HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: michael@chpc.utexas.edu (Michael Lemke)
Subject: Re: The Problem with UNIX
Organization: The University of Texas System - CHPC
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 92 07:02:35 GMT

In article <By00oI.4yH@research.canon.oz.au> andy@research.canon.oz.au (Andy Newman) writes:
>
>barnett@crdgw1.ge.com writes:
>>I don't want to type
>>       list -long -time  -reverse -all
>>or
>>       list -lo -ti  -r -a
>>or
>>       list -lo/ti/r/a
>>or even
>>       list -l/t/r/a
>>when I can type
>>       ls -ltra
>
>Its funny, a lot of of the systems that have these long-winded command
>names and options (ever used VM/CMS?) have a method of shortening the
>commands to something that's less demanding on one's typing abilities.
>
>E.g. on VM/CMS (I haven't used it for a while so excuse any
>inaccuracies) the command to copy one file to another is really called
>"copyfile" but most people use CMS abbreviations to allow them to run
>it as "co" (one letter difference from 'cp' ignoring ASCII/EBCDIC :-)
>

But there is one major difference to Unix (assuming VM/CMS works the
same as VMS in this respect):  You made the abbreviations yourself (up
to a point) so you get something *you* can remember.  So *you* can
choose to type FORTRAN, FORTR, FORT or FOR depending on your mood today
and don't have to memorize some meaningless character combination (can
you pronounce - not spell - cp?).



-- 
Michael Lemke
Astronomy, UT Austin, Texas
(michael@io.as.utexas.edu or UTSPAN::UTADNX::IO::MICHAEL [SPAN])
From: moewes@mhd1.moorhead.msus.edu (Christopher R. Moewes)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.wizards
Subject: please ignore. test
Date: 18 Nov 92 21:00:42 GMT

this is just a test.



*==========================================================================*
*  Christopher R. Moewes                                                   *
*  Moorhead, Mn 56560           /o)\  InCrEaSe ThE pEaCe                   *
*  (218) 236-6480               \(o/ ChRiS (moewes@mhd1.moorhead.msus.edu) *
*==========================================================================*
Newsgroups: comp.unix.wizards,comp.unix.shell,comp.unix.misc
From: les@chinet.chi.il.us (Leslie Mikesell)
Subject: Re: The Problem with UNIX
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 00:01:27 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.021538.25729@mole-end.matawan.nj.us> mat@mole-end.matawan.nj.us writes:
>> Do yourself a favor and compile ELM.
>
>This user says `bletch!'  I've got ELM.  It threw away a valuable piece of
>mail on me because the mail included another mail header.

This is fixed in 2.4 if you tell it your mailer uses the Content-Length:
headers.  It also won't blow up when the mail contains null characters
now.

>Right now I have
>a non-elm mailbox with a message in it that ELM will present out of order.

What is your sort order?  Set it to 'reverse mailbox' if you want the
stock mail order (and then it doesn't depend on the mailer getting the
date format right either).

>ELM's handling of the cursor keys is just plain wrong. ... ... ...
>What?  It's just fine for you and you haven't noticed any problems?

Odd maybe, but it works for me.  Up/down go by messages, left/right
go by screens.  I always use j & k anyway.  What happens for you?

>My favorite way to deal with mail is to go into vi, create a mail command
>with a here document filled with blank lines and ending in `x', and 1G!Gksh
>the whole thing.  It subjects me to the fewest bogons of anything I've got.
>(Oh, you don't like vi?  Fine with me.

Actually I like vi but I don't see the point of that exercise.  How about
cat /usr/mail/you?  Or more useful: less /usr/mail/you (pg if you don't
have less).

Les Mikesell
  les@chinet.chi.il.us
Organization: EARN-France Montpellier
Date: Friday, 20 Nov 1992 17:04:24 GMT
From: <CASTRO@FRMOP11.BITNET>
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
Subject: Seeking X-Windows Unix for i486dx50

Hi

I am looking for a public freeware unix system (I can't afford buying it)
which could support X-window using application.
my configuration is:
i486DX 50
4mb RAM
100 Mb Hard disk available for unix partition
Tseng Lab ET4000, VESA compatible video card
800x600 SVGA Screen. (1024x780 is also available but not the most comfortable)

If you know a server where I could find this (I have ftp facilities)
please tell me

Thank You

Bye
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos,comp.unix.questions,comp.unix.programmer,comp.unix.wizards
From: Frank.Prindle@launchpad.unc.edu (Frank Prindle)
Subject: Looking for UNIX pgm to read/write MSDOS floppies
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 22:06:53 GMT

Hi,
I am looking for a PD UNIX program which will copy a UNIX file to or from
an MSDOS formatted floppy given that I have a raw device access only to a
720K diskette.  Nothing fancy required, just copying files back and forth
with no translation or anything.  I've tried "archie" but just can't seem
to find a good search string for something like this.  Please reply by
email, since I don't regularly subscribe to or read these newsgroups.  My
email address is "prindle@nadc.navy.mil" or "Frank.Prindle@bbs.oit.unc.edu".
Many thanks in advance,
Frank Prindle
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
From: joel@wam.umd.edu (Joel M. Hoffman)
Subject: Re: UNIX on a PC
Keywords: unix pc systems
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:03:06 GMT

In article <Bxvs45.KHq@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> vyainsm@expert.cc.purdue.edu (Sean Vyain) writes:
>My questions:
>
>	How do fast PC clones, like a 486DX/66MHz, compare with more traditiona
>		workstations for performance?  Are the processors fast enough?
>		The disk systems?  What kind of buses give the best results?
>		EISA? VESA?
I think you'll find a 486DX/66 much faster than any Sun you'd consider
buying.  Of course, the speed depends on the OS as well.  I'm
currently running Linux on a 386/25, and response time is better than
the Suns we have at school.  Of course, the processor is slower (I
think), and the disk is certainly slower (I have an IDE), so if you
have computationally intensive tasks or large data-bases, you'll see a
difference.  On the other hand, because Linux is SO well designed,
almost everything else runs FASTER.  I'm not running X, but I
understand that with 8MEG X runs in real time even on 386/25's.


>	How do different UNIX implementations for PCs, such as 386bsd, Coherent
>		Linux, etc..., compare to say SunOS?  Are the more expensive
>		UNIXes (read AT&T) really worth the price?
On the contrary.  The free implementations are better, IMHO.  Linux is
certainly more stable (even though it's still in bet 0.98), has MUCH
MUCH better support, comes with source code, etc.  People are even
working on detailed and comprehensvie documentation.  Linux seems to
be the fastest Unix available.  386bsd currently has better network
support.  SCO Unix has a better DOS emulator, and a fancier windowing
environment under X.  SCO Unix with those features also costs about
$2000 more than Linux (which is free), for which price you may as well
buy another computer to run your DOS apps. on....


>	How much, in the way of system resources (disk space, RAM, disk cache,
>		processor cache) do you find necessary to get the same level
>		of performance as a traditional workstation?

I have a 386/25, with 6MEG, and two IDE drives for a total of about
200MEG for Linux.  I get VERY good performance.  I'm not running X,
but I can run GCC via make in an Emacs window while I'm downingloading
something and still get great response time.

>	Who makes reliable equipment that is reasonably priced with decent
>		support?  I am thinking of mail order companies like ZEOS, or
>		LodeStar.

Zeos makes very good equipment, and you can't beet the price.  I
purchase from Dell, because their support is better (at least, it was
when I bought my computer).  Over the summer, my computer was zapped
by lightning in a remote location in New York State.  Dell came
through, and arrived the very next day with a new motherboard, and
replaced the whole thing.  Dell's computers are also built better than
Zeos, as they invest more in R&D.  But I don't think you'll really
notice the difference there.

-Joel
(joel@wam.umd.edu)

Xref: sparky comp.unix.msdos:1112 comp.unix.bsd:9249 comp.unix.sysv386:16756 comp.unix.xenix.misc:238 comp.unix.xenix.sco:3364
From: ashley@gidday.enet.dec.com (STEPHEN ASHLEY)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos,comp.unix.bsd,comp.unix.sysv386,comp.unix.xenix.misc,comp.unix.xenix.sco,unix-pc.general,comp.unix.pc-clone.32bi
Subject: Re: HELP! problem with tar PC <-> SUN
Date: 24 Nov 92 01:57:15 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


>Here's the problem: there appears to be a 10x differential in the blocking
>factor used by the Sun and the PC's. If a tape is written on the Sun with
>a blocking fator of 2, the PC reads it as a blocking factor of 20. Both
>"say" they are writing with block size=512 and blocking factor=20 by 
>default, but the evidence shows this to be wrong. The Sun at least is smart
>enough to recognize the different blocking factor when reading the tape
>and has no trouble. The PC, however, has to be told, and this is where the
>*REAL* problem comes in:


	I dont know if this your problem or not, but here it is then.
If have been told (Sun tec support Oz) that Sun OS does not support Helical
Scan tape drives that use hardware based compression. As I said this is
probable not your fault, but what the heek.

	Stephen Ashley,
	Alice Springs Out Back Oz.
Xref: sparky comp.unix.msdos:1097 comp.unix.bsd:8942 comp.unix.sysv386:16513 comp.unix.xenix.misc:225 comp.unix.xenix.sco:3333 comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit:476 comp.unix.sys5.r4:518 comp.unix.wizards:4728
From: mark@roissy.umd.edu (Mark Sienkiewicz)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos,comp.unix.bsd,comp.unix.sysv386,comp.unix.xenix.misc,comp.unix.xenix.sco,unix-pc.general,comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit,comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.unix.wizards
Subject: Re: HELP! problem with tar PC <-> SUN
Date: 16 Nov 92 19:01:46 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland

In article <1992Nov12.234822.1273@leland.Stanford.EDU> dkeisen@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dave Eisen) writes:
>This probably still won't make him happy. He'll want to read tapes
>that were created with a blocking factor of 20 using a blocking
>factor of 20 and tapes that were created with a blocking factor of
>2 using a blocking factor of 2. In other words, he wants tar to

I agree the client is being unreasonable, but I can't remember _ever_
working for a client who was not unreasonable at least some of the time.

>be clairvoyent. If this is the case, all you can do is tell him that
>he wants something impossible and hope you don't lose the business.

On most systems I've used, you can detect the block size of a tape by
doing something like:

	char buffer[BIGGEST_POSSIBLE_RECORD_SIZE];

	n=read(fd,buffer,sizeof(buffer));
	printf("block size is %d bytes\n",n);

Mark S.
From: steve.beling@analog.com (Steve B. Beling)
Subject: pc cross compiler
Summary: Does anyone know of a cross compiler running on a sparc which generates 
         PC compatible code ? OASYS of Waltham Ma. makes one but it only 
         supports MSC 5.1. I'd like to get one that supports 
         a newer compiler (MSC6.0 or 7.0) or the new Borland. 
         Basically I want anything that has a decent debugger.
         steve.beling@analog.com
Originator: sbb@mithras
Organization: Analog Devices, Inc.
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 22:03:35 GMT
From: alex@coombs.anu.edu.au (Alex Stivala)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
Subject: Re: Seeking X-Windows Unix for i486dx50
Date: 22 Nov 92 06:59:38 GMT
Organization: Australian National University
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.76.2

<CASTRO@FRMOP11.BITNET> writes:

>Hi

>I am looking for a public freeware unix system (I can't afford buying it)
>which could support X-window using application.
>my configuration is:
>i486DX 50
>4mb RAM
>100 Mb Hard disk available for unix partition
>Tseng Lab ET4000, VESA compatible video card
>800x600 SVGA Screen. (1024x780 is also available but not the most comfortable)

>If you know a server where I could find this (I have ftp facilities)
>please tell me

>Thank You

>Bye


Linux with Xfree86 (you could try a "package" such as SLS) should be
just what you want. 4 MB RAM is a bit small for X though (I have only
4 MB on my 386DX and find X a bit slow, but still useable).  Major ftp
site is tsx-11.mit.edu in /pub/linux.

You could also try out 386BSD I suppose, I don't know much about that though.

Alex.
--
Alex Stivala, B.Inf.Tech.(Eng.) student, Australian National University
Internet:   alex@coombs.anu.edu.au
Fidonet:    Alex Stivala 3:620/243
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
Subject: Simulation of INMOS ANSI-C Toolset on IBM-AT
From: slfjd@saturn.ee.usu.edu (sane sachin arvind)
Date: 18 Nov 92 15:56:58 MDT
Distribution: world
Organization: Utah State University
Keywords: Transputer, Operating systems.

Hi !,
My friend in India is working on transputer based systems using PC as a host. He is 
working on a project "Simulation of INMOS ANSI-C Toolset on IBM-AT".
It involves writing a multitasking kernel for IBM with DOS.
If you can help me getting any litt. related to this it will be of great
help to me and him. He has already read material from Tanenbaum's book on
O.S. which has the complete source code of MINIX (mini UNIX) and one on
The XINU approach.

The key thing is that it should all go with DOS.

Thanks in advance,

- Sachin Sane
From: sct@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Stephen Tweedie)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
Subject: Re: Seeking X-Windows Unix for i486dx50
Date: 23 Nov 92 14:15:14 GMT
Organization: University of Edinburgh Dept. of Computer Science, Scotland

In article <alex.722415578@coombs>, alex@coombs.anu.edu.au (Alex Stivala) writes:
> NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.76.2
> <CASTRO@FRMOP11.BITNET> writes:
>>Hi
>>I am looking for a public freeware unix system (I can't afford buying it)
>>which could support X-window using application.

> Linux with Xfree86 (you could try a "package" such as SLS) should be
> just what you want. 4 MB RAM is a bit small for X though (I have only
> 4 MB on my 386DX and find X a bit slow, but still useable).  Major ftp
> site is tsx-11.mit.edu in /pub/linux.

> You could also try out 386BSD I suppose, I don't know much about that though.

Probably best stick with Linux.  386BSD does not yet have shared
libraries, which means that X binaries get very big very quickly.  On
a machine with more memory the difference would not be so pronounced,
but while you can get away with 4MB for Linux/Xfree86, 386BSD in 4MB
would probably be unbearably slow (although it should still function
properly; both operating systems are incredibly robust for free
software.)

Cheers,
 Stephen Tweedie.
---
Stephen Tweedie <sct@uk.ac.ed.dcs>   (Internet: <sct@dcs.ed.ac.uk>)
Department of Computer Science, Edinburgh University, Scotland.
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
From: folini@ghost.dsi.unimi.it (Folini Carlo)
Subject: HP9000 -> serial port -> PC : File transfer. NEED HELP!
Organization: Computer Science Dep. - Milan University
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 13:01:06 GMT

I work on a HP9000 c700 under X-windows. I don't succed on downloading files
from it to a pc-dos compatible via the serial port. Can someone help me?
What I really need is unix definition of the port . (i think!?)

Thanx in advance for any help !

Carlo

Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
From: steve.beling@analog.com
Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
Date: 18 Nov 92 14:03 PST
Subject: pc cross compiler
Nf-ID: #N:1992Nov18.220335.12844@analog.co:930882999:000:1
Nf-From: analog.com!steve.beling    Nov 18 14:03:00 1992




Newsgroups: comp.unix.msdos
From: vyainsm@expert.cc.purdue.edu (Sean Vyain)
Subject: UNIX on a PC
Keywords: unix pc systems
Organization: Purdue University
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 22:07:17 GMT

	Hi.  I have been thinking about getting a UNIX box for home, but I have
several questions that I haven't found answers to.  At first I wanted to get a
used workstation (read: SUN), but recently I have been questioning how reliable
such a system would be, and how much it would cost to maintain.  Then, I started
thinking about getting a PC clone.  This seems more likely.

My questions:

	How do fast PC clones, like a 486DX/66MHz, compare with more traditional
		workstations for performance?  Are the processors fast enough?
		The disk systems?  What kind of buses give the best results?
		EISA? VESA?

	How do different UNIX implementations for PCs, such as 386bsd, Coherent,
		Linux, etc..., compare to say SunOS?  Are the more expensive
		UNIXes (read AT&T) really worth the price?

	How much, in the way of system resources (disk space, RAM, disk cache,
		processor cache) do you find necessary to get the same level
		of performance as a traditional workstation?

	Who makes reliable equipment that is reasonably priced with decent
		support?  I am thinking of mail order companies like ZEOS, or
		LodeStar.

	How much does it cost to get access to Internet from home for USENET
		news, email, and ftp access?  For those who work for companies
		that have Internet access, what are the company pocilies on
		personal use of the network connection?

	And finally, how much did you pay for your setup?

Thanks for taking the time to read through all those questions, and thanks again
if you're planning on replying.  If you think that this discussion isn't worth
continuing on the net, feel free to email me at:

	vyainsm@cs.purdue.edu

	Thanks again to all those who reply,

		Sean Vyain
Newsgroups: comp.unix.programmer,comp.sys.sun.misc
From: emike@sdc.com (E. Mike Durbin)
Subject: Re: Installing a shared library without screwing up.
Keywords: libc.so replacing
Organization: Systems Development Corporation
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 18:36:13 GMT

In article <mark.722062866@coombs> mark@coombs.anu.edu.au (Mark) writes:
>On SunOS 4.x.x:
>I've heard a lot of horror stories about mistakes with libc.so replacing and
>how dynamic library loading programs die real quick if you tamper with their
>library.
>
>What is the right/best way to replace a libc.so with your site customised
>version? I dont want to have to go find the installation tape everytime
>I attempt it. Do I use 'cp' or 'cat mylib > /usr/lib/libc.so' or what? Im a
>bit worried that a context switch will happen halfway through it and bugger
>it all up.
>
>How would you guys replace it?
>
>Any hints welcome.
>Mark
>mark@coombs.anu.edu.au
>mark@gnu.ai.mit.edu
>markm@rmit.edu.au

The problem is with any executable, binary or shell script.  SunOS uses
the origional file as backing store, so if it is modified while it is
running, you have problems.

Because the kernal identifies any file by it's inode, use 'mv' to
maintain the integrity of any file that is memory mapped:

	mv libc.so.3.1 libc.so.3.1.old

before overwritting it (again, same is true for shell scripts and
any binary executable).  Then, after you know that the '.old' file
is no longer referenced (wait a day, week, month?), you can remove
it.

E. Mike Durbin
emike@sdc.com  or  emike@obs.com
Xref: sparky comp.unix.programmer:5316 comp.sys.sun.misc:5303 comp.unix.solaris:324
From: schmidt@net1.ics.uci.edu (Douglas C. Schmidt)
Subject: Dynamic linking on Sun OS
Newsgroups: comp.unix.programmer,comp.sys.sun.misc,comp.unix.solaris
Reply-To: schmidt@ics.uci.edu (Douglas C. Schmidt)
Organization: University of California at Irvine: ICS Dept.
Date: 17 Nov 92 19:28:43 GMT

Hi,

	I've been experiementing with dynamic linking via Sun OS 4.1.2.
However, I'm having the following problem when I try to use the
dlopen(), dlsym() library:

% ./a.out ~/tmp/x1.o _foo
ld.so: mmap data error (22) for /i0/da/ud/schmidt/tmp/x1.o

The main program looks like this:

----------------------------------------
#include <stdio.h>
#include <dlfcn.h>

int
main (argc, argv)
     int argc;
     char *argv[];
{
  char *path = argv[1];
  char *symbol = argv[2];
  void *handle;
  int (*f)(void);

  if ((handle = dlopen (path, 1)) == 0)
    dlerror ("dlopen failed");

  fprintf (stderr, "handle = %d\n", handle);

  if ((f = (int (*)(void)) dlsym (handle, symbol)) == (int (*)(void)) 0)
    dlerror ("dlsym failed");

  fprintf (stderr, "f = %d\n", f);

  if (f != 0)
    (*f)();
  else
    fprintf (stderr, "symbol %s not found\n", symbol);
  dlclose (handle);
}
----------------------------------------

The x1.c file looks like this:

----------------------------------------
#include <stdio.h>

void
init ()
{
  fprintf (stderr, "starting x1\n");
}

int
foo ()
{
  fprintf (stderr, "goodbye world\n");
}
----------------------------------------

	I'm compiling them both with /bin/cc and using the -ldl option
to /bin/ld.  Does anyone know what I am doing wrong and what
the cryptic error message:

ld.so: mmap data error (22) for /i0/da/ud/schmidt/tmp/x1.o

means?!

	Thanks,

		Doug
--
His life was gentle, and the elements so            | Douglas C. Schmidt
Mixed in him that nature might stand up             | schmidt@ics.uci.edu
And say to all the world: "This was a man."         | ucivax!schmidt
   -- In loving memory of Terry Williams (1971-1991)| (714) 856-4101
Newsgroups: comp.unix.programmer
From: aw36+@andrew.cmu.edu (Andrew N. Westmeyer)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.programmer
Subject: PASCAL rules
Date: 21 Nov 92 21:28:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.If3nOE200axfAQXUMa
Organization: Freshman, CIT general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Hey guys,

     What's going down?  I am in a comp sci class which utilizes Object
Pascal Genie, a graphically interfaced Pascal environment.  It's
user-friendly.  I am thoroughly convinced that Pascal is THE best
computer language, and those who think otherwise can go to hell.

Have a nice day,
Andrew
Xref: sparky comp.unix.programmer:5409 comp.sys.sun.apps:2550 comp.unix.questions:13903
From: mikec@hplona90.uksr.hp.com (Mike Croom)
Subject: Re: mmap() for hp-ux?
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 13:26:03 GMT
Organization: HP PSO , Central London
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]

release 9.0 on the 700 series has mmap

--

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| Financial Services PSO                                                      -
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Newsgroups: comp.unix.programmer