HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: eliot@stalfos.engr.washington.edu (eliot)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Mansell left because of Prost?
Date: 29 Sep 92 21:17:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: engr.Sep29.210620.21641
Organization: clearer than blir

In article <BvCp3p.9GM@news.cso.uiuc.edu> tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn Padfield) writes:
>	Senna is an unbelievable hypocrite!!!!!!!! He has said that if he
>doesn't have a chance to win, he won't drive next year. He has a right to
>refuse to drive what he believes will be an inferior car (in the '93 McLaren
>MP4/8), but to cry about Prost and his supposed no-Senna clause is outrageous!
>All of this from the man who vetoed Warwick from Lotus!!!!!!!! I have practi-
>cally no respect for him anymore, or Mansell for that matter!


I feel that Prost is justified in vetoing Senna.  After all, didn't he
tell the world that he deliberately crashed Prost out in Japan 2 years
ago?  Too bad for Senna if he can't play F1 politics.. no use whining
and calling names.  I'd rather have a driver playing politics than a
driver playing with death on the racetrack.  I hope that Senna sits
out 1993, because if he doesn't it will get real ugly when he crashes
into Prost deliberately again.  The way he was talking at the Portugal
post-race interview sends shivers up my spine.  All he has to do is to
pull a Berger style "racing accident" to stop Prost.  And I think he
is low enough to do such a thing too.

There, let's see the flames start on this one... :-) :-)


eliot
From: rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com (Richard Beckett)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 08:13:35 GMT
Subject: Re: Portugal results SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Labs, Bristol, UK
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Reply-To: rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com


In article <1992Sep28.191627.20244@hubcap.clemson.edu>,
csroach@eng.clemson.edu (Shane Roach) writes:
|> 
|> I didn't join the live feed till the sixth lap, so why did Schumacher start
|> in 25th position?  He qualified around 5th.
	
	
	He didn't get off the grid on the warm up lap in time, cause his 
	engine cut. It happened to someone else as well, who got away last,
	so Schumacher was 25th.


	Cheers,


		RIK


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rik O'Chet, Bristol, England.		
Email: rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com		One's never alone with a Rubber Duck !
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: tak@doe.utoronto.ca (Tak Ariga)
Subject: Re: ESPN vs. CBC 
Organization: Dictionary of Old English - U of Toronto
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 05:26:39 GMT

In article <1992Sep26.201827.14960@iisat.alt.ns.ca> kevin@iisat.alt.ns.ca 
	(Kevin Davies) writes:

> >4. CBC shows the post-race driver interviews. Often as entertaining as the
> >   on-track action.
> 
> 	Yes, this is quite something.  I think they only started
> 	that this year.

Well, they started showing the interviews _regularly_ midway though
last season.

Up to that point, the CBC would sometimes show the post-race 
interviews, and sometimes not.  In the middle of last season, I wrote a 
letter to the CBC about their F1 coverage.  Among my comments were that 
I liked the post-race interviews, and asked that they show it.  I got 
a prompt reply saying that they'll pass on my comments to the producers.
Guess what?  They started showing the post-race interviews (albeit, 
usually only the victor) the VERY NEXT RACE.  

Not to entirely claim credit, but I suggested other changes and many 
were implemented too!  It may have been a coincidence, but I was 
happy.  :-)  I recall someone here on r.a.s. saying their suggestion
was also heeded (about getting Gerry Donaldson for some analysis, 
which they did at the start of this season.)  [Was it Tom?]  I'm glad 
that the CBC listens to its viewers, and that we can make a difference.

-- 
Tak Ariga, Dictionary of Old English Project, University of Toronto, Canada
           tak@doe.utoronto.ca  tak@doe.toronto.edu  utdoe!tak
From: conrad@pico.OZ (Conrad Drake)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Desmo Debut Delayed
Date: 29 Sep 92 05:56:02 GMT
Reply-To: conrad@pico.qpsx.oz.au
Organization: QPSX Communications
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

chrisp@regenmeister.Sun.COM (Chris Prael) writes:
: The sole reason for multivalve heads is to increase the cross section 
: (area) of the valve opening, thus increasing the volume of air/fuel 
: mixture that can be moved into and out of the cylinder.  Valve cross
: section is also the sole reason for the twin plug head design that Alfa
: Romeo did in the 60s 
 Ummm, maybe for Alfa, but it's not the only reason for twin plugs.
Refer to rec.motocycles for a (current) discussion of twin plug heads.

: and valve cross section is the primary reason that
: short stroke engines produce more horsepower that do long stroke engines
: of the same displacement.
Primary?  Only at the same RPM and ignoring power loss/ ring float due
to excessive piston speeds.

I think that I whould be correct in stating that piston velocity limits
were the primary reason for the migration  (in the 40s-60s) to short
stroke motors.

Conrad Drake

--
"There's something stirring in my loins and it isn't the spirit of Jesus"
                - Helen Razor, JJJ announcer, 1992.

Email: conrad@pico.qpsx.oz.au
Snail: QPSX Communications, Private Bag 24, West Perth 6005, Australia. 
Numbers:(ph) +61 9 324 1641, (fx) +61 9 321 2984 (dod) 0604

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: wolf@pioneer.unm.edu (Mark Giaquinto)
Subject: Re: F1/CART safety (Re: Mansell goes to Indycars)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 03:58:44 GMT
Organization: Space and Planetary Image Facility

In article welty@cabot.balltown.cma.COM (richard welty) writes:
>In article chrisp@regenmeister.Sun.COM (Chris Prael) writes:
>>You must have missed something.  It has been more than 5 years since the
>>Formula 1 regulation permitted the driver's feet to be forward of the
>>centerline of the front wheels.  CART/USAC rules still permit the
>>driver's feet to be a significant distance forward of the front wheel
>>centerline.
>i was under the impression that this was changed in indycars about
>3 years ago, and that the current rule was comparable to the current
>F1 rule.  can someone (hopefully with access to an actual rulebook)
>please shed some light on this for us?  i know that the foot box rules
>for indycars will be radically revised for 1993 in light of the piquet
>accident ...

The change in rules in 93 were not cause of piquet or any other accident, it was
the result of of a five year "study" (not sure if that is the correct term), if
the remember right.  Anyone know if the reduced downforce rules have been a
aaprovved for 93?

Mark
>
>richard
>-- 
>richard welty                            518-393-7228
>welty@cabot.balltown.cma.com
>  ``if you can read this, mario, you're too close''
>    -- bumper sticker seen on a CART safety truck


Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield)
Subject: Re: McLaren and Renault
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 13:29:14 GMT

danjones@pyrps5.eng.pyramid.com (Dan Jones) writes:

>Brian Lee Wilson writes:
>>
>>Do you think that McLaren and Renault will have a decent         
>>relationship considering how Ron Dennis got it?        

>Have I missed something, or is this still in the rumour stage?  And
>if I missed something, how did Ron get it?

     You may have missed something. There was a rumor following Portugal
that TAG was going to buy out Ligier just so McLaren would have Renault
engines for '93. I believe it to be nothing more than a rumor, and a 
bad one at that, but maybe it is true, and maybe others have greater
faith in the rumor mill. But, somehow I just don't think that the team, 
or its engines, could be purchased without Guy's or Francois' okay. And
that okay would seem impossible to get. Why would Guy voluntarily give up
his Renault's to a competitor for money alone. He seems to have enough of
that without TAG's help. Anyway, I just don't think this one is quite
baked thru yet, so maybe a month will tell us more.

My $0.02
Cory

>Dan Jones
From: adams@spss.com (Steve Adams)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Dover Eyewitness Wanted (NASCAR)
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:35:11 GMT
Article-I.D.: spssig.adams.718040111
Organization: SPSS Inc.

meier@rtc.atk.com (Christopher M. Meier) writes:

>In article <adams.717861596@spssig> adams@spss.com (Steve Adams) writes:
>>Oh?  The man with 3 LAST place finishes so far this year?   The guy with a
>>real good chance of not finishing in the top-ten in points?
>>
>>Yeah, yeah, 5 championships...but the King has seven...and 4 times as many
>>wins...
>>   Steve Adams        "Space-age cybernomad"       Fax:   (312) 329-3558
>
>Yeah, well, if Earnhardt was running as many races a year as Petty
>used to, things might be different.  And if he had been racing as long.
Agreed...but hey, what's the net if there are no cheap shots? ;-)

>Anyone else notice that the Goodwrench chevrolet has been puking almost
>every race since Shelmerdine started racing himself?  Is he still a
>member of the Childress team?  Why?  I wouldn't blame only Dale for
>his points position; matter of fact I would give him little of the blame.

I wouldn't give Dale any of the blame.   I have never, ever seen Dale have
this many mechanical problems.  It's really unbelievable for a top team to
have this happen...

Dale is a good driver...and he's changed a lot from the Wrangler days...

 -Steve  (I *STILL* like Eliott better...at least he has good taste in cars!)
--
  The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
                         -------------------
   adams@spss.com                                  Phone: (312) 329-3522
   Steve Adams        "Space-age cybernomad"       Fax:   (312) 329-3558
From: winalski@adserv.enet.dec.com (Paul S. Winalski)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Buick out of IndyCar?
Date: 1 Oct 92 21:07:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: nntpd2.1992Oct1.210743.6216
Reply-To: winalski@adserv.enet.dec.com (Paul S. Winalski)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation, Nashua NH


In article <e55XRB2w165w@dlhpfm.UUCP>,
dlhpfm.uucp!dlh@ab.com (daniel lance herrick) writes:
|>
|>Has a Buick with the extra boost ever finished an Indy 500?  I thought
|>the Buick engine was a qualifying engine; that the boost was guaranteed
|>to break the engine long before it completes 500 miles.

Al Unser (Sr.) drove one to a third place finish in this year's Indy 500.
They use the extra boost throughout the race, not just in qualifying.

--PSW
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Re: Buick out of IndyCar?
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 20:39:21 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.163928.2893@kronos.arc.nasa.gov> chucko@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Chuck Fry) writes:
>Sure it has!  Big Al Unser finished 3rd in one this year.  He actually
>led for a while during one of Michael A.'s pit stops... you should
>have heard the crowd roar.  Big Al did in fact play an important role
>in helping wear down Mikey so his son could win.
>

and Big Al has a VERY legitimate chance (in the Penske) in seeing the
checker first at Nazareth this Sunday.  Being out of a cockpit for a
time never seems to bother him.  Absolutely one of the most cool and
calculating drivers that has ever competed in IndyCars.  Not always a
charger, but he knows how to bring it home.

-cball-
From: tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn Padfield)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Benneton/Portugal ??
Date: 29 Sep 92 22:11:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.BvD1n2.F7v
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley) writes:

>What were those two rectangular LCD readouts above the dash on the
>Bennetons keeping track of ? They both seemed to around zero when
>Brundle/Schumacher where off the gas and around 500 when they were
>on the gas. Also, did Mclaren use the active suspension at any time
>during the weekend ?

>George

	I think the two LCD's are speed and lap time, although I'm not sure
especially the latter. I'm not sure if McLaren used the active any, have to
wait until FOSA sends me a newsletter next week.

TOBY...
From: b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1 Portugal: Patrese incident
Date: 30 Sep 92 00:22:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: utarlg.29SEP199219224380
Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

salil@igor.tamri.com (Salil Saxena) writes...
martin@inferenzsysteme.informatik.th-darmstadt.de (Martin Protzen) writes:

>>So although slowing down (and
>>being pushed by Patrese) he went for a pit stop but actually didn't
>>stop there. German TV showed Berger on the track again before Patrese
>>had left his car. That means his only intentions were to keep Patrese
>>behind.
> 
>Interesting you mention this.  The ESPN folks had mentioned that maybe Berger
>was trying to Pit.  But as you well pointed out, Berger didn't come in and
>pit. Instead went through the pit lane and back on to the race track, probably
>at full steam.  It was also mentioned that maybe the McLaren pit crew was not
>ready for Berger, who then had to pit a bit latter.
> 
>I find this last statment a bit hard to believe.  If Berger was trying to pit,
>the McLaren pit crew would have definetly known and would have been ready.  If
>Berger was not ready to pit, then maybe Berger was slightly pushed into the
>pit lane, when Patrese hit Bergers wheel.
> 
>Perhaps you are right.  Maybe Berger was a bit too impatient with Patrese and
>might have done this just to get Patrese off his back (yes, I know put on
>my Nomex suit).
> 
>>Martin.
> 
>Salil Saxena

I think that the both of you are fools for spouting of at the mouth before
you have fully viewed the evidence. If you had bothered to review the tape
of the incident as it happened (not the replays that stayed on Patrese) you
can clearly see Berger pulling into the Mclaren pits and just stopping
as Patrese starts his long slide along the guardrail. The cameras then zoom
in on Patrese who spends the next 8 seconds sliding, stoping, waiting for
a second, and then finally getting out of his car. The camera pans back out
and we then see Berger exiting the Mclaren pit. So what the hell was Berger
doing for those 8 seconds, getting a damn cup of coffee ? You two and Patrese
are trying to label the man a psychopath and you don't even have the facts 
strait. What was Berger supposed to do ? Try to put his hand out at 300
km/hr ? Pull over to the side of the road, wait for everybody to pass him
and then pull into the pits ? Had Patrese not hit him, he would of ended
up trying to pass Berger in the pits, put simply, Patrese was too close
to Berger for his own good, it was a racing accident and both drivers are
at equal blame. Review the tapes !

George.
From: jimd@pequod.gvg.tek.com (Jim Delwiche)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: (F1) Prost a coward???
Date: 1 Oct 92 21:56:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: gold.5345
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1992Sep30.032347.25557@ascii.co.jp> marbm-b@ascii.co.jp (Marcos Bachir Mubaied) writes:

>	Alain Prost will be a pseudo-champion. He does not have
>	confidence in himself so vetoed both Mansell and Senna.
>	What is the meaning of this title gained by a coward like that?

I have a lot of trouble with labeling a man a coward who drives F1 for
a living!  Every man and woman who straps on a race car is more than a
little courageous, even they ones in the Saturday night bullrings.

Now, let's get every good driver a good ride, and have some racing.

Jim
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: denis@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Denis Schiozer)
Subject: Re: Top Five Drivers/Top Three Tracks
Organization: Stanford Univ. Earth Sciences
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 19:44:41 GMT

In article <Bvnwpp.3s5@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield) writes:
>      This is an interesting thread. I would like to include more
>than just 5/3. For drivers, I think most would agree to the following
>as leading drivers:
>   1. Al Prost- the best. Senna isn't better, neither is Mansell. Period.
>   2. Ayrton Senna- what needs to be said about him. He clearly is
>		    stunning with a good car and motivation.
>   3. Nigel Mansell- if he can go 2 secs a lap faster than Patrese in
>		     in the same car, then he truly is fast.
>   4. Mike Schu- the hottest up-and-coming driver. The next Senna.
                                                    --------------

That one was funny!
You say Prost is better but deep inside you know Senna is better
because you call Schumacher "the next Senna".

                             Denis

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport,rec.autos.tech
From: cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield)
Subject: Re: Tires : Slicks vs. Treaded: Help Please
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 19:18:34 GMT

white@watsci.uwaterloo.ca (Brad White) writes:

>Hellom
>My friend and I are having a debate.  Consider that it is a clear and sunny
>day. Which tire would give you more traction?  A slick or a treaded tire?
>He is arguing that a treaded (!!) tire has more effective surface area on the raod
>i
>than a slick. Race car drivers use slicks
>because they have better fuel mileage to maintain a given speed than treaded tires.  Is this right?  I
>always thought that on a *dry* surface, slicks had more rubber in contact
>with the road which would result in better tractionk, but also would
>increase the rolling firction and therefore reduce gas mileage.  That is the
>trade off between infinitely wide slicks and the ones that they use.
>Thanks
>Brad


     You are right, your friend is very mistaken. A slick has one hundred
percent rubber on the road- how can you get more surface area than that? A 
slick is faster, and I would think that it is less fuel efficient as well.

Cory

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: dye@i88.isc.com (Ken R. Dye )
Subject: Re: race car project: ITB Alfetta Sedan
Organization: INTERACTIVE Systems Corporation, Naperville, IL
Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1992 17:19:31 GMT

To me, it doesn't make sense to wait a whole year doing time
trials.  Around here, anyway, the Alfa clubs wants something
like $250 for Road America, while typical race entries run
around $125 (and a lot more bang for the buck).  Which would
you rather have your car break at?  While time trialing will
help sort out general handling problems, there are other ones
it won't begin to touch:

overheating (in drafting/traffic situations)
setting up the car to be more forgiving (if you have to take a bad line)
brake wear/overheating
that ITGT Porsche who isn't racing *anyone*, but for some reason has to
pass you on the inside of a really tight turn

You may even find out that w2w isn't really for you.

Anyway, what worked for me:

1) get the car safe
2) get a MILD motor overhaul(something that will *last*, no 11.0:1 compression)
3) whatever $$$ are left can go for mild suspension tweaks and race
   entry fees

Later on, you can tweak/trick out your suspension, and next winter
drop in that killer motor.

--Ken	(ITC 510, Midwestern Council; perhaps SCCA next year)
-- 
Ken R. Dye				an optimist is a guy		 |
Interactive Systems Corp., Chicago	that has never had		 | 
(800) LAI-UNIX x341			much experience			 |
dye@i88.isc.comm						archy	 |
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn Padfield)
Subject: Re: staus of Brabham, Fondmetal, and a q about Canada
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 03:19:46 GMT

zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd) writes:

>What is the current situation with Brabham and Fondmetal?  I've put 'did not 
>enter' in my chart but I'm not sure this is correct.

>What happened to Belmondo in Canada?  I have only a  ?  in my chart!


>              Have another day    [Armageddon, the musical] 
>  Dave Budd, MCC, Oxford Rd, Manchester, England   (44|0)61-275-6033

	Belmondo started 20th, moved up to 16th, pitted on lap 21,
which dropped him to 21st, and in last place. Through retirements
he moved to 14th, 5 laps down, and the last man circulating.
	Brabham has been acquired by its creditors, who are going
to liquidate them. Fondmetal had temporary financial difficulty, and
Gabriele Rumi says they will be back for Suzuka. 

TOBY...
From: dlhpfm.uucp!dlh@ab.com (daniel lance herrick)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Buick out of IndyCar?
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 23:34:37 EDT
Organization: dlh Performance Marketing

cartley@slate.mines.colorado.edu (Craig Artley) writes:

> I'd guess that this will have the biggest
> effect on the Indianapolis race, since this was the only venue where the
> engine was competitive, due to the extra boost.

Has a Buick with the extra boost ever finished an Indy 500?  I thought
the Buick engine was a qualifying engine; that the boost was guaranteed
to break the engine long before it completes 500 miles.

dan  of dlh Performance Marketing  POBox 1419  Mentor Ohio 44061
         NCoast.org!dlhpfm!dlh or ab.com!dlhpfm.uucp!dlh
From: scdorcy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (JAMES DORCEY)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Nazareth Grand Prix Results, PPG IndyCar World Series Standings
Summary: SPOILERS
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:28:00 GMT
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <7182989756362@c00369-247dan.eos.ncsu.edu>, jcsmith@eos.ncsu.edu 
(Jay C. Smith) writes...
> 
>Note:  these are the results of the Bosch Spark Plug IndyCar Grand Prix.
>I make no mention of the Marlboro IndyCar Challenge in this posting.
> 
>SPOILERS
>
>
> 
>Remember last year when Bobby Rahal was nearly speechless at Arie Luyendyk's
>win at Nazareth?  He just couldn't believe that Arie could finish the race on
>just two pitstops.  Bobby learned something from that, and pulled the same
>feat with his win this year.

I was impressed by the style and grace in which Michael accepted defeat ;-) 
Hope he has fun in F1!

>I listed Al Unser, Jr. and Danny Sullivan's cars as G92's, but I had heard
>a while back that the Galmer G93 might be ready to debut at Nazareth.  Was
>it there?

Al Jr. had a G93 and I think that Danny drove a '92.  The intelligence of 
driving what is basically a brand new chassis while having a miniscule lead 
in the PPG points with two races to go is _very_ debatable.  The only thing 
that I can think of that could justify that car selection would be the 
performance of the '92 Galmer on the 1 mile oval was so poor that they had 
nothing to lose by trying the '93.

JD