From: hudson@athena.cs.uga.edu (Paul Hudson Jr)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Homosexuality and Christianity
Date: 15 Apr 92 20:02:29 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens

In article <adams.703342780@spssig> adams@spss.com (Steve Adams) writes:
>hudson@athena.cs.uga.edu (Paul Hudson Jr) writes:

>Comparing animate, souled people with souless animals or inanimate objects.
>There is no comparison.

Peter compares the false teachers to souless animals, but that is beside
the point.  The point is that marriage as ordained by God in the Scriptures
is between a man and a woman.  This does not apply to homosexual marriages
because,
1.  Marriage as ordained by God is between a man and a woman.
2.  Sex acts between a man and a woman are condemned in the Scriptures.

It is from the law that we learn what marriage as God intended it is (Genesis)
and in the law homosex is condemned.  It is also condemened in the New 
Testament.  (e.g. Romans 1:25-28)
Also notice that becoming one flesh is related to the sex act between a
man and a woman.

>That's true.  But again, the Bible is silent on marriage between same-sex
>couples.  It neither approves nor disapproves of such unions.

It does have something to say about "consumating" such "marriages" because
this act is sinful according to the Scriptures.

Plus, Jesus, teaching on Genesis teaches us what marriage is,

(I quote from the KJV because I carry a Gideon NT, and that is the only
version I have with me.)

Matthew 19:4-6,

And He answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that He wich made them
at the begenning made them male and female,
And said, For this cause shall a MAN leave his father and mother and shall
cleave unto his WIFE, and they twain shall be one flesh?
Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh.  What therefore God hath
joined together, let not man put asunder.

>Firstly, these items are condemned in Leviticus.  I reiterate that
>Leviticus does not apply to Gentiles.  It applies to Jews only.  Gentiles
>are required to follow the Noahide Covenant.

Notice that one of the seven principles of the Noachide covenant is to 
abstain from sexual immorality, pornea.

Christian Gentiles should submit, not only to the Noachide commands, but
also to the teachings of the apostles.  For example, we are not to 
get drunk, we are to be humble.  Loving ones neighbor as oneself is not
one of the Noachide laws.
Homosex as a particular aspect of sexual immorality is addressed in
the writings of Paul, the apostle.

Look at the list of sins in Romans 1, where Paul discusses homosexuality.
See if they are not mentioned in the Law (the Tanak.)  Many of them,
if not all, can be found in the law of Moses.  By the law comes the 
knowledge of sin.  though we Gentiles do not have to keep all the 
commands of the law, (ex. pork, polyester,) with spiritual descernment
it is possible to see in the law what things are sin.  Paul had this
spiritual descernment, and/or revelation, and so we see in his writings,
and in the wriitings of other apostles how we are to live.  
Look through the Old Testament and see the sins that deserved the death 
penalty.  Are any of them not sins in for modern day Christians?
The only thing I can think of that could be seen as not a sin is
entering the temple uncircumcised.  But we see in the New Testament that
believers are circumcised, but it is in the heart, regardless of whether
the flesh is circumcised.
Also, the temple has been destroyed.

>>Do you believe that beastiality is sinful.
>Yes.  Copulation between a souled, reasoning person and an unsouled,
>unreasoning person is most certainly sinful.  It cannot in any way, shape
>or form be an expression of mutual love and respect.

A interesting fact to note is that both homosex between men and 
sex with animals was worthy of death under the law of Moses.  I think
they are almost always, if not always, listed in the same passages in
the law.  But as we see in I Corinthians 6 that God forgives those
who repent of sins that were capitol crimes in the law, through the
Lord Jesus.  

Link Hudson.