From: thester@nyx.cs.du.edu (Uncle Fester)
Subject: Re: Old Software
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix @ U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 18:31:20 GMT


I don't want to beat a dead horse or flame anyone, but Jeff is right.
I bought my first Atari in 1981.  A 400 w/48k, 810 drive, 410 recorder and
a couple of games and the BASIC Programmer package.  (A *large* box with
the BASIC cart and manuals.)  It wan't until 1988 that I ever had one
piece of pirated software.  I had a Happy installed in 1986 to back up
everything for myself alone.  
In February of 1990, I bought a Packard Bell 386sx and didn't even have it
a whole week before I managed to be given several illegal copies of PC
software.  I have a rather large collection of the stuff now and don't use
any of it.  But my point is this;  the Atari 8 bit users are not as bad as
they have been made out to be.  Just because there was a lot of
hardware/software made for copying stuff doesn't mean a thing.  Commodore
had its share of same and you can still buy stuff for that machine today.
I've read magazines for the 8 bit with articles concerning piracy actually
laying the blame for no software on some sort of conspiracy by the
develepors to make the Atari community an example by not producing stuff
for it.  Sort of like, "see, if you pirate this is what will happen to
you."  I don't believe that at all.  But it is tolerated to an extent on
the clone platform because of the sheer number of machines that are
installed.  I love my Atari, but if I can't legally buy a piece of
software then I will gladly take a pirated copy.  The notion that there
are developers in Europe and Peru still making stuff for the Atari doesn't
make me feel better either.  It's not easy to get and it's not the stuff
that I want. (mostly)  What I want is the stuff that was made and isn't
even being sold from musty old shelves at American T.V. or the like.  If
the copyright holders won't allow the stuff to be released then what am I
supposed to do?  If you look in the big Sears catalog, you will see that
they are selling parts for autos that were made in the 1930's.  Do you
suppose they had to ask Ford or whoever for permission to make/sell a part
for an auto that is no longer in production?   
I've been through the same hassle of trying to find the copyright holder
of particular programs and met with little or no success in some instances
and with others the answer was the same as the original poster of this
subject.  "No way."  I had the same idea (be a source for old software)
and was going to make it a virtually non-profit venture on my part. 
Royalties and fees would of course go to the proper people.  They just
don't want to hear it.  I wish any poor sucker that tries to do the same
immense luck if they try to do the same.   The number of copyright holders
that will even deign to discuss the issue with you will number less than
five.  I am talking about the old "classic" stuff.  I don't know what sort
of experiences Darek has had, but it sounds like he lost some money some
where and still holds it against the Atari community at large.  Well, I've
lost money too Darek.  We can't all get rich off of a machine that was
destined to all but disappear.  
Since 1981 and my first Atari, I now own two additional 400's, two 800xl's
and a 130xe, an XF551 and two 1050 drives.  I bought all but the extra
400's at retail and not some clearance sale.  I forgot the printers that I
have gone through.  Two Atari printers and an Epson and a Star Micronics.
The amount of software that I purchased was enormous.  I contributed
monetarily to the wealth of Atari and its software producers.  Now they
have abandoned us to go on to drink from another well.  That well will run
dry also eventually and will in turn be abandoned.  I don't believe in
piracy but I *do* believe that if a particular piece of software is not
available for sale anywhere in _this_ country then the acquisition of same
by whatever means is not hurting anyone.  
I think I've blathered on long enough, but you can bet that this subject
will continue to come up with the same old arguments and wild accusations.
To what end?  It's certainly not going to make time go backward and make
things like they were in the early 80's.  Face it.  We're dead in the
water and any piece of useable flotsam that drifts our way whether legal
or not isn't going to make one whit of difference.

--
:  Master,                        :       Uncle Fester       : Printed  :
:    Me and Rex took the kar      :   thester@nyx.cs.du.edu  : on 100%  :
:    to town. Stay home. Stay!    :         -or try-         :recyclable:
:       Ha ha ha ha.   The dog.   :    T.HESTER4 on GEnie    : phosphor :
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit