HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: meganb@sequent.com (Megan Breninger)
Subject: Just a note to say...
Followup-To: nothing inparticular
Summary: see below
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 16:45:27 GMT


**** M E R R Y  C H R I S T M A S *****

**** H A P P Y  N E W  Y E A R ****

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's so nice to have such friendly horsey people to talk to,
share positive experiences with, and know you all will be
here for help and guidance, when needed.

Here is hoping 1993 is your best year ever, whatever your goals
may be!

Megan, Larry her Fiance, Clyde his Black Lab, Edgar her Black Cat,
and HIGH ACTION HANK, APHA, her WONDER HORSE!!!

(1993 is going to be one very active year for us, as I hope we
qualify for World, 'cause we are, for our first time ever, going
to try!!!)
From: gunnj@ddn-wms.nmi.com (Janet Gunn)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Advice Needed:  Sudden Change in Jumping
Summary: ground lines
Date: 19 Dec 92 01:58:59 GMT
Organization: Network Mgmt Inc., Fairfax, VA

In article <5996@rosie.NeXT.COM>, llyons@next.com (Liza Lyons) writes:
> 
> In all cases, until recently, he's been inclined to stand off and get a big  
> spot if he's going to get an unusual spot.    
> 
> The problem:  Several weeks ago, Kinsale suddenly started jumping from the base  
> of his fences.  At the time, we were preparing for a Novice event and the  
> fences were set at an appropriate height.  No matter how much engagement and  
> pace I created, he would go straight for the base (he didn't "slow down" in  
> front - he was always committed and unwavering in his approach).  In a  
> x-country school the following day, he repeated this behavior although I was  
> able to induce some better spots on fences immediately following those where he  
> went for the base, and I "stuffed" him out of it.
> 
> Help !  I feel like my training program is somehow to blame for this change,  
> but I don't know what to correct so we achieve a happy medium between the "old"  
> and "new" Kinsales :-|
> 

Since "the base of the fence" is where the horse SHOULD jump from, I assume you
mean that he is getting in TOO deep.

First of all, as long as you are sure not to get ahead of him, especially
when he "puts in an extra one", getting in too close is a lesser fault.

It is, however, easy to correctwhen schooling, simply roll out the ground line
somewhere between 2 ft and the height of the fence.  You could also play
with changing the distances in your grids.

If the major problems are when galloping cross country, he is probably
getting on his forehand without your knowing it.  I have had to deal with this
with both the mares I have trained from scratch, at about the time they were 
ready to move up from novice to training.  Make sure you get a definite 
"rebalancing" into something more like a showjumping frame about 6 strides
out.  Later you can work on making it more subtle.  Whatever you do,
this is NOT the time to "count strides".  When he does get in close,
make sure you give him lots of extra leg, or even the whip, to give him support.
In those cicumstances it is better to be left (with you body, not your hands, 
let the reins slide through your hands) than to get ahead of him.

Hope it helps.

Janet gunnj@nmi.com
or ddn-wms.ddn.mil
From: dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Carlyle Morgans
Date: 15 Dec 1992 20:48:43 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]


: I know exactly what you mean.  I was visiting the woman who is leasing
: our old gelding and she was showing me her Morgan gelding.  I'm glad she
: told me it was a Morgan right up front, otherwise I would have stuck my
: foot in it and said, "What a nice looking Saddlebred!"  
: The horse really does look Saddlebred, has the upright neck and is lean
: looking.  Doesn't look anything like I think a Morgan should look.

: Sue
 
I've had the same experience. :) 
Karen
From: dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: A Hard Keeper
Date: 14 Dec 92 04:17:35 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Sarah Pallas (pallas@cephalo.neusc.bcm.tmc.edu) wrote:
: In article <1gdje9INN5s4@nigel.msen.com> dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski) writes:
: >
: >Sterling has been hard to put weight on, so he gets corn oil as part of
: >his ration.  This works without making him high.  If you do this, the 

: Some people (including fellow netters) have said that corn oil may
: make a horse tie up, so you might want to try something else, like
: soybean oil.

: -Sarah Pallas 
 
Does anyone have further information?  I have never run across this and don't
see why it would.  Corn causes no problem that I know of and the reason that
corn has such a high coloric density is the amount of fat (corn oil) that
it contains.  Tying up is usually caused when a horse in heavy work is given
the same grain (and one would presume supplement) ration on a day off. 
Another cause of tying up is a selenium deficiency.

Karen and Sterling
From: pxjones@crdec6.apgea.army.mil (Paulette Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re:  A Hard Keeper
Date: 14 Dec 1992 14:39:18 -0500
Organization: BBN news/mail gateway
Reply-To: equestrians@world.std.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: news.bbn.com

A while back I asked for advice about a 30yr old TB hard keeper.
I got some wonderful advice.  What we've ended up doing was changing
the sweet feed to New Hope (6 2-lb coffee cans, 1.5 in AM, 2 in PM and  
1.5 in evening, has beet pulp in it), adding vegetable oil and soybean
meal to it and worming every day with Strongid C, plus every other month
our regular barn rotation of paste wormer (vet says stop Strongid C
on the days we worm), plus alfalfa hay.  The horse has stopped losing
weight, but has not put on any noticeably.  His previous feed was
4 2-lb coffee cans of an alfalfa pellet complete feed and grass hay. 
I think if they had upped the amounts and maybe added vegetable oil,
he might have done just as good or better.   Good luck.

Paulette & Nipper
From: ce423@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Josh Lackey III)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Recommended Sources:  Is Eventing Humane?
Date: 17 Dec 1992 06:45:09 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: ce423@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Josh Lackey III)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, llyons@next.com (Liza Lyons) says:

>Hi, again:
>
>Some of the discussion that I was involved in a few months ago with regards to  
>the "humaneness" of eventing has prompted me to do some research for a paper on  
>this topic.
>
>Aside from Denny Emerson's "Chronicle of the Horse" article (and the USCTA  
>magazine), do you have any suggestions for additional sources on either  
>eventing or other equine sports?  I'm looking for case studies, position  
>articles (either pro or con), and research.
>


  Have you also considered the "humaneness" of Horse Racing  ???

   I went to my first horse race a couple years ago and was

    amazed how prevalent the use of drugs was on the horses, i.e.
  
      stimulants and pain killers, etc.  

    I dont think they should prohibit Horse Racing, but I guess none of
us will never know what the sport would be like without stimulants???
-- 
Josh Lackey III     
     
     Internet E-Mail:     ce423@cleveland.freenet.edu
                          jlackeyi@nyx.cs.du.edu
From: llyons@next.com (Liza Lyons)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Recommended Sources:  Is Eventing Humane?
Date: 11 Dec 92 20:03:17 GMT

Hi, again:

Some of the discussion that I was involved in a few months ago with regards to  
the "humaneness" of eventing has prompted me to do some research for a paper on  
this topic.

Aside from Denny Emerson's "Chronicle of the Horse" article (and the USCTA  
magazine), do you have any suggestions for additional sources on either  
eventing or other equine sports?  I'm looking for case studies, position  
articles (either pro or con), and research.

If you do - and have copies of articles on line - I'd *really* appreciate it if  
you could send them to me.

Thanks for your help !!

Liza
llyons@next.com
From: deblev@nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu (Debbie Levine)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Advice needed for "Stall Kicking"
Date: 16 Dec 1992 22:47:04 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology
NNTP-Posting-Host: nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu

In article <MARY.92Dec16090914@cloudpeak.tivoli.com> mary@cloudpeak.tivoli.com (Mary Anthony) writes:
>...  I hesitate about
>using them.  1) The chains sound cruel -- maybe it's the word chain connected
>with my horse I don't like. 2) I'm worried the chain will scar him.  3) Will
>the chain catch on something?.

This isn't a problem I've had to deal with.  I haven't seen the kind of
chains you describe, and I don't think, from the description, that
I'd feel comfortable using them.  What I have seen in catalogs somewhere
advertised as kicking chains, had a sort of cuff that appeared to fit
snugly above the hock, with a ball dangling maybe a foot below from a 
rope or chain.  When the horse kicks the ball is supposed to kick
him back.  This device seems a little less likely to chafe or get
stepped on or get caught on something, and more likely to break if it
DID get hung up.

I think if it were my horse, I'd be tempted to try to be there for several
feeds in a row, and really get after him each and every time he
kicked.

Debbie
deblev@ipac.caltech.edu
From: dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Carlyle Morgans
Date: 15 Dec 1992 05:02:22 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Linda B. Merims (lbm@avs.com) wrote:
: Did any of you Morgan folks out on the net read your December
: "The Morgan Horse", particularly the yellow sales supplement
: article from the AMHA board of directors on what happened to
: Maxine Snow?  I'd love to hear your thoughts.

: What a dilemna for the breed--in the SAME issue:

: 1992 World (sic) Champion In Hand Mare:
:        Carlyle Cwhateverhernameis  (Fiddler's Trustee x Senora Showbiz Vona)

: Maxine Snow of Carlyle Morgans expelled from AMHA membership over
:   not cooperating with the AMHA Directors in establishing the identity
:   of the Morgan mare Senora Showbiz Vona

: So it appears a fair bet that the '92 Champion Morgan In Hand mare
: is suspected of being only half Morgan.

: Linda B. Merims

That's what'll happen when people can't nbe satisfied with the wonderful
qualities of the breed that they have.  Too bad.  I love Morgans, and I
think that if you want a small Saddlebred, you should buy a small Saddlebred.
(I like Saddlebreds too, so that wasn't a slam.)

Karen



Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: reichard@nb.rockwell.com (Diane Reichard)
Subject: Re: Hay Cubes Anyone?
Organization: Rockwell International
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:02:05 GMT


In article <1gqhaeINNk1n@gap.caltech.edu>, deblev@nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu (Debbie Levine) writes:
> In article <1992Dec16.225337.18505@sco.com> kristinr@sco.COM (Kristin Robinson) writes:
> >
> >((SCO LYRIX 6.1
> >))
> >
> >Does anyone out there feed hay cubes?  What is your experience with them,
> >pluses and minuses?  
> 
> Another thing to consider is that cubes have been known to get 
> contaminated.  A couple of years ago several horses in Southern
> California died, and many more were quite sick, when a load of
> cubes got processed with a rabbit carcass, and the cubes were
> contaminated with botulism.  At least that was what I heard the
> final explanation was -- the deaths and illnesses were definitely
> connected to a particular shipment of cubes, and effected both
> The LA Equestrian Center and one of the big operations in Orange
> Countyl.

There was a definite diagnosis of botulism (unfortunately for some, post-mortem).
Orange County Fairgrounds was the hardest hit in this area, although several
other OC stables had botulism deaths.  Two horses in the same aisle as my
boy died (there were a couple days where he wouldn't eat, thankfully!).

Diane R.
From: rlt@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (r l taylor)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Carnivorous horse?
Date: 18 Dec 92 14:19:00 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <BzFs9K.EpC@watserv2.uwaterloo.ca> Ruth Vale <rmvale@watnow.uwaterloo.ca> writes:

>One of our mares has taken a likely to eating dog food - usually
>because its the first thing she sees, on the way to her stall, that

>Just wondering whether an occasional munch on dried dog food is
>going to get her into trouble.  She is not prone to colic and is
>more likely to founder than get an upset stomach.  Anybody else
>out there experience problems when horses eat things intended for
>dogs, when I forget to hide their bowl where she can't get it.
>A friend's appaloosa has a liking for hot dogs and she's had
>no problem to date, but dog food?

I know a number of "old-timers" who use dry dog food to get weight on
starved horses they're trying to fatten up.  Usually the cheapest brands,
which are probably mostly grain products and fat (not so much meat), a
couple of cups a day.  They usually soak it in water first, so it doesn't
swell up in the horse's stomach.  I've seen a lot of "before" and "after"
horses, and it seems to work.  And I've never heard of one having a problem
as a result.

My first horse (also an App - is there a pattern here?) was fond of hot
dogs, too.  Also hamburgers, cotton candy, and anything else he could
snatch from patrons at the county fair.  Fortunately, by the time he
had developed this habit, he belonged to a real cute 10-year old girl
who could charm the victims out of being upset! :-)  He never had any
problems, either, though I was concerned about the bread he was eating.
My vet at that time had warned me that white bread could ball up in their
stomachs and cause a potentially fatal blockage.  (I've eaten whole wheat
ever since! :-)  )

Roberta
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: tonyp@convex.com (honey bunny)
Subject: DON'T RIDE IN HORSE TRAILER WITH A HORSE
Organization: CONVEX Computer Corporation, Richardson, Tx., USA
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 17:51:44 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

My friend's friend had a horse that was ill and had to be
taken to the vet.

To keep the horse calm he rode in the trailer with it.

Horses are good at forward/backward motion, but not 
with side-to-side.

There are alot of twisty roads out here.

Horses weigh "a *REAL* lot".

---

You don't want to know what they found when they opened the
back door to the horse trailer.

---

D O N ' T     R I D E     I N     H O R S E     T R A I L E R S     ! ! !


--
    Tony J. Podrasky          - When God was making big men,
     San Diego , Ca                        -and- 
    tonyp@convex.com            When God was making little men,
QSL? QRU? QRZ? QLZ? QFA?        Samuel Colt was making  EVENERS     - unknown
From: D5.F72@forsythe.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Advice Needed:  Sudden Change in Jumping
Date: 17 Dec 1992 14:27:12 -0800
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: morrow.stanford.edu

Dear Liza,

The horse I ride started doing the same thing, given a choice, he
would choose the chip stride rather than the long spot.  It wasn't
until after he had dumped a rider because his back/shoulder was
so sore and he started being worked on by a chiropractor that we
were able to figure it out.  If his shoulder (or now occasionaly
his hip/loin coupling) "goes out" he will consistently look for a
short spot.  After being adjusted, he's back to his old self of
getting a good spot or taking off long.  I had begun to think that
I had started riding to short spots and that it was my fault, when
it really had nothing to do with me!  You might want to have him
examined by a chiropractor - ours works with our vet - but some
work alone.  You might ask around for recommendations, I am sure
some of the other eventers must use one!

Gary (& Gunner aka Shoot for the Moon)
From: deblev@nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu (Debbie Levine)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Swinging Hindquarters
Date: 19 Dec 1992 00:01:59 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology
NNTP-Posting-Host: nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu

In article <1992Dec18.165838.27998@ucsu.Colorado.EDU> templin@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (Templin Geri-Ellen) writes:
>(I can't take Belle on the trail either. too anxious. some eventer huh?)

First, thanks for the advice!  Morris will trail ride, with a quiet horse,
but he doesn't enjoy it.  He tends to spend the whole time worrying and
works up a nervous sweat.  The first couple trail rides he EVER (we
assume) went on, he came back utterly lathered from head to tail, but
he has improved since then.

The best event horse in our barn is a real spook!  He is afraid of
shadows, blowing bags, you name it!  Bushes are especially terrifying!
But, put him on a cross-country course, and he'll jump over just about
anything...

Debbie
deblev@ipac.caltech.edu

Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: mapike@sei.cmu.edu (Mary Ann Pike)
Subject: Still need MSM info
Organization: Software Engineering Institute
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 11:43:50 EST

I got several replies asking "do you mean DMSO" and one telling me that
MSM is a derivative of DMSO, but no replies from people who have actually
used it to treat arthritis. Again, I am asking for a friend whose dogs
are becoming arthritic...she would like to be able to do something for
them to ease the discomfort.

I would like to know: does it work? is it expensive? is it easy to find
(do you need a vet to prescribe it?)

Thanks for any information you have.

Mary Ann Pike   (mapike@sei.cmu.edu)    and     Robyn (14-year-old Arabian)
Software Engineering Institute                  & her June colt Baaskin Robyns
Carnegie-Mellon University                      (inquiries welcome for either)
Pittsburgh PA
From: deblev@nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu (Debbie Levine)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Help! My horse has turned into a Juvenile Delinquent!
Date: 17 Dec 1992 18:27:03 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology
NNTP-Posting-Host: nimoy.ipac.caltech.edu

I have to second Sue's question:  WHY keep this stallion entire?  If
you aren't planning on breeding him, it will be easier on all
concerned, including the horse, if he is gelded.

That aside, the barn I'm with has a number of stallions and most of 
them are quite easy to deal with.  I think the key is to pretty much
handle them like any other horse -- including not permitting "studdy"
behaviour.  (Of course you need to be very alert around other horses, you
can't ignore the fact that they are stallions!)

It sounds like your barn manager is not experienced at handling young
stallions.  It seems to me that you should either place him with 
a good trainer/handler or make the time to work with him yourself
or sell him.  If he continues to misbehave and is under-exercised
you will wind up with an unmanageable, dangerous horse.  He needs
competant handling and he needs to get out and expend some of that 
energy.

IMHO,
Debbie
deblev@ipac.caltech.edu
From: dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: more ramblings on bareback
Date: 14 Dec 1992 04:02:43 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Sullivan (GC.SUL@forsythe.stanford.edu) wrote:
: A few more musings on bareback riding...

: My friend and I have consistently found by riding all of her 4 horse
: s and my two that the gaits seem a lot smoother when riding
: bareback.  Your seat is directly on the back of the horse, with
: nothing to brace your feet against-so there is less to cause you to
: bounce.  I always ride very limp with relaxed (lousy ) posture.  Any
: time you try to keep your body erect, you are going to bounce.  You
: need to think in terms of just melting into the horse.

You should not be bracing your feet against the stirrups (unless of 
course you are fighting, say with a lance or trying mounted archery).
You can sit tall in a saddle with out bracing.  Watch a dressage show and
you will see that many of the top riders do part of their warm up without
stirrups,  and the collected trot of an upper level horse is  *very*  bouncy.

: I still can't believe that riding bareback can be harder on the back
: than even the best fitting saddle.  A person's bottom is much more
: flexible than a saddle tree.

Yes, but a persons bottom often doesn't stay put and often sits on the spine.

: Of course, I still like to think that as long as I can grab a
: handful of mane and swing up on the back of my 16 hand mare, I can't
: be getting that old!

Congratulations!

Karen
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: bmc@mayo.edu (Bruce Cameron)
Subject: mail order source for buggy parts
Organization: Mayo Foundation, Rochester MN. Campus
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 19:14:11 GMT

Having just become the owner of a 1850's dog cart
in need of repair, I was wondering; does anyone
know of a mail order source for buggy parts?

I am not going to try to restore the cart, simply
fix whats wrong.

Thanks.

-- 
--Bruce
-----------------------------------------------------
Bruce M. Cameron		bmc@mayo.edu
Mayo Foundation			voice: (507) 284-3288
200 1st St SW			fax:   (507) 284-9623
Rochester, MN 55905		ARS -- WD9CKW
From: sbishop@desire.wright.edu
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: ARABIANS
Date: 12 Dec 92 19:16:32 EST
Organization:  Wright State University 

In article <1gdeknINN5s4@nigel.msen.com>, dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski) writes:
> : ...and has an exotic
> : color bay. He has a WHITE tail too! 
> 

I just want to make one point, bay is NOT an exotic color in Arabians.  For
many years the majority of Arabians in this country were grey, mostly because
the early imports were mostly grey.  Now there are many bay, chestnut, and
black Arabians.  My mare Quality is chestnut, her sire was bay, her dam was
flea-bit grey.  She also has a half-sister who is bay, out of the same dam.

The white tail on a 'bay' does sound suspicious.  Is his mane black?  If
it isn't he's not a bay.

Sue


> Does Shah Hameer have a grey parent by any chance?  If so he could
> be a late changing grey.  My Arabian, Oneco Sterling, is the son
> of a stallion by the name of Black Knight.  Knight did not *begin*
> to grey out until he was a five year old!
> 

Mike McCabe used to have a gorgeous young gelding who was jet black with
just a few white hairs in his tail.  He slowly turned grey over several
years.


> Good luck with your friend,
> 
> Karen Sugalski & Sterling
> (on Dan's account)
>
From: dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Good grief, spurs, not stirrups!
Date: 15 Dec 1992 20:41:47 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Joyce D. Scott (jscott@adobe.com) wrote:

: Which way up do English spurs go?  

: On an English spur the point (the business end) seems to be at an angle
: to the curved part that goes around the ankle.  I have not found a picture
: in any of my horsie books of a rider with English spurs showing to use
: as a reference.  The reference book I have mentions when to wear them, but
: not how.  I have found a few pictures in catalogs.  State Line seems to
: think the point goes up.  Rick's appears to be just as convinced that it
: goes down.  Miller's doesn't sell any and doesn't show any on the boots
: they sell.  My teacher said up, I think, but my new spurs have printing
: on the inside with the makers name and if I point them up, the printing is
: upside down.  

Oops one other thing.  If the spur had differnt length arms, the shorter one
goes on the inside of your leg.  Does that help?

Karen

Newsgroups: rec.equestrian