From: a0cb@rigel.cs.pdx.edu (Chris Bertholf)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Kikes and Nazis
Date: 22 Jan 93 20:31:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: pdxgate.6737
Organization: /etc/organization

:>The reason for the concern is that not only do most Germans feel that they
:>have been forgiven by the world (that is 'they' as a nation, rather than
:>'they' as individuals), but many feel there is nothing to forgive.  As their

Such as many Jews feel there is nothing to forgive for what Xians call
Deicide?  It makes sense to me that I would not be responsible for the
acts of a previous regime, in which my ancestors may or may not have
actively participated in.  How is it that on the one hand, it is 
discriminatory and 'anti-semitic" (more about that later) for a
Xian to believe the Jews are Christ killers (i.e., placing the blame
for the death of someone on a whole race) but it is OK for Jews to
say the same thing about all Germans (i.e., they are collectively
responsible for the acts of some)...  Interesting phenomenon!

:>characteristics have not changed at all, they are once again a dangerous

Which STEREOTYPES are you speaking of, Mr. biggot?

:>threat while this state of affairs is allowed to continue.  As their 
:>economic situation worsens (as a result of unification they are only just
:>starting the recession from which the UK is apparently recovering), the
:>number of unemployed increases, the level of salaries and unfavourable
:>exchange rates make German goods less desirable, we can only expect the
:>racial tensions in Germany to become worse.

Sure, racial tensions are mounting in Germany.  And they are calm in
the Afro-Asiatic regions, especially in Israel. There are also no
tensions in the US, Bosnia, SOUTH AFRICA, etc.  NOT!

:>true that the Germans give
:>aid to Israel, but let us also remember  [... junk deleted]
:>the entire reason for the latter is an attempt to show the
:>world they are sorry.

Sorry for what they have done, or restitution for something the current
generation of germans DID NOT DO, but feel obligated to do because of
attitudes like yours...

:>Let me make one more point.  In countries where the word Jew is hardly known
:>(in South East Asia), the Germans are heartily disliked solely as a result
:>of their reputation as aggressive and demanding tourists and their superior
:>and assertive natures.

This is patently false.  Sure, I have met some aggressive Germans, but I have
also met many kind, peaceful, intelligent, and caring Germans, both in and
out of Germany.  Considering that I have stayed in Germany 5 times, for
durations of 2 days through durations of many weeks, I think my perspective
is probably not as skewed as some others.  As a whole, they don't strike
me as much more arrogant than the average Jew, Swiss, or US citizen
(not that I am singling out any groups, just giving some examples).

:>I believe this is also so in South America and
:>other places where there are very few jews about.  Thus the problem most
:>people have with Germans does not arise from the allegations of jews like
:>myself, nor the memory of what took place 50 years ago, but is a result
:>of the charcateristics of the Germans today.

PURE BS.  

:>Of course, amongst people
:>of my parents' generation (those in their 50's and 60's today), irrespective
:>of religion, this whole discussion would appear to be ludicrous - the nature
:>of the Germans is universally acknowledged amongst those people who lived
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This is not only patently false, it proves your ignorance!

:>in the allied countries during the war, and doesn't even merit argument.

Yes, I am sure there are many, such as yourself, that try to spread as
much hate, feuled by innuendo and promulgation of stereotypes about Germans,
that this attitude is somewhat prevalent.

Personally, I think this whole discussion is Anit-Germanic.  Is the pot
calling the kettle black, or what!

Stereotypes about entire religious groups, races, national origins, or based
on any 'characteristic of difference' are still stereotypes.  Promoting them
indicates the level of tollerance you have for the differences of others, and
in my mind makes you just as bad as a dyed in the wool Anti-semite, racist,
sexist, or any other 'ist' by which the differences of others are used to
discriminate against that group which 'exibits the difference'.

This blather, spouted by you and many others, is as stupid as calling a
Pallestinian anti-Semitic.  Just because a Jew coined the term 'anti-semitic'
doesn't mean that it is a correct phrasing of what was described. Technically,
the 'Semitic People' include all peoples of the Afro-Asiatic language family,
(i.e., HEBREW, ARAMIC, ARABIC, and ETHIOPIC).  The complete ignorance of
people that use these terms incorrectly, make rash statement like yours
above, and are just generally clueless beyond the rhetoric and propaganda
they regurgitate is what makes reading this group so interesting...

-Chris
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish