HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: das9674@ucs.usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A)
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Organization: Univ. of SW Louisiana, Lafayette
	<jprad.726772491@faatcrl>
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 01:16:35 GMT

In article <jprad.726772491@faatcrl> jprad@faatcrl.faa.gov (Jack Radigan) writes:


   jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:

   >:   After all, people *did* get work done in the days before MMU's, VM, MP and
   >: other esoteric niceties, right?

   >People also got work done before they invented computers, cars, and even
   >wheels.  Are you suggesting that we should go back to those days?

     Why must everything be so monochromatic with you?  

     -jack-

No, why must everything be monochomatic with YOU?  Jerry exaggerated YOUR
example of VM's non-worthness by saying that people
'*did* get work done in the days before MMU's, VM', etc.

Look, entirely too much bandwidth has been wasted on this.  VM is a 
stop-gap measure for lack of RAM, RAM (as in my case) one may not
be able to afford (or use, in ISA's case).
--
Dan Stephenson   das9674@usl.edu
"I'd rather have a kiss of my yellow gypsy's lips"
From: skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: More Amiga OS weaknesses and strengths
Date: 12 Jan 93 05:10:10 GMT
Organization: University of Mississippi, Dept. of Computer Science

In article <C0pAF5.8Fp@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod) writes:
>>Hmmm.. heres something you find interesting..
>>
>>Theres a program called GigaMem, which gives you I GIG of VM.
>>Its reviewed in Issue 43 (Feb) 1993 of Amiga Format (UK mag).
>>ohh BTW HB Marketing are distributing it here in sunny(??!?) England.
>>
>>Regards..
>
>Too bad it doesn't work on 040s and isn't part of the operating system.

Too bad you didn't check your facts first, it does work on the 040.  I 
guess your Byte and Computer Shopper didn't tell you that though, did 
they?

Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate
skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: Byte's Amiga 4000 review...
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:55:10 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
X-Posted-From: hemi.msi.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

Matthew Simmons (zarthac@bradley.edu) wrote:
:
: Second, doesn't it
: kinda say something for the OS if its better than windows or os/2 and
: fits on a single floppy?
:

Why bother with hypothetical situations?  It isn't better than either Windows
or OS/2!
--
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
| JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
| Drummers do it... |     Burlington, MA USA     | in my book of memories.   |
|    ... In rhythm! |        jerry@msi.com       |         -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
From: andrey@cco.caltech.edu (Andre T. Yew)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Is the 3do a CDTV killer?
Date: 10 Jan 1993 01:11:49 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: punisher.caltech.edu

papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod) writes:

>>	Rumors have it that the 3DO hardware design involves at
>>least RJ Mical, Dave Needles and Dale Luck, three of the original
>>Amiga designers.

>I get it!  More C= employees jumping ship to hop on the competitor's
>boat.  I understand.

	I don't think so.  C= fired them years ago, and Dale has
been doing productive things for the Amiga (his X server).

--Andre

-- 
             Andre Yew andrey@cco.caltech.edu (131.215.139.2)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: papresco@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Paul Prescod)
Subject: Re: Will PC Makers Survive Multimedia?? 
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:42:47 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.204213.24443@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA> tmc@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA (Tim Ciceran) writes:
>And an MPC is? Care to elaborate on this one?

An MPC is a 386 with a sound board and CD-ROM that have interfaces to
work with MPC compliant windows programs.  That means if you buy an MPC
machine (theoretically) your sound board and CD-ROM should work with
all MPC software.  Nobody ever checks, but I've never heard of an
incompatibility. 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod)
Subject: Is the 3do a CDTV killer?
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 22:14:35 GMT

>	Rumors have it that the 3DO hardware design involves at
>least RJ Mical, Dave Needles and Dale Luck, three of the original
>Amiga designers.

I get it!  More C= employees jumping ship to hop on the competitor's
boat.  I understand.

This 3d0 looks like it could be a CDTV/CD-I killer.  32 bit RISC and
they have the GALL to say the RISC CPU is a "baby sitter" for the
advanced custom chips.

Sounds like what CDTV would be like if C= brought it into th 90s!
Except that it has the backing of some MAJOR companies (which CDTV
doesn't)


Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: easton@zds-oem.zds.com (Jeff Easton)
Subject: Re: CBM does it again... 23 watt p.s. for A1200?!?
Organization: Zenith Data Systems, OEM Systems Engineering
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1993 01:03:15 GMT
Keywords: gimme a break

In article <C0K3Dv.22B@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>In article <1993Jan8.214447.8423@mpifr-bonn.mpg.de> mlelstv@specklec.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst) writes:
>>In <1993Jan8.122914.21083@cheshire.oxy.edu> leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt) writes:
>>>Geez, thats even less powerful than the pathetic 35 watt p.o.s. I had
>>>burn up on me with a console alone!  Of all the things to scrimp on, this
>>>has to be about the most ridiculous... come on, why not give us a standard
>>>150 or 200 watt p.s.  How much could it cost?
>>
>>$80 extra ? And most folx wouldn't use it and could as well get problems
>>because such a unit generates extra heat.
>
>   BS on both counts.  I can get nice 150W power supplies with built-in fans
>and numerous outputs for $40 new, in tiny quantities (IE: one).  Think of how
>much it would cost Commodore to purchase such power supplies with only a single
>output in huge quantities.  And heat would not be a problem, because the fan
>could still be there.

  But the real question is why do you need a 150W power supply for the 
A1200 if the computer (fully expanded) uses less than 20W?

  When the designer is working up the specification for a power supply,
he will be getting quotes from PSU vendors (Astec, Delta, etc) on what
the PSU will cost him.  Ballpark figures are quoted up front of
xx cents per watt as a general rule of thumb.  If the power supply
loading analysis shows that a fully loaded unit will require, say,
20 watts, who in their right mind would specify a 150W power supply?
Marc, Thomas, would you pay $75.00 extra ($25.00 actual cost x3 (markup))
for the peace of mind a 150W power supply would (apparently) bring
you?  Do you shop for Laptops or Notebooks based on which one provides
the biggest power supply?  Why dont you give the Design Engineers a
little credit?

  People that shop by only comapring bullet points on a spec sheet
should be taken out back and shot, IMHO.  :-)

>| Marc Barrett -MB-  |  email: barrett@iastate.edu

-Jeff Easton (Who knows how much a 145W PSU costs, thankyou :-)

-- 
  ___  ___    Jeff Easton             easton@zds-oem.zds.com
 (__  (__     Zenith Data Systems     j.easton@mi04.zds.com
 ___) ___)    Saint Joseph, Mich.     easton@andrews.edu
Monte Carlo   Z-LS/20 - Choice of a quiet generation

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls)
Subject: Re: RISC Amiga?
Organization: University of Mississippi, Dept. of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 18:25:48 GMT

In article <C0qstz.7CD@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> papresco@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Prescod) writes:
>>>Yes, and once the 68060 IS released (probably over a year from now and
>>>behind schedule), how long will it take for a stock Amiga to
>>>incorporate it.  They are selling PCs that can use the Pentium already.
>>
>>Don't be such an ass.  Commodore gets info on the 060 early just like 
>>the Clone assemblers get info on the 586 early.  As for selling Amigas
>>that can use the 060, Commodore has been doing that since the A1000.
>
>So if I want a 68060 based computer, I can buy a A4000 for $2500.00,
>throw out the 68040, and put in the 68060...good plan!

How is that any different from buying a 486DX2-66 machine from the 
Bozo Clone Emporium and then adding a Pentium to it?

Also, remember that the A4000 does not have a CPU on the motherboard,
so it is a simple matter to change CPUs by putting in a different card.
The A4000/060 will be doable as soon as the 060 is available...

>How long was the 68060 out before a stock Amiga supported it?

The 060 is not out yet...

But I would guess you mean the 040.  There were 040 boards for the A3000
and A2000 available within months of the 040's release.  NeXT and HP 
might have had them earlier, but no one else did.

Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate
skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu




Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: iank@microsoft.com (Ian Kennedy)
Subject: Re: The Mac is not ideal (was Re: Amiga OS weaknesses and strengths)
Date: 06 Jan 93 19:49:41 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <C0F6rC.Ap0@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>   Every program that I have that is oriented toward getting good printed
>output includes its own printer drivers.  This includes PageStream, ProPage,
>and WordPerfect.  If the Amiga printer drivers are adequate, why does every
>developer of a graphical word processor or DTP program always include a 
>replacement for the Amiga's printer drivers?

Every developer? What about Final Copy? It uses the native printer drivers
and generates excellent output, laser quality on my BJ10e bubblejet.
But you wouldn't know that.

>   On the Amiga, the printer drivers are fairly 'dumb'.  They include only
>the barest of facilities for translating the output for a specific printer.
>When an Amiga application send graphical data to the printer drivers, it
>is send in the form of bitmapped graphics.  No structured graphic capabilities
>are provided in the Amiga's print system.  When an Amiga application sends
>a font to the printer drivers, the font is sent just like another piece of
>bitmapped data.  So that if you have a document with CompuGraphic structured
>fonts, the fonts get sent as bitmaps, resulting in jaggie-hell on most
>printers.

You fool. That is the fault of the programmer, not the printer support. One
only needs to look at Final Copy to know this. Yes, the printer
driver accepts bitmapped data only. If the programmer knows what they're doing
then they will send a bitmap at the printers best resolution and not just
use a bitmap at the display resolution. Final Copy does this and it's
excellent. Other wordprocessors could do this too, with CompuGraphic fonts
even and the output would look great.

But you wouldn't know this either would you? Because it's true.

>   BTW, this is why so many Amiga applications replace the Amiga's printer
>drivers completely.  They are built to work with bitmaps and only bitmaps,
>and have no facilities for working with structured graphics or structured
>fonts, so that getting really good output with the Amiga's printer drivers is
>just about impossible.

Again, you're full of shit. It's a throw back to pre 1.3 days when all the
printer drivers sucked. Now there is NO reason not to use the system
printer drivers. You only need to covert your data to a bitmap at the
printers best resolution supported by the driver and send it out. It's
alot easier than writing your own printer driver and works great. Again,
one only needs to look a Final Copy to know this.


-- 
"Apple's attitude toward its ROM code is a little like that of a rich kid
toward his inheritance. Not actually knowing how to create wealth himself,
he guards what he has with hysterical fervor." - John Perry Barlow
MAIL : IANK@MICROSOFT.COM			 Crime and Puzzlement
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: mikeh@starnine.com (Mike Haas)
Subject: Re: More Amiga OS weaknesses and strengths
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:09:27 GMT
Organization: StarNine Technologies, Inc.

In article <barnabas.33e5@terapin.com> barnabas@terapin.com (Colin Smith) writes:
>um, er, what is your point? i have notin against the mac, but I like the fact
>that the Amiga cannot run a program that is on say dh0 and the icon is on dh1.

Of course it can... (read on)

>That forces you to keep track of where your files are. What if you cannot find
>that file or your entire HD is a total mess?

WB 2.0 can assign a default icon which can be double-clicked  OR...

You can launch that application from the shell.

>As for this Mac vs Amiga crap,
>Just give it up. The Mac has it's capabilities, and so does the Amiga. your
>happy, I'm happy. So what's the prob?

Hey, this is C.S.A.A, and we'll have none of that "nice guy" junk!
Take it to alt.fairy.tales.
From: bloc1469@ee.ee.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Date: 5 Jan 1993 20:05:59 GMT
Organization: Electrical Engineering Dept. University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.2.33

In article <1993Jan5.163814.23145@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>Aw, what's the matter, Greggie?

I didn't like the tone of that "How convenient" statement.

>Maybe you f*cked up and overwrote some Windows code?

I sure did.  Unfortunately, that Windows code was part of MS-DOS.  :)

>I honestly don't know how to do this -- specifically, I wouldn't know which
>range of memory to zero out.  Why don't you just post the source?  It would
>really add to your credibility.

I don't _HAVE_ the source.  It's at PC9 at school, along with the
programming books and everything else I used to figure out how to DO it.

>BTW, if the program you allegedly wrote is a DOS program, no wonder it
>killed your system.  All programs terminate by calling exit().  If your
>program stomps over the OS handler for the exit() call, gee I wonder what'll
>happen...

It was a Windows program that would look for the image and remove it
with zeros, and then exit.  It never returned, the system locked.

So am I to understand that I'm the only person who ever thought of
trying this?  Don't I feel like the hacker...

Greg



--
(: (: (: (: Have you overdosed on smileys today?  Why NOT!?! :) :) :) :)
(: "Our father, who art in Iowa, Hollow be thy head, Thy ideas run    :)
(:  Thy will be done, At Commodore as it is at Apple"  -Dan Barrett   :)
(: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: () :) :) :) Wubba, the Dark Angel :)
From: peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com (Dr Peter Kittel Germany)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Byte's Amiga 4000 review...
Date: 12 Jan 93 07:29:38 GMT
Reply-To: peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com (Dr Peter Kittel Germany)
Organization: Commodore Germany

In article <EMCOOP.93Jan11095850@bcars148.bnr.ca> emcoop@bnr.ca (hume smith) writes:
>
>new group - comp.sys.pet.advocacy :-)

YYYEEEEAAAAAAAAHHH!!!

Peter, one of the most extreme PET lovers... :-)

-- 
Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to \\  Only my personal opinions...
Commodore Frankfurt, Germany  \X/ {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmger!peterk
Wer's nicht kann, soll's bleiben klopfen oder Steine lassen!
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: mlelstv@specklec.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst)
Subject: Re: Amiga and Macintosh Printing
Organization: Max-Planck-Institut f"ur Radioastronomie
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 13:13:27 GMT

In <C0Jv8v.ILv@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett) writes:
>      Support of outline font systems such as TrueType and Adobe Type Manager

Isn't needed. Printer drivers handle arbitrary bitmaps, not just fonts.

>      Print enlargement
>      Print reduction

The printer drivers support arbitraty enlargement and reduction.

>      Portrait and landscape paper orientations (Amiga supports this in
>         in graphics mode only)

Since you can't scale or rotate builtin printer fonts this would be rather
silly. Arbitrary fonts are printed as bitmaps which can be scaled and rotated
easily.

>      Fractional widths
Could you explain that ? Fractional scales and sizes are handled by the
printer driver.

>      Multiple paper bins on printers with this capability
>      Envelope support, for many envelope sizes

Yes, would be nice for the printers that support it.

>      Precision bitmap alignment 

Is that any different from pixelwise alignment ?

>drivers that are free because they are junk.  There is a lot more involved in
>developing a Macintosh printer driver than in developing an Amiga printer
>driver.  And you get what you pay for.

As you have written hundreds of of printer drivers for any system you are the
best expert to comment on 'how much is involved in developing' one.

Regards,
-- 
Michael van Elst
UUCP:     universe!local-cluster!milky-way!sol!earth!uunet!unido!mpirbn!p554mve
Internet: p554mve@mpirbn.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de
                                "A potential Snark may lurk in every tree."
From: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us (MARK BROWN)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: clone prices & doom & gloom
Reply-To: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us
X-Software: Legend (216-825-2747) UUCPShell v4.9/med20Dec92
X-Disclaimer: Opinions of users do not necessarily reflect those of managment
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:54:28 EST
Organization: The Legend BBS Public Access (216)825-2747

What is the price that you paid for your Diamond Speed card(the 24X 
version?) I will try and Make a point with this Message upon Recieving 
your Reply.
    Mark

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 00:05:49 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
X-Posted-From: hemi.msi.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

Tom R Krotchko (TomK@cup.portal.com) wrote:
:
: Jerry, just for grins, open a DOS session under windows, and then delete
: every occurance of COMMAND.COM that you can find. Then tell me what
: happens.
:

What for?  What would this prove?

:
: TomK@cup.portal.com
:
--
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
| JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
| Drummers do it... |     Burlington, MA USA     | in my book of memories.   |
|    ... In rhythm! |        jerry@msi.com       |         -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
From: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us (MARK BROWN)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: HELP--AMIGA OR IBM PC CLONE?
Reply-To: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us
X-Software: Legend (216-825-2747) UUCPShell v4.9/med20Dec92
X-Disclaimer: Opinions of users do not necessarily reflect those of managment
Date: 8 Jan 93 23:12:28 EST
Organization: The Legend BBS Public Access (216)825-2747

well LUCKILY we don't have to worry about which Video Card Maker and 
WHICH sound card Maker, and WE DEFINATLY DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT ALL 
THE FREEKIN' I N C O M P A T I B I L I T Y!!!. that comes with buying 
a clone. Yes if you call computibility they can customize your Amiga 
if you'd like them to. C= Has always uses the fastest Ram Scemes for 
the Amiga so you don't have to worry about the Speed of the ram.
 NOW since you don't have to worry about the Display card, sound Card, 
Speed rating of the ram, and have the Added bonus of not worrying 
about how every thing is going to work together, Maybe you should at 
LEAST try an Amiga, NO? (Computabilty doesn't chew up as Much paper as 
Gateway does using Actors and the such, Save a forest dude_).
    Mark

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: corban@wavefront.wti.com (Corban Gossett)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Does reading this group make you depressed? The story of a victim.
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:52:05 GMT
Organization: Wavefront Technologies Inc, Santa Barbara, CA
X-Disclaimer: Not a spokesperson for Wavefront Technologies, Inc.

In article <1i23i9INNshi@uwm.edu> bloc1469@ee.ee.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block) writes:
>
>Three of the ones listed, AmigaTeX, CygnusEd/any other editor, and
>Real3d are NOT "development tools".  AmigaTeX is as much an
>application as WP 5.1.  Programs like Caligari Professional and
>Journeyman compete with well known programs like Alias and Wavefront.
>
>


I really doubt that they can compete with the likes of the later two.
Journeyman can't render worth squat, and Caligari has a long way to go also.
Nice try though!

 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:15:19 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
X-Posted-From: hemi.msi.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

Gregory R Block (bloc1469@ee.ee.uwm.edu) wrote:
:
: >Windows programs run in Protected Mode, which uses virtual addressing.
: >You thought you were overwriting DOS, but you probably overwrote something
: >else.
:
: I don't think so--it wasn't in protected mode.
:

Of course it was, unless you were running Windows 3.0 (not 3.1), specifically
set to Real Mode.  Were you?

:
: Greg
:
--
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
| JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
| Drummers do it... |     Burlington, MA USA     | in my book of memories.   |
|    ... In rhythm! |        jerry@msi.com       |         -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: d91ds@efd.lth.se (David Sundqvist)
Subject: Re:  Comdex/Quicktime released for the PC
Organization: Lund Institute of Technology, Sweden
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 23:56:54 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.135853.15161@pcnntp.apple.com> Dale_Adams@gateway.qm.apple.com (Dale Adams) writes:
>Well, unless your accelerator has at least a 68020, you're not running in 
>color, so you can't fully emulate a Mac.  The bottom of the line Macs 
>these days all have 16 MHz 68030s.  Most Macs have faster processors, so I 
>doubt you're running Mac software faster than them.  How about some real 
>numbers here instead of general claims?  A commonly used Mac benchmark 
>program is Speedometer (or you can use the Mac benchmark of your choice).  
>What numerical results do you get running this on a Mac emulator on your 
>accelerated A500?
>
When I last looked at a Mac advertisement (december) they were still 
selling MacClassic wich has a 68000 processor. And for twice the price
of an a600. So the claim wasnt that far off i think. 
>- Dale Adams
- David

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy