HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ailsa@wonky.UUCP (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: MOTSS-oriented music?
Date: 26 Jan 93 00:29:29 GMT

In article <1993Jan24.203627.12693@netcom.com>, jfh@netcom.com (Jack Hamilton) writes:

> In article <1993Jan23.085540.12922@fuug.fi> an6245@anon.penet.fi
> (Nobody in particular...) writes:
>>I've seen posted on here lists of both MOTSS-oriented movies and gay
>>TV characters.  I haven't seen anything yet related to MOTSS-oriented
>>music.
>
well, i can list QUITE a few motss-oriented musicians:

Ferron
Holly Near (less so lately, but _imagine my surprise_ is GREAT if you're
just coming out!)
Alix DObkin
Phranc
Theresa Trull
Chris WIlliamson
Lucie Blue Tremblay
the Indigo Girls (check out their cover of "romeo and juliet" on their
latest album)

i know i'm forgetting a lot of women's music Names, but these are the
ones in my collection, anyway...

and of course, there's Erasure, Mark Almond, and Romanovsky and Philips,
but that's hardly news to y'all, eh?  B)

                                                -ailsa

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                           ailsa@wonky.uucp
 LIfe moves so mysterious with its cute little spins        ________
 And it's everyone's koan and door to get in        Silence \      / Action
 It's old human nature, it's cold or it's hot          =     \    /    =
 I think of you often, I like you a lot              Death    \  /    Life
 But if it's snowin' in Brooklyn                               \/
 I'd say snow is what we got.           -Ferron
Xref: sparky soc.motss:58091 soc.bi:18943 alt.sex.motss:2242 alt.support:1642
From: fogarty@sir-c.jpl.nasa.gov (Tim Fogarty)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,soc.bi,alt.sex.motss,alt.support
Subject: Re: HIV-negative survey (repost)
Date: 23 Jan 1993 02:26:35 GMT
Organization: JPL, Space Imaging Radar Software Group
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: sir-c.jpl.nasa.gov


In article <74177@cup.portal.com>, Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com writes:

|>If you value your life, do not ever dare to suggest reducing the
|>number of partners as a strategy to remain HIV free. To do so is
|>homophobic, judgemental, and immoral. To cite studies that show
|>the relationship between number of partners and HIV rate is also
|>immoral.

Especially when they are taken out of context.  You take a study that
shows that in a sample of people in San Francisco using condoms, some
percentage of them are HIV+.  Therefore you state that using condoms
does not lower the risk.  You IMPLIED that these people who are HIV+
became HIV+ while using the condoms.  This is misleading as well as
illogical.  The study you quoted had collected no data to support this.  

A much more likely scenario is that those who knew that they were HIV+
then started using condoms.


|> Do not discourage sex, or imply that there is such a thing
|>as excessive amounts of sex. Just make sure you use condoms 100% of
|>the time, and pray that the AIDS failure rate is better than the 10%
|>pregnacy failure rate for condoms.

This 10% figure is very old, and the failure rate is much lower when
used correctly, such as only using water based lubricants.  Oil based
lubricants can weaken latex.

Also, the 10% figure is a 10% chance for a whole year.  How much is that ?
I dont know how often young heterosexual married couples have sex, but
lets assume twice a week.  Therefore thats about 100 times a year.  That
means that condoms, even when used improperly, have a failure rate of 1 in 1000.

Want to be extra safe ?  1) only use water based lubricants,  2) use condoms
with a spermicide, the spermicide also kills other cells that may harbor HIV,
3) even with a condom, withdraw before ejaculating.



I've tried to write Mr Hu, but I cant get there from here.  How do others
get uunet sites ?

--
Tim Fogarty (FOGARTY@SIR-C.JPL.NASA.GOV)
Sys Man and Sys Admin for the EGSE in the POCC at JSC for SRL-1 and SRL-2
SRL-1:  STS-59, launch date April 14, 1994
SRL-2:  STS-68, launch date December 1, 1994
finger for details
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: cjones@physci.ucla.edu (Chad Jones)
Subject: Re: Contacting the White House
X-UserAgent: Nuntius v1.1
Organization: University of California Los Angeles
Date: 27 Jan 93 13:18:35 PST

In article <1993Jan27.171902.21808@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> Jeannine
Marie Pinto, jmp8p@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU writes:
>Does the White House have a FAX number?  And how about an email
>address?

No email yet, but here's two fax numbers:
(202) 456-2883
(202) 456-2461

I hope your fax machine has redial, though.  I'm setting my fax modem to
call in the middle of the night so I don't get a busy signal.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chad Jones                 | Do I need someone here to scold me or do I
Network Manager            | need someone who'll grab and pull me out of
UCLA Physiological Science | this four poster dull torpor pulling
cjones@physci.ucla.        | downward?                 -- 10,000 Maniacs
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.sex.motss
From: tom@flood.com (Tom Chatt)
Subject: Re: Tim Chain Porn (Re: High School Athletes (lusher))
Organization: The Flood Group, Inc.  Torrance, Ca.
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 93 08:25:08 GMT

joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis) writes:
|        That's when he noticed that no one was left in the lab. It was
| 4am, after all.

A computer lab empty at 4am?  The willing suspension of disbelief
has its limits...

-- 
Tom Chatt                        \   Don't take offense, take action.
Internet: tom@flood.com           \    Speak up. When we remain silent,
UUCP: ...!uunet!flood!tom        / \     we oppress ourselves.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis)
Subject: Are Queens Bitchier, Really?
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 15:57:59 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.200906.23519@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>In article <77557@apple.apple.COM> richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel) writes:
>>Clay Bond taught me, albeit indirectly, that sometimes it pays to read
>>past what appears, on the surface, to be hateful and vulgar.
>
>Clay Bond was never vulgar, or stupid, for that matter.

Responses:
 1) I'm touch typing blind right now, upon reading the last sentence
my eyeballs shot out of my head and lodged in the wall opposite, I'm
going to have to replace them with some new leica lenses.
 2) Clay was never vulgar or stupid except when he was. His vulgarity
was that he never debated with someone that he didn't descend simply
into personal attack, and his stupidity was that he chose his enemies
poorly, people who were uninterested, incapable or afraid of attack.
Both defects when elaborated in his writing created a kind of ennui.
 3) I also hesitate to mention the number of people who ceased to
participate because of Clay's postings; I think the resurgence of
women's voices on MOTSS post-departure speaks for itself.
 4) I'm reading Steve Dyer typing that he was never vulgar, or stupid?

>>Several
>>years ago I would have reacted very differently to Matthew's contributions.
>>He is not for everyone; but then, who _is_ on this forum?  There are gems
>>to be found amongst all that hard, black coal.

Richard, richard. We've got to get spanking on that damn metaphor
dictionary. 'gems amongst all that hard, black coal?' that's as bad as
saying 'the greener the pasture, the more full of shit' - who needs
the smell?

>With Melmon, what you see is what you get, mostly.  And that's spite
>without much intelligence or wit to make him worth reading.  Believe me,
>you're not doing him any favor by comparing him to Clay Bond.

Melmon writes, as opposed to those who type. That's usually enough to
pass for wit and intelligence, well that worked for Clay. Melmon is
also much more clever about whom he chooses to flame. His taking on
personalities is much more entertaining, and gutsy, but Clay's searing
first-time posters was cruelty. So soon we forget. I can't think of
the last bad first-time flame I've seen in a while.

One can be a shit without hurting people. He attacks people with
steely carapaces. Big deal.
-- 
US Jojo; damp, slighly soiled, but tasty nonetheless.
From: viejones@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Michael A. Jones)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: G&L MILITARY BAN: Call the White House NOW!
Date: 26 Jan 93 10:51:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <9648052325011993/A05354/POSSE/1171CDC11400*@mrgate.uwyo.edu>, LASAGA@corral.uwyo.edu (LASAGA) writes...
> 
>In article <chavez.727989434@quorum.com>, chavez@quorum.com 
>(R. Martin Chavez) writes:
>>3.   Legislation is being introduced in the House and Senate to 
>>make the ban enforceable by legislation.  (Remember the ban was 
>>instituted through an Executive Order 50 yrs ago - legislation
>>could make the ban into LAW!!!)
> 
>Would congressional legislation be able to override an executive
>order by Clinton?  Or would an executive order by Clinton be able
>to override congressional legislation?  Anybody know?
> 
>-maria

Congress prevails and could pass a law overriding an executive order
issued by Clinton.  Furthermore, the military code contains
provisions outlawing homosexual behavior (sodomy, other stuff?) and can
only be amended by Congress.  This is why both Clinton and Aspin
have been making such an effort to get some kind of compromise
solution with the Joint Chiefs of Staff.  They figure that if they can
come up with something the military can swallow that Congress will go
along.  The idea Aspin was pushing the other day was that 
the Courts were bound (not sure where he gets that idea) to 
override the ban sometime and the military might as well have 
some say in what the new policy will be and how its implemented.  
A quote I saw from Senate Minority leader Dole indicates that he's confident
Clinton doesn't have enough support on the Hill.



					Mike
From: rich@netcom.com (Richard Poppen)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Another reason?  CO 2
Date: 25 Jan 93 17:00:57 GMT
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)

In article <1993Jan25.160427.13532@lclark.edu> snodgras@lclark.edu
(Bil Snodgrass) writes:
>
>Read in the Jan.16th Denver Post that the Attorney Generals
>office of Colorado was working throught the three day weekend to 
>get the injunction to CO 2 into the court of Appeals.  
>
>I understand that their duty may bind them to follow through on
>the Appeal, but I cannot believe that they had to work through
>the weekend and on Martin Luther Kings Holiday!
>
>Remember, the Attorney General is a part of the Colorado Government
>and those silly little SALES TAXES you pay in Denver, Aspen, Vail
>and Boulder goes to the government of Colorado.  Seems that they are
>just a tad enthusiastic to get this thing to the Appeals Court.  Does
>it bug anyone the this same Attorney General has not gone to the Appeals
>Court to get Measure 2 Appealed for the Homosexuals it is going to affect.
>You know those Gays who are also the people of Colorado!

No ... as you seem to imply in your second paragraph, the Colorado
attorney general's office is bound by law to try to get the amendment
upheld, regardless of the individuals' opinions of it.  If they think
it won't stand anyway, the quickest way to get rid of it is to push the
appeal as fast as possible.  I'm glad they're doing it; I hope it's
overturned in time for me to arrange my annual August trip to Aspen.

--Rich
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rhayden@oracle.com (Ronald Hayden)
Subject: Re: Clue phone for William J. Clinton
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Belmont, Ca.
	<RHAYDEN.93Jan26141412@hqsun2.oracle.com>
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 05:09:18 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <RHAYDEN.93Jan26141412@hqsun2.oracle.com>
rhayden@oracle.com (Ronald Hayden) writes the same message twice.

My apologies for the duplicate messages; my news-poster is playing
games with me...

--

  - Ronald Hayden

    ----------------------------------------------------------------
   | Documentation Manager, Oracle Toolkit Group                    |
   | Co-chair of Oracle Lambda, Oracle's Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual group |
   | Writer, magician, and various other things                     |
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
From: coren@speed.osf.org (Robert Coren)
Subject: Re: Are Queens Bitchier, Really?
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 22:46:43 GMT

In article <1993Jan27.155759.27905@spdcc.com>, joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis) writes:
> In article <1993Jan26.200906.23519@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
> >In article <77557@apple.apple.COM> richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel) writes:
> >>Clay Bond taught me, albeit indirectly, that sometimes it pays to read
> >>past what appears, on the surface, to be hateful and vulgar.
> >
> >Clay Bond was never vulgar, or stupid, for that matter.
> 
> Responses:
>  1) I'm touch typing blind right now, upon reading the last sentence
> my eyeballs shot out of my head and lodged in the wall opposite, I'm
> going to have to replace them with some new leica lenses.

While not necessarily disagreeing with what follows, I have to ask:
don't nobody around here know how to read?

I assume the lack of parallelism between Richard's adjectives and
Steve's is deliberate. Steve's remark makes much more sense if you
note that he carefully does not deny that Clay could be hateful.

>  2) Clay was never vulgar or stupid except when he was. His vulgarity
> was that he never debated with someone that he didn't descend simply
> into personal attack, and his stupidity was that he chose his enemies
> poorly, people who were uninterested, incapable or afraid of attack.
> Both defects when elaborated in his writing created a kind of ennui.

Besides which, calling people shit-for-brains is vulgar. That doesn't
mean that it's necessarily bad in all cases or contexts, mind you.

I don't think Clay was or is stupid, but he did a damn good imitation
of stupidity sometimes, in his steadfast refusal to go the effort of
figuring out what people really meant (while at the same time
maintaining that their failure to understand what *he* meant was
evidence of their stupidity).

And, for the most part, I'd rather read Bond than Melmon anytime. This
doesn't say much about what I think of them as people, since I've
never met either of them.

For the record: Matthew's comments about people getting what they
deserve (you all know what I'm talking about) were, indeed, hateful,
vulgar, stupid, and thoroughly offensive.

> 
> Melmon writes, as opposed to those who type. That's usually enough to
> pass for wit and intelligence, well that worked for Clay.

Oh, come on, Joseph. If you "wrote" the way he does, but in the volume
that you do, we'd all have stopped reading you long ago. "Wit" and
"intelligence"? Yeah, like Joan Rivers.
From: lmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Laurie Mann)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Clinton is President, Bush is not even history
Date: 22 Jan 1993 13:41:10 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer Inc, Marlboro MA
Reply-To: lmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: ansible.pubs.stratus.com

Richard Poppen writes
>In article <1993Jan20.204139.29513@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com (Andrew  
Solovay) writes:
>>In article <1jk2ceINNl9h@transfer.stratus.com>  
lmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com writes:
>>>The inaugural speech was fine and short.  The poem by Maya Angelu was quite
>>>moving.  But, my favorite part (after Al Gore's displacement
>>>of Dan Quayle as VP) was the music played immediately before Bill Clinton
>>>took the oath.  
>>The Monty Python theme song is John Philip Sousa's "Liberty Bell March",
>>which is about as American as apple pie.
>>Now, how many millions of Americans expected a giant foot to squash
>>George Bush?
>Or to hear Bill Clinton announce, in a John Cleese-esque voice,
>"And now for something completely different"?

I think that's precisely WHY that march was chosen to usher
Bill Clinton in to office.  He wants to herald and encourage change.  It was  
also the theme of his speech.  He wants his administration to be completely  
different from the last two.

He's actually not off to a terrible start.  He's making some mistakes, but
it looks like he's trying to create progress rather than getting completely
mired down immediately.

** lmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Internet) Laurie.Mann (GEnie) **
******      And now for something completely different...     ******
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: milr@quads.uchicago.edu (mark ryan miller)
Subject: Gays in Military 
Reply-To: milr@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 15:34:58 GMT

Well, we've heard the idea that the argument to keep gays out
of the military are the same as ones used to keep out blacks.
Does anyone have (or has anyone been reading) original articles
from the '40s that talk about what happened then?  I'm afraid
we might be comparing apples and oranges.  I don't think it's
likely, but I would like to have some more information.

--Mark
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: Charlie Fulton <charlie@isis.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: MOTSS-Oriented Music, Part II
X-Xxdate: Tue, 26 Jan 93 12:03:22 GMT
Organization: Ctr for Advanced Rsrch in Oppressive Binarisms
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d7
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 17:00:39 GMT

This article was probably generated by a buggy news reader.
From: mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Audrey
Date: 25 Jan 93 23:57:24 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss
Organization: Apple Computer, Inc.

In article <1k1o7pINNj7t@mizar.usc.edu>, adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
wrote:

> Well, there are great movie stars who are great actors.  There
> are also great movie stars who are great movie actors.  (Garbo
> is preeminent here.)  And, of course, there are also great movie 
> stars who are, by any objective standard, *terrible* actors.  (Joan 
> Crawford comes to mind.)  But the Academy Awards have nothing to
> do with the quality of an actor's performance.  Never have (do
> you really think Luise Rainer was *that* magnificent?), and
> never will.

Dolphie has spoken (not that I had any doubts...).  I think, perhaps,
Miss Hepburn will still manage to sleep nights, though it is
extremely unlikely the opinions of such cultural giants as Adolphson
and (<snort>) Reaser will ever reach her ears.

*X*
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jarvis@psych.toronto.edu (Brian Jarvis)
Subject: Re: finding each other at MOW... an idea
Organization: Department of Psychology, University of Toronto
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 18:41:29 GMT

In article <thaaang.728155474@cwis> thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:
>Okay, fine then. We'll all be Steven groupies and tote bass drums.

I'll have one hell of a time explaining it at the border...

Brian
-- 

Brian A. Jarvis,          Rm. 4026, Sidney Smith Hall, Dept. of Psychology,
jarvis@psych.toronto.edu  University of Toronto, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
System Administrator      M5S 1A1  (416) 978-3948
From: buckmr@rs6421.ecs.rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Actionary Activism (NY)
Date: 26 Jan 93 22:48:35 GMT
Article-I.D.: rpi.00p3n9+

jsb16@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Jennifer S Broekman) writes:

>If it's time to act (instead of react), how shall we start? Obviously NY
>State needs a nondiscrimination law covering orientation. We need to visit
>Sen. Moynihan and Sen. D'Amato while we're in DC. Is anyone organizing
>a delegation to the Senators? Is there a group lobbying for state legislation?
>Do we have an Assemblycritter willing to propose the legislation?
Honey, where have yu been? Anyone interested in getting involved in New York 
State's attempt to become a free state, please email me.

[There is some possibility of optimism, but not much] I'll let you know how
things progress.

I can tell you the bill is going to be passed by the Assembly floor Feb 1 but
there is an uphill battle to get it passed in the Senate [Republican controlled
35-26].

-- 
RON BUCKMIRE, 11 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735. "See YOU in D.C. 4/25/93"
vox:(518)-276-8910 fax:(518)-276-6920 buckmr@rpi.edu buckmr@rpitsmts.bitnet
Feminism "...encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children,
practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become lesbians." -- Pat Robertson.
From: dauber@tattoo.mti.sgi.com (Jeff Dauber)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Tim Chain Porn (Re: High School Athletes (lusher))
Date: 22 Jan 93 00:38:45 GMT
Reply-To: dauber@tattoo.mti.sgi.com (Jeff Dauber)
Organization: sgi
NNTP-Posting-Host: tattoo.mti.sgi.com

In article <brsmith.727658272@duncan>, brsmith@duncan.cs.umn.edu (Brian R. Smith) writes:

|> ever logged into, and the first I administrated.  VMS?  What's that?  I
|> had Mt. Xinu 4.3BSD with NFS and *source*, and I *liked* it...

Well, when I was a kid, you had to boot the machine by flipping switches
on the front.


FWA
From: limey@hri.com (Craig Hughes)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: More Capitol phone #s to call about the ban
Date: 26 Jan 93 20:05:56 GMT
Reply-To: limey@hri.com
Distribution: usa
Organization: Horizon Research, Inc.

Sorry if these are duplicates, but they might be useful:

House Armed Services Committee
2120 RHOB
Washington, DC 20515
(202) 225-4151

Senate Armed Services Committee
SR-228
Washington, DC  20510
(202) 224-3871


--craig
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: heard@franklin.cc.utas.edu.au (George Heard)
Subject: Re: MOTSS-oriented music?
Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 20:56:41 GMT

an6245@anon.penet.fi (Nobody in particular...) writes:

>I've seen posted on here lists of both MOTSS-oriented movies and gay
>TV characters.  I haven't seen anything yet related to MOTSS-oriented
>music.

OK - forgive me for being deeply rooted in the 70s (that was probably phrased
incredibly badly) but there were a few MOTSS-oriented bands around, especially
in the late 70s...

Elton Motello - one album "Victim Of Time" has the following tracks...
 "I Am The Marshal" - about a policemans sadistic(?) love for a criminal
 "Get The Boy"
 "Teenage Pimp"
 "Jet Boy, Jet Girl" - The original, an English version of "Ca Plane Pour Moi"

Most people would consider it a shocker, but there is Supernaut's one hit
"I Like It Both Ways"

Jobriath (boy am I going to get flamed now) was an openly gay glam artist (now
I'm really going to get flamed). He did two albums "Jobriath" and "Cratures
of the Street", mainly full of non-gender specific love songs. Peter Frampton
played on both albums...

Quarterflash has been mentioned - I'm not sure about Mud, ditto "Liberation"
by the Village People.

Laurie 8

Laurie 8 <heard@postoffice.utas.edu.au>  | Some Driveways are concrete
Theoretical Chemistry PhD student        | Some Driveways have bricks
University of Tasmania, Australia        | Other Driveways
Unashamed 70s man, glad to be glam.      | Have Pebble-Mix - Laurie 8         
Opinions expressed above are those not only of Laurie 8, but the whole world