HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pat@rwing.UUCP (Pat Myrto)
Newsgroups: seattle.general
Subject: Re: Bush's veto of family leave bill
Keywords: Family values
Date: 3 Oct 92 01:40:24 GMT
Distribution: seattle
Organization: Totally Unorganized

In article <1992Oct1.150229.3298@kopachuk.uucp> dcb@kopachuk.uucp (David Breneman) writes:
>In article <1992Sep29.180942.13930@eskimo.celestial.com> alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler) writes:
>>In article <1992Sep28.203508.16673@beaver.cs.washington.edu> craig@cs.washington.edu (Craig Anderson) writes:
>>>In article <1992Sep26.190047.5728@eskimo.celestial.com> alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler) writes:
>>>>If you are pulled
>>>>over for any reason there is an automatic search warrant for your car, 
>>>>including the trunk.

Much stuff about extension of 'lunging distance' to include trunk, glove
box, etc, and considetation of extending it to under the hood, towed
items, etc deleted...

I heard (urban rumor category) that if a container within the car that
is locked, and no key is present (such as a combination lock) that such
things cannot be searched without a warrant, because if it would require
actually busting it to gain access, it was not within the scope of this
lunging distance rule.

I believe the lunging distance thing originated for officer safety - the
officer had the right to ensure that any potential weapons were located
and removed from 'lunging distance' of the suspect so a stashed weapon
couldn't be lunged for, and used against the officer.  I have no problem
with that.  I have a BIG problem with extending it to areas WAY beyond
any kind of reach of the suspect (anything that would require fumbling,
or many seconds to gain acces to).  One could stretch it to include the
trunk, I suppose, since many trunks can be made accessable from within
the drivers compartment (the back seat is often the only barrier).  But
trailers, under the hood, etc makes little sense:  The officer is
supposed to remove the suspect from proximity of his car if there is
cause to suspect a problem.

So, I wonder if something the officer would have to break into would
be within the scope of 'lunging distance'?  The suspect's refusal to
open a combination lock (something that hardly can be operated with
the scope of a lunge) would seem to me to be a refusal of permission
for the officer to search it.  I also recall that there is a reasonable
time limit an officer can hold a person on a 'Terry Stop' without
either turnning the party loose, or actually placing him under arrest.

Anybody have any factual info on all this?

-- 
pat@rwing.uucp                                  (Pat Myrto),  Seattle, WA
                      If all else fails, try:
         ...!uunet!{pilchuck, polari}!rwing!pat
WISDOM:    "Travelling unarmed is like boating without a life jacket" 
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: jewell@Data-IO.COM (Cal Jewell)
Subject: Re: Best Doughnuts in Fremont/Ballard?
Summary: colon   dash   right parenthesis
Organization: Data I/O Corporation
Distribution: seattle
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1992 21:07:35 GMT

#In article <1992Sep24.040618.9864@polari>, hnoble@polari.online.com writes:
#
# A co-worker is bewailing his inability to find good doughnuts in
# Fremont or Ballard.   If any reader knows of a good doughnut shop,
# please post.  
#

Ask a cop. 

Alternately, you could keep your eyes out for a doughnut shop with one or
two police cars in front of it. 

Either way, you can't miss.

For the humor impaired, sprinkle with :-) where needed.

-- 
Cal...                        "Mmmmmmmm.  Purple."
 jewell@Data-IO.COM      
 ...!uunet!pilchuck!jewell         -- Homer Simpson
Newsgroups: seattle.general,alt.recovery
From: bill@Celestial.COM (Bill Campbell)
Subject: Wanted: Printer for Al-Anon directories
Organization: Celestial Software, Mercer Island, WA
Distribution: seattle
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 18:11:04 GMT

I'm looking for a printer to print the Al-Anon/Alateen meeting
directories for the Puget Sound area.  We run 12-15 thousand at a
time of a 32 page 3-3/8 x 4-1/4 directory on a web press.  The
printer who has been doing this doubled the price this time so
we're looking for another.

Thanks

Bill
-- 
INTERNET:  bill@Celestial.COM   Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!bill   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!bill   Mercer Island, WA 98040; (206) 947-5591
SPEED COSTS MONEY -- HOW FAST DO YOU WANT TO GO?
From: das@voodoo.boeing.com (Deb Schwartz)
Newsgroups: seattle.general
Subject: Wanted:  Unix book
Date: 5 Oct 92 17:39:26 GMT
Distribution: seattle
Organization: Yet Another Graphics Project, Bellevue, WA

Anyone have a copy of "Advanced Programming in the Unix Environment" by
W, Richard Stevens that they'd like to sell me?  Please email or call
me at 865-6558 during the day.

Thanks,

Debbie Schwartz // das@voodoo.boeing.com  // or uunet!bcstec!voodoo!das 
Xref: sparky seattle.general:3141 pnw.general:2178
From: celia@ssc-vax.boeing.com (Celia H Modell)
Newsgroups: seattle.general,pnw.general
Subject: Re: Tell Viacom Cable to add the SCI-FI Channel
Summary: write not call
Date: 28 Sep 92 16:56:06 GMT
Distribution: seattle
Organization: Boeing Defense and Space Group, Seattle WA

In article <5227@sumax.seattleu.edu>, casimir@sumax.seattleu.edu (Jim Lubin) writes:
> Viacom said they have a 36 channel capacity and that they are currently at
> 36 channels. If they get a large number of request to add the SCI-FI
> Channel, they will.
> 
> Please call!
We did call and were told to write.

Celia Modell


-- 
               >>>ALL OPINIONS EXPRESSED ARE MINE ALONE<<<
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
	  INTERNET: celia@ssc-bee.boeing.com         COMPMAIL: c.modell
	  UUCP: uw-beaver!bcsaic!ssc-bee!celia       COMPUSERVE: 72376,252
Xref: sparky seattle.general:3232 pnw.general:2249
From: sugm@Celestial.COM (Seattle Unix Group)
Newsgroups: seattle.general,pnw.general
Subject: OCTOBER SEATTLE UNIX GROUP MEETING
Date: 5 Oct 92 05:34:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: Celestia.1992Oct05.053425.4897
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Celestial Software, Mercer Island, WA


                  OCTOBER SEATTLE UNIX GROUP MEETING
                        MEETING TIME AND PLACE
        _______________________________________________________
        Topics: NT -- Microsoft Presentation
                UNIX Shells
          Time: October 13th 1992 (Second Tuesday) at 7pm
         Place: Mercer Island Community Center
                8236 SE 24th
                Mercer Island, WA (Next to Luther Burbank Park)
          Cost: $5.00 Non-Members.

 Will it be ``Daniel in the Lion's den'' or ``The Lion in Daniel's
 Den''?  Mark Lewin, Technical Evangelist for the System Developer
 Relations Group of Microsoft Corporation will be speaking about
 Microsoft's new operations system, Windows NT at our October meeting.
 Byte Magazine seems to think this may be the end of Unix.  Their
 September issue cover states ``Unix is at a crossroads.  Soon, Unix
 will face its most powerful adversary to date: Microsoft Windows NT.
 Will Unix survive?'' This may prove to be the most interesting meeting
 of the year, come early seating may be difficult to come by. Oct 13th
 at 7:00 PM.

 Also on the agenda will be a discussion on the three primary shells
 used in Unix - The Bourne Shell (/bin/sh), The C Shell (/bin/csh) and
 the K Shell (/bin/ksh).  We will talk about the advantages and
 disadvantages of each Shell as your main interactive shell and their
 use as scripting languages.

       DIRECTIONS TO Mercer Island Community Center @ Mercer View:
 Westbound I-90 from Bellevue        Eastbound I-90 from Seattle
 _______________________________________________________________________
 I-90 to Island Crest Exit   I-90 to 77th Street Exit
 Right one block past Light  Left at stop sign
                             Right at stop sign
                             Left at 1st intersection past traffic light
 Right at stop sign          Right at stop sign
 Left into Community Center  Left into Community Center

Bill Campbell
--
-- 
Seattle Unix Group          INTERNET: slug@Seaslug.ORG
6641 East Mercer Way            UUCP: camco!slug
PO Box 820                     VOICE: (206) 947-5591 
Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820     FAX: (206) 232-9186
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: gwynne@milton.u.washington.edu ()
Subject: Re: Remember to Register to Vote
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: seattle
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 20:38:50 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.202154.20522@u.washington.edu> gwynne@u.washington.edu writes:
>In order to vote in November's General Election, you MUST be
>During my primary voting,
>I saw 10 people come in to vote only to be sent away. 

Never try to post while under the influence of post grant deadline
fatigue. 

What I meant to say in my orignal post was that polling attendents
had to send several eager voters away because they weren't registered
in their current neighborhood.  

Bleh.

Kristan
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler)
Subject: Re: Bush's veto of family leave bill
Keywords: Family values
Organization: =>ESKIMO NORTH (206) 367-3837 SEATTLE, WA.<=
Distribution: seattle
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 18:09:42 GMT

In article <1992Sep28.203508.16673@beaver.cs.washington.edu> craig@cs.washington.edu (Craig Anderson) writes:
>In article <1992Sep26.190047.5728@eskimo.celestial.com> alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler) writes:
>>If you are pulled
>>over for any reason there is an automatic search warrant for your car, 
>>including the trunk.

>According to a Seattle Times article I read last month, this is not (yet)
>true.  Police still need consent in order to search a car if they
>don't have a warrent.

   Well, I'll have to re - look up the exact wording, but this was a 
supreme court decision a year or so ago that police do have the right
to check the trunk.  Maybe it just hasn't yet filtered down to a local
level.

-- 
****************************************************************************
* Dave                          *               The Alpinist               *
* alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com *            DARE to be stoopid!           *
****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: bill@Celestial.COM (Bill Campbell)
Subject: Re: Bush's veto of family leave bill
Organization: Celestial Software, Mercer Island, WA
Distribution: seattle
Date: Sat, 03 Oct 1992 16:17:59 GMT
Keywords: Family values

In <941@nazgul.UUCP> bright@nazgul.UUCP (Walter Bright) writes:

.....
:Naturally, all these costs are hidden because they are not accounted for
:using normal accounting techniques. This means that they appear "free" to
:politicians and gullible constituents.

A few thoughts on the family leave issue:
	1.	Having children isn't an emergency, but should be a
		conscious decision where one of the factors is job and the
		cost of supporting the child.  I'm continually amazed at
		the arguments that people have the right to have as many
		children as they want and expect someone else to bear the
		costs of raising them.
	
	2.	The last thing this world needs now is more people.  Does
		it help to have policies that make it easier to increase
		the world population?

	3.  It isn't an employer's responsibility to take care of the
		employee's family.  What employer would hire someone who
		has a serious illness in the family if it meant that the
		employer would be responsible for that family?

Bill
-- 
INTERNET:  bill@Celestial.COM   Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!bill   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!bill   Mercer Island, WA 98040; (206) 947-5591
SPEED COSTS MONEY -- HOW FAST DO YOU WANT TO GO?
Newsgroups: seattle.general,pnw.general
From: davidb@zeus.ce.washington.edu (David W. Barts)
Subject: Re: environmental costs of windpower
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 16:52:21 GMT

In article <MS-C.718176375.1103527590.mrc@Ikkoku-Kan.Panda.COM>, Mark Crispin <mrc@Ikkoku-Kan.Panda.COM> writes:
> If you think that windmills are environmentally neutral, go to one of the
> California windmill farms and see for yourself.  Better yet, *think* of what a
> windmill farm entails; a whole gaggle of tall towers with *large* propellers
> (remember, you have to get *more* joules of power out of the wind than what
> you generate -- laws of thermodynamics & all that -- and it takes a fair
> amount of umph to turn a generator), with various towers pointed in various
> directions to cover the directions the wind blows.  Can't have any trees (they
> block the wind).  Too bad about the birds.  Too bad about any use of the land.
> Too bad about the noise.

Based on these drawbacks, let's see how Rattlesnake Mountain fares as a
windmill site.  (Yes, I've seen Rattlesnake Mountain myself, in fact I
once lived in SE washington).  There are no trees within *miles* of it
-- just sagebrush and bunch grasses.  There are also no houses or even
farms within *miles* of it.  Aside from an observatory and a weather station
on the summit of the ridge (the mountain has a ridge that's 30-40 miles
long), there's nothing there.  Nobody to get annoyed from any windmill
noises.

They'd usually give the report from the RM weather observatory in the
local papers and TV stations when a storm came through, and Rattlesnake
Ridge does get a *lot* of wind.  When I heard that a wind power station
was being erected there, it struck me as the perfect location.

> Windmill farms are great if you are getting a tax credit to build 'em, don't
> have to turn a profit, and don't have to care about how they affect the
> locale.  They suck big time if they have to generate enough electricity to pay
> for their construction and maintenance, if you care about the environment
> around them,...

Wind power may not be as profitable as thermal or hydroelectric power,
but that's only because the latter generate huge economic externalities
that the utilities don't have to pay for -- they just force everyone
to cope with the crap they dump in the environment (or the cost
of disrupted river ecosystems in the case of hydro power).  Wind power
generated in a place like Rattlesnake Mountain generates little or no
externalities.

--
David Barts  N5JRN                      UW Civil Engineering, FX-10
davidb@ce.washington.edu                Seattle, WA  98195
Newsgroups: seattle.general,uw.general
From: dudgeon@milton.u.washington.edu (Doug Dudgeon)
Subject: recommendation on brake repair?
Reply-To:  dudgeon@opus.cheme.washington.edu
Organization: University of Washington
Distribution: seattle
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:11:19 GMT

I need to have the brakes serviced on my 88 Mustang:  new pads, rotors
resurfaced, etc.  The dealer wants too much, of course.  Midas & Walt's
want about 1/3 of what the dealer wants, which makes me wonder about just
what kind of job they could really do.

Any recommendations for (or against) a particular shop are greatly appreciated.
I'm looking for something in the U-District/Ravenna area, but I would be
willing to travel further for "the right shop."  Thanks.
-- 
Doug Dudgeon                              Dept. of Chemical Engineering, BF-10
dudgeon@opus.cheme.washington.edu         University of Washington, Seattle
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: graham@cs.washington.edu (Stephen Graham)
Subject: PAL/NTSC Conversion
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: seattle
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 15:09:51 GMT

A friend of a friend has a PAL format tape of her daughter's wedding in
Britain and would like it converted to American standards. Where in this
area does this and how much does it cost?

Thanks,
-- 
Stephen Graham
graham@cs.washington.edu	 uw-beaver!june!graham
Newsgroups: seattle.general,pnw.general
From: klg@statsci.com (Kevin L. Gross)
Subject: Re: Tell Viacom Cable to add the SCI-FI Channel
Reply-To: klg@statsci.com (Kevin L. Gross)
Organization: Statistical Sciences, Inc
Distribution: seattle
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:35:25 GMT

erik@tera.com (Erik Hedberg) writes:

   BTW, if the cable bill (just passed by Congress) reduces Viacom's
   income (some heated debate on this), they'll have less money available
   (per year) for upgrading their system.  I don't expect to see more
   channels on Viacom in my lifetime ... (I'm thinking about a satellite
   dish ;-).
   Erik

What they'll have is less profit. If they have some competition, perhaps
they will see the need to install the fiber with much more alacrity.

Four phone calls to Viacom, four different responses. Yah, I believe, I
believe. The veto King will likely veto it, since it is a long-term
solution instead of a short-term profit.

-- 
-Kevin L. Gross          klg@statsci.com           Disclaim THIS: 
 This message is protected under the 1st Amendment to the Constitution
 of the United States of America. I'm protected under the 4th, 5th, 9th
 and 14th Amendments among others, or at least I used to be.
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: kevin@milton.u.washington.edu (Kevin Caskey)
Subject: Re: Bush's veto of family leave bill
Keywords: Family values
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: seattle
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 15:58:16 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.045922.1626@seanews.akita.com> billmcc@seanews.akita.com (Bill McCormick) writes:
>In article <1992Oct2.014801.7422@mdd.comm.mot.com> zintel@mdd.comm.mot.com (Mike Zintel) writes:
>>In article <938@nazgul.UUCP> bright@nazgul.UUCP (Walter Bright) writes:
>>>If you have unlimited free health care, and tons of leave for various reasons
>>>mandated by law, then you will no longer have a robust and productive
>>>economy.
>>
>>Do I have this straight?
>>
>>A robust and productive economy is more important than health.
>
>Lines like this always take me back to bedtime stories.  This one makes
>me think about the story of the "Goose That Laid The Golden Egg."  Even
>now I can hear the farmer say something like:
>
>   "Do I have this straight?  A healthy goose is more important than golden
>    eggs."
>
>If you want to sacrifice a robust economy for short-term gains you are
>doing nothing less than attempting to kill that goose.
>
>Bill

Bill,
Normally, I don't follow-up on this sort of thing but...
In general our economy is not outperforming european economies such as 
Germany. Sure, Germany is having a bit of trouble right now but try to 
put this in scale. They are absorbing overnight a country with a much weaker
economy than theirs and one fourth the population. They will succeed after
some start up jitters. They have had all the welfare stuff you hate since
they invented the stuff in the 1870's.

Could our robust economy absorb a country of 6o million (US pop. * .25)
with the success Germany will shortly have? We have problems here but
family leave would not be one of them. The Economist magazine (not a leftist
rag by any means) did a study on national health systems. It disliked ours
on one end of the spectrum and England's on the other. What they liked best 
were the systems in the middle. Yes they liked the German system but thought
that the Dutch system was possibly a bit better.

On the subject of family leave, they site  a US insurance company that
actually reduced employment related costs when it introduced a liberal
family leave program (if you want to check it out, it's the issue I received
Saturday last).

Look around, gather facts, check out alternatives, THEN form an opinion.

Kevin
From: dgeary@sierra.com (David Geary)
Newsgroups: seattle.general
Subject: Recommendations for FireWood
Date: 30 Sep 92 00:08:11 GMT
Distribution: seattle
Organization: Sierra Geophysics,  Kirkland WA


  Can anyone recommend a place in the South end to buy a cord of
wood?  I have no idea how much wood a cord should be, and therefore
I'd prefer an honest individual to buy from.  Also, whomever I buy from
must be able to deliver (I live in Auburn), as I don't think I can quite 
fit a cord into my Honda CRX (I *do* know a cord is bigger than that ;-).

  Thanx, 


-- 
David Geary           	|   Seattle - America's most attractive city ... 
Sierra Geophysics	|	
dgeary@sierra.com	|   to the jetstream ;-(
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: mckenzie@cs.washington.edu (Neil McKenzie)
Subject: Re: PAL/NTSC Conversion
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: seattle
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 16:44:05 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.150951.15796@beaver.cs.washington.edu> graham@cs.washington.edu (Stephen Graham) writes:
>A friend of a friend has a PAL format tape of her daughter's wedding in
>Britain and would like it converted to American standards. Where in this
>area does this and how much does it cost?

Or, just view the PAL tape on a PAL player.  Scarecrow Video rents
PAL equipment (TV & VCR).  They're on Latona at 65th, between I-5 and
Green Lake.
-- 
--Neil McKenzie 
mckenzie@cs.washington.edu	UUCP: ..!uw-beaver!uw-june!mckenzie
The army: the great prince issues commands, founds states, vests families
with fiefs.  Inferior people should not be employed.  (The I-Ching)
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: gregs@polari.online.com
Subject: Re: U Dist. Restaurants?
Organization: Seattle Online Public Access Unix.  (206) 328-4944 (all lines telebit-equipped)
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 20:40:22 GMT

das@voodoo.boeing.com (Deb Schwartz) writes:

>In article <machman.718055106@milton> machman@milton.u.washington.edu (The Machman) writes:
>>
>>Try the Last Exit on Brooklyn, just south of 40th st.  They have 
>>espresso, coffee, teas, sandwiches, soups, desserts, etc., and
>>a unique atmosphere.
>>
>He's right that it's a great place, but be forwarned:  the unique
>atmosphere he mentions is tobacco smoke, lots of it (unless it's
>changed - I haven't been in there for about 2 years).

Try Stella's.  It's open 24hrs and has great food.  It's an Italian place
(actually, a "tratoria") located on 45th ave and about Roosevelt, I think.
It's below the Metro cinemas.  

-- 
Gregory Sumner                        ::
gregs@polari.online.com               ::               Go Dawgs! 
Seattle, Wa                           :: 3-0
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: green@fylz.wa.com (Washington Green)
Subject: Parenti Video, Sunday Oct 4
Organization: Washington Green -- State Newsletter of the Greens
Distribution: seattle
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 17:00:37 GMT

On Sunday, October 4, a video tape of Michael Parenti titled
"Democracy and Popular Struggle" will be shown at 549 NE 80th in
Seattle.  (Grey house with white trim.)  The video will start at
7:30pm.  The presentation is free.

This video is from a talk that Parenti gave at Cypress College.  It
deals with the dual nature of democracy, how procedural formal
democracy is strengthened and strengthens the struggle for economic
democracy.

For more info on this and other upcoming videos, call 526-2919 and
press 6.
-- 
Washington GREEN -- the newsletter of the Washington State Greens
8315 Lake City Way #207, Seattle, WA 98115  -- (206)526-2919 x28
Newsgroups: seattle.general
From: markz@ssc.com (Mark Zenier)
Subject: Re: --Utility to Buy Windpower
Organization: SSC, Inc.,  Seattle, WA
Distribution: seattle
Date: Sun, 04 Oct 1992 01:24:46 GMT
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

noah@cs.washington.edu (Rick Noah Zucker) writes:
: 	I don't understand.  Why would the wind power plant be opposed on
: environmental grounds?  Because of its appearance?  Because it may harm
: wildlife?

Because the Tri-cities (Richland, Kennewick, Pasco) are the Pro-Nuclear 
center of the country, and they don't like to be proved how wrong they've 
been about the cost disadvantages of alternative energy.  ;-)

Mark Zenier  markz@ssc.wa.com  

Newsgroups: seattle.general,pnw.general