HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: 160955r@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Post election speculations
Date: 29 Sep 1992 16:30:04 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

Romania now enjoys the dubious distinction of having voted twice back
into power cosmetically altered communists; moreover, since these elec-
tions will  undoubdtedly  be perceived as "democratic" by the West,
the Iliescu rascals will enjoy hard currency funding  for whatever
hare-brained schemes they have in mind..
What we now have in Romania is a recipe for disaster: an ailing economy
with high inflation and uneployment led by a bunch of pseudodemocrats with
an ultranationalistic twist!
Another  destabilizing factor may be the emerging structure of parilamentary
power; apparently, neither FDSN/PRM/PUNR/PSM nor CD/FSN/PUMR will muster more
than 40% in any of the chambers, fact which opens the door for the small
and otherwise insignificant political formations to become arbiters each
and every time an issue is considered..Expect the budget to be voted piece-
meal-wise folks..
A real danger: Petrica Roman suffers a sudden nostalgia attack, redefines
himself as a "moderating factor" and brings his troops back into the
Iliescu-KGB line, case in which we should expect a Romanian Academy team
of experts (led by Birladeanu of course) to recommend collectivization as
the best way to achieve high yields per acre in Romania...
Fact is, Romania's GNP hovers around US$1300.00 per capita. In recent decades
it became obvious that the only way to propel a country into the 8-10k per
capita level is through massive exports. There is simply no other path.
United or not, Western Europe poses formidable trade barriers to Romanian
exports, while the American market, even if and when re-clause, is less
suitable for traditional Romanian exports.
Now, does anyone believe that an Iliescu/Verdet/Funar-led Romania  is likely
to get any political leverage with the West!?!
Lucian Blaga once said that people are of two kinds: some of us try to re-
veal the mistery; the rest palpitate in the horizon of reproduction...
Maybe Iliescu should rename FDSN the Palpitating Reproductors Party..
All right, I'm getting weird, I know..

Cheers!

-- 
Radu T. Tomescu at UCBerkeley
Department of Economics
From: acarstea@icaen.uiowa.edu (Alin-Andrei Carsteanu)
Subject: Re: table after 6 rounds
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 18:09:57 GMT
Organization: Iowa Computer Aided Engineering Network, University of Iowa

In article <19t0h6INNomj@pollux.usc.edu> bucur@pollux.usc.edu (alexander bucur) writes:
>In article <1992Sep21.231215.15028@lsil.com> sispas@lsil.com writes:
>>1. Steaua Bucuresti         6   5  1  0    21- 4   11p 
>>2. Dinamo Bucuresti         6   4  2  0    17- 4   10p 
>>3. Rapid Bucuresti          6   3  3  0     8- 3    9p
>
>Rapiduletul, cuibusor de nebunii .....
>
>I would love to be there and see them going crazy at such beatiful results.
>
>Knowing the backup the Dinamo and Steaua receive, it is quite nice to see that
>other clubs get a chance to show good work.
>

With this history-making article of Sasha, we've reached the "1000" threshold,
at least considering US-distribution! How about a beer on it?!
	Alin
From: 160955r@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Ion Baiesu, Dan Desliu, Dead
Date: 5 Oct 1992 16:57:50 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu


Ion Baiesu, well known Romanian humorist, inventor of "Tanta" and
"Costel", died a few days ago in New jersey shortly after a compli-
cated open heart surgery.

About a week ago Dan Desliu apparently suffered a heart attack while
swimming in the Black Sea, close to the Writer's Compound; his body
was found only several days later.

Pantha Rei...

Cheers!


-- 
Radu T. Tomescu at UCBerkeley
Department of Economics
From: se@comp.lancs.ac.uk (Steve Elliott)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: tranlation, please!!
Date: 6 Oct 92 12:30:31 GMT
Organization: Department of Computing at Lancaster University, UK.

I've just received a letter from a friend of mine
working in Romania, She's obviously trying to learn the language.
Please could someone translate the following?

La revedere pentru acom


Steve Elliott
-- 
se@uk.ac.lancs.comp
Department of Computing, Engineering Building, 
University of Lancaster, Bailrigg, Lancaster, LA1 4YR, UK
PHONE: +44 524 65201 ext 3783.
From: busuioc@acsu.buffalo.edu (Anca I. Busuioc)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Re: Education
Date: 6 Oct 92 21:19:49 GMT
Organization: UB

>|snf_av@debet.nhh.no writes:
>|> 
>|> 	If those talking about "lack of education" are speaking for
>|> themselves, I really agree.
>|> 
>|> Anca

	(gee, Anca, that was kinda harsh...  i think you're off a
lot of christmas lists)


Alexander Mihai Popovici writes:
>I think the Romanian education is broader in a classical sense than the
>American education.  However I don't think that this part of the education is
>too  important in forming a young person.
>
>What a Romanian education does not teach you is the importance of
>independent thinking and the value of the different opinion.
>The flexibility to deal with opposing ideas and to tolerate and 
>respect them.  

	hm, i tend to agree with this.

	let's remember that we (the romanians on the net)
are the privileged ones: we went to good high-schools, in big
cities, and we actually managed to learn something.  most of us 
went to college in romania too.  now we're here, impressing the
americans.  good for us (collective pat on the back.)

	BUT, for kids in small villages, who spent 1/4 of their 
school year picking the harvest, and who also had the worst
teachers (now, what teacher in his right mind would have
wanted to teach outside the city???), it's a totally different
story.  also, remember some of those "licee de constructii"?  my 
mother taught at 2 of them.  she used to bring home exams for us 
to marvel at (they were written by whole classes of astonishingly
ignorant students.)  that was 5 years ago.  how educated could 
those people be today?  not only professionally but as citizens?
as voters?  (hint-hint)

	yes, i'm glad i went to high-school in romania and not
here.  i am grateful to my parents for all their nagging ("study
or else you'll end up at agricultural highschool X, learning about
tomatoes")  i also would have liked more choice in my curriculum
and some other options that americans have and i didn't have.
so i guess my education _did_ lack something.

	the point is, i can't say that OVERALL, romanians did a
better job than americans.  lots of people fall through the
cracks in both systems.   let's just enjoy the applauses we get
here for our wonderful european education...


	anca
	innocent abroad

	(ok: there is another Anca but she is in norway and she
	-- being a much more accomplished typist -- uses capitals,
	so hopefully there will be no confusion)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
From: acarstea@icaen.uiowa.edu (Alin-Andrei Carsteanu)
Subject: Re: Moldova/Romania News from RFE/RL, 9/24/92
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 18:07:16 GMT
Organization: Iowa Computer Aided Engineering Network, University of Iowa

In article <1992Sep24.130417.14875@umr.edu> msirbu@next5.cs.umr.edu (Mihai Sirbu) writes:
>RFE/RL Daily Report           No. 184, 24 September 1992
>
>ROMANIA'S NSF LEADER ON POST-ELECTORAL STRATEGY.  Petre Roman,
>leader of the National Salvation Front and former prime minister,
>praised his opposition rivals at a press conference on 23
>September. Roman said that the DC is likely to win the elections
>and to form Romania's first genuinely democratic government since
>the 1989 anti-communist revolution. He further pledged his party's
>support for the DC in the parliament, even if the NSF is not part
>of the next government; but added that the offer was limited to
>the period necessary to achieve stability in Romania.  Roman
>declined to be drawn out on press speculations that he could
>become foreign minister in the new cabinet.  (Dan Ionescu, RFE/RL,
>Inc.)
>

I think, this might be essential! Everyone was very loud about the
presidential elections, and it's really amazing for me, why!? Romania
does not have a "Presidential system". (Fortunately, unlike in the
US, in Romania the president does not have any veto rights against
laws, et c.). Some told me "it's an important symbol". Symbol of what?
Of the paternalism we're not able to get rid of? "The president giving
us salami"?
And: When the f... are we gonna get into real life and forget about
symbolism? Romania is run by a Parliament. They are the exclusive
lawmakers. So, I guess, the DC will have Parliament majority with this
(unconditional !) NSF support and this is probably THE thing in those
elections!!!

Best wishes to everyone & good luck to Romania, as someone was saying!

	Alin
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Date: Fri,  2 Oct 1992 11:11:55 -0400 
From: Paul Grigore Hodor <ph20+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Elections


On 01-Oct-92 in Re: Elections                
user marian@vms.huji.ac.il writes:
>>                       Funar was quite hard to really get to what things
>> he was refering to.  I am quite afraid of such people getting to
power, howev
>er
>> we had legionars during the 1930-1940 (my grandfather was one, and he
changed
>> to communist when during the 46-47 period).  I blamed my grandfather for
>> what he did, however the machismo that goes with such movements makes many
>> "little dicks" to like them and to become die-hards believers.
>>
>> Sasha Bucur
> 
>The problem of legionarism was quite complicate. Many of legionars were people
>without culture and education, who have fallen "victims" of an intolerant
>and demagogic ideology. These people were themselves thirsty of blood. But
>I have to emphasize that also many intelectuals, some of them brilliant, have
>fallen by their naivity to the same ideology. For instance, the great geometer
>Dan Barbillian, who was also a genial poet, under the name Ion Barbu; or the
>strong mathematician (theory of probabilities and mathematic statistics) Octav
>Onicescu, who was later a member of Romanian Academy, during ceausescu. These
>are examples from my domain of activity. May be there are many other examples.
> 
> 
>Marian Dodu
> 

It appears that all nationalistic movements have at the beginning the
support of some highly educated people, yet the development of such
movements is always the same. I personally know two university
professors from Cluj-Napoca, highly regarded professionals, who are
members and passionate supporters of "Vatra". I think there are enough
similarities between the very beginnings of nazism and legionarism,
compared to what is happening with PUNR, to make us aware of the danger.

Paul Hodor
Carnegie Mellon U, Dept Bio Sci
Pittsburgh, PA, USA

Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
From: acarstea@icaen.uiowa.edu (Alin-Andrei Carsteanu)
Subject: Re: table after 6 rounds
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 17:48:24 GMT
Organization: Iowa Computer Aided Engineering Network, University of Iowa

In article <gekpPlG00io2IcqFNO@andrew.cmu.edu> Radu Eugen Edelstein <re0x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Sasha writes:
>>Rapiduletul, cuibusor de nebunii .....
>
[..............]
>
>I say:
>Sorry, Sasha, but Rapid *is* among the *priviledged ones* now.

How comes?
	Alin
From: mihai@nada.kth.se (Mihai Dorobantu)
Subject: Re: Post election speculation
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 07:54:19 GMT

In article <BvD549.J7o@acsu.buffalo.edu>, adumi-v@acsu.buffalo.edu writes:
|> Personally, I fear more from worms like Corneliu Vadim Tudor, or Ghe. Funar
|> than from the old fox Iliescu.
|> But still, with a miracle, four years with Iliescu could be avoided.
|> 
|> Auguri,
|> 
|> Virgil 

The miracle is happening in Brasil, so it is unlikely to repeat
itself in Roumania.

That doesn't mean we can't hope for it...

On the other hand, the list of worms in public life is growing
at an alarming rate (Adrian Paunescu is a "new" star). I think we cannot
set appart the elections' results and this growth. Combining the two 
gives a sad, sad outlook for Roumania!

By the way, the list of "good guys" doesn't seem to grow.

Best regards,

Mihai Dorobantu
From: piij@hippo.ru.ac.za (Mr ID Jennings)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: three questions
Summary: three questions about romanian society
Keywords: election, hungarian, rugby
Date: 2 Oct 92 17:54:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: hippo.1992Oct2.175425.6030
Organization: Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa

Three questions about Romania - unconnected, but perhaps connected in
ways that I don't understand.

1stly: When will the election results be available?

2ndly: What proportion of the population in Romania has Hungarian as its
mother tongue - and is this a likely source of tension on the Yugoslav
scale?

3rdly: How did rugby football become popular in Romania?  Who introduced
it?  What sort of a record does the national team have?

Thanks
-- 
Ian Jennings
Philosophy Department
Rhodes University
Grahamstown 6140
From: snf_av@debet.nhh.no
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Education
Date: 2 Oct 92 08:48:32 MET
Organization: Norwegian School of Economics


	If those talking about "lack of education" are speaking for
themselves, I really agree.

Anca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
From: broder@src.dec.com (Andrei Broder)
Subject: Platforms ? 
Reply-To: broder@src.dec.com
Organization: DEC Systems Research Center
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 21:04:48 GMT

Can a good (and informed) soul post a two line description of the
various parties, full names and current platforms, especially the
small ones?  I am starting to get lost in the alphabet soup.

Thanks,

- Andrei
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
From: mihai@nada.kth.se (Mihai Dorobantu)
Subject: Re: Elections
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 12:36:16 GMT

In article <1992Sep29.102329.10782@u.washington.edu>, viktoria@carson.u.washington.edu (Viktoria Seibert) writes:
|> In article <1992Sep27.204159.13549@morrow.stanford.edu> mihai@sep.Stanford.EDU (Alexander Mihai Popovici) writes:
|> >Some stuff on the oncoming elections from clari:
|> >
|> >
|> >	BUCHAREST, Romania (UPI) -- 
|> >	Ultra-nationalism is also gaining ground. A presidential candidate
|> >for the Party of National Unity for Romania, Gheorghe Funar, may score
|> >highly with lesser educated classes with his program of national
|> >dignity, law and order and an emphasis on traditional heroes.
|>                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|> 
|> This sounds real ominous... With all due respect to The Church Lady of 
|> Saturday Night Live, "Could he mean *Dracula*??"
|> 
|>                        O prietena in naopte,
|>                                Vica
|>                                >:-[
I'm afraid it can be much worse then Dracula. I shouldn't wonder if
in PUNR's view "traditional heros" include the Genius of the Carpathians
and his Academician wife (+ the whole lot now in prison at Jilava).
Their close relatives, Romania Mare, already sings songs of praise to
the former executive and ideology.

Mihai Dorobantu
From: sispas@lsil.com (Steve Ispas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: For Karel Stokkermans
Date: 1 Oct 92 20:58:27 GMT
Reply-To: sispas@lsil.com
Organization: LSI Logic Corporation

Hi Karel,

I am wondering if you sent those soccer results from past years (or just last year)
for the Romanian National Championship.  If you did than somehow I didn't get it yet.
If you sent it to the address below, it should be OK.  Thank you very much.  You can reply to my email, I just can't get through to yours.
---


******************************************************************************
* Steve Ispas 				                           +-----+   * 	
* LSI Logic Corporation          Phone    : (408) 433-8799        LSI LOGIC
* 1501 McCarthy Blvd.            FAX      : (408) 433-6802         |     |   *
* M/S E-192                      email    : sispas@qafs2           +-----+   *
* Milpitas, Ca.  95035           internet : sispas@lsil.com                  *
******************************************************************************
From: ph20+@andrew.cmu.edu (Paul Grigore Hodor)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Re: Education
Date: 3 Oct 92 13:12:19 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.oenUmny00WBMQ3Jndl
Organization: Doctoral student, Biology, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


On 02-Oct-92 in Re: Education                
user Alexander Popovici@sep.S writes:

>I think the Romanian education is broader in a classical sense than the
>American education.  However I don't think that this part of the education is
>too  important in forming a young person.
> 
>What a Romanian education does not teach you is the importance of
>independent thinking and the value of the different opinion.
>The flexibility to deal with opposing ideas and to tolerate and 
>respect them.  
>The fact that it's more important what kind of
>person you are than what you have read.
>To stand tall and proud when everybody says you are wrong but you 
>feel you are right.
>The American spirit.
> 
>I am not saying one system is better than the other.  
>I think the American education (up to grad school)
>is weaker in the quantity of
>knowledge and information the average student ingests.
>People tend to get specialized and the Renaissance, complete
>model is harder to find. 
>However my point is that education
>should do more to a person and a nation than instruct them.
> 
>Cheers
>Mihai

I don't see why the Romanian education should teach "The American
spirit". I have never heard of a country who teaches its students the
spirit of another country.

There are many people I know who left the country when they were in
middle- or high-school. They all have done better in school abroad than
at home, due to the more advanced level of the Romanian education. (It
is true they all came from above average town schools.) How about you,
Sorin?

On the other hand there was an important turn in Romanian education
around 1980. Politics became more and more involved in school life, in
parallel with a sharp decrease in the quality of life. The older
generation of teachers were faced with the problem of being required to
do something they hated to do, the younger simply didn't care what was
going on. What happened in the following years in schools was anything
else but education.

Paul
From: ph20+@andrew.cmu.edu (Paul Grigore Hodor)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Leul de argint
Date: 6 Oct 92 10:51:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.8eoS0ha00WBOA5OVUQ
Organization: Doctoral student, Biology, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


At the international film festival in Venice, Dan Pita's movie "Hotel de
lux" won the "silver lion", together with a movie by Claude Sautet. The
"golden lion" was won by the chinese director Z. Yimou.

Paul
From: marian@vms.huji.ac.il
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Re: Elections
Date: 1 Oct 92 16:21:41 GMT
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem

>                       Funar was quite hard to really get to what things
> he was refering to.  I am quite afraid of such people getting to power, however
> we had legionars during the 1930-1940 (my grandfather was one, and he changed
> to communist when during the 46-47 period).  I blamed my grandfather for
> what he did, however the machismo that goes with such movements makes many
> "little dicks" to like them and to become die-hards believers.
>
> Sasha Bucur

The problem of legionarism was quite complicate. Many of legionars were people
without culture and education, who have fallen "victims" of an intolerant
and demagogic ideology. These people were themselves thirsty of blood. But
I have to emphasize that also many intelectuals, some of them brilliant, have
fallen by their naivity to the same ideology. For instance, the great geometer
Dan Barbillian, who was also a genial poet, under the name Ion Barbu; or the
strong mathematician (theory of probabilities and mathematic statistics) Octav
Onicescu, who was later a member of Romanian Academy, during ceausescu. These
are examples from my domain of activity. May be there are many other examples.


Marian Dodu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
From: sgrama@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Sorin Grama)
Subject: Re: Education
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 22:08:54 GMT

>
>I am not saying one system is better than the other.
>I think the American education (up to grad school)
>is weaker in the quantity of
>knowledge and information the average student ingests.
>People tend to get specialized and the Renaissance, complete
>model is harder to find.
>However my point is that education
>should do more to a person and a nation than instruct them.
>
>Cheers
>Mihai

I totally agree with you.  I had the opportunity to experience both
the American and Romanian high-school educations and I believe that
the American education really gives you a lot of choices on what you want to
do with your future.  There's a world of opportunities out there...
I like its practical side and orientation towards real life problems.
After all what does it help to know for example how to integrate a function
if you can't apply the result in a useful way?

Oh, well, just a worthless opinion...

-- 
  _____    
 /  _____   Sorin Grama                   *  phone:    (614) 292-1434
 \_____  \  System Administrator          *  internet: 
    _____/  Ohio State Geology Department *  sorin@geo1s.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
From: mihai@sep.Stanford.EDU (Alexander Mihai Popovici)
Subject: Re: Education
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 19:55:55 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.084832.853@debet.nhh.no>, snf_av@debet.nhh.no writes:
|> 
|> 	If those talking about "lack of education" are speaking for
|> themselves, I really agree.
|> 
|> Anca

This education issue pops out once in a while so why not add my own $0.02?

I think the Romanian education is broader in a classical sense than the
American education.  However I don't think that this part of the education is
too  important in forming a young person.

What a Romanian education does not teach you is the importance of
independent thinking and the value of the different opinion.
The flexibility to deal with opposing ideas and to tolerate and 
respect them.  
The fact that it's more important what kind of
person you are than what you have read.
To stand tall and proud when everybody says you are wrong but you 
feel you are right.
The American spirit.

I am not saying one system is better than the other.  
I think the American education (up to grad school)
is weaker in the quantity of
knowledge and information the average student ingests.
People tend to get specialized and the Renaissance, complete
model is harder to find. 
However my point is that education
should do more to a person and a nation than instruct them.

Cheers
Mihai
From: bucur@pollux.usc.edu (alexander bucur)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.romanian
Subject: Re: Post election speculations
Date: 30 Sep 1992 09:48:44 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: pollux.usc.edu

In article <1aa0acINN1cr@agate.berkeley.edu> 160955r@garnet.berkeley.edu () writes:

Radule,
beside what you just said, i believe that in a year or two will see the 
re-appearance of the most distinguished superlatives that the 80s have
showed us.  We'll see all that self-patting on the back for "well done"
jobs.

I just feel like puking right now.

Sasha Bucur