From: braca2@cspyr1.cs.adfa.oz.au (BRAY CHRISTOPHER)
Subject: Re: Yet more civilization questions
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy, Canberra, Australia
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 05:38:33 GMT

koren@fc.hp.com (Steve Koren) writes:

>  - I usually move from Despotism to Republic as quickly as possible,
>    skipping all intermediate steps.  Is there any particular reason to
>    go through the others?  It doesn't take very long to develop the
>    Republic, and that's usually about the time I want to change anyway.
>    I figure that the fewer governmental changes, the better.

	I usually sit on Communism/monarchy until (the former if I get
pyramids) I've got good military domination.  It is easier to maintain a
force with these two types of government.  I slowly phase out the military
as I expand into more commerce orientated governments.

>  - Along similar lines, I usually stay at Republic for the duration of
>    the game and not move to Democracy.  From the description in the
>    manual, Democracy sounds very close to Republic, except that you
>    make more citizens unhappy by moving military units out of the city.
>    Is there any good reason to go to Democracy instead of Republic?  It
>    just sounds harder to keep your people happy.

I believe that Democracy increases your trade a bit.

>  - The game always seems to end early, and not because another
>    civilization has gotten to space, either.  According to the manual,
>    there are 5 ways to end the game: you quit (from the menu), you
>    retire (again from the menu), your civ. is destroyed, another civ.
>    gets to Alpha Centauri first, or you conquer the world.  But there
>    seems to be another, unwritten condition for ending.  Along about
>    2040 or so, the game puts up a banner saying, "<your leader> plans
>    retirement in 20 years!".  (This is *without* using the retire
>    option in the game menu).  Then, in 20 years, the game ends.  This
>    is usually just about the point where things are starting to get
>    interesting, and its always frustrating.  Once or twice I've had the
>    game end because another civ. got to AC first, but usually my games
>    end because of this "forced retirement".  As far as I can tell, it
>    isn't mentioned in the manual anywhere.  What's going on?  Most of
>    the time, nobody has built a spaceship by this time.

In my manual it mentions that the game ends at 2080 for chieftan, 2060 for
warlord, 2040 for prince, 2020 for king and 2000 for Emporer.  this just 
adds to the difficulty of the level.  The best way to avoid this is to get
many more cities going, and produce your spaceships with the highest priority.

>  - Similarly, does it seem to anyone else that there isn't enough time
>    to get all the needed advances and build the spaceship?  Here's what
>    happens for me.  I start out with a 100% scientific budget.  I get a
>    new discovery about every 8 to 11 turns.  As soon as possible, I
>    convert to Republic, and build libraries, universities, and a few
>    scientists.  I have to lower the scientific budget to about 50% or
>    so in order to make some money, but with everything else, I still
>    get advancements about every 15 to 21 turns.  That seems like a
>    reasonable pace, but yet, there is no way I can keep up with other
>    civilizations.  On level 3, other civilizations are building
>    ironclads when I'm just getting sailing ships, and they have
>    spacecraft technology when I'm just getting flight.  How do they get
>    so far ahead?  I don't think I can support a higher science budget,
>    and I build all the universities and libraries that i can, and often
>    try for the Wonders which increase your learning rate.  Sometimes I
>    even get a few advancements by invading other cities.  Is there any
>    hope of keeping up?  I can't maintain a 100% scientific budget once
>    my civilization starts needing money to support itself.

Try investing in marketplaces, banks and trade.  These three items increase
the amount of revenue that comes in, as to mfg. plants later on.  Slow the 
growth of your cities amenities, and concentrate on expanding or trade.  
This way you can keep ahead of the rising costs of the cities.  I never 
expect to maintain a 100% scientific budget, I can usually sit around 20-
40% depending if I build the colossuses or not.

>  - Often, I build a large city which is more or less thriving.  Then,
>    some units from another civ. will move in and plop themselves on top
>    of the squares around my city, and "pillage" to destroy the
>    irrigation and mines.  I can't kick them out, because my Republic
>    government won't let me break a truce.  They succeed in killing my
>    city, because without the irrigation and mines, the city can't
>    support itself any more - it looses people and resources, becomes
>    unable to support the military units it has placed around the map,
>    and just basically withers and dies.  Is there anything that I can
>    do to stop them?  Why can't I "return the favor"?  I can never
>    pillage around *their* cities unless they outright attack me.  I'm
>    sure I have lost games due to this sort of thing - they never
>    declare war, but they march through my territory and wipe out all my
>    cities by removing resources and food.

Having a military unit sitting near your city can often help this when your
empire is small ( another benefit of having a monarchy/communism is that 
you dont loose production here), other military units can move by, and you 
can thrash them if they attack. However it is a pain in the arse.

>  - Similarly, once in a while enemy units will surround my city with an
>    impressive array of military hardware, building up what is obviously
>    an invasion force over about 5 or 10 turns.  Doing this, they can
>    stop *my* units from moving near them.  They are obviously going to
>    invade, but I can't attack them first.  So I have to sit there and
>    wait for them to attack me.  Is there any way to be a bit more
>    proactive about this?  After the battle starts, the city is more or
>    less doomed since they can cut off the food and resources for that
>    city.  The only way I can figure to avoid this is to surround each
>    and every one of my cities completely with defensive units.  But
>    that's a pretty big waste of resources and makes lots of people
>    unhappy.  Blocking off "bottleneck" areas of the continent doesn't
>    help, because they can move in with ships.

A quick change of govt. or antagonise them with diplomats can help here,
but the best thing to do is try and defend yourself, and have other cities
send in their own men to that location.

>  - What happens to a trade route with a different civ. if the other
>    side declares war on you?

	Nothing as far as I can tell.  Its best not to destroy cities
with whom you have trade routes with as it reduces your trade.

>  - How much does it cost to "support" various military units?  Often,
>    right before a critical battle, I'll get a message like "Boston
>    can't support battleship!" and my battleship will up and disappear
>    off the face of the map.  This can be annoying!

If you keep an eye on the shield production on a city then you will know 
how many more units you can produce, usually the shields will look like this

uuu uuuu <-- shield spare
^^^
Shield used supporting military units.
If your shields look like this however

uu nn <-- black shields, which means that you are supporting too many
	  units.
the best way to avoid over expending shields is to limit the number of
units from each city, and to continually check on where your people are
working.

>  - What's the "optimal" number of cities to found early in the game?  I
>    usually try to get about 5 to 7 major cities.  Usually 2 or 3 of
>    them turn out to be really good, 1 or 2 are a big flop, and the rest
>    are average.  Is there any reason not to build more cities early in
>    the game in order to get more production capacity later?  I've been
>    thinking about trying, as early as possible, to send out as many
>    settlers as possible to found new cities.

I usually start of with 2 cities, and send out heaps of men to explore 
around the place. After my first two cities I try to make sure that every
other city is in a good location.  If a city is a flop, limit the population
and turn it into a science/money/entertainment city.  And keep the 
amenities down too.

>  - There are 20 squares around your city to put people in.  After your
>    city size reaches 20, what happens to the extra people?  (I've never
>    gotten a city over 19, but I've heard its possible).

If you can support the people with food they will turn into entertainers,
which is often useful as people are usually pretty unhappy at this stage.
I often turn alot of them into scientists/taxmen as well.  It depends on 
what you are after.

>  - After you get a better defensive unit type for a city, is there any
>    reason to keep the old type around?  Should i keep militia after
>    I've gotten riflemen?  Is there any cost to support them if they are
>    in the city itself?

Kill the bastards.  Or send them on a suicide mission against enemy 
vets, never against their newbies tho.

>  - steve
hope that helped mate.


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