HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fanning@NMC.ED.RAY.COM (Robert Fanning)
Subject: Re: Gore-tex vs etc
Organization: Equipment Division, Raytheon Company
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 15:21:37 GMT

In article <1992Nov22.180126.18370@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> lskiclub@nyx.cs.du.edu (Lancaster SkiClub) writes:

[stuff deleted]
>
>Sympatex is slightly cheaper than Gore-tex and is in fact more durable, no
>need to was in special detergents and does not delaminate like Gore-tex
>has been prone to. Sympatex is also a lot softer than gore-tex which means
>the garments are more comfortable and the z-liner idea is more practical.
>
>                 Dan Gibson - Lancaster Uni Ski Club

Speaking of materials... how about Bergundal (sp?) cloth.  I've only seen
it in Columbia garments, but it talks about being water and wind resistant.
I realize it is not supposed to be as water proof as Gortex/Sympatex...
but what is the net experience with the cloth?
BTW, I'm in the market for a shell I can wear skiing, hiking and biking in 
the cold/wet New England weather.  The REI brand of Gortex-like stuff seems
nice and less expensive than regular Gortex, but the Columbia Burgundal is
even more in my price range.  Any opinions out there?

Rob Fanning
fanning@iatc.ed.ray.com
From: kenm@array.com (Ken Murphy)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Anything happen to ASA?
Date: 18 Nov 92 13:55:56 GMT
Organization: Array Microsystems, Colorado Springs, CO. USA
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Mike Seningen (seningen@maserati.ross.com) wrote:
: Tried calling the American Ski Association 1-800 number 
: and was greeted with a "Sorry the 1-800 number you called has
: been disconnected and no further information is available at this time!"

[...]

Some folks here already got their card.

Merf
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: jrredho@sandia.gov (John R. Red-Horse)
Subject: Re: The Colorado Skier - Trivia 4
Organization: Sandia National Laboratories
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 21:27:29 GMT

In article <16NOV92.10102154@enh.nist.gov> hudgens@enh.nist.gov writes:
>Pajarito was the best area among Taos, Santa Fe, and Pajarito.
>
>>>>the local boy scout troop (so I'm told), and is open only on Wednesday,
>>>>Friday, Saturday and Sunday.  I understand they are making improvements to
>>> ^^^^^^
>
>I'd swear that I skied there on Friday 3 years ago.  All lifts run on Sat,
>Sun and holidays.  1-2 lifts run on Wed's. Even so, it's worth the trip
>because the terrain is good and uncrowded--cheap lift ticks too.

I'm sorry for not being more precise.  Pajarito is open Wednesdays (1 lift
only), Saturdays and Sundays, all Federal holidays and the week between
Christmas and New Year's.

Cheers.
-- 
John Red-Horse                  jrredho@somnet.sandia.gov
Structural Dynamics Division
Sandia National Labs                        (505)845-9190
~
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: snodgras@cs.unca.edu (Ryan Snodgrass)
Subject: Re: Big Sky?
Organization: University of North Carolina at Asheville
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 01:45:47 GMT

Don't know how good the skiing in Big Sky yet (anyone skied there yet this
year?), but Steamboat has been great the last two years I've gone there.  I
am heading out to Big Sky in a month or so, and hopefully Steamboat again
in early 1993.  let me know what you find out,

Ryan
From: dbernard@clesun.Central.Sun.COM (Dave Bernard)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Ski Cooper, near Leadville, Co.
Date: 20 Nov 92 17:27:36 GMT
Reply-To: dbernard@clesun.Central.Sun.COM
Organization: Sun Microsystems

Anyone ever been there?  It looks attractive on paper because:

	*Kids ski school & day care is cheap
	*Lodging is cheap
	*Downhill & Cross Country skiing both available w/day care

Good or bad experiences, I'd be interested.  I realize it's not a
destination resort, but modest skiier that I am, it may fit my needs.
Doesn't sound as though it gets very crowded.

	Dave

Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: rvele@ctp.com (Raymond Velez)
Subject: Kastle SGM 198 cm GS skiis with m46
Organization: Cambridge Technology Partners
Distribution: us
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 15:12:48 GMT

	Does anyone have a recommendation on the Kastle SGM 198cm GS
skiies with Marker M46 bindings.  I am an advanced skier, and I ski
bumps as much as possible.  Since these are GS skiis will they not be
suitable for the bumps.  Secondly, I do race as an amateur whenever I
get the chance.  I usually race slalom.  Are these skiis too wide for
that.  Thank you in advance.
				Ray

-- 
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((*))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
rvele@ctp.com  |   Cambridge Technology Partners       |		
Raymond Velez  |   304 Vassar St, Cambridge, MA        |
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((*))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
From: saw8712@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Steve A. Ward)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Steepness
Date: 19 Nov 92 23:11:53 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle

Hal, thanks for that info- gets my blood pumpin just seeing those stats.  I'd 
also be interested in how some of these others stack up in overall difficulty.
For example, Corbetts @ Jackson Hole has about a five foot drop off to
get into it.  Then for a large part of the chute, it is very narrow- maybe 
10 yrds.  In other words THERE'S NO HOLDING BACK! 
-- 
Steven A. Ward
The Boeing Company
internet: saw8712@bcstec.ca.boeing.com
phone: (206) 662-0239
From: hkelly@tantalum.eds.com (Kelly Shuldberg)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: The Colorado Skier - Trivia 4
Date: 15 Nov 92 18:14:47 GMT
Organization: EDS Research, Albuquerque, NM

In article <1992Nov13.212852.17542@cs.sandia.gov> jrredho@sandia.gov (John R. Red-Horse) writes:
>In article <1992Nov9.202658.29119@edsr.eds.com> hkelly@edsr.eds.com (Kelly Shuldberg) writes:
>>
>>North-west of Santa Fe is Los Alamos with its own litle ski area, Pajarito
>>("Little Bird" in Spanish).  The area offers much more challenging skiing
>>that either SF or Sandia, but there are few amenities to go along with it.
>>There is one lodge with no food service or the like.  The area is run by
>>the local boy scout troop (so I'm told), and is open only on Wednesday,
>>Friday, Saturday and Sunday.  I understand they are making improvements to
> ^^^^^^
>
>I'm not a long-time NM resident, but I have skied Pajarito many times.
>It is my impression that it is *not* open on Fridays.  Further, on
>Wednesdays only one lift is in operation (though this is not really
>a problem).
>>
>>h. kelly shuldberg
>>hkelly@edsr.eds.com
>>Albuquerque, NM
>
>cheers.
>-- 
>John Red-Horse                  jrredho@somnet.sandia.gov
>Structural Dynamics Division
>Sandia National Labs                        (505)845-9190
>~

My computer just took a trip to la-la land, so I hope this isn't a repeat
of information.  I have skied Pajarito only once (a Saturday), but it's
recognized as kind of a sister area by the local patrol.  Senior tests for
the Sandia patrol are conducted there, for example.  John may well be
correct, that they are not open on Fridays.  I can check, if anyone is
really interested.

h. kelly shuldberg
hkelly@edsr.eds.com
Albuquerque, NM
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: harsant@headplant.trl.OZ.AU (Dave Harsant)
Subject: Re: Club Vertical
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne Australia
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 01:08:55 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.195453.4445@clarinet.com> grant@clarinet.com (Grant Robinson) writes:
>
>[diatribe alert]
>Whatever happened to doing things for fun?  Why has society become obsessed
>with numbers?  Why should you care whether you or your friend skied more

You know, that's the third diatribe I've counted in the last week.

--
Dave Harsant,
Telecom Australia Research Laboratories  |  d.harsant@trl.oz.au
From: beilstei@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: gore-tex patent expires? (was:Re: Gore-tex vs etc)
Date: 23 Nov 92 12:52:42 GMT

In article <98736@netnews.upenn.edu>, lobaugh@a.chem.upenn.edu (John Lobaugh) writes:
> On the subject of Gore-tex, I read a net.rumor on rec.backcountry that the 
> patent on Gore-Tex is about to expire and that we are going to see a whole
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

> host of cheap Gore-Tex products in the near future.
> Does this make sense to anyone out there? I have no idea how patent
> law works and how it differs from country to country so I thought I would ask 
> the net...
> 
> -- 
> "Let us say Yes to our precesence together in Chaos" John Cage
> John lobaugh@a.chem.upenn.edu

John,

	I believe the rumors you have heard are true on the Gortex patent.
While working at DuPont 3 summers ago there was a discussion about the future
of the Gore company (obviously they make Gortex and other products based
on the Gortex technology) and how the expiration of the patent would 
effect the company.  Now from what I understand (I won't vouch for the
accuracy of this) the original formulation of the "gortex" material was 
invented at DuPont, and the person who founded the Gore company was a former
polymer researcher at DuPont who further refined the process to get around
the original DuPont patent he developed.  Now since then the Gore formulation
of Goretex (formulation is very important here) is the information covered
in the patent.  Now from friends who work at Gore, I have learned that the
formula has been updated and improved over the 30 year life-span of the
patent, and this new formulation (and the new process that goes with 
the new formula) has never been patented and is thus proprietory information...
in other words a company secret!  Now when one goes and interviews with
the Gore company, a plant tour never includes a tour of the production 
facilities, just a look at the beginning of the factory and a look at the
end of the factory (this I know to be a fact).  Thus security and secrecy is
of highest priority at Gore to protect the investment.  This is true of most
companies with outstanding products, I think you'll find that information
is only patented if someone else discovers it in the mean time.

	So in conclusion (if I can really draw any on these facts), I believe
the Gore company and the product Gore-Tex will not be undersold and overrun by
cheeper competitors.  The prices may sink somewhat however, as other companies
develop or pursue the technology just to insure a stronghold in the market.
I think most of the important information about the Gore-Tex product is
not included in the patent that will be expiring.   In addition, the process
for making Gore-Tex is not covered in the patent, and being a chemical engineer
I can safely tell you this is often more important than what the product 
really is in terms of chemical structure etc.  These are my observations
from a combination of personal experiences and second hand knowledge.....so
I could be totally wrong :-), but I have a feeling that I am closer to
the truth than not.

Hope that helps.....Jim.
From: andyboyl@wam.umd.edu (Andrew 'OPIE' Boyle)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Question on cheaper mail order lift tickets
Date: 15 Nov 92 20:12:38 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park


I have a question to all of you skiers out there.  I remember
reading in a brochure at the end of the last skiing season about
a mail order company that sells lift tickets to many
ski resorts in the northeast through the mail with a substantial
discount.  Problem is that I have lost the brochure.  If anyone
out there knows about the company, or one like it, I would 
appreciate it.

Please E-mail all responses, 
Thanks ahead of time,
Andy
andyboyl@wam.umd.edu


97.43% of all statistics are made up; most of them (83.6 percent) are wrong.
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu (Chris Webster)
Subject: Re: To all of you who call yourselves skiers..
Reply-To: chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu
Organization: Research Aviation Facility, NCAR, Boulder, CO
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:11:43 GMT

sveint@edb.tih.no (Svein Gunnar Tjoenndal,o92b) writes:
>To be honest, I'm very dissapionted.
>I just joined up with this conference, hoping to read something
>useful about skiing.

Why don't you start a "useful" discussion?  Sometimes we have
useful stuff to say and most of the time we don't.

>What I found was this:
>A lot of nerds talking about bars and hotels!!!!!!!!!!
>You guys have really got a problem.
>A serious one.

Get a life.

>					Svein Tjoenndal
>           Cross-country skiing, the first (and real) winter sport
>           was invented in Norway by vikings about 500 AD. 
>           (I guess you just didn't know...)

How do you know that I don't know?  Don't be such an arrogant
pompous assed shithead.

--Chris


Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: atlef@dhhalden.no (ATLE FJOGSTAD)
Subject: Re: re: Norwegian Wood
Organization: Ostfold College
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 02:06:07 GMT

In article <atlef.9.722311319@dhhalden.no> atlef@dhhalden.no (ATLE FJOGSTAD) writes:
>From: atlef@dhhalden.no (ATLE FJOGSTAD)
>Subject: Re: re: Norwegian Wood
>Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 02:01:59 GMT
>    You should rather look for Norwegian beer like Frydenlund, Hansa, Aass,
>    E.C. Dahls (Lysholmer) og Ringnes.
                            ^^
                            Sorry this should be: or

Atlef

/-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+\
|    Atlef                       |    Real skiers push their       |
|    Atlef@sofus.dhhalden.no     |    limits to the edge.          |
|--------------------------------+---------------------------------|
| * To Ski is not about life and death, it's much more important!* |
| *****             Skiers do it in the snow!                ***** |
\-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+/
From: sbirdwell@pbs.org
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: worst wipeout
Date: 20 Nov 92 12:04:28 EST
Organization: PBS:Public Broadcasting Service, Alexandria, VA

	the absolute worst wipe-out i ever had was one my snowboard.
	alpine skiers just love it when a board dude wipes out. i know
	'cause i used to be one myself.

	just cruuzin' this groomed trail at copper, a road really, and like
	hoppin' on and off the sidewalks and dancing in and out of the trees.
	faster 'n that i want to go really, and i never quite learned
	how to apply the breaks. comin' 'round the bend, switching
	from impulse to warp drive, i just can not stay on the trail.

	off into no man's land i go. just when i think i got the hang
	of it, i grab this tree stump and that's all she wrote. back to the 
	carnival its airborne cart wheel time. knocked the livin' #*%! out
	of me. tumbled into a shoulder deep drift. took me quite a while
	to get my breath back while viewing this full constellation of 
	twinkles. thought to myself this sure was stupid, worst ever.
	looked out yonder at the end of a chair lift and the lift 
	operator dude with his binoculars looking at me.

	the snow bored is still buckled tight to both my boots but
	i can't see 'em, they're down there some where. took me at
	least twenty minutes to dig out. still could stand on nothin'
	solid in that drift either. i had to lay out on my board, like
	a boogy board, and swim out of the soft stuff. by this time there
	are more than a few at the lift hut, sharing the binocs and
	laughing hysterically. what a bummer. i got to the part where
	i could slide on somethin' solid and get back to somewhere that 
	looks like and resembles skiable terrain. sat on my bum for 
	a while. got up and buckled in. very conservatively made my way 
	back to the condo. stripped down, got a six pack, hit the 
	hot tub, and called it a day.

  ----------------- standard employee+employer disclaimers apply ------------

  c. scott birdwell                             " luck is where opportunity 
  satellite facility engineer                     meets up with preparation "
  public broadcasting service,              .                  .            
  satellite replacement office           .                            .     
                                                 o      .                   
  sbirdwell@pbs.org                .            <\\-       .                
                                            ,,___/_>__,    
                                      .      "     .  .  .   surf the snow
  ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: rec.skiing

In rec.skiing, johnc@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU (John Cooley) writes:

> The newer Verticals are both stiffer and more responsive than the older pair.
> The older pair, by the way, was not defective.  Some 30 days of skiing after
> what the shop told me was their last tune, I ripped a binding out of the ski
> on Retta's Run.  

Hey, that's the same run I trashed my white Verticals on!!!!!!!  What's up
with that? (aka Cliff Clavin)

I was skiing along and I heard a popping noise which I thought was a ski
pre-releasing.  To my surprise, it was the ski cracking in half!  Somehow
the dragging ski tip made me try to ski directly over a mogul by doing 
splits, with one ski on either side of the mogul - it almost ripped
my groin - ouch!

All vintage Vertical owners, AVOID RETTA'S RUN!!!!!!

Keith Erskine
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (Jim Puckett)
Subject: Weather Channel Ski Reports!
Organization: NASA/MSFC
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 14:24:03 GMT



Why, O why, did last night's Weather Channel ski reports mention
a)Vermont
b)New Hampshire
c)Maine
and
d)Seven Springs along with e)Boyne Mountain, just to say the last two
weren't open yet?

Did the San Andreas slide all the way east to Kansas, and go Ka-Boom?
Did the entire Rocky Mountain chain (along with those Midwest areas that
have been open for weeks 8-) fall off the face of the earth?

jim p.

-- 
Jim Puckett    NTI    puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov     
Madison,AL (205)461-4922  
i need to ask myself.....
***********         Would I rather be right, or happy?         ***********
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: rjn@netcom.com (Richard Newton II)
Subject: European Ski Destinations
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 23:06:21 GMT

Last summer, I got a coupon for a free roundtrip ticket to Europe as
part of a promotion from United Airlines.

Wisely, I've decided to use it for a ski trip :-).  I was mostly considering
Switzerland.

So, I am asking for some net.advice on a plethora of questions:

    If you could go to any one ski area in Europe, where would it be? 
    How are the snow conditions now? 
    Are snowboards allowed? 
    Should I take my own skis/board?

Thanks, all!

-- 
Rich Newton, rjn@netcom.com
Newsgroups: rec.skiing,co.general
From: freedman@cs.ColoState.EDU (keith freedman)
Subject: Re: BOYCOTT Purgatory-Durango
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:41:55 GMT
Reply-To: freedman@cs.ColoState.EDU
Organization: Colorado State University -=- Computer Science Dept.

In article 3985@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov, puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (Jim Puckett) writes:
>It has come to the attention of this office that those responsible for the
>nasty, nasty Amendment actually reside in Durango, CO during the month
>of January. Week of the 9th-17th, I think.
>
>SHOW 'EM YOU CARE! BOYCOTT PURGATORY-DURANGO!!
>
>jim p.
>
If I understand correctly, you are asking people to boycott purgatory because some
people with no morals vacation there?!  And are you asking people to punish the
owners of Purgatory because they are allowing these people to ski there since it
would be difficult for them to figure out how to prevent them from being there
in the first place??!?

Who would this show that you care?
How would this show that you care?
(You can answer these questions in e-mail if you like).

---
Keith Freedman
Colorado State University
Department of Computer Science
Systems Administration

Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: gunn@cucbs.chem.columbia.edu (John Gunn)
Subject: Re: Steepness
Organization: Center for Biomolecular Simulation
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 20:04:36 GMT

In article <Nov20.172559.77516@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna) writes:
>In article <1992Nov20.151802.21989@uvm.edu> waw@moose.uvm.edu (Mad Dog SkiDeath,send mail to Wesley.Wright@uvm.edu) writes:
>>From article <1992Nov18.195849.10259@netcom.com>, 
>>by brunette@netcom.com (Hal Brunette):
>>> Goat      Stowe, VT                    35.3               19.5 degrees
>>> 
>>Remember, too, that these are average grades over the length of the trail.
>>Maximum grades may differ. The upper sections of most of the front four
>>trails at Stowe are closer to 42%, if memory serves. The attraction of
>
>Yes, and Corbett's is 90 degrees at the top.
>
>-- 
>
>-Wayne Trzyna
> trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU

Yeah, except for that first turn, Corbett's is actually a pretty easy
run to ski.  If you don't count the cliff, I'd say Alta Chutes is a more
challenging run, and probably steeper.  My vote for steepest run would go
to Pallisades at Squaw Valley anyways.

-- 
John Gunn, Ph.D                    |  "A casual stroll through the lunatic      
Columbia University                |  asylum shows that faith doesn't           
Center for Biomolecular Simulation |  prove anything."                          
and Head Coach, Ski Team           |     - Friedrich Neitzsche                  
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: patch@sequent.com (Pat Chewning)
Subject: Re: Please! Name our ski team
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: USA
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 14:02:59 GMT

>In article <BLANE.92Nov18172722@hobbes.sanders.lockheed.com> blane@hobbes.sanders.lockheed.com (Michael Blane) writes:
>>Hello netters,
>>  We are uncreative and need help choosing a name for our corporate NASTAR
>>team.  Previous monikers include Sprockets and Frost Heaves, so please, 
>>don't suggest one of those.  I will post a summary, so start thinking....
>>
>

How about the MASTERGATERS
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: jog@kpc.com (Rajeev Jog)
Subject: Re: Closest ski area to San Jose?
Organization: Kubota Pacific Computers Inc.
Distribution: ca
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:38:31 GMT

joynt@titania.etdesg.trw.com (Robert M. Joynt) writes:

>I will be in San Jose early for the Sun User Group conference 12/5 and 12/6
>and would like to go snowboarding on Sunday 12/6. What is the closest ski
>area to San Jose and what is the drive time? I have thought about South
>Lake Tahoe but the travel time looks like 4hours. Any suggestions?


>Thanks!

>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Robert M. Joynt                                  TRW Electronic Systems Group
>Workstation System Manager                       M5/2216B One Space Park 
>Internet: joynt@etdesg.trw.com                   Redondo Beach, CA 90278
>Phone: (310) 814-1615                            
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You're not likely to do too much better.  Kirkwood, Iron Mountain, Bear
Valley & Dodge Ridge are slightly better: ~3:15-3:30 hours; also 
Boreal (right off I-80 near Donner Summit) *might* be less than 4 hours. 
-- 
Rajeev Jog
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kubota Pacific Computer Inc.                                   +1 408 727 8100
2630 Walsh Avenue, Santa Clara, CA. 95051-0905, USA.               jog@kpc.com
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: jharvey@Cadence.COM (Jeff Harvey)
Subject: Re: Ski's
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 18:35:34 GMT


I just bought 4S's last year.  The going price seemed to be in the $299 - 
$335 (US) range.  (Bindings extra, of course)
From: jtbell@acsu.buffalo.edu (Jonathan T. Bell)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: To all of you who call yourselves skiers...
Date: 19 Nov 92 19:52:43 GMT
Organization: UB

In article <1992Nov19.122100.5638W@baron.edb.tih.no> sveint@edb.tih.no writes:
>To be honest, I'm very dissapionted.
>I just joined up with this conference, hoping to read something
>useful about skiing.
>What I found was this:
>A lot of nerds talking about bars and hotels!!!!!!!!!!
>You guys have really got a problem.
>A serious one.

	I think maybe it is YOU who has the problem...from what I get out of 
this group is good information on equipment and areas (including the 
extracircular activities). Why don't you lighten up and get off your pompous
attitude?

					-Jonny B.
Newsgroups: rec.skiing