From: morrow@fnalo.fnal.gov (Elmo the Stunt Elk)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Sandman Thoughts!!!
Date: 20 Jan 93 23:44:58 -0600
Organization: The Eekcidental Tourist
NNTP-Posting-Host: fnalo.fnal.gov

<U58505@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
> By the same token, are there any atheists out there who read Sandman?
> How do you feel about Gaiman "espousing" the existence of a supreme
> god like being by implication.

	Well, I'm currently a practicing antitheist (opposed to organized
religion [except for the Church of Peter David :-] ).  I was raised Catholic,
though.
	To me, the whole thing, -including God and Hell-, are mythological
constructs; I enjoy the stories Neil tells about mythologies I'm familiar
with as well as his own mythology.

> 1)  Were the Endless created by God directly or came into existence as a
>     side effect of his creations?  I'm under the impression that the
>     Endless weren't created directly but were a side effect of his
>     works.  The first created beings (with sentience) were the angels.
>     As soon as God created the first angel, the side effect of that one
>     act was all the Endless coming into existence.

	Thematically, Sandman breaks down to "All stories are true". 
Therefore, what you just said is right.  Gaiman has suggested quite
strongly that Death came into existence immediately after the first living
being, and that the others (save the eldest, Destiny) came into being after
that, as living beings began to be able to Dream, Destroy, etc.  (You might
want to think about why Desire and Delirium are twins, for example.)
	There is no such thing, in Sandman, as "objective" truth.  There
are just stories.  What you make of the stories is another story.  And all
stories are true.  Including all creation myths.  Including all seven
different ones in McKean's Cages #1.

> 2)  Who was the first angel?

	I don't know the traditional answer.  As far as "who's older,
Endless or Angels?", I suspect that Gaiman's answer is that the Endless
are, since the Christian mythology, which is true (all mythologies are
true), nonetheless depends on humanity telling their tales, and humanity is
quite young.  When -you- tell the story, though, the answer is quite
different.

> 3)  Dream tells Matthew that except for the creator, Lucifer is the most
>     powerful being in the universe.  So does this mean that the triumvirate
>     existed because Lucifer let it happen out of boredom?

	That is how I interpret Lucifer's comments in Season of Mists.

> Here's an interesting point about the Phantom Stranger that some of you
> may not know.

	[summarizing the Alan Moore story in Secret Origins 10.]
	Keep in mind that this is just one of the origins for the Stranger,
albeit the most popular.

> 1)  Lucifer acknowledging the power behind the mark of Cain.

	You can argue this point, but I tend to agree with you.

> 2)  Lucifer telling Dream that he quits as the Ruler of Hell.
>     I loved it when he thought he was defying God and then came to
>     realize it was all part of the great plan.  That would mean that
>     he's actually rebelling for the first time, I don't think God
>     saw that one coming.

	God's plan is ineffable.  Read _Good Omens_ :-)
-- 
"Confronted with a choice, the American people would choose the policeman's
truncheon over the anarchist's bomb."--Vice President Spiro Agnew
  
elmo (morrow@physics.rice.edu,morrow@fnal.fnal.gov)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc