HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jhenderson@pomona.claremont.edu
Subject: LCFI - Announcement
Organization: Pomona College
Date: 15 Sep 92 20:13:44 PDT

Hello, fellow netters,

This is the official announcement of the next LCFI:

	When:  October 24th (Saturday)
	Where: Oceano County (L52)

This airport is on the coast, just two blocks from the beach, with plenty
of restaurants within walking distance.

Activities available (from the Pilots Guide): rent clam forks, swimming,
fishing, horse back riding, golf, overnight camping around lagoon at the State
Park (reservations required, through Ticketron), deep sea fishing.
Transportation is available to all the activities farther than walking
distance, according to this guide.

Fuel is available on the field. The overnight tie-down fee is $5.00, for those
who would like to spend the weekend there.

I suggest that we decide on the food once we get there, unless the majority
wants to have a picnic.

The runway is a bit on the short side, 2,335 feet long, so those wishing to fly
in their personal 747's won't be able to do it. However, San Luis Obispo is
only 8 miles away, so if you plan on flying an airplane that can't make it, I'm
sure we can work a pick-up. I offer to make a run or two if needed (I'll have
an Archer II).

So...if you plan on attending, please contact me by mail at the address below.
I will make periodic postings with the list of attendees and available seating.

Indicate, please, the type of airplane that you will be flying, N-number,
number of attendees and number of available seats, if any, and departure
airport. Also indicate whether you prefer for lunch...a restaurant or a picnic.

For starters...

Javier Henderson	jhenderson@pomona.claremont.edu		POC
Archer II		N3837N					2 seats

Perhaps an arrival time of noon to 1pm would be advisable, to lessen the
possibilities of the marine layer being a factor.

Hope to see you all there!

And for those too far to make it to this fly-in...I can't restrict the
distribution of postings with the software they use at this site (ANU-NEWS on a
VMS machine). Sorry...
______________________________________________________________________________
Javier Henderson, N6VBG         | Beat the 55mph limit (legally):
jhenderson@pomona.claremont.edu | Learn to fly!
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: landry@solvit.enet.dec.com (Chris Landry)
Subject: Re: Jeppesen Student Kit
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 20:43:13 GMT


In article <9209040257.AA11433@GROUCHO.CS.NYU.EDU>, deragon@GROUCHO.CS.NYU.EDU (John Paul Deragon) writes...
> 
>	They *require* the purchase of the Jeppesen Student Pilot
>kit.  Basically it consists of a hard cover book entitled the
>"Private Pilot Manual" and an abridged version of the FARS,
>along with a Sylabus, Test booklet and Manuvers guide.  You also
>get a plotter and a cardboard flight computer, all this sets you
>back about 130.00.   
>	
	I, too, bought this kit at the "recommendation" of the FBO when I
	started flying.  The Private Pilot Manual is fine, but the kit is
	a rip off.  The price of the whole is 40-50% higher than the sum of
	the parts.  Of course, if they require it . . .

	Thinking back, I think I also got "free" use of the Jepp videos
	that go with the book.  I only watched one or two.  Your mileage
	may vary, but I found them to be pretty much a waste of time.

	chris

Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: jcmorris@mwunix.mitre.org (Joe Morris)
Subject: Re: Twin aircraft (was: Re: Twin Beechcraft crashed in Hinckley, IL)
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 16:17:32 GMT

zari@bolzano.math.ethz.ch (Alain Zarinelli) writes:

>                                                       To make things
>even more complicated there is one "critical" engine if the two engines
>turn in the same direction (if they turn in opposite directions neither
>is critical): during climbs the down-spinning propeller-blade gives more
>thrust than the up-spinning. The way the two engines are mounted on the
>wings gives asymmetric thrust vectors and thus an angular momentum
>tending to twist the aircraft. This is the reason why the losing of the
>critical engine during TKOF is somehow the "worst case".

A real-world dictionary (as opposed to the written test guides) would define
the term "critical engine" to mean "the engine which is still running".

;-)    <-- for the humor-impaired

This is the reason why a few twins were marketed with opposite-rotating
engines.  (The Commanche C/R is a good example.)  In these birds with
either engine shut down the remaining powerplant generated a P-factor
opposite in direction to the turning moment on the fuselage caused
by the absence of the other engine's thrust.

Joe Morris
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: pj@linz.ensmp.fr (Pierre JOUVELOT <jouvelot@cri.ensmp.fr>)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Genral Aviation in Israel?
Date: 15 Sep 92 13:21:58 GMT
Organization: Ecole des Mines de Paris, France


I'm interested in knowing whether flying general aviation aircrafts is
possible in Israel?  Can you rent planes there?  Are there equivalences
for foreign PP-ASEL licences?  How much does it cost?  

E-mail replies favored.

Thanks,

Pierre
--
Pierre Jouvelot		       			E-mail: jouvelot@cri.ensmp.fr
Centre de Recherche en Informatique		TPH: +33 (1) 64.69.48.36
Ecole Nationale Supe'rieure des Mines de Paris
From: glenb@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Glen Baker)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Logging time for the Inst
Date: 9 Sep 92 18:40:57 GMT
Organization: What, me? Organized?

In rec.aviation, geoff@peck.com (Geoff Peck) writes:

> DANGER!  I think that this is an EXCEPTIONALLY bad idea.  The purpose of a
> safety pilot is to *look* *for* *traffic* -- and maybe keep track of
> terrain by looking out the window.  An instrument student is likely to do
> exactly what Judy suggests -- be fascinated by all the goings-on _inside_
> the airplane.  This is a very, very bad thing.

 Hmm, seems to me that this isn't *all* that different than a CFI's job.
 The CFI has to look for traffic, watch the instrument student's performance,
 critique the performance, decide what to do next, possibly work the
 radios, etc.
 
 Of course, the obvious reaction will be "yes, but the CFI is *trained*
 for that" to which my response would be that as a pilot I am *trained*
 to look for traffic, fly the airplane, run the radios, navigate, etc.
 I find that sitting in the right seat playing safety pilot is *easier*
 than flying the airplane...my job is reduced to looking for traffic
 and watching terrain. If the pilot under the hood blows his altitude or
 heading that's his problem as long as he hasn't created a safety issue
 at which point I'd take the airplane anyway. I'm not there to instruct,
 just to keep us safe.

 I'm not refuting the claim that if the safety pilot keeps his/her head
 in the cockpit it would be a very very bad thing, I'm just pointing out
 that in my own case it's *much* easier to keep my head out of the
 plane when I'm not actually flying it!

 ..glen
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: ednschmi@kraken.itc.gu.edu.au (John Schmidt)
Subject: Re: Greenhorns wanting to fly in Australia
Organization: ITC, Griffith University, Brisbane, Australia
Date: 15 Sep 92 12:10:01 GMT

star@ruble.tuwien.ac.at (Dr. Werner Staringer) writes:

>I've completed my PPL-ASEL here in Austria about six weeks ago.
>During the past six weeks my wife has grown from a totally ignorant
>passenger ("do we have to fly that fast?") to a professional
>crew member ("watch your speed, we are quite slow!").

>Now we are thinking about whether we should turn our planned
>5-week trip to Australia this X-mas into our first flying holiday.
>We would appreciate any advice you netters can give us on that.
>Any and all opinions are welcome, be it advice to leave that for
>some other time (until the ink on my license is dry...) or
>valuable info on how to prepare for the trip.

>Currently, we know next to nothing about flying in Oz. We haven't
>even been there (we had lived in New Zealand for 18 months, but never
>made it across the Tasman). How easy is it to rent a plane over there
>and what are the costs involved? Are the rental planes in acceptable
>condition? Insurance? How tricky is the weather? Is my Austrian
>ICAO licence valid as is, or do I need to take any further steps?
>What are useful sources of information? Where should we go?
>(we arrive in Sydney)

Australia is a great place for flying.  It is the driest continent (good VFR
most of the time), and the distances are long enough to make flying really
worth while. Rental planes are usually in good condition. I don't know if you
have to validate your licence, but I would assume so. In any case, you
probably need local information. I have done quite a lot of flying family
holidays, so I can give you more information on email if you wish.

Navigation in remote areas might be a problem for people unfamiliar with
local landscapes. My daughter's boyfriend, a pilot from the UK, thought I
was an absolute genius navigationally until he got used to it.

John Schmidt
Griffith University, Brisbane.
Email: j.schmidt@edn.gu.edu.au
From: suffron@informix.com (Nancy Suffron)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Mag check random thoughts
Date: 9 Sep 92 04:09:59 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <1992Sep1.212730.20259@ichips.intel.com> papworth@pdx022 (David Papworth) writes:
>>>> Now how many of us have, in going to R, sailed right through it and gone to
>>>> OFF, then quickly turned it back to BOTH, to be rewarded with a loud report
>>>> the mag switch . . . sheesh.  Luckily I didn't break anything.
>>
>>I was also taught to check the mag grounding that way -- warned by a
>>CFI who has seen people bitten by hot mags on the ramp.  He did
>>next to BOTH on a Tomahawk) first, then RIGHT, then OFF very briefly.
>
>But please, folks, if you want to do this, turn the switch to "off"
>when the engine is at no more than a fast idle. DO NOT do it at
>runup RPM (typically 2000 RPM). DO NOT FOLLOW the "left, both, right,
>both, off, both" runup advice above.
>
>If you inadvertantly do this "check" at runup RPM, LEAVE THE SWITCH
>ON OFF, retard the throttle, and pull the mixture to idle cut-off.
>Once the engine stops, do a normal re-start. It is hard to remember 
>this; one almost reflexively returns the switch to "left" after
>an inadvertant trip to "off". (And gets rewarded with a "BANG!").

Now you tell me!


>I did this just once. 

Me, too.  Unfortunately, it was during the runup of my PP check ride.
Of course, I heeded my natural reaction, jerked the switch back to 
"both," and immediately jumped almost out of my skin.  Not a good way
to impress the DE. :-(  Luckily, he was very understanding, we talked
briefly about what had caused the backfire, and the rest of the check
ride proceeded well, .... er, that is, well enough to get the ticket
anyway. ;-)

Nancy
PP-ASEL

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nancy Suffron                   email: suffron@informix.com
Client Services Engr.       phonemail: 913-599-8475
Informix Software, Inc.     snailmail: 16011 College Blvd.
                                       Lenexa, KS  66219
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: venky@thelonious.bellcore.com (G A Venkatesh)
Subject: Re: FAA on the DEA
Reply-To: venky@thelonious.bellcore.com (G A Venkatesh)
Organization: Bellcore, Morristown NJ
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 92 16:04:32 GMT

In article <BuLFG3.JJq.2@cs.cmu.edu> dst+@cs.cmu.edu (Dave Touretzky) writes:
>Last week I flew 150 miles down to Charleston, WV to attend an FAA safety
>seminar and listening session.  No, I'm not an FAA groupie; I needed to do
>this to get my Phase V Pilot Proficiency Wings, which encourages my
>insurance company to give me a break on rates.  There were no seminars in
>the Pittsburgh area during the time frame I wanted to attend one.

I have heard some strong rationalizations for flying somewhere and this one
is way up there. :-)

venky
From: joell@hpgrla.gr.hp.com (Joel Larner)
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 14:59:34 GMT
Subject: Re: What do you do during long boring flights?
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Greeley, CO
Newsgroups: rec.aviation

Along with all the other recommendations on watching for traffic, checking
position, etc. you can obtain flight following from center.  This does a
number of usefull things.  It provides someone to talk to occasionally
(to help your boredom concern), and it provides lots of safety features.

1. In the event you don't see some possible traffic hazard center MAY
   point it out to you.  Remember, you are VFR and the other traffic
   is also, center is not required to provide separation, but they
   will if the other traffic shows up on there radar and they have 
   the time.

2. If something happens to your aircraft and you unfortunately have to
   make an off airport arrival with the earth, center knows right where
   you are.  We know you are in trouble immediately and where you are,
   thus search and rescue efforts are now hours ahead of where they
   would be with just a flight plan (and days ahead if you did not
   file a flight plan, hint-hint).

3. You get to listen to other traffic and I try to visualize where they
   are.  They may be approaching you!!!

-------------------------------------------------------
Joel Larner - Hewlett Packard, Greeley Storage Division
CAP SAR Pilot            email:  joell@hpgrjq.gr.hp.com
                           CAP:  Pikes Peak 293
                    In The Air:  N182H

Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: mark@hpcvxmsr.cv.hp.com (Mark Rowe)
Subject: Re: Twin Beechcraft crashed in Hinckley, IL
Reply-To: mark@.cv.hp.com
Organization: UDT-CV (ITO)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 17:20:22 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.141242.11958@spdc.ti.com>, serafin@epcot.spdc.ti.com (Mike Serafin) writes:

> The C310I handbook gives the following figures for SE climb:
> 
> gross	sea level	2500	5000	7500	10000
>  wt
> 4300	   560		 440	 325	 210	  90
> 4700	   460		 345	 235	 125	  20	
> 5100	   360	         255	 155	  50	 -55
> 
> all figures assumes standard temp.  SE service ceiling is 7500.
                                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
My understanding was that the service ceiling of an aircraft was
the altitude at which the plane could no longer maintain a 500 fpm
rate of climb.  Am I mistaken?  If not, how does the C310I rate a
service ceiling of 7500 when it cannot climb at 500 fpm much above
sea level even at the lightest weight charted?

Mark Rowe       Corvallis, OR       PP-SEL G I       Comanche N5943P
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: barrk@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (Keith Barr)
Subject: Single Twin Performance (Was: Twin Beech...)
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 23:44:15 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.041119.18763@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> hutton@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (ed Hutton ext. 6488) writes:
>I can think of several reasons why I might want to fly a twin.
>An extra engine is not one of them. The single engine performance
>numbers I have read are pretty weak. Any twin drivers want to
>post some of the climb figures from their POH?

These figures are for a Beechcraft Duchess 76 (an underpowered twin some say):

All use ISA
Rate of Climb for altidude and weight
Altitude      3900lbs   3400lbs   2800lbs
  SL            230       380      600(est)
 5000            80       240      460
10000           -70        80      250

Remember ISA is fairly chilly.
        BEW = ~2700 lbs
100 gallons =   600 
     2 Pasx =   350
            -------------
               3650 lbs is typical for takeoff.
I fly out of BJC, elevation 5657 msl, so a summer takeoff where an engine
dies would not be much fun...thank goodness for 9000 feet of cement.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Keith Barr             | What is Silver Nitrate?   |    Aerospace Engineer
-----------------------|                           |-------------------------
Commercial Pilot/Inst. | Rental fee on the Lone    | barrk@tramp.colorado.edu  
Single & Multi/IGI     | Ranger's horse after dark |       barr@ncar.ucar.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Steve.Campbell@f47.n282.z1.tdkt.kksys.com (Steve Campbell)
Sender: FredGate@tdkt.kksys.com
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: MSP Fly-In Proposal
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1992 23:52:00 -0600

It might also interest you that ANE FBO called Anoka Flight Training is
planning an airplane auction October 10'th and 11'th.  He says that he
is expecting 100 airplanes.  Unfortunately ANE is up on the north end
of town, but some of tou might finfd it interesting.
Steve Campbell
campbell@ee.umn.edu

 * Origin: FlightLine BBS {MSP} MN USRdual 612-544-5118 (1:282/47.0)
From: rl@socrates.ucsf.edu (Robert Langridge)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Soaring decisions (was: ...long boring flights)
Date: 7 Sep 92 11:50:07 GMT
Organization: UCSF Computer Graphics Lab

rmiller@i88.isc.com (Richard J. Miller) writes:

>In article <rl.715520553@cgl.ucsf.edu> rl@socrates.ucsf.edu (Robert Langridge) writes:
>..
>>As one leading competitive 
>>pilot (I believe it was AJ Smith, but may have been George Moffat) once 
>>remarked some years ago, if you aren't thinking all the time, and making 
>>serious decisions at least once a minute, you probably aren't going very far.  
>probably Moffat, circa 1973-5 when he was developing his theory of points
>per minute (and winning just about everything in sight ...)

My Silver (altitude, distance and duration) was all done in New Joisey 
(*Central* NJ, flying a 1-26 out of Trenton-Robbinsville, not up in the 
wilds of northern NJ :-) in 1974 and Moffat lived and taught a few miles up 
the road, and generally regarded  by sailplane pilots as little short of 
a deity, so I thought Rich was probably right.  However, I looked back at 
my old "Proceedings of the First Annual Symposium on Competitive Soaring" 
dated Mar 8 & 9 1969 (edited by Ed Byars and Bill Holbrook) and find, in a 
panel discussion on "Factors Influencing Crucial Decisions" (page 55) this 
by AJ in the verbatim report:

"You can actually time yourself and say, if you haven't been making or
reviewing decisions, really basic decisions, at the rate of several
per minute, that you've been asleep." 

There are discussions by both AJ Smith and George Moffat in this, and in
succeeding symposia.  Both were fierce competitors, sometimes resented
by the more easygoing pilots.  But they won, and as Rich says, won often.

Bob Langridge				Phone: +1 415 476-2630, -1540, -5128
Computer Graphics Laboratory		               FAX: +1 415 476-0688 
926 Medical Sciences
University of California	                    E-Mail: rl@cgl.ucsf.edu
San Francisco  CA  94143-0446 
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: hchong@netcom.com (Hoi Chong)
Subject: Re: Medical Certificate
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 06:48:18 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

From article <BuJtCJ.LzE@acsu.buffalo.edu>, by v064myby@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Christophe J Quaranta):
> 
> 	This is my first time posting on this board.  I have been flying
> "wet goo" power models for some time and have recently been toying with
> the idea of flying a full size plane with me in it.
> 	I've read a little on the requirements for getting a private 
> license (hours or solo flight required & so forth), I keep seeing this 
> requirement of having a medical certificate. What's involved in getting
> one?

I just got mine few days ago -- $60 plus "health".  I thought it was much 
less stringent than the "standard medical" I received (and passed) after 
accepting employment at a BIG company a few years ago.  Go to any FAA 
district office and ask for a list of local FAA medical examiners. 

Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: hgp@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (howard.page)
Subject: Re: Interstate Landing--Not such a good idea
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 13:14:57 GMT
Keywords: Emergency Landing Road Interstate


If my mind serves me correctly (which it usually doesn't),
I understand the NY State Thruway has a fee specifically
for landing one's airplane on the Thruway, something like
$150 (ten years ago???)

'anyone know for sure?

Howard
From: hurvitz@oscar.UUCP (Dennis Hurvitz)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: slandering twins
Date: 15 Sep 92 21:16:48 GMT

In article <BuE42t.ML3.2@cs.cmu.edu>, dst+@cs.cmu.edu (Dave Touretzky) writes:

> 
> PS: for people wondering about the advantages of having a second engine,
> remember that you spend very little time in takeoff configuration; most of
> your time is spent in cruise.  An engine failure in cruise is no big deal to
> a twin driver.  It's something to think about when you're flying over a
> large body of water, or hazardous terrain, or in hard IMC at night.

i lost one during an ils approach in feb '91 in ft lauderdale. i didn't
bother going thru the drill, i left the gear down, added a little power
and maintained the glideslope. normal landing. didn't feather, didn't
nuttin. funny thing was, the yaw damper was engaged, and although the
right engine failed, the airplane yawed to the *left*, courtesy of the
yaw damper. took a second to figure out wtf.

i whole heartedly agree with alot of the above. i'm still looking for
rotating beacons when crossing terrain at night, always pretending i'm
a loran or gps so i know where the next aerodrome is...

our classic point of contention though is in those few seconds as the
gear is coming up on departure. i *still* maintain that if you don't
feather the sick engine while it is still windmilling 800+ (or whatever)
rpm, then some of these monsters *will* lock into fine pitch (high rpm)
high drag.... although healthy engines windmill ok enough, sick
engines are tempermental, knowhatimean ?
     
:)    just thought i'd throw that in for old times sake..


dennis hurvitz
cutlass n5271u
duchess n6009k
mei
From: ron@pilot.njin.net (Ron Natalie)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Flying saves money (sic)
Date: 6 Sep 92 23:27:17 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

> Aviation fuel taxes and ticket charges go into the Aviation Trust Fund,
> which supports capital investment (airports, facilities, equipment,
> etc.).

But it doesn't actually get spent.  The trust fund has been imobilized
the last few years because it is used to hocus-pocus demonstrate that
the deficit isn't as bad as it realy is.

-Ron
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: bullock@watson.bms.com (JOAN BULLOCK)
Subject: Wrong Way Corrigan
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Keywords: transatlantic
Organization: Bristol Myers Squibb Pharmaceutical Research Institute
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 19:53:00 GMT


I see by the old EAA calender on the wall that next friday, Sept 25 is 
Wrong Way Corrigan Day.  Is anyone out there suffiently familiar with the 
history rather than the myth to post the full unadulterated story?  

Did Corrigan truly set out from Long Island (I believe) for the west coast 
and wind up in Ireland?  Or was that just a cover story and his destination 
actually was Europe.  Hearsay subscribes to both versions - with equal 
conviction. 

Would appreciate it if someone would solve this burning mystery.  Or at 
least post a source.


Thanks in advance,

Joan Bullock
Warrior N2227Z
bullock@bms.com