HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cej@dstos3.dsto.gov.au
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: Re: STTNG: Evolution
Date: 18 Nov 92 16:00:12 CST
Organization: Defence Science and Technology Organisation

In article <1992Nov13.034140.11124@kurango.cit.gu.edu.au>, arock@kurango.cit.gu.edu.au (Andrew Rock) writes:
> andrew@daneel.rdt.monash.edu.au (Andrew Moore) writes:
>
>>Wow a resonable plot, Wesley was not too much of a dork (well okay, a
>>little dorkey,, but what the heh :-) )
>
> Yes a good plot, but a familiar one. Anyone ever read "Dragon's Egg"
> by Robert L. Forward? I haven't but a friend once reccommended it
> to me and described the plot: A ship approaches a neutron star
> on which a life form evolves out of the neutron star stuff. Their
> accelerated time perception has them evolving so fast that by
> the time the ship gets close to the star the inhabitants are
> sufficiently technologically advanced to solve a problem for
> the ships crew that the crew were not even aware of yet.
>

If you see Dragon's Egg in the bookstore, get it! It is worth the read
(There is a sequel which is also good.) Character development in the novels
is not very good, but the concepts in the book are very interesting (possibly
because Forward is a physisist (sp)).

As for similarities between that & the TNG episode-slight. You picked the
main similarities (v. fast time perception & cultural development because
of size), but there is not really anything else similar about the two.

--
Chris Jones                                  E-mail: cej@dstos3.dsto.gov.au
CSS/CD/ERL                                    Phone: +61 8 259 6758
DSTO Salisbury, South Australia                 Fax: +61 8 259 6328

Disclaimer: The opinions expressed are purely personal and do NOT represent
            the official view of DSTO.

"I'm going to put the shame file in the sludge file!  Or is that the sludge
 file in the shame file? Shame, sludge, sludge, shame, ...
 That's life, get nicked.."   Derrin Hunch, Fast Forward
From: zebee@sirius.ucs.adelaide.edu.au (Zebee Johnstone)
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: Re: TNG - "The Ensigns of Command"
Date: 21 Nov 92 08:01:59 GMT
Organization: The University of Adelaide
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: sirius.itd.adelaide.edu.au

s892024@minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU (Richard A. Muirden [GA]) writes:


>what I want to know is that if the text of the treaty was 500,000 words
>what search condition did Picard use to find those sub paragraphs in all
>that saying they wanted a 3rd party? I mean don't tell me he and worf
>and troi read the whole thing in that time....

No, but how about a legal-eagle expert system?  GEt it to find 
any paragraphs which dealt with restraint or delay.

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
     Zebee Johnstone  DoD #605   | You don't own an Italian motorcycle 
     Adelaide City Council       |  - you merely have the privilege 
    zebee@itd.adelaide.edu.au    |    of paying its bills.... 
Newsgroups: aus.sf,aus.films
From: u8706558@cs.uow.edu.au (Sean Volke)
Subject: Re: Sydney's SF Film Fest
Organization: The Shell
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 01:31:20 GMT

Matthew Hall <mjhall@socs.uts.edu.au> writes:

>Sean Volke, u8706558@cs.uow.edu.au writes:
>>Well, it's Tuesday now does anyone know if they've been printed yet ?
>>The question is will they be printed in time ? If at all ?

>Well, I just talked to them, and
>YESYESYESYESYESYESYES!!!!
>the tickets are there, so you can buy/pick them up from 5:30pm today
>(being Wednesday the 18TH).

Well mine just arrived in the mail this morning (Thursday 19th).

>Hooray.
Yippee!
-- 
    ___        |MOSH       'Wake up mislead children of wrath           
   /   \  THE  |FOR        Escape the consequence of the fire'          
  | O  | SNAIL |THE                                 Mortification     //
__\___/_____\/_|MASTER     u8706558@wraith.cs.uow.edu.au            \X/ 
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: steve@fulcrum.oz.au (Steve Taylor)
Subject: Re: ST-TNG Shades of Grey
Organization: The Fulcrum Consulting Group
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 00:05:14 GMT

Lee.Nye@f364.n633.z3.fidonet.org (Lee Nye) writes:

>    In UNnatural Selection, Dr Pulaski is infected with a virus that bonds
> with her (or rather alters her) DNA.  The solution (after 20 mins of wasted
> screen time) was to send here thorough the transporter and use a copy of her
> DNA as a template, thus screening out anything that shouldn't have been
>there.
> 
>    WHY COULDN"T THEY DO THAT FOR RIKER????
>    They would have a copy of his DNA in the transporter computer. It's not as
> though he doesn't use it regularly.

Yeah - when I saw "Unnatural Selection" and the cure-diseases-by-transporter
trick, I thought: "They've just invented a miracle cure for every disease
know to science. I wonder if anyone will ever mention it again?".

With a continuing series, they could be a little more careful about 
introducing universe spanning changes. That aside, it was a pretty fair
episode, except that as usual, they forgot to kill Wesley..



								Steve
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: remek@mamura.ee.mu.oz.au (Remek Lipinski)
Subject: Wesley (was: Re: Season three...)
Organization: Electrical and Electronic - University of Melbourne 
Distribution: aus
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 22:18:13 GMT

I do not understand why everyone hates Wesely so much. Perhaps it is because
deep down most people (tng fans) would do anything to be in his place? Or
maybe he remids us of all the things we aspired to and never achieved?
===============================================================================
** Remek Lipinski   :  remek@mullian.ee.mu.OZ.AU                              **
**                                              "I'll be back!"  - T800      **
===============================================================================
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: daz@mullian.ee.mu.OZ.AU (Darren Primm)
Subject: Re: Evolution
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Distribution: aus
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 22:35:24 GMT

sad@deakin.OZ.AU (Scott Macdonald) writes:

>I noticed that Picard and Riker both seemed to speak slightly quicker and at
>a slightly higher pitch.  Particularly at the start with Picards log report.

>Did anyone else notice this?

Yes, this is a pity. This also happened on the sell through vidoes in
England. When transferring from NTSC to PAL, a speed up on the video
sometimes accurs, from 24 fps, to 25 fps. That is why you get the
increase in pitch in voices, and quicker speech. It is most annoying.

>Scott Macdonald
Daz.

--
  Darren (Dazza) Primm, Dept EE Eng, Melb Uni, Parkville, 3052, Australia
 "There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish, sometimes."
   Internet: daz@mullian.ee.mu.oz.au  [dazza@ecr.mu.oz.au]  IRC: Family
From: martin@zen.maths.uts.edu.au (Martin Caden)
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: Re: TNG - "The Ensigns of Command"
Date: 22 Nov 92 05:32:41 GMT
Organization: University of Technology, Sydney
Distribution: aus
NNTP-Posting-Host: zen.maths.uts.edu.au

I think that the theme of this show was adaptability.  We see several cases
where adaptation was necessary, and forth-coming.  The original colonists had
to adapt to the Hyperonic radiation - and did.  Then they had to adapt to
circumstances which would force them to abandon all that they had built - and
eventually did.  These are two different forms of adaptation - but equally
difficult.

Perhaps the most interesting twist was the circumstances which required the
"wrong" members of the Enterprise crew to deal with important problems.  It's
difficult to imagine anyone less suited than Data to confront the leader of the
colony and to convince them of the need for evacuation.  Of course Picard
would have fared much better at the colony - he most certainly would not have
been so easily countered by the strong leadership of whatsisname.  On the
other hand, Data would have been the ideal liason to the ever-so-precise
aliens.  He could simply have scanned the treaty and entered into a precise
conversation designed to resolve the situation to mutual benefit.

The more I think about it, the more I like this show.  What would have happened
if the roles were reversed?  Perhaps disaster.  Picard may have simply entered
into a battle of wills with the colony leader, who, being on home turf, may
have treated Picard as a challenge to his leadership and imprisioned him until
"after" the attack.  Had Data been the liason to the aliens, he may have
conceded, with undoubtable logic, that the human colony was in violation of the
treaty and so was subject to summary removal.  There's a message here that the
obvious course is not always the one that will bring the desired result.  In
a battle where you are at best equal to your opponant, it might be best to
fight with unconventional weapons, to exploit your differences to your
advantage.  Picard used a ruse that a strictly legal mind would not have
thought of, Data used the colonists perception of him as "alien" to strike
genuine fear into them.

As for the usual "but Data - you ARE creative/caring/etc.." scene, and the
BFGS (Beautiful Female Guest Star), well, the less said the better.

--
  Cheers,   O
           /|\ Martin Caden                   School of Mathematical Sciences
           /^\ martin@zen.maths.uts.edu.au    University of Technology, Sydney
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: remek@mamura.ee.mu.oz.au (Remek Lipinski)
Subject: Re: Wesley (was: Re: Season three...)
Organization: Electrical and Electronic - University of Melbourne 
Distribution: aus
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 03:28:27 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.012337.10520@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> timkin@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (Tim Wilkin) writes:
>: maybe he remids us of all the things we aspired to and never achieved?
>
>Now, considering my last comment, how the hell could anyone aspire to be
>like Wesley and achieve it...it isn't the 24th 1/2 century and I don't
>think any of us will be around to see that New Years Party!!!
>
I was not trying to make a direct comparison, I am quite aware of what year
it is, rather pointing out personal goals that most pople set for themselves.
In this category Wesley would be grouped as an overachiever, something most
people get intimidated by, and thus as a defence feel compelled to ridicule. 
===============================================================================
** Remek Lipinski   :  remek@mullian.ee.mu.OZ.AU                              **
**                                              "I'll be back!"  - T800      **
===============================================================================
From: kat@werple.apana.org.au (Kathryn Andersen)
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: Q Appreciation Society
Date: 22 Nov 1992 15:25:23 +1100
Organization: werple public-access unix, Melbourne
NNTP-Posting-Host: werple.apana.org.au
Keywords: Q!

Greetings
As promised, here is the address of the Q Appreciation Society:
238 Nemies Road, Runcorn QLD 4113

They've only put out one 'zine so far, but it was fun.

Kathryn
-=-=-=-=-
Guess Q?
-- 
 _--_|\		Kathryn Andersen	<kat@werple.apana.org.au>
/      \	Hawthorn -> Melbourne -> Victoria -> Australia
\_.--.*/	-> Southern Hemisphere -> Earth -> Sol -> Milky Way Galaxy
      v			-- My other account is an Apollo --
From: s892024@minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU (Richard A. Muirden [GA])
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: Re: TNG - "The Ensigns of Command"
Date: 20 Nov 92 05:49:29 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre
NNTP-Posting-Host: minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au

hoahosth@halls1.cc.monash.edu.au (ANDREA HOSTH) writes:

>Why was this episode called "The Ensigns of Command"? I miss whatever 
>connection they are making totally.

I believe the point was that Data was an "Ensign" when it came to
Command, as he pointed out he was trained for Starship command, but
on the planet, his first real taste of being on the spot with no
backup and having to make command decisions as well as doing his
job - thus he was as green as any ensign on his first landing party when
it came to this kind of thing...

thats what I saw the connection to be...

course I could be quite wrong..


>It was also very badly scripted, the colonist leader was a terrible actor 
>and the story was full of little inconsistencies. How did the colonists 
>overcome the radiation to survive? Just saying that they were forced to 
>adapt is no explanation. The woman with the thing for androids knew a hell 
>of a lot about computers/androids in general. Now it is possible for a 
>colony ship to retain technology, but not when, as is said early on, "They 
>were too busy trying to survive for history lessons". (ie. even the story of 
>why the ship had turned up on the planet was not well-known - survival being 
>a much higher priority than learning). They didn't know what a phaser was 
>but they knew enough about androids to turn Data off with an interesting 
>electrical shock weapon. 

Ah but she admitted her info was out of date and how
bad their computers were... and data said "you are right"

They might not have known about androids, but what I think they
did was like short him. I mean look at it this way, if we came
from the 60's where all we knew was how to pull out the power cord
of an ibm/370, and we were plonked infront of a mac fx, surely we'd
try and pull the power cord out even though the mac was far advanced
(this is an example, not a joke :) perhaps I should say sun and not
mac), and we didn't know anything about the advanced
technology, but we could still shut it down. That's what I think
is a reasonable type explanation for how the leader could shut data
down for awhile...

>Oh well.

I actually thought Troi was less of a bimbo this time :)

what I want to know is that if the text of the treaty was 500,000 words
what search condition did Picard use to find those sub paragraphs in all
that saying they wanted a 3rd party? I mean don't tell me he and worf
and troi read the whole thing in that time....


>Ankh

-richard

-- 
Richard Muirden, System Administator, RMIT.Aero. Engineering.. Office: 10.12.26
raeram@kittyhawk.aero.rmit.OZ.AU, s892024@minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU 'phone: 660-3142
ram@lionet.wesley.OZ.AU, ram@coombs.anu.edu.au - in case you don't like RMIT! :)
---------Hopeless Romantic, Fanatic of Shostakovich and "Star Trek" ------------
From: Lee.Nye@f364.n633.z3.fidonet.org (Lee Nye)
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: STTNG: Evolution
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1992 12:13:00

AM> Obviously they have changed the legal ages somewhat..
AM> 17 years old and unsupervised in a bar that (we safely assume)
AM> serves
AM> alcohol (or its equivalent in the 24 and a half centaury.)

    The strongest drink Ten Forward sells is something called synthehol. It's
 supposedly against regulations to sell anything stronger than this. The other
 point is that I seem to remember Wesley being told he was too young to drink
 in a previous episode , or maybe it was one of the books.
    Besides Guinan would probably know who's allowed what in the bar anyway.

Lee.


 * Origin: The Little Shop of Horrors!! - [03] 702-8889 (3:633/364)
From: s924683@minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU ( Chandi )
Newsgroups: aus.sf
Subject: Re: TNG - "The Ensigns of Command"
Date: 20 Nov 92 12:16:50 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre
NNTP-Posting-Host: minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au

hoahosth@halls1.cc.monash.edu.au (ANDREA HOSTH) writes:

>Why was this episode called "The Ensigns of Command"? I miss whatever 
>connection they are making totally.

>It was also very badly scripted, the colonist leader was a terrible actor 
>and the story was full of little inconsistencies. How did the colonists 
>overcome the radiation to survive? Just saying that they were forced to 
>adapt is no explanation. The woman with the thing for androids knew a hell 
>of a lot about computers/androids in general. Now it is possible for a 
>colony ship to retain technology, but not when, as is said early on, "They 
>were too busy trying to survive for history lessons". (ie. even the story of 
>why the ship had turned up on the planet was not well-known - survival being 
>a much higher priority than learning). They didn't know what a phaser was 
>but they knew enough about androids to turn Data off with an interesting 
>electrical shock weapon. 
 It is quite posible that the phasers they had did not work on the planet..
 as data's before modification.  There fore (and since there was no need for
 them) they might have forgotten phaser technology.   

 About They Knowing a lot about data....   Isn't data pretty old... As in 
gh info in the ship.... even though just theory (usually thearoy arives years
before parctical stuff arives).   
>
`Oh well.
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: pad@probitas.cs.utas.edu.au (Paul A Daniels)
Subject: Re: Wesley (was: Re: Season three...)
Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
Distribution: aus
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 23:06:48 GMT

In <1992Nov20.024945.2864@plasma.apana.org.au> jgh@plasma.apana.org.au (John Gerald Howell) writes:

>remek@mamura.ee.mu.oz.au (Remek Lipinski) writes:

>>I do not understand why everyone hates Wesley so much. Perhaps it is because
>>deep down most people (tng fans) would do anything to be in his place? Or
>>maybe he reminds us of all the things we aspired to and never achieved?



>I have to agree, Wesley Crusher is a great character; intelligent,
>witty, sophisticated, charming, talented, he has all the qualities I so
>admire in a Star Fleet officer. Who wouldn't trade places with
>someone so obviously in tune with other peoples feelings and needs?
>I've always dreamt of being aboard the Starship Enterprise, hurtling
>through space, a young ensign, bound for greatness. A young ensign who
>could solve any problem, handle any situation, just by being present in
>the same room, just by focusing his mind for an instant. In my youth,
>after watching an episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation,
>I remember turning to my brother and saying:

>'I want to be just like Wesley.'

>My brother, of course, agreed totally. He too had dreamt of being like
>Wesley; out there in the far reaches of the galaxy, in command,
>unstoppable. He too had come to respect such an awesome figure,
>such a mystical, magical boy. Over the years Wesley has become an
>idol to me in every way, a symbol of all that is honest and true,
>a beacon to guide me home, a source of inspiration, knowledge, hope.
>Who could forget such incisive dialogue? All those tender
>moments as he grew towards manhood? The loyal protection he gave
>Captain Picard when he was suffering heart trouble? The anguish he
>felt when he discovered his girl friend was a shape shifting metamorph?
>It disgusts me to think that anyone could find flaws in such a
>flawless creation. The character who has inspired and profoundly moved
>so many fans deserves all the praise he can get. Three cheers for
>Wesley Crusher, in all the known universe, there is no-one I admire
>more.
>  


>-------------------------------
>John Howell Melbourne Australia
>(jgh@plasma.apana.org.au)
>-------------------------------
>:-)

	Enough, enough, I give in ,. I'll hate Wesley too , just please sstop!!!

Paul.
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: kat@bacchus.esa.oz.au (Kathryn Andersen)
Subject: Re: TNG book: Q-In-Law
Organization: none
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 22:59:57 GMT

In <11028@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au> rhys@cs.uq.oz.au (Rhys Weatherley) writes:
>Anyway, yesterday I noticed the latest one in the store.  And lo and behold,
>Q was on the cover!  So, against my better judgement, and the above-mentioned
>policy, I just had to have it and payed out the money.

>Well, what can I say?  "Q-In-Law" by Peter David is a riot!  I was laughing
>my head off all the way through.  4 hours after purchasing the book, I turned
>the last page very impressed (I'm a speed reader - another character flaw :) .

>Basically the plot of the story is "Q meets Lwaxana Troi".  Need I say more? :)
>In the background is a wedding linking two alien factions, which Q manages
>to stuff up (of course).  The climax is particularly hilarious.  But, I'll
>shut up now or I'll ruin it for you. :)

>Buy or borrow this book if you are a Q fan - I'm sure you'll love it as I did.
Odd, I have heard the totally opposite report of this book - that it is
absolutely terrible.  This from a person who is a Q fan too!  Since my
friend is usually on the mark, I decided against getting the book.
Not that I normally purchase Trek books, but since I like Q (almost the
only really interesting character apart from Data and Ensign Ro(*)) I
actually considered buying it.  Now I don't know what to think.

The only ST:TNG novel I have is Metamorphosis by Jean Lorrah, which is
*the* Data novel.  Have your cake and eat it too.

(*) Ensign Ro Laren joins the crew in the 5th season.

BTW, if you like Q, check out QAS, the Q Appreciation Society, in
Queensland.  They put out a fanzine, Quizine, which is hilarious!
Let's see, oh, darn, I left my address book at home!
I'll post the address later.

Kathryn Andersen
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
"That box, Orac, that's what we came for."
    -- Servalan (to Blake)  (Blake's 7: Orac [A13])
-- 
 _--_|\		Kathryn Andersen
/      \		Home: <kat@werple.apana.org.au>
\_.--.*/		Work: <kat@bacchus.esa.oz.au>
      v		Hawthorn -> Melbourne -> Victoria -> Australia -> Earth -> Sol
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: hoahosth@halls1.cc.monash.edu.au (ANDREA HOSTH)
Subject: TNG - "The Ensigns of Command"
Organization: Halls of Residence, Monash University 
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 23:20:28 GMT

Why was this episode called "The Ensigns of Command"? I miss whatever 
connection they are making totally.

It was also very badly scripted, the colonist leader was a terrible actor 
and the story was full of little inconsistencies. How did the colonists 
overcome the radiation to survive? Just saying that they were forced to 
adapt is no explanation. The woman with the thing for androids knew a hell 
of a lot about computers/androids in general. Now it is possible for a 
colony ship to retain technology, but not when, as is said early on, "They 
were too busy trying to survive for history lessons". (ie. even the story of 
why the ship had turned up on the planet was not well-known - survival being 
a much higher priority than learning). They didn't know what a phaser was 
but they knew enough about androids to turn Data off with an interesting 
electrical shock weapon. 

Oh well.

Ankh
Newsgroups: aus.sf
From: hughm@tplrd.tpl.oz.au (Hugh McGuinness)
Subject: The Avengers, 18/11
Originator: hughm@sydrd19
Organization: Telectronics Pacing Systems
Distribution: aus
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 02:23:58 GMT



Part of the joy of watching the Avengers is to see all the
bit-part actors and try to recognise them.  Last night I
saw a record 4: Yootha Joyce (Man about the House), Paul
Eddington (Yes Minister), Clive Dunn (Dad's Army) and the
guy who played Mr Dundridge from _Blott on the Landscape_
(what _was_ his name? my TV decided to go blurry at that
point in the credits).

One episode even had Ronnie Barker and the head woman from
the UFO moonbase (without the purple anti-static wig, though :-()

Will we ever see the old Honour Blackman episodes?  I wasn't born
when they were first shown and they're in black and white so there's
little chance of 9 ever showing them (though they show _Dangerman_
for years, albeit at 5am...)

hugh
-- 
Hugh McGuinness | hughm@tplrd.tpl.oz.au, hughm@tps.com | (612) 413 6941
Telectronics Pacing Systems, 7 Sirius Road, Lane Cove 2066 NSW Australia
Hardware person | Er' perrehne
Newsgroups: aus.sun-works