Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 11:13:13 CST
From:         Michael Million <MM24681@UAFSYSB.BITNET>
Subject:      Reply to Brad Kaiser

 In reply to:
 >From:         "(Brad Kaiser)" <bradk%isdgsm@RTSG.MOT.COM>
 >Subject:      Re: Free Will and Predestination

 Brad, I certainly don't mind if you jump in... doubt Dave does; he
 might like some assistance in answering some of my questions.
 Instead of answering what one has to give God if it is not the
 submission of your will to His Will, you ask the questions below:
 [I was hoping that by answering questions from other posters I would
 be given the courtesy of having my questions answered but I guess
 either you folks have no answers or you think my questions unimportant.
 I wish we could have some mutual respect along these lines; it is a
 very normal way to proceed with constructive conversation.]

  >1) Is Jesus Christ truly God, in every sense?

  It is my understanding that all creatures must approach the Father
  through the Son; to the creatures of a local universe, the Creator
  Son is the same as God in all aspects perceivable.  So the answer,
  as I know it, is *yes* ... we on earth know our Creator Parent by
  his bestowal life on our planet, the living revelation, Jesus Christ.
  We are unfamiliar with his larger personality as a Creator Son; but
  this should cause us no great concern.

  Brad asks:
  >2) If so, where on earth today is the infallible source of His
  >   true doctrine?
  >3) Upon what or whose authority do you base *your* teaching?

  Happily, the answer is the same to both of these questions.  The
  volume known as _The Urantia Book_ is the divinely composed, direct
  revelation for our epoch.  All who earnestly seek the truth would
  benefit by holding this work in their hands, so to enrich their lives
  by the spiritual treasures within.

  >Scripture says you were conceived in sin (Ps 51).
  Biblical scripture was written by man, who is capable of error and
  misunderstanding.

  >How do you know that your feelings do not deceive you?

  We are all left to our own decisions about such matters as source of
  knowledge and what we accept as truth.  Fortunately, I do not have
  to rely totally on my inner recognition of spiritual truths; they are
  greatly enhanced by the supplemental elaborations in the above-
  mentioned source.  As you have your source, others have theirs.  I
  would rather bet on direct revelation than inspired mortal writings.
  The heart will recognize truth and will respond, if not now, then
  later.  As B. Fuller once said, 'the truth once revealed can never be
  repealed.'  My heart does jump with joy when I read the elaborated
  truths in the restatement of the Gospel of Jesus.

  Why is no one of you willing to answer my question of what you have to
  offer God, if you have no voice in any of your life decisions and
  claim to have no free will?  Can you answer that?

 >Good luck; it never worked for me.  Let me know when you've worked
 >the bugs out.

 I seriously doubt that luck will have much to do with it; notice I
 said natural urges _can_ be mastered by the mind... I strive daily to
 accomplish self-control.  I am assured that the striving is the
 important fact here; _striving_ for perfection is what is requested of
 us.  No one understands mortal failings better than our Creator Son
 for he chose to live a life among us as a brother; in so doing, he
 set an example of how to live a life of contact with the Father for
 his whole universe, not just our planet.  After the initial mortal
 life, we have a long career of ascension to learn/grow/become the
 experientially perfect_ed_ beings God requires of us.

 >While I believe that man has a will, it is certainly not sovereign.
 >God always has the "last laugh", so to speak.  (Not to imply that God
 >laughs at us; merely a figure of speech.)

 As I said before, the concept of free will implies a self-governing
 aspect to existence; that we can have a sovereign free will in no way
 diminishes the divine sovereignty of either the Son or the Father.
 In this case, the word 'sovereign' is used in the definition of self-
 governing and *not* paramount or supreme in a complete sense.  God has
 made every effort to insure our self-governing nature as He is the
 original source of personality *and* the fragment of divinity
 indwelling us. The parade of beings ascending in return to Him is His
 supreme pleasure.

 I am going to post an excerpt about the Creator-creature link.  I will
 not be posting many excerpts.  I read the very numerous postings of
 'Scripture,' so I consider it only fair that I am able also to post an
 occasional excerpt; it will be so titled in the subject line.

                                     in brotherhood,  Michael Million