HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: loosemore-sandra@cs.yale.edu (Sandra Loosemore)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Beginning a classical collection
Date: 1 Jan 1993 22:30:15 -0500
Organization: staff hacker @ Yale Haskell project
	<Dec.30.01.14.07.1992.15387@pilot.njin.net>
	<1993Jan2.010949.22900@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: functor.systemsz.cs.yale.edu
In-reply-to: lungtt@gus.ecn.purdue.edu's message of Sat, 2 Jan 1993 01:09:49 GMT

lungtt@gus.ecn.purdue.edu (Terence T. Lung) writes:

   >But no one has yet mentioned one seemingly obvious thing to do: go to
   >some concerts!
   Wow!  I don't think so unless you know what you're doing.
   Do you have $$$ to spare for this?

Concerts don't have to be a costly experience, especially if you live
in a college town.  Here at Yale, most concerts and recitals sponsored
by the music department are either free or charge <$5 admission, and
sometimes there are four or five of them in a single week.  I'd have
to say that the Yale student orchestras are at least as good as the
local professional group, and their programming is certainly more
adventurous.

-Sandra
From: jiu1@husc11.harvard.edu (Haibin Jiu)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: RFV: BRUCKNER RE: THE BEST
Date: 1 Jan 93 20:39:00 GMT
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

In article <1992Dec27.173906.16090@athena.mit.edu> syliao@athena.mit.edu (Stan Yi-Huang Liao) writes:
>The 8th is also a great one.  I love its finale!

The 8th is IMHO very bad because it is full of trite passages.

>Now there are at least three of us on this net who like Bruckner's
>music.  So we are expecting 297 votes on the "other side" now.

Pardon me but personally I think he really sucks.

HBJ
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: Greatest Conductors: Why?
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 22 Dec 92 19:14:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.123351.17765@visual.com> rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel) writes:
>Brian Haag writes:
>
>> I would
>>say that Bernstein ranks as one of my favorite conductors for those moments
>>when he creates an incredible electricity. 
>
>And I'd say I agree entirely.  
>  
>  Rob recommends some seekable Bernstein performances.
>

I want to add a couple of wonderful Bernstein-conducted performances to
seek out.

1.  Haydn Masses "Paulenemasse" or "Mass in the Time of War"
                 "Nelson Mass"  and Symphony 88.
                  -  Some real lively performances of great pieces.
                     On Sony mid-price - 2CDs (in this Prince of 
		     Wales set).

2.  Milhaud - "La Creation du Monde", " 4 Brazilian Dances",  
              "La Bouef sur le Toit".  Really terrific performances of
               of some jazz/latin-inspired music.  This CD is so much
               fun.  Typically, I'm very pleased with Bernstein's 
               performances of 20th Century dance music.  He brings a
               a lively, rythhmic punch to this music.  

John D.




Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Subject: beethoven late string qua
Reply-To: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 29 Dec 92 18:41:37 EST

JG>Steve Monroe (v035550@stortek.com) wrote:
  >: I am interested in opinions on recordings of Beethoven's
  >: "late" string quartets.

JG>: Favourites? recordings to avoid, etc.

Here is music equivalent to one of the Seven Wonders of the World. There
certainly are performances which don't do them justice but I think you'd
have a hard time finding a professional performance that managed to
*mask* this music's essence.

I heard the Bartok Quartet in one of these a few seasons back ...
haven't heard their (now oldish) recordings reissued on Hungaraton but
I'd expect at a good price you'll encounter highly idiomatic playing.

The Alban Berg Quartet on EMI were celebrated in some circles. I haven't
heard these recordings but I have found this ensemble a bit thin on
musical interpretation despite virtuosic talents.

The Amadeus Quartet are often overlooked because they were just around
for so long. They were outstanding Beethoven players. You might be lucky
enough to find their whole cycle for not much more than the late cycle
by a full-priced group.

I'll second the nomination for the Vegh Quartet. Decent notes, too. They
have a good sense of "brooding" in the moments called for.

Quartetto Italiano are at their best in the late cycle but I've always
*respected* this set more than *loved* it.

The mono Budapest cycle from the Library of Congress (c 1953), last on
Odyseey LPs, hasn't made it to CD yet. It will be a *top* contender when
it does.

And run, don't walk, to any store selling portions of the Busch cycle
recorded mainly in the mid-30s for EMI (and as late as the mid-40s on
Columbia). In fact, the Busch are a top drawer recommendation in any
chamber music from the mainstream Austrian/German repertoire such as
Beethoven, Schubert and Brahms.

Lastly, for an interesting peek into 19th century performance practice,
have a look at the Rose Quartet on Biddulph. Recorded in 1927, there is
one quartet from each of Beethoven's "periods". Formed in 1881, this
Quartet *premiered* works by Brahms, Schoenberg and others. The notes by
Tully Porter are fascinating; the sound is quite good for its time. It's
a much more enlightening "time capsule" than, say, the Busch recordings,
from the point of view of 19th century interpretations.

Alexander Inglis  |  InterNet: alexander.inglis@canrem.com
Toronto,  Canada  |  CompuServe: 70307,20     BIX: ainglis
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Friday, 25 Dec 1992 17:44:23 CST
From: Howard Wachtel <U13054@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: HELP: music quiz

In article <1992Dec22.000824.18082@csis.dit.csiro.au>, tsui@csis.dit.csiro.au
(Kenneth Tsui) says:
>
>I need help to answer the following for a music quiz. Some of the questions
>are quite interesting. I'll post the answers when they come out in Feburary.
>
>Thanks.

>5. What composer was the greatest chess player of his day?

   That was Philidor, known for the opening that bears his name.

   Now I've got one for you--what chess grandmaster is also one of the
world's top flute players?

>12. Which composer died after wounding himself while conducting?
>

   Jean-Baptiste Loully.
________________________________________________________________
Howard K. Wachtel              University of Illinois at Chicago
U13054@UICVM.CC.UIC.EDU        Phone (312) 975-7970
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu (Bob Kosovsky)
Subject: Re: NEW New Grove?
Reply-To: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu
Organization: Computer Center, CUNY Graduate School, New York NY 10036
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 14:55:28 GMT

>In article <1992Dec20.062000.7076@news.columbia.edu>,
>gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener) wrote:
>> 
>> An article in the Dec. 13 Washington Post apparently intimated that there
>> might be a new edition of the New Grove before the end of the decade.  
>> Not having procured a copy of the article yet (one is on its way to me), 
>> I'm not sure what was said, but I'm curious if anyone knows what the
>> official word here is.
>> 
>> As I understand it, the last revision took a decade.  I know they've been
>> spending much time on the new Opera dictionary, so I'm wondering what might
>> be the earliest we'd see a New New Grove?  Is 7 years really enough time
>> for another revision?  Or was the Post being optimistic?

I spoke to somone who worked for Grove (until 2 months ago).  She confirmed
that yes, there are two projects:  to make a new edition of the entire
Grove, and to investigate the feasibility of putting the current edition
(6th) on CD-ROM.

Bob Kosovsky
Graduate Center -- Ph.D. Program in Music(student)/ City University of New York
New York Public Library -- Music Division
bitnet:   kos@cunyvms1.bitnet        internet: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu
Disclaimer:  My opinions do not necessarily represent those of my institutions.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: sampson@nosc.mil (Charles H. Sampson)
Subject: Ozawa
Organization: Computer Sciences Corporation
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 21:10:08 GMT

     In a recent thread on Greatest Living Conductors, one respondent
placed Ozawa near the very bottom of his list.  I have to agree.  I
never cease to be amazed at the breadth of styles that he manages to
mangle.  Yet he continues on, conducting all over the world.  Clearly
there are some Ozawa fans out there.  What kind of music does he do
well?  Are there any particular recordings that show his "talent" in
a favorable light?

				Charlie
From: rwilmer@gateway (R. Wilmer)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: SURVEY: FAVORITE PIANO CONCERTO
Date: 21 Dec 92 23:55:21 GMT
Organization: Mitre Corporation, McLean, VA

In article <BzLuKw.BDI.1@cs.cmu.edu> indira+@cs.cmu.edu (Indira Subramanian) writes:
>
>In article <1992Dec21.011843.3283@cronkite.ocis.temple.edu> zorro@picasso.ocis.temple.edu (John Grabowski) writes:
>>
>>I must admit I'm starting to enjoy these "Greatest All-Time" and "Favorite" 
>>threads, so I'm starting another one.  :-)   The question is, What is your
>>favorite piano concerto?
>>
>>And a very important sub-question: What's your favorite *Beethoven* piano 
>>concerto?
>

With me they are the same question.  Probably Beethoven's 3 (although
I feel the 4th and 5th are just as great.

I think the 3rd was the concerto I have heard first, have heard most
often, and continue to enjoy the most.

I love it for the same reason I love Il Trovatore:  its invigorating
energy that leaps at the listener or the performer.
I think Verdi and Beethoven convey energy more than any other
composers (perhaps along with Handel) the way Shakespeare does among
writers.

To answer the questions about who is a musician and a pianist, I am
an opera singer, but have worked as a pianist and I find the Beethoven
3rd tremendously stimulating to play.  Most of it falls very easily
under the hands.

In one of Nadia Boulanger's courses we studied all of the Mozart
Piano Concertos.  During that course we had a conducting contest
of her students that was won through student applause by John 
Elliot Gardner--at the time, he did not use the Elliot--over Brazilian
and Greek students.  They all conducted one of the earlier concertos.

The most memorable performances of concertos I heard live were:

Rubinstein:  Brahms' First and Second
Rubinstein:  Beethoven Fourth 

My favorite recordings of piano concertos are:

Serkin:  Beethoven's Third
Serkin:  Mendelssohn's First and Second

Other favorite concertos are:

Mozart d minor op 466
Mozart a major op 488 (love the Horowitz video & recording of it)

That early lively Shostakovitch concerto (1 or 2).

I like the traditional romantic and Russian concertos, but for
me they do not keep their freshness the way the Beethoven
and Mozart do after many many hearings.

Richard
From: 00hfstahlke@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: New archive of Russian recordings
Date: 21 Dec 92 18:03:06 GMT
Organization: Ball State University, Muncie, In - Univ. Computing Svc's

I heard a report on PBS last night that the Russians have opened up a fantastic
(a word I normally avoid) archive of old recordings including, for example,
Shostakovich performing his Op. 87 preludes and fugues, and many other
wonderful and unheard treasures.  The report also mentioned a Western audio
company working with them and the very high quality remastering that the
Russians can do.  Does anyone know when and how any of this will be made
available?  Or what delights we can look for to come from it?

Herb Stahlke
Ball State University
From: thomast@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Thomas Kaeppel Tsukada)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Stephen Albert
Date: 29 Dec 92 22:48:50 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor


I heard on the radio yesterday that composer Stephen Albert had
died in an auto accident in Massachusetts.  He was fifty-one.  
Several of his compositions were connected to the works of
James Joyce (To Wake the Dead, Symphony RiverRun, TreeStone,
and Flower of the Mountain).  I like his music very much.  It's
a tragedy that he should die so young.

Tom Tsukada
Real-Time Computing Lab
University of Michigan
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg)
Subject: Re: Berg
Originator: brad@buck
Organization: Viewlogic Systems, Inc.
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 21:59:02 GMT


In article <1992Dec22.190135.17394@Princeton.EDU>, mikulska@comet.Princeton.EDU (Margaret Mikulska) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec22.173348.9371@viewlogic.com> brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg) writes:

|> >Of course, the music is not exactly melodic in the old fashioned sense,
|> >with Berg following the 12 tone model. 
|> 
|> Not in WOZZECK.  There is no "12 tone model" in this opera - it's a
|> freely atonal work.  (LULU is dodecaphonic, though.)
|> 
I didn't really mean "12 tone" in the sense of the term that you evidently
thought I meant. To me, "12 tone" means "no key", ergo "atonal". I thought
there was some special term, something other than "12 tone" or "dodecaphonic"
to describe the technique whereby no pitch may be repeated until all 12 have
been used. Perhaps I am imagining this.

You're entirely correct that the "no pitch repeat" rule does not apply to 
Wozzeck; pitches are repeated frequently, to great effect, throughout the
opera.

- BK
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley)
Subject: Re: CD inserts.
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 20:15:50 GMT

> B. Narasimhan writes:
>
> Certain labels like Archiv, DG, to name two, include excellent
> historical material in their CD inserts on the composers. Others
> don't, although RCA and CBS seem to be improving.  However, I am
> always frustrated by the fact that not much info is included about
> the performers or the orchestra.  I have the whole set of 9 Beethoven
> symphonies by Roger Norrington and it has some info on him and his
> orchestra repeated in all of the CD's.
>

The Glenn Gould edition has a blab in every CD released so far about the
20-bit sound used to refurbish the recordings. As well, Gould's often amusing
liner notes are not reprinted verbatim.
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: Jenufa at the Met
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 29 Dec 92 23:31:16 GMT

In article <FgR9VB1w165w@dorsai.com> shire@dorsai.com (Kenneth Shire) writes:
>Chris I>Rysanek...another universe, etc.
>
>  [Praises for the Met's Jenufa.
>

Unfortunately, we in the provinces can't easily get to New York
to see an opera.  But, luckily, we have the "Live at the Met" 
radio broadcasts.  So, I got to hear the last two acts of
"Jenufa" with the acoustics of my luxury Tercel.  And, it was
magnificent.  It's my first hearing of "Jenufa" and I'm anxious
to hear it again and again.  

I'd say it's pretty hard to listen to an opera for the first
time on the radio, no visual cues or libretto to help follow 
the action.  It didn't matter though.  The score and 
(judging from Chris and Kenneth's comments) the performances
were so outstanding that I just had to add my praises.  

John D.
From: ST801578@brownvm.brown.edu (Calvin Lee)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: NEW New Grove?
Date: 22 Dec 92 04:08:23 GMT
Organization: Brown University - Providence, Rhode Island  USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: brownvm.brown.edu
News-Software: BNN via BNN_POST v1.0 beta

How much does the new New Grove cost?

-Calvin Lee
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,rec.music.early
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: RFV: Bruckner Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 19:13:24 GMT

sowhat@gphs.vuw.ac.nz (Christian Zick) writes:
[....]
: I also had a record with organ music from Bruckner, which I sold later on. 
: Although I am almost addicted to organ music, I did not find anything
: beyond sweet-humming noise in his organ compositions.

Well it is generally acknowledged that Bruckner's organ music is
second-rate, because his finest work was improvised. Those who heard
him said that he was undoubtedly one of the greatest organ improvisers
ever. 

: I must admit that I had the feeling of having cleaned up my record collection
: when it contained no more Bruckner.

The loss is entirely yours.....
--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
From: rhutchin@pilot.njin.net (Roland Hutchinson)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Beginning a classical collection
Date: 30 Dec 92 06:14:07 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In <1992Dec28.091408.16539@leland.Stanford.EDU> paulxxxx@leland.Stanford.EDU (paulastya gupta) writes:

>Hello!  Questions from an ignormaus:

As many others have said: libraries and classical radio stations can
help you quite a bit, assuming there still is a classical radio
station in the Bay Area. [Note ironic grimace of former KQED
subscriber.  It's all news and public affairs now.]  Stanford has a
superb (non-circulating) collection of recordings in its music
library.

But no one has yet mentioned one seemingly obvious thing to do: go to
some concerts!  You are very close to the San Francisco Symphony, and
to Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra, and if a schlepp to the city or the
East Bay is too far for you, there are many offering by both the Music
Department and by the Lively Arts at Stanford right on your own
campus.  Call them up and get on their mailing lists.  (Oakland and
San Jose symphonies, too, for that matter.  Support your regional
orchestras!  Is Oakland up and running again, by the way?  They were
in serious financial straits last I heard, several seasons ago.)

As even the most diehard audiophile in this newsgroup will agree,
experience of live performances of classical music is essential to
develop your ear for recordings--and for a number of other reasons,
besides.
-- 
Roland Hutchinson                       Visiting Specialist/Early Music
 Internet: rhutchin@pilot.njin.net      Department of Music
 Bitnet: rhutchin@NJIN                  Montclair State College
                                        Upper Montclair, NJ 07043
From: knotts@hpl-opus.hpl.hp.com (Tom Knotts)
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 20:50:23 GMT
Subject: Re: Looking for Classical Wedding Music
Organization: HP Labs, High Speed Electronics Dept., Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical


> I'm getting married in June in a small church that has a nice pipe organ. 

Tell us about the organ, and we'll be the judge as to whether or
not it's nice.....

On second thought, don't, as that'll surely start another flame war. :-)

Tom

From: Frank.Panettiere@f2010.n391.z1.FidoNet.Org (Frank Panettiere)
Sender: UUCP@p0.f1060.n391.z1.FidoNet.Org
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: RE: SVIATOSLAV RICHTER
Date: 23 Dec 92 16:22:26 EST


 >  PTH 1:391/1060.0@FidoNet
 > From: casseres@apple.com (David Casseres)
 > Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
 >  Organization: Apple Computer Inc.
 >  Message-ID: <casseres-181292141530@missmolly.apple.com>
 >  Date: 18 Dec 92 22:17:50 GMT
 > 
 > In article <1992Dec11.161136.24309@visual.com>, rwh@visual.com (Rob 
 > Holzel)
 > wrote:
 > > 
 > > 
 > > My own favorite Richter recordings.  These are all in good-to-
 > > excellent sound:
 > > 
 > > Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto #2 (DG)
 > > Dvorak Piano Concerto/Schubert "Wanderer" Fantasy (EMI)
 > > Schubert "Winterreise" (with Peter Schreirer[sp?]) (Philips)
 > > Bach Well-Tempered Clavier  (already mentioned)
 > > Brahms Concerto #2/Beethoven "Appassionata" Sonata (RCA)
 > > 
 > > 
 > > And the one recital that would place him at the top of the list,
 > > even if no other proof was available:
 > > 
 > > Chopin Scherzos (Eurodisc/Melodyia)  (Unfortunately not available 
 > >            in the States, but I managed to tape a copy)
 > > 
 > > He does the Rachmaninoff Preludes like no one else, also.
 > 
 > Another gem is the Beethoven Triple Concerto, with Rostropovich and
 > Oistrakh, and von Karajan conducting the Berlin Philharmonic.  I've 
 > never
 > heard another recording of this that achieves the magic balance 
 > among the
 > piano, cello, violin, and orchestra.
 > 
 > --
 > 
 > David Casseres
 > Exclaimer: Wow!
 > 
 > --- Fred-Uf 1.8h(L)[BETA]
 >  * Origin: NW Arkansas <=> Fidonet GateWay (1:391/1060.0)
 > 


Don't forrget the live piano solo performance of Pictures at an Exhibition.
 It showed me that you don't need a full orchestra to perform it.

                                                                Frank


 * Origin: The Coop: ARK tradition since '87 501-273-CHIC (1:391/2010)
From: rags@triples.math.mcgill.ca (Robert A. G. Seely)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Seasonal recording
Date: 22 Dec 92 01:39:22 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization


OK - I admit it - I've been playing a lot of my "seasonal" recordings lately
(the thread on Xmas CDs may have had something to do with it) - and felt
compelled to add this one - it might not make it to the Noel stands in your
local shop because of the subtle labelling (No word "Christmas" on the
jacket):

Sarum Chant - Missa in gallicantu
    Tallis Scholars (Gimell CDGIM 017)

Phillips et al are up to usual standard - which means those that hate them
can miss this, but sensible ;-} folk can enjoy it.  The treatment of chant
is a little on the "traditional" side.

-rags
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: km34@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Keith Moulton)
Subject: Re: Bamberg Symphony
Reply-To: km34@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Keith Moulton)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 20:47:15 GMT

In article <143806@lll-winken.LLNL.GOV> borchers@poogh.llnl.gov (Robert R. Borchers) writes:
>
>The last time I was in Bamberg, about two years ago, the Bamberg symphony  
>seemed to be alive and well. Bamberg is not in Bavaria. Bob 
>
	Bamberg is the sister-city of my hometown, Fredonia, NY.  It is, in
fact, in Bavaria.  More specifically, it is located in Ober-Franken in Bayern,
ie. Bavaria, about 35 miles south of the East German border and another 150
miles or so north of Munich.  Last I heard, the Symphony was doing just fine,
in spite of the fact that Ober-Franken has the highest per-capita beer
consumption in Germany:-)

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: velde2@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Francois Velde)
Subject: Re: Ozawa
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 20:50:28 GMT

In article <CURTIS.92Dec23151026@sun1.aer.com> curtis@sun1.aer.com (Curtis Heisey) writes:
>
>My taste-related complaint is that Ozawa is just plain dull,
>especially in the Baroque/Early Classical repertoire, which too often
>sounds like a grind through of the notes.   
>
>I do think that Ozawa does a good job with the contemporary repertoire,
>such as Saxton's *The Creation*.  I must admit that I've only heard Ozawa
>when he leads the BSO, and I haven't heard the BSO on tour with Ozawa, so I 
>can't judge Ozawa in his entirety as a conductor.

I heard Ozawa (on the radio--too poor at the time) conducting several 
Mahler symphonies in Paris about 10 years ago. If I remember right, there
was the Second, played in Saint-Denis (where our kings were buried: decent
republicans shuddered at the thought of an accident...).  I have an awed
memory of Ozawa's direction, and kept the tape for a long time. It was
gigantic, violent, disheveled.  But maybe today, with more years of Mahler
enjoyment behind me, I would think differently.

And I *love* the way his hair flies around when he conducts :-)


-- 

	Francois Velde