From: herm@acme.etsu.edu (Herman H. Fredriksson)
Subject: Do NOT reply to a NOTICE. Do NOT send a PRIVMSG on a PRIVMSG.
Followup-To: alt.newbies,alt.stupidity
Summary: *sigh*
Keywords: bots, are, lame.
Organization: Say NO to bots inc.
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 08:07:00 GMT

gardabr@unix1.MRIH.NO (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen) writes:
>titus chiu (titus@coombs.anu.edu.au) wrote:
>: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen) writes:
>: >titus chiu (titus@coombs.anu.edu.au) wrote:
>: >: gardabr@unix1 (Gard Eggesbo Abrahamsen) writes:
>: >: [..stuff about vi on alt.irc?.. you know why I deleted it..]

>: my mistake, i meant to say alt.irc
 
>If you manage to telnet from tin, be my guest and tell me how. We were in fact
>talking about what possibilities I have to be reading newsgroups and being on
>irc simultaneously.

1. Maybe titus assumed too much and didnt make it simple enough for you, but
   what he means is that..he doesnt see why you need to tell us about
   how you telnet from here to there, and post it to alt.irc. He doesnt
   obviously mean you are going to telnet from a newsgroup.

2. To telnet from tin, you do the following:

    2.1 Press the [!] key (its normally above the number one.. press shift).

    2.2 Type: telnet newbie.mrih.no (or some other host)

before this turns alt.irc into a "alt.teach.gard.how.to.use.software", please
go and read the manuals or press H for help, or generally, just get a clue. 

>: [..stuff from titus explaining vi..]
 
>: >Escape x for delete? It's rediculous. And I wan't telnetting from irc, but
 
>: u could actually do dd for delete line, dw for delete word and just x for
>: delete char.
 
>Of course, but let's say you wrote the word "herrman", and wanted to remove
>the r. What is more pleasant to press? ESC h h h h x l l l a 
>or left left left backspace right right right ???
>What is more pleasant to press? ESC d d or ctrl+k? ESC : w q or ctrl+x ctrl+c?
>Of course this has a lot to do with taste, but I prefer to be in constant
>edit mode and have the commands on control keys, rather than changing between

emacs chews up a lot of memory resources. Its been described as
EMACS = Eight Megs And Constantly Swapping. I'm not saying emacs is bad
just that each editor has its own good points / bad points. This discussion
belongs in comp.editors... please take it there if you followup to this 
particular section.

>editing and command modes. This has, of course NOTHING to do with not listening
>to herm's warning. You say Glurg could flood the channel because of the public
>chatting. Well, I have not seen ONE BOT that is fool proof. Not even nickserv.
>If you try to ...
>/set exec_protection off
>/on -notice nickserv /exec -msg nickserv@service.de help ;say $0-
>/msg nickserv@service.de help
>..voila! A flood!

now listen in you pinhead, you dont reply to a NOTICE, especially with
a PRIVMSG, you dont reply with a PRIVMSG to a PRIVMSG, Understand?,
Comprende?, Sjo"nner Dere?, Fo"sta'r du?, Verstehen sie?

>And in fact, I _am_ working on a bot now, programmed in C, which will register
>the last message from a nick to compare with the newest, and also check the
>time. If it clearly is a flood, the message will be ignored.
>Well, this test can of course be omitted by changing between several nicks
>and thereby giving each nick enough time, but I will be working on this, too.
>So it's not me not listening. I have just proven that it is impossible to
>do a bot as fool proof as you want it to be in 100% ircii.

>What will be the next? All ircii bots to be removed and replaced with bots
>written in a language that is capable of timing each nick to discover a flood
>attempt? Well, you don't have to wait for me, my new version is under
>developement...

You are not listening, there is a method to solve the flooding problem. 
That is to have all automata follow a simple rule. As specified in the
protocol description. 

to who ever is maintaining the current ircII: Can you please remove the 
"-msg" flag from /exec, when /exec is called from /on msg or /on notice,
and possibly others like /on ctcp and /on ctcp_reply, so that dorks like
this wont keep shooting themselves in the foot, in the next version.

herm.
(say NO to unattended bots)
-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  Herman H. Fredriksson                     Email: herm@nitha.etsu.edu  |
|  Things that make you go herm.....             herm@coombs.anu.edu.au  |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+