From: slkg9733@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Steven L. Kellmeyer)
Subject: Re: Survivors of Abortion: The Dreaded Complication
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 04:17:40 GMT

chrisl@stpaul.gov (Chris A Lyman) writes:

>slkg9733@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Steven L. Kellmeyer) writes:

I notice that you inadvertantly left this part out, Chris, so I
helpfully re-inserted it.  You can reply to any of the complaints
I answered about the Philadephia Enquirer article.  I notice
that you completely omitted it, so should I assume that you are 
now satisfied with the Enquirer article?

(By the way, Doug = >>
	     Chris = >
	     ME = 
)

--------------------------------------------------------------
>dsh@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) quotes from the 
>Philadelphia Inquirer:

>> Something happens in a very small  number  of  abortions,  per-
>> formed  relatively  late  in pregnancy, that no one wants to talk
>> about. It horrifies  many  of  the  medical  personnel  who  have
>> encountered it.

>> What happens is that about once a day somewhere  in  the  U.S.,
>> something goes wrong and an abortion results in a live baby.

>Considering that fewer than 100 third trimester abortions are
>performed in the U.S. _every year_, I'm already doubting this
>article.

Big deal.  Premie survival in the second trimester is pretty common 
now days.  Try to stay up with the technology, huh?

>The fact that this article is _11_ years old (and therefore
>copies of the original are hard to come by) makes me wonder
>what point DearOldDoug is trying to make.

Oh, if the subject is over 11 years old it isn't true anymore?  
I guess RvW *SHOULD* be overturned, after all, it's now 20 and 
counting - way to old to be useful.

Besides, if you don't like the article, call the CDC.  They're the
ones who assert that there are between 300 and 400 live births 
resulting from abortion every year.  That's more than one a day.
One young lady, 14 years old, and the survivor of a saline abortion,
makes pro-life speeches around the country 20 days a month, every month
of the year (a tutor takes care of her schooling needs).

>And how about this litany?

>``We have produced an unusual dilemma,''

>``We've had guys drinking too much,''

>``You are doing a destructive process,''

>``There  is  a  lot  in  medicine  that  is  unpleasant,''

>``You get burned out,''

>``It's  disconcerting,''

>``That's not medicine,''

>``This is happening all over the  place,''

>``It is frightening,''

Pretty typical remarks from medical personel involved in the abortion
process.  What's your point?

>Btw, the birth of my daughter could be considered an abortion...

Oh, did you want her to die?  Did the ob/gyn try to strangle her with
surgical sutures and fail?  Did s/he cut off her buttocks in order to 
speed her bleeding to death?  Or did s/he wrap the baby in a newspaper
and put her on a side table, while ordering everyone to stay away from
the bundle 'til it stopped moving?  How many of the baby's limbs were
cut off doing the attempted D&C (the little girl in New York is only
missing an arm)?  Or did your wife get a hysterotomy?  Did you dig your
daughter out of the trash can on the way out of the clinic (I say clinic
because most abortions are not done in hospitals)?  Does your daughter
now have cerebral palsy due to the violence done her during this
"considered abortion" (many do)? If she does, you must feel like hell.
I extend my sympathy to you and your wife, and I hope your daughter 
learns to understand why you might want to consider her birth an
abortion.

>-- 
>Chris Lyman -  a personal        /   "I belong to no organized
>opinion for every occasion       /   political party.  I am a
>email: chrisl@pwcs.stpaul.gov    /   Democrat." -- Will Rogers

Steve Kellmeyer

-------------------------------------------------------

[deletions]

I hereby and formally apologize to Chris and his wife for my attack on 
what was a special occasion for Chris and his wife.  All I can say in 
my defense is that I found the juxtaposition of the beautiful event
of birth with the bloody horror of abortion to be a demeaning travesty.
I reacted emotionally to the staggeringly wretched comparison
instead of allowing it to pass.  I realize that this explanation in
no way modifies the brutality of my response - it merely puts me
on the same level as the man who made the comparison to begin with,
and that is a level I should not like to descend to again.

I will say, in passing, only that I was and am entirely sincere in 
the sympathies I extend to both his child and his wife.  I am deeply
sorry for them both.  They have to live with Chris. I have to live
with the terrible reply I made to this man.  May God have mercy on
each of us.

>-- 
>Chris Lyman -  a personal        /   "I belong to no organized
>opinion for every occasion       /   political party.  I am a
>email: chrisl@pwcs.stpaul.gov    /   Democrat." -- Will Rogers

Steve Kellmeyer
Newsgroups: talk.abortion