From: mick@maxine.wpi.edu (Ravi Narayan)
Subject: Re: rec.moto.harley
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 14:42:32 GMT

Somewhere, Sometime, Thus Spake jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard):
:- 
:- Bzzt. The entire group creation process is conducted in news.groups and not
:- the affected group in large part *exactly* so that "anyone out there on
:- Usenet" can participate and vote intelligently.
                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

	in essence therefore, the voting process is directed not at
	anyone out there, but at people who can participate and vote
	with intelligence... note the word directed (as against "meant
	for"). anyone with any "god-given" cause can of course vote, but
	i would hope the voting process is not directed at them. an
	intelligent voter is one who understands and appreciates the
	issues involved, studies the charter, and ascertains the need
	and justification (not the same thing) for a new group *based*
	on the information provided in the charter. someone who has
	little understanding of the issues and proudly proclaims it (as
	Joel did) presents his opinions from the viewpoint of one who
	views this issue as a self-righteous cause (as chuck rogers
	argues) maybe due to the perception of the general public of
	harley-davidson as some kind of symbol of american retaliation
	to japanese domination (it wouldnt make a difference to such
	people if harley-davidson was a motherboard manufacturer), which
	largely neglects and underplays, to its own detrimental value,
	the fact that they are efficient and beautiful motorcycles.
	(there is also a section of the general public which views a
	rider on a harley-davidson as a potential rapist of their
	daughters, and i would, under the circumstances, encourage the
	anti-harley bigots to bring this perception to the fore-front to
	generate "no" votes, *if* i were to adopt such an attitude
	towards the voting process).

	"affected group" members have access to news.groups as well as
	rec.motorcycles and cannot be denied the opportunity to express
	their opinions/cast their vote, even if the "anti-harley" bigots
	want to keep them away.

:- feel that there is no longer a place for them in r.m. It is those folks who
:- have convinced me that there is a place for a group for them.

	this then is the essential piece of advice to the voter, if
	she/he needs any, ..... study the charter and if *convinced*
	about the justification for the newsgroup, then do vote yes.

:- I've voted YES on r.m.h.Just to sway you to go ahead and send in that NO vote
:- you're itching to knee-jerk your mailer into sending,

	and not for some reason like this.

:- I also favor helmet laws.

	i am not surprised.

:- (I've cleaned up too many dead, helmetless motorcyclists off the roads
:- to believe otherwise. EMT-P is the abbreviation for paramedic.)

	misuse of logic and lack of an understanding of causation. 95%
	of those bikers you scraped off the road might still be dead,
	even if they had been wearing a helmet. "not wearing" a helmet
	does not lead to death, but "stupid riding" might. (note: i do
	wear a helmet at all times. refer to rec.moto post by pooder for
	a neat summation).

:- (Helmet law flames via email, please.) 

	since he posted this in public bringing in a new issue, i
	respond in public. i would suggest further follow-ups to
	rec.motorcycles on the helmet issue.

	happy riding,

	- ravi

	Dis: my views and opinions do not in any way represent those of
	Worcester Polytechnic Institute. the loss is not mine.

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.sig (n): a piece of mail with a fool at one  :  Ravi Narayan, CS, WPI   (0)
          end and flames at the other. (C).   :  DoD# tan90-SuzukiGS500E  H
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