HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: spira@panix.com (Greg "Sarcasm Is A Way Of Life" Spira)
Subject: Re: Mason/Maddux trade
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 03:23:53 GMT
Organization: Boo! 
Keywords: Mets, Padres

In <kbanaian.119.0@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu> kbanaian@bernard.pitzer.claremont.edu (King Banaian) writes:

>In article <1992Dec18.212948.18288@panix.com> spira@panix.com (Greg "Sarcasm Is A Way Of Life" Spira) writes:
>>
>>Yes.  Yes.  Usually, you're not allowed to trade a player you sign until
>>mid-season.  I assume that this was either a special circumstance or
>>Mason approved the trade.
>>
>Is that really true?  You sign a player to a contract and then have to keep 
>him?  I think that rule applies for draft picks signed (the Pete Incaviglia 
>Rule, if memory serves), but I never heard this applied to free agents?

I'm about 98% sure that there is a rule saying that you can't trade signed
free agents until June 1 or some date like that.  The Inky rule is a whole
different story; that says you can't trade a draft pick for a year after the
draft, I think.

I'd love to get my hands on something that explains all these rules in
detail.

Greg 
Organization: Doctoral student, Biology, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 16:33:05 -0500 
From: "J. Anthony Graves" <jg4e+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: $$$FANTASY LEAGUE$$$

This is the first posting.  I am looking for fans that are interested in
picking up a league in the Pittsburgh area.  I am willing to negotiate
all terms and rules, as well as the money that we will be playing for. 
Having computer access is a huge plus, but certainly not manditory.  If
you are interested please e-mail me at jg4e+@andrew.cmu.edu.  It can be
a really interesting and exciting time, if we can get a group of
interested and exciting people.  I'm waiting to hear from you.
-Tony Graves
From: deitch@gisatl.FIDONET.ORG (David Deitch)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Brave staff greatest in recent history?
Date: 11 Dec 92 23:40:00 GMT
Organization: Galaxy Information System (GIS) Atlanta, Ga

Dateline Thu, 10/Dec92 18:39.
In , Len Reed of lbr@holos0.uucp  wrote to All at 1:133/411,

 LR> Neither Smoltz nor Avery has ever won 20.  Why are they 
 LR> suddenly locks to do so?  Glavine won exactly 20 the 
 LR> last two years.  Maddox won 20 last year (though with a 
 LR> moribund offense).

     Avery won 19 I believe in '91.

 LR> Yes, any of these guys could win 20.  (Avery is the most 
 LR> suspect.) Any of them could even win 25.  But to count 4 
 LR> times 20 in December is ridiculous.

     So was the idea of the Braves in the World Series in Spring of 1991...

>The World Series is comin' back to the USA!

 LR> Of course, unless it's Jays versus Expos, which isn't 
 LR> impossible. (Wouldn't CBS love that!)  As to winning the 
 LR> World Series, the '54 Indians won 112 games (back when 
 LR> they only played 154) and got swept by the Giants.

     Greg Maddox chose Atlanta over an additional $6 million because he wanted a World Series Championship ring.  Almost as bad as the rest of the Atlanta Braves.  If it ever gets underway, it's going to be a great season.

          David Deitch, (GIS) Atlanta



--  
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Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: scott@asd.com (Scott Barman)
Subject: Re: All-time Mets
Organization: American Software Development Corp., West Babylon, NY
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:06:27 GMT

In article <1992Dec10.203219.21586@athena.mit.edu> frisch1@athena.mit.edu (Jonathan Katz) writes:
>Let's try:
>C: Gary Carter
>1B: Hernandez
>2B: Jefferies (for one year :-))
	Felix Millan?  Where would he fit?
>3B: HoJo
>OF: Strawberry
>OF: Dykstra
>OF: Agee
	Cleon Jones?  He only has the team record for BA in a season.
>P: Seaver
>P: Gooden
>P: Cone
>(not Ryan, he never had a great year with the Mets)
	Jon Matlack?  Only the 1972 ROY.
	Jerry Koosman?  The lefty pair with Seaver.
	Craig Swan?  Slighted on bad teams.
>RP: Tug Mcgraw
	Jesse Orosco?  Mets all-time save leader.
>Mgr: Johnson
	Gil Hodges?  (Need I say more?)

-- 
scott barman			| <This space intentionally left blank>
scott@asd.com			|
 (I can barely speak for myself, you expect me to speak for my employer??)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: paula@koufax.cv.hp.com (Paul Andresen)
Subject: Re: NUMBER 24
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:33:59 GMT

In article <20004@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> itlm013@george.ucdavis.edu (Captain Caveman) writes:

|> >I think that Bonds is every bit
|> >the player Mays was - both were top of the heap.  

To paraphrase a certain [ex] A's pitcher with the squeeky voice:
Bonds couldn't even carry Mays' jock strap. I can't think of a single phase of
the game where Bonds approaches Mays. Let's wait about 10 years, and then see
if anyone even remembers who Barry was.

--->Paul, hates the Jints, but loved Mays
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
              If you're really hip, the passing years will show.
                                           ......Tower Of Power

  paula@koufax.cv.hp.com   Paul Andresen  Hewlett-Packard  (503)-750-3511

    home: 3006 NW McKinley    Corvallis, OR 97330       (503)-752-8424
                            A SABR member since 1979
From: ccastmm@prism.gatech.EDU (Mike Marler)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Brave staff greatest in recent history?
Date: 15 Dec 92 05:50:24 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In <770.2B298426@gisatl.FIDONET.ORG> deitch@gisatl.FIDONET.ORG (David Deitch) writes:

|>Dateline Thu, 10/Dec92 18:39.
|>In , Len Reed of lbr@holos0.uucp  wrote to All at 1:133/411,
|
|> LR> Neither Smoltz nor Avery has ever won 20.  Why are they 
|
|>     Avery won 19 I believe in '91.
|
Let us not forget something that I consider almost as important: the NLCS MVP
in 1991.
-- 
Mike Marler                        | "Saving every nickel to spend on my
Internet: ccastmm@prism.gatech.edu |  my next set of thrills..." -somebody
Disclaimer: These views are not and should not be viewed as those of OIT.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: dave@bradley.bradley.edu (David Vessell)
Subject: Re: NL East analysis.k
Organization: Bradley University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 06:49:45 GMT

iacurtop@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Iacurto Paul) writes:
>
>So it looks like a thrre team race between the Mets, Expos and
>Cardinals. Cubs and Phillies will fight for fourth. Pirates will
>finish last.
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Is my ratings system accurate?

I don't know....you're not really considering defenses in all that.

>Have I over estimated or under estimated certain players?

Well, you failed to take into consideration that, in all likelihood, Jose
Oquendo will resume his starting position at 2nd for the Cardinals.  His
.300 bat and 40+ SB speed might make more of a difference than Pena.

-- 
 davE.   Making the world safe for intelligent dance music.  dave@bradley.edu.
########## David L. Vessell -- Bradley University Computing Services #########
    "The opposite of love is not hate but indifference." -- Sigmund Freud
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Subject: Stats Inc Major League Handbook
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 13:53:38 GMT


I just got my copy, and was struck by a few things:

"I find the Handbook is a complete and comprehensive tool... my coaches
and I refer to [it] constantly to help us in our game preparation." -- Jeff
Torborg, NYMets manager.

Isn't that slander or something?

And, of course, about the Minor League Handbook:

"STATS has been very helpful over the years in assisting me to evaluate
players and in making trades." -- Larry Himes, Chicago Cubs, executive
VP, baseball operations.

Oh yeah?  Then why do you keep acquiring Sammy Sosa?

As an aside, does anyone really believe that they'll be able to develop
a pitcher projection system?  I don't.

-- 
David M. Nieporent   | Is it too early to start making predictions for 1993?
niepornt@phoenix.    | Probably, but that never stopped me before.
   princeton.edu     | ALE: Baltimore ALW: Chicago NLE: Montreal NLW: Atlanta
Baltimore Orioles 93 | AL MVP: Cal Ripken  AL Cy Young: Mike Mussina
From: sgs@stein.u.washington.edu (Steven Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Birthdays
Date: 11 Dec 92 22:34:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Dec11.223405.3354
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

Baseball Birthdays

December 10
Steve Renko, 1944
James Dalton Jones, 1943
Ike Cabaney, 1894
Paul Assenmacher, 1960
Rick Wrona, 1963
Art Griggs, 1883
Jim Stephens, 1883
Bob Roselli, 1931

December 11
Charley "Hoss" Radbourn, 1854 (HOF)
Lee Maye, 1934
Bill "Swish" Nicholson, 1914
Eddie and John O'Brien, 1930
Hal "Skinny" Brown, 1924
Fred Toney, 1887
Art Wilson, 1885
Jay Bell, 1965
Mike Henneman, 1961

December 12
Ralph "Roadrunner" Garr, 1945
Gorman Thomas, 1950
Dave Revering, 1953
George Wright, 1958
Clyde Kluttz, 1917
Tully Sparks, 1874
James "Phenomenal" Smith, 1864
Steve Farr, 1956

December 13
Larry Doby, 1924
Ferguson Jenkins, 1943 (HOF)
Carl "Oisk" Erskine, 1926
Lindy McDaniel, 1935
Dale Berra, 1956
Billy Loes, 1929
Ron Taylor, 1937
J.C. Martin, 1936
Hank Majeski, 1916
Jeff Dan Robinson, 1960
Shotgun Shuba, 1924
Bubba Morton, 1931

--Steve

-- 
 sgs@u.washington.edu             * "The tall people want what the 
 Steve Smith                      *  short people got."
 University of Washington HR-20   *    --D. Wiggin-"Philosophy of the World"	 
 Seattle, WA 98195                *
From: rickert@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (John H. Rickert)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Casey quote (WAS Re: Blue Jays-Gillick)
Date: 18 Dec 1992 22:18:22 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department at Rose-Hulman
Reply-To: rickert@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (John H. Rickert)
NNTP-Posting-Host: g215a-1.nextwork.rose-hulman.edu

In article <1992Dec17.092432.15033@Princeton.EDU>  
niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent) writes:

> Exactly.  Who was it who said "I've been lucky enough to play for Casey 
> Stengal before and after he was a genius?"

I'm a little' behind the times' reading these articles (doggone exams), 
but I'll post anyway ...
It was Warren Spahn.

john rickert
rickert@nextwork.rose-hulman.edu
If you thought the Henderson or Miller team was sparse...
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Subject: Re: Brian Dorsett
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 00:18:13 GMT

In article <18DEC199212052600@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu> doctor8@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu (Jason Abner Miller) writes:
>In <1992Dec17.214529.2185@midway.uchicago.edu>, thf2@midway.uchicago.edu says:
>>In article <1992Dec17.204828.19676@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> akamholz@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Andrew E Kamholz) writes:

>>>Well, I suppose you are right. If he has the talent and the health, there's
>>>no reason, though, that he couldn't still be considered a prospect.

>>Sure there is.  A prospect is someone who is potentially successful.
>>In baseball, 32-year-olds aren't "might become"s, they're "used to be"s.
>>Dorsett isn't going to become a better player.  He's a poor fielder,
>>and not such a great hitter.

>	Dorsett probably sucks.
>	But, 2 years ago, what did all you guys say about that 33 year-old
>castoff, retread, and nobody, Skeeter Barnes?

I said he probably sucks.  And I haven't seen anything to change my mind
about that, either.

He had a limited amount of success in 1991 in a grand total of 159 ABs.
That's it for his major league "sucesss."

Hell, Junior Ortiz once hit .335 in 170 ABs.

-- 
David M. Nieporent   | Is it too early to start making predictions for 1993?
niepornt@phoenix.    | Probably, but that never stopped me before.
   princeton.edu     | ALE: Baltimore ALW: Chicago NLE: Montreal NLW: Atlanta
Baltimore Orioles 93 | AL MVP: Cal Ripken  AL Cy Young: Mike Mussina
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: santiago signs with marlins
Organization: Allegheny College
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 20:20:58 GMT

 Benito Santiago has signed a two-year $7 million deal with the expansion  
Flordia Marlins.  This gives them instant creditability and a Hispanic  
draw for a large Hispanic community in Miami.

--
Would the last one out please turn off the lights ...
	Tom Gwitt	gwittt@alleg.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Subject: Re: Two out of three gone (Ripkens that is)
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 05:26:26 GMT

In article <1gb3o8INNi3q@uwm.edu> paul@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Paul R Krueger) writes:
>Just heard that Baltimore signed Harold Reynolds and released Billy "I live
>off the family name" Ripken. Rejoice O's fans.

Why?  This is worse than keeping Ripken.  At least he doesn't cost a
draft pick.

Reynolds is no better than Ripken.  No better than McLemore.  Certainly
not better than the semi-platoon.  I'd rather play Hulett there.  He's just
as long term a solution.

ICK.  The only reason I'm not screaming is because (1) I was expecting
it, (2) I'm incredibly relieved the Dawson rumor didn't come true, and
(3) it was only a one year contract.


-- 
David M. Nieporent   | Is it too early to start making predictions for 1993?
niepornt@phoenix.    | Probably, but that never stopped me before.
   princeton.edu     | ALE: Baltimore ALW: Chicago NLE: Montreal NLW: Atlanta
Baltimore Orioles 93 | AL MVP: Cal Ripken  AL Cy Young: Mike Mussina
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: wall@cc.swarthmore.edu (Matthew Wall)
Subject: Re: Expos or Phillies?X
Followup-To: rec.sport.baseball
Organization: Swarthmore College Computing CenterCenter
Distribution: rec
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 19:22:08 GMT

Filling in a few blanks here:

> 
> 
> Who will have a better team in 93: the Expos or Phillies?
> 
> Mail answers at iacurtop@ere.umontreal.ca
> 
> 
>                  EXPOS                   PHILLIES
> C                Tim Laker               Darren Daulton
> 1B               Greg Colbrunn           John Kruk
> 2B               Delino Deshields        Mickey Morandini
> SS               Wil Cordero             Mariano Duncan
> 3B               Tim Wallach             Dave Hollins
> LF               Moises Alou             Wes Chamberlain

Pete Incaviglia will likely get lots of pt in the OF for the Phils

> CF               Marquis Grissom         Len Dykstra
> RF               Larry Walker            Stan Javier
> 
> SP1              Dennis Martinez         Terry Mulholland
> SP2              Ken Hill                Kurt Schilling
> SP3              Chris Nabholz           Tommy Greene
> SP4              Mike Gardiner           Danny Jackson
> SP5              Ken Bottenfield         ???
> 
Ben Rivera is ahead of Greene on the depth chart. A quality young starter.

> R                Mel Rojas               Mitch Williams
> R                John Wetteland          ?????

the Phils are close to signing Larry Andersen and possibly John Candelaria.
Andersen might help - or he might just glue sunflower seeds to Lenny
Dykstra's chaw.

My own 2c: The Expos in a walk. The Phils might make a run at 3rd.

- matt

---------------------------------------------------------
This space left intentionally blank until spring training.
From: deitch@gisatl.FIDONET.ORG (David Deitch)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: ward to atlant
Date: 18 Dec 92 05:21:58 GMT
Organization: Galaxy Information System (GIS) Atlanta, Ga

Dateline Wed, 16/Dec92 03:39.
In , UUCP of 2r73bryantm@vms.csd.mu.edu wrote to All at 1:133/411,

 U> ANY word on the D Ward to atlanta for mercker or wholers??

     Not likely.  We already got rid of Ward once - its not likely we would take him back again...

Which opens up a good question...

How many players have started their careers with a team, been traded, then later in their career traded back?

          David Deitch, (GIS) Atlanta



--  
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  (________)    (_/(_|(____/ (jm)   
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: paladin@leland.Stanford.EDU (Jason Gische)
Subject: Re: Brave staff greatest in recent history?
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 92 21:06:52 GMT

In article <1g7l1dINN9b1@transfer.stratus.com> gene@bogus.sw.stratus.com (Eugene Loparco) writes:
>In article <cubsfan.723966608@camelot> cubsfan@camelot.bradley.edu (Michael Silverman) writes:
>>Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, Avery 20 wins apiece
>>Pete Smith 15 or so...plus the usual scattering of middle
>>reliever wins.
>
>I'd rather have Gooden, Viola, Cone, Fernandez, Darling from a few years
>back...

Except that by that time, Darling was already mediocre, Gooden was first
recovering from surgery and had the worst year of his career, and Viola
was his usual great-first-half-shitty-second-half self.  That staff
will forever look better on paper than it really was.  And it hurt to
see.

Now you might be able to make a case for the 1986 staff:
Gooden, Ojeda, Darling, Fernandez, Aguilera.

Wait a year and see.

Jason Gische
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Mattingly discussion, take 2.
Date: 18 Dec 1992 18:22:44 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer Inc, Marlboro MA
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: gondolin.pubs.stratus.com

In article <1992Dec18.172048.18109@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu>  
akamholz@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Andrew E Kamholz) writes:
> In article <92352.051418RVESTERM@vma.cc.nd.edu>  
<RVESTERM@vma.cc.nd.edu> writes:
> >first off, while i am sure that there have been gold glove winners
> >who were the best (defensively) at their position, in general, the
> >award is one big popularity contest.  mattingly, like ozzie smith,
> >wins because he used to be good.  i think he's still slightly  
above
> >average, but he's not the best.  not by a long shot.
> 
> Have you guys who continually knock Mattingly's defensive skills  
SEEN
> HIM PLAY? I have. The only guy in the league who comes close to his
> ability is Mark McGwire, who I have also seen play. (I drove cross  
country
> and saw several games at each of several parks). Wally Joyner is  
next,
> followed by Kent Hrbek. I don't know what you're considering in  
your
> formula for defensive ability, but he is, by a long shot, the best.

How many games have you seen him play?  And how many games have
you seen the others play?  Enough to really say who is best?
There are a number of players who I only see half a dozen times
per year. Some of those players hit very well indeed during those
games. Joe X, for example, may have a great swing, drive the ball 
well, etc. I've seen him. Can I now say he is the best in the league,
or should I also look at stats from the other games as well
as stats for other players?  I doubt anyone would say this
was a good basis for calling someone the best hitter; why, then,
do we do the same thing for defense?  

In fact, defense is a step worse.  It would be more like the hitting 
scenario above but with the added complication that I don't keep 
score. I just remember that Joe X had some impresive hits, he
connect well, seemed to make contact a lot, had a nice looking
swing, etc.  

Mattingly still LOOKS good on defense (and really he's not bad).
But he only gets to an average number of balls hit toward him.
If he's the best in the league, why doesn't he get to more?

--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: mjones@fenway.aix.kingston.ibm.com (Mike Jones)
Subject: Re: All-time Red Sox team
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 15:54:14 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

campbell@rz-berlin.mpg.de writes:
: >>In article <1992Dec10.195508.23031@watson.ibm.com>, mjones@fenway.aix.kingston.ibm.com (Mike Jones) writes:
: >>|> To sort of paper over the angst I've gotten from Lou Abbott's (I know, it's
: >>|> It seems like there's a really good first team, but my bench is kind of
: >>|> weak. Who am I forgetting?  	
: >>|> SP  Cy Young
: >>|> 	Roger Clemens
: >>|> 	Lefty Grove
: >>|> 	Smoky Joe Wood
: >>|> 	Luis Tiant
: >>	Bill Monbouquette
: >>	Bill Lee (well, occasionally. And for pure entertainment value!)
: > Actually, Lee was the next name on my list. He did win 17 three years in a
: > row, no mean feat for a lefty in Fenway. I don't think I could take
: > Monbouquette over any of those guys, 
: > Tiant:                     Eckersley:          Lee
: How do Mel Parnell (another lefty) and Dick Radatz (Reliever on shitty teams)
: stack up?

Parnell had four really good years. In a ten-year career (123-75, 3.50), he
went 15-8, 3.14 in 1948, 25-7, 2.77 in '49, 18-10, 3.61 in '50, 18-11, 3.26
in '51, and 21-8, 3.06 in '53. He's definitely in the running for the #5
spot. Radatz had a short, but high, peak:

1962  9-6, 2.24, 24Sv
1963 15-6, 1.97, 25Sv
1964 16-9, 2.29, 29Sv
1965 9-11, 3.91, 22Sv

in 1966, he only had 19 IP, then was traded to Cleveland and did nothing
notable after that. I think we could make room for him in the pen.

   Mike Jones  |  AIX/ESA Development  |  mjones@donald.aix.kingston.ibm.com

Sometimes I feel like I'd like to resign. Let Agnew be President for a while.
He'd love it.
	- Richard Nixon
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: jeffh@pisces.sps.mot.com  (Jeff Heilner)
Subject: Re: All-Time Oakland A's Team
Organization: Motorola SPS - Tempe, AZ
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 16:23:50 GMT

In article <1992Dec16.192725.18039@midway.uchicago.edu>  
thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank) writes:
> Sheesh, Billy Martin really did decimate his pitching staff, didn't he?
> The 1980-81 A's had really amazing starting pitching, and they all blew
> their arms out.

This seems to be the popular opinion; that Mike Norris, Rick Langford,  
Matt Keough, and Steve McCatty were great pitchers whose arms were ruined  
by Martin's unwillingness to use a bullpen (which was non-existent).

But, I give Billy Martin (and pitching coach Art Fowler) credit for  
getting stellar performance out of mediocre talent, rather than blame for  
ruining "a great staff."

Why? Well, none of these pitchers really distinguished themselves prior to  
their years under Martin. None were great college pitchers, or even great  
minor league pitchers. For one, Keough started out as a position player in  
the minors.

I'm not gonna argue that 16 inning complete games are a healthy way to run  
a pitching staff. We all know it's not. 

It's just that I feel that these pitchers may never have achieved the  
"greatness" they are purported to have had if it wasn't for the man who is  
so popularly blamed for destroying them.


Of course, I don't have any stats to back up my opinion, so it's probably  
all a bunch of "bunk", huh?  ;)

- jrh
 
--
**************************************************************************
Jeff Heilner                      Motorola - Semiconductor Products Sector 
Software Engineer                 Network Support and Development
jeffh@pisces.sps.mot.com (NeXT)   Tempe, Arizona USA
**************** GO A'S! **** GO SHARKS! **** GO WARRIORS! ***************
   
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball