From: kyle@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Kyle Wohlmut)
Subject: Re: HERO vs. GURPS
Followup-To: rec.games.frp.misc, rec.games.hero
Summary: What argument?
Keywords: Thrombulator
Organization: Rocking Pig Enterprises
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 21:25:12 GMT

In article <1992Jul27.161302.19657@rchland.ibm.com>
BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com (Bill "Sure" Seurer) writes:
>In article <Bs1xpz.DJD@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, joshua salter <jsalter@silver.ucs.indiana.edu> writes:
>|> 
>|> 	I have purchased HERO, and found my old copy of GURPS to compare them.
>|> I was unable to come to a conclusion. My findings:
>|> 
>|> 	HERO's Merits			|	GURPS Merits
>|>    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>|>    well-defined Characteristics +1	|   simplistic Attributes -1
>|>    Good combat rules	+1		|   Good combat rules	+1
>|>    un-scaled attribute costs	0	|   scaled attribute costs	+1
>|>    reasonably cost-effecient	0	|   supplements needed -1
>|>    not many supplements -1		|   lotsa cool supplements out +1
>|> 
>|> 	I'm using both to see which game works better in action, (long campa-
>|> igns). Suggestions on what supplements to buy? (For each.)
>|> 
>--- 
>Oh goody!  Another GURPS-Hero flamewar!!
>
>Actually, I'd say...
>
>
>  HERO's Merits                      |      GURPS Merits
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>too many physical attributes -1      |   too few important attributes -1
>overly complex combat versus         |   overly complex combat versus
>  non-combat  -1                     |     non-combat -1
>silly logarithmic scale for          |   too many point breaks in
>  non-supers attributes -1           |     attribute costs -1
>too few supplements -1               |   so many supplements you feel
>                                     |     you HAVE to have them all -1
>

You both forgot Gurps: -1, Supplements don't work (and they don't).

>I have always been bothered by Hero's 27 (or whatever) attributes for
>physical things and 2 (INT and EGO, right?  It's been a while...) for mental.
>OK, so most comic book heroes are big on bashing things around and short on
>brains.  But still...

Well, gee, I don't like GURPS having only 4 physical characteristics
that have all been boiled down way too far, or the fact that GURPS
only has 1 'mental' attribute.  Well, ok, so this information isn't
exactly accurate, but still... (BTW Bill, how many mental attributes
have -you- got?)

>
>As anyone who has followed this newsgroup knows EVERYONE thinks that IQ
>and DX play too important a role over ST and HT in GURPS and it either needs
>(your pick) new skill rules, more attributes, different attribute costs,
>a kitchen sink, skill rules requiring a PhD in Math to understand, more rules,
>even more attributes, less general skills, more general skills, no defaulting,
>different defaulting, and more rules about kitchen sinks.
>
>Why does everyone love games (exaggeration warning) that
>have 200 page rule books 150 pages of which are detailed combat rules and 
>5 pages of which are vague social interaction rules?  Are everyone's games
>really that dominated by combat?

I think it probably has something to do with the fact that most of us
have some kind of social interaction every day of our lives, so we
don't need to be told exactly how it works.  Whereas a good number of
us DON'T get into combat every day, and may need a little more help in
that area.

>As for GURPS having too many supplements, I stood at the SJG booth at
>GenCon last year trying to convince some dorky AD&Der that to play GURPS
>in a fantasy setting all you needed was Basic and maybe
>GURPS: Magic.  She was just sure she JUST HAD to have Fantasy, Beastiary,
>Fantasy Bestiary, Magic Items, and who knows what else too and that was way 
>too expensive.
>
>Sigh.
>

(Echo sigh.) Some people...

--
 /'''      Kyle Wohlmut -- Rocking Pig Enterprises
 c-OO      'Ye shall not eat one day, nor two days, nor five days,
    \       neither ten days nor twenty days; but even a whole month, 
   -        until it come out at your nostrils...' (Numbers 11:19-20)


Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc