HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Violinist in Joan Crawford movie?
From: thayes@desire.wright.edu
Date: 29 Jul 92 10:02:58 EST
Organization: Wright State University 


I saw a movie last week about a violinist.  The movie was made probably in
the 1930's.  It starred Joan Crawford as the woman jilted by the violinist's
devotion to his music.  At the end she ... well I won't spill the beans.

But anyway, does anyone know the title of the film?  And furthermore, does 
anyone know who the violinist was on the movie's (primitive) sound track?
In the parts of the movie I saw, he played Bizet's Carmen suite and much
of the overture to *Tristan und (I never get this name right!)*.


Thanks!

-----ted hayes
From: prevost@linc.cis.upenn.edu (Scott Prevost)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Can you tell me the name of this piece of music?
Date: 27 Jul 92 22:16:43 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

>AB RAHIM,HARMAN SHAM writes:
>
>	Yesterday, while watching the first day of Olympic gymnastic    
>competition, I noticed that a piece of music is played over and over
>again to accompany the competitors.  I'm wondering if anyone can identify
>this piece of music.

I only watched briefly, but I seem to recall hearing "La Campanella"
from a Paganini violin concerto.  I'm familiar with this piece
primarily from Liszt's transcription for piano.



===============================================================================
Scott Prevost                    || Predictions:        || "We're enjoying
prevost@linc.cis.upenn.edu       ||                     || sluggish times, and
Computer and Information Science || Clinton-Gore in '92 || not enjoying them
University of Pennsylvania       || Flyers in '95       || very much."  G. Bush
===============================================================================
From: lionel@cs.city.ac.uk (Lionel Tun)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Borodin (was: Dvorak)
Keywords: Dvorak
Date: 23 Jul 92 12:17:02 GMT
Organization: City University, London

In article <1992Jul17.141214.7912@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> jefrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Jason E Frank) writes:
>In article <1992Jul17.125003.6340@city.cs> lionel@cs.city.ac.uk (Lionel Tun) writes:
>>
>>Have you tried Alexander Borodin? His String Quartet No 2 for example
>>or his symphonies. 
>
>While we're on the subject, does any of you have a favorite reading of
>Borodin's Quartet No. 2?  I have the one done by the Emerson Quartet which
>I'm very fond of, but I'm interested in alternative interpretations 
>(especially any which are paired with his No. 1).  Thanks.
>--j.e.f.

I cannot decide between the Cleveland Quartet on Telarc (coupled with
Smetana Qt 1) and the Brodsky Quartet on Teldec. I actually saw the
Brodsky Qt and they are a very tight group. The Cleveland are very
polished and sound good.

--
Lionel Tun   (lionel@cs.city.ac.uk)
Vision Group, City University, London, EC1V 0HB. 071-477 8000 x 3889
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: lampson@tellabs.com (Dave Lampson)
Subject: Re: Liszt/Schubert Soires de Vienne
Organization: Tellabs, Inc., IL
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 22:18:44 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.084911.21177@discus.technion.ac.il> sorin@techunix.technion.ac.il (Goldenberg Sorin) writes:
>Is there some recording of this on tape ?

There definitely is a recording on CD, and the catalogs say that this is 
available on cassette as well (419499-4).  It's the "Horowitz in Moscow"
release:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CHOPIN                 Mazurka #7                             Op.  7/3       DDD
                       Mazurka #21                            Op. 30/4    
LISZT                  "Annees de Pelerinage" Second Year:    S. 161/5
                          Italy "Sonetto #104 del Petrarca"
                       Caprice - Waltz "Soirees de Vienne"    S. 427  
MOSZKOWSKI             "Etincelles"                           Op. 36/6
MOZART, W.A.           Sonata #10               C Major       K. 330  
RACHMANINOV            Polka "de W.R."                                
                       Prelude                                Op. 32/ 5   
                       Prelude                                Op. 32/12   
SCARLATTI, D.          Sonata                                 K. 380  
SCHUMANN, R.           "Traumerei"                                    
SCRIABIN               Etude                                  Op.  2/1
                       Etude                                  Op.  8/12   
Piano                        HOROWITZ, Vladimir
Deutsche Grammophon                                   419499-2       (1)   58:04
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: minimalism
Originator: news@ernie.Princeton.EDU
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:30:15 GMT

In article <BrrFJG.EF@quake.sylmar.ca.us> 
brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder) writes:
>I'm glad to hear that "minimalism" is not your "favorite"  genre, 

Um, were you talking to someone?  I don't see any attribution line...

>but how can you justify having any desire to listen to it?  

Huh?  Why do desires need to be justified? Do I need to justify my
desire for a chocolate chip cookie?  If I like one, I like one.

Now, while we're at it, tell me what this unnamed person's *obligation*
to justify it might be?  What's it to YOU if he or she likes to listen?
Why assume that they're doing something horribly irrational, just
because you don't understand their reasons?  

>Or are you another of these "Lustigians"

Ever ready with the inaccurate insult, eh, Brian?

>who don't think that there is any way to evaluate musical quality aside from 
>knee-jerk emotionalism which is beyond explanation?

Where do you get that, Brian?  Have I ever claimed that, or anything
like it? 

I see that your memory is as faulty as your reasoning and reading
skills, not that I'm surprised.  

Nowhere have I *ever* claimed that there are no ways to evaluate
musical quality.  I have, however, argued that these ways are
context-dependent and not universal, and that they must be derived from
knowledge and experience of a particular culture, and cannot be derived
from first principles.  

>P.S. Yes, I am back!

And you still haven't learned even to keep your line length down.  

Roger
>
From: jamesc@bassclar.Eng.Sun.COM (James Langdell)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: 20th c. "teaching pieces" for piano
Date: 27 Jul 1992 18:01:16 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Distribution: world
Reply-To: jamesc@bassclar.Eng.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: bassclar

There's several sets of graded pieces by Tansman that I've played
with pleasure as an adult.

I hope the music you've found by Nielsen includes a collection
of 5-finger pieces by him (I forget the title).  Those pieces are
so musical (not simply pedagogical) that I played through about
ten of them before I realized that my fingers hadn't moved from
their starting position in each piece.  

--James Langdell    jamesc@eng.sun.com
  Sun Microsystems  Mountain View, Calif.



Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: music@moravian.edu (Steve Heller)
Subject: Re: Question about "Carmina Burana"
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 10:14:12 EDT

In <1992Jul23.213950.20514@nntpd.lkg.dec.com> tsai@tecrus.enet.dec.com (Kuo-Yeang Tsai) writes:


>I am going to attend the "Carmina Burana" concert at Tanglewood this
>coming Augst 8th and I have a question which has been on my mind for
>a long time.

>Why does it (Carmina Burana) sound demoniac? 

>Even without reading the somewhat offensive lyrics, friend asked
>"Is this Satan-worshipping music?" upon hearing the first few 
>passages.

The opening, 'O fortuna', is indeed ominous, but the only reason
people might associate it with Satanism is because it has been used
countless times in films, taking advantage of the raw, primitive power
of the opening and closing theme. The lyrics, however, are not even
slightly 'evil', but simply glorifying 'fate and fortune', empress of
the world (in a metaphorical sense). In actuality, the vast bulk of
the work is much less ominous than the opening/closing, dealing mostly
with pagan love and life, not demon-worship. And I personally don't
think the rise of Nazism had anything to do with the music, despite
its menacing tone. 
-- 
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
#   "Who let all this riff-raff into the room?!?" - The Surrogate Band    #
# Work: music@moravian.edu  <#!AMIGA!#>  Home: moravian.edu!vortex!lothar #
#           [ All opinions are strictly MY OWN! Hands off! ]              #
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: lampson@tellabs.com (Dave Lampson)
Subject: Re: Smetana [was: Borodin (was: Dvorak)]
Keywords: Dvorak
Organization: Tellabs, Inc., IL
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 22:51:30 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.215210.16147@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> spg@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Stephen P. Guthrie) writes:
>
>What about a recommendation for Smatana's quartets (both of them). I can't
>find many recordings of both on a single cd, although the Medici (?) quartet
>have a recording on NimBus. 
>This gets only 1 1/2 stars in the Penguin guide. Would people agree that
>Medici's playing is not too good, oor would this be a reasonable choice?


The Medici is just a bit uneven.  I really like the Smetana Quartet (makes
sense doesn't it Borodin Q. for Borodin, Smetana Q. for Smetana).  I'm not
sure if this is still available, but it is still listed.  It also got great 
reviews from 5 different reviewers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SMETANA                Quartet #1 in E minor "From My Life"                  DDD
                       Quartet #2 in D minor
Smetana Quartet                        
Denon                                                 33C37-7339     (1)   45:55
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


-- 

Dave
lampson@tellabs.com

For detailed lists of Recommended Classical CDs, Basic Repertoire and Buying
Guide access cs.uwp.edu (131.210.1.4) by anonymous FTP, or email me for info.

Contribute to the rec.music.classical biography project!  Email me your bio!

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: music@moravian.edu (Steve Heller)
Subject: Re: Complete Set of LvB Piano Sonatas
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 09:54:32 EDT

In <LEE.92Jul23143842@meercat.wang.com> lee@wang.com (Lee Story) writes:


>Who gives a damn about hi-fi?  My favorite Prokofiev is still Richter's
>1960 Carnegie Hall live recording of the 6th Sonata---insanely great
>performance, terrible sound.

I'd like to hear that one!

>Has anyone reviewed Richard Goode's Beethoven recordings?  I've heard
>raves, but haven't seen them in nearby stores.
>--
I have the late sonatas by Goode. For the most part I think they are
excellent. I particullarly enjoy the Hammerklavier. He does something
just slightly 'off' in op.111 however (IMHO). I prefer Chas. Rosen and
Brendel in this one, but otherwise the Goode are great! He does some
fine Schubert as well...
-- 
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
#   "Who let all this riff-raff into the room?!?" - The Surrogate Band    #
# Work: music@moravian.edu  <#!AMIGA!#>  Home: moravian.edu!vortex!lothar #
#           [ All opinions are strictly MY OWN! Hands off! ]              #
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rwilmer@zinka.mitre.org (R. Wilmer)
Subject: Re: Emmanuel Chabrier
Organization: Mitre Corporation, McLean, VA
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 20:05:13 GMT

In article <CB.92Jul21123323@tamarack13.timbuk> cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster) writes:

>I've read that Chabrier was influential in
>the development of...  something or other...orchestration, maybe? 

Chabrier developed a new style of French composition at a time
when French composers were mainly divided into the schools of
Saint-Saens and Franck.  His influence was on Satie, Poulenc,
and some of their followers (Auric, Honneger).

Richard - rwilmer@gateway.mitre.org

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Re: Liverpool Oratorio - McCartney & Davis
In-reply-to: diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au's message of Tue, 21 Jul 1992 08:37:43 GMT
Organization: pubs
	<1992Jul21.083743.17520@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Date: 22 Jul 92 17:09:49 CDT

I wrote:
   
   : >It's not a new genre.  There's been a lot of music trying to straddle
   : >classical and jazz or pop.  Gershwin and Bernstein made the idea work,
   : >but it's hard to think of very many other successful examples.  

John R. Dooley writes:

   : Ravel's piano concerto. 
   : Some of Milhaud's ballet music.
   : Copland mixed jazz into some of his music.

Diarmuid Pigott writes (summary):

   John Lewis/Gunther Schuller/William Russo: Third Stream Music, 
     In Memoriam ...
   Russo/Corky Siegal/Seiji Ozawa: Street Music, 3 Pieces for Blues 
     Band and Piano
   Eberhard Weber ...

Ravel, Milhaud, and Copland did a good job of bringing a jazz *sound*
into classical music, as did Martinu, but these strike me as similar to
the many uses of folk styles in classical music, in that it's still
classical at heart.  I posted a note about Third Stream jazz a few
months ago.  In third stream, people such as (early) Kenton seem to
refine and intellectualize their jazz styles with a "classical" feel,
but to me they're still not really straddling the line, though the
resulting music is often great.  (My latest kick in this area is Gil
Evans's work from the late 50s such as Out of the Cool.)  I've heard
only a few examples of Lewis's and Schuller's attempts, but to me they
didn't work too well.  So perhaps I'm splitting hairs, but most
claimants to crossover status that I've heard struck me as either not
truly fusing the two kinds of music, or not quite successful.  (I'd bet
anyone in this forum could instantly identify which side of the fence a
given work came from.)  But I like most of the attempts.

Chris Brewster
From: ttak@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tim Takahashi)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Complete Set of LvB Piano Sonatas(wrong notes)
Date: 24 Jul 92 01:19:17 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <13075.2a6ef60c@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu> egras@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu writes:
>> Hear hear.  If your highest priorities for Beethoven performance are
>> the fewest wrong notes, the steadiest tempos, and the best recorded
>> sound, then Schnabel is not for you.  But some of us have other
>> priorities....

>>   Modern tape-splicing and competitions, which emphasize
>> technical perfection, have conditioned us to overreact to wrong notes;
>> and one's ear can adjust to 1930s recordings

>	I really don't understand this tolerance for wrong notes and uneven
>tempos (I am not talking about a little rubato used).   When do you agree that
>there are too many wrong notes?
>	It seems to me that once a performer decides to record a piece, then
>he has agreed to be up to the challenge of playing it correctly.  I, for one,
>believe that my ear shouldn't have to adjust to wrong notes.  An excellant
>recording consists of a pleasable interpretation of the notes in the piece and
>none of these wrong notes.

First of all, before the advent of magnetic tape in the late 1940's all 
recording work was done "direct-to-disk." A disk mastering lathe was set up,
and the master disk was cut on the spot while the music played. In such
a recording there is no ability to correct mistakes except to record another
"side." (There are notable exceptions to this rule, many Toscanini recordings
were assembled by remastering several different sides into a single composite
side - see "The Other Side of the Record," by Charles O'Connell) 

Because period recordings were "live," we must judge them by the standrds
of a broadcast concert, not a commercially processed recording. By those
standards, Schnabel was not a particularly sloppy technician (certainly
not compared with Paderewski!). 

The sound of the 1930's is generally pleasant. Lacking a bit in the extremes.
The microphone style, particularly for Piano recordings, tends to give a
very "live" concert-hall perspective. The "Attack of the giant killer
Hammerklavier" microphone style came later.

The "loose" tempo of the past has a corrolary, a "mechanical" tempo of the
present. Schnabel was never known for histrionics, either....


To the original poster, I offer these words of wisdom. Try to find a
single disk of Artur Schnabel playing some Beethoven Sonata's. Listen
and judge for yourself! This man has been considered one of the foremost
Beethoven interpreters of all time. Do you care for his interpretation?

tim

.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: carnes@engin.umich.edu (Richard Carnes)
Subject: Re: Complete Set of LvB Piano Sonatas
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 92 09:37:51 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

tony@cns.nyu.edu (Tony Movshon) writes:

>In article 197@spchsys.spchsys, jjt@spchsys.spchsys (John J. Turley)
>writes:
>> One thing I would recommend you avoid then is the recordings by Artur
>> Schnabl. These were done in the 1930's, and there are occasional mistakes.
>> I am also not so keen on the interpretation... Perhaps if they had been
>> done in the 1980's, they would have recorded with much better equipment
>> and spliced out the execution errors.
>
>Oh, please! Schnabel's Beethoven sonatas are one of the great triumphs
>of the art of recording, and for many (myself included) remain the
>standard against which all other interpretations are judged (usually
>unfavorably).  The sound is 1930s sound, for sure. So what? In this
>case, it doesn't make sense to dwell on its shortcomings, just enjoy
>the music for what it is.

Hear hear.  If your highest priorities for Beethoven performance are
the fewest wrong notes, the steadiest tempos, and the best recorded
sound, then Schnabel is not for you.  But some of us have other
priorities....

If you are choosing between integral sets of the Beethoven sonatas, I
would recommend the Schnabel as your first set, especially considering
the price.  Modern tape-splicing and competitions, which emphasize
technical perfection, have conditioned us to overreact to wrong notes;
and one's ear can adjust to 1930s recordings, as one can learn to
enjoy black-and-white movies.  Listen to Schnabel's recording of the
last five sonatas if you want to understand why many regard him as the
finest Beethoven pianist of the century.

Richard Carnes
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: colby@tsd.arlut.utexas.edu (Colby Leider)
Subject: Carmina Burana
Organization: None here.
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 17:03:59 GMT


WHAT IS THE DEAL WITH CARMINA BURANA???!?!?!

IT'S JUST A PIECE O' MUSIC!!!!  YEAH, IT'S NEAT & ALL THAT,
BUT GET A LIFE!!!!!!




From: knotts@hpl-opus.hpl.hp.com (Tom Knotts)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 00:03:56 GMT
Subject: Re: Clavieruebung
Organization: HP Labs, High Speed Electronics Dept., Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical

> 
> This is an interesting question.  The "Clavieruebung" in general is a
> set of four published works by Bach, probably intended to show off the
> possibilities of various keyboard instruments.

I beleive that it also served as a study for keyboard players.
"Clavieruebung" translates as 'keyboard practice".

> The first volume is six
> Partitas (suites of pieces based on dance forms);

Composed for a single manual harpsichord.

> the second volume is
> two more harpsichord pieces, the Italian Concerto and the French
> Overture.

Composed for a two manual harpsichord. That is, it is required to
simultaneously play on two different keyboards, one set to forte,
the other piano. This is accomplished by using two 8' strings for
the former, and a single 8' for the latter.

> These are two imitations of orchestral music; concerti were
> generally for a string orchestra with one or more soloists, and big
> suites with overtures (the word "overture" here being shorthand for
> "overture-and-suite") wer elikewise often the province of the orchestra.
> Part of the point here is the contrast in national styles.

A large amount of Bach's keyboard music is really orchestral music
written out for the keyboard.

> 
> The fourth volume is the Goldberg Variations, an exhaustive catalogue of
> variation styles, canon styles, and so on.

Again written for two keyboards. Almost all the movements are to be
played on different keyboards. Not for a contrast in volume as in part
2, but because the right- and left-hand parts frequently cross over one
another.

> indeed an astonishing piece (I assume you mean the first of the two
> settings);  it is a rare example of fugal counterpoint in six parts
> (with the pedals uncharacteristically taking two lines at once).

This is not the only instance that Bach uses double pedal. He does
so at the end of the prelude in D major, for example (sorry, don't
remember the BWV).

> There are some pieces in the German Organ Mass which are not
> chorale-based.  These include the prelude and fugue that begin and end
> the work, and the four duets.  Preludes and fugues were used at organ
> concerts and as music before and after a service.

The prelude is one of Bach's finest preludes. In addition to being a
very enjoyable piece to hear, it is filled with hidden Chrisitian
symbolism which is always amusing to contemplate.

Tom

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: lksmith@truth.uucp (Smith)
Subject: Re: Cut Out Classical
Organization: The MITRE Corp., Bedford, Ma.
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 13:26:16 GMT

In article <l7ft3mINNqp1@news.bbn.com> delatizk@bbn.com (Jonathan Delatizky) writes:
>spg@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Stephen P. Guthrie) writes:
>
>>What happens to cds that have been deleted from the catalogs?
>
>Many music (I hesitate to use the term "record" anymore!) stores do now have
>a section for cutouts - the Boston branch of Tower, for example - and there
>are also mail order outlets that also carry them.  Berkshire Music Outlet (I
>may have garbled their name), which used to be a major source of cutout LPs,
>now has a large CD section in their catalog.  (I don't have their address
>handy, so can't include it here.  Perhaps someone else will.)

Last time I was there (a few years ago) it was the Berkshire _Record_
Outlet, I believe (considering Jonathan's comment about the term "record"
it's not impossible they've gone with the flow).  And they had moved
to a new place, just off exit 2 of the Mass. Pike, putting them on
Route 102 in Lee, Massachusetts.  There's a slight chance they're
actually in Stockbridge, but I don't think so.  Directory assistance
as of two minutes ago :-) gives their number as 1-413-243-4080.  I was
about to call them to check the address but I recall that they don't
open till 11 am.  (Nice hours! :-) )

I haven't been there recently, but when I was there they had an excellent
selection and I found some terrific items at good prices.  Definitely
recommended.

Hope this helps.

Linda
----------------------- 
lksmith@truth.mitre.org  

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: scridd@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (JEFFREY RIDDLEBAUGH)
Subject: Re: Can you tell me the name of this piece of music?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date: 31 Jul 1992 11:04 EST  

In article <64442@hydra.gatech.EDU>, gt5571d@prism.gatech.EDU (AB RAHIM,HARMAN SHAM) writes...
>Hi!
>	Yesterday, while watching the first day of Olympic gymnastic    
>competition, I noticed that a piece of music is played over and over
>again to accompany the competitors.  I'm wondering if anyone can identify
>this piece of music.  Your help is very much appreciated.
> 

I believe that it was from the Paganini Violin Concerto No. 2, last
movement.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical