HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kat@doe.carleton.ca (Kathiravan Krishnamurthi)
Subject: Re: Reservations....
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1992 01:25:34 GMT

In <1992Sep15.194554.1016@cypress.com> ssr@siberia.cypress.com (Bapcha/FPGA) writes:

>It is due to the fact that the reservation system in Tamilnadu is
>fucked up - that it creates a furore whenever it is discussed.
^^^^^^^^^^^^

>-- 
>Bapcha - A very bad boy from Cypress Semiconductor
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>3901 N.  First Strasse
>San Jose,  CA 95134, 408-943-2719

Yes, no hypocrisy here.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: chai@m.cs.uiuc.edu (Ian Chai)
Subject: Re: MEDJU PRVIMA
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 22:40:11 GMT

mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu writes:
>Evo, sada imamo svoju news-group posto nemamo svoju drzavu. Nazalost, ja sve
[etc]

Hi! I'm interested in what's going on in what used to be Yugoslavia,
but don't speak the language, so could someone translate this message?

(Fortunately, the other messages are in English.)

Thanks.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: jngreen@nyx.cs.du.edu (Joel Green)
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 92 16:02:23 GMT

In article <alanf.716017533@bruce.cs.monash.edu.au> alanf@cs.monash.edu.au (Alan Grant Finlay) writes:
>mmokhtar@attmail.com (Mazen Mokhtar) writes:
>
>>  After suffering major defeats, the Bosnians appear to be scoring some
>>successes against the Serbs. Does anyone have the details?
>
>to hold onto.  Sorry to be so pessimistic but the Serbs have got the old
>Yugoslav defense system behind them.  Even the UN would have a hard time
>defeating them (remember Vietnam).

Of course the UN would have a hard time defeating them .. they are a peace
keeping force who only carry light machine guns.  If a force was sent to
defeat them however, I'm sure it wouldn't be too much trouble defeating
them (remember Iraq).


Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: souissi@ec.ecn.purdue.edu (Ridha Souissi)
Subject: Re: B-H is NO place for IWN
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 11:39:44 GMT

In article <1992Sep12.051259.3059@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu> mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu writes:
>Hey you from IMNET don't you dare to post your Islamic crap in this group
>again. B-H musilims are not that crazy about Islam as you think, so save
>your cheap propaganda for some other place, and stay away from this 
>newsgroup. If we want someting that is definitely this: NO TO BE IDENTIFIED
>WITH ISLAM FUNDAMENTALISM!
>

I am not in any way associated with IWN, but I would like to
say this:  This newsgroup (and others) are open mediums of
communication for all (unless it becomes moderated).  we don't
need censorship.  If you don't like their articles, just
don't read them.  Also I don't see how merely *reading* the
articles will associate you with "Islamic Fundamentalism"
which you seem to dislike.  The same articles are distributed
in other newsgroups as well.  As for B-H Muslims, their
president assured the European community times and again that
he is does not want to establish an Islamic state, and
the B-H people are not by any means fundamentalist Muslims.
This did not prevent the Serbian murderers to massacre them
while the whole world is watching and trying to provide
some food for the victims while they are being killed.

Ridha.
>Good luck, MLADEN


Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: vesseur@fwi.uva.nl (Joep Vesseur)
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes
Organization: FWI, University of Amsterdam
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 22:36:51 GMT

mmokhtar@attmail.com (Mazen Mokhtar) writes:

>Assalamu `alaykum,
hello to you too,

>  After suffering major defeats, the Bosnians appear to be scoring some
>successes against the Serbs. Does anyone have the details?
i don't think you can talk about successes whatsoever in this context.

>[...]
>Peace be upon the rightreous,
peace be upon everyone...

>Mazen Mokhtar

joep.
From: bhmughal@athena.mit.edu (Bilal H Mughal)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: B-H is NO place for IWN
Date: 14 Sep 92 00:58:38 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

In article <1992Sep12.051259.3059@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu>, mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu writes:
|> Hey you from IMNET don't you dare to post your Islamic crap in this group
|> again. B-H musilims are not that crazy about Islam as you think, so save
|> your cheap propaganda for some other place, and stay away from this 
|> newsgroup. If we want someting that is definitely this: NO TO BE IDENTIFIED
|> WITH ISLAM FUNDAMENTALISM!
|> 
|> Good luck, MLADEN


Sad.  If your forefathers hadn't subscribed to this Islamic crap you
would have been saved this terrible war, right?  Quite unfortunate indeed.
Someone shoots at you because you are a Muslim and you join him in spitting
on your religion/nationality.

It won't be long before you realize who your true well-wishers are.  Just
think:  "Fundamentalist" Iran gifts you a planeload of weapons so that you can 
defend yourself while the secular West participates in denying you that right.
Or, perhaps, you'd rather not have "fundamentalist" weapons anyway and would 
rather die an honorable secular death instead.

regards,
Bilal
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: stevan@alchemy.tn.cornell.edu (Stevan Vidic)
Subject: Percentage of Muslims
Organization: Alchemy International
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 20:31:29 GMT

In Article <1992Sep15.142901.23124@cbfsb.cb.att.com>
mmokhtar@attmail.com (Mazen Mokhtar) declares:

>  The percentage of Muslims in B-H is about 54%. It is impossible to look
>into people's hearts to know who actually believes, but the majority of
>Bosnians are Muslims.

Bullshit!  Muslims make up 44% of Bosnia and Herzegovina (B&H) population. 
This percentage is consistent with both the 1981 and 1991 censuses.  Before
you start making sweeping statements, check the facts first.  OK?

Regarding the issue of believers and non-believers, I am sorry to disappoint
you but Bosnians could care less about it.  You obviously know diddley nothing
about the history of that region.  References to Muslims in B&H signify the
nationality and not necessarily the religious alliance.  True, some of them
practice Islam, but a lot of them don't believe in God at all.  Many of B&H
Muslims were members of the Yugoslav Communist Party, so you could probably
refer to them as atheist Muslims (yeah, it appears to be a contradiction in
terms).  As for those that declare themselves believers, go ask them if they
are Shia or Sunni.  Chances are they won't be able to tell you who succeeded
Mohammed or what happened to Ali.

[stuff deleted]

> The Croatians are transgressors against B-H, in that they must be condemned.
>They are also victims of Serbia, in that they must be supported. No matter
>how you juggle the numbers, the percentage of Muslims in B-H is still above
>50%.

Would you cut the crap because this argument really suuuuccccks?  Check the
census data and spare us the cheap propaganda.  The percentage of Muslims in
B&H is 44%.  Get it?  Goooood.


>>Do you know what is the number of Serbs still in Sarajevo, who are dieing
>>under shells of their compatriots? It's not that simple as it seems.

>  There are many Serbs in Sarajevo who support the Muslims because they
>have a sense of decency. They are not being killed by Muslims. The only
>Serbs being killed by Muslims are the ones on the hills, shelling the
>Sarajevo without regards to justice.

Where did you get this rubbish?  Many Serbs who support the Muslims??  Give me
a break and get real.  The number of Serbs fighting with the Muslims is
negligible and their reasons range from law evasion to obsequiousness.  You
can hardly squeeze decency in between, duplicity yes.  


>Peace be upon the righteous,
>
>Mazen Mokhtar

Yeah, right.
Stevan

Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu
Subject: B-H is NO place for IWN
Reply-To: mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu
Organization: Univ of S Carolina College of Sci and Math
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 92 05:12:59 GMT

Hey you from IMNET don't you dare to post your Islamic crap in this group
again. B-H musilims are not that crazy about Islam as you think, so save
your cheap propaganda for some other place, and stay away from this 
newsgroup. If we want someting that is definitely this: NO TO BE IDENTIFIED
WITH ISLAM FUNDAMENTALISM!

Good luck, MLADEN
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: rached@blanc.eng.ohio-state.edu (rached)
Subject: Re: B-H is NO place for IWN
Organization: The Ohio State University Dept of Electrical Engineering
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 05:29:56 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.033520.730@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu> mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu writes:
>In article <1992Sep14.005838.14110@athena.mit.edu>, bhmughal@athena.mit.edu (Bilal H Mughal) writes:
>
>There is one thing which is gratly misunderstood. In B/H there are Muslims
>(written with an uppercase letter) and this signifies nationality, and there are
>muslims (written with a lowercase letter) and this signifies the religion. I
>lived for 28 years in Sarajevo with Muslims but not muslims. It is the war now 
>and people are desperate. In those circumstances one can plant the seeds of any
>religion and ideology. I just wached on TV how Muslims are becoming muslims,
>and Croats are becoming chatolics, Srbs I could not see because they did not
>let the TV crew in their church, but I beleive that they too are becoming
>eastern-orthodox. This is sad, because it represents how desperate those people
>are. As far as Iran is concernd, they are led to beleive that Muslims = muslims
>so they think of spreading Iranian fundamentalism in B/H. I don't think our 
>Muslims are that desperate that they cannot differentiate between these two 
>evils, 1. the war that Serbs and Croats are waging against them and 2. Islam 
>fundamentalism which is trying to buy them at their weakest moment. Iran has
>big interest in BiH and they are trying to do something. The west see no
>interest and they just sit and pretend thay do someting while doing nothing. No
>one does anything if there is no interest - we all know that. 
>
>MLADEN   

Dear MLADEN
You differentiate between Muslims and muslims. This differentiation does not exist 
with theose who are persecuting your people. Muslim or muslim your sister is being raped
your brother is being killed and your child is being sent away from his home.
Muslim or muslim you are being bombarded, your house destroyed. Food, water
and electricity are being cutoff from you.
The difference is that the muslim who is fighting will Inshallah have his
reward with Allah and will be victorious. The Muslim who subscribes to the
religion as something of a nationality will be killed by the enemies but will
not receive the rewards.

Wake up ! smell the burning country. While you are trying to divide Muslims
Serbs are wiping them out indiscriminantly. All the above rhethoric did not serve 
you. The Serbs waited until they finished with the Croats and then targeted you. 
It is better for you to be part of a Muslim Ummah than to be part of a nationality
that has no nation. If you had defined yourself as a Bosnian I would have 
respected your ideas but to take the name of a religion and leave its basic 
principles ? that's cheating.

You are either a Muslim and thus our brother and we have to help and protect
you or you are a Bosnian and thus we will see if it is in our INTERSET to 
help you, otherwise we sit and watch like the west is doing.


rached


Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu
Subject: Re: B-H is NO place for IWN
Reply-To: mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu
Organization: Univ of S Carolina College of Sci and Math
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 03:35:20 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.005838.14110@athena.mit.edu>, bhmughal@athena.mit.edu (Bilal H Mughal) writes:
>In article <1992Sep12.051259.3059@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu>, mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu writes:
>|> Hey you from IMNET don't you dare to post your Islamic crap in this group
>|> again. B-H musilims are not that crazy about Islam as you think, so save
>|> your cheap propaganda for some other place, and stay away from this 
>|> newsgroup. If we want someting that is definitely this: NO TO BE IDENTIFIED
>|> WITH ISLAM FUNDAMENTALISM!
>|> 
>|> Good luck, MLADEN
>
>
>Sad.  If your forefathers hadn't subscribed to this Islamic crap you
>would have been saved this terrible war, right?  Quite unfortunate indeed.
>Someone shoots at you because you are a Muslim and you join him in spitting
>on your religion/nationality.
>
>It won't be long before you realize who your true well-wishers are.  Just
>think:  "Fundamentalist" Iran gifts you a planeload of weapons so that you can 
>defend yourself while the secular West participates in denying you that right.
>Or, perhaps, you'd rather not have "fundamentalist" weapons anyway and would 
>rather die an honorable secular death instead.
>
>regards,
>Bilal

There is one thing which is gratly misunderstood. In B/H there are Muslims
(written with an uppercase letter) and this signifies nationality, and there are
muslims (written with a lowercase letter) and this signifies the religion. I
lived for 28 years in Sarajevo with Muslims but not muslims. It is the war now 
and people are desperate. In those circumstances one can plant the seeds of any
religion and ideology. I just wached on TV how Muslims are becoming muslims,
and Croats are becoming chatolics, Srbs I could not see because they did not
let the TV crew in their church, but I beleive that they too are becoming
eastern-orthodox. This is sad, because it represents how desperate those people
are. As far as Iran is concernd, they are led to beleive that Muslims = muslims
so they think of spreading Iranian fundamentalism in B/H. I don't think our 
Muslims are that desperate that they cannot differentiate between these two 
evils, 1. the war that Serbs and Croats are waging against them and 2. Islam 
fundamentalism which is trying to buy them at their weakest moment. Iran has
big interest in BiH and they are trying to do something. The west see no
interest and they just sit and pretend thay do someting while doing nothing. No
one does anything if there is no interest - we all know that. 

MLADEN   
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: svedja@lysator.liu.se (Dejan Ilic)
Subject: Re: B-H is NO place for IWN
Organization: Lysator Academic Computer Society, Linkoping University, Sweden
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 15:53:38 GMT

cicic@cc.uow.edu.au (muris cicic) writes:

>mmilicevic@spike.psc.scarolina.edu writes:

>>Hey you from IMNET don't you dare to post your Islamic crap in this group
>>again. B-H musilims are not that crazy about Islam as you think, so save
>>your cheap propaganda for some other place, and stay away from this 
>>newsgroup. If we want someting that is definitely this: NO TO BE IDENTIFIED
>>WITH ISLAM FUNDAMENTALISM!

>>Good luck, MLADEN

>AGREE 100 %.

>Muris

You got my support..
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: bartjan@cs.kun.nl (Bart-Jan Bouwers)
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes
Organization: University of Nijmegen, The Netherlands
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 07:05:27 GMT

In <1992Sep8.174419.2017@cbfsb.cb.att.com> mmokhtar@attmail.com (Mazen Mokhtar) writes:


>Assalamu `alaykum,

>  After suffering major defeats, the Bosnians appear to be scoring some
>successes against the Serbs. Does anyone have the details?

It seems that the last success was the killing of 2 French UN soldiers.
This stupid war...

>Peace be upon the rightreous,

>Mazen Mokhtar

Bart-Jan
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: svedja@lysator.liu.se (Dejan Ilic)
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes
Organization: Lysator Academic Computer Society, Linkoping University, Sweden
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 15:27:37 GMT

arnsenad@me.utoronto.ca (Senad Arnautovic) writes:

>svedja@lysator.liu.se (Dejan Ilic) writes:


>Are those people shelling from the hills tourists who dont't know what
>they are doing? Of course, Sarajevans have to defend themselves against
>"tourists"? Are you saying people of Sarajevo will sit and watch their
>town being destroyed totally.
>How can be peace achieved when Serbians have taken 70% of Bosnian
>territory and now want peace and have U.N. forces protect the land
>they occupy? It would have been similar as Germans in 1942 reaching
>Stalingrad in Russia had asked (hypothetical) U.N. forces to come
>to Stalingrad "to keep paece". In this situation would then Mr. Ilic
>ask himself who gave the arms to Russians and why the Russians were attacking
>Germans when Germans wanted peace in Stalingrad, why the Russians didn't
>stop fighting in Sarajevo.

>Senad Arnautovic

There is just one thing we have to get straight.. You (Senad) are comparing Serbs with Germans (in WWII) and Americans (in Vietnam) and are all the time forgetting that there were Serbs living in B-H for centuries so you can't make the comparation like you did.

2) You seems to want to say that you allies are giving you weapons and you are makeing some of your own. But the quantities you are makeing in place are quiete small so you have to smuggle. Is it there your allies gets in picture like the iranian plane that should bring you humanitarian releif but "it happend" to have a large quantities of arms and ammo ?

3) Gimme an possible scenario where Muslims would be in the position where the serbs are now and how the muslims would react...
From: murthy@ssd.dl.nec.com (Vasudev Murthy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes
Date: 15 Sep 1992 11:47:38 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes

In article <GHt-Km_@engin.umich.edu> avrat@engin.umich.edu (Ali Kodal) writes:
>In article <1633@lysator.liu.se> svedja@lysator.liu.se (Dejan Ilic) writes:
>>All have the right to get weapons when the feel threat by some other side but nobody should use humanitarian transport to get arms.
>>
>>Do you think that simmular things that you described didn't happend with the role attacker/victim reversed.
>
>
>I think smuggling weapons is OK if the UN (which is tool of emperialist
>west) puts embargo to you
>
>Ali Kodal

Really? What are you doing here in the Imperialist West?
WHy not go back to the Islamic Society you came from? Oh,
"to get an education"? Then you'll go back and fight the
evil West?


Vasudev



-- 
Vasudev Murthy             Any opinions expressed are strictly  
murthy@asl.dl.nec.com      my own  and have nothing to do with
(214) 518-5031             Advanced Switching Lab, NEC America, Inc.
1525 Walnut Hill Lane Irving TX 75038
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: arnsenad@me.utoronto.ca (Senad Arnautovic)
Subject: Re: Bosnia's recent successes
Organisation: U of Toronto, Dept. of Mechanical Engineering
Organization: UofT Mechanical Engineering
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 19:05:30 GMT

fes9s@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Frank Erick Sellin) writes:

>>>>>  After suffering major defeats, the Bosnians appear to be scoring some
>>>>>successes against the Serbs. Does anyone have the details?
>>>>
>>>>to hold onto.  Sorry to be so pessimistic but the Serbs have got the old
>>>>Yugoslav defense system behind them.  Even the UN would have a hard time
>>>>defeating them (remember Vietnam).
>>
>>>Of course the UN would have a hard time defeating them .. they are a peace
>>>keeping force who only carry light machine guns.  If a force was sent to
>>>defeat them however, I'm sure it wouldn't be too much trouble defeating
>>>them (remember Iraq).
>>
>>Ivan Auger
>>ivan@stat.ph.albnay.edu
>Right on, Mr. Auger. Vietnam is an analogous comparison.  Yugoslavia, if
>anywhere, virtually perfected the modern guerrilla war.  Mountainous, with
>access to the sea and interested parties to all sides who can send
>supplies, Yugoslavia (or rather, what's left of it) can boast a more
>effective record in the Second World War per capita than just about
>any other country I can think of.  These people tied down 35 German
>divisions.  Add to that the fact that Tito transformed Bosnia-Hercegovina
>into a thousand military stockpile facilities of staggering amounts of
>stuff, in preparation for any post -1948 Soviet threat, and we have
>a virtual hornet's nest here. There is not going to be any clear and
>flat terrain turkey shoot a la Iraq.

Vietnam is indeed analogous comparison with the analogy:
Bosnia freedom fighter = Vietkong and Serbians = Americans.
And history has shown who won despite huge American over-power.
So, in this Balkan war, nacionalist Serbians will eventually
loose against Bosnians (Muslims, Croats, loyal Serbs) despite all
former Yugoslav army help in weapons and manpower,
since they are aggressors and they have taken Bosnian land.
Just like Germans  who occupied Yugoslavia and people (Serbians, Croats,
Muslims, etc) fought them because Bosnia is not a German land, so
are Chetniks (nationalist Serbs) being fought, because Bosnia
is not Serbian land either. Just give the Bosnians the wright weapons
and no western military intervention is needed.  
Regards
Senad H. Arnautovic


Newsgroups: soc.men
From: garry@rice.edu (Garry C. King)
Subject: Request - Violence Info
Followup-To: soc.men
Organization: Rice University
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 18:06:24 GMT


For what seems to be the umpteenth time this year,
the local paper has published a Violence Against Women (TM)
article which doesn't ring true to me.  Could someone 
please post or email me recent statistics on interpersonal
violence ?  

If my suspicions are correct, it's time for a letter to the editor.

Many Thanks.
Newsgroups: soc.men