HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bh419@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ted B Samsel)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Torturing Politicals
Date: 10 Nov 1992 14:59:38 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


y
I recall that the name was ALFERD PACKER and the  dining room is
on the UC Boulder campus.
On a similar note: PBS's documentary on the Donner Party stated
that one of the survivors later opened up a restaurant in
Sacramento.
-- 
Ted....
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: wismith@amelia.nas.nasa.gov (William R. Smith)
Subject: Re: Torturing Politicals
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 16:15:02 GMT

Joan Shields writes:
	
	Perhaps a list of books that deal with or are full of gallows humor?
	



A friend of mine heard about a book on a radio talk show and bought
it.  Its about using laughter to overcome depression, and is called
"Lighten Up".  He's just started it so I don't have a recommendation
to share yet.

We talked about "gallow humor" and how it was common in companies
(ok, company) we knew about that were going thru lay-offs.



William Sburgfort Smith
Intel, SSD

Xref: sparky rec.arts.books:20078 alt.society.anarchy:726
From: gwr@hedonist-1.lanl.gov (Graham W. Redgrave)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Kant (never did understand what it Was)
Date: 12 Nov 92 23:37:24 GMT
Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory

Marko Amnell writes:

[...]

|> Here is the full passage from Kant:

[two infinities from the experience of none?]

|> 
|> In Kant's case, however, the "conditions and limits of this life" were
|> those of a shrewd speculator who hoarded his gold beneath his bed.

Perhaps, but a teacher of mine thought that the Practical Reason was
ample evidence for Kant's belief in angels.  Since I have never known
one whose insights I could trust better, I looked at the the PR again,
and, if you hold it in the right light (find the passage [I will, if
you want] where he talks about leaping through the last veil of the 
conditioned into the world of the unconditioned), you can start to see
them too.  Wrote a paper that was a couple of weeks late, and none 
the better for its maturation in my head, but I never did to my satis-
faction get a grip on my teacher's claim...

|> -- 
|> Marko Amnell
|> amnell@klaava.helsinki.fi
|> Graduate Student in Philosophy

Yours in struggling for a vision (Kant's?) of the unconditioned,

-- 
Graham Redgrave    |    --  I don't speak for the government, 
gwr@life.lanl.gov  |        but I wish the government would speak for me ...  --
From: amnell@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Marko Amnell)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Those Sexy Finns (was: Advice to the World Weary)
Date: 6 Nov 92 18:55:42 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <6NOV92.16030567@vax.clarku.edu> hhenderson@vax.clarku.edu writes:

>>Ah, yes, the real Finns?  The peasantry.  What are they?  Humble,
>>honest, hardworking, bad self-esteem, and they drink too much.  
>
>But peasants are so REAL.  That's what makes them sexy.  Less
>talk, more action.

Now you sound just like Baudelaire or Kafka.

>>Maybe it's that fact I keep saying "I was taught not to eat with
>>the help".  
>
>How do you say that in Finnish?  The only Finnish phrase I can remember
>is "hattupainen mies ja avoauto".  As you can guess, that doesn't
>help much in conversation.

Easy, "Haista vittu!!", no, actually it's "Minulle on opetettu ett"a
herrasmies ei sy"o renkien ja piikojen kanssa" or something like
that.

-- 
Marko Amnell
amnell@klaava.helsinki.fi
Graduate Student in Philosophy
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Books Wanted:Authors:Thayer..Swanson
From: hayes@brandonu.ca
Date: 6 Nov 92 15:02:11 CST
Organization: Brandon University, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

Looking for Tiffany Thayer's Three Musketeers, published circa 1940-46,
Neil Swanson's Unconquered (1944?) and his The Judas Tree (same era).
Hardback.paperback, what ever.  Any help in finding will be appreciated.
If you have copy/copies and will sell, lend, etc.  please contact:
Dr. Dale Hayes  Brandon University   Brandon, Manitoba Canada R7A 6A9
From: amnell@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Marko Amnell)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: The Eudaemonic Pie
Date: 6 Nov 92 10:55:24 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <1992Nov5.232230.5279@netcom.com> tmaddox@netcom.com 
(Tom Maddox) writes:

>In article <1992Nov2.144747.8341@klaava.Helsinki.FI> amnell@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Marko Amnell) writes:
>>I don't bring peace of mind, I bring a sword to cut you free from Habit.
>
>	*Megalomania alert*.

I'm so glad you picked up on the allusion, Tom.  Is it just today, or
are you always this quick?  What has it been now, four days?
'Must be all that gratuitous love and affection I got as a baby.
Or maybe it's living in a penthouse that overlooks Helsinki and the
sea...
 
-- 
Marko Amnell
amnell@klaava.helsinki.fi
Graduate Student in Philosophy
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: heidi@wales.net.com (Heidi Wolf)
Subject: Malt does more than Milton can (Was: Re: Et in Arcadia ego)
Organization: N.E.T., Redwood City, CA
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 17:01:09 GMT

In article <12NOV92.14000432@vax.clarku.edu> hhenderson@vax.clarku.edu writes:
>MacFideau writes:
>
>>The phrase "civilization as we know it" takes on special significance
>>when uttered by one from the Isle of Islay, since the island is defined
>>by one product, Islay Mist, to my mind the archetypal Single Malt. It
>>has a peaty single-mindedness that is, Thank God, too much for many.
>>Helps keep the price down. Obligatory booky reference? Oh yes, I believe
>>that Islay mist was the late Sir Compton mcKenzie's favourite tipple.
>
>Don't forget Laphroaig.


Here's another obligatory booky reference for you:  John McPhee's
THE CROFTER AND THE LAIRD, which contains three essays (one quite
long and two short).  One of the two short essays is about Scottish
malt whisky/whiskey/uisgebeatha.  The title essay concerns McPhee's
sojourn, with his family, on one of the islands off the west coast
of Scotland.  


Heidi Wolf, descended of Dalgleishes on the distaff side
From: crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: The Cairo Trilogy
Date: 10 Nov 92 17:39:48 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Nov10.025309.8772@netcom.com> sjk@netcom.com (Shel Kaphan) writes:

>Just finished reading the recent translation of The Cairo Trilogy by
>Naguib Mahfouz.  (This includes the books "Palace Walk", "Palace of
>Desire", and "Sugar Street").  Has anyone else out there read these?
>I thought they were splendid, and haven't had such an involving
>reading experience in quite some time.

I've been putting off reading the last 10 or so pages of _Sugar Street_
because I don't want it to end.  "Involving" is the right word for these
books.  I feel like I know these folks and care about virtually all of
them.  He's rare in that he doesn't pass judgment on his characters; he
just presents them in all their complexity and humanity and lets the
reader like and dislike whom he will.  It's also rare to find a writer
with such a profound understanding of a wide variety of personalities. 
Most authors people their books with a few personalities, or reproduce the
same one in different forms, and then let you know which characters you
should like or dislike.  Mahfouz belongs to that tiny minority with the
talent to reproduce real life -- with all its gray areas and
complexities -- through fiction.  Really, really good stuff.

  
-- 
The trick of reason is to get the imagination to seize the actual world --
if only from time to time.     -- Annie Dillard, "An American Childhood"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lauren Crawford  //  crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu
From: hhenderson@vax.clarku.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: RE: The Truth According to Mickie Medved
Date: 6 Nov 92 20:48:01 GMT
Organization: Clark University


mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto) writes:

>Humor is an important tool, as well.  I think that a large part of
>the reason that the ERA failed is that feminists were incorrectly
>perceived as being humorless, giving rise to the "angry lesbian feminist"
>stereotype.  

But they *are* humorless, Mark.  Most of them, that is.  Trust
me on this one... And do you really think the ERA didn't pass
because people thought feminists didn't have a sense of humor?
What an odd idea!  

>        1.  How many angry lesbian feminists does it take to
>            change a lightbulb?
> 
>            One, and it's not funny!

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!  Mark, ya blew the punch line!!!!!
It's supposed to be, simply:  "That's not funny."  See?
That's funnier.

>        2.  How many tortured political prisoners does it take
>            to change a lightbulb?
> 
>            None, those sockets are for the prisoners.

Uh, yeah, you're right, this joke isn't that great.

Here's a variation on a theme for you:

         Q:  How many politically correct persons does it take to
             change a lightbulb?

         A:  You are a racist, sexist, homophobic crypto-Fascist.
             Have a nice day.

Here's one from my alma mater:

         Q:  (index finger and thumb held about 3 inches apart)
             Why do Bryn Mawrtyrs park this far from the curb?

         A:  Because Haverfordians have told them that it's 6 inches.

There are a FEW feminists out there who have a sense of humor about
themselves.

Heather
HHENDERSON@vax.clarku.edu
From: microsoc@black.ox.ac.uk (Microsoc)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Et in Arcadia ego
Date: 11 Nov 92 21:52:21 GMT
Organization: Oxford University Computing Service, 13 Banbury Rd, Oxford, U
Originator: microsoc@black

In article <1dpq02INN311@morrow.stanford.edu> francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir) writes:
	[discussion deleted]
>
>I have stated before that Balliol and Somerville should have joined
>forces. As it is, Balliol has nothing like equal numbers, and Somerville
>loses the creme de la creme to Balliol.

Unfortunately for them, Somerville (and Hilda's) [the two colleges for
women only] now lose the Creme de la Creme to _everywhere else_, making
them consistently the last on the Norrington Table. How are the
mighty fallen!

> Americans should know that the
>British Camp Bed is a Procrustean thing not designed to encourage the 
>livelier sexual pursuits.
>
>Your Head Porter, whose name I forget, ran the JCR when I was a
>stripling, and he will know all about sconcing. It might be worth
>a try.

I'll ask him. Are we thinking of the same chap? (Tim Ward-Barbour) 

> Are there still Smokers?  Balliol Book of Bawdy Verse?

Not to my knowledge...
>Gorduley? Cellars full of Chateau Margaux? &c., &c.

Certainly.. and with St Cat's night coming up soon, both will be tested to
the limit.
>
>Cor Blimey. Two Balliol Boys talkin' like this and all paid for by the
>Department of Defense. Shall we let them into the secret of just what
>a Domus Exhibitioner is? Nah. A hint. Domus is Latin for House, as in
>House Wine....
>
>							Fido
Is everyone else bored by this? Should we continue nattering by post? Or
are you interested in the details of the evolution of Britain's second
oldest place of learning?

	Yours in Effortless Superiority,

						Marc
From: lnh@soliton.physics.arizona.edu (sometimes a Wombat)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Columbus and the Egg?
Date: 9 Nov 92 17:52:36 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Society for the Appreciation of Janni Lee Simner

abl@cybill.inesc.pt (Antonio Leal) writes:
> neal@hpcndm.CND.HP.COM (Neal Bauer) writes:
> 
> One day, after returning from his voyages, Columbus was sitting at the
> dinner table with some important personages.  One of them was deriding
> the importance of the admiral's exploits, saying that anybody could have
> done it - just sail due west.
> 
> A mite ticked off, Columbus grabbed an egg from a nearby plate, and
> asked the speaker if he could make it stand up on the table.  The
> speaker tried, but of course the egg rolled to its side.  Other diners
> gave it a try, but none could do it.  So Columbus took the egg, cracked
> the shell slightly at the wide end, and stood it up on the table.
> 
> "Oh, I could have done that!", said the first speaker.
> "So, why didn't you ?", asked Columbus.

Er -- I remember my science for the kiddies books saying that he made a
small pile of salt, stood the egg in it, then gently blew away the salt
that wasn't directly supporting the egg.

Come to think of it, that implies a) salt was cheap then (which is
wasn't) and b) salt was as finely ground as it is today (which I don't
think it was).

Never mind.

	the maundering worse than usual Mr. E-----
--

LNH@physics.arizona.edu   \  In the deserts of the heart 
sometimes a Wombat         \ Let the healing fountains start  -- Auden
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: u894755@bruny.cc.utas.edu.au (MOOMIN )
Subject: FANTE
Summary: Who is he?
Keywords: FANTE
Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 04:20:37 GMT

FANTE
Who is he?

Bukowski mentions him as his favourite author.....

cripes

(I wish hemingway were alive, he'd be 93)
From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Torturing Politicals
Date: 9 Nov 92 22:01:05 GMT
	<1992Nov9.223435.17061@informix.com>
	<1992Nov9.231707.21849@wam.umd.edu>
Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University

I'm sorry I ate
That missionary steak
Said the cannibal king with a frown.
For often I've heard
The old proverb,
You can't keep a good man down.
--
John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
*
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu (Roger Squires)
Subject: Re: Cormac McCarthy
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 92 23:26:01 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

I just finished Chapter 11 of _Blood Meridian_ and have
to say that I like this book more and more.  It is increasingly
reminiscent of Faulkner (_The Bear_ and some of the hunting scenes
in the novels especially), and when in the middle of the Anasazi 
ruins the Judge piped up with a story, I thought "Huh O, Cormac
is going off on a tangent like the horse story in _A Fable_."

But no! it was short and delightfully apropos.  I actually got
a small spine tingle out of this one, quite rare.  Also, in Chap. 10
there is a nice story about the geological prowess of the Judge
and how he exponuds on copper ore and then leads the company on
an apparently wild-goose chase over the countryside (up volcanoes,
down caves) that results in locating all the ingredients for gunpowder.
Since McCarthy reads McPhee, I'm wondering if the elements of this
story were pulled from one of the latter's books -- just curious.
Hopefully the book will continue its ascent.

In article <1992Nov4.032908.20635@netcom.com> tmaddox@netcom.com (Tom Maddox) writes:
>>Tom Maddox says:
>>
>> 	I've never caught McCarthy in an inarguably inappropriate word
>>  choice.
>>	 So, if you have caught him out, I'd be interested in seeing 
>>  examples.  Without proof, I simply don't believe it.
>>

Well, I'll stick my neck out and propose the following passage:

	...Below them in the paling light smoldered the plains
	of San Agustin stretching away to the northeast,
	the earth floating off in a long curve silent under
	looms of smoke from the underground coal deposits burning there
	a thousand years.  The horses picked their way along the
	rim with care and the riders cast varied glances out upon that
	ancient and naked land.
	   In the days to come they would ride up through a
	country where the rocks would cook the flesh from your hand and
	where other than rock nothing was.  They rode in a narrow
	enfilade along a trail strewn with the dry round turds of
	goats and they rode with their faces averted from the rock
	wall and the bakeoven air which it rebated, the slant black
	shapes of the mounted men stenciled across the stone with a
	definition austere and implacable like shapes capable of
	violating their covenant with the flesh that authored them
	and continuing autonomous across the naked rock without
	reference to sun or man or god.

I'm bothered with his use of 'rebated' here.  He appears to mean
'reflected' or 'threw back,' but it just seems odd, since it is
the rocks themselves which are emitting (not reflecting) heat, 
though it is the hot air which is mentioned.  Anyway, no big 
deal, it is a nice passage.

Roger Squires
rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: gjprice@malloco.Ing.puc.cl (gjprice)
Subject: Re: popular fiction vs. literature
Organization: Pontificia Universidad Catolica de Chile
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 13:56:00 GMT

hola gilkes:
   esto no es mas que un pendejeo por parte miA.
 eso es todo, cambio y fuera.
From: jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Et in Arcadia ego
Date: 12 Nov 92 11:06:08 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

In article <1992Nov10.231727.9987@black.ox.ac.uk> microsoc@black.ox.ac.uk (Microsoc) writes:

~Those of the r.a.b.ble given to apocalyptic wails of "barbarians at the
~gates" may care to know that nowadays Balliol is a mixed College, with
~no guest rules whatsoever (camp beds are available from the Porters'
~Lodge). And this very term (Michaelmas '92) saw the (re)introduction of
~semi-formal hall (no gowns) after many years... O Tempora! O Mores!
~
~On the other hand, the Bursar in his infinite wisdom _does_ allow students
~to have data-links free of charge in their rooms...

But more recently Balliol is better known as *horror of horrors* the cradle
of Oxford Marxism, under the guidance of its famous Master, C. P. Hill.

-- 
===Jeremy Henderson===jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk=          

"I have to scan these posts in case Jeremy includes some line
out of context in his .sig" - FriendOfFernandoKhomeini.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: chrisi@lloyd.Camex.COM (Chris Ischay)
Subject: request for bookplate source
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1992 14:04:49 EST

I apologize in advance for posting one of *those* messages.  You know, the
ones that start, "I never read this newsgroup but I don't know where else
to ask this question."  True to form, my question is followed by, "Please
send e-mail as I never read this newsgroup."  So begging your indulgence,
here's my question:

Could someone tell me about a good source for bookplates?  I mean those
little sticker jobs that go inside front covers and say "Ex libris ____."
Someone near and dear wants them as a present, and I'd love to find
something in keeping with my friend's period tastes (1890s through 1940s).
If not with a period feel, at least something beautiful.  I've looked
around some with no success at all.  Any suggestions?  Specific stores or
catalogs?  Your help is appreciated.

Thanks,
Chris Ischay
chrisi@camex.com
From: c60b-2hz@e260-1a.berkeley.edu (Nathaniel Meyers)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Martha Grimes-The Old Silent
Date: 8 Nov 1992 22:05:20 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: e260-1a.berkeley.edu

Well, I wouldn't have minded if she had ended with the Old Silent.  That had
a nice finality (albeit an ambigious one).  The Old Contemptibles was a good
enough story but EVERYTHING in the Jury/Plant Saga was anti-climatic or
contrived.  If she's tired she should quit (*sigh*), but she CAN'T let it
end with the Old Contemptibles.  At this point we need a swan song.
-Nathaniel
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: ashall@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Andrew S Hall)
Subject: Re: What do you all think of the Situationists?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:08:05 GMT

Several people have posted notes about the Situationists.
The most acessible and comprehensive book has been ignored.
The Situation Internationale which is edited by Raoul Vaneigm
(maybe, I am not sure) is a large collection of S.I. writings,
communiques, rants etc. This is an absolutely essential work
if you want to study S.I.
                                 Andrew Hall
# Humanity won't be happy until the last capitalist is hung  #
# with the guts of the last bureaucrat.                      #
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: akiy@cs.titech.ac.jp (Akiyama Jun,713,4188,)
Subject: Re: A rose is a rose is a rose.
Organization: Department of Computer Science, Tokyo Institute of Technology
	<1992Nov3.090837.7567@klaava.Helsinki.FI>
	<js!qsyd@lynx.unm.edu>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 06:47:22 GMT


When I am dead, my dearest,
   Sing thou no sad songs for me.
Plant thou no roses at my head,
   Now shady cyprus tree.

	---Chrisina Rossetti, from "Song"

             akiy@cs.titech.ac.jp[]Amiga/Mac/IBM/NeXT/NEC/Unix-box User   
 UCLA undergrad (studying abroad)[]
    Tokyo Institute of Technology[]"Speech is of Time, Silence is of Eternity."
      Natural Language Processing[]     ---Thomas Carlyle, _Sartor Resartus_
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto)
Subject: Re: The Truth According to Mickie Medved
Organization: Yale CS Mail/News Gateway
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 17:36:50 GMT


mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin) writes:
 
> fi@grebyn.com (Fiona Webster) writes:
 
>> There are things that can't be laughed at?  Topics that contain no
>> raw material for humor?  Like what?
 
> Torturing political prisoners to death. To name one thing.
 
A few years ago, I saw someone on a talk show who said that anything can
be funny, but sometimes we need time to distance ourselves from the pain.
I think it was Terry Gilliam, or one of the other Pythons.
 
To illustrate this, I will say that I found a scene in THE LIFE OF BRIAN
funny, which involved the torturing of political prisoners.  In it, a
number of people are hanging on crosses.  Eric Idle, who is one of those
being crucified, starts singing a song with a very happy melody, which
all the others join.  The words went "Life's a piece of shit/When you
look at it."  Some people might find this offensive -- I did not.
 
I would never joke about the Holocaust, but I have been told that
many survivors did.
 
Whenever there is a disaster (the Challenger exploding, Bhopal,
Madonna publishing a new book) there are always jokes.  It is part
of the healing process, and does not mean that we do not feel the
pain.
 
Humor is an important tool, as well.  I think that a large part of
the reason that the ERA failed is that feminists were incorrectly
perceived as being humorless, giving rise to the "angry lesbian feminist"
stereotype.  With this, I will leave Mike with two lightbulb jokes.
I just made up the second one:
 
        1.  How many angry lesbian feminists does it take to
            change a lightbulb?
 
            One, and it's not funny!
 
        2.  How many tortured political prisoners does it take
            to change a lightbulb?
 
            None, those sockets are for the prisoners.
 
I don't think either joke is that great, just posting them because I
want to show that there is al least raw material to do so.
 
Mark

Newsgroups: rec.arts.books