HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dfs@doe.carleton.ca (David F. Skoll)
Subject: Iran bombs "guerilla" bases in Iraq
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 18:55:07 GMT

According to CBC news, Iranian planes bombed what they called
"guerilla" bases in Iraq said to be used by the Mujahadin (sp?)
opposition to the Iranian regime.

Looks like another country besides Israel bombs "guerilla" bases,
in other countries, eh Brad?

I wonder if Mr. Hernlem will condemn this bombing and violation
of Iraq's sovereignty with the vigour with which he condemns similar
Israeli actions?  Will he condemn the terrorist attacks on Iranian
embassies with the same feebleness as the attack on the Israeli
embassy?

We shall see.

--
                     |         | "Step up and shake the hand
David F. Skoll       | ||||||| |  Of someone you can't stand,
|_ _ _  __   __ _ __ |  \\V//  |  You can tolerate him if you try..."
 / |  | |_|   | |  | |  __|__  |  -- Tom Lehrer, "National Brotherhood Week"
_____|________________________________________________________________________
From: naftaly@supergas.ingr.com (Naftaly Stramer)
Subject: Re: Undercover Agents
Reply-To: naftaly@dazixco.ingr.com
Organization: Dazix
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 15:24:29 GMT


In article <1992Apr6.172135.24308@ncsu.edu>, hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem) writes:
>
>PALESTINIANS ACCUSE ISRAELI ARMY UNDERCOVER AGENTS FOR "COLD-BLOODED" KILLINGS
>
>OCCUPIED JERUSALEM, Sun. (AFP)
>
>A growing number of Palestinians are accusing Israeli Army undercover
>units of killing Arab suspects in cold blood, a charge denied by the
>Israeli military which sees the force as an efficient deterrent to
>anti-Israeli activity.
>
>"You cannot kill somebody only becuase he is wanted. There is a law to
>be respected," charged Faisal Husseini, an advisor to the Palestinian
>team at Arab-Israeli peace talks.
>
>Husseini last week accused the special units -- troops disguised as
>Arabs -- of "executing instead of arresting" at least 18 Palestinian
>suspects since December 9. His Arab Studies Center reported that 69 were
>killed from January 1989 until December last year.
>

Hundreds of Arabs were murdered by their brothers in the West Bank & Gazza. I
didn't hear Mr. Husseni condemning those murders. I didn't hear Mr. Husseni
saying "You cannot kill somebody only becuase he is wanted" on those murders.

--
Naftaly Stramer (303)530-0441, FAX (303)581-0106    DAZIX, An Intergraph Company
Internet: naftaly@dazixco.ingr.com                  6285 Lookout Road    
UUCP: ..uunet!ingr!dazixco!naftaly  	            Boulder, CO 80301
Please excuse my English
From: gross@befvax.uchicago.edu
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Marwan GET A LIFE
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:41:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: midway.1992Apr13.204158.1671
Reply-To: gross@befvax.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago, Dept of Molecular Genetics

In article <14675@vela.acs.oakland.edu>, rwstarke@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Ross W. Starkey) writes:
>>The sceen was about two brothers from Nablus (Nablus==Jabal El-Nar==the
>>mountainf fire) running with fear from 7-8 Israeli soldiers who finally
>>captured them ... The reporter was probably hiding on an adjacent hill, so
>>the sceen looked like taken from a distance ... One of the soldiers looked
>>all around him to see that there is nobody seeing him (the stupid did not
>>see the reporter and the camera) and after that the 5 DEVILS started their
>>evil business ... 2 of the Devils held the arab teenager, one pressed him
>>firmly to the ground and the other twisted the boy's arm and extended his
>>elbow behind his back ... Another Devil looked around him and found a huge
>>rock on the ground, he picked it up, and then with all his force, he lifted
>>it high up and slamed it to the poor guys hand ... For those pro-Israelis,
>>I want to say that the devil hit the boy on his Elbow ... GOD ... THE
>>ELBOW ... I sware to god that I felt that stone on my elbow as I was 
>>watching the scene ... The scene was so unpleasent to watch that I could
>>not bear to continue to see it ... I jumped and went streight to my room.
>
>OK, Marwan, this shit is getting annoying.  I demand one thing.  SHOW
>DOCUMENTATION.  Your racist garbage is sufficiently obnoxious that I 
>will state right here.
>
>I BELIEVE MARWAN GHARAYBEH MADE THIS UP.
>
>I demand documentation from a credible source.  Not the Saudi Daily
>Journal, not the PLO Monthly,  I want a Western daily, weekly, or monthly. 
>NYT, Newsweek, the Economist, US News & World report.  When you provide
>a source and reference so I may look it up, then I will respond.  NOT
>until then.

CBS news.  Shown on Israeli TV.  Caused quite an outcry among Israelis,
as this kind of stuff hadn't been shown before, lead to an investigation,
and reconsideration of Israel's policy dealing with protestors.
Look at previous posts.  I already commented on this, and someone else said 
they saw it in an Israeli newspaper.  Marwan probably has done some 
editorializing, (I don't think the rocks were that big, and the beating
might have been done by clubs) but this is not made up.
Marwan and I don't agree on much, and quite often disagree in not
so pleasant ways  so don't flame me for this.
(You can check this if you have records of older posts)

>-- 
>Ross Starkey                         "Of course you know, this means WAR." 
>rwstarke@vela.acs.oakland.edu        "This whole thing is goony, I shou'da
>                                      stood in bed!"  "Gruesome, isn't it?"
>FIGHT DICTATORSHIP!  VOTE!!!!                                  --Bugs Bunny

Leon Gross
I'm not an actor, but I play one on TV.
From: aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Anisa Alnoor Aldoubosh)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: ARAFAT ALIVE-PLO BLAMES MOSSAD?!?
Date: 16 Apr 92 21:36:04 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado at Denver

In article <1992Apr14.024911.1015199@locus.com> jle@locus.com (John Elghani/10000000) writes:
>
>... I don't think the'd kill him.   In fact probably the Mossad helped
>find him.   If that is not true, why didn't they kill him when he
>was evicted twice from Beirut and Tripoli ports?

I agree.  If the Mossad really wanted Arafat, he wouldn't be with us today.
Someone told me that the reason why the Mossad has not taken Arafat 'out' is
for the simple reason that they don't want him to be considered a martyr by
the Palestinians.  But given the Mossad's dirty, deceitful, and bloody past,
it does surprise one to hear that Arafat is still alive after that ordeal.

Anisa

	"From a distance we all have enough, and no one is
	in need.  And there are no guns, no bombs, and no
	disease - no hungry mouths to feed.  From a distance
	we are instruments - marching in a common land.  Playing
	songs of hope, playing songs of peace, there the songs
	of every man.
			"From A Distance" B.Midler
From: hernlem@che13.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Israel Accused Of Gunning Down Activists
Date: 6 Apr 92 14:07:34 GMT
Reply-To: hernlem@che13.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem)
Organization: North Carolina State University

In article <cubsfan.702336098@camelot>, cubsfan@camelot.bradley.edu
(Michael Silverman) writes:
> In <1992Apr3.163711.3172@ncsu.edu> hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad
Hernlem) writes:
> 
> 
> >PALESTINIANS ACCUSE ISRAEL OF GUNNING DOWN ACTIVISTS
> 
> >OCCUPIED JERUSALEM, Fri. (UPI)
>  ^^^^^^^^
> 
> The UPI news wires do not include this word. This is something called
> "editorializing" and UPI does not do that. Brad, its fine that you report
> these news items, but do you have to embellish them, and not only that,
> but make your additions indistinguishable from the original text of the
> UPI story.

I don't get these stories from the "wires". This is exactly the way the
story appeared in the newspaper. If I change anything or leave something
out I somehow make a note of that fact but I usually present news
postings exactly as I read them.

Brad Hernlem (hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: U.S. Aid To Israel?????
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Date: 14 Apr 92 20:16:44 GMT
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department

In article <204557@unix.cis.pitt.edu> abas@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Jasem Alhumoud) writes:
>
>Subject: U.S. Aid To Israel?????
>                
>
>           Discovering the Victims of the U.S. Aid to Israel
>
>                  " By Eleni Katsoulakis"
>

[...fictional, hate-inspiring article deleted...]

>
>  "Eleni Katsoulakis, a journalist in her native Greece, is a free-lance
>   writer presently living in New Jersey."
>
>
>                  Jasem (Dr. J.)

I have not been able to find this "Eleni Katsoulakis" in the phone directory
with New Jersey Bell.  It appears that the author of this vile article may 
well be as imaginary as the article itself.

Dr. J. Alhumoud , don't let this stop you.  Why not send the article to 
B-CPU?  They often print fictional articles written by people hiding 
behind imaginary names.  You might even get $50,000 for it and an honorary 
membership in the IHR!!!  You're just their type.

-- 
Jake Livni  jake@bony1.bony.com    
American-Occupied New York
My opinions only - employer has no opinions.
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:10377 soc.culture.arabic:1856 soc.culture.lebanon:2140
From: souissi@ei.ecn.purdue.edu (Ridha Souissi)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.lebanon
Subject: Re: Death Squads in Occupied Territories
Date: 7 Apr 92 22:52:54 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <JIME.92Apr7173950@bullwinkle.atc.ll.mit.edu> jime@bullwinkle.atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert x6127 g41) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.182432.27791@cs.brown.edu> dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:
>>   The people who are murdered are people who cooperate with Israel,
>>   and Israel has no reason to want them dead. Palestinian extremists
>>   do, and they kill them brutaly.
>>
>>   I don't know the current number, but in March the NY Times gave the number
>>   of Palestinians killed by Palestinians as 54. It is three time more
>>   than the number of people killed by the IDF in riots (I don't know
>>   the number of Israelis, including the brave Muslem guy killed by
>>   the Jaffa slasher, who were killed by terrorists. I can think
>>   of 6 right now, there are probably more, maybe someone
>>   has the exact number?).
>
>This Palestinian killing Palestinian is not dissimilar to the Zionist
>killing Zionist violence which occurred during the British Palestinian
>mandate.  Different factions disagreed on how to push towards an
>independent state, and the disagreement led to murders.
>
>As it turns out, one of the favorite way one Zionist murdered another
>in those days was simply to inform on him to the British.  This would
>result in arrest, confinement, execution, or just the elimination of
>his cover.  Any of these outcomes accomplished the goal of removing
>the offending individual from the scene.
>
>How much do Palestinians inform on each other to the Israeli
>occupation, I wonder?  Probably enough so that it gives the Israelis a
>real tool against the local instigators.
>
>Such violence between factions of a disappropriated group are common:
>the Palestinians, the pre-Israel Zionists, the Afghan "freedom
>fighters", and the South African blacks have all fought each other
>even when their common goal has (had) not been achieved (yet).
>

I don't think the Palestinians  who are collaborating with Israel have the
same goals as those who are resisting the Israeli occupation.

>--
>=Jim  jime%atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: rivk@quads.uchicago.edu (nora gayle rivkis)
Subject: Feminism Meets Terrorism
Reply-To: rivk@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 02:43:28 GMT

In article <1992Apr3.195626.29417@bony1.bony.com> jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni) writes:
>In article <1992Apr1.143612.16645@ncsu.edu> hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem) writes:

>>I guess that in Jake's mind women bear
>>children and children grow up to become terrorists so killing women and
>>children "is a legitimate preventative measure, or something along those
>>lines." 

>You guess wrong, Ali.  Shouldn'a relied on your buddy Ahmed.

Is there a reason why the two of you seem to regard killing women as
worse than killing men?

Just curious.

>Jake Livni

	-Nora
-- 
Oseh shalom b'imromav, hu ya'aseh shalom aleinu v'al kol yisrael.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (perlman eric)
Subject: Re: PROMINENT IRANIAN BAHA'I EXECUTED
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 17:36:31 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.094324.13245@fmg.bt.co.uk> ghbr@fmg.bt.co.uk (Hossein Bagherzadeh Rafsanjani) writes:
>In article <1992Apr15.141837.11548@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> sethr@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (seth.r.rosenthal) writes:
>
>But you should ask yourself this: Should such an eventuality takes place in
>Palestine, who would be ultimately responsible?  Certainly not the PLO who has
>called for over twenty years for a secular and democratic Palestaine in which
>all dominations (Jews, Moslems Christians etc) could live together with equal
>rights - a call to be brutually suppressed by the Israeli government.  The rise
>of fundamentalism in Palestine (as well as in Iran and elsewhere) should be
>blamed first and foremost on the governments in power who have used all means
>of oppression against demands for a more just and democratic society with equal
>rights and political freedom for all people regardless of their faith or race.

Just a little honesty, please.  The PLO's "call" is about as fallacious
and fraudulent as can be, as its actions through the years demonstrate.
Bombing Synagogues in Europe, for example?  Is this an act demonstrating
equality of rights for all religions?  Or how about bringing down
civilian airliners?  Attacking Embassies?  The claim above is just
ridiculous.

-- 
"How sad to see/A model of decorum and tranquillity/become like any other sport
A battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee." -Tim Rice,"Chess"
     Eric S. Perlman  <perlman@qso.colorado.edu> or <eric@lyra.Colorado.EDU> 
  Center for Astrophysics and Space Astronomy, University of Colorado, Boulder
From: souissi@ei.ecn.purdue.edu (Ridha Souissi)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: U.S. Aid To Israel?????
Date: 8 Apr 92 17:19:09 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <dfs.702741356@lore> dfs@doe.carleton.ca (David F. Skoll) writes:
>Yeah, yeah, Brad Hernlem already posted it.  Do you think if you say it
>twice that more people will believe it?
>

I for one didn 't read it when it was first posted by Brad as
you claim.  So saying it twice may benefit those who didn't
see it the first time.

>--
>                     |         | "Step up and shake the hand
>David F. Skoll       | ||||||| |  Of someone you can't stand,
>|_ _ _  __   __ _ __ |  \\V//  |  You can tolerate him if you try..."
> / |  | |_|   | |  | |  __|__  |  -- Tom Lehrer, "National Brotherhood Week"
>_____|________________________________________________________________________
>
Organization: Bar-Ilan University Computing Center, Israel
Date: Monday, 13 Apr 1992 09:03:30 IST
From: Hank Nussbacher <HANK@BARILVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Israelis debug Patriot software

>The following article in a recent comp.risks posting demonstrates the
>American and Israeli co-operation in field testing weapons systems.
..
>Isn't that something?!  Israeli software engineers fixing problems to
>safeguard Saudi military targets!

I'll share what I already sent to Risks:
 Let me quote three more sections from that report:

 "First, the Patriot was not equipped with an embedded (internal) data
 recorder to retain system performance information.  Second, although
 portable, external data recorders were available, US commanders
 decided not to use them because they believed the recorders could cause
 an unanticipated system shutdown.  However, Israeli commanders used
 data recorders on the Patriot systems they controlled and provided
 this data to the US Army." For which they were most graciously
 thanked in the US media recently - Hank

 "Army officials said they believed the Israeli experience was atypical -
 they assumed other Patriot users were not running their systems for
 8 or more hours at a time."

 "On February 21, 1991, the Patriot Project Office sent a message to
 Patriot users stating that very long run times could cause a shift in the
 range gate, resulting in the target being offset.  The message also
 said a software change was being sent that would improve the system's
 targeting.  However, the message did not specify what constitutes very
 long run times.  According to Army officials, they presumed that the
 users would not continuously run the batteries for such extended periods
 of time that the Patriot would fail to track targets.  Therefore, they
 did not think that more detailed guidance was required."

 Risks:

 1) Using 1970s computers in 1990s battlefields.
 2) Ignoring or downplaying warnings from allies.
 3) Allies in the future may not be so quick and willing to share
    learnt information based on the method the US found to thank
    Israel for sharing Patriot information.
 --
>Jake Livni

 Hank Nussbacher
 Bar-Ilan University
 Israel
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: bc744@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Ira Kaufman)
Subject: Re: LYING BY OMISSION!
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 92 12:26:00 GMT


   That's all VERY interesting, Brendan.  But one cannot substitute
personal attacks for responding to the points raised in this flame.
Analyzing a book, without having read it, is not a very good way to
enhance one's intellectual image.  Do you think that you might, along
with the insults, at least TRY to respond to the points raised.  If
you cannot remember them, I shall refresh your memory.

1.  The United Nations Partition Plan of 1947.
2.  The Arab partition was larger than the currently disputed areas.
3.  The Arab world rejected the partition.
4.  The armies of several Arab nations attacked the Jews, killing
    about 6,000.
5.  The opening up of Jerusalem for all religions, ONLY AFTER Israel
    reunited the city in 1967
6.  The Arab world changing its mind about the territory, AFTER the
    Jews developed the area.

And I have not misquoted you, as you erroneously claim.  I am simply
accusing you of omitting from your discussion of the issue, facts 
that show a very different picture than the one you are trying to
create.  The above items are not opinions.  They are statements of
fact.  If they are incorrect, then say so.  If they are correct then
be man enough to take them into account in your discussions.  If you
do not refute them or respond to them in your discussion, then it may
be assumed that you have an agenda that cannot withstand the ravages
of historical fact.  I do not claim that the Palestinians are not a
victimized people.  I merly point out that the Arab world itself has
been responsible for more Palestinian displacement and suffering than
the State of Israel.  If you don't believe me, just look at one little
piece of data.  Who do you think has killed omre Palestinians since
the beginning of the intifada?  The Israelis or the Arabs themselves?
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: WHAT I MEAN!
Date: 7 Apr 92 22:44:14 GMT
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department

In article <1992Apr6.063011.12365@newshost.anu.edu.au> bdm@cs.anu.edu.au writes:
>
>In article 16840@usenet.ins.cwru.edu, bc744@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Ira Kaufman) writes:
>>
>>   When I made a statement about what is actually Jordan, I was
>>not precise enough for many of you to know what I meant.  Today
>>what we refer to as Jordan contains much more land that could
>>be called Palestine than all of Israel.  
>
>Not you too!  This a MYTH.  

Not you, again.  You're a KOOK!

>>So I feel that the drive
>>for a homeland for the Palestinians must include some land that
>>is currently called Jordan.  If one does not acknowledge ALL of 
>>the historical Palestine, then the drive for a homeland for the
>>Palestinians again takes on an anti-Israel hue.  When the drive
>>for a Palestinian state does not include land that is currently
>>in Jordan, this is not fair to Israel and, by logical extention,
>>will never be well received by Israel.
>
>If the self-defined group which today calls itself "The Palestinians"
>includes a large number of people whose roots (not just refugee
>status) are on the east of the Jordan River, then it is reasonable
>that they include that fraction of Jordan in their land claims.
>You haven't established the "if" part, so the "then" part is not
>yet imperative.    

The "if" HAS been established.  Otherwise, why are no land concessions 
being demanded of Jordan in the current peace/land talks?  Why is 
Jordan permitted to reach peace with Palestineans by driving tens
of thousands of them to refuge in Lebanon, with nary a word of 
re-compensation of their stolen land, while Israel is being asked 
to reach peace via land-concessions?

If the Palestinean Arabs get land from Israel without getting their
land back from Jordan, there will STILL be no peace in the Middle East.
And it won't be Israel's fault.

-- 
Jake Livni
jake@bony1.bony.com
My opinions only - employer has no opinions.
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Terrorism
Date: 9 Apr 92 22:31:13 GMT
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department

In article <2463@creatures.cs.vt.edu> sahle@csgrad.cs.vt.edu (Eskinder Sahle) writes:
>In article <1992Apr5.090216.7127@midway.uchicago.edu> rivk@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>>In article <1992Apr3.190515.28427@bony1.bony.com> jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni) writes:
>
>>>You must love arguing, Ahmed.
>>>Jake Livni
>>
>>Of course he does. All of us do; why else do we play on the net? ;-)
>>	-Nora
>
>
>But Nora: haven't you realized that Jake never argues?  Seriously.
>I have yet to see the guy actually engage himself in an argument.

This is because you are blind to both fact and logic.

>Up to now, the only thing he has been able to provide us with are
>sarcastic statements that at times turn nasty in their cheapness.
>Not much more.

When you have something reasonable to discuss, by all means, bring 
it up.  Until then, you are typing straight into the bit-bucket....

-- 
Jake Livni
jake@bony1.bony.com
My opinions only - employer has no opinions.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: dfs@doe.carleton.ca (David F. Skoll)
Subject: Re: U.S. Aid To Israel?????
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 13:35:21 GMT

In <1992Apr08.165203.192872@cs.cmu.edu> anwar+@cs.cmu.edu (Anwar
Mohammed) writes:

>Well, Israel is harboring suspects in the terrorist killing of Alex 
>Odeh, ADC founder.  I don't know if the U.S. has requested extradition
>yet, but don't the U.S. and Israel have an extradition treaty?

Someone on the news group about 1.5 years ago said that the suspects
in the Odeh case are believed to be in the West Bank, and that for the
U.S. to request extradition would be tantamount to recognizing
Israel's sovereignty over the WB.  I must admit it sounds doubtful to
me, but that could be the reason.

--
                     |         | "Step up and shake the hand
David F. Skoll       | ||||||| |  Of someone you can't stand,
|_ _ _  __   __ _ __ |  \\V//  |  You can tolerate him if you try..."
 / |  | |_|   | |  | |  __|__  |  -- Tom Lehrer, "National Brotherhood Week"
_____|________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast