X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.csg-l
Date:         Wed, 19 Aug 1992 15:27:34 -0400
From:         psy_delprato@EMUNIX.EMICH.EDU
Subject:      Locus of Control, Behavior

[FROM: Dennis Delprato (920819)]

IN SUBJECT: Drivers, cognition, & PCT and perception


>>(Rick Marken (920819.1000))

>penni sibun (920818.2000)

>not really.  remember, i started out denying that there was such a
>thing as an ``environment.''  and i also denied that there is a locus
>of control anywhere.

>>Well, then it's going to be real hard to get you interested in control
>>theory. Your assumptions obviate the need to explain the basic
>>phenomenon of control.

On the conundrum of locus of control:  It is my understanding that
HPCT takes the traditional question of locus of control (it's
inside the organism--mentalists/cognitionists; it's outside the
organism--most behaviorisms; it's both inside and outside--cogni-
tive behaviorists) as poorly put.  Rather one part of the control
does not control any other part.  The entire system IS a control
system.  Another conundrum, behavior, enters in here (below).
Furthermore, control is not an "it" that one can locate anywhere.

>as an aside, i don't think behavior is ``what *needs* to be done.''  i
>think it's what *is* done.

>>I have spent the last ten years trying to develop demonstrations that
>>would show that precisely that assumption is wrong. The idea the behavior
>>is "what *is* done" is the fundemental assumption of ALL psychologies --
>>behaviorism, cognitivism, psychoanalysis, psycholinguistics and, apparently,
>>interactionism. You seem to be committed to this point of view -- so I don't
>>imagine that it will be possible to sway you. Most people feel the same
>>way -- at least tacitly. If you are willing to try to see our point of view,
>>I would recommend reading about (and, better yet, doing) what I call my
>>Mind Reading program (described in chap 2 of my book of the same name).
>>The program shows how a person can clearly and unequivocally be "doing"
>>five different things (moving five objects on the screen)

The five different "things" are five different behaviors, but none are
of interest to the (HPCT) psychologist.  They are not of interest because
they are structural, topographic, or physical behaviors.  To scrutinize them
is to learn what the person is doing--physically, not psychologically.  I am
getting at what I thought was understood in HPCT, but perhaps needs
reemphasized.  This is that there is behavior and there is behavior.  In
the most elementary sense, it is crucial to distinguish between behavior-1,
or physical behavior (the behavior of the moon, of molecules, of stones),
and behavior-2, or psychological behavior.  Most psychology up to the
present (as exhibited in behaviorism, information-processing theory)
has usually taken behavior as behavior-1.  Many thinkers have come close
to making the break--drawing a firm line between behavior-1 and behavior-2,
but have not been successful.  Freud, Brentano, James, and Skinner, among
others, have almost made convincing cases, but it is clear that we
continue confusing behavior-1 and behavior-2.

>>but only
>>doing one thing "intentionally".

THIS is recognizing behavior-2.  Intention, purpose are not found in
the behavior of the moon, in the behavior of atoms.

>>An observer cannot see which of the
>>five behaviors is intentional so any one or all could be called the
>>behavior (doings) of the subject. But, from the subject's perspective, he or
>>she is only doing one thing -- moving one of the objects.

Translation: In the absence of certain strategies (perhaps "the test"),
an observer cannot except speculatively identify what the psychological
event here is.  HPCT provides a theoretical framework and methodology
for understanding psychological events.

One additional point on behavior.  To state that behavior is the control
of perception is not equivalent to stating that  behavior (an "it"?)
controls perception.  I think that sometimes the latter is implied
in certain statements beginners to HPCT might make to themselves or
to others.

I hardly speak for HPCT.  Consider me a student.

Dennis Delprato
Department of Psychology
Eastern Michigan University
Ypsilanti, MI  48197 U.S.A.
Psy_Delprato@emunix.emich.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU