HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 30 Dec 1992 10:47:30 CST
From:         OPDBS@VM.CC.LATECH.EDU
Subject:      Request for your prayers

Dear list members

Please include my wife India in your prayers; she has MS and is faced with
the decision to take a treatment that is life threatening. If she doesn't
take the treatment, she may very well become an invalid, so you can see her
options. The treatment is very stressful and dangerous. We seek God's will
in this matter.

We covet your prayers.

Doug Strain
opdbs@vm.cc.latech.edu
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Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 14:26:33 -0600
From:         jim coen <coen@ACC.WUACC.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Operation Pest.

What is at issue is not Operation Rescue (either the support or non-support
of this group). What ought to be at issue is: why is there a NEED for
abortion? We all know that most abortions are *not* performed in order to
save the mother's life. This is a lame argument in support of abortion.
Abortions are performed, for the most part, as a means of contraception.
If the statistics were known, I feel certain that it would be clear that
a majority of abortions are performed on women who got pregnant when
1) they didn't want to  2) were doing something they shouldn't have been
doing. The question I have is this: why didn't they use a cheaper, more
readily available, and less costly (in terms of human life) form of
contraception?

Just wondering?
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Date:         Mon, 28 Dec 1992 05:31:04 EST
From:         "SHELBY A. CROSS" <LIBSAC@EMUVM1.BITNET>
Subject:      RE:FRESH INFILLING-MAKS

Dear Maks,

I'm just taking time out with Christia to praise the Lord with you for
Rachel rededicating her life to Christ.  When the Lord gives you revela-
tion knowledge, you can't help but share what the Lord has revealed to
you in His precious Word.  TO GOD BE THE GLORY FOR ALL THE THINGS HE HAS
DONE!!!!!!!

Your sister in Christ,

Shelby--
From: DIEFENBAK@TOPAZ.UCQ.EDU.AU (Ken Diefenbach)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Ebenezer Scrooge et al
Date: 21 Dec 92 22:58:00 GMT
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The Network in Australia which has the rights to all the Disney stuff ran the
usual Christmassy things on Sunday night including Mickey's Christmas Carol.
The message of Ebenezer Scrooge's "correction" comes through loud and strong
even though (perhaps) the use of Disney characters may seem to trivialise
the message.

The Tiny Tim thread of the story is always going to move me, as a parent of
a handicapped child who is also blessed with the gift of bringing out some of
the best in others he comes in contact with. Must admit I was surprised to be
so moved, but one's kids evoke that sort of reaction.

I guess Ebenezer's change wasn't portrayed as a conversion experience as it
could have been. May all who think on the Babe this Christmas become aware of
what happened when He grew up.

God bless
Ken D.

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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 22 Dec 1992 08:00:48 EST
From:         "SHELBY A. CROSS" <LIBSAC@EMUVM1.BITNET>
Subject:      RE:SANCTITY OF LIFE-MAKS

Dear Maks and Christia,

This post that you wrote really hit home this past week when I had to attend a
funeral for a 17 year old young man named Avery Pennant.  He was a classmate of
my daughter at her school.  He was playing the video games at an arcade and
another young man came up to him and said that he wanted to play.  Avery told
him to wait until he had finished and he could have the machine.  The boy
pulled out a gun and shot him in the head.  I still can't grasp this killing
and taking a life for a .25 video game.  Maks this article hit the nail on
the head.  We need to get up together with our schools, businesses, and chur-
ches and get out and make a difference before it's too late.  We do need to
return back to our moral values and to decency.  May God continue to bless
you.

Your sister in Christ,

Shelby--
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 16:00:35 CDT
From:         Ian Williams <iwilliam@AU.ORACLE.COM>
Subject:      my first meeting - christia

Well, I met my first CHRISTIAn yesterday also, a person who works near me
and reads CHRISTIA via the news feed bitnet.listsver.etc
A big hello to James!

Its great to see there ARE human beings on the end of this thing, and that
I am not being tricked by an ultra smart (maybe NOT so smart???) computer!!
:-)



---------------------+-------------+-----------------------------------------
Ian Williams         |    _--_|\   |      Internet: iwilliam@au.oracle.com
Oracle Systems       |   /      \  |      Phone   : +61 8 239 3900
Adelaide, Australia  |   \_.--*_/  |
                     |         v   |
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 09:19:00 CST
From:         Sieg A U R I C H <B882SA@UTARLG.UTA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: our baby, the first look

Ian,

        I got your message:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++ BEGINNING OF YOUR MESSAGE++++++++++++++++++++++++
Subj:   our baby, the first look

Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 15:59:01 CDT
From: Ian Williams <iwilliam@AU.ORACLE.COM>
Yesterday we had the ultrasound of the baby (the 18 week one).. WOW!
I feel priviledged to be allowed a look into the workshop of God, who is
forming our baby.. It almost seemed like an intrusion into a place where
the baby was only half made, and the finishing touches were still to be
added. Still I am thankfull for  modern technology..

It all seems a little more real now... Praise be to him!

Ian Williams
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++END OF YOUR MESSAGE+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

        It brought back so many vivid memories of when our twins were born.
My wife started to have labor at 24 weeks and ended up being hospitalized for
10 weeks, with daily ultrasaounds and monitering.  She delivered 2 healthy
boys, even at 6 weeks early and only 3.5 lbs.

        Congratulations, and we'll pray that all will continue to go well.

        A   M E R R Y  C H R I S T M A S  to you!!!

                        Sieg <><
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 11:48:13 EST
From:         "SHELBY A. CROSS" <LIBSAC@EMUVM1.BITNET>
Subject:      RE:DEATH NOTICE-HOMEGOING

Dearest Carl,

I was sorry to hear about your grandmother, but am sharing in joy for
the beautiful life she lived and also that she does not have to suffer
any longer, but can rejoice in the presence of Our Saviour.  We will
be still praying for your wife's father and glad that he came through
the surgery so well.

Dear Heavenly Father,
We thank You for all your blessings.  We ask You to continue to be with
Carl and his family and give them strength through this sad time, but
we praise You also for bringing his father-in-law through this serious
surgery.  We ask that You totally heal him from the top of his head to
the soles of his feet and that he will have a speedy recovery.  We
pray this in Jesus mighty Name.  Amen and Amen.

Your sister in Christ,

Shelby--
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 22 Dec 1992 14:39:22 EST
From:         "jones, mark" <JMJONES@UGA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Operation Pest.
              22 Dec 1992 13:30:55 -0600 from <coen@ACC.WUACC.EDU>

>We are expecting our first grandbaby-does that count?

You bet, Jim. Sorry for being so narrow. If I hear and observe correctly
the grandbabies are just as exciting! Nieces and nephews too! Children
are truly a gift from the Lord!
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Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 10:09:43 -0700
From:         "Gordon C. Zaft" <zaft@CARITAS.COTDAZR.ORG>
Subject:      Re: Operation Pest.

On Dec 21,  7:21am, "DRCV06::GRAHAM" wrote:
} Subject: Operation Pest.
} I loved the article about the Operation Rescue rabble getting sung at when
} they tried to disrupt a church service.  When, oh when will Christians
} everywhere stand up and say that Terry and his reprobate organization don't
} represent them!
}
} I'm sure the people involved in this atrocity thought they were doing God's
} work, but so did the Jews who Crucified Jesus.  They need to be
} re-educated, right away.  There are enough reasons why the World can and
} will beat up on Christians, we most certainly don't need to add to their
} agendas by this kind of activity.
}
} Dan Graham
}-- End of excerpt from "DRCV06::GRAHAM"

        Come now, don't you think calling it an 'atrocity' is a bit
strong?

        Frankly, considering what the Presbyterians were sponsoring,
I would have been out there too.  It's an affront to all that
Christ stands for.

        Need to be re-educated, eh?  It's obvious that that particular
church has already been 're-educated' by society.  However, our values
are supposed to come from a higher source than secular society.

GZ

--
* Gordon Zaft     Argus Consulting  4500 E. Sunrise #N-6, Tucson, AZ 85718
* zaft@caritas.cotdazr.org | noao.edu!coyote!caritas!zaft
                 Semper fidelis Christi et Vicarii sui.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 16:21:40 EST
From:         Marty Helgesen <MNHCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Phillipine missionaries in Saudi Arabia

A prayer request for the Phillipine Missionaries in Saudi Arabia was
posted to the Free Catholic Mailing List which I read as
bit.listserv.catholic.  Here is a followup posting:
=========================================================================
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 09:09:09 PST
From:         "John R. Covert 23-Dec-1992 1204" <covert@COVERT.ENET.DEC.COM>
Subject: Re: Pray on Christmas Day for this martyr for Christ

>Is anyone doing anything practical. Like voicing a protest to our
>government?  -- Mary Matejka

Mary, I'm glad you wrote this.  It moved me to get more details on the
story in preparation for making some phone calls to the State Department,
and possibly to the U.S. Embassy in Saudi Arabia.

Fortunately, I found out that it won't be necessary.  The Philippine
Embassy informs me that the Philippine government was able to successfully
negotiate the release of the Philippine missionaries, who will be deported
to the Philippines within the next few days.  I am also informed that the
reports carried on a number of major radio and TV networks that one of them
had been sentenced to death were incorrect.

/john
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Marty Helgesen
Bitnet: mnhcc@cunyvm   Internet: mnhcc@cunyvm.cuny.edu

"Experience beats in vain upon a congenital progressive."
        --  C. S. Lewis
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Date:         Wed, 23 Dec 1992 08:34:56 -0500
From:         Braden Glen <d246@UNI05.LARC.NASA.GOV>
Subject:      From C S Lewis...

  Mathematicians, astronomers, and physicists are often religious, even
mystical; biologists much less often; economists and phychologist very seldom
indeed. It is as their subject matter comes closer to man himself that their
anti-religious bias hardens.
                                     'Religion without Dogma', Socratic Digest

  In our age I think it would be fair to say that the ease with which a
scientific theory assumes the dignity and rigidity of fact varies inversely with
the individual's scientific education.
                                     'The Discarded Image', ch 2

  In science we have been reading only the notes to a poem; in Christianity we
find the poem itself.
                                     'Miracles', ch. 14

Everyone have a merry Christmas and Blessed New Years...
  In His Love      Glen

Glen Braden                 d246@uni05.larc.nasa.gov
(Job titles too numerous    wk 804 865-9387
 list)                      hm 804 851-6530
UNISYS

'By examining the tongue, physicians find out the diseases of the body; and
 philosophers, the diseases of the mind and heart' -Justin
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Date:         Wed, 30 Dec 1992 11:21:30 -0500
From:         Braden Glen <d246@UNI05.LARC.NASA.GOV>
Subject:      From C S Lewis

'Is-is he a man?' asked Lucy.
'Aslan a man!' said Mr Beaver sternly. 'Certainly not. I tell you he is the
king of the wood and the son of the great Emperor-Beyond-The-Sea. Don't you
know who is the King of Beast? Aslan is a lion-the Lion, the great Lion.'
 'Ooh!' said Susan, 'I'd thought he was a man. Is he-quite safe? I shall feel
rather nervous about meeting a lion.'
'That you will, dearie, and make no mistake,' said Mrs Beaver, 'if there's
anyone who can appear before Aslan without their knees knocking, they're
either braver than most or else just silly.'
'Then he isn't safe?' said Lucy.
'Safe?' said Mr Beaver. 'Don't you hear what Mrs Beaver tells you? Who said
anything about safe? 'Course he isn't safe. But he's good. He's the King, I
tell you.'

         C S Lewis 'The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe'

In His Love
Glen

 Glen A Braden                           D246@uni05.larc.nasa.gov
 System Analyst                          wk 804 865-9387
 UNISYS                                  hm 804 851-6530

 'By and by when I look at His face, beautiful face, thorn scarred face,
    By and by when I look at His face, I'll wish I've given him more...'
                                              -Hymn,
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Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 13:40:25 -0600
From:         jim coen <coen@ACC.WUACC.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Operation Pest.

I haven't seen any lately.
From: DIEFENBAK@TOPAZ.UCQ.EDU.AU (Ken Diefenbach)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: Responsibility and Final Actions
Date: 21 Dec 92 22:50:00 GMT
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MAKS, Darren, and others

    Allow me to share with you about my Pa (grandfather). Pa isn't a great
writer of encouraging and moving books like Joni Erickson-Tada (sp?). Pa is
one of nature's rough diamonds. He grew up a hard man in hard times. He was
a bullocky (I think the US equivalent would be a mule-driver - in Oz they
used bullocks to haul trees out of forests) during the depression.

     Pa is 86. He had a huge stroke 11 + years ago. He is diabetic, has high
blood pressure, a plastic hip, arthritis. His left arm and side are still
partially paralyzed. Nanna died earlier this year. Had she lived, they would
have celebrated their diamond wedding earlier this month.

     Pa never gives up. He enjoys every last vestige of good things available
to him. He works continually at getting the most out of every available if
wasted muscle. Things he can't hope to achieve, he doesn't worry about. He is
a real blessing to us all in the example he sets.

     I'm glad Pa hangs on. All of us will be very sad when he finally goes.
But he has been an example to us all. He is a Christian (was converted at about
30 I think) and still tries to get to church as often as possible, and out for
things like carols by candle-light etc. I thank God for his example.

     As I scan this message, I think the spirit of Christmas has muddled me a
bit, the letter doesn't have too much to directly do with the Kevorkian thing.
Sorry folks. Rambling mode off.

Regards
Ken D.
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Original_cc:  XIAN
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 20:09:00 CDT
From:         "Love does not subtract, it multiplies." <HOLZMAN@FNAL.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: Boycotts, Rights, & Hypocricy

<    PM: There is a strong movement within the homosexual community to
<remove *ALL* age limitations with regards to sodomy.

This is a lie.  Nambla exixts, assuming it is not a governmentsting operation,
but is not a significant power base in the gay/lesbian/bisexual communities.

<(MAKS> But just
<because homosexuals want to do this, doesn't mean they wouldn't be good
<teachers. After all look at all the heterosexuals trying to get age
<limitations removed for raping girls. NOT.)

OK, then look at all the heterosexuals raping girls instead.  Shall we ban
heterosexuals from teaching?  They're a *proven* risk!  If you wish to bar
proven pedophiles from teaching, fine.  See the difference?

On a religious note, Michael, by propogating a claim that homosexuals as a
group seek to rape boys, you bear false witness against every single
homosexual who does not so desire.  I understand that your Diety is rather
down on such behavior.  This seems to me a poor witness of your Lord in your
life.

Dan
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Sat, 2 Jan 1993 22:09:43 EST
From:         JEK@NIHCU.BITNET
Subject: Re: CS LEWIS - SCREWTAPE REVIEW

Ian Williams writes:

 > Today I started and finished 'The Screwtape Letters' by CS
 > LEWIS.... It deals with letters from a senior demon to a junior
 > demon giving advice on how better to tempt the junior demon's
 > "patient".
 >
 > My major problem with the book is the huge Arminianism
 > undercurrent in the theology. The demons themselves did not
 > know for sure the salvation state of the person in question. No
 > born again experience of any sort was noted, just that the
 > person had become a christian.  Never throughout the whole book
 > was any indication of any eternal security noted (and I do not
 > think to put it down to author's license).

Ian, you object that the demons tempting humans in THE SCREWTAPE
LETTERS do not know whether a human they are tempting is one of
the elect. But suppose they did. Would they not spare themselves
the trouble of tempting anyone they knew was saved? And would they
not spare themselves the trouble of tempting anyone they knew
was damned? Given your premises, namely
   (1) eternal security, plus
   (2) knowledge by the demons of who is secure and who is not,
it seems to follow that demons will never tempt anyone at all.
Of course, many Christians who believe (1) will reject (2). I have
seen arguments for (1). Do you have any for (2)?

 Yours,
 James Kiefer
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 28 Dec 1992 16:11:00 CDT
From:         "Love does not subtract, it multiplies." <HOLZMAN@FNAL.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Operation Pest.

<besides, from what I understand, what was interrupted in this case
<was not a worship service but a workshop on teen sexuality (or did
<I misread the original post?).  That's a far cry from what happened
<at St. Pat's.

The article says:

"...the anti-abortion activist group Operation rescue attempted to disrupt a
WORSHIP SERVICE at a Dallas Presbeterian Church that HELD A TEEN SEXUALITY
CONFERENCE." (emph. mine)

As I read it, a worship service was disrupted because of controversy over a
sexuality conference.

Dan
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 29 Dec 1992 00:37:28 EST
From:         JEK@NIHCU.BITNET
Subject:      The Holy Innocents (28 Dec)

   THE HOLY INNOCENTS (28 DEC) (transferred to Tues 29 Dec)

We read in Matthew 2 that when Jesus was born in Bethlehem, King
Herod, fearing for his throne, ordered that all the male infants of
Bethlehem be killed. These children are regarded as martyrs for the
Gospel -- "martyrs in fact though not in will." Augustine called
them "buds, killed by the frost of persecution the moment they
showed themselves." For a discussion of the historical background of
the episode, send the message GET INFANCY PART1 to
LISTSERV@ASUACAD.BITNET or LISTSERV@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU.

(P.S. Sorry about the late posting on John -- my node was down.)

PRAYER (traditional language)
   We remember this day, O God, the slaughter of the holy
   innocents of Bethlehem by the order of King Herod. Receive, we
   beseech thee, into the arms of thy mercy all innocent victims;
   and by thy great might frustrate the designs of evil tyrants
   and establish thy rule of justice, love, and peace; through
   Jesus Christ our Lord, who liveth and reigneth with thee and
   the Holy Spirit, one God, for ever and ever.

PRAYER (contemporary language)
   We remember today, O God, the slaughter of the holy innocents
   of Bethlehem by King Herod. Receive, we pray, into the arms of
   your mercy all innocent victims; and by your great might
   frustrate the designs of evil tyrants and establish your rule
   of justice, love, and peace; through Jesus Christ our Lord,
   who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, one God,
   for ever and ever.
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Date:         Thu, 31 Dec 1992 16:36:44 -0700
From:         "Gordon C. Zaft" <zaft@CARITAS.COTDAZR.ORG>
Subject:      Re: Operation Pest.

On Dec 28,  4:11pm, "Love does not subtract, it multiplies." wrote:
} Subject: Re: Operation Pest.
} <besides, from what I understand, what was interrupted in this case
} <was not a worship service but a workshop on teen sexuality (or did
} <I misread the original post?).  That's a far cry from what happened
} <at St. Pat's.
}
} The article says:
}
} "...the anti-abortion activist group Operation rescue attempted to disrupt a
} WORSHIP SERVICE at a Dallas Presbeterian Church that HELD A TEEN SEXUALITY
} CONFERENCE." (emph. mine)
}
} As I read it, a worship service was disrupted because of controversy over a
} sexuality conference.
}
} Dan
}-- End of excerpt from "Love does not subtract, it multiplies."

I stand (well, sit) corrected.



--
* Gordon Zaft     Argus Consulting  4500 E. Sunrise #N-6, Tucson, AZ 85718
* zaft@caritas.cotdazr.org | noao.edu!coyote!caritas!zaft
                 Semper fidelis Christi et Vicarii sui.
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