HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Leigh Palmer <palmer@sfu.ca>
Subject: Re: Sarfatti Forteana
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A768627D16011C1B@rs13-annex3.sfu.ca>
X-Xxdate: Thu, 31 Dec 92 16:40:29 GMT
Organization: Simon Fraser University
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d16
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 16:39:11 GMT

This is the first occasion on which I have 
consciously crossposted, but this topic is 
serendipitous (and gratuitous) in sci.physics, 
and has long been of interest to me. I'd love
to see the answer (the old OED is a tainted 
source on this topic, and I have not seen the
new one) without having to read those other 
groups. In the foreknowledge that it is easier
to obtain forgiveness than permission, then...

In article <1hu5biINN10e@hilbert.math.ksu.edu> 
Francis Fung, frandag@math.ksu.edu writes:

>Incidentally, do you by any chance know the
>derivation of the word "Yankee"? Just a non
>sequitur. :) Have fun!

I'll get the ball rolling, if not in the alley,
then on a jocular, um, plane.

"Yankee" is the term applied by politicians to
the gullible marks from whom they extract (or
yank) their ill-gotten tribute. Yankees (and
they proliferate here in Canada, too) continue
to pay their taxes without complaint for fear
the Yankers will deem them illiberal otherwise,
the greatest sin of our age.

Leigh Hunt Palmer
Xref: sparky sci.skeptic:21757 alt.messianic:3733
From: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
Subject: Re: Will the -REAL- Christians please stand up? Was: What did Judas betray?
Date: 28 Dec 1992 17:57:48 GMT
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
Distribution: world
Reply-To: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol1.gps.caltech.edu

In article <1992Dec28.165941.28423@hfsi.uucp>, ata@hfsi.uucp (John Ata - FSO) writes:
>You can make the same point about most groups and reach the same
>conclusion.  Are Reagan Democrats "real" Democrats?  Are Clinton
>Republican "real" Republicans?

Yes, to both, since there's a well-defined definition of both Democrat and
Republican:  It depends solely on what party you've registered with.

>In the end, the only definition
>that counts of a Republican or Democrat is one who is registered
>as such regardless of their belief.

That's correct.

>So a Klu-Klux Clan president
>can legally say that he is Republican, but since his beliefs are
>diametrically opposed to what Republicans normally think, his
>opinions are not generally researched for the core beliefs of the
>Republican Party.  And I would suggest that a Christian is one who
>thinks that they are following Christ regardless if some of their
>beliefs are in variance with other Christian beliefs.

In other words, if he calls himself a Christian, then he *IS* a Christian.
Or have you, John, perhaps developed the ability to read minds?  If this person
says he truly believes he's following Christ, how do you know that that is *NOT*
what he really believes?

>However, if
>someone claims to be a Christian and then ignores the core beliefs
>of Jesus, although they may be called a Christian in name, their
>actions are there for everyone to see and discriminate.

John: WHO THE HELL GETS TO DEFINE "THE CORE BELIEFS OF JESUS?"  Christians of
	various demoninations have be slaughtering each other for milennia
	because THEY CAN'T AGREE ON WHAT "THE CORE BELIEFS OF JESUS" are.
Why can't you get that one simple (though to your position, extremely
problematical) fact through your head and into your mind?

I know, I know, the "core beliefs of Jesus" are obvious to you, John Ata, and
anybody who disagrees with you is NOT A REAL CHRISTIAN.

You dogmatic stupidity really *IS* beyond belief.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: CARL@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXen and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
From: greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM (...the printer guy <alas.Reply-To: greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Homeopathy
Date: 24 Dec 1992 16:48:02 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: antizen.ebay.sun.com



Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.conspiracy,alt.alien.visitors
From: sarfatti@well.sf.ca.us (Jack Sarfatti)
Subject: re: Crocker's suggestion on Wolff's charge of crackpottery.
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 18:44:27 GMT


OK, Steve Crocker has made some good points and I will not proceed further
with the lawsuit and contacting the fool's employer - but one these days
"Pow! a psychic whammy - a telepathic pop! Beware the Wrath of SAR!
Sweet Dreams, Dave! Who do the quantum voodoo? Control of
action-at-a-distance is quite practical in may cultures, African, Haitian,
Brazilian,Aborigine, Shaman - the use of dream time, astral projection,
out of body, precognitive remote viewing etc. Of course, it's all cargo
cult pseudo science - don't believe it. But remember Neils Bohr kept a
horseshoe over his door anyway. I suggest that Dave stock up on silver
bullets, wooden crosses, wooden stakes and lots and lots of garlic!
.
From: Mischa_Sandberg@mindlink.bc.ca (Mischa Sandberg)
Subject: Re: Tunnels #1.
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 20:10:01 GMT

> Dave Weingart writes:
> Actually, what I found most peculiar about Canadians and politeness
> was the unwillingness to cross the street before a green OK, even
> when there's clearly no traffic for miles in any given direction.
> (Here in New York, we charge out into oncoming traffic whether there's
> a green or not).

Hmm. Don't know where you visited, except perhaps Toronto The Good.
In Vancouver, it is an iffy proposition whether a car will or will not
stop for a red light, anyway. In Ottawa (home to our nation's finest
bureaucrats) nobody pays attention to the lights, and I'm not sure
whether jaywalking is worth a citation in either sense.


--
Mischa Sandberg ... Mischa_Sandberg@mindlink.bc.ca
                 or uunet!van-bc!rsoft!mindlink!Mischa_Sandberg
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
Engineers think equations are an approximation of reality.
Physicists think reality is an approximation of the equations.
Mathematicians never make the connection.
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
From: "James F. Tims" <p00168@psilink.com>
Subject: Re: Will the -REAL- Christians please stand up? Was: What did Judas betray?
Organization: Semper Excelsior
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 15:09:19 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink (3.2)

>DATE:   Sun, 3 Jan 1993 02:52:24 GMT
>FROM:   John Ata - FSO <ata@hfsi.uucp>
>
>In article <1i44cuINN86i@iraul1.ira.uka.de> stoesser@i31s17.ira.uka.de (Achim Stoesser) writes:
>>In article <1993Jan1.191432.13862@hfsi.uucp>, ata@hfsi.uucp (John Ata - FSO) writes:
>>|> In article <1humf2INNniq@iraul1.ira.uka.de> stoesser@i31s17.ira.uka.de (Achim Stoesser) writes:
>>|> >In article <bruce.725729139@cortex>, bruce@cortex.dixie.com (R. Bruce Rakes) writes:
>>...
>>|> >|> It is my understanding that Nazi Germany was Xtian.  Can anyone else
>>|> >|> confirm this?
>>|> >
>>|> >- Hitler was Roman Catholic.
>>|> 
>>|> His regime and his government, however, were not founded on
>>|> Christian values.  That is the point that was being made (although
>>|> I agree that Hitler's "religion" can cloud the issue).  I don't
>>|> know of any Christian denomination at the time of Hitler that
>>|> espoused the killing of non-Christians as even remotely following
>>
>>So the Pope was not a Christian? (You deleted my line "- Pope Pius IX (?) 
>>was the first one to make contracts with Hitler.")
>
>What do you mean by making contracts with Hitler?  Do you mean the
>the Pope made a contract with Hitler to kill non-Christians or to
>espouse the superiority of the Aryan race?
>
>>
>>|> Christ.  I won't even mention the superiority of one race over
>>|> another, etc.  Therefore the beliefs and actions of his regime are
>>|> in direct contradiction to the faith he claimed to have as well
>>|> the teachings of Christ.  Quoting his belief in a God doesn't
>>
>>Probably _any_ beliefs or actions  ar in contradiction to "the(sic!) teachings
>>of Christ" because these teachings are contradictive by itself and/or subject
>>to contradictive interpretation. Hence, nobody is a Christian.
>
>Sorry, this is pure nonsense.  Hitler's actions were not only in
>direct violation of Jesus's teaching but also against the law and
>norms of the RC Church in his day as well as today.  If you would
>like Scriptural and/or RC canon law references, I would be happy
>to do so, although we probably should continue such an exchange in
>another forum such as Email.
>
>-- 
>John G. Ata - Technical Consultant | Internet:  ata@hfsi.com

Sorry, this is pure quibbling.  What in the world does violation of 
JC's or the RC's teaching have to do with Pope Pius IX making deals with 
Hitler?  Though it would be a surprise to see anything of substance 
from your side of the aisle, this particular tack supports one of the arguments  
raised against you, i.e. that Xians do not follow the teachings of JC 
and that we cannot look to the New Testament for a definition of Xian. 


  ,...,.,,
 /666;    ',    jim tims
////;    _~ -   p00168@psilink.com
(/@/----0-~-0
 ;'  . `` ~ \'
  , `    ' , >
;;|\..((   -C----> Considering the Vatican's Machiavellian history, why
;;| >-  `.__),;;   are you even surprised that Pope Pius IX supported Hitler? 

Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
From: cust_ts@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Tero Sand)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Uri's Magic
Date: 25 Dec 92 16:18:18 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <1h311iINNfm0@gap.caltech.edu> carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU writes:
>Careful, Robert.  Galileo just a few days ago passed through perihelion, so
>it's now just about as warm as it's going to get, and NASA's been hoping that
>the warming would be sufficient to allow them to free the stuck ribs.  Based on
>Geller's past performances, in particular the "broken watch" trick, I wouldn't
>put it past him to claim credit if NASA's next attempt to unstick the ribs
>works.

I understood that NASA now believes this scenario to be unlikely to
work. However, they have some other plan that they think has a good
chance of working. What it was, I've forgotten.

Of course, further discussions of Galileo (if they don't refer to Uri
Geller) should go to alt.sci.planetary.

	Tero Sand
-- 
	EMail: cust_ts@cc.helsinki.fi   or   custts@cc.helsinki.fi
   "I feel most ministers who claim they've heard God's voice are eating
too much pizza before they go to bed at night, and it's really an 
intestinal disorder, not a revelation." - Reverend Jerry Falwell
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
From: meier@Software.Mitel.COM (Rolf Meier)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.med
Subject: Re: Hearing aids
Date: 22 Dec 92 17:47:00 GMT
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.

In article <GERRY.92Dec16125546@onion.cmu.edu> gerry@cmu.edu (Gerry Roston) writes:

>The second doctor told her that in her case, she needed a hearing aid,
>such as the one described above, but that they don't exist!  He said
>that the only type on the market were straight amplifiers, and in her
>case, they'd be useless.  Now, as an engineer, I know that the
>technology for a selectively amplified hearing aid is not difficult.  
>
>So the question is this: Who's telling the truth?  Do Miracle Ear
>hearing aids work as advertised?  Is the second practitioner correct,
>or is he "jealous" of a technology not available to him?  Any
>information, including personal anecdotes, are welcomed.

A hearing-impaired colleague informs me that frequency-equalized
hearing aids have been state-of-the-art for many years.  He had his
hearing analyzed and the proper correction was implemented in
his hearing aid.  As with most hearing-impaired, his response at
the low frequencies is almost normal.

On the matter of the cause of the impairment, my understanding was
that it is commonly due to damage (or improper development) of the
little hairs that pick up vibrations  in that little shell-shaped
thing (I forget the name).  If the nerves were damaged, no amount
of amplification would get the signal to the brain.

__________________________________________________________________
Rolf Meier					Mitel Corporation
From: ssammy@cs.strath.ac.uk (Paul Sammy 4th Year iE/CES)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: Looking for Daniken sceptic
Date: 21 Dec 92 15:40:13 GMT
Distribution: sci
Organization: Information Engineering


Hello there.

I'm looking for a book that purports to reveal the
inconsistencies and downright lies that Eric Von Daniken
(allegedly) wrote in his "Gold of the Gods" series.

I know it exists (I've read it somewhere), but I'm not sure
of the title or the author.
I think its called "Gold of the Gods Revealed" or something
similar.

If possible I'd like a ISBN and a publisher, so I can order it.

Paul


--

Q:  Why are electrons patriotic?            | Internet: ssammy@cs.strath.ac.uk
A:  Because they go to the poles and volt.  | JANET   : ssammy@uk.ac.strath.cs
Copy this line into your .signature to protect it against viruses! [version -9]
From: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: AIDS
Date: 29 Dec 92 16:17:21 GMT
Reply-To: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Organization: The Wistar Institute of Anatomy and Biology
In-reply-to: biow@cs.umd.edu (Christopher Biow)

In article <63003@mimsy.umd.edu>, biow@cs (Christopher Biow) writes:
>Could most, if not all, heterosexual transmission of AIDS be 
>attributed to anal sex? Or pre-existing genital lesions?

Probably not, at least in the USA.  See Peterman et al "Risk of human
immunodeficiency virus transmission from heterosexual adults with
transfusion-associated infections" JAMA 259:55 (1988).  In short, 9
out of 10 partners who became HIV+ denied having anal intercourse.

>Conversely, can we say that ordinary vaginal intercourse _does_
>have a significant chance of transmitting AIDS? Both ways,
>or only male to female?

In the USA, it is mostly male to female.  There were a few HIV+
prostitutes for years in the San Francisco/Oakland area, long before
anyone realized the potential danger.  Yet not one case attributable
to them is known.

In contrast, Africa follows both male to female and female to male
patterns.

>For some reason, I have _never_ seen this addressed in any 
>press reports of research on the disease.  

So?
-- 
-Matthew P Wiener (weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Psychics' Predictions Fizzle For 1992
From: lippard@skyblu.ccit.arizona.edu (James J. Lippard)
Date: 2 Jan 1993 19:28 MST  
Distribution: na,local
Organization: University of Arizona
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

In article <1993Jan2.231655.12160@cs.unca.edu>, kepley@cs.unca.edu (Brad Kepley) writes...
>>do you really think people actually believe this obvious entertainment?
> 
>I'd say they do.  Aren't "psychics" sometimes used by the police or
>is that bull*** dished out by the cons who call themselves psychics?

There is only a very small overlap between the "psychics" who make
predictions in the tabloids and those who sometimes consult with
police.  (The only tabloid predictor I can think of, offhand, who
also claims to have done psychic detective work is Irene Hughes.)
There is also a fairly big difference between what the tabloid
predictors claim to be doing and what psychic detectives claim to
be able to do.  Most psychic detectives do not claim the ability
to solve crimes or come up with names and addresses of criminals,
but only to come up with additional clues.  Sometimes they appear
to succeed, but these successes are not necessarily the result of
paranormal abilities.  (See Arthur Lyons and Marcello Truzzi,
_The Blue Sense: Psychic Detectives and Crime_ for more information.
Prometheus will also be coming out with a volume on psychic
detectives edited by Joe Nickell in the next year or so.)

Jim Lippard              Lippard@CCIT.ARIZONA.EDU
Dept. of Philosophy      Lippard@ARIZVMS.BITNET
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721
Xref: sparky sci.skeptic:21719 alt.messianic:3727
From: rice@sumex-aim.Stanford.EDU (James Rice)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Hoagland? What's the deal?
Date: 28 Dec 92 09:28:40
Organization: Knowledge Systems Lab, Stanford University
Distribution: world
	<1992Dec18.145633.15270@twisto.eng.hou.compaq.com>
	<BzGzMz.2zp@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>,<roelle.724974838@uars_mag>
	<1hk5e5INN34t@gap.caltech.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpp-ipc-2.stanford.edu
In-reply-to: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU's message of 27 Dec 1992 11:52:37 GMT

Although I dropped the message long ago, I'd like to thank whoever
recommended the book "Labyrinth of Night" by Allen Steele early
on in the face-on-Mars thread.  I just started it and am having a lot
of fun.  I highly recommend it to any hard core SF reader who has
retained the ability to suspend disbelief enough still to enjoy
classic Heinlein stories of native species on Mars and Venus.

One particular quotation from the U.S.'s soon to be earstwhile
vice president make the book worth reading anyway:


  "Mars is in essentially the same orbit.  Mars is somewhat the same
   distance from the Sun, which is very important.  We have seen
   pictures where there are canals, we believe, and water.  If
   there is water, that means there is oxygen.  If there is
   oxygen, that means we can breathe."


Compliments of the season,


Rice
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
From: schumach@convex.com (Richard A. Schumacher)
Subject: Re: Chuck Missler and imminent Armageddon
Organization: CONVEX Computer Corporation, Richardson, Tx., USA
Distribution: world,local
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 17:47:03 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.


>I have found Chuck [Missler] to be a most helpful teacher. He does go on
>a bit about astronomy and warfare but where he does concentrate
>on the fundamentals of life in Christ, he is mature and insightful. It's
>straight down the line, conservative Christianity.

But how can you tell? I mean, if he commits such shameless and 
ignorant howlers when we can check up on him (that is, when
he talks about science), why should one trust his judgment on
other matters?


Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
From: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
Subject: Re: Will the -REAL- Christians please stand up? Was: What did Judas betray?
Followup-To: sci.skeptic,alt.messianic
Organization: Johns Hopkins University CS Dept.
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 21:53:54 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.165941.28423@hfsi.uucp> ata@hfsi.UUCP (John Ata - FSO) writes:
>You can make the same point about most groups and reach the same
>conclusion.  Are Reagan Democrats "real" Democrats?  Are Clinton
>Republican "real" Republicans?  In the end, the only definition
>that counts of a Republican or Democrat is one who is registered
>as such regardless of their belief.  So a Klu-Klux Clan president
>can legally say that he is Republican, but since his beliefs are
>diametrically opposed to what Republicans normally think, his
>opinions are not generally researched for the core beliefs of the
>Republican Party.  And I would suggest that a Christian is one who
>thinks that they are following Christ regardless if some of their
>beliefs are in variance with other Christian beliefs. However, if
>someone claims to be a Christian and then ignores the core beliefs
>of Jesus, although they may be called a Christian in name, their
>actions are there for everyone to see and discriminate.

But how do I tell if someone ignores the core beliefs of Jesus?  Not only can't
Christians agree on who is a Christian, they can't even agree on what the core
beliefs of Jesus are.  It's as if there were a few dozen mutually contradictive
Republican party platforms.
--
"the bogosity in a field equals the bogosity imported from related areas, plus
the bogosity generated internally, minus the bogosity expelled or otherwise
disposed of."  -- K. Eric Drexler

Ken Arromdee (arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu, arromdee@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
From: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Subject: Re: Homeopathic remedies
Reply-To: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Organization: Rosemount, Inc.
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 21:57:46 GMT

p00168@psilink.com (James F. Tims) writes:
: >wsadjw@rw6.urc.tue.nl (Jan Willem Nienhuys) writes:
: >: 
: >: It is even not much more irrational than astrology.
: >:
: >
: >Excellent!  
: >
: >In english that is called being "damned with feigned praise."
: >
: 
: "When needs he must, yet faintly then he praises;
: So marreth what he makes, and praising most, dispraises."
: 	--Phineas Fletcher, _The Purple Island_ [1633], canto 7.
: "Damn with faint praise, assent with civil leer,
: And, without sneering, teach the rest to sneer;"
: 	--Alexander Pope, _Prologue to Imitations of Horace_, l. 193

Well, you learn something every day.  Having heard rather than read
the phrase, I always thought they were saying "feigned" rather than
"faint."  Though you've got to admit feigned works well also.  (I just
looked it up to make sure it meant what I thought it meant.)

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  Catsup and Mustard all
Rosemount Inc.                                |over the place!  It's the
                                              |Human Hamburger!
grante@aquarius.rosemount.com                 |
From: jfl@panix.com (Jeff Lipton)
Subject: Re: Biblical Inerrancy?
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 06:54:09 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix & Internet, NYC

In article <NICHAEL.92Dec15115352@kariba.bbn.com> ncramer@bbn.com writes:
>In article <1992Dec15.152931.16426@linus.mitre.org> m23364@mwunix (James Meritt) writes:
>
>   In article <723869794.AA08733@csource.oz.au> joe@csource.oz.au (Joe Slater) writes:
>   }Tuesday December 01 1992, James Meritt writes to All:
>   }
>   }JM> That's nice.  Do you think that God thought in Arabic, King James's
>   }JM> English, or any other mortal tongue?  And if not, wouldn't ANYTHING
>   }JM> that is codefied suffer the same "change and loss of meaning"?
>   }
>   }Obviously the Divine Language is Hebrew. This can be easily demonstrated by the
>   }fact that Adam spoke it before languages were divided, as recorded in the
>   }Bible. I have no doubt that this argument will immediately win hearts and minds
>   }in this newsgroup.
>
>   No, that is Adam's language (hack hack hack).  What did God think in before
>   Adam?  You know - what was "LET THERE BE LIGHT!" expressed as?
>
>(setq *LIGHT-P* t)


According to one beautiful Jewish legend, the Torah was written in letters
of white fire on scrolls of black fire, prior to the creation of the physic-
al world. However, if God chose the lambda calculus, I would imagine that
he would have preferred the elegance of scheme...
	(define Light? #t)

 - Jeff

-- 
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Jeffrey F. Lipton, M.D. (jfl@panix.com) |   (212)-982-1219 (home)          |
| 353 E. 17th, #19-E  NY, NY 10003        | "Disobedience was Man's First    |
+------------------------------------------------ Virtue" (Oscar Wilde) -----+
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic