HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: minkpup@IASTATE.EDU (Lisa E Peterson)
Subject: Re: seeing
Reply-To: minkpup@IASTATE.EDU (Lisa E Peterson)
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 17:59:49 GMT

In article <1992Apr10.215957.15632@news.iastate.edu>, twnv6@isuvax.iastate.edu
writes:
> 	I have another problem I would like some help on.  How do other people
> deal with seeing their perps?  I was raped by my best friend six months ago,
> and I see him all the time.  We live in the same residence-hall complex, so I
> see him sometimes in the commons or at food service.  I also see him
sometimes
> on campus.  And the worst part, he is now dating one of the girls on my
floor,
> who I happen to be very good friends with, and most of our friends are the
> same.  I can't seem to get away from him!!!  And he can't understand why I    
> refuse to have anything to do with him, he seems to think that I should be
able 
> to forgive him.  ARGH!!  The entire situation just makes me mad!!  He STILL   
> claims that he did nothing wrong, and that I made the whole thing up.  Which
is 
> why he thinks I should forgive him.  I just don't know what to do about the   
> situation.  I have remidied part of the problem though, I will be living in a
> different complex next year.  But what can I do abnout the now?  I really
hate
> to have anything to do with him, but I don't want to lose friends either.  A
> few of my friends also refuse to have anything to do with him, but those are
> only the ones here at school that I have told.  HELP!?!?!?  Please!?!?!  Any
> advise or suggestions would be VERY helpful.  Thanks in advance.
> 
> 	*e-hugs and warm thoughts to those who want them*
> 
> 		pj
> 

I've dealt with this by telling the guy "I no longer want you in my life because
you hurt me so don't go out of your way to try to get me to forgive you.
You may not think you've done anything wrong but the fact remains that I was
hurt by you in some way and don't wish to be around the person that caused that
pain." If your friends invite you to a function that he's going to be at and
you
feel apprehensive, don't go.  This is definitely a case where a few white lies
to your friends about things won't hurt much.  You need to take care of yourself
first and don't feel you have to tell all of your friends about what he did if
they push for a reason why you no longer want to do things that he is part of.

_moo-cow


Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: enigma@netcom.com (Enigma)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: clarification
Date: 16 Apr 92 02:52:28 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <45628@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> Bede_Jarrow@hikssrv.lib.purdue.edu (Bron) writes:
>I feel the need to clarify a recent post I made last week.  My letter to my
>perp-boss was _never_ sent or shown to him.  It was simply my way of letting
>out anger.  I had forgotten to mention that this was an unsent letter, and
>didn't think anyone would think that I had sent it, but some people did.  I'd
>never send or show him anything like that--that'd be cutting my own throat.

Well, I wish I'd said this at the time, but I thought that letter was great!
I assumed you did not send it to him, because it sounded like a "letting off
steam" letter, and your other posts sounded as though you hadn't sent it. 
But I remember thinking it was a really empowering thing to do.


>I'm not sure what I will do after graduation in August but I'm really trying to
>listen to myself and what my intuition is telling me.  I'm feeling more and
>more that I am scared about getting into another hectic, abusive poistion. 
>What I might do is take a month or two off and travel.  There is a possibility
>of a job here but I really would like to move West.  It's scary but I can do
>it!

That sounds like a really teriffic idea.  In my (not so) humble opinion,
taking time off to do something fun is a wonderful idea, and  travel always
gives one a different perspective and fresh ideas.  If you want a suggestion,
what about taking that month or two and traveling around to places you 
might like to live?  


>I said goodbye to my doctor today.  I saw her for a chronic illness for 1 1/2
>years.  I felt at times that she emotionally abused me--invalidating my
>feelings, inapprorpriate teasing, rubbing it in that I have a lot of insurance
>claims.  I never told her about my feelings, although today when she made the
>crack about the insurance I said "There are a lot of other people who have
>higher claims than I do."  She agreed and said I _had_ avoided hospitalization
>and really I wasn't that expensive.  She also said she felt I would be a
>success and that I had surmounted a lot of challenges here--that felt good to
>hear.  I'm glad we ended on a positive note.  I did thank her for the medical
>help she's given me.  I got all the drugs I need for 6 months, but will see a
>doctor at the campus facility if needed over the summer.

Another suggestion if you want it:  I just saw a movie called "The Doctor",
which you might enjoy seeing since you're thinking about this.  It's about
a doctor who finds out what life is like as a patient (It was based on a 
book called "A Taste of My Own Medicine", which made me laugh).  

>
>Well, that's where I'm at--16 more days til the end of semester and 109 in my
>grad career!
>
>Thanks for reading,
>Bron

Thanks for writing!  Your post put me in a good mood - I get the feeling
things are starting to going bettter for you, because you're making them
better.
-- 
Enigma (enigma@netcom.com)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (Teresa Kline)
Subject: Re: Coming in from the cold... :-)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Yeah, *right* !
Date: 17 Apr 1992 08:53 EST  

In article <1992Apr17.060059.2668@muddcs.claremont.edu>, uribe@jarthur.claremont.edu (Soprano) writes...
>I will not be silenced any longer.
> 

Good for you!  And I wondered about your name.  Singing is a help, isn't it?
You can feel joy and anger and never have to "feel" it.  If that makes any 
sense.

-- Teresa

		Life -- just for the FUN of it!!!!
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: uribe@jarthur.claremont.edu (Soprano)
Subject: Coming in from the cold... :-)
Organization: Harvey Mudd College
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 06:00:59 GMT

I will not be silenced any longer.

I originally posted anonymously here as "Coloratura".  I chose that name
because singing has been the means by which I have started to realize
that there is more to me than the helpless girl who was isolated and
victimized for so long.  I originally chose to post anonymously not to
protect my own identity, but because the college where my husband
teaches (and whose computers I use) is very much a small town, and I
did not want any potential gossip about me to reflect on him (although
why anybody would *care* is beyond me.... ;-).  But the time has come
for me to reclaim myself -- and that includes my own name.  It is not
*my* shameful secret, because *I* did nothing wrong.  There is no reason
why I should not stand proudly before the world with my head held high
-- and so I'm going to try to.  I have little doubt that I'm going to
have setbacks, but finally, at long *long* last, I'm on my way!

                                        Lydia

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Soprano (Lydia M. Uribe)                       uribe@jarthur.claremont.edu |
| Claremont, CA                                          uribe@hmcvax.bitnet |
|            Cats, quilts and diving - what more could anyone ask?           |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: aberson@enh.nist.gov
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: RE: Friend in trouble with violent boyfriend
Date: 7 Apr 92 21:12:06 GMT
Organization: NIST

As with "Looking for Advice," you cannot force your friend to do anything.
The more you try to do so, the more harm you may do.  You can only
tell her that you are available if she needs to talk, and that you 
will help her when she asks for help.  There isn't much more for you to
do, and you must be prepared for a time to know that she is still being
abused.

There probably is no quick fix in this situation.  Sorry I cannot help
you more.

                                                                        ____
    Sim David Aberson   Ft. Lauderdale, FL   aberson%3338.span@sdsc.edu \  /
     April 4, 1992  Marjorie Stoneman Douglas' 102nd birthday            \/
      I'll probably see her out dancing.
From: chrislyn@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Tracey L. Stanchfield)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: I'm angry today
Date: 9 Apr 92 18:57:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: bsu-cs.1306
Organization: Dept of CS Ball State University Muncie In

Bron--

 just a quick note to say "Bravo!" for expressing yourself so 
assertively-- hope things turn out ok.. I think you did the right thing.

tracey
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: bob@reed.edu (Robert Ankeney)
Subject: Yield and overcome
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 17:21:20 GMT



     I've had an enquiry about what my signature is all about, so I
thought I'd share a little about it with anyone interested.  I enjoy
doing Tai Chi, which is technically a martial art.  The style I do is
geared more for health, fitness and relaxation/meditation.  It is
rooted in Taoist philosophy, and a lot of our group are interested in
the philosophy.  I apply the ideas to my lifestyle, and I have found
a lot of what it has to say to be very helpful to my process.  My
signature quote is from a translation of the Tao Te Ching by Lao Tzu.
I recently read a translation/adaptation of it in The Tao of Leadership
by John Heider which felt particularly applicable to my process.  It
reads:


22. The Paradox of Letting Go

When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.
When I let go of what I have, I receive what I need.
     These are feminine or Yin paradoxes:
* By yielding, I endure.
* The empty space is filled.
* When I give of myself, I become more.
* When I feel most destroyed, I am about to grow.
* When I desire nothing, a great deal comes to me.

     Have you ever struggled to get work or love and finally given up
and found both love and work were suddenly there?
     Do you want to be free and independent?  Conform to God's law;
that is how everything happens anyway.

     When I give up trying to impress the group, I become very impressive.
But when I am just trying to make myself look good, the group knows that
and does not like it.
     My best work is done when I forget my own point of view; the less I
make of myself, the more I am.
     When I yield to the wishes of the person working, I encounter no
resistance.

     This is the wisdom of the feminine: let go in order to achieve.
The wise leader demonstrates this.

----------

     I particularly identify with "When I feel most destroyed, I am about
to grow."  It seems like every time I feel like I'm falling apart, I'm
coming up on more memories or an important breakthrough.  Either one means
new growth for me.  And when I don't struggle with myself, when I don't
fight feeling my sadness or anger, it's easier.

     Just thought I'd share that, as where I am in my process lately, it
felt very applicable.  Reading that affirmed what I had been feeling and
caused me to cry again.

     Take care, all.
     Robert
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Perfect victim?
From: jfriedman@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 16 Apr 92 18:08:29 EDT
Organization: Wesleyan University

Teresa-

I do not profess to be an expert on how to break the cycle of victimization,
since I find myself caught in it as well.  I do want to point out, however,
that (not to sound cliche) your clear and brave (in terms of self awareness)
identification of this potential within yourself shows that you are NOT the
perfect victim at all - for a victim who identifies her/himself as one can
learn to FIGHT, while someone who does not realize they are being victimized
cannot.  Hold on to this victory!!!!! You can win!!!!!  I know what it is to be
in a situation where acceptance and rejection of a path or action are both
"passive" choices, because not doing something for the sole reason that someone else
wants you to do it allows that person to have as much control over your actions
as doing that very thing because they want you to do it would have.  The
crucial (and painfully difficult) thing is to try to get in touch with yourself
and what YOU want, no matter if it agrees or contrasts with what others want of 
you.  I do not know if there is an end to this struggle, and I can only offer
you hope and support and quiet strength.

				-jac

Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@milton.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: Some replies and a few questuions
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 18:24:52 GMT

ladyhawke:
have you been reading the recent sex/power thread?  there is a lot of
discussion there about some of the issues you mention -- about 'consenting' (i
don't want to use that word, but i can't think of a better one at the moment.
it has the wrong connotations although its strict interpretation is useful
here) to the abuse, about feeling shame over it, about the abuse feeling
pleasurable, etc.  if these articles haven't expired on your site, i would
reccomend that you read them.

if they have expired:  in a nutshell, it's not your fault.  you were 3-6 years
old, as you say.  you could not provide informed, adult consent to engage in
sexual activity with an adult.  yes, you were raped.  it's not your fault.
children are very succeptable to subtle suggestion and manipulation by adults
that they can be made to think that practically anything was their idea, or
that they are to blame for something, etc.  don't buy into it, because it's not
true.  you were no more responsible for that than you would be if an earthquake
happened right after someone convinced you to jump off a chair.  genital
stimulation, even in an abusive context, can feel good.  that's just normal
human physiology.  unfortunately, these good feelings can lead to a lot more
confusion in the child's mind as to what's right and wrong, good and bad.  but
you're an adult now, with adult reasoning facilities, so you can think your way
out of this one.  look at the facts as they are, and try not to make unfair
judgements against yourself.  hang in there, and e-hugs if you want them.

this is a very brief synopsis from memory.  i still suggest you read those
articles if you can.

-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
From: v130py5w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (ReNeE)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: ho hum blues
Date: 16 Apr 92 17:36:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41


like i said ho hum 
i'm thinking of breaking up with my SO, i can't take his EX-wife tagging
along on his heels telling him how bad i am. I can't take him sticking up for
her anymore. I can't take her doing laundry at his house twice a week. I can't
take her buying his friendship anymore. He says they've been friend forever...
bull they were only friends when it was convient for her. She cheated on him
and rubbed his nose in it. She has 3-4 guys at once always letting them think
that they are her one and only. She's a sleeze, and he holds her above me.

He says that he needs her in his life so he has an example of how he doesn't
want to live.....bullshit...eveyone knows how they don'[t want to live they don't
have to be reminded.  he also says that if i were to ask him to choose that i
would be asking him to change who he is, who he has become and he couldn't do it
which means i'd lose and i'd lose big time...

He says i'm the best thing that's ever happened to him. His winning lottery 
ticket. That he 'loves' me and cares about me. He is loving but...

Tuesday night was a friends b-day. He wouldn't sign my name to her card cause
he bought the gifts from his ex for her(the friend). He said if his ex found 
out it would
piss her off........................who the F*CK cares!!! Her feelings mean more
than mine? I'm supposed to just stand back when he says he feels bad about not
being able to put my names on the card and so ohh that's o.k....
ughhhh
i really like him alot, i find him cute and friendly, outgoing and caring but
i just can't take the ex anymore. It's more complicated then i've made it out
but this is pretty much the jist.

the other night when i was upset and wouldn't talk to him we went to the mall
for pizza. I'm usually quite talkative but i didn't say much at all. He asked if
i was still in this group. I think he was thinking that the reason why i was
brooding was cause of ASAR and my recovery. What an arrogent ass he knew why i
was brooding....i couldn't believe he was trying to blame ASAR...ha!
I just told him...i didn't think he cared.


so i'm bummed cause i don't know what to do....
dunp him or keep him..
i'd like to keep him but this ex shit is tearing me apart!
ReNeE
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: asar.257@wpi.wpi.edu  
Subject:   a poem
Followup-To: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
X-Aps2-Version: 2.1
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service @ WPI
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 15:55:19 GMT

Hi again.

I won't try to apologize for not posting in some time.  I continue to lurk
and seem overwhelmed now adays by the huge volume.  Anyway, the poem was
sorta a response to the way i am feeling now (i wouldn't mind telling the
whole world about my past but i don't know where to begin or if i really
want to... but all that may be explained in a later post... poetry is safe.)

UNTITLED.

oh...
no...
no nothing.

just...

just...

no, nevermind.
it was nothing. nothing.

no...

no, I mean...
just...

nevermind.




I think it sounds better outloud but then again i have been going about
reading it (and by now quoting it) to everyone i really would like to 
tell something to.  ok, not everyone but you get the idea.

anyway, that's the mouse speaking.
mouse


--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
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From: gery@midway.uchicago.edu (Black Pearl)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Overt paedophilia IS sexual abuse (Re: sex/power)
Date: 8 Apr 92 18:46:06 GMT
Article-I.D.: midway.1992Apr8.184606.24763
Organization: University of Chicago

In article <FAY.92Apr7161719@dolomite.WPI.EDU>, Peter R Fay writes:
> 
> [in response to Sim]...
>
> I am a survivor and am quite aware of how destructive shame can be to
> those who "take on" other's shame... by the way, if survivors take on
> other's shame, who do you suppose is the one who gets not to feel
> shame?  Perpetrators.  If you think this tactic of encouraging
> perpetrators to accept their own shame is as bad as the original
> crime, well, I'm at a loss of what to say.

Oops, I deleted the part where you say each emotion, including shame,
has its place. I agree with what you say. There is a world of difference
between feeling shame for something you did not do (in fact, was done
to you) and something you did do. It's unhealthy for me (& my father)
that I feel ashamed and dirty for what he did, but he does not. It's
healthy if I feel ashamed for going on a drunken rampage and smashing
my husband's favorite vase. It's part of my recovery to feel shame for
the things I did wrong, and I (albeit grudgingly) value the right
to do so. It's also part of recovery to reject the shame for somebody
else's misdeeds. I hope some day I can do that too.

Friends in healing,
Black Pearl
From: sabolps2@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Paul Sabol)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Is this abuse?
Summary: You might like my other post on def of abuse
Date: 10 Apr 92 01:43:01 GMT
Article-I.D.: mentor.44707
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center

In article <meskanen.29@katk.Helsinki.FI> meskanen@katk.Helsinki.FI (Meskanen Kaarina) writes:
>First of all, I wnat to find out if the following experiences are 
>situations that could be regarded as sexual abuse...

)2 stories deleted except this line(
>I was a very easy target...

Well, I don't know what to say about now wanting to remember and wanting
to forget.  Many of us here have felt a certain amount of fear of knowing
and a longing to know.  I think right now I am more wanting to know then
fearing.  I think I would suggest that you try to be aware of you feelings
when you are having these memories.  You mentioned embarassment...tnat is
a good start.  Now on the the question at hand.

I am not a profesional but I do have an opionion that is held by some 
profesionals.  It is as I said in another post today...something is 
abuse if the survivor feels it is.  This doesn't even mean you felt it
was at the time...you can change you mind or get new information.  I 
once heard it said (albeit pessamistic) that the answer to the question
was one ever abuse is either Yes or One doesn't remember for sure!

I think that you were abused.  And I think that the abuse had some clear
effects on you that are very consistant with the shame based attitudes
that many of us adopt for survival.  The line that sticks out to me is 
the one I left quoted, "I WAS A VERY EASY TARGET."  You felt objectified
You were used because you were a GREAT LITTLE GIRL.  You were turned
into a walking genitalial by those girls and the boys too!  You felt 
very embareassed.  And the rape is certainly abuse...Let me say I think
that I can empathise with you.  I am a male and I was raped by a female
and I am often met with ...that can't happen... or ...how can that 
happen...  There is an implicit disbelief in what SOCIETY views as an
odd story...I just want to say that I can totally understand with being
caught off guard and unable to 'fight back.'
a
Paul Stephen Sabol  sabolps2@sage
From: aberson@enh.nist.gov
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: RE: Advice Needed (Please)
Date: 7 Apr 92 21:20:20 GMT
Organization: NIST

In a previous article, bouchard@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Hilary ) wrote of herself
and two friends:

Welcome!  I hope this answer does not seem too short, but it is frequently
asked here (I hope the FAQ gets done sooner so that a set response can
be read by all).

As for counselling, call a local rape treatment center of psychological
association for therapists who work in this area.  Shop around for one
who suits you.  You can also ask for various groups of sexual abuse 
survivors as they may be helpful also.

As for books, The Courage to Heal by Ellen Bass and Laura Davis is 
widely regarded as one of the best.  There is also a workbook and a
cassette tape version.  This book has a list of sources which you
can also use.

Good luck and take care.

                                                                        ____
    Sim David Aberson   Ft. Lauderdale, FL   aberson%3338.span@sdsc.edu \  /
     April 4, 1992  Marjorie Stoneman Douglas' 102nd birthday            \/
      I'll probably see her out dancing.
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery