HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay)
Subject: Death and Marriage (was Re: Conversion Question)
Organization: International Irony League -- Death before smileys!
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 01:33:25 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.225149.17731@cbnews.cb.att.com> ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet) writes:
>But you ask a theoretical question, one that cannot truly be
>answered.  It's like saying, Tell me, when the resurrection comes,
>will wives, who had the (mis)fortune to outlive several husbands, be
>permitted to stay with their several husbands?

That one's easy. Unless I'm very much mistaken, a marriage is
voided by the death of either partner. Thus, when the woman is
resurrected, she's not married to any of her former husbands. She
might choose to remarry one of them, but it's entirely up to her.

Am I wrong?

-- 
Andrew M. Solovay    "I've learned a secret about keeping house... after
                      four years, the dust doesn't get any thicker."
                                        --Quentin Crisp
From: backon@vms.huji.ac.il
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: ORTHODOX
Date: 11 Nov 92 19:02:12 GMT
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem

Look in a dictionary for the derivation of the word ORTHODOX. It comes from the
Greek ORTH: straight, correct, true, right   and  DOXA: opinion.
It thus amuses me to no end when I  see representatives of the Reform and
Conservative movements denigrating the "orthodox".

Josh
backon@VMS.HUJI.AC.IL
From: nmuller@ems.cdc.com (Nelson Muller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Pyramids
Date: 11 Nov 92 21:13:14 GMT
Reply-To: MAKE_ADDRESS(USER,ems.cdc.com)
Organization: Empros Systems International, a division of CDC

In article <1992Nov11.192728.3120@cbfsb.cb.att.com>, klur@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (david.s.klur) writes:
|> 
|> I just saw a PBS special about Pyramids -I thought the show
|> as excellent, except at the end when some pyramid specialist
|> marvelled at the dedication of the ancient Egyptians at being
|> able to work so hard for so long to complete the pyramids.
|> 
|> Now, I had thought that slaves (mostly Jews, but maybe others also?)
|> built the pyramids under the pharaohs' rule.  After all, Jews
|> celebrate Passover, the freedom of the Jews from slavery in Egypt.
|> 
|> So, who actually built the pyramids?  
|>

Credit is given to those that designed the pyramids - the pharaohs. 

|> 
|> --
|> David Klur 	           | "3 is prime, 5 is prime, 7 is prime,
|> AT&T			   |  9 is experimental error, 11 is prime,
|> dklur@attmail.com	   |  13 is prime..."
|> Me? Speak for AT&T?!?	   |
From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Mmmm... Purple)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Jewish Movies on Video?
Date: 5 Nov 92 03:53:42 GMT
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations

In article <9210271404.AA15337@host0.COLBY.EDU> <jjsulliv@COLBY.EDU (Jennifer J. Sullivan '94)> writes:
>
>Our campus Hillel Society regularly sponsors Movie Nights.  But we're running
>out of flicks!  Does anyone know of any good Judaism-related movies that
>are out on video?  Or even sort-of-good?  (We're even considering checking
>out _A Stranger Among Us_ when it comes out!)  

- Crossing Delancey
- Homicide
- Frisco Kid
- Hannah and Her Sisters
- Annie Hall
- Bananas
- Ten Commandments
- Hester Street
- Jazz Singer
- Gentleman's Agreement (is this the right title? it won Oscar Best Picture)
- Fiddler on the Roof
- Europa, Europa
- Zelig
- To Be or Not to Be
- Exodus
- Take the Money and Run
- Avalon
- Judgment at Nuremburg
- Yentl
- Radio Days

That's just off the top of my head.  Good luck, feel free to e-mail with
questions; I've seen most of them, and heard of the rest.
-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
also at quibeaux@uchicago.edu | standard disclaimers | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet)
Subject: Re: Prayer shawls
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories,  Columbus, Ohio
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 20:02:14 GMT

In article <9211102318.AA05344@host0.COLBY.EDU> <jjsulliv@COLBY.EDU (Nice Young Lady(tm))> writes:
>
>I see a great variety of tallit (where is my hebrew textbook when i need a 
>plural form?) in our local temple, from the plain white with a few blue stripes,
>to the rabbis gold-embroidered one, some with colored embroidered hebrew letters,
>I've even seen on with BLACK stripes and one covered totally with blue stripes (most of them only have a few stripes on either end, this one looked like
>some sort of kitsch horse blanket).  I want to make (handsew, embroider, etc.)
>a tallis for a friend of mine, as a gift, and I was wondering, among
>all the variations, what are the absolute REQUIRED characteristics of prayer
>shawls, and what variations are dictated mostly by fashion, and, of them,
>what do you all find preferable?  

A good deal of what makes for a good-looking talit is custom and
habit.

My family's minhag is that blue stripes are what unmarried men wear,
and black stripes once married.  But when our family attended a
week-long kallah at Camp Ramah in the Poconos about 20 years ago we
made a pale green, no-striped talit.  That was the only material
left at the time!  I wear it occasionally.

The requirement for a talit is it be a 4-cornered (rectangular)
cloth, with tzitzit in each corner.  The real work is getting the
tzitzit tied correctly.   Many Jewish bookstores will sell you
untied tzttzit and even instructions on how to tie them.  There is a
minimum size to it (a pocket handkerchief is too small.)

The tzitzit is supposed to have a thread of techeilet - blue -
in it, but since there is pretty much an agreement that no one knows
what techelit really is, the blue is left out of the tzitzit.
So some people place blue stripes on the garment itself.

I prefer woolen talit with woolen tzitzit, and think wool feels
pretty comfortable, and not too bad even on a hot day.

I think one of  Jewish Catalogs has a good description of how to
make a talit and tie it.  And unless your family has some particular
custom you follow, the colors, arrangements, etc, should be up to
you.
-- 
Art Kamlet  a_s_kamlet@att.com  AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: amarkel@encore.com (Arieh Markel)
Subject: Re: Israel and the diaspora
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 16:23:09 GMT

nobby@milton.u.washington.edu (Vitaly Shmatikov) writes:

>In article <BxHqCx.KF5@cs.columbia.edu> ratner@cs.columbia.edu (Michael Ratner) writes:
>>In article <1992Nov7.234200.8473@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxha.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
>>>In article <92312.0400382893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>>>
>>># In article <4428@bimacs.BITNET>, rothberg@bimacs.BITNET (Danny Rothenberg) says:
>>>
>>
>>[ ..stuff deleted..]
>>
>>>	The US was (and still is) imposing quotas on ALL immigrants into
>>>the US, and one of the criterion is whether or not the individual is
>>>considered an economic or political refugee.  If Israel is offering
>>>them a refuge, the US is not going to let them in as a political
>>>refugee when they can let in someone else who is.
>>>
[ some more stuff deleted ... ]

A question regarding the so called refugee status awarded to soviet
jews who were allowed to leave.

I had understood, that they had to renounce the soviet citizenship and
accept Israli citizenship before they left, thus making them immediately
citizens of a country of which they cannot claim to be refugees from.

Am I correct ?

>Just a small correction. It's not true that only those with direct relatives 
>in the U.S. can obtain refugee status. My family has no direct relatives here 
>but we still got admitted. Sometimes I'm wondering what drives American 
>immigration officials when they're considering applications of Soviet Jews.
>The process is apparently informal but I have hard time trying to figure
>out which factors count.

As far as I know, my mother's family was not admitted to the US in 1938,
when trying to flee Austria because not all members could claim direct
relatives. Luckily, those who managed to escape were able to reach
Argentina.

Arieh
-- 
 Arieh Markel		  		        Tel: (305)-797-2403
 Encore Computer Corporation                    amarkel@encore.COM
 Optimizer & Instruction Scheduler Group        uunet!gould!amarkel
 Ft. Lauderdale, FL
From: rothberg@bimacs.BITNET (Danny Rothenberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: sexism
Date: 4 Nov 92 13:29:06 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <9210311303.AA01391@host0.COLBY.EDU> <jjsulliv@COLBY.EDU (Jennifer J. Sullivan '94)> writes:
>**************
>
>Do you mean to imply that if you disagree with one rabbi's interpretation, you
                           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>should find one whose interpretation differs and is one you agree with, and it
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>will be fine?  I know that if I brought up any of these questions to the rabbi
^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Isn't there a halachic problem with doing this?  After all, doesn't it
say in Pirkei Avot (Ethics of the Fathers) that on should find
him/herself a rabbi and follow him (I cannot remember the exact
mishna)?

>   "Do what you want, G-d isn't a sexist and it wasn't His idea
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Is this not the major complaint of 'orthodox' [rabbinic] Judaism about
other forms, at least in their perception?

>
>JJ


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Danny Rothenberg            |    ^     Life's a dream-so sleep through it!
Bitnet:                     | \-/-\-/         Be'ahavat Chinam
rothberg@bimacs             |  X   X Am Yisra'el       The People of Israel
Internet:                   | /-\-/-\Be'Eretz Yisra'el In The Land of Israel
rothberg@imacs.cs.biu.ac.il |    V   Im Torat Yisra'el With The Torah of Israel
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: holmes@garnet.idbsu.edu (Randall Holmes)
Subject: Re: Conversion Question
Organization: Boise State University
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 00:07:49 GMT

In article <FAIGIN.92Nov10104736@soldan.aero.org> faigin@aero.org (Daniel P. Faigin) writes:
>On Tue, 10 Nov 1992 03:24:37 GMT, shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff) said:
>
>> I assume that some Reform Jews will soon enter the fray.  In
>> case they don't, let me suggest that they are convinced that
>> _they_ are the legitimate inheritors of rabbinic Judaism!
>
>What is a legitimate inheritor to begin with? Can't all major movements
>determine a common basis, and all be valid as forms of Judaism? Why must there
>be only one way to worship and interpret halacha?

	I am a liberal Reform Jew, but I agree with the Orthodox that
if their understanding of the nature of the Law is correct, there can
indeed be only one way (or a narrow range of ways) to worship and
interpret the Law.  Since I remain Reform, I clearly do not think that
this is true.

>
>Daniel
>--
>[W]:The Aerospace Corp. M1/055 * POB 92957 * LA, CA 90009-2957 * 310/336-8228
>[Email]:faigin@aerospace.aero.org              [Vmail]:310/336-5454 Box#13149
>		    "And as they say, the rest is compost"


-- 
The opinions expressed		|     --Sincerely,
above are not the "official"	|     M. Randall Holmes
opinions of any person		|     Math. Dept., Boise State Univ.
or institution.			|     holmes@opal.idbsu.edu
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: sexism
Date: 10 Nov 92 07:21:40 GMT
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs

mw = weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)

mw: Exactly.  The shirt under the t.k. is to keep it clean.

But is the shirt under the tk required by halacha or is it just
convenient to do so since undershirts are cheaper than tk's so it's
easier to have lots of undershirts than lots of tk's?  If the former,
could you provide a reference?
-- 
/|/-\/-\          Adif tzav pinui metzav shmoneh.
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@     
/ nysernet.org 			    Jerusalem
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: goldberg@techunix.technion.ac.il (Jacques Goldberg)
Subject: Re: WARNING: Sam Saal coercion
Organization: Technion, Israel Institute of Technology
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:11:40 GMT

andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>.................... I suggest that if anyone else is being harassed by Sam
>they inform him that if he persists in his activity, he will be reported on.

   I am fond of what Sam writes. Therefore I suggest that if anyone else is
being pleased as I am by Sam they inform him that if he dares stop his 
activity, he will be reported on.
   I can't speak for Sam, but I personally feel much more frightened by the
WorldMaster than by postmasters, by the way.
            Yaaqov Goldberg
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: clmn@ellis.uchicago.edu (Bill Coleman)
Subject: Re: Living in Israel - Voting in USA
Reply-To: clmn@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Live & Direct from Downtown Petah Tikva ISRAEL
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 14:41:35 GMT

In article <2756@israel.nysernet.org> warren@nysernet.org writes:
>There is a Hebrew expression that is relevant: "notnim? tikach!"
>(They're giving something away?  Take some!).  As long as both Israel
>and the US agree to joint citizenship, why not have both?  Why should
>an Oleh/Olah volunteer to make it more difficult to enter his/her
>former country (not to mention other countries which might allow U.S.
>citizens to visit without a visa which they require from Israelis)?
>
>You might ask how many people who hold two passports used the U.S. one
>to enter the U.S. during the Gulf War, I would think very few.
>-- 
>

I am as much in favor of something for nothing as anyone else.  I don't
blame any olim for retaining their US citizenship; I do say it's bad
public policy on the part of the U.S.  I do think that voting in U.S.
elections, even if allowed, is at best in poor taste.  I personally find
it somewhat offensive but that's just me.  Finally, I think that olim who retain
their American citizenship should refrain from arguing that American Jews have
no business remaining in America.  It just doesn't sit well.

-- 
Bill Coleman
clmn@midway.uchicago.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: Seth Ness <ness@aecom.yu.edu>
Subject: Re: Minyan in Senate!
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <Seth Ness <ness@aecom.yu.edu>>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 22:56:25 GMT

On Tue, 10 Nov 1992, Ed Suranyi wrote:

> In January there will be a minyan in the U.S. Senate!  Or, at least,
> there would be if you count women.  There will be exactly ten Jews
> in the Senate.  There will be two states for which BOTH senators are
> Jewish:  California and Wisconsin.
> 
> Ed
> ed@wente.llnl.gov
> 
> 
> 

i had heard that there will be eleven jews in the senate. but i was under
the impression that diane feinsteins mother was not jewish.



Seth L. Ness                         Ness Gadol Hayah Sham
ness@aecom.yu.edu                      




Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: emc@doe.carleton.ca (Eli Chiprout)
Subject: Re: Small town Judaism
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 15:49:41 GMT

In <92313.1800582893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:

>Outside of Toronto, Montreal and Winnipeg, Canada's Jewish population is
>relatively small and there has been some concern about the survival of
>Jewish life in smaller communities like London, Kingston or even Ottawa.
							     ^^^^^^^^^^^
When was the last time you were in Ottawa?  This is no small town and
the Jewish community is doing just fine thank you.

(Maybe Kingston is different :-)


--
Eli Chiprout                  " 'Al ta'am vereach, ein lehitvakeah!"
Dept. of Electronics, 
Carleton University, Canada
emc@doe.carleton.ca
From: rothberg@bimacs.BITNET (Danny Rothenberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Autopsy - Kahane and Rosenbaum
Date: 4 Nov 92 14:39:53 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <1992Nov3.133417.28935@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxha.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
>In article <92308.0207422893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>
># In article <1992Nov2.142127.5261@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>, saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com
># (samuel.saal) says:
>
># >In article <Bx2pE5.Jz6@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>
># >kgivon@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (karen lee givon) writes:
>
># >>I am Jewish, Israeli, and Zionist, but I am relieved that Kahane is
># >>gone.  He was a crazy fanatic...the world will be a much better place
># >>when fanatics are gone.
>
># >Isn't it interesting how releived people get when a Jewish "fanatic" is
># >murdered but how quickly they call a nonJewish one a martyr when he
># >dies - even when it is a by natural causes.
>
># Almost as interesting as the large numbers of Israelis who were relieved
># by his death. I always found it curious that the worst fanatics on Israel
># are not Israelis but Americans. Why is this?
>
Probably because everything in Israel tends to be done to extremes (in
my opinion, a failure in the Middle East in general).  And not just in
Israel so far as Jews are concerned; some of the worst anti-Semites in
historey have been Jews, or at least of Jewish origin.

>       This proves that you do not know anything about the late Rabbi and
>are just interested in furthering an agenda based on lies.  WHen the
>Rabbi died, plenty of people who had vehemently opposed him in Israel
>mourned his death and actually tried to attend his funeral.  Most of
>the popularly known figures were barred from the funeral because of
>the way they treated him when he was alive.

YOu are now proving how intolerant you actually are.  It is a positive
mitzvah to accompany somebody on their last journey, ie go to their
funeral (the Hebrew is 'levayah'-accompanying).  I happened to be in
the region of the funeral procession as it passed the central bus
station in Jerusalem, and was petrified as THUGS started hitting
busses which had come through Arab areas and therefore MIGHT have been
carrying Arabs.  It sort of reminds one of Mussolini's Blackshirts and
Hitler's Brownshirts.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Danny Rothenberg            |    ^     Life's a dream-so sleep through it!
Bitnet:                     | \-/-\-/         Be'ahavat Chinam
rothberg@bimacs             |  X   X Am Yisra'el       The People of Israel
Internet:                   | /-\-/-\Be'Eretz Yisra'el In The Land of Israel
rothberg@imacs.cs.biu.ac.il |    V   Im Torat Yisra'el With The Torah of Israel
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: makowsky@enuxva.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Subject: Re: Autopsy - Kahane and Rosenbaum
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 19:48:36 GMT

In article <4440@bimacs.BITNET>, rothberg@bimacs.BITNET (Danny Rothenberg) writes:

# In article <1992Nov6.193242.4385@ennews.eas.asu.edu# makowsky@enuxha.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:

# >In article <2757@israel.nysernet.org# warren@nysernet.org writes:

# ># dm = makowsky@enuxha.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)

# ># me: I don't know about David Skoll, but I have read the deceased racist's
                                                                      ^^^^^^^^
# ># me: books and articles and heard him speak.

# ># dm: We are discussing Rabbi Meir Kahane.  Not whoever it was you heard
# ># dm: speak.

# ># Yes, we are discussing the late racist rabbi.

# #       By "we" I meant the discussion I was taking part in involving the
# >non Racist Rabbi Meir Kahane (HY"D).  Please stay out of this
# >discussion if you want to discuss another Rabbi who might have
# >happened to be a racist.
 
# Well.  I do not know about Warren, but I definitely heard somebody
# calling himself 'Rabbi Meir Kahane' spouting Kach propoganda at 'The
# Museum of the Potential Holocaust' at Ussishkin street, here in
# Jerusalem.
 
# I also know that when a friend of mine challenged him on his sources,
# he eventually came out with something along the lines of: "Who is the
# talmid chacham?  Me?  Or you?"  Sounds like a massive cop-out to me.
 
	Cop out?  Maybe.  But hardly racist.

# >--
# >"For all I care, you can send your money to the Hitler memorial fund, too, if
# >that pleases you."

# >From  arens@vaxa.isi.edu (Yigal Arens) in article <9323@venera.isi.edu>
#        ^^^^^
 
# Perhaps it might be more appropriate if someone else's name were
# there? :-|

	Whose?  Yours?  Mr. Skoll's?
From: tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil (Tim Miller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: WARNING: Sam Saal coercion
Date: 6 Nov 92 23:11:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: hrt213.9211062311.AA09426
	<1992Nov6.185755.25651@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
Organization: AL/HRTI, Brooks AFB

On Fri, 6 Nov 1992 18:57:55 GMT, saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) said:

 S> In article <emc.721074151@pulaski> emc@doe.carleton.ca (Eli
 S> Chiprout) writes:

[...]

	*plonk* *plonk*

-- Cerebus <tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil>
"The sond of *both* of you falling into my killfile."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay)
Subject: Not Techelet Again (Re: Prayer shawls)
Summary: It's a JOKE, dammit!
Organization: International Irony League -- Death before smileys!
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 23:52:01 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.200214.4118@cbnews.cb.att.com> ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet) writes:
>The tzitzit is supposed to have a thread of techeilet - blue -
>in it, but since there is pretty much an agreement that no one knows
>what techelit really is, the blue is left out of the tzitzit.
>So some people place blue stripes on the garment itself.

Oh no! Not the Techelet thread again!

Well, it's been a month since we had this argument, so I guess
it's time for it to start again. I'll try to get things off on
the right foot.

<Ahem>

Orthodox Jews do not believe we have the proper Techelet anymore,
since most of what is called Techelet is made from non-kosher
(e.g. Conservative) Chilazonim.

That ought to get the ball rolling...
-- 
Andrew M. Solovay    "I've learned a secret about keeping house... after
                      four years, the dust doesn't get any thicker."
                                        --Quentin Crisp
From: CARIAN@auvm.american.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: SCJ Gathering in Baltimore/Washington Area
Date: 12 Nov 92 13:52:31 GMT
Organization: The American University - University Computing Center

There are a lot of folks here in the DC/Baltimore area who post regularly
to SCJ who I have never met, but would like to.

I think it would be fun to have a sort of SCJ gathering; I will be
happy to coordinate it.

I'm proposing lunch on Sunday, Dec. 6 at Hunan Gourmet* in Rockville.
If you're an SCJ reader in the area please e-mail me with answers to
the following questions:

1.) Are you interested in the concept of such a get-together?

2.) If so, can you make it for Dec. 6? If not, please suggest
some alternative dates and times.

*Hunan Gourmet is certified Glatt Kosher by the Rabbinical Council of
Greater Washington.

I look forward to hearing from Rob Levene, Eliott Shimoff, Ron Cohen,
Jeff Edelheit and probably some others whom I have neglected.

Rabbi Charles Arian
CARIAN@american.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish