HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sbixby@cup.portal.com (Steven W Bixby)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: roads & inconsiderate motorists
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 10:00:19 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Michael Smith wrote...

<stuff deleted>
>So what is it about motorists? I vacillate between two hypotheses:
>
>1) The activity of driving *in itself* tends to disturb people's mental
>equilibrium. Some combination of isolation effect, physical immobility 
>combined with high anxiety, and perhaps neurological damage due to lead 
>poisoning. 
>
>2) The automobile has become so hegemonic in our economy, culture, and 
>collective imagination, that any interference with it is seen as a kind 
>of atrocity or sacrilege. The analogy would be with the abject, 
>flea-bitten peasantry of mediaeval Europe, with their deep love and 
>veneration for the lords and clerics that ground their faces in the mud. 
>The car bestrides our physical and emotional lives like a two-ton, 
>poison-spewing incubus, and yet we love it, with the deep, tremulous 
>love that only profound masochists know.

>Of course, these two hypotheses are not mutually exclusive.

I would have to go toward #2.  I've only been riding seriously for a couple
of years now, so I have a great deal of bad-attitude experience.

I think people simply feel that they own the road when they're driving on it.
This goes for other cars, too.  When you're driving along, minding your
own business, and some A-H in a big Mercedes just plows around you, cuts
you off, or pulls some strange act of rudeness (not so strange?), your first
instinct is to get upset because this car has interfered with your desire
to have a clear road in front of you and all around you, to drive as you
please, without interruption.  I just happen to choose big-$ cars as a 
hitting post, because their drivers frequently seem to have the attitude
that "I paid more for my hunka-shit-pile than you did for yours, so I have
more right to do as I please."

But anyway, few people in cars want to be interfered with.  On the roads,
where there are many other cars, it's not much of a choice - drivers MUST
interact with other drivers.  They get used to other drivers.  Cyclists
are relatively rare occurances, and they're treated as nuisances.  And when
a driver is frustrated with all the Mershitties and whatnot blowing them
around, they overheat and take it out on whatever they can find smaller than
them.

Finally, it's a lot easier to take frustration out on a cyclist who is at
your mercy, than it to do it to another car, whizzing by with windows closed
and stereo rattling windows for miles.

Ok, 'nuf rambling...  It's just that so many people take their priviledges
for granted, rather than realizing that the priviledge is conditional upon
other's accepting them and sharing them.  If only people would accept that
they're not the only ones trying to get somewhere in a hurry, or whatever,
then the roads would be safer and less stressfull for everyone.  Human nature
is screwed, I guess.

 -swb- (Steve Bixby - sbixby@cup.portal.com)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: galway@chtm.eece.unm.edu (Denis McKeon)
Subject: Re: MTB LOCKS, ADVICE SOUGHT
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 92 04:48:04 GMT
Organization: Connemara - Computing for People
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.0.1 12/13/89)
Status: OR

[I tried to reply by mail, but the reply bounced big time.]

In article <v-y-1V-@engin.umich.edu> Robert Drongowski <Robert.Drongowski@cc.umich.edu> writes:
>...
>Since stealing of bikes on college campuses is rampant, we purchased a
>GIANT MTB U-lock (Address Santa Fe Springs, CA).  They require
>registration within days of buying the bike and lock.  Since a few weeks
>...
>that bike had to have been locked to a secure stationary object blah,
>...
>To date, I have not received any reply to my lettter (1 month) and have a
>few questions.
>1.  Is this company reputable?
>2.  Has anyone recovered a claim using this companies warranty??
>3.  Are extended warranties a good idea??
>4.  Do any of these type of companies really deliver on their warranties??
>5.  If a bike is stolen, do you have to have photographic evidence that
>the bike was locked to a securely stationary object??

1: No idea, but the company likely is reputable.  

2: I haven't.

3: Yes. The time limit is to avoid bogus claims - e.g., unlocked bike
stolen from dorm room, owner then sends in registration and claims loss
due to failure of lock.  Relax about the company, and hope that your son
understands how to use a U-lock to secure a bike properly (yes, to a
securely stationary object).  If you getting acknowledgement of receipt
was that important, you should have sent the forms by registered mail.

4:  Yes, except Kryptonite won't warranty in NYC dues to heavy losses there.

5: Do you really think that every time you lock the bike you will have
to take a picture of it?  Get real.  However, many companies require
that you send in the defeated lock, or parts thereof.

The problem here is that people will "lock" a bike to a 1-inch sapling,
and return to find a 1-inch stump, with no bike or lock.  They then want
to recover from the lock company.  Other traps for the unwary include 
sign-posts with no sign at the top, or an easily removable one.  Or
parking meter posts with a loose meter, or no meter (I've seen it done!)

The important question here is:  How to secure a bike around campus?

    When you're out and about, lock it to something substantial.

    Unless dorm/house/apartment rules prohibit, put the bike inside at
    night or whenever you're not going to be using it later that day.

    When you're home or at work - anyplace where you're there many hours
    per week - lock it to something substantial, but also try to make it
    inaccessable to a thief who is "shopping" the campus - and who may
    notice the bike on Monday, loosen the rack bolts Tuesday night, and
    remove the bike on Wednesday night.

Learning how to secure a bicycle is easily worth $6/year.  
Doesn't this cost pale beside the rest of the costs of college?

--
Denis  McKeon                            Good.   Fast.   Cheap.
galway@chtm.eece.unm.edu                       Pick two.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: corfmanr@gtephx.UUCP (Russ Corfman)
Subject: Re: Bikes and sidewalks
Organization: AG Communication Systems, Phoenix, Arizona
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 20:38:15 GMT

In article <1992Sep25.203256.1100@csi.uottawa.ca>, pete@aix1.uottawa.ca (Peter Hickey) writes:
> In discussing the 'conversion' factor between running & cycling..
> 
> In article <1992Sep23.221725.6997@gtephx.UUCP> corfmanr@gtephx.UUCP (Russ Corfman) writes:
> >
> >This is just a total crock of shit (to put it bluntly). This was
> >hashed out before and I guess it has to be done again. There is
> >no conversion factor and it's just silly to try and come up with
> >one. What is the conversion factor for apples to oranges? That is
> >about as silly of a question.
> >
> I think not.  I suspect that conversion between apples and oranges
> would be straightforward.  Multiplication by a constant.
> 
> In terms of calories, 1 apple = some numbers of oranges.  In terms of
> carbohydrates, you need to eat some number of oranges to get the same.
> 
> I suspect that this conversion would be easier than runninv vs cycling.

I take it Pete has never heard the term, "comparing apples to oranges."
For Pete's benefit, it means that some things just aren't worth comparing.
Running and cycling are two such things that shouldn't be compared. Heck,
the differences between cycling in and of itself are too great to be
compared.

Ciao,
-- 
Russell Corfman
AG Communication Systems; Phoenix, AZ
UUCP: ...!{ncar!noao!enuucp | att}!gtephx!corfmanr
Internet: gtephx!corfmanr@enuucp.eas.asu.edu
(602) 581-4403

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: elr@trintex.uucp (Ed Ravin)
Subject: Re: roads & inconsiderate motorists
Summary: don't give me this armchair lawyer crap
Organization: Four Wheels Bad, Two Wheels Good
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 18:00:04 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.212710.14280@netcom.com> tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich) writes:

>Come on! This was hit and run. If the cop wouldn't do anything all it
>would take is a trip down to the DA's office and the _insistance_
>that he write it up. You would have to press charges so you'd need
>some sort of proof, but a dented bike and possibly body are pretty
>strong evidence in court.

Another kind word from an armchair Usenetter.  Here in New York City,
you're lucky if the cops who respond to your bike accident call will
even get out of their cars to take your report.  Cops are supposed
to be helpful to victims of motor vehicle accidents, regardless of who
caused it and regardless of whether you're driving a car, bike, or you're
just a ped.  I don't know how many times Tom has been hit by cars, but
the last thing you want to do after you're checking for broken bones and
eyeing your trashed bicycle is to go on the warpath getting the cops,
the D.A., and insurance company to do their jobs and recompense you for
the wrong you've been done.

>If you have any trouble in these sorts of cases, you'd need only to
>contact a lawyer who would probably do the work on contingency since
>it is a positive win situation with any evidence at all.

Actually, according to Bicycling magazine, most insurance companies let
bicycle accident claims go to jury trial, because juries tend to be
more sympathetic to the motorist's side of the story.  As a matter of
fact, it turned out that when you compared claims and awards for cyclists
against claims for motorcyclists, even the motorcyclists got better
treatment from juries than the bicyclists.

Let's try to steer clear of the "victim-blaming" trend -- someone run
down by a motorist should not be required to have the advocacy skills
of Perry Mason in order to see justice done.
-- 
Ed Ravin- elr@trintex.uucp| I like to think (and the sooner the better!)
  elr%trintex@uunet.uu.net| Of a cybernetic meadow where mammals and computers
           +1-914-993-4737| Live together in mutually programming harmony
my opinions, nobody else's| Like pure water touching clear sky.  -R. Brautigan
From: walvdrk_r@research.ptt.nl (Kees van der Wal)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: effects of car exhaust?
Date: 28 Sep 92 09:48:23 GMT
Organization: PTT Research, The Netherlands

In article <alanf.717658880@bruce.cs.monash.edu.au>, alanf@cs.monash.edu.au
(Alan Grant Finlay) writes: 

>>Recently some tests have been done in Amsterdam. A comparison was made between 
>>the amount of (not so healthy) fumes inhaled by cyclists and car drivers. The 
>>cyclists breath more but the concentration at the side of the road and at the 
>>level of his face are considerably lower than in the middle of the road. The 
>>result was that car drivers inhale more toxic fumes than the cyclist. 

> If that is true then why is it that I can't smell the fumes as strongly 
> when I drive (windows closed) than when I cycle in the same traffic density?

I have no reason to doubt their observations. But smelling is very difficult to 
measure. One effect that could play a role is that after a while in an
environment with a steady level of nasty smell you don't notice it anymore. It
could very well be that when you're on the bike periods with "fresh air" and
"nasty fumes" alternate and thus you notice every time you enter a cloud of 
fume.

Regards, <kees>
From: dawson@willard.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Glasses and goggles
Date: 6 Oct 92 23:37:13 GMT
Organization: Willard's House BBS, Atlanta, GA -- +1 (404) 664 8814

ronf@panther3.panther.mot.com (Ron Feigen) writes:

> There are many (ski) goggles that can fit over glasses (depending on the size
> There are also wrap-around sun glasses by Oakly, Bolle and USA Sport (and oth
> I am sure) that can be fitted with a prescription lens.  The Bolle are the
> cheapest to fit, and the Bolle Edge looks a lot like a goggle.

(Sorry to barge into your discussion, but...)  Here is my evaluation:

I had an opportunity to examine a pair of Bolle prescription sun glasses, the
kind with the little insert behind the tinted lens for placement of the pre-
scription lens.

The bridge of my nose is quite narrow, and these glasses would never stay up
in real world scenarios.  Unless Bolle has a model with a narrower bridge,
I don't believe I'll be able to use these...

So, I'll continue to wear Oakleys with my contacts, or my regular glasses,
which provide very little in the way of protection agains the wind.  To each
his own, but I find Oakley's to be UN-comfortable in hot weather, as it seems
like there is an undue amount of head behind them, especially as I prefer to
wear a helmet at all times.  I'm fairly certain I'd find wrap-around goggles
(the skiing kind) to be unbearable.

> 
> -- 
> 
> >
> Ron Feigen
> ronf@panther.mot.com


-- 
dawson@willard.UUCP (Willard Dawson)
Willard's House BBS, Atlanta, GA -- +1 (404) 664 8814
From: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Ticketing illegal cycling (was Re: Bikes and sidewalks)
Date: 27 Sep 92 14:15:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: pegasus.1992Sep27.141521.27415
Organization: Pegasus,  Honolulu

>
>Cops do occasionally recognize us a vehicles.  I don't always agree
>with their method of selection though.  I am typically consciencious
>of pedestrians and always allow them to go first and I usually stop
>at lights and stop signs, etc.  I was ticketed for making an illegal
>left turn.  While I was making this illegal left turn, a messenger
>was blowing his whistle as he ran a red light and blew through a
>crowd of people.  Also a delivery person was going the wrong way down 
>the street.  The reason the cop picked me was I was the only one who
>stopped for the pedestrians.  Now I know I disobeyed the law. But 
>I felt like I was picked on because of what was going on around me.
>Plus it was a $65 ticket.  I thought that was a little bit out of hand.
>I guess that's just the way it goes.
>

Okay, now I'm curious ... what do you think would have happened if
you didn't have any i.d. when you were stopped?  Don't need a license
to ride a bike ...  what would the cop do?



-- 
Richard Foulk		richard@pegasus.com
From: mattc@npg-sd.SanDiegoCA.NCR.COM (Matt Courtois)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Super light stuff
Date: 4 Oct 92 16:54:04 GMT
Organization: NCR Corp., Network Products - San Diego

In <Eemoni_00WB=4ZRVQF@andrew.cmu.edu> cm43+@andrew.cmu.edu (Christopher L. Morrow) writes:

>Following what another memeber of this BBoards audience posted:
>Getta Mission Control..

>Anyway, I have never heard of one, (a mission control) breaking...

I sent a Mission Control with a few half inch cracks, back to Klein
this April.  No problem, they replaced it.  They have also, repaired
and paint my Attitude twice and replaced it once with a new frame.
I love the way the bike handles and rides.  I love the Klein 
warranty, too!

If Klein thinks that their frames and components will last me
a life time or 1,000,000 miles, great.  I've proved otherwise by
having 3 frames and 1 Mission Control fail by using the products
for what they are intended.  All this occurred in 1 1/2 years.
I know in my lifetime Klein will be replacing my frame again.

When I hold the bare Attitude frame set, it's amazing how light
it is. It's also amazing that it stands up to the things I put
it through for as long as it does.  There is no way the frame
could last for 10 years under heavy off-road riding. The frame
can't be that light and be durable enough to last that long.

Maybe if I were lighter, the Mt. Bike data I've collected over the 
last 2 1/2 years would be different. But, at 190 lbs, I've found
that the lighter things get, the better the chances are it will
fail.  I'm not saying heavier stuff will not fail, beacuse nothing on
a Mt. Bike will last forever.

The Mantis catalog states the following, "Off road bicycles undergo
high stress during normal use and will fail in time."  I've found
this to be true.


Matt (mattc@opus.sandiegoCA.ncr.com)
 
think people don't keep a Mt. Bike that long, or sell it.
From: AGECON23@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU (Hugo@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu  <AGECON23@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU>)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Air Transport
Date: 1 Oct 1992 19:16:45 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

Wouldn't it be nice to be able to ride your bike to the airport,
check-in, then ride right up to the plane, with racks in the cargo,
then hop on the plane, and you're flying.

Arrival would be even better: you get off the plane, get your bike,
and ride right out to the road!  No terminal, taxis, luggage claim, etc.
What a great idea, somebody tell the airlines.

  - Tony Dziepak  <Hugo@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu>
From: ceharris@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Carl Harris)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Route Maps
Date: 28 Sep 92 21:21:53 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Virginia Tech Computer Science Dept, Blacksburg, VA

Here in Blacksburg, Virginia, there is a bicycle route marked with
a black and white sign bearing the number 76 and a bicycle icon. 
Some 300 miles from here in Williamsburg, Virginia the same sign
appears on the Colonial Parkway.  Is this an "intra-state" route
which follows ordinary roads?  Are there more such routes?  If so,
can I obtain a map of these routes?

Pardon me if this is a FAQ...

Carl Harris
Internet:  ceharris@csugrad.cs.vt.edu
-- 
+---------------+---------------------------------------------------+
| Carl Harris   |program (tv).  To engage in an activity similar to |
| CS @ VA TECH  |banging one's head against a wall, but with fewer  |
|               |opportunities for reward.                          |
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: piper@bach.udel.edu (Jon Malenfant)
Subject: Question 2?????
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 14:20:48 GMT

 This a repost to my origional post.

 I am curious how much this bike I just came into is worth and then how
 much I can possible sell it for since it is too small for me.

 The bike is a Gitane Vitus 788 with Simplex components with a 
 StrongLight crank and Weinmann Type 500 brakes.  The two measurements
 that I was told to include are the main tube ( 57 cm ) and the seat
 post tube from center of bottom bracket to the top of the tube ( 58 cm ).

 Thanks for any help you can give and thanks to tomk!

-- 
*********************************************************************
*  Jon R. Malenfant     "Nothing in the world compares to flying!"  * 
*  piper@bach.udel.edu         piper@freezer.cns.udel.edu           *
*********************************************************************
From: cm43+@andrew.cmu.edu (Christopher L. Morrow)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Super light stuff
Date: 1 Oct 92 19:09:34 GMT
	<de.t02Ka23Y201@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com>
	<4emiZ_i00iUyA17Gha@andrew.cmu.edu>
Organization: Junior, Chemical Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Following what another memeber of this BBoards audience posted:
Getta Mission Control..

I whole-heartedly agree, you can't beat the stiffness and light weight.  Besides
they look really cool too.
If you are worried about not beng able to fit the stem into your Head tube, just
have amachine shop create a sleeve to fit over the stem and inside the headtube,
sort of like a spacer...
In anycase, this might not sound too kosher, but I called Klein after Cannondale 
replaced my frame for me and asked about the sleeve, the guy out there (Ken)
said that as a company person he can't advise it, but he knows several people
doing it without any problems and that it shouls create no problems if done with 
Aluminum comparable to the stem.(6061-T6 I think).  Anyway, I have never heard of
one, (a mission control) breaking...
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: marquis@well.sf.ca.us (Roger Marquis)
Subject: Re: Tour sitting down (was Re: Demise of the touring bike?)
Keywords: recumbents, touring
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 19:15:09 GMT



In article <1992Sep26.003344.12256@seas.gwu.edu> freytag@seas.gwu.edu (Richard Freytag) writes:
>>
>   ...  re:          recumbents.  The more people realize the comfort
>that can be had riding 'bents the manufacturers will mass produce them
>making them affordable for the average cyclist.  Even at current prices
>there are advantages to recumbents for touring that seem to outweigh
>the present cost advantage of a diamond frame.  One advantage is the
>comfort in which one can tour on 'bents making long trips much easier.  
>Opinions anyone?
>
>-Richard Freytag

I can't really see recumbent sales taking off any time soon Rich.
Having been on a few 'bent rides I much prefer the diamond frame.
Recumbents tend to be heavy and this makes climbing a chore.  They
also have long wheelbases and a high center of gravity which makes 
descending tedious.  It's also very difficult to suspend yourself on 
uneven pavement.  This combined with the low profile, which is
difficult to see from a car, especially in traffic, make a recumbent
really useful only in flat, untrafficked, well paved environments.
These are serious restrictions for any riding, touring included.


Roger (marquis@netcom.com)
Xref: sparky rec.bicycles:22766 rec.bicycles.misc:644 rec.bicycles.rides:186 ga.general:417 atl.general:328
From: david@UUCP (David R. Mayne)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.rides,ga.general,atl.general
Subject: 3rd Annual Bear Creek Mountain Bike Festival Oct 17-18
Date: 25 Sep 92 01:17:18 GMT
Followup-To: poster
Organization: University of Absurdity


The North Georgia Chapter of the Southern Off-Road Bicycle Association
and Outback bikes are pleased to announce the 3rd Anuual Bear Creek
Mountain Bike Festival, to be held on October 17-18, in the scenic
Cohutta Mountains of north Georgia.

What better eay to experience the Fall splendor of the Cohuttas !
(north Georgia leaves are usually peaking at this time)

The festival will feature organized rides for all abilities
(from casual rides to"death marches") on over 70 miles of trails
and dirt roads in the Cohutta Wildlife Management Area. There
will also be a bicycle raffle and other fun events and games
(such as the infamous bike-toss, bunny-hop contest, the chainless
bike race, etc.).

Sample rides include a traverse by the state record poplar tree,
a longer ride featuring vertical waterfalls and many views,
and a 5 mile "hair raising" descent of the Windy Gap Cycle trail, with 
bearmed curves and jumps galore.

Lodging is available in nearby Ellijay or Fort Mountain, or
camping will be available at the festival site.

For more information, call David Mayne in Atlanta at (404) 876-0943
(evenings) or Gary Vandiver in Ellijay, GA at (706) 635-7501 (evenings),
or send me email at wmms.UUCP.

PS to the net police: where do we put ride and event announcements,
in .misc or .rides, or both ?


-- 
David R. Mayne         1372 Normandy Dr. NE             Atlanta, GA 30306
david@wmms.UUCP        (404) 876-0943        ...!gatech!bagend!wmms!david
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles