From: darknite@camelot.bradley.edu (John S. Novak III)
Subject: Re: The Wheel of Time: Prophecies and Portents
Organization: Bradley University
Date: 13 Dec 92 05:58:00 GMT

In <1992Dec10.130729.5499@msc.cornell.edu> hillyard@msc.cornell.edu writes:

>As could probably be infered by all my posting lately with stuff
>having to do with Eye of the World, I just reread the series.  
>While doing so I marked where some of the major portents and prophecies 
>appeared and compiled them.  Here they are with some comments.

Cool!  I think this goes in my keeper file...

>Min's viewings:  which supposidly refer to major turning point
>or event to come and are always true.

As a point of accuracy, are Min's viewing's always of events to
come, or can they be historical in context?

>Lan
>	Seven ruined Towers
>	A babe in a cradle holding a sword

For instance, the seven ruined towers might simply be Lan's past
history.  I would the second viewing here as well, although it
may be indicative of Lan someday having a child with Nynaeve
Al'Meara, and the child going through Lan's ritual.  Might Lan,
after the Last Battle, have designs on rebuilding Malkier?

>I believe the baby is Isam.  Lan is going to face him at some
>point.

I must be dense.  Or reading TSR right before finals has dulled
my mind.  In either case, who or what is Isam, please?

>Thom
>	A man--not him--juggling fire
>	The White Tower
>The man is likely Rand, and as I proposed before the White Tower
>may refer to a mariage to Moiraine.

No clues on this one.  

>Perrin
>	A wolf
>	A broken crown
>	Trees flowering around him
>	An Aielman and a cage
>	A Tuatha'an with a sword
>	A falcon and a hawk, perching on his shoulders, both female.
>The hawk is Berelain, her and Perrin are likely to meet again.

The wolf is pretty obvious, as are the caged Aielman, the
Tuatha'an with a sword, and now (with your suggestion) the falcon
and hawk.  I would suspect that the broken crown refers to the
broken kingdom of manetheren.  Trees flowering around him may
refer to someone having transplanted the Tree of Life into what
may end up as Perrin's new kingdom, or at least his new lands, in
the Two Rivers.

>Mat
>	A red eagle
>	A eye on a balance scale
>	A dagger with a ruby
>	A horn
>	A laughing face

The dagger and horn are obvious.
The eye on the scale could be tied to the 'sacrifice a half of
the light to save the other half.' This could easily refer to Mat
figuring out whether the sacrifice is worth it.

Wasn't the Red Eagle the banner of Manetheren?

I don't know about the laughing face.

>   Answers
>	What fate?
>	  To marry the Daughter of the Nine moons.

Marry an important Seanchan, I'm sure.

>	  To die and live again, and live once more a part of what was.

This seems somehow caught up with his Manetherian heritage and
'reincarnation' but I have no idea past that.

>	  To give up half the light of the world to save the world.

The eye thing.

>   Agreements
>	  Memory restored
>	  To be free of Aes Sedai and the power.
>	  Away and back to Rhuidean
>I think eye on a balance scale refers to some considered
>decision on whether to lose it (I suggested to gain knowledge in the tower of 
>Ghenji).  And so give up half the light of the world to save it.

Ah.  Great minds think alike, apparently.

>Rand
>	A sword that isn't a sword

Either Callandor, or his sowrd formed of the One Power.

>	A golden crown of laurel leaves
>	A beggars staff

No idea.

>	Him pouring water on the ground

Rain in the Aiel lands, at the end of TSR?

>	A bloody hand and a white hot iron
>	Three woman standing over a funeral bier with him on it
>	Black rock wet with blood

No idea on these, either.

>Elayne
>	The Rose Crown of Andor
>	A severed hand, not hers
>Rands hand?

Got me.

>Egwene
>	A white flame
>She takes the Amyrlin seat.

Agreed.

>Logain
>	A halo of gold and blue, signifying glory to come

From what else I've read in this thread, it seems that other
people think that Logain will go to take Callandor again, as
well.  I do, to.  Given also the discussion of means around
stilling/gentling, I don't find it all to unlikely that we'll see
Logain ungentled.  Perhaps he learns to trickle a little power
around the shields, and uses Callandor to magnify his power and
break it?

>Gawyn
>	A heron marked sword, his or threatening
>	His banner with a field of green rather than white
>	Either breaking Egwene's neck or kneeling to her
>It seems he's likely to become Egwene's warder and lead the
>Green Ajah, or Battle Ajah, to war.

It would seem that the heron blade becomes his as well-- he seems
to be damned good with the blade.

>Prophecies

>	Twice and twice shall he be marked,
>	twice to live, and twice to die,
>	Once the heron to set his path.
>	Twice the heron, to name him true.
>	Once the Dragon for remembrance lost.
>	Twice the Dragon for the price he must pay.

This all seems well-known.

>	Twice dawns the day when his blood is shed.
>	Once for mourning, once for birth.
>	Red on black, the Dragon's blood stains the rock of Shayol Ghul.
>	In the Pit of Doom shall his blood free men from the Shadow.

Possibly an interesting way of saying that his blood is shed
twice-- once for mourning, and once for birth.  Mourning the old
Age, birthing the new Age?

Someone else noted that all which might be needed is a few drops
of Rand's blood on Shayol Ghul-- its possible, but it seems like
an awful bother to simply go bleed somewhere...

>The day of his funeral (once for mourning), Rand is somehow
>reborn (once for birth) and the last battle takes place.

>	Into the heart he thrusts his sword,
>	into the heart, to hold their hearts.
>	Who draws it out shall follow after,
>	What hand can grasp that fearful blade?

>I have a random, perhaps not too likely hunch, that Logain ends
>up drawing Callandor and it allows him to reverse his gentling.

Very possible.  However, who draws it out shall follow after.
Does this mean Logain will help Rand?

>	Power of the Shadow made human flesh,
>	wakened to turmoil, stife and ruin.
>	The Reborn One,  marked and bleeding,
>	dances the sword in dreams and mist,
>	chains the Shadowsworn to his will,
>	from the city, lost and forsaken,
>	leads the spears to war once more,
>	breaks the spears and makes them see,
>	truth long hidden in the ancient dream.

This seems to be directly related to the end of TSR.

>From Rhuidean
>	The stone that never falls will fall to announce his coming. 
>	Of the blood, but not raised by the blood, he will come from Rhuidean
>	at dawn, and tie you together with bonds you cannot break.  He will 
>	take you back, and he will destroy you.

This is understandable.

>The Dark Prophecy
>	Daughter of the Night, she walks again.
>	The ancient war, she yet fights
>	Her new lover she seeks, who shall serve her and die, yet serve still.
>	Who shall stand against her coming?
>	The Shining Walls shall kneel.
>	Blood feeds blood.
>	Blood calls blood.
>	Blood is, and blood was, and blood shall ever be.

This one scares me.  Then again, Lanfear scares me (more than
anyone else in the book-- more than Ba'alzamon, more than
Ordeith...)  The concept of a 3,000 year old woman, in love with
the most important man in the world and thoroughly evil just
scares me.

This really does imply that Rand somehow serves her, and dies,
and serves again.  How, I don't know, as Rand shows a remarkable
integrity and fortitude against being snared in the plots of
others.

>	The man who channels stands alone.
>	He gives his friends for sacrifice.
>	Two roads before him, one to death beyond dying, one to life eternal.
>	Which will he choose?  Which will he choose?
>	What hand shelters?  What hand slays?
>	[...]

Oddly enough, the life eternal option probably implies that he
would need to serve the Dark One-- Ishamael certainly offered it
often enough.

>Moiraine speaking of the prophecies

>	He has yet to break the nations, or shatter the world.  Even scholars 
>	who have studied the Prophecies for their entire lives do not know how
>	to interpret them all.  What does it mean that he shall 'slay his 
>	people with the sword of peace, and destroy them with the leaf'?  What 
>	does it mean that he 'shall bind the nine moons to serve him'? 
>	Yet these are given equal weight with Callandor in the Cycle.  
>	There are others.  What 'wound of madness and cutting of hope' has 
>	he healed?  What chains has he broken, and who put into chains?

The first question probably refers to his telling the Aiel of
their true past, and what it meant to be Jenn Aiel.  The second
probably means that he will, through Mat, gain the Seanchan as an
ally.  The 'wound of madness and cutting of hope' may refer to
him fixing the taint on Saidin.  He has broken the chains on
Asmodean and, by really stretching, put different ones back on.

>Egwene's dreams

>	Rand as tall as a mountain, walking through cities, crushing
>	buildings beneath his feet, with screaming people like ants 
>	fleeing from him.  Rand in chains, and it was he who was
>	screaming.  Rand building a wall with him on one side and her
>	on the other, her and Elayne and others she could not make out.  
>	"It has to be done," he was saying as he piled up stones.  "I'll 
>	not let you stop me now."  His were not the only nightmares.  She had
>	dreamed of Aiel fighting each other, killing each other, even
>	throwing away their weapons and running as if they had gone mad.  
>	Mat wrestling with a Seanchan woman who tied an invisible leash to 
>	him.  A wolf--she was sure it was Perrin, though--fighting a man whose 
>	face kept changing.  Galad wrapping himself in white as though
>	putting on his own shroud, and Gawyn with eyes full of pain and hatred.

>The Seanchan woman is of course the 'Daughter of the Nine Moons'.  It seems
>that Galad does indeed join the Whitecloaks.  Another reference to Rand being
>chained and probably tortured.

The first part, about Rand, seemed symbolic rather than literal.
The Aiel running scared has been seen at the rainstorm.  Mat
wrestling with the Seanchan could very well be his wedding night,
or might refer to a power struggle between he and his new wife.
I agree that Galad seems likely to join the Whitecloaks.

>Any I missed?  Comments?

On a related topic, has anyone sat down and figure out what some
of the names mean?  My roommate (the medieval history major)
insists that even more names than I had thought refer to
characters from the Arthurian Myths, including even Perrin.  He
then promptly clams up and refuses to elucidate ("I don't know
rhat much about them" he claims. Grr.)

At any rate, I'll start:
Rand al'Thor -- Son of Thunder?  Fits with the concept of being
the Dragon.

Egwene al'Vere -- Vere might come from a root word meaning
'green' implying that she will join the Green Ajah (not that this
should surprise anyone.)

Nynaeve al'Meara -- al'Meara, meaning 'of Meara' is an easy and
abvious cognate for 'of Mierin,' who is, of course, Lanfear.
Ugh! 

Some other nagging concerns:

Could there be other ta'veren running about?  After all, we've
only really seen people from the central lands of the book.  Is
it possible that there is a Seanchan ta'veren running about,
making sure that everything the Seanchan do is 'on schedule?'
Possibly the woman Mat will marry?  How about an Aiel ta'veren?

Also, what about the lands past the Three-Fold lands?  Is it
possible that they are the Seachan, or are they a completely
separate people?  Hmm.  I know that most of the silk in the
civilized lands comes from past the Three-Fold lands, by way of
the Sea People (and before, by the Cairhien, as well.)  I seem to
remember the Seanchan wearing silk as well-- did they trade with
that culture, or _are they_ that culture?

--
"Giving every man a vote has no more made men wise and free than
Christianity has made them good."
		-- H. L. Mencken
John S. Novak, III		darknite@camelot.bradley.edu