HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: timlee@public.btr.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: good book on S&L scandal
Date: 30 Jul 92 04:35:04 GMT
Reply-To: timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee)
Followup-To: misc.invest

tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill) writes:
|
|			Book Review
|			-----------
|	In$ide Job: The Looting of America's Savings & Loans
|		by Pizzo, Fricker & Muolo
|
|This is probably the best book written so far on the S&L scandal.
|Not only does it appear to be balanced and accurate, it is also a
|real page-turner that often reads like a mystery novel.  I would
|highly recommend it to anyone interested in the S&L crisis, which
|is the biggest financial scandal in the history of the USA, and
|probably in the history of the world.
|
|For people who don't have time, here is the book's own summary of
|what went wrong:
|
|	"The S&L industry was deregulated by the Garn/St.Germain
|	act of 1982...  Swindlers, mobsters, politicians, greedy
|	S&L executives, and con men capitalized on regulatory
|	weaknesses created by deregulation and thoroughly fleeced
|	the thrift industry.  Then, after exhausting the capital
|	there, they made their way right into the national treasury
|	itself.  While it is certainly true that economic factors
|	(like plummeting oil prices in Texas and surrounding states)
|	contributed to the crisis, S&Ls would not be in the mess
|	they are today but for rampant fraud."

Sounds like they missed the point.  Rising interest rates in the
from the late 1960s to the early 1980s made many S&Ls insolvent by
market value standards, even though the usual accounting methods
that they showed to the government showed them to be solvent (e.g.
an old mortgage carried at face value, even though its 6% interest
rate was a money loser when the S&L had to pay 10% to keep deposits).
Here are some books to read:

Lawrence J. White:  _The_S&L_Debacle_
Edward J. Kane:  _The_S&L_Insurance_Mess_

In White's book, a table on page 70 shows the profits and losses
by FSLIC insured thrifts from 1978 to 1983.  The entire period
was marked by losses, with 2nd half 1981 and 1st half 1982 being
the worst.   On page 78, the tangible net worth of all FSLIC
thrifts as percentage of assets was 0.5% in the second half of
1982.

In Kane's book, Kane estimates the market value net worth to
total assets at FSLIC insured thrifts on page 75.  For every
year from 1971 to 1984, this ratio is negative, indicating
that the industry as an aggregate was bankrupt long before
deregulation happened.

In other words, the S&L industry was failing before deregulation.
Fraud and stupidity (probably more of the latter) may have made
things worse, but the damage was already there, hidden by the
S&Ls and the government.
From: dfavor@logan.tivoli.com (David Favor)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: fat cat investors???
Date: 21 Jul 92 12:01:03 GMT
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Jul20.145436.9254@mercury.ncat.edu>, wang@mercury.ncat.edu (Tzung-Kwang Wang) writes:
|> In article <1991@tivoli.UUCP> dfavor@logantivoli.com (David Favor) writes:
|> >the $25,000-per-year should have some form of small business that allows him/her
|> >to write off that $100 scientific calculator.
|> >
|> >the $25,000-per-year engineer should also have some form of small business
|> >that allows fat-cat-traveling anywhere in the world to be tax deductible.
|> >
|> How do a engineer start some form of small business? Dose the busimess
|> have to register and a tax id, or can one just go out and do some
|> consulting work and deduct the expanses when filling tax?
|> 
|> TK Wang

------- starting a software consulting business

unfortunately you can no longer start decide to start a software consulting 
business and receive payment on a 1099. as of 1986 this became illegal, well
a better way to say it is that the IRS will penalize you for this activity.

if you want to start a software consulting business the best form, for most
individuals, is an S Corporation. be warned though... this is a long term
choice. for this to work you will be required to spend a tremendous amount
of time educating yourself. if you do not follow the correct 'Corporate form'
of doing business (i.e. file appropriate paperwork, conduct/document corrent
periodic and yearly meetings) the IRS may rule your Corporation is not actually
a Corporation and penalize you.

starting a software consulting business is time consumming, but the financial
rewards are lucrative.

------- starting some other business

it may be beneficial to consider some other business that may be run as a
sole proprietership. the best small business is one that deals with people.
deductions are numerous and easy to prove. for example, a trading company.
everywhere you travel you talk to merchants either to buy or sell goods.
other people (non-merchants) you treat as potential customers. this type of
business allows most personal expenses to be converted to business expenses.

------- a word of caution

for an activity to be considered a business it must be run with the intent to
make a profit. rule of thumb is this. if a business shows three years of losses
in the fourth year, close it down and start another small business.

------- best small business

for most people the best small business is based on an activity that is already
engaged in, usually some form of hobby. just continue to do what you enjoy doing
and find ways to structure your expenses as business expenses.

------- this discussion elsewhere

you might want to read misc.invest.real-estate also.
From: bucknerb@bnr.ca (Brent Buckner)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Dow Jones Investment Strategy
Date: 30 Jul 92 18:20:23 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Ontario, Canada

In article <1992Jul30.154400.29274@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> aa536@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Alayne M. Whaley) writes:
>
>A while back, I read a tidbit of information about an investment 
>strategy that involved the stocks on the DJIA...
>
>I believe I read a Jane Bryant Quinn article and there is a book 
>out that outlines the strategy.  Seems you pick the 5 lowest 
>stocks (just price wise or taking other things into consideration, 
>I dunno.) and buy into them.  And then every so often (every year or
>two?) reevaluating the stocks and buying those instead.  
>
>Any information about the book or strategy would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanks!
>-- 
>Alayne M. Whaley            ! "She's always lived for tomorrow. She's never 
>aa536@cleveland.freenet.edu ! learned how to live for today. She's dying to 
>ae919@yfn.ysu.edu           ! try something foolish. Something for herself for
>----------------------------- a change"-Is There Life Out There-Reba McEntire

"Beating the Dow" is the title of such a book.  I cannot recall
the author's name.

It outlines three strategies for stock selection.  You revisit the
portfolio annually.

As I recall, the three strategies are:
1)  Buy the 10 highest-yielding stocks in the DJIA, or
2)  Of those ten stocks, buy the five with the lowest
    dollar price per share, or
3)  Of those ten stocks, buy the stock with the second lowest
    dollar price per share.

Caveat emptor.
-- 
at Bell-Northern Research
voice:        (613) 765-2739
Canada Post:  P.O. Box 3511, Station C, Ottawa, Canada, K1Y 4H7
I do not claim that BNR holds these views.  
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: ed@odi.com (Ed Schwalenberg)
Subject: Predicting mortgage interest rates via the futures market
Organization: Object Design, Inc.
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 17:51:15 GMT

Like many people, I'm enjoying the effect of falling short-term interest
rates on my adjustable-rate mortgage.  I'm also wondering whether to change
to a fixed-rate mortgage, now that fixed rates are pretty low, too.  I'd like
to base my decision on the best information I can find.

For adjustable rates, I just have to follow 1-year T-bill rates, which is
readily done, specifically the Fed numbers published in "Key Interest Rates"
in the WSJ every Tuesday.

For fixed rates, the directly interesting number is the FNMA 30-year rate
for 60-day commitments.  Which Treasury rate does this track most closely?
I recently heard someone say that it's more related to the 10-year bond than
the 30-year rate.  Does anyone know for sure?

With the answer to the above question, one can then look at Treasury futures
to see what "the market" thinks interest rates will be in the future.  (The
market may be wrong, but I can't think of any source more likely to be right.)
Does anyone know how to actually turn a futures price into an anticipated rate?
That is, if I want to know what the one-year and ten-year Treasury rates are
likely to be on a given date for the next several years, how would I interpret
the prices I see quoted in the WSJ?

I'll summarize emailed responses, and post the result.
From: root@sickbay.austin.ibm.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Charles Givens
Date: 20 Jul 92 19:15:24 GMT
Organization: ttmar Ltd., Austin

>A friend of mine with a lot of money and no common sense recently
>paid $1000 for a Charles Givens home-study course in investing and
>personal money management.
>Anyway, the merchandize includes audio and video cassettes titled
>"Money Strategies Financial Library." The $1000 fee also allows
>him to get free personal money-management advise for the rest of
>his life from a Charles Givens financial advisor.
>Does anyone have experience in dealing with the Charles J. Givens
>Organization and this particular program?
>In particular, I believe my friend has a 30-day trial period in
>which he can cancel. My opinion is that he should cancel. What
>do you think?
>Thanks.
 Wholehearteldy YES, YES, YES, YES !!!!!!!!!!
 Look, I don't know this Givens guy and I will not say anything against HIM,
 as a person. As a concept it STINKS. A lot of sorry ass souls, (sorry, your
 friend may qualify), think that they can BUY common sense and experience.
 I am a semi professional trader, (have been a broker for two years) now I
 only play with my money.) I have enough experience and knowledge I could
 start peddling something like this, but I could not sleep at night. (well :-))
 I went thru this myself, bought AIM casettes (Automated Investment Management)
 by Mr. Lichetto (sp?) and even so, it was not the total crap, I could have
 bought his book only !! As a whole it had some merit but not $200 worth.
 Your frind maybe better to take some CC courses or cont. education stuff.
 My .02 dollars worth.
 Cheers
 AMN
From: bhoughto@sedona.intel.com (Blair P. Houghton)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: How does quarterly loss directly affect shareholder?
Date: 28 Jul 92 17:48:06 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Intel Corp., Chandler, Arizona

In article <1992Jul27.212108.15587@pony.Ingres.COM> gmcquary@Ingres.COM (George F. McQuary) writes:
>loss was "equilavent to 35 cents per share".
>Does this mean that they will now sell their stock to the public 35 cents
>lower per share? That they will try to get 35 cents per share from each
>share holder to coop their loss? Is this meaningful information at all?

It means don't expect a dividend this time around.

It means that if you really owned the portion of the company
for which you hold the stock, this is how much you would
have lost.

It means if there's another stock that has worse per-share
losses you shouldn't want it; and if there's another stock
that has better per-share losses, or a profit, you should
want it more than this one.

				--Blair
				  "35 cents per post."
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: hanrahan@sequent.com (Tom Hanrahan)
Subject: Yacktman Fund
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 21:41:41 GMT

Can someone send me the address and/or phone number (preferable 800
number) of the Yacktman Fund?  This is a new fund started by Donald
Yacktman, the former investment manager of Selected American Shares.

-- 
Tom Hanrahan	           	
hanrahan@sequent.com
From: a_willisgt@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Splitting $ into mutual funds (?)
Date: 23 Jul 92 18:31:30 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

Hello, folks -

  A friend of mine and I got into an interesting discussion yesterday evening. 
I've been investing in a mutual fund for almost seven years; my friend has
recently married, and I'm trying to encourage him to begin investing *now* for
his retirement, and college tuition for the munchkins.

  In the course of explaining mutual funds and the like, he asked me if he
should open seperate accounts: one for retirement, one for tuition, etc.  I
didn't really know what to say. I've just one one fund, one account, and that's
it.  Just one general fund for any future financial needs.  I've never really 
thought about splitting it into seperate accounts.  

  I don't claim to understand a whole heck of a lot about investing.  I treat
my mutual fund almost as if it were just a high-quality savings account (with a
little risk).  These were my intial thoughts on the subject:

  o  The only time money should be divided among different accounts is when an
     investor is trying to spread cash over different investment types.  If,
     say, I wanted a moderate-growth/low-risk annuity for my retirement, and a
     high-growth/moderate-risk fund for the kids' tuition.

  o  It just wouldn't make sense to have two accounts in the same fund. 
     Whatever charges/fees are associated with the fund would be charged 
     against each account, I've got to worry with more figures, and so forth.  

  But gang, I could be dead wrong, and just don't realize it.

  Any investment gurus care to comment?


Ty Willis
Stephen F. Austin State University
a_willisgt@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: jdavis@husc13.harvard.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Insurance (was Re: Charles J. Givens)
Date: 26 Jul 92 23:41:02 GMT
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

Wow!  Well, from an e-mail conversation and from the posts to this group,
I've discovered that one of my fundamental assumptions about insurance was
incorrect.  I was unaware that insurance companies raise there rates [as
much as they do] when you make even a small claim.  I thought getting in
an accident would cost you as much as getting in an accident and making a
claim, and this appears to be incorrect.

I'd just like to say publically that this really sucks.  Obviously, then,
the only real reason to have insurance is to cover catastrophe (as many
people better informed than I have already stated).

Thanks for straightening me out.

Jason Davis
jdavis@husc3.harvard.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: xcpslf@decsrv.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (stephen l favor)
Subject: Re: Charles J. Givens
Keywords: drivel
Reply-To: xcpslf@decsrv.oryx.com
Organization: Oryx Energy Co., Dallas, Texas.
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 14:22:37 GMT

Well, I've avoided this one to this point because I'm still working on an
unbiased opinion of Givens, but I'll offer my current opinion.

In article <1992Jul20.181600.17579@hemlock.cray.com>, frankb@willow41.cray.com (Frank Barriuso) writes:
|> 
|> In article <2033@tivoli.UUCP>, dfavor@logan.tivoli.com (David Favor who
|> doesn't read news drivel but interesting enough, does reply to it) writes:
|> >
|> >
|> > > In article <1992Jul18.134628.27584@hemlock.cray.com> frankb@willow41.cray.com (Frank Barriuso) writes:
|> > 
|> > > If he has no common sense, then maybe he should keep the course.
|> > > The Givens program is geared for people with no common sense.

Not Completely true.  As Mr. Barriuso points out, many of the things are based on
comman sense.  If you're in it to figure out how to lower your insurance, then
get out.  You can go to promos for these groups and get the same information.
I heard a Given's like organization on late-night TV say something about
deductables, so I called my insurance agent, asked them about it, and they
told me everything I wanted to know.  But if you want to squeeze blood out
of the IRS, Givens can do it for you if you pay the price (both time and money).

|> >
|> > ------- how to flame Givens in a believable manner
|> > 
|> > become a member and relate your experinces in the form of facts. if you are
|> > up to this contact me for membership information.
|> >

Only become a member if you wish your whole life to become an extension of the
Given's Organization and/or your own business adventures.  That's how it works.
You save taxes by making everything in your life business.  Personally, I don't
like having to mention Givens or my company everywhere I go.  I prefer to work
and leave work.  When I have some money to venture, I'll probably play the
penny stocks or something, but I don't want to start an all-consuming business.
On the other hand, my brother (David Favor, above) seems to enjoy it
profusely.

In general, it seems to me that organizations such as this tend to make a few
people very rich and a lot a people a few hundred or thousand dollars less
rich.
From: McAldon International Inc. <mcaldon@igc.org>
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Date: 24 Jul 92 21:19 PDT
Subject: Re: Mail Order Companies
Nf-ID: #R:1992Jul23.024939.997@midway.uchi:-597308463:cdp:1426500224:000:1160
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!mcaldon    Jul 24 21:19:00 1992


|Please pardon me if this post is in the wrong newsgroup (and perhaps
|tell me where I ought better to direct my efforts).
                         
There must be a better group but I can't name it.

|   I'm thinking of opening a mail order company specializing in soccer
|equipment.  Naturally, I need to know about various small catches and laws.
|If you have any experience or knowledge of such things, please send me your
|advice.  I am new to this whole scene; I could use any helpful hints.
Thomas Bengal Hafner		 hafn@quads.uchicago.edu	     Chicago,IL

I've done lots of mail-selling, including running an ad agency doing m/o.
You're not gonna learn how to do it by a few E-mail tips.  I assume you
don't have the money or inclination to hire a specialist, which would be
the obvious way to go.  There must be books on the subject.  I suggest you
check out a few big bookstores.  Get something recent.  DMcKenzie

                         |        Vote for the environment          |
|    mcaldon@igc.org     |            Vote for AL GORE              |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
From: timlee@public.btr.com
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Capital Strength of Banks (was Re: December Surprise Scenario)
Date: 31 Jul 92 04:53:15 GMT
Reply-To: timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee)
Followup-To: misc.invest

bakken@cs.arizona.edu (Dave Bakken) writes:
|timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee  timlee@btr.com) writes:
|
|>All I can say is, check on the capital strength of the banks, S&Ls
|>and credit unions that you deposit significant amounts of money in,
|>or use for regular checking accounts (you don't want all your checks
|>bounced with "failed bank" stamped on them, do you?).
|
|Exactly how does one go about this, and for what does one look
|for?  Also, does this apply to banks in which your mutual funds
|hold their assets?  Thanks!

Sources of information about banks/S&Ls/CUs:

1.  Annual report, statement of condition, or other financial
statement from the institution.
2.  Credit rating agencies (if it is a large institution).
3.  Credit rating agencies that specialize in financial institutions,
such as Veribanc, Bauer, and Weiss.
4.  Others?

Items used as indicators:

1.  Equity compared to assets.
2.  Bad loans compared to assets.
3.  Comparing 1 and 2.
4.  Interest rate risk.
5.  Whether the place is losing money.
6.  Liquidity of assets.
7.  There are probably others.

As far as analyzing banks whose stocks your mutual funds own,
it's probably about the same usefulness as analyzing any other
stock the mutual fund owns.  Remember that one does not always
own bank stock for the same reason one puts money in a bank --
a risk taker may buy a weak bank's stock in hope of a large
turnaround gain, for example.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee                 timlee@btr.com  ...!decwrl!btr!timlee
This message comes with no warranty, not even an implied warranty of
fitness for any particular purpose.
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: philba@microsoft.com (Phil Barrett)
Subject: Re: "Flash memory"
Date: 21 Jul 92 16:28:15 GMT
Organization: Gizmos R US.

In article <4876@gold.gvg.tek.com> johna@psdcae1.gvg.tek.com (John Abt) writes:
>In article <1426500222@igc.org> mcaldon@igc.org (McAldon International Inc.) writes:
>>A few days ago, the LA Times quoted a Goldman-Sachs analyst as saying
>>AMD and Intel were leaders in "flash memory."  Is this true?  And just
>>what is the future for flash memory?  Is it related to the "bubble
>>memory" of a few years back?   DMcKenzie
>
...
>
>AMD is the leader with INTEL not far behind. AMD just, in the last week, announced
>a new flash technology partnership with a major Japanese firm (Toshiba I think).
>
>AMD should remain a leader in flash; but the big question with AMD now is the 486.
>If they can ship that chip in Q4 or Q1, their stock should recover.
>
>John Abt

This is interesting.  I was under the impression that Intel is the main
force behind flash.  Didn't they just chop the prices to parity (pun
semi intended) with DRAM prices?  I've heard very little of AMD in all
this.  What devices do they have?  What makes them the leader in your
eyes?  (price? reliability? read speed?  write speed?  Life cycle?
system support?...)   I'm not trying to be snide, I really want to know. 

In all this, there are several problems with flash memory that need to
get solved:
	- limited life cycle.  I'm not sure what the next generation
	  will have but the current parts are rated at 10K erase/program
	  cycles.  This will have to improve by several orders of magnitude
	  to go beyond a speciality part.
	- prices.  these are still high -- 4 to 5 times mask programmed
	  ROM.  This may be ok for replacing EPROMs but to be ubiquitous
	  in electronic equipment and enable a host of new applications,
	  the price needs to get lower.
	- slow erase/write times -- currently on the order of 10s of
	  microseconds for writes alone.  These devices have an odd
	  characteristic that each bit starts out as a 1 and may be written
	  to a zero but the device (or block) must be erased to get the bits
	  back to 1.  The erasure is pretty slow these days (on the order of
	  hundreds of milliseconds).
	- system support.  These devices are very quirky when it comes
	  to writing data to them and for the current generation, required
	  some tricky timing algorithms to avoid over programming (and
	  ruining the chip).  This may be getting solved but is a real
	  problem for general usage (i.e. must have a driver tuned to the
	  current hw environment, you cant just write the data from your
	  program).

For me the holy grail is disk drive replacement and thats a few years out
if ever. (yes, there are some today but thye don't cut it yet)



All the above is strictly my own opinion and not necessarily that of
my employer

Phil Barrett
From: shm@phoenix.syl.nj.nec.com (Shailendra Majmundar)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: SWISS A/C BY MAIL
Date: 24 Jul 92 13:42:41 GMT
Reply-To: shm@syl.nj.nec.com
Organization: NEC Systems Laboratory, Inc.

Recently I got a junk mail advertising a "The Book of TAX knowledge" 
published by Boardroom Classics, NY, which boasts many tax saving tips 
including one which claims "You can open a Swiss bank a/c by mail, and 
legally answer "no" when the IRS asks if you've got one. See page XX"!!

I am wondering how such a thing be legal?? If it is illegal, how can
someone publish such an info??

Sam (shm@syl.nj.nec.com)
From: as@sgi.com (Ashmeet Sidana)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Morningstar ratings (part 3/3)
Date: 29 Jul 92 17:06:32 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

In article <1992Jul29.024641.23179@cc.gatech.edu> barrett@cc.gatech.edu writes:

>Quest For Value                  4                          
etc.

So is 1 good and 5 bad or vice-versa?

---Ashmeet