From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: BARBIE DOES IT AGAIN!!!!
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 92 17:59:54 GMT

In article <3717@master.CNA.TEK.COM> judyd@rosebud.CNA.TEK.COM (Judy E. Drake) writes:
>In excellent article <LOWRY.92Oct4152902@rotor.watson.ibm.com> 
>lowry@watson.ibm.com (Andy Lowry) writes:
>
>>The problem I have with what the doll says is not that it's
>>unrealistic or unreasonable, but that it reinforces some existing
>>stereotypes that are damaging to women (and to society in general).
>
>Andy brings up some excellent points, and I'd like to add an 
>observation of my own.  In school, I was a girl who was good at
>math, and I didn't find it hard.  However, being good at math was 
>not perceived as a very "feminine" trait by most of my peers, and I 
>got into the habit of hiding and downplaying my math skills in order 
>to conform to a more "desirable" feminine model.  I'm sure lots of 
>women in this forum remember doing this as well.  The fact that 
>Barbie, a supposedly attractive character, says she finds math 
>hard reinforces for those girls who _are_ good in math that they'd 
>better pretend they're not if they want to be popular or liked,
>or even normal.
>
>Judy Drake

  These stereotypes really do affect people.  In my case I had
  two stereotypes being applied to me and they sort of canceled
  out.  I was good in math and science, as well as English, and social
  studies, etc.  Since I am female, a lot of people would just as
  well apply the "feminine" stereotype of being bad in Math
  and good in English.  However I am also Asian American and
  the stereotype for Asian Americans is to be bad in English
  and good in math.  Even though English is my native language
  and I speak without an accent, my teachers still gave me lower
  grades in Speech with the remark on my report card, speaks
  with a Chinese accent.  Of course they played up my math
  and science skills by asking me to be class leaders on science
  projects and teach "new math" to the rest of the class.

  All through high school and college, I did well in both sciences
  and the humanities.  In fact, I feel that I excelled more in
  humanities since I was more interested in it than math and science.
  I got three 5's on AP tests in English, Am History and Euro History.
  And in college I took upper level sociology classes as a freshman.
  I was also in the College Scholars program and did independent research
  in writing children's books, with regard to race and sex stereotyping.
  HOWEVER, because of my ethnicity, teachers and profesors continued
  to recommend Mathematics as a major, just because I did well in
  it.  I spent the least effort in my math classes and did not show
  very much enthusiasm (sleeping through most of the lectures), yet
  when it came time to apply for grad school I was unequivocably
  recommended to pursue a career in math.  I scored 780 out of 800
  on the verbal GRE and only 760 out of 800 on the math section,
  but still my professors insisted that I'd be a good mathematician.
  I did get into UCLA Law school solely on the basis of my LSAT scores
  where I scored in the 93%, but with NO recommendation letters because
  I dared not ask any of my professors.  UCLA was the only Law school
  that will take applicants without recommendation letters, using
  just a GPA and LSAT score.  But when I got in, no one in my family
  nor any of my professors encouraged me to go.  They said that I
  "wasn't the type", that I "was too kind to be a lawyer", that
  I "am more of an introspective personality" (Hah!), and finally
  that "no one would take me seriously because I didn't have a forceful
  personality, like Jack Kay (a white male)".  Okay, so my dad and
  mom insist that I get a PhD in Mathematics, and UCLA did not inform
  me that I had a scholarship until Fall (when I was already registered
  in the PhD program at UCSanDiego).  Finally I gave into the stereotyping
  and decided to just become another one of those Asian American
  scientists and engineers.  It was so EASY to slip into the role that
  people have already assigned for you.  Once I accepted the role,
  everything went smoothly.  I eventually got my PhD from Cornell
  (still asleep in the classes), and am now working at a technical
  job doing things like distributed computing, network management,
  and (formerly) neural networks.  Of course I will never get into
  the managerial ranks, given the stereotyping and the glass-ceiling.
  In retrospect, I don't think I'd much enjoy being a lawyer either.
  All the nit-picking and case studies, yuk!  But at the least I
  feel that my life would be different if I stood up to my parents
  and professors and picked the major I wanted, which was Diplomacy
  and World Affairs.

  But I want to point out that stereotyping does indeed affect what
  fields people will pursue, and/or be successful in.  It is easier
  to conform to peer, parental, and teacher's authority than to
  break with it.  After all, if the teachers right you better recommendation
  letters based on their view of you, then you're more likely to be
  successful in the field that they picked for you.

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