HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dleland@dante.nmsu.edu (LELAND)
Subject: Re: Champions: mage special effects
Organization: New Mexico State University, Las Cruces, NM
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:22:40 GMT

In article <RATINOX.93Jan7104836@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu> ratinox@meceng.coe.northeastern.edu (Lemming Productions Present...) writes:
>
>I do assume that some form of Limitations would be on each Multipower to
>bring the real cost down a bit.

That sounds ok as far as I can see. Again, what's the point level in 
thiss game? It sounds as though you're running with 230-250 point people.
That's a lot for a "fighter" type isn't it? A fighter is a talented normal
who has a lot of equipment. Mages seem to need a lot more points to be 
effective. I don't think you can make a D&D style first level fighter and
a first level or so wizard for the same point cost. 

But maybe that's ok. SHould mages start out (especially your "super" mages)
at a higher point level than other types of FH characters? I think maybe
they should.

Just a thought...


Queen of Swords
dleland@nmsu.edu
From: by670@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Marc-Eivind Cruz Evensen)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Yet more killing attacks
Date: 12 Jan 1993 03:25:11 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


OK, OK, I admit that my original explanation for KA variability was ill
conceived and probably should have been stillborn. (I've received posts
and E-mail to this end)

BUT, I still stand behind the variability of STUN in KAs. Here is my better
expressed, and hopefully better, reasoning. KAs, such as guns or knives
have the unique ability to do damage without a subject fully realizing the
seriousness of the injury. In combat, I have heard of many instances where
a combatant receives a knife wound or bullet wound, not realizing the injury
uintil after the fight, when he sees a blood stain, etc. In my book, this
would count as doing significant BODY and little STUN; also, KAs may be
able to cause "much pain" with little actual damage (little BODY, bug STUN).
Hence, the reason for variabilty in KAs. At the same time, I have never
experienced or heard about a person who was slugged (significantly) and
didn't notice a great amount of pain and suffering immediately afterward.

On the point of my comments about game balance... sorry, I got sidetracked.
Its just that I've seen many games (especially HERO) get out of control
and ruin an otherwise extremely workable system. The original point in 
asking was simply to guage the climate of the game being played.

The nature of KAs is truly, to be variable in the amount of physical damage
they deal out (a narrow miss can still do damage), unlike normal attacks
(I've never really seen a "graze" from a baseball bat (except to the head).
The variability of the damage, as I see it, is not problematic. (NOTE: I'm
talking about BODY, this paricular paragraph is NOT discussing the STUN
issue) (Yes, another one of my senseless asides)

A multiplier, really does not relfect the natureof killing attacks as I have
characterized them above, and does not d justice to an otherwise wonderfully
intergrated and "realistic" system (one of the best, in my opinion).

-- Marc
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: ROLEPLAYING WH40K
Date: 6 Jan 93 21:44:15 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <43117@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>, dtnguyen@sdcc13.ucsd.edu (Take Life One) writes:
> Has anyone ever tried to roleplay characters based upon the
> Warhammer 40K system? I'm not talking miniature rules only, more
> like an actual roleplaying with individual characters. E mail or
> post at your leisure. Thanks
> 
> Dzu

	There is a Warhammer Fanatasy game out right now.  I have never seen
it, but it should be easily modifiable to th 40k system (with modifications-of
course).  Anybody ever done this?



		Lynx/Shade
> 
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: tsang@cs.washington.edu (Donald Tsang)
Subject: Re: Killing Attacks
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 18:38:53 GMT

In article <> max@crash.cts.com (Max Callahan) writes:
>t has been my experience that most people just don't understand how
>killing attacks work, so here is the math behind them. Capture this file
>it's long, and you'll want to have it on hand for later reference as this
>flame war goes on
>            Champions math 101
>            an introduction to damage

[lots deleted; I wish the CTS systems had better editors; Max's article
 might have been readable if well-formatted]

Umm... you (Max) have gone about the analysis all wrong.

The important factor isn't "how often you can put STUN through", or
even "what the average STUN through is", but "how often you one-punch
the villain/hero".

And the answer for KA's is "distressingly close to 1/6 of the time".

(21/216 of the time, you get average-or-better BODY, and x5 STUN, enough
to stun that 18 CON hero with 15 DEF; 10/216 of the time, you get
9-or-more BODY and x4 STUN; 1/216 of the time, you get 12 x3)

So 32/216, or 4/27 of the time (~15%), you will do at least 35 STUN (20
STUN past defenses).  35 STUN is only possible about 1/7000 of the time
with the normal 6d6 EB (7 times in 6^6 possibilities; .015%).

So it's about 1000 times more likely that 2d6K will STUN the guy with
15 DEF and 18 Con.  Once you're stunned, you're pretty much doomed in
a one-on-one.

The BIG objection to this is you don't even have to take any BODY for this
to occur!  12 resistant PD and 3 normal PD will give you the 15 PD... and
you'll never take any BODY from either the KA or the EB.

Which would you rather have, a 6d6 EB autofire or a 2d6 RKA autofire?
The answer should be obvious... (about 55% chance of stunning on 5 hits
with the RKA, vs about 0.075% with the EB -- the difference goes through
the ceiling with higher DEF totals)

-- 
Donald Tsang                    "Ho!  Haha!  Guard!  Turn!  Parry!  Dodge!
tsang@june.cs.washington.edu     Spin!  Ha!  Thrust!"
..!uw-beaver!june!tsang                       -- Robin Hood Daffy
From: passt1+@pitt.edu (Phil A Sircely)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: What do you look for in a magic system?
Date: 7 Jan 93 00:07:19 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <93006.123635DK6TOPER@MIAMIU.BITNET> DK6TOPER@MIAMIU.BITNET (Dan Karipides) writes:
>This is an informal survey concerning what role-players like in a
>RPG magic system.  (I am currently working on my own system--aren't
>we all--and would greatly appreciate you opinions.)
>

I want my magic system to be not one of spells that are already setup for me
, although some initial spells are important.  I want a system that is based
on realms of magic.  So that I can create my own spells by combining realms.

Yea I know Someone is bound to say look at Ars Magica.  And yes that is a 
similar idea to the one i've stated which I like but I would lean toward
this creationalitic system.  

I personally would try to make a unique system that works this in this flexable
way.  Maybe I would treat realms as Skill areas and treat them just like 
my other skills.  Maybe I would treat realms like areas within a person
that could be tapped in part or in full depending on my power

Philip R. Spagnolli



-- 
---------        Philip R. Spagnolli               University of Pittsburgh
---------        passt1@pmax1.cis.pitt.edu
have a nice day              
if you can.  HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAH
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: dvandom@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dave Van Domelen)
Subject: Advice to Indie Game Companies
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 03:14:03 GMT

In a short article/letter in #1 of the New Space Gamer, "Red" Rahm has more 
than a few things to say about selling your own system.  I am copying this from
page 3 of issue 1, and feel the content of it gives implicit permission to 
reproduce in this situation (and if it doesn't, Red knows where I live)

     [brags about how his system is the finest now on the market, he has 
learned from the greats and improved on their stuff]
     "However, those whose designs I have yet to see, those who have a game or 
just an idea in the works, you are the ones I fear.  But you better take a 
lesson, else you will blunder like those already in the arena.  Believe in your
game system, self promote and above all tinker with a good thing.  If you do 
not think your idea is by far the greatest, how will you ever convince someone 
else that it is[?]  Do not design a mediocre game; let the professionals do 
that.  Design something inspirational, and take the throne from me.  (My own 
rise has been arduous, and I plan not to fall too easy.)  Yet, I also hope I 
become a has-been, and someone will pick up the standard of originality and 
charge the breach.  Maybe we'll even join forces, and I can help you see your 
designs get out in print.
     "Above all, don't forget - play and play and play and play your designs.  
There's always room for another designer.  There's always room for more players
at the table.  There's always a place for those who have stopped gaming to 
return.  Without new games there will never be new players.  Repackaging of old
games will not expand our hobby.  Expanding the number of games and the number 
of players will give more authors a chance to see others enjoy their designs."

     Inspirational enough?
          Dave Van Domelen, "Your face in the mud, you glance up at the strange
stumbling object and realize you're watching your own decapitated body trying 
to make its way without you."  #8 on "13 Cool and Hideous Ways to Die" in Space
Gamer #1.
Xref: sparky rec.games.frp.misc:10496 rec.games.frp.dnd:7899
From: camelsho@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (   James A Seymour)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: META RACES: CITYBOOK V--Ruffiri and Effigies
Date: 6 Jan 1993 08:03:45 -0600
Organization: Kansas State University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

I have long admired the CITYBOOKs in Flying Buffalo's
Catalyst Series.  I was lucky enough to pick up IV &
V on the used shelves of our local game store, THE
MASTER GAMER.  (He generally sells used gaming items
for no more than half price, depending on the condition.)
I would highly recomend any of these books to GM's
interested in new ideas.

In CBV, I was immediately take by the news races presented.
If any of you out there use any of these races in your games,
please post how you handle them in terms of game mechanics.
I'm an particularly interested in the Effigie and Ruffiri
races.  

Brief Racial Overviews:

Effigie...  Smallish humanoids with the abilities to alter
their sizes and looks to fit a wide variety of human types.
They are able to withstand a great deal of pain.  Tempering
the racial advantages are the facts that environmental 
conditions have been kind only to those with subservient 
tendencies.  Also, as a race, effies are very susceptible
to ANY magic---no matter the form.

Ruffiri...  A fairy spawned metamorph race. i.e. Ruffiri go
through 4 different stages if they survive to full developement.
The first resemble cats/dogs.  Second comes a low to average
intel small furred humanoid.  Third stage is expansion of
mental abilities.  Fourth comes the immortal Masters of the
highest intel and appear as the racial type of the viewer.

james seymour/camel/camelsho@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.board
From: casper@vxcrna.cern.ch (CASPER,DAVI./PPE)
Subject: Re: Dumb Moves By Game Companies
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:28:00 GMT

In article <LwXywB3w165w@Micor.OCUnix.on.ca>, alsandor@Micor.OCUnix.on.ca (Michel Boucher) writes...
>casper@vxcrna.cern.ch (CASPER,DAVI./PPE) writes:
> 
>> AH's predilection for dividing game rules into basic and advanced under separ
>> covers, requiring incessant leafing through both; for instance see the rules
>> to Firepower.
>> 
> 
>Actually, I don't find that annoying at all.  In fact, it does make 
>playing the game somewhat easier for me.  It seems that the particular
>games that have that feature were either designed or developed by
>Craig Taylor.  

It would be OK, if the "advanced" rules were complete in themselves.  I can't
see the utility of leafing through both documents to see, for instance, LOS
rules (basic) and exceptions/special cases (advanced).  


Dave

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: myleslee@next16pg2.wam.umd.edu (Alan Brady Ward)
Subject: Re: superhero game suggestions
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 14:03:34 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.082822.23896@nmsu.edu> dleland@dante.nmsu.edu  
(LELAND) writes:
> In article <6842@npri6.npri.com> murphy@npri6.npri.com (David P. Murphy)  
writes:
> >i am sheduled to begin GMing a superhero game (our group finally got  
tired
> >of AD&D and wants a change :-) and would like to hear opinions about 
> >HERO CHAMPIONS or any other system.
> 
You may have never heard of it, but the best hero system I know is DC  
Heroes by Mayfair Games.  Though the rules take some getting used to, once  
you do you'll wonder how you ever did any other hero game without them.  

Basically everything is based on attribute points (APs).  There are two  
basic charts which are referenced to find out how successful and how  
effective an action was.  Everything is measured in APs, whether it be an  
AP of length, weight, time, etc.  Two APs is twice as much as one AP,  
three APs is twice as much as two APs and four times as much as one AP,  
and so forth.

There are nine Stats broken down into Physical, Mental and Mystical  
attributes (rows) as well as Acting/Opposing, Effect and Resistance  
attributes (columns).

DEX, STR, BODY
INT, WILL, MIND
INFL, AURA, SPIRIT

Powers and skills are again, measured in APs and Powers can be Physical,  
Mental or Mystical.

There's much more to the game, and you would have to learn some  
fundamentals.  It would take a few sessions to get comfy with all the  
details, but once you do, you'll, IMHO, find it a great system.
From: 911087e@axe.acadiau.ca (JOHN ANTHONY ENZINAS)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SRII:  Physical Adepts
Date: 8 Jan 93 15:06:01 GMT
Organization: Acadia University

In article <C0HxCL.B13@visix.com> gray@visix.com (Gray Jones) writes:
>From: gray@visix.com (Gray Jones)
>Subject: SRII:  Physical Adepts
>Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 18:14:45 GMT

>Wow, SRII sure did knock those crazy physical adepts down a peg or two....

>I just want to double check, are there any misprints in the physical adept
>section of the SRII book?

>Did the game designers decide that a starting Physical Adept should not be
>a match for a starting Samurai?

>Case in point:

>A samurai buys Wired reflexes 2, he can do this with the Priority B Resources
>(400000 Y).  He gets
>+4 reaction and +2D6 initiative dice.  Let's assume the samurai also takes
>attributes priority A
>and has 6's in both Quickness and Intelligence (that means a Reaction of 6 for
>the folks at home).
>For a 1/2 of his available essence and about 40% of his available money, he
>gets a 10 reaction and
>3 initiative dice.

>A physical adept wants to go toe-to-toe with the same samurai.  He has the
>same attributes,
>and attempts to buy enough Improved Reaction and Improved Reflexes to have the
>same 
>initiative dice and Reaction.  He spends 4 points on 2 extra dice of
>initiative and 8 points to
>raise his reaction up to 10 (4 points above the racial maximum).  I think it
>is rediculous that
>a PA must be a grade 6 initiate to have the same initiative as a starting
>samurai.

>If there is no misprint, could somebody please post some useful house rules
>that put the
>PA somewhere between SR (where they were too powerful) and SRII.

>thanks
>--gray

your best bet is to use the reaction rules from the first Grimoir. you are 
still slower than a sam but remember you can also get things like killing 
hands and combat sensce.
--johnny vague
From: un107041@wvnvms.wvnet.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Dumb Moves By Game Companies
Date: 7 Jan 93 09:34:28 GMT
Followup-To: rec.games.frp.misc
Organization: West Virginia Network for Educational Telecomputing



Well, I might as well toss my two cents in here.

While I really like FASA's second edition rules for Shadowrun, I don't like
what they did with the equipment tables.  If you would like updated character
sheets with the new damage codes and legality codes, you first have to look up
the piece of equipment in SRII, this isn't as easy as it sounds, since some of
the stuff is in the equipment section, and others are in the sourcebook update
sections.  Now this is all fine and good, but to get the legality codes, you
have to get ShadowTech out and find them.  It gets a little anoying flipping
back and forth in SRII and then over to ShadowTech.  I really wish FASA would
come out with a tell all equipment list, not commentary, no pictures, just the
equipment list and the applicable codes.  It would make character generation a
little easier, not to mention updating old characters.


Scott
williams@cs.wvu.wvnet.edu
or
un107041@wvnvms.wvnet.edu
From: mjo@iao.ford.com (Mike O'Connor)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Dumb Moves By Game Companies
Date: 8 Jan 1993 22:53:39 GMT
Organization: Not an official spokesperson for Ford Motor Company
Reply-To: Mike O'Connor <mjo@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost

In article <1462@blue.cis.pitt.edu> seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:

:	FGU's publishing really marvelous games (V&V, Space Opera) and
:never advertising, revising, or even redoing the artwork. The simple
:lack of repackaging and advertising destroyed them.

I wouldn't necessarily call V&V "marvelous" -- never much cared for
the fact that most of the defenses simply consisted of less of a
chance to hit someone and that whole play-yourself-as-a-superhero bit
that they recommended.  Space Opera seemed decent, but I never really
got a chance to play it.

						...Mike

-- 
 Michael J. O'Connor           |  Internet:  mjo@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com
 Ford Motor Company, OPEO      |  UUCP:      ...!{backbone}!fmsrl7!mjo
 20000 Rotunda, Bldg. 1-3001   |  Phone:     +1 (313) 248-1260
 Dearborn, MI  48121           |  Fax:       +1 (313) 323-6277
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: tkelly@unix2.tcd.ie (Mithrandir)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Vampire: yet another question
Keywords: Vampire
Date: 11 Jan 93 16:07:58 GMT
Organization: Trinity College, Dublin

In <C0ouoC.7CL@sci.kun.nl> gip207@sci.kun.nl (gip2 course) writes:

>Now for one question I forgot in my last post. This one is about the Thauma-
>turgic Paths mentioned in the Sourcebook (Movement of the Mind, Lure of
>Flames and Weather Control). The alternate paths mentioned in the Players
>Guide (which is still 1st Edition as far as I can tell) seem to work like
>disciplines but those in the sourcbook don't make any sense at all. For
>instance at Lure of Flames it is mentioned that only small flames can be
>created at lower levels of abilities, but the only indication given on the
>size of the fires is the number of successes rolled, and a roll of this
>kind is easier at lower levels and so has a greater chance of creating larger
>fires......

   The entries on the paths saying 
     "one sucess 
      two sucesses"
   and so on are typos.

      They should read " *
                         **
                         ***
      etc. for all three Paths presented in the 2ed Vampire.

    They make much more sense this way.

>The only alterations I can think of is that the successes mentioned at the end
>of the Path descriptions should be replaced by rating points but even then they
>don't make perfect sense. Any suggestions on this subject would be most 
>welcome.

  Why don't the dots make perfect sense?
 They represent your growing ability in the path, don't they?

>			-Jos
--
 Haggis: Haggis is a black pudding eaten by the Scots and considered not
only a delicacy, but fit for human consumtion.The minced heart, liver
and lungs of a sheep are mixed with oatmeal and boiled in the sheep's
stomach before ...Excuse me a minute... [Mithrandir/tkelly@unix2.tcd.ie]
From: P.C.Steele@newcastle.ac.uk (P. Steele)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Spell locks
Date: 5 Jan 93 14:02:09 GMT
Organization: University of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK, NE1 7RU
Originator: n1z6g@tuda


In article <1992Dec22.072334.9075@coe.montana.edu>, icsu0237@cs.montana.edu (Jeff Patterson) writes:

[stuff about spell locks being used deleted ]
> 	I am trying to keep the balance by "charging" 1 point of karma
> a month per lock to keep the astral link secure.  If he doesn't pay the
> point, there is a chance that the link will unstailize and suck him into
> astral space; no hope of return.  Is this fair?  Am I missing something
> in the rules?  Is it answered in SRII?  How do you guys handle it?

I personally think you are being a little unfair in making your mage spend 1
point of karma a month. After all there is nothing in the rules to say that spell
locks can give up working on their own accord and suck someone off into astral
space. (Of course the GM is always the final decision maker on such things).

The way I would handle it is next time you send the group into combat have an
astrally projecting mage in the area and have him groud spells into those spell
locks. Yes you can do that it says so in the rules. You can also be really nasty
and start grounding area effect spells like powerball into his spell lock. This
not only effects him but it effects anyone in the area as if a powerball had been
cast on the mage in question in the usual fashion.

You could also have the mage attack the spell lock itself. All spell locks have
a force of 1 no matter what force spell they are holding (this is different for
quickenings). Any mage worth his/her salt should be able to defeat a spell lock
in astral.
-- 
Phillip Steele

P.C.Steele@uk.ac.ncl
From: boyes@forty2.enet.dec.com (Mark Boyes)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Yet more killing attacks
Date: 11 Jan 93 15:32:14 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1993Jan10.084255.14568@netcom.com>, akuma@netcom.com (Steven E Barnes) writes...

(Exteme variation in damage from a 4d6 Hero System Killing Attack)
> 
>Isn't this absurd?  Shouldn't the damage from an attack
>be reasonably consistent?  What is the real-world explanation
>for this amazing variance?
> 
>-steve
> 

Even the biggest, fastest, pointiest bullet can cause a flesh wound?

`Marky' Mark Boyes | Mantra: I'd much rather have a trampoline in my front room 
16 West Court,     |         than an isolation tank.
Osney Island,      | Mail: Mark.Boyes@reo.mts.dec.com   | Kinsey rating: Nobody 
Oxford, OX2 0NP    | Day: 0734 206708 Night: 0865 725151 |  knows I'm straight.
Xref: sparky rec.games.frp.misc:10528 rec.games.board:13016
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.board
Subject: Re: Dumb Moves By Game Companies
From: dudleyh@redgum.ucnv.edu.au (Dudley Horque)
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 03:03:22 GMT
Organization: UCNV, Bendigo, Victoria, Australia

In article <1993Jan4.114519.10737@odin.diku.dk> torbenm@diku.dk (Torben AEgidius Mogensen) writes:
>acadams@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Arthur C. Adams) writes:
>
>>Non-RPG companies getting into RPG's. It bloodied SPI. Avalon Hill
>>never did well with anything except RuneQuest.
>
>Avalon Hill's "Powers and Perils" is actually not a bad system, but
>...

I firmly believe that Avalon Hill's Tales From The Floating Vagabond is
one of the best game systems ever written. It's well written, funny, and
succinct.

If anyone's at a Con in Australia, check to see if there's a T2FV
event... it's probably mine. At CanCon the scenario Idle Idol Eye will
be run - try it.


-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Ciao4niao                                 My philosophy on life is far too deep
Dudley Arthur Horque                   to fit into two lines... I'd need three.