HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lmc@cs.cornell.edu (Linda Marie Competillo)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Comments on Nonfat Miracle Whip
Date: 20 Nov 92 16:19:17 GMT
Organization: Cornell Univ. CS Dept, Ithaca NY 14853

In article <BxzBL3.H98@dale.cts.com> npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan) writes:
>I'm glad you brought up pie crust.  I like crusts on my pie-like items
>but the fat content on crust is outrageous.  Even graham cracker crusts
>are loaded with fat.  Has anyone successfully come up with a nice crust
>that isn't fatful?
>
>I was toying with the idea of turning an angel food cake into bread
>crumbs and patting it into a pie-tin and baking it.  Or maybe using
>graham crackers with NF-mayo.  
>

This inspires an idea that I haven't tried, but I make a very high-fat Italian
cheesecake with angel food cake: you pack the inside of a bowl with angel 
food cake and then layer it with layers of slices of AF cake and a mixture
of ricotta cheese, heavy cream and 10x sugar, etc. Then you refigerate it for
at least 12 hours and invert the bowl onto a plate and frost the whole thing
with whipped cream. I won't mention the shaved chocolate that goes over all.
So.......my idea is why not do the same thing with some sort of low-fat pie 
filling? Maybe sugar-free chocolate pudding or something similar layered in
the bowl with the AF cake and it wouldn't even have to be frosted with 
anything. I guess this isn't exactly a pie, but it sparked the idea when 
Nancy mentioned the AF cake.

-- 


Linda Competillo
Publications Assistant
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: jfrawley@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Judy Frawley)
Subject: Re: Limiting exercise
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 13:46:25 EST

In article <1992Nov18.144123.12444@watson.ibm.com> amygk@watson.ibm.com (Amy) writes:
>Judy,
>
>To me, determining fat gram content of homemade products is easier than
>guessing at some store bought products (like Tahini - see my previous post).
>
>Get a fat gram counter (like the T-Factor Fat Gram Counter, a small booklet,
>$2.95) or equivalent book. You listed the following recipe:
>
>3/4 cup walnuts               23.1 g
>1 egg                          5.6 g
>1/3 cup milk  (skim?)          0.5g skim, 6.6g whole
>3 Tbsp oil                    42.0 g
>
>total for part of recipe      71.2 g skim, 77.3g whole
>This doesn't include the flour (1.2g per cup) and bananas (0.6g per medium
>banana).
>
>Unfortunately, your yummy recipe is too yummy! Even if you get 12 slices
>of banana bread out of it, it's over 6g fat per slice.
>
>If you use the applesauce instead of the oil, cut the walnuts down (or out)
>and use skim milk, you get:
>
>1/4 cup walnuts                    7.7g   (chop them, they'll go further)
>1 egg                              5.6g
>1/3 cup skim milk                  0.5g
>3 Tbsp unsweetened apple sauce   < 0.1g
>
>total for part of recipe          13.9g
>
>A big difference. I bet it tastes just as good, too. I've been doing a lot
>of low fat cooking for the past year, making substitutions like these.
>Some day I'll post my 3g/muffin blueberry muffin recipe, and our lower
>fat veggie pizza recipe. I can't imagine ordering a greasy pizza anymore.
>
>Well, good luck and let us know if you try the modified version.
>-- 
>Amy (amygk@watson.ibm.com)
>My opinions, IBM's hardware

And, here, I thought I was doing so well using skim milk :-)
Oh, well. It was good, and I only had one piece; the rest
disappeared thanks to my daughter and friends :-)

I think I will try the modified recipe and try to find that
fat gram counter.

I wonder if I could use just the egg white. (2 whites equiv to 1 whole egg
in most modified recipes I've seen.)

I'll let you know what happens.

Judy Frawley


From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 20:38:08 GMT
Subject: Re: 1300 cal/day, why?
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet

I've heard the number from the dietitians at HMR.  The basis of it seems to 
be that a person needs to take in this much nourishment to get the
essential nutrients (minerals, protein, carbohydrate, even the smidgeon
of fat necessary for the bod), assuming a "normal" diet.  When we were
on the fast (800 calories a day for me and some others, 500/day for those
with less to lose), we had to take additional vitamin/mineral supplements
to get those goodies in.

For small people, the dilemma of maintining the weight *and* getting the
proper nutrition seems unsolvable, unless physical activity is increased.
For what it's worth, the dietitians at our HMR program tend to the
petite to *very* small range, with one lady pushing 90 pounds.  Let's see,
that's 990 calories/day.  Her answer is walking, though to keep her milage
at a reasonable point, she does/did carry her kid on a backpack to increase
the factor.  Since walking is a weight bearing activity, any extra weight
being carried helps to increase the calories earned.

Some numbers:  For the 90 pound dietician, to get the 410 calories from
activity, she'd have to walk 6.8 miles per day.  A lot, but doable.  (Numbers:
100 calories/mile for 150 pound person. so 6.8 * 90/150 * 100 = 410

If she carried 20 pounds on her back, it's 5.6 miles.  Not much, but easier.
BTW, things like aerobics can help here, as well as weight independent
activity, like stationary bicycling.  A strong rider can churn out 500-600
calories in an hour on something like the Schwinn Airdyne.  (I'm amazed at
how many small women are strong riders.)

Pete Brooks
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: When Food Is Love
From: jsl+@pitt.edu (John S Lundberg)
Date: 20 Nov 92 18:20:23 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <98520@netnews.upenn.edu> crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford) writes:
>Know what?  I'd love to meet someone formerly fat who followed X diet plan 
>and kept the weight off permanently -- or for even 10 years.  I still haven't.
>I've heard about them, and TV diet ads display them, but I haven't met one
>personally yet.  

You could wait 10 years and meet me...

I have a friend who lost about 80 lbs in the late 1970s on one of the
liquid diets.  He's kept it off since then by being very careful of
what he eats and living a very active life.

I know another person who both quit smoking and lost about 50 lbs and
has maintained both of those changes for about the same period of time.
He's been walking the same .9 mile loop every day for years and says
that it's like brushing his teeth in the morning--just something he 
does.

I also know people who've never been able to manage to sustain a weight
loss but who seem to be well-adapted to being overweight.

I think Calvin Trillin has written about a friend of his ("Fats Goldberg")
who lost a lot of weight and kept it off by allowing himself 1 day/week
to cheat.  I think he also can eat anything he wants when in Kansas City
(he normally lives in New York).  

It's been done.
-- 
John Lundberg
From: dabay@morse.cns.vt.edu (Marian Dabay)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Yogurt Smoothie Discovered
Date: 20 Nov 92 17:34:20 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech, Blacksburg, VA

In article <1992Nov19.181753.25446@pmafire.inel.gov> agnes@pmafire.inel.gov (Agnes Gentillon) writes:
>You can also use 3/4 cup of buttermilk instead of the yogurt.  

For all those counting fat, you can use SKIM buttermilk!!!
I like to take skim buttermilk, frozen blueberries, a little vanilla
and a packet or two of Equal.  Process in the blender until
smooth.  This tastes just like blueberry cheesecake.  It's 
wonderful!!!
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: awinters@hamp.hampshire.edu
Subject: please think before you diet..
Organization: Hampshire College
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 05:56:20 GMT

one thought I would like to remind you:  scientific studies show that 98% of
diets do not work.  This means that weight will be regained and sometimes you
will end up with more than what you started with.   the diet industry is
exactly what it says it is it is an industry....created to make money.  please
be careful with them.  there is no reason why everyone should try to be the
same size.  think carefully before you go on a diet.  there are ways of
accepting your body without changing it.
From: npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Salad Bars
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:34:48 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Titan Linkabit Corporation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Jessica Hart (jessica@wrs.com) wrote:
> >I just wish I could get non-fat sour cream in restaurants for my baked
> >potatoes.
> >
> Why not use nonfat yogurt instead. I guess restaurants aren't very likely
> to have it, are they? What is "nonfat" "sour cream" made out of? (My theory
> is that eating a lot of artificial stuff is probably not much better
> than eating some butterfat. For OUR health, I mean. Naturally it's
> better for the cows if you don't eat the sour cream. But this is
> not talk.vegan.flames.)

I never cared for yogurt on potatos.  And I _ADORE_ sour cream.  
Non-fat sour cream is made out of sour skim-milk, not very artifical, 
and thickeners like gums and corn starch.  They're doing amazing things 
with plant starches in replacing fat.  I don't think you have to be 
afraid of eating something "unnatural" in most of the new non-fat foods.
Any more than you have to be afraid of any "full-fat" food.
> 
> Why aren't there more restaurants catering to people who really
> want ACTUAL lowfat food (not just "natural" food like Good Earth
> or "diet" food like frozen Weight Watchers. I mean Cuisine
> with a capital C! I can cook it -- thanks to the Now and Zen
> Epicure cookbook and others --  why can't they???)

Oh, the Hyatt hotels have a divine selection of light (low-fat) meals
on their menus.  Things like pasta with marinara and summer squash and
scallops.  I discovered that when I was traveling once.  Tasted great!

--
Nancy P. Milligan 				npm@dale.cts.com
Titan Linkabit					cts!dale!npm
3033 Science Park Road
San Diego, CA 92121
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: turisja@cis9.b10.ingr.com (Janene Turis)
Subject: Thanksgiving salad
Organization: Intergraph Corp., Huntsville, AL
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 22:20:10 GMT

Janene Turis  -- turisja@cis9.b10.ingr.com
<standard disclaimers apply>
------------------------------------------

Cranberry Gelatin 
(Makes 8 servings)

1 large or 2 small packets of raspberry 
  or cherry flavored lo-cal gelatin

Mix gelatin with 1.5 cups boiling water.  Cool.

In a blender or food processor, chop 2 cups raw cranberries and 
2 tablespoons orange peel.  Add 1/2 cup crushed pineapple (canned
in its own juice, drained), 1 chopped apple, 1 sliced banana.  
Mix with 2 envelopes Equal or other artificial sweetener to equal 
4 teaspoons sugar.

Add fruit and 1/2 cup orange juice to gelatin.  Chill until firm.

Each serving provides (WW exchanges):  1 Fruit, 8 optional calories for
                                       the gelatin
From: crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Health Factors
Date: 23 Nov 92 22:18:39 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <19921123115542CSMSCST@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU> CSMSCST@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Chris Thomas) writes:

>Right.  Which is exactly anyone who understands research design
>doesn't do research that way.  You end up talking to exactly the
>wrong people.  Rather that looking at who smokes (is overweight,
>has high BP, whatever) and has survived, you need to look at how
>many people with that condiditon didn't survive.  

Well, it's a fact:  All fat people die.

Then again, all thin people die, too.  



-- 
The trick of reason is to get the imagination to seize the actual world --
if only from time to time.     -- Annie Dillard, "An American Childhood"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lauren Crawford  //  crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu
From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 20:20:44 GMT
Subject: Re: Help! What's Happen?
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet

/ hpcc01:alt.support.diet / parks_typ@med.wcc.govt.nz /  3:24 pm  Oct 28, 1992 /
In article <63620064@hpcc01.corp.hp.com>, brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks) writes:
>
>
>Thanks for that, it was really informative.
You're welcome.
>
>I have a question though ...
>
>You write:
>>The food bit is critical.  My understanding is that on a normal diet,

>What if the woman is about 6 inches taller than 'average'?  

Hmm, er, I don't know.  I'm 6-2, not extremely tall for a man.  It might be
time to talk to a professional.  Either a dietician or an MD should have
something to say, and it's gonna have a lot more information behind it than
anything I have access to.

>
>Rachel                           "Supergoof!"

Pete Brooks
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Almost non-fat pie crust (was: Comments on Nonfat Miracle Whip)
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
	<1992Nov20.161917.13736@cs.cornell.edu>
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 00:12:18 GMT

From Thursday's L A Times, embedded in a non-fat pumpkin pie recipe:

1 C fine dry bread crumbs
Vegetable cooking spray

Generously spray 9-inch glass pie pan with vegetable cooking spray.
Scatter bread crumbs over pan and evenly press into surface of pan.
Spray crumbs with cooking spray and bake crust on middle rack of
350-deg oven 10 to 15 minutes, until dry and lightly toasted.  Cool on
rack.

Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "A MiG at your six is better than no MiG at all."  Unknown US fighter pilot
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Subject: Re: When Food Is Love
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 06:09:55 GMT

In article <98520@netnews.upenn.edu> crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford) writes:
>Know what?  I'd love to meet someone formerly fat who followed X diet plan 
>and kept the weight off permanently -- or for even 10 years.  I still haven't.
>I've heard about them, and TV diet ads display them, but I haven't met one
>personally yet.  

I don't know about "diet plan X", but I've met Gordon Banks, and you'd
never know that he used to weigh however much he said he did (some 300+
pounds when he was in college, and he must be in his 40's now.)  
Which is not to say that he doesn't struggle with weight.  Part of the
problem with keeping weight off is that too many of us start struggling
again much too late. :-)  Losing 5 pounds is easier than losing 15 which
is easier than losing 50, etc...

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
From: MOSTERBE@cmsa.gmr.com
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: health clubs
Date: 19 Nov 92 14:54:19 GMT
Organization: GM Research Labs


In article <1992Nov17.101223.25773@newstand.syr.edu> mprisco@lynx.cat.syr.edu writes:

As for me, I just stick with my aerobic videotapes at home. I am the opposite --
 I agree.  Wondering what videotapes you use at home.  I have a couple I do
3-4 times a week and would like to get a new one but can't decide by reading
the boxes which tapes are the best.  Since I'm over 40, I need one that is
good but not terribly damaging to your body.  Can you (or others out there in
"netland") recommend a good one?  I saw one by Marilu Henner that looked pretty
good, has anyone done that one?
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu (Larry Watanabe)
Subject: Re: Swimming (was: One whole week)
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 21:46:58 GMT

shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan) writes:

>I read that book.  Thats where I read that swimming doesn't burn fat.
>Has he changed his mind on that?  The book I read was a 1978 edition.

I haven't read Covert Bailey, so I don't know if he has changed
his mind or not. However:

In "Swim for the Health of it" (Ernest Maglischo & Cathy F. Brennan,
Mayfield Publishing Company) Ernie cites the following study:

Appearance and circulatory benefits you can expect from 8-12 
weeks of swimming:

Body composition changes	Training benefit

	weight				loss: 2-6 lb
	fat				loss: 6-8 lb
	lean body weight (muscle)	increase: 2-4 lb

Circumference changes
	
	waist				loss: 1-2 in
	hips				loss: 1-2 in
	thighs				loss: 1-2 in

Circulatory changes

	resting heart rate		lower: 5-10 bpm
	working (submax) heart rate 	lower: 10-12 bpm
	blood cholesterol		lower: 290-40 mg/ 100 ml of blood
	blood triglycerides		lower: 10-50 mg/100 ml of blood
	stroke volume			higher: 10-20 ml of blood
	blood pressure			lower: 8-20 mm Hg
	HDL-C				higher: 10-20 mg / 100 ml of blood

HDL-C stands for high-density lipoproteins per 100 mg cholesterol.
The former help reduce the latter in human blood.

Source: Based on data from Adams, McHenry, and Bernauer, 1977;
Doherty, 1977; Frick, Kontinnen, and Sarajeg, 1963;
Luetkemeir, 1978; Wilmore, 1977.

(I don't have time to type in all these references - if you 
are interested, get Maglishcho's book - this table is on page 5).


Ernie notes that "If you swim a minimum of 30-45 min perday
for 3-5 days of every week, you can expect to lose between
2 and 6 lbs of body  weight in about 6 weeks. This rather
modest loss of weight underlies a more significant loss of
body fat that will improve your appearance dramatically ..
the significant loss of body fat coupled with the increase
of muscle tissue that occurs with exercise will give your
body a lean, firm, well-defined appearance that could not
be achieved by dieting alone."

-Larry Watanabe watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu

Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: body image
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:14:27 GMT
Reply-To: geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks)
Organization: Univ. of Pittsburgh Computer Science

In article <UezRquW00WBMQ5VY5g@andrew.cmu.edu> cj14+@andrew.cmu.edu (Cory Harper Jacques) writes:
>Any suggestions on buiding a positive body image? I've lost weight and
>feel great, but I still think of myself poorly and when the opposite sex
>touches me I almost cringe! I believe that my self image will have a big
>effeect on my ability to accept myself and keep the weight off! So I
>need suggestions on changing my body image and making it possitive!!!
>

Well, I can tell you what helped me.  It took some time after
I lost 160 lbs before my mind actually started thinking of myself
as a thin person.  Buying new clothes, especially those that
flatter your new physique can help.  Engaging in competitive
athletics can also help (unless you're a klutz, I suppose).
Being able to hold my own with my peers or even with younger
men did a great deal for my body image and self esteem.  Certainly
a good exersize program and being very fit will do a lot for
your self esteem also.  If you've been a recluse, you may need
to get more social experience with the opposite sex (you didn't
say what your sex was and I'm not sure whether Cory is a man's or
woman's name).

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gordon Banks  N3JXP      | "I have given you an argument; I am not obliged
geb@cadre.dsl.pitt.edu   |  to supply you with an understanding." -S.Johnson
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: trumpins@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Barbara Trumpinski)
Subject: Re: holiday dieting
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 02:39:39 GMT
Keywords: diet holidays socials

In <grenus.722024304@pasture.ecn.purdue.edu> grenus@pasture.ecn.purdue.edu (Karen M Grenus) writes:

>How are people handling the holidays? So far I have a potluck and two 
>Thanksgiving dinners to go to. I've been on NutriSystem for 4 weeks and
>have lost 10 pounds, but I'm afraid of gaining it back.
>	Should I just eat very little the day of the party and work out like mad that week? I don't want to offend the people that invited me to dinner by not
>eating or by whipping out my own freeze dried entree.

>Karen Grenus

well....we are spending this sunday at my mother-in-law's house...a
minimum of 2 high fat meals in about 5 hours...then is thanksgiving
day (i have to fix something for my husband, stepson....), friday -
sunday is a science fiction convention (fast food and open
bar...chips, etc. in the con suite) and saturday afternoon my mom is
doing a traditional thanksgiving dinner...

i am taking diet soda EVERYWHERE...and i have an appoinment with my
nutritionist for the following week....but all i am doing otherwise is
eating what is there...and limiting my portion size...

.....

(add to this the hormonal changes to which women fall prey at certain
times of the month....sigh)

barb t.

--
***************************************************************************
conan the librarian a.k.a. kitten           /\ /\  barbara ann 
"my life's a soap opera, isn't yours?"      {=.=}
                                              ~   trumpins@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu 
"love is the wild card of existance"
                          rita mae brown
From: npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: body image
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:23:08 GMT
Organization: Titan Linkabit Corporation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

I've noticed that people's body images seldom reflect how I perceive
their bodies.  I once had a roommate that was quite rotund (sounds like
the beginning of a limmerk), and she didn't usually see herself that
way at all.  She once compared herself to Marilyn Monroe, which is
apparently how she saw herself.  But when she saw a photograph of
herself she got very depressed about her weight.  For some odd
reason we can seem to edit our image in mirrors.

I also didn't see myself as really fat when I was, and it was a
photograph of me with my little 4 year old neice that convinced
me how huge I was.

It seems like I get a clearer idea of my body when I see it in a
picture.  Maybe that's because I can see the whole thing at once, 
rather than just focusing on a piece at a time.
--
Nancy P. Milligan 				npm@dale.cts.com
Titan Linkabit					cts!dale!npm
3033 Science Park Road
San Diego, CA 92121
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: liana@nexus.yorku.ca (Liana Simons)
Subject: Re: E-Mail WW Group
Organization: York University, CS Dept. Toronto
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 01:33:36 GMT

Me too and I also sent back the questionaire....


Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: mazur@inmet.camb.inmet.com (Beth Mazur)
Subject: Re: Swimming (was: One whole week)
Organization: Intermetrics Inc, Cambridge MA
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:59:36 GMT

In article <Nov.17.11.42.02.1992.9354@gandalf.rutgers.edu> shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan) writes:
>I read that book.  Thats where I read that swimming doesn't burn fat.
>Has he changed his mind on that?  The book I read was a 1978 edition.

No, it looks like the consensus is that swimming is a good way to
become fitter (in a cardiovascular sense), but not necessarily the
best way to lose fat.  There are theories why that is (cold water, 
increased appetite, etc.), but nobody really knows the real story.

Beth Mazur                   "...life is more than a vision.  The sweetest
mazur@inmet.inmet.com         part is acting after making a decision."
...!uunet!inmet!mazur                                  -- The Indigo Girls
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu (Larry Watanabe)
Subject: Re: please think before you diet..
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 03:51:10 GMT

abel@vax.sonoma.edu writes:

>As far as the statistics go, somebody should have filled Bill Clinton 
>in.  The chances of one of perhaps 200 million eligible people 
>actually becoming President is so low that it is almost ridiculous.  
>So, he should have gotten smart and never tried.

Speaking of Bill Clinton, do you notice that there seems
to be an awful lot of media coverage of his exercising?
He seems to have a constant struggle to control his weight.

It'll be nice have a president you can identify with :)

-Larry  Watanabe watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu


Newsgroups: alt.support.diet