HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: I want my SR2!!!
Date: 15 Sep 92 08:52:48 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology

In article <1992Sep14.232946.42996@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> kucloak@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>Better yet.  We could get FASA on the internet.

  Think about it for a second, FASA is a big (compared to the average size of
gaming companies) company. It's products (and thus itself) attracts a lot of
flammage on several groups.
  Would you really like them to see what people say about them around here?

1/2:)

>| Bryan "Use a bigger gun" Reed    |	

-bertil-
--
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."
"This is the famous Hasan B Mutlu-trigger, insert it in your .sig file today!"
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly)
Subject: Re: Looking for "women's" rpg.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 18:02:53 GMT

millerl@wharton.upenn.edu writes:

>I'll start.

>1. Less dice rolling. Ideal would be no dice rolling, since that way you know
>what you can do and don't have to mess around with probability theory to
>predict your character's capacities.

I think anyone will be attracted to a system with less dice rolling. I've found
most of White Wolf's games tend to try and reduce the dierolling. Whether
the higher number of women observed playing White Wolf games is due to this,
the subject material, or the fact that White Wolf has the best darn games
is unclear at this time.

>2. Less emphasis on violence and mayhem. In most rpgs the biggest section of
>the rules is the combat section. This alienates many people, especially women,
>who don't want to worry about murder and warfare when they're just trying to
>relax.

I don't think this is limited to women. I think anyone who plays RPG's gets
tired of the mindless combats. However, the resolution to many situations
in roleplaying games is combat. Ensuring that the combat system is dramatic
vice mechanical is the big challenge here.     

>3. Mechanics that emphasize *role*playing and perhaps problem-solving rather
>than power trip stuff and board-game style play. I think the best way to do
>this is to remove other distractions, but there may be some positive steps as
>well.

Hehe..kill all the munchkin gamers maybe? I know nothing tends to make a women
reluctant to try something than to run into someone blathering about their
52nd level Everyclass and magic weapon there is character. Usual response
from the females I've been with upon meeting the species Munchkinisc Gamicus?
"What a geek." Attempting to convince them that all roleplayers aren't quite
as socially challenged is usually the hard part of getting a women to try
roleplaying.

Axly
From: ztsindi@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (The Independents - SUNY Buffalo)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Sci-Fi Suggestions
Date: 7 Sep 92 05:39:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41


	Well, we've been doing some pretty good SF gaming with GURPS
recently. The scenerio is entirely home brewed, it takes place in the
late twenty first century. True cloning has been around for only 
thirty years (2060's), most of the cyberpunk stuff in SF is taken
for granted as is limited (in-system) space travel. I was more
interested in designing the social and political structure of the
world than the techno. Just easier to pull out 'device x' than invent
background material I guess (for me at least it is). I suspect that
what I've set up must be like GURPS Terradyne but I haven't seen
to much of that to know. We've been using this world for about four
months and are enjoying it a lot. A lot of background material helps
make it interesting for the long campaigns. 
	GURPS has been maligned as being too realistic, too fantastic,
too cumbersome, too simplistic, etc. Its a function of GURPS
Generalized nature. Actually the system can be excellent for SF. We
have certainly found it so. Its good for both the 'puzzle style'
scenerios and the 'action' ones. 
	A note on supplemental books. DON'T buy them! Unless you
have hard vacuum in your skull you should be able to think up
most of what is in the supplements. I bought the HI-TECH book
looking for ideas for my campaign. All I got was a hint of a 
suggestion about 'clone families' and a huge assortment of tech level
8+ weapons, most of which I'd thought up already (except the Hell 
Grenade). For 16.95 it was not worth it. The Worldbooks are Much
different IMNSHO. They contained much useful material. Cyberpunk is
good as is Gurps Space. 
	GURPS is a fantastic system as long as you use it as a frame
and don't demand that it does all the work for you. Remember G is
for Generalized and U is for Universal. We like to switch off GM's
while keeping our characters, much too hard to switch between systems
, with GURPS you don't have too. 
	So for all your SF gaming needs pick up a copy of GURPS today!
Nutritious for the whole gaming gang AND just pennies per serving!
							;) Joe
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: deitrich@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Dave Deitrich)
Subject: Looking for Saramud's Advice Columns
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 20:24:17 GMT

Greetings!

Are there any FTP sites out there that have all the "Saramud's Advice to 
Young Wizards" columns out there?  I have a friend who wants to read them,
but I never saved them when they were on rec.games.frp.archive.  Any help
will be greatly appreciated.  Thanks much!

Dave Deitrich
deitrich@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu
From: jfzeigl@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Jon Zeigler)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: RPG Fiction
Keywords: RPG fiction, drivel
Date: 5 Sep 92 03:57:04 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: The Great Beyond

In article <3563@bcstec.ca.boeing.com> hall@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Robert J. Hall) writes:
>Anybody have any interesting opinions, good or bad, about the relatively
>recent phenomenon of RPG-associated pulp fiction? I know some think this stuff
>is pure mercenary drivel, but I've actually enjoyed some of these publications.
>In particular, I've found R. A. Salvatore's (sp?) works to be an enjoyable
>read, and some of the Shadowrun books are interesting, if only for their
>novelty value. On the other hand, Pools of Radiance was down right painful.
>(Fortunately, many of these books are showing up in the used book stores,
>reducing their cost considerably.)
>-- 
> Bob Hall,                 | "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again.
> Workstation Peripheral    | Then give up. No use being a damn fool about it."
> Boeing Computer Services  |                                     -Groucho Marx

<<<FLAME ON>>>

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I have always considered this stuff to
be a sterling example of Sturgeon's Dictum: Ninety percent of *everything*
is crud.  I have *yet* to pick up a piece of RPG-inspired fiction and enjoy it.
Often, I find I can't even finish the book -- and I've got a cast-iron stomach
when it comes to finishing a book the first time through.

In general, the writing style is juvenile, the plot derivative, the setting
predictable, the characterization cardboard, the dialogue painfully inane, and
the overall quality abysmal.  The cover art is usually rather nice.

Maybe I've just been unlucky.  For example, I've never touched any of T$R's
stuff -- to be fair, I would guess that if there is any decent writing to be
found in this market, they probably have it.  Still, I've been burned so often
by this crap that I'm less than willing to plop five or six more dollars down
to see.

I'll stick with the *real* professionals, thank you.  Tolkien or Zelazny for
fantasy.  Brin, Niven, Vinge, or Anderson for the hard science fiction.
Accept no cheap substitutes.

<<<FLAME OFF>>>
-- 
* Jon F. Zeigler (jfzeigl@afterlife.ncsc.mil)                           *
*  "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Emerson    *
* The US Government and the Department of Defense are not responsible   *
* for my opinions.  In fact, I try not to let them know I have any.     *
From: v057qkmm@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Bluerazor)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Sci-Fi Suggestions
Summary: has anyone played it?
Keywords: battlelords
Date: 9 Sep 92 23:46:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41


>OK,
>	Let's see..
>	Lot's o' guns
>	Lot's o' equipment
>	Lot's o' armor
>	Lot's o' races
>	Lot's o' background
>	Lot's o' information
>	Easy to understand rules that cover just about everything.
> 
>The fourth edition BattleLords is The Edition.  I think that Larry has 
>finaly gotten it right.  If your going to get BattleLords, this is the
>one.  Lock-n-load is another situation.  Larry's a great game designer,
>lousy editor.  However, for the price, and the sheer volume of information
>you get for it, I think it's worth a few typos.  _This Is Only A Test_ is

	About this problem: Editing work on Lock N Load was finished last
night. All future printings of this book will be virtually error-free.

>the first (and only) module to come out.  It was made by "The Canadaians".
>(Who the hell are The Canadaians anyways?  I hear referances to them all the
>time.  I picture this group of people in coon skin caps saying, "This is
>a good game, 'eh.  Pass me a beer, 'eh?")  Good design and well made.
>An excellent module to start with and even gives some ideas for long time
>campaining.  The pullouts even have a page with everything you need to 
>keep track of enemy armor damage.  Larry's got a whole slew of modules
>on the burner even as I post.  I played in some of them.
>(NASTY, NASTY, Larry! We hate's, FOR-EVER!)
>	The game does have alot of guns, and I do mean ALOT of guns!
>However, I think this is because of Larry's method of operations, not his
>style.  He works on one section at a time.  The system first, then the
>background, then the guns, then the armor, then the equipment, then...
>Wait until he comes out with the new races!  From Furbals to Fotts, he's
>got a WIDE selection.
>	I'd chat some more but I gotta go.  Psy 302, ya know?
> 
> 
> 
>			-Robert "Larry has killed me 13 times" Goodfellow

-> bluerazor
From: mancinis@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (steven mancini)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SR: Non-animal totems
Date: 8 Sep 92 20:13:16 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center

In article <1992Sep8.102601.9934@ncsu.edu> bkdavis@eos.ncsu.edu (B K DAVIS) writes:
>
>
>Does Christine Ring a bell ??
>:)

	Actually, I built my version of her already. 'Christine' is a
	Free City Spirit. Shadow version. Since you cannot 'enchant'
	complex items such as vehicles, I decided to center her
	Hidden Life in the radio. I also gave her Personal Domain
	which extended only as far as the car. From the way the Geek
	who 'owned' her acted, I also added in Possession.

	But then again, I have never read the book, so I am not
	sure if John Carpenter does Stephen King any credit....

						-Minotaur


+-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+
| Steve Mancini (a.k.a. The Minotaur) | phi@sage.cc.purdue.edu          |
|    Grad Student {Dazed & Confused}  | mancini@vm.cc.purdue.edu        |
|    Political Science Department     | mancinis@mentor.cc.purdue.edu   | 
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| "Of all that is written, I love only what a person hath written with  |
|  his blood. Write with blood and thou wilt find that blood is spirit" |
|				    -Nietzche, Thus Spoke Zarathrustra  |
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 

-- 

+-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+
| Steve Mancini (a.k.a. The Minotaur) | phi@sage.cc.purdue.edu          |
|    Grad Student {Dazed & Confused}  | mancini@vm.cc.purdue.edu        |
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: uplink@cwis.unomaha.edu (John M. Scheibeler)
Subject: Re: Resurrection in HERO (was Re: Permenant damage in HERO)
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 02:28:31 GMT

slb3y@cc.usu.edu (Punk Rocketeer) writes:

>     This little gem came up in the last Champions game I ran.  Player
>had a Transformation which he originally explained to me as being for
>the reattachment of severed limbs, setting broken bones, etc.  No
>healing, of course, since Aid does that, but at least repairing the
>visible damage.

>     The problem came up when I turned one of the PC's into a vampire. 
>Suddenly the Transformer tells me that he originally envisioned the
>power to also allow anything up to and including resurrection.  My
>response as GM can be summed up as follows:  "You gotta be kidding."

   My response as a GM can be summed up as follows: EHHNT! Not!

>     What do all you Hero gamers think?  To me, resurrection is not
>genre for superheroes, Jean Grey to the contrary.  Superheroes die
>seldom enough that it generally turns out to be a major event.  (Which
>this one was supposed to be, anyway.  The player with the now-vampire
>was moving away, leaving the campaign for good, so we gave him a
>sendoff.)  Opinions on resurrecting metahumans, anyone?
>-- 

   C'mon, I only created it as a joke!  As another GM pointed out to
me, there's no way a Transform like that can recreate another player
exactly.

>Patrick S. Clark | When the world's in trouble I am not slow.
>Email is life!   | So it's hip-hip-hip and away I go!
>Usual Disclaimer | (You should know this one.)
From: v054nn84@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Foto...Taking pictures again, and Happy for it!)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Improvisation
Date: 6 Sep 92 10:34:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Jeez, after reading that one quote about the player who would leave if he/she
thought the referee were putting clues in front of the players...I wouldn't
WANT that person in the game.  what the hell DOES a referee do?  GO out, build
a full size movie set of the office they are going to trash and singlehandedly
place all the clues and then leave the room?  Good god man/woman. what is wrong
with improvisation?  What is it?  Got screwed over by a bad ref once and afraid
we are all like that?  Come on, why are referees supposed to be restricted?  If
that were the case I would only use modules!

Skeksis - Me transmitte sursum, Caledoni
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: r.g.frp.* and sci fi games
From: ppugliese@pimacc.pima.edu
Date: 12 Sep 92 21:09:10 -0700

In article <12SEP199215541729@rosie.uh.edu>, lib1p@rosie.uh.edu (Tammy Stark Blandino) writes:
> I have heard several people say several things and I thought
> I would try to put it all together in a single post.  Note
> this is not intended as flaming material, but as an observation.
> 
> This is r.g.frp.misc.  In the hierarchy r.g.frp.* is for 
> fantasy role playing games.  Sci fi games are not fantasy
> games.  Therefore, officially they do not belong here.

Sci-fi is just as much fantasy (FTL drives, psionics, etc.)
as 'swords & sorcery' is.

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cleggp@aix.rpi.edu (Paul Jason Clegg)
Subject: Re: Let's talk REAL sci-Fi systems
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 16:20:26 GMT

In article <BuGI25.KzE@acsu.buffalo.edu> v054nn84@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Foto...Taking pictures again, and Happy for it!) writes:
>In article <1992Sep11.140011.102@gems.vcu.edu>, porterg@gems.vcu.edu writes...
>> 
>>If the system is *much* more realistic than all others, I think a side by
>>side comparison is in order, to convince the net.public of the truth.  Using
>>examples we can all imagine, and hope to not personally experience.
>> 
>>1.      A medium caliber pistol hit (9mm or .45) to the unarmored head.


[Etc. Deleted.]

>Greg,
>
>    I would like to include Star Wars to your comparison list, but I don't
>think it would work...not enough weapons for comparative purposes.. ;)
>Seriously, before I try to include any other systems into the discussion I
>want to ask if, for the sake of the debate, the systems do not have all of
>the weapons will they be discounted? I have to be honest, I have run only a
>couple of Sci-Fi systems in my time (Alpha Dawn and Star Wars) and don't recall
>seeing too many plasma cannon in the others I have looked at.  You idea of 
>a consistant framework for the discussion is a good one so I hesitate to
>jump out of the boundaries so quickly.
>
>Skeksis

I have also played Star Frontiers Alpha Dawn and Star Wars.  Star Frontiers
was my first game (back before it was called "alpha Dawn"!).  Lesse, a pistol
hit would be a single shot from an autopistol.  2d10, I think, and the average
STA of a character is about 50 (45 if it's an NPC).  Nope, no chance of an
instant kill.  The assault rifle would be a single shot from an autorifle, or
perhaps equal to a shot from an Gyrojet rifle.  2d10 again, I believe.  Yep,
this is NOT looking too realistic.  But that's why I moved on to other systems.

As for Star Wars:  The key point was "realism" to begin with.  (Quick Note: I
am not putting down Star Wars; I don't personally like the system, but I
really like the setting...)  Star Wars is designed with the "heroic" theme in
mind, so much so that the player characters are 1.5 times better than an NPC
to start with, not even considering AFTER they start improving.  I don't
personally think Star Wars has a very realistic system, but hey; it's not
really supposed to be.  I think my main problem with it is that it's much too
complicated for the simplistic results a combat generates.

Other games I'd like to hear comments on about their combat system's "reality":

MegaTraveller
2300 AD
Space Master

I don't have, and haven't played, these three games, so I won't complain about
them.  Yet.  :)

...Paul


Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: peters@physics.ubc.ca (Dan Peters)
Subject: Re: Gaming boards
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 01:04:10 GMT

>I have no rec.games.rpg on my system :-(

Don't worry, it gets very little traffic. Once every 3 weeks or so, someone
makes a short post saying something to the effect of "hello, is anyone there?",
and that's about it. You're not missing anything.

Drin
--
-----------------
Gutted - Flame NA
From: v054nn84@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Foto...Taking pictures again, and Happy for it!)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: RE: Improvisation
Date: 6 Sep 92 22:54:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Your players actually notice when they are being spoon-fed?  Amazing!  My
player only notice that they are being fed when the pizza arrives!

:)

Skeksis - Let me get this straight.  I'm driving a 91 Geo and he's driving a 93
Vette and you want me to drag?  What are you, some kind of optimist?
From: sjs28257@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Steve Stelter)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Repartee in Gaming
Date: 9 Sep 92 15:34:39 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

v054nn84@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Foto...Taking pictures again, and Happy for it!) writes:

>Brian J Maloney (I hope I spelled you name right) raises an interesting point
>in the thread of attracting more women to gaming, that of there being more
>repartee.  I would like to see more repartee in gaming, period, not just
>as a way to make gaming more attractive to women as I think that repartee adds
>a lot to the game.  My problem is simple, how do I go about encouraging my
>players to engage in repartee among their characters and between my NPCs and
>their charcters.  They do a fine job of keeping it going from player to player,
>but this is not exactly what I am looking for.  Any comments on ways to
>encourage the growth and (hopefully) quality of repartee will be greatly
>appreciated.  On the other hand flames such as "Repartee suck" and "Your a
>lousy ref because you have this problem" are NOT encouraged.

The best way I can think of is to lead by example.  When you play NPCs,
speak in character all the time, and ask that the PCs do the same.

                                 --Steve Stelter
                                   sjs28257@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: DarkUrthe review anyone?
From: mdlcpgs@lhn.gns.cri.nz (Phil Scadden)
Date: 10 Sep 92 15:39:25 +1200
Organization: Institute of Geological and Nuclear Sciences, Lower Hutt, New Zealand

I understand there may be DarkUrthe Legends playtesters on the net.
In view of their press release, I wonder if anyone would like to
give more information on combat, skill categories, character creation
(ie how long does it take, what sort of attributes, "feel" of the
characters)? A good citizen out there?
	Phil
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: mfterman@dae.Princeton.EDU (Mutant for Hire)
Subject: Re: Looking for "women's" rpg.
Reply-To: mfterman@phoenix.princeton.edu (Mutant for Hire)
Organization: Mutant for Hire, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 02:12:16 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.114800.1@wharton.upenn.edu>, millerl@wharton.upenn.edu writes:
>1. Less dice rolling. Ideal would be no dice rolling, since that way you know
>what you can do and don't have to mess around with probability theory to
>predict your character's capacities.

Actually, I'd change this to less complexity in the rules. Or more
simplicity in the rules, however you want to approach it. As long as
how things are resolved simply goes well, I don't think the fact that
rolling dice is a problem. Also, allowing players to roleplay a lot of
challenges instead of doing simple die rolls to resolve them would
prove a lot more attractive.

>2. Less emphasis on violence and mayhem. In most rpgs the biggest section of
>the rules is the combat section. This alienates many people, especially women,
>who don't want to worry about murder and warfare when they're just trying to
>relax.

There is a disproportionate amount of emphasis on this section since
its the part that has the greatest potential impact on your character.
In any system, how much fighting goes on is purely a function of how
much the GM wants in it. But yes, someone who is turned off on combat
and sees a huge section devoted to resolving combat could be turned
off by the results.

Thing is, combat needs more detail than lockpicking, or trying to pry
secrets out in casual conversation, since there's a chance the PC will
die or be damaged, both of which tend to impact the rest of the game.

>3. Mechanics that emphasize *role*playing and perhaps problem-solving rather
>than power trip stuff and board-game style play. I think the best way to do
>this is to remove other distractions, but there may be some positive steps as
>well.

Well, getting rid of AD&D levels and so forth is a big step in the
right direction. A lot of the rest of it is more in the campaign books
than in the rules, and a lot more is in the GM. Any game can be
munchkinized if you try hard enough, and any game can be a real
roleplaying experience with little powermongering, it depends on the
GM and the players.

>What other aspects of play or design should be emphasized or de-emphasized in
>order to attract non-roleplayer women to our games?

Find out what daydreams and fantasies are popular with women, and then
figure out how to encode them in the Hero system. :) :) :) I'm sure
something like GURPS: Darkover would be popular with a lot of
feminists.

-- 
    Martin Terman, Mutant for Hire, Mad Scientist, Priest of Shub-Internet
    Disclaimer: Nobody else takes me seriously, why should you be the first?
mfterman@phoenix.princeton.edu mfterman@pucc.bitnet terman@pupgga.princeton.edu
"Sig quotes are like bumper stickers, only without the same sense of relevance"