HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gvoon@locus.com (George Voon)
Subject: GCC stdio.h
Organization: Locus Computing Corporation, Los Angeles, California
Date: Fri, 04 Sep 1992 23:04:12 GMT

I'm having trouble compiling with the GNU C compiler from comp.binaries.os2.
When I included stdio.h, it gave me errors saying that sys/cdefs.h and
machine/ansi.h were missing.  When I commented those out, I got a lot of
parse errors.  What am I doing wrong?  Thanks ahead of time for any advice.
BTW, this is compiling the sample1.c from the package.

George Voon
gvoon@la.locus.com
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
From: serenang@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Serena Ng)
Subject: Re: Opening second VDM slows down processing in first one. Is that ok?
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Distribution: comp
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 12:56:19 GMT

I have two hard disks both partitioned by the FDISK that came with DOS5. If
I want to format the first hard disk as HPFS (presumably using the FDISK that
came with OS/2) would the soft pointers on the second hard disk be lost? Anyone
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
From: djs6015@ultb.isc.rit.edu (Don Smith)
Subject: Re: TE2 and <--
Originator: djs6015@ultb
Organization: R.I.T.
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 05:54:01 GMT

In article <BuHn97.8tr@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> gtaylor@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Gord Taylor) writes:
}In article <1992Aug31.094702.13681@actrix.gen.nz> Steve.Withers@bbs.actrix.gen.nz writes:
}>In article <klliou.715197673@milton> klliou@milton.u.washington.edu (Kan-Lee Liou) writes:
}>> I am using TE2 to emulate VT100 to connect to both UNIX and VMS machines 
}>> I keep getting problems in using editors (vi for UNIX or ed for VMS).
}>> The problems are parts of the text I am editing may become invisible (actually,
}>> it is happening now).  No text is lost, but I just cannot see it.

I had the exact same problem. What you need to do is to use the
new commpak2.dll instead of the one that came with TE/2 1.20.

I ftp'ed this new .DLL file from ftp-os2.nmsu.edu a while back,
while it was new. I'm sure its still there.... where I don't know.

-- 
   | Don Smith                  | Woman mirrors the universe, and within |
   |djs6015@ultb.isc.rit.edu    |her temple she contains all the ritual  |
   |DJS6015@ritvax.isc.rit.edu  |sacraments needed to unleash the vortex |
   |DJS6015@ritvax.BITNET       |ov the subconscious.  John ZeWizz       |
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
From: locicero-joe@CS.YALE.EDU (Joe LoCicero)
Subject: HELP!  No DOS, Windows, Shutdown!
Organization: Yale University Computer Science Dept., New Haven, CT 06520-2158
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 20:16:57 GMT

HEEEELLLLPPPP!

I was humming along fine, when suddenly I couldn't shut down!  After 
doing a hard reset, and everything else that is associated with all the
problems I usually have with OS/2 (booting from floppy, chkdsk c: /f:3 and
chkdsk d: /f:3), I can't shut down, and all attempts to run DOS or Windows
programs result in a TRAP 000e...

ALSO - when I try to run COMMAND.COM from an OS/2 Window, I get SYS0008,
some error about not enough memory... when I've got 8MB and a huge hard
drive.  I've even deleted SWAPPER.DAT and had OS/2 recreate it to no avail.

THanks for your help.  You can e-mail me too at 

locicero-joe@minerva.cis.yale.edu

if you come up with a solution. 

-JoLo, consternated and frustrated.

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------
-Joe LoCicero                         locicero@minerva.cis.yale.edu -
-       Why does the porridge bird lay his egg in the air?          -
-        Firesign Theatre :  We're All Bozos On This Bus            -
From: ecampbel@neumann.une.edu.au (Edward Campbell)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: internal processing error anyone?
Keywords: system error
Date: 12 Sep 92 06:32:45 GMT

Can anyone enlighten me on the following error message on booting OS/2 :

   System detected an internal processing error
   at location ##0160:fff64ae0 - 000d:aae0.
   60002, 9084
   038600d1
   Internal revision 6.307, 92/03/01
   The system is stopped...

Is it a memory or CPU error or what?

Another error message was when I installed DOS on an OS/2 FAT formatted
partition and booted DOS :
  SYS01475
  SYS02027
halting the system. DOS booted ok when I let DOS format the partition
on installing.
Is there a difference between DOS and OS/2 FAT formats?

Thanks for any info.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
From: wjb5106@rigel.tamu.edu (Walter Barnett)
Subject: Re: First column of DIR == ?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 20:18:00 GMT

In article <1992Sep7.094642.12692@nuscc.nus.sg>, swknasri@nuscc.nus.sg (Sriram N (Dr)) writes...
> 
>I did a DIR in the root of my HPFS drive and found to my surprise
>that some subdirectories have positive numbers on the first
>column to the left (this is usually 0 for both files and dirs).
>This column is just next to the filename.
> 
>What does this mean?  Incidentally, I saw a CMD file in one of
>the subdirectories that has a large (40000+) number in the first
>column (it is about 32k in size, as indicated by the second columni).
> 

These are the extended attributes for the files.  The large EA on the
*.cmd file is because the command processor stores information about
REXX scripts in the EAs for faster subsequent execution. 

_______________________________________________________________________
Walter Barnett        Aerospace Engineering        Texas A&M University
From: sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: Some suggestions for OS/2
Date: 15 Sep 92 15:35:37 GMT
Reply-To: sip1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Dept. of Econ., Univ. of Chicago

In article <20335@plains.NoDak.edu> person@plains.NoDak.edu (Brett G Person ) writes:
>I'd like an OS that wasn't so damn dependent on the install disks!
>Other products I have don't make me haul out the install disks ALL
>THE TIME to fix a problem.   Heck, even unix (copyright at&t) doesn't
>make me haul out the boot tape to fix the file system. 
>Yes, i have a full backup of my disks, and yes, I undderstand - and
>even agree with- the way drive c: can't be written to by checkdisk
>when it's the active drive...but still.
>I'd like a checkdisk that, if it found a problem, could take all
>running apps down, clean the swap file up, do a checkdisk and drop me

Check the FAQ List about enabling autochecking.  You don't need to run
CHKDSK from your install disks (or very rarely need to) if
autochecking is enabled in your OS/2 CONFIG.SYS.

-- 
Timothy F. Sipples      | The OS/2 FREQ. ASKED QUESTIONS LIST is avail. from
sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu | 128.123.35.151, anonymous ftp, in /pub/os2/all/faq.
Dept. of Econ., Univ.   | Or from LISTSERV@BLEKUL11.BITNET (send "HELP").
of Chicago, 60637       | Family Values Means a Job
From: gt7159a@prism.gatech.EDU (WATKINS,MARK ANTHONY)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Minimize Icon To viewer problem
Date: 14 Sep 92 15:54:00 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology


	I am running several programs at startup. Actually they are all part
of ibm tcp/ip package.  I have the /min option when starting the programs and I changed the
system setting to minimize to viewer, but the viewer comes up after the programs
are started.  The result is the programs are minimized to the desktop.  This is
not what i want.  If there is anyway to get around this let me know.


-- 
WATKINS,MARK ANTHONY
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
uucp:	  ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt7159a
Internet: gt7159a@prism.gatech.edu
From: pdg@crosfield.co.uk (paul goffin)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: v13i299: zip19x32.zoo  and FTP!!
Date: 10 Sep 92 07:41:11 GMT
Organization: Crosfield Electronics, Hemel Hempstead, United Kingdom.

In article <1992Sep9.204002.16961@njitgw.njit.edu> dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) writes:
>In article <2AAD239E.5017@deneva.sdd.trw.com> reimert@mamacass.etdesg.trw.com (Scott P. Reimert) writes:
>>Part 3 of Info-ZIP Zip 1.9 never made it this far. Would it be possible to 
>>get it reposted please?

>Just ftp the program from ftp-os2.nmsu.edu.  Everything posted to
>comp.binaries.os2 is sent there.  It's currently in /pub/os2/new.
>It'll be moved elsewhere RSN.  It'll also be mirrored in the
>"archives" directory tree - where all c.b.o2 submissions end up.

David, if we all had access to ftp, then none of the binaries newsgroups
would be necessary at all.  Some of us (me included) don't have access
to ftp.  Some of us (me included) don't have access to mail servers
either.

It's very annoying to get _most_ of what looks as if it could be useful,
but to then not be able to use it as it isn't complete.

Now I much appreciate the help given to all by the various contributors
to this and other newsgroups, but I really get sick of posted answers
like "Just ftp X from Y.  No problem".  If I could just ftp it,
it would have done and I wouldn't need to post requests for repostings
in the first place.  (Oh, that was a complicated thing to write; did
it make sense?)

And while I'm having a bit of a moan, I also hate the "Just
call 800-xxxxxxx for your free update" comments.  For most
of the world, updates are not free, and what's more, we can't
call (easily) the 800 numbers.

Sorry if this seems a bit negative.  I appreciate the help and
information I get here, honestly!  but please, don't assume that
we all have the same facilities as a US University.

Paul
-- 
+-------------+-------------------------------------------------------+
+ Paul Goffin +  Crosfield Electronics Ltd. U.K.  +44 442 230000x3357 +
+             +  Opinions expressed are mine! (Yours for a small fee) +
+-------------+-------------------------------------------------------+
From: schumach@duncan.utk.edu (Chris Schumacher)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Best graphics card -- advice please
Date: 6 Sep 92 03:13:00
Organization: University of Tennessee, CS dept.
Distribution: comp
NNTP-Posting-Host: duncan.cs.utk.edu


I know this gets asked often, but the answers seem to change.  Major
considerations include:

1) accelerator would be nice, but will there be drivers? (no, I can't
   afford an ultra).

2) what's the best Tseng 4000 chip?

3) 800x600x256 NOW.

4) should I wait until the 32-bit graphics engine comes out?

5) speed must be better than Trident 8900c.

6) what's the difference between VRAM and DRAM? 

7) what's HICOLOR?

8) is now the time to buy?

9) future OS/2 support is important.  I don't want to buy from a
   company that doesn't care about its OS/2 users.


In a nutshell, what should I get?  I will pay up to $300, but it has
to be worth it.  I'd prefer to pay less.  I'm sure in a year or so the
accelerators of today will be pokey(?) so should I get a serviceable
one now and wait for acceleration?

Thanks for all input,
From: lutz@solace.psych.rochester.edu (Dave Lutz)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: Questions with OS/2
Keywords: OS/2
Date: 8 Sep 92 21:38:41 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

In <Bu9x1M.5n9@news.cso.uiuc.edu> jst50986@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jack S. Tan) writes:


>- I have been having trouble closing DOS and OS/2 windows on the Desktop.  I
>  type 'exit' at the prompt, and the title bar changes to "Closing:  DOS [OS/2]
>  Window," but then does not close.  Double-clicking on the title-bar icon
>  produces the appropriate waring (losing my data in the active session, etc.),

  I haven't seen this, but have a possible explanation.  Did you by any chance
add /P to the command.com options for your DOS window?  The /P option on
command.com makes the session permanent (ie you can type exit all you want and
it won't really go away), which may make it impossible to close the window
normally.

  This would only explain the problem if CMD.EXE has a similar option, and you
used that as well.  I don't have an OS/2 system in front of me, so I can't
check right now.

Dave Lutz
lutz@psych.rochester.edu
From: gouvea@zariski.harvard.edu (Fernando Gouvea)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: Problems with Norton Desktop.
Date: 7 Sep 92 01:09:31 GMT
Organization: Colby College Dept. of Math/CS

In article <1992Sep6.220335.12171@gn.ecn.purdue.edu> ashwath@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Ashwath Ram) writes:
>
>Yesterday i installed Norton Desktop for Windows 2.0 using the
>WIN-OS2 full screen mode. I don't have NDW running as the primary
>shell and all I want to do is run desktop in the full screen
>WIN-OS2 mode. But everytime I try to load it up it keeps crashing
>and throwing me out of WIN-OS2 mode. Has anyone else tried this,


My experience (also on a Gateway, but 386/33) is almost identical to yours:
NDW starts loading, and then crashes, usually just at the point when it
should access the disks to create the drive objects. The programs that come
with it, for the most part, do the same: they work until you try to open or
save a file (disk access again!), then boom! The exact error seems to
depend on things like the video driver, but this is the general pattern.

I sent e-mail to the ibm bugs program about this; I suggest you do the
same. They e-mailed back and forth a few times, then seemed to subside,
without really suggesting a solution.

By the way, the Norton Utilities for DOS, though they run, also exhibit
some problems with disk access on my machine. SI, for example, takes a
loooooong time to find out how many disks are installed... and can't figure
out what the A: and B: drives are.

My guess: the Norton programs do something like direct disk access, which
is bound to go wrong in OS/2.

					Fernando

-- 
============================================================================
Fernando Q. Gouvea				fqgouvea@colby.edu
Dept. of Math/CS				(207)-872-3278
Colby College					Mudd 407
From: gonzaled@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (L W Gonzalez-del-Valle)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: Why I love OS/2. (Kids, try this at home!)
Date: 12 Sep 92 00:59:41 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder

Well, my story isn't as great as some of the others...
One thing I really enjoy about OS/2 is the incredible DOS window support.
My friend and I both run OS/2; he got it first for his 486/33 and was able
to open about 4 DOS windows (at least) and not lose performance.  A big 
shocker for me was that I could do the same on my 386SX.
Anyhow, the fun part was: we wrote a program that filled the DOS interrupt
vector table with zeroes...a simple DEBUG script.
Of course, in ordinary DOS, this causes either a) system reboot or b) lockup.
In Windows 3.0, this causes a lockup.
In Windows 3.1's DOS box, the window was closed and Windows opened a dialog
box saying something like "System integrity has been violated by this app.;
quit Windows and restart your system."
Windows then proceeded to hang the system upon exit...

But, OS/2 ran the application and popped up a dialog box to say something
to the effect of "This application has been bad, so it said bye-bye."

At that point, my friend and I both new what OS/2 Crash Protection meant.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: The CSD will be free!
From: Spartacus At Cuny <I18BC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Monday, 14 Sep 1992 18:31:32 EDT
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

In article <1992Sep10.211223.13714@utdallas.edu>, goyal@utdallas.edu (Mohit K.
Goyal) says:
>
>To those of you who don't know, IBM has repeatedly stated that the upcoming
>bug fixes and enhancements will be free.

   Why surprised?  IBM believes customers shouldn't have to pay
for bug releases, Microsoft does.  I purchased a 32bit Operating
System...I expect it to be 32bit.  The 32-bit GRE is something
owed to us.  I'm grateful to IBM for any additional in-house utilities
and bitmaps IBM includes...but everything else is owed to us.
BTW-I don't mind paying for a S&H and Media charge for the CSD
floppies...but I do mind paying for the upgrade recorded on them.

What I wrote above is my own opinion, someone else doesn't agree
well...its a democracy we live in and thats how I feel.

-------
------------------------------+      All The Best,
Reply To:                     |
                              |      Edward Galarza,
     I18BC@CunyVM.Cuny.Edu    |      Brooklyn College Of The
     I18BC@CunyVM.BitNet      |      City University Of New York
------------------------------+      "Que viva el OS/2!"
New accounts above 8-)
From: xtifr@netcom.com (Chris Waters)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: Read only files, HPFS, wrong, wrong, wrong
Date: 11 Sep 92 18:10:34 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In <1992Sep10.235042.13115@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> parry@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (Tom J Parry) writes:

>Chris Waters (xtifr@netcom.com) wrote:

[ discussion of a major compiler bug (incorrectly blamed on RCS) elided ]

>> >So, can anybody think of a solution to the RCS problem?
>> 
>> Yes.  Replace your compiler with one that isn't brain-dead.

>Does GCC count? :-)

The emx version of GCC has no problems compiling R/O files on my system.
I can't say whether the GCC/2 version has this bug or not, because I
haven't used it.
-- 
Chris Waters    | the insane don't | NOBODY for President!
xtifr@netcom.COM| need disclaimers | Because Nobody's perfect!!
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
From: parry@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (Tom J Parry)
Subject: Re: Read only files, HPFS, wrong, wrong, wrong
Originator: parry@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au
Organization: Monash University, Melb., Australia.
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 23:50:42 GMT

Chris Waters (xtifr@netcom.com) wrote:
> In <1992Sep10.050559.5642@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> parry@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (Tom J Parry) writes:
> 
> >have not checked out of the RCS.  Under UNIX it works great, but under the
> >DOS style (and hence HPFS), you check out a file, but then can not compile
> >it because it is read only. This is especially painful when using GNUMAKE
> >(but I'll save that sob story for my next post...)
> 
> Sounds like a bug in your compiler.  What (godforsaken) compiler are you
> using?  I'm using RCS, under DOS & UNIX & now OS/2, and haven't had any
> problems on any of these platforms...
> 
> A compiler shouldn't need to do more than read the file--so the fact
> that the files are read-only shouldn't (and doesn't, with any compiler
> I've seen) matter.
> 
> >So, can anybody think of a solution to the RCS problem?
> 
> Yes.  Replace your compiler with one that isn't brain-dead.

Does GCC count? :-)

-- 
Tom J Parry.
Your reality is a figment of my imagination.
From: mstaben@comtch.spk.wa.us (Matthew Staben)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: 30 min per disk to load os2
Keywords: slow boot
Date: 5 Sep 92 03:57:30 GMT
Organization: Waffle BBS at CompuTech Spokane, Washington

stevesm@scotty.hco.tek.com (Steve Smith) writes:

> Hi netters,
> 
> Well its my turn this time.  My brother recently bought OS/2 and tried
> loading it on his '486 machine.  He was able to load OS2 and get it
> running, however, as he was loading it, he noticed that the average
> time it took to unload the software from the 3 1/2" disks was 30 min.
> It literally took all night just to load the OS!
> 
> 
> Also, now when he tries to boot OS/2, it takes about 10 minutes!
> 
> The hardware consists of a 33Mhz, '486 clone with AMI bios, 8 megs ram
> and a 28 msec 71 MB MFM hard disk. ( I know the HD is way too small
> but he wanted to buy OS/2 while the price was right, he plans to
> upgrade the HD in the future.)  
> 
> My question is what could be causing this slow down? Could the hard
> disk be the reason for the incredible slowness of the system?
> 
> BTW, I've got a clone 33Mhz, '386, AMI bios with (only) 4Megs, 16msec
> 120MB IDE hard disk and only takes about 1 1/2 minutes per disk to
> load and 1:40 to boot to os2.
> 
> =============================================================================
> Steve Smith				     T&M Engineering CAD and Computers
> Mail: Tektronix, Inc. PO Box 500, M/S 13-880 Beaverton OR  97077 (503)627-403
> E-mail: stevesm@scotty.hco.tek.com
> =============================================================================
>  "It's a dog eat dog world out there, and I'm wearing Milk Bone underwear."
> 						 	-Norm on Cheers-
> =============================================================================

 
Before you go any further, call up the IBM NSC bbs and obtain the driver
fix for MFM/RLL drives.  Follow the instructions which are included and
your life will become much easier.  
 
I too had this problem, and no, OS/2 isn't that slow :-)
 

mstaben@comtch.spk.wa.us
 
- A warning to anyone, still in command...
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
From: sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples)
Subject: Re: DeskJet Gone Mad
Reply-To: sip1@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Dept. of Econ., Univ. of Chicago
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 00:02:26 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.165847.11883@abo.fi> CBURMAN@finabo.abo.fi () writes:
>we had a nasty brownout on our floor yesterday, and it killed my OS/2 
>_dead_. I tried everything but couldn't get it up again. So I've spent the 
>day re-installing the little sweetness (with all patches and fixes, nicely 
>configured program objects, etc. it's taken all day).
>Things are all right again EXCEPT that my DeskJet 500 doesn't work 'as 
>advertised'. It prints the first page, and then starts to feed out empty 
>sheets as many as I put in the tray. Only way to stop it, is to reset the 
>printer.
>I had this problem (or something very similar) when I installed OS/2 the 
>first time. The solution was then to tick the "printer specific" 
>box in the printer's driver settings. (Somebody could explain this 'printer 
>specific' stuff to me. I'm too stupid for this.) But now it doesn't matter 
>what I do, I only get the first page & a lot of blanks.

Have you tried using the patched DeskJet driver in the epson.zoo file,
available via anonymous ftp from ftp-os2.nmsu.edu?

-- 
Timothy F. Sipples      | The OS/2 FREQ. ASKED QUESTIONS LIST is avail. from
sip1@ellis.uchicago.edu | 128.123.35.151, anonymous ftp, in /pub/os2/all/faq.
Dept. of Econ., Univ.   | Or from LISTSERV@BLEKUL11.BITNET (send "HELP").
of Chicago, 60637       | Family Values Means a Job
From: gregory@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Greg Wright)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: MathCAD 3.1 under Win-OS2
Date: 9 Sep 92 21:27:34 GMT
Organization: Boeing

>  There seem to be conflicting reports on MathCAD 3.1 under Win/OS2. Myself,
>I can run it only once. If I exit it and try to load it again it issues the
>famous "Not enough mem. Try closing some Windows apps....." The only way to
[lots deleted]
>Good luck,

  I just got off the phone with a tech at Math Soft. The official position
of Math Soft is that the problem is with OS2 and not MathCad.  The only 
"fix" they recommend is restarting OS2. :-(
  I figure we will just have to wait for 3.1 support from IBM.

-- 
 ________Greg Wright____________     "I struggle to be brief     
| gregory@bcstec.ca.boeing.com  |     and become obscure."         
|     gregory@halcyon.com       |                             
|____uunet!bcstec!gregory_______|               NOT A BOEING SPOKESPERSON.
From: dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
Subject: Re: Joel's new ATI VGA Wonder drivers (1.01)
Date: 8 Sep 92 15:09:42 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <3241@isgtec.isgtec.com> ted@isgtec.com (Ted Richards) writes:
>
>I still get the "twinkle" effect in full-screen OS/2 sessions.  Nothing
>seems to prevent that.  I presume this is a bug in the OS/2 screen
>switching code.

Odd.  I don't have any twinkling at all.  The 1.01 drivers are
perfect.  They do everything with no problems.  And BitBlt operations
seem a bit faster as well.

I have an ATI VGA-1024 (512K on board) using the 800x600x256 driver.

-- 
   |)  David Charlap           "TELEPHONE, n.  An Invention of the devil which
  /|_  dic5340@hertz.njit.edu   abrogates some of the advantages of making a
 ((|,)                          disagreeable person keep his distance."
  ~|~                              --- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc