HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine)
Subject: Re: T$R and Science Fiction RPGs
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 21:54:41 GMT

In article <BzBExu.72B@news.cso.uiuc.edu> tgt33358@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Thanatos) writes:
>In article <BzBCLB.5xy@news.cso.uiuc.edu> irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine) writes:
>>Oh, I wonder how T$R will attempt to go into cyberpunk. 
>>*shudder*
>Well, drow can replace lost limbs with elaborate mechanical devices...

Yay rah, so instead of playing Shadowrun/CyberPunk2020/etc. they keep
on playing AD&D.  It kind of makes me sick, the generic "all things to
all people T$R tries to do - it drove me into more specialized games
like Ars Magica and such.

>
>And T$R is attempting yet another foray into the world of metascience fiction,
>with a game they call the Amazing Engine, which allows cross-genre roleplaying.
>I'd type in the description, but it makes my ears bleed reading it.  Basically,
>you create an "archetype [not their word, but I'll use it], a being consisting
>solely of stats.  We'll give him a highPsyche, Willpower, Charm, and reflexes,
>and low Intuition, Learning, Fitness, and Position.  In one genre, he'd be 
>James Bond.  In another, he'd be a cunning thief.  In a third, he'd be a 
>rockerboy.  You get the point.

Yeah, they have caught GURPSitis and will try to do what Steve Jackson Games
did.  They will, I predict, succeed as well as they have done with their
other forays into other genres, like _Buck_Rodgers_ (puke).


-- 
+-------------------------+---------------------------------+-----------------+
| Brent L. Irvine         | The above personal opinions     |Winter vacation: |
| irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu | can be yours too for only $50!  | 20 Dec - 4 Jan  |
+-------------------------+---------------------------------+-----------------+
From: loren@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu (Loren Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Group Split Group
Date: 17 Dec 92 17:15:58 GMT
Organization: Wharton Marketing

In article <BzD691.D1K@bcstec.ca.boeing.com> hall@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Robert J. Hall) writes:
>Since a group split seems to be a reoccuring theme that occupies much of the
>volume in this group, I suggest we create a rec.games.frp.split group just
>so everybody can discuss group splits to their heart's content.

You aren't the first to propose such a group. The joke is as old as split 
discussions on rec.games.frp. I must have seen that particular witty comment 
a hundred times while the reorganization was going through the process, 
and at least a hundred times before that. In fact, .advocacy was created in 
part to hold such discussions. So if you want to talk about more splits 
along game lines or any lines, TAKE IT TO .ADVOCACY! We don't need a .split 
newsgroup because we already have .advocacy!

--
+++++++++++++++++++++++23
Loren Miller              LOREN@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu
Time am I, wreaker of the world's destruction, matured, grimly
resolved here to swallow up the worlds.             -- Krishna
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: George.Harris@launchpad.unc.edu (George Harris)
Subject: Re: Where could I find RQIV beta?
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 19:59:03 GMT

In article <1992Dec17.171104.901@nwnexus.WA.COM> mcg@halcyon.com (Michael C. Gilbert) writes:
>I've been browsing the r.g.f.m posts for the last few weeks and couldn't
>miss the ongoing discussions of the RQIV system.  I've GMed a Glorantha
>campaign since 1978 (14years!) and I have a great interest in new
>developments.
>
>Where could I get a copy of the currently circulating draft?

	This question brings up an issue that has been percolating for some
time in my fevered little brain, so I thought I might as well bring it up
now.

	The RQ4 draft is a playtest draft.  It is *not* meant for general
circulation.  Further, I sincerely doubt the appropriateness of discussing
parts of this draft in a public forum.  I haven't contacted any of the
rules committee about this, and if anyone has and they endorse such public
discussion, please say so, but otherwise, I think it is a little outside
our charter as playtesters to make the details of the proposed rules 
public.  Just a thought from a fellow playtester.

>Michael Gilbert
--
"If you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce, they taste more like
prunes than rhubarb does."		-Groucho Marx

George.Harris@launchpad.unc.edu		or, preferably	gharris@jade.tufts.edu
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: brandon@caldonia.nlm.nih.gov (Brandon Brylawski)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: RQ: First Aid
Date: 16 Dec 92 18:50:59 GMT
Organization: National Library of Medicine
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

gal502@huxley.anu.edu.au (Graeme Lindsell) writes:
: In article <1992Dec13.210512.1@wharton.upenn.edu>,
: millerl@wharton.upenn.edu wrote:
: > 
: > Between RQ2 and RQ3 characters became capable of healing damage with
: > First Aid skill rolls, and I for one think that alters campaign feel in
: > undesirable ways. As the RQ4 rules propose to essentially double
: > characters' hit points I think that the First Aid rules could be cleaned
: > up a little, restoring the feel of the original rules, that damage is
: > permanent unless healed by magic, including divine means, or rest.
: > 
: > First Aid: The rough and ready art, often practiced by soldiers, of field
: >      medicine. This allows one to stop a wound from bleeding, to splint a
: >      broken limb, or to fashion a rough sling. A successful roll will stop a
: >      wound from bleeding in one round, and splint a broken limb or fashion a
: >      sling within five minutes. A failed roll will require four rounds to
: > Comments?
: 
:  This seems fine, I have always thought RQIII First Aid a bit strange. The
: only problem is that it emphasises heal spells even more. The way that 
: wounds in RQ can be quickly and easily repaired by magic, while poison
: and disease can't be, and must be treated by relatively rare skills, has 
: always seemed strange to me. If RQIV is doubling hitpoints, do you think
: that a reduction in the effectiveness of spirit magic Heal spells
: might be in order, ie making them increase the rate of healing (like
: Treat Wounds, the RQIII sorcery spell)? One could introduce a proper
: Treat Wounds skill, that takes 10 minutes to an hour to perform, and
: make spirit magic into a "HealSharp" spell, that increases the chance
: of success and effectiveness of the skill. 

I would also like to cast a personal vote for wounds that heal more slowly.
Having magic rapidly and perfectly undo damage removes a lot of possible flavor
from a game; no-one remains wounded for very long until they are completely
out of magic points. On the other hand, wounds that heal at a realistic rate
cut journeys way too short. I would also like to see healing be ritual magic
that speeds up recovery from wounds, e.g changes recovery times from
weeks to days, and from days to hours. The efficacy of the ritual should
probably require 1 mp per point of damage, and work better if one made
a ritual roll, for instance.

Brandon
From: c188-cr@po.berkeley.edu (Chua Hak Lien)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Palladium/Wizards of the Coast Lawsuit
Date: 17 Dec 1992 22:22:13 GMT
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: po.berkeley.edu

God! What does Palladium think it's doing? First, Siembada throws
a tantrum in White Wolf about them not publishing Rifts material,
then they ask _Challenge_ ( and probably other magazines.. ) not
to print articles for their systems, and now a lawsuit against WoC
just because of the use a trademark? 

This one really takes the cake. T$R may be petty, but this is
ridiculous!

Chua
+==+
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cad28526@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Chuck Douglas)
Subject: Re: GURPS Luck
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: rec
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 08:44:10 GMT

slb22@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Seth "the Lesser") writes:
>dseal@armltd.co.uk (David Seal) writes:
>> On the other hand, I've found it usually saves time to ask for one roll with
>> a suitably large penalty. Also, having multiple rolls, such that fail any
>> one of them means failure at the whole task, produces courser-grain skill
>> resolution.  E.g:
>>
>>  Effective    Chance of success    Chance of success    Chance of success
>>   skill        with one roll        with two rolls       with three rolls
>>  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>     4-           0.0185               0.0003               0.0000
>>     5            0.0463               0.0021               0.0001
>>     6            0.0926               0.0086               0.0008
>[rest of table deleted]

>Umm, David, you've got your equations wrong.  It should be _easier_ to make a
>roll if you get three chances, not _harder_....

[table and statistics formula deleted]

I thought he had made a mistake in these calculations myself because I
*thought* he was talking about 3 independant trials.  But I hadn't read 
the paragraph preceeding the table close enough.  If you look, you will
see that he was talking about 3 rolls where failing 1 of them means failure.
This is no longer independant and his table (I assume he figured it right)
becomes correct.

>Seth L. Blumberg          \ Warning: This posting has been determined to cause
>slb22@columbia.edu (play)   \ cancer in laboratory animals.  Please make sure
>sethb@ctr.columbia.edu (work) \ that no white mice are allowed to read it.  
>    > No one I know shares my opinions, least of all Columbia University. <
-- 
Chuckers -- a computer operator/programmer/benthic sorter/emaciated aryan.
cad28526@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu	          |"You know I'll give you everything
Novanet:  douglas/o/nova douglas/cerl/nova|I've got for a little peace of mind!"
douglas-cerl OR douglas-o@nova.novanet.org|--"I'm So Tired" by The Beatles
From: cq267@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jeremy Fox)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: New Rifts releases?
Date: 14 Dec 1992 02:17:19 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


From observing discussion on RIFTS in this group I realize that RIFTS
is not very popular.  Knowing this, I was wondering if anyone new when 
any new releases were coming out from Palladium about the world of RIFTS.
I read somewhere they were going to adapt the Mechanoids soon, but I
have seen no real products materialize about the Mechanoids or anything else 
from Palladium, either.  I remember Palladium had a sort of newsletter,
does anyone know if it still exists?  Thanks for any help.

Jeremy Fox		jfox@tstc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: swaim@owlnet.rice.edu (Michael Parks Swaim)
Subject: Re: Swashbuckling
Organization: Rice University
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 00:56:50 GMT

In article <Bz66nz.GA7@news.cso.uiuc.edu> irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine) writes:
>
>Does anyone know of RPG games set in the 1492-1715 era?
  How about GURPS Swashbucklers?


-- 
Mike Swaim            | "101 Dalmations? Yeah I saw that."
swaim@owlnet.rice.edu | "You Did! REALLY? The same film?
Disclamer: I lie      | Let's stop driving! We must get out and jump
up and down and up and down and dance around and around!" Matt and Delerium
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: DJ mailing-list
From: zog@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Scott Allen Bauer)
Date: 19 Dec 1992 04:16:54 -0600
Distribution: world
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu


     If you are interesting in the game Dangerous Journeys
by Gary Gygax'z send me mail with the heading DJ list to 
subscribe to the DJ mailing list.  I am orgainzing this list
for people that want to swap ideas on how to modify the game 
to suit every game worlds needs and sharing other ideas and
any other use that people want to use it for. 

     email address  zog@matt.ksu.ksu.edu

ZOG out
From: fshaver@eng.auburn.edu (Martin Shaver)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Werewolf-the Apocalypse
Date: 20 Dec 92 20:11:15 GMT
Reply-To: fshaver@eng.auburn.edu
Organization: Auburn University Engineering

In article 49u@news.cso.uiuc.edu, tgt33358@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Thanatos) writes:
> In article <BzEyoD.871@news.cso.uiuc.edu> irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine) writes:
> >In article <1992Dec16.095623.21277@tdb.uu.se> y91moe@tdb.uu.se (Mattias Oestklint) writes:
> >>
> >>Gimme some input on this one, please! (Werewolf)
> >>
> >I just picked up a copy, but havent but skimmed it.  Looks really cool
> >[I would say cooler even than Vampire! :)=], but the NET is suprisingly
> >*quiet* about it...
> >
> >Is it *that* unpopular?  
> Well, the White Wolf rep on the Vampire mailing list finally got around to 
> playing the game he wrote about a month after it came out, and was quite 
> surprised to notice how much werewolves kick vampire tail, hands down.
> Totally.  COmpletely.  So much so, that he suggested SCRAPPING the werewolf
> system, and running out to get Vampire 2nd edition, solely for the combat
> system.  Oops.
I got around this little problem by reducing the garou to kindred ratio (1 garou
for every 6 or so leeches).  After all, the garou are supposed to be a dying breed.

> 	My main problem is merely setting.  I've worked hard to create a 
> Machiavellian atmosphere, perfectly condusive for V:TM, but very bad in W:TA.
> I suppose the intent of the two games comes into play.  VTM is a game of
> _personal_ horror, with humans giving in to basest desires, and becoming
> a monster, and WTA is a game of _Savage_ horror, with the horror conferred
> by genes, and not by moral judgement.
Agreements.  My players _want_ to play werewolves.  I think they needed a change
from the horror of being kindred...

> 	Make no mistake:  I LOVE the way garou are displayed, but only find
> them useful in relation to other creatures, such as how they deal with
> the other four World of Darkness areas.  But as a stand alone, it just doesn't
> run very well. 
The failure of WW to make W:TA more compatable with V:TM almost forces W:TA to
be a stand alone game.  No one here had figured out how to "convert" gifts<-->
disciplines between these games, which to my understanding were supposed to
be more compatable.  Thoughts?

-------
Martin Shaver
"If we don't succeed we run the risk of failure."  J. Danforth Quayle
From: millerl@wharton.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Swashbuckling
Date: 14 Dec 92 01:44:42 GMT
Organization: Newt World Order

In article <RATINOX.92Dec12195703@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu>, ratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri) writes:
> Almost any "heroic/cinematic" style of game could be easilly adapted
> for swashbuckling. HERO 4th edition, Star Wars, Shadowrun (with a
> *lot* of streamlining), TORG, and the Interlock games (CP2020/Mekton
> II) have lots of swashbuckling potential.
> 
> I'd recommend staying away from the "realistic" games such as GURPS,
> Corps, Timelords/Warp World, and Phoenix Command (:-).

I wouldn't use Timelords or Phoenix Command (!) as swashbuckling RPGs
either, but we played a GURPS/swashbucklers campaign and it worked very
well. It wasn't very realistic at all, with characters balancing one
handed on doorframes, swinging into battle on ship's rigging, running a
prisoners' rebellion against armed guards, and all sorts of other
swashbuckling stuff that wasn't very realistic. And we didn't even use
the "just a scratch" rules. The swashbuckling maneuvers, including
swinging on chandeliers, sliding down banisters, rug pulling, wall
hanging pulling, using a shirt as a shield, and the *attack cape*, were
enough to give it a great feel for swashbuckling. Even without those
rules GURPS gives major advantages to fencing weapons against real war
weapons. I've played a few of the swashbuckling specific games,
including the one that I thought was the worst RPG I ever played
(Yaquinto's Pirates and Plunder), and GURPS was by far the best for
buckling swash.

I'm also surprised that you endorse CP2020 over GURPS for this style of
play, since they claim that CP2020's Friday Night Firefight is one of
the most lethal combat systems out. IMHO, GURPS combat is in no way as
lethal as FNFF.

-- 
whoah,
+++++++++++++++++++++++23
Loren Miller                           internet: MILLERL@wharton.upenn.edu
Mediocrity is a hand rail.                         -- Baron de Montesquieu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: ljcg8873@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Lawrence J. Chapa)
Subject: Re: RQ: First Aid
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 00:23:06 GMT

It seems most people believe that the amount of damage done
to a person is immediate.  It is possible that when you
hit somebody and determine the amount of damage that is
done, the damage done is the result of the blow plus
all related damage (like blood loss until it clots).
If damage from a blow is the net result of all damage
related to the blow, it is not too far fetched to see
first aid as preventing damage that hasn't occurred yet
but will if nothing special is done to treat the wound.
However, I do believe that if this is the case then 
first aid should address a percentage of the wound and 
not an absolute value.

It also seems that first aid may provide a psychological
healing effect (faith healing).  When your mom kisses your
booboos so it will stop hurting, I don't think it heals 
it any, but it sure feels better.

I am presenting these arguments to help highlight some 
arguments supporting the current system, which appears
under represented.  

Larry (playing devil's advocate)
From: mjo@iao.ford.com (Mike O'Connor)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: New Rifts releases?
Date: 14 Dec 1992 18:55:50 GMT
Organization: Not an official spokesperson for Ford Motor Company
Reply-To: "Mike O'Connor" <mjo@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ope001.iao.ford.com

In article <1ggqrfINNk0b@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>
cq267@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jeremy Fox) writes:

:I read somewhere they were going to adapt the Mechanoids soon, but I
:have seen no real products materialize about the Mechanoids or anything else 

Mechanoids *is* out for Rifts.

						...Mike

-- 
 Michael J. O'Connor           |  Internet:  mjo@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com
 Ford Motor Company, OPEO      |  UUCP:      ...!{backbone}!fmsrl7!mjo
 20000 Rotunda, Bldg. 1-3001   |  Phone:     +1 (313) 248-1260
 Dearborn, MI  48121           |  Fax:       +1 (313) 323-6277
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: jacobus@symphony.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Subject: Re: ARS-MAGICA
Organization: Purdue University
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 08:38:19 GMT




Might as well toss out a quick description of some of the Magi of our local
covenant:


Gloriana:  A Merinita, of course, who is convinced that she is the sister to
the Queen of the Fey.  Recently, she discovered that Merinita magic may not
be the be-all and end-all.  Her most distinguishing "feature" is her generally
insatiable nature.

Quede:  Flambeau, through and through.  Burn it down, sift through the ashes,
sneer at the survivors before you torch them too.  Thinks Faeries are annoying
bugs.  However, more than anything he HATES Infernal forces.  When he's feeling
mellow, he tosses around spontaneous Perdo Terram instead of his normal variety
of fire jets, ribbons, pila, etc.

Ursus Igni:  Ursus is a bear.  Sometimes he likes to pretend that he is a
Bjornaer Magus.  At least that's how he sees things.  He also sees himself as
the owner of the land the covenant is upon.  The others are there at his
sufferance.  However, since they give him plenty of food and a warm place
to sleep, it's unlikely he'll ever try to force his "privilige".  Generally
a very mellow sort, but it's not good to rouse his ire.  Some day he hopes
to find an excuse to let loose with that Mists of Change he learned.  However,
his one ideal is to replicate every Ignem spell so that he can cast it while
in bear form--this is one Bjornaer who does NOT have the Ignem deficiency.

The Bonisagus:  He actually has a name, but nobody can remember it.  His
ambition is to be the first Magus in the covenant to get and train an 
apprentice.  Currently, he's stuck in the covenant for a full year or more.
Due to a little mishap, our Aegis of the hearth is "stuck" to him.  It
follows him around--so he can't leave.


Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: esper@cs35b.cs.umn.edu (Dave Sherohman)
Subject: Re: SRII ?'s "Walking" fire, Ultrasound
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 01:35:32 GMT

In article <1992Dec16.160812.89592@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> mak9@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (MICHAEL A. KAUFFMAN) writes:
>Our group has come up with two questions that we would like feedback on:
>
>1)  SRII p. 93 states "Smartguns never waste rounds." (This is in reference to
>"walking a weapon in full-auto mode.) Does this statement mean that the rounds
>are never fired, and therefore do not add to recoil modifiers?

Correct.

>  If the rounds are not fired, does that mean a smartgun can
>fire two 5-round bursts (max 10 rounds per action) at separate targets no
>matter how far apart the targets are? (Of course the second target would
>subject to a +2 target modifier because it is a second target.)

Yep.
>
>2) Why does the Ultrasound sight only half visibility modifiers due to dim
>light, darkness, and invisibility, as stated in the Sourcebook Updates section
>of SRII?  Ultrasound uses acoustic waves to target objects.  Modifiers based
>on the electromagnetic spectrum (or lack thereof), of which visible light is
>a component, should have no effect on Ultrasound.

They don't.  Ultrasonic imaging is inherently less detailed than visual
sighting.  I suppose it might be more realistic to assign a modifer for any
use of an ultrasonic sight (using it instead of trying to see the target
normally), but you're probably best off working from both (thus the final
modifier is proportional to the visibility mod).

esper@ima.umn.edu
From: sprague.wbst311@xerox.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Newspaper Report on NY Lead Figure Ban
Date: 16 Dec 92 20:37:19 GMT
Organization: Xerox
Originator: msprague@superior

The Rochester (NY) Democrat and Chronicle has an article on NY State
banning lead figures in todays issue (by Sherrie Negree).  It's not a
bad write up, but things don't look bright.

She did a fair job of presenting the collectors point of view, including
several "Crazy Igor" quotes.  I won't repeat any of that here, as you
have all seen or heard it already.  Following is a quote from near the
end of the article.

|
| Health officials and consumer-safty advocates, however, say
| childern inevitably will touch their parents' figurines and
| be exposed to lead.  Besides the military figurines, there
| are miniature Dungeons and Dragons and Star Wars characters
| geared for children.
| 
| "My feeling is: 'Why should adults be exposed to lead?'"
| said Judy Braiman, a Brighton toy-safety expert with the
| Empire State Consumer Association.  ^It's all right for adults
| and not Children? This is toxic."
|
| The Health Department decided to ban the products after
| laboratory experiments documented that lead easily rubs off
| toy figurines, said Faith Schotenfeld, a department spokeswoman.
| Studies have shown that exposure to even low levels of leand can
| produce harmful effects in children, giving rise to learning
| disabilities and behavioral problems.
|
| [Some text deleted]
|
| Manufacturers at the hearing requested that the state phase in
| the ban over the next year.
|

Sigh.  If the manufacturers are requesting a phase in time, it looks
like the ban is going to happen one way or another.  I know that lead
is dangerous, but so are a lot of things.  I think the Health Department
is getting carried away.

I also don't like the fact that they said the "Dungeons and Dragons"
and "Star Wars characters" are geared for children.  Guess I'm just
a pretty big kid.  :-)

			~ Mike  (sprague.wbst311@xerox.com)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc