HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Men In Black
Date: 24 Jul 92 20:42:01 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/428.0 - <ParaNet(sm) , Arvada CO


 > Yes, Barker was definitely "pulling peoples' chain" with just about
 > everything he wrote. If anyone did anything the least bit strange, he
 > would suggest "was X visited by (gasp!) the Three Men???????".
 >
 > James Moseley, one of the *least-silent* individuals in UFOlogy today,
 > was claimed by Barker in "They Knew Too Much about Flying Saucers" to
 > have
 > been silenced by the MIB during the 1950s. Moseley obviously views the
 > whole thing as a big joke. If you ask him about it, he just smiles
 > and says, "I'm sorry, I'm not at liberty to discuss that!"

What is your reading on John Keel, who also is a big proponent of the MIB 
stuff?

Mike

--  
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
Xref: sparky alt.alien.visitors:4948 sci.skeptic:13435
From: mcgrew@dropout.rutgers.edu (Charles Mcgrew)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Men In Black
Date: 31 Jul 92 01:07:43 GMT
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.


	mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu writes
	Ahem.  Testimony from hypnotic regression is VERY shaky.  Good
	hypnotists are very, very careful because it is so easy for
	the hypnotist to create false memories by suggestion, even
	unintentionally....In other words, the explanation is
	simple--a charlatan is promulgating his own twisted fantasies
	through abuse of hypnotism.

... In general I agree with your comments about hypnosis (but am not
quite willing to completely go along with your condemnation of Mr.
Hopkins.)  A number of abductees' memories have not been
hypnosis-enhanced, and Budd doesn't hypnotise-interview all there are
(he's the best known, is all.)  The phenomenon (regardless of source)
is very complex.  Jacques Vallee had a bit on this subject in his
recent book "Confrontations" (in a section appropriately titles "The
Abduction Quagmire").  I recommend the book.  Here's a semi-summary:

	* Don't hypnotise people yourself, unless you are a qualified,
	  professional hypnotherapist.  

	* Just because a non-professional has performed (even many)
	  hypnosis sessions before, is no guarantee that what
	  information is gained has any value (or truth) at all.

	* There is (as Robert said) a real danger that a
	  hypnotherapist may "pull" false memories from a subject with
	  leading questions, and even plant such memories and screw
	  the subject up in this way.  If you really want to use
	  hypnosis, use a properly-checked-out professional (often a
	  psychologist), and use one who does NOT have a pro-UFO or
	  anti-UFO bias.  Let the hypnotist frame the questions, and
	  control the situation.

	* Hypnosis should be a last resort; often it is not required.
	  Once a subject has been interrogated through hypnosis
	  (especially an amateur), then any further, non-hyposis
	  rememberances will be suspect.


... playing with people's heads is dangerous stuff.  Be careful.

Charles
From: John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Ley Lines
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 23:44:08 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world
  <61064@cup.portal.com>

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: leo@zelator.in-berlin.de (Stefan Hartmann)
Subject: Re: NASA's Block of Ice!
Organization: Puplic-Access-Xenix-System
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 92 20:39:47 GMT

In <1992Jul23.144101.29930@odin.corp.sgi.com> rodb@slugo.corp.sgi.com (Rod Beckwith) writes:

>Jason,[you write]:

>>Despite this, I must say that this video sequence show's the most
>significant
>>UFO in decades.

>>I'd like to see more discussion of this important piece of evidence.

>If you look back when this story first aired here in the U.S., you will
>find a tedious amount of discussion on the piece of ice/UFO. Also check the
>alt.skeptics newsgroup.

>I also have a question for you folks DOWN UNDER.(That's AUSTRAILIA for
>those of you who don't know where down under is.) I recall that about 3-4
>years ago that
>an egg shaped craft buzzed a family in a car on some highway down there. As
>I recall there was some material released by the craft & it was retrieved
>by the occupants of the vehicle. The material was brought in for analysis &
>that was the last I ever heard about it. I think a fishing boat offshore
>also reported
>seeing the craft about an hour later. There was quite a bit of news on the
>incident back then, but as most  news stories go , the press never really
>follows up. 

>Rod 


>-- 
>Rod Beckwith     |$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 
>Datacom I/S      |"The great obstacle of progress is not ignorance,
>rodb@corp.sgi.com|but the illusion of knowledge."


Hi,
this UFO accident what You mentioned was in Adelaine, Sothern
Australia !

I heard about it too and still have a newspaper article about it !

Well, the UFO shook a car and the family which was driving in this car
did hide near the car.
When  they came back, when the UFO left, there was some black ashes
all over the top of the car !

This ashes should be investigated by some chemical lab, but I never
heard of any results !

Did anybody hear about the results of the chemical test ?


Please send email as a reply to me, cause I am from tommorrow on
2 weeks on vaccation (holidays)!

Best regards, Stefan Hartmann.
email to: leo@zelator.in-berlin.de


-- 
 
*************************************************************
*  Stefan Hartmann       This is how to contact me:         *
*  EMAIL: leo@zelator.in-berlin.de                          *
*  Phone : ++ 49 30 344 23 66      FAX : ++ 49 30 344 92 79 *
*************************************************************
From: shanwang@sara.cc.utu.fi
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: RE: Ley_Lines <<= Please cool down =>>
Date: 23 Jul 92 02:24:33 GMT
Organization: University of Turku, Finland


    
       	Dear Alexi,
      
            Thank you so much for kindly help for Hillman. I am sorry because
	for a long time he is away from his Dept. for vocation and will  come
	back next week. 

	    Well, anyway please me to say please cool down for you  disagree-
	mant. I think most of your ideas about Lein-Line should be right. Any
	way you are well-experienced professional but actuallyhillman is only 
	a young  innocent  enthusiasm  in this field.  I guess that the  only 
        difference is your analysize method is a little different. I had read
	quite a lot of papers of UFO stuff written by this young fellow.   It
	seems that his  researching style is  relatively systematically,  but 
        also too carefully and slackly. He always express his thankness to me
	for your genious  guidiance which lead  his inspiration.  But  please            
	be patient or caution for a while because you don't know his  present 
	subject and hindrance. I hope not from Carl, that fellow is so diffi-
	cult to deal with in some cases.
                             ^^^^^^^^^^^

	    In short, please cool down, Mr. Alexi.  I hope time can  show more
	evidence to you about Hillman's present business. Haven't you fell any
	convenience on your Lab. ? For instance, some new research  utilities?
	Before Hillman leave for vocation,  he said that  those could be  very 
        useful for your Corp-Cicycle investigation  research on your UFO Club.
	
	    I hope later hillman can sent you some  good news and could  go to 
        discuss with you face to face for your joint interested topic. But I'm
	afraid to say that  maybe he  is realy not  available for taht seminor
	because he is faraway from your place.

	    Well, anyway thanks a lot for your kindly care for his paper. Hope
	later you can get more chances to do some joint research programmes. I
	guess you will like that.

	    By the way, could you recommand me  some  E-mail address of  other 
        enthusiasm who can make a important role in this Corp-Circycle  inves-
	tigation. If next week Hillman want to contact with you. Those fellows
	can forward tht news to you...

	    Anyway, let's cool down for a while,  I hope  you can satisfy  your
	achievenent now. Ain't right. Please let's wait for a while, ok ?

            Thanks for your kindly consideration.
	
	    Best wishes.

	    Cheer:)							
                                                 Yours UFOly

						 Auratapaa_Wang
From: rxkgre@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (Geof Evans)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: WIR's [Was MIB]
Date: 22 Jul 92 18:38:14 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre, Melbourne Australia.

EIVERSO@cms.cc.wayne.edu writes:

>In article <1992Jul21.022007.4543@nntpd.lkg.dec.com>
>rosch@cpdw.enet.dec.com (Ray Rosch) writes:
>>Has anyone been followed by WIR's [Women in Red]? Were you wearing Obsession
>>or Old Spice?
>They have this trick where they ask you to hold a twenty dollar bill in
>your hand. Then they take the money and hold it in their hand. I'm not sure
>what happens next but some men apparently undergo bizzare changes, some
>leaving piles of sticky goo on the ground.
>Enough comedy...
>You mean LIRs (Ladies in Red)?
>I'd suggest you watch the movie: The Thin Blue Line, wherein we learn
>that the famous LIR was actually a LIO (Lady in Orange).

<<<* Hey I really dig the sense of humour that this group seems to be developing     "No maam...we're musicians"
     UFO's are *serious* business but you gotta laugh...least I do.

-- 
  ___________________________________________________________________  
|| Geof Evans                 | DOMAIN: rxkgre@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au  ||
|| Melbourne,Australia 3000   | Tel: +61 3 663 3663		     ||
||   If they *really* wanna know...tell 'em that God was drunk.      ||
||___________________________________________________________________||

			
Xref: sparky alt.alien.visitors:4756 sci.skeptic:13159
From: thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Erich Von Daniken
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 02:17:24 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <62658@cup.portal.com> <1992Jul23.170148.919@m.cs.uiuc.edu>

In article <1992Jul23.170148.919@m.cs.uiuc.edu>
mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath) writes:

>In article <62658@cup.portal.com>, thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) writes
 in part:
>|>[...]
>|> Some actual (and identifiable) dinosaur footprints were present in the rock
,
>|> along with what appeared to me (and these were the ones labelled as "unknow
n")
>|> to be the tracks of a military jeep.  Two parallel tracks with about a 5 fo
ot
>|> separation (for some 15 feet, in the slab fragment) which resembled today's
>|> high-tech all-weather tire-treads.  Tracks which were made millions of year
s
>|> ago. Incredible; I'll never forget that sight; and when I uttered that thou
ght
>|> out loud (I was only about 8 years old then), everyone turned around and
>|> looked at me strangely, yet no-one made any comments or smiled.  [ See belo
w ]
>
>Incredible is the word.  This would be a lot harder to understand if I
>hadn't read the classic science fiction story of that time from which 
>this little joke was taken.

If it's a joke, then it's one on me [for I was there].

However, I'm not going to "defend" my remembrance since nearly 40 years have
elapsed (this was about 1952-1953; we lived in the area from 1951 to 1956).

And at that (original) time I was in the company of my Dad who desired to
tour the entire Museum in one day (he was like that; and the museum occupied
an entire city block [it was HUGE]).

Next time I'm in DC, I'll make a point to re-visit that Smithsonian exhibit
and attempt to collect more info; this cannot be until at least mid-1993.

One correspondent commented that perhaps the tracks were those of amphibians'
flippers.  'Spossible (and more plausible!)  All I stated was that the tracks
bore a resemblance to tire tracks, NOT that they were tire tracks!  :-)

As for science-fiction, could not the author have seen the same exhibit which
stimulated HIS story?  Have you a reference [title, author, etc.]?

Thad Floryan [ thad@cup.portal.com ]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,rec.humor
From: chip@tct.com (Chip Salzenberg)
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 15:57:33 GMT
Organization: TC Telemanagement, Clearwater, FL

According to garys@bluemoon.rn.com (Gary Stollman):
>But please don't try to ruin my reputation by making others believe
>that I am writing totally ludicrous notes on here...

Heh.

Heheh.

BwaHAHAHAHAhaha.....
-- 
Chip Salzenberg at Teltronics/TCT  <chip@tct.com>, <73717.366@compuserve.com>
   "Do Rush place weird subliminal backmasked messages in their songs to
 compel unwilling geeks to commit evil .sig atrocities?"  -- Dean Engelhardt
Xref: sparky alt.alien.visitors:4669 sci.skeptic:13055
From: thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: zeta reticuli?
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 05:58:21 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

In article <mBoaoB1w165w@spectrx.saigon.com>
aaron@spectrx.saigon.com (Aaron Anderer - System) writes:

|  [...]
|  be discovered or created, even fudged so we could understand how you can 
|  go through space that fast without the g-force problems associated with 
|  normal rocket accelleration.
|  [...] 

Wellll, a "solution" to the problem of g-forces would be an "inertia-less"
drive.  One would be even able to make abrupt, right-angle turns at speed
without any deleterious effects.

Damifino how one would go about constructing such a drive, though.  A
Unified Field Theory hasn't materialized (yet), and that would be only
the FIRST step.  Heck, we haven't [practicably] harnessed fusion!

I wonder: does anyone know if there ARE any researchers tackling the problem
(of a Unified Field Theory)?  I haven't the background, funding, nor the time
to do so myself, and I haven't read of any ongoing studies in the journals to
which I subscribe.

Thad Floryan [ thad@cup.portal.com ]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: jdnicoll@watyew.uwaterloo.ca (James Davis Nicoll)
Subject: Re: zeta reticuli?
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 03:31:21 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.130451.21078@nntpd2.cxo.dec.com> timpson@nntpd2.enet.dec.com (Steve Timpson) writes:
>
>In article <mBoaoB1w165w@spectrx.saigon.com>, aaron@spectrx.saigon.com (Aaron Anderer - System) writes...
>>I was talking to my mom about some of the stuff I've been reading in this 
>>group, and I mentioned Zeta Reticuli.  She said that she heard that star system 
>>had a super nova quite recently, actually one of the larger ones.  Could some 
>
>        WRONG!
>
>        there have  been  no  known super  novas  in  our  galaxy in quit
>        sonetime.  they  are  a  rare event and the most recent have been
>        extra galactic.

	A supernova within 40 lightyears would be very very obvious
(Apparent magnitude of ~ -21ish, I think) and could also be very very
bad, wrt our current ecosystem. None of the ZR stars are SN candidates,
though.

							James Nicoll
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: kring@efes.physik.uni-kl.de (Thomas Kettenring)
Subject: Re: ***Good_Luck_for_Your_Astral_Convey***
Organization: FB Physik, Universitaet Kaiserslautern, Germany
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:06:07 GMT

In article <aero.711995750@neptune>, aero@neptune.ecn.uoknor.edu (Aero Student Account) writes:
>John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
>
>>Dear John H.
>>Haven't any time but will comment on this later.
>>John Winston.
>
>Would someone please teach Mr. Winston about the subtleties and
>nuances which distinguish "followup" from "reply?"

I did that some weeks ago, and he answered thanking me but continued posting
instead of mailing, so I put him in my KILL file.  That works much better.

-- 
--------------thomas kettenring, 2 dan, kaiserslautern, germany---------------
Do you ask a Napoleon why it has to be Moscow, of all places?  Do you ask a
Mondrian why one has to paint only in the rectangularly framed primary colours
Red, Blue, and Yellow?  Ah, how all questions are ruined in view of a persuas-
ively recited system of madness! And is there a mortar keeping those systems
together firmer than real or supposed enemies?  -  Robert Gernhardt
From: jmv@grip.cis.upenn.edu (Jean-Marc Vezien)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Is Bigfoot a Visitor?
Date: 31 Jul 92 20:18:29 GMT
Organization: GRASP Lab


Rod,

I usually don't feel the urge to post in this group,
but this time I'd like to enter the thread, just to say:

cool down.


Sentences like "He drew blood first.." won't lead us very far.
Let's examine the facts, ok ? You told us how you woke up
once and saw a strange looking creature in front of you.
It seems logical, under the circumstances to ask "Could 
it be a dream ?" "Were you fully awake ?".You say:

|>I was fully awake genius. I can tell the difference
|> between
|> reality & a dream.


Unfortunately, as many people could tell you, some dream
look terribly real (I've dreamed I was waking up and something
terrible, like my parents'death, was occuring. Looked TERRIBLY real,
let me tell you). I'm NOT saying you were dreaming, it is just a POSSIBILITY.


It could also be an alien.

Or a stupid joke.


As usual, it's normal to try the most plausible explanation first,
and in your case, hypnogogic vision is the most plausible.
(As it was said, it's a very common phenomenon. Aliens stepping in
average citizens' bedroom is VERY rare, indeed). Of 
course, nothing is sure. But nobody DENIES you saw something.

I remember one day in summer, I was around 10, I was looking at the 
afternoon blu sky. I spotted a "jet plane", following the tiny object
along a linear progression. I told my mom, "look at the jet",
I turned back to spot the plane again, I found it flying...
exactly orthogonally to its previous direction !  Of course, nobody
can believe that, and I've come up to several rationnal explanations.
It still could be an UFO, but it's very unlikely.
It is also very unlikely, although nobody can "prove" it, that
you just had some kind of dreamish hallucination.


JM.
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
From: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath)
Subject: Re: Erich Von Daniken
Reply-To: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 17:58:45 GMT

In article <62705@cup.portal.com>, thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) writes in part:
|> If it's a joke, then it's one on me [for I was there].
That's what I meant.

I tend to suspect you could have seen a plaster cast of footprints
with jeep tracks added.  Easy enough to do.  Pretty funny, too.

|> As for science-fiction, could not the author have seen the same exhibit which
|> stimulated HIS story?  Have you a reference [title, author, etc.]?
Yes, the causation could very well be the other way.

If I had the reference I would have posted it. :-)  I'm still searching.
I think this was in a collection of short stories by Arthur C. Clarke.
Anyone want to help out here?

|> One correspondent commented that perhaps the tracks were those of amphibians'
|> flippers.  'Spossible (and more plausible!)  All I stated was that the tracks
|> bore a resemblance to tire tracks, NOT that they were tire tracks!  :-)
Ahem.  Actually, you were pretty darn certain that they were tire tracks
in your previous posting.

-- 
  Robert E. McGrath
  Urbana Illinois
  mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.sci.physics.new-theories
From: jcitro3@cwis.unomaha.edu (Joe Citro III)
Subject: Re: NASA's Block of Ice!
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 03:12:32 GMT

I do not claim to be a physicist or even a hobbiest of quantum mechanics, but
if the first object was indeed ice that moved due to the shuttle's engines
(or whatever) then why did the first object that clearly seems to be furtherter
away move first? Would not the initial force applied by the shuttle act on
the nearer object first (supposed fired shot)?  Accordingly, the UFO would not
have moved until the shot (or ice) arrived. Any explanations?

                                        Joseph A. Citro III
                                        
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy
From: mdl@phelixsalt (Michael Lynch)
Subject: Re: steamshovel
Reply-To: mdl@phelixsalt (Michael Lynch)
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 16:03:10 GMT

In article <168328196.SKTHOMA@UMSLVMA.UMSL.EDU>, SKTHOMA@UMSLVMA.UMSL.EDU (Kenn Thomas) writes:
|> In article <4oFTNB3w165w@utopia.hacktic.nl> gary@utopia.hacktic.nl (Gary Stollman) writes:
|>  
|> >SEE ? I am everywhere ! It's impossible to implant me with one of your
|> >crystals..
|>  
|> We did it last week, glasshead, when you were in the shower playing with
|> yourself.
|>  
|> --
|> "I mean the clearing out of the Jews, the extermination of the Jewish race.
|> It's one of those things it is easy to talk about -- `The Jewish race is being
|> exterminated,' says one party member, `that's quite clear, it's in our program
|> -- elimination of the Jews, and we're doing it, exterminating them.'"[Himmler]
|> I'm trying to post to this list but the set up here is very confusing. Please
|> forgive the intrusion.  My main purpose is to contact potentials readers of and
|>  writers for Steamshovel Press, a conpsiracy theory magazine.  The current issu
|> e of SP contains interviews with Mark Lane, Kerry Thornley, Dick Gregory and Ji
|> m Marrs; an article on AIDS cures; a "saucer section" with UFO speculations; cr
|> iticism of Noam Chomsky.  Previous issues have had material on the CIA's involv
|> ement with Abbie Hoffman's death; the Pentagon origins of AIDS; stuff on Wilhel
|> m Reich.  The next issue, under production, includes an article on Reich's FOIA
|> file; an overview of INSLAW and the Danny Casaloro case; something on the Shrou
|> d of Turin; an interview with Deborah Davis, who wrote Katharine The Great, abo
|> out Mary Pinchot Meyer, Bob Woodward and Nixon, etc. Anyway, we're always looki
|> ng for contributions from the conspiracy minded for future issues and this post
|> ,if I can get this to work right, is just such an appeal.  Contact me at this e
|> -mail address or at 5927 Kingsbury, St. Louis, MO 63112.


I'm not sure what this is -- a very long .sig, or a request of some sort.
However, I do have a subject for the next issue of Steamshovel Press.  I
saw it on a bumper sticker the other day.

Humpty Dumpty was pushed.


We really should know more about this.  Was there CIA involvement, perhaps?

Mike Lynch
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors