HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: krak@quads.uchicago.edu (leszek  kordylewski)
Subject: Re: "Kio okazus, se ^ciu parolus E-on?"
Reply-To: krak@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Distribution: inet
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 15:57:01 GMT

In article <9208010951.AA04083@ixos.ixos.de> reinhard.foessmeier@munich.ixos.de (Reinhard Foessmeier) writes:

>Por Zamenhof tio certe ne estis lo plej grava.  Li kredis ke komuna
>lingvo malkreskigus reciprokajn malamon kaj malrespekton inter la homoj.
>Eble li nun estus malpli optimisma, vidante ke Serboj kaj Kroatoj,
>kiuj havas pli-malpli la saman lingvon, mortigas sin reciproke.
>(Ecx se ne cxiuj, sed nur kelkaj banditoj el inter ili).

1. Memoru, ke la banditoj je la unua flanko estas konsiderataj heroaj 
patriotoj je la dua...

2. Lingvo estas nur unu el multaj faktoroj kiuj difinas nacion. 
La faktoro grava, sed nenecesa. 

3. Cxu iu scias kiel nun fartas la jugoslavaj samideanoj ? 


-- 
KRAK@MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
From: tordm@vana (Tord Malmgren)
Subject: Re: Interlingua
Reply-To: TordM@VanD.PhySto.SE
Organization: Department of Physics, University of Stockholm -- Sweden
Distribution: inet
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 10:33:52 GMT

In article <9208200505.AA16214@cognos.COM>, lendonc@cognos.com (Cleve Lendon 3821) writes:

>>There are too many Esperantists who either view themselves as members of
>>some exclusive club, or who are so possessed by ideas of world
>>peace/brotherhood/whatever, that they ignore the fact that Esperanto
>>simply isn't catching on.

>Firstly, our "club" is not exclusive.

 just for information, I was informed that "Universala Esperanto Asocio"
has a very high membership cost thus exluding some people who can't afford
it, and if that isn't "exclusive"




---------------+--------------------------------
 Tord Malmgren | InterNet: TordM@VanD.PhySto.SE | These opinions are my own,
               | BITNet  : TordM@SESUF51        | and NOT of this department!
---------------+--------------------------------
 Department of Physics, University of Stockholm
From: dfkihueg@RZ.UNI-SB.DE ("Edmund Grimley-Evans")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: mia / la mia
Date: 20 Aug 92 19:24:27 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

>      Mia samlaborejano (mia = iu mia; la mia = la sola mia; c^u ne?)

Ne. La vortoj "mia", "nia", "via", "lia", "^sia", "^gia", "ilia", "sia"
(kaj supozeble anka^u "^slia") jam enhavas la ideon de difiniteco.
"Mia" signifas do "la ... de mi". Se vi ne volas la difinitecon,
ekzistas pluraj solvoj:

La plej simpla solvo estas simple diri "de me":

    Samlaborejano de mi...

Alia solvo estas nuligi la difinitecon per "iu":

    Iu mia samlaborejano...

Mi persone mal^satas tiun duan solvon, sed al kelkaj homoj ^gi
pla^cas...

Edmund

=======================================================================
Edmund GRIMLEY EVANS                              dfkihueg@rz.uni-sb.de
=======================================================================
From: hottasan@ho.shs.sumiden.co.jp (HOTTA Hirohiko)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Olimpikaj Ludoj
Date: 17 Aug 92 03:56:57 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet


Jen simpla plendo.

En la olimikaj ludoj kreskas komercismo. 
Rilate al tio stranga afero okazis.
Chin-ideograma skribo sur uniformo de chinaj 
ludantoj estis malpermesita.
(Japanaj ludantoj emas surhavi anglan landnomon "Japan". 
Pro tio la malpermeso ne donis japanojn. -- feliche au mal- )

La organizanto diras ke oni ne povas rekoni, 
chu la ideogramoj estas komercaj reklamoj auh ne.

Chu nur latinaj literoj estas universalaj?
--
HOTTA Hirohiko /Faka delegito de UEA /Konsiliano de Japana Esperanto-Instituto
From: dfkihueg@RZ.UNI-SB.DE ("Edmund Grimley-Evans")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Der GERDA-Kurs im Netz
Date: 17 Aug 92 12:31:38 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

(Mi samtempe sendas Esperantan tradukon.)

			DER GERDA-KURS IM NETZ

Der GERDA-Kurs ist ein Esperanto-Kurs fuer Fortgeschrittene im
Computernetz. Er benutzt den Text des bekannten Buchs "Gerda
malaperis!" von Claude PIRON, das schon breite Verwendung fuer den
Anfaengerunterricht gefunden hat. Das Buch ist ein Mini-Krimi mit einem
ausgewaehlten Wortschatz, so dass die wichtigsten und haeufigsten
Esperanto-Woerter frueh erscheinen und die weniger wichtigen spaeter im
Buch. Auch die Grammatik wird zum Teil in Stufen eingefuehrt; in den
ersten beiden Kapiteln gibt es zum Beispiel keinen Akkusativ. Fuer
jemanden, der FEC/CGE gemacht hat sind die ersten Kapitel etwas zu
einfach, aber bis zum Ende des Kurses lernt man die tausend wichtigsten
und nuetzlichsten Esperanto-Woerter auf natuerliche und unterhaltsame
Weise und uebt das Denken, Lesen und Schreiben auf Esperanto.

Der Kurs besteht aus 25 Kapiteln. Zu jedem Kapitel habe ich Fragen zum
Inhalt (Verstaendiskontrolle) und verschiede Uebungen hinzugefuegt. Es
gibt auch eine grosse Datei mit allen vorkommenden Woertern, zusammen
mit Uebersetzungen und Erklaerungen. Im Idealfall soll alle
Kommunikation zwischen Schueler und Lehrer in Esperanto stattfinden,
und alle Kursmaterialien ausser der grossen Wortliste und der
Einfuehrung sollen einsprachig auf Esperanto sein. In der Praxis ist es
aber manchmal sehr nuetzlich, auf andere Sprachen zurueckzugreifen,
also will ich das auf keinen Fall verbieten!

Im Augenblick gibt es die Datei "vortlisto" mit den Uebersetzung aller
gebrauchten Woerter maschinenlesbar nur auf englisch und auf deutsch.
Als Buch gibt es sie aber auch in mehreren anderen Sprachen.

Wenn Sie mit dem GERDA-Kurs Esperanto weiterlernen wollen, schreiben
Sie an mich. Ich werde Sie mit einem erfahrenen Esperanto-Sprecher
zusammenbringen, der Ihnen die Lektionen schicken und Sie durch den
Kurs leiten wird.

	Edmund GRIMLEY EVANS
	dfkihueg@rz.uni-sb.de
	(Organisator des GERDA-Kurses im Netz)

=======================================================================
Edmund GRIMLEY EVANS                              dfkihueg@rz.uni-sb.de
=======================================================================
From: dfkihueg@RZ.UNI-SB.DE ("Edmund Grimley-Evans")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Rick Harrison on Esperanto
Date: 22 Aug 92 15:56:19 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

Mi konsentas, ke WARINGHIEN uzis trompajn argumentojn por pravigi la
akuzativon en Esperanto. Ekzistas tamen tre konvinkaj argumentoj por
^gi. Legu ekzemple la artikolon "Pledo por akuzat(iv)o" de VERLOREN VAN
THEMAAT en LITERATURA FOIRO de A^ugusto 1992!

Tre koncize, oni povas argumenti, ke sen la akuzativo oni devus multe
pli ofte uzi pasivajn frazojn en Esperanto, kaj por tion fari oni devus
reformi la verbsistemon, ^car la nuna verbsistemo ne estas farita por
tia uzado.

La^u mi apena^u indas simpligi iun ajn parton de Esperanta gramatiko.
E^c por (ekzemple) angloj la lernado de sufi^ca vortaro estas multe pli
problema ol la ^gusta uzado de akuzativoj, a^u e^c de refleksivoj. Mi
supozas, ke por japanoj la akuzativo devas ^sajni e^c pli bagatela
kompare kun la grandega tasko lerni sufi^ce da vortoj por legi nian
literaturon. Eble iu el niaj japanoj legantoj povos komenti pri tio...

Cetere, se mi devus inventi novan planlingvon, mi nepre permesus tiel
nomatan "liberan vortordon" (^car la alternativo estas uzado de pasivaj
frazoj kaj aliaj komplika^joj), kaj mi nepre provizus ian metodon
distingi subjektojn kaj objektojn. Ver^sajne mi montrus la rektan
objekton per prepozicio, same kiel oni montras ^ciujn aliajn specojn de
objekto per prepozicio...

Edmund
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: kazi@brahms.udel.edu (Zunaid Kazi)
Subject: Re: on recent discussions -- I
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:38:22 GMT

Thank you Dipen, for an elegant and succint summary of the discussions 
on this thread. Unfortunately no summary will do justice to anybody, as
was amply evidenced by the sudden flurry of clarifications that were
generated by your artcile [Shakil, Arun, Zunaid et. al]. No, I am not
going to start with my Axioms again, even though Shakil still sees
some inconsistencies. :) 

[The net releases a collective sigh. Oh, Net Pantheons, spare us from 
 Zunaid's verbose obfuscations]

What I would like to do, is to caution against drawing any sorts of
conslusions about Bangladeshi attitudes and beliefs from this circuitous 
discourse. Most unfortunately, the regular posters in no way represent
the typical (if there is such a thing) Bangladeshi ethos. I am not 
referring to the fact that all of us belong to a class which is a
numerically insignificant subset of Bangladeshi society; and not even
to the even more stratified microset that includes those of us who are
abroad. 

Regular SCB'ites are quite atypical if you compare them with the rest
of the lurking hordes who read but do not post. Naive and new readers of 
this bulletin board might incorrectly conclude that Bangladeshis hold very
enlightened/benighted [choose your own adjective] attitudes towards 
homosexuality. The responses to Ali Ishtiaq's marriage and to the whole
notion of homosexuality have been accepting and positive in general. I
am pretty certain that Ali Ishtiaque was pleasantly surprised by the
attitudes that were exposed on the net. I am quite sure that the reactions
from the Bangladeshi expatriate society have been negative in general.
And I do not wish to extrapolate to the reaction in the old country.

This atypical attitude doesn't just stop here. General attitudes towards
religion, moral philosphy, gender and racial prejudices, political views
etc are all far removed from what is the norm. Of course, there are exceptions,
but in general this has been the case. I am sure there are more agnostics,
atheists, and "i don't give a whit"s on the net than in the expatriate
society at large. [Just an example] 

Why is this? 

I have some thoughts that I will expound on in a later post. (As soon
as I finish the next chapter of my thesis.)

== Zunaid Kazi
   kazi@cis.udel.edu

Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: kundu@watson.ibm.com (Sandip Kundu)
Subject: Re: Minoritity in Govt. positions
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 17:43:15 GMT
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

> discrimination are to be taken with wrath and contempt. As Sandeep puts it in
> a succint manner, Bangladesh being an Islamic country, has now adopted the
> policy to promote Moslems, while Hindus are to be dispensed off with. The

Deb,

      Next time you qoute me please spell my name properly.
I must distance myself from your statement above. I did not
say or imply that discrimination is a problem specific to
Bangladesh or Islam. There are some in SCB who believe or
argue that there is no discrimination in Bangladesh. My post 
was partly directed at them and partly to the silent majority
to shame them into some action (wishful thinking :)-). 
      

Sandip Kundu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.indian
From: yasin@laser.dev.cdx.mot.com (Yasin)
Subject: Fourteenth of August
Organization: MOTOROLA 
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 15:53:27 GMT

Keywords: Independence Day


A.A.

To all my fellow Pakistanis a very happy


	I N D E P E N D E N C E

		D A Y


Pakistan Zindabad,
Pakistan Paindabad,

Yasin Qamaruddin.
From: fahmed@ (Farhad Ahmed)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: No confidence Vote & ....
Date: 20 Aug 92 21:28:22 GMT
Reply-To: fahmed@ (Farhad Ahmed)
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.  Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: dhaka

In article <1992Aug19.205445.17206@cbnewsm.cb.att.com>, was@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (wasif.sattar) writes:
> I understand that there was a `no confidence' vote in the parliament about
> a week to ten days ago requested for by the opposition members of parliament
> citing Khaleda Zia's government's inability to cope with the various 
> problems. Does anybody have details of this process? My neighbor told me
> that the news was carried by the Indian TV news casts from the NY area 
> last weekend.
> 
> Shubhechhante,
> Wasif Sattar

Assaalaamu-Waalaikum.

Yes, I also learned about it from the Indian TV news last
weekend. The "no confidence" vote against a rulin' party
was the first in the history of Bangladesh. The vote was
defeated by 164 to 132(I don't recollect the exact
numbers but they were close).

A dawn to dusk hartal was observed thru'out B'desh on 
Aug 20'92 in protest against the shooting of Mr. Rashed 
Khan Menon. Govt. has promised a thorough investigation 
of the incident. Some sources believed the shootin'
might have resulted due to internal fueds between leftist
parties.

Allah Hafez.

Farhad Ahmed.
+--------------------------------------------|------------------------------+
	Internet: fahmed@dhaka.eng.sun.com   | Farhad Ahmed
	Phone   : (415)-336-3265 (work)      | Sun Microsystems, Inc.
	          (408)-923-9192 (home)      | Mail St # MTV19-04
	                                     | 2550 Garcia Avenue
	                                     | Mountain View, CA 94043-1100
	  " SYSTEMS FOR OPEN COMPUTING "     | USA
+--------------------------------------------|------------------------------+
From: hyder@cs.utexas.edu (Syed Irfan Hyder)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: Contradictions in Statistics
Date: 19 Aug 1992 14:11:00 -0500
Organization: U Texas Dept of Computer Sciences, Austin TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: pageboy.cs.utexas.edu

In article <4763@balrog.ctron.com> raja@ctron.com writes:
:
:ag3l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Arun K. Gupta) writes:
:: 
:: Nadeem Malik is correct in the statistics that (at least in 1971 or so)
:: there were more Hindu men with two or more wives than Muslim men with
:: two or more wives in India.
:
:....It matters even though there are 5 times as many Hindus as Muslims 
:in India ??!!!! On any statistics there will be more number of
:Hindus doing any 'X' than muslims in India !!

I read some where statistics can be made to support any  thing
and can also be made to disprove any thing.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: ahmed-shakil@CS.YALE.EDU (Shakil Waiz Ahmed)
Subject: Re: Contradictions in Quaran
Organization: Yale University, Department of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:41:41 GMT


In article <86423@netnews.upenn.edu>, sarkar@grip.cis.upenn.edu (Nilanjan Sarkar) writes:

> A small observation : In order to prove the 'timelessness' of this religious
> dictum, one needs to show that not only now but never will the number of
> man  exceed the number of woman. 

There are a couple of problems with this "small observation."  First
of all, note that in order to prove that the religious dictum is *not*
timeless, you have to prove the opposite, something which you also
cannot do.  So neither of us has proved anything in that respect.

But more importantly, please note that the issue of the number of
women outnumbering the number of men is an observation which *I* made,
and is not something stated in the Qur'an, thus making your point
moot.

-- Shakil
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: mece1e3@Jane.UH.EDU (Arindam Ghosh)
Subject: Re: Active conversion and the Bahai faith
Reply-To: mece1e3@Jane.UH.EDU
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 02:45:10 GMT

In article <63916@cup.portal.com>, hassan@cup.portal.com (hassan monu alam) writes:
>>Active conversion is explicitly banned in the Bahai
>>Faith: we are told to answer questions if somebody
>>asks.
>
>
>You seem to have conveniently ignored the fact that nobody
>in SCB asked you any questions on your faith.
>
That's why I posted the apology; otherwise I would have been glad to
supply the information

>
>>So I am sorry if I gave the impression that  am trying
>>to convert anybody.
>
>We are even more sorry that we have to put up with your
>proselytizing.
>
Even though I am sorry: can you please tell me why are you afraid of
a new religion and its ideas. You conveniently ignored my statement
that religion is a matter of FREE CHOICE and not BIRTH or does your
brand of Islam prohibit this free choice? I know Iran's does


Arindam
From: hassan@cup.portal.com (hassan monu alam)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: travel by Aeroflot, Bangladesh
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 16:56:24 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

I remember reading in the OAG Biman planned to start 2 flights
per week from JFK to Dhaka. Does anyne know if these started.

My experience with Biman (and all South Asian airlines) has
been they are not necessarily puntual. On the bright side, 
that means if you are connecting from another carrier to
Biman, you need not be afraid of missing the Biman flight :-).

They are generally cheap and overcrouded, and service tends to
vary with how high on the social heirarchy the crew percieve
you  to be (ie non desis, and professionals get treated better
than workers from the Middle East). 

"It's not a journey, it is an adventure"
From: buchignani@hg.uleth.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: Bangladesh and State Religion was Re: Contradictions in Quaran
Date: 19 Aug 92 22:40:18 GMT
Reply-To: buchignani@hg.uleth.ca
Organization: University of Lethbridge

re: examples.

I would not want to generalize for all of Bangladesh, but let me
restrict myself to a hinterland region of Sirajganj District, where
I recently did fieldwork. Please excuse my presenting these examples
in a pointlike fashion, as this could easily become a book.

1. As noted in my earlier reply, this area had a distinct regional
culture once: gender and family relations, power relations, religious
practice, song and dance, language and identity were all quite
different than in Comilla or Dhaka. Arab culture-bearing Islam has
reduces some of these distinctions. It has, for example, severely
reduced, almost killed local dance traditions. While purdah restrictions
remain minor compared to, say, Comilla, womens' dress has, where
economically possibl shifted and become homogeneous. Things symbolic
of Hindus and Hinduism are of course disparaged by some. The forces
of local adaptation of Islam, once strong, are weakened by the
assertion of authority by those claiming metropole-origin orthodoxy.
Even such things as whether or not one might plant some flowers
around one's house (now for Muslims, not) have been affected...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.pakistan
From: bhattach@dip.eecs.umich.edu (sayan bhattacharyya)
Subject: Re: Culture x Nature
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor, MI
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 22:45:04 GMT

In article <1992Aug17.200549.26269@nic.umass.edu> s1006420@titan.ucc.umass.edu (and a thousand battles shall be won..) writes:

>My point is that culture is not developed in a linear or 
>concrete only mode of thought, therefore just the climate conditions
>are not the only thing to come into play in the process of culture
>and clothing in a particular society as you seemed to say.
>
>V.


Just to bring some subcontinental relevance back to this discussion
(in view of the newsgroups in the Newsgroups: line above) ....

I would agree with V here that climate is only *one* of the factors.
If it were the only factor, why does the 'Bhadralok' go to work wearing
a suit in Dhaka , Calcutta or Rawalpindi whereas a dhoti or a lungi 
would have been so much more comfortable ? Isn't that a reflection of
our colonial hangover , that is of the way we have been socialised
and ideologically indoctrinated to ape the 'sahib's ?

-Sayan.




Xref: sparky soc.culture.bangladesh:4558 soc.culture.indian:28490 soc.culture.pakistan:13820
From: kazi@brahms.udel.edu (Zunaid Kazi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Poem: The Inward I
Date: 13 Aug 92 00:34:36 GMT
Organization: University of Delaware


           THE INWARD I
           -------------
           [With apologies to Bel Kaufman and William Shakespeare]

           
           To be
           Or not to be
           By this, I mean to be myself
           Who am I though?
           Where am I going?
           Where do I come from?
           Do I exist?
           Am I?
           Or am I the illusion of
           My own subconscious?
           Be!
           And I am
           Who am I?
           I know not
           My id and ego
           Hide my soul from me
           Who am I?
           I know not I
           I shout
           WHO AM I?
           There is no answer
           The world goes on
           The world goes
           Remorselessly on
           In silence...

[ (c)1982 : From "The Resplendent Isles ]

== Zunaid Kazi
   kazi@cis.udel.edu
         
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.pakistan
From: rps@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (raj.sharma)
Subject: Re: Culture x Nature
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:30:53 GMT
Followup-To: poster

(and a thousand battles shall be won..) writes:

> My point is that culture overrides nature in several aspects ...

	
	The culture that is not in harmony with nature
	                 is a false culture;
    	and [therefore]
	not worth having.
	

---raj
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.pakistan
From: mermmzh@engvms.unl.edu
Subject: Re: Book Review: Negationism in India
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln
Date: 13 Aug 92 22:31:58 CST

In article <1697slINN9e0@matt.ksu.ksu.edu>, misra@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Boo!) writes:
>>But, I am really not understanding how this gives an idea that persecution
>>of Hindus are going on in Bangladesh.
> 
> 	If Bd really thinks of minority issue then perhaps.. we should see
> "minorities" in powerful positions.. decision making positions. And could 
> someone supply the dates when those ministers served..I dont think going back
> 20yrs really shows anything.. i was hoping for somethign recent. Thanks..
> 
>>---Zakir
> 
> 
> 
>>> 
>>> Anisul Haque
>>> Texas A & M University
>

The  ministers in the previous posting served in Mujib,s cabinet
( 15 years ago). here are some other names ( not complete )

Members of Ziaur Rahman's cabinet ( approx. 10 years ago )

Sunil Gupta
Rosoraj Mondal
Benita Roy ( President's Adviser)

Members of Ershad's Cabinet ( 2 years ago )

Nitai Roy
Sunil Gupta


The only Hindu member of the present Khaleda's cabinet is

Gayesshor Roy
 
---Zakir


Xref: sparky soc.culture.bangladesh:4489 soc.culture.indian:28189 soc.culture.pakistan:13674