HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Date: Wed,  4 Nov 1992 21:54:10 -0500 
From: David O Hunt <bluelobster+@CMU.EDU>
Subject: It doesn't matter what you believe?

Okay, so you're a Christian.  Believe in God, the Devil, angels, and demons.
Believe in an authority so high above you that you are slime to Him.  That
is your right as a human being.  However, your belief doesn't change the
fact that there is no God.  If doesn't change the fact that there is no
Devil.  It doesn't change the fact that there is an ongoing denial of
reality by believers.  It doesn't change the fact that this so-called
omniponent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent God that Christians have
deluded themselves into groveling before is self-described in His book
as a rapacious, vain, egomaniacal, jealous, intolerant, gluttonous (for
blind adulation), and slothful diety.  Even if such a God as is described
in the Bible existed, I've judged Him and found him lacking!
It doesn't change the fact that the self-aggrandizing sacrifice of himself
on a cross is so very similar to many other mythologies of the era, along
with virginal births being similarly borrowed from other religions.
It doesn't change the fact that the so-called Creator of the universe is
so aloof that he can't provide real proof of His existence, but must
test the faith of His followers by a truly intricate and self-consistent
web of evidence to the contrary of His works.  I won't be toyed with
like a cat with a mouse, and it's clear that this diety you believe in
has - not love - but disdain to treat His supposed creations in this manner!

It doesn't matter that whole generations of people have willingly given
all their money to His glorification.  That millions have been slaughtered
by his self-appointed earthly representatives.  That those who believe
don't have the inner strength the make it in this world without the
support of a supernatural crutch.


So go ahead and believe.  It won't change reality.

David
From: sham@cs.arizona.edu (Shamim Zvonko Mohamed)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: School vouchers
Date: 4 Nov 92 22:53:27 GMT
Organization: U of Arizona CS Dept, Tucson

In article <1992Nov3.213601.7536@leland.Stanford.EDU> yergeau@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dan Yergeau) writes:
>
> - Do you oppose tax breaks for parents not sending their
>   children to public schools?

Yes. I don't have any children, but I'm not asking for a tax break. (In fact
I'm taking a tax hit.)

> - [Off the topic of K-12 education, but still relevant to public
>   funding of religious education]  Do you oppose government grants to 
>   college students (formerly Pell grants, but I'm not sure what they 
>   are calling them now-a-days) being used to pay tuition at religious 
>   colleges?

Strawman. The government has decided to provide free K-12 education, therefore
it cannot support religious institutions. When college education becomes free
for all, we can talk about outlawing these outright grants. (Student loans are
different - since they have to be paid back, the students should be able to use
them for any kind of institution.)

> - [Off the topic of education, but relevant to public funding of
>   religious preferences]  Do you oppose the use of social insurance
>   tax dollars (i.e. MediCare) being spent in a non-secular hospital?

Again, this government has decided, reprehensibly, to not provide basic health
care to the citizens. I have to admit I don't know a lot about Medicare, but if
it just provides funds that the patient can use as they see fit, yes, I would
oppose those funds being spent in non-secular hospitals.

> - Do you oppose the use of public funds to be used to purchase
>   religious books for public libraries?  If so, what criteria should
>   be used to determine if a book is "religious"?

Another strawman. If a religious institution owns a widget manufacturing plant,
does that mean that no public works can use those widgets? No. Just like
religious people are allowed to work for the government, even though those
people may take part of their earnings and give them to a church.

-s
--
  Shamim Mohamed / {uunet,noao,cmcl2..}!arizona!shamim / shamim@cs.arizona.edu
  "Take this cross and garlic; here's a Mezuzah if he's Jewish; a page of the
    Koran if he's a Muslim; and if he's a Zen Buddhist, you're on your own."
 Member of the League for Programming Freedom - write to league@prep.ai.mit.edu
Newsgroups: alt.atheism,talk.abortion
From: I3150101@dbstu1.rz.tu-bs.de (Benedikt Rosenau)
Subject: Re: What REALLY pisses me off about Fundies
Organization: Technical University Braunschweig, Germany
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 13:33:00 GMT

In article <1992Nov3.183610.1435@Cadence.COM>
mas@Cadence.COM (Masud Khan) writes:
 
>It is a well know fact that women who have gone through abortion go through
>very serious traumas.
Insert often and you get closer to the truth.
And it is a well known fact that women who have given birth to a child go
often through long phases of depression. And lose interest in sex.
   Benedikt
From: young@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (young.u.huh)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: *TRUE* Christians
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:00:35 GMT
Organization: AT&T

From article <1992Nov6.180308.4974@blaze.cs.jhu.edu>, by arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee):
> 
> Christians don't believe Christianity is mythology in the sense you mean--
> they don't believe it's a set of nice stories whose factual nature is
> irrelevant.  [...]

This reminds me of a conversation I had with a Christian about 
mythologies.  She was talking to a group of people about the
positive value of reading mythological literature and that, in 
particular, children should be exposed to various mythologies.
When I asked her what types of mythologies she has read, she
mentioned, Greek, Roman, Egyptian, etc.  I asked her if she read 
any Jewish mythology.  She said, No.  I told her that Jewish 
mythology is read by so many people around the world that it is 
translated into hundreds of languages, and even to this day, 
many people believe in it.  Then I asked her, "Are you sure
you haven't read it?"  She thought for a moment and said, "You
mean the Bible?"  -- End of conversation.

Young Huh
yhuh@ihlpe.att.com
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: Cure the Believers!
From: kmagnacca@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 12 Nov 92 03:40:04 EST
 <1992Nov9.131249.24244@spectrum.xerox.com> <1992Nov10.164821.29822@newstand.syr.edu> <1992Nov11.193331.938@bnr.ca>
Organization: Wesleyan University

In article <1992Nov11.193331.938@bnr.ca>, bcash@crchh410.BNR.CA (Brian Cash) writes:
>                            
> I prefer the joke about the text that was translated from English to
> Russian and back to English ("The Flesh is Weak, but the Spirit is 
> Strong" into "The Meat is Rotton, but the Wine is Good").
> As far as the name goes, classical latin didn't have the letter 'J'.
> Hmmm...

  Nor does Hebrew or Aramaic; quite a lot of languages don't have
a 'j'.  In Hebrew Jesus is Yeshua, a shortened form of Yeheshua,
Joshua (according to my dictionary, anyway).

Karl
------
"Find a great ideal, a great purpose, marry it, and raise a family."
					 --Negativland, "U2"
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: Don't believe anything you hear!
From: kmagnacca@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 6 Nov 92 04:55:54 EDT
Organization: Wesleyan University

In article <92309.190952MVS104@psuvm.psu.edu>, <MVS104@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
> Okay everyone, simply mark the two files after reading them, flaming
> does no good. These fools are coming here in greater frequency these
> days. Why don't we migrate over to soc.religion.christian and mess up
> their day in return?

   Because if we posted something blatantly stupid like that on
s.r.c it would probably get the axe from the moderator.

Karl
------
"Find a great ideal, a great purpose, marry it, and raise a family."
					 --Negativland, "U2"
From: mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: Questions about other stuff(sorry, lousy title!)
Date: 6 Nov 92 00:18:37 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

In article <Uey44zu00WBME6MNZq@andrew.cmu.edu> jw67+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jordan M. Wolbrum) writes:
>1)  What do you think happens when we die?
>I think it's just like a blown fuse, and when it's your time to go,
>you're gone forever.

I simply don't know. I think your guess is plausible, though.

>2)  Without a soul, could it be possible to clone a human and copy all
>of the original's memories into the clone, creating two of the same
>person?

Only temporarily. The two entities would thereafter have
different experiences, and so, I think, should become
different people. More interestingly, suppose we hook both of
them up to a device that updates each with the experiences
of the other. Is their common consciousness a single person?
What happens to that hypothetical person if one of the
bodies dies?

>3)  What's the deal with supernatural type stuff(ghosts and the like)?
>I think it's a load of crap.

I think it likely that you are right, but do not claim to
have a full inventory of possible experiences, nor full
explanation of all experiences I have had.

>4)  Will technology replace religion in the future?
>Believe it or not, I think it will.  I think the public in general
>depends less on the concept of a God then ever before.  I also think
>that science will one day disprove the existance of a soul, and will be
>able to create complex life from non-organics.

I doubt it. The category of things we call religions is amazingly
varied. Many religions have little or nothing to do with gods.
I suspect there will always be room for mysticism and for
that poetic aspiration that gives rise to religion.
From: bobb@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Robert Beauchaine)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: "God is unfair" Bible passages.
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:13:25 GMT
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

In article <Bx8nwn.8q6@newcastle.ac.uk> J.M.A.Gilman@newcastle.ac.uk (J.M.A. Gilman) writes:

  [Large thought provoking though not-very-objective critique of
  some "unfair" Bible verses mercifully removed]

  To which I say:  so what?  Perhaps you can convince me that
  'Baldilocks' was confronted by a band of juvenille delinquents.  A
  bear mauling is still a bear mauling, no matter how you try to
  gloss over the words.  Perhaps the people of Sodom where to the last
  man nothing but a group of 'gang bangers'.  The destruction of an
  entire city includes newborns, infants, and toddlers, none of whom
  could possibly be guilty of any conceivable sin.

  It seems you want us to think that the people on whom god
  unleashed his wrath deserved nothing less.  This is the point I
  argue, not the specifics of any single biblical account of exactly
  how it happened.  Make the victims seem sub-human by inflating a
  vision of their utter depravity to the point that killing them
  almost seems merciful.  Yet another case of the same kind of 
  dehumanization that I have referred to in my posts on capital
  punishment.  How infinitely more barbaric the act when it's your
  god we'er considering, who supposedly made these people with full
  knowledge of how they would turn out and how he would then deal
  with the problem.  

  BTW, your post was by and large interesting, but in all cases you
  lacked objectiveness by selectively choosing those interpretations
  and translations that would make your god look better in our eyes.
  C+ for effort.

/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ 

Bob Beauchaine bobb@vice.ICO.TEK.COM 

"Look, I tried the cat experiment.  On the third trial, the cat was
dead.  On each of the subsequent 413 trials, it remained dead.  Am I
doing something wrong?"
			James Nicoll

Q.  How many Heisenbergs does it take to screw in a light bulb?
A.  If you know the number, you don't know where the light bulb is!

Xref: sparky alt.atheism:21188 talk.religion.misc:21037 sci.skeptic:19540
From: max@hilbert.cyprs.rain.com (Max Webb)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism,talk.religion.misc,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Efficacy of Prayer
Date: 13 Nov 92 21:09:21 GMT
Organization: Cypress Semiconductor Northwest, Beaverton Oregon

In article <1992Nov11.032736.2010@hfsi.uucp> ata@hfsi.uucp (John Ata - FSO) writes:
>In article <1992Nov9.213948.27071@oclc.org> jay@oclc.org (Jeff Young) writes:
>>ata@hfsi.uucp (John Ata - FSO) writes:
>>: 
>>: One must be very
>>: careful when judging a religion to separate the human members of
>>: the religion from the religion itself...
>>
>>What about the ghastly commands of God in the Old Testament?  If
>>I remember right, this is the same God that Christians have faith in.
>>If the Bible is the word of God, I should be able to judge God based
>>on his own actions as depicted in the OT and not just indirectly
>>via his followers.  Is this a fair judgement?  Why not?
>
>I guess I'm somewhat hazy on what you mean by "judge God based on
>his own actions".

Well, we could always return to Hosea, where God describes himself
as a mountain lion (hunting the unrighteous), and informs a nation that
for their sins, their pregnant women shall be ripped open, and dashed
upon the ground.  (presumeably by his able + devoted followers.)

Then you could try to convince us again that(in actuality), God
was only sorrowfully predicting the consequences of their behavior.
Not so much a raging mountain lion, as a weepy mountain lion.

Good luck.

>>-- 
>>> Jeff Young <   "Why are we going in there again, daddy?"
>>> Personal   <   "Shut up," his father explained.
>>> opinions   <         Ring Lardner
>
>
>-- 
>John G. Ata - Technical Consultant | Internet:  ata@hfsi.com
>HFS, Inc.                VA20     |     UUCP:  uunet!hfsi!ata
>7900 Westpark Drive     MS:601    |    Voice:  (703) 827-6810
>McLean, VA  22102                 |      FAX:  (703) 827-3729

Max G. Webb

(sorry for the imprecision of the biblical ref, but left
my ancient mythology texts at home...)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
From: David.Rice@ofa123.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Marriage a religion?
X-Sender: newtout 0.02 Nov  5 1992
Date: 06 Nov 92  15:22:40

Edwin Bologna (bologna@shrike.und.ac.za (Edwin Bologna))
ID: 1d2sfkINNoq@shrike.und.ac.za
 
EB> "Since Marriage is a Relgious belief, why do you atheists
EB> get married?"
 
Since morality is a Atheist belief, why do theists have morals?
 
Marriage is a political means of aquiring property (a woman),
and the legal means of taking any posessions that woman may
have. It is also the means whereby men restrict a woman's
sexuality, because men, for the most part, are assholes, and
secondly, most men do not wish to raise another man's child---
one way to keep a woman to oneself is to create the specious
and purely gratutitous institution of marriage, and have as
one of its general dogmas the utterly inane prescription to
monogamy.

--- Maximus 2.00
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
From: coons@ct46.med.ge.com (James J. Coons)
Subject: Re: Well.......... It seems that Clintons is IN!!!!!!
Reply-To: coons@ct46.UUCP (James J. Coons)
Organization: GE Medical Systems - CT, New Berlin, WI
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 16:26:03 GMT

In article <Bx6Cx1.3q@umassd.edu> rolls@cis.umassd.edu (Frank Pinto) writes:
>Get ready all!
>
>Clinton seems to be in.............'
>
>Frank Pinto

Bush said: Atheists should not be allowed to be citizens.
Citizens said: Bigots should not be allowed to be president.

Look who won.

Thank all of us!

Jim Coons
From: mathew <mathew@mantis.co.uk>
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: FAQ FILE REMINDER (read, learn and inwardly digest)
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 92 11:25:29 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Mantis Consultants, Cambridge. UK.

[ This is a canned posting ]

This is a reminder about the alt.atheism Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
file.

The file exists to help new readers avoid embarrassing themselves by asking
questions which have been covered over and over again.  Please read it before
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If you haven't already done so, reading the posts on news.announce.newsusers
titled "A Primer on How to Work With the Usenet Community", "Answers to
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Usenet" would be a good idea.

To find a copy of the alt.atheism FAQ file:

1. Check the newsgroup alt.atheism.  There should be a copy of the latest
   version of the FAQ file.  Look for the subject line "Alt.Atheism
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   If you don't find anything in steps 1 or 2, your news system isn't set up
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   FTP is a a way of copying files between networked computers.  If you
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   mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu with
      send usenet/news.answers/ftp-list/faq
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4. If you don't have FTP, send mail to mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu
   consisting of the following line:

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      send usenet/alt.atheism/Alt.Atheism_Frequently_Asked_Questions_(FAQ)

5. (Penultimate resort)  Send mail to info-server@mantis.co.uk consisting of
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      send atheism/atheism.txt

   and our poor overworked modems will try and send you a copy.  There's
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mathew
From: madhaus@netcom.com (Maddi Hausmann)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re:  Top Ten Reasons to Bash Atheists
Date: 9 Nov 92 01:14:07 GMT
Organization: Society for Putting Things on Top of Other Things

epowers@kirk.NMSU.Edu (POWERS) writes: >
0eyrBfG00iUz49aYU=@andrew.cmu.edu  writes: >>
>> One difference.  The first post(TTRTBF)was funny.  The second one was not.
>> -JW
>
>		Sorry, you must have them mixed up.

No, you're just reading the wrong board.  
Alt.religion.christian.fundamentalist.bigot is a few more groups down.
-- 
Maddi Hausmann                madhaus@netcom.com
Humorist, Satirist, Tech Writer.  Take your pick.

Centigram Communications Corp, San Jose California  408/428-3553
From: boyd@acsu.buffalo.edu (Daniel F Boyd)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: morality????????
Summary: How about Jesus?
Date: 6 Nov 92 00:26:36 GMT
Organization: UB

In article <dpn2.42.720821405@po.CWRU.Edu> dpn2@po.CWRU.Edu 
(Damien P. Neil) writes:
> Can you name one person who, after being executed, became a repeat
> offender?

How about Jesus Christ?  ;-)



-- 
Daniel F. Boyd -- boyd@cs.buffalo.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"It's not a System called 'X-Windows', it's a window system named 'X',
after the owl on 'Mister Rogers' Neighborhood'".
From: mathew@mantis.co.uk (mathew)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: FAQ FILE REMINDER (clip and save for valuable prizes)
Date: 6 Nov 92 17:42:43 GMT
Organization: Mantis Consultants, Cambridge. UK.

[ This is a canned posting ]

This is a reminder about the alt.atheism Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
file.

The file exists to help new readers avoid embarrassing themselves by asking
questions which have been covered over and over again.  Please read it before
posting.

If you haven't already done so, reading the posts on news.announce.newsusers
titled "A Primer on How to Work With the Usenet Community", "Answers to
Frequently Asked Questions about Usenet" and "Hints on writing style for
Usenet" would be a good idea.

To find a copy of the alt.atheism FAQ file:

1. Check the newsgroup alt.atheism.  There should be a copy of the latest
   version of the FAQ file.  Look for the subject line "Alt.Atheism
   Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)".

2. Check the newsgroup news.answers for the same subject line.

   If you don't find anything in steps 1 or 2, your news system isn't set up
   correctly, and you may wish to tell your system administrator about the
   problem.

3. If you have anonymous FTP access, connect to rtfm.mit.edu [18.172.1.27].
   Go to the directory /pub/usenet/alt.atheism, and you'll find the latest
   version of the FAQ file there.

   FTP is a a way of copying files between networked computers.  If you
   need help in using or getting started with FTP, send e-mail to
   mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu with
      send usenet/news.answers/ftp-list/faq
   in the body.

4. If you don't have FTP, send mail to mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu
   consisting of the following line:

      send usenet/news.answers/finding-sources
      send usenet/alt.atheism/Alt.Atheism_Frequently_Asked_Questions_(FAQ)

5. (Penultimate resort)  Send mail to info-server@mantis.co.uk consisting of
   the following line:

      send atheism/atheism.txt

   and our poor overworked modems will try and send you a copy.  There's
   other stuff, too; interesting commands to try are "help" and
   "send atheism/index".


mathew
Organization: Freshman, Art, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Date: Thu,  5 Nov 1992 05:11:11 -0500 
From: Jennifer Lynn Urso <ju23+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: leave us alone!!!!

one question, well actually several:

why on earth, if you're a christian, are you posting on this board.
maybe you're even subscribed to it, i don't know.
but do atheists spend their spare time posting on christian
boards(please note that you don't see too many jewish, buddhist,
islamic, or hindus posting on the atheism board, trying to show us our
faults)
why oh why oh why can't you just live your own lives being comfortable
in what YOU believe in?
being an atheist doesn't mean that you don't believe in anything, right?
right.
SO.
stop trying to convert.
get a hobby.
stop posting on this damn board!!!
there are a lot more important things to discuss on here that doesn't
have to do with atheists and christians quibbling over their beliefs.
we never asked christians to post on here.
the newsgroup isn't named
netnews.alt.killyourbabieswehatechristianseveryoneelseiswrongbutuslistena
ndthenceasetobelievewearerightyouarewrongconvertconvergodisdead
no, i'm sorry, doesn't say that.
so why do these christian subscribers act like it is???
post on your on board, damn it, and discuss some REAL issues for a change.
just because you christian alt.atheism subscribers don't like us doesn't
mean you can't just leave us the hell alone.

maybe it seems weird to post a message that's somewhat directed towards
christians on the alt.atheism board, but they're obviously not
subscribing to the christian boards, so i KNOW their going to read it on
here.