HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Reason vs. Morals
Date: 15 Oct 92 22:48:26 GMT
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia

In article <1992Oct13.051714.24460@cs.umb.edu>, ahmad@ra.cs.umb.edu (Ahmad Hashem) writes:
|> 
|> You are confusing the normal state with the state of emergency.  If you
|> insist that in emergencies (i.e., cases of extreme penury) people will
|> only look for survival (and this is something I will dispute in what follows)
|> then this hardly says anything about the normal state, which remains the rule.
|> 
|> But Islam also teaches its followers the principle of 'eethar' (altruism)
|> which is especially commendable in states of emergency.  There were cases 
|> after cases in the history of Islam when people practiced altruism even 
|> when they were in the most dire need (e.g., when several bleeding soldiers
|> were lying on the ground and all in need of water, the first refused
|> to drink when he heard the second saying "water!", same with the second,
|> and third.  When the fourth was offered water he was already dead; when water
|> was offered back to the third he was already dead; and the second and the 
|> first!  Could you tell me what happened to their individualistic impulses?)
|>
 
 No I am not, Humans when faced with problems that border on the verge of
 breaking laws will break laws. This is the essence of my argument, this does
 not deal with an emergency, it deals with every day life situations. The nature
 of our soceity forces us to do so. This is very similar to the basic law
 of resistance "current will choose the path of least resistance". We choose
 the easiest way out, this forces us to break religious and civil laws.
 
 Christianity states that if I break the laws, I will be judged after death.
 Islam and Judaism deal with you on earth first and what ever is left of you
 than your god will deal with. Thus, your reasoning and moral practices will
 be more stringent but they are still breakable if you are faced with certain
 problems.
 
 A.Faris
From: ahmad@ra.cs.umb.edu (Ahmad Hashem)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Reason vs. Morals
Date: 17 Oct 92 01:40:40 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston

In article <1992Oct15.224826.21931@trl.oz.au> a.Faris@trl.oz.au writes:
> Humans when faced with problems that border on the verge of
> breaking laws will break laws. This is the essence of my argument, this does
> not deal with an emergency, it deals with every day life situations. The 
> nature of our soceity forces us to do so. This is very similar to the basic 
> law of resistance "current will choose the path of least resistance". We 
> choose the easiest way out, this forces us to break religious and civil laws.

Well, if this is your point of view, I respect it, and:
 1. I don't agree with it.
 2. I don't think you can back it with evidence.

> A.Faris

Ahmad
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: rayes@Goat.mcs.kent.edu (Mohamed Omar Rayes)
Subject: HELP IS NEEDED
Reply-To: rayes@mcs.kent.edu
Organization: Dept. of Math and Computer Science
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 03:24:21 GMT

From msa-request@eleceng.ee.queensu.ca Thu Oct  8 22:57 EDT 1992
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Reply-To: HADDARA@SSCvax.CIS.McMaster.CA
Date: 08 Oct 1992 22:44:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Al-Muraqqash Al-Akbar <HADDARA@SSCvax.CIS.McMaster.CA>
Subject: Appeal for a brother
Message-Id: <01GPQ0VLWBF69I574V@SSCVAX.CIS.MCMASTER.CA>
To: msa@eleceng.ee.queensu.ca
Status: RO

Number: msa/08Oct92/452
Bismillahirrahmanirahim

    A Student's Life At ...................... from Islamic Center Of Minnesota

                           A Student's Life At Stake
                                      from
                          Islamic Center Of Minnesota

        Mr. Riaz Ahmad  Malik  (from  Pakistan),  a  Ph.D.  cadidate  of
        Anthropology in the  University  of Minnesota, has ben diagnosed
        having STOMACH  CANCER  (Gastric  Carcinoma)  in the last stage.
        According to the medical advisors, if treatment is delayed, this
        life-threatening disease can  spread  rapidly  to other parts of
        the body.

        As a last resort a prolonged and very painful medical treatement
        (Chemotherapy) has been recommended to save his life. Mr. Malik,
        unfortunately, can not afford this very expensive treatment. Mr.
        Malik has a wife  and  a  9  month  old  doaughter  as  his only
        immediate family in the U.S.

        Given the circumstances it is  our moral obligation to help save
        a human life. Please  pray  for  his  recovery  and if possible,
        please provide monetary help  to  Mr.  Malik and his family. You
        are requested to send you  donations  directly  to the following
        Bank Account, especially established for this purpose:

        RIAZ AHMAD and HAMIDA MALIK
        Account # 9861341157
        TCF BANK SAVINGS FSB
        2100 NORTH SNELLING AT COUNTY ROAD B
        ROSEVILLE, MN 55113

        Home Address:
        1019 East 29th Ave, SE
        Minneapolis, MN 55414

___________________________
HADDARA@SSCvax.CIS.McMaster.CA
From: ahmad@ra.cs.umb.edu (Ahmad Hashem)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Reason vs. Morals
Date: 13 Oct 92 05:17:14 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston

In article <1992Oct12.013111.2007@trl.oz.au> a.Faris@trl.oz.au writes:
>Where I am coming from, Ahmad, is that individualistic competition will lead
>a person to be in a state of war with everything around him. I know for a fact
>that people cannot live in that mode, otherwise, we will easily kill each other.

I see your point, but don't forget cases like the Eskimos where 
the elderly voluntarily stay behind the group and die in order to
save the travelling group from the burden of taking care of them.
Also, don't forget the sacrifices that individuals make for their
children, friends, countries, etc.  

As I said earlier, I am not denying the spirit of competition of individuals;
but at the same time I think we should not forget about the other side,
the generous communal side of our nature.

>MY reasoning is as follows: Survival, invidualistic thinking, and protection of
>our way of life are the central issues that will make us deviate from practicing
>reaoning and morality.Every society is driven by competitive forces that will
>make it very difficult for any person to practice any religion the way it was
>intended.
.
.
>
>I do not disagree with you that Islam does ... take both sides into account.
>As I said all religions attempt to do so, Islam comes closer than the others
>in bonding reasoning and morality. However, as I said above a person cannot
>practice both simultaniously at all times. You might think you do, but I say
>you have not been faced with the situation that will make deviate yet.

You are confusing the normal state with the state of emergency.  If you
insist that in emergencies (i.e., cases of extreme penury) people will
only look for survival (and this is something I will dispute in what follows)
then this hardly says anything about the normal state, which remains the rule.

But Islam also teaches its followers the principle of 'eethar' (altruism)
which is especially commendable in states of emergency.  There were cases 
after cases in the history of Islam when people practiced altruism even 
when they were in the most dire need (e.g., when several bleeding soldiers
were lying on the ground and all in need of water, the first refused
to drink when he heard the second saying "water!", same with the second,
and third.  When the fourth was offered water he was already dead; when water
was offered back to the third he was already dead; and the second and the 
first!  Could you tell me what happened to their individualistic impulses?)

>A.FAris

Ahmad
From: minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: PAL-NET
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:15:44 GMT
Organization: University of Cincinnati

In article <11257@crackers.clearpoint.com> martillo@nero.clearpoint.com (Joachim Martillo) writes:
>I received the following question via e-mail.
>
>Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1992 21:13 EDT
>From: John Sununu <RENGLE@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu>
>Subject: Pal-Net
>To: martillo@nero.clearpoint.com
>X-Vms-To: IN%"martillo@nero.clearpoint.com"
>X-Vms-Cc: RENGLE
>
>

[message deleted]
>
>
>-- 
>Joachim Carlo Santos Martillo Ajami
>
>The article represents noone's opinions other than the author's.

martillo actually received a message from john sununu? THE john sununu? not
that i actually believe the header that came with the message (i get the feeling
that martillo is concocting another one of his fairy tales again to make himself
look larger than life, yet again), but if it is true, then i guess i see why
the government is in the shape it is in.

zafar
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:4287 alt.wanted.moslem.gay:111
From: rdc@netcom.com (MR. COMMUNIST)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,alt.wanted.moslem.gay
Subject: Re: haha
Date: 15 Oct 92 19:07:02 GMT
Organization: Soviet Socialist Society, Incorp.

nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>ashamam@oak.math.ucla.edu (Asher Shamam) writes:
>>Q :what's the difference between a palestinean and a bucket of
>>camel shit ?
>>
>>A : the bucket

I think it's safe to assume the the Asher Shamam left his computer
account logged in and walked away, and someone else entered the post.
There is no need to continue this thread.

This is not productive:

>FUCK YOU ASSHOLE!


r.
-- 

IVAN IQTOVITCH,		"WORKERS UNITE  OVER IMPERIALIST PIG"
COMMUNIST PARTY,		--IVATOLI STEPHANIVIC,
MUSMAK DEVISION			  BRAVE MARTAR
From: awair@igc.apc.org (Arab World and Islamic Resources)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Marcel Khalife Concert - Toronto
Date: 9 Oct 92 05:35:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:cdp:1471800193:000:476
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!awair    Oct  8 22:35:00 1992


From: Arab World and Islamic Resources <awair>
Subject: Marcel Khalife Concert - Toronto

I am forwarding the following message from
From: CED14304@RYEVM.RYERSON.CA

    There will be a MARCEL KHALIFE concert in Toronto
    Sat. 31st October at Convacation Hall
    University of Toronto - located at Kings Circle.
    Tickets are $35 and $50.
If you would like to enquire about tickets, send e-mail to
CED1430@RYEVM.RYERSON.CA (Omar Sahib)


Jennifer Smith
awair@igc.apc.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
From: wowoc@acs.ucalgary.ca (Witold Owoc)
Subject: Broadcast TV
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 01:08:18 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, AB, Canada

Is anybody aware of any plans to change the system of
broadcast TV in Bulgaria from SECAM to PAL ?

Thank you in advance for any input - sorry I do not know Bulgarian.

Witold Owoc <wowoc@acs.ucalgary.ca>

#disclaimer "my.private.views"
From: shtono34@wharton.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
Subject: Emu, read this (others may skip)
Date: 8 Oct 92 23:40:02 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

Sorry to bother you all with this message. It is directed to just
a couple of people on the Net. My Email address has changed and this
is the only way of informing them. You guys can now get in touch with 
me by using the reply command.

-Vassil Shtonov
Xref: sparky soc.culture.bulgaria:1494 soc.culture.yugoslavia:9066
From: hlaban@mr.med.ge.com (Tom Hlaban 4-6341 MRCE)
Subject: adoption
Organization: GE Medical Systems, Magnetic Resonance
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 02:14:43 GMT

My wife and I are Americans in the process of adopting a 2 1/2 year old
girl who is currently living in an orphanage in Silistra.  Is there 
anyone on soc.culture.bulgaria with any sort of knowledge or experience
relevant to our situation?

-Tom Hlaban
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
Subject: Books in BG in NYC
From: <ANTHC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Saturday, 10 Oct 1992 03:36:27 EDT
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

Hi:
   Someone proposed last year, any source of information about Bulgaria

abroad to be posted on the Net.  I found two sources for books in BG in NYC.

1.  The New York Public Library

    Donnell branch (Foreign Languages, 2nd floor)

    20 West 53rd Street

      Really a small and poor collection.  Even Vasov is not there.  I wonder

why Bulgaria is wasting so much money to support radio and TV broadcasting in

NYC but never supply this library with more books in BG?

2.  Bible in BG is available in the book store of

    AMERICAN BIBLE SOCIETY

    1865 BROADWAY

    NEW YORK, NY 10023

      Two versions are available:

      a)  Thomson version.  Contain references.  (the Old and the New Testament
          flexable cover
          Item No. 103787    $7.00

          This is a revised edition.  The language is the current BG language.
          Different from the edition of the ABS from 'skoropechatnicata na
          Mateosyan ot Carigrad' which circulated in Bulgaria.
            I was surprised to reallize that it is the same Bible that
          I was offered in 'the sinodalnata knijarnica' in Sofia 'pod rafta'
          for 200 levs in 1988.  At that time 200 levs was my monthly income
          before taxes - average income in BG at that time.  My monthly income
          now in US $'s is $1,600.  It is the lowest earned by labor income in
          US today.  Can you imagine a Bible in America to be $1,600 !!!
            Now I know why Botev called them 'pravoslavni skotove'.  They are
          not spreading the Gospel.  They are trying TO SELL the Gospel.

         b)  Bulgarian New Testament.  Thomson version.  Small print.
         Hardcover.
         Item No. 103788   $3.00
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
From: cza@troy.uucp (C. Akgun)
Subject: Re: The Bulgarians were first in numbers and scholarships in Roberts College (Constantinople)
Organization: BCR, NJ-USA
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 15:33:57 GMT

In article <6418@m1.cs.man.ac.uk> lb@cs.man.ac.uk (Luben Boyanov) writes:
>Dear all,
>
>I'd like to say that I'm sorry that you had to see several postings
>(incl. mine) which were not appropriate for the moderate tone and
>tolerant behaviour of the participants of this newsgroup. My outrage
>was caused of the continuing trend of postings, attempting to portray in
>ugly light the Bulgarians and the Bulgarian nation. This have been used as a
>scapegoat for somebody's history 'excuses', but one must know that the story
>and history of the Balkans is rather different (and there are a lot of books
>on that subject). I thought for a while that there were some 'badly placed
>words' (only) which were nevertheless an insult to a nation, but after
>exposing the biased attitude and the bad tempered intentions of the authors
>of those postings, I decided that it's better not to come down to this level
>any more and to post something else which I read recently and is more
>appropriate for the newsgroup. It is about the Bulgarians and how they
>performed in Roberts' College - in Constantinople years before the liberation
>of Bulgaria. Oste vednij - sujaliavam, che ne se stupriaha i otgovorih na
>gadnite zabelejki i natiakvania otnosno nashata nazia.
>
>
>Now - here is some interesting text from a book ["Turkey in Europe",
>James Baker, London, Paris & New York, 1877 (3rd ed.)] describing

I am glad that you come to your senses and not to allow the
historical masturbation for the name of self serving revelation
by pseudo historians.  SCT and SCG have been ruined by those 
impostures.  

Now back to the topic, Robert College in Istanbul.  This has
college continued to be very successful after the Ottoman era 
which was ended in 1923.  It was an autonomous college which received
high level of grants from USA.  Most of the  faculty were
Americans (a few British also).  Teaching were done in
English.  In early 1970's this college was handed off to the
Turkish Goverment and became "Bosphorus University of Istanbul."
Teaching is still done in English.  Faculty are mostly
Turkish but still a few American professors are spending their
sabbatical leaves from US.  This school is currently ranked as 
third best place in Turkish educational system.  School of Engineering 
is the dominating faculty and the student body.  

The high-school still keeps the name "Robert College" and is
a private school.  Teaching were still done by some Americans (Peace
Core people) until the late 1970's.  They accept students
if they pass their enterance exam.  It is very highly sought private 
school by the Turkish elite to get their kids in for high school 
education.  Some of the students are the American children who are 
with their families working for American or Turkish companies.

C. Akgun
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
From: es182@albnyvms.bitnet
Subject: Travel to Bulgaria
Reply-To: es182@albnyvms.bitnet
Organization: University of NY at Albany
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 18:29:41 GMT

In response to Daniel's posting:

I've investigated, I think, all the possibilities of flying to Bulgaria.
With one exception, all fares originating in US and going to Bulgarian
are over $1000. The exception: Jesair which runs NY-Sofia for a bit over
$600. Other possibilities: fly to Greece or Turkey with tickets purchased
from wholesalers in New York, and then go on by ground.

Ernie Scatton
From: lb@cs.man.ac.uk (Luben Boyanov)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
Subject: What Bulgarians in the USA think on the elections
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:01:00 GMT
Organization: Dept Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K.


there and the politicians who are running for President. I've watched the 2
debates so far and was impressed by 1 politician only (Al Gore). I'd be
curious to hear what and how Bulgarians think on the performance of all
candidates (if somebody wishes to spare few moments for such 'gossip').

Best regards

Luben

PS. I heard that BG lost by Sweden (in soccer) but does anybody know the
result? 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
From: mihov@kronecker.mit.edu (Diko Mihov)
Subject: Round 10 Results
Organization: MIT Department of Mathematics, Cambridge, MA
Distribution: soc.culture.bulgaria
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 21:38:40 GMT

From rec.sport.soccer:


:Round 10 Bulgaria
:>
:Haskovo    3-0 Yantra
:Dobrudja   2-1 Chernomorets
:Lok GO     1-1 Slavia
:Lok Pl     1-3 Levski
:Lok So     2-1 Sliven
:Spartak V  1-1 Etar
:Beroe      4-0 Pirin
:CSKA       3-1 Botev Pl
:>
:--
:-- Karel Stokkermans, RISC-Linz, Schloss Hagenberg, Austria, Europa
: -- email: kstokker@risc.uni-linz.ac.at (or k314070@edvz.uni-linz.ac.at)
:"O hoe vergeefs / des doelmans hand / zich strekte naar de bal    [  21-6-88,  ]
: die 'een minuut / voor tijd de Duitse / doellijn kruiste..."     [ J. Deelder ]

Cheers,
Diko
From: lb@cs.man.ac.uk (Luben Boyanov)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
Subject: Querry (JUNK - sorry)
Date: 9 Oct 92 09:59:12 GMT
Distribution: uk
Organization: Dept Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K.


Sorry to use this forum, but I've failed to reach Marin Guenov 5 - 6 times
this morning via the email and all addresses I tried there. Could you Marin
give me a hint what I must do to send you my reply successfully?

Regards

Luben
From: daniel@danbo.bg (Daniel Kalchev)
Subject: Travel from USA to Bulgaria
Organization: Digital Systems
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 19:51:53 GMT

Dear friends,

I friend of mine from USA would like to visit Bulgaria, but needs to
do it as cheap as possible. I recall someone posting their experiences
here some weeks ago, but unfortunately lost them. I will be
very grateful if you share your experience.

I did already consult the BALKAN office here, and they said that the
nice Air France deal I used to travel to USA ($574 round trip, with a
night in Paris :) is available only if the trip starts here. They
said that if the trip starts from USA, it would cost twice as much.
I don't feel like buying two tickets starting from Bulgaria. <grin>

Thanks in advance,
Daniel
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria
From: st923042@pip.cc.brandeis.edu
Subject: Re: Emu, read this (others may skip)
Reply-To: st923042@pip.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 05:49:13 GMT

Hey Lyonya! Guess who? How are you doing?
Ivan Hristov     
Xref: sparky soc.culture.bulgaria:1492 soc.culture.greek:9565 soc.culture.yugoslavia:9063
From: lb@cs.man.ac.uk (Luben Boyanov)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Tsar Samuel as an anscestor of Sisman
Date: 8 Oct 92 16:17:16 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.bulgaria
Organization: Dept Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K.


Hi,

Despite that I remember seeing the same information somewhere else more
recently time, I've just found 2 sources (AR said that he wanted to 'nail' them
or something like this) supporting what I said that I remember reading that
Samuil was an anscestor of Sisman:


"In the very year (976) in which Basil mounted the throne at
Constantinople, Tsar Samuel, son of the successful rebel chieftain, Sisman,
took control over the western section of Bulgaria not included in the
recent conquest of John Zimisces." page 109, [1].

and

"But it was the west the Shishman dynasty remained, and the glory and
extend soon outstripped Simeon's achievements. In 976 Samuel, the fourth
son of Shishman, succeeded to his father's dominions over the western or
Macedonian regions of Bulgaria." page 13, [2].



[1] "The Balkan Peninsula and the near East", Schevill, F., G. Bell and sons,
Ltd, New York, 1922 (repr by Arno Press  1971).

[2] "Macedonia, Bulgaria" vol. IV., Peace Handbooks, (Issued by the Hist.
Section of the British foreign office 1920).


Regards

Luben


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Let us not allow splits and splintering to frighten us. It is, indeed, a
pity, but what can we do, since we are Bulgarians and all suffer from one
common disease"
				Gotse Delchev
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky soc.culture.bulgaria:1490 soc.culture.asean:6799 soc.culture.bangladesh:5088
From: silatman@hls.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bulgaria,soc.culture.asean,soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Nationwide Demo for Bosnia,Fri Oct16
Date: 8 Oct 92 19:45:17 GMT