From: alok@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (alok.vijayvargia)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian.american
Subject: Re: Why is SCIA needed ? (Re: An Indian-American Legislator
Date: 14 Apr 92 15:46:31 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T

In article <92102.213528AXM128@psuvm.psu.edu>, AXM128@psuvm.psu.edu (ARIJIT MAHALANABIS) writes:
> In article <1992Apr10.221023.20963@cbnewsi.cb.att.com>, alok@cbnewsi.cb.att.com
> (alok.vijayvargia) says:
> 
> >In article <92101.111615AXM128@psuvm.psu.edu>, ARIJIT MAHALANABIS
> ><AXM128@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
> >> I would venture to say that anything
> >> that is not of European origin cannot in reality become "American" under
> >> current social definitions.
> 
> >Not quite. Asian-americans and african-americans have become part of American
> >society. They are increasingly socially accepted.
> 
> I don't think this is true. African Americans especially like to project
> themselves as quite different from mainstream America. Although Asian Americans
> are a lot more integrated in this respect, they still are far from mainstream
> America. I wonder if you could cite any info. that would contradict this. I
> have my doubts.
> 

Look at the represention from african-americans in political arena.
Look at the representation of asian-americans in media, business etc.

> 
> If one compares representation in government by Americans of Eastern European
> origin with representation in government by Americans of Asian origin, there
> is a vast difference. Even if we consider the fact that there are fewer
> Americans of Asian origin, I would hazard a guess that the representation of
> their community is proportionately less. There have been theories forwarded
> by American historians that the Asian and African American communities will
> never become identified as main stream America, simply because of physical
> attributes. As much as this theory may upset people it is true. I cannot alter
> the color of my skin but a Polish American change his last name to make it
> more 'American.' I can, right off the top of my head, think of several
> Congressmen of prominent stature who are of Eastern European origin. But I
> cannot think of one single Asian Congressman. If they are well represented,
> why is this the case? Of course it could just be me.
> 

See above.

> >> While other minorities have made
> >> progress in defining themselves as American and yet remaining culturally
> >> tied to their own roots, we Indian Americans are still a little confused
> >> as to whether we should stick to our own roots or go wholesale 'American.'
> 
> >Other minorities have made progress partly because they had more time
> >and partly because they make a conscious effort to positively project
> >their roots. This is especially true for asian-americans.
> 
> >For Indian-Americans they are indeed confused as you say. Perhaps with time
> >and effort such confusion would reduce.
> 
> If this argument were forwarded by anyone else, I would tend to agree with
> them. But Alok, just days ago you were condemning your own roots. It is IMHO
                                         ^^^^^^^^^^
Condemning is the wrong word. I said, I am questioning them.
Questioning is NOT condemning.

> hypocritical to say that we can advance ourselves by projecting our roots
> positively and then saying that you are ashamed of your roots. Which one is

Once again, a misleading statement. I said I am ashamed of the human rights
violations happening in India, not of my roots.

> your true view Alok? Perhaps you are one of the confused individuals :-).

Perhaps it is you :-) Perhaps we all are :-)

> >> The result is that those who stick to their roots do so vehemently and
> >> refuse to acknowledge the benefits of this society and those who emulate
> >> American pop culture completely ignore their roots. I think we will remain
> >> under-represented politically in this country until we find a middle
> >> ground that will allow us to be culturally aware of our roots and at the
> >> same time allow us to be accepted into mainstream American society.
> >>
> 
> >And that is one major reason why I decided to push for this group. This group
> >can be a stepping stone in developing a cultural middle ground , retaining
> >the good aspects of our INdian heritage and at the same time acquiring
> >the good aspects of the American society.
> 
> I was under the impression that this is why SCIA was formed. 
And that indeed is the primary reason why it was formed.

> But more and more
> I'm convinced it was formed more to protect you from the barbs of those who
> would refute you. 
If you like to believe that, you are entitled to.
But it is the view of those who are trying to destroy this group.

> If it was really your intention to turn SCIA into a group
> for those with problems or solutions to living in America you would have just
> kept quiet and let them flame away. But you keep exacerbating the situation.

It is possible that I have gotten dragged into the recent flames, however
to conclude on this basis what my intentions were is ridiculous.

> 
> >Not all is good in Indian heritage. Likewise not everything is hunkey-dorey
> >in America. Indian-Americans have this unique opportunity to be in touch
> >with both the Indian culture (through their own living in INdia or through
> >their parents, relatives, INdian friends etc.) and American society
> >(by virtue of living/working/growing up here).
> 
> Not all is good in Indian heritage indeed. But what gets me is people like
> you being ashamed of India. Not everything is well in America as you point
            ^^^^^^^
Once again you are misleading. What I said is that I have felt (lately)
ashamed of human rights violations in INdia.

> out correctly. But I have yet to find one single American who is ashamed of
> his country.
> 
There are many I have met. They cite specific issues though. Many Americans 
were ashamed of the actions taken in the Gulf last year.

Likewise I find the handling of Punjab and Kashmir problems in INdia
is something one ought to be ashamed of. Just think about how many innocent
citizens have died there.

> >Challenge is in translating this opportunity into action and this group
> >can provide a medium.
> 
> Again, IMO, I think it is foolish to believe that SCIA alone could solve
> all problems that IA's face in this country. 

I don't believe that it alone can solve all the problems. I never said that.

> But it could have been an invaluable tool for many people. 

Well it still is.

> It's too bad that you saw it fit to act in an unethical and immoral manner.

????????

> 
> >> Arijit.
> 
> >Alok
> 

Listen, you are now playing into the hands of those who don't want to see this
group develop. IT IS POSSIBLE THAT I MAY HAVE DONE THAT TOO RECENTLY.

> Arijit.

Alok