From: satish@glob.Eng.Sun.COM (Satish Ramachandran - SunSoft Engineer)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Eve teasing in Tamil Nadu
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:58:56 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: glob

In article <C0GIKo.F95@ireq.hydro.qc.ca> srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (K.Srinivasan) writes:
>There have been two postings with personal attacks regarding
>this subject from two MEN. Here is my reaction.
>
>After all, in my company there were no eve teasers. Not my fault!!
>
>attacks and improper language. Sending personal e-mail to them is
>your personal choice.
>K. Srinivasan at Hydro Quebec


Listen Srinivasan

This is a public discussion and so, let's keep it there.  
I'm taking the liberty of responding in public to your e-mail message to me.
Your e-mail had the subject:
Subject: my apoligies for NOT encoutering eve-teasing in TN

That to me indicates you are apologetic for NOT encountering
eve-teasing in India, not for the opinions you expressed in support of
eve-teasing in India.  What are your trying to achieve?  to quote from
Rushdie's magnum opus:  "What sort of a man are you? man or mouse?"

Yes - I expected you to turn around and use my strongly worded plea for
showing more sensitivity to a social problem and apply it to yourself and
request a more gracious treatment.

Boors who profess attitudes that you expressed in your original
message don't need to be treated in any civil manner.  The code of civil
conduct does not require handling criminals with kid gloves, or folks of
bad intent with kind words.  You may wish to look into the code of conduct
for any culture as evidenced by its laws (as "weird" as they may seem) and
you will see that they uniformly do not condone what they consider to be
bad, sociopathic behavior.  though their own ideas of what such ideas may
differ.

My message was intended to make you wake up and realize that the problem
in India is far more serious than you make it to be; what's worse, I saw 
you (re-read your message) condone such practices by comparing it to Italy
(in particular, Southern Italy). 
I think they acknowledge the problem far more than you admit it to be!  

Let's put it this way and actually get it down to concrete, personal levels
so as to make this discussion more relevant.  Suppose you have a wife/sister(s)/
cousine(s)/mother who gets verbally harassed and physically grabbed by
folks in general (*).  Would you profess that "they take it lightly as long
as they don't get 'hurt'"?  Or, would you think that its time to look into
why the problem exists, what can be done about it, what role models exist or
can be created, ...?

From your e-mail letter to me, I see some reason for hope that you'll see the
light.  But, there are doubts on that still coz you seem more focussed on
pointing the finger at me than in thinking of your own failings on this
count.

You and your mutual-admiration-society-members seem more intent on discussing 
abstract, historical literature and nomenclature of terms.  Would your Andaal or 
Sakthi tolerate the treatment that you seem to so blissfully ignore/condone?  
what if they were alive today and were going through the same treatment meted 
out to many a woman "in a PTC bus while the conductor looks elsewhere"?
Are you more interested in discussing the past while plain ignoring the 
present social problems?  The current social problems will not go away, if 
that's what you want to happen by ignoring them!


-s

(*) -- in case you don't know, verbal harassment and random physical grabbings
of women are an endemic problem in India.  Nowhere is the distance between
theory and practice so great -- the culture there would laud and worship women
in many forms AS IN MYTHOLOGY, but when it comes to practice...

(b)  No - I don't belong to Madras either.  Have visited it but a few times
in my life.  That did not however give me the authority to ignore or condone
what happens there (or in India) by comparing it to other places....

(c)  i don't know what thiruppavai, etc. are other than that they are some
historical, culturally relevant literature/poetry.  If you want to involve
yourself in translating its verses, go ahead and make yourself happy.  But
doing that and condoning cretinous public behavior in current times does not
behoove of an educated man, esp. an educated man with opinions!

(d)  I am not entirely surprised by your turncoat antics.  When members of a
certain sect get knuckled under for no other reason than that they belong to
it (no matter what), you and your cronies either applaud or maintain silence.
When women get knuckled under, you were first seen clapping and indulging in
"Look Amma, they do it in Italy too.  I have been there and know.  We can
do it in India too!"  What sort of a mortal are you?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian.telugu,alt.culture.karnataka,alt.culture.kerala