HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: byau@jarthur.claremont.edu (Ben Yau)
Subject: Re: Warriors big men
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 07:07:25 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.044305.24154@leland.Stanford.EDU> terry@leland.Stanford.EDU (Terry Wong) writes:
>In article <1993Jan7.030227.11740@muddcs.claremont.edu>, byau@jarthur.claremont.edu (Ben Yau) writes:
>
>Actually, last night was a fairly typical game for him.  There have other
>games where he has shot better.
>
>					terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU

thanks.. i had been hearing on the net about him, but I had to see it 

WID MAH OWN EYES to really believe it.  If he plays that well every
game, the Warriors really did well in teh draft.  

Also, Houston (the other rookie) played really well (as I mentioned
in previous post).  How does Nellie end up getting such good rookies?



ANOTHER NOTE:  so which of the sophs this year have gone down since
last year?  L.Johnson is still strong.  Mutumbo is alright, but not
being used effectively with the likes of Pack, Jackson, and Macon
being put to use by Issel.  I thjink in the sonics game he only scored 
5 pts (mutumbo).  

Owens... he's going down.
How about the others?  Is Steve Smith the next big point guard (big
meaning 'big' literally in the footsteps of Magic Johnson, albeit he
left pretty big imprints behind him)

How is Doug doing in Dallas? (or do I have to ask.. yeesh.. 2 wins.
I heard that he gets in foul trouble too often and too early)

Terrell?  STacey?  

just curious.. i haven't heard much about the sophs anywhere except
for LJ.

This year's rookie class is definitely going to be one for the ages.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Yau		    byau@jarthur.claremont.edu	          SHHHTEENKEE FOO FOO
---------------------------------
"Aw mom, you act like I'm not even wearing a bungie cord!"
						-Calvin from
						"Calvin and Hobbes"
				-----------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: donald@landru.mtc.ti.com (Don Ziegler)
Subject: Wanted: scores from 12/22
Keywords: n
Organization: Manufacturing Technology Center, Texas Instruments, Dallas
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:43:23 GMT


I'm looking for the NBA scores from December 22 to present.  The scores
that I'd have most trouble finding would be 12/22-12/27.  Please post
them, e-mail them, or tell me where I can find them.

Thanks.

Don    (donald@landru.mtc.ti.com)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: centeno@pasadena-dc.bofa.com (R. CENTENO)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Lakers are in Trouble
Date: 4 Jan 93 15:10:39 PDT
Organization: Bank America Systems Engineering, Pasadena, CA

In article <1i9vchINNfql@news.aero.org> robert@aero.org (R. S. Statsinger) writes:
|> 
|
|>In both cases, you would making a move to improve your team. But the 
|>above "deal" surely wouldn't open much salary room for Houston, and
|>anyway, who are they going to that would make this worthwhile? Re
|>the second point, Hakeem (a) asks for a raise and (b) stands up to
|>one of the worst front offices in basketball. This makes him a 
|>malcontent? Only to those who fall for the Rockets' party line...
|
|>Paul

>I have to agree with Paul's reasoning here. Last season, *perhaps* the
>Rockets might have nibbled at Scott, Worthy, and Vlade for Hakeem. This
>year, at least so far, I don't think they're even bothering to listen.
>You can say anything you want about the salary cap or trading malcontents;
>at this point, this trade would be foolish for the Rockets, and I think
>they know it.

	Alright, Alright!!  I have to admit (since i'm the one who started
this discussion), I just want to Lakers to make some kind of move that 
would make them just look good again.  I realy didn't give a Rat's Ass about
whether or not it would be a good move for the Rockets.  After all I'm a BIG
Laker fan (is that still a good thing to say???), and if the trade would make
the Rockets worse, that's even better. I foolishly was defending the Lakers'
crappy play earlier this season.  What was I thinking!!!!  They looked like 
SHIT again against the Bucks.  Vlade even had 20 pts.  I once said "When Vlade
decides to play and quit being lazy, they win".  Wrong!!!!!  I hate to say it,
but they need some serious work.  Somebody please let Jerry West know that I'm
NOT pleased so far...and to do something about it soon!!!

>			R.S.

			-Rob

>PS   Happy New Year, Guys (& Gals :-)

 What he said.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: hout@eastham.ma30.bull.com (dave hout)
Subject: Petro
Reply-To: hout@eastham.ma30.bull.com (dave hout)
Organization: Bull HN Information Systems
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 14:42:38 GMT

Hi,
	Could anyone out there tell me what happened to Drazen Petrovic?
I just heard he isn't playing tonite against the Celtics.  Is he on or going on the
IR?  Thanks.

Dave

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave Hout
hout@eastham.ma30.bull.com
508-294-2307					
Bull Worldwide Information Systems
300 Concord Rd. Billerica MA 01821 
MA30/850A
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: tamada@cheshire.oxy.edu (Michael K. Tamada)
Subject: Re: Protest system unfair? (Re: Suns file protest in San Antonio loss)
Organization: Occidental College, Los Angeles, CA 90041 USA.
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:39:18 GMT

In article <43332@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> cs163wav@sdcc8.ucsd.edu (Anthony Minkoff) writes:

>I've got to wonder if the protest system isn't unfair to the team in
>whose favor the officials erred.

   [...argument that San Antonio has to win game twice deleted]

     Well, there's an NBA rule that discourages baseless protests:  teams
have to pay $1,500 for each game they protest.  If the protest is upheld
they get their $1,500 back.  If not, it's forfeited.
     Of course, if the protest is upheld, then San Antonio does have to
replay the remainder of the game.  But IMO, that's fair.  It's not
a question of making the "protestees" play the game over gain, rather
it a question of making rules violators (or beneficiaries of officials'
failing to call rule violations) play the game over again.  And I 
don't see anything wrong with that.  It's not as if innocent teams are
randomly being forced to re-win honestly won games.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
  |__	       o
  | W			   Mike Tamada
		  |\	   Institutional Research Office
		   \O	   Occidental College
		    |      tamada@oxy.edu
		   /|
		  | |

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: ortcm@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (thomas.mcguigan)
Subject: All-Star voting early returns
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:24:48 GMT

The NBA released early returns on the voting for the Eastern Conference
All-Star team. As reported in the Orlando Sentinel:

The three top vote getters, thus far are Michael Jordan (175K), Scottie
Pippen (170K), and Shaq (116K)

In the voting for center, Shaq is follwed by Ewing (73K), Bill Cartwright
(29K), Brad Daugherty (28K), Sam Bowie (24K), Moses Malone (14K - pretty
good considering he's out for the season), Robert Parish (12K), Rony Seikaly
(11K), Alonzo Mourning (10K), and Pervis Ellison (4K).

The sentinel did not give figures for votes at other positions.  Early
returns for the Western Conference will be released tomorrow.

Tom@Orlando
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: shyeah@wam.umd.edu (Orange Beef)
Subject: What are the Bullets gonna do about King?
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 03:57:42 GMT

	Hey just wondering what U Bullets fans think about the coming
of Bernard King?  I know Abe Pole is gonna bring him back so they
can drop him next year to get his over $2 mil salary spot. (This
is the most logical thing to do)  But if they do bring him back
who are they gonna drop?  A guard?  A forward? CJ?  Again I would
think a forward would be dropped cause Unsel keep Overton on injured
reserve earlier this year and then dropped Foster to keep him.
But the main question is WHO are they gonna drop?

Centers:
	Pervis Ellison: Shyeah right, they wouldnt drop him unless
		they really want to keep losing.
	Charles Jones: Maybe, but they need a back-up center.  Plus
		he has the best defense on the team.
Forwards:
	Harvey Grant: Another shyeah right, especially since he got
		that mega-deal of a contract this summer.
	Googs: NOT!
	Larrey Stewart: Maybe-naaaaaa he is a good power foward for the
		team.
	Don MacLean: Another maybe, But I see him as the future small forward
		for the Bullets.
	Buck Johnson: Most likely.  But Unsel likes his defense, though he
		can score, but either can CJ.
Guards:
	Micheal Adams: I dont think so.
	Rex Chapman: Another I dont think so.  They said before the draft
		that they wanted to revolve the team around certain players
		one of them was Chapman.
	LaBradford Smith: Maybe, but he's the back-up shooting guard.
	Doug Overton: Maybe, but Unsel likes him, or else he wouldnt have
		keeped him at the being of the season.
	Brent Price: Another of the most likely to go.  I like him though.
		Needs more playing time but could develope into his brother. 8)

So these are my views with Buck Johnson I hope, and think should be the one to
	go, yet MacLean may go, or Brent or even a Highly doubt about them
	releasing CJ.  Who knows. 

And YES I do care. 8)

A loyal Bullets Fan!
(remember Hoop's Bday is coming soon)

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: oliver@athena.mit.edu (James D. Oliver III)
Subject: Re: I BEE-LEEVE!  Nellie is a JEE-NYOUS!
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 08:09:02 GMT

In article <JERRY.93Jan6182830@orion.MicroUnity.com> jerry@MicroUnity.com (Jerry Kreuscher) wrote:
> But last night
> Mullin was called for a "foul away for the ball", which gave the
> Sonics two free throws and possesion.  Why didn't the Spurs get that
> call?

I dunno.  After the game, Bob Bass really got in the face of the refs, and
maybe complained about it to NBA headquarters.  Bass was a former director
of officials in the ABA, so his griping about rules tends to carry some
weight. 

> In any case, I'm glad you've finally found the Nellie Faith.  Next
> thing, you'll be talking up the Celtics.

Apparently I already have been, at least according to Rich Maxwell
____________________________
	Jim Oliver  
	oliver@athena.mit.edu /	joliver@hstbme.mit.edu
	oliver%mitwccf.BITNET@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
From: dorin@ksr.com (Bob Dorin)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Shaq vs. Wilt
Date: 4 Jan 93 16:20:17 EST
Distribution: usa
Organization: Kendall Square Research Corp.

In article <1992Dec29.210658.12833@jmb2.jmb.com> lewism@jmb2.jmb.com (Mike Lewis) writes:
>
>other assorted slug coaches with Philly - especially in the early years
>Alex Hannum (coached the '67 team, not that bad but what did he do after that?)
              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>Many of Wilt's game 7 woes against Boston can be attributed to the miserable
>coaching of his teams (with exceptions noted above).  I would say that Wilt's
>teams did better against Boston than any other of the era, and this in spite
>of inferior personnel and coaching overall.

Don't knock Alex Hannum!  He coached the only teams that beat the
Celtics during the Russell era: the 1957-58 St. Louis Hawks and
the 1966-67 76ers.
--
Name:    Bob Dorin
Company: Kendall Square Research 
Email:   dorin@ksr.com, ksr!dorin
From: u_nique@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Jerray Wei)
Subject: Re: Jordan & Pippen: No Olympics
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 00:50:57 GMT

In article <C03K75.CrB@news.cso.uiuc.edu> dmd39855@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Daniel DuBois) writes:
>
>I'd like to see you call Pippen and/or Jordan "whiners" to their faces.
>You have no concept how hard they work.  NONE.  No concept how grueling
>a season they already have to put in.  100+ games, practices every day,
>playing against the best basketball players in the world, day in and
>day out (some of whom apparently are out to injure you after watching
>the NY and Detroit games the last few years).  Jordan's work ethic is
>legendary.  The reason they're stating their aversion to doing it all
>again is because of the negative affect it's had on their TEAM, the
>Bulls organization.  I consider this resposible conscientiousness a
>'good thing.'  An ignorant statement like that makes me just want to
>pimp-slap you.
>
You know, I'd put up with that schedule if I earned oh $4 million a year,
plus how many more times that in endorsements.  Have you noticed that no other
Olympians have been suffering from the experience of pummeling teams by 50
million points and playing golf every day?
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:09:38 CST
From: David E. Thomas <U47526@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Suns file protest in San Antonio loss
Distribution: usa
 <OLIVER.93Jan5201512@coate.mit.edu> <1993Jan6.181643.16051@ennews.eas.asu.edu>

In article <1993Jan6.181643.16051@ennews.eas.asu.edu>,
koehnema@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (Harry Koehnemann) says:
>
>In article <OLIVER.93Jan5201512@coate.mit.edu> oliver@athena.mit.edu (James D.
>Oliver III) writes:

>>If the protest is upheld, it will be the second such in NBA history.  The
>>first one was about nine years ago, also at the HemisFair, in a game
>>against the Lakers.
>
>I think there have been more as well - one in the East involving CHicago.
>ANyone know circumstances surrounding either of these?
>

The one with Chicago that you are probably thinking of was in a game a few
years back against the Knicks.  As I recall the Knicks were inbounding with
one tenth of a second left in the game and they were two points down.  They
got the ball in and hit a three pointer before the buzzer.  (I think it was
Trent Tucker now with the Bulls who hit it).

The Bulls filed a protest saying that if the timekeeping was accurate there
was no way they could have gotten the shot off in time. (The videotape
certainly seemed to confirm this).

The protest was not upheld, but the NBA as much as admitted that the Bulls
were correct since they adopted the current 'three tenths of a second' rule
as a response.


David E. Thomas
University of Illinois at Chicago

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: claird@NeoSoft.com (Cameron Laird)
Subject: Life after LA (was: Alaa is playing in Boston!!!)
Organization: NeoSoft Communications Services -- (713) 684-5900
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:01:55 GMT

In article <1993Jan05.171607.17309@microsoft.com> paulg@microsoft.com (Paul Goode) writes:
>In article <jxu.726164498@black.clarku.edu>, jxu@black.clarku.edu (The batman) writes:
>> Once again, Alaa played well last night.  He scored 21 points against LA
>
>Hey, maybe he heard what Sonics broadcaster Mychal Thompson
>said about his game:
>
>"Alaa...The big pharoah who sometimes plays like a mummy."
>
>All right, so it's a case of the pot calling the kettle black. 
>It's still a good line.
>
>Paul
>
>

Mychal is a broadcaster now?  He seemed like an
honorable fellow; how's he doing in his new life?
-- 

Cameron Laird
claird@Neosoft.com (claird%Neosoft.com@uunet.uu.net)	+1 713 267 7966
claird@litwin.com (claird%litwin.com@uunet.uu.net)  	+1 713 996 8546
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: koehnema@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (Harry Koehnemann)
Subject: Re: Suns file protest in San Antonio loss
Followup-To: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Reply-To: koehnema@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (Harry Koehnemann)
Organization: Arizona State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:16:43 GMT

In article <OLIVER.93Jan5201512@coate.mit.edu> oliver@athena.mit.edu (James D. Oliver III) writes:
>In article <1993Jan5.191311.24199@ennews.eas.asu.edu> koehnema@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (Harry Koehnemann) wrote:
>> Here's where it gets interesting.  Suns are ready to inbounds the ball.
>> SA has 6 people on the court.

Oops.  minor mistake here (forgot the game I waatched).  Suns had thrown
the ball away on their inbounds pass so SA had a chance to win it.  The
ref hands it to a SA guy and Majerle and Barkley come running at the ref
with six fingers up and signaling for a T.  The ref takes the ball back
and allows SA to take a guy off the court.  It's all on film.

>Ah, you beat me to it.  What can I say, they had six men on the court.  But
>if Don Nelson had done it, everyone would be saying what an brillant
>coaching strategem it was.

Talk in AZ is that the appeal has a very good chance of being upheld.  The
ball was obviously live, SA had 6 guys on the court, and Phx brought it to
the refs attention - everything that needs to happen for T.  In fact it
happened to GS this year in a game against the Suns and they were assessed
a technical.  So, that 14 games streak that ended may not be over after all.

>If the protest is upheld, it will be the second such in NBA history.  The
>first one was about nine years ago, also at the HemisFair, in a game
>against the Lakers.

I think there have been more as well - one in the East involving CHicago.
ANyone know circumstances surrounding either of these?


>Vinnie of the Black had a great first half offensively--15 pts. and nine
>assists, but Lucas didn't play him at all the second half, which didn't
>make sense to me.

He kindof supprised me - all I've heard about the Spurs is that they have
noone that could begin to play the point.  He didn't look to damn bad to me.

>Dumas is very, very frightening.  How long until he or
>Ceballos start bickering over playing time?

Dumas started last night at Houston and looked good, great at times with
some real bonehead mistakes.  He's supposed to be a better defender and
rebounder than Ced, both are very good at the offensive end.  I think
Dumas has really lit a fire under Ceballos this year - he looks much
better than he did last year.

As far as playing time, except for Majerle and Barkley everyone gets
~20-30 minutes on this team.  Some play more depending on the opponent.
I think that's Westphal's biggest strength is his ability to keep 10
potential starters happy - but winning also helps that I'm sure.
--
Harry Koehnemann
enuxha.eas.asu.edu
From: gbennett@frx730.intel.com (gbennett)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Protesting NBA Games
Date: 12 Jan 93 19:00:06 GMT
Organization: Intel Corporation

In article <1iuuhvINNbbf@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> as232@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Michael Lerner) writes:
>
>This is the most boneheaded, childish idea yet.  Let's face it, the refs
>make a hundred bad calls in the course of an NBA game in favor of one team
>or another; one call DOES NOT DETERMINE THE COURSE OF A GAME!  If we start
>reversing refs calls on the floor, we open a veritible Pandora's Box.  You'll
>have people protesting 10-second no-calls, every offensive foul will be
>protested by the offending team, etc.
>
>Sure, the 6-man no-call was at the end of the game.  I think it was a good
>no-call, but it should stand regardless.  I'm sure there was an equally bad
>call made against San Antonio moments before. ;)
>
>Mike
>-- 

To completely hash out the concept of refs making bad calls, what about all of
the no-calls certain players (e.g. Jordan, Ewing, Barkley, Malone, etc.) and
teams are "rewarded".  During the last Kings/Lakers games, the Kings were down
by 1 with 6 seconds left in the game.  Spud Webb drove into the lane and was
obviously tripped by Sedale Threat.  The refs didn't call anything except a 
jump ball between Sam Perkins and Lionel Simmons (which Perkins won).  This is
yet another example of the refs looking at the uniforms and deciding whether
or not to blow a whistle.  In others words, the refs threw out the rulebook and
decided the Lakers would win the game just because they are the LOS ANGELES
LAKERS.

As you can see, one call (or non-call) can determine the course of a game.

-Jerry
From: eiswirth@vixvax.mgi.com (Steve Eiswirth)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Rogers out, Lowe in
Date: 11 Jan 93 17:17:27 CDT
Organization: Management Graphics, Inc.

Firing Rogers was an overdue move.  Sid Lowe will be an improvement because
he's more of a hardass type, which is one of many things the Wolves need.

Regardless of the coach, the team will never win 30+ games unless they get
better players.  They have 3 good players in Laettner, West, and Person;
the rest of the players are either OK or worthless.  The guy most
responsible for insuring that the team will suck for its first 5 years is
Bob Stein, son in law of one of the co-owners (read: non-basketball guy who
"screwed" his way into power).  Stein was instrumental in
wasting two consecutive 1st round picks with Spencer and Longley.  There's a
long list of players drafted after these two Herman Munster's that have
turned out to be good players.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: byau@jarthur.claremont.edu (Ben Yau)
Subject: All Star Voting: 
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 03:35:28 GMT

Misc: info from waatching games over the weekend.,

all I know is that Shaq is leading centers in voting with 113,000 some, and se
second is Ewing with 70,000 some.


as for the west coast, 
Kemp is FIFTH in forwards behind

Mullin, Malone, Barkeley, Buck Williams


As for west coast guards, Ricky Pierce is SECOND!! and I think Payton is not 
even in the running (he was not mentioned as a potential in the all-star game by
the game commentators Collabro and Sikma, although they did say Pierce
was second in the running)

Just thought that would give a jolt to what we all thought who might be on
the all-star team.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Yau		    byau@jarthur.claremont.edu	          SHHHTEENKEE FOO FOO
------------------------------

"Nothing spoils fun like finding out it builds character"
						-Calvin from 
						"Calvin and Hobbes"
				----------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: hatch@gandalf.nosc.mil (Mark D. Hatch)
Subject: Re: All-Star Voting Summary
Organization: Naval Ocean Systems Center, San Diego
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:52:40 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.192156.21037@brtph560.bnr.ca> markham@brtph597.bnr.ca (Andrew Markham P205) writes:
>thomas.mcguigan writes:
[Summary of All Star Voting Deleted]
>I guess that give the East a starting line-up of

>PG: Hornacek
>SG: Jordan
>SF: Pippen
>PF: Johnson
>C:  O'Neal

>Talk about a bunch of versatile players!!!  Will the West get
>ANY rebounds?

Will the West get any rebounds?  Considering that Robinson and Barkley
will almost assuredly start, and Karl Malone might start (he is currently
trailing Chris Mullin by a small amount for the other starting forward
spot) and will definitely make the team, I don't see rebounding as a
concern for the West.  Throw in the fact that Drexler is leading the 
leading vote getter among Western Conference guards, and the fact that,
if healthy, he is a better rebounder then Jordan, and the West All Stars
should be a great rebounding team.

On another note, it is sad that so many fans have their heads so far up
their ass when it comes to All Star voting.  Hakeem is playing the best
ball in the NBA at the center position, yet trails Robinson by a wide
margin, and barely edges out Duckworth in the voting.  Drexler injuries
prevent him from earning the top spot among guards, and both Stockton and
Hardaway are more deserving starters than Ricky Pierce.  As a matter of
fact, Pierce doesn't make my All Star team as a reserve.  Pippen belongs
on the East team, but should not be dominating the voting among forwards
like he is.  I guess it really helps being Mikey's teammate.  Hell, while
were at it, why not throw Grant, Cartwright, and Paxson on the team as well?

>I hope to see Price, Dumars, Wilkins, Grant and Ewing on the bench...

Strong bench.  Price or Dumars whould start ahead of Hornacek, but Grant
has no business being on this team.  On the the remaining spots should 
go to Daugherty.

>Andrew W. Markham (markham@bnr.ca)
								Mark Hatch
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro