HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp

This posting is to announce our annual gaming convention.  

Place: Boise, Idaho;  BSU Student Union Building
Time:  October 10th, 8 AM to 11 PM
Contact: rhonda@hpdml92.boi.hp.com

Please email me if you have questions or would like to pre-register.

Here is the posting that will appear in _Dragon_ magazine.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
GAMEMASTER '92, "The Masters",  October 10th

Idaho's favorite gaming convention returns to the Student Union Building of 
Boise State University.  Featured RPGs will include AD&D, D&D, Shadowrun, 
Champions,  Paranoia, GURPS, Call of Cthulhu, Chill, Cyberpunk, Star Wars, Star 
Trek RPG, Robotech and Marvel Super Heroes.  We will also hold tournaments for 
Axis and Allies, Fortress America, Car Wars, Talisman, Star Fleet Battles, 
Warhammer 40K, Battletech, Ace of Aces, Clay-O-Rama,  and AD&D Battlesystem.  
Other events include open gaming, a miniatures painting competition and an 
auction.  Our Guest of Honor, Gary Thomas, co-author of TSR's The Shadow Elves, 
will run a D&D adventure set in the realm of the Shadow Elves.  He will also 
talk on "Writing and Publishing Gaming Material".  Pre-registration is $5 or $4 
for students (bring your student I.D. to the convention) if received by October 
7th.  Registration will be slightly more at the door.  To pre-register send $5 
(or $4 for students) along with your name, address and phone to: The 
Gamemasters Guild; 3531 Sugar Creek DR; Meridian, ID 83642.  For more 
information or if you are interested in running a game, call: (208) 888-6851 .
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: Needed: Roomate for Gencon
From: <RK3HMKTW@MIAMIU.BITNET>
Date: Wednesday, 29 Jul 1992 01:19:42 EDT
Organization: Miami University - Academic Computer Service

In an article I posted earlier, I mentioned that I needed a roomate for
The upcoming GENCON.
 
I still do.
 
The letter may be funny, but the intention is not.  I'm looking for someone
in the Cleveland area to maybe an hour or two outside the Cleveland area
who wants to go to GENCON but doesn't have transport/room.
 
I've got a room at a Budget Motel supposedly 10 miles from MECCA.  My
vehicle is small but has room for gaming equipment/etc.. (two seater
sports car with decent back space).
 
Expected costs (modified due to further knowledge of costs):
 
Room (three nights, 20, 21, and 22):  aprox $25 per night: = $75.00
Gasoline for both there and back (total of both)           = $35.00
Total of one half expenses:                                ---------
                                                             $110.00
 
 
I only ask for either a non-smoker or a curteous smoker (really curteous
smoker) because of asthma on my part.
 
Departure on Thursday from Cleveland:  4am
Arrival at your location            : ???
Arrival at Hotel (reservation conf.): circa  12:30pm
Arrival at GENCON                   : circa  1:30pm
 
Departure from Gencon (Sunday)      : 5pm
Arrival at your location            : ???
Arrival into Cleveland              : circa 1am
 
This is a sincere message, as I cannot afford the expenses alone, and
the group I usually go with is not going this year.
 
A bit about me (for your own info):  I don't drink (well, rarely drink,
and never while driving), I don't smoke, enjoy just about any kind
of music (except pure raw country), and am told that I'm a generally
interesting person.  Never convicted (or charged) with a crime.
 
A bit about the room:  It's a King size.  Thus, I don't care if when
we get there we flip a coin to see who sleeps on the floor each night,
take a "crash wherever" stance, or what-have-you.
 
 
Well.. I hope to hear from you... anyone?
 
--Hills (Ryan Kolter)
From: Galthor Bar Torm
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: map maker
Date: 23 Jul 92 22:00:17 GMT
Organization: CSU

Well, assuming that you mean in an VM environment, BASIC and REXX would
be the easiest since both languages take up the least memory and
niether has to be submitted to run.  If you want a random generator
maybe something like the following :
 
 
/* MAP */
Say'Map Maker for the Mainframe'
RANDOMIZE
SAY'Enter Town name'
Pull name
tech=int(rnd(1)*3)+1
people=int(rnd(1)*10)+1
people=people*10*tech
if tech=1 then say name' is a village.'
if tech=2 then say name' is a town.'
if tech=3 then say name' is a city.'
z=int(rnd(1)*4)+1
if z=1 then &goto -g
if z=2 then &goto -h
if z=3 then &goto -i
if z=4 then &goto -j
-g
say'+==========+==========+========+'
say'=          =          =        ='
say'=          =          =        ='
say'+==========+==========+========+'
 
etc.....
 
  It will be mostly random on the whole, but the program
 is feasible.  As for the exact hex sizes, you might
 want to check the train on the print that you are
 printing on for the dpi.
 
 
 
Hope this is some help to ya.
 
 
Galthor Bar Torm
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: mar@physics.su.OZ.AU (David Mar)
Subject: Re: Psionics
Organization: School of Physics, University of Sydney, Australia
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 01:20:15 GMT

In article <13742@mindlink.bc.ca> Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow) writes:
>That's mere handwaving.  The "explanations" don't include a plausible
>scientific explanation for why a basic force (along the lines of gravity and
>the strong nuclear force) in the universe can't be detected on instruments, yet
>can be detected and controlled by a sack of electrochemical activity (a brain).
>The common way around this is to claim that there is something special about
>life or sentient life.  This translates as "magic".

Now wait on a minute....
In my game, psionics _does_ exist because of another basic force in the
universe. I don't have a detailed explanation of exactly what that force is
or how it interacts with other things (mainly because I can't be bothered
trying to write down some consistent equations and trying to solve them).

But the important thing about it is that it _can_ be detected by instruments
other than sentient brains. It can also be manipulated by mechanical
devices. So it is possible to have a device which uses "the psionic force"
to (for example) levitate masses or broadcast telepathic messages to
people. In practise, this sort of thing isn't done much because it is
hideously expensive - whereas psionic sentients have no monetary penalties
applied to use of the power.

David Mar.                              mar@astrop.physics.su.OZ.AU
Astrophysics Department, University of Sydney  NSW  2006, Australia.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: dmgirard@nyx.cs.du.edu (David Girardot)
Subject: the good guys: more on TFT
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 15:47:26 GMT


 
Given that there are at least a few of us TFT die-hards, mebbe I should
post my rules mods.  They include a greatly expanded "talents" section, a
points based char generation system with ads/disads/quirks, etc, and even
a bunch of house rules...  Well, maybe I'd better wait till the char
system is finished, but I do have the talents section more or less done.

If any of you TFT'ers have any of this kind of stuff online, I would
*love* to see it, esp. adventures and scenarios, but anything will do.  I
actually have a NPC generator (picks talents, jobs, all of it) that I
wrote in applesoft.  I might still have it around at home, but have no way
of posting it to the net. :(

--David

girardot@vax.dickinson.edu

--

<- <- <-   *  *  *    T   *   O   *   G   *  *  *   ->  ->  ->
      Girardot@dickinson.edu     Girardot@dickisn.bitnet
			     -*-
From: seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Psionics
Date: 25 Jul 92 13:32:11 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh
Originator: seawasp@pmax1.cis.pitt.edu

In article <13731@mindlink.bc.ca> Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow) writes:
>seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:
>game "for the sake of completeness" is unlikely to make any gamers happy.  Did
>many people consider AD&D's original psionics system to be "important and
>useful"?

	The groups I played with for years did. I found the AD&D system to be
one of the better (not the best) representations of a psi system, and
very nicely different from the magic system [a crime which most other systems
perpetrate is to basically nudge the names of the powers around but leave
the mechanics the same for spells and psi, which destroys the entire point
of HAVING psi.].

	In fact, one of the things I HATED most about second ed AD&D was the
fact that they eliminated PSI from the game; when they finally came out
with the Psi handbook, they'd added so many bizarre powers that the thing
was starting to read like Marvel Super Heroes.

>Certainly!  If you want a psionics game, buy a game with complete psionics
>rules that you like.  If you want a SF campaign with psionics, find a game that
>supports it.  If you want a SF campaign that isn't tainted by psionics, buy
>that.  I don't think that games that do everything (poorly) is better at
>handling a particular flavour of gaming (such as SF without psionics) than a
>system specifically designed for it.

	Nice philosophy. But what if that isn't an option?

	For example, let's say that you issue Legacy, I look over it and
say, "Gee! THIS is the kind of SF game I've been looking for! I like
the mechanics and background..." 
	Where am I going to get those PSI rules, eh?

	In short, if you like a system but it is missing certain rules you
want, you either have to 
	1) Drop the system and find one with all the rules you want,
even if the new system itself is not really what you wanted mechanically
	2) Try to patch incompatible systems together (I actually had
SOME success with this, patching Space Opera psionics into AD&D)
	3) Invent your own rules.


                                 Sea Wasp
                                   /^\
                                   ;;;
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: PCHEM14@Zeus.unomaha.edu (FALL88)
Subject: Re: CHAMPS: Marksman....
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:29:51 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.11

gil@smtc21.engr.scarolina.edu writes:
> and me, a martial artist with a 1d6 autofire penetrating
> x3 0 END knife (among other things) named Ginsu.

Just wondering: Any reason for penetrating x3 on a *knife*?  I'm
not aware of too many martial arts that let you stick knives through
steel girders.  By the way, since your attack is so easy to cancel
(quad harden bottom 2 PD/dam resist for 3 pts) don't expect it to
effect mechanon again.  He does that, you know.  Hope you've got a
real attack in that character somewhere...  :)

-james
From: mperry@waikato.ac.nz
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Psionics
Date: 31 Jul 92 12:15:02 +1200
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

In article <13873@mindlink.bc.ca>, Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow) writes:
> al@calsci.UUCP (Al Petterson) writes:
> 
> 
>> How do you extrapolate the existence of FTL without the existence of time
>> travel?  By rejecting general relativity?

The start of the topic was SF, then it developed to an argument of mainly two.
The theory of realitivity is based on evidence gained at speeds well less than
the speed of light - to be more explicit, at speeds close to no speed at all.
From this small amount of data a theory was made - making projects upto light
speed and beyond. Can we rely on this theory based on the limited data at close
to 0 speed.
From: Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Psionics
Date: 24 Jul 92 19:30:54 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:

> Nope, I don't. First, any game designer SHOULD include psionic rules in an SF
> game, for the sake of completeness.

Ah yes, completeness.  That's a great reason for adding something.  Does that
mean tacking on a gratuitous little section "for the sake of completeness",
even if they're total garbage?  Does it mean doing a proper job of it, at the
expense of time that could be spent improving other parts of the game?

> They're in SO many works of great import and have great potentialities.

They're also in so many more works of great crap, and have great potential for
spoiling a game.

> I use Psi in my games and I have a consistent, logical, "scientific"
> explanation for their existence, their functioning, and the whys and
> wherefores of (a) how they work, (b) why they don't work [apparently] here on
> our earth, and (c) their precise relationship to the other powers of the
> universe.

Do you have a simple enough summary that you could post?  I've never seen a
good explanation/justification for psionics before.

--

Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: tmyoung@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Thomas M. Young)
Subject: Re: Hero System for anything but supers
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 92 18:16:59 EDT

In article <0095DE99.76FAD3C0@abby.chem.ucla.edu> doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu writes:
>Hold it, 15 is hardly an "average" weapon skill in GURPS.  I suspect you've
>seen some real power-gamers at it with GURPS, since I've RARELY seen a
>starting character with even ONE stat of 15, and never played one with a
>stat of 15... and I've been playing GURPS for about four years.
>
>IMHO, a starting skill of 12 is perfectly reasonable for a starting fighter,
>especially if you've got a weapon/shield combo or a defensive weapon (staff,
>rapier, and the like).  People pay for those 15 DX's... they either can't
>penetrate heavy armor, or they can't take much damage before keeling over.
>Or, alternatively, they're VERY vulnerable to anything requiring an IQ roll.
>At any rate, IMHO it just isn't worth it to get the 15 DX.  Of course, I don't
>like to play characters with an IQ of less than 12, so I suppose that colors
>my choice of point expenditures quite a bit.
>
>
>-Doug Gibson
> doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu

Actually, 15 is a pretty common *skill* in the games I've played in, but it 
is a very uncommon *stat*.  16 is the level of skill described as 'expert',
and that has been fairly true in my own experience.  Levels of of 12 or 13
are perfectly playable, but IMHO a 15 or 16 is worth the points unless you
have really sorry stats.  As for the vulnerabilities you describe, that 
really depends on what point values you play at.  I agree whole-heartedly
if you play at a 100-point level, but if you play at 150 or 200 you give
up less to take a high stat.


--
Tom Young                                         tmyoung@rodan.acs.syr.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan)
Subject: Re: HERO vs. GURPS: Magic
Reply-To: sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan)
Organization: Plymouth State College - Plymouth, N.H.
Distribution: rec
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 18:06:33 GMT

dseal@armltd.co.uk (David Seal) writes:
>
>However, to try to be reasonably objective: as you say, Hero can be easily
>modified - probably more easily than GURPS. The flip side of this seems to
>me to be that Hero *has* to be modified. For instance, GURPS provides you
>with lists of spells, etc.; Hero tells you how to design a spell. The latter
>is better if you *want* to design your own spells - it's just a waste of
>time if you don't want to put in that much effort.

While I basically agree with the bulk of your post, I disagree with this
paragraph.  I have not been able to create a good improvisational magic
system in Hero, but I have done so in GURPS.  In this instance, which is
ultimate flexibility, GURPS is superior to Hero.  Someone sent me e-mail
once claiming he could do an improv magic system in Hero, but when I
asked for more details, he never replied.

It may be possible - I just haven't seen it done yet, but I use such a
system regularly in GURPS - and it's more flexible than the Hero magic
system.

-- 
  - Steffan O'Sullivan		         sos@oz.plymouth.edu
From: rick@qucdnee.ee.queensu.ca
Subject: Re: CHAMPS: Marksman....
Organization: Queen's University EE Department
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 17:05:31 GMT

In article <1992Jul26.213319.26221@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu>, gil@smtc21.engr.scarolina.edu (Gil Young) writes:

> My question is this:  What are your experiences with Mechanon?  
   he's a wimp. :-) first time i/we met him, 'way back when, i was 
playing "the relativist" a gravity control guy with a Controlled 
Continuous attack. put him down in a couple of rounds. (mechanon has (or 
had in those days; i haven't looked recently) a big Vulnerability to 
gravitic attacks. we didnt know this, but just assumed this was a phony 
mechanon because it obviously had a glass jaw.)

rp
From: jacobus@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: HERO vs. GURPS
Date: 27 Jul 92 23:12:12 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center



To the question "which is better, Hero or GURPS?", there is only one answer
that can solidly be defended:


"Yes."


Or perhaps it's "No."


It might be "Maybe."



Aw heck, I'm just gonna give up and play Tunnels and Trolls from now on.
From: a_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Hero System for anything but supers
Date: 23 Jul 92 02:11:50 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

In article <0095DE99.76FAD3C0@abby.chem.ucla.edu>, doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu writes:
> Hold it, 15 is hardly an "average" weapon skill in GURPS.  I suspect you've
> seen some real power-gamers at it with GURPS, since I've RARELY seen a
> starting character with even ONE stat of 15, and never played one with a
> stat of 15... and I've been playing GURPS for about four years.

	About the only time I've seen 15+ for starting characters in a combat
skill is either for a Guns-type skill (that gets an IQ bonus) or a character 
based on 150 or more points.

> 
> IMHO, a starting skill of 12 is perfectly reasonable for a starting fighter,
> especially if you've got a weapon/shield combo or a defensive weapon (staff,
> rapier, and the like).  People pay for those 15 DX's... they either can't
> penetrate heavy armor, or they can't take much damage before keeling over.
> Or, alternatively, they're VERY vulnerable to anything requiring an IQ roll.
> At any rate, IMHO it just isn't worth it to get the 15 DX.  Of course, I don't
> like to play characters with an IQ of less than 12, so I suppose that colors
> my choice of point expenditures quite a bit.

	I *always* make sure I have a literate character. I tend to balance
stats on characters, with most running from 11-13 (I spend about 60-80 points
on stats).

Brandon Cope
From: Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca (Nick Janow)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Psionics
Date: 27 Jul 92 18:13:36 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

mar@physics.su.OZ.AU (David Mar) writes:

> In my game, psionics _does_ exist because of another basic force in the
> universe. I don't have a detailed explanation of exactly what that force is
> or how it interacts with other things (mainly because I can't be bothered
> trying to write down some consistent equations and trying to solve them).

Doesn't that make it fantasy, rather than science fiction?  I think the general
consensus is that science fiction is the extrapolation of an actual or imagined
science or technology on society.  If you don't have an explanation for the
science (psionics), then how can you extrapolate properly from it?  In the
extreme case, the effects are applied for reasons other than extrapolation,
with a weak attempt to claim that it is still SF.  The recent "Battlemech"
discussion has showed that game to be in the latter category.

Does your science of psionics include examples of this "basic force" in
insects, geophysical activity, the bonding of clay particles, etc, or at least
include an adequate explanation of why the force does not manifest itself in
such areas?  Can the players understand the science well enough to apply it in
ways you haven't written into the rules.  For example, if you have a crystal
that absorbs and stores psi energy, can the players turn that into a psychic
shield or a psychic bomb?  Can they study the crystal structure and use that
knowledge to create variations of it or find a different crystal with a similar
structure?

I'm not saying that fantasy is somehow inferior to SF.  Furthermore, even if
your psionics was properly fantasy rather than SF, it needn't invalidate other
SF elements of the game.  I'm just arguing that if you don't operate from an
"extrapolation from a set of scientific facts", then your psionics rules would
be by definition be fantasy rather than SF.


Actually, I'm just arguing for entertainment value.  >:-)

--

Nick_Janow@mindlink.bc.ca
From: Rannou@info.polymtl.ca (Patrick Rannou)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: The late, lamented Iron Crown...
Date: 22 Jul 92 03:35:46 GMT
	<1992Jul20.161835.25017@burrhus.harvard.edu>
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique de Montreal, Canada

In article <1992Jul20.161835.25017@burrhus.harvard.edu> canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson) writes:



	   My God!  Should TSR get the Middle-earth license truly, the world
   would end.  I would be forced to take up guerilla warfare against them!
	   Surely Chris Tolkien would not allow TSR to get it!  Of course, he
   probably doesn't know how much TSR sucks.
	   Perhaps I should go get some of the key MERP stuff now before it's
   too late ...

   Carl

Well, the fact isn't that TSR sucks or not... It is that ME licensing going
to TSR would mean that all those D&D players would suddenly have access to
yet another book(s) to buy, and thus Tolkien would make far more money that
way...


Simple, isn't it?

Patrick Rannou.
--
/---------------------------\
| Patrick "Paradak" Rannou. |
| Rannou@info.polymtl.ca    |
\---------------------------/
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy
From: akuma@netcom.com (Steven E Barnes)
Subject: Re: HERO vs. GURPS: Magic
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 92 19:42:53 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: rec

In article <1992Jul31.164729.20206@news.columbia.edu>, jhk6@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (John H Kim) writes:
> 
> 	At it's simplest level, an improv magic system in Hero would be 
> bought as a Variable Point Pool, only with a number of control skills 
> instead of just one. Each form and technique (in the Ars Magica terminology) 
> is a separate skill. They are bought like Sciences or Knowledge skills. In 
> order to cast a spell, the mage must take a half-phase, then make a successful 
> roll on the appropriate form and technique (-1 per 5 active points in the 
> effect he wants). 
> Ex. a mage with Healing at 17- and Man at 14- wants to heal someone who is 
> gravely wounded. The GM has ruled that in this game, Aid costs 10 pts per 
> die. So the mage decides to try 3d6 of Body Aid. This is 30 active points, 
> and so he must roll and 11-, and then an 8-, in order to formulate the spell.

This is one of the more common ideas I've seen.  The problem is that
it is quite expensive.  Example: my mage knows 5 forms and 3 techniques
at 17-; the costs are: 3 (scientist) + 8 * 7 = 59 points.  All this 
lets him do is cast 30 point spells at 11- (not very impressive in my
book), and he hasn't even payed for his power pool yet! (a minimium
of 30 points, plus the control cost)

I'm not saying it won't work, but that all these VPP schemes need
to give the player a serious cost break.  Maybe make the pool cost
half "official" cost, make the spells -1 / 10 active points, maybe
provide methods for getting spell roll bonuses (foci, extra time,
etc)

-steve
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.advocacy