HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: azzouz@lptl.jussieu.fr (Hicham AZZOUZ)
Newsgroups: rec.music.country.western
Subject: bluegrass music
Date: 5 Nov 92 12:51:04 GMT
Organization: L.P.T.L, Universite P. & M. Curie, Paris, FRANCE

REDELSS JOHN wrote the following message
>What is the bluegrass mailing list?  What sources are available on the Internet
>for a bluegrass enthusiast?  Please e-mail me if you have any information
>about this. 

I am also interested in having the same informations.
Newsgroups: rec.music.country.western
From: aan3q@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Arlyn Newcomb)
Subject: How do you get your info??
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 21:07:57 GMT

Speaking strictly as a novice concert-goer, etc., I was
wondering how you all find out where and when your favorite
Country Music artists are going to be performing in your area.
Do you hear about it on the radio?  Is there a magazine or
newsletter that lists this information?  In short, is there an
organized and exhaustive reference available on this subject??

:))

--
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
+ aan3q@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU | God may be subtle, but He isn't  +
+   I speak only for myself. | plain mean.   --Albert Einstein  +
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
From: jesus.questor.wimsey.bc.ca!scottc (Scott Chapman)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: lute construction
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 06:11:13 GMT
Reply-To: scottc@jesus.questor.wimsey.bc.ca
Organization: The Questor Project

	I am interested in constructing a seven-course lute from scratch.  
I would appreciate any information/recommendations regarding a mail-order  
wood supplier.(curly maple, yew and German spruce in particular).Any other  
tips will be warmly received.

		dumky@jesus.questor.wimsey.bc.ca
From: britten@utklib.lib.utk.edu (Bill Britten)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Broadside Band
Date: 10 Nov 92 18:40:19 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee Library

Can anyone comment on the Broadside Band's 1991 disc "English Country 
Dances" ... on the SAYDISC label?
From: jml2q@UVA.PCMAIL.VIRGINIA.EDU (Julie Lehrman)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Cantigas
Date: 6 Nov 92 10:34:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: uva.9211062034.AA13809
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
X-Mailer: UVa PCMail 1.7.1

I'm looking for sources about the Cantigas of Santa Maria.  I already have
several recordings, including the excellent one by Ensemble Alcatraz, and I
would like to know more about the music for the poems. Has a facimile been
published of all or part of the manuscript?  How were the melodies written,
and where would I learn to read the notation?  What is known about
instrumetation? What is the best compliation of the words, and translations?
Lastly, is there a guide to gallego-portugese pronunciation that I can
reference?
 
I would prefer sources in English, but I do read modern Spanish. I have
acsess to inter-library loan, so that should help.  Are there journals that
publish articles about the Cantigas that I should be following?
 
I look forward to getting a place to start my research into this wonderful
body of music.
 
Julie Lehrman,  P.O Box 4699   Charlottesville, VA 22905, USA
jml2q@Virginia.edu
From: alves@calvin.usc.edu (William Alves)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Re: vibrato in a cappella renaissance music
Date: 7 Nov 1992 14:05:02 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: calvin.usc.edu

In article <1992Nov6.230605.22787@midway.uchicago.edu> hcresnic@midway.uchicago.edu writes:

>	As a singer, I have found it difficult to sing vibrato-less without
>constricting one's vocal cords to the point where it's destructive. Especially
>if you have been taught to sing with vibrato, as most young American singers 
>have, putting in the requisite amount of breath will almost invariably produce
>a vibrato (am I right, voice teachers?). 

I don't think I would ask voice teachers, because they, too, have been trained
that way. Though singers have insisted to me on more than one occasion that
singing without vibrato is "unnatural" and "destructive," I've never gotten
a clear answer on exactly what physical properties make it so. In fact, there
are plenty of cultures where vibrato-less singing is the norm. An early
music performer friend of mine pointed out that early music singers tend
to have as long, if not much longer, careers than, say, opera singers.
I agree that the Western tradition of voice pedagogy is the culprit, but
the singers you list are good counterexamples to show those teachers that
restricted or eliminated vibrato doesn't necessarily result in a constrictive,
non-projecting sound that is harmful to the vocal cords.
From: RGOL@SLUMUS.BITNET (Rita Goldberg)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Cantigas
Date: 8 Nov 92 07:22:38 GMT
Article-I.D.: SLUMUS.08NOV92.13367558.0009.MUSIC
In-reply-to: In reply to your message of FRI 06 NOV 1992 15:34:29 EST
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

One of the most knowledgeable people about the Cantigas-- especially
as literature-- is Joe Snow of the Spanish Department at the
University of Georgia.  I don't know if he uses E-mail, but you can
easily find him at Georgia with a letter or phone call.
 
 
Rita Goldberg,
St. Lawrence University
From: ST402808@BROWNVM.BITNET (Kim Plofker)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: vibrato in singing early music
Date: 8 Nov 92 10:28:56 GMT
Article-I.D.: AEARN.EARLYM-L%92110822055273
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT


   I think there's been some disagreement in this discussion as to what
vibrato actually is, and whether it should be there and what to do about it
etc.  Vibrato is nothing but tiny (or not-so-tiny) fluctuations in pitch
caused by changes in the vibration of the vocal cords.  Different people
naturally have different amounts of vibrato in their voices; a physics
professor I know habitually does an amusing illustration of frequency
fluctuations in waves using an oscilloscope and recordings of Joan Baez and
Barbara Streisand, an excellent example of the variation possible in amounts
of natural vibrato.  Boy singers tend to have less vibrato than the average
adult female, simply because their vocal cords are smaller and thinner and
don't wobble so noticeably.
 
   As for what to do about it:  A common practice among untrained or
badly-trained singers is to try to eliminate unwanted vibrato by clamping
down with the throat muscles to reduce the wobble of the cords; and yes,
everybody's voice teacher is quite right in saying that THIS IS VERY VERY BAD
FOR YOU!  It really does produce vocal strain and a cramped sound and poor
projection and all those other nasty things. Don't do it!
 
   So does that mean that Renaissance singers either had naturally
straight-tone voices in statistically amazing proportions or went around
sounding pinched and ruining their voices?  Well, of course not (although it
may be true that people with heavy natural vibrato didn't make it very far
as singers in that era).  Diminishing unwanted vibrato, up to the point that
the structure of your cords permits, requires (i) a good deal of time and
effort, (ii) good breath control (poor breath support makes it very hard to
keep a pitch true), and (iii) ear training.  The correspondent who pointed
out that early singers owed a lot to their interest in precise tuning was
right on target.  As a rule, when the mechanism is working right, your cords
produce the sound your mind's ear is hearing; so the sharper your ear, the
more focused your voice will be.  Similarly, if you want to add vibrato to a
voice that's too "straight" (sure, how many of us have THAT problem?), think
trills and quavers and practice hearing that almost imperceptible change in
pitch until you can get the proper wiggle in your sound. (Also make sure
you're not getting a straight tone by constricting your cords.)  Personally,
I think the prettiest sound for almost any voice is one that uses the natural
amount of vibrato; why not focus on the style and repertoire that best suits
your own tone?
 
   Well, just my two cents,
 
   Kim Plofker
Xref: sparky rec.music.early:1480 rec.music.classical:15594 ne.general:3043
From: IMAGING.CLUB@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("Imaging Club")
Newsgroups: rec.music.early,rec.music.classical,ne.general
Subject: Mass. Longy Historical Performance Series presents
Date: 6 Nov 92 17:49:26 GMT
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs


                     Concertos and arias of
           J.S.Bach, Antonio Vivaldi, and G.P. Telemann,
            including Bach's Fifth Brandenburg Concerto

                 Frances Conover Fitch, harpsichord
                       Carol Epple, traverso
                    Dana Maiben, Baroque violin
                      Laurie Monahan, soprano
                              with
     Sonja Lindblad, recorder        Judith Bedford, bassoon
        Joan Esch, cello               Jane Hershey, gamba
                       and guest artists

                Monday, November 16th at 8:00 pm
                  Edward Pickman Concert Hall
                  27 Garden Street, Cambridge
                         Admission $5

    Free parking is available for Longy's weekday concertgoers
    at the Everett Street Garage on the corner of Massachusetts
        Avenue and Everett Street, close to Harvard Square.
From: TUK@IAEA1.BITNET (Peter Tuff)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: vibrato in a cappella renaissance music
Date: 6 Nov 92 10:27:00 GMT
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Hi!
 
>                          And on a more practical note, does anyone have
> suggestions on how to help amateur singers today improve the quality of
> vocal production for early music?
 
From one singer to another:  Find a singer of early music you admire/
trust and inquire of him/her about a teacher or coach you could consult.
 
 
Peter Tuff
IAEA, Vienna
From: al@JUPITER.NMT.EDU (Al Stavely)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: Woodwind hole placement
Date: 5 Nov 92 16:15:46 GMT
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Thanks!  Yes, I saw this.  It was posted to rec.music.folk, and I
posted a further followup.
 
Cheers...
 
        - Al
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Announcement
From: PHARRIS@UMKCVAX1.BITNET
Date: 04 Nov 1992 21:11:45 -0600
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> *************ANNOUNCEMENT*****************************************************
   **
>
> RMUSIC-L is on the air...Join us for exciting and intelligent discussions on
> the music industry...Concert and Album Reviews...Trivia...
> Lyrics and Artists from 1935 to the present ( Later if the discussion
> warrants it)... All types of Music for all types of People. It is ouRMUSIC-L.
>
> To join us, send this command: SUB RMUSIC-L Your Name
>         to: LISTSERV@GITVM1
>
> Hope to hear from you soon!
>
>                            Paul Harris
> ******************************************************************************
   **
>
>
>
                        Dig
                    If you will                    Paul Harris
                a picture of you                     PHARRIS@UMKCVAX1
              and I engaged in a kiss.                 PHARRIS@VAX1.UMKC.EDU
           Sweat of your body covers me.
        Can you my darling, can you picture
           this? Why do we scream at each
              other? this is what it
                   sounds like
                    when doves
                        cry.
 
                                 -Prince-
From: MAINT2@ERS.BITNET (Ken Koester)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: vibrato in singing early music
Date: 10 Nov 92 19:22:40 GMT
In-reply-to: Message of Mon, 9 Nov 1992 20:09:38 GMT from <hcresnic@QUADS.UCHICAGO.EDU>
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

What confuses me in this discussion is that recorder players are taught to
produce vibrato with the diaphragm alone--using the cords is a no-no.  And
singers are then held up to us to emulate!  Apparently, this is all wrong.
 
My question then becomes, why do singers produce vibrato with the cords
instead of with the diaphragm?
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
From: hcresnic@quads.uchicago.edu (hugh carney resnick)
Subject: Re: vibrato in singing early music
Reply-To: hcresnic@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 20:09:38 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.153519.19444@axion.bt.co.uk> efosbroo@zaphod.axion.bt.co.uk writes:
>From article <1dkdapINN6u5@calvin.usc.edu>, by alves@calvin.usc.edu (William Alves):
>>
>> Part of my posting was questioning the "naturalness" of vibrato in the first
>> place.
>	...
>> But what IS one's "natural amount" of vibrato? I think one's vibrato is
>> the result of one's culture, listening from childhood, and training. (At
>> least, I haven't yet seen any evidence to contradict this.) If we took
>> all 18-year-old singers from around the United States and Europe virtually
>> all would have a sizable vibrato, not because it's natural, but because
>> that's what they've learned - consciously or unconsciously.
>> 
>> Bill
>
>I find this all a bit puzzling. I'm not the only singer I know who has 
>had to try to develop a little vibrato for when it's necessary (one of 
>my friends has given up on the grounds that the only way she could do 
>it was by shaking). Consequently, I've always assumed that vibrato was 
>learned rather than natural. I've heard several boy trebles who have 
>vibrato, but it's not common, and it's usually the very-trained.
>
>It does seem, though, that even young American singers have quite a 
>wobble - but then, over here we only hear the ones who are in fashion, 
>and it could have been the fashion rather than the voices. Judging by 
>this newsthread, either the fashion is more prevalent than I realised, 
>or it is basic to `American style' - and there can't be only one style 
>of solo singing in the US, can there?
>
>Elisabeth

_____
I think the difference may come (IMHO) from the different way that 
Europeans and Americans are first taught to sing. I may be wrong, but 
most Americans seem to learn to be solo singers, while Europeans (and
I include the English in this group too, Elisabeth :^>) get their
first experience in a choir:ergo, group singing, ergo blend, ergo less
vibrato. It _is_ learned to a large extent.

Yes, I know that this post is open to ultimate flaming, but what's wrong
with an incorrect opinion to keep discussion alive?

hugh
-- 
___________________________________________________
Hugh C. Resnick (hcresnic@midway.uchicago.edu)
"Who is the super EQ team?" -- Voice Farm
___________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
From: bogusz@fuw.edu.pl (Wojtek Bogusz)
Subject: lute (do it your self)
Organization: Warsaw University Physics Dept.
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 16:02:35 GMT


 I am dreaming about lute from year or so. And all of this discussion
about harpsichord and organ in kit inspired me to think "Could I be able
to build a lute my self ?".
 Here in Poland you may buy quite good (I think, well do not know much
about lute yet) lute for about 1000-1200 $ and I do not know can I effort
this.
 Are there any lute amateur "builders" there ? What about kit for this ?
Does it exist at all ? Does it makes any sense to think about building this
beautiful instrument by my self with out deep knowledge and tools ?

 Hope to hear some thing...

 Wojtek Bogusz

 e-mail: bogusz@fuw.edu.pl
         bebe@plearn.bitnet
From: knotts@hpl-opus.hpl.hp.com (Tom Knotts)
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 20:08:56 GMT
Subject: Re: Bach's 2nd keyboard partita, keyboard fingering
Organization: HP Labs, High Speed Electronics Dept., Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.music.early


> 
> I was just wondering, how is it possible to fluently and easily
> finger the fifth bar after the repeat in the Capriccio of
> Bach's keyboard partita number 2 C minor. (clavieruebung part I)
> 
> The whole piece seems to be oriented on switching the middle voice
> between the two hands and is quite fascinating when you start
> counting the times you have to switch it... 
> 
> Also, if you remove the left hand part in the beginning, it's a 
> fugue.. each voice enters just like in a fugue.
> 
> I find this piece really fascinating.
> 

This is one of my favorite harpsichord pieces. Before I injured my
hand, I played it at least twice a day. It is quite an amazing piece,
but not surprising given the greatness of the composer.

Measure 5 after the repeat (measure 53) is the toughest of the entire
partita, I think. Measure 80 is also a challenge.

I choose to play the bass part entirely with 5. My left-hand fingering is:


tenor  1  321212
bass   5    5 5 

The first 5^5 transistion is perfectly OK, as I choose to articulate the
first 8th note anyway. I prefer to slur the second 8th note with the
first, but since 5^5 seems to be the only option -- at least for me -- I
simply play them as connected as I can. This is fairly easy to do with
the light touch of the harpsichord, and such an execution is common to
harpsichord technique. However, if you can manage 5  5 4, then by all
means do it. But take advantage of the natural break in the phrasing to
allow the first 5 5.

Tom


From: knotts@hpl-opus.hpl.hp.com (Tom Knotts)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 21:45:51 GMT
Subject: Re: Harpsichords as Do-it-yourself
Organization: HP Labs, High Speed Electronics Dept., Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.music.early

> 
> Yes, but the other problem is, that I live in Finland.. where could
> I get one?
> 

Try contacting the Zuckermann Harpsichord shop in Paris. Perhaps
they can help. They used to sell kits.

Tom
From: alves@calvin.usc.edu (William Alves)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Re: vibrato in singing early music
Date: 8 Nov 1992 17:02:17 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: calvin.usc.edu

In article <EARLYM-L%92110822055273@AEARN.EDVZ.UNIVIE.AC.AT> Kim Plofker <ST402808@BROWNVM.BITNET> writes:
>   I think there's been some disagreement in this discussion as to what
>vibrato actually is, and whether it should be there and what to do about it
>...Different people
>naturally have different amounts of vibrato in their voices;...

Part of my posting was questioning the "naturalness" of vibrato in the first
place. I have seen no evidence that Western-style vibrato is "natural" and
not learned. The fact that Barbra Streisand and Joan Baez have different
amounts of vibrato is obvious, but were their styles inborn or learned? I
suspect the latter - Baez emulating a folk tradition and Streisand a thea-
trical one.

>   As for what to do about it:  A common practice among untrained or
>badly-trained singers is to try to eliminate unwanted vibrato by clamping
>down with the throat muscles to reduce the wobble of the cords; and yes,
>everybody's voice teacher is quite right in saying that THIS IS VERY VERY BAD
>FOR YOU!...
>   So does that mean that Renaissance singers either had naturally
>straight-tone voices in statistically amazing proportions or went around
>sounding pinched and ruining their voices?  Well, of course not (although it
>may be true that people with heavy natural vibrato didn't make it very far
>as singers in that era).  Diminishing unwanted vibrato, up to the point that
>the structure of your cords permits, requires (i) a good deal of time and
>effort, (ii) good breath control (poor breath support makes it very hard to
>keep a pitch true), and (iii) ear training.

Well, how DID they do it, if not by "clamping down?" I suspect that they
didn't learn to have vibrato in their voices in the first place, not
because of a great amount of training. Why is it that untrained singers
in many other cultures have little or no vibrato, seemingly with no effort?

>I think the prettiest sound for almost any voice is one that uses the natural
>amount of vibrato; why not focus on the style and repertoire that best suits
>your own tone?

But what IS one's "natural amount" of vibrato? I think one's vibrato is
the result of one's culture, listening from childhood, and training. (At
least, I haven't yet seen any evidence to contradict this.) If we took
all 18-year-old singers from around the United States and Europe virtually
all would have a sizable vibrato, not because it's natural, but because
that's what they've learned - consciously or unconsciously.

What's needed is less voice teachers who think that Wagner or romantic
lieder are the standard by which all voices should be measured, and more
voice teachers who concentrate just as much on intonation, rhythmic 
precision, and proper performance practice as they do on tone quality
and histrionics.

(Dream on, eh? :-)

Bill
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
From: acid+@cs.cmu.edu (Christopher Colby)
Subject: Re: vibrato in a cappella renaissance music
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 21:36:44 GMT

In article <EARLYM-L%92110516262327@AEARN.EDVZ.UNIVIE.AC.AT> tom terry <TERRY@UCONNVM.BITNET> writes:
>I have been singing Renaissance music for many years. An issue that comes
>up occasionally is the use (or avoidance) of vibrato, especially in the
>higher voices. Singers like Emma Kirkby and the Tallis scholars produce
>what I would call a very pure tone, well-supported but with little trace of
>vibrato, and I have the impression that this type of sound is widely regarded
>as the ideal for music of this period. Why? Is it because boys were used

In a _Fanfare_ interview, Peter Phillips said that his group (the Tallis
Scholars) don't use vibrato so as not to obscure or muddy the counterpoint.
So it seems to be a decision of taste, not of authenticity, at least in
Peter Phillips's case.  Of course, one can understand why such a decision
of taste would be made for Renaissance music, in which lines counterpoint
are of paramount importance, much more often than for later music.

I did notice that at least one of the tracks on the Tallis Scholars'
_Christmas Carols and Motets_ album is sung with vibrato.  I'm not sure
why.  Anybody know?

-chris
From: ccsdgdc@sunlab1.bath.ac.uk (Douglas Clark)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: William Byrd/Tallis Scholars
Date: 5 Nov 92 14:21:21 GMT
Organization: Bath University Computing Services, UK


Just to say that I have recently purchased the Tallis Scholars' CDs
'The Great Service' and 'The Three Masses' and the music is quite
fabulous. I think 'The Three Masses' is the better music of the two.
I have heard the Tallis Scolars live a couple of times at
the Bath Festival and am pleased that Peter Phillips
has been able to capture their sound on CD.
From: JMBLOCK@MOSLER.HAM.MUOHIO.EDU (Jennifer Block)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: Harpsichord Wood
Date: 12 Nov 92 16:28:12 GMT
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Priority: normal
X-mailer:     Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).

I'm looking for a source of harpsichord-grade wood in the Detroit,
Michigan vicinity.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
Jennifer Block
From: RCPSBRL@HDETUD2.TUDELFT.NL (Hans van der Laan)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: Harpsichords as Do-it-yourself
Date: 9 Nov 92 10:29:00 GMT
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> As usual in netgroup discussions, there has been a lack of good
> information on this topic, so here are some sources:
>
> BOOKS:
>
 
"The Harpsichord Owner's Guide - A Manual for Buyers and
Owners" by Edward L. Kottick; The University of North
Carlonina Press, Chapel Hill and London (1987);
ISBN 0-8078-1754-7.
It gives a very good overview of maintenance and repair
of harpsichords, with beautyfull drawings.
 
Hans van der Laan  (VanderLaan@RC.TUDelft.NL)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early