From: muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu (Muffy Barkocy)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: length of relationships (was Re: Some fears and doubts ...)
Date: 12 Oct 92 15:14:41
Organization: Natural Language Incorporated
	<1992Sep26.183743.29287@leland.Stanford.EDU>
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: mlloyd@westmark.Stanford.EDU's message of Sat, 26 Sep 92 18:37:43 GMT

In article <1992Sep26.183743.29287@leland.Stanford.EDU> mlloyd@westmark.Stanford.EDU (Mike Lloyd) writes:
>idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid) writes:
>: In article <1992Sep23.035528.22908@leland.Stanford.EDU> mlloyd@westmark.Stanford.EDU (Mike Lloyd) writes:
>: >: (there's nothing intrinsically blessed about duration,
>: >: after all)
>: >It's that parenthetical point I wanted to pick out.  Maybe
>: >it's obvious to y'all, but it struck me as one of those "Of Course!",
>: >lightbulb-above-head remarks.  Assuming I read it cleanly (in
>: >at least one context, durability can be quite appealing ...)
>: >it seems to point up another of those heinous traditional
>: >value thingys.

Basically, if you're searching for a "life partner," that implies great
duration (livelong, in fact).  The shorter the duration of the
relationship, the more you have "failed" in finding a "life partner."  I
don't condemn the search for a life partner, but I do think people
(including myself at times) go rather too far on the "I'm a failure
because my relationships keep 'failing'" track.

>I've been considering why the observation that durability is
>not everything struck such a chord in me.  [...]

>Combining such experience with my journeyman lifestyle, and
>with my improving self-image since coming out, I guess I've
>arrived at some dreamlike notion of strong, independant
>partners who can take pleasure in the transitory, and live
>a day at a time, the way I try to.

>I think that's a fine goal, but I analyze it carefully to
>try to find inconsitencies between it and the real world.
>I'm concerned that it's too naive, and fails to take into
>account the real feelings of those I deal with.

There *do* exist people (myself, for example, and other people I have
met/been involved with) who enjoy relationships even when the people
involved are pretty clear that the relationship will not be life-long.
So, your goal is not completely inconsistent with the "real world."

The major problem is that there are a lot of people who will agree to a
relationship like this because they *want* a relationship with you, and
they figure that you will eventually "change."  They then can get very
angry with you when you *don't* change.  However, I see this not as you
neglecting *their* feelings, as long as you were clear about your goals
from the start, but them neglecting *your* feelings by going against
their agreement with you and then trying to blame you for them not
getting what they now admit that they want.  Often, they were even being
honest when they started the relationship; then they see how things are
working so well and they start to want more.

Really, there is nothing "intrinsically blessed" about *any* length of
relationship, whether you are interested in life-long ones or short, fun
ones.  You may have reasons to choose one or the other, but it's hard to
know what a relationship will be like until you go through it.  Staying
in a relationship just so that it will be long-term and therefore not
have "failed" or leaving a relationship because it's going too well and
might actually become "serious" seem equally silly to me, though.  Why
insist on one or the other?  If you have constraints, let people know
about them and proceed with whatever is comfortable for everyone.

One of my "short term" relationships lasted for three years (longer than
any other) and, strictly speaking, still hasn't ended (but since he
moved several hundred miles away a few years ago it hasn't exactly
continued, either...*smile*), but it would never have been a lifelong
relationship (could have continued indefinitely, though).  I met my
husband, who I *did* want to spend my life with, at about the same time,
and that didn't last nearly as long...*wry smile*.  Feelings and
interactions are hard to predict or control.

Muffy
--

Muffy Barkocy                               muffy@mica.berkeley.edu
~smiling girl directing traffic flow
.45 strapped over cotton print dress
marimba-brown and graceful limbs
give me a moment of loneliness~ - Bruce Cockburn