HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mermmzh@engvms.unl.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Sports News
Date: 13 Apr 92 01:49:56 GMT
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln



HOCKEY
======
Another good news for the Mohammedan fans.  MSC has become the unbeaten
champion in the first division hockey league this year ( after winning the
cricket league ). In the final match they beat Abahani 3-1. Pakistani
international Momtaz ( who played for Mohammedan this year) scored
the highest number of goals in the league. Last year Mohammedan and
Abahani were the joint champions.

FOOTBALL
========
Abahani won their 13th straight game in the first division football league 
by beating Agrani Bank 1-0. It was a tough game. So Abahani is still leading
the table with no loss of points. Mohammedan and Brother,s are following
Abahani. Each of them has already lost 3 points.

Abahani recruted another Russain player from Moscow's Torpedo club. He is
Alaxzendar Palincov. Torpedo club's Vice President is visiting Dhaka now.
He said that he wants to continue a friendly relationship with Abahani and
as a first step four Abahani players will go to Moscow to paly for  
Torpedo club after the Dhaka league is over. These 4 player will not be
able to play in the Russain national league, but they will play in the
local 1st division league as members of Torpedo club's 2nd team. These 
4 players are Ghaus,Masud rana, Mamun Joarder and Zakir.

The games of the 3rd group of Asain( under 16) football championship
will start on 1st May at Rajshahi stadium. The first game will be 
played between Bangladesh and Maldive. Other teams participating
are India,Pakistan,Nepal and Sri Lanka. In Bangladesh Rajshahi is the
first city outside Dhaka to host an international football tournament
recognized by FIFA. The champion of this group will go to Saudi Arabia
for the final round.

---Zakir

 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: mermmzh@engvms.unl.edu
Subject: Re: Bihari Massacre and 71 war
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln
Date: 8 Apr 92 14:01:17 CDT

In article <24350004@hpcc01.corp.hp.com>, syed@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Tanwir Syed-Mohammad) writes:

>  Here, I am not trying to justify the act of Pakistan Army since there
>  is no justification for that but I would like to know how you guys justify the
>  killing of Biharis in Santahar, Khulna, Rung Pur etc. during the nine months of
>  Bangla Liberation movement.  How you guys justify the one month of Bihari 
>  killing after 6 December.  Don't tell me that these were isolated incidents.
> 
>  Regards
>  Tanwir Syed

 

   I don't think anyone in the net is trying to justify the killing of
   innocent Biharis. Bengalis who killed INNOCENT Biharis should be
   punished also.

   From my personal experience and observations, I think the killings of 
   Biharis were isolated incidents. It was not in "hundred of thousands."
   Most of the Biharis( lot of them were born and brought up in Bangladesh),
   during that time, supported the killing of the Bengalis by Pakistani
   army. Some of them also took part in the killings by becoming members
   of Al-Badr. etc. Because of that most of the Bengalis were angry at
   them. But, I must say, that in any way does not justify the killings 
   of innocent Biharis ( whatever the number may be).
 

> 
>  "You are the winner therefore you are the good guys and loosers are evils.
>   Otherwise it might have been the other way around.  This is the way we
>   write the history. No one sees the crimes of a winner.  After victory
>   winner's crime becomes history of bravery and something to be proud of."
> 



  Bengali writers may be biased in their observations. But you are in
  America now and so you have a chance to read the books on 71-war
  written by international writers. You can also read the reports
  published by famous newspapers( like NY Times, Washington Post, etc.)
  during and after the war. These are available on microfilms in 
  almost all the libraries in U.S. I have tried to read all the materials
  available on 71-war at our university library. But I did'nt find anybody
  (outside Pakistan) mentioning the large scale killing of the Biharis.
  Of course there were reports(with pictures) on the killing of 4 non-
  Bengalis by Kader Siddiqi. Kader defended his action by saying that
  they were criminals not innocent. This should be investigated. U.S govt.
  was supporting Pakistan in 1971, so it is very unlikely that the reports
  of these newspapers were biased.

  If you know about any book or report ( By INTERNATIONAL writers),
  supporting your alligations, please let us know.

---Zakir
From: rahman@UTSTAT.TORONTO.EDU (Sheikh M. Rahman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Testing
         _______
Date: 15 Apr 92 12:23:00 GMT
Organization: Statistics, University of Toronto, Toronto


This is just a testing. Please ignore it. Thank you.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: ij21@vaxb.acs.unt.edu
Subject: Re: Hindu Muslim Contr.(was we need a..)
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 23:35:16 GMT


Regarding the topic of hindu muslim dialogue
============================================

	The articles posted on the above mentioned topic are interesting.
I lived in Delhi from 1984 to 1987 for my B.Comm and got a chance to obresve
the practice of secularism in India. I am going into deep details but the
summation of my observation is that the religious fanatics are the ones who
make a big issue out of the Hindu Muslim controversies, not the general public.
Just another comment. We do not have such problems in Bangladesh. Why in India?
From: s0k5099@zeus.tamu.edu (KHAN, SHAHRIAR)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: Zero
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:46:00 GMT
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

>(Please do not be sensitive about the use of the term "India":
>the discussion is about times long ago...)
> 
>MI:
>>>>		" Zero was introduced by the Arabs...
> 
>AT:
>>>No it wasn't, except to Eurocentric minds. It has long been known and
>>>accepted that zero was invented by Indians; 
>Modern number system was developed, and Zero invented, in India.
>It is the Europeans who confused the issue....

	Yeah right. The Chinese might even claim that the radio, television,
radar, and the internal combustion engine were invented by Chairman Mao Tse 
Tung. It is conspiracy by Imperialist Capitalists which has attempted for 
decades to cover this widely accepted truth.

	The wheel was invented by a Bangladeshi (or some ancestor of his), 
and fire was discovered by his pasher geraamer morol shaheb.

Shahriar 
Texas A&M University
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: naeem@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Naeem Mohaiemen)
Subject: Re: Bihari Massacre and 71 war
Organization: Oberlin College Computer Science
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 04:22:14 GMT

In article <24350004@hpcc01.corp.hp.com> syed@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Tanwir Syed-Mohammad) writes:

			
    The only reason I am posting this article is to know how you guys are 
    justifying the killing of hundred of thousands of Biharis during the
    celebration of independence.
-----
To my memory, no Bengali on scb has EVER tried to justify the killings of the
Biharis. The reason they are mentioned infrequently is because we are FIRST
and foremost concerned with the injustice done to our people. 

I am not trying to justify the actions against Biharis, but 3 million 
Bengalis were killed, how many Biharis were killed? Numbers do not trivialize
the atrocious murder of a Bihari, but they do give an indication of whether
it was a widespread phenomenon in 1971.



     And lastly to Mr. Naeem, Wasi, Zunaid and others - while you are
    condemning the act of Pakistan Army, and do count me in, also do a justice
    to those innocent Biharis got killed by your heroes.  Don't pretend that
								^^^^^^^
    nothing happened to Non-Bengalis before and after independence.  
-----------

I have never pretended that Biharis were not killed. Neither to my knowledge 
have any of the other Bengalis mentioned.

--
Naeem Mohaiemen  naeem@occs.cs.oberlin.edu  snm8696@oberlin  216-774-1993
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"This is a [war] between the pure and the impure"
	[Pakistani army officer, quoted in Maj. Rofiqul Islam's compilation]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: bhatnagr@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Raj Bhatnagar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: We Need A Hindu-Muslim Dialog (Was: Re: Muslim situation in India)
Date: 14 Apr 92 19:50:42 GMT
Organization: Univ. of Cincinnati

In article <1992Apr14.041325.21024@cs.yale.edu> ahmed-shakil@CS.YALE.EDU (Shakil Waiz Ahmed) writes:
>
>In article <1992Apr14.024922.12777@midway.uchicago.edu>, trivedi@curie.uchicago.edu (Anil Trivedi) writes:
>
>
>Well, it *is* relevant since they invaded the very "motherland" your
>refer to.  Since there are various parties who invaded your
>"motherland," it does not make sense to point fingers at the Muslims.
>Indeed, your very concept of "motherland" is shaky.
>

The theory of Aryan invasion is at best only a "theory" wihtout any
convincing proof. All existing literary and historical works of ancient
India never mention any migration from anywhere, and rather are full of
conflicts with people from outside India and expansion of Indian empires
outward from the Gangetic and Indus valleys. It was in these valleys
that the Indian civilization germinated and took root and then expanded
outwards. 

The present day Muslims of Indian subcontinent, are almost
completely descendents of the same stock of people who lived as Hindus
in India before the philosophy of Islam came to India. And yes, the 
philosophy of Islam did come from outside India as opposed to the native
indian philosophies.

So the Indian philosophies are native to the land, Islam is an import,
and the people are all the same stock. Islam being an import does not
mean I am making a good or bad judgement. We should retain good things
from all directions and discard bad things as the needs and times change.


> A factfinding committee of Hindu historians declared all
>BJP claims on the Babri Masjid null and void, and yet they are still
>pursuing the matter.  Why?  

What was this imaginary fact-finding committee? To be precise,
there is sufficient evidence that there was a temple at the site
of RJB before the mosque structure came but what can not be proved
is that Ram was actually born at this particular site. that can not
be done for Christ, Muhammad, Buddha, Alexander, or any one that long
ago. What is important is that there was a temple at the site.





>-- Shakil



---raj
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: sahmed@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Saif Ahmed)
Subject: Re: Bihari Massacre and 71 war
Organization: Oberlin College Computer Science
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 17:43:00 GMT

Isn't Kader Siddiqui wanted for treason?? Or am I mistaken.

Saif
--
===========================================================================

Saifuddin Ahmed
sahmed@occs.cs.oberlin.edu
(216) 775-5807

===========================================================================
From: naeem@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Naeem Mohaiemen)
Subject: Bihari killings
Organization: Oberlin College Computer Science
	<s0sovINNseb@matt.ksu.ksu.edu> <1992Apr9.185413.1@engvms.unl.edu>
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 04:39:06 GMT

In article <1992Apr9.185413.1@engvms.unl.edu> mermmzh@engvms.unl.edu writes:
     					 Since Bangladesh's liberation war
     were supported by the erstwile U.S.S.R and the eastern block, there
     was no reason for the American press to conceal the news of MASS SCALE
     Bihari killing, If it really happend. 
--------

However, it is true that, from 26th March all foreign journalists were
forced out of the country by Pakistan govt. Main source for info was refugees
in India. This information was disseminated by Indian press, Mujibnagar govt
in exile in India, govt in exile reps in London and Bangladeshis in London.
So a Pakistani critic could plausibly argue that the primary sources of
information may have supressed news [On the other hand, American intelligence
agencies had a lot of info that they supressed, one would assume this was
because it would not have lent support to Nixon's agenda.]
Other points that can be brought up are:
	i)Bengali population in cities, esp. Dhaka, were mostly on defensive,
too busy running to attck Biharis. This situation changed rapidly in the last
days of war and aftermath. But then Kader Siddiqui's publicity stunt forced
Mujib to intervene.
	ii)For most of the period, Bengalis living in areas with heavy Bihari
population were not in positions of power, so that attacking Biharis would 
be last thing they would do, given they were living out in open and any such
attack would result in en masse recrimination.

Note, I am raising some issues, I am not denying that some killings of Biharis
took place. I give credence to figures published by independent sources. 


--
Naeem Mohaiemen  naeem@occs.cs.oberlin.edu  snm8696@oberlin  216-774-1993
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"This is a [war] between the pure and the impure"
	[Pakistani army officer, quoted in Maj. Rofiqul Islam's compilation]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: tun@PHY.UCSF.EDU
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: comment on propaganda from Burmese Junta
Date: 13 Apr 92 23:26:13 GMT


  >From: Soe Myint Aung <ap38@UMD5.UMD.EDU>
  >Subject: Bangladesh: 4 tribal rebels killed
  >X-To: seasia-l@msu.edu
  >To: Multiple recipients of list SEASIA-L
  <SEASIA-L%MSU.BITNET@pucc.Princeton.EDU>

  >"Four Bangladesh tribal rebels killed."
  >
  >Chittagong, 31 March -- Bangladesh troops killed four tribal rebels in
  >a raid on their jungle camp in southeastern Bangladesh on Monday, defence
  >sources said.
  >
  >Troops overran the camp at Basantipara Village in Chittagong Hill Tracts
  >after nearly an hour of fighting with heavily armed Shanti Bahini (Peace
  >Force) guerillas, they said.
  >
  >The Shantis began their insurgency in 1973 after Bangladesh rejected
  >their demand for autonomy for the 5,500 square mile hill tracts.[MNA/Reuter]
   --------------------------------------------------------------------
  >"Pakistan builds wall to stop Kashmiris"
  >
  >Chakothi(Pakistan), 31 March -- Pakistani security forces were furiously
  >building a stone barrier on Monday to halt Muslim militants bent on
  >storming the ceasefire line dividing Pakistani from Indian-ruled Kashmir.

  >   A sea of paramilitary troops wearing blue helmets and riot gear stood
  >behind coils of barbed wire about 1.5 miles short of Chakothi and the
  >Indian-defended ceasefire line. [MNA/Reuter]

|From: hassan@cup.portal.com (hassan monu alam)
|Subject: Re: More Propaganda from the Burmese Junta
|Message-ID: <57277@cup.portal.com>
|Date: 12 Apr 92 00:10:27 GMT

|Looks like our favorite Burmese decided that offence was the best defense.
|He seems lump Pakistan and Bangladesh as one, not realizing we let
|Punjab, Sind, Balauchistan, NWFP and Kashmir secede the union in 1971.
|(How can the majority secede :-).

I concur.  Mr. Soe Myint Aung is totally brain-dead, brain-washed and/or
clueless!!! Posting PRO-SLORC materials is enough to prove the point.

Coban Tun
Burma Foundation
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: trivedi@curie.uchicago.edu (Anil Trivedi)
Subject: Re: We Need A Hindu-Muslim Dialog (Was: Re: Muslim situation in India)
Organization: Enrico Fermi Institute, University of Chicago.
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 21:48:25 GMT

In article <1992Apr11.205003.20390@cs.yale.edu> ahmed-shakil@CS.YALE.EDU (Shakil Waiz Ahmed) writes:
>
>In article <1992Apr11.190108.20809@midway.uchicago.edu>, trivedi@curie.uchicago.edu (Anil Trivedi) writes:
>
>[Much gas deleted]
>
>> [My "tit for tat" comments here, as they are in response to someone
>> else's point-scoring speech, do not constitute a balanced exposition
>> of my views. BUT WE DO NEED A HINDU-MUSLIM DIALOG, NOW.]


>Your "tit for tat" comments totally missed the point and represent the
>very bigotted perspective that may well be the cause of many of the problems.

You obviously have no understanding of what caused the problems in the
first place and what is fuelling them today. Or maybe you like to avoid
looking the problem in the eye.


>What relevance does the situation in Saudi Arabia or Iran
                                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>have to the issues that were raised in the original article?  Did the
>author say anything about other Islamic societies?  

Well, the author lives in Saudi Arabia.
Yes, he did bring up other Islamic societies.
Yes, all Islamic societies which influence Indian muslims are relevant.


>Is this not a classic example of pointing
>fingers elsewhere to divert attention from the real issues?  

No, it an example of pointing fingers to some of the real issues. :-)

>sticking to the topic on hand... 

You mean, only other people get to decide what is relevant? :-)

>Snide remarks about distant societies ....

Anyway, I didn't say anything nasty about Bangladesh. :-)
Don't be so sensitive about Saudi Arabia or Iran; or do you not like 
to hear the truth about them. You are not claiming that what I said
is INCORRECT, are you? Only that I shouldn't have said it? :-)

It is not irrelevant. History has been so tricky and tangled that
it is all relevant today: I join you in wishing that external Islamic
societies weren't involved. From the beginning.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: zahin@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Kazi Zahin S. Hasan)
Subject: Re: Jamaat's rise in power
Organization: Oberlin College Computer Science
	<NAEEM.92Apr14171314@occs.cs.oberlin.edu>
	<sho7cINNm26@matt.ksu.ksu.edu>
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 22:32:59 GMT

In article <sho7cINNm26@matt.ksu.ksu.edu> misra@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Boo!) writes:

>Jamaat forms coalition govt with BNP, the party's first time
>with parliamentary clout since liberation. Election officials say appr. 60%
>of Jamaat's parliamentary candidates were professionals, the largest of any
>political party candidates-- Jamaat ends up with third highest tally of seats.

	   I mean someone is electing these people so, I would assume they 
   in some form support their ideas. Does this mean that you have a large
   pro-pakistani group even after the war?
==========================================================================

	Jamaat has tried very hard to whitewash its image since '71.
Most Shibir activists would probably claim that their party leaders
were _ non-violent_objectors_ to the independece movement in '71, and
that the allegations of their collaboration in the atrocities of the
Pak army are merely anti-Jamaat propaganda. 
--
Zahin Hasan
zahin@occs.cs.oberlin.edu
(216) 775 5403
OCMR box 1551
Oberlin College, Oberlin, Ohio 44074
				

	"No, I mean is there any venomous creature you're particularly
fond of?"
	He looked out of the window for a moment.
	"There was," he said, "but she left me."

				from "Last Chance to See"
					by
					Douglas Adams
From: a0h9342@zeus.tamu.edu (HAQUE, ANISUL)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh,soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: Behind Azam's arrest [Dhaka courier]
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:20:00 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.bangladesh
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41


In article <1992Apr15.153654.4954@udel.edu>, kazi@bugs.cis.udel.edu (Zunaid Kazi) writes...
>In article <NAEEM.92Apr14180428@occs.cs.oberlin.edu> naeem@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Naeem Mohaiemen) writes:
>>
> 
>	[Dhaka Courier Excerpts]
> 
>>[Golam Azam: the screw tightens; Dhaka Courier, Apr 2, 1992]
>>
>>..On mar 22, ambassador of a middle eastern country met with Home minister to
>>plead for azam..the foreign envoy and Jamaat leaders reportedly threatened
>>govt with dire consequences
> 
>Anybody know which middle easterm country is meddling in this affair? My 
>suspects include either Saudi Arabia or Iran. The alleged threat by the 
>foreign envoy should be roundly condemmed. But with the dependence on aid, 
>I seriously doubt such an event will ever come to pass.

The Middle Eastern countries with pro-Jamaat sentiment don't include Iran. 
Iranis, though fundamentalist, don't follow the preachings of Moududi. The 
strongest supporter of Jamaat in the ME is Libya. She is also the patron of 
the Freedom Party.

About aid, less than 5% (I am not sure about the figure, but it is of
the same order) of the total Bangladeshi aid comes from Middle East. The major 
concern of Bangladesh in the ME is the large number of Bangladeshis 
working there. It is interesting that although India is neither a muslim 
country nor very close with ME, the number of Indians working or doing 
business in the ME exceeds the number of Bangladeshis (even Pakistanis) by 
a large margin. Maybe Bangladesh needs to reconsider her policy.

[lot of stuff deleted]

Zunaid asks
>Who are the analysts who are predicting inevitable Jamaat victory. The
>one belief that assuages me is the belief that Jamaat can never assume
>power thrugh democratic means. Is a Jamaat victory ineveitable?

I don't believe Jamaat can go to power thru democratic means in BD. Though 
Bangladeshi muslims are very religious, they, in general, oppose any kind 
of fundamentalism.

[stuff deleted]

>-- Zunaid
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Zunaid H. Kazi          kazi@cis.udel.edu              302-456-3493
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Regards,

Anisul Haque
a0h9342@sigma.tamu.edu
Texas A & M University
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
From: kazi@bugs.cis.udel.edu (Zunaid Kazi)
Subject: Re: Pakistani teams
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 15:52:34 GMT

In article <1992Apr13.010110.4831@sbcs.sunysb.edu> Rishad@engws10.ic.sunysb.edu (Rishad Quazi) writes:
>In article <12085@tamsun.tamu.edu> a0h9342@zeus.tamu.edu (HAQUE, ANISUL) writes:
>>liberation war before '89. Rather the words like 'Hanadar' or 'Dakhaldar' were 
							    				    ^^^^^^^^    ^^^^^^^^^^^
>						                                |		    |
>						                                |		    |
>						                               /            /
>What do these words mean?	     _____________________/____________/
>
Handar = Invader / Agressor 
Dakhaldar = Occupier

>-:|Rishad J. Quazi

-- Zunaid H. Kazi
From: misra@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Boo!)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: Bihari Massacre and 71 war
Date: 9 Apr 1992 02:46:39 -0500
Organization: Kansas State University
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

>  they were criminals not innocent. This should be investigated. U.S govt.
>  was supporting Pakistan in 1971, so it is very unlikely that the reports
>  of these newspapers were biased.

	why would you assume that it was unlikely that the papers were 
biased? I am sure there is something in that sentence that is making it 
sound different. 

>
>---Zakir