HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: helz@ecn.purdue.edu (Randall A Helzerman)
Subject: Re: FCC will proclaim Microsoft is run by Communists! : )
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 20:27:57 GMT

In article <8296@lib.tmc.edu>, jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard) writes:
|> In article <1993Jan4.003455.13434@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> helz@ecn.purdue.edu (Randall A Helzerman) writes:
|> >You didn't answer the question!  If the FCT rules against Microsoft and Microsoft
|> >offers to change its ways by becomming like McDonalds, would you be satisfied?
|> 
|> Sure. No supplier would go for it, and MS would fold up like a house of cheap
|> cards.

Wait a minute!  I thought that Microsoft as a big evil monopoly could force
them to do anything!  The above statement is an admission that Microsoft
can't force a vendor into doing anything which the vendor doesn't think is
in his best interest.

_Any_ company, be it Standard Oil, U.S. Steel, or Microsoft, will fold like
a house of cheap cards if it doesn't offer its customers deals which they
like.  And the bigger they are the harder they fall.

|> >I've lived in many southern Indiana towns where McDonald's has a monopoly in 
|> >the local fast food Market.  Do you think that McDonald's is being "sleezy"
|> >in those small towns by forcing them not to well Wendy's burgers? Should the 
|> >FTC force McDonalds in small towns to sell Kentucky Fried Chicken?
|> 
|> McDonalds is protecting its trademarks from dilution by preventing those who
|> have the rights to use them - its franchisees - from selling products that
|> would confuse the public. 

How would that be any different than the "confusion" the average shopper
must feel when going to K-mart and seeing both K-mart brand soap and 
Zest on the shelf?  The fact is that I'm about to burst

The fact is that if McDonald's has the right to refuse to sell to anybody who
won't just sell exclusivly McBurgers then Microsoft has the right to offer
discounts to anybody willing to sell Windows exclusively.
From: gordt@cyberspc.muug.mb.ca (Gord Tulloch)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: Is Microsoft the next
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 93 18:12:37 GMT
Summary: Canada
Followup-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Organization: Cyberspace Online Information System
Keywords: Canada

In article <1993Jan3.092308.13063@umr.edu> ckincy@cs.umr.edu (Charles Kincy) writes:
>Another thing to be considered:  Canada has little in the way of 
>military.  I wonder how well Canada's health care system would work
>if it didn't rely on America for defense?

Canada has a sufficient military for a non-agressive world role, which
is primarily used fro peace-keeping (Canadian personnel are all over
the world in peace keeping roles, while the US makes a big deal out of
Somalia)  Canadians have little need to take over small island nations
nor pick fights with other countries - maybe that's why we have free 
global medical care.  If I am sick or injured, I'd rather head for the
local Walk-in Clinic for immediate care than somewhere where I have to 
fill out a form and verify I can pay for the treatment before I get it...

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
==  Gord Tulloch           |     Voice: (204) 775-3650 (work)     ==
==  173 Antrim Road        |            (204) 663-7941 (home      ==
==  Winnipeg, Manitoba     |     Data : gordt@grpwest.muug.mb.ca  ==
==  R2K 3H9                |            gordt@cyberspc.muug.mb.ca ==
==                         |     FIDO : 1:348/207@fidonet.org     ==
--------------------------------------------------------------------
==                    Official IBM OS/2 Ambassador!               ==
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: hochstae@allfiwib1.wiwi.uni-marburg.de (Christoph H. Hochstaetter)
Subject: Re: NT Destined to Succeed??
News-Software: IBM OS/2 PM RN (NR/2) v0.16 by O. Vishnepolsky and R. Rogers
Reply-To: hochstae@allfiwib1.wiwi.uni-marburg.de (Christoph H. Hochstaetter)
Organization: Techn. Univ. Clausthal
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 15:30:59 GMT

In <C0H2xH.BvA@news.iastate.edu> TW.FY4@isumvs.iastate.edu (Timothy I Miller) writes:
>In article <1993Jan6.184720.321@solaris.rz.tu-clausthal.de>,
>hochstae@allfiwib1.wiwi.uni-marburg.de (Christoph H. Hochstaetter) writes:
>>
>     Actually, I feel like I can compare the OS/2 which is on my
>machine, without TCP/IP and LAN Server, to Window NT because I just
>did a base installation (probably the same thing I would do with
>NT).  Do you get a choice to have these things installed, or would I
>have to go through and manually take the networking stuff out?  I
>think it makes a big difference.

Sure, you can decide at installation time not to install any network
features. I need networking here and I installed both OS/2 and NT
with network and TCP/IP. The only thing I don't like is, when people
compare performance of OS/2 2.0 GA without networking to Windows NT
beta with networking and TCP/IP, which has been done here in this
group.

>     Of course, I can't load NT onto my hard drive anyway, since it:
>
>     1)  Won't install if Boot manager is on the disk
There is a simple fix for it. Just set the partition type of the boot
manager to zero and keep it the active (boot) partition.

>     2)  Doesn't come with adaptec 1522 drivers
Right, not now.

>     3)  Won't let me install the swap file onto a different disk
>         until after NT's been installed
I had 3 MB free space on my C: drive, which was enough to install NT.
I then selected a swapfile on another drive.

>     4)  Requires to be installed on drive C: (along with the swap
>         file)
No, you can choose at installation time to install it on any drive.
Only a couple of files of about 1 MB totally must reside on C:


Christoph
-------------------------------------------------------+-----------------------
Christoph H. Hochstaetter, Philipps-University Marburg | Universitaetsstr. 25
Internet: hochstae@allfiwib1.wiwi.uni-marburg.de       | D-W-3550 Marburg
Bitnet  : HOCHSTAE AT DMRHRZ11                         | Germany
Fido    : 2:243/660                                    | Phone +49-6421-28-7092
Fax     : +49-6421-28-4858                             |
Xref: sparky comp.os.os2.advocacy:12049 comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy:3777
From: jeh@cmkrnl.com
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: The sin of MicroSoft
Date: 10 Jan 93 18:11:46 PST
Organization: Kernel Mode Consulting, San Diego, CA

In article <cfI29cm00iUz00yONH@andrew.cmu.edu>, sl31+@andrew.cmu.edu (Stephen M. Lacy) writes:
> Ok, I think that maybe you guys aren't up on the current state of
> Computer Science Undergraduate Studies.  I'm a third year student in
> computer science here at CMU, and this is what I've been through so far:
> [...]
> Ok, here come the clinchers.  15-211 was basically an introduction to
> data structures class, with a little more thrown in.  
> [...]
> 15-212 doesn't sound so bad, except for the same clincher that came with
> 15-211, we're using Scheme, BUT WE'RE NOT GOING TO TEACH IT TO YOU. 
> (Scheme is a dialect of Lisp)  By the end of this course we wrote a
> metacircular evaluator.  What this is, is a program that says "Implement
> Scheme in Scheme" without using the (eval '...') expression.  We also
> covered completeness, and all that stuff (what does 'NP' stand for
> again?)
> 
> Artificial intelligence was pure theory.  We had one progrmming
> assignment in Lisp, which was to re-write the huristic function for
> Tic-Tac-Toe so that it was better than it currently was.  This
> assignment was VERY early in the course, and I think because no one knew
> Lisp (we had all learned Scheme) he dropped the rest of the programming
> assignments.  We did just about everything in AI problem solving thats
> been done.  Pure theory.
> 
> 15-462: Computer graphics.  Now, assuming that you've already learned
> everything yourself, we're going to let you use what you've learned. 
> "Using any computer and any programming language, and any operating
> system you wish, implement the following...."  2D transformations, 3D
> trans., 3D projections, Ray-tracers, particle systems, splines,....must
> I go on?
> 
> Please, give us more credit than you are.  Things have changed a lot in
> the last few years.

Sounds to me as though they've stayed pretty much the same.  Which is to say,
pretty much irrelevant.  

	--- Jamie Hanrahan, Kernel Mode Consulting, San Diego CA
drivers, internals, networks, applications, and training for VMS and Windows-NT
uucp 'g' protocol guru and release coordinator, VMSnet (DECUS uucp) W.G., and 
Chair, Programming and Internals Working Group, U.S. DECUS VMS Systems SIG 
Internet:  jeh@cmkrnl.com, hanrahan@eisner.decus.org, or jeh@crash.cts.com
Uucp:  ...{crash,eisner,uunet}!cmkrnl!jeh
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: yiupun@leland.Stanford.EDU (Yiupun Michael Kwong)
Subject: Re: FCC will proclaim Microsoft is run by Communists! :)
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 93 05:42:47 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.192253.13045@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> helz@ecn.purdue.edu (Randall A Helzerman) writes:
>
>Does it though?  Why arn't there any more DRAM manufacturers in the US?
>Why can't you buy a "Made in America" camera any more?  Why does Sony and not
>GE make the best CD players?  Our manufacturing base, strangled by
>regulations _including_ the antitrust laws, just can't compete with the giant
>vertically integrated companies of Japan and Korea.  The antitrust laws prevent
>the pooling of resources which are necessary to create the next generation of
>consumer electronics.
>
>And unless we arn't vigilant now, our software companies are going to go the
>same route as our manufacturing base.

Japan is no less regulated than the US.  Better regulated maybe.
Look at MITI.  It actively engages in setting an industrial policy, and it
orchestrated Japan's entrance into consumer elctronics.  Look what it has
done.

In fact, the computer and semiconductor industry have faced a comeback in
last couple of years, and a lot of people point to SemaTech, a joint 
effort by government and industry as one reason for the comeback.

I don't necessarily believe in government intervention.  Too much of it
definitely will choke development.  However, to say that all govt.
interventions is necessary bad is as much a dogma as to say a big brother
type government should be implemented.  And just as unfounded.
From: aaron@spectrx.saigon.com (Aaron Anderer - System)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Cyrix Issue...
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 93 06:57:07 PST
Organization: SPECTROX SYSTEMS (408)252-1005 Silicon Valley, Ca

x90wardell@gw.wmich.edu writes:

> In article <1993Jan11.023720.22106@wam.umd.edu>, rsrodger@wam.umd.edu (Yamana
> articles that the Cyrix 486 chip is exactly what was said above:
> a 386sx with a 2K onchip cache and  a few extra instructions that
> are math related.  It is NOT a 486 class processor (in terms of
> compatibility).

I own a 486DLC-33 with a Cyrix 3D87 chip.  All the software I run believes
that it is a 486, I have run 486 specific test programs and they run fine
(and they don't run on 386/387 combos).  It has a 1k cache, not 2k like you
said, but it is quite fast(mine runs 107mhz on landmark 2.0).

=====================================//
Aaron Anderer, System Operator      //     aaron@spectrx.saigon.com
SPECTROX SYSTEMS +1 408 252 1005   //          szebra!spectrx!aaron          
                                  //===============================
From: mhuth@hardy.u.washington.edu (Mark Huth)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT Destined to Succeed??
Date: 6 Jan 1993 05:47:47 GMT
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: hardy.u.washington.edu

soh3@quads.uchicago.edu (min-woong sohn) writes:


>Hey, you only have personal experience with a system with 12 megs of
>memory and you'are calling Steve liar????

>Is NT really bootin up on 8 meg systems?  Is there anybody who has
>personal experience with this?

>Mi 

I've run it in 8 megs...it isn't as fast as os/2 in 8 megs, but it isn't 
horrible either.  I'd suppose I'd suggest that it runs like a beta...(grin)
I've been told how to remove the networking and other parts that I don't need
on that particular machine.  I'll give it a try and see how much it speeds 
NT up.  I'm told that removing unneeded modules makes it quite zippy in 8 
megs.  n
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: philipla@microsoft.com (Phil Lafornara)
Subject: Re: DOS 6 Beta Looks for
Date: 08 Jan 93 02:08:33 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <3801.942.uupcb@almac.co.uk> mike.dickson@almac.co.uk (Mike Dickson) writes:
>PL..>F-Fear- Fear that Using OS/2 and DOS on the same machine would be dangerous
>PL.. It is.  DOS 6 may make your FAT partitions unreadable by
>PL.. OS/2 or other operating systems.
>
>Congratulations, Phil. You may have put lots of people right off using
>MS-DOS 6.0, irrespective of whatever the finalised code actually does.

    Stacker makes your FAT partitions unreadable by OS's that
don't have Stacker available.  This hasn't scared people off.
The question is whether the benefits of the incompatibility are
worth the loss in interoperability.

				-Phil
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phil Lafornara         				1 Microsoft Way         
philipla@microsoft.com				Redmond, WA 98052-6399 
Note:  Microsoft doesn't even _know_ that these are my opinions. So there.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: helz@ecn.purdue.edu (Randall A Helzerman)
Subject: Re: Is Microsoft using "Force"???
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 22:16:40 GMT

In article <1ikr0dINNnj0@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, dab6@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas A. Bell) writes:
|> 
|> In a previous article, helz@ecn.purdue.edu (Randall A Helzerman) says:
|> 
|> >I'll agree, Microsoft is offering some shitty deals.  But when Microsoft
|> >says "This is my best offer--take it or leave it" the vendors are quite
|> >free to take it or leave it.  
|> 
|>           And go out of business .....

....and perhaps go out of busines, just like you'd put out of business someone
who made a living selling your clothes to Goodwill without your approval.
Microsoft owns the software just like you own your pants--and you're free
to keep your pants if you don't like the the deal and Microsoft is free 
to keep its Windows if it doesn't like the deal, and the cloners are free
to buy OS/2 if they don't like the deal, and you're free to choose a cloner
who bundles OS/2 if you don't like the whole deal.

So what's the big deal?
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: mlevis@ringer.cs.utsa.edu (Mike Levis) (OS/2)
Subject: Let's advocate new OS/2 newsgroups (was Re: Does IBM have...)
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 21:50:03 GMT

In article <C0nB6I.81q@panix.com> os2man@panix.com (Larry Salomon Jr.) writes:
>How about comp.os.os2.bugs?  comp.os.os2.suggestions could be considered
>useless since 1) a lot, if not all, of the material conceivably could also
>be posted to comp.os.os2.misc and 2) it would probably degenerate into
>another advocacy group ("Tom:  I would like 'A' to be included with OS/2",
>"Dick:  get real!  'A' is so large that it would take 21 disks for it
>alone!", "Harry:  *you* get real!  'A' is worth the extra space.", etc.).

I think that three of the proposed newgroups will cover bugs:
   .ver1x -> bugs and discussion of OS/2 1.x
   .setup -> bugs, and driver & hardware questions for OS/2 2.x (but this
             group cannot be RFDed until March)
   .beta  -> bugs and suggestions for current and future OS/2 betas

In addition, the proposed .announce (moderated) will include IBM
workarounds for bugs, among other things.

>Cheers,
>Q

To remind everyone, these are the proposed (but not yet RFDed) OS/2
newsgroups:
  comp.os.os2.ver1x
  comp.os.os2.beta
  comp.os.os2.announce (moderated)    [we still need a moderator]

And these proposed newsgroups can be RFDed in March:
  comp.os.os2.setup
  comp.os.os2.programmer.porting
  comp.os.os2.programmer.misc [this is a rename of comp.os.os2.programmer]

Can anyone think of more OS/2 newsgroups that we may need but is not
covered by these proposed newsgroups, or the current ones?  Post any
more suggestions.

BTW, thanks to all who have posted suggestions on new OS/2 newsgroups
so far, even if your suggestion(s) have not made it to the "proposed"
status.  Your suggestion(s) have allow the charters of the proposed
newsgroups to be better defined.

-- 
======= Mike Levis   mlevis@ringer.cs.utsa.edu =======
::  ftp ftp-os2.nmsu.edu (128.123.35.151) for OS/2  ::  .--.
::  software & information.   Get /pub/os2/00Index  :: (OS/2)
::::::::  & /pub/os2/all/info/faq/faq20i.txt  ::::::::  ~--~
From: jonathan@jspc.wimsey.bc.ca (Jonathan Story)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: Is Microsoft the next
Date: 04 Jan 93 08:49:24 GMT

In article <1993Jan3.201902.4899@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>
          dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker) writes:

> Canadians believe in spreading the load among those who can pay.

A gross overgeneralization (i.e. speak for yourself, bud).

Now, can we all get back to flaming over the _right_ subject, please?
From: jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: FCC will proclaim Microsoft is run by Communists! : )
Date: 5 Jan 1993 17:21:02 GMT
Organization: UT Health Science Center Houston

In article <1993Jan5.164051.3929@tc.cornell.edu> bai@msiadmin.cit.cornell.edu (Dov Bai-MSI Visitor) writes:
>Society cannt decide about anything. Only humans can have the ability
>to decide.

One of the ground rules of any society is that decisions made by whatever
means that society has for reaching decisions are decisions of the whole
society. In American society (the one, after all, whose rules/laws MS must
operate under), decisions made by the lawmaking bodies are, by definition,
decisions of society.

>A better statement is that the _majority_ of individuals voted for
>a certain law, and are imposing their will on the minority that
>disagree. That does not make a law in any way more fair or practical.

This is an argument against a majority-rule democracy. It holds little water,
however, unless you can somehow provide a better solution.

(Quoting .signatures is an unnecessary waste of bandwidth.)
-- 
Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC, PP-ASEL | Never ascribe to malice that which can
jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu      | adequately be explained by stupidity.
      "Science is all in the public domain, and allows few secrets."
              -- Tom Clancy, _The Sum of all Fears_
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: philipla@microsoft.com (Phil Lafornara)
Subject: Re: DOS 6 Beta Looks for OS/2!!!!!!!!
Date: 04 Jan 93 18:42:38 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <79005@hydra.gatech.EDU> gt0449a@prism.gatech.EDU (Rob Coleman) writes:
>Immediately upon trying to install Dos 6.0, the install program says:
>
>"An OS/2 partition has been detected.  The OS/2 partition will not be
>available under MSDOS 6.0."
>
>Not at all threatening; just informative.

     Hmm... that bears little enough resemblence to the original
message posted here that I wonder if there might be _another_
message that shows up.
     But yes, I don't see how anyone could complain about that one.

				-Phil


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phil Lafornara         				1 Microsoft Way         
philipla@microsoft.com				Redmond, WA 98052-6399 
Note:  Microsoft doesn't even _know_ that these are my opinions. So there.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: mlevis@ringer.cs.utsa.edu (Mike Levis) (OS/2)
Subject: Re: Does IBM have an Internet email address?
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 07:21:15 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.212952.29167@zooid.guild.org> Mark Kovarski <kovarski@zooid.guild.org> writes:
>There are several officials from IBM reading this and other conferences. I
>have suggested to create a newsgroup called comp.os.os2.suggestions or
>something similar. This would benefit both, the users and IBM. Is anyone in
>the process of taking votes for the new newsgroups?

Would comp.os.os2.beta fit the bill?  This proposed newsgroup would
allow beta OS/2 2.x users to trade information.  Whenever IBM comes out
with a new beta, then this newsgroup will be busy reporting bugs.  But
as the beta improves, posts in this newsgroup will shrink.  Then people
can propose new OS/2 features for future betas.  In other words, OS/2
system programmers or designers can read this newsgroup to read either
about beta bugs or suggestions for new features, depending on the
progress of a given beta OS/2.

>Best Regards,
>Mark K.

-- 
======= Mike Levis   mlevis@ringer.cs.utsa.edu =======
::  ftp ftp-os2.nmsu.edu (128.123.35.151) for OS/2  ::  .--.
::  software & information.   Get /pub/os2/00Index  :: (OS/2)
::::::::  & /pub/os2/all/info/faq/faq20i.txt  ::::::::  ~--~
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: bai@msiadmin.cit.cornell.edu (Dov Bai-MSI Visitor)
Subject: Re: FCC will proclaim Microsoft is run by Communists! : )
Organization: /usr/local/lib/news/organization
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:40:51 GMT

In article <8328@lib.tmc.edu> jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard) writes:
>Not if those terms are unfair and anticompetitive. This society has decided
>that such dealings are wrong. If you don't like that, you can either work to
>get the laws changed, or move to a place that doesn't care about it.


You have to be more accurate here.

Society cannt decide about anything. Only humans can have the ability
to decide.

A better statement is that the _majority_ of individuals voted for
a certain law, and are imposing their will on the minority that
disagree. That does not make a law in any way more fair or practical.

>Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC, PP-ASEL | Never ascribe to malice that which can
>jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu      | adequately be explained by stupidity.
>      "Science is all in the public domain, and allows few secrets."
>              -- Tom Clancy, _The Sum of all Fears_

Dov
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: jcmorris@mwunix.mitre.org (Joe Morris)
Subject: Re: DOS 6 Beta Looks for OS/2!!!!!!!!
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:50:17 GMT

z_kupkams@ccsvax.sfasu.edu writes:

>	I Recently talked to a Beta Tester of DOS 6.0. He Runs OS/2 with 2 Hard
>Drives, One FAT, One HPFS. He decided to Install the DOS 6.0 Beta on the FAT
>Partition, and got a Message saying, and I paraphrase: 

>- OS/2 Detected! Due to the size of OS/2 you may wish to delete your OS/2 
>files before installing DOS 6.0 -

H'mmm...I suppose that whoever wrote that particular message thinks that
Windows NT can be completely installed on a 360 KB 5-1/4" diskette?  It
sounds like the Microsoft marketing group has taken control of the 
installation program design...

Joe Morris
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy