From: garyh@sco.COM (< Gary H >)
Subject: Re: Before Buying Japanese.
Organization: The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 21:45:04 GMT


In article <1993Jan11.193310.15833@bnr.ca> dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton) writes:
!In article <1993Jan11.162238.25862@oakhill.sps.mot.com>, rvkl60@email.sps.mot.com (Tom Mathes) writes:
!|> >Granted, but just because GM can finally build a car that doesn't fall apart
!|> >when it hits the pavement does not mean they are as good as Honda.  It just
!|> >means they are not as bad as they used to be.
!|> 
!|> And Hondas stay together forever?  Yeah, right.  I look at friends' and
!|> family's Hondas for evidence.  My sister's 1985 Accord rattles like
!|> a claptrap, has fabric disintegrating all over, has plastic parts breaking
!|> in several places or deteriorating (recently, the glove box lock assembly
!|> broke; it was a plastic mount, and to properly repair it requires *a new
!|> dashboard*!!).  A friend's 1984 Accord looks like a rolling wreck (paint
!|> was shot 3 years ago, rusting in several places, fabric in shreds, rattles
!|> and creaks all over, plastic is gone or broken everywhere), and my mom's 
!|> 1986 Prelude also rattles like a claptrap, not to mention has trashed 2 
!|> sets of rotors, due to warping, in only 60K of usage, and has had a CV
!|> joint go out recently.  In the meantime, I owned a 1987 Grand Am that 
!|> had one bulb burn out in 60K of usage, along with a $40 set of shocks, 
!|> a 76 Pontiac that needed a clutch and a water pump during it's 130K of 
!|> usage, and a brother with a 90 Grand Prix that only had 1 fuse blow so
!|> far (and nothing ever went wrong again).  As for my Saturn SC, nothing 
!|> has gone wrong mechanically in 1 year of ownership.  I only have had 
!|> constant problems with a paint repair, from an aftermarket shop, that 
!|> was done to repair some vandalism (some jerk keyed my car).  The Saturn
!|> OEM paint looks great and hasn't chipped; the aftermarket paint has had
!|> problems, though.  I cannot attribute that to Saturn.
!|> 
!|> If this is examples of GM workmanship, I'll take it any day over what
!|> I've seen these supposed "superior" Hondas have.
!
!And I have many many many friends who own/have owned Accords over the last 10
!years and have had NO problems whatsoever.  You can find examples of good and bad
!in any car.  The real question is which car is better more often, and according
!to the long term statistics I've seen it's the Honda Accord.

That's right! In my circles, everyone who has Honda's had not had a single
problem with their car.  I don't like Honda's myself, but when they are good,
you can't deny them of their reputation and quality.  Sure, I can find
someone on this Earth who has had problems with their Accord, but I will bet
you that I can find alot more people that have problems with their GM cars
than the Honda's.

Heck, my dad loves his 79 Buick Regal.  The car is worth about $1200.  He
spend ~ $1500 to repair the darn thing last year, but he won't part with
it.  In fact, someone offered him $1k for the car, but he refused.  I have
an 82 Celica and never do minor or major maintence (except oil change), but
the car has keeps running.  It has almost 120k miles on it and I'm finally
going to do minor service on it!  In fact, I'm going to change the spark
plugs in it today (it's only been change once before).  So, why you ask,
am I finally doing maintenence on this car? I got a new car (M3), and
came to the realization that all cars, not just the new car I got, needs
regular maintence.  I also want to keep the celica running as long as
possible since I'm going to use it as a commuter car.

>
>|> 
>|> I've never driven the Diamond-Star cars myself, nor the MX-3.  I have
>|> driven several Hondas, a few BMWs, a Miata extensively, some larger
>|> GM cars, and to be honest, driving my Saturn is the most satisfying of
>|> the lot.  It doesn't have the "impressiveness" of the BMW, but it feels
>|> better behind the wheel (better ergonomics perhaps).  It doesn't rattle
>|> and buzz like the Hondas I've driven, and has a gutsier low-end torque
>|> feel, not to mention it feels more solid to me.  It doesn't rattle your
>|> teeth out like the Miata, but it has a nice, precise steering feel.  It
>|> doesn't have the quietness of the big GM metal, but it does have that
>|> great off the line torque of it's bigger bretheren.  It also is a fun
>|> all around car to drive, and it looks great to boot.  None of that
>|> amorphous, bland styling so many Japanese imports have these days.
>
>And I've driven the Saturn, the MX-3, the Impulse, and the Talon and I report
>exactly the opposite.  I thought the handling of the Saturn was terrible.  All
>this proves is that we have different opinions.

In my humble opinion, the saturn looks ugly.  I like the looks of the Dodge
Intrepid, though (there, that shows I'm not biased -- oh, the corvette is
cool too 8-)).


!|> In maintenance and insurance, I win that contest easily over these imports.  
!|> I'm happy with my car, and that's what matters to me.  According to Mr. J.D.
!|> Powers' firm, Saturn owners are much happier with their cars than Honda or 
!|> Acura or Mazda owners.  Isn't that what really matters after all?

I just admit, the saturn does win over maintenece and insurance.  It has
self-adjusting valves and another neat feature with the timing chain I can't
recall now.

Gary
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