HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: wgb3@pyuxf.uucp (25336-buoni)
Subject: Problem refinancing home
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 17:00:56 GMT

Hi,
   We are currently in the process of refinancing our mortgage with AVSTAR 
mortgage company in Bethlehem, Pa. and have run into some difficulties.  We 
were supposed to be refinancing today (Monday 12/21) at 11:00 am, but it has 
been postponed until Christmas Eve (as if I don't have to do)!  
   Last Wednesday we were told that there were some papers that were not signed
when we originally sat down in October, and that they had to be signed by 
Thursday for us to close on Monday.  They insisted that we both come in at the 
same time, and it had to be before 6:00 (my wife usually babysits Thursday 
evenings so that cost us $20.00).  When I got to the office (over 1 1/2 hours 
from where I work) I found out that they had overlooked our well/septic system!
It had to be done the next day, and we needed $125.00 to do it!  When I 
expressed feelings of dissatisfaction concerning the service I was informed 
that errors of this type are common.  If we don't like it we can leave now and
forfeit our application fee!  
   The next morning my wife called our current lender to make sure that 
everything was OK on their end.  They had NOT been sent any documentation 
concerning the refinance and informed my wife that the required documentation 
had to be sent to them at LEAST two days prior to closing.  Ooops, another 
minor goof!
   We found out this morning that our water failed the inspection.  The 
inspector informed my wife that it was no big deal (caused by all the rain 
that we've been having) and that we were the third that he had failed in the 
general area.  He also told her what we need to do to correct the situation.
The problem is that our rate is only locked for a specific time period.
   My questions are:
     - do we have any legal ramifications if the don't honor our current 
       rate (it was their oversight that has resulted in our running around
       at the last minute).
     - are there any organizations that consumers can turn to when such 
       situations arise?

I'd appreciate any advice I can get concerning this matter.

Thanks,
Bill Buoni

My opinions are my own and do not represent the views of my employer!
From: roder@cco.caltech.edu (Brenda J. Roder)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Not being allowed to vote.
Date: 30 Dec 1992 01:15:41 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: sandman.caltech.edu

lfinkelstein@vax.clarku.edu writes:

>A friend of mine showed up at the poles to vote in the Presidential election.
>After spending quite a while on line he was told that he couldn't vote because 
>they had sent him an absentee ballot.  He never requested an absentee ballot, 
>and never got one.  He wondered if maybe his family had registered him as an 
>absentee, but was told that only he could do that.
>After much arguing he was still not allowed to vote.

I had this happen once because I _had_ requested an absentee ballot and then
came home again in time for the election.  I meant to bring it back with me
so that they could see I hadn't used it, but forgot and left in in New Jersey
(I live in CA).  I went to the polls and they looked in up in their book.
I was quite impressed, there was an entry for "absentee voter shows up at polls
without absentee ballot".  They let me vote, but placed my ballot in a special
envelope with my name outside it.  Presumably, they checked that no absentee
ballot was received from me before adding my ballot to the rest of the batch.
So, perhaps it depends on the state rules or on the competence of the polling
place workers.

-- 
-- Brenda (roder@cobalt.caltech.edu)
Thought before action, if there's time.
    _The Edge_  Dick Francis
From: tjc50@juts.ccc.amdahl.com (Terry Carroll)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re:  Good Legal Writing
Date: 21 Dec 92 22:13:52 GMT
Reply-To: tjc50@juts.ccc.amdahl.com (Terry Carroll)
Organization: Amdahl Corporation

In article <1992Dec19.182458.13949@midway.uchicago.edu>, 
thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank) writes:
> Actually, it's 54 FRD 282 (W D Pa 1971).
> 
> Ted "note the punctuation savings achieved by the Maroonbook" Frank

Note that the punctuation savings are more than compensated for by the 
extended tagline.

Terry Carroll - tjc50@juts.ccc.amdahl.com - 408/992-2152
The opinions presented above are not necessarily those of a sound mind.
From: dan.baer@ehbbs.gwinnett.com (Dan Baer) 
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: ADDRESS
Date: 1 Jan 93 23:30:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Ed Hopper's BBS - Berkeley Lake, GA - 404-446-9462
Reply-To: dan.baer@ehbbs.gwinnett.com (Dan Baer) 

 Question: Does anyone know a good way to find the address of a person
when you only have their phone number. I have tried 'PhoneFile' on
CI$ but they do not have the phone number in their database. The
phone number should be in Carroll County Georgia (prefix 562).
  Any help in this matter is appreciated!
              AdvaThanksnce.
                                               
----
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
|       Ed Hopper's BBS - ehbbs.gwinnett.com - Atlanta, Georgia         |
|  USR/HST: 404-446-9462                  V.32bis: 404-446-9465         |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: misc.legal,talk.politics.misc,alt.president.clinton
From: art@world.std.com (Al Thompson)
Subject: Re: Weinberger's Pardon
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
	<1992Dec29.135226.20152@panix.com>
	<1992Dec29.221407.24874@ryptyde.cts.com>
	<1hqqbuINN5qa@spim.mti.sgi.com>
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 16:25:24 GMT

In article <1hqqbuINN5qa@spim.mti.sgi.com> mpolen@suntory.mti.sgi.com (Mike Polen) writes:

[...]

   When Republicans break the law, you call it a "liberal-sponsored" witch
   hunt.  So when the cops come after you, they will probably be liberals?

   So far, it is only Republican adminstrations that show a disdain
   for the law and a contempt for the public.

It has come out that the Tonkin Gulf incident was cooked up.  This
incident was used by LBJ to get from congress the authorization to
conduct war in Viet Nam without a formal declaration.  This lie lead to
the deaths of over 50,000 Americans and countless Viet Namese.  Somehow
the Iran-Contra hanky panky pales in comparison.  LBJ was a Democrat,
remember?
From: uctlxpd@ucl.ac.uk (Peter Bartlett)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Diplomatic Immunity
Date: 23 Dec 92 00:15:19 GMT
Organization: Bloomsbury Computing Consortium

roder@cco.caltech.edu (Brenda J. Roder) writes:

>Recently, I saw one show (Law & Order, set in New York City) which had
>someone with diplomatic immunity accused of murder.  They said that it 
>(immunity) didn't apply for crimes of a (greivous? serious? major? darn,
>I can't remember the exact word they used) nature, so they were able to 
>bring him to trial.  About a week later, I saw a different show (less
>serious The Commish) where they had a rapist ith diplomatic immunity.  They
>had to convince the Ambassador to waive this person's immunity before they
>could arrest him.  So the question is, which one was correct (more correct?)
>or is rape not sufficiently grave to warrant automatic waiver of immunity.

It may depend on the country where the alleged criminal act was invoked.
I remember a case from (I think) the UK where a body was discovered,
presumably having been pushed from a window (either dead or dying in the 
drop) from the embassy.  Diplomatic immunity applied.  Presumably alleged
murder would count as a "greivous" or "serious" crime?

peter
From: goid@zooid.guild.org (Will Steeves)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Sophie Tucker is a Sexist Sow.  :-)
Summary: Most Gentlemen Don't Like Love - NOT!
Keywords: Oh Well, I never *claimed* to be a "gentleman" or "REAL Man," anyway..
Date: 27 Dec 92 18:24:00 GMT
Organization: The Zoo of Ids
Organisation: GOiDS "R" We, Inc.
X-To: MATTHEW ROSENBLATT

matt@smoke.brl.mil (Matthew Rosenblatt) writes...
MR>In article <1992Dec12.034910.4543@zooid.guild.org> goid@zooid.guild.org
MR>(Will Steeves) writes:

MR>>matt@smoke.brl.mil (Matthew Rosenblatt) writes...

MR>>MR> I don't have to imply anything.  I'll come right out and insult the
MR>>MR> "Pro-Male-Choice" posters and say that they don't care about any unwante
MR>>MR> children they may conceive, nor about anything else except being able
MR>>MR> to enjoy sex without having to worry about the consquences.

MR>Thanks to Will Steeves for reprinting one of my old articles.  That
MR>gives me a chance to slam the "Pro-Male-Choice" posters once more.

Yes, and many thanks for deleting EVERYTHING which I posted in response to
this "slamming" of yours.  I call you on a foul, Matthew Rosenblatt.


MR>But this time I'll do it as the great Sophie Tucker did it 55 years ago
MR>in Cole Porter's musical, "Leave It to Me."  Because the kind of
MR>reasoning that seeks to let men "copulate and run" away from their
                                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
MR>responsibilities -- that kind of behavior simply gives all men
MR>an undeserved bad name:

I noticed that you haven't recently posted very much about "the reasoning that
seeks to let women 'copulate and kill'" in order to run away from their
"responsibilities," though.

Have you abandoned your Pro-Life views, Matt?


MR>  "Most gentlemen don't like love, they just like to kick it around,
MR>   Most gentlemen don't like love, 'cause most gentlemen can't be profound.
MR>   So if your boy friend, some fine night, should say
MR>   He'll love you forever
MR>   And part from you never,
MR>   Just push him out of the hay,
MR>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
MR>   'Cause most gentlemen don't like love, they just like to kick it around."

MR>They didn't call her "the last of the red-hot mamas" for nothing.

Oh super, Matt... They sure didn't call *John Lennon* one of the "red-hot
papas" for writing the song where he says "Rather see you dead than with
another man" - they *censored* him!

Somehow, though, it's okay to say offensive things about men but not women,
right?

---
Will Steeves, goid@zooid.guild.org                      "Neil Hull is GOiD"
ZOOiD BBS, Toronto, Ontario - The Zoo Of Ids            "GOiDS Rule"
(416) 322-7876

"Gravity: It's more than just a fragrance.  It's the LAW!"
   - Will Steeves, President, GOiDS "R" We, Inc.

 * SLMR 2.1a * Oxymorons: "Postal Service" and "Tech Support"
Xref: sparky misc.legal:21692 comp.sys.sun.misc:5987
From: peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Newsgroups: misc.legal,comp.sys.sun.misc
Subject: Re: Put away your Motif manual; Sun's lawyers are at the door!
Date: 23 Dec 92 15:27:48 GMT
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC

In article <1992Dec22.212558.29781@netcom.com> horen@netcom.com (Jonathan B. Horen -- [408] 736-3923) writes:
> I think it's like "Joe" being able to sue GM if I rear-end him with my
> Z-28 Camaro (or, better yet, like not being able to sue AT&T if a user
> on your SysV machine destroys months of work via rm -fr *)

You mean Novell. AT&T is out of the UNIX business.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                            `-_-'
Ferranti International Controls Corporation                'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012 USA
+1 713 274 5180                            "Zure otsoa besarkatu al duzu gaur?"
From: matt@smoke.brl.mil (Matthew Rosenblatt)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Know the source of Liberty's quote, "tired,huddled masses"?
Summary: Not like the Colossus of Rhodes . . .
Keywords: Palestine, Texas (about 40 miles SSW of Tyler)
Date: 31 Dec 92 14:47:30 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: U.S. Army Ballistic Research Lab, APG MD.

In article <1992Dec31.004219.17196@cbnews.cb.att.com> ask@cbnews.cb.att.com 
(Arthur S. Kamlet) writes:

>The poem celebrates the Statue of Liberty.  First was the statue,
>later the poem.
>
>    Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
>    With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
>    Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
>    A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
>    Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
>    Mother of Exiles.  From her beacon-hand
>    Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
>    The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
>    "Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
>    With silent lips.  "Give me your tired, your poor,
>    Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
>    The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
>    Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me,
>    I life my lamp beside the golden door!"
>Emma Lazarus
>The New Colossus

>[ The "ancient lands" cite in the poem is a reference to Shelley's
>  Ozymandias - a  different "colossus" statue fallen with old age
>  and disuse: ]   [Art Kamlet]

Izzat what it is?  And here all along I've thought that "the brazen
giant of Greek fame, With conquering limbs astride from land to land"
was none other than the Colossus of Rhodes -- one of the Seven Wonders
of the Ancient World, no less.

>    The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.

I notice that most of the responses to the original poster's 
misc.legal question kind of left out this line.  Maybe it makes 
some people today uncomfortable.  But "refuse" means that which 
is "not wanted," and that sure fits my grandparents, the inhabitants 
of whose native lands made it abundantly clear to them that they were 
not wanted there.

There's a "mass" of about 400 members of Hamas presently "huddled" in
the snow and cold of a no-man's-land in the Lebanon.  Would it not be
in the spirit of Emma Lazarus's fine poem for the United States to
welcome them through its "golden door" and provide each of these
"homeless, tempest-tossed" men, along with his family, forty acres 
of land near Palestine?

					-- Matt Rosenblatt
                                        (matt@amsaa.brl.mil)

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
TRUTH     JUSTICE     FREEDOM     YIDDISHKEIT     IVY     THE AMERICAN WAY
Newsgroups: misc.legal
From: dpollard@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dennis B Pollard)
Subject: Re: Attorney v. Lawyer
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: misc
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 22:15:25 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.135251.29758@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> cthorne@magnus.ac
s.ohio-state.edu (Charles E Thorne) writes:

>
>In Ohio no one may represent another person at the bar except an attorney.
>Para-legals can only perform under the supervision of an attorney (mostly
>preparing paper work).
>

Actually, certified legal interns, i.e., law students who have completed 2/3 of
law school, may represent clients in Ohio, so long as they comply with Supreme 
Court Rules.  Basically, an attorney, usu. the student's prof., must sit at the
table with the student.

Last semester I prosecuted cases in Delaware County, Ohio, and next semester I 
look forward to doing criminal defense.
From: eck@panix.com (Mark Eckenwiler)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Adverse Possession
Keywords: Sovereign
Date: 21 Dec 92 23:01:49 GMT
Organization: Superseding Information, Inc.

In <1h524fINNcbl@meaddata.meaddata.com>, joem@meaddata.com sez:
>In article <19486@smoke.brl.mil>, matt@smoke.brl.mil (Matthew Rosenblatt) writes:
>|> 
>|> 1)  Does adverse possession run against the sovereign? 
>|> 
>Yes, most definitely.  Property law is a different beast then suing a
>state for civil damages, so the 11th amendment sovereign immunity does
>not apply.

Time out.  Since the 11th amendment is only a bar to suing the states
*in federal court*, it wouldn't make any difference if it did apply
(and absent citation to some authority to the contrary, I suspect it
does).

Secondly, "yes, most definitely" is clearly wrong.  The law will vary
from state to state.  In NY (last time I looked anyway), there was a
distinction made between property held by the State pursuant to
the exercise of various powers (the Capitol, tidal portions of Hudson
riverbank) and "just plain" property (e.g., houses seized for tax
delinquency).  I'll let people guess which one can *never* be
adversely possessed.


> In fact adverse possession is most often used against a
>state, particularly in wild forest areas.

I'd like to see some recent authority for this proposition.  Public
policy would strongly militate against this result.


>  #2 You
>have to adversely possess the property for the statutory period,
>defined by statutes in the state but it is typically 25 years.

There may be different statutory periods for "normal" property and
such property of the state as is subject to AP.

-- 
	     Every time you think, you weaken the nation.
				- attributed to Moe Howard

	Mark Eckenwiler    eck@panix.com    ...!cmcl2!panix!eck
From: linley@netcom.com (Bruce James Robrert Linley)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Sorry, we don't accept cash... Huh?
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:18:01 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, UCLA


	I just had a disturbing experience with a Federal Express delivery
yesterday. It was a COD for $30.00. So I hand the guy a twenty and a ten. To
my surprise, he said that he cannot accept cash. Holy inflation, Batman, our
money's worthless! Is this legal? Has the phrase, "This note is legal tender
for ALL debts public and private" lost its meaning? What's the world coming to?

-- 
Bruce James Robert Linley | "Well, I tried shoving a weiner in the warp drive,
Comp Sci & Engr, UCLA     |  but it didn't do a bit o' good."
<linley@netcom.com>       | - Star Dreck, c/o Dr. Demento
<linley@seas.ucla.edu>    |
Xref: sparky misc.legal:21703 comp.sys.sun.misc:5993
From: pecampbe@mtu.edu (Paul Campbell)
Subject: Re: Sorry, we don't accept cash... Huh?
Organization: Michigan Technological University
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 02:58:36 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.191801.6412@netcom.com> linley@netcom.com (Bruce James Robrert Linley) writes:
>
>	I just had a disturbing experience with a Federal Express delivery
>yesterday. It was a COD for $30.00. So I hand the guy a twenty and a ten. To
>my surprise, he said that he cannot accept cash. Holy inflation, Batman, our
>money's worthless! Is this legal? Has the phrase, "This note is legal tender
>for ALL debts public and private" lost its meaning? What's the world coming to?

Actually, if you read the caption, it claims that it is a note. The legal
definition of a note is a type of debt instrument. It is an unconditional
promise to pay some one a definite amount; however, there is evidence to
show that this particular form of debt instrument has no such intentions.

Notice that the issuer is the Federal Reserve Bank. Note also that there is
no branch of the Federal government known as the Federal Reserve Bank. The
bank is a seperate institution.

Last, the legal definition of TENDER. A tender is an offer to meet some
contractual requirement (tender of performance or tender of payment for
example). I'm doing this off the top of my head..I don't have Black's or
Bouvier's with me, so I can't do direct quotes.

Now, tendering payment of a debt CAN be refused. There is nothing that say
that you have to actually accept payment. That caption is silly and
unnecessary because I could tender you small, shiny pebbles (and unless
you knew the baubles were diamonds, you'd be wise to refuse). Worse yet,
a debt cannot pay a debt, and a Federal Reserve Note at least from it's
appearances is a debt instrument and represents debt.

So, quite well within their legal grounds, the carrier refused your
offer. And no, that paper you offered is worthless (unless the coinage
act of 1787 has been recently repealed or they suddenly started
placing wording on the notes stating that they were redeemable for
something other than more worthless paper).
From: tzs@stein.u.washington.edu (Tim Smith)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Sorry, we don't accept cash... Huh?
Date: 2 Jan 1993 00:35:31 GMT
Organization: University of Washington School of Law, Class of '95
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: stein.u.washington.edu

linley@netcom.com (Bruce James Robrert Linley) writes:
>>for silver regardless of the "promise".  But more to the point we can
>>demonstrate why a delivery service would not accept cash quite handily,
>>we place you in a Fed.Ex. truck and let you collect cash on deliveries
>>through oh... South Central L.A.            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>Gee, I guess having all those credit card numbers (from plastic payments)
>poses no risk whatsoever? The drivers could keep a small amount of change.

The risk of credit card number is a lot lower than the risk of cash.  Just
how many liquor stores and drug dealers (oops...redundency) do you think will
let you make a purchase by giving a credit card number without having the
credit card itself?  Or grocery stores?  Or other stores?

Also, the problem is not change, I would guess, but much larger amounts
of cash.  What's the average value of things shipped C.O.D. by Federal
Express?  That times the expected number of such shipments that a driver
will have to handle on a delivery route, divided by two, is the amount of
cash that they would have to worry about.

--Tim Smith
From: mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin)
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Copyright of personal likeness?
Date: 27 Dec 92 15:53:02 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Electronic Frontier Foundation
Originator: mnemonic@eff.org

In article <1992Dec27.153503.20181@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> ddaye@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (David C Daye) writes:
>Hi!  I'm a performer who has recently discovered a terrific photo
>of myself in a textbook that's been in circulation for the past 8 years.
>
>I'm curious about a person's rights to his/her likeness.  Do ordinary
>citizens have any, to the extent that permission to publish a photo
>of them is ever required?

Generally, no. There is an exception in some jurisdictions for the
appropriation of one's likeness for a commercial purpose, but your example
here would not qualify as such an appropriation.

>Does this change if the citizen is obviously performing in public?

Assuming we're talking about a photo rather than a recording of the
full performance, no.

>Does it matter if the citizen earns income from performing?

No.

> Does
>the situation change further for persons who are widely known as
>public figures? 

No.

>Finally, are there distinctions for use of likenesses in different
>situations, such as news, educational texts, or artwork?

Yes. It's the "commercial purposes" distinction referred to above.
Your photo can be used in a textbook or a news article, but it can't
be plastered on a cereal box.



--Mike




-- 
Mike Godwin,    |"I'm waiting for the one-man revolution
mnemonic@eff.org| The only one that's coming."
(617) 864-0665  |                           
EFF, Cambridge  |                   --Robert Frost 
Newsgroups: misc.legal
From: titmas@chdasic.sps.mot.com (Eric Titmas)
Subject: Re: George Bush pardons criminals
Organization: SPS
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 00:28:07 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.213641.12543@panix.com>, eck@panix.com (Mark Eckenwiler) writes:
|> 
|> If you know anything at all about habeas corpus jurisprudence, you
|> will immediately recognize the relevance of Justice Harlan's
|> distinction between "guilt-related" constitutional violations (e.g.,
|> denial of counsel) and non-guilt-related violations (illegal search).
|> The decision to vacate North's conviction, because based on a
|> non-guilt-related violation, casts no doubt on the validity of the
|> factfinding process.

But there were witnesses whose recollection and testimony changed because 
of North's forced testimony.  Specifically, McFarland's story changed after
hearing North - casting a large doubt about the "validity of the 
factfinding process".
-- 
Eric Titmas      Motorola ASIC       titmas@chdasic.sps.mot.com               

It is impossible to take in more money than Congress can spend.  - Thomas Sowell
Newsgroups: misc.legal