HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: barroso@priam.usc.edu (Luiz Andre' Barroso)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: BRAZIL: CAN THEY BE CHAMPIONS AGAIN?
Date: 14 Apr 1992 18:35:49 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: priam.usc.edu

rorschak@daimi.aau.dk (Jesper Lauridsen) writes:

>st912880@pip.cc.brandeis.edu writes:

>>The 1990 team was a disappointment. After a good opening game against Denmark
>                                                                      ^^^^^^^^
>>which they won 2-1, they resorted to cautious, defensive minded football which
>>cost them dearly. 

>Ahem, they played against Sweden! I don't know how you can mix up the brilliant
>Danish team with that failure the swedes send to Italy. In fact Denmark have
>never lost against Brazil, we have won both games. The last one with 4-0.

AHHEEMM ! (Excuse me) Let us set some things straight here. First of all there
were no such things as brilliant teams playing in the 1990 world cup. It was
such a bad cup that Argentina almost won it all! And yes, Cameroon was fun to
watch though. Second, tremendously impressive 4-0 victory came on a out-of-
championship game in which no brazilian could name 5 of the players on the
starting lineup - a team that was put together a couple of days before the
game, in the off-season.

>Trivia: Denmark have a clean record against the 3 traditional powers of
>southamerican soccer, Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay.

Hey, I enjoyed watching some games the Dannish team played on the latest
world cups but are you trying to imply some sort of dominance of Dannish
football over those countries'? In which case I think you are stretching
a bit aren't you?

>>The big question is: Can Brazil be World Champions again?

>No.

A lot of interesting insight in this answer... Isn't it delightfull to
discuss with the experts?

>-- 
>|Jesper Lauridsen        |  Liverpool FC - 18xChampions, 4xCup Winner,    |

Luiz A. 

ps: yes, I am brazilian. Indeed winning it all in 1994 is a long shot for my
brazilian team, but then again, isn't it also for everyone else?
From: sc4n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Saverio Cittadini)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Denmark-Italy 0-1 (Under 21)
Date: 10 Apr 92 13:24:11 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Under 21 European Championship semifinal, 1st leg (played in Aalborg,
Apr. 9th):

Denmark 0 - Italy   1
	    19' Buso

An important step for Italy towards the final. There were two key
episodes in the game: at the 19', the goal by Buso which gave Italy
the lead; at the 25', Luzardi elbowed an opponent in the italian
penalty box, and the referee awarded Denmark a penalty kick and
sent Luzardi off, but goalkeeper Antonioli saved the penalty kick.
After this Denmark attacked for the rest of the game, but Italy
defended very well despite being one player short and wentt away 
with a precious win. 2nd leg will be played in Perugia on April
22nd.
       Saverio

e-mail: CITTADINI@SIVAX.CINECA.IT
"The sky is light-blue, since God is a Napoli fan"
V I N C I   P E R   N O I   M A G I C O   N A P O L I  !!!
From: dudley@treefort.Corp.Sun.COM (Dudley Gaman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: the Flying Aces
Date: 16 Apr 92 21:38:50 GMT
Organization: Frisbee Discophilia
NNTP-Posting-Host: treefort.corp.sun.com

In article <CS132093.92Apr16162316@cslab1f.cs.brown.edu> cs132093@cs.brown.edu (Mark "?" Prince) writes:
>	I am a mediocre, but learning Ultimate Player, who wants to
>learn much better disc control over the summer when I am back in
>Michigan.  I get hints from the guys on my team, but I don't have
>their support over the summer, and want to keep active.  Any ideas?

If you can find a copy of Charles Tips' _Frisbee by the Masters_, published by
Celestial Arts about 1977, you'll find a good discourse (pun intended) on
various throws and catches.

The IFA (now defunct Internatinal Frisbee Assosiation) had a number of training
books for skill testing and school courses.  You may be able to get one by
contacting Dan "Stork" Roddick at Wham-o.

The most important skill for ultimate is one you can practice in front of the
mirror in your bathroom.  Shout "Stalling...1...2...3...".  Make sure you shout
loud enough to be heard but not so loud as to ruin the SOTG.

Dudley

ps. 8') for the humor impaired.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: wolff@crc.ricoh.com (Gregory J. Wolff)
Subject: Re: Seedings
Organization: RICOH California Research Center
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 92 02:32:15 GMT

In article <702662417.F00002@blkcat.UUCP> Eric.Simon@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Eric Simon) writes:
> 
>Basically, those are the two options - neither of which I am satisfied with: (1)
>Based on last year's finish; or, (2) captains voting.
> 
>Some day I would like to see something innovative - i.e., something besides
>those two methods.  Anyone have any ideas?
> 
>--  Eric
>
OK Eric, you asked for it.
How about seeding teams based on their "Spirit of the Game" performance.
I envision something like this, at Regionals (sectionals) every team captain 
gets to rate the other teams on some Spirit of the Game measure, which
is compiled into a spirit rating for each (advancing ) team.  
This rating should be comparable across regions (sections), since the 
scale of sportsmanship should vary much less between regions than 
ability.  Soo, you can use a teams "spirit" rating to seed them,
subject to their finish within their region.

This has the benefit of rewarding teams who have respect for their competition
as well as providing some incentive for those who "play to win" to at
least fake a decent attitude.
Another possibility is that you could arrange it so that all the teams
with low spirit are in the same pool!

-Greg
Gregory J. Wolff
Ricoh California Research Center
wolff@crc.ricoh.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: padgett@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Allan Patrick Padgett)
Subject: Seedings
Originator: padgett@Xenon.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 18:21:40 GMT

Regarding seedings, Ben Fulton says...

>What's wrong with doing it subjectively?  My suggestion (and this is for
>a highly structured tournament like nationals, of course) would be to ask
>the team captains submit a ranking of all the teams going to the tournament,
>assign (say) 12 pts for each first place, 11 for each 2nd, and so on, and
>taking the total scores as the seeding.  Now, with only 12 teams, there might
>be some collusion to screw some team over, but maybe some larger base of
>polls would do the trick.

I like the idea of having the teams decide since they usually know who
belongs where.  (I think this has been done in Open play?)  But, in college
play there is one big problem: teams from different regions don't know
anything about each other.

For example, the only non-western team I have seen this year is Wilmington.
I would be able to rank them, but that leaves 9 other teams that I have
know idea about...


While I'm on the net, let me ask a question that I get asked all of the
time. Right now, the wildcards for nationals are given based on regional
size, right?  What do people think about doing this by regional _strength_
instead?  I know that last year (and this year) Oregon had a HOT team, that
could have won nationals.  But, the west can only send two teams, and 
Oregon had thier first two losses the second day of Regionals.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: ODUFFY@VAX.LSE.AC.UK
Subject: Hombres t-shirts
Organization: Ultimate mailing list
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 14:05:28 GMT

To the person looking for Hombres t-shirts:

Write to Ozzie (last name??)
	40 Mexfield Rd.
	Putney SW15
	London
	UK

Be warned, Ozzie makes up new batches of shirts about twice a year.  Each
have different designs and come in multiple formats (long sl, short, sweats) 
and each design sells out pretty quickly so you may not be able to get
the one your heart is set on.  


Also, a little Ultimate update from London.  The Hombres played an 
exhibition game at Wembley against a mixture of all-stars from other
teams (mainly London Transport) before a London Monarchs WFL game.
It was a great experience for all of the limey boys who grow up dreaming
of playing at the citadel of soccer.  Unfortunately there wasn't much of 
a crowd there as we played about an hour before kick-off.  But those who
were there got into it with the help of one of our players, Gary Williams,
who did a great job as MC over the PA, describing the basic rules and
commentating on play.  The other drawback was that we weren't allowed
to wear cleats (or sharks) so some of our unfortunate geezers ran around
in street shoes for 20 minutes.  All in all it was good fun.  We purposely
played an open game, lots of hucks, soft d on the thrower, lots of layouts.
The exhibition went down well and they have invited us back for at least
one more this season.  We're trying to convince them to let us play at
half-time next time.  Finally, for better or worse, (I'm approaching the
ideological event-horizon), we found that sponsors came running when we
told them we were playing at Wembley.  So let that be a lesson to any 
teams out there wondering how in the hell they are going to save up 
enough money to get to Japan or the next world clubs.

Ciao for now,

Brendan O'Duffy (Horizontal Hombres)
London

--
Hi <If it wasn't for the comment this would probably be the shortest signature 
with any significant content!>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: fontes@astro.psu.edu (Chris Fontes)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: Seedings
Date: 6 Apr 92 21:47:26 GMT
Organization: Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics, Penn State University

In response to Allan's comment about the college
wildcards being decided using regional strength
instead of population:
  First of all, I thought that the West did in fact
secure one of the wildcard births for the 92 nationals.
Could someone verify or refute this statement?
If it's true, then Oregon will its chance.
  Secondly, I am against using power as the deciding
factor for a couple of reasons. As captain of the Penn
State team for the past two years, I have seen some
incredible growth for college ultimate in the Mid Atlantic
region. The same situation of having several national
caliber teams in the same region is happening there too.
But the key issue is not power, but Growth. That's how
this situation came about in the MA region. There was a big
push in that region to get as many teams to sectionals
as possible so that we could get a wildcard birth. It worked.
Not only did we have more teams, but the already established
teams practiced that much harder for a shot at the wildcard.
Sort of a nice cycle.
   I guess I'm mostly against the power scheme because it
undercuts growth, and that's too important to ignore
if ultimate is going to flourish. I'm also against the 
power scheme because it's just too subjective. The 
College Top 20 still has some bugs to be worked out before
it can be used as an objective tool. Also, college teams
change so frequently that a powerful third place team
in a region could be easily overlooked, simply because
they come from a traditionally weak region.
   It seems much more reasonable to me that  college
teams should focus some of their attention on getting
and keeping newer schools into the ultimate scene.
Too many times I've seen a school get off to a good start,
but could not get into tournaments because they didn't
have the right connections or weren't the kind of
team somebody wanted to let into their tournament. I hate
that kind of stuff.
     Sorry to use so much memory folks. I guess this
issue was too important for me to pass up.
Chris "Why go hozo when you can run faster?" Fontes
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: evh@genie.slhs.udel.edu (Troy Saville)
Subject: Re: WORLD'S BIGGEST DISC GOLF TOURNAMENT
Organization: UDel, School of Life & Health Sciences
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 21:24:59 GMT

In article <702590429.F00001@blkcat.UUCP> Eric.Simon@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Eric Simon) writes:
>I'm just wondering (pure naivete here) what makes a bunch of tourneys that are
>held on the same day one large tourney.  IF all the UPA Sectionals were held on
>the same day, would that be the largest Ultimate tournament, or am I missing
>something here.

As i mentioned in my previous post, the idea was to get people interested
in disc golf. I'd venture guess that calling it the 

     "world's biggest disc golf tournament" 

is simply a _vehicle_ to accomplish just that.
Since each player in the 'tournament' gets a tshirt, i figure
they might wear that tshirt again. Someone else might see it and ask
about disc golf.....Yes you are missing something here, I was talking about
disc golf and not ultimate. 

If you want specific answers, call John Houck:

   (512) 459-3322

If your asking if ultimate is more popular than disc golf, then that
is a different story altogether.
have fun.
-- 
- Golf Discs and "MINI'S" bought and traded, DISC GOLF INFO ? - SEND EMAIL
   evh@genie.slhs.udel.edu - T Saville - MENS OPEN PRO - PDGA #5399
From: bwright@lobo.rmhs.colorado.edu (Bill Wright)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: RE: Disc Golf Rules & other ideas
Date: 17 Apr 92 02:20:55 GMT
Organization: Rocky Mountain High School

for those of you interested in Disc Golf Rules and rules to all other disc 
sports, we will attempt to download the entire WFDF (World Flying Disc 
Federation) rule book including freestyle, Double disc court, distance, 
self-caught flight, accuracy, ultimate, discathon, and disc golf.
I bet lots of you have never heard of some of these events, but you should 
know what they are and how to participate. State tournaments and the U.S. Open 
are the only chances many of these events are held, but demonstrate the 
abilities of the true all-0around disc athlete. We will attempt to load these 
rules so that they can be downloaded by event. I'm new to this system, but its 
only a matter of time to figure it out.

Other info on disc golf: for those of you interested in making your own holes 
they are a patented item, not that I am concerned I think the patent even runs 
out in '93. The company owns that patent and sells disc golf holes, For the 
most part is is more economical to buy them than to make them. They have 
conquered all the glitches and durability problems through seventeen years of 
experience. The cost is over $300 per hole if you are a PDGA member, but it 
will last a lifetime! Is it worth it?

If anyone has any specific comments about freestyle you can email me if you 
wish. I am the current freestyle Players association director and can fill you 
in on all the ups and downs of freestyle frisbee.We are also the producers of 
this years U.S. Open Flying disc Championships to be held in Fort Collins, 
Colorado.

Hi Dudley, did theresa get her discs yet? Hope they work, although nothing 
works great at Delaveaga.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: scooter@hirgon.hw.stratus.com (Scott Jeffrey)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: You have a point there, but (maybe you should wear a hat to cover it)...
Date: 15 Apr 92 13:21:46 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.


Hi ho,

	Y'know, with the advent of this latest rules interpretation
thread (loud stall counts), I got to thinking: What's becoming of all
these rules questions?  We've been presented some very real (albeit 
far out) scenarios, and some very compelling arguments with differing
rules interpretations.  For instance:

	-The one where a disc comes to rest on a player's chest (or was
	it his back?), and his mark snatches it up.  Who's disc is it
	really?

	-The one where a receiver takes his/her time walking back to
	the line after a long pull.

	-The one where a defensive player can make a play on an out-of-
	bounds disc (to make sure it _stays_ out of bounds), but an
	offensive player can't.

	-I'm sure there were more, but these are a couple that I can
	recall off the top of my head.

	What I want to know is, Is someone from the UPA listening?  Will
we see any rules changes?  How can the rules be made more clear?  Has there
been a consensus reached with regard to these interpretations (and the ones
I've neglected to mention)?  I'm asking these questions because whenever 
some violation happens, the game usually comes to a screeching halt while 
the penalty is debated, and disrupts any flow the game had.  This is 
totally frustrating.  I'd like to see some rulings made more clear, to
maintain the flow of the game without stopping to pull out the Ninth Edition
every time something out of the ordinary happens. 

keysho,
scooter


-- 
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
+  scooter@hirgon.hw.stratus.com                  Flat Flip Flies Straight  +
+                       "Go to the forest and move"                         +
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
From: DURRETT@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: how strong is a disc?
Date: 8 Apr 92 19:50:02 GMT
 <1992Apr6.120837.6561@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu>
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center

In article <1992Apr6.120837.6561@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu>,
fulton@copper.ucs.indiana.edu (Ben Fulton) says:
>
>What ultimate players are going to spend hours building up their arms and
>chest, when all it'll do is slow down their running speed?  It's like saying
>marathon runners are pansies because they can't bench press as much as
>professional weightlifters.
>ben
>fulton@copper.ucs.indiana.edu

I'd just like to point out that some rather inaccurately concieved training
strategies are being advocated here. Conventional weight-room mythology and
my not-too-limited experience with the subject indicates that sprint speed
upper-body strength are strongly positively correlated. I'm certainly
evidence of that. I was ponderously slow as a child, but I now have
respectable acceleration. I know it isn't correlated with leg strength since
I used to squat 500lbs(225 kg) as a 16-year old, and can maybe put up 300
now that I'm 27 and just as fast if not faster than I was then. On the other
hand my bench press has increased slightly, and I know I'm faster when I'm
on the weights than off. The reasoning in the mythos for this increase in
sprint speed with increased upper-body strength is that a large portion of the
difference between any two sprinters of equal natural sprint ability in the
legs is due to the pump of their arms(watch Carl Lewis run the 100m and
you'll see what I mean). Further anecdotal evidence is supplied by the
reduction in Ben Johnson's 100m time while he was on steroids. If you look
at before and after pictures, you'll see that the primary difference is in
upper-body mass(and presumably stregth). While I definitely suggest staying
away from steroids(the injury factor alone should be reason enough) I think
it is inaccurate to suggest that one will be slowed in Ultimate play by
lifting weights for the upper body. For the legs, though, I know only one
really good way to keep them prepared for Ultimate, and that's to play.
Running intervals is just entirely too boring.

Just to remark on the issue that started this thread: Yes, he was a total
dick for ripping up the disk, but so what? At least you don't have to play
with him.

Roo-Dog Rip
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
Roo-Dog Rip is:                  <>SLAC, Stanford, the DOE and the
Derrell Durrett                  <>University of Colorado neither claim
D_DURRETT@COLOPHYS.BITNET        <>responsibility nor accept liability
D_DURRETT%KAOS@VAXF.COLORADO.EDU <>for my opinions. Gee- what a surprise.
From: Eric.Simon@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Eric Simon)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: More seeding questions
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1992 09:09:42 -0500

Seeding at Regionals, I believe, is done somewhat subjectively, although, since
the Top 20 _with a region_ is a decently accurate tool, and is relied on.  But,
Bruce Lord is the person to talk to.
 
But the best part of a double elimination, is that seeding is fairly irrelevant,
as far as picking the top two teams - if you lose two games you're out.  And if
you lose two games, then you are probably not among the top two.  Granted, you
may lose earlier or later, depending upon seeding, but it _is_ hard to argue,
when you've lost two games, that you should have been among the top two.
 
--  Eric

Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: padgett@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Allan Patrick Padgett)
Subject: Top 20 Women from Eric
Originator: padgett@Xenon.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 04:41:42 GMT

                                                                 
NEWS RELEASE                                            
                                                                          
Date:                   April 7, 1992                                 
                                                                 
From:                   UPA College Rankings Office               
                                                          
Contact:                Eric Simon                          
                                                             
        
The Ultimate Players Association has released the current 
Collegiate Women's Rankings of the 1992 season.  Teams must 
have played a tournament game before April 6 to have been included.

Rank   Team                   P.R.*    W -  L      LW
 1     UNC-Wilmington          1573   14 -  0       1
 2     Cornell                 1345    3 -  1       2
 3     Cal Poly-S.L.O.         1285    4 -  3       4
 4     Columbia                1258    8 -  2       3
 5     East Carolina           1127    3 -  3       5
 6     Brown                   1064    2 -  2       6
 7     Stanford                1048    2 -  3       7
 8     U.C.Berkeley            1001    4 -  4       8
 9     U.C.Santa Barbara        982    3 -  3       9
10     U. Penn.                 939    2 -  3      12
11     Tufts                    907    2 -  4      10
12     Rutgers                  814    4 -  5      11
13     U.C.Santa Cruz           622    1 -  6      13
14     Virginia                 612    0 -  1      14
15     S.U.N.Y. Purchase        593    1 -  4      15
16     Vermont                  502    0 -  3      16
17     Drew                     430    1 -  1       -
18     U.C.San Diego            384    0 -  2      17
19     Bucknell                 319    0 -  3       -
20     Vasser                    41    0 -  1       -

For more information about the UPA call 1-800-UPA-GetH.  
(Calculations include all games whose scores were called 
in before 1 pm ET, Monday, April 6, at the above number).

*P.R. is the "UPA Power Rating."  W - L is the Won/Loss Record.  
LW is the UPA ranking last week.