From: dean@pico.qpsx.oz.au (Dean Economou)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: Modern Day Miracle!
Date: 6 Oct 92 03:47:00 GMT
Organization: QPSX Communications LTD, Perth, Western Australia.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

Oooh.  I really have to say something about this....

irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine) writes:
: In article <9226820.1659@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby) writes:
: >s342046@emu.insted.unimelb.edu.au writes:
: >
: >The whole philosophy of Free Market Economy is just a way for
: >the competitive countries like UK and USA (and Europe for that
: >matter) to rip off less competitive countries like Australia

First, I'd hardly say that the UK and the USA are examples of
comptetivie countries.  They are both falling down the same gurgler
as the rest of us.  The US is taking longer because it's so huge.

: >and New Zealand.  Why did "some" dumb Australian politicians
: >listen to their lies and follow their "orders" is beyond my
: >comprehension.
:

I think they were acting in what they thought was the best interests of
the countries.  I also think they were misguided.

: And look how well managed economies, and closed markets have
: been able to maintain, let alone improve the standard of 
: living of its victims.  I doubt that 'rip off' would apply, as

Places where these practices seemed to have worked include Japan and
some Western European countries such as France.

: this same 'rip off' usually means to make the home grown enterprises
: competitive and as cheap as the others in the markets.

But it aslo forces the standard of living for those workers down to the
same level as the "cheapest" economoy with which you compete.  The only
way to avoid that is to subsidise those workers with funds from other
industries which are comptetitive.

: 
: And please, no 'holier than thou' tirades.  The USA has experienced
: similar 'rip off' with Japan, Korea, Germany, etc.  USA industry
: is more competitive and stronger for it.

: 
: >
: >The USA keeps telling the rest of the world to open up their
: >markets, and reduce trade barriers, etc, and then turn around,
: >and took over Australia's three biggest export markets for
: >agricultures, and kicked Australia out of newly formed markets.
: 
: And Geoge Bush supervised it all!  Really!  I doubt that a
: presidential decree making Australian goods illegal or some
: such malarchy was done.  The USA was able to deliver cheaper.

The issue is not that we are stopped legally from compteting.  The issue
is that the US and Europe subsidise their farmers so that agricultural
goos (eg wheat) can be dumped at lower then "real" production cost.
This is effectively a reverse tariff.  Inefficient US and European
farmers are being subsidised by competitive sectors of their economies
at the expense of countries like Australia.  It's not that it's illegal
to do this, just horribly inefficient.

: There is nothing to stop Australian buisnesses from entering those
: markets (and if you disagree, please give examples).

Yes, nothing to stop us, but nothing to gain when you have a reverse
tariff subsidised by the US or European taxpayers.

: 
: >
: >It keeps telling Asia/Pacific nations not to form a trade
: >bloc, and then turn around and create a North American Trade
: >Bloc.  Having USA in APEC really worries me.

I think Trade "Bloc" is a horrid phrase, but the idea behind it is fine,
as long as the "Bloc" applies to gruops of economies with simliar
outlooks.  By this measure, Japan, USA, Australia, Europe and some
South-East Asian economies should all be in the same bloc. 

: 
: Because the US, Canada and Mexico are going to drop trade barriers,
: does not mean that they are going to form a protectionist 'bloc.'
: You assume too much here (that NAFTA is going to even work...).
: 
: Why would the USA in APEC be worrisome?
: 
: >
: >How can the rest of the world let USA get away with such
: >hypocricy is beyond my comprehension!

Short of declaring war, you can't really stop them.  All you can do is
show them that the current policies are ultimately damaging to them.

Cheers,
Dean.

: 
: Because its not hypocricy.  
: -- 
: Brent L. Irvine					"Dyslexics of the World
: irvine@decwa.ece.uiuc.edu			UNTIE!"		- Kral Maxr