HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Nigel.Allen@f438.n250.z1.fidonet.org (Nigel Allen)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: APTA commuter rail conference
Date: 9 Apr 92 06:28:06 GMT


Here is a press release from the American Public Transit Association.

 APTA Celebrates Growth of Commuter Rail at Conference in
Washington April 12-15
 To: Assignment Desk, Transportation Writer
 Contact: Chip Bishop of the American Public Transit Association,
          202-898-4114

   WASHINGTON, April 7 /U.S. Newswire/ -- As cities across the
country rediscover commuter rail, public transportation's proven
alternative, the American Public Transit Association is celebrating
the mode's re-emergence at the Fifth Annual APTA Commuter Rail
Conference, April 12-15, at the Hyatt Regency Hotel here.
   Virginia DOT Secretary John G. Milliken and Maryland DOT
Secretary James Lighthizer will speak at the opening general
session, Monday, April 13, at 10 a.m.  Immediately following the
session at noon, Milliken and Lighthizer will hold a news
conference at Union Station, Gate C, to discuss the emerging role
of commuter rail in their states.
   Other keynote speakers at the conference, hosted by Amtrak,
Maryland's MARC commuter line and the new Virginia Railway Express,
include Federal Railroad Administrator Gilbert Carmichael, Federal
Transit Administrator Brian Clymer, Amtrak President W. Graham
Claytor, and Del. Eleanor Holmes Norton (D-D.C.)
   Hundreds of commuter rail general managers, board members and
others will attend the conference, which will include a series of
workshops on commuter rail operations, finance, technology, and
planning, as well as tours of maintenance facilities, state-of-the
art customer information systems, and newly-renovated Union Station
in the nation's capital.
   Top transit officials in attendance will include APTA Vice
Chairman Louis J. Gambaccini, general manager and CEO of
Philadelphia's SEPTA transit system; Rod Diridon of Santa Clara
County, Calif., APTA's vice president for rail transit; and Peter
Stangl, chairman of the New York Metropolitan Transportation
Authority.
   The conference is being planned by the APTA Commuter Rail
Committee, chaired by Michael J. Nielsen, senior director of
corporate administration, Metra commuter line in Chicago.  Edward
Gregerman, APTA's director of rail technology, is the staff
advisor.
   APTA is the international association of operating transit
authorities, their suppliers and others interested in the
advancement of transit service.
 -30-
 /distributed by U.S. Newswire  202-347-2770/
--  
Nigel Allen - via FidoNet node 1:250/98
INTERNET: Nigel.Allen@f438.n250.z1.FIDONET.ORG
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: brennan@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Joseph Brennan)
Subject: Re: Rail Maps in General (was Re: Rail Maps - Wisc,Mich)
Reply-To: brennan@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Joseph Brennan)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 18:49:34 GMT

In article <1992Apr3.180631.19951@cbnewsh.cb.att.com>
fwk@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (f.w.kerfoot..iii) writes:

>Are maps of this sort which show all rail lines and perhaps abandoned 
>rights-of-way on a larger scale than tourist maps available for other
>parts of the US? My particular interest would be central New Jersey,

You don't say anything about the topographic maps made by the US
Geological Survey, so let me put in a word for them.  Check your local
library, which either has local ones or can tell you what regional
library does.  These show enough detail to trace most abandoned
routes.  You can buy your own copies of them too, but to see a few
counties worth at once you probably will do well enough to start at a
library collection.

As a companion to the topos, you need some older maps.  To some
extent, you could just use old atlases, particularly the state maps in
atlases by Rand McNally and Hammond, which used to go into great
detail about railroads.  Another resource in a larger (or older) local
library would be one or more of those county atlases that were popular
in the late 19th Century to about 1910-- they show tremendous detail,
usually buildings and property ownership, and since most of the
railroad network was in by 1900, they show almost all railroads that
ever existed in the area being covered.

Central Jersey, eh?  In a small bookstore in the visitor center at
Batsto Village in south Jersey-- ever been there? state park, nice
restored village-- I found some reprints of a few different old New
Jersey state maps showing railroads in fine detail.  They come rolled
up.  I'm sure one can get them elsewhere but that's the only place I
ever saw them. Only a couple of dollars each.  If you visit Allaire
Village, and what railfan in central Jersey could miss that one,
check out the store there too.  I found a small book there about 
Point Pleasant Beach trolleys!

Joe Brennan
From: Steve_Hooper@mindlink.bc.ca (Steve Hooper)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Crossing Gate Rules and Laws
Date: 8 Apr 92 00:11:07 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada


Canadian laws and the CROR say that no part of a train or movement (thus this
encompasses a train going over the crossing or someone switching) may block a
public crossing for more than five minutes.

                - Steve

--

 steve_hooper@mindlink.bc.ca   []  Riding the "High Iron" of
 OR      a777@mindlink.bc.ca   []         CP Rail
 The Great White North in      []
 Vancouver, BC CANADA          [] Opinions are mine, NOT CP's
From: 31ochs@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: It's hard to love a GE
Date: 8 Apr 92 19:29:25 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

In article <LqkRiB1w164w@railnet.nshore.ORG>, rad@railnet.nshore.ORG (Rick DeMattia) writes:
> elw4@po.CWRU.Edu (Evan L. Werkema) writes:
> 
>> Anybody else like GE's?
> 
> When I used to work around the B&O railroad, my recollection is
> that the crews there generally liked the GE's.  More comfortable
> cabs, quieter cabs.  Yes, they loaded up differently from EMD's;
> the more competent trainmen understood that it was a difference
> and not necessarily a deficiency.
> 
> Though as I recall, the ladders were knee-killers!
> 
> --
> UUCP: {uunet|backbone}!nshore!railnet!rad   rad@railnet.nshore.org
> CompuServe: 72517.666@compuserve.COM

Up here in Michigan, the CSX crews generally don't like GE's, at least the
older ones. I've heard them tell me that they ride real rough, and the
doors won't stay shut on them, the just kinda bang open and closed.
One crew member I met even sat in an old GP30m without a radio, and carried
his own in there(the engine radio was missing) because he didn't want to
ride in the GE, which I think was a U36B, or B36-7.
Sorta like the Alco/MLW units that come through on the CP Rails to Chicago
The crew hate those too. Although watching them in a consist with EMD's
they really bounce, whereas the EMD's just ride smoothly.
The steps on an Alco are also real knee smashers I guess.

Fred Ochs

31OCHS@gw.wmich.edu   (VAX)
ochs@sol.cs.wmich.edu (UNIX)

_________________________________________________________________________
        _______________
       /_______________\__+--+_---_+--+__
    ___|[  ]| ###|  ###   ######|###### |
  | | ______|    |                      | |
  |_|/|_|___|____|______________________|_|
   H   \--/  \ \o/  o          /  \--/   H
___"__O----O__`---------------'__O----O__"_____

A GP30 with some imagination ;^)
From: s921886@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (James Chun Ng)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: BALTIMORE LIGHT RAIL!!!
Keywords: MTA, Oriole Park at Camden Yards, Metro, Light Rail, MARC, Park & Ride
Date: 11 Apr 92 05:40:58 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre, Melbourne Australia.

rnewman@bbn.com (Ron Newman) writes:

>In article <1992Apr4.064157.14092@wam.umd.edu>, gurd@next06csc.wam.umd.edu (Daffy Duck) writes:

>|> 2.  The line is largely single track, and that limits frequency to 15  
>|> minutes, and since there is street running involved only 2 car trains can
>|> be used.

>Why can't 4 or 6 car trains be used in street running?

>-- 
>Ron Newman		rnewman@bbn.com
Hi Ron:
In Australia we had mutiple trams running on the streets, Sydney and Adelaide, Sydeney closed it's system back in 1961, Adelaide is still running two car sets, other Austrlaian cities never had double sets let alone more.
Melbourne has the most modern type on tramcars even the articulated ones are designed to be able to run as mutiple units, but the coupler has not been installed, even so it is for towing the vehicle rather than coupling.
Don't know about your road enviorment in the states, but it is not possible to run "trains" on our city roads.
regards
from Down Under
James Ng
From: rambler@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Dan Meyer)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Soo U30c's?
Date: 8 Apr 92 22:45:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: orbit.7427
Organization: People-Net [pnet51], Minneapolis, MN.

jack@jato.jpl.nasa.gov (Jack Kobzeff) writes:
>In article <1992Apr04.033546.13544@mixcom.com>, Steven.Schultz@mixcom.mixcom.com (Steven.Schultz) writes:
>> 
>> The Soo Line had 10 U30Cs. #800-809. Serial numbers: 36715-36724. They were
>> delivered April '68: 800-802, May '68 803-807, and June '68 808-809. They were
>> retired Nov. '83-April '84, and were sent to E.M.D., McCook, IL, on trade-ins
>> for new SD-40-2s. They were then sent next door to Pielet Brothers' for
>> scapping, although I don't know if they ever were. They still might be there.
>
>Also, didn't SOO get some ex-MILW GE units? Or were they gone by that time?

The Soo did get some MILW GE units, however, the never ran for the Soo and
were traded for newer power, maybe the SD-60's...

-- Dan

Remember: " Buffalo never Oink " Seen on a South Dakota travel brocure.
Advertisment: Try the Railway Post Office , a railfan BBS ! (612) 377-2197.
UUCP: {crash tcnet}!orbit!pnet51!rambler
INET: rambler@pnet51.orb.mn.org
From: rogerm@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Roger Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: RR Crossing Fatality No train required
Date: 16 Apr 92 19:02:40 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA

Here in Fort Collins, Colorado we had a railroad related fatality on Mason 
Street.( The longest continous grade crossing in the U.S. on a main line
railroad) A 55 year old woman driving a moped got the front wheel of her
moped caught in the flange way which threw her off the bike and she was run
over by another car that was following her. There have been numerous injuries
to bicyclist due to getting wheels caught in flange ways causing the city
to pass an ordenance requiring cyclist to dismount before crossing railroad
tracks. The city has been sued over this in the past and there is a suit still
pending against the Fort Collins Municipal Railway from a girl who rode her
bike no hands over one of our crossings which was properly marked and broke
her collar bone.

				Roger Mitchell
				Master Mechanic: Ft. Collins Municipal Ry.
From: pierson@cimcad.enet.dec.com (Dave Pierson)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Playing Chicken!!!
Keywords: grade crossings, incidents, history
Date: 14 Apr 92 21:56:07 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

In article <1992Apr13.194836.4861@cbnewsd.cb.att.com>, clb@cbnewsd.cb.att.com
(carl.l.blesch) writes, in part:

>I've heard two theories about why car-drivers inadvertantly or
>not-so-inadvertantly tangle with trains.
	
	To paraphrase that noted Rail traveller, Sherlock Holmes:

		It is a capital mistake to theorize in advance of the facts.

	(directed at the theorists, not at Carl...)

>One is that since passenger trains are not part of the mainstream culture
>anymore, the public in general doesn't have an appreciation for railroads or
>an internalized concept of the power, mass, momentum, (pick whatever the
>appropriate physics 101 term is) that trains have - both in terms of stopping
>distance and crushing potential.

	I happen to have stumbled on some studies of this.  By a professional
	historian.  The problem was a bad in 1900 as it is now.  AT least in
	terms of rhetoric expended.  Grade separation programs date back that
	far, at least.  The automobile & its (illusion) of protection made
	things worse.  (Racing the train to the crossing was not practical
	in a horse and buggy, or even a coach and four.).

> Secondly, there is no legal connotation to the flashing grade-crossing lights
>(I'm sure the lawbooks say it's illegal to go around a flashing signal, but
>people don't think of that).
	IMHO, (some) people don't think, period.  I mentioned in the past that
	BN had established a semi-mobile video cam setup.  They would outfit
	a grade crossing, video the violators & get the local PD to run them
	into court.  Done on a regular basis, this DOES reduce the incidents,
	'cause peole get the message.

>If it were a standard traffic signal, maybe people would think twice,
>having the gut feeling that they could be ticketed for going around it.
	Locally, we have a couple of crossings protected by "traffic light"
	type signals.  They may be marginally more effective.  But against the
	"dain bramaged" or terminal egotist, NOTHING is safe.
	(we had an incident, locally, of a teenage driver driving into the side
	of a MOVING train.  PAST the flashing lights.  First words out of their
	mouth, afterwords, were:

		But I'm a GOOD driver.  Really.
	
	Out of touch with reality....)

thanks
dave pierson			|the facts, as accurately as i can manage,
Digital Equipment Corporation	|the opinions, my own.
200 Forest St			|I am the NRA.
Marlboro, Mass		01752	pierson@cimnet.enet.dec.com
"He has read everything, and, to his credit, written nothing."  A J Raffles
From: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Montrealer Notice
Date: 17 Apr 92 17:26:34 GMT
Reply-To: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com (George Robbins)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <53380@mimsy.umd.edu> mangoe@cs.umd.edu (Charley Wingate) writes:
> George Robbins writes:
> 
> >Yeah, but in the case of DC, I'd put it the other way.  The old station
> >building has been refurbished and is quite nice, but it's not the train
> >station.  Over in the back corner is a little "station" which is kind of a
> >cross between airport and bus terminal styling, but reminds me most of a
> >miniature version of NY Penn station - low ceilings and a sense of
> >passengers as cargo, rather than people.
> 
> I think you're remembering a previous incarnation of the station, because it
> hasn't looked like this since the renovation was finished.  The station
> proper occupies about half of the lower level of the concourse, with an
> immense ticket counter, baggage areas, and the gates/waiting areas  (and
> most improbably, a McD's at one end-- golden arches and all).  The ceiling
> over the waiting area is the concourse roof, which is about 25 feet up.  The
> platforms haven't changed, but (at least to my eye) the platform area in DC
> has mostly been well-kept up.

Yes, this is probably the case.  It's been a few years since I was through
there and what you describe sounds like a major improvement from what I
remember.  It's kind of shame that DC is such a nice city for the motorist,
or I'd take the train more than once every n-years.

-- 
George Robbins - now working for,     uucp:   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr
but no way officially representing:   domain: grr@cbmvax.commodore.com
Commodore, Engineering Department     phone:  215-431-9349 (only by moonlite)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: johnm@hpmcaa.mcm.hp.com (John Mosbarger)
Subject: Re: SP/SF merger paint scheme spotted
Organization: HP Cardiology Business Unit - McMinnville, OR
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1992 16:17:58 GMT

gjs@wdl30.wdl.loral.com (Gregory Scott) writes:
> In article <10296@gollum.twg.com> nolan@twg.com writes:
> >
> >
> >Just last Friday, 3 April, I was waiting for the Caltrain commuter on San
> >Francisco's peninsula and spotted a GP9 in the Kodak paint job. I thought all
> >the old stuff was gone by now. So who knows how many units of which types
> >still wear that uniform? Where do they live? Feeble minds wanna know.
> >--
> >Nolan Hinshaw			Internet: nolan@twg.com
> >The Wollongong Group		Dingalingnet: (415)962-7197
> >Piobairi Uillean, San Francisco
> >		Ritheann an charr seo ar phoitin!
> >
> 
> I have seen two others within the last week:
> 
> 1. Tuesday March 31, southbound out of Lodi, CA leading a mix of
> TOFC & COFC. Didn't catch the number just had time to see it cross
> Lodi Ave headed out of town about 8:45am.
> 
> 2. Friday April 3, Ogden, UT Union Station, again didn't catch
> the number but I think I got one clean picture with the telephoto.
> Saw what I think was the same unit south of Salt Lake City about
> 11:30 am (fourth of four units).
> 
> Both units were extremely dirty.
> 
> Have Fun
> Greg Scott
> gjs@wdl1.wdl.loral.com

     In the Portland-Eugene pool there are at least 2 SD9's still in Koda-
chrome, 4363 and 4420.  They're ugly, too, but I never liked that scheme,
anyway.

--
John Mosbarger
HP McMinnville, OR
johnm@hpmcaa.mcm.hp.com
From: wbrill@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Warren Brill)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: B&O, BR&P, B&S, WA&G (was Re: Railway Lantern)
Date: 16 Apr 92 19:28:15 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA

In rec.railroad, sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames) writes:

> In article <1992Apr7.075039.2353@cevax.simpact.com> kclark@cevax.simpact.com (Ken J. Clark) writes:
> >In Message-ID: <IdrDKVu00Uh_A8Zy1I@andrew.cmu.edu>,
> >ap2z+@andrew.cmu.edu (Alan Edward Petrillo) writes:
**********[ LOTS of stuff DELETED ]****************
> 
> One of the many nicknames for the road was Beggers, Robbers, and Pickpocketors.
> Stan Ames
> BR&P/B&S SIG Coordinator.

Hey, all you guize wanna guess what Colorado Native was nicknamed the
Dangerous & Rapidly Getting Worse.  [Wait, I know this one.....]

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
o                                      ____i----i_________________     o
o    Warren T. Brill, a.k.a.         =|____|[][]|  #### #### #### |=   o
o    wbrill@hpxxx.fc.hp.com         i_|___/|____|\________________|_i  o
o    brill@handel.cs.colostate.edu  =++ ()=()=() ======= ()=()=() ++=  o
o                                  =================================== o
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
From: christen@hpspkla.spk.hp.com (Tim Christensen)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 18:55:28 GMT
Subject: Re: Crossing Gate Rules and Laws
Organization: Hewlett Packard Company, Spokane, Wa.
Newsgroups: rec.railroad

Of the 3 states I have lived in the following state statutes regulated blocked 
grade crossings:

Montana:  15 minutes at a public crossing.
          No limit for private crossings.

North Dakota: Varied according to county or city ordinance.  Usaully set at 10 -
15 minutes.

Washington:  State law indicates 15 minutes.  Local ordinaces may be more 
restrictive.  County of Spokane indicates 5 minutes.

These sorts of public safety laws ( usually this is the reason cited ) have
motivated railroads to eliminate grade crossings.  Throughout the BN system
grade crossings have been surveyed for traffic density ( auto traffic ) and 
applications to State and County boards have been made by the railroad to 
eliminate low use crossings.  Many times the railroad has even put in a gravel
road parallel to the tracks to take auto traffic to the neares high density 
protected grade crossing.  It is worth it for the railroad, since blocking a 
crossing especially crossings of passing tracks is common and involve up to 
45 minutes cutting and reassembling the train.  Also takes more trainmen to
accomplish.
From: nigel.allen@CANREM.COM (Nigel Allen)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: apta commuter rail conf.
Date: 11 Apr 92 00:00:00 GMT


Here is a press release from the American Public Transit Association.

 APTA Celebrates Growth of Commuter Rail at Conference in
Washington April 12-15
 To: Assignment Desk, Transportation Writer
 Contact: Chip Bishop of the American Public Transit Association,
          202-898-4114

   WASHINGTON, April 7 /U.S. Newswire/ -- As cities across the
country rediscover commuter rail, public transportation's proven
alternative, the American Public Transit Association is celebrating
the mode's re-emergence at the Fifth Annual APTA Commuter Rail
Conference, April 12-15, at the Hyatt Regency Hotel here.
   Virginia DOT Secretary John G. Milliken and Maryland DOT
Secretary James Lighthizer will speak at the opening general
session, Monday, April 13, at 10 a.m.  Immediately following the
session at noon, Milliken and Lighthizer will hold a news
conference at Union Station, Gate C, to discuss the emerging role
of commuter rail in their states.
   Other keynote speakers at the conference, hosted by Amtrak,
Maryland's MARC commuter line and the new Virginia Railway Express,
include Federal Railroad Administrator Gilbert Carmichael, Federal
Transit Administrator Brian Clymer, Amtrak President W. Graham
Claytor, and Del. Eleanor Holmes Norton (D-D.C.)
   Hundreds of commuter rail general managers, board members and
others will attend the conference, which will include a series of
workshops on commuter rail operations, finance, technology, and
planning, as well as tours of maintenance facilities, state-of-the
art customer information systems, and newly-renovated Union Station
in the nation's capital.
   Top transit officials in attendance will include APTA Vice
Chairman Louis J. Gambaccini, general manager and CEO of
Philadelphia's SEPTA transit system; Rod Diridon of Santa Clara
County, Calif., APTA's vice president for rail transit; and Peter
Stangl, chairman of the New York Metropolitan Transportation
Authority.
   The conference is being planned by the APTA Commuter Rail
Committee, chaired by Michael J. Nielsen, senior director of
corporate administration, Metra commuter line in Chicago.  Edward
Gregerman, APTA's director of rail technology, is the staff
advisor.
   APTA is the international association of operating transit
authorities, their suppliers and others interested in the
advancement of transit service.
 -30-
 /distributed by U.S. Newswire  202-347-2770/

Disclaimer: I don't work for APTA or any transit operator. I just think
that trains are neat (as are streetcars, since I live in Toronto, and I
just heard one joining by on College Street at 3:32 a.m.).
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario/Detroit, MI
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: jcj@tellabs.com (jcj)
Subject: Re^2: Rail Maps in General (was Re: Rail Maps - Wisc,Mich)
Organization: Wazmodyne Industries
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 13:39:28 GMT

In article <55BoiB1w161w@gator.rn.com> steveh@gator.rn.com (Steve Heininger) writes:
>fwk@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (f.w.kerfoot..iii) writes:
>
>> 
>> Are maps of this sort which show all rail lines and perhaps abandoned 
>> rights-of-way on a larger scale than tourist maps available for other
>> parts of the US? ...

>...  I also purchased recently at a Great AMerican Train show a route map
>of the NS.  ... He also had Conrail and other railroad maps ...

I've seen maps for CR, UP, NS, CSX, and WC at shows.  I've been told
SF doesn't publish a map, but I did find track charts at a show that
show all tracks, bridges, grade crossings, signals, all company and
lots of customer buildings, and rail and ballast types (!).  I'd
expect most railroads print these; finding them is another story.

-- 
			  jcj@tellabs.com