HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lazarus@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Marvel Implosion Imminent? (was: Re: Marvel copies DC... again)
Date: 4 Jan 1993 23:56:08 -0600
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

intruder@cats.ucsc.edu (Isaac N. Truder) writes:

>Anyway, a lot of doom-saying going on here, but it's all just theory.  I
>really would like to hear if anyone is willing to say Marvel is not
>setting themselves up for a fall this time.

Actually, considering the amount of money Marvel is getting from
their existing titles, and considering that their titles are getting
the largest percentage of sales (something over 50%, but exact figures
I don't have sitting at my elbow currently), I think they can afford
to take such gambles as introducing new lines, and apparently they
do also.  Regardless of their motives.

I DO agree, though, that using a Marvel mainstream "star" to introduce
every title of the UK line was a bit hard to swallow.  I think that
the characters SHOULD be allowed to "make their own books", without
being wet-nursed along by the big money-grabbing names.  One of my
housemates disagrees, saying that it's a good business practice.  Well,
the tactic won't necessarily be the death of this line...

Bart -Laz- Smith
The 'Cat

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: maguire@zappa.jpl.nasa.gov (Kevin Maguire)
Subject: Re: The Big Marvel Slurp (Was Re: Marvel Implosion Imminent?)
Followup-To: rec.arts.comics.misc
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 19:06:11 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.073245.3315@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu>,
jelmore@nyx.cs.du.edu (John Elmore) wrote:
> 
> [Lots of stuff about the big boom deleted]

  [including John's]

> advantage it has over Marvel. That, and its willingness to publish things
> that are outside of the DC Universe (GRIFFIN and TEMPUS FUGITIVE are
> two good examples) that aren't striaght schlock--REN & STIMPY, KID-N-PLAY,
> CAPTAIN PLANET, and BILL AND TED'S EXCELLENT COMIC BOOK are examples of
> what I call schlock, REN & STIMPY's popularity notwithstanding.

Hey!  Did you actually read Bill & Ted or are you dismissing it out of 
hand as a silly-movie tie-in book?  I would have dismissed it for the same
reasons, except that it was done by Evan Dorkin (Pirate Corp$, Milk and
Cheese, Kyle 'n' Evan - Critics At Large).

Bill & Ted, while it lasted, was a great example of a Dorkin book.  Goofy
supporting cast, really funny stupid plot elements and lots and lots and
lots of alternative music in-jokes in the backgrounds.  If you like any
of Dorkin's other stuff, go to your local $0.25 bin and pick up some Bill
& Ted back issues - but avoid the fill-ins;  they're crap.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Maguire                       No, not THAT Kevin Maguire
maguire@zappa.jpl.nasa.gov          I'm a rocket scientist, not an artist
From: khale@camilla.Eng.Sun.COM (Abhijit Khale)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Did Ya' Notice in Future Imperfect
Date: 8 Jan 1993 23:04:31 GMT
Organization: Sun
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: camilla

Apart from the stuff already mentioned, look for the tiara of
Wonder Woman on one of the Shelves (the 2nd from the top, below the
one with Kandor). The shelf below that has something that looks
like Wonder Woman's lasso and the lowest one has something that looks
vaguely like Wonder Woman's bracelets. 

As for the urns, theres one with Kent on it (the first name is
not visible .. could it be Clark ??) done in red and blue.
There's also an urn labelled "She", which seems to me to be a reference
to a rather terrible film about some amazons in a postnuclear future
(the name itself is derived from a Rider Haggard novel). 

Also, theres the strip of garment on the roof, just behind the Wizard's
helmet, which looks a bit like Donna Troy's costume (which Perez
designed). I can't think offhand  of any Marvel character with
a costume like that [ stars in the costume ]. 

Minor nitpick : Are these the real things or merely models ? Some like
Wolverine's skeleton or Cap's shield certainly look real (Cap's shield
is undented, unlike US Agent's shield, which is destroyed). How did
Rick move Thor's hammer ?  Wouldn't Big Daddy Odin want it back ? Why
dont the rebels use some of the artifacts as weapons ? This holds
in particular for things like Cap's Shield, the Black Knights Ebony Sword, 
or the Absorbing Man's ball and chain. 

And there's Rick's comment : "Now if I had a giant penny ..", which
should be caught by any Batfan. 

Abhijit

PS : forget comparisons to A-2001. Why not go all the way back and compare
the very basic plot premise to Robert Heinlein's novella 
By His Bootstraps :-) ? 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: rogerk@queernet.org (Roger B.A. Klorese)
Subject: Re: What is ACME??
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 16:25:17 GMT
Organization: QueerNet

In article <1993Jan11.105124.22347@ousrvr.oulu.fi> sn@phoenix.oulu.fi (Sami Nieminen) writes:
>
>   Yeah, the ACME co... I've seen it in lots of american comics and
>it's been producing all kinds of weird stuff. But I'm curious to know,
>where has the name come from and why it is so darned funny ?

It comes from Warner Brothers ROAD RUNNER cartoons; it's the company from
which Wile E. Coyote is always ordering ridiculous apparati for his attempts
to de-beep-beep the world...
-- 
ROGER B.A. KLORESE                                              +1 415 ALL-ARFF
rogerk@unpc.QueerNet.ORG              {ames,decwrl,pyramid}!sgiblab!unpc!rogerk
"Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from."
                                                                   -- J. Foster
From: palmesap@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Allan P Palmes)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Action Comics 686 (clones)
Date: 11 Jan 1993 23:31:09 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department at Rose-Hulman
Reply-To: palmesap@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Allan P Palmes)
NNTP-Posting-Host: g222-05.nextwork.rose-hulman.edu

In article <11JAN199317431550@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov>  
sewon@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (WAYNE WONG) writes:
> In article <C0pCH5.1BG@news.ucs.mun.ca>, cwelsh@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Craig  
Welsh  ) writes...
> > 
> >In case people missed my post on the weekend, Superman WILL NOT be
> >coming back as a clone in any form. This was reported on CNN on the
> >weekend with the source being an editor at DC comics. He definately  
will
> >not becoming back as four clones, or clones in any way, shape, form, or
> >manner. The DC spokesperson wanted to set the record straight because  
of
> >the wild specualtion on his return.
> 
> I don't have all of the details, but the latest Comic Buyer's Guide 
> (#1000?) had an interview with one of the Superman writers (Jurgens?).   
The 
> writer commented that the creators of the four Superman books would not  
be 
> jobless after Funeral For a Friend.  Rather, the creative teams will  
work 
> on four new series, each featuring a *new* hero.  He points out that the 
> heroes are not the ones to be featured in Legacy of Superman #1  
(waverider, 
> and a few others I don't recall).  In response to questions about the  
four 
> new characters, the writer responded:
> 
>  "Something old, something new.  Something borrowed, something BLUE."
> 
> Hmmm....  The "four clones" theory would fit.  
> 
> The writer was more specific, but my recollection of the details are a 
> little fuzzy since I only skimmed the interview.  If there's interest, I 
> could dig it up.
> 
Well, Dig it up!

>  - Wayne.
>   
=========================================================================
>     W     A     Y     N     E     .     A     .     W     O     N     G
>   
=========================================================================
>                                                  
SEWON@LIMS01.LERC.NASA.GOV
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: dvc@eagle.hr.att.com (David Van Cleef)
Subject: Re: Harvey does Ultraman (recommended!)
Originator: news@cbnewsb.cb.att.com
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
	<16B4A1331A.YANJUNA@YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu>
	<1993Jan3.031752.6391@julian.uwo.ca> <1i7lq2INNeio@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 17:29:55 GMT

>>>>> On 3 Jan 1993 21:28:34 GMT, intruder@cats.ucsc.edu (Isaac N. Truder) said:
INT> NNTP-Posting-Host: am.ucsc.edu


 > Ultraman is a 3 issue miniseries and issue number 1 comes in two
 > formats. Regular and Gimmmick (with awesome Japanese monster card
 > and special  poly-bag design). 

INT> Yeeeow!  WHEN??

INT> And I think another important question here is -- what KIND of Ultraman
INT> are we talking here?  I've seen a lot of the latest Ultraman series
INT> (ULTRAMAN: TOWARDS THE FUTURE in syndication in the US, ULTRAMAN GREAT
INT> in Japan) and it's pretty weak compared to the old stuff.  I'll bet this
INT> is the series from which the comic will be taken.  I detect some
INT> high cheese-factor potential here.

According to what I've read, the comic will be set in the Ultraman
Great 'universe', several years after the TV series.
--
David A. Van Cleef			AT&T Bell Laboratories
internet: dvc@eagle.hr.att.com		Red Hill Facility, Middletown, NJ
					+1 908 615 4906
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: jd53@prism.gatech.EDU (DE LA COVA,JORGE)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Harbinger?: Is Peter aka. Sting gay???
Date: 11 Jan 93 19:02:10 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

Where the hell did you come up with "Pumpkin eater" for bi-sexual?
-- 
DE LA COVA,JORGE
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
uucp:	  ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!jd53
Internet: jd53@prism.gatech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: Greg Clow <ecurrent@zooid.guild.org>
Subject: Re: DC: Vertigo Preview
X-To: DAVID PAUTLER
Organization: The Zoo of Ids
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:29:00 GMT

pautler@ils.nwu.edu (David Pautler) writes:

>Laura Perkinson says:
>>	Someone PLEASE tell me that the guy who did the art in the Sandman
>>story won't be drawing the comic ever ever again! Lord that was wretched
>>looking stuff.
>
>I wholeheartedly disagree.  Kent Williams is my favorite artist so far.
>I wish they would have used his depiction from the very start and get
>rid of that cartoony fright wig Dream's been wearing (yes, I know Neil
>draws Morpheus this way too).  I'm really tired of having the art ruin
>the story for me.

Hear hear!  I, too, have been pretty disappointed with the last couple of 
art teams in SANDMAN.  Not that Jill Thompson, for example, is a horrible 
artist... she's not, but her interpetations of some of the characters 
(especially Morpheus) really turns me off.  (add to that the fact that I 
don't think Vince Locke's inking meshes very well with Thompson's pencils) 
Williams' stuff tends to be a little too... abstract, I suppose for some 
people, but I think his stuff is amazing.


>What else has Kent Williams done?

Let's see.  Most recently, he did the TELL ME, DARK hardcover GN for DC... 
it's pricey, but well worth it.  A truly amazing piece of work.  He did a 
long line of covers for HELLBLAZER.  He did either MOONSHADOW or 
SILVERHEELS for Epic in collaboration with Jon J. Muth... they've both 
been collected as trade paperbacks, so you should be able to track them 
down and check which it is.  Also with Muth, he did some X-Men limited 
series thing.  And he did a wonderful 4-issue series for Epic called 
BLOOD: A TALE that's been collected as a trade paperback as well.

Greg



--- WinQwk 2.0 a#0
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: teo33398@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Doctor Zero)
Subject: Re: Sandman Speculations: The Villain Unmasked?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 00:47:30 GMT

richmond@spiff.Princeton.EDU (Stupendous Man) writes:

>Of course, I don't like the thought that Lucien is responsible
>for the demise of Ishtar, Capax et al., because I really do like
>him - he's perhaps the supporting character I'd most like to
>meet for dinner.  Happily, I think that Gaiman is too good a
>writer to make Lucien into the stereotypical comic-book
>"evil villain;" instead, I see Lucien as somehow reluctantly
>dragged into the situation.  Perhaps one of the other Endless has
>talked with him about the neccessity of Destruction's continued
>privacy.  Maybe he just knows more about the recent "accidents"
>than he's admitting, and isn't really their cause.  

	Lucien and Desire both.  I've gotten the impression from them that
they both know much more than they're telling.  Desire at the end of Pt. 5, and
Lucien in Pt. 4.  I don't think that they're actually keeping the middle child
Endless hidden, but they know what's going on.  And I really doubt that they're
the ones killing all of the old gods.

	In addition, does anyone have a clue about which god or goddess that
Etain of the Second look could have been?  And also in the latest issue, Lucien
is still Much taller than Dream.  Mean something?  No doubt.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Hand in hand is the only way to land..."    The Cure
					    "The Lovecats"
finger teo33398@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu for the extended remix .sig...
From: Peter_A_David@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: How does PAD write scripts for Marvel?
Date: Tue,  5 Jan 93 04:28:50 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world
  <92365.102749EAO102@psuvm.psu.edu> <C08z3r.Eww@ns1.nodak.edu>

What was the original question?  I don't recall seeing it.

PAD
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: rsholmes@rodan.syr.EDU (Rich Holmes)
Subject: Re: Why Vertigo? Was: Marvel copies DC... again
In-reply-to: Alexx@world.std.com's message of Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:10:37 GMT
Organization: Syracuse University
	<1993Jan6.145905.13727@schbbs.mot.com> <C0GAtq.5pH@world.std.com>
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 93 11:11:56 EST

In article <C0GAtq.5pH@world.std.com> Alexx@world.std.com (Alexx S Kay) writes:

>Secondly, they may be trying to get more reader cross-pollination.  If a
>non-comics reader who's discovered Sandman then picks up a copy of another
>random DC comic, say JLA, they probably won't get much out of it.  On the
>other hand, if they pick up a random Vertigo comic, the chances of a
>successful match of tastes and content are signifigantly higher. 

Sounds like you're describing me. I'm buying comics for the first time
in my life, at the ripe old age of 37, unless you count a couple of
Batman TPBs a couple of years ago. (I've been reading fantasy & SF for
ages, and I got into Pratchett, and I bought the "Light Fantastic"
comic adaptations, and then while hanging around alt.fan.pratchett I
kept hearing about this cool comic Gaiman does, so I bought _Preludes
and Nocturnes_... you can guess the rest). I have virtually no
interest in superhero books, and I haven't yet gone beyond Sandman
(and the Vertigo preview), but I suspect I'll end up buying at least
an issue or two of most of the new Vertigo series.

I don't know how many of me there are out there, but I for one feel as
though DC timed the Vertigo launch perfectly. (Hmm, maybe they're
doing it just for me.)

--
- Rich Holmes
"Grown men, he told himself, in flat contradiction of centuries of
accumulated evidence about the way grown men behave, do not behave
like this." -- Douglas Adams
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: lsmith@deci.cs.umn.edu (Lance "Squiddie" Smith)
Subject: You say Hellstorm..I say Hellstrom (Was Re: Marvel copies DC... again)
Organization: The Hellblazing Squids of the Poor
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 17:49:00 GMT

In article <1ijg9mINN8v0@matt.ksu.ksu.edu> lazarus@matt.ksu.ksu.edu writes:
>jdelisle@udel.edu (J. G. Delisle) writes:
>
>Haven't seen the ads yet, myself... I don't even READ the Spirits line,
>unless a housemate's picked one up and I happen to be really bored.  ;)
>Anyway, I must've misread your original post... I thought you'd said
>HellstROm, as in Damon.  Does this have anything to do with him, or is
>HellstORm something that I have NO knowledge of?

Daimon HellstROm is the main character of HellstORm. The ad copy reads
"What happens when the Prince of Lies finds out he's been lied to his 
 entire life? Daimon Hellstrom returns in the new monthly horror series
beginning in February."

The first issue (by Rafael Nieves and Michael Bair) has a parchment cover 
with spooky red thermographic ink. 

The distributors (and maybe Marvel) are billing it as a cross between 
Midnight Sons and Vertigo. While the artwork in the preview shot does
have the gritty quality of some Vertigo titles, the woman in the spandex
suit with no front looks more like something from Marvel. (Nice furry
booties!)

-----------------------------
  Lance "Cr2O3.2H2O" Smith  | "They found him in the spring, frozen in an ice
    (lsmith@cs.umn.edu)     |  block, high above any sky trail. He still wore
   Are my fiften minutes    |  his top hat, monocle and blue and yellow scarf." 
         over yet?          |         _Mr Peanut and the Glamour of the Snow_
From: silbrmnd@acf3.nyu.edu (Darkmage)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: DC: misc stuff
Date: 8 Jan 93 21:46:36 GMT
Organization: New York University

dhenry@plains.NoDak.edu (David R. Henry) writes:

>>>Hellblazer: this is one of my favorite DC titles. It's consistently very good
>>
>>It's inconsistent.  Royal Blood was a major disappointment, as were Ennis's
>>other attempts at blood-and-gore, such as that silly laundromat story.  But
>>"Dangerous Habits" was the best this title's ever been.

>While I agree in principle with Dani's comments (the one's on the bottom,
>for you latecomers), Ennis didn't write the laundromat story. I remember
>this only because I'm oddly fond of that story.

>Of course, I have no idea who really did. I leave it to those annoying
>netters with both memories and easy access to their comics collections
>while netting to fill in the blank.

It was John Smith.  I thought _Counting_to_Ten_ was a good story:
not the _best_, but good.  And I happened to *like* _Royal_Blood_; It's
up there with _The_Fear_Machine_ and _Dangerous_Habits_ on my list of 
favorite HB stories.


>"You've got to be an originator." --Richard Darwin

>-- 
>David R. Henry - Rogue Fan Club - "I have a pullchain in my head." -- RIII
>My mind is a jackal.--Richard Darwin // What was the question? --Kate Bush
>"All you of Earth are IDIOTS!"-P9fOS // Thanks... for the memories.--Rogue
>dhenry@plains.nodak.edu * ud137927@ndsuvm1.bitnet * ud137927@vm1.nodak.edu

	-DM

----
	*my .sig doesn't work.*
  Darkmage, the Clueless Wonder
From: manga@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Peter Michael Betz)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: New Years Eve party in Columbus, OH
Date: 5 Jan 1993 04:09:31 GMT
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4


help!!
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: kamg@ecf.toronto.edu (KAM GREGORY K)
Subject: Re: Why I watch Entertainment Tonight
Organization: University of Toronto, Engineering Computing Facility
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 19:48:13 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.173332.23426@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> dvandom@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dave Van Domelen) writes:
>So I can catch this kind of information.  Seriously, ET is a better source of 
>info on the entertainment industry than any other available on broadcast TV.  
>Every so often a really important (to me) piece of news comes down the pipe 
>from ET.
>     Also, as a Jeopardy/College Bowl type person, I need a regular fix of pop 
>references and entertainment news.
>     Dave Van Domelen, has taped the ET articles on Supes, Ren & Stimpy and 
>BTAS....

...and of course for those of us in Canada (and northern US) there is also
the weekly comic book show, PRISONERS OF GRAVITY...

Greg

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: jordan@castor (Jet Jaguar)
Subject: Re: Why Vertigo?
Organization: University of Georgia
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 06:06:08 GMT

In article <DAN.93Jan8150359@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu> dan@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Dan Parmenter) writes:
>Unless Vertigo is offering creator-ownership  (which I doubt,
>considering Swamp Thing is one of the titles, and that's been a real
>cash cow for DC lately everywhere but in comics) then it can only
>provide the illusion of change.  Marvel's Epic line (Elektra and the
>Havok/Wolverine crossover notwithstanding) still represent a more
>progressive outlook as far as creator-ownership. 

As several people much more astute than I have pointed out, some of the
Vertigo characters ARE creator-owned.  The ones that aren't, I will add,
are either old DC characters that aren't being written by the original
creators anymore, or the Sandman.  And from comments I've heard from Neil
Gaiman, the Sandman is going to be over pretty soon, before it stretches out
too long.  (On GEnie he said something to the effect of "I don't know of any
work of art in any medium that has benefitted from being stretched out
indefinitely.")

Personally, I think I agree with Abhijit (sp?) in that I could give a rat's
orifice about creator-ownership.  There are so few truly original characters
in comics that for the most part it doesn't matter who's writing them.   
(Granted, Cerebus is one of those characters where the writer does matter,
so maybe Dave Sim does have a right to be so obnoxious about the subject.)

I look on Vertigo as something that will save me some time.  As I mentioned
in one of my other long-winded posts, almost all of the titles in the
Vertigo preview looked pretty good to me, so SWAMP THING and LEGION OF SUPER
HEROES notwithstanding, I can count on stuff under the Vertigo label to
be what I'm interested in, and stuff in the regular DC label to be pretty
boring standard superhero fare.  (Oh, wait.  Make that LEGENDS of the DARK
KNIGHT and SHADOW of the BAT notwithstanding too.)

Chuck

-- 
                  Chuck Jordan | jordan@castor.cs.uga.edu
"It's for you, McGruff."
"Did you hear what he called me?  I HATE that!  Let's sneak up into his
room and drain all the liquid out of his body."		-- Sam & Max
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: cwelsh@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Craig Welsh  )
Subject: Re: Action Comics 686 (clones)
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 18:24:40 GMT

>that we will never get the "original" back. I think this is a plot device to
>waste some time until DC is ready to bring him back...sigh...
>
>By the way I think the writing has gotten better on the FFAF issues. Then again
>the death was so bad that it wouldn't take much. Still I am enjoying the 
>writing more. We see a totally freaked out Lex Luthor, which is neat. I thought
>the Christmas issue was a little too focused on just one story. 

In case people missed my post on the weekend, Superman WILL NOT be
coming back as a clone in any form. This was reported on CNN on the
weekend with the source being an editor at DC comics. He definately will
not becoming back as four clones, or clones in any way, shape, form, or
manner. The DC spokesperson wanted to set the record straight because of
the wild specualtion on his return.

He IS still coming back in April, though. Speculation as to how is
welcome, but no clones allowed.  

_craig 
***********************************************************************
*      Stupid Last Requests While waiting on Death Row                *
*      #1 - To hear "Wombling Merry Christmas" one last time.         *
***********************************************************************
 

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc