HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: STrzaskoma@news.cso.uiuc.edu (Stephen Trzaskoma)
Subject: Re: Catullus & his sparrow
Organization: U of Illinois Dept. of the Classics
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 17:04:36 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.190749.19413@leland.Stanford.EDU>
alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson) writes:
>In article <BzF92w.DqA@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, Stephen Trzaskoma writes:
>>But to deny that the word passer has an erotic
>>context is Victorian prudery.
>
>And not simply Victorian. 
Agreed!
>

>
>Ahh.  But Catullus ran with a fast crowd, not unlike the late Victorian
>aesthetes (Beardsley, Wilde, usw.) who used language amongst themselves that
>was *intentionally* shocking to the upright, prudish Republican mores by which
>they were surrounded.
>

>It is thus possible to maintain both our statements, that Catullus and his
>friends used this language freely, and that the terms were obscene, shocking,
>and not in *free* use among the general populace.

While I do not have any sort of violent reaction to the above, the references
in Catullus indicate that he didn't run with a bunch of proto-bohemians, but
rather moved among the best circles in Rome (including Caesar who was his
father's friend). His references to Mamurra as Mentula ("Prick") caused Caesar
acute embarrassment but didn't shock him.  After all, the story goes, having
apologized for hurting Caesar's reputation by attacking Mamurra, Caesar invited
Catullus to stay that very night for dinner.  As for *free* use, the small
hints of colloquial Latin that we do have indicate that half of Catullus'
brilliance lies in his incorporation of that kind of speech into his very
polished poetry.  Pedicabo ego vos et irrumabo would have made perfect sense to
the general populace.  They would have been impressed even more by the fine
meter; they also would probably have laughed when they realized that Catullus
had taken what was essentially a moribund metaphor (like our own f*ck you) and
given it back its literal sense.  All in all, I simply cannot agree.

Respectfully,
Stephen Trzaskoma

(p.S. how are things at Stanford Classics (are you in the dept?)?  I did my
undergrad work there....)
>-- 
>Rich Alderson   'I wish life was not so short,' he thought.  'Languages take
>                such a time, and so do all the things one wants to know
about.'
>                                                        --J. R. R. Tolkien,
>alderson@leland.stanford.edu                              _The Lost Road_
>
From: louns@cs.washington.edu (Michael Lounsbery)
Newsgroups: sci.classics
Subject: Re: PEOPLE Rebus Classics Query-Again
Date: 28 Dec 92 18:59:50 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle

In article <1992Dec24.163810.24246@midway.uchicago.edu> dfb1@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>     Several months ago I saw an article in PEOPLE magazine
>about a graduate student, deciphering a cryptic Greek
>painting.  He/She figured out the figures represented letters
>of the Greek alphabet -- A "rebus".  I think there was
>something like that in the Satyricon.
>     If anyone has any information about this PEOPLE piece,
>the scholar who was the subject, or any published form in
>which this or similar items might be found, I would
>appreciate hearing about it.
>     My Mailing Address is:	dfb1@midway.uchicago.edu
>     Phone:  312-548-1210.   Thanks.  Don Brosnan

Perhaps you're thinking of the Portland Vase? There was a big article in the
New York Times about someone explaining it by saying the architecture was
supposed to be the letters for PI.  It sounded pretty contrived to me.  I
heard a much more convincing explanation at a talk here at the UW a few
months previous.  The talk I heard (I forget who, someone with an
appointment at Corning Glass, appropriately enough) explained it as a
parallel representation of Paris/Hecuba/Aphrodite and Augustus/Augustus'
mother/Neptune.  He gave a pretty compelling explanation, but I'll skip the
details here.

If this is it, I'm mystified as to why the PI explanation got so much
coverage.  It was quite out of the ordinary, which probably attracted
attention, but the justification really seemed pretty weak.

Regards,

Michael Lounsbery
louns@cs.washington.edu
Newsgroups: sci.classics
From: dfb1@quads.uchicago.edu (donald francis brosnan)
Subject: PEOPLE Rebus Classics Query-Again
Reply-To: dfb1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 16:38:10 GMT

     Several months ago I saw an article in PEOPLE magazine
about a graduate student, deciphering a cryptic Greek
painting.  He/She figured out the figures represented letters
of the Greek alphabet -- A "rebus".  I think there was
something like that in the Satyricon.
     If anyone has any information about this PEOPLE piece,
the scholar who was the subject, or any published form in
which this or similar items might be found, I would
appreciate hearing about it.
     My Mailing Address is:	dfb1@midway.uchicago.edu
     Phone:  312-548-1210.   Thanks.  Don Brosnan
Newsgroups: sci.classics
From: dfb1@quads.uchicago.edu (donald francis brosnan)
Subject: PEOPLE Rebus Article Query
Reply-To: dfb1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
     Several months ago I saw an article in PEOPLE magazine
     If anyone has any information about this PEOPLE piece,
     My Mailing Address is:        dfb1@midway.uchicago.edu
     Phone:  312-548-1210.   Thanks.  Don Brosnan
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 15:45:10 GMT


Newsgroups: sci.classics
Organization: Universit de Sherbrooke
Date: Monday, 28 Dec 1992 19:55:05 EST
From: <LDAA@UDESVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: sci.classics
Subject: The devil and semantics

In the book "Qu'est-ce que l'autorite?", philosopher J.M. Bochenski
says this (I am freely translating from the french):

The poet makes the devil say: "Keep to the words! Thus you will enter
into the temple of certainty".

Does anyone know to what Bochenski is alluding?

Pierre Blackburn   Ldaavm1.si.usherb.ca
departement de philosophie
College/Universite de Sherbrooke
Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada
Newsgroups: sci.classics,alt.postmodern,rec.arts.books
From: gcf@panix.com (Gordon Fitch)
Subject: Re: The devil and semantics
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 20:06:21 GMT
Organization: mydog in exile

In article <92363.195505LDAA@UDESVM.BITNET> <LDAA@UDESVM.BITNET> writes:
| In the book "Qu'est-ce que l'autorite?", philosopher J.M. Bochenski
| says this (I am freely translating from the french):
| 
| The poet makes the devil say: "Keep to the words! Thus you will enter
| into the temple of certainty".
| 
| Does anyone know to what Bochenski is alluding?

Do we know that he is alluding to something in particular?
-- 

 )*(    Gordon Fitch    )*(    gcf@panix.com    )*(
( 1238 Blg. Grn. Sta.,  NY NY 10274 * 718.273.5556 )
From: Andy Wright <A.Wright@uts.edu.au>
Newsgroups: sci.classics
Subject: Re: Catullus & his sparrow
Date: 22 Dec 1992 00:51:48 GMT
Organization: UTS Students Association
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: awright.kgi.uts.edu.au
X-UserAgent: Nuntius v1.1

In article <BzF92w.DqA@news.cso.uiuc.edu> Stephen Trzaskoma,  writes:
>Roman???) poetry where the reading of sparrow=penis would make a whole
lot of

Fascinating stuff! And to think that for all these years I thought
"passer mortuus est was about a bird". The things they don't tell you in
High School!!!
>===========================================____________========<
>|                          | PHONE:          L______|\\       |<
>|       ANDY WRIGHT        |   (02) 3305470 /  m|m  \  "THEY  |<
>|    Education Officer     | E-MAIL:       ( --O-O-- )  WANT  |<
>|--------------------------|     (PEGASUS)  |  /U\  |   WHAT  |<
>| UTS Students Association |   utechkur     |  ===  |   !?#!" |<
>| Kuring-gai Campus Office |     (AARNET)    \__^__/          |<
>| Eton Rd LINDFIELD 2070   |    andyw@wattle.ccsd.uts.edu.au  |<
>===============================================================<
From: GC.GGG@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gwyn Gordon)
Newsgroups: sci.classics
Subject: FUNDING ANNOUNCEMENT
Date: 29 Dec 1992 14:49:33 -0800
Organization: Stanford University
NNTP-Posting-Host: morrow.stanford.edu


***FUNDING OPPORTUNITY***

Research Expeditions International is accepting applications for
funding for research projects scheduled for 1994.

Research Expeditions International specializes in Participatory
Research, in which well-educated lay people provide funding and
volunteer as the on-site work force. Studies best suited for
Participatory Research involve data collection or unskilled labor
which is easily taught to one or several groups of adults.
Preference will be given to studies in the following areas: animal
behavior; archaeological excavation; and tourist impact on culture,
economy and ecology. Studies in other fields will certainly be
considered if appropriate.

Applications for the 1994 season are due February 1, 1993.

For informational materials and application, contact:

Gwyn Gordon
gwyn.gordon@forsythe.stanford.edu
415-494-2515
806 Los Robles Avenue
Palo Alto, CA 94306
From: dietz@cs.rochester.edu (Paul Dietz)
Subject: Re: Nuclear Power and Climate Change
Organization: University of Rochester
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 21:49:34 GMT

In article <1992Dec31.212045.25005@vexcel.com> dean@vexcel.com (Dean Alaska) writes:

> Okay, I can accept that.  Someone e-mailed to me to say that India has
> a home-grown nuclear industry but I guess Bangladesh wouldn't get
> technology from them.  If this is working for Bangladesh (and India),
> I have no problems with it.


India does have a nuclear industry, but it is not doing terribly
well, I understand.  They are having a hard time building plants
on time or on budget.

Bangladesh would be a poor choice for nuclear power, at least in the
near term.  They actually have considerable natural gas (some of the
cheapest natural gas outside of OPEC); Bangladesh exports nitrogen
fertilizers made with the gas to other countries in Asia.  Their main
concern would be to minimize capital cost, so gas turbines (perhaps
with cogeneration) are likely their best choice.  If I recall
correctly, simple cycle gas turbogenerators cost less than $500/kW.

	Paul F. Dietz
	dietz@cs.rochester.edu
From: drury@esvax.dunet.dupont.com (Robert F. Drury)
Newsgroups: sci.energy
Subject: Re: Flywheel batteries as EV power source
Date: 28 Dec 92 14:14:04 GMT
Followup-To: sci.energy
Organization: Du Pont Electronics

Stuff delete
> Rutan's Voyager aircraft circled the globe on 200 gallons. That's
> 125 MPG. And most people will acknowledge that aircraft drag can
> be reduced below that of practical autos, and that Voyager couldn't
> be called a practical aircraft for anything but record setting.
> 
> Any claim for a practical vehicle that gets over 50 MPG equivalent
> over a 600 mile run, gas, electric, flywheel, whatever, should be 
> scrutinized with great care.
> 
> Note that the Sunracer style vehicles used in the solar electric
> vehicles races often claim better than 1,000 MPG equivalent, but
> one look at those vehicles reveals they aren't practical transportation.
> 
> In the 1970s, Mercedes built a diesel streamliner with a 0.40 cubic
> inch engine that claimed a closed course record of 1053 MPG at an
> average speed of 12 MPH and a total distance travelled of 8.8 miles.
> I think they intended to go further, but something broke off when they
> hit a bump.
> 
> Gary
> -- 
> Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | gatech!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
> Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | uunet!rsiatl!ke4zv!gary
> 534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | emory!kd4nc!ke4zv!gary      
> Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     | emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu

	My 1992 Honda Civic VX has *averaged* 52.3 MPG over the past 30,000 miles.
 Since I drive over 40,000 miles per year, I require a practical car.
From: moroney@world.std.com (Michael Moroney)
Subject: Re: Domestic Hot Water Heaters - oil vs. electric
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:37:38 GMT

dbliss@fox.nstn.ns.ca (Doug Bliss) writes:

>I have heard that oil-fired domestic hot water heaters are very 
>ineffecient (20-30% efficiency) compared to electric hot water heaters.  
>Does anyone have any information on efficiencies and heat losses expected 
>from these types of hot water heaters?

First, my home heating system is essentially a oil-fired hot water heater
(except the hot water heats my house not a shower) and it is rated as 87%
efficient.  Higher efficiency is available.  I see no reason why an oil
fired hot water heater should be only 20-30% efficient.

Second, while the electric heater is 100% efficient at converting the
electricity you pay for into heat, the power plant is only about 40%
efficient at generating the electricity and getting it to you.

This is reflected in the higher price of electricity compared to oil.

(consider gas, if possible, too)

-Mike
Newsgroups: sci.energy
From: jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)
Subject: Re: Nuclear Power and Climate Change
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 93 04:28:19 GMT
Organization: Dixie Communications Public Access.  The Mouth of the South.

yodaiken@chelm.cs.umass.edu (victor yodaiken) writes:

>In article <1992Dec31.165855.22315@vexcel.com> dean@vexcel.com (Dean Alaska) writes:
>>In article <p2qrxnc@dixie.com> jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond) writes:
>>nor will it drastically change operational costs.  There is no
>>experience with 50 year old reactors.  I have read that the issue
>>of embrittlement is not well understood.  If John De Armond
>>thinks these figures are junk he better take his arguments to his
>>friends in the nuclear industry.

Ahhh, Yackadamn's back!!!!  Just like a persistent case of the Clap.

>The facts are that there are proposed methods for reversing embittlement
>but they have not been tried except in the Soviet Union and, I believe,
>one small experimental reactor in Belgium. The costs of these proposed
>methods are large, their effectiveness is not known. 

Cost is only high relative to small things like, say, your paycheck.
Relative to new power plant construction, annealing the pot is trivial.
As to effectiveness, if you've ever annealed a piece of hardened
steel, you know how effective heat is in eliminating stress.  Really
does not matter how the stress got there.  

>The NRC shut down
>Yankee Rowe precisely because its containment vessel showed signs of
>losing enough ductility to make its continued operation dangerous. The
>utility chose to decomission rather than to attempt annealing. The
>rapidity of ductility loss is the subject of controversy. 

Three strikes and you're out, yackadamn.  Yankee was shut down by the
utility because it was a tiny unit that was not economical - in the
judgement of the untility - to refurb.  While I would have liked to
see Yankee do a demonsration project with that tiny reactor, it was
not my money to spend.

C'mon Yack.  You can do better than that.  What's wrong, still drunk
from New Years?

John
-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC               |Interested in high performance mobility?  
Performance Engineering Magazine(TM) | Interested in high tech and computers? 
Marietta, Ga                         | Send ur snail-mail address to 
jgd@dixie.com                        | perform@dixie.com for a free sample mag
Need Usenet public Access in Atlanta?  Write Me for info on Dixie.com.
From: ken@sugra.uucp (Kenneth Ng)
Newsgroups: sci.energy
Subject: Re: Notch another one up for the Greennazis
Date: 23 Dec 92 03:25:07 GMT
Organization: Private Computer, Totowa, NJ

In article <550001@hplred.HPL.HP.COM: curry@hplred.HPL.HP.COM (Bo Curry) writes:
:Not necessarily helpful  I think that when Pu enters the marrow, it is actually
:   in the bone itself, not the marrow cells.  It should substitute for Ca in
:   the bone structure.  A marrow transplant would probably leave the Pu behind
:   to make leukemia all over again.  I doubt there is any effective treatment
:   for over-exposure to Pu.
:Actually I've heard Pu can be leached out with some organic compounds,
:so it can be flushed out of the body with treatment - anyone know
:what the current status of that is?

Source: Handbook on Toxicity of Inorganic Compounds, edited by Hans G. Seiler.
Page 724, on plutonium detoxification.  "A chelating agent, DTPA, is widely
used for this treatment. ... It efficiently combats contamination by soluble
compounds and prevents the bloodstream from transporting Pu to liver, bone,
and other target organs, by chelating the plutonium bound to blood proteins.
... The DTPA chelate is excreted in the urine.  DTPA has no real effect once
the plutonium is deposited on the skeleton."

Now is my conjecture.  Has anyone ever tried large concentrations of calcium
in the diet for long term (and gradual) reduction of plutonium in bone?  My
presumption is that the body will tend to absorb calcium, as opposed to
plutoium, which is really what it is after.

-- 
Kenneth Ng
Please reply to ken@eies2.njit.edu for now.
Apple and AT&T lawsuits: Just say NO!
Xref: sparky sci.energy:6320 sci.electronics:21286
From: vbreault@rinhp750.gmr.com (Val Breault)
Newsgroups: sci.energy,sci.electronics
Subject: Re: Flywheel batteries as EV power source
Date: 21 Dec 92 16:31:52 GMT
	<1992Dec17.011649.987@cmkrnl.com> 	<BzJHE7.B8@xrtll.uucp>
	<gfBCW0a00YUn84A25_@andrew.cmu.edu> <78150@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM>
Followup-To: sci.energy
Organization: General Motors Research Labs
In-reply-to: mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM's message of 21 Dec 92 14:13:46 GMT

In article <78150@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM> mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM (Mark Wilson) writes:

   Sounds like an interesting idea to me.  Make one end of the flywheel a motor
   driven by line current.  Make the other end a generator that powers your
   computer, or whatever.  Output is electrically isolated from the input, and
   the mass of the flywheel will even out the surges and dropouts.

You've just described a motor-gererator (MG) set.  Other uses for MGs:
voltage/phase/frequency conversion.

--
-val-

Val Breault - GM Research - vbreault@gmr.com - N8OEF            \      /|
Instrumentation dept., 30500 Mound Rd., Warren, MI 48090-9055    \    / |
The opinions expressed by the author do not necessarily reflect   \  /__|
those of GMR or those of the General Motors Corporation.           \/   |___
From: huber@news.gac.edu (Tom Huber)
Newsgroups: sci.energy
Subject: Energy Simulation Games/Programs
Date: 21 Dec 92 22:40:36 GMT
Organization: Gustavus Adolphus College
NNTP-Posting-Host: toms-pc.gac.edu

I am going to be teaching a course "Energy: Where are we and What's Next"
this January.  I am looking for energy simulations which deal with managing
"scarce" energy resources and the implications of different stratagies.
Does anyone know of such simulations, either "role playing" type of games 
or computer simulations.
Thanks!
-------------------------------------              
Tom Huber, Physics Department
Gustavus Adolphus College
St. Peter, MN 56082 
(507) 933-7036
Internet: HUBER@GAC.EDU   Bitnet: HUBER@GACVAX1
-------------------
    Tom Huber                      Internet:  huber@gac.edu
    Physics Department             BITNET:    huber@gacvax1.bitnet
    Gustavus Adolphus College
    St. Peter, MN 56082 USA        Phone:     (507)933-7036
Newsgroups: sci.energy
From: gary@ke4zv.uucp (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Flywheel batteries as EV power source
Reply-To: gary@ke4zv.UUCP (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 17:28:52 GMT

In article <drury-281292091239@esrfd.es.dupont.com> drury@esvax.dunet.dupont.com (Robert F. Drury) writes:
>Stuff delete
>> 
>> Any claim for a practical vehicle that gets over 50 MPG equivalent
>> over a 600 mile run, gas, electric, flywheel, whatever, should be 
>> scrutinized with great care.
>
> My 1992 Honda Civic VX has *averaged* 52.3 MPG over the past 30,000 miles.
> Since I drive over 40,000 miles per year, I require a practical car.

That's quite extraordinary. The GEO Metro, the VW Rabbit Diesel, and the
Civic VX are the current mileage champs in the US. Their *highway*
mileage is rated in the 50s. City mileage ratings dip into the low
40s. You must do mostly highway driving.

These economy champs are the target that EVs have to shoot for. And
it's a hard one to surpass without turning the vehicle from a practical
econo-commuter to an impractical Sunracer. And there's still the family
van, the salesman's sedan, and the tradesman's pickup, none of which
can approach these mileage numbers on a routine basis.

Gary
-- 
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | gatech!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | uunet!rsiatl!ke4zv!gary
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | emory!kd4nc!ke4zv!gary      
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     | emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu
Newsgroups: sci.energy
From: pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai)
Subject: Re: Popular Science Fly Wheel Article
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 19:19:23 GMT

In article <1h41jqINNn2j@gap.caltech.edu> carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU writes:
>	2)  They've reduced the energy stored in each flywheel.  I'd be happier
>	    if they were using about 500 flywheels, but 20's a start.  They're
>	    now only talking about something like 2 sticks of dynamite
>	    equivalent in the event of a flywheel failure.

Wouldn't you expect that a containment failure in one would quickly
cause all the others to fail too? Wouldn't 20 flywheels in general be
more likely to have one failure than one flywheel would, assuming the
same levels of margin were engineered into both designs?  (just as a
trivial example, if you use electro-magnetic bearings that's 20 times
as many connectors which could fail. There's also 20 times as many
vacuum valves which could fail.)

>>For now, the flywheel battery exists only as a computer simulation.
>
>Yup.  The jackass who was complaining that this discussion was talking about
>theoretical considerations instead of tested technology apparently thinks that
>we should just take advertisers' claims as gospel, rather than treating them as
>theoretical considerations, and not tested technology.

Not only that, but a spokesperson (president of the company, actually)
who is obviously intentionally using misleading words like "fluff".
(his success rate at deceiving the public must be phenomenal
considering how many USENET english majors he's hoodwinked)

-- 
My opinions are my own.
From: lewc@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Lew Chua-Eoan)
Subject: wind powered generators
Organization: Austin, Tx.
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 00:51:51 GMT

I don't know if i'm in the right news forum but here goes:

Does anyone know of commercially viable wind-powered generators.
i.e. I need firms and contacts. Tx.