Newsgroups: can.general
From: mart@csri.toronto.edu (Mart Molle)
Subject: Re: For those who like the German example of highways ...
Distribution: can
Date: 1 Oct 92 15:23:59 GMT

donald@sq.sq.com (Donald Teed) writes:

>A little while ago there was a thread about driving going on
>in various Canadian newsgroups.  Some people were in favor
>of having higher speed limits, and offered the example of
>Europe as a fine place to drive safely and quickly.

>Here is a posting from rec.autos.driving that might make the
>hair stand up on your neck.  Then again, if you are one of those
>insensitive high octane/adrenaline types, maybe not.

[request for pictures of a 220 vehicle pileup on the autobaun in fog deleted]

I haven't seen the pictures, but what's your point?  We have plenty
of big pileups on this side of the Atlantic too.  Over the last 10
years or so, I can remember massive pileups on the 401 near Kingston,
and on the 400 near Barrie.  Probably much smaller than the recent
German tragedy, but not bad for a 3rd rate country with an identity
crisis... :-)

Before I can accept your thesis that the accident would not have taken
place if they had enforced a "civilized" speed limit, let me ask you:

 1. What were the weather conditions involved?  I've heard of several
 large pileups in Europe over the years, and so far they all seem to
 involve a sudden arrival of a fast-moving "pea-soup" fog.  Would a
 lower speed limit have been enough to make a difference?  Do similar
 weather conditions occur in Canada?
 
 2. Is a lower speed limit really the *best* countermeasure for this
 type of situation?  Why not ban fog instead?  Or install a network
 of roadside early warning signs that can be activated in bad weather
 to warn of bad weather ahead?  (They may not be needed everywhere,
 since the really bad fogs generally happen in certain areas.)  Indeed,
 isn't it mandatory in Germany for car radios to include a remotely
 activated warning system that causes them to broadcast road hazard
 warnings no matter what the radio is supposed to be doing at the time?
 I suppose the money-is-no-object technology lovers might even advocate
 some sort of collision avoidance radar system...
 
 3. Including the effects massive pileups like this, are the German
 autobauns really more dangerous than our own highway system in terms
 of fatalities per mile?  If not, and the only difference is that we
 have frequent small accidents (that don't make one's hair stand on
 end) instead of rare massive big ones (that do have that effect),
 then why is our system better than theirs?  Wouldn't I be safer to
 live under their system, and simply avoid driving in bad weather??
 
While I hate to be branded "insensitive", I wonder if Mr. Teed is not
being too emotional (or maybe manipulative) about this.  In particular,
I bet more people get killed or injured in an airplane crash, when
one occurs (which, thankfully, isn't often).  Should we then limit
commercial aviation to hang glider speeds for "safety" reasons?  Or,
if my memory is correct, ban airplanes from landing, since most
crashes happen in takeoff or landing, and the worst-ever crash was
between two jumbo jets taxiing on the ground in the Canary Islands?

While I feel very badly about the German autobaun tragedy, I don't think
it is "proof" that driving in Germany is less safe than it is in Canada.

Mart L. Molle
Computer Systems Research Institute
University of Toronto
Toronto, Canada M5S 1A4
(416)978-4928
Newsgroups: can.general