HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu)
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 23:43:11 GMT

In article <1992Jul27.164053.2452@island.COM> fester@island.COM (Mike Fester) writes:
>In article <4465@dove.nist.gov> hira@cme.nist.gov writes:
>>My first post to this newsgroup, with encouragement from Clare.
>>
>>Well, some of you have made references to the experiences you've had
>>about being asked your nationality. So I'll add my $0.02 worth.
>>
>>I had just finished my hour long presentation and answered questions, and 
>>the next thing to do was to meet with the chief. The first question that
>>came out of his mouth was, "Are you a US citizen?" I was pretty taken
>>aback, but didn't retort anything (something I regret). I'm an asian 
>>indian who was born and raised in the US, and shit like this pisses me
>>off, but white friends shrug it off like its his job to ask me that 
>>question. Who wants to bet that he *never* asks white applicants that 
>>question? 
>
>Happens all the time. I was asked if *I* was a US citizen before I took my
>last couple jobs (and no, they were not defense related). Had to show proof
>of it as well. No big deal. Happened to friends of mine at Hughes as well.
>For the record, I'm blond/brown hair color, blue eyes, no accent. My friends
>at Hughes were Dk brown hair, green eyes, red hair, blues eyes, and black 
>and black (the last one was born in Taiwan). All American citizens. And it 
>*is* someone's job to ask if you're a US citizen. Most cases, *your* (or
>my) job to prove it.
>
>Mike
>-- 
>Disclaimer - These opiini^H^H damn! ^H^H ^Q ^[ .... :w  :q  :wq  :wq! ^d  X ^?
>exit X Q  ^C ^? :quitbye  CtrlAltDel   ~~q  :~q  logout  save/quit :!QUIT
>^[zz ^[ZZZZZZ ^H  man vi ^@  ^L  ^[c  ^# ^E ^X ^I ^T ? help  helpquit ^D  ^d 
>man help ^C ^c help exit ?Quit ?q CtrlShftDel "Hey, what does this button d..."

Being required to show proof of citizenship (or other right to work in the
US) is a result of the immigration reform in 1988? (87?).  I think it's
wonderful that this requirement is universal, not just for the non-whites.

On the other hand, this usually happens when some Human Resources person
processes your paperwork on your first day, not when some high-level
manager meets you after you give a technical presentation...
						--Alan Hu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 18:37:50 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.211445.8612@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com> lam@popeye.comm.mot.com (Dan Lam) writes:
>In article <1992Jul23.072717.17394@oakhill.sps.mot.com> jpak@manute.sps.mot.com writes:
>
>	[repost from Huy Cao about Amy and Andy at UCLA deleted]
>
>Good post Jim,

>It is indeed hard to differentiate some Asian ethnicities.  Heck I got
>mistaken for being Philipino by some Phillipinoes themself.  I therefore
>usually asume that people are just curious about my ethnicity when they
>ask me where I am from.  I don't hesitate telling them mine but some
>time I asked them back if they are French, Dutch, Jamaican, etc.  I
>think this is a good way to tell people that "WE ASIANS (*) DON'T ALWAYS
>LOOK THE SAME".

Good post. Reminds me of my undergrad days (Texas Tech, a real h*ll-hole).

Being an engineering oriented school, we had a lot of foreign students, 
particularly Iranian and Nigerian. I got to be quite good friends with several
Nigerians and we'd often do homework together. One day, one of my friends said
to me "You know, it is SO hard to tell you white people apart. You really all
look alike." I answered, no, it is Africans who look more similar. He replied
that Nigerians were from different tribes and had different sizes, facial 
features, etc, and it was very easy to tell them apart. I answered, "Well, yeah,
but whites have different hair color, so it should be EASIER to tell us apart".
He stopped and thought about that for a bit, and finally admitted that there 
might be something to that. Growing up in a relatively racially homogenous area,
the clues HE used to distinguish people were obviously different from what 
we're used to. Perhaps this explains the "they all look alike" response of
some people. My mother, who grew up in an all-white suburb of Chicago can now
distinguish Asians pretty easily, after moving to California. Many Japanese
had (in my experience) a difficult time recognizing a friend of mine from the
Ivory Coast, when he was with a group of his friends from that country (or me
when I led a group of Canadians on a quick tour of our building).

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - These opiini^H^H damn! ^H^H ^Q ^[ .... :w  :q  :wq  :wq! ^d  X ^?
exit X Q  ^C ^? :quitbye  CtrlAltDel   ~~q  :~q  logout  save/quit :!QUIT
^[zz ^[ZZZZZZ ^H  man vi ^@  ^L  ^[c  ^# ^E ^X ^I ^T ? help  helpquit ^D  ^d 
man help ^C ^c help exit ?Quit ?q CtrlShftDel "Hey, what does this button d..."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: c60a-zg@volga.Berkeley.EDU (Martin Guerrero-LabA)
Subject: Re: Pencil-twirling (was Re: Self-examination)
Keywords: pencil-twirling
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 02:30:44 GMT

Pencil-twirling -- It seems to be an Asian phenomenon.

Yes, Cal students do it.

As for an Asian phenomenon, even outside of the U.S., you do see quite
a bit of this.  Pencil twirling sometimes relieves stress when taking
exams which could determine the rest of your life.

Comment from a Caucasian:
  Something along the lines of: "Haven't you noticed only Asians can do that?"

Well, I know many non-Asians who do it.
From: angeli@infocomm.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Date: 24 Jul 92 18:45:23 PDT
Distribution: na
Organization: INFO COMM - Computer Consulting, Redwood City, Ca

In article <1992Jul23.211445.8612@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com>, lam@popeye.comm.mot.com (Dan Lam) writes:

> 
> It is indeed hard to differentiate some Asian ethnicities.  Heck I got
> mistaken for being Philipino by some Phillipinoes themself.  I therefore
> usually asume that people are just curious about my ethnicity when they
> ask me where I am from.  I don't hesitate telling them mine but some
> time I asked them back if they are French, Dutch, Jamaican, etc.  I
> think this is a good way to tell people that "WE ASIANS (*) DON'T ALWAYS
> LOOK THE SAME".
> 
> (* note:  ASIAN here means Asian looking.  I dont want to get into 
> arguments about A vs AA, FOB vs. ABC, etc.)
> 
> 
> PS:  Jim, for your info, my story happened in the HEB on Riverside
> 	road near I35 about 3 years ago when I was working in Austin..

I just wanted to make a correction: the spelling of people from the
Philippines is Filipinos -- don't ask me why; I don't know why.  And on the
same note, my sister has been mistaken for Italina, Mexican, Chinese and more. 
Just depends on how tanned she is at the time, how she does her hair, or put on
her makeup.

I usually think I can recognize other Filipinos but am sometimes mistaken.  But
since I speak the language, I can always be sure once they start talking.  This
is always interesting to me since I rarely hear my language spoken anymore and
I like meeting other Filipinos who speak it.

--
Angeli Salgado - INFO COMM Computer Consulting, Redwood City, Ca
E-MAIL:	angeli@infocomm.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: cristina@dazixca.ingr.com (Cristina Ungstad Yu)
Subject: Re: Year of the Dragon (Re: Asian American Media Image)
Keywords: good movie, 2 thumbs up!
Organization: Dazix,An Intergraph Company
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 02:38:19 GMT
From: janhsu@hardy.u.washington.edu (Mark Choi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Korean Views on Race (Re: LA Times. 7-13-92 [long])
Date: 29 Jul 92 18:00:12 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle


I advise everyone to put Dwighty in your local kill file. My point was 
made well and clear, and it completely domolished his. Anyway, this is
not the place to argue, that is, of course, if Dwight Joe has anything
valid to argue, but I doubt that.
-- 
    .  .      +-------------------------------+
  --|--|      | Mark Yun Wook Choi            |
   /.\ |      | janhsu@hardy.u.washington.edu |
  --|--|      +-------------------------------+  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: Korean Views on Race (Re: LA Times. 7-13-92 [long])
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 15:53:42 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.205056.15598@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>In article <1992Jul28.192852.3755@udel.edu> shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul28.023440.1118@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>>outrageous demands.  But the Korean gov't is insisting that the Japanese
>>>gov't give the Koreans in Japan special privileges not afforded to
>>>other foreigners.

They aren't "foreigners".

>answer: finger-printing.

>The S. Korean gov't demanded that Japan no longer finger-print the
>Koreans in Japan.  Japan acceded but continues to finger-print many
>other foreigners.

It fingerprints ALL foreigners. It does NOT fingerprint Japanese of
Korean descent. Koreans of Korean decsent who immigrate to Japan are
fingerprinted.

>I challenge Mr. Shin to name 1 single case of a Korean who fulfilled
>the requirements of citizenship--the same requirements that other
>foreigners must fulfill--but who was denied citizenship in Japan.

Japan is famous for its 'case-by-case' approach to law. There is NO set
requirement for citizenship as it exists here. 

>The constant b*tching by Koreans in Japan concerning citizenship and
>the rights that accrue with it is bogus.  The Koreans don't want 
>Japanese citizenship but demand the rights that come with it.  When

No, they WANT Japanese citizenship; they DON'T want to give up their
names.

>the Korean murmur increases, the Japanese gov't should point out
>--with the force of American will--the various discriminatory practices

Why should the US get involved in this? If US values are applied, Japan
is entirely in the wrong, and would have to change its entire approach 
to immigration.

>in Korean society against Japanese.  Just to name a few, they
>include the banning of Japanese language programming in the theaters

This ban has been lifted.

>or the airwaves and the prohibition of Japanese access to purchasing
>shares of Korean firms[1].

Many of those "Korean firms" were fully-owned subsidiaries of Japanese com-
panies until just recently. They are still partially owned by the Japanese.

>[1] When access was liberalized to allow limited American participation,
>the Japanese were singled out for prohibition by the Koreans.  The Japanese
>are still prohibited to this very day.

No they aren't.

BTW, foreign ownership of certain Japanese stocks is forbidden as well.

And in any event, it hardly compares the Japanese attempt to wipe out the
Korean culture.

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - These opiini^H^H damn! ^H^H ^Q ^[ .... :w  :q  :wq  :wq! ^d  X ^?
exit X Q  ^C ^? :quitbye  CtrlAltDel   ~~q  :~q  logout  save/quit :!QUIT
^[zz ^[ZZZZZZ ^H  man vi ^@  ^L  ^[c  ^# ^E ^X ^I ^T ? help  helpquit ^D  ^d 
man help ^C ^c help exit ?Quit ?q CtrlShftDel "Hey, what does this button d..."
From: tse@loonybin.apple.com (Gary Tse)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Keeping in mind that this is AmeriKKKa
Keywords: knock
Date: 24 Jul 92 20:02:07 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Raoul Duke School of Pharmacology and Journalism

In article <1992Jul24.141934.8674@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
|How about this?
|
|Work with whomever you want to         -- male, female
|Make friends with whomever you want to -- male, female
|Have lovers with whomever you want to  -- male, female
|But marry                              -- male, female
|
|Gary, is it sexist to prefer mates of a specific sex?

[Boy, there is amazing potential for making double entendres here.
I will do my best to be circumspect.]

Depends.  The question is whether a gender-specific organ is required
for the various posts you mentioned.  For the overwhelming majority of
professions and friendships, the answer is no.  For most lovers and
mates, the answer is yes.  I don't think there is sexism where there
are legitimate gender-specific requirements.

-- 
Gary Tse, tse@Apple.COM			``Out of a misty dream
(408) 862-5452			Our path emerges for a while, then closes
						Within a dream.'' -- E. Dowson
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: thao@bnr.ca (Anthony Murtagh)
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Richardson, Tx.
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 17:30:10 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.143709.9331@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>In article <4465@dove.nist.gov> hira@cme.nist.gov writes:
>>

[stuff about looking non-us deleted] 

>
>  That reminds me of some job advice I got from some older Asian
>  Americans.  First of all, if you have an English first name
>  and a Chinese middle name, don't put your Chinese middle name
>  in.
>

my friend changed his first name when when he was naturalized.  of course,
he had been going by that name and mostly everybody except his parents
perhaps called him by his real name.

[stuff gone...gone....]

>
>  Ver important: put in bold text at the top of your resume.  U.S. Citizen
>  if you're so lucky to be one.  They said that this will help
>  separate your resume from all the Yen-Ping Wang and Shao-Ching Chu
>  that are applying for the job.  And also put your birthplace in
>  a prominant position so that they won't think you're naturalized.
>                                                       ^^^^^^^^^^^

i'm naturalized but it doesn't matter since i'm hoping i'll never
have to work for a defense contractor anyway so hopefully, i won't
be jilted as such.

>
>  I must say that I followed their advice and was able to land two
>  jobs at defense contractors.  None of them asked me if I was a citizen
>  because they had already screened my resume.  Do people think I'm
>  selling out to get a job?

in a sense yes, but that is your perogative.  besides some people are
already "american."  the only thing that keeps them from being "full 
american" is their appearance, so a name change is nothing.

i feel like i'm drifting from my origins, and my name is the only thing
that identifies me (well, that and my appearance  :-)  ).  

basically, it's all a cosmetic thing but i'd like to retain my name anyway.
life is just a big game.  sometimes you win...sometimes, you land on park
place with 10 hotels...and you don't own park place.....

laly thao


/***********************************************************************************\
*   thao@cse.uta.edu	   |  "The lipstick is purple.  The mecha is Psycho."	    *
*   B645ZAY@UTARLG.UTA.EDU |                          -old Panime newsletter        *
\***********************************************************************************/
From: kimy@monteverdi.cs.unc.edu (Yong-Mi Kim)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: A hot market (was: History of family name)
Date: 28 Jul 92 17:19:31 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill



Has anybody else noticed that some mail order catalogs now feature
Asian-looking female models, but no Asian-looking male models?

Catalogs I have in mind are L.L. Bean and J. Crew.

Of course, I have considered sending J. Crew a picture of my younger
brother, since he wears a lot of their stuff, and some of my white
female friends think he's quite a hunk ("tall, dark and handsome!").



yong-mi
not quite pale and reedy enough for Tweeds
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: fester@etorofu.island.COM ()
Subject: China's Economy
Summary: World's fastest growing economy
Originator: fester@etorofu
Organization: Island Graphics, Marin County, California
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 19:37:19 GMT

In today's (July 28, 1992) business section of the SF Chronicle, there is an
article about mainland China's economy. Some highlights:

It is now the world's fastest growing economy. Free market reforms have meant 
the economy has grown by about 9% a year during the last decade.

While most of China's output is controlled by the state, the biggest growth
has been in the private sector.

A CIA report indicates that China's exports grew at a rate of 41% last year.
(I read the newspaper article on the report; it was based entirely on data 
supplied by the Chinese government, so some caution should be used in 
interpretting the results).

China Bicycles now accounts for 30% of the world's bicycles, though this
may be due entirely domestic consumption.


In short, if you have access to it, this is an interesting article to read.

Mike
 
-- 
Disclaimer - These opiini^H^H damn! ^H^H ^Q ^[ .... :w  :q  :wq  :wq! ^d  X ^?
exit X Q  ^C ^? :quitbye  CtrlAltDel   ~~q  :~q  logout  save/quit :!QUIT
^[zz ^[ZZZZZZ ^H  man vi ^@  ^L  ^[c  ^# ^E ^X ^I ^T ? help  helpquit ^D  ^d 
man help ^C ^c help exit ?Quit ?q CtrlShftDel "Hey, what does this button d..."
From: hira@cme.nist.gov (Ron Hira)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Date: 24 Jul 92 15:19:13 GMT
Reply-To: hira@cme.nist.gov
Distribution: na
Organization: National Institute of Standards and Technology

In article <3636@randvax.rand.org>, edhall@rand.org (Ed Hall) writes:
|>From: edhall@rand.org (Ed Hall)
|>Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
|>Date: 24 Jul 92 13:51:18 GMT
|>
|>In article <4465@dove.nist.gov> hira@cme.nist.gov writes:
|>>I had just finished my hour long presentation and answered questions, and 
|>>the next thing to do was to meet with the chief. The first question that
|>>came out of his mouth was, "Are you a US citizen?" I was pretty taken
|>>aback, but didn't retort anything (something I regret). I'm an asian 
|>>indian who was born and raised in the US, and shit like this pisses me
|>>off, but white friends shrug it off like its his job to ask me that 
|>>question. Who wants to bet that he *never* asks white applicants that 
|>>question? 
|>
|>It might not be the "chief" who asks the question, but anyone at a
|>government lab will get asked about their citizenship at some point.  It
|>can have a direct influence on just what projects someone can work on,
|>since even some of the most innocuous-sounding stuff might require a
|>security clearance.  Only a government bureaucrat could understand why...
|>
|>When I first came to RAND (which is quasi-governmental) it was one
|>of the first questions I was asked.
|>
|>		-Ed Hall
|>		edhall@rand.org
                         
Yes, this is a common reply of most white people, and it has *some* merit.
You have to take the situation in context, I had already gone thru the first
interview besides having worked for the government before. The point was
that it was the *first* question the "chief" asked me. I highly doubt that
he'd asked a white boy with a Philly accent the same question.

BTW, to work for the federal gov't as a civil servant, you must be a US 
citizen regardless.

Ron
From: angeli@infocomm.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Asking someone his "nationality" (Today's "Dear Abby")
Date: 24 Jul 92 18:35:02 PDT
Distribution: na
Organization: INFO COMM - Computer Consulting, Redwood City, Ca

In article <1992Jul23.212045.18628@oakhill.sps.mot.com>, jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak) writes:
> In article <24819@dog.ee.lbl.gov> kevin@daffy.ee.lbl.gov (Kevin Gong) writes:
>>The original question was "Where are you from?"  Now, maybe I'm a little
>>strange, but when someone asks me where I'm from, the last place on my mind
>>is China (especially considering I've never been there).
> 
> How many generations removed from China are you?  That might have a lot to
> do with explaining why you and I think differently on this.

   Jim, I was born in the Philippines, came here (the US) in 1982 and
   became a U.S. citizen in 1989.  If people ask me where I'm from, I
   say, "My parents are from NY, but I live in the Bay Area now"
   (current reply), or "I'm from NY more recently, but I was born in
   the Philippines" (college years).  I'm guessing that it's not
   necessarily the number of generations, since I am first generation,
   that people consider themselves "more American."  My sentiments are
   a lot like Kevin's, probably because I haven't had much experience
   with racism.  I was pretty amazed at people's reaction here on the
   net regarding the question, "where are you from?"  But, as I talk
   to Asian Americans, I find that more have been subject to
   name-calling, racism, than not.  I'm learning a lot from this
   newsgroup, although it's not always easy to "listen" to all the
   shouting.

   All for now.

--
Angeli Salgado - INFO COMM Computer Consulting, Redwood City, Ca
E-MAIL:	angeli@infocomm.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Keeping in mind that this is AmeriKKKa
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 14:12:19 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.014159.19306@oakhill.sps.mot.com> jpak@manute.sps.mot.com writes:
>In article <1992Jul24.012847.19203@oakhill.sps.mot.com> I wrote:
>>You can knock 2, 3, and 4, which I'll bet covers a surprisingly large
>>chunk of the people I've encountered in my life, and probably many others,
>>too.  Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if at least half of this newsgroup
>>thinks this way.
>
>I thought about this, and I changed my mind.  To cover half the people in
>this newsgroup (readers, not necessarily posters), you have to add the
>following "profile":
>
>                                           Heritage of Americans
> Work with whomever you want to         -- Asian, European, African, Aboriginal
> Make friends with whomever you want to -- Asian, European, African, Aboriginal
> Have lovers with whomever you want to  -- Asian, European
> But marry                              -- Asian, European
>
>
>There.  Now, I'm pretty sure I have half the group covered.
>
>Knock away.
>
>Jim

  You got it.  If I could have a dollar for every time someone told me
  that they preferred Asian and Europeans, or Europeans and then Asians.
  Some even spell out, "No Blacks and Hispanics."  One of my friends said
  this to me and another friend, even though I'm married to a Hispanic
  and she's married to a Black.  Of course we just looked at each other
  and decided not to help her find anybody.

  You see, people feel an especial need to tell me that when they ask me
  for help finding a date.  They NEED to clarify for me, because I happen
  to have a very diverse group of friends (and nothing missing in my
  personal "chart") and they don't want to confront the "embarrassment"
  in case the nice young man or nice girl I find for them is the "wrong"
  type.