HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mdresser@pbs.org (Melanie Dresser)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Need help with my first horse
Date: 5 Nov 92 11:57:45 EST
Organization: PBS:Public Broadcasting Service, Alexandria, VA

In article <1992Oct26.133238.3065@lugb.latrobe.edu.au>, SOCC9241430E@LUST.LATROBE.EDU.AU (JACKSON,Chris) writes:
> Barbara writes.....
>  
>> If I need a blanket (or two), how do I figure out the size?
> 
> Again, go to the saddlery, tell them how many hands your horse is, and 
> they should tell you the size required.....make sure you buy good quality
> rugs, because horses have a tendency to ruin rugs.

Going by hand size is not the way to fit your blanket.  If I went by 
the hand size chart at the tack shop Quest at 16H should wear a size
76/78, but that doesn't even begin to cover his big behind.  He wears
a size 82, but when buying cotton sheets or blankets, I always get
an 84 since they tend to shrink down about one size.  
Measure from the middle of the chest around to the back of the butt
and that should give you a better guess as to the proper size.

Blankets with leg straps seem to stay put best, and I have to say
once again that the best fitting blankets I've ever bought are the
Big-D blankets, and I have heard good things about the fit of BMB,
which are a little less expensive.

Most Tack shops charge a lot for blankets, mail order is good if
you know what you like.

The catalogs I do most of my ordering from are
Jeffers Vet Supply  1-800-JEFFERS
Weise Vet Supply    1-800-869-4373
Valley Vet Supply   1-800-468-0059  (have BMB blankets)
Pard's Western Shop 1-800-334-5726  (have Big-D blankets)

Melanie
   and Quest
-- 
**************************************************************
          Melanie L. Dresser	  mdresser@pbs.org    
**************************************************************
"In this world, you must be oh so smart, or oh so pleasant.
Well, for years I was smart; I recommend pleasant.  You may
quote me."  Elwood P. Dowd
**************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Regarding New Zealand Rugs
From: Bliss B Siman <ROPBB@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Friday, 6 Nov 1992 16:45:05 EST
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

I think Miller's has the KIWI in its catalog, and I just bought a blue NZ rug
but I don't know if it has the bird on the side. I'll look.
From: hannah@pomponio.ai.sri.com (Marsha Jo Hannah)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Any videotapes available on lameness?
Date: 5 Nov 92 17:30:29 GMT
	<1992Oct31.143750.9662@microsoft.com>
Distribution: usa
Organization: SRI International, Menlo Park, CA
In-reply-to: brandyt@microsoft.com's message of 31 Oct 92 14:37:50 GMT

In article <1992Oct31.143750.9662@microsoft.com> brandyt@microsoft.com (Barbara Brandy Thorp) writes:

   In article <1992Oct30.172559.21114@cbnewsm.cb.att.com> maul@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (m.k.maul) writes:
   >Does anyone know of videotapes showing lameness problems in 
   >horses?  The riding club I belong to has programs each month
   >and a video illustrating the problems and how to detect them
   >would be an interesting program.
   >Mike Maul

   ... the Breakthrough Books on Horses catalog ... list one (sort of)

   PMB: A Diary of Lameness.  Tony Gonzalez, farrier.
   With the Proper Balance Movement (PBM) system, even radically
   defective horses can be made sound and safe.  The author, a farrier
   for 25 years, shows how PBM works and demonstrates how the 
   particular physiology of your horse relates to its particular 
   movement patterns.  ...

   ... I would be interested if anybody here knows anything about
   this...

   ..Brandyt & Pajtas.

A couple of years ago, some friends and I attended a 2-day seminar by
Tony Gonzales, Linda Tellington-Jones, and Sally Swift.  Gonzales was
entertaining, and he clearly was a good farrier (i.e. started with a
horse that moved funny, and had it moving noticeably better after just
a trim, then much better the next day, after shoeing it overnight).
Unfortunately, he wasn't nearly as good at communicating what he saw,
did, etc.  One of my friends, who has trimmed his own donkeys for
years, tried to ask questions, and came away shaking his head---
Gonzales just wasn't able to explain himself in a way that anyone in
our party (including my trainer, who had taken a shoeing course at
college) could "get hold of".  I've never seen his video, but based on
what I've heard of him as a speaker, I'd want to borrow it before
buying it.

Marsha Jo Hannah		Murphy must have been a horseman--
La Honda, CA			anything that can go wrong, will!
From: pallas@cephalo.neusc.bcm.tmc.edu (Sarah Pallas)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Hoof Care Products
Date: 9 Nov 1992 22:04:47 GMT
Organization: Baylor College of Medicine, Houston,Tx
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: cephalo.neusc.bcm.tmc.edu

I'd like to start a new discussion about hoof care products.  Here in
Houston, our soil has lots of clay, which means that either the horses
are swimming in mud or that their feet are bone dry.  I've been using
Fiebing's Hoof Dressing, which is basically pine tar, but Monty's
owner claims that it is damaging his feet (they do look dry and awful, but I
don't know if it's the Fiebings).  So I'm interested in trying
something else, but don't know which products are good and which are
worse than nothing.  I'd also like something easy to use.  The
Fiebing's is liquid and can be applied with an applicator, keeping my
hands clean.  Price is another consideration.  I'd had good luck in
the past with the Fiebing's and also "Bear Cat" which is a pine tar
derivative applied only to the coronary band.  It completely cured the
cracks and chipping on the hooves of a horse I leased in Boston a few
years ago.  But it was very messy.
From: regard@hpsdde.sdd.hp.com (Adrienne Regard)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Wrapping/linaments - do you use them?
Date: 5 Nov 1992 16:18:27 -0800
Organization: Hewlett Packard, San Diego Division
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpsdde.sdd.hp.com

In article <1992Nov5.195505.25509@cbfsb.cb.att.com> pfau@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (lynn.r.pfau) writes:
>Question for readers:
>I'm wondering what people out there do to their horses legs
>after a workout. I recently moved to a new barn - hunter/jumper,
>and everyone there uses at least standing wraps after jumping.

I'm with you.  Hose 'em down, and leave 'em alone.  Of course, I don't
stall my horse -- she has a 48X48 and then some to tromp around it.  That
might make a difference.  I might use standing wraps for one day after a
really big effort -- a clinic or, say, 4 major classes.

>(A related question - what do you folks put on legs when riding?)


Usually splint boots front and back for trail and jumping, with bells if
I'm turning out.  I use Professional Choice wraps when jumping cross country
because of the concussion.  She never knocks herself except for the one
day a year I *don't* put boots on her.....  My splints are 4 years old and
completely undamaged, but leave 'em off, and she'll cut herself somewhere.
From: regard@hpsdde.sdd.hp.com (Adrienne Regard)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Wrapping/linaments - do you use them?
Date: 6 Nov 1992 13:12:58 -0800
Organization: Hewlett Packard, San Diego Division
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpsdde.sdd.hp.com

In article <1defsmINNqes@morrow.stanford.edu> GC.GGG@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gwyn Gordon) writes:
>In article <1dcdkjINN5tl@hpsdde.sdd.hp.com>,
>regard@hpsdde.sdd.hp.com (Adrienne Regard) writes:
>>I'm turning out.  I use Professional Choice wraps when jumping cross country
>>because of the concussion.
>
>What are these? Are they combination wrap-boots? How do they work?


Professional Choice wraps are a leg wrap made out of a material similar to
neoprene.  Mine are squares, not strips of cloth, and close with velcro --
but not with the loop-curl-back velcro closure of most splint boots.  Rather
it's a straight wrap velcro around the leg.

           --------------------
          |                    |-------
          |                    |-------
          |                    |  
          |                    |-------
          |                    |-------
          |                    |
          |                    |-------
          |                    |-------
          |                    | 
          |                    |-------
          |                    |-------
          ---------------------

The sides of the boot overlap, and there is a lining like thick chamois inside
that supports the leg.  (This is the 'polo' version of the boot.  The current
product is advertised in various nationwide magazines with a jumping/support
version of the boot where the bottom velcro strap is attached to a neoprene-
like flap that pulls under the fetlock for additional support.)

Supposedly, these boots have been treadmill tested on various animals, and
help spread the concussion more evenly through the leg, lessening shock to
any particular part of the leg, and thus reducing the likelihood of lameness.
I'ts supposed to be particularly good for horses with suspensory vulnerability,
and/or horses doing a lot of verticle work (jumpers).  It's also fairly thick,
so riding through brush is not a problem.

They look pretty funky, like knee supports on athletes, being quite a bit
thicker than normal splints (about twice as bulky).  And they aren't cheap,
at about $80 a pair (for the new design).  And they don't have the tendon 
support bubbles that Ulster boots have, which can be wonderful for horses
that are vulnerable to ruptured tendons.  But they *do* claim, with some
research, to reduce shock....

I don't know how they measured that, and maybe it's just marketing hype.  But
I know lots of trainers who swear by 'em.

Adrienne Regard
From: lcasey@uoft02.utoledo.edu
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Leg wraps/rub downs/hosing...
Date: 6 Nov 92 15:40:48 EST
Organization: University of Toledo, Computer Services

I use front splint/ankle boots.  Seems like when I use bell boots, the backs of
the horse's pasterns get rubbed raw.  Anyone else have this problem?  I just
quit using them because of this.

After a workout, I rarely do anything unless the horse is obviously in need


Leigh




of wraps/linament/hosing etc.  Hasn't happened very often.
From: VBENJAM@uga.cc.uga.edu (Virginia Benjamin)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: RE: Feeding old horses
Date: 11 Nov 92 04:43:35 GMT
Article-I.D.: relay1.9211102349.AA07992
Reply-To: equestrians@world.std.com
Organization: BBN news/mail gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: news.bbn.com

Your description of undigested grain in the manure is exactly the phrase
used by a friend who knew something had to be done to help her 24-year-old
thoroughbred. She started squeezing a few drops of RATION PLUS (by Crump,
I think) from its eyedropper dispenser onto his grain and is VERY pleased
with his weight gain (and no longer sees the whole grain in his manure).
She described RATION PLUS as "yogurt for horses" which acts as a digestive
aid on the grain so that the horse receives the most benefit from his feed.
Another participant in the conversation this summer said she had just sent
away for a sample that was advertised in a horse magazine (free sample and
a $4.00 handling fee) so you might look in some recent issues of magazines
to see if you find any coupons...

virginia (athens, ga.)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: jen187@mis.csiro.au (Graham Jenkins +61 6 276 6812)
Subject: Re: Shoeing, Blacksmith Questions...
Organization: CSIRO ITS
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 92 20:50:49 GMT

In article <1dr447INNh8r@seven-up.East.Sun.COM> sfrisch@panache.East.Sun.COM writes:

>been there one week to the day prior.  I also noticed
>that the nails were not flush to the shoe and was told
>that they would work their way in and that there
>was about an 1/8 of an inch of shoe overlapping his hoof.
>
>The person that I board from said that the ferrier told her
>that Billy's feet fit shoes right out of the box.
>

I don't claim to be any expert on shoeing but this seems a little odd.
I've never yet seen a farrier put shoes on a horse straight out of the
box, they've always required at least a bit of reshaping. Also the shoe
should be flush (more or less) all round the hoof except right at the 
back where they might stick out a bit. As for the nails "working their
way in", this just seems to me that they're going to work their way
loose on the hoof and make it real easy for the shoe to come off.

Like I said, I'm no expert but I've watched lots of horses get shod 
at endurance rides and other places and the things you've mentioned
seem a bit strange to me.



-- 

|  Graham Jenkins          |  graham.jenkins@its.csiro.au           | 
|  CSIRO                   |  (Commonwealth Scientific & Industrial | 
|  Canberra,  AUSTRALIA    |  Research Organisation)                |
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: turowski@sophia.smith.edu (Petra Turowski)
Subject: Re: Rain Scald
Organization: Smith College
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 15:59:41 GMT

Beata asked:
>Is "rain scald" the same thing as "rain rot" (in the US)?
>A related question: has anyone heard the theory about rain rot being
>caused by acid rain? I've always thought that it is a fungal
>infection of the skin. Any comments?

Rain scab = rain rot = rain scald

The "theory" that rain rot is caused by acid rain is utter rot.
It was probably started by someone who had no idea and was
merely speculating and propagated by people who aren't happy
unless they are worrying over something.  If one wants to worry 
about species affected by acid rain, there are plenty of them
that are endangered; there is no reason to pull possibilities
out of a hat.  Worry about amphibians and sweet water inhabitants
instead.

There is plenty of evidence that rain rot is an infection, fungal
or bacterial.  Three simple bits of evidence are that the
condition is contagious, that it goes away when treated with 
iodine, and that mostly horses who are susceptible to infection
for one reason or another actually suffer from it (the condition).

Petra  (Ok, ok, I'm not a vet or a microbiologist, I'm only a chemist.
  But I've had experience with rain rot, and besides, I am firmly
  convinced that I know everything.  In my defense, I've had more
  than enough experience with the effects of acids on skin, to my
  shame, and the formation of bumbs and scabs isn't one of them
  (effects).   In fact, rain rot reminds me a lot of when I had
  chicken pox, except I wasn't supposed to scratch off the scabs.)
From: alanmoore@yang.earlham.edu
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Horseless Rider Needs Directions(s)
Date: 12 Nov 92 14:33:58 GMT
Organization: Earlham College, Richmond, Indiana

>I've realized that I'm not sure what it is I should be buying; i.e.,
>some land, board at a local barn, a little farm, etc..

Personally, I would never board one of my horses.  However, I have always lived
in a rural area and have been lucky enough to get places with enough land to
keep my horses.  It is really nice to be able to wake up and look out your back
window to check on your horses.

Board around here runs $100-$200 a month, which will go a long way towards
paying off some land.  My feeling on board is like rent; you're just
throwing it away (I shouldn't talk; I'm still renting... but I'm looking!).  Of
course, some places feed and take care of your horse, but if you are going to
have someone else do that for you, do you really want a horse?  One advantage
to boarding a horse is you get more chances to get other people to help you
with their experiences with horses; basically, more chances to "soak
knowledge".

I spend about $200 a year on my horses, including feed and medicine.  I trim
their feet myself, and usually doctor them myself, something I think everyone
should do... but that's a personal opinion.

I already have tack, and I don't show, so the funding of a "show habit" is
foreign to me.  One thing you will probably need is a trailor, which will
probably be in the neighborhood of $1000-$2000.  I got one for $500, but
cosmetically its not in the greatest shape, and I don't use it a lot.

Some notes on trailors if you buy one -

  Put a new floor in it if you are not absolutely sure the one that is in
  it is safe (this is cheap insurance).

  Put good radial tires on them (I bought new tires for my van and put the
  tires from my van on my trailor since they were still in good shape).  This
  will provide a good ride for your horses and make the trailor pull easier.

  Buy a big log chain and bolt it on either side well behind the hitch on your
  your trailor to use as a safety chain.  Make sure it is long enough to hook
  to the truck frame (not hitch).  I have never seen a horse trailor with
  a big enough safety chain on it (except mine :-).

I have never had a horse go throught the floor, or blown out a tire, but I have
lost a trailor, and there's no worse feeling that I know of. (Having your
trailor pass you on the road with your horses looking at you like "Hey, where
are you going?" is slightly disconcerning.)  I was lucky, nobody and no horses
were hurt.

Alan and Spring and Lady

> PPS - "I used to have money. Now I have horses." - saw it on a shirt at the
>       QH Congress.

PS A guy won the lottery, and people asked him what he was going to do with
  the money.  He said "Well, I'm not going to change my lifestyle; I recon
  I'll jest keep showing horses and working full time until it's all gone..."
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: majewski@bach.udel.edu (Kathleen Majewski)
Subject: Linda
Organization: University of Delaware
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 15:32:44 GMT

Iam sorry to waste the band width, Linda, I lost your email account would
you please email me back, I have that information for you.

Thanks,
Kathy  email at: majewski@brahms.udel.edu

Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: reichard@nb.rockwell.com (Diane Reichard)
Subject: Re: Hoof Care Products
Organization: Rockwell International
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:06:46 GMT


In article <1dmn9vINN7up@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, pallas@cephalo.neusc.bcm.tmc.edu (Sarah Pallas) writes:
> I'd like to start a new discussion about hoof care products.  Here in
> Houston, our soil has lots of clay, which means that either the horses
> are swimming in mud or that their feet are bone dry.  I've been using
> Fiebing's Hoof Dressing, which is basically pine tar, but Monty's
> owner claims that it is damaging his feet (they do look dry and awful, but I
> don't know if it's the Fiebings). 

I wouldn't think that Fiebing's would damage his feet.  It may not be helping
enough, but shouldn't be damaging it.

					 So I'm interested in trying
> something else, but don't know which products are good and which are
> worse than nothing.  I'd also like something easy to use.  The
> Fiebing's is liquid and can be applied with an applicator, keeping my
> hands clean.  Price is another consideration.  I'd had good luck in
> the past with the Fiebing's and also "Bear Cat" which is a pine tar
> derivative applied only to the coronary band.  It completely cured the
> cracks and chipping on the hooves of a horse I leased in Boston a few
> years ago.  But it was very messy.

I've had good luck with Absorbine Hooflex.  To get around the messy part
of using it, I get a box of the latex surgical gloves (disposable) and
use a glove to apply it to the hoof.  After you're done, you can just
peel off the glove and toss it.  You can get them from a medical supply
store fairly cheaply.  It also seems that you waste less of the Hooflex
applying it this way, so it may actually save you a few cents.
> 
> 
Diane R.
From: jwg2y@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Warner Granade)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Horseless Rider Needs Directions
Date: 12 Nov 92 22:59:43 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Virginia

You ask whether you should buy land or board. There
is a third option.  We rent a house (which was once
the stallion barn) on a 400 acre farm. There are four
other houses and a 6 stall barn which comes with our
house. We have all of the farm to ride on and build
cross-country jumps (and help mow and fix fences). 
There are cows and sheep and we have from 3-6 horses count-
ing the ones there for training.  It is a full-time
committment and often requires two people.  My wife is
the horse person, and I am the pit crew (I do all of the
stall cleaning and groom for her at shows). Check with
your husband.  I'm not sure I would want this lifestyle
if I wasn't into the horses with her. We get up early,
carry water, wait for the farrier, wait for the vet.
It's great to hear the horses nicker when we go out to
feed in the morning, and we have bonded, and I get to 
see my wife which I would not do if she was boarding
somewhere.  The trade-offs are seldom vacations and
getting into the house after dark.
I wouldn't trade it for the world (except maybe when
it's raining and the */#% mare won't let me catch her).
Maybe you could come and stay at my house and let me
go on vacation while you decide if it's the style of
life for you.
--
Warner Granade *****jwg2y@virginia.edu
804-924-7409
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: woit@qucis.queensu.ca (Denise Woit)
Subject: Re: A Question...
Organization: Computing & Information Science, Queen's University at Kingston
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 20:42:22 GMT

David Kosenko writes:
>We had a mare that was a school horse that was very similar, except that
>she responded perfectly to voice commands, so when the instructor said 
>"canter," she would canter, regardless of what sort of signals the
>student gave.  

This reminded me of something similar.

I used to board my horse at an "old-school" western trainer's place.
When he wanted his horse to halt, he's say "HOE" quite loudly. 
No matter what any of us boarders were doing in the areana, cantering, 
jumping, etc., all of our horses would come to a *dead* stop.
It was always funny to watch the new boarders when this happened to
them for the first time!
							...Denise
From: juliec@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Julie Chapman)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 14:53:48 GMT
Subject: Pulls like a train!
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Rosa, CA
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian


 I keep wishing that I could get inside someone's skin (like Dr. Klimke's) so
 that I could *feel* the amounts of leg and hand that are "good". Failing that,
 it's time to take advantage of the vast collective wisdom here.

 My horse: an energetic little 15.1hh Appendix QH whom I'm showing in 1st level
 dressage (and taking jumping lessons with - his former owner evented him to
 training level). He's athletic enough to make at least 3rd level. 
 Me: 5'8", bodybuilder (so I do NOT lack for strength in any way!), runner,
 etc.

 Problem: Copper can get *quite* fresh and strong and forward, such that with
 big, swinging half halts there's still no checking his very fast, forward
 canter. If I could only TELL whether I'm using too much leg, not enough leg,
 too much hand, not enough hand...He will listen and collect nicely at the
 trot, and moves forward beautifully at the walk. But heaven forbid: if we've
 done a lot of transitions or any amount of canter, subsequent canters will
 become *extremely* strong - he charges off from the depart and is hard to
 make round and collected. When he is listening and working round, his mouth
 goos up nicely, and he CAN be very light...about half the time. I spend time
 on lateral work at the trot when he's being very forward. Generally, the
 longer I ride him, the hotter he gets.

 I've wondered if a different bit would be better: I ride him now in a fat
 eggbutt Dr. Bristol. (For jumping, this bit is *entirely* inadequate: his
 former owner used a double bridle on him for cross-country). Also: I ride him
 2-3x a week; I'd love to ride more, but have two jobs.

 Any suggestions much appreciated!

 Julie T. Chapman
   and Copper Image (aka Coppertop, the little Duracell horse)

 P.S. - Last night was a case in point: he pulled like a locomotive at the
 canter *and* the trot, was impossible to collect.