HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Re: Soviet military training
Date: 31 Dec 92 00:32:12 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <1992Dec30.213232.8829@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu> mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko) writes:


> I spent some time (namely, 2 years) in the Sov.Army & can assure
> everyone that the cited statement is not just stereotype. As for 
> Chechen desire to secede from Russia - my opinion ( & of many my friends, 
> too) that Russia would benefit greatly from "sanitary cordon" on 
> the border of "Independent Chechnja". 

Hmmm.. there's an idea :-).. Maybe the Estonians, Latvians
and Lithuanians can start terrorizing everyone in the Red
Army. Would that result in them being asked to leave and
be independent :-)..



>Want would you say about
> politician who use the threats of terroristic actions against Russians 
> as a tool for pressuring Russian government ? This is precisely what the
> head of this "independent republic" general Dudaev did repeatedly in his
> interviews to Russian media. Not to mention mafia structures formed 
> by the citizens of "free Chechnia" in many Russian citys. 

The kind of statement made by Dudaev is obviously stupid. 

But I can't stop wondering how it's possible for a population
of less than one million people in a nation of about 250-300
million can produce enough army age recruits to terrorize the
whole Red Army.

Are they superhumans ? Or are they congenitally born to be
terrorists ?
-- 

	mark	

   hubey@amiga.montclair.edu         hubey@apollo.montclair.edu
   hubey@pilot.njin.net               ...!rutgers!pilot!hubey    
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: henry@bms.com (Henry Mednikoff)
Subject: Re: U.S. reserve officers support program
Reply-To: henry@bms.com
Organization: Bristol-Myers Squibb PRI
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 15:11:12 GMT

In article 1ham0vINNiep@agate.berkeley.edu, muh@physics1 (Yury M. Mukharsky) writes:
>In article <1992Dec23.143001.10809@synapse.bms.com> henry@bms.com writes:
>>Don't we have enough discontent in the inner cities where people need training & skills?
>
>Sure, there are enough discontent, but there are no nuclear warheads there.
>
>>Why the world community can not use the millitary expertise of hi tech, well trained troups of CIS in Yugoslavia to stop the bloodshed?
>>Where were they 2 years ago when The US, France & GB were risking lives of their personal in the UN declared war on Iraq?
>
>How long ago have you emigrated? Be happy, they are not on the opposite side.
>Do you think it takes 5-hour reorientaion class to switch "potentsial'nogo
>protivnika" and "potentsial'nogo sojuznika"?
>
>Yury M.


When I came to New York in the mid 70's, it took me 1 day to get my "re-orientation"
done when I had to pay My rent and living expenses - so I switched from High voltage
Substations and Power Generating Plants (My specialty in the USSR) to Audio-Visual Systems  for Board Rooms & Conference Rooms.
I did not like such change but My stomak & My landlord would not wait for new power plants to be built in Manhattan.
Russia can & should go through so called quick re-orientation to earn hard currency
and to feed their people.
Why do I have to be happy that they are not on the opposite side?
They were before and I was happy because My mother-in-law could not travel to America.
(:})
Merry Christmas, Happy CHanukka, S Novim Godom, S Rojdestvom Hristovim.

Henry.

Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: thietaniemi@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Re: 2Re: Bulgarians - descendents of a Finnis tribe?
Date: 31 Dec 92 12:22:15 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <21223123092232734@FREDONIA>, MULLER@fredonia.bitnet (Bill Muller) 
writes:
> I am not a linguist by any definition, but have always been told that
> Finnish, Hungarian and the language of the Basques are related to each
> other and NOT related to other European languages.  


This is partly correct. They are not Indo-European languages, but still 
Finnish and Hungarian are not related to Basque (if not trough Adam and
Eve or through the staff of Noach's Arch :-)

There was a correct answer in one above posting about Finno-Ugrians
that form even larger a group with Samoyedic tongues: the Uralic
languages.

The discussion above started with one Finn quoting some Turks that claim
they are related to Finns, which is not accepted in any sense of the
term (which is self-evident to any Finn, but somebody misunderstood
the initial idea, which is understandable.).

I would not mind being a relative of Turks - one should never forget that
they might have the only state in Europe that was not conquered during
the last millennium :-)


with best regards
Tapani Hietaniemi, Universitas Helsingiensis
                   urbs fennorum
From: thietaniemi@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Re: Metal smuggling (Was: Soviet military training
Date: 31 Dec 92 12:09:28 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <1992Dec31.023346.13878@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu>, 
mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko) writes:

I comment only one detail in an interesting posting:

> Baltic rep. are
> independent already. Strong border is a good idea in that case too,
> since considerable part of national product of this countries is 
> obtained by smuggling valuble metals from Russia (tolerated by 
> governments of those rep.) & selling to the west without paying export 
tariffs.


The Baltic states are for a strong border, especially Estonia, which
has it's bordes in at least preliminary control now. Many Russians
have opposed more rigid border controls and custom and visa regulations
in Estonia, instead.

"Considerable part of national production" is a very vague statement.
It is true that some individual fortunes have been accumulated in
metal trade, at least in Estonia, about which I know something. But
still, the Estonian economy works mainly with some other kinds of trade:
textiles, food processing, oil shale and such things.

Claiming that Estonian government would "tolerate" smuggling is a hard
accusation which should be substantiated by some facts.

I have got the impression that the problem is the LEGAL trade:
smuggling is forbidden in Estonia and not tolerated. But what should
the Estonian goverment or police do when the non-ferrous metals 
exported from Russia have their Russian custom papers totally in order?
The problem is that Russia can't eradicate the corruption of it's own
and does not effectively control the Red army.

Or have you got another kind of impression?

asks
the observer
Tapani Hietaniemi, Universitas Helsingiensis
                   urbs fennorum
From: dharkins@papillon.ucsd.edu (Dan Harkins)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: The source
Date: 22 Dec 1992 18:23:31 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: papillon.ucsd.edu

In article <BzFzyo.1pJ@news.cso.uiuc.edu> paul@uxc.cso.uiuc.edu (Paul Pomes)
writes regarding how to bounce crap back to the source:

> When I bother to, I copy the articles back to zuma!sera after putting the
> following entry into my pathalias file:
>
> zuma	zuma!%s@anatolia.mn.org

You also might try han@att.att.com or h.mutlu@att.att.com.
His telephone number is (708) 979-6684 and his mail address
is:
	Hasan B. Mutlu
	AT&TBell Laboratories
	2000 N. Naperville rd.
	PO Box 3033
	Naperville, IL 60566-7033

I used to have his home address and telephone number too, but I seem to
have misplaced it (and he has since unlisted it). A convienent location 
to send ginsu knives and abdominizers and all sorts of other COD items! :-) 

Dan.
From: sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Re: Metal smuggling and trade
Date: 2 Jan 93 17:55:25 GMT
Organization: Enea Data AB

Tapani Hietnaniemi (thietaniemi@cc.helsinki.fi) writes:
>I suppose you have never heard about the richest lady in Estonia, namely
>Tiiu Silves, who has made a fortune by selling non-ferrous metals.
>No she is developing her activities and creating a kind of business
>dynasty. She might be considered one of the most succesfull new capitalists
>in Estonia - and she has not been caught involved with anything illegal.

As a curiousity it could be mentioned that she started her business
career after the death of her husband by making and selling waffles.
Her waffles were a big success because she used cream instead of
water in the batter.

She might not have been caught doing anything illegal, but it is
difficult to imagine that she has not had contacts with the criminal
world, voluntary or involuntary. For some reason she has bodyguards...

-- 
Erland Sommarskog - ENEA Data, Stockholm - sommar@enea.se
Jag gav en k{ck tjeck en check.
From: sorokin@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at (Zhenja)
Subject: Re: ESTONIAN news (foreign policy)
Organization: Inst. for General Electrics & Electronics, TU Vienna
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 12:14:59 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.125805.1@cc.helsinki.fi> thietaniemi@cc.helsinki.fi writes:

>Some Estonian news from Tallinn & Tartu:
>-------------------------------------------------------------------

>                      14.12.92 - 20.12.92
>                         
>            CSCE PRIME MINISTERS MEET IN STOCKHOLM

[stuff deleted]

>During the conference Russian Foreign Minister Andrei Kozyrev
>shocked delegates with a speech that seemed to mark a new cold
>war and a return to Soviet-style foreign policy. Estonia reacted
>to this quickly, stating that the wheels of history cannot be
>turned back, that a new Soviet Union or Russian empire will not
>be reborn and that Estonia cannot be steered off the road leading
>to democracy and the market economy.

And that's all information about the incident??!!??
Dear Tapani, please, give the source! ( AVTORA!)

[stuff deleted]
>-----------------------------------------------------------------

>forwarded without comment by
>the observer
>Tapani Hietaniemi, Universitas Helsingiensis
>                   urbs fennorum

Sincerely, 
Sorokin Zhenja, Vienna, Austria.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko)
Subject: Re: Stereotypes of Soviet Peoples
Organization: Northeastern University, Boston, MA. 02115, USA
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 05:07:52 GMT

In article <Jan.1.22.52.24.1993.4235@pilot.njin.net> hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey) writes:
>In article <Sorokin.36.725923408@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at> Sorokin@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at (Sorokin Zhenya) writes:
>
>> And do not forget, Chechens are muslims, so the prospectives of "peaceful 
>> coexistence" are very, very dark.
>> Sorokin Zhenya
>
>
>Would you please elaborate on this. The Balts are not Muslims and
>they apparently did not want to live a life of "peaceful coexistence"
>as a part of the USSR. Neither did the Armenians and Georgians.
>-- 

I can understand them - how can they live as a part of non-existent 
state like USSR ;-) BTW, this is an example of imperialistic mentalitet
(not to mention  mind-reading ;) - the statement above have sence only 
in case peaceful coexistance is possible only between parts of one 
country.
From: mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Re: Soviet military training
Date: 30 Dec 92 21:32:32 GMT
Organization: Northeastern University, Boston, MA. 02115, USA

In article <01GSXCK83JTE8WWTNJ@MUVAXJ.RFERL.ORG> "talk.politics.soviet via ListServ" <TPS-L@indycms.bitnet> writes:
>>I have heard that most ruthless privates came from
>>Tshesheni-Ingushia.
>
>Oh, come on... How can you believe those stereotypes? The Chechen
>republic wants to secede from Russia--that's the reason for all
>the carefully nurtured rumours and stereotypes, like the one
>that most of them are criminals and mafia members.
>
>Sometimes those stereotypes can be very persistent. For example,
>many people think that the famous 'Afghantsi' are all macho,
>tough guys who don't care about any dangers. Bull...! They are
>normal young guys not different from other soldiers.
>
>Sabirjan


I spent some time (namely, 2 years) in the Sov.Army & can assure
everyone that the cited statement is not just stereotype. As for 
Chechen desire to secede from Russia - my opinion ( & of many my friends, 
too) that Russia would benefit greatly from "sanitary cordon" on 
the border of "Independent Chechnja". Want would you say about
politician who use the threats of terroristic actions against Russians 
as a tool for pressuring Russian government ? This is precisely what the
head of this "independent republic" general Dudaev did repeatedly in his
interviews to Russian media. Not to mention mafia structures formed 
by the citizens of "free Chechnia" in many Russian citys. 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: Sorokin@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at (Sorokin Zhenya)
Subject: Re: Stereotypes of Soviet Peoples
Organization: Inst. of General Electronics and Electroengeneering, TU Vienna
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 12:43:20 GMT

In article <1i2nvqINN6pa@agate.berkeley.edu> ceg@dec-4.CE.Berkeley.EDU (Carl E. Grigorian) writes:
>From: ceg@dec-4.CE.Berkeley.EDU (Carl E. Grigorian)
>Subject: Re: Stereotypes of Soviet Peoples
>Date: 2 Jan 1993 00:35:06 GMT
>In article <Sorokin.36.725923408@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at> Sorokin@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at (Sorokin Zhenya) writes:
>>
>>Famous, oh yes. You know, Stalin is still the most famous Osetian in the 
>                                                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^!?
>>world...          
>
>
>Seeing that you know so much about Soviet ethnic groups, I wonder if you can
>solve what has been a mystery for me as of late. You see, I was under the
>impression that Stalin was a regular Georgian. My Encyclopedia Britannica
>is also of the same opinion. It has also been suggested to me by not so
>reliable sources that he was a Mountain Jew, whatever that is, despite the
>fact that he was a Christian seminary student at one time. Now, you say he
>was an Ossetian. Could you elaborate a little bit?
>

Actually, I am not a big specialist in Soviet ethnic groups. Stalin's pre-
1927 hystory is a mistery, because he personally carefully destroyed all 
possible non-favouring documents. Some say that it was because of his work 
for OHRANKA at certain period. My information is nothing but also a rumour. 
About jewish origin: due to street-level antisemitism you'll *always* get 
rumours about jewish origin of *every* more or less prominent person, from 
Lenin to Yeltsin (wait for the origin of Hasbulatov...). It is very hard to 
distinguish the truth in such cases. 
In any case, my remark about osetian was nothing but a joke. It wouldn't 
have dony any difference, if I wrote "georgian" or "russian", and that's 
what I wanted to stress! Hasbulatov's way to power have nothing to do with 
his nationality. Lukianov, for example, tried to do *the same*.

>
>ceg

Yours, 
Sorokin Zhenya
Vienna, Austria.


Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko)
Subject: Re: Soviet military training
Organization: Northeastern University, Boston, MA. 02115, USA
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 04:56:31 GMT

In article <Jan.1.17.23.12.1993.1145@pilot.njin.net> hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey) writes:
>In article <1993Jan1.020135.23560@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu> mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko) writes:
>
>> Probably this newsgroup is your only source, guy - hence a questions of 
>> that kind. Is Cuba independent from America ? (There's an american military
>> base there, if you haven't read that before ;-)
>
>I'm not in the mood to continue the pointless rhetoric. Logical
>inferences of your posts point in the direction that I pointed out.
>
Don't mix your own impressions with logic inference. 

>
>> Is it your definition of Hitler (writing nasty books ;) ? Let me ask you
>> just 1 (one) lill' question : are you college student ? ;->
>
>No. Is your definition of Hitler wearing black ties, like
>Dudaev does :-).  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> I've deleted most of your pointless rhetoric.
May be, because you can't answer ? ;-> 

>Since Dudaev hasn't put anyone in ovens yet I assume he must
>have advocated it since you say he's a new Hitler.
>
>Why don't you try using the finger command to find out what I
>do, not that it will make much difference to confused people
>like you who apparently prefer ad hominem attacks and 
>repeating rumors to logic.
>

I was reluctant to delete this bright sample of logic ;->

>
>
>People of low intellectual capability don't normally get higher
>education. Logical inference.
>

You're good counterexample to that statement ;-)


>
>> Again brilliant piece of ignorance. You have no even slightest idea, 
>> how divisions of SA are composed - and still trying to argue.
>
>Instead of high-school level rhetoric and personal attacks why
>don't you try posting your knowledge ?
>
I'm not in a mood to educate you. Just don't post on the matters you 
have no clue in.

>> When & where I said that i implyed (...) without speaking to them
>> or hearing other people's opinions ? Oh , I've forgotten- you're
>> reading directly my thoughts. ;-)
>
>More ridiculous rhetoric. If you don't know any Chechens, how
                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>do you know anything about their intellectual capabilities ?
>You either have personal knowledge or you heard things from
>others. Logical inference. You should try it sometime.
>
I tryed it on the underlined sentence and failed to understand how
you figured out that it's true. My fault, apparently ;-)

>
>> I'd better not to discuss that to preserve the effectiveness of those
>> methods   ;-)
>
>Is it original or does "Siberia" enter into these methods :-)..
>--                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Now I see, that UseNet is not the only source of your opinions ; 
films 'bout James Bond are also significant one.
From: thietaniemi@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: BALTICS; Mayorov's xmas joke
Date: 26 Dec 92 13:22:47 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki


This piece of news is from Radio Free Europe/ Radio Liberty

> BALTIC WITHDRAWAL SCHEDULE "UP TO BALTIC LEADERS." Col.  Gen.
> Leonid Mayorov, the commander in chief of the Northwestern Group
> of Forces stationed in the Baltic region, told a Latvian newspaper
> that the schedule for the withdrawal of his troops would
> "ultimately depend on the astuteness of the Baltic leaders." His
> remarks were reported by Baltfax on 22 December.  Mayorov said
> that more the 40% of the forces have been pulled out. He charged
> that the Baltic leaders are deliberately avoiding signing
> agreements with Russia on the withdrawal schedule and on the
> temporary stationing of Russian troops on their territories. (Doug
> Clarke, RFE/RL, Inc.)


Here, MR Mayorov seems to be claiming that he would gladly withdraw his 
troops from the Baltics but the Baltic leaders do everything to resist
his sincere intentions. Most odd,

thinks
the observer
Tapani Hietaniemi, Universitas Helsingiensis
                   urbs fennorum
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko)
Subject: Re: Soviet military training
Organization: Northeastern University, Boston, MA. 02115, USA
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 23:13:56 GMT

In article <Jan.2.02.36.27.1993.7873@pilot.njin.net> hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey) writes:
>In article <1993Jan2.045631.15193@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu> mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko) writes:
>
>>...[attempts at with]...
>
>Mr. Kagalenko, whatever your motives or methods are, they
>don't interest me. You can continue to show yourself
>for whatever you are.
>
>Let me ask you again, once more:
>
>You stated that you wanted a 'sanitary cordon' around the
>Chechens or Chechnia. You also stated unequivecally that
>the Chechens are of low intellectual/mental caliber.
>
>Once again, for the record of thousands of people reading:
>
>1. How do you know about Chechen intellectual abilities ?

Reread my posts. 


>
>2. What exactly is your idea of 'sanitary cordon'.
>

Something equivalent to the US-Mexico border

>If you still have problems understanding the questions, I will
>be happy to repeat.
>
I, however, will not be happy to repeat answers already posted. Try to 
think a little before posting; it may help.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
From: dbd@urartu.sdpa.org (David Davidian)
Subject: Basque & Related Languages
Organization: S.D.P.A. Center for Regional Studies
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 16:09:19 GMT

In article <21223123092232734@FREDONIA> "talk.politics.soviet via ListServ" <TPS-L@indycms.bitnet> writes:

>I am not a linguist by any definition, but have always been told that
>Finnish, Hungarian and the language of the Basques are related to each
>other and NOT related to other European languages.  Are there linguists
>out there who can help us on this one?

The spoken language of the Basques is related to Georgian, a Caucasus language.
The Georgian-related, or Caucasian languages, are related to neither Indo-
European nor Ural-Altaic groups.

-- 
David Davidian <dbd@urartu.sdpa.org> |"The massacres? Oh well! They merely  
S.D.P.A. Center for Regional Studies | amuse me!"  -Talaat Pasha, architect of 
P.O. Box 382761                      | Turkish the genocide of Armenian people. 
Cambridge, MA 02238                  | (Four Years Beneath the Crescent, p 208)
From: jjt@spchsys.spchsys (John J. Turley)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Re: What is happening in West Ukr.
Date: 21 Dec 92 21:19:53 GMT
Reply-To: jjt@spchsys.UUCP (John J. Turley)
Organization: Speech Systems Incorporated, Tarzana, California

In article <1HJVBYS2@cc.swarthmore.edu> enute1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Eric J. Nute) writes:
>To the net,
>		I spent a year in the city of Lviv from fall 1990 to summer 1991.  Has
>anyone been there more recently?  I am really asking for information about
>the curretn state of affairs in Ukraine.  Thank you very much.
>
I happened to be there just this last October. It was quite an experience, since
the last time I was there was 1989, and it was still very much the 'Soviet Union'.

Now, the famous area of the center of town, called formerly 'Lenin Prospect' is
'Independence Square'. The statue of Lenin right next to the opera house is now
gone-- replaced by a fountain. There were so many name changes, that to tell you
the truth, I can't recall all of them.

While getting a ride one day from one of the locals, I asked him what the name
of the lovely street was that we were driving on. He told me that he was unsure!
It had been named after a war hero who supported the revolution; they are not
calling it that anymore, but are unsure if they should give it the pre-revolutionary
name or not.

Another noticeable change is the amount of Ukrainian I now saw. Back in 1989, I
was comfortably surrounded by Russian, the language I had studied here at the
University. It was in a nearby town (Drugovich) where I had first seen some
Ukrainian printed; now, I really had to look hard to find Russian! Everywhere,
from the post office to the parks had only Ukrainian.

I can't give you a detailed account of the economy, as I don't consider myself
anywhere near an expert. But I can tell you that my many friends there are a
little worried about the changes. Some people have lost their jobs and are busy
looking for new ones. Inflation is terrible! I wanted to send three postcards
to friends in LA and the cost was over 50 rubles for postage for this. Anyway,
what I kept hearing this time was that everything is in a state of flux-- from
the renaming of streets and landmarks, to the uncertainty of steady jobs and
prices.

-John



-- 
<>  John Turley -- Linguist, Systems Administrator, and President for Life   <>
 <>                    Speech Systems, Incorporated                         <>
 <>                  18356 Oxnard St., Tarzana, Ca. 91356                   <>
<>                      celia!spchsys!jjt@usc.edu                            <>