From: raghavan@mth.msu.edu (K. N. Raghavan)
Subject: Re:More Information on Vivadi Ragas
Followup-To: Article by Krisha,K.
Summary: Clarifications/Corrections to Krishna's post
Keywords: Ganamurthy, 22 srutis, frequencies 32/27, 9/8, 10/9.  
Organization: Department of Mathematics, Michigan State University
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 92 02:44:17 GMT

This is in reply to the article "More information on vivadi ragas" 
by Krishna Kunchitapadam which appeared a few days ago on the net.
There were some points in that article which I did not agree with,
and  after having discussed them  with Krishna,  both of us have 
decided that it would be good to post corrections/clarifications to
those points in the above mentioned article.  And that is the purpose
of this post.   Please note, however, that I am writing this article
by myself;  so all opinions/errors are entirely mine.  If this article
seems a little too technical for your taste,  I recommend the conclusion 
at the end.


Point # 1:  Quote from the earlier article
-----------------------------------------------------------------
  Sruthi                    Notation F-ratio   Used in raga
-----------------------------------------------------------------
  Trisruthi Rishabha        ru r3    10/9      Bhairavi
  Chatusruthi Rishabha      re r4    9/8       Kalyani
  Sudha Gandhara            ga g1    32/27     Ganamurthy
       					       ^^^^^^^^^^^
  Komal Sadharana Gandhara                     Bhairavi
  Sadharana Gandhara        gi g2    6/5       Kharaharapriya
                                                               END Quote

It is incorrect that the frequency 32/27 is used in the raga Ganamurthy.
To be sure,  there are very strong and valid criticisms of claims
which say that such and such frequency is used in such and such raga.
But there does not seem to be any doubt that 32/27 in NOT used in
Ganamurthy.   This frequency is way too high for the Gandhara of
Ganamurthy and way too low for its Madhyama.  In other words,  even
a gross estimation of frequency is enough to show that 32/27 is not
used in Ganamurthy;  we are not talking about minute intervals here.


Now, the following question arises immediately:  Why is 32/27 called
Shuddha Gandhara then?    The only reasonable answer is that this is a
bad case of nomenclature.   The above table of frequencies and names
was taken from Samba-moorthy's "South Indian Music"  Book IV.  I do
not know if these names are Samba-moorthy's own creation or whether he
took it from someone else.   In any case,  it is very very misleading
to call 32/27 "Shuddha Gandhara".   It is better to refer to it only
by its other name (see table above), viz. "Komala Sadharana Gandhara".



POint # 2:   Quote from earlier article:
__________________________________________________________________
  Ekasruthi Dhaivatha       da d1    128/81    Saveri
  Dvisruthi Dhaivatha       di d2    8/5       Mayamalavagowla
  Trisruthi Dhaivatha       du d3    5/3       Kambhoji
  Chatusruthi Dhaivatha     de d4    27/16     Kalyani
  Sudha Nishada             na n1    16/9      Kanakangi
                                               ^^^^^^^^^
  Komal Kaisili Nishada                        Bhairavi
  Kaisiki Nishada           ni n2    9/5       Kharaharapriya
                                                              END quote


The correction here is similar to that raised in point # 1 above.
The frequency 16/9 is too high (even by a gross estimation) for the
nishada of Kanakangi and it is too low for the upper Shadja.  And
analogously,  it is better to use only the term "Komala Kaishiki Nishada"
for this frequency.   



Point # 3:  Quote from earlier article

>                 In  fact,  some  texts  on  Indian music, do not
>distinguish  between  Chatusruthi  Rishabha  and  Sudha  Gandhara
>(which  led to the same swara sthana for these two sruthis in the
>12-swara system).                                          END quote

This statement is misleading because the terms "Chatusruthi Rishabha"
and "Shuddha Gandhara" are used in different senses.  If, as the names
of frequencies in Samba-moorthy's table suggest,   these terms are
used respectively for frequencies 9/8 and 32/27,  then the above
statement is false.   No musicologist in his right mind would map these
frequencies to the same svara-sthana.   The correct interpretation of
the above statement is this:  the frequencies 10/9 and 9/8 which are
called (according to the table) "Trisruti Rishabha" and "Chatusruthi
Rishabha" respectively are mapped to the svara-sthana which is universally
(in Carnatic music) called "Chatusruti Rishabha/Shuddha Gandhara"
svara-sthana.   The frequencies  32/27  and  6/5 are both mapped to the
svara-sthana which universally (in Carnatic music) is called
"Sadharana Gandhara/Shatsruti Rishabha"  svara-sthana.


Point # 4 (In conclusion):

If all this clarification seems ever so confusing and not the least
bit of any practical use,  I can only say "Welcome to 22 srutis".
If I may be allowed a cynical statement,  our musicologists have
successfully disguised the fledgling nature of their so-called science
by the clever use of perfected tactics, not the least of which is using
the same label for ten different things,  so they can endlesslessly
clarify terminology without ever getting to the heart of the matter.

--Raghavan

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