HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jmb@ukc.ac.uk (J.M.Bremner)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: ATSF business cars derailed?
Date: 9 Apr 92 19:36:02 GMT
Reply-To: jmb@ukc.ac.uk (Mike Bremner)
Organization: Institute of Mathematics and Statistics, University of Kent

In article <11228@mindlink.bc.ca> Steve_Hooper@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Hooper) writes:

> . . . . any business or private car we haul on CP, occupied or deadheading,
>always goes on the tail end.  Usually the business cars are put on a shortened
>version of a grain train (usually about 75 cars as compared to the normal 112)

I'm surprised to hear that, since I'd have thought that, even with a
somewhat shortened train, the ride could be somewhat uncomfortable.
Weren't caboose crews expected to wear safety harnesses?

I must admit that, on the only occasion I've ridden in the brake van of a
freight train in this country, I found it surprisingly smooth.  This was
on a loose-coupled train of about forty short-wheelbase four-wheel wagons
with no continuous brake (i.e. a few years ago!), and was accomplished
without any appreciable shocks while starting and stopping, and without
using the van brake on the downhill stretches.
From: eddie@railnet.nshore.ORG (Eddie Van Huffel)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Playing Chicken!!!
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 92 14:40:21 EDT
Organization: Railnet BBS (phone # changing April 1992)

mef@cs.rit.edu (Mark E Fischer) writes:

> Some people have some very strange reasoning why grade crossing accidents 
> happen.  I few years back I had a long discussion with a woman who
> insisted that there were electromagnetic forces in the rails that cause 
> cars to stall on the tracks and jam the car doors shut so that you can't
> get out.  That was here explanation and and hours worth of discussion 
> couldn't convince her otherwise.
> 
> Sigh... How can you argue with logic like that?
> 
> 
> 


BUT OF COURSE THERE ARE DEFINITELY THOSE FORCES.  I HAVE SEEN THEM AT WORK.  
HOWEVER, WE KNOW THEM BY DIFFERENT NAMES, PRIMARILY STUPIDITY, AND PANIC
                                                    ^^^^^^^^^      ^^^^^
AND THEY RUN RAMPANT AROUND DRIVERS STALLED ON RAILROAD TRACKS.

--
eddie@railnet.nshore.ORG (Eddie Van Huffel)
Railnet BBS (phone # changing April 1992)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: eoliver@laurel.ocs.mq.edu.au (Eddie Oliver)
Subject: Re: Electromagnetic Fields (was RE: Playing Chicken)
Keywords: track circuits, train orders 
Organization: Macquarie University, Australia.
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 07:57:23 GMT

In article <11442@mindlink.bc.ca> Steve_Hooper@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Hooper) writes:
>> 
>Perfect, 100% ballast.  Thus the CPR has been hauling ballast out of there and
>spreading it far and wide.  Very economical stuff.
>
>BUT, recently a number of signal malfunctions were attributed to the ballast.
>It seems that the high content of lead and zinc in the ballast was actually
>high enough to short the rail circuits and trigger signal systems!
>
>Needless to say, they have not hauled ballast out of there for a few years now.

Why not? Surely there are still many sections of track on CP which are not
track-circuited? Can't they still use it on branch lines, sidings etc.?

Which raises a broader question. What is current Canadian practice for operating
trains on unsignalled lines? There has been some intermittent discussion here
and in the signalling mailing list re the demise of train orders, and their
replacement by other systems which seem to many of us just to be train orders
under another name, or with extra restrictions; but I don't recall much debate
about the current practices on CN, CP, BCR etc.

Eddie Oliver
From: Steve_Hooper@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Hooper)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: More injuries
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:28:32 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world


Here's a good one, just happened a few days ago.

Some kid was putting his fingers on the track, taking them off, putting them
on, taking them off etc while a train barreled down on him.

He lost four fingers.

Some stupid local kid.


--

 steve_hooper@mindlink.bc.ca   []  Riding the "High Iron" of
 OR      a777@mindlink.bc.ca   []         CP Rail
 The Great White North in      []
 Vancouver, BC CANADA          [] Opinions are mine, NOT CP's
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: andradee@woods.ulowell.edu
Subject: SPV (Was Re: RDC's and SPV's?)
Organization: University of Lowell
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 18:19:18 GMT

In article <1992Apr12.035741.1952@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>, elw4@po.CWRU.Edu (Evan L. Werkema) writes:
> 
> Ed Andradee writes:
> 
>> the years, it sounds like the RDC's and SPV's were/are very unreliable units.
>                                          ^^^
>   What is an SPV?  I know what RDC's are (Santa Fe had some) but I've never
> heard of SPV's (Santa Fe didn't have any).  Thanks.
> 

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I know, SPV stands for
Self Propeled Vehicle. This I am REALLY uncertain of, but I believe that as far
as the US is concerned, they only ran in the east, maybe as far as Chicago? But
I could not prove this if asked!

BTW thanks to everyone who responed to my origianal post. It has been real
enlighting to read all this on the RDC's. Personally, I think that they are
some of the neatest passenger vehicals produced. If that unoffical running of
over 100mph is correct, that makes me feel good, because I have 2 models of the
RDC's and the one that is powered can reach about 120mph scale. I guess they
could really move. Again thanks....

				Ed Andrade
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: kls@ditka.Chicago.COM (Karl Swartz)
Subject: Re: SP/SF merger paint scheme spotted
Organization: Chicago Software Works
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 06:24:10 GMT

In article <1992Apr7.155023.12133@wdl.loral.com> gjs@wdl30.wdl.loral.com (Gregory Scott) writes:
>Both units were extremely dirty.

Assuming you were talking about SP and not ATSF units, is this not
redundant?  I believe a finish coat of "grime" is required before
they even leave the paint shop.  :-)

-- 
Karl Swartz		|INet	kls@ditka.chicago.com
1-415/854-3409		|UUCP	uunet!decwrl!ditka!kls
			|Snail	2144 Sand Hill Rd., Menlo Park CA 94025
"Unix is a fractal thicket." (Mark Barnett)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: jimsp@strider (James Spears)
Subject: Re: SP/SF merger paint scheme spotted
Organization: Intel Development Tools Operation, Hillsboro, OR
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 15:46:03 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.062410.14175@ditka.Chicago.COM> kls@ditka.Chicago.COM (Karl Swartz) writes:
>In article <1992Apr7.155023.12133@wdl.loral.com> gjs@wdl30.wdl.loral.com (Gregory Scott) writes:
>>Both units were extremely dirty.

>Assuming you were talking about SP and not ATSF units, is this not
>redundant?  I believe a finish coat of "grime" is required before
>they even leave the paint shop.  :-)

>Karl Swartz		|INet	kls@ditka.chicago.com

No No No! This is a common misconception but in reality a lot of the SP's new
power is delivered to Oregon (for sales tax reasons) and is allowed to run up 
some mileage until th units are no longer *new* then they go to Califorina after
a trip to the shops Eugene Oregon fo the offical coat of grime :-)

Sorry I could not help my self.
James

-- 
James Spears           General Manager C. E. Keen Flume & Lumber Co.  ---------
                              Steam Forever! 4-8-4's have more fun!   | PLATE |
jimsp@strider1.hf.intel.com      Pacific Railroad Preservation Assoc. |   C   |
Intel, Hillsboro, Or.               and Railfan at large.........     ---------
From: eddie@railnet.nshore.ORG (Eddie Van Huffel)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Capitol Limited Timetable
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 16:27:32 EDT
Distribution: na
Organization: Railnet BBS +1 216 883 6298

       RAILNET BBS   (216)883-6298   AMTRAK SCHEDULES
                   C A P I T O L / T B L
 
In Cleveland, call  861-0105 or 696-5115 for more information.
Tell the ticket agent where  you  saw this notice. Elsewhere,
call (800)USA-RAIL or your travel agent.
 
---------------------------------------------------------------
             T h e  C A P I T O L  L I M I T E D
 
       Sleeping car service- roomettes and bedrooms
    (First Class service including complimentary meals)
      with complimentary coffee, tea and orange juice
                     served 6:30-9:30am.
                 Reserved coach service (Dome).
                   Dining and Lounge service:
       Complete meals, sandwiches, snacks and beverages.
       Checked baggage handled (see agent for exceptions)
 
 30.......................Train Number.....................29
Daily    Effective Apr. 5, 1992 Thru Oct. 24, 1992       Daily
---------------------------------------------------------------
 4 45p  780       CHICAGO,IL -Union Sta. (CDT)       Ar   8 45a
 5 12p  764       Hammond-Whiting,IN (CDT)                7 52a
 6 14p  696       South Bend,IN (EST)                     6 50a
 6 38p  679       Elkhart, IN                             6 25a
 7 35p  624       Waterloo, IN (EST)                      5 34a
10 05p  546 Dp    TOLEDO, OH (EST)                        5 20a
11 22p  464       Elyria, OH                              3 29a
11 59p  439       Cleveland, OH                           2 57a
 1 22a  383       Alliance, OH                            1 27a
 3 15a  300    Ar PITTSBURGH,PA -Amtrak Sta.         Dp  11 42a
 3 30a  300    Dp                                    Ar  11 27a
 4 56a  240       Connellsville,PA                        9 31p
 7 31a  148       Cumberland,MD                           7 16p
 8 56a   74       Martinsburg,WV                          5 41p
 9 18p   56       Harpers Ferry,WV                        5 19p
10 00p   17       Rockville,MD                            4 37p
10 42p    0    Ar Washington,DC (EDT)                Dp   4 15p
|-------------------------------------------------------------|
| Train 174           (Connecting train)             Train 181|
|                        Through coach                        |
| 12 10p    0  Dp Washington,DC (EDT)             Ar  2 49p   |
| 12 45p   40     Baltimore, MD                       1 54p   |
|  1 57p  135     Philadelphia,PA-30th St. Sta.      12 49p   |
|  3 27p  225  Ar New York, NY-Penn. Sta. (EST)   Dp 11 20a   |
|-------------------------------------------------------------|




--
eddie@railnet.nshore.ORG (Eddie Van Huffel)
Railnet BBS +1 216 883 6298
From: calizan@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (PAUL LIZANICH)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Electromagnetic Fields (was RE: Playing Chicken)
Date: 13 Apr 92 19:50:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: lims02.13APR199214505450
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

The only rails I know of which would emit an EMF would be those on a model 
railroad.  They could have some sort of field on them, especially those 
modelers who have a command control waveform running on their rails.  

Just a thought,
Paul01

PS
Please no flames for mentioning 'm---l railroads on rec.RR
From: rambler@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Dan Meyer)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Morris and Essex Timetable
Date: 15 Apr 92 00:25:02 GMT
Organization: People-Net [pnet51], Minneapolis, MN.

brennan@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Joseph Brennan) writes:
>
>                NJ TRANSIT RAIL OPERATIONS  SCHEDULES
>        As Seen on the Railway Roast Office BBS (212) 555-5555
>
>             M O R R I S   A N D   E S S E X   L I N E S
>
>                  effective 07-27-1991 to 04-04-1992
>
>For more information call (800) USA-RAIL or your travel agent.

I hope that this isn't serious; I am getting a kick out of it, however
Remember: " Buffalo never Oink " Seen on a South Dakota travel brocure.
Advertisment: Try the Railway Post Office , a railfan BBS ! (612) 377-2197.
UUCP: {crash tcnet}!orbit!pnet51!rambler
INET: rambler@pnet51.orb.mn.org
From: rad@railnet.nshore.ORG (Rick DeMattia)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Rail Maps - Wisc,Mich
Date: Wed, 08 Apr 92 22:05:18 EDT
Organization: Railnet BBS +1 216 883 6298

Regarding US state railroad maps - I have used the USGS state
maps - they are generally much older than the section maps (topographical
maps) - the one for Ohio dates from 1952 - and they show railroads,
rivers and streams but not highways.  Kind of nice for the railfan.

--
UUCP: {uunet|backbone}!nshore!railnet!rad   rad@railnet.nshore.org
CompuServe: 72517.666@compuserve.COM
From: wes@uf.msc.edu (Wes Barris)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: RR GIF - WM #1204 M-2 Challenger
Keywords: WM Challenger Cumberland AJ-12
Date: 6 Apr 92 18:49:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: uc.1992Apr6.184923.11368
Reply-To: wes@msc.edu
Organization: AHPCRC

In article <1992Apr6.152908.11397@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>, 2212msr@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (max.s.robin) writes:
|> The GIF inquestion pictures Western Maryland ry. M-2 #1204.  This was a
|> Baldwin built Challenger (4-6-64, 1940 construction date) typically used
|> on the Connellsville Extension.  (For those of yoo who are not WM knowledgable,
|> this was the mainline from Cumberland Md to Connellsville PA, where the 
|> WM interchanged w/the P&WV.)
|> 
|> The photo was take in the Cumberland narrows just west of town.  To the 
|> left of the locomotive, and about 40' lower down is US Highway 40, and 
|> across the river to the left is the B&O mainline which heads over Sand 
|> Patch toward Chicago.
|> 
|> I believe that this 'photo was one taken by Bill Price, a Cumberland newspaper
|> photographer and rabid WM fan.  Date would be probably be spring '52.
|> 

Thank you for providing this information.  Check out the article entitled
"Challengers over the Alleghenies" in Trains magazine, April 1992 pages
48-55.  It is easy to see that this engine (c_and_o_steam.gif) is a sister
to those shown in this article.

This image would be better names wm1204.gif or something similar.
-- 
      o o o o o o o . . .   ________________________________ _____=======_T___
    o      _____           ||Wes Barris                    | | wes@msc.edu   |
  .][__n_n_|DD[  ====|____  |Minnesota Supercomputer Center| |(612) 626-8090 |
 >(________|__|_[___/_____]_|University of Minnesota_______|_|_FAX: 626-1596_|_
 _/oo OOOOOO o`  ooo   ooo  'o^o^o                    o^o^o` 'o^o         o^o`
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Make yourself into a sheep, and you'll meet a wolf nearby. -- Russian proverb
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: cthorne@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Charles E Thorne)
Subject: Re: Crossing Gate Rules and Laws
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 20:44:58 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.131546.33@physc1.byu.edu> hansend@physc1.byu.edu writes:
>The discussion of the "car attacking the train" has jogged my memory
>about something I would like to ask the train drivers, and anyone else
>who may have an answer.  When I used to live in Los Angeles, I would
>cross a track about 1/2 mile from my work place.  Once in a while, there
>would be a crew out working this track doing some switching and stuff,
>and the gates would be down though they would not cross the road at all.
>Of course, in Los Angeles, this would result in a large amount of
>traffic stopped because of the gates.  Question:  What rules, laws,
>etc., apply in a situation like this, where the gates are activated by
>switching activity, or a parked string of cars, but the train is not
>crossing the road on a regular basis, if it crosses it at all?

I think that the railroad owns the right-of-way.  They're only allowing
the cars to cross to be "nice guys".  If you go around the closed gate, and
the train strikes you, it was your fault.

Charlie
From: Steve_Hooper@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Hooper)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: ATSF business cars derailed?
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:24:16 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

> J.M.Bremner writes:
> 
> Msg-ID: <686@eagle.ukc.ac.uk>
> Posted: 9 Apr 92 19:36:02 GMT
> 
> Org.  : Institute of Mathematics and Statistics, University of Kent
> 
> In article <11228@mindlink.bc.ca> Steve_Hooper@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Hooper)
> writes:
> 
> > . . . . any business or private car we haul on CP, occupied or deadheading,
> >always goes on the tail end.  Usually the business cars are put on a
> shortened
> >version of a grain train (usually about 75 cars as compared to the normal
> 112)
> 
> I'm surprised to hear that, since I'd have thought that, even with a
> somewhat shortened train, the ride could be somewhat uncomfortable.
> Weren't caboose crews expected to wear safety harnesses?


Nope.  Cn cabs are equipped with seat belts, but ours are not.

> 
> 
> I must admit that, on the only occasion I've ridden in the brake van of a
> freight train in this country, I found it surprisingly smooth.  This was
> on a loose-coupled train of about forty short-wheelbase four-wheel wagons
> with no continuous brake (i.e. a few years ago!), and was accomplished
> without any appreciable shocks while starting and stopping, and without
> using the van brake on the downhill stretches.


Hey, try riding one on a hotshot container/pig train in mountain country!
There's enough slack to rattle your teeth, break your arm, or throw you from
one end to the other.

As for business cars on the tail-end, the hogs just take it a little easier,
use the air more often (power-brake) etc etc.

Although one day I do recall, we were following a train into the main yard.  He
had a business car on his tail-end, and whoever was on it would NOT shut off
the inspection lights.  We closed right up to 3 car lengths and stopped...the
entire time flicking our lights.  Some bonehead finally figured it out and shut
them off.  After sitting for ten minutes, 5 officials came out on to the
tail-end platform.  Just then the hog got the OK to pull it in to the yard, and
when he started pulling, he just about tossed five brass into the ballast!  Too
funny to watch! :)


--

 steve_hooper@mindlink.bc.ca   []  Riding the "High Iron" of
 OR      a777@mindlink.bc.ca   []         CP Rail
 The Great White North in      []
 Vancouver, BC CANADA          [] Opinions are mine, NOT CP's
From: gurd@next04wor.wam.umd.edu (Daffy Duck)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: ATE
Date: 16 Apr 92 00:47:26 GMT
Reply-To: gurd@wam.umd.edu

M00209@MBVM.Mitre.Org writes
> I lost the note, but somebody asked yesterday about ATE.
>  
> ATE I believe stands for "American Transit Enterprises".  It is a  
transit
> management firm which manages and either operates or hires operators for  
many
> municipal transit agencies (local Transit Authorities, etc.) all over  
the
> country.  I believe that in most cases, they merely manage the operation  
and
> hire somebody else to actually run and maintain the busses, but I may be  
wrong
> on this.  CalTrain was their only venture into "heavy" rail - don't know  
if
> they are involved in San Jose or any other "light" rail cities.
>  

ATE is a subsidiary of Ryder (yeah the same people who rent trucks), one  
of the largest transporation companies in the United States.  You are  
right, in that ATE provides "management" to local transit agencies  
throughtout the US, on a contract basis.  However, they also actually  
operate a few bus services including one in Montgomery County, where I  
live.  
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: pierson@cimcad.enet.dec.com (Dave Pierson)
Subject: Re: Crossing Gate Rules and Laws
Keywords: Grade Corssings, RUles, Laws, USA
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date:  7 APR 92 12:26:11    

In article <1992Apr6.131546.33@physc1.byu.edu>, hansend@physc1.byu.edu
writes, in  part:

>The discussion of the "car attacking the train" has jogged my memory
>about something I would like to ask the train drivers, and anyone else
>who may have an answer.

>Question:  What rules, laws, etc., apply in a situation like this, where the
>gates are activated by switching activity, or a parked string of cars, but the
>train is not crossing the road on a regular basis, if it crosses it at all? 
	I can speak best for Massachussetts, tho such things are, i think fairly
	similarly handled:
		State law says a crossing may not be blocked for more than
		5 minutes.  (blocked means train present, or gates down).

	If a train is stopped, in theory, the crew must cut the train.  Penalty
	is a fine.  Most grade crossing control gear is fitted with a (locked)
	cutout, which allows the crew to manually control the gates.

	The RR "operating Rules" will usually have language like:
		"In accordance with state law <mumble>, section <fratz> any
		train blocking a Grade crossing for longer than <foo> must...
	etc.

	Crossings of busy urban streets can have fairly complex controls ranging
	from full, manual, local, attended control to crossing gates coupled to
	CTC for remote operation.

thanks
dave pierson			|the facts, as accurately as i can manage,
Digital Equipment Corporation	|the opinions, my own.
200 Forest St			|I am the NRA.
Marlboro, Mass		01752	pierson@cimnet.enet.dec.com
"He has read everything, and, to his credit, written nothing."  A J Raffles
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: andradee@woods.ulowell.edu
Subject: RDC's and SPV's?
Organization: University of Lowell
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 15:03:24 GMT

Could someone please answer this question for me? I am young, and so do not
have first hand knowledge of all the details, but from what I have heard over
the years, it sounds like the RDC's and SPV's were/are very unreliable units.
Why is this? IS this because of a fault in the design of these units, of what?
Any insight would be appriciated.
		Thanks.......
				Ed A.
From: gregg@zehntel (Gregg Fuhriman)
Subject: Another SP auto-bash
Reply-To: gregg@zehntel (Gregg Fuhriman)
Organization: Zehntel, Inc. Walnut Creek, CA
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:22:29 GMT

Yet another "SP train munches auto" story:

On April 7, in E. Martinez, CA (Avon) a pickup tried to beat an SP switcher
at a crossing with no gates (just flashers).  The switcher cleanly broad-sided
the pickup, injuring the driver and pinning him in the vehicle.  The stupid
thing about this is that the switcher was LIGHT ... it was pulling no train
at all.  If the pickup driver had waited 5 SECONDS, the crossing would have
been clear.  This happened in broad daylight ... I can't imagine what the
driver was thinking.   Needless to say, his truck was very mashed, even though
the switcher was probably only going about 10 MPH.  It was out the next day
switching again, with no apparent damage to its front pilot.

							FCF
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: dave@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (David A Rasmussen)
Subject: Re: SPV (Was Re: RDC's and SPV's?)
Originator: dave@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
Reply-To: dave@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 22:22:30 GMT

From article <1992Apr13.131918.1@woods.ulowell.edu>, by andradee@woods.ulowell.edu:
> BTW thanks to everyone who responed to my origianal post. It has been real
> enlighting to read all this on the RDC's. Personally, I think that they are
> some of the neatest passenger vehicals produced. If that unoffical running of
> over 100mph is correct, that makes me feel good, because I have 2 models of the

I didn't see the original posting, but I recall a couple summers ago when I went
to ride the soon to be abandoned VIA trackage in eastern canada that the CP
line between Quebec City and Montreal via Trois Riveres was 90mph for
RDC's, and I got to sit in the drivers seat in the back. It was kinda scary
over not the smoothest jointed rail.

-- 
Dave Rasmussen - Systems Programmer/Manager, UW-Milwaukee Computing Svcs Div.
Internet:dave@uwm.edu, Uucp:uwm!dave, Bitnet:dave%uwm.edu@INTERBIT
AT&T:414-229-5133 USmail:Box 413 EMS380,Milwaukee,WI 53201

Newsgroups: rec.railroad