HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: osan@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (Mr. X)
Subject: Re: Greenoch History
Organization: Twilight Zone
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 18:33:00 GMT

In article <kfNNSt30Bwx2QTITEh@transarc.com> Stephen_Y._Chan@transarc.com writes:
>birmingh@fnalo.fnal.gov (Phillip J. Birmingham) writes:
>> In article <1993Jan26.001502.3882@craycos.com>, sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi)\
>>  writes:
>> > Seriously, Greenoch is the second-best martial art in the whole, damned
>> > world...
>> 
>>          Uhh, what's the first? Meik-do?
>
>	How much is it worth to you to find out?

	Oh Stephen.... BRAVO!  A *true* Meikdo $ensei.  Hakamas off to you
	sir!  Er... uh, well, uh... the *womens'* hakamas off to you, at
	any rate!   Hey, you know, I *like* that idea...   Womens' hakamas
	off...  wow!

	CEO $ensei, it seems Stephen has, in one fell swoop, made a serious
	threat to your seat.  Methinks you will have to come up with a very
	convincing counter to this.  It was short, sweet, direct, graceful
	and about as effective as anything could possibly be.  Your answer?

	-Andy V.
From: Stovall@f88.n106.z1.fidonet.org (Stovall)
Sender: Jpunix@urchin.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Hapkido's origins...
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 10:21:00 -0500

(deleted stuff concerning Daito Ryu's alleged links to Hapkido)

JF>...How about the lineage of Daito Ryu Ju-Jutsu?  Did it just stop,
JF>or did it continue down the blood line?!...there were quite a few
JF>students who received the transmission scrolls from Sokaku Takeda,
JF>Choi not being one of them!

Who cares? The legitimacy of a martial art is a function of its
practitioners. Everyone is aware that Hapkido is a relatively new
martial art that has stolen many of its techniques from other sources.
In a confrontation, pedigree is less important than pragmatism.

Peace in our time,

Tom
___
 X SLMR 2.1a X The best defense against logic is stupidity...
From: actize@garnet.berkeley.edu
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Quarterstaff Technique
Date: 22 Jan 93 03:59:26 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

I saw an old movie where Robin Hood takes on Little John.  The fight scene 
takes place on a log which is a bridge over a stream.  Each contestant mounts 
the bridge at opposite sides of the stream, and so must balance on the log as 
well as fight.  The staffs were held the way a weightlifter would attempt a 
deadlift on a barbell.  i.e. hands centered on staff, spread, one grip up, one
grip down.  The moves consisted of pushing on the opponents staff raised chest
high, and "hooking" with the staff to strike with either end of the staff in a 
circular type path.  There was no jabbing, poking, or hand position moving.

Well, ummm.
From: JTCHEW@lbl.gov (Ad absurdum per aspera)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Van Damme studies.....?
Followup-To: rec.martial-arts
Date: 21 Jan 1993 18:56:51 GMT
Organization: Honest Ernie's Used Ions
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.252.153

In article <1993Jan21.105024.5964@walter.cray.com>, radner@cray.com 
(Lauren Radner) spoils our fun with the newbies by confessing:

> Sinanju...  The books are very silly, and a lot of fun.  

Yeah... I think of them as sort of the "Spinal Tap" of airport-lounge 
paperbacks, i.e., a funny and very knowing parody that took on a 
life of its own. 

I really enjoyed the slightly tongue-in-cheek "Remo Williams" 
movie, too, though I must admit that the Doberman pursuing 
Fred Ward through the factory stole the show.  (For perspective,
keep in mind that I saw it on Dollar Night at a "draft house," a
pleasant Atlanta cultural institution wherein you sit there 
swilling cheap beer as you watch the movie... :)

I seem to recall seeing the name of Richard Sapir (co-creator of the
Destroyer series, along with Warren Murphy) among the credits of
one of those Hollywood bullet ballets, probably Lethal Weapon II.

Joe
"Just another personal opinion from the People's Republic of Berkeley"
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: Robert_Cocking@mindlink.bc.ca (Robert Cocking)
Subject: Aikido vs. kicks
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 21:40:28 GMT

Having read a few books on Aikido and being very new to the budo, I have not
found any defense against kicks.  Beyond a basic block, I can't really
imagine an Aikido technique to deals with this kind of attack.  Is there a
sensei to enlighten me?


--

Robert Cocking.......robert_cocking@mindlink.bc.ca
From: gatenby@v2.cgu.mcc.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: hapkido question
Date: 27 Jan 93 15:15:47 GMT
Organization: Manchester Computing Centre CGU

Malcolm Wright writes:
> gatenby@v2.cgu.mcc.ac.uk wrote (that was me)
> 
> ** wharfie's question about hapkido v jujitsu deleted **
> 
>>The main difference I could see (I don't know anything about the weapons) was
>>that the throws seemed very "aikido-like" by which I mean a lot of
>>wrist-twisting seemed to be going on and the concentration on "fancy" kicking
>>was also greater.
> 
> I see two reasons for high & fancy kicks in our style of Hapkido.
> 
> The first is that stetching and kicking high in the gym helps to kick
> at low to middle height on the street when you're not warmed up.
> (Including, say, back kick to the knee, or spinning kick to the large nerve
> on the outside of the thigh).
> 
> The second is that energetic kick-sparring is great for learning timing
> and couterattack, even for grappling applications.
> 
> Malcolm

I don't disagree with any of this, I don't think I wrote that I did, I'm just
saying that we tend to devote more attention to other things, high/fancy kicks
is not something we concentrate on. (personally I find them enjoyable to
practise (& I think they're useful mainful for the 1st of Malcom's reasons))

LPAF
Neil

 Neil Gatenby, Computer Graphics Unit,	| Email: gatenby@uk.ac.mcc.cgu.v2
 University of Manchester,		| Tel: (+44)61 275 6095
 Manchester M13 9PL, England.		| Fax: (+44)61 275 6040
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 	     Strive to Survive, Causing Least Suffering Possible
From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andrew Michael Woodward)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Happenstance Weapons
Date: 25 Jan 93 13:47:29 GMT
Organization: University of Wales, Aberystwyth


There is no such thing as unarmed combat. If you cant improvise a weapon, you
are overlooking something (If anyone has a direct use for a postage stamp, 
you are better at this game than me.)
From: jfrost@odaiko (SYSTEM 0PERATOR)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: test
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 93 22:37:07 PST
Organization: The Big Drum Network

This is the last test!
Julian

-- 
  ___________)  UUCP:   {hplabs!hp-sdd ucsd nosc}!crash!odaiko!jfrost
 (      |       ARPA:   crash!odaiko!jfrost@nosc.mil
     ___|____   INET:   jfrost@odaiko
    /   |       PACKET: KC6NSE @ KC6NZN.#SOCA.CA.USA.NOAM
   (____/ .
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Is chi/ ki real?
From: MWright@massey.ac.nz (M.J. Wright)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 04:20:22 GMT
Organization: Massey University, Palmerston North, New Zealand
Keywords: ki chi tricks
Summary: Lies Lies and more Lies
X-Reader: NETNEWS/PC Version 2c


[snip amazing feats of chi/ki]

Some of the apparently spectacular feats that are usually fraudulent
tricks of technique:

- Being so tough people can break baseball bats on your shins
- Being so tough you can have a car drive over you
- Firewalking
(your grandmother would be just as good a subject for these tricks)
- Breaking thick ice
- Breaking many, many bricks
(salt the ice, put more sand in the brick mix)
- Plucking an egg out of boiling water
- Moving a pen by thought control
(these are effectively stage magician tricks)

Treat these sorts of claim with a ton of salt: offer to use your own car 
(don't let it out of your sight), offer to swing the bat yourself, offer
to provide the bricks or the ice, offer to set up the boiling water,
offer to provide a gasmask for the pen trick.  But don't be too credulous.

These people give ki a bad name.  I agree that we all have ki, and can  
develop it to assist our martial arts, but this has little to 
do with demonstrations of spectacular tricks.

Malcolm

PS: I accept that up to six or more bricks/concrete slabs can be broken 
by a strike, but the ability to do this is not very widespread, and if 
you do it too much it does your hands NO GOOD AT ALL, especially if you
make a minute error of technique every 20th time.
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: m23364@mwunix (James Meritt)
Subject: New President
Organization: MITRE Corporation, McLean VA
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 16:07:45 GMT


Wonder when Bush told Clinton about Dr. Smith and Remo...


--
James W. Meritt:  m23364@mwunix.mitre.org - or - jmeritt@mitre.org
The opinions above are mine.  If anyone else wants to share them, fine.
They may say so if they wish. The facts "belong" to noone and simply are.
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: seibl@Q.nas.nasa.gov (Michael J. Seibl)
Subject: Re: WANTED: Women's self-defense success stories!
Organization: NAS Program, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 23:32:04 GMT

In article <1k250hINNiu5@pith.uoregon.edu>, toman@bovine.uoregon.edu (Jay toman) writes:

|> >      ^^^^^
|> > 
|> >I believe that Bernard Goetz(sp?) proved otherwise.  He actually killed
|> >someone because he felt threatened.
|> 
|> He didn't just feel threatened, he WAS threatened, with a weapon !
|> Sure, it's a very gray area, what's a real threat and what isn't, 
|> my point was that from my armchair-quarterback-hearing-it-second-hand
|> position, the woman in the story freaked out and blew it big time .
|> 
|> >
|> 
|> 						J. Toman

 I hope not to start a flame war but if I do, so be it.  

The main problem if passing judgement on stories that we read or hear about is the main fact that we were NOT THERE!!! We don't know all of the story.  Her intuition told her that the only way to get out of her situation was to fight.  I say, good for her.  

After five years of assisting and later teaching Rape and Assualt prevention to women and men, and hearing the stories of people who have been assaulted and survived to tell about it, there was a time that the survivor "felt something was wrong" before it happened.  Most of the time there was nothing "wrong" on the surface, but out of the blue things happened.

Ted Bundy used a fake cast while caring a lot of books to get women to beleive that he was in pain and needed help. Point being, I share with my students "I think it's better to be in court explaining why this other person was hurt, than  the other person being in court explaining why he raped/beat-up/killed you."

Seib


		Live long, and perspire.




Seib Seibl   Computer Science Corp. NASA/Ames Research Center
             Moffet Field, Ca       Harware Support Engineer
	     (415) 604-4620

Seibl@Q.nas.nasa.gov
Organization: Sponsored account, Accounts, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 13:12:35 -0500 
From: Stephen_Y._Chan@transarc.com
Subject: Re: Puzzled - History of Korean MAs
	<1993Jan19.210012.24926@massey.ac.nz>

M.J.Wright@massey.ac.nz (M.J. Wright) writes:
> Kickass-Do was used to repel the Japanese invasions of Korea in the 
> Middle Ages.

	You know, those Midieval Samurai Killing Machines weren't
particularly successful when they invaded China and Korea. Anyone out
there have any theories on that?

	Stephen
From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andrew Michael Woodward)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Gracie
Date: 25 Jan 93 14:28:03 GMT
Organization: University of Wales, Aberystwyth


>=>> =>If someone's trying to kick my ass, I don't want to be on the ground
>=>> =>with him standing up.  That's one problem I have with what I've seen
>=>> =>in Model Mugging: they teach women to go to the ground and fight from
>=>> =>there.            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>=>> 

If you konow how to use it, the ground is your freind, but only against
one opponent (armed or unarmed). I posted to this effect a couple of weeks back
but had to go away for a copuple of weeks, so I missed the abuse.

If you dont know the training hstory of your opponent, go to ground. chances are
he'll not have much idea how to get to you. The big disadvantage is that you 
have removed your option of running away (Venerable art of Ni-Ke).
Xref: sparky rec.martial-arts:17540 rec.arts.movies:38547 alt.cult-movies:12171
From: upham@cs.ubc.ca (Derek Upham)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts,rec.arts.movies,alt.cult-movies
Subject: `Kung fu' movies vs. `Wu xia' movies (was Re: Brandon Lee Movies)
Date: 26 Jan 1993 23:58:08 -0800
Organization: Raven's Auto Body Repair Shop, Mega-Tokyo.
NNTP-Posting-Host: cascade.cs.ubc.ca

jangi@hilbert.coe.northeastern.edu (Shrirang Jangi) writes:
>In article <nahilgendorf.51@honors.uoregon.edu> nahilgendorf@honors.uoregon.edu (Nathan Hilgendorf) writes:

>>True, Hong Kong does make the best martial arts movies. I saw Swordsman II a 
>>while ago and thought it was actually pretty poorly done, which surprised 
>>me, since Once Upon a Time in China I and II were awesome. Oh well...

>I agree that neither Swordsman I or II is as good as Wong Fei Hong, but I 
>think that the floating rotating sword of Jet Lee and the concept of "sword
>chi" in Swordsman II are visually stunning. BTW, Swordsman III is already out.

These are sort of unfair comparisons.  "Swordsman" 1 and 2 aren't
`kung fu' movies, they're `wu xia' movies (action fantasy, like "A
Chinese Ghost Story", and "Zu, Warriors of the Mystic Mountain").  If
you go looking for martial arts, you're going to be disappointed---
the writers and directors don't devote nearly as much energy to them
as `kung fu' writers and directors do.  (Actually, "Once Upon a Time
in China" is only half `kung fu'; the other half is historical drama.)

Derek

-- 
Derek Lynn Upham                               University of British Columbia
upham@cs.ubc.ca                                   Computer Science Department
=============================================================================
"Ha!  Your Leaping Tiger Kung Fu is no match for my Frightened Piglet Style!"
From: curt@access.digex.com (curt williams)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Evil Black Belts (was : Fighting against animals?)
Date: 28 Jan 1993 20:22:41 -0500
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

In article <C1J2qp.Hy2@ms.uky.edu> bud@ms.uky.edu (William K Glunt) writes:
>>	Is this the "Count Dante" that caused trouble in Chicago
>
> At one time, Dante, whose real name was John Keehan, was one of the
>most respected karate teachers in the U.S.A....got to be about sixth


I'm showing my age, but I remember John Keehan very well.  I don't
connect him with the Trias organization at all.  I think the facts are 
that before he went looney, he was a reasonable well respected
brown belt level judo competitor.

The story out of Chicago is that he got into a dispute with a rival
school (might have been trashing another school) and someone got
killed with a sword.  I'm pretty sure he didn't do any time, and I
don't think anyone else did either.

NOTE OF CAUTION:  If you haven't noticed it, a lot of martial arts
people love a good scandal and many of them aren't well educated. I'm
tempted to say that I've heard almost all the stories, and while I've
heard many of them, I know it's not close to "all of them."  I'd
guess 99% or more are false or really blown out of proportion.  I
wouldn't have said anything about Count Dante if it hadn't been
all over the MA press during the 1960's (?).

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: comptec92024@camins.camosun.bc.ca
Subject: Re: Beating S*** out of Celts (long)
Organization: Camosun College
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 10:18:16 GMT

In article <1993Jan19.173058.3078@mtroyal.ab.ca>, mtambay@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:


 
> Would anyone know if the romans had any one-on-one fighting art (excluding 
> the gladiatorial stuff.)
============================================================================

The arts of Wrestling and Boxing come to mind. Most likely the art of the
gladius, and spear.

Mackezie (I did like the one about the two scots)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: mhirsch@dynastar.princeton.edu (Michael Hirsch)
Subject: Re: Fighting against animals?
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University Department of Computer Science
	<1993Jan26.164414.29599@ttinews.tti.com>
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 19:10:25 GMT

>>>>> On Tue, 26 Jan 1993 16:44:14 GMT, reid@metis.tti.com (Reid Kneeland) said:
Reid> Nntp-Posting-Host: metis.tti.com

Reid> In article <77570@apple.apple.COM> mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins) writes:

>the story of Wu Sung, a martial hero monk of China, who is said
>to have been caught sleeping by a hungry tiger. If you have
>ever seen a figurine of a Chinese fellow smacking a tiger
>in the head with his fist in a Chinatown shop, this is Wu Sung

Reid> This sounds rather implausible to me.  Why was he sleeping in a
Reid> Chinatown shop?  And how did the tiger get in there?

No, no! you misunderstood.  It was the fist that is in the Chinatown
shop.

It's an old technique:  When attacked by a tiger, first, put a
Chinatown shop around your fist, raise your fist (and the shop with
it, of course) and bring it down on the tiger's head.  Even a modestly
sized Chinatown shop is sufficient to incapacitate most tigers.
--


Michael D. Hirsch		mhirsch@cs.princeton.edu    
Computer Science Department	Voice: (609) 258-1751       
Princeton NJ, 08544		FAX:   (609) 258-1771       
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: dsmythe@netcom.com (Dave Smythe)
Subject: Re: Speaking of Carradine and "Kung Fu"...
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 08:15:53 GMT

In article <1993Jan23.040634.7600@cbfsb.cb.att.com> osan@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (Mr. X) writes:
>Another good aspect of the show was its emphasis on responsibility  and 
>non-interference, i.e. allowing people to live their lives as they see fit.
>This was made clear in an episode where Kane flacshes back to  a situation
>where a gambler comes his master for medical attention after having lost
>his pinky in a wager.  The master tries to save the hand, but is not able
>to and tells the man that his whole arm will have to come off..  The man 
>refuses to allow tha amputation.  The monk waits.  At some point events 
>conspire such that the sick man asks them to please proceed with the 
>amputatiion, and they do so.

As I recall, they wanted to take the *hand* and he refused.  He eventually
came back to have his hand removed and awoke to find that they had taken
his whole arm.  The woman ragged on him because he could no longer work,
I thought.  When Kwai Chang asked his obligatory question: why did you remove
the whole arm? I think the answer was something like: If we took the hand
then he might not really get the lesson.  By taking the whole arm, they
pounded the lesson in and probably saved his life by getting him to give
up gambling.  That's all from (old) memory, but I think it's right.

>What I found proper hear was that the monks did
>not take the "we must save you from yourself" attitude that is so nauseatingly
>pervasive these days.  Tehy allowed the sick man his right to determine his
>own fate after having informaed him as to the possibilities.

But they actually *did* do something to save him from himself by doing much
more radical surgery.  I remember being shocked at that...

>I really think the basic quality of the series
>was actually rather good.

I agree.  I found them quite entertaining.  Still do.  It had more than
passing influence on my choice of MA :-)

>Ask yourself what you'd rather have your kids
>weatch; this or Knots Landing

No contest.

D

-- 
========================================================================
Dave Smythe   N6XLP    dsmythe@netcom.com (also dsmythe@cs.stanford.edu)
From: chang@adelphi-assb01.army.mil (Forrest Chang)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: TKD rule survey
Date: 27 Jan 1993 17:07:38 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

Dakin asks about the following situations:

	My opinion:

>1.  Inside crescent kick (push, not strike) to back of thigh to
>    jam opponent's back spin kick.  Is this an illegal strike to
>    the leg (remember, it's  a push) or is it a legal block?

	If it was intended as a push, yes tho' quite possible, the
defender meant it to be an attack on the leg and it came out a push.
This is tough, how do you determine intent?

>2.  Push kick to opponent's butt to stop his back side kick (aka.
>    spinning side kick, dui yup chagi, etc.).  Is this an illegal
>    strike to the back or a legal jamming action?

	This is legal, it was a push, no?  Also this depends on 
the relative positioning of both when contact was made to the butt.
If it was as I tried to illustrate in my last post about tkd sparring,
that's fair game.  To me, butt != back.  If one kicked the butt, they
either messed up and kicked too low or they're doing a cut kick on a
turning kick.

>3.  Using the leg to block kicks (either with a shin smash as an
>    inward block or with the outer thigh as an outward block).
>    Is this an illegal strike to the leg, or is is a legal block?

	This is illegal, bringing up the leg to put between you and
incoming kick is good.  From your description, it would be fairly
simple to "accidently" get some knee action into that block

	FO
From: roberts@pogo.wv.tek.com (Robert Stroud)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: MARTIAL FARTS!? - Japanese Names?
Date: 22 Jan 93 18:47:42 GMT
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Wilsonville,  OR.

In article <1jne24INNa8r@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> jmeyers@ecst.csuchico.edu (Jeff Meyers) writes:
>
>Now we need to research the ancient Japanese words / kanji for this!
  
    I can't believe I am posting on this but since you asked...

    The word for the dreaded bodily wind in Japanese is
    
    "Onara".  Now that you know just try and say goodbye
    
    in Japanses to someone without thinking about it.  Or
   
    embarassing yourself by mis-pronouncing Sayonara!

    
    A  :-0 to you all.  :-)


-- 
Robert Stroud       Robert_Stroud@simulacrum.wv.tek.com
Obukan Kendo Club   Portland Oregon USA
From: shulick@cineret.ucs.indiana.edu (Sam Hulick)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Fighting against animals?
Date: 26 Jan 93 20:39:31 GMT
Organization: Vallen Software


I read somewhere that if you open your hand into a star shape (fingers
outstretched) and hold it front of a dog's face, it frightens them and
brings them under control.  Is this true?  It was some book written by a
group of monks (in the US) whose monastary's goal is the betterment
between dog & man.  Very good book, but this hand thing sounds a little
like BS.  Anyone confirm this?

-- 
    // Amiga 3000   ___ \ Sam Hulick: shulick@indiana.edu (NeXTmail OK!)
   // 68030 25 MHz /__/\ \  )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
\\// OS 2.04       \__\/ / (((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((
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Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts,rec.arts.movies,alt.cult-movies