HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: djkordsm@quesadilla.engr.ucdavis.edu (David Joseph Kordsmeier)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: What Amiga Users Want In Future Software Applications!!!!
Date: 6 Nov 92 17:02:47 GMT
Organization: College of Engineering - University of California - Davis


	So the A4000 is finally out.  We've got the A1200 on the horizon, with more 
computers promised.  I think we can all stop disputing over the fact that the a4000
is an awesome machine and CBM is on the right track.  

	None of this means anything without software.  

Let me rephrase that:

	The future of our Amiga in the home and workplace depends upon there 
	being an adequate supply of QUALITY sofware applications( DTP, CAD, 
	Spreadsheets, etc ) .  

	I think it is time we Amiga users took some initiative to let 
Software Developers know what we WANT.  This involves not only coorespondence
on what you like and dislike about the product, but it also involves 
SUPPORTING ( aka buying your software ) these Developers.  The Amiga community cannot
afford to see anymore developers fold or move to other platforms.

	My main purpose of this post is to get people thinking and post some of their own 
ideas on what they applications they want to see developed, or what improvements they 
want to see in existing applications.  Perhaps we could get a TOP 10 MOST WANTED 
SOFTWARE APPS list going and keep it regularily updated until developers DELIVER.
( much like the one you see in NextWorld ).

	Don't doubt the power of the net.

-dk

 

 
 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: trevore@vast.unsw.edu.au (Trevor Elbourne (Supr. Hell) BE)
Subject: What does an A4000 cost ??
Organization: University of New South Wales
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 01:45:52 GMT

I would appreciate if people in Europe and the USA could drop me some
email with details on A4000 pricing in your part of the world. I
recently rang the only distributor in Australia advertising the A4000
(to my knowledge) and was quoted $5499 for the basic setup !! I was
expecting a price somwhere in the order of $3800 as this price was
quoted in a newspaper article as being the likely price, why the huge
difference ??

Cheers
-Trevor

--
"Let me be the first to offer you my sincerest contrafibularities."
	- E. Blackadder

Trevor Elbourne 			University of New South Wales
trevore@vast.unsw.edu.au
trevore@cs.unsw.oz.au
From: ralph@bugend.edvina.se (Staffan Vilcans)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: NO MORE *&#*$(^*& FEMALE BIMBO ADS!!!!!!!!
Date: 11 Nov 92 00:01:54 GMT
Organization: Bugend BBS

Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman) writes:

> One other factor -- one of the usual assumptions operating was that anyone
> answering a phone who had a female voice was a clerical staff person.  It
> gets -real- tiresome to continually have to deal with this.  I'm sad to say
> that I'm just as guilty myself of the assumption -- all that cultural crap
> is pernicious.  And every time I get reminded about the situation, I get
> cranky..

Well, I have never counted the times I have asked some poor switchboard 
operator or secretary highly technical questions. I think you get tired 
of being connected to the wrong department after they have 
misunderstood you after a while, but I keep on going.

I think the worst missunderstanding was then I called an hospital and 
was connected to the emergency shrink!


---
"Piracy is theft." / FAST
"Property is theft." / Pierre Proudhon
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: 10667547@eng2.eng.monash.edu.au (JIMMY FANG)
Subject: Re: Oh my God!  Help my friend not buy an IBM!
Organization: Faculty of Engineering, Monash University 
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 04:54:04 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.162154.6253@gw.wmich.edu> x90wardell@gw.wmich.edu writes:
>From: x90wardell@gw.wmich.edu
>Subject: Re: Oh my God!  Help my friend not buy an IBM!
>Date: 9 Nov 92 16:21:54 EST

>	AGain, we look at things from a different point of view.  I
>had an Amiga and it was no where near as good as the current Amiga 3000
>or Amiga 4000 (I had an Amiga 2000).  But for me, easy software support
>means a lot to me and cheap hardware upgrades also mean a lot to me and
>no Amiga user can honestly say that upgrading the Amiga is cheaper than
>an IBM clone.  Case in point, 88 meg removable drive for an Amiga 500
>is $900.  For mine, $390.  

The only thing different between the two would be the hard-drive controller.
In Australia, the difference is about A$100.  Perhaps the IBM removable 
drive is some cheapo-no-name-brand-with-30-second-warranty and the Amiga 
version is by Maxtor or Quantum or Sysquest?  I haven't seen the 88 meg 
version direct to the public for less than A$800.

Most Amiga dealers sell Quantum hard-drives for the same prices as the clone 
dealers in Australia.  Don't know how market-forces work in the US...

> I would never again want an Amiga as my home machine but
>I still recommend it to newer computer users because an Amiga 500
>based machine is still a damn fine piece of work.  But only for
>a family, in my opinion.  
>	If I were going to do video productions or something else along
>that line, then I would go to an Amiga 4000 but software support and
>upgradability at a low cost means a lot to me.
>
>						-Brad


Jim Fang - Bachelor of Economics (3) / B.E (3) .-_|\        Snail Mail:
Monash University - Clayton, VIC, Australia   /     \       POA Box 539
InterNet: 10667547@eng2.eng.monash.edu.au     \_.-._/       Brentford Square
FAQ Maintainer for comp.sys.amiga.games            o     // Victoria 3131
                   comp.sys.amiga.introduction   AMIGA \X/  Australia

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A)
Subject: Re:  Top 10 reasons why ...
Organization: University of Southwestern Louisiana
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 17:05:46 GMT

In article <36838@cbmvax.commodore.com> grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins) writes:
>In article <1992Nov9.222911.18961@usl.edu> das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A) writes:
>> Why is it that Amiga hires mode seem to have LOTS higher horizontal res than
>> vertical res?
>> 
>> Ex: Resolution on the order of the 'super wooper duper productivity mode' might
>> be something like 1200X350 or something weird like that.
>> 
>> Can someone explain to me why this is so different from the marginal 
>> horizontal res edge in PC, Ex: 640X480, 800X600,1024X768,1280X960,1280X1024.
>> If it were an Amiga with similar horzontal resolution, they might
>> read:                          640X200, 800X300,1024X350, 1280X450,1280X550,etc.
>> Note, these may/may NOT be actually figures.
>
>Well, I've seen high-end PC's with as many as 13 crystals and osciallators to
>generate all the wierd clock fequencies they need for system operation and
>all the video clock frequencies.  Lately they use special clock synthesizer
>chips to avoid this.
>
>In the Amiga chipset, the video clock is some binary division of the main
>clock frequency - 28MHz, so the video clocks double instead of going up by
>odd increments.

Umm..thanks, but could you answer my question, please?
Did you, and I didn't notice?

All I wondered is why the Amiga seems to end up with hires horizontally,
and not-so-comparitively-hires vertically.  Do you mean it isn't
arbitrary?  Eru only *knows* how many funky resolutions IBM-brand
PCs have come in before..

>Commodore, Engineering Department     domain: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com
-- 
Dan Stephenson                                                 das9674@usl.edu  
"There once was a Lady from Hyde/who ate some bad apples and died/but while we
lamented/the apples fermented/making cider inside her inside!" 
                        -Member of the Court, Texas Renaissance Festival
From: jason@aspen.math.uh.edu (Jason Grimes)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Calling all lurkers!
Date: 12 Nov 92 23:36:31 GMT
Reply-To: jason@aspen.math.uh.edu (Jason Grimes)

time

jason
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: tmc@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA (Tim Ciceran)
Subject: Re: Top 10 reasons why ...
Organization: Brock University, St. Catharines Ontario
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 22:21:05 GMT

In article <1deb2lINNl10@falcon.natinst.com> glens@natinst.com (Glen Sescila)
writes:

>>6 wheels and nuclear power wouldn't sell from a company with a limited
>>corporate infrastructure, ethereal revenue, no dealers and a non-existent
>>software base. But, I digress: 

>	I want to buy a new computer, not a company.

Whether you like it or not, in buying a machine you make a vested interest
in the manufacturer's corporate longevity.

>>To interface with what? 

>	How about all these Macs/Laser Writers/Net Modems we have on our
>AppleTalk network throughout the building here at work?

Fine, assuming that you can use a Falcon in this context. 

>>How many Falcons will come equipped with 2.5" SCSI-II drives? 

>	The Falcon has IDE for internal Hard Disk and SCSI for external
>devices (bigger hard disks, CD-ROM drives, etc).

Which is gratuitous after all. 

>>AGA specific software will be HD installable. Anyone who buys a floppy-only
>>system deserves the frustration.

>	Anyone who buys a hard disk from Atari or Commodore deserves to be
>shot.  There are many less expensive sources.

The 40 MB IDE 2.5" drives are an added $200 from CBM. This is on par with the
rest of the market.

>	Yeah, that is a good reason to buy something(1200), because it has
>fewer features than its competitor!  That makes no sense at all.  Again, add
>up the price of the 1200 and the most usfull features from the Falcon that
>the 1200 is lacking.

I would consider most of the "useful" features of the Falcon (DSP, AppleTalk,
SCSI-II) to be inconsequential. What's left for third-party support?

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: tmc@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA (Tim Ciceran)
Subject: Re: Flash! A1200 pricing
Organization: Brock University, St. Catharines Ontario
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 17:55:15 GMT

In article <1992Nov05.003324.10684@medsys.rn.com> wendell@medsys.rn.com
(Wendell Dingus) writes:

>Have no idea of the accuracy, but an un-named (large retail chain) source
>just told me that they'd have A1200's for $599 and $799 sometime before
>Christmas. The $799 price is for an A1200HD version, but he didn't say
>what size the drive would be...

Sounds good to me. I would imagine that the default configuration will
include a 40 MB drive.

>The only thing the A1200 and 4000 need now in my opinion is 31.5Khz or
>greater video rates!

I'd argue that this situation would be best solved through RTG. Why?
Among other things, it would:

 o open up the market to third party development, reducing
   unit pricing of graphics cards

 o allow CBM to promote the Amiga as an entry-level workstation
   and increase the viability of professional software 

 o enable users to determine their individual needs, without
   concern for the LCD 

 o allow existing non-AGA machines to be upgraded for increased
   features

>I've been on a quest to find other (non-1950/60) multiscan monitors that
>sync that low and have come up dry. I feel that it's an absolute must
>that something be done about this soon.

However, as much as this may seem odd, AGA is obviously a short-term
solution. When confronted with selecting a monitor based on 15 kHz
compatibility and features for the long-term, I'd go for the latter. 

>Yeah I know 31.5Khz can be used, but from what I've read the boot menu
>is 15.75Khz, and that's sort of useful now and then... There needs to
>be a 4320 video de-interlacer card soon!

But for the price of such a deinterlacer, you could buy an entire
graphics card.
From: jmpor@dynam.adsp.sub.org (Jean-Marc Porchet)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Clinton/Gore (Was: A4000 graphics)
Date: 3 Nov 92 16:35:23 GMT
 <Bx2tzA.8t2@news.iastate.edu>
Reply-To: cbmehq!cbmswi!dynam!jmpor@cbmvax.commodore.com
Organization: Merging Technologies (IV-24 designers)
X-Newsreader: Arn V1.00 beta rel2

In article <Bx2tzA.8t2@news.iastate.edu>, Marc N Barrett writes:

>    The fact is, we have the best health care in the world, and our health care
> system does not need to be replaced.  It only needs to be fixed.  The Tote
> Reforms and malpractice reforms championed by Vice President Quayle would go
> a long way toward fixing most of the problems with our health care system.

This is really the first time I hear someone saying : "US health care are the 
best in the world".

I can't speak for Germany, but here in Switzerland everybody can go to 
the hospital and get health care, even if he doesn't have any insurance or
the money to pay for the care.

At the hospital their first question is What is wrong and not have you got
an insurance.

Marc, I think  it's time to go out of Iowa and look at the world by yourself
before writing such idiocy.

--

PS : forgive my bad English, I'm still trying to learn it
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jean-Marc "JUMP" Porchet                             Phone : (41) 22-754-1733

EMAIL :   ...{uunet,rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmehq!cbmswi!dynam!jmpor
	       or try   mcsun!cbmswi!dynam!jmpor		 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
'Simple things should be simple & complex things should be possible' Alan Kay
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn)
Subject: Re: Oh my God! Help my friend not buy an IBM!
Organization: Qld Dept Primary Industries
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 04:32:25 GMT

In article <1dmitrINN49n@mozz.unh.edu> ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene) writes:
>'>If you're not interested in computers buy a PC. Do I need to explain my
>'>point?
>
>	Yeah, I think you do need to explain.

I'll make a stab at it - every single Amiga user I know is a computer fanatic.
A geek, if you like.  The computer is their hobby, as well as a tool that
they use.  Now, I'm sure that many people in the video industry who use Amigas
just consider it a tool and aren't really interested in how it all works, and
what other fascinating things it might do, but I've never met any.  It might
be the circles I move in.

> I bought a PC last year and
>   I'm interested in computers (I had an A500 before that and an Apple IIe
>   before my A500).  Why does buying a PC mean you aren't interested in
>   computers?

It doesn't.  All it means is that you're in a quite small minority of PC 
owners.  Most PC owners I've met (and I know dozens) aren't "into" computers
in the way that I, and my Amiga owning mates, are.  I'm sure your "into"
computers, too - your presence here kind of proves it.

> This sounds like more Amiga elitism crap to me.

It's something we've all observed.  The Amiga crowd knows about, and is
interested in, computing.  Those who aren't "into" computing or video are
highly unlikely to buy an Amiga.

> Bash the competition along with the people that use it.

These observations are only about *most* Amiga and PC users.  I haven't seen
anyone say that ALL PC users are ignorant, but, an awful lot of them are...


-- 
David Meiklejohn (also known as davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au)
 - Regional support guy for PC's, Unix, and networks thereof.
 - But I'd rather be using an AMIGA!  Wouldn't you?
Find me in Mareeba, Australia (on the pointy bit in the northeast)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: torban@csuvax1.csu.murdoch.edu.au (Torban Bennett)
Subject: Amiga in a comic!
Organization: Murdoch University
Date: 13 Nov 92 10:12:55 GMT

Sorry, that heading might have been a bit misleading, but hey...;-)

I was reading the letter section of "The Hacker Files" (a DC comic
about intrigue on the net, blah hackers, blah top secret, blah blah
not a particularly great comic IMHO, but the content matter is somewhat
noteworthy.  However I digress, I'm not here to review the comic.)

Anyway, there was a letter from Jim Maciorowski of Safe Hex International
talking about virus's etc, and the ed said in his reply
  "Safe Hex also sells virus-killing programs cheap, but only
   for the AMIGA computer.  Don't know how many AMIGA users we
   have out there, but I thought I'd spread the word anyhow."

The good news is, in keeping with the tradition of their story, they have
got themselves a genie account, so people can email them.  I'd love to reply
via email, only I can't find the address anywhere.  Does somebody happen to
know it?

Torban Bennett - Net Lurker at large 
         (although this is my 7th post today Skip, do I still qualify?)
From: jfriesne@sdcc13.ucsd.edu (Jeremy Friesner!)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: === 1200 Released this Week ====
Date: 6 Nov 92 04:54:52 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego

In article <Paula_Lieberman.070k@amicol.UUCP> Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman) writes:
>And, for stuff
>that is doing a lot of internal processing and not doing lots of memory
>access, a 68030 on a 16 bit bus will outperform an  addressing-limited
>68E020.

All other things (especially Mhz's) being equal, I think that's
wrong.  The 68EC020's memory addressing limit is not a problem
as long as you don't need more than 16 megs (read: most programs
run on low end Macs and Amigas), and the 68EC020 will be sending
and receiving 32 bits at one time vs. the crippled 68030 16 at
one time.  So, I think the EC020 would be faster.

Jeremy


-- 
|~~~~///~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|   ///  "Channel Z! All Static! | "WaddayaMEAN my A3000's not    |
\\\///  All Day! Forever!" -B52s |  AGA compatible!  D-OH!!!" -Me |
|\\X/____________________________|________________________________|
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: west@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Bruce West)
Subject: Re: Oh my God!  Help my friend not buy an IBM!
Organization: University of North Texas, Denton
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 11:22:04 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.110930.6270@gw.wmich.edu> x90wardell@gw.wmich.edu writes:
   [major stuff deleted...about how IBM beat Amiga in all this stuff]
>of sound and graphics and animation.  Maybe eventually I will meet someone
                                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>who has an Amiga 3000 with animation that will make my head turn, but
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>I am not going to hold my breath.

    The above is where all these arguments come from.  The Amiga users, MANY
of whom have A3000s, have used 386s and 486s extensively in either their
school or workplace.  The IBM arguers havn't really seen what they are
missing.  This guy has never even touched a decked A3000?!?!  Much less
an A4000.  No wonder he has an IBM - I can tell he really researched his
choice of computers.
    I carefully researched my choice of computers and am not a mindless
Amiga follower.  But I will say Mac went out the window right away - an
OS in which you can't type, 'nuff said.  And IBM simply couldn't measure
up.  I'm a CS student with a serious interest in graphics.  With my Amiga
I can enjoy a cheap, fast, multitasking environment with some nice base
graphics and sound and great multimedia and presentation software.  Awesome
support for programmers.  And if I ever get into real serious graphics I can
get a card to make my Amiga look like an Silicon Graphics Iris - or if I
get into the video end I can get a toaster for about the same price.  Now
THAT is what I call open options - *and* being happy along the way.

>
>							-Brad

Ciao...



                                                           - Jason
From: Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: === 1200 Released this Week ====
Distribution: world
Date: 9 Nov 92 19:50:47 EDT
Organization: Amiga Colony BBS

re article by Jarko Lindbald.  Rather than spend $3500 to start with,
people prefer to buy something for $1000 and add value incrementally over
time.  There's a BIG gap in affordability between a 4000 and a 1200.  A lot
MORE people can afford to get a 1200 and then expand or attempt to expand
it, especially given the difference in prices.  

There are very few third party internal add-in cards for Amigas, and as for
the BridgeBoard support/AT slots, it's less expensive to buy a '386SX
system than just the 386SX Bridgeboard!  For someone who wants Amiga AGA
and 32 bit performance, and doesn't need a video slot or IBM PC
compatibility or Amiga slots that the market has produced, what, one or two
multiserial port cards, a networking card or two, three sound cards for 12
bit or 16 bit, and a very limted number of higher resolution graphics
cards, the A4000 is overkill in terms of price and the slots and PC
compatibility.  Like,the difference between the 500 and 2000 was almost
$1000 when I bought my 500, and it provided -no- 
useful advantages at the time.

At that time, the A2088 BridgeBoard MIGHT have been in existence, hard
drives and controllers for Amigas were extremely scarce, there was nothing
that used the video slot, and there were just about no Amiga slot cards. 
However, the performance of the two machines was just about identical -- so
what was worth outlaying the extra $1000 for?!  The way I looked at it, if
I were going to spend $1000 there ought to be some performance advantage
WORTH $1000.  With the A1200 and the A4000, there is a major performance
difference between an 020, which even disk drives have abandoned for use as
controllers, not to mention printers, and the '040.  But, the 020 is TEN
YEARS old -- which in terms of the computer world, is ancient.

I'm thinking in terms of things like scanning in images -- a 300 dpi color
scanner is what, $1500 or less?  At 300 dpi on an 8 1/2 X 11" sheet, that's
at 3 bytes per dot, 3 X 300 X 300 X 8.5 X 11 = roughly 27 X 10,000 X 93.5
bytes
which is roughly 3 X 10 X 10000 X 100 = 3 X 10,000,000, or nearly 30 MB.
To manipulate that one either needs virtual memory or an awful lot of RAM.
And no, that is NOT an unreasonable thing to think about. A LOT of stuff is
scanned, and at higher resolutions than 300 dpi.  And a lot of people
buying 1200s could get disappointed.....


-- Via DLG Pro v0.992
From: root@rkamiga.UUCP (Rick Kelly)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re:  === 1200 Released this Week ====
Distribution: world
Date: 6 Nov 92 08:36:02 EST
Organization: Rick's Amiga

In article <Paula_Lieberman.0710@amicol.UUCP> Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman) writes:
>re aricle by Peter Hjalmarsson:  Another thing delaying Amiga hardware
>stuff into the US market is that there are apparently very few approved
>test sites for FCC compliance testing for Amigas/Amiga hardware, especially
>when compared withe other machines.

This sounds bogus to me.  I have been involved in FCC testing, and it is a
fairly standardized procedure that differs mainly in whether it is going for
class A or class B type acceptance.

A computer only has to have one unit tested in each of it's shipped
configurations.  That would be 2 for A600, 2 for A1200, and 2 ? for A4000.

>By the way, apparently IDC, doing a study on the share of the
>market/numbers sold of microcomputers in 1991, didn't even MENTION Amigas
>-- though it did include the 20,000 or so NeXt machines, for example, 1.8
>million Macintoshes, 21.2 million IBM PC-compatibles....

Interesting.

--
Rick Kelly		Rick's Amiga		Framingham, Mass.

		think!unixland!rmkhome!rkamiga!root

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy