HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tyadav@athena.mit.edu (Tapesh Yadav)
Subject: Netnews problem...
Followup-To: tyadav@athena.mit.edu
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:33:23 GMT

==========================

 Seems like, this net news node has some problems.
 My follow ups seem to not go thru.
 Wondering if it is just here?

 Is there someone who would post if I email my follow up to him/her
 in future? May be, this group could have a volunteer node for such
 forwarding by posters with net news bug problems.

 Hoping this goes thru

T.Y.
----
tyadav@athena.mit.edu
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: krishna@seas.smu.edu (Sanjay Krishna)
Subject: What do American students think of India/Indians ?
Organization: School of Engineering and Applied Science
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 19:38:11 GMT


These are the results of a survey I circulated in the class for which I am a
TA. The class consists of three sections of 15 students each. Most of the 
students were told that this was for the Inter-cultural Resource Centre and 
were asked to be sincere. ( Actually it was me that wanted to hear American
opinions from American minds and not through some one else's interpretation 
of their opinion).                                         

                   Survey about India/Indians 

 I   Do you perceive India as a        
   a) starving third world country dependent on foriegn aid. 
   b) third world country with a large agricultural and industrial base but
              over-burdened with a large population.  
   c) country of snake charmers, tigers, elephants, palaces and Maharajas.

 Results - a) 13  
           b) 24
           c) 7   

 II  Judging by the Indians/ Asian Indian American students that you have met, 
        would you consider them to be         
   a) nerds/geeks.
   b) regular, nice but boring.
   c) party people and fun loving. 

 Results - a) 25
           b) 17
           c) 2

 III   As an American who is not of Asian Indian descent, would you prefer that 
   a)  Asian Indian Americans retain their culture and identity.
   b)   Merge with the American mainstream.    

 Results - a) 10 
           b) 15
  Both - an overwhelming 33. 

 IV   Were you aware of the existence of an  Indian Student Association at SMU ? 
   a) Yes
   b)  No
 
 Results - a) 17
           b) 28

I was encouraged by the majority that had the correct view of India. However
the fact that nearly half of them have misconceptions makes me wonder if the
way we Indians/Indian Americans have gone about dissemenating information is 
correct or we need to change it. 

Question # 2 - Almost all the students that chose the option b) Nice, serious
but boring, scored out boring and wrote smart and intelligent. In effect, they
made up for the lapse I committed. The perception of nerd/geek is consistent
with the image they have of other Asian Americans. It was heartening however
that 5 of the students said they were just regular students and/or they hate
to generalize about any group of students. 

Question # 3 - Perhaps the most controversial. Many said there is no such thing
as " American mainstream". But they all agreed that greater interaction was 
essential among different race groups and a common platform be reached. 

Question # 4 - this has nothing to do with this newsgroup. But believe me 
SMU has an ISA that is most active and is the most visible, others ( except
for ABS ( Assoc of Black Students), CHAS ( Hispanic), Alpha Phi Alpha ( the 
African- American fraternity) ) would have done worse.  

Sanjay. 
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: mps1@cec1.wustl.edu (Mihir Pramod Shah)
Subject: Re: RACISM
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis MO
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 22:01:07 GMT

Venu,

	There are MANY ways of combating racism other than the simple "fight
it" arguement.  Simply saying "stand up" is empty and does not provide or show
any real productive ways of combatting racism.
	Let me give you an excellent example.  This week at our university, we
are having what is called "Asian Awareness Week".  It is sponsored by various
on-campus Asian groups, including Asian Students Association, Chinese Students
Association, Association of Korean Students, Hawaiian Club, and Ashoka (the
Indian Students Association, of which I am a part of).  The type of program we
have developed is very comprehensive.  We have planned activities such as
variety show to show dances and fashions, a carom board tournament, two
discussion forums on racism and multicultual awareness, and a dance party,
among many other event.  On the discussion forums, we invite people of all
races and cultural backgrounds.  We discuss issues of the day related to race
and discrimination.  It is conducted in a civilized way and people are free to
express their views in a forum-like atmosphere.  It is very healthy and very
educational.  Our Student Union president happens to be a fine young black man
committed to unifying the student body and breaking down racial barriers.
	The moral of the story?  We non-whites have the responsiblity to
EDUCATE our fellow white citizens in a constructive manner.  This does not
mean that only non-whites have to do the work.  Like I said, ALL races have to
work productively TOGETHER.  The "fight back"
mentality is more confrontational than helpful.  We simply cannot just protest
and holler and yell "Stop Racism!" or "Discrimination is a Vice!"  Of course,
if there is blatant racism, like KKK demonstrations, then more drastic measures
have to be taken.  But as far as mainstream American society is concerned, the
type of program I outlined in the 2nd paragraph seems a more humane and
constructive approach.  Every group on campus here does it.  We have Black Arts
and Sciences Festival, Cha'i Week (Jewish awareness), Interfaith Dinners, and a
whole bunch of other events that properly raise awareness of different
cultures without being rude, loud, or disorganized.

	I hope some of you out there realize that there are good ways and bad
ways of "combating" racism and racial stereotyping.  If we begin "fight back"
attitudes, we will only hurt the cause.  Civilized debate, education, and
mutual understanding are the key.  It is all of our job to do this.

Peace...Mihir
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Monday, 16 Nov 1992 10:16:57 MST
From: Ashish Vaidya <ICASV@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: what up

Hey what up,

     This is ashish again.  I know a bunch of you are really excited about
hearing from me again.  I'm sorry that i couldn't respond to many of your
letters,  i have had a very huge battle with the flu, but I feel good now.  So
what's been said that I've missed for the past couple of weeks?  can someone
tell me what's up?

     I usually talk about racism and I think i'm over it for now.  My friend in
pho just got shot, he's in the hospital recovering froma shot to the anal area.
They shot him where he was working.I guess all this hostility has now gone to
my head, so i know of no other way of expressing my self.  All i know is that
my brother should not have been shot.  I know it happens and I know it may not
even have been racially motivated but, what else am I supposed to infer from
this situation.

     Right now all I'm asking is that if anyone knows a gujarati girl or guy,
who are brahmin, can you please ask them to write me.  I want to talk to others
like me.  I'm cool headed now and all i want to do is talk.  From anyone.
From: sanzgiri@bombay.metaphor.com (Ajit Sanzgiri)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: arranged marriages
Date: 18 Nov 92 18:22:34 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Metaphor Computer Systems, Mountain View, CA

In article <6971@dove.nist.gov> hira@cme.nist.gov writes:
>In article <1992Nov5.193328.14324@cbnewsi.cb.att.com>, alok@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (alok.vijayvargia) writes:
>|> 
>|> I don't think Indian guys talk about sex either with each other.
>|> Not in India at least. I haven't seen very many talk about it
>|> here either. As I said 'sex' is considered private in Indian culture.
>|> I don't necessarily think that it should be so private..
>
>This is not what I've encountered from guys including my cousin from
>Bombay. In fact he talks about women ad nauseum. 
>
>Ron

	It may be my imagination but it seems to me that Indian (I suppose I
	better say II) women are often more comfortable discussing sex among
	themselves.
	Perhaps I had better clarify. The kind of talk Ron mentions above
	and is prevalent among some Indian men is the locker-room macho
	bragging style. However, when it comes to discussing sex clinically
	and that too with actual people (husbands mostly I imagine but by
	no means restricted to within the marriage) women have less
	inhibitions. My wife told me much to my surprise the "frank"
	discussions she's had with my elder sister-in-law. My brother and
	I on the other hand are extremely unlikely to share similar
	confidences.
	I find these gender-based differences in attitudes fascinating.

	Ajit Sanzgiri
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian,news.groups,alt.fan.alok.vijayvargia
From: misdeva@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu (Devjani Mishra)
Subject: Re: SEX
Followup-To: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Organization: Yale University
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 06:30:22 GMT

In article <1elv50INN7vg@menudo.uh.edu>, mba2@Rosie.UH.EDU (Puneet_S)
wrote:
> 
> In article <misdeva-201192004534@morse-college-kstar-node.net.yale.edu>, misdeva@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu (Devjani Mishra) writes:
> >In article <1egoa5INN89t@menudo.uh.edu>, mba2@Rosie.UH.EDU (Puneet_S)
> >wrote:
> >> 
> >> Attention! Not for the mild-mannered or the comically inclined.
> >> 
> >> 
> >> I am taking this matter seriously, definetly not in fun or pun.
> >
> >Me too.  (Look out!  It's a woman talking dirty! All right!)
> >
> PS	You see that's just it... Why is it dirty?  This is a serious
> 	group of people who have many things in common.  Our difficulties
> 	in growing up / adapting.  These discussion are there to help	
> 	us listen to people and then reflect on our own opinions.  Isn't
> 	what this is really about, a frank open, unencumbered discussion
> 	where both the male and female point is useful....If not, then
> 	for this discussion alone, I really want to see that.  Those of
> 	you out there who feel embarassed discussing this topic, Why?
> 	Is it the mind set that society has placed on us?  If you 
> 	want to respond to private E-Mail, that's fine.  If you want
> 	send me private E-Mail.... I'll combine some of the comments,
> 	removing the source and post it as a collection of comments....
> 
> 	For this, please send it to my MBA2 account....
>
> It's not my goddamn planet, monkey boy
> Puneet

Okay.  When I said "Look out! It's a woman talking dirty!",  it was a JOKE.
 I don't honestly believe these subjects are "dirty".  As Amirthi pointed
out in her post, it's "amazing how strong an influence cultural pressure
and our own conditioned expectations can have on our lives" - especially
for women.  In my reading of various II/IA newsgroups, threads concerning
sex are usually composed mostly if not wholly of posts by men.  It is
"really about a frank, open, unencumbered discussion", and we seem to be
successfully having one.

       /-                 Devjani Mishra      misdeva@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu
      /   /               New Haven, CT          diva@minerva.cs.yale.edu
  ___/  _  _   _  ___           
 /  /   /   | /  /  /     "Women are repeatedly accused of taking things
/__/_  /_   |/  /__/_      personally. I cannot see any other honest way of
                           taking them." - Marya Mannes
                           
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: alok@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (alok.vijayvargia)
Subject: Re: SEX
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 23:02:52 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.222748.15519@midway.uchicago.edu>, moh2@quads.uchicago.edu (Kateri/Mary Anne) writes:
> 
> P.S. -Congratulations to Saeed for being the first to respond (shaming
> me into doing so)...and to Puneet for having the courage to bring up
> these questions in the first place.

Congratulations to you too for being courageous in answering questions
on 'Sex' issues. I found your answers quite reasonable.
It is good to have a women's perspective on these issues and Honor goes
to you for being that first woman.

Alok
From: samaddar@siemens.com (Sumitro Samaddar)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: Individualism...
Date: 17 Nov 92 18:36:59 GMT
Reply-To: samaddar@siemens.com

tyadav@athena.mit.edu (Tapesh Yadav) writes:

> Contextually, this particular question: "Who is this "someone else?" is a 
> relevant and generic question. And as your post implicitly suggests, has many 
> different answers:
> - the "someone else" is someone you love
> - the "someone else" is a stranger, an arbitrary stranger

> If you love that someone, then anything you do would make both of you
> happy - your values, tastes, personalities have a lot in common. You 
> are happy both ways: in the act of making someone happy, AND because 
> the "someone" is happy. This someone, then, could be 

Why this constraint of "If you love someone"? As long as you made someone
happy, "You are happy both ways: in the act of making someone happy, AND
because the 'someone' is happy".

> If the someone else is stranger, then we are talking about "living for
> others ala altruism" stuff. And, if Venu or you meant that, then we just
> have to respectfully disagree and leave it there. Because, IMO,

Even if the "someone else" is an arbitrary stranger, making him/her happy
need not imply altruism. Stand-up comics and entertainers actually feel
good if they succeed in getting a smile on some arbitrary strangers face.
The sense of accomplishment/happiness felt by all inventors also depends
on the benefit/happiness it provides to arbitrary strangers. In a way, one
can be selfish and make arbitrary strangers happy primarily to make oneself
happy. (I like this kind of selfishness).

>  Each human is responsible and capable of his/her own happiness.
>  No if and buts.

You didn't make clear in your post where does the soul mate (tm) enters
in this scheme of things. If one person can add to your happiness, why not
more?

Sumitro
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: venu@cirrus.com (Venu Nayar)
Subject: Re: Excluding men
Organization: Cirrus Logic Inc.
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 18:13:05 GMT

In <1992Nov16.140428.12218@midway.uchicago.edu> moh2@quads.uchicago.edu
(Kateri/Mary Anne) writes: 

I am cross-posting this to sci since that was where the newsgroup
originated. At the time, I followed up suggesting various ways in which men
could be a part of the group but still preserve the charter of providing a
forum where women could post free of men (among them being a initially just
allowing men to receive but not to post, etc). However, my suggestions were
not considered (according to me). At that point, there was no reason to
carry on the discussion since mailing lists are private lists and if the
moderator(s) don't listen to you, that's it!

I suppose it is now up to the participants to discuss it now. I have left
Amirthi's postin in its enirity since I am cross-posting it to SCI.

>Hi guys.....here's something that's been disturbing me - tell me what
>you think.

>I was recently invited to subscribe to a mailing list for discussing
>concerns of Indian women in the US.  Ok, well and good.  It's a
>moderated list, with nightly digests sent out by the moderators, who
>will rotate.  I think it grew out of soc.culture.india, because the
>discussions on it appear to have been going for a while.

>Now, my problem with the list is that men are excluded.  In fact, now
>that I think about it, I'm not even sure that you're supposed to know
>it exists, but that feels far too much like secret societies and the
>KKK for me to be comfortable with it.  So I'm telling you about it.

>At the moment, men are not allowed to read or post to the list...nor
>are we supposed to crosspost to newsgroups, although that's up for
>discussion.  What do you think?   This feels to me like
>discrimination, despite the practical reasons for doing so.  (Those
>being:  1)  women who are shy and afraid to speak around men, 2) men
>who are loud and take over the conversation, 3) the focus of the group
>turning away from women's issues and becoming another s.c.i., 4)
>providing a safe space for women to discuss personal lives without
>fears of their husband's friends hearing about it, or possible their
>husbands, etc....)

> - Amirthi (who gets a very uneasy feeling at *any* form of exclusion
>or separatism)
>-- 
>More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads.  One
>path leads to despair and utter hopelessness.  The other to total
>extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly.
>						 - Woody Allen
-- 
Venu Nayar			|		Internet: venu@cirrus.com
Cirrus Logic Inc.		|		(510)-226-2100 X3737 
For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat,
and wrong.
From: gagrawal@cs.tamu.edu (Gopal Agrawal)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: SEX
Date: 23 Nov 1992 16:35:00 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department, Texas A&M University
NNTP-Posting-Host: neuron.tamu.edu

In article <1equdlINNhqc@menudo.uh.edu> mba2@Rosie.UH.EDU writes:
>
> If your spouse/SO can have sex
>>with someone X months/years ago and you accept his/her claim that that is not
>>going to affect your relationship, why is difficult to accept the same claim
>>if he/she had sex with someone yesterday/(an hour ago)/(having right now) ?
>>
>PS	Jealousy.....It's evil, It's there, and I know I am/can be very
>	Jealous....May not like it, but it's a part of me....and I accept it.
>	I may try to change myself to be less of it....but I don't want to..
>	By being this way, it makes me understand how the SO might feel
>	if I was in a similar situation... hence, I won't allow myself in
>	said situation.....
>Puneet

Maybe if you looked at it from an evolutionary viewpoint, every species 
has its own unique way to see to it that it maximizes its chances for 
breeding and keeping alive its offspring. In case of humans, this translates
to better mental (& physical) care for the children who require both their 
parents to take care of them (though the distinction is blurring ever 
since single parents took to playing the role of both father & mother, 
but how effectively they can do that depends on the individual I suppose). 

Actions due to Jealousy is then a way to ensure that the parents 
stick together and the chances of survival of their offsprings are 
bettered i.e., it is not an evil but a survival mechanism. Hence,
knowing that your girlfriend/boyfriend is having (or recently had)
sex with someone else triggers off that gut feeling that she/he may
not necessarily be committed in the future either. However, if one 
is convinced that his spouse/SO has long forgotten previous sexual
encounters, then it may not cause any Jealousy.  

regards,
--   
   ______ ______ ______ ______ __  |\/\/\/|
    ____/  __  /  __  /  __  /  /  |  \  /|  LIFE's COMPLEX - IT HAS
   / __   /   /  /   /  /   /  /   | (o)(o)  REAL & IMAGINARY PARTS.
  /   /  /   /   ___/  __  /  /    C      _) 
_____/ _____/ __/   __/ __/ ______/ | \___|  
E-mail - gagrawal@cs.tamu.edu       |   /   All Std. Disclaimers apply.
From: samaddar@siemens.com (Sumitro Samaddar)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
Subject: Re: .....Re: Heritage and Culture
Date: 17 Nov 92 17:09:26 GMT
Reply-To: samaddar@siemens.com

tyadav@athena.mit.edu (Tapesh Yadav) writes:

> [5] If there is something really called culture/heritage, many readers of
>     this newsgroup should have overwhelming shared beliefs; but, with few
>     months of its life, all I observe is a set of very contrasting 
>     opinions/thoughts. 

Newspapers rarely print good news. That doesn't imply that there isn't any.
Contrasting opinions on newsgroups don't imply lack of shared beliefs. It
will appear quite silly if postings were full of "same goes here", "I think
so too", "me too".

> [6] You can never completely know anyone other than yourself. So I don't 
>     how you can be sure that everyone IS influenced; 

I'm not sure of that either. Even self-analysis is influenced by the
way one learns to analyze (from Aristotle etc).

Sumitro
Newsgroups: alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: raghavan@wk28.nas.nasa.gov (Venkatraman Raghavan)
Subject: Re: Excluding men
Organization: -
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 18:48:10 GMT
Distribution: usa

moh2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:

   >Hi guys.....here's something that's been disturbing me - tell me what
   >you think.
   >
   >I was recently invited to subscribe to a mailing list for discussing
   >concerns of Indian women in the US. 

I have seen some postings about this mailing list on SCI about a month
ago. The reason quoted for excluding men was to encourage women who
wouldn't 'feel comfortable'/participate if men were included. 

It is upto the moderator to post summaries on newsgroups. (I use the
command 'catch up' on SCI a lot and I don't know if any of the
digests appeared on SCI). If there is enough interest we can request
the moderator to post the digests here too.

   >Now, my problem with the list is that men are excluded.  In fact, now
   >that I think about it, I'm not even sure that you're supposed to know
   >it exists, but that feels far too much like secret societies and the
   >KKK for me to be comfortable with it.  So I'm telling you about it.

I have very high regards for some of the members of the group and I 
really don't think there is anything discriminatory about such groups.
(Being a male, I haven't had a chance to see what they are writing about. 
I am waiting to see one of those digests.) What do you think about groups
such as MENSA, which also require certain eligibility requirements?

   >At the moment, men are not allowed to read or post to the list...nor
   >are we supposed to crosspost to newsgroups, although that's up for
   >discussion.  What do you think?   This feels to me like
   >discrimination, despite the practical reasons for doing so.  (Those
   >being:  1)  women who are shy and afraid to speak around men, 2) men
   >who are loud and take over the conversation, 3) the focus of the group
   >turning away from women's issues and becoming another s.c.i., 4)
   >providing a safe space for women to discuss personal lives without
   >fears of their husband's friends hearing about it, or possible their
   >husbands, etc....)

Everything depends on the moderators. It can be a useful group for 
exchanging information and thoughts, or it can be a 'male bashing'
private club.
   
   > - Amirthi (who gets a very uneasy feeling at *any* form of exclusion
   >or separatism)

Last week Preeti Gholap jokingly called Manish the 'male feminist'
and now we will have to call you the 'female anti-feminist'.  :-)

Why do people have to be one 'ist' or the other? I got branded MCP 
by some of the above mailing list people for suggesting a 'middle 
of the road' philosophy. :-(

Regards,
Raghavan