HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Organization: Brigham Young University, Provo, Utah, USA
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.circplus
Date:         Tue, 29 Sep 1992 11:49:34 MDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         Laurie Cardon <LIBLXC@VM.BYU.EDU>
Subject:      Community user fees revisited

I know this is a repeat of something that was already discussed.  However,
because of a disk space problem, the archives of this forum don't go back
far enough for me to recover the discussion.

We are re-evaluating our fee structure for community borrowers.  I would
like to get as much information as possible on the rules and fees used in
other libraries (particularly larger academics).  What categories of
borrowers do you allow?  Do fees/rules vary between groups?

At BYU we have:  general community, $50/year  2 week loan
                 alumni/senior citizens, $40/school year  2 weeks
                 high school students, $10/year  2 weeks
                    (permission slip signed by teacher & school librarian
                     is required)
                 local teachers, no charge  2 weeks
                 researching w/ faculty, no charge  2 months
          we do not issue corporate cards (multiple borrowers)
          a 'friends' card used to be available for $10, but no longer

You may send your replies either to the list or to me directly.  I will
summarize all information and distribute it to the list.

Thanks,                               Laurie

*************************************************************************
Laureen Cardon             : Truth is an approach to living,
Circulation Librarian      | not just an approach to knowing.
Brigham Young University   |
Provo, Utah 84601          |              - Parker Palmer
LIBLXC@BYUVM.BITNET        |        (quoted at 1992 BYU Conference)
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Date:         Mon, 28 Sep 1992 11:06:05 EDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
Comments:     Resent-From: PAIHARP@NERVM
Comments:     Originally-From: paige harper <PAIHARP@NERVM>
From:         PAIHARP@NERVM.BITNET
Subject:      UF Library Paraprofessional Development Conference

This message is being cross posted to several lists, please excuse.

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
REMEMBER!!!   It's Still Not Too Late!  REGISTRATION DEADLINE IS APPROACHING!!!
_______________________________________________________________________________

The Library Paraprofessional Development Group of the University of Florida are
holding their First Annual Paraprofessional Development Conference, February
20-21, 1993 at the Holiday Inn - University Center in Gainesville, Florida and
wants to welcome all interested paraprofessionals.

              REGISTRATION DEADLINE IS POSTMARK OF NOVEMBER 4, 1992

The registration fee of $90 includes:  Conference introductory kit, breakfast
and lunch buffets Saturday and Sunday, banquet Saturday, attendance at all
lectures and panel discussions and two roundtables (from a choice of twelve,
including all aspects of library work -- circulation, reference, cataloging,
acquisitions, interlibrary loan, reserve, children's services, adult services,
documents, periodicals/serials, administrative services, and preservation).

The Conference is designed to include information on all types of libraries
as well as all aspects of library work.  Paraprofessionals across the country
are expected to attend.  An ideal chance to interact, develop contacts,
encounter first-hand knowledge of new technologies impacting on traditional
library procedures, and perhaps to get some individual attention from people
who can help you solve problems.  Tours of campus libraries and opportunities
for some hands-on experience are possible if arranged in advance.

For further information please contact:

Tinker Massey, 300 Smathers Library, University of Florida, Gainesville, FL
  32611  Phone:  (904) 392-0351.  Fax:  (904) 392-7251
      EMAIL:  TINMASS@NERVM.BITNET   OR  TINMASS@NERVM.NERDC.UFL.EDU
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Date:         Fri, 2 Oct 1992 13:20:20 CDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         kendall <KSIMMONS%UKANVM.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Staplers, Kleenex and Hole-Punchers
              2 Oct 1992 08:46:00 CST from <PATTERJL@CNSVAX.UWEC.EDU>

Oh, and the people that asked if they could borrow our bells so they could
play Jeopardy.

Kendall
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Date:         Tue, 29 Sep 1992 15:01:17 -0400
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         EADWML@RITVAX.BITNET
Subject:      IDs

This may be a question addressed to very few...but here it goes anyway!

The RIT campus is going to a multifunctional all-campus ID card
(featuring credit/debit/is also an ID).  With this new card the library
will go from wanding a patron OCR# to bring up the patron's account to
wanding a barcode that is the student's social security number.
My question:  are there any other libraries that use a ss# as a
library ID barcode/number and what problems have you had with this?
Or insights?

Thanks

Liz Dopp
Rochester Inst of Technology
EADWML@RITVAX.BITNET
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Date:         Fri, 2 Oct 1992 15:58:50 U
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         Joanne Leary <joanne_leary@QMRELAY.MAIL.CORNELL.EDU>
Subject:      Change at the desk

                       Subject:                               Time:3:22 PM
  OFFICE MEMO          Change at the desk                     Date:10/2/92
We fought the change battle for years.  Talk about misery; talk about no-win
situations; it was almost as bad as trying to maintain daily homework solutions
for 150 Engineering courses.  We could never keep enough change to satisfy the
demand (which of course escalated the more we kept on hand).  After years of
not satisying anyone, putting up with thefts from the cash box and driving
ourselves into an early decline, we finally got out of the change business once
and for all by going ahead and buying a change machine, which of course did not
last the semester before it was vandalized.  I was so goddam happy I could have
cried.  It was finally over.  We put up signs at the copiers and the off-campus
phone stating that we could NOT provide change, and for a short while we could
point to the smashed change machine as Exhibit A.  Not too long after that, the
copiers were fixed up with Vendacard units, which were certainly a mixed
blessing, but we were indeed out of the change business for good.  We still get
inquiries, but the level of expectation has certainly changed.  Bus drivers no
longer make change; laundomats around here don't have change either.
Storebanks have proliferated, on the other hand.  People no longer expect the
change service as a given, and that is what has made all the difference.

And if they do inquire, I will have Rustoleum to thank for perhaps the best
one-liner I've ever heard.

Joanne Leary
Cornell Engineering Library
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Date:         Mon, 28 Sep 1992 17:14:00 BSC
Reply-To:     gomide@BRFAPQ
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
Comments:     @FAPQ.FAPESP.BR - @FAPQ%FPSP.HEPNET - @BRFAPQ.BITNET - .BR
              gateway
Comments:     Warning -- original Sender: tag was GOMIDE@BRFAPQ
From:         gomide@FPSP.FAPESP.BR
Subject:      Apologies re: InterMeta course

PLEASE DO NOT SEND MONEY !
It is with regret that I perform this task. Dr. Gelson V. Gomes. a
professor of the University of Parana, Brazil, has exceeded this
privileges and announced a eletronic course:

> ____________________________________________________________
>        Mastering INTERNET Tools, Seizing METANET Power -
>                      The InterMeta Course
> ____________________________________________________________

I must apologize for this flagrant breach of network etiquette. Please
be aware that Dr. Gelson had no right to do so, since this is against
the rules of our ANSP network, and also against the Bitnet rules.
PLEASE DO NOT SEND MONEY!
I will not discuss what his motivations were. But his account has been
revoked, and there will be no such course through my network.

Please write by normal mail, to:
-> Gelson V. Gomes
-> 358, R. Alvaro Andrade - ap.1201
-> Curitiba PR BRAZIL 80610-240
to get more information on his objectives. He may want to give the
course by normal mail.  :-)

With regards,
--
Alberto Courrege Gomide | Fundacao de Amparo `a Pesquisa - (11)831-3357
Software Supervisor     | Rua Pio XI, 1500 - CEP 05468-901 - Sao Paulo
<gomide@fapq.fapesp.br> | FAX (11)261-4167 Telex (11)82014 - Brazil
(ACG8) - .BR Domain Technical Contact. |
--
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Date:         Tue, 6 Oct 1992 21:14:00 -0400
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         "Tom Flemming,
              McMaster University HSL" <TOMFLEM@HSCVAX.CSU.MCMASTER.CA>
Subject:      RE: Late night waxing philosophical....

Just for the record, I want you all to know that in my library, it is
the Circulation staff who get the cards, flowers and candy from our
graduating students at the end of each academic year.  Sure, Reference
staff get appreciation at the time we do something for somebody who
really needs it in a hurry, or who has no idea how to find it for
herself (or himself), but when all is said and done and they're
leaving the place with fond memories of the good time they had in
medical/nursing/whatever school, it is the Circ staff they come back
to thank especially.  Let's face it, it is the Circ staff they meet
early in the morning when they arrive, and who kick them out late at
night as we close.  Circ is there with them in the dark of night after
we Reference types have gone home, and Circ can always be counted on
(I shudder to think of it, at times ...) to recommend the title in the
Reserve Collection that "everyone" is using for whatever this term!

All our other departments are envious of the regard in which our Circ
staff is generally held by our students.

... and by the way, I'm a Head of Public Services who has never worked
in Circ, but believe me, I know from whence cometh our good reputation
on this campus and I thank our Circ staff for it every day!

........................................................................
Tom Flemming                Internet:  tomflem@HSCvax.csu.McMaster.ca
Head of Public Services     Bitnet:    tomflem@McMaster
Health Sciences Library     Envoy 100: mac.lib.hsl
McMaster University         LIFEnet:   TFLEMMIN@life.jsc.nasa.gov
1200 Main Street West
Hamilton, Ontario           (416) 525-9140   x2321      work
Canada   L8N 3Z5            (416) 527-2848              home
........................................................................
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Date:         Mon, 28 Sep 1992 11:10:22 -0400
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         REYESJ@NYUACF.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Friday afternoon and 103 degrees

Yes, it's "May you live in interesting times."

Joan Reyes
NYU Law Library
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Date:         Sat, 26 Sep 1992 18:12:29 CDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         kendall <KSIMMONS%UKANVM.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Self-Serve Checkout
              24 Sep 1992 12:10:27 -0500 from
              <SHONTZ%ATHENA.DECNET%UTHSCSA1.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Because of not enough staff and terminals, our checkout service is not the
fastest in the world, even though our system itself is good, but do we
ever work on friendly service.  I mentioned this before, and think that it
really makes a difference.  I, too, use my ATM almost exclusively, but when
I go to my bank for other reasons, I have a vice-president who recognizes me
and remembers my name - and I go in about 3 times a year.  I LOVE that.  I
feel I'll get the best help possible as opposed to being treated like one of
many unimportant anonymous faces.

Kendall
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Date:         Mon, 5 Oct 1992 22:24:00 EST
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         "W.C. DIVENS" <N93774@PITTVMS.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Just curious???

>Most of our regular patrons come in everyday through the course of the
>academic year and are pretty nice to us.  I never thought about how
>REALLY nice they were until I was out for surgery this summer--I received
>more get well cards from faculty and student patrons than I did from my
>co-workers!  Yuh never know.

>Ted Ficklen
>Health Sciences Library
>University of Missouri-St Louis
>swgfick@umslvma

But of COURSE Ted....in a Health Sciences Library the patrons view
every library staff member as a future client!  :^)

Hope all is well!

Rusty
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Date:         Mon, 5 Oct 1992 07:27:00 EDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         GEFFNER@SJC.BITNET
Subject:      defusing situations

I agree with the "visitor" to the discussion that we circ. people tend to
be combative/negative at times and that keeping the situation from
developing is probably wiser than winning.

However, the nature of a circ. person's job is such that bending over
backwards for patrons could be harmful.  In this job, as in a bank, one
cannot bend the rules because one wants to seem friendly, nor can one
dedicate all one's time to a patron who wants endless attention (one
graduate student here this summer asked me 18 questions during a couple
of hours because she was lonely--and I'm not even the reference librarian).
As for handing out supplies, there are two problems.  1) Who pays for these?
If the school pays, then that is money that could have gone for salaries,
materials.  2) By giving out supplies you create an impression of responsi-
bility for them.  Thus, if you can't fix the stapler jam, you get more heat
than if you hadn't provided the stapler in the first place.  Many of the
charges of "unfriendliness" we get are due to our inability to service
copiers or help patrons in the separately run computer lab upstairs.

As the library's official "bad cop" I have noticed that I have almost no
problems with patrons compared to the friendlier staff members (except for
the reference person, whom patrons tend to play up to).  Friendliness is
often used against new staff by clever patrons.

In addition, since a significant amount of treatment staff get at the desk
could be characterized as abusive, one might argue that trying to be a "good"
staff member could be as futile as being good is for abused children/spouses.
One's passiveness makes one a more attractive victim.  How much of the abuse
is racism/sexism?  What responsibility does one have for maintaining the
dignity of one's position?  Do we want to be as apologetic and accomodating
as waitresses?

The "visitor" also needs to consider what circ's function is as compared to
reference.  Here we often limit a patron's access to an item or are charging
fines: how many people are happy to hear no?  In addition, circ. people can't
"make" administration put in new policies to prevent problems from developing.
It took me years to convince my director to get a VENDACARD attachment for
one of our copiers, and about a year to get a third coin-op copier.  Circ.
workers aren't often in a position to address long term needs (we just live
with the problems and get called grouchy).

Ann Williams, SJC, Circulation

P.S.  My advantage is that I was a grouch before I moved into circ.  I love
seeing how fast the new people discover why one should cultivate the right
amount of grouchiness, enough to give patrons pause for thought but not too
much to intimidate them.  Let's put the faculty in public services for a day:
let's see how they deal with lack of control over one's working conditions!
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Date:         Fri, 2 Oct 1992 09:11:00 EST
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         "W.C. DIVENS" <N93774@PITTVMS.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Staplers, Kleenex and Hole-Punchers

>Anyone have any advice on this? Funny Stories? Anyone ever tried NOT offering
>these or other such things at their circ desk?

Actually....

Our favorite line is when a paton comes up and says "Can I borrow a
staple"?  Our response is "Sure...but be sure to return it here."
To date we have only one returned.

I got in some hot water once for introducing logic into a
library argument.  A patron was hollering about our policy of
not giving change.  Being in a bit of a snit at the time,
when called into the discussion and asked by the patron
why the library did not provide change...my response was
"Because the bank doesn't lend books".

I think change is the #1 request...

Rusty
From: GEFFNER@SJC.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.circplus
Subject: MLS
Date: 2 Oct 92 00:42:00 GMT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"circplus@idbsu"

In the past our circulation librarian had an MLS.  However, eventually
the job was given to me (a general asst. with 4 years experience).  Why?
I suppose cost and the decreasing importance of the specialized library
training.  After all, when you are busy waiting on patrons, running a
reserve room, handling copiers, training student workers, and answering
the phone, how much cataloging and reference work do you do?  I suppose
too with cost cutting being so important in a non-income generating unit,
paying a few thousand more for a professional doesn't make much sense.

In my ten years here (a small college) I've noticed that many of the
professional jobs have changed in such a way that the MLS training isn't
as necessary.  With most cataloging being copy cataloging, acquisitions
being automated and reference questions answered by CD-Roms, will the
MLS become obsolete or will library schools adapt their training?  How
strong are library programs now?

When I had the opportunity to get a Master's degree, I opted for an M.A.
in English.  I'm now working on a second Bachelor's in management.  Frankly,
I think good communications and management skills are more helpful with day
to day jobs.   From what my professional colleagues tell me, I don't get
the sense that these skills were strongly emphasized in their library
courses (except, perhaps, in specialized reference and administrative
courses).  Sad to say, to me, the MLS programs they went through sound
like a buy a degree program: pay for 10 gut courses and walk out with a
Masters (perhaps this perception is why librarians haven't received the
same hike in wages that teachers have).

Do you perceive the MLS as being extremely helpful in your day-to-day
activities?  Or are you a good circ. supervisor due to the school of
hard knocks?  What skills should we be looking for in a circ. super.?
Getting along with people seems too vague: after all, you also have
supervisory responsibilities that the average clerk doesn't face.  Also,
do technical demands create a need for computer-literate supervisors or
is this something one can learn on the job?

Ann Williams, Saint Joseph College
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Date:         Mon, 5 Oct 1992 16:10:21 EDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         Ruth Shaw <RSWX@CORNELLC.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Just curious???

We often have leaving graduates, or post docs come up to the desk and thank
us for having such a nice library and for our helpfulness.  I was astonished a
few weeks ago to receive a gift from a Korean gentleman on his way home as
a thank you.  Yes! Patrons do thank us, and often.

Ruth Shaw
Physical Sciences Library
Cornell
From: JTCAVANAGH@CCMAIL.SUNYSB.EDU (Janet M Cavanagh)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.circplus
Subject: Re: Apology warrented?
Date: 29 Sep 92 17:05:59 GMT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
Organization: State University of New York, Stony Brook
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               State University of New York at Stony Brook
                       Stony Brook, NY 11794-3339

                                            Janet M Cavanagh
                                            Head, Circulation/Reserve Department
                                            Library-Circulation
                                            516 632-0771
                                            29-Sep-1992 01:00pm EDT
FROM:  JTCAVANAGH
TO:    Loretta Merlo                        (
 _@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu:CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET )

SUBJECT: RE: Apology warrented?

Somewhere we should discuss the issue of "casual emotional abuse." It seems to
be spreading in our culture (It was invented here on Long Island.) Our frontline
staff, and those of us responsible for their training, need all the support we
can get. We at least deserve the courtesy and respect of the library
adminstratrs who are cozy behind several layers of doors and authority, in
conducting their inquiries into these complaints by patrons by telling them that
they would like the library personnel's input on these complaints, or words to
that effect.
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Date:         Mon, 28 Sep 1992 10:06:25 EDT
              <CIRCPLUS@IDBSU.BITNET>
From:         Carol Goodson/West GA College <CGOODSON@UGA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: apology

On Sun, 27 Sep 1992 18:46:00 EDT <GEFFNER@SJC> said:
>One of my rules about apologies when a patron criticizes a subordinate is
>to NOT apologize until I find out what really happened.  Why apologize for
>a staff member who is doing his/her job?  After all, we supervisors impose
>the rules on the staff--it's unfair not to back them up.
>
****such problems are built into the nature of Circulation Dept. work...as
opposed to Reference work...which is why I prefer the latter...it's like the
dichotomy between a company's Credit & Collections Dept., vs. Sales...the
delightful job of Reference is to locate the material and get it into the
(usually) grateful hands of the user, whereas the poor Circulation Dept. is
stuck with having to get it all back in a reasonable period of time....I think
Circulation is the toughest job in any library...if you maintain your patience,
your job will ultimately make you a saint!

..................................................................
| Carol Goodson, Coordinator/Off-Campus Library Services         |
| Ingram Library, West Georgia College                           |
| Carrollton  GA  30118                                          |
| PHONE: (706) 830-2360   FAX: (706) 836-6626                    |
| BITNET: cgoodson@uga    INTERNET: cgoodson@uga.cc.uga.edu      |
| COMPUSERVE: 70253,1146            cgoodson@sun.cc.westga.edu.  |
..................................................................
 The difference between the Democrats and the Republicans is that
 while the Democrats remind you that life isn't fair, the
 Republicans make sure it isn't.
...................................................................
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