HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger)
Subject: Re: SHOCK COLLARS (go ahead flame ME!!)
Keywords: shock collars unnecessary
Reply-To: jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger)
Organization: Ask Computer Systems Inc., Ingres Division, Alameda CA 94501
Date: 1 Sep 92 05:22:04 GMT

Charlie Sorsby writes:
> the "shock collar"...is [no] substitute
> for knowledge, understanding, and common sense

Its usual use is exactly a substitute for same.

> Can you name a single other tool that will allow you to make a
> correction (not mete out punishment)

The technical term (EAB) is punishment.

-- Jon
--
Jon Krueger  jpk@ingres.com  
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: emm@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (ellen.m.mcsorley)
Subject: re: the idiot Newfs
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 19:25:44 GMT

Uh oh!  Sophie and Arnie didn't want to give
their breed a bad name, and asked that I tell
you they are very smart - heck, they trained
me to do anything they want me to do for them
in less than 2 months!  "Mommy, I want my biscuit
now - mommy, we NEED new toys, these have holes
in them and don't squeak - mommy we CAN'T do
obedience now, we have headaches - can we go
swimming, though??"


Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: martin@biostat.washington.edu (Don Martin)
Subject: Re: Kennel Info Help
Organization: Biostatistics, School of Public Health, Univ. of Wash.
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 23:01:12 GMT

In article <l9n8ieINNj5i@news.bbn.com> ryuen@BBN.COM (Ray Yuen) writes:
>
>
>Has anyone ever heard of a kennel (private breeder?) out in the midwest
>called SunDowner?  There is a pet shop here in Boston that advertises
>that they don't buy their dogs from puppy mills, but I know that they
>buy from a place called SunDowner.  Any info is greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanks,
>
>-Ray Yuen  (ryuen@bbn.com)

There is a reputable Old English Sheepdog Kennel outside
of Baltimore Maryland that is named Sundowner. Jack
and Betsey Lenard. 

Please do not confuse them with any kind of puppy mill.
These are show breeders wwith very high standards. They
are very careful about who they sell too, OFA and check 
eyes on all breeding stock and so on.

Don Martin
Widdershins Old English Sheepdogs


Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: goc@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (joy.a.gochman)
Subject: Agility Show  - More Information
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 13:35:51 GMT



More information on the Agility Shows  in Maryland.
I could not E-Mail to the people that asked for more information.


***************************************************************

		Artful Dodgers, Timonium MD, Saturday Oct 3,1992
		Keystone Agility, Norristown Penn., Sunday Oct 4,1992

Where: Essex Community College

Directions: From I-695 (Baltimore Beltway) take Exit 34 (Rosedale)
and turn left onto Maryland Route 7 (philadelphia Road) in the
direction of White Marsh. Proceed 1/4 mile north on Route 7 to
traffic signal and turn left onto Rossville Boulevard.  The campus
is located approx. 1 mile on the right, directly past Franklin 
Square hospital. Once on campus follow signs to show site (near
parking lot C).

Time:
Registration(must have mailed entry):7:30-8:00
Event Start:9:30


-- 
					joy gochman
					mtdcb!joy
From: williamsk@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com (Desperately seeking a major)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Akitas
Date: 4 Sep 92 18:59:34 GMT
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Sep3.181053.8800@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com>, kaufmanj@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com (And be ye kind one to another...Eph. 4:31) writes:
> I have to add my two cent's worth...but a word of warning...this is rather 
> long.  I tend to be windy (no comments from you, Kimberly Williams!)...

She may be windy, but she's knows her stuff about Akitas! (I always have 
comments for you Jan!)

> 	Storm, while a half sister to Talyn (same mother), is so very 
> different.  Where Talyn is aloof, dignified, and "regal", Storm is exuberant
> (the best word for her!), out-going, and just full of vinegar!  She's eager to 
> please, obedient, to a certain degree, and loves to play Frisbee (I tease my 
> friend Kim that Storm played with her golden Spencer too much as a pup!).  
> Even with all of this, Storm is very dominant.   

Yeah, she's dominant.  At 10 weeks old she got upset when Spencer tried
to show dominance over her.  She was outweighed about 3 times!  They did get
along famously though.  We have some great pcitures of their wrestling
matches.

> 	I love akitas.  I will always own at least one.  They are beautiful, 
> intelligent, impressive-looking animals.  They are loyal, independent, but can 
> be very stubborn.  If raised improperly, or obtained from the wrong breeder, 
> they can also be unpredictable and aggressive (towards other animals AND 
> people) -- but isn't this true for any breed?
> 

Well, uh, er yeah, I guess.  But goldens being aggressive?  Wow - that's like
the federal government having a balanced budget - almost impossible!

Kim

(soon to be temporary Mom for Jan's clan when she goes on vacation - except 
I DON'T DO BIRDS!)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: tlh8c@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Thomas Lee Horton)
Subject: Medially luxating patellas
Followup-To: tlh8c@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU
Summary: Knock-kneed poodle
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 01:46:53 GMT

Gaby, the wonder-poodle, has been gimping around off-and-on since
we got her.  Each time, it would only last a day or two, then
she seemed to recover.  Our guess was she was sleeping on it funny
or some such.

This last bout went on for about two weeks, so we decided to take
her to the vet.  The doctor diagnosed that she had MEDIALLY LUXATING
PATELLAS, or that she was basically knock-kneed.  This causes
her to favor one leg, keep it more or less straight, and to really
bow the other one out, which renders it more-or-less dysfunctional.

The vet said she was adapting very well and that it would cost around
$700 to get an operation to repair the condition.  It might as well be
$7,000,000.  I'm a poor grad student.

We're taking doc's advice B, which is to give her buffered aspirin to
relieve the pain and hoping for the best.  This has helped, and she is
on all fours rather than three legs, but she still (of course) favors 
the other.

What do you wise owners know about this?  Please respond via e-mail.

Thanks.
From: vlcoleman@lescsse.jsc.nasa.gov (vicki coleman)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Balancing Type, Temperament and Working Abilities (was Re: Looking
Date: 23 Aug 1992 18:57:29 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Engineering and Sciences

>>TH>...........  Too few people are concerned about a "total dog."  Some
>>TH>want temperament only, some want looks only and yet others only care
>>TH>about working ability.  I personally am not sure that a conformation
>>TH>champion should have to show working ability, but I do think there
>>TH>should be more emphasis on having both conformation and working titles
>>TH>on dogs.  I would support a proposal for the AKC to combine a
>>TH>conformation championship, some level of obedience or other working
>>TH>title, and a temperament test to yield an all-around championship.  It
>>TH>seems that while each of these areas are separate and can be judged that
>>TH>way, but in the end these qualities must be combined in the best of
>>TH>our dogs.

I too would support such a proposal.  I own a Finnish Spitz and in the USA
they are used solely as companion dogs (they are in the AKC Non-Sporting
Group).  In Finland, however, they are bird dogs.  They're ability as
bird dogs is so highly valued that you cannot put a conformation title
on a Finnish Spitz unless it has a certain number of field points.  I'm
not 100% sure but I also think that you can't get a field title on a
dog without a certain number of conformation points.  It seems to me
that makes for a good all around dog.  I don't know of any breeders of
the Finnish Spitz here in American that actually hunt with their dogs,
but I do know that a lot of the breeders are importing some dogs from
Finland to help maintain the hunting instinct.  Also, there has been
some talk about holding field trials at the Speciality.

On a side note, I've read with interest about having problems with
dogs that bark too much.  The bark of a Finnish Spitz is so highly
valued in Finland that they hold a competition each year to select
the "King of the Barkers".
From: terry@eece.ksu.edu (Terry Hull)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Hunting ability in Labradors
Date: 26 Aug 1992 15:43:52 GMT
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: ralph.eece.ksu.edu

daveb@pogo.wv.tek.com (Dave Butler) writes:
k>This is why I would 
>assert that no dog should be able to earn either a champion status, or a best 
>in breed (and definitely not a best in show) unless it has excelled in the
>working requirements of its breed.

That would be quite difficult for the AKC.  Take the Rottweiler for
example.  They were originally herding dogs, and have been changed
from that into a guarding/protection/police dog.  The AKC will not
allow Rottweilers to herd in their trials, and do not recognize any
organization that gives Schutzhund titles.  They also do not
themselves award Schutzhund titles.  Under these conditions, how can
the AKC possibly evaluate the Rottweiler's working ability?  They do
not even have an endurance title to evaluate the dog's stamina.  IMHO,
this is a sad state of affairs.

Another thing to consider is the difficulty of comparing one dog's
ability in Schutzhund with another dog's hunting ability.  Also, how
do you evaluate the working ability of a lap dog?  Do you remove all
"working" requirements for that breed because they don't work?
Doesn't that make it easier for the lap dog to get a BIS than a German
Shepherd?  The next question seems to be what do you do with a
multi-talented dog like the GSD?  Do you make him herd, do police
work, do agility, do obedience or what to prove his working ability?
(Sorry, the AKC does not recognize agility titles either.  Drat!)  It
seems like there are a lot of issues to be handled before a proposal
like this could ever be put into effect.  

--
Terry Hull  -  terry@eece.ksu.edu
Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering, Kansas State University
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: afallen@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (E. Allen Arrington)
Subject: Wants an Akita
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: 1st Kentucky Cavalry Co. C
Date:  4 Sep 1992 13:28 EST  

One of the stable hands at the barn where we borad our horses would like to 
get an Akita (sp?).  Does any one know of any breeders in the Cleveland 
Ohio general area?  What is the price range?  He is looking for pet 
quality as opposed to a show dog.  Any info would be welcome.  Please 
respond via email.  Thanks!  

E. Allen Arrington  
        Trooper, 1st Kentucky Cavalry, Co. C 
        Mounted Memorial Unit
and Mason (big sad-eyed quarterhorse)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Hot dog
From: bmann@desire.wright.edu
Date: 28 Aug 92 15:43:57 EST
Organization: Wright State University 

In article <1992Aug26.184314.1065@newshost.lanl.gov>, 
srlee@beta.lanl.gov (Stephen R Lee) writes:> 
> One thing that can help dogs cool off (if they are outside) is a childrens
> wading pool.  You just put the pool in the shade somewhere and put some
> water in it, and maybe toss a couple of toys in it.  Most dogs (particularly
> those that love water) quickly learn that the pool is a fun way to cool off.

On advice from posters in this group, I got my then 9-month-old Airedale an
inexpensive child's wading pool and he absolutely loved it!  He included it in 
the circuit when he went running in happy puppy circles in the yard and 
would stand in the middle and stick his nose under the water - puffing and
blowing bubbles.  Unfortunately, he also chewed holes in it and couldn't
quite understand why all the water ran out.  It is now in many pieces in
his fenced yard.  Next year, I guess I'll break down and buy him something
a little more substantial.  Any suggestions of a source for a more tooth-
proof pool short of constructing a sunken concrete-lined pond?

- Barbara Mann, Wright State University
- bmann@desire.wright.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: emily@azariah.tamu.edu (Emily Glass)
Subject: Re: Setter Questions?
Organization: Texas A&M University, Dept. of Electrical Engineering
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 17:33:02 GMT


The shape of the head on the setter is distinctly different from that of the
retriever.  (The muzzle is much deeper on the setter.) 

I have a dog, Annabelle, that I got at the animal shelter, who I think is 
lab/setter mix.  However, if it wasn't for a big patch of white on her chest
(I don't know where she got that from), I could problably get an IRQ number 
for her as a flat coated retriever, and show her obedience w/the AKC.  The 
shape of her head is somewhere in between that of a lab and a setter.  The 
reason that I think she has Irish setter in her, besides the fact that she
has feathery hair, is that she is playful, and full of energy to the extent 
of being "ditsy" at times (she is no longer a puppy, but acts like one).  
She is also extremely social (loves all people and dogs to the extent of 
being a pest about it sometimes). I have only "meet" one flat coated 
retriever, so I don't know what their personalities are like.  I used to 
have a lab, when I was a kid, and have known a lot of labs, and although 
they can have a lot of energy, once they reach 2 yrs or so, they are "calmer" 
-- rather they have more self-control -- than Annabelle.  




Emily Glass
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: carruth@mksol.dseg.ti.com (matthew carruth)
Subject: Re: S**t eating dog
Keywords: Stinky! |~{(>
Organization: internet
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 20:06:12 GMT

I've got a dog who goes nuts for cat's litter box.  It really is disgusting, but
the only solution I've found is to keep the poop separated from the pooch.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My views are my own and do not reflect those of my employeers....
From: mjohnson@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (Marget Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Kennel Info Help
Date: 27 Aug 92 13:30:08 GMT
Reply-To: mjohnson@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (Marget Johnson)
Distribution: na
Organization: Stakeholder Relations, NCR Corp in Dayton,OH

In article <l9n8ieINNj5i@news.bbn.com> ryuen@BBN.COM (Ray Yuen) writes:
>Has anyone ever heard of a kennel (private breeder?) out in the midwest
>called SunDowner?  There is a pet shop here in Boston that advertises
>that they don't buy their dogs from puppy mills, but I know that they
>buy from a place called SunDowner.  Any info is greatly appreciated.

Ray: By definition, any breeder that sells to a reseller (broker, wholesaler,
pet shop) is a commercial breeder. And all commercial breeders are puppy
"mills" or "farms". Whether they provide adequate care for their breeding
stock and new-borns is a different issue. 
Don't be fooled by pet shops that say they don't buy from puppy mills. This
usually means that they have eliminated the middlemen (wholesalers and
brokers), and are buying all their stock from one (huge, no doubt) commercial
operation - a puppy mill. 
Tell the pet shop owner you aren't interested in buying a puppy from
ANYONE who is not the breeder of the puppy. And you will not patronize a store
that sells puppies. 

As long as raising puppies for the pet shop
trade is profitable, puppy mills will continue. 

Thanks for listening..........

Marget Johnson
-- 

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger)
Subject: Re: SHOCK COLLARS (go ahead flame ME!!)
Reply-To: jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger)
Organization: Ingres Division, ASK Computer Systems.
Date: 2 Sep 92 22:38:08 GMT

young@alw.nih.gov writes:
> If you have a voice (loud and strong) enough to train a big-running
> pointer or german shorthair for field work more power to you.

Good reason to train hand motions with voice.

Of course, a noisy city is another reason.

-- Jon

Jon Krueger  jpk@ingres.com  
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: jhill@sierra.com (Julie Hill)
Subject: Re: The Great Lab Debate
Organization: Sierra Geophysics Inc.,  Kirkland, Wa
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 14:43:23 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.142757.10788@sierra.com> jhill@sierra.com (Julie Hill) writes:
>In article <1684DA498.X005CB@tamvm1.tamu.edu> X005CB@tamvm1.tamu.edu (Chris Barnes) writes:
>>so in his book ("Water Dog").  The problem here is that the different
>>types of hunting dogs have different amounts training needed before
>>they are useful.  Hounds require virtually no training - they are
>>released and they run around barking like mad and it's up to the
>>hunter to keep up.
>
>Not true.  Bloodhounds used in Search and Rescue require quite a bit of
>training.  They must be taught to follow one scent, to search an area if they
>lose the scent, to indicate when an article that has the lost person's scent
>on it is found, to search for corpses as opposed to living people, etc.  Also,
>they are kept on leash when they are trailing.
>> 
>> 
Forgot to say that Bloodhounds are silent when trailing.

Julie

-- 
********************************************************************************
*  Julie Hill              Sierra Geophysics, Inc.              Kirkland, WA   *
*  jhill@sierra.com
********************************************************************************
From: lpj@col.hp.com (Laura Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Strange and Alarming Behaviour in Tazi
Date: 2 Sep 92 16:47:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: col.1992Sep2.164709.15944
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division

shedevil@vix.com (Anne P. Mitchell JD) writes:
> 
> We have NO clue as to what this behaviour was, let alone what caused
> it.  Tazi immediately was her old self, wagging her tail at Jess, etc,
> after this happened.  My mind is racing looking for explanations.. she
> was asleep and Jess startled her and in her sleep haze she didn't
> recognize Jess...or for some reason after a month alone with just me
> in the house she has forgotten that there is someone else who belongs
> in the house...

Possibly a combination of these two things. I've noticed similar behavior
(not so threatening, though; just "intruder barking") from my Irish setter
almost every time that my stepson Erik comes to stay with us. She *knows*
Erik; she likes him; but for the first few weeks he's in the house, she
needs to be fully awake and get a good look at him before she accepts that
yes, this is OK. After the first few weeks, she starts taking him for 
granted, recognizing his footsteps and the sound of his car, etc.  (Although
if she's waked out of a *really* sound sleep, she'll "intruder bark" even 
at me or my husband; then she looks really sheepish when she realizes.)
-- 
Laura Johnson
lpj@hpctdls.col.hp.com
Opinions expressed are my own, but may be licensed for a nominal fee.
From: walls@inland.com
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Invisible fences
Date: 1 Sep 92 11:08:06 CST
Organization: Inland Steel Company; East Chicago, IN

Hi, Netters!! I was wondering if someone could give me information on
invisible fences. Are these safe?? Do they protect animals from wandering?
Are they humane?? Any information would be greatly appreciated.
From: trimpe_b@wums.wustl.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: RE: Donating a puppy for auction (was Re: Puppy ID collars)
Date: 2 SEP 92 08:51:54 GMT
Organization: MIT PLASMA FUSION CENTER
NNTP-Posting-Host: msnews.wustl.edu

In a previous article, jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger) wrote:
>Someone asks:
>> How do [people] feel about donating pups to organization
>> like DU (ducks unlimited) to sell at auction?

>If I've understood the proposition correctly, we're talking
>about selling a dog to the highest bidder.  Anyone one who
>has the cash can bid.  No further screening will be performed.
>Is that correct?
>If so, I feel like throwing up.
>-- Jon 
>Jon Krueger  jpk@ingres.com  

	Okay okay okay- I agree that auctioning off dogs to impulse 
buyers is a bad idea but isn't this organization one of duck hunters??
What sort of dog is it?  If it's a (for example) Labrador isn't that
part of what labradors are all about??  Wouldn't an active duck hunter be 
likely to know what owning a hunting dog is all about??   Wouldn't the
dog likely lead a great life retrieving??  Okay so if this dog is a 
say collie it's probably not that great an idea- but what is the harm
if this dog is a lab, springer, setter or other type of hunting dog?
Would you feel differently if someone was auctioning off a dog to
'Dog Lovers Annonamous' where 'anyone who has the cash can bid'-?

Personally I believe the problem starts way before the auction.  Why
are these dogs being donated to begin with- a tax break? an extra
puppy?  These people should not be breeding period.

I really am serious- please no flames- sigh
I guess I just don't get the uproar.
Beverly
Wash Univ. Med School

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: bradav@auto-trol.com (Brad Davidson)
Subject: Re: Hunting ability in Labradors
Organization: Auto-trol Technology Corporation
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 05:41:28 GMT

>
>What do you do for the toy breeds? They were not bred to do work, they
>were bred to be companions. What about Dobermans? Require them to get a
>Schutzund 1 title? The Doberman Breed Club wants nothing to do with bite
>work. I don't see this idea working irrespective of the AKC goals...
>
>Scott Winders
>winders@aux.support.apple.com
>
>"My opinions are my own, not my employer's"

Who says a toy breed can not work? I know of a number of toy breeds that do
weight pulling and they are quite good.

The outstanding ones are:
Bridgette, a 14 pound poodle that pulls 525 pounds on wheels, 245 pounds on
    snow.
Punky, a 14 pound Chinese Crested that pulled 500 pounds on wheels.
Sally, a 8 pound Kerry Blue Terrier that pulled 250 pounds on wheels as a
    rookie.

Punky appears in the AKC video on Chinese Cresteds pulling.

So who says that Toy Breeds can not work.  I believe a breeder that does
anything more then showing is better than just showing.

Weight pulling a great sport for you and your dogs.

Brad Davidson
From: mlhb@mammoth.dr.att.com (BLO54626-BonhamM(DR2020)214)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Donating a puppy for auction (was Re: Puppy ID collars)
Date: 28 Aug 92 19:44:57 GMT


Why not simply you sell the puppy to the right home and give the money to your
favorite non-profit organization?  That way,

1.  You wouldn't have an impulse buyer
2.  You'd know whom the puppy went to (and presumably found a good owner)
3.  You could deduct the contribution on taxes

Everyone (including the puppy) wins.

Sky Warrior

-- 
-----------------------------                                              
SKY WARRIOR aka MLH Bonham  | "Good tea.  Nice House." -- Lt. Worf
mammoth!mlhb@druhi.att.com  |----------------------------------------------
mlhb@drutx.ATT.COM          | SKY WARRIOR RACING KENNELS - Coming to an
                            | Iditarod near you!
----------------------------- 
From: loftis@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Kirk Loftis)
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 15:36:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Dogs and Jogging
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server