HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hrose@eff.org (Helen Trillian Rose)
Subject: Well, it's finally happened
Organization: The Evil Fascist IRC Admins From Hell, Inc.
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 01:38:32 GMT

-> *NickServ@service.de* whois Wumpus
-NickServ- *** No nickname 'Wumpus' registered.


Hope you're enjoying it, Greg. :-)

--Helen
--
Helen Trillian Rose             	email eff@eff.org for EFF info
Electronic Frontier Foundation   	irc operators: operlist@eff.org
Systems and Networks Administration	Flames to: 
<hrose@eff.org, hrose@cs.bu.edu>	women-not-to-be-messed-with@eff.org
Newsgroups: alt.irc.recovery
From: suopanki@zombie.oulu.fi (Heikki Suopanki)
Subject: Re: 7 months, 2 weeks
Reply-To: suopanki@phoenix.oulu.fi
Organization: Unixverstas Olutensin, Finlandia
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 23:51:28 GMT

>>>>> On Thu, 13 Aug 1992 19:50:13 GMT, gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) said:

> 7 months, 2 weeks, and counting.

3 years, 7 months, and counting.

-Heikki
--
                                                                .0.0.
                         Have you fucked your wolf today?        _U_

Heikki Suopanki, Oulu Finland, I don't run a BBS.
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15276 soc.culture.latin-america:3189 talk.politics.misc:41261 alt.politics.elections:11275 misc.headlines:5849
From: hallam@zeus02.desy.de (Phill Hallam-Baker)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,misc.headlines
Subject: Re: Derailing the Reagan Revolution: Part zero: highlights
Date: 19 Aug 92 21:29:33 GMT
Reply-To: Hallam@zeus02.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA

In article <Bt8EvA.8K6@apollo.hp.com>, nelson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson)
|>In article <1992Aug19.003724.6521@meteor.wisc.edu> stvjas@meteor.wisc.edu
|>(Steve Jascourt) writes:
|>>In article <1992Aug18.013719.3556@desire.wright.edu> demon@desire.wright.edu
|>(Stupendous Man) writes:
|>>> [concerning article he posted from Forbes magazine]
|>>>	We'll see that while places like Eastern Europe and Mexico use the
|>>>Supply Side Bible to bootstrap themselves into prosperity, the US, Japan
|>and
|>>>Europe seem content to emulate the failed socialist systems we defeated in
|>the
|>>>cold war.
|>>>
|>>>Brett                                                      
|>>
|>>The systems referred to as "we defeated in the cold war" were NOT socialist.
|>>The word socialism is filled with mythology. A real socialism would involve
|>>all of the people in making decisions. It would have to be decentralized,
|>with
|>>active say by those affected.
|>
|>  Oh give us a break.   This is like that other poster claiming that
|>  the Catholic Church, or fanatical fundies, or whatever, are not
|>  Christian because they don't live up to his idealistic image of 
|>  what Christianity is "supposed" to be.

Chrisitianity is not defined in terms of actions but by beleif. A socialist
system is one in which certain policies are implemented. The analogy is flawed.


|>    If large numbers of people
|>  say "we are Xists, we are doing this in the name of X" then I'm not
|>  going to debate with them about the meaning of X -- it's their word
|>  so I'll let them define it. 

OK so you think that it would be perfectly right for a bunch of Satanists to
decide to call themselves Christians?

The term Socialist may be fairly ambiguous, however that does not mean that
merely calling yourself socialist makes you one. It is a bit hard to see the
Nomeclatura driving round in chaufeured Zills as having created a classless
society. Besides Bretts argument progresses to the "Y is an X-ist, Y is evil
therefore all X-ists are evil".


Phill Hallam-Baker
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15045 talk.politics.misc:40497 misc.headlines:5719
From: stvjas@meteor.wisc.edu (Steve Jascourt)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,misc.headlines
Subject: Re: Derailing the Reagan Revolution: Part zero: highlights
Date: 19 Aug 92 00:37:24 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Meteorology and Space Science

In article <1992Aug18.013719.3556@desire.wright.edu> demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man) writes:
> [concerning article he posted from Forbes magazine]
>	We'll see that while places like Eastern Europe and Mexico use the
>Supply Side Bible to bootstrap themselves into prosperity, the US, Japan and
>Europe seem content to emulate the failed socialist systems we defeated in the
>cold war.
>
>Brett                                                      

The systems referred to as "we defeated in the cold war" were NOT socialist.
The word socialism is filled with mythology. A real socialism would involve
all of the people in making decisions. It would have to be decentralized, with
active say by those affected. The Soviet block countries were state capitalist
countries-- there was a distinct ruling class with a better living standard
than the others and who collected the wealth and controlled the assets of the
country. The masses had no say in how things were run and had not an equal 
share with the ruling class in the goods produced. Just to make matters clear, 
let's explain with a simple example. In a Western-style capitalism, a factory 
is owned by a company of [most probably] wealthy individuals who determine what
and how much the factory will make, conditions for employment, etc., and their
determinations are made primarily on market considerations. In state
capitalism, that factory is owned by the state, which is controlled by a
beaurocratic class, and the determination of what the factory will make, who
will work there and under what working conditions and wages, etc. is made by
the state for the benefit of the beaurocratic class who is making that
determination. In both cases, the decisions are made to benefit the small 
(relatively) group of people running the factory, not to benefit the larger
group of workers or the whole of the society. In a socialist society, those
decisions affecting working conditions and such would be made by those working
there, having to live with those conditions, and the production of the factory
would also be determined by them, and how many such factories would be built 
would be determined by the people as a whole (probably through some form of
representative government but not a coerced one foist upon the people).

Stephen Jascourt   stvjas@meteor.wisc.edu
From: Dorothy Morse <dmorse@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: alt.activism
Date: 18 Aug 92 16:42 PDT
Subject: Re: Faxing to Somalia --- How ?
Nf-ID: #R:castle.ed.ac.uk:24923:cdp:1296500291:000:700
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!dmorse    Aug 18 16:42:00 1992


Hugh
Thanks a million for your interest in helping the Somalians.  Are you on 
the university linkup called Internet?  or Bitnet?  If so, it should be
possible just to use your regular faxing method and the addresses given
...If that doesn't work, it is my hope that our software support here will
be able to tell you exactly what procedure to follow.

The "fax numbers proper" are the numbers between @f0091 and .fax.sunet.se 

So, with the "country code"--for the United States--you should be able
to fax by whatever is the usual means, for whatever the fee is, if you
don't use the sunet method.  Let's hope we can get the instructions to you
quickly, so you can send lots of free faxes.

Dorothy
From: ckna@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: alt.activism
Subject: bush and the republican convention
Date: 16 Aug 92 10:35:34 GMT
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

News reports indicate US President George Bush intends to drop a bombshell
that will send the US economy back up. Granted. Did he have to wait for so
long to do the right thing? Now that NAFTA is meandering through the approval
processes what else can Bush/Quyale offer US voters?

chris
Xref: sparky alt.activism:14968 talk.politics.misc:40262
From: bunker@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Alex Bunker)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: "Free elections" indeed
Date: 17 Aug 92 23:39:41 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Physics & Astronomy, McMaster University


>	For the 1984 abuses: any America's Watch or Amnesty international. 
>Also news reports from the time document:
>
>	Arrest of opposition leaders.
>	Violent assualts on opposition rallies.
>	Sandanista death squads killing vocal opposition leaders.
>	Sandanista take over/shut down of opposition press.
>	Revokation of ration cards to opposition members.
>	Wide spread round up of potential adversaries, many of whom have never
>been seen since.

Brett this is a falshood. I do not know about americas watch but
I KNOW Amnesty International had NOTHING NEGATIVE to say about the election.
The 1984 election was monitored by international observers 
representing organisations from around the world including
the governments of Ireland and Sweden and they gave a 
UNANIMOUS REPORT that the elections were FREE and fair.
They were given free access during the campaigning
the election and the counting and gave their unanimous
STAMP OF APPROVAL. Then the Reagan propoganda machine went
into full gear spreading lies which were successful since
many such as yourself are either stupid enough to believe them or
malicious enough to spread. Amnesty international got on the
Sandanistas case for acts like exiling priests and shutting down
the opposition newspaper for a matter of months. These are the
LIMIT of what they did and are quite understandable (though not
commendable) considering they were undergoing a foreign backed
terrorist insurgency on their own soil. US canadians committed far
worse acts during the two world wars (rigged elections,mass internment
of Japanese) which were fought on foreign soil.
  what bothers me is that if it was not for the few of us who 
know something about these issues there would be no stopping these
lies. I used to work for a Canadian member of parliament maintaining
a news clippings bulletin on Central America to keep his caucus informed.
It was depressing to see how easily lies are spread and how muzzled the
truth is on Central America. Chomsky seems to have it right and
is a breath of fresh air. Alexander and Leslie Cockburn similarly.
somehow these viewpoints have been suppressed by the conservative 
american newsmedia (when was the last time you saw Noam Chomsky
interviewed on CNN CBS ABC or NBC?)

ALEX
.
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15177 alt.discrimination:3910 talk.abortion:32716
From: smccabe@author.ecn.purdue.edu (Sarah A McCabe)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.discrimination,talk.abortion
Subject: Re: FOCA: And I quote.....
Date: 20 Aug 92 23:16:02 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <RJOHNSON.92Aug18092840@conus.shell.com> rjohnson@shell.com (Roy Johnson) writes:
>
> >mprc@troi.cc.rochester.edu (M. Price) writes:
> >	Mr. Johnson, Mr. Arnold believes that women--well, actually girls,
> >but he probably meant women--will go through six months or more of
> >pregancy and then have an abortion because they can't fit into their new
> >swimming suits.
> >	This seems to me to represent a particularly low opinion of women.
>
>That's probably because you think he's referring to lots of women, rather
>than a few irresponsible ones.  Most women don't get abortions at all,
>and fewer still because they can't fit into swimsuits, but there are still
>those who consider abortion reasonable family planning, or have them
>because pregnancy would interfere with vacation plans.  This is a real
                         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Could you please provide some documentation for this claim?  Perhaps
something a little more verifiable thatn "it could have happened so it
probably did" or "my best-friend's sister's next-door-neighbor's niece did
this."  Thanks ever so.

Sarah McCabe
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15282 soc.culture.latin-america:3192 talk.politics.misc:41321
From: bfrg9732@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Brian F. Redman)
Subject: Re: Ethnic Cleansing
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 17:25:41 GMT

aj336@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Pat Weber) writes:


>Ethnic Cleansing - virtually every culture in World history
>has done it. More recently, the Americans did it to the Indians,
>the Germans to the Jews, the Jews to the Palestinians...it's
>happening now, and not just in Yugoslavia. So, what else is new?

>This is cultural evolution, the strongest survive. It's not 'nice',
>nor would I want to be 'cleansed' by the Canadians, but it's a fact
>of life. We are animals and we struggle for survival - it's
>Nationalism, the nemisis of World Government.

Hmmmm..... there's a Brit and a Stupendous Man who might want to
have a chat with you.

Brian Redman
(bfrg9732@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu)
"Ah yes, Armageddon. I remember it well."


Newsgroups: alt.activism
From: aj336@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Pat Weber)
Subject: Ethnic Cleansing
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 14:14:48 GMT


Ethnic Cleansing - virtually every culture in World history
has done it. More recently, the Americans did it to the Indians,
the Germans to the Jews, the Jews to the Palestinians...it's
happening now, and not just in Yugoslavia. So, what else is new?

This is cultural evolution, the strongest survive. It's not 'nice',
nor would I want to be 'cleansed' by the Canadians, but it's a fact
of life. We are animals and we struggle for survival - it's
Nationalism, the nemisis of World Government.
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.discrimination,talk.abortion
From: rjohnson@shell.com (Roy Johnson)
Subject: Re: FOCA: And I quote.....
Organization: Houston, TX
	<1992Aug04.225303.33154@watson.ibm.com>
	<Aug06.053904.68099@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>
	<Aug08.040829.32076@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>
	<1992Aug11.185816.26931@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>
	<RJOHNSON.92Aug13125458@conus.shell.com>
	<1992Aug17.185319.26187@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>
Date: 18 Aug 92 09:28:40

 >mprc@troi.cc.rochester.edu (M. Price) writes:
 >	Mr. Johnson, Mr. Arnold believes that women--well, actually girls,
 >but he probably meant women--will go through six months or more of
 >pregancy and then have an abortion because they can't fit into their new
 >swimming suits.
 >	This seems to me to represent a particularly low opinion of women.

That's probably because you think he's referring to lots of women, rather
than a few irresponsible ones.  Most women don't get abortions at all,
and fewer still because they can't fit into swimsuits, but there are still
those who consider abortion reasonable family planning, or have them
because pregnancy would interfere with vacation plans.  This is a real
concern for those who consider that there may be another life at stake--
part of my life, if it's funded by my taxes -- it is not the general slam
at women that it would be so convenient to be able to dismiss it as.

 >>I guess you aren't?
 >
 >(i.e., anti-trite-reasons-for-abortion).
 >	I find it hard to believe that anyone on this group is
 >pro-trite-reasons-for-abortion. However, I am not reserving the right to
 >make the decision for an individual woman that her reason is "trite," as
 >you and Mr. Arnold seem to be doing. Moreover, I am not in favior of
 >legislating against "triteness," either.

You don't have to be "pro-" to not be "anti-".
By not opposing trite (or, if you prefer, trivial) reasons for abortion,
you support the presumed right of women to have abortions for any reason.
We disagree on this point, and that's fine.
--
Roy Johnson, Shell Development Company (but speaking for myself)
"There's a big difference between being a lesbian and being a male!"
and "So I guess even a sex change couldn't solve all his problems."
			-- tabn3@isuvax.iastate.edu (Griffy)
Xref: sparky alt.activism:14871 soc.culture.latin-america:3082
From: harelb@MATH.CORNELL.EDU (Harel Barzilai)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: El Salvador: Death Squads Escalate
Date: 16 Aug 92 04:59:49 GMT
Organization: misc.activism.progressive on UseNet ; ACTIV-L@UMCVMB

To: delval@Csli.Stanford.EDU

    If you don't understand that those ads can be an integral part of
    such a campaign and that they can be very intimidating, perhaps it
    would help you to think of an analogous (hypothetical) situation
    in which renegade officers from the old soviet army engaged in a
    similar campaign in an attempt to go back to their old order and
    prevent investigations on human rights abuses. It is not a matter
    of left vs.  right (a distinction which by now is pretty blurred
    anyway).


The 50-page Amnesty Internationl report _El Salvador: "Death Squads"
-- a Government Strategy_ helps shed substancial further light on
this, so that these ads are "merely ads" as much as the "sad music"
that they used to play on Soviet TV before announcing a leaders died,
for example, was merely "sad music"

******************************************************************
[This 50 page report, with pictures (which are clearer in the Spanish
edition), is only $5 from Amnesty International, Publications, 322
Eighth Ave., New York, NY 10001. Ask for "El Salvador: ``Death
Squads'' -- A Government Strategy", first published in October, 1988;
or call Amnesty at: (212)807-8400 (ask for "publications")]
******************************************************************


    in fact, many latin american guerrillas have abandoned their old
    marxist-leninist orthodoxy after the demise of soviet communism
    (Indeed, that's one of the main reasons why peace processes have
    now a chance.) Third, in the current climate in El Salvador, the
    ads are probably not too far away from incitation to violence,
    something which

These illusions ("now have a chance") are based on a lack of
understanding of Washington's (a)motives/plans and (b)Power

Chomsky's '88 "Is Peace At Hand?" in the premier issue of Z magazine
(avail by email from harelb@math.cornell.edu) documents the mangling
of the "Peace Accords" of that time, although a more thorough reading
of the history of Washington's intervention and policies in the entire
region and sabotaging of virtually *any* possibility of democracy (in
the *meaningful* ERGO *harmful* to corporate/elite interests sense of
the word) over the years and decades.

[further inqueries after this brief net.visit -->harelb@math.cornell.edu]
Xref: sparky alt.activism:15246 soc.rights.human:3134 talk.politics.misc:41172
From: aj336@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Pat Weber)
Subject: Re: Ban Guns Now - Make life easier for us
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 16:33:59 GMT


Michael Rivero rivero@mdcbbs.com  says:
(replying to my post about how gun ownership doesnot prevent
Govt excesses against freedom)

>(historical perspective deleted)

>  1/2 of the provisions to protect liberty have been set aside by
>the Federal government. If guns are outlawed, only the outlaws will have them.
>The regular citizens will be defenseless. That's an open invitation to
>military coup and the subordination of the democratic process to fascism.
>That's been the pattern, without exception, in all modern nations that
>had a standing army and an unarmed civil population.

Regular citizens ARE defenseless NOW! With or WITHOUT guns! You miss my
point, the US govt doesnt need a military coup to enslave
us - they do it NOW thru legislation! Yet all this time you are deluding
yourself into thinking that you still have your freedoms. This conversion
to a police/fascist state is going on right now - yet you (we) sit there
with our rifles in the closet convincing ourselves that we still have our
freedom. In fact we cheer on our military in patriotic ferver - who cares
if we let our military deprive others of their freedom...afterall, they'd
NEVER do it to us..right?
Newsgroups: alt.activism
From: rchilder@us.oracle.com (Richard Childers)
Subject: Re: WALMART, WALGREENS and KMART say NO TO AIDS EDUCATION
Organization: Memes-R-Us
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 23:52:05 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com writes:

>Just ask yourself why gays are such a high risk group. It's not because
>the moralists have willed it on the gays (though many wish they did)
>and it is perfectly within the power of these individuals to stop what
>should have stopped years ago when they knew very well why AIDS had
>become an epidemic in the gay community. Most gays have already changed
>their act as infection rates have plummeted, yet gays continue to
>lapse into risky behavior and become statistics.

And what is this is simply self-destructive behavior, not immediately
associated with homosexuality per se, but, rather, associated with the
contempt and hatred they receive as a minority, from the majority ?

If this is true, educating the population to deal with issues like sexual
variety from a clinical perspective - as opposed to a moral perspective -
would be a solution to both problems.

-- richard

-- 
-- richard childers		rchilder@us.oracle.com		1 415 506 2411
         oracle data center  --  unix systems & network administration

                   Klein flask for rent. Inquire within.
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.elections,sci.econ
From: john@anasazi.com (John R. Moore)
Subject: Re: FOCA: And I quote.....
Reply-To: john@anasazi.com
Organization: Anasazi Inc, Phoenix AZ USA
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 23:27:11 GMT

Keywords: 

In article <Aug11.054758.30153@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> sa114984@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (Steven Arnold) writes:
]In article <1992Aug6.123139.16032@hemlock.cray.com>,
]rja@redwood26.cray.com (Russ Anderson) writes:
]> 
]> In article <Aug06.053904.68099@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>,
]sa114984@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (Steven Arnold) writes:
]
]> Given that there are only 3 doctors in the US perform 3rd trimester (post-
]> viability) abortions in the US, and then only for medical reasons (source:
]> 60 Minutes), I doubt your claim that "what we end up with is virtual 
]> abortion-on-demand from conception to birth".

Hmmm... that's odd. I heard a PRO-CHOICE advocate state that 1% of
abortions in the US are in the 3rd trimester. These must be very
busy and rich doctors.


-- 
John Moore NJ7E, 7525 Clearwater Pkwy, Scottsdale, AZ 85253  (602-951-9326)
john@anasazi.com ncar!noao!asuvax!anasaz!john anasaz!john@asuvax.eas.asu.edu
"Government is the agent of those who are too refined to do their own mugging."
  Joseph Sobran
Xref: sparky alt.activism:14869 soc.culture.latin-america:3080 talk.politics.misc:39976
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Never again.  How soon we forget.
From: demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man)
Date: 14 Aug 92 09:21:44 EST
Organization: Demonic Possesions, Inc.

In article <1992Aug13.104909.1@fnalc.fnal.gov>, maxwell@fnalc.fnal.gov writes:
> In article <1992Aug12.235831.898@oneb.almanac.bc.ca>, kmcvay@oneb.almanac.bc.ca (Ken Mcvay) writes:
>> In article <1992Aug12.144041.1@fnalf.fnal.gov> maxwell@fnalf.fnal.gov writes:
> [...]
> 
>>>It's not a case of saying "sorry, you're just not worth it".  It *is* a case of
>>>saying, to Uncle Sam and his bootlicks (ABC-CBS-NBC-PBS-CNN) :"You are liars.
>>>You have been caught lying to us time and time and time again. Why should we
>>>trust you?" 
>> 
>> ...and, while saying it, know with a certainty that women and children, and
>> other non-combatants, are being killed wantonly. I can see how that would
>> appeal to some.
>  
> You've just articulated justification for US military intervention in every
> civil war in the world.  What makes the B-H/S situation special? 

	It's one thing to fight a war--that's bad enough.  But to deliberately
set out to eradicate a people, well genocide isn't one of my favorite spectator
sports.

Brett                                                      
_______________________________________________________________________________
Proconsul Computer Consulting                                        CHA-CHING!
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Disclaimer:								   NOT!
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.discrimination,talk.abortion