HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: court@newton.physics.mun.ca (J. Lewis)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: sci.astro.amateur?
Summary: Amateur astronomy is very diverse
Date: 13 Apr 92 02:38:04 GMT
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland



	My problem with the concept of sci.astro.amateur is that I don't think it
will WORK - because this group ALREADY is sci.astro.amateur!  There is
little professional-professional discussion in this news group; it comprises
mostly amateur-amateur or professional-amateur threads.  "Amateur" astronomy
is amazingly varied - there is nothing comparable to it in the other sciences -
"amateur" astronomers include casual stargazers with little technical
background; non-astronomical engineers and scientists with some interest in
the field; people who write and publish primarily for amateurs;  "amateurs"
of varied technical backgrounds who are fascinated by the
difficult techniques of astrophotography; and "amateur" photometrists,
SN-hunters, and comet-hunters who are "amateur" only in the sense that they
don't make a living from their astronomical work.

	I think that in fact this newsgroup is LESS varied in its contents
than primarily "amateur" magazines such as "Astronomy" and "Sky and Telescope". 
I would suggest that we ENJOY rather than complain about the sci.astro
embarras de richesses.

	I do not personally follow all of the threads on sci.astro all of the
time, but nearly all of them are of at least occasional interest.  With the help
of kill files and the rn "=" command I can at present keep the time I spend on
sci.astro within reasonable limits.

	I would suggest that, instead of creating a new newsgroup, it might
be useful for posters to this newsgroup to include standard descriptors in their
Subject fields.  This practice has been followed in one of the bitnet groups - I
think wwII-l - albeit enforced by the list owner.  Such descriptors might
include e.g.
	BINTEL - amateur telescopes and binoculars;
	AUR - aurora data;
	SOL - solar activity;
	VAR - observations on nonrecurring or rarely recurring phenomena 
		such as comets and novae;
	COS - discussions on cosmology;
	PHY - astrophysical discussions;
	PHOTO - discussions re astrophotography;
	NASA - information from NASA;
	GEN - none of the above.

Anyway, just a suggestion.

John Lewis
Physics
Memorial Univ. of Nfld.
Xref: sparky sci.astro:5076 sci.space:7602
From: zzz@erg.sri.com (Michael J. Konopik)
Newsgroups: sci.astro,sci.space
Subject: Re: comet approaching?
Date: 16 Apr 92 21:10:06 GMT
Followup-To: sci.astro
Organization: SRI International, Menlo Park, CA

In article <1992Apr16.075357.9874@news.Hawaii.Edu> tholen@galileo.ifa.hawaii.edu (Dave Tholen) writes:
>Should something be done about the situation?  Well, the astronomers have
>done their job by calculating probabilities to the best of our limited
>knowledge.  Now it's up to politicians to decide priorities.

Yes, but what about those probabilities?  The figures I've heard cited on
the news (KCBS radio, if I recall) claimed that the probability that a
person alive today will die from an asteroid impact within the next 50 years
are higher than they are that that same individual will die from a lightning
strike in that same period of time.  If those are the actual figures that
the astronomers are reporting, then I wouldn't hold my breath - not a lot of
people (let alone politicians) are going to buy into it.  Chicken Little had
better odds of finding an audience...

Wouldn't it be nice if the media reported the basis for such figures, too?
Without that information, all those statistics and such are meaningless.

				   -Mike

The seer sez:  The chances that you'll take a staple in the forehead today are
  higher than they are that you will get your index finger stuck in your fly.
Newsgroups: sci.astro
From: barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N Barrett)
Subject: GSC CD-ROM Bright Star Database
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 10:06:20 GMT

   I have a question regarding the Starchart package found in the archives
of comp.sources.misc and comp.sources.unix.  One of the files in the misc
distribution of this software mentions the "GSC CD-ROM", and implies that
this is a large database of bright stars which is usable with the 
Starchart software.  Could someone tell me how someone go go about getting
this CD-ROM?  I would also like to get some pointers to some large bright
star databases which are available via FTP which work with the Starchart
software.

---
| Marc Barrett -MB-  |  email: barrett@iastate.edu
--------------------------------------------------
From: fsrsg@acad3.alaska.edu (Richard S. Guse)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Large black hole discovered ?
Date: 15 Apr 92 17:07:13 GMT
Organization: Psi INc.

In article <1992Apr15.171505.4707@csc.canterbury.ac.nz>, wft@math.canterbury.ac.nz (Bill Taylor) writes:
> I read in the local paper here, that NASA has recently discovered an
> alleged enormous (10^6 solar masses) black hole at the centre of M32.
> 
> Is this new ?  Is it a reliable "discovery"?  What's it all about ?
> 
> Can anyone enlighten us ?

from how you worded that, it sounds like they're awfully positive about this
black hole, and it's size!  one can extrapolate to the idea that there are
black holes in the center of galaxies...I'm guessing M32 is such...altho
that one has skipped me.  I'd be curious as to how they know.  there could
be many different signatures for a black hole, most of them can mean other
things!  anyone have the estimated size of the gravitational object at the
center of this galaxy?

-- 
     .         .      .       .   ______-==-______. ______-==-______        .
.      .    .       .   __-------=----------------==----------------=-------___
 ________________  _  _-  -------=________________==________________=-------  .
(______________(_||_)/_______/  .    .  ----              ---- .          .
   /_____/_____           _-               .        .    .           .
 .         .   \________ -    .  "Number 1, set a course to the main() routine,
  Capt. Mycroft Holmes III   .    recursive warp factor 6."      .        .
  CO, USS Beelzebub     .            .        .Isaac Asimov (1920-1992)
. Recursive Class Starship . NCC+=666++   .     You will be missed... .     .
Xref: sparky sci.astro:5058 sci.space:7574 news.answers:1077
From: curtis@space.ualberta.ca (Curtis Krawchuk)
Subject: Re: SHOULD WE FURTHER EXPLORE MARS ???
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 22:03:29 GMT

In article <1992Mar27.210628.55315@yuma.acns.colostate.edu>  
hauserma@osprey.cahs.colostate.edu (Jake Hauserman) writes:
> 
> If and when we do go back,  what would be the advantage to sending
> humans instead of lots of little probes?

I think an important point is being missed here.  Before anything is sent to  
Mars, we need to raise that $50 - $500 billion.  The money eventually comes  
from the public taxpayers who don't really like sending their hard earned  
dollars to the government just to make some guy in a white lab coat happy!

A lot of time and money was spent in the 50's and 60's (?) towards advertising  
the adventure and romance of man exploring the solar system.  This (and other  
things) eventually lead to the manned missions to the moon. It is that human  
element that needs to be stressed to the public.  Without it, the mission is  
just those know-it-all's sending another toy into space and spending a billion  
here and a billion there.  To the public, there are a lot of other things that  
money could do!!

Don't get me wrong, I am all for the exploration for Mars.  But I don't think  
that we will get the needed funding if all we wanted to do is send those space  
probes there.  We have to get the public dreaming about colonies on Mars etc.  
before they write to their local gov't rep. to encourage funding for space  
exploration.

Curtis Krawchuk
curtis@space.ualberta.ca
From: henne@eana.f3.gmd.de (Peter Henne)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: What is the altitude of MIR?
Date: 8 Apr 92 07:06:24 GMT
Organization: GMD

In article <899@aplcomm.JHUAPL.EDU>, fmonaldo@aplcomm.JHUAPL.EDU (Monaldo Francis M. S1R x8648) writes:
> 
> Does anyone know the altitude of the MIR space station ?
> 
It varies around 375 to 400 km, as orbit-maintenance is performed
using small own engines or those of docked Progress-cargo-vessel.
Current orbit is 379 x 400 km.

Peter
____________________________________
|e-mail: henne@eana.f3.gmd.de        |
|____________________________________|
|Peter Henne                         |   
|German National Research-Center for |
|Computer-Science -GMD-              |
|Schloss Birlinghoven                |
|5205 St.AUGUSTIN                    |
|Fed.Rep. of Germany                 |
|____________________________________
From: mcdonald@aries.scs.uiuc.edu (Doug McDonald)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: The Moon on the Horizon affect.
Date: 14 Apr 92 20:49:01 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana


In article <1992Apr14.180604.9466@linus.mitre.org> chaloux@mandolin.mitre.org (Dave Chaloux) writes:
>On another topic, if anyone has been debating whether they want to build
>an observatory or not, I would highly recommend they do so. 

So would I. I've recently been using the one pictured in the current
Sky and Telescope (though the area aruend it has been a bit more
built up since that picture was made the observatory itself is unchanged).
I have to go over to the astronlmy dept. to get the key, and the
light pollution is awful, but still it is so quick and easy to look at
planets or planetary nebulas. It take maybe 3 or 5 minutes to get
going (a 15 foot long scope on a German mounting takes a bit of
doing to get the cap off and on the correct side of the pier.)

Doug McDonald
From: paulz@hpspdla.spd.HP.COM (Paul Zander)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Weight of Earth?
Date: 16 Apr 92 23:37:19 GMT
Organization: HP Stanford Park - Palo Alto, CA

We worked on this one in high school physics. Weight is a measure of
gravitational attraction. With apples in the store, you determine the
force of gravity between the apples and the earth.  So how might you
measure the weight of the earth?  After considerable discussion, we
started the experiment.  Some of the girls got results close to 100 
pounds, while the football player measured the weight of the earth as
almost 250 pounds.  :-)

Previous posters have given values of MASS which I expect is what the
original poster probably wanted to know.

Anyone got any other ideas on how to determine the WEIGHT of the earth?
From: howell@grover.llnl.gov (Louis Howell)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: sci.astro.amateur?
Keywords: Does anybody actually read these?
Date: 8 Apr 92 02:30:16 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory

In article <1992Apr7.150110.7927@nsisrv.gsfc.nasa.gov>, dsc@gemini.tmc.edu (Doug S. Caprette Bldg. 28 W191 x3892) writes:
|> In article <1992Apr7.001540.20151@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jcastner@isis.cs.du.edu (John Castner) writes:
|> >   I was wondering if anyone else out there saw a need for a new
|> >newsgroup, devoted to amateur astronomy, and containing primarily
|> >the many discussions on telescopes and telescope making presently
|> >found in this group.  I feel that as someone interested in astronomy,
|> >...
|> 
|> Since amateur astronomy is a recreation activity, even when 'real' science is
|> being done (its still fun) how about:
|> 
|> rec.astro

I don't think that an amateur/pro division of the group, whatever the
names, would work very well.  Too much of the traffic here does not
clearly fall into one category or the other.  Consider the "Save
Palomar Observatory" thread---is this an amateur or a professional
issue (and who's supposed to write all the letters)?  What about the Nova
Cygni thread, or announcements of other recent discoveries?  Since
the professionals presumably hear about such things through other
channels, couldn't essentially all of the material here be considered
amateur-based?

On the other hand, the idea of a split is not without merit.  This is the
biggest single group I currently read.  I just don't think the amateur/pro
dividing line is clear enough to adequately distinguish between subgroups.

Here are some suggestions for possible subgroups that would not be quite
so ambiguous.  I'm not pushing for any of these, just tossing them out
as alternatives.

sci.astro.equipment:  Emphasis on amateur equipment.  This would take
  all that material on telescopes that Castner does not want to read.

sci.astro.observing:  This would be the group for amateurs who are not
  equipment freaks.  Could be the appropriate group for posting
  ephemerides, aurora warnings, observation reports.  I would hope,
  however, that it would not encourage more of the "Me too!  I saw it
  too!" type of content-free notes we were deluged with after the big
  eclipse and, to a lesser extent, just after the nova was announced.

sci.astro.news:  Similar to sci.space.news, featuring material like the
  space probe updates, solar wind forecasts, etc.

sci.astro.research:  This would be modelled after such groups as
  sci.math.research, comp.graphics.research, etc.  These groups are
  professional and moderated to keep out the riff-raff.  Tom Van
  Flandern's material on cosmology might go here.  I don't think
  there's enough real professional correspondence going though
  sci.astro yet to justify such a group, though.

sci.astro.computing:  Discussions of software, pictures, raw data, etc.

sci.astro.planets (sci.astro.solar_system?):  These were brought up a
  few weeks ago and apparently sank without a trace.

-- 
Louis Howell  (nazgul@llnl.gov)
From: yaron@astro.as.utexas.edu (Yaron Sheffer)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Distance of delta Cephei
Date: 22 Mar 92 22:50:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: ut-emx.68865
Organization: University of Texas, McDonald Observatory

In article <1992Mar22.155159.26194@st-andrews.ac.uk> vsm@st-andrews.ac.uk (Vivienne Seonaid Moore) writes:
>I'm presently doing a practical on delta Cephei, and I
>need to know its distance. I won't be able to check the

This, er, practical, er, is not designed to actually find the distance
of del Cep basing on some work needed to be performed, now is it? ;-)
Xref: sparky sci.astro:5092 alt.save.the.earth:559 pnw.general:648
From: delisle@eskimo.celestial.com (Ben Delisle)
Newsgroups: sci.astro,alt.save.the.earth,pnw.general
Subject: Street lights
Keywords: Get rid of 1/2
Date: 17 Apr 92 08:02:44 GMT
Organization: The Watchers of the Watchers.


  
	The power company is telling us to conserve elecrtical power,
and they are always asking for rate increases. One source of power 
useage that is very wasteful and somewhat unnecessary is the excessive
use of street lighting. They either charge higher elctrical rates or taxes
to pay to run the lights, and then they ask us to use less electricity, 
while cities and power companies put in more and more of these things 
that take more electricty.
	One-half to two-thirds are unnecessary, are wasteful of resources, 
and a source of great light pollution, one can not even see the stars in 
the sky at night, just a blank darkness with a sparce sprinkling of stars.
	Sure you may need lighting at intersections and curves, but along
strait streaches of road?
	Removing a portion of these lights will save us money in lower
power rates and permit us to see the stars better in the night sky without
driving or walking a hundred miles.
 
 
 

 +-(c)--------------------------+  
 | delisle@eskimo.celestial.com |    Nothing is fool proof, 
 +------------------------------+    Fools are too ingenius.
From: rjg@umnstat.stat.umn.edu (Robert J. Granvin)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Weight of Earth?
Date: 17 Apr 92 04:14:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: news2.1992Apr17.041436.1115
Distribution: na
Organization: School of Statistics, University of Minnesota

>>I know it's a strange question, and I know I can probably find it in
>>a library (if I had the time to go there :-), but I'm in need of the
>>approximate weight of the Earth (in tonnage?).
>> 
>>Does anyone have such a number on the tips of their fingers that they
>>could email me?  Would appreciate it...

I hadn't intended to follow-up, but it seems necessary.

To those who provided me with useful information, I do appreciate it.
Thank you.

General note: I _know_ I meant mass.  The post was a quick one, and I
realized the error after the post.  I didn't feel it was necessary to
cancel and repost the question, but it seems if one is to avoid a strange
amount of insults, it appears to have been necessary.

Based on how this seemed to "bend a couple of people out of shape," it
seems this isn't the place to ask what (is acknowledged) to be a simple
question.  Unfortunate, really, since it does seem to be a valuable
resource for info.  Didn't come off that way the last couple days, though.
For them, remind me to only post questions "worthy of their time."

Again, to those who honestly offered good info, thanks.

-- 
Robert J. Granvin                                       School of Statistics
rjg@umnstat.stat.umn.edu                             University of Minnesota
From: acdendy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (ROGER DENDY)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Save Palomar Observatory!
Date: 6 Apr 92 13:27:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: lims01.6APR199208274749
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Apr4.214450.16584@cco.caltech.edu>, peri@cco.caltech.edu (Michal Leah Peri) writes...
> 
>.... The issue is being cast as a conflict between yellow LPS lights and
>white HPS lights, between high crime and safety, between astronomy
>amd the citizens of San Diego.
> 
>The situation is complicated because the reality of the relationship
>between lighting and safety does not match the perception of a vocal 
>segment of the public.  The overwhelming message conveyed by those
>who spoke against LPS at the hearing ... is that the sareets are not
>safe and that LPS lighting is the cause.
> 
>Added to all this, the downtown merchants --  especially those in 
>the Gas Lamp Business -- want special lighting in their area,
>claiming that the LPS drives away business.
> 
>=========================================================================

Tourism is a major business in San Diego.  And it is understandable that 
the perception of safety is important to tourism.  But the Gas Lamp 
District has been advertised poorly, in that it is not a gas lamp district 
(Beacon Hill in Boston is a gas lamp district).  The connection between 
these ugly yellow lights and astronomy should be advertised to people; this 
will give them a feeling of contributing to science by making minor 
sacrifices, the same way recycling gives people the feeling of helping the 
environment.  Palomar should establish a stronger relationship with the 
people of San Diego, and with tourists, so that it is apprectiated as a 
treasure to be saved.  Programs at the Fleet Science Museum in Balboa Park 
might be one way to start this relationship.

Palomar has bigger long-term problems than the type of lighting in downtown 
San Diego.  The growth in the area is staggering.  It has been said that 
the only thing stopping L.A. and San Diego from merging along the coast is 
Camp Pendleton.  Well, now development is detouring around Camp Pendleton, 
and the continuous city is slightly farther inland: San Diego to Escondido 
to Fallbrook to Temecula to Riverside.  And if the Palomar Observatory 
cannot establish itself in the minds of the people and in the chambers of 
local governments as a resource which must be preserved, then it will be 
awash in city lights as severely as the Mt. Wilson or Griffiths Park 
Observatories.

>					--  Michal Peri
>					    Caltech Astronomy 
>

R Dendy
From: dsc@gemini.tmc.edu (Doug S. Caprette Bldg. 28 W191 x3892)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Clyde Tombaugh
Date: 16 Apr 92 15:20:34 GMT
Organization: NASA GSFC CDP VLBI

In article <qdzjsnc@lynx.unm.edu> cease@carina.unm.edu (Cecilia De Blasi) writes:
>In article <92106.143349IP25086@portland.caps.maine.edu> IP25086@portland.caps.maine.edu writes:
>>Could somebody tell me if Clyde Tombaugh, discoverer of Pluto is
>>still alive?  I was just curious.
>>
>>Thank you      Edward G....Physics Department *student* USM
>
>Yes, he lives in Las Cruces, New Mexico, and is still associated with
>the university there.  He is about 85 now, and only rarely gives talks
>anymore...
>
Indeed, I saw him at the AL convention in Peoria some years back.  He spent
several hours in the lobby just conversing with others about his experiences,
and telescopes in general.  He described the observing he did with his 16 inch
f/10 Newtonian in his back yard.  Interstingly enough, for planetay observing
he said he prefers Ramsden eyepieces, and generaly uses about 750 power 
(although on nights of poor seeing he had to use 'only' 550 power or so.)
The scope was mounted such that when pointed to Zenith the objective was about
9 feet above the ground!  Clyde Tombaugh explained that this was because most
of the convection cells responsible for seeing are found within 3 meters of
the ground.  He described the eyepiece position ~20 ft up, as too high to 
jump, but too low to parachute.

He said that he did a little work still for the Universty maintaining the
scopes, and traveled to give talks--but also said that he would be cutting
back on travel soon.   I thought to myself that this was no surprise as he
was over 80.  He then went on to explain that he as working on a 20" f/8,
and wanted to spend more time at home so he could finish it!

If you ever have a chance to meet Clyde Tombaugh, do not pass it up!
Xref: sparky sci.astro:4855 sci.space:7345
From: dal3@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (dale.e.parson)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Re: Beginners and circles
Date: 7 Apr 92 21:19:24 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <1992Apr2.122846.17601@linus.mitre.org> chaloux@mandolin.mitre.org (Dave Chaloux) writes:
>Riku Henriksson writes:
>
>>  I don't agree fully. Of course we are living in a free world (most
>>of us) and we can do what ever we want to, even use setting circles
>>if we want. I agree that. I just cannot think that circles would be 
>>a good way to start a new hobby.

I'll give an almost-rank amateur's response. I bought by C8 last fall
after a 20 year hiatus from some 2 1/2" refractor amateur observing
in high school in around 1971. I wanted to find a pretty faint globular
cluster somewhere in the south sky (SEE HOW RANK I AM? I don't have
my notes here, & can't remember its I.D.). Anyway, I tried repeatedly
to find it star-hopping, kept getting lost, am comfortable with geometry,
so said, "What the heck, let's try the setting circles." Not trusting
the actual position of the setting circles, I pointed at a known star,
subtracted distances from the coordinates of the star & desired
globular to get a setting difference, moved the scope for that
difference, & found the globular in almost no time, after which I
stared at it for a long while (they say when you start falling asleep
comfortably in sub-freezing weather that you're in danger of freezing,
so I went to bed at that point). If I had continued trial-and-error
I would have soon given up on the globular. It was a great way to
start the hobby.


Dale Parson, Bell Labs, dale@alux2.att.com

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|    "These words are too solid, they don't move fast enough           |
|     to catch the blur in the brain that flies by, and is gone..."    |
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|     Suzanne Vega                                                     |
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