From: sinhaa@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (Anand Sinha)
Subject: Re: Value of Stats
Organization: Department of Computer Science, McMaster University
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 20:20:50 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.193135.6882@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> 91287041@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (roger maynard) writes:
>
>The only time the argument "who is the better player" has any meaning at all
>is in spring training when one player is trying to beat another out.  And
>seldom is that decision based mainly on statistics.  Of course the nerds well
                                                                    ^^^^
NERDS? what is there a new movie coming out? The Revenge of the Bad News Bears
by the Nerds? The Tri-Lambdas go to spring training with the Bad News Bears?

>try to say that it should be...

Actually, spring training is the one time when "nerds" say that spring training
numbers do not mean anything. Ever heard of "sample size"? I didn't think so
Roger. 

the rest of the time the question "who is the
>better player" is impossible to answer.  You can determine who has the 
>better DA or OPI or OBA or whatever but that is only going to tell you who
>has the best statistics and not who the best player is.  And if you think that
>they are one and the same then you have closed your eyes to a large part of
>the game.

Do you ever get anything through your thick skull?? No one has said that
stats show you who the best player is.  They do HELP to show who the better
player is.  

READ MY LIPS ROGER AND THE REST OF YOU ::

STATHEADS(tm) ARE BASEBALL FANS FIRST. WE USE STATISTICS TO, IN OUR OPINION,
GAIN A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF THE GAME. WE DON'T BELIEVE IN INSIPID STATS LIKE
"hitting .250 against LHP with runners on 3rd on a Sunday after a full moon". 
NUMBERS LIKE OBA, SLG, DA, HELP US TO APPRECIATE TALENT. 

As an example of this...Alfredo Griffin has long been one of my favourite
players. (Ok I admit this).  I was sorry to see him leave Toronto so that 
Tony Fernandez could play SS. I was glad that he was on the Dodger team
that won the WS in '88.  On the other hand, I hold no illusions about his
value to the Blue Jays in 1992. He has little or none, save that he may be
a good influence to the rest of the team.  I'd be a good influence for less than
1/10 of the $1mil he's making this year. And, probably, I could generate about 
as much offense as Alfredo.  Now this does not take away that fact that I like
the player.  I just think that he is a waste of a position on the bench, and
will do little to help the Jays with the WS this year.  The statistics that
Alfredo has managed over the years only helps to prove that he is, offensively
and defensively, a liability.  His clubhouse spirit is not measurable, nor can
you show me a) that it *does* help a team b) that he actually does have team
spirit, and c) that there aren't 100 million other people in the world who 
can do exactly what he does for the ball club.  Get it yet Roger? Or did you
lose interest in my post once I used the "statistic" word?

To the other netters sorry for my tone with Roger. I have a personal peeve
with the "gentleman" for his ad hominem attacks on my hometown in rec.sport.
hockey, and I think that his attitude deserves this kind of treatment.


Anand Sinha
Blue Jays #1 -> all the way in '92
Robbie Alomar for MVP
Juan Guzman for Cy Young