From: whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Subject: Re: idiots with guns
Reply-To: whheydt@PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:23:33 GMT

In article <92Nov09.165851.25398@acs.ucalgary.ca> parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr) writes:
>In article <1de8siINNdnk@crcnis1.unl.edu> msb@hoss.unl.edu (micheal bloomberg) writes:
>>In <9211021750.AA23667@math.bu.edu> jeffs@math.bu.EDU (Jeff Suzuki) writes:
>
>>If local SCA groups gave constables a half hour or more of 
>>training every week they would be better trained than the vast majority
>>of security guards.
>
>This is what I would like to see...A small cadre of trained and
>useful Scadians capable of preventing minor problems, and
>practicing damage control in large ones. The key here is
>*trained*...How can I go about finding this training for
>myself and my fellow constables?

How small a cadre?  To run a 'normal' gate at a Western camping event
(from around noon to midnight on Friday and 8 am to 6 pm on Saturday)
requires 30 people in 2 hour shifts.  Some excess over the bare
minimum are specified to account for the more active arrival times.

This means that the Constable-in-Charge is looking for 30 volunteers
to be away from other activities during the event.  Now *add* to that
any additional security or fire safety activities that are needed....
Where are you going to find enough people who are also willing to
spend additional time being trained--and pay for that training?

>>However, security companies have very specific insurance and bonding require-
>>ments that would be very expensive to reproduce on a small scale.  By providing
>>training and whatnot, you would be implying that your security force was 
>>competent and professional.  You would open yourselves up to immense lawsuits.
>
>Hmmmm. I suspect it would be no worse than the liability of the
>Chirgeonate....

Governing and Policy Decision #11:

"Policy on First Aid at Events" (Aug. 1985)

"While organized first aid services are desireable at Society events,
the corporation may not be placed in the position of promising to
provide them.  Therefore, while Society branches are encouraged to
make every effort to have qualified volunteer first aid personnel
available, they are specifically prohibited from requiring the
presence of a medical officer at events, and from in any way implying
the Society's sponsorship of an event depends upon the prescence of
organized first aid services."

(Modulo my typing, that's the entire text of G&PD 11.)

If there existed a core group of formally trained security personnel,
I think you'd find an similar ruling put out covering them.  We really
are *not* in a position to promise some services--even where wo do
everything we can to provide them anyway.

	--Hal

        Hal Ravn, Province of the Mists, West Kingdom
        Wilson H. Heydt, Jr.,  Albany, CA 94706,  510/524-8321 (home)
-- 
Hal Heydt                    |    "Boycott Time-Warner"
Analyst, Pacific*Bell        |         --J. Danforth Quayle
510-823-5447                 |    "... kill all the lawyers."
whheydt@pbhya.PacBell.COM    |         --William Shakespeare
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