HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Subject: Akido -vs- Akijitsu (meaning of _Aiki_ 
Distribution: world
Organization: IE Technical Services Holland
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 19:12:05 +0000


In article <Bvq04y.BMG.2@cs.cmu.edu> mh4e@resumix.portal.com writes:

>
>My understadning is AikiJuJutsu and JuJutsu were developed as two different> arts
>during the feudal era of Japanese history, and the nomes of each were changed> (to
>their current form) in the 19th century.
>

In the classic Ryus there was not the distinction between the arts.
A Ryu would teach Ken, other weapons, Ju Jitsu and Aiki Ju Jitsu.
The latter was mostly taught to senior students.  It is only in
fairly recent history that the split has taken place.

>Having taken both, I can assure you there are more that just subtle> differences.
>Their approaches to combat situations are completely different.
>

I think that depends on which Ju Jitsu Ryu you have looked at.  Having
done Ju Jitsu from a Ryu which also had an Aiki Ju Jitsu side to it, I
found the differences were not so pronounced.  In another Ju Jitsu style
I studied, there were profound differences.

Nigel

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Nigel Backhurst ( nigel@ietech.demon.co.uk )
c/o 88 Ashburton Road, Hugglescote, Coalville, LE6 2LX, U.K.
p/a IE Technical Services Holland, Deventerstr 150, 7321 CE Apeldoorn
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From: gmadaus@sw.stratus.com (George Madaus)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: cat claws / shuko
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:57:57 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

Hi Folks,

A beginner's question :

	what are cat claws / shuko that are being discussed in another thread

Best regards,
gm
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: bburgar@cix.compulink.co.uk (Bill Burgar)
Subject: Stoning - avoiding flying objects.
Reply-To: bburgar@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 07:38:41 +0000

>Pat Cleveland writes:
>
>>Just another data point on random violence...
>>Two days ago a couple was attacked walking on a path near Cornell at 9:30 pm.
>>It's still unclear as to what exactly happened, but so far it is believed
>>that four men attempted to rob the couple and then attacked them with ROCKS.
>>The woman is still in the local hospital but is expected to make it;
>>the man was evacuated to a hospital in Sayre, PA where he remains in critical
>>condition.
>
>>Thought stoning was an obsolete means of execution :<( .
>
Stephen Northcutt writes:
>Nope, alive and well as you are clearly now aware.  Thrown objects are
>very common in the middle east and riot situations in general.
>
>I have always felt that any decent MA study should include practice
>evading and blocking throw object (or catching and reusing).  A pretty
>safe way to accomplish this training is tennis balls.  Apparently tennins
>balls wear out and don't bounce so good so you should be able to acquire
>all you need from your local tennis club.  Get a bunch.
>
>WARNING: eye protection required, yes a tennis ball can injure an eye!!!!!
>
>Beginner training:
>Instructor has balls, student facing them 15 - 20 feet away.  Instructor
>kihaps and throws ball.  Student can block, dodge etc.  All other students
>collect the balls which GO EVERYWHERE :-)
[more great ideas on missile dodging training - deleted]
>I've posted this before, as a thing for MA kids to try, has anyone ever
>given it a whirl?  It really is a blast and important training.
>
>Stephen


After a particularly tough senior grade session we will sometimes play
games to calm down a bit before facing the outside world. One game
involves the use of foam footballs that are available in the school gym
where we train. The game is rather like British Bull Dog except instead
of catching the "runners" the people in the middle have to throw the
balls to hit them.


The other place where dodging is very important is snowball fights. We
had a tradition at school; when there was snow we had a huge snowball
fight (which often degenerated into real fights!) 6th formers against the
rest. (6th formers are 18 year olds the rest range 12 to 17 years). That
meant about 60 6th formers against about 300 little sods who would throw
volleys of snowballs about 100 at at time, almost impossible not to get
hit!


Still, it did teach you to stay alert, especially when things turned
nasty and they started to put stones in the snowballs.


Bill Burgar.
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: lchurch2@bluemoon.rn.com (Leonard Church)
Subject: Aranada y Kali
Organization: Blue Moon BBS ((614) 868-998[024])
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 14:30:37 EDT

I was asked by someone, what Aranada is.... it translates out roughly to 
be "the way of the Spider" and is a combination of the various filipino 
martial arts and native fighting technics in Peru.  It was brought to 
South America by immigrant workers and took on the local techniques of the 
region... it is characterized by the use of circular traps, and 
simultaneous strikes.  Many of the techniques involve ground combat, 
[wrestling like] with jujitsu type choke outs.  The weapons of the system 
include sickle(sp?), short pole [size of a walking stick or cane], kris 
type blades in sizes from 3inches to 14inches, and wooden swords.  A 
weapon that is sometimes used within the system is a net, similiar to a 
casting net for fishing with barbed hooks laced throughout.

The over view of the system involves its theory on the eight points of 
attack and defense, governed by the 4 elements, fire earth sky and water. 
All strikes are with "loose" hand until contact and then instantly 
clenched for more impact. The trapping techniques are similiar to Wing 
Chun and the redirection of force is similiar to Aikido. 

The Element of Fire governs strikes with the hands and weapons.
The Element of Earth governs kicks and ground fighting.
The Element of Sky governs breathing and concentration
The Element of Water governs the redirection and channeling of external 
and internal forces.


-------------------------------------------------------------
Growing trees in a concrete Jungle | lchurch2@bluemoon.rn.com
-------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: popovich@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich)
Subject: Re: What should I carry?
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1992 03:10:57 GMT

>     -It's legal everywhere in the U.S. except Wisconsin, as far as
>     I know. Here in California people have to get a license to
>     carry Mace, but this is fairly easy and cheap to do.

As far as I know, Mace isn't legal in New York (City -- I think it's
legal in New York State outside the City).  And I've heard that it's
illegal in Kalifornia (I didn't know that there was an LTC available
for it, though), and I don't recall ever seeing Mace for sale in the
People's Republic of New Jersey when I've been there, so it's probably
at least restricted there, too.  It seems that generally there are a
lot of restrictions on Mace, particularly in cities.  I'll let
somebody else post about how (in)effective Mace or capsicum spray is
likely to be on somebody who is drunk, on drugs, or simply has got a
good head of steam (adrenalin) behind his attack, and the elevated
pain tolerance of your standard psycho-{killer,rapist}.

>     -It _seems_ as easy to use as a can of RAID.

Not to mention easy to get turned around under pressure and spray
yourself with :-(.  Another thing to consider is, how are you going to
get to that can of RAID and whip it out in time to defend yourself if
you're ever attacked?

> My only concern would be that Mace didn't work. I've never been
> maced, but I have been teargassed at a demonstration :-). Tear gas
> works. If Mace is anything like as effective, it would at least give
> you time to escape or pick up a pool-cue, and would probably put an
> attacker down for a while. Any thoughts?

Isn't police teargas considerably stronger than the stuff that's sold
to the public for personal defense, even where it's legal?
	-Steve
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: dpipes@spica.srg (Dave Pipes x4552)
Subject: Re: Nice combos with cat claws (or other combos)
Organization: just me
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 14:20:18 GMT
Followup-To: rec.martial-arts

In article <BvzJu6.IKr@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> shulick@navajo.ucs.indiana.edu writes:
>
>Are there any good books that explain and depict good combinations using cat
>claws or sai?  I'd really appreciate it.  My cat claws are coming in the mail
>in a couple weeks, and I've already made up a few of my own combos which I
>think are excellent to use against non-MA's.

Hmmm....Perhaps you can tell us how you developed the method which allows
you to tell whether your opponent is MA trained?  I think that would be
more useful than the cat claws (unless of course they really are retractable,
but I digress...mrowrr...).  Seriously, why practice a weapon like that to
mess up some guy who doesn't have a clue?

>
>Also, another question.  Can non-MA's learn the art pretty well?  For example,
>I've not taken any martial art, but I develop my own techniques.  Can this be
>fairly effective?

Try them on a sparring partner.

>
>I just can't afford to take hapkido lessons, so are there any books that teach
>it pretty well?  Or are there good self-defense books out there which a person
>can learn from? I  know the absence of an instructor isn't great, but I can't
>afford it.  Thanks for any info.

You need a partner to learn Hapkido.  I don't know about books.

David Pipes
robear@digex.com
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: ddewar@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (derek.a.dewar)
Subject: Re: Karate style in 'Karate Kid' movie trilogy?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 15:32:10 GMT

In article <POPOVICH.92Oct12031028@morningside.cs.columbia.edu> popovich@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich) writes:
>>	Can anyone tell me what style of karate Miyagi teaches Larusso in 
>>the karate kid movies? I happen to watch part of 'Karate Kid III' the other
>
>I think it's called "movie-do" :-).  If anybody knows about an actual
>style with any substantial resemblance to the stuff in the Karate Kid
>movies, I'd like to hear about it, too.  I always wondered if maybe
>the makers of these movies intended for the Karate to be Goju-like,
>because they named their "sensei" Miyagi :-).  Of course, what they
>intended and what actually happened may very well be two completely
>different things.
>	-Steve


  The style was infact Goju-Ryu, taught to both actors by Pat Johnson
  who is apparently a 9th Dan. (Sounds a bit high to me...).


  As for the kata, it is called Seienchin (spelling?) which, translated
  means "Song of the fisherman". The kata is performed as if you were 
  in a small fishing boat, hence the wide kiba-dachi stances. There are
  no kicks in the kata, and most of of it is performed slowly (without
  tension), although this may vary from style to style. There are some
  differences between the Goju kata, and the Shito-Ryu one, which I practice,
  but regardless, it's an impressive kata.


  Hope this helps,

  Derek A. Dewar
  AT&T Network Systems UK Ltd.
  ddewar@ihlpb.att.com
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: tmr@wdl1.wdl.loral.com (Tim Ryan)
Subject: Re: Radio Communications in the DOJO
Organization: loral western development labs
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 14:17:38 GMT

> Steve
Nice idea, I wonder what will happen when they start sweating?

Tim

In article <1992Oct9.230518.1998@craycos.com>, sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi) writes:
> 
> >In article <1992Oct9.162643.23455@wdl.loral.com> tmr@wdl1.wdl.loral.com (Tim Ryan) writes:
> >
> >   Does anybody elses, studio have radio communications in there Dojos?
> >
> 
> Hmmm...maybe they can start correcting technique with those electric dog collars
> like the one Dan Quayl(e) uses to keep his pooch away from his putting
> green. You know:
> 
> one jolt	Bend your knees more
> two jolts	Make a tighter fist
> 	...
> 100 jolts	Your dues are late
> 
> etc, etc...
> 
> Steve
> 
>
From: bd622@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Sten-Erik Armitage)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Shuri-Ryu
Date: 7 Oct 1992 06:52:23 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


	I am currently on a desperate surch for a book written
by Grand Master Robert Trias (deceased) entitled "The Pinnacle"

It is basically a book discussing all the forms, and knowledge in
the Shuri-Ryu Karate-do system... If anyone has ANY leads, or 
information on how I could aquire a copy of this book, PLEASE
contact me via E-mail at one of the three adresses that should be 
listed below.  

Thanks so much for any help you can give me!

Sten-Erik Armitage

-- 
    +----------------------+------------+-----------------------------+
    |Sten-Erik Armitage    | The Answer | sarmit@heartland.bradley.EDU|
    |(309)692-0466 (voice) |definatly is| bd622@cleveland.freenet.EDU |
    |(309)692-0467 (data)  | Fourty-Two | usr6401a@tso.uc.EDU         |
From: jothomas@chopin.udel.edu (John Richard Thomas)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Chung Do Kwan forms
Date: 13 Oct 92 21:32:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.Bw2x64.FsL
Organization: University of Delaware


There are two books written by Duk Sung Son on the Chung Do Kwan Style of Tae 
Kwoon Do.  The first book he wrote with an American who's name escapes me.  The title of the book is "Korean Karate:The art of Tae Kwoon Do".  This book 
contains all the forms up to black belt.  The second book Duk Sung Son wrote
contains the black belt forms.
From: poore@ds13.scri.fsu.edu (David Poore)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: ISO: Vegetarian Martial Artists
Date: 9 Oct 92 13:39:11 GMT
Reply-To: poore@ds13.scri.fsu.edu (David Poore)
Organization: Florida State University

In article <718590057snx@ietech.demon.co.uk> nigel@ietech.demon.co.uk ("Nigel G. Backhurst") writes:
>In article <JON.92Oct7140712@zeus.med.utah.edu> jon@zeus.med.utah.edu writes:
>>depends.  do white belts count as meat?
>I thought they were non-fattening deserts!!!

Appetizers?

David Poore
poore@ds13.scri.fsu.edu

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: csc4013@gsusgi2.gsu.edu (CSC 439 Student)
Subject: Greetings, Moderator.
Organization: Georgia State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 20:53:59 GMT

Greetings,

I just thought I'd introduce myself to the group, and discover if there is
a moderator, and if so, to find out what needed to be done to gain entrance
to this group.

My name is Bill Sadler, I'm a grad student in CSC at Ga. State University.
I've been involved in Shotokan since 1978, and am 1st dan.  I've had 4
instructors, 2 in Shotokan, 1 in TKD, and 1 in Aikido.  Oh, I've also 
studied w/ Bud Malestrom and Steve Hayes (only a little).

Well, greetings!

-Bill Sadler

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: garth@dojo.West.Sun.COM (Garth)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Usability of shuko and sai (was Re: cat claws / shuko)
Date: 16 Oct 92 20:30:16 GMT
Reply-To: garth@dojo.West.Sun.COM
Organization: Sun Microsystems
NNTP-Posting-Host: dojo.west.sun.com

In article 7720@iscsvax.uni.edu, venenga@iscsvax.uni.edu () writes:
>> But you're probably right, sai, along with lots of other MA weapons, can't be
>> carried around.  But what MA weapon really can?  Wouldn't even carrying a stick
>> or nunchaku be somewhat difficult?  What IS a good MA weapon to carry around,
>> and that is effective?

Kalli sticks really aren't too bad, and you can even get creative about how
you disguise them...they even have telescoping models.

A good solid leather belt with a heavy buckel works very well.  The Marines
have used this for years to clear out fights in bars.  Just wrap the leather
arround your hand a few times and you have a small flail and a well protected
hand.

A small knife can be legal, and easily hidden.
 
>
>How about the hands, feet, elbows, knees... :-)

They easiest weapons to bring to bear, and the ones most likely not to
get you into trouble... 

-Garth
 
  | Garth R. Doverspike		Sun Microsystems, S.E. Seattle |
  | garth.doverspike@west.sun.com			       |
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: osan@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (Mr. X)
Subject: Re: ma movies and books
Organization: Twilight Zone
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 21:13:52 GMT

In article <13727@pogo.wv.tek.com> roberts@pogo.wv.tek.com (Robert Stroud) writes:
>>
>    Watching Blind Fury for kenjutsu is kind of like 
>    watching Tampopo to learn about cowboys!  For that 
	      ^^^^^^^
	Good movie.
From: wrat@unisql.UUCP (wharfie)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Usability of shuko and sai (was Re: cat claws / shuko)
Date: 16 Oct 92 14:39:20 GMT
Organization: UniSQL, Inc., Austin, Texas, USA

In article <Bw78FH.96s@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> shulick@navajo.ucs.indiana.edu (Sam Hulick) writes:
>What IS a good MA weapon to carry around, and that is effective?

	You mean, besides the right attitude? :-)

	A cane, a walking stick, a kubotan - a short stick just slightly
longer than your hand is wide - , a Bic pen, or a keychain with some keys on
it.  

	Of less dubious legality and lethality (is that a word?) are
a good knife or a small caliber pistol.

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: roberts@pogo.wv.tek.com (Robert Stroud)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Usability of shuko and sai (was Re: cat claws / shuko)
Date: 16 Oct 92 21:05:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: pogo.13777
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Wilsonville,  OR.

In article <Bw8BtL.GIC@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> shulick@navajo.ucs.indiana.edu (Sam Hulick) writes:
>In article <1992Oct16.181632.4122@craycos.com> sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi) writes:
>Ahh.  So what does "gama" mean?  (e.g. the weapon kusari-gama).  A kind of kama
>with a long chain & a ball at the end.  Nasty weapon..
           
        "gama" means "kama" (sickle)

-- 
Robert Stroud       roberts@usa.wv.tek.com
Obukan Kendo Club
Portland Oregon USA
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: dccarr@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (david.c.carr)
Subject: Re: Vegetarian Martial Artists
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 15:20:37 GMT

From article <1992Oct10.214438.21968@exu.ericsson.se>, by exudms@exu.ericsson.se (New Dave):
> ....those who obstain from meat, milk, eggs, true sources
                                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^
> of fat and protein, usually will suppliment these for the many different
> forms of "dofu", or tofu.

ARRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!

Excuse me.  My intolerance of ignorance kicked in for just a moment.

You can get all the protein you need from grains and legumes.
These are also "true sources" of protein.
Tofu is good stuff, as is tempeh - both made from soybeans
(high protein legume) - but adequate protein is available from
a wide variety of sources.


Dave Carr
isshin shorinji ryu okinawa te
ronin, wa bun bushi no michi
"Don't push the river, but don't pull no punches."
david.c.carr@att.com
Xref: sparky rec.martial-arts:13069 rec.arts.tv:19456
From: achou@plasma.icsl.ucla.edu (Albert Chou)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts,rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: Kung Fu TV series
Date: 7 Oct 92 19:10:47 GMT
Followup-To: rec.martial-arts
Organization: University of California at Los Angeles, EE Dept.

In article <1992Oct5.213616.19082@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> ddukhovn@nyx.cs.du.edu (The Great Harlequin) writes:
>I have recently seen a movie that David Caradine(sp?) has starred in that

Carradine's recent book _The Spirit of Shaolin_ has an up-to-date catalog
of his films (as of 1991).  He comments on some of the movies (perhaps even
most; I've forgotten) in the book.

Al
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: eisen@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Carl West)
Subject: Butterfly knife re-visited
Reply-To: eisen@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Carl West)
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 92 15:51:30 GMT


I finally got to spend some time at the library.

In 1872, Thomas Garrick of Providence, Rhode Island patented a knife
and borer combination tool that had a split handle in the `butterfly'
style, but he didn't nail down the handle idea.

In 1880, Edmund Jansen of Solingen, Germany patented a "clasp-knife".
This "clasp-knife" is what we know today as a butterfly knife. From the
wording of the patent, it appears that the idea of a pocketable,
split-handled knife was new and original with Herr Jansen.

In 1926, Pablo Werner of Esquintla, Mexico patented a way of adjusting
the size of the handles of a butterfly knife. (it looks pretty clunky
to me)

In 1982, Lester De Asis of California patented "Apparatus and Improved
Method of Manufacturing Handles for Butterfly Defense Knife" wherein he
describes in excruciating detail exactly how to make his particular
style of butterfly knife handle. He makes no claim to the idea of the
butterfly knife itself. In his background statement, De Asis says:

	 In more recent years, knives embodying this concept were made
	 in the Batangas province of the Philippines during and after
	 WWII. Known as a butterfly folding knife, it was made in
	 jungle workshops from available materials, with metal,
	 baffalo[sic] horn or plastic handles. They were constructed of
	 available materials with hand tools in family shops.
	 Therefore, each knife was an individual item which was not a
	 duplicate of any other knife. As a result, there was very
	 little quality control incorporated into the manufacture of
	 these knives.


There are various other patents on different ways to latch the ends of
the handles together, and at least one on a sheath that will unlatch
the handles as the closed knife is drawn from it.

I hope to add a new and different butterfly style knife to the patent
records in the near future.

Carl

When I stop learning, bury me.
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 17:48:48 EDT
From: <RMT109@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: needed info on ESI

     I didn't know which news group to turn this posting at so I decided I'd
put it in the two groups that come close to the subject I'm asking about.
     I'm sure plenty a martial artists and gun enthusiasts have seen ads on
ESI ( Executive Security International ) I've planned on signing up for their
programs in the spring of '93.  I have their course cataglog but I was
wondering if anyone has any more info about them or any personal experiences.
You can reply through Netnews or contact me through E-mail to :
                          RMT109@psuvm.psu.edu
          Speedy replies will be greatly appreciated.