HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical


> >sighted in berkeley tower of records saturday morning.  also there
> >is some whopping reissue project (phillips i think) called the "bayreuth
> >edition".  i didn't look close but it appears to have most or all
> >of wagner's operas from bayreuth performances.  the ring was the
> >boulez version, i don't remember the others.  snappy packaging, inexpensive;
> >operas available seperately or in one big crate.  i'd be curious
> >about what folks thought of the individual performances since they were
> >cheap and so am i!

> I know there was some noise about the fact the Parsifal is NOT the
> glorious Knappertsbusch, but a vastly inferior one... I don't remember,
> but I think it was the Boulez also.  

Indeed, but thankfully the Tristan is Bohm's and the Tannhauser
Sawallisch's. Both Excellent.

Simon.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: sweaver3@mach1.wlu.ca (scott weaver 9209 U)
Subject: RVW Tuba Concerto
Organization: Wilfrid Laurier University
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 00:11:29 GMT
Keywords: oops, I goofed.  Please don't shoot me, I'm only a tubist!

Like it says up there somewhere, I goofed!  I gave a few wrong names on that
wonderful recording of the tuba Concerto.  So, here is the revised edition
of that last posting of mine...

Bryden Thomson conducting the London Symphony Orchestra, featuring Patrick
Harrild on the tuba.  The CD is under the Chandos label, and the number is
CHAN8740.

(I incorrectly said last time that the conductor was Sir Adrian Bouldt, and
the tubist was Patrick Childe.  No need to shoot me, I'll just throw my tuba
up in the air, and have it land on my head.  That should start getting
things straight in there!)
-- 
Scott B. Weaver		Internet: sweaver3@mach1.wlu.ca
"Dream Weaver"		UUCP: ...!torn!watserv2.uwaterloo.ca!mach1!sweaver3
Patience comes to 	Snail: 2C-264 Regina Street North
those who wait...	       Waterloo, Ontario, Canada N2J 3B7
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Musicians rubbishing composers
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 17:42:50 GMT

In article <1eic8tINN5cq@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott) writes:
>Michael J Valinis (mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu) wrote:
>: Then there's the job Humperdinck did on himself:
>: 
>: "At first I thought I should be a second Beethoven; presently I found that to 
>: be another Schubert would be good; then, gradually, satisfied with less and 
>: less, I was resigned to be a Humperdinck."
>
>
>RVW said of his own 4th symphony: "It's what I wanted but I'm not sure
>that I like it."

Actually, I think it was "I don't know if I like it, but it's what I
meant."

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
From: haynes@cats.ucsc.edu (Jim Haynes)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Music to calm down by
Date: 20 Nov 92 05:46:14 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: hobbes.ucsc.edu


I had a friend who used Pachelbel's canon for that purpose, but I suppose
it's passe now.  Personally I'm partial to Scott Joplin's "Solace".
Some people suggested New Age music, but that stuff sets my teeth on edge.  
You might like organ music: try Bach's "Come, Sweet Death," and a number
of other Bach chorales.  Cesar Franck organ music too, and his orchestral
suite "Psyche".  Mendelssohn's "Midsummer Night's Dream".  Maybe some
Fritz Kreisler violin pieces.  Offenbach's Barcarolle from Tales of
Hoffmann.  You may have to try a lot of things before you find the ones
that work best for you.
-- 
haynes@cats.ucsc.edu
haynes@cats.bitnet

"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was!"
"No it aint!  But ya gotta know the territory!"
        Meredith Willson: "The Music Man"
From: abrocke1 (Aaron Brockett)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Live concert experience.
Date: 18 Nov 92 17:42:57 GMT
Organization: Swarthmore College

In article <97611@netnews.upenn.edu>, hxie@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Hong-liang
Xie) writes:
> 
> 
>  I went to listen to the concert of Philadelphia Orchestra. It was Mahler's Symphone No.4. I got the cheapest price of $4 and sat on the last row the highest floor, 4th. The sound effect was O.K. until the voice of the soprano came out. The sound was very dim and low.
> 
> I figured there were two reasons:
> 
> The voice of the soprano was just what I heard. I mean, the piece may be supposed to be sung like this or the soprano was not a good one. I believe she is Roberta Alexander.
> 
> Second, The sound effect of the hall is such that the instrument radiats evenly but the human voice is more directional. We must draw the conclusion, if this reason is true, that don't get the cheap and sit in the last row whenever you go for an opera.
> 
> I am not an frequent theatre goer. As a matter of fact, this is the first time aafter I came to the city one years ago.
> 
> Any comment from you experienced guys, I am looking forward to that.
> 
> Zhi Cai
> cai@robin.drexel.edu

My experience with those seats way up in the back is that the sound carries
up there just as well as to the rest of the hall. As a frequent Philly
orchestra attendee, I've sat nearly everywhere in the various balconies at
one time or another, and the sound is roughly the same no matter where you
go. However,  I've found that the seats at the top center do have a
tendency to magnify audience noice due to the enclosed space they're in.
The rustling and coughing is much more obtrusive. This shouldn't affect the
soprano's voice quality though; I'd have to conclude that she wasn't doing
that good of a job.

--Aaron
Brockett
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Subject: Re:Re: tonality and modern music
Organization: University of Western Ontario
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 04:20:20 GMT

My two cents. I think that by and large it is the substructure that makes 
post-tonal music so much more difficult for many to appreciate. The tonal 
system acts as a magnificent organizing device that is dynamic--it 
creates tension and release through time. A good tonal composition is an 
argument with a resolution. Without tonality as a structuring device 
composers have to turn to other means in order to create a sense of 
growth--for instance texture, density, activity, etc. It takes training 
and a lot of exposure to appreciate these elements, especially since they 
are subordinated to tonality as organizing devices.

Serial music was a noble experiment and produced some great works, but in 
the end it was a failure because most listeners don't have perfect (or 
even relative) pitch so couldn't recognize pitch organization to save 
their souls. Hardly any non-trained musician has the musical memory to 
appreciate the other serialized parameters.

By the way, not all "modern music" is atonal, even if it purports to be. 
Sometimes it's apparent (Berg violin concerto, Webern op. 27) sometimes 
it's down their somewhere--just hard to put your finger on (Scriabin, 
lotta Schoenberg. Even Stockhausen and Boulez).

I am spending too much time on this bulletin board!! I'm supposed to be 
doing an MBA!!

r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: brucek@Ingres.COM (Bruce Kleinman)
Subject: Re: Advice on Prokofiev piano sonatas?
Organization: Ingres, an ASK Company, Alameda CA 94501
Date: 23 Nov 92 20:07:06 GMT

In article <1992Nov22.222927.4035@midway.uchicago.edu> pkbockus@gsbphd.uchicago.edu (Keith Bockus) writes:
>Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley) writes:
>
>> I want some advice on Prokofiev piano sonatas on two fronts:1. Of all the
>> sonatas, which are the 3 or 4 most popular or most worthy
>>     of note in the repetoire?
>>  2. Which are the most respected/recommended recordings?
>
>I'm very fond of Matti Raekallio on the Ondine label.

I second this opinion -- Raekallio is perfect for this repertoire.  
I have several of Boris Berman's disks with one sonata on each, and I
find them much too high-minded; I want a bit of brutality in my Prok.
I've also got Richter doing numbers 2 and 8 brilliantly, as usual.
Raekallio is of course much better recorded, plus if you're as obsessive
as I am, there's nothing like completeness.  But the Richters are very
much worth getting too if you happen upon them.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Schirmer's (was Re: Looking for a source for composer prints)
From: phoogenboom@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 17 Nov 92 20:08:00 EST
Organization: Wesleyan University

In article <1992Nov17.160009.910@Princeton.EDU>, roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
> In article <1992Nov17.035139.13356@news.columbia.edu> gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener) writes:
>>Anyone know a good source for prints of composer portraits?  I'm looking for
> I bet Schirmer's has them, too.

To what are you referring when you say "Schirmer's"?


Peter Hoogenboom
phoogenb@ucs.indiana.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: jwa@vipunen.hut.fi (Jyrki J Wahlstedt)
Subject: Re: Recommended Classical Recordings
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date: 20 Nov 92 01:08:37

In article <1992Nov18.190842.16560@math.ucla.edu> pugh@pico.math.ucla.edu (David Pugh) writes:

>A few suggestions for the otherwise excellent classical music
>recommendations.

  Well, some more. I just think there could be more works by 
  Olivier Messiaen. I found only his Quartet pour la fin du temps.
  Surely Turangalila, Vingt regards..., Des canyons aux etoiles,
  St. Francis of Assisi, Trois petites liturgies, the organ music
  deserve a place in lists, each according to its genre.

  You may easily guess that for me he is one of the best contemporary
  composers. (As a personal note: A group, a member of which I was, 
  made a Christmas story production two years ago. We read the Gospel
  text, verse by verse, and between the verses poetry, news texts and
  a prayer (by St. Francis). Most of the time we showed slides on the
  wall and played music (compiled in cassettes). The music was mostly
  from Bach's Christmas Oratorium, but when the shepherds went to see
  the child, I put in that place the fifth movement of Messiaen's
  Turangalila, Joie du sang des etoiles. And that was a music in its
  right place!)

--
!
!	Jyrki Wahlstedt
!		Jyrki.Wahlstedt@hut.fi
!
!  Our life is no dream, but it should and will perhaps become one.
!
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rdorocke@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (rob lawrence dorocke)
Subject: Re: Carmina Burana
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 15:43:58 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.120506.8154@omen.UUCP> caf@omen.UUCP (Chuck Forsberg) writes:
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
>In article <1992Nov16.195956.9360@mccc.edu> pjh@mccc.edu (P. J. Holsberg) writes:
>>Any idea where I can get the English translation of Orff's "Carmina
>>Burana"?  Thanks.
>
>There are some recordings of the original Carmina Burana songs
>that come with translations.
>
The CD by the San Faancisco Symphony and chorus (London Digital) conducted by
Herbert Blomstedt has the translations into English along with French, German
and one other language that I cannot recognize.
wq
4d
>I can say from personal experience that the translations provided with
>concert programs are sometimes hoplessly sanitized.
>-- 
>Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX          ...!tektronix!reed!omen!caf 
>Author of YMODEM, ZMODEM, Professional-YAM, ZCOMM, and DSZ
>  Omen Technology Inc    "The High Reliability Software"
>17505-V NW Sauvie IS RD   Portland OR 97231   503-621-3406
From: slj1k@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Music to calm down by
Date: 19 Nov 92 19:43:03 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <3344@voodoo.UUCP>, das@voodoo.boeing.com (Deb Schwartz) writes:
> ...appreciate recommendations for music that has a calming effect.
> 
	anything by gariel faure, especially the pavane or his requiem
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark L. Reece     |  ``... and the trees are all kept equal by hatchet, axe and
SLJ1K@CC.USU.EDU  |  saw.'' - Neil Peart ``... uh, Viv, can you, like, actually
je taime, jen     |  kill yourself with laxative pills?'' - Neil, a young one.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Batons in period orchestras (was Re: More Haydn)
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:55:09 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.203151.20954@athena.mit.edu> ridgway@athena.mit.edu (Lee Ridgway) writes:
>I'm not sure who made the baton a standard fixture for orchestral conductors
>(Berlioz?), but it didn't become so until well into the 19th century. Most
>orchestras of the 18th-early 19th centuries didn't have conductors as we know
>them (one person, standing in front of the band, waving his arms). The
>"directing" (when did the word "conductor" become common?) was done usually by
>the concert master or keyboard player/soloist.
>
>Interestingly, several conductors of modern orchestras are moving away from
>constant use of the baton: Ozawa, Masur, Mehta are ones I think of immediately.

I don't recall *ever* seeing Boulez use a baton - asnd my memories of
seeing him conduct go back 25 years or so. (I almost hate to admit).

Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.


Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Subject: Re: the worst composer ever
Organization: University of Western Ontario
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 23:04:28 GMT

Jeez, lighten up! I don't necessarily think this enquiry proves 
anything--I'm just interested to see what people say. I am the last 
person on earth to say that any composer is BAD. Such a judgement is 
usually based upon matters of taste, not of technique. Fact is, I don't 
like Delius. That doesn't mean I hate all people who like Delius. That 
doesn't mean he couldn't write I-IV-V-I without putting in parallel 
fifths. Come on! It's a meaningless but interesting poll.

In response to Bruce Rodean who says 

I don't think you quite understand how EXTREMELY DIFFICULT composing is-
Have you ever tried it?--I think not.....otherwise you'd know that it's 
not the
easiest thing to do ( not even close )!!!!

Sorry Bruce, I have. I agree with you entirely--it's very, very 
difficult. You may look at my moniker and think I'm some bloody 
no-brained business student BUT fact is, I also have a Ph.D. in 
musicology from Harvard (a.b.d). I have pushed around more than a few 
notes in my life. Do not jump to conclusions. There is no money in 
musicology and much as I love music I have to eat. That's why I am 
a business student.

r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario
From: diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Florence Foster Jenkins
Date: 16 Nov 1992 11:15:16 +0800
Organization: The University of Western Australia
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: uniwa.uwa.edu.au
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Funny you should mention her. I've just bought a copy for my secretary
to mime to for his drag shows. He's over the moon, particularly about
the Laughing Song from Fliedermaus. Let's hear it for Terry! (At the
Perth Irish Club in Subiaco, November 28th. Tickets at door.)

I prefer the Faust Travesty which accompanies FFJ. I must say
that the glorious trio reduced to a duet, and sung by a baritone
stretching to reach high tenor notes is quite a sound. Not to be
listened to by the squeamish or fastidious.

I should recommend the Scratch Orchestra and the Portsmouth Sinfonia,
who were to the symphonic reportoire what FFJ was to opera. Their Hall
of the Mountain King, William Tell Overture and Hallelujiah CHorus are
etched into my memory.

For people who like discomfort, may I recommend the recording of the
last Castrati? Prof Moreschi is another favourite of mine, ever since I
discovered him on a very battered 78. His music isn't bad, but the style
of singing is so bizarre that very few can tolerate it.
From: "richard wyble" <richard.wyble@channel1.com>
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: wind ensemble music
Date: 15 Nov 92 18:36:56 EST
Reply-To: "richard wyble" <richard.wyble@channel1.com>
Distribution: rec
Organization: Channel 1 Communications

JP |From: clonij@nuge109.its.rpi.edu (John Paul Cloninger)

JP |There was a mention of Fennell-type wind ensemble music a few posts back.
JP |Does anyone know of any other suppliers of wind ensemble recordings?  What
JP |I do own is tapes dubbed off of records.  I know I can do better. Thanks.

If one actually does this, one should not advertise the fact, especially on 
an internationally distributed network. The practice is less than 
questionable, it is highly illegal!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Richard J. Wyble, Worcester, MA       Internet: richard.wyble@channel1.com
                      Written Sun, 11-15-92, at 4:24pm
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
  DeLuxe 1.25 #12515  
--
Channel 1 (R)   Cambridge, MA
From: stehle@erg.sri.com (Roy Stehle)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Clarinet construction
Date: 18 Nov 92 18:43:19 GMT
Organization: SRI International, Menlo Park, CA

In article <1992Nov17.183110.15040@Princeton.EDU> roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig) writes:
>In article <1992Nov17.161018.18555@tc.fluke.COM> strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes:
>>All the good clarinets I have seen were made of ebony, a wood in
>>increasingly short supply.  Within the next 2 decades there will no
>>longer be enough ebony for musical instrument construction.  
>
>Well, what's the international grenadilla situation?  (I honestly don't 
>know.)  I know that Heckel has several decades worth of bassoon wood
>stocked away to age; don't know what the clarinet people are doing.  

The wood used for clarinets comes from the Mpingo tree.  It is often
referred to as grenadilla or ebony.  There was a very interesting discussion
of the shortage of Mpingo trees and the manufacture of clarinets on a PBS
_Nature_ series called "The Tree of Music."  (I videotaped the 1-hr show for
my own interests.)  You might wish to contact your local PBS station to see
if they plan reruns.

According to the show, the Mpingo must be 50 years old to provide wood
suitable for clarinet manufacture.  Recent demands for farming land in
Africa have resulted in repeated burning of the fields and forests.  These
fires are killing the young Mpingo trees before they can grow strong
enough to resist the fire.  Old trees are being cut; new trees can't
survive the fires.  A botanist is growing Mpingo trees in his nursery
and encouraging locals to care for trees he's started.  Local artists
depend on the wood for complex carvings, so there is some consideration
for a continued livelihood.  However, earning a wage today from the
available supply is of first priority.

The program said that Boosey-Hawkes let the wood age for about a year
after harvest.  From that, I would assume that their total stock would
not exceed the demand of a year or two.

Not mentioned in the program is a wood called "Ironwood" available in
Mexico that, to me, seems to have the high density of Mpingo wood.
It would be interesting to have someone try it as an alternative.

Roy Stehle
SRI International
stehle@erg.sri.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: hcresnic@ellis.uchicago.edu (hugh carney resnick)
Subject: Re: Adagio for Strings
Reply-To: hcresnic@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:20:41 GMT

In article <1764.3163.uupcb@synapse.org> barry.copeland@synapse.org (Barry Copeland)  writes:
>EM> Hi. Does anyone know who wrote Adagio for Strings?
>
>Samuel Barber.  Many excellent recordings available.
>
>Barry
>
>---
Yes, there are many. IMHO the best orchestrated version (as opposed to the 
piece as a part of Barber's String Quartet) is Bernstein's recording with 
the LA Philharmonic on Deutsche Grammophon. An extra bonus is you also get
wonderful readings of Appalachian Spring (Copland), American Festival
Overture (William Schuman), and Bernstein's own "Candide" Overture.

The tempo of the recording on the Platoon is taken way too fast.

hugh

-- 
___________________________________________________________________
	  Hugh C. Resnick (hcresnic@midway.uchicago.edu)
"Is it my 500th birthday? Well, that's none of your Busnois."
___________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: sgp@Ingres.COM (the happy existentialist)
Subject: Re: Speaking of the Solti Ring...
Reply-To: sgp@Ingres.COM (the happy existentialist)
Organization: Ask Computer Systems Inc., Ingres Division, Alameda CA 94501
Date: 17 Nov 92 01:33:46 GMT

In article <1992Nov16.201323.3311@visual.com> rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel) writes:
>
>
>>sighted in berkeley tower of records saturday morning.  also there
>>is some whopping reissue project (phillips i think) called the "bayreuth
>>edition".  i didn't look close but it appears to have most or all
>>of wagner's operas from bayreuth performances.  the ring was the
>>boulez version, i don't remember the others.  snappy packaging, inexpensive;
>>operas available seperately or in one big crate.  i'd be curious
>>about what folks thought of the individual performances since they were
>>cheap and so am i!
>
>>sgp
>
>
>I know there was some noise about the fact the Parsifal is NOT the
>glorious Knappertsbusch, but a vastly inferior one... I don't remember,
>but I think it was the Boulez also.  
>
>Also, although the Boulez Ring was fun to watch on-screen, I don't think it
>cuts it on purely musical terms.

why not?  i've heard occasional references to it and seen little
chunks of the video, but haven't really heard much about it or,
more to the point, heard it myself.  i imagine the dry-eyed approach
wouldn't go over big w/ the average wagner fan. i found boulez doing
ravel an incredibly refreshing experience, but wonder if that approach
would work so well w/ something very much intended as Drama with a
capital D.

>
>Generally, I recommend that you resist the temptation to buy on the basis
>of fancy packaging and obtain the individual operas separately.  There are
>some terrific performances available at mid-price.  I can understand
>your attraction to the Bayreuth set, however -- the CD companies are getting
>quite fancy with their re-issues of material.   You almost want to buy
>the stuff because of how great it will look on your shelf.  :-)
>
>Also, isn't the Solti "Ring" itself available more cheaply now? 
>
>
>Rob

no, cheap got me more than anything and i, for one, wouldn't want
the whole thing - that much wagner all at once would be too much
like drinking 6 cases of ale in an afternoon.  though it would look
cool on the shelf ;-).  mercifully, the operas are available seperately.
no surprise that the knap parsifal was not included; it is probably
more valuable to the bottom line as a seperate entity.  personally,
i'm curious about the boulez ring for contrast and a quality (and,
if possible, inexpensive) tristan to fill a "need" ;-).

		sgp (checkbook sagging under record collection)
From: spahr@hpwala.wal.hp.com (Lani Spahr)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 14:48:14 GMT
Subject: Re: John Williams, both of them
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Distribution: rec.music.classical

|> I promised my brother I'd post this rather stuuuuupid question:

|> There's John Williams the composer(Boston Pops, Close Encounters,etc),
|> and there's John Williams the guitarist(plays all guitar music,
|> quite wonderfully IMHO).  I know that they're different people.  Are
|> they related?

No.