From: pprior@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Paul A Prior)
Subject: Re: [M] Ozone in da Skimmer...
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 01:17:47 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.202152.486@cs.wisc.edu> rader@ssec.wisc.edu (Steve Rader) writes:
>
>tse@ra.nrl.navy.mil (Anthony Tse) writes:
>|> 	Well, I started to shot my mouth off about a year ago about this
>|> ozone in a skimmer BS and hardly anyone want to listen.  Now I think more
>|> and more people are against ozone. 
>
>
>|> My theory, ozone oxidize protein, so
>|> if you inject ozone into your protein skimmer, the water
>|> in your skimmer will have the lowest concentration of protein in your
>|> entire system.  Unless you tank is in really really bad shape, your
>|> skimmer won't be skimming anything with ozone.
>
>Huh?  If you inject ozone into a skimmer, you'll have the same
>concentration of protein, but you'll have smaller oxidized proteins.
>Smaller, more oxidized proteins are more hydrophyllic than larger 'ens
>and thus more likely to be skimmed out of the system. 

Hydrophillic compounds will NOT be skimmed out.  The basis of skimmer
function is that hydroPHOBIC compounds tend to collect on the -inside-
of the bubbles in the skimmer (so that they are "out" of the water)
and then they collect on the top and are pushed up.  If you make
more hydrophillic compounds they are skimmed LESS effeciently.


>
>Any comments from the organic-chem types?

Well, hate to brag, but I did score a 99.5 percentile on my MCAT
organic chemistry section.


'course I got a "C" in the class <SEG>



>
>|> I have a ozone
>|> generator, I used to use it on my Oceanic #4, my Oceanic #4 used to
>|> produce 1/4" of gunk every week before the ozone injection, the day
>|> I started ozone injection, no foam, none what so ever.  I called Oceanic
>|> and they said, that's typical, happen all the time.
>
>No suprise to me.  A shop owner I've known for a decade or so made three 
>important points when I raised your objections to ozone.  I think they
>are at the source of the misconceptions about ozone and ozone's "bad rap"...
>
>     1) When folks go from air to ozone injections in their skimmers, they
>	almost all ways inject much less volume of gasses into the 
>	skimmer.  Hence, they get less waste from their skimmers.

Well, I have experience the exact same phenomenon as Anthony (even a 
little ozone cuts back foam production almost to zero) and my
setup is exactly the same whether the ozone is turned on or off (the
air passes through my ozonizer always, whether it is turned on or off).
Thus the air flow is not a factor at least in my case.


>
>     2) The process of oxidation bleaches (brown) proteins so that
>	they appear transparent...  Just because the waste from a ozone driven
>	skimmer is clear doen't mean there is *less* protein in the waste.  To
>	the contrary, the smaller, oxidized proteins are more adpt to cling to
>	oxygen and thus more adpt to be expelled from the skimmer.

Your comment on color is true.  However, when my skimmer puts out "x" amount
of foam per day without ozone and x/10 with ozone, unless the organic
compound concentration is 10 times higher, it is lessening effeciency.
At least for me the drop in foam production is Dramatic, not just a little.
As for your assertion that smaller oxidized proteins are more likely to
"cling to oxygen," I see no scientific reason why that should be so.



>
>     3) Ozone generators built for aquaria make ozone by sparking electricty
>	across some contacts.  This design will inherently make the ozone
>	generator fail within 6 months as the contacts corrode.
>
The sanders series does need to be cleaned frequently (I cleaned mine
out about a month ago for the first time in over a year, and it had 
a bunch of oxidized gunk in it), but if we use a non-functioning
ozonizer as a control, then one should get the same production as 
without it, no more no less.


>These points seem reasonable to me.  But on the other hand, I've been able
>to maintain very good water quality (crystal water with < 2ppm nitrate) using
>a large skimmer, RO makeup water and an empty wet/dry on my bear-bottom reef.  

I think you've got a sound system there.


-- 
--------pprior@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu----(614) 621-8240----------------
Paul A. Prior    Ban anchors, not reef tanks    Nuke Gay Whales for Jesus  
3rd year medical student - Surgery Rotation		        
The Ohio State U. College of Medicine   Tobacco Kills- Please don't smoke!