HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Follow up to holes in the desert
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 92 20:49:33 GMT
Distribution: ca

Back when we were discussing man-made seismic activity, the issue
was raised as to what the DOE had planned for old craters in the NV desert.
While discussing this with an ex-officemate who worked on those devices,
I received a curious explanation about the plans.

1) There are NO craters from just below surface detontations.
2) If there were craters, the mere presence of a crater is felt to be
a warning in and of itself for future generations.  No plans for filling
old contaminated craters exists.  If such craters existed.

The explanation to 1) was that all devices detonated in NV were either on
towers made or specific height for very specific reasons (which I won't get
into), or 2) were underground blasts which typically inadvertantly chimneyed
their way to the surface in unexpected manner.

This is curious to me because my normally clear office mate explained and
holds to the above when I can assert than various crater making experiments
were done before the limited surface test-ban treaty.  So the answer is
no filling is planned, and presence is a sufficient warning.  A follow-on
possibility might answer more when I get a tour at LLNL, but whether I can
post that answer might be questionable.  I'll let you know.

"Fall out? What fall out?"

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Acting Associate Editor, Software and Publication Reviews
  Scientific Programming
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Ref: Mathematics and Plausible Reasoning, vol. 1, G. Polya
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: practice
From: riseley@vax.sonoma.edu
Date: 15 Sep 92 10:07:49 -0800
Organization: Sonoma State University

This is the first actual post that you all are seeing in the newsgroups.  Hey
wo;lf chill out please.  Really just pay attention and everyone will learn how
to post a message.  You'll all really dig it.  Cool.  Enough.
From: stead@skadi.CSS.GOV (Richard Stead)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: Follow up to holes in the desert
Date: 8 Sep 92 22:42:11 GMT
Distribution: ca

In article <1992Sep8.204933.17752@nas.nasa.gov>, eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya) writes:
> 1) There are NO craters from just below surface detontations.

Well, part of the confusion may be what is meant by "crater".  There have
been tests specifically for the purpose of making craters (cratering shots).
The sovs were big on this - wanted to use them to make reservoirs and such.
I don't know if we did any of these.  The marks in the desert would be
referred to by the average person as "craters", but bomb folks would call
them "collapse features".  The vast majority of tests in Nevada are conducted
at depths sufficient that no radioactive material should vent.  The cavity
left by the explosion will nevertheless collapse, leading to a depression
on the surface.  I see no reason to attempt to fill these.  The shock of the
blast (accelerations > g) will kill off most desert vegetation there, but
it should soon grow back - the desert topsoil is still on top after collapse.
The collapse pits themselves are not contaminated, contamination is contained
at depth.

> The explanation to 1) was that all devices detonated in NV were either on
> towers made or specific height for very specific reasons (which I won't get
> into), or 2) were underground blasts which typically inadvertantly chimneyed
> their way to the surface in unexpected manner.

Inadvertant, unexpected chimneying may lead to surface contamination.  Any
such features should probably be investigated and perhaps buried if the site
is ever turned over to another use.  Chimneying is different from a normal
collapse.


--
Richard Stead
Center for Seismic Studies
Arlington, VA
stead@seismo.css.gov
From: RHUGGINS@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Rich Huggins x3095)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: Moving to San Mateo, but where?
Date: 8 Sep 92 15:57:08 GMT
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center

Call San Mateo County Office of Emergency Services 415-363-4790.

They have lots of specific information and organizations for
further information.

The USGS has done a very interesting map that would interest you:
Misc. Investigations Series Map I-1257-H, 1986, "Map showing
predicted shaking intensities of an EQ in San Mateo Co., CA,
comparable to magnitude to the 1906 SF EQ".  Factors in local
geology and soils.  Large, detailed, colorful.  You'll get to
know the foundations of your new habitat.
From: jc@optimla.aimla.com (John VanHoozer)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: Follow up to holes in the desert
Date: 9 Sep 92 17:25:24 GMT
Reply-To: jc@optimla.aimla.com (John VanHoozer)
Distribution: ca
Organization: OptImage Interactive Services Co., L.P.

In article <51202@seismo.CSS.GOV>, stead@skadi.CSS.GOV (Richard Stead) writes:
|> In article <1992Sep8.204933.17752@nas.nasa.gov>, eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov 
|> (Eugene N. Miya) writes:
|> > 1) There are NO craters from just below surface detontations.
|> 
|> Well, part of the confusion may be what is meant by "crater".  There have
|> been tests specifically for the purpose of making craters (cratering shots).
|> The sovs were big on this - wanted to use them to make reservoirs and such.
                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The L.A. Times ran a series of articles on the legacy of the Soviet nuclear
tests.  Awful stuff... even if only 25% were true!  Question,  does any one
know if they did use some of these "craters" for reservoirs?  I could see
this having a lasting health effect for years.


		[ other interesting stuff deleted ]

|> --
|> Richard Stead
|> Center for Seismic Studies
|> Arlington, VA
|> stead@seismo.css.gov

-- 

					jc

___________________________________________________________________________
John C. VanHoozer			     |
OptImage Interactive Services Company, L.P.  |  uunet!{optimage,aimla}!jc
11040 Santa Monica Blvd., Suite #300	     |  Fax:  (310)445-5720
Los Angeles, Ca. 90025			     |  Phone:(310) 445-5721
___________________________________________________________________________
Disclaimer:
   Opinions,  yew doone neeed my steenkeeng Opinions.

Carpe Diem:  A carp a day, that's all we ask.
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
>From: lockhart@uci.edu (Jack C. Lockhart)
Subject: Re: S.Cal Maps?
Summary: Where to get earthquake maps & reports via modem
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes,sci.geo.geology
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Keywords: Earthquake Maps & Reports
Date: 4 Jun 92 20:17:26 GMT
Followup-To: ca.earthquakes,sci.geo.geology

In article <1992May29.224030.4856@moe.corollary.COM> garyl@moe.corollary.com (Gary Lorman) writes:
>I used to collect the postscript maps for Southern California earthquake
>activity.  The last one I have is from Aug 91.  Will these maps ever be
>posted again?
>					Thanks.
>-- 
>--garyl----------------------------------------------------------------------
>		"Any shark that gets to be 11 or 12 feet long with 
>	      300 big teeth can be considered dangerous" - 'Shark Bowl '92'
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------


It is not certain if the Southern California postscript maps will be
posted again.  However, there are several ways for you to get this
information.  Data is available via this news network, FTP, and MODEM.

Two sites available via modem are listed below.  One site is located
in Northern California (Sacramento area); the other is in Southern
California (Anaheim area).

I compile each weeks earthquake data posted or submitted by Kate at
Caltech and Andy at USGS; into a ".zip" file and upload it to the
California Public-Safety Radio Association (CPRA) Communications
Bulletin Board System (PSCBBS), located in Anaheim, California.

Earthquake files are located in file directory #19.  Each weeks ".zip" file
is named "usgsYYWW.zip" where "YY" is the year, i.e., 92 and "WW" is the week
of the year, i.e., 01, 02, 03...  The file "usgs9201.zip" would be the weeks
data from 00:00:01 January 02, 1992 to 23:59:59 January 08, 1992.

Contact Gary David Gray - assistant sysop - (voice line) (714)
938-4311 for BBS access.  Speeds are: 300/1200/2400/9600; error
correction and data compression are also supported.  Access is granted
more favorably to those who work for a public-safety agency.


/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
|         Jack C. Lockhart         < INTERNET > LOCKHART@uci.edu             |
|      Radio Systems Engineer      <  BITNET  > LOCKHART@uci.edu             |
|    Network & Telecomm Services   < ! BANG ! > ...uunet!usc!uci.edu!lockhart|
|    2209 Central Plant Building   <  VOICE   > (714) 856-8477               |
| University of California, Irvine <   FAX    > (714) 725-2270               |
|      Irvine, CA  92717-5475      <   HAM    > WD6AEI                       |
|              U.S.A.              <COMP.PHONE> (714) 725-2238               |
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/



>From ucsd!nosc!crash!hrlaser Wed Jan 30 09:47:45 PST 1991
Article: 2054 of ca.earthquakes
>From: hrlaser@crash.cts.com (Harv Laser)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: dependence on time of year
Date: 30 Jan 91 16:13:17 GMT
Organization: Crash TimeSharing, El Cajon, CA

Andy.. the California Division of Mines and Geology has a BBS up and
running in the Sacramento area. It's at 916-327-1208, 300/1200/2400.
It's popular "Wildcat" software running on some kind of MS-DOS machine.
You might want to liase with the sysop there.

Be advised that we echo the weekly reports from CalTech and USGS on
our bbs at 916-327-1208.  And, we do the uudecoding for you.  If
you miss the reports and want copies of past reports, all that we
have received are available as ZIP files -- downloads are possible
on your first call.  Log on at 8-N-1, please.

-- 
           Ted Smith  --  tcs.sactoh0.SAC.CA.US
         California Division of Mines and Geology
        Call our MS-DOS based bbs (CDMG ONLINE) at
                   916-327-1208 8-N-1



Harv Laser                                      {anywhere}!crash!hrlaser
"Park and lock it.  Not responsible."           People/Link: CBM*HARV
From: stead@skadi.CSS.GOV (Richard Stead)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: This can't be right ...
Date: 10 Sep 92 14:17:23 GMT

In article <72236@apple.Apple.COM>, galcher@apple.com (Bill Galcher) writes:
> and saw this news article.  Am I just way off base, or are there a couple of
> missing decimal points that should be in the depth values given in this
> article?
> 
> > 	JAKARTA, Indonesia (UPI) -- A strong earthquake measuring 6.0 on the
> > Richter scale jolted the Indonesian island of Java Wednesday but there
> > were no reports of casualties or damage.
> > 	The quake occurred shortly after midday Wednesday and had its
> > epicenter in the Java Sea near Bawean island, about 375 miles east of
> > Jakarta, a Meteorogical Institute official in Jakarta said.
> > 	The institute said the quake occurred at a depth of 383 miles (617

Perfectly ordinary and expected depth.  Earthquakes can be as deep as 690
km, and all quakes deeper than about 100 km are subduction events - quakes
in the down-going slab.  In fact, there are more events from about 550 - 690 km
than there are from about 300-550 km.  This is due to stress distribution
in the slab.  The great depth explains why there was no damage.



--
Richard Stead
Center for Seismic Studies
Arlington, VA
stead@seismo.css.gov
From: galcher@apple.com (Bill Galcher)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: This can't be right ...
Date: 10 Sep 92 04:19:50 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA

I was reading through one of the (official) newsfeeds that our machine gets
and saw this news article.  Am I just way off base, or are there a couple of
missing decimal points that should be in the depth values given in this
article?

> From apple!!clarinews Sun Sep  6 17:33:39 PDT 1992

> 	JAKARTA, Indonesia (UPI) -- A strong earthquake measuring 6.0 on the
> Richter scale jolted the Indonesian island of Java Wednesday but there
> were no reports of casualties or damage.
> 	The quake occurred shortly after midday Wednesday and had its
> epicenter in the Java Sea near Bawean island, about 375 miles east of
> Jakarta, a Meteorogical Institute official in Jakarta said.
> 	The institute said the quake occurred at a depth of 383 miles (617
> km) beneath the earth's surface. It said the tremor also was registered
> at seismic stations on the island of Bali and Bandung in West Java.


Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
From: sdg@wag240.wag.caltech.edu (Siddharth Dasgupta)
Subject: Re: Zion quake
Reply-To: sdg@wag240.wag.caltech.edu (Siddharth Dasgupta)
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, CA
Distribution: ca
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 21:56:03 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.180320.12049@unocal.com>, stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini) writes:
> 
> I heard from some people from my company who visited the Zion area the Labor
> Day weekend there some impressive ground movements in the 5.9 quake last week.
> They claim one area fell 50 feet.  They saw some houses that were rented in two
> by the fissures.  The south entrance of Zion Park was closed to vehicles
> the weekend, althought the park was still open.  They said camping and hiking
> was quite pleasant without the crowds.
I was in Zion (axtually Springdale UT, on the South entrance) on September
4-7 (the Labor Day weekend). The south entrance was OPEN during this time.
I saw pictures (and was also told) of the 3 houses that were damaged in
Springdale by the quake (the local crafts store were selling pictures and
T-shirts to help raise money for these three families). Two pictures had
the cracks go through the middle of the house and the dirt driveway was 
split in two in one of them. There seemed to have been no major damage
in Zion National Park itself (other than from the 300% increased visitation
since 1980!!).

-- 
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Siddharth Dasgupta (sdg@wag.caltech.edu) (818) 397-2725
Materials & Molecular Simulation Center, Beckman Institute, CALTECH,Pasadena
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
From: casey@well.sf.ca.us (Kathleen Creighton)
Subject: Disaster preparedness
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Distribution: ca
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 22:32:20 GMT


I found the following list of relief supplies needed (from the Florida
Relief Committee) in a Fidonet echo.  I thought it was kind of interesting
in a hindsight sort of way--it's interesting how a real disaster sharpens
priorities.

The following list contains the current needs in rough, priority order:

NO CLOTHING AT THE PRESENT TIME, PLEASE.

Non-perishable food items of all kinds. There is NO refrigeration in most of
the strike zone. Canned and packeted goods in original containers are
welcome.

Baby food and formulas of all kinds and plastic baby bottles, inserts and
nipples.

Bottled water in factory sealed bottles [NO volunteer filled bottles, please]
of gallon or larger sizes. Cases of water very desirable.

Disposable diapers and baby cleansing cloths; baby powder; baby ointment.

Insect repellents and sun screens including those for sensitive skin.

NON-PRESCRIPTION, OTC [over-the-counter] medications of non-perishable type
such as aspirin, acetaminophen [Tylenol, Panadol, etc.], ibuprofen [Midol,
Bayer IB, etc.] in tablets and liquids for children; cold and cough
medicines; allergy medicines; basic first-aid supplies such as bandages,
dressings, antibacterial ointments, band-aids, rolled gauze, elastic bandages
[ACE, etc.], rubbing alcohol, hydrogen peroxide, and cotton swabs. NO
prescription or perishable meds, please.

Personal and feminine hygiene products such as: toilet paper, personal
cleansing towels [Softkins, Baby wipes, WetNaps, etc.]; tampons, sanitary
napkins; toothbrushes and toothpaste; disposable razors; anti-perspirants and
deodorants; bleach.; tissues and paper towels.

Equipment and supplies: NON-electric can openers; generators up to 300KW
[kilowatts]; propane for forklifts and tractors at the Relief Center and down
south; batteries and flashlights; chainsaws; shovels, rakes, picks; plastic
tarps or large sheets of plastic.

These are ju, OTC [over-the-counter] medications of non-perishable type
such as aspirin, acetaminophen [Tylenol, Panadol, etc.], ibuprofen [Midol,
Bayer IB, etc.] in tablets and liquids for children; cold and cough
medicines; allergy medicines; basic first-aid supplies such as bandages,
dressings, antibacterial ointments, band-aids, rolled gauze, elastic bandages
[ACE, etc.], rubbing alcohol, hydrogen peroxide, and cotton swabs. NO
prescription or perishable meds, please.

Personal and feminine hygiene products such as: toilet paper, personal
cleansing towels [Softkins, Baby wipes, WetNaps, etc.]; tampons, sanitary
napkins; toothbrushes and toothpaste; disposable razors; anti-perspirants and
deodorants; bleach.; tissues and paper towels.

Equipment and supplies: NON-electric can openers; generators up to 300KW
[kilowatts]; propane for forklifts and tractors at the Relief Center and down
south; batteries and flashlights; chainsaws; shovels, rakes, picks; plastic
tarps or large sheets of plastic.
From: rah@public.BTR.COM (Richard A Hyde  rah@btr.com)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: Follow up to holes in the desert
Date: 11 Sep 92 01:30:11 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: BTR Public Access UNIX, MtnView CA. Contact: Customer Service cs@BTR.COM

In article <1992Sep9.172524.23269@aimla.com> jc@optimla.aimla.com (John VanHoozer) writes:
|                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|
|The L.A. Times ran a series of articles on the legacy of the Soviet nuclear
|tests.  Awful stuff... even if only 25% were true!  Question,  does any one
|know if they did use some of these "craters" for reservoirs?  I could see
|this having a lasting health effect for years.
|
|

The concept wasn't to use the blast crater as a reservoir..  The soviets
were (and are) big on using explosives to create a "rubble dam" at the
end of a river valley.  To date, I believe that they have only used
*large* quantitys of conventional explosives to do so.  In a nuclear option
perhaps they were counting on most of th radioactives to be entombed by
the rubble.  With a very clean bomb it might not be a problem.  After all,
you can't make water radioactive by exposing it to radiation.


-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|   Richard Hyde  |  RaH@btr.com  |    This space intentionally left blank   |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky ca.earthquakes:1063 sci.geo.geology:1894
From: mgm@clipper.ingr.com (Mike Marfell)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes,sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: CALL FOR AMATEUR EARTHQUAKE FORECASTERS
Keywords: ELF Monitoring, Earthquake Forecasting, magnetic
Date: 4 Sep 92 22:36:18 GMT
Organization: Intergraph Advanced Processor Division - Palo Alto, CA

In article <1992Sep4.204944.21331@mercury.cair.du.edu>, elesatz@diana.cair.du.edu (Eric LeSatz) writes:
> 
> Actually, I saw a thing on CBS This Morning about forecasting
> earthquakes. Apparently there is a geiser (think in Yoesmite) that
> changes its eruption cycle a few days before an earthquake. Actually,
> that kinda makes sense.
> 
> FYI,
> 
> Eric
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> |__Eric LeSatz_________________[]{}  I've got seven in the clip and one      |
> |__elesatz@diana.cair.du.edu___[]{}  in the chamber. Will that be enough??   |
> ==============================================================================

     Quick note, the geiser is in or near Calistoga, Ca. 
-- 

                      "Just Say No! To Cable TV"
Mike Marfell                                      mgm@clipper.ingr.com
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: Follow up to holes in the desert
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 92 06:05:03 GMT
Distribution: ca

In article <51202@seismo.CSS.GOV> stead@skadi.CSS.GOV (Richard Stead) writes:
>tests specifically for the purpose of making craters (cratering shots).
>The sovs were big on this - wanted to use them to make reservoirs and such.
>I don't know if we did any of these.

We did.  From single holes to canal digging (Buggy: the most interesting
footage I saw, was a sequence of 5-1.2 Kt devices, this would have an
interesting seismic signature).  This is what's funny about George's
description and explanation.  Anyways, I need to wait until after Sept. 19 to
get more answers on this one.  I think we did something close to 3 dozen
Plowshare (peaceful) nuclear shots back during those times.

>Chimneying is different from a normal collapse.

Understand.

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Acting Associate Editor, Software and Publication Reviews
  Scientific Programming
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Ref: Mathematics and Plausible Reasoning, vol. 1, G. Polya
From: rcarter@gaudi.nas.nasa.gov (Russell L. Carter)
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
Subject: Re: Follow up to holes in the desert
Date: 9 Sep 92 21:05:55 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA

In article <1992Sep8.204933.17752@nas.nasa.gov> eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya) writes:
>Back when we were discussing man-made seismic activity, the issue
>was raised as to what the DOE had planned for old craters in the NV desert.
>While discussing this with an ex-officemate who worked on those devices,
>I received a curious explanation about the plans.
>
>1) There are NO craters from just below surface detontations.
>2) If there were craters, the mere presence of a crater is felt to be
>a warning in and of itself for future generations.  No plans for filling
>old contaminated craters exists.  If such craters existed.

The National Atomic Museum in Albuquerque "The Most Exciting Free Attraction
in the Southwest" has lots of pictures of the Nevada Test Site, among
others.  Sure looked like craters to me.  Hard to say how deep they were.

Russell
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes
From: stevens@scubed.com (Jeff Stevens)
Subject: Re: Follow up to holes in the desert
Organization: S-CUBED, A Division of Maxwell Laboratories
Distribution: ca
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 16:05:36 GMT

In article <7968@public.BTR.COM>, rah@public.BTR.COM (Richard A Hyde  rah@btr.com) writes:
|> In article <1992Sep9.172524.23269@aimla.com> jc@optimla.aimla.com (John VanHoozer) writes:
|> |                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|> |
|> |The L.A. Times ran a series of articles on the legacy of the Soviet nuclear
|> |tests.  Awful stuff... even if only 25% were true!  Question,  does any one
|> |know if they did use some of these "craters" for reservoirs?  I could see
|> |this having a lasting health effect for years.
|> |
|> |
|> 
|> The concept wasn't to use the blast crater as a reservoir..  The soviets
|> were (and are) big on using explosives to create a "rubble dam" at the
|> end of a river valley.  To date, I believe that they have only used
|> *large* quantitys of conventional explosives to do so.  In a nuclear option
|> perhaps they were counting on most of th radioactives to be entombed by
|> the rubble.  With a very clean bomb it might not be a problem.  After all,
|> you can't make water radioactive by exposing it to radiation.
|>

The Shagan River which runs through the major (former) Soviet nuclear
test site in Eastern Kazakhstan was dammed by a cratering underground 
nuclear explosion on January 15, 1965.

----------------------------------------------------------
Jeff Stevens	stevens@s3mars.scubed.com, stevens@seismo.css.gov
Newsgroups: ca.earthquakes