HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nchepbur@leibniz.uwaterloo.ca (Neil Hepburn)
Subject: Re: CP Music
Keywords: Music Rap
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 14:17:05 GMT

In article <1992May4.180043.10601@news.cso.uiuc.edu> bdl50755@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Corwin) writes:
>I am interested in why nobody in this newsgroup has even considered rap music
>to be CyberPunk.  In the sprawl now this is what is played.  You don't here 
>any heavy metal or pink floyd et al in the gehto.  Anyway, I am just 
>interested in what all of you out there have to say.

The only band that I can think of that has actually been quoted by reviewers as being out-and-out cyberpunk, is Voivod. Listen to their album _Nothingface_, I find that it has some very cyberpunkish overtones, especially with songs like "Into my hypercube". 

As a point of interest, their all time favourite book is Neuromancer.

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
/\/eil /-/epburn			nchepbur@napier.waterloo.edu

"God created man in his own image, and then man retured the favour."
														(Baudlaire)
 
"I know a mouse and he hasn't got a house, I don't know why I call him
Gerald. He's getting rather old but he's a good mouse."  
														(Syd Barrett)
From: chuck@korova (Chuck You, Dude)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: c_punk movies
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 09:38:26 CDT
Organization: VHF void tube of the mind

braca2@cspyr1.cs.adfa.oz.au (BRAY CHRISTOPHER) writes:

> From article <25JUL199217254118@romeo.caltech.edu>, by joelong@romeo.caltech.
> 
> 	hook
> 
> 	P.S. Does anyone else out there consider Heinleins _Friday_
> 	    Cyberpunk??  It has all the elements (corporate war, some 
> 	    nice hi tech, replicants, space colonies, etc, etc) except 
> 	    for the net.  and it was written about 1974, i think.
> 

   I don't know, _Friday_ is one of my all-time favorite books and I have 
been trying to figure it's CPishness for awhile now.  Friday does take 
place in a future that is LIKE what we consider Cyberpunk, that is 
(IMHO), a thinly veiled view of the present, but it lacks the grittiness 
of most Cyberpunk.  It's as though we had the right world, but were 
looking at it from the wrong end, above instead of below.  
   Correct/Incorrect?
 /// & ///

--
              VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783
        "where you can find the Zeta Greys SAFEWAYING themselves
                into the WONDERBREAD *heart* of America!"
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: montyb@alpha.aosg.gsf.dec.com (Monty C. Brandenberg)
Subject: Re: Until the End of the World (possible spoilers)
Organization: AOSG
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 19:15:49 GMT

In article <xfnm3_#.tmaddox@netcom.com>, tmaddox@netcom.com (Tom Maddox) writes:
|> In article <l6tujgINNmo@boogie.cs.utexas.edu> swisher@cs.utexas.edu (Janet M. Swisher) writes:
|> >I liked this movie, but thought it had definite flaws.  It never would
|> >have been made by Hollywood . . .
|> 
|> 	Indeed.  Which is not a flaw.  Wenders is a European director with a
|> sensibility very different from most anything in Hollywood.  My favorite film
|> of his is _Wings of Desire_, but _End of the World_, for all its length and
|> despite my disagreement with its thesis, is far more interesting than most
|> things out of Hollywood.
|> 

Indeed not a flaw (almost a requirement for being interesting anymore).
I just read two collections of essays by Wenders (published in the US & UK
by Faber & Faber) that were rather interesting.  Some points:

	.  His early major influences were American westerns of which
	he is still fond.

	.  Until the End of the World has been a movie-in-progress since
	1977 when he started thinking about doing a science fiction film.

	.  At one of the Cannes festivals, he set up a camera and tape
	recorder and had a number of directors come through and comment
	at will and in their own time on the question of whether or not
	cinema is dying due to the influence of TV.  The responses vary
	widely from the puerile, to the inane, to the profound, to the
	politically correct.

	.  Makes some truly spot-on observations on the rigid
	adolescence of current American filmmaking with good backing
	analysis.

It was an interesting and unpretentious collection which I recommend.
I believe the titles were 'Emotion Pictures' and 'The Logic of Movies'.

					Monty

PS.  I hope this doesn't become a Dune/BladeRunner-like question but
the European edit of UtEofW supposedly was longer (an additional country
or two).  Is this known to be true?

PPS.  In 'Die Himmel U"ber Berlin' (Wings of Desire in the US), one of
the angels in the library is looking over the shoulder of someone reading
a book or poem entitled something like 'Das Ende eine Weld' (The End
of a World).  Is this an actual novel or poem and, if so, does anyone
have a reference?
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: _The Long Run_
From: steiner@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu (jason steiner)
Date: 29 Jul 92 15:58:51 EST
Distribution: world

lesher@bucknell.edu (T. Lesher) writes:
> 
> Now another question.  I have read Gibson, but not Sterling.  I also read
> Daniel Keys Moran's _The Long Run_.  It's set in a futuristic U.S.A. where
> US civil war has been quelled by an action of the United Nations.  The Net
> figures heavily in this, as do interplanetary stations, off-world colonies,
> and cyberization (especially of officers in the UN Peacekeeper force.
> 
> Any opinions on this book?  My impression is that it's a bit less gritty than
> Gibson's stuff, but good nonetheless.
> 
> Also, I've been told that the preceding book, _Emerald Eyes_, is out of
> print and unlocatable.  Anyone wanna refute this and/or give me some leads?

wish i could. i found both at a local library & have been searching
bookstores ever since. actually, The Long Run has a lot more in common
with a ripping good Heinlein tale than cyberpunk. supposedly those 2
books are just the start of a -long- series D.K.Moran has plotted out.
hope he actually gets around to writing the rest. he's pretty talented.

jason

--
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,
`, "Get off the cross. We need the wood." steiner@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu `,
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,
From: layne@pitt.edu (Deborah E Layne)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Other Books
Date: 29 Jul 92 17:39:15 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh
Originator: layne@unix.cis.pitt.edu


Does anyone else read Pat Cadigan?  She takes many of the themes
of Neuromancer well beyond their limits (and with rock and roll).
Books:  Mindplayers and Synners.  

Comments?
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: ahawks@nyx.cs.du.edu (andy)
Subject: Re: Gibson's _Book of the Dead_ release
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Reply-To: ahawks@nyx.UUCP (andy)
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 04:27:35 GMT

In article <17224@autodesk.COM> dansmith@Autodesk.COM (Daniel Smith) writes:
|
|	This is probably Lo Tek, but aren't there monitors for the Mac
|with video out?  You could just tape it :-)
|
|            dansmith@autodesk.com            dansmith@well.sf.ca.us
|_____________________________________________________________________________

Despite yer smiley, these posts about Agrippa and how to go about making it
publically accessable bother me.  In almost every instance there has been a
suggestion in which Agrippa must be taken *outside* of it's state and cloned.
The essence must be kept *inside*, ie: alterred in its original form, not
altered from a clone form, to be truly cp, IMHO.  Similar to a cyber-implant
in your body (ie: a memory chip for example).  If I were to clone myself and
then implant the chip, that would be cyber, but not punk.  However, if I were
to just insert the chip in my head, altering my original being, that would be
cyber and punk, cyberpunk.

The suggestions about transcribing, taping, or whatever are not really cp.

Oh, wait!  I'm wrong!  They are actually ultimately cp!  In cp, the surface is
the substance, right?  Ok, so screw it - transferring it to a different media
*is* cyberpunk.  Nevermind, I'm screwed.

Wow...cool...Ok, so, now, maybe we should set up a videotaping tree or
something. No, that's too complicated.  Nevermind, in today's world it's more
practical to just get the thing in it's original medium, so, whatever....

Well, anyway, who's actually got a copy?  Second of all, who's got an unread
copy? Third of all, who's actually working on hacking the thing?

PS - In keeping with the spirit, I think the first place the thing should be
uploaded to is MindVox.  

 ___________________________________________________________________________
|                                        |                                  |
| hawkeye (andy) :: ahawks@nyx.cs.du.edu |   Future Culture Mailing List!   |
|________________________________________|     Tomorrow's Reality Today     |
|                                        | cyberpunk, virtual reality, rave |
|  The Kracker Box BBS :: 303.438.1481   | computer underground, industrial |
|  120 megs...vt 100 reqd...14.4k baud   | [ future-request@nyx.cs.du.edu ] |
|________________________________________|__________________________________|

Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: bhilpott@wam.umd.edu (Manuel de Anarchismo)
Subject: Re: Tetsuo
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 03:49:19 GMT

Bzzzzzzzt.. Wrong answer..  Tetsuo is a movie very different from Akira.
The movies are not Anime, but they are japanese.

Dan
bhilpott@wam.umd.edu

Xref: sparky alt.cyberpunk:3493 alt.cyberpunk.movement:298
From: sirota#m#_alex@msgate.corp.apple.com (Alex Sirota)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk,alt.cyberpunk.movement
Subject: Gibson's _Book of the Dead_ release
Date: 17 Jul 92 16:52:38 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc.

Here is the official release I got from clainews...

From apple!lll-winken!looking!newsbytes Fri Jul 17 00:05:15 PDT 1992
Article 1336 of clari.nb.apple:
From: jbs@korova (jacques)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: c-p
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 23:10:28 CDT
Organization: VHF void tube of the mind

That'
Gibson, Sterling, etc., are all well and good, but have y'all done the 
background reading? Spinrad, Ballard, Brunner, Pynchon, Jarry, etc.? Work 
backwards and then go forward in a different direction to arrive at 
a very different, but equally valid aesthetic. It'll be worth it. 
Cyberpunk is only one of many available forms. 

BTW, Hakim Bey's *Temporary Autonomous Zone* (Autonomedia Books - best 
known for publishing Semiotext(e)) and Jean Baudrillard's *Simulations* 
(same publisher) are good light reading.

--
              VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783
        "where you can find the Zeta Greys SAFEWAYING themselves
                into the WONDERBREAD *heart* of America!"
From: jbs@korova (jacques)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Agrippa
Date: 24 Jul 92 06:14:56 GMT
Organization: VHF void tube of the mind

Why don't you just take photographs of each page or output the display to 
a projection screen and photograph THAT? I think this is a fish story. 
Granted, Neuromancer made a big splash, but what publisher would touch 
such a baroquely self-indulgent work as Agrippa? Sounds pretty though. At 
least there's one part of the story I might check out sometime. I can 
always pop on over to the Houston Museum o' Fine Arts and look for 
Ashbaugh's etchings (assuming they're on display).

BTW, this story reminds me of that San Francisco legend of the mysterious 
Black Album that the Beatles supposedly recorded with the Rolling Stones 
("That's DEFINITELY Lennon singing...I'd know Keith's chops anywhere!").

I'm not gonna commit myself on whether the press release is a lotta 
hooey, but if most of us trust the regular news like we can piss thru 
concrete, what makes us think we can trust news of even more dubious 
provenance? We hear stories here we won't see on Eyewitness News at %, 
but there's no guarantee they're true.

...and with that, the long-winded old cyberpunk falls asleep in his 
Barcalunger.

--
              VHF void tube of the mind (713) 492-2783
        "where you can find the Zeta Greys SAFEWAYING themselves
                into the WONDERBREAD *heart* of America!"
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 1992 15:19:23 MST
From: <ISTRSC@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Mondo The Book

I just picked up a copy of Mondo 2000 #7 (brand-new) which had a
full-page ad promising a September release date for the Mondo book.

Don't have any info about the Sterling book...
From: olson@dstl86.gsfc.nasa.gov (Paul Olson)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: The Difference Engine
Date: 21 Jul 92 19:25:00 GMT
Organization: Mission Operations and Data Systems
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Jul21.045745.15617@honte.uleth.ca>, tagg@hg.uleth.ca writes...
>In article <20JUL199222275714@dstl86.gsfc.nasa.gov>, olson@dstl86.gsfc.nasa.gov (Paul Olson) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul20.204205.11655@honte.uleth.ca>, tagg@hg.uleth.ca writes...
>
>[cybercourt case arguments deleted]
>

Touche!  Boy, I wish I could tell my soon-to-be-ex-wife to lump her claim for
alimony!

Dr. Forbin
From: hooker@aristotle.ils.nwu.edu (Robert Hooker)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Rave and Raves?
Date: 28 Jul 92 15:47:45 GMT
Distribution: alt
Organization: Institute for the Learning Sciences


OK, maybe i'm not very cool and CP and all;

But what is a Rave or the Raves,  i read about it (he, she, them) all the 
time and still have no idea what it is all about.
From: ron@zooid.guild.org (Secret Mud)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: The only thing that really irritated me about Neuromancer.
Date: 21 Jul 92 13:04:54 GMT

From: neilg@fraser.sfu.ca (Neil K. Guy)
>moon!cyberden!impmat@well.sf.ca.us writes:
>
>>The only thing that bothered me in Neuromancer and his other books was a 
>>recurring phrase which had to do with eating and talking at the same 
>>time...
>
> Seriously? Does this really offend your sensibilities? I guess those
>dirty scum lowlife Gibsonesque characters never had mums to tell them
>not to talk with their mouths full.
>
> - Neil K.

Hey, why do they all chicken out and talk around their food?  Give me a
character with the guts to talk straight through their lunch!

"Mmuggle enffle?" gurgled Case as bits of taco sprayed the table like the
output of a mexican particle accelerator set on puree...
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: stm@sequent.com (Scott "Worf" MacQuarrie)
Subject: Re: Tetsuo
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: sqnt
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 22:31:57 GMT

tagg@hg.uleth.ca (Nathaniel Tagg) writes:

>In article <Brs2I7.ID1@acsu.buffalo.edu>, dewind@acsu.buffalo.edu (Padraig) writes:
>>bhilpott@wam.umd.edu (Manuel de Anarchismo) writes:
>>
>>>I saw a movie a while ago during the DC Film Festival called Tetsuo (sp?).
>>>It seemed to me that the overall theme of the movie was definately in
>>>the cyberpunk realm, and the 'sequel' Tetsuo 2:  The Body Hammer was
>>>equally cyberpunk.  The aesthetic of the movie was interesting in that
>>>the whole thing revolved about the idea that destruction in and of itself
>>>can be art.  The movies are japanese productions of so/so quality but
>>>really interesting concepts.  I was wondering if anyone else had seen either
>>>of these movies?
>>
>>The only thing I can say about it is that I believe Tetsuo was one of the
>>main characters in Akira.  Perhaps Tetsuo is actually a sort of sequel to 
>>Akira or something like that.  Akira did have a lot of CP type of stuff in 
>>it...perhaps a predecessor to modern Cyberpunk.
>>
>>Padraig

>    The best film I saw that typified a  Cyberpunk attitude was a French film
>called "La Femme Nikita" or something very close to that.  Not high-tech, no
>corps, no cybernetics, not really even science fiction.  But it had all the
>vigor, fear, violence, attitude, and minimal respect for human life that
>typifies cyberpunk.  Subtitles don't hurt the movie any.  "Victor the Cleaner"
>remains my favorite homocidal maniac.

The film is "La Femme Nikita" and it's a cross between a spy movie and
cyberpunk (whatever that means). 

I rented it based on the various review recommendations and awards it has
won (the usual list). It's an excellent movie that deals mostly with the
main character Nikita.

I'm not going to say if it's cyberpunk or not cyberpunk, or even if I think
it's postmodern (which I do). I liked it and the characters are fasinating
and unpredictable. The movie is origional and not another sequel or formula 
movie with cardboard characters.         

Although, I suspect David "it's evil....I hate it...I hate it...I hate it") 
Brin won't like it. [Sorry couldn't resist.]


Rent the movie,
-- 
Scott T. MacQuarrie                  Marketing Training Developer 
                                       Sequent Computer Systems   
     stm@sequent.com                Beaverton, OR      503-578-5456
From: olson@dstl86.gsfc.nasa.gov (Paul Olson)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Smart Pills
Date: 31 Jul 92 20:08:00 GMT
Organization: Mission Operations and Data Systems
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Jul29.050058.15924@highlite.uucp>, mike@highlite.uucp (Mike Wiik) writes...
>olson@dstl86.gsfc.nasa.gov (Paul Olson) writes:
>[stuff deleted]
>In any case I'm not a scientist, nor play one on TV, but imho treating
>a potentially very important subject like this with (imho) stupid humor
>is bad enough when it comes from the media, and worse when it comes from
>a scientist, or one playing one on the net. I've experienced a mild
>energy increase just from heavy choline and B6, more than with Dirk'n'
>Sandy's early mixtures, but I really wanna try some vasopressin! I hope
>to see some of your more scientific posts on alt.psychoactives...

No, you won't find any of my posts there.  I prefer the byte-oriented areas
myself.  BEEP...  I do agree that these drugs are important.  They could, in
fact, change the balance of power in the world (see all the various scifi
stories on super humans, etc.).  So enjoy them now before the government puts
regulations on them and funnels the supply into the Halls of Congress.  Can you
imagine if those guys got smart about their graft and corruption?

>|But you won't find me at the
>|front of the line, waiting for a paper cup and pills.  I'll let others suffer
>|neurotransmitter failure first.
> 
>Maybe those who go off-line for a second to take a leak will miss the
>singularity. In any case this is alt.cyberpunk, where you're expected
>at least to POSE like someone shoving into the front of the line... :)

Hey, wait a minute!  I thought we were all _non-conformist_ Bozo's on this bus!

I guess what it comes down to, for me at lest, is that most of the major body
parts have either transplant or synthetic replacements.  I don't even worry
about them.  The brain doesn't.  You can't swap a brain.  Therefore, it
shouldn't be messed with.  To take off on a tag line I saw out here, "A mind is
a terrible thing to baste!" ;)  But don't tell me that at 06:30 when I'm
pounding my trimethalxanthine to begin another work day! |-(

So everyone out here too took my posting far too seriously, ease up before you
blow a vein.  I'll stay low and keep moving!

 >  >	-Mike >  >--  >   | o==== . : ... :  :  .    
|Mail Me Neat Stuff->POB 3703 Arlington VA 22203 > --@-- . o o o ... O -O- o o
: |No disclaimers needed: I actually pay for this. >   |           ... :  :       
|----------------------------------------------- >mEssAGE fRoM sPAcE ARt
stUdiOs |Man:TheMissingLinkBetweenApes&HigherIntelligence

Dr. Forbin
From: wendell.martin@matrix.sbs.com (Wendell Martin) 
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: YABB - DIFFERENCE ENGINE
Date: 21 Jul 92 01:30:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The MATRIX BBS - Birmingham, AL - 205-323-2016
Reply-To: wendell.martin@matrix.sbs.com (Wendell Martin) 

A kindred soul!  DiffEng was a waste for me too.  Not the retro aspect,
just the wrating which was undeniably vague.

Wendell
From: vender@plains.NoDak.edu (Does it matter?)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: _The Adolescence of P1_
Date: 24 Jul 92 19:04:44 GMT
Organization: North Dakota State University, Fargo, ND

[[Stuff compressed]]
>Yes, good book.  Try this one out at some time.
>_The Forever Machine_ by someone who'm I think has a
>last name that starts with "W" (don't have it in front of me
>right now).
>
>Read about a quarter of it, then look at the publishing date.
>It could be set now, in the 90's.
>
>petesk@microsoft.com

Another book along the same lines, 'When H.A.R.L.E.Y. Was One' is also
  worth looking into.  The technology in the edition I read was a little
  dated, but the development of the machine is still very interesting.
  Unfortunately, I think a revised/updated edition was published, but
  I'm not sure its still in print (it was advertised in an old Dragon
  magazine a few years ago).
From: tagg@hg.uleth.ca (Nathaniel Tagg)
Subject: Re: Tetsuo
Reply-To: tagg@hg.uleth.ca
Organization: University of Lethbridge
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 17:33:27 GMT

In article <Brs2I7.ID1@acsu.buffalo.edu>, dewind@acsu.buffalo.edu (Padraig) writes:
>bhilpott@wam.umd.edu (Manuel de Anarchismo) writes:
>
>>I saw a movie a while ago during the DC Film Festival called Tetsuo (sp?).
>>It seemed to me that the overall theme of the movie was definately in
>>the cyberpunk realm, and the 'sequel' Tetsuo 2:  The Body Hammer was
>>equally cyberpunk.  The aesthetic of the movie was interesting in that
>>the whole thing revolved about the idea that destruction in and of itself
>>can be art.  The movies are japanese productions of so/so quality but
>>really interesting concepts.  I was wondering if anyone else had seen either
>>of these movies?
>
>The only thing I can say about it is that I believe Tetsuo was one of the
>main characters in Akira.  Perhaps Tetsuo is actually a sort of sequel to 
>Akira or something like that.  Akira did have a lot of CP type of stuff in 
>it...perhaps a predecessor to modern Cyberpunk.
>
>Padraig

    The best film I saw that typified a  Cyberpunk attitude was a French film
called "La Femme Nikita" or something very close to that.  Not high-tech, no
corps, no cybernetics, not really even science fiction.  But it had all the
vigor, fear, violence, attitude, and minimal respect for human life that
typifies cyberpunk.  Subtitles don't hurt the movie any.  "Victor the Cleaner"
remains my favorite homocidal maniac.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Nathaniel Tagg               The U of Hell,  Lethbridge, AB
    "It's just a matter of putting one point seven one five three seven two
and two point two oh four six two eight together."     --The Doctor 
___The opinions expressed by the author of the preceding message are not 
nessesarily representative of the opinions of the author of the
preceding message.____
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk