HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ivie@cc.usu.edu (CP/M lives!)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Deutsches Museum (was: Zuse Computers
Date: 16 Aug 92 20:07:05 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <2a8c2f6cwnr070@ark.abg.sub.org>, ralf@ark.abg.sub.org (Ralf Stephan) writes:
> 
> If I'm not mistaken, the "Deutsches Museum" in Munich should have one
> machine.  Anyway, this museum is a must for any technology lovers out there.

Ahhh. Deutsches Museum is wonderful. I was in Munich on business a couple of
years ago and visited the Deutsches Museum. I had flashbacks to a forgotten
field trip there in first grade (Dad was in the US Army stationed at
Fort McGraw).

It was kind of funny seeing people try to take flash pictures of the
planetarium screen...

Roger Ivie
ivie@cc.usu.edu
From: okes@solb1.essex.ac.uk (Oke S)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Favorite CPU
Date: 21 Aug 92 16:22:35 GMT
	<BszsBv.A32@sunic.sunet.se> <1992Aug20.195709.11827@Cadence.COM>
Organization: University of Essex, UK
In-reply-to: phz@cadence.com's message of 20 Aug 92 19:57:09 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.195709.11827@Cadence.COM> phz@cadence.com (Pete Zakel) writes:
>In article <9208121907.AA27870@thep.lu.se> magnus@THEP.LU.SE (Magnus Olsson) writes:

>! Of course, if you're writing software which will decide matters of
>! life or death, bounds checking isn't enough - what if you've written
>! an air traffic control system, or, even worse, the fly-by-wire
>! software in an airplane, and in the middle of a critical manuever you
>! get the message
>! 
>! Array index out of bounds - core dumped?

>Didn't one of the Air Force's recent jets have a flight control system that
>caused the plane to flip over when it crossed the equator into the southern
>hemisphere?

I believe this was a bug in the first version of the fly-by-wire system
for the F-16.

--
This signature is copyright 12/6/1992 Simon Oke. All rights reserved. If you
like it and keep a copy for your own use, you owe me $20. Please pass it on
to your friends with all documentation.              Email okes@essex.ac.uk.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 In the beginning, the universe was created. This made a lot of people very
	angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: aduell@nyx.cs.du.edu (Tony Duell)
Subject: Re: Computers killing people?  (WAS Re: 9 track data storage???)
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 92 15:55:08 GMT


I don't want to start a flamewar, but there is a lot of confusion and
mis-information about concerning the IBM-PC printer port. Here, as I
understand it (from the techref and the UMC data book) is the story:
1) The original IBM PC port had 8 unidirectional (output only) data lines.
There were however 5 input lines (busy etc). File transfer system (Laplink
etc) use these line to transfer 1 nybble at a time.
2) A simple modification allowed an unused bit of the control register
(CSR for you DEC hackers) to disable the data outputs. Because there was a
buffer to allow diagnostc readback of the states of the external pins,
This made the port bidirectional.
3) Some clones had this mod done in manufacture, thus giving a
bidirectional port.
4) UMC's first single-chip port (The 8211) had a facility to disable the
data lines, but the necessary bit of the control register was not there.
Thus this port could not eaasily be made bi-directional
5) Some LSI I/O chips (you know, the ones with printer,serial, etc) are
bidirectional. Either as described above, or by forcing a wierd set of
states on the handshake lines (I think - I can look it up). 

You cant assume that an arbitrary PC printer port can be used for input. 
-tony 'PDP11 Hacker' Duell
ard@siva.bris.ac.uk

Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:12774 comp.human-factors:1815 comp.misc:3272 comp.programming:2391
From: ajaym@cbnewsc.cb.att.com (alton.jay.mitchell)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.human-factors,comp.misc,comp.programming
Subject: Re: Indentation
Date: 19 Aug 92 21:46:53 GMT
Organization: AT&T

>  - What studies have been made about the effects of different levels of 
>    indentation?

Though a bit dated, I thought a reasonable study was reported in:

	Communications of the ACM
	Nov 1983 / Volume 26 #11 / Page 861
	"Program Indentation and Comprehensibility"
	Miara, RJ, et.al.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: rbe@yrloc.ipsa.reuter.COM (Robert Bernecky)
Subject: Re: hacking too long?
Reply-To: rbe@yrloc.ipsa.reuter.COM (Robert Bernecky)
Organization: Snake Island Research Inc, Toronto
Distribution: alt
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 20:07:38 GMT

In article <1992Aug11.123439.48@its.bt.co.uk> tjo@its.bt.co.uk (Tim Oldham) writes:
>In article <19926.337.11759@execnet> "jeff zeitlin" <jeff.zeitlin@execnet.com> writes:
>>  What I actually find frightening is that people who I _know_ don't
>>  have any involvement with computers, or ham radio, or anything like
>>  that actually _understand_ when I tell them that it's 23:08.
>
>Aren't you taught 24-hour time at school in the USA? 

Probably not. The United States is the only non-metric country
in the world, except for Libya. Strange bedfellows...
Also, current US educational practices discourage teaching people 
things like how to subtract 12...    8^}

Bob

Robert Bernecky      rbe@yrloc.ipsa.reuter.com  bernecky@itrchq.itrc.on.ca 
Snake Island Research Inc  (416) 368-6944   FAX: (416) 360-4694 
18 Fifth Street, Ward's Island
Toronto, Ontario M5J 2B9 
Canada
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:12840 comp.unix.misc:3315
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
From: Tom Christiansen <tchrist@convex.COM>
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 00:51:59 GMT
Reply-To: tchrist@convex.COM (Tom Christiansen)
Organization: Convex Computer Corporation, Colorado Springs, CO
Originator: tchrist@pixel.convex.com
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX ComputerCorp. The 
 opinions expressed are those of the user andnot necessarily those of CONVEX.

From the keyboard of lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner):
:In article <BtAL3J.DuH@mtholyoke.edu> jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:
:
:>others.  Certainly it's easier to write solid code in a HLL than in assembly.
:
:No, it isn't certain, and more importantly it's easier to write code that's
:*insidiously* not solid in some hll.  I find for many environments that it's
:miuch easier to write *any* code in assembler, and the solidity is a nice
:byproduct.  For some people who are their own worst enemy, a hll level language
:is the place to go (or better just don't attempt to be a programmer if it's
:really a problem; in fact I'll go one better: if you can't get a rudimentary
:or better handle on assembler, don't even think of writing in hll; you 
:obviously don't know enough about computers to continue without furthering
:your education.).  

What ridiculous, self-serving, patently false elitism!  There are
innumerable programmers who write only in HLLs, get their jobs done, and
go home.  If we were all forced to use assembler, much less programming
would get done.  That's what compilers are for.

Take this to alt.flame or some such.

--tom
-- 
    Tom Christiansen      tchrist@convex.com      convex!tchrist

"The number of UNIX installations has grown to 10, with more expected."
    - _The UNIX Programmer's Manual_, Second Edition, June, 1972.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: cdl@chiton.ucsd.edu (Carl Lowenstein)
Subject: ancient typographical errors
Organization: Marine Physical Lab, UC San Diego
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 19:57:54 GMT

Last night I was teaching my NeXT how to do anagrams, following the
lead of Jon Bentley's _Programming Pearls_, Column 2.  Then I set it
to work on "/usr/dict/words".  I found a surprising pair:

	synaptic snyaptic

In a few quick probes today I have found the non-word "snyaptic" to
be present in /usr/dict/words for SunOS4.1.1, Ultrix4.1, Ultrix1.2.
And of course NeXTstep2.1, where I first found it.

Any other takers?  How old do you suppose this one is.  With a bit of
time I could resurrect /usr/dict/words from 6th Edition Unix to look.

	carl

--
From: hsu@pix.com (Big Dave Hsu)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Peet Peeves! (was Re: pronouncing "bps"?)
Date: 13 Aug 92 04:30:51 GMT
Organization: Pix Technologies -- The company with no adult supervision

In article <l8h2tkINNstc@utkcs2.cs.utk.edu> eijkhout@cupid.cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) writes:
>In article <1992Aug12.031639.11024@uwm.edu>, anthony@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Anthony J Stieber) writes:
>|> A sub-peeve of mine is the
>|> term "CD-ROM".  I really wish they would have called it CD-Data,
>|> CD-ReadOnlyStorage, ROCD, or something.
>
>Don't you think that the term Compact Disc is already quite ridiculous?
>Naming a medium after its *size*? Laser Disc would be a much better name,
>but unfortunately this is nowadays applied to *video* discs. Oh my.

Tsk tsk...consumer LaserDisc video (1978?) has been around for much, much
longer than Compact Disc audio (1983), trademark and all.  Moreover, there's
a tradition of naming a new medium after its size, especially when its size
represents a fundamental innovation.  Observe the Philips CompactCassette
logo on each of your audio cassettes (yes, it's molded into the shell
somewhere)...ever wonder what a full-sized cassette looked like?

-dave

-- 
Dave Hsu                           <hsu@pix.com> -or- <hsu@eng.umd.edu>
Caffeine and Salsa Czar	          "Yeah?  Well there are a lot of people out
Pix Technologies Corporation       there who are full of shit and making money.
Have nerds, will telnet.           And *I'm* not going to be the exception."
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: sasbmt@jjoyce.unx.sas.com (Bruce Tindall)
Subject: Re: Film Newbies  (was Re: "We don't need no steenking badges...")
Originator: sasbmt@jjoyce.unx.sas.com
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 20:04:44 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.


Odd that with all this discussion of Blazing Saddles, no one has
commented on the name of the gubernatorial character played by 
Mel Brooks, at whose eponymous freeway toll booth Slim Pickens and
his evil army were delayed while searching for exact change.  I'll
let somebody else do the honors; all I can say is, it's a gas!

Germanely yours,

-- 
Bruce Tindall, Core Testing Manager, SAS Institute Inc., Cary NC 27513
From: phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG (Phil Gustafson)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Early Programable calculators.
Date: 15 Aug 92 20:30:18 GMT
Organization: Famed Parquet Floor

In article <16gt5dINNbsb@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> haynes@cats.ucsc.edu (Jim Haynes) writes:
>
>Hey, anybody remember the Mathatron?  It was as big as a desk, used a
>Model 33 Teletype for I/O, but was basically a programmable calculator.
>-- 

This sounds like a late Mathatron.  The early Mathatrons printed their output
on paper tape, like ancient stock tickers or telegram printers.

Mathatron lived in the former Waltham Watch factory building in Waltham,
MA.

phil

-- 
|play: phil@zorch.SF-Bay.ORG; {ames|pyramid|vsi1}!zorch!phil                |
|work: (Under Construction)              | Phil Gustafson                   |
| "Never give up!  Never!  Never!  Never!"                                  |
|                                          H. Ross Perot, 1992              |
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: siegman@EE.Stanford.EDU (Anthony E. Siegman)
Subject: Re: Zuse Computers
Organization: Stanford University
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 04:08:05 GMT

>> Any of you  used or know were Zuse computers can be seen?
>
>If I'm not mistaken, the "Deutsches Museum" in Munich should have one
>machine.  Anyway, this museum is a must for any technology lovers out there.

  Also, maybe, the Museum of Science and Technology (or whatever it's
called) near Victoria and Albert Hall in London.  In any event, used
to have a sizable collection of very early computer stuff.
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:12456 comp.unix.misc:3209
From: grog@adagio.UUCP (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
Subject: Re: Favorite CPU (Was: Re: Unix Roots of DOS?)
Date: 12 Aug 92 17:46:09 GMT
Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers
Organization: LEMIS, Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

In article <JOHN.92Aug11182828@gna.axis-design.fr> john@gna.axis-design.fr (John Hughes) writes:
>My favorite wierd instruction is "BIKE" on the Tandem Nonstop-II.  The
>manual claims it stands for "Bicycle while idle".  It's a one-
>instruction idle-loop.

The BIKE instruction does more than this, in fact. Historically, but
from memory, we had something like:

1977: at the end of the dispatcher there was an idle loop:

	bicycle: go to bicylce;

1979: XRAY (performance monitor) was introduced. The code changed to

	while bicycling do
	  sxsomefunnydefine (paramnameiforget);

1981: The TNS/II (NonStop II) came out. The BIKE instruction was not
introduced just to idle: it went through a whole lot of internal
self-testing stuff, but was interruptible. When the self test failed,
the CPU would freeze with a completly undecipherable code, causing us
support people much pain. The code became something like

	while sxsomeotherfunnydefine (anotherforgottenparm)
          code (BIKE);

1983: The NonStop TXP came out. Initially, this had no imperfections,
so BIKE really was a NOP. However, we found one problem later which
was extremely rare, in the BTST instruction (test ASCII character in A
register and set the condition code depending on whether the character
was alphabetic, numeric or special. This was used to implement the TAL
$ALPHA, $NUMERIC and $SPECIAL intrinsics, but was not used in
Guardian). The problem cropped up when the editor refused commands
beginning with ? (ERROR: THERE IS NO SUCH COMMAND - don't you love
these shouting programs?). In any case, it turned out that the PAL
which did the BTST instruction had failed, so we implemented a
self-test in BIKE, which presumably solved the problem (only this
particular failure never happened again :-).

later still: They now have an idle process. I think they have changed
the terminology, but BIKE is still there.

Are you the John Hughes who used to work for Univac out of Sydney?
Give me a call if you are.
-- 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
*** NOTE ***: Headers are mangled - reply to grog%lemis@Germany.EU.net
From: esr@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Zuse Computers
Date: 21 Aug 92 00:26:38 GMT

In <5764@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at> Markus Stumptner wrote:
> There is a paper by Bauer and Woessner (The Plankalkuel of Konrad
> Zuse) describing the principles of the language in the July 1972
> Communications of the ACM (Vol. 15:7).

A detail I think I remember about this design, BTW, is that it lacked a
conditional primitive.  Loops, but no if-then.
-- 
					Eric S. Raymond <esr@snark.thyrsus.com>
From: ivie@cc.usu.edu (CP/M lives!)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Non Unix-OS's
Date: 18 Aug 92 10:15:32 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <LJT3.92Aug17224607@CS1.CC.Lehigh.EDU>, ljt3@CS1.CC.Lehigh.EDU (Lewis) writes:
> In article <20064@nntp_server.ems.cdc.com> tbruseha@kafka.ems.cdc.com (Tom Brusehaver) writes:
> 
> This is not a flame of Tom, but of the concept in general.
> 
>>...DOS (all versions) can only deal with 640K.
> 
> This is completely, utterly, and totally WRONG.  Unfortunately, it has been
> repeated so many times that it has become an accepted 'fact'.
> 'didja ever stop and think that things like BIOS are above 640K?  That
> the screen is above 640K?

And don't forget the DEC Rainbow that allowed 896K of MS-DOS memory.

Roger Ivie
ivie@cc.usu.edu
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:12553 comp.human-factors:1781 comp.misc:3229 comp.programming:2322
From: tvv@tandem.com (Tom Van Vleck)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.human-factors,comp.misc,comp.programming
Subject: Re: Indentation
Date: 14 Aug 92 17:04:44 GMT
Reply-To: VanVleck_Tom@tandem.com
Organization: Tandem Computers, Inc.

Martin Schroeder writes:
|> When did it start that programs were indented?
|> I want to know:
|>  - Which was the first language that mentioned indentation? Algol60 says 
|>    something, but it isn't very much.
|>  - What studies have been made about the effects of different levels of 
|>    indentation?

I saw FORTRAN programs with leading spaces to indicate indentation in
the early sixites.  I bet this practice preceded ALGOL.  There are two
interlocking ideas here: that the compiler should ignore white space
and that the human user should use it consistently to enhance
readability.

BTI computer systems had an implementation language called DRAGON, in
which the indentation WAS the loop/if scope indicator.  Pat Helland
worked on the language there and told me about it after he left.

-- 
Tom Van Vleck <vanvleck_tom@tandem.com>
From: ralph@falcon.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ralph Becker-Szendy)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Peet Peeves!
Date: 18 Aug 92 19:01:58 GMT
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center

In article <1992Aug18.121033.20557@corax.udac.uu.se> andersa@Riga.DoCS.UU.SE 
(Anders Andersson) writes (edited):
>As if it were only a matter of terminology...  But I *have* seen
>people having trouble compiling their programs, and reaching out
>to power-cycle their VT100.  What's worse, it may actually work
>once in a while, thus improving their confidence in the method.

Know the feeling. When I'm done working on my cp/m machine at home, I
often type LOGOUT. Only to be told that there is no LOGOUT command
(the exact error message is LOGOUT?). Then I remember that the system
behind the terminal is not a mainframe, and open the floppy doors and
hit the red power switch.

The whole confusions stems from the fact that as seen and felt by the
user (the user sees the screen and feels the keyboard), there is no
compelling difference between a standalone system, a workstation, a
networked PC, and a terminal connected to a system. The big difference
is in the process of starting and ending work (you don't log into a
Macintosh usually, you just hit the triangle-button on they keyboard).

-- 
Ralph Becker-Szendy                          RALPH@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center                      RALPH@SLACVM.BITNET
M.S. 95, P.O. Box 4349, Stanford, CA 94309                    (415)926-2701
My opinion. This is not SLAC, Stanford U, or the US DoE speaking. Just me.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.arch
From: jkenton@world.std.com (Jeff Kenton)
Subject: Re: seeking info on Imlac Composer
Organization: Kenton Systems Corporation, Weston MA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 14:54:43 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.034735.12420@ceilidh.beartrack.com> dnichols@ceilidh.beartrack.com (Don Nichols (DoN.)) writes:
>
>	I don't know whether there is any connection other than similarity
>of name, but I have a copy of a program sold by a company called WordMark
>called Composer.  If it is at all likely to be related, I'll look up the
>manufacturer's address.  This one came with a 3B1 (AT&T UNIX-PC), a
>68010-based system from around 1985.  The company also makes (or made)
>similar programs for the PC&Clone market.
>

Not the same thing.  Imlac was a company that built their own
minicomputer + display processor starting around 1970.  They
built a display based editor that supported variable width
characters, did composition and output paper tape to typesetters.
I was there in 1972.

Historical note:  Imlac is not an acronym -- it is the name of a
character in the play "Rasselas" by Samuel Johnson, a part-time
philosopher and prophet of doom (Imlac, not Johnson).


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
=			Jeff Kenton	(617) 894-4508			=
=			    jkenton@world.std.com			=
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: avg@rodan.UU.NET (Vadim Antonov)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Hacker Test
Date: 13 Aug 1992 13:20:00 -0400
Organization: Berkeley Software Design
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net

In article <josef.713690262@uranium> Josef Moellers <mollers.pad@sni.de> writes:
>Jensen's Device is based on ALGOL's "Call By Name": When You specified
>a formal parameter to a procedure/function to be a "NAME" parameter, then
>referring to it would cause a re-evaluation of the actual parameter,
>e.g.

Interesting enough that Jensen's Device DOES NOT require call by name;
a call-by-value is quite enough if a language can encapsulate
an expression into a procedure (or lambda expression for you LISP
sectants :-) Algol-68 and SCHEME can do it with ease. The only
difference is that you need to specify the formal parameters.
A small price for avoiding a major Algol-60 brain-damage (and
it allows to check the expression for validity).

If you don't like the procedure call overhead use macroprocessor, like

#define SUM(n, expr) \
	{ sum = 0; \
	  for( i = 0 ; i < (n) ; i++ ) \
		sum += (expr); \
	}

Usage:

	blah += 3;
	SUM(17, foobar(i) + boo(i, blah));
	printf("sum=%d\n", sum);

--vadim
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: d88-hba@nada.kth.se (Harald Barth)
Subject: Re: Classic opcodes...
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 18:53:52 GMT

>on a Sun 670MP:
>   % nm /vmunix | grep halt_and
>   f8005058 T _halt_and_catch_fire

Anyone knows what it does, who wrote it, ...

Harald.

Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
From: hsu@pix.com (Dagwood Splits the Atom)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Osborne
Date: 21 Aug 92 00:08:09 GMT
Organization: Pix -- The company with no adult supervision.

In article <1992Aug20.012811.21189@u.washington.edu> fetrow@biostat.washington.edu (David Fetrow) writes:
>In article <1992Aug19.222046.3406@ttinews.tti.com> hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:
>>IBM had no part in Osborne's downfall.  They went belly-up through sheer,
>>gross mismanagement and were probably just this side of a class-action suit
>>by the customers when it happened.  Good riddance, IMHO.
>
> There was quite an interesting book about the fall of Osborne written by
>Dvorak and Adam Osborne!

"Hypergrowth".  Came out...when?  '84?  '85?

> It helps to know that, up until recently, Osborne had the record for fastest
>growth of a computer company. They still hold the record for steepest fall.

Depends on what you call recently.  Although Osborne held the record at one
time, as of '87 the record for growth was held by Compaq, and of course in
the past year and a half there have been several new claimants to the throne.
Given the lingering nature of OCC's death, I'm not sure they get the steepest
fall award either...I'd probably give that one to Eagle Computer, which came
to a "crashing" halt (excuse the pub) the night of their IPO.

-dave

-- 
Dave Hsu                           <hsu@pix.com> -or- <hsu@eng.umd.edu>
Caffeine and Salsa Czar	          "Yeah?  Well there are a lot of people out
Pix Technologies Corporation       there who are full of shit and making money.
Have nerds, will telnet.           And *I'm* not going to be the exception."
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,alt.3d