HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: shrdlu@willow.sdd.trw.com (Lynda L. True)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Security Clearance
Date: 21 Jul 92 15:45:54 GMT
Organization: TRW Inc., Redondo Beach, CA

In article <wgdms7m.allyn@netcom.com> allyn@netcom.com (Mark Allyn) writes:
>You talk about serious debt. How serious do you think they will get
>itchy with? In my own case, I have about 2,500 in credit card debt with
>an income of 40,000. Is this something they will get antsy about??

No, no, no....

This is not serious debt. You aren't in bankruptcy, you're paying your
payments (I assume), your balance isn't continuing to grow at an
alarming rate. Everybody these days probably has more credit card
debts than they should, but that isn't an unreasonable amount of debt.

The things that get you in trouble are lots of late payments or
defaults on them, bankruptcies, wages being garnished...

Also, if you win any money gambling you had better declare it, because
otherwise your bank balance and/or spending habits will change
unnaturally, and it won't look good.

TTFN, Lynda
-- 
Of course I don't SPEAK for TRW; they pay me to THINK for them.

shrdlu@rowan.sdd.trw.com (Lynda L. True)
Work Phone - (310) 812-1660 or (310) 812-1570
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: orville%weyrich@tnet.com (Orville R. Weyrich)
Subject: Re: Need suit and tie for a job interview ??
Reply-To: tnet.com!weyrich!orville
Organization: Weyrich Computer Consulting
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 09:11:53 GMT

In article <1463@outland.UUCP> richard@adpgate.UUCP ( ADP OPuS) writes:
>
>  My hope is to someday work in a place where many different individual 
>  people work.  Some may be sikhs with turbans, some may be expressing 
>  their African heritage, women will have short and long hair as will 
>  men.  And the best part of my dream is that leaders and managers will 
>  not be chained to sartorial stereotypes; the black woman in the 
>  multi-colored garb may just as possibly be the company president as 
>  the man with the waist length hair just as possibly as the man 
>  with the sport coat and tie.  Does that sound so damned radical? 
>  Maybe then we can get on with being a great economy and stop wasting
>  or energy on a lot of unimportant things.

It sounds great to me. I grudgingly wear a tie; I can't imagine what
kind of self-masochistic motivation drives womem to exert peer pressure
on each other to dress and make up the way they do in the work-place --
certainly I would not think less of a person [male or female] that came
to work in clean 50+ % cotton permanent press clothes chosen from a wardrobe 
that is only large enough to last from one washer load to the next. 
That is what I do when I think that I can get away with it. 
Is Madison Avenue that strong in this country? Certainly the clothiers
and the paint-manufactures would be the big economic losers if Americans
were to dress sensibly in the work-place. It remains to be seen whether
an increase in work-place productivity would result that would more than
balance the reduction in spending on [IMHO] nonsense. But "I have a dream"
:-).

orville

--------------------------------------       **********************************
Orville R. Weyrich, Jr.                          Weyrich Computer Consulting
Certified Data Processor                       POB 5782, Scottsdale, AZ 85261
Certified Systems Professional                      Voice: (602) 391-0821
Certified Computer Programmer                Internet: orville%weyrich@tnet.com
--------------------------------------       **********************************
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: M21552@mwvm.mitre.org
Subject: Re: Salary for programmer
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, McLean VA 22102
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:26:59 GMT

Your salary in CS will depend not so much on your MS degree, but rather on
your experience and area of expertise.  For example, I have a friend that
does not have a MS, but specializes in MS Windows applications.  As a
consultant last year he made over $100,000 because he set out as a goal to
be one of the few experts, outside of MicroSoft programmers, that knows
everything there is to know about the internals of Windows and building
Windows applications.  This year he sold a MS Windows testing tools to
a company on the west coast who bought the rights to the software from
him for over $750,000 plus he works as their personal consultant on the
tool for $80,000 anually.  Another friend of mine who specializes in
data communications and does not have a MS makes about $72,000/yr working
full-time at a company and he is approx. 34 years old.  I guess you should
weigh out your experience and specialty to determine how much you are worth.
Good Luck!
From: root@sickbay.austin.ibm.com
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Where to go over 35.
Date: 20 Jul 92 16:09:53 GMT
Organization: tmar ltd.

>While attending interviews for my job search I noticed several
>interesting qualities related to software firms.  I would like to hear
>any related comments on the subjects.
>1.  There are no older people in software development.
>Where do programmers go when they turn 35?  When I was introduced to
>the teams for some major products on the market, the average age
>seemed to be less than 30.  Beyond that, there seemed to few 'older'
>people at most other positions in the companies too.  I am somewhat
>concerned that after 10 years in this industry I will magically
>disappear.
 Some (of course not all) older hackers go and contract, or start some
 "other" business. (I did). It is hard to step backwards (employment)
 once you were on your own and made some decent money.
>2.  The better the position, the more casual the dress.
>I know people who code small COBOL projects for an insurance company
>who never deal with the public, yet must wear ties to work.  However
>at the top companies, it seems jeans are standard attire and sometimes
>shorts.
 Trust me dress code has nothing to do with it, it is more the stock
 option and the very performance of the said option is that will make you
 or break you. (see Microsoft)
>3.  It is difficult to write code at a chalkboard in front of your
>potential boss.
>Take the pressure as a given, your brain can forget things you knew in
>your sleep before the interview.  I think the biggest problem though,
>is not having reference material.  "So you know assembly huh?  Code
>this routine."  What would have been a five minute task at a computer
>has you tring to remember which instruction variation was correct, and
>which registers that instruction uses.
 You have said something I would call "a truism". But being in this 
 business for 13 years, I have never had to perform like a monkey.
 (except at microsoft interview. but that was at the interview !!)
>4.  People seem to like their work more than business related positions.
>It seems most developers would be doing some sort of programming even
>if they weren't paid for it.
 Maybe, but not me :-)
>-- Lee
 Cheers
 AMN
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: jscott@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Wile E. Coyote)
Subject: Looking for jobs
Summary: Middle East Specialist, Wash. DC area
Keywords: jobsearch
Organization: George Mason University, Fairfax, Va.
Distribution: misc.jobs.misc
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 04:40:19 GMT
Expires: 08/12/92 


I am posting this article for a friend of mine who has no net access.
What I am looking for is any information or contacts having to do with
jobs in intelligence analysis in general and middle east analysis
specifically.  Any information on headhunters or other contacts in the
Washington DC area would be of great help.  My friend's resume will be
posted in misc.jobs.resumes within the next week but for now please
make any replies to me via e-mail regarding jobs or contacts, etc.  The
scope of this job search is only limitted to the Greater Wash. DC area
and to jobs having to do with political analysis.

Thanx in advance,
John Scott (jscott@gmuvax2.gmu.edu)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: karkan@msdrl.com (Jim Karkanias)
Subject: Head Hunter list in SF Bay area
Organization: Merck Research Laboratories
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 92 12:34:23 GMT

If you have any contact information regarding placement agencies located in
the San Francisco Bay Area, or who place there, would you please be so kind as
to email it to me?  Thank you.

Jim
From: gartrell@girtab.usc.edu (Fred Gartrell)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: KPMG Peat Marwick?
Date: 30 Jul 1992 21:23:26 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: girtab.usc.edu

In article <1992Jul27.191333.6491@vu-vlsi.vill.edu> dibruno@vu-vlsi.vill.edu (Rich Rauscher) writes:
>A friend of mine will shortly be interviewing with KPMG Peat Marwick.
>Does anybody have any information or opinions on the firm ?
>
>-Joe
Can you say OVERTIME !!!. I didn't work the Peat, but I did work the Ernst &
Young.  In less than ten words,  SWEAT SHOP, CPA requirements, STRESS.

The Big 6 are generally the same in terms of the above.  Generally, you'll
find the differences in the specific office personalities.  In L.A., the
downtown office is much different than the Century City office.

If they swoon you over with "You'll work on entertainment clients" watch
out.  An audit is an audit.  Taxes are taxes. Consulting is consulting.
Make sure that the people you work with are friendly, as they will become
his or her surrogate spouse. You'll get to know what they smell like,
how they eat, and other interesting tidbits of their personal life.

The Big-6 is great for experience, training and exposure.  For a lifetime
committment,  I personally left.  I didn't want the stress and major
overtime.  Expectations are high at manager and above; however, these
trends are beginning to move downward to seniors and second year staff.

MASS LAYOFFS are a real thing in the Big-6.  Don't think that because
you have a job with a large accounting firm,  all the Big-6 have started
the trend of mass layoffs around summertime.  No Joke !.  I was in
the Big-6 when they started to layoff many of my friends.  I luckily
survived and left on my own accord.

These are my .02 worth.  Hope they paint a clear picture of life in the
Big-6.


Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: jjj@mits.mdata.fi (Joni Jarvenkyla)
Subject: Re: Need suit and tie for a job interview ??
Organization: Microdata Oy, Helsinki, Finland
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 19:53:58 GMT

In article <14mc2jINNo9j@stanley.cis.Brown.EDU> plutchak@pilsner.geo.brown.edu (Joel Plutchak) writes:
>   I wore a suit to only my first interview after college.  I've
>been a full-time employee for over ten years.  Draw your own
>conclusions.

Not all people can afford this. It never hurts to dress well. If it
really irritates you, it's always possible to ask about the dress code
in the company/the job you're applying to.

Of course the situation is a little bit different if you're hunted
through friends/other more personal contacts, but I wouldn't take any
risks when going to an appointment cold turkey.

-- 
jjj@mits.mdata.fi     Thanks, Life; thanks, Death    And the other me:
jjj@niksula.hut.fi    for freeing me from self       Jenny L{rv{joki
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: akkana@netcom.com (Akkana Peck)
Subject: Re: glass ceiling for software engineers
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 00:07:55 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Distribution: usa

In article <LAWS.92Jul18232450@sunset.ai.sri.com> laws@ai.sri.com (Kenneth I. Laws) writes:
>Glass ceilings are frustrating to those trapped below, but they
>may be advantageous for the company.  I refer to a theory that
>Laurence J. Peter expounds in "The Peter Principle."  If it is

The Peter Principle stems from the practice of promoting employees
out of their current jobs into positions of increasing managerial
responsibility.  If this is the only meaning of "promotion", then
indeed a "glass ceiling" can be advantageous for the company.
Lord knows the average engineer doesn't have the skills to make
a good manager.  (Need I add that the average manager doesn't have
the skills to make a good manager either? :-/ )

But why does "promotion" necessarily imply a change of job?  A few
enlightened companies have "technical tracks" that an engineer can
follow, gaining status and pay raises and responsibility while 
continuing to perform primarily technical tasks.  This seems like
a fairly effective method of countering the Peter Principle.

Reward valuable employees by giving them more money and responsibility,
but don't force them to do a job different from the job they enjoy and at
which they excel.

>Glass ceilings sound terrible, but Peter points out the joy of
>obtaining professional service from someone who has developed
>competence over a period of decades.  [ ... ]
>He recommends that we all do likewise, ducking promotions that
>would only lead us to incompetence, unhappiness, and insecurity.

Agreed.  But as long as companies provide pay and status increases for
engineers who consent to move into management, but not for engineers who
feel that they will better serve the company in a technical role,
engineers will continue to work toward managerial jobs for which they
may not be qualified.

	...Akkana			akkana@netcom.com
From: paw@coos.dartmouth.edu (Pat Wilson)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Need suit and tie for a job interview ??
Date: 22 Jul 92 22:14:44 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

oleary@epx.cis.umn.edu () writes:

>Rather than blindly holding a belief, why not seek the truth?  Has it
>occurred to you that one candidate may not have been born with silver
>spoon in mouth, but was forced to work and struggle to attain the education
>that was handed to the "senator's son"?  What kind of streets have you tried
>to walk down in a suit?  Isn't it possible that a person dresses not as they
>would like to, but in the only way they can afford to?

You're veering from the point.
I've *never* met a person that couldn't afford (a) soap and water, (b)
to comb their hair, and (c) to wash their clothes.  I doubt that _anyone_
with the capabilities to function in the type of positions *that are being
discussed here* can't afford at least a clean (note: not necessarily *new*) 
shirt with a tie and clean pants.

Women have a _much_ more difficult time trying to "dress for success" than
men do - all men need do is find a white shirt and a black tie, and perhaps
a not-too-loud sportcoat, and they'll fit in almost anywhere.  Women, on
the other hand, must decide among (a) jeans&tshirt (which is much more
casual, it seems, for women than men), (b) reasonable pants, (c) reasonable
skirt-n-blouse, (d) nice pants suit, (e) dress, and (f) business suit every
time.

--
Pat Wilson
Systems Manager, Project NORTHSTAR
paw@northstar.dartmouth.edu
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: frankli@seq.uncwil.edu (william carter franklin)
Subject: FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
Organization: Univ. of North Carolina @ Wilmington
Distribution: global
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 17:20:41 GMT





FLIGHT INSTRUCTION							   919-799-0088





			        	ROBERT G. SIKORSKI
			    	Certified Flight Instructor







private-commercial- Instrument             5333 FIELDING DRIVE
Single and multi-Engine Land              Wilmington N.C., 28405
From: marcusen@oodis01.af.mil (Contractor Chad Marcusen)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Technical Writer:  What is the current market like?
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:49:40 GMT
Organization: Hill AFB, Utah
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4


	A friend of mine has a chance to interview for a Technical Writing 
	position and asked me what the current market is paying.  Here are her
	qualifications:

		BA in English
		Masters in Literature
		7 years teaching Jr. High English
		Editor of 2 published technical manuals
		Editor of a college magazine

	How much might she expect as a technical writer? 
	How much might she expect as an editor?

   ______________________________________________________________________
   __                    __       _ _ _    marcusen@logdis1.oo.aflc.af.mil
  /  ) /          /     /  )     ' ) ) )
 /    /_  __.  __/     /--<       / / / __.  __  _. . . _   _  ____
(__/ / /_(_/|_(_/_    /___/ o    / ' (_(_/|_/ (_(__(_/_/_)_</_/ / <_

INGRES 6.3/02p  (pyr.u42/02)		 AV 458-0365 (2882) COM (801)777-0365
OO-ALC/SCCC (CDC)			 Control Data Corporation
Programmer/Analyst			 Pres UIUG (Utah Ingres User's Group)
From: mike@isgtec.com (Mike Sellers)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Bonus Criterion and %
Date: 28 Jul 92 14:20:59 GMT
Organization: ISG Technologies Inc., Mississauga Ontario

thsskac@iitmax.iit.edu (Kevin A. Chin) writes:
> A large automotive company gave out several million in bonuses
> to it's management while at the same time laid-off a bunch of 
> blue collar workers. The company was losing money for the year.

This, in my mind, is slimy 19th-century thinking.  Or perhaps I 
should say slimy, 20th-century thinking. :-(  In any event, it
highlights a company that will not make it in the coming years.

> Just a couple of questions:
> 
> 1) When can an employee *expect* a bonus?

This depends entirely on the company.  Many companies, especially
more established ones, give bonuses either regularly (every Christmas),
or for specific goals that have been met.  In either case, they lose
the opportunity to reward their employees for their overall behavior.

However, there is a trend beginning (hmmm... can trends be beginning, 
or are they trends only when they're in full swing?) to assign all 
employees some base pay plus a bonus when their unit and the entire 
company does well.  In a large and diverse company, such a pay plan 
might break down along the lines of:
  80% base pay
  10% group performance bonus pay
   5% division performance bonus pay
   5% overall corporate performance bonus pay

This type of plan has several real advantages:  It gives employees
sufficient security while tying their renumeration to their own
"local" performance and to the performance of the entire company.
They are *rewarded* for doing well, and for playing as a member of
the whole corporate team.  Note too that for mid-level and upper
management types, the percentages might change to reflect more of
a reward for performance at different levels.

> 2) What is an "average" bonus, as a % of pay?

I don't think there is an average.  It depends entirely on how good
a job someone has been doing, how they are viewed by their management,
and how their efforts affect the bottom-line.  I've seen and heard of
(first-hand) bonuses ranging from a dinner out with your spouse to 
$50,000+.  The standard deviation is obviously high. :-)

> 3) Lawyers,sales,marketing types often get bonuses, 
> 	do computer people (not included in above)
> 	get bonuses?

Yes.  In every computer firm that I know of, technical people do
get bonuses.  In every case that I know of where someone has gotten
wealthy from this business, it is because of bonuses, either in terms
of cash, or more probably, in terms of stock options and equity given
by the company.  These are often even better than cash.

> thanks.
> Kevin

--
                    Mike Sellers       mike@isgtec.com
                        User Interface Team Leader
                    ISG Technologies, Toronto, Canada
            "Actum ne agas" -- Do not do what has been done.
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: scott@asd.com (Scott Barman)
Subject: Re: Where to go over 35.
Organization: American Software Development Corp., W. Babylon, NY
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:40:07 GMT

In article <t3fm89j.pdh@netcom.com> pdh@netcom.com (Phil Howard ) writes:
>If you know, and need to know, only ONE assembler language, it might
>get tough.  If you have programmed as heavily as I have in one, it won't
>matter.  I found an old dusty IBM 360 GREEN CARD last week while cleaning
>out a box of junk.  The only reason to keep it is that it is an antique.

Hey, I have one of those!  I think I have it stuffed between the pages
of an old IBM 029 Keypunch manual.  Another item for the archives, along
with my S/360 AND S/370 P-OP!  (and I don't consider myself that old! :-)

>Let's put it THIS way.  Suppose you won a lottery that supplied you with
>a very good regular income for the rest of your life ($60,000 indexed
>to inflation per year) plus your choice of a new workstation or PC each
>year from what was new that year (up to $10,000, indexed, and cannot sell
>it).  Now what would you do?

Forget the computers and this screwball industry.  I would be on the
Outer Banks of North Carolina fishing to my heart's content!
-- 
scott barman			| <This space intentionally left blank>
scott@asd.com			|
 (I can barely speak for myself, you expect me to speak for my employer??)
From: swamy@devnull.mpd.tandem.com (Swamy S. Bale (Pi-Net))
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Looking for information on home based programming ....
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:57:33 GMT
Reply-To: swamy@devnull.mpd.tandem.com (Swamy S. Bale (Pi-Net))
Distribution: na
Organization: Tandem Computers; Austin TX
Originator: swamy@pecos

Hi everybody,

I purchased a computer and some compilers including Windows programming
tools and C++, and do have reasonable amount of spare time to do some
extra work. I am interested in finding part time programming assignments and
don't know how to approach the companies for this kind of stuff.

Is it better to send the resume? 

If I do that, it goes to human resources where it may get dumped or lost?

Can anybody explain how to approach the right people, what are the 
things involved in negotiating the contract, opening/closing the deal,
how to get customer requirements etc.,

Any references for books, tapes, or articles regarding this matter is also 
welcome.

If there is enough interest, I will summarize. 

P.S: This is not for doing the job at client location, but in my home office.

thanks
swamy 

Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard)
Subject: Re: Where do old programmers go?
Organization: The Turing Project, Charlottesville Virginia.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 23:04:40 GMT

In article <kaufman.711945816@Xenon.Stanford.EDU> kaufman@CS.Stanford.EDU writes:
>dens@pygmy.rice.edu (dens) writes:
>
>>Anybody who does NOT stay current with his chosen profession deserves
>>to drop into obscurity.
>
>On the other hand, its fun to be able to say "Well, that may work, but on
>the IBM 7090 we did it this way..."

I'm only 25 but still get odd looks when I mention the systems I worked
on 12 years ago, PDP11, RSTS/E, Ohio scientific 6502 with 32K, a >>1<< bit
CMOS CPU with 1 1bit register :)
PDP11 whats that?
Now I need to find some new data books, the 1976 CMOS data book
doesn't cut it any more...  

I just hope that its possible to keep learning new things, I'm already
slightly behind since I'm still using C instead of C++, atleast now that
GNU C++ is out I have the opportunity to learn it.
-- 
>>Unix/C Contract worker available 5 years C/unix work experience<<  ______
Available for Telecommuting/Travel and contracts on the T Line       \    /
in the Boston MA area. Send me e-mail for a copy of my Resume.        \  /
       -- VWIS 508-793-9568 (2400 baud), Linux support BBS.--          \/