From: gd8f@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (Gregory  Dandulakis)
Subject: Re: Scopjian Flag
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 21:22:10 GMT


It seems that there was enough dose of bias in the previous answer, but since 
it didn't seem to be malicious in intentions, I will give a short response:


In article <BxrFC2.Mv6@gabriel.keele.ac.uk> cla04@seq1.keele.ac.uk (A.T. Fear) writes:
>
>Now while I agree that the use of the Vergina star as the Republic of
>Macedonia's flag is tactless, we might consider that Greece using this
>same symbol all over its stamps etc as part of its 'Macedonia is Greece'
>propaganda campaign is equally tactless, given that the modern Greeks
>are equally unrelated to the ancient Macedonians as the inhabitants of
>the Republic of Macedonia.  


I hope that you accept the right of every country to use on stamps
everything which is part of their country. The star of Vergina, along
with Greek Macedonia is part of Greece. Right? (What do you think about
Greece putting in her flag the Hagia Sophia magnificent monument. Don't
we diserve it?) As far as the political message, is not any better than 
the British advertisement of their Royal family and system and the Malvines
Islands (or Faucland is better?) or the American stamps about their 
democratic system and won wars.


>I wonder if the Macedonia adoption of the
>flag design was in response to this mass propaganda - I'm afraid I don't
>know enough about the chronology of this symbol war to come down one way
>or the other here.  I think I'd like to see Macedonia adopt a different
>symbol in return for Greece finally stopping her psuedo-historiacal
>posturing and recognising Macedonia for what it is the republic of
>Macedonia.  


Greece has never appropriated officially anything which belongs to
others. Making two ruberies (name+symbol) for just bargaining to keep
one, it doesn't change the fact that they try in both cases to lay
claims on others valuables (land+history).


>Alternatively both sides could just use the symbol
>recognising that the fact that they both occupy a land once inhabited by
>the ancient Macedonians makes this period part of both of their culture
>heritages.  


The *UNBROKEN CULTURAL CONTINUITY, THROUGH EVOLUTIONARY GRADUAL CHANGES*,
of the ancient Macedonian and Greek people (with the terminology of a histo-
rian) to the modern Greek people, is an obvious and undisputed truth (we are
not talking for genes now...). As long as the natural heirs of those legacies
exist, the appropriation of this history by new owners, because of long resi-
dency in this area, is unecessary and politically dangerous.


>The purpose of the sun-burst in its antique setting remains
>unclear and its design isn't unique by the way, it can be found on Greek
>coins predating the rise of Macedonia and on vases painted in early
>Italy - I shall check the precise reference over the next couple of
>days, in other words althoufgh it *might* have been the emblem of the
>Macedonia royal house, something yet to be *proved*, it isn't a uniquely
>Macedonian emblem.  Since the coins come from the far North West of
>Greece and we know Celts were keen on sun symbols perhaps the sun-burst
>is celtic inspired. By the arguments above it should then only appear on
>the Welsh flag! I hope this won't be taken up though as the dragon is
>much nicer... 


Nobody disputed your genuine knowledge on ancient history, nor your
desire to stamp your name in Science by breaking through novel proposals.
But the claim of uniqueness here is referred to this symbol as part of
a flag from a modern state, not of the uniqueness in the unrelated whole
universe. 


>> Enough is Enough! The Balkans had their share of bloody history.
>> This CANCEROUS GROWTH should be immediately REMOVED.
>
>It doesn't seem to bode well that someone complaining about a flag
>representing territorial threats should come out with such bellicose
>statements like this in his turn. Have we a supporter for the Serb
>extremists' idea of partioning Macedonia here?


Listen! We have some about 10 million muslims in the Balkans, leftovers
of the Ottomans, and which muslim-loving and protecting Turkey wants
to use as a pretext to reastablish the old grandeur in the balkans.
Since your country doesn't seem to be extra willing to accomodate those
Balknan muslims, and since Skopjia uses the threat of Turkey to achieve
its goal (unite all three peaces of "unfairly" divided ottoman Macedonia),
ofcourse and I SUPPORT the idea of the Albanians to unite with Albania,
Bulgarians to unite with Bulgaria and Serbia to take its share for 
fighting desperately against the Ottomans to liberate this land. Poli-
ticians who never fought for their land to be liberated, they don't 
deserve to be country rulers. (Did Britain fight to have Cyprus under 
her boot for so long time? Or Serbia is not Britain?!!!)


Gr
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