|| UUNET:uunet!bcr!fist  
#include <std.disclaimer> My opinions are my own!!!
I Don't shop in malls, I BUY my jeans, jackets and ammo
in the same store.
From: ryang@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu (Robert H. Yang)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Saturday night COPS on FOX
Date: 16 Nov 92 23:09:30 -0500
Reply-To: ryang@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Organization:  

> In article 9788@wixer.cactus.org, lestat@wixer.cactus.org (Lyle J. Mackey) writes:
>
>Motorcycling is dangerous, it's a fact, 
  1.  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^      2. ^^^^^^


	1. So is taking a shower.

	2. Is this a "fact" or an "opinion" ?     :-)

Rob
--
Rob Yang (Pittsburgh, PA, U.S.A) RYANG@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU
'92 CBR600F2 (Hon) "It hisses on snakes."   AMA 642916 DoD 0593 FSSNOC 1721
'79 XT500 (The Bitch)        '90 Plymouth Laser RS (Sweetie)
                     '87 KDX200 (Name That Bike)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: markk@tcs.com (Mark Kromer)
Subject: Re: What would you ride on a long distance trip?
Originator: markk@sparcplug
Reply-To: markk@tcs.com (Mark Kromer)
Organization: Teknekron Communications Inc.
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 02:03:07 GMT

In article <Bxw183.92L@news.iastate.edu>, tomes@iastate () writes:

>BTW, for those about to flame me for riding a pig, that 'pig'
>can easily do the DOT test for the displacement range two sizes smaller, and
>seems to have no problem keeping up with the local twistie-loving crowd.
>What non'Wing riders don't seem to understand is that the flat four and
>transmission are within a foot and a half of the ground.  Where is the CG
>of their sportbike's engine/trans?  Angular momentum is the primary
>determinant of handling,  about the pivots described by the tire contact
>patches.

At turn in, the motorcycle rotates about the cg not the contact
patches.  Re: countersteering.  Low polar moment in the transverse
plane (and in the longitudinal plane but for different reasons) is the
key, not low cg.  Keep the mass concentrated as close to the cg as
possible.

Winter's approaching, time for the "how does a motorcycle turn" flame
fest again.

--
)V(ark)<               markk@tcs.com                   DoD #400
1988 FZR400           1985 ZX900 Ninja              1977 RD400D
            TCSI Berkeley, CA USA  (510) 649-3781
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: svoboda@rtsg.mot.com (David Svoboda)
Subject: Cage crash
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 14:53:18 GMT

Last night, 12:30 am or so.  I was driving a cage in the rain, coming 
home from a happy movie.  Traffic was light on Dundee Road, a four-lane-
plus-raised-center-turn-lane thoroughfare a mile from my home.  There was
one vehicle, a Bronco or similar by the taillights ahead of me by about 40 
yards.  Looking ahead, as biking has trained me to do, I spotted what I 
thought was the headlights of a car sliding on the wet pavement oncoming, 
quite some distance away.  Well, as soon as I saw the headlights bounce up 
the curb and back, weaving and sliding SERIOUSLY, I braked, spotted a 
pizza-place parking lot to my right, and escaped into it, hoping that the 
drunk driver wouldn't follow me in.  He didn't.  Instead, he creamed 
head-on into the Bronco that was ahead of me on the road.  I got out of 
the car to go help, but as I walked up, I noticed that the car was a Fiero, 
and was BADLY twisted and crunched, and the driver wasn't moving.  I sprinted
back to the Pizza Place to scream for them to call 911.  I ran back to the
vehicles.  Someone was talking to the woman in the Bronco, who had blood
all over her face.  She knew her name, but was in shock.  The Fiero's door
was torn off, and I could see the guy looked pretty twisted, especially
his neck, and his face looked pretty pushed in.  I decided he was better 
off where he was, to wait for the ambulance.

I directed traffic until the emergency vehicles arrived a few minutes
later.  They packed the lady in the Bronco off in an ambulance, and 
just put a sheet over the guy in the Fiero.

I think that the only difference between me and the lady in the Bronco
was that I was looking further ahead, and looked for an out when faced
with an emergency.  I think she froze when presented with a fast situation.
Looking at the scene from her perspective, and knowing how long she had to
react, I think she could have made it over the curb onto the grass on
the right side of the road, if she'd thought of it.  I thank my motorcycle 
experience for being able to sit here and type this right now.  I feel
horrible that I wasn't able to help the guy.

Dave Svoboda (svoboda@void.rtsg.mot.com)    | "I just can't take
90 Concours 1000 (Mmmmmmmmmm!)              |  this weird shit
84 RZ 350 (Ring Ding) (Woops!)              |  before breakfast!"
AMA 583905  DoD #0330  COG 939  (Chicago)   |   -- Evo Woman
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: cjackson@adobe.com (Curtis Jackson)
Subject: Re: Riding on ice (Was: Re: Long winter's nap) 
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated, Mountain View
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 20:33:23 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.151159.6347@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> jimbes@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (james.bessette) writes:
}Probably the most dangerous sitiuation I faced (that didn't consist of haveing
}to dodge another vehicle) is when I rode on ice.  

I don't understand. Ice? On the road? Did a PartyTime Ice Co. truck crash
or something?

This is almost as stupid as the new little neighbor boy who came over
yesterday while I was checking out my bike and asked me if it snowed
here in San Jose. Hey, snow and ice only happen in places that we visit
to snow ski, and in places where ignorant Yankees live. And you can't
fault them for it -- they just aren't smart enough to move to where
it's warm.

Still waiting to use my "winter" gloves (those are the ones that actually
cover the whole fingers; even the fingertips!). It's only mid-November,
folks, get a clue!

This has been your official San Jose DoD FuckHead Report,
-- 
Curtis Jackson	  '91 Black Lab "Studley Doright"   '92 Collie/Golden "George"
cjackson@mv.us.adobe.com	USPA #A-10080 (lapsed)	DoD #721 '81 Maxim 650
  "They that can give up an essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
   safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin (1759)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles

In rec.motorcycles, rtaraz@bigwpi.WPI.EDU (Ramin Taraz) writes:

    >>>>> On 16 Nov 92 20:48:57 GMT, labrg@emory.edu (Ryan Montieth Gill) said:

           Anybody out there ever
    labrg> know anyone to die in an auto accident?  Did you ever consider
    labrg> abondoning the automobile as a transportation source?  Just a
    labrg> thought....


*   its different though, 
*   if you get into a car accident you might come out unharmed, but on a
*   bike you are gonna be injured,

Bullsh*t.  I've had two accidents on motorcycles.  Once I went off the 
road, off an embankment, and into a mud puddle.  The other time I had
a car turn into me (not in front of me - INTO me).  I didn't get so
much as a bruise either time.  (I did have to hammer the footpeg back
into shape the second time-motocross boots are great!).

I know of lots and lots of motorcycle accidents where the rider wasn't
injured.

I've had to take a week off from work twice as a result of bicycle 
accidents,  and had surgery once from a bicycle overuse injury, but 
that doesn't seem to be as contriversial as a motorcycle.

I liked the time when I went into work on crutches after a bicycle
crash.  As I passed by my secretary's desk she asked what happened.
"I fell off my bike"
"You should get rid of your motorcycle-they're dangerous"
"I was riding my bicycle"
"You should have been wearing a helmet"
"I was wearing a helmet - I hurt my leg!"

Frank Ball   1UR-M          frankb@hpsad.sad.hp.com
Hewlett Packard             (707) 794-4168 work, (707) 538-3693 home
1212 Valley House Drive     (707) 794-3844 fax, IT175, XT350, Seca 750
Rohnert Park CA 94928-4999  KC6WUG, LAW, AMA, Dod #7566, I'm the NRA.
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: serafin@epcot.spdc.ti.com (Mike Serafin)
Subject: Re: Saturday night COPS on FOX
Organization: TI Semiconductor Process and Design Center
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 22:22:35 GMT

In article <1434@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu> labrg@emory.edu (Ryan Montieth Gill) writes:
>rtaraz@bigwpi.WPI.EDU (Ramin Taraz) writes:
>: I was just watching cops on fox and they had a report on an accident
>: 
>: I might want to stop riding my bike.  I have always though about the
>: possibility of getting into an accident and losing some body parts,
>: but it is different when you see it happen!
>: 
>: anyway, I just thought you might be interested in hearing about this.
>: I was shaken up a little.
>: 
>	Anybody out there ever know anyone to die in an auto accident?
>Did you ever consider abondoning the automobile as a transportation
>source?  Just a thought....
>

This type of knee-jerk reaction has always puzzled me about any other mode of
transportation than cars.  My theory is that car accidents have become so
commonplace that people have become desensitized to them.  Things such as
aircraft and motorcycle accidents tend to be sensationalized a bit more in the
press.  Around Dallas, everytime a plane even thinks about crashing it makes
news. Motorcycle accidents tend to make news frequently, and always with a
byline that somehow leads the viewer/reader believe the motorcyclist  was
somehow at fault even though he/she may not have been.  Unless the car accident
killed 15 people and tied up traffic for 3 days it usually doesn't make the
news.
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: jlevine@rd.hydro.on.ca (Jody Levine)
Subject: Re: Squash or slide?
Organization: Ontario Hydro - Research Division
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 92 17:29:30 GMT

What I want to know is, how many people have actually managed to hit the kill
switch during a crash? In my low-speed low-side I wound up standing over the
bike (in recently scratched leathers) still holding the clutch lever, and
the engine was still running! It would have been a pain to get it into neutral
so I just shut it off.

I've        bike                      like       | Jody Levine  DoD #275 kV
     got a       you can        if you      -PF  | Jody.P.Levine@hydro.on.ca
                         ride it                 | Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: sheppamj@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Matthew Sheppard)
Subject: VIRTUAL REALITY machines
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 20:52:46 GMT

Well, the virtual reality people came to clarkson this week and I went
to a nearby school (Suny-Canton) to hear the lecture one of the people
gives every once in a while.

It was a well prepared speach and in it he discussed the history of
virtual reality.  One of the first virtual reality machines, designed in
the 60's was a MOTORCYCLE simulator.  It included a steroscopic movie
display and vibrations to simulate the motor speed.  Supposidly in part
of the demonstration the bike used for the filming goes by a pile of
burning leaves and somehow the device simulates this smell.

Anyone heard this before?  Sounds like something I'd like to go see if
it's still operational.  Perhaps the AMA musemu should consider aquiring
such a device.

Tried to ride,
	almost died,
Left the bitch
	on her side.
Picked her up,
	I couldn't hide
My baby was scrathced
	I coulda cried


--
| Matthew Sheppard  CLARKSON UNIVERSITY  sheppamj@sun.soe.clarkson.edu |
| I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.ANoN |
| I don't want a pickle. DoD#477 TEP#477 RIDE FREE (8^]..etcetera..    |
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: paulb@harley.tti.com (Paul Blumstein)
Subject: Re: ABATE Voter's Guide
Organization: Black Belt Motorcyclists Association
Distribution: ca
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 18:02:11 GMT

In article <1992Nov13.225425.7667@c3.PLA.CA.US> niall@c3.PLA.CA.US (Neal Bedard) writes:
+In article <1992Nov12.030034.16992@ttinews.tti.com> paulb@harley.tti.com (Paul Blumstein) writes:
+>Hi there!
+>
+>Remember the ABATE voter's guide that I published here a while ago.
+>You may have also seen it from other sources.  For example, the
+>AMA mailed it to all their CA members.
+
+Yes, I saw it - it seemed to be heavily loaded with Republicans. Bleagh.

The guide was not meant to be partisan in any direction.  It was designed
to differentiate the pro-motorcycle candidates from the rest.  If you
prefere Democrats and your favorite candidate is not listed, it is in
your interest to make an appointment to talk to him or her and explain
why motorcyclists rights are important.  Or would you rather be
legislated off ogf your scoot?

+>Anywho 2 out of 3 of the recommended candidates won.
+
+"Like the rooster taking credit for the sunrise..."

ABATE did not take credit for it.  It was a statement of fact.
The importance is given in my next statement (below).
+
+>That means a more friendly Sacramento for all of the motocyclists.

See?

+Excepting the governor, of course. His chariot swing low soon...

The Guv was not up for re-election.

I am about to make a statement.  (Everyone is probably hitting "N" now :-).

It may produce controversy, it is not meant to.  It does seem ironic 
to a lot of us.
o
Freedom of choice.  A person can do what they want as long as it
does not hurt their neighbor.  From that, one would think that
the same people who are pro choice on abortion would be anti-helmet law
and vice versa.  It is not so... at least among politicians.
More Democrats than Republicans are pro-choice when it comes
to abortions, but not helmets.  More Republicans than Democrats
are pro-choice when it comes to helmets, but not abortions.
Go figure.
____________________________________________________________________________
Sorry, but I sent my .sig file out for a cleaning, so I have
nothing clever to say today.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Paul Blumstein, paulb@harley.tti.com, DoD #36, ABATE, AMA, HOG, KD6LAA
            Transaction Technology, Inc., Santa Monica, CA
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
From: rescorla@rtnmr.chem.yale.edu (Eric Rescorla)
Subject: Re: HELMETS
Organization: Rescorla for himself.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 02:26:38 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.001059.7670@megatek.com> randy@megatek.com writes:
>be part of the traffic, I always wear a helmet.  However, I *know*, from
>riding for ten years with and without helmets, that your awareness of your
>surroundings at low speeds is greatly increased *without* a helmet.
Hmm...I always find this sort of "I know" argument to be suspicious.
People "know" a lot of things that are flat out false when empirically
tested. Have you considered the possibility that you just think that
your awareness of your surroundings is greatly enhanced? Have you
tried generating a sample suite of external things to notice and
testing this theory? If not, I suggest that you really don't have
enough data to make such a sweeping claim--even for yourself.
-Ekr




-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Rescorla, DoD#431 (Nighthawk S)              rescorla@rtnmr.chem.yale.edu
Former chemist now CM400 mechanic                 ekr@eitech.com(preferred)
                "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss."
From: robert.laszko@filebank.cts.com (Robert Laszko) 
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: HEIN GERICKE GEAR
Date: 21 Nov 92 07:49:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The File Bank BBS - Fallbrook, CA  619-728-4318
Reply-To: robert.laszko@filebank.cts.com (Robert Laszko) 

Does anyone have any comments on Hein Gericke's Colorado jacket? I tried
one on yesterday & loved it. It has just about everything I'm looking
for in a riding jacket, except a Mandarin collar & body armor - been
looking for a new jacket for over a year & this one's the closest I've
found to 'perfect'.

Bob
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: fucking BDI motorcycle drivers
From: dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams) 
Date: 19 Nov 92 11:36:00 GMT
Reply-To: dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams) 
Distribution: world
Organization: The Courts of Chaos * 501-985-0059 * Public Access Usenet


-> ObMoto: To all .edu-breaths contemplating a Seca II, be warned that
-> this bike has revealed its cold-blooded nature to me.  It rides well
-> when it's fully warmed, but bogs badly from a stop until then ....
-> and we're not talking 30-second warmup, either.  It even sags after
-> upshifting, until it realizes I'm serious.  Damn Jap-crap -- I should
-> have bought a Harley.

 Harley-Davidson wrote the book on cold-blooded starting.  After they
dropped the accelerator pump on some models, cold running became a real
bitch.  SNORT! POP!  BANG!
                                           
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles