HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pharvey@quack.sac.ca.us (Paul Harvey)
Subject: Re: Origin of the Pentacle?
Organization: The Duck Pond public unix: +1 408 249 9630, log in as 'guest'.
	<fYci0Mj@quack.sac.ca.us> <1jkce5INNbek@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu>
Date: 21 Jan 1993 20:16:59 UTC

In article <1jkce5INNbek@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu> 
napalm@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (jason hill) writes:
>im i the only one how sees the human body repressented in the  pentacle?
>top point=head; side points=hands; bottom points=feet

Nope, five extremities. Just like Sesame Street, one two three four -
five, five, five, how many is five?

This post brought to you by the number FIVE.
From: man@labrea.zko.dec.com (Richard Man)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: article in Boston magazine
Date: 25 Jan 93 17:07:23 GMT
Reply-To: man@labrea.zko.dec.com (Richard Man)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <51-JNEWS-2.1@wonky.UUCP>, ailsa@wonky.UUCP (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
> In article <C164GB.8J4@encore.com>, aaldrich@encore.com (Al Aldrich) writes:
> >
> > I just came across an old copy of Boston magazine from May 1992, which had
> > a great article about paganism in general and specifically in the Boston
> > area. It contains several good interviews and quotes from Boston area
> > pagans. It was very unbisased and actually, extremely pagan positive from
> > my perspective. I recommend seeking it and and having a look see if you
> > can. Also, might be useful for Boston area pagans seeking connections..
> >
> well, you COULD just post the possible contacts yourself...  please?
> PRETTY please?  B)
>                                                 -ailsa

The article is mainly on the EarthSpirit folks. Some of the pictures were
apparently taken for the Times-Life Witches and whatever book.

--
- Richard F. Man (man@labrea.zko.dec.com)
"Small Rovers, Big Dreams"
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: bast@wam.umd.edu (Jaguar)
Subject: Re: Re Eye color
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 06:28:28 GMT

Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Re Eye color
Summary: 
Expires: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Keywords: 

Let me claify what i said about Irridology (sp?)
They claim to be able to diagnose what is wrong with you basied on 'patterns'
seen in the iris of your eyes. They perscribe treatment.
The people doing the study also wondered if eye doctors would also , 
throught thier experience with eyes, be able to do the same thing.
IOt seems that the irrodologists and the eye doctors were equally
sucessfull at corectly diagnosing the conditions of patients only around
50% of thre time. (you could roll dice and get the same success rate)
Note, we are talking about diadngnosis  of non-eye realated problems
here.
Baisiclly it showed that the irredologists were NOT very good at diagnosing.
They were little more than guessing. Which is what the eye doctors were
doing.. guessing on the state of a patients health in non eye related 
problems, based on examining the eye.
Not a convincing case.
I think the study was in some pop-science magazine (the summary of)
like Omni... or Disovery
Jaguar
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: spider@netcom.com (Mark Lovell)
Subject: Re: Five sides...
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 06:41:14 GMT

Ashley (ksm@abb-sc.abb-sc.com) wrote:

: In article <1993Jan24.015605.8713@netcom.com>, spider@netcom.com (Mark Lovell) writes...
: > 
: >Hi, Newbie here.
: > 
: >In one tradition I follow this is the pattern:
: > 
: >         Ether
: >   Earth       Air
: >     Fire   Water
: > 
: >Drawn on the body, earth is to the right.


: 	Hmm, I'd heard that the heavier elements where at the bottom, so if you 
: switched earth and fire, you would have the five points as I understand them. I 
: never learned which belonged on the left or right though, so I can't help 

What can I say?  The pattern above is not from cerimonial magic as
far as I know, but is the pattern of a Faerie Tradition exercise
that I have been taught.  I think it's pretty clear that this is one
of those (multitudinous) things that varies from dradition to 
tradition :)
-- 
-----------------------------//\o/\\------------------------------
Email to spider@netcom.com      |
                                |
From: emarsh@hernes-sun.Eng.Sun.COM (Eric Marsh)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: GOD
Date: 26 Jan 93 17:22:52 GMT
Organization: Sun
NNTP-Posting-Host: hernes-sun

In article <728022574.0@iphase.fidonet.org> Richard.Willis@iphase.fidonet.org (Richard Willis) writes:
>
>               To Whom It May Concern,
>
>               There is a true god. Satan is real. Follow him and you will go
>to hell. Follow Jesus and inherite eternal life. Any questions?
>
>
> * Origin: U_PAGAN: <<<<<<<<<< RE-ELECT NOBODY! >>>>>>>>>> (1:112/29)
>


Hi,

    I don't want to waste a lot of bandwidth on the net, but I figured
I ought to make some sort of a response.

    I've personally been discussing assertions similar to those you
have just made, with Christians for some time now. Ultimately nobody
has been able to provide any substantial evidence for those claims.
In the final analysis, those who I have discussed this with have fallen
back on "faith," which I take to mean "I can't prove it, but _I_ 
believe it anyway."

    You know, there are a lot of people like myself who really get
tired of you guys and your noise. Why don't you show a little
consideration and just leave us alone? The only thing your accomplishing
with your actions is to convince those of us who have studied
religion that Christians in general are basically void of any conscious
thought, and only able to ape those phrases handed down to them by their
leaders. 

    If you want to pester someone, go pester someone else.

Eric
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Masonic Practices??
From: jonc@status.gen.nz (Jon Clarke)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 93 17:18:43 GMT
Organization: The CServer at the Z*NET International Global News Gateway

an4484@anon.penet.fi writes:

> Date Entered: 01-24-93 03:46
 
 Date replied to: 25JAN93

> 
> 
> My understanding (as much I guess as an outsider could have) of Masonic
> practices would be that they descend from the Knights Templar of around
> the time of the middle ages. Their purpose inbeing was to be the guardians
> of the Holy Grail.
 
 This is not the case at all.  While some so called seudo-masonic
 orders may practise this it is not the tennants of Freemasonary at
 all in any country world-wide.
 
> 
> Funny though....I was talking to a Witch whose grandfather was a Mason and
> it seems their beliefs are a little more elaborate than that. It seems that
> the whole idea behind Masonry is that Christ as a man was married or at
> least had sexual relations with Mary Magdelan which produced offspring.
> The Masons  then have one purpose....to defend these descendants of Christ
> down through the ages.
 
 Oh dear, it looks like the witch you were talking to was running on
 un-leaded for this is simply not the case at all my anon friend.
 
 I suspect the reading of her grandfathers dairies has lead to a
 conclusion other than the truth of the matter. Maybe a bit of time
 travel on her behalf to her grandfathers period would resolve the
 problem, a simple spell I am told.
 
> 
> And the reason for the secrecy is that the whole premise of the Christian
> religion is the fact that Jesus was the Son of God....hence the need for
> secrecy. The Witch (who had evidently gleaned this info from her grandfathers
> diaries seemed to resent this, in that this means the Masons are basically
> defending a lie...namely, Christ as the celibate Son of God who never married
> as that might make certain Christian practices/beliefs untenable.
 
 Various non-masonic orders based in the Catholic religion do indeed
 practise what you have mentioned here and have no grounding in any
 masonic related orders.
 
 The reading of Temple and the Holy Grail my enligten you to the French
 Templars around the time of the refermation (late 1500's). While the
 Knights Templar were supposed to be the orginal Guards of the first
 temple they were infact an order founded in Malta and members of the
 Knights hospitalier and founded at the time of the first crusades.
 
 These times being ruled by the church of Rome they were infact a 
 religious order of fighting/support monks.  The order has indeed
 moved to many suedo-masonic orders and infact some trace their
 origans to these chaps, but alais the masonic fraternity do not
 trace their origins to these people period.
 
 I guess you should attend your local Catholic Church and ask
 the friendly Priest about the Knights Columbus there in the USA
 and you will be more enlightened about your request than the
 misguided ramblings of your friend.  Simply say Templas Vi Paxum <f>
 
> 
> Any comments on this?
  
 No (grin).
 
 Now here comes my real name and sig <sic>
From: traite@fellini.harvard.edu (Shirley Traite)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Hey Ailsa!!!!
Date: 28 Jan 93 16:13:40 GMT
Organization: Harvard University, Statistical & Data Analysis Center

Sorry to take up bandwidth but we could not figure out any other way.

Ailsa,

Steve Boylan and I have been trying to reach you but can't
seem to get our networks to network with your network :) :)
Sooooooooo
Could you give either one of us a call sometime?  We'd like
to include you in any Boston Area alt.pagan thingie.

My work number:  617 432-0073 (I'm in and out but I DO have voice mail.)

Steve Boylan's work number: 508 486-6239 (He is also out often but
he also has voice mail.)

Blessings to you.
___
Shirley Traite (traite@sdac.harvard.edu) |I only speak for myself.
Statistical Programmer                   |
SDAC/Biostatistics Dept.                 |
Harvard Sch. of Public Health            |

<> IT IS A VIRTUE TO HAVE AN OPEN AND INQUISITIVE MIND. <>
From: cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Subject: Re: the next generation...?
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 28 Jan 93 02:38:55 GMT

In article <7474@m1.cs.man.ac.uk> lilleyc@cs.man.ac.uk (Chris Lilley) writes:
>In article <2B5F5C82.2498@news.service.uci.edu>
>cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) [Hi JANIS] writes:

[deleted] [HI CHRIS!]

>>Gotcha!  Just let the kid grow up with a sense of logic and rationality
>>sbout the universe, and that the universe is open to questions, and that
>>there are some things that you CAN get the answers to, and some things
>>that no one yet knows the answers to, and some things beyond asking
>>questions . . . They'll get the hang of it for themselves.
>
>Yes, I agree. And yet - at what point does this become a tacit message
>to the child, 'only that which is logical has validity, learn to
>mistrust your feelings' ?

Chris, I honestly don't see what you're driving at.  Where have I said
that using your logical brain requires not using your feelings or
trusting them?

Blessings,
Janis
From: dhardin@bbn.com (Dawn Hardin)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Origins of ambergris (Re: Whale Puke)
Date: 26 Jan 93 21:05:55 GMT
Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman (BBN)
NNTP-Posting-Host: spcink.bbn.com

In article <1413@abb-sc.abb-sc.COM> ksm@abb-sc.abb-sc.com (Ashley) writes:
>
>After considerable 
>reading I am wondering if the substance is vomited or passed through the anus 
>as it is believed to be created in the large intestine. 

The people who thought that the "Space" thread didn't belong in
alt.pagan must be beside themselves with joy over this charming nugget.

Dawn
-- 
"You have this adorable and misguided notion that death is something really
radical and cool but I still can't help being attracted to your fresh-faced
uncompromised tatoo-ed rebel stance and god damn, I'd like to help you
sing your tune."  "Folk Song..." by Bongwater
From: alizard@tweekco.uucp (A.Lizard)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: The ABYSS Catalog
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 18:27:59 PST
Organization: Tweek-Com Systems BBS, Moraga, CA (510) 631-0615

acsrdl@UMASSD.EDU writes:

> Could someone please post the US-Mail address for the Abyss bookstore?  It's
> been a while since I received one of their catalogs, and embarassingly enough
> a friend of mine asked me about something I was *SURE* was in it... and I
> couldn't find a copy of it.  Thanks!

Abyss
RR1 Box 213 Chester Rd
Chester, MA 011011-9735

Blessed Be,
A.Lizard

-------------------------------------------------------------------
A.Lizard Internet Addresses:
alizard%tweekco%boo@PacBell.COM        (preferred)
[path]!pacbell.COM!boo!tweekco!alizard (bang path for above)
alizard@gentoo.com (backup)
PGP2.0 public key available on request.
Xref: sparky alt.pagan:15685 alt.magick:6881
From: emarsh@hernes-sun.Eng.Sun.COM (Eric Marsh)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan,alt.magick
Subject: Time to fight back (was: latest update on the Circle thing - SF Bay Area Pagans PAY ATTENTION)
Date: 21 Jan 1993 18:06:48 GMT
Organization: Sun
NNTP-Posting-Host: hernes-sun

In article <1406@abb-sc.abb-sc.COM> ksm@abb-sc.abb-sc.com (Ashley) writes:
>
>In article <TuHoXB2w164w@tweekco.uucp>, alizard@tweekco.uucp (A.Lizard) writes...

>>The bad news is, with the recent Supreme Court ruling, it's probably going to
>>be harder to get restraining orders against picketers.  Occult shop owners
>>are going to have to just hope picketers break local ordinances so that they
>>have at least some protection.

>	I think we need to start a telephone tree and caravan list so that 
>when Fenholdt does come after us and our stores, we can have a group 
>protecting in minutes. I would also suggest that we don't wear our athames 
>to avoid concealed weapons charges and such..double bladed knives are illegal 
>in SF by local ordinence, must be openly displayed elsewere....actually this 
>should be a new subject. Defence techniques anyone?

I was just made aware of this today and I'm contemplating ways to
approach this thing. I have recently received some background info
on what's going on here, and I think that it will influence the approach
that we should take. 

Here is what's going on: Feinholt is only doing this stuff because
he can then use the "anti-Christian" response to drum up money from
his followers. Apparently he was able to play the legal action at
Circle for some pretty good $$. So the first thing we want to do is
not to give him what he wants...

I have some ideas, but I don't want to advertise them to the world.
I think that we ought to have a powwow on this thing, but first I'm
going to try some other things I've got at my disposal. I don't really
want to give anything away here, because it is a public forum.

Anyone interested in getting active on this thing, please leave your
name and number on the BAPA line at (510) 656-GAIA.

>
>			-Ashley,

Eric
From: cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Subject: Re: Green pentagonal pentacles? (was Re: wearing pagan/pentacle jewelry)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 21 Jan 93 19:09:26 GMT

In article <8fLZ0Ay00WAuMFDlEt@andrew.cmu.edu> Daniel Patrick Schanbacher <ds7o+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Excerpts from netnews.alt.pagan: 19-Jan-93 Re: Green pentagon pentacle..
>Janis Maria Cortese@skid (808)
>
>> How many letters are in the alphabet they code"  If there are 25 or
>> fewer, then five marks falls out quite naturally, without necessitating
>> any mystical correspondence.
>
>Well, there are in fact 25 letters in the ogham alphabet. But they are
>broken up into 5 groups of 5

I am being misquoted here, for some bizarre reason.  I said 2^5 -- two
to the fifth, or thirty-two, the max number you can encode usinbg 5
bits.

Blessings,
Janis
From: vossdavi@student.msu.edu (Lisa Ann)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: GOD
Date: 27 Jan 93 00:40:57 GMT
Followup-To: alt.pagan
Organization: Chaotic Goods
NNTP-Posting-Host: cemmac11.cem.msu.edu

In article <1k2rgcINNm2c@shelley.u.washington.edu>,
mimir@hardy.u.washington.edu (Al Billings) wrote:
> 
> In article <728022574.0@iphase.fidonet.org> Richard.Willis@iphase.fidonet.org (Richard Willis) writes:
> >
> >               There is a true god. Satan is real. Follow him and you will go
> >to hell. Follow Jesus and inherite eternal life. Any questions?
> 
>  Yes. Were you born without a brain or did your religion remove it?


     Good question, Al. I have another. Richie, would you mind going off
somewhere and buggering yourself?
From: alizard@tweekco.uucp (A.Lizard)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: GOD
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 04:56:36 PST
Organization: Tweek-Com Systems BBS, Moraga, CA (510) 631-0615

Richard.Willis@iphase.fidonet.org (Richard Willis) writes:

> 
>                To Whom It May Concern,
> 
>                There is a true god. Satan is real. Follow him and you will go
> to hell. Follow Jesus and inherite eternal life. Any questions?
> 
> 
>  * Origin: U_PAGAN: <<<<<<<<<< RE-ELECT NOBODY! >>>>>>>>>> (1:112/29)
> 

Yes. One. Who gave a clueless jerk like you access to a fidonet
gateway?
A.Lizard

-------------------------------------------------------------------
A.Lizard Internet Addresses:
alizard%tweekco%boo@PacBell.COM        (preferred)
PacBell.COM!boo!tweekco!alizard (bang path for above)
alizard@gentoo.com (backup)
PGP2.1 public key available on request.
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: stacey@aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu (Stacey B. Martin)
Subject: Re: Critical Thought
Originator: news@essex.ecn.uoknor.edu
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 17:55:09 GMT
Organization: AUS
Followup-To: alt.pagan

In article <C1HEJy.3AK@athena.cs.uga.edu>, you wrote:
> 
> > (I wrote)
> >       I also very much liked your statement about Catholicism
> >	keeping us from God. OH, YES. Campbell says that all Western religious
> >	traditions, including Judaism, are religions of exile - separating man	
> >	from God.
> 
> Campbell says this because he does not believe in a personal create present to
> the world yet distince from it.  So, of course Western religions keep people
> from God.  

	Uh, I don't know what got left out of this sentence, but Campbell states
	that unlike many Eastern religions, where you are invited to step
	across the Threshold, Western religions emphasize expulsion (as from
	Paradise), the unaccessability of God, and separateness (you as a 
	believer are not encouraged to oneness, unless, of course, it's by
	their rules, and the spiritual/mystical NEVER plays by any rules).
 
 If you look at the problem, for instance, that the
	Catholic Church has ALWAYS had with their mystics (John of the
	Cross, Theresa of Avila, and Galileo :-), etc.), then you realize
	the truth of JC's statement.

> His God is himself when it comes down to it.  What he really
> believes is a type of Hinduism, that all things are really the same
> manifestation of the one reality which is beyond all logic, personality, and
> rationality.

	Uh, does this mean that the belief you say JC has is beyond all logic,
etc.,
	or that the one reality is beyond all logic, etc.?

 JC said once he never believed in a personal God. Unless
	he told you otherwise, I'd say he hid his beliefs pretty well. Except
	how he felt about Catholicism. :-) He was another renegade.

	Many great mystics of
	Judaism and Catholicism have taken a point of view much closer to the
	Eastern rather than Western tradition.
	 
> If you read Paul in Romans 1 you will see how he disagrees with Campbell in a
> basic way.

	I don't read Paul if I can help it. As far as I'm concerned, Paul had	
	some huge personal problems. Not to mention the fact that I find it
	incredibly humorous that people quote Paul as if HE were the Christ,
	instead of Jesus.
 
> Ted

	Stacey
From: joshua@rtfm.mlb.fl.us (Joshua Geller)
Subject: Re: wearing pagan/pentacle jewelry
Organization: Institute for the Study of Ancient Science
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 20:42:51 GMT

pharvey@quack.sac.ca.us (Paul Harvey) writes:

>There is a reason for this. Before Christianity really, good and bad
>were seen as a pair, an inseperable pair. 

by who? the jews? the buddhists? the zorostrians?

josh
From: stave@apollo.hp.com (Joel H. Stave)
Subject: Re: Why Science Fiction?
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 18:23:38 GMT
Reply-To: stave@apollo.hp.com
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Apollo Division - Chelmsford, MA

In article <2B5DEF77.11902@news.service.uci.edu>,
cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
|> modelled on street gangs.  I always thought this might be good . . .  I
|> would also like to pursue this very scary thread of whether men will
|> ever be able to give birth.  Given the past of humanity, I think that if
|> this ever comes to pass, it's going to be open season on women: "Fuck
|> you, honey!  We don't even NEED you anymore!"  This would be a good
|> topic to pursue in fiction.

Judging from what every woman I have talked to has said about
pregnancy and giving birth, I somehow doubt many men are going
to sign up for this.  Speaking for myself, I am not particularly
desirous of 9 months of discomfort ending in a day or two of
severe cramps culiminating in something that was desrcibed to
me as "pooping out a grapefruit".

  Husbands always tell their wives "Honey, if I could spare you
this discomfort and take it on myself, I would", but they only
say that because they know they won't have to make good on it.

  What I think would be more likely is that the technology
would be developed, but the evil male-dominated medical
establishment would hide the information and squash all the
research, because if it ever got out they'd have to put up
or shut up.

Joel Stave
stave@apollo.hp.com
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: dlg1@quads.uchicago.edu (deborah lynn gillaspie)
Subject: Re: []
Summary: Sources for herb plants 
Keywords: herbs
Reply-To: dlg1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 17:37:48 GMT

Liam,
Hardly any of the places want to ship in this weather, so you've got a
little bit of time. Look for a copy of the magazine The HERB COMPANION,
put out by Interweave Press. It's one of those six-times-a-year things.
It's chock full of ads for places that ship hard-to-get herb plants. 
Interweave also publishes something called the Herb Companion Wishbook
and Resource Guide, ISBN 0-934026-74-2 The editor is Bobbi McRae.

Some places that offer angelica plants are:

The Herb Barn
Sandy Nelson
Trout Run, PA 17771
(717) 995-9327

The Herb Farm
32804 Issaquah-Fall City Road
Fall City, WA 98024
(206) 784-2222

New Hope Herb Farm
Rt.1, Box 660
Spencer, IN 47460
(812)829-6086

Sunnybrook Farms Nursery
9448 Mayfield Road
Chesterland, OH 44026
(216)729-7232

I couldn't find any places in Texas that have plants, though some have
seeds. The Wishbook was published in 1992, but already one place has
gone out of business, so I'd call first to make sure they are there 
and to arrange for a catalog or price list.

Blessings, --Debbie the Librarian, whose sage finally died this week
because it's too cold outside and too dry inside...<g>



-- 
Internet:         dlg1@midway.uchicago.edu
Bitnet:           dlg1%midway@uchicago
  
Newsgroups: alt.pagan