From: hillel@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (hillel.e.markowitz)
Subject: Re: Vegetarianism & Halacha (was Re: Following Sedar tradition)
Organization: AT&T Migration Systems
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 21:18:24 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.154030.24559@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> jgoldber@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Joel Goldberg) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.133909.23257@cs.yale.edu> engelson-sean@CS.YALE.EDU (Sean Philip Engelson) writes:
>>I am a frum vegetarian (frum enough to qualify for the "right-wing
>>extremist" epithet from some quarters, vegetarian enough not to allow
>>noten-taam lekhatkhila :-).  I'd like to summarise my thoughts on the
>>matter, of which I have many, due to the continual necessity to
>>justify myself to others.  I'll restrict myself here to halachic
>>questions, even though I personally am motivated by other factors as
>>well.  There are two types of questions I'll attempt to answer, (a)
>>does halacha allow vegetarianism, [deleted]
>>
>>The third main halachic objection to vegetarianism is that it is
>>associated with avodah zarah [idolatry], and hence should be avoided
>>as a matter of mar'is `ayin [something which, while not itself
>>forbidden, looks like a forbidden act].  I have even heard it
>>suggested that vegetarians should specifically eat a piece of meat on
>>Shabbat to avoid giving this impression.  However, it seems to me that
>>this position is rather weak, especially in the US today.
>>Vegetarianism, though it is a part of several Eastern Asian types of
>>avodah zarah, as well as neo-paganism, is certainly not a primary
>>indicator for membership in such a cult.  It is more associated here
>>(although less and less as time goes on) with the "California" "health
>>food" fad, and has no religious overtones at all.  Even did it have
>>some such overtones, I would think that extrapolating from this
>>halachically permitted behavior (which itself doesn't even look like a
>>forbidden activity) to think someone an avodah zarah-nik, would be a
>>case of choshed b'k'sherim [suspecting the innocent].
>    
>   Without consideration to the question of vegetarianism, is this an
>   acceptable argument in general? My understanding about the
>   prohibition of shaving the face with a blade is that scarring the
>   face was a feature of some cults of avodah zara. The parallel
>   with vegetarianism extends to there being some african cultures
>   that purposely scar their bodies. Could one thus argue to
>   allow shaving with a blade?


The Torah explicitly forbids shaving with a blade.  Thus, whether
or not the reason may be scarring, we are still forbidden to shave
with a blade.  Similarly with permanent tatoos which are the full
scarring mentioned above.  Once the Torah forbids it, unless it
says you are forbidden as long as such a reason applies, we are
forbidden to do it.  After all our idea of the reason may be wrong
or there may be more than the reason we think of.

The situation with vegetarianism is a matter of considering if it
applies or not in our situation.  The modern idea of "animals have
rights too" (equating them to human beings) is IMHO avodas zarah
and is not the same as avoiding tzaar baalei chaim, protesting the
methods of the factory farms, or the health reasons mentioned
above.  In any case, whatever we do, we should be careful to keep
our reasons and actions proper.

___________________________________________________________________
| Hillel Markowitz        |        Im ain ani li mi li             |
| H_Markowitz@att.com     |        Veahavta Leraiecha Kamocha      |
|_________________________|________________________________________|