From: davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks)
Subject: Re: Hmmm...
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 17:57:40 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: VMARK Software, Inc.

In article <1993Jan20.224732.2765@cbnewsk.cb.att.com> lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor) writes:
>In article <1993Jan20.165833.21741@uvmark.uucp> davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks) writes:
>>Hmm... SF was 14-2, Dallas 13-3.. And, it was in SF.  But, Dallas wins.
>>Guess that refutes the validity of YOUR data selection as well.
>Yes, that, namely a do-or-die game actually played, refutes the
>regular season comparsion between SF and Dallas. Yet there is no
>do-or-die game actually played between SF and Buffalo. So who is
>better is only based on opinions. You based your opinion on one game
>among 16, I based my opinion on 16. 

But, my one game was played between the two teams in question, your 16 total
games were played under very different circumstances against different teams.
>
>>"more widely accepted data" by who???  
>By the league. A 14-2 team would beat out a 11-5 team for a division 
>championship, playoff berth, etc.
>
>>Last I heard, more people accepted the
>>results on the field when comparing two teams.  
>Right, but last I heard, no people accepted the result of only one game among
>16 regular season games to rank teams.
>
>>Exceptions do occur, such
>>as the Phoenix game or the Colts/Jets games for the Bills.  But, for teams 
>>with very similar records (15-4 vs. 14-5), it is usually better to go head 
>>to head.   
>Who's 15-4? Last I heard, SF is 15-3, Buffalo is 14-5. Doesn't look
>like similar record to me. 

Sorry for the typo, in al the other cases, I did state 15-3...  Still looks
very similar.  15-3 vs. 14-5 is very similar.
>
>>Remember, the head-to-head shows a DEFINITIVE view of which team was better,
>>at least on that day.  The overall record includes many other factors such
>>as strength of schedule, etc... 
>Strenght of schedule, in the NFL tiebreaker totem pole, is the 8th important
>criteria or so. 

Exactly, so it is one of the many other factors.  Thanx for proving my point.

>
>>Can you honestly say that SF is "Definitely" better than Phoenix??  
>Yes.

Then why didn't they beat Phoenix????

>>Because a team's regular season merits are not determined by one game.

But, that one game has a lot of merit as well.  It is #1 on the NFL tiebreaker
list... Head-to-head matchups...

>> SF might have been the better overall team,
>>but Phoenix might match-up well and beat SF 10 out of 10 times.  We will
>>never know, but we at least know that Phoenix is 1 of 1 so far.  There is
>>only 1 way to truly prove who is the best....  Look at it...
>Yes, like SF is 14-2 and Phoenix is 5-11. So you are saying that one game
>defines who's the best? Nope, the league doesn't use that criteria.

Yes they do.  They use it in the case of tiebreakers.  And, the league doesn't
say that since SF is 14-2, and has the best record, that they are the league's
best team.  That is what the SuperBowl is for.  All it does is rewards them
by giving them the best chance at getting to the SuperBowl...
>
>>Why have the superbowl, world series, stanley cup, etc... why not give it to
>>the team with the best record???  
>They could have. 

But they don't...  Why, because no one seems to agree with you that the team
with the best record should get the award.

>
>>Why, because it is determined by the teams as they play head to head.  
>Oh, so if Dallas win the SB, the Rams can claim the SB because they
>beat Dallas head-to-head? What a stupid argument.
>
>The Bills beat the 49ers head-to-head in a different setting, namely
>one game in sixteen. The W/L in that one game does not define the season.
>All 16 games do.  The W/L in any one game in the playoff does.

But, that W/L during the season is a largely different situation.  Different
teams, different locations, different conditions, etc... all help to define
those situations.  The head-to-head is the ultimate challenge.

>
>>Why is everyone yelling about needing a playoff
>>in College Football??  Because of the same thing, people want the best team
>>decided on the field and not by records, polls, or other things...
>Yes, maybe the 49ers and the Bills should decide on the field in a single
>elimination setting. So far they haven't.

Why, the 49ers weren't good enough to get there.  People who want the playoff
system don't care about the wanna-bes like the 49ers, they want the best.
Alabama was the MNC, but no one says there should be a playoff where they 
have to play all the top teams to prove it..
-- 
David T. Meeks            || "New shadows tugging at the corner of his eye
VMark Software, Inc.      ||  Jostling for attention as the sunlight flares
uvmark!davem@merk.com     ||  Through a curtains tear, shuffling its beams
davem%uvmark@merk.com     ||  As if in nervous anticipation of another day"