HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: yal@cltr.uq.oz.au (Yvette Lian)
Subject: Re: Femme/Butch in Bisexuality
Keywords: Femme Butch 
Organization: Centre for Language Teaching and Research, Uni of Queensland, AUSTRALIA.
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 10:22:41 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.180732.1318@rational.com> iw@Rational.COM (The_Virgin_Ho) writes:
> [Iseult's definition of femme and butch]

> So why I have told you all this? I would like to know if anybody out 
> there has thought about this in regard to themselves and their own 
> attractions. Do you maybe find butch women attractive and femme 
> men attractive? Or vice versa. Or do you find your own kind attrac
> tive, or the opposite. Does any of it even make any sense to you?

Well, everyone I know (from my queer circle of friends) thinks I'm butch...
but by their definition, I don't think I am.  I mean, I guess for the most
part I look pretty rough and at times, downright aggressive, but this isn't
necessarily what *I* call butch.  I think butch/femmeness is an attitude,
more than anything else, something which is reflected in one's actions and
mannerisms, speech, dress sense (to a certain extent)... 

By Iseult's definition, I am definitely butch.  But I still wouldn't call
myself butch, mostly because I define butch differently.... prime example:
A woman I spent a lot of time drooling over at this year's Pride festival -
she wore all black leather all the time, was covered in chains, had a
shaved head (mohawk style, it was just starting to grow back), and was very
muscly.  THAT'S what I call butch.  So by that definition, I am not butch
at all, however much others might think I am.  However, as far as lust is
concerned, I very much go for butch women... which is a bit strange really,
because my girlfriend is not butch at all. :)


> kd lang is definitely butch, so is Melissa Etheridge 

I'll say! *drooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool*
(although neither of these two cuties are anywhere near as butch as half of
the dykes living in West End... *sigh* to think it's just a 15 minute
drive, and me with no car...)


Cu later!

--
Yvette Lian
yal@lingua.cltr.uq.oz.au or s315948@parasol.cs.uq.oz.au (student account)
FIDO: 3:640/352 
IRC nick: Maxine2
From: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Teensy Weensy Virginities
Date: 12 Oct 1992 05:33:36 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Oct11.162830.23798@bas-a.bcc.ac.uk> SA121@phx.cam.ac.uk (Arrowsmith) writes:
->In article <1b7uvbINNi5b@agate.berkeley.edu> rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport) writes:

->much a case of having to draw a fairly arbitary line somewhere, one
->side of which you are virginal, and on the other deflowered; I think
->allowing as much flexibility as Roy is doing, however, makes the term
->somewhat useless.  

*grin* That's one of the points I was trying to make ... that in some ways,
it's rather utterly useless ...

I mean, hell, I suppose I was no longer really a virgin as of my second
night back in Berkeley when I kissed/hugged/bitten/slept with my first man
... (who's still my man :) ) ... there was no sex, but emotionally speaking,
it was a loss of virginity of sorts.

->(Oh, yes, I am one of that very few who is a complete and utter virgin
->wrt one gender, however you define it (-8 )  

Hmm ... have you never touched a person of that particular gender? Have you
never hugged a person of that gender?

->Basically -- does it really
->matter, particularly when there is liable to be confusion of terminology?

Exactly!! 

-- 
Roy S. Rapoport          rsr@soda.berkeley.edu            bdsm@ocf.berkeley.edu
    Sex is not the answer.  Sex is the question.  "*splutter* *choke* *gasp*
         *blink* Huh? Me? You _must_ be kidding" is the answer.
DISCLAIMER:  "I meant every word of it ... but nobody else did."
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: alan@osf.org (Alan Hamilton)
Subject: Re: Geraldo
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: 15 Oct 92 13:58:39

panda@Micor.OCUnix.on.ca (Elizabeth Holden) wrote:
> I've been meaning to post a note about the Geraldo programme for ages.  
> 
> (1) Tom [...] By deception, and mostly by cowardice, he has locked
> himself into a world where he lives without respecting his wife, finds
> no love in his mechanical affairs, lives in fear of disease, discovery
> and defamation....


> (3) Loraine didn't have much chance to say anything - G eraldo kept 
> cutting her off to speak to Tom or Jane.
> (5) Marie was embarrassing; one can't help feeling sympathy, but the 
> problem was not that her husband was bi, the problem was that her husband 
> was unfaithful and gave her AIDS.  Another deception.  Too many subjects 
> thrown into one pot.
> (6)  Geraldo seemed pretty arbitrary about what the subject *was*.  He's 
> a ditz!  NO wonder I never watch that show.

Talk show hosts are usually "pretty arbitrary about what the subject
is," unless you build a relationship with them, explain the various
side issues that are likely to come up, and get their help in heading
them off (or at least clearly identifying them as other issues.)

Jane was not very articulate.  Tom was almost completely inarticulate,
except for repeating "Bisexuality exists" over and over (it needs to
be said, but is not the *only thing.)  Still, Geraldo kept going back
to them, trying to dredge up embarrassing, juicy, sensational tidbits.
This is quite common.  If you are contemplating participating in a
media event, discuss *ahead of time*, with loved ones, with friends
and with the other people who will be on the show, what and how much
you are willing to reveal of your personal life on TV, radio, or
whatever.  In general, *don't* do this with the talk show producers,
as they are all too likely to have it brought up by the host during
the show, in an attempt to get you upset and increase the level of
sensationalism.

Tom's technique can be used to good effect, however.  Whenever the
host asks a question, you can answer the question you would like
her/him to have asked.  You can lead into other things more gently by
saying something like, "I am more interested in..." instead of leaving
people wondering if you are unable to follow the questions.  ;-)

-Alan
From: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Teensy Weensy Virginities
Date: 16 Oct 1992 08:53:12 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Oct15.121237.7019@micor.ocunix.on.ca> grinch@micor.ocunix.on.ca (Dave Ferguson) writes:
->Of course, it's still kind of difficult for a man to be anal passive with a
->female partner, so I guess I *was* distinguishing for that one...

Actually, not really, if you think about it ... it just means that your
female partner would be using something that she wasn't born with, and
doesn't have to lug around when she doesn't need it (I'll let Iseult or
Charles continue the thread, as they are much mroe equipped to handle it).

One of the things I think I've come to realize is that when it comes to
sex and genders, the sex of the victim/receiver matters, because there are
some things you'll _only_ be able to do to women, as there are some things
you'll only be able to do to men, but the gender of the person _doing_ those
things very very rarely matters, I think.

I'll have to think more about the subject, though.

*grin*

-- 
Roy S. Rapoport           rsr@soda.berkeley.edu            rsr@ocf.berkeley.edu
                   The few.  The proud.  The geeks.
DISCLAIMER:  "I meant every word of it ... but nobody else did."
From: woodhous@latcs3.lat.oz.au (Joe P Woodhouse)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Hello...[grin]
Keywords: hello...
Date: 7 Oct 92 17:47:21 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia

eec@leland.Stanford.EDU (Edie Cheng) writes:
>woodhous@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Joe P Woodhouse) writes:
>>dsuchy19@ursa.calvin.edu (Dawn Suchy) writes:

   Ah ha! I'm in the middle again, just like the other day during that
Poly-talk, eh? (nod to Nick - thank you *so* much for ytalk! 8->).


>>   ...Lovers posting to soc.bi about me! Whatever next? 8->
>zing!  bet you never expected to see me here.. :)  

   [thunderstruck]

   I don't know whether to crow from joy or die from embarassment! All
these people outing themselves! (ah, but a couple are still closeted 8-P).

   What can I say but "I loves ya's all!"? 8->

Joe.

  / Joe Woodhouse        / I'm just a sweet bisexual...   / Hello, there.
 / Latrobe University   /    (think - Rocky Horror)      / Threesomes are fun.
/ Melbourne, Australia / Music. Magic. Mathematics. Me. / I like cats! (miaow!)
From: sara@castle.ed.ac.uk (Swamp Thing)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Kilroy
Keywords: Kilroy woz ere
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:13:47 GMT
Organization: News Addicts

Well Kilroy woz ere and it went pretty damn well IMAO.  Sara the chicken
refused the opportunity to be on telly however many eminent Edinburgh
and ex-Edinburgh bisexuals appeared, I spotted our very own Bill,
Bethan, and Dave Berry, and the wonderful (tho unfortunately non-net)
Kate Fearnley and her wonderful Mum.  Then there was the one-and-only
Clive Grace, not officially an Edinburgh bisexual but apparently in
Edinburgh nearly as much as me.  Hell now I'm almost sure there were
others who we know and love but I can't for the life of me remember who
altho 'twas only this morning.

Anyway as young master Crowley said elsewhere the opposition probably
didn't really get a word in, but for a start there weren't enough of him
and for another thing he had no argument, except for the one that said
that God says it's unnatural, and the other one that said that *we*
don't have an argument ... (OK I know I wasn't there, that was a kind of
generic "we" ...)

And from what folk said about the Geraldo episode, I would say this was
probably more successful if anything because the arguments put were all
straight forward and not over-intellectualised; I really can't see it
going over the audience's head.  And I would be very interested to see
what effect it has on the amount of new people contacting support groups
and so forth in the UK. 

Sara
-- 
 >{8-)     Sara Hopkins     (-8}<              _____^__
 Geography Dept.  Edinburgh Uni.  Drummond St. \ OOO/ / The Thing
 Edinburgh,  EH8  9XP,  UK. +44 (0/31) 650 2662 \++/ /   From
 >{8-) sara@geovax.ed.ac.uk (-8}<   ** nice **   \/\/ The Swamp
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: h431@quads.uchicago.edu (heather e blair)
Subject: Re: being "in love"
Reply-To: h431@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 15:24:09 GMT

Thanks, everybody, your replies have all been wonderful.  This is
why I love the net.

But I wouldn't say I'm "in love" with the net :-)
-- 

- Heather Blair       h431@midway.uchicago.edu
From: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Two women please
Date: 14 Oct 92 18:57:06 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.1bhqi2INN36n
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Oct14.172037.28782@midway.uchicago.edu> orc@amber.uucp (David Parsons) writes:
->In article <1992Oct14.124615.203108@uctvax.uct.ac.za> krgjus01@uctvax.uct.ac.za dribbles:
->[Need we guess what the article was?  No, I think not...]
[David Parson's followup deleted]

     "Mommy, tell me a story..."

     "Fine ... what would you like me to tell you?"

     "Tell me the story of Orc!"

     "But you heard the story last night."

     "Again! *pout*"

     "Oh fine.  Once there was a group of people ... they were all generally
nice and gentle people, and also rather sick and perverted, like Tracy and I
... so you know they were generally good people.  They all communicated in
this group called soc.bi, which was this nice place where they could talk
and share experiences, and share both the happiness and the pain in their
life, and generally flirt with each other."

     "Wow ... sounds nice ... "

     "It was ... it was very nice, albeit a bit noisy from time to time.
Anyway, this was a nice place, but every once in a while someone would come
in who just utterly did not fit in, who was so utterly clueless, it was
almost, but not quite, funny.  The problem was, most of these people were
nice, and usually tried to avoid pouncing on the poor fool.  This could have
led these poor souls not get the message, if it wasn't for ... "

     "Orc!"

     "Yes, dear ... now lie back down *tucks*.  Orc was always there to let
the people know what he thought of them, in clear, succinct bursts of flame
... *fond look in her eyes* I remember those short articles ... the biting
sarcasm, culminating with his signature line, 'fuck you' ... *sigh* I
remember the articles I used to read, thinking "Oh my ... Orc's going to be
angry ... " ... the anticipation, the sitting on needles, until I saw Orc's
reply ... Ah, those were the days.  Now go to sleep, Teddie ... uncle Mike's
coming over tomorrow."


-------

Sorry ... I couldn't resist it :)

Thanks, David! :)

-- 
Roy S. Rapoport          rsr@soda.berkeley.edu            bdsm@ocf.berkeley.edu
                   The test results came back today ... 
                           I'm queer-positive ... 
DISCLAIMER:  "I meant every word of it ... but nobody else did."
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: mlloyd@westmark.Stanford.EDU (Mike Lloyd)
Subject: Re: two men (was: two women)
Organization: DSO, Stanford University
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 20:34:07 GMT

iw@tosser.Rational.COM (The_Devine_Dolly) writes:
: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport) writes:
: 
: >->>... (not to mention lesbians, and wouldn't we all just _love_ to
: >->>convert a lesbian? *groan*)
: 
: Oh but I have :-) <smirk>

OK, I'll bite (so to speak).  The begged question here is "What to"?
Are you claiming to have convincd her (them?!) that men have their uses
in certain circumstances, or rather that you convinced her of the joys of
forms of penetrative play she felt were unPC (in a Susie Sexpert kind of
sense)?

bemused flirts
Mike the inquisitive
-- 
Mike Lloyd, B0/1 h- f- t w- c g+ k+ s m- e? |"Bloody nose and burning eyes
      Retro-hippy, music nut, bi and        | Raised in laughter to the skies"
          backrubber of devotion            |     - Bruce Cockburn
 ....."I suffer from internalized homophonophobia"....."Their, they're".....
From: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Femme/Butch in Bisexuality
Date: 14 Oct 1992 03:52:54 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
Keywords: Femme Butch

In article <1992Oct14.003615.23226@cs.cornell.edu> borah@cs.cornell.edu (Vicki Borah) writes:
->I note with some amusement that although I am definitively femme, in
->looks and attitude, I enjoy dressing up in 'butch' clothes (ie
->tuxedo). However, I do it in a flashy, attention-getting way, thus
->fitting in with your femme definition. Guess I can't ever be butch
->after all....
->Hopelessly girlishly yours,
->Vicki

*tries to imagine Vicki in a tux, then decides it's a bad idea for his peace
of mind*

Dear, maybe you can be butch if you have a really really femme escort?

*smiles* Care for a volunteer? 

:)

-roy, who would look absolutely ridiculous in anything like a dress.


-- 
Roy S. Rapoport         rsr@soda.berkeley.edu          bi-bdsm@ocf.berkeley.edu
          I'm not gay but my boyfriend ... err, actually he's bi also.
DISCLAIMER:  "I meant every word of it ... but nobody else did."
From: ttk@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (the troglodyte killer)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Completely Missed a Slug
Date: 16 Oct 1992 20:54:14 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: ucscb.ucsc.edu


>>     *blush* (slurp!)
>>
>>     I think you got me here for good..  I like this newsgroup!
>>Definitely been having funky dreams since I started reading..
>>:-)  Not that I mind.
>>                                                      -- TTK
>>B0 f- t+ w- g k s- m+ r- p-(++)
>
>Boy I sure missed this one when it was orginally posted.
>Completely overlooked the address....its from Santa Cruz! Yea!
 
     'Twas wondering when I'd run into a fellow slug..  There're 
enough pink triangle pins here to make one feel out-of-place >not< 
wearing one.  ;-)
 
>Welcome TTK.   *nibble* *hugs* *kisses*
 
     >snuggle!< 
 
>Of course you are using the right computer system when your
>posting as compared to me who usually posts from cats because
>b is so fucking slow, which means I'm miss using University
>facilities.  Maybe I'll try and post this from b and see if
>it works.
 
     Also, neither gcc or cc are set up right on b system.  But I 
have the environment set up the way I like it anyway..  I'll just 
have to duck into si or am occasionaly to compile stuff.
 
>(part of the problem is I can't seem to set the term type right
>for using vi on this computer so I'm always totally lost.)
 
     I'm currently working on a wordstar-clone for people who hate 
the vi editor.  Work is slow but I'll email ya when it's finished.
In the meantime, when I want to reply to a post, I hit ^Z to put 
rn into the background, then edit the post on my own computer 
(using vde, an MS-DOS wordstar clone) and then upload it to 
"temp".  "fg" brings me back into rn, and then when I reply I type 
"temp" when Pnews prompts me for a prepared text file.  No vi 
required!
 
     I'm at Porter..  Howzabout you?
 
                                                      -- TTK
B0 f- t+ w- g k s- m+ r- p-(++)
From: fenthe@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Yet Another Demuffining(sp?)
Date: 9 Oct 92 18:42:58 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

In article <1b37ciINNdr0@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>, rlebeau@cats.ucsc.edu (Robert Charles Lebeau) writes:
> [ demuffinning ]

 Hi! Welcome to soc.bi!

> 		Hugs (in the tradition of soc.bi),

 **hugs'n'snuggles'n generally cuddly things**

-- 
Daniel Mitchell = Fenthe Marten = fenthe@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu =
m91djm@ecs.ox.ac.uk = dmitchell@cix.compulink.co.uk = bi furry juggler
Snailmail: 18, High St // Earls Colne // Essex CO6 2PA // ENGLAND
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: crj10@phx.cam.ac.uk (Clive Jones)
Subject: Re: Teensy Weensy Virginities
Telephone-Messages: +44 223 33 4900
Address: Christ's College, Cambridge CB2 3BU, ENGLAND.
Organization: 6am Digital Playground
X-Furry-Character: Gerald_Duck
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 23:08:07 GMT

In article <1b7uvbINNi5b@agate.berkeley.edu> rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport) writes:
>
>On tuesday I talked with one of my best friends who knew what had happened
>on saturday (in excruciating detail ... I was boasting :) ), and made a
>comment along the lines of "Well, I'm not a virgin anymore."  To which his
>response was "Err, yes you are."  We basically started discussing whether or
>not what I had done on saturday counted as sex, and this started me
>thinking (not something I do often enough :) ).

[Fx: long-suffering sigh]

YES - it's very difficult to know what counts as virginity, or loss
thereof, if one's even slightly open-minded about how to get one's
sexual kicks, and especially if one's not heterosexual (and
improvising a little! (-8 ).

I also came to the conclusion that virginity was a matter of degree.
For quite a long while I used to have to ask people what they meant by
virginity before I could say whether or not I was a virgin. Luckily,
it didn't exactly matter to me what labels people wanted to use -
virginity is a label, just like bisexual, and people should only use
it if they're comfortable with it.

--Clive.
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: gpb@gpb-mac. (greg berryman )
Subject: out (on the net)
Organization: SPS
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Distribution:  world
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 19:04:30 GMT

Well, there I was, trying to decide if I should come out ( at least on the
net).  I even added the triangle and Bear codes to the .Sig to see how 
they looked.

Then somebody asked a question in comp.misc and I posted an answer!  .Sig
and all.

So, here I am.  This group has been one of the most frendly places on the
net, so I think I really belong here.  << e-hugs >> to all.


--
These words, opinions and mistakes are mine alone... not Motorola's.
gpb@gpb-mac.sps.mot.com  ____     B0 f-- t g- k+ s m h- r p 
Greg Berryman            \  / 
Motorola Inc.             \/      Austin, Texas, USA
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid)
Subject: Re: explanation needed
Organization: Eris's Restaurant
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 09:20:46 GMT

In article <1992Oct8.060816.13492@scammell.ecos.tne.oz.au> rl@scammell.ecos.tne.oz.au (Raymond Lee) writes:
>Can somebody lighten me up what these symbols mean? I had
>puzzled for a loooonnnng time!!
>:  B0/1 h- f- t w- c g+ k+ s m- e? 

It translates (roughly) as: "Gee gollykins, wouldn't I just like to get
into this guy's Levis?"  But then, I have had the pleasure of meeting
him, albeit for one evening only.

Come back, Mike, I miss you.

				Kay
-- 
6'2", dark short hair, blue eyes, bisexual and horny as ....
Kay Dekker, Dept of Industrial Design, Coventry University, Coventry UK
37 Old Winnings Road, Keresley Village, Coventry   |B0 f t+ g++ k++! s+ e r p!
Phone: +44 203 838668 (work) +44 203 337865 (home) |Deflowerer-of-innocents
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: mlloyd@westmark.Stanford.EDU (Mike Lloyd)
Subject: Re: out (on the net)
Organization: DSO, Stanford University
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 20:02:31 GMT

gpb@gpb-mac. (greg berryman ) writes:
: Well, there I was, trying to decide if I should come out ( at least on the
: net).  I even added the triangle and Bear codes to the .Sig to see how 
: they looked.

Damn fine they look too .. (sounds of slurping over bearcode)

: Then somebody asked a question in comp.misc and I posted an answer!  .Sig
: and all.

Heehee - I did that once too, posted to local groups trying to sell a
hi-fi (sorely missed!).  None of the responders seemed to mind, or even
notice, but the eventual buyer and a friend of his probably figured it
out when he called unexpectedly and found me, rather dishevelled and
unwilling to let them in immediately (they went off for coffee), and
when they got back there was this other guy (now clothed!) sitting on my
bed ..  No eyelids batted.  I was impressed.  :-)

: So, here I am.  This group has been one of the most frendly places on the
: net, so I think I really belong here.  << e-hugs >> to all.

Indeed you are, indeed it is, and indeed you do!
<< e-hugs >> back!

Mike, considering declaring fluffy-war on Fenthe, but feeling this may
be rash :-)
-- 
Mike Lloyd, B0/1 h- f- t w- c g+ k+ s m- e? |"Bloody nose and burning eyes
      Retro-hippy, music nut, bi and        | Raised in laughter to the skies"
          backrubber of devotion            |     - Bruce Cockburn
 ....."I suffer from internalized homophonophobia"....."Their, they're".....
From: jsb16@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Jennifer S Broekman)
Subject: NY soc.bi dinner
Reply-To: jsb16@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (jenneke)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 22:10:46 GMT

Heya! This is to announce the second NYC soc.bi dinner, to take place this 
Friday at 7:30pm. Whether we eat Indian food uptown or Indian food downtown
hasn't been decided yet, so if you want to come, send me email saying which
you prefer. Directions to the restaurant we choose will be mailed to those 
sending me email.

-jenneke
jsb16@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu

My biggest budget problem is food:
My stomach wants four meals a day.
My budget wants two.
From: ngervae@next.com (Nik Gervae)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: I am not a bisexual!!!!
Date: 16 Oct 92 18:42:04 GMT

In article <Bw3toG.DoJ@cck.coventry.ac.uk> idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the  
Crisco Kid) writes:
- ObBi(ish)ness: if a transvestite is someone who enjoys wearing clothing
- traditionally ascribed to the "other" sex, presumably the non-TV people
- out there are cisvestites...

Chemists....  :-)

--
Nik Gervae
Software Publications	## S2/8bg+-l+y++-/:!z-n-++o-+/++:x-+:a++:u-+v+:j+-p(eR)
NeXT Computer, Inc.	## B2(go-t & sburns)f-tc-!g-(--)k--s---mr-p+
ngervae@next.com	## [[[[NXDisclaimer alloc] init] disclaim] free];
Newsgroups: soc.bi