HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tovey@mullauna.cs.mu.OZ.AU (Gadget)
Subject: Re: Question about hit points.
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 09:25:10 GMT

rworkman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Ryan Workman) writes:

>Why would a fireball normally kill a 0 level fighter while just singing a
>10th level fighter?
>Both would have equal chance of "avoiding" or defending against such an
>attack.  There seems to be an incongruency here.  Can anyone help?

I think a 10th level fighter has more chance of avoiding a fireball than his
0 level friend. By the time he gets to 10th level, he's almost certainly
seen a few! Maybe he drops to the ground instinctively, or maybe he knows
something of the words to the spell, or maybe something else. Sure you can
find other spells to which these explanations don't work, or it could be
fired from a wand or something, but my rationalisation is that he's a 10th
level fighter, and I'm just a role-player. I can't explain all his abilities
and knowledge.
Gadget
Matt Tovey             |  Commpower Engineering | tovey@mullauna.cs.mu.OZ.AU
Voice: 61-3-419-4716   |  Melbourne,            | "Tomorrow's ideas on
Fax:   61-3-419-4716   |  Australia.            |       yesterday's technology"
Hone:  61-3-417-6528   |                        |
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: dagolden@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Alexandre Golden)
Subject: Re: Walking Bandages
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:32:58 GMT

In article <2573@cix.cict.fr> maillet@tls-cs.cert.fr (Luc Maillet) writes:
>In article <1993Jan5.220717.21737@Princeton.EDU>, dagolden@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Alexandre Golden) writes:

>>[my proposition for making healing prof. more common and more powerful]
>
>  IMHO, this makes the healing proficiency both too useful and too common.
>I mean, why bother with CLWs anymore ( at low levels ) ? And this distinction of
>"smaller wounds" is just the one that give the Cure LIGHT wounds its name... Not
>to mention the fact that, if powerful ( for everyday people ) is common, then the
>world becomes very different ( Middle Ages people were famous for their fear of
>injury. Curing 1-8 or 1-8 hp means bringing a 0-level peasant from 1 hp back to
>full health if you're lucky ( 1/6 or 1/8 chances ).

Well, the original post was looking for ways that the cleric wouldn't be a
"hit point battery" (to use an expression from a campaign I'm in).  I question
the logic that it's too powerful just because cure LIGHT wounds exists.  Why
have lanterns if there is a spell called "light" then?  There CAN be non-
magical solutions to problems.

Second, while the middle ages may have been known for fear of injury, DND is
NOT necessarily the middle ages (magic?).  I assume some level of medical
knowledge is not improbable in any society that can research magic.  As for
healing that 0-level peasant... Why not? 

Scenario 1:
  Gee, he's been gashed open.  Lets wrap a bandage (poultice) around it.  Oh,
it's infected, let's take him to the leech and drain some blood.  Oh darn, he
died.

Scenario 2:
  Gee, he's been gashed open.  Quick, clean the wound with alcohol.  Get some
sterile needles and thread.  Sew him up.  Put clean bandages on.  Much better
chance of survival.

>  I'd rather let the PCs learn caution in their dealings with their foes. If
>fight becomes more dangerous and healing is infrequent, then life increases in
>value...

Uh, yeah, but you wind up with more dead PC's that way.  (Maybe that's
acceptable in your campaign, I don't know.)  And if you really want to make
them value life, why not get rid of healing altogether?  Then the PC's really
have an incentive to learn caution.  They might just decide to stay home
instead.





-- 
David A. Golden '95           (dagolden@phoenix.princeton.edu)
Princeton University
From: tfoley@camaro.uucp (Tim Foley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: D&D and Christianity
Date: 7 Jan 93 12:53:06 GMT
Organization: camaro

In article <79152@hydra.gatech.EDU> tmiller@prism.gatech.EDU (Thomas Miller) writes:
>
>  The problem is, the "Satan-haters" (I think you meant the anti-rpg
>people) aren't reading this.  They're either in other newsgroups or
>else not on the net at all.  We can make a million good points here,
>but most of the anti-rpg crowd will never hear them...and I was told 
>that the previously mentioned soc. newsgroup is moderated, and that
>pro-rpg arguments never make it (never get posted by the moderator)...
>No wonder the anti-rpg people persist and prosper.

  Hmm, I have to agree with you there.  But since their bloody faq made it 
over to our group, I think it should be more than fair to post a message to 
the moderator, in a fair, and *non flame* manner to bring the discussion 
into a more open/war-like area (ie. comp.sys.amiga.advocacy...just kidding 
:)
   The moderator of the christian group is probably some devout church 
go-er, and would not take kindy to starting a flame war in his newsgroup, so 
if we word the message well enough, he might just post it.
 
  Jeez, this reminds me of the days of MADD, I just recently went into a 
drugstore and some guy was handing out leaflets to support MADD, at first I 
was getting ready to slug this guy and stuff these leaflets down his throut, 
but after reading the leaflet, its on Drinking & driving, they stole the 
other name that the Mothers against D&D were using...gotta like it.
 
  Just out of curoiosity, did any of you have the ISCF back in your 
highschool days?  We did, the Inter school christian 
fellowship...oh...boy...with us across the hall in the D&D club and them in 
the iscf, things got quite interesting, I wonder if ISCF is still around 
these days?  I know D&D clubs are.... :)
 
 
		DDAMADD   (pronounced Damn Mad)
 
   D&D against Mothers against D&D
 


-- 
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------
               The HeartBeat of America...Yesterdays Camaro Z28 
                             tfoley@camaro.uucp   
     Call the Camaro Linux Pub-access site: 1-416-238-6550 USRobotics HST
    Note: Please, no ftpmail or mailing lists or the host gets annoyed :)
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: jdelisle@udel.edu (J. G. Delisle)
Subject: Re: Question about hit points.
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Boyz from the Dwarf
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 03:09:00 GMT

In article <C0ptL5.3up@mentor.cc.purdue.edu>, rworkman@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Ryan Workman) writes...
>What are hit points really suppose to represent?

	Hit points represent (in humans/demi-humans), the skill with which
lethal blows are made nonlethal (for example, two fighters take 25 hit points
of damage. The 20th level fighter knows how to soften the blow, so he 
survives. A first level fighter doesn't know that, and is killed instantly.)

>Why would a fireball normally kill a 0 level fighter while just singing a
>10th level fighter?

	The 10th level fighter knows has more experience handling magical
attacks, and how to roll with the flames. The 0 level fighter knows how to
hold a sword and carry a shield. Nothing more.

>Both would have equal chance of "avoiding" or defending against such an
		 ^^^^^
>attack.  There seems to be an incongruency here.  Can anyone help?

	Since when do level 10 and level 0 fighters have the same saving
throws? The 10th level knows what to do in the situation of a magical attack,
the 0 level knows squat... as a result, the 10th level has about a 50% chance
of halving the damage (by rolling, dropping to the ground, etc), but the
newbie fighter doesn't know that, so has a much lower chance of making his
save (roughly 15% chance of success). No incongruency here.

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| From the terminal of Joe Delisle  |  Don't open your eyes, take it from me |
| jdelisle@loyola.edu  (preferred)  |  I have found, you can find, happiness |
| jdelisle@cs.loyola.edu            |  is slavery.  -- NIN                   |
|              "I was up above it, but now I'm down in it"                   |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: larwick2476@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: NEW AD&D Character Generator
Date: 11 Jan 93 21:11:09 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

   Hello, All you gaming enthusiasts...

   I have just finished (partially) a AD&D 2nd Edition Character Generator
program written for the MSDOS machine in TURBO PASCAL.

   The program does the following:
      -Get's character's name
      -Can choose any roll-up method from PHB/DMG
      -Can choose to have 1's rerolled on dice
      -Can scan through and choose any race from the PHB (stat dependent)
      -Can choose sex
      -Calculates Height
      -Calculates Weight
      -Calculates Current Age and Maximum Age

   I have plans to add Classes, proficiencies, money, possessions (?), and any
other ideas that anyone has.

   PLEASE DOWNLOAD THIS PROGRAM AND SEND ME SOME FEEDBACK... IT IS A VERY SMALL
PROGRAM THAT ONLY TAKES UP 29K OF DISK SPACE.

   Send all FEEDBACK/OPINIONS to:     larwick2476 @ iscsvax.uni.edu

      Hope you get some use out of this program ...

      I posted it to wustl.wuarchive.edu in the /pub/MSDOS_UPLOADS directory
under the name of DNDGENV1.EXE

   Until Later,

         Bret Larwick
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: boyd@colonial.eecs.umich.edu (Eric Boyd)
Subject: Re: Cursed Items - Why?
Keywords: magic items, cursed items, wizards
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor, MI
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 16:17:30 GMT

I always liked the "cursed sword of beserking, +1". While any player
might consider this weapon "cursed", the slightly cowardly barbarian
chieftan for which it was forged loved it as it ensured he was at the
front of any battle, and hence strengthened his position of leadership!
-- 
    _/_/_/  _/_/    _/  _/_/_/      _/_/_/  _/_/_/ _/  _/  _/_/
   _/	   _/  _/  _/  _/          _/  _/  _/  _/  _/_/   _/  _/
  _/_/_/  _/_/    _/  _/          _/_/    _/  _/   _/    _/  _/
 _/ 	 _/  _/  _/  _/          _/  _/  _/  _/   _/    _/  _/
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: kurgan@spock.uucp (Andrew Twyman)
Subject: Re: Walking Bandages
Organization: Choate Rosemary Hall
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 15:39:35 GMT

In article <1ib3lbINNba9@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> pkralik@ecst.csuchico.edu (Wintermute) writes:
>Greetings!
>
>	I am in the process of creating a campaign, and as I was thinking of
>what I did and didn't like about AD&D, I reached this dilemma...
>
>I often play Clerics, and it seems that every time I do, I wind up in the 
>position of being viewed as the party's walking first aid kit.  I find that
>I am unable to be very creative with my PC's spell selection.  Anytime I take
>a non-healing spell, i.e. one i would like to experiment with, and we come 
>across a combat situation, I feel a little guilty about not having that extra
>CLW for the front line fighters, etc.  I was wondering how, as a dm, I could
>help to prevent this from happening to PC Clerics.  I really hate to limit
>the combat encounters because of a lack of clerics, but if I don't, and there 
>aren't enough clerics, the players get upset about having to trek back and 
>forth to find a church, healer, etc.  I really enjoy playing clerics, but I 
>just feel that it would be more enjoyable if there were more, i dunno, maybe
>freedom in the spells I could take.  There has to be more to being a cleric
>than cleansing wounds and curing diseases.  I have been toying with the idea
>of using a system whereby the Cleric would get "faith points" for various 
>activities of a "true clerical" nature.  I think that this might help to 
>emphasize the other aspects of being a cleric. 

	In our campaigns we play with Clerics being able to call for their
spells as they need them, with the spell progression representing the number
of spells of each level that a Cleric can cast before having to pray to regain
those spell abilities.  This allows the Clerics to use healing spells if they
need them, but call for other spells when they are not currently healing.  We
also believe that it makes more sense for gods to grant spells on demand,
rather than using the mage-like memorization system.  Perhaps you guys should
try it.  I've played some really good Clerics under this system.
						-Kurgan
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  -"I have something to say.  It's better to burn out, than to fade away!"-  |
|                          -* THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE *-                        |
kurgan@choate.edu--------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: mpd48941@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Mike Duff)
Subject: Magic Item Creation
Reply-To: duff@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 09:10:10 GMT

Has anyone come up with a decent way to determine how much a newly-created
magic item is worth in XP and GP?  I've been guessing up until now, but I was
wondering if anyone had gone to the trouble of making a set of parameters
up and gauging worth from that...

Also...
Does anyone have a fairly extensive list(on file) of the magic items from
1st ed.?  I have all the books, but I really would like to incorporate the
info into a little program I'm going to write.  I'll use the NET.SPELL...'s
but I would like to have the original listings as well if possible.

Thanks

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Michael Duff                | "Thank you for bringing up such a painful     | 
| ACM membership coord.       |  subject.  While you're at it, why don't you  |
| U. of Illinois- U/Champaign |  give me a nice paper cut and pour lemon      |
| duff@cs.uiuc.edu            |  juice on it."        - Miracle Max           |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: by670@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Marc-Eivind Cruz Evensen)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: No Healers
Date: 10 Jan 1993 20:50:47 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


On the question of advantages of not having a healer, there is really only one.
This comes in the form of a role-playing aspect instead of a group-power
aspect. The absence of a healer forces the party to think and work together
instead of just blundering through adventures. I've always believed that
priestly "miracles" have come to easily and that healing priests (or the
players which control them) trivialize the fact that a god is empowering
him to heal a companion. (Ah, but I digress)

Lack of a healer forces cooperation and forethought into a group, not such
a bad thing if you need it.

Just a thought.

-- Marc
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: tovey@mullauna.cs.mu.OZ.AU (Gadget)
Subject: Re: No Healers
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 04:26:02 GMT

ross@lclark.edu (Anthony Ross) writes:
>The party I'm DMing right now has one priest (with no access to healing
>spells), no one with healing/herbalism proficiencies, and no healing
>potions. Have others been in this situation before? If so, what are some

I was in a group which survived for several years without any healing magic
Occasionally we were given a healing item from a temple who were interested
in our quest, but they never lasted very long. :-)
  Generally the lack of healing never made much difference to our party...
Whenever we were injured, or facing a challenge we would rest awhile. We
divided our hitpoints into two catergories... body and avoidance.
body was your level plus your CON, and avoidance was the rest. The theory was
that in adventurers of highish level, most of your hitpoints were not actual
damage, but loss of 'energy' through having to exert yourself to avoid a 
blow. As such we recovered (I think) 1 point of body/day (as per rules) and
5 point of avoidance/day. It was given that a weeks rest was enough to heal
all avoidance. We had the additional restriction given that unconsciousness
would put a party member out of any physical action (including standing,
walking) for a week.
  (NB. A week in our world was 9 days)
  Basically the only time our lack of healing made any difference to us was
in the longer dungeons where we would have to find a secure place to rest
every now and then.

Oh also. We never had any ressurection magic. This probably had a greater
effect on the party than the lack of 'healing'. Once you get upto the stage
of the campaign where all of the party have good saving throws and good hit
points (about 12th level) and the standard spells cease to have any immediate
danger, and the ol' instant death spells start appearing in your own and the
enemy wizard's spellbooks, then things become a bit more serious.
  For instance, the time my character, who I had been playing for 3 real
years, died, I retired her permanently. Unlike some characters who seem to get
used to dieing periodically, I couldn't handle this. I chose to let her go.
(This had a pretty severe effect on MY psyche!)

Questions welcome...
Gadget

Matt Tovey 	       |  Commpower Engineering	|	
                       |  Melbourne,		| tovey@mullauna.cs.mu.OZ.AU
Voice: 61-3-419-4716   |  Australia.		| "Tomorrow's ideas on
Fax:   61-3-419-4716   |			|       yesterday's technology"
From: tmiller@prism.gatech.EDU (Thomas Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: D&D and Christianity
Date: 5 Jan 93 18:03:03 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article <lkjcn6INNq70@kara-kum.cs.utexas.edu>, brinkley@cs.utexas.edu (Paul Brinkley) writes:


<several good points deleted>


> But think about this, Satan-haters:  If you give the chance to a party of
> good and neutral characters to slay a city-full of peasants for experience,
> they'll most likely turn it down.
> 


  The problem is, the "Satan-haters" (I think you meant the anti-rpg
people) aren't reading this.  They're either in other newsgroups or
else not on the net at all.  We can make a million good points here,
but most of the anti-rpg crowd will never hear them...and I was told 
that the previously mentioned soc. newsgroup is moderated, and that
pro-rpg arguments never make it (never get posted by the moderator)...
No wonder the anti-rpg people persist and prosper.





Thomas Miller



Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: ldusseau@chimera.UWaterloo.ca (Lisa Dusseault)
Subject: Re: Cursed Items - Why?
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 01:50:21 GMT

In article <79522@hydra.gatech.EDU> ccoprdj@prism.gatech.EDU (Jorge Diaz)  
writes:
> In article <1993Jan8.005616.9419@lclark.edu*> ross@lclark.edu (Anthony  
Ross) writes:
> 
> [Why would a mage make a cursed magic item?]
> 

Here's what my mage (and most others I've encountered) would think:

"Hmm.  I've just made an extremely powerful item.  It occurs to me that
if my enemies got hold of this, I'd be in a bad spot.  I also don't want
my rival across the street to kill me just to get this.  I know!  I'll
curse it, so that if any but I touch it, they'll turn to frogs."

With this reasoning, one would find many, many, many more cursed items
than useful items in a dungeon.  The items are not truly cursed since one
(or more) people can use it, but probably that wizard is now dead, so
effectively the item is cursed.

Lisa
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: phaedrus@halcyon.com (Mark Phaedrus)
Subject: Re: Cursed Items - Why?
Organization: The 23:00 News and Mail Service
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 04:25:39 GMT

In article <C0nvED.M10@bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au> kinsler@newton.physics.uq.oz.au (Paul Kinsler) writes:
>Yeah. but its no fun if the PC can just throw the cursed sword away, is it?
>
>Either you lie through your teeth to the player:
>PC: i do ... 8 +3plusses, ... eleven points!
>DM: well, actually your sword also does double damage this round, so thats 22!
>    (dm marks off 8-3 = 5 points)
>DM: but this must be a tough orc - obviously a leader type, it is still alive...
>which can be a pain to keep track of...
>Or you just say:
>DM: This sword somehow keeps forcing you to wield it in combat. It also seems
>    be -3.

     I think you're operating under a faulty assumption here; namely, that the
players are somehow contractually entitled to know, down to the point and the
plus, exactly what the modifiers are in their rolls and how much damage they're
doing when they hit.  I've never played under a DM who operated this way.
In almost all the groups I've played or DM'ed in, the players still get to
make their "to hit" rolls, but all damage rolls are secret.  Then the DM
describes, in genuine English words, what the result looks like to the players.
"Your attack cuts several inches deep into the orc's side; blood gushes forth,
and its knees buckle, but it keeps staggering toward you."  (Or, in the case
of a "hit" that actually isn't due to a curse, "You barely nick the orc, not 
even drawing blood.  It laughs as it presses its counterattack."  This has two
advantages; it greatly enhances the atmosphere (the monsters don't seem so
much like collections of stats anymore), and it gives the GM much greater
latitude to keep unknown modifiers unknown.
-- 
\o\ Internet: phaedrus@halcyon.com  (Seattle, WA Public Access Unix)     \o\
 \o\ "How'd you like to move a few steps down the food chain, pal?"       \o\
  \o\ If you enjoy fantasy/SF stories with transformation themes, email me \o\
   \o\ for a copy of the Transformation Stories List.                       \o\
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd