HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ad626@yfn.ysu.edu (Steve Crocker)
Subject: Re: Report on Gritz from Idaho
Organization: Youngstown State/Youngstown Free-Net
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 05:33:38 GMT


Ted, please explain what your questions about Gritz's alleged 
anti-semitism had to do with your quote from Joe criticizing
the doctrine of "code words". Or do you simply follow the 
Humpty Dumpty school of linguistics.

-Steve
"I pay words overtime and make 'em mean what I want"
H. Dumpty (quoted in L.Carroll, Alice in WOnderland)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa,misc.activism.progressive
From: jad@hopper.ACS.Virginia.EDU (John DiNardo)
Subject: PREVAILING WINDS RESEARCH: The Secret Treaty of Fort Hunt
Followup-To: alt.conspiracy
Originator: rich@pencil.cs.missouri.edu
Keywords:  PREVAILING WINDS RESEARCH: The Secret Treaty of Fort Hunt
Organization: UVA. FREE Public Access UNIX! 
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 00:06:37 GMT

      From Prevailing Winds Research, Reprint #003 :
*   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *

           "THE SECRET TREATY OF FORT HUNT"
                   by Carl Oglesby


Read this article in conjunction with "How Allen Dulles and the
SS Preserved Each Other," and you'll have a pretty good idea of
how we got into the mess we're in today. This article from 
"Covert Action [Information Bulletin]" tells the story of ODESSA
and it's relationship to Reinhard Gehlen's spy organization 
which formed the basis of our modern Central Intelligence Agency
and National Security Council.  "The unconditional surrender 
that the Germans made to the Allied Command at the little red
schoolhouse in Reims was the surrender only of the German Armed
Services. It was NOT the surrender of the hard SS core of the
Nazi Party. The SS did not surrender, unconditionally or 
otherwise, and thus, Naziism itself did not surrender. The SS
chose, rather, to seek other means of continuing the war while
the right wing of the United States Military Establishment, 
through fears and secret passions and a naivet'e of its own,
chose to facilitate that choice. The history that we have lived
through since then stands witness to the consequences."
 $1.30

-   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -

        As a small non-profit group, Prevailing Winds Research
        hopes it can serve an important social service, attempting
        to preserve important and scarce information and making it
        available in the form of audios, videos, books and reprints.
                      ASK FOR A CATALOG.

                  PREVAILING WINDS RESEARCH
                       P.O. Box 23511
                   Santa Barbara, CA 93121

         Telephone: (805)566-8016     FAX (24 hours) (805) 569-2411
                 PWR Bulletin Board System: (805) 569-5005

----------------------------
Transcribed by John DiNardo


Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: andromed@Hail.ATM.Dal.Ca (Mike Boschat)
Subject: JFK and Iraq
Organization: ATM, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 03:05:14 GMT

my 2 cents worth..if President John F.Kennedy was around he would know
what to do with Iraq...and not just slap them on the wrist, he would have
gone all the way, and captured saddam to stand trial for war crimes.
I think if Pres.Clinton was smart as he knelt by JFKs grave he would have
had time to reflect on JFKs policy...." let the word go forth from this
time and place..to friend and foe alike..."
thank  you..                 

                                        Clear skies

                                        Mike Boschat

 --------------------------------------------------------------------------
|    JOHN F. KENNEDY              | " Our problems are man-made, therefore |
|                                 |  they can be solved by man. "          |
|  ASTRONOMICAL  OBSERVATORY      |                                        |
|                                 |                      J.F.K.            |
 --------------------------------------------------------------------------
30th Anniversary of President John F.Kennedy assassination Nov.22, 1963-1993 AD
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.revisionism,alt.news-media
From: battin@venus.iucf.indiana.edu (L GENE BATTIN)
Subject: Re: Jew-haters radio network
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4   
Keywords: Cowardly lying Jew-hating Nazis
Reply-To: battin@venus.iucf.indiana.edu
Organization: VENUS.IUCF.INDIANA.EDU
Distribution:  world
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 17:45:06 GMT

In article <1993Jan23.032403.7757@cs.ucla.edu>, 
pierce@lanai.cs.ucla.edu (Brad Pierce) writes...

>---------------  FORWARDED POSTING  ---------------------------------
>Newsgroups: misc.activism.progressive
>From: harelb@math.cornell.edu (Harel Barzilai)
>Subject: "who are these people?" -- radio "free" america
>Message-ID: <1993Jan23.005215.10932@mont.cs.missouri.edu>
>Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 00:52:15 GMT
> 
>******************************************************************
>Topic 183	Who are these people?	2 responses 
>caribdesk	media.issues	 7:39 am  Nov  8, 1992 
>****************************************************************** 
>From: Bob Thomson <caribdesk> 
>Subject: Who are these people? 
>****************************************************************** 
>/* Written  4:37 pm  Nov  5, 1992 by odin@world.std.com in igc:p.news */ 
>/* ---------- "Who are these people?" ---------- */ 
>From: Hank Roth <odin@world.std.com> 
>Subject: Who are these people? 
>******************************************************************
>---------- Forwarded message ---------- 
>Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 01:20:16 PST 
>From: RICHARD HAREL <RHAREL@FAB8.intel.com> 
>To: odin@world.std.com 
>Subject: Who are these people ??? 

[stuff deleted]...

>SEARS WAS THE ONLY COMMERCIAL ADVERTISER DURING THE PROGRAM. (ALUMINUM SIDING). 

Perhaps SEARS should be made aware of their sponsership of this, and what some 
might think of it...

[more stuff deleted]...

>Topic 183	Who are these people?	Response  1 of  2 
>caribdesk 
>media.issues	 7:39 am  Nov  8, 1992 
> 
>From: Bob Thomson <caribdesk> 
>Subject: Who are these people? 
> 

[more stuff deleted]...

>Topic 183	Who are these people?	Response  2 of  2 
>caribdesk 
>media.issues	 7:40 am  Nov  8, 1992 
> 
>From: Bob Thomson <caribdesk> 
>Subject: Who are these people? 
> 
>/* Written 12:42 am  Nov  8, 1992 by pnews@igc.apc.org in igc:p.news */ 
>/* ---------- "Who are these people?" ---------- */ 
><<< via P_news >>> 
>[Forwarded from Usenet] 
>From: Chip Berlet 
>  

[more stuff deleted]...

>influential racial theorists. Carto is described   
>by the London-based anti-fascist magazine   
><Searchlight> as the "leading U.S. publisher of   
  ^^^^^^^^^^^
>anti-semitic, racist and pro-nazi material."   
>  

Would someone be so kind as to post the address and subscription ordering
info for this magazine (Searchlight)?

Thanks.

--Gene
From: lwb@cs.utexas.edu (Lance W. Bledsoe)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: CHRISTIANS ARE BEING DUPED!
Date: 26 Jan 1993 11:09:46 -0600
Organization: CS Dept, University of Texas at Austin
NNTP-Posting-Host: im4u.cs.utexas.edu

In article <1993Jan25.190128.3319@cnsvax.uwec.edu> mcelwre@cnsvax.uwec.edu writes:
>     Orthodox religions have CONSPIRED to KEEP US IN THE DARK about the
>following important information:
>           
>               One such perfect Master alive today is an American, Sri 
>          Harold Klemp, the Living "Eck" Master or "Mahanta" for the 
>          "Eckankar" organization, now headquartered in Minneapolis, 
>          (P.O. Box 27300;  zip 55427). 


See.  There you go.  It's people like this that give all of us
"other wackos" a bad name! :-)

I suggest that postings like this be directed to:

	alt.I.had.a.big.drug.problem.in.the.60s

Lance
The Incarnate Master of Conservative Thought :-)




-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  Lance W. Bledsoe        lwb@im4u.cs.utexas.edu        (512) 258-0112  |
|  "Ye shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall make you free."         |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: rburns@StarConn.com (Randall J. Burns)
Subject: Re: Bo Gritz/CFR/Trilaterals
Organization: Starnet-Public Access UNIX--Los Altos, CA  415-949-3133
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 20:57:30 GMT

In article <1299600163@igc.apc.org> NLG Civil Liberties Committee <cberlet@igc.apc.org> writes:
>
>
>A serious book about the political goals of the Trilateral Commission is
>by Holly Sklar, who warns about confusing political influence and power
>with conspiratorial analysis and conjecture. 
I'd like to hear more about this.

>She also considers Gritz and
>the Populist party/Liberty Lobby crowd to be bigots.
The real question is on a scale of 1-10, how bigotted are they? My
honest guess is that Gritz is somewhere between Pat Buchanan and David
Duke.

The big objection that I've personally had to the posts about Gritz is
they tend to analyze him as existing in some kind of vacuum. Bigots 
exist about among all ethnic groups.  Bigots are particularly  important
among organized criminal activity(i.e. Sicilian the Mafia is _not_ and equal
opportunity employer).

I tend to think that Gritz blows the relative importance of Jewish
financial mafia's _all_ out of proportion. Still, given the history of
the Rothchilds and Meyer Lansky, it is understandable why the 
message might have some serious appeal to certain elements of the
population. Some of the Left-Wing analysis of the ruling elites border
on accusations that there is an equally cohesive and important 
WASP mafia. I would like to have these accusations looked at
with some degree of parity.

>Acting as a gullible apologist for Gritz makes you
>guilty of helping spread bigotry. 
Perhaps criticizing Gritz from a predictable and partisan perspective
also contributes to the spread of bigotry?

>We have repeatedly presented facts showing statements by Gritz that are
>anti-Jewish, and his close working relationship with racist and fascist
>groups. Why are you unable to accept the facts?
It isn't just a question of accepting the facts. It is a question of 
asking what context the facts are found in.
>
From: jonc@status.gen.nz (Jon Clarke)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Masons
Date: 25 Jan 93 16:21:01 GMT
Organization: The CServer at the Z*NET International Global News Gateway

gtoal@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal) writes:

> In article <9DNVXB1w165w@status.gen.nz> jonc@status.gen.nz (Jon Clarke) write
> :> There is a big divide between US and european freemasonry. The latter was 
> : 
> : Opps no-one told us European's this. When was this the case, and where
> : did you get such dis-information from ?
> 
> :> The corrupt P2 lodge and the banco ambrosiano scandal show that freemasonr
> :> a very shaddy side. Mafia and fascist infiltration is widespread. They wer
> : 
> : Ah no I see where you get your dis-information from. Fairy stories.
> : Please for the sake of the readers in this news.group understand the
> : differnce between Freemasonary and a Friendly society/fraternity.
> 
> Perhaps the first poster should have said 'there's a big difference between
> european and non-european freemasonry', since clearly at least one part of
> NZ hasn't a clue.  The sinister side of the Italian lodges is well documented
  As P2 was an unreconised freemasons lodge I find this responce a little
  hard to fatham.  If you had included the next paragraph of my article
  you would have seen where the confusion came from in the media.
 
  I still believe many readers of this news.group have problems 
  understanding the difference between say the Knights of Columbus
  a dedicated Catholic society who's aims are to undo the refermation
  of the late 1500's and to remove the prodestant faith, the Orange
  Order, P2 and Freemasons (none of which have anything in common,
  bar a few members maybe freemasons) so maybe it is time for the 
  readers of this group to stop and think of who they are refering
  to in their posts.
 
  Just a thought not that anyone will listen.
 
 ---
 "Fred, did you see the Knights of Columbus are going to banned from
  the Guiness Match this year?" "No". "Oh"
From: monaghan@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (N.O. Monaghan)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Books Available From JBS - Part 1, Western Islands Press
Date: 27 Jan 93 21:28:26 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.

lwb@cs.utexas.edu (Lance W. Bledsoe) writes:

>    File Name:      jbsbooks.01

>    Description:    Books available from The JBS.
>                    Part 1 includes books published by
>                    Western Islands Press

For those readers outside America, I would strongly advise ordering
books from the JBS - they can be ordered by credit card and if posted
book rate via US mail, are very cheap indeed to buying the same books in
Britain or Europe - if in face they are even available here. I have done
so, and found the servive to be superb.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
N.O. Monaghan

monaghan@dcs.gla.ac.uk
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: Re: Globalist Influence in US Government
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 21:45:20 GMT

In article <1993Jan27.193934.737@westford.ccur.com> harty@westford.ccur.com (Kevin Harty) writes:
>The JBS was founded to combat world government (New World Order).
>A OWG under the UN will be socialist, authoritarian, and freedom limiting.  

Evidence?

>Consider now the UN Declaration of Human Rights.  The UN view is something
>completely different.  The difference is fundamental.  There is no mention of
>God anywhere, nor is there is no alternative non-religous recognition
>of natural rights.  

There's no mention of God in the US Constitution, either.  

>> Personally, I don't think these groups are much more than social clubs with 
>> a civic/academic bent. C. Wright Mill's *The Power Elite* seems to have come 
>> closer to the point -- that "conspiracies" are just cliques in a political 
>> culture.
>
>Government officials, including our President, belong to these groups.
>The CFR does not allow disclosure of its meetings and may dismiss a member
>who does so.  Considering the high powered officials who belong, I think
>the meetings should be on C-SPAN.  After all, what they discuss and come
>to consensus on affects us all immensely.  

Evidence of this?  

>If they had no power to set
>plans in motion, then I would agree that it would be a "social club".

Then you agree that it is a social club.  The CFR has no power to secretly
set plans in motion.

>However, when you have the President, Secretary of State, CIA Director,
>National Security Advisor, Secretary of Defense, Secretary of the Treasury,
>Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and many others belonging to an
>an organization such as the CFR having a closed-door meeting policy,
>meeting with similarly high-ranking government officials, then I worry.

These officials could all meet in the West Wing of the White House in
a closed-door meeting with or without the CFR.

>	"An end run around national sovereignty, eroding it piece by piece,
>	is likely to get us to world order faster than the old-fashioned
>	frontal attack."

I'd like to see the context for this remark.  Out of context, it means
nothing.
-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
standard disclaimers          | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller)
Subject: Re: Secret Societies
Organization: Trinity College, Hartford, CT.
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 03:19:14 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.231816.22283@digi.lonestar.org> gpalo@digi.lonestar.org (G
erry Palo) writes:
>
>Of the different kinds of people in the world, two are especially interesting.
>These are conspiracy theorists, who believe in this or that specific cons-
>piracy, and the anti-conspiracy theorists, who go non-linear at the very
>suggestion of any conspiracy at all.  Sometimes the latter do not go com-
>pletely non-linear, or rather they cover up the fact with clever, biting
>humor.  Either way, the two types basically never communicate.
>
>Gerry Palo (73237.2006@compuserve.com)

And there those like myself who believe in the likelihood that
conspiracies of all sorts are hatched every day (most of them
petty) but who go "non-linear" at the sight of grown people
(computer-literate people at that) who seem to have no need for
evidence of any sort.

Norman Miller
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,talk.politics.misc,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa
From: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Jewish Bankers
Date: 25 Jan 1993 20:44:23 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank) says:

Quote that Ted Frank is responding to:
>>Personally, I see Gritz's speculation in the same vein as the attempts
>>of ignorant people to attempt to undertand the dynamics of organized
>>crime-and Mr. Frank's comments in the vein of comments that attempted
>>to deny the existance of the Mafia.
>
>And what evidence do you have of a "Jewish banking Mafia"?
>-- 
Do you admit the possibility, Ted, that there might be a multicultural
banking Mafia?  If there is no evidence that there is one, is there any
evidence that there is not one?

The reason I ask, my understanding of human nature--and bankers are
human--leads me to believe that there would be such a thing unless it
was specifically prevented.  Why?  Because it would be good for profits.

Doesn't the BCCI scandal demonstrate that such a thing can happen?  How
can we be sure that BCCI was the whole problem?  Maybe it was just the
tip of the iceberg?

Are not the rich and powerful just as tempted to break the rules,
commit crimes, as the man in the street?  If I have no proof of a
bankers conspiracy, maybe it is because bankers are even better at
getting away with their crimes than drug pushers are.

Even if we cannot prove that a drug lord is operating in the
neighborhood, the fact that there is widespread drug use constitutes
proof that somebody is pushing drugs.  We may have no evidence, but we
can see the results.

So it is with criminal bankers.  We may have no evidence with which to
convict.  But we can see the results all around us.  Excuse me, SOME of
us can see the results.  Others are as willfully ignorant as the tobacco
lobbyists that still deny there is any proof that tobacco causes
cancer.
-- 


--------- All my opinions are tentative pending further data. ---------
------------ John W. Redelfs, cj195@cleveland.Freenet.edu -------------
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.news-media,alt.president.clinton
From: aq817@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Steve Crocker)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Yale Law One-World Government?
Date: 21 Jan 1993 08:10:57 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Ted, you say that somebody posted the CFR membership list, and you
found it no more impressive than the Yale Law alumni. I suspect you
are mistaken. The CFR membership includes 1500 people and makes a 
LONG document. I don't think I would have missed it here. Perhaps
you are confusing it with the substantially shorter list of 
Trilaterial Commission members which WAS posted here. I'd be interested
in the comparison with the Yale Law list, since I strongly suspect 
you're wrong. After all, the CFR issues invitations on the basis of
position and influence, while such is not automatically guaranteed to 
Yale Law graduates. Do you know of an accessible source for the Yale
Law list? The CFR list is found in their Annual Report which is 
available in most university libraries. (Go ahead and read it, be 
brave, it doesn't hurt. Really.)

-Steve
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: bill@ganesha.cognet.ucla.edu (William M. Eldridge)
Subject: Re: REVERSING THE SCALES OF INJUSTICE: If Iraq Occupied the 
Organization: UCLA Cognitive Science Research Program
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 00:24:21 GMT

In article <C165K9.7Mr@dartvax.dartmouth.edu> Mason.L.Allen@dartmouth.edu  
(Mason L. Allen) writes:
> BTW, I favour much stronger initiatives in the U.S. and elsewhere to
> limit the use of gas and to explore alt. sources of energy.  If the
> U.S. wasn't so goddam dependent on petro, we wouldn't have had ANY
> problem over there - it would have been left as a holy war between
> Isreal & Iraq.
> 
> m.


Somehow, I think the invasion of Kuwait didn't have much to do with
a holy war against Israel.
--
Bill Eldridge	 bill@cognet.ucla.edu
*** He who remembers the past is condemned to misread it. ***
				- George Santana
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: jmk@cbnews.cb.att.com (joseph.m.knapp)
Subject: Re: MK-ULTRA
Organization: AT&T
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 22:25:35 GMT
Keywords: MK-ULTRA,MK-DELTA,CIA,LSD-25,TSD,mind control,Manchurian Candidate

In article <C0DwEu.1JL@ais.org> seraphim@ais.org (Henry Hardy) writes:
>Anyone know if Owsley (sp?) is still alive?

Last I heard he is alive and well and selling designer belt buckles at
Dead concerts (I'm not kidding, he is running some scam... er business). 

---
Joe Knapp   jmk@cbvox.att.com
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:14783 alt.activism:21513 alt.society.civil-liberty:7547 alt.individualism:6300 alt.censorship:10154 misc.headlines:7588 soc.culture.usa:10278 alt.activism.d:4575
From: schoinas@fox.cs.wisc.edu (Yannis Schoinas)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa,alt.activism.d
Subject: Re: U.S. & Iraq
Date: 27 Jan 93 22:47:03 GMT
Organization: U of Wisconsin Madison - Computer Sciences

Mason.L.Allen@dartmouth.edu (Mason L. Allen) writes:


>In article <schoinas.727503335@cs.wisc.edu>
>schoinas@fox.cs.wisc.edu (Yannis Schoinas) writes:

>> His claim on Kuwait was a pretty good one, considering the
>>     artificial creation of most of the arabic countries. Nothing
>>     really to do with Hitler's claims. I am not saying that a
>>     panarabic union is politically viable.

>this is like my tenth reply or something to this debate,

>You seem to have a good grasp of history, Yannis (I respect that). 
>True, with the exception of Egypt, virtually every Middle Eastern state
>which exists now is an "artificial state" created by the withdrawal of
>the French & British Empires.  Historically, there is NO DIFFERENSE
>between the people of Iraq, Jordan, Syria, Saudi Arabia, the
>Palestinians, and whatever.  Before 1917 - 1946, they were ALL
>provinces in Empires.  Before the Europeans, they were in the Ottoman
>Empire.  There was NEVER an Iraq or a Kuwait as we now know them.  BUT,
>historically, Kuwait and Iraq were distinct provinces for centuries
>-since before the Turks, kept separate w/ different regional
>governments, diff. trading areas, etc.  That is exactly what happend in
>Europe w/ Hitler.  The states he conquered were nothing more than the
>remenants of provinces of the Russian, Polish-Lithuanian, and Hapsburg
>Empires.  There was never a Poland like this is today.  What was
>Czechoslovakia but a UNION OF WEST SLAVS???  But, I digress...

Well, it seems that we don't disagree. But if you take a few centuries
back, you will notice that France, Germany, Spain, Italy... were a 
conglomerate of people and traditions of much less uniformity than today's 
middle eastern arabic countries. Not that I am not talking about the african 
arabic countries or even Syria. Just the Arabian peninsula and Messopotamia. 
Sure, some countries in the area have a long history but so did Acquitaine[sp?] 
and Burgundy in France. Following the same logic more than 200 petty states in
Europe could have been easily created. In fact, they were created.

						 Bye,
						Yannis.
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy