From: exudms@exu.ericsson.se (New Dave)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Activist shot at Berkeley
Date: 2 Sep 92 18:05:14 GMT
Reply-To: exudms@exu.ericsson.se
Organization: Ericsson Network Systems, Inc.

In article 16346@orionsci, goodwin@orionsci (Ben Goodwin) writes:
>In article <715302097snx@ietech.demon.co.uk> nigel@ietech.demon.co.uk ("Nigel G. Backhurst") writes:
>>
>[snip]
>>
>>A few months ago during some inner city troble, I saw a police
>>officer effectively disarm a six foot two machete wielding
>>160 lb assailent using an English Police trunction.  I belive
>>these are somewhat smaller than American Police nightsticks.
>>I had to admire the move.  I hold dan grades in a number of
>>martial arts, including some weapon arts, but there was no way
>>I would have disarmed the attacker without causing major damage.
>>As it was he had a couple of very nasty bruises and a cracked
>>shin.
>>
>>Sorry but using a gun against a machete seems a bit of an
>>overkill.
>
>I've kept out of this, because at the beginning there was alot of hearsay
>and venting of spleens.  But now that things have calmed down... :)
>
>I disagree with Nigel's above statement totally.  I couldn't disagree
>more if I tried.
>
>Any cop who tries to disarm a person with a long knife IMHO is an idiot.
>The gun allows the officer to stay out of striking range of the lunatic.
>Why should a guy who gets paid as little as a policeman be forced to put
>his life at serious risk going hand to hand against a thug.  Why give them
>guns in the first place? 
>
>Its sad when you hear about a police officer shooting someone, and killing
>them.  But its even worse to hear about a police officer killed in the
>line of duty.
>
>Sorry, but this thread has at times disgusted me.  The people who posted
>that the "God damned cop was wrong, and killed a poor innocent" make me
>nauseous.
>
>You come at me with a knife, and I promise you that if I have a gun, I
>will use it.
>
>Hum, I realize I may look at little cruel above, but I have no pity for
>anyone who attacks a police officer.  You do something like that and
>you get what you deserve.
>
>-- 
>
>-Ben
	******************************************

 This thread reminds me of an incident that happened simular to this one
in Dallas. It was some time back when a kid ran out of the back of a house 
towards the officer with a "BUTTER KNIFE" and was shot dead.

???

Another time an officer shot and killed the store owner with a gun, thinking
he was the asailent.

???
A vice squad was working a drug bust and mistakebly shot one of there
own. *This has happended a few times.
???
Sometimes you hear these stories were youths or "inicent girls" are shot
by police. And only shame is given to the police that become victims of
circumstances.
???
And something that is even sadest of all, and that is when an officer is 
disarmed, defensless, and killed due to the lack of skills needed to 
confront a situation.
A traffic cop on a routine stop in down town Dallas was approched from
behind by a vagrant bystander and was knocked to the ground. The Vagrant
quickly took away the officers gun while a crowd of other vagrants cheered
on and shot the officer dead at point blank as he was begging for mercy.

The Police are NOT martial artist though some may question this. But
if anyone, no matter what state of mind they are in, attacks a Policeman,
they have committed themselves. They have made up there mind to do
so, a full commitment on there part. ***

Now if I were a Police in a situation, I would have to react on my best
instinct. And if I had enough time to analyze the situation, I would try
to use what ever method necessary to seize or subdue. But 
CIRCUMSTANCES may not give me or anyone a chance.

The girl shot at Berkley probably could have been subdued and 
apprehended if a foot sweep and disarm technique was used.  Mace, salt,
or SAND could have been used, but was it available? The Police are not martial artist. They are not warriors. And our tricky laws 
give the police less mobility, but more fire power.

( this may sound as a double statement, but yes I know a few martial artist
that are on the police force.) As there job goes, they are not alowed to
"Use Excesive Force" and can be sued by the criminal!
What have you seen before in a Segal or a Chan movie?
???!!

Please no flames or mud, I'm not hungry.

/New Dave



	*Opinions are mine and not that of my employer*