HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: greyham@research.canon.oz.au (Graham Stoney)
Subject: Re: AT&T sues BSDI & Our Retaliation
Organization: Canon Information Systems Research Australia
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 04:52:53 GMT

In article <1992Aug10.225150.29474@unislc.uucp> erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp) writes
:
> As to your theory that there is no enforceable contract without
> "consideration", that's all it is - a theory.

Sorry, but this is not correct. In virtually all countries with legal systems
derived from or similar to the English (eg: USA, Australia, most others), a
contract is valid only if there is some consideration; although some places
have laws that may treat special types of contract differently.

This is not some handwavy theory; a contract I signed a couple of months back
was not binding on me for exactly this reason, and that was what the legal
advice I got at the time said.

Graham
-- 
Graham Stoney                    | "a Perl script is correct if it's halfway
Flip Dibner fan club, "Hi Flip!" |  readable and gets the job done before your
Ph: +61 2 805-2909  Fax: -2929   |  boss fires you." L. Wall & R. Schwartz
From: jeff@aiai.ed.ac.uk (Jeff Dalton)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd,misc.int-property,misc.legal.computing
Subject: Re: Poisoned textbooks and net articles?
Date: 12 Aug 92 15:15:55 GMT
Followup-To: misc.int-property
Organization: AIAI, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

In article <1992Aug12.041630@eklektix.com> rcd@raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn) writes:
>jeff@aiai.ed.ac.uk (Jeff Dalton) writes:
>>>              Of course, there are some folks out there
>>>that contend that if you release a piece of software to the net, you in
>>>effect place it in the public domain, but I don't believe a judge would buy
>>>that argument.
>...
>>Well, just when _are_ we allowed to use information we read in books
>>or on the net?  And what's the point of reading these things if the
>>answer is "never"?  How much does copyright restrict us?...
>>any point in reading books, for instance?)
>
>This digresses a bit from BSD to "intellectual property" stuff, but it's
>worth knowing, given (as others have pointed out) the large amount of
>published material on BSD systems.
>
>Copyright protects the form of expression.  It explicitly does *not*
>protect ideas or information.  (Patents protect ideas; that's not at issue
>here.)  So, for example, the copyright on a textbook protects the par-
>ticular presentation of ideas, concepts, and facts.  You can use the ideas
>and the information in a textbook; you can't (for example) copy the way
>they're explained.

OK, (1) suppose someone posts some code to the net w/o a copyright
notice.  Can I use it, or is there an implicit copyright that says
"no"?  If the latter, then I may be better off if I don't read
net articles that contain code.

(2) Suppose I find out about an algorithm by reading a textbook.
How much does my implementation have to differ from the one in
the book?  Should I stay away from textbooks that give code and
look for ones that give only informal or mathematical descriptions?

Now, from "form of expression" it sounds like translation to a
different programming language might suffice, but I doubt it really
does.

In short, does the common practice of finding out how to do something
by reading books, papers, and net articles violate copyrights?

-- jeff

PS I've directed followups to misc.int-property.  Is that ok?
From: cflatter@nrao.edu (Chris Flatters)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Job control patch for emacs 18.58/386BSD
Date: 21 Aug 92 16:03:08 GMT
Reply-To: cflatter@nrao.edu
Organization: NRAO


Someone posted a patch for GNU emacs 18.58 under 386BSD which cured
problems with job control in shells running under emacs in this group
about a month ago.  Could they either mail me a copy or repost it
please.

	Chris Flatters
	cflatter@nrao.edu
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: 386bsd tip marks bytes
From: satmech@ecst.csuchico.edu (satmech)
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 05:02:01 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico

In article <1992Aug21.194339.24212@engage.pko.dec.com> ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com writes:
>
>After several frustrating days of problems with a terminal server, I discovered
>something.
>
>Tip is setting the high bit of every character, even though I am setting
>parity to none.  (There seems to be no entry in /etc/remote for character
>size; why?)  My Ultrix system doesn't do this.  Does anyone know anything
>about this?
>
>Thanks
>
>Eric
>--
>/=============================================================================\
>| Eric Ewanco - Software Engineer     For the rash and outrageous opinions ex-|
>| Digital Equipment Corp, Maynard MA  pressed herein I alone am responsible;  |
>| ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com          they do not belong to DIGITAL(TM).      |
>\==============================- 2 Th 2:15 -==================================/
>

I ran into this same problem myself.  Oddly enough, the cut down version
of tip on the boot floppy doesn't have this problem so instead of using
"/usr/bin/tip com1", try using "/usr/distbin/tip /dev/com1"
 
"
From: tom@afthree.as.arizona.edu (Thomas J. Trebisky)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: 680x0 version of 386BSD?? [Was: Re: Mac version of 386BSD??]
Date: 20 Aug 92 17:38:17 GMT
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ

gab10@griffincd.amdahl.com (Gary A Browning) writes:
>It is not just drivers that need to be rewritten.  Have you though about
>changes required for the different hardware interrupt stack frame,

Yes

>interrupt masking structure, the MMU (BTW, the 68000 machines do not
>usually have one of these.

Any 680x0 system you would want to run unix on will have an MMU. It is
just not on chip (unless you have an 030 or 040)  Motorola made the
68851 mmu coprocessor for the 68020, but at lot of folks (like sun and HP)
built their own custom MMU's external to the cpu.  You can even run unix
without an MMU on a vanilla 68000, but I won't go into the horrid schemes
involved in doing that.

The 680x0 interrupt structure is just the other way around, it is on-chip
instead of the off chip PIC situation with the 80x86.

>This makes the porting task much harder, not easier.

I am not sure what you mean.  But I never claimed it was easy.  :-)

>You should read the series of articles from Bill and Lynne in Dr Dobb's
>Journal about the porting of 386BSD.  You are basically doing the same
>task for the 680x0 architecture as he has for the 80[34]86.

>After reading the articles,
>you may change your mind and decide to wait and start with BSD4.4 which
>already has some support for various 680x0 machines.

NO way!  When the going gets tough, the tough get going!  Besides, there
is no need to wait, the hp300 stuff in the Net2 code supports the
HP 68020 and 68030 workstations, so I (We) have a lot more to go with than
Jolitz did for the 386.

In fact if I had an hp300, I could just about open the can, heat and eat.
I get the impression the guys at Berkeley actually had hp300's on their
desks, but I could just be starting a rumor.

But this doesn't mean it will be easy.  If it was easy, I would drop it
and go find something hard to do.  :-)

--
	Tom Trebisky	ttrebisky@as.arizona.edu
...."There's no sense in being precise when you don't even
.... know what you're talking about." 
                       - John von Neumann
From: walter@insu1.etec.uni-karlsruhe.de (Reiner Walter)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: ulimit()
Date: 13 Aug 92 09:18:55 GMT
Organization: Institut fuer Nachrichtensysteme, Uni Karlsruhe

I want to port the system call ulimit() from INTERACTIVE to BSD/386.
I couldn't find a similar system call for BSD/386.
Is ist possible to port this system call?



Reiner.
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
From: bdowning@mary.fordham.edu (Brian Downing)
Subject: Anybody got C-Kermit up and running on 386BSD 0.1 ??
Organization: Fordham University
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 12:40:00 GMT
X-Posted-From: mary.fordham.edu
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

 Subject says it all. Anybody got C-Kermit up and running on 386BSD?
I tried building it from the source code but had errors that I don't
have time to look into. If no one else has had a chance to fix this
then I will, maybe next month.

Thanks...

Brian Downing   VAX User Assistant,  Fordham University, New York, New York
Internet: bdowning@mary.fordham.edu  Bitnet: bdowning@fordmulc.bitnet
void random_witticism(char *, ... ) { ... }
From: tls@panix.com (Thor Lancelot Simon)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: 680x0 version of 386BSD?? [Was: Re: Mac version of 386BSD??]
Date: 19 Aug 92 19:54:13 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix & Internet, NYC

In article <1992Aug19.134736.6219@news.iastate.edu> niko@iastate.edu (Nikolaus E Schuessler) writes:
>In article <1992Aug19.093937.14857@olymp.informatik.uni-bonn.de> volker@sfb256.iam.uni-bonn.de ( Volker A. Brandt ) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug18.174205.23671@news.iastate.edu> niko@iastate.edu (Nikolaus E Schuessler) writes:
>>
>>Right, that's what I thought too.  It's just that the project is too big for
>>me to do alone.
>>
>
>Well I agree with you there... the first few steps would have to be platform
>specific anyway... floppy drivers, video drivers and a minimum kernel...
>
>Think we could require 68030 or better for openers?

Do that, and you lose all the old Sun 3s knocking around out there for cheap.
Of course, supporting both the Sun 3 and the 68030 could be a pain in the ass,
with the different MMU and all.  On the other hand, I dont think it would be
so hard to support the 020 and the 851 MMU if you were going to support the
030 -- isn't the 030 MMU just a subset of the 851?

-- 
Thor Lancelot Simon	 tls@panix.COM
  "Oh, you have wounded me!  I have very few prejudices, actually.  The
biggest problem is that I am intolerant of fools.  That is why I have
such a low tolerance level for Libertarians."  -- Jim McMaster
From: hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Diamond Stealth clock values?
Date: 15 Aug 92 04:52:42 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)


Currently, I am writing a X11R5 driver for the Diamond Stealth svga.
Does anyone know how to set the clock values for the Stealth?

Or, what is good alternative for an S3 based svga card which has
a good doc set, i.e., I can program the S3 chipset and set its
clock values without having to deal with hardware glue?

Cheers,
Amancio Hasty
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
From: terry@cs.weber.edu (A Wizard of Earth C)
Subject: Re: Endless boot cycle
Organization: Weber State University  (Ogden, UT)
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 02:17:44 GMT

In article <45240001@hpycla.kobe.hp.com> yas@hpycla.kobe.hp.com (Yasuyuki Suzuki) writes:
>/ hpycla:comp.unix.bsd / armhold@action.rutgers.edu (George Armhold) /  1:34 am  Aug 15, 1992 /
>
>armhold> "Press any key to reboot from HD".  I do, and the machine
>armhold> goes into an endless boot cycle.  When it tries to read the bootstrap
>armhold> code from the HD it does a hard reset, memory check, etc, and then
>armhold> loops again. 
>
>This is exactly the same situation as mine!
>The following is my configuration.

This problem seem to occur as the result not being able to find the disk
label.  You can check this by:

1)	Set the write protect off on a copy of your dist.fs/fixit.fs floppy.
2)	Boot off the floppy.
3)	Type:

		mount /dev/wd0a /mnt

	This will either work or give a disklabel error.

3a)	If it mounted, this isn't the problem, and you should unmount it:

		umount /mnt

The soloution for being unable to find the disk label is to have the 386BSD
partion be the first one on the disk, or to use the entire disk for 386BSD.
This is because there are multiple methods being used to recognize the disk
lable, and is not likely to be resolved quickly.


					Terry Lambert
					terry_lambert@gateway.novell.com
					terry@icarus.weber.edu
---
Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present
or previous employers.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                       terry@icarus.weber.edu
 "I have an 8 user poetic license" - me
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
From: guy@Auspex.COM (Guy Harris)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: Reading 386bsd dist files (bin,src,etc)
Date: 20 Aug 92 21:31:15 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Santa Clara

>I started to do the same thing, but found it much easier to simply ignore
>the native cpio completely, and snarf the Net-2 cpio.c and compile & run
>*that* on my cross-host (an SGI 4D/35, BigEndian like the Sun-3). The Net-2
>(and 386bsd) version will run on either Endian-ness machine and extract
>from archives written on either Endian-ness. [And it's faster than piping
>through a converter.]

Yup; that's the code I put into the SunOS 3.2 "cpio" (when somebody
who'd just joined Sun tried to read a "cpio" tape of his home directory
at his previous job, which was written in non-"-c" form on a VAX, and
found that somebody at AT&T's royally screwed the pooch, and rendered
the byte-swapping options completely useless for reading such tapes). 

Any vendor with an SVR3-vintage "cpio" in their UNIX should pick up
those changes; they include stuff to automatically figure out the byte
order for non-"-c" tapes, and to support symlinks (although there's a
bug in that code, and you should pick up the fix in a recent posting I
made here).  (It also includes changes to keep it from printing "errno"
numeric values in its error messages.)
From: car@trux.UUCP (Chris Rende)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: How to test a computer for 386bsd-ableness?
Date: 21 Aug 92 21:04:27 GMT
Organization: Central Transport, Warren, MI


Are there any tests that I can run on my computer to see whether or not
386bsd will run on my system? (WITHOUT loading 386bsd itself).
(Cache test, AMD386/40 test, No FPU test, etc...)

I'd like to run some tests before I go to the effort of getting 386bsd
and installing it on my system...

Thanks,


car.
-- 
Christopher A. Rende           Central Cartage (Nixdorf/Pyramid/SysVR2/BSD4.3)
uunet!edsews!rphroy!trux!car   Multics,DTSS,Unix,Shortwave,Scanners,UnixPC/3B1
car@trux.mi.org                Minix 1.2,PC/XT,Mac+,TRS-80 Model I,1802 ELF
trux!ramecs!car     "I don't ever remember forgetting anything." - Chris Rende
From: qs101@cl.cam.ac.uk (Quentin Stafford-Fraser)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: Restrictions on 'free' UNIX / 386BSD (Re: selling 386BSD)
Date: 19 Aug 92 08:27:51 GMT
Reply-To: qs101@cl.cam.ac.uk (Quentin Stafford-Fraser)
Organization: U of Cambridge Computer Lab, UK

In article <1992Aug18.155958.3671@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>,
gsh7w@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Hennessy) writes:
 
|> Then how come every time my brother wants to install a new program, I
|> have to use EDLIN to edit the config.sys file on his pc?

Ah, but his point was that the operating system runs straight out of the
box - I think that's fair. Most applications will do too, though of
course you may need to tweak things for best performance.

Mind you, if you must use EDLIN, then anything seems complex... :-)



Quentin


 -----------------------------------
 Quentin Stafford-Fraser            
 Cambridge University Computer Lab  
 qs101@cl.cam.ac.uk
 Tel +44 223 334645
 -----------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
From: terry@cs.weber.edu (A Wizard of Earth C)
Subject: Re: Motif on X386???
Organization: Weber State University  (Ogden, UT)
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 21:09:59 GMT

In article <16kt8jINN9so@agate.berkeley.edu> randyc@ocf.berkeley.edu (Randy Yen-Pang Chou) writes:
>Anybody got motif working on X386 with 386bsd?  How's the performance?
>How much memory do I need to compile it(not including the docs) ?

You have to have at least the 1.2 Motif sources, and, if you mean "how much
disk" instead of "how much memory", the answer depends on whether you want
the whole thing or just enough to do stuff with or everything but docs.  This
varies from "a lot" to a "whole lot", depending.  Figure 40 Meg or so for
what I consider minimal utility.

If you're really talking memory, I can't tell you without yanking memory out
until it won't recompile.  Understandably, I probably wont do this.

As for performance, it normal compared to OLIT; in other words, OLIT still
sucks at drawing ovals, but is lower overhead otherwise (but I think as
a purely subjective point, Motif is prettier).  The other thing to consider
is that Motif doesn't tend to permanently allocate color registers, thus
preventing you from having quite as many colors on the screen at the same
time.

					Terry Lambert
					terry_lambert@gateway.novell.com
					terry@icarus.weber.edu
---
Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present
or previous employers.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                       terry@icarus.weber.edu
 "I have an 8 user poetic license" - me
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
From: karl@NeoSoft.com (Karl Lehenbauer)
Subject: New hints for people having trouble booting 386BSD 0.1
Organization: NeoSoft Communications Services -- (713) 684-5900
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 05:57:53 GMT

A couple of booting successes tonight:

A 50 MHz 486 with UMC chipset and AMI BIOS

A fairly old 33 MHz 386 with Chips chipset and AMI BIOS

I was having a lot of trouble booting these guys.  The 486 would hang at
the probe, the 386 would just spin and never do anything.

Well, the 386 had a scratchpad RAM option, it could be "type 1", using stack 
at 0:300, or "type 2", which said "1K DOS".  Setting it to "1K DOS" made it go.

Similarly the 486 had an option on where to put the type 47 disk definition
RAM area (they're both SCSI systems) at 0:300 or "1K DOS", so they're doing
the same thing but the newer BIOS is more descriptive.  Anyway, once again,
1K DOS and it launched.

Boot the fixit disk, pull the OS down over ethernet and, voila, 100,002
386BSD systems ;-)

-- 
-- Email info@NeoSoft.com for info on getting interactive Internet access.
You will now awaken feeling relaxed and refreshed, remembering everything 
you've read except the details of the Omega contingency plan.
From: eje@irenaeus.mlo.dec.com (Eric James Ewanco)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: 386bsd: kernel rebuild?, disklabel?
Keywords: 386bsd
Date: 20 Aug 92 14:48:12 GMT
Reply-To: ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


OK, I got 386bsd up and running -- it looks great.  But I had a question.

Evidently you need the source to rebuild the kernel, unlike my DECstation 3100.
Is there any way you can load the kernel code and rebuild it without
downloading and unpacking the entire source distribution?  I don't yet have
room for the source -- I could possibly if I hooked up a second Conner 3100,
but then I'd need to rebuild the kernel to get a second drive to work, right?

second, WHAT THE *^%$#@ DOES disklabel DO?  and how do I use it? The man page
is absolutely no help, since I do not have a VAX 11/780 with disk packs or
whatever.  i would like to be able to create a new file system in drive A or on
my new drive when I get it installed (right now I need to find a place to mount
it first).  But everyone here is talking about disklabel, and nothing anywhere
talks about what the heck it is.

Am I correct in assuming that there are virtually nil docs for 386bsd?

P.S. on my 16550 question: it certainly appears that 386bsd supports the 16550
judging from all the messages, although perhaps it doesn't in the released
kernel? anyway my 9600 link seems to be working fine.  I am uploaded tcsh and
the source to sz right now and am having no problems.

Eric
--
/=============================================================================\
| Eric Ewanco - Software Engineer     For the rash and outrageous opinions ex-|
| Digital Equipment Corp, Maynard MA  pressed herein I alone am responsible;  |
| ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com          they do not belong to DIGITAL(TM).      |
\==============================- 2 Th 2:15 -==================================/
From: randyc@ocf.berkeley.edu (Randy Yen-Pang Chou)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Logitech serial mouseman on X386???
Date: 13 Aug 92 21:46:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.16el7sINNbar
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: tornado.berkeley.edu


Has anyone gotten X to recognize a Logitech serial mouseman?  If you 
have, please send me the changes you made in order to make it work.  

Thanx!

---Randy
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
From: mo@gizmo.bellcore.com (Michael O'Dell)
Subject: hardware group?
Keywords: 
 
Reply-To: mo@bellcore.com
Organization: Center for Chaotic Repeatabilty
Distribution: world 
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 02:50:25 GMT

is there a specific newsgroup dedicated to pc hardware issues
like motherboards, controllers, etc?

	-mo
From: khera@cs.duke.edu (Vivek Khera)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: Restrictions on 'free' UNIX / 386BSD (Re: selling 386BSD)
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:04:46 GMT
Organization: Duke University CS Dept., Durham, NC
In-reply-to: niko@iastate.edu's message of 14 Aug 92 14:21:33 GMT
X-Md4-Signature: 7ff6c4eefee3262027fd6b93d10585e2

In article <1992Aug14.142133.24168@news.iastate.edu> niko@iastate.edu (Nikolaus E Schuessler) writes:

   >management source codes.  I reread the Leffler 'devil book' several times.
			       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
   What book is this? What is it about? how much?

@Book{leffler:bsd,
  author = 	"Samuel J. Leffler and Marshall Kirk McKusick and
			  Michael J. Karels and John S. Quarterman",
  title = 	"The Design and Implementation of the 4.3BSD UNIX
			  Operating System",
  publisher = 	"Addison-Wesley",
  year = 	1989,
  keyword = "UNIX",
  comment = "This defines Berkeley Unix."
}

i think i got my copy for about the standard textbook rate.  its a
highly recommended book for anyone doing serious work on BSD systems.
--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Vivek Khera, Gradual Student/Systems Guy  Department of Computer Science
Internet:   khera@cs.duke.edu             Box 90129
            (MIME mail accepted)          Durham, NC 27708-0129 (919)660-6528