HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: umli0052@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Sheng Li)
Subject: Re: Yzerman's worth and media influence (Re: Hot Pens Trade Rumor)
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 15:41:01 GMT

In <+bW=yg-@engin.umich.edu> gautam@engin.umich.edu (Gautam Singh Grover ) writes:

>In article <1h41f2INNket@access.usask.ca> gerry@skatter.usask.ca writes:

>Which brings me to another question - how is Yzerman regarded as compared
>to, say, people like Lafontaine, Pierre Turgeon, Roenick (who, in my opinion,
>is another grossly underrated player) or Mats Sundin? 

Yzerman for quite of long time and probably still do in many people's mind as the number three player in the league, right after Gretzky and Lemieux.  Since 
Now Detroit aquired talented players like Federov, he has seen less ice time and consequently lower numbers.  However, he is still in the top 10 for sure.  As to compared with the above player, I think those players except Sundin has all developed to be franchise players like Yzerman's quality.  Sundin is very talented mind you.  It's just that this is the first year where he posted some great number in NHL.  His production probably has a lot to do with Sakic's efforts as well.  If he can keep doing in for



 at least two season, then I think he can emerge in the class of *star franchise players*.

>People like Sundin and Nolan do not get enough credit just because they 
>play in a remote outpost of the NHL. Players like Jagr, on the other hand,
>get exaggerated media coverage just because they play for a champion 
>team, and, of course, we know how many "fans" champion teams can suddenly 
>developed. Jagr may be good, but comparing him to Yzerman is, as you 
>say, laughable. 

I totally agree with you on this point.  All those trade rumors are so ridiculous, just like most trade rumor.  They are just fantasies of some * hockey fan*.
I bet if Quebec wins the cup this year, names like Sundin and Nolan will become the talk of the league too.  Personally, I think Jagr is grossly over-rated.  Did you ever notice that he only posts good numbers when he plays with Mario? and if he is not on the Francis' line, he probably won't be noticed by the media at all.
-- 
     ----------------------------------------------------------
    / umli0052@ccu.umanitoba.ca | "It's a bird, it's a plane, /
   /                            |  it's Saint Patrick."      /
  /    #li0052@ccm.umanitoba.ca |                           /
From: hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: CIS (Soviet) Hockey League. Table Dec 20.
Date: 29 Dec 92 14:33:16 GMT
Organization: Nokia Telecommunications.

In article <AA-l_FhGc7@skorpion.lt.su>, root@skorpion.lt.su (Almantas Lauzadis) writes:
> You have good information about MHL LIGA.
> This is a Standing Table before Xmas.
> 
> December 20
> 
>             WEST
>  1 Kr. Sovetov Moscow           30  19  4  7   84 - 57   42
>  2 Dinamo Moscow                30  17  7  6   99 - 61   41
>  3 Riga Stars                   30  16  4 10  107 - 84   36
>  4 SKA St. Peterburg            30  16  3 11   83 - 80   35
>  5 Sokol-Eskulap Kiev           30  15  4 11  107 - 86   34
>  6 Spartak Moscow               30  15  4 11   89 - 80   34
>  7 Himik Voskresensk            30  13  6 11   83 - 92   32
> _8 Torpedo Yaroslavl            30  12  5 13   80 - 80   29
>  9 Metallurg Cherepovez         30  13  2 15   82 - 94   28
> 10 Dinamo Minsk                 30   6  8 16   64 - 84   20
> 11 Kristall Saratov             30   6  5 19   64 - 114  17
> 12 CSKA Moscow                  30   3  6 21   59 - 99   12
  UUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

  Is this really true or do my eyes lie to me !! Anyway, I saw
  them yesterday on TV playing against Team Canada. That was part
  of the Spengler Cup, I think. I noticed that this CSKA Moscow
  consists of very young players, many of them are 17-20 years old.
  And there are some elsewhere championship games for juniors going on!

  But - surprise: I saw them beating Canada 5:3 !!! Definitely there
  are still lots of talented youngsters in ... you know those countries
  east and south of us: Russia etc. 

  BTW the goalie of CSKA (Mikhailovsky sp??) was great. Some years ago
  we used to say that the russian goalies are not at the level of the
  other team (don't think of Tretjak), but now the times are different. 

> -------
>    Almantas Lauzadis
>    Kranto 28, Panevezys 5319, Lithuania
>    root@skorpion.lt.su
> -------
> 

/Hannu
From: jkung@acs.ucalgary.ca (Jimmy Kung)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: NHLPA Hockey 93 - Evaluation
Date: 29 Dec 1992 03:35:12 -0600
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

In article <1992Dec29.054734.20177@netcom.com> you write:

[...stuff deleted...]

>Conclusion
>~~~~~~~~~~
>All in all, it's a fun game.  I do have some major gripes with it
>but it sure beats the hell out of Wayne Gretzky Hockey I & II on
>the PC.  I would be interested in a comparison between WGH3 and
>NHLPA.  I believe in the entertainment value of the game over
>realism but realism is important too.

I've pretty much had it out with everyone on rec.games.video, so
I won't rehash it here, but I pretty much thought NHLPA '93 (and
all console hockey games) are totally inferior to WGH 3 and the
League Simulator II.  For the exact reasons you stated above,
that realism is important.  Once you get beyond the fun of
making bonecrushing checks, and trying to get into fights, you
need to get into realism.  (Although 2 player mode in NHLPA '93
is great fun as well)  In terms of realism, I've felt that only
WGH3 provides a realistic feel of real hockey.  In terms of
skating, passing, and playmaking, it is superior.  In NHLPA '93,
you rarely get the opportunity to make PLAYS, rather than just
running around to shoot the puck.  (and you don't need to pass to
score anyhow)  In really enjoy working the powerplay around, with
the ability to change my formations, and set up a good shot.  On
the other side, I love being able to play the box when killing a
penalty, and either steal the puck on a stab, or get busted and
give them a great scoring chance.

In terms of a league function and statistics, the League
Simulator II again totally destroys all console games, and I
don't think console programmers will ever approach that level.
Having to juggle a team with a few injuries, making trades to
shore up a weak spot, and playing the grind of 80 (although it's
84 now) games is what hockey is all about.

Anyhoo...  Remember, that's just IMHO, and I'm biased because I
was born in a small town in Ontario where hockey was the only
thing to do during the winter (other than watching hockey of
course!)  Most people will probably enjoy the certain aspects of
NHLPA '93 (and others) better than I do.

jkung@acs.ucalgary.ca      |  "It's better than bad,it's good!"
                           |             - Log(tm) by Blammo!
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Senators schedule and ticket info WANTED!
Organization: Memorial University. St.John's Nfld, Canada
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 18:12:07 GMT

Could someone send me the Ottawa Senators' home schedule for the month
of March?  I'd really appreciate it.
 
And how difficult is it to get tickets?  From scalpers or otherwise?
 
Stephen Legge
 
Organization: H&SS Dean's Office, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 10:15:04 -0500 
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: No Penguin reports


I didn't see the Pens/Flyers game (taped it but haven't watched it yet)
and only bits and pieces of the Pens/Sabres game so I can't report on 'em.
I don't even know their final scores.  Mea culpa.

Too many sugar plums dancing in my head, I guess...

Mom.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: John MacLean ??
Organization: University of Toronto Chemistry Department
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 19:00:23 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.135438.10140@nynexst.com> fischman@nynexst.com writes:
>
>MAC hasn't been on a steady line with *anyone*.  Neither has anyone else on the Devs.
>I think (IMHO) its a major problem with Brooks.  He juggles lines just about *every*
>game.  Johnny Macs knee is fine - its his timing thats off.  He was offered a trip
>to Utica to work on his timing in a low pressure environment, but he vetoed the
>request. He's been complaining a little in the media about how there isn't *anyone*
>on the team that he's played on a line with in the past.  He say's hes not making
>excuses, but he is.  
>

Why blame Brooks...he has been given a team without centers...
blame the GM.

Bowman and Keenan are the supreme line-jugglers of all time.

Gerald
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: cliffr@pyuxf.uucp (25347-roberts)
Subject: Devils tickets for sale
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
  
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 13:46:01 GMT

I'm try to sell one last game that I can't make.  It's NJ Devils vs
NY Islanders on Saturday, January 16th.

The seats are dead on the blue line and nice and close to the ice.
I'm willing to sell them at a loss.  Two seats plus the parking pass
for $45.00.  

email me if interested: cliffr@pyuxf.cc.bellcore.com


cliff
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: WJHC: Canada-Sweden
Date: 29 Dec 92 12:59:03 GMT
Organization: University of Toronto Chemistry Department

In article <1992Dec29.083134.3241@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
>>> I had been looking forward to watch "the next Lemieux", Alexandre Daigle,
>>> but he didn't show much skills in this game, at least not any positive
>>> skills because halfway through the game, Daigle made an ugly cross check
>>> straight in the face/neck of Kenny Jonsson. A major penalty was called and
>>> Daigle was gone for the game.
>>
>>I noticed you neglect to mention that Markus Naslund received a similar
>>penalty for a wicked slash to Tyler Wright's neck in the 3rd period...
>>
>
> Markus Naslund took the blame for the loss after that stupid slash. It 
> was only his third game penalty ever. Naslund said he intended a slash,
> that's a common part of the game being one man down, but no way did he
> mean to slash that high... it was accidental.
>

Yes...we all know...
...Naeslund's slash was accidental...Daigle's was intentional! -)

>>>
>>> Three stars (personal opinion):
>>> 1 - Peter Forsberg
>>
>>Not only for his outstanding play, but for the great motivational speech
>>to the Canadian team about how they couldn't skate and how easy they
>>would be for Sweden to beat. 
>>
>
> I strongly doubt he ever said that, he is absolutely not the type that
> makes cocky statements. Besides, his friend Tyler Wright was over in Sweden
> to visit him this summer... I don't think that's the kind of things you
> say to your friends.
>

Forsberg was quoted as saying before the game
"They (the Canadians) are not so good.  We are going to beat them.  We
are a much better team.  We are better skaters.  They play tough but it
is a bigger ice surface, and they're going to have some problems with
that.  They maybe are not so tough, but we better be careful to not get
hurt in a game like this."

From an article by Bob McKenzie in the Toronto Star.

Gerald
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: NHL in the Olympics (was: WJHC: Practice Game, Sweden-Canada)
Organization: University of Toronto Chemistry Department
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 23:00:53 GMT

In article <1hl9coINN83o@cs.tut.fi> ma71780@cs.tut.fi (Asumaa Mika Tapani) writes:
>
>Canadian Olympic teams have been a disaster.  Canada has finished
>in top three once since 1980.  Even United States have won Olympic Gold
>during that time.  It proves that much better Canadian Olympic teams 
>are needed to make Olympic Games more than a joke.
>

1980 was our first year back...and we got stuck a strong pool...so
we ended up fifth or sixth.  We were unlucky 4th's in 84 and 88, and
2nd in 1992...which means in the last three Olympics, our team has
essentially as good results as anyone except the Soviet Union/Russia...
...and our finishes have been getting progressively better.    

The national team program in Canada is an extremely successful program...
it would be a tragedy to see it sacrificed for an NHL publicity stunt.

Gerald
From: gerry@skatter.usask.ca
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Question about salaries?
Date: 22 Dec 1992 08:41:10 GMT
Organization: University of Saskatchewan
NNTP-Posting-Host: skatter.usask.ca

From article <1992Dec21.105315.1@husky1.stmarys.ca>, by gen5061@husky1.stmarys.ca:
> -- 
> Question:
> 	When a player has a contract with an NHL team and midseason gets
> sent down to the minors, what happens to their salary, anything?

It depends on whether or not the player has a one way contract, if he does
he gets paid the same regardless of where he plays(see Juneau,Joe of Boston
for such a phenomenon and the difficulty obtaining such a contract) otherwise
he will receive less. How much less I can't say, again it probably depends
on the contract although I would think it would usually be a significant
decrease.

As for Dionne I highly doubt he has a one way contract considering he was
really never heard about until he went hog wild in his call up last season.
Thus I think being demoted should be enough of a kick in the head to hopefully
get him going.
--
Gerry Gryschuk       "If it can't be expressed in figures, it is not science;
gerry@sask.usask.ca   it is opinion"
Go Habs!!!	      "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity"
			 - Lazarus Long(R.A.Heinlein)  
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: jzuena@ferrari.nmc.ed.ray.com (John Zuena)
Subject: Re: league simulators
Organization: Equipment Division, Raytheon Company
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 17:24:24 GMT

In article <BzMxyJ.7w2@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umward10@news.cc.umanitoba.ca (Derek Ward) writes:
>"adam thompson" (adam.thompson@canrem.com) wrote:
>: I was wondering if anyone might be able to help me find a hockey league
>: simulator for the IBM.  I don't just want a stats database for a pool,
>: but something that actually simulates game results, allows trades, etc.
>: almost identical to the actual NHL.  I've seen one for the Amiga, but I
>: can't find one for the IBM.  Could someone help me out?  Thanks alot.
>: 
>  Superstar Ice Hockey isn't around for the PC?  That's odd.  Wayne
>Gretzky Hockey is probably the closest thing that you're looking for,
>although it doesn't allow "trading".
>
>--
>_   ///         Computer Science                    "However, everyday, I'm
>\\ ///	        University of Manitoba, CANADA!     dumping the body..."
> \X//  AMIGA!   umward10@ccu.umanitoba.ca           

Well, Wayne Gretzky Hocky has an add-on called The Hockey League Simulator 
(actually it is a standalone program which interfaces with WGH) that allows
you to play both GM and coach of any team.  You can make trades (even with
computer controlled players) and decide which 20 players to dress for a game.
A version 2.0 is coming out which works with WGH 3, so you may want to wait.
The version 1.0 is real bad about trades with the computer (you can give one
half decent player and 2 scrubs from your minor league affiliate and get the
likes of a Messier, Yserman, or Lemieux... kind of makes it easy to beat the
computer)

- John Z.
From: larry@spuds.solbourne.COM (Larry Keryc)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Devils indemnity -- Still Crazy After All These Years
Date: 31 Dec 92 14:07:29 GMT
Organization: Solbourne Computer Inc - NYC Metro
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Gary L Dare (gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu) wrote:
: 
: Last Wednesday's NYT Sports had an article about the territorial
: compensation that the Devils must still continue to pay to both the
: Rangers and the Islanders after ten years in this area ...  it comes


Gary, I believe the article stated that the Flyers are still getting
money from the Devils too.  Although it is a much smaller amount than
what the Rangers and Islanders receive.

The article also pointed out the Devils lack a "personality".  Fans are
not relating to the many Europeans on their roster.  The team lacks
players who the fans can identify with.  Apologies again to Paul Simon,
but where have you gone Kirk Muller and Pat Verbeek???

Lamorillo tried to get some identity to the team by hiring Brooks.  With
the Devils struggling, Lamorillo was asked if he was pleased with job
that Herb Brooks is doing.  He said Brooks is doing a great job.  At the
time the question was asked, Tommy McVee had a better record at the same
point in the season last year.  Hmmm...

The Devils have done nothing to build on the momentum of the 7 game
playoff series with the Rangers.  Their 19k+ building draws 9-12k for 
their home games.  Shame...

See ya!

Larry
-- 
Larry Keryc                    |  UUCP:     ..!uunet!solbourne!larry
Senior Systems Engineer        |  Internet: larry@solbourne.com
Solbourne Computer, Inc        |  Fax:      (201) 843-4265
Park 80 West Plaza 2 Suite 200 |  Voice:    (201) 843-7441
Saddle Brook, NJ 07662         |  Voice:    (212) 679-7830
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL INJURY REPORT FOR 12-23-92
Organization: AT&T
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 22:45:38 GMT
Keywords: injury status




NHL INJURY REPORT FOR 12-23-92


TEAM	PLAYER			INJURY				DATE BACK
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

NJD	Scott Niedermayer	back spasms			D-to-D

NYI	Ray Ferraro		broken right leg		INDEF
NYI	Rich Pilon		strained knee ligaments 	Dec. 26

NYR	Jan Erixon		stiffness in hip and back	INDEF
NYR	Brian Leetch		nerve damage in neck		INDEF

PHL	Dominic Rousell		pulled groin			D-to-D

PIT	Mike Needham		back spasms 			D-to-D

WAS	Randy Burridge		right knee surgery		INDEF
WAS	Rod Langway		shoulder and knee surgery 11/20	INDEF

BOS	Brent Hughes		separated right shoulder	INDEF
BOS	Cam Neely		left knee surgery		INDEF
BOS	Vladmir Ruzicka		strained groin muscle		INDEF
BOS	Glen Wesley		broken foot			INDEF

BUF	Randy Moller		knee ligament damage		INDEF

HAR	Jim Agnew		partial tear of ant. cru lig.	INDEF
HAR	Tim Kerr		arth. sur. on right knee	INDEF
HAR	Randy Ladoceur		infected right elbow		D-to-D
HAR	Jim McKenzie		hip flexor strain		D-to-D
HAR	Frank Pietrangelo	fractured right kneecap		INDEF

MON	Benoit Brunet		sprained left knee		INDEF

QUE	Kerry Huffman		sprained left shoulder		D-to-D
QUE	Valeri Kamensky		broken right ankle		INDEF

CHI	Keith Brown		left shoulder surgery		Jan. 01
CHI	Karl Dykhuis		inner ear infection		D-to-D
CHI	Michel Goulet		groin pull			D-to-D

STL	Bob Bassen		broken right foot		Jan. 05
STL	Dave Lowry		sprained right knee		Dec. 29
STL	Ron Wilson		sore left knee			D-to-D

TBL	Basil McRae		broken left leg			Dec. 31

TOR	Bob McGill		sprained right knee		INDEF

CAL	Al MacInnis		dislocated left hip		INDEF
CAL	Michel Petit		separated right shoulder	Jan. 03
CAL	Carey Wilson		right knee sprain		D-to-D

LAK	Wayne Gretzky		herniated disc			INDEF
LAK	Lonnie Loach		broken thumb			INDEF
LAK	Warren Rychel		ankle contusion			D-to-D
LAK	Dave Taylor		concussion			D-to-D

SJS	David Bruce		groin				D-to-D
SJS	Yvon Corriveau		back strain			D-to-D
SJS	Link Gaetz		impaired motor skills		INDEF
SJS	Arturs Irbe		sprained knee			Dec. 28
SJS	Jayson More		sprained knee			D-to-D
SJS	Neil Wilkinson		back				D-to-D
SJS	Doug Wilson		sore leg			D-to-D

VAN	Dave Babych		torn ligaments in knee		INDEF
VAN	Doug Lidster		sprained knee			INDEF
VAN	Jim Sandlak		bulging disks in back		INDEF

WIN	Randy Carlyle		groin pull			D-to-D


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



\|||||/
-SPIKE-
From: fishman@cbnewse.cb.att.com (joseph.a.karpierz)
Subject: Re: Mike Keenan on tv now?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 19:35:37 GMT
Summary: Mentioned somewhere

In article <8fBq7RG00iV1M2OVQ0@andrew.cmu.edu>, Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 
> I heard something about Mike Keenan being a "reporter" for Canadian
> television now.  I know he was at the Pgh/Quebec game last night.
> Does anyone have the scoop on this?  (I'm an avid Mike Keenan fan.
> There are some people who I think should never be out of hockey and
> he's one of them. Yeah, I know he's an ass but I like Chris Chelios
> too so what do I know.  Jacques Demers is another one (who isn't an
> ass) who comes to mind as someone I hope stays in the game forever.)

You know, now that someone has mentioned it, I think I did read that in the
Chicago Sun-Times very recently.  I also believe the article went on to say
that his contract or agreement or whatever will be up in January.  The 
speculation, I believe, is that he will latch on with one of the two new
expansion clubs.

In terms of coaches, it almost sounds like a person is described as an ass if
he's tough on his players and a winner.  On the other hand, the reports coming
out of the Blackhawks' locker room is one of a loose and happy group.  One
of the local sportswriters didn't hesitate to point out that the Hawks'
recent surge began when Keenan was fired.  The theory is that the players and
Sutter no longer had him looking over their collective shoulders.

> Anyway, thanks.

Anytime.


Joe Karpierz
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Protected List Question (was:Latest Leaf Trade Rumour)
Organization: University of Toronto Chemistry Department
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 23:20:17 GMT

In article <1hqfaoINN1mi@gambier.rick.cs.ubc.ca> p7z092@rick.cs.ubc.ca (Anthony Jang) writes:
> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>>Note:  If the expansion draft for Anaheim and Miami does go ahead
>>this summer with a protection list of 1 goaltender, 5 defensemen,
>>and 9 forwards as suggested, then it is almost a certainty that
>>either Fuhr or Potvin has to be traded before then.  
>
>I thought Potvin would be considered a rookie in that players with
>less than one year experience would not need to be protected.  (I know
>Potvin played a few games last year, ~4.)
>

Potvin has a full season at St. John's which would make him a second
year professional this season...at least that is the way I always have
understood the rules...under the typical way expansion drafts were
held previously, that would make him exempt, but the proposed new
rules by the expansion committee, would allow only first year 
professionals to be exempt.  I could be wrong...of course.

Gerald