HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: FOCA: And I quote.....
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 05:50:58 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.IBM.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In  <1992Aug17.213604.21970@ncsu.edu>  dsh@odin.ece.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
> In article <1992Aug17.203431.19143@watson.ibm.com>
> margoli@watson.ibm.com writes:
>
> >dsh@zeus.csc.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
>
> >> garvin+@cs.cmu.edu (Susan Garvin) writes:
>
> >>>john@anasazi.com writes:
>
> >>>> Hmmm... that's odd. I heard a PRO-CHOICE advocate state that 1% of
> >>>> abortions in the US are in the 3rd trimester. These must be very
> >>>> busy and rich doctors.
>
> >>> That's *less* than 1%.
>
> >> The annual number of abortions performed at 21 weeks and after tends
> >> to number in the thousands.
>
> > What does "21 weeks" have to do with "third trimester"?
>
> Premature infants that have been born between 21 and 24 weeks have
> been known to survive.  The reported "third trimester" figures that
> you cite do not represent all post-viability abortions, but only those
> performed after 24 weeks.

In other words, my figures address Mr. Moore's misconception regarding
the number of third-trimester abortions, and your comments had nothing
to do with what he said (quoted above).

> The Alan Guttmacher Institute is the research arm of Planned Parenthood,
> which is one of the largest abortion providers in the United States.

Then they should have a good grasp of the numbers, right?

> >   LESS THEN 100 ABORTIONS ARE PERFORMED EVERY YEAR AFTER THE 24TH WEEK OF
> >   PREGNANCY.
>
> Thousands of abortions are performed every year past the 21st week of
> pregnancy.

Two questions, Doug.  Is the 21st week before or after the 24th week?
In what trimester does the 21st week occur?

A bonus question.  Do your comments regarding the number of abortions
performed at 21 weeks have any bearing whatsoever on Mr. Moore's comments
about third-trimester abortions?

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
Newsgroups: alt.activism
From: mrmu@leland.Stanford.EDU (Marianne Mueller)
Subject: genocide (was: "ethnic cleansing")
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 05:03:41 GMT

|> "THIRTEEN TRANSPORTS, comprising 13,000 Jews, were sent from Theresienstadt
|> to ghettos of the Lublin  district between  March 12 and June 13, 1942.  At
|> least  6,000 of  these Jews  were  murdered in  Sobibor and  about 7,000 in
|> Belzec." (Testimony of Yehuda Lerner)

I'm not with it.  Is anything happening in the bay area to demand that
the rich men who run

	DUPONT
	GENERAL MOTORS
	XEROX
	etc

get their asses together and stop the genocide?  It could be pointed
out that they have the means and the motivation, since no small number
of Deutsche Marks are currently burning in the nightly fires (causing
said CEO's bad dreams, maybe).   

Seriously, the West can do something, and I wonder if anyone in the
bay area is trying to jump up and down and demand that something
decent and humane and loving be done, now, quick. 

If anything is going on, please post to alt.activism.  Thanks. 

Meanwhile, thousands of 20 year olds from Czechoslovakia are being
massed in the wilds of central Europe, training for their journey
south 9 months hence to the certain slaughter.   This is going on.
From: emmett@kpc.com (Emmett Kilgariff)
Subject: Re: THE OCTOBER SURPRISE -- "The Verdict is Treason (part 2)
Organization: Kubota Pacific Computer Corporation, Santa Clara, CA
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 18:13:03 GMT

In article <2A8D2A9F.6694@orion.oac.uci.edu> cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman) writes:
>misc.activism.progressive Auto-Poster writes
>
>> As for Bush and Casey, prosecutor O'Rourke failed to demonstrate
>> that they could NOT have been in Paris on the relevant days. 
>
>So much for the standards of justice of the hard left. Unless you can prove  
>that you could not _possibly_ have commited the crime, you are automatically  
>assumed to be guilty. I like that. 
>
>"Mr Barzilai, can you _prove_ that you were not the mastermind behind the  
>labour union firebombings against the New York Post news stands ? The labour  
>union shootings of Greyhound busses ? The labour union hand grenade attacks  
>against the homes of drywallers ?"
>
>"... No, you can't ? Well, in that case the
>
>                   V E R D I C T   I S   M U R D E R
>
>Lets go and execute you.".
>

	I'm not up on the Oct Suprise, but the if The Auto-Poster's statement
just means they didn't have an alibi - not enough to prove guilt, but usually
used (along with plenty of other information) to help build a case for guilt.




Xref: sparky alt.activism:14762 talk.politics.misc:39456
From: Chris.Holt@newcastle.ac.uk (Chris Holt)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.guns
Subject: Re: UFO "October Surprise" and USA TAKEOVER?!
Date: 5 Aug 92 09:47:23 GMT
Organization: University of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK, NE1 7RU


        [sci.skeptic and alt.conspiracy removed from Newsgroups line]

[Why am I doing this?  I should know better...]

cescript@mtu.edu (Charles Scripter) writes:

>Actually, it appears that areas with the most firearms have the
>lowest crime rates (perhaps because the risk to the peretrator is
>too great).  Likewise, they appear to be *highest* in regions with
>the most restrictive gun laws.

People keep saying this as though it means
        Restrictive gun laws cause high crime rates.
A rather more likely situation is
        High crime rates cause restrictive gun laws;
in which case the question that has to be answered (and hasn't been)
is, would the crime rates have been higher or lower without the
restrictive gun laws?  It probably depends on availability nearby,
whether you're looking at short term differences vs. long term
changes in attitudes, and a host of other things that make any
such study unreliable; but saying that gun laws are useless because
places that have such laws have a lot of crime is not an argument.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Chris.Holt@newcastle.ac.uk      Computing Lab, U of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     "NP-complete do you call it, Sir?  I wish it were undecidable."
Xref: sparky alt.activism:14673 talk.politics.misc:39071 alt.individualism:5216
From: Chris.Holt@newcastle.ac.uk (Chris Holt)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,alt.individualism
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Date: 5 Aug 92 10:25:58 GMT
Organization: University of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK, NE1 7RU


        [soc.motss dropped from Newsgroups line]

dasher@well.sf.ca.us (D Anton Sherwood) writes:

>Actually, individualists _do_ owe each other one thing, which transforms us
>from cannibals to social animals:  to refrain from invading each other's
>person and property.

Did anyone else think of the Good Samaritan at this point?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Chris.Holt@newcastle.ac.uk      Computing Lab, U of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     "NP-complete do you call it, Sir?  I wish it were undecidable."
Newsgroups: alt.activism,misc.headlines,alt.desert-storm,talk.politics.misc
From: dswartz@sw.stratus.com (Dan Swartzendruber)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,misc.headlines,alt.desert-storm,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: U.S. "TO PROVOKE IRAQ" on MONDAY
Date: 18 Aug 92 20:15:58 GMT
Followup-To: alt.activism
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <l92kj8INNf5n@spim.mips.com>, mpolen@gelato.mips.com (Michael Polen) writes:
> Michael P. Deignan (KD1HZ)) writes:
> |> harelb@MATH.CORNELL.EDU (Harel Barzilai) writes:
> |> 
> |> >Topic 31        -> U.S. TO PROVOKE IRAQ MONDAY <-       2 responses 
> |> 
> |> How does it feel to be consistantly wrong?
> |> 
> |> 
> Since it was a White House leak, I can live with it.

Which Harel bit on, hook line and sinker because it plays right into
his US can do no right world view.

-- 

Dan S.
From: aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer)
Subject: Re: "Sandinista Mismanagement": Somoza's Legacy
Organization: Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 00:36:56 GMT

In article <9208192255.AA01643@poly.math.cornell.edu> harelb@MATH.CORNELL.EDU (Harel Barzilai) writes:

>    "Somoza had looted the national treasure and left the country with
>    one of the world's highest per capita debts

The irony of this is amazing. When the Sandinstas where voted out
their last acts where to loot the government stealing cars, office furnature,
buildings, money, and anything else they could gab.

In the end, they where no different from any of the other dictators
they claim to oppose.

  Allen
-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Allen W. Sherzer | "If they can put a man on the Moon, why can't they     |
|  aws@iti.org     |  put a man on the Moon?"                               |
+----------------------247 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15253 alt.news-media:892 alt.activism.d:2764
From: cedman@714-725-3165.nts.uci.edu (Carl Edman)
Subject: Re: Media Bias at Republican Convention
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.news-media,alt.activism.d
Reply-To: cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman)
Date: 22 Aug 92 01:07:26 GMT

Chuck Lavazzi writes
> I don't read "The Nation", but it happens to be a fact that
> the editor of TNR is rather politically conservative by
> all but the most extreme rightist standards.  Have you
> actually looked at the magazine lately? 

Actually I subscribe to it and read most issues religiously. That does not  
alter the fact Michael Kingsley is a leftist and as a matter of fact considers  
himself so. As for the staff of the New Republic it includes everything from  
moderate conservatives like Fred Barnes or Morton Kondracky to self declared  
socialists like Robert Kutner. On average it is a moderately leftists magazine.

> >
> >	Carl Edman
> 
> Chuck
> No .sig, no frills, no foolin'

I gave up on sigs after my first thousand or so posts. IMHO they are slightly  
silly.

	Carl Edman
From: mpolen@gelato.mips.com (Michael Polen)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.individualism,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Age of Consent
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:59:53 GMT
Organization: MIPS Computer Systems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: gelato.mips.com

Jack Newsbaum) writes:
|> >
|> The age where the child assumes full responsibility for his needs, and
|> leaves the guardianship of his parents or other adults. This may be
|> either by his own declaration of emancipation, or it may be by virtue
|> of his parents or other guardians having relinquished responsibility
|> for the child's guardianship. As I see it, this need not be tied down
|> to any specific chronological age.
|> 
|> Any child who has moved out of his parents' home, and assumed total
|> responsibility for his life's needs is, in my opinion, old enough to
|> be considered a legal adult and to make decisions about sexual
|> relationships for himself.
|> 
So if parents kick out a 6 year old child, for any reason (lets say he
reminds daddy of a brother he hated as a child), then that child is
now responsible for his own life and is ready to consent to sexual and
economic offers?
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc
From: Dorothy Morse <dmorse@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: alt.activism
Date: 14 Aug 92 22:31 PDT
Subject: Re: PLEASE USE FREE FAX-BY-EMAIL -- >>S
Nf-ID: #R:1992Aug14.010848.22967@mont.cs.m:-150481764:cdp:1296500284:000:558
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!dmorse    Aug 14 22:31:00 1992


Some trouble getting thru now on the State Dept. fax no., and some
thought that they may simply have unplugged their fax machine.

Two new numbers to try:

Bureau of African Affairs  202-647-6301  (Herman Jay Cohen, Asst. Secy)


Bureau of East African Affairs 202-647-0810  (Mark Johnson, director)


I don't know if these will go through free of charge yet in the SUNET
format--Bernhard may have to set that up.  But they can be tried in
peacenet faxing and from regular fax machines.
 I'm sure we'll hear from Bernhard soon if these will work with SUNET 

Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.drugs
From: fitz@wang.com (Tom Fitzgerald)
Subject: Re: GOP Convention, Houston
Organization: Wang Labs, Lowell MA, USA
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 01:41:10 GMT

> vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu writes

> > Who cares. The only people left on the GOP bandwagon are hardcore
> > Republicans anyways.

cedman@714-725-3165.nts.uci.edu (Carl Edman) writes:

> You mean such stalwart drug warriors as William F
> Buckley, Milton Friedman or George Shultz ? Be serious.
> Large parts of the intellectual leadership of the
> conservative movement have already come out for
> marijuana legalization.

You might notice that the people you're naming are NOT in office.  The
power is in the hands of the Bush league, they're the people that need to
be opposed.

> If you want to demonstrate
> against the current drug prohibition, demonstrate
> against Charlie Rangel (Rep., D-New York)

People like Rangel, and Kerrey of MA, are definitely prohibitionists, but
they're not in a position to do as much harm as the feds.  Along with
Rangel, you can add in Helms, Kemp and Phil Gramm (all Republicans, and far
more influential than Schultz, Friedman and Buckey) as frothing
prohibitionists.

-- 
Tom Fitzgerald   Wang Labs       fitz@wang.com   "I went to the universe today;
1-508-967-5278   Lowell MA, USA                   It was closed...."
Xref: sparky alt.activism:14974 misc.headlines:5677 alt.desert-storm:1708 talk.politics.misc:40282
Newsgroups: alt.activism,misc.headlines,alt.desert-storm,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: U.S. "TO PROVOKE IRAQ" on MONDAY
From: kmcvay@oneb.almanac.bc.ca (Ken Mcvay)
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 00:15:50 GMT
Organization: The Old Frog's Almanac, Vancouver Island, CANADA

In article <1992Aug17.214143.10331@bmerh85.bnr.ca> robinc@bnr.ca (Robin Collins) writes:

>My question is whether or not  military action (of this type) 
>will do political harm  or good to the Bush campaign. 
>I have problems seeing the help that it
>will do. You bomb a few buildings and then what? You destroy the evidence
>you claim you need and then what?
>Althought war mongers may be temporarily pleased with the Rambo treatment,
>won't it do more damage than good politically in the long run?

Not if it occurs within the context of UN-sanctioned military response to
Iraq's non-compliance .    

>For one thing, both Egypt and Syria say they will not participate.

<yawn>

>Iraq is obviously not occupying Kuwait. 

That is not the issue - the issue is non-compliance with United Nations
resolutions and the terms of the cease-fire.

>The Iraqi people are likely to rally behind Hussein if Iraq is attacked.

Right - the Kurds and Shiites will rally 'round Saddam. Sure they will. When
pigs fly.

>Surely most Americans will see this as stupid brutality rather than a
>brilliant manoeuver. 

I'd see it, from Canada, as one more indication that the UN intends to
enforce compliance, and I'd applaud. I would completely support any move to
stop fixed-wing flights in the south, as has been discussed on today's news,
and I don't believe for a single moment that the Shiites would support
Saddam when the Yanks began shooting down whatever's left of his "air
force" in order to enforce the terms of the cease-fire.

>Why would they do it? (I don't even see this as a method of teaching
>lessons in obedience...the child will gain more than the parent, surely.)

Perhaps it would be done because Iraq consistantly refuses full compliance
with UNR 687 and 688 (the only two I am familiar with)... or do you believe
that United Nations resolutions are meaningless and should not be enforced?
-- 
   ----------The Old Frog's Almanac, Vancouver Island, Canada---------
An anonymous Canadian official was asked, in early 1945, how many Jews
would be allowed into Canada after the war. "None," he said, "is too many."
(From the preface of NONE IS TOO MANY, Toronto, 1982. ISBN 0-919630-31-6)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.discrimination,talk.abortion
From: rjohnson@shell.com (Roy Johnson)
Subject: Re: FOCA: And I quote.....
Organization: Houston, TX
	<1992Aug04.225303.33154@watson.ibm.com>
	<Aug06.053904.68099@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>
	<Aug08.040829.32076@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>
	<1992Aug11.185816.26931@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>
Date: 13 Aug 92 12:54:58

mprc@troi.cc.rochester.edu (M. Price) writes:
 >sa114984@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (Steven Arnold) writes:

 >>	The "medical reasons" you cite no doubt include things like being
 >>stressed because the poor girl can't fit into her new swimming suit. 

	I hereby nominate Steven for
 >MostDisgustingMisogynisticProLiferPigofthe Week, based on the above
 >quote.

Why?  The above quote isn't misongynist, it's anti-trite-reasons-for-abortion.

I guess you aren't?
--
Roy Johnson, Shell Development Company (but speaking for myself)

Xref: sparky alt.activism:14876 talk.politics.misc:39987 soc.culture.latin-america:3083
From: harelb@MATH.CORNELL.EDU (Harel Barzilai)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: doubles again -- sorry
Date: 16 Aug 92 06:33:50 GMT
Organization: misc.activism.progressive on UseNet ; ACTIV-L@UMCVMB


"As Chomsky writes" post was posted twice again, for mysterious
reasons. I'll try to be more careful with the email poster.

Harel
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15294 alt.drugs:14944
From: ddc1@jaguar.uofs.edu
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.drugs
Subject: Re: GOP Convention, Houston
Date: 23 Aug 92 09:41:07 GMT
Followup-To: alt.activism
Organization: University of Scranton


		HASTEN THE FALL OF THE POLICE STATE!!!

		     VOTE BUSH/QUAYLE IN `92!!!

	Remember we have to get all the way into it, before people will get
mad...so vote for the oppressors!!!! Don't prolong it any more than we have to.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave D. Cawley		   |	Where a social revolution is pending and,
University Of Scranton	   |	for whatever reason, is not accomplished,
ddc1@jaguar.uofs.edu	   |	reaction is the alternative.
ddc1@SCRANTON		   |				-Daniel De Leon
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.drugs,alt.society.civil-liberty
From: brianm@cc.gatech.edu (Brian N. Miller)
Subject: Re: Broward County Sheriff (was Re: SWAT...)
Organization: Georgia Tech College of Computing
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 00:39:56 GMT

In article <1992Aug17.035229.17253@infonode.ingr.com>, pat@fitz.uucp (Patrick Fitzgerald) writes:
|>
|> I seem to remember an incident in Florida, where police tactics backfired
|> (literally).  The police pulled over a car (driven by suspected drug
|> dealers), and decided to search the trunk of the car; however, the trunk
|> blew up in their faces when they opened it. 

Ha-ha-ha !!!   
Die snoopy Pigs, die!

CAN = Cannabis Action Network
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,misc.headlines
From: nelson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson)
Subject: Re: Derailing the Reagan Revolution: Part zero: highlights
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 13:01:57 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

In article <1992Aug19.003724.6521@meteor.wisc.edu> stvjas@meteor.wisc.edu (Steve Jascourt) writes:
>In article <1992Aug18.013719.3556@desire.wright.edu> demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man) writes:
>> [concerning article he posted from Forbes magazine]
>>	We'll see that while places like Eastern Europe and Mexico use the
>>Supply Side Bible to bootstrap themselves into prosperity, the US, Japan and
>>Europe seem content to emulate the failed socialist systems we defeated in the
>>cold war.
>>
>>Brett                                                      
>
>The systems referred to as "we defeated in the cold war" were NOT socialist.
>The word socialism is filled with mythology. A real socialism would involve
>all of the people in making decisions. It would have to be decentralized, with
>active say by those affected.

  Oh give us a break.   This is like that other poster claiming that
  the Catholic Church, or fanatical fundies, or whatever, are not
  Christian because they don't live up to his idealistic image of 
  what Christianity is "supposed" to be.    If large numbers of people
  say "we are Xists, we are doing this in the name of X" then I'm not
  going to debate with them about the meaning of X -- it's their word
  so I'll let them define it.   In the case of "socialism" it's not 
  as though there is some competing real-world example of the term's
  use that's competing for a place in the meme pool. 
            

  BTW, if Patrick McGuinness, with whom I have a bet about the XSSR
  remaining free is still here -- on NPR yesterday they noted a recent
  poll in Russia on the anniversary of last year's coup:  3/5ths of
  the people said they would welcome another coup and 68% thought that
  another coup would improve their lives.


---peter
Newsgroups: alt.activism
Subject: Re: THE OCTOBER SURPRISE -- A Quick Introduction (part 1) 
From: rivero@mdcbbs.com
Date: 12 Aug 92 13:17:10 GMT
Organization: Electronic Data Systems, Unigraphics Division, Cypress CA
Nntp-Posting-User: rivero

In article <1992Aug11.020252.10381@anomaly.sbs.risc.net>, kd1hz@anomaly.sbs.risc.net (Michael P. Deignan (KD1HZ)) writes:
> harelb@math.cornell.edu (misc.activism.progressive Auto-Poster) writes:
> 
>>    "In effect the jury believed Brenneke and said the American 
>>    government officials were lying.  This verdict and its 
>>    implications of treason were virtually ignored in the American 
>>    national press." 
> 
> Funny, I seem to recall about two months ago a published report indicating
> that the Congressional investigation into the "October Surprise" yielded
> no substantial evidence to prove that such a conspiracy existed.
> 

  The Warren Commision said the same thing, remember? I hate to be the one
to tell you, but the government has been known to lie on occasion.


<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
|  Michael Rivero rivero@mdcbbs.com  Middle-Aged Mutant Ninja Animator   |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
|  I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and    |
| causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . Corporations  |
| have been enthroned, an era of corruption in high places will follow,  |
| and the money-power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign  |
| by working upon the prejudices of the people until the wealth is       |
| aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed.               |
|                                                                        |
|              --- Abraham Lincoln                                       |
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.discrimination,talk.abortion