HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: arjay@cnplss5.cnps.philips.nl (R.J. Kimmel)
Subject: Re: To all those looking for lists of recruiters...
Organization: Philips Centre For Technology, Eindhoven
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 09:49:46 GMT

paradis@sousa.ltn.dec.com (Jim Paradis) writes:

>Sheesh... it seems like every other posting in this group is someone
>looking for lists of recruiters in some area or other. 

>Anyhow: as it says in news.announce.newusers, you're better off not
>asking the net if there are other easily-available resources  out
>there.  In the case of recruiters, you can trot down to the public
>library and look in the Yellow Pages for your target area (under
>the heading "Executive Search Consultants").  Alternately, if you're
>in a reasonably large city, there'll probably be a newsstand somewhere
>that carries a lot of out-of-town papers 
>-- 
>Jim Paradis (paradis@tallis.enet.dec.com) 

Excuse me, but not everyone asking for "recruiters" has the option
of looking up the information in the yellow pages.  (Although
yes, I admit, some are simply lazy, or unimaginative.)  I am an
American living in Europe and I would like very much to return to
the US but the libraries here do not keep the US yellow pages in
stock or even in their files.  And out-of-town papers are limited
and are generally "European" version (without classified ads).

At one time I called the newspaper circulation offices to see about
getting a few copies sent to me.  They insisted on charging me
twice the normal rate (accepted) and insisted I take a minimum 6
month subscription (grudgingly accepted), but would not accept my
Eurochecks, would not accept credit cards, and told me not to send
cash.

I am open to suggestions.  But I've run out of ideas, other than
posting to the net asking for recruiters, or headhunters.  Any
assistance you can offer would be appreciated.

R.J. Kimmel
Technical Documentation Manager
in the Netherlands

Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: jka@windshear.larc.nasa.gov (J. Keith Alston)
Subject: Re: Why do Americans get so little vacation time?
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, VA  USA
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 16:43:35 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.151211.18487@weyrich.UUCP>, orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net (Orville R. Weyrich) writes:
|> 
|> Why do you think that only Union workers can negotiate? Everyone has the right
|> to "walk". The interesting thing is that companies that are most hurt by key 
|> people "walking" are also those that are most hurt by key people taking 
|> "family leave" at irregular and unpredictable intervals.
|> 

 Are you equating "walking" with negotiation? Walking out the door isn't
 negotiating anything, its giving up. What do non-union employees have to
 negotiate with?
-- 
************************      Don't just do it!     ***********************
Lockheed Eng. and Sci. Co./Nasa Larc|J. Keith Alston jka@windshear.larc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: seamin@icaen.uiowa.edu (Seyamak Amin)
Subject: Salary Requirement -- Include or DO NOT include
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 04:48:46 GMT
Organization: Iowa Computer Aided Engineering Network, University of Iowa

Forgive me if this is a FAQ!

QUESTION:

Is it o.k. to put the salary requirement (or, at least a range) in your
resume/CV letter? If yes, where is the right place: resume or CV letter?

The reason that I'm asking is that some ads want to specify your salary
requirement or salary history. I like to know even if the employer is not
asking, is it a right thing to mention the range of salary you are looking
for?

Please respond to my e.mail address. 

Thanks in advance,

S. Amin
seamin@icaen.uiowa.edu
From: brada@bardlover.Eng.Sun.COM (Brad Albom)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Advocate for Repeal of 1706
Date: 6 Oct 1992 01:14:21 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: bardlover

>>P.S.  I heard a runor a while back that Ross Perot (pronounced "parrot" ?)
>>was instrumental in buying off Rep. Pat ("My vote's for sale to the
>>highest bidder") Moynihan (also D-N.Y.) who created 1706 in the first place.
>>Can anyone provide any verification on this rumor ?
>
>Buying him off on what? 1706? Or something else? When Perot ran EDS, it was
>my impression (perhaps I'm wrong) that EDS did not hire contractors and
>consultants. If they couldn't own you, they didn't want you. What, then,
>would Perot have gained assuming he bought Moynihan off on 1706?

To be a little more clear, I meant that EDS saw independents as
competition to their business & so in an effort to stifle the
competition, Perot/EDS supported this method of making it more difficult
for their competition to do business.  Hence 1706.

Once again, this was just a rumor I heard.  I was looking to see if anyone
had some solid information.  However, something like this would be 
consistent with what I've heard over the last few months WRT Perot's
method of doing business.

-brad albom
Software Engineering Solutions, Inc (Not related to Sun Micro)
Office: (415) 969-0141    - Probably get a secretary
FAX   : (415) 969-0177    - Probably get a high pitched tone
email : brada@eng.sun.com - Best Bet (In On Random Weekdays)
From: dgeary@sierra.com (David Geary)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: interview question
Date: 29 Sep 92 20:02:34 GMT
Organization: Sierra Geophysics,  Kirkland WA

In article <1992Sep15.235602.3260@bosslogic.com> jai@bosslogic.com writes:
>
>In article <qHmyqB1w164w@csiatl.Gwinnett.COM> olga@csiatl.Gwinnett.COM  
>(olga from the volga) writes:
>> guox@mcclb0.med.nyu.edu (Xuan-Hui Guo) writes:
>> 
>> > When I had interviews, people like to ask me if I have any other  
>offer.
>> > I wonder whether they want to hear I said yes or not. Why do they want  
>to
>> > know
>> > that? how does that contribute to the hiring decision?  Any insight is
>> > appreciated.
>> > 
>> > --
>> > XHGuo
>> I usually tell them that information is confidential.
>> 
>> olga@csiatl.gwinnett
>> YOW!
>
>Someone asked me this too sometimes in an interview. I think it made a  
>better impression if I said that I had an offer (even if I did not have an  
>offer), but be a bit tactful about it and say that you would prefer this  
>job that the interviewer has because it more challenging, fits your  
>objectives, etc, etc .....
>

  Sheesh.  Doesn't anybody consider telling the truth anymore?




-- 
David Geary           	|   Seattle - America's most attractive city ... 
Sierra Geophysics	|	
dgeary@sierra.com	|   to the jetstream ;-(
From: jy1c+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jill A Yocca)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Contract Programming Job (Pittsburgh)
Date: 5 Oct 92 07:42:47 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.weo69rq00iV3A2XGpo
Organization: Sophomore, IM - Graphic Communications, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Many full time and contract programming and support positionss available 
immediately in the Pittsburgh, Pa area using:
 
                      Oracle
                      Novelle (CNE a plus)
                      C++/Windows
                      Vax Powerhouse        
                      RDB

Contact MR.ADAMS @ (412)941-2220 ext.717 or fax (412)942-9140
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: mctague@sju.edu (Brendan McTague)
Subject: Seeking: Headhunters in Central Michigan
Organization: St. Joseph's University - Philadelphia, PA
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 02:56:48 GMT

I will be moving to central Michigan  in less than a year (my wife will be
attending Law School in the area) and I am seeking any and all information
about technical oriented head hunters in the Central Mich area. I have a BS
in comp sci and 3-4 years experience in the field. Please e-mail me any and
all leads.

Thank you in advance,

Brendan


-- 
************  
*  _   /|  *  Independant Thought is the Mother of All That Is Considered Evil.
*  \'o.O'  *     It is also the Father of All that is Considered Great.         
*  =(___)= *                            ---
From: wlee@argo.acs.oakland.edu (Walter Lee)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Geographic-based split for misc.jobs.offered?
Date: 26 Sep 92 18:59:50 GMT
Reply-To: wlee@argo.acs.oakland.edu
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester, MI

In article <1992Sep25.145835.1697@falcon.aamrl.wpafb.af.mil>, bkottmann@falcon.aamrl.wpafb.af.mil (Brett Kottmann) writes:
>	Is there any interest in splitting misc.jobs.offered into geographic
>regions?  Such as:
>
>	.offered.usa.west
>		    .east
>		    .south
>		    .midwest
>		    .other (eg national, covers two or more of the above, etc)
>		.canada
>		.europe
>        ...
>	
>	It seems that a lot of people are looking for jobs in a specific
>region, and this would help narrow it down.  This is not to say that a job post
>couldn't be xposted to two or more groups, especially if it involved travel, or
>was a mutli-location offer, etc.

It also seems that a lot of people are looking for jobs in a specific industry,
profession, seniority level, salary range etc. etc. etc.


>	If you like the idea, suggest geographic divisions that you think would
>be helpful.
>
>	If there is enough interest, I'll do a formal RFD.  Please, debate in
>misc.jobs.misc for now.  Thanx,
>

misc.jobs.ofred is slightly more flexible than help wanted in the classified
ads.  You can make it more flexible in some ways and less flexible in other
ways by making it more or less "classified" (or vice versa).  I think an online
database would be more useful than a newsgroup.  (Just like computer dating way
back when!-)  I'd really like one BIG and very publically accessible database
to cover the entire worldwide (at least nationwide) labor market.  Then maybe
people would at least be able to find out about the existence of openings
without being in some fraternity or country club.  (Point that the world don't
owe me (the opportunity to earn) a living taken in advance).  But an online
relational database"operated" at the grass-roots level (like USENET??) should
be possible...

select * from jobs where state in ('MI', 'IN', 'OH');
select * from jobs where yrs_exp <= 0;
select * from jobs where salary=max(salary);

Problem:  Many if not most employee-seekers would be put off by the formatting
requirements.  (Look how often people try to drive in the point on what info
should be on the Subject: line in misc.jobs.offered)  I think someone (actually
an army of folks) would have to volunteer some data-entry services to have any
data integrity.


                  
>Brett--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>	"Why the courts don't tell a husband who has been living off his wife
>to go out and get a job is beyond my comprehension."--Joan Lunden
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mine too


Walter Lee    wlee@argo.acs.oakland.edu, lee@plex-1.ann-arbor.mi.us

Keep the Aspidistra Flying!
From: cote@cs.ucsd.edu (Brad Cote)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: what's a nice place? Places in the US
Keywords: job, place, high-tech
Date: 2 Oct 92 17:25:20 GMT
Distribution: usa

mike@isgtec.com (Mike Sellers) writes:

>For me, areas like the SF Bay area, Washington DC, and Los Angeles (with 
>the possible exception of nearby San Diego) are simply out of the question.
>The combination of *extremely* high cost of living, poor environment, 
>high crime rate, and similar factors do not (for me) make up for the 
>loss of job opportunities that I risk.  

No, No, No! San Diego is *JUST* as bad as L.A! Crime is high, cost is high,
traffic is high, environment is bad, etc. Don't move here, there are no
jobs and no future. On top of that, the Chargers and Padres are 
perrenial doormats.

> Mike Sellers 

				Brad Cote'
				University of California, San Diego
				STARE Project
				Chairman of KPOSD*

*Keep People Out of San Diego.
From: jbm@hal.com (Brad Might)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Cash Prizes for Ideas on Saving U.S. Jobs
Date: 1 Oct 92 23:56:22 GMT
	<1992Sep30.151501.9522@informix.com> <1afjm1INNkmd@overload.lbl.gov>
Organization: HaL Computer Systems
NNTP-Posting-Host: infinity.hal.com
In-reply-to: prem@prem.lbl.gov's message of 1 Oct 92 19:31:12 GMT

>>>>> On 1 Oct 92 19:31:12 GMT, prem@prem.lbl.gov (Shirdi R. Prem) said:
> NNTP-Posting-Host: prem.lbl.gov

> (Craig Shaver) writes:
>>
>>I agree, if we can get the rest of the world to go along with our standards
>                     ########################################################
>>then we will be able to 'afford' some of the social programs the fluff 
>>heads want to force on business.
>>Craig Shaver  (cshaver@informix.com for now) (415)390-0654 (415)926-6407

> 	__WHY__ should the rest of the world be made to go along with
> 	U.S. standards ?? Does the U.S. always comply with the standards
> 	in other nations ?? Or doesn't it have to, because it has bigger
> 	guns ??

> 	Prem!

In 2 words:

Metric System
--
- standard disclaimers apply -
jbm@hal.com (Brad Might)      
HAL Computer Systems - (512)794-2855
8920 Business Park Drive Suite 300 Austin, Tx 78759
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net (Orville R. Weyrich)
Subject: Re: Cash Prizes for Ideas on Saving U.S. Jobs
Reply-To: uunet.uu.net!weyrich!orville
Organization: Weyrich Computer Consulting
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 92 21:00:59 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.134512.11961@clsi.COM> kevin@clsi.COM (Kevin Cameron) writes:
>
>In article <1afjm1INNkmd@overload.lbl.gov>, prem@prem.lbl.gov (Shirdi R. Prem) writes:
>> In article <1992Sep30.151501.9522@informix.com> cshaver@informix.com (Craig Shaver) writes:
>> >
>> >I agree, if we can get the rest of the world to go along with our standards
>>                     ########################################################
>> 
>> 	__WHY__ should the rest of the world be made to go along with ...
>
>Ideally, we should go along with the highest standards possible ( and the USA is
>not necessarily the best ). 
>
>Refusing to buy goods from countries where the workers are exploited may
>encourage their governments to do something about it.

Determining whether a worker is exploited or not requires a value system. 
Different countries have different cultures and value systems. How arogant
to enforce our own value system abroad.

>Free trade in a global economy makes sense, but the playing field should be
>level.

I see little evidence that the U.S. has the power to enforce a level playing 
field. I'm not even sure that if we had the power, that we should enforce
our vision of a level playing field. I am sure that different countries have
different cultural value systems, and that through the eyes of these other
value systems, what looks level to us might not look level to them, and vice-
versa.

orville

--------------------------------------   **************************************
Orville R. Weyrich, Jr.                        Weyrich Computer Consulting
Certified Data Processor                     POB 5782, Scottsdale, AZ 85261
Certified Systems Professional                   Voice: (602) 391-0821
Certified Computer Programmer            Internet: orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net
--------------------------------------   **************************************
From: sandee@Think.COM (Daan Sandee)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Working Temporarily in Canada
Date: 28 Sep 1992 11:53:13 GMT
Organization: TMC
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: telecaster.think.com

In article <1992Sep27.214924.24979@news.columbia.edu>, gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
|> 
|> From what you have described, you are submitting yourself for the
|> equivalent of the American H-1 process which requires a Labor
|> Certification and numerous other hoops to jump through.

For the record, an H-1 does not require labor certification. It requires
*one* application to the INS and no particular hoops to jump through. 
The time to acquire it is from one month to infinity depending on how often
the prospective employer and the INS screw up (in my case, it took nine
months).

Daan Sandee                                           sandee@think.com
Thinking Machines Corporation
Cambridge, Mass 02142                                 (617) 234-5044
From: esprit@netcom.com (Alan F. Perry)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Where all that vacation time went!
Date: 1 Oct 92 23:05:16 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1850@sousa.ltn.dec.com> paradis@sousa.enet.dec.com (Jim Paradis) writes:
>
>>	I happened to spy a graphic in tonight's paper.  It's
>>entitled "School Vacations (Average length of summer vacations
>>for primary and secondary schools):"
>>
>>	U.S.	12 weeks, France 11, Italy 8, Germany 7, Japan 6
>>
>>	So that's it!  We give up vacation time as adults because
>>we get so much as kids :-)
>
>Yes... well, there's a big push in a lot of areas to go to some
>form of year-round schooling.  However, I don't see that as the
>precursor to increasing the amount of adult vacation time.  Rather,
>I see it as a way of getting kids accustomed to keeping the ol' nose
>to the grindstone 12 months a year.... 8-(

When I was in year-round school in the late-70s, I still got 12 weeks
off; it was just spread through the year.  You went to school for
9 weeks, then got 3 weeks off, plus the typical Christmas time off.

alan

-- 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------------
Alan F. Perry                      | "e-mail is wrecking my life"
esprit@netcom.com                  |              - someone standing in SF
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: gregory j farrar <gfarrar@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Info about employers
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 17:20:45 GMT

I have had preliminary interviews with several corporations and would
like to get peoples opinions about the companies. Please respond 
to me personally as well as posting any information.

The companies are:

Northern Telecom ( Richardson, TX. location )
Proctor & Gamble
Eli Lilly
NCR


Thanks,

gfarrar@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: coimay@sn01.sncc.lsu.edu ( LAURA CARRIERE)
Subject: Re: Family Leave Act
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4   
Reply-To: coimay@sn01.sncc.lsu.edu
Organization: The unofficial LSU news node
Distribution:  world
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 23:10:43 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-7510]: sn01.sncc.lsu.edu

In article <jyc.718300647@Leland>, jyc@leo.Stanford.EDU (Jon Corelis) writes...
> 
>   There must be women on the net reading this who live and work in
>countries which have such legally mandated leave.  Perhaps some of them
>could post and tell us whether they feel such leave has resulted in
>discrimination against them in the job market, and whether consequently
>they feel they would be economically better off if such laws were
>repealed in their country.  

Ack, now you've done it.  You've dragged my into this discussion and I
was doing so well at keeping my mouth shut.

First of all, I'm Canadian, from Toronto and have been living in the
U.S. for two years.  I got the second job that I interviewed with
right after university at age 22.  I was single.  (Not that employers
are allowed to ask that.)  At the age of 26 I was offered another
job which I interviewed for just out of interest.  At this point I
was engaged and they knew that.  I gave notice at my first job and
my employer made a counter offer.  And he certainly knew I was about
to get married.  I never felt any hesitancy by either employer to
hire me because I might get pregnant and take my 20 weeks.  (I believe
it's now up to 6 months in Ontario, but I'm unclear on who pays and
how much.)

Now I'm 30 and we're moving to California in January.  So that means
I'll be interviewing again.  This time I'm feeling some pressure.
U.S. employers look at me and think, "She's running out of time,
she'll probably get pregnant and since there's no parental leave
there's a good chance she'll quit."  In Canada the employer may
lose the employee for 4 to 6 months, but they'll be back.  Here
employers waste time and money training women who feel obligated to
quit their jobs so that they can spend at least the first six months
with their new baby.

And from my point of view, in Canada I would never have to ask a 
company what their maternity leave policy was (or if it exists at all)
whereas in the U.S. I might want to know when comparing two offers,
but I'd be a fool to inquire now, wouldn't I?

Another poster asked what we gave up to get maternity leave.  We gave
up giving 2-6 week old babies to child care centers.  We gave up the
increased health costs that go along with sicker babies.  We gave up
exhausted working mothers who weren't able to function at full
efficiency for much longer than 6 months.  We gave up believing that
women only work to supplement their husband's salary and not to support
their families.  And yes, we gave up some tax money.  I think most 
Canadians believe it was well spent.  I know I do.

Laura Carriere
From: paradis@sousa.ltn.dec.com (Jim Paradis)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: To all those looking for lists of recruiters...
Date: 28 Sep 92 16:58:32 GMT
Reply-To: paradis@sousa.ltn.dec.com (Jim Paradis)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


arjay@cnplss5.cnps.philips.nl (R.J. Kimmel) writes:
>Excuse me, but not everyone asking for "recruiters" has the option
>of looking up the information in the yellow pages.  
>[or newspapers]

Sorry, Arjay... my flame wasn't directed at you... i was kvetching
about folks at U.S. sites who *have* plenty of resources available
to them, but who use the net out of laziness or cluelessness...

--
Jim Paradis (paradis@tallis.enet.dec.com) 
Working for DEC, speaking for myself.

Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: rmkrmk@wam.umd.edu (" RUCHINATOR ")
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc,misc.jobs.offered,misc.jobs.resume
Subject: PART TIME JOB
Date: 30 Sep 92 18:44:13 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park

Hi, i'm looking for a Computer Science part time job.  Currently
I am attending the University of Maryland working towards my CS degree.
I would like to work within the Software Developement/Design field. 
I have programming experience.  If you know of anyone hiring a programmar
for a part time position, please let me know.  Or you can ask them to 
get in contact with me so i can give them more details on work/education
experience.  

Thank you, 

Ruchi Kansal
(301-314-3304)

(I would prefer a job within the DC area, but I am also looking to coop
at a company other than IBM for my next coop term. )

(rmkrmk@wam.umd.edu)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net (Orville R. Weyrich)
Subject: Re: Where all that vacation time went!
Reply-To: uunet.uu.net!weyrich!orville
Organization: Weyrich Computer Consulting
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 15:43:21 GMT

In article <1850@sousa.ltn.dec.com> paradis@sousa.enet.dec.com (Jim Paradis) writes:
>
>>	I happened to spy a graphic in tonight's paper.  It's
>>entitled "School Vacations (Average length of summer vacations
>>for primary and secondary schools):"
>>
>>	U.S.	12 weeks, France 11, Italy 8, Germany 7, Japan 6
>>
>>	So that's it!  We give up vacation time as adults because
>>we get so much as kids :-)
>
>Yes... well, there's a big push in a lot of areas to go to some
>form of year-round schooling.  However, I don't see that as the
>precursor to increasing the amount of adult vacation time.  Rather,
>I see it as a way of getting kids accustomed to keeping the ol' nose
>to the grindstone 12 months a year.... 8-(

operating schools year-round  !=  attending school year-round.

It makes a lot of sense to use the buildings all  year-round, and it also
gives much more flexibility in helping kids that just can't learn it all
in the first time around. They can then be held back a semmester (not a
year), and not suffer the indignity of being sent to "summer school".
It should also reduce the number  of "social promotions".


orville

--------------------------------------   **************************************
Orville R. Weyrich, Jr.                        Weyrich Computer Consulting
Certified Data Processor                     POB 5782, Scottsdale, AZ 85261
Certified Systems Professional                   Voice: (602) 391-0821
Certified Computer Programmer            Internet: orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net
--------------------------------------   **************************************