HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: erno@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (Erno Pena)
Subject: Where to get ABS pipes?
Reply-To: erno@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 07:40:15 GMT

Does anyone know where I can get a good bulk supply of ABS plastic pipes?  
(i.e. the stuff UGF uplift tubes are made of) I don't see it sold in any of  
the mail order places in FAMA, TFH, or AFM.

I've got an idea for a radical new filter/scrubber and it requires about 60  
ft. of 1/2" and 1" dia ABS plastic pipes. I'd like to guestimate the cost  
before I actually try to build it. I prefer the ABS plastic to the PVC  
because it is thinner, easier to work with, and see-through.

Any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks

--

E r n e s t o   F.   B.   P e n a      |     "Volite Magis,
................................      |      Facite Magis,
erno@uiuc.edu   NeXTmail accepted      |      Estote Magis."
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
From: weka@polari.com
Subject: Discus-ongoing
Organization: Seattle Online Public Access Unix.  (206) 328-4944 (all lines telebit-equipped)
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 15:45:49 GMT

I'm new to this system and noticed I missed a few discus
articles...
The pet shop people told me that cardinal tetras are from
discus waters and get along with them quite well.???
I have six discus now, one which is very blue-one and a half
years old, one reddish-one year old and always sick, 4 babies.
A rash of gill flukes came in somehow and killed three last year-the 
reddish discus was treated with clout and now is overcome with
bacteria (I had it checked out).  I have been treating with maricyn
2 and now maricyn which perked up all the other fish but the reddish one 
still shows fin rot, white around the face and hides when not eating.
It used to be the most "sociable".  Any ideas?

Andree Hurley     Weka@polari.uunet.UU.NET
From: tli@skat.usc.edu (Tony Li)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: How many aquarists in the U.S. or the world?
Date: 14 Apr 1992 02:03:35 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: skat.usc.edu

In article <1992Apr14.063821.15485@Veritas.COM> oleg@veritas.com (Oleg Kiselev) writes:
    >offender to a chair and having Oleg chant the last one thousand 
    >"Splashing Around With Sally" articles to you, to the tune of "Row
    
    Is that supposed to be a punishment for me or for the "offender"?  
    
Both.

-- 
Tony Li - Escapee from the USC Computer Science Department          tli@usc.edu
		       The net is not what it seems.
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
From: wkb@cbnews.cb.att.com (wm.keith.brummett)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria,alt.aquaria,sci.aquaria
Subject: Fascism (and a real query)
Summary: You're not only fascist, you're a generalizing xenophobe ...
Date: 9 Apr 92 17:51:01 GMT
Followup-To: alt.aquaria
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T


    In article <1992Apr7.193656.24662@cs.ucla.edu>, jason@lanai.cs.ucla.edu
    (Jason Rosenberg) writes:
    >>>
    >>> I find the term "eco-nazi" to be extremely offensive.  
    > 
    > Well, your [sic] starting to sound like a card carrying member of the
    > NRA (gag!).

    Jason; as a "card-carrying" (life) member of the NRA, I find your
    statement to be extremely offensive.

    > Nazism is not about fringe groups lobbying for what they believe in.

    It is about people imposing their own views upon others by manipulating
    the law.

    > Don't use the term anymore, please.  I promise I will make an issue
    > of it every time you mention it.

    May I make the same threat?

    > (Now I am sounding like a overzealous lunatic!  But I sure don't feel
    > like one).

    They say your first impulse is probably correct.

    My apologies to the rest of the group (I guess we really do need an
    'alt.aquaria.politics'.)  In an attempt revive the legitimacy of this
    posting, I'll ask:

    What do people think of the Kordon Master Aquarist test set?  I have
    a few odd test kits from various companies laying about, but I'd like
    to get a fairly comprehensive set for freshwater and marine use
    without having to shop for a second mortgage.  What's the scoop?

    Thanks.   -- Keith

-- 
    | (614) 860-3187         Copyright (C) 1992, by       AT&T, Room 3B202 |
    | att!cblph!wkb  or,     W.K. Brummett and AT&T      6200 E. Broad St. |
    | wkb@cblph.att.com       All rights reserved.      Columbus, OH 43213 |
    `----------------------------------------------------------------------'
From: kjackson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Keith Jackson)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: [F] Discus
Date: 3 Apr 92 18:07:16 GMT
Reply-To: Keith Jackson <kjackson@cix.compulink.co.uk>
Organization: Gated to News by demon.co.uk


In article <1992Apr01.102810.28135@Veritas.COM>, oleg@Veritas.COM 
(Oleg Kiselev) writes:
>
>Exactly how much water is the Imperial gallon?  I did not think it was 
>THAT much more than the US gallon.

I keep forgetting that the 'colonies' are different! A US gallon is 
80% of an Imperial one so when I posted a 15-gallon tank I meant a 
30in x 15in x 12 in which is almost 20 US gallons. I wouldn't 
willingly keep discus in anything smaller than 36in. I have to, at 
present, because two have spawned and won't have anything else in there.

>Angel fish grow larger than discus, 
>their height reaching more than 10" (and over 15" for P. altum).  
>If discus need space (and 15 gal is enough space for may be 3 sub-adults), 
>angel fish need even more, with tank height being a far more important 
>consideration than with any other fish.
>
I agree with your comments about the angel fish. I was just 
trying to point out that discus were entirely unsuitable. Even if 
they don't reach their full potential, angels can SURVIVE and breed in a 
small tank. Overall, though, small tank == small fish.

Where I may disagree is over a tall tank. One of the banes of fishkeeping
is a tank which is tall and narrow because it reduces the area for gaseous
transfer. Some deep tanks end up with dead spots because the current
required to fully circulate the water is too much for the fish to be
comfortable. If you want a tank to get angels (or discus) to a good height,
you must maintain a good height to surface area ratio. Not all of us can
manage a 96in x 24in x 24in like my friend has. He breeds discus and keeps
his non-breeding stock as a shoal. That IS a sight to see.

Keith
From: dwest@duncan.cs.utk.edu (David West)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Building, rather than buying, aquarium equipment
Date: 14 Apr 92 17:14:19 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, University of Tennesee, Knoxville
Distribution: world
Reply-To: dwest@duncan.cs.utk.edu (David West)
NNTP-Posting-Host: duncan.cs.utk.edu

Hello netlanders,

I know the regular folks on this net get tired of hearing all those "HELP--I'm just. . .
(endless list of questions)."  I also know that the usual, and most practical,
reply to these questions is "Buy a book."  However, I'm rather curious about 
things that probably aren't listed in a beginners book, namely:

1)  Is it wise to attempt to build one's own equipment for a reef tank environment?
       After all, it certainly seems a much cheaper method of set-up.

2)  Any inciteful ideas, designs, etc. on building equipment?

As it stands, I'm planning on building my own wet/dry filter (everyone says that it's
easy, yet everyone I ask always adds one more component to the list of things needed to complete it), my own hood and light system (doesn't seem 
complicated) and  an individualized protein skimmer.

From netlander experience, am I going to overburden myself at the outset, or 
will I enjoy my system more knowing that I contributed a great deal to its design?

Please feel free to reply to my e-mail address if you prefer.

Thanks,
Dave  "The Eternally Optimistic" West
From: black@cfm.brown.edu (Kelly Black )
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Malaysian Algae Eaters
Date: 7 Apr 1992 22:27:15 GMT
Organization: Brown University Fluid Mechanics Lab
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: eddy.cfm.brown.edu
Keywords: Algae Eater

I have a 55 gal. tank and I am about to start over.  I used
to have an "Amazon" tank but I would like to have a "Malaysian"
tank this time around.  The question I have is what to do with
the algae.  What algae eaters are from Southeast Asia?  Also,
is there any good books about plants that tell you where the
plants are found?  In my experience the Amazon tank was rel-
atively easy compared to what I am trying to do now.

Thank you,
Kelly Black
black@cfm.brown.edu

-- 
The secluded mermaids hate European goods, which have increased male power. The
tabooed 'male' animal, the dog (used in the chase), is an added danger because
it can see the spirit world. Dogs walk purposefully on their own, although they
have nowhere to go, and they frequently stare attentively into space.  - Unknown
From: rayb@deakin.OZ.AU (Ray Bradbury)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: (f) Clown Loach question
Date: 14 Apr 92 22:15:35 GMT
Organization: Deakin University, Victoria, Australia

In article <1992Apr13.111646.4647@csc.canterbury.ac.nz> cctr128@csc.canterbury.ac.nz (Kelwyn Osborn, CSC Uni of Canterbury) writes:
>In article <1992Apr10.133626.5317@lmpsbbs.mot.com>, lipinski@macn15.rtsg.mot.com writes:
>> I have two clown loaches in a sixty gallon tank along with 4 Tiger barbs, 3
>> Zebra Danios and a Red Tail Shark.  The Clown Loaches ususally seem to be
>> "lying" on their sides whenever I first walk in the room and I think that they
>
>Don't fret.  This seems to something that clown loaches delight in doing.  My
>clown has taken to "hanging" upside down next to my pleco under a piece of
>driftwood ( bit of mouthfull really ).  So nope they ain't sick it just one of
>the many peculiar things they do.


These are bizarre fish... But fun..

In my tank we have a little volcano (I know, tacky!!) that blows
bubbles up like an air stone. Our clown loach used to point
downwards into the bubbles, and stay there for hours (or just
disappear into the volcano not to be seen for days)..

Unfortunately we lost him, along with most of our other fish a
couple of days back due to an ammonia overdose. It was a sad day as
this fish really had character.


Ray.
From: greg@enterprise.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Greg George  Area SSE - Midwest Area)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: Biological Filtration
Date: 15 Apr 92 11:56:46 GMT
Organization: "Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, CA."
NNTP-Posting-Host: enterprise.central.sun.com

In article <1992Apr14.065358.16778@Veritas.COM>, oleg@Veritas.COM (Oleg Kiselev) writes:
|> >>Two: how are you managing to decrease the nitrates level with a protein
|> >>skimmer?  I though protein skimmers only pulled organic carbons out of the
|> >>water and the idea was to get them out before they break down to ammonia and
|> >>get metabolized to nitrate by the bacterial beds...
|> 
|> greg@enterprise.Central.Sun.COM (Greg George  Area SSE - Midwest Area) writes:
|> >You may be misinformed: fish excrete ammonia into their environment,
|> >this ammonia is broken down into nitrite by nitrifying bacteria,
|> >the nitrite is further broken down by other bacteria into nitrate.
|> 
|> Do you see my statememnt above (">>") somehow disagreeing with what you say,
|> other than I used the word "metabolize" and you used the word "break down"?
|> The most appropriate term would probably be "oxidized", but that's not the
|> point.
|> 
|> Skimmers do not do very much to directly remove ammonia.  Some degassing is
|> possible, but that's not what the skimmers' primary task is.  They foam up
|> dissolved organic carbons (proteins, organic acids, etc.) before these 
|> substances get broken down to ammonia.  

I don't think that I said anything about ammonia...Plus, these things are
broken down from ammonia->nitrite->nitrate, not the other way around.

|> 
|> >From my observations, my nitrate levels have dropped dramatically
|> >since adding a protein skimmer.
|> 
|> I am sure they did, but this was not due to a removal of ammonia, but by
|> removing the stuff that would become ammonia if allowed to stay in the water.

See above...

|> 
|> Without live rock or some other source of balanced nitrification and
|> denitrification in the tank ammonia will build up until the fish die.
|> If there is only nitrification present then nitrates will build up until 
|> the fish start dying from stress-related diseases when NO3 levels go 
|> above 60ppm.

According to many books, the nitrate levels in most tanks go high and
stay there because there are not enough real plants to handle the
nitrates. Many fish can live comfortably in levels of 110ppm+ of
nitrates since these are far less toxic than ammonia or nitrites.

|> 
|> I may indeed be misinformed, but not about protein skimming in salt water.
|> -- 
|> "... i heard the droning / in the shrine
|> 	     of the sea-monkey / palace of the brine ..." -- Pixies.
|> Oleg Kiselev                                             oleg@veritas.com
|> VERITAS Software                           ...!{apple|uunet}!veritas!oleg
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
From: finn@redwood.ssc.gov (Finn Knox-Seith)
Subject: [F] Do I need RO?
Keywords: RO
Organization: SuperConducting Supercollider
Distribution: north america
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 23:17:23 GMT


I just got spec's for my tap water from the water company.
It looks as though my water would be good for african cichlids or marine fish, 
but I like plant tanks, aequidens curvicepts, angel fish and discus.  I am
wondering whether I should use ro for these fish or if there is a cheaper
alternative with my tap water.  The water is mixed from three sources...

source         #1       #2       #3
Hardness(ppm)  94       68      117
TDS (ppm)     152      150      172
Fixed Solids   97       80       99
pH              8.9     10.3      8.2

My angels have spawned (once) in my plant tank, after I added peat and used
an aquarium pharmacuticals water softening sponge.  Most (90%+) of the eggs
fungused, the ones that hatched were eaten by the father.  The plants do not
do very well and the angels never seem all that healthy.  I only own a low
range pH kit (I'm about to order a high range kit), and the pH has never been
on scale (<7.6), even when I went two months without a water change and added
a little pH down every day until I ran out... approximately 2oz of ??? chemical
pH reducer in a 60 gal tank!!

I have baby discus in an other tank, and believe that I need to drastically
reduce the pH and hardness soon if they are to mature properly.  Perhaps the
net will suggest that I return all of my soft water fish and stick to my
south american cichlids, which seem to thrive in this water.
From: booth@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (George Booth)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 19:09:07 GMT
Subject: Re: Homebrew Aquaria (Poverty: Mother of invention!)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Loveland, CO
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria

In rec.aquaria, dks@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (douglas.k.steckel) writes:

    All this is fine except for the
    fact that I don't have any money... we'll a little. Aside from the tank,
    everything will be pretty much home brew. Which leads me to the following
    questions.

Don't try to Dupla-cate (grin) what you see in _T_O_A_ if you can't 
afford it.  If you want flourishing live plants, it is very tricky 
if you don't throw technology at the problem.  People have luck with
plants due to good local water, selecting the right plants for the
local conditions, settling for short term success, etc.  But I would
conjecture that "what worked for them" would probably not "work for
you".  I think Dupla's approach is very Dupla-catable.  At least, I
was able to use their methods and achieve great results where nothing
I had tried in the past worked.  

            In all my reading I have never seen quartz/halogen mentioned once,
            there must be a reason. Tell me what I am missing.

Wrong color spectrum and inefficient.  You will make up the cheap initial 
cost in your electric bills. 

            It's white. Maybe too white. The metal halides I've seen on plant
            tanks have a yellowish hue.

Those were probably "4300K" MH lights, not the "5100K" lights that are all
the rage now.

    SUBSTRATE HEATING

Based on my results, you probably don't need it.  
 
            Dupla $tuff in general is quite expensive by my standards ...   

Most of the Dupla fertilizers have high initial cost but last a long time.

----------
George

Newsgroups: rec.aquaria,alt.aquaria
From: richb@kronos.com (Rich Braun)
Subject: Skimming, carbon (was Re: Biological Filtration)
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 16:52:54 GMT
Organization: Kronos Inc. / Waltham, MA
Disclaimer: This posting is a personal opinion and not that of Kronos Inc.

oleg@veritas.com (Oleg Kiselev) writes:
>Skimmers do not do very much to directly remove ammonia.  Some degassing is
>possible, but that's not what the skimmers' primary task is.  They foam up
>dissolved organic carbons (proteins, organic acids, etc.) before these 
>substances get broken down to ammonia.  
>...
>Without live rock or some other source of balanced nitrification and
>denitrification in the tank ammonia will build up until the fish die.
>If there is only nitrification present then nitrates will build up until 
>the fish start dying from stress-related diseases when NO3 levels go 
>above 60ppm.

To add my 2 cents:  installing a protein skimmer increased the life
expectancy of fish and the few inverts I've tried keeping (shrimp,
snails) from about 6-9 months to an indefinite period.  It only seems to
have had a minor impact on nitrate levels.  I conclude from this that
there are a number of noxious chemicals which are removed by the
protein skimmer, which have little or nothing to do with the nitrogen
cycle.  I also surmise that dissolved oxygen levels are significantly
higher than without the skimmer, without the need for the messy salt
spray caused by airstones installed inside a tank.

Now that I've been running my 55-gal tank without activated carbon for half
a year now, I've got a followup and a recommendation.  After about four
months, the water started to turn visibly yellow, but did not seem to
have any visible impact on the health of the inhabitants.  Three days ago,
I bought a nylon-net bag and put about 6 oz of activated carbon in it.
This bag was placed in the sump underneath the protein skimmer's water
outlet.  Water in the tank cleared up in about 36 hours.

Hence my recommendation, for money-conscious marine fish-only aquarists
like myself, is to use activated carbon in the wet section of a trickle-
filter sump on an as-needed basis, perhaps a few days every two or three
months.  The disadvantages of using carbon continuously are (a) cost,
(b) leaching of chemicals, such as phosphates, into the water, and (c)
maintenance:  it has to be changed frequently.

-rich
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
From: jimh@ultra.com (Jim Hurley)
Subject: FAQ
Organization: Ultra Network Technologies
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 92 18:23:16 GMT

A lot of people have been complaining about not seeing the FAQ.
I haven't seen it this year.

A while back there was a posting about maybe someone stepping in
and taking it over.

I talked with our network administrator and got approval for
storage for the FAQ. I would volunteer to keep it up-to-date
and posted monthly, if there is some problem with the current
method.

-- 
Jim Hurley --> jimh@ultra.com  ...!ames!ultra!jimh  (408) 922-0100
Ultra Network Technologies / 101 Daggett Drive / San Jose CA 95134
From: gdrew@cs.umd.edu (Greg Drew)
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
Subject: Re: Hospital tank setup
Date: 10 Apr 92 15:15:52 GMT
Organization: U of Maryland, Dept. of Computer Science, Coll. Pk., MD 20742

Well, I do not know of the "best" way for setting up a hospital tank, but
here is what I did on a VERY limited budjet.  I used a 10 gallon tank (you
are probably right about wanting a larger tank for your fish).  For ease of
cleaning, I am keeping the tank bare.  Filtration is handled by two box filters
driven by a small (Whisper 200?) air pump.  I chose the box filters for 
several reasons.  First, I had heard from the net that they were good for
mechanical, biological, and chemical filtration.  Second, they would not 
make large water currents, and I was a little worried about this in a bare 
tank that might be housing a weak or stressed fish.  Finally, they were
cheap, about $2.95 each.  The tank has been running for a while now, and I 
can confirm what I heard about these filters; they are not the worlds prettiest
objects, but they work well.  I use two so that I can change one completely 
while still leaving the other intact for continued bio-filtration.  In addition,
if I ever have to use a medication that would kill the bio-filter, I can
move one of these filters temporarliy into a healthy tank so that I can
reestablish bio-filtration immediatly after the treatment period is over.

The only other equipment on the tank is a "hang on the side" heater, a cover,
and an incandescent light (it was FREE).

To cycle the tank, I put gravel from an established tank with an UGF into
each of the filters and added 2 guppies to the tank to provide food for the
bacteria.  I did a 20 to 30% water change every day or two and tested for
ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates.  I was amazed when it had completely cycled 
in under 2 weeks.  To keep the bio-filters running, I keep the two guppies
in it full time (and I may add some sort of scavenger).  When the tank is in
use for quarantine of new arrivals or treatment, I move the guppies to another
healthy tank temporarily.  I have only done this once, to quarantine some
new fish, and everything worked fine.

Additionally, I threw some java moss and some duckweed into the tank to
provide a little cover, and hopefully use up some of the light and nutrients
that would go to growing algae (especially with the incandescent light).  The
java moss is growing slowly, and the duckweed just took off like crazy.  

					-- GDD
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Greg Drew                          | Watch for coming attractions 
gdrew@trellis.cs.umd.edu           |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria,alt.aquaria
From: mvp@hsv3.uucp (Mike Van Pelt)
Subject: Re: monster swordtail
Organization: Video 7 + G2 = Headland Technology
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 00:40:59 GMT

In article <92094.173021IO20413@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> IO20413@MAINE.MAINE.EDU writes:
>Do you have swordtails that big?  I can not believe it, all sword tails that I
>have seen are about 1 to 1.5 inches long, including mine.  What am I doing
>wrong.

The trick seems to be to feed them a *lot*, preferably live food, from
the moment they are born.  This is very hard to do without fouling the
water.  A tank of "green water" with associated 'bugs' (daphne, etc,)
would probably be ideal.  I once saw a platy (another "tooth carp")
that was about 4 inches long.  It had been raised in a tank with thick,
pea-soup-green water.  Wild green mollies are often over 3" long in the
bayous back home. (Alabama Gulf Coast.)

-- 
Mike Van Pelt            Paradimethylaminobenzaldehyde,
Headland Technology      Go soak your head in a good strong insecticide,
mvp@hsv3.lsil.com        Slosh it around and impregnate your brain
...ames!vsi1!hsv3!mvp    With dichlordiphenyltrichloroethane.
Newsgroups: rec.aquaria
From: erno@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (Erno Pena)
Subject: Cannister Filters : Fluval vs. Eheim?
Reply-To: erno@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 01:14:47 GMT

Can anyone who has either one of these brands of cannister filters give a  
recommendation about which one to buy? It seems like the Fluvals are the  
better deal, being a little less expensive and already pre-packed.

--

E r n e s t o   F.   B.   P e n a      |     "Volite Magis,
................................      |      Facite Magis,
erno@uiuc.edu   NeXTmail accepted      |      Estote Magis."
Xref: sparky rec.aquaria:3951 sci.aquaria:828