HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bloom@inland.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Quiet combat?
Date: 5 Jan 93 08:25:30 CST
Distribution: usa
Organization: Inland Steel Company; East Chicago, IN

In article <1993Jan4.184044.29591@cbnewsd.cb.att.com>, mju@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (michael.j.urban) writes:
>>I fly R/C, not combat, but I'm going to let you know how I feel anyway. 
>>I posted about a year ago on the subject of "why don't the control-
>>line flyers use mufflers?"  It seemed strange that the AMA is such a 
>>strong advocate for mufflers in R/C and yet had no stated public policy 
>>for C/L.  I fly at Ned Brown Woods in Elk Grove Village and the C/L 
>>engines are indeed quite loud and irritating; loud enough that you 
>>cannot hear your R/C plane in the air.  The loudest engines are the 
>>combat types practicing for competition.  
> 
> 	
> 	Items #4 & 5 above are still true.  There are no effective
> 	mufflers available that would survive the inevitable carnage, and
> 	no one seems to know how to design them.

There aren't any now, because noone has really tried to design one.  I 
guarantee that within 1 month of an AMA rule requiring mufflers, you 
will see ads in the model magazines for commercial units for sale.  

> 	
> 	I would like all the RC flyers out there to note that the single
> 	loudest event in all of model aviation is one of your own, and
> 	that is Pylon Racing.  Not only are they loud, but there are
> 	usually FOUR of them going at once, and they are up there in the
> 	sky where the noise propogates more widely than when on a 60 foot
> 	tether.  I would be the last to suggest that they be placed under
> 	some kind of noise level regulation.  

OK then, I will be the first to suggest that R/C Pylon must also have 
silencers!  Tell me, are there pylon racers practicing at your 
control line field?

>       To someone who appreciates
> 	high performance model engines, that stuff is music, not noise.
> 	However, it does sort of irritate me to have an RC flyer complain
> 	about the noise of a competition control line event, when the
> 	competition RC event is louder.

It's not the noise at the Nationals that bothers me, but the noise at 
my home field where I fly every week.  The noise at my home field is 
not going to get any quieter until the rules for combat are changed. 
You don't have to listen to R/C pylon racers every time you fly.  Why 
should I have to listen to open exhaust combat engines every time I 
fly?  

> 	
> 	Mike Urban

Maybe some of the musicians of R/C pylon can converge on your field 
for a little music democracy.
From: dqwelch@sgidq4.sdrc.com (Mike Welch)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Rocket powered R/C (Estes Astro Blaster)
Date: 4 Jan 93 15:08:53 GMT
Organization: SDRC

In article <42995@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>, dlou@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Dennis Lou) writes:
|> 
|> 
|> Anyone have any experience with the Estes Astro Blaster?


Yes, I built one scratch from a friend's plans.

|> 
|> I was thinking about getting either this one or the Sig Ninja.
|> 
|> The Astro Blaster sounds really intriguing because it is a canard and
|> can fly rocket boost, slope, or you can use a dummy rocket motor and 
|> plug in a .049.  This would work out great for me since I can fly it on
|> the slope when I'm at school (Torrey Pines site), fly it under power
|> at a schoolyard when I'm home for the holidays, and fly it rocket boost 
|> when I want to show off to my friends.

I built mine without the rocket motor.  My firend had a "blast" with his
under rocket power.  (Sorry for the pun.)

|> 
|> My concerns are that 
|> 1> I don't know how well it will fly on the slope.  For that matter, I don't
|> know how well it will fly period.  (I already read the Dec `92 MAN review,
|> but they never mentioned anything about slope performance or much about glide 
|> characteristics)

I thought I could improve the glide by changing the airfoil to an Epler 374.  
I was wrong.  The canard seemed to be too small.  I changed the incidence in 
order to increase the lift.  This resulted in very poor glide.   I was 
generally disappointed in the glide.  Even at Torrey Pines.  I could keep it
up.  It would roll nice.  but..  

|> 
|> 2> The elevator/aileron canard configuration prevents stall maneuvers (i.e.
|> snap rolls and tumbles)
|> 

I could barely do a loop.    Too much pitch stability. 

The fuse was big and boxy. Too much drag to retain energy. 

|> 3> the .049 pusher configuration means you can't use a clunk tank (the
|> clunk will be facing the wrong way) and the QRC/Texaco/Black Widow
|> engines won't go inverted which, combined with #2, means you can't do many
|> good stunts under power.

The glide was alot worse inverted.  Too much drag from the canard.

I still might add an .049.  That should make up for the poor glide.

|> 
|> Anyone have any comments on this plane or how to solve #3?
|> 
|> -- 
|> Dennis Lou             || "But Yossarian, what if everyone thought that way?"
|> dlou@ucsd.edu          || "Then I'd be crazy to think any other way!"
|> [backbone]!ucsd!dlou   |+====================================================
|> dlou@ucsd.BITNET       |Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak went to my high school.


				Thanks,

				Mike

******************************************************************************
  Mike Welch                 * "Gun laws go against Darwin's Theory.
  SDRC                       *  Let stupid people kill each other."
  2000 Eastman Drive         * 
  Milford, Ohio 45150        * "Governments should not mandate the
  Tel: (513) 576-2514        *  use of safety belts.  Let Natural
  Email: Mike.Welch@sdrc.com *  Selection work."  - me
******************************************************************************
From: cbusch@ub.d.umn.edu (Chris)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Jet engines...
Date: 10 Jan 1993 02:58:09 -0600
Organization: University of Minnesota, Duluth
NNTP-Posting-Host: ub.d.umn.edu

   Are there actaully rc jet engines?  I occasationally hear reference
to ducted fan engines, how do they work? If there are rc jet engines,
are the jet engines pulse jet or normal turbine jets?
Just curious.

--
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Chris Busch     cbusch@ub.d.umn.edu =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
 C(o_o))        _                        "The use of COBOL cripples the
   (=)         (_ -|- -|- is the         mind; its teaching should, 
  --|--        language of choice.       therefore, be reguarded as a
   /^\      Protest the use of BASIC!    criminal offense." -E.W. Dijkstra
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Wanted: Cheap run-of-the-mill standard VGA board. 
Wanted: RC airplane engines, radios, planes, etc
From: dfk@col.hp.com (David F. Kurth)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: First plane (sailplane) advice?
Date: 8 Jan 1993 21:00:48 GMT
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: hplsdaw.col.hp.com

sbixby@cup.portal.com (Steven W Bixby) writes:
> >Ok,  I've read the  FAQ and  decided to build a Standard class sailplane
> >as my first R/C craft.
> 
> >Airtronics Olympic II
> 
> EXCELLENT!
	This was my first plane, and I agree it is an excellent choice.
	The plane flys well and slow, which is want you want as a beginner.
	As your skill increases and you want to fly on windy days, you can
	add lots of ballast, or get a higher performance plane.

> >SIG Riser 100
> 
> No experience with it, but Sig kits are usually pretty good, and the
> instructions are excellent; I doubt you'd go wrong with this kit.
	I believe the SIG Riser 100 uses an E205 (or other non flat-bottom) 
	airfoil.  This airfoil and plane will fly a lot faster than the Oly, 
	and this is usually leads a beginner into trouble quicker than
	he can react to correct.  You want to control the plane, and not 
	have the plane control you.

From this note, I gather you are not afraid to ask for help.
Make sure you find a local club or somebody to help you.  You 
should be able to find someone that will really want to make you
successful.  Sailplanes are a lot more fun if you have someone 
to answer your building questions, and correct common mistakes 
before they lead to disasterous results.  (I did a radio check on 
someone's new plane which failed.  He still had the receiver 
antenna all coiled up neatly with a rubber band, just the 
way it came out of the box.)  There are lots of tips and
techniques that make building easier, and you won't find them 
in any of the instruction manuals.  A plane that is balanced
and true is easy and a thrill to fly.  One that is all out of
"whack" will simply be a pain to fly.  Get some help, get 
some advice, and then go have some fun.

Good luck.

Dave Kurth
dfk@col.hp.com
From: guy.byars@ssa.org (Guy Byars) 
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Rocket powered Glider
Date: 5 Jan 93 21:26:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Soaring Society of America's BBS (513)-871-7720
Reply-To: guy.byars@ssa.org (Guy Byars) 


Regarding the Estes Astro Blaster, I built one, flew it, and lived to tell
the tale!

Construction:

Simple, it was a VERY will prepared kit.  All wood was perfectly pre cut, 
foam cores were of good quality, instructions clear ... in short, a good
kit.


Test Gliding:

Center of gravity is _critical_!  However, even balancing the model 
with the CG exactly as shown on the plans, it would still lawn dart.

After moving the CG back to where it would fly, it still had 
problems. It seemed to have a serious lack of up elevator.  Also it was 
no floater and had to be flown FAST!  ( 16oz on a 36" plane).  Thermaling 
is not an option.


Rocket Launching:

Terrifying and Wonderful!!!!  The plane is launched via a standard launch 
rod and electric igniter.  (I used fuse myself, but I was in the middle of
150 acres of private farmland.)  I used the D engine and flights were very 
impressive.  A rapid climb to 250-300 feet in about 4 seconds.  You could 
make VERY slight corrections under power and it would respond.  Given the 
weight and wing loading, the flights down were very short, (launch - pattern
 - land).  On a slope it would have done much better.  I can't wait to try 
the new E engine.


Rocket Powered Hand Launches:

Not recommended, but after a few normal flights we got bored and started 
experimenting.  We lit the fuse, waited about the right amount of time, then 
threw it.  It worked well at first, the rocket ignited about 1 sec after 
release and started a normal climb.  At this point, I couldn't resist trying 
a few aerobatic maneuvers under rocket power.  The result was exhilerating 
and predictable.  The lack of up elevator control preventing me from pulling 
up in time out of a very impressive loop and contact with the ground produced 
moderate, but repairable damage.


If you have never tried a boost glider, I would highly recommend it.  However, 
the Estess Astro Blaster is more a novelty than a good flying plane.  And at 
$1.75 per rocket motor, it isn't long before it will be gathering dust.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Neither my brother nor I have the means to support 
both a wife and a flying machine.  - Wilbur Wright



--- WinQwk 2.0 a#571
                                                     
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: bencze@isl.stanford.edu (William J. Bencze)
Subject: Re: out of control
Organization: Stanford University
Date: 6 Jan 93 09:42:28


  An easy solution to the "accidentally turning off the receiver"
problem is to change the switch entirely!  I use a 3/32" phono
plug and jack like those found on small transistor radios.  They
are designed with a built-in switch which is used to turn off the
speaker and reroute the audio to the headphones.  I mount the
jack (female) half in the fuselage with the jack's hole sticking
through the fuse via a 1/8" hole.  These jacks are fairly small
and it is easy to mount it so that the end of the threaded flange
is flush with the fuse on the outside (I do away with the
mounting nut, and just epoxy the thing in).  I wire it us so that
the receiver is turned on when the plug (male half) is removed;
on the ground I insert the plug to turn the plane's electronics
off.  It's also helpful to attach a 1' or so piece of red ribbon
to the plug to make it easy to see that the plane is turned on or
off.  The ribbon also makes a nice "remove before flight"
streamer, just like the big planes have! (Tell the gullible that
it's your pitot tube cover!).

  As an added bonus, you can wire an extra plug up to your
recharger and then charge the plane through the "switch" (be sure
you wire everything properly or you can kill your NiCds)

  The necessary parts are available at Radio Shack or any other
electronics parts store.  If anyone wants additional details, let
me know!

-Bill

--
 Bill Bencze                               bencze@isl.stanford.edu
From: billg@hpspdla.spd.HP.COM (Bill Gingras)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: The Chup (was  Re: Dynaflite Skeeter and other HLG)
Date: 8 Jan 93 16:58:17 GMT
Organization: HP Stanford Park - Palo Alto, CA


I'm currently building a Skeeter.  I would say that the kit is worth
$15.00.  I've heard from several people that it is a good flyer but I've
never actually seen one fly.

What you've heard about the building instructions is true.  They tell
you to build things in such a way as to make the plane impossible or at
least extremely difficult to build later on.  For example, they tell you
to sheet the wing leading edge first, then later they tell you to
install the dihedral braces.  It's much easier to install the braces
BEFORE sheeting the wing.  I'd say that if you have some building
experience, build it, and use what you've learned in the past when
something doesn't seem right.  If you have to go soley by instructions,
you'll be frustrated.

- Bill G
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Winch construction query
From: SRINGROS@bcsc02.gov.bc.ca
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 07:59:07 PST
Organization: BC Systems Corporation

>
>Some friends of mine want to build their own winch for launching sailplanes
>(sport flying - not necessarily competition). I wonder if somebody could send
>me some relatively detailed plans, with parts list, where to get stuff, etc.
>I know some of the basic parts, but not the details...
>
Max, I'm sure someone from the COGG (Central Ontario Glider Group) would be
able to help you. Sorry, but I can't give you any names.  Anyone else have
$.02?
 
 
 
Scott Ringrose
Printing and Presentation Services
B C  Sytems Corporation, (604)389-3729 BCSC01(MVS)=SC32169
BCSC02(VM)=SRINGROS INTERNET=SRINGROS@BCSC02.gov.bc.ca
From: hartzell@cs.Berkeley.EDU (George Hartzell)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: First plane (sailplane) advice?
Date: 10 Jan 1993 20:38:43 GMT
Organization: CS Division, UC Berkeley
Distribution: world
Reply-To: hartzell@cs.berkeley.edu (George Hartzell)
NNTP-Posting-Host: cory.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: MikeSummers@cup.portal.com's message of Fri,  8 Jan 93 08:28:49 PST

In article <73179@cup.portal.com> MikeSummers@cup.portal.com (Michael
- Summers) writes: 
   >[...]
   >I'd like to solicit comments on:
   >[...]
   >Airtronics Olympic II
   >[...]

I'm currently building my first plane, a 2 meter sailplane.  I started
with a Gnome that I bought from Northeast Sailplanes, but got
frustrated (8 pages of instructions, no diagrams or pictures, not the
best first timers plane) and bought a Great Planes Spirit.  I'm much
happier, it has an _excellent_ instruction manual and the parts are
easy to work with.  They have a larger version, the Spirit 100, which
got rave reviews in one of the magazines recently.  It's a lot more
expensive though ($80 vs. $35) and seemed excessive for something I'm
likely to turn into matchsticks.  Maybe my next one though.

Another plane to consider is the Airtronics Olympic 650 (though it's
also a 2 meter plane).  It got some good reviews, and is the example
plane in the book "Sailplane and Soaring Manual" by Al Doig, from R/C
Modeler Magazine.  The book has great pictures and instructions (about
building, testing, and flying [theory and practice]), if you ordered
the plans from RCM you could easily scratch build one from the book.
That plus the kit instructions (which are also supposed to be good)
should make an excellent first plane.

One nice thing about the Gnome and the Spirit are that they have a
spoiler option, which many people suggest is worth having (it seems
reasonable to me...).  I don't know if the Oly does or not.

Of course, I don't know anything about flying these things yet, so
both of these planes might be totally inappropriate (especially if
you're set on a bigger plane).  I decided that I'd be happier
successfully building something, even it if wasn't the hottest plane
in the air.  That'll come later...  People seem to thing that the
Spirit is a fine plane though.

  > I  also need recommendations on books about sailplanes (building
  >and flying) and radios. (As my kids will eventually push me into
  >power I thought I'd go with a good 4ch setup.)

The RCM book mentioned above seems worth having.  I went with a Futaba
4 Channel NBF with standard servos.

  >Thanks in advance for the help-- Mike.

g.
--
George Hartzell                                     hartzell@cs.berkeley.edu
Computer Science, 570 Evans Hall,
University of California, Berkeley, CA 94720
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: D2KAK@VM1.CC.UAKRON.EDU
Subject: Re: e: smoke systems for YS120FS
Organization: The University of Akron
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:03:20 GMT

In regards smoke systems. We have been using smoke on our 1/4scale
models for quit a while now. The key to good smoke is heat and nothing
in the glow catagory produces as much heat as a gas burner(at the
exhaust anyhow). The best smoke muffler we found was a home built affair
using wire screen rolled up and inserted into the muffler housing. The
smoke oil was then injected at the exhaust port and hit the screen
producing great smoke. You may be able to insert a roll of wire screen
material into a stock muffler to produce the same result. The hot screen
really makes dense smoke.Also, the better you atomize the smoke fuel, the
better your smoke will work. Use a very thin orifice at the point where
you inject the oil.
     The smoke oil we are using is a mix of Corvus oil (just like the
real airshow performers use) and diesel fuel (about 80%/20%). Bennets
R/C Products in Indiana make a smoke fuel that also works very well.
I don't know how much success you'll have with the 4 strokers as we
have never tried using smoke on them. Let me know how you make out.
 
Kraig Krumm  (AMA59622)
Canton, Ohio
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: Engine problems
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:29:29 GMT

In article <16B4D9F9D.ANDERCD@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu> ANDERCD@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu writes:

> Someone else wrote:
>>2. The piston and liner got scratched in the crash by the grit and when I
>>squirt WD40 into the cylinder and turn the prop, I get a little escaping
>>gas as the piston approaches the top. As I loosing so much compression that
>>the crankcase suction that is supposed to draw fuel in is failing? How can
>>I test this and what is the solution?

>time to buy a new engine!


By the way.... if you have a scratched and/or worn piston liner, and
the replacement is expensive, try getting it "chromed". I'm not sure 
what current chroming costs are but it used to be $15 in 84 or so, so 
I'd guess $30. Anyone know Bob Oge's phone number? I've been to his 
workshop and there were all of these unhoned, chromed Mark VI liners 
sitting on the bench... he'll even make you piston/liner sets (at least
he has the tools to do it).

I imagine this'll save you big bucks if you are into Pattern..






-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: stand@austin.ibm.com (Stan Douglas, N5CKQ)
Subject: Re: Building Board
Originator: stand@stand.austin.ibm.com
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:22:12 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: IBM Austin


I used to use our formal living room dining table to build on.  To protect it I
put down several layers of news paper then two pieces of 24x48 inch plain white
ceiling tiles.  That works very well and is flat if you stay on one piece of
tile.  Alas the wife was not pleased to lose the dining room and I was evicted to
the garage.  So I built a work bench the whole length of the garage.  Plywood for
the top was too expensive and in looking around I found 28x82 inch interior doors
for $12 in a local hardware store and I used those.  It is very flat and good
enough for building a wing on.  I now have enough room to have my band saw and
drill press out all the time.  Finally, I also have a glass shelf that I use, as
well as a couple of pieces of 12x36 composite shelf pieces.  Once the work bench
top (doors) becomes beat up I will unscrew the worn door and flip it over.

Stan
From: ed@kronos.com (Ed Baker)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: FAQ
Date: 8 Jan 93 15:52:56 GMT
Organization: Kronos Inc. / Waltham, MA
Disclaimer: This posting is a personal opinion and not that of Kronos Inc.

In article <jrp.726467370@wombaj.kowari.cpsg.com.au> jrp@bohra.cpg.oz.au
 (John Pitman) writes:
>It looks to me as though there are some areas not covered in the
>current FAQ that may be useful.
>
>I am thinking of are :  the need for straightness (compared to C/L),
>	the need to have small (preferably seaqled) gaps at hinge lines,
>	check the hinges for strength and attachment security,
>	preferably straight pushrods, not kinked,
>	attaching nyrod outers to start and end holes, and midway,
>	assembling tanks correctly and checking for leaks,position of re engine,
>	checking wings for warps (home made incidence meters) and fixing them,
>	rigging of control horns and pushrods (at 90 degrees etc)
>	fitting keepers on clevises, using threaded ends into clevises
>	when to use epoxy, Ca, white glue,
>	installing servos,
>	choice of radio (channels, dry vs nicd, value for $),
>	choice of covering colours for visibility,
>	size of beginner plane,
>	etc.
>does any body think it is worth posting this sort of stuff, and should it get
>added to the FAQ????

Yes!  There are several topics which repeat a few times a year.  Here are
some more off the top of my head:

        What's a good building surface?
        How do I attach a clear plastic canopy?
        Should I buy a OS-40FP or a more powerful first engine?
        How do I eliiminate jitter due to long servo leads?
        Is there a home-built circuit for a "go-light"?
        Do Nicad batteries need to be cycled?
        Can I restore a dead nicad cell?
        Do CA and Epoxy glues emit harmful fumes?
        Should I learn to fly planes before helicopters?
        Are the rocket powered gliders any good?
        What's the best flight simulator?
        How does a wing produce lift?
        What's a good book on flying?  On helis?  On building?
        Who are Iskandar Taib, Dave Svoboda, and Steve Bixby? :-)

I didn't actually read the FAQ, so my apolly-wogies if any of the above
are already in there.  I've never seen anyone answer a question on this
newsgroup with, "read the FAQ!"  I'm going to go read it now :-).

-Ed