From: prem@cs.montana.edu (M.P.Premkumar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re: Reservation, Casteism and Hypocracy
Date: 20 Aug 92 18:07:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: coe.1992Aug20.180743.25801
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, MSU, Bozeman Mt 59717

In article <1992Aug18.130729.15534@utagraph.uta.edu> muthu@mecad.uta.edu (S.N. Muthukrishnan) writes:
>I was surprised to see the amount of hypocrats on this group! Oh! boy, what a  
>chaos! Eductaion has not driven sense into some (or should it be many ?). In  
>essence it seems that the educated  but still barbaric people were all moved  
>into sct. Why is everyone so fired up when the word Periyar, Brahmin and  
>reservation come up? Is it a sense of guilt.

No it is a clash of beliefs.

>
>Never have I seen or heard of a place as bad as TN. I sometimes feel so ashamed  
Have you seen other places at all ? I doubt it. Except for a few states all 
others are worse than TN. Born and bred in TN I would say TN is the best. But
I am willing to accept that some may be better but the "worst" ? No way !


>to mention the fact that I am from TN. Can anyone deny that?  Born as human  
>beings everyone has the equal right to justice in a society. The mistakes of  
>the past cannot be corrected by their descendants. 

Who else should do that ?

>Well, I know you want to  
>refuse that, but listen for a moment. What will build pride in some one who  
>does not make any effort for the fruits of hardwork? The sense of security that  
>exists today in reservation only tends to show how weak in mind people are. It  
>only shows how apprehensive one is.

Sorry pal you are wrong. There are more and more socially backward people in TN
who believe in themselves than there were before.

>
>Reservation in India and particularly TN is so biased that an average FC person  
>thinks twice before wanting to settle down in TN. 

It is upto the individual. Don't generalize.

>The standard of living in TN  
>has dropped considerably over the past two decades comparing it to the rest of  
>the country. Even a private company cannot have its own ways to recruit people.  
>It is the wish of the employer. If the government deals with businesses like  
>what they have done so far no business will flourish in TN. Look at for  
>instance the number of sick industries. How many engineering firms have been  
>setup in TN over the last two decades of the so called reformist rule. Nothing  
>has changed except the fact that

You are mixing politics with reservation. Mal administration is not an issue in
this ongoing discussion. And by the way will any other party(like the Congress)
do away with the reservations ? I can bet my fortune they won't.

>
> the percentage of reservation for nonFC communities have gone up.  
> the communities wanting to be declared backward has attracted demonstrations.
> hindibashing has been patronised.

It is not hindi bashing. It is hindi imposition bashing.

> implementing ridiculously costly schemes like noonmeal scheme for fetching 
>  votes.
> threatening employees with suspension for disobeying orders that are idiotic
>  and stupid.
> training people to elect uneducated, uncouth, filthy, corrupt politicians.
> training for goondaism (one of the only ism's to be patronised by the 
>  reformists).

Once again you are mixing politics here. Do you know of states called Bihar,
Haryana, Andhra ????? Goondaism is patronised by reformists ??????

>
>Before you reply to my claim that "TN in particular is a bad place to live in  
>for an FC", think about this. 
>
>1) Why in the world will one want to set up reservation based on the atrocities  
>(notice that I am not claiming what was done in the past was right) of the  
>past? Does'nt it lead to discrimination.

NO !!

>
>2) I don't say reservation should not have been made as the alternative to get  
>rid of the ills of the past, but is'nt there a way to do it.

Go ahead and propose one.

>
>3)Why does a FC student with 96% have to wait with anxiety if he/she would get  
>into a professional institution? Why does a BC/SC/ST student with 65% get into  
>engineering or medical school. What is the case if the FC student is poor and  
>the BC/SC/ST student is rich (stinkingly).

1. 96% in what ? Why are people so ambiguous when they make such allegations
knowing pretty well how professional admissions are done in TN ? Why don't you
talk about the total aggregate out of 250(200-MPC & 50-entrance) ?

2. 65% in what ? (refer to above) And are you kidding ? BC with 65% entering
Govt. colleges ? And why do you club BCs with SCs knowing pretty well the
cuttoffs and reservation percentages are different ?

3. Rich/Poor & FC/BC mmmm. Isn't that an isolated instance ? 


>
>Please take note of the point, that I hate to use the  adjectives of  
>FC/BC/SC/ST. I have to have some refernce to what the government means.
>
>4) The so called reformists are nothing more than selfish crooks. 

Reformists = ???. If you are referring to politicians you are dead right. But
I repeat politics is a different ball game.

>
>All those who have been into professional colleges through reservation should  
>sit back and think if what is being done now is right. Reservation has existed  
>for more than forty years, a time span sufficient to educate a totally new  
>generation. What happened to all these people who got their education through  
>reservation? 

They are fine.

>Why are they afraid to come out and say, we don't need reservation  
>any longer? 

Because they know that just because they have utilised and benifited 
reservations doesn't mean the problem is solved. They know there are still
millions who need reservations.

>Are they afraid? Do they think they are incapable of qualifying  
>without reservation? 

No.

>Let these prophets subscribing and talking act. I think  
>these people who talk are only capable of talking. They know nothing about  
>action. Their words are as separatist as their minds and their attitude. Those  
>who have enjoyed the fruits of reservation (that was a legitimate need) are  
>today backing off from their duty. Shedding their responsibilities they are all  
>out to ensure that the caste based reservation will exist for generations to  
>come.

Gross generalisation. But I accept many just want the reservations to continue
because of selfish interests. It is because of such selfish irrational people
that genuine arguments are also thrown to the dust bin by ati-reservation 
people.


>
>I wish education could inculcate some rational thinking in the minds of people.
>
>I don't care for TN. I do care for my relatives and friends who are going thro'  
>the agony of this hypocracy everday. 

Oops did I talk about selfish interests. I am sorry I didn't look below, your
broad mindedness.

>My sympathies are for them. They are _not_  
>for the FC/BC/SC/ST. 
>
>I issue a call for all those rational minded people to come forward and pledge  
>to end this reservation system followed in TN and in other parts of the country  
>I am unaware of.
>
>Muthukrishnan
>
>
>
>S. N. Muthukrishnan                    muthu@mecad.uta.edu (NeXT mail)
>Dept. of Mech. Engg., UT, Arlington    muthu@fem.uta.edu   (NeXT mail)
>Arlington, TX  76019
>


Sincerely yours,
M.P.Premkumar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil