HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brant@seq.uncwil.edu (AT-Dreamer)
Subject: Re: Neophyte tent groundsheet question
Organization: Univ. of North Carolina @ Wilmington
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 16:26:47 GMT

Put the sheet on the inside in a bad storm and make a little tub out of
it so the rain runs under the plastic (ps sheet needs to be bigger than
the tent bottom so it can run up the walls a little).


                  chuck b.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Worlds may change, galaxies disintegrate /brant@seq. | "What doesn't kill us 
but a woman always remains a woman.     / uncwil.edu |    makes us stronger"    
- Kirk, "Conscience of the King,"      / "Chuck"     |    -- A.T. Dreamer
From: mssmith@afterlife.ncsc.mil (M. Scott Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Bears attacking people?
Date: 13 Oct 92 19:50:39 GMT
Organization: The Great Beyond

I read with interest the story of the bear killing a person in Yellowstone,
and I think it's interesting that there are people who are strongly for
killing the bear(s) and strongly against it.

So, I have a few questions.

First, I didn't hear any details about what happened at Yellowstone --
exactly what did the person do to provoke the mother bear?  Did he just
stumble upon the bear and her cubs, accidentally, and get attacked?  Or
was he making funny faces at the bear, or what?

(Basically, was it HIS fault?  What I've read so far seems to indicate that
it was his fault, although I haven't seen evidence that it was.  If he was
just hiking and got attacked by the bear, I would tend to feel pity for
him and I wouldn't have the attitude that "yay, finally the bear strikes
back!"  So please fill me in on the details.)

I can understand the uproar to not shoot the bear and her cubs because they
had killed a man, but if I knew the person who was killed, I don't think
I would have the same emotion.  (Again, this is prompted by not knowing
the details of whether the man did anything to provoke the attack.)  If
the man was innocently hiking, and the bear attacked him, I would tend
to think that the bear would attack other people later on, especially
having tasted human blood.

Finally, I'd like to hear info about bears and what one must worry about
when hiking or camping in bear country.  If I go hiking with a group of
people, would that discourage a bear from attacking me (assuming the
bear had a reason to, like I accidentally stepped on her cubs' paw)?

Scott
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna)
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 20:41:19 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Computer Science Department

In article <1bk9vpINN9lk@hpscdf.scd.hp.com> sommer@scd.hp.com (Jeremy Sommer) writes:
>Mary Shafer (shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov) wrote:
>: On 14 Oct 92 16:05:00 GMT, ecologycntr@igc.apc.org (Ecology Center) said:
>: 
>: Hey, I'm bad at geography, but even I know that the Amazon is in
>: Brazil.  It's not in Peru or Nicaragua, it's in Brazil.  The Sendero
>: Luminoso (the members are not called Senderistas) is not in Brazil,
>: particularly not in the Amazon basin.
>
>Try looking at a map.  I'm sure the townspeople of Iquitos will be glad to know
>they are not on the Amazon  :-)

The Amazon is a bigger river than most people realize.   4000 miles source
to sea.  Makes the Mississipi, the Colorado, and even the Yukon look like
creeks.
-- 

-Wayne Trzyna
 trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Backcountry in the Movies
Date: 15 Oct 92 23:05:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: unocal.1992Oct15.230530.10558
Organization: Unocal Corporation

Tarzan series.
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 16:45:06 GMT

On 14 Oct 92 16:05:00 GMT, ecologycntr@igc.apc.org (Ecology Center) said:

C> No doubt john meant "Senderista", an epithet for the cult-like 
C> Communist Party of Peru.

Hey, I'm bad at geography, but even I know that the Amazon is in
Brazil.  It's not in Peru or Nicaragua, it's in Brazil.  The Sendero
Luminoso (the members are not called Senderistas) is not in Brazil,
particularly not in the Amazon basin.

A good clue is the Spanish name; they speak Portuguese in Brazil.

Look, he just goofed.  Anyone can do it.  Real men and women admit
it and get on with their lives.  Let it go.

--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "There's no kill like a guns kill." LCDR "Hoser" Satrapa, gunnery instructor
                       "A kill is a kill."  Anonymous
From: cheu@venus.its.uci.edu (Kelvin Cheu)
Subject: Re: Backcountry in the Movies
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Reply-To: cheu@venus.its.uci.edu (Kelvin Cheu)
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 15 Oct 92 04:36:03 GMT


These are the few I can think of:

	Gorilla in the mist
	Medicine Man
	K2
	Dances with Wolves
	....

anymore ?


Kelvin

BTW, there is a Chinese (made in Hong Kong) version of the
God Must be Crazy, staring the same bushman, and his tribe.
From: racg8670@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Becca )
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Neophyte tent groundsheet question
Date: 7 Oct 92 18:29:18 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.BvrKow.5E3
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

jemorti@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Jack Mortimer - K31) writes:

>In article <BvrD8F.1Do@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, racg8670@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Becca ) writes:
>|> I suggest a space blanket (if you have a 2 person tent)...
>|> 
>|> and you can get one just about the perfect size for a small tent for only
>|> $5...
>|> 
>In fact, the best price I could find was around $10.  Where are these
>available for $5?  And BTW, I am thinking of the blanket that has one side
>silver and one side a colored plastic (mine is red).  I did not consider the
>emergency space blanket that folds to nearly pocket size.
>Jack Mortimer
>jemorti@relay.nswc.navy.mil

I could be wrong (as I often am)...

We got ours at Wilderness Sports in Seattle...

it is the emergency one that folds to about the size of a heavy set of hiking
socks :)

could be that we paid $10 for it... but even at $10 I would consider this 
well worth it...

oh ours is blue on the colored side...

becca
From: johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcou
Date: 9 Oct 92 22:58:45 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Inc.


O.K. we've got marijuana growers in California and bootleggers in Kentucky
so far.  Let me add another data point.

I read a book awhile back called "Running the Amazon".  I don't recall the
authors name but it's an incredibly fasinating book about a group of people
that "ran" the entire length of the Amazon river from it's source at over
17k' to the mouth at ocean.  During the trip they came across some sections
that had never been charted that had some incredible rapids.  At one point
their journey led them to a sandbar where their camp was broken by gunshots
over their heads.  They were in the heart of sandanistan guerrilla territory
and their coca fields.  They were captured but managed to negotiate their
escape by giving up three six packs of beer.  I've never been in a kayak
in my life but thoroughly enjoy this book.  

-- 
+==========================================================================+
| John Fereira     | Auspex Systems | "Auspex does not share my opinions.  |
| johnf@auspex.com | Santa Clara CA |  So Why am I still working here?"    |
+==========================================================================+
From: johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcou
Date: 16 Oct 92 21:49:53 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Inc.

In article <Oct15.162131.72089@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna) writes:
>In article <15004@auspex-gw.auspex.com> johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:
|>
|>OK, OK, I give up.  So it wasn't Sandanista's.  I don't recall exactly what
|>this group of people were other than they were some organized guerilla group
|>with lots of guns and didn't particularly care for a group of people in
|>kayaks floating through their "territory".
|
|The Shining Path.
|
Thanks.  Those were the dudes.

|>It's been a few years since
|>I've read "Running the Amazon".  Yes, it was by Kane, who incidently prior
|>to this trip, was a San Franciscan journalist and had no kayaking experience.
|
|He also said in a lecture I attended, that he didn't care to ever see a kayak
|or whitewater again.

After reading the book I can understand why.




-- 
+==========================================================================+
| John Fereira        | Auspex Systems | "Ask me about my vow of silence." |
| johnf@auspex.com    | Santa Clara CA |                                   |
+==========================================================================+
From: "eliot gelwan" <eliot.gelwan@channel1.com>
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: ll bean 1-800 #
Date: 13 Oct 92 23:42:39 EST
Reply-To: "eliot gelwan" <eliot.gelwan@channel1.com>
Distribution: rec
Organization: Channel 1 Communications

On 10-13-92 KELVIN CHEU wrote:

KCDoes anybody has the 1-800-number of LL Bean.  I heard that it is
KCquite a good mail order store. Experience with LL Bean is welcome.
KCThanks.

1-800-221-4221

                   |
...eliot          -*-              Postlink: ->CHANNEL1 [R/O okay]
                   |               Internet: eliot.gelwan@channel1.com

---
EZ 1.39 #178 [in Brookline MA 10:52 pm, Tuesday 10/13/92]
--
Channel 1 (R)   Cambridge, MA
From: morrison@cup.hp.com (Bobbie_Morrison)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: making your own
Date: 7 Oct 92 19:01:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: cup.BvrM6A.Fn6
Distribution: usa
Organization: Hewlett-Packard
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]

millere@frith.msu.edu wrote:
: 
: Does anyone know of any plans which are available which
: tells you how to make your own gear? (e.g. tents, panniers, shells)
: and how to obtain the specialized clotH?

There are a handful of places that sell both the patterns and the various
fabrics.  Here is my list.  I use The Rainshed most often although I've
sometimes found lower prices, or materials that The Rainshed didn't carry
at Outdoor Wilderness Fabrics.  You can call The Rainshed for their catalog.

--Bobbie


The Rain Shed
707 NW 11th
Corvallis, OR  97330
(503) 753-8900
- Also carries reflective fabric and patterns for windsocks.

The Green Pepper
3918 West First Avenue                
Eugene, OR  97402
(800) 767-5684
- Also carries neoprene fabric.

Frostline Kits
2512 W. Independent Avenue            
Grand Junction, CO  81505-7200
(800) KITS-USA
- Also carries down, and down kits.

Outdoor Wilderness Fabrics
2511 Latah Drive
Nampa, ID 83651
(208)466-1602
- Will do wholesale prices if large purchase.

Mountain Mend
1580 Canyon
Boulder, CO 
(303) 443-1925
- No additional information [alg].

Seattle Fabrics
3878 Bridge Way N
Seattle 98103
(206) 632-6022
- canvas, gor-tex, polarplus, etc.

Daisy Kingdom
134 NW 8th
Portland, OR
(503) 222-9033   
800-234-6688 or 503-222-3817; FAX 503-222-9120.
$2.00 for nursery/craft catalogue.
Mastercard, Visa, UPS an Fed Ex.
- They sell outdoor fabrics and also patterns. They
do sell by mail order.

Narain's Outdoor Equipment
Berkeley, CA
(415) 527-2509
- They are in Berkeley next door to REI.  They carry Gore-tex,
but they are not mail order [alg].

Malden Mills
Lawrence, Mass
(508) 685-6341	
- Near Mass/NH border.  Factory outlet store with large
discounts on PolorPlus (Synchilla) and PolarLite.  Open Tues,
Thurs, Fri only 10-6.  No Mail Order!  

--
From: sawicki@src.dec.com (Filip Sawicki)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: "Points": the good way to measure time/distance on the trail
Date: 9 Oct 92 21:17:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: src.1992Oct9.211743.7917
Organization: DEC Systems Research Center

In article <81383@ut-emx.uucp>, psilsbee@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Peter Silsbee) writes:
|> 
|> Which takes more work/time, 10 miles along flat
|> ground, or 5 miles with 5000 feet of elevation gain?  The distance system
|> says the ten miles is twice as much as the five miles. I'm not sure 
|> what the points system says, since I'm lazy, but it at least attempts
|> to take into account the work required to lift 180 pounds of human (or
|> whatever) up those 5000 feet. Not one-to-one at all.
|> 

Let's see... 10mi ~= 17km (or so), 5000ft ~= 1666m, and thus we get:

 10mi +    0ft = 17pt
  5mi + 5000ft = 25pt

fi.
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: miles@ms.uky.edu (Stephen D. Grant)
Subject: Re: Bears attacking people?
    <1992Oct14.204815.1767@raven.alaska.edu>      
    <1992Oct15.162722.3740@afterlife.ncsc.mil> 
    <1992Oct16.12428.13921@ms.uky.edu>
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 22:28:30 GMT
Organization: University of Kentucky, USA. -5 GMT

I apologize. I meant to send that letter e-mail and NOT post it.

Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: jahn@guinness.Idbsu.EDU (Greg Jahn)
Subject: Re: Coyotes (was Re: Wolves)
Reply-To: jahn@guinness.idbsu.edu
Organization: BSU - Data Center
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 14:42:57 GMT

In article <7032@transfer.stratus.com>, omar@az.stratus.com 
(Omar Stoltzfus) writes:
|>In article <1992Oct6.170216.12384@unocal.com> stgprao@st.unocal.COM
|>(Richard  
|>Ottolini) writes:
|>> In article <1992Oct6.013334.10817@eos.arc.nasa.gov>
|>jbm@eos.arc.nasa.gov  
|>(Jeffrey Mulligan) writes:
|>> >This mention of wolves reminded me I wanted to ask something
|>> >about coyote behavior.  I just returned from a trip to New Mexico
|>> >during which I spent 3 days in the Pecos Wilderness area (thanks
|>> >to all the NM net readers who sent me advice!).  Anyway, the first
|>> 
|>> New Mexico?  California is full of coyotes.  I encounter them
|>jogging in the
|>> Stanford and L.A. foothills on a monthly basis.
|>
|>Huh?  Jogging coyotes?  Only in California :)

Holy shit.  Were they wearing lycra?  Oh no, ... I bet they take
their human pets with them when they go camping too ... a living
hell, coyotes in lycra sitting around the campfire singing Kumbaya,
with their pet humans running around unchained playing Lynard Skynard.

--
Greg Jahn Boise State Univ.|'I decided to just lie low and let events
/ jahn@guinness.idbsu.edu /|take their course. Maybe that's the way
/ dosjahn@idbsu.bitnet    /|the sheep think as they are led off to the
/ (208)385-3891.thephone  /|the slaughterhouse.' On marriage, Camilo Cela
From: trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcou
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:21:31 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Computer Science Department

In article <15004@auspex-gw.auspex.com> johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:
>
>OK, OK, I give up.  So it wasn't Sandanista's.  I don't recall exactly what
>this group of people were other than they were some organized guerilla group
>with lots of guns and didn't particularly care for a group of people in
>kayaks floating through their "territory".

The Shining Path.

>It's been a few years since
>I've read "Running the Amazon".  Yes, it was by Kane, who incidently prior
>to this trip, was a San Franciscan journalist and had no kayaking experience.

He also said in a lecture I attended, that he didn't care to ever see a kayak
or whitewater again.
-- 

-Wayne Trzyna
 trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: gamiddle@math.uwaterloo.ca (Guy Middleton)
Subject: synthetic fill for sleeping bags?
Organization: MFCF
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 14:55:50 GMT

I want to buy a sleeping bag, but there are so many different kinds of fill
that I am completely at a loss.  I think I understand the down/synthetic
problem, but what about all the different synthetics?  I know about hollofil,
polarguard, primaloft, and lite loft.  Are the different synthetics suited to
different conditions?

 -Guy Middleton, University of Waterloo		gamiddleton@math.waterloo.edu
		(+1 519 885 1211 x3472)		gamiddleton@math.uwaterloo.ca
From: giddings@denali.physics.ucsb.edu (Steve Giddings)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the
Date: 16 Oct 92 01:35:58 GMT
	<SHAFER.92Oct15094500@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov>
Organization: University of California Santa Barbara
In-reply-to: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov's message of 15 Oct 92 16:45:06 GMT

shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) states in response to 
ecologycntr@igc.apc.org (Ecology Center):

>C> No doubt john meant "Senderista", an epithet for the cult-like 
>C> Communist Party of Peru.
>
>Hey, I'm bad at geography, but even I know that the Amazon is in
>Brazil.  It's not in Peru or Nicaragua, it's in Brazil.  The Sendero
>Luminoso (the members are not called Senderistas) is not in Brazil,
>particularly not in the Amazon basin.
>
>A good clue is the Spanish name; they speak Portuguese in Brazil.
>
>Look, he just goofed.  Anyone can do it.  Real men and women admit
>it and get on with their lives.  Let it go.

In fact the source of the Amazon (as defined by the longest tributary) is
the Apurimac River which starts high in the Andes mountains in Peru.  The
book describes a journey from near this source to the mouth of the Amazon
in Brazil.  If memory serves the story was supposed to refer to an
encounter with members of the Shining Path, the terrorist organization (or
popular movement depending on your opinion) that has been giving the
government of Peru trouble.  In fact, I hear second hand from another
member of the expediton that the only "guerrilla" they encountered was a
scared kid with a rusty .22.  Call it journalistic liscence if you wish.

giddings@denali.physics.ucsb.edu

These opinions are my own and noone elses. 
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: allen%asylum.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Allen Sanderson)
Subject: Re: Wolves and Bears
Date: 13 Oct 92 09:17:46 MDT
Organization: University of Utah CS Dept

>There was a wolf, or wolf-like animal shot last week, south of Yellowstone
>Park.  The news articles that I've read say that it appeared to be the lead
>animal in a pack of 4-5, and weighed in at 93 pounds.  The rangers are not
>willing to commit to it being a wolf until after DNA testing is completed,
>mainly because it muddies the issue of wolf reintroduction into the
>park.

This is very true as I hope that the wolves are already there.
Although some "officals" say that an introduced group would probably
be better.

>My understanding is that if the wolves are already there, they are protected 
>under the endangered species act.  If they are not, and are "artificially"
>introduced, they are considered experimental, and can be shot by ranchers if
>they venture beyond the park boundaries.

I read the same in an AP story in the Salt Lake paper so wait and see.
I had not relized that the DNA of some wolves is very questionable.
That is many wolves are not pure wolf.  This is were many groups are
calling for a change in the ESA so that only pure species are
protected and not mixed species and sub-species.

On a side note.  Last week I posted a comment about a man who was
killed by a sow grizly bear rightly fully protecting her cubs in
Glacier National Park.  The park is planning on killing the bears (the
sow and two cubs) because they had eaten part of the victim.  The
officals "believe" that now that the bears have tasten human meat
that they will be more agressive towards humans in the future.  I
personally find this thinking absurd as this was an isolated
incident.  Personally I am getting tired of every time a human
interfers with wildlife and gets hurt or killed that the animal is
concidered dangereous and is killed.  (Gee just think if we inacted
such an attitude towards other humans, next time some repeat offender
mugs grandma we go out and shoot them).   I would be much in favor of
them tagging the bears an monitoring their movements instead.  If
people agree or disagree I would suggest you call the park and voice
your views.  The parks number is 1-406-888-5441.

Cheers,

Allen R. Sanderson

Salt Lake City, Oootah


"Ethics are bit a like an erection, no matter how well intended they are prone
 to sudden deflation"
 
        Dougal Haston - refering to climbing ethics.
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: bytw@calvin.edu (Randy Bytwerk)
Subject: Austrian Berghuette
Followup-To: rec.backcountry
Organization: CAS Department
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:54:52 GMT

  I'm planning a trip to Austria next summer, and want to spend at least
one night in one of the mountain huts. I've stayed in several before, but
this time  I'll be travelling with people who haven't done a lot of
mountain walking. I'm looking for a hut that is in suitably spectacular
surroundings, but that isn't outrageously difficult to reach.
		I'd welcome suggestions from those who have experience hiking there.

Randy Bytwerk (bytw@calvin.edu)
Calvin College
From: sommer@scd.hp.com (Jeremy Sommer)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the
Date: 15 Oct 1992 17:32:41 GMT
Organization: Hewlett Packard Santa Clara Division
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpscau.scd.hp.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]

Mary Shafer (shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov) wrote:
: On 14 Oct 92 16:05:00 GMT, ecologycntr@igc.apc.org (Ecology Center) said:
: 
: C> No doubt john meant "Senderista", an epithet for the cult-like 
: C> Communist Party of Peru.
: 
: Hey, I'm bad at geography, but even I know that the Amazon is in
: Brazil.  It's not in Peru or Nicaragua, it's in Brazil.  The Sendero
: Luminoso (the members are not called Senderistas) is not in Brazil,
: particularly not in the Amazon basin.

Try looking at a map.  I'm sure the townspeople of Iquitos will be glad to know
they are not on the Amazon  :-)

: 
: A good clue is the Spanish name; they speak Portuguese in Brazil.
: 
: Look, he just goofed.  Anyone can do it.  Real men and women admit
: it and get on with their lives.  Let it go.

You've got to be kidding!

: 
: --
: Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
:  "There's no kill like a guns kill." LCDR "Hoser" Satrapa, gunnery instructor
:                        "A kill is a kill."  Anonymous


-Jeremy Sommer
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: JB <jbl@mesaadm.cre.nt.com>
Subject: Raccoon question
Organization: NT/BNR
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1b3
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 12:10:16 GMT

I am a licensed wild animal rehabilitator who specializes in raccoons. 
Yesterday, I received notice from my state wildlife commission that due
to reports of rabies in this state, rehabilitation of raccoons is
prohibited.  I am in NC, and have had the pre-exposure series of
vaccinations for rabies.  My pets are vaccinated.

Questions:
Are there other rehab-ers out there and/or a net that might lead me to
them?
Do any of you guys have info on the recent spread of rabies in your area
or any laws relating?
Has anyone noticed a marked decline in the medium mammal population in
your area, possibly due to rabies or distemper  (foxes, raccoons,
marmots, etc.)?
Is it possible for an infected mother to pass the disease to nursing
babies?
Thanks.
JB