HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Subject: the best finale!
Reply-To: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 17 Dec 92 17:27:00 EST

 >>What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?

K>Oh, come on... if we're talking about finales, it absolutely MUST
 >be the last scene of Poulenc's "Dialogues des Carmelites". ;-)

Nahhh, far too choppy ....

Am I allowed to nominate the adagio to Mahler's 10th Symphony? It may be
the first movement, but it's the last he finished ....

Or how about the finale to anything by Messaien ... because it's
finally over?

And certainly, MOST definitely, the last movement (half the piece,
actually) of Mahler's Song of the Earth.

The allegretto finale of Beethoven's Tempest piano sonata?

The finale act of Verdi's Rigoletto?

The finale of Shostakovich's 15th Symphony?

Alexander Inglis  |  InterNet: alexander.inglis@canrem.com
Toronto,  Canada  |  CompuServe: 70307,20     BIX: ainglis
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: mgresham@dscatl.UUCP (Mark Gresham)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: How to read orchestral scores?
Keywords: scores, orchestra
Date: 17 Dec 92 23:42:12 GMT
Reply-To: dscatl!mgresham@gatech.edu
Organization: Digital Systems Co,  Atlanta, Ga

In article <1992Dec15.220402.4757@osf.org> coren@speed.osf.org (Robert Coren) wrires:

>There's an edition of the Beethoven symphonies which, for all its
>faults, is likely to be useful in the early stages;
 
Sorry, but I have to disagree.  Avoid the "arrow" scores at
all costs.  They are grossly misleading, and do not help
the beginner get a real handle on the process of score reading,
particularly for the "critical" or "serious" (read "in-depth")
aspirations of the original poster.

When I began learning score reading, in my teens, we were
specifically prohibited from using the "arrow" scores.

Cheers,

--Mark Gresham
dscatl!mgresham@gatech.edu
=====


Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Herrmann (was Dvorak's New World...)
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 17:52:07 GMT

Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley) writes:
: > Deryk Barker writes:
: >
: > smitra@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Sami Mitra) writes:
: > : Is it just me or do others think too that John Williams
: > : lifted the Jaws theme from the first few bars of the last
: > : movement of this symphony!
: >
: > I thought he filched it from Bernar Herrman's theme to Psycho, which
: > was - as BH admitted - nicked from Stravinsky.
: >
: 
: 
: Where did Herrmann admit this? I've never seen any such quote. The only place
: I'm aware of that he did any "filching" for Psycho was from his 1935
: Sinfonietta for Strings, recently available on a Koch International Classics
: CD.

Jeeez Mike, I dunno! I'm casting my mind back to things I read/heard
over 20 years ago. It sure sounds influenced by Stravinsky to me.

--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: parson_r@cubldr.colorado.edu (Robert Parson)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 02:50:18 GMT

In article <1gnii7INNibh@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu>, stinerkt@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Kevin T Stiner) writes:
> I just listened to Brahm's Symphony #1 over and over and over...  The  
> final movement is possibly the BEST ending to a classical piece I have  
> ever heard!  That sparked me to ask this question to find out what else I  
> should listen to to hear some amazing endings:
> 
> What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?
> 
 Rather than answer your question, let me recommend to you the last movement
 of Nielsen's 3rd symphony, whose main theme reminds me a great deal of
 the Brahms 1st finale (although the layout of the movement is very different.)
 Is this a deliberate "homage", or is it my imagination?

 The Nielsen 5th makes an even more obvious reference to the 1st movement
 of the Brahms 1st.

 Robert
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: johnme@ecs.comm.mot.com (John Meyer)
Subject: Re: ideal christmas cds
Organization: pcb_design
Distribution: rec
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 05:49:44 GMT

>
>Sheeesh! Imagine what 3 and half hours of Clementi sounds like when he
>has the *entire* orchestra to practice with!
>
>                 ___
>                (o o)
>                 !O!
>                  -
>
>(Does this remind *anyone* of Edvard Munch?!?)
>

  Kinda,but he should be screeming with his hands on his head!



john
From: Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Urban legends
Date: 20 Dec 92 23:59:35 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada

I heard a story about Andre Previn when he was working in Hollywood. The
musicians in the studio orchestra tuned up on B rather than A. But Previn had
perfect pitch, so when the rehearsal started, he says "OK, let's transpose
everything a tone up!" (Corrections to this story welcome if it is not
exact.)
From: dg@dgupta.hpl.hp.com (Dipankar Gupta)
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 14:59:35 GMT
Subject: Re: Reply to Greatest Living Pianist
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories, Bristol, UK
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical


Seeing the following:
   : 
   : Top tier: *Sviatoslav Richter, Emil Gilels, Rudolf Serkin, Artur
   : Rubinstein, Walter Gieseking, Dinu Lipatti, Wilhemn Kempff, 

reminds me of a note in a Rachmaninov Concerti flyer, which claimed
that Rubinstein was forced to cancel his performance of the fiendish
3rd after Gieseking gave a brilliant rendition of the same.

I was wondering if this performance is available. 

-- Dipankar
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rsm13@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ravi S Moorthy)
Subject: Re: Greatest living conductors
Reply-To: rsm13@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ravi S Moorthy)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 01:51:11 GMT

In article <BzF575.C2C@news.cso.uiuc.edu> bjh42543@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Brian J. Haag) writes:
>fernande@cps.msu.edu (Jose Roberto Fernandez) writes:
>
>>Inspired by the recent thread about greatest living pianists, I
>>propose another thread on the "greatest living conductors."  So,
>>who do you think are the greatest living (or recently died) 
>>conductors?  I nominate the following for the top tier:
>
>>*Karajan, Solti, Giulini, and *Bernstein
>>(additional possibilities being Abbado, Haitink, and Maazel)
>>(*-died recently)
>
>Giulini is good, but I really don't think that he belongs in the same category
>with the other three that you mentioned.  Also, I would nominate the fast-
>rising Simon Rattle for the second tier along with Giulini.

I would add 
1)  Michael Tilson Thomas to it.  I liked his Prokofiev's
    Symphony no 5

2)  Pinnock, Ashkenazy, Dutoit, Boulez, Jarvi and Leppard.
                                                                       
There are other names also but I would stick to these.

Ravi
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ridgway@athena.mit.edu (Lee Ridgway)
Subject: Re: Samuel Barber's Hermit Songs
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 21:09:22 GMT

A brand new biography has been published by Oxford U. Press. It's by Barbara
Heyman (I think that's how I remember the name), and the title is "Samuel
Barber: The Composer and His Music"  (or something like that).
I leafed through it in the MIT Music library yesterday and it looks
thorough.

The only other biography I know is one that came out in the 50s.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ted@dgbt.doc.ca (Ted Grusec)
Subject: Re: interesting phenomenon
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 92 00:59:09 GMT

In article <724114284.8050.0@romulus.mercury.andrew.cmu.edu> Ken Zuroski <kz08+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>Hi:
>
>I've been listening to quite a bit of modern classical music as of
>late--the first time I ever really got into it in my life. One
>interesting side effect of all this listening is that: more and more
>when I'm just sitting doing some work and NOT listening to music, all of a
>sudden I find the ambient sounds around me are somehow working together
>and producing "music," which is almost as pleasurable an experience as
>if I put some Bartok or Stravinsky on the CD player. I guess my brain
>is becoming tuned to appreciate odd and--I don't have the correct
>terminology to describe this--exotic tempos, syncopations etc., as well
>as "atonal" (correct word?) pitches and so forth; a sudden
>repetition of phrases is no longer a requirement for me to
>consider a sound "music." For instance, just before I posted this--in
>fact, what posted me to prompt--was that I was listening to a
>combination of the whir of my computer's hard drive, which seemed to be
>punctuated by the sounds of someone shoveling snow from outside my
>house, with the sounds of water dripping in the bathroom also thrown in
>there as another "voice."
>
>
>Well, kind of an odd point and perhaps it should better be directed at 
>sci.psychology, but I was interested if others experienced this when they
>first began listening to modern music. 


What you are reporting is a common experience for a sensitive, musical
mind.>
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Ted Grusec - Communications Research Centre, Ottawa, Ont., Canada
From: kre@po.CWRU.edu (Keith R.W. Elflein)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: organized music
Followup-To: rec.music.classical
Date: 14 Dec 1992 04:59:02 GMT
Organization: International Horn Society
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: b61693.student.cwru.edu

I am a music performance major here at CIM/CWRU. actually, i am a double
major with chemical engineering being my second major. I just want to say
that i am sick and tired of the way that organized music (symphonic) is run
in the United States. I am fed up with all the lack of jobs, the poor
wages, the shitty benefits, and especially THE ATTITUDES. Look people, if
you are going to be in music, be in it for the right reason. Music is not a
power struggle, it is expression. I only want to play, not to conquor. I
was going to go to Eastman, but i decided against it due to the above
conditions. The perfect job for me would be to play professionally, but,
let's face it, it's just not practical,that's why i chose double-major, and
i truely feel sorry for all the poor souls who are in music alone and will
have no job, or a shitty one at best.THOSE OF YOU WITH ATTITUDES, and you
know who you are, GET A REAL LIFE! your attitudes make you all the worst
bunch of musicians to walk the planet. I hope you all end up working for
K-mart.


"When tears of joy are flowing, Love laughs sweetly at the beloved! To kiss
them from her cheeks is Love's most beautiful, greatest payment."
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer)
Subject: Re: Messiaen Favorites (not Turangalila)
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 15:09:13 GMT

In article <2B31ACA1.1286@news.service.uci.edu> josh@aris.ss.uci.edu (Josh Stern) writes:
>
>Organ:
>     Les Corps Glorieux - (1939); L'Ascension (1933).  Louis Thiry, Calliope.

L'Ascension is also written for orchestra, and it is very good early
Messiaen.  You can really hear his Debussy influences on this.

>For Piano:
>     Visions de l'Amen (1950) - two pianos; Canteyodjaya (1953).  
>     Yvonne Loriod & O. Messiaen, Ades.

Also 20 Regards sur L'Enfent Jesus is very good.

One of my favorites is Chronochromie (the color of time) but I know that
last movement will raise some eyebrows. 

Jeff

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: jtbell@hubcap.clemson.edu (Jon Bell)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: Presbyterian College, Clinton SC
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 17:46:47 GMT

In article <1gnii7INNibh@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> stinerkt@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Kevin T Stiner) writes:

>What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?

In the pulse-pounding vein, it's hard to beat the ending to Rimsky-Korsakov's
"Russian Easter Overture."

Jon Bell / Dept. of Physics & C.S. / Presbyterian College / Clinton SC

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mvburke@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (mary virginia burke)
Subject: R*q***m 
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 21:49:32 GMT

WhatEVER.  I would like to put in my vote for a couple of particular recordings
that I haven't seen mentioned yet:

--Ton Koopman/Amsterdam Baroque Orchestra doing the Mozart:  For my money, THE
best, most exciting, moving, heartfelt perf available today.  Yeah, it's a 
period performance--but don't let it scare you, these guys know what they're
doing.  Believe me, it's worth the price of admission just for Harry van der
Kamp's rendition of the Tuba mirum; he's about the only person I've ever heard
who makes it sound like an actual utterance rather than a string of notes that 
happen to have syllables attached.  And what a sound!  You'll never go back to
those modern performances again. :-)

--Britten/Pears/Fischer-Dieskau/Vishnevskaya doing the Britten War Requiem: I
admit that Vishnevskaya isn't always my cup of tea, but everything ELSE about
this performance is magnificent.  Except the quality of the recording--even the
CD version is a little remote or something.  Anyway, I vote for Britten's Dies 
Irae as THE scariest.  

Cheers--MVB
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: learning piano on a Clavinova
From: Marco Simionato <simion@iveuncc.unive.it>
Date: 16 Dec 92 15:36:39 +0100
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Venezia (Italy)
X-UserAgent: Nuntius v1.1.1d9X-XXMessage-ID: <A754FDE9C0040134@quadra.cicsd.unive.it>X-XXDate: Wed, 16 Dec 92 15:38:17 GMTLines: 11

I would like to start and seriously learn to play piano, but I don't
have the possibility to accomodate a vertical piano at my place -
my parents would not suffer it.
I was then thinking that a Clavinova - or digital piano -
could do for a start, thus allowing me to regulate the volume.
I was glad to read on this list that such instruments are being taken
seriously by professinal pianists. What I can say is that last year
Sviatoslav Richter stayed at a hotel near Venice for a couple of weeks
and he had a Yamaha Clavinova set up in his room for rehearsing.
So this thing must be good!
Do you think that a beginner also could profit from it ?
From: abrocke1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Aaron Brockett)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Beroff's Prokofiev?
Date: 16 Dec 92 03:39:05 GMT
Organization: Swarthmore College

In article <chomicki.724092596@antares.cis.ksu.edu.cis.ksu.edu>,
chomicki@cis.ksu.edu (Jan Chomicki) writes:
> 
> In the local CD store there is a very attractively priced 2-CD set
> of all Prokofiev's piano concertos played by Michel Beroff. 
> I'd appreciate any recommendations for or against getting it.
> How does it stack against a similar set by Ashkenazy?
> 
> While talking about Prokofiev, any recommendations for his violin
> concertos? I'm familiar with Mullova's recording of the second and
> I like it very much.
> -- 
> Jan Chomicki				Computing and Information Sciences
> chomicki@cis.ksu.edu			234 Nichols Hall
> Phone: (913) 532-6350			Kansas State University
> Fax: (913) 532-7353			Manhattan, KS 66506-2302
> 
Well, I can parrot back what the Penguin guide has to say about Beroff's
set. They really like his performance, compare it favorably to Ashkenazy's,
and  give it their recommendation based on lower price and better
couplings.

As for the violin concertos, Kyung Wha Chung gives a maginificent
performance of them on London. Embarrassingly, I can't remember the
conductor and I'm only halfway sure that it's the London Symphony Orchestra
playing. It's offered at midprice, and has a great recording of the
Stravinsky concerto as well. Great disc!

--Aaron
Brockett
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: Mark Preece <mark@cambridge.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Xmas CD
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d7
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 17:07:49 GMT
X-Xxdate: Mon, 14 Dec 92 12:09:17 GMT
Organization: Apple ATG

In article <1992Dec11.174004.16257@tc.fluke.COM> Norm Strong,
strong@tc.fluke.COM writes:
>It's time for my annual Xmas CD, and I'm looking for recommendations.
>
>It should be for chorus, with or without accompaniment, and have lots of
>rarely heard music.  I don't want another CD with the usual English
>stuff.  

I've just discovered "A Boy was Born" by Britten on Virgin Classics, sung
by the London Sinfonietta Chorus & the Choristers of St Paul's Cathedral,
conducted by Terry Edwards. It also contains "A Shepherd's Carol", "Hymn
[not Ode] to Saint Cecilia", and other stuff. Nice stuff. New to me, but
might be the usual English stuff to others...

-Mark Preece
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Subject: beethoven's piano sonatas
Reply-To: "alexander inglis" <alexander.inglis@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 11 Dec 92 15:44:16 EST

RAGS>A rather hard-to-find set by Anton Kuerti was released in the mid '70's -
    >early 80's (I think) and is well worth a listen (if you ever come across
    >it).  I don't know if it was ever reissued on CD.  Pity if not.

RAGS>(BTW - Kuerti is a good contender for the "most-overlooked, underrated
    >pianist" category.)

The set was recorded for a short-lived Canadian company, Aquitaine.
Kuerti and the company got into a row over rights and payments. In fac,
Kuerti ended up not being reimbursed for much of the recording costs --
it was quite a fiasco. When the German subsidiary of CBS expressed a
desire to issue the set in Europe about a decade ago, a spokesman for
Aquitaine said that, despite it being a record company, they were under
no obligation to release any recordings! I believe it was plain personal
enmity which finally denied Kuerti the German-CBS deal. A great pity!

Alexander Inglis  |  InterNet: alexander.inglis@canrem.com
Toronto,  Canada  |  CompuServe: 70307,20     BIX: ainglis
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: Other BEST finales
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 18 Dec 92 16:30:10 GMT

In article <m6JyVB1w165w@student.business.uwo.ca> r4smith@student.business.uwo.ca (Richard Smith) writes:
>for big, the final chorus of the St. Matthew Passion
>for little, Haydn op. 33 #2 SQ (The Lark?). 

I think this quartet is nicknamed "The Joke".

John D.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: bryan@netcom.com (Bryan Higgins)
Subject: Re: Good music for brass quintet
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 04:18:11 GMT

jcm2w@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (John Clarke Mccanless) writes:

>bryan@netcom.com (Bryan Higgins) writes:

>>The Ingolf Dahl brass quintet is a great piece.  Also, check out "Brass
>>Menagerie" by Cheatham.

>Where?  Did anyone record these?

The Dahl has been recorded by the American Brass Quintet (with trumpeter Gerard
Schwartz).  My LP on BASF is probably out of print.  Not sure about the
Cheatham; I confess to being confused about the original poster's request for
recordings.
-- 
Bryan Higgins, Berkeley, California  (bryan@netcom.com)
From: alves@calvin.usc.edu (William Alves)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Difficult concertos for various instruments
Date: 11 Dec 1992 13:02:07 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: calvin.usc.edu

In article <1992Dec11.045228.11335@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> jcm2w@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (John Clarke Mccanless) writes:

>Also, every Mahler symphony has some tasty horn licks, and of course
>every R. Strauss tone poem.

By the way, some time ago I heard a historical recording of Richard Strauss
conducting Til Eulenspiegel. When the famous theme first enters, the horn
player completely flubbed the top note. No second takes in those days, I
guess. :-)

Bill
From: hamish@netcom.com (Just Another Deckchair on the Titanic)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Bartok Piano Concerto Recommendations?
Date: 19 Dec 92 02:24:12 GMT
Organization: Pandemonia PLC

Does anyone out there have any strongly-held preferences for particular
recordings of the Bartok Piano Concertos (either together or
individually). I long ago lost my old Geza Anda recordings; what's
*good* out there now? Opinions please....

	Hamish
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Hamish Reid   +1 510 596-3917   hamish@netcom.com   hamish@sybase.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: Ockeghem (was Re: Lost Masterpieces)
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 06:40:10 GMT

In article <y1p2b+b@rpi.edu> mccomt@aix.rpi.edu (Todd Michel McComb) writes:
>In article <1992Dec19.063407.25773@Princeton.EDU> Roger Lustig writes:
>>In article <BzGqqC.CLJ@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk> Jack Campin writes:
>>>Almost everything by Ockeghem.  I don't suppose there's any chance of
>>>those works still existing undiscovered anywhere: just too old.

>>What makes you think there were many more?  We have lots of masses,
>>lots of chansons, a few motets (fewer every year as reattribution 
>>changes the picture).  The Chigi codex dates from his time or close 
>>to it, and has a large collection of his masses.  What large number
>>of pieces do we know existed at one time?

>Maybe there weren't many more.  I can imagine someone like Ockeghem being
>very discriminating in what he was willing to put in print.  But just

Metaphorically speaking...  8-)

>think of the ideas, the unpublished material, all totally lost.  The fact

True of every composer.  Imagine the improvisations that Haydn or Chopin
didn't write down.  Think of the 75% of Brahms' work he claimed to have
burned.

>that I can regard Ockeghem as one of the greatest composers ever based only
>on what does exist makes me really wish there was more material.  Of course,
>if the set of chansons finally appears here (and Steve Apter mentioned a
>while ago that it has appeared in Japan), I might not feel so short-changed 
>-- particularly if I find a recording of the Missa Mi Mi.

There is one, I think.  PErhaps on Reflexe?  As for the chansons, why not
learn them?  Find a few friends who can play this or that, or who can
sing with you.  

Roger
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Harmonia Mundi Contact Info (was Re: CD Pricing)
Reply-To: lampson@pulse.com
Organization: pubs
Date: 17 Dec 92 12:13:37 CST


Reply-To: lampson@pulse.com

In my recent posting concerning CD Pricing which included the text of a tract
from Rene' Goiffon, president of Harmonia Mundi USA, Inc., and my comments
thereon I failed to provide the contact information.  Since several others
have stated an interest in sending comments to Mr. Goiffon as well, here is
the address and phone number:

Rene' Goiffon, president
Harmonia Mundi USA, Inc.
3364 S. Robertson Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA  90034

(310) 559-0802

Of course, if you believe you spend too little on recorded music, then you
might want to send him a letter of support.  I suspect he'd appreciate it.  (:-)

Dave
lampson@pulse.com