HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: eric@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Raymond's Reviews #189: short takes
Date: 9 Apr 92 19:38:35 GMT


This is Raymond's Reviews #189 (short takes)

%T The Dark Beyond The Stars
%A Frank M. Robinson
%I TOR
%D March 1992
%O paperback, US$4.99
%P 408
%G ISBN 0-812-51383-5

Frank Robinson is one of those writers, like T. L. Sherred and Sterling Lanier,
who've escaped being feted as a master of SF only because they publish so
infrequently.  This time around he gives us a rather original spin on the
interstellar-generation-ship premise; a psychological thriller set on a
decaying starship.  Sparrow, the amnesiac protagonist, quests to recover
his lost memories, and the things he learns propel him into conflict with the
vessel's mad, immortal captain.  A dark, gripping tale; recommended.

%T Crisis on Doona
%A Anne McCaffrey
%A Jody Lynne Nye
%I Ace
%D March 1992
%O paperback, US$5.99
%P 327
%G ISBN 0-441-23194-2

The cover tells you most of what you need to know about this book; it
juxtaposes a fetching strawberry-blonde and a cat-man who's been not so
subtly detailed to look like Vincent from the _Beauty_And_The_Beast_ TV
series.  Yes, it's yet another stone-boring romance for female adolescents
of all ages.  The only surprise is that they aren't hot for each other but
both friends of the annoying, gung-ho Tom Corbett clone who's the book's
actual protagonist.  Between the covers, a strictly business-as-usual
plot.  And it's a *sequel*, too.  Feh.

%T PartnerShip
%A Anne McCaffrey
%A Margaret Ball
%I Baen
%D March 1992
%O paperback, US$5.99
%P 323
%G ISBN 0-671-72109-7

Maybe there's hope for Anne McCaffrey yet.  Or maybe Margaret Ball (author of
_Flameweaver_, RR166) is a good influence.  Whatever; this book is no 
masterpiece, but it's a big improvement on the fluffy wish-fulfillment
romances and poor-grade carno McCaffrey's stamped her name on recently
(RR#21, RR#75, RR#140, RR#164).  This is historically appropriate, because
it's a sequel to _The_Ship_Who_Sang_, McCaffrey's last groundbreaking SF novel.
It's two hundred years after Helva's time, and the shellperson Nancia is
beginning her career as a courier ship. The technical challenges are nothing
compared to the perplexities of dealing with her passengers and the system
that produced them...

RECEIVED BUT NOT REVIEWED:
   _Spell_Of_Fate_ (_Dance_Of_Gods #3) by Mayer Alan Brenner
   _Fire_Sea_ (_The_Death_Gate_Cycle_ #3) by Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman.
   _The_Elf_Queen_Of_Shannara_ by Terry Brooks.
From: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Cliff hangers
Date: 10 Apr 92 15:36:57 GMT
Reply-To: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <26980008@hpspkla.spk.hp.com> mcjunkin@hpspkla.spk.hp.com (Bart L. McJunkin) writes:
> 
>     ARGH!
> 
> I hear you.  The sequel 'The Kif strike back' came out with
> such a whimper that I didn't find out about it until 2 years
> after it was published.  I found it in a used book store!
> 
> Refresh my memory, is the Morgaine series finished?

Given the context of the story, there's no way it can be finished,
short of fairly explicity killing off Morgaine and Vanye.  At that
any half-rate hack could probably pop duplicates out of a convenient
gate.

I think Cherryh has shown considerable retraint in only tacking
Exile's Gate onto the original series, though I wouldn't mind if
she wants to do another one or two when she has something to add.

-- 
George Robbins - now working for,     uucp:   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr
but no way officially representing:   domain: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com
Commodore, Engineering Department     phone:  215-431-9349 (only by moonlite)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: b_hart@odin.dev.macsch.com (Bill Hart)
Subject: Re: Irish/Celtic Fantasy
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Reply-To: b_hart@macsch.com
Organization: MacNeal-Schwendler Corporation (MSC), Los Angeles, California
Date: 10 Apr 1992 16:11 -0700

In article <willimsa.702918331@unix1.tcd.ie>, willimsa@unix1.tcd.ie (Gavin Williams) writes...
>In <1992Apr10.013953.1683@nic.umass.edu> s5223927@titan.ucc.umass.edu (Daniel Lescohier) writes:
> 
>>In article <al.702856151@iris> al@iris.claremont.edu 
>>(crispy derson the wearer of wigs) writes:
>>>I am looking for recommendations for fantasy books based on (heavily or not
>>>so) Celtic/Irish myth.  This could include re-tellings of classic myth/legend/
>>>fairy tales, or just books in an Irish vein.  I've heard _The Book Of Kells_
>>>by R. A. MacAvoy (sp?) is a good place to start; any suggestions?
> 
>>	Katherine Kerr's Deverry series (five books so far) is an
>>original story in the traditional Celtic style.  The titles of the
>>five books are:
> 
>>Daggerspell
>>Darkspell
>>The Bristling Wood
>>Dragon Revenant
>>A Time of Exile
> 
>>	Each book is generally divided into more than one "book."
>>Each "book" can skip backward or forward up to a few hundred years.
>>Katherine Kerr follows the different incarnations of several souls,
>>and how their Wyrds intertwine.  Includes dweomermasters.
> 
>I didn't know that there was a fifth?  The series finished with
>the fourth didn't it?
> 

Yes, there is a fifth book, as listed above, _A_Time_of_Exile_.

As yet, I have only seen it as a trade paperback, but would assume that
the regular paperback should be due soon.

>And yes, it's a very good series.
> 

I'll second (or is it third) that!

>--
>         ______________________________________________________________
>	|  A.G. Williams          |        Plus qu'il n'en faut.       |    
>	|  willimsa@unix1.tcd.ie  |                                    |
>	|_________________________|____________________________________|
---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Bill Hart                      | Any opinions expressed are mine, |
| MacNeal-Schwendler Corporation | and may not reflect those of my  |
| b_hart@macsch.com              | employer.                        |
| wfh@macsch.com                 |                                  |
---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rible@vorpal.ucsb.edu (Max Rible)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Zelazny/Amber (Spoilers)
Date: 15 Apr 92 23:38:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: ucsbcsl.4197

Mutant for Hire writes
> In article <4062@ucsbcsl.ucsb.edu> rible@vorpal.ucsb.edu (Max Rible) writes:
> >Jeff Tang writes
> >> 1.  How will the jewel for an eye effect Coral?
> >She said it was like being in a continuous Trump contact. She'll probably
> >first discover something interesting about perception, then usage...
> 
> Question is, how much control does she have over it and vice versa. When
> Merlin probed the thing, she started denying him higher initiation, but
> doesn't remember the experience. Also remember that he is an initate of
> the Jewel as is Ghostwheel, which makes me wonder what this initiation is.

I think the difference is that he was using the power of the spikard
to probe the Jewel, rather than that available to an initiate of the
standard Pattern.  If he'd gone in under his own Amber-related power,
it probably would've worked.  (I also suspect that using the Logrus
would've worked as well, though with more difficulty; Dworkin drew that
first Primal Pattern somehow...)

> 13. Is Luke/Rinaldo still alive? His trump went black. If I just spilled
> blood on the Pattern, I'd be expecting a fast lightning bolt. Of course,
> Brand did it and got out alive, but Brand could also trump out at the
> speed of thought.

It may be that the Pattern can't react fast enough to do anything about
these sorts of trouble: if it could play with force shields and sudden
torrents, it wouldn't have had quite the problem with Martin's blood in the
first place.  My guess is that Luke's currently being held prisoner by
the Pattern against Merlin's good behaviour.

>   Martin Terman, Mutant for Hire, Mad Scientist, Priest of Shub-Internet
Max Rible
From: klaus@diku.dk (Klaus Ole Kristiansen)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Gene Wolfe
Date: 8 Apr 92 08:09:05 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, U of Copenhagen

I have read these books by Wolfe: TheBook of the New Sun, The Urth (sp?) of
the New Sun, Endngered Species.

Wolfe is a great language wizard. I love the language of TBotNS. It gives
the fantasy world a unique, alien feel.

The stories in ES are very different (from each other). They are not all
to my liking, but they are all well written. Three are really great
stories. Those three are also very, very different.

Klaus O K

PS. I bought ES because someone said on the net that it contains
3 really great stories. I agree, but I wonder if we we agree on which
they are. For me it's War beneath the Tree, When I Was Ming the Merciless,
and In the House of Gingerbread.
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:5565 rec.arts.books:7678
From: joan@med.unc.edu (Joan Shields)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Why Do People Read Horror?
Date: 8 Apr 92 16:53:48 GMT
Organization: UNC-CH School of Medicine

In article <1992Apr3.130144.4600@digi.lonestar.org> jtisdel@digi.lonestar.org (Michael Tisdel) writes:

>The appeal of Horror, then, appears to be that it is different
>from main stream literature.  It provides windows into the psyche
>of other individuals which one isn't likely to see (i.e. how many
>love stories have a man been driven mad by his guilt as in "The
>Tell Tale Heart"?).  It also provides an escape from the real world
>where there is no clear good and evil to a fantasy world where the
>evil is self-evident.

The above reason applies to me as well.  I like the psychological horror
and suspense of Lovecraft and Poe.  Another reason is that a lot of them
are just plain good stories - you know, that illusive thing called a plot.
I've always been partial to a strong plot.  



Joan
From: heinzman@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Bill Heinzman)
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 22:23:54 GMT
Subject: Issac Asimov
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Loveland, CO
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written

   Listening to NPR on the way into work. Issac Asimov died tody at
   age 72.

   WKH                                  heinzman@hpisla.lvld.hp.com
                                        Measurment Systems Division
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: u8706558@cs.uow.edu.au (Sean Volke)
Subject: Re: Asimov
Organization: Dept of Computer Science, Wollongong University, Australia
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 04:39:57 GMT

seiler@amarna.gsfc.nasa.gov (Ed Seiler) writes:
>I also have a complete (to the limits of what I have been able to find)
>bibliography, which lists both hardback and paperback editions, together
>with publisher, publishing date, ISBN #, Library of Congress call numbers,
>etc. It is 132-column ASCII text, and runs about 157K. If anyone wants a copy,
>let me know.

>Ed Seiler
>seiler@amarna.gsfc.nasa.gov

It would probably be a good idea to post this on the net as there seems
to be several of us after it.

The Snail

		<Can't quite get my .sig to work.>
-- 
**************************************************************************
*    ___        |							 *
*   /   \  THE  |     I am unquestionably,absolutely,certifiably         *
*  | O  | SNAIL |			insane !!!			 *
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: amorgan@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Crunchy Frog)
Subject: Re: A.C. Clarke a Channeller?
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 18:26:54 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.132730.2849@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> 
  craigb@ot.austin.ibm.com writes:
>Last night I heard a tape of a guy named James Mullaney talking
>about UFOs and he said that Arthur C. Clarke recently admitted
>that (get this) he didn't write _Childhood's End_, but that he
>channelled it.
>
>Uh...this is a little too weird for a midwest boy like me. 
>
>Does Clarke really believe he channelled _Childhood's End_?
>Or is this part of a massive government disinformation project? :-)

I am sure he doesn't believe this, and I am equally sure he didn't
say it (methinks Mullaney has been smoking something unusual).

>Craig

C Frog
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: orson@bluemoon.rn.com (Craig Smith)
Subject: STEVEN BRUST / VLAD TALTOS / GENES
Organization: Blue Moon BBS ((614) 868-998[024])
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 92 00:11:00 EDT

I remember asking about what Brust said about genes and the ability
to control chaos.  I refound an interesting quote from "Jhereg":

  "And Morrolan Doesn't have the skill to create chaos?  Poor fellow.  How 
can he live without it?"
  Aliera chuckled.  "It isn't a skill one can learn.  It goes back to 
genes again.  So far as I know, it is only the e'Kieron line of the House 
of the Dragon that holds the ability--although it is said that Kieron 
himself never used it."
  "I wonder," I said, "how genetic heritage interacts with reincarnation 
of the soul."
  "Oddly," said Aliera e'Kieron.

Later, when he writes:

  Dissolve them in chaos.
  The phrase rang through my mind, and echoed through the warehouse of my 
memory.  "I wonder how genetic heritage interacts with reincarnations of 
the soul."
  "Oddly."
  *I was Aliera's brother.*

He then throws the ball of chaos.

It seems then, that *heritage* of genes is important.  In other words, the 
interaction of the soul with the body is important.  Having been in a body 
that had the e'Kieron genes, he had the latent ability to create chaos. He 
should then also have the latent ability to control it, which Aliera later 
verified.

Any comments?

Craig E. Smith                                        csmith@onetouch.COM
Columbus, OH                                        orson@bluemoon.rn.com
"Life is a fulltime occupation."--Gene Kalman   ...!uunet!onetouch!csmith
"It's just one .sig after another."--me   ///<<<{{{[[[(((*)))]]]}}}>>>\\\
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: amorgan@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Crunchy Frog)
Subject: Re: SF about doing science ?
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 03:03:27 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.015358.19628@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> 
  ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Thomas Koenig) writes:
>doom@elaine5.Stanford.EDU (Joseph Brenner) writes:
>
>>I want to ask here for recommendations for "science" fiction
>>stories that are actually about the social process of doing
>>science, as opposed to engineering (or psuedo-scientific
>>magic or mysticism, for that matter).   
>
>One book which I can definitely recommend is "Cantor's Dilemma" by
>(forgot the name of the author, unfortunately)

Carl Djerassi.

.. stuff deleted ..

>Thomas Koenig, ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz

C Frog
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Irish/Celtic Fantasy
From: bill@mathnx.math.byu.edu (Bill Smith)
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 18:09:11 GMT
Organization: Brigham Young University -- Mathematics Department

In article <1992Apr10.050159.22776@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> pciszek@isis.cs.du.edu
(Paul Ciszek) writes:
> The _King of Ys_ quadrology by Poul and Karen Anderson has an Irish plotline
> that appears to contain about as much effort as the Ysan plotline.  The
> Andersons research things exaustively, and feel no compulsion to "nice up"
> other cultures.
>
> --
> Paul Ciszek, pciszek@nyx.cs.du.edu | Saddam Hussein still has a job; do you?

Robert E. Howard had some kind of Celtic character didn't he?
I'm thinking of Bran MacMorn (sp).  Then again, I guess he was
a *Pict* - a race he had some kind of special affection for.  But in
Howards fantasy, the Picts were the original inhabitants of just about
everywhere ;-)
--
Professor William V. Smith
Phone: 1-801-378-2061 Fax: 1 801 378 2800
email: smithw@hamblin.math.byu.edu  or  uunet!hamblin.math.byu.edu!smithw
NeXTmail: bill@mathnx.math.byu.edu
SMail: Math Dept. -- 314 TMCB; BYU; Provo, UT 84602 (USA)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: eam3@po.CWRU.Edu (Eric A. Meyer)
Subject: Re: Asimov dead 6 April 1992
Reply-To: eam3@po.CWRU.Edu (Eric A. Meyer)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 92 02:04:05 GMT


In a previous article, scott@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG () says:

>According to reports received from matt@oddjob.uchicago.edu (Matt Crawford)
>and langbein@gandalf.rutgers.edu (The Fugitive), Isaac Asimov (age 72) died
>this morning in NYU Hospital, of kidney and heart failure.
>
>"No eulogy needed, none attempted." -- Matt Crawford.
>
>I second.

I third, fourth, and fifth.
Damn.

		-EMeyer
-- 
"Unstable condition--a symptom of life       | Eric A. Meyer (eam3@po.CWRU.edu)
 In mental and environmental change          |  President, Beta Nu Chapter of
 Atmospheric disturbance--the feverish flux  |      Theta Chi Fraternity
 Of human interface and interchange-"  -N.P. |  Drink 'Bite The Wax Tadpole'!!
From: erich@lighthouse.caltech.edu (Erich Schneider)
Subject: Re: different kind of universe
Organization: California Institute of Technology
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 00:53:43 GMT

In article <NICKH.92Apr14182131@VOILA.VENARI.CS.CMU.EDU> nickh@CS.CMU.EDU (Nick Haines) writes:

>I've written a few stories set in a universe of my own devising, with
>some rather different physical laws. I'd like opinions and ideas on
>the physics and sociology.

>To start with, gravity doesn't work the way it does here. I'll explain
>how it _does_ work below. (I get this out of the way to avoid the
>obvious flames). And the universe appears blatantly artificial to us,
>but so what (remember the Arch in Ringworld).

[lots more about weird physics deleted]

Warning: mild criticism ahead

One of the most interesting statements I ever heard about SF was at a
panel discussion at a convention about four years ago. It was made by
Barbara Hambly, and the panel's topic was (I think) "Inventing Fantasy
Worlds".

Hambly said (I paraphrase): "A large number of times people have come
up to me and asked for criticism of their science fiction stories.  I
agree to listen.  They then begin describing their story with, 'Well,
there's this _world_, see, and...' and begin describing it.  I usually
stop them at this point and ask: 'But what's the story _about_?', and
they say again, 'But there's this _world_, see, and...'." 

She went on to make a statement that I agree with: that setting should
flow from the story you're trying to tell, or more generally, what
you're trying to talk about with the story.

This speech changed the way I look at SF.  I think it's demonstrably
valid.  The truly great SF stories put story first and let the setting
help in telling it.  Only a maverick few manage to foreground the
setting and succeed. (_Rondezvous with Rama_ and _Ringworld_ come to
mind.)  _Dune_ has an incredibly detailed environment that is
important to the story, but it succeeds because the story itself is so
powerful.  The same is true of _Lord of the Rings_.  Without the
excellent story to go along with it, Tolkien's brilliantly constructed
societies are dry as dust to most people. (Which is why many who love
_LOTR_ can't stand most of _The Silmarillion_.) And while _Ringworld_
is mildly interesting to me as a science aficionado, it doesn't
impress me as much as "Flatlander", _A Gift from Earth_, or the Gil
Hamilton stories, for the same reason.

So why not go ahead and tell us what your stories are _about_?

(PS: One of my favorite SF works is Le Guin's _Always Coming Home_.
Some might say that my thinking this book is brilliant is inconsistent
with my above position. I don't think so, because _ACH_ isn't a
narrative in the traditional sense, and pretty much tells its story
without characters. _ACH_ is an excellent example of setting telling
the story and not obscuring it.)
--
erich@lighthouse.caltech.edu

"Today/Yes  Winners/Yes Losers/Yes  In the Zone/Yes  Tomorrow/No"
                       - Walter Jon Williams, _HardWired_
From: cgy@cs.brown.edu (Curtis Yarvin)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Critics
Date: 7 Apr 1992 16:53:01 GMT
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
NNTP-Posting-Host: swamp.cs.brown.edu

In article <1992Apr7.155011.2358@u.washington.edu> gwangung@milton.u.washington.edu (Just another theatre geek.....) writes:
|In article <ku29n7INNrri@stanley.cis.Brown.EDU> cgy@cs.brown.edu (Curtis Yarvin) writes:
|>In article <1992Apr6.151732.6712@u.washington.edu> gwangung@milton.u.washington.edu (Just another theatre geek.....) writes:
|>
|>Artists are, by and large, decent folk, with a greater tendency to
|>honesty than sugar magnates and other recipients of Federal pork.  But any
|>system that turns them into amateur bureacrats who spend their time looking
|>for bigger and better nipples on the Federal Tit, instead of honest crafters
|>trying to please their customers, is a perversion of nature.
|
|	But the problem is that, under ANY system, artists are going to have
|spend time being amateur bureaucrats.
|
|If it isn't cultivating donors, it's spending time marketing, promoting and
|publicizing.

In my oh-so-slightly-warped opinion, there's a fundamental ethical difference
between trying to convince a bureaucrat who has (gasp) stolen someone else's
money to give it to you, and trying to persuade people that your show's a
lot of fun and they should go see it.  Stapling up posters on telephone
poles and sending releases to your local newspaper is hardly what I'd call
"bureaucracy."

|>I've spent enough time haranguing against those who'd like to forcibly bend
|>society to fit their intellectual ideals. 
|
|	Physician, heal thyself.

A fine point, but the nil solution is always objective.

c
From: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Dead authors still going strong (was $$$$$ DUNE SERIES $$$$$)
Date: 9 Apr 92 03:21:06 GMT
Reply-To: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <00344@meph.UUCP> gsarff@meph.UUCP writes:
> In article <qqcpnINNosn@agate.berkeley.edu>, cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu writes:
> >I don't know if the publisher could trademark Herbert's name after the
> >fact.  If they could, you might indeed see Dune stories in endless
> >series like Perry Rhodans.  (but you will not see me reading them.)
> >
> 
> I have some perry rhodans, from the dark times when I was a kid.  Are they
> still putting them out, if not how many were there when they finally stopped?

Do you read German?  8-)

The originals are a weekly 64-page newprint magazines, dime novels if you will.
The Perry Rhodan series in the US was based on translations of these combined/
edited to novel length.  I believe the orginal series is still going forward,
but the US versions are long gone...

-- 
George Robbins - now working for,     uucp:   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr
but no way officially representing:   domain: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com
Commodore, Engineering Department     phone:  215-431-9349 (only by moonlite)