HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: forda@gtephx.UUCP (Andrew Ford @ AGCS, Phoenix, Arizona)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: NOTE: Bigfoot/Sasquatch Information Request
Date: 23 Jul 92 14:29:58 GMT
Organization: gte

In article <58936@mimsy.umd.edu>, ai065@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Thomas Hill) writes:
# 
#    Our research group is currently investigating reports and sightings of the
# animal known as "Bigfoot" or "Sasquatch". If you or somebody you know has had
# such a sighting or come across what may be evidence supporting the existance
# of such an animal, please get in contact with us in one of the following
# formats:
#  
# o Leave a private message in electronic mail.
# o Call Thomas Hill at 216-362-6529.
# o Or write:
#  
#   Thomas E. Hill
#   16124 Richard Dr.
#   Brook Park, OH 44142
#  
#  Contact with us can be totally anonymous if you wish. We are especially
# interested in Ohio sightings but are by no means limited to investigations in
# that state. Please, serious responses only.
# -- 
# "A large creature about 7 1/2 to 8 foot tall. It was greyish black in color,
# and as it went away from me I seen the backside of it walking as a man would
# walk on it's hind legs."- Former Sheriff Oliver Potter, Vancouver, Washington
# The Cryptozoology Information Network. Want on our Email mailing list? Amiga!

So what kind of caliber would be best for this beastie?
(Handgun and rifle, of course)

Hey, this *is* rec.guns 8^)

PS - Why not just post sightings, I haven't had any good hunting
in a long time 8^) 8^) 8^) 8^) 8^)
-- 
"25 States allow anyone to buy a gun, strap it on, and walk down the street with
no permit of any kind: some say it's crazy.  However, 4 out of 5 US murders are 
committed in the other half of the country: so who is crazy?"   -  Andrew Ford
gtephx!forda@enuucp.eas.asu.edu  OR  !uunet!samsung!romed!enuucp!gtephx!forda

[MODERATOR:  .... *groan*  ..... please, no.....]
From: megatek!cjp@uunet.UU.NET (Chris "Systems Stud" Pikus)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Headspace guages
Date: 23 Jul 92 14:29:44 GMT
Organization: Megatek Corporation, San Diego, California


	I'm building an AR-15 and realize that to properly -- and more
importantly, safely -- finish it, I will need to check the headspace
of the barrel/bolt fit. So, I'm off to order the set of headspace guages.

	I know what the function of the Go (too small) and No-go (too
large) guages are for. What is the "field" guage for? Why would someone
want one in addition/instead of the go and no-go?

	Is the third one necessary?
 
-- 
Christopher J. Pikus,        | "Yeah, there's such a fine line
Megatek Corp., San Diego, CA | between stupid and clever."
INTERNET: cjp@megatek.com    | 		-- "This is Spinal Tap"
From: th2_oate@csd.brispoly.ac.uk (Tom Oates)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: British gun laws circa 1960
Date: 23 Jul 92 14:30:25 GMT
Organization: Bristol Polytechnic, England

#prichard@devon.larc.nasa.gov writes:
#
##2) might this an American cartridge such as .45 Colt or .45 ACP?  .45
##   seems a bit big for an old British revolver.

I had to smile when I read this. What makes you think that old British
revolvers had smaller calibres than old American revolvers? The weapon
you're referring to is almost certainly a Webley Mk 6 circa WW1. The
Mk6 was chambered for the .455 rimmed cartridge. This was (technically!)
a larger cartridge than the .45 ACP. The .455 bullet was slightly heavier. 
However, the muzzle velocity was much less than the .45 ACP which is
the superior cartridge. The .455 cartridge was known in Britain as the 
"man-stopper". It was originally developed during the late 19th
Century to use against angry tribesmen during British colonial wars who 
would keep on fighting unless they were hit by a .455 hollow-point.
The old .455 hollow points I've seen look a lot like a wad-cutter that's
been loaded upside down. Very nasty effects at bedroom distances. 

The .455 was routinely (and mistakenly) referred to as a .45. I think
that's where the confusion lies.

Does anyone out there own a Webley Mk 6? Would they like to comment?

-- 
*************************************************************************
*  Tom Oates  (Bristol Poly, England)    *   DISCLAIMER:-               *
*  JANET: th2_oate@csd.brispoly.ac.uk    *   I speak only for myself.   *
*************************************************************************
From: dcwst8+@pitt.edu (David C Winters)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: An embarrassing question...
Date: 25 Jul 92 22:02:25 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


What is/are the primary name(s) for the semi-auto only, civilian
version of the M14??

I _know_ that I should know this, so I'm now hiding my head in shame...


RE: my mistakenly describing the AC-130H Spectre instead of the AC-47D
Dragon Ship:  Ooops.     Which was the gunship that they called
"Spooky?"  Was that the Spectre?

--
David Winters  
dcwst8@unix.cis.pitt.edu OR winters@vms.cis.pitt.edu

          Illigitimi non carborundum.
From: googs@gilligan.rtp.dg.com (Joe Gugliemino)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Looking for Info on .380's and dealers
Date: 28 Jul 92 20:37:58 GMT
Organization: Data General Corporation, Research Triangle Park, NC


I've been thinking about buying a pistol for concealed carry/home
defense and am leaning towards a .380 as a good compromise between a
number of factors, including concealability, power, and magazine capacity.
I have seen a lot of .380's advertised as backup weapons, so I don't
feel too off-base about making this choice, as opposed to selecting a
.22 or .25 popgun.

Gun Tests recently did a .380 evaluation, but only covered a few models.
There seems to be a lot more out there, and I'd like to hear people talk
about their .380 experience, especially with, but not limited to, any of
the following models: Baretta 84F, Sig P230, Taurus PT58, Walther PPK or
PPK/S, Colt Gov't/Mustang, Makarov, and AMT.

I'm not completely sold on the .380, but I don't want to start another
caliber flame-fest.  If you have some personal .380 vs nnn experience I
would appreciate hearing your thoughts.

Also, do you have recommendations for dealers in the Metro West region
of Ma?  My ideal would be a dealer with a large selection, good prices,
and a range where you can test-drive before you buy.  I bought my target
pistol at a gun show, so I don't have much to go on.  Like I said, I'm
not sold on any one thing, so trying a few out at a range would be a big
plus.

Post or email; if I get enough interest I'll summarize the mail and post
it...  Thanks.

-- 
                             Joe Gugliemino

googs@gilligan.webo.dg.com          Voice: (508) 870-6318
Joe_Gugliemino@DGC.ceo.dg.com               Phone messages routinely routed
Data General Corp., Westboro, Ma.             to the nearest black hole...
From: n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: 9mm subsonic ammo
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:53:34 GMT
Organization: Western Washington University

wdm@druhi.ATT.COM (MotyckaWD) writes:

#There is an interesting article on bullet weight by Ken Waters in the latest
#issue of Handloader.  Basically Ken says that "heavy isn't as good as a
#well constructed medium weight bullet in the same caliber." (this is heavily
#paraphrased)  Good reading for all who haven't made up their mind that heavy
#is best ;-)

The 9mm 123 gr Hydroshock +P+ at 1244 fps sounds like a good choice 
for the caliber.   I think it's LE only though.

Jim D
From: jheath@fieldofdreams.npirs.purdue.edu (Jim Heath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: British gun laws circa 1960
Date: 23 Jul 92 18:36:34 GMT
Organization: Center for Environmental and Regulatory Information Systems, Purdue University

#From article <BrsDCK.FDC@newcastle.ac.uk>, by J.M.Spencer@newcastle.ac.uk (Jonathan Spencer):
# prichard@devon.larc.nasa.gov writes:
# 
# #not a t.p.g. question, but an informational one;
# 
# #I have a book by an English dude who sailed around the world sometime
#                              ^^^^
# #around 1960.  at one point, he mentions checking his Webley .45 since
# #the upcoming port had a bad reputation.
# 
# He cannot have been both English AND a dude :-)
#

Sure he can.  Take him to a dude ranch and he's English and he's
a dude ;-{).
 
# #1) would this handgun (presumably a revolver) been legal to posess in
# #   the British isles, and
# 
# That was prior to the current Acts. But even today, yes, they can be
# held under suitable licence. But, I'm pretty sure that exceptions exist
# for firearms are part of a ship's equipment (retain a mutiny?) and
# licences are not required.
# 
# #2) might this an American cartridge such as .45 Colt or .45 ACP?  .45
# #   seems a bit big for an old British revolver.
# 
# Can't answer this one.
#

There may have been some Webleys chambered for the .45 ACP and/or
the Long Colt.  Weren't they generally loaded with a .455 British
round?  I think it may have been called Webley.  They are
definitely revolvers. 
-- 
"Land of song, said the warrior bard,           Jim Heath
Though all the world betrays thee.
One sword, at least, thy rights shall guard, (The Minstrel Boy)
One faithful harp will praise thee."         (Thomas Moore)
From: jglarson@watmsg.waterloo.edu (Johan Larson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: ammo calibers ?!
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:33:55 GMT
Organization: University of Waterloo

The book "Small Arms of the World" by Ezell contains a table at the
back giving imperial and metric measurements for a broad range of 
ammunition types.  The common name for ammunition usually indicates
the caliber in either imperial or metric, although there are exceptions
such as the .38 which is actually of caliber .357; go figure .

The book, now in its twelfth edition, is a true classic.
If you don't have one, buy it, read it, learn it, love it.
I keep mine under my pillow ;-) .
It is about the size of a phone-book, and available from 
Barnes & Noble.
-- 
Johan Larson
                    The net is packed with objectivists, anarchists, 
                    libertarians and self-appointed threats to the current 
                    order, writing on company time with company equipment.
From: dnelson@umbio.med.miami.edu (Dru Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Hello, concerning a sale of a model 41 Smith and Wesson
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:52:53 GMT



  Hello,

    I have a Smith and Wesson target pistol that I would like to
    sell.  Before I put it in the local bargain paper I would
    rather try to see if I could get to people more interested
    in target shooting and this excellent gun.

    What would the best way be to sell this gun lawfully?
From: dcwst8+@pitt.edu (David C Winters)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: AVOIDING GETTING MISTAKENLY SHOT
Date: 24 Jul 92 15:36:50 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


In article <199207231924.AA11569@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> meyer@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Don Meyer) writes:
#gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn) writes:
#>Oh, really?  What other purpose could you have in carrying such a badge?

#Actually, volunteer firemen in my neck of the woods are issued badges.

There's also a mailorder firm that blends Western stuff and USCavaly
stuff, and sells both types, named Kaufman's West.  It sells an "Official
Taxpayers' Badge," with red, white, and blue enamel on it.  A decent
gag, but not for me ( $25, on my budget, is too much to spend for stuff
that stupid).

Disclaimer:
Any thougts on what to do with it are left to the reader's imagination.


--
David Winters  
dcwst8@unix.cis.pitt.edu OR winters@vms.cis.pitt.edu

          Illigitimi non carborundum.
From: nguyen@Cadence.COM (Anh-Dung V. Nguyen)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: 9mm Information
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:38:51 GMT
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc.


		Hi I'm fairly new to this group.  At least it is my first post.
		I'm looking to purchase a hand-gun for the first time.

		The choices open due to my finances seem to be:

			9mm
				Browning Hi-Power
				Taurus 92C
				Glock 19

		Not that I don't like Sig but they're just way beyond 
		my budget range.

		Any other recommendations or comments on what would
		be a good choice for a compact 9mm or compact high
		capacity .45's.  I have fairly small hands, just 
		barely being able to achieve a good grip on the 
		Glock.

		No SIG-Glock wars please.

		Thanks,
		Andy
From: leem@jpl-devvax.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Lee Mellinger)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: M1 Garand/M1A history & differences?
Date: 21 Jul 92 21:12:10 GMT
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory (NASA)

In article <9207210938.AA02403@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu> raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man) writes:
:#The Garand was also used in Nam.  As you may have observed, when
:#the Garand fires its last round it makes a distinctive "t-ting"
:
:The US Army were already buying M16 in the hundreds of thousands in 
:1958 - 1961, so I guess very few VC had the good fortune to run into
:an M1.

The first M16 buy was by the USAF for 25,000 for their Combat Defense
Force in 1963.  The Army did not see any until about 1965-1966.


Lee


"Mit Pulver und Blei, die Gedanken sind frei."

|Lee F. Mellinger                 Caltech/Jet Propulsion Laboratory - NASA
|4800 Oak Grove Drive, Pasadena, CA 91109 818/354-1163  FTS 792-1163     
|leem@jpl-devvax.JPL.NASA.GOV
From: jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Georgia - Land of Paradise for Progunners???
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:39:03 GMT
Organization: Dixie Communications Public Access.  The Mouth of the South.

osan@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (Mr. X) writes:

##The larger cities are not the case.  In fact, I have heard on the net 
##from some problems with a police chief who has imposed the policy of
##arresting and charging citizens with valid CCW permits for illegal 
##carry of a firearm.

#	Is this person leaving himself or his department and perhaps even the 
#	state open to the possibility of a VERY LARGE civil action, not to 
#	mention criminal charges for false arrest?

I posted the original report.  The county is Cobb and the chief is
named Hightower.  At the time an internal power struggle spawned by 
some top officials turning traitor and secretly agreeing with Gov
Miller to pass a trigger lock and a waiting period bill destroyed
the state NRA organization, we were preparing a suit.  We had two 
victims, two Cobb county officers ready to testify as to their
instructions and volunteer legal counsel.  Unfortunately the
power struggle got in the way so the case is off.  For now it will
depend on someone with the necessary money to pursue a suit
by him/her self.  

A rather long narrative of this situation was posted in t.p.g several
months ago by me.  I might be able to find it in my archives if anyone
is REALLY interested.

To the extent that many police ignore any law they think they can get 
away with breaking and to the extent that a private citizen must spend
real money to bring and prosecute such suits, the chief IS somewhat 
immune.

John

-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC               |Interested in high performance mobility?  
Performance Engineering Magazine (TM) |
Marietta, Ga                         |Interested in high tech and computers? 
jgd@dixie.com                        |Write me about PE Magazine
Need Usenet public Access in Atlanta?  Write Me for info on Dixie.com.
From: post@hpfcso.fc.hp.com (David Post)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Best defense: Machine gun or shotgun?
Date: 23 Jul 92 14:30:20 GMT

Dave Waller asked about what might be better for an relatively untrained
person to defend against an angry mob in the case of social collapse.

I am wondering how many folks recommending a machine gun instead of a
shotgun in a full riot situation have actually shot a machine gun.

I recently had the opportunity to use one and observe others, novice and
experienced, using one.

The gun I used was a MAC-10, a 45 ACP MG with cyclic rate of about 1000
rounds per minute.   I was the last user and watched everyone elses
mistakes.

#From ten yards, I shot a 30 round magazine in 3 or 4 bursts at a torso-sized
targets and had 5 hits, none in the A zone.

I watched as an experienced person, the owner, emptied a magazine at three
groups of three El Presidente silouettes from 15 yards.  He managed a total
of 6 hits on 9 torso-sized targets, I think there was one A-zone hit.  With
another magazine of 30, he managed 5 hits on a single torso-sized target.
It took about 1.5 seconds to change magazines.

Other folks did not get a single hit on those nine targets.  ( Mostly
shooting over ).

How much experience will most folks have with their machine gun?

A shotgun with an extended magazine could be manipulated to get off 7 torso
hits before reloading ( unless you had a 50 round drum ).  The technique is
relatively easy.

May I suggest that there is a third, more effective technique that could be
used in a full riot situation and with which it is easier to gain experience
with?

That would be a small semi-automatic rifle in 223 or 7.62x39 with 30 round
magazines.  I think most people, with a little practice, can achieve 2 torso
hit per second at 15 yards range.  You would only reload at 10-15 second
intervals ( unless you had a drum magazine ).

And of course, all this is theoretical because if you open fire on a
murderous mob they may tend to mill around a bit, making it tougher to do a
"Rambo-style" movie defense.  :-)

David Post  davep@hpfcpp.fc.hp.com  hplabs!hpfcla!post
From: burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Diff between 40 S&W/10mm and 10mm Auto Dies.
Date: 21 Jul 92 21:12:23 GMT
Organization: Quarterdeck Office Systems, Santa Monica CA

In article <1992Jul21.015018.9534@massey.ac.nz> C.T.Teo@massey.ac.nz (C.T. Teo) writes:
#Re: Diff between 40 S&W/10mm and 10mm Auto dies.
#
#What is the difference between Lee 40 S&W/10mm and a 10mm Auto dies set?
#
#Can the 10mm Auto dies be use to load 40 S&W case?
#
#Either email or post (with Moderator's permission ?). Thanks
#
#C.T.Teo@massey.ac.nz
#Massey University
#New Zealand.
#
You could probably get away with this EXCEPT that you could not get the 
case far enough into the seater to crimp it.  Usually this is done the other wayaround.  10mm in a .40S&W - .357 in a .38 die. etc.

Bill	burge@qdeck.com
From: gisie@wam.umd.edu (Dr. Death)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Air Weapons and the Olympics
Date: 28 Jul 92 21:41:54 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park

In article <9207281857.AA29808@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (steve hix) writes:
#
#But we now have some evidence that there really are shooting
#events at the Olympics!


Here is the schedule for ALL of the shooting events at Barcelona
(times are in Barcelona time)

July 26, Sunday
Final, air rifle, women 8:30am - 4pm
Finals, free pistol, men 8:30am - 4pm
Clay target, skeet 9am - 4pm

July 27, Monday
Sport pistol, precision, women 9am - 3:30pm
Finals, sport pistol, rapid fire, women 9am - 3:30pm
Finals, air rifle, men 9am - 3:30pm
Clay target, skeet 9am - 3:30pm

July 28, Tuesday
Finals, air pistol, men 9am - 2:30pm
Semifinals & finals clay target, skeet 9am - 2:30pm

July 29, Wednesday
Finals, smallbore free rifle, men (English) 9am - 2pm
Rapid fire pistol, men 9am - 2pm

July 30, Thursday 
Semifinals and Finals, rapid fire, pistol, men 9am - 4:30pm
Finals, smallbore free rifle, 3 postitions, women, 9am - 4:30pm

July 31, Friday
Finals, smallbore free rifle, 3 positions, men 9am - 4:30pm
Clay target, trap 9am - 4:30pm
Running game target, men 9am - 4:30pm

August 1, Saturday
Finals, air pistol, women 9am - 3:30pm
Finals, running game target, men 9am -3:30pm
Clay target, trap 9am - 3:30pm

August 2, Sunday
Semifinals and Finals, clay target, trap 9am - 3pm

All of the shooting sports are held at the Camp de Tir Olimpic (Mollet
del Valles).  Seating is unlimited (I guess it's a field).  Does anyone
know if the triplecast stuff is showing any of the shooting competition?


Doc



-- 
x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-
|  Dr. Death    gisie@wam.umd.edu                                      |
x  "If your fighting for your life, it's OK to die..."                 x
|-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x|
From: megatek!hollen@uunet.UU.NET (Dion Hollenbeck)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Do it your self bluing solution - fatal mistake?
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:10:18 GMT
Organization: Megatek Corporation, San Diego, California

#>>>> On 30 Jul 92 14:55:40 GMT, n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) said:

James> I did some touch up with Birchwood Casey Perma-Blue and afterward
James> there were some unsightly spots on the slide.   I've heard this
James> blue is not as durable as "real" blue, does this mean it will
James> wear off after a while?

Why you got spots is that hot blueing which most original blueing jobs
are done with is alkaline, while cold blueing is acid.  At the
interface between the two, you will always get a "ring".  Even if it
is ugly, the purpose of blueing is to keep the metal from rusting.

I am not in agreement that cold blueing is any less durable if
correctly done (here I go again, opening myself up to flames), but if
it is, then when it starts wearing, just do it again.

-- 
Dion Hollenbeck       UUCP: {uunet, ucsd, sun}!megatek!hollen
                      INTERNET:            hollen@megatek.com
Megatek Corporation  9645 Scranton Rd.  San Diego, Ca.  92121
From: ray.normandeau@factory.com (Ray Normandeau)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: NATIONAL BLACK RIFLEMEN
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:39:00 GMT
Organization: Invention Factory's BBS - New York City, NY - 212-274-1243v.32bis



The Queensbridge Tenant Council which represents tenants in the
largest public housing project in the USA (Queensbridge Houses in
NYC) is trying to locate the: National Black Riflemen's Association.

I was hoping that maybe someone here might have contact information
for them. If so please reply to this message or by EMail to:
CompuServe ID 73770,121 or Internet: ray.normandeau@factory.com.
I usually check my Internet mail every day.
Messages can be sent from CompuServe to Internet by using on the TO
line >INTERNET: ray.normandeau@factory.com

Thank you,
Ray Normandeau
718-392-1267
Press Secretary for Queensbridge Tenant Council