HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kurt@cashew.asd.sgi.com (Kurt Akeley)
Subject: Re: Future development of PEX/PHIGS
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:05:06 GMT

-- 

In article <1992Aug18.182730.3478@dsd.es.com>, rthomson@mesa.dsd.es.com (Rich Thomson) writes:
|>
|> ...
|>
|> Under OpenGL, the same reformatting happens; you merely get what
|> language designers call "syntactic sugar" so that you can provide the
|> data in any datatype you wish.  However, at the core of all graphics
|> rendering today (at least the PEX/OpenGL type) is a graphics pipeline.
|> Data goes in one side and pixels come out the other (I'm
|> oversimplifying).  This pipeline is going to have its own natural data
|> format for the data that is the most efficient for its algorithms.
|> Your data will be reformatted to this internal representation.

Not so, at least on high-end machines.  Silicon Graphics machines such as
the GT, GTX, VGX, VGXT, and RealityEngine all have pipelines that accept
data in arbitrary formats and do the conversion with no performance loss.
To call this "syntactic sugar" is to call all of the pipeline operations,
such as matrix multiplication and texture mapping, syntactic sugar.  After
all, any of these operations can be performed by the CPU at reduced
performance.

The OpenGL X protocol allows servers to implement data conversion by
including separate tokens for all data types.  Thus, for example, the 24
OpenGL vertex commands (e.g. glVertex2i, glVertex3f, and glVertex4d)
all have their own tokens in the protocol.

|> >In PHIGS and PEXlib, data reformating is almost essential, it is ubiquitous.
|> 
|> PEXlib is not intended to be an API, but an SPI.  If you want the
|> same syntactic sugar that is provided in OpenGL, you can write a
|> toolkit on top of PEXlib that does this reformatting for you.

And you will pay the resulting performance penalties.  Performance is
maximized when low-level operations that can be performed by the graphics
pipeline ARE performed by the graphics pipeline.  When these capabilities
are not supported by the low-level protocol, toolkits cannot patch things
up without performance loss.

|> If possible, I recommend you get a PEX server from your workstation
|> vendor instead of the PEX-SI.  The SI is, after all, a Sample
|> Implementation, and can't be expected to run blazingly fast or provide a
|> gigantic feature set.

I guess I wouldn't consider the OpenGL feature set to be gigantic, but it is
large, and the OpenGL sample implementation includes all of it.

-- Kurt Akeley	    kurt@sgi.com  (415) 390-3612  M/S 7U-550
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: rthomson@mesa.dsd.es.com (Rich Thomson)
Subject: Re: Available PEX toolkits?
Reply-To: rthomson@dsd.es.com (Rich Thomson)
Organization: Design Systems Division, Evans & Sutherland, SLC, UT
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 17:26:03 GMT

In article <468@imp.diablery.10A.com>
	devil@diablery.10A.com (Gil Tene) writes:
>- Is there a PHIGS/PHIGS+ compatible library that interfaces to PEX 
>  (One that lets you simply link with working PHIGS code).

The PEX-SI includes a PHIGS/PHIGS-PLUS API.

>- Any other toolkits?

"Toolkits" is an over(ab)used term.  What kind of "toolkit" are you
looking for?

>- Are there any standards trends out there?

Again, this question is so vague that I don't know how to answer it.
Are you talking abotut X Consortium Standards, OSI/ANSI standards, or
"defacto" standards?

>- What is the "safest, most standard" toolkit to use on a long-lasting
>  project? 

I would guess that the "safest" toolkit to use would be one where you
have all the source code, since you are guaranteed access to the code.
Thus if you want to switch to a new platform, you can port the toolkit
if it isn't provided by the vendor of that platform.

>- What is the difference between a PEX library and a PEX toolkit?
>  (e.g. PEXlib vs. PEXtk)

PEXlib and PEXtk are both interfaces to the protocol, although PEXlib
is intentionally more protocol-specific than PEXtk.  PEXtk is another
API that generates the protocol.

>- Where is the best place to get up-to-date informations and
>  documentation on PEX related subjects?

This newsgroup is probably the best place; I'm pretty sure all the PEX
vendors read this newsgroup (and lots of others too).

						-- Rich
-- 
	Repeal the personal income tax; vote Libertarian in 1992.
Disclaimer: I speak for myself, except as noted; Copyright 1992 Rich Thomson
UUCP: ...!uunet!dsd.es.com!rthomson			Rich Thomson
Internet: rthomson@dsd.es.com	IRC: _Rich_		PEXt Programmer
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: rpimente@es.com (Richard Pimentel)
Subject: Time to put up or shut up
Keywords: benchmarks NCGA GPC
Reply-To: rpimente@es.com (Richard Pimentel)
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp., Salt Lake City, UT
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 17:22:00 GMT


I am sorry for dragging this discussion back from the technical and into
the inflamatory but I have reached the end of my patience. Read on.

FLAME ON

I, for one, am getting tried of all this discussion about who will be faster,
OpenGL vs. PEX. NCGA has spent a number of years developing a picture level
benchmark (PLB) for resolving these kinds of arguments. Both DEC and Evans &
Sutherland have faithfully reported their PEX performance numbers for all
five benchmarks over the past two years. Other vendors have reported their
benchmarks for PHIGS and their proprietary API's. 

But where is SGI?? For a company that has marketed themselves as the leader
in 3D graphics performance they are conspicuously absent. Not only do they
report performance numbers for only one out of the five benchmarks, they 
only give those numbers for their highest-end grahics accelerators.

And PLEEASSE!! No more complaining that the benchmarks are baised in favor of
PHIGS. We don't hear these complaints from IBM (who reports GL numbers) or HP
(who reports Starbase numbers). One can, after all, report both their PLB 
literal numbers AND their PLB optimized numbers.

SGI is a large profitable organization that clearly has the resources to 
generate PLB benchmark numbers. I suspect strongly that the only reason they
are not published is that they are not very good.

So SGI, if GL is so great where are your benchmark numbers? Where are your
Indigo numbers? Heck :-), for that matter, where are your OpenGL PLB
benchmark numbers?

As my mother always said, "The proof of the puddling is in the eating."

The ball is your court!


Richard Pimentel

P.S. I speak only for myself without my company's consent or knowledge.



Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: jarl@hsr.no (Jarl Haugland)
Subject: Future development of PEX/PHIGS
Organization: Rogaland University Centre
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 17:04:34 GMT

I have a couple of questions concerning what to expect from PEX and PHIGS
in the future (whitch in this case is within a year or two). I know that some
info is available in the PEX 6.0 specification papers, but I would appreciate
getting some more, bouth facts and rumours.

Interesting questions are:
  * When (if ever) will the official PHIGS version have support for
    immediate mode?
  * Will PEX/PHIGS support additional advanced graphical techniques like:
    - double buffering
    - texture mapping
    - antialiasing
    - etc....
    My understanding is that OpenGL will support many of these when it's
    available, so PEX/PHIGS will have to speed up to be into the race...

Finally, a different question. Is PEXIM publicly available (ftp'able)?
And if it is, then where?

-- 
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
/ Jarl Haugland                  | E-mail: jarl@hsr.no   | The cost of living \
/ Rogaland University Center     | Tlf:    +47-4-874432  | hasn't affected    \
/ Stavanger, NORWAY              | Fax:    +47-4-874300  | its popularity.    \
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
From: fellow@natinst.com (Osbert Tan)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
Subject: 3D Scanner -> Phigs diagram
Date: 17 Aug 92 19:22:47 GMT
Article-I.D.: natinst.1992Aug17.192247.936
Organization: National Instruments, Austin, TX

As a neophyte in the PHIGS world, I would like to know how people convert
data output from a 3D scanner (I have no idea what format they're in either)
to a form that can be drawn using PHIGS. Such that a solid object can be
modelled pretty easily on a graphics workstation. It will be beneficial to me 
if someone can share her/his experience in designing such interface/form of 
data format to be used by PHIGS. Any experience similar to the above mentioned
is also greatly appreciated.

thanks,

-Osbert
-- 
                                     _ _
---------------------------------ooo--U--ooo------------------------------------
fellow@cs.utexas.edu  Standard disclaimer applies. My opinions are, simply mine.
fellow@natinst.com            Down with racism. Down with imperialism.
From: evaleros@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu (Elsa S. Valeroso)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
Subject: PEXtk 1.0 Test Programs
Date: 20 Aug 92 18:21:31 GMT
Article-I.D.: uoft02.1992Aug20.132131.9585



	I have just compiled PEXtk Version 1.0 based on DEC Contrib PEXlib 5.0
	on one of our Sun SPARC station IPCs. I ftp'd the source code and the 
	library from export.lcs. 


	My question is: "When I execute any of the test programs, shouldn't the
	workstation be clear of any previous images drawn by a previous test 
	program? Whenever I try to execute the test program dtest, which is 
	supposed to read an .obj file and rotate it forever, the image from the
	previous position is never cleared before it is drawn again in a 
	different position. The resullt is a screen full of indistiguishable 
	objects.  clr_test, another test program, appears to be working 
	correctly when double buffering isn't specified.  However, when it is 
	specified, previous images are still displayed in addition to the 
	current one. It seems that the problem lies in the double-buffering. 
	Test programs which do not use double buffering seem to be working 
	fine.


	Could somebody please look into this? Please inform me if I need to
	include any other information in this request. I'm not sure if I
	mentioned all the pertinent details. 

	Thank you.

	-elsa
	
===============================================================================
+ Elsa S. Valeroso                   +                                        +
+ Dept of Computer Science and Eng'g +  evaleros@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu      +
+ 3052 South Engineering Bldg.       +  evaleros@maine.cse.utoledo.edu        +
+ The University of Toledo           +  evaleros@missouri.cse.utoledo.edu     +
+ Toledo, OH 43606.                  +  valeroso@uoftcse.cse.utoledo.edu      +
+ (419) 537 - 3556                   +                                        +
===============================================================================
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: cannon@ziggy.es.com (Gary Cannon)
Subject: Re: Future development of PEX/PHIGS
Reply-To: cannon@ziggy.es.com (Gary Cannon)
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp., Salt Lake City, UT
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 22:08:27 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.170434.18221@hsr.no>, jarl@hsr.no (Jarl Haugland) writes:
> I have a couple of questions concerning what to expect from PEX and PHIGS
> in the future (whitch in this case is within a year or two). I know that some
> info is available in the PEX 6.0 specification papers, but I would appreciate
> getting some more, bouth facts and rumours.
> 
> Interesting questions are:
>   * When (if ever) will the official PHIGS version have support for
>     immediate mode?

This is being worked on in ANSI by a subgroup of X3H3.1. The next meeting of
X3H3.1 is in Sept. and I will know more about the progress then. But in any case
this may take a while.

>   * Will PEX/PHIGS support additional advanced graphical techniques like:
>     - double buffering
>     - texture mapping
>     - antialiasing
>     - etc....

These items are being discussed by another subgroup of X3H3.1 but the approach to
providing these capabilities is probably through registration. This is hopefully
a much faster process.

In addition to these efforts, there will be a meeting of the PHIGS Rap. Group at
the next ISO SC24/WG2 meeting in mid Oct. This group will be discussing the start
of the PHIGS revision cycle which may (emphasis on may) bring in some of these
areas.

--
 ---		Gary G. Cannon
 ---		Evans & Sutherland
 ---		cannon@dsd.es.com
Xref: sparky comp.windows.x.pex:468 comp.graphics:8952
From: marrou@cs.ucf.edu (Lance R. Marrou)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex,comp.graphics
Subject: Re: 3D Scanner -> Phigs diagram
Date: 18 Aug 92 18:24:57 GMT
Organization: University of Central Florida

rthomson@mesa.dsd.es.com (Rich Thomson) writes:
** text deleted **

>I guess that depends on what you mean by "3D scanner".  CyberWare has
>a 3D scanner that outputs (x,y,z) vertices with (r,g,b) values at each
>vertex.  Such a dataset could be converted into a PHIGS structure
>using any of the following PHIGS-PLUS primitives:
** text deleted **

>						-- Rich
Are you sure that the CyberWare scanner maintains the rgb values as well
as the 3D data?  Also, to add, I believe the maximum scan lines
obtainable is 512x512 (horizontal x vertical, wrapped).
This is the only 3D "scanner" that I know about, are there any others?

--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Lance R. Marrou
   Work   - Marrou@IST.UCF.edu
   School - Marrou@Eola.cs.UCF.edu
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: rogerk@Veritas.COM (Roger B.A. Klorese)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Re: jump relocation out-of-range
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:25:53 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: VERITAS Software

In article <1992Aug19.125703.7774@cid.aes.doe.CA> afshwrh@cid.aes.doe.CA (Wayne Hodgins) writes:
>Hi
>
>When I attempt to compile & load the following code...
>
>#include <Xm/Xm.h>
>#include <X11/Intrinsic.h>
>#include <X11/StringDefs.h>
>#include <X11/Shell.h>
>.....
>	Widget toplevel;
>	XtAppContext app_context;
>.....
>        toplevel = XtAppInitialize(&app_context,"XText",NULL,
>                   0, &argc, argv, NULL, NULL, 0);
>.....
>
>I get this message from ld...
>
>/usr/lib/libX11.a(XlibInt.o): jump relocation out-of-range, bad object file prod
>uced, can't jump from 0x4d51e8 to 0x10048428 (syscall)
>
>The code loads fine as a standalone test program; the message occurs when
>I try to incorporate it into an existing larger program.
>Any ideas on what the problem may be?

Yes.

Somewhere, a symbol called "syscall" is being defined as a global data
variable; the loader is therefore attempting to place it at a data
address (0x10048428).  Somewhere else, such as in libc, a function called
"syscall" (a standard libc routine) is being called.  The linker can
resolve the symbol already, because of your data item, so it doesn't load in
the proper (function) "syscall."  But it can't jump to it, because the
difference in addresses is greater than that allowed for some jump types in
the (Mips?) architecture.

Search your code for a variable called "syscall" and rename it.

-- 
ROGER B.A. KLORESE                                             VERITAS Software
4800 Great America Parkway #420   Santa Clara, CA 95054    +1 408-727-1222 x310
rogerk@veritas.com                               {apple,pyramid}!veritas!rogerk
"Life turns on a dime." -- Ruth Ann
From: matt@tfs.com (Matthew Hom)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: How to simulate non-autorepeating keyboard?
Date: 20 Aug 92 21:24:55 GMT
Distribution: comp.windows.x.motif
Organization: TRW Financial Systems

My X server does not support any of the XKeyboardControl features.
I have tried disabling autorepeat via "xset r off" and although
xset returns 

Keyboard Control:
  auto repeat:  off    key click percent:  0    LED mask:  00000000
  auto repeating keys:  0000000000000000
                        0000000000000000
                        0000000000000000
                        0000000000000000

the autorepeat is still active. Is there a way an application can
grab the keyboard when a keypress occurs and ignore subsequent keypresses
until the keyrelease comes in? I haven't been able to get the right
sequence of calls to do the trick. Can someone send me some code that
does this?

Thanks.

+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| These opinions are my own and do not reflect those of my employer.    |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Matt Hom                              matt@tfs.com                    |
| TRW Financial Systems                 (310)590-7510                   |
| 200 Oceangate, Suite 1000                                             |
| Long Beach, CA 90802-4336                                             |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: baker@ctron.com (Lauren Baker)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Help on resources
Date: 20 Aug 92 23:07:42 GMT
Reply-To: baker@ctron.com (Lauren Baker)
Organization: Cabletron Systems Inc

I have been trying to remove the Motif frame from certain applications,
using the statement:

Mwm*xbiff*clientDecoration:		none

This works. My problem actually is I have a client name that
I got from xwininfo with a space in it, and when I put this
name in the place of xbiff above it doesn't work. I have verified
that this client does operate correctly if the resource is set
globally. 

Is there some particular way that a space in a client name should be
handled? And is there some better way than xwininfo to find a client
name (for example, xwininfo says xcalc's name is Calculator and I am
not sure this is correct). An xprop -id gives the same value.

Any help would be appreciated.
Lauren
From: adelt@imada.ou.dk (Adel Shavandi)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: icons for data structures and algorithms needed!
Summary: where can I find these icons ?
Keywords: specified icons needed
Date: 19 Aug 92 13:35:59 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Math. & Computer Science, Odense University, Denmark





Hello

Does somebody know where I can find icons for following subjects:

  a) Algorithms and Data Structures
  b) Stop
  c) Continue
  d) View
  e) Start
  f) Preferences
  g) Comparisons
  h) Visualization
  i) Cartoon/Animation



I will appraciate any help.




			Thanks in advance,
				Adel
From: goldman@kulkulkan.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Roy Goldman)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Bit Map Storing & Copying
Date: 21 Aug 92 20:33:29 GMT
Organization: University of California at Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: kulkulkan.cs.berkeley.edu

I am doing some cursor work, using XDrawLine to draw the actual
cursor.  I'm looking for a way to store the bit pattern at a location
before drawing the cursor, so I can restore the bit pattern when I
erase the cursor.  Does anyone have any ideas on how to do this?

(I'm currently using R4 but will soon upgrade to R5, if that makes a
difference)


Thanks for your help,

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Roy Goldman
goldman@cork.cs.berkeley.edu
Ensemble Research Group
From: pcb@gunfight.austin.ibm.com (Peter C. Bahrs)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Papers on X server porting?
Date: 13 Aug 92 20:06:48 GMT
Organization: *IX Open Systems, IBM Boca Raton

Can someone post or send references to papers/books on 
X server internals/porting?

Thanks for your time,
Peter

/*---------------Thanks in advance...----------------------------------+
x  Peter C. Bahrs            outside: pcb@gunfight.austin.ibm.com      x
x  IBM AIX R&D                        peterb@bcrvmpc1.vnet.ibm.com     x
x  Boca Raton, Florida        inside: bcrvmpc1(peterb)                 x
x                                     pcb@calrissian.bocaraton.ibm.com x
+---------------geaux cajuns!------------------------------------------*/
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: Mathias.Koerber@sniap.mchp.sni.de (Mathias Koerber)
Subject: XBell melodies ?
Reply-To: Mathias.Koerber@sniap.mchp.sni.de
Organization: Siemens Nixdorf Informationssysteme, AP 114
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 15:24:13 GMT

XBell can only soud a bell of one pitch and duration. It is however
possible to set the volume from -100 to 100 percent. This should
be usable to design a few distinguishable signals...

Maybe have a resource say:

Xclient*errorbell: R:2,-100:2,50:3,0:4,-50:5,-100:6,P:4

to
	R:2	repeat the following signal twice

	100:2	sound 3 XBell(display,100)
	50:3	sound 2 XBell(display,50)
	etc..

	P:3	pause for 3 ms

Has anyone already done this? if not, how would you implement this
(interpret the signal). What additional operators would you add?

curiously

Mathias
----
Mathias Koerber    | Tel: +49/89/636-45685 | Mathias.Koerber@sniap.mchp.sni.de
SNI AP 114         | Fax: +49/89/636-45860 | koerber.muc@sni.de
MchP/LZ Rm:L1562   | X.400:  C=DE/A=DBP/P=SNI-SMTP/O=de/OU1=sni/OU2=mchp/
Carl-Wery-Str. 22  |         OU3=sniap/S=Koerber/G=Mathias
D-8000 Muenchen 83 | X.400:  C=DE/A=DBP/P=SNI/O=SIEMENS NIXDORF/OU1=MUENCHEN/
(United!) Germany  |         OU2=P4/OU3=D5/OU4=AP11/S=KOERBER/G=MATHIAS
* Eifersucht ist eine Leidenschaft, die mit Eifer sucht was Leiden schafft *
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: bharper@cimlinc.uucp (Brett Harper)
Subject: How to get rasterized outline fonts in a window?
Organization: CIMLINC, Inc. - Engineering
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 16:55:40 GMT

I have a bit of a problem.  I would like to render outline style fonts 
to a window.  I have the rasterizer but have no efficient way to get
the resultant bitmap into the window.  How is this usually done?  
(BTW: The application makes HEAVY use of text.)

Does X11R5 provide a server side renderer that takes care of this problem?

If I need my application to still work on pre-R5 servers what do I do?


Any help would be most appreciated!

Thanks,
Brett Harper

brett.harper@cimlinc.com
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: Rosales@dsif.fee.unicamp.br
Subject: change colormap?
Organization: The Internet
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 15:33:04 GMT

Help!

I create my colormap wiht this code:
------------
	cms  = xv_create(0, CMS,
		CMS_TYPE, 	XV_STATIC_CMS,
		CMS_CONTROL_CMS,TRUE,
		CMS_SIZE, 	NUM_COLORS,
		NULL);
    
	initialize_colors(colors); /* RGB values */

	xv_set(cms, CMS_COLORS, colors, NULL);
  
	index_table = (unsigned long *)xv_get(cms, CMS_INDEX_TABLE);

	sc_display = (Display *) xv_get(Base_frame, XV_DISPLAY);
	sc_drawable = (Drawable) xv_get(Base_frame, XV_XID);
	sc_screen = (Xv_Screen) xv_get(Base_frame, XV_SCREEN);
	sc_screen_no = xv_get(sc_screen, SCREEN_NUMBER);

	gcvalues.function = GXcopy;
	gcvalues.fill_style = FillSolid;
	gcvaluemask = GCFunction | GCFillStyle; 

	sc_gc = XCreateGC(sc_display, sc_drawable, gcvaluemask, &gcvalues);

 ---------------
  I whant to change the RGB values in a colormap so my figure using this 
  colormap automatically change to the new colormap. I am sure that this is 
  quite simple, but I don't get it right now! 

  Any hints will be greatly appreciated!

  Please e-mail. Thanks in advance.

Environment:  SPARCstation 2 with SunOS 4.1.1
              OpenWindows version 3
              XView 3/ X11R5

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x,comp.windows.misc
From: rbraun@spdcc.com (Rich Braun)
Subject: X technical training
Organization: Kronos Inc., Waltham, Mass.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 22:38:29 GMT

I have an employee who is interested in an X/Motif training course
offered by Addison-Wesley's Technology Exchange Company.  The literature
cites course authors Wayne Dyksen and John Korb of Purdue University,
and course advisor Oliver Jones of Picturetel.

Since this is a high-priced 4-day course, before making a recommendation
on taking it I want references on this company and these course instructors.
A friend of mine who was involved in X implementation long ago says he
doesn't know who's who in the industry today, so I'm asking USENET.  Does
it make sense for a person to get introduced to X programming through
one of these intensive intro courses, or is there a better way?  Can the
course help to put a developer in touch with peers for ongoing assistance?

Please send email or post.

Thanks,
-rich
richb@kronos.com
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x