HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tiot_kk@tac.fi (Kimmo Kauranen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: The last results of the Rally of the Thousands Lakes 
Date: 31 Aug 92 09:12:45 +0300
Distribution: rec
Organization: City of Tampere

In article <MIKA.PAAKKO.92Aug30142652@boa.cc.lut.fi>, Mika.Paakko@lut.fi (Mika Paakko) writes:

THE RALLY OF THE THOUSANDS LAKES
================================

The rally of 1000 lakes ended yesterday for the victory of Didier Auriol.
This was the fourth time he drove in Jyvaskyla, in '89 he was the 3rd, '91
he was the 2nd. Juha Kankkunen and Markku Alen gave him a fight, but not
good enough to beat him. Juha was naturally a little disappointed. Alen
drove so quickly he can (like 5-10 years ago), but Toyota is not Lancia.
Ari Vatanen also drove well, but he don't anymore have that furious speed
he used to have before his accident in Argentina.

Winning the Finns in Jyvaskyla is not very easy, '72 Blomqvist,
'89 Eriksson, '90 Sainz and '92 Auriol. During the last 30 years these
are the only one (if I remember correct the winners of 60's). So
everybody who wins here droves directly in our hearts and so did Auriol too.
We say that foreignors can't win in Jyvaskyla. It means that Auriol became
a Finn after he won here! He must have some Finnish blood and relatives ;-)

Another driver who drove in our heart was Colin McRae. He was like young
Ari Vatanen, three times out and without Subaru logo you could't quess
that car a Subaru. 

CONGRATULITIONS DIDIER!!!!!

The final results after SS 37 of 37:
---------------------------------------------------------------
 
 	1. Didier Auriol	FRA	Lancia		4.32.45
 	2. Juha Kankkunen	FIN	Lancia		4.33.25
 	3. Markku Alen		FIN	Toyota		4.34.44
 	4. Ari Vatanen		FIN	Subaru		4.35.17
 	5. Massimo Biasion	ITA	Ford		4.41.46
 	6. Lasse Lampi		FIN	Mitsubishi	4.42.41
 	7. Sebastian Lindholm	FIN	Ford		4.43.58
 	8. Colin Mcrae		GBR	Subaru		4.48.30
 	9. Phillippe Bugalski	FRA	Lancia		4.49.40
        10. Jarmo Kytolehto	FIN	Mitsubishi	4.57.14 (Group N)
        11. Esa Saarenpaa	FIN	Ford		4.58.00
        12. Juha Hellman	FIN	Mitsubishi	5.02.44 (Group N)

The Special Stage Winners
=========================
           1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
Auriol      22   7   2   3   1   1
Kankkunen   16   9  10   1   0   0
Alen         6   6  12  10   2   0
Vatanen      2   4  13  15   1   0
Biasion      0   0   1   0   6   7
Lampi        0   0   0   0   2   8
Lindholm     0   0   0   1  10   8
McRae        0   0   1   2  10   5
Makinen      1   2   0   2   0   3
Delecour     0   0   0   0   2   2
Blomqvist    0   0   2   0   4   5
Gronholm     1   0   0   0   1   0

-- 
---
Kimmo Kauranen  *  Department of Information Technology
                *  City of Tampere, FINLAND
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: hallam@zeus02.desy.de (Phill Hallam-Baker)
Subject: Re: BELGIUM-SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply-To: Hallam@zeus02.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 21:15:31 GMT

In article <pod.715223578@suite.sw.oz.au>, pod@suite.sw.oz.au (Paul O'Donnell)
writes:

|>In <Btt506.9LD@news.cso.uiuc.edu> tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn
|>Padfield) writes:
|>
|>>and Mika Hakkinen. With about 15 laps left, everyone started to pit for
|>slicks
|>>as the track now had a dry line. Schumacher's stop was very quick, leaving 
|>>Mansell in second after his stop. Mansell set out in pursuit, but his
|>Renault
|>
|>It was a bit more complex than that.  Mansell's main problem was that he
|>waited so long to put on slicks.  Schumacher was making an enormous
|>amount of ground on Mansell while Mansell was on wets.  Maybe Mansell
|>thought it was going to rain again.

In the aftermath interview it turned out that there had been a right royal cock
up. Patrese had been contacted by the pits and mumbled something about tyres,
the pits had though that he wanted to go in then and got things ready, meanwhile
Mansell radioed in with a request to go in and was told he couldn't because
Patrese was going in. then Patrese was told to come in because they were ready
and though he was being given orders - he did not know that he had made the
request! Thus both drivers ended up being shafted since Patrese would have
prefered Mansell to win rather than Shumacher!! Even in fact if he lost a
place.

Apparently Mansells exhaust manifold bust on one side losing him revs.


|>Congrats to Schumacher.  Thos has been hassling me all year for being
|>a Schumacher fan but I've been vindicated.

Yep, should be interesting next season. If Senna was not so snobbish about
"williams or nowt" he could have been driving Benetton next year with a damn
good chance at the title. As it is it looks like a Shumacher/Mansell contest is
in the offing, experience vs raw talent and both mad as hatters win at all costs
types to boot, should be fun!

--

Phill Hallam-Baker
From: boubez@tastesgreat.rutgers.edu (Toufic Boubez)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: F1: world sport? (was Re: Proposal: rec.autos.formula1)
Date: 1 Sep 92 19:00:31 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (David Cornutt) writes:

>lallo@stsci.edu (Matthew D. Lallo,622,4577) writes:

>>And remember, F1 is a world sport and this is a world net. 

>Wrong, F1 is a European sport.  I get sick of Europeans who try to claim
>that Europe = the entire world except for the U.S.  (Yes, they run a few
>races outside of Europe, but then again, CART runs races outside of the
>U.S., and the F1 fans persist in telling us that CART is still just
>a "national" series in spite of this.)  Just because Bernie or Max Mosley
>or whoever proclaims FISA to be the only worldwide motorsport does not
>make it so.

Unless you count countries like Japan, Brasil, Canada, Mexico, South
Africa, as being part of Europe, I would tend to say that F1 is in fact a
world sport. And, from what I hear, it seems that F1 is major attraction in
a couple of those countries. Another factor to take into consideration is
the size of the market for the races. It seems that practically every
country has TV and radio coverage of F1 races, with reporters on the scene.
I can't claim I know about whether this is the case for CART, but maybe
somebody with more info can enlighten us.

>David Cornutt, New Technology Inc., Huntsville, AL  (205) 461-6457

toufic
            R 2 4      Toufic Boubez
            |_|_|      boubez@cesl.rutgers.edu
            | | |      Computational Engineering Systems Lab
            1 3 5      CAIP Center, Rutgers University, NJ
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: welty@balltown.cma.com (richard welty)
Subject: Indy Vancouver <spoilers!>
Organization: New York State Institute for Sebastian Cabot Studies
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 23:57:57 GMT


Wrestlemania XXI

--or--

does bobby need  a vacation?



here there be spoilers



this race looked more like the `world wrestling federation' than
a genteel open wheel race.  contact, serious hard contact, and plenty of
it.

people were not watching their mirrors, experienced pros like emerson
fittapaldi, even.  his incident with little al was clearly his fault;
al was well inside and had taken the line.  geez, that galmer is one
tough chassis.  all that, and little al finished second.

the back of jimmy vassar's car must have looked like a safety truck
to michael, but fortunately for michael, he got away with it.

terribly frustrating day for eddie cheever; he had 2nd in his grasp
and lost it due to apparent engine failure.  also frustrating for cheever
teammate robbie gordon; a good run brought to a premature end.
it would seem that ford doesn't want to admit engine failures; as the
espn crew remarked, just what kind of electrical problem causes blue
smoke?  perhaps the part that drives the alternator broke?

the `whine like an andretti' award, though, goes to an unexpected
driver.  bobby rahal (who i'm normally a fan of) made some incredibly
self serving comments to the broadcast crew after he was put out due
to an altercation with Stefan Johansson.  now it is true that Johansson's
pass attempt was bold, risky, and from the result, ill-advised.  however,
rahal seemed to take the attitude that since he was points leader, Johansson
should not even have attempted a pass, which is assinine because rahal
and Johansson were clearly in a duel for a meaningful race position.
it looked like rahal got suprised by the attempted pass.  whining is
not attractive on anyone; least of all on bobby rahal.

this result (an andretti victory, fittipaldi & rahal out of the points,
little al second) rather muddies the points picture, now doesn't it.

sigh,
   richard (off to watkins glen for three days)
-- 
richard welty                            518-393-7228
welty@cabot.balltown.cma.com
  ``if you can read this, mario, you're too close''
    -- bumper sticker seen on a CART safety truck
From: MJackson.Wbst147@XEROX.COM (Mark Jackson)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: F1: Why no US GP?
Date: 4 Sep 92 16:48:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: yngvi.9209041648.AA19521
Organization: Xerox Corporation, Webster NY

In article 23510@ncube.com, bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe) writes:

> Should we also introduce the economics of putting on a F1 race as
> another reason surrounding the absence of an F1 race in the U.S.?

Yes, the cost of putting on a GP is enormous, arguably unreasonable.
But not prohibitive at 16 locations a year outside of the US, so
probably not prohibitive here.  The attractiveness of IndyCar as an
alternative is a fairly distinctive factor here, however.

> This is one point I've never really understood, and could someone more
> knowledgeable than me please give an explanation why permanent garage
> facilities are necessary in F1?  I know of no other series,
> international or usa-local, that HAS to have permanent garages.  The
> transporter with extended tent setup seems to work for the folks at
> IMSA, INDYCARS, NASCAR, NHRA, PRORALLY et all.  Just curious.

Why, it's so the teams will have a garage door they can close quickly
after the car retires to keep out the press, of course.  I'm surprised
you didn't know that, Bob :-)

Mark <MJackson.Wbst147@Xerox.COM>
     Between 20 and 30 percent of the gross national product of the
     United States comes from high energy physics.
				- Senator Phil Gramm (R-TX)
Organization: Sophomore, Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Date: Tue,  1 Sep 1992 10:35:16 -0400 
From: Juan Jose Mata <jmb3+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: F1: No Williams for Senna in 93
	<Btvt3A.28L@news.cso.uiuc.edu>

> 	What do you mean by Benetton's barnard design? John Barnard left
> Benetton after the '91 season, went to Toyota, and now is with Ferrari
> again!! He had no influence on the Benetton B192. The chances of Senna
> going to Benetton are about slim and none!!

I'm sorry if I got this wrong, but isn't the B192 chasis the one John
Barnard designed for Benetton. I mean, even after any modifications made
by today's Benetton engineers, wasn't the 'shark design' as some people
called it in Europe Barnards?


		- J.J.


#################################################
#     Juan Jose Mata <jmb3+@Andrew.CMU.EDU>     # 
#     Carnegie Mellon University - Freshman     # 
#     Electrical and Computer Engineering       # 
#-----------------------------------------------# 
#     Go L.A. Dodgers !   Go L.A. Kings !       # 
#     Go L.A. Lakers !    Go S. F. 49ers !      #  
#               ! Hala Madrid !                 # 
#################################################

"How terrible is wisdom when it brings no profit to the wise, Johnny."
				-Louis Cyphre (Lucifer)
				 (Robert DeNiro in Alan Parker's Angel Heart)





Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: balinton@space.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Senna coming to Comas' aid (Re: Rahal has a big mouth)
Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 22:13:13 GMT

In article <_2hn43q.esprit@netcom.com> esprit@netcom.com (Alan F. Perry)
writes:

>This is not the first time Senna has stopped to help after a big
>accident.  He also did this when   Martin Donnelley had his BIG crash
>at Spain in 1990.  Did he also do this during 1991?
>
>alan

Actually, I am under the impression that it is Senna who is always the one
to stop and help drivers in trouble.  

Another particular incident was when a race was red-flagged for an Alex
Caffi accident (Portugal??), the announcers said that once again only one
driver inquired as to his condition, and naturally it was Senna.  They seemed
amazed that only Senna regularly checked on other drivers.

beverly
From: t9014143@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Ques: on Cd and FW
Date: 1 Sep 92 20:09:36 GMT
 <BttF1p.CK3@news.cso.uiuc.edu> <1992Aug31.184900.28792@sdf.lonestar.org>
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

In article <1992Aug31.184900.28792@sdf.lonestar.org>, smiley@sdf.lonestar.org (M. Smiley) writes:
> In article <BttF1p.CK3@news.cso.uiuc.edu> tvp53202@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Toby Vaughn Padfield) writes:
>>	 The posts along this thread were getting to long to include, so
>>I'll just add my $0.02... Williams will again be the benchmark in '93, but
>>the Benetton with the new Ford-Cosworth V-12 will also be a FORCE!!!!!! 	I'm sure it will have some teething problems, but the HB V-8 didn't have
>>too many bugs when it first came out, so i THINK it should be pretty compet-
> 
> Yeah, and the Honda V-10 didn't have too many problems out of the box, but,
> look at the problems the V-12 had. Benneton will be a force only because they
> posess the 2cd best chassis at the moment (alright Schumacher helps a bit).
> 
>>TOBY PADDINGTON...
>>
> How many last names do you have Toby ?
> 
> George.



Taking '2cd' to mean Cd(drag co-efficient) does anyone have figures on the
current crop of cars.

One other question, given that teams like McLaren, Ferrari, Brabham were
started by the drivers themselves, was Frank Williams ever an F1 driver, if a
racing driver? If not F1 what other form of racing?
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C J                                         |
                                            |  Space for rent....
Internet : T9014143@phillip.edu.au          |
E-mail   : cwebb@arcadia.mc.phillip.edu.au  |
                                            |
================================================================================
From: pete@minster.york.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1: No Williams for Senna in 93
Date: 1 Sep 92 10:48:06 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of York, England
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Alan F. Perry (esprit@netcom.com) wrote:
: aghao@sersun2.essex.ac.uk (Aghanya O A) writes:
: >On the other hand, I have to say that I can clearly remember him doing 
: >somehing similar in 1985 or 1986 to Martin Brundle (I think), who he expressly
: >prevented from joining Lotus by prevailing on the team management.
: 
: Actually, it was Derek Warwick.  He did eventually get to drive for the team,
: though.
: 
: alan

Yes, but Warwick drove for Lotus in what was probably their worst season
ever -- think of Donnelly's accident, Warwick's own accident at Monza, the
lousy chassis, the Lamborghini engine, etc. etc. Had Warwick joined Lotus in
the team's good spell in the mid-Eighties I think the recent history of F1
would have been _considerably_ different... almost certainly would have given
him some wins; may have made him into a Championship contender.

Still, he won this year's World Sports car Championship... (and there was a
rumour that he might be looking at Indycars next season... that would be
something...)

pete
--
*Peter Fenelon -- Research Associate -- Software Safety Assessment Procedures*
Dept. of Computer Science, University of York, York, Y01 5DD (+44/0)904 433388
EMAIL: pete@minster.york.ac.uk `There's no room for enigmas in built up areas'
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: johnf@apollo.hp.com (John Francis)
Subject: Bobby's comments at Vancouver
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 17:13:32 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

I think Bobby has been running at the top for too long.  His
comments about Stefan Johannsen were somewhat unkind, even
considering the fact they were made on the spur of the moment.
The championship may be the most important thing on Bobby's
mind right now, but Johnanssen probably has different interests -
not the least of which is whether he has a drive for next year.
That is probably rather more important to SJ than the championship
is to BR.  If Bobby can't remember how competitive things are on
the lower rungs of IndyCar racing then he needed the refresher
course that he got this weekend.
-- 
John Francis                                johnf@apollo.hp.com
The world can be divided into two classes :-
 those who divide people into two classes, and those who don't.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Generic Racing Tidbits
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 18:00:49 GMT

1.  Requisite F1-related post:
Derek Warwick is looking for an IndyCar ride.  "I really
don't have an interest in racing sports cars anymore (ref
of course to WSC these days).  I want to take a crack at
finding a competitive IndyCar for next year."  He was 
7th in the '84 and '88 F1 Championships.

2.  NASCAR:
- Sunoco will drop its sponsorship of the Billy Hagan team
at the end of the season (Terry Labonte).  There have been
rumors that negotiations are underway for Sunoco to become
the official gas of NASCAR, replacing Unocal.  The Hagan 
team has run Chevs, Olds and Fords this season.  Next year
will be Chev-exclusive.
- Dave Marcis has replaced Greg Sacks on the Larry Hedrick's
Kellogg's Chev for the remainder of the season, being reunited
(from the late 70's) with Harry Hyde.
- Contrary to what I said last week, McDonald's WILL NOT be on
the Petty/STP car next year.  Nor will they be with Bill Davis
(currently running Jeff Gordon in BGN with his Ford).  Crazy
rumor is that we may see Junior Johnson get the McDonald's deal
next year with Jeff Gordon in the seat. But wait....Gordon supposedly
signed with Rick Hendrick for next year.  Others think Hendrick will
get McDonald's, also with Jeff Gordon in the Chevy's seat.  Silly
stuff indeed.
- Cale Yarborough may lose the TropArtic sponsorship after the end
of this season.
- Junior Johnson will own a mule "until the day I die".  And we
ain't talking Fords here, but the real thing.  Probably a couple
of good 'coon dogs as well.

3.  IndyCars:
- Scott Pruett hopes he will go wherever the Bud money goes.
King Motorsports (Bernstein) still has the best shot.  Jim
Crawford and Roberto Guerrero have also been mentioned as shoes.
- Milwaukee may get back its tradition date immediately following
the Indy 500.
- Jeff Andretti will announce soon which team he'll be with in '93.
He's currently getting around in a wheelchair.
- Mario Andretti has more IndyCar road course wins (21) and poles (23)
than any other driver.  Al Unser Jr. has completed more miles (2884) in
competition than any other driver this year (before Vancouver).
- Roger Penske may use a Buick in one of his Indy entrys next year.
Reportedly, he's also been talking to Al Jr.
- The average age of the top 10 (by points) IndyCar driver this season
is 36.

-c'ball-
From: biomelih@buengc.bu.edu (Melih Ucar)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Patrese signs up with Benetton !
Date: 4 Sep 92 01:15:05 GMT
Followup-To: rec.autos.sport
Organization: College of Engineering, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA
Originator: biomelih@buengc.bu.edu


	I am surprised that nobody wrote anything about this :

	Today at 14:00 GMT BBC World Service annouced that Patrese had signed
up with Benetton/Ford team replacing Brundle. They also mentioned that he was
going to race with Schumacher (maybe this ends the rumors about the possibility
of Schumacher racing at another manufacturer)

	Does anybody have follow-ups to this ?

	Regards,

Melih Ucar
biomelih@buengc.bu.edu

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: andyw@meaddata.com (Andy Welter)
Subject: Re: David Letterman's top 10
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 13:06:30 GMT
Reply-To: andyw@meaddata.com


In article 715331968@suite.sw.oz.au, pod@suite.sw.oz.au (Paul O'Donnell) writes:
>In <1992Aug31.095713.1@wharfin.mit.edu> lang@wharfin.mit.edu writes:
>
>>I thought it was also hilarious when Andrew Marriot finished one of the
>>pit reports with "This Robin Leach back to you Bob."
>
>>Apparently the guys from ESPN had to explain to Andrew just _who_ Robin
>>Leach was.
>
>I have a feeling I am about to embarrass myself here.....
>
>Who _is_ Robin Leach?
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
A short, annoying, fawning toady, with a voice that sounds alot like Andrew Marriot.
He hosts a show called "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous".  

I for one don't see how Letterman could get the two confused.  :-) :-)

---
|Andrew Welter	     |  All views are mine and not |      (513) 865-6822   
|Mead Data Central   |    that of my employer      |        Online M&R       
|P.O. Box 933        |                             |     andyw@meaddata.com
|Dayton, Ohio  45401 |          	           | ...!uunet!meaddata!andyw

Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 13:53:03 -0400 
From: Dino_P._Chiesa@transarc.com
Subject: Senna + Wiliams: NOT



Obi writes of Mr. Senna:
> He then went on to say, "I could stay with McLaren, but as I beleive that 
> Williams will again have the most competitive car next season, I woud say that
> it is most likely that ****I would stay at home next season****".
> 

lms@rle-vlsi.mit.edu (Luis Miguel Silveira) writes:
> I find this decision rather deplorable.  Ayrton Senna is a
> *professional* driver.  A professional driver's _job_ is not to win.
> Instead his job is to drive for a team, develop a car, help the
> designers, the mechanics, etc, with his hints and his experience, his
> feelings and his opinions.  If he wins, great, otherwise, at least he
> must try his best.
 

And then, Gilberto disagrees with that.

I agree with Luis, on this one.  It shows a poor attitude if a driver
says, "If I don't get the best car, then I won't play..."  Though, we
certainly shouldn't be surprised at this sort of attitude coming from
the superstar drivers of F1.

As I recall, a similar position was taken by Mr. Prost for '92.  He
considered driving, but in the end, did not, because he did not
believe there was an available car+team which would meet his
standards.

So, we don't have to like it, in either case, but the drivers don't
care what we think, do they?

---------------------

I would have liked to see Prost campaign a Ligier in '92; I would
be interested to see Senna compete in '93, regardless of the car.


-dpc
From: taylor@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Ross Taylor,Peyt312,6652,2655436)
Subject: Re: F1: No Williams for Senna in 93
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 13:12:00 GMT

From article <5243@sersun1.essex.ac.uk>, by aghao@sersun2.essex.ac.uk (Aghanya O A):
> 
> MY OPINION:
> 
> On the other hand, I have to say that I can clearly remember him doing 
> somehing similar in 1985 or 1986 to Martin Brundle (I think), who he expressly
> prevented from joining Lotus by prevailing on the team management.  What goes
> 
> 	Obi.	

No doubt someone will correct me if wrong but I think it was Derek Warwick
that Senna refused to have join him.  Don't know if this was at Lotus
or some other team.

Ross Taylor