HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: guay@fraser.sfu.ca (Theresa Delilah Guay)
Subject: Re: paranoia?
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 04:25:14 GMT

In article <91TJoB1w164w@penn.Gwinnett.COM> tdelaney@penn.Gwinnett.COM (ted delaney) writes:
>question (no wierd ramblings this time I promise)
>
>Do any rit-abuse survivors out there suffer paranoia?
>I have several folks lately tell me "Oh, your just being paranoid"....
>is it an 'ism' for survivors? (gee, am I being paranoid about being paranoid?
>(smile))
Yes I too get paranoid, though for a reason. The director of a local RA survivors organisaton has gone into hiding due to death threats and the organization has
shut down RA therapists are being harrased out here.

>
>just thought I would check out others observations, etc..
>anyone know of any books to recommend?

Breaking the Circle of Satanic Ritual Abuse is a very good book
From: tdelaney@penn.Gwinnett.COM (ted delaney)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Re; odd question & Sunday Night..
Date: 24 Jul 92 17:23:30 GMT

anon-1055@twwells.com (m&m) writes:

> Ted Delaney asks (paraphrased):
> > do all of MPD's go to same heaven or hell ?
> 
> Following is strictly my opinion & my own understanding of my spirituality.
> I enjoy discussing this kind of stuff but if you want to discuss it with me
> please use email.
        thanks for saying that...(about your opinion)
                much nice stuff deleted
       for me, I tend to be very shy/cautious wary of anyting religious (even
       CS Lewis...I guess I am afraid of being 'sucked back in' the the
       fundamentalist group I was a member of....sorry....but I don't think
       I can read them now (and I am taking a break from self-help/healing
       books....

> By the way I read Sunday night ramblings - a big ehug for any of you who want
> and will accept it.
thanks again.

Ted, and friends
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: anon-1012@twwells.com (All Me of Us)
Subject: Re: help
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com
X-Email-Accepted: yes
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 18:13:06 GMT

anon-1149 writes:
>I want to write so much but I'm afraid. I've seen what you do to
>people who aren't like you but I dont have anywhere else to turn.
>I want to imagine that I want friends and someone here with me so
>I won't be alone anymore but i know that's not true. This is why
>I'm different.  I don't want to get better.  I don't believe in
>better. All I do is sit here and moan about how much I hurt but I
>don't do anything about it. I talk about friends but every time I
>try to make friends I do something that makes them hate me. Its
>always been like this. No matter what I do I do something wrong.
>I've given up on believeing that I can do anything right.  I
>can't even manage to kill myself.  That's what i wish most of
>all. I wish that I was dead. It's all I have left to wish for.

Welcome.  You're in the right place.  I have been there too.
I'm not sure what I can say that might make you feel better,
but I desperately wish I could.  Your healing is up to you;
it's your decision what steps you want to take.  No one can
do it for you, but we can walk *with* you.  I'm glad you posted
what you did; it shows that at some level you do care about
yourself, and that's a good start.

Keep coming back; let us know how you're doing.  We care and
we listen.  It's hard for me to hear you being so hard on yourself,
and I know what it feels like, since I do so much of that to
myself.  It does get better, if you want it to.

Good luck,

All Me of Us





--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for a help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: bu850@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Karla M. Alwan)
Subject: Re: Varia
Reply-To: bu850@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Karla M. Alwan)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 16:53:11 GMT


In a previous article, anon-1159@twwells.com (Kristian) says:

[good stuff deleted]
>particularly exhibitionist and have never been much of a confider
>of personal things,  so  I  find it strange to feel a very urgent
>need to go over  and  over  what  happened  to me.  I do this for
>myself only when I am alone at home.  I have only told my partner
>the basic fact that I was  sexually  abused  as  a child and that
>a female was part of the abuse  (I have not indicated to him that
>there was incest).  He seems generally supportive  of  me  and is
>glad that I am in a group, but seems quite uncurious about any of
>what  happened.   I don't particularly want to give him  all  the
>gory details and I definitely don't want to turn him off  or bore
>him with a constant recital.  This "need" to go over every detail
>as if to confirm that it all happened is quite a drain on  energy
[good stuff deleted]


hmmmm...  seems to me that if he cares for you a lot, he would
be interested in hearing all the gory details.  I mean not that
it is pleasant, but...  Also, I mean if he is your lover, it
would be important for him to know how to go about things.  Maybe
if you gave him a copy of _Allies in Healing_ or let him scan
through _Courage to HEAL_ (have you heard of these books?) it
would lossen him up a little, and then you could talk with him
about it.   

I know it is hard though...  I hate telling my frends
about it.  I am afraid they will go away, and not want to be
with me if I go on about it.  So I guess what I try to do is to
tell them that I am afraid of that.  And then I have them
reassure me that when they get too overwhelmed by it all, they
will ask me to slow down, or stop...

It is hard though, I know...  I am always afraid they will not
tell me when to stop, and then they will get sick of me.  But,
I just have to remeber that they care for me.  And if they
are the kind of person I want as my friend, they won't go away for
something that isn't my fault...

That's all I can think of right now...

Take care...  *hugs* if you want them...

-Karla

>
>"Kristian"
>
>
>
>--
>To use this service, send EMAIL to:
>anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
>anon-help@twwells.com  -- for a help message
>anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
>anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
>anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
>

-- 
|alwan573@pirates.armstrong.edu   <=== USE THIS ONE!          
|Karla.Alwan@lambada.oit.unc.edu             |
|ng548@dsom_op.pnl.gov                       |
|bu850@cwns16.ins.cwru.edu                   |
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: kevin@kosman.uucp (Kevin O'Gorman)
Subject: Re: Looking
Organization: Vital Software Services, Oxnard, CA
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 15:39:56 GMT

anon-1130@twwells.com (starfish) writes:


>I am looking for some assistance. I want to find a 12 step program, in the
>SF Bay Area for sexual abuse survivors. I have no idea how to go about finding 
>one. Ideas? 

Survivors of Incest Anonymous (SIA) maintains a hotline at (301) 433-2365.
They can probably direct you to a local group.  You can also try AA in your
local area; they are usually in the phone book and as a courtesy to other
12-step programs usually will give out contact information to local intergroups
where there is one.  Therapists who deal with abuse issues also frequently
keep track of what meetings exist.

Good luck and e-hugs to you.
-- 
Kevin O'Gorman ( kevin@kosman.UUCP, kevin%kosman.uucp@nrc.com )
voice: 805-984-8042 Vital Computer Systems, 5115 Beachcomber, Oxnard, CA  93035
Non-Disclaimer: my boss is me, and he stands behind everything I say.
Organization: The American University - University Computing Center
Date: Tuesday, 28 Jul 1992 23:22:27 EDT
From: <KHEAD@auvm.american.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: "except at night"
 <1992Jul28.163341.21037@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>

Karla
regarding any ideas on what to do, I just want to say I don't
have any but I agree with you and I'm willing to help if I can.
As for protecting innocent fathers, I have a hard time swallowing
that line.  Perhaps I can't see it objectively, but I think the
chances of people lying about abuse are at most one in one thousand.
And 90 percent of those cases, a little investigating could flush
the truth out.  How many abusers are out there walking the streets
looking just like anybody?  They are not even worried, so smug
and confident that they covered their tracks well.  They
ought to be scared.  They sure ought to be.
From: bob@reed.edu (Robert Ankeney)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Varia follow-up
Date: 27 Jul 92 16:59:11 GMT
Organization: Reed College, Portland, Oregon


     I wish I had a clear answer for you.  I've been having a *lot* of
awful memories lately.  And part of me says "You're just making all of
this up".  I just take that to be my old denial talking.  I'd clearly
prefer that it never happened.  I'd almost prefer to believe I'm crazy.
Unfortunately, I don't believe I'm *that* creative.  And I've had dreams
with what turned out to be rather clear symbology prior to the memories.
Then I ask myself, could it be my unconscious creating fantasies like
dreams?  Perhaps to avoid *really* remembering my abuse?  Will I ever be
certain?  Despite pretty clear evidence I've found, I often doubt myself.
That's the nature of my denial.  What kept me alive all these years.  I
will say I have had memories that I now suspect are distortions that
served to *minimize* what actually happened.
     I wish I could give you a definitive answer.  All I know is that I
have clear emotional reactions and body memories to go along with these
memories.  They're real enough to me.  So whether the memories are real
or distortions or whatever, processing through my emotions about them
makes me feel stronger.  And for me, that's a major improvement.  I
don't know if I'll ever be completely satisfied about the accuracy of
my memories.  And I can live with that.  I'm frustrated.  Part of me
wishes someone would come forward and confirm everything.  And part of
me is so scared that might happen.
     Good luck, and welcome to the group!

     Take care,
     Robert

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Ankeney                 | "Yield and overcome.                |
...!tektronix!reed!bob         |  Bend and be straight.              |
...!tektronix!bob@reed.EDU     |  Empty and be full."    - Lao Tzu   |
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@milton.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: asar
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 15:50:48 GMT

welcome, anon-1160.  i hope this can be a safe place for you too.  the
frequently asked questions list for this group is due to be posted on friday.
i think there are some sections in there that you would find useful,
such as the section on cutting.  take care of yourself; i look forward to
hearing more from you soon.

-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: bu850@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Karla M. Alwan)
Subject: Re: asar
Reply-To: bu850@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Karla M. Alwan)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 20:34:09 GMT


In a previous article, anon-1160@twwells.com () says:

>
>I just had a hunge binge and threw up most of it.  WHen I realized I didn't
>throw up nearly enough of it but couldn't throw up any more, I started
>feeling desperate again.  I cut up my arm again.  Oh shit I can't stop.
>I thought maybe if I wrote this it would stop me long enough to make the
>feelings go away.  For now.  Sorry I am new and not sure what I am doing,
>plus when i am in states like this i really don't know.  sorry.

No reason to say sorry.  That's most of the reason asar is here:
to try to get out feelings...

*hugs*  if you want them...

Take care,
Karla.

>
>
>
>--
>To use this service, send EMAIL to:
>anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
>anon-help@twwells.com  -- for a help message
>anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
>anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
>anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
>

-- 
|alwan573@pirates.armstrong.edu   <=== USE THIS ONE!          
|Karla.Alwan@lambada.oit.unc.edu             |
|ng548@dsom_op.pnl.gov                       |
|bu850@cwns16.ins.cwru.edu                   |
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: holzman@fnalo.fnal.gov (Daniel B. Holzman)
Subject: Re: NEW & ALREADY DISAPPOINTED IN SAR
Organization: FERMILAB
Followup-To: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 23:31:47 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnalo.fnal.gov
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <Tanya_Davis.esh.qmail.slac.stanford.edu-180792095704
@tahiti.slac.stanford.edu>, 
Tanya_Davis.esh.qmail.slac.stanford.edu (Tanya Davis) writes:
> listen etc.  I haven't received any response, yet I have noticed that this
> category has an abundance of postings all the time.  So I wonder whether I
> got lost in the system -- again.  

Hi.  My name's Dan.  I can't speak for anyone else, but I haven't been able to
read the group in a while.

> crisis center that has this problem -- Why?  Is there anybody really out
> there?  So far I haven't found anyone.

I do in fact exist.
-- 
Daniel B. Holzman                    | Eight Words the Witch's Rede Fufill:
HOLZMAN@FNAL.BITNET                  | An It Harm None, Do What You Will
HOLZMAN@FNALC.FNAL.GOV.INTERNET      |
                                     | All Acts of Love and Pleasure are
Love doesn't subtract,               | Her Rituals
   it multiplies    - Heinlein       |
TEAM STAR Charter Member             | Speak the Word.
Disclaimer:  Fermilab's far too large to have an opinion, let alone mine.
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp)
Subject: Re: Looking
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 19:33:16 GMT

anon-1130@twwells.com (starfish) writes:

: I am looking for some assistance. I want to find a 12 step program, in the
: SF Bay Area for sexual abuse survivors. I have no idea how to go about finding 
: one. Ideas? 

You might want to try the local hospitals.  I had a friend who was looking for
the same thing out in Livermore, so I called all the local hospitals and asked
around.  I got a lot of good leads that way.

Good luck!
-- 
Ed Carp, N7EKG		erc@apple.com	<-- preferred email address!
"In wildness is the preservation of the world."  - Henry David Thoreau
** Member, Linux port team - uucp division ** :)   801/269-8125
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@milton.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: Hello, another first post
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:56:49 GMT

anon-1154@twwells.com writes:

>A netfriend of mine suggested I look in on this list awhile back.  I've been
>scanning now and then, working up the courage to post.  But it's hard.  I saw
>a therapist briefly when I was about 18 years old.  I was a newlywed at that
>time, and certain sexual activities would trigger anxiety attacks and feelings
>of revulsion.  My husband still insisted I perform these acts.  Right around

are you still married to this man?  if so, does he know how these things make
you feel?  to me, it would seem important to make sure he knows, and if he
still doesn't respect your wishes as to what happens with your body, then you
might consider getting him out of your life.

>that same time The Exorcist was playing, and we went to see it.  It really
>messed me up, and I was terrified of the dark.  This embarrassed me, but I
>struggled to maintain a normal facade.  About the only useful thing I learned
>in therapy was that (in my case) there were definite connections between
>my fear of the dark, fear of the devil, and my history of sexual mollestation.

[story of father's and grandfather's abuse, mother's and grandmother's denial
deleted.]

>Do you ever, ever get past it????.........

yeah, you do.  but it takes a while, and a lot of hard work, and difficult
conversations with other people, and sometimes re-structuring the way you see
the world.  but i get the feeling from the way you write that you will be able
to pull it off.  i'm confident that you will get better and happier.

>For now, just sign me - Chris

welcome, chris.  i hope that you can talk to us about things you need to
resolve, and i hope that we can provide for you some helpful insights into
them.
-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp)
Subject: Re: PBS documentary "Promise Not To Tell"
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 21:49:51 GMT

bu850@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Karla M. Alwan) writes:

: >Karla, it is now common practice in this country for women to accuse
: >the fathers of sexual abuse in separation proceedings.  During the
: >hate and pain involved in the separation, these accusations ruin
: >the relationship of the father with his children, often get the women
: >custody, and also hurt the father's relationship with the community.
: 
: I think this is very rare.  Far more often, someone that

Sorry to say, it isn't rare.  I have a close friend that has been accused
by his ex-wife of child abuse.

: is guilty, is set free, than someone wrongly convicted.  It is
: extremely difficult to fake child abuse.  IMHO it is very rare

Again, sorry to say, but this isn't accurate, either.  It's very easy to
fake child abuse if you know what you're doing, and it takes a very
perceptive investigator to find out the truth.  Even if the child is
abused, can it be proved that the accused (and not the accuser) did it?
It's very tough to prove without evidence that points conclusively at
the accused.

: that someone is wrongly convicted of child abuse, especially
: sexual abuse.  Most of the current laws do far more to protect the 
: accused, than the accuser...

That, too, is changing.  I can remember a time when a woman who had
accused a man of rape was put on trial herself - by the defense
attorney, by the press, and by the public.  Her past sexual history
was drug up, personal details were paraded before the jury and the
press, all in an attempt to discredit her.  Fortunately, that is
changing...

: It would be difficult to prove I had abused I child I didn't know.
: I think it is very difficult to convict someone innocent...

If I wanted to, I could frame someone else for child abuse.  You see,
the moment someone files a complaint against someone for child abuse,
the burden of proof is not on the accuser, but the accused.  You have to
prove you *didn't* do it, rather than your accuser to prove that you *did*.

If I called the Child Abuse Hotline and said, "I've seen Karla beating her
kids," you can bet your bottom dollar that Child Protective Services will be
out the next day to collect the kids.  Mind you, nothing has been proved,
only alleged.  I understand that that's the way it needs to be, but the
burded of proof would be on *you*...
-- 
Ed Carp, N7EKG     erc@apple.com                801/269-8125
"This is the final task I will ever give you, and it  goes  on  forever.   Act
happy, feel happy, be happy, without a reason in the world. Then you can love,
and do what you will."           -- Dan Millman, "Way Of The Peaceful Warrior"
From: Bede_Jarrow@hikssr.lib.purdue.edu (Lisa)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: thanks all; goodbye
Date: 30 Jul 92 19:54:23 GMT
Reply-To: Bede_Jarrow@hikssrv.lib.purdue.edu (Lisa)

I'd like to thank all who have responded to me and listened to me and given me
support.  I don't know what I would have done without this group.  I hope to
get back on eventually.  In the meantime, I will be in touch with some of you
via mail or phone, and cloister (jason) has offered to keep the group up to
date and psot for me.

I will check my e-mail one last time Fri. and possibly Sat.

take care of yourselves; lots of e-hugs to those who wish; best wishes in
healing!  I'm so glad this group exists!

Lisa
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@milton.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: advice needed
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 20:46:19 GMT

kara@BORN.phys.virginia.edu (Kara Jayne Keeter) writes:

>Now this weekend I am supposed to go see my mother.  I am not
>prepared to confront her about anything yet.  Like I said, at the
>wedding she tried to initiate a discussion herself, but I didn't
>feel ready.  I know the advice is to not confront until you are
>sure of your objectives, motives, expectations, etc... and I
>haven't gone through all that yet.  My question is, should I avoid
>any discussion of past abuse and/or old family secrets this
>weekend?  What should I do if my mom brings it up?

you should do whatever you're comfortable with doing.  you can always refuse to
talk about it.  something like "mom, i can't/won't/don't want to/am not ready
to talk about this right now.  i will let you know when i am."  i think that if
you are sure of what you want/don't want, and are willing to let people know
that you're going to be steadfast about it, they will relent and let you go at
your own pace.
-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
From: tdelaney@penn.Gwinnett.COM (ted delaney)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: paranoia?
Date: 30 Jul 92 00:14:00 GMT

nancy@genie.slhs.udel.edu (Nancy Lebovitz) writes:

> In article <91TJoB1w164w@penn.Gwinnett.COM> tdelaney@penn.Gwinnett.COM (ted d
> >question (no wierd ramblings this time I promise)
> >
> >Do any rit-abuse survivors out there suffer paranoia?
> 
> As for your particular case, I don't know what you've been saying that
> has led to people saying that you're paranoid. You might be factually
> correct and you might not. Check for evidence if it's something important
> to you. Ask the people who call you paranoid why they think so. (If they
> just seem to have a habit of denigrating inconvenient ideas and emotions,
> you might consider not talking to them about things that are important
> to you.) 

actually, it is a good friend that I discussed this with, he knows me/us, and
has for 11 years...(wow, that long)
I asked him point-blank, and he said yes, he thought I was, not obnoxiously so-

I tend,if confronted at work, or if I am noticed by a boss- to get very converned
/worried about what they think....stomach knots/fear/worry....this also happens
in other areas.....

thanks for the response.
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery