From: keb3_ss@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Karin E. Baker)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: The Analogy Betwixt Gays & Blacks (Re: Children in Same-gender Families)
Date: 19 Dec 92 16:02:35 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

In <1992Dec15.093547.16763@news.DKRZ-Hamburg.DE> k206027@smog.DKRZ-Hamburg.DE (Bakayaroo Banzai) writes:

>In article <14DEC199213373618@zeus.tamu.edu> rlc1028@zeus.tamu.edu writes:
>>In article <645@blue.cis.pitt.edu>, psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek) writes...
>>| 
>>	There is a distinction between Gay identity and Gay behaviour.
>[...]
>>
>>	Gays are like Blacks in that there is something about them,
>>irrespective of thier behaviour, which they cannot seem to change.  In 
>>particular, Gays are sexually responsive to members of their own gender.
>>They cannot love members of the opposite gender in the same capacity.
>>This is a trait which they are either born with or acquire sometime before
>>they have an awareness of it.  
>>
>>	Blacks cannot, without much effort, change their skin colour,
>>and Gays cannot change their gender attraction.
>>
>On the contrary, I have known several "gay" people who rejected 
>homosexual practices and are now heterosexuals. Whether or not
>they still feel "attracted" to same gender relationships is a point
>of debate (they claim to me that they're not). I realize that
>"rehabilitation" is a very sore point with the gay community but
>these people also claimed not to have been coerced. I would add
>the "without much effort" qualification to homosexuals as well. 
>Whether or not they were truly "gay" to begin with is a subject
>I will gladly let others debate endlessly. I'm only trying to 
>point out that I have known others who have had a seemingly 
>contradictory experience.

Your friends won't be the only people who thought they were gay or are
homosexual leading heterosexual lives.  But are they being true to 
themselves, to their spouses?  Will there be a divorce down the line
when they realize they need to be true to themselves and who they are? Or
will they just realize that living in the closet, living as a heterosexual
is much easier than thinking about facing a world of people like Ted
Krueger.. 

Fortunately the world is not filled with Ted Kruegers.. so don't give up 
hope, folks!


>>	Gays are like Blacks in that the hatred of them is a hatred of 
>>their culture and behaviour.  Most people who admit to disliking Blacks
>>admit that it has nothing to do with skin colour, but with culture.
>>
>I agree with this statement in as far as it goes. Most homosexuals 
>seem to vehemently deny that such a thing as a gay "culture" exists.
>And indeed I know homosexuals in all walks of life from totally
>straight-appearing to flaming. Black people appears to come in several
>flavors as well, from Clarence Thomas to Ice-T.

(neither of which are too complimentary examples of people of color.. at 
least you could have chosen someone like MLK to represent one end of the 
spectrum..)


>>
>>	Likewise, just because someone is Gay doesn't imply that they
>>do this or that sex act, live this or that lifestyle, or believe in this
>>or that ethical system.  Being Gay doesn't imply a behaviour. 

Let's stop a moment and put in some definitions:
homosexual: someone who is attracted to members of the same sex.
gay:  someone who accepts this, and who strives to be part of a culture.

This does not mean that the person accepts every facet of the culture, but 
seeks to identify him/herself with other gay people.  

There is a very distinct gay culture, which has its own language, its
own history, and its own misconceptions and stereotypes.


>>
>Very true, it only implies a sexual attraction to a member of the
>same sex. I leave off "love" relationship because I feel love for many men
>in my life without being sexually attracted to them. There are many
>different kinds of love, sexual love being the only one I feel sets
>gays apart from anyone else.

How about romantic love.. I think that more accurately describes my 
feelings for my lover, which are feelings I wouldn't necessarily have 
for a man.


>That said, the rest of your post I would leave unchanged. Homosexuality
>(excluding acts which take place outside of a consenting, adult relationship),
>should not be a grounds for discrimination and the treatment of it today
>differs little from race issues of the 50s and 60s.

Good solid thought!


> 
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>*  "Supernatural, perhaps...Baloney, perhaps not" - Bela Lugosi               *
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>Matt Marchese	    The opinions expressed here are not those of my employer, *
>Cray Research  	    my wife, my church, or myself...But they are the opinions *
>DKRZ                of Elvis as revealved to me through the medium of my pet  *
>Hamburg, Germany    hamster, Lee Harvey Oswald...                             *
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-- 
;^) -Karin
keb3_ss@uhura.cc.rochester.edu
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.bush