HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: paco@cs.rice.edu (Paul Havlak)
Subject: Re: First Vienna Awards
Reply-To: Paul Havlak <paco@cs.rice.edu>
Organization: Center for Research on Parallel Computations
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:14:07 GMT

    Let's please stop the mutual Slovak-Magyar bashing here.  Isn't it
enough that neither group completely trusts the other.  Historical
arguments show the origin of the distrust, but current actions and
words are more relevant to the perpetuation or resolution of this
conflict.

In article <921110101903_76317.2023_EHB32-2@CompuServe.COM> 
	Joe Pannon <76317.2023@COMPUSERVE.COM> writes: (quoting Bogdan)
>    The Hungarians thought that the moment had come to press for revision of
>  the territorial clauses in the Treaty of Trianon.  IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE
>  AGREEMENTS OF MUNICH, DIRECT NEGOTIATIONS OPENED (my emphasis, again - JP)
>  on October 9 at Komarno between a delegation from the Hungarian government
>  and a Czechoslovakian delegation led by Father Tiso.  The negotiations
>  closed in failure on October 13.  The two parties both agreed to ask
>  Germany and Italy to arbitrate.  In the First Arbitration of Vienna in
>  November, 1938, Hungary regained 4670 square miles with 1,030,000
>  inhabitants, 830,000 of them Magyar and only 143,000 Slovak, and the towns
>  of Kassa, Komarom and Munkacs (Munkatchevo).  Between November 4 and 11,
>  Hungarian troops marched into this territory and were universally welcomed
>  as liberators.  The Hungarians had hoped for more, but Hitler, who wanted
>  to take charge of the Slovaks, had not meant to grant more.  From a purely
>  ethnic viewpoint, the new border was nearly perfect, with only 66,000
>  Hungarians under Czechoslovakian rule. ...

    I think that this passage, describing the dismemberment of
Slovakia by Hungary (with arbitration by Hitler and Mussolini!) will
fail to put the Slovaks at ease.

regards,
paco (an anglo-moravian Texan)
--
Paul Havlak			Dept. of Computer Science
Graduate Student		Rice University, Houston TX 77251-1892
PFC/ParaScope projects		(713) 527-8101 x2738 	paco@cs.rice.edu
From: BAUER@RCKHRST1.BITNET (GEORGE BAUER)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.slovak-l
Subject: Re: Slovakia's Hydro-energy Potentials
Date: 7 Nov 92 01:17:26 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: SLOVAK-L@UBVM.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"SLOVAK-L@UBVM.BITNET"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

I too am interested in the similarity between the Hungarian and Slovak
emblems.

I would have thought that with the Slovak feelings toward the Hungarians
in 1918 they would have RUN from anything Hungarian.  I understand the
three peaks -- but they even have a Hungarian connection.

As I remember, only the colors are different...

Thanks for mentioning this...


=======================================================================
DR.  GEORGE R. BAUER             | INTERESTS:
                                 | Computers in Business & Education.
Just returned from teaching      | Education:  Curriculum development.
Czech teachers of English        |    International Education, TEFL.
in Prague, Czechoslovakia.       | Central Europe:  Post revolution
Now looking for a job in Europe. |    economic, social, political
                                 |    changes and opportunities.
E-MAIL ADDRESS:  BAUER@RCKHRST1  | Free lance writer.
=======================================================================
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.slovak-l
Date:         Sat, 7 Nov 1992 15:11:55 +0100
From:         MARTONAK@ITSSISSA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Slovakia's Hydro-energy Potentials

>Can somebody fill me in on why it was so important for Slovakia to build
>a costly electric power plant on the slow Danube, when the country -- I
>imagine -- has plenty of fast rivers in the numerous mountains. The,
>river Vah, for instance, comes to mind right away, but there are
>several others one can see on the map of Slovakia.  They seem to be far
>more efficient and politicaly less controversial choices than the border
>river Danube.

On Vah there's already a plenty of electric power plants. They were built
in the fifties. And the reasons for which the decision on building the
Gabcikovo - Nagymaros project was undertaken, were not only those related to
energetics, but also other having to do with prevention of floods. Gabcikovo
is not intended to be just a power plant.

>I can appreciate the concern most Slovaks seem to have about the
>economic consequences of abandoning a virtually completed expensive project,
>but remember:  Hungarians faced the same choice when they decided to abandon
>their part of the mutual project.

Not at all. Hungarians, from the very beginning, were building very slowly, and
the amount of money they spent is far less than what was spent on the Slovak
side. Actually, one of the reasons, for which they cancelled their part of the
common project, is that they have never had enough money to complete it.

>After all, they, too, sank billions
>into it before cancellation, and more will be spent on restoration of
>preexisting conditions.

Excuse me a question: do you really believe in that ? I simply cannot understand
where such an idea might ever come from. Who, do you think, will pay for the
"restoration of preexisting conditions" ?

>My last curiosity: the Slovak national emblem is virtually identical to
>the right half of the Hungarian national emblem.  Is that a coincidence,
>or if not, how did that come about ?

I have no idea what the Hungarian national emblem is like.

>Regards,
>Joe Pannon

Best regards.

                                Roman Martonak
                                International School for Advanced Studies
                                Strada Costiera 11
                        34014   Trieste
                                Italy

tel.: +39 40 3787428
fax:  +39 40 3787528
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.slovak-l
Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:40:50 +0100
From:         MARTONAK@ITSSISSA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Slovakia's Hydro-energy Potentials

Mr. Joe Pannon writes:
>> >After all, they, too, sank billions
>> >into it before cancellation, and more will be spent on restoration of
>> >preexisting conditions.
>>
>> Excuse me a question: do you really believe in that ? I simply cannot
> understand
>> where such an idea might ever come from. Who, do you think, will pay for the
>> "restoration of preexisting conditions" ?

>Believe what?  That they DID spend the billions, or that they will have to
>spend still more to restore the preexisting conditions (as much as it is
>feasible, of course)?  Who else would pay for the restoration than the
>Hungarian taxpayers?  I guess, I don't understand what you don't
>understand.

I don't understand, how one could even think about the possibility of
"restoration of preexisting conditions". At least to me, it looks like something
absurd. I don't believe that even somebody in the Hungarian government considers
this idea seriously. To mean something seriously and just speak about something
are different things. In my mind, the propaganda hysteria around Gabcikovo in
Hungary has simply reached a point, that it does not allow even to reasonable
persons (which, no doubt, there must be) to express their mind freely and speak
about Gabcikovo in an objective way. Nevertheless, I believe that the situation
will change, sooner or later, and reasonable points of view will prevail also
in Hungary.

Best regards.
                                Roman Martonak
                                International School for Advanced Studies
                                Strada Costiera 11
                        34014   Trieste
                                Italy

tel.: +39 40 3787428
fax:  +39 40 3787528
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
From: gfrajkor@CCS.CARLETON.CA ((George Frajkor))
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.slovak-l
Subject: Re: Gabcikovo [Really!]
Date: 5 Nov 92 02:35:13 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
              Palus" at Nov 4, 92 2:18 am

Milan Palus writes:
> >         Yup.  Consider how long it took the Palestinians to be seen
> >as other than terrorists.
>
> Wonderful reply from the vice-president(?) of the Slovak World
> Congress and the person from a Canadian School of Journalism.
> Probably the Congress spent all the energy by explanation
> how brave was the fascist Slovak state.

      Such remarks are first of all untrue and secondly uncalled for.



    Jan George Frajkor       _!_
 School of Journalism       __!__
 Carleton University,         |
 Ottawa, Ontario             /^\
 Canada K1S 5B6           /^\   /^\
   -- gfrajkor@ccs.carleton.ca --
  613 788-7404     fax:613 788-5604
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.slovak-l
Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 09:50:36 -0500
From:         Igor Jurisica <juris@TELOS.AI.TORONTO.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Roots of the Slovak-Hungarian Conflict

pannon@BCSFSE.BOEING.COM (Joe Pannon) writes:

>Oh brother (or sister)!  Don't you hear enough of that from Duray?  Or
>are his statements not allowed in the Slovak media?  For starters, wasn't
>there enough protest against approval of certain clauses in the new
>Slovak constitution?

This is not a sound argument. Just because Duray said something it
does not prove that it is true. The issue of the certain clauses in
the new constitution was already discussed and explained on the net. If
you don't have better arguments than these than just acknowledge your
mistake.

>If I was a Hungarian in Slovakia, for me probably the most
>objectionable thing would be to be forced to study the official Slovak
>history putting down Hungarians, having to "learn" about historical
>figures of Upper Hungary that they were really Slovak heroes and noble
>men whose names one could hardly recognize any more because of their
>Slovakization by latter day baptizers in Bratislava.  The same way all
>Hungarian city and town names, even of those with overwhelmingly
>Hungarian populations.

Why do you think all children in Canada have to learn the history of
Canadian indians (besides other things)? BTW, they do it quite thoroughly.

You should also consider that Hungarians in Slovakia can study everything
up to the university in hungarian. Now, when the borders are open, they are
free to continue on some Hungarian universitie in their studies.

>Autonomy within the Slovak state where Hungarians are in majority and
>the Hungarian language also accepted as official language.  We are
>talking about people inhabiting that area for over a 1000 years and
>Slovakia can't look at them the way the US looks at her immigrants.

Indians were in US and Canada long time before the first settlers.
Is some of the Indian dialect an official language in US or CDN?
But this is a distant example, since Slovaks were on that territory
long before Hungarians.

Igor
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
From: lexa@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (lexa matej)
Subject: Re: Slovakia's Hydro-energy Potentials
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:39:58 GMT

pannon@BCSFSE.BOEING.COM (Joe Pannon) writes:

>Can somebody fill me in on why it was so important for Slovakia to build
>a costly electric power plant on the slow Danube, when the country -- I
>imagine -- has plenty of fast rivers in the numerous mountains.  The,
>river Vah, for instance, comes to mind right away, but there are
>several others one can see on the map of Slovakia.  They seem to be far
>more efficient and politicaly less controversial choices than the border
>river Danube.

I am not an expert, but there are more than a dozen of hydroelectric power
plants on Vah river, I do not think it would flow any more after building an
additional dam. Danube is slow, but it's flow rate is high because of the size
of the river. So technically, at least to me, the decision seems logical.

-- 
Matej Lexa                              At present: lexa@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Irrigation Research Inst.               Dept. of Plant Biology
Bratislava, CZECHOSLOVAKIA              University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign**************** "There's only one kind of music. Good music." *****************
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Organization: Cornell Information Technologies
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Wed, 11 Nov 1992 12:56:01 EST
From:         John Voigt <FLIX@CORNELLC.CIT.CORNELL.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Monthly list of LISTSERV sites with outdated BITEARN NODES
              files
              10 Nov 1992 18:32:04 CST from <COURCOUL@VMTECQRO.QRO.ITESM.MX>

Heehee - rather interesting to see this little exchange.

We used to get a lot of confusion with those node names when I was at
Tulane.  I'm sure it continues.

The tables at Tulane are in very capable hands and while they may not
be up to date by a week or two because of vacation schedules and such,
I'm sure they are still being properly maintained.

Oh, and while I have this mailfile open - it's Voigt - not Voight - but
it's a common mistake I'm used to.

John Voigt - Cornell Information Technologies
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Sat, 7 Nov 1992 09:30:32 MET
From:         Ulrich Giese <U001213@HNYKUN11.URC.KUN.NL>
Subject:      Re: A new NEWTAGS DESCRIPT

On Sat, 7 Nov 92 01:03:22 +0100 Eric Thomas said:
>
>On Fri, 6 Nov 1992 12:43:00 PST Michael Stein <CSYSMAS@UCLAMVS> said:
>
>>The last  time I tried  it (may years  ago), I wasn't  authorized. Since
>>that wasn't the first  time I hadn't won a NETSERV  battle I've a policy
>>that I don't fight with it anymore...
>>
>>So, is this wonderful document available elsewhere?

thanks eric. but maybe i should mention again, that i'm making available
the BITEARN NODES, NODUPDs as well as the GRIBM program and also this
mentioned document on an anonymous FTP :
     FILE.NIC.SURFNET.NL that's 192.87.46.2
     within the "netman/mgmt-earn" directory.

files there will be updated within the next minutes (and also in the future
updates will happen normally near the availability date of the files on
NETSERV).

-ulrich-
>
>If that is  a joke, it is not  funny and it was a waste  of bandwidth and
>time for many people. The official source of the document is NETSERV, any
>other  source  is potentially  outdated.  The  document is  available  to
>anyone. It could be that many years  ago this or another document was not
>available to you, but I fail to see the relevance. If you are not able to
>retrieve the document  from NETSERV, I am sure Hans-Ulrich  would like to
>hear about the details  of the problems you are having so  he can fix it.
>If what you meant is that your religion prevents you from trying to order
>documents from NETSERV, I'm afraid that  is a private problem between you
>and your local  divinity which I doubt  it is the duty of  people on this
>list to solve for you.
>
>  Eric
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 19:50:15 EST
From:         Mark Bodenstein <MAB@CORNELLC.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Monthly list of LISTSERV sites with outdated BITEARN NODES
              files
              10 Nov 1992 18:32:04 CST from <COURCOUL@VMTECQRO.QRO.ITESM.MX>

On Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:32:04 CST Juan M. Courcoul said:
>On Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:47:04 GMT (Richard Alan Schafer) said:
>>|>  TSCVM    VERS8904
>Those of us who use or manage a Relay server will point out that Tulane,
>aka TCSVM ...

Juan,

I think you're confusing TSCVM (Trenton State College) with TCSVM
(Tulane University.)  I just checked, and Tulane has up to date tables.

Mark Bodenstein
Cornell University
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Organization: State University of New York at Buffalo
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 08:54:13 EST
From:         "Steven P. Roder" <TKSSTEVE@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU>
Subject:      Re: GRIBM Messages
              12 Nov 1992 09:57:59 MET from <U001213@HNYKUN11.URC.KUN.NL>

On Thu, 12 Nov 1992 09:57:59 MET Ulrich Giese said:
>On Wed, 11 Nov 92 10:24:28 CST Barry Finkel said:
>>
>......... it seems that GRIBM isn't able to handle multiple server-(mailer)
>tags.

     It also seems that it cannot handle multiple nodes that have the same
mailer, as in the case of the University at Buffalo's VAXCluster.

>>
>>GR starting, version 91-11-19, date=92-11-06, time=08:56:26
>>
>>   (c) GMD Bonn 1989, 1990; EARN association 1990, 1991
>>   Author Peter Sylvester
>>
>>GR directive: XMAILER           DDNAME=XMAILER
>>GR directive: GETNODES
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> DALAC    NETNORTH NJE      CA        2024
>>MAILER@DALAC ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> DMRHRZ11 EARN     * type * DE         602
>>SMTP@DMRHRZ11 ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> PHOENIX  BITNET   NJE      US        1429
>>SYSTEMX@PHOENIX ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> PUCC     BITNET   NJE      US          73
>>VMMAILB@PUCC ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> PUCC     BITNET   NJE      US          73
>>VMMAILT@PUCC ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> UBVM     BITNET   NJE      US        1295
>>MAILER_L@UBVM ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> UBVMS    BITNET   NJE      US        1526
>>SMTPUSER@UBVMS ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> UBVMSB   BITNET   NJE      US        1401
>>SMTPUSER@UBVMS ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> UBVMSC   BITNET   NJE      US        1534
>>SMTPUSER@UBVMS ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> UBVMSD   BITNET   NJE      US        1074
>>SMTPUSER@UBVMS ignored.
>>Multiple mailer definitions for
>> WEIZMANN EARN     * type * IL         194
>>VMSMTP@WEIZMANN ignored.
>>GR directive: GENROUTE ANLOS    DDNAME=ANLOS
>>GR directive: GENROUTE ANLVM    DDNAME=ANLVM
>>GR directive: GENROUTE ANLVMV1  DDNAME=ANLVMV1
>>GR successful.
>>GR done.


Steve Roder
(tkssteve@ubvm.bitnet | tkssteve@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu | (716)645-3564
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Thu, 5 Nov 1992 14:16:48 CET
From:         Hans-Ulrich Giese <U001212@HEARN.BITNET>
Subject:      9212 new/del nodes
Comments: To: xmailer@HEARN.BITNET
Comments: cc: Nadine Grange <grange@frors12.BITNET>

this is the list of new and deleted nodes for this month.

new nodes:
ANAHUAC  0323 MX BITNET
ARIZBPA  0418 US BITNET
BPAVMS   0505 US BITNET
CMIVMS   0522 US BITNET
ECC      0574 US BITNET
JSU      0944 US BITNET
MISVMS   1127 US BITNET
SPCVXX   1244 US BITNET
SPRING   1315 US BITNET
TCU      1463 US BITNET
UMIAMI1  1769 US BITNET
UMIAMI2  1870 US BITNET
VMNMIMC  1884 US BITNET
JPNIUJ00 0610 JP CAREN
JPNKEK   0613 JP CAREN
ICTUNIV  0108 IT EARN
UCARTCOL 1723 CO RUNCOL

deleted nodes:
AWITUW01 BIBLIO31  BLEKUL13  CENCOL    CNEDCU51  CSBSJU    FRCIRP62
HASEOC   HTIKHT5   ICEP      IRMITSE   ISSCORI1  ISUCARD   ITORIPTO
JPNUTKOM NTIVAX    NTIVAXA   NTIVAXB   NTIVAXC   NTUVAX    PLWAUW12
PLWMEN21 SFAUSTIN  SPC11E    SUFFOLK   TAMCBA    TAMVXOCN
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 18:17:46 EST
From:         Roger Fajman <RAF@NIHCU.BITNET>
Subject: Re: GRIBM Messages

> >......... it seems that GRIBM isn't able to handle multiple server-(mailer)
> >tags.
>
>      It also seems that it cannot handle multiple nodes that have the same
> mailer, as in the case of the University at Buffalo's VAXCluster.

Seems unlikely to me.  Why do you say that?
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Organization: Instituto Tecnologico de Monterrey, Campus Queretaro
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 20:14:00 CST
From:         "Juan M. Courcoul" <COURCOUL@VMTECQRO.QRO.ITESM.MX>
Subject:      Re: Monthly list of LISTSERV sites with outdated BITEARN NODES
              files

WOOOPS !

Take foot, open mouth, etc....

Sorry 'bout that... I should visit my optometrist real soon now !  ;)

JMC
From: TKSSTEVE@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (Steven P. Roder)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Subject: Re: Monthly list of LISTSERV sites with outdated BITEARN NODES
              files
Date: 12 Nov 92 19:56:23 GMT
Organization: State University of New York at Buffalo
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
              12 Nov 1992 12:13:56 EST from <HAROLD@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU>

On Thu, 12 Nov 1992 12:13:56 EST Harold Pritchett said:
>
>We are talking about two different nodes here.  Yes, Tulane has had problems
>since john left, but the node with the 4 year old tables is TSCVM and not
>TCSVM.  This node, Trenton State College is one I have never heard of
>except when this discussion comes up every month or so.  I suspect they
>would not notice if we cut them off...

I think they might notice.  They just upgraded LISTSERV to 1.7e! and are
asking a question about problems with LISTSERV on another list!


Steve Roder
(tkssteve@ubvm.bitnet | tkssteve@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu | (716)645-3564
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 12:13:56 EST
From:         Harold Pritchett <HAROLD@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Monthly list of LISTSERV sites with outdated BITEARN NODES
              files
              10 Nov 1992 18:32:04 CST from <COURCOUL@VMTECQRO.QRO.ITESM.MX>

On Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:32:04 CST Juan M. Courcoul said:
>On Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:47:04 GMT (Richard Alan Schafer) said:
>>|>  TSCVM    VERS8904
>>
>>If I hadn't tried in vain many times to deal with problems caused by this
>>incredibly out of date site, I'd have trouble believing this.  This site
>>is almost 4 *YEARS* obsolete!  And unless your luck is better than mine,
>>you'll never get any response whatsoever to a complaint to their postmaster
>>or anyone else at the site.
>
>Those of us who use or manage a Relay server will point out that Tulane,
>aka TCSVM, turned into a digital black hole when a personnel readjustment
>caused John Voight, aka IFixVM, to seek greener pastures elsewhere.
>
>I'd even venture to say that, were BITNIC to silently drop TCSVM from the
>tables one day, they wouldn't even notice.... ;)

We are talking about two different nodes here.  Yes, Tulane has had problems
since john left, but the node with the 4 year old tables is TSCVM and not
TCSVM.  This node, Trenton State College is one I have never heard of
except when this discussion comes up every month or so.  I suspect they
would not notice if we cut them off...

Harold
From: ERIC@SEARN.BITNET (Eric Thomas)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.nodmgt-l
Subject: Re: A new NEWTAGS DESCRIPT
Date: 7 Nov 92 00:03:22 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
              6 Nov 1992 12:43:00 PST from Node Management <NODMGT-L@UGA>

On Fri, 6 Nov 1992 12:43:00 PST Michael Stein <CSYSMAS@UCLAMVS> said:

>The last  time I tried  it (may years  ago), I wasn't  authorized. Since
>that wasn't the first  time I hadn't won a NETSERV  battle I've a policy
>that I don't fight with it anymore...
>
>So, is this wonderful document available elsewhere?

If that is  a joke, it is not  funny and it was a waste  of bandwidth and
time for many people. The official source of the document is NETSERV, any
other  source  is potentially  outdated.  The  document is  available  to
anyone. It could be that many years  ago this or another document was not
available to you, but I fail to see the relevance. If you are not able to
retrieve the document  from NETSERV, I am sure Hans-Ulrich  would like to
hear about the details  of the problems you are having so  he can fix it.
If what you meant is that your religion prevents you from trying to order
documents from NETSERV, I'm afraid that  is a private problem between you
and your local  divinity which I doubt  it is the duty of  people on this
list to solve for you.

  Eric
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU