HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Michael J Valinis)
Subject: Re: Urban Legend
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 12:44:09 GMT

Here's another wonderful story.  I may not have the exact details right, 
Because it's been many years since I read this (I think it was in the _Atlantic
Monthly_....

One oppressively hot summer Glenn Gould was in New York for either a recording 
session or a perdormance, I forget which, and during a break in the rehearsal, 
he went outside in the 90+ deg. F. weather, wearing his overcoat, heavy scarf 
and gloves.  He found a little park and sat down on a bench.  A few minutes 
later a policeman came along and mistaking him for a vagrant, asked him if he 
had a job.  Gould replied, "Yes, I'm a musician."  The policeman said, "That 
explains it", and walked off....
-- 
*>   Michael J. Valinis   -=+<*>+=-   mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   <*
*>=>  "Music is your own experience, your thoughts, your wisdom. If you  <=<*
*>+>=> don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." -Charlie Parker <=<+<*
*>=>+>=>+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+<=<+<=<*
From: jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley)
Subject: Re: Beginning a classical collection
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 29 Dec 92 23:54:17 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.182626.4981@midway.uchicago.edu> gustavo@dent.uchicago.edu (Gustavo Comezana) writes:
>In article <1992Dec28.091408.16539@leland.Stanford.EDU> paulxxxx@leland.Stanford.EDU (paulastya gupta) writes:
>>Hello!  Questions from an ignormaus:
>>
>>1) How can one "break" into classical music?  My current collection 
>>includes the grand sum of *2* classical CD's.  My current thoughts 
>>are to get a book outlining the music of different ages (baroque, 
>>romantic etc.), and start with the recommendations made as to great 
>>works by the major composers.
>>
>Tough question. Some time ago I read a book written by a music critic
>from TIME magazine which seemed a good introduction for the layman,

Walsh ...  "Who's Afraid of Classical Music"

I like this book too.  It's a quick read and his suggestions
encompass a  broad repertoire.  It is very opinionated so take 
his suggestions with a grain of salt.  (Even he suggests that too.)

>>  [Various times of 1812 overture discussed.]

>While it is not very unusual for conductors to make cuts, what
>accounts for most differences in timing is the speed that a
>conductor decides to set for the piece. 

I'd say for most pieces conductor's cuts are unusual.  But, the
choral intro to the 1812 is frequently cut.  I agree, though,
that differences in timings are usually due to tempos.

>
>You mention timing diferences of about a minute; well, I can think of
>an example of two recordings I own of the same piece (Mahler's 4th
>Symphony), one conducted by Rafael Kubelik and another by Franz
>Welser-Most in which the timing difference is even most striking:
>Kubelik dispatches the third movement in about 12 minutes, 
			^^^^^^^^^^^^^^	        ^^^^^^^^^^
My god!  	

>
>>3) Should one look only for DDD recordings as opposed to ADD or AAD?
>>This further complicates CD purchasing.
>>
>This means nothing. CD's may sport wonderful of perfectly awful sound
>quite regardless of whether they are DDD, ADD or AAD.

100% agree.  The performance should generally take precence over the
recording technology.

>>Any recommendations for my tastes?
>

I agree with those who recommend listening to a classical radio
station and visiting the library.  Get a variety (here you can
get 5 CDs at a time) from the library:  (...say...)  Beethoven's 5th,
a Mozart piano concerto or his woodwind or clarinet quintet, 
Stravinsky dance suites (The rite of spring, the firebird), 
a collection of Bach's popular music (Concertos or other 
orchestrations), and Schubert's chamber music (the Trout 
Quintet, for instance).  Then, branch out from there
and develop your own tastes.  Be open minded though.  
Some hear one piece they don't like, then dismiss everything
else that composer does.  (If Brahm's 4th isn't your cup
of tea, you may like his 4th, his concertos, or his violin
sonatas, etc.)

Enjoy

John D.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cs748ab@maccs.mcmaster.ca (Andrew Fung)
Subject: Re: SURVEY: FAVORITE PIANO CONCERTO
Organization: Department of Computer Engineering, McMaster University
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 14:57:32 GMT

From: zorro@picasso.ocis.temple.edu (John Grabowski)
 
>I must admit I'm starting to enjoy these "Greatest All-Time" and "Favorite" 
>threads, so I'm starting another one.  :-)   The question is, What is your
>favorite piano concerto?
>
>And a very important sub-question: What's your favorite *Beethoven* piano 
>concerto?

Rachmaninoff's Second for its gorgeous, melachony and sublime melodic lines.
Others includes Beethoven's all mighty five, Brahms' second, Tchaikovsky's 
first, Chopin's first.

Of all the Beethoven's piano concerto, my favorite is the third. But how could 
I forget the wonderful beginning of the fourth and the Rondo of the fifth.

Andrew Fung
Dept. of Electrical &
Computer Engineering
McMaster University
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
andrew@vision1.eng.mcmaster.ca
From: smoliar@argon.iss.nus.sg (Stephen Smoliar)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Say it ain't so
Date: 23 Dec 92 22:41:44 GMT
Reply-To: smoliar@iss.nus.sg (Stephen Smoliar)
Organization: Institute of Systems Science, NUS, Singapore

In article <1992Dec22.174149.826@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>
dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker) writes:
>Our TV Guide for this week has a movie on the TLA channel (out of Los
>Angeles I think) entitled
>	'The Smurfs and the Magic Flute'.
>
>Tell me I'm mistaken, please....
>
Such a beast does, indeed, exist.  Unless I am mistaken, however, the story has
nothing to do with the Schikaneder libretto, nor does the film have anything to
do with Mozart's music.  If TLA is the cable version of KTLA, then I seem to
recall that this channel tried to make this movie a Christmas tradition for
Los Angeles.  Don't get stuck on the treacle.
-- 
Stephen W. Smoliar; Institute of Systems Science
National University of Singapore; Heng Mui Keng Terrace
Kent Ridge, SINGAPORE 0511
Internet:  smoliar@iss.nus.sg
Organization: University of Central Florida--Computer Services
Date: Tuesday, 29 Dec 1992 12:17:00 EST
From: Laura Kittleson <LAURA@UCF1VM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Carnival of the Animals

A long time ago, in a town far far away, I used to listen to
a radio station that would occasionally play a recording of
Saint Saens' Carnival of the Animals, in which Noel Coward
read verses written by Ogden Nash, relevant to the work.  I
cannot find this recording in any music store, catalog, in
Penguin or Schwann.  Asking music store employees has not been
at all helpful.  Does anyone know where I could find (for
purchase) a CD recording of this work?  How about the ones
I've heard OF in which Hermione Gingold and Grace Kelly (two
separate recordings) read Nash's verse?

Also, I'd like to find the piano scores for the two-piano-and-
orchestra version of this work.  No luck in any of the places
I've known to look.

Any help would be very much appreciated.

Thanks!

Laura Kittleson
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: paulxxxx@leland.Stanford.EDU (paulastya gupta)
Subject: Beginning a classical collection
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 92 09:14:08 GMT

Hello!  Questions from an ignormaus:

1) How can one "break" into classical music?  My current collection 
includes the grand sum of *2* classical CD's.  My current thoughts 
are to get a book outlining the music of different ages (baroque, 
romantic etc.), and start with the recommendations made as to great 
works by the major composers.

2) Last time I was at the local music store, I compared several CDs 
of Tchaikovsky's 1812 overture, and noticed that the times differed
by as much as 1 minute!  Does this mean that it may be slightly cut
off in the shorter time performance?  This complicates CD buying.

3) Should one look only for DDD recordings as opposed to ADD or AAD?
This further complicates CD purchasing.

4) Should one look for particular condutors/orchestras performing that
piece?  This really complicates CD selection!

***************************************************

Thanks.  As a side note, I was recently listening to The Planets by 
Holst.  Strangely enough, as much as I liked "Mars", I thought the 
remainder of the CD in its entirety was boring.  I am in my early 
20s, and seem to go for involved peices (I also like hard rock and metal).

Any recommendations for my tastes?

- paulxxxx@leland.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu (Bob Kosovsky)
Subject: Re: Requia
Reply-To: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu
Organization: Computer Center, CUNY Graduate School, New York NY 10036
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 20:27:48 GMT

Chris Brewster starts:

>>I didn't study Latin but my wife did.  We agreed that more than one
>>kleenex would be several kleenices, and she informed me that more than
>>one thermos would be several thermores.  I want to get these things
>>right.

Gabe Wiener continues:

>	One sheriff, two sheriffim.

Latin?  That's Hebrew!

Bob Kosovsky
Graduate Center -- Ph.D. Program in Music(student)/ City University of New York
New York Public Library -- Music Division
bitnet:   kos@cunyvms1.bitnet        internet: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu
Disclaimer:  My opinions do not necessarily represent those of my institutions.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 18:20:17 GMT

jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu (John R. Dooley) writes:
: In article <1992Dec22.154152.3333@walter.bellcore.com> broken@venison.bae.bellcore.com (Tony Brokenborough) writes:

[Much tedious Bruckner bashing deleted]
: >|> : Name something that has !!!!!!
: >|> 
: >|> 11 symphonies, 3 Masses, Te Deum, much choral music, String Quintet.
: >|> 
: >
: >I hope that you aren't including his so-called 'romantic' symphony in the
: >above list !!! 
: 
: I can't speak for Deryk, but I suspect the fourth symphony is included.
: It's commonly considered the easiest introduction to Bruckner's
: symphonies, but (of the Bruckner symphonies I've heard) I'd opt for
: #8 as a good intro too.

yes I am including the Romantic, although it's possibly my least
favourite. 
[....]
: Also, I am wondering why Deryk mentions 11 symphonies.  I though 
: Bruckner wrote only nine.  

There are 11: apart from 1-9 there is a number 0 (Die Nullte) which
Bruckner began before the 1st but finished afterwards. It's in D minor
and the suspicion is he thought it too similar to the 3rd. Both
Haitink and Barenboim recorded No.0 as part of their complete cycles.
There is also an earlier symphony in F minor, the so-called 'Schul'
(School or Study) symphony. There are a few recordings of this around
now, the most recent being by Inbal I think.

: A question:  I have versions of #4, #7, #8, #9.  Of these #8 is my
: favorite, and #9 is a very close second.  What's recommended for the
: next Bruckner symphony to explore?   I was considering #5.  I 
: believe there's a Solti-led performance that includes (as a filler)
: the "Te Deum".  Is this a recommended place to delve?

Avoid Solti's Bruckner 5. This may be a remake, but he made the first
digitsal recording of the 5th in the early 80s. In a fit of
pro-digital zeal (long since worn off) I rushed out and bought it.
Dreadful!

For number 5 I suggest you get the new BPO/Barenboim on Teldec: a
great performance. I also highly recommend the Klemperer 6th on
mid-priced EMI.
--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel)
Subject: Re: Hildegard Behrens vocal collapse?
Organization: Visual
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 12:43:52 GMT

I appreciate the indulgence as I passed along the rumors, but mostly
this came from a sense of alarm.  I think Behrens is wonderful, despite
her obvious, often-discussed-in-the-review-press flaws.  I didn't like
hearing that she might have suffered such a terrible setback.  

Regarding my friend's discomfort over the thought of Gwyneth Jones
taking on the Brunnhilde role, Jon Conrad wrote:

>Your friend must be out of touch.

Well, admittedly, his first love is early music, mostly choral.

> I wonder where your friend's been hiding.  :-)

With Gardiner recordings, for the most part...  :-)  But he does occasionally
emerge for a Wagner or Strauss opera.  

By the way, any upcoming MET productions of "Die Frau ohne Schatten" coming
up?  I just discovered this music and I think it's AWESOME.  I hear that the
MET production a while back was one of the best at taking full advantage
of their staging capabilities.   

Rob
From: spacefox@bu.edu (Godfrey Degamo)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Madrigals...
Date: 22 Dec 92 01:57:30 GMT
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5


Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: brucek@Ingres.COM (Bruce Kleinman)
Subject: Re: Saxophone, use of -
Organization: Ingres, an ASK Company, Alameda CA 94501
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:18:24 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.095212.26084@ulci20.unil.ch> jwenger@ulci06.unil.ch () writes:
>Friends and I were chating about music in general, and saxophones in
>particular. No one could mention a piece of classical music, orchestral,
>chamber or other, where one or more sax were used. Can you?
>I'll post the consolidated list of your answers, as soon as I get something
>publishable.
>Thanks in advance, a merry Xmas and happy Newyear to all.
>.

Lovely little sax solo in the middle movement of Rachmaninoff's 
Symphonic Dances.
From: rshapiro@bbn.com (Richard Shapiro)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Single-volume reference books: Concise Grove? (almost a faq)
Followup-To: rec.music.classical
Date: 29 Dec 92 11:53:34
Organization: BBN, Cambridge MA
NNTP-Posting-Host: kariba.bbn.com
In-reply-to: gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu's message of Fri, 25 Dec 1992 06:17:09 GMT

In the faq list, in answer to the question:

   Q7. What are the essential reference books to classical music?

I see that, of course, the complete Grove is mentioned but, somewhat
surprisingly, the single-volume Concise Grove is not. Was the latter
left out intentionally because it's unsatisfactory in some way or was
this just an oversight? I'd like a thorough, up-to-date, affordable,
single-volume general reference and, at first glance, the Concise
Grove looks like the one to get. Should I reconsider?

Send email if you think this is an over-discussed topic. In fact, send
email anyway; I'm not always able to read through all the articles in
r.m.classical. Thanks --

rs/rshapiro@bbn.com



Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Michael J Valinis)
Subject: Re: music of Langlais
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 23:55:47 GMT

In reply to someone's previous posting (sorry I didn't save it), I would 
recommend this album of Langlais' music:

_Jean Langlais_  Hyperion CDA66270

It contains:  Missa Salve Regina
              Rosa Mystica
              La Nativite
              Messe Solennelle
              Hymne d'Actions de Graces (Te Deum)

Performers:   Westminster Cathedral Choir
              English Chamber Orchestra Brass Ensemble
              James O'Donnell, Andrew Lumsden, organs
              David Hill, conductor/organ solo

It was recorded in Westminster Cathedral in July, 1987, & released in 1988

Of related interest, I'd also like to recommend an album of organ music be 
Jehan Alain, performed by Marie-Claire Alain.  I have this on an Erato cassette
recorded in 1972.  I don't know whether or not it was ever released on CD.  The
cassette is Erato MCE 15555.  The album contains:

              Intermezzo (1935)
              Suite pour Orgue (1934-1936)
              Le Jardin Suspendu (1934)
              Litanies (1937)
              Trois Danses (1937-1939)

I think that these two albums give a good, if somewhat superficial, 
introduction to 20th century French organ music.

Michael
-- 
*>   Michael J. Valinis   -=+<*>+=-   mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   <*
*>=>  "Music is your own experience, your thoughts, your wisdom. If you  <=<*
*>+>=> don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." -Charlie Parker <=<+<*
*>=>+>=>+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+<=<+<=<*
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Michael J Valinis)
Subject: Re: buying a trumpet
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 08:43:09 GMT

An upper limit of $3,000.00 will buy a lot of trumpet.  Concerning Bach
trumpets, the Bach Stradevarius is a really nice instrument in the $900.00 to
$1000.00 range... It's been a few years since I priced any, so don't take those
prices as gospel.  It's important that there can be BIG differences even among
various instruments of the same manufacturer and model.  When we bought a Bach
Strad for my daughter several years back, I tried three of them... two were
very good but the third was the easiest blowing trumpet I'd ever tried.  So...
if you can, borrow a trumpet player friend to help you try out the horns you
look at.  Better yet, have the intended recipient try them out himself... that 
way there's a better chance that he will be satisfied...
-- 
*>   Michael J. Valinis   -=+<*>+=-   mvalinis@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   <*
*>=>  "Music is your own experience, your thoughts, your wisdom. If you  <=<*
*>+>=> don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." -Charlie Parker <=<+<*
*>=>+>=>+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+<=<+<=<*
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu (Bob Kosovsky)
Subject: Re: Furtwaengler on Toscanini
Reply-To: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu
Organization: Computer Center, CUNY Graduate School, New York NY 10036
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 16:50:09 GMT

Bravo, Arturo!

Thanks a lot, Chris.  Hope you are well.

Bob Kosovsky
Graduate Center -- Ph.D. Program in Music(student)/ City University of New York
New York Public Library -- Music Division
bitnet:   kos@cunyvms1.bitnet        internet: kos@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu
Disclaimer:  My opinions do not necessarily represent those of my institutions.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: pajerek@telstar.kodak.com (Don Pajerek)
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Reply-To: pajerek@telstar.kodak.com (Don Pajerek)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corp. - Telstar
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 19:52:33 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.154744.3519@walter.bellcore.com> broken@venison.bae.bellcore.com (Tony Brokenborough) writes:

[stuff deleted]

>Oh please shut up !!!!!!
>
>99% of the people on the net HATE's Bruckner's music.


Well, I'm not qualified to challenge this statement. Let me express
my hope that your hatred of Bruckner provides you with many
rewarding moments down through the years.

Just a wish for the season   :-)


Don Pajerek

Standard disclaimers apply.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: bryan@netcom.com (Bryan Higgins)
Subject: Re: Single-volume reference books: Concise Grove? (almost a faq)
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 02:43:48 GMT

will@ogre.cica.indiana.edu (William Sadler) writes:

>In <RSHAPIRO.92Dec29115334@kariba.bbn.com> rshapiro@bbn.com (Richard Shapiro) writes:

>>In the faq list, in answer to the question:

>>   Q7. What are the essential reference books to classical music?

>For a single volume reference I would suggest Willi Apel's Harvard Dictionary
>of Music

I was surprised the faq didn't mention Slonimksky's "Baker's Biographical
Dictionary" which is thorough and delightful.
-- 
Bryan Higgins, Berkeley, California  (bryan@netcom.com)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: syliao@athena.mit.edu (Stan Yi-Huang Liao)
Subject: Fugues for Violin Solo
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 14:18:10 GMT

I am wondering if there are fugues for violin solo other than those in
Bach's Solo Sonatas (BWV 1001, 1003, and 1005), and, if so, what your
opinions about them are.  Thanks.

Stan

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: erwin@helsinki.ks.uiuc.edu (Edgar Erwin)
Subject: Re: Thanks: Bartok P.C. Recommendations
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 18:33:01 GMT

Hamish Reid writes
> A week or so ago I posted an article asking for recommendations on
> what to replace my long lost Bartok Piano Concerto records with.
> Eleven people responded - and I ended up with eleven
> different recommendations. I didn't know there *were* that many 
> Bartok PCs out there... 
>

_American Record Guide_ attacked this question in a recent issue.  You might  
try to find that article.  They made several recommendations which I'm sure I  
can't remember clearly.  I do remember that they praised Aschkenazy's  
performance of the third as their opinion of the best version available. (Solti  
conducting.)  You can only buy this in the complete set of three, but that's  
not such a bad idea really.  The performance of the second is also first rate.

Ed erwin@lisboa.ks.uiuc.edu
From: David.Martland@brunel.ac.uk (David Martland)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Shostakovich symphony recommendations
Date: 21 Dec 92 16:58:43 GMT
Organization: Brunel University, Uxbridge, UK
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

John R. Dooley (jdooley@maemaster.eng.uci.edu) wrote:
: In article <BzJutF.Hvy@mach1.wlu.ca> bili6745@mach1.wlu.ca (bilinsky keith) writes:
: >In article <1992Dec19.202445.18333@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> jefrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Jason E Frank) writes:
: >>
: >> jason requests recommendations for Shostakovich's symphonic works.
: >>
: >
: >Listen to Shostakovich 5, get the 1959 New york, Bernstien if you can,
: >Others will flame it for being inaccurate but its a woderfully exciting
: >work/performence.
: >

: I wouldn't say flame you -- just disagree.  I prefer Bernstein's/NY Phil
: later version (recorded live in Tokyo).  In both versions, he's as good
: as it gets in the first three movements, especially the luscious 
: largo (3rd movement).  But, in the earlier version, his tempo in the
: finale is so fast that I lose track of the music.  This interpretation 
: is indeed daring and worth listening to, but it seems a poor choice 
: for a first listen.  The latter recording is more conventional and 
: still brilliant.  (Also it's available at mid-price with the 1st cello
: concerto performed by Ormandy/Ma/Philadelphia.)  And, for another 
: great interpretation of the 5th, try the Rodshensky/USSR Ministry 
: of Culture Orchestra on Melodya.  They're interpretation of the 
: 3rd movement is possibly more gorgeous than Bernstein's!  

: John D.

I always liked the old Andre Previn version recorded a long while ago with the LSO -
can't remember which company is currently carrying it - is it RCA or Decca/London?

I also think that there was a version by Mravinsky (probably with the Leningrad PD)
which was absolutely stunning - has it been reissued  on CD?

Dave Martland, Brunel University, UK
-- 
                       David Martland
                  Dept. of Computer Science
                      Brunel University
                       United Kingdom

                  David.Martland@brunel.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical