Return-Path: crispen <@ada3.ca.boeing.com:crispen@efftoo>
X-Envelope-To: ALLMUSIC@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 09:33:25 CST
From:         crispen <crispen@EFFTOO.BOEING.COM>
Subject:      Ave atque vale (till 1993)

Dave <USTS060@RUST1.DPO.UAB.EDU> asks:

>The heart of this debate (as paraphrased by me) is:  Why
>is it that some symbols and images are sacred and others not and who
>determines whose are sacred?

and Marco sez:

>        The question is interesting -- not necessarily per se, but mainly
>because often art in general (and rock music in particular) are pointed at
>for having a sort of negative attitude towards most "sacred" things and
>symbols.

Of course!  We musicians/artists/writers are what?  Manipulators of
symbols!  Is it any surprise that we tend to look on other people's
manipulation of symbols (e.g., religious, political) with a little less
blind acceptance than the average person?  We know how much of the
mass/convention/revival meeting is technique.

We only *tend* toward cynicism/skepticism because anyone can choose
to buy into a symbolic system and suspend disbelief (I always thought
that "willing suspension of disbelief" was a pretty good definition of
"faith", but you know what a muddlehead I am).

I always shock my fundamentalist friends who suppose that the only
reason that I'm not with them is my ignorance.  I say to them, "I know
a good bit about your religion; perhaps more than you do.  I have
chosen my beliefs because I find them *better* than yours."

If Lenny (or, rather than putting words in Lenny's mouth, Mr. X) has
chosen Protestant Christianity or whatever, then it occurs to me that
we ought to assume that he's done the same thing: chosen his beliefs
because he finds them better than others.  My experience does not
permit the notion (however comforting I in my skepticism might find it)
that every single believer is a dupe and a fool.

At the same time, while we cynics are poking fun at believers in
symbols, we ought not get bent out of shape by their poking fun
at some of the "coherent symbology" we've (probably *un*consciously)
bought into (e.g., political correctness).  In that respect at
least, that they've chosen their values while we've fallen into
ours, they've got us by the short hairs, and we should accept it
with good humor.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chrome-Plated Megaphone of Destiny <alevin@TOPCAT.BSC.MASS.EDU> sez:

>*SHUDDER*
>I actually like some Queensryche and Fates Warning, but don't EVER call them
>Progressive. I know progressive, and they ain't it.

Well, Adam, the term "Progressive Metal" has been used for at least
Queensryche for some time (sorry about my ignorance of Fates Warning).

What term would you use to distinguish them from Ratt or Poison?  Or
don't you think there's a difference worth mentioning?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
doug anders <doug@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU> mentions _Blues and the
Abstract Truth_.

Do you have this gem?  How about _Fantabulous_ and some of the other
stuff from the Reprise label?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
To "Gary M. Gettier" <gmgettie@THAMA1.APGEA.ARMY.MIL> and
Chrome-Plated Megaphone of Destiny <alevin@TOPCAT.BSC.MASS.EDU> who
talk about my favorite Enya and Deborah Gibson tunes, the following:

        He sees you when you're sleeping
        He knows when you're awake
------------------------------------------------------------------------
To everyone (remaining) on ALLMUSIC, we're bringing down our local
net this afternoon so I'm unsubbing around noon.  We'll be back on
the air on January 4 as soon as the listserv takes our sub request.

A very happy holidays to all of you.  May Santa (or Satan) give you
everything you want instead of everything you deserve.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

  Deck the halls with boughs of non-endangered plant species
  Fa la la la la, la la la la
  'Tis the season to be self-actualizing,
  Fa la la la la, la la la la
  Don we now our alternate-lifestyle apparel
  Fa la la la la, la la la la
  Toll the ancient non-denominational-winter-solstice-holiday carol
  Fa la la la la, la la la la

                                   \|/
                                   -*-
                                   .*.
                                   ***
        M  E  R  R  Y             .@**.
                                 'w**o*`
         X  M  A  S  !           *ow***z
                                '***w**z`
                                *****wz*o
                               '*@***zw**`
                               ********w**
                              'x**o*z***w*`
                              *x*********w*
                             '*x***z*@***ow`
                            'O**x*z*********`
                            ****zx****O******
                           '*zz****x*****@*O*`
                          *z*'*O*'***x*`***`***
                         '****'****'*`*xx*`****`
                       '*'*O ' **' *** `*O `**x`*`
                                   &&&

+-------------------------------+--------------------------------------+
| Rev. Bob "Bob" Crispen        | Personnent hodie voces puerellae     |
| crispen@foxy.boeing.com       | Laudantes jocunde qui nobis est natus|
+-------------------------------+--------------------------------------+
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