HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: AS.DLH@forsythe.stanford.edu (David Hatt - 5-0083)
Subject: TWA membership club
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 20:34:03 GMT

I remember there was net.talk about TWA's membership where you pay
$75 or $49 each year from whatever and I forgotten what people have
said.

Anyway, are there any people out there who know what I'm talking
about?  If so, what are the advantages, disadvantages, costs, etc.?

Thanks.

Dave


-----------------------------------------------------------------
David L. Hatt          Internet:  dave.hatt@forsythe.stanford.edu
Grant & Contract Accounting       BITNET:  as.dlh@stanford.bitnet
857 Serra St., First Floor                    Work: (415)725-0083
Stanford University                           Fax:  (415)725-8014
Stanford, CA 94305-6048
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: "Window" seats (was Re: Aircraft Age)
From: Aron Eisenpress <AFECU@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Monday, 5 Oct 1992 12:47:00 EDT
 <1992Oct4.092139.29854@ohare.Chicago.COM><138044@lll-winken.LLNL.GOV>
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

In article <138044@lll-winken.LLNL.GOV>, ed@wente.llnl.gov (Ed Suranyi) says:
>
>   {...}   The thing
>that annoyed me the most when I flew in a UA DC-8 a couple of years
>ago was that half the "window" seats did not have a window -- they
>had a blank wall.    {...}
>But as someone who had to take a cross-country flight sitting next to
>a wall, rather than the window I had expected, I was VERY disappointed.

United's 767's which are still in the 2-class configuration do *not* have a
window in row 8.  (The 3-class ones, where row 8 is in business class, do).
-------

 -- Aron Eisenpress, City U of NY
    (AFECU@CUNYVM.BITNET, or AFECU@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU on the Internet)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air,news.groups
From: cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub)
Subject: Re: REC.TRAVEL.MARKETPLACE
Organization: University of Colorado at Colorado Springs
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 23:21:49 GMT

Thank you henry, and all the follower uppers for so eloquently showing
there is a need for a proper place for the "i have tickets to sell"
fostings.  Now if you could just remember to vote when the CFV comes
out.
-- 

charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU       -or-         (719) 593-3492     
on leave at the University of Iowa  cdash@cs.uiowa.edu (319) 335-0739
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: hrose@eff.org (Helen Trillian Rose)
Subject: Re: Aircraft Age
Organization: The Evil Fascist IRC Admins From Hell, Inc.
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 20:29:30 GMT

Kraig> == Kraig R. Meyer <kmeyer@aero.org> 

 Kraig> I don't recall seeing this information in any of the FAQ lists,
 Kraig> and thought readers might find it interesting.  The following
 Kraig> little factoid was published in the LA Times travel section
 Kraig> yesterday:

 Kraig> Average Age of the Fleets of Major U.S. Airlines (as of First
 Kraig> Quarter 1992)

 Kraig> TWA			18.0 years
 Kraig> Northwest		16.2 years
 Kraig> Continental		14.4 years
 Kraig> United			11.5 years
 Kraig> USAir			10.2 years
 Kraig> American		 9.2 years
 Kraig> Southwest		 6.9 years
 Kraig> America West		 6.6 years

TWA does not surprise me in the least. Their aircraft are always old and
poorly maintained (I *know* that a dirty aircraft doesn't indicate
mechanical condition, but when I line up a NW 747-400 that's new and
shiny with a TWA 747-100 that's grungy and disgusting looking, I know
which one *I'd* rather fly). 

Northwest surprises me quite a bit. They're overhauling their fleet
(unfortunately with A320s) but have quite a few 757s, a substantial
747-400 order (some of which have been delivered, some that they're
still waiting on). Admitted, they have one of the largest DC-9 fleets
(remnants of Republic) in the country, but does it make *that* big of a
difference?

Continental has tons of old 737s (-200's). This doesn't surprise me.

United is about "average" -- adding new 737s and 747s (plus 767s) while
phasing out their older stuff (no more United DC-8s :)

USAir is adding alot of modern 737s and using them for shuttle service
up and down the Northeast. 

I'm kind of surprised American's fleet is this young. Admitted, they've
been adding 757s and 767s like it's going out of style, but their main
trunk aircraft are still DC-10's. 

Southwest is no surprise. They've launched two 737 models in the past
ten years. That's the only aircraft they fly. I think they've ditched
all of their 737-200's (I'd have to check my JP to be sure).

America West matters little as their financial condition is shaky
enough. They have a large A320 fleet. Airbus will finance most of the
purchase price of a new airplane. I *hate* government aircraft
subsidies (read: airbus, who is owned by various European Governments).

I'm *very* surprised Delta didn't show up. I would have been interested
to see their aircraft age.

--Helen
--
Helen Trillian Rose             	<hrose@eff.org, hrose@kei.com>
Electronic Frontier Foundation   	email eff@eff.org for EFF Info
Kapor Enterprises, Inc.                 Flames to: 
Systems and Networks Administration	women-not-to-be-messed-with@eff.org
From: henry@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: Re: BAGGAGE AT CAROUSEL
Date: 4 Oct 92 05:22:43 GMT
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems; a div of Booz, Allen & Hamilton

smsriv@melkor.lerc.nasa.gov (Rakesh Srivastava) wrote: 
->>>Anyway, what prevents somebody (other passengers, airport personnel)
->>>from taking your baggage at the airport's baggage claim carousel ?
->>
->>Usually nothing, except usually by time the baggage is on the carousel
->This is not entirely true at some airports. There are security people
->at these airports who do not let you walk out of the carousel area unless
->they cross check the stub on your baggae and the stub on the ticket ...

i've only seen this happen at ATL and LAX; i've never seen this happen
at other big city airports (SFO, JFK, LGA, EWR, BOS, ...)

--
# henry mensch / booz, allen & hamilton, inc.  / <henry@ads.com>
From: ruppen@lexis.qal.berkeley.edu (Not Obsessed)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: selling tickets on rec.travel.air
Date: 28 Sep 1992 17:31:14 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: lexis.qal.berkeley.edu



Perhaps the posting of airline tickets for sale, particularly the OW tickets,
wouldn't be so annoying if the posters of said articles would restrict
an article's distribution to the local area nearest the ticket's originating
airport? It makes no sense for someone in, for example, San Francisco to 
have to read an article trying to sell a OW ticket from Atlanta to Chicago. It's
a waste of time and the net's resources.

Andy Ruppenstein (ruppen@qal.berkeley.edu)

From: rog@hpscit.sc.hp.com (Roger Haaheim)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1992 13:47:39 GMT
Subject: He became a legend
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara, CA
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air

Mike Stump and I worked at Northwest Airlines in mid-'50 to early '60's
as passenger agents (ticket counter, baggage, etc.)  and Mike was well
known for "happenings".  This is one Stumpism that I vividly recall:

Scene:  Late afternoon, very busy day, long lines, a seat assignment
	board behind him with little tags showing those seats still
	available.  Tag gets pulled off and stapled to ticket when you
	make your choice.

        Everyone is anxious, testy, and we're processing folks as fast
	as we can.  Situation is very tense.

Harried man:      "Can I pick my seat on this flight?"

Mike, instantly:  "I don't care what your personal habits are."

Result:  A roar of laughter from all within earshot, including the
	 Harried man.  I was all but collapsed on the counter, and Mike 
	 didn't bat an eye.
From: ramanath+@pitt.edu (Jayaram Ramanathan)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: VERY CHEAP tickets for sale, LA -> OKC/Dallas
Date: 5 Oct 92 23:03:41 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

Two 1-way tickets for sale: Los Angeles to Oklahoma City (via Dallas FW)
Date: October 11, 1982  (Dates can be altered for $25 fee, I'm told.)
One female, one male.

Asking price: $50 each, $80 for the pair

E-mail to: ramanath@unix.cis.pitt.edu  OR  call (405) 372-7834

Jay Ramanathan
From: johnl@iecc.cambridge.ma.us (John R. Levine)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: Re: BA Frequent Flyer Partners
Date: 6 Oct 92 19:12:54 GMT
Organization: I.E.C.C.

>Only persons with a residential address in the UK
>are eligible for BA Frequent Flyer Program.

Sometime in the last year, BA turned their U.S. Executive Club program into
a frequent flyer program.  Contact BA for details.  You only get credit for
BA flights (though you get them for any BA flight anywhere, unlike foreign
tie-ins to US FF programs) and can redeem them on BA and maybe American and
US Air.

Regards,
John Levine, johnl@iecc.cambridge.ma.us, {spdcc|ima|world}!iecc!johnl
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: sethb@fid.morgan.com (Seth Breidbart)
Subject: Re: Mensch
Organization: my opinions only
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 00:07:29 GMT

In article <1992Sep28.145420.12752@wam.umd.edu> davidcam@wam.umd.edu
(David Gordon Campbell) writes:

>My little 3-line posting wasn't bothering anyone.

It annoyed me, too.

>  The only reason to
>have a group like this, is so that we all can fly a little cheaper.

Wrong again.  Some of us want to discuss air travel.

Fortunately, there's a vote going on for misc.travel.marketplace, so
all your garbage can go to another group, which I won't read.

Seth		sethb@fid.morgan.com
From: weiss@babbage.seas.ucla.edu (Michael Weiss)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: Re: BAGGAGE AT CAROUSEL
Date: 28 Sep 92 03:46:41 GMT
Organization: SEASnet, University of California, Los Angeles

In article <32-PCNews-120beta@hart.actrix.gen.nz> graeme@hart.actrix.gen.nz (Graeme Hart) writes:
>RMNL69@paccvm.corp.mot.com (Les Aquino @ Motorola) once wrote....
>>Anyway, what prevents somebody (other passengers, airport personnel)
>>from taking your baggage at the airport's baggage claim carousel ?
>>Seems to me that anybody can get anything at that point.
>Usually nothing, except usually by time the baggage is on the carousel
>you're off the plane, and waiting for your bags, besides, the staff are
>much better off pilfering the freight area, or getting at your bags
>BEFORE they come off the plane :).

It varies, depending upon the airport.  At LAX, for example, you can't take
your bags out of the terminal without matching claim tags.
-- 
\ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | /
-  Michael  weiss@seas.ucla.edu   |  School of Engineering & Applied Science  -
-   Weiss   izzydp5@oac.ucla.edu  |   University of California, Los Angeles   -
/ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | \ 
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: ncole@nyx.cs.du.edu (Noah Cole)
Subject: Re: BA Frequent Flyer Partners
Organization: Macalester College, St. Paul Minnesota USA
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 92 17:07:52 GMT

ammann@cs.sfu.ca (Ammann Manuel) writes:

>Only persons with a residential address in the UK
>are eligible for BA Frequent Flyer Program.

Not Ture.. I am a member an d I have an address here in the US

-Noah Cole
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: konstan@cs.umn.edu (Joe Konstan)
Subject: Re: Luggage (was: AIRLINE SCAM)
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Minnesota
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 15:51:47 GMT

In article <hafer-011092170321@canard.apple.com>, hafer@apple.com (Rob Hafer) writes:
|> Another tip: Many airports in the U.S. still offer 'curb side check-in' for
|> domestic travellers.
|> 
|> When returning from a trade show, I drove up to the terminal and dropped
|> off 750lbs of boxes for four passengers...needless to say we tipped heavily
|> but did not have to pay any excess baggage charges.  On several other
|> occasions I've checked well above my allotment of luggage at the curb
|> (where they often don't have scales and tipping is encouraged).

It used to be that you could easily check extra luggage by checking some
at curbside, and some at the ticket counter (or with another skycap).  

Recently, I noticed that NorthWest has updated their baggage handling system
to provide individual barcodes at the skycap stations, and the barcodes
are accompanied by information about how many bags have been checked.  While
weight may still not be an issue (and I never recall be bothered about weight
on domestic flights anyway), it is now much harder to check more than 
3 bags per person without paying the $45 extra luggage fee.

(Of course, when my wife and I flew NW moving to Minneapolis, they didn't 
mind that we checked 6 and carried 4 on board.  Ticket agents still have
some flexibility.)

Are other airlines doing this as well?

Joe Konstan
konstan@cs.umn.edu

Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: kls@ohare.Chicago.COM (Karl Swartz)
Subject: Re: Govenment subsidy: Was Re: Aircraft Age
Organization: Chicago Software Works
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 09:32:48 GMT

In article <92275.235833RFRANCIS@ESTEC.BITNET> C R Francis <RFRANCIS@ESTEC.BITNET> writes:
>It's also true that Airbus does not have any miliatary forerunners or
>derivatives of any of its aircraft (unlike Boeing or MD)

It's interesting to note that Boeing's most successful commercial jets
have had little or no benefit of miltary purchases -- I'm not aware of
any 727s purchased by any military and only a handful of 737s were
sold to the miltary (as trainers).  And Boeing's cash-cow, the 747,
has only generated a few military sales -- for very specialized roles,
again unlikely to have been substantial enough to make much difference
to Boeing.

McDonnell-Douglas of course sold a large number of militarized DC-10s
in the form of the KC-10.  I haven't noticed that turning MD or the
'10 family into a runaway success.

-- 
Karl Swartz	|INet	kls@ditka.chicago.com
1-415/854-3409	|UUCP	uunet!decwrl!ditka!kls
		|Snail	2144 Sand Hill Rd., Menlo Park CA 94025, USA
"Unix is a fractal thicket." (Mark Barnett)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: amg8408@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Avijit  Moitra)
Subject:  Need address for bucket shops or consolidators for KLM
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 15:54:37 GMT

 Does any one know the address or telephone numbers of bucket shops or
consolidators for INTERNATIONAL TRAVEL specially for KLM.  An e-mail reply
will be highly appreciated.  Thanks in advance.
Newsgroups: sfu.general,rec.travel.air
From: teo@cs.sfu.ca (Chor Guan Teo)
Subject: air ticket for sale
Organization: CSS, Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Distribution: bc
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 00:21:15 GMT

Two round-trip air tickets for sale : Vancouver --> Ottawa, Ottawa --> Vancouver

#1: Oct. 8th (Vancouver -> Ottawa) & Oct. 13th (Ottawa -> Vancouver)

#2: Dec. 14th (Vancouver -> Ottawa) & Jan. 6th (Ottawa -> Vancouver)

Ask for C$380 each O.B.O. 

Please contact :

phone number : 936-0718
email address: weizhou@cs.sfu.ca
From: fmbutt@engage.sps.mot.com (Farooq M. Butt)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: Re: Transit Visa? (Germany)
Date: 29 Sep 92 21:20:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: oakhill.1992Sep29.212017.14632
Organization: Motorola RISC Software, Austin, TX

In article <1992Sep25.195633.18488@nsc.nsc.com> volker@nsc.nsc.com (Volker Soffel) writes:
... deleted ... 
>police officier and say "I'm a political refugee, I apply for asylum" and
>according to german law he/she would be allowed to stay and apply for assylum.
>However if you got a transit visa, then you're only "in transit" so you
>can't apply for assylum. So german policy is to require a transit visa
>for people changing terminals at Frankfurt airport, IF those people are
>citizens of third world countries. This does not apply for US citizens,
             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
read: largely dark-skinned people 

>Canadians or Europeans.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

read: whitevolk




Germany's ludicrous immigration policy has often been debated on the 
Usenet so I'll save my net.breath :-) Suffice it to say Germany harasses and
extracts large fees from dark-skinned people coming through their precious 
country.  I make it a practice to never go through Germany when connecting
flights and I would strongly advise other "3rd worlders" to stay the heck 
away.  BTW: After talking to the German consul in Boston, I got the distinct 
impression that he wasn't too interested in having me over either ;-) I 
got treated like some prospective illegal alien until he found out that 
I am a US resident and had zero interest in immigrating to his country. 
Flughafen Frankfurt Main purports to be an efficient hub in the center 
of Europe but as far as I am concerned, an airport that doesn't even have 
a real transit lounge is pretty pitiful (and, yes, most US airports 
do fall into this category).

fmb
 
-- 
Standard High-Tech Disclaimer: NOTHING  in the above article has the slightest 
relationship to reality. If any reality correspondences are found, please 
notify me IMMEDIATELY. Any threats, abuse or stupidity of any kind is purely 
UNintentional. These are MY Opinions NOT my employer's.
From: dickerso@fester.dell.com (Russell Dickerson - X2787)
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: Re: Airlines to Fly ***Please Read***
Date: 28 Sep 92 21:59:42 GMT
Reply-To: dickerso@cpat.stortek.com
Organization: IO SpecialistsConsulting

marke@ultra.com (Marke Clinger) writes:
>I heard about this flight (amazing eh?). The crew was on loan from 
>Continental, so was the plane.

>I was on a United flight one time where the ground and cockpit grew
>were on loan from continental...we waited for 40 minutes while the
>ground crew and the pilot argued over an entry in the flight book.

Marke, get a life.  If you want to trash Continental, at least get REAL
info.  I doubt very seriously that Continental was loaning its crew and
planes to its competitors. Dont make stuff up just to support your claims.
IF this is true, prove it...(from previous post several weeks ago->) and I 
doubt very seriously that Continental ever "rolled" a DC-9, or DC-10 
without it being a major press item and I never saw anything about it.
A roll of a DC-9 with passengers would involve a number of injuries to
passengers and crew.  Not something easily kept quiet.  While it can be done
(I've done it in the simulator.. I can even loop/roll the shuttle) in theory,
in practice it is entirely different.

I held my (fingers) the first time but this goes too far.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Russell Dickerson	Unix/X Consultant	IOSpecialists
(303) 673-5409 ---REPLY TO>>> dickerso@cpat.stortek.com <<<!!!!--------
For every vision, there is an equal and opposite Congressional revision.
From: mingos@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
Subject: Air safety
Date: 29 Sep 92 18:34:16 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

Dear All, 
 
  Sorry to post this here, but I need help, and this seemed the best place to
go.

  My wife and I were planning on trekking in  Nepal next year, but following
 the two recent accidents, she is refusing to be flown into Kathmandu airport.
  Reports in the press here speak of;
   1.  Kathmandu being a devil to land at.
   2.  Pilots hating to have to land there
   3.  Pakistan Int'l Airlines being an accident prone bunch of hackers

  what I'd appreciate is ANY information about flights into Kathmandu, and 
 information about the safety record of any of the airlines which fly into
 Nepal from the UK (PIA, Thai Air, Cathay Pacific, and Royal Nepal Airlines,
 fly there to my knowledge, there may be others).  
  Other stuff I'd be interested in is how many crashes there have ever been at
 Kathmandu, out of how many flights there (rough numbers will do, doesn't
 matter how rough, really).  Is Nepal likely to put radar in the airport, etc

   In short, ANYTHING, which you think I may be interested in related to this. 
 Anecdotes, statistics, opinions, experiences, ANYTHING.
   If people prefer, email me to save bandwidth.

    Thanks VERY much in advance 

                             Gavin

  
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: thomke@mtl.mit.edu (Stefan Thomke)
Subject: Re: Charges for baby on INTL flight
Organization: MIT Microsystems Technology Laboratories
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 03:29:19 GMT

In article <142.18588@incc.com> jerry@incc.com (Jerry Rocteur) writes:
>In article <1992Sep24.232123.1140@nas.nasa.gov>, tanner@sundog.nas.nasa.gov (Leigh Ann Tanner) writes:
>> In article <HROSE.92Sep23201221@rocza.eff.org>, hrose@eff.org (Helen Trillian Rose) writes:
>> |> LeighAnn> == Leigh Ann Tanner <tanner@sundog.nas.nasa.gov> 
>> |> 
>> |> In article <1992Sep23.022306.28628@ads.com>, henry@ADS.COM (Henry
>> |> Mensch) writes:
>> |> |> tanner@sundog.nas.nasa.gov (Leigh Ann Tanner) wrote: 
>> |> |> ->But if they charged for the ticket, shouldn't that child be
>> |> |> ->able to use a seat??
>> |> |> 
>> |> |> when you buy an airline ticket you are buying transportation ... not a seat.
>> |> 
>> |>  LeighAnn> You are buying a seat for transportation.  But if you are
>> |>  LeighAnn> under 2, then the transportation is free, if you sit on your
>> |>  LeighAnn> parent's lap, that being the point of the original post.
>> |> 
>> |> infants and children under 2 years old weigh something. As does their
>> |> baggage allowance (one suitcase, one stroller, one diaper bag, any
>> |> amount of duty free items [excluding alcohol, which infants are not
>> |> allowed to claim], etc). Airline fuel isn't free.
>> |> 
>> 
>> Yes, I guess this applies to International flights only.  Does anyone
>> know why this applies only to those flights??
> 
> I just wish they'd charge double so I don't have to hear your runts
> scream all the way from Brussels to LA.
>
> They should have kid free zones on airplanes, just like smoke free
> zones, what bliss.....

Perhaps they scream because they have to sit next to you. How do you 
dare to compare babies with a bad habbit such as smoking ! Maybe 
you'll end up next to me and my 10 week old son on a flight to 
Europe and I'd be more than happy to work on your attitude.

Stefan (and happy father)

>-- 
> __^__                                                              __^__
>( ___ )------------------------------------------------------------( ___ )
> | / | Jerry Rocteur                       Email: jerry@InCC.COM    | \ |
> | / |             Independent Computer Consultants                 | \ |
> | / |--------------------------------------------------------------| \ |
> |___|          Remember, the force is always with you!             |___|
>(_____)------------------------------------------------------------(_____)
>   ^                                                                  ^







Newsgroups: rec.travel.air
From: staggers@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Ken Staggers)
Subject: Re: BAGGAGE AT CAROUSEL
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 21:38:31 GMT

In article <1992Sep25.070528.11863@schbbs.mot.com> RMNL69@paccvm.corp.mot.com (Les Aquino) writes:
>This might be an FAQ.
>Anyway, what prevents somebody (other passengers, airport personnel)
>from taking your baggage at the airport's baggage claim carousel ?
>Seems to me that anybody can get anything at that point.

In my letter to John Dasburg, prez of Northwest, I noted that it was entirely
possible that my missing luggage was stolen because at Newark Airport some
guy loaded a ton of luggage on a giant cart for someone...walked outside
to load the luggage into the car...and came back with one piece and yelled
"Is this anyone's bag?".

--Ken
Newsgroups: rec.travel.air