HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: josh@Happy-Man.com (Joshua_Putnam)
Subject: Re: WELL anonymity policy
Reply-To: Joshua_Putnam@happy-man.com
Organization: Happy Man Corp., Vashon Island, WA 98070-7399
Distribution: inet
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 23:25:58 GMT

In <1h7tncINN8st@morrow.stanford.edu> karish@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Chuck Karish) writes:

>My reference to a venerable comment, usually quoted as
>"Consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds", was
>directly to the point.  Your insistence on consistency
>as an essential criterion for an acceptable membership policy
>seems silly and wrong-headed to those of us who fail to
>understand your use of the term.

Actually, the quote applies even more in its original form:

" A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored
by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. " -- Emerson.

In other words, consistency merely for the sake of consistency is
foolish and arbitrary.  Far better to judge each situation on its
own merits, provided one has the capacity to do so.

The blurb cited here about "special arrangements" sounds like a
reasonable one, and certainly does not imply that pseudonyms will
be arbitrarily denied, merely that getting one is not the
default, but rather something requiring non-default actions by
the user, i.e. making special arrangements.  (Like the airlines'
"special arrangements" to get a vegetarian in-flight meal: ask in
advance since it isn't what they usually do.)
-- 
 Joshua_Putnam@happy-man.com    Happy Man Corp.  206/463-9399 x102
 4410 SW Pt. Robinson Rd., Vashon Island, WA  98070-7399  fax x108
 We publish SOLID VALUE for the intelligent investor.  NextMail OK
Info free; sample $20: Send POSTAL addr: Solid-Value@happy-man.com
From: gardner@convex.com (Steve Gardner)
Subject: Re: RSA sucks (Re: PGP warning (ooo; I am scared))
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 21:01:48 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In article <1992Dec27.180042.7620@netcom.com> nagle@netcom.com (John Nagle) writes:
>mitch@novavax.UUCP (Mitch Silverman) writes:
>>>Please let him know how you feel about the theft of mathmatics (sic) by the
>>>patent office.
>      Why so down on RSA getting their patent?  Public-key cryptography
>was a major invention.  Before Rivest, Shamir, etc. invented it, it was
>generally thought to be impossible.  It was a real invention, not something
>obvious that slipped past the PTO, like the XOR-draw patent, or something
>that ought to be an antitrust violation, like the way Hayes uses its
>patent on "+++" as an out-of-band signal to modems.
	It's not that RSA is more evil than any other software patent holder.
	It's that software patents as a legal concept are an ill-considered
	creation of people who do not understand either mathematics or
	software.  It is a wrong headed concept and people like RSA should
	not exploit an obviously intellectually and morally bankrupt system
	for private gain.  They *do* understand both software and mathematics
	and are therefore more accountable for supporting a bad system.


							smg

Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
From: jem@sunSITE.unc.edu (Jonathan Magid)
Subject: CERT warning
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 07:17:26 GMT

Today I logged into my first system that displays the US department
of Justice reccomended warning that was posted by CERT...

A scarey thing to see facing you on every login; I am glad its not a 
system I use often and hope that its not a warning that becomes more and
more common...

jem.
-- 
Jonathan Magid     jem@sunSITE.unc.edu       sunSITE Administrator
Virtual pizza Delivery (tm)::faxed in 30 cycles or less or you get it
----------------------------------------FREE!!!-----------------------
From: barrey@Novell.com (Barrey Jewall)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: Re- Novell buys Unix System
Date: 28 Dec 92 23:45:08 GMT
Organization: Novell, Inc.

In <199212212107.AA23802@eff.org> Brad_Hicks@mhs.attmail.com writes:

>Me, I'm waiting to see what happens when Novell HQ (in Provo UT) tells the
>ex-AT&T jocks in New Jersey that they have to get rid of the coffee and
>soda machines.  Novell doesn't allow caffeine anywhere on its corporate
>property.  Can you imagine big hairy C programmin' UNIX studs with NO
>CAFFEINE?


Well, I don't know about Provo, having been there only once, for a day,
and not being a coffee drinker, I didn't notice whether or not there
were coffee machines there.

However, I work at Novell's second largest location, in San Jose, Calif.,
and the coffee machines are everywhere here. Same with Walnut Creek, up
the road a piece. Coke and the like are sold in vending machines in 
each building.

Ooops, I've left my Vivarin out in the car when I drove to work today,
I'd better go hide it or Security will come and get me!!!

In short, someone has sold you a line of **#@&%@#WQ#@$!!
 
>Can you say "mass defections?"  Sure, I knew you could.

Nah...


NOTE: Novell pays people to speak for them. I ain't one of those people!!

Bah
--
+ Barrey Jewall - Network  Admin.++  and yea, though I walk through the shadow 
+ barrey@novell.com	         ++ of death, I shall fear no evil, for I am
+ Novell, Inc.- San Jose, Calif. ++ the meanest sonofabitch in the valley...
From: howard@titan.hal.com (Howard Gayle)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: Why PTO doesn't get it, was Re: Legal Stuff!
Date: 29 Dec 92 18:45:04 GMT
Reply-To: howard@hal.com (Howard Gayle)
Distribution: inet
Organization: HaL Computer Systems, Inc., Campbell, California
NNTP-Posting-Host: titan.hal.com
In-reply-to: pfarrell@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Pat Farrell)

In article <1992Dec29.003326.3552@gmuvax2.gmu.edu>, pfarrell@gmuvax2 (Pat Farrell) writes:
> I think we should start looking 
>for solutions that can be realisticaly implemented. Viable
>solutions start with rethinking the fundamental assumptions of
>software patents. Helpful steps may be as simple as moving 
>the whole PTO to a city where the salaries are competitive.

I suggest Chernobyl. :-)
--
Howard Gayle
HAL Computer Systems, Inc.
1315 Dell Avenue
Campbell, California 95008
USA
howard@hal.com
Phone: +1 408 379 7000 extension 1080
FAX  : +1 408 379 5022
From: karish@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Chuck Karish)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: WELL anonymity policy
Date: 24 Dec 1992 03:18:19 GMT
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: inet
NNTP-Posting-Host: pangea.stanford.edu

In article <1hb7v9INNm74@agate.berkeley.edu> spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu
(Steve Pope) writes:
>In article <1992Dec24.020623.5763@eff.org> mnemonic@eff.org
(Mike Godwin) writes:
>>In article <1hb30lINNlfe@agate.berkeley.edu> spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu
(Steve Pope) writes:
>
>>> For me it [ the information that the lack of pseudonymity is
>>> one disadvantage of the WELL ] has shown up in face-to-face 
>>> conversations with WELL users.  
>>
>>How many [users]?
>
>Not a great number -- at least 2, possibly one or two more.

How many WELL users did you talk to in all?

>The context arises when I query along the lines of, "what is 
>a good access service around here"?   WELL has the huge
>advantage that you get all of the WELL conferences.  But
>one disadvantage is you can't be completely anonymous --

When you ask people about this service, do they immediately
say "It's great, but I have to use my real name and I'm bummed!"
or do they say "Now that you mention it, you can't be
completely anomymous.  Hmmm..."

>I don't have to ask 5,000 well users to confirm
>what I already know.

Indeed.
--

    Chuck Karish          karish@mindcraft.com
    (415) 323-9000 x117   karish@pangea.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
From: pjs269@tijc02.uucp (Paul Schmidt)
Subject: Re: Professional registration
Organization: Advocates for Self-Government - Davy Crockett Chapter
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 13:04:07 GMT

bhayden@teal.csn.org (Bruce Hayden) writes:
: morpheus@entropy.mcds.com (morpheus) writes:
: 
: >Jim.Riddle@inns.omahug.org (Jim Riddle) writes:
: 
: >> I'm personally tired of hearing from all of these people who could've
: >> gotten college degrees if they wanted to do so.  I'd like to know why
: >> they didn't and why they seem to hold it against we who did!
: 
: >Lack of money could be a hell of a good reason.
: 
Hiwassee College, a two year school, will not turn anyone away that
wants a degree but has a lack of money.  They will accept any student
and work out a way for that student to go to college.  If anyone wants
more information about the college, send me E-Mail.
-- 
Paul Schmidt: Advocates for Self-Government, Davy Crockett Chapter President
706 Judith Drive, Johnson City, TN 37604, (615)283-0084, uunet!tijc02!pjs269
"Freedom seems to have unleashed the  creative energies of the people -- and
leads to ever higher levels of income and social progress."  --  U.N. report
From: rat@ruth.UUCP (David Douthitt)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: Virus design
Date: 27 Dec 92 13:19:12 GMT
Organization: Network XXIII - +1 608 222 9253

mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin) writes:

| In article <ZmLawB1w165w@ruth.UUCP> rat@ruth.UUCP (David Douthitt) writes:
| 
| >Suppose someone wrote a virus that was BENEFICIAL?  One that spread just
| >like others, but had a beneficial effect on the system.
| 
| Virus researcher Fred Cohen has theorized about such viruses. Some of his
| work has appeared in the proceedings of the DPMA's annual Virus and
| Computer Security conferences.

DPMA??  Not ACM?  Guess those stuffed shirts ARE good for something :-) :-)
At the college I went to, I could have joined DPMA - but felt no self-
respecting hacker would join them and joined ACM instead...

Are there texts of the conferences with Fred's talk in them?


--
UUCP: ....!fullfeed.com!ruth!rat        |  Network XXIII - +1 608 222 9253
InterNet: rat@ruth.UUCP                 |  80Megs+ of Usenet/Fido programs!
Fidonet: David Douthitt 1:121/23        |
"...because appealing to the masses has |  Files available more ways than
 never appealed to us."                 |  any other BBS in America!
Files via: anon uucp, Fidonet FREQ, mail to archive-server@ruth.uucp, etc.
From: kityss@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (arnette.p.baker)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: RE: InterState Caller ID
Date: 22 Dec 92 22:46:48 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

bhayden@teal.csn.org (Bruce Hayden) and
>timhu@ico.isc.com (Timothy Hu) write:

>>If you live in a state where CallID is not available, will your number
>>still show up on their machine?

It depends.  The ANI (Billing Number) delivery provided by
many long distance carriers to 800 number customers will deliver all ANI data
that the Long Distance Carrier's network has.  (Blocking, aka "privacy"
is not applicable to ANI delivery.)

Caller ID (TM) delivery is based on transport of the Calling Party Number.
CPN may be different than ANI (for most of us residential POTS users
it is the same. POTS= plain old telephone service).  Until there is
full Network Interconnect of SS7 (a signaling protocol that allows
transport of CPN and a "blocking" indication) between a local
telephone company and the Long Distance Carriers - Caller Id Delivery
will probably not function on inter-state calls.  This is because
most, not all, state to state calls must use "long distance".  

However Network Interconnect is just around the corner.  What happens
then???  Well, technically the CPN and blocking indication can be
transported between states - the rest will be up to the FCC and
the courts I guess.  

>I believe so - I think that the caller's id is carried down to the
>local exchange, where it is stripped out (since traditionally we
>ad no way of using it). It is supposedly there for call setup and
>accounting purposes. This is why (at least in Colorado) all caller ID
>requires is an upgrade of the software in the local exchange - an
>upgrade that is probably going to happen anyway (meaning that your
>local exchange will have the capability for Caller ID probably long
>before the local PUC will give you access thereof).

ANI is passed from the local phone company to a long distance carrier
(so they can bill the person for the call).  CPN transport requires
SS7 signaling.  SS7 is most likely both a software and hardware upgrade
for your local company.

Just my simplified description.  Not the opinion of my employer.

Arnette Schultz
kityss@ihlpe.att.com
From: ron@zooid.guild.org (Secret Mud)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: EFFector Online 4.04 Civil Disobedience by H.D. Thoreau
Date: 27 Dec 92 04:17:48 GMT

From: wixer!cactus.org!wixer!pro-smof.cts.com!shiva@cactus.org (System Smof)
>That Thoreau dude sure is a wordy sumbitch. He sounds like a typical
>liberal arts major. heh.

If Thoreau is a typical liberal arts major, then we need a lot more of them.

Maybe he just needs a more modern editor to help make his writing a little
more concise.  What's Thoreau's net address anyway?  :)
From: spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: WELL anonymity policy
Date: 22 Dec 1992 23:19:49 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley -- ERL
Distribution: inet
NNTP-Posting-Host: zion.berkeley.edu

Rita Rouvalis writes in response to my posts.
>
>	I don't think anybody really cares one way or another about
>what you think of the policy.  

Well, a few have followed up on the thread I started 
so that's some level of interest.

>	Personally, I don't know what your point is.

You probably don't have an interest in computer
privacy issues then.

To illuminate you a bit, the WELL is primarily a social
computer network -- I've never subscribed, but I often
recommend it to friends who don't like the flaming and
noise on usenet.

The interations that occur on socially-oriented networks
are very dependent on things like psedonymity policies
and practices, and on privacy issues in general.  

The topic is a pretty mainstream one for this newsgroup
(comp.org.eff.talk).

Steve
From: rat@ruth.UUCP (David Douthitt)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: Virus design
Date: 28 Dec 92 12:35:59 GMT
Organization: Network XXIII - +1 608 222 9253

betsys@cs.umb.edu (Elizabeth Schwartz) writes:

|     Or take the bad-virus-fighting part and make it available, for
| free, with source and no liability, via ftp and other common channels.
| Good programs don't have to break into systems; we will invite them in
| by the front door.

Ha!  If that was true, then viruses would be eradicated because no one
would run a system that was unprotected and unchecked.  That's the point
of an antibody - the user can be just as lazy and apathetic as ever;
the antibody takes over and eradicates viruses from their system.

We already have free software available via common channels; the problem
is people don't use them.

|    I'm not psychic; if a program shows up on my system, unannounced,
| and says "Hi! Sorry I cracked su on your machine, but I'm a GOOD virus
| so don't mind ME" I'm not gonna waste time trying to guess if it is
| lying :-)

What about a virus that showed up on your system, and said "Hi!  I used
security hole x, but I fixed it!"  Imagine what would have happened
(with appropriate warnings and so on) if a virus was written (very similar
to what rtm did), but instead it closed up the security holes that rtm
eventually used.

Those holes are the perfect example - after all, they *HAD* been fixed
as I understand it, but many people did not update their software to
fix them.  See what happens when you leave it up to the admins?


--
UUCP: ....!fullfeed.com!ruth!rat        |  Network XXIII - +1 608 222 9253
InterNet: rat@ruth.UUCP                 |  80Megs+ of Usenet/Fido programs!
Fidonet: David Douthitt 1:121/23        |
"...because appealing to the masses has |  Files available more ways than
 never appealed to us."                 |  any other BBS in America!
Files via: anon uucp, Fidonet FREQ, mail to archive-server@ruth.uucp, etc.
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
From: pjs269@tijc02.uucp (Paul Schmidt)
Subject: Re: Licencing of computer professionals
Organization: Advocates for Self-Government - Davy Crockett Chapter
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 12:58:44 GMT

Jim.Riddle@inns.omahug.org (Jim Riddle) writes:
: Thomas Aaron Insel asked me to tell him that the whole thing isn't
: different from plumbing.
:  
: I can't, because it isn't
:  
: The whole thing about plumbing and registrations and licensing is the
: same as it is with engineering and probably should be with some aspects
: of software.  Anytime you do anything affecting the public health and
: safety you need to be certified capable of doing it correctly and,
: perhaps the point that is being overlooked, you have to lay your own
: ticket on the line if what you do fails.
:  
: What's wrong with that?
:  
I want to have safe and reliable software.  Improperly designed software
could have dangerous consequences in certain products.  Mandatory
licensing (by the government) leads to poorer quality and shortages
while making those that are licensed into a protected monopoly.
Voluntary certification by independent and competing groups produce
better quality and doesn't stifle innovation like licensing would.

There are several good books on how governmental licensing does more
harm than good.  Nobel Prize winner Milton Friedman wrote in "Capitalism
& Freedom" about the harm caused by licensing, using the medical
profession as the prime example.

But the best book I have read on the subject is "Healing Our World:  the
Other Piece of the Puzzle" by Dr. Mary J. Ruwart.  This book does an
excellent job of explaining the harm of governmental licensing and is
based on a concern for helping others, especially the poor.  "Healing 
Our World" can be ordered from the Advocates for Self-Government 
(800)932-1776.
-- 
Paul Schmidt: Advocates for Self-Government, Davy Crockett Chapter President
706 Judith Drive, Johnson City, TN 37604, (615)283-0084, uunet!tijc02!pjs269
"Freedom seems to have unleashed the  creative energies of the people -- and
leads to ever higher levels of income and social progress."  --  U.N. report
From: gritton@alaska.et.byu.edu (Jamie Gritton)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: Brad Hicks forwarding
Date: 21 Dec 92 15:59:43 GMT
	<BzJ0Mp.9Hx@mtholyoke.edu> <1992Dec20.002813.4938@news2.cis.umn.edu>
Reply-To: gritton@byu.edu
Organization: Brigham Young University, Provo UT USA

charlie@umnstat.stat.umn.edu (Charles Geyer) writes:

> How do we get the attention of someone with a clue at AT&T?

Indeed.
--
James Gritton - gritton@byu.edu - I disclaim
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk,sci.crypt,alt.security.pgp
From: pmetzger@snark.shearson.com (Perry E. Metzger)
Subject: Re: [sci.crypt, et al.]  Re: PKP/RSA comments on PGP legality
Organization: Partnership for an America Free Drug
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:07:37 GMT

strnlght@netcom.com (David Sternlight) writes:
>Even for those who have no ethical concerns, suppose you were known to use it.
>It might jeopardize your ability to pass the scrutiny needed to obtain
>government employment, receive government research funds, or work on
>government contracts if somebody, somewhere, has a note in a file about you
>"violated Munitions Act."

I doubt that they will give a damn. However, I do suspect that my real
problem with getting government employment would be the fact that I am
an anarchist. Not only would working for the government be ethically
wrong to me, but I doubt they'd want me, either.

--
Perry Metzger		pmetzger@shearson.com
--
Laissez faire, laissez passer. Le monde va de lui meme.
From: rat@ruth.UUCP (David Douthitt)
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
Subject: Re: Beneficial Virus?
Date: 2 Jan 93 19:02:48 GMT
Organization: Network XXIII - +1 608 222 9253

rpowers@panix.com (Richard Powers) writes:

| Well, its becoming obvious that you and others here have a deep
| prejudice against programs which self-replicate.

Just another instance of paranoid tendencies :-)

| Just for the sake of argument:
| 
| If you copy an executable from one system to another without a
| permission file/marker it would still run.  The virus would just not
| stay in memory after doing its job of decompressing the file it was
| attached to, and thus not spread.

Interesting - NOT committ hari-kari?

| Alternatively (prefferred), it
| could alert the user to its existence, and give the user the choice of
| letting the virus stay in the file, or telling the virus to remove
| itself from the file.

PREFERRED?  I think far too many people would PANIC and would do something
drastic.  Better to either die or not stay resident...


--
UUCP: ....!fullfeed.com!ruth!rat        |  Network XXIII - +1 608 222 9253
InterNet: rat@ruth.UUCP                 |  80Megs+ of Usenet/Fido programs!
Fidonet: David Douthitt 1:121/23        |  ... Files via Fidonet FREQ,
"...because appealing to the masses has |  anon uucp, first time login,
 never appealed to us."                 |  mail to fileserver@ruth.uucp
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk
From: jet@boxer.nas.nasa.gov (J. Eric Townsend)
Subject: login banners, an fyi..
Organization: Numerical Aerodynamic Simulation, NASA Ames
Date: 22 Dec 92 14:19:01


here at nas.nasa.gov (NAS facility, NASA Ames), we have pre-DoJ memo
banners.

Every intereactive shell I start up starts with the following message:

==============================================================================
You are connected to a U.S. government computer system.  Any unauthorized
attempt to gain access to this system may subject you to fine or imprisonment.
==============================================================================

And when I telnet to another machine (notice that the banner comes up
*BEFORE* the user has logged in):

$ telnet fubar
Trying xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx
Connected to fubar.nas.nasa.gov.
Escape character is '^]'.


IRIX System V.3 (fubar)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You are connected to a U.S. government computer system.  Any unauthorized
attempt to gain access to this system may subject you to fine or imprisonment.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

login:






--
             J. Eric Townsend --  jet@nas.nasa.gov -- 415.604.4311
              '92 R100R, DoD# 0378, BMWMOA, AMA, ACLU, EFF, CPSR
                                "HotHead Rules!"
Newsgroups: comp.org.eff.talk