HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: more of ...can of worms....
Date: 17 Aug 92 19:14:11 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <2416@israel.nysernet.org> warren@nysernet.org writes:

>While I was once in a shul (The Jewish Center in NYC) where they asked
>me to put on a tallit even though I normally don't, I've never heard
>of a man being asked to not wear one if it's their practice, even if
>it's clear that the individual is below the legal age of marriage in
>that state.

In grade school, I had one Rabbi who thought it was permissible and
even encouraged for any man to wear a Talit as soon as he was old
enough to understand the Mitzvoh.  He stated that there was no reason
that one should be prohibited from wearing it, therefore it is, at the
very least, good training for after the Bar Mitzvoh.  

In this school, the only one wearing Talit were the Rabbis and one
student whose father thought he should.  I overheard this when the
student asked whether he should wear it (he was 10 years old at the
time).



-- 
   |)  David Charlap           "I don't even represent myself
  /|_  dic5340@hertz.njit.edu   sometimes so NJIT is right out!.
 ((|,)
  ~|~  Hi! I am a .signature virus, copy me into your .signature file.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: mark@fenris.albany.edu (Mark Steinberger)
Subject: Re: Advertising on the Net - NOTES FROM A SEALED ROOM
Keywords: Persian Gulf War
Organization: State University of New York at Albany
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 21:51:29 GMT

In article <1992Aug14.190652.18380@midway.uchicago.edu> goer@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>I have nothing
>against you or Bob.  I'm merely poking at him for doing something he
>himself realized might not be strictly kosher.

Yes, and how easy it is to poke at someone whose defenses are down.

Welcome to soc.culture.jewish, where you can flame away at anyone
who's handy. Moral superiority comes cheap in these parts.

--Mark
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: lms@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com (Max Stern 310-524-6152)
Subject: Re: Facts and Opinions: Insights on American Jewish Thinking(?)
Organization: NCR (Torrey Pines Development Center)
Disclaimer: This posting does not neccessarily reflect the opinions of NCR.
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 20:27:39 GMT

In article <57360@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> hrubin@pop.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin) writes:

>
[...]
>Much very basic mathematics, etc., has been done by armchair amateurs,
>and even more in statistics.

Not to mention astronomy.
-- 

 |\/|  /_\  \/
 |  | /   \ /\                      Max.Stern@TorreyPinesCA.ncr.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Subject: Re: more of ...can of worms....
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: 14 Aug 92 07:43:54 GMT

ka: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
a: allen@ssc.gov

a: What you want is one thing, what you need is perhaps something else.
a: When someone is damaging themselves, even unintentionally, we all have
a: a responsibility to help them.  Suppose, for example, someone was
a: doing something you knew was dangerous, but that they didn't believe
a: was dangerious (such as carrying some highly radioactive material, for
a: example).  I think you would agree that it is worth being called an
a: ignoramous and worse to protect them from themselves.  Why do you get
a: so angry, then, about the Rabbis trying to protect your Neshama?

ka: This argument proves too much.  (Apply it to Christian missionaries, for
ka: instance.

Yes, it applies to anyone who is sure that they are right.  It's not
surprising that, unlike a radioative substance, where most people
could agree on how to test it, in this case, from the point of view of
Stan (or me, if the critic is a Christian missionary) it's like being
told that the object is emitting dangerous N-rays which are undetectable.

(Of course in this case the question isn't "do N-rays exist?" but "are
N-rays harmful, or are they good for your health?")

I know how I would react if someone came to my shul and told me that
practice X that we do (I think I've discussed a number of non-standard
practices here, I don't want to get sidetracked into a discussion of
those again) was harming our neshamot.  Let alone if this was done
with the intensity that one would expect in the case of an immediate
danger (such as carrying highly radioactive material).

Of course, the difference here is that we know that what we're doing
is correct.  But Stan, Allen, the Christian missionary, they all know
that what they're doing is correct too ...

But the difference of course is that we are really right and the
others are just fooling themselves :)
-- 
/|/-\/-\       The entire universe		Jerusalem
 |__/__/_/     is a very three-sided apple.
 |warren@      But the farmer
/ nysernet.org is worried.
From: strnlght@netcom.com (David Sternlight)
Subject: Re: more of ...can of worms....
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 17:58:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)


Does a divorced man with children, who is interested in remarrying,
From: de@moscom.UUCP (David Esan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: become jewish ?
Date: 19 Aug 92 18:52:27 GMT
Reply-To: de@moscom.UUCP (David Esan)
Organization: Moscom Corp., Pittsford, NY

In article <2436@israel.nysernet.org> warren@nysernet.org writes:
>    Kassin of the Brooklyn Syrian community, who declared: "Our community
>    will never accept any converts, mail or female, for marriage."  The
                                     ^^^^
You can convert by mail?

I thought only basketball players like Aulcie Percy could get conversions 
like that.

Heard old Aulcie is doing time in the US for drugs.  Guess basketball in
Israel doesn't pay as well as the US.

-- 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 -->     David Esan      de@moscom.com  
 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: more of ...can of worms....
Date: 17 Aug 92 21:34:22 GMT
Reply-To: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Organization: The Wistar Institute of Anatomy and Biology
In-reply-to: hrubin@pop.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin)

In article <56990@mentor.cc.purdue.edu>, hrubin@pop (Herman Rubin) writes:
>IF the person is not endangering others, we have the moral right only
>to attempt persuasion.  What gives you the right to tell them what is
>good for them?  [...]

Not all of the `can of worms' discussions are of this form.  They also
include the ever popular "_this_ is what Judaism says" discussion, not
actually telling the listener what to do.
-- 
-Matthew P Wiener (weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu)
From: carpenter@vixvax.mgi.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: punchline needed
Date: 12 Aug 92 14:25:14 GMT
Organization: Management Graphics, Inc.

(I originally posted this to rec.humor.d, but received no response.
It then occurred to me that I might do better posting it here.

My father overheard a joke that goes something like this:

"A Jewish man, married, dies while having sex with another woman.
The other woman notifies his wife, who heatedly tells her
to take care of the burial herself.  After a few days, though, the
wife thinks better of it, and wants to have the body moved to the
family plot.  She has the original grave opened, and the coffin
raised, but upon looking inside, finds not her husband,
but a note reading..."

At this point, the person telling the joke switched from English to
Yiddish.  One of his listeners, after hearing the punchline, said,
"You know, that would be hard to translate!"

Is there anyone who knows the joke and will attempt the translation?
Incidentally, I am expecting that this joke will not be offensive,
but will rather provide some jewish self-commentary.  Otherwise, I
would not be pursuing it.
============================================================================
"The floggings will continue until morale improves."
============================================================================
Dave Carpenter                                       Voice:  +1 612 851 6142
Management Graphics                                    FAX:  +1 612 851 6159
1401 E. 79th St.                        Internet:   carpenter@vixvax.mgi.com
Bloomington, MN   55425 USA
From: aaron@kesher.UUCP (Aaron Schmiedel)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: more of ...can of worms....
Date: 19 Aug 92 14:35:02 GMT
Organization: KESHERnet International - Dallas, TX

In article <1992Aug17.204310.27551@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> stank@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (Stan Krieger) writes:
>
>If we want to get theoretical on this, will they claim that the minhag
>that covers the situation for my son is that of my dad's community (which,
>being Poland, is no tallit until marriage)?  Of course, during our
>affiliation with a Conservative synagogue when I was growing up, my
>dad had me wear a tallit since I was 10 or 11.


Then your father adopted the custom of *THAT* community, which now translates
to the custom of yours.

So it boils down to... do you want to keep your tradition, or change it to
suit the community around you?

For instance, the shul I daven at wraps the tfillin differently from the way
*I* was taught.   There is also another gentleman who wraps his the same as
I do.  So out of (a high) of 30 men, we are the only two who wrap with the
"shin" on the hand instead of the upper arm.

IF that became a source of contention where, as you stated above, it had
about as much validity to the "community" as that of the RC, I would definitely
rethink my position in that community.  As long as it is halachically 
permissible, it's fine.    I would think that if it *DID* become an issue,
there would be a lot of Jews at your <my> shul who have too much time on
their hands, nu?

Our big fuss is how to pay the bills.  :-)




-- 
| Aaron D. Schmiedel            |  All my opinions represent what is right  |
| KESHERnet International       |  and true.  Just ask me....               |
| The Jewish Computer Network   |       <aaron@kesher.lonestar.org>         |
| Voice: (214) 239-1941         | ...uunet!convex!egsner!sdf!kesher!aaron   |
Xref: sparky soc.culture.jewish:14076 soc.culture.yugoslavia:7840
From: markr@mot.com (Mark)
Subject: Re: Should a jew settle in Israel?
Reply-To: markr@mcil.comm.mot.com
Organization: MCIL
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 15:25:06 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.153913.3562@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>In article <1992Aug19.131828.10261@rs.com> horen@rs.com writes:
>>In article 17390@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM, nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>>>>In article <-#!nfbp.yosi@netcom.com> yosi@netcom.com (Yosi Almog) writes:
>>>>
>>>>What about you, do you think there is any importance for a jew to live
>>>>in Israel?
>>>
>>>You are asking the wrong person. However I will be honest with you and tell
>>>you my opinion. If you ask the question "Does a Jew have the right to live
>>>in Israel?" I would answer "A Jew have the right to live anywhere in the 
>>>world and so does anyone else". As far as is it important, I would say I don't
>>>know simply because I am not a Jew.
>>
>>Well, then, do I, as a Jew, have the right to live in Mecca? Do you think that
>>I have the right to go up onto the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, into the
>>Al-Aksa mosque, and worship in my Jewish way?
>>
>>Be honest.
>
>Well, I will be honest with you. If you tell me as a non-Jew that I am welcome
>to live anywhere in the World except that I am not allowed to enter a 
>synagogue or live in a certain area in Jerusalem that is sacred to Jews,
>I will gladly accept that. Not allowing non-muslims to live in Mecca 
>or go up onto the Temple Mount is a religious belief. You can do it if
>you convert to Islam and I think you don't have plans for that. 

I don't know any places in the world, a non-Jew may live.  I do know
that there are NO restrictions as to who may enter a synagogue, a
synagogue is just a building where Jews gather to pray.  I've been in
numerous synagogues where there were any number of non-Jews present.
(including during services)

Religious beliefs that affect other peoples actions are, IMNSHO, bad
beliefs. (no offense to your religion, but it shouldn't tell ME what
to do and what not to do, or where to go and where not to go)

Mark


Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: allen@golem.ssc.gov (Michael Allen)
Subject: Re: Smoking during major fasts
Reply-To: allen@ssc.gov
Organization: SSC Laboratory, Dallas, TX
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 15:03:42 GMT

>>>>> On 13 Aug 92 18:39:26 GMT, dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) said:
In article <1992Aug13.183926.17362@njitgw.njit.edu> dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) writes:

David> Nntp-Posting-Host: hertz.njit.edu

David> In article <1992Aug10.222355.7301@news.ysu.edu> aa324@yfn.ysu.edu (Marlene Miller) writes:
>
>I don't smoke, but I'm curious to know if smoking is permitted during
>major fasts.

David> I've always believed (and been supported by one or two Rabbis) that
David> smoking isn't allowed at all.  The reason?  It's a health hazard, and
David> you're commanded not to do things to yourself that are dangerous.

I believe that that the Halachah as posken by R. Moshe Feinstein ZT"L
is that it is forbidden for a Jew to start smoking, but that one who
already smokes is not transgressing by continuing to smoke.
--
===================================================
But those who toiled knew nothing of the dreams of 
        Those Who Planned;                         
And the minds who planned the Tower of Babel       
        Cared nothing for the workers who built it.

	-Metropolis
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: rig@eng.umd.edu (Ronald Greenberg)
Subject: Re: more of ...can of worms....
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 20:35:24 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park, College of Engineering

In article <1992Aug11.195514.649608@locus.com> hayim@locus.com (Hayim Hendeles) writes:

>Why is everyone making such a big deal over the tallis? In fact, the 
>custom is in most Ashkenazic communities, that one does NOT wear a
>tallis before they are married. (There are Kabbalistic reasons
>cited for this in the Sefer Taamei Haminhagim, for those who care
>to look).

>I suppose some wish to wear the tallis in the synagogue in order
>to feel "Jewish". Perhaps they do not have ample opportunity
>to feel "Jewish", and hence need to search for new ways.
>
>There is enough Mitzvos the Torah did give us, without having to
>go out and invent new ones. If we kept those, we wouldn't need
>to search for temporary doses of Jewishness.

I didn't think we had made a big deal over it.  It seems to me that
you are protesting too strongly.  It happens that I am not married and
do not where a tallis, which I indicated is the dominant minhag in
Orthodox synagogues.  But the other approach is perfectly valid via
Orthodox sources.  Obviously, I have no problem with your minhag,
since I do it myself, but you shouldn't object to the other minhag.
-- 

Ronald I. Greenberg	(Ron)		rig@eng.umd.edu
From: rubinoff@linc.cis.upenn.edu (Robert Rubinoff)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: become jewish ?
Date: 14 Aug 92 12:57:03 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Aug14.101010.11514@cicb.fr> moisan@cicb.fr (Herve Moisan -  stagiaire CICB) writes:
>is it true that nobody can become jewish and it is obligatory to
>have a jewish mother ?

No.

Actually, the process of converting to Judaism is quite simple.  (Note that
"simple" is not the same as "easy".)

   Robert
From: stateman@hplred.HP.COM (Howard Stateman)
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:51:56 GMT
Subject: PC/Laserjet Hebrew Fonts?
Organization: HP Research Grants Program
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish

Could someone please point me to an ftp site or BBS which has public domain
or shareware Hebrew software for MS-DOS or MS-Windows? I just need to print
a few lines in Hebrew, and don't want to spend a lot of sheckels for
something which will only be used now and then for small projects. Ideal
would be TrueType fonts for MS-Windows 3.1. But anything which will give me
Hebrew output to an HP Laserjet (PCL or Postscript) is fine.
Toda Raba.

Howard Stateman  
howeird@hpl.hp.com 
Support Engineer, HP Research Grants Program 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: jeybbu@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Subject: Re: Facts and Opinions: Insights on American Jewish Thinking(?)
Reply-To: jeybbu@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 16:51:58 GMT

Steve,

Well spoken....

I have often said that Judiasm is the only area of knowledge where parents
are happy to have their children know less than the parents.

RE: error of the Jewish "right"...The danger here is the fixation on
the literal text and, particularly among some BTs, the gross
over simplification of complex issues.  They also confuse midrash, and
very local minhag with halakah.  

The lack of a factual, or knolwedge base for discussion is also
very valid.  See Bloom's, "The Closing of the American Mind."
It is not just a Jewish problem as your Murphy Brown item
illustrates.

Shabbat shalom,,,,

Julian Yudelson
Kol Israel chaverim..

JEYBBU@RITVAX.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: ckinberg@milton.u.washington.edu (Clare Kinberg)
Subject: Re: Gates NY Times Op Ed
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 19:46:58 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.185803.19430@u.washington.edu> ckinberg@milton.u.washington.edu (Clare Kinberg) writes:
>Does anyone have an archive of the thread concerning the Henry Louis
Gates New York Times Op Ed piece about anti-Semitism and African
Americans.  I am a new user and lost it before saving. Please resond to
Clare Kinberg (ckinberg@milton.u.washington.edu)
Thanks.


Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: amir@cc.gatech.edu (Amihood Amir)
Subject: Re: Breaking a Glass in the Marriage Ceremony - Why?
Organization: College of Computing
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 13:33:04 GMT

>I think Rabbi Maurice Lamm, in "The Jewish Way in Love and Marriage"
>deplores the fact that the breaking of the glass is immediately
>followed by shouts of Mazel Tov!   He recommends placing the glass
>breaking inside the ceremony and not at the end.  Has anyone seen
>this done?
>
>(If it is done, how does everyone know when to shout Mazel Tov :^)
>--
>Art Kamlet  a_s_kamlet@att.com  AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus

In many weddings in Israel, the breaking of the glass is followed by
the crowd singing "Im Eshkachech Yerushalaim".

-- Ami


					
					-Amihood Amir (amir@cc.gatech.edu)
From: de@moscom.UUCP (David Esan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: become jewish ?
Date: 18 Aug 92 18:16:10 GMT
Reply-To: de@moscom.UUCP (David Esan)
Organization: Moscom Corp., Pittsford, NY

In article <1992Aug14.220035.19125@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> ejk@coral.JPL.NASA.gov (Elya Kapelyan) writes:
>|> to a Jew (halachically or not).  I have met a couple (both non-Jews)
>|> who were refused by a Sephardic rabbi and then converted into
>|> a Chasidic group.  I think the rabbi was from Syria.
>
>	How do they justify this (halachicly)?  It seems to be way out of 
>the mainstream of Jewish practice.

The Ba'al Koreh in my shul is the grandson of the Chief Rabbi of the Syrian
Jewish community (now mainly in Brooklyn).  They decided that conversion in
the US were not the result of a sincere wish to become Jewish, but a wish
to marry a Jew, or to advance in business.  They refused to do any more 
conversions.

I do not remember if they will accept converts from other groups of Jews, or
will not accept them.


-- 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 -->     David Esan      de@moscom.com  
 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: engelson-sean@CS.YALE.EDU (Sean Philip Engelson)
Subject: Re: Jewish friends - help!
Organization: Yale AI Mobile Robotics Project
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 13:30:13 GMT


In article <1992Aug12.173546.17090@njitgw.njit.edu>, dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) writes:

|> As for hunger vs. kashrut - you're allowed to violate all but three
|> laws to save a life (including your own).  if you're really starving,
|> you are even allowed to eat a ham sandwich if there is nothing else
|> edible around.  Of course, it's better to prepare and not get into
|> such situations in the first place.

Just to ensure that there are no misunderstandings---by "really starving",
David was not using the common colloquialism for "really hungry".  He meant
starving to death, in the literal sense that without the ham sandwich you will
die.  

Ah the perils of halachic advice over the net....

Happy T"U b'Av!

		-Shlomo-
-- 
Sean Philip (Shlomo) Engelson		Im eshkachekh Yerushalayim, 
Yale Department of Computer Science		Tishkach yemini;  
Box 2158 Yale Station			Tidbak leshoni l.chiki
New Haven, CT 06520				Im lo ezkerekhi...
From: dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Egg Creams (was Re: Proof of the Decline and Fall)
Date: 21 Aug 92 20:18:29 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <92Aug21.032854.22038@acs.ucalgary.ca> kmjoffe@acs.ucalgary.ca (Kenneth M. Joffe) writes:
>Hold on a second here.  What is this crap with seltzer??  Maybe I
>do not know exactly what an 'egg cream' is. I remember my
>bub making something called 'goggle moggle'.  Not sure if
>that is an official name or her own term.  It involved boiling
>milk with an egg in it, adding vanila extract and other stuff.

Nope.  The "egg cream" is a New York invention.  Oddly names, because
there's no egg or cream in it.  It's composed of chocolate syrup
(again, Fox's U-Bet is the best for this purpose), milk, and seltzer.
The stronger the seltzer, the better.  Proprtions are individual, and
are defended almost more than halacha!  :-)
-- 
   |)  David Charlap           "I don't even represent myself
  /|_  dic5340@hertz.njit.edu   sometimes so NJIT is right out!.
 ((|,)
  ~|~  Hi! I am a .signature virus, copy me into your .signature file.
From: ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Some cute definitions ...
Date: 19 Aug 92 09:13:40 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <1992Aug19.005616.613623@locus.com> hayim@locus.com (Hayim Hendeles) writes:
>I heard a cute definition the other day, which I thought my net friends
>might enjoy.
>
>Definition of a  "fanatic"   - anyone to the right of you
>   "       "  an "apikorus"  - anyone to the left  of you
>
>For those who don't know, an "apikorus" might be loosely translated as
>a heretic.                    ^^^^^^^^
>
>Hayim Hendeles

The origin of the term is: Helenistic philosopher having that name.

The term LIBERAL , by the way , has a Hebrew origion.
Liberal = LIBI RAL = my hart is a poisen.

Shalom   gideon Ehrlich   ERETZ YISRAEL


Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: horen@rs.com (Jonathan B. Horen)
Subject: Request for Material
Organization: Renaissance Software, Inc.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 19:59:20 PDT

About 4-5 months ago (wow, time flies!) someone posted a listing of
Jewish/Yeshivish "smilies". Had it, rm'd it.

Anyone got it, and want to repost it or email it to me?

Toda me-Rosh, v'tizku le-Mitzvot.

 +------------------------------+-----------------------------------+
 | Jonathan B. Horen            |      _ ___ _ ___   _  __ _ _ _    |
 | Tech Writer/Sys Admin        |      /   / /   /   / / / / / /    |
 | Renaissance Software, Inc.   |     /   / / / /   /_/ /_/ /       |
 | email: j.horen@rs.com        |    /             /                |
 +------------------------------+-----------------------------------+