From: (Gerry Gryschuk)
Subject: Re: In Defence of Fair-Weather Fans
Organization: University of Saskatchewan
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 22:28:36 GMT

From article <7756@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>, by genetic+@pitt.edu (Dr. Dave):
> Thus spake (Gerry Gryschuk):
> 
>>From article <1992Oct12.084618.1@uwovax.uwo.ca>, by jpalmer@uwovax.uwo.ca (The Econoclast):
> 
>>> In Defence of Fair-Weather Fans
>>> by John Palmer
>>[a whole bunch of bandwagon rationalizing deleted ...]
> 
>>All I can say to this John is that although the feeling of cheering for a
>>winning team is good it is nothing compared to cheering for a loosing team
>>that eventually gets to be a winning team. Sticking with a team through
>>its worst times makes the good times infinitely more gratifying. 
> 
> Gerry, like John Reynard before you, you seem to have missed the point of 
> what John Palmer was saying.  Nowhere did he say that it is *wrong* to be
> a fan of a bad team, or to get enjoyment out of baseball in whatever way
> works best for you.  What he *did* say is that there is no inherent *moral*
> superiority that attaches to "loyalty to the team".  Neither you nor John
> Reynard have said anything to contradict that claim.  You may personally
> think that Palmer's ideas are icky, and misguided, but you haven't really
> disagreed with the main point of his article.
> 

But Dave he also said he "couldn't understand how such masochistic loyalty
came to be elevated to a virtue for so many people". He also asked,
"Why bother?"(alleging loyalty to a losing team). It is not necessary
to always be totally contradictory and I wasn't attempting to be. I was
simply trying to indicate in a short message how we as die-hards could
see this quality as a virtue. The extreme gratification of watching your
team win after so many disappointments is the main quality in this and
that's what I was trying to indicate.

Your right though I do find fair-weather fans a distraction and even
after John's article I still can't accept them as fans of my team,
however I do accept them as fans of baseball in general. In this latter
sense neither die-hards or fair-weather fans have a claim to moral
superiority. I was/am not trying to claim any.

> Yes, it's tremendously gratifying to follow a bad team that becomes good.
> Does this mean that people who *don't* stick with bad teams should be subject
> to censure?  No, it just means that they won't get that same rush you get.
> Their loss.

Your right the tone of my article does lend the idea that I really detest
fair-weather fans. Sorry. Fans of the game of baseball no matter how they get
their enjoyment should not be poorly judged as you indicate.

> 
> Consider
>>all the die-hard Jays fans that are right now in a near state of ecstasy,
>>I submit that you will never know how really good this feels.
> 
> What does this have to do with whether or not it is a character flaw to be
> a fair-weather fan?  That was the claim being refuted.  

Again, it doesn't. There was however more in the article than simply
refutation of an alleged character flaw.
--
Gerald Gryschuk            Saskatoon,Saskatchewan = a place with 9 months
gerry@sask.usask.ca           of hockey and 3 months of poor skating.
Go Habs!!!		             (Maldonado is a bum.)