HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: buboo@alf.uib.no (Ove Ruben R Olsen)
Subject: Re: Bots'n'vi
Organization: University of Bergen, Norway
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 20:51:27 GMT

Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen writes:

>Of course, but let's say you wrote the word "herrman", and wanted to remove
>the r. What is more pleasant to press? ESC h h h h x l l l a 

nay... ESC FrxA
 
 F - Find backward
 r - the 'r' char.
 x - Xterminate
 A - Add At EOL

Ignorance is not A Good Thing. To use my tools I learn them well.

> ESC : w q or ctrl+x ctrl+c?

ESC ZZ 
heck ... I have a macro... pushing F10 saves and quit, even in TEXT mode.

I have macros done the right way... no need to EVER push the ESC key...
but ... the editing is exstremly limited. I prefer the power of a good
editor.

>Of course this has a lot to do with taste, but I prefer to be in constant
>edit mode and have the commands on control keys, rather than changing between
>editing and command modes. 

Try doing more advanced stuff in emacs... :-) I won't say more... just go
gentle with the terminal.

AND: Before critizising something, learn it.

\Ruben.

PS: To learn VI is like learing to drive a Ferrari. A pain, but once you 
    have learned it, it's powerfull and fast.
    I do prefer a Ferrari instead of a battleship on land.
  :DS


-- 
        Ove Ruben R Olsen a Gnarfer and VI user. EMAIL: ruben@uib.no. 
     Maintaining the EX/VI-archive and a couple of the Comp.Editors FAQs.
    People that are ignorant tend to live a frustrated life, at least when 
     it comes to editing - But I do belive this is a general rule in life
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: mrgreen@mullian.ee.mu.OZ.AU (matthew green)
Subject: Re: A better idea than most was (Re: People who take VR too seriously...)
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 07:55:25 GMT

gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) writes:

>In article <1992Nov22.013125.128339@zeus.calpoly.edu> asamonte@hertz.elee.calpoly.edu (Just some loser...) writes:

>>In my opinion it's just called quality control.  There are already tons
>>of operators who are just given ops on a whim so they can me one, and 
>>/kill people or whatever.

>So why create more? IRC only needs one or two sane operators on-line
>to deal with routing problems, so there's no reason why csd needs one
>at all. It doesn't matter how high the quality is if it's a useless
>job.

One or two sane ones in each hostmask..  We don't really want people
trying to squit behind hostmasks do we..   

..
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: dms50304@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Darkman)
Subject: Re: Avalog arrested....
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 19:00:08 GMT

jont@cs.su.oz.au (Jonathon Earnshaw Tidswell) writes:
[blah deleted from me]
>I believe there was no police involvement at all.
>In fact I dont believe any missles were launched.
>The article I saw was humour, however the author forgot the "necessary"
>':-) For the humoured impaired' disclaimer.

I don't think I needed a smiley to know it was intended as humour.  Just
the fact the Avalon went out of his way to kill made me think that there
was some hidden truth to it.  I seem to remember someone saying he *was*
arrested but that the story was an inflated balloon also.  Oh well. :)

-- 
--- Daryn Sharp   Darkman@uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: robertso@boole (ROBERTSON nancy)
Subject: IRC servers
Keywords: irc servers help
Organization: University of Grenoble (France)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 17:31:41 GMT

Hi there!

	I just got IRC client, and I don't know where I should connect to.
Could somebody post a list of servers or tell me where I can find one
please?

	Thanx for your help.
-- 
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
*       Nancy Robertson	<robertso@ufrima.imag.fr> 	*
*       Universite Joseph Fourier de Grenoble           * 
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: buboo@alf.uib.no (Ove Ruben R Olsen)
Subject: Ignorance is part of the Lamb.
Followup-To: poster
Reply-To: "he he he... drit i det" <somewhere@over.the.rainbow.oz>
Organization: Say NO ! to unattended bots, INC. 
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 13:56:11 GMT

Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen writes:

[... wast of bandwidth on local situation deleted ...]

> However, to run tin, I have to telnet unix1. When I telnet unix1
>from samson, vi (which is the silly editor tin uses on unix1) does no longer
>recognize the cursor keys, and editing anything is impossible. I can at best
>post something without quotes - if what I write is correct before I press
>return.

How about TRYING TO LEARN your software before using it ? This goes not
only to VI, but also to ircII and tin.
How about asking someone ? Nay... others are LAME... 
Maybe you are just lazy and do not want to have any other info that the
one that is give to you personaly, and the whine if you don't like it ?

There is a excelent VI archive on alf.uib.no, but then again I suspose 
you prefer to ftp to utsun.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp since that is in Japan, and it's
sooooooo cool to do it.  In the VI archive you will find anything that you 
ever need to learn VI.

Oh I forgot... you come from The PC Generation... I forgive you...

[... waste of bandwidth on a disclaimer discaliming that disclaimers are a 
     waste of bandwidth deleted. Beside, the things you call disclaimers are
     so called .sigs. Signatures are small textfiles that is appened to the
     outgoing post ...]

\Ruben (Bandwidth waster).
(Say NO to uanttened bots)


-- 
        Ove Ruben R Olsen a Gnarfer and VI user. EMAIL: ruben@uib.no. 
     Maintaining the EX/VI-archive and a couple of the Comp.Editors FAQs.
    People that are ignorant tend to live a frustrated life, at least when 
     it comes to editing - But I do belive this is a general rule in life
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl)
Subject: Re: This is the point!! (was bots-how to get rid of them)
Organization: Department of Astronomy, University of Virginia
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 02:59:34 GMT

In article <By3JFF.KFp@news.cso.uiuc.edu> mkwg9074@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (M. K. Weaver) writes:

>	God forbid...I don't think we are advocating more
>	bots. I think the main advocating had been to make
>	an alt.irc.bot and for the discussion of the future
>	and useful purpose of bots.

Amid all the useless flaming, I should point out that not one of the
people who wants to create the group has bothered to figure out how to
do it. You obviously have enough interest; all anyone who wants to
create the group has to do is get a clue.

Here's a free clue: go read alt.config. All you have to do is follow a
rather simple procedure and you can create any group you like. You do
not have to be anyone special.

>	Some one has been asking for
>	help with starting a game of Diplomacy <sp>. HAS ANYONE
>	HELPED THIS PERSON? 

No. Not only has it already been done (3 years ago) and died out, the
knowledge needed to build such an automaton is merely general computer
knowledge. Helping this person on just the one specific area is
unlikely to produce good results. The people who've written
well-designed bots, like Armin, Wisner, and Misha, taught themselves
how to do it.

>	It has been pointed out that there are bot authors that
>	have good intentions and that there are bot authors that
>	have had bad intentions.

I just hope that the people with good intentions have enough of a clue
to understand how to keep their bots from going into loops.
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: mrgreen@mullian.ee.mu.OZ.AU (matthew green)
Subject: Re: An idea!
Keywords: Monica for president!
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 12:58:54 GMT

mkwg9074@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (M. K. Weaver) writes:
>dms50304@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Darkman) writes:
>>Wow Monica, you must really tired after all those posts.  Wow!
>>I hereby suggested a new newsgroup:
>>
>>	alt.fan.monica.weaver

I'm all for it..  you can newgroup it though..

>	Nah....I have all the fan I need...[he knows who he is]

I wonder who this "telecommunication" thingo she is talking about is then...

>>Just think about it.  Everyone can talk about equal rights for bots (*tries
>>to hold back laughter*) and use <>'s and everything!  Sorry for the stab
>>there Monica, but it had to be done.  I'm in one of those wierd moods again.

whats wrong with a < here and a > there ??

>	<holds hand on arm> Aw...you cut me you cut me...how am I going
>	to get the blood out of this white sweater. :)

give it to me..  I'll wash it for you..  :) <I bet she does to!>

..
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: jking@socs.uts.edu.au (smathy werp)
Subject: Re: yes or no? (bot deopping)
Organization: Computing Sciences, Uni of Technology, Sydney.
Date: 23 Nov 92 01:45:32 GMT


>rmn9458@rigel.tamu.edu (rebecca) writes:

>I have a question for the ircops and experienced irc users:
>when there is a net-split, people on channels can be separated.
>If someone creates a channel by that name while the split is 
>occuring, they get automatic op status. (with me so far?)
>Ok, the question is, when the two reconnect, is it or is it not right
>for a bot on one to deop ops on the other?
>[this bot is "permanently" in the channel to guard it and only makes certain
> people ops, so if the new op isnt on its list it deops
>them immmediatly]
>I understand its purpose (to prevent people from taking advantage of net-splits
>and messing up the channel; they are possessive of their channel by the way)
>but is it correct and is that grounds for being killed by an ircop?

rebecca ..
	this is done not to prevent people from gaining ops in (relatively)
	sincere joins during splits .. but to stop people with OLD server
	gaining ops through channel hacking .. there is no way for a bot
	to be programmed so as to know the difference between ops gained
	through splits and ops gained through hacking ..

	thats all
--


	| Life: Jason | IRC: elephant | email: jking@socs.uts.EDU.AU |
From: titus@coombs.anu.edu.au (titus chiu)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Re: Global Birthday Greetings
Date: 18 Nov 1992 12:08:51 GMT
Organization: Coombs Computing Unit, Australian National University, Canberra.
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.76.2
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user on Coombs at ANU. The
              opinions expressed are those of the user and not necessarily
              those of the Australian National University.

avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) writes:
>troy@cbme.unsw.EDU.AU (Troy Rollo) writes:
>
>>Oh yeah, real huge. It happens to be less than the bandwidth taken up by
>>a single MODE command. Now, with a bot generating MODE commands willy-nilly,
>>that bot is likely to waste far, far more bandwidth.
>
>There are more clients from *.edu servers/hosts at most any time of
>day than there are servers in total.  Consider, there are at least 50
>servers which match *.edu and one of those has (at times) had one tenth
>of the total number of clients on IRC attached to it.

i would have thought that a global matching $*.edu would just mean it uses
the bandwidth of sending to all the servers in *.edu (assuming that client
to server connections dont use much bandwidth at all which can be false
at times) so generally, what troy said is correct.

>avalon

titus
(Say NO to unattended bots)
--
titus chiu                                   -- email: ---------------------
                                             ---- titus@coombs.anu.edu.au --
  dont drink and drive home                  ---- titus@turing.ORG ---------
  get stoned and fly home.                   -------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: dms50304@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Darkman)
Subject: Re: Avalog arrested....
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 05:10:47 GMT

How about someone just give us the real story on what happened?  I seem to get
the impression that Avalon destroyed a few sites computer systems that he
thought people were hacking into his system from and the method of destruction
was a trapdoor in a server version he released.  Did I hit the nail on the
head or am I completely off base?  I also assume that he was arrested for this?
Someone care to comment on this?

-- 
--- Daryn Sharp   Darkman@uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen)
Subject: Re: Ignorance is part of the Lamb.
Organization: MRIH, More og Romsdal Ingeniorhogskole
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 13:16:00 GMT

Tom Kovar (tom@bim.itc.univie.ac.at) wrote:
: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen) writes:
: : In fact, I prefer not to ftp at all other than when I need something and I
: : don't feel like programming it myself. Also, installing a functioning version
: : of vi is not my job. I have tried to persuade the one who does this to compile
: : tin on the samson and use emacs instead, but he just says that "something went
: : wrong when I tried to compile it on samson, and it won't do any good to try it
: : again."
: 
:   This statement is the best acknowledgement of all Ruben has written about
: you ignorance towards learning to use software.
:
It's not ignorance towards learning to use software, rather than a lack of
information flow. Now... my quoted statement above was what I heard from a guy
who know a lot more about it than me. I mean... c'mon! He's been here two years
longer than I have. How am I supposed to know when he's right or wrong about
this stuff?

:   It is not necessary to "compile in" any editor. Nearly all newer programmes
: of this kind (news readers, mailers,...) ask the value of the environment
: variable EDITOR and start the editor listed in it (complete programme path).
: Only if this variable does not exist or does not point to any executable
: file, the "compiled in" editor is started. So if you want to use your favourite
: editor /usr/gardabr/jeg/er/en/dum/bruker, there is no hindrance. Btw - to find
: this out, it is enough to scan through "man tin". A matter of 3 minutes.
: 
In fact I was surprised to even find a man on tin, as most of my man requests
have told me that there is no man on it.

:   So long. Send your flames to no.dritt, v.s.g.

This has been one of the most usefull articles, so I see no reason to flame it.
In fact, I see no reason to send any flames anywhere about anything.

:   Hilsen,
:                                                                         Tom



 Gard
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: mkwg9074@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (M. K. Weaver)
Subject: Re: Keep the flood.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 06:47:52 GMT

titus@coombs.anu.edu.au (titus chiu) writes:

>First of all, i aint the one complaining about the state of the ircII client.
>Second, maybe i do need a few more clues, but at least i dont log.


	You heard it hear first folks...titus is doing his part
	for the environment by not "logging". 

	<I happen to think titus that your remark is the nature
	of remarks that were asked to be taken to personal mail
	The Second one I mean.>

	Why is it that you all can't argue without people bashing?

	clueless to why people can't get along...
	
	"People are people"
-- 
"When you sit with a nice girl for two hours, you think it is only a minute.
But when you sit on a hot stove for a minute, you think it's two hours.
THAT'S RELATIVITY." (Albert Einstein)
                 "My name is Monica. Got a minute?"
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen)
Subject: Bots'n'vi
Organization: MRIH, More og Romsdal Ingeniorhogskole
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 18:37:14 GMT

titus chiu (titus@coombs.anu.edu.au) wrote:
: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen) writes:
: >titus chiu (titus@coombs.anu.edu.au) wrote:
: >: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen) writes:
: >: 
: >: >from samson, vi (which is the silly editor tin uses on unix1) does no longer
: >: >recognize the cursor keys, and editing anything is impossible. I can at best
: >: 
: >: just because you don't know how to use vi doesn't make it silly, and i dont
: >: see why anybody would want to know how you telnet from one place to another
: >: on irc anyway.
:       ^^^
: my mistake, i meant to say alt.irc
: 
If you manage to telnet from tin, be my guest and tell me how. We were in fact
talking about what possibilities I have to be reading newsgroups and being on
irc simultaneously.

: 
: Just because you cannot comprehend a 'load of escape key commands' does
: not make an editor awful or silly, you are of course entitled to your
: opinions. I can understand now why you have not listened to herm's warning
: on the faults of your bot, you cannot comprehend it.
: 
: >Escape x for delete? It's rediculous. And I wan't telnetting from irc, but
: 
: u could actually do dd for delete line, dw for delete word and just x for
: delete char.
: 
Of course, but let's say you wrote the word "herrman", and wanted to remove
the r. What is more pleasant to press? ESC h h h h x l l l a 
or left left left backspace right right right ???
What is more pleasant to press? ESC d d or ctrl+k? ESC : w q or ctrl+x ctrl+c?
Of course this has a lot to do with taste, but I prefer to be in constant
edit mode and have the commands on control keys, rather than changing between
editing and command modes. This has, of course NOTHING to do with not listening
to herm's warning. You say Glurg could flood the channel because of the public
chatting. Well, I have not seen ONE BOT that is fool proof. Not even nickserv.
If you try to ...
/set exec_protection off
/on -notice nickserv /exec -msg nickserv@service.de help ;say $0-
/msg nickserv@service.de help
..voila! A flood!

And in fact, I _am_ working on a bot now, programmed in C, which will register
the last message from a nick to compare with the newest, and also check the
time. If it clearly is a flood, the message will be ignored.
Well, this test can of course be omitted by changing between several nicks
and thereby giving each nick enough time, but I will be working on this, too.
So it's not me not listening. I have just proven that it is impossible to
do a bot as fool proof as you want it to be in 100% ircii.

What will be the next? All ircii bots to be removed and replaced with bots
written in a language that is capable of timing each nick to discover a flood
attempt? Well, you don't have to wait for me, my new version is under
developement...

/ Gard - say...

Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: dinn@ug.cs.dal.ca (Michael 'Moose' Dinn)
Subject: my philosophy on bots and their ilk.
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 22:01:02 GMT


This is the .motd of my server. It would be nice if every server admin
adopted these.


-- snip snip -- cut here -- snip snip --
 _     ___  _
' )   /    //                             |\^/|
 / / / _  // _. ________  _           ._|\|   |/|_.
(_(_/ </_</_(__(_) / / <_</_           \ CANADA  / 
                                       <____ ____> 
   To Dalhousie's IRC Server.               |

Simple Rules:
	1. every client must have a way of 
	   returning the real user@host
	2. No annoying mode-changing bots
	3. If you don't own the account you're using, 
	   don't expect to get on this server.

-- snip snip -- cut here -- snip snip --

	
some clarification:

	1. /whois or /ctcp finger.

	2. Any bot that does anything to a channel mode (although there are
	   some of these that are useful)

	3. Shared accounts are evil.


These 3 rules work for me... what do the masses think?

--
 Michael Dinn, 4th year CS Student  |  dinn@ug.cs.dal.ca (School)
 IRC Caretaker and Gopher Tamer     |  dinn@appliedmicro.ns.ca (Work)
 Dalhousie University, Nova Scotia  |  (902) 461-4773 V.32/V.42bis (BBS)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: thecure@mullian.ee.mu.OZ.AU (matthew aardvarkious)
Subject: Re: [*] Irc Statistics (Idle)
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 01:53:53 GMT

dougmc@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Doug McLaren) writes:

>In article <9231622.8711@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> thecure@ee.mu.OZ.AU (matthew aardvarkious) writes:
>>
>>    (1)  67.15690%    2 hours   +-------------------------------+
>I assume (hope) you mean LESS than two hours here ...

Yepo.

>>*** CTCP FINGER reply from toocool: Xavier O'Neal,STORMS
>>+   10,(515)296-9253,(515)296-9253,Zay (toocool@pv7b86.vincent.iastate.edu)
>>+   Idle 1171989 seconds

>A few points to make here ...

>  1) judging from the ctcp finger replies, most ircII bots are always idle.
>     You may feel that this is appropriate, or maybe not, but that's not the
>     point.  'idle' here means time since the last key was pressed.  Most bots
>     don't use a keyboard to control themselves ...
>     Whether these bots are *useful* or not depends on the bot and on who
>     you ask.
>     Basically, ctcp finger is a good way to find ircII bots.

I did do this actually. Approximately 60% of the bots on IRC are IRCII 
clients. I accidently deleted the list, and didn't bother again.

I will have to wait for 2.2 to get a proper idle time though.
--
These are my personal views and do not reflect those of Melbourne University.
Anything I may say that may be deemed offensive and/or damaging should NOT
be redirected to administration, as they have had nothing to do with it. 
Please direct any/all complaints/enquiries to thecure@ee.mu.oz.au
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Monday, 16 Nov 1992 21:34:20 CST
From: Jay Lorenzana <U40348@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Server/Domain Address???


I am trying to run IRC on our system, but unfortunately no one know
how to use it, even the consultants!

I have the files on my CMS account and when I run RXIRC ver 1.5
I get a timeout error, server/host not responding.  I guess it
is because the server is in Germany!  Address is arbi.infomatik.
uni-oldenburg.de.

The response I get before the 20s timeout error is:
* IRC Session started on 16 Nov 1992 at 11:38:41
rxIRC v1.5 - You are JAY (Jay Lorenzana)
Logging is on; Loud beeps are off; Quiet ignore is off
IRC session ended on 16 Nov 1992 at 11:39:02

*********************************************

Thanks for any help you can offer.

-Jay

         Univeristy of Illinois
               at Chicago

                                   Internet: U40348@uicvm.uic.edu
                                   Bitnet  : U40348@uicvm.bitnet
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil (Tim Miller)
Subject: Re: IRC going down in two weeks all over (!?)
Organization: AL/HRTI, Brooks AFB
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 01:10:00 GMT

On Sun, 22 Nov 1992 00:09:59 GMT, mtymp15@staff.tc.umn.edu (David Hutton) said:

 D> Heard this rumor from a friend of a friend who is on the Board of
 D> Directors.  Claims that it is taking up too much room (i.e.
 D> bandwidth on the Internet).

	Here we go again, kids!

	I remember this rumor from awhile back on operlist.  It seems
that the NSF began monitoring IRC packet traffic through the T3 links
and reporting the stats in their monthly reports back in...when was it,
December of '90 (or was it '91?).  

	Anyway, after slogging through a month of "Imminent Death of IRC
Predicted" bullshit, I ttok the time to contact the address listed in
the monthly reports and *ask* why IRC traffic was being reported
suddenly after years of unreported operation.

	The response from the NSF (Sorry, the mail is *loooong* deleted)
was basically: "Someone asked us to because they felt that IRC was a
valid Internet-wide application, that should be tracked along with ftp,
talk, telnet, et. al."

	So much for the death of IRC.

 D> This source is reliable, is there anyone who can back up this claim?

	If you're that worried about it, I'd say contact your
administrator, get the point-of-contact for the NSF, and ask.

	Anyone concerned with IRC's bandwidth would be well advised to
grab any random month's stats from the NSF and take a look at IRC vs.
network traffic ni general.  It's insignificant.

-- Cerebus <tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil>
"They were quite nice about replying to me, and I was only a lowly
 student at the time..."