From: algebra@leland.Stanford.EDU (Leong Weng Ng)
Subject: Re: Hudud Laws
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 00:35:13 GMT

In article <199208142128.AA07701@admin.keh.utulsa.edu> sya@admin.keh.utulsa.edu (Syed Shibli) writes:
>
>From the keyboard of Leong Weng Ng, who writes:
>
>>	I think Mr. Chan has raised a very pertinent point
>>here. Even if Hudud laws are implemented with the utmost
>>scrupulousness and fairness, I think it will still cause
>>a fracture in the identity, if nothing else, of the nation
>>of Malaysia. The potential for such a fracture is made even
>>more significant when we consider the fact that Malays are
>>constitutionally linked to Islam (a fact previously raised
>>by another netter). This could serve to widen any existing
>>gulf between Malaysian Malays and Malaysians of other races.
>
>  This is all very well, but do please give examples where
>  coexisting sets of laws have "fractured" the identity of
>  a nation. In all fairness, I can only say that your 
>  hypotheses might turn out to be correct, but they are just
>  mere speculations, and history does not seem to concur with
>  you. You use grand words of discourse such as "[national]
>  identity" and "fracture", but where do these entities come in
>  eventually? The crux of the issue is stability, and we have
>  examples of this throughout the world. Identity is not forged
>  by the uniformity of a nation's laws, nor is it a reflection of
>  it. Identity is very much stability, from whence it originates.

	I somewhat disagree with your view that identity
necessarily originates from stabilty. Stability, assuming
that you mean a situation whereby there is no open conflict
between different social and economic groups in a country,
can mean quite a number of things. Stabilty could just
mean that one group is economically and socially subjugated
by another, and the weaker group has no power to oppose the
more powerful group, so that no conflict can occur. This
possibility is not likely to occur because history tells us
that oppressed groups will most likely eventually come to
blows with their oppressers. But that is just one possibility.
On a more cheerful note, stability could mean that we have
two groups coexisting, but in separate spheres of power. One
group may control the economic power whilst the other wields
the political power. The former group may just be happy to
be politically powerless because they have a big share of the 
economic pie. But can we say that the economic group identifies
with their country in the same way that the political group does?
Herein you have a case of a fractured identity within a 
framework of stability. Let me illustrate with a meager
analogy: Having stability with a fractured identity is
like having a lawful marriage without any love. Society
tells us that there are many such marriages, analogy tells
us that this could happen to nations too. The above is my
comments re: your view about stability. Regarding how 
different sets of laws can cause a fractured identity, I
cannot give examples from history nor construct a logical
proof that that will happen. I was, as you said, speculating
about this possibility. However, I am not making a random
guess at things because IMO this is a very real possibility,
not just for Malaysia, but also for any other nation. I am
drawing from the fact that when two groups of people somehow
get the signal that they are different from one another, they
tend not to relate well to each other. Relations may only
remain at a superficial hand-shaking level. IMO, the Hudud
laws may have the effect of accentuating differences between
racial groups in Malaysia. I do not mean to detract the 
implementation of Hudud laws at all, but whilst there exists
a possibility of such a societal effect, it is in the interest
of all Malaysians to give it due consideration.

(:-| opinion-giving mode)
Weng Leong
Stanford U.
 
>--
>                                           --Syed Shibli
>                                             +1 918 631 3257
>                                             sya@admin.keh.utulsa.edu
>
>