HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rajat@sunny1.che.clarkson.edu (Rajat Kapoor,P303,2124)
Subject: Re: Ram (Was he Fact or Fiction)???????????
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 19:18:06 GMT

From article <1992Dec11.063242.6000@njitgw.njit.edu>, by deepak@konark.njit.edu (Deepak Kakadasam):
> 
> As fas as I know "RAM" was just a fictitious creation. Was there for
> real a Ram, a Ravan...etc...........

I`ve noticed a streak of certain beliefs amongst Hindus that borders
on being outright incredulous. One of them is that the events described
the vicious circle.

Rajat
denial that it could have taken place only in the last 10,000 years or so.
From: iyengar%ppl.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Satish Iyengar)
Subject: Re: ...... Hyderabadi muslims ........
Date: 15 Dec 92 13:43:32 MST
Organization: University of Utah

In article <1992Dec15.183019.28236@cs.wayne.edu>, uds@trace.eng.wayne.edu (Seetamraju Udaybhaskar) writes:
|> 
|> narain@bass.bu.edu gave a very good account of what he saw and explained
|> quite clearly the reasons for his disgust the hyderabadi muslim's behaviour.
|> 
|> whatever the other people's response is to it : I have something to say too.
|> 
|> 
|> My personal experience is identical.  having lived in many parts of india,
|> I venture to state this : the hyderabadi muslims are the most
|> agressive and the most unpatriotic muslims in the subcontinent (going by
|> the definition of the concepts of Nationnality and Citizenship).
|> 
|> True, their behaviour is disgusting.  But I also see them with
|> clearer glasses.  I follow political history and this is what I came to
|> know.  The hyderabadi muslims NEVER WANTED TO BE A PART OF INDIA.
          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Having lived in Hyderabad all my life and having read about the history of
Hyderabad, I tend to disagree with you.   Agreed, there are a few cases of 
bigotry among the muslims.  But I don't think your claim that the Hyderabadi
muslims never wanted to be part of India is wrong.  The then Nizam of 
Hyderabad wanted Hyderabad to be annexed into Pakistan but the average 
muslim on the street did not have such strong feelings in that respect.  In
my dealings with muslims in Hyderabad, I have found that they are as partriotic
as any other Indian.  You may disagree with me here but this is my $0.02 worth.

	[stuff deleted]

|> 
|> Seetamraju Udaya Bhaskar Sarma
|> (email : seetam @ ece7 . eng . wayne . edu)
|> 
|> 

Cheers,

Satish.

-- 
Satish S. Iyengar                             Phone:(Home) (801) 581-1424
Dept. of Electrical Engg.                           (Work) (801) 581-5618
University of Utah,                                        (801) 585-3676
Salt Lake City, UT 84112.
From: garyd@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Gary Deol)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re:Khalistan
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 22:37:34 MST
Organization: Edmonton Remote Systems #3, Edmonton, AB, Canada

A reply to a message written by: uds@trace.eng.wayne.edu 
                                 (Seetamraju Udaybhaskar)
 
 
>> The Indian Army had been practising the attack on the Golden Temple 
>>since early 1983. They even made a full size replica model to 
>>practice on. 
 
>U make it sound like ``hitler's germany was planning on invading poland
>and practising for 10 years''
 
 Do you think they thought of Blitzcreig over the weekend?
 
>I could go on and on about how the army still gives the people in the
>punjab administration sleepless nights, because it has been 
>threatening to withdraw completely from the punjab cess-pool.
 
  The only reason why they are threatening right now to withdraw
is becasue SSP Saini beat up and locked an Indian army officer, if
that is what the security forces can do to `officers' what do you
think they do to normal citizens? <- RIP perhaps?
 
>Blame the GOI and curse IG for what she did to punjab and we are all 
>ears (to use perot's statement)...
 
  The blame is already there, we want the satisfaction of punishment,
and the best way to punish India is to create the independant state
of Khalistan.
 

Gary Deol              garyd@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca
From: fafat@phakt.usc.edu (Vijay Fafat)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: Do we need a religion?
Date: 18 Dec 1992 22:43:05 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: phakt.usc.edu

Akash writes:
>You agree then that we need some common sense apparatus (apparati?)
>before we can even start talking scientifically. 

	O definitely. 

>Note that all you
>can do is demonstrate (rather violently) that there is light, not
>prove it, assuming that there is common sense apparatus. 

	I do not understand what you mean when you say "demonstrating" is'nt
	proving.

>Even then,
>photocells are not unique sources of electricity, and convex lenses
>are not unique precipitators of fire. So you still have some proof
>left.

	whaaaaaat? I suggest you write with more perspicuity.


>The domain of science is limited to talking about observations of
>reality. It no can talk of reality itself. 

	o no, not again! For the last time, what do you mean by "reality
	itself"??? If you're talking about something which exists only in
	your imagination, I'm not interested. Spare me that which I have no
	way of knowing about for myself. And my own religion seems to indicate 
	there's nothing called "objective reality". A particle does not
	"possess" any physical properties in any objective sense till a
	measurement is made on it. If you don't agree with that and don't 
	wish to give any reasons other than some arcane verses from peepuls
	who believed in making rash statements, spare me. I don't see how
	the impasse can be broken. As I'd told Woopie babu, you be happy with
	your ignorance, I'll be with mine.


>	The delight of the Eternal from which words turn away
>	without attaining and the mind also returneth baffled,
>	who knoweth the delight of the Eternal?

	I'm NOT interested in such philosophical dissertations. if that's 
	all you have to say, spare me. Gootchie goo with Worma on the 
	phone. He would be most attentive.
 

>By analogy, it is impossible for us to talk about "psychological"
>phenomena unless we have some common subtle sense apparatus. So
>I guess I have a long wait ahead while I watch evolution meander
>along its course. But I have hope because such a sense is latent
>or behind the veil in you. It is that in you which sees your eye's
>seeings (my earlier quote from Kena).
>-Akash


	You're most welcome to have your own delusions. Even I have
	my own. Madhuri Dixit... :)

	FFT
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: f43703a@nucc.cc.nagoya-u.ac.jp (SUPRATIC GUPTA)
Subject: Defination of Castee system Re: Caste system/ we have to destroy it
Organization: Nagoya University Computation Center, Nagoya, Japan.
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 01:45:45 GMT



Defination of Caste system that has no contradiction. If this is the
defination, then all societies have this. There is no problem.

Caste system is a collection of compatible people. In past they
represent people of simillar Job. Even today I think it is true.


   -- This has no objection.

But this is not what we mean by caste syustem that exists in India,
that ought to be destroyed. The defination is:

Caste system is the group of people that have anssistors that have
                                              ^^^^^^^^^^
similar Jobs. It is not necessory that they be compatible or have
^^^^^^^                                        ^^^^^^^^^^
same job. I am a Vaidya, meaning doctors, Non of my family members are
doctors.

    -- This is the ddefination of the caste system that the world
is telling bad in Hinduisim.

So I posted this letter because I find people asking in SCP

Will a rich persson marry his survent?

    --This is caste system according to the first defination and
is perfectly OK. So this question is not a good question. You should ask

Will a rich person mind marrying the daughter/son of his survent who has
achived fantastic Academic credential?

   -- If the answer is YES, he minds, then the caste system (2nd defination)
exist and should be removed.


Am I now clear in my point. In that way neither Islam nor Budhisim has caste
system. But there is obviously little reflection of our caste system in Islamic
society also. One of my muslim friends that it seems SAHIDS consider themselves
higher then the rest. But this is not Islam. It is just a bad reflection
of Hinduisim in Islam. It is almost non-existent.

So 1st defination is OK, but 2nd is not. All we, even Budha protested
is this 2nd defination. This 2nd defination retrads the developement
of the lower caste and improves the higher caste.

Hiriditory nature of caste system has to be destroyed. The name Brahmins,
etc. has also to be removed.  They are too old to be used.          

Please coment. Drop a personal mail to me if it is still not clear


-- 
With regards

SUPRATIC GUPTA
From: plaul@engr.LaTech.edu (Pummy Laul)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: Phone company info wanted...
Date: 21 Dec 92 01:18:26 GMT
Organization: Louisiana Tech University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Sandeep N Gupta (gupta_sn@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu) wrote:
: Hi netters,

: 	I am new here and wanted some info on long-distance phone companies.
: I have taken AT&T Reach out World scheme which offers a rate of $1.56 to
: India in the evenings and on weekends. Recently someone had mentioned something
: about india calls at the rate of $1.25 or so. could someone elaborate?
: also i am aware that MCI has a special family calling scheme under which the
: number you call most often gets very cheap rates. But since i stay with two
: other students, I fail to understand how to make use of the scheme.
: Could you please enlighten me . 

: You may reply on the net or use my email address :
:        gupta_sn@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu

: Thanks in advance,

: -Sandeep Gupta.
:  




This article is in reference to the earlier articles regarding US Sprint calls to India.  

Sprint has some hidden charges like accounting codes  (something like AT&T's Call Manager).  Accounting codes cost $ 5 a month.  AT&T's call manager is free.

Sprint Plus does not really offer any major savings, if you really look at it closely  you will notice that Reach Out America on AT&T is slightly more expensive than Sprint Plus and the free Call Manager feature on AT&T makes up for it.

I personally still prefer MCI Friends and Families for the best savings for calling within the US, but my roomates who do not call that much within the US prefer AT&T for its Call Manager feature.

Solution:-

Have All 3 on the same phone.

1)  Have Sprint as your primary long distance company with Sprint World and THE MOST
    Make only your India calls on Sprint ($ 1.23/min) and THE MOST feature 
    automatically saves you 20 % on the number called the most, make sure that it is an
    India number and divide the 20 % with your roomates.

2)  Use MCI  by dialing 10222-1-phone number  and enjoy the friends and family benefits

3)  Use AT&T by dialing 10288-  ;  Please note=  USE AT&T only if you want to enjoy the
                                                 Call manager feature.

MCI & AT&T allow you to use their benefits even if you do not have them as their primary long distance company
                                   
Good Luck




-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pummy Laul			   |   
		   		   |    A Tall Oak is Just a Small Nut  
Internet: plaul@engr.LaTech.EDU    | 
Bitnet:   plaul%engr.LaTech.EDU    |    That stood its Ground.
		     @LaTech.Bitnet|   
Tel- (318)-251-9945                |    
------------------------------------------------------------------------------	
  			
Rock Chalk JAYHAWK!!!!!
From: bala@research.att.com (Bala Krishnamurthy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Procter & Gamble Forming Joint Business w/ godrej
Keywords: P&G Godrej
Date: 17 Dec 92 19:38:33 GMT
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories


apnews reports:
 CINCINNATI (AP) _ The Procter & Gamble Co. said Thursday it has
invested $22 million in a joint venture with an Indian company to
make, sell and distribute consumer products in India.
	   P&G said it signed an agreement with the Godrej Group, of
Bombay, India, to form a joint business to be called P&G Godrej.
The business will market, sell and distribute Godrej and P&G toilet
soap products, make synthetic detergents, and take over sales and
distribution of other cleaning and personal care products of P&G
and Godrej.
	   Also under the agreement, P&G India Ltd. will acquire the Key
and Trilo detergent product trademarks from Godrej Soaps Ltd., a
member of the Godrej Group.
	   Procter & Gamble, a Cincinnati-based consumer products company
with worldwide annual sales of $30 billion, said it will own 51
percent of the joint venture and manage it.
	   Godrej Group, a family-owned business, will continue to
separately operate its other businesses in India, including
chemicals and biotechnology.
	   P&G India Ltd., a P&G company which began operating in 1964,
will continue to make and sell its product line which includes
Ariel detergent, Vicks cough and cold products, Whisper feminine
protection pads, Mediker shampoo, Clearasil acne treatment and Oil
of Olay skin cream.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: akhil@zen.gsm.cornell.edu (Akhil Kumar)
Subject: Need to convert a tape from NTSC to PAL..
Nntp-Posting-User: @cornell.edu
Organization: Cornell University 
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 04:22:36 GMT


I have to get an important tape converted from NTSC to PAL.
Will appreciate recommendations based on your experience.  

Thanks,

Akhil
(akhil@zen.gsm.cornell.edu)
 
From: sbmn@hpcupt3.cup.hp.com (S.Subramanian(contr))
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 21:05:10 GMT
Subject: sexual harassment
Organization: Hewlett Packard, Cupertino
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian


The heat and dust generated by RJB/BM has settled  and  life  has
returned to normal even in India.  It is high time we get on with
other interesting things which are escaping our attention.

Sometime back there was a very heated debate  in  this  forum  on
sexual harassment,  wherein  one side  argued that the women face
little harassment  in  US.   Having  followed  this  thread  with
great  interest,  I  can't help drawing the attention of SCI to a
recent report in San Jose Mercury.

Three women who had worked as secretaries to Larry  Micheal,  the
CEO   of   Santa  Cruz Operations (SCO) have exposed the the kind
of harassment that they have been subjected   to.    Apart   from
the  lewd  comments  and  jokes  that  he  keeps cracking, he has
been forcing them to kiss him and accompany him   to   his   home
during work  hours  against  their  will.   Their  complaints  to
the VP (Personnel) have been dismissed  with  the   advice   "co-
operate   or  quit".   After they came public, many women who are
working or had earlier worked for SCO have come up  with  stories
that  reveal  what  had  been  happening in SCO for the past five
years.  The message had  trickled   down   from   the   top   and
women   had   been  facing harassment not just from Larry and his
son but even from managers at various levels.

I do not like to draw generalizations  about   a   society   from
an  isolated  incident.  But what really surprises me is the fact
that even in a corporation of the size of SCO, such things can go
on  for  several years without the ouside world knowing about it.
Will  this  kind of a thing happen in India ?  Is  it  not  worse
than   a   piercing   look  or   an innocuous  comment  a   woman
encounters in the streets ?

Subbu
From: sgs1679@usl.edu (Sudhindranath Sira G)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: This is for the "Secularists"
Date: 17 Dec 92 17:34:55 GMT
Organization: University of Southwestern Louisiana

In article <1992Dec15.194829.23290@news2.cis.umn.edu> prabhak@giga.cs.umn.edu (Satya Prabhakar) writes:
>(The Purple Bleeder ) writes:
>>As for the mahatmas who abound on the net......please 
>>think how it hurts if u are a true Indian when u see
>>people loyal to Pakistan, chhering them openly, 
>
>Well, let us just say that Leander Paes of India gets
>to the US Open Tennis Finals and is slated to meet
>Andre Agassi. There is no question as to who I shall
>root for.
>
>How about you?
>

Well, since you asked for it, suppose the Ragin' Cajuns (representing
my university here in USA) plays a basketball match against Bangalore 
University (where I did my undergraduation), there is no question about 
which side I will support ---- neither of them. I would not support any 
side at the expense of the other. Because it is something that I would 
not be able to do. I would just enjoy the game and take an attitude of 
"May the better side win...".

>If an Indian who has become an American citizen roots
>for Paes, is that treason?
>

It is *not* treason, but it may not be liked very much by your
American friends. Having come out of India to make a living here,
you ought to show more *balance* in your attitudes.


>Satya Prabhakar
>--

Regards,

--Sudhi.

--
********************   Sira Gopinath Sudhindranath.   **********************
email : sudhi@usl.edu,         Address : USL PO Box 41688,
        sgs@ucs.usl.edu                  Lafayette, LA 70504-1688. USA.
****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: seeta@eng.wayne.edu (Seetamraju UdayaBhaskar Sarma)
Subject: Re: Army in India [was Re: 3 BJP ruled state g
Reply-To: seeta@eng.wayne.edu
Organization: College of Engineering, Wayne State University, Detroit Michigan, USA
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 22:34:17 GMT

In article 1gos8qINNe38@fido.asd.sgi.com, shankar@sgi.com (Shankar Unni) writes:
-+>The one big difference between India and Pakistan is that India's army
-+>is extremely apolitical. Probably by design, since successive
-+>governments keep tinkering with the armed forces' command structure
-+>and transfer officers at whim.
-+>
-+>And the armed forces cannot really do much about this, because they
-+>are not organized enough for that (a chicken-and-egg problem).


The armed forces was made impotent to act INTERNALLY.   Thank Dr.Ambedkar for his
briliant legal knowledge to completely tie up the armed forces.  If I am right
the armed forces CANT EVEN act on their own to PROTECT the country from an invasion.

The notion of the president as supreme commander I guess was american.   The army
structure is so loose that ::: the higher the army officer is in rank, the
lesser influence he has on the soldeirs...   In fact, that's the reason why there
is such strong relationships between the junior commissioned officers and the
senior officers, as the seniors cant get things done without the cooperation of tje
junior officers (NOt that its impossible, but its close to it).

BTW, I suddenly recalled Gen.Cariappa's proposal to the queen to hand over india
to the armed forces (particularly the army) after indepenedence (Illustrated Weekly?)

i.e., india would have started off with martial law...

Seetamraju Udaya Bhaskar Sarma
(email : seetam @ ece7 . eng . wayne . edu)


Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: rrp@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (rakesh.r.patel)
Subject: Re: why dulipkumar uses hindu name for popularity!!!
Organization: AT&T
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 14:34:03 GMT

In article <1992Dec10.125359.1@us.oracle.com> vsood@us.oracle.com writes:
>In article <1992Nov30.141622.12980@cbfsb.cb.att.com>, rrp@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (rakesh.r.patel) writes:
>> In article <1f8j3rINNc4a@shadow.ksu.ksu.edu> drparul@shadow.ksu.ksu.edu (TRANSCEND  G O D) writes:
>>> I always wonder, why few muslims uses hindu name for gaining social
>>> respect, social acceptance in the indian society..As Dulip Kumar who is
>>> a true muslim but to get an identity he goes with hindu name..
>>>
>>> But that seems a good sign for developing harmony between muslims and hindus
>>> our muslim brothers may help us on this issue.   
>>>
>>>
>> That's the stupidest thing I've heard. How hiding yourself be good???
>> 
>> 
>> Rakesh Patel
>
>
>ANY movie star, including Indian (muslim) ones get names from their producers
>directors or managers, this is for marketing purposes, not HIDING purposes.
>It is absolutely inane to think that he is trying to hide himself, when if you
>listen to him speak it only takes you 5 seconds to figure out he's a muslim.

I agree. But this is implying that this is good way for 'developing 
harmony'. Come on! I agree, hiding was probably a bit too strong. But if you
think a bunch of actors changing their names is going to help matters, forget
about it.
>
>
>Stop trying to build more barriers between hindus and muslims. There is enough
>trouble in our country already. 

If I am the cause of building barriers between hindus and muslims by commenting
on an innocuous posting, then I apologize. But I seriously doubt it that I
commiting sedition or being a Naraadmuni. A bunch of eggheads, engaging in
in verbal jousting, on a net is hardly cause for alarm.  That's all.
>

Rakesh Patel
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: raj@utkvx3.utk.edu (S. KANAKA RAJ)
Subject: Who is a fanatic?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Tennessee Computing Center
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 04:04:00 GMT


	The one great advantage of Bhakti is that it is the easiest and the
most natural way to reach the great divine end in view; its great disadvantage
is that in its lower forms it often times degenerates into hideous fanaticism.
The fanatical crew in Hinduism, or Mohammedanism, or Christianity, have always
been almost exclusively recruited from these worshippers on the lower planes of
Bhakti. That singleness of attachment (Nishtaa) to a loved object, without
which no genuine love can grow, is very often also the cause of the
denunciation of everything else. All the weak and undeveloped minds in every
religion or country have only one way of loving their own ideal, i.e. by hating
every other ideal. Herein is the explanation of why the same man who is so
lovingly attached to his own ideal of God, so devoted to his own ideal of
religion, becomes a howling fanatic as soon as he sees or hears anything of any
other ideal.
	This kind of love is somewhat like the canine instinct of guarding the
master's property from intrusion; only, the instinct of the dog is better than
the reason of man, for the dog never mistakes its master for an enemy in
whatever dress he may come before it. Again, the fanatic loses all power of
judgment. Personal considerations are in his case of such absorbing interest
that to him it is no question at all what a man says - whether it is right or
wrong; but the one thing he is always particularly careful to know is who says
it. The same man who is kind, good, honest, and loving to people of his own
opinion, will not hesitate to do the vilest deeds when they are directed
against persons beyond the pale of his own religious brotherhood.

				- Swami Vivekanandha

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Religion, which is the highest knowledge and the highest wisdom, cannot be
bought, nor can it be acquired from books.	- Swami Vivekanandha

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

S. Kanaka Raj



Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
From: godura@oin.cis.udel.edu (Ruchir Godura)
Subject: Re: Hipocricy.
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 19:41:57 GMT

In article <1992Dec16.212241.25175@cypress.com> ssr@siberia.cypress.com (Bapcha/FPGA) writes:
>
>Shariyat for Shao Bano but Supreme Court for Debris Masjid. You go
>figure.  I ain't saying that the destruction of the Babri Masjid was
>right..... just wanted to HILIGHT the hipocrisy involved in this
>issue !
>
Congratulations on a VERY relevant comparison !
Wonder why no one brought this up before ?
Shariyat when the muslim men want to oppress their women. How about
Shariyat when a muslim is arrested for theivery ?
Oh, no, then they want the SECULAR laws of the land.
Ruchir.
>
>-- 
>Bapcha
>3901 N.  First Strasse
>San Jose,  CA 95134, 408-943-2719

-- 
Ruchir Godura | godura@cis.udel.edu | (302) 292-0668 (H) (302) 831-1949 (W)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian