From: c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: H. Ross Perot's proposed gas tax
Date: 7 Oct 92 15:18:56 GMT
Organization: Delco Electronics Corp.

In article <1992Oct7.131145.26473@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> whs70@dancer.uucp (22501-sohl) writes:
>>I hate to say this but the above statement is arrogant. It reminds me of
>>the 'let them eat cake' mentality... It's easy for us (computer types) to
>>go out and get a new car to avoid paying gas taxes; try convincing said
>>mall employe to buy a new car so that she'll spend the money on car 
>>payments and full insurance instead of gas... I.e. spend $400 a month to
>>save $50 a month... Great economics there.
>
>$400 a month with current borrowing rates for a 4 year loan will buy
>quite a bit of new car.  Additionally, there is always the used car market
>to get a car which still has considerable useful life to it AND which
>gets 30+ MPG.

$400 a month may not be a big amount of money for someone making $50K a year,
or a Dual Income family. $400 a month is right around half to a third
of the income of the kind of people I'm talking about. 

As for the used car market, for one people are holding more to their cars;
cars with good reliability and 30+mpg still command high prices, and 
used car loans are MUCH costlier for older used cars. 

Anyhow, if you can't see why the kind of people I'm talking about can not
afford $100/month extra, let alone $400 a month, a trip to an economically
depressed area of your state (newark?) would be sufficient. I bet you'll
find lots of new 30+mpg cars there...

>Question: Does Detroit (Michigan) still exempt "poor" people
>from emissions testing requirements?  Does any other state/locality
>have a similar exemption based on on individuals income?

When I was there (85-87) only the three county area had to do testing
(Wayne, Macomb, Oakland). Cars older than (I think) 1974 were outright
exempt, and then if your car failed, you only had to prove you spent
$80 to fix it. If, after $80, it did not pass, tough, you get the 
sticker anyway.

Of course the emission tests in Detroit were a joke to start with. Certain
cars (i.e I remember the Honda Prelude) simply could not pass just because
of the way the test instrumentation was made. Even if you took a 
brand new Prelude for testing it'd still flunk. 

The solution is what we (and everyone else) is working on, onboard diagnostics
with a standard interface which can produce real (i.e. while driving)
pollution values, not on a test stand. That's a couple of years away and
will be the next industry standard (OBD II). 

Coming from an industry that makes (among other things) pollution control
equipment, I have an interest in seeing all old cars off the road obviously.
The solution of the government of Greece (hmm ;-) for once a good idea) was
to offer pretty much excemption from a substanitial part of import duties
and taxes to any new car meeting 'clean' EEC standards. We're talking 
40% of the value of the car rebates there... The catch was that you turn 
your car in to your friendly government agency which in turn turns your
car into a cetchup container...

I'd favor this approach, i.e. some rebate from the government in the form
of some tax rebate IFF you turn in your clunker which in turn is pulverized.

Spiros












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-- 
Spiros Triantafyllopoulos                    c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com
Software Technology, Delco Electronics       striantafyll@kosds1.gm.hac.com
GM Hughes Electronics, Kokomo, IN 46904      [A Different Kind of Disclaimer]