HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Server Bug (PATCH)
Date: 26 Jan 93 16:55:18 GMT
Organization: Deep Thirteen, Gizmonics Institute

bharat@shadow.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>[Server bug in docked refueling]
>Yes, I noticed this problem a while back and patched it on my server.
>--------- PATCH BEGINS -----------
>in daemonII.c change:
>                /* Add fuel */
>                    j->p_fuel +=  8 * j->p_ship.s_recharge;
>                    j->p_fuel += 12 * j->p_ship.s_recharge;
>                    j->p_fuel +=  2 * j->p_ship.s_recharge;

Note that in the old way, a ship will get 2, 8, or 12 times refuel rate.

>to:
>                j->p_fuel += 2 * j->p_ship.s_recharge;
>                if  (...) {          /* fuel planet */
>                   j->p_fuel +=  8 * j->p_ship.s_recharge;
                                 ^^^
>                } else if (...) {    /* docked on SB */
>                   j->p_fuel += 12 * j->p_ship.s_recharge;
                                ^^^^
>                }
>---------- PATCH ENDS ---------------

This is basically the same as the patch I posted yesterday, EXCEPT
that you didn't reduce the additional refuel rate for fuel planet or
SB to insure that the net refuel rates stay the same.  This strikes me
as a perhaps unwarranted change of game balance, especially with
regard to speeding up fuel planet refueling by 25%.

The 8 and 12 should probably be changed to 6 and 10, as I did
yesterday, to keep the impact of the patch on play minimal.

-Leonard
From: ss72+@andrew.cmu.edu (Sean Christopher Simmons)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Shorter games?
Date: 27 Jan 93 04:02:07 GMT
Organization: Sponsored account, School Of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


	I don't know how it is for other players, but for me first hour always
sort of drags, but the second just flys by.  When we played 3-hour games
(CMU internal league) the 3rd hour began to drag too.  On the other
hand, overtime is my favorite part of INL play.  I don't doubt that this
is partly because play is so intense in overtime.
	Tom seems too have two reasons for wanting to shorten the game:
1) Two hours if too long for one game of netrek.  Keeping up that level
of intensity for that long is too tiring.
2) Shorter games increase the chance of an upset.

	Well, the first seems like a simple case of personal perference.  I
normally feel like I play better an better as the game goes on, so I
like a longer game.  It also allows more chance to use the SB in various
different ways which can be important. 
	As for the second point, it seems to undermine the whole point of
having even games.  Isn't the better team SUPPOSED to win?  Isn't the
team that wins the championship supposed to be the best team?  If not,
then what is the point of all of the planned even scheduals and
play-offs and all?  In short, this arguement seems like a much better
point AGAINST a shorter game.  If you really want random results, why
not start the game off in overtime.  That will make it a lot shorter too.
	 I don't know about others, but I like netrek.  I really enjoy INL
games, because they're the highest quality netrek.  Naturally, I want my
best games to last for a while.  If you see the game as some kind of a
chore that must be done, then perhaps you should re-think why you're
playing in the INL at all.

ZZnew guy
From: gc2n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Greg K Chung)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Server Bug
Date: 24 Jan 93 15:22:18 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.cfMo3_u00VAzA5yXIK
Organization: Sophomore, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


We recently found on bronco.ece (and therefore many other servers) a
disturbing bug:

A SB, doing nothing, at 60K fuel.
A BB, doing nothing, docks on the SB.  Nothing extraordinary happens.

BUT:  When the BB turns its shields on, even at full fuel, and still
doing nothing (SB shields down, doing nothing) the SB LOSES FUEL.  

Given that the BB generates enough fuel for its own shields at warp 0,
and the SB more then generates that much, how can the net effect be a
LOSS of fuel?

This effect is probably prevalent elsewhere with regards to other
ships.  Who knows. 


Rear Admiral "#10 Base" Stiletto
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 19:54:08 -0500 
From: Sean Christopher Simmons <ss72+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Yea, tho' I walk through the valley of the shadow of Red Shirt
	<books.185.0@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu>
	<ofKrzA600VokMbUG0X@andrew.cmu.edu>
	<kfLCujq00WBLA8S2h=@andrew.cmu.edu>

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 20-Jan-93 Re: Yea, tho' I walk
throug.. Jason Sung Park@andrew.c (3699)

> Scouts			planets	armies	kills	deaths
> psycho		(F0)	 1	  27	  25	  48
> guest  		(F0)	 2	  46	  30	  46
> Balton		(F1)	 4	 117	  88	 112
> Stigmata	(F3)	 3	  90	  80	  74
> Warlock		(F4)	 5	  82	  61	  70
> Crack Pot	(F6)	 5	 129	  35	  75
> null_void	(Fa)	 2	  83	  48	 113
> Brother X	(Fc)	 3	 118	  91	 106
> Red Shirt	(Fe)	 8	 261	  70	  56
>  
> Total			33	 953	 528	 700
>  
>  
> Other
> Val Ckurai	(R2)	 6	 137	 108	  68
> Ladyhawke	(R5)	 2	 191	  95	  83
> Kill_The_Scums	(R7)	 4	 169	  98	  91
> Phantom		(R8)	 5	  55	  70	  74
> Balinor		(R9)	 1	   3	  39	  21
> Lancelot	(Rb)	 3	   0	  18	  20
> Mr. Wizard	(Rb)	 1	  10	  24	  18
> Adrenochrome	(Rb)	 1	   8	  22	   8
> SpaceAce!	(Rd)	 3	 233	  78	  72
> grapes		(Rf)	 7	  61	  72	  58
> Balinor SB				  49	   2

	At one point, the non-scouts took Den (Agri)
	The SC wee not allowed AS in the opening bombing wave or a SB at any time.

Psycho and Lancelot were probably the weakest players in the game.
I don't know who guest or Stigmata were.
Brother X was ZZnew guy
Ladyhawke was EEK!
Kill_The_Scums was Akira
grapes was tufu

ZZnew guy
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Pop code compromise?   Plague code?
Date: 27 Jan 93 05:18:36 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1k4gje$rbv@agate.berkeley.edu> beorn@elk.Berkeley.EDU (Beorn Johnson) writes:
)
)OK, so what objections are there to this plan?  I think someone actually
)implemented this some time back (but I forgot the server).  Actually, I think
)this has been proposed already, but no one is careful enough to distinguish
)arguments for/against 10-second pops and arguments for/against scattered pops.

It was on bezier.  It's the proposal I made to the council a while back,
as well, but it looks like if we're going to get some fix in the
pop clock thing this season it will be on the 'we are updating the
server to emulate all bronco-based servers, except, ironically, bronco,'
which would mean 10-second pops.

)Someone a while back complained about the plague code.  I was in an
)INL game where my team's homeworld plagued in the first 30 seconds.
)I think the plague parameters could be re-tuned to prevent this and
)hardly anyone would notice.  Note that plagues are designed to limit
)the natural growth of armies, and prevent a team from stockpiling a
)planet so heavily that an enemy ship explodes before reaching orbit.
)You can smooth things out by making plague more likely but costing
)fewer armies.  Since planets an INL game don't have many armies for
)most of the game anyway, the only visible affect would be that no one
)gets their homeworld plagued to four in the opening minute.  (Makes
)game more "comparable").

This seems reasonable to me, but I'm sure someone will have an
argument.

)And another thing:  Why not just start INL games with 6 armies on each
)planet?  I hate the opening AS round.

I've felt this way too, but the SB needs to be able to load up on armies,
at least.  You'd really need 15 per planet or so, or 6 per planet and
20 or 25 on the homeworld.  But right now I have other flame wars
to deal with.
 -Tom
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: theodore@wam.umd.edu (Theodore Jonathan Casser)
Subject: Farm League Update
Reply-To: theodore@wam.umd.edu
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 01:00:15 GMT

Greetings again!
I realize that it has only been one day since my last post.  Since  
yesturday, after my post at 21:20 GMT (that's 4:20 PM EST for those of you  
who don't think on Greenwich Meridian Time =^) )  I have reiceved several  
enthusiastic responses.  At the current rate, we may have four or five  
teams of newbies in the new season.
	Again, any newbies who are interested in playing Netrek with other  
newbies this spring should contact me at <theodore@wam.umd.edu> or at  
<saavik@eng.umd.edu>  Thank you again for your attention.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
T.J. Casser  <theodore@wam.umd.edu>
"It's not what you know, it's who you know..."
Let's go Terps!
(301)314-8554   7114 Elkton Hall, College Park, Md 20742
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Picard: Worf, do you have eleven weapons on you?
  Worf: Of course not, sir.
Picard: Good... How many DO you have on you?
  Worf: Fourteen.
        ...
  Gava: Fourteen?  In a uniform far less designed                   
        for weapons concealment than that of a
        Klingon?  Very impressive.
  Worf: Everything about me is very impressive.
                   _Strike_Zone_
From: mccoy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Jim McCoy)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Abusive Misuse of Tedd Hadley's Server
Date: 21 Jan 1993 22:26:05 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas - Austin
Distribution: world
Reply-To: mccoy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Jim McCoy)
NNTP-Posting-Host: tramp.cc.utexas.edu
Keywords: request
Originator: mccoy@tramp.cc.utexas.edu


In article <srt.727642355@aerospace.aero.org>, srt@aero.org (Scott Turner) writes:
> hadley@thoth.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley) writes:
> >   My experiments with robot oggers and a robot base...
> 
> Tedd Hadley has provided us with the base ogg server, an invaluable
> and clever tool.  [...]
> 
> I therefore suggest a "clue game" on Tedd's base ogg server
> (vlsi.ics.uci.edu), say 1/21 and 1/22 at 4:00 PST.  Imagine if you
> will a universe where every planet is Agri, Fuel and Repair, every
> player can base, and (if Tedd whips some quick mods into the code) where
> bases can take planets and bases can dock on bases.

But can a base dock with a base docked with a base....

Now _that_ would be something to see (visions of 2 teams of 8 bases linked
together, sharing thier fuel and repair with each other come to mind...)

jim
-- 
Jim McCoy                |  PGP 2.0 Key md5 hash:
mccoy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu |  61323c49024cb089337c78a05aafe8c6
j-mccoy@nwu.edu          |  finger mccoy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu for public key


Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: sherod@newton.Colorado.EDU (Scott Herod)
Subject: Re: Improving the DD
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 22:05:42 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.204551.17033@en.ecn.purdue.edu> bdhall@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Brian D Hall) writes:
>
>	If you want to "experience" the impact of adding 1000 fuel to the DD,
>come play at fife.ecn.purdue.edu.  That mod has been in place for quite some
>time.
>
>   Brian Hall
>   (bdhall@ecn.purdue.edu)

But fife still has the fire-out-the rear penalty (?).   This hurts my
dog fighting.  I usually turn towards someone, then turn away, then fire.

I have avoided getting into this so far...  Anyway, if people think the
DD needs to be improved (I don't) there are two things to consider.
First, the DD does not have a readily defined role like the SC or AS.
Many people have pointed out that given any of the standard task there
is a better ship than the DD.  Unless some new strategy develops that
will remain the case. 
Second, any change that increases fire power only makes it more like a
CA, yet it will never become the pure fighter that the CA is without
becoming a CA.

If people insist on improving the DD why not raise its shields and hull
a bit?  5 each maybe too much though.

The BB one the other hand.  I only fly one in LPS (and occasionally SB
oggs) when the final planet has fuel or better when it is near an enemy
fuel planet.

Mad DDogg
From: fadden@hkn.Berkeley.EDU (Andy McFadden)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: This is a test
Date: 27 Jan 1993 21:08:29 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: hkn.berkeley.edu

Trying yet again to post news.
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: wang@db.toronto.edu (Huaiqing Wang)
Subject: Re: Biggest scum? (Was Re: Yea, tho' I walk through the.... ) 
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 24 Jan 93 04:08:58 GMT

>7+ on bombing, 3+ on planets, 0.5< on offense in something like 3 or 4 hours.

Errrr, correction. 7+ planets, 5+ bombing, 0.5< offence. Also, I never said
I was the biggest scum. I suppose the entire BOBO (add spaces after
appropriately) is fairly big. But I suppose chi and Greg and maybe even
SpaceAce! will argue about that.

I am just the biggest (best? :)) twink around. I don't have a clue how to
scum, let along dogfight. I have been following ZZnew guy's "Admiral in
a day" guide quite religiously. :)

	-- Rabbit Hunter
From: noah@cad.gatech.edu (Noah White)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: From the STatbOy: Regular stat postings?
Date: 26 Jan 1993 19:19:18 -0500
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: cae.cad.gatech.edu

In <1993Jan26.195244.8255@coe.montana.edu> osyjm@cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) writes:
>For the upcoming season, is there any interest in my posting regular stats
>of the games, and the cumulative stats for the players?  
>I've got most of the scripts finished now, so this could be done.

>Team captains could possible use it to look for strong players on other
>teams, although most likely people know who those are anyway...

  I second this motion. 

-Noah


Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James Hawtin)
Subject: Re: SFB netrek
Reply-To: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk
Organization: School of Computer Science, The University of Birmingham, UK
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 06:53:31 GMT

Give it a try.... sounds interesting, perhaps you should have the larger
galaxy as well? If people like it they will vote with their feet :-)


			James.

Commodore "I may have a rank but I still play like a twink" wibble
From: sfd@soda.berkeley.edu (Scott Drellishak)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Paradise, tonight, 8 + players
Date: 21 Jan 1993 19:15:43 GMT
Organization: Metaphor Computer Systems
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <l5j3rwh@rpi.edu> colles@vccnw06.its.rpi.edu (Grey Knight (Shawn Collenburg)) writes:
)sl7sg@cc.usu.edu writes:
)>	Ok, there you go.
)>		The address is :  paradise.declab.usu.edu -p 2592
)>			-Lynx
)If I played, I'd use the name PlAnEtScUm, esp. w/ the reduced weapons.
)
)Grey Knight

Paradise is an experimental server to try out new and odd mods.  I
think you'll be surprised by how long it takes to fly to those planets
you're going to scum.  In any case, don't condemn a mod until it's
been playtested a bit -- balance isn't easy to achieve.
-- 
/--------------------------------------------------------------------------\
| Scott Drellishak   sfd@neuromancer.metaphor.com                          |
|                "Spumco ... the Danes call it quality."                   |
\--------------------------------------------------------------------------/
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: keith@majestix.cs.uoregon.edu (Keith Steiger)
Subject: Re: Abusive Misuse of Tedd Hadley's Server
Summary: yipes!
Organization: University of Oregon Computer and Information Sciences Dept.
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 22:58:36 GMT

In article <1jn7ttINN5v2@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu> mccoy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Jim McCoy) writes:
>But can a base dock with a base docked with a base....
>Now _that_ would be something to see (visions of 2 teams of 8 bases linked
>together, sharing thier fuel and repair with each other come to mind...)

I can just see what would happen if one of those bases died in the middle
of a heated battle, though.  "Chain reaction" seems insufficient to describe
that kind of devastation.

	Keith Steiger
	formerly ameiba of Reed's 300ms+, now on a T1 line
	"Has anyone compiled blessed/RSA binaries for a Sparc?"

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: lnklam@cayley.uwaterloo.ca ()
Subject: Re: Another Base lost!!!!!
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 06:51:18 GMT

In article <1993Jan23.202300.11462@ncsu.edu> jecoleb@eos.ncsu.edu writes:
>
>*hee hee!*  Now, that's something I hadn't thought of... using the
>MetaServer to search for oggable SBs on low-clue servers. :)
>
	No kidding. The least the base expects an ogg, the easier it 
will be to ogg. Also, look for servers with say 4 against 4 (or 5vs5/6vs6).
Chances are the base(s) will be wondering on its own, picking up armies, with
little or no escort, possibly somewhere near the front line. Extra bonus if no
repair planet nearby.

>Next time YOU base, remember this -- an SB is almost *always* a juicy target.
>Whenever I'm playing, if there's an enemy SB out there, we're not in a 
>particularly desperate situation and there's a couple of others interested 
>in ogging, it dies.  Painfully.
>
	True. But not if the base is hanging back near HP and with defenders.
The base will become more defensive in posture if an ogg is imminent. So, 
the next time I base, especially in a low clue 4 vs 4, I will watch out for 
base-ogg scummers (like you, maybe?). Geez, maybe I should base only in clued
8vs8 game, eh?

>There are few things in life more pleasing for an ogg-scum like myself than
>watching an SB spew its internal mechanisms in multiple directions.
>
>And, no, I wasn't one of the oggers in this case.  Just wish I had had the
>opportunity.
>
	Well, why don't you go ahead and be a slot/base-ogg scummer, as
described in the original post? Keep pressoring/tractoring the base off
an repair planet with your scum character on the same team; then ogg the
base on the other team. Before long, with luck, you'll get the see the
explosion of those "internal mechanisms".

>		---Lt. Cmdr. ItFlies,ItDies., NCSU (certified base-scum)
>		   "Arrogance is an exact science."
>
-COLD
Keith (Killer on garnet)
"Ignorance is an exact art."

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ss72+@andrew.cmu.edu (Sean Christopher Simmons)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Pop Timer
Date: 25 Jan 93 17:56:48 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.QfN=O0K00VpNM3P1kp
Organization: Sponsored account, School Of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


	I think that an important point when declairing or not declairing the
Pop timer illegle is that it is independant of the client.  It doesn't
get info from the client, nor does it provide info to the client.  If I
wanted to put a clock down next to my monitor, would this be illegle? 
What if I modified the clock for 2/3 RPM?  Mods that others have
suggested that detect cloakers, show phaser circles, etc are NOT client
independant.  This seems like an important distinction to me.  Am I
completely off base?

ZZnew guy

PS

If we go to scattered pops, it won't mattern anyway.
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: More Questions on the Cutting EDGE
Date: 26 Jan 93 18:47:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C1H5IL.4sn.2
Reply-To: hill@norman.vi.ri.cmu.edu
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Brian Paulsen writes
> In article <63677@mimsy.umd.edu> leonard@mimsy.umd.edu (Leonard Dickens)  
writes:
> >Greg Chung writes:
> )Except for SBs, I see very little reason for anyone to distress except
> )to note armies carried.  Remember: your ship is EXPENDABLE!  This is
> )another good reason to keep army info in the distress.
> 
> I agree - once the SB is out of armies (or near out of), the team should
> rarely try to protect the SB.  Once I'm out of armies in a SB, I fully
> plan for the ship to be expendable.  

No...not showing information on armies doesn't imply to me that you carry  
none.  Maybe i'm just weird, but I think some would agree.

> Sit at warp 0?  How many people have warp 0 mapped to anything?  The 
> only way I can get to warp 0 is by hitting repair.
> 
> Brian

I also.

Rob
aka Spaceace!
From: v119matc@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Claus Schwinge)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: A new change suggestion! (I kept it short)
Date: 26 Jan 93 21:55:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Something no-one has suggested since UDP came along is changing the speeds
of all things in the game.  UDP makes it possible to have much more 
continuity in the game, with less gaps and freezing. So, why not speed up 
the whole game.  Raise the speed of all things that move (torps, ships,
plasma's) by 10-25%.  Since people are getting better information now 
that UDP is along, I think it is time to try speeding up the pace of the
game.  Keep fuel costs of moving proportionally the same (ie scout moved
at warp 8 w/out losing fuel, now moves at warp 8*1.25=warp 10 without losing
fuel, and has a new maxwarp of 12*1.25 = warp 15), and turn rates also raised
proportionally.  Maybe phasor&trac/press ranges should also be raised.

And, no, I don't have a server of my own to try it out on.

-Halfdane

P.S. Has this been tried before anywhere?
From: sn@plato.chemietechnik.uni-dortmund.de (sn)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: European wants to play in an INL team
Date: 22 Jan 1993 15:19:36 GMT
Organization: Universitaet Dortmund FB Chemietechnik 
NNTP-Posting-Host: plato.chemietechnik.uni-dortmund.de

Well I'd like to play in the INL as well. A Europe-Only team would be
cool... We'd have to play at night though because Germany is lagged
90% of the (local) daytime.

-Sven
AKA Courier
From: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James Hawtin)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Metaserver
Date: 28 Jan 93 07:14:46 GMT
Reply-To: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk
Organization: School of Computer Science, The University of Birmingham, UK

I think perhaps an "Clever" Euro Metaserver would be good, so it works as a
relay from charon for most of the US sites but pings the euro ones itself
(and perhaps bronco, discovery & doorstop)?  This would be useful for when
there is net split. Also would not load the servers too much.

If there is a euro metaserver then perhaps charon should reject calls from
europe and perhaps europe from the states, to limit hosers a bit?

			James