From: uunet!infmx!robert@ncar.UCAR.EDU (Robert Coleman)
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Subject: Re: Shaming men's sexuality
Date: 15 Dec 1992 15:57:53 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
Originator: muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu

cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:

>In article <1g80lcINN1b6@agate.berkeley.edu> rhb@world.std.com (Robert H Brueckner) writes:
>>In article <1g435qINName@agate.berkeley.edu> spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope) writes:
>>
>>   If by "men's" magazines you refer to soft-core pornography,
>>   I have read that in the United States 90% of
>>   men and 70% of women at least occasionally read or view
>>   such material.  Are you saying that all (or even most)
>>   of these people suffer from low self-esteem and feelings of
>>   inadequacy?  This seems really far-fetched.
>>
>>   Why do you believe this?  
>>   Steve
>>
>>I believe it because it's true. Apart from the fact that pornography
>>presents an unrealistic view (no pun intended) of the opposite sex, it
>>is also usually an "objectified" view. I don't believe it is erotic in
>>the way art is erotic, drawing out some hidden truth that makes us
>>understand more about the subject and our own sensuality. I think it
>>merely caters to the baser male presumptions about women and their
>>"uses."

>Every single man I've known who consumes porn regularly has laughed
>uproariously at the joke that says "What's the quickest way to bring a
>woman to orgasm?"  The answer is "Who cares?"  And porn suppliers claim
>to be combatting sexual repression?  Something is obviously not getting
>through.

	The punchline has two interpretations.  It seems dumb to me in the
first, which is "who cares about womens' orgasms", 'cause much if not most
of my enjoyment comes from pleasuring my partner.
	But the second one is, "Who cares what the *quickest* way is?  Why
would I want to end the sex act (for those women who aren't interested in
more than one orgasm, or who's orgasms are multi-orgasmic in the first place)
in 60 seconds or less?"
	Yeah, I got a laugh out of *that*.

	So, I'm afraid you're going to have to go back and ask them *why*
they laughed.	

	(Oh, and regardless, your sample set is too small to draw conclusions
from, unless you know a few hundred thousand men who regularly consume
pornography.)

	I know of one survey where a bunch of college women were herded into
an X-rated movie, and given opinion surveys about women's issues which were
correlated with their opinions about the movies.  Some control groups were
done, including a group of men who were regular patrons of the theatre.
	To the surveyors surprise, the men who were regular patrons scored
*higher* on the "openness to women's issues" scale than the college women!

	Of course, the connection with "sexual repression" in the above
story is small...but it's still amusing.

Robert C.
-- 
----------------------------------------------
Disclaimer: My company has not yet seen fit to
	    elect me as spokesperson. Hmmpf.


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