From: cthurrot@pearl.tufts.edu (MUST'VE TAKEN A WRONG TURN AT ALBERQUERQUE)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Bought a 93 Civic LX 4-door....(long post)
Keywords: Ransom for the buyer's order........
Date: 23 Dec 92 03:10:00 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1gnqc0INNgtc@menudo.uh.edu>, rao@tree.egr.uh.edu (Jagannatha  Rao) writes...
> 
> 
>Thanks to everybody who wrote to me regd. a new car purchase that I was  
>assisting with. 
> 
>We wanted to get a decent 4-door small sedan with reasonable options for about  
>$12K + TTL. 
> 
>We got many suggestions; the Sentra, The Mazda Protege, Saturn, Geo Prizm etc.
> 
>We finally bought a Civic because: we were in a hurry (car rental charges were  
>adding up), I have a Civic of my own, the Protege was a very nice car but there  
>were questions about the resale value of an Escort-similar car, Sentra's were  
>our next best option but air-bag was not standard and foldable rear seat was  
>available only in higher trim models, the Saturn SL1 felt (very much)  
>underpowered and SL2 was a bit out of our price range. 
> 
>The Civic LX  has moderate power and has many power options which are nice in a  
>sedan (power locks, windows and also cruise).
> 
>Now, let me relate my own little "dealer from hell" story. Note that I have  
>read Remar Sutton's book a few times, so that helped.
> 
>I figured the  total dealer cost on a 93 Civic 4-door LX with a/c and floor  
>mats to be around $11,500. This after making an educated guess about the  
>infernal "dealer installed a/c option".  My credit union approved a 6.25% fixed  
>apr, 48 month loan if I were to cosign, to which I   agreed.
> 
> 
>So, after a week of test driving   different cars, we descended on our first  
>Honda dealership last Friday. After the usual protest about why the buyer had  
>to bring  me along, I made a firm offer of $11,900.  After some hesitation, the  
>salesman took it to his manager, who turned it down. He came back with things  
>like "you are close, etc. etc." but we walked out.
> 
>At the next place ("dealer from hell"), we walked in and offered a firm price  
>of 12,000. Told him that on that price, we would buy immediately. The salesman,  
>who did not seem very experienced, took this to his manager  who turned it down  
>also. We were on our way out when the manager accosts us 
>and rudely tells us what he thinks of us and our offering price.  I asked him  
>if he was prepared to give us a firm, final price that we may consider on our  
>way out. No way.
> 
>	"My list on that car is $13615.  $12K is below my cost."
>"No, that is not true, I believe you are making $500-600 profit on my offer."
>	"who told  you that?"
>"My bank did."
>	(very abusively) "You believe your bank? How many cars do they sell?  
>Which  is your bank? Who did you talk to?" etc. etc.. (more shouting, more  
>rudeness, and all other salesmen are now watching the manager scream at us).
> 
>"Listen, you keep this up for 5 more seconds and I am walking out of here"
>and we did, saying that "you just lost our $12K business". We get into my car,  
>and are half way out of the parking lot when we see the manager-oaf come  
>running.  He was all apologies, smiles, and asking if we would reconsider  
>walking out. I told him that I would not get out of my car until he agreed to  
>my $12K price.  We sat in the car until he came back and said "I can't do floor  
>mats in that price. My cost on them is $48, so for $12048, you can have that  
>car."  I did not believe him, but thinking that he wanted some sort of victory,  
>I agreed to $12048. What a worm.	
> 
>I thought our problems were over, but that did not turn out to be the case.  
>After the usual protest for a phony $25 documentation fee, and turning down all  
>of $1200 worth of fabric protection, paint sealant, underbody coating etc., our  
>horrors began.  We had signed a buyer's order and they wanted a cash deposit.  
>No problem, I put down a check for $200. I demanded both a copy of the buyer's  
>order (to take to my credit union) and a receipt for my deposit.  The deposit  
>receipt appeared after some protests (I don't know why) but they flatly refused  
>to let me have a copy of the buyer's order, saying they won't let me pass the  
>firm price on this car to others, and they <<promised>> to fax it to my bank  
>themselves. 
> 
>THIS THEY DID NOT AND WOULD NOT. What jerks..
> 
>They knew that we were renting a car and so they kept delaying, lying, and not  
>faxing for 3 more days until we got mad and asked what was happening. They said  
>thay wanted to  arrange the financing themselves and we should visit the  
>dealership again. I asked him to tell me the financing terms over the phone and  
>he said "you are not the buyer, you are a cosigner who is not needed on our  
>(exhorbitant rate) financing, so jump into some lake". I put the buyer on a  
>conference call, and now the finance-worm got very upset, and  he hung up on  
>us, saying that he would not fax it to my credit union and if we wanted to buy  
>the car, we had to pay him a visit. Otherwise, the limbo continues. 
> 
>Finally, I called my credit union to complain about this dealership, and asked  
>them to get involved by requesting the buyer's order themselves on my behalf.  
>This they did and we finally took delivery of the car. The sales critter said  
>at the end that the dealership was very upset with us because they "literally  
>gave the car to us" and wanted to make some profit on the back end of the   
>financing. I don't believe this. 
> 
>However, I am still a little satisfied that I got this dealer so aggravated and  
>riled up about this deal. 
> 
>BTW, if you are in Houston, the dealership is McDavid Honda on the Gulf  
>Freeway.
> 
>  
> 
>--
>Jagannatha Rao				E-mail:rao@tree.egr.uh.edu
>Department of Mechanical Engineering    Tel   :(713) 743-4535
>University of Houston                   Fax   :(713) 743-4503
>Houston, TX 77204-4792
[B
Sorry to hear about your bum deal with the dealer.  I just went through the new
car deal myself and had a completely opposite experience.  One of the things 
that was important to me was service and how I was going to be treated, so I
went down to the Saturn dealer and have no regrets 1 month into owning the car.
They really care, and the finance guy ran around to get me a lower rate when
GMAC went up on their finace rate (9.5% to 10.75%  Ouch!).  I'll admit the
SL1 is a bit underpowered on the highway, that was the main reason I ponied 
up the extra $1400 or so for the SL2 equipped mostly the same (plus all the
really nice SL2 features like 15" wheels and better looks).  I tried other
dealers before the Saturn, and the treatment was NOTICEABLY different.

Good luck with the Civc.

BTW, did that car include an airbag?
-Chris
Newsgroups: rec.autos