HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ggolden@msen.com (Glenn Golden)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: Wanted: info about Object Magazine
Date: 8 Oct 1992 18:52:03 GMT
Organization: MSEN, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, MI
NNTP-Posting-Host: heifetz.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

I am reading the latest issue of Object Magazine
(published by SIGS). I recommend this to object fans.

I am inspired by the articles I am reading, and want
to converse with the authors, or even the editor
or publisher ... but there are NO EMAIL addresses or
even phone numbers listed in the issue!  I can't even
get a phone # for the magazine, based on the NY address
listed in the issue!

You would think that communications would be encouraged
in a new, high tech, emerging field such as this!  I do!
(even if it has been emerging for 25 years!)

***

If anyone has an EMAIL address for this magazine, or for
the editor, Marie Lenzi, or the published, Richard
Friedman, please EMAIL this to me!

***

If anyone associated with magazine is reading, please
take this as a request to include this information about
your staff and authors in future issues.

Thanks!

- Glenn R. Golden, Dexter  MI.
  (home) ggolden@msen.com
  (work) ggolden@comshare.com
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: maxtal@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (John MAX Skaller)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: Re: o.m(...) vs m(...), and is the real world o-o?
Date: 9 Oct 92 19:57:50 GMT
Organization: MAXTAL P/L C/- University Computing Centre, Sydney

In article <Bvq4tr.GI9@inews.Intel.COM> <ssmith@LOX.intel.com> (Stephen P. Smith) writes:
>In article<1992Oct4.150650.9408@ucc.su.OZ.AU>maxtal@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (John MAX Skaller) writes:
>> 
>> SO all systems either enforce the interface or they crash,
>> either at compile time or run-time or both. At compile time
>> is far better, for obvious reasons.
>> 
>
>Funny, my machine doesn't crash when it gets run-time errors:

I didnt say it would crash when it got a run-time error.
Reporting a run-time error IS enforcing the interface.
>
>I can tell the machine to do the right thing(tm).
>
>Perhaps you are using old software? :-)

	The paint has not yet dried on my compiler :-)


-- 
;----------------------------------------------------------------------
        JOHN (MAX) SKALLER,         maxtal@extro.ucc.su.oz.au
	Maxtal Pty Ltd, 6 MacKay St ASHFIELD, NSW 2131, AUSTRALIA
;--------------- SCIENTIFIC AND ENGINEERING SOFTWARE ------------------
From: tmb@arolla.idiap.ch (Thomas M. Breuel)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: Re: Polymorphism (was: Re: comparing object-oriented platforms)
Date: 15 Oct 92 22:11:25 GMT
Reply-To: tmb@idiap.ch
Organization: IDIAP (Institut Dalle Molle d'Intelligence Artificielle
	Perceptive)
In-reply-to: hall@dec254.uucp's message of 14 Oct 92 20:04:08 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.200408.17846@dec254.uucp> hall@dec254.uucp (Phil Hall) writes:

   But [CARD85] says:

     "The semantics of generic procedures is macroexpansion driven by the type
      of the arguments.  Thus generic procedures can be considered
      abbreviations for sets of monomorphic procedures."

   I am not familiar with "ML-style polymorphism" but I expect it is the
   same as "generic procedures" above.

   The way I understand [CARD85]'s parametric polymorphism is that 
   the same *implementation* accepts a parameter of any type or some set
   of types.  I've heard the "any type" version refered to as "pure" 
   polymorphism.  This assessment would label "parameterized
   types/generics/ML-style polymorphic functions" as overloading
   rather the parametric polymorphism.

   Is this a correct assessment?

No. Overloading means that you write several different functions with
differently typed arguments, but you happen to give them the same
name. Milner- (ML-) style polymorphism means that you write one
function that can be applied to arguments of a variety of different
types, as long as those types are used consistently.

Now, is Milner-style polymorphism a trivial feature? When evaluating
type systems, probably the most important question to ask is:

 * Does it let me write code in such a way that I can reuse
   it with different types without duplication or unsafe typecasts?

In a monomorphic type system without closures (e.g., C), you clearly
have to duplicate code in many situations.

In a monomorphic static type system with closures with unlimited
extent, or, equivalently, in a monomorphic static type system with
inheritance (pre-3.0 C++), you can reuse some code, but you have
problems giving return values the right type.

You can get around these limitations by providing any of the following
three facilities:

 * dynamic typing with downcasting
 * parameterized modules
 * Milner-style polymorphism

Returning to the original point, yes, to an extent you can view
parameterized modules or Milner-style polymorphism as a sophisticated
form of type-driven macro expansion. However, this makes all the
difference in the world in terms of code reuse.

					Thomas.
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: jmehta@atc1.atc.com (Jaimin Mehta)
Subject: Object-oriented s/w engr tools
Reply-To: jmehta@atc1.atc.com (Jaimin Mehta)
Organization: Advanced Technology Center, Laguna Hills, CA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 20:44:01 GMT

Few months ago somebody had posted a list of diagramming/CASE tools
for object-oriented s/w development.  One of them is OMTool based on
Rumbaugh's OMT and marketed by Versant Object Technology.  

Could somebody repost the (updated?) list or send me an email please.

Thanks.

-jaimin mehta

P.S.: Are there any public domain tools, and if so please comment 
on them.   

###################################################################
         ------------- Jaimin Mehta
        -------------- Advanced Technology Center
       --------------- 22982 Mill Creek Drive
     ---o---ooooo-oooo Laguna Hills, CA 92653
    ---ooo----o---o--- Phone: (714) 583-9119  FAX: (714) 583-9213
  ----o---o---o---oooo Internet: jmehta@atc.com
###################################################################
From: usenet@inesc.pt (USENET News System)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: Help on browsers
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:07:17 GMT
Organization: INESC - Inst. Eng. Sistemas e Computadores, LISBOA, PORTUGAL


Hello

I'm developing a class browser for an OO language called SOM
(Semantic Object Model) and I'm looking for articles and books
about browsers.

I would be grateful if you could send me some information on the matter,
namely, I'm interested in the following issues:

1 - Taxonomy of browsers.

2 - What kind of functions they should offer.

My principal concern is in Class Browser's, but information related with
Instance browser, both OO or Relational based are also wellcome.

Thanks in advance

                   Joao Damasio.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Joao Damasio                                     E-Mail:jcdam@tutor.inesc.pt
INESC Lisboa - Information Systems Group         Tel: +351 1 3100327
Rua Alves Redol 9-4E                             Fax: +351 1 525843
1000 Lisboa Portugal                             Telex: 15696 INESCP
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: dent@DIALix.oz.au (Andrew Dent)
Subject: Re: OOP not GUT of programming?
Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Western Australia
Date: Wed, 07 Oct 92 12:43:18 GMT

>In article <5OCT199215551226@elroy.uh.edu> st1lv@elroy.uh.edu (McLeod, Stephen) writes:
>>I have been talking to a lot of people about this lately and some had the view
>>that OOP was basically a good algorithm for handling the data base handling
>>aspect of a solution be it an OS, a Database, or a guided missile program but
>>that it was not appropriate for writing, say, a compiler, a text editor and
>>so on.

I've written a FORTRAN->Pascal translator where using OOP allowed me to 
devlop generic classes (eg: for I/O) and specialise for different cases.

I've also written a multi-user classified advertisements entry system
where OOP is VERY convenient for packaging ad objects that are editable
within a certain context, and share behaviours with other displayable objects
in composing columns.

Andy Dent (A.D. Software - Mac & VAX programming)
94 Bermuda Dve, BALLAJURA  Western Australia  6066
Phone/Fax: 09 249 2719 (local)  +619 249 2719 (International)
       Internet: dent@DIALix.oz.au    Compuserve: 100033,3241
From: burandt@ira.uka.de (Axel Burandt)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: mail adresses wanted
Date: 15 Oct 1992 14:39:03 GMT
Organization: University of Karlsruhe, FRG
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: i11s14.ira.uka.de

Hello,

I'm looking for the foolowing mail adresses:

Piere America,Philips Research Labs
5600 JA Eindhoven

Frank S. de Boer, Technical University Eindhoven,
5600 MB Eindhoven, The Netherlands

Please sent your answers to:

burandt @ira.uka.de

Thanks

Axel Burandt
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: herkimer@tigercat.den.mmc.com (Don Herkimer)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: OO Complexity Metrics
Date: 7 Oct 92 20:04:58 GMT
Organization: Martin Marietta

I need references for O-O design/code software complexity metrics; i.e.,
recent journal articles, theses, etc.  I'm doing a Master's project in this
area.

Also, if anyone has written complexity measuring code for Smalltalk-80,
please send me mail.


Thanks in advance,
Don
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: Bob Hathaway <objsys@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: o.m(...) vs m(...), and is the real world o-o?
Organization: Object Systems
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 00:41:27 GMT

In article <Bvq4tr.GI9@inews.Intel.COM> <ssmith@LOX.intel.com> (Stephen P. Smith) writes:
>In article<1992Oct4.150650.9408@ucc.su.OZ.AU>maxtal@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (John MAX Skaller) writes:
>> 
>> SO all systems either enforce the interface or they crash,
>> either at compile time or run-time or both. At compile time
>> is far better, for obvious reasons.
>> 
>
>Funny, my machine doesn't crash when it gets run-time errors:
>
>(defun add-to-nil (x) (+ x nil))
>ADD-TO-NIL
>(compile 'add-to-nil)
>ADD-TO-NIL
>(add-to-nil 10)
>Trap: The second argument to the ADD instruction, NIL, was not a number
>While in the function ADD-TO-NIL  SI:*EVAL  EVAL
>
>ADD-TO-NIL
>   Arg 0 (X): 10
>s-A,    Supply replacement argument
>s-B:    Return a value from the ADD instruction
>s-C:    Retry the ADD instruction
>s-D,    Return to Lisp Top Level in Dynamic Lisp Listener 2
>s-E:    Restart process Dynamic Lisp Listener 2
> Return a value from the ADD instruction
>Form to evaluate and return: 100
>100
>
>I can tell the machine to do the right thing(tm).
>
>Perhaps you are using old software? :-)

Very funny, but he's wrong even earlier.  There's always exception handling,
checking if the message is there before passing it, catching stray messages
in the object, letting the invoking active object terminate and even just
ignoring the errant message.  Just because a Smalltalk program might crash
doesn't mean there's no way around it.

bob
objsys@netcom.com
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: conrozi@kk188.ericsson.se (Roman Zielinski TT/TSM)
Subject: OOTher 1.04c now available
Organization: Ericsson
Distribution: comp
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 07:16:39 GMT

I've uploaded a patch version of OOTher (1.04c) to Simtel20 and
garbo. SIMTEL has acknowledged upload, garbo not yet...

OOTher is a simple and easy to use graphical OO analysis and design
drawing tool for Coad's notation. It's distributed as shareware
$0 fee for students, $50/(1 lic) for home users, $150/(5 lic) for com users.


The new version (c) contains some smaller bug corrections, including
support for the postscript printers.


To fetch from simtel send a mail to: LISTSERV@VM1.NoDak.EDU
with subject SIMTEL20-request.
Body:

/PDGET MAIL PD1:<MSDOS.WINDOWS3>OOT-104C.ZIP UUENCODE



To fetch from garbo (when it's in) send a mail to:
mailserv@garbo.uwasa.fi, subject: garbo-request
Body:

send win3/programming/oot-104c.zip


Regards
Roman Zielinski [author]
From: bevan@cs.man.ac.uk (Stephen J Bevan)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: Re: Basis of OOP
Date: 16 Oct 92 15:54:17 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Manchester
In-reply-to: thinman@netcom.com's message of 15 Oct 92 21:17:04 GMT

In article <1992Oct15.211704.9602@netcom.com> thinman@netcom.com (Technically Sweet) writes:
   rjk@world.std.com (robert j kolker) writes:

   >Question: What is a proper underlying mathematical model for OOP?

   Great question!  OOP isn't based on mathematics.  OOP is based on
   linguistics! 

   Read the first two chapters of "Women, Fire, and Dangerous Things"
   by George Lakoff.  OOP is an application to computer programming of
   our fundamental linguistic process of categorization.

I take that you therefore think that (mathematical) category theory
has no part to play in the process.


   Reading this book also sheds new light on why the currently
   available OO mechanisms are all limited and klunky.

The same could be said after reading a book on (mathematical) category
theory.

bevan
Xref: sparky comp.object:3946 comp.software-eng:3760
From: mquinn@auzodt3.mel.cocam.oz.au (Michael Quinn)
Newsgroups: comp.object,comp.software-eng
Subject: OBJECTIFYING STRUCTURED APPS
Date: 14 Oct 92 01:21:56 GMT
Followup-To: comp.object
Organization: Co-Cam Computer Group, Oz


To all comp.object and comp.software-eng  netters

I have a dillemma

Our division will be undergoing a gradual transition to an Object oriented
philosohpy (appropriate to the project of course).  As part of 
this transition is the "objectifying" of an existing system that was 
built from the ground-up using the following
	1 Structured Analysis and Design ( ER and DFDs )
	2 Implemented in 4GL and SQL
	3 Relational database
	4 Screen forms definitions for user interface

Having come from a limited SA/SD background, and reading most of the 
"Classical" OO tomes (Rumbaugh, Booch, Coad-yourdon), I am left with 
the impression that maybe Rumbuagh's object model provides a good
starting point in identifying the classes etc and it seems to provide
a transition path from SA/SD, ER's and DFD's.

From the existing system's data model , DFDs and ER diagrams and database
schema, is it a feasilble approach to try to reverse-engineer the 
exisitng system.  Note that we will also be enhancing this existing
system to provide additional functionality.

Another aim of the project is to develop a "library" of re-usable
code and extract this from the existing system (one of the many aims of
"objectification" !!!! ).

I would greatly appreciate the following information:
	Any refereneces that may specifically address the "objectifying" 
of an existing applicaion

	Is this approach fraught with dangers and pitfalls

Personal replies would be appreciated to the address below and perhaps we
could start a discusionn of "OBJECTIFYING STRUCTURED APPS"


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Michael Quinn                        Email to:  mquinn@auzodt3.cocam.oz.au
CoCam Australia                      Phone : 61-3-286-3322
64 Trennery Crescent
Abbostford  3124                       ,-__|\
Victoria  Australia                   /      \
                                      \ _,-._/
                                             *

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: yrichard@erysichthon (Yllona Richardson)
Subject: Re: OO Test Methods
Keywords: OO, software testing
Organization: Fannie Mae
Distribution: comp.object, comp.lang.eiffel, comp.lang.objective-c
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 13:39:32 GMT

In comp.object article <1992Oct5.202235.4252@medtron.medtronic.com> you  
wrote:
> neil@ogicse.cse.ogi.edu (Neil Van Dyke) writes:
> : Can anyone point me towards info on testing of OO systems?
> : 

I'm also interested in finding an adequate test method/mechanism for OO  
systems.  Thus far all I've used is the Eiffel Viewer.  But then again,  
I'm an Eiffel Bigot -).  

The Eiffel Viewer is an interactive tool that allows you to explore the  
object structure.  You can use it to see what each object contains, follow  
references to other objects, set attributes (instance variables), create  
objects etc.  The viewer is implemented as Class VIEWABLE, therefore any  
class (or system) that needs the services of the viewer can inherit from  
Class VIEWABLE. This is especially useful in languages that support  
multiple inheritance; Class VIEWABLE can be easily removed from the  
inheritance tree when debugging is complete. The viewer can be set to  
trigger automatically on failure as well.

Right now I'm exploring the use of the Eiffel Viewer with Objective-C.   
Unfortunately,  support for multiple inheritance in Objective-C is fairly  
obscure (could just be my ignorance), so I'll have to create (or subclass)  
a new class OBJECT, VIEWABLE_OBJECT which must include all the features of  
class VIEWABLE.

Any suggestions out there?


*------------------------------------------------------------------------*
"The large print giveth, and the small print taketh away."  -- Tom Waits
		Yllona Janine Richardson	::	yrichard@fnma.com
		Advanced Technology Group
		FannieMae	(Federal National Mortgage Association)
*------------------------------------------------------------------------*
Newsgroups: comp.object,comp.databases
From: jack@odi.com (Jack Orenstein)
Subject: Re: Oct 1992 Version of Schema Evolution Support Summary
Organization: Object Design, Inc.
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 14:30:42 GMT

In article <Bw117M.AKw.1@cs.cmu.edu> clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU (Stewart Clamen) writes:

    ...

   [The following is the current state of my public survey into the
    schema evolution and database conversion support exhibited by known
    research and commerical DB and OODBMS.  

    Entries prefixed with asterisks have not been updated in a year.  I 
    would very much appreciate any current information on those systems.

   ...

   >> Object Design

   Object Design, to the best of my knowledge, do[es]n't support schema
   evolution at this time.

   [Chet Wood <arc!chet@apple.com>]

   ...

   > ObjectStore

   ObjectStore does not provide schema evolution as yet but it has
   promised to provide schema evolution in the next release.
   [h.subramanian@trl.OZ.AU]


ObjectStore is an ODBMS produced by Object Design, Inc.  Release
2, which is in beta test now, supports schema evolution.  The
kinds of evolution supported include change of a data member's
type, addition and removal of data members, and change in
inheritance structure. There are default transformations built
in, (e.g. from int to float), and user-defined transformations
may be run also.

Jack Orenstein
Object Design, Inc.
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: jgarland@ws20.ips.iacd.honeywell.com (Jeff Garland)
Subject: Re: OOP not GUT of programming?
Keywords: interleaf, object, design, LISP
Organization: Honeywell Industrial Automation & Control
Distribution: comp.object
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 92 15:58:58 GMT

In article <5OCT199215551226@elroy.uh.edu>, st1lv@elroy.uh.edu (McLeod, Stephen) writes:
|> to use it to do everything but is OOD/P really *that* good?
...[stuff deleted]
|> that it was not appropriate for writing, say, a compiler, a text editor and

My understanding is that the Interleaf publishing system was developed 
using object oriented concepts with a LISP implementation.  While people
may quibble about whether it is a good word processor it is clear that
the design is open, extendable, and commercially successful.  Thus it can
be argued that it may be a good design technique for a text editor, whether
it is the best is another question...


-- 
Jeff Garland                     |  If you can't stand the heat...
Phoenix, Az USA                  |  get out of the desert.
jgarland@ips.iacd.honeywell.com    
Just because I say it doesn't mean Honeywell would agree.
Newsgroups: comp.object
From: sp_pm@space.alcbel.be (Paul Moore)
Subject: Repost: Please reread: Has anyone successfully used HOOD?
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 10:52:52 +0100
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X-To: comp.object.usenet

Hello,

I have just started working for a company working in the aerospace field. I
have some questions about the use of HOOD, and I would be grateful for some advice.

1. I have had some experience with the Ward/Mellor and Hatley/Pirbhai
   structured analysis methodologies. There are two excellent books available
   that explain how to use these methodologies [1] and [2], each with
   lots of examples showing how the method is used. It seems that the only
   documents available explaining how to use HOOD are the HOOD User Manual,
   and the HOOD Reference Manual. These two manuals do not explain how to use
   the methodology, and certainly do not explain the methodology to new users.
   Are there any better books available that teach the use of HOOD? It should
   *NOT* be necessary to attend a training course to learn how to use HOOD.

2. It seems that HOOD is used at the structured design level of the 
   analysis/design/implementation software project cycle, as defined by
   Constantine/Page-Jones and Yourdon/Ward/Mellor. This means that its use
   should be preceeded by a structured analysis phase. Is this correct? How
   does it relate to modern structured analysis techniques, such as the two
   mentioned in point 1 above, and which structured analysis methodology is
   recommended for use with the HOOD methodology?

3. It seems that HOOD is oriented towards Ada as the implementation language.
   Does this mean that HOOD is still mandated by ESA when the language used
   is not Ada, for example C and C++. If so, can HOOD still be used if the
   implementation language is not Ada. For example, HOOD appears to take
   advantage of Ada's built-in inter-process-communication facilities. What
   if these facilities are not present in the implementation language used?

I will summarise responses I get to the net, if sufficient interest warrants.

Please respond by email, as I don't have a connection to the News.

Regards, Paul

[1] Structured Development for Real-Time Systems, Vols 1-3, 
    Paul T. Ward and Stephen J. Mellor, 1985.
[2] Strategies for Real-Time System Specification,
    Derek J. Hatley and Imtiaz A. Pirbhai, 1987.

---
Paul Moore,                      email: sp_pm@space.alcbel.be
Alcatel Bell Telephone,
Space Dept. TS 664,              phone: (+32) 3/829.5024
Berkenrodelei 33,
2660 Hoboken,
Belgium
From: burandt@i11s14.ira.uka.de (Axel Burandt)
Newsgroups: comp.object
Subject: mail-adress wanted
Date: 15 Oct 1992 14:28:29 GMT
Organization: University of Karlsruhe, FRG
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: i11s14.ira.uka.de
Keywords: mail-adress wanted


Hello,

I'm looking for the following mail adresses:
 
Pierre America, Philips Research Laboratories
5600 JA Eindhoven, Netherlands

Frank S. de Boer, Technical University Eindhoven
5600 MB Eindhoven, Netherlands

Please sent your answers to the following mail adress:

burandt@ira.uka.de

Thanks a lot

Axel Burandt