HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cayley.waterloo.edu!djohnson@overmind.mind.org
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Value of Stats
Date: 22 Jul 92 22:21:00 GMT
Organization: University of Waterloo
X-mailer: Stadel 3.4a-227
X-Spam-content: irrelevant

In article <1992Jul22.164840.15493@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri 
Nichols) writes:
>In article <Brrr8I.4uw@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> 
djohnson@cayley.waterloo.edu (David Johnson) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul22.000141.12304@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri 
Nichols) writes:
>>>In article <BrrGCL.FI7@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> 
djohnson@cayley.waterloo.edu (David Johnson) writes:
>>>>If Rance Mulliniks, Derek Bell, and Rob Ducey don't think that a .300 
hitter
>>>>15HR and 50 RBI man so far shouldn't be playing then they shouldn't be
>>>>considered team players as well.  
>>>
>>>Even if that .300 hitter with 15 HR and 50 RBIs is a grouch who hates
>>>everybody else on the team, and only gives 75%? 
>>
>>If he is having bad effects on the team and causes the rest of the team to
>>play poorer then maybe he shouldn't play and should be traded but that
>>decision is up to management.  It also depends on who can replace him.  If
>>they had a Ducey to replace him with then the decision becomes harder but
>>if they have Derek Bell, a great prospect and can do the job then yes I
>>would consider getting rid of him off the team.  Do you have any examples
>>of this situation?
>
>So, you think that management should get rid of such a player, but you
>don't think it's okay for Derek Bell to think the same thing.
>
>Is that correct?

Yes.  Derek's job is to play when asked to.  If he has a problem with another
player, lack of playing time etc he should speak to the management about 
this.
It is not Derek's job to make decisions about what players the team should
get rid of.  It is the managements job to get and manage the players and it
is the players job to play baseball. 

>
>Sherri Nichols
>snichols@adobe.com
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 1992 21:11:27 EDT
From: Ryan Robbins <IO20456@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: RULEBOOK QUESTION. Ryan, Help Me!

He's out. Hair is counted as part of a player just as the uniform is
when getting hit by a pitch.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: g_waugaman@nac.enet.dec.com (Glenn R. Waugaman)
Subject: Home/road differentials (was ARTIFICIAL TURF: EMBARASSMENT)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 20:18:38 GMT



>> Other teams build their rosters to their ballpark.  The Twins can too; 
>> that's fine.  But what exactly is it about the stadium and the makeup of 
>> the Twins' lineup, though, that has caused the Twins to enjoy the largest
>> home/road differential while in the Metrodome, by far, of all current
>> teams in baseball, beyond the advantage which any other current turf team
>> or power team or speed team has ever enjoyed?  What's the scientific
>> explanation, other than the roof/turf combination?  I don't see anything
>> else about the park that's particularly unusual, and likewise for the
>> Twins' players. 

> I'd like to see some numbers on this.   

Okay, here is the effect that I've been referring to, given by the 
home/road numbers of each MLB team over the period that the Twins have 
been in the Metrodome, 1982-1991.  Note that the difference between the
Twins and the team with the second greatest home/road differential, Kansas
City, is almost as large as the difference between Kansas City and the MLB
average.  If you remove the Twins' numbers, the distribution in home/road
performance is almost perfect (-.11 to +.10); the Twins are off the scale 
at +.18!  Any theories?

1982-91		HOME	AWAY	RATIO

MLB AVE		.542	.458	1.18
 1. Min		.557	.410	1.36
 2. KC		.580	.453	1.28
 3. Hou		.557	.437	1.28
 4. Tex		.523	.411	1.27
 5. Phi		.540	.434	1.24
 6. SF		.547	.443	1.24
 7. NY AL	.566	.460	1.23
 8. Cle		.485	.396	1.23
 9. Det		.581	.479	1.21
10. Bos		.575	.476	1.21
11. Oak		.568	.473	1.20
12. Mil		.546	.460	1.19
13. Chi AL	.546	.461	1.18
14. NY NL	.587	.496	1.18
15. Sea		.488	.413	1.18
16. Chi NL	.528	.447	1.18
17. SD		.536	.461	1.16
18. LA		.562	.488	1.15
19. STL		.556	.489	1.14
20. Bal		.513	.457	1.12
21. Tor		.581	.519	1.12
22. Pit		.517	.467	1.11
23. Atl		.481	.436	1.10
24. Mon		.528	.484	1.09
25. Cal		.532	.491	1.08
26. Cin		.504	.473	1.07

>> An honest question: is there any limit to how far the game can be
>> distorted from the environs it's played in everywhere else, with a
>> justification that it's the team's prerogative to build itself a "home
>> field advantage"? 
>
> Ok, here's another honest question:  How much can a home park be changed
> before all other parks are too foriegn?  It seems to me that if the home
> park was that much different from other parks, the home team would have
> difficulty playing at all other parks.

A fair question, but one that I think there's an obvious enough answer to,
if the effect we're talking about is one of familiarity and adjustment as
opposed to team-building based on the physical (speed on turf, power in
home run parks, etc.).  The team with the foreign home park plays 81 games
a year in the generally uniform road parks it faces, but each individual
opponent only plays 12-13 games in that one foreign road park. 

---
Glenn Waugaman
Digital Equipment Corporation
Littleton, MA
g_waugaman@nac.enet.dec.com
---
From: css.itd.umich.edu!sweda@overmind.mind.org
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Value of Stats
Date: 22 Jul 92 23:52:00 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan ITD Consulting and Support Services
X-mailer: Stadel 3.4a-227
X-Spam-content: irrelevant

In article <Brr235.D8s@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> 
djohnson@cayley.waterloo.edu (David Johnson) writes:
>In article <1992Jul21.160012.29170@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca> 
sinhaa@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (Anand Sinha) writes:
> 
>>Hmm. Whom did the Jays have to play the OF to replace Bell? Syl Campusano? 
>>Rob Ducey? Mookie Wilson? Let's face it, Bell was the 3rd best OF the Jays
>>had in the organisation that could play at the Major League level. He knew 
it.
>>And the Jays knew it.  Now, I don't know Dave Winfield's situation, but 
>>didn't Dave demand to play in the OF 2-3 times during a week? Even though 
he
>>rarely gets to a ball? No, Dave should not play the OF, not with his lack 
of
>>mobility. It is not good for the team for Dave to play the OF. Yet he 
demanded
>>that he play there.  Doesn't seem like he's in it for the best of the team.
>
>If you remember Mookie DH'd quite a bit that season and so by putting Mookie
>in left you improve defense and the offense would remain the same.  Also
             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Speaking as both a Mets fan and as a Mookie Wilson fan I can assure you
that Mookie couldn't throw the ball through a wet paper towel.

>it would have been nice to see Ducey get a chance to play because I think
>that he could be better than average defensively and and OK offensive 
player.
>

Just one question:  Did you believe all that mediot blather about how
Fred McGriff was a "choke" hitter in Toronto because his RBI totals were
low?  If so then I can understand your how you got your opinion about 
George Bell.
From: gritter@cs.purdue.EDU (Carl R. Gritter)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: They're He-eeere...!! (Expos,Expos,Expos)
Date: 29 Jul 92 22:56:33 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, Purdue University

In article  <29JUL199212111077@pavo.concordia.ca> p_emond@pavo.concordia.ca (PATRICK EMOND) writes:
> for his long-term chances, unless the Expos place Owen on the 15-day DL (Foley
> and Barberie could share backup SS duties).

If Cordero continues to play well, it might be the end of the line for
Tom Foley as an Expo.  Since Cordero's defense is erratic and since he's
rather inexperienced (only 20 yrs old), the Expos may send down
Cordero and keep Foley's experience in the lineup.  Of course, the
Expos did the reverse for Rick Cerone (they called up Bob Natal and
then didn't use him ... puzzling ...).  You might see Jerry Willard
(currently at AAA) as the Expos' third catcher before the years out.

> The Expos are showing some interest in getting Frank Tanana from Detroit, but
> are hoping Brian Barnes can perform well enough as #5 starter (Tanana is 38 or
> 39 years old, and would likely cost the Expos a decent prospect) as to make
> the trade unnecessary.

Sheesh, lets hope not.  Its a real reach.  Tanana might do well
against NL hitters the first time around but he might just as easily
get hammered.  I'm sure the Tigers would make a deal for one of the
Expos pitching prospects in a minute.  I would think the Expos would
be better off with Ojeda (although not that much).

> And in case you didn't realize it--THE EXPOS ARE IN FIRST PLACE! (Felt like
> yelling it, hope you don't mind).

Don't mind at all.  Its been a while (Aug 89 during the very painful
Langston saga).  I'm holding my excitement because the Expos have
folded too often in August.  However, this team is playing very well
and really starting to believe in itself.  Delino Deshields has been
playing out of this world and a bullpen led by John Wetteland and Mel
Rojas has been remarkable.  The starting pitching is solid and the
defense above average (esp with Walker and Alou back from injuries).
They're also hitting pretty well (heck, even Wallach is hitting
lately).

Drombrowksi who?

Lets hope the magic continues,
Carl
From: yajima@nttcom.ntt.jp (YAJIMA Hiroshi)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Japan Central League
Date: 27 Jul 92 01:20:29 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: NTT Network Information Systems Labs. Musashino, Tokyo

I am very glad to hear that Katsumi Hirosawa hit a two-run home run and
Tetsuya Iida belted a solo homer as the Yakult Swallows edged the Yomouri 
Giants 3-2 at the Tokyo Dome Sunday.
 With the win, Yakult completed a three-game sweep of the Giants and moved into
the first place in the Central League standings.
 Hirosawa has 14 homers and Iida has six homers this season.
 Yakult Starter Hikaru Takano gave up four hits in six innings to pick up his 
fifth win of the season.
 The Swallows now are a half-game ahead of the second-place Hanshin Tigers.


    |  / __  __/ __  __/ NTT Network Information Syatems Laboratories
  / | /     /       /    Hiroshi Yajima          yajima@nttcom.ntt.jp
_/  _/    _/      _/     TEL: +81 422-59-4256	 FAX: +81 422-59-4254
                         TELEX +72 0282 2620 NTTECL J

--

    |  / __  __/ __  __/ NTT Network Information Syatems Laboratories
  / | /     /       /    Hiroshi Yajima          yajima@nttcom.ntt.jp
_/  _/    _/      _/     TEL: +81 422-59-4256	 FAX: +81 422-59-4254
                         TELEX +72 0282 2620 NTTECL J
From: a_copeab@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Value of Stats
Date: 27 Jul 92 12:34:00 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

In article <1992Jul24.221235.3817@adobe.com>, snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
> In article <3690@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> rrmst3+@pitt.edu (Roberto R Molinari) writes:
>>Just because you can't have first hand knowldege of it doesn't make it okay to
>>ignore it IMHO.
> 
> If I don't have any way of having any sort of accurate knowledge about it,
> then I would be just as well off making things up.  That's the problem.

	Oh, well excuse us, oh Baseball Goddess. From now on we will make sure
we can quote at least a half dozen accurate sources for our posts, and make 
sure we state no opinions, only facts. After all, this newsgroup is for facts,
not opinions.

	Get a life.

Brandon Cope

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball,rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: king@ssvax.gte.com (Larry King)
Subject: Re: JODY REED???
Organization: GTE/SCSD
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 12:31:42 GMT

Jody Reed's wife had a baby girl a couple of days ago.  He should be
back in the lineup either tonight or tomorrow.

--
Larry King
GTE Government Systems, Needham, MA    		(617) 455-3384 
E-Mail : king%ssvax.dnet@get.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball,rec.sport.baseball.fantasy
From: kbos@carina.unm.edu (Kurt Bose "of Biscayzee")
Subject: Re: DICKS THAT SHOULD BE IN OTHER GROUPS
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 20:57:50 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico
Keywords: James D Craft is a DICK

In article <-ma1Hf_kp8@atlantis.psu.edu> whoosh@oggle.zone (The Whooshing Machine) writes:
>In article <92207.044326JIMBO@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, JIMBO@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU writes:
>>I'M SO SICK OF SEEING THIS :=) IN A NEWSGROUP DEVOTED TO
>>THE LOVE OF SPORTS THAT I DEMAND THAT IT CEASES. GOT A PROBLEM ?
>>SEE ME PERSONALLALY!
>
>You seem to be taking things very seriously, asshole.  If you don't like
>what's posted in r.s.b, then don't read it.  It is highly unlikely that you
>are unable to read, anyway.  Perhaps you should read alt.romper.room or
>rec.building.things.with.legos.  In the mean time, you require OGGLEs:
>
>OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE OGGLE         

Y'know, whoosh, I learned that when I was five.  Glad to see you picked it up.

I just got an apology from Mssr. Craft.  Hope to hear yours soon.  Bye, bye.

Oh, BTW, it looks better when you choose a word that doesn't go into 80 evenly.
Makes these *neat* crooked lines.

God, I hope this thread dies soon.

-- 
Kurt Bose (as in Daisy, not Rose) - kbos@carina.unm.edu - I'm not the AntiChrist
I AM a Junior Stathead.  Flame me; it's fun!  I'm a shutmouthed, selfless idiot!
Latest Attempted Compiler of the R.S.BB FAQ - Now Accepting Submissions...(hint)
Have you hugged a Dan Gladden fan today? - Dave Rossing : .456/39/132 at Denver!
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: tkevans@eplrx7.es.duPont.com (Tim Evans)
Subject: Re: Oriole tickets
Reply-To: tkevans@eplrx7.es.dupont.com
Organization: DuPont Engineering Physics Laboratory
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 20:21:09 GMT

josh@loglady.ninds.nih.gov (Joshua (Summer student)) writes:

>I live in the Baltimore area, and I called to get about 4 tickets to a game, and
>the earliest game they had tickets for was around August 25.  Sorry, unless you
>go to the game and try and get them from scalpers...

>good luck

>josh@loglady.ninds.nih.gov

A feeding frenzy has developed for Orioles tickets.  Between the new
ballpark and the unexpected performance of the team, you're lucky
to find tickets to any desirable game.  Tickets can be ordered by
calling (410) 481-SEAT.

You can also get the Baltimore Sun and look in the classified
ads, but you should be prepared to pay scalper prices.  Only
the City of Baltimore has laws against scalping, and this is
pretty much only enforceable in and around the ballpark.  What
kind of deal you make with someone with an ad in the paper
is between you and them.  Good luck.

-- 
Tim Evans                     |    E.I. du Pont de Nemours & Co.
tkevans@eplrx7.es.dupont.com  |    Experimental Station
(302) 695-9353/7395           |    P.O. Box 80357
                              |    Wilmington, Delaware 19880-0357
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: ARTIFICIAL TURF: EMBARASSMENT TO THE GAME
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 16:01:05 GMT

In article <92202.183405IO20456@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> IO20456@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (Ryan Robbins) writes:
>good luck on their side. A guy hits a Baltimore chop that bounces
>twenty feet into the air and travels only sixty feet or so? All
>Boggs could do was run in and wait for the damn thing to come
>down, and even then everyone was safe.

Do you know anything about the history of the name "Baltimore chop"?  

>Why do the Cardinals, the Royals, the Reds, the Pirates, and the
>Phillies (all non-dome teams) elect to have artificial turf? If a
>team is not playing in a dome, then it has no business playing on
>anything but natural grass.

It is a business decision.  The Cardinals, Royals, Reds, and Pirates all
consider themselves regional franchises; that is, they draw their fans from
a larger geographic area than do the teams in say, New York.  As a result,
fans often have to travel quite a distance to go the game.  Artificial turf
increases the likelihood that that trip won't be in vain.

>Since the advent of artificial turf, baseball has really gone down
>the hill. Turf hits are ridiculous! Baseball should ban artificial
>turf from being used in outdoor stadiums. It may be a bit of a dras-
>tic move, no doubt, but necessary to making the game more enjoyable
>to the fans and the players. 

Banning artificial turf wouldn't make the game more enjoyable to me.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com

Organization: Doctoral student, Industrial Administration, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 08:24:40 -0400 
From: Nolan McCarty <nm20+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: All 6th-best team
	<3848@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>



   Stuff about picking 6th best player on each team deleted. 


> Twins: Puckett, Mack, Knoblauch, Smiley, Tapani?
>Expos: Martinez, Hill, DeShields, Walker, Grissom/Barberie/Stairs?
>Texas: Sierra, Palmeiro, Gonzalez, Palmer, Brown  (except they'd have to
>	protect Ryan, or be stormed by irate fans...)
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Let's cut to the chase.  Here's a possible team of 6th-bests:
 
>	C	Sandy Alomar		Indians
>	1B	Kent Hrbek		Twins

    Since I. Rodriguez would not be protected by Texas, wouldn't you
rather have him than Sandy Alomar. While Ivan is not an offensive threat
of the caliber of Tettleton and Hoiles, he sure beats Alomar and I think
he is better defensively.

NOlan
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: stanm@comm.mot.com (Stan Macasieb)
Subject: Game 2: Cubs vs Buckos
Reply-To: stanm@comm.mot.com
Organization: Motorola
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:08:59 GMT

Pittsburgh pitching gets hammered as Mike Morgan pitched seven strong innings
of shutout ball en route to an 11-1 rout of the NLEast-leading Pirates by the
Cubs.

The Lovable Cubables now move to within 4.5 games of first. Les Expos have
a chance of moving within 0.5 games of the Buckos if they beat the Cardinals
tonight. 

Who'd thunk it?

--Stan Macasieb (stanm@comm.mot.com) 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: ak@opal.cs.tu-berlin.de (Andreas Kutschera)
Subject: Re: Red Sox roster moves
Organization: Techn. University of Berlin, Germany
Distribution: fb20
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 10:37:12 GMT

ron@osf.org (Ron Birnbaum) writes:

>In article <1992Jul27.032110.2745@dartvax.dartmouth.edu>, csquared@coos.dartmouth.edu (Christopher M. Cohen) writes:
>|> For anyone who cares, John Marzano and John Valentin have been called up by the
>|> Red Sox, Marzano before this evening's game and Valentin after.  To make room,
>|> John Flaherty was sent to Pawtucket and Tim Naehring was put on the 15 day DL.
>
>  Close!! Upon urging from Sox fan and rec.sport.baseballer Valentine - 
>the Sox are starting John Valentin at Shortstop for tonight's (Monday) game!

... and started a one-game winning streak.
Nowadays you have to be satisfied with very little when you're a RedSox fan :-)

------------------------------------------------------------------
Now that the Sox are 11 games back, I can start concentrating on the upcoming NFL season
What a great September I'll have rooting for the Steelers before I can concentrate on
the upcoming NBA season rooting for Minnesota....
Get ready for spring training by Christmas :-)
all replies to : ak@cs.tu-berlin.de
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"Man throws woman out of window"	- New York Post
"Woman throws man out of window"	- Good Housekeeping
all replies to : ak@opal.cs.tu-berlin.de
From: pcaster@mizar.usc.edu (Dodger)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Offerman, Butler, and Sharperson
Date: 21 Jul 1992 14:11:23 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

Well, you beat me to it.  I was just going to post something
about the rise of Offerman as well.  Quietly, Offerman has
raised his average to a very respectible .272 and he is
hitting right handed pitchers better too.

What I really noticed about the move of Offerman to lead off is 
his great increase in stolen bases.

Also, Offerman seems to have inspired Butler.  Butler was a dismal
11 stolen, 11 caught stealing earlier in the season.  But now
that Offerman is stealing so successfully, he seems to be
putting pressure on Butler, and I think Butler has stolen
8 straight successfully now, giving him something like 19 steals,
11 caught stealing....still not GREAT, but much much better.

Sharperson has been steady all year.  

Do you think the Dodgers' poor defense is catching?  Watching
Howard Johnson play Webster's hit into a triple, I was
reminded of the play of Eric Davis the day before :-)

				BleedsDodgerBlue

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: kettler@pierre.mit.edu (KETTLER, THOMAS R.)
Subject: Re: What happened to Leary???
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: MIT Lab for Nuclear Science
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 18:44:00 GMT

>In article <1992Jul28.190829.27445@europa.asd.contel.com>, king@ssvax.gte.com (Larry King)           writes...
>>	Does anyone know what happened to Tim Leary from the Yankees.  I
>>think he only has one start since the "foreign object" incident and was
>>curious if the Yankees are taking it out on him or what.  Is he hurt,
>>bullpen bound, gone????  E-Mail would be great if you have an answer.
>>Thanks in advance...
>> 
>Maybe the Yankees traded him to the Cubs so that the Cubs could make up the 
>vast pitching hole resulting from the trade of Danny Jackson with the Yankees 
>receiving Luis Salazar in exchange d:;-). (Sorry, I couldn't resist!)

Seriously, I checked yesterday's McPaper since Tuesday's papers have the AL 
team-by-team standings and stats. According to it, Leary's name is still listed
on the Yankee roster. Whether or not he should be is another matter. BTW, I 
have given his stats below compared to the rec.sport.baseball pitching 
favorite, Jim "Ack" Acker since he was released only last week:

		W-L 	ERA	IP	 H	 R	ER	HR	BB    K

Tim Leary	5-6	5.23	93	77	56	54	 8	52   33
Jim Acker	0-0	5.28    30.2	45	19	18	 4	12   11

Leary had been in 15 games and started all of them with 2 CG's while Acker was 
in 17 games as a reliever, finishing 3.

This indicates that Tim just must try to harder by giving up more homer's to 
achieve the cult following of Acker. Unfortunately, the Yankees just won't let 
him pitch anymore d::-(.

					Sincerely yours,

					Thomas R. Kettler "Expos Fanatic"
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: dtate+@pitt.edu (David M Tate)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Value of Stats
Date: 24 Jul 92 17:36:04 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Factors of Ys, Inc.

In article <BrwHpK.45L@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> djohnson@cayley.waterloo.edu (David Johnson) writes:
>
>You are probably right that nobody gets along with everybody but there are
>many people who never create problems when this occurs.

HOW DO YOU KNOW?

This is the third time I've asked this question, and you've ducked it every
time.  If you *don't* know, just say so.


-- 
        David Tate         |  "Complacencies of the fungo, and late 
  dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu  |   Infield and B.P. in a sunny field
     "Sunday Afternoon"    |   [...]         mingle to dissipate
  Wallace "Vern" Stevens   |   The holy hush of Pastime National..."