HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: yfeng@tssmed.hsc.usc.edu (Jeffrey Feng)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Qin Hui was not Qin "Kuai"
Date: 12 Oct 1992 16:22:59 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: tssmed.hsc.usc.edu

In article <BvyqLt.K5v@nic.umass.edu> s9874203@titan.ucc.umass.edu (s9874203) writes:
>In article <ldbg2nINN9n9@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin) writes:
>>In article <Bvv2J7.D8M@cs.psu.edu> jyw@phys.psu.edu (Jin-Yuan Wu) writes:
>I can't believe someone check Kang Xi for pronunciation. How old/young are
>you? :-)
>Beijingese call it Da Shi Lar. How come?
Many words in Beijing dialects are pronounced differently than what
the dictionary suggests. 'Da shi lar' is an example. Don't ask why
this is the way the pronounciation handed down from previous       
generations. (I'm from Beijing).
>
>>              3. Zi Nan (it was Zi4 Nan3, now it is pronounced Zi3 Nan3)
>Zhi3 Nan3 (guide)?
If it means 'guide' then it should be pronounced as Zhi3 Nan2,
not zhi3 nan3.

Qin2 hui4 vs. qin2 kuai4:
  Maybe I'm too ignorant or at least too uninformed. I've never
heard anyone pronounce it as qin2 kuai4 and I was born in Beijing.
One guy claimed that some one from Beijing told him that qin2
hui4 should be pronounced as qin2 kuai4. How interesting?
Also I consulted several friends from Taiwan who too believe that
it should be pronounced as hui4. By the way, the pronuciation in 
Kang1 Xi1 zi4 dian3 is done through other words, and this is called
qie4 yun4. As I can recall, only people who are now over 80 may
know how to use it with the exception of some scholars who studied
ancient Chinese history and culture.
  Any other points? 
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:27842 soc.culture.taiwan:14378 soc.culture.hongkong:12534
From: ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: Oct. 1 or Oct. 10, which is the more important day for China?
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:29:12 GMT
Organization: Muskingum College

In article <gA7-QX-@engin.umich.edu>, chyang@anaphora.engin.umich.edu (Chung Hsiung Yang) writes:

>> 	   I would say, if it was not Old Chiang, Taiwan would not exist
>> 	   as she is today. 
> 
> 	Yes, you are right!  If it was not for Old Chiang,
> there would have been a united China instead of a Communist China and a
> Nationalist China.  

	** You can have your own imagination. I have my.
	   However, we seems agree on one thing: It will be different
	   from now is. That is enough.

> 
> 	Under Chiang's leadership, his over reliance on the recruited warlords
> and his de-emphasis of intellectual leadership allowed his troops to rob and
> pillage the common people.  Unfortunately, because of that Mao took advantage 
> of the situation and got the Chinese people on his side, Mao took China 
> quite easily after that.
> 
> 	When Chiang retreated to Taiwan on his defeat, he abandoned ten of 
> thousands of his troops in China, while they were awaiting instruction.  
> These loyal KMT troops where subsequently became sitting duck for the
> communists.  Some of them managed to escape to countries in South East
> Asia.  Many of whom are still defiently defending KMT and refusing to 
> believe that their leader had put them to their bitter end. 
> 
> 	Take nothing away from the Old Chiang, he was a brilliant military
> stategist and an excellent general.  But he is only a military man.  
> He lacked the compassion that Dr. Sun Yat Sen had toward the Chinese
> people.  Or for that matter, he did not have the compassion that his 
> Chiang Chin Kuo had toward his people.
> 
> 	I also did some brief reading over the summer on the biographies
> of intellectual KMT revolutionaries who were comtemporaries of Old Chiang, 
> such as Hu Shi and Co.  Unless, my Chinese is getting worse, I did not get 
> the impression of their overwhelming support when he took power.
> 

	** I may or may not agree upon what you said. But that
	   it not important. 

	   We seems agree upon another issue: The Old Chiang is
	   not a crook. (this is what I originally responded to)
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Blood card...
Date: 15 Oct 92 21:29:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: sei.1992Oct15.212952.18269
Organization: Software Engineering Institute


...indeed.  The only Americans who might fault Chinese students who support the
protection Bill are some truly idealistic (and/or fundamentally psychotic)
intellectuals who think that China is the great Marxist ideal.  They
apparently are able to dismiss both Amnesty Int'l's and the CIA's estimates of
the tens of millions of executions carried out as political murders under the
communist regime.  Hell, I'm not even anti-marxist, but just seeing how Stalin
and Mao managed things, at least I have sense enough to say, "...hey, maybe
you'd better think your implementation over a little eh?"  

There is no mystery that China is dangerous to anyone who dares openly express
his (or her) thoughts.  Why don't we simply examine what happened during Mao's
"hundred flowers period" for example.  Hell, all (or most of you) know that
you can be sent to jail just for saying what you don't like.  Now I'm not
particularly patriotic, but I still think we're much better off along the
lines of free speech here than there.   You won't (yet at least) be beaten or
jailed for ridiculing the President for example.  Hell, you won't even be
jailed for burning him in effigy.  

My advice is: don't let the foolish intellectuals and spies lay a their
broadaxe, guilt trip on you at all.  They are completely out of touch with
reality.  Life in China is dangerous to you if you value the ability to speak
your mind, travel to another city freely, work in the same town as you
relatives, and to avoid being tossed in jail at the whim of your local cadre
leader.

If someone refers to you as a "Blood carder"--just tell 'em "Petey says, 'piss
up a rope.'"
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 01:08:22 EDT
From: <XXX100@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re:Favorate Xiao3ren2shu1

> From: Tuya@ccmail.uoregon.edu
> Subject: Favorate Xiao3ren2shu1
> Posted-Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 18:26 EST

 >          One thing I miss in the U.S. is xiao ren shu (XRS).

       So glad to know another XRS fan.

 >          Here are my favorate ones:

 >          1.  3 guo2 yan3 yi4;  I especially enjoy the five tiger
 >          generals, and I spent long time trying to figure out how
 >          they ranked in terms of wu3 yi4.  The result is like this:

 >              Luu3 bu4
 >              Ma3 chao1
 >              Guan1 yu3
 >              Zhao4 yun2
 >              Zhang1 fei1
 >              Huang2 zhong1

         You listed 6 generals. Lu Bu wasn't  in 5 tiger generals.
         His wu yi was super. However he didn't pass Mei Ren Guan.
         Who could?

 >          2.  Yue4 fei1 zhuan4;  In terms of wu3 yi4 the following
 >          people impressed me the most:

 >              Gao1 chong3 who play a spear
 >              Yang4 zai4 xing4, another spear user
 >              Yue4 yun2 who uses hammers

 >          I frankly don't like Yue Fei.  I think he often times became

             Me either.

 >          very soft to the king and jian1 chen2.  His early days
 >          impressed me the most when he went through all sorts of
 >          tests and became a general.  Once he did, he became a
 >          conservative republican :-).

          He was more like a politician.His mother's four words on
          his back bent him breathless.
          I was wondering what his Nu Fa Chong Guan looked like.

 >          3.  Shui3 hu3 and the West Tour;  I like the painting of the
 >          serie the most.  The cloth look like Song dynasty.

          Some of best drawn XRS I've ever seen are the series of
          Gu3 Dai4 Cheng2 Yu3 Gu4 Shi4, full of various drawing styles.
          The  plainest and most interesting drawings are wei2 Qi1
          XRS.

 >          Anyway, xrs is my best time killer.  If I have XRS at hand,
 >          I can forget everything in the world.  I propose jin1 yong1
 >          to draw all his stories.

         Agree,especially Lu4 Ding3 Ji4. Great fun reading it.
         Miao4 Yu3 Lian2 Zhu1, like Si3 Ma3 Nan2 Zhui1(dead horse hard
         to catch up).
         Also propose Gu3 Long2's books.

 >          Oh, Xiao3 ren2 shu1,  huang3 ru2 ge2 shi4.
From: dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby)
Subject: Traditional vs Simplified Characters
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 11:37:20 GMT

A friend of mine, who is an Australian, is learning Chinese.
Unfortunately, at University level, he's being taught the
Simplified Characters.

Since he started learning Chinese, we've had endless debates
on whether Traditional Characters are better than the Simplified
version.

I personally think Traditional Characters are better, not
just because I've been using it all my life; but the Simplified
version loses a lot of the meanings of the words.  For example:

the word "Love".  In the Traditional version, there is a "heart"
in the middle of the word; unfortunately, the people from
Mainland took the "heart" out of the word "love".  Which really
destroys the meaning of the word.

the word "district".  In the Tradtional version, it is a three
sided square, surrounding Three "mouths".  now, the 3 mouths
symbolizes "populated".  However, the simplied version took
the 3 "mouths" out, and replace it with a "X".  Again, that
kills the meaning of the word.

            --------
           |    -
           |   |_|
           |
           |  -   -
           | |_| |_|
           |_________

The word "produce".  "Chan3" in "Sheng1 Chan3".  Orginally,
the word "Sheng1" which means growth/produce appears at the
bottom of the word "Chan3", however, it's been taken out.

                `
             -------
               ` '
           ------------
           |
           |
           |
           /
          /

To me, this change is extremely stupid.  I mean, if they want
to simplify, fair enough, I'm for it.... but by taking the
heart out of the word "love" is pure stupidity.

Can someone tell me who is responsible for all these changes?

Note that, I am NOT against simplification, but I think how
it's done.  I think a lot of the changes that Mainland has
done is silly... it simply kills the word's meaning in the
symbol, like taking the "heart" out of "love".

-- 
1)-----------------------Rev 6:8 "... They were given authority over a quarter
of the Earth, to kill by the sword, by famine, by plague, and wild beasts."
From: jianshe@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Share a Room at Denver Cell Meeting!!!!
Date: 8 Oct 92 15:21:10 -0300
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada



I am going to attend American 32nd Annual Cell Biology Meeting at Denver, 
Colorado on 15-19 November this year. I reserved a room with two beds at 
Comfort Inn Downtown ( Hotel) at Denver. I would like to find someone ( male)
to share the room. If you are interested in it, please call me at (902)494-6525,
or send me a e-mail: Jianshe@ac.dal.ca. Thanks a lot for your attention.
J. Zhang at Halifax.
From: qinyi@uk.ac.man.cs (Yi Qin (BCW PhD))
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: A question to ROC vs PRC
Date: 7 Oct 92 22:13:49 GMT
Organization: University of Manchester, UK
In-reply-to: xpei@gwdgv1.gwdg.de's message of 7 Oct 92 15:49:23 GMT

>What will be consequences, if both KMT and CCP could develop
>both in the mainland and Taiwan island, and would have a peaceful
>competition in obtaining supports to build a government.
The first thing to happen is to resolve the argument which one is the
real KMT. :-)

qinyi
qinyi@cs.man.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.taiwan
From: ykhsu@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (yung-kao.hsu)
Subject: Re: SURVEY -- who do you hope wins the U.S. election?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 13:06:51 GMT

In article <1992Oct16.024516.10082@objy.com> cw@orion.uucp (C.W. Chung) writes:
>In article <1992Oct15.164614.18170@cbfsb.cb.att.com> ykhsu@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (yung-kao.hsu) writes:
>>	...
>>	'silent majority' think first. IMO, the suvery questions suggest
>>	nothing but entertaining value; which is fine.
>
>Hmmm, you mean to find out what people think about the MFN issue is 'nothing
>but entertaining value'?  You mean all the debates that has been going on
>in the net and elsewhere are 'nothing but entertaining value'?  

	I stand by my statement. I don't see how one would make a selection
	based on one single issue; life is too complicated than that.
	As for those MFN postings, I skipped them; they contained few
	interesting reasons, wits, and are mostly junks. So, you guess me
	wrong on this; they have few values and that include entertaining.


>...
>but are perfectly willing to let his opinion known in a more suitable
>context (like email).  

	I don't deny that but there are both sides for this argument.

>It appears that some people are really against the idea of trying to 
>find out what the netter think on probably the two of the most important

	I am not (but I will not attend). I only want to express a different
	viewpoint from yours in looking at this survery and others of similar
	nature. I certainly have nothing against Norm just because he is 
	doing it; I think he can understand this based on our past exchanges.
	Actually, I probably will enjoy seeing the result and, with Norm's
	expertise, he may even provide us with few analysis on the psedo-
	scientific result.

Yung-Kao Hsu

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: byab345@chpc.utexas.edu (Da Kuang)
Subject: Chinese Rocket Carries U.S Cargo
Organization: The University of Texas System - CHPC
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 92 19:21:52 GMT

Beijing--A Chinese rocket roared into orbit on Tuesday, carrying an advanced
U.S-built sensor that is expected to help electric power producers around
the world avert blackouts caused by storms on the sun. The $1.2 million
instrument, built at the applied Physics Laboratory of Johns Hopkins 
University, was given a free ride into space on the Swedish satellite
Freja, which also carried instruments from Swedish, Canada, France and 
Germany. The satellite was launched by a Long March 2-C rocket from 
Jiuquan in the Gobi Desert.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
  This news appears in a local newspaper here. The subject line is the
actual news header. I appreciate the attitude and hope all countries
work toward cooperation.
From: jialin@dogwood.botany.uga.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Action-9201.appendix
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:59:17 GMT
Organization: Botany Department - U of Georgia, Athens


In article <2AD24DC8.27779@news.service.uci.edu> yeh@netix.com (Mr Shannon Yeh) writes:
>
>	That's fine.  As long as you realize the existence for Shannon Yeh
>	and its alliance, everything will be fine.  

You, Chinese students in America, will be fine as long as you 
recognize the alliance of Sh*tnoodles, even you eat a "blood-card".  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)
Subject: Re: Who Cares 150 F-16s.
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 19:19:00 GMT

In article <81136@ut-emx.uucp> joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang) writes:
>In article <lcehk8INNk1p@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin) writes:
>>All the world communist countries are dying off, (same as your logic)
>
>CCP has a chance at surviving because it's about the only "communist"
>state that is no longer economically communist.  
>
>>why CCP can survive? (because some of you still support CCP)
>
>I don't support CCP, but I'm not too enthusiatic about overthrowing
>it.  The reason is that I've looked at 20th century Chinese history.
>When people overthrew the Qing, they got the KMT.  When people
>overthrew the KMT, they got the CCP.  Based on this, I strongly
>suspect that if one just overthrows the CCP, one will plunge China
>into chaos, and after about 20 years, one will end up with yet another
>party which people want to overthrow.
>
>Because of this, I am not enthusiatic about just overthrowing the CCP
>through traditional means.  We need to find other ways so that we can
>break this cycle of modern Chinese history.
>
>I think the best way of breaking this cycle is by developing the
>Chinese economy.  A developed economy puts a lot of pressure on the
>government to act in a certain way.  Power in such an economy flows
>out of the hands of centralized bureaucrats and into the hands of
>workers and businessmen.  Gradually, the rulers realize that they
>simply cannot rule in the old way and start to listen.  
>
>As long as the CCP keeps on its policy of economic reform (and by now
>so much power has flowed to the provinces that its impossible for it
>not to) and as long as there seem to be some people in the CCP who
>understand the situation, I would say that our efforts are better
>spent transforming the CCP rather than overthrowing it.
IN THE WHOLE WORLD HISTROY, THERE WAS NOT A SINGLE NATION INDUSTRIALIZED
BY DEMOCRACY, ALL UNDER SOME KIND OF CENTRAL CONTROL.
AT BEST WAS U.S. SMALL HANDFUL OF UNDUSTRIALISTS CONTROL THE NATION, MAJORITY
OF CITIZENS WERE INDER SUPRESSION--- 16 hour a day 6 days a week working
hours, machine gunning striking workers, 9 year old coal mine workers.


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: usenet@news.acns.nwu.edu (Usenet on news.acns)
Subject: Re: To Li Xiaolin, et al
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois, USA
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 16:46:32 GMT

In article <2ADCE5A1.25620@news.service.uci.edu> yeh@netix.com (Mr Shannon Yeh)  
writes:
> Li Xiaolin, did you notice that I VERY seldomly responded your shit, because
> you are not worthy of my effort to knock you out.
> 
> shannon
> -------

Oh, boy! Now you are paying attention to Mr. Li. Is this because his suggestion  
of suing you made you nervous.

Carl
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: 129.83.161.10 (H. Chao)
Subject: Re: 9201 people will be more active
Organization: MITRE
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 14:14:10 GMT

In article <Bw0Hwq.HFu@cs.psu.edu>, echeng@phys.psu.edu (Eddie Cheng)
writes:
> 
> In article <Bw00Ct.KMn@news.orst.edu> wenz@ucs.orst.edu (Wen Zongyao) writes:
> >
> >There are so many other problems of China, a singal bill is not that 
> >important.  Instead spend your time working on the so-called '9201', try
> >to do something really can help China.  
> 
> 	I agree on this point.  The signed bill itself is not the primary
> damage to China at this time.  However, the false or biased image of
> China created in the process of lobbying for this bill is.  
> 
> 	I also agree that now we should concentrate on doing something 
> that really can help China.  One of the things is to try to project
> the true and unbiased image of China today, to present faithfully
> the progress China has made since the tragic days of 1989, both
> economically and politically.  I would like to see everyone here,
> who would either accept or decline the offer this Bill made, now
> to work hard on preserving China's open door policy and Sino-US
> trade, especially in the possible Bill Clinton presidency.
> 
> 	We can no longer sit around to see the China-bashing and the
> threat to Sino-US trade.
> 
> 
>     Eddie
> 
> 
Congradulation, that is the right track.  Global Economic War will be the
next war after the Cold War.  How to win this war?  What you can contribute
to win this war?

MSWD
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.china
From: xiaofei@einstein.physics.buffalo.edu (XiaoFei Wang)
Subject: Re: ******* FREE CREDIT CARDS *******
Organization: UB
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 18:49:40 GMT

* If you know any other financial institutions who issue VISA/MASTERCARD with
* no annual fees, please let me know. 

AT&T, the wrong choice. 
1-800-CALL-ATT ask for universial card. 

-- 
xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu | Subscribe Chinese Poem Exchange and Discussion List 
mail LISTSERV@UBVM.BITNET with "SUB CHPOEM-L 1st LastName" in the MESSAGE BODY
InterNet Address: UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU | Posting in UUENCODED GB and BIG5
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: lieqiu@alfred.carleton.ca (Liebin Qiu)
Subject: looking for Miss Pan Weiying (coming from Beijing)
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 18:22:48 GMT


If you know Miss Pan weiying, a Chinese student now studying in
U.S.A., please tell me her address by email, or tell her my
information:

Qiu Liebin
36E - 1411 Morisset Ave.
Ottawa, Ont., Canada K1Z 8H3
Email: lieqiu@ccs.carleton.ca

Thank you.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: jyw@phys.psu.edu (Jin-Yuan Wu)
Subject: Re: Tuition from Parents (was Re: Fax to Mr. Bush ...)
Organization: Penn State, Department of Physics
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 18:13:23 GMT

In article <1992Oct15.162836.1132@linus.mitre.org> 129.83.161.10 (H. Chao) writes:
>Just for curiosity.  Why C.G. do not collect tuitions from these students? 
>This is unthinkable for us who came from Taiwan.  C.G is too poor to
>support this "free lunch" for these student.  C.G should build more
>elementry schools, middle schools, instead of waste the education fund in
>this way.  Do not "Hua Da4 Qien2 ban4 Da4 Xue2, Hua Xiao3 Qien2 ban4 Xiao3
>Xue2" (use too much money on universities, while use too little money on
>lower level education).  The literacy rate in China is 77%, comparing with
>Japan 99% and Asian 4 dragons >90%.

Good suggestions. 
When the people's living standard grows to certain level, the goverment
should consider collecting tuitions from college students.
High education is a very money consuming program. A country has got to
find some way to concentrate money to run the high education. 
Before 1949, there were some people who could afford the tuition. 
This affordability was not due to the wealthy of the entire population,
but rather due to the concentration of the money via private channels.
Were these private channels all fair? The answer is obvious.
After 1949, most of the private channels do not exist anymore. But
to run the high education, some other channels of money concentration
are required before the average living standard reaches to a high enough
level. These channels are implicated taxes. When the affordability of
a significant population becomes strong enough, collecting a fraction
of the education cost will helps a healthy operation of the high education.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: echeng@phys.psu.edu (Eddie Cheng)
Subject: Re: Once Again, US Welcome You
Organization: Penn State, Department of Physics
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 18:46:00 GMT

In article <16216@mindlink.bc.ca> Sanyee_Tang@mindlink.bc.ca (Sanyee Tang) writes:
>
>    Take the lesson of bloody 1989, for personal safety.  And history will
>forgive them.  Nobody would go to a prominent Chinese-American professor's
>70th birthday party and ask: "Did you take advantage of Chinese soldiers'
>sacrifice in Korea in 1950?"  Or "did you took advantage of McCarthy's
>anti-communism hysteria in US in the early '50s?"

	No, probably nobody would come to ask these questions (unless you 
want to follow Bill Clinton into politics :-) ).  But it shouldn't
take a "someone" to ask.  One's own self would sometimes question
these things.

	"History" tents to forgive anyone.  (Well, maybe not Qin Hui/Kuai :-)).
But some people would still rather choose to hold some least-level
moral standard.

>
>    I understand there is a big difference between legal immigrants and
>undocumented aliens.  But I may be too "westernized" to see the difference
>between "Great, Glorious and Correct" immigrants of talents and resourceless
>immigrants looking for protection.  I stopped to subscribe to that kind
>of elitism long times ago.

	It has nothing to do with elitism.  I salute those poor immigrants
from Mexico or those refuges from East Germany couple of years ago who
state(d) clearly that they are here to pursue a better life, not here
because they want "democracy", "human rights" in their own countries.

	The point here is honesty, not talents or resources.


    Eddie
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china