HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu (Robert Fentiman)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Thrawn & Pellaeon
Date: 18 Dec 1992 00:37:36 -0600
Organization: University of Minnesota, Duluth
NNTP-Posting-Host: ub.d.umn.edu

In article <ofAIwT_00WB30bI3sX@andrew.cmu.edu> Robert Edward Timlin <rt16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>     Having freshly re-read both Heir to the Empire and Dark Force Rising, I
>was struck by a strange thought - the Empire is being lead by Sherlock Holmes
>and Dr. Watson. Seriously! The only thing that's missing is for Thrawn to
>quip, "Elementary, my dear Pellaeon," at some point.
        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Actually, as a piece of trivia, the line "Elementary, my dear Watson"
was never said by Holmes.  He did use the word "Elementary" and the
phrase "my dear Watson" a bit, but NEVER together like that.  Of course
this bit of information is really useless (unless you're playing
'Trivial Persuit').

>     The image is strongest in HTTE, and once I thought of it, I couldn't get
>it out of my head. I just see Thrawn sitting there in cap & cape, smoking a
>pipe while explaining things to Pellaeon.
>
>     Anybody else get this impression? I swear, almost seems like Zahn did it
>intentionally. Or I am just overstressed from finals and totally looney? :-)
>
>                                                -Robb Timlin
>                                                 rt16@andrew.cmu.edu

Now that I think about it, I suppose I could conjure up that immage. 
Sometimes, I think, that Thrawn gets too accurate a conclusion for the
facts he is given.  He seems deductive, but an awfull lot of his
conclusions are based on conjecture.  He assumes things for fact that no
one could know for sure without godlike (or narrator like) knowlege.

Holmes, on the other hand, worked entirely on fact.  His saying (that
should probably be attributed to Doyle) that once you eliminate all the
probabilities, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the
truth.  Thrawn seems to skip much of the elimination process, but comes
up with some incredibly accurate guesses.

	Thanks
	Robert Fentiman

UseNet: rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu
At: University of Minnesota, Duluth
From: PHT007%SIRIUS.UKC.AC.UK@ib.rl.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Winter as a spie.
Date: 12 Dec 1992 11:26:51 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

In response to Donald Blewetts mail about the possibility of Winter being
Thrawns spy, I would have to agree that I have felt that there was something
fishy about her, after only having read the first book (I'm waiting for DFR to
come out in P/Back in England)

Dirk Gently

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: jmars@mta.ca (Jennifer K. Mars)
Subject: John Williams
Reply-To: jmars@mta.ca
Organization: Mount Allison U, Sackville, N.B. Canada 
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 17:21:53 GMT

I haven't heard the Home Alone 2 soundtrack, but lifting your own
themes is scarcely a rare thing in movie soundtracks.  Batman
has elements of Beetlejuice, etc., etc.  You have to remember that
composition for an entire film is not only difficult but it's a
rushed process. Timing is difficult too - a scene is xx:xx minutes
long and the music has to match that exactly. It's therefore
unsuprising that a composer would draw not only on other works but
on his own - and even get a bit redundant. Working under deadlines
where creativity is involved generally calls for some artistic
compromise.

Of course as a consumer/listener I *wish* every movie and could be
as carefully composed as a concerto... but if wishes were Tauntauns
we all would ride. :-)

-Jen.
From: pml3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (Paul Michael Lewis)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Star Wars is NOT literature
Date: 17 Dec 92 20:24:57 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

I have no objection to people enjoying Star Wars.  That's fine.  I grew up
with the movies, too, but I know where to draw the line.

The problem arises when people overanalyze the movies.  They are NOT
literature.  IMO, they aren't even well written.  When interpolating what
Lucas 'might have meant' or 'implied', that's where the pitfall arises.

Hollywood doesn't intend to produce well-written or meaningful entertainment.
Star Wars was not produced to induce thought or empathy.  Star Wars was simply
eye candy.  A lot of neat space ships, cool costumes, and a couple good actors.
Over analyzing something that was intended for good-natured entertainment is
like getting blood from a stone.

This is not a flame or even a criticism.  The movies were good, but I think
they have to be put into perspective.


-- 

+-| Paul Lewis |--| Jonestown: WLVR 91.3fm  Monday 11pm-1am |-+-------------+
|  'I'd love to turn you on.'                  -The Beatles   |             |
|  'You should be with us, feeling like we do  -Perry Farrell |     1       |
|   like you love to, but never will again.'                  |    2 3      |
|  'The struggle between God and man breaks    -Kazantzakis   |             |
|   out in everyone.'                                         | Renaissance |
From: cottoncp@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Chad P Cotton)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Darth Vader's voice
Date: 18 Dec 1992 05:30:27 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department at Rose-Hulman
Reply-To: cottoncp@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Chad P Cotton)
NNTP-Posting-Host: o233-04.nextwork.rose-hulman.edu

In article <AKHIL.92Dec16142423@stokes.ae.utexas.edu>  
akhil@stokes.ae.utexas.edu (Akhil Vidwans) writes:
> 
> Has anyone noticed how DV's voice ( courtesy JEJ )
> changes during the course of the triology? 

	This may also be due to Mr. Earl Jones becoming used to being the  
voice of ol' Darth (what a strange name, what might it infer?).  I have  
done a few productions myself, non-professional, and I could tell that as  
I became accustomed to playing my role that the style of my character  
changed.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chad P. Cotton				|  "I want to know God's thoughts;
Class 1995				|     the rest are details."
Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology	|		- Albert Einstein
Terre Haute, IN				|
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: mcmahan@cs.unca.edu (Scott McMahan -- Genesis mailing list owner)
Subject: Re: why don't all you star wars fans get a life -- Some new ?'s
Organization: University of North Carolina at Asheville
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 20:11:13 GMT

Bradley Larsen u (lars4752@mach1.wlu.ca) wrote:
: In TESB, why the heck does Vader torture Solo?  Even Solo himself says they
: didn't ask him any questions.

To trap Luke! On Dagobah, Luke can feel something wrong with his
friends, and rushes off w/o completing his training.

: In ROTJ don't you think Leia and Luke should have been a little more 'banged
: up' after they fall off their speeder bikes?  

No, they were wearing their helmets.

: In ANH, is Greedo considered to be a bounty hunter or just one of Jabba's
: 'henchmen'?

I imagine that he'd do either for the cash. Being a bounty hunter
on Tatooine seems to me like it would mean working for Jabba, 
since he's the head honcho and there aren't any other powerful
underworld figures around.

What puzzles me is why an amphibious person would
be on Tatooine in the first place.

: In TESB, who is this Hobby that Luke keeps referring to during the
: snowspeeder scenes?  He's obviously must be a pilot, but why is he cut from
: the film?

They wanted more $$$ for special effects? I dunno. He's just
one of the pilots.

Scott
From: finton@barney.cs.wisc.edu (David J. Finton)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Yoda quote
Summary: ? "No think.  Only do."
Date: 16 Dec 92 21:03:07 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison -- Computer Sciences Dept.

My brother gave me a Yoda quote, and I'm wondering if he got it right:
              "No think. Only do."
I don't remember this one;  what I remember is "There is no try;  only do."

Can anyone verify whether Yoda says either of these, or something close?

Thanks,

David Finton
finton@cs.wisc.edu
From: ss@wpi.WPI.EDU (Scott Streeter)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Imperial Shuttles
Date: 14 Dec 92 14:02:32
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA 01609-2280
	<1992Dec11.214338.18542@wheaton.wheaton.edu>
	<SS.92Dec14074434@wpi.WPI.EDU> <Bz9Hs0.733@news.cso.uiuc.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpi.wpi.edu
In-reply-to: caine@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu's message of 14 Dec 92 18:23:58 GMT

>>>>> On 14 Dec 92 18:23:58 GMT, caine@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Dark Lord of the Sith) said:

>Well since X-wing (actually all Rebel fighters) have hyperspace
>capability, equiping the shuttle would seem reasonable. It was also
>fully armed too. If you notice (easier seen on the model kit) there
>are laser turrets on the front, and back. Carrying top level personel
>like the Emperor and Vader would demand the Shuttle to take on
>offensive and defensive tactics, if attacked.

caine> Correction---> X-Wing fighters do not have hyperspace
caine> capabilities.  However, they can be fitted with the hyperdrive
caine> engines.  As far as I know, Luke's X-Wing is the only one with
caine> hyperdrive.  It's in the Star Wars Sourcebook and in the
caine> Timothy Zahn books Star Wars: "Heir To The Empire" and "Dark
caine> Force Rising."

Well then why is it that all the fighters at the end of Jedi all did a
hyperspace jump to the Death Star?

--
 Scott Streeter                             Visit the Star Wars Archive at
 ss@wpi.wpi.edu                             wpi.wpi.edu       130.215.24.1
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: jort@swi.psy.uva.nl (Jort Okhuijzen)
Subject: Re: Star Wars MUD
Organization: Social Science Informatics
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 06:57:44 GMT

HDW@UCSVAX.UCS.UMASS.EDU (H D WALDEN) writes:

>In <1992Dec15.045350.17317@njitgw.njit.edu> jlv3566@hertz.njit.edu writes:

>> 
>> does anyone knoiw the adress where i can get a Mud program as well as a telnet site for mudding.... I believe it was 130.161.144.22 but i am not sure can someone verify this for me thanx

> 	The Star Wars MUD is located at 130.161.144.22.
Indeed, its called KoBra (after the initiators) and can be reached at port
8888, hence telnet 130.161.144.22 8888.

Jort

>-dave

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: sche7135@mach1.wlu.ca (Scott Schelter u)
Subject: Favorite SW Moments
Organization: Wilfrid Laurier University
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 20:40:21 GMT

      My All-Time favorite moment in the SW films is near the end of ROTJ.
Lando has just blown up the power tower in the Death Star II, and the Falcon
is racing out before the whole thing blows up. This entire scene is great,
but the best part if when the MF shoots out through the flames back into
space.

      This is just incredible. Every time I see the film, the adrenaline
starts to get to me even though I know the outcome. THAT is truly excellent
FX.
From: tlg4@po.CWRU.Edu (TJ Goldstein)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: why don't all you star wars fans get a life
Date: 13 Dec 1992 00:28:46 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: tlg4@po.CWRU.Edu (TJ Goldstein)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc5.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, dkemper@oolong.hacks.arizona.edu (David Kemper) says:

>>Actually, I thought that most of the responses were amusing and
>>delightfully cutting, not to mention intelligence.
>
>True, in some cases, but while they amuse you they also amuse the original 
>poster, which is probably what he was after: cheap kicks from getting 
>flamed left and right.  Someone sent me mail calling such posts 
>"flame-bait," and that seems as good a term to me as any.

I'm afraid that you're probably right, in this case.  Though, by the
time he gets his account back all of these messages will probably have
expired ...

>
>Many schools have rules that state that their machines can only be used for 
>class-related work.  Anyone who posts to this group from such a site (other 
>than the occasional "I need such-and-such info from the trilogy for a 
>paper" posts) is breaking the rules at that site.
>
>Scott took it upon himself to "police" the net, informing the 
>administartors of a post that he personally didn't like that originated 
>from their site.  In order for him to be fair, he should send mail to the 
>sysop of EVERY post that comes from a .edu site, informing them how their 
>resources are being used.  Then it would be up to the individual sites to 
>enforce their rules if any applied.  Instead, Scott chose to single out one 
>post because he didn't agree with it.

Perhaps I'm naive, but I think that if a university didn't want its
students to post to a group like this, they wouldn't subscribe to it.
Or if they did, they wouldn't grant write-access.

Plus, just as a side note, not every adress ending in ".edu"
is a school account.  For example, those ending in 
:@Cleveland.Freenet.edu" are community accounts, but they
originate at Case Western Reserve University.  They are NOT
students, but just ordinary people who have had write-access
for, what, a year?

-- 
Assistant Sysop, SF&F Sig       (GO SCIFI)|TJ Goldstein
Primary Sysop, CWRU Safety Sig (GO SAFETY)|tlg4@Cleveland.Freenet.Edu
Chat Coord., Academy One Sim's   (GO ACAD)|
                   It's not my fault, I had pneumonia.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: medwards@qualcom.qualcomm.com (Matt Edwards)
Subject: Re: Melting SW toys
Organization: Qualcomm, Inc., San Diego, CA
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 22:29:16 GMT


My friend and I used to play 'space battle' with the x-wing and
tie fighter and ram the two of them together as hard as we could.
I remember breaking off the x-wings that way *grin*
I also remember supergluing and then epoxying the tie fighter
wings into the tie fighter when they wouldn't stay any more.

Of course the worst memory was taking all my large size figures
outside to my moms garage sale and asking $1.00 each for them
for some reason.  What the f*ck was I thinking?!?!?

Thankfully nobody bought them.  One lady was going to but wouldn't pay
more than 50 cents for each.
From: jseaver@bigwpi.WPI.EDU (Jason John Seaver)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Thrawn & Pellaeon
Date: 18 Dec 1992 13:21:36 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: bigwpi.wpi.edu

In article <ofAIwT_00WB30bI3sX@andrew.cmu.edu> Robert Edward Timlin <rt16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>     Having freshly re-read both Heir to the Empire and Dark Force Rising, I
>was struck by a strange thought - the Empire is being lead by Sherlock Holmes
>and Dr. Watson. Seriously! The only thing that's missing is for Thrawn to
>quip, "Elementary, my dear Pellaeon," at some point.

	Actually, Holmes never said that in any of the stories.  However,
Thrawn could say before one of his explanations that once all the impossible
has been eliminated, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the
truth.

>     The image is strongest in HTTE, and once I thought of it, I couldn't get
>it out of my head. I just see Thrawn sitting there in cap & cape, smoking a
>pipe while explaining things to Pellaeon.

	Now you've got it stuck in mine.  Thanks a lot :)

>     Anybody else get this impression? I swear, almost seems like Zahn did it
>intentionally. Or I am just overstressed from finals and totally looney? :-)

	Paelleron does seem to serve the same purpose as Watson (to give Thrawn
someone to explain things to).  I don't know whether Zahn was deliberately
trying to copy Holmes & Watson, but he may have been going for the same effect
without making the direct connection.

Lines: 4
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 08:02:30 MST
From: julie@alaska.et.byu.edu (Julie Gritton)
Organization: Brigham Young University, Provo UT USA
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Darth Vader's voice
Reply-To: julie@bones.et.byu.edu
	<1gro39INN7qi@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu>
	<BzG8IL.Fv1@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>

I think we should each post six copies of that lengthy treatise on
Lucas and Dickens and writing Star Wars poetry.  *grin*

"You could use a good kiss!"		JULIE
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: HDW@UCSVAX.UCS.UMASS.EDU (H D WALDEN)
Subject: Re: trivia buffs... :-)
Organization: UNIVERSITY OF MASSACHUSETTS - AMHERST
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 19:39:26 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

In <1992Dec19.010921.3007@cc.umontreal.ca> lebeld@JSP.UMontreal.CA writes:

> 
> 	Name the place(s) where we can see english words (not only letters
> and numbers, but actual words) in ANH... This not that easy, I can assure you


	Piece 'o cake--one that I immediately think of is the tracter(sp?) beam
in ANH, when Ben turns the power off.
-dave
From: EAO102@psuvm.psu.edu (Ernie Oporto)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Upcoming comics./Dark Empire #6
Date: 16 Dec 92 00:43:04 GMT
 <1992Dec14.135831.1476@uvm.edu> <1992Dec15.114020.2502@dct.ac.uk>
Organization: The Pennylvania State University

In article <1992Dec15.114020.2502@dct.ac.uk>, bssbc3gsd@dct.ac.uk (Grant Doig)
says:
>
>The end, where Luke, Leia and the unborn sprog turn the emperors force storm
>against him was awful.
>And i would have thought it would take more than someone saying "you've turned
>too far to the dark side" to make luke return to the light....
>it was very "oh you've turned to thedark side"
>" oh!! so I have, Leia! I think i'll turn back now."

I though the ending was appropriate because it showed that Luke had graduated
from using the lightsabre as a Jedi tool, to actually using the Force.  Never
saw Yoda use one of those clunky physical weapons, now did we?  Ben on the
other hand still used his.  I wonder what that says about him?
As to why he would act one way and then the next, if your very existence
depended on it, wouldn't you feign being a nasty guy for a while?

---
"Mos Eisley Spaceport.  You'll never find a more wretched hive of scum
 and villainy.  We must be cautious."
  _____)           ______        _)       _)  EAO102@PSUVM.PSU.EDU
                               __       __    OPORTO@CORVETTE.ECE.PSU.EDU
______    ______            ___      ___      Ernie "SHOKK" Oporto
                               __       __    Computer Lab Attendant
(_______ _      _ ________ _     _) _     _)  for PSU's CAC Department
From: julie@skatter.usask.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Luke Gone Down Hill?
Date: 15 Dec 1992 00:11:13 GMT
Organization: University of Saskatchewan
NNTP-Posting-Host: skatter.usask.ca

From article <92345.001424GPS108@psuvm.psu.edu>, by <GPS108@psuvm.psu.edu>:
> Don't forget Black Magic Woman or something.  I caught this one on free
> Cinemax over the summer and what a bomb of a film this was!  Yuuuck.  The only
> reason I think that Hamill did it was for the love scene in the shower.
> Here's hoping he finds a nice girl and stops making abysmal career moves!
> 
>                                                      ---Eric

But... Um...  Isn't he still married?  And I thought he just had a new
kid too...



It's not that I like the Empire.  
I hate it, but there's nothing 				Jules
I can do about it right now! 
	- Luke Skywalker.

--
From: goldfoot-josh@yale.edu (Josh A. Goldfoot)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
Subject: Re: Star Wars is NOT literature
Date: 20 Dec 1992 10:59:47 -0500
Organization: Yale University Science & Engineering UNIX(tm), New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu

In article <1992Dec19.004830.122729@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> pml3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (\
Paul Michael Lewis) :
[...]
 
>The SF atmosphere is the only thing that carries the movie.  Outside of that,
>there is an overly simplified good vs. evil plot.  Been done many times.
 
Yes, it has been done many times. It's been done in such eye-candy-esque works
as The Divine Comedy, the Iliad, Othello..
 
No one who has seen RotJ can possibly claim that Star Wars is oversimplified.
Yes, it is about good and evil, but there is very little pure good and pure
evil. It is about the struggle of individuals to be good and the temptation
to do wrong.
 
Lucas based his story on several classical and epic literary themes. Can
anyone deny the similarlities between Luke Skywalker and Moses? Both were taken
from their true parents; both grew to be powerful and noble men who fought
against evil.
 
>>       So, in that Star Wars is anallyzed by an ardent body of people
>>well into a decade after its release indicates that there must have
>>been far more than 'eye candy' involved.
>
>This is your reasoning?  There are PLENTY examples of media which are without
>substance that are loved by many.  Unfortunately, that doesn't inject value
>into them.
 
Star Wars isn't really in the media any longer, but people still watch it.
 
We can end this discussion right here: Wait 70 years or so, and if people are
still watching movies, I'll bet that they will be watching Star Wars and loving
it. This is the test of a classic: if it speaks to timeless, universal themes
that have a cross-generational appeal. We can debate this as much as we like
and there will be no resolution, until after we're all dead and the movies
are still alive.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: g-martin1@uiuc.edu (Gregory A. Martin)
Subject: "Star Wars: Dark Empire" comic sets for sale
Originator: gamg6900@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Reply-To: g-martin1@uiuc.edu (Gregory A. Martin)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 20:27:47 GMT


Star Wars fans,
	I have several sets of the "Star Wars: Dark Empire" comic book
series for sale. This series is an original story with the familiar
Star Wars characters continuing six years after "Return of the Jedi".
The series was published by Dark Horse Comics in six issues starting
in late 1991. Many Star Wars fans were unaware of this series as issues
were sold only in comic specialty shops, and the issues have sold out
in most stores.
	Issues 1, 2, and 3 were reprinted several months after the
original issues. Among comic collectors, original issues are more
"valuable" than reprints, but to Star Wars fans there is no difference --
the story and art are exactly the same. I have both originals and
reprints for sale.
	If you're interested in the "Star Wars: Dark Empire" set,
send your questions and bids to:
						Greg Martin
						g-martin1@uiuc.edu
P.S. - "Star Wars: Dark Empire" sets make GREAT Christmas gifts for
       Star Wars fans!
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars
From: lars4752@mach1.wlu.ca (Bradley Larsen u)
Subject: New Questions
Organization: Wilfrid Laurier University
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 16:21:39 GMT


Got some more questions for the net.

1)  Supposedly the time between TESB and ROTJ is 6 months.  How long did it
take Boba Fett to reach Tationne sp? If it only took say a couple of weeks
why would he still be hanging around Jabba's palace after 6 months?  

2)  What did Lando do to deserve his General rank?  He says during ROTJ 
"someone must've told them about my manuver on ?".  When did he do this 
act of bravery?  It couldn't have been between the movies because at that
time wasn't he trying to infultrate Jabba's palace?

3)  Does Darth Vader have a rank?  I know his title is Lord, but wouldn't 
a lord be above rank of a Grand Moff (ANH - Tarkin)?

4)  Where did the emporor get all of his evil powers?

5)  What kind of weapons do the emporor's guards use?

6)  In ANH, when the MF encounters the TIE fighter scout (near Alderaan) Han
flicks a switch, and some guns start firing above the cockpit?  Are these
just secondary type weapons that were originally on the ship or are they one
of Han's special modifications?

7)  What is your favorite ship/vehicle from Star Wars? (mine's the ATAT)

8)  Who is the character(s) you would have liked to seen more of in the movies?
    (I always wished that the Han would have ran into IG-88 somewhere along
     the line, but Boba Fett's still pretty cool.) 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.starwars