HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 31 Jul 1992 01:25:00 EST
From:         MING the Destroyer <199561011@VUVAXCOM.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: Our beloved government and its duties Abroad

From:         Jason Briggs Cormier <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET>
Subject:      Our beloved government and its duties Abroad

Here is a new question:  What type of foreign policy
should our government pursue?

There are calls for what amounts to isolationism and
some others call for what could end up being more
"manifest destiny"/imperialism.

I believe it is Brzenzki who supports a "selective global
commitment".  This may not be his exact wording, but the
concept is basically as follows.

The US should narrowly define its national interests and
defend these and these alone.  These interests could be
defined in many different terms including economic, but
the key is that this doesn't include the entire globe.

-->now according to this, we would be justified in invading a
country overthrowing their govt. and establishing a government
that will allow our businesses to set up shop in their state,
like for example (and this is, of course, only hypothetical, you
know) if we had, say, installed and supported the shah of iran
so that we could have access to oil and certain strategic positions
near the ussr.  now of course we all know that our country has never
done these things.  you are suggesting that it start?



We should not consider ourselves the guardians of Democrasy
and therefore should not pursue a foreign policy which takes
us to war in order to it.

I believe that this is the stance that I support.  Are
there any who think that there is something better?

-j.b.

-->yup.  the us should never go to war or carry out covert activities
to boost the economy or benefit some big corporation.  the us should
peacefully do everything that can be done to stop or prevent human
rights abuses, both abroad and at home, including political and economic
pressure.

-->how's that for a start?

-->brni
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Wed, 29 Jul 1992 12:39:07 EDT
From:         James P Love <LOVE@PUCC.BITNET>
Subject:      GATEWAY/WINDO ALERT

From:     chris@essential.org (Chris Lewis)
Subject:  Gateway/WINDO Action Notice
Date:     July 29, 1992


GATEWAY/WINDO Action Notice:

ALERT! ALERT! ALERT!

The Congress is running out of time to consider S. 2813, the GPO
Gateway to Government, and H.R. 2772, the GPO Wide Information
Network for Data Online (WINDO), legislation this year. These
bills would provide for single point on-line access to government
information through the Government Printing Office (GPO).

The House Committee on Administration and the Senate Committee on
Rules and Administration will likely meet to mark up these bills
before the scheduled August 13 congressional recess.

It is critical that members of these committees, and their
staffs, hear from supporters of the legislation over the next two
weeks if these bills are to pass the Congress this year.

Phone calls to members and their staff are most needed, but
written letters are appropriate as well.  All communication
should emphasize the need for expanded public access to federal
data bases and the simple and efficient good government approach
incorporated in these two bills.

Members of congress can be reached by phone through the Capitol
switchboard at 202/224-3121.  Mail to Senators should be
addressed:  The Honorable ______, U.S. Senate, Washington, DC
20510.  Mail to Congressmen/women should be addressed: The
Honorable _______, U.S. House of Representatives, Washington, DC
20515.

Members of the Committee on House Administration of the House of
Representatives are:

Charlie Rose, NC                   Bill Thomas, CA
Frank Annunzio, IL                 William Dickinson, AL
Joseph Gaydos, PA                  Newt Gingrich, GA
Leon Panetta, CA                   Pat Roberts, KS
Al Swift, WA                       Paul Gilmor, OH
Mary Rose Oakar, OH                James Walsh, NY
Bill Clay, MO                      Mickey Edwards, OK
Sam Gejdenson, CT                  Bob Livingston, LA
Joe Kolter, PA                     Bill Barrett, NE
Martin Frost, TX
Tom Manton, NY
Marty Russo, IL
Steny Hoyer, MD
Gerald Kleczka, WI
Dale Kildee, MI

Members of the Committee on Rules and Administration of the
Senate are:

Wendell Ford, KY                   Ted Stevens, AK
Claiborne Pell, RI                 Mark Hatfield, OR
Robert Bryd, WV                    Jesse Helms, NC
Daniel Inouye, HI                  John Warner, VA
Dennis DeConcini, AZ               Bob Dole, KS
Al Gore, TN                        Jake Garn, UT
Daniel Moynihan, NY                Mitch McConnell, KY
Christopher Dodd, CT
Brock Adams, WA


Note:  If you need copies of the legislation and a fact sheet,
send an email message to love@essential.org.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Lewis                       voice:     202/387-8030
Director, Washington Office         fax:     202/234-5176
Taxpayer Assets Project        internet:     chris@essential.org
P.O. Box 19367
Washington, DC  20036
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: politics@ohstvma.BITNET
X-VMS-To: @POL
X-VMS-Cc: CDELL
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 1992 11:41:00 CST
From:         "VALENTINE M. SMITH" <CDELL@UMKCVAX1.BITNET>
Subject:      Politics by "mob oppression" ...

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 21:26:01 EST
From: Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject: RE: Pro-Choice and the GOP Convention

All:

(First paragraph deleted)

> BTW, I also read that prolife demonstrators are an increasing
> presence on the Clinton campaign trail, occasionally rivaling the
> pro-clinton crowd in number.  Interesting development going in to the
> GOP convention season, no? --Missy Justice

No, I do not beolieve this is an "interesting development," but
political terrorism on a very narrow track. I have never felt, after
27 years in one kind of politics or another, that this tactic was
fair, regardless of who was the "victim of the mob." You want to
debate the issues? Fine. But harassing the candidates to promote a
spcific point of view is annoying, rude, discourteous to those who
came to hear whoever speak, and generally anti-American, as far as
I'm concerned. BTW, I'd be just as disgusted if NOW sent legions to
harass Bush or Quayle - the tactic stinks! VMS
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
X-VMS-Cc: CORJB
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 31 Jul 1992 14:12:48 -0500
From:         Jason Briggs Cormier <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: A New Conservative Movement?

I think that many in the US would vote for a Kemp/E. Dole
ticket, including many Democrats.

-j.b.
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
X-VMS-Cc: CORJB
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Tue, 21 Jul 1992 16:43:30 -0500
From:         Jason Briggs Cormier <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: How to Defeat Aids

Carl says:

>  Aside from blood transfusions, I think that the way to defeat Aids
>is to encourage people to discontinue a promiscuous lifestyle and to
>make abstinence in vogue.  As for education, since sex ed has been
>introduced into the schools the rate of diseases and teen pregnancies
>have increased.  Also, there is no protection against Aids even from a
>condom.  The Aids virus is one fifth the size of the smallest hole in
>any condom.

I think that this is a very good point.  The only way to bring
abstinence into vogue is to do some massive social restructuring.
This will take an incredible change in our entertainment industry.
Who should start this?  the government?  That gets very close to
Big Brother.

A way perhaps, could be to increase the movie ratings standards.
I don't think that this would go over very well with many people
however, people who would be screaming "censorship" and bringing
up the 1st Amendment.

-j.b.
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 1992 17:08:04 EST
From:         MacPhil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
Subject:      Re: A response to "Another Gulf War"
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu>

On Fri, 24 Jul 1992 16:04:29 -0500 Jason Briggs Cormier said:
>>Removing Hussein from power may have been one of Bush's motives, but it was
>>not one of the U.N.-sanctioned objectives (am I remembering this right,
>>everyone?).
>
>And remember the federal directive banning the US from assassinating
>the head of state for another country...
>
>MacPhil:
>        Isn't there a difference between assassination
>        and death in war time?

you are catching on faster than I gave you credit for.

>        Another question shouldn't a government do what it
>        needs to even if it goes against its directives?

N.B.  I didn't say we did or should obey such directives.  I merely
pointed out the existence of one.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
When ambidextrous people can't do it right, we do it left.

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Thu, 23 Jul 1992 11:46:38 EST
From:         MacPhil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
Subject:      Re: what does this mean?
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu>

On Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:38:00 EST linda said:
>everytime i have posted something today, i get a message back saying that the
>list is held and my post delayed.
>what does that mean?
>has anything gotten through?
>please respond personally-i don't want to take up too much space w/this.

You must have read my post regarding this several days because you replied
"oh" -- but....one more time:

LISTSERV has a parameter regarding the maximum number of posts allowed
to be sent for an entire list from midnight-to-midnight.  When that
number is exceeded, the list is "held" until the owner sends a command
to LISTSERV saying "FREE POLITICS" which allows the flow of messages
to continue.

I coulda sworn this was clear the first time...

------------------------------------------------------------------------
When ambidextrous people can't do it right, we do it left.

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:59:37 -0700
From:         Andy Freeman <andy@SAIL.STANFORD.EDU>
Subject:      Hillary Clinton's Kid Proposal

[The author of this is taking the bar this weekend and doesn't read
POLITICS-L anyway, so there isn't going to be much of a dialog.  On
the other hand, it is the only comments I've seen written by someone
who actually read the proposal.]

I, as much as anyone else I think, believe in the rights of children,
*and* the ability for them to get themselves out of a bad situation.
Heck, I myself was emancipated as a minor.  In fact, I was out on my
own at the age of 11.

But we are not talking about a mechanism which will necessarily, if at
all, help abused kids!  [I might note that almost without exception,
all the responses in vehement favour of this proposal have included
such language as "*I* was abused, if only *I* had had such a remedy
available..." - please realize that those of us who had less than
ideal childhoods sometimes interpret things through a filter based on
those experiences, and react from feelings.  Nowhere, in fact, does
this proposal actually address abused and neglected kids.]  And, in
fact, the mechanism for getting kids out of truly abusive homes through
the court system has *always* been there, at least in the lifetime
of anyone reading these postings.

Hillary Clinton's proposal will not help abused children.  Abused
children, and children from highly dysfunctional families, are just
about the *last* kids who will go to a court, of *all* places, and ask
to get out from under their parents.  And, again, these legal
mechanism are *already* in place anyway, in many, if not all, states.

What such a proposal *would* do would be to allow your adolescent son
or daughter to drag you into court because you have said "No, you
cannot have a full-time job while you are flunking all of your
classes."  It will allow your teenaged daughter to sue you because you
won't let her get liposuction [not to mention pay for it].

What else it would do would be to create a whole new industry of legal
professionals.  Wow...what a deal..I can cull clients from the junior
high school, and heck, if I win get their parents to pay their legal
expenses, on *top* of that plastic surgery.

If I truly believed that this idea would help neglected or abused
children, then I wouldn't have even posted it.  Geez, I'm not
unreasonable, or unfeeling even.  I happen to believe though, that it
will not only not help the kids who need it, but it will *harm* those
kids who are *not* mature enough to make such decisions, but drag
their parents to court anyway..because they can.  So what if they end
up losing their case...the harm done to the family at that point could
be irreparable.

This is NOT to say that there aren't real problems with the system.  I
just don't think that this is the answer, and in fact I think it could
be very harmful, in the long run, to the kids themselves, as well as
to society as a whole.

[Remember, that wasn't written by andy.]

-andy
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Wed, 22 Jul 1992 09:36:00 EST
From:         linda <SABOE@VUVAXCOM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: How to Defeat Aids

increasing standards for movie ratings will eliminate aids.
hmmmmmm.....i didn't know you could contract aids that way.
-linda
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.EDU
X-mailer:     Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R2).
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 31 Jul 1992 10:43:18 EST
From:         "Greg `TwoTone' Spiegelberg" <GSPIEGEL@BSA1.KENT.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Sex and marriage, sex and marriage, go to . . .
Comments: To: POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.EDU

From:          John Mignault <jbm@PANIX.COM>

}In article <POLITICS%92072922470756@OHSTVMA.IRCC.OHIO-STATE.EDU> Travis Kidd
}<TKIDD@CLEMSON.BITNET> writes:

}>Guy's car at girl's house at night with lights off=prima facie evidence.
}>(And vice versa.)
}>
}The only thing this establishes is that his car is parked in front of her
}house. And what time of night? 10 pm? 2 am? What if "girl" (or guy) is sick
}and asked guy (or "girl") to come over and tend to her?

What if the car is parked on a street that allows parking on only one
side??  Which house is the person at??  Or are you going to barge
into all of them only to find out (possibly :) that you're simply
harassing people with your morals??


[---Stuff Deleted---]
}It just gets more and more burdensome and unenforceable. Unless,
that is,
}you're willing to have one hellacious mess of a police state....

I ain't paying for it!!!!  I pay enough taxes already!!!

}>-Travis
}--John Mignault
}   jbm@panix.com
}Groucho Marx for World Humor God(tm)
}Vote Discordian In November

-Greg, The Objective
 Vote Republican & keep gov't out of our lives
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Thu, 30 Jul 1992 22:04:14 EDT
From:         Jamie <PL436000@BROWNVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Flying in the face of logic, and history

I was delighted to read that Kerry has never had sex with Travis
or Robert. Brava, encore.
I was tantalizingly close to an endorsement (perhaps
an unwanted one), but then....

The Kerrys publically admit that they hate ilk.
One of them chides us for not having read Roe v. Wade, then
displays her ignorance of its content, and then the other
would have us believe that we don't need a history czar.
Nor a logic czar. What an insult.

I will have to reconsider.

It seems to me at present that we desperately need either
(a) the most moral man alive,
or (b) some forthright candidates who can't help it if they
       are unspeakably altitudinous.


But there's still plenty of time for waffling.


And thank jove, she's back, salve, liese.


Jamie
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Sun, 26 Jul 1992 12:06:09 EST
From:         MacPhil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
Subject: RE: Is Quayle pro-choice?
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu>
              26 Jul 1992 09:22:13 EDT from <MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU >

On Sun, 26 Jul 1992 09:22:13 EDT K=A*T said:
>False.  He said "I would ... support whatever decision she made."
>Mine is a DIRECT QUOTE typed word by word out of our local news-
>paper.  Is yours direct?  Where did you get yours?

Local newspapers are definitely an excellent source for word-by-word
quotes...they never misrepresent the truth--an excellent promotoer
of the UL.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
When ambidextrous people can't do it right, we do it left.

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Sun, 26 Jul 1992 14:54:58 EST
From:         MacPhil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
Subject: RE: Is Quayle pro-choice?
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu>
              26 Jul 1992 13:20:23 EDT from <MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU >

On Sun, 26 Jul 1992 13:20:23 EDT K=A*T said:
>From:         MacPhil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
>
>>> False.  He said "I would ... support whatever decision she made."
>>> Mine is a DIRECT QUOTE typed word by word out of our local news-
>>> paper.  Is yours direct?  Where did you get yours?
>
>> Local newspapers are definitely an excellent source for word-by-word
>> quotes...they never misrepresent the truth--an excellent promotoer
>> of the UL.
>
>Whatever "UL" means.  Take these: COP, NSE, PDE, TES, PCM, etc.
>I care for acronyms used in the medical field (and I am not
>saying "UL" is one of them) as you care about acronyms used
>in the engineering field.

Since you seem to be rather experienced on the nets, I would not think
it too much presume you've heard of <U>rban <L>egends?  Newspapers
are one of the best methods of passing them along...even adding
authenticity to a story /p any basis in fact.

>And in case you are being sarcastic (fat chance!....see I can be
>sarcastic too) let me tell you this:
>        1. Most local papers do not cover national news through
>           their local staff, they use wire services.
>        2. Our local paper is part of Knight-Ridder (sp?)
>           papers which is a nationwide news organization.

Now, /c this in mind, what obligation does your local newspaper have
for printing a wire source story in its entirety?  Have you ever
compared the "same" wire story in two newspapers and compared the
differences?

>        3. I watched Larry King Live personally.

This is incredible -- but you didn't quote what you saw or heard on
tv -- you quoted something in print, as if a secondhand news source
was any more accurate.

The reason I'm picking @ nits 'n lice is that several quotes/interpretations
of what James Danforth Quayle did or didn't say during that reply have
been stated on this list and each claimed to take it directly.  I'm not
sure quoting a source such as a wire service story actually adds any
credibility to a viewpoint.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
When ambidextrous people can't do it right, we do it left.

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Wed, 22 Jul 1992 17:04:00 EDT
From:         Travis Kidd <TKIDD@CLEMSON.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: cost vs. return

On Tue, 21 Jul 1992 09:26:42 -0500 Jason Briggs Cormier <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET> sa
id:
> Values and morals have to be taught at home or in private schools,
> but the facts can and must be taught in all schools.  There are
> too many people who get pregnant, catch a disease or something
> as a result of unsafe sex, for people to argue that the current
> system is working.
>
> -j.b.

Sex outside of marriage should be a jailable offense.
-Travis
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
X-VMS-Cc: CORJB
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Tue, 28 Jul 1992 11:07:15 -0500
From:         Jason Briggs Cormier <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Questions, questions

>sheesh. you need to get a grip, Jason. Does
>your mother know you talk this way about women?

fyi, my mother has a stronger opinion on this than
I do.  I was just asking questions and trying to get
someone to convince me of an opinion that I want
desperately to believe incorrect.  I have yet to be
convinced.

Too often the "issues" as I see them are left behind.

I suppose my main question is why should I accept
abortion as a legitimate woman's right?  No one can
say when life begins or stops.  The result is that
I am not qualified to determine when a child is a child
and when it is a piece of tissue.  Accordingly, I
can't help but think that abortion is wrong because
we can't be sure.

Please I am begging someone, anyone to come up with
the argument that will satisfactorily clear this up.

I do apologize if I have upset anyone or whatever.
I should been incommunicado today as I am under
what amounts to duress.

I will do better next time.

Es tut mir leid.  I am truly sorry.

-j.b.
>jEnnifEr ElisE colE stEEle
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET
X-VMS-To: WVNET::IN%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 1992 15:57:24 -0400
From:         KILBURN@WVSVAX.WVNET.EDU
Subject:      Re: A response to "Another Gulf War"

MacPhil:
>So you see this as the "August Surprise, Part II" ?

Could be, I s'pose.

>Depends upon whether Saddam is left alive (again)...that was one of the
>big criticisms publicly during our first road trip--we sent a large
>quantity of resources and left the turkey alive.

Yeah, but it'll be tricky to work it out right.  We'd either have to get a
new Security Council resolution to take him out, or we'd have to get him in
the form of collateral damage during one of those surgically-precise air
strikes on a non-civilian target.  If Bush wants to really cover his a*s,
that is.  I suspect some folks (many? most? :)) wouldn't much care how it
happened, but others would.

I wonder what the effects of a military strike in the nearish future will
be for Middle East relations more generally.  Any speculations?  What
happens if we go in with the planes, bomb a bunch of stuff, miss Hussein,
and *still* don't get into the Ag. building?  What if we get Hussein and
blow up the Ag. building?

Kerry
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU