From: gting@fraser.sfu.ca (Gabriel Sii Kuok Ting)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Cold war against ISLAM (Part-1)
Date: 22 Jul 92 07:50:51 GMT
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada

Sorry, but I HAD to barge in here.

eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:

>In article <KYTAN.92Jul20105455@mantra.fia.dmg.ml.com> kytan@mantra.fia.dmg.ml.com (Kok-Yong Tan) writes:

>: 
>: >What gives here?
>: 
>: You must remember that the next in line, in terms of fanatacism, are people like
>: the Moonies.  And they proclaim themselves to be Christians.  So, it's not
>: Muslims that the world media are against.  Just kooks.  Especially ones
>: dangerous to others' health.
>Not the world media. The Western Media.
>It is what they perceive as kooks(?). I still do not understand why people
>call Khomeini as a dictator when he does not have any official power. His
> official tittle is only as a religious leader which is againt Muslim principle.
>In true ISLAMic government style, the head of state must have absolute power
> like a president of USA. Of course with consultations and he can be removed
> by the majority. 
Against Muslim principle. I like that. Then why in hell does everyone (well
almost) in Iran (and Muslims around the world) support Khomeini? A true Islamic
nation may be a good thing, but  how many countries out there are a pure
Islamic nation that actually WORK? Too few to sufficiently influence the media
from changing the negative views portrayed by the unfortunate terrorist
activities of some so-called Islamic nations. Judging by your definitions of
an Islamic state,
it sounds pretty much like a dictatorship, and you know what the
sensational-news-are-us media thinks of such a nation. (Cuba, Libya, to name 
a few)  

>	The IRANIAN religious leader can only advice or give fatua regarding
>religious laws, but he does not have the mechanism to enforce it. It is up
>to the people to do it. Of course Iranians respect Khomeini more that their
>President, but that is their choice. If the Americans will respect their pope
>or whatever more than their President , that is their choice. You cannot say
>that the pope is a dictator. In fact it is the complete democratic process,
>where people's choice is paramount.
To the west, or some of the so-called "civilised" world, these kind of
religious teachings might constitute brain-washing, ala Hitler. How else
would you explain someone who can rouse up a whole nation to chant "Death
to America, the Great Satan" when all it did was to support the Shah, Khomeini's
opponent, even if it was for oil? Or can you blame them for jumping on the 
same for blatantly playing God and urging the people to murder a writer? 
Please define "civilised" for me. You don't find the Pope pronouncing that
the producer of "The Last Temptation of Christ" should be castrated for doing
what he did, do you?

>	What is so extremist about Iranian revolution? Was it because of
>the executions of war criminals? I though after world war 2 there were a lot
>of executions of war criminals judged by generals, not even proper judges.
>At least in Iran they are judged by Islamic judges, with witnesses called 
>to the stand. The generals are not involved as judges, I mean the revolutionary
>guards and soldiers loyal to the Islamic revolution. Because in Islam, only
>certain people with certain criteria can be Judges. Professionals soldiership
>is not an important criteria.
Hmm... I thought they do that in all courts of law? Using proper judges, I
mean? And witnesses. 

>	Why are they so scared of Iran? They even support Iraq, which is
>a proven dictator. Now tell me who is the most dangerous ones. The religious
>ones or the ones who pretend to be religious.
Good question.

>	Do you know what NAZI means. I THINK it is Nationalist Socialists
>Christians. They claim to represent Christianity. Even the Irish REpublican
>army claims to be Catholics, so their battle was supposed to be based on
>Religion, but do they follow Christian practices.
Flame on:
Are you actually trying to say that the media SUPPORTS the Nazis and the IRA??
Flame off.

>	Come on. It is more than that. You just have to ask a lot more 
>questions.
True. You're only asking the wrong ones. Try asking from a civilised/uncivilised
perspective. To the west, anything not western is considered uncivilised, and
unfortunately, Islam never was a major part of the western civilisation.
Christianity was, and you wonder why Christianity is better supported by the
western media.


>--
>Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,
>Nanyang Technological University, Singapore 2263.
>Internet Email: eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg
>Bitnet Email: eoahmad@ntuvax.bitnet

Gabriel Ting
Disclaimer: SFU had NOTHING to do with this post other than letting me post
this. All views are mine and there's no guarantee on them being the same as
anybody else's. Discussions welcome. Please redirect flames to >/dev/null.