HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kumar@syd.dit.CSIRO.AU (V.R.Kumar)
Subject: Re: reservation
Organization: CSIRO Division of Info Tech, Sydney, Australia
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 22:44:29 GMT

In article <Bt9Los.KrH@news.cso.uiuc.edu> jsg9939@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (J. Sreedhar ) writes:
>kumar@syd.dit.CSIRO.AU (V.R.Kumar) writes:
>
>
>>Reservation is very much essential for a country like India.
>> 
>
>>Anbudan,
>
>>V R Kumar
>
>
>>-- 
>> V.R.Kumar (Ramkumar Venkatachalam)                                 
>> CSIRO, Division of Information Technology                         
>> P.O.Box:1599, Macquarie Centre, North Ryde, NSW 2113, AUSTRALIA  
>
>Okay, but for how long? And should it be from cradle to grave?!
>
>Isn't it true that all humans (and Indians in particular) tend
>to `relax' and become less productive when there is no accountabiliy?

Just because of reservation, do the Indians tend to relax ???
Again, a generalised statement. Until India has achieved a high
percentage in education, reservation is very much essential. One has
to face the side-effects because of reservation. If there is no reser-
vation, there is no way that poor people from villages can have
education. Think about villages. Do not think about Bombay, madras,
Calcutta or Delhi. 75% of India lives in villages.

Anbudan,

V R Kumar

-- 
 V.R.Kumar (Ramkumar Venkatachalam)                                 
 CSIRO, Division of Information Technology                         
 P.O.Box:1599, Macquarie Centre, North Ryde, NSW 2113, AUSTRALIA  

Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: ram@vttcf.cc.vt.edu (Lakshmi Ramadurai)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Joke time
Date: 13 Aug 92 23:37:38 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech, Blacksburg, VA


        
       I extremely regret for my previous posting which included my
comments bout Dr. Srinivasan's joke. i mistook him for a college student
i msorry bout that Dr. srinivasan. please donot take it serious as it was not
meant to hurt u intentionally. hope u understand me. keep in touch . my 
phone #: 703-951-8221.
meendum sandhippom. v please reply.
ram.
From: pennats@ptolemy.CS.ORST.EDU (Shankar Pennathur)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Kanchi Aacharya
Date: 18 Aug 92 21:03:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: CS.1992Aug18.210322.11578
Reply-To: pennats@tesla.cs.orst.edu (Shankar Pennathur)
Organization: Oregon State University, Corvallis


In article <9208182044.AA14233@ha06.eng.ua.edu> bkannan@ha06.eng.ua.edu 
(Balaji Kannan) writes:
>
>
>In an earlier article I wrote:
>
>>  [******' crap [daily dose] deleted]
>
>    I am sorry folks. I am sure the uncensored appearence of c*** has
>    offended "some" puritan souls on the net. But then, I was faced
>    with a difficult choice of economic usage of asterisks with max
>    effect. Since this newsgroup is about offending as small a minority
>    as one can manage to,I thought I'd go ahead and offend; then apologise.
>    [Some decorum there!]
>    I have no regrets about the choice I made. Caught between ******
>    and cr**, I had to settle for ****** to be less offensive, you see.
>    You all know that. Anyway, I thought I'd do my bit.
>
>    BK

Dont even bother apologizing BK. When the original poster did not even
display an iota of sensitivity to the people he offends by writing such
crap, I think your posting was well within limits, in comparison.

Ofcourse the usual disciplining postings from SundaraPandian and Krishna Raj
will follow... For that has been the norm in this newsgroup so far...


Shankar.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:1070 alt.culture.tamil:1196
From: thiyagarajan@mims.enet.dec.com (RT)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Please do not respond to the article 'Periyar Temple'
Date: 17 Aug 92 20:02:55 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation




In article <1992Aug17.145104.16689@cs.odu.edu>, raj@news.cs.odu.edu (M. P. Krishna Raj) writes...
>Please do not respond to the articles of the above nature.
> 
>Ignore them.
> 
>There was a similar poster in another soc.culture.group.
> 
>Everybody boycotted him.
> 
>This person is one of them who posted articles in SCI
>against the formation of SCT.

So is SCT reserved for only people who voted YES?

> 
>Now the same person is posting articles in SCT so that
>other nettors will come with nasty replies.
> 
>Let us boycott him/her.
> 
>Raj

I am not afraid of opposition. You have every right to oppose my views.
I hope that atleast some guys will hear your voice. I don't think many guys in
this net give serious thoughts about my article. By posting this note your are
kindling the curiosity of the other netters who may look forward to my future
artciles.

Hope that this is not TN assembley to punish free-journalism.

Anyway I got some e-mails from this same group prising my article

RT
Xref: sparky soc.culture.tamil:1385 alt.culture.tamil:1227 soc.culture.indian:28958
From: prem@cs.montana.edu (M.P.Premkumar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: Curious minds wants to know... tamil..?
Date: 20 Aug 92 19:13:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: coe.1992Aug20.191349.3308
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, MSU, Bozeman Mt 59717

In article <1992Aug20.181842.11727@cs.wayne.edu> uds@wsu-eng.eng.wayne.edu (Seetamraju Udaybhaskar) writes:
>In article <2872@ucl-cs.uucp> B.Kumar@cs.ucl.ac.uk writes:
>>
>>Curious mind wants to know - What is the use of creating s.c.t and a.c.t 
>>if every article is simulatenouly posted on SCI as well :-)?. - Viswas.
>
>Good question.  Any answers ?
>
>
>Seetamraju Udaya Bhaskar Sarma
>(email : seetam @ ece7 . eng . wayne . edu)

Yeah. First of all the truth is not all articles are posted simultaneously in
SCT and SCI. Second, if the article is broad based and justifies its presence
in SCI then why not ?

Eg: Rajanikanth next CM ? - belongs to SCT alone
    Poems, stories & jokes in Tamil - belong to SCT but it may be posted on SCI
    Reservations, Aryan invasion, religion - belong to both

Am I clear ?


Sincerely yours,
M.P.Premkumar
From: vigneswa@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Tamil (Sri Lankan) Pop/Bailah, AE Manoharan....
Date: 13 Aug 92 16:58:13 GMT

	Both terms, bailah and pop songs, are acceptable.  The first Tamil pop
song was "sinnamAmiyE". It was written by Niththi Kanagaratnam (a graduate, if
it means something).  These songs  were very popular during seventies and were
fast in nature.  Some of these songs had meaningful words ("kaLLU kadai pakkam
pOkAthE" is a good  example) in  them.  There was a  song about Sri Lanka, its
natural beauty and wealth ("ilankai enpathu...").  There were few songs on God
too (eg. "mAl marukA ezhil vEl murukA..")

	AE Manoharan was a very popular singer, specially among the  Sinhalese
pop fans.  Later he sang many "translated" Tamil pop songs. He never wrote any
pop songs, if not by ghost writers.  Manoharan acted in "vAdaik-kARRu", one of
the very successful Tamil movies produced in Sri Lanka.  Then he went to India,
only to act in the  stereotype roles of "villain sidey" and  was beaten up  by
Kamal and Rajini. He sang two songs (at least) for Tamil movies.  One was with
Kamal for "manitharil iththanai niRankLA" (...mAmA sarakkuu innikku nallAl-lE..
ada rAmA ....) and the other for "kAsmeer kAthali" (surAngani....).  Surangani
was a popular Sinhalese song, apparently taken from an  African folk song.  If 
I remeber correctly, GK Venkatesh was the music director of "kAshmeer kAthali".
Only the  first few lines, that also with few modification ("thang-genappu", a
phrase meaning "just brought", was changed to "surAnganikkA") of the Surangani
song was used in the movie.  

Vicky:
UMass,Aug 13

++++++
I referred to the following SCTamil postings:

==========
> I could recollect only one popular pop song.
>  chinna mAmiye, un chella magal engE
>  pallikkuththAn chendrAlO, padikkaththAn chendrAlO
==========
>    There are many, the most popular one being "Churaangani.."
> which goes like this :
>   "churaangani, churaangani
>    churaanganikkaa maalu **kannaavaa**        ** genAvA**
>    maalu maalu maalu *churaanganikka* maalu   * thang-genAppu * (changed!) 
>    churaanganikkaa maalu **kannaavaa**..
>                    [ Anyone knows what the above means ? ]
>   *** arisi irukku paruppu irukku aakkaa mudiyilE ***
>   *** aduppu irukku neruppu irukku chEkka mudiyilE***.. ***Tamil words***
=========
>  Other pop song I remember is,
>   "kaLLukkadai pakkam pOkaathE.
>    un kaalaip pidiththu kenjugiREn.."
=========
>	I am not sure if they call it pop song in Sri Lanka. I think they call
>it Ceylon Bailaas. They were written by A. E. Manoharan. 
=========
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
From: ngopalas@ho09.eng.ua.edu (Nath S. Gopalaswamy)
Subject: Re: Categories and Castes
Organization: The University of Alabama
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 18:32:52 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.122258.10537@morgan.ucs.mun.ca>, raghu@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Raghu B) writes:
|> 
|> 
|> Dear Netters,
|> 
|> 	It is interesting to note that people are taking this
|> reservation problem very seriously. That is a good sign of improvement
|> for our Indian society.
|> 
|> 	I wanted to convey this message. In tamil Nadu as far as
|> I know the reservation system is the worst in the whole of nation.
|> In educational institutions the reservations is like this.
|> 
|> 	S.C/S.T	     -     8% + 15 %
|> 	BACKWARD CASTE -   50 % (Oh my god!)
|> 	OBC	       -   I think is a part of B.C or have they
|> 			   taken over some share of O.C
|> 	O.C  (open category) - remaining % .
|> 
|> 	So even if you guys have a brilliant idea that the reservations
|> should be based upon the % of the population then Brahmins constitute
|> 10% of the population. Then why the hell don't you guys give him his
|> share of 10% and not interfere with that. You have the remaining 90% and
|> you do whatever the hell you want to do with it. Why do you want to
|> screw others share. You get yours and we get ours. This is justice and
|> this is fairness.
|> 

This is priceless! This is like the Lok Sabha, representation based on the
population of each state. Now I know what that will lead to. I think the
Open Category is more like 18 %. But the majority of the so called Backward
caste guys do not study hard as they are secure in the knowledge that they 
will get in anyhow, so in my view it is only hurting them in the long run.
If everything was thrown open, then I am sure the BC guys will compete as hard
because they know their ass is on fire. In my batch in IIT nearly 30-40% 
belonged to the alleged BC category, but they seemed to have no problems in
tackling the JEE like the FC's. So all this hogwash about reservations is
nothing more than dumb politicians wanting their dumb sons and relatives in
through an easy way.
Reservation is never the answer. Instead, help should be provided in the form
of coaching classes etc to help the truly deserving. And after coaching they
should participate in open competition without any reservation scheme to give 
them a false sense of security. Merit should never be sacrificed, the country
cannot afford any more free-loaders on the system. And this caste division will
not be perpetuated as it is no longer present all the time on people's minds.

Nath.

|> 
|> 
|> 			Raghu, Balasubramanian
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
From: ratan@thebe.rutgers.edu (Santosh Ratan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: I HATE TAMILS (2) (Respect other's)
Date: 19 Aug 92 14:52:04 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.tamil
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <19AUG199209392130@utkvx4.utk.edu>, raj@utkvx4.utk.edu (S. KANAKA RAJ) writes:

> "Hey idiotic Tamilians. Learn Indhi which is such a great language. You are 
> losing your life without learning it." This is what people who try to impose
> Indhi say. Now do they not mean that Indhi is superior to other languages? I
> would like to see Samaskridham (Sanskrit) being taught in schools which is
> indeed ONE of the rich languages; but not Indhi which is first of all not a
> pure language. It is a masaala language.

What is tamizh? is it a madrasee language or is it same as tamild.

and what mean indhi???

And who is this morone who wants to learn a RICH language in the age
of economic recession. Why doesn't he learn to live with what he's
gaat? Can he learn anything?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: babu@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Natarajan Sureshbabu)
Subject: Re: Six abodes of Lord Murgan
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 03:18:42 GMT

In article <1992Aug16.222403.14502@syd.dit.CSIRO.AU> kumar@syd.dit.CSIRO.AU (V.R.Kumar) writes:

>" Aaeru mayil aeri vilaiyaadum mugam ondrae
>  Eesanudan gnyaana mozhi paesum mugam ondrae
>  Koorumadi yaargal vinai theerththa mugam ondrae
>  Kundruruva vael vaangi nindra mugam ondrae
>  Maarupadu soorarai vathaitha mugam ondrae
>  Valliyai manampunara vandha mugam ondrae
>  Aarumugam aana porul nee arulal vaendum
>  Aadhi arunachalam amarntha perumaanae "
>
>V R Kumar

	Isn't this from aruNagirinAthar's thiruppugazh? I used
to sing this often, but without going through the meaning.

The second one here is swamimalai, and the fourth is Thiruchendur.
Can you explain the other lines. I thought Murugan married
DheivayAnai in ThirpparangunRam. 
Bye,
Babu

Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil,soc.culture.indian
From: rags@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Raghavan Jayaraman)
Subject: History and JJ
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 13:40:22 GMT

We have noticed and will notice indiscriminate usage of books on history to
counter or bolster one's argument without resting for a moment to ruminate
about their usefullness in solving the existing problems. 

Reserving my opinion for a later time, I would like to share with you,
since many of U are fans of JJ, very interesting lines from the book"
JJ-sila kurippugal" by Sundara Ramaswamy.

"dOOrathin idaiveliyil karum-pUlli ennai KNOkki nagarndu vandu YAAnai
enpathai KAttikondu POIvittadu. KAlathin idaiveliyil pUlligal ennai KNOkki
varuma? varAdu. NAnnum pUlligalai KNOkki nagara mudiYAdu. pUlli irunda
KAlathaiyum suZhalaiyum ARAya murpattu, arindum ariYAmalum pUlliyai alaKKa
murpadugirom. Sarithiram muKKAdu POttirukkum pennai PONdradu"

Translation:-

A black dot moved from a [an interval of]distance to me, to show itself to
be an elephant. But will dots move to me from a [an interval of] Time? No.
They will not. Even I can't  go to them [to their time].We try to measure
those dots from scarce information extracted by  dwelling into their time
period and environment. History is like a veiled woman.

raghavan
From: rags@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Raghavan Jayaraman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: History and J.J.
Date: 23 Aug 92 14:00:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.1992Aug23.140034.2675
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.

The aim of posting that piece was to point out certain pretentious claims
which can be argued on and on without any results. This includes articles
on forgeries on hindu scriptures to fanatical claims in Ayodya and
defenitely it wasn't to single out a particular person.

Lemme answer some specific analogies.


In article <9208220244.AA02774@cec1.wustl.edu> sp2@cec1.wustl.edu (Sundara Pandian) writes:
> 
>Raghavan Jayaraman writes on `History and J.J.'
>-------------------------------------------------
>
>> We have noticed and will notice indiscriminate usage of books on history to
>> counter or bolster one's argument without resting for a moment to ruminate
>> about their usefullness in solving the existing problems. 

SP:- [stuff deleted]
 Nevertheless,
> he takes a patient seriously if he shows signs of a family disease.
> Then the doctor goes to the patient's family record and tries to
> see whether he shows the same symptoms of his family disease.This
> is like saying `History repeats itself'.

JR:- Such analogies sometimes make us lose the focus.Think for a while
whether a doctor would be wise enough to search for dockets on thousands of
generation to track a diease and would he  be accurate notwithstanding
innumerable influencing factors and doubts on accuracy of such dockets.

It is important to bear in mind that such diseases are called
hereditary/family diseases as nobody knows how exactly and to whom they are
'passed' on but rather they know how to control it.

SP:-
> It happens rarely that
> a doctor cures a patient completely in his first dose of medicine.
> If you see like  that perspective,  a historical article rarely 
> carries all correct views.

JR:-
This above statement totally contradicts your assertion in the article on
"varnashrama Dharma" viz" Varnashrama Dharma indeed was introduced by
brahmins" based on the book by Kanakasabhai.


[stuff deleted]                                                         
						   S.Pandian.
>                                                  sp2@cec1.WUSTL.edu
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------


raghavan
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: rst@vuse.vanderbilt.edu (R. Sritharan)
Subject: Re: History and J.J.
Organization: Vanderbilt University School of Engineering, Nashville, TN, USA
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 19:12:28 GMT

In article <9208220244.AA02774@cec1.wustl.edu> sp2@cec1.wustl.edu (Sundara Pandian) writes:
> 
>Raghavan Jayaraman writes on `History and J.J.'
>-------------------------------------------------
>
                    ...
> posted. Just discarding the articles as `rubbish' and then clearing
                                                             ~~~~~~~~
> oneself as `I didn't say that' or calling the posters as `brain-
  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~       
> dead' is just like vomiting. It doesn't pay anything positive to
                    ...
>     History is like a family disease.
>                                                          S.Pandian.
>                                                  sp2@cec1.WUSTL.edu
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think Balaji Kannan posted something which proved that
S. Pandian himself was guilty of this.

-- rst
From: lkumar@umiami.ir.miami.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: News in USA: "Reverse Discrimination" suit dismissed.
Date: 18 Aug 92 14:15:45 EDT
Organization: Univ of Miami IR


The following news item is taken from `The Miami Herald'
dated 8/18/92. 

Relevance to Indian circumstances and also the fact that 
asian-indians in US (citizens only) are considered as 
ethnic minorities, made me to post it in the Newsgroup, 
so that interested people may have a chance to discuss.

[Diclaimer: No copy right violations intended.]

-- Laxman

---------------------------------------------------------- 

		`Reverse Discrimination' suit dismissed
		========================================
       	 Judge: City's policy didn't trample whites' rights
	----------------------------------------------------

NewYork Times Service

WASHINGTON --- After more than a decade of litigation, a
federal judge has upheld an affirmative action plan for
Birmingham, Ala., including numerical hiring goals that
were attacked by the Reagan administration and white city
employees.

	The Birmingham case, one of the nation's most 
celebrated tests of affirmative action, involves 
firefighters, police and other city employees.
It has attracted attention around the country and was
reviewed by the U.S.Supreme Court.

	The Supreme Court ruling in 1989 allowed the
reopening of the job bias cases in Boston, Chicago,
Memphis, San Francisco and other cities. Civil rights
advocates considered it a major setback.

	Judge Sam C. Pointer Jr., of the U.S. 
District Court in Birmingham, said that city's 
affirmative action plan was legally justified in
view of past exclusion of blacks from city jobs.
He concluded Friday that the plan ``did not
necessarily trammel the rights of whites'' and
did not violate their constitutional rights.

	The decision ``will give encouragement 
to many employers, public and private, to continue
their affirmative action plans,'' said 
Richard T. Seymour, attorney for black police and 
firefighters.

	Birmingham Mayor Richard Arrington Jr. welcomed 
the ruling. `` I hope that it will help hasten the end 
of this fight over reverse discrimination in the City of
Birmingham,'' he said.

	The Bush administration says it supports the 
affirmative action in principle. But it has often opposed 
enforcement of numerical goals for the hiring and promotion
of blacks, Hispanic people and women, arguing that such goals 
become rigid quotas.

	The Birmingham case began in 1975, when a Justice 
Department suit charged a pervasive ``pattern and practice''
of illegal job discrimination against blacks and women.
A negotiated consent decree set up the affirmative action plan.

=================================================================   
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
From: Venkatachalam Aruna  (Affable)
Subject: Re: A THREAT from a boneless tiger in the net
Reply-To: aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu (Venkatachalam Aruna)
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 15:10:20 GMT

In article <Bt9LA1.KLq@news.cso.uiuc.edu> jsg9939@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (J. Sreedhar  
) writes:
> thiyagarajan@mims.enet.dec.com (RT) writes:
> 
> 
> >I received the following threat from one spineless tiger in the net who does
> >not have guts to post his view in the net and sent me e-mail
> 
> 
>  
>==============================================================================
> 
> >From:   "LTTE@surya.waterloo.edu" 19-AUG-1992 12:07:34.52
> 
> >LTTE will kill all the Brahmins.
[headers deleted]
> This is simply outrageous. And cause for serious concern. 
> All right-thinking people should condemn such atrocities.
> 
> Has the guy come to waterloo for education or for terrorism?!
> If such things continue, we must notify the university and the
> police.
> 
> -Sreedhar
> 
  Yes, it is atrocious. One guy from Norway did post similar crap
in SCI and ACT and due to the efforts of netters, his account is cancelled.
All we have to do is to notify the postmaster at that site
and he will take care of everything.

Concerned,
Venkat
--
venkat@jetson.uh.edu                  | If you love something,set it free.
venkat@menudo.uh.edu                  | If it comes back, it is yours.
aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu(NeXT mails okay)| If it does not, it never was.
(713)-923-7773(h) & (713)-743-4250(w) |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Organization: Physics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 11:45:25 -0400 
From: "Arun K. Gupta" <ag3l+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: A threat from...




India's space effort has both civilian and military uses.
Considering the state of the world, I would not sneer at
the military uses.

First, satellites have scientific uses. They are good
platforms, sitting above the earth's obscuring atmosphere
to do science. (This is probably the most exciting and
the least useful :-( application for India).
Satellites are an excellent platform for observing the earth.
Resource management, managing the environment, predicting crop
yields, predicting the weather, cyclone management etc. are
conveniently done from satellites. Just for example, it is
possible to predict the harvest yields to good accuracy well
before the harvest (The US has been estimating Soviet yields
for a long time using satellites.) If there is going to be a
shortfall, then the government can arrange for grain imports
at a time when the international prices are favorable, and
well in advance of any price rise in India for example.
Similarly, prediction of the monsoon will be improved with
satellite observations.

Needless to say, satellites can be used for observing troop
movements, and gathering military information. I think this is
a good use of technology, it enhances Indian security.

More later,
arun gupta
ag3L@andrew.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil