From: johnhall@microsoft.com (John Hall)
Subject: Re: I'm Still Waiting
Date: 14 Dec 92 00:36:59 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation
Distribution: usa,local

In article ohall@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
|   Slavery as I stated "to my understanding" was very brutal in the U.S.
|   Most of my information is based on readings from the past, documentaries, and 
|   word of mouth from relatives.  One need only look at the current situation of
|   the black race in U.S. to be convinced slavery in this nation was and is
|   brutal.  I speak from experience.  
|   In other systems of slavery slaves were allowed to work off thier debt to 
|   thier masters.  If a slave was killed curses fell upon the nation. 
|   Source "The Bible."  In the U.S. slaves couldn't work or buy thier way out of
|   slavery.  I haven't studied slavery in other nations but aren't
|   the slaves in these other nations of the same race and not imported. 

You can't defend 'more brutal' if you haven't studied slavery in other
nations.  The slaves of Jamaica, Haiti, and so forth were imported
from africa -- and in far larger numbers than here.  As far as the
current situation of blacks in the US as an indication of how bad
slavery was, would you rather be from the US, from Haiti, or from
Uganda?  Blacks may be second class citizens here, but there isn't
a country where they have it better.

In some systems you could buy your way out, but I don't think
that was typical at all.  The bible doesn't begin to cover the 
different slave societies that have existed.

| > Remember that any response must account for the fact that only about
| > 5% (500,000) of the 10,000,000+ africans taken from africa arrived 
| > in territories which later became the US.  However, the US wound up
| > with the largest slave society in the new world due to much higher...
| >DELETED INFO.
| 
|   More like 900,000 in the 16th. century and 2,750,000 in the 17th.  Source:
| Slavery a comparative perspective by Robin W. Winks. 
| This is a conservative figure based on other more reliable documents I have
| read in the past.

More reliable than bill of sale records and the census?
My figures are from "Slavery: History and Historians" by ?Pareesh.

Also note that slaves weren't hitting US shores *at all* in the 16th
century.  I have a feeling you are wrapping all of North/Central/
South America in your estimates -- not restricting it to lands
later controlled by the US.  

| > Castration occured, but doesn't seem to be as common as the
| > Enuch practices of asia.  America was hardly known for human
| > sacrifice or canibalism, both of which occured in various other
| > slave societies.
| > 
|   Again what was the purpose for the castration in these asian countries was it
| thier culture.  In the U.S. it was certainly used as punishment and birth
| control.  Sounds brutal to me.  

Yes, it was brutal.  Less of it here than elsewhere.
I doubt it was used for birth control here.


-- 
-------------------------
My comments are my own.  They are independent and unrelated to the
views of my company , relatives or elected representatives.

From: patm@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Pat Murphy)
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 18:10:19 GMT
Subject: Re: Looks like the cops are at it again
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA