From: rsrodger@wam.umd.edu (Yamanari)
Subject: Re: Here's some Advocacy for you.
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 14:14:30 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.023809.80035@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> sjb5@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STACY JOHN BEHRENS) writes:
	<some really good points made>

>And NT is better?


	They're both pigs.  However, is it *always* necessary to
	define OS/2 in relavence to Windows (orNT)?  If Windows
	is bad (as I've said--I *use* it, but it's bad) and
	NT is nonexistant--why is OS/2, being better than something
	really awful, any *good*?  NT is a super -pig, OS/2 is a pig.
	Next to the configurations DOS users are used to, there's
	not much difference between the two as compared to the
	difference between *either* and DOS.  Windows, too, for that
	matter--for most things, 4 megs'll do you.

	What I wouldn't give forefficient programming.  PageStream
	on the Amiga (2.1) was something like 4 megs for the entire
	program--including print drivers.  This is *roughly* equivalent
	to Aldus, which is almost three times the size (I'm factoring
	in fonts, font support and printing--all supplied by Windows).
	Procomm Plus for Windows is ~1.1megs *just* for the exe 
	file.  Is the whole world *insane*?  DOS comm programs run
	1/3rd or less than that.  And if DeScribe (3.0) is any example
	of how the situation is going to be for OS/2 apps, it's not
	much different in the OS/2 world.
 
	[end of rant on piggish practices by programmers]


>You're idea's about NT finishing off OS/2 need a good shot of reality.  First.
>NT does not run very well, (certainly worse than OS/2) on desktop system.


	Accepted (at present--even if I do feel that by release
	it will be at least as good at OS/2 for native apps, better
	for Windows and still much worse for DOS)


>investment to move to NT.  (at least in theory)  Third, NT lacks a user
>interface that is worthy of the system.  A great many people think that the
>WinGUI is not even good enough for Win3.1, much less NT.  Fourth, not everyone


	There are replacement GUIs.  A lot of people like Norton
	Desktop--I prefer NewWave, and IMHO NDW is one of the most
	buggy programs Symantec has ever put out--and I've used *Justwrite*.


>wants to move to NT.  Virtually every person I've met who uses Unix, when I ak
>them about moving to NT, they laugh.  Many of the people who currently do not


	I'm not expecting any group other than Windows users to move
	en masse.  I think that a lot of OS/2 users who have the systems
	necessary (16 meg users) will take a look, especially if MS
	prices right.  A lot of people who want NT's features
	will move (unless MS releases a Windows 4.0 [or whatever]
	with the features) to NT because the other option is a Mac
	(Unicode, for instance.)

	OTOH, people buying Alpha machines (dec must be sick of waiting
	for MS.  I wouldn't be surprised if they started working with 
	IBM...) wont make much choice, and the speed difference between
	these machines and Intel hardware will probably make them not 
	bad sellers.. (but this is dependant on how they market them--
	if they market them as real workstations, the only strength
	would be applications, but if they aim them at the low-to-mid
	(mid) PC market, they'll do very well.  The workstation versions
	will, in all reality, be running Unix--I don't doubt this--
	but NT [or OS/2Mach, forthat matter] licenses these machines
	for the mainstream..)



>NT will NOT become "the standard OS".  It will simply be one more big player


	It will probably becomethe standard OS for high-end Intel 
	based hardware.  OS/2 could easily play cockroach if they 
	got the 6 and 8 meg performance a lot better, and I suspect
	that they can--if they try.  


>real world work as NT.  Given NT's continually slipping "ship dates" this


	This coming from an OS/2 advocate?  Lesse.  3.1 support was
	first promised for last June, then "end of summer" (september) 
	then "before the year is out" and now, what, March?


>Yes, see above.  I've got plenty more too.  NT is good but it is a *long* way
>from perfect.


	Getting better.  Stalemate this round.



-- 
	"If you can't eat sand, why the hell are you living in a desert?"


	Nuclear redevelopment for a better world!
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.advocacy