HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: GB vs LA Riot at Calvin
Date: 10 Oct 1992 23:19:03 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <2AD717CF.19649@ics.uci.edu> hadley@broadway.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley) writes:
)
)   Benchmark program:  a special client that sends commands to the server and
)   records the time delay for a response.  (NOTE: ping just isn't good enough.
)   The ping times I recorded from calvin to berkeley clearly do not reflect
)   the actual conditions.)  Over a period of 5 minutes say, deviation from
)   the average can be calculated and reduced to a few figures.  The result
)   calculated in this manner should exactly reflect the playing conditions.
)   (These figures would also be sent directly to the server).

'ping's were very weird.  The pings you showed from USC to Cal were 
reasonable; pings from Cal to USC had 10-15% packet loss with max ping
times of 3300ms.

On the other hand, the UDP window showed very little packet loss--around
2%.

The bad thing about the lag last night was loss of commands, not of
updates; I didn't have to hit '=' too often, but every time I wanted to
lock on to a planet I had to hit 'l' 3 or 4 times.  You'd hit 'c' to
cloak and wind up heading towards your opponent at max warp, uncloaked.
Or you'd hit 'c', see that you didn't cloak, hit 'c' again, and the
server would process both cloak requests and you'd still wind up 
heading towards your opponent at max warp uncloaked.  And at least once
we lost a planet because I had a phaser lock on someone but the server
dropped my max warp packet so I was chasing them at warp 3.

When I tried setting 'send with TCP', my UDP link severed.  This happened
a fair amount all night, actually.  We also each had 30-second freezes;
not general ghostbusts (although there were a couple of those, too), but
times when your screen would be frozen and everyone else's was going fine.
Well, not fine, but as well as could be expected.

What can I say, it was a frustrating game.  The Bears took it better than
they might have, for the most part; at least we didn't get into any
fistfights, and actually had some fun towards the end when LA Riot had
no kills and we did the 'fleet to KLI' maneuver.  Also, a big cheer went
up when we took ALD with about 5 minutes left in the game after being in
an LPS for about an hour.
 -Mojo
From: books@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu (Roger Books)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: CALL FOR VOTES
Date: 14 Oct 92 14:10:51 GMT
Organization: FSU nuclear physics

In article <1bgevhINNq15@agate.berkeley.edu> tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) writes:
>Path: mailer.cc.fsu.edu!gatech!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!soda.berkeley.edu!tom
>From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
>Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
>Subject: Re: CALL FOR VOTES
>Date: 14 Oct 1992 06:33:21 GMT
>Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
>Lines: 22
>Message-ID: <1bgevhINNq15@agate.berkeley.edu>
>References: <1992Oct14.030027.7314@wixer.cactus.org>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
>In article <1992Oct14.030027.7314@wixer.cactus.org> rhodesia@wixer.cactus.org (Felix S. Gallo) writes:
>)
>)In our game against Lagg U, we killed 67 more total armies than they
>)did, despite the game being nearly equal the entire time.  At no
>)point did they have more than three of our planets, and the usual
>)number was two.  This points to a condition in the server where a
>)team can be screwed by a random number generator in the most
>)important facet of the game.  I'm not complaining about the game
>)with Lagg U -- they deserved to win -- but I think we should come
>)up with some plan to force pops to be more equal, all things
>)considered.
>
>From the description I heard of the game, you guys were behind almost
>the entire time.  Even if it's only an average of, say, 3 planets over
>the course of the game, they'd need to pop just one army each every 5
>minutes or so to make a 67 army advantage.
>
>I find that every team thinks the other team popped more armies, and
>that this feeling is rarely borne out by the numbers.  It's also
>very unlikely for the karma not to balance during the course of
>a game; you just don't notice when *your* planets are popping.
> -Tom

I was just in a game where this happenned.  It wasn't the whole game, it
was only about 10 minutes.  The other team had one pop during the whole 10
minutes.  You know, it's really annoying to be SC bombing and have the other
team get no armies for you to bomb.  It's even more annoying when your team
takes no (zero, zip, nada) planets during the whole time.  When they started
popping it made up for the loss, but if there had been a clue on my team
they wouldn't have had the planets anyway.  (I finally lost patience and
went to take but then they started popping.)

Sherlock

Oh, I did get the 1 army.

Roger
books@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu
From: jonathan@author.ecn.purdue.edu (Jonathan L Neuenschwander)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Ogg Tactics (Was Re: Dogfighting....again :( )
Date: 12 Oct 92 07:33:57 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

sherod@newton.Colorado.EDU (Scott Herod) writes:

>One useful trick that a friend and I have practiced is for one person
>to go in uncloaked as if to deny the carrier the planet.  While this person
>plays with the escort or carrier the other person comes in fast cloaked.

>Mad DDogg

Definitely a useful tactic.  There have been several times that I've killed
the cloaker with minimal damage, yet been so engrossed in that fight that
I became easy prey for the distractor.

The tactic works best though when the distractor keeps track of the cloaker
and doesn't cross into his path.  Otherwise, the cloaker may take accidental
hits, tipping off the victim.

This same basic idea also works well for planet-taking.  

Jonathan
El Kabong

HELP!  Distress Call from .sig file, 0% Shields, 98% Damage, 0 Armies.
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Ogging/bombing/dogfighting
Date: 12 Oct 92 20:48:44 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

I think there's a point that Chclut has been missing.  When Hugh said that
you win by killing all of your enemies armies he is correct.

If the enemy has no armies, he has no planets.  Period.  (Either all the
planets are yours or are independent... genocide.. end of story.)

Justin
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: The neverending thread
From: jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick)
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 01:27:34 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle) writes
> As I stated earlier, I have been killed with armies:  on the way to take
> a planet (trying to get by defenders), as a starbase (though not with many),
> or picking up off a crucial planet to prevent it being bombed below 4.
> 
> Assuming I was playing seriously at the time (always a big assumption if
> clue level is low), then either the situation you described fit one of the
> above scenarios or did not happen.

I *love* that excuse:

 God->ALL: Newbie (F1) was kill 3.00 for UnoggableJustin (R0)
 God->ALL: UnoggableJustin (R0+6 armies) was kill 1.66 for Newbie (F1)
 F1->ALL : Hey!  I waxed his butt!
 R0->ALL : Nah.  I wasn't playing seriously.  As soon as you uncloaked I
 R0->ALL : decided to stop playing seriously, and I counter-ogged you.  Nyaah.

I gotta remember that one.  It's even better than "your SB ogg only
succeeded cos there's a full moon", which was the previous humor
winner. 

Jonathan H., jch@cs.cmu.edu                        Spaceman Spiff, Flying Pig
I run a Netrek information archive.   Access: [1] WAIS (gourd.srv.cs.cmu.edu, 
port 6000, name netrek-ftp)  [2] AFS (try cd /afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/jch/netrek)  
[3] Anon FTP from gs69.sp.cs.cmu.edu   [4] e-mail from ftpmail@decwrl.dec.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves)
Subject: Re: CALL FOR VOTES
Followup-To: rec.games.netrek
Originator: spot@HOPELESS.MESS.CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 08:06:06 GMT


it always seems like that.  esp if the other team scout bombs :)

the random factor is in the noise, don't mess with it.

-- 
			organize
Scott Draves		enumerate
spot@cs.cmu.edu		file
Organization: Junior, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Wed,  7 Oct 1992 10:41:52 -0400 
From: "Brian A. Hixon" <bh1k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: I've lost all respect for Rob
	<91922@netnews.upenn.edu>

>Balinor has always seemed overrated as a base, but again I've only seen
>him play rarely.

Hmm...
I am definitly over rated as a base now.  I havn't really played one
since late Spring.  At one point I was pretty good(I trained under
Balton ;-)
I just got tired of bases last year and stopped playing them.

Oh well.

;-)

Bri Guy
Balinor


Brian Hixon		bh1k@andrew.cmu.edu

Of all the things I've lost, I miss my Mind the most.



Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: surge@cqs.washington.edu (Jonathan Sari)
Subject: Re: Netrek in an arcade?
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 22:38:57 GMT

An arcade game would probably be infeasible.  The way to do it would be to
have a nintendo-like system which has a phone outlet, which knows how to
dial up an existing phone network.  So the person buys the machine, plugs
in his phone cord, and away he goes.

The problem then becomes how to allow all of the netrek functions without
a keyboard controller.

-Ensign Pac-man
Organization: Freshman, MCS general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 03:07:06 -0400 
From: Randy Eugene Griffith <rg3c+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Jousting


Just wanted to say thanks to all the guys on rwd4 last night for the
great time jousting.  

I'm surprised the geeks didn't get all pissed off at us; maybe they were
and they just quit instead of trying to get all 4-5 of us to "play
serious."  

Anyway, the jousting matches were great, as were  doing laps around the
galaxy and charging the other teams home planet at max speed just for
the hell of it.  Don MacLean was, as always, a good diversion as well.

Anyway, there was a slight bit of confusion about jousting... These are,
as I understand them, the rules.  Correct any mistakes or feel free to
make any suggestions.

Okay here's what jousting is:  You select a jousting partner on the
other team (this should be a mutual thing).  You lock onto that person. 
They lock onto you.  You fly at max speed at each other.  When in range
you attack, almost always resulting in mutual destruction.   You get
back in the game and do it over.  And over.  And over.  
Now here are some technicalities.
Once you are locked on, you are not allowed to break lock or turn away. 
If you do then you are a limp-wristed democrat vegetarian (to paraphrase
a certain quote by Fuhrer here at CMU :).  You MAY turn if you survive
the initial pass, in order to swing around and finish off the opponent. 
 
It's generally accepted that you shouldn't use phasors, but this issue
hasn't been settled yet.  Decide it on your own when you are jousting... 

Now here are some great MegaJoust/JoustleMania events:
Get 4 players to Joust, 2 from each team, and start them in opposite
corners.  Then on cue, everybody locks onto the opposite corner, goes
maximum speed [preferably everybody has the same ship type] and they
meet in the middle in a big shin-dig of jousting, and usualyl have a
mutual big 4-way explosion.  It looks impressive on the color monitors.

Anyway... So try jousting some time.  It's much more fun than taking
planets, and it'll get all the geeks mad too.

-- Randy "The Apeman" Griffith
"You gonna be the new worm face now"
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: surge@cqs.washington.edu (Jonathan Sari)
Subject: Re: Who is the best?
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 01:30:12 GMT

Spaceace!
Organization: Senior, Chemistry, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 12:20:57 -0400 
From: Charles William Swiger <cs4w+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: XG vs OTR stats

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 13-Oct-92 XG vs OTR stats
"Timothy C. Worsley"@and (2057)

>Andre many of Andre the Giant's lost and Hiemdall's Ogged armies were on
>the base.  The fact that Mr. Wizard killed freindly carriers is more 
>testement that we were trying for the last planet than that he messed
>up.  I'm amazed that he's the only one to do this.
>
>ZZnew guy

Yeah.  To quote Mike "We sucked donkey dick."  I guess I was due for a
beating in the base though; last INL game I got a 150 kill SB
(admittedly against non-locals), this time I averaged about 10.  Ugh.

I don't think our team was ever really able to threaten Balton (XG's starbase).

Congrats XG...

-- Infidel, Heathen, and a chastened Andre the Giant :-)....

+---------------------------------------------+ 
|  Charles William Swiger -- CMU sucks rocks  | "The television screen is the
|   AMS & normal mail: cs4w+@andrew.cmu.edu   | retina of the mind's eye."
|    NeXTmail: <temporarily out of order>     |           
+---------------------------------------------+            --Videodrome
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 01:43:09 -0400 
From: "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Something seriously amiss

	Today I was watching over the shoulder of a player on bronco who had
visable tractor beams.  I was suprized and told him that he never struck
me at the sort to use a 'borg, even on 'borg night (Tuesdays on bronco).
 He informed me that the client was not a 'borg, and that it was blessed.
	It seems that some player from Berkeley has written an blessed a client
with -- among other things -- visible tractor beams, visible locks which
show the direction or the lockee.  It is supposedly now the standard
client at Berkeley.

	I would just like to ask and make sure that this INFO-'BORG is not
being used for INL play.  I would also suggest that this client be taken
off of any FTP site that it is currently on an unblessed.  It is my
understanding that it was written and blessed by the same person who
hosed the net in the GB-GBO game this summer.  I doubt if there is
anything that can be done to this person.

DON'T FUCKING BLESS BORGS
FUCK, WHY THE HELL DO YOU PLAY THE GAME that you have to have some
advantage over your opponent?   Don't people realise that blessing and
distibuting 'borgs waters the game down.  
	If you have this 'borg, I ask you -- I beg you -- to throw it out.

ZZnew guy
From: echeverr@scf.usc.edu (Evil Geniuses For a Better Tomorrow)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Something seriously amiss
Date: 16 Oct 1992 00:13:44 -0700
Organization: Illuminus Cartel
NNTP-Posting-Host: girtab.usc.edu
Summary: fnord
Keywords: fnord

In article <ldog0gINNf2m@grit.cs.utexas.edu> davidt@cs.utexas.edu (David Eng-Yeow Teo) writes:
>I still think that the client is stretching it alittle.  Reasons :-
>1)  Visible Tractors :-
>Approved but maybe you ought to look at it again.  If you tractor or
>pressor someone before he cloaks, the tractor lines will still be there.
>In such situation, the client is acting like a borg with "See Cloakers"
>option on.    

(David, use auto-fill-mode, or hit return after each line...)

Counter-argument:  If you phaser someone before he cloaks, your phaser
will still be there.

Besides, the tractor/pressor lines will be jumping around.  Not
precisely helpful.

5150
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: The neverending thread
Date: 13 Oct 92 12:02:18 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <Bw1DDy.L38.2@cs.cmu.edu) jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick) writes:
)botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle) writes
)) As I stated earlier, I have been killed with armies:  on the way to take
)) a planet (trying to get by defenders), as a starbase (though not with many),
)) or picking up off a crucial planet to prevent it being bombed below 4.
)) 
)) Assuming I was playing seriously at the time (always a big assumption if
)) clue level is low), then either the situation you described fit one of the
)) above scenarios or did not happen.
)
)I *love* that excuse:
)
All right, already.  Lemme clarify what I mean by not playing seriously.
In fact, lemme remove that condition, since the only time that I carry
when not playing seriously are when plasma scumming and when distressing
to the enemy (or ALL) and running into 3rd space to draw oggers (although
lately I have been using this as a legitimate tactic).  Since I don't
recall being killed recently in either of these situations, I will remove
the stipulation of playing seriously.  Wait:  I thought of an example.
Greg was trying to ogg me (playing as Val's character).  He couldn't.  He
asked me to dogfight him in Kli space.  I agreed.  I carried.  Oh well, guess
I was ogged.

But I will add two conditions:

If I am deliberately trying to get two or more oggers after me in third space
(esp if I get the only clue after me) so that my team has a numerical
advantage.

If a SC bomber is about to bomb a planet and I don't have the fuel to kill
him, or if there are two bombers against one, and I am sure that I can
not stop both of them and they will bomb, I will pick up to prevent a lucky
bomb down to 2 or 3.  This doesn't happen very often either.


)I gotta remember that one.  It's even better than "your SB ogg only
)succeeded cos there's a full moon", which was the previous humor
)winner. 

Brutal.  You guys are merciless.

)Jonathan H., jch@cs.cmu.edu                        Spaceman Spiff, Flying Pig

Justin
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 07:54:59 -0400 
From: Tomato Boy <stimpy+@cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: ENPN Coaches' Poll!  (After Game 1)
	<718531779.7395.0@merope.weh.andrew.cmu.edu>
	<1b10chINNa9f@agate.berkeley.edu>

Mojo writes:
#
# )ps: note that we play the two other teams ever to get a #1 vote in
# )    our regular season!
#
# Which either guarantees you the #1 spot, or you lose.  We'll see.
#  -Mojo

Depends on the tiebreaking system. If it goes by number of planets
taken, we could go 4-0 and NOT make the playoffs... 
I think that happened to the CMU football team a couple years ago.
They went undefeated and didn't make the playoffs because of 
strength of schedule.

--Tomato Boy
btw, I agree the gummi bears are a great team, but side salad is
simply awesome. Most people picked xgolems to go all the way, and
they didn't even take ONE of our planets.
From: bav@hobbes.ksu.ksu.edu (Brick Verser)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: LA Riot -vs- GB, game stats
Date: 12 Oct 1992 05:28:45 GMT
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: hobbes.ksu.ksu.edu

jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick) writes:
>ObTrek: I've never believed in opening-wave oggs.  But seeing 7 IC
>AS's game pound on the helpless FLEE SB, with 3 oggers surviving to go
>off and bomb, was an enlightening experience.  Fun, too :)

I believe in it, but only if the enemy isn't expecting it.  There's no 
easier time to toast an enemy base than during the initial bombing run.
Games between teams which are otherwise equally matched will be decided
by who has the army advantage early, and disposing of the base's potential
for grabbing/guarding 50 armies goes a long way toward that.  At the same 
time, if you go in and try to ogg the enemy base and fail, you've done to 
yourself what you were trying to do to them.

Is there a section in the archives discussing opening strategies?  There
should be if there isn't, to help along new INL teams.  But we need to
come up with really cool names for each (like the ApolloGambit, or the
SunscreamerCreamer*).

--Brick

* Obligatory Felix (whose news is probably still broken so he won't see this)
From: jb7m+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jon C. R. Bennett)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Jousting
Date: 11 Oct 92 00:27:51 GMT
	<1992Oct10.191642.8659@cs.brown.edu>
Organization: Robotics Institute, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA



all this talk about jousting reminds me of a ski t-shirt i saw recently,
it said

	"To Turn Is To Admit Defeat"

jon
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: INL strategy: take a weak planet, or the front line?
Date: 9 Oct 1992 10:06:04 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <92235@netnews.upenn.edu> paulsen@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (FreeKill) writes:
)In article <BvtIHs.FKr.2@cs.cmu.edu> hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill) writes:
)>
)>Some people have commented on this, and I have found it to be quite  
)>interesting.
)>
)>Mojo thinks you should leave a back line planet to take the front line.  I  
)>strongly disagree.  Take as many cheap planets as you can.
)
)Hard to believe, but I agree with Rob.  Take as many planets as possible.
)Don't let the idea of strategical planets influence you hugely.  Yes, it's
)very, very good to get a strategical planet, but if you own almost all of
)the enemy's planets, the strategical one will fall eventually.  Sooner
)or later, you'll actually take the important planet and the enemy won't
)be able to take it back, because they have no armies.  They will have no
)armies because they have no planets

I was misunderstood, to an extent.  I said that I'd rather have 
a front-line planet than MIR; this is not the same as saying I
would go for a front line planet rather than take MIR back.  If 
I was in a game where we were just trading MIR back and forth, 
though, I would; if I take it back, I'm letting my opponent dictate
the flow of the game.
 -Tom
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re:  Hell Peacock
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 19:34:51 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

ZZ writes
> speak out against new ideas (Transwarp, upgrades, warp 7 DDs, Iggy).  I
> was talking about the rank depending on defense and not showing the
> armies killed on board.  
> 	While you may point out that these were in the original server 
> code, I
> will point out that  you adamantly left them in even though the standard
> no longer worked that way.  It wasn't even that you didn't want to
> change your server; you made plenty of other changes.  You just wanted
> to discourage Ogging, and it worked.  *This* is why I said that you set
> back Berkeley netrek, and I'll stand by it.
> 
> ZZnew guy

I completely agree with the above.  The defense and not reporting of  
armies gives the ogger NO reward for his team play.  This discourages  
ogging, and set berkeley trek behind the pack..

Rob
aka Spaceace!
From: tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu (Timothy C. Worsley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Hell Peacock
Date: 12 Oct 92 06:35:04 GMT
	<92513@netnews.upenn.edu>
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 11-Oct-92 Re: Hell Peacock
Justin Botelle@eniac.sea (2316)

> Oooh, yeah... Love all those Admirals who made it on offense.   The only
> person I know who even has a chance is John Kim with Offense Tackle. 
> He's a Commodore now, but could make Ad on Quad DI (if he maintains his
> ratings), with only 150 more hours.  Of course, he's already an Admiral,
> and I believe was a Rear on your stupid server.

	My character, Commodore Human Target, is on the same track, but I don't
play him much.  Dumb Ogging is fun sometimes, but isn't always that
helpful.

ZZnew guy