From: zcjm0f@wwnv67.hou.amoco.com (CJohn Mace)
Subject: Re: Protest over FSU Mascot
Organization: Amoco Production
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 16:16:40 GMT

In article <kitchel.725419826@manta> kitchel@manta.dpsi.com (Sidney W. Kitchel) writes:
>HADCRJAM@admin.uh.edu (MILLER, JIMMY A.) writes:
>
>>In <kitchel.725139442@manta> kitchel@manta.dpsi.com writes:
>
>>> dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com (David Head) writes:
>
>> [Dave can't see why Seminoles is seen as degrading, although he can see
>> [ why Redskins would be.  Notes that the Seminoles of Florida have no problems
>> [with the name and have made the mascots costume.  Suggests drawing animal 
>> [names out of a hat, tongue firmly in cheek at this point.]
>
>>> 	It's not a matter of your opinion, Dave, or the opinion of the
>>> FSU AD about the appropriateness of the name. It is a matter of the
>>> Indians' opinion.
>>[deletion]
>>> 	I used to have an opinion close to yours but I have reformed.
>>> There is absolutely no defense for "Redskins" and damned little for
>>> "Seminole", if the Seminoles object.
>
>>  But that's just it, Sid.  The American Indians in question, the Seminoles of
>>Florida, don't mind.  They seem to like it.  But their fellow American Indians,
>>who of course know what's good for the Seminoles of Florida, want to have
>>their little protest anyway.  Sounds awfully paternalistic and patronizing to
>>me--like the Seminoles of Florida need their wise brothers to make their
>>decisions for them.  I think not.  Re-read Dave's post, I think you missed 
>>something.
>
>	Well, Jim, I was expecting a goober to walk into this one, but
>to be an aggie too! There has been NO evidence presented in this group
>about the opinion of the Seminole people. A couple of times over the
>last two years the claim has been made that one of the Seminole chiefs
>in Florida says it is OK. But I have heard nothing about the Seminoles
>as a group. The original posting claims that a goup of Seminoles in
>Oklahoma do not appreciate it. I'd like to know more about a consensus
>if it exists.


Is anyone else out there as sick of the "politically correct" world as
I am?  This whole debate is SOOOO stupid!  Its kinda like the 55 mph 
speed limit...  Does anyone really believe in it?  It seems like everyone,
his dog, and his mother-in-law has their collective noses in everyone 
else's business these days!  If you want racism to go away, you have 
to teach your children that racism is not correct.  Its not the responsibility
of the public schools, or the Universities, or the Washington Redskins 
football organization to teach that.

The native Americans were wronged in the worst way, repeatedly.  First 
they were killed, then they were forced to live on the worst land, then
were forced to live there impoverished.  These were heinous (sp?) acts
that can never be repaired, IMHO.  When I think of the American Indian,
I think of a proud people who cared for the land they lived on, then
again, my great-great grandfather was an Indian Chief (never told that
to anyone before... now all of my friends will understand why I can't
grow a beard)  :-)  This man had two choices.  He could either go live
on a reservation, or he could declare American allegiance and go about
his way.  He chose to face racism and unfairness and to not go to the
reservation.  I can't even imagine the prejudice and hassle he had to
go through, living in Southern Alabama as and Indian farmer.

Moral of the Story:  If you don't want to be a victim, quit playing the
part.

Moral of the Story II:  Morality CANNOT be legislated.

cmuck

ps- if there was a button on the wall that would alleviate the earth 
    by removing all humanity, I would push it.  No regrets, no questions
    asked.