HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sma@waikato.ac.nz (Stephen Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Proof: God wrote the Bible
Date: 6 Oct 92 17:14:41 +1300
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

In article <1992Oct5.193913.1366@unislc.uucp>, erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp) writes:

> Second, where is it that the resurrection of Christ is claimed as a
> "cornerstone" of Christian faith?  Theology or doctrine, perhaps; no more than
> that.  The apostles creed was written many years after the fact (at the
> Council of Nicea, I believe).
Try the writings of St. Paul, where he states that if Christ was not raised
from the dead then all that we are doing is for nought.

> 
> Lastly, I question the assertion that "man needs a savior".  This was inserted
> into Christian theology almost immediately after the cruxifiction; Jesus never
> claimed that he was a "savior" in the sense that you are referring to.  True,
> he *did* say "I am" to "Are you the Messiah?" but that was almost certainly
> (to put it delicately) a "political device" to ensure his cruxifiction, since
> he was never "The Messiah" in the terms the Jews considered.  To the Jews, the
> "Messiah" was to be "the lion of Judah", a poltical, religious, and military
> leader who would throw off the yoke of Roman rule (and oppression) - preferably
> by force.  Let's rephrase the question and the answer to be more accurate:
> "Are you the Messiah, the One who has been fortold to come and liberate us
> from the yoke of Roman rule (by force if necessary)?"  "Well, I am the One
> fortold, but I am not here to do what you think I am here to do.  I am here
> to free you from your mindset, from your legalistic, rigid thinking.  I am here
> to free you, yes, but in your hearts and souls, for that is where true freedom
> lies."
Jesus said "I am the way, the truth and the life.  No-one comes to the father
but by me.
Also, what evidence have you that this messiah that the Jews thought was coming 
was the one fortold?  Or did the Jews just think a saviour would save them from
what they wanted to be saved from (the Romans).

Stephen..
From: "gary walsh" <gary.walsh@canrem.com>
Subject: dolphins
Reply-To: "gary walsh" <gary.walsh@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: talk
Date: 5 Oct 92 11:12:52 EST

In article <67067@cup.portal.com> John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:

J->Subject: Dolphin Spills The Beans.
J->  As most of you know scientist have been working for a long time to try to
J->communicate with dolphins. Just lately a person using a computer was
J->successful in figuring out most of the dolphin's chips and other sounds.
J->  Here are some of the questions and answers put to a 4 year old dolphin they
J->call Adonis;

What scientists where?  Can you provide references?  You give us this
alleged conversation with a dolphin but provide no information on where
this occurred or who "Dr. Jones" is.  This reminds me of that SCTV skit
where a news item begins "Scientists say..." and they cut to John Candy
in a lab coat.

                         gary.walsh@canrem.com | Fido node 1:229/15
                         GEnie:G.WALSH7        | East York, Ontario.

 * DeLuxe2/386 1.25 #5606 + I am parked diagonally in a parallel universe.
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
From: milsom@ntb.ch (Paul Milsom)
Subject: Re: Heaven (was Re: July 4, 1992 - Global Spiritual Independence Day)
Keywords: Heaven
Reply-To: milsom@ntb.ch (Paul Milsom)
Organization: Neu-Technikum Buchs 
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 18:27:44 GMT



Rajagopalan writes:

		>you don't get to stay in Heaven permanently...
		>"Heaven" is the presence of God..

which provokes Tom into saying:

		>Man, I'll have to bite on this one.

		>A cute story to be sure, but how do you know this?  

Well, when it comes to this kind of question, I can't resist biting either, 
as I've got a copy of the book with all the answers to this kind of question. 
YES. It's called "A Course In Miracles". With "Heaven", we have to define our 
terms. There does seem to be a state ("level") like John mentioned, where 
you're in a wonderful "country", and everybody is happy and loving. I heard 
this from a Swiss lady who was in a coma for several weeks, and she 
experienced exactly this (I quote John):

		>...a wonderful place, a lot like Earth, but with perfect weather.  
		>There are hills and mountains, meadows and gardens, lakes and 		
		>oceans, and you can live wherever you want. Everyone loves one 	
		>another and there is harmony everywhere. happiness is eternal.. 	
		>It is the happiest moment of your life expanded for ever and ever.  
			
I do not believe, however, that this is Heaven. Of course, it sounds to be a 
very nice place, but the Swiss lady said that people could go to lectures if 
they wanted, or join learning groups. This leads me to believe that the state 
described was just a higher plane.

The little girl's message:

	>God loves us all and we will all be in Heaven with Him sooner or later 

is what Jesus and other people have been trying to tell us for centuries.

Reincarnation (acknowledged nowadays by very many people) explains why not 
everyone gets to stay in this "wonderful country", although it seems that not 
everyone has to come back as far down as Earth. You do, of course, normally 
need a lot of lives on an earthly plane before you can stay at a higher 
level. (This means that *all* of us here still haven't learnt!) 

When we finally do get back to Heaven (all of us), then nobody will have to 
leave home any more. Actually, we haven't left, we just *think* we have!

Of course, nobody can *prove* anything like this, but you just have a look at 
the above-mentioned tome, and ask yourself if anybody on Earth would be 
capable of writing something as beautiful as this. (It was channelled.) It 
was only after they had published it in prose form that they realised that a 
lot of it is in blank verse.

				Happy reading

Although I quote Raja, I mean it:

 	>May the God of peace visit you all and abide in your hearts forever.

												Paul.

Paul Milsom
milsom@ntb.ch
Neu-Technikum Buchs Switzerland
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors
From: harrism@aquila.rtp.dg.com (Mike Harris)
Subject: Re: UFOs and Newage
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 92 18:50:20 GMT
Reply-To: harrism@dg-rtp.dg.com
Organization: Data General Corp., Research Triangle Park, NC

In article <66370@cup.portal.com>, John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
|> Subject: Portal. Part 3.

|>   Our scientist have found that many planets have a hole on both ends with a 
|> centeral sun and when these planets rotate just right the centeral sun 
|> shines out and make  the planet light up. Some people say that they can see 
|> this opening from the pictures printed in Look or Life magazines showing the 
|> earth from our moon rockets.
|>   I once read a story in some informtion that was from the Boderline Research 
							      ^^^^^^^^^
							      Typo.....

|> Association that I don't know and the people who printed it didn't know 
|> whether it was true or not but never let it be said that I ever failed to 
|> tell a story just because it was not true. Let's just say that this story 
|> has a grain of truth to it and is food for thought.
|>   End  Part 3.
|> John Winston.
Xref: sparky talk.religion.newage:4519 alt.alien.visitors:7136
From: John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,alt.religion.kibology
Subject: Re: Re^2: UFOs and Newage
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 92 08:00:46 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Sep23.164901.27569@cbnewsc.cb.att.com>
  <1992Sep25.175939.15686@tellab5.tellabs.com> <Bv6411.KIv@world.std.com>

Dear Kiboites: How in the world did I manage to to get on this new
group called Alt. religion. Kibology. It's a pleasure to be on anything
with Kibo. I once borrowed a book from Don Showen after he had been 
in a study of L. Ron Hubbard and had seperated himself from Scientology.
The book was called something like the following name The First 3 
Trillion Years Are The Hardest. It talked about why we cried salty tears
and the evolution of crabs or something like that. I believe L. Ron was 
really on to something.
John Winston.
From: elascurn@daimi.aau.dk (Lars R{der Clausen)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: sexuality in today's world
Date: 6 Oct 92 10:08:54 GMT
Organization: DAIMI: Computer Science Department, Aarhus University, Denmark

All my answers are very much IMHO and out of a limited experience.

tt@wag.caltech.edu (Toshi Takeuchi) writes:

>This post has been very difficult for me to write due to the sensitivity 
>of the subject.  I am trying to approach the topic of sexuality, NOT
>on the basis of what is right or wrong, but on the basis of experience,
>example and the effects of sexuality in our lives.
>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Why is sexuality such a hot topic?

Because it's one of the basic drives in life.

[...]
>Okay, so what do you do?

>When you feel sexual energies, instead of acting upon them immediately,
>you might want to think about balancing them.

>Instead of acting like an animal and get led around with your hormones,
>you might want to balance your energies and act with awareness of
>your actions.

>--When you feel sexual intensity, then balance yourself as you would in
>  meditation.  The sexual energy can begin to move through your being
>  and balance your being.

>Since I work with chakras, whenever I feel energy in my gonads, I try
>to move it to the back and push it up the back, through the throat.
>You may feel tingling rush up from the gonads to the throat.

I work with the chakras too, but I don't try to move upwards (yet). When I
feel sexual energies, I just lean back and enjoy them right where they are.
Doing this helped me turn an impossible love into a caring friendship, and
was a wonderful experience to boot.

>--The key point with me, is that whenever I feel that energy, I 
>  try to let it flow through my being, rather than saying,
>  "AAh this feels good, but I don't want it to be there, go away."

>Don't whip and torture yourself.  Balance it out.

But, for Gods sake, keep your grounding. It's (relatively) easy to have great
spiritual experiences, but bringing them down to earth and into everyday life
is plain hard work. But it'll be better in the long run.

>Toshi
>tt@wag.caltech.edu

>P.S.  This has been a long post.  Please read it, reply to it, and make
>      comments about it.  I need help on this subject as much as any
>      of you might!!

So do I. I guess most of us do.

Yours lovingly, Lars Clausen
-- 
Think of your family tonight.  Try to crawl home after the computer
crashes.
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: redd@mpx2.lampf.lanl.gov (Dale Redd -- MP-6 Operations)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: July 4, 1992 - Global Spiritual Independence Day
Date: 28 Sep 92 15:18:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: mpx2.28SEP199209180953
Distribution: usa
Organization: LAMPF Data Analysis Center, Los Alamos, New Mexico
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <66693@cup.portal.com>, John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes...
>Subject: The History of the Earth (4.5 Billion Years).

  (stuff about space-being Balaron deleted)

>  After the Earth was formed the first space people that came to it, observed 
>the Earth and they brought along some good type bacteria, benign bacteria 
>and minute plant life. In other words, small plants like mosses and lichens. 
> This produced a sort of a loam soil out of the rocks and water that was on 
>Earth. 
>  For a long time the S. P. didn't come back but they sent their first colony 
>here finally and they set a set up a colony here. They brought other types 
>of animal life with them at that time, and these people were in 
>communication with their fellow people on other planets but their friends 
>who were on other planets got in inner glactic wars and they didn't come in 
>contact with people on Earth for quite a long time and the Earth people 
>became cave dwellers and eventually ceased to exist.
>  Now the second colony that came here were more technically advanced than the 
>first colony. They seemed for a time to do well. They disappeared in a huge 
>seismic convulsion, which changed the face of the Earth.
>End Part 1.
>John Winston.

The veterans of the psychic (aka Inner Galactic [sic]) wars were actually
all the senior officers of the Enterprise who unknowingly sniffed spores
from indiginous earth flowers.  These spores made them want to stay forever
on earth and live in harmony in a utopian society.  Unfortunatly, this plan
was foiled by the Captain who became angry, and discovered that anger broke
the spell of the spores.  The space people beamed back to their ship and
flew away.

(with apologys to Gene Roddenberry)

Gee, I can do this stuff too!

Dale
From: rjp1@cbnewsc.cb.att.com (be here now)
Subject: what do you mean?
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 20:45:04 GMT
Keywords: a clue

I.n F.act Y.ou're O.range
U.mbilical C.reates A.nd N.egates R.eal E.nglish
A.nd D.estroys T.houghts H.appily
I.mplying S.elflessness...


--
Bob Pietkivitch     | "Moon, my long lost friend, is smiling from above."
rjp1@ihspa.att.com  |  -- Genesis, Stagnation 1970

Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Subject: Re: Nicea and dogma etc.
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 18:05:12 GMT

In article <0qB4RB2w164w@uuisis.isis.org> doug@uuisis.isis.org (Doug Thompson) writes:
>The Nicean Ecumenical Council of A.D. 319, was called by the Emperor
>Constantine to settle the status of Jesus and invent the Trinity. Well,
>not quite invent, but turn it from controversy into dogma.
>
>But as for re-writing the Bible, it's text was fixed a couple of
>generations earlier. I don't recall anything from Nicea that disputes
>the canon of the Bible.

It's generally held that the New Testament Canon was fixed (not counting
later Protestant/Catholic disputes) by the Epistle of St. Athanasius
in 367. Of course, it had been _de facto_ fixed for some time already,
but there was still dispute about certain letters and books.

>
-- 
  
        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
  
 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

       "Beware when the great God lets loose a thinker on this planet.
        Then all things are at risk. It is as when a conflagration has
        broken out in a great city, and no man knows what is safe, or
        where it will end."
                               - Emerson: Essay, "Circles"
From: farris@ruhets.rutgers.edu (Lorenzo Farris)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Heaven (was Re: July 4, 1992 - Global Spiritual Independence Day)
Date: 30 Sep 92 16:21:57 GMT
Followup-To: talk.religion.newage
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <1992Sep30.132125.8199@pslu1.psl.wisc.edu>, gorski@pslu1.psl.wisc.edu (Tom Gorski) writes:
> In article <92273.142247RAJA@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> <RAJA@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> writes:
> >Ah! the "truth" is , that you don't get to stay in Heaven permanently. You
> >have to come back to this or another planet to get  a chance to fulfil your
> >desires. You can stay permanently when you don't have any material desires
> >left. But for a religious person "Heaven" is the presence of God and that
> >has nothing to do with nice weather etc.etc.
> Man, I'll have to bite on this one.
> A cute story to be sure, but how do you know this?  
> >rajagopalan
> --Tom G.
The truth is, you don't even have to die to get there.  It's simply a 
different state of awareness.  You can see evidence of it by observing
a being who is in that state of awareness.  You can "know" it by
engaging in the practices which eventually put you in that state of
awareness. Heaven is right here, all around you, and within you, if
you just learn how to see it.
-- 

"Ask me a riddle, and I [should] reply,       Lorenzo Farris
`Cottleston, Cottleston, Cottleston Pie'"     farris@ruhets.rutgers.edu
                -Winnie the Pooh          
[bracketed addition mine]                 
From: reykja@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Reykja Sigurdsson)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 06:19:41 GMT
Subject: genetic memory
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage

I have seen some discussion on this newsgroup about the nature of genetic
memory. I recall reading the entire concept in a book called "Dune" by 
Frank Herbert. (In fact, one of the main characters, Alia, is said to 
'carry all the knowledge of her ancestors'. 

I would be very interested in finding publications about this concept,
pro and con. On one level, it makes a lot of sense to me. On yet another
level, I think I need to study it more.    

There are also references to genetic memory in Norse mythology. 

Any comments, recommendations, flames, etc. to rks@cscns.com

thanks...

rks



Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: doug@uuisis.isis.org (Doug Thompson)
Subject: Practicalities
Organization: International Shared Information Service (Ottawa)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 92 01:52:25 GMT

Do any of you enlightened denizens of the new age have any practical
advice for stopping smoking? I figure it's about time.

=Doug

----------------------------------------------------------------------
UUCP: uunet.ca!uuisis.isis.org!doug                Voice: 613-722-4724
DNS:  doug@uuisis.isis.org, doug@uuisis.UUCP, doug@isishq.fidonet.org
                      SKAN Communications Inc
      POST: P.0. Box 3041, Stn C., Ottawa, K1Y 4J3, CANADA 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: karenm@yenta.alb.nm.us (Karen Millar)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: to Thyagi...
Summary: just a note...
Keywords: sexuality and religion
Date: 3 Oct 92 16:23:10 GMT
Organization: yenta unix pc, rio rancho, nm


Dear Thyagi,
 
I will reply to your posting this evening when I have more time, 
but for now let me say that you and I are really not very different
in our views, but that evidently you took some of my verbage 
in a different way than I meant it.. :-) I will be very succinct 
in my specific reply; you will have fewer doubts about my view.
 
Warm embraces.... Karen.
 
-- 
    Love is the answer...
	Communication Facilities Designer
	Freelance in the Land of Enchantment              Albuquerque, NM
	karenm@yenta.alb.nm.us                             (505) 266-8659
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: waddell@firnvx.firn.edu (Kathy Waddell)
Subject: Re: Becoming aware
Followup-To: talk.religion.newage
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4   
Keywords: anger,meditation,balancing,healing
Reply-To: waddell@firnvx.firn.edu
Organization: Florida State University Computing Center
Date:  6 OCT 92 12:41:01    

In article <1asaogINN4ad@ef2007.efhd.ford.com>, smd@sl0091.srl.ford.com 
   (Steve Dahmen) writes...
> ...
>In article <19mgooINN34j@gap.caltech.edu>, tt@wag.caltech.edu 
   (Toshi Takeuchi) writes:
>... 
>:
>:--What is it that is within us that we may do some bad things in
>:  the heat of anger?
>:
>:We become caught up with our emotions and lose all awareness of our
>:actions.
>:
>:We act from animal instinct and knee-jerk reflex rather than with awareness.
>:
>... 
>Emotions require expression, and should be expressed.  The problem is that
>generally, our emotional experiences have gone so unprocessed that the only
>way we know some times is to fight back so that our Rage is felt and heard.
>Better than shaming ourselves for having an "animalistic" reaction, would be
>to acknowledge the feeling, watch it, meditate with it, see what It has to say,
>and if moved, vent the feeling in our own space.
>...

When I have become aware of my feelings while in the grip of a strong 
"negative" emotion (ie. I'm upset) and I ask myself why am I angry or why 
am I sad, etc, the answer is usally the same: I'm not getting my way.

It can be anything from being impatient with a single event or an entire
lifetime of frustration with ourselves.  We are making ourselves unhappy
because we are not getting something we want.  We are making our happiness 
dependent on this external thing or event.  When we can accept this event,
or accept ourselves as we are, or accept not getting what we want then we
free ourselves from our unhappiness.  It's not that we shouldn't want or
desire certain things or circumstances, it's just that we should not be
so attached to them that we make ourselves upset when we don't get them.

>...  If you consistently deny your emotions, ESPECIALLY the strong
>ones, in my vision you are stunting your overall spiritual growth. You may
>gain some outer appearance of peace, but the issues behind your emotion
>do NOT go away.  They just remain.  You can deal with them now, or in
>another incarnation. Some say it doesn't matter; that peace NOW is what
>counts.  I, and others, say that we must begin to heal the emotions.
>It's the lack of attention given to the Emotions that have created a good
>deal of the situation on Earth now.

There is a difference from being in bondage to your emotions and denying it
and freeing yourself from that bondage.

I see nothing wrong with going with your emotions and experiencing them 
while remaining aware of what is happenning and staying detached, if
possible.  The problem is that some emotions are destructive.  Anger can
be destructive to others but especially to yourself.  There is no need to 
deny your emotions, but to control them ( even if only minumally ) not 
them control you. 

Have fun!

   =-Kathy->                                    waddell@firnvx.firn.edu