HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jjonsson@alexandria.lib.utah.edu
Subject: Re: Phoenix is absolutely scary...
Organization: Marriott Library, University of Utah
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 06:21:22 GMT

In article <C02zpq.7EM@chinet.chi.il.us> prb@chinet.chi.il.us (Paul Botts) writes:

>In article <jjonsson.309@alexandria.lib.utah.edu> jjonsson@alexandria.lib.utah.edu writes:
>>      As for the defenses in the West not being up to the defenses of the 
>>East, that's just plain B.S. Who has consistently been among the league 
>>leaders in team defense for the last few years? If you look, I think you'll 
>>find the Jerry Sloan coached Jazz right up there. Also the Lakers have 
>>always been very good at the defensive game. I expect that there are a few 
>>teams who will challenge the Suns, and may even beat them, Portland and Utah 
>>being first among them.

>If you want to take points allowed per game as the measure of team
>defense, sure, Utah's right up there. That is, however, a ridiculous way
>to measure team defense, 

Huh? Excuse me? What's the point of defense if not to stop the other team 
from scoring. . .

>since it is highly dependant on a team's
>*offensive* style of play. 

Again, Huh? I just don't get this one. The Jazz play a very good "defensive" 
offense, keeping control of the ball, and playing half-court offense. 
Slowing the pace of the game keeps the scores down, and the Jazz can beat 
anyone in the half-court. I don't understand how transition teams like the 
Suns, Portland, and Bulls are in the same league as Utah when it comes to 
half-court play. On the other hand, the Knicks play a very similar style of 
ball. Pat Riley has seen his share of defensive battles with the Jazz, and I 
think he's learned quite a lot from the Jazz, Jerry Sloan, and the man-
mountain defense of Mark Eaton.


Jeff Jonsson
Marriott Library Data Control, University of Utah.
==============================================================================
--"It's the sound of the secret--  jjonsson@alexandria.lib.utah.edu
-- machinery at the center of  --  jjonsson@utahlib.bitnet
-- the world." -Cliff Steele   --  "You talkin' to me?"
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: dmd39855@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Daniel DuBois)
Subject: Re: Culture comes to USENET (was Re: Jordan & Pippen: No Olympics)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 18:11:56 GMT

vince@paradyne.com (Vince Ciletti) writes:
>>> 
>>>BTW can someone explain why the Olympics hasn't had such an adverse affect
>>>on Barkely and his Suns? And what does rough play on the part of NY or
>>>Detroit in years past have to do with the Bulls now?
>>> 
>>
>>The 'thesis' of my post was about how hard Jordan and Pippen work, and
>>grueling season they have to go through.  Very much of that 'gruel'
>>has to do with teams coming at them so hard because they're the
>>champs (especially physical teams like Detroit and NY).  And as for
>>comparing to Barkley, he was resting during the playoffs last season
>>whilst Pippen and Jordan were getting knocked around by the likes of
>>Anthony Mason.  AND there were two Bulls sent to the Olympics, two
>>VERY important Bulls, two Bulls that pretty much carry the team.
>>Double your trouble.
>>
>>Cmon you had to see all these points coming!  A ten year old could
>>make this case.

>I believe the 'thesis' of the other responses to your post was that
>Jordan and Pippen are the only 2 olympians complaining.  Stockton
>fractured a leg, and Ewing dislocated a thumb *while playing/practicing
>with the Dream team - neither one of them has talked about how drained
>they are.  

Is there some rule against saying a particular action was un-helpful?
Maybe the other guys are being quiet just because they dont feel like
saying anything.  Anyway, I still protest use of the word 'whiners'.

>The point is: 
>     Both Jordan and Pippen ARE great players, but they don't work any 
>     harder than the rest of the NBA.  In fact, I've read about Jordan's

I still say they do.  You don't get to be that good without working
harder than the people around you.  You'll have to show me pictures
of Jordan and Pippen sitting on their duffs eating sandwhiches
while every other player in the NBA works out in the weight room
to prove me wrong.

>     practice ethic leaving alittle to be desired from some of the other
>     Bulls players.  The fact that they went one or two more rounds in the
>     playoffs than most of the other olympians.
      ^ This isn't a sentance, I don't understand what your trying to
        say.  Sounds like your making the same point I was trying to
        make, about the fact they have to play more games than most
        people in the NBA, resulting in more wear and tear on them
        than the others.  It'd be kinda silly to agree with me when
        your trying to argue with me.

>Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't recall Jordan, Pippen or any of
>the olympians playing heavy minutes throughout the games.

No, your right on this one.  But they played heavy minutes in all those
NBA playoff games.

>Also, didn't Jordan
>take off most of the pre-season to "recover" from the Olympics?  

Which may be the reason theyre playing poorly (OK, relatively poorly)
now.  Pre-season and training camp are important.

-Dan
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: swenson.rtsg.mot.com (R. Scott Swenson)
Subject: BOXSCORE - den24hou23.26dec92
Organization: Motorola
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 17:08:53 GMT

den 82, hou 90   26dec92



den ( 7-17)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
ellis,laphonso    37   7  16   0  1   1  2   3  9   3  4  0  1  1  0  0  0   15
williams,reggie   40   7  18   0  2   2  2   2 11   3  3  3  1  1  0  0  0   16
mutombo,dikembe   41   5  10   0  0   2  2   4 13   3  4  0  4  2  0  0  0   12
jackson,chris     35   6  19   1  4   1  1   1  4   3  3  1  2  0  0  0  0   14
macon,mark        34   7  10   0  1   0  1   0  2   6  3  4  4  0  0  0  0   14
lichti,todd        7   0   2   0  0   0  0   1  1   0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0    0
pack,robert       13   0   3   0  0   0  0   0  2   2  0  0  1  0  0  0  0    0
plummer,gary      11   1   1   0  0   0  0   0  1   2  1  0  2  0  0  0  0    2
hastings,scott     7   2   2   0  0   1  1   0  4   0  1  0  1  0  0  0  0    5
liberty,marcus     8   0   2   0  0   0  0   0  2   1  0  2  1  0  0  0  0    0
brooks,kevin       7   2   5   0  0   0  1   0  0   0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0    4
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
den totals       240  37  88   1  8   7 10  11 49  23 19 10 17  4  0  0  0   82
FG, 3P, FT averages:     .420   .125   .700       team rebs  3

hou (14- 9)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
horry,robert      16   1   5   0  0   0  0   1  1   3  3  1  1  0  0  0  0    2
thorpe,otis       35   6  13   0  0   1  2   4  9   3  1  1  2  1  0  0  0   13
olajuwon,hakeem   38   7  17   0  1   4  6   7 16   4  3  2  5  4  0  0  0   18
maxwell,vernon    20   3  12   1  5   0  0   0  3   1  2  0  2  0  0  0  0    7
smith,kenny       28   5   7   1  1   3  4   1  2   3  1  2  1  0  0  0  0   14
herrera,carl      32   6  11   0  0   0  0   1  6   0  2  1  1  0  0  0  0   12
floyd,sleepy      28   4  12   0  3   6  6   0  7   4  2  3  3  3  0  0  0   14
brooks,scott      20   2   4   1  1   0  0   0  3   2  3  1  1  0  0  0  0    5
bullard,matt      13   2   6   1  1   0  1   1  2   1  1  1  0  1  0  0  0    5
rollins,tree      10   0   1   0  0   0  0   0  5   0  2  0  1  0  0  0  0    0
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
hou totals       240  36  88   4 12  14 19  15 54  21 20 12 17  9  0  0  0   90
FG, 3P, FT averages:     .409   .333   .737       team rebs  5

den   22  18  20  22  -   82
hou   22  25  28  15  -   90

attendance 14775, time 2:01, officials: JForte,KMauer,JCapers

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: jwnagle@loglady.ninds.nih.gov (Jim Nagle)
Subject: Re: Bullets fans, what's wrong with Pervis?
Reply-To: jwnagle@loglady.ninds.nih.gov (Jim Nagle)
Organization: National Inst. of Health, NINDS, LMCN
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 18:04:43 GMT

Pervis strained his knee in a game vs NJN early this year and has
not been 100%. He's trying to play thru it but while admirable perhaps
not best for the team although the coaches surely have something to say
about that as well. Bullets only other center is C_Jones who is actually 
having a decent year for him....no offense but decent D especially blocks...

Pervis is also not receiving much benefit from the refs this year
which is not to say he doesn't commit fouls, of course he does but
having watched all televised Bullet gms this year he has frequently
suffered from highly questionable calls as shown by replay.

His rebounding numbers are down in part to the arrival of Gugs whose most
consistent area so far has been rebounding.

-jim
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: u_nique@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Jerray Wei)
Subject: Bulls vs. Knicks!
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 21:18:05 GMT

Well, the on Christmas day, the Bulls and the Knicks were on center stage, and
I think it told the world a lot about the possible Eastern Conference
Championship we might see in the spring.

I was rooting for the Knicks the entire way and was exasperated at every turn.
Patrick Ewing is an overrated player!!  How come it is that against the Bulls,
the other Knicks play half decently...now if Patrick would only ever make half
of his shots, things would work out, but no.  I remember a couple of games last
year when McDaniel and even Gerald Wilkins lit it up and Ewing kept tossing
fallaway 20 foot brick after brick.  There's simply no excuse for not getting
his head under the basket against the likes of Cartwright and Perdue.  He's
got to work harder for position and take it inside and maybe do some fakes.
I think there's only been one game in the past three years where he had a good
game against the Bulls and it's frustrating.  He's not even shooting 50% this
year, and on top of that, he's nowhere near the top ten in shot blocking.

Pat Riley messed things up too.  I don't know why he left Greg Anthony out
to get his butt messed up by the Bulls' trap.  How many straight times did
he turn the ball over for dunks?  Riley is supposed to know how to get out
of traps, they weren't that tough.  Maybe sometimes he needs Rivers and Anthony
out there at the same time because Blackman and Starks don't dribble too well.
After scoring 10 easy points the first half, the Knicks forgot to set up
Charles Smith.  Give Starks less playing time!  That boy just can't resist
shooting.  Maybe play a tape of his teammate, Blackman to teach him about
shot selection.  If Ro had been given more time, he would have outplayed Jordan
from a shooting standpoint.  One additional thing...Doc Rivers has offensive
potential, unlike Anthony.  He can drive to the hoop, but he never looks to do
so.  If he could do that, he could create for his teammates, but Riley seems
to favor an offense with no one on one play.

Chicago has immense problems to overcome as well if they are to threepeat.
Michael Jordan shooting 40% on route to a 35 point game isn't going to do it.
B.J. Armstrong isn't the answer at point, and Scottie Pippen...any more
questions on how he didn't deserve to be an Olympian?  Every other Olympian
could take charge on the court...heck, even Christian Laettner is having a
better season than Pippen.  Why does he look like such a wimp out there?
There definitely isn't a Knick he couldn't take it to the hole against, but
again he settled for dump off shots.  16 points from him and virtually nothing
from the other Bulls isn't the answer to a championship.
From: robert@aero.org (R. S. Statsinger)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Lakers are in Trouble
Date: 29 Dec 1992 23:24:44 GMT
Organization: Bureau of Chairs and Bureaus
NNTP-Posting-Host: halcyon.aero.org

In article <1992Dec29.132844.42@pasadena-dc.bofa.com> centeno@pasadena-dc.bofa.com (R. CENTENO) writes:
|
|I'm thiking Vlade, Worthy, and Scott for Hakeem and draft pic(s).  Vlade 
|replaced by Hakeem, Scott replaced by Peeler/smith/cooper, and Worthy replaced
|by Campbell. I think with moore playing time, Campbell will be a good player.
|He has loads of raw talent.

I am, grudgingly, starting to agree that Worthy may have to be traded.
This has been hemlock to me for so many years, starting with having to 
fight off the net.idiots years ago who wanted to trade him for Ralph Sampson.
I always hoped the team would get a great center after Kareem left
while still able to keep Worthy, and a couple years ago the gossip
was Scott, Green, and Vlade for Hakeem. Seemed very painful at the
time, but much MORE painful was the thought of Worthy being part of
a deal. Today, I'd have to say that I'd support the trade you propose,
even though the Lakers have no one to fill the small forward spot
adequately. I wonder if Houston would go for Scott, Worthy, and Elden
Campbell. I'd rather see Vlade play forward than Campbell.

|Your right.  Its sad that the others did not take cue from him, and play some
|ball!!!  Scott returned, and played pretty well for his return.  He played 
|the #3 guard, and produced for the limited time he was in.  Lets hope he
|returns to his pre-injury form.

Let's hope he's traded instead.......

|>What do the Lakers need? A true point guard, so that Sedale could start
|>as offguard and average the consistent 20+ per night that he would
|>if he didn't have the responsibility of running the offense. And
|>a center who is tough and animated all of the time, instead of one
|>who's tough and animated for a few weeks and then takes a month off.
|
|I disagree.  Sedale is a true point guard.  He handles the ball extremely
|well, and still created his own shots when he wants.  The point is...the off
|guard, Peeler/Smith, need to be a threat so that Sedale is not covered at all
|times.  Hopefully Scott will do this for him, but I will NOT hold my breath.

Nor will I. But Sedale came into the league as an off guard, not a point
guard. To his credit, he has learned the PG position well enough to
become the de facto Laker leader and to deserve consideration for
play in the All Star game, but he is a great natural shooter and penetrator
who, I bet, wishes secretly that someone else was the PG.

|Personally, I think Peeler will eventually achieve this type of play, just 
|needs to season more.  As fas as the Center goes, your right.

You may be right about Peeler. I like him alot. I also think the Lakers
would benefit by finding a taller person to play #3 or #4 guard,
assuming that Worthy and/or Green are traded or are no longer
used in that capacity.

				R.S.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro,pdx.sports
From: jscott@micom.com (James Scott)
Subject: Q for blazer fans
Organization: Micom Communications Corp., Simi Valley, Ca.
Distribution: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 17:23:37 GMT

any blazer fans out there able to tell me what kind of $$$ rod
strickland signed for?

thanks,

james
From: prb@chinet.chi.il.us (Paul Botts)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Phoenix is absolutely scary...
Date: 30 Dec 92 16:41:48 GMT
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX

In article <jjonsson.309@alexandria.lib.utah.edu> jjonsson@alexandria.lib.utah.edu writes:
>	As for the defenses in the West not being up to the defenses of the 
>East, that's just plain B.S. Who has consistently been among the league 
>leaders in team defense for the last few years? If you look, I think you'll 
>find the Jerry Sloan coached Jazz right up there. Also the Lakers have 
>always been very good at the defensive game. I expect that there are a few 
>teams who will challenge the Suns, and may even beat them, Portland and Utah 
>being first among them.

If you want to take points allowed per game as the measure of team
defense, sure, Utah's right up there. That is, however, a ridiculous way
to measure team defense, since it is highly dependant on a team's
*offensive* style of play. Now, take a look at the whole picture -
opponents' field-goal pct., opponents' offensive rebounds, steals and
blocks, *plus* points allowed - and you will see that the Bulls have
been the best in the league for the past two seasons, and that this year
the Knicks are so far. Not that Utah doesn't play some very good
defense, mind you, just not quite at the caliber of the Bulls.

I do not think Utah has the horses to beat the Suns this year, mianly
because they play offense 4-on-5, and because they still don't have much
of a bench. Portland, though, may very well go back to the finals again,
because they did improve their bench; when or if Clyde gets healthy, the
Blazers just may finally have what it takes to grab a ring (I put very
little stock in this "lack of heart" business that has sprung up as they
have fallen a little short the last three years). I'm still picking a
Bulls-Suns Finals, but Portland is my first alternate choice in the
West. I don't see a first alternate choice in the East - the Cavs are
the next best team, but the Bulls absolutely own them, so unless
somebody else knocks off the Bullies in the playoffs, I can't see the
Cavs getting there. The Knicks play like a Finals team some nights, for
parts of games, but not regularly. Riley may have them really focused by
playoff time, but the mix of personalities and attitudes doesn't seem
quite right on that team. They still take whole quarters off sometimes.
From: reille85@wharton.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: MO' ON MO YASIN - DON'T LAUGH, HE'S REAL
Date: 21 Dec 92 23:56:14 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

I am very disappointed with the luke-warm reaction with regards to North
Carolina playground legend Mo Yasin.  What with the movie "White Men Can't
Jump", you'd think people would be paying more attention to these playground
legends.  Am I the only one who reads as much basketball information as
possible?  This guy has played with Jordan, and that other Whartonite,
Newberg68 tried to make a fool out of me, but I have read about this Mo "The
Assassin" Yasin. I'm willing to offer more information as interest warrants.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: ortcm@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (thomas.mcguigan)
Subject: BOXSCORE lal26orl24.30dec92
Organization: AT&T
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 15:51:07 GMT


lal 96, orl 93   30dec92

dnp: orl - kerr,steve(cd)
           reynolds,jerry(cd)
illegal defense warning: orl,lal
technical fouls: illegal defense, lal (5:07, 3:17 2nd)
                 illegal defense, orl (1:17 1st, 11:44 2nd, 3:37 4th)
                 skiles,scott (3:33 3rd)

lal (15-11)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
perkins,sam       34   8  15   0  0   5  5   3  6   5  4  0  3  0  0  0  0   21
worthy,james      30   3  12   0  0   1  2   1  3   0  1  0  5  0  0  0  0    7
divac,vlade       29   3   8   0  1   6  8   1  6   0  5  1  2  0  0  0  0   12
scott,byron       24   3   5   0  1   2  3   0  1   1  1  0  0  0  0  0  0    8
threatt,sedale    41   4   9   0  0   4  4   1  7  11  2  1  2  0  0  0  0   12
edwards,james     20   2   5   0  0   3  4   1  4   3  3  0  0  0  0  0  0    7
green,a.c.        27   3   5   0  0   5  8   1  5   1  1  0  1  0  0  0  0   11
campbell,elden    18   4  11   0  0   2  4   2  3   1  4  0  1  1  0  0  0   10
peeler,anthony    17   4   4   0  0   0  0   1  4   1  1  1  2  0  0  0  0    8
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
lal totals       240  34  74   0  2  28 38  11 39  23 22  3 16  1  0  0  0   96
FG, 3P, FT averages:     .459   .000   .737       team rebs 12
procedure technicals 2

orl (13-11)      min  fgm fga 3m 3a ftm fta or tr  as pf st to bk tc ej ff  pts
scott,dennis      42   8  18   3  5   0  0   0  0   1  1  2  1  0  0  0  0   19
tolbert,tom       26   2   7   0  0   1  3   2  6   0  4  0  1  1  0  0  0    5
o'neal,shaquille  44   7  11   0  0   9 11   7 23   2  3  0  7  0  0  0  0   23
anderson,nick     43  11  18   2  4   6  8   2  7   2  3  0  1  0  0  0  0   30
skiles,scott      39   3  12   1  5   1  2   0  2   9  1  0  3  0  1  0  0    8
turner,jeff        7   1   2   0  0   0  1   0  0   0  2  0  0  0  0  0  0    2
kite,greg          8   0   0   0  0   0  0   0  0   0  4  0  1  0  0  0  0    0
royal,donald      17   1   3   0  0   2  4   0  2   3  4  2  1  1  0  0  0    4
green,litterial    9   0   2   0  0   0  0   0  0   1  0  0  1  0  0  0  0    0
bowie,anthony      5   1   3   0  1   0  1   0  0   0  3  1  0  0  0  0  0    2
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
orl totals       240  34  76   6 15  19 30  11 40  18 25  5 16  2  1  0  0   93
FG, 3P, FT averages:     .447   .400   .633       team rebs 12, team TO's 1
procedure technicals 3

lal   22  25  22  27  -   96
orl   27  20  22  24  -   93

attendance 15151, time 2:28, officials: TBernhardt,MCallahan,HHollins
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: campo@sunthpi3.difi.unipi.it (Massimo Campostrini)
Subject: Re: Toni Kukoc interview in Jan 93 'GQ'
Organization: Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 14:17:46 GMT

In article <1992Dec20.010718.2044@HQ.Ileaf.COM> raczka@HQ.Ileaf.COM (christopher raczka) writes:
>
>  The January 1993 edition of 'GQ' Magazine features an interview/story
>  on Toni Kukoc
>
[stuff deleted]
>
>  But, Mr Richmond did do his homework and went to talk also with
>  Toni Kukoc's current employer ... Gilberto Benetton, and Mr Benetton
>  doesn't appear to be willing to let Kukoc out of his SIX year
>  (guaranteed) contract
>
   I believe Toni Kukoc's contract has an escape clause, if Toni wants to
join the NBA he can drop his contract.  The point is that he has now a
*rich*, *long*, *guaranteed* contract (he's the best paid player in
Europe), what can the Bulls offer him (apart from excitement?)

	Massimo


--
        Massimo Campostrini
Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare, Sezione di Pisa,
Piazza Torricelli 2, I-56126 Pisa, Italy  ||  Phone: (+39)(50)42093
Internet: campo@sunthpi3.difi.unipi.it    ||  Fax:   (+39)(50)48277
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: smw@ira7.ecn.purdue.edu (S. M. WU)
Subject: Ex-Boiler (was: Re: Sonic Injuries 12-21-92)
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 01:27:44 GMT

In article <1h5pkeINNu77@sumax.seattleu.edu> davidy@sumax.seattleu.edu (Stimpson J. Cat) writes:
>
>	Rumor has it Seattle will start Steve Scheffler at center because of
>the thiness. 
>

Is Steve Scheffler the only ex-Boiler in NBA right now???
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro