From: tallman%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Robert Oliver)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc,rec.arts.startrek.tech
Subject: TIMELINES - I don't think so - RESPONSE
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 92 01:24:36 EDT
Reply-To: tallman%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Robert Oliver)
Organization: Ailanthus Project

 
     Where's the old Stone-Finkas timeline gone when I need it?   
:-)Sorry to rain on Tallman's parade, but TPTB have basically put TOS 
inthe timeframe of 2264-2270.  The "five year discrepancy" is *not*  from 
an error by Picard.  The Sarek ages are what finally nailed downthe 
correct years.Of course if you want to believe that the first Kirk year 
was 2270, goright on...  But don't expect me to go for this timeline any 
more thanI'd try to push the old FASA 2207-2212 scheme.Dave.* * * * *
 
 
Sorry, but I'm not running a parade and I'm not "pushing" anything. There 
are more references to the original series than just the Sarek reference. 
If I'm not mistaken the Stone-Finkas timelline consists of a large amount 
of fabricated material. Not to put down their creative efforts, but 
anybody can just make things up. Here you go Dave, a whole bunch of 
senseless, mindless ramblings on my part that you I know you will 
casually dismiss.
 
Note: logical speculation would have each season as being 1 year.
 
STAR TREK : THE ORIGINAL SERIES
 
1. No actual references to the years the series is set in is ever made.
 
2. Season 1 - the events of "Space Seed"
 
3. Season 2 - the events of "Journey to Babel" Sarek states his age as 
102.437 years
 
STAR TREK: THE MOVIE SERIES
 
1. No actual references to the years the movies are set in is ever made
 
2. ST:TMP - The Enterprise refit (presumably right after her return from 
the 5-year mission) has taken 1 1/2 years
 
3. ST:TWOK - Khan paraphrased, "You see here all that remains of the crew 
of the Botany Bay, marooned here fifteen [15] years ago by Captain James 
T. Kirk." Kirk paraphrased, "There is a man out there I haven't seen in 
fifteen [15] years trying to kill me..." These are two references to the 
time span of FIFTEEN years, not twenty. A few people have suggested that 
these numbers were just rounded off from twenty (or 21 if you are trying 
to get the date 2264 out of this). Why would anybody round off the number 
15 to 20? This makes no sense at all. As a genetic superman with a vast 
intellect I have a really hard time believing that Khan would round off 
the date of a VERY important part of his life or forget it. Kirk has been 
in Khan's mind from the very day he was left on Ceti Alpha. The events of 
ST:TWOK take place in 2285, as indicated in the TNG Tech Manual. I accept 
the manual as canon due to its authors. In essence, Okuda & Sternbach can 
be considered part of The Powers That Be (your reference) as they have 
worked in the movies (Okuda, at least) and on TNG and are responsible for 
creating a good deal of the visual and technical aspects of the show. If 
they aren't official, then nobody is. This puts season one of TOS in the 
year 2270. Grab a calculator if the math is too intensive. Also, the 
vintage of Romulan ale McCoy gives to Kirk is 2283. If season one occurs 
in 2264 then ST2 must take place in the year 2279. How does McCoy get ale 
from the future? Obviously he stole a starship, slingshot himself around 
the sun and arrived in the future (whatever year required for the '83 to 
age appropriately). He then reversed the process (McCoy is such an 
engineer) and returned himself to "2279". Ayuh!
 
4. ST:TSFS - Set in the same year as ST:TWOK. Admiral Morrow says that 
the Enterprise is 20 years old, putting the Enterprise's construction at 
2265. The E has been around longer than that, 2245 by the TNG Tech 
manual. 2265 is close, however, to a refit I think the E underwent before 
TOS. The model and sets from "The Cage" differ from those used in the 
rest of the series.
 
5. ST:TVH - Set in 2286 (TNG Tech Manual) TNG premeired in 1987 and was 
said to be 78 years after the voyages of the original crew, which at the 
time would have been ST4. It was revealed in the first season TNG episode 
"The Neutral Zone" that the year was 2364. Here's the math: 2364 - 78 = 
2286.
 
6. ST:TFF - Assumed to be in the same year (about three months later). 
Nimbus III is settled 20 years ago, around 2266. Being that this date is 
before the events of TOS's season one "Balance of Terror" in which it is 
stated that Romulans have never been seen before. Many people (and I can 
understand this) believe this means that Nimbus could not have been 
settled on this date. I have many pet theories that can easily explain 
this, most of them centering around that fact that governments do not 
always tell their citizens everything. Governments (including the UFP, 
witness the Genesis Incident) LOVE to hide things from the populace that 
they consider dangerous. The expiramental colonization of Nimbus III 
(doomed to failure) is probably one of those things.
 
7. ST:TUC - Although the novelization of the movies are not considered 
canon, the authors must be privy to information that is not directly 
presented in the movie. It is mentioned more than once in the ST6 
novelization that the events of tha last two movies occurred more than 10 
years ago (and I believe, more specifically, 10 1/2 years ago). This 
would put the date at 2297. I beleive this date is confirmed (or at least 
helped a bit) by McCoy's statement in the trial that he has been the CMO 
aboard the Enterprise for 27 years. 2297 - 27 = 2270. The Dr. in the 
second pilot "Where No Man Has Gone..." was Dr. Piper, who was presumably 
replaced by Dr. McCoy shortly after.
 
STAR TREK: THE NEXT GENERATION
 
1. Season 1 - "The Neutral Zone" the date is stated as 2364.
 
2. Season 3 - We assume to be the year 2366. Picard says that Sarek is 
202. 2364 - 100 = 2264 by Dave's reasoning. Should the events of TOS 
hinge on this one reference?  Why is it assumed that Picard knows Sarek's 
exact age? I propose a short quiz. From the top of your head, with no 
pauses or trips to a reference book, answer the following:
 
George Bush's age
Dan Quayle's age (if you know this, drop a line to Dan)
The US ambassador to Russia's age
Saddam Hussein's age
Hitler's age when he died
 
These people (excluding Dan) can be considered to be reletively important 
figures to the average American, but I doubt that anybody knows their 
exact ages. Sarek is without a doubt an important figure in the UFP, but 
there is no reason that Picard MUST know his age. Picard seems to have 
made a simple mistake. Dave's only reasoning that I can see (and please 
give me more if you have it) to put TOS in 2264 comes from this one 
source. 
     Well, there you have it. The insane drivel of complete idiot. I 
obviously don't have CLUE when it comes to timelines. On a less sarcastic 
note I've heard that Mike Okuda is working on an "official" timeline 
(perhaps as part of a second TNG tech manual?) and maybe he will set the 
record straight.
 
 - Robert Oliver
   October 1, 1987 (or is it 1997, I don't really know)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc,rec.arts.startrek.current