HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Timothy.J.Young@dartmouth.edu (Timothy J. Young)
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: Re: Rivendell (was Re: ALBUM BOUT)
Date: 25 Jan 93 03:11:30 GMT
 <1jurifINNlns@cat.cis.Brown.EDU> <1993Jan24.235142.9313@wam.umd.edu>  
 <1993Jan24.205546.10137@iscsvax.uni.edu>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

In article <1993Jan24.205546.10137@iscsvax.uni.edu>
wipperma9340@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:

> Perhaps I should add the level of Satanic influence as another thing by which
> to compare albums.  With Rush there's plenty of that to go around.

Well, has anyone ever thought about that stuff they say at the
beginning of "Witch Hunt". It sounds like some kind of incantation. For
that matter, what's that mumbling about nine minutes thru "The Camera
Eye"?



Tim Young, Dartmouth College, Class of '96
"Not everyone can carry the weight of the world..." -R.E.M.
The opinions expressed here are not necessarily those of Dartmouth
College or any of its students...
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
From: Timothy.J.Young@dartmouth.edu (Timothy J. Young)
Subject: Re: The meaning of "The Trees"
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
 <108426@bu.edu>  <108428@bu.edu>
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 07:17:04 GMT

In article <108428@bu.edu>
jaeger@buphy.bu.edu (Gregg Jaeger) writes:

>  So the maples formed a union
> >> And demanded equal rights.
> >> "These oaks are just too greedy;
> >> We will make them give us light."
> >> Now there's no more oak oppression,
> >> For they passed a noble law,
> >> And the trees are all kept equal
> >> By hatchet, axe, and saw.

  I don't know, it sounds really political. Do the lyrics imply that it
shouldn't have been this way (thus being an anti-collectivist song) or
that the "oaks" learned their lesson for "ignoring their pleas" and
wondering "why the maples can't be happy in their shade." 
  Someone e-mailed me and said this :
     Oaks = U.S.  and     Maples = Canada
I suppose the song could be taken to mean that the U.S. grabs all the
light and treats Canada almost like a "child" or a protectorate.


  How about that one?  Those of us who are Canadian might not like that
much.
Personally, I think you guys handled that upside-down Canadian flag at
the World Series thing well. Could you imagine what would have happened
if Canada did that to the U.S?  They'd be rednecks out there burning
Rush records...   

-Tim Young, Dartmouth College, Class of '96
The opinions expressed here are not necessarily those of Dartmouth
College, its students, or anyone else.
"Not everyone can carry the weight of the world..."- R.E.M.
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
From: "mike rizzello" <mike.rizzello@canrem.com>
Subject: album bout #2
Reply-To: "mike rizzello" <mike.rizzello@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: alt
Date: 27 Jan 93 16:40:39 EST

WI>ALBUM BOUT #2

WI>All the World's a Stage v. A Show of Glands . . . I mean Hands

     Please, don't bore me!  ASOH is the clear winner!  It excells in
   "crispocity" and  quality.  Besides, the material is much better.
   I must proclaim a "no contest" here.  Although ATWAS is a heavy rocking
   album, I just seems to drag on, and on and on and onnnnnnnnnnnn....zzzzz.
   Although "What You're Doing" (missing from CD ver.) is its highest point,
   the thing as a whole cannot compare to ASOH.

     I would have prefered a battle between ESL and ATWAS or ASOH.

WI>My preference in #1:  Hold Your Fire.  As a matter of fact, it's may favorite
WI>album of all time- even though I'm comparing it to things that are completely
WI>different.  Mission= total genius; Tai Shan: cool; Prime Mover:  rocks;  High
WI>Water: awesome; et al (insert praise here)

  Can't agree with you more.  Mission is +'ively genuis, and Ften is the
ultimate experience on a surround sound system!   Once again a not contest
between FBN.

  How about HYF versus Presto?

    My opinion- It would be like a battle between the Bulls vs. the Bears!
                   Unimaginable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  (see SNL take off of
                                                          Jepoardy)


 * OLX 2.1 TD * This is a BRAG line, and I'm proud of it!
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: Timothy.J.Young@dartmouth.edu (Timothy J. Young)
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: Dumb Question about Trees
Date: 24 Jan 93 00:40:16 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH
X-Posted-From: InterNews1.0a5@newshost.dartmouth.edu

Fellows,
        This may be dumb question, but in the Trees,what is Peart
writing about? Is it about race relations? Is it about Quebec vs.
English Canada? Is it about liberalism/socialism in general?  I'm not
quite clear, though I have a basic handle on it. Also, is Rush becoming
politically more liberal? Their earlier lyrics seem to often be
rightist Ayn Rand-derived stuff, whereas in songs like "The Big Money"
and "Red Tide" Peart seems to be more politically liberal...

Just wondering...

-Tim Young, Dartmouth College Class of '96
(Insert disclaimer here.)
 
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
From: moleface@next09cville.wam.umd.edu (Moleface)
Subject: Re: Album bouts
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 05:56:11 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.230900.10084@iscsvax.uni.edu>  
wipperma9340@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
> In an attempt to add more excitement to the net, I have a new idea.  How  
about
> Album bouts?  It entails taking one album and placing it in the ring  
with
> another in order to see how the two compare.
> 
> RUSH ALBUM BOUT #1
>         Hold Your Fire v. Fly by Night
> 
> How about it?  Which one do you think is better and why?
> 
> If people like the idea, I'll present my opinion- and bout #2- in a few  
days.
> 
> Yours etc.,
> 
> The Analog Kid

Hold Yer Fire, definitely.  It's a more mature work, both musically and  
lyrically.  FbN does have moments, such as "Anthem" (although sometimes I  
think that they hit that E after the chorus a couple too many times) and  
the 'Of the Battle' section of "By-Tor."  The rest of the song, IMHO,  
lyrically doesn't sound very Peartinant; I actually think it's a bit  
goofy.  But on the whole I do like the album, especially "In the End."  I  
just think HYF is a better package on the whole.  I don't know HOW in the  
hell Geddy sang and played the bass at the same time on "Turn the Page" (I  
just remembered: multiple tracking.  Still, it musta been hell to do in  
concert).  Also, "force Ten" and "Lock and Key" are two incredibly power-  
ful songs, even if I don't know what the former's about.
From: esuyn@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr J Currid)
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: Re: Satanism and Humor (was Re: Rivendell (was Re: ALBUM BOUT)
Date: 28 Jan 1993 15:20:31 -0000
Organization: Computing Services, University of Warwick, UK
NNTP-Posting-Host: oregano.csv.warwick.ac.uk

In article <1993Jan28.023809.21084@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> jm012b@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Jeffrey P. Moon) writes:
>
>>   How does one listen to backward satanic messages if one has to look
>>so hard for them, anyway. This was one thing I was always unclear on...
>>That's why I thought that whole Judas Priest thing was a riot...
>
>
>	I also thought the whole Judas Priest controversy was a riot, too.
>Actually, I decided one day to try and find that "DO IT" message in there...
>
>	About a minute and a half into the song, I heard... very faintly,
>but distinguishably... what sounded like a person muttering DO IT. I can't
>tell if it was purposely said or if an instrument is creating that sound...

I think it may be of use to interject my offering here...
IMO, one does not look for backward satanic messages. The case in question
is of course one specific example, but there is a whole broader sphere of
subliminal suggestion/broadcasting that operates on a subconscious level
whereby people are influenced in ways they never even realised. There have
been cases of supermarkets playing tapes over the PA during which there
are instantaneous messages to 'buy such and such' or cinemas that show 
advertisements containing instantaneous pictures of hot deserts and the like.
The point is that you may not notice it but your brain does, and it triggers
thirst in you, for example, making you go and buy a drink. 
Subliminal suggestion in this form as far as I am aware is illegal, but
that is what the whole issue of these satanic messages was all about,
wasn't it?
Maybe Rush even put subliminal messages in their songs like 'spend lots
of money on Rush material'...

John 
Warwick
From: wipperma9340@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: The meaning of "The Trees"
Date: 25 Jan 93 18:49:33 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

Neil said that "The Trees" is "An allegorical metaphor on human behavior."

Yours etc.,

The Analog Kid
From: dan@rat.csc.calpoly.edu (Dan Delany)
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: FAQ: Changes to Rush Fans Frequently Asked Questions
Date: 24 Jan 93 08:30:22 GMT
Organization: The Rat's Nest, Cal Poly SLO


Rush FAQ: Changes since last posting

A few lines around each change are shown to give you an idea of the context.

Lines that have been added have a + in the first column.
Lines that have been deleted have a - in the first column.
Lines that have been modified have a ! in the first column.  The old form of
the line is shown first, then the new form is shown.

Special note for the Jan 24 1993 update:  There have been lots of small
changes - spelling fixes, reformatting, and that sort of thing.  I've
adjusted the relevant files so that only the informational changes
are in the diffs.

 ----- Changes to faq.header -----

No differences encountered

 ----- Changes to faq.1 -----

*** /tmp/da8042	Sun Jan 24 00:30:10 1993
--- faq.1	Wed Jan 20 08:37:19 1993
***************
*** 53,58 ****
--- 53,65 ----
      the US CD is [AAD].  Some people have told me that their CD says
      [ADD] on the disc and [AAD] on the label.
  
+ What are some titles of some good Rush bootlegs, and how might I
+ go about finding some?
+ 
+    The FAQ, TNMS and alt.music.rush do not encourage this illegal
+    activity, but a list of titles is available by emailing
+    meg@syrinx.umd.edu and asking for information.
+ 
  What album is <song> on?
  
     Check the complete discography, available for FTP from ftp.uwp.edu
***************
*** 729,734 ****
--- 736,743 ----
     TNMS 3rd anniversary issue                               556
     Discussion of the origin of the "Cygnus X-1" title       567
     "One on One" radio interview with Neil: RTB era          571
+    May 1992 _Lighting Dimensions_ article                   594
+    February 16 1992 _Houston Chronicle_ interview with Neil 597
  
  I've been seeing <acronym> used in TNMS.  What does it mean?
  

 ----- Changes to faq.2 -----

No differences encountered

 ----- Changes to faq.3 -----

No differences encountered

-- 
dan@rat.csc.calpoly.edu                                              Dan Delany
   "Nothing takes the taste out of peanut butter quite like unrequited love."
     -- Charlie Brown
From: bungy@bigwpi.WPI.EDU (Jason Allen Bungert)
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: Re: The meaning of "The Trees"
Date: 26 Jan 93 20:15:48 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: bigwpi.wpi.edu

In article <C1H8HJ.HFK@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cka52397@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Slartibartfast) writes:
>
>	I can see that, but my interpretation was that "They" in "They passed
>a noble law.." doesn't refer to either the Oaks or Maples, but to an unknown
>third party.  :-)
>
>-- 
> Chintan Amin  The University of Illinois, Urbana Champaign  c-amin1@uiuc.edu
>  "Public speaking is very easy!" <-- Quayle 10/88  ;-)
>  "Unfortunately, the people of Louisiana are not racists" <-- Quayle, 10/12/90
>NeXTMail Accepted at cka52397@sumter.cso.uiuc.edu  Go Illini Holiday Bowl 1992


     I always thought that the wildlife passed the Noble Law.  I mean
"And the creatures all have fled."  Maybe they all got pissed off with
all of the bickering and just chopped (or got the beavers to do it)
down all of the trees.  That's just my interpretation.
					
							-Bungy.
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
From: jpm56290@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Duner)
Subject: Re: The Pass
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 00:16:48 GMT

jaeger@buphy.bu.edu (Gregg Jaeger) writes:

>In article <C1FG2L.3v3@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> mwilson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Zaphod Beeblebrox) writes:

>>Ever since the release of Presto, The Pass has been a special song to me.  I
>>don't think too much arguement could be done over the basic theme of the song,
>>but there is one little tid-bit that I'm not fully decisive about.  The final
>>line in the Lyrics notes on the CD is:
> 
>>       Christ, what have you done?

>This subject has been discussed _ad infinitum_ in The National Midnight
>Star. No concensus could be reached on the interpretation of this line
>(not that one is necessary). 
 
  Maybe this would be a good question that someone could try to bring up the 
  next one of the boyz is on ROCKLINE.  I'm sure after the new album is out,
  at least one of them will be on the show.  Then we could get the final answer
  so we don't have to go through all that crap on the NMS again.  :)

  Yes I know my .sig is spelled wrong.  I forgot to change it.  :) 
-- 
***IIIII L     IIIII N   N IIIII*********************************************
***  I   L       I   N N N   I            John Meseke (Duner)               *
***IIIII LLLLL IIIII N   N IIIII   email- jpm56290@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu         *
*****************************************************************************
From: esuqs@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr W J Lynn)
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: Re: The meaning of "The Trees"
Date: 28 Jan 1993 21:07:38 -0000
Organization: Computing Services, University of Warwick, UK
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: garlic.csv.warwick.ac.uk

In article <C1KoMx.AM@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> mwilson@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Zaphod Beeblebrox) writes:

>Actually, the lyrics state that the Maples formed a union and passed a noble
>law.  I don't think there was meant to be a literal interpretation of what
>belongs in the plant kingdom and what is human.  I believe all that is
>implied is the simple fact that the Maples, who only saw their oppression and
>nothing else, forced equality on everyone.  This equality was not
>brought about by raising the Maples to the standards of the Oaks, but by
>reducing the Oaks to the level of the Maples.

No, the lyrics don't state that at all.
Lets put it this way, would the oaks allow the maples to pass
this law?

(I don't beleive i'm talking about trees passing laws :) )

They were under the oaks who did _not_ want to change.

  "But the oaks can't help their feelings 
   if they like the way they're made.......
   and they wonder why the maples can't
   be happy in their shade......"

They can't see what the prob is, so why do anything about it?

The whole song basically says to me.....

There are 2 groups bickering over something......
neither side wants to back down, nor sees why they should.....
and in the end, an irrelevant third party decided he/she's had
enough and chops them all down to size.
The only way theu can in fact be _equal_ is to be ground level. :)

Thanks for your time.

Warren.
--

|warren@dcs.warwick.ac.uk/esuqs@csv.warwick.ac.uk/cstadcl@csv.warwick.ac.uk|
| If you cannot stand      |      /  _  _  _     This is how we know what  |
| up for what you beleive, |     //|| \| \| |\ | love is, Jesus christ     |
| Your beliefs are nothing | /| //-||_/|_/|-| \| laid down his life for    |
| and neither are you.     |/ |//  || \| \|_|  | us.    1 John 3:16        |
|warren@dcs.warwick.ac.uk/esuqs@csv.warwick.ac.uk/cstadcl@csv.warwick.ac.uk|
Lines: 60
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 93 15:15:12 MST
From: Nathan Ashworth
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Subject: Re: Album bouts

In article <1993Jan24.195856.25752@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>  
jm012b@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Jeffrey P. Moon) writes:
> In <1993Jan22.183648.7721@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> khiggins@nyx.cs.du.edu (Ken  
Higginson) writes:
> 
> >In article <1993Jan21.230900.10084@iscsvax.uni.edu> wipperma9340 writes:
> >>In an attempt to add more excitement to the net, I have a new idea.  How
> >about
> >>Album bouts?  It entails taking one album and placing it in the ring wit
> 
> >>another in order to see how the two compare.
> >>
> >>RUSH ALBUM BOUT #1
> >>        Hold Your Fire v. Fly by Night
> >>
> >>How about it?  Which one do you think is better and why?
> >>
> >>If people like the idea, I'll present my opinion- and bout #2- in a few 
> >ays.
> >>
> >>Yours etc.,
> >>
> >>The Analog Kid
> 
> >Easy!
> > 
> >Hold Your Fire
> 
> Yes; definitely a great album, although Fly By Night isn't something to
> scoff at itself. However, head to head, I'd would agree that HYF wins hands
> down.
>  
> >Why?  One reason: "Open Secrets"
> > 
> >Easily one of the best Rush songs ever!
> > 
> 
> I think it is a great song, too. However, not one of their best ever
> (although we shouldn't really be arguing that...). I really like "Prime
> Mover" and "Time Stand Still" more. Overall, the album is excellent.
> -- 
> Jeffrey Moon			* "And the trees are all keep equal,	 
	
> University of Rochester		*  By hatchet, ax, and saw..."
> New York			*		- Rush, "The Trees" 

  I would have to say that Fly BY Night is the better album.  I say this  
because I like Rush's older style of music.  HYF is a great album, but in a  
totally different style.  The whole question comes down to whether you like the  
older Rush albums more than the new.  When I first started listening to Rush, I  
much preferred the newer albums.  However,  I have gained an appreciation for  
the older albums.  Fly By Night, Hemispheres, and 2112 are my favorite albums.   
I also like the older albums because of Alex's guitaring.  In the older albums,  
Alex's riffs are much better (harder)  In the newer albums, he has gotten more  
into effects than plain old good guitaring.  However, you might have to be a  
guitarist to appreciate this.  

Joel Helquist (on friends account)

P.S. BTW I'm enjoying a digitized version of YYZ on my NeXT at the moment!     
Organization: Freshman, MCS general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 14:47:44 -0500 
From: "Jonathan T. Moore" <jmci+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: The meaning of "The Trees"
	<108333@bu.edu>

jaeger@buphy.bu.edu (Gregg Jaeger) writes:
> In article <1993Jan26.091436.10172@iscsvax.uni.edu> wipperma9340@iscsvax.uni.e\
> du writes:
> >In article <108275@bu.edu>, jaeger@buphy.bu.edu (Gregg Jaeger) writes:
> 
> >> I don't think so. The _trees_ passed a law that they must be kept equal.
> >> If any humans _reduced_ (a la "kept equal", not _felled_) _some_ trees
> >> it was presumably due to _their_ law. It's not that the trees were
> >> fighting humans or something.
> 
> >> My reading has always been that the trees `democratically' pushed
> >> equality too far. Presumably this is what Neil meant by "human
> >> behavior"...
> 
> >Weren't the humans responsible for passing the Noble Law?  The Oak oppression
> >was stopped by hatchets, axes, and saws used by humans. 
> 
> Nope. The _maples_ passed a noble law.
> 
> > Unfortunately for all
> >of the trees, the humans didn't distinguish between the kinds of trees that a\
> re
> >chopped down.  The humans came by to end the war between the trees- not for
> >altruistic motives, however.
> 
> Say what?
> 
> The relevant lyrics are:
> 
> So the maples formed a union
> And demanded equal rights.
> "These oaks are just too greedy;
> We will make them give us light."
> Now there's no more oak oppression,
> For they passed a noble law,
> And the trees are all kept equal
> By hatchet, axe, and saw.
> 
> 
> "They" clearly refers to the maples here.
> 
Well, I don't think it is at all that clear, since the nearest
antecendent to the word "they" is in fact "oak," which would imply
that in fact the oaks passed the noble law (which indeed would seem
better to fit the adjective "noble" anyway, what with the old notion
that nobility implied responsibility to those beneath you). Any law
(excuse my analogy) passed by peasants to tear down a king and make
him an equal can hardly be called a noble act....

> 
> 
> Gregg
> 
> -- 
> Gregg Jaeger (jaeger@buphy)  Dept. of Physics (and Philosophy), Boston Univ.
> "You see, the quantum mechanical description is in terms of knowledge" -Peierls
> "One can _not_ put the psi-function... in place of the... thing" -Schroedinger
>                    _De gustibus non disputandum_, NOT!

-----------------------------------------------
Jon Moore             (jmci@andrew.cmu.edu) 
 "What have I got in my pocket?" --Bilbo     
 "Let the truth of love be lighted,          
  Let the love of truth shine clear." --RUSH 
-----------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: alt.music.rush
From: cs911029@ariel.yorku.ca (THOMAS J DUCK)
Subject: Rush and Satan (was Re: Rivendell (was Re: ALBUM BOUT))
Organization: York University, Toronto, Canada
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 13:18:13 GMT

In article <1993Jan24.205546.10137@iscsvax.uni.edu> wipperma9340@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:

>Perhaps I should add the level of Satanic influence as another thing by which
>to compare albums.  With Rush there's plenty of that to go around.

     Now,  here is an argument that I have never understood.  Care to 
point out any Satanic influences in Rush?  I've never been able to find
any (and I've been listening to them for years and years and years!).

Cheers,
Thomas J. Duck
From: irsman@iastate.edu (Ian Schmidt)
Subject: Re: Album bouts
Organization: Two Meg Software, Music Division
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 22:21:22 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.230900.10084@iscsvax.uni.edu> wipperma9340 writes:
>In an attempt to add more excitement to the net, I have a new idea.  How about
>Album bouts?  It entails taking one album and placing it in the ring with
>another in order to see how the two compare.
>
>RUSH ALBUM BOUT #1
>        Hold Your Fire v. Fly by Night
>
>How about it?  Which one do you think is better and why?

Cool idea.  Now down to brass tacks...

HYF is the clear winner on this one as far as I'm concerned.  Although, the
albums are far enough apart that it's not really fair to compare them.  I'd
say HYF totally blows FBN away, but I enjoy Anthem and I think In The End is
one of Rush's finest moments, both on FBN and live on ATWAS (I wish they'd
bring it back for the next tour...THAT would be a major thrill!)  FBN is a good
album, but HYF's maturity is far cooler.  Plus, I like the orchestral and 
choir sounds on HYF (note to keyboard-bashers: many of the 'synth' sounds on
HYF are actual orchestras and choirs...only live is sampling used.  Source:
'Visions').




-- 
        Ian Schmidt: irsman@iastate.edu or aol.com, BITNET: twbv4@isuvax       
 "I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose free will." - Neil Peart
Newsgroups: alt.music.rush