HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jgrimm@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com (Jeffrey Grimmett 9999)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos,comp.sys.amiga.applications,comp.sys.amiga.introduction,comp.sys.amiga.marketplace,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Programming
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:49:11 GMT
Organization: NCR (Torrey Pines Development Center)
Disclaimer: This posting does not necessarily reflect the opinions of NCR.

Quoth rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu (Robert Fentiman):

]> >That's a good thing about many languages. That's not a problem; it's
]> >that every AMOS program I've ever run into behaves in a completely
]> >unacceptable way. Nuts - I've had more bug reports for AMOS than I
]> >have for ShadowMaster. Because of that, I'm not going to buy a copy,
]> >and I'm certainly not going to pirate one.

]> I've SEEN more bugs on any C or Assembly program then I have ever seen
]> on an AMOS one.  Why?  Amos is SUPER simple to code when comparing it to

That is a SILLY statement.  Or to put it another way, I've seen more useful
C programs that DO NOT crash than I have seen useful Amos utils PERIOD.  The
last Amos util I received, a FidoNet file request (FREQ) tool, ALMOST worked
once on my system (an 020), but since then only causes multicolored lines
to flash across the screen and the power LED to blink (in short, it nukes
my system!)  THIS is stable?  Well, maybe for Amos or Red Sector Demos, but
NOT for something as simple as a program as that (I have something similar
in AREXX that took me an hour to make.  Big deal.)

BTW, it works fine on my roomie's 68K system.  I'm amazed the mere presence
of the GVP controller didn't cause a meltdown.

So what's  the deal?  Can you, or anyone, show me a USEFUL Amos-written
utility that will work no matter what platform I put it on?  Otherwise, you
might as well write your stuff in Sanskrit.  It'll do me just about as much
good.

-- 
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@*************************************************
Jeff Grimmett [SuperBitMap BBS]          * fido!1:202/1401.0 [619-460-7290]
jeff_grimmett@f1401.n202.z1.fidonet.org  * jgrimm@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com
 The opinions expressed in this message are thoughtful, reasoned, and logical.
      	It goes without saying that they are not those of my employer.
*******************************************************************************
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: ewhac@ntg.com (Leo 'Bols Ewhac' Schwab)
Subject: Re: Music and Code from Demos
Organization: Politically Incorrect Software, Ltd.
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 21:53:57 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.004942.20842@colorado.edu> judd@wilkinson.cs.colorado.edu (Stephen Judd) writes:
>You are talking to Leo Schwab!  He is THE original Amiga hacker!  He wrote
>a whole bunch of hacks you might have seen (like !esuom).
						  ^^^^^^
	Um, I don't think I wrote that one.  The only mouse hack I can
recall doing was Robotroff.  Still works, too, though it could use some
cleaning up...

>He wrote one of the
>earliest Amiga demos I saw, a very funny thing called Marketroid.  I still
>have it, and it still makes me laugh.

	For real laughs, take a look at the C source code.  It's a *mess*.
There are one or two clever tricks in there, like the Robotron-style
explosions and implosions.  I was rather proud of them at the time.  There
are also a couple of egregious mistakes in it too, like calling LoadRGB4()
from inside a VBLANK interrupt.  Ack!

>Finally, he is the one who wrote
>the Disney Animation Studio.

	Oh yes, that thing.  I did that while working for Silent Software,
Inc.  Looking back, there are many things I would do differently today.

	I also can't take all the credit for it.  I have to gratefully
acknowledge the help of William Arthur Ware (author of the game
"Firepower"), who wrote the exposure sheet command parser, and also wrote
the routines that render the conics (circle, ellipse).  I would have been
nowhere if I needed to write those.

	Will and I also collaborated on the CDTV ROM project.  You know the
boot screen?  The preferences screen?  The CD-audio control screen?  The
screen blanker?  Those are ours (artwork by Jim Sachs).  Ask me nice and
I'll tell you how to bring up the secret messages...  :-)

>He is one of my heros, along with Jim Butterfield.
>
	Aw, shucks.  :-)

>judd@colorado.edu   //  FORTRAN is God's Language.
			 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
	Are you feeling all right?				:-) :-) :-)

_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
Leo L. Schwab -- The Guy in The Cape                    ewhac@ntg.com
 \_ -_          Recumbent Bikes:                ..or..  ewhac@well.sf.ca.us
O----^o       The Only Way To Fly.                     (pronounced "EH-wack")
	"In desperation, the government sent for Bullwinkle J. Moose."
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi (Osma Ahvenlampi)
Subject: Re: '040 specs + DEMOS on A4000
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 18:07:04 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.104255.4078@daimi.aau.dk> u920659@daimi.aau.dk (Carsten S|rensen) writes:
>geirh@solan.unit.no (Geir Haugen) writes:
>>Note: The 68040 only implements a fundamental subset of all 68882
>>      instructions in hardware. All other 68882 instructions (i.e.
>>      sin, cos, exp) are emulated in software.
>Eh, how fast are they then?

Usually faster than the 68882 counterparts... Makes you feel REAL good, doesn't
it?

>>Buy a A1200 (or better: a A4000) and start coding for AGA!!
>How are we supposed to do that? No focken HW guide!!! Anybody found out
>some of the new regs yet? Geir?

You mean you can't dis-assemble the graphics.library yourself?
--
Osma Ahvenlampi  -  oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi   * Workstation power for micro-
All my opinions are not necessarily really mine * computer price: Amiga := FUN
From: jxp@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Joe Potter)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Phenomena egos??
Date: 16 Nov 92 12:14:34 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh

> mknip@niksula.hut.fi (Mats Anders Knip) writes:
> >(For those who didn't know it, using 8 sprites disables a word from
> >each side of the screen. Time used by the copper to update the
> >pointers, I guess. This is the area that can be eliminated)

	That'll be the word to fetch the sprite data.  That's a DMA access
normally, but you can do it at any point before the sprite is displayed with the
copper, allowing you sprites on an overscan screen.  More next post...

						Joe.
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: ajft@ajft_sun.cs.adfa.oz.au (Adrian Tritschler)
Subject: Eric Schwartz demos under WB2.04?
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:43:14 GMT

OK, one dumb question: I was trying to play some of the Eric Schwartz Aerotoons
last night for a friend of mine and all I get is the left half of the screen,
the right half is blank and the same colour as the background of the left half.
Worst thing is, I could have sworn I've played these demos under WB2.04 and
they worked. Any hints?
	WB2.04, 1M chip, PAL, 1M fast, MoviePlayer V1.0
	(oh, its a Phoenix boarded A1000)

	More lists of what demos run under WB2.04 (& 3.0?) please!

-- 
// Adrian Tritschler                     // ajft@ajft_sun.cs.adfa.oz.au      // 
||\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\|| (06) 268 8166/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\||
|| Real Daleks don't climb stairs,       || Comp Sci Dept, ADFA              ||
\\ they just level the building.         \\ Canberra, ACT, Australia         \\
From: franklin@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (John Franklin)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Music and Code from Demos
Date: 22 Nov 92 14:55:04 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech Computer Science Dept, Blacksburg, VA

In article <d2hacker.722155564@dtek.chalmers.se> d2hacker@dtek.chalmers.se (Magnus Hacker) writes:
>franklin@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (John Franklin) writes:
>
>>Um... no.  The Timex Sinclair 1000 was a door wedge sized and shaped
>>computer with a membrane keyboard and came with 2K of memory.  You could
>>pump it up to a whopping 16K with an add on pack and you could store
>>your programs with any audio cassette recorder that had an input jack.
>
>>The 128K machine that you're thinking of is a Cray in comparison.
>
>Could this be the (in)famous ZX80? (or was it ZX81?)
>I remember I was about to buy one of those, but my eyes fell
>on a VIC20 instead..

Err... I think they were different machines.  I seem to recall from about
10 years ago checking out a book from the public library called "Programs
for the ZX80" or something like that.  It also said, "WORKS ON A TIMEX
SINCLAIR 1000!"  They were compatible, but different machines.

>
>Just think about it... 3.5 kilobytes of RAM!
>
>Sigh... those were the days...

There were hacks that you COULD do with it... A friend of mine did a 
hardware hack on with with his VCR to bypass the copy protection on
video tapes... I guess that would be the first (and probably the only!) demo
ever done with it!

jf
-- 
John Franklin
franklin@csugrad.cs.vt.edu
franklin@elfie.async.vt.edu
From: franklin@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (John Franklin)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Eric Schwartz demos under WB2.04?
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:36:55 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech Computer Science Dept, Blacksburg, VA

In article <1efvudINNj1u@sbusol.rz.uni-sb.de> masc@sbustd.rz.uni-sb.de (Martin Schulze) writes:
>
>1st: Dont use an OverScan-WorkBench
>2nd: Dont use Productivity or something like that.
>     PAL/NTSC works fine other Scrennmodes will force an "out of memory"
>
>The only problem I had on my A3000 was the too fast running animation
>called "pogo" :-(

Hmm... I've never had any problem with  "Pogo".  I do have problems if:

1. CpuBlit is running. 
2. I've used SetCPU to set BURST mode.


All I have to do, though, is turn it off and everything runs fine.

jf
-- 
John Franklin
franklin@csugrad.cs.vt.edu
franklin@elfie.async.vt.edu
Xref: sparky alt.sys.amiga.demos:1703 comp.sys.amiga.applications:8760 comp.sys.amiga.introduction:1559 comp.sys.amiga.marketplace:8996 comp.sys.amiga.misc:17039 comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:29369
From: djohnson@cs.ucsd.edu (Darin Johnson)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos,comp.sys.amiga.applications,comp.sys.amiga.introduction,comp.sys.amiga.marketplace,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Programming
Date: 17 Nov 92 20:50:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: sdcc12.41142
Followup-To: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Organization: =CSE Dept., U.C. San Diego

>Why are you so ignorant ? Off course it's better to have many commands. You 
>don't have to use them if you think you could write better routines 
>yourself, but it's very, very nice to have them.

Library routines are not the same as commands.  Large libraries
are nice.  A large set of commands muddles the picutre.

Actually, this whole thing is rather a silly argument of
"The system is buggy", "no, the language is good",
"no, the system is buggy", "no, the language is good"...
Ah well, it's the spice of life.
-- 
Darin Johnson
djohnson@ucsd.edu
    Where am I?  In the village...  What do you want?  Information...
Xref: sparky alt.sys.amiga.demos:1659 comp.sys.amiga.applications:8688 comp.sys.amiga.introduction:1540 comp.sys.amiga.marketplace:8924 comp.sys.amiga.misc:16891 comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:29184
From: rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu (Robert Fentiman)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos,comp.sys.amiga.applications,comp.sys.amiga.introduction,comp.sys.amiga.marketplace,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Programming
Date: 15 Nov 1992 20:05:38 -0600
Organization: University of Minnesota, Duluth
NNTP-Posting-Host: ub.d.umn.edu

In article <Bxs6zF.KEE@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> browder@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Chip Browder) writes:

> Not a flame, but what the heck does AMOS have to do with demos? The only demo
> I have ever seen written in AMOS was the lamest thing I have ever seen. In
> any case IMO it's not worth dedicating 15 articles * 5 newsgroups to. I 
> especially don't see reason for a flood of them here.


That was a mistake on all our (meaning the people on this thread) parts.
When we respoded, none of us bothered to check the 'Newsgroup:' header
to see where it was going.  Each time we responded, it got sent to all
these newsgroups.  This problem has been rectified.  I, for one,
appologize for this situation.

	Thanks
	Robert Fentiman

UseNet: rfentima@ub.d.umn.edu
At: University of Minnesota, Duluth


Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: jbarwick@lifestyle.rhein-main.de (Joey Barwick)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: The Lords (C64)   Was: Questions...
Date: 15 Nov 92 13:42:55 MED
Organization: Life-Style

Are there some old guys from the 64 out there ? like the lords .. hmm maybe
some old euro-groups ?


//Stainless Steel
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: nilsco@ifi.uio.no (Nils Liaaen Corneliusen)
Subject: Re: '040 specs + DEMOS on A4000
Organization: Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 12:15:02 GMT
Originator: nilsco@holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no


In article <brianc.722114997@pv660a.vincent.iastate.edu>, brianc@iastate.edu (Brian J Cerveny) writes:
> In <1992Nov18.104255.4078@daimi.aau.dk> u920659@daimi.aau.dk (Carsten S|rensen) writes:
> >geirh@solan.unit.no (Geir Haugen) writes:
> >>      instructions in hardware. All other 68882 instructions (i.e.
> >>      sin, cos, exp) are emulated in software.
> >Eh, how fast are they then?
> Still faster than the 68882 built-ins.

But are you taking the exception overhead into account when saying that? Of
course, sw written especially for the '040 is faster. But programs for the
030/882 running on a 040 could actually be running slower since it has to
emulate this through exceptions.

------------------------------------------------------------
INCLUDE "disclaimer.i"                       Zrouoggathog
Nils Corneliusen                             Cthulhu in '96!
internet: nilsco@ifi.uio.no                  Hasoithshuna
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi (Osma Ahvenlampi)
Subject: Re: Writing a StarField. Which method is best?
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
	<1992Nov17.211753.11335@ntg.com>
	<LUNDMAN.92Nov19150314@kauri.kauri.vuw.ac.nz>
	<OAHVENLA.92Nov19113731@lk-hp-3.hut.fi>
	<MKNIP.92Nov20135703@valerian.hut.fi>
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:18:52 GMT

I said:
>> Well, there's a easy way of getting sure 50 (or 60) fps without turning off
>> the interrupts. Use them yourself. Make them high priority ones, and nothing
>> can stop you from having all the time you want, while the system is running
>> (well, would be if there's time) in background. If you don't mess with the
>> copperlists yourself, but use Views for that, you can even switch back and
>> forth applications... Now all this is unnecessary on a A500, as all the time
>> is probably used anyway, but what if you have a 25MHz 68030? A lot of time
>> is left unused, and could be used your something else, provided you don't
>> do the blitter waiting in busy loops... There are ways around that too.

In article <MKNIP.92Nov20135703@valerian.hut.fi> mknip@niksula.hut.fi (Mats Anders Knip) writes:
>You do have a point there, but you are forgetting one thing: we are
>talking demos here, not utilities - and demos aren't usually run
>in the background. A demo is lika a movie - when you watch a demo
>you watch the demo and do nothing else. You don't need multitasking in
>a demo. Switching off all interrupts is perfectly fine in a big demo
>(especially as a bigger demo usually loads via trackdisk from boot...)
>as long as you reset the old pointers in the end (naturally...).

The display switching just comes as a byproduct, the big thing is that,
provided enough power, you can watch demos and download new ones at the same
time. Even if YOU don't do anything else while watching a demo, you might wish
that your computer does.
--
Osma Ahvenlampi  -  oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi   * Workstation power for micro-
All my opinions are not necessarily really mine * computer price: Amiga := FUN
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
From: tommyl@stud.cs.uit.no (Tommy Larsen)
Subject: Re: '040 specs + DEMOS on A4000
Organization: University of Tromsoe, Norway
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 14:00:11 GMT
Reply-To: tommyl@stud.cs.uit.no

In article <1992Nov17.184951.21672@ugle.unit.no>, geirh@solan.unit.no (Geir Haugen) writes:

|>       //COMMODORE                   Geir Haugen, Trondheim, Norway
|>   \\ // AMIGA 4000/040              Norwegian Institue of Technology (NTH)
|>    \X/  SERIAL #187                 Internet: geirh@solan.unit.no


Really? Mine has serial #179 :)

Happy Hacking!

-- 
tommyl@stud.cs.uit.no
Xref: sparky alt.sys.amiga.demos:1661 alt.amiga.demos:2
From: idr@rigel.cs.pdx.edu (Ian D Romanick)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos,alt.amiga.demos
Subject: American Chart
Date: 16 Nov 92 07:34:38 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

Here is the Official Obelisk vote sheet and rules, enjoy!

You MAY NOT vote for yourself, anyone else in your group, or any of your
group's productions.  Feel free to send news and photographs (prefered) or
digitized pictures along with your votes.  You may also send in the phone
number and brief description of the best NON-ELITE bbs' in your area.  News
of illegal activities WILL NOT BE PRINTED.  If you send a disk or $2.00 (US
funds only, please) we will mail you a copy of the chart as soon as it is
released.  Mail all votes to:

		idr@rigel.cs.pdx.edu

or

		Epsilon
		POB 1914
		Beaverton, OR  97075-1914
		U.S.A.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Your Name (or alias):

Your Group:

Your Position (coder, artist, etc):

Best Coder:    1)
               2)

Best Artist:   1)
               2)

Best Musician: 1)
               2)

Best Demo:     1)
               2)

Best Group:    1)
               2)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------


                                  - Ian Romanick
                                    Dancing Fool of Epsilon

[]--------------------------------------------------------------------[]
 |                                                                    |
 | My opinions are exactly the same as PSU's.  NOT!                   |
 | Mail at:  idr@cs.pdx.edu             Epsilon, for the best in NTSC |
 |                                      demos! :^)                    |
 |                                                                    |
[]--------------------------------------------------------------------[]
From: ewhac@ntg.com (Leo 'Bols Ewhac' Schwab)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Writing a StarField. Which method is best?
Date: 23 Nov 92 23:50:00 GMT
Organization: Politically Incorrect Software, Ltd.

In article <1992Nov18.115111.8537@ifi.uio.no> larshaug@ifi.uio.no (Lars Haugseth) writes:
>In article <1992Nov17.211753.11335@ntg.com>, ewhac@ntg.com (Leo 'Bols Ewhac' Schwab) writes:
>>>START	move.l	4.w,a6
>>>	move.l	156(a6),a1
>> 		^^^
>> 	Okay.  Why isn't this a symbolic offset?  That is, why didn't you
>> say:
>>
>> 	move.l	IntVects+6*IV_SIZE+IV_DATA(a6),a1
>
>Because demo-coders usually use a floppy-based system when writing
>programs, so it's a pain in the ass to use includes. Especially in
>routines like this where the includes are used in perhaps 10 lines
>of the source. I *don't* do like this when doing more "serious" stuff.
>
	Just a small historical note:  "Disney Presents: The Animation
Studio" was, for the first two years of its life, written on an A1000 with
512K chip, 2M fast, two floppies, a flakey 68020 card (no 32-bit RAM), and
VD0: (ASDG's recoverable RAM disk).  It was compiled with Manx 3.4b and all
the sources, includes and C: commands were held in RAM.  The thing finally
grew too big to fit in VD0:, and I graduated to a hard disk (my, that was
nice).

	I don't know what the typical demo coder's environment is, but I
can't imagine it being any worse than Lattice v1.0 on a 512K system (yes, I
lived with this; it was worse than you can possibly imagine).

>But would I manage that many stars if I should use the system-routines
>for everything? The whole point of my routine is to make it as
>fast as possible.
>
	For setting up the displays, you would need to call the dead-slow
system routines only once to build the display.  You would then call
LoadView() to bring displays to the front; LoadView() is an *extremely*
inexpensive routine.  If you prefer not to use LoadView(), you can just jam
COP1LC with the copperlist the system built.

	And by the way, with the advent of AGA and v3.0, you *no longer
know* how to build correct copperlists, since they now can be *monitor-
specific*.  The task of computing and assembling copper lists has been
largely removed from graphics.library and placed loadable code modules in
the v3.0 Monitors drawer.  (At least, this is how it was explained to me.)

	So it behooves you to use the system routines where possible.  I
mean, wouldn't it be cool to have your demo automatically show up on an
A4000 on a crisp multiscan monitor in scandoubled 60 Hz?

_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
Leo L. Schwab -- The Guy in The Cape                    ewhac@ntg.com
 \_ -_          Recumbent Bikes:                ..or..  ewhac@well.sf.ca.us
O----^o       The Only Way To Fly.                     (pronounced "EH-wack")
         "Because you never know who might want to sit in your lap."
From: d2hacker@dtek.chalmers.se (Magnus Hacker)
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos
Subject: Re: Music and Code from Demos
Date: 23 Nov 92 06:05:32 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology, Gothenburg Sweden

nilsco@ifi.uio.no (Nils Liaaen Corneliusen) writes:

>The ZX81 had just 1k ram as standard. But you could a 'wobblepack' with a
>whopping 16k extra. (wobblepack - it usually sent small wobbly lines down the
>screen and if you moved it *slightly*, kaboom!) It also had an amazing two
>color palette and max resolution of 64x44. Those were the days...

Yes, I remember something like that. The 3.5K I was referring to belonged
to my old VIC20. Actually, I took it out yesterday, from the depths of my
closet. On power-on it started a strange noise which went on for about
twenty seconds. Then -WHOUSH- black smoke came from it.

Need I say that it is back in the closet?

--
Magnus Hacker, d2hacker@dtek.chalmers.se

Is this my signature?
Newsgroups: alt.sys.amiga.demos