From: ejohnfel@csws17.ic.sunysb.edu ()
Subject: This Interracial thingy?
Originator: ejohnfel@csws17.ic.sunysb.edu
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 05:19:56 GMT

Hmmmm,

	Ya know I was enjoying this whole long series of posts on
this interracial thing until my bullshit detector went bust. Lets set a
few things straight Einstein (That means you Bill)...

Bill writes...
>They're slimy bastards who don't know shit about culture, just look at
>	them, going after Chinese-ge females because "They're easy"
>	Easy for what?  Easy to get into bed, because that's all Caucasian-cu
>	wants... F**K F**K and then more F**King.

	Concerning this point, THE STREET GOES BOTH WAYS bud. Since I must
admit there is quite a bit of F**King going on, the most important point is
that it takes two to tango, unless there is an awful lot of rape going on
that I don't hear about. And besides, I've never met and easy AFs, one
AAF though, but that was a rumor. Say, you couldn't intro me to some of the
easy AFs you know Bill, could you?

	Pertaining to the slimy bastards, I only see one at this juncture,
and he ain't a CM  >:(   And as for being culturally deficient, I'll agree.
Most Americans are very niave to the real (and beautifully rich and diverse
cultures of the..) world. So maybe its a good thing that he (the CM looking
for AFs) to get a little culture and find himself a lady of the asian
persuasion (sp?). And learn about her history eh? (Ya know, building the
world wide family two people at a time, and that sort of other goody-two-shoes
stuff)

Bill once more, waxing philosophical....
>Again, let's get back to my original point.

You actually had one?

>(1) Caucasian-ge men who prefer Chinese-ge women
>(2) Chinese-ge men who prefer Chinese-ge women
>Why do Caucasian-ge jerks see no problem with #2 but think that #1 is
>normal?

        You know this really ties in wth some thoughts I've been having...
why is that some people find eating pigs knuckles normal? Or liver for that
matter? Bill, face it, they like ASIAN women. It is NOT normal when you
hate somthing that you like, then you are schitzo, know what I mean partner..

Bill...
>The Caucasians-cu don't know shit about respect.

	Bravo, very good generalization, apparently neither do you. Hmmm,
does that make YOU caucasian-cu?

>They don't call their parents in respoect, no they use their first names.

	I am adopted, however, my cousin calls his parents, Ma'am and Sir.
Does that count? My best friend friend George "the Boomer" Boomgaard calls
his pop "dad" and his mom "mom". What would you like us to do, lay prostrate
on the floor and praise our almighty parental units? Do you?

Bill again...
>They don't give a shit about their wifes, look at the high devorce rate
>	(but wait, aren't Asian divource rates on par with Caucasian?
>	Doesn't matter, I'm taking a Dwight-like view, remember?)

	And asians do (give a shit about their wives that is)? My GF worked
in a Chinese restaurant where her Hong Kong born boss made several passes at
her (of course not while his over bearing Cantonese wife was around). And
made several references about setting her up in Queens with a brothel that
hires asian college girls for services. Of course he admits to her that he 
frequents the place, and even goes on to describe how one young (and very
mislead) lady got SOOOOOO hot while giving him a back rub the she just
had to gush her sexual fluids all over him (imagine that, he has a dick on
his backside, amazing).

Bill...
> <Still in Dwight mode>

	Spare us with the sophmoric humor, one jerk is enough.

Bill...
> Because British Caucasian-cu's went in and pillaged our country with
> their superior Weapons and inferior morality.  Because they took away

	Ok, buckeroo, hold on here just a sec while I whip out my
thermo-nuke flame thrower..... (.....rumbling noises.....).

	I was almost agreeing with you up to here. I'm lost here? Was this
Brit thing before or after the war lords divied up China and raped and
pillaged it themselves? As history shows the Brits weren't the first to use
China as a door mat. As I recall, Japan seemed to have this interest in
conquering China, and oh yes... lest we not forget the war lords who pretty
much F**Ked (in more ways then one) China over a few centuries for
personal gain (and then some).

	Are you still in Dwight mode here?

	As for inferior morality, when I read this... thats when my BS
detector hit its max and blew up. Which morality is this we are referring
to here? The British hypocracy of the opium trade, or the corruption of the
Chinese officials that made it so easy for the Brits to use China as a 
"stationary" target for their version of Gun-Boat Diplomacy?

	Or perhaps its the same superior morality that lead Mao to starve
hundreds of thousands in order to pay back loans to Russia? Or perhaps the same
superior morality that lead to the Cultural Revolution where many a famous
scholars and artists met their demise in "Hospitals" and jails? Or perhaps
the same morality present when the Lu Shen was harassed by the Guomidong (sp)
party.

	Or perhaps, dare is say...... ok, why not, its cliched by now but
I must,
				Tianiman Square (sp)

	<Gasp.... Gulp....>

	Heck my GF's father is a professor at Jaio Tong (a definite spelling
mistake) University, in Shanghai, and despite the soothing remarks of the
morally SUPERIOR upper-echelons of China, he (and she who is my SO) remarked
that there was a noticable decline in the student body (no pun intended)
after that episode.

	So much for superiority eh?

	Is Dwight dead yet? Excuse my ramblings, let me not digress... I have
plenty of ammo left.

>their superior Weapons and inferior morality.  Because they took away
>our pride in being Chinese.  But guess what?  We don't deny our Chinese
>ethnicity, unlike some people, and we don't condemn Chinese-cu out
>of hand.  We don't generalize about Chinese-cu and it's evilness.
>We don't even generalize about Caucasian-cu and it's evilness.
>We just say, they're nice people, sure, but we'd rather marry our own
>people.

	Hold on a sec Bill, your logical arguments are beginning to fade
here. Who stole China's self-esteem? According to Lu Shen China caused its
own internal problems, and Lu Shen was by far a more learned man and greater
philosopher then the two of us put together, and unlike you or I he was born
in China when it hit bottom. He felt China's problems were due to it's own
self-neglect, Chinese were numb to what was happening to them in some
instances.

	I don't know who you hang out with but let me tell you this, Chinese
history is full of the same SH*T that went on in Europe and America. I hear 
stories from many friends who are coming to the US now from China. And really
hasn't changed all that much, interpersonal BS (lying, stealing, cheating,
overall not-very-niceness) is still living high on the hog in places like
Shanghai, Canton, and gazillions of small villages.

	The asian community here at USB has a few pains in the ass that seem
to personify the worst in asian culture. However, let me state for the record
that in general, ALL 'pains in the ass' (ie everybody who is human and a pain
in the ass) tend to make me grouchy (present company included Bill).

	Whats worse are the pundits of stupidity who the rest of us must
unfortunately face each day. :(

Bill again, oh joy!
> of hand.  We don't generalize about Chinese-cu and it's evilness.

	But we do generalize about others evilness don't we? Hmmm, my racism
detector is beginning to hum.

> We don't even generalize about Caucasian-cu and it's evilness.

	Wait a sec, then what was the biz about inferior morality? Now you
really got me confused. Will the real Billy Chan please stand up!

> We just say, they're nice people, sure, but we'd rather marry our own
> people.

	But what if they don't, does this make THEM a bad asian/Chinese?
Obviously not. To each his own, if Dwight wants to be caucasion, let him?
If Michel Jackson wants to be caucasion, let him... If Joe Schmo wants to
be a fat, 6 foot 1 transvestite with a pink mohawk, I say more power to him, 
heck this is America, Land of the free, home of the truly weird.

	Dwight writes..
>>But naturally, Chinese-cu jerks think that this is okay and normal.

	First off, they ain't jerks, second, its not, I am sorry to
tell you this, but that is reality Dwight, people feel what they feel.
You nor I have the right to tell them what they should think and calling
them "jerks" isn't going to win any brownie points with'em, I submit
Billy boy as my proof.

(continuing Dwight's diatribe)
>>50 or so posts to this group; not one of those posts accuses Mr. Chan's
>>parents of being morally depraved.  However, if you go back to those posts

	There is a new vision among the younger generation that believes
in tolerance. This too includes understanding. EVEN ones owns parents, for
better or worse. Mr. Chan's parents may have a traditional view, this does
not make them depraved, it simply points out that they were born in a different
time, when tolerance and compassion were in short supply. (although some days
I believe its beginning to happen again).

>about Caucasian-ge men, you will find that many of those posts denounce 
>Caucasian-ge men (and Chinese-ge women who go out with them) as being morally
>depraved.

	This too offends me greatly. I have seen Chinese/Japanese/Korean
girls/guys on campus with few same nat. friends because of this interrac. situ.
I think it is offensive, these are good people. And they certainly aren't
depraved. And if a bit of interracial lust tickles their fancy, fine with me.

>HEY, Are you that much of an imbecile or do you not realize this is
>Soc.culture.asian.american.  Take a good look at the name. ASIAN AMERICAN.

	Ohhhhhhhhhh, name calling, very very chic Bill, whats next a lynch
mob?

	Elitist swine..... 8)

>Dwight, Mr.Caucasian-ge who thinks like the Nazi's, out to destroy all
>Chinese-ge out of hand, GO BACK TO soc.culture.KKK.

	Oh, ok, thats pretty good too. (shucks, no lynching).

	I have often noticed that anger perpetuates much like the famed and
very fabled Domino theory. One jerk makes a stupid remark, then some other
jerk puts his foot in his mouth in reply, then the F**King damn breaks
and more idiots cascade into the scuffle, with a flurry of useless, even
stupider comments, which inevitably lead to personal attacks (usally on
the order of magnitude like cracks about offesive body odors, and other
non-related garbage) (Gee, I guess I'm one of the jerks? Nahhhh)

	Do us a favor Bill, stick to the logic arguments, your personal
attacks are stupid and petty, you aren't petty are you?

Bill writes in response to Dwight's question, "Do you want to know what
my point is really" or something to that affect.
>NOPE, WE DIDN"T ASK.

	Well, Bill, as a net reader, I for one like to watch people make fools
of themselves, please Dwight by all means continue...

Dwight writes..
>these Chinese-cu boys is that they think that they own Chinese-ge women

	This IS very true, mind you, not all Chinese-ge, just the few who can't
accept reality, or grew up in some distant village, City-Folk seem a little
more tolerant (at least in my experience).

>supply of Chinese-ge women is being diminished by the Caucasian-ge men.
>That's the essential truth of the matter.

	Correct in a way, considering that this is not China, there are X
amount of Chinese ladies and X amount of Chinese gentlemen, since I assume
it is harder for AMs to find CFs then AFs to find CMs (or more precisely CMs
to find AFs willing to date them). I would say there is a slight gap here.
Wouldn't that worry you? Lets face it, every body wants to be loved, from
the most efeminate (sp) man to the most gung-ho-macho-dude (even though he
hates to admit it, even to himself "the jerk"), and if you only want a
specific type of person, and that person is quickly becoming a non-option
for you, wouldn't that piss you off?

Bill writes...
>What's really bothering one Chinese-ge boy is that he thinks that the
>Caucasian-ge own everything, and that simply because he is CHinese-ge,
>he won't get any.  So instead of changing the problem, he tries to become

	Any what? Riches or asian women?

Still Bill... (ho hum)
>supply of women _is_ being diminished by the Caucasian-ge men, so he 

	Now that I'd like to see, dream on.....

	Hmmmm, more personal attacks eh, running out of ammo eh Bill?

Still Bill...
> <END FLAMING>

	Thank GOD.

Still Bill...
>Sorry folks, had to do this.

	No your not, and no you didn't.

>usually puts out anyway, so my contribution to the noise is almost
>insignificant.

	I'm inclined to agree with you... ;)

>Dwight: Commit suicide, and I hope next time, for your sake, you become
>	Caucasian-ge.

	Bill, that was truly uncalled for. Practice what you preach Ok.

>Disclaimer: The above ideas/comments/etc. were presented by one Chinese-ge
>	Chinese-cu who has gotten sick and tired of hearing one Chinese-ge
>	Caucasian-ge/cu wanna be attempt at every thread to disrupt that
>	thread of discussion with his one-sided stubborn ideology.
>	Regular rational thinking (if there is any) will return to me as
>	soon as my OCHEM final is over with (I'm on the borderline range)
>	and the stress is gone.

	I hope you pass.

>Probably should've mailed this instead of posted it.

	Yes you should have.

	Unlike Bill, I really didn't have to do this, I wanted to.

	And I am not sorry for the use of bandwidth, thats what its there
for. In addition I REALLY would like to apologize to those who find this
whole thing REALLY stupid (except Bill and Dwight). Its just that I have felt
the sting of a kind of racism and how it affects others. In one way some
can simply ignore it, others tend to react with hatred (more fuel to the
fire). I don't agree with Bill that Dwight is trying to BE caucasion, nor
do I believe that narrow views on interracial-relationships are justifiable
with any form of logic except that of cultural teachings (which usually isn't
based on logic anyway.) Nor would I chastise some one for having such views,
as long as they keep it to themselves (however, we know that they usually
don't).

	For those intelligent enough to at least find some middle ground
and simply accept things at face value, I applaud you, you have taken
a major step forward.

	I am no great philospher, nor do I intend to convey and aire
of superiority, as I certainly am not. And I have no illusions that this
post will end the bickering. :(

	However, in closing, (finally eh?)...

	That aside from the desire to live, then next biggest is to be loved,
don't deny someone their right to be happy simply because they don't fit
your ideal. Dwight.... chill out, Bill, ditto.

PS- Let the flames begin, I'm wearing my asbestos undies.
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| Name : Eric G. Johnfelt      | "It is amazing that the purest and greatest |
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