HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jwj@arco.com (Jim Jennings)
Subject: Re: Oil fields - how do they work ?
Organization: ARCO E&P Technology
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 21:40:11 GMT

In article <1992Oct08.091112.29990@bas-a.bcc.ac.uk> uclyjjd@ucl.ac.uk (Julian
Daley) writes:
>On a recent trip from Singapore to London (returning from my honeymoon,
>in fact !) we flew over Saudi Arabia.  For a couple of hours all we
>could see on the ground was redish sand covered with darker, circular
>disks.  By looking at roads etc we estimated these discs to be about
>1/4 mile in diameter.  We asume these were oil fields (there's a lot
>of oil in Saudi, right?), but being a mere physicist I'm not sure.
>

The disks are probably cultivated areas watered by rotating irrigation systems.
 Oil fields are almost never circular, and almost always larger than 1/4 mile
in diameter (especially in Saudi Arabia, lots larger).  Generally, all that you
see on the surface at an oil field is a network of roads connecting the well
sites.  The well sites themselves are small.

>
>Can anyone confirm my assumtion and explain how these things work.  I
>thought oil was collected by drilling a big hole and sucking.
>

Oil wells come in lots of sizes, but usually they are 6 inches in diameter or
less at the bottom.  They generally are larger at the surface.  I have heard of
wells as shallow as a few hundred feet and as deep as 10,000 or more.

One does not suck on an oil well.  Some wells flow to the surface on their own
(I have heard this is common in Saudi Arabia) due to the density difference
between oil & water.  The pores of all rocks below the water table are full of
water, except where there is oil or gas.  If the reservoir pressure is
depleated to the point that this does not work, the oil is "lifted" with a pump
at the bottom of the well.

By the way, an oil reservoir is not an underground cavern filled with oil.  It
does not slosh in an earthquake.  An oil reservoir is a porous rock in which
some of the pores have oil instead of water.

....................................................................
Jim Jennings   Voice: (214) 754-6922   ARCO Exploration and    Plano
jwj@arco.com   Fax:   (214) 754-6010   Production Technology   Texas

Disclamer:  Don't blame my employer for any dumb things I might say.

Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: toma@hyperion.gsfc.nasa.gov (Tom Atwater)
Subject: Re: least likely to get a tremor
Organization: Code 916, NASA Goddard Space Flight Center
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 11:16:08 GMT

In article <Bvv4Ez.CzA@oryx.com> xdejxs@jeep.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (john sharry) writes:
>In article <1992Oct9.125118.15378@nsisrv.gsfc.nasa.gov>, toma@hyperion.gsfc.nasa.gov (Tom Atwater) writes:
>|> In article <1992Oct9.002638.2285@merrimack.edu> nin15b63@merrimack.edu (THE WOLF) writes:
>|> >Which areas of the USA have the lowest levels of earthquake/tremor activity? 
>|> 
>|> Judging by a map in "Places Rated Almanac" (1983 ed.), the Great Plains
>|> and the Southeast.
>|> 
>I'm not sure about the southeast.  Charleston, South Carolina had one of
>the worst earthquakes in the US sometime in the 1800's I think.

Yes, I was incorrect -- I was going by memory. I went back and looked at the
map in question again, and it showed the SE as being about average for the US.
The Great Plains are definitely below average, though, as were all of Texas,
Louisiana and I think Arkansas.

This is not to say there are no earthquakes in these places, of course --
just that the probability of a large magnitude earthquake there is
apparently lower than the rest of the US.

By the way, the data for that map was taken from a govt report dated 1972,
so it's probably out of date anyway.

(Maybe I should have kept my mouth shut and let some more knowledgeable
people answer the original question!)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: cleavy@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Cleavy McKnight)
Subject: Re: DEM data wanted
Keywords: DEM, digital elevation model
Organization: Stanford Univ. Earth Sciences
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 01:06:40 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.113936.1815@ucbeh.san.uc.edu> wyrickba@ucbeh.san.uc.edu writes:
>Greetings,
>
>           I am in search of Digital elevation map data for the PC program
>VistaPro. The program uses DEM format data from the USGS to render fractal 
>landscapes. I am particularly interested in data from the Bryce Canyon/
>CanyonLands area. Any help on getting this data or information on where I can
>find it would be greatly appreciated.
>
     A source of DEM's available via anonymous ftp is:
     spectrum.xerox.com (192.70.225.78)  I believe the directory is
     something like /pub/map/dem or /pub/dem

     I don't know if there are any from Bryce/Canyonlands, however.
     You can contact the ESIC (Earth Science Information Center(s)) at
     the various USGS offices (Reston, VA; Lakewood, CO; Menlo Park, CA)
     for catalogs & price lists for ordering specific DEM's.
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: least likely to get a tremor
From: derek@nezsdc.icl.co.nz (Derek Tearne)
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 20:28:55 GMT
Organization: Fujitsu New Zealand

In article <1992Oct13.153310.17526@unocal.com> stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini) writes:
>Take yesterday's Cairo quake for example.
>It was in an unexpected location, althought geologists will find an "obvious"
>explanation sooner or later.  The ten percent or so of quakes that occur
>off of plate boundaries are slippery events to explain and forecast.

Or the recent earthquake in Zaire.  A fair distance from any plate 
boundaries.  Pretty much in the centre of the continent,  the nearest tectonic
feature being the African Rift Valley.  In a central shield location the 
earthquakes are usually deep seated.

I didn't think the earthquakes on the plate boundaries are predictable let 
alone the rarer ones off the boundaries.



-- 
Derek Tearne. -- derek@nezsdc.icl.co.nz --  Fujitsu/ICL New Zealand -- 
Some of the more aware dinosaurs were worried about the environmental
consequences of an accident with the new Iridium enriched fusion reactor.  
"If it goes off only the cockroaches and mammals will survive..." they said.
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: karish@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Chuck Karish)
Subject: Re: Mineral Cleavage
Organization: Mindcraft, Inc.
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 21:58:00 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.134836.59513@cc.usu.edu> alanj@cc.usu.edu writes:
>I have been assigned a TA here at Utah State teaching labs for Introductory
>Geology.  The main problem I have encountered so far is teaching the concept of
>mineral cleavage.

What sort of problems do people have with the concept?  Do they
confuse crystal growth surfaces with cleavages?

Nothing you do will enable all your students to be able to
visualize cleavage planes in 3-D and understand their
intersections.

>Again remember that most of these students are only in these classes because
>their major requires it or for physical science GE credit but they need to
>understand the concept for their upcoming exam.

If you can motivate students by showing them something
they think is neat, more power to you.  If not, just
don't let the more opportunistic of them wear you
down.
--

    Chuck Karish          karish@mindcraft.com
    (415) 323-9000 x117   karish@forel.stanford.edu
From: nin15b63@merrimack.edu (THE WOLF)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: least likely to get a tremor
Date: 9 Oct 92 00:26:38 GMT
Organization: Merrimack College, No. Andover, MA, USA

Which areas of the USA have the lowest levels of earthquake/tremor activity? 
Of the world?
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Andy Harrington                      | nin15b63@merrimack.edu
 Computer Geek                        | aharrington@ldbvax.lotus.com
 Merrimack College, North Andover, MA | The basis of life is freedom; the
                                      | purpose is joy; the result is growth.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Subject: Re: Cairo Earthquake?
Organization: Unocal Corporation
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 15:39:11 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.211309.10676@news.Hawaii.Edu> gerard@caliban.soest.hawaii.edu (Gerard Fryer) writes:
>I just had a phone call from a very distraught Egyptian at one of
>Waikiki's hotels asking for info on today's earthquake in Egypt.  I
>did a quick finger of quake@geophys.washington.edu to find that it was
>a shallow event with a magnitude of 5.9 and an epicenter very close to
>Giza.  That location makes little sense to me.  Does anyone understand
>the tectonics?

Rivers sometimes follow fault zones of weakness.  Perhaps the Nile follows
one.  KNOWN river faults are the Sacramento-Golden Gate channel and the
Bright Angel in the Grand Canyon.  There are probably others.
From: ceb@dbrus.Unify.Com (Caroline E. Bryan)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: Creation science and depth of the oceans
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:18:13 GMT
Organization: /usr/lib/news/organization

In article <1992Oct12.104746@trc.amoco.com> zkdc05@trc.amoco.com (Kelly D. Crawford) writes:
>
>In article <tslage78.718857045@ursa>, tslage78@ursa.calvin.edu (Thomas Slager) writes:
>> I was in this little argument with a kid at school who thinks the world is 
>> only about 13,000 years old.  He cited an argument given by creation scien-
>> tists that the oceans would be much shallower if the earth were as old as
>> we believe.  I am not fammilliar with theory, but I figure it has been shot
>> down.  Anybody care to tell me what the thoery is and why it don't work?
>
> There are several different creation theories ranging from a very young
> earth, to a very old earth.  The best creation theories today (IMHO) are
> compatible with a very old earth, evolution, etc.  Dr. Hugh Ross has a book
> (I think it is called "Reasons to Believe") that puts forth a "creation-
> evolution" theory that is quite acceptable to both science and Christianity.  > If anyone is interested, I can try to find a better reference...

Oh, pooh.  I majored in geology, and am Christian.  I find nothing in the
theory of a 4-billion-year-old (or older) planet that contradicts anything
in informed Christian faith.  The oxymoronic "creation scientists" profit
from their victims' ignorance of geology and lack of Christian faith.  I
can't understand why anyone wastes any time on them.


Carrie		ceb@rechenau.unify.com	x6244		---------------------+
|   "Technical work needs reviewing for the same reason that pencils need    |
|   erasers."			- Daniel P. Freedman & Gerald M. Weinberg    |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: wyrickba@ucbeh.san.uc.edu
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: DEM data wanted
Date: 7 Oct 92 11:39:36 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: Univ. of Cincinnati

Greetings,

           I am in search of Digital elevation map data for the PC program
VistaPro. The program uses DEM format data from the USGS to render fractal 
landscapes. I am particularly interested in data from the Bryce Canyon/
CanyonLands area. Any help on getting this data or information on where I can
find it would be greatly appreciated.

WARNING: I am not a geologist(nor do I play one on TV), so please keep the
jargon light. Thanks.

Brent Wyrick
Friend of Geology major...
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: plate tectonics
Date: 11 Oct 92 16:39:05 GMT
Organization: Unocal Corporation

In article <1992Oct10.203834.5203@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu (Joe Cain) writes:
>	Texts like "Plate Tectonics, how it works" by Cox and Hart
>were written in the mid-80's before computers were so pervasive. Are
>there now programs for pc's or unix workstations that make the
>graphical analyses and illustrations more automatic than those
>described therein? e.g. I would think that by now someone would have
>worked out programs to graphically illustrate the first motion diagrams
>such as those on pp. 192-200. Also, are there not codes that would
>input first motion data and plot the focal sphere projections, and
>perhaps even analyze the results and draw the fault and auxiliary
>plane projections? I see that Mary Fowler's text (Global Geophysics,
>Cambridge U. Press, 1990) presents a graphical recipe for such
>creations implying that this is the way it is done.

There is- Terra Mobilis by C. Goetze of UT Austin.  That is six or seven years old.
The grand-daddy of all plate tectonics graphics software comes from Dr. Morgan of Princeton,
but this was designed for old-style early 70s computers.  Considerable work has gone on at the
University of Chicago.

All the above software were basically line outlines.  I believe UT Texas is working on shaded
relief versions and some part of my company suppports it.  Some shaded relief work, customized
to particular regions, has been done at Stanford and U Penn (cest moi).

Part of the difficulty is good map projection software and spherical geometry constraints.
Cox's book covers some of these issues.  Another bottleneck is a good set of digitized plate
boundaries.  These differ from standard geographic datasets that are either political borders
or sea level borders.

There is lots of auxilary information that can be displayed too such as magnetic stripes,
seimicity, and vulcanism.  Again the situation is get this data in digital form.  You'd be
surprised too how inconsistent this data is.  One of the purposes of the Stanford project was
to use graphical constraints to help resolve the inconsistencies.
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: rmg3@grebyn.com (Robert Grumbine)
Subject: Re: Magnetic Shifts, Climate, and Evolution
Organization: Grebyn Timesharing
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 01:40:40 GMT

In article <1992Oct8.195226.4058@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu (Joe Cain) writes:
>In article <1992Oct7.215130.22194@eos.arc.nasa.gov> kyrsten@eos.arc.nasa.gov (Kyrsten Swazey) writes:
>
>>The connection between glaciations and evolution is relatively
>>well-established, correct?
>
>	I would be interested in hearing of and understanding the
>latest information on the ideas regarding the interactions between
>life and glaciations, etc if some knowledgeable person would summarize
>	
  While people certainly have tried to establish correlations between
the climate (including glaciations) and evolution, I don't think this
could be called 'relatively well established'.  The particular relation
between glaciation and evolution is (in my limited experience) generally
made for homonid evolution.  The typical argument is to note the times
of particularly interesting glacial age changes and then point to
notable times in homonid evolution and note that they occur at around 
the same time, with the evolution trailing the climate (as the causality
argument would require).  Example:
Onset of large scale permanent glaciation in the Northern Hemisphere: 
  3 Mya
Beginning of 100 ky ice age oscillations  700 kya
Previous Interglacial  125 kya
Last Glacial Maximum    18 kya
Climatic optimum         6 kya (4000 BC)
  Correlative Evolutionary features:
Australopithecus becomes extinct 3 Mya ('making room' for the homonids)
H. Erectus 1.75 Mya
Tools/Fire 500 Kya
Neanderthal man appears 100 kya
Neanderthal extinct      20-30 kya
Agriculture developed    10 kya

  While this is a fun game to play, the dates I listed for the
evolutionary features have an enormous amount of slop.  I have two
almanacs at hand, one lists the Australopithecines as being extinct
at 3 Mya, the other has them still around at 1.75 Mya.  The first 
arrival of Neanderthal man could easily be 500 kya, while some would
debate whether they are even now extinct properly speaking (in some
technical sense that I won't even begin to defend).  Obviously there
are better data sources than almanacs.  Nonetheless all the evolutionary
dates must be taken with caution given the scarcity of remains.

>>What about the fact that glaciations are apparently coming in closer
>>succession?
>	
>Hmm, can someone summarize the glaciations or point to a reference
>containing such a summary?

  During the Pleistocene, the frequency of glaciation _decreased_ about
700 kya.  During the last 700 ky, ice ages have averaged about 100 ky
per cycle.  Prior to that, there were 20+ cycles with periods of 41 ky.
To get back to the magnetism arguments, there was a magnetic reversal
about 730 kya.

Bob Grumbine
rmg3@grebyn.com
From: sbs@weyl.bu.edu (Stephen Selipsky)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: Magnetic Shifts, Climate, and Evolution
Date: 9 Oct 92 18:45:33 GMT
Article-I.D.: bu.98153
Reply-To: sbs@weyl.bu.edu
Organization: Boston University Physics Department


Joseph Cain <cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu> asks
|> ... can someone summarize the glaciations or point to a reference
|> containing such a summary?

I did a very quick electronic search on this last year, to which I seem
to have appended some references from this group... I apologize to whomever
I'm not attributing.

AUTHOR          Oerlemans, J. (Johannes), 1950-
TITLE           Ice sheets and climate / by J. Oerlemans and C.J. van der
                 Veen.
PUBLICATION     Dordrecht ; Boston : Reidel ; Hingham, MA, U.S.A. : Sold and
                 distributed in the U.S.A. and Canada by Kluwer, c1984.
CALL NUMBER     QC981.8.I23 O37 1984

TITLE           The Last great ice sheets / edited by George H. Denton,
                 Terence J. Hughes.
PUBLICATION     New York : Wiley, c1981.
CALL NUMBER     QE697 .L293               (detailed maps of Pleistocene)

TITLE           The Winters of the world : earth under the ice ages /
                 edited by Brian S. John.
PUBLICATION     New York : Halsted Press, c1979.
CALL NUMBER     QE696 .W5M            (a lot of info on old ice age cycles)

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

"Orbital geometry, CO2, and Pleistocene climate",
by Nicklas G. Pisias and John Imbrie
Oceanus, Vol. 29, No. 4, Winter 1986/87

Fisher A. G. and D. J. Bottjer, Orbital forcing and sedimentary
sequences, J. of Sedimentary Petrology, Vol. 61, No. 7, December,
1991. This whole issue is devoted to the subject of "orbital
cyclostratigraphy."

Imbrie, J. and K. Imbrie, Ice Ages: solving the mystery, Short Hills
NJ, Harvard U. Press, 1976.

and such classic articles as:

Hays, J. D., J. Imbrie, and N. J. Shackelton, Variations in the
Earth's orbit: pacemaker of the ice ages, Science, V. 194, p
1121-1132, 1976.

(There have been many recent Science articles on these topics...)
From: alanj@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Mineral Cleavage
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:48:35 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

I have been assigned a TA here at Utah State teaching labs for Introductory
Geology.  The main problem I have encountered so far is teaching the concept of
mineral cleavage.  I understand what it is but I am having a hard time passing
that understanding on to my students.  I was wondering if anyone has any great
ideas on how to help others understand this concept.

Again remember that most of these students are only in these classes because
their major requires it or for physical science GE credit but they need to
understand the concept for their upcoming exam.

Thanks in advance

Alan
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: toma@hyperion.gsfc.nasa.gov (Tom Atwater)
Subject: Re: least likely to get a tremor
Organization: Code 916, NASA Goddard Space Flight Center
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 10:57:18 GMT

In article <18040@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> helm@jade.ucdavis.edu (Catie Helm) writes:
>I wouldn't put too much faith in the great plains being safe either, if
>that definition includes anywhere that's within a couple hundred
>kilometers of the New Madrid area.

No, the Great Plains does not include the New Madrid area.

Generally, it refers to the Dakotas, Nebraska, Kansas, eastern Montana, Wyoming
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu (Joe Dellinger)
Subject: Re: Kilauea/HVO report?
Reply-To: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu
Organization: School of Ocean and Earth Science Technology
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 10:24:44 GMT

In article <x7dpqw-@lynx.unm.edu>, pjohnso@polaris.unm.edu (Paddy Johnson CIRT) writes:
|> There hasn't been an HVO report for awhile.

	Sorry, I haven't been getting them, so I can't post them. I've
been told the Ham people have been too busy handling communications on Kauai.
In particular, the person from the Big Island who posts the HVO reports
onto the local ham network (from where I then get them from through _another_
intermediary) has spent at least a couple of weeks as a volunteer on Kauai.
He may still be there. The magnitude of the disaster on Kauai is simply
incredible. Not too many people killed, but the infrastructure is completely
wiped out. I shudder to think of the cost if that monster had struck Oahu!

	I'll let them know people have been asking after them; maybe I can
get the flow going again!

PS: If they haven't expired already, perhaps you can check out my posts on
    sci.geo.meteorology about the "hurricane experience". In particular,
    a friend of mine had the bad luck to be kayaking the North shore of
    Kauai on Iniki day. She's OK, but sure had an interesting story to
    relate, which you can find in s.g.m!

PPS: Obligatory state of Hawaii tourism notice: Oahu, Maui, Lanai, and the
     Big Island are all fine and open for business.  :-)

     /\    /\    /\/\/\/\/\/\/\.-.-.-.-.......___________
    /  \  /  \  /Hawaii Institute of Geophysics, Honolulu\/\/\.-.-....__
___/    \/    \/Joe Dellinger, Internet: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu\/\.-.__
From: Desiree_Bradley@mindlink.bc.ca (Desiree Bradley)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: Cairo Earthquake?
Date: 13 Oct 92 07:58:50 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

> Gerard Fryer writes:
>
> I just had a phone call from a very distraught Egyptian at one of
> Waikiki's hotels asking for info on today's earthquake in Egypt.  I
> did a quick finger of quake@geophys.washington.edu to find that it was
> a shallow event with a magnitude of 5.9 and an epicenter very close to
> Giza.  That location makes little sense to me.  Does anyone understand
> the tectonics?


Here's my personal opinion -- for whatever it's worth.  When it comes to
tectonics, Cairo is not that far from the Red Sea that separates Arabia from
Africa.  I think I did hear that two continents are moving apart as part of
the continental drift process.  So I'd expect that there are tectonic plates
in the area.  What I do know for sure is that on the map shown on the
television news he Nile Delta is just north of Cairo.  That would make it
likely that a lot of Cairo is built on soil that the Nile laid down and that,
therefore, the soil under Cairo would be subject to liquefaction.  So when
there is an earthquake buildings would not stand up well.  I hope that the
distraught Egyptian hasn't lost any relatives in that quake.

Desiree Bradley
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: least likely to get a tremor
Date: 13 Oct 92 15:33:10 GMT
Article-I.D.: unocal.1992Oct13.153310.17526
Organization: Unocal Corporation

Take yesterday's Cairo quake for example.
It was in an unexpected location, althought geologists will find an "obvious"
explanation sooner or later.  The ten percent or so of quakes that occur
off of plate boundaries are slippery events to explain and forecast.
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology,sci.geo.meteorology,alt.sci.planetary,sci.astro