HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: d90mj@efd.lth.se (Maarten Johansson)
Subject: Re: Music and Code from Demos
Organization: Lund Institute of Technology, Sweden
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 14:01:45 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.122837.15807@ugle.unit.no> mortene@Lise.Unit.NO (Morten Eriksen) writes:
>>>Mahoney & Kaktus are my heroes!!  God they make me laugh!
>>
>>Kaktus was glad to hear that! We study at the same place...
>
>Does he still use his Amiga? Can't you please make him upload their productions
>on a ftp-site? Please?
>
>Morten
is a really good name,sn't it?

I will tell him at once! He has asked us in PHA if it's possible to
release anything for us, so he's still using his Amiga. He's also
making some serious hardware-things, I guess.

****************************************************************
 d90mj@efd.lth.se - Celebrandil of Phenomena - Marten Johansson 
****************************************************************
From: umage@mcl.ucsb.edu (Slender Fungus)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Fractals
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:24:23 GMT


 
		who here has written any good fractal routines in
		integer math ?

	and BTW, anybody who has compiled a mandelbrot generator,
	try changing
z=z*z+c	to say
z=z*z+z+c
 
	.. really wild!
 
 
		i'm thinking on doing some choas stuff in asm. land.
 
		in  fact, an idea which uses the blitter to do the
	choas generating and comes out really fast is sifting out of the fog..
What a cool background to a demo that'd be, eh ?  Real time fracatal..

--
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
From: martin@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
Date: 5 Nov 92 10:40:01 -0600
Reply-To: martin@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
Organization: St. Cloud State University, St. Cloud, MN

In article <1992Nov5.154808.9289@lth.se>, d90mj@efd.lth.se (Maarten Johansson) writes:
>In article <Bx7BxE.A2t@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> kodak@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Jason Balicki (KodaK)) writes:
>>In article <1992Nov4.112647.4850@lth.se> d90mj@efd.lth.se (Maarten Johansson) writes:
>>>In article <tamrar.0gqt@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca> tamrar@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca (Tamra Ross) writes:
>
>>>>I have run the following on my 3000/25 2 megs chip & 4 megs fast mem only
>>>>sometimes having to degrade a bit (caches off, privlage enabled)...  
>>>bla... bla...
>>>>Substance        Quartex
>>>>Phenomena        Enigma
>>>
>>>Enigma was made by Azatoth of Phenomena, not Phenomena by Enigma...
>>>Have you never heard of Phenomena before, you dickhead?
>
>bla... bla...
>>I like Phenomena's stuff, but if it's full of arrogant 
>>egomaniacs like you who get huffy when someone makes a mistake
>>then my opinion drops.  Have you NEVER made a mistake?
>bla... bla...
>>--Jason Balicki
>>kodak@mentor.cc.purdue.edu
>
>Phenomena isn't full of arrogant egomaniacs. I hope and guess most
>people know that. If you ever meet us you will understand. No, I
>have NEVER made a mistake before! If I don't know what I'm talking
>about I keep my mouth closed.

Claiming you have never made a mistake before sound quite arrogant in itself.

>
>****************************************************************
> d90mj@efd.lth.se - Marten Johansson - Celebrandil of Phenomena
>****************************************************************

Jim
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   It is not I who am CrAzY, it is I who am MAD!!!!! -Ren (SpaCe MaDDneSs)
Living w/o a computer 'till the 4000 comes. Sigh... X-ASOCC (CBM Blew that one)
           Jim Martin   MATRIX -- If it's made, we sell it. Almost.
A4000 Coming SOON!!, Real soon.                 MARTIN@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: u920659@daimi.aau.dk (Carsten S|rensen)
Subject: Re: PT CIA timing Was: The Lords (C64) (Was: Questions...)
Organization: DAIMI: Computer Science Department, Aarhus University, Denmark
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 10:56:08 GMT

hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu (Mark) writes:

>In (Some obscure Article Number here) Osma Ahvenlampi writes:
>
>>Except that PT supports CIA interrupts.. Takes a bit more time, but what the
>>hell... :-)
>
>Yep. One note about that though... if you use CIA timing, you cannot
>fineadjust the speed (the xF20-xFFF commands have no effect).

Eh.. Sorry pal but it's the other way around :)

>Foo.

Carsten

Xref: sparky alt.sys.amiga.demos:1618 comp.sys.amiga.applications:8640 comp.sys.amiga.introduction:1514 comp.sys.amiga.marketplace:8881 comp.sys.amiga.misc:16817 comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:29104
From: rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu (Robert Fentiman)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos,comp.sys.amiga.applications,comp.sys.amiga.introduction,comp.sys.amiga.marketplace,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Programming
Date: 14 Nov 92 23:23:46 GMT
Organization: University of Minnesota, Duluth
NNTP-Posting-Host: ub.d.umn.edu

In article <mwm.2n55@contessa.palo-alto.ca.us> mwm@contessa.palo-alto.ca.us (Mike Meyer) w
>
>Does it open a public screen so I can use Lens-like programs on it?
>Does it paste to/from the clipboard? Can those things be done in AMOS?

I have no idea if it can open public screens or not (possibly Amos Pro
can), however, it is a mood point FOR ME as I don't have 2.X (but I sure
want it).  I'm sure it can paste from/to clipboard.

>Could it run on the WB so I can cut and paste text between other
>applications and it? Could KeyShow show what the alt'ed and
>alt-shift'ed keys would generate? Could KeyShow, or a grammer checker,
>or may favorte spelling checker run on the same screen? Could I run a
>text editor on that screen to work on an ARexx macro for it in that?

I have not tried opening a window on WB yet.  It shouldn't be hard for
the ARexx macro (I should think).  Anyway, as I have stated, I am a NEW
user of AMOS.  Find some others (there are PLENTY around) who are more
experienced to answer some of these questions.

>Can I use clipboard cut/paste in that program? Can it be run on the
>WB? Does it have some form of preferences, including icons to enable
>specific settings? Would my commodites work properly while I was
>running it? If the answer to any of the above is no, then your program
>isn't going to be on my disk for very long. More importantly, COULD all
>those things be true?
>
>	<mike

As I have just started writing it (porting what code I have from the 
AmigaBASIC version I wrote).  Icons in amos are NO PROBLEM whatsoever! 
As I said before, I don't have 2.X, and I have no idea on how it affects
the commodities.  As with ANY language, these properties that you
describe are code dependant.  I could write a C program that would not
allow what you have said.  Does that make C bad?  I am fairly positive
many (if not all) of what you have suggested can be implemented in an AMOS
program.  Everything I have stated IS TRUE to the extent of my
knowledge.  For answers to these questions, ask a more experienced AMOS
user.

	Thanks
	Robert Fentiman

UseNet: rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu
At: University of Minnesota, Duluth
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: tfinn@crash.cts.com (Aaron Grier)
Subject: Re: Music and Code from Demos
Organization: CTS Network Services (crash, ctsnet), El Cajon, CA
Date: 10 Nov 92 15:33:55 PST

In article <BxHzDH.M24@dcs.ed.ac.uk> jxp@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Joe Potter) writes:
>> 	Well plasma on the IBM is currently done via palette cycling...
>> pretty fast and relatively easy to do (you've just got to do your code
>> right!)
>
>	Yes, that's how you *animate* a plasma pic; how do you *draw* it?
>
	Fractals...

agrier@gompers.gompers.edu (real internet addy)
tfinn@crash.cts.com (UUCP address)
From: matt-dah@dsv.su.se (Mattias Dahlberg)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Karsten Obarski
Date: 11 Nov 92 16:48:33 GMT
Organization: The DSV institute of Stockholm, Sweden
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]


Please email Karsten Obarski's address to me.


--
=========================================================
=  Regards  =  email:              =  1280x512x256000+  = 
=  Mattias  =  matt-dah@dsv.su.se  =  I love it.        =
=========================================================
=  If we don't *buy* our programs, there soon won't be  =
=  any new software for the Amiga. Obvious, is it not?  =
=========================================================
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: jbrown@lonestar.utsa.edu (Justin W. Brown)
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 05:45:54 GMT

In article <1941@vall.dsv.su.se> matt-dah@dsv.su.se (Mattias Dahlberg) writes:
>Aaron Grier (tfinn@crash.cts.com) wrote:
>
>Talking about US demos. Didn't you guys have the pretty great DefJam over
>there before? (In Illinois I think...)

Hmm... the name does sound familiar.  Probably read it in countless
greets-scrollers :).  I guess I assumed that, like everyone else, they were
European.  And they're definitely old (before I got my Ami)...and probably
dead.

-Maruku of Megawatts
jbrown@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu

Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: marvil@lysator.liu.se (Martin Vilcans)
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
Organization: Lysator Academic Computer Society, Linkoping University, Sweden
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 14:02:22 GMT

njale@dhhalden.no (NJAL EIDE) writes:

>By hardware-tricks most people mean calling/reffering to absolute adresses 
>in the rom. If the rom is changed or the locations of the rom-routines are 
>shuffled around, things will stop working. Therefore hardware-coding can 
>hardly be called legal.

Calling absolute ROM addresses is NOT a hardware trick. It's just a dirty
OS-trick, which I guess no-one does any more.

>By the way, turning off the C64's border re-drawing, wich is a few bytes of 
>code, can hardly be called forcing the machine to do things it shouldn't.

Yes, it can. It forces the computer to do something it isn't designed to do.
There are no such hardware tricks on the Amiga. All features in demos rely
on documented hardware. (Well, there exists one hardware trick for the
Amiga; changing the IN/OUT bit of the keyboard serial port quickly makes the
caps lock LED blink.)

>Making the Amiga sound like it has more than four voices, or fast moving HAM-
>games are much more of that theme.

Nej nej nej! Creating more sound channels is a software trick. And is
creating fast moving HAM-games forcing the computer to do something it
shouldn't?


Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: mknip@niksula.hut.fi (Mats Anders Knip)
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
	<MKNIP.92Nov11143513@superman.hut.fi> <njale.28.721552562@dhhalden.no>
Date: 13 Nov 92 13:50:26

>   What is the point with every single programmer re-inventing the wheel ? If 
>   nobody could take advantage of others expiriences the world would never go 
>   forward. It would be very prosperous if everybody had to figure out quick-
>   sort etc. for themselves, or ???

Demo-coding is not about getting other peoples routines and touching them
up a little. Demo coding is (or should be) inventing new cheats and
ways of doing things nobody has done before. Most people don't understand
this - there are still dozens of groups that release demos that nobody
wants too look at because they contain no new ideas at all. In my
oppinion, they shouldn't release anything at all if they can't do anything
new, or at least give the routine a new angle.
So, how do you come up with all these new ideas? Very often a new cheat
is a spinoff from another routine you've written. You know what kind
of routine you want to make, and suddenly you realise that if you change
this pointer here and that address there you get a really nice effect.
If you work on other peoples routines you hardly ever get to see any
of these "new" variations, because somebody else have probably done it
already. If you write the routine yourself, then maybe you do it in a way
nobody else would, thus finding those secret passages that the others
didn't find.
Demo coding isn't professional programming. If you work as a pro and need
a fast sorting-routine, you look i a book for the optimal routine and
use it. If you want a sorter for a filled in vector-demo, you see what
kind of data you have and try to figure out how to rearrange it in
order to use different cheats and tables to get it as fast as possible.
Naturally, knowing about what alternatives others have used will
help you in deciding which teqnique you will develop, but that should
be done by asking some other coder about the main idea, and then writing
the routine yourself. Not by taking his code and inserting it to your
program.
And, of course, the most important thing : if you figure out how to
write the routine yourself you learn SO much more. The only way to
learn "demo-assembler" is the hard way. Because that is very much what
demo-coding is all about. Anybody can take another persons starfield
routine and use it, but if you re-invent it yourself you can actually
feel proud about what you've done.
--

 *=-------------------------------------------------------=*=----------------=*
 *          E-Mail:   mknip@niksula.cs.hut.fi              *                  *
 *   Helsinki University of Technology /                   *                  *
 *                      department of Computer Science     *                  *
 *=-------------------------------------------------------=*=----------------=*
From: d90mj@efd.lth.se (Maarten Johansson)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Phenomena egos??
Date: 5 Nov 92 15:48:08 GMT
Organization: Lund Institute of Technology, Sweden

In article <Bx7BxE.A2t@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> kodak@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Jason Balicki (KodaK)) writes:
>In article <1992Nov4.112647.4850@lth.se> d90mj@efd.lth.se (Maarten Johansson) writes:
>>In article <tamrar.0gqt@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca> tamrar@nucleus.cuc.ab.ca (Tamra Ross) writes:

>>>I have run the following on my 3000/25 2 megs chip & 4 megs fast mem only
>>>sometimes having to degrade a bit (caches off, privlage enabled)...  
>>bla... bla...
>>>Substance        Quartex
>>>Phenomena        Enigma
>>
>>Enigma was made by Azatoth of Phenomena, not Phenomena by Enigma...
>>Have you never heard of Phenomena before, you dickhead?

bla... bla...
>I like Phenomena's stuff, but if it's full of arrogant 
>egomaniacs like you who get huffy when someone makes a mistake
>then my opinion drops.  Have you NEVER made a mistake?
bla... bla...
>--Jason Balicki
>kodak@mentor.cc.purdue.edu

Phenomena isn't full of arrogant egomaniacs. I hope and guess most
people know that. If you ever meet us you will understand. No, I
have NEVER made a mistake before! If I don't know what I'm talking
about I keep my mouth closed.

****************************************************************
 d90mj@efd.lth.se - Marten Johansson - Celebrandil of Phenomena
****************************************************************
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu (Mark)
Subject: The Lords (C64)   Was: Questions...
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 03:42:38 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.194836.22251@ultb.isc.rit.edu> jms1086@ritvax.isc.rit.edu writes:

>SOmeone was mentioning plasma on an IBM.. I have seen it, so it can be done..
>I believe it was in VGA... I think it was in the UnReal demo...

I think I saw that too, but it was not plasma.. it was colorbars. (If
I recall correctly)

>people that used to make 64 demo's, anyone know what happend to the
>American group Lords? They used to be pretty good! Alot of their stuff
>impressed me....

Thanks. A lot of what we did impressed me too. :-)

As for The Lords, Eclipse (original coder) fell off the earth
clutching a guitar. Morrissey (Artist extraordinaire) still lives in
L.A. and is making a living throwing raves. (Yes, it can be done). 
Doctor O (Second coder) still lives outside of L.A.; I talk to him
five or more times a week. He and I stay in _close_ touch. He's got an
Amiga, but no net access. Currently I think he is running a 50 Mhz 040
system in a 2000, with about 28 MB of RAM and DCTV. He does a lot of ray
tracing, of course... :-D
	As for me, Reverb (Musician for Lords, and I coded a bit too),
I'm the only one of us who is in a demo group. I write music for
MegaWatts now, although there has been an overbearing burden on the
coders, so nothing with my music (or Maruku's for that matter) has
been released yet. Note, I said _yet_.

Man, is it fun to be remembered.... ::hee::

And see, all you Amiga folk thought I was a nobody. ::egomaniacal
chuckle::  Oop... kidding...

               ______   _______ ____   _______________  ______ _  
              / ___ \\ /  ___///  //  / /  ____/ ___ \\/  ___ \\\\
       _____ / /__/ ///  //_  /  // _/ /  //_ / /__/ //  /  / ////
      /___///   ___///  ___///  // /  /  ___//   ___//  /__/ ////
           /    \\  /  //   /  //_/ _/  //  /    \\ /  ____  \\\\
          /  /\  \\/  //__ /     __//  //__/  /\  \/  /___/  ////
         /__// \__/______//_____/  /______/__/  \___________////
             
                                Mark Hazen
                          hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu


Man, is that a pisser of a sig or what?




-- 
My other .sig is also an Amiga.              -hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu
Mark Hazen			 	     -Reverb of Megawatts (huh?)
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: mjbrown@lonestar.utsa.edu (Marc J. Brown)
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 04:42:09 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.093758.20621@lth.se> d90mj@efd.lth.se (Maarten Johansson) writes:
>
>No, I don't dislike Americans and it's often stupid to generalize like
>that. All those Americans I know are really nice friends in fact, but most
>of them still don't know anything about eurodemos.

Well, that's true :).  It's a mystery to me, too..

>You are free to enter (almost) any democompo in Europe if you like to. If
>you send me a module I can help you enter the next one in Denmark.

The PartyII?  I was told that this was not possible... but if you can help,
I'd appreciate it :).

>Music
>and demos are still not the same though.

True... but I have been noticing that there are many significant parallels
between coding demos and coding music... When you "code" music, you can
optimize it, use tricks nobody's ever used before (not talking about
rarely-used effect commands, either), professionally edit it (the samples,
especially) to fit your specific needs, etc.  It's been my observation
that 99% of all mod-writers out there don't care about any of this.
It's especially bone-chilling to hear the "click!" resulting from a poor
loop :).

>I have got phonecalls from Americans in the middle of the night a couple
>of times. The reason why they call is just in order to complain.

Some people are morons :).  How did they ever get your phone #?

>I know
>that I can't generalize too much, but I haven't seen any good american
>demos since EagleSoft in 1986.

That's one up on me :).  I've NEVER seen a good American demo.  However,
I've seen a couple of very small but somewhat interesting Canadian demos :).

>About one year ago I tried to start an American Demo Chart like the
>EuroChart by Crusaders, to make people more aware of the existing american
>demos. Maybe that's a good idea, don't you think?

It would be a good idea if this country actually produced enough demos
to make a top-ten (or a top-three... or a top-one ;)... the only group
I know of that has any American members is ours (gee...duh! :)  Actually,
I heard that a group called Bloodsuckers used to have some...but I haven't
seen anything from them at all (so they're probably dead).

>Don't Blame The Lame!

But they deserve it :).

 _____________  ________ __  ____  __  ______                                _
<__  _    _  //\\  __  // / / _  >/  \ \  ___> "Nan desu ka!? Kore.." -Ren_ //
   \ \\  // //  \\ \< << <_/ // __ <\ \_> >    mjbrown@lonestar.utsa.edu  \X/
 () \/ \/ \//____\\/ \/ \___/<_/  \_>\___/ ()  of M==E==G==A==W==A==T==T==S

Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu (Mark)
Subject: Re: PT CIA timing Was: The Lords (C64) (Was: Questions...)
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:54:17 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.105608.27304@daimi.aau.dk> u920659@daimi.aau.dk (Carsten S|rensen) writes:

>hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu (Mark) writes:
>>Yep. One note about that though... if you use CIA timing, you cannot
>>fineadjust the speed (the xF20-xFFF commands have no effect).
>
>Eh.. Sorry pal but it's the other way around :)

Ah, hell. So it is.

Don't you just hate it when you know what you mean to say but you say
the exact opposite? :-P 



-- 
My other .sig is also an Amiga.              -hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu
Mark Hazen			 	     -Reverb of Megawatts (huh?)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: gunnbr@nextwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu. (Brian R Gunn)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: PAL Hardware switch
Date: 11 Nov 1992 13:57:11 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department at Rose-Hulman
NNTP-Posting-Host: l130b2.nextwork.rose-hulman.edu

Will someone please send me information on making a hardware switch for PAL  
mode on my 500??  Someone posted this information a while ago, then posted  
later that it was wrong.  Degrader is really starting to interfere with  
things--a hardware switch would be *MOST* usefull.

Brian
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi (Osma Ahvenlampi)
Subject: Re: The Lords (C64)   Was: Questions...
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
	<1992Nov7.034238.28597@athena.cs.uga.edu>
	<1992Nov8.183306.26743@ultb.isc.rit.edu>
	<1992Nov9.052857.1837@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 09:09:37 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.052857.1837@athena.cs.uga.edu> hazen@athena.cs.uga.edu (Mark) writes:
>3) PT format, as well as most other music formats, are keyed for PAL
>synchronization. 

Except that PT supports CIA interrupts.. Takes a bit more time, but what the
hell... :-)
--
Osma Ahvenlampi  -  oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi
This article does not necessarily represent anyone's opinions, not even mine.
If you are offended by this article, be so in silence. I am not interested.
From: jms1086@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
Date: 10 Nov 92 23:20:35 GMT
Reply-To: jms1086@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology

Ok.... Now we have the general idea for an AC... Now why not acatully make 
one? I'm sure there's enough American demo-collectors that if we stick 
something on an FTP site, it will sure start going to the boards quickly..
(You know those credit hungry people!)... But why not have an American
contest for the best demo? Open to Americans only, and we'll pick out a 
disk with some of the best entries... That would be an insentive... It 
could start out just an Internet thing, but it could spread.... 

Now for me... Can anyone send me some code for a scroller? Asm, or 
even C... I don't wanna have to sit down and figure it out myself...
I'll hack through the code to find out what it does, and then
go through and write my own version... And if ya wanna be REALLY
generous, how about a sine scroller! HEh heh... Any coder wanna take a
coder wanna be under his/her wing?!?!

				-Garion....
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos