From: awatson@pecan.cns.udel.edu (angela watson)
Subject: Re: sdf.lonestar.org:/u/df/suicide_quux
Organization: not yet... 
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 16:32:20 GMT

In article <92283.220143U56503@uicvm.uic.edu> <U56503@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
>In article <1992Oct10.011708.17107@udel.edu>, Psycho Kitten says:
>
>>to derive pleasure from enriching people's lives.  It's almost like
>>playing god... you get to decide who will benifit from your existance and
>>who you will ignore.  Life can also be based on hatred or an abstract
>
>>enjoy granting benevolance on whomever I chose... I enjoy bringing a
>>smile to people's faces or a light of understanding in their eyes.
>
>Well...Oh Jeesh!...(Gulp) I *hate* to say this--really--gosh, I can hardly
>bring myself to type it--but I *have* a compelling need to say:
>
>==>  Aren't you Practicing Random Kindness And Senseless Acts Of Beauty?
>
>There!  It's out!  Whew!  Can ASHers stand it?  Doubtful.  Astonishing!  :)
>
>Don't you just *hate* it when someone is right and you can't admit it?
>I sure do....
>
>Brady
>
>>                                Psycho Kitten
> [.sig deleted]


	Yes, I am practicing Random Kindness and Senseless Acts of Beauty.
(But I was doing it long before I'd ever heard it called that.)  I've
been accused of being overly generous at times (not by anyone on the net)...
it does confuse people when I'm randomly kind -- kindness doesn't fit
into the bitch image some people have of me.

	And for Tom Dennis:

	Horseshit? Maybe... I was overgeneralizing.  If "soceity" didn't
give a shit whether people lived or died _of their own free will_ then
you'd never heard any talk about suicide being "bad" or wrong.  Most 
people don't give a damn whether those they don't know live or die.  But
those who oppress or enjoy controlling other peoples lives don't want
the oppressed to off themselves prematurely.  In their eyes, it's bad
for business if the peons start dropping like flies.  

	As far as laws go... No law can be passed to prevent someone from
killing someone else IF THAT'S WHAT THEY REALLY AND TRULY WANT TO DO.  Sure,
they might get punished or executed themselves, but that doesn't bring
the victim back to life.  Laws can't stop everyone from doing "bad"
things.  Laws usually catch those who screwed up and didn't cover
their tracks well when they did something illegal.  By making suicide
illegal, they hope to prevent those who failed from trying it again.

	There are more loose ends than just cleaning up after the dead
body and reading the will.  Who's going to pay to support any dependants
you left behind? Who's going to pay all the outstanding bills (if your
estate doesn't cover them)?   It isn't easy to sell a house that someone
recently committed suicide in (esp. if it was with a gun).  Don't kid
yourself, wills take more than two weeks to finish with (up to months or 
years if you screwed up your records in life or if it gets contested).

	Considering how little "society" seems to care for the vagabonds,
you'd think their suicide would be encouraged.  While it would save the
oppressors and those in power a bit of money to have these "walking problems"
vanish overnight, they aren't about to campaign for the elimination
of all those who need more than they can currently give.  I don't think
the banks (and other businesses) would be too terribly happy if a million
or so depressed people went on shopping sprees before they died (buying
non-refundable goods and services, of course).  While they might be
able to get some of the money back from the estates, they'd lose a fair
amount of money in laywers fees and uncollectable debt.

	There are people who just don't like to see other people die (or
be miserable) for any reason.  They have their own reasons why they
don't want people to die.  I don't have anything against them.

	At least in the US, the promotion of dangerous and toxic substances/
actions is for the benifit of a relatively small group of wealthy individuals.
Tobacco companies could put nicotine in another less polluting form for
people to consume, but that would possibly cut into their profits.  They
also aren't about to admit that they are just out to hook people on
drugs for purely monetary reasons (have to keep up apperances). Caffine and
tobacco are two of the most widely used drugs in the US... I don't think
the Cola and Chocolate industries are about to let go of addictive 
drugs in their products any more than Tobacco companies will begin to
sell nicotineless products.  

	Those who make money off toxic dumping and other life-threatening
things don't care if people die, so long as the Company turns a profit. 
Death is ok with them, so long as they get to make money off of it.  In
their eyes, why should they care if people who are not potential customers
are harmed (or die) from the company's actions?  So long as they can 
avoid paying for their actions (lawsuits and increased costs), they just
don't care.  If a significant number of a company's employees (lower ones)
committed suicide around the same time, someone would be bound to
start asking questions... 

	Death of another is hard for some to cope with (depending on
who died).  Suicide is purposeful death... it scares most to think that
life could be so horrible of someone that they would opt for nonexistance
over life (not including possiblities of afterlife).  

	My original response was to someone saying 'Why should I have to
explain myself? It's my life and only I can live it. No one can tell me
that I can't kill myself (must live for their sake).'  He didn't seem
to fully believe himself... I don't think anyone should continue to
live "for someone else's sake" unless the other person means more to
them than themself.  There were times that I continued on "for someone
else's sake"... and looking back, it was a stupid thing to do. (living
for someone else)         

	Please direct flames to email... ( this has strayed a bit too
much for my liking...)  I'll be happy to continue this outside ASH.

	Psycho kitten

 
-- 

Psycho Kitten   \ zaphodb@brahms.udel.edu    \ Check my .plan \ Just a Grim
Angela M. Watson \ awatson@pecan.cns.udel.edu \ for more info  \ Reaper wannabe

Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday