HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Fri,  8 Jan 1993 06:13:05 -0500 
From: Erik Lauer <el0g+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: INL plague code (was: Re: INL pop code)

leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens) writes:

>Erik Lauer writes:
>>BTW, an early plague of a core planet is a big random problem.  Has
>>anyone though of making planets not plague the first few minutes (or
>>maybe not plague unless the planet has lots of armies)?
>
>We should consider the idea of totally removing plagues from the INL, at
>least from non-neutral race planets.  The function of plague is population
>control for non-tmode and for neutrals; in INL players should be forced to
>control the enemy population themselves.

I think this should be carefuly thought out.  If you keep the planetary
fire the way it is now, people could try to pile a lot of armies on some
planet (home planet, dra if it is agri...).  I think the SB would be
empty, just helping the armies shoot the bombers.  I don't know if this
change would cause strategies to be changed, but perhaps games should be
played without plague before a season of these games are tried.


Erik
---=
From: leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: INL plague code (was: Re: INL pop code)
Date: 7 Jan 93 17:30:38 GMT
Organization: Deep Thirteen, Gizmonics Institute

Erik Lauer writes:
>BTW, an early plague of a core planet is a big random problem.  Has
>anyone though of making planets not plague the first few minutes (or
>maybe not plague unless the planet has lots of armies)?

We should consider the idea of totally removing plagues from the INL, at
least from non-neutral race planets.  The function of plague is population
control for non-tmode and for neutrals; in INL players should be forced to
control the enemy population themselves.

As it stands the plague code essentially limits the good a team can do for
itself defensively in the opening.  In particular, guarding planets while
the SB moves around and piles all the armies on the homeworld is not a
viable strategy.  As it stands, the balance between initial offense and
defense is clear: defending more than about 50 armies is difficult; more
than 75 is impossible.

I don't consider this a "big problem" though.  Even in the game where TWNN
lost some 40 armies to a homeworld plague, eventually the game boiled down
to a midfield slugfest with the winner decided by who could control that
space and move armies into it most effectively.

-Leonard

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ninja@halcyon.com (Jonathan Roy)
Subject: INL team want a newbie? :)
Organization: The 23:00 News and Mail Service
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 01:36:31 GMT

I'm a definate newbie... Only been playing two days. However, as this
appears to be a new addiction for me, I'd like to get into the INL this
season. I'm a quick learned, and not a loner when it comes to team
games.

I'd love to get on a team w/ some fairly experianced players willing
to "bring me up" so to speak.

My school should have Inet access wthin 2-3 weeks, when I plan to
start playing on the servers a few hours a day. Right now I'm limited
to playing against other newbies, or simple moving targets. :)

Thanks for anyones consideration. What looks to be my two favroite
actions are running Starbases, or harassment with Scouts.

-- 
  F F  Jonathan Roy, of the Free Access Foundation    Email: ninja@halcyon.com
   A   Mail faf@halcyon.com for information, or FTP to halcyon.com:  /pub/faf/
  F F  Vorlons, of the Galactic Bloodshed Development Team      GEnie: J.ROY18
 "Everything that has transpired has done so according to my design." - _RotJ_
From: dtabb@ecst.csuchico.edu (Don Tabb)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Clue game
Date: 12 Jan 93 01:38:30 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico
NNTP-Posting-Host: hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu

In article <1it2hc$qjq@agate.berkeley.edu> turin@soda.berkeley.edu (Jimmy Reza de la Turin) writes:
>
>
>he sucks, plain and simple.
>
>if he plays.. i don't want him on my team.
>
>
>Duck Dodgers

It's not for me to say who is clue and isn't.  this is
all the poeple who asked to play.  that shows some clue.
If the Net world wants, I'll put people on into teams.
and leave the less clue out but I think that's tight.
or we could have 2 game? ....?


don
scorn!
dtabb@cscihp.ecst.csuchico.edu
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: bronco clue
Date: 12 Jan 93 15:23:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C0qys0.C80.2
Reply-To: hill@norman.vi.ri.cmu.edu
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Robert Christ writes
> Has anyone else noticed a revival of bronco clue level?
> I've seen some really nice games over the past week.  Is it
> the end of break or anticipation of the upcoming INL season (I
> know I am itching to get in a real game).
>   rob

CMU starts to school today.  Most CMU players have been getting their fix.   
Its tough to go without a month of trek :-).  See you on the net.

Rob
aka Spaceace!
From: jeffw@cs.tamu.edu (Jeffrey A Waller)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: ntserv
Date: 4 Jan 1993 05:52:39 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept., Texas A&M University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: solar.tamu.edu

In article <JRICHARD.92Dec30003111@cs.cs>, jrichard@cs.cs (John 'MacGyver' Richardson) writes:
|> In article <Bzq7LL.JA5@cs.bham.ac.uk> jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James Hawtin) writes:
|> 
|> 
|> >
|> >  take most of the time is ntserv or rather the swopping/contex switch of 16 of them.  Why is this forked perhaps it could be written as a single process? I know this is
|> >
|> 
|> Ok, not to beat a dead dog, but I've been working on this for a while now.
|> It was pretty easy to come up with multiplexed I/O for logging in.  HOWEVER,
|> the big problems are: 
|> 
|> 	o scheduling becomes a disaster!  However, I'm trying reading 
|> 	  one packet from whoever's ready and going on to the next slot.
|> 	  Updates taken care of by the daemon now get taken care of by
|> 	  a signal handler.


A warning here.  Try to minimize the stuff you do during an interrupt;  many
library calls are not reentrant (like malloc--using SunOS anyway).  However,
this is not a problem as you don't really need to use async IO (see below).


|> 
|> 	o reading and writing becomes a disaster!  If you use TCP you have
|> 	  to deal with partial reads and writes of packets because you have
|> 	  to use nonblocking I/O.


This is not true.  select() and poll() are system calls that allow a process
to do syncronous IO among a set of file descriptors under either BSD or SYSV
respectively.   Both calls block until a read (among other things) is 
possible on any of the of file descriptors, macros are supplied to figure
out which one(s) have data ready.   



          If you want to write code, you have to
|> 	  have states for everything in the universe (so to speak). The
|> 	  solution?  Use UDP only.  But that requires a TCP like protocol
|> 	  to get those packets that absolutely have to get there (like a 
|> 	  login name).  Feel like re-inventing the wheel?  I sure feel 
|> 	  like I am now.  :)


I just got back from vacation, so I have missed the discussion (if any)
on the problem I suggested that arises using an all UDP implementation.
Could someone fill me in?  Is there a solution? is it not a problem? or
was the post one of those bigtime 'n' deals?

  
|> 
|> Despite the above, it's kinda fun, so I'm keeping at it.  I had a shot with
|> writing the server in C++, but virtual functions and shared memory ogged me
|> (so to speak again) as they don't work well together.  Ah... too bad. :(
|> It would be cool to do.
|> 
|> (Also, I'm probably be the only person still left working on this)  If anyone
|> has any ideas about the protocol problem (I've got some stuff from rjones (any-
|> one have any more?))  Feel free to send me mail!  
|> 
|> BTW:  what happened the the netrek hackers mailing list?   If it's 
|> gone is anyone interested in making a new one?
|> 
|> John Richardson       
|> jrichard@cs.ulowell.edu
From: rmk@baal.unh.edu (Robert M. Kenney)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Sometimes you just gotta wonder....
Date: 10 Jan 1993 23:13:04 GMT
Organization: MIS Service Center, UNH, Durham, NH
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: baal.unh.edu


	Sorry, but I've been out since Wednesday night due to the flu...

In article <1993Jan8.155523.15707@oz.plymouth.edu>, dbld@oz.plymouth.edu (d^2) writes:
|> Actually saw ghost show up on MetaServer...I was overjoyed!!! A close site
|> (basically on my loop)....I immediately hopped on got a wait queue of 1.
|> 
|> Now, I have never seen anyone ever play ghost so I was again overjoyed and
|> watched my wait queue of 1 never change.  Over the time I began to become
|> a little frustrated....so the inevitable telnet to 2591 to see what was what.
|> 


	What I wish is that I'd been there to see this as it was happening.
    Just having come in tonight(Sunday), and found ghost boned over like
    this, there wasn't much chance of following up on the problem.  The
    daemon process *was* still there(although I nuked it, and re-started the
    sh'd mem seg). Using hindsight, I probably should have checked it out
    more before killing it, rather than panicking the way I did.

	I'm beginning to wonder if I should just change it back to the 
    normal, reliable, boringly normal vanilla bronco it used to be.  It
    seems like I make a few minor changes, and POOF, it no workee!

	If any of the people who were on ghost at the time it started
    acting up could send me a mail message, I'd appreciate it.

|> 
|> What in the hell is this?  ghost is a modified server, I know that, but
|> sometimes you just gotta wonder what Bob is doing down there.
|> 
|> Now I know why I never play at ghost. :/

	Gee, aren't we getting a bit personal here?  I've never even
    met you in person, and you're already chewing my ass. :-)

|> Tallon



--------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert M. Kenney                                Nearnet: rmk@baal.unh.edu
MIS Service Center                              Phone:   (603)-862-4711
Kingsbury Hall, UNH
Durham, NH, 03824
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: isae@IASTATE.EDU (Gadjah Mada)
Subject: Re: Server pop code
Reply-To: isae@IASTATE.EDU (Gadjah Mada)
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 22:09:33 GMT

In article <AfI4ek_00YUo41umwR@andrew.cmu.edu>, jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Joseph E.
Beck) writes:
> 
> I'd like to get this cleared up.  Several claims have been made that
> no server other than Bronco and rwd4 use 10 second pops, all the way
> to almost all servers use 10 second pops.  If you're a server god
> could you please post which pop method you are using, 10 second, 40
> second, or a system of your own.  This way we can get an idea about
> what most people are used to.

 Doorstop has been using the PLANETSTAGGER mod.

> 
> 	thanks,
> 
> 	joe

-Rony
 isae@IASTATE.EDU
From: fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Holy players, batman!
Date: 12 Jan 93 22:57:18 GMT
Reply-To: fadden@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

** MetaServerII v1.0 started on Mon Jan 11 11:45:06 1993
[...]
Statistics taken Tue Jan 12 14:53:06 PST 1993

#of connections:
 0 (old)         840
 1 (new)        1712
 2 (verbose)     354
 3 (info)         13
 4 (faq)          14
 - total        2933

#of different sites:     536


I take it vacation is over...?

-- 
fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: New INL season
Date: 12 Jan 1993 03:48:20 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <104401@netnews.upenn.edu> paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Brian Paulsen) writes:
)Couple questions...
)A) When does it start?

Very soon, hopefully by the first week in February.  The Call For Teams
will go out within the next few days.

)B) Do most people have their team rosters figured out?

Probably not.  I know the core players on the Bears but don't have
a full roster yet.

)C) Is scheduling going to be more ladder-based, or swiss-based, or
)	Tom-based?

We don't know.  This will be the first thing the INL Council decides
after the new members are voted in.  More input here is welcomed.
 -Tom
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ewing@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu (Rick Ewing)
Subject: Changing the alignment of an altar???
Followup-To: rec.games.netrek
Organization: Vanderbilt University Academic Computing Center
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 22:35:39 GMT

I've heard that it is possible not only to change your character's
alignment during a game, but it is also possible to change an altar's
alignment (not without consequences, I suspect).  is it indeed possible,
and if so, an clues on how to accomplish this?

--Rick Ewing
  Vanderbilt University
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Elements of teamwork (long)--faking to planets
Date: 9 Jan 93 12:44:34 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <104158@netnews.upenn.edu>, bellew@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Douglas V Bellew) writes:
> :>(4) All cloakers look alike.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 	Just my $.02 but it seems a large amount of people forget this.
> One thing I find is a pain as a defender and a tends to work well
> is to get basically on top of your carrier (Note: at the beginning of
> the run and not on the planet) and then either run in, and do the escort
> thing, getting people who would normally have known who the carrier 
> was by following the galactic to shoot at me, 
> or go to another nearby planet where I can draw  people to.
> It makes it tough to tell who the real carrier is.  (insert here all
> the nifty variations like comming at right angles and switching 
> flight paths, etc.)
> 

	With a good cohesive team, this can have great effects, as was
demonstrated last night on doorstop.  Two carriers would target a planet, on
the left side of fed space (we were rom).  About 4 or five people would cloak
and rush a planet on the right side.  Once we saw most of the F* people rushing
towards the right planet, the two carriers rushed down the left side, and took
the planet, unhindered.  This happened several times throught the night. 
However, I must add, the other team was a *little* cluless.


		-Lynx
From: slt22@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Blab
Date: 5 Jan 93 09:00:18 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

     I just thought I would get a word in.  I usually play netrek along
side Lynx and I've been watching him put together this new server.
The ships are awesome.  This is shaping up to be great.
     Another thing, does Minute Man read this group?  If so respond
on the group!  
                               Later,
                               Lord Death
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: New Bitmaps (was) Re: Cluechecking on servers - get the twinks!
Date: 7 Jan 93 19:34:05 MDT
Organization: Utah State University


	Also, on the line of the bitmaps, if you want to take a look at them, I
have uploaded all of the north facing views on; ftp.cis.ksu.edu.  The file is
netrek.bitmaps-2.0.tar.Z  Read the included README file for more info.

		Later

			-Lynx
From: el0g+@andrew.cmu.edu (Erik Lauer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Traitors
Date: 3 Jan 93 22:01:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.EfFyv1600VB6420FMo
	<63144@mimsy.umd.edu>
Organization: Doctoral student, Mathematics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens) [Wreck, Dirty Rat] writes:

>Bert Enderton writes:
>>When you've got the enemy team down to an LPS (or near to
>>that) involving their home or core world(s),
>>During phase two, killing any enemy
>>and enabling him to reappear nearer the target planet is a big mistake.
>>Doing so consistently is treachery.  Understand?
>
>>Starbases are almost always traitors in these situations.  A starbase
>>with two escorts trying to keep it alive, that constitutes three
>>traitors.  (On the other hand a SB can be very useful in phase one).
>
>SBs can also be useful in phase two; the problem is that they often
>attract clueless defenders who will kill nearby wounded or fuelless
>enemies.  (And few ships can avoid one of these two states near a
>base.)  Nonetheless, if the SB does not have syncophantic escorts, it
>can be quite useful for the taker to move by the base on the way to
>planet; this is often the best way to approach the front cloaked if
>you are trying to sneak.  Plus, enemy oggers (who tend to be an LPSs
>best players), will often brave the base's fire trying to ogg, in
>which case it is sometimes possible for the base to trap the player,
>det his fuel, phaser him to warp 2 and then hold him with tractors
>from suiciding on local planets while the taker makes his move.
>
>It is also sometimes possible to trap scouts in the same fashion, even
>in INL games.
>
>Trapping a talented enemy and holding him useless and out of the fray
>is, I think, one of the most satisfying potentials of base play.  It
>does not happen very often, but when it does... tremendous fun.  I
>once held MUCUS PIG for nigh on a minute before some clueless scum on
>my team killed him.
>
>-Wreck

I am amazed at how long some good people can be held.  Look at all your
options:

Repair
Warp 0, shields down, without repair  [These two make a guessing game
for the base]
Move under your maxwarp [Won't fool a great base, but most seem to just
info you]
With fuel you can cloak at warp 0.  If you are not tractored, go.  If
the SB  pressors (or realeses you and is moving away)  when you uncloak,
cloak. Otherwise you fire point blank, with sheilds down going warp 0
while the base is tractoring you - about as efficient as an attack gets.






Erik
---=
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: artc@iplmail.orl.mmc.com (Art)
Subject: LOOKING for NEXT binaries....
Organization: MMC
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 19:55:02 GMT

Could somebody tell me where I can get a copy 
of Netrek binaries for Next????



thanks 
Art
From: exodus@IASTATE.EDU
Subject: Re: Netrek 358: Starbase Theory & Concept
Reply-To: exodus@IASTATE.EDU
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 01:13:36 GMT

leonard@mimsy.umd.edu writes:


>> exodus@iastate.edu writes:
  >>I know even in pick up games when I'm
>>playing with Balton or Wreck, I always find myself
>>wishing they were in a ship....



>Touched, I am.  If it is your opinion that I am hurting the team,
>please do tell me.  I may very well select option two and turn the
>sucker in.




  Well, first off, a Wreck or a Balton is pretty much _never_
hurting your team when he's on it. I was just trying to say
that a clue player in a ship is usually more valuable than
one in a base. I prefer to see twinkies get in the base and
sit back in the core collecting armies. That way they aren't
giving away kills and they are doing something useful besides.
  Anyway, what my post was getting at was that I don't really
think a starbase is an effective means of achieving space
control outside of the core. It seems like anytime you have
a base out defending front lines (say Rigel-Canapus) your team
ends up leaving other areas (such as Ceti-Beta) more vulnerable
because you end up with 3 or 4 of your team constantly around
the base (either trying to defend it, or scum kills of it). It
seems to me that the most effective defense is a team of highly
alert players that are on top of carriers, on top of the game.
If you don't have twinkies passing out kills on your team, this
isn't _that_ hard of a thing to do. The advantage is almost
_always_ to the defenders; it is much easier to kill a carrier
than it is to take a planet.
  Anyway, this is just my 2 cents worth.

						Exodus
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: sherod@newton.Colorado.EDU (Scott Herod)
Subject: Re: Netrek 358: Starbase Theory & Concept 
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 23:27:14 GMT

In article <1993Jan10.091241@IASTATE.EDU> exodus@IASTATE.EDU writes:
>  The more I play netrek, the more come to believe
>that the starbase's usefulness is vastly overrated.
>In my estimate, the only effective use of a base in
>a clue (or INL) game is to protect armies in the core
>or defend in an LPS. They are usually a big waste of
>
>( stuff deleted)
>
>  Ummm, what does everyone else think? Am I way off
>on this one?
>
>
>					Exodus

Well you asked.  I tend to agree with you.  I really get annoyed when
we have a base during the enemy LPS.  Many times I have seen a base ogg
get the enemy started talking with the corresponding clue level increase.
Soon no more LPS.

The only time I have seen a really effective base in pick up play 
was in defending agianst an attempt to take the genocided Kli
space by the feds.  Usually I am happy when our base dies when we
control part of enemy space.

Mad DDogg
From: delbaeth@cqs.washington.edu (Robert Christ)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Netrek 358: Starbase Theory & Concept
Date: 11 Jan 93 00:07:00 GMT
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: bart.cqs.washington.edu

I agree that most of the time SBs are a drain on a team.  However, I am
usually one of the most vocal guys calling for an ogg.  I just can't
help myself.  I think blowing up and SB is about as much fun as you can
have in trek.   I am not foolish enough to call for an Ogg of Red Shirt
when he takes out a base.  I think I saw Warsong take out a base once.
I never even shot a torp at him..

I would also put myself in the 99% of SBs who are totally useless.  In
defense though, I play SBs in order to learn how to live through an
ogg.  LaggU is in dire need of someone who can play an SB.  In our
games vs. SS and TWNN our base would pick up 25 armies and never leave
the homeworld and still it would get dooshed on the first ogg wave.

Sometimes I play pickup games to win and sometimes I play to improve
my INL skills.  Most of the time they lead to the same thing but when
playing a base it is pretty rare..
   rob
From: v119matc@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Claus Schwinge)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Servers sharing player databases
Date: 12 Jan 93 20:38:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1993Jan4.212224.62453@cc.usu.edu>, sl7sg@cc.usu.edu writes...
> 
>	When thinking of ways for servers to share databases, I thought of a
>way, that would be feasable, and easy.  If this has already been discussed,
>sorry.

This has come up before, but the problem was that different servers have 
different clue levels, and giving the same credit for a planet taken on 
twink.hoho.weenie as godly.orbit.pluto would not be fair. To solve this 
problem, each server could be scaled according to the it's average DI/hour
in each category.  (A lot like some professors scale the grades gotten in 
labs taught by different TA's)  i.e.  twinkie server has an average bombing
ratio of 8.5 (no one stops bombers, they're too stupid).  Bronco has an 
average bombing ratio of 2.2 (A bad guess on my part).

When the main (meta?) server looks at my bombing ratings on twinkie, it is
divided by 8.5.  Then when bronco gets my bombing update, it multiplies it
by 2.2, hence normalized ratings.

I'd really like to see this implemented, but I think it will happen 2 days 
after the DI scheme gets changed.

> 
>		-Lynx
>		 Brandon Gillespie
>		
>	Oh, yea, it would also be nice, to have a toggle that the player could
>use, where it tells the server to not figure its stats with those of other
>servers...?

Never, all stats all the time

-Halfdane