From: brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder)
Subject: Re: Institutional racism
Organization: Quake Public Access
Distribution: usa,local
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:14:49 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.143251.1@skyblu.ccit.arizona.edu> ohall@skyblu.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>In article <1992Dec21.040250.21819@athena.mit.edu>, solman@athena.mit.edu (Jason W Solinsky) writes:
>> In article <1992Dec15.092141.1@milori.ccit.arizona.edu>, ohall@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>>|> In article <BzAvB2.38v@quake.sylmar.ca.us>, brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder) writes:
>>|>> In article <1992Dec14.112048.1@milori.ccit.arizona.edu> ohall@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>>|>>>In article <1992Dec12.145948.923@blkbox>, collins@blkbox (Chad R. Collins) writes:

>>|>>>White females in the work force are commonly
>>|>>>faced with the problem of it not being discovered that they are married to
>>|>>>a black man.  Co-workers of mine experienced it and told me so. 

>>|>>So, what are they worried about?  Being fired because they are married to
>>|>>a black man? I think in most places all it would get you is a few unwelcome
>>|>>stares.  More than anything I think this is mostly just a case of the
>>|>>unusual attracting attention.  I KNOW it makes a big difference where you
>>|>>live too.  Here in Hollywood, I see mixed race couples all the time and I
>>|>>rarely take more than a passing notice of it (and neither does anyone else).
>>|>>In less-integrated places (places where mixed marriages are more rare) such
>>|>>a relationship would probably attract some attention, but do you really
>>|>>think it would get you fired?

>>|> Why should they chance it?  Besides who enjoys being stared at because you 
>>|> are married to one of another race.  This nation is terribly behind.  It
>>|> hurts and it is sick!

>>Don't be a fool. Everybody notices the unusual most often. It is human nature
>>and there is nothing wrong with it. If they don't enjoy being stared at they
>>should avoid unusual things. In Arizona, Inter-racial couples are unusual.
>>I pity anybody who is so shy, they are distrubed by a little extra attention.

> A little extra attention.  Is that what you call it?  

Yes, that's what it's likely to get most people most of the time.  What do
you call it?

> Why is it to most of
> you whites I have been conversing with everything that bothers me and other
> blacks seems to be little?  

I don't know exactly what you mean, but this is a potential problem for 
whites as well as blacks.  Remember, interracial relationships don't just
happen to one race.  If I dated or married a black woman, I'd expect a little
extra attention, but I wouldn't let it stop me.  I'm not going to let some
racist idiots tell me whom I may date or marry.

One thing that just occurred to me is that for those who are likely to be
interested in that stuff, wouldn't it be considered sort of a "move up" for
the black half of the relationship and "slumming" for the white half?  That
being the case, isn't it more a problem for whites than blacks?  

> It may seem little now!

Sure, it's little...and it's still bad too, but that's my point.  Nobody these
days is going to fire someone because he's involved in an interracial 
relationship.

>>|>>>It's kind of bad when in a white school system a white girl says to a 
>>|>>>black boy "I like you but my dad would not approve...".  

>>|>> I think these days most parents would be a bit more open-minded than that
>>|>> don't you?
 
>>Yeah, right? It hasn't happened yet. A large fraction of the people who are
>>parents now would get really pissed. Fortunatelly, this is not the case for
>>the people who will be parents in years to come. Give it 20 years.

> That remains to be seen.  
> Hey joker, why didn't you speak up when response > |> > above was originally
> posted?  I guess there is a white man who doesn't live in Hollywood who 
> agrees that parents aren't open minded. 

Some are and some are not.  Here in Hollywood, most are.  A great many other
places are like that, and even in most other places not as tolerant as 
Hollywood, many parents wouldn't really object.  And what if they do? 
Shouldn't kids think for themselves?

> If you agree that this large fraction of parents would be pissed, then why 
> do you have trouble believing that there is extreme predjudice in the job
> market, etc.?  Where does this large fraction of parents work?

Good point.  The fact that most parents wouldn't stand in the way of 
an interracial relationship indicates that they also wouldn't discriminate 
on the job.  Actually, since realtionships of children are much more 
personal and thus are probably more racially touchy than job-related matters.

> Give it 20 years!! That's a common expression.  Things are getting better.
> Give it time.  The check is in the mail.

Don't you think things are getting better in many ways?  Do you really think
that vast changes in people's prejudices can be changed overnight?  I'd
be happy if there were some way to eliminate racism without waiting, but 
there's no way to do it.  Of course you can throw a tantrum because the world
won;t change as quickly as you (and I) would like, but is that going to do
any good?

> In 20 years or not, I'm on a different course.  In other words, as Clark
> Gable once said "Frankly Scarlet, I don't give a *#$%!"

That's obviously false since you are bothering to discuss the subject.
You give every indication of being someone who fives a damn.

--Brian

Newsgroups: alt.discrimination