HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rutkows@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Chris Rutkowski)
Subject: Re: Software (IBM) Needed...
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 18:26:02 GMT

In <1992Oct4.120503.8675@zip.eecs.umich.edu> fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:

>In article <1akl59INN23c@bigboote.WPI.EDU> thethe@lagrange.WPI.EDU (Quincy Cabell) writes:
>>I am in need of a program for music (on staff) writing on XXX platform.
>>  Does anyone
>>know about Midisoft Studios, Finale, etc.???  Or for that matter PD/shareware
>>capable of doing the same thing.  
>>
>>I need to be able to place notes on a staff and print out like a musical score.

>The world is ready for a notation program that can fairly-readily produce
>decent, sightreadable notation.  In the meanwhile, composers who aren't
>willing to set aside all their time to be programmers might prefer to master
>pen-and-vellum technique.

Actually, it's a bit more complicated than that.

Some of us have PHYSICAL conditions which prevent us from using
"pen-and-vellum" to compose music.  A computer program that will allow
composition note-by-note at the keyboard or with a mouse, then print on
some 24-pin or laser printers, would be a GREAT asset.  And, judging by
the large number of MIDI programs that are available, a "scaled-down"
compose-and-print program is very feasible.

In this way, people with handicaps need not become programmers, yet can
still continue to compose and create music for others to enjoy and
play.

-- 
Chris Rutkowski - rutkows@ccu.umanitoba.ca
Royal Astronomical Society of Canada
University of Manitoba - Winnipeg, Canada
From: thethe@lagrange.WPI.EDU (Quincy Cabell)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Software (IBM) Needed...
Date: 3 Oct 1992 17:27:05 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: lagrange.wpi.edu

I am in need of an IBM program for music (on staff) writing.  Does anyone
know about Midisoft Studios, Finale, etc.???  Or for that matter PD/shareware
capable of doing the same thing.  

I need to be able to place notes on a staff and print out like a musical score.
It doesn't need to be too fancy, but the nicer the better, thanks (Soundblaster
type output).  - thethe@wpi.wpi.edu

(FTP sites would be very much appreciated, too...)
From: fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: Scoring software gripes [beaming]
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:48:12 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor

In article <1992Oct5.123652.16097@husc3.harvard.edu> elkies@ramanujan.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies) writes:
>In article <1992Oct4.210703.2845@zip.eecs.umich.edu>
>fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:
>>                     [Finale] still can't beam the sequence
>>eighth, thirtysecond, sixteenth, thirtysecond correctly, no
>>matter what you do to it. (*2)
>>
>>(*2: puts the broken beam on the wrong side of the stem.  Beams, like
>>staff groupings and bracketings, are implemented as flat lattices when
>>musicians use tree structures as their working paradigms)
>
>Moreover, the tree structure may depend on context; either beaming
>of 1/16,1/32,1/16,1/32 can be "correct" (is the implied local rhythm
>2*(3/32) or a syncopated 3/16?).  Even more important than having
>reasonable defaults is the capability to override them.
>
>--Noam D. Elkies (elkies@zariski.harvard.edu)
>  Dept. of Mathematics, Harvard University

Finale draws this for 8-32-16-32:

 ----------------------------+--------------
 |                    |------+-------------|
 |               -----|      |        -----|
 |                    |      |             |
*                    *      *             *
                ^^^^
                N.B.

This is not well-formed in any musical context.  The 32nd beam is supposed
to be contained beneath a 16th beam.

A better example of context-dependency might be when dots and hemiolas
occur in 6/8.

          {    ------------------     -----------------
          {    |         --|    |     |          |--  |
          {    |           |    |     |          |    |
Examples  {   * .         *    *     * .        *    *
          {
Contexts  {   *       *        *     * .        * .
          {  |       |        |     |          |
          {  |       |        |     |          |
          {  ------------------     ------------

There's plenty of debate about whether composers should be allowed to
use the second example in the second context (both beaming examples
are well-formed), so automatically providing the first example but allowing
the composer to toggle to the second would be a happy solution.  However,
in the previous example, the problem was more serious: the program should
offer a well-formed structure first, and never stick the user with
a form never seen outside that particular program.
From: pms26964@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Phil Scopes-not PMS)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: MIDI hookups
Date: 2 Oct 92 23:31:57 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

Usually, modules that have only a MIDI in and out jack (no thru jack) have
an option to "echo midi in to midi out."  If you turn this on, your out
jack will also function as a thru jack and carry through anything arriving
at the in jack.  Hope this answers your question.

-Phil

-- 
* Phil Scopes (pms26964@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu)
* University of Illinois
* Champaign/Urbana
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: ladasky@netcom.com (John J. Ladasky II)
Subject: Re: 'Happy Birthday To You' 
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 02:01:07 GMT

	O.K., I don't remember where I saw this, but...

	Mr. Paul McCartney of Beatles fame became quite the music copyright
broker in the late 60's, as the Fab Four were falling apart.  He bought up
the rights to Beatles stuff, as well as the rights to just about anything 
else that was for sale.  When you're more popular than Jesus Christ, I guess
you can also afford to spend more than He does, too.

	So, as I heard/saw it, "Happy Birthday" was one of the tunes that
Paul bought.

	In the late 70's and early 80's, a music superstar by the name of 
Michael Jackson started to buy and sell musical copyrights as well.  Most
people are familiar with the fact that Paul and M.J. were buddies, and that
M.J. ended up buying the rights to most Beatles tunes.  The world's richest
entertainer is, IMHO, also one of the most unscrupulous - which is why we
can enjoy "Revolution" in Nike commercials today.  (Of course, we also have
to wonder what Paul was thinking when he sold all that stuff...)

	I was made to understand that "Happy Birthday" was also purchased
by Jackson from McCartney.  Furthermore, several restaurants were succesfully
sued for copyright violations when their staffs would sing "Happy Birthday"
to customers.  I personally have not heard "Happy Birthday" sung in a res-
taurant by the staff for a couple of years.  Perhaps the word got around.

-- 
== John J. Ladasky II ("ii") ========================= ladasky@netcom.COM ==
"Great composers do not borrow -	     "Talking about music is like
 they steal."  - John Ladasky	      ~ -     dancing about architecture."
(quote stolen from Stravinsky, who    o o     - Elvis Costello?  Laurie
 stole it from a statement made by     >        Anderson?  Frank Zappa?
 Pablo Picasso about painting, who    \_/    -------------------------------
 stole it from...)			     "Property is theft." - Groucho
============================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: rolfe@fraser.sfu.ca (Christopher John Rolfe)
Subject: Re: 'Happy Birthday To You' 
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 18:18:03 GMT

fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:

>Speaking of which, could anybody point me to the current owner of the
>authorship copyright on the tune "Happy Birthday" --- the familiar one
>North Americans sing to each other at birthdays?  Seems like it should
>be public domain, but I'm pretty sure it isn't...an E-mail address would
>be good.  But if nobody knows, the music reference librarian can probably
>help me dig it out.

	Trivia, trivia.  I love it.  
'Happy Birthday To You' was penned by Mildred and Patti Hill 
( I think Mildred was a school-teacher in the Mid-West? ), contrary to
the flat-out boo-boo in the 1980 Concise Oxford Dictionary of Music (
tongues out to the Concise Oxford ),
which cites some publisher named Clayton. F. Summy as the author.

	I also seem to recall that it's still under copyright but I
don't know to whom.  You might try a children's piano book ( ten to
one some anthology has the tune ), or look for Copland's arrangement
of it for symphony orchestra.  I would guess that the original
publisher would have to be included somewhere in the score.
	Other famous variations?  The Concise
Oxford also mentions Stravinsky's 'Greetings Prelude' [1955] which
apparently violated the copyright ( Igor thought it was public domain
).      
	Are you planning piano variations for your mom? :-)



-- 
Chris                   | 2617 East 4th,| If brevity is the soul of 
rolfe@sfu.ca            | Van., B.C.    | wit, what is semibrevity
Simon Fraser University | V5M 1K5       | the soul of?
Burnaby,  Canada        | Canada        | 
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: pope@wisper.com (Darryl Pope)
Subject: Music notation software?
Organization: Wisper Technologies
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 01:30:50 GMT

Can you recommend a notation package that can also translate midi input
into written form (on a staff, of course).  I prefer it for Windows.
I'll send you my recipe for brownies.

-Darryl
-- 
   \      //   //              => Glad you got married instead of me! <=
    \    //   T E C H N O L O G I E S      Darryl Pope, pope@wisper.com    
     \  //\  // ` ((   // ) ((/  //''      Wethersfield, Connecticut
      \//  \// //  )) //    ((/ //         USA 
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields)
Subject: Re: TECHNO Samples...
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 13:13:28 GMT

In article <1992Oct4.121527.9093@zip.eecs.umich.edu> fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:
>But now if I write a double fugue using Khad Gadya as the second subject,
>I don't expect my ancestors to rise out of the grave and say, "you can't
>use that! That's OUR little holiday song!"

Speaking of which, could anybody point me to the current owner of the
authorship copyright on the tune "Happy Birthday" --- the familiar one
North Americans sing to each other at birthdays?  Seems like it should
be public domain, but I'm pretty sure it isn't...an E-mail address would
be good.  But if nobody knows, the music reference librarian can probably
help me dig it out.
From: diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: forte/piano
Date: 28 Sep 1992 15:39:46 +0800
Organization: The University of Westrn Australia
NNTP-Posting-Host: uniwa.uwa.edu.au
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

A sax can play quietly. You just have to choose the appropriate reed,
and have a good saxophone. I also have a set of mutes for my Conn 1919
C-melody that help make it soft. 

The player, too must be chosen carefully. Too
many people who play the sax have never cultivated the quiet end of it's
dynamics. It can be a beautiful instrument for chamber work.

I have an interest to declare. I play the saxophone and live in a
weatherboard (ship-lap to the US speakers reading) and have had to
cultivate the skill.
From: diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: Music notation software?
Date: 29 Sep 1992 12:37:39 +0800
Organization: The University of Westrn Australia
NNTP-Posting-Host: uniwa.uwa.edu.au
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Darryl Pope (pope@wisper.com) wrote:
: Can you recommend a notation package that can also translate midi input
: into written form (on a staff, of course).  I prefer it for Windows.
: I'll send you my recipe for brownies.
: 
: -Darryl

The best thing for free is (I am reliably informed, never having gotten
Tex to work on my computer) MIDI TEX. This is a MIDI file to MUSIC TEX
translator. I belief the result is in scoree format. (Available from
?Utrecht FTP site).

However (having used many scoring programmes and tried to do this) it's
never really as easy as you hoped. Things like touch and anticipation
are completely misinterprested, and as there is some degree of
quantising inevitable, the result may require some heavy amendations.

The trouble is, midi programs lack "swing", if they're anything more
than just record/playback machines.

Music printer Plus (which costs a bit) does this quite well, but still
needs an awful lot of editing to get things right.

Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields)
Subject: Re: Scoring
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 15:12:09 GMT

In article <1992Oct5.145035.15092@leland.Stanford.EDU> bil@cmn16.Stanford.EDU (Bill Schottstaedt) writes:
>In article <1992Oct4.210703.2845@zip.eecs.umich.edu>  
>fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:
>>Score was produced by a frustrated
>> ex-composer whose knowledge of computing was limited to half of a  
>freshperson's
>> FORTRAN class.
>
>This snide comment about Leland Smith is untrue and uncharacteristic
>of the estimable Mr Fields.

well to phrase it right and less colorfully, he learned fortran and
dos, and said "That's all the knowledge I should put into this
project because its all the stuff that will ever be standardizable."
ten years later he learned some postscript.  

But it's sad we don't hear more new compositions out of him (ever).
Some of his stuff from the 40's was quite pretty (I read some of his
choral scores years ago).

But I stand by what I've said about software: we're at the beginning
of a journey, and years from now we'll laugh that we ever did things
in such a difficult way (a true technophile speaks!)...
From: elkies@ramanujan.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: Scoring software gripes [beaming]
Date: 6 Oct 92 02:46:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Oct5.224649.16107
Organization: Harvard Math Department

In article <1992Oct5.194812.10063@zip.eecs.umich.edu>
fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:
>Finale draws this for 8-32-16-32:
>
>  ----------------------------+--------------
>  |                    |------+-------------|
>  |               -----|      |        -----|
>  |                    |      |             |
> *                    *      *             *
>                  ^^^^
>                  N.B.
>
>This is not well-formed in any musical context.  The 32nd beam is supposed
>to be contained beneath a 16th beam.

Ouch.  This is indeed worse than I imagined.  And their customer serviceman
(I presume "Norm" is not a woman's name) insisted this is correct!?  Blecch.

Actually my 16-32-16-32 example can be beamed three ways: one in 3/16:

  ----------------+------+--------------
  |---------------+------+-------------|
  |               |---   |          ---|
  |               |      |             |
 *               *      *             *


and two in 2*(3/32):

  ----------------+------+--------------
  |---------------+------+-------------|
  |            ---|      |          ---|
  |               |      |             |
 *               *      *             *


and                 NB
                   vvvv

  ----------------+------+--------------
  |---------------+      +-------------|
  |            ---|      |          ---|
  |               |      |             |
 *               *      *             *

Is it too much to ask that all three should be specificable?

--Noam D. Elkies (elkies@zariski.harvard.edu)
  Dept. of Mathematics, Harvard University
From: elkies@ramanujan.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Scoring software gripes [beaming]
Date: 5 Oct 92 16:36:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Oct5.123652.16097
Organization: Harvard Math Department

In article <1992Oct4.210703.2845@zip.eecs.umich.edu>
fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:
>                     [Finale] still can't beam the sequence
>eighth, thirtysecond, sixteenth, thirtysecond correctly, no
>matter what you do to it. (*2)
>
>(*2: puts the broken beam on the wrong side of the stem.  Beams, like
>staff groupings and bracketings, are implemented as flat lattices when
>musicians use tree structures as their working paradigms)

Moreover, the tree structure may depend on context; either beaming
of 1/16,1/32,1/16,1/32 can be "correct" (is the implied local rhythm
2*(3/32) or a syncopated 3/16?).  Even more important than having
reasonable defaults is the capability to override them.

--Noam D. Elkies (elkies@zariski.harvard.edu)
  Dept. of Mathematics, Harvard University
From: yjossa@mathlab.sunysb.edu (yuri jossa)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: Equipment to compose with.
Date: 2 Oct 92 06:47:22 GMT
Organization: J. Random Misconfigured Site
X-Posted-From: mathlab-gw.pi.sunysb.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

Organization: SUNY at Stony Brook, Dept. of Math
Keywords: 

In article <1992Sep24.101911.43301@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> maddog@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>I have a question for y'all.  (More of a survey-type, but what the hey.)  What
>kind of equipment are you using with your creative genius?  :-)  I don't write
>all of the time (unfortunately!) but when I do, it's usually in front of the
>ol' piano.  But, for orchestrated pieces. . .or anything that doesn't involve
>a piano, for that matter. . .getting a feel for the sound just isn't quite
>there.
>
>I have looked at a good synth./sequencer combo that I'm very interested in.
>The new(er) Yamaha SY35 and an Alesis sequencer is what I did some experimenting
>with.  I was very impressed.  The Alesis has been a solid piece of equipment
>for a long time now.  The SY35 seems to be a very nice piece of work.  The
>most important aspect of this synth. (for me anyway) is it's multi-timbral
>capabilities.  (There are countless other sound creation/editing functions,
>but from a compositional point of view, they really aren't that important to
>me.)
>
>So, anyway what kind of setups are the rest of you using?  Banging it out on
>the piano like me?  Or do you have a "better" setup?  (Wouldn't it be nice
>to have a full choir at your desposal to play with???)  :-)
>
>Catch me later!
>
>					Maddog
>				Programmed to serve. . . .


I compose on paper then i have the stuff played or 'click' it in

my PC , i use Encore 2.1 for windows , export the midi files

change a few things like the note velocities to humanize things up

and then play back in synths, samplers etc.

You always should know what instruments or synth voices you are

writing... and the notation gives ,a feel or 'real' music not just

some exercise in mathematical/computer practice.

When i am notating the pieces i change voicings, chord progressions

etc. just like sitting at the piano but more accurate.

:)
From: jasper@cwi.nl (Jasper Kamperman)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Ear training software for Commodore Amiga
Date: 6 Oct 92 10:54:54 GMT
Followup-To: jasper@cwi.nl
Organization: CWI, Amsterdam

I'd like to have Ear training software for the Commodore Amiga,
because my ears need training and I happen to have an Amiga.

The software doesn't have to be Public Domain, if it's not *too*
expensive.

Thanks,
Jasper Kamperman.
Xref: sparky rec.music.compose:132 rec.music.makers:10007
From: gavras@acs.bu.edu (alexis gavras)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose,rec.music.makers
Subject: MIDI hookups
Date: 2 Oct 92 20:03:48 GMT
Followup-To: rec.music.compose
Organization: Boston University, Boston, MA, USA
Originator: gavras@acs.bu.edu

Help!!!! I'm a newcomer to the world of MIDI, who's recently acquired a
module (Boss' Dr.synth) and a sequencer (a Brother PDC 100) to go with my 
Casio VZ-1 keyboard. Since I don't have a mixer I'm trying to make recordings
using only sounds from the Dr. Synth. The problem is that when I hook things
up so that I can record module sounds to the sequencer, the sequencer is not
hooked up to play anything back, so I don't hear anything I've recorded on the
other tracks to accompany me. My keyboard and module each have MIDI in, out,
and through slots and my sequencer has only MIDI in, and out, so I would like
to know how others have hooked up similar equipment in order to achieve the
desired results. I know this sounds very basic, but I bought this stuff from
a "professional" dealer who has been unable to figure this stuff out either,
so any response would be GREATLY APPRECIATED.

                          Thank you in advance,

                                                 Alexis
From: fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
Subject: Re: Scoring
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:57:19 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor

In article <1992Oct5.145035.15092@leland.Stanford.EDU> bil@cmn16.Stanford.EDU (Bill Schottstaedt) writes:

>This snide comment [] is untrue and uncharacteristic
>of the estimable Mr Fields.

Aw, Bill, I thought you knew.  At certain times of the month my snideness
hormones get in an uproar.  Makes me want to play agressive bach all day!
:-)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: cottle@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu (David M. Cottle)
Subject: Version 1.1a of LIME (notation software) now available
Organization: University of Illinois School of Music
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 14:01:56 GMT


Hi,

A demonstration version of Lime 1.1a is available for Macintosh 
SE and II series computers.  A binhex'ed stuffit file containing 
the executable and manual can be copied via anonymous FTP from 
/pub/lime on novamail.cerl.uiuc.edu (internet number: 
128.174.180.9). Read the "README" file in /pub/lime for further 
instructions.

The demonstration version is fully functional, but is limited to 
three pages.

Here are the most important differences between 0.7 and 1.1:

	-Several pieces can be edited at  one time.

	-Several pages  from the same piece can be edited at one 
	 time.  The pages can be from the same or different notation contexts.

	-You can copy and paste between several pieces you are 
	 editing at one time.
	
	-You can enlarge or reduce (zoom) the view.  (See Layout.)

	-It supports Sonata and Interlude fonts.  (See Options.  
	 You must purchase these fonts separate from Lime.  )

	-System breaks can be set at fixed (always the same) or 
	 variable (calculated by the program) locations.

	-Unusual accidentals (user defined, also some quarter 
	 tone symbols that can be adjusted in cents on synthesizers 
	 that play microtones) are available under the note menu.

	-Dashed ties and slurs

	-"X moves with note" and "Y moves with note" have been 
	 changed to "Horizontal lock" and "Vertical lock."  NB: 
	 Having the boxes checked now has the opposite effect.  
	 Horizontal Lock checked means the annotation does not 
	 move left or right with the note, but is "locked" in 
	 position on the page.  Likewise, having the Vertical 
	 Lock checked means the annotation will not move up and 
	 down with the note, but is locked on the page.  

	-The Parameters dialogue has been improved, making 
	 it easier to find the parameters.



If you have problems or questions, please write Email to the Lime 
Consultant.  If you decide you would like to buy Lime after you 
experiment with it, the ordering information is in the front cover 
of the manual, or call (217) 244-4298.  


Lippold Haken
CERL Sound Group
252 ERL -- University of Illinois
Urbana, Il   61801-2977

Lime Consultant:   Lime@uiuc.edu

(dmc)
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose
From: bil@cmn16.Stanford.EDU (Bill Schottstaedt)
Subject: Re: Scoring
Organization: DSO, Stanford University
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 92 14:50:35 GMT

In article <1992Oct4.210703.2845@zip.eecs.umich.edu>  
fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew H. Fields) writes:
>Score was produced by a frustrated
> ex-composer whose knowledge of computing was limited to half of a  
freshperson's
> FORTRAN class.

This snide comment about Leland Smith is untrue and uncharacteristic
of the estimable Mr Fields.
Newsgroups: rec.music.compose