HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: friedenb@ash.egr.msu.edu (Gedaliah Friedenberg)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Yassir Arafat Insane?
Date: 16 Dec 92 01:55:05 GMT
Reply-To: friedenb@ash.egr.msu.edu (Gedaliah Friedenberg)
Organization: College of Engineering, Michigan State University


From today's Israeline:

Syrian Deputy President Says Yasser Arafat Lost his Sanity

Today's YEDIOT AHRONOT quotes the Italian newspaper "Il-Jiornale"
which published an interview yesterday with Syrian Deputy President
Abdel Halim Hadam, the man considered "number two" in Syria. Hadam
said in the interview that he is convinced that PLO Chief Yasser
Arafat has lost his sanity. "I have the impression, that following
the plane accident, Arafat lost his sanity..." Hadam said that
Arafat's claim that parts of the Golan Heights belong to the
Palestinians constitutes the final proof of his madness.


What took everybody so long?  I have been claiming he lost his mind
when he hugged Saadam Hussein & Mohmar Quaddafi with the whole world 
watching.  Many people have been claiming this for years.  

;^)


Gedaliah Friedenberg
-=-Department of Mechanical Engineering
-=-Department of Metallurgy, Mechanics and Materials Science
-=-Michigan State University


                   
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman)
Subject: Re: Israeli soldiers kill Palestinian boy
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 17:08:23 GMT

In article <1genihINNhqk@manuel.anu.edu.au> bdm@cs.anu.edu.au writes:
>In article 22288@colorado.edu, perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) writes:
>>In article <1602@tdat.teradata.COM> jcg@tdat.teradata.com (Jonathan Gingerich) writes:
>>>In article <4570@bimacs.BITNET> ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich) writes:
>
>>>>  A mericans. please inform us what an American soldier is expected to
>>>>do if he is stoned at Somally ?
>
>>>Leave.
>
>>While I don't often side with Gideon Ehrlich, in this case I am forced
>>to.  Jonathan, the UN mandate given to the multinational forces
>>currently operating in Somalia does allow shooting back if resistance is
>>met.  Anyone who doesn't think that stoning doesn't fall under the
>>category of possibly deadly force needs to re-think their position.
>>Under the UN mandate, the US (or any of the other nations') forces would
>>be justified in countering resistance.  [..rest deleted..]
>
>I can't believe my eyes.  If American soldiers start killing Somali 
>children (I include younger teenagers) who throw stones at them
>there will an international outcry like you have never seen.

If that were all that were going on in Somalia, perhaps. ut that never
was all that is going on in the intifada.  The intifada is not a popular
uprising - not anymore, whether or not it was at the beginning.  Right
now it has deteriorated into a battle between members of different PLO
factions, which hold a large portion of the Palestinian population in
terror.  Over the last two years, many more Palestinians have died at the
hands of such militia than have been killed by the IDF.  And the vast
majority of those killed by PLO-affiliated death squads are completely
innocent.  The militias charge that they're collaborators, but the
reality is far from that.


-- 
"How sad to see/A model of decorum and tranquillity/become like any other sport
A battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee." -Tim Rice,"Chess"
     Eric S. Perlman 				 <perlman@qso.colorado.edu> 
  Center for Astrophysics and Space Astronomy, University of Colorado, Boulder
From: wolfone@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Patrick Chester)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Malcom X
Date: 14 Dec 92 22:23:48 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <1937@spam.ua.oz> jaskew@spam.ua.oz (Joseph Askew) writes:
]In article <1ft432INNj44@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> bc744@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Ira Kaufman) writes:
]
]>John Elghani asks, regarding Malcolm X, "Who killed him?"
]>
]>  Everybody knows that the Jews did it!
]
]No it was the Greys! Malcolm was going to tell the world about their
]bases on the Far Side of the Moon. He had to be silenced!

No, the Greys were the tools. Everybody in the know knows that the real
orders came from the Reptiloids of Cygnus IX. The Greys merely executed the
orders.
 
]Is this going to be the stupidest thread in this group yet?

Yes, probably. Since I'm in a silly mood right now I decided to perpetuate
it a little longer. Heck! Let's start a cascade! It should beat the flamage
from the pro-Israeli vs. pro-Palestinian groups trying to "prove" that it's
all the other sides fault. That and that their actions are justified by the
other sides crimes.
 
]Joseph Askew
]
]-- 
]Joseph Askew, Gauche and Proud  Barbarian horns draw out the northern wind;
]jaskew@spam.maths.adelaide.edu  Paler than water lies the Thistle Pass;
]Disclaimer? Sue, see if I care  Sky swallows up the road to Kokonor;
]One China One Korea One Eire32  Moonlight, a thousand miles along the Wall.


-- 
Patrick Chester            |----------------------------------------------------
wolfone@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu |"The earth is too fragile a basket in which to keep
Politically Incorrect      |  all your eggs." Robert A. Heinlein
Future Lunar Colonist      |"The meek can *have* the Earth. The rest of us are 
#^%$!! Militarist          |  going to the stars." Robert A. Heinlein
(Of the Sun Tzu mentality) |----------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:23768 soc.rights.human:4599
From: eggertj@moses.atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert x6127 g41)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,soc.rights.human
Subject: Re: Israeli Expulsion of 418 Palestinians
Date: 21 Dec 92 03:02:40 GMT
	<23096@venera.isi.edu> <1992Dec20.074547.1840@ennews.eas.asu.edu>
Reply-To: eggertj@atc.ll.mit.edu
Organization: MIT Lincoln Lab - Group 41

In article <1992Dec20.074547.1840@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
>   In article <23096@venera.isi.edu> arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens) writes:
>   # In article <1992Dec18.124600.16290@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
>   # > Throughout the entire evolution of the fourth Geneva convention,
>   # > including its official interpretations, it is clear that the Convention
>   # > does not prohibit all expulsions, despite the fact that the wording of
>   # > the convention may lead one to believe that.
>
>   # Article 49 of the 1949 (Fourth) Geneva Convention on the Protection
>   # of War Victims states, among other things:
>
>   #   Individual or mass forcible transfers, as well as deportations of
>   #   protected persons [i.e., inhabitants of occupied territory -- YA]
>   #   from occupied territory to the territory of the Occupying Power or
>   #   to that of any other country, occupied or not, are prohibited
>   #   regardless of motive.
>
>   # Yes, I can see why the innocent reader might be misled into believing
>   # that the convention prohibits expulsions.  Luckily we have Mr. Makowsky
>   # to set us straight.
>
>	   Unfortunately, Yigal does not seem to be able tor read.  If he
>   did, he would have seen the justification (which I originally saw in a
>   column by William Safire) for what I wrote.  And I never claimed the
>   convention does not prohibit any exoulsions.

It does not seem to bother Makowsky that the US officially disagrees
with his interpretation of the Geneva Convention.  Or that the EC and
its member states do as well.  Or that the UN does as well.  As long
as one journalist (William Safire) says that forced deportation is
ok, then Makowsky is secure in his belief.

What's wrong with you?  Can't you tell right from wrong?  Rounding up
and deporting innocents is wrong.  Even if it seems expedient, it is
still wrong.
--
=Jim  eggertj@atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.arabic
From: gmeltzne@jarthur.claremont.edu (Goof)
Subject: Re: Opposites and yet so alike
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 20:12:33 GMT

In article <29724@castle.ed.ac.uk> jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk (Jeremy Henderson) writes:

>
>Err...hang on a minute, can someone suggest what ARE the views of Jews in`
>general??

	You can't!  You know what they say, put 2 Jews in a room and you'll
	get 3 opinions.


	Geoff

>
>
>-- 
>===Jeremy Henderson===jeremy@castle.ed.ac.uk=          
>
>This message cost the net hundreds if not thousands of dollars.
>Bloody good value if you ask me.


-- 
Email: gmeltzne@jarthur.claremont.edu            

A .sig?  A .sig? We don't need no stinkin' .sigs!
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: bdm@cs.anu.edu.au (Brendan McKay)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Anti-Semitism
Date: 15 Dec 1992 09:21:58 GMT
Organization: Australian National University
Distribution: world
Reply-To: bdm@cs.anu.edu.au
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.23.70

In article <42569@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> Ron Evans writes:

>        I didn't know this group now had a spokesman.

Ron, it's not my fault if you missed the election. 

See you all on Dec 27.  Be good kiddies while I'm away.

Brendan.

Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: adam@endor.uucp (Adam Shostack)
Subject: Re: Malcom X
Organization: Aiken Computation Lab, Harvard University
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 16:16:48 GMT

In article <1992Dec11.210839.20081@muddcs.claremont.edu> gmeltzne@jarthur.claremont.edu (Goof) writes:
>In article <4650@copper.Denver.Colorado.EDU> aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa) writes:

>>How do you think we feel about a masjid being destroyed by Islam-hating,
>>radical Hindus?
>
>	Probably pretty upset, but I was curious because the was no mention
>	of this anywhere on this group.  

Hindus in India destroyed a mosque, Muslims "retaliated" by destroyng
11 Hindu temples, and 700 people died.

I'm not sure how relevant this is to the middle East, except to show
us what happens when religious fanatics start attacking each other.

Adam


Adam Shostack 					adam@das.harvard.edu

What a terrible thing to have lost one's .sig.  Or not to have a .sig
at all because of elections.  How true that is.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: jle@locus.com (John Elghani/10000000)
Subject: Re: Exchange rates of the Middle East:
Organization: LC
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:49:56 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.105510.9027@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil.Idriss:) writes:
>In article <1992Dec10.010719.13252@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
>>In article <1992Dec10.002148.2413848@locus.com> jle@locus.com (John Elghani/10000000) writes:
>> 
>># Exchange rates of the Middle East:
>> 
>>#                       U.S.Dollar       currency 
>>#                       Equivalent    per U.S.Dollar 
>>#                      Tue     Mon     Tue     Mon 
>>#  SOON TO BE          .3013   .3013  3.3195  3.3195 
>>#  FOREVER             .0142   .0142   70.30   70.30 
>>#  PART OF            2.6504  2.6504  0.3773  0.3773 
>>#  ISRAEL              .3743   .3717  2.6720  2.6900 
>>#  AND THERE IS       1.4832  1.4789  0.6742  0.6762 
>>#  NOTHING YOU        3.3389  3.3333  0.2995  0.3000 
>>#  CAN DO            .000535 .000534 1868.00 1871.00 
>>#  ABOUT IT!           .2665   .2665  3.7520  3.7520 
>>#  HA! HA!             .2723   .2723  3.6725  3.6725 
>
>Somehow I believe that this is really your intention.

Did you ever doubt that motive brother Nabeel?  Don't you see 
their extraordinary concentration on bringing as much as possible
occupiers from around the world?

jle


Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: gmeltzne@jarthur.claremont.edu (Goof)
Subject: Re: Israeli soldiers kill Palestinian boy
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 07:44:56 GMT

In article <23066@venera.isi.edu> arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens) writes:
>In article <1992Dec16.004724.8176@colorado.edu> perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) writes:
>>
>> In article <23061@venera.isi.edu> arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens) writes:
>> >In article <1992Dec15.182856.23705@colorado.edu> perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) writes:
>> >>
>> >> ...  I do know that numerous
>> >> PLO-affiliated activists who've stated even slightly non-standard
>> >> opinions have been forced to seek protection from Israeli authorities
>> >> not for being collaborators - which they're not - but just for speaking
>> >> something that some party or other doesn't approve of.
>> >
>> >This often repeated claim is absolute nonsense, completely untrue.  But
>> >here's Mr. Perlman's chance to redeem himself: Please post the names and
>> >circumstances under which PLO-affiliated activists who've stated
>> >"slightly non-standard opinions" have "sought protection from Israeli
>> >authorities".  Come on.  Let's see you do it.  You say "you know" of
>> >"numerous" such cases.  Describing ten (10) cases would be enough.  OK,
>> >five (5).  Alright -- just two (2).  Can you provide us ONE (1) example
>> >of a PLO-affiliated activist who did no more than state a slightly
>> >non-standard opinion, and as a consequence was forced to seek protection
>> >from Israeli authorities?
>>
>> Steven Emerson, in the November 23,1992 edition of the New Republic,
>> documented two such cases, Dr. Arens; I will be happy to post the
>> information when I get home.  The claim is true.  I'd like to know what
>> your sources are, Dr. Arens - I think you, not I, need a chance to
>> redeem yourself - badly.
>
>"The claim is true"???  You claimed you "knew" of "numerous" such cases,
>and The New Republic is not exactly a neutral source with respect to
>Israel -- but no matter.  Let's see those two (2) cases.  Then we'll
>talk.
	
	This I find amusing.  In your above paragraph, you steadily lower
	the requirement to finding only one (1) example.  Now that Eric
	found one you require him to find 2 other.  Of course you probably
	don't count his example since the New Republic is "not exactly 
	neutral"  but somehow I expected you to discredit the source.

	Geoff

>--
>Yigal Arens
>USC/ISI                                                TV made me do it!
>arens@isi.edu


-- 
Email: gmeltzne@jarthur.claremont.edu            

A .sig?  A .sig? We don't need no stinkin' .sigs!
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Rosignolo)
Subject: Re: Homosexuality in Islam
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 22:37:20 GMT

In <18113@autodesk.COM> mickw@autodesk.com (Mick Washbrook) writes:

" We might as well ask straights to stop breeding. For all this talk of
" Islam and homosexuality, you still can't walk down the street in an Arab
" country without getting propositioned constantly. Jeez--I wish I had
" as much luck in the Castro. Time for a trip to Egypt, methinks.

   You probably mean Saudi Arabia, because I don't think Egypt is 
full of homosexuals despite that most Arabs think Westerners are too 
feminine to be considered men.

             _
 |\_________(@)= |CENSORED|    The above is fiction. I hope you enjoyed it!
   \_\  --/ _/                      
     \=====/       "wa lI qalamon  fI 'onmolI  'in hazaztohO            
        ||            famA  .duRunI   'aLA  'ahoZa   lmohaNadA
        ~~          'i_thA .sUla fawqa .Tirsi waq^o .sarIrihI
                     fa'iNa  .sulIla  lmashrafiYi  lahO  .sudA" 
                                           -- ibn Sana' Al-Mulk
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Subject: Re: Israeli soldiers kill Palestinian boy
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 21:47:07 GMT

In article <1992Dec13.060357.2435100@locus.com> jle@locus.com (John Elghani/10000000) writes:

>Do you think those people are throwing rocks out of joy?  Especially,
>since they know they could get shot and killed right before the
>rock lands.  IT IS FREEDOM FROM AN OPRESSOR- GOT IT?

How many times have we seen Arab mothers say that they are proud to
have borne children who will die in the name of the greater flory of
Allah?  Perhaps joy has something to do with it, after all.  

-- 
Jake Livni  jake@bony1.bony.com              10 years from now, George Bush will
American-Occupied New York                   have replaced Jimmy Carter as the
My opinions only - employer has no opinions. standard of a failed President.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: michaelp@ifi.uio.no (Michael Schalom Preminger)
Subject: Re: craziness and brotherly love
Organization: Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 17:28:51 GMT
Originator: michaelp@mead.ifi.uio.no


In article <1992Dec16.155607.23608@cs.brown.edu>, H.M. writes:
> [as always, posted without permission]
> [Israel Line 12-15-92 wries....]
> 
> [IL] Syrian Deputy President Says Yasser Arafat Lost his Sanity
> 
> [IL] Today's YEDIOT AHRONOT quotes the Italian newspaper "Il-Jiornale"
> [IL] which published an interview yesterday with Syrian Deputy President
> [IL] Abdel Halim Hadam, the man considered "number two" in Syria. Hadam
> [IL] said in the interview that he is convinced that PLO Chief Yasser
> [IL] Arafat has lost his sanity. "I have the impression, that following
> [IL] the plane accident, Arafat lost his sanity..." Hadam said that
> [IL] Arafat's claim that parts of the Golan Heights belong to the
> [IL] Palestinians constitutes the final proof of his madness.
> 
> OK, so we all knew Arafat was crazy a long time ago. But in yet
> another example of the deep love all Arabs feel for their fellow
> brethren we see that the final, unarguable, unrefutable proof of this
> fact was when Arafat declared that a part of land which Syria thinks
> belongs to Syria in fact belongs to the Palestinians. Hmmm.....
> 
> Mr.Hadam does not consider the PLO's claim that ALL of Israel belongs
> to the Palestinians as an indication of madness. But, the claim that a
> miniscule part of land which Syria does not even control belongs to
> the Palestinians surely is a sign of the unfortuneate deterioration of
> Yasser's mental state.
> 
> Makes you wonder, doesn't it? Does Syria really give two shits worth
> about Israel or the Palestinians? Or does Syria really only care about
> Syria? Hmmmm....
> 
> Harry.
Its probably the syrian oligarchy that really only cares about the syrian 
oligarchy.

Michael
From: revans@euclid.ucsd.edu (Ron Evans)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Practicing what is preached
Date: 15 Dec 92 04:14:41 GMT

><Bz8Gx7.I51@world.std.com> wmcguire@world.std.com (Wayne McGuire) writes:

>Personal abusiveness is considered one of the
>gravest sins among those who are interested in making this medium
>work and thrive.

Then later,

>There is a nice correlation between
>your exclamation points, uppercased shouts, and verbal filth and
>your inability to read English.
*****************
Today,

>To: Ron Evans
...
>(Wrt to your other message: if you are trying to suggest that my
>messages overall are as personally abusive as Mark Ira Kaufman's,
>you are really making quite a stretch, don't you think?)


	The title "Practicing what is preached" should make
	clear what I was trying to suggest.


-- 
Ron Evans (revans@math.ucsd.edu)
From: flax@frej.teknikum.uu.se (Jonas Flygare)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: : Homosexuality in Islam
Date: 14 Dec 1992 11:46:41 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Control and Systems, Teknikum, Uppsala
Distribution: world
Reply-To: flax@mizar.docs.uu.se
NNTP-Posting-Host: frej.teknikum.uu.se

In article <nabeel.724288533@oracle.sce.carleton.ca>, nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Rosignolo) writes:

|>   I do not know why he included the case of interracial marriages into
|> the discussion, but Lesbianism is threatening to the family, the society
|> cell that the society is interested in. It is not proper to raise
|> children with a single parent or no parents at all or other than the
|> parents. Lesbians must be bound to be constructive to the society they
|> live in. Sexual love should _all_ pour in one pot, the family (spouse)
|> not for every pedestrian or such.

|>   This is the sort of society religions approved. If you do not believe
|> in religions, live as you wish, but away from the bases of religion.
|> That is (may be one reason) why the punishment of homosexuality in
|> Islam (often death) seems too severe to atheists, but I think it is 
|> very lenient (but I condole myself that God will take care of them once
|> they die.)
|> 
|>   It is not that I am homophobic or something, on the contrary, I have
|> homosexual tendencies like everyone else, but I do not consider every
|> damn emotion I have, sexual or has to be carried out. Some emotions are
|> to be suppressed, e.g. fear (sometimes.)

I can see it now.. You die. You come to the gates of Heaven, only to find out
that God is a Big Black Lesbian, with an attitude.. :-)

Why is it that so many religious people take upon themselves to carry out
the 'will' of God? Yes, I have a firm belief, but I hesitate to call myself
christian. I embrace most of the traditional christian values, (it's wrong
to steal, etc. etc.) but I do believe that any punishment thieves get is
mainly to protect society. To lean on 'divine will' when meting out punish-
ment.. well hybris is _one_ word that comes to mind..

I think that religion can be a support to the individual in times of crisis,
but when you let your whole life be _determined_ by some claimed divine will,
you are treading dangerous ground. If I cannot bear to take responsibility 
for my _own_ actions, then how will I ever be able to face my Creator (if 
there is one) when I die? I will _not_ look up my actions in a _book_ even
if people _claim_ it was written by God himself. I must determine in my own 
heart if I do right. 

Sorry for the emotional outburst.. I tend to get that way when people say 
things like 'We should kill all X so they can recieve the judgement of God'
Yes! Help all weak and old people on their way! It's a crime to be ugly!
Outlaw beards! Decapitate anyone with pimples! Jihad! AIIIIGH!

/depressed..


--------------------------------------------------------
Jonas Flygare, 		+ Wherever you go, there you are
V{ktargatan 32 F:621	+
754 22 Uppsala, Sweden	+
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
From: bc744@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark Ira Kaufman)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: No Subject Line
Date: 18 Dec 1992 13:04:14 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


   I just LOVE the sophisticated name this guy uses.  If somebody
who has a strong bias against Israel wants to express his hostile
opinions, unfettered by any sort of objectivity, he knows that he
can be much more successful with the right name.  Of course, some
name like the 'Center For Policy Research' has got a nice ring to
it.  It sounds academic and objective.  It almost works.  The one
fly in the ointment is that, since this clown has NEVER posted an
opinion that wasn't negative towards Israel, and since real think
tanks that I have contacted have never heard of this 'center,' it
is kind of a joke.  It seems that this 'center' is really nothing
more than some guy with a computer and a hatred of Israel.  There
is no 'Center for Policy Research.'  But I like the name!  It's a
real high-falootin' label ya got there, partner. 

BTW, has any of your institution's battery of scholars(!) noticed
that there are some nasty things happening TO Israelis?  No?  Why
am I not surprised?  In any case, keep up the fine 'research!'

Xref: sparky talk.politics.mideast:23618 soc.culture.arabic:5727