From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: Re: fraternities
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 17:46:43 GMT

Followups directed out of a.f.c....
In article <1992Apr12.123401.4989@ac.dal.ca> 01sybok@ac.dal.ca writes:
>In article <1992Apr9.185513.15773@news.iastate.edu>, mds@iastate.edu (Mark D. Smucker) writes:
>> 	``A 1990 national survey of more than 12,000 students
>> 	by the Campus Violence Prevention Center at Maryland's
>> 	Towson State University found that about half of all 
>> 	reported acquaintance rapes were committed by frat members
>> 	and athletes.''
>        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>break it down by percentages. What porportion of the population are fraternity
> members and athletes? How many rapes were fraternity members?

Why is it relevant?  The point is how all-male social organizations
perpetuate stereotypes and provide behavior reinforcement that leads
to rape.  I assure you that fratoids and athletes make up well under
half of the college population.

>> 	``A 1990 study by the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
>> 	concluded that 34 of the 54 reported sexual assaults were by
>> 	fraternity men, even though they represent just a quarter of
>> 	male students on campus.''
>
>Hmm... how was the study conducted? You have to watch these things, I learned
>in an Experimental Design class. For example, I understand that only something
>like 10to 20% of rapes get reported. Maybe a disporportionate number of rapes
>by fraternity men are reported. This would mean the vast number of unreported
>rapes (which outnumber reported rapes) are by nonfraternity men, and therefore
>most rapes are done by nonfraternity men. 
>See, you can twist data to mean almost
>anything, if you work at it... you have to be sure your stats are done on 
>reliable studies.

Well, this study will have to be pretty darn unreliable before one could
question the hypothesis that fraternity members commit a disproportionate
number of campus rapes.  Did you do any of the calculations?  Let's give
you the full benefit of the doubt, assume (1) that 90% of the rapes weren't
reported, and (2) the null hypothesis that fraternity members don't
commit a disproportionate number of campus rapes.

		Frat Rapes	Non-Frat Rapes		Total
Reported	    34		      20		  54
Unreported	   101		     385		 486
Percent Reported   25.2%	      4.9%		 10.0%

(Or we can try a more realistic 20% report rate..., just to show that
 I'm not choosing numbers.)

Unreported	    33		     183		 216
Percent Reported   50.7%	      9.8%		 20.0%

Either fraternity members are five times more likely to rape or
victims of fraternity rapes are five times more likely to report the
rape.  (Or some combination in between, which doesn't hurt the conclusion
that fraternity members are more likely to commit rape.)  Do you
have any reason to believe that fraternity rapes would be much more
likely to be reported?  Ex ante, one would expect the opposite:
fraternity rapes are much more likely to involve late-night parties,
alcohol, and women who aren't feminists.  You can attack the study for
not including unreported rapes all you want, but it doesn't change the
conclusions -- it's much more likely that fraternities are more likely
to commit sexual assaults than that victims of sexual assaults are more
likely to report the assault if their assaulter was in a fraternity. 
-- 
Ted Frank          + "He wanted to be the car rather than the thimble or the
1307 E 60 St, #109 +  hat."  -- District attorney explaining Marc Cienkowski's
U o' C Law Skool   +  murder with bow and arrow of Michael Klucznik in
Chi, IL 60637      +  Doylestown Borough, PA over a game of Monopoly.