HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Major Label Music is EVIL!
From: denmark@csustan.csustan.edu (Mark Dinh)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 23:47:45 GMT
Organization: CSU Stanislaus

In article <Bsxouq.13o@rice.edu> mlevi@owlnet.rice.edu (Marcel Nolan Levi) writes:
>In article <Fvb-9F_@engin.umich.edu>, Mr. Q writes:
>>...  One needs to be at grade level 13.4 to make
>>heads or tail out of what I'm saying.  I guess that means all the
>>alternateens won't be getting my message, after all.)
>
>Name one 'alternateen' or anyone below grade level 13.4 who would be 
>on UseNet!
>
What the hell does age have to do with the music (or for that matter, 
understanding it).  I guess you guys take
pride in the fact that you listen to _complex, mature_ music and you have
_legitimate_ (make me laugh) reasons behind listening to it (i.e. major
labels suck).

I am 17 and despite what you think, I don't listen to Cracker and Bananarama.
Rather I listen to Catherine Wheel, Boo Radleys, Pavement, Superchunk,
Stereolab, Wedding Presents, etc.  

The reason why I, and most of you guys out there, listen to this stuff is
because I got a chance to while being a dj at my local college.  Hell, if
I had a chance to do this when I was 13 and listening to Madonna and the
Pet Shop Boys (I still like them alot), I would have gotten into these bands
earlier.  

So . . . so . . . go suck an egg.  Naw, just kidding.  Just keep an open 
mind about what and why you listen to these bands (this is really the thing
that should separate you from mainstream music), and don't try to pigeon
hole people or ideas.

My holier-than-thou 2 cents worth  :-)
-- 
*"I'm TV sick.  No one /-M---A---R---K-- --D---I---N---H-\ "Let me just once  *
*works so hard to make/----denmark@csustan.csustan.edu----\   be cruel w/o    *
*me feel so bad"--JMC/--------Cal State U, Stanislaus------\ being kind"-Ride *
____________________/-----------U at Calif Berkeley---------\__________________
From: mlevi@owlnet.rice.edu (Marcel Nolan Levi)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: what is SHONEN KNIFE
Keywords: banana bison baka osaka yakuza illuminati
Date: 14 Aug 1992 13:48:01 GMT
Organization: Rice University

Ilsa VanHook writes:

>the most important band of our time.

That's a good one.  I almost thought
you were serious. ;-)

Marcel,
mlevi@rice.edu
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: ralph@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Ralph Brandi)
Subject: Re: INDIE NET - Debate
Organization: Democrats for Broccoli
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 03:15:12 GMT

In article <37400001@otter.hpl.hp.com> arf@otter.hpl.hp.com (Andrew Farmer) writes:

>   Isn't this just the sort of argument everybody said was going
> to happen when alt.music.alternative was being debated?

Yup.  And the amazing thing to me is that the discussion is about an
alt group.  If people want a group within alt to discuss independent
alternative bands, they should just start it, not discuss it to
death.
-- 
Ralph Brandi     ralph@mtunp.att.com     att!mtunp!ralph

"I may have had the needle in my arm dozens of times, but I never
pushed the plunger"    -- Presidential Candidate Dave Barry
From: fsjdh@acad3.alaska.edu
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Velvet Underground, Lou Reed (Was REM sound alikes)
Date: 14 Aug 92 23:19:40 GMT
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks

I think you're really underestimating Lou Reed. The fact that he is a "three
chord chugger" is beside the point. Lou Reed's style isn't so much a superb
technical guitar style, but rather a superb songwriting ability. Look at some
of his solo work such as the album "Berlin" and you begin to see a more mature
writing style (which covers a broader range of topics than his work in the
Velvet Underground while sticking to a general topic - not an easy thing to
do). Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to take anything away from John Cale or 
Maurine Tucker (or Sterling Morrison and Doug Yule for that matter); But the
fact is that Lou Reed Had a very controlling presence in the Velvet
Underground. The Velvet Underground was a BAND, and respectively each member in
a band contributes their own style, but it wasn't Cale or Tucker who wrote such
classics as Sister Ray and Heroin. The Velvet Underground was also an attitude,
or you could say a way of life, and if the Velvet Underground is to be
considered as an influence on later musical styles (e.g. punk rock and new
wave), then it was Lou Reed who has more to do with that occurance than any of
the other members of the band. Now, while John Cale and Mo Tucker later Went on
to make solo albums in the same musical vein as the Velvet Underground, Lou
turned more towards his roots of Rock and Roll (this is even evident in the
Velvet Underground's last studio album "Loaded"). If you are a big fan of the
earlier style of the Velvet Underground this might be to your disliking, but
the fact is that he went on to make the music that he wanted to do, and was
best at, and in that sense he has never betrayed his musical integrity. John
Cale and Mo Tucker went on in the same way, but unfotunately never had the
comercial success that Lou did. What this all boils down to is that Without Lou
Reed in the Velvet Unerground, there wouldn't have Been a Velvet Underground.
The styles of Joh Cale and Mo Tucker couldn't have stood on their own without
the songwriting and Personality (and, at times, extreme lifesyle) of Lou Reed.
Lou Reed Captured what was in essence the Velvet Underground, and if that
doesn't convince you of his influence over later music scenes (even if it is in
a roundabout way), than I personally don't know what will.

Joe Don H.
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: kbennett@milton.u.washington.edu (K. Lena Bennett; Slacker Goddess)
Subject: Re: Who sings "88 Lines about 44 Women?" 
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 18:21:48 GMT

The Nails song was off the album _Mood_Swing_.  My ex had it.  
Skinny tie stuff.  Definitely not Trent....

Lena


Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: cc647@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Cornick)
Subject: Re: Nirvana and Sonic Youth.. The connection..
Reply-To: cc647@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Cornick)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 21:30:07 GMT


In a previous article, ab870@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Eric Rickin) says:

>
>In a previous article, cc647@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Cornick) says:
>
>>Yup. After _Goo_ sold big, Geffen apparently asked the Youth to recommend
>
>Sold big?  220,000 is big?
>
well, bigger than any previous Youth LP... bigger than expected,
anyway...

mark cornick                 stu_m1cornic@vax1.acs.jmu.edu
**********************************************************
love-struck ink runs farther unstuck tongues cannot regain
            so find another way to go -- jawbox
From: hamrick@milton.u.washington.edu (Mike Hamrick)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Breeders
Date: 13 Aug 92 09:21:48 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

Pat (Somebody you probably don't know) writes:

>    Safari? The first and last tracks aren't much more than standard
>fairy-floss, but the other two blew me away. Try playing "Don't Call Home"
>at 100 dB and see if you don't cry (like I did) at the wailing beauty of
>it.

Joey responds:

>_Standard fairy-floss_?!?!  Yow.  Granted, "So Sad About Us" is a fairly
>straightforward run-through, but the song's a classic.  "Do You Love Me Now?",
>though, is probably my favorite Breeders' song (so far).

[Cool description of why he likes "Do You Love Me Now?" deleted.]

I'm afraid I'm in Pat's camp on this issue.  The middle two songs on the EP
are excellent, while the outter two or mostly filler.  "So Sad About Us" is
pretty dissapointing.  "Don't Call Home" is as good as anything you'll find
on the near-perfect "Pod" LP.  They really have a cool fucked-up guitar sound
in "Don't Call Home," don't they?  I wonder how they did it.

mikeh
From: stefan@spc.nl (Stefan Posthuma)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: NEW THREAD: Favourite Cure Song
Date: 19 Aug 92 16:43:01 GMT
Organization: SPC Company BV, The Netherlands

edf250y@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au (Andrew Marks) writes:

>How about this for a new thread... What is you favourite (and least
>favourite) Cure song?

Okay, Faith, Six Different Ways and Desintegration are my favourites,
Hot Hot Hot off the mixed up album always annoys the hell out of me for
some reason.
My fave Cure album is Faith by a long way....
-- 
"We convoke the Nephilim and they come  {*}  Stefan Posthuma,  SPC Company
to us, strangers with the eyes of men."  |   stefan@spc.nl
From: houk@athena.cs.uga.edu (Joshua Houk)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: INDIE NET - Debate
Keywords: indie net
Date: 22 Aug 92 18:24:57 GMT
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens

In article <=x+nc7c@lynx.unm.edu> lazlo@triton.unm.edu (Lazlo Nibble) writes:
>
>If you want to create someplace where people don't talk about bands you
>don't want to talk about, you should probably make it a mailing list.
>No matter how convoluted a set of rules you put in a newsgroup's charter,
>people are going to post there based on what it's called in the name, and
>any variation on the word "independent" in the name is going to leave it
>wide open for discussion of all those (ewg!) pop bands you hate.  Hell,
>PWL -- Kylie Minogue and Jason Donovan's label, for Christ's sake -- is
>an indie.  Billy Ocean's on Jive, S'Express and Bomb The Bass on Rhythm
>King . . .
>

I think Lazlo hit that one on the head. There's just no way to
properly define the term "indie", at least not to everyone's
satisfaction. If we block out non-US labels we block out Flying Nun,
Nard Wuar, Xpressway and Paperhouse. Even then, what about IRS,
Caroline, etc.? Mailing lists can be focused on one particular
segment of the music world, and can be a lot of fun (well, depending
on the people who subscribe to them). Imagine lists devoted to
pop-losers, to NZ bands, to noise-rock (I will *not* use the word
skronk, 'cause everyone knows that everyone involved with the Village
Voice sucks *bad*), to, well, anything! (Provided, of course, that there
are enough people interested to keep it going.)

Yeah - I hate wading through these "Morrissey Vs. the Smiths" posts
as much as anybody (of course - the answer is they *both* suck), so
instead of whining about it - change it and start posting about stuff
you like here, and join or start up your own mailing list!

BTW - does anyone here know how to start one up? I'm considering doing
so, so...


-- 
Joshua Houk || houk@athena.cs.uga.edu

I promise to watch this if you promise not to go.
   - Polvo
From: rjc@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Caley)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Major Label Music is EVIL!
Date: 18 Aug 92 14:30:27 GMT
Organization: Human Communication Research Center
In-reply-to: conroym@news.colorado.edu's message of 18 Aug 92 03:49:29 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.034929.9242@colorado.edu>, Matthew Conroy (mc) writes:

mc> 1. Someone said that a 'true artist' wouldn't even record an album,
mc> they'd simply sing in the bathtub or something...well, this seems
mc> to miss the point that there is much artistry in RECORDING, not just
mc> in playing an instrument or singing, i.e. one's art may BE the 
mc> RECORDING, rather than just the song...

That was me, and I think you missed my point. I was simply pointing
outr that it is silly to say that a `true artist' would not be chasing
the exposure they would get from a major label since anyone who
publishes musyt want exposure. If singing in the bathtub wasn't
enough, they could do a recording and then keep the master in a
cupboard, that guarantees no exposure, no sell out etc. I think very
few artists would do this (there are a few who seem to need lit
matches under the fingernails to get things published, e.g. Kafka).

mc> 3. For me (and this is something i haven't seen here, hope i didn't miss
mc> it), the BAD thing about major labels is that they are, or are owned (i'm
mc> not sure what the difference is) by HUGE CORPORATIONS, which have the sole
mc> reasone for existence of making PROFIT...PROFIT is something i am   
mc> specifically against, 

So, where does your food come from? Manna from heaven?

mc> ...HOWEVER, i purchase virtually all of my recorded music USED, 

And of course, the shops you purchase it from are run by eccentric
millionairs who charge you exactly what they payed someone else for
the item and live on fresh air?

mc> 4. I wonder about this: "complete artistic control"...what does
mc> this phrase really mean? Suppose an up-and-coming so-called
mc> alternative band of the say Nirvana style gets signed to, say,
mc> Warner Bros., who tell them they have that C.A.C., [...] I just
mc> find it hard to believe that a label would support a band in any
mc> endeavor they might choose...

They don't need to. If the contract is done properly, the label either
publishes what the band produces, or they fall foul of whatever
penalty clause the contract contains. Metal Machine Music got into the
shops, so did The Dreaming, so did After Bathing at Baxters. 

--
rjc@cogsci.ed.ac.uk			_O_
					 |<
From: Mark.Cornick@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Mark Cornick)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: NY Eye & Ear Control
Summary: Tell me about it...
Date: 15 Aug 92 00:21:06 GMT
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service


I saw a CD called _New York Eye & Ear Control_ at my local used CD shop.
It's got Unsane, Cop Shoot Cop, Royal Trux, etc. on it. Can someone tell
me about this disc--is it worth picking up? Please reply by e-mail to
stu_m1cornic@vax1.acs.jmu.edu and thanks!

mark cornick                 stu_m1cornic@vax1.acs.jmu.edu
**********************************************************
love-struck ink runs farther unstuck tongues cannot regain
            so find another way to go -- jawbox           

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Xref: sparky alt.music.alternative:9026 rec.music.misc:21504
From: zappia@usops.enet.dec.com (Jim Zappia)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative,rec.music.misc
Subject: Re: Feelies info ===>> Read it!
Date: 12 Aug 92 21:21:53 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


>Anybody have any more Feelies news?
> >                         --------------------------

	Other than the band Speed the Plough being produced by a member
	of the Feelies I can't add anything at this time.

	- Jim
From: ben@athena.mit.edu (Ben)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Major Label Music is EVIL!
Date: 17 Aug 92 03:28:41 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
	First of all, I'm not ben, I'm his friend steve who uses his modem. 
	Second-- in response to justin@phoenix-- i wasn't "blaming" bands 
	So I'm not trying to dump on bands, per se.  I do think that one of 
	Anyway,

steve / WHRB
ben@athena.MIT.edu.
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: dave@bradley.bradley.edu (David Vessell)
Subject: Re: Major Label Music is EVIL!
Organization: Bradley University
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 20:38:43 GMT

v22964qs@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Mike Cluff) writes:

>graziano@rocko.enet.dec.com (Rocko Graziano) writes...
>
>>The only people I've known who dismissed bands when they 'sold out' were the
>>people more interested in the act of being alternative than in the pursuit of
>>finding and enjoying great music.
>
>Yes!  It's become a knee-jerk reaction for those Hipper-Than-Thou -- Those
>Trying So Hard To Be Avant-Garde.
>
>Just because the Majors have a tendency to prefer crap doesn't mean that 
>*everything* they release is crap.  
>After all, when has the quality of music been an inverse function of the number
>of people listening to it?  Hating music because more people like it is just as
>mindless and reactionary as *liking* music because more people like it.  

It's true that a lot of stuff that is wildly popular is fairly mediocre
because it needs to be homogenized to the point where a whole lot of people
will like it.  Regardless of why that is, without such music, the critics'
darlings would never get published.  It's not because obscure bands are bad
but because since everyone's idea of what is good differs so wildly, it's
unlikely that something really good in one person's eyes will be viewed the
same in another's.  At any rate, we need safe pop music that lots and lots
of people like.  Can you guess how many obscure bands Sire has been able to
support and record because of the money that Madonna and Depeche Mode made
for the label?

As Peter Schickley says, "We operate on the idea that all musics are
created equal, or as Duke Ellington put it, 'If it sounds good, it is
good.'"

Bon apetit.  And lets leave the major label bashing to the poseurs....

-- 
=========*davE*.....making the world safe for intelligent dance music.=========
--(David Vessell)--(Bradley University Computing Services)-(dave@bradley.edu)--
From: rm34@quads.uchicago.edu (Robert James Mohammed Monk)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Who sings "88 Lines about 44 Women?"
Date: 13 Aug 92 19:34:36 GMT
Reply-To: rm34@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Media Maven

In article <BsxIp7.1us@beach.csulb.edu> douellet@beach.csulb.edu (Daniel Ouellette) writes:
>In article <BsvMGG.KnJ@rice.edu> mlevi@owlnet.rice.edu (Marcel Nolan Levi) writes:
>>even suggest that.  The band is called The Nails, and the only place
>>I've seen the song is on a 12" with only 2 songs -- the original
>>version and the "Radio version" of 88 Lines About 44 Women.
>>
>
>There was also an original 7" with the same two versions. Also, about 6 months
>ago there was a rerelease 7" by (I think) Rough Trade with, again, the same
>two versions. This rerelease had a glossy cardboard sleeve printed in blue
>ink.

The song is also on an EP and an album, neither of which has names that I can
remember.  The album had their biggest "hit," "Home of the Brave" (aka 
Apocolyptic Be Bop).  Pretty good stuff.  I don't own any of this stuff-- it's
gotten rare in it's old age.

BTW, I think they sound more like Crash Test Dummies than NIN.

Brother Robert
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: burger@leland.Stanford.EDU (Scott Schlossberg)
Subject: Re: Talking Heads news!!
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 13:29:21 GMT

In article <geWSbMK00WDK87cHZE@andrew.cmu.edu> Vernon H Harmon <vh00+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>I just heard on the radio--the local classic rock station no less!--that
>despite the fact that the Heads said they were through, they will be
>releasing a new album in the Fall!!
>
>.....same as it ever was......
>
>--Vernon.

...Not quite the same.   The album will be a greatest hits compilation with 
possibly a couple of new, unreleased songs.  I think it's supposed to be a
double record.  Originally, this was scheduled to be released last year, but
some kind of problems with the bands split caused the delay.  Should be good
anyway!

Scott
burger@leland.stanford.edu

PS:  If you like the Talking Heads, pick up Uh-Oh by David Byrne...it's really
good (and not too Brazilian).





-- 
Scott Schlossberg takes his leave of you. | Selection committee still 
Drop a line at burger@leland.stanford.edu | attempting to chose quote.
The Texas Rangers will dethrone the Twins!| Stay tuned for further
The New York Giants will be back in 1992!!| updates...Scott
From: woodwick9526@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Gear Daddies
Date: 20 Aug 92 15:02:07 -0500
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

HI, me again.  I was just wondering if anybody knows anything about the 
Gear Daddies ohter than the put out 2 albums, a 3 song 45 and they are
from the great town of Austin, Minn. 
                        Thanks 
                                woody
ps. if you get a chance pick up their stuff.
                        Let's Go Scare AL
                                AND 
                        BILLY'S LIVE BAIT
 
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: flamengo@wpi.WPI.EDU (Lourenco William Dantas)
Subject: Re: FREE TRIBE CONCERT B^) .....WAY COOL!!!!
Keywords: FREE FREE FREE
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 15:01:13 GMT

In article <Bt3HxF.8ED@wpi.WPI.EDU> rmason@starbird.WPI.EDU (Robert Hutchins Mason) writes:
>In article <dchou.713923060@husc8> dchou@husc8.harvard.edu (David Chou) writes:
>>...Nonetheless, a great show, with Janet in that black outfit dancing her
>>slo-motion dervishes. I'm nearsighted, but from what I could see, she was
>>a babe :)  Anyone out there recommend their album "Abort"?  Like I said, 
>>I found it hard to concentrate on their music after awhile.  
>>
>>							-Dave
>>
>
>Has anyone else noticed at Tribe shows, that Janet & Terri where the SAME
>clothes for every show? I'm serious, I've seen them about 4-5 times this year
>and every show, Terri had on that green velour dress, and Janet in the same
>black outfit...  Just a side note.

	At Lollapalooza, where TRIBE played on the second stage, the two
	ladies wore different clothes than what they wore during Saturday's
	show. And for some reason, I always picture Terri in that dress,
	although this was the first time I have seen her wear it.

>
>And of course, you should buy the album Dave. :)

	Yes, definitely, an excellent album. IMHO, all the songs could
	be singles. 
>
>BTW people, the new Tribe material sounds great!
>

	I agree!

>-bob
>rmason@wpi.wpi.edu
>

	Oh, and toward the end of the concert Saturday, these two old
	ladies came up behind me (I was up front) to take pictures of
	the band. Turns out that one of them was Terri's grandmother!
	I thought it was pretty sweet.

	LOU (flamengo@wpi.wpi.edu)
	
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative,rec.music.synth
From: EIVERSO@cms.cc.wayne.edu
Subject: OMD got all their ideas from...
Organization: Wayne State University, C&IT
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 01:56:36 GMT

OMD got all their ideas from "KOTENMELODIE 2" by Kraftwerk
from the AUTOBAHN album, (IMHO)!
 
Well, maybe that's a tad extreme, but the only thing that is missing
from the Kraftwerk tune is the sappy--I mean, the wimpy--uh, the vocals!:-)
Other than that, it sounds like OMD. Which is funny cuz it was released in
'75 and OMD didn't release anything until '79.
 
--Eric
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
From: gairns@ccrs.emr.ca (Jamie Gairns)
Subject: 24 Hours
Organization: Canada Centre for Remote Sensing, Ottawa
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 05:05:29 GMT

	Twenty-Four Hours - Joy Division

So this is permanence
Love shattered pride
What once was innocence,
turned on it's side
A cloud hangs over me,
checks every move
Deep in the memory,
what once was love
I never realised the lengths
I'd have to go
All the darkest corners
of a sense I didn't know
Just for one moment
I'd heard somebody call
Looked beyond the day in hand
There's nothing there at all
Excessive flash point,
beyond all reach
Solitary demands
for all I'd like to keep
Let's take a ride out
see what we can find
Valueless collection of hopes
and past desires
Oh, how I've realised, how I wanted time
Put into perspective,
all I had to find
Just for one moment I thought
I'd found my way
Destiny unfolded -
saw it slip away
now that I've realised how
It's all gone wrong
Got to find some therapy,
this treatment takes too long
Deep in the heart
of where sympathy held sway
Got to find my destiny
before it gets too late
----------------------------------------------------------------------
			it is late








Seamus
From: wiatr-m@acsu.buffalo.edu (Marc Wiatrowski)
Newsgroups: alt.music.alternative
Subject: Re: Smiths releases
Date: 20 Aug 92 13:24:16 GMT
Organization: UB

how does this sound:

	"We hate it when..."  written for Johnny Marr    and
	"Your the one for me, Fatty"  written for Robert Smith

Any comments?

marc