From: rhb@world.std.com (Robert H Brueckner)
Subject: Re: Is this offensive?
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
	<RHB.93Jan24173229@world.std.com>
	<1993Jan25.064546.18197@en.ecn.purdue.edu>
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 16:03:41 GMT

In article <1993Jan25.064546.18197@en.ecn.purdue.edu> oshiro@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Woodrow S Oshiro) writes:


   >Read my post on "ijime" and then ask me that question again.

   I read it.  But, why are you asking me to ask my question again?  Does
   your post prove that 'Japanese "Neanderthals" are worse than American
   "Neanderthals"'?  Hardly.

As I said, I was not trying to prove this.


  Every incidence of violence in Japanese schools
   can easily be matched up with a violent incident in a U.S. school.
   (Remember, you were the one who was inviting a comparison.)  Robert, you
   even write in your "ijime" article:

	  I am not trying to bash Japan with this post. And I know American
	  schools can be even more dangerous for more children for different
	  reasons (or the same ones). 

You see, I was not trying to prove this. Don't you get it yet?

   > But for
   >the record, I think Neanderthals are Neanderthals, no matter what the
   >color of their skin of sound of their language. If you examine my post
   >which you excerpted you'll see that it's main flavor was that there
   >*isn't* much difference, even if the portion you quoted may have
   >seemed to be an apology for American dumbshit bellicose jocks who like
   >to bully people (which was not the point I was trying to make).

   I did examine your article; and I didn't see this "main flavor" which you are
   talking about.

Obviously, to be understood by you I would have to cleave to the
strictly literal. How boring. And how not worth it.

  How else should I interpret:  "much more cruelly and relent-
   lessly"?  If this was some attempt at sarcasm, the attempt crashed and burned
   before it got off the ground.

No, the fact is that the "ijime" Japanese experience lasts and lasts,
whereas the bullying of American football jocks is more situational.
If you happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, you get
smacked. But I'm still not defending *any* kind of bullying, and I
wish you'd get that through your thick skull.

   > Next
   >time you say "That was not all there was to your original claim," make
   >sure you refer to *all* of it. It wasn't that long.

   Let me give YOU a piece of advice.  Next time you get yourself into a position
   you can't defend, admit you made a mistake.  Don't try to slime out of it.


No, let me give YOU a piece of advice. Make sure you understand the
posts here before you start to flame away. And don't base arguments
on a couple of sentences taken out of context. The fact that you cite
my own admission in my article that "Neanderthals are Neanderthals,"
ought to have made you think that maybe I wasn't trying to defend the
jocks. A bit too subtle for you, perhaps? I'm not surprised. This
commonly happens when people react with their emotions and not their
brains. They lose all perspective and all appreciation of subtlety.

BTW, my point in the "ijime" article is not to say that America is
better than Japan. It is to show that, in spite of what apologists
like you spout, Japan does have a lot of serious problems. I went
through a phase where I thought Japan was a miracle country, and could
do no wrong, and defended it absolutely to anybody. Then I learned
more. I still don't think it's a bad country, and it's one I'm very
interested iI still enjoy and appreciate it for many, many different
things.. But it does have faults, and I think those should be as
legitimate a point of discussion in this newsgroup as sumo or Yaohan
or anything else.

Some people, like you, Woody, seem to feel that any criticism of Nihon
constitutes Japan-bashing. Well, in that case, I'd advise you not to
read my posts. Because sometimes they do contain criticisms. And if
you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

RB

-- 
|"The truth is cruel, but it can be loved, and it makes free those who  |
| have loved it." -- George Santayana  // Opinions expressed here, when |
| clear and persuasive, are my own. --Rob Brueckner (rhb@world.std.com) |

Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan