From: asya@remarque.berkeley.edu (That's Mistress Asya)
Newsgroups: rec.games.bridge
Subject: Re: interesting hand
Date: 15 Dec 92 22:13:35 GMT
Reply-To: asya@ux5.lbl.gov
Organization: The Great White North
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Dec15.020504.18493@netcom.com> mss@netcom.com (Mark Singer) writes:
>In article <Bz7xAJ.CBw@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> bharat@cs.uiuc.edu writes:
>>rudy@netcom.com (Rudy) writes:

>>>--
>>>AJTx
>>>AKxx
>>>AKQxx

>>>2S  X  4S  5H
>>>P   ?
>>>    5N P   7H
>>>7S  X ----

>>Anyway, seriously, declarer ought to be highly distributional, but
>>stranger things have happened.  The CQ at trick 2 is marked...
>Definitely NOT

I agree. The Queen of clubs is a thoughtless play designed to lay
the blame on partner (well, I thought you wanted a ruff or you
wouldn't have played the Jack).

>>As long as partner has at most 2 clubs, there is no problem with this
>>hand.  I simply make sure to take all my clubs and hearts; and hope to
>>get any of 3C, 2H, 2D for upto 1700. 
>"ought to"  "as long as" "hope to"
>These are very interesting expressions to be using in a situation such
>as this.  In fact, there are many things that can be done with absolute
>assurance, if...

If partner has just 2 clubs, why is it so clear that the right thing
to do is to cash your 3C, 2H and 2D?  Maybe partner is 7-2-2-2 and the
way to 1700 is 1C, 2D, diamond ruff, club over, club and diamond for
a promotion?

>you remember that bridge is a partnership game.  As an absolute fact,
>you know that parter has either KQ of hearts or K with extra length.
>As an absolute fact, he knows about all of your first round controls.
>So...

But neither one of you knows about the heart count.

>>One rare scenario is when RHO has gone berserk and has 4 clubs, then
>>there is a slim chance that partner has the SK and you can get a
>>promotion.

Why is that "going berserk"?  In fact it would be more berserk if
RHO didn't have a side 4 bagger.  What do you expect he bid 7S on,
6-2-2-3?

>what you need to do is let partner *tell* you whether or not there
>is a promotion coming.  The idea is to put *partner* on play to 
>direct the defense, and so the critical question is "which heart
>do I underlead so that partner knows the count in the suit".  We
>were playing 3rd and lowest, and standard leads from intermediate
>sequences.  Should this hand lead the heart 10 as "third best"?

However, Mark, since it seems that you held the other hand, you
might be fixing on the fact that your heart count is not known to
partner, and that sie might not know that hearts is safe to play
at all.  Would you not bid the same way with Kx KQxxxxx 9x Jx?

Of course my point is that king of diamonds at trick 2 cannot cost.
Partner will play the 9.  Now you have to decide what to do.

If partner is 22 in the minors, you must play on diamonds and partner
with 7 hearts will know to get back to you with clubs.  If partner is
2-4(clubs) you must play on diamonds letting partner get back to
you in hearts and now the only problem becomes how to safely cash out
your hearts before the promotion.  If partner is 4(d)-2, well, then
you are always getting this 1700. (well, unless you do something
silly) Period.  So...

>False again.  It is not at all academic.  Declarer may have 6
>spades, and may also have 4 (!!!!!!!) diamonds.  Now if partner
>has Kx of spades...

>Of course, *you* have no way of knowing this.  Partner does.  *If*
>partner can read a third-best heart underlead, he can return the top
>of a doubleton diamond, get a ruff with his small trump, then put
>you back in with either a heart or club (depending on declarer's
>*heart* length and, with the K of spades, give you a suit preference
>for another diamond.  Of course, if *you* know the dimaond count
>and know that no uppercut is coming, *you* can then try to cash the
>obvious "round" card(s).

Of course what does 3rd best mean?  AJTx  -- as opposed to what holding?
Forgetting for the moment that it may not be safe to lead a heart at
this point (why is RHO saving if not a heart void?) the only question is
what heart holding can partner expect?  Lenthwise, you could have 4 or 5.
On the auction, 6 seems unlikely and 3 is just barely remotely possible.

>Sorry, Rudy, if I ruined your problem.  But all of these forwarders
>keep viewing this defensive problem as if it is *their* problem to
>work out.  C'mon guys.  This is just a variation of a dummy reversal.

I thinking you are fixating on what you know to be the case -- that is
the number of hearts that partner holds.  Maybe this was Rudy's problem
to work out after all.

>BTW, which heart should you lead?

The King of Diamonds, I presume.  The question that I have is this:
if your partner is "Mr. Count" then which club/diamond will he play
from 4?  Second highest?  How about from JTxx?  Can't you *find out*
the count in the minors by playing two rounds of diamonds?  Well, no
you'll find out the count in diamonds, how will you find out the club
count?
>--  Disappointed with my 1400, but still well above average for the board
>
>>
>>-- 
>>R. Bharat Rao                         E-mail: bharat@cs.uiuc.edu
>>AI Group, Beckman Institute for Advanced Science and Technology
>>405 N. Mathews, Urbana, IL 61801   (217)-333-5978 (O), 337-6498(H)
>>Electrical & Computer Engineering, University of Illinois, Urbana
>
>
>-- 
>Mark Singer    
>mss@netcom.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.bridge