HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: Rubber Power Planes
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 20:00:43 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.094059.1@pa881a.inland.com> schiewer@pa881a.inland.com (Don Schiewer) writes:
>Sorry to use MODELS.RC for this post, but I'm not sure where
>to put it.

No problem.. rec.models.rc is a misnomer anyhow... us C/L and 
FF people post here all the time.

>I am looking for suggestions for which type of rubber power plane
>I should build first.  Are there any HP plotter plans out there?

I'm not too experienced with Indoor models, but I've been flying 
large all-sheet stick models (like a large Sleek Streek). I can 
get 1 minute+ flights outdoors, more with help. 

Get a copy of the SIG catalog (Montezuma, IA 50171) and a copy of 
the Peck Polymers catalog (I'll post the address when I find it).




-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: sringrose@galaxy.gov.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Another Fiberglassing Question....
Date: 17 Nov 92 16:09:58 -0800
Organization: BC Systems Corporation


  Sorry for the double post, I'm just an IBM mainframe weinie!

     Try using a spray adhesive (3m spray-77).  Spray a very light mist
on the cloth, just enough to give it some tack and then glass as usual.

Scott
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: miked@syscon.rn.com (Mike DeMetz)
Subject: Re: flight simulator
Organization: Syscon Corporate Headquarters - South Bend, IN USA
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 12:48:39 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Yes the Aerchopper has a glider which can be powered(short run) or
winched. You push a button to launch.
From: patpower@crchh458.bnr.ca (Patrick Power)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Gentle Lady building ???
Date: 15 Nov 92 20:15:04 GMT
Reply-To: patpower@crchh458.bnr.ca (Patrick Power)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Richardson, Tx

In article <1992Nov12.095555.1@pa881a.inland.com>, schiewer@pa881a.inland.com (Don Schiewer) writes:
|> I have just started building a Gentle Lady sailplane.
|> I have finished the tail section and I need to decide 
|> how to connect the control surfaces.  
|> 
|> Should I use a monokote hinge or mylar slots?
|> 
|> Also, I have heard that the wing on the GL can be weak.
|> The plans include an additional instructions which show how to
|> increase wing strength by adding more balsa strip to the
|> first 6 foils on top of the existing bass wood main spar.
|> 
|> Are there any other spots that need strength on the GL.
|> (I already added small triangular braces to the apex of
|> the LE of the stab.)
|>

      I am currently building a GL also.  I would appreciate if any
hints/tips/etc (specifically ones geared toward the aerodynamically-
challenged :)  )  would be posted here (no mail access).
 
|> Thanks
|> -- 
|> Don Schiewer   | Internet  schiewer@pa881a.inland.com    | Onward Great
|> Inland Steel   | UUCP:     !uucp!pa881a.inland!schiewer  | Stream...

      Thanks again



Pat Power
The Pride of Mesquite, TX.
From: sringrose@galaxy.gov.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Aileron/Elevator mixers?
Date: 17 Nov 92 14:18:03 -0800
Organization: BC Systems Corporation

In article <1992Nov13.164602.5291@informix.com>, robertw@informix.com (Robert Weinberg) writes:
> In article <1992Nov12.143318.1211@galaxy.gov.bc.ca> sringrose@galaxy.gov.bc.ca  
> writes:
> 
>>  Rob, I have to ask - why would you mix aileron/elevator?
> 
> I'm a novice at this stuff, but there are all kinds of mixing out there. Some  
> planes, like Klingberg wings, have no elevators (no tail at all). Even fairly  
> conventional planes are sometimes configured without an elevator on the tail.
> Instead, the elevator function is incorporated into the ailerons. These "elevons"   
> (elevator-ailerons) are structurally the same as ordinary ailerons, but move in two  
> different modes - they move in opposite directions, like standard ailerons, to roll  
> the plane, but also work together, moving in the same direction, to change the  
> pitch. This is accomplished either electronically or mechanically.
> 
> The pilot just uses his stick in the usual way, but either the radio or the plane  
> "mixes" the axes of the stick so that the pilot's operations get translated  
> properly into the two modes of motion in the elevons.
> 
> 
> 
> Rob
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: tse@ra.nrl.navy.mil (Anthony Tse)
Subject: Re: Another Fiberglassing Question....
Organization: Naval Research Lab, Washington, DC
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 21:07:20 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.152802.26427@rtsg.mot.com> svoboda@rtsg.mot.com (David Svoboda) writes:
>In article <1992Nov16.162843.26528@informix.com> robertw@informix.com (Robert Weinberg) writes:
>|
>|How do you make the fiberglass lay down nice and tight while the epoxy sets up?
>
>Use polyester resin instead?

   Is that really better?  I've done some fiberglassing with polyester
resin, you have about 10 minutes before the stuff become so cured that
you can't work it anymore.  I always thought epoxy (the kind for
fiberglassing, not the kind for glueing) is better, lighter (and more
expensive).  I knew a guy who built and sold model racing boat hull,
I think he put his glassed hull under heat lamp.

-Anthony

Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: lesnyd@monsanto.com (Larry E. Snyder)
Subject: Re: Skis & Cold weather running
Organization: DSC
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:27:36 GMT

In article <Bxz0qF.CGA@acsu.buffalo.edu>, v064myby@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Christophe J Quaranta) writes:
> 
> 
> 	As I live in cold & snowy western New York, I'm wondering if I could
> put skis on my pt40 trainer & fly it off of snow?
> 	Has anyone tried this? 
> 	Also what's the best way to keep the engine running in cold (10-20 
> degree) weather? I've heard various solutions involving hose clamps around
> the cylinder, adding gasoline to the fuel, etc.  
> 	Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> 				
> 							Latre,
> 							'Q'

Model Aviation (I think) had an article several years ago about making your
own skis for your RC plane. It was complete with plans and everything. Since
it only snows here once or twice a year it wasn't worth it. If you can find
an archive ov MA, try that.

Larry
From: dxk10@po.CWRU.Edu (David Kazdan Md)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Gentle Lady building ???
Date: 22 Nov 1992 00:56:18 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


Another stock gentle lady builder here...

I did use the Monokote (actually, Ultracote) hinge; my only
suggestion is to use a thicker spacer than the instructions suggest.

Vertical stab does need reinforcement.  When our GL (my wife and
I built and flew it) got caught downwind over trees and was forced
by inexperienced pilots into a graveyard spiral, the wings sheared
off and were stuck in the tree canopy (took us a while to spot
the wing up there).  The fuselage dived all the way down, maybe
80 feet, and did fine--just the rudder sheared off and had to
be re-glued.  We're just finishing covering a second wing...in
red this time, not green.

Keep us posted...

			73,

			David

-- 
David Kazdan, M.D., Ph.D                            dxk10@po.cwru.edu
Department of Anesthesiology, University Hospitals of Cleveland, Ohio
Amateur Radio:  AD8Y
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: moskowit@panix.com (Len Moskowitz)
Subject: Re: Another Fiberglassing Question....
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:38:14 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix & Internet, NYC

In article <92323.233606N42@psuvm.psu.edu> <N42@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:

>Again, use wax paper on the outer surface. It will not only produce a smooth
>surface but will help in holding down the cloth and give you the 
>opportunity(sp) to squish any excess epoxy out of the glass.  I define 
>excess epoxy as any
>amount of liquid that you can displace with a finger or roller>

Some wax papers will not allow the epoxy to cure properly and you'll
have an eternal gunk mess on your hands.  Use plastic wrap instead.

-- 
Len Moskowitz
moskowit@panix.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: dqwelch@sgidq4.sdrc.com (Mike Welch)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Torre Pines weekend of December 19th...
Date: 16 Nov 92 22:16:40 GMT
Organization: SDRC

I will be traveling on business to San Diego in December and will have Saturday
the 19th to play around.

I would like to visit the famous Torre Pine flying site while I there.  Is anyone
familar with the area.  I hear alot about it in model magazines.  The slopes we
fly in Ohio small in comparison.  I'm considering bringing a small sloper.

I assume there are restrictions on who can fly there.  I am an AMA member.  Do 
I need a local member to "sponsor" me, in order to fly a plane? 

Are there any scheduled events for that weekend?  What are the chance the site
will be flyable?

Any other comments would be welcomed.

Please e-mail your responses.  I do not receive this news group.

                                Thanks,

                                Mike

******************************************************************************
  Mike Welch                        *  "The more you read, 
  SDRC                              *   the more you'll know.
  2000 Eastman Drive                *   The more you learn,
  Milford, Ohio 45150               *   the more places you'll go." 
  Email: Mike.Welch@sdrc.com        *    - Theodor S. Geisel (Dr. Seuss)
******************************************************************************
From: eeak@teal.csn.org (Ed Krejcik)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Gentle Lady building ???
Date: 16 Nov 92 15:36:07 GMT
Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc.

In article <1992Nov13.194611.25492@nevada.edu> duncan@nevada.edu (DUNCAN R MCCOY) writes:
>
>I had a Gentle Lady, built "box stock"....
>
   I too built my Gentle Lady "stock".  MonoKote hinges and everything and
   it flew like a dream.  I've crashed it twice & fixed it and it still flies
   great.  I think you have to screw it up pretty bad to get it not to fly.
   
   The bottom line - I don't think any extra reinforcement would have done
   any good in the crashes (flying ability maybe).

   Have Fun - I think it's a great plane!!!
-- 
*** Ed Krejcik                  +--------------------------------------+  *** 
*** Precision Visuals, Inc.     | "Don`t be outraged, be outrageous!!" |  *** 
*** Boulder, CO                 +--------------------------------------+  ***
*** 303/530-9000      Email to: eeak@pvi.com          Disclaimer: mine... ***
From: stand@austin.ibm.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: re: new R/C car guy has problem, needs HELP!
Date: 18 Nov 92 21:34:01 GMT
Organization: IBM Austin
Originator: stand@stand.austin.ibm.com


I don't know anything about RC cars, I'm only a flying modeler, wet type
at that.  However, I do know that 29.695 MHZ is in the 10 meter amateur
radio band and you must hold an FCC Amateur License to operate that 
transmitter on that frequency.  If I remember right there are 10 meter
repeaters on that frequency or thereabouts.  You probably aren't going
to cause too much trouble there, but find a lot of trouble for yourself.
I haven't listened on 10 meters for awhile now and I think the activity
there is probably dropping due to the sun spot activity being on the down
side of the 10 year cycle.

Stan
N5CKQ
From: frankfx@volkswagon.EBay.Sun.COM (Joe Fenech)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Gentle Lady building
Date: 17 Nov 1992 21:05:38 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: frankfx@volkswagon.EBay.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: volkswagon.ebay.sun.com



I have a Gentle Lady that I have flown since July purely on
the slope. It has about 50 flights on it. I recently peeled the
Monocote of the wing to replace it with Econocote since landing
on sand has introduced to many patches on the wing. I found 2
breaks in the wing that I attribute to heavy diving and high 
wind climbs. I have also done at least a hundred loops with this
wing, some tighter and faster that others...

The leading edge balsa sheeting was broken between the 2nd and 3rd
inboard ribs in a symetrical fashion on the right and left. I assume
this was caused by flexing of the wing in loops and hard dives. I
doubled all the leading edge sheeting with 1/32 ' sheeting with the
grain perpendicular to the original sheeting. I applied this sheeting
between the ribs underneath the wing. I also epoxied the joint of the 
sheeting and the ribs. This should be a good reinforcement.

I also found the first two inboard ribs of the left polyheadral wing 
panel broken at the apex of the rib. They where broken on the grain. 
I probably could have felt this if I inspected carefully after flying.
This probably broke with wing flexing also. Recently I have been 
attempting to fly inverted and I suspect the abrupt roll outs and 
dives may have created stress and broke as described. To fix/prevent
this, I doubled the ribs on both sides in the areas mentioned with 1/32,
again perpendicular to the grain. 

I have since covered the wing and flow 5 times. All is back to normal.
These mods may be worth building into your wings.

I also echo the weakness of the tail expressed by others.

 
Joe 
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: eeak@teal.csn.org (Ed Krejcik)
Subject: Plane for .19 engine?
Keywords: Second plane, sport trainer
Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 21:22:16 GMT

Since I have lots of time to shop around (I haven't finished my EAGLE II yet),
I'm still trying to figure out a good plane for an old Enya .19 I have.

Does anybody know anything about the SIG Doubler II?  Its for a .15 size 
engine.  Looking at the box at my local hobby shop, it looks like a 
smaller version of the SIG Mid Star 40.  The Mid Star 40 gets great
reviews at my local flying field and from RCM.

Any input on the Doubler II or a better suggestion for a second plane
with a .19 size engine?

Thanks,




-- 
*** Ed Krejcik                  +--------------------------------------+  *** 
*** Precision Visuals, Inc.     | "Don`t be outraged, be outrageous!!" |  *** 
*** Boulder, CO                 +--------------------------------------+  ***
*** 303/530-9000      Email to: eeak@pvi.com          Disclaimer: mine... ***
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: mjalava@lk-hp-19.hut.fi (Mika Matti Jalava)
Subject: Re: Another Fiberglassing Question....
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 08:35:02 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.150104.29464@news.columbia.edu> liggio@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Vincent J. Liggio) writes:

>I used just regular rubbing alcohol, of 70% strength.  No special reagent
>grade (too expensive, and hard to find), but I suppose that it wouldn't
>hurt if you have it around.  I don't know if ethanol or any similar -ol
>would work.  Guess it depends on the chemistry of the epoxy.

At least here in Finland ipa (rubbing alcohol) is extremely easy to
find and CHEAP. We use it mixed with gasoline to make condensed water
to mix with it and prevent it from causing problems in the carburetor.
This fuel anti-freeze is usually 99 % ipa. Don't know if it is common
in warmer countries.

You can also use methanol to thin epoxy. Many modelers should have
access to that.

	Mika
From: patch@sequent.com (Pat Chewning)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Another Fiberglassing Question....
Date: 18 Nov 92 00:22:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Nov18.002234.2910
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.

>In article <1992Nov16.162843.26528@informix.com> robertw@informix.com (Robert Weinberg) writes:
>|
>|How do you make the fiberglass lay down nice and tight while the epoxy sets up?

One technique I have used is as follows:

	1) cut fiberglass cloth to approx size
	2) LIGHTLY spray 3M 77 contact adhesive on fuselage (or other piece).
	3) stick cloth down carefully.  You will not have another
	opportunity to move it once it touches the adhesive.
	4) Adhesive will hold the cloth in place over corners, etc.
	5) let dry
	6) apply thin epoxy or polyester resin, it will soak throught the
	cloth into the fuselage.
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: kelley@samwise.colorado.edu (Tim "Ditch Miester" Kelley)
Subject: Realistic P-40 Kit
Organization: Colorado Center for Astrodynamics Research
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 17:43:00 GMT

I am looking for a realistic kit for a P-40 preferred size 60
I have looked through the Royal and the other big names and 
cannot find any kits that are not foam -- which I do not want.
If any of you know where I can find a wood kit for a P-40
would you please contact me -- Tim Kelley -- kelley@sanddunes.scd.ucar.edu
From: sbixby@cup.portal.com (Steven W Bixby)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Another Fiberglassing Question....
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 09:46:21 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Nov16.162843.26528@informix.com>
  <1992Nov17.152802.26427@rtsg.mot.com>

>|How do you make the fiberglass lay down nice and tight while the epoxy
> sets up ?

>Use polyester resin instead?

YUCK! Not an option, IMHO.  :)

In my (limited) experience with glassing, the fiberglass cloth will lift
around corners because the cloth is too thick to go around the corner.  For
glassing a fuselage, especially one that isn't normally expected to be
glassed, 1/2 or 3/4 oz fiberglass will do well around the corners.  Also,
it always helps both aerodynamics and good looks, to round the corners well.

Alternatively, don't try to wrap the cloth around the corners - in the
instance of a four sided fuselage, use one strip for each side, with just
a little overlap for strength.  literally sand off the overlap.  I've
done this a couple of times with great results.  HOWEVER:

Can anyone comment on whether the strength factor diminishes greatly when
using multiple pieces of fiberglass on each side as opposed to wrapping
the glass 'round the corners????  Whaddya think?

As far as POLYYUCKSTER resin, it's unhealthy, relatively speaking.  It smells,
doesn't cure very well in thin layers, almost impossible to thin or clean
off with solvents, doesn't sand worth a sh*t.  All IMHO, of course.  Mileage
WILL vary, especially since I've used it numerous times in the past, before
"discovering" epoxy finishing resins.

			Dave Svoboda, Palatine, IL
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: svoboda@rtsg.mot.com (David Svoboda)
Subject: Re: Epoxy (sensitization)
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 05:19:46 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.165634.9963@dcdwest.uucp> plb@dcdwest.uucp (Phil Blais) writes:
|
|Epoxy sensitization is definately alive and well. 
|
|In conjunction with composite airplane construction and the resulting cases
|of epoxy sensitization a product known as SAF-T-POXY was developed
|specifically to minimize the sensitization risk. It is still in use and very
|popular with the EAA/homebuilt crowd.

Really?  That is VERY good to know.  Thanks.  My dad uses SAF-T-POXY, but
I never thought to question why he picked that particular brand.  I'll ask
next time I see him.

		Dave Svoboda, Palatine, IL
From: dbraun@cad636.intel.com (Doug Braun )
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Monokote Vs. Ultracote
Date: 24 Nov 92 02:41:45 GMT
Reply-To: user@machine.domain
Organization: Intel Design Technology


Hello,  I have a glider (Bobcat) whose wing I covered with
translucent yellow Monokote.  But when flying it in
a field with some prickly weeds, I kept getting rips and tears in
the covering on the bottom of the wing.  Actually, it was getting shredded.

My other glider (Oly 2) is covered with Ultracote, and I have never
seemed to have this problem, but I have not flown it at the same field.

So my question is:  Is Monokote basically more brittle than Ultracote?
It seems to me that Monokote is stiffer but more brittle, while Ultracote
is a bit more elastic but tear-resistant.  Opinions are invited.
It would seem that because of the camber, the upper wing surface
should have a stiffer covering to reduce warpage and twisting, while
the lower (flat) surface can have a more elastic covering.

Actually, if "Monokote vs. Ultracote vs. whatever" is not in the FAQs,
it should be.


-- 

 Doug Braun                         Intel Design Technology
                                    408 765-4279

 dbraun@scdt.intel.com

 or maybe:

  / decwrl \
  | hplabs |
 -| oliveb |- !intelca!mipos3!cadev6!dbraun
  | amd    |
  \ qantel /
From: JAW141@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Opinions wanted.
Date: 20 Nov 92 16:07:37 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

A friend of mine would like to get a nice remote control car for around a $100.
He was considering the Tyco Turbo Trax car.  Does anybody know anything good
or bad about this car we should consider or could you specifically recommend
something else.
Thanks a lot,
             Andy
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: long@ecs.comm.mot.com (Ralph Long)
Subject: Re: Conversion of radio to RS232
Organization: Motorola Worldwide Radio Products Group, Software Quality Assurance
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 21:44:21 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.080934.32734@kronos.com>, ed@kronos.com (Ed Baker) writes:
> 
> In article <1992Nov16.192827.6372@samba.oit.unc.edu> tracton@radonc.unc.edu
>  (Gregg Tracton) writes:
> >
> >Model Netters,
> >
> >Does anybody know how to convert a Futaba Attack-4 radio so that it
> >outputs RS232 in place of it's radio signal?
> 
> RS232 describes the physical method of sending digital data over a serial
> communications line; it does not prescribe the actual information being
> sent/received.  Questions of baud rate, character length, parity,
> character set, etc. must be addressed.  Then the format of the data must
> be described.
> 
> The radio outputs a variable resistance for each of it's channels.  This
> value must be measured and converted to digital format for transmission
> on the RS232 line.  A circuit could be built to accomplish this, but the
> interface requirements would have to be documented.
> 
> >Then, I could use it with a flight simulator.
> 
> If so, then you need to know the baud rate and protocol for the particular
> software package.
> 
I would suggest, given the nature of the question and the purpose stated that
there may be confusion here about whether an RS-232 standard interface is
actually called for or whether the simulator in question uses a RS-232
standard connector for connecting the control hardware.  Use of the connector
does not guarantee use of the RS-232 electrical standard and as indicated
above, use of the electrical standard does not provide any information on
how the digital information is actually formatted.

Ralph Long
Motorola, Inc
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: sysrick@noao.edu (Rick McGonegal)
Subject: Re: Conversion of radio to RS232
Organization: National Optical Astronomy Observatories, Tucson, AZ, USA
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 14:53:05 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.080934.32734@kronos.com> ed@kronos.com (Ed Baker) writes:
>In article <1992Nov16.192827.6372@samba.oit.unc.edu> tracton@radonc.unc.edu
> (Gregg Tracton) writes:
>>
>>Model Netters,
>>
>>Does anybody know how to convert a Futaba Attack-4 radio so that it
>>outputs RS232 in place of it's radio signal?
>
>RS232 describes the physical method of sending digital data over a serial
>communications line; it does not prescribe the actual information being
>sent/received.  Questions of baud rate, character length, parity,
>character set, etc. must be addressed.  Then the format of the data must
>be described.
>
>The radio outputs a variable resistance for each of it's channels.  This
>value must be measured and converted to digital format for transmission
>on the RS232 line.  A circuit could be built to accomplish this, but the
>interface requirements would have to be documented.
>
>>Then, I could use it with a flight simulator.
>
>If so, then you need to know the baud rate and protocol for the particular
>software package.

Although a relatively expensive way to do it the AeroChopper flight simulation
program includes a modified Futaba radio and interfaces to the computer through RS-232.

FWIW

rick

Newsgroups: rec.models.rc