HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
Subject: Re: Let's stuff his mailbox (Re: Fwd from CLINTON ...)
Date: 26 Aug 92 22:43:29 GMT
Organization: Dixie Communications Public Access.  The Mouth of the South.

hagerp@moose.cs.indiana.edu (Paul Hager) writes:

>So, go to it, netters.  Let's give the Clinton people something to
>think about.

My note to him is simple.  The only imaginable thing worse than a second
Bush administration is a Clinton one.

John

-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC               |Interested in high performance mobility?  
Performance Engineering Magazine (TM) |
Marietta, Ga                         |Interested in high tech and computers? 
jgd@dixie.com                        |Write me about PE Magazine
Need Usenet public Access in Atlanta?  Write Me for info on Dixie.com.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
From: "Paul Hager" <hagerp@moose.cs.indiana.edu>
Subject: The Clinton Challenge -- a brief fantasy ...
Organization: Computer Science, Indiana University
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 00:08:42 -0500

	As I was scanning sci.skeptic and observing the flensing
some poor creationist was getting by the group, I had a sudden
flash -- a "what if" fantasy.  What if Clinton, who has a campaign
connection to Compuserve, were issued a personal challenge to 
defend his drug-war strategy on talk.politics.drugs?  The challenge
would be for him to argue for his position in at least one post
each day for one week.

	Imagine what it would be like.  His every departure into
cant or drug-war mythos would be ruthlessly punished by the
t.p.d brain trust.  Of course, applying good operant conditioning
methodology to the process, if he ever got something right, we
would pat him on the head and say, "nice Governor."

	The Governor is a busy man: what with bus tours and
flesh pressing he probably doesn't have time to devote an hour
or two each day to a measly 10K or 20K constituents on the net.
However, he does have a "position team."  Maybe they could act
as his surrogate.  They could be the flensees (how's that for a
neologism) and we could be the flensors.  What a delightful idea.
Maybe I'll suggest it to the campaign.

	Sharpen your knives, netters.

-- 
paul hager		hagerp@moose.cs.indiana.edu

"I would give the Devil benefit of the law for my own safety's sake."
                       --from _A_Man_for_All_Seasons_ by Robert Bolt
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,talk.politics.misc
From: scdorcy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (JAMES DORCEY)
Subject: Re: NHRA announces Piss Testing
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Distribution: na
Date:  2 Sep 1992 16:29 EST  

In article <1992Sep2.094638.24976@ITcorp.com>, geoff@ITcorp.com (Geoff 
Kuenning) writes...

>I have a couple of questions here, which relate to my own personal
>biases regarding piss tests:

>(1) Does the NHRA have a history of serious personal injury (including
>    death) which is traceable to substance abuse?
>(2) Are there substances which have been demonstrated to improve NHRA
>    race results?

[Stuff regarding justification if either question is answered yes deleted]

>Beyond these, I can't see much justification for piss testing.  Feel
>free to correct me if I'm wrong.  But it seems to me that the only
>valid reasons for regulating *any* racing behavior are (1) general
>safety, and (2) protecting the little guy from manipulation by the big
>guy.

In response to (1), I do not believe that there is a history, per se, 
however racing of any sort is dangerous enough without adding additional 
risk (to drivers, officials, and fans) due to substance abuse.  This would 
appear, in direct response to your question, to be a pro-active move rather 
than a reactive move.

Keep in mind that NHRA is marketed as a family sport and looks to uphold a 
family image.  This image has already been tarnished by the arrest and 
conviction of a premier Pro Stock driver on drug related charges.  Not good 
when you are trying to get mom and dad to bring their kids to the 'strip to 
see the show.  The point is that Safety and Money could both be motivators.

One could argue that the testing is voluntary - you don't have to take the 
test if you don't want to compete.

In response to (2), if there is some type of drug which _improves_ neuro-
muscular reaction time, it's news to me.

JD
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.drugs
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
Subject: Re: Let's stuff his mailbox (Re: Fwd from CLINTON ...)
Date: 27 Aug 92 19:14:43 GMT
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)

jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond) writes:
>
>My note to him is simple.  The only imaginable thing worse than a second
>Bush administration is a Clinton one.

     Given that Bush thinks I can't be a citizen because I'm an
atheist and this is "one nation under God", that he's already gotten
us into one war (against an enemy that his administration made a
military threat) and one illegal military action ("Just Cause" - if
the Constitution still meant anything, he would have been instantly
impeached for that), and his appointment to the Supreme Court of an
obvious liar (did _anyone_ believe that Thomas had no opinion on
Roe v. Wade?), I have to think it's the other way around. Just barely.

     <Sigh.> There's about, what, 260 million Americans, right? Let's
say half of 'em are over 35. That's 130 million. Say 10% are not
native-born Americans, that leaves 117 million - let's make it even and
say 110 million. One hundred ten million individuals Constitutionally
eligible to be President of the United States. And who does our
political process come up with? <Sigh.>

===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@flubber.cs.umd.edu| "Born to die" | Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
          This is a .signature antibody. Vaccinate your .sig!
"Duty then is the sublimest word in the English language.  You should do your
 duty in all things.  You can never do more, you should never wish to do less."
 -- General Robert E. Lee
Xref: sparky talk.politics.drugs:6110 alt.drugs:15302
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.drugs
Subject: Re: Definition of an addict.
Date: 3 Sep 92 16:48:10 GMT
Followup-To: talk.politics.drugs
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)

al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka) writes:
>>Assuming for the sake of argument that the numerous studies from
>>different research groups in the US and UK (at least) that have
>>consistently found that a large proportion of addicted people outgrow
>>their problem without treatment were all mostly government-funded, I'm
>>still trying to figure out what government funding has to do with this
>>conclusion.
>
>People who can quit on their own are not addicts, by definition.

     BING! BING! BING! BING! BING! BING! BING! BING! BING! BING! BING!

     Sorry, you just tripped my bullshit detector...

     Where'd you get _your_ definition of addiction? I don't have a
medical dictionary or a copy of the DSM around, so let's go to
_Webster's Encyclopedic Unabridged Dictionary of the English
Language_:

ad-dic-tion (...),n. the state of of being given up or having yielded
to a habit or practice or to something that is habit-forming, as
narcotics, to such an extent that its cesstion causes severe trauma...

     Nothing there about requiring another's help to overcome the
addiction. Sound like another AA redefinition to make themselves look
like the only "True Path to Recovery (tm)".

>The common sense conclusions drawn from the "research" you cited
>are pure A.A., minus the higher power.

     Take away the "higher power" from AA and there's not much left.
Half of the 12 steps involve it.

>So "science" first tells a lie to discredit the self-help programs,

     The only lies - or perhaps I should be kinder and call them
errors - I've seen in this discussion have issued from _your_
keyboard.

===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@flubber.cs.umd.edu| "Born to die" | Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
          This is a .signature antibody. Vaccinate your .sig!
      "There are some microorganisms that exhibit characteristics of
       both plants and animals.  When exposed to light, they undergo
       photosynthesis and when the lights go out, they turn into
       animals.  But then again, don't we all?"
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,talk.politics.misc,alt.drugs,sci.med
From: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
Subject: Re: Alcoholism and the "addictive brain" (was: Definition ...)
Reply-To: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 23:38:08 GMT


In a previous article, carnes@sparky.eecs.umich.edu (Richard Carnes) says:

>.......  So then what does this gene have specifically to do with
>alcoholism?  All kinds of pleasure-seeking behavior (such as eating
>and sex) would need to be examined to determine whether this gene is
>at work.

Other kinds of pleasure-seeking behavior (such as drug abuse, gambling,
and politics--ESPECIALLY politics, because nuclear war makes drunk
driving look like a picnic) would need to be examined, in addition.

-- 
=======================
"Endeavor to persevere"
=======================
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
From: reaper@wixer.cactus.org (Keath Milligan)
Subject: Re: The Clinton Challenge -- a brief fantasy ...
Organization: Real/Time Communications
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 19:55:36 GMT

In article <65048@cup.portal.com> atfurman@cup.portal.com (A T Furman) writes:
>          [From the San Jose Mercury News, October 9, 1992]
>
>                     [Reprinted without permission]
>
>
>          CLINTON SACKS STAFFER, REAFFIRMS DRUG STANCE
>
>
>Washington, DC (UPI)  Presidential contender William Clinton dismissed
>campaign staff worker Joe Clueless today after a series of computer
>"bulletin board" system exchanges on the drug issue.  When confronted
>by advocates of drug legalization, Clueless allegedly backed down and
>conceded the rightness of the pro-drug viewpoint. 
>
>In a statement issued today, Clinton denied that Clueless represented
>the views of the Clinton camp.  "I'm cutting George Bush off at the
>pass on this one.  No one hates the drug menace more than me.  I can
>read public opinion polls like anyone else, and there are a lot more
>Archie Bunkers out there than drug-sotted members of the computerized
>technological elite.  America wants a boot camp president, and that's
>what I'm going to be.  If Mr. Clueless can't do his job of communicating
>to the American people how I represent them, he'll just have to find
>other employment.  I hired him and I can fire him.  Of course, I support
>legislation requiring six months' notice for plant closing layoffs, but
>nothing that would apply to me."
>
>When asked whether he would still vote for Clinton in the upcoming
>election, Clueless replied, "Since Bush is even worse, and there are
>only two choices, I guess I'll have to."
>
>
>    Alan T. Furman         | VOTE LIBERTARIAN!!  Marrou/Lord in 92!!

This looks fake.. maybe it was a joke and I'm just "clueless" myself.
Can anyone offer any further information on this?

If this report is genuine (I'm sure this is exactly what Clinton
*thinks*, I juts didn't think he would say it), it illustrates a serious
problem that our electronic community must overcome.  Just as other
"special interest groups", such as the women's movment and the gay
movement have been able to garner more power as a group than they had as
individuals, the electronic community ("drug-sotted members of the
computerized technological elite") is in the position to do just the
same.  We may even have some technical advantages.

-- 
oooooo ooo o o  o            Keath Milligan            o  o  ooooo oooo oooooo
oooo oo ooo  o   o   Prometheus Light and Sound, Inc.   o   o  o ooooooooooooo
oooooooo o oo  o         Real/Time Communications        o    o o ooo oooooooo
oooooo oooo ooo  o  internet: reaper@wixer.cactus.org  o   o  o ooo oo ooooooo
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.drugs
From: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
Subject: Re: Definition of an addict.
Reply-To: al037@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Dave Polewka)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 23:47:14 GMT


In a previous article, carnes@sparky.eecs.umich.edu (Richard Carnes) says:

>There is plenty of evidence in the research literature that many,
>perhaps most people with addictions outgrow their problem without
>treatment (it's called "maturing out", originally a street term). 
>[...]

What is the source of the funding for these studies?
What is the political agenda of the researchers?


-- 
=======================
"Endeavor to persevere"
=======================
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
Subject: Re: Smoking as a Drug Delivery System
Date: 3 Sep 92 16:27:27 GMT
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)

feustel@netcom.com (David Feustel) writes:
>It is my impression that most health hazards associated with
>cigarrettes come from the tars in the smoke. I read once that one drop
>of nicotine applied to the skin of a rabbit would kill it. What are
>the long term health hazards of nicotine (as opposed to cigarrete
>smoke) injestion?  Thanks.

     It constricts arteries, increasing the chance of heart attack, stroke,
and periphial vascular disease.

===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@flubber.cs.umd.edu| "Born to die" | Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
          This is a .signature antibody. Vaccinate your .sig!
      "There are some microorganisms that exhibit characteristics of
       both plants and animals.  When exposed to light, they undergo
       photosynthesis and when the lights go out, they turn into
       animals.  But then again, don't we all?"
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
From: shrum@eos.arc.nasa.gov (Rick Shrum)
Subject: Re: The Clinton Challenge -- a brief fantasy ...
Organization: NASA Ames Res. Ctr, Calif.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 22:40:05 GMT

In article <1992Sep1.195536.2798@wixer.cactus.org> reaper@wixer.cactus.org (Keath Milligan) writes:
>In article <65048@cup.portal.com> atfurman@cup.portal.com (A T Furman) writes:
>>          [From the San Jose Mercury News, October 9, 1992]
>>                                           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>                     [Reprinted without permission]
                       [*pre*printed?]

>>
>>
>>          CLINTON SACKS STAFFER, REAFFIRMS DRUG STANCE
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>    Alan T. Furman         | VOTE LIBERTARIAN!!  Marrou/Lord in 92!!
>
>This looks fake.. maybe it was a joke and I'm just "clueless" myself.
>
>If this report is genuine (I'm sure this is exactly what Clinton

Check out the date again :/

>oooooo ooo o o  o            Keath Milligan            o  o  ooooo oooo oooooo


                            R ****
                             I
                              C
                          **** K	

Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
From: lintz@fred.cis.udel.edu (Brian Lintz)
Subject: Socialist Worker's Party: Drug Policy
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:14:03 GMT

Monday night (Aug. 31) I attended a talk given by Estelle Debates, 
the Vice Presidential Candidate for the Socialist Worker's Party.
The talk was mainly about Bush's most recent policy toward's Iraq,
ie. the no-fly zone, etc. There was only a small group of people
attending the talk, so afterward I was able to talk one-on-one
with her. I started by saying that I had noticed in her talk that
she had twice referred to a "war on our rights". I said that it
seemed to me that the current War on Drugs seemed like an excuse
to take away more and more of our rights. She absolutely agreed
with me, so I asked what her party's alternative would be. She
told me they basically believed in legalization of marijuana, and
decriminalization of small amounts of other drugs. Also an emphasis
more on treatment (let anyone who wants it be able to get it free)
and less on enforcement. In a somewhat related note, the party
also believes in legalizing prostitution. Anyway, their ideas seem
to based on the Amsterdam model, though I wasn't able to confirm
this because other people wanted to talk to her.

Anyway, I thought there ideas weren't so bad, but I still haven't
found a political party that I'm totally enthusiastic about. I
looked into the Libertarians (I know a lot of the people on this
board are), but I don't like the free-market economics. I also
don't like total socialism. Does anyone know of a party that is
libertarian on social issues, but believe in a mixed economy?

Brian Lintz
lintz@udel.edu
Xref: sparky talk.politics.drugs:5985 alt.society.civil-liberty:5610
From: system@korova.uucp (razorback)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.society.civil-liberty
Subject: Re: Good News: Great Anti-WoD article in a teen magazine!
Date: 24 Aug 92 05:17:16 GMT
Organization: VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783

doctor1@cbnewse.cb.att.com (patrick.b.hailey) writes:

> A hard-hitting slam of the drug war appears in this month's (get this!)
> "Sassy" magazine, a life-style magazine aimed at, I gather, 7th through 10th
> grade girls!
> 
> The cover blurb is "1 American President's Lame Drug War", and the tone of th
> article is even more caustic and in-your-face.  The article is organized into
> the following sections:
>      Lame Strategy #1: Invade the Drug-Producing Countries; Lame Strategy
>      #2: Put Scary Dictators on the Payroll; Lame Strategy #3: Build More
>      Prisons; Lame Strategy #4: Blame the Addict; Lame Strategy #5:
>      Curtail Our Civil Rights;  Here's a Strategy That Might Actually
>      Work.


unfortunately, since i am among that generation and feel that i perhaps 
know them best (although i DENY any insinuations that i am related to 
them in thought, shape, or form...(mabye form))

i have found that you can lead a bowhead to knowledge, but you cant make 
them think.

people of my generation dislike lots of things, but they absolutely ABHOR 
anything that makes them THINK, has CULTURE, or is SERIOUS.

so, even though i would like to send that lady the entire chippendale 
troupe for her very own, i feel that her well-intentioned efforts were 
sorely misplaced...alas...

hell, i would have read it...if i read anything fluffy like that...

ohwell...

squiddie

--
              VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783
        "where you can find the Zeta Greys SAFEWAYING themselves
                into the WONDERBREAD *heart* of America!"
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
From: gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven)
Subject: Re: NHRA announces Piss Testing
Reply-To: gak@wrs.com
Organization: Wind River Systems, Inc.
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 21:17:37 GMT

In article 11988@news.cs.indiana.edu, "Paul Hager" <hagerp@moose.cs.indiana.edu> () writes:
>(...If people
>thought about it just a bit, I'm sure they'd agree.  For example,
>we could ban the practice of Christianity on the grounds that it
>produces enough people like Jim Jones that it is too risky to allow
>people to practice it.)

No they wouldn't.  Christianity is Good(tm), while drugs are Evil and Bad(tm).

If "people" were even capable of the kind of thought you suggest,
respect for personal freedom wouldn't have sunk this low to begin
with.

>In a situation that is dominated by hysteria, one's ability to
>choose is about as likely as bucking a stampede.

That's another way of saying it...

---
I don't know what system you use,  you might try vodka in Evian bottles.   Some
people like  cream in  their morning coffee,  I spike  mine with  a little  JD.
Mickey's Big Mouths are an excellent choice, you can use the empty bottles as a
desktop vase.                               -Hoodlum Empire "Get Drunk At Work"
Richard Stueven        gak@wrs.com         attmail!gakhaus!gak        107/H/3&4

P.S.  It just occurred to me that this thread was probably not the most
      appropriate place to introduce my new .sig ...   :-)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.drugs
From: lewis@aera8700.mitre.org (Keith Lewis)
Subject: Re: Medical MJ in CA?
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 19:32:10 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.215755.7022@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>, rwilson@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Randy Wilson) writes:
>	The Santa Cruz board of supervisors has voted unanimously to
>	legalize marijuana for medical use.  They have declared that
>	residents will not be arrested for marijuana possession if
>	they have a written prescription from their doctor for an
>	existing medical condition.  The new law only applies to San
>	Francisco residents.
>
>Obviously I mis-heard either the "Santa Cruz" or the "San Francisco"
>part of the message, but can anyone fill me in on the rest?  Which
>city was it, and how much can they actually do, given that most of the
>laws are state and federal?  Can they legally keep city police
>officers from enforcing particular state laws that they disagree with?

No, the new law has no real force.  The FBI can still enforce federal laws
(as they did in DC to arrest then-mayor Marion Barry).  The state of
California can also enforce their laws against hemp.  The police department
can probably even do an end-run around the city and enforce state laws, but
the chief would probably be fired for it.

It is good to know that there still are places populated by a majority of
at-least-semi-reasonable people.

Keith Lewis             klewis@mitre.org          "Mr. Cheap"
I don't dance to music; music dances to me.  Email me for my PGP key.
The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs,alt.drugs
From: starr@genie.slhs.udel.edu (Tim Starr)
Subject: Re: Medical MJ in CA?
Organization: UDel, School of Life & Health Sciences
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 05:17:30 GMT

The San Francisco board of Supervisors voted to implement a citywide ballot
initiative to legalize medical marijuana.  What they did is give lowest priority
to enforcement of hemp prohibition when the hemp is being used for medical
purposes and direct the City's lobbyist in Sacramento to muster support for
legalizing medical marijuana statewide.

The initiative was done by SF NORML's Dennis Peron, a former hemp dealer who's
been busted twice, as I recall, shot by the cops once, and who also passed an
initiative to legalize marijuana completely in the late '70s.  He claims that
Supervisor Harvey Milk would have supported implementation of the initiative
had he not been murdered.


Tim Starr - Renaissance Now! - Think Universally, Act Selfishly
starr@genie.slhs.udel.edu

"True greatness consists in the use of a powerful understanding to enlighten
oneself and others." - Voltaire
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
From: tmiller@camms2.caos.kun.nl (Todd M. Miller)
Subject: US Feds and Grow lights (again)
Summary: Feds with nothing better to do than...
Keywords: homegrown, marijuana, drugs, Feds, privacy
Organization: University of Nijmegen
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 11:39:26 GMT

Picked this up in comp.risks:

An AP story in today's paper (21 Aug 1992) date-lined San Francisco states that
Federal prosecutors sought court orders yesterday to force three local
businesses to turn over their customer lists, sales receipts and shipping
records for indoor "Growing lights" since the start of 1990.  They also want
copies of any correspondence mentioning marijuana.

The three companies--Diamond Lights, General Hydroponics, and Berkeley Indoor
Garden Center--refused to turn over the documents without a court order and are
now fighting the court order on the grounds that the request was too broad and
would violate customer privacy.


--

Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs