From: hhd0@newshost.gte.com (Horace Dediu)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: New MBs
Date: 21 Aug 92 15:41:14 GMT
Organization: GTE Laboratories, Waltham, MA

In article <7740210@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM>, rjs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Bob Schneider) writes:
|> hhd0@newshost.gte.com (Horace Dediu) writes:
|> 
|> >The 500E is a specialty item, hand-built by Porsche under M-B supervision.  The
|> >motor is from Porsche (hmmm, it may be the same as the 928S plant). It's a very
|> >limited production only for the U.S. (power freak) market.  They did not do a
|> >shoddy job shoe-horning the motor in there, taking care of all safety and
|> >handling and balance problems that arose.
|> 
|> 	Where did you hear that the motor was from Porsche? Everything
|> 	I've read (Autoweek, etc.) has stated the it's the same 5.0l that
|> 	they use in the 500SL and the 500SEL. To be explicit, everything
|> 	I've read said that the motor is from Mercedes, not Porsche. Can
|> 	you provide a reference? I'll see if I can dig one up to prove
|> 	you wrong. I do recall reading that the 500E is assembled by
|> 	Porsche and that the body has to go on after the engine has been
|> 	placed on the chassis (won't fit the other way around).

You are absolutely right.  I was just thinking out loud.  I checked the statistics
and posted them already re. the 500E powerplant.  I am now wondering why they
use Porsche to assemble it?  Could it be simply that the M-B assembly plant is
not geared for the custom work required in the 500E?  I was at their Stuttgart
plant and they are geared for very efficient assembly with very high quality
control (countless checks along the way).  I guess they could not modify their
assembly techniques to accommodate the 500E, and so contracted Porsche to do it.
Any ideas?

|> >They have a 300 Cabriolet in Europe now.  Amazing what you can do with one
|> >chassis:  300E 2.6, 300E 2.5D, 300E, 400E, 500E, 300E 4MATIC, 300E wagon, 300E
|> >cabrio, 300CE...  "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."
|> 
|> 	Actually, that's a 300D, not a 300E 2.5D (although it does come
|> 	with a 2.5l diesel). Although MB is a gotten awfully flexible with
|> 	their naming conventions lately, I've never seen a diesel with an 
|> 	"E" designation anywhere on the car. The closest I've seen MB come 
|> 	to "stealth" badging is to something like "300D  turbo) on the
|> 	back of a 1987 300D (notice they left the word "diesel" off the
|> 	turbo designation, a deviation from the past although any MB fan
|> 	immediately knows that the "D" designation is for diesel and that
|> 	the only turbo's MB has on passenger cars are on diesels)
|> 
|> Bob Schneider     rjs@fc.hp.com

The 300 w/2.5D  has a different denomination in Europe (which confused me)  I
think it's called the 250D.  They european designations are strange:  190E 1.8,
190E 2.0, 230E (=US 190E 2.3--there is no 190E 2.6 that I have seen), 
260E (=US 300E 2.6), 250D (=US 300D).  The S classes are more or less the same,
but the common practice there is to remove all badges from the big M-B's (and
the small ones as well, but less common).  It's the ultimate "stealth"
badging--none at all.  In fact most people M-B's from the factory without
badges (unless it's the top of the line, where you would want to show off).  
The badges can be removed with a heat gun anyway, according to the factory
technician I talked to.

Also new is a 500SC and 600SC (coupe versions of the SEL models.)
-- 
Horace Dediu                                                  GTE Laboratories
(617) 466-4111                                                40 Sylvan Road
Internet: hdediu@gte.com                                      Waltham, MA 02254
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