HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cstadez@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr C M Soanes)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Death vs Grindcore vs Thrash
Date: 17 Nov 1992 12:45:52 -0000
Organization: Computing Services, University of Warwick, UK
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: ginger.csv.warwick.ac.uk
Summary: My 2p

Ok, here's my two-penneth.

Personally, I dont dive a shit which group is in which category.
If a band's music catches my attention, i'll by it.
If you like a band then it doesn't really matter as to which category their
in, and from the peceding articles it's pretty clear that the lines are fuzzy
anyway. so: my maxim is this, if you think you're going to like a band, either
through hearing a single/video or reading a review, then either find a friend
who's got some of their stuff and listen, or try it out in your local store.
categorisation is immaterial, and doesn't affect whether or not the music's
good does it?.

		Tiff.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We're a rock band, we're black vomit, show us a plate and well throw up on it.
							        	-anon-
 cstadez@csv.warwick.ac.uk           ||         'Big Chris' Soanes.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: mega@lut.fi (Mega the Root of All Evil)
Subject: Re: Fear Factory (Was Re: Top Death Metal Groups)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 21:37:38 GMT
Disclaimer: Death before disco
	<41305@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>
Organization: Lappeenranta University of Technology, Finland


> In article <41305@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>, bruss@cs.ucsd.edu (Brian Russ) writes:

> The one I'm interested in is Fear Factory -- are they standard
> death metal?  Something different?  I'm not a huge DM fan (though
> Paradise Lost is great, and Entombed isn't so bad) ... the really-
> fast DM I can live without, but the slower grinding stuff -- that's
> what I'm looking for ...

 Fear Factory IS something different. There are fast songs and slow songs. Killer
 riffs but they don't lack melody. 17 tracks and 55 minutes of music. The lead
 singer has really low and rough voice but sometimes he uses very thin,high and
 melodic voice on choruses. The lyrics deal with socio-poltics,war etc. so no
 'praise the satan' stuff. Listen Napalm Death's "Suffer the children" and
 imagine it to be ten times better - that's Fear Factory.

 I am not a big DM fan either and IMHO 85% of all DM bands are crap. I guess
 this should help you...


 
 
--
 =================================================
 I E-mail: mega@lut.fi                           I
 I "And when you kill a man, you're a murderer   I
 I  Kill many, and you're conqueror              I
 I  Kill them all...you're a God!"  - Megadeth - I
 =================================================
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: mega@lut.fi (Mega the Root of All Evil)
Subject: Re: Death vs Grindcore vs Thrash
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 21:30:34 GMT
Disclaimer: Death before disco
	<1992Nov17.180653.8145@leland.Stanford.EDU>
	<1992Nov19.184307.8106@Cadence.COM>
Organization: Lappeenranta University of Technology, Finland


> In article <1992Nov19.184307.8106@Cadence.COM>, jyoung@Cadence.COM (John Young) writes:

> Jeeezus,you people are hilarious
> YOU SUCK
> THE POPE

  I guess it's time to listen Nuclear Assault's "Hang the pope" :)

--
 =================================================
 I E-mail: mega@lut.fi                           I
 I "And when you kill a man, you're a murderer   I
 I  Kill many, and you're conqueror              I
 I  Kill them all...you're a God!"  - Megadeth - I
 =================================================
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: vidaros@dhhalden.no (VIDAR OLAF SOLBERG)
Subject: Re: death vs. thrash vs. grindcore
Organization: Ostfold College
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 10:58:12 GMT

< All things deleted >

Here is MY opinion of what is the differences between Thrash, Death, 
Grindcore, Speed, ... - and all these musical styles!


* Thrash *
Fast, straight and rythmfull

	Metallica, Megadeth, Anthrax, (mostly) OverKill, Testament, Rage,
	(old) Helloween, Nuclear Assault, Kreator, (old) Running Wild,
	Slayer, Sepultura, Annihilator

* PowerThrash *
Faster and heavier with some deep powerful heaviness

	(Some) OverKill, Dark Angel, Metal Church (at least The Dark), Agent 
	Steel

* Death *
Combinations of slow and fast - real heavy sound

	Carcass, Pestilence, Cancer, Deicide, Cadaver (a norwegian band. 
	They're on euro-tour these days)

* Doom * 
Very slow and heavy (not thrashy)

	Candlemass, Black Sabbath, (some old) Manowar

* Grindcore *
(I'm not so very sure either... Maybe it's just hardcore!? )

	??

* Hardcore *
Thrashy Metal, with influences by punk

	Pantera, (can't remember more just now...)

* Power Metal *
Thrashy Heavy metal with this deep heaviness

	Sanctuary, Scanner, Judas Priest's "Defenders..." (The Sentinel is 
	an exstremely good example), (some Manowar)

* Speed *
_F_a_s_t_!

	Motrhead, Metal Church (also here), Slayer (Reign In Blood), 
	Judas Priest's "Painkiller", S.O.D., M.O.D.

* Funkthrash *
Heavy funkrock with influences from thrash (or vice verca)

	(newer) Suicidal Tendences, Faith No More, Gothic Slam, Realm

------

As I said, - this is MY opinion!! 

If you have another opinion, - just delete and add in this list!! 


VidarOS

	"Are you f**kin' sleepin' out there??"	- JAYMZ
From: rhr9081@hertz.njit.edu (Ray Rich)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: BRUCE'S VOICE
Date: 18 Nov 92 04:17:28 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <10NOV199215474770@rigel.tamu.edu> rpl1966@rigel.tamu.edu (RUDE DOG) writes:
>In article <1992Nov8.143636.60503@cc.usu.edu>, slgsn@cc.usu.edu writes...
>>WHAT'S UP WITH BRUCE? I THINK HE SUCKS. I USED TO LISTEN TO IRON MAIDEN MYSELF,
>>BUT I BAILED OUT ON THEM BECAUSE OF BRUCE'S SHITTY VOICE. HE SOUNDS LIKE HE'S
>>AN OPERA SINGER OR SOMETHING.
>>QUESTION-WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO PAUL DI'ANNO?(MAIDEN'S FIRST SINGER FOR THOSE OF
>>YOU WHO ARE MUSICALLY ILLITERATE)
>Paul left Iron Maiden, I bet he's kicking himself now, to start up a solo career
>The group was named something stupid, with Di'anno in it.  They made a couple of
>albums and died.  You might be able to find out more about him, if you could 
>find the name of his group.  Sorry I couldn't remember.
>
>And now for the flame.  I think Bruce is doing a much better job than Paul ever
>did.  For your information, Paul frequently wore lace, and other such frilly
>things as that.  Now I'm not closed minded, and though fags do scare me a bit,
>I cannot ever imagine Iron Maiden being a group for fags.  Can you??
>
>Well I guess that's about enough of that.
>
>Rude Dog

	Well, I like both, actually.  I don't think Dianno could ever do
Revelations, Children of the Damned, or Flight of Icarus, but I've never heard
Dickinson do Murders in the Rue Morgue, Killers, or Remember Tomorrow as well
as Paul.  As for frilly lace, can't say that I've ever seen that.  In fact,
on the 12 Wasted Years Home Vid, Bruce talks about when he was offered the
job as lead singer saying, "I'm not going to wear all that leather crap!"
He then smiles and the camera cuts to a live concert shot of him doing just that.

	BTW, can anyone give me a complete run-down of the careers of all
past and present Maiden members, with band names and album titles and such?
I realize this is a daunting task, but I'd greatly appreciate it.

	Also, is the ??? Burr in Killers related to Clive Burr, former Maiden
stickman?  They do look alike.

	If you like Bruce's voice, check out his early stuff with Samson.
I just got Survivors (with Dickinson on vocals, not the original w/ Paul
Samson singing) and Shock Tactics.  Both excellent, especially "Blood Lust".

						Later,
							Raythrax
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: vidaros@dhhalden.no (VIDAR OLAF SOLBERG)
Subject: Re: OverKill
Organization: Ostfold College
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 09:15:26 GMT

In article <92325.153536DVW2@psuvm.psu.edu> DVW2@psuvm.psu.edu (Nut) writes:

>Subject: Re: OverKill
>
>The new Overkill is being recorded right now and the tentative title is
>"Overkill IV".  I heard a few song names but can't remeber them right now.
>
>-Nut

How can it be called "OverKill _IV_", when it is their 6. album??
- After "Feel The Fire", "Taking Over", "Under The Influence", "The Years Of 
Decay" & "Horrorscope" (...and the EP "!!!Fuck You!!!")  Great albums!!

I think the typing just wasn't right..  "OverKill VI" sounds better.


VidarOS

	"We don't wanna thank you, but Queen for let us play here!"
						JAYMZ
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: mucds@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Corey D. Stinson)
Subject: Re: OverKill
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:04:47 GMT

  Hate to be a "me too" person but ME TOO!  Howabout an Overkill
fan club mailing list?  Overkill rules!

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
| Corey D. Stinson             |   .  _______   .       .   .         .  .  |
| Western Illinois University  |     /       \      \|    .     .           |
| Macomb, IL                   | .   \ O   O / .  . \|/_   .       .        |
|  (the center of the action)  |      |  U  |      .//       .         .  . |
|  mucds@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu       |    .  \|||/    .  //  .       .      .     |
| Fear of the dark...I have the constant fear that something's always near! |
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: djs55750@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (the man )
Subject: RE-CLARIFICATION of this classifying argument
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 21:33:11 GMT

Hullo, it's me, one of the instigator's of this discussion :)  I have seen a
lot of posts about "let's not classify these" and "we can't do this, etc.
etc.", and I just eanted to let you know you are most definitely right on the
money.  But whoever and I that started this one out I think were just looking
for a "loose" classfication so we had a basis for comparing music we had
never heard.  And I think we have done a darn good job in expressing our
opinions without trying to step on anyone's toes (except for the @sshole who
thinks he knows who the m@n re@lly listens to).  So, congratulations, men
(and any women too) I think we have done a good job of discussing without
flaming, and if Mr. Suaron comes back, perhaps we can all just leave his
articles unread and continue the way this newsgroup has been thus far in my
experience...mature, but nice and heavy!  So to whoever argued that this
classification shouldn't be done, I would just like to say that you're right,
but we weren't trying to set anything in stone and flame those who wouldn't
conform, we/I was just trying to get a frame of reference going...and to all
who have responded (everyone I think!) thank you, i now have a better idea of
what to expect from a lot of bands.  


					hoping to keep this newsgroup
					uncorrupted and trying to lead the
					movement of the the "just don't read
					flamers' posts" association,

					the m@n

P.S. The "@" is @lmost @s @nnoying @s the guy on @lt.rock-n-roll.met@l who
c@n't seem tpo FIX HIS C@PS LOCK KEY!
-- 
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
| "Before you see the light,  |  "...cutting my face, and walking on    | 
|      you must DIE!"         |      splinters...I lost my soul...         |
|              - Slayer       |          to the look in your eye."         |
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: s7280041@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (s7280041)
Subject: Re: Top Death Metal Groups
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 17:13:00 GMT

In article <BxqtxD.2HB@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, djs55750@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (the man ) writes...
>Hi, y'all, i was just wondering what you think the best death metal groups in
>the world are.  A lot of it is kinda crappy if you ask me, and a lot of it
>seems to be image (Deicide, etc.), but some if it is pretty cool.  I kind of
>like Entombed and Morbid Angel so far, but am looking for more.  I have
>dabbled in Bolt Thrower and was impressed somewhat.  So any opinions would be
>appreciated..thanks :)
> 
>						Dave
	Check out the group Unleashed.  In my opinion this is probably if
not the best death metal band out there.  Cool beats and tempo's mixed
with harmonious death(whatever that means).  If you're planning on 
purchasing one of their albums get the newer one which contains the
BEST death metal song ever--->Onward into Countless Battles<---

l8r from the gutter,
Tom
From: bcopelan@cs.strath.ac.uk (Barry Copeland TBS92)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: "Death Metal"
Date: 19 Nov 92 16:50:16 GMT
Organization: Comp. Sci. Dept., Strathclyde Univ., Glasgow, Scotland.

In article <1992Nov18.213729.16118@Cadence.COM> jyoung@Cadence.COM (John Young) writes:
>>>If you insist on taking part in a debate, please understand the terms 
>>>involved...
>>
>>>Sepultura are thrash leaning towards both Hardcore and Death... definately NOT
>>>grindcore.
>>
>Bullshit,Sepultura is metallifag commercial shit metal.I read the
>earlier post by"the man"and he was a lot closer to thrash than this
>other idiot

WHAT???
As "this other idiot" I have to say FUCK YOU!!
Sepultura are not really commercial - they have never been any where in the 
charts , and outside the HM press are totally unheard of.They also sound 
excellent.

>"the man"seems to like real grind(Entombed,Bolt Thrower,etc)like me,
>and not the homo-metal that everyone else in this group does.So I
>would suggest to him to try:
>like old Accused,The Unleashed,Benediction,Napalm Death,Autopsy,
>mabey even old Celtic Frost,Whiplash's first power&pain is a classic.
>GWAR,and as he mentioned Morbid Angel.

I have been into real grind such as Entombed and Bolt Thrower for years...
Bolt Thrower since their Peel Sessions were broadcast in '88 and Entombed since
"Left Hand Path" came out. 

I haven't heard much Accused but I am into The Unleashed, Benediction, N.D., 
Autopsy, Celtic Frost and Morbid Angel.

>and "the man"don't listen to f@gs like this guy,he's probably the
>kind who considers Godflesh deathmetal,and bands like meatallif@g and
>megaf@g real metal when it's commercial garbage.

I don't consider Godflesh to be real DM, but I do consider them to be one of
the most inovative and excitibg bands around.

Metallica and Megadeth (I take that is what that craphead meant) are both good 
Speed bands.

Just because you are closed minded and cannot appreciate where your favourite
type of music is coming from ,does not mean that anyone who is openminded and
can is f@g.

Listening to Led Zep and Carcass...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Barrie Copeland         /"When a man lies,he murders some part of the world,
bcopelan@cs.strath.ac.uk/These are the pale deaths which men miscall their lives
                        /All this I cannot bear to witness any longer           
                        /Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home" 
                        / CLIFF 1962-86
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: 5ea8manchest@vms.csd.mu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Grave, Entombed
Date: 23 Nov 1992 17:31:31 GMT
Organization: Marquette University - Computer Services
Reply-To: 5ea8manchest@vms.csd.mu.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: vmsd.csd.mu.edu

I've read about these bands (Grave and Entombed) and would like a little
more info on them before I purchase a release by either one of them.
What do these two groups sound like; are they real dark, slow or fast,
do the singers have low or high voices, etc.  I like slow, dark stuff
better, and I've been told Entombed is grindcore, though this label has
been applied to groups as different as Morbid angel and Godflesh (I prefer
the eerie darkness of Godflesh myself).  I know Grave is DM, but this term
is applied even more widely than "grindcore."  Also, which Entombed
album would you recommend (given that I prefer the style I do).  Any info
on this would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks, Eric M.
From: 5ea8manchest@vms.csd.mu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Battle Zone
Date: 19 Nov 1992 02:34:30 GMT
Organization: Marquette University - Computer Services
Reply-To: 5ea8manchest@vms.csd.mu.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: vmsa.csd.mu.edu

In article <1992Nov17.033008.12788@news.columbia.edu>, pw15@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Philip  Wang) writes:
>I just found out that Paul Di'anno's band Battlezone (before they changed their
>name, or rather, extended it, to Paul DI'anno's Battlezone but otherwise same
>members) released an album called, wow, BATTLEZONE, I guess also on Shatter 
>Records. Can anyone tell me of the availablility of this album? I hear it's 
>just as killer (bad pun, sorry) as CHILDREN OF MADNESS and MURDER ONE. Aside 
>from LIVE PLUS ONE (a 1980? Iron Maiden EP released in Japan) it's the only
>Paul Di'anno recording to my knowledge that I don't have.
>
>philip
>Philip Wang
>E-mail at pw15@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
>"Though many a tortured night prevails thy Exorcisms shall but fail
>While Crucifix doth burn my flesh I shall not yield to you unless I Die."

Phil, I had to special order this Bzone album the year it came out, so
I don't know if it is in print or not.  However, it is supposedly better
than anything they have done since then, though i haven't heard the
later albums myself.  If you can get a hold of it, I'm sure you'd like
it, so keep trying.
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: cons008@titan.ucc.umass.edu (Chuck Hazlett)
Subject: Re: SUARON SUCKS SUARON SUCKS SUARON SUCKS
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 21:58:37 GMT

In article <1er4ibINNi98@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> maf10@po.CWRU.Edu (Moses A. Fridman) writes:
>
>
>As well as his buttbuddy, THE POPE.  
>-- 

I haven't seen Suaron all semester.  What are you screaming for?

-Chuck
From: tphailey@eos.ncsu.edu (THOMAS PATRICK HAILEY)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Death vs Grindcore vs Thrash
Date: 19 Nov 92 18:52:40 GMT
Reply-To: tphailey@eos.ncsu.edu (THOMAS PATRICK HAILEY)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Originator: tphailey@c00016-118dan.eos.ncsu.edu


>Allright another old timer who knows what's up.I'm only 25.but I
>remember the good day's before Metallifag was the big homo band.
>I see these little kids wearing shirts of bands that had already
>got big(small time big)and broke up when these kids were 5 years old.
>
>REMEMBER WHEN:metal was leather and spikes,you could actually
>slam dance,get shredded to a bloody pulp and enjoy every minute
>of it.
>I remember seeing Possesed,and this other band that was Hirax under
>a different name,and I think Sacrilege(or mabey Sacrifice I was pretty
>hammered that night)They didn't prance around like the homo in Fags
>or More..I mean that faith band,sorry.
>
>Kreator was much more rippen than metallifuk in the early 80's
>Good to see SOMEONE knows what they're talking about(besides me
>and my brother) 
>
>                  Product of the pre-laMeT.V. mentality
>			THE POPE!!!!

Yeah, looks like you've been out of the punk scene for a good while 
now. You'd get torn to shreds for throwing around the words "fag"
and "homo" like you do. Of course, you were punk back in the good 
old days before anyone was capable of intelligent thought. 

                   Product of intelligent reasoning
                        TOMASS
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: feygin@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Alexander Feygin)
Subject: Re: Left out Progressive
Reply-To: a-feygin@uiuc.edu (Alexander Feygin)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 19:57:44 GMT

01mbmccabe@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu writes:
} > You left out one type, which might actually help you... Progressive.  There's
} > even a newsgroup (alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive) for it.  I won't go into
} > a long in-depth description of what progressive metal is - though I could,
} > since I co-wrote the FAQ for the group. ;)  Queensryche (except most of their
} > songs on "Empire") tends toward being progressive metal, as do groups like
} > King's X, Fates Warning, Crimson Glory, and Dream Theater.
} YOu seem to have forgotten one of the original prog.rock groups
} RUSH...What about Yes?  C'mon...

neither of these are metal....not even rush.

neil peart even said something like "we have never been a metal group
nor will we ever be".


-- 
  Alexander Feygin      "This species has amused itself to death"
 a-feygin@uiuc.edu                -- Roger Waters

The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not CCSO
From: rancid@leland.Stanford.EDU (Chanel Wheeler)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Death vs Grindcore vs Thrash
Date: 17 Nov 92 17:43:52 GMT
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA

In article <1eapi0INNbb8@ginger.csv.warwick.ac.uk> cstadez@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr C M Soanes) writes:
>Ok, here's my two-penneth.
>
>Personally, I dont dive a shit which group is in which category.
>If a band's music catches my attention, i'll by it.
>If you like a band then it doesn't really matter as to which category their
>in, and from the peceding articles it's pretty clear that the lines are fuzzy
>anyway. so: my maxim is this, if you think you're going to like a band, either
>through hearing a single/video or reading a review, then either find a friend
>who's got some of their stuff and listen, or try it out in your local store.
>categorisation is immaterial, and doesn't affect whether or not the music's
>good does it?.
>

I completely agree with you but to converse with other people you need
to have descriptive words that each of you have similar meanings for.
So many people tell me about these REALLY HEAVY bands that turn out
to sound alot like Pearl Jam. Our perspectives are different--Pearl
Jam IS really heavy to them, it's lightweight crap to me. On the other
hand, if they describe a band as being grindcore, well then I have a
much better idea of what they might sound like. I don't choose the music
I like by what category it fits in, but certain styles of music do
catch my interest more than others. I also know that any grindcore band
is more likely to put out quality music than a "metal" band.

chanel
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: gse9k@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU (Scott Evans)
Subject: Re: Left out Progressive
Reply-To: thrash@virginia.edu (Scott Evans)
Organization: or lack thereof
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 20:03:39 GMT


>> You left out one type, which might actually help you... Progressive.  There's
>> even a newsgroup (alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive) for it.  I won't go into
>> a long in-depth description of what progressive metal is - though I could,
>> since I co-wrote the FAQ for the group. ;)  Queensryche (except most of their
>> songs on "Empire") tends toward being progressive metal, as do groups like
>> King's X, Fates Warning, Crimson Glory, and Dream Theater.
>
>YOu seem to have forgotten one of the original prog.rock groups
>
>RUSH...What about Yes?  C'mon...


That's the thing...Shag was talking about progressive *metal*, not
progressive rock, although it's certainly arguable that the former
descended from the latter.  And the point was to say what category
a band like Queensryche could go in, since pop sure ain't it.  


s