HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: streynol@es.stat.ncsu.edu (STEPHEN TODD REYNOLDS)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Where is Scott Tai?
Date: 17 Apr 92 18:30:16 GMT
Reply-To: streynol@es.stat.ncsu.edu (STEPHEN TODD REYNOLDS)
Organization: North Carolina State University

Whatever happened to Scott Tai?

This group has been incredibly boring since his departure...

Just wondering.


Steve Reynolds
SO, Applied Mathematics
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Subject: Re: Issac Asimov
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 08:04:18 GMT

Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) sez:
>Christopher J Dcosta writes about "Re: Issac Asimov" to All  [12 Apr 92 21:23]
>
>CJD>phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill)writes: 
>>noonan@sonata.enet.dec.com (Costumes & Makeup & Kliegs, oh my!) writes:
>>>In article <14167@claris.com>, Mike_Steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike
Steiner) writes...
>
>>>>Other notable Mensans include the Late Buckminster Fuller (honorary
>>>>International President), Sir Clive Sinclair (Sinclair Computers),
>>>>Don Pedersen (former president of Ford Motor Company), F. Lee
Bailey,
>>>>Theodore Bikel, Adrian Kronaur (SP?) (_Good Morning, Vietnam!_), and
Jean
>>>>Auel.
>>>
>>>
>>>         And me.  One must never forget *me*!
>>


DOH - RAY - ??? - FA - SO - LA - TI - DUH!


>> Uh! Duh! Who is you?
>
>CJD>  (musical introduction..Nat goes) UNforGETTABLE, THAT's what 
>CJD> you is ...
> 
>> Oh! Yeah! The fifth letter of the alphabet!
>
>CJD>  D U H ?? funny, I thought it was the 21st, duh.
>
>Chris, you were counting from the wrong end, and you overshot by one, to boot.

           
Oh! duuh! :-B     (<----still-ain't-got-a-clue-but-afraid-of-looking-dumb)
From: Mike_Steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Use of this newsgroup (Was Re: TIME TRAVEL)
Date: 6 Apr 92 20:16:10 GMT
Organization: Claris Corporation

In article <1992Apr6.071706.5672@uunet.uu.net>, kyle@uunet.uu.net (Kyle Jones) writes:
> 
> 
>  > So, why should we have to look elsewhere for a discussion that
>  > started here as an RG report?  I access this newsgroup from a
>  > BBS, not from an internet site or a usenet site.  That means
>  > that the traffic has to be sent to the BBS via modem.  I don't
>  > want to have to keep subscibing to an unknown number of the
>  > 3,000 newsgroups just to follow a message thread.
> 
> It does make it difficult.  USENET is not geared toward
> short-term discussions.  Newsgroups are usually created for
> topics or categories of topics that will have long-term interest.
> Similarly, sites get feeds for groups they will be intereted in
> over the long haul.
> 
> One might say that if you're only interested in time travel
> discussions when they pop up in rec.org.mensa, then you're not
> really interested in time travel, just as one might say a person
> who is intersted in science only when it's mentioned in SF
> stories really isn't interested in science.

Rather, it is that I'm interested in too many things to be able to
spread myself all over, trying to follow them.  If I'm interested
in two dozen topics, and I have to winnow through two dozen news
groups to find them (and try to filter out all the other topics in
each of those newsgroups), it becomes counter-productive--especially
when such a newsgroup as this exists where just about everything in
which I'm interested is discussed eventually.  Also, by having such
a disparity of topics in one group, a synthesis exists where seemingly
unrelated topics provide springboards for ideas about each other.

>  > What if some of the correspondents' sites don't carry the
>  > newsgroup to which it is moved?
> 
> They are generally out of luck.

But, if you don't move it, they are in luck.

>  > > > What about a discussion about how Mensa would be different if
>  > > > someone from 1992 had gone back in time to tell the founders
>  > > > how Mensa developed into a social organization, and they
>  > > > changed their charter as a result?
>  > >
>  > >  Sure. Some good ideas could come out of this sort of speculation. 
>  > 
>  > And that discussion will invariably branch into discussions of the nature of
>  > time travel and the feasability of the situation happening in the first place.
>  > Now, we have two branches of the same discussion on two different newsgroups.
> 
> Which is fine if the branches are about different subjects.  It's
> more work to follow them if you're interested in all the branches
> But it is better to move the discussion because you pick up
> readers who would have missed the discussion were it not moved to
> the appropriate place.

but then you completely bifurcate the topic, instead of having two
intertwined threads--which makes for a more enjoyable and enlightening
discussion, IMO.
From: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Issac Asimov
Date: 13 Apr 92 06:22:21 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:143/207.1 - Sunnyvale Fido Conn, Sunnyvale CA


Christopher J Dcosta writes about "Re: Issac Asimov" to All  [12 Apr 92 21:23]

CJD>phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill)writes: 
>noonan@sonata.enet.dec.com (Costumes & Makeup & Kliegs, oh my!) writes:
>>In article <14167@claris.com>, Mike_Steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner) writes...

>>>Other notable Mensans include the Late Buckminster Fuller (honorary
>>>International President), Sir Clive Sinclair (Sinclair Computers),
>>>Don Pedersen (former president of Ford Motor Company), F. Lee Bailey,
>>>Theodore Bikel, Adrian Kronaur (SP?) (_Good Morning, Vietnam!_), and Jean
>>>Auel.
>>
>>
>>         And me.  One must never forget *me*!
>
> Uh! Duh! Who is you?

CJD>  (musical introduction..Nat goes) UNforGETTABLE, THAT's what 
CJD> you is ...
 
> Oh! Yeah! The fifth letter of the alphabet!

CJD>  D U H ?? funny, I thought it was the 21st, duh.

Chris, you were counting from the wrong end, and you overshot by one, to boot.
 
/207 143/207
--  
Mike Steiner
UUCP: uts.amdahl.com!kennel!207.1!Mike.Steiner
INTERNET: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG
"The views expressed above are those of Mike Steiner only."
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: terryk@encore.com (Terence M. Kelleher)
Subject: Re: Fermat's flunkeys (was Re: A Real Challenge)
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: 14 Apr 92 22:28:16


In article <45427@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> hrubin@pop.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin) writes:

   This has been heavily discussed on other newsgroups, in particular
   sci.edu and misc.education.  As long as those in charge of the schools
   consider being with one's age group more important than learning, which
   they do, nothing will be done.

But, who is in charge of the schools?  They are mostly run by local
school boards that we elect into office.  They are regulated by the
state legislators, who are elected to represent us.  If we want to
change the priority of our school systems, it seems we must be the
ones taking action.

Most good teachers I have known would rather spend their time doing
productive teaching.  They would prefer to teach to classes with
students at a similar level, to avoid holding back a whole class to
drag the slowest, or perhaps least interested, students along.  Of
course, many of these good teachers sell real estate now.


Our local group had the president of a local school board come to
speak with us last week.  He said that school systems are directed by
the government to: 

	a) educate
	b) provide for "social" development
	c) baby sit.

All programs they want to develop must balance these three objectives.

In general, they are restricted to strive for "sameness" of student
output, rather than allowing each child to strive for his/her best.  

He put the blame for the state of the education system on the people
and the government, for under financing the system, for burdening the
school systems with highly restrictive teachers contracts, and for
pressuring the school system to "mainstream" both the gifted and the
mentally deficient into a single system with the average.

As an example of the teacher's contract problem, he pointed out the
schools Latin teacher, who has had no more than 6 students a year for
the last 4 years, teaches no other subjects, and is paid one of the
highest saleries in the school due to length of service.

--

                                 +----------------+
Terence Kelleher              +--+-------------+  |
Encore Computer Corp.         |  | E N C O R E |  |
terryk@encore.com             |  +-------------+--+
607-687-2644                  +----------------+

Xref: sparky rec.org.mensa:2805 alt.atheism:8089
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wednesday, 8 Apr 1992 10:00:17 EDT
From: John A. Johnson <J5J@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa,alt.atheism
Subject: Re: Brainwashing (was Re: IQ and religious belief)
 <graham.702002243@bizet> <1992Apr3.091154.2363@mac.cc.macalstr.edu>
 <1992Apr7.133634.2388@mac.cc.macalstr.edu>

In article <1992Apr7.133634.2388@mac.cc.macalstr.edu>,
amitchell@mac.cc.macalstr.edu says:
>
>In article <1992Apr3.091154.2363@mac.cc.macalstr.edu>,
>amitchell@mac.cc.macalstr.edu writes:
>> In article <graham.702002243@bizet>, graham@maths.su.oz.au (Graham Matthews)
>writes:
>> graham writes:
>>> Before I answer what do you mean by 'belief' and do you mean something
>>> different when you say 'belief' and 'assumption'.
>
>In my search for a suitable definition, I'm finding that my assumptions tend
>to
>be much easier to renounce than my beliefs are.  Maybe I should go look it up
>in Webster or something, but I'm trying not to be cheap about this.  I may end
>up doing it anyway....

If you are going the dictionary route, better use the OED rather than
Webster's.  But Graham is not asking what the dictionary means by
'belief' and 'assumption,' but what YOU mean.  You've put your finger
right on the important connotative difference for us:  assumptions are
much more tentative and subject to revision than beliefs.
In our search for rationality, Graham and I attempt to remain as
open as possible to intellectual reconsideration by employing
assumptions rather than beliefs.

>
>> However, Graham, you tend to state that you *believe* that all beliefs are
>> irrational, not that you *assume* that all beliefs are irrational, and
>> therefore, I think my question still applies.  I could understand if you
>stated
>> beliefs were *non*rational, but you don't.  I think all of this just boils
>down
>> to sticky semantics, though....

Indeed.  I think it is better to say that Graham and I DEFINE beliefs as
irrational (or nonrational--a term a prefer).  Defining is not the same
as believing.   We thus avoid the apparent paradox you raise.

>
>No one's responded to this yet: you're all too busy flaming each other.  If
>you're serious about this discussion, PLEASE try to answer the questions
>raised
>in it!
>Allison

Sorry, Allison, for not responding sooner to your legitimate and
important questions.  WEEMBA has us all balled up with his trivia that
we have been terribly distracted from posts likes yours that deserve
consideration.
-----------------------------------
John A. Johnson (J5J@psuvm.psu.edu)
Department of Psychology Penn State DuBois Campus 15801
Penn State is not responsible for my behavior.
"A ruthless, doctrinaire avoidance of degeneracy is a degeneracy of
 another sort.  Getting drunk and picking up bar-ladies and writing
 metaphysics is a part of life."  - from _Lila_ by R. Pirsig
From: Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Who pays for schools?
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 14:41:48 -0500

Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG writes:

    Other people have suggested that only those who go to school (or
    their parents) should pay for schooling because they are the only
    ones who pay for it.

Er, don't you mean "who benefit from it"?

    That philosophy fails to take into account that whenever a member of
    society is educated, the entire society benefits

 Exactly.  That is one of the major reasons why although I believe
 Libertarianism is the general direction the country needs to head in, I
 dread the day they hold major power... it would be a bleak one for
 education, ease of travel, utility customers, those in need of police
 protection, those whose houses happen to catch on fire for one reason
 or another (which would be more likely since they would not require
 that one's *neighbors'* houses are up to fire codes), etc. etc. etc.

Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: sue@netcom.com (Sue Miller)
Subject: Re: Re^2: mrmrks and beating a dead horse ...
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 92 04:36:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article <2197.29E7AB44@kennel.FIDONET.ORG> Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes:
>
>Sue Miller writes about "Re: Re^2: mrmrks and beating a dead horse ..." to All
> [11 Apr 92 13:13]
>
>>I wonder why people insist on arguing from ignorance, Scott..
>>
>>Is it because they couldn't get into Mensa?
>SM>  I *hate* this phrase. Hate it hate it hate it.
>
>Come on, Sue; tell us what you really think about it.  :-)
>

I was only slightly nicer to a woman in a university statistics
class who said the same thing.  I guess it just pushes one of my
more viscerally-located buttons.  :-)

>BTW, a bunch of people back where you came from told me to say "Hi" to you if
>you stopped by here again.  So, "Hi" from all of those people.
> 

Hello to all of them, too!  Tell them I'm about to make another move-
I have a job in Manchester (UK) which starts just about the minute
my work permit arrives.  What's the number of your board again?


sue
From: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: A REAL CHALLENGE: Fermat's last theorem..
Date: 14 Apr 92 04:52:56 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:143/207.1 - Sunnyvale Fido Conn, Sunnyvale CA


Faust II writes about "Re: A REAL CHALLENGE: Fermat's last theorem.." to All
 [13 Apr 92 10:16]

>Yeah; I spent a few weeks on it back in high school. Actually, I proved it.
>The proof *is* elegant, but a bit on the long side. I'll see if I have time
>to type it in later...

FI>  Don't do that ! Copyright it, and get a noble prize before you 
FI> send it in. (assuming you're right)

He would do much better if he could win a Nobel prize.  Being noble is find
and dandy, but winning the Nobel garners fame and fortune.
 
/207 143/207
--  
Mike Steiner
UUCP: uts.amdahl.com!kennel!207.1!Mike.Steiner
INTERNET: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG
"The views expressed above are those of Mike Steiner only."
From: killer@robin.cs.hut.fi (Kalle Kivimaa)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: /T/T/ Weekend Plans
Date: 8 Apr 92 22:08:52 GMT
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, CS-lab

In <1992Apr8.004659.3196@ncsu.edu> tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai) writes:

>I wasn't.  Look at any standard calendar--Sunday is the first day of the
>week, and hence, doesn't constitute the 'weekend'.  :)

DISCRIMINATION!!!!

Any calendar I can easily find will have Sunday as the LAST day of the
week, so it DOES constitute weekend.

Now YOU are discriminating people on the basis of their calendar!

---

This is a semicolon-dash-right-bracket-posting.  Any other use is
strongly recommended against.

For the humour and English-impaired, this is a smiley-posting....
--
************************************************************************
* The night sky over the planet Krikkit is the least interesting sight *
* in the entire Universe.  -- Douglas Adams, HHGTG                     *
************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: douglash@meaddata.com (Douglas Holzworth)
Subject: Responding to Tai
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 16:22:48 GMT
Distribution: na

A while back, I posted about the need to refute statements/positions with which
one disagrees.  "A falsehood uncontested can be considered truth by others"
perception.

After reading Scott Tai's continuing deluge, I see I need to modify that
position by appending: "But there's also no sense butting your head against a
brick wall."  There comes a time when useful discourse can degenerate into
useless bickering.  I now recognize Scott's name from another newsgroup
which he badgered about bigotry and elitism (remember the China Doll tirade,
Scott?).

Congratulations, Scott -- into the KILL file you go.  I hope you get over 
whatever event caused this racial paranoia.  You appear to be an otherwise
intelligent individual.
From: phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Which is the Best RG? (Was: Re: A Truly International Gathering)
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 92 01:35:14 EST
Organization: Miracle Computer Consultants

crossgl@infonode.ingr.com (Gordon Cross) writes:

>What are your favorite RGs??  Mine are in approximate order:
>
>Asilomar			Monterey, CA
>HalloweeM			Chicago, IL
>Feast of Pleasures & Delights	Dallas, TX
>Snowball			central NJ
>Alabama RG			Huntsville, AL


[Other than the top 5 deleted]

My top 5 (in order) are:

New England Pilgrimage          Marlboro, MA
Mensautumn                      Conn & West Mass.
RG at the end of the Universe   Manchester, MA
Snowball                        Central NJ
Cape Cod Mini-RG                Dennisport, MA


Assigining 6 points for first, 5 for second, etc...  The score is:

Alisomar                        Monterey, CA           5
New England Pilgrimage          Marlboro, MA           5
HalloweeM                       Chicago, IL            4
Mensautumn                      Conn & West Mass       4
Snowball                        Central NJ             4
Feast of Pleasures & Delights   Dallas, TX             3
RG at the end of the Universe   Manchester, MA         3
Alabama RG                      Huntsville, AL         1
Cape Cod Mini-RG                Dennisport, MA         1

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Hill                     | "All you people in TV land,           |
| Miracle Computer Consultants  |   I will wake up your empty shells.   |
| Email: phil%miracle@merk.com  |  Peak time viewing blown in a flash,  |
|  -or-  phil.hill@channel1.com |   as I burn into your memory cells.   |
| FAX:   (508)875-3297          |  'cause I'm alive." - Peter Gabriel   |
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: A criticism
Date: 15 Apr 92 10:18:34 GMT
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University

choy@skorpio.Usask.CA (Henry Choy) opines:
>Greetings and salutations
>
>Suppose the universe is bound by physical laws. All of us are forced to
>act according to these laws. Intelligence is just something we've
>concocted, not clearly either. Anyone who thinks he has
>intelligence is really fooling himself/herself/itself. We may be credited
>for having achieved so much, but our achievements are not great (maybe
>we don't live in a great universe).

Now HE deserves the "NOBLE" prize ! :->
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/ Tai's Truths
Date: 8 Apr 92 22:29:54 GMT
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory

Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes:

> Scott Tai writes about "Tai's Lies" to All  [05 Apr 92 23:55]

>> Besides, why are you complaining about flames--you continue to invite them.

> ST>  No, you just continue starting them.

> Bullshit, you fucking liar.
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I assume you think this doesn't count?

---------
Scott Tai
 
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: michaelg@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Michael Greenwald)
Subject: Anecdote/Analogy
Organization: CS Department, Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: rec
Date:  7 Apr 92 15:43:09 GMT

"... But there was an evaluation committee that had to try to help us
along, and help us ultimately decide which way we were going to
separate the uranium.  This committee had men like Compton and Tolman
and Smyth and Urey and Rabi and Oppenheimer on it.  I would sit in
because I understood the theory of how our proces of separating
isotopes worked, and so they'd ask me question and talk about it.  In
these discussions one man would make a point.  Then Compton, for
example, would explain a different point of view.   He would say it
should be >this< way, and he was perfectly right. Another guy would
say, well, maybe, but there's this other possibility we have to
consider against it.

"So everybody is disagreeing, all around the table.  I am surprised
and disturbed that Compton doesn't repeat and emphasize his point.
Finally, at the end, Tolman, who's the chairman, would say `Well,
having heard all these arguments, I guess it's true that Compton's
argument is the best of all, an now we have to go ahead.

"It was such a shock to me to see that a committee of men could
present a whole lot of ideas, each one thinking of a new facet, while
remembering what the other fella said, so that, at the end, the
decision i smade as to which idea was the best -- summing it all up
--- without having to say it three times."

 --- From "Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!"
     copied without permission
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Subject: /T/ Mensa Frauds Exposed - reasons exposed
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 18:02:26 GMT

mcbeanb@brandonu.ca writes:

>In article <1992Apr2.183006.11618@ncsu.edu>, 
>tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai) writes:
>> Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes: 
>>> You and "gmc" have yet to show who is being hurt by Mensa, and how they are
>>> being hurt.
> 
>> Obviously, anyone who wants "to identify and foster human
intelligence for the
>> benefit of humanity, and to encourage research in the nature,
characteristics,
>> and uses of intelligence" (as stated in MENSA's purposes) but who
doesn't
>> believe in or meet the 2% rule.

> *There* it is!  Why didn't I say that earlier?  I mean, surely, these people
> aren't "hurt" to any significant extent, but why should they be excluded, 
> especially considering that they are likely interesting/stimulating/whatever
> people who would get along just fine with present-day Mensans...
> Sure, this may drudge up some points which have been done to death, but that
> statement by Mr. Tai just seemed to have a ray of clarity to it, and I
> couldn't help but to think about it...

> Brian McBean  -  McBeanB@BrandonU.Ca

I couldn't agree with you more, Brian :)

---------
Scott Tai
From: hall@orion.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Philip Hall 283-4031)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: (T/F) TAI'S INTELLIGENCE DEBATE: INTRODUCTION
Date: 13 Apr 1992 23:01:11 GMT
Organization: nasa-jsc


If intelligence is truly inherited, that would seem to imply 
that there is a difference in brain physiology (structures
or chemistry) that would account for the differences.

One thing that occurs to me concerns the famous 7 +- 2
characteristic of short term memory (the author's name escapes
me). In any case, these "chunks" of memory seem to be used
to create various permutations of information which can then
be "processed" by our brain's reasoning engines. It seems to
me that a brain capable of handling 9 "chunks" would be much
more powerful than a brain which handles 5 "chunks" and these
two values may both be within 1 SD. Possibly more intelligent
individuals can handle 11 or even 13. Anybody know of any 
research on this or any other physiological characteristic of the
brain which might account for differences in intelligence??

PH