HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: enough already.
Date: 29 Sep 92 02:28:50 GMT
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1992Sep28.173309.24418@osf.org> coren@osf.org (Robert Coren) writes:
(about my claim of having been on the motss.black-list at some time)

>But, Nelson, love, the big difference is that you (and JD, too, in
>whatever instance) had the sense not to turn it into a pissing contest.

I just must not be macho enough, dear.

Seriously, what I'm referring to are things that are (happily) faint
memories. Unlike what many motssers relate, I don't really remember
when I "demuffined". It didn't seem like a big deal - I was well
familiar with electronic forums, and I was already out to most
everyone, so posting to soc.motss just seemed natural.

But this also means I didn't read much before posting, and I was even
younger then than I am now, and I said some really stupid things.
Which stupid things, I don't remember. (if anyone has conveniently
accessible archives of this stuff, I think it would be useful for me
to read it.)

I well remember at least one pissing match with Clay Bond. I said
something stupid, and he flamed me. I tried to fight back, but of
course the way I tried to fight back was probably to defend the
indefensible things I said. 

His constant insults upset me. Finally, after some time, I just
resolved myself to the fact that Clay was going to be good at hurting
me, and that I would be better off just dealing with it. So I did, and
I was happier.

What hurt was that it seemd all of soc.motss was sided with Clay,
against me (yes, the cabal existed then). I got so tied up in the
emotions of the flame war that I stopped learning anything about the
problems with what I was actually saying. The thing that finally
turned it around for me was a few letters from motssers saying "look,
Clay's going really hard into you and you should just ignore it,
because he can be that way.  But you should think about what you are
saying, objectively, because it is not too clever."

>It's the insistence by all parties concerned on having the last word
>that drives the noise and nastiness levels up to near-intolerable.

It certainly doesn't help, does it?

Yours in soc.motss.nice,
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/        You stupid vulgar greedy ugly American death sucker
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: astrology and YOU
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 19:51:11 GMT

In article <mike02770920904132348@batpad.lgb.ca.us> mike@batpad.lgb.ca.us (mike batchelor) writes:

>(Of course, anybody born between August 1957 and November 1970 will
>have any conjuction with Uranus occurring in Scorpio, because this
>is how long it takes Uranus to cross that sign.)

Hah!  I'm on the cusp!  (November 12, 1970.)  I guess this explains
something about being bi ...

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "You are just naive and repressed because
\  / twpierce@unix.amherst.edu /  penis envy is here and it's now and it's
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /  all around you." -- Neal C. Wickham
From: markm@ogicse.ogi.edu (Mark Morrissey)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Professional meetings/conferences in Oregon?
Date: 1 Oct 92 01:26:40 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.43474
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute (formerly OGC), Beaverton, OR

In article <BvECwM.D7@world.std.com> entropy@world.std.com (The Entropic one) writes:
>It sucks that Oregon is going down the toilet, there seem to be alot of
>good jobs there.

Uh, please don't write us off quite yet, okay?

Oregon has a fairly large market for conferences and conventions.  Some
have already said that they will not come to Oregon if Measure 9 passes,
time will tell.  At this point, we only know that the Govenor's office
is predicting a falloff if the measure passes.  Given that Portland is
trying to become a major player in the convention business, this fact
could sway a lot of people who rely on convention dollars to vote against
measure 9 no matter what their personal feelings are on the subject.

I am not too sure how I would feel if Measure 9 was defeated but that
the OCA got a message which said "get them, but don't jeapadize the
convention trade".  Certainly wouldn't make me happy.

--mark
--
Mark Morrissey           One Hatred to rule them all.  One Hatred to find them.
markm@cse.ogi.edu        One Hatred to bring them all and in the darkness bind
                         them.  In the land of Bigotry where the Shadows lie.
From: anthropo@carina.unm.edu (Dominick V. Zurlo)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Surnames (was: TERMS OF ENDEARMENT)
Date: 6 Oct 92 17:38:06 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <1992Oct6.120800.2350@quantime.co.uk> roger@quantime.co.uk (Roger Phillips) writes:
>In article <84dpwtf@lynx.unm.edu>,
>anthropo@carina.unm.edu (Dominick V. Zurlo) writes:
>> >>... what on earth
>> >>could one do with "Seebacher" and "Winnig"?
>> 
>> I like Win-bach-ing, Winbaching, sounds like Win (as in a race)
>> bach (as in batch) ing (as in ing)
>
>I thought the "bach" part would be pronounced
>as in "Bacharach" rather than as in "bachelor".
 Yeah, but it sounds better the other way!!! :)
>
>> What about Zurlo and Guiney?  I thought of Zurney or Guilo,
>> but they don't sound too catchy to me.
>
>How about Gurley? :-)
Well I had actually thought of this, but it is much too like my 
ex-'s actual last name, Hurley.  
I asked David last night about all this, and he says he'll just take my 
name becuase he doesn't really like the way it sounds, but mine sounds more
like a stage name!  A stage name! Huhn! i was offended (not really, but...)
What y'all think???
>
>Ok, this may be premature
>(it's only been 10 days so far),
>but for Phillips and Juffs,
>all I can think of is Jips or Phluffs.
>Please help.
Phuflips (puff-lips)  heh heh :)
Pulfips  (pool-fips)  hah hah :)
Jullips  (like the drink with mint)  Tasty.  :)

Flapjack
"Yes, I'm bi - both top and bottom."
or as my daughter says:
"Yes I'm bi - I just buy and buy and buy...."
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Re: Madonna offers haven to Diana
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 07:06:02 GMT

anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:


>In article <7463@charon.cwi.nl> waal@cwi.nl (Peter de Waal)
>writes:

>CNN reported last night that Bill Gates is the richest
>American, with $6.7 billion, roughly $320,000 for each day
>of my life.

(Pssst! I'm related to #'s 24, 25, and 26 (on last year's list, anyway).
Someone please let them know they owe me back allowance *big* *time*!)

>I could even afford a few
>scholarships to my special camp here in Madison, I think.  I
>know any number of delicious young men who would love me
>*really and truly*, too.  Some of them are Dutch!

So, like, what should all us happy campers pack, anyway?

--
John Dorrance * Alleged Homosexual/Shameless Hussy * thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu

			Dark. Handsome. 6 feet tall.
		  31 flavors? I believe he's got 'em all!
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mdrayton@sr.hp.com (Mike Drayton)
Subject: Re: Lesbian/Gay Square Dancing (great idea!!) :)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara Division
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1.1 PL5
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 20:21:12 GMT

A Usenet Pal (asente@adobe.com) wrote:
        [about square dancing stereotypes]
> ... people in funny clothes
> stomping around and do-si-doing in a barn while some old geezer saws away
> at a fiddle and spouts off incomprehensible nonsense about shucking clams.
The best square dance I ever had a chance to be at was at Mt.
Pleasant, Iowa's Old Threshers' Reunion in 1972.  Funny clothes?
Well, some people _did_ have overalls on.  It was an impromptu dance,
no matching outfits, no "choreography", no shucking.  Some jiving.
A couple people were clog-dancing through all the figures, which was
pretty entertaining.

> Traditional square dancing has a rather limited vocabulary of steps.
> Usually each dance is choreographed in advance, and is taught just before
> doing it.
Actually, the dances are often pretty old, so to say they're
choreographed is not really accurate; they're just passed along.

> A complete novice can come to a traditional square dance and
> participate fully.  
I'd say this is a feature, not a bug.

> Most traditional square dancing is done to traditional
> folk tunes, usually played by a fiddle band.  It is often combined with
> contra dancing (a New England folk dance done in lines) at an evening.
This is not true (in my experience) in small-town settings, but is
kind of an innovation in urban areas.  Contras and squares come from
separate (but equal?) traditions.

> A caller is present to call out what steps to do, but the steps are
> predictable from what was taught at the beginning.
Good calling is an art form unto itself, at least as my older friends
in Missouri did it.  Maintaining a constant patter with an interesting
rhythm and a cohesive rhyme scheme was just as important as directing
the dancers.  Using a "musical voice", i.e. calling at a pitch that
relates harmonically to the music is part of it, too.

> At an IAGSDC dance, you won't find any fiddles...
More's the pity.  My interest in square dancing is mostly because I'm
a fiddle player.  I have a great deal of affection for traditional 
music and dance of all kinds.

ObMotss:  I loved the people from whom I learned this stuff, but I
don't know if I could go and visit them anymore (if they were still
alive).  I don't think I could survive in those communities.  

Mike Drayton      mdrayton@sr.hp.com       Hewlett-Packard Co.
                                           Santa Rosa, California
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: CABAL stuff
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:16:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Oct5.191625.2062
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1992Oct5.164742.7553@panix.com> ro@panix.com (r l reid) writes:
>What I even less like is that when I order non-meat dishes, someone
>always wants you to explain your reason for not eating meat - even
>if it's just at this meal.

I think Ro here is a classic case of internalized vegetarianaphobia.
You've got to be PROUD of your queerness, Ro. Shout it out to the
world, in black Antique Olive Bold on orange, "Vegetables make me
hot, meat makes me vomit".

Veggie pride,
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                   There is absolutely no other possibility
From: JAJONE02@UKCC.UKY.EDU
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Kentucky sodomy law update
Date: 29 Sep 92 03:15:49 GMT
Organization: University of Kentucky

On last Thurs., Sept. 24, 1992, the Kentucky Supreme Court handed down a decisi
on (4 to 3) that Kentucky's same sex only sodomy law was unconstitutional in th
at it violated an implied right to privacy in the STATE constitution as well as
 right to equal protection under the law (only homosexuals punished).  This dec
ision upheld two lower court decisions deriving from the 1986 arrest of Jeffrey
 Wasson outside of a Lexington, KY, gay bar.  An undercover policeman engaged W
asson in conversation leading up to an invitation to come back to Wasson's home
 after 20 min. of chatting.  The officer then drew out details of what would
happen in Wasson's home and then arrested him on solicitation to commit sodomy.
  Sodomy in Kentucky is defined as oral-anal, anal-genital or oral-gential cont
act between members of the same sex.  The decision in Commonwealth of Kentucky
v. Jeffrey Wasson et al. effectively repeals the KY sodomy law.  All private
consensual sex acts between adults are thus legal here now.
 
This is the first sodomy law overturned since the advent of AIDS and the infamo
us Bowers v. Hardwick decision in 1986 in the US Supreme Court.  Besides New Yo
rk, Kentucky is the only state to thus far overturn its sodomy statutes via the
court system.  Michigan's court challenge appears to be effectively dead and th
e Texas decision is still pending.  Oral arguments before the TX Supreme Court
are not until January.  So, Kentucky becomes the 26th state to overturn its sod
omy law:  the majority of US states now are "free states."  24 other states and
the District of Columbia still have these laws on the books and many states sti
ll enforce them.
 
The 3 dissenting judges' opinions held that public health (AIDS) and traditiona
l Judeo-Christian morality should uphold the law.  Also, they felt that privacy
 was too broadly defined and could lead to consensual incest (oh pleez!) and
home drug usage.  The majority opinion to overturn the law bluntly said that th
e decision was not a stamp of approval of homosexuality but said that homosexua
were inferred as a class of people needing protections because this law was cla
erly aimed at them.
 
______________________________________________________________
   Jeff Jones                         JAJONE02@ukcc.uky.edu
   University of Kentucky    "Clinton/Gore '92"
   "It probably sounded better in the original German."
      -Molly Ivins with The Nation on Pat Buchanan's speech at
       the GOP convention
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Subject: Re: Phyllis Schaffly's son John . . . COMES OUT NATIONALLY!
Followup-To: rec.cooking
Summary: TITTY SAUCE YAMS (part II)
Organization: dubious
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 02:21:28 GMT

[we are creeping up fast on george herter's recipe...]

     An African woman named Canary Richardson who was a cook on a
Northeastern Georgia plantation [where *does* he get this
information?]  made the following recipe based on the honey and water
tit mixture.  It is the greatest recipe ever made with the yam or
sweet potato [he adds, in case you'd forgotten, since two short
paragraphs before, that these expressions are synonyms] and one that
will bring you instant compliments.  [ooooh]

[well, not *quite* there yet...]


Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: balistik@big-brother.nevada.edu (Shawn Hicks)
Subject: Re: Ah, Fashion.
Organization: Not yet, but we're working on it...
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 23:14:38 GMT

In article <67103@cup.portal.com>, Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:
>Shawn Hicks writes:
>>I agree.  Lots of therapy.  Lots of big, hairy men with perky
>>nipples and red hair is a good start.  Maybe a few with long
>>shaggy beards that tickle, or butts so matted with fur that
>>you can't tell the hills from the valleys.  And when I'm all
>
>This part is nice.
>
>>better, I'll let them shave me.  Hair grows back.
>
>This part is obscene.  Just because you can paint over it,
>does that mean there's nothing wrong with graffiti?

Depends.  If the person who owns the wall wants the graffiti
there, then yes, it is ok. 

>Or, just because you can have it stitched up and it will heal,
>does that mean it's OK for me to cut you up?

If I ask you to, sure.  This comming friday a very accomplished
woman will insert a needle into my body and follow it with
a metal ring.  It'll heal. 

Of course your analogy is blown a bit out of proportion.  After
all, hair is not living, and cutting has no effect on it, or
the body it is attached to.  I don't think tattoos, piercings,
and military haircuts are obscene, and I can find no reason
why anyone else should, but you are welcome to your opinions.

>>George, why would anyone want to mar you in that way?  Besides,
>
>You'll have to ask the chain of fools who keep proposing this
>abomination to me.

Perhaps they are teasing, knowing how animated you become.


Shawn
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Re: Out in a snap (was Re: Ah, Fashion.)
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
	<1992Oct2.142611.28583@macc.wisc.edu> <1992Oct2.210635.22012@panix.com>
	<1992Oct5.210449.10346@uoft02.utoledo.edu> <36316@hoptoad.uucp>
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 16:23:41 GMT

On 6 Oct 92 08:28:09 GMT, laura@hoptoad.uucp (Laura Creighton) said:

>> Or do you, like most men who do not live with women, send your shirts
>> "out"?

Laura> Being able to afford wash&fold is something that only the most poor
Laura> cannot afford, and only the most miserly would resent.  Yet I meet
Laura> women well able to afford wash&fold, who instead go to the
Laura> laundromat.  It's noble.  It's a duty.  It's a royal pain in the
Laura> butt.

Laura> ---------------

Laura> I just wish that men didn't assume that men without women don't
Laura> do their own washing, and women, especially women with men,
Laura> understood that *they didn't have to*.

Laura> Wash&Fold.

Forget Wash&Fold--send your cotton shirts to the laundry and
get them back starched and ironed on hangars.  I _love_ sliding
into a nice crispy medium-starched smoothly ironed Hawaiian print
shirt.  Prying the top edge of the pocket loose to clip my badge
on--oh the ripping noise.  Sometimes it's nice to have a little
pleasure at 0530.

I don't go to the laundromat because I have a washer and dryer.  If
I didn't, however, everything would go to Wash&Fold.  Life is too
damned short to save a buck a load, to sit on excruciatingly badly
designed plastic chairs in a hot, humid room full of screaming
children, afraid to leave lest someone take your sheets home with
them.

Even with my own washer and dryer, I still take things to Wash&Fold.
Mostly oversized articles like king-sized vellux blankets that my
dryer can't handle.

I have someone who comes in and cleans my house, too.  And someone
else to mow the lawns and pick up after the dogs and wash the cars.

I'm still a good woman, a "womanly" woman, even if I don't sacrifice
my life on the altar of domesticity.  And I can spend all the time
I save doing needlepoint or reading murder mysteries.

--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "There's no kill like a guns kill." LCDR "Hoser" Satrapa, gunnery instructor
                       "A kill is a kill."  Anonymous
From: richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: evil twins
Date: 5 Oct 92 20:38:33 GMT
Organization: Xiola Blue

John Dorrance writes:

>*snif* Well. Can I be a flood hazard instead?

Depends on how you are flagging.

Besides, you have Special Points in my book for naming a group of
young men wandering about bored at a shopping mall as a "Twinkie Fun Pak".
-- 
a flying squirrel is: richard@apple.com  Apple Computer Inc.

i'm your girl            friend
i'm your squirrel        friend
i'm your round the world friend

cruising: vidi, vici, veni.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon)
Subject: Re: Ah, Fashion.
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 19:46:17 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer, Inc.
Followup-To: soc.motss

> In a previous article someone wrote this about Madonna:
> 
> > She is, perhaps, the most famous woman
> > in the world - which confers wealth - but how she got there has more
> > to do with a tremendous sense not only of self-promotion, but of 
> > knowing *what* to promote.
> 
> Marlene Dietrich (want to talk icons, baby?) 
> put her finger on the difference between herself 
> and Madonna: "I acted vulgar; she *is* vulgar".  
> Madonna is the Jayne Mansfield of the '80s and,
> if we're really unlucky, '90s.

Almost predictable.  But what would Marlene Dietrich be today
(other than an old woman)?  Neither as good an actress as Merle
Streep (sp?) nor as good an icon as Madonna.  Dietrich may have
'acted' vulgar, in her day (even earlier, I suppose, than your day...),
but in the here and now, she'd be anything but vulgar.  On a good
day, she'd be quaint.  On a bad day, passe.  Madonna is just 'acting'
vulgar - same sense, different decade.

Greta Garbo and Monroe,
Dietrich and DiMaggio.
Marlon Brando, Jimmy Dean.

On the cover of a magazine...

Melmothra, ACC
From: mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Camille Paglia on fashion (was Re: Ah, Fashion.)
Date: 5 Oct 92 16:24:54 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss
Organization: Apple Computer, Inc.

In article <1992Oct3.000245.25659@reed.edu>, nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
wrote:
> 
> I don't normally like to respond to people being this stupid, but I
> feel libeled:
> 
> In article <1992Oct2.184745.27510@gallant.apple.com>
> mcmelmon@taligent.com (Matthew C. Melmon) writes:
> >Nelson surprises me in e-mail with a textbook example of the Liberal
> >Wannabe Intellectual mantra: a random sampling of society doesn't
> >count, because they are 'mostly stupid people.'
> 
> this is a misrepresentation of what I said, as well as being taken out
> of context. If Mr. Melmon had asked my permission to say this, I
> would have requested that he did not.

Context.  Rather difficult to take the remark out of context.  'A random
group is mostly stupid, but only in context'  Bullshit, Nelson.  Note
the capital 'B.'  Nor was it a 'misrepresentation.'  The words 'mostly
stupid people' are an exact quote.

It ain't libel when it's the truth, snookums.

Melmothra, ACC
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: ry@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (ryerson.schwark)
Subject: Re: enough already.
Organization: UNIX System Laboratories, Summit, NJ
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 14:05:13 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.225650.3389@PacBell.COM> rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams) writes:
>
>Oh!  OK.  Speaking of blessed, did I ever tell you any of my
>altar-boy stories...?

No, but you're going to, aren't you?


Ry
ry@usl.com
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue)
Subject: Re: Ah, Fashion.
Organization: insert anything here
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 17:34:52 GMT

Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:
>() Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable
>() that we have to alter it every six months.
>()      -- Oscar Wilde
>-----

	That is a great quote.

	How come things that are SO *incredible to die for the ultimate
in sexy trendy I would kill to wear something like that* look so
pathetically awful later on?  The clothing doesn't change... but there
are lots of things that people ran out to be seen in that they wouldn't
be caught DEAD in now.

	Seems to be this change of worth is pretty indicative of the
lack of worth in "fashion" as any sort of qualifier to someone's
beauty.

BBC
From: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Faggots
Summary: IN CASE OF HYDROGEN BOMB ATTACK (part II)
Date: 1 Oct 92 00:07:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: cis.1992Oct1.000736.15479
Followup-To: alt.end-of-the-world
Organization: earnestly practicing faggots

[item 3e...]

Have six number x1 1/2 traps and two twenty foor coils of woven
picture frame wire for snares. Have 100 fish hooks in assorted
sizes and 200 yards of nylon fishing line in a variety of weights.
The above items can supply your family meat, fowl, and fish if
properly used.

[other uses could be imagined...]
From: dh0a@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (DONALD L. HARDY)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: gay science fiction
Date: 6 Oct 92 12:33:54 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University


CJ Cherryh' "Cyteen" series has two main characters (Justin and Grant) who are
lovers, though it is not a major issue.

A nice read.  I like her stuff.
>I'll try to think of any others....
>
>Tim
>--
>Tim Mansfield                                         timbomb@cs.uq.oz.au
>Dept of Comp Sci, Uni of Qld, Australia, 4072           +61 (0)7 365 2956
>"Nothing is wrong with the idea that there would be a God...
>               who changes the water." mvs@softway.oz (Mark V. Shaney)
>
-- 

******************************************************************************

Donald L. Hardy                                    Office of Physical Planning
Project Planner                                    Lehigh University
dh0a@lehigh.edu                                    (215) 758 5110