HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: shaig@Think.COM (Shai Guday)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport,rec.autos.tech
Subject: Surface Area (was Re: Tires : Slicks vs. Treaded: Help Please)
Date: 7 Oct 1992 16:00:16 GMT
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.think.com

In article <bassek.718451041@vipunen.hut.fi>, bassek@lesti.hut.fi (Basse Kankkonen) writes:
|> 
|> It ocurred to me that the formula of friction is F=u*m*g
|> (u=constant of friction,m=mass,g=acc. 9.81m/s^2)
|> This means that the traction is not depending on the area.
|> BUT the constant u is depending on the temperature, and a tire with less
|> area heats up faster and it will decrease the lifetime of the tire and the 
|> grip of course.
|> (Thats why cars don't use bicycle wheels!!!)

One correction.  While the above formula is correct, it is a common
mistake to apply it to tires in such a manner.  The reason for this
is *drumroll* statistics!  When applied to the surface area you are
assuming that all of the tire's surface area is in contact with the
tarmac.  This assumption is faulty due to inevitable inconsistencies
in the road surface.  The dynamic nature of the contact requires
highly complex modeling, the reason for numerical analysts being part
of the research staff at all major tire developers.

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: wayned@cbnewse.cb.att.com (wayne.martin.degrange)
Subject: Re: top 5 drivers/top 3 tracks
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 19:20:28 GMT
Summary: top 5 drivers (read my favorites) top 3 tracks too.


I like the way this conversation has been going, giving
everyone a chance to share their favorite drivers and
tracks.  For me it is as follows:

Top 5 Drivers (alphabetical order,of those that have raced in the last
1 or 2 years):

	1  Dale Earnheart	
	2  A.J. Foyte
	3  Rick Mears  (No one alive can match him on the ovals)
	4  Nelson Piquet
	5  Ayrton Senna
	
Top 3 Tracks (alphabetical order):

	1  Indianapolis (does 240mph straights get your attention)
	2  Monza (I guess I like high speed)
	3  Spa  (like that hair-pin in turn one)
	
Well there you have it, I've been slightly more subjective
than anyone else, but I think the picks have merit.

Wayne
From: ah335@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard Banks)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: %Brakes - technology - F1
Date: 16 Oct 1992 19:35:20 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: ah335@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard Banks)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


I think Richard Welty already said the main thing that limits brake rotor
size if wheel diameter.  So move the brakes closer to the center of the
axle out of the wheel area?  This would help the center of balance yes,
but now you have unsprung weight, right?  How significant is it?
And if you might try this idea on a F1 car I would think the rotors
would get in the way of the uprights and pushrod, plus add drag.
But they would stay cooler.
From: ajd@DIALix.oz.au (Anthony Doig)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Indy in urope???!!!
Date: 16 Oct 92 03:07:30 GMT
Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Western Australia

In <1992Oct14.170443.22241@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> dwood@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Deron A Wood) writes:

>Interesting tidbit in USA Today (10-14), and I quote

>"The IndyCar cicuit reached agreement with the Federation International Sport 
>Auto to stage up to six international oval races next season.

How many ovals in Europe are there that are capable of running Indycars.
There is an oval at Calder, Australia that runs NASCARs (I don't know about
Indycars, though), but this is the only one I have heard of outside North
America.

Doigman.
-- 
Anthony Doig					| E-mail : ajd@Dialix.oz.au
Corporate Systems Development			| Voice  : +61 9 321 2442
Perth, Western Australia			| Fax    : +61 9 474 2553
--
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: plamoia@encore.com (Pete LaMoia)
Subject: Miami track
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:10:22 GMT


  RE: new Miami track.

  There have been a few articles in the Miami Herald,  and  one  in
  Autoweek, which talk about a new track in the city of North Miami
  Beach.  Cutting to the chase, the main  problem  is  getting  the
  "blue-hairs/condo-commandos"   to   allow   the   N.M.B.   zoning
  department to  approve  the  action.   The  city  commission  has
  approved the idea.

  The location is (for  those  of  you  familiar  with  north  Dade
  County)  the old Interama/Munisport dump site, near the corner of
  US1 and 163st, adjacent to  FIU  North  campus.   Promoter  Ralph
  Sanchez  (Miami  IMSA  Grand Prix) is trying to get this new site
  going because his lease with the city of Miami for  the  downtown
  race  is  running  out in 1997.  This site would be logical: it's
  now a toxic waste dump, and erecting  a  permanent  facility/park
  could  not  do  any  more harm, in fact, I believe that Sanchez's
  plans include a clean-up before starting construction.

  On 6-26-92 the Miami Herald ran a  brief  article  with  a  small
  picture  of  the  site plan; it looks fan-f***ing-tastic!  It's a
  2.1 mile permanent track (is that enough for  F1?)  with  a  nice
  long straight and some hellacious tight hairpins and wide curves!
  The plans also show a lodge (hotel?) at the end of the straight.

  Earlier this year, Gary Long, a Herald writer,  had  a  long  and
  positive  article  about this subject titled "IndyCars may return
  to Miami in 2 years." He said that Ralph Sanchez had  a  contract
  to  build the track, and that he'd even consider running races on
  both tracks, assuming that the new one is approved and  he  can't
  get  out  of  the  one  in downtown Miami.  He also said that the
  other option, to secure the date, would be to run the IndyCars on
  the downtown track until the new one is built!

  INDYCARS IN DOWNTOWN MIAMI, I like the sound of that!

  F1 IN NORTH MIAMI, I like the sound of that as well!!

  In my humble opinion, the Miami area would be a PERFECT place for
  F1  in  the US: with the sun/surf/glamour/boats and international
  connections to South America, it could be another Monaco.

--
Pete LaMoia (plamoia@encore.com)
=================================
Xref: sparky rec.autos.sport:11326 rec.autos.tech:14040
From: bsherman@pyrxbooter.eng.pyramid.com (Brad Sherman)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: TBS Coverage of the MY500
Date: 12 Oct 92 21:04:09 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View

>One quick look at Bill pulling the car into the pits certainly proved
>that his rear axle was grossly out of alignment, but the TBS crew sure
>didn't seem to notice.
>
>Ever notice that whatever race Ken Squier is calling, it sounds just
>like the Daytona 500 on CBS?  "Stay tuned for flag to flag coverage..."
>
>-cball-

It also appears as if TBS' coverage of WC events will be expanding in
coming years.  I hate to see this happening.  ESPN has spoiled me so.
If there were an MRN affiliate somewhere in the area, I'd turn the
TV set down and turn on the radio so I don't have to listen to TBS'
audio - Squier is almost more than I can bare.

Brad
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: pmh2962@tamsun.tamu.edu (Patrick Michael Hayes)
Subject: Re: Jr & Flossie - NOT!
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 16:36:53 GMT

In article <402@rehab1.UUCP> dans@rehab1.UUCP (Dan Schein) writes:
>
>    It appears the bit of news someone else on the net didnt want to
>  post about junior johnson (RE: his moving the 2nd team across the
>  holler) is that he has filled for divorce. Turns out flossie does
>  not know where jr is currently living and that they havent lived
>  together for over a year.
>  -Dan
-----------------------------
Howdy!

That's interesting.  Remeber when Jr was canned by NASCAR for a couple
races?  The JJ cars were entered as owned by Flossie, and the
numbers were changed.  That's where Hut Stricklin's "97" you saw
this weekend (the JJ development car -- that JJ pulled to get BE
a couple more points when the trackbar gave out) came from.

Question?  Does Flossie "own" number "97"?

_IF_ the above is true, its a shame.  Racing, like some other
occupations, can be hell on a marriage, huh?

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pat Hayes, Meteorology, TAMU  <whoop!>  " ... Aggie by the grace of God."
net: phayes@tamu.edu -or- O&M 1008, TAMU, CS, TX 77843-3150 (409)845-1680 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky rec.autos.sport:11316 rec.autos.tech:14017
From: rodder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Jon D. Rodder)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport,rec.autos.tech
Subject: Re: Tires : Slicks vs. Treaded: Help Please
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:36:58 GMT
Followup-To: rec.autos.sport
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <bassek.718451041@vipunen.hut.fi> bassek@lesti.hut.fi (Basse Kankkonen) writes:
>
>It ocurred to me that the formula of friction is F=u*m*g
>(u=constant of friction,m=mass,g=acc. 9.81m/s^2)
>This means that the traction is not depending on the area.
>BUT the constant u is depending on the temperature, and a tire with less
>area heats up faster and it will decrease the lifetime of the tire and the 
>grip of course.

First, that formula only applies to dry friction with no wear.  There is
considerable wear occuring when the tire is skidding. 
Also, the coeeficient of static friction of a given tire is a function of
the temperature of the tire.  Its not very noticeable in street tires,
but there is a world of difference as far as traction goes between 80F
and 180F with Goodyear slicks (180F being the "operating temp" for the ones
I've used).  At 80F, they are fairly hard...  and 180F they are quite
sticky.


-- 
--=< Jon D. Rodder ----- rodder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu >=-- 
    \    IRC-Op at tramp.cc.utexas.edu (Rodder)   /
     \    89 Jeep Wrangler - 258/PIECE OF JUNK!  / 
      \        79 Rx-7 - 12A/Holley 4bbl        / 
       \________67 Camaro RS - 350/4spd________/ 
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: chuck@eos.ncsu.edu (Chuck Kesler)
Subject: Re: Motorsports vs. Traditional Sports
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project EOS
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 01:41:30 GMT

In article <1992Oct13.205454.29245@hubcap.clemson.edu> andy@newton.cs.clemson.edu (Andrew J. Greenshields N3IGS) writes:
>In article <1992Oct13.194156.25712@cbnewsm.cb.att.com> rlsx@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (russell.l.stauffer) writes:
>>
>>... No public (or
>>private) school will have auto racing as a sport, although some vo-tech
>>type schools will build a street-stock for the local bullring.
>>
>  I have often thought what a great sport inter-collegiate single
>seater racing would be.  Most universities have all the departments
>necessary to form a competative team.  You have the engineering and
>science departments to design and build a chassis and engine.  The
>business department could handle the sponsorship side of things.  Most
>universities have enough on campus roads to make a decent track.  I
>suppose this is something of dream though.  It would bring a whole new
>meaning to college sports :)
>

You're not alone!  I've often looked at our College of Engineering and
thought that it would be great project to set all of the departments off
on.  We've got a wind tunnel that the aerospace guys could use to do 
the aerodynamics, mechanical engineers to handle suspensions and engines, 
materials and textile engineers to work with composites, and all sorts 
of electrical and computer engineers to handle the various electronic
wizardry.  Toss in the chemistry types for brewing up something like Elf's
finest, some physicists and mathematicians for R&D, and I didn't even think
of bringing in the business folks for running the whole thing, but that's
a great idea too.  Now there's a school sport for you!  Students can 
actually learn something while participating.  Who needs this stupid
basketball and football stuff...what a waste of resources! :-)

So whaddya say Andy, F-ACC (Formula ACC)?? :-)

-chuck-

-- 
   Chuck Kesler                     |  Internet:   chuck@eos.ncsu.edu
   Unix Systems Programmer          |  US Mail:    Box 7901, NCSU Campus 
   Engineering Computer Operations  |              Raleigh, NC 27695 USA
   North Carolina State University  |  Phone:      +1 919 515 2458
From: dan@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Danilo Silva)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Speed Comparison
Date: 12 Oct 92 17:47:26 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO  80523

I was watching a motorcycle race on TV and wondering how those bikes (500s)
would compare to F1 on a same track. I understand that a bike is usually
faster than a car (like 0-60 in 2.7 sec for ZX11), but F1 ...???

Anyone ???
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: garyl@moe.corollary.COM (Gary Lorman)
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison
Organization: Corollary, Inc. Irvine CA
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 02:36:37 GMT

In article <Oct12.174726.15809@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> dan@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Danilo Silva) writes:
>I was watching a motorcycle race on TV and wondering how those bikes (500s)
>would compare to F1 on a same track. I understand that a bike is usually
>faster than a car (like 0-60 in 2.7 sec for ZX11), but F1 ...???
>
>Anyone ???

Well, a few years ago, I saw a test (on TV). It was between a high
performance street car (Mustang I think), A racing bike, and a
Indy car.  They gave the Mustang about 1/2 of a lap headstart over
the bike, and then another 1/4 of the track before the Indy car started.
All started from the same starting point, from a standstill.
I forget which track, but I think it was about 3 miles long.
Well the Indy car passed the bike, just before they (bike and Indy car)
passed the Mustang, which was several turns before the end of the lap.
So correct me if I wrong, but I don't think any bike can match
the performance of a Indy or F1 car.
-- 
--garyl-------------------------------------------------------------------------
		"Any shark that gets to be 11 or 12 feet long with 
	      300 big teeth can be considered dangerous" - 'Shark Bowl '92'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1 Rules update
Date: 16 Oct 92 00:47:00 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

MJackson.Wbst147@XEROX.COM (Mark Jackson) writes...
>In article 14OCT199223023473@utarlg.uta.edu, b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu
>(George M. Smiley) writes:
> 
>> In case you missed Speedworld. . .
> 
>> IndyCars have been granted permission to
>> run at most 6 races outside U.S/Canada but
>> they all must be ovals. 
> 
>> . . .Surfers Paradise isn't a oval
>> and it is on the 93 schedule, so I don't think CART cares
>> too much about getting FISA's permission to race.
> 
>As clearly stated on ESPN's Speedworld, and mentioned in other
>postings, the six oval races are in *addition* to the existing event at
>Surfers Paradise.
> 
>Mark <MJackson.Wbst147@Xerox.COM>
> 
>     Sloppy thinking gets worse over time
>				- Jenny Holzer
>
I'll agree that it was an ill-formed sentence. The point was that Surfers
Paradise has been on the CART scheldule for the last two years and will 
to be on the scheldule for as long as it remains profitable. FISA giving
permission for a race that has already taken place is twice is ridiculous.
Furthermore, FISA granting CART anything is even more ridiculous. If a 
promoter would of put up enough money and the timing was right CART
would of been running ovals outside the US years ago. FISA is just
trying to save face by this 11th hour announcement, only problem is
they come of looking like complete fools in the process. Perhaps if
they had worried about WSC more and what CART was doing less we would
still have a decent World Sports Car class to watch for next year.  
Please don't send me mail over something as trivial as pragmatic
sentences formed late at night, my mail file is too large as it is.

George
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bassek@lesti.hut.fi (Basse Kankkonen)
Subject: Rocket fuel banned from F1!
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date: 14 Oct 92 09:12:04 GMT

Finally FISA made the decision about the fuel used in f1. Next year the
fuel may only have common ingredients (like normal unleaded fuel).
Only Elf was against this decision (Surprising???-Not really). They will
continue their battle with FISA in court .(So far only a rumour).

 This means that the small teams have a chance of succeeding next year,
the fuel prices will be under $200 per litre. Williams might not be so
dominating next year.

Basse
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
***               I can resist anything but temptation                      ***
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
     bassek@vipunen.hut.fi ,  @taltta.hut.fi  ,  pkankkon@otax.tky.hut.fi
From: squigg@gssec.bt.co.uk (Stephen Quigg)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Another new F1 car not mentioned
Date: 15 Oct 92 11:26:54 GMT
Organization: BT Glasgow Systems and Software Engineering Centre, Scotland.


-- 
Did I miss something earlier ?
Autocar (I think) also said that Reynard was going up a formula next year as
well ,or is it just that Reynard IS Pacific ....

I'm definate that Reynard has an F1 car under development ,but it could be for
the '94 season and not '93 ????

Could someone please clarify this ?

thanks.....
Stephen Quigg
squigg@gssec.bt.co.uk 
British Telecom , GSSEC , Glasgow
(Nothing in any of my mail represents my Employer in any way)
From: pete@minster.york.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Top Five Drivers/Top Three Tracks
Date: 8 Oct 92 10:43:21 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of York, England
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Top 5 drivers:

	1)	Gilles Villeneuve -- sums up what motorsport is all about
	2)	Jim Clark	  -- the ultimate talent
	3)	Stirling Moss	  -- could drive _anything_ well
	4)	Ronnie Peterson	  -- the most exciting driver ever
	5)	Chris Amon	  -- beautiful to watch, hideously unlucky

Top 3 circuits:

	1)	Spa - either the original or the newer version
	2)	Monza before the chicanes
	3)	the Oesterreichring

Pete
--
*Peter Fenelon -- Research Associate -- Software Safety Assessment Procedures*
Dept. of Computer Science, University of York, York, Y01 5DD (+44 0904 433388)
EMAIL: pete@minster.york.ac.uk (or pete%minster.york.ac.uk@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk)
QUOTE:`Money warps engineering judgement' -- Alan Mertens, Galmer Engineering.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: taylor@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Ross Taylor,Peyt312,6652,2655436)
Subject: Re: Senna test drive Williams
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 14:28:04 GMT

From article <1b0qt4INNs56@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>, by humpty@tartarus.uwa.edu.au (Daniel Ong):
> cheung@mlb.geomechanics.csiro.au (Lawrence Cheung) writes:
> 
[Stuff deleted]
> 
> Prost et al were using the smaller tires in preparation for next year. 
> Therefore their times were expected to be slower than this year's times.
> I bet if you got Mansell to test on the smaller tires, he wouldn't have
> been able to handle it and would have been a lot slower than Prost. 

This claim is absurd and based on no evidence.  I should have ignored
it.

> After all, Prost beat the shit out of him during the Ferrari days.

I suggest you consult the record books.  It is true that Prost garnered
(there I am using that word that Pat Hayes liked so much) more points
than did NM during their one year together.  It is not true that
Prost was consistently faster than NM. Check the records before you
make statements like this.  In fact, AP and NM were fastest about
the same number of times.  If memory serves (and I did check this
some time ago but am no longer completely sure) NM had a number
of poles and AP had none that year.

I think it is generally accepted that keke Rosberg was one of the
very fastest of drivers.  If you consult the records for the year
that Rosberg and Mansell spent together at Williams you will find
that NM was frequently faster than KR.

I agree that qualifying is not necessarily a test of driver ability.
Senna, however, has made quite a career of it.

My point is only that claims that AP is/was/will-be better than NM
or (insert your least favorite driver here) usually are flawed
and very often are not supported by actual data.

Ross Taylor
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1: Re: Notes from Portugal
From: sam@dac.mdcbbs.com
Date: 8 Oct 92 11:14:41 PST
Organization: MDC - Douglas Aircraft, Long Beach, CA
Nntp-Posting-User: sam

In article <1992Oct7.190914.7449@gdr.bath.ac.uk>, bspahh@gdr.bath.ac.uk (Andrew Henry) writes:
> 
> A rumour from the weekend at Nazareth was that Mansell's contract
> at Newman/Haas would be bought out by a Formula One team (Williams
> or Ferrari ?).  Another Indycar team has apparently offered Ayrton
> Senna the same deal as Mansell has at Newman/Haas !
> 
> 
> 			Andrew  Henry
> Sempre  Gilles					bspahh@gdr.bath.ac.uk

Second Hand Rumor Department:  Senna is in negotiations with Ganassi Racing.
     Look for a possible anouncement this weekend at Laguna.  If this works
     out to be true, I can see Bernie and Max going into convulsions!
     Imagine what this will do for CARTs international image efforts!


-- 
   Robert Arance                       Douglas Aircraft
                                       Long Beach, California

   "It's better to go into work slow, and come out fast,
    than to go into work fast and come out dead."
From: nyberg@lut.fi (Juha Nyberg)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: WILLIAMS DRIVERS
Date: 12 Oct 92 20:01:24 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Lappeenranta University of Technology, Finland

I heard that Williams still wants Hakkinen
to be their driver. Williams would buy him
from Lotus to be their second driver. Could
anyone confirm this, or am I wrong again ??
--
Juha nyberg                Thy say that there is someboby better than me
email nyberg@lut.fi                 but I haven't found one yet.
Xref: sparky rec.autos.sport:11075 rec.autos.tech:13724