From: keb3_ss@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Karin E. Baker)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.homosexuality,rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Levis Drops Boy Scouts...
Date: 12 Aug 92 14:00:19 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

In <1992Aug10.211545.7159@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> jfh@greenber.austin.ibm.com (John F Haugh II) writes:

>In article <1992Aug9.234825.11097@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> stank@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (Stan Krieger) writes:
>>                                          And going one step
>>further, how many parents are going to be so irresponsible as
>>to let their sons be in an organization where an adult leader
>>is openly immoral (and the immorality could be a 25 year old
>>Scoutmaster who casually brings up his sleeping around to the
>>boys; it is not limited to whom he has sex with).

>The issue of gay scout masters isn't all that's at stake.  The
>problem extends to gay scouts.  Just as I wouldn't want my child
>being taken off to the woods by a young girl (or boy - pick your
>favorite target of affection ...), I wouldn't want my son being
>the target of sexual advances from another boy.  Childhood is
>supposed to be a time for learning in a safe and protected
>environment.  There will be plenty of time to be taken advantage
>of once the child is old enough to decide matters for themselves.

>In the simple case of "homosexuality is perfectly OK" (and I say
>"simply" only because it avoids the morality issue - and it
>isn't clear one bit that homosexuality is morally acceptable)
>we have young children in the woods with other young children
>that view them as targets of their sexual curiousity.  We don't
>allow this when one child is a boy and the other is a girl, so
>there is no historical precedent for doing so when one is a boy
>and so is the other.  Thus the entire argument FOR allowing
>homosexual boys falls right back up against the argument AGAINST
>allowing heterosexual girls - and that argument certainly has
>nothing to do with "homophobia".  [ Though I can hear it already,
>the pro-gay scouts will be claiming that not letting girls be
>sexually molested by boys is some sexist male conspiracy ... ]

>The stories from my childhood of boys and girls at summer church
>camp who lost their virginity only proves the validity of this
>complaint.  We don't need boys who are sexually immature being
>taken advantage of by sexually mature boys any more than we
>needed to have sexually immature girls being seduced by sexually
>mature boys.  Yes, it happens.  Yes, it will continue to happen.
>And YES, allowing homosexuals into the scouts will INCREASE the
>rate at which it happens within Scouting.


Glad to know ONLY boys have hormones, and girls are simply sexless.. after
all, it's only the little boys (and big BOYS) we have to worry about.. 

(That, my dear man, is definitely sexist!)


>Children will be children.  But we needn't encourage them
>to have sex by injecting them into an environment where they are
>more likely to be taken advantage of.  And adding homosexual boys

And you haven't taught your children to say "no"?  And when I played
doctor as a child with both boys and girls, I wasn't being taken
advantage of, nor taking advantage of anyone else..  I knew perfectly
well if I didn't want to do anything, I didn't have to!


>to Scout troops will put any boys that aren't ready to deal with
>sexual issues at risk of the first gay scout that seeks to take
>advantage of them.  Which is precisely what the gays want - get

And how often has this happened in the history of scouts?  I'm sorry to tell
you, there have been gay scouts.. just the number who've come forward in this
group is indicative of a great larger number!  The thing is, most boys 
don't know.  Most boys experiment with boys and girls even if they "turn
out" heterosexual.  What about locker rooms?  Should we have four 
different locker rooms and bathrooms?  One for straight boys, one for gay boys,
one for straight girls, one for gay girls.?

I don't think so...

>them while they are young, confused, and easily impressionable.


Let me guess, when you were young, confused, and easily impressionable at
church camp, you were seduced into gay sex.. and you just haven't
come to terms yet with how much you enjoyed it!


>After all, there is NOTHING wrong being gay.  There is NOTHING
>wrong with having sex.  Try telling that to a young boy whose
>been raped.  Mothers have been trying to deal with the daughters
>who've been molested by boys at summer camp for decades.  Why not
>spread the misery to boys ...

Sounds like a plan to me! About time men understood the fear of rape.. but
somehow I don't think "allowing" gay scouts into camp is going to suddenly
increase the number of boy rapes.  After all, if you are 14 and believe you
are gay, are you really going to kick yourself out of scouts?  I don't think
you are going to be that brave to stand up and state openly your sexuality,
nor know definitely about your sexuality.

I work with a group here on campus, and you'd be surprised at how many people 
are just discovering who they are in graduate school, or medical school!  
Not a lot of little gay boys running around..


>-- 
>John F. Haugh II      | MaBellNet: (512) 823-1078       | SneakerNet: 042/2F068
>InterNet: jfh%snowball.austin.ibm.com@ibmpa.awdpa.ibm.com               [TSAKC]
-- 
--Karin
keb3_ss@uhura.cc.rochester.edu