From: santos@mickey.ai.kyutech.ac.jp (Rafael &)
Newsgroups: fj.news.group,fj.misc,soc.culture.japan
Subject: MAKING NOISE part 1 was:Re: About Fj.life.in-japan CFV[Pidgin English]
Date: 21 Aug 92 04:54:14 GMT
	<CLAUDE.92Aug19140916@tokyo.trc.mew.mei.co.jp> <2400@aegis.or.jp>
	<1992Aug20.030402.19568@rkna50.riken.go.jp>
Organization: KIT Iizuka, AI Dept, JAPAN.
In-reply-to: mtachiba@rkna50.riken.go.jp's message of 20 Aug 92 03:04:02 GMT


   >>From: mtachiba@rkna50.riken.go.jp (Masahiko Tachibana)

   >>Kon-nichi-wa.  

Kon-nichi-wa, Mr. Tachibana. Thanks for the support !

PRE-DISCLAIMER: I tried to make these complains the most "light" possible.
Lots of smilies :) and some :(
THIS IS NOT A FLAME (TM) mode on:
CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG (TM) mode on:

>>It is far beyond my ability to explain all the discussions for the creation 
>>of fj.life.in-japan. 

By what I understood of the discussions, it is impossible to explain them all.
I guess that there are some people MAKING NOISE to make impossible the 
creation of the group. 

>>I'll post some brief summaries on my articles and
>>some of the follow-up articles on a Subject: Is fj kind to minorities

THAT is kind ! Thanks a lot !

>>1) I think majorities of fj now is Japanese majoring information-science.
>>	I am not majoring information science, so in that sence I am a minority
>>	in fj.  From a minority's viewpoint, I think fj now is not kind to
>>	minorities.  This I think comes from the fact that new newsgroup like
>>	fj.windows.ms was easily created but fj.sci.medical or fj.life.in-japan
>>	are not.

You see, I am in the "information science" group of people and I cannot 
understand why it is SO difficult to create a group that have lots of
people posting even before the creation. Do somebody knows if it is 
normal ? I guess that other groups started with 0 articles, or no ?
Maybe I am wrong, but I remember that some CFD started after ours and
the groups were created... 
But, I will not say that fj is not kind to minorities... There are some
people (a minority) complaining about the creation and it seems that
this minority is even more important than us :(

>>	(Mr. Ohta disagreed because news system is for majorities and for 
>>      minorities you have mailing-lists.)  

For Mr. Ohta, I know that he can read articles in english, but he always
answer in Japanese. Only because he is MAKING NOISE everybody is concerned 
about his opinion, or no ?

>>2) I read the foreword on "Guidelines on the use of JUNET", where I found
>>	the spirit of the founders of fj is that information science is to 
>>	dedicate various fields of science, culture, arts, etc. as an infra-
>>	structure in the future.  I want to insist that everyone committing 
>>	the creation of newsgroups keeps this spirit in mind.
>>	(From this point of view, I argued against Mr. Ohta if he thinks of 
>>	majorities as fixed matter, the thought will work as an inihibitor
>>	for the expansion of fj as literally major media)

I remember that one of my university professors (a very wise guy) said 
that Information science was just a tool for another sciences. I agree.

>>4) As for fj.life.in-japan, some are anxious about almost all the commun-
>>	ication are done in English, But we already know someone whose mother 
>>	tongue is Portuguese has no other means to communicate in English here
>>	in fj.

Are you talking about me ? Thanks a lot !
Remembering: Don't think I like to speak English. If I could, I prefer
speak/write in Japanese, but I cannot (YET). I know that there are other
Brazilian posting a lot here, but he can speak/write/read Japanese
(Identify yourself, Mr. C ! MAKE NOISE !) and other Spanish (You too,
Mr. P ! MAKE NOISE !).

>>      If we do not let a man like him join us, we cannot help being
>>	criticized as fj is not kind to minorities.

Let me MAKE SOME NOISE about that:

 - I DO NOT WANT all the Japanese people to communicate in English or
   Portuguese;
 - I DO NOT WANT you all to post all your articles in English or 
   Portuguese;
 - I DO NOT WANT force you to be different because of MY temporarty
   inability to communicate in Japanese;
 - I JUST DO WANT a small innofensive group to post questions/ideas/
   suggestions/recipes/jokes in English, because I think that almost
   all the interested people can communicate in English.

Is that asking too much ? 
If you agree with me, MAKE NOISE. Post your opinion.

>>	(Mr. Hatano writes he wonders if it is suitable for them foreigners to 
>>	create the newsgroup only for them.

WHO said only for the foreigners ? By "all the interested people" we
mean NO DISCRIMINATION !

>>	I wrote to his opinion that some won't need it and some need it.
>>	Then we should make it because there are some who need it.)

Clear. That's exacly the idea. The people that do not need it can
read a book, go to the movies, put us on his killfile, but some
are trying to make the group impossible (and so far, are doing it).


>>I hope this summary would have neither mis-translation nor mis-understanding.
>>$@5L(J  $@2mI'(J (Tachibana Masahiko)			mtachiba@rkna50.riken.go.jp

BIG THANKS (TM) for the correct translation and comprehension of our
ideas/problems.

Rafael Santos.