HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
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Date:         Thu, 21 Jan 1993 12:09:29 EST
              <CDROMLAN@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         James Jay Morgan <MORGANJ@UCS.INDIANA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Good books for a new administrator

Just a note about Computer Selects and Lan Times: Lan Times is listed
as having a "3 month embargo" by CS.  I presume this means that they
aren't allowed to mount it until 3 mos. have passed.
On a more positive note, InfoWorld has just announced that it, and PC World,
its sister publication, will be added to Computer Selects.
Jim Morgan
MORGANJ@INDYVAX.BITNET  MORGANJ@INDYVAX.IUPUI.EDU
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.autism
Date:         Fri, 22 Jan 1993 09:28:41 EST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         Daniel Mont <D6M@CORNELLA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Toilet Training
              21 Jan 1993 13:44:03 PST from <etam@DELTA.TYMNET.COM>

Ed, When Simon started toilet training he was about 22 months old. Alex
is just about two years older than Simon. Alex is very well trained as
far as urine is concerned. He is not as good with bowel movements --
especially when he is engaged in some activity.  For some reason, he is
more prone to have an accident with us than at school.

Dan
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.autism
Date:         Thu, 28 Jan 1993 17:07:08 +0000
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         Miss Sarah Tiller <sklyslt@UCL.AC.UK>
Subject:      Autistic echolalia

Hi all I hope this message egts through. I am doing a project on autistic
 echolalia, I'm in my 3rd year at university college london. Anyone got any
 ideas/references/ ANYTHING AT ALL TO SAY ABOUT THE SUBJECT please mail me.
 sarah.
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Date:         Sat, 23 Jan 1993 13:11:22 EST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         Lisa S Lewis <LISAS@PUCC.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Autistic Variants.

On Fri, 22 Jan 1993 14:45:40 CST Jim Sinclair said:
>On Fri, 22 Jan 1993 15:19:13 EST Lisa S Lewis said:
>>Often children with SI problems have difficulty in motor planning. They may
>>be tactilely defensive or crave deep pressure.  They may have trouble locating
>>their own bodies in space. Their balance may be poor or their movements
>>uncoordinated.  Or they may need to rock and spin.  SI kids usually LOVE to
>>swing.
>
>Sounds familiar--I will have to get this book.  Can anything be done for
>adults?

Most people think that SI therapy is most helpful before the age of six,
I'm afraid. However, it certainly can't hurt an adult, and might actually
help an adult in that they can be made more aware of body placement, e.g.

>>Oh, and by the way, SI therapy supposedly decreases
>>self-stimulatory behaviors, but it hasn't for Sam.
>
>Could it be that those behaviors ARE a form of do-it-yourself SI therapy?
>
The theory is that yes, these behaviors are done because the child NEEDS
the stimulation. Therefore, in theory, the therapy should replace (fulfill)
the same need.  I can't say that we've ever seen this to be true.  However,
the therapists have given us lots of ideas for things in Sam's environment
which will fulfill these needs more appropriately.  For example, when
weather permits outside play, Sam will spend hours on end on his
his tire swing. It hangs horizontal (i.e. parallel to the ground) rather than
in the vertical position you usually see. He lays across it and spins while
swinging.

And the therapy has definitely helped his motor planning abilities.  We've
also seen a huge change in his ability to handle different textures. He used
to scream at the sight of a Funny Foam can, now he loves to play with it and
requests it often.  Also he couldn't bear to touch playdough...now he not only
loves it, but it is an activity in which he does a lot of pretend play and has
great language use.  So I would have to say that the therapy has been very
beneficial.

Sam's full-day, extended year school does not provide any OT (surprisingly.)
I am lucky to be in a very good school district, and persuaded them to pay for
an hour of SI/OT per week. It was written in to his IEP in October, so we're
set for this year.  We're also lucky to be near a facility (the Eden Institute)
that provides SI at reasonable cost.  A certified OT evaluates the child and
sees him quarterly; she prescribes therapy, which is carried out by a trained
OT asst.  Because the asst. doesn't have an OT they charge $25/hour instead of
the $50-70/hour that OTs charge.
Lisa
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Date:         Tue, 26 Jan 1993 19:54:58 -0500
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         FARBER_R@SPCVXA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Autistic Variants.

Thanks JIm,When you find that article,please send the references.
Thanks.In the past,people in "The know"would say that self-stim.
behavior was not good,had to be extinguished.and could not attend
to tasks while engaging in self stim. behavior.
I would be interested  in hearing about the article you refer to.
Rosanne
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Date:         Tue, 26 Jan 1993 20:08:28 -0500
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         FARBER_R@SPCVXA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Please forward to AUTISM mailing list

Kathy,
   I received your message and will forward the Rimland tape
to your mother,A.s.a.p.
I too would like to echo yor sentiments in regard to thanking
Lisa.THANKS LISA !!!!
Rosanne
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.autism
From: jsternbe@utkvxn.utk.edu (Sternberg, James)
Subject: More Autistic Variants Stuff
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Tennessee Computing Center
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 01:27:00 GMT

Hello there,

	All of the information which you have given me on sensory integration
disfunction, pervasive personality disorders(?) has been extremely helpful, and
I am looking forward to more.  One thing is still extremely unclear to me
however.  What is the relationship between autisic-continuum disorders, SID,
and PPD?  I beg that your response does not contain the word "vestibular" :).
                                        -James Sternberg

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Date:         Sun, 24 Jan 1993 11:19:03 EST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         Daniel Mont <D6M@CORNELLA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: A Little Help From My Friends

>
>Why do you think he would have been hurt if he hadn't been invited?  Is he
>aware of things like parties, and of whether or not he's invited?  I wasn't
>at his age.  Somehow my mother always knew that classmates were having
>birthday parties and that I had been invited to them, but if she hadn't
>told me, "You're going to Nancy's birthday party this Sunday," I never
>would have known about it.  I certainly wouldn't have picked up on it from
>the other kids at school!  As an adult, I usually find being invited to

I don't think Alex would have known the party existed if he hadn't
been told about it.  He doesn't pick up on things like that. But, when
Simon is invited to a party or a friend's house Alex gets upset (though
not extremely so) that he has not been invited by one of his "friends",
though these friends are always unnamed.

And yes, we are planning to ask one boy that he sees somewhat regularly
(the son of a friend of ours) to go bowling.  There has never been
any negative friction between the two, and they recently had a good
time taking turns playing a computer game together.
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Date:         Mon, 25 Jan 1993 10:13:42 -0600
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         "Deborah V. Good" <dgood@UA.D.UMN.EDU>
Subject:      Re: A Little Help From My Friends
              22, 93 1:49 pm

Jim, perhaps I should have been a little more descriptive in my reply
regarding times when we guide our son James back to social interactions.
If he wanders away from the group, we do allow him some time
(approximately 5 minutes) for him to go back to the group by himself.  Sometimes
this does occur.  If it doesn't AND WE THINK HE'S UP TO IT, we guide him
back to the group.  If he isn't quite up to it, we give him a little
more time, or we intervene a bit by suggesting a snack to the whole
group, which brings him back without it being a pressure situation for him.

Perhaps we're intervening too much . . . but the kids lose interest in
him if he's up the street riding his bike and they're playing in our
backyard.  And when they lose interest in him, we feel he's losing out
on some valuable time when he could be doing some interaction.  Plus he
appears even more different, and that hurts us because it's establishing
a pattern of the way the kids think about him.
Remember, we don't force him to play with the kids, but we require that
he be in the back yard when they're there, etc.

James is indicating more and more his interest in being with other kids,
and he's better able to handle playing a game with a peer.  We, as his
parents, think he's also able to handle or should be learning how to
handle social situations which he becomes bored with.

We never have tons of kids
over so it's not as if the number of kids and the volume is
overwhelming.  Also he is familiar with these kids as well.  We believe
if he doesn't want to play on the tire swing or in the sandbox anymore
with his friends
that he can find another activity in the area which wouldn't require him
to interact with the kids.  We've also observed him suggesting other
activities - such as riding their bikes (one of his passions) - when
he's grown bored of a situation.

I hope this explains our position without sounding defensive!  Since our
son doesn't have siblings, I recognize that his exposure to peers is very
important for me.  I also know my son, and I believe he really wants
that exposure as well.  Deb
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.autism
From: jsternbe@utkvxn.utk.edu (Sternberg, James)
Subject: Re:      Re: Autistic Variants.
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Tennessee Computing Center
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 15:16:00 GMT

In article <9301211705.AA02435@hpfe15.fc.hp.com>,         Jean Jasinski <jean@HPFELA.FC.HP.COM> writes...
>Has anyone mentioned sensory integration dysfunction as another
>disorder presenting autistic-like symptoms (without language involvement)?
> 
>There is a fairly good book written for parents by Jean Ayres, the SI
>pioneer.  I **think** it is called "Sensory Integration and the Child"
>but I have the book at home and can fully check the title.  Sensory
>integration occupational therapy has been one of the single biggest
>improvers for my son.
> 
>Jean Jasinski
>Ft. Collins, CO

Thank you for this information.  Our library does not have this book, so I will
have to get this book over inter-library loan. While I am waiting for this, can
you tell me anything about this sensory integration disfunction?  Does this
mean that the brain has difficulty integrating all of the information it is
given through the senses into a coherent whole "picture"?  What are the
symptoms which are usually associated with this?  Please forgive all these
questions, but I fell that I am getting close to the answer which I am seeking.

                                                   -James Sternberg

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Date:         Fri, 22 Jan 1993 21:52:42 -0500
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         FARBER_R@SPCVXA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Toilet Training

Bill is absolutely correct! It is sometimes a long process.
When we start it in school wiyh a particular child-----we do nothing else
with that child.Our bathroom is right inside the room so it's convenient
 but boring,decorating the bathroom helps,PATIENCE is a must,REWARDS

are also a must and must be immediate.We use Skittles and stickers.
In fact everyone in the room gets Skittles when Christopher is
successful!Another important,let me rephrase that,A VERY IMPORTANT
aspect is parent involvement.It is critical that if toilet training
is being done in school parents have to follow through at home.
I can't tell you how many parents think our program will work
in 3 hrs. at school and then immediately put the child in diapers
when they arrive home.Rosanne
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.autism
From: jbadner@world.std.com (JA Badner)
Subject: Re: Pain signals
Organization: The World @ Software Tool & Die
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 13:43:20 GMT

Jim Sinclair <GOLEM@UKANVM.BITNET> writes:

>Not approaching her at first is the sensitive and caring thing to do.  If
>you know she's going to want contact later, after she's had some time to
>get acclimated to your presence, you might try to structure your visits to
>allow for that.  Maybe you could go right to the younger child and give her
>undivided "Aunt Judy time" first (with Abby in the room,) and then when
>Abby's warmed up you can explain that it's her turn for Aunt Judy time and
>give her an equal period of undivided attention (perhaps one of the parents
>could play with the other child while you do this), and then afterwards
>you can just be there with both kids and let them both seek contact as they
>wish?

I know not approaching Abby first is really the _only_ thing to do
as anything else would be too difficult for her.  Basically I do as
you say (and it is exhausting! :-)) but I think it leaves both girls
feeling like they're not getting enough and want more.  Also, when I'm
around, no other adult (including their parents, grandmother, and uncle)
is "good enough" although they are when I'm not there.  There is 
definitely some sibling rivalry, each girl trying to get me to show that
I love them best (Becca more so than Abby) and I try to balance it as
best as I can.

Judy
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Date:         Wed, 27 Jan 1993 15:32:17 -0600
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         "Lynda W. Huggins" <HUGGINS@MERLIN.NLU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Autistic Variants.

Steve,

A member of our local ASA chapter has a deaf autistic son age 21.  I will
ask her for info.

Lynda in Louisiana
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Date:         Sun, 24 Jan 1993 00:50:10 GMT
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         lexier@SFU.CA
Subject:      Re: A Little Help From My Friends
              Jan 21, 93 3:10 pm

>
> Daniel, do you have the address/telephone number for the Pacific Association?
> We'd like to get a copy of Lyle's video, too!
>
>                                         Lauren
>

Pacific Association for Autistic Citizens
201-3277 Cambie Street
Vancouver, B.C.
Canada     V5Z 2W3

Tel: (604) 879-8888
Fax: (604) 879-3989

Lyle Lexier
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Date:         Thu, 21 Jan 1993 10:44:09 PST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         Edward Tam <etam@DELTA.TYMNET.COM>
Subject:      Toilet Training

Hello everyone,

We have quite a hard time try to toilet train our 3 1/2 years old autistic
son. I guess the major problem is to teach him to communicate to us when
he needs to go to the washroom. Another problem is that, seems to us that
our son has no control on his bladder and as well as his bowel movement.

Would somebody out there like to share their teaching experiences or has
any recommended books in this area. I guess the toilet
training period will vary on a case by case basis. Does anyone know
whether there is any statistic on how soon an autistic child can be
toilet trained?

Best Regards,

Edward Tam
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Date:         Mon, 25 Jan 1993 15:46:15 CST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
Comments:     Resent-From: Jim Sinclair <GOLEM@UKANVM>
Comments:     Originally-From: Derrick Smith <73547.310@compuserve.com>
From:         Jim Sinclair <GOLEM@UKANVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Pain signals

Forwarding this from Derrick.  Reply from myself to follow.

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Jim,

>Derrick, which do you suppose is more damaging in instances like this:
>the untreated or belatedly treated physical injury, or the disbelief and
>inducement to doubt one's own perceptions?

I believe that emotional abuse--which is a component of every other kind of
abuse but also exists by itself--inflicts the deepest injuries in most cases.
I've been physically injured lots of times, but my body carries few bothersome
reminders from those experiences; an impressive number of scars, none of them
particularly hideous or disfiguring.  I was sexually abused for years, but
again, I don't believe there are any visible signs of it today.  The emotional
damage, though, has wreaked havoc throughout my life and caused bitter pain.

I never know when my own experiences have been so "non-autistic" that they
become irrelevant to conversations in this thread.  I include them this time to
explain my conclusion that being caused to doubt your own senses is more
damaging in the long run than the broken bone.  I would guess that this would
be a particularly grievous injury to inflict upon an autistic person.  I would
guess that the logical and perceptual faculties in autistic people would become
far more important to them than would be the case among non-autistic people.
They would have to lean upon them very heavily.  It could not be an
insignificant event to suffer jarring doubts about those very faculties.  In
fact, it would constitute a very grave example of emotional abuse, even though
it was not intended to be.

Although the immediate circumstances included a painful broken foot, I would
suppose the assault against your ability to believe yourself, however
unintended, would have had greater consequences in the long term.

I wonder whether you would confirm or deny any of this speculation from your
own experience?

Derrick
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Date:         Tue, 26 Jan 1993 10:04:42 EST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
Comments:     Resent-From: Bob Zenhausern <DRZ@SJUVM>
Comments:     Originally-From: "Kathy Brade" <brade@terminator.rs.itd.umich.edu>
From:         Bob Zenhausern <DRZ@SJUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Please forward to AUTISM mailing list

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
The machine I usually read e-mail on is down due to hacker-breakin.
Please forward this message on to the group.
Thanks!
Happy New Year!
kathy brade
   --brade@umich.edu

p.s.  I am still receiving the list mailings as my mail is forwarding.
=======================================================================
Subject: more tape stuff

Since the tapes have already gone out and Lisa is tired of dealing
with the whole mess (THANKS LISA!!!),
could someone in the Midwest please add my mother to the list?
Her address is:
   Martha Brade
   108 John Street
   P.O. Box 98
   Kinde, MI 48445 (Michigan)

Rosanne or whoever has the Rimland (B6) tape, can you please forward it
on to my mother also?  Thanks!

Also, I think Lisa intended everyone to see the post script...

>P.S. Hey guys...I got the tape, I got permission, I compiled a list and I
>sent them out priority mail.  And now I'm sick of the whole thing :)  If any-
>one else wants to see it, please wait awhile.  When I get it back (from the
>end of the list in B.C.) I'll let the list know.  Or else go back through
>the list, find someone near you who wanted it, and contact them directly via
>e-mail.  Thanks.  And sorry for being crabby...but this is taking over my
>life!

I think everyone borrowing the tapes, wants to thank you Lisa for all of
your work.  I've organized similar things and know how you feel!
Happy New Year everyone!
kathy
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Date:         Mon, 25 Jan 1993 12:02:28 EST
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         RJKOPP@SUVM.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Autistic Variants.

If by referring to self-stim you mean rocking, rolling etc. I think there
are times when it is needed.  I watch my daughter alot to figure out why she
is doing it.  Granted there seem to be in-appropriate times, but she knows
that too.  If she is rocking or bouncing and it is inappropriate, if I
remind her that now is not a good time and she continues, thourgh a number
of other signs such as appearance of eyes, expression, strength of rocking
and environmental conditions I try to figure out if it's boredom or something
else.  If it is stress to her I have decided that rocking is her way of get
ting herself ready for it or dealing with it.  I try to help if I think she
wants out of a situation or I will remove her if it is so  strong that it
indicates she is in stress.

At home we are much more lax about it as by that time she usually seems
tired and worn out after a day of school (control) and after school (where
she is still being worked into the routine).  These are times her rocking
will be much more gentle, she may even close her eyes.  I also know she
suffers from headaches (something she inherited from me) and that is how
she copes with them till tylenol kicks in, if it will.   She definitly
uses rocking to wind down enough to get to sleep, something that sometimes
we forget to mention to a new sitter that really throws them off, they think
it's because she can't get to sleep or is scared so they go and talk to
her or leave a light on (other than a night light) which usually results in
her waking up more and staying up, usually too late and the next day my
daughter  is wiped out or has headaches.  A stupid thing to forget when
it is so important for her to wind down.  So we go through a little guilt
every once in a while.

I have had many therapists and teachers that want to jump on this immediatly
and consider any of it bad, and I disagree.  It has a purpose for my daughter
probably for other kids, granted too much of it is non-productive, but I
think some of it is useful and provides a way for some to cope with difficult
things or environs.  It is often a good indicator for us as parents to know
when something is wrong or stressing my daughter or that she is just tired
and maybe for that day needs to get to bed a little earlier.  Some of it
also is just fun for them, such as rocking to music (one of my daughters
favorites!), kind of like beginning dance.

Thanks,
Ray Kopp
Computing Services
Network Systems
rjkopp@mailbox.syr.edu
217 Machinery Hall
X-5776
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Date:         Thu, 21 Jan 1993 12:46:17 GMT
              <AUTISM@SJUVM.BITNET>
From:         lexier@SFU.CA
Subject:      Re: Life Goes On
              21, 93 10:05 am

I have created my own maillist called "life-goes-on@sfu.ca".  It discusses the
show Life Goes On.  On my maillist Corky and Amanda are discussed a lot.  I
already said to the maillist that they are the best actor and actress, because
they represent a great deal of what handicapped people can accomplish if they
are given the chance.

Lyle
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