From: lmollett@lunatix.uucp (Laura Mollett)
Newsgroups: alt.mythology
Subject: Re: aranrhod & a request for information
Date: 14 Aug 92 18:22:21 GMT
Organization: Lexington Public Access Unix. -KY- (606) 253-1481

In article <1992Aug11.224633.26407@ctr.columbia.edu> lilorenzin@apollo.davidson.edu writes:
>From:	APOLLO::LILORENZIN   "flame" 11-AUG-1992 18:43:49.46
>To:	LILORENZIN
>CC:	LILORENZIN
>Subj:	
>
>greenthings & salivations... :)
>
>i'm looking for information on the celtic goddess aranrhod.  in my copy of the
>mabinogion, she is tentatively identified with a minor character goewin, math's
>virgin footholder, raped by gwydyon & gilvaethy.  the two women being
>originally one is offered as an explanation for the parentage of dylan & lleu. 
>my question is therefor - does anyone know of information supporting the
>conclusion drawn by this translator? 
	Oh, I have something wonderful on this :) (well, I thought it was :).
I don't know of anything that really proves that Aranrhod is the same as Goewin,
but I think the real question is whether Gwydion is Lleu's father, and it
seems to me like he was identified as such in other myths.  If a comparison
with the Hindu myth [see below] is appropriate, mebbe Llew has several
fathers, and isn't Gwydion identified with light or fire in some way?  Mebbe
he compares with Agni, but I don't really have anything to indicate that.
I've always been interested in Aranrhod, and when I became interested in the
Hindu myths, I was reading about the birth of Skanda and came across a figure
whose name is Arundhati.  Now, I'm not really a linguist (I just play at it),
but I'm sure it wouldn't be difficult at all to cognate those names.  They
really close, especially with pronunciation which I can't do :).
	Skanda is a champion God figure.  He's the only one who can rid the
Gods of a terrible demon, and he's the son of Siva in one version or of Agni
in the other.  He has (in both versions) a whole slew of mothers.  The really
interesting part is that Arundhati is the only one who is NOT his mother.  She
definately remains "virgin" in both versions.  I'll try not to get carried 
away, and just give the pertinent parts <grin>:
	Quoting from Penguin Classics, _Hindu Myths_, ed. by Wendy Doniger
O'Flaherty, 1975:
	...But when she [Svaha, the daughter of Daksa] found out that 
	Agni had gone into the forest and was thoroughly heated by desire,  
	the angry goddess thought, 'I will take the forms of the wives
	of the Seven Sages, and when the Purifier, tortured by desire,
	is deceived by their forms I will satisfy his desire.  In this
	way, he will have his pleasure and I will obtain my wish.'  The
	goddess first assumed the form of Siva [the punctuation marks
	differentiate this name from that of the God Siva, but I can't
	show them on the net], the wife of Angiras, a woman of virtue,
	beauty, and merit....I have come here for intercourse; take your
	pleasure quickly.  The Mothers [the wives of the 7 sages] are
	awaiting me and I must go, Oblation-devourer.'  
	  Then Agni was overcome with rapture, and he united with the
	goddess 'Siva', who was filled with pleasure and took his seed
	in her hand....She went quickly [in the form of a bird] to the
	high plateau of that mountain, which was difficult to reach, and
	she threw the seed hastily into a golden pot.  Then the goddess
	assumed the forms of the wives of the remaining noble Seven
	Sages and satisfied the desire of the Purifier.  But she 
	could not take the divine form of Arundhati because of
	Arundhati's powerful asceticism and devotion to her husband.
	Six times the lustful Svaha threw the seed of Agni into that
	pot on the first day of the lunar fortnight.
	  The seed shed there, full of energy, engendered a son who
	was honoured by the sages as Skanda because he had been shed
	[skannam]....
			[pg. 109-110]
and in the other version, same book:
	[the other gods have interrupted Siva in his lovemaking, because
	his lovemaking was causing the whole world to tremble.  This
	caused Siva to spill his seed on the ground, and at Siva's 
	command Agni turns into a bird and eats the seed.  All the gods
	became pregnant by the seed, because they only eat food that
	has been placed in Agni (fire).  They were cursed by Siva's
	wife, and Siva's seed burned them.  So they went back to Siva
	and asked him to remove his seed.  Agni also asks to have the 
	burning seed removed from him]
	...Therefore Agni folded his palms together and bowed and
	praised Siva, for his soul was not content, and he said: 'God
	of gods...remove this feverish burning...'  Then Sambhu, the
	supreme lord...replied to the Purifier, 'You committed an improper
	act when you ate my seed...But now that you have come to me for
	refuge you will be relieved, Agni....Leave that seed carefully
	in the womb of some good woman and you will be relived...'
	  When Fire heard Sambhu's sppech, he...replied...'Your seed is   
	hard to bear, great lord and ruler.  No woman in the three universes
	is capable of holding it in her womb, except Sakti.'  When Fire
	spoke in this way, Narada was prompted by Sankara to help Agni,
	and he said, 'Agni, listen to my auspicious words which will
	remove your feverish burning, delight you, bring you supreme bliss,
	and dispel all your sins....I will tell you this carefully and
	accurately as Siva wishes:  Fire, place this great seed of Siva
	in the bodies of those women who bathe at dawn in the month of
	summer.'
	  Now, at this time the wives of the Seven Sages came there
	wishing to bathe at dawn in the month of summer, in accordance
	with their rites.  When they had bathed, six of the women were
	pained by the intense cold, and they wished to go near the flames
	of the fire.  Arundhati, seeing them behaving so stupidly, tried
	to prevent them, by the command of the lord of the mountain, for
	she was of particularly good conduct and good counsel.  But the
	six wives of the sages were so deluded by Siva's magic power of
	illusion that they went there against her will in order to dispel
	their chill.  All the tiny particles of his seed immediately 
	entered their bodies through their hair follicles, and Agni was
	free of his feverish burning....All of the women but Arundhati
	became pregnant and they went home, tortured by the feverish
	burning and suffering because of Agni.  When the husbands saw
	the condition of their wives, they were quickly overcome by anger,
	and they all took counsel together and abandoned their wives.
	When all the six women realized their transgression, they were
	afflicted with great misery and their hearts were deeply troubled.  
	The sges' wives left the seed of Siva in the form of an embryo on
	a peak of Himalaya, and then they were free of the feverish
	burning.
	[the seed is eventually thrown into the reeds on the side of
	the Ganges and becomes Skanda, the son of Siva]
			[pg. 166-168]

Now the wives of the Seven Sages aren't exactly raped, but it does seem very
close.  I also thought it interesting that the seed is desposited in a
"golden pot" which seems similar to me to Gwydion keeping Llew in the box
until he is born.  I can't help but wonder why Arundhati should be a specific
virgin figure, and why Aranhod can't carry her children until they are born,
but apparently it is important that she be a virgin in both myths (to hold
the feet of Math in the Celtic, and I dunno why in the Hindu).

>also - if anyone off the top of their head can give examples of other goddesses
>portrayed as having been raped, it would help broaden my research... (i can't
>believe i'm actually *asking* for more work.  funny farm, anyone?)
	There are lots of Greek rape scenes, & at least one is a Goddess.
I could look it up and give you a name if you like, but it prolly isn't that
hard to find. 
>
>							thanks...
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>...flame			...many waters cannot quench love...
>lilorenzin@davidson		   lilorenzin@apollo.davidson.edu
>

				Laura Mollett