From: jladwig@soils.umn.edu (John Ladwig)
Subject: Re: hello
Reply-To: john.ladwig@soils.umn.edu
Organization: UMN Soils GIS Lab
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 00:56:50 GMT

In <MUFFY.92Aug6072333@remarque.berkeley.edu> muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu (Muffy Barkocy) writes:
>In article <Brr2H0.4yx@well.sf.ca.us> jrussell@well.sf.ca.us (Jerry Russell) writes:
>[assuming monogamy]
>>[...] the monogamous ideal.  I always felt that every woman I met
>>was judging me for my suitability as her lifetime soulmate;  and
>>I, likewise, was constantly judging by the same criteria. 

>They probably were, for the most part, just as you were.  This is one of
>the real problems I have seen with assumptions of monogamy.  It prevents
>people from simply trying out various relationships and seeing what they
>like.  Every relationship has to be very very serious, very committed,
>very in love.  It was really amazing for me when I finally met people
>who just wanted to like each other and have fun.  Which is not to say
>that we didn't *consider* the possibility of a long-term relationship,
>but rather that even if it seemed clear that that was extremely
>unlikely, that did not mean that we had to write each other off as
>possible lovers.

This was the hardest thing for me, personally, to internalize when I
started negotiating for Personal polyamory (love that 'literation...).
Made a pretty bad botch of it the first time round, too.  Took a couple of
years of stock-taking and communication to repair that little problem. 
Still all friends, but we didn't see much of the one I was interested in,
for a while...  

What I learned from that experience is that I am very much at risk for
"lifetime soulmate" yearnings when I am unhappy in my present situations;
love especially, but also work, or other life environments.  I'm trying to
keep a close eye on that now, and my partner is aware of my tendency, and
helps me keep watch.

>>I find myself fantasizing about the day-to-day life of the polyamorous.

Umm, it's a lot like real life, only more complicated.  
Sorta reminds me of the old Buddhist rumination on what the enlightened
man does after achieving Nirvana; he puts on his clothes and makes dinner. 

To be fair, there is a larger warm spot in my heart for having several
love relationships; I have more people to talk heart-to-heart with; more
people to go girl-watching with, and the threesome I am in has a
wonderfully synergistic fun effect.  

More than just "playful discussions about monogamy, commitment, etc.  and
the teasing revelation that, though acting a lot like a single guy, "I'm
married and poly*; aren't you?", I have *real* discussions about monogamy,
commitment, etc.  I quickly find that pro-poly types will make themselves
known pretty quickly when brought into contact with one another.

>>Is this the picture, or have I got the wrong idea completely?

I think you have a naive view, one that is pretty commonly reinforced in
American culture.  The reality is both better, and less titillating, for
me, than the fantasy you write about.

>There are many options...the
>point is not meeting as many people as you can and having sex with them,
>the point is that you can feel whatever you want to for other people
>(specifically love, but closeness and caring and such too), even if you
>already share strong feelings with someone, and you can express those
>feelings with sex if you choose to do so.

Right on the money, Muffy.  That's why I pay the dues for this club; more
closeness and human contact.

--
	     UMN Department of Soil Science; St. Paul, MN

Internet: john.ladwig@soils.umn.edu             Fidonet: John Ladwig 1:282/8
          jladwig@torpedo.forestry.umn.edu