HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: eddie@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Edward M. Averett)
Subject: Unicursal Hexagrams and Yantras
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 11:24:44 GMT

I agree with Tagi.  We need to add Something to the FAQ list on this, please.

The Unicursal Hexagram card comes in at least some of the larger sized  Thoth
decks.  Not a manufacturer's logo, or the OTO, or a jay-random card. 

It'a a meditation tool, and can be associated with a number of things Crowley
refers to in lots of places.  In short, it's a Yantra (visual component of 
meditation similar to a (surprise) mantra). The five-petaled thingy in the 
center is basically a pentagram.  You can find lots of things to see in it, 
including a lot of the X = Y equation associations Crowley uses in kabalah
and stuff.  

Like the Law of 5's, a lot depends on how you think about it.   -) 

A simple exercise:  In a mostly dark room, with a light behind your left 
shoulder, hold the card in your right hand extended from you comfortably, OR
place it 18" to 24" in front of you, slightly below your chin on a surface
where it won't slip.  Remove distracting objects near it from your view. 
Focus your attention on the design. Narrow your consciousness till all that 
exists for you is the design.  Allow your focus to move between the various
parts of the design, as it desires.  Look at the relationships between them.
When the card assumes 3-d capability and "flows" then you have reached one
of the basic steps.  Play with this.  Read the "naples arrangement" if you 
have a copy of the Book of Thoth, then go back and study it. 

Examine the numbers 6, 5, and 11 in all the references of Crowley you can 
remember. Go back and study the card, as above.   Etc.   Have fun.  Don't 
talk about it.  Think and meditate.  Do not reveal the great secrets 
which will be revealed to you to the uninitiated. 

Everything you know is wrong.  Nothing is true. Everything is permissible. 


				-eddie@legba.oit.unc.edu
				Pope, Stuart Little Cabal, P.O.E.
From: eddie@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Edward M. Averett)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Women of excellence... (Re: Learning Styles)
Date: 30 Aug 92 02:00:28 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill

In article <1992Aug30.005557.2418@samba.oit.unc.edu> shava@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Shava Nerad Averett) writes:
>to import the 'casting couch' into the engineering field.  You have to 
>deal with people who will never take you seriously because you have tits.
>
(lots of good stuff deleted)

Hey!  *I* have tits, they're just non-functional, except for mild sensual
stimulation.    -) 

followups to some j-random alt.sex grope. ..
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: ndarvish@vax.clarku.edu
Subject: Court Cards
Organization: Clark University
Date: 3 SEP 92 16:14:04 GMT


        I am having trouble interpreting court cards when using the celtic cross
spread. How do you interpret a 'personality' into the positional meaning of the
card? For instance, how do you interpret a prince of swords whn it is in the
position of the crown, or of 'emotional attitudes'?
        I usually use Crowley's method or the Golden Dawn's (virtualy the same)
and never run into this problem.
        The only way that i have overcome this porblem is to use only the major
arcana cards when using the celtic cross but then you don't get the same
subtlety of interpretation that you do with the full deck.

        If anyone here can help, please email me at any of the following:

                        ndarvish@black.clarku.edu
                        ndarvish@jack.clarku.edu
                        murder@gnu.ai.mit.edu

                                Thanks,
                                        Bruin
From: knightster+@CMU.EDU (Shawn Clayton Knight)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Pagan Computer Chuckle
Date: 25 Aug 92 23:49:43 GMT
Organization: Freshman, Physics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

>"If you record your Book of Shadows on the hard disk of an Apple Macintosh
>portable computer, would that then be an -Eldritch PowerBook-?"

Well my LC works just fine ;-) ...

-shawn
From: Gerald_Del_Campo@sorinc.UUCP (Gerald Del Campo)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Another Crowley question
Distribution: world
Date: 27 Aug 92 18:58:46 PDT
Organization: Shades of Reality BBS - Medford, Oregon

In a message dated Thu 27 Aug 92  5:14, ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A.
Davis-Howe) wrote:

>That you chose your own path, and question all things; and have a tendency
>(from what I have read of your posts) to research things out before making
>your mind up one way or another.

 BD> There is nothing in this that is particular to any one religion.  The
 BD> people who taught me this were mostly very much Christians.  (Oh well,
 BD> there goes another stereotype about the evil Christians down the
drain.)

Yes, along with the stereo-typical evil Thelemite  :)

>What I was trying to emphasize is that Thelema has very little to do with
>Crowley, and that calling yourself a Thelemite is not declaring to the
>universe that you are a Crowley groupie.  There is this false belief among
>that occult communities that Thelemites are Crowley wanna-be's.

>Crowley was not the first to coin the term.

 BD> OK, then I think it is my turn to ask *you* to define Thelemite. 

Moi?  You are asking me to open Pandora's Box... or drink from a bitter cup
;)
I don't think I could properly define it because (by definition) Thelema is
undefinable.  One might grasp an aspect of it, which strikes a harmonious
chord; but defining it would mean transcending it.

 BD> What is the basis of Thelema, if not Crowley's writings?  

Thelema is no more based on the writings of Crowley than Christianity is
the writings of Jesus.  Crowley may have emphazised, or brought attention
to a "mass consciousness" which is becoming more and more predominant, but
he didn't invent it... it exists despite of Crowley  ;)

 BD> Also, will most people who call themselves Thelemites agree with you
 BD> definition, and will they fit your definition of Thelemite?

Absolutely not.  It is the wrath of the Thelemites who have experienced
different Thelemic realities which I am trying to avoid  ;)

One could, however, go to Liber AL and consult it for advise regarding the
behavior of Thelemites, or what value thelemites hold close to their
hearts, but this would border line on "interpretation", and we are
prohibited.

If I see a person who speaks their own mind, votes, is concerned with
environmental issues, and is willing to fight for other people's freedom of
choice and religion I see a Thelemite.  I really admire those few
individual Thelemites who would fight to maintain the Christian right to
worship... even though they wouldn't do the same for us.

Whew!  What a question!  ;)

Love is the Law.
Gerald

-- Via DLG Pro v0.992

Xref: sparky alt.magick:4110 soc.culture.german:6100 soc.culture.jewish:14988
From: tedrick@whistle.Berkeley.EDU (Tom Tedrick)
Newsgroups: alt.magick,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Crowley's Significance? (Hitler)
Date: 28 Aug 1992 09:31:19 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: whistle.berkeley.edu

When you take "magick" in Crowley's sense to the extreme you come to a 
Hitler ("triumph of the will" and all that). After all, when you get to
a certain stage in the power game genocide is one of the few remaining 
pastimes still interesting enough to play (testing your will against the
collective strength of a nation or race). So "great men" (in the 
Nietzschean sense, that Crowley so admired) like Hitler, Stalin, Mao, 
Pol Pot, Ghengis Khan, Saddam Hussein, and so on, represent the 
culmination of this type of thinking. Probably the game some black
magicians are playing today is plotting the extermination of the human 
race (after all, what will it matter to them since they won't be around
much longer? At least, that's their attitude.)

You can reduce all Crowley's complicated nonsense with any practical
value to the simpler problem of finding efficient algorithms to achieve
whatever your goal is. Otherwise trying to assimilate all that garbage 
will mislead you (and probably make your head ache :-)

More conventional practitioners of "magick" (otherwise known as
scientists :-) have brought tremendously destructive forces (such as the
hydrogen bomb) into the world. So you ought to think about what lies at
the end of this amoral road. Ethics and morality do have a useful place
in human life, despite what the black magicians say.

Personally I believe in reincarnation so I hope any black magicians 
plotting our doom and the end of human life as we know it will fail in 
their task ... also don't be fooled into thinking there is some secret 
useful knowledge in "magick" that scientists don't know about 
(scientists are very devious creatures :-) Most people I've met who
consider themselves to be black magicians impress me as being rather 
stupid (And California is full of such nut cases, believe me :-)

Hitler managed to mislead the German nation into following him
down the road to destruction, so don't be too sure it can't
happen again. If you can fool so many millions of people in
one of the most well educated countries, no nation is safe.
There is no more intelligent people than the Jews, yet
Hitler's brand of evil dealt them a devastating blow.

By the way, "blitzkrieg" (the tactics Hitler used to conquer
so many nations) was invented by a disciple of Crowley (see
"Memoirs of an Unconventional Soldier" (J.F.C. Fuller) and
the "plan 1919" material.

-- 
"To be a born liar, possessed of a natural antipathy for truth 
in all its many forms, is the high road to prosperity and reknown.
If there is one thing which leads to success in life, it is the 
gift of lying in a convincing way." -J.F.C. Fuller
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: rtsumn01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu
Subject: The pentagram
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 00:03:46 GMT
Organization: University of Louisville

Apologies to those of you who may have read this question elsewhere, but I seek
a more substantial answer than the ones I have received already...

Does anyone know the origin of the pentagram and its evolution into modern-day
usages?

--Semhaza
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: rtsumn01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu
Subject: Re: The pentagram
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 07:22:55 GMT
Organization: University of Louisville

In article <Ied2ORe00VpGME9EUv@andrew.cmu.edu>, Kerwin Yap Chua <kc3u+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> If we are to believe the archaeological finds in Iraq, the pentagram
> originated as a protection symbol used on some of the old talismans and
> the famous cylinder seals that ancient Sumerians wore.
> 
> Note: I am about to mention the Necronomicon.  Please forgive me, 

That really brightened a lousy day  :-)

Thanks everyone for your responses to my question; I got a lot more information
than I was hoping for.

--Semhaza
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: abraham@hydra.unm.edu (Abraham McCollough)
Subject: Re: Rev. Bell's Final Post (for a while)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 92 20:34:42 GMT
Organization: psychohazard

In article <-2jn=vk@lynx.unm.edu> cipher@lacerta.unm.edu (Rev. J. B. Bell) writes:
>BUT, I would still like to be in touch with whomever would like to
>write me.  I'd be particularly happy to hear from Shava, Josh, Tagi,
>Peggy, and anyone else I admire whome I may have forgotten
>inadvertantly.  Also it would be very nice to hear from any members of
>the IOT or OTO or those just interested in the styles of the
>respective (dis)organizations.  Very especially wonderful would be to
>hear of such *in my area*.  Enough of that; the address:
>
>Rev. J. B. Bell
>901 Montgomery Ave., Apt. 207
>Bryn Mawr, PA 19010
>
>I don't have a phone yet or I'd list the number.
>
>Thanks to everyone for insight, fun, fury, and companionship.
>
>                         Sincerely,
>
>                         --Rev. J. B. Bell
>

What the good reverend neglected to mention was that all the mail sent to 
his account will be forwarded through me.  I rather suspect it was his subtle
way of teasing me for being so neglectful of my computer accounts.

Regardless, for those few of you who might recall my rare and now ancient 
posts, I will be accepting any notes you care to drop the Reverend.  He and
I will be communicating using the quaint affectations of paper and pen.  I
should be happy to stick my nose as far into his private life as possible, if
only from a sense of perversity.

Beyond that, I offer a humble apology for my neglect.  I will make an effort
to return here on a more regular basis.                                   

Abraham
From: mmig6535@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Mark Inaba)
Subject: Re: Learning Styles
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 23:07:24 GMT

	Hi..I think I'm a do/think, I like to play with the little stuff
first, and when I can get around, read up on it and see all the nifty
details I missed. I know about nothing about magic anyone want to help
me get started in this cycle?

-Mark
From: lazarus@maico.ksu.ksu.edu (Bart -Laz- Smith)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: The pentagram
Date: 3 Sep 1992 23:51:00 -0500
Organization: Kansas State University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: maico.ksu.ksu.edu


I was only off base in stating that it ORIGINATED in Christianity, then... or,
actually, Steve's SOURCE was off base.  Again, I'll ask him sometime to mail me
his notes from his bit of research.

Another piece of trivia that I heard somewhere: the number "666" was a secret code
number of Ceasar's, and since he was considered an "enemy" of Christianity, when
the early Christians learnt of the number, they considered it to be a number of
evil...  Any "solid" evidence supporting this out there?

--
Bart -Laz- Smith
Kansas State University
The 'Cats WILL rule in '92!
"You're too young and I'm too well hung..." -- Spinal Tap
From: pbreton@cs.umb.edu (Peter Breton)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Neurolinguistic Programming (NLP)
Date: 25 Aug 92 22:23:21 GMT
Organization: Arkham University, Providence RI, Dept of CS


  Does anyone know the current state of the NLP folks? 
  According to a Mother Jones article a few years ago, Richard Bandler
had been hanging out with some mafioso/drug dealer types, was addicted
to both alcohol and cocaine (this from a man who specialized in curing
addictions!), and eventually found himself accused of the murder of a
woman who was shot under mysterious circumstances. A jury found him 
not guilty (you can bet that communication skills helped here!!), and he
dropped from sight. John Grinder, the cofounder (with Bandler) hasn't
been much associated with the NLP "movement". More NLP books come from
Steve and Connaie Andreas (spelling??), from Bandler's ex-wife, Leslie
Cameron-Bandler, and from the most successful of the lot, Anthony Robbins.
In Bandler's book USING YOUR BRAIN FOR A CHANGE	he badmouths Robbins, 
slamming the firewalk as a tool for change (perhaps that's why Robbins now 
emphasizes that the walk is "only a metaphor"), and says (p 114) "Ask the
next firewalker you meet if he's willing to walk the same length on a steel
plate that's the same temperature as those coals!" Apparently (I don't recall
my source, unfortunately), Robbins took up the challenge and did exactly that!
  Anybody with more dope on this??
From: cward@Think.COM (Christopher)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Working in Groups
Date: 27 Aug 1992 12:43:07 GMT
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
Distribution: alt
NNTP-Posting-Host: custard.think.com

In article <m9=n8x_.friday@netcom.com>, friday@netcom.com (Carol Anne Ogdin) writes:
|> >2) Start your own group.  The key here is similar the the national group
|> 
|> This is a lot harder than it appears to be at first; everybody is willing
|> to participate if YOU do all the work.  Quality people may be on a parallel
|> path, but like tennis, you have to pick players with roughly the same skill
|> level--else you spend all your time being a teacher (or student).

Actually my experience is that it is harder to find like-minded, competent
people.  I don't mind playing teacher though I find my own progress goes just
as slow as without students.  The only advantages I have found is that being 
the teacher seems to really help you get a good understanding of what you know
since you have to explain it to someone else.  Also, the group tends to 
align itself more closely along your biases.

In collecting people my experience is one out of ten or twelve works out.
This can be really depressing when you figure out that you have to go through
over 100 people to get ten worth building a group with.  These are 100 people
with which you have to spent a fair amount of time too.

--Christopher

Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath)
Subject: Re: Magic/magick/midget/maggot???
Reply-To: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 22:12:52 GMT

In article <guest.48@dhhalden.no>, guest@dhhalden.no (.GJEST) writes:
|> 
|> Someone please tell me; whats the difference between 'magic' and 'magick'?
|> 
|> G.H.		

For about 100 years conjurers and stage artists have used the word 
"magic" to describe their illusions.  

"Magick" is usually used to refer to something other than slight-of-hand
tricks.

-- 
  Robert E. McGrath
  Urbana Illinois
  mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
From: jasonk@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Jason Kraushar)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Looking for OTO members
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 22:36:24 MDT
Organization: Edmonton Remote Systems #1, Edmonton, AB, Canada

  Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
  
  Hi there... I am attempting to compile a list of email addresses of OTO 
members who use this newsgroup, in an attempt to see if there is a 
possibility of setting up alt.magick.OTO or somesuch. As well, a mailing 
list ascii-format magazine may be in order. We'll have to see. Anyhow, if 
you are a member of the OTO, or are interested in finding out more about 
the Order, please mail me: jasonk@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca and indicate which 
you are (member or aspirant).
 
  Waiting to hear from you...
 
  Love is the Law, love under Will.
 
    Fr. Avatar

Jason Kraushar              jasonk@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca
From: shawnb@ecst.csuchico.edu (SEPB)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Another Crowley question
Date: 28 Aug 92 00:30:35 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico

In article <1992Aug26.221952.11453@m.cs.uiuc.edu> mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu writes:
>This whole thing is way off the original topic, so I suggest we drop
>it.
>
>I still say AC was a miserable human being who abused, exploited, 
>cheated, and deceived his friends.  I will revise that opinion
>in the light of better information about his life, which the
>flame-masters have consistently omitted to provide.

Sir,

	Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.

  I do not in any way consider myself a 'flame-master'.  If you would like
I'd be more than happy to refer you to a wealth of 'better information' as
you call it.  Read the man's own works.  Read the words of the responsable
people who knew and worked with Crowley:  

  "Never does Crowley attempt to minimize his worst traits in favor of the 
higher or more socially acceptable.  Here is evident that magnificent 
difference which makes him altogether dissimilar to any other spiritual,
metaphysical or philosophical instructor of our time."
						
                                                 -Israel Regardie
                         			 _The Eye in the Triangle_

  That is an extremely clear reading of A.C. as a man, and very indicative
of the man's actions and philosophy.  This aspect of the man makes him the
hardest to accept, for many.  He would have wanted it no other way. "Don't
take my word for it!" he says, refusing to play the guru game.  He was
undoubtably one of the most scientific and skeptical of mystics.
  I see very little indication in my extensive readings into The Master 
Therion's personal life, and personal writings, of him acting in any such
a way that would render him a 'disgusting human being' in anyone's eyes.
I see lots of complete disinformation scattered about concerning Crowley,
which I am sure would have amused him now as much as it did in his day.
  When I think of Crowley, I think of an intensely interesting man who had
a great deal of compassion for humanity (but certainly no pity.) He left
behind him an important legacy, more than one Magickal Organization 
continuously operating, a huge corpus of writings, and _The Book of the Law_.
Unless one studies and appreciates these writings, a less-than-fair 
understanding of the man will result in an ill-conceived opinion or bias.

			Love is the law, love under will.

					Fraternally,
					Fr. A
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Unicursal Hexagram
Date: 26 Aug 92 15:23:10 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

gdavidso@nyx.cs.du.edu (Greg Davidson) writes:


>What is the history and Symbolism behind the Unicursal hexagram ?
>and how is it better/worse to use than a traditional one?
>thanks..

>grag

It was created by Crowley.  The point is to be able to trace the figure in
ritual without breaking the figure.  The standard hexagram requires drawing
two triangles, with a movement from one triangle to the other.  This extraneous
movement can be distracting.  Crowley's solution is very practical, if not as
esthetically pleasing, since is is not perfectly regular.

Drawing of hexagrams is usually used for invoking/banishing planetary forces.

              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: mesm@netcom.com (Mary E. S. Morris)
Subject: Re: Working in Groups
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 09:52:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

cward@Think.COM (Christopher) writes:
: I've seen a number of Rosicrutian-by-mail advertised.  I'd be interested in
: seeing you post who you dealt with.  What you were looking for and why that
: group fell short of your needs.
: 
: --Christopher
The pamphlets that I received were lessons on surrounding things with 
light, changing internal talk, and generally changing your mindset
so that you believe that it is possible to change external reality.

That was as far as I got.

By that point, I had done all of those things. I had tried a couple
of things similar to the emotional-type spells discussed here recently
and reaped the karma thereof. I had a sort of hit and miss communication
with my oversoul. Mostly I was looking for an experience that I 
hadn't had. I didn't care what, I just wanted to try some new things.--


Mary E. S. Morris    |  The future exists first in imagination, then
mesm@netcom.COM      |  in will, then in reality. -- Galivan Burwell
=====================================================================
Netcom - Online Communication Services San Jose, CA
Organization: Sophomore, Physics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA