From: josh@viewlogic.com (Josh Marantz)
Newsgroups: fj.mail-lists.x-window
Subject: Re: PC-Xview Remote for Windows and DOS
Date: 8 Jan 93 22:17:49 GMT
Distribution: fj
Organization: Viewlogic Systems, Inc.

Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 18:33:51 GMT
Message-Id: <1993Jan8.183351.25665@viewlogic.com>
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x


>Anybody out there have used PC-Xview Remote for Windows or for DOS.
>NCD's brochure claims it's 10 times faster than SLIP or PPP. What
>applications have you ran on that shows decent performance. Also,
>anybody used a Silicon Graphics as the host.
>
>Thanks in advance.
>Constantine Orogo, cdost+@pitt.edu

I'm using it quite a bit.  Up until recently, I've used their Windows
version, and been generally happy, although I've had a great deal of
frustration with the keyboard, especially with respect to the modifier
keys, auto-repeat, etc.  I can go into more detail if you like.  It
may seem like a minor point, but you can get incredibly irritated when
the keyboard doesn't work right.  I've been discussing this problem
with them for almost a year, since before Spectragraphics was acquired
by NCD, and things have slowly become more tolerable, but they're
definitely not there yet.

Believe it or not, one of the things I really liked about the Windows
version was the Window window-management, which Motif & Open-Look
could learn a lot from (check out Alt-Tab)!  It has excellent
facilities for keyboard navigation through windows, far better than
twm, which I was quite happy with before MS Windows.  Unfortunately,
in Windows you can't type into a partially obscured window, which
really sucks.  Of course, being able to access other Windows programs
while running X clients is probably pretty important to most PC
people, and overrides other technical considerations.

What would be really cool here is for NCD to supply me an Xlib DLL
that used Windows DDE to talk to the server, allowing me to do X
development under Windows.  Of course, if you're on Windows, you'll
probably get better results coding to the Windows API.  So there
probably isn't a market for such a product, although I'd use it.
Besides, if I want Deskview/X, I know where to find it (Quarterdeck).

I'm using the DOS version now, which has much more of workstation feel
to it, and better performance than the Windows version.  One
especially nifty feature is that it takes advantage of my 1meg video
card, even though my screen resolution is 1024x768.  When I bump the
mouse against the top and bottom of the display, it does a lightning
fast, smooth vertical pan.  I can store most of an xterm window
off-screen, and pan to it with a flick of the mouse.

They provide a Motif-like window manager, which is adequate.  I'd
prefer twm, but it's too slow over the phone line, especially with
OpaqueMove!  It does work, though.  I understand that this window
manager was a Spectragraphics creation from before the merger, and the
NCD hardware-based local window manager is more powerful.  Perhaps
we'll see that on the PC sometime soon.  I definitely would like to
see the MS Windows keyboard window navigation features integrated in,
though.

For both the DOS and Windows products, the speed is better than you
might expect.  Emacs seems to run almost as fast through Xremote as it
does using Kermit, through a 9600 baud modem.  But it's better than
Kermit because I get >24-line windows, the Alt-key works, and I can
run other X clients.  GUI intensive programs are a bit more painful.
I still do most textual things from Emacs, even when I'm on the Sun
console.  With a little patience, I've been able to do some real work
with Viewlogic's Electrical CAE tools (schematic capture, mainly).
But if I were going to design the next generation microprocessor, I'd
use the native Windows version instead of trying to use the Sun stuff
the phone line!

Overall, I have a number of quibbles, but PC-Xview is relatively new
and is improving.  It is revolutionary technology, allowing me once
again to work effectively from home, using hardware that I had on my
desk already.  The last time I could do that was when a vt102 and a
1200 baud modem was the state of the art, and the GUI was DEC'S VMS
equivalent to curses (SMG).  With faster modems and digital phone
lines, the situation will get even better.

I'm curious, has anyone used VisionWare's XVision with Xremote?  How
has your experience compared to mine?
-- 
Joshua Marantz                          You make my life and times
Viewlogic Systems,                        a book of bluesy Saturdays
josh@viewlogic.com                      And I have to choose...