HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bret@technix.mn.org (Bret Indrelee)
Subject: Re: 20th level mages
Organization: Private System - Saint Paul, MN
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 00:32:06 GMT

In article <8er6LkC00Uh7A475R6@andrew.cmu.edu> "Jordan M. Wolbrum" <jw67+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>If you were a 20th level mage, would you bother enslaving peasants? 
>That would just anger everybody enough to send the adventurers after
>you.  At this point in the mage's life he probably just wants to
>research new spells, or approach godhood, or explore other planes.  Face
>it, there's very little that mere humans can do for him, and much that
>they can do to inconvenience him.  There also are other powerful mages,
>and most people at these levels have some sort of truce, if they want to
>live.

Or go find an artifact or lost knowledge.  Or go explore the underdark,
where there are supposed to be different types of magic.  Only the
Ego-maniac / powermonger is likely to try to rule the world.  Most of
the high level mages would get there because of their search for
PERSONAL power.  Quite a bit different than questing for political
power, at least in a world that has magic.

-Bret
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bret Indrelee               |   Pretend there is something profound
email: bret@technix.mn.org  |   written here.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: covin@tartarus.uchicago.edu (David Covin)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: house-rules
Date: 14 Oct 92 00:04:40 GMT
	<MeqSes600VooM8Bo86@andrew.cmu.edu>
	<1992Oct13.003357.10122@u.washington.edu>
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Chicago Computer Science

In article <1992Oct13.003357.10122@u.washington.edu> scythe@byron.u.washington.edu (The Grim Reaper) writes:

   In article <MeqSes600VooM8Bo86@andrew.cmu.edu> "Joseph E. Beck" <jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
   >
   >From: ccoprdj@prism.gatech.EDU (Jorge Diaz)
   >>Well, gee, you might as well just say "A cleric can spank a mage.  Let's
   >>switch the mage and cleric attacks and hit dice."
   >Please tell me this is a joke.  A cleric can't spank a mage.  Win?
   >Perhaps.  But certainly not a sure thing (sleep, color spray,
   >fireball, etc. come to mind).
   >
   Command-sleep, 

Lasts one round; doesn't work if the mage is suitably intelligent/high level.

   cause blindness, cause light wounds.....

Require a touch.  Compare magic missile, color spray, web, lightning
bolt.  For anything that requires a save, the magic-user will stand a
better chance.

On the other hand, once the spells are done with (very quickly, if the
characters are low-level), the cleric is in *much* better shape than
the mage.

--
David Covin                           covin@despair.uchicago.edu
From: mm68@unix.brighton.ac.uk (Lost Boy)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: familiars and homonculi
Date: 7 Oct 92 12:52:33 GMT
Organization: University of Brighton, UK

edb892rsft@vx24.cc.monash.edu.au writes:
> 
> 
> A player in my campaign wants to get both a familiar and a homonculous
> Is it possible to have both at the same time? I know that a homonculous
> is an alchemic creation cf Montrous Compendium but they seem similar to
> each other......
> 

Since a homonculous is not an actual familar (no find familiar spell is 
needed) then I see no reason why not. The cost of such a creature as I 
recall is quite high component wise so that could be argued as enough of
an offsett for (effectively) two familiars.

If not, who is to say that two (very) different familiars are going to get
on. If you are feeling very mean, one might be killed in competition!

Also, following on from the other response made. Does the 'character' or
the 'player' know about it? The craft of making such a creature is not
commonly known.

I have not had this problem, yet, but I would be partial to just imposing 
strict following of the components and other costs. If things start to 
unbalance then a bit of familiar rivalry might make the mage think twice.




-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|On the end of every wizards staff is a knob! - T.Pratchett                 |
|									    |
|Michael May, Brighton University, Sussex, England			    |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: ccoprdj@prism.gatech.EDU (Jorge Diaz)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: Intelligent opponents
Date: 11 Oct 92 23:59:56 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article <wright.718801697@latcs1.lat.oz.au> wright@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Michael G. Wright) writes:

>Of course, if you want a Dragon that _NO_ party is going to kill (or even get
>away alive from), try the Dragon of Tyr in Dark Sun. Yep, that thing's a sure
>fire Munchkin killer!

But, doesn't it have to be?  Isn't Dark Sun "Munchkin Land"?


-- 
Jorge Diaz                       | "I want you to remember, Clark... in all
Georgia Institute of Technology  |  the years to come, in your most private
Office of Information Technology |  moments...my hand at your throat.  I want
ccoprdj@prism.gatech.edu         |  you to remember the one man who beat you."
Organization: Junior, Mathematics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 14:27:41 -0400 
From: "Peter F. Delaney" <pd1x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: house-rules

In article <1992Oct14.012223.7594@u.washington.edu>,
scythe@byron.u.washington.edu (The Grim Reaper) writes:

> I remember a looong time ago (back when there was only rec.games.frp =)
> someone posted some extra skills for thieves.  There was about 12 skills
> listed, and thieves could pick any 9 to advance in.  Some of the extras
> included Lie Detection, Resist Detect Lie-type spells, umm....

	Yep, that was me.  I wrote that up because I thought thieves had no
real choices when compared with other classes.  Although they could
decide where to put points, that was about the limit of their decisions.
 No specialization, no spell choices, no deity choices, etc.

	I've since replaced the system with a new one.  If people are
interested, I can post it here for public consumption/dissection.  I
will warn that it hasn't been tested yet, and so we don't know if it
works well or not.

Pe+eR
.
Pe+eR Delaney, CMU, Pittburgh, PA ... Compuserve: 73750,3667
Internet: blackclove+@cmu.edu ...  Local: pd1x
PSYCHOLOGY:  The art of getting a really huge government grant
to say, in fancy words, "We don't know why."
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: c188-cr@po.berkeley.edu (Chua Hak Lien)
Subject: Re: The TSR Trap
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 13:59:11 GMT

In article <1992Oct11.080116.8813@leland.Stanford.EDU> loren@leland.Stanford.EDU (Elina Aulikki Compton) writes:
>
>What is up with all of those Dragonlance Authors?  Didn't Weis & Hickman
>create the series?!
'Cause there all people out there willing to read the same fantasy
novel 30-40 times. TSR is the Mills and Boons of fantasy, after all...

>What is happening with Gygax?  Didn't he help create the original rules?
See FAQ.

>TSR should constantly acknowledge Tolkien ( as well as all fantasy 
>authors ) for his works of the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings, as
>well as others such as the Simarilion.   Without the role-playing
>public, TSR would be nothing.  
(Your last sentence didn't seem to have much bearing with your
previous ones. )
Fantasy didn't start and end with Tolkien. His books owe much
to British folklore, but you don't see him saying so, do you? I think
hobbits are derivatives of characters found in Irish folklore...
Anyway, AD&D actually owes more to Jack Vance and the late Fritz Leiber
than Tolkien. 
(As to your last sentence, w/o the role-playing public, SJG, GDW etc.
would be nothing as well, obviously. )


>It will be your own project that would have taken just a little 
>longer than a 3-month campaign.  
Yes, I'm sure all of us have lots of time to spare....

>
>			Scott @ Stanford

I'm not crazy about AD&D rules, but they do get the job done as far as
I'm concerned. AD&D presents * HEROIC * rules, for chars that are larger
than life. And if TSR wants to make a profit out of coming up with
crap, so be it. There is an audience out there who is indiscriminating
enough to want to buy it, after all. But believe it or not, there ARE
actually some good products out there. Dark_Sun, for example. (White_Wolf
thought so too, giving it 4/5 rating. ) And for those who don't have time
to plan out their own adventures, there are a large supply of modules
and magazines to help one out, which is more than one can say for a lot
of other products. What the RPG public chooses to play is hardly T$R's
fault.

Chua
+==+

Common sense is not so common.
			- Voltaire
From: dcarroll@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu (Dana Carroll)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: A modest proposal concerning HEALING
Date: 15 Oct 92 15:19:47 GMT
Organization: Ohio University CS Dept,. Athens

The way I do my healing spells is to allow them to get better along with the
Cleric casting them:

Cure Light:  D6 + (1 per level above 1st)
Cure Serious: 2D8 + (1 per)
Cure Critical: 3D10 + (1 per)
Heal: All hit points regained

Notice only Cure serious uses the same dice as the books.  I allow Heal to
restore all lost hit points, because a peasant with 2 hp getting a Heal
spell from the books could fall unconscious and start bleeding!

This system has worked very well, and is not unbalancing.

--Meariki the Ruthless


*******************************************************************************
*                                      *                                      *
* 0 0  Dana Carroll                    *  No matter how much you know,        *
*  ^   Great Math God                  *  you don't know much.                *
* `-'  dcarroll@oucsace.cs.OhioU.edu   *                                      *
*                                      *                                      *
*******************************************************************************
From: Devon_Sheppard@mindlink.bc.ca (Devon Sheppard)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: Kobolds (Re: Intelligent opponents)
Date: 13 Oct 92 09:18:27 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

Ken Arromdee writes:

>Another point about the kobolds with green slime buckets as weapons: What
>would you do to PCs who tried to do that to the monsters?

>You would no doubt think of some reason why not only would it not work most
of
>the time, but it'd be too hazardous for any sane player to do.  Now,
remember
>most of those reasons apply to the kobolds too....

>Ken Arromdee (UUCP: ....!jhunix!arromdee; BITNET: arromdee@jhuvm;

... and of course, the point that >I< really wondered about... these buckets
can be made of neither wood nor metal, so your kobolds are hauling around
stone buckets full of green slime?! Give the monsters unreasonable advantages
like these, and of course they'll win.

Play the monsters intelligently, but do it fairly as well.

  Devon

--
devon_sheppard@mindlink.bc.ca

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: bret@technix.mn.org (Bret Indrelee)
Subject: Re: Kobolds (Re: Intelligent opponents)
Organization: Private System - Saint Paul, MN
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 01:19:25 GMT

In article <Bw3C2p.Fz9@news.cso.uiuc.edu> rsm58307@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Ron) writes:
[ Next block of text converted to lower case.  I hate people who shout...]

>>note cloudkill doesn't rise; thus a u-bend (like the one in a sink)
>>will prevent it from going further (the vietcong used similar traps
>>for tear-gas agents in vietnam)
>
>Yeah sure. Who's the kobold genius who figured this shit out? "Hmm. Human
>wizard have cloud kill. I stop him by making U-bend not unlike that used
>by Vietcong."

Maybe they tore apart a beaver dam.  I think that beavers also put a trap
in the tunnel leading into their lodge...can someone confirm this?  The
use of a bend as a trap for gas has been used for a long time.  It doesn't
take any great skill to build either, so I would tend to allow the Kobalds
to do it.

-Bret

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bret Indrelee               |   Pretend there is something profound
email: bret@technix.mn.org  |   written here.
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology-Office of Information Technology
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 13:01:54 EDT
From: Paul Goodwin <CC100PG@GITVM1.GATECH.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: stats for Aliens
 <14941@chalmers.se> <1992Oct12.101912.1461@ccsvax.sfasu.edu>

Hmmmm...sounds like the novel version of Aliens was closer to some of the
original screen-concepts than the final movie.  (Got the collector's
set for Aliens, and it has, in addition to some other stuff, some of the
earlier concepts for the movie...which included poison tail-stingers).

Paul
From: weeks@astroatc.uucp (Pat Weeks)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: XP...
Keywords: XP
Date: 12 Oct 92 16:55:53 GMT
Organization: Astronautics Technology Cntr, Madison, WI


	Well, as far as monsters go they gave a pretty good guideline in the
DMG, but certain larger abilities should be modifies accordingly by the GM
involved.  If GM's give XP for magical items then no extra XP other than the
+1 hit die should be added to the monster XP, because if they defeat him, they 
will get the XP and stuff anyway!!  If no XP for magic is given then perhaps 
the monster XP should increase by the XP of the magic items...

	As far as mages and stuff, I think NPC XP should be equal to or a 
proportion of the XP that NPC possesses.  I personnaly think it's fair to give
out 80000 XP if you are successful in killing an 8th level mage.  Hey, he's
smart, he could take out a high-level party by himself although he usually
has some cool henchmen to help out...as well as nasty items...  Actually I
should say it should be more like 20000 XP...25% of it...  And speaking of
20000XP...   20000XP for a dragon??  Come on!  That's ridiculous!!


						Ghostwheel
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (SilverFang Ahroun)
Subject: Re: house-rules
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 02:35:36 GMT

boelter3945@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:

>In article <1992Oct9.145716.5145@Princeton.EDU>, tao@potato.princeton.edu
>   (Terry Tao) writes:
>> I'm all for doing away with percentile strength ! (sorry Mr munchkin..) not
>> only is it unfair to other non-warriors, the difference between 18 and 19
>> strength is so massive that any race with a +1 to strength suddenly gets
>> super 18/00 strength far too often!
>> 

>   Just a curious question, but when you have such a race (+1 to strength)
>and you rolled an 18 strength (for example), doesn't that +1 just move you to
>the next higher category (18/01) instead of a full jump (19)?  That's the way
>I've always run things like that.

Most of the races that get a strength bonus state the highest that it will
take the stat is 18. The only place  where I've seen this being a possibile  
problem is in Dark Sun (aka. Munckins in Paradise).

Axly

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: joeg@meaddata.com (Joe Gayda)
Subject: Re: Missed Move Silently Results
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 19:42:07 GMT
Distribution: na

|> >With a thief, you're the 2nd worst in hand to hand, have the worst
|> >saving throw table, have the 2nd worst  HP die, don't have spell use,
|> >and have abilities that are countered/duplicated by magic of 1st/2nd
|> >level.  Doesn't sound very powerful to me.  

Now, I think the idea of switching the thief's THAC0 and HD with the
clerics has some merit.  I still argue, that the thief is the best
class for adventuring, especially when acting as an individual.

Although many of the thief's skills can be duplicated through spells,
no other class can REMOVE mechanical traps.  Most magical traps, the
thief has 1/2 his Find and Remove Traps percentage as the chance for
success.  This may be my interpretation, but unlike other classes that
get a +2 for behind, a thief gets his +4.  (It's not a backstab, but
he's still more proficent)  Spells run out, but your thieving skills
don't.

Given 160,000 XP:

Class  LEVEL THAC0   ---- % chance of spell failure ----
                     5th     6th     7th     8th    9th
--------------------------------------------------------
Thief   10    16     25%     25%     25%     25%    25%
Mage     9    18      0%     15%     25%     35%    45%
Fighter  8    13      NA      NA      NA      NA     NA
Cleric   8    16      5%     15%     30%      NA     NA


  - The thief has the second best THAC0, AND if he is fighting from
    behind, he is ONLY one worse than the fighter.  He is TWO better
    than the cleric, and SEVEN better than the mage.  This can make
    a big difference when the rogue reads a scroll/spell that then
    requires a THACO hit, such as chromatic orb.  (He'd kick ass!)
  
  - Notice the "advantage" of "less failure" when reading higher
    level scrolls.  The thief is better than the mage or the cleric!!

  - The thief can READ BOTH CLERIC AND MAGE scrolls.  That is VERY
    powerful.

  Minor advantages:

  - A mage reading a scroll with have an AC of 10 plus an protective
    magic.  A thief can have at least an AC of 7.  3 pts could mean
    life or death!!
 
  - Thief is already attracting henchmen.


  Drawbacks:

  - 2nd Lowest Hit dice
  
  - Acquiring Scrolls.  However I prefer the method of taking out low
    level mages, (1st to 6th), with a backstab.  Then using their
    spellbooks as scrolls.  (Special to our campaign world.  Spells on
    either side of the one read are lost, and 1% chance book explodes.)


  Since no other class provides this amount of versatility, I think
  high level thiefs are exceedingly fun.  Of course, I've yet to have
  a character live past 7th or 8th level...


--
Joe Gayda           | The probability of       |          (513) 865-1560   
Mead Data Central   | someone watching you     |     
P.O. Box 933        | is proportional to the   |       joeg@meaddata.com
Dayton, Ohio  45401 | stupidity of your action | ...!uunet!meaddata!joeg

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: skomedal@solan.unit.no (Knut Torstein Skomedal)
Subject: Re: A modest proposal concerning HEALING
Organization: Norwegian Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 20:10:51 GMT

 I've got the various priest spells from the FTP-sites at Caltech and greyhawk.
Among those spells you find:

cure minor 2d8+1 (2nd level)
cure moderate 3d8+3 (3rd level)
cure serious 4d8+5 (4th level)
cure critical 5d8+8 (5th level)

with these you get more healing  and a better progression of the relative power
of the spells. that goes a long way towards solving the problem of healing up
characters with lots of hit points without using the Heal spell.

Knut Skomedal
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton)
Subject: Re: Killing Liches with Staves of the Magi, HA!!!
Reply-To: dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 21:05:34 GMT

In article <RANNOU.92Oct8175430@watson.info.polymtl.ca>, Rannou@info.polymtl.ca (Patrick Rannou) writes:
|> In article <1992Oct7.132008.2170@bnr.ca> dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton) writes:
|> 
|> 
|>    In article <oeoa8tq00Uh7A8RNJD@andrew.cmu.edu>, "Jordan M. Wolbrum" <jw67+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|>    |> Seriously, I was just joking around about the staff thing!
|> 
|>    I broke a Wand of Fireballs one time.  It involved a large dragon, a character with
|>    very few hit points, an evil alignment, and a teleport spell.  96 Charges left!  I
|>    lived, but the rest of my party and the dragon were scattered all over the astral
|>    plane.  Nothing a few resurection spells couldn't help :):)
|> 
|>    That's evil for ya!
|> 
|> That's also a very stupid GM. You could never have dropped the teleport
|> spell in time: The moment you break the want, BOOOOM!
|> 
|> And who's a point-zero? YOU, the evil (and stupid, unless he's sure his
|> friends will succeed at resurrecting his charred remains, but I find that
|> doubtful...) mage. ASnd know also that although som,e special display can
|> exist from a magic item if it's broken, wether there is 1 or 96 charges in
|> them won't make a KABOOM unless it's a retributive strike (and to last
|> account such strikes are found ONLY on wands of the magi and w. of force).
|> Now, this r.strike MUST be magically activated. i.e.: by hand.
|> 
|> You can't just teleport the wand over the dragon, let it break when it
|> falls to the ground, and kaboom at long range. You must "activate": this
|> special power yourself. You'll die for sure.
|> 
|> And IF an item could do such damage by being broken, then I'm sure the
|> first time you fell into one of these common 10'feet deep traps, you'd have
|> remembered it for a looong time.
|> 
|> BOOOM! "Huh, where am I... it looks like fire everywhere, and people
|> screaming... Oh, I'm in Hell... YAY!"
|> 
|> End of PC.

Wrong wrong wrong!  Read it again.  I said I threw the wand to the ground, activated
the explosion and teleported away.  Teleport is a 1 segment spell.  There's enough
time.  My old DM ruled that all wands and staves could be used in retributive
strikes - his world.

Don Clayton
a.k.a. Rear-Adm. Maverick, DM of the Drow
My brain, my thoughts, my words.
If I had a million dollars, I'd buy you a K-car (a nice reliant automobile),
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
From: skomedal@solan.unit.no (Knut Torstein Skomedal)
Subject: RE:healing
Organization: Norwegian Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 92 15:58:06 GMT


Hey, When we enter this subject, wouldn't it be an idea to think about
the basis for those inflated hit point totals?

I mean, aren't most of a fighters Hit points supposed to be due to 
fighting skills (i'e. parrying, dodging to avoid being hit),
pain tolerance, exhaustion and so forth? 
I believe someone aired the opinion that a highlevel character had maybe max 10
"bodily" hit points, while the rest was based on skills acuired in adventuring.
Something of thge sort is also discussed in the character description of the 
Fencing Master class presented in dragon magazine. 
(I've got the Best of Dragon edition.)
If so, wouldn't most of the fighters hit points return when he's had a 
chance to catch his breath after the fight?

I think this is one of the paradoxes in the AD&D system.
Of course, incorporating something like that in the healing process could
complicate the process enormously, and would probably dispence with healing
for the most part. (Gets his hit points back after(how long?); when do we start
spending the physical hit points? (probably the last to go)). Voila, ready 
to fight again. After all, the character would catch his breath, suppress 
most of the pain, and would certainly not lose the ackuired skills.

Does this sound funny? I certainly can't think of a good way to add something
like this to the system.


Knut Skomedal