HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Organization: Central Michigan University
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.seasia-l
Date:         Thu, 3 Sep 1992 06:06:49 EDT
From:         Elliott Parker <3ZLUFUR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:      HK: Re: refugees
X-To:         seasia-l@msu.edu

=======================  Forwarded  Message  ===========================
             (listserv and Ian's machine are fighting
             and sometimes won't let him post  :-)  )

Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 15:04:45 -0500
From: chai@cs.uiuc.edu
Subject: Re: AAAAARGH!!! NOT AGAIN!


Anyway, here it is:

Subject: Re: Refugees

>Mexico is not a good enough example; ok then, how about haiti for a nice brutal
>government.

True... but in this case, IMO, the US is wrong.

(BTW, I'm not the original poster.)

Anyway, what I say is colored by the fact that I am pro-open-travel -- ie.
people should be allowed to settle wherever they want and can find a job,
regardless of nationality, and after establishing residency, become full-
fledged tax-paying citizens and contribute to the local economy and politics.

I feel this way because I think nationalism -- discrimination against people
because of where they're born in -- is just as wrong as racism -- discrimination
agains people for what race they're born in. Neither is in the control of the
person in question and does not consider the merit of the person.

True, a very small percentage of people in the world actually manage to change
their nationality in their lifetime, but unless you're rich and/or can get an
education in a lucrative field, forget it. (Gone are the days of "Send me your
poor, your huddled masses yearning to be free" etc.)

>if everyone in the world who wanted to emigrate for political reaons
>was given the chance to do so, imagine the chaos.

True, immediate unrestricted travel would cause a period of difficulty until
adjustment has time to take place and it stablizes. (If a practical plan were
implemented, it would have to be gradual, with the bringing up of poor nations
into the world community.)

I think that eventually, everyone would be better off.

But that's just my opinion, and if you dislike it, you are entitled to your
own opinion.

Ian

P.S. Also, this is an "off-the-cuff" article so please forgive any mistakes.
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Organization: Central Michigan University
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Date:         Tue, 25 Aug 1992 16:49:08 EDT
From:         Elliott Parker <3ZLUFUR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:      TH: Startling survey findings
X-To:         seasia-l@msu.edu

=======================  Forwarded  Message  ===========================
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 00:25:13+0700
From: kamol@munnari.oz.au (Kamol Hengkietisak)

Samak reveals startling survey findings

     PRACHAKORN Thai leader Samak Sundaravej yesterday revealed a
surprising survey predicting the PTP will gain a clean sweep of
all 35 seats in Bangkok. It also claims people favour him as the
most suitable premier.
     Requests for comment on previous surveys which predict the
downfall of the PTP in the September election sparked Mr Samak
into claiming that a group called Huai Khwang 92 had made a
nationwide survey showing Prachakorn Thai will win all Bangkok
seats -- "with narrow victories in only a few constituencies".
     The PTP won two seats in Bangkok in the last election.
     According to other PTP candidates, the survey was made by
members throughout the country following the registration of
candidates and the outcome was presented to party executives
yesterday.
     PTP members actually did not want him to reveal the findings
because they expected the Press would not publish the "clean
sweep" prediction, Mr Samak claimed.
     According to Mr Samak, those surveyed consider him most
suitable as prime minister because he is a party leader and used
to be deputy premier, was a minister five times and headed several
parliamentary committees.
     Mr Samak alleged it is only the Press that does not support
him.
     "Prachakorn Thai, under the pretext of moral principles,
neither led people to death nor damaged the national economy.
Which other party should be supported? Did Samak lead people to
Phan Fa, stand on a car and ring a bell (during the May events)?"
Mr Samak said.
     Mr Samak said he intends to convey the PTP's policies
directly to the public in a live telecast on September 9 and the
May events will be mentioned during 30% of the two-hour programme.
     If elected to Parliament, the PTP will vote against the
executive amnesty decree pardoning all those involved in the May
events, he said.
     This was because the PTP wanted those involved in the
incident to be arrested, he said. Unlike the demonstrators,
soldiers would not be affected because their crackdown was
legitimate according to the law.
     Responding to PollWatch members' claims that five PTP
candidates were involved in vote-cheating, Mr Samak challenged
whether PollWatch dared to identify the candidates.
     If PollWatch is courageous enough, it should ask the Interior
Ministry to ban yellow slips from being used in place of ID cards
on election day, Mr Samak said, adding tens of thousands of the
slips have been used to benefit some parties in the election.
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Date:         Mon, 31 Aug 1992 10:45:08 -0700
From:         DWONG@POMONA.CLAREMONT.EDU
Subject:      Thai dance troupe tour

To answer Christopher Reznich's question (you didn't include
your e-mail address), I *think* the National Theater troupe
will be performing in Chicago and Cleveland as well; as far
as I know, they won't be getting out to the West coast at all.
For more info, write to me directly.

Deborah Wong
DWONG@POMONA.CLAREMONT.EDU
DWONG@POMONA
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X-Organization: City Polytechnic of Hong Kong
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Date:         Tue, 1 Sep 1992 15:47:00 +8
From:         ISROBERT@CPHKVX.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Refugees

ok then, here is a slightly more comprehensive reply, tho'
i wonder if it is worth the effort.
has anyone out there actually visited a camp?
it is true that on ONE occasion vietnamese were dragged screaming and
complaining onto an aircraft. that has never been repeated, and forced
repatriations now progress more calmly.
So far this year, 13 refugees have arrived, hardly what i would call
`the refugees continue to pour in at record numbers [sic]'
a lot of the original REFUGEES report is studded with facts - how many are
documented? no sources are given, eg: `on top of this, refugeea are
given inadequate counseling [sic] by case workers who are hostile to them'.
or: `Economic migrants MIGHT account for five percent of the boat people
and this is probably a very generous figure' {please note the might and probably
   }.
Mexico is not a good enough example; ok then, how about haiti for a nice brutal
government.
vietnam is very keen to get economic sanctions against it imposed by the US and
supported {with varying degrees of willingness} by many other states lifted -
oppression of returned refugees is not going to ease this process. at present
the eec has a large investment programme in vietnam, not only
for returnees but also for those who never left in the first place.
Vietnam appears to be changing, with expanding economic ties, as
sometimes related in this list, with the fall of the USSR and consequent
effects in Cam Ranh Bay, and there is hope that a more stable future
may be envisaged with the re-integration of vietnam into the world
community. it is a complex issue, tied up with MIAs, US foreign policy, face,
and a whole host of other issues.
the end is not in sight, nor is that of the refugees themselves, but things
are getting better.
if everyone in the world who wanted to emigrate for political reaons
was given the chance to do so, imagine the chaos.

and for economic reasons?!

robert davison, city polytechnic of hong kong
isrobert@cphkvx.bitnet
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Date:         Sun, 30 Aug 1992 16:11:05 -0400
From:         Nhan Tran <tran@PEORA.SDC.CCUR.COM>
Subject:      NEWS/VN: VN ship attacked by pirates in Hongkong waters
X-To:         FISHLM%SNYBUFVA@pucc.princeton.edu, scv@media.mit.edu,
              seasia-l@msu.BITNET, vietnam@cco.caltech.edu, vn-news@saigon.com

08/29

VIETNAM SHIP ATTACKED BY PIRATES IN H.K. WATERS

    HONG KONG, Aug 29, Reuter - A Vietnamese-registered cargo ship was attacked
by suspected Chinese pirates in Hong Kong waters and held for five hours in the
latest of a spate of raids on Indochina-bound ships.
    The cargo ship Tramy sent out a distress signal late on Friday saying it was
being chased by speedboats with armed men on board about two miles southwest of
Stanley beach, a popular weekend resort and residential area.
    It was released five hours later, early on Saturday. No injuries were
reported and the vessel has resumed its passage to north Vietnam, Security
Branch spokesman Peter Randall said on Saturday. No further details of the
attack were available.
    Acting Deputy Secretary for Security Ian Strachan said the government had
contacted Chinese authorities for clarification.
    "We would like to know what their response is to this, whether or not those
people were from the government or not before we decide what our next move will
be," Strachan told government RTHK radio.
    The incident is the latest in a wave of attacks on Indochina-bound ships
which Hong Kong shipping agents have blamed on Chinese officials. Agents say
Chinese authorities have been seizing registration papers and confiscating
cargo.
    But many of the incidents -- shipping agents have reported 14 in the past
five weeks -- are ignored by Hong Kong officials because they take place outside
the territory's waters. Officials say it could be part of a Chinese crackdown on
smuggling.
    Peter Randall, a Security Branch Information Officer, said the government
had begun investigations into Friday's incident.
    "Initial reports from them (Chinese authorities) say this is part of
cracking down on smuggling activities. But this is denied by the shipping agents
whose ships were involved."
    A Cambodia-bound ship, the Song Tien 2, on Saturday sent a message to its
agent, Junlick Shipping Company in Hong Kong, asking for help to secure the
release of its crew, arrested at Zhuhai port in southern China.
    Junlick representative William Lo said the ship, which left Hong Kong on
Friday, was carrying Chinese-made goods for Beijing's diplomatic mission in
Phnom Penh.
    "I'm very unhappy with the Hong Kong government because they say it's not
their business as it happened outside Hong Kong waters," said Lo.
    "Those pirates are already controlling the waters. That means our harbour
has been sealed off. So we can't do any business. What are we supposed to do --
play the stock market and the property market?"
    "Many clients are already cancelling their orders because of these
incidents," he said.
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Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 1992 11:55:37 EDT
From:         Jody.Diamond@DARTMOUTH.EDU
Subject:      Wayang Announcement
X-To:         "sea-music@mailserver.sfu.ca" <sea-music@whistler.sfu.ca>,
              "SEASIA-L@MSU" <SEASIA-L@MSU.BITNET>

--- Forwarded Message from Marc Hoffman <marros@igc.apc.org> ---



In celebration of Indonesian Independence Day, the Embassy of
Indonesia, in cooperation with the Washington Gamelan Society,
presents a performance of:

INDONESIAN WAYANG KULIT
(SHADOW PUPPET PLAY)

Six-hour presentation of the Ramayana performed by 4 puppeteers:
Soeprapto, M. Hoffman, R. Hadiwijoyo, and S. Siswojo.

September 12, 1992 at 7:00 pm at the Embassy of Indonesia, 2020
Massachusetts Avenue, N.W. , Washington, D.C.

Open to the public free of charge.  Seating is limited.  For
reservations and information call:  202 775-5275 or 202 775-5270.

MUCH OF THE PERFORMANCE WILL BE IN ENGLISH.  ACCOMPANIED BY FULL
GAMELAN ORCHESTRA


To musicians of Javanese gamelan--

We are giving a 6 hour wayang on Saturday, September 12, 1992 at
the Indonesian Embassy in Washington, D.C. and gamelan musicians
are especially welcome to come and be with us.  If you are
interested in coming, please get in touch with me at
marros@igc.org or call 301 585-7601.

Marc Hoffman
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Organization: Central Michigan University
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.seasia-l
Date:         Wed, 26 Aug 1992 06:51:01 EDT
From:         Elliott Parker <3ZLUFUR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:      TH: Nukul wants more priv. sect. bus routes
X-To:         seasia-l@msu.edu

=======================  Forwarded  Message  ===========================
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 23:33:46+0700
From: kamol@munnari.oz.au (Kamol Hengkietisak)

     TRANSPORT and Communications Minister Nukul Prachuabmoh
yesterday said that he wants the private sector to operate more
bus routes which are currently run by the Bangkok Mass Transit
Authority in an effort to improve services.
     Mr Nukul said he has told this to the BMTA because past
improvements were unsatisfactory.
     The private sector has taken over running city buses on 12
routes but he wants them to do more.
     "We will increase private sector participation by whatever
means. The administration of the bus service must be better. I am
after them about it all the time," Mr Nukul said.
     The public has protested against plans to raise the bus fare
by 50 satang on the first of next month.
     Mr Nukul defended the increase, saying that bus fares had not
gone up for a long time.
     If the fare is kept the same, the only alternative would be
for the Government to subsidise the BMTA, which is not right. The
Government has already spent over 10,000 million baht on the BMTA,
he said.
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Date:         Thu, 3 Sep 1992 14:49:28 CDT
From:         Ian Chai <chai@SUMTER.CSO.UIUC.EDU>
Subject:      Indonesia; new way to post

Elliott: I am trying to get around my posting problems by signing on this
account to SEASIA and trying the posts from here... still at the same univeristy
so I don't know if it'll have the same problems or not...

Anyway, to Daniel Saptura's comment:
>Even right now nobody talk about the meeting of the non-aligned movement (NAM)
>which were held in Jakarta

I thought of forwarding the Clarinet article about it but Clarinet is a
commercial venture and it infringes on their copyright to forward wholesale
and I didn't feel like re-stating it in my own words...

However, if there's great interest, let me know and I'll try to summarize.

Ian
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Organization: Central Michigan University
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Date:         Sun, 30 Aug 1992 08:22:26 EDT
From:         Elliott Parker <3ZLUFUR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:      SEA: Citations on journalism
X-To:         seasia-l@msu.edu

     Some citations not in the mainstream of SEA studies that may
still be of interest:

Martin Smith, "State of fear: Censorship in Burma (Myanmar),"
(Article 19 Pub., 1991, ISBN 1 870798 71 6).

The Committee to Protect Journalists, "In the censor's shadow:
Journalism in Suharto's Indonesia (With an update on the massacre
in Dili)" (Committee to Protect Journalists, 1991, ISBN 0-944823-
04-1).

The Committee to Protect Journalists, "Frontline reports,"
(Committee to Protect Journalists, 1992, ISBN 0-944823-07-6);
includes "First-Person accounts of a massacre in Dili, East
Timor, November 12, 1991," by Allan Nairn and Amy Goodman, pp. 9-
15 and "Press and state in Southeast Asia," by James Clad, pp.
29-44.

Neill McKee, <Social Mobilization & Social marketing in
developing countries:  Lessons for communicators> (Southbound, 9
College Sq., 10250 Penang, Malaysia, 1992, ISBN 983-9054-01-5).

Brigid Schulte, "Why did press ignore East Timor massacre?," in
<Washington Journalism Review>, July-Aug 1992, p. 12.

The following are in <The Pacific> ( U. of California, Graduate
School of Journalism, Berkeley, CA 94720, Spring 1992, no ISSN
given):

Khunthong Lawserivanich, "Exploring the Thai Press: Self-
censorship allows the Thai press to maintain its freedom," pp. 7,
9.

Slamet Djabarudi, "Word against word in Indonesia: A rape case
and its coverage lead to international attention," pp. 12-13.

This issue also includes pieces on Nepal, Sri Lanka, American
Samoa, Fiji, Taiwan, Japan, India, and China.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Elliott Parker                 BITNET: 3ZLUFUR@CMUVM
Journalism Dept.               Internet: 3zlufur@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu
Central Michigan University    Compuserve: 70701,520
Mt. Pleasant, MI 48859 USA     The WELL: eparker@well.sf.ca.us
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Date:         Wed, 2 Sep 1992 14:10:06 -0400
From:         Nhan Tran <tran@PEORA.SDC.CCUR.COM>
Subject:      CAM: Phnom Penh proposes presidential election
X-To:         FISHLM%SNYBUFVA@pucc.princeton.edu, seasia-l@msu.BITNET

08/24

PHNOM PENH PROPOSES PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION

    By Kevin Cooney
    PHNOM PENH, Aug 24, Reuter - The Phnom Penh government proposed on Monday
that Cambodia hold a presidential election to anoint Prince Norodom Sihanouk as
head of state.
    "The successful election by the Cambodian parties and the Cambodian people
of their national leader would constitute a big national pride and a great
success of the policy of national reconciliation in Cambodia," the government
said in a document distributed to diplomats.
    The diplomatic corps had gathered for another meeting of the Supreme
National Council (SNC) representing the administration and its three former
guerrilla enemies including the Khmer Rouge.
    Khmer Rouge leaders still attend the council even though they have refused
to disarm most of their men under the latest stage of the United
Nations-sponsored peace plan.
    The meeting was held in one of the palaces of Sihanouk's royal compound. He
has ruled as head of state, acknowledged by all factions, since returning from
exile last October.
    Sihanouk has dominated Cambodian politics for decades as a boy god-king, as
a prime minister and as figurehead president under the Khmer Rouge.
    Diplomats said he had been actively campaigning for a presidential poll
before parliamentary elections due next May under the peace treaty signed in
Paris last October.
    The Phnom Penh government "gives its unwavering support to the prince's
candidacy for the position of the president or head of state so as to provide
Cambodia with a president or head of state enjoying complete authority and
serving as the solid foundation of the nation and people as well as the core for
unifying the political forces," the document said.
    The government, installed by Vietnam in January 1979 after its invading
soldiers drove the Khmer Rouge from power, said a presidential vote would not
interfere with the parliamentary elections.
    "The fact that Cambodia has its president or head of state legitimately and
directly elected by the Cambodian people would only help in the implementation
of the Paris agreements, especially in promoting a neutral environment and
stability..." it said.
    Khieu Samphan, titular leader of the Khmer Rouge which put Cambodia through
a reign of terror in the 1970s that killed a million people, on Monday rejected
an electoral law adopted by U.N. Cambodia chief Yasushi Akashi at an SNC meeting
earlier this month.
    He said in a statement the electoral law played into the hands of the
Vietnamese, which the Khmer Rouge says is out to colonise its smaller neighbour.
    Khieu Samphan said Hanoi's intentions "hang like the Sword of Damocles over
the heads of all the Cambodian people."
    The United Nations says the Khmer Rouge has offered no evidence to support
its claims that Vietnam is still militarily active in Cambodia.
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Date:         Tue, 25 Aug 1992 17:12:53 -0400
From:         Joyce Brabner <ah881@CLEVELAND.FREENET.EDU>
Subject:      What NGOs in Cambodia Are Helping Families Reunite?
X-To:         SEASIA-L%MSU.BITNET@cunyvm.CUNY.Edu

After many years of forced separation, my friend is going back
to Phnom Penh, to see her family.  MN has been living in Los
Angeles with her 3 children.  She speaks "survival" English, and
has saved up her ticket money by sewing clothing, and working in
a donut shop.  She's a smart, brave woman who depends on her 18
year old daughter to translate, when dealing with U.S. red tape.

MN's daughter has asked me to find out about U.S.-connected
NGOs now working in, or near, Phnom Penh because it's possible
that MN's elderly father may want to come live with her in the U.S.
There may be other ways that refugee or relief organizations
can help or advise MN.  She will be in Cambodia for a month, and
it's likely that something like this may take longer.  We imagine
that this family might start thinking about what's possible during
MN's visit, and that both sides could continue to work things out
through offices based in the States and Phnom Penh.

I think the American Friends Service Committee has an office
in Phnom Penh, and you may know of other groups.  Please e-mail
any suggestions, phone numbers, addresses or names of contact
people to me.  & Thanks!

--
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Organization: Central Michigan University
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Date:         Tue, 25 Aug 1992 16:44:47 EDT
From:         Elliott Parker <3ZLUFUR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:      TH: Kasem adds weight to mirror assembly
X-To:         seasia-l@msu.edu

=======================  Forwarded  Message  ===========================
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 00:21:36+0700
From: kamol@munnari.oz.au (Kamol Hengkietisak)

     THE proposal to set up a mirror assembly is not damaging and
will not spoil the political atmosphere surrounding the general
election, PollWatch Commission chairman Kasem Suwannagul said
yesterday.
     Dr Kasem, also deputy prime minister and university affairs
bureau minister, said there was nothing wrong with the idea and
academics should not be afraid to express their opinion.
     A group of 115 persons, led by respected political scientist
Prof Chai-Anan Samudavanija, petitioned His Majesty the King
recently to appoint a National Assembly, comprising
representatives from all walks of life, to serve as a forum where
people could express their wishes and opinions for the Parliament
to consider and to promote ideas on constitutional amendments.
     They also urged His Majesty to delay royal endorsement of the
charter amendment requiring the prime minister to be an elected MP
until a new government is formed.
     This was primarily aimed at preventing the status of
non-elected Prime Minister Anand Panyarachun from being put to
question.
     Dr Kasem said those who do not agree with the idea also have
the right to express their opinion.
     "But academics value freedom of expression more than anything
else. I do not think that the mirror assembly proposal has spoiled
the election atmosphere because the Constitution has already been
amended and no one can change that," Dr Kasem said.
     He said the academics also respect the opinion of others
which in itself is a great quality and those who cannot accept
different opinions lack that spirit.
     On the criticism that if the academics were looking for a
political role they should run for Parliament, Dr Kasem said there
were many ways to participate in politics but the more important
question was what steps one must take to strengthen the system.
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