From: bakc@giraffe.ru.ac.za (MR KR COMAN)
Newsgroups: sci.military
Subject: Re: Worst allied fighter in WW2
Date: 18 Dec 92 21:25:53 GMT
Organization: Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa


From MR KR COMAN <bakc@giraffe.ru.ac.za>

In article <BzEzBD.FG2@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> Urban F <urf@ki.icl.se> writes:
>From: Urban F <urf@ki.icl.se>
>Subject: Worst allied fighter in WW2
>Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 17:30:49 GMT
>
>From Urban F <urf@ki.icl.se>
>
>MR KR COMAN <bakcgiraffe.ru.ac.za> writes:
>
>>1. Brewster Buffalo -- so bad that it deserves a class all of its own.
>
>You mean the Gloster Gladiator was better? (It was in production
>in 1939.) Yes, I know there was a South African whom I've
>forgotten the name of who shot down 50+ aircraft with it, but I'd
>like to think that showed his skill, and not the ability of the
>aircraft. Similarily, the Finnish air force had very good success
>with the Buffalo.

	Point taken regarding the Finns use of the B.B., and their 
outstanding performance with this a/c -- full credit given.  As a qualifier,
 I've also posted elsewhere that the Red AF during the Winter War left a lot 
to be desired in terms of equipment, command and control, motivation and 
morale.   I also understand that the Finns had some Glads. in their 
inventory at the time and did good work with it.

	As far as the Glad was concerned, it was a well-liked a/c but one 
that had no place in the front-line from 1939.  It is significant that no 
Glads were sent to France with the RAF's Advanced Air Striking Force in 1939,
presumably because the authorities were well aware of its obsolesence.  In 
the Central European theatre the sole use made of the Glad on offensive ops 
was during the 1940 Norway debacle.   Glads were tasked to this for two 
reasons: (a) Spits and Hurri-birds had top priority for France and Home 
Defense, and (b)the Glad was the only fighter in the RAF with even a 
marginal chance of operating off rough, improvised airstrips in a Norwegian 
winter -- including frozen lakes -- their short take-off and landing runs 
plus basic simplicity and ruggedness being vital factors here.   Also they 
were shipped across by a/c carrier (the very small, HMS Glorious) -- no way 
could even a Hurri get off given the level of experience available at the 
time.   Thus the Glads got the job by default.   That they were in such 
small numbers and so out-classed that they got decimated cannot be denied.

	Outside of the Central theatre, the Glad was used in two areas. The
Med in 1940 and East Africa/Ethiopia in 1940.  Keep in mind that they were
committed in quite small numbers and that their oppo was the Italian Regia
Aeronautica flying bi-plane Fiat fighters that in every respect were pretty
much on a par with the Glad (the latter outgunning them tho with 4 mg's 
versus the Fiat's 2).   So yes, for the time and in these theatres the Glad 
was suitable, was not superior but was certainly not inferior.   Apart from 
Norway, the only time the Glad was purposefully committed against vastly 
better oppos was during the siege of Malta.  In this instance I recall that 
bits and pieces of Glads were found in a warehouse, assembled and thrown 
into the fight -- quite understandable under such desperate 
circumstances.   (A number of Glads might also have been operating with the 
RAF during the disasterous intervention in Greece, but I'm not sure of 
this.)   Overall, by mid 1940 surviving Glads *in Britain* were used for 
basic fighter familiarisation and air combat training for rookie pilots 
going on to fly Spits and Hurri's.  Certainly no Glad squadrons feature in 
the RAF's Order of Battle after May 1940.

	As far as South African use of the Glad is concerned, this was 
during the East Africa/Ethiopian campaign of 1940-1.  The SAAF was equipped 
with a rat-bag collection of odd a/c -- early on their primary bomber was
a couple of converted civilian Junkers 86's: a fine irony!   Amongst this 
collection were Hawker Furys and some Glads.   When the first couple of 
clapped-out Hurricane I's arrived -- the very early jobs with fabric wings, 
the SAAF's fighter capability took a quantum leap forward.  The Italians had
nothing in the theatre that could match it.    As far as I'm aware (could 
dig out the lit if required), top SAAF fighter pilots early in the war such 
as Frost and Pattle flew these "state of the art" Hurri-birds to rack up 
their scores -- not Glads.

	OK.  To round this off.  The Buffalo -- my thinking here was that 
(unlike the Glad) in 1940 this was *intended to be a red-hot, modern 
fighter*, it did not have a history that was almost over, as was the case 
with the Glad.   When evaluated by the RAF in 1940-41 against the realities 
of air combat versus the Germans the conclusion was that the plane was a 
nothing but a death sentence to its pilots should it be assigned to front-
line squadron service in Europe.   Again by default -- what to do with 
them?  Send 'em out to the Far East let the RAF in Malaya and the 
Australians make of them what they will.....the rest is history.
Cheers,
Keith Coman
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"If we pay dogfood salespeople more than we   :  Dept of Management
 do teachers, we should not be surprised if   :  Rhodes University
 our dogs eat like kids, and our kids end     :  Grahamstown, 6140
 up reading like dogs."                       :  Rep of South Africa
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: sci.military