From: lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU (LaMonte Koop)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: A4000 at WOC
Date: 14 Sep 92 16:00:16 GMT
 <1992Sep13.025524.16629@tronsbox.xei.com> <1992Sep13.145220.1204@msus1.msus.edu>,<1992Sep14.034736.24755@tronsbox.xei.com>
Reply-To: lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
Organization: St. Cloud State University, St. Cloud, MN

In article <1992Sep14.034736.24755@tronsbox.xei.com>, bleys@tronsbox.xei.com (Bill Cavanaugh) writes:
>In article <1992Sep13.145220.1204@msus1.msus.edu> lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU writes:
>>In article <1992Sep13.025524.16629@tronsbox.xei.com>, bleys@tronsbox.xei.com (Bill Cavanaugh) writes:
>>>In article <1992Sep12.162130.1197@msus1.msus.edu> lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU writes:
>>>>In article <1992Sep12.193651.17020@cco.caltech.edu>, keith@cco.caltech.edu (Keith Allan Schneider) writes:
>>>>>He wasn't using a second hand report.  He was using mine.  I tried one of the
>>>>>things out, and it was much slower (in 256 color mode) than my A3000 in
>>>>>16 color mode.
>>>>
>>>>Which is second hand from Marc's perspective.  It is a matter of opinion as
>>>>to the speed of the system in the 256 color mode.  Some feel it is faster than
>>>>you say, some slower.  This one point is highly subjective in this setting.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Wrong.  That report is second-hand data from Marc's perspective, but
>>
>>Exactly what I said, please re-read before you post to flame.
>>
>
>Actually, what you said was:
>lkoop@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU (LaMonte Koop) writes:
>>    Interesting enough how you are making your own assumptions based upon
>>second and third hand reports.
>
>I was pointing out that it was a first-hand report;  a report from
>someone who's hands actually touched the machine.

If you wish to use that viewing, fine.  Yet, the point has somehow been lost
here...

>>
>>Well, in fact it is you who is playing semantic games, and in that respect
>>I am really not in the mood.  You missed the point of what I was saying and
>>chose to move on to attack language usage.  I was making the point that Marc
>>was making judgemental remarks when he himself has not even used the system
>>in question.  In that respect, what I have said is true.  Marc is not right
>>on that respect, and I am in no way playing 'games' as you put it.
>
>The point of what you said was that Marc has to actually use the
>machine before he can comment on it, even when someone he trusts uses
>one and tells him about it.

The point here is that making comment on the machine is fine from a perspective
of not having used it.  However, making judgemental conclusions is not.  Lets
not add the 'trust' component here.  I highly doubt Marc even knew the poster
of the original data.

>   By that logic, none of us has any right
>to comment on anything, since we're all relatively inexperienced
>compared to the number of things that happen every day everywhere.  Do
>you think that we should all go to Florida before we believe that the
>hurricane was bad?  That we should go to Somalia before we believe
>that the people there are hungry?

This is clouding the issue.  Marc made references to the A4000 under 256 color
mode and judged it "unusable", and stated that it "crawled".  These
pronouncements were made after reading one person's report about the machine,
and never having any experience on it whatsoever.

Fairly well all sources of data about the aforementioned hurricane have 
mentioned that it was very damaging, giving reports that tend to correlate
with each other.  Yet, if you look at reports on the A4000, there are 
conflicts in what Marc chooses to use as a basis for his judgements.  In
such situations, it IS an expectation that one needs to make a first hand
appraisal of the situation.  I'm quite sure an insurance company would not
rely solely on news reports about the hurricane damage levels in Florida,
and even more so if several different news sources gave conflicting data.

                 ----------------------------------------
           LaMonte Koop -- SCSU Electrical/Computer Engineering
 Internet: lkoop@tigger.stcloud.msus.edu -OR- f00012@kanga.stcloud.msus.edu
              "You mean you want MORE lights on this thing???"
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Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy