HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cbrunson@vermont.East.Sun.COM (Chuck Brunson - Sun BOS Corporate Software Engineering)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Ultimate in Colorado Springs
Date: 27 Jul 1992 19:39:16 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: cbrunson@vermont.East.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: vermont.east.sun.com

I'll be in Colorado Springs for awhile and would like to play with
an area team if possible. I've already called 1-800 UPA-GETH and
gotten the contacts that they have listed (only one and the number was
disconnected).
I'd appreciate any info you can give me and my number and email address
are listed below if you just want to give it to someone and have them
contact me. TIA


---
UPA Masters Team: Red Menace			Chuckie B.
1991 Nationals Masters Champions		Sun Microsystems BOS
BACUL Team: 	  RADial ACTive			chuck.brunson@East.Sun.COM
Boston Area Corporate Ultimate League		Work Phn. (508)671-0527
 You're NEVER too old to play!

Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: hausmann@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: PDGA Worlds Invitation
Date: 21 Jul 92 08:12:08 -0500
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

I just got my invitation to the PDGA worlds (second mailing??) and it is simply
a photocopied page folded in half, stapled, and stamped...

Not much to look at--even looks boring enough to throw out without thinking.  I
was warned that this would be the case by the Masters in our town who already
received their invites a couple weeks back.

What concerns me is that the River Bends Tournament Disc Club is working so
hard to present a professional image to sponsors, but when it comes to the
players who play on the road all year to qualify for this tournament...they
send this little rag.

Granted, the expense of send course maps, city information, etc. with every
invite is expesive, but geez, how about a little something to hand on the wall
in case we can't attend?

Just a thought...

-Tom

Tom Hausmann // hausmann@iscsvax.uni.edu //  (319) 273-2119 // 319-273-2546 fax
Dept. of Math & CS // University of Northern Iowa // Cedar Falls, IA 50614-0506
Readers Digest Condensed Books would release Alvin Toffler's works as pamphlets.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: jal41820@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Smiley)
Subject: Re: pickup games
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:50:27 GMT

tedk@jpl.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Ted Ko) writes:
:)I'd definitely make use of an e-mail service like that.  Maybe the latest cop
:)of the official rules should also be available.

Well, if anyone wants to submit anything for it, like pickup lists, rules,
whatever, go ahead and mail them. Don't worry about loading my mailbox; I've
got that taken care of...  :)

I'll let the group know when I've got stuff available...

-- 
        Josh Laff              #     #      
email to: smiley@uiuc.edu     _       _     Hello! I am a signature virus!  
      (217) 356-6079         |#\_____/#|    Join the fun and copy mo*#(*&^!>.
                              \#######/     
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: tedk@jpl.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Ted Ko)
Subject: Re: pickup games
Organization: Bellcore
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 19:50:34 GMT

I'd definitely make use of an e-mail service like that.  Maybe the latest copy
of the official rules should also be available.

-- 
<--The-Dark-Elf-<<<
(tedk@ctt.bellcore.com)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: mcnay@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (Gene H. McNay)
Subject: Giving out phone numbers
Organization: Schlumberger CAD/CAM at Ann Arbor, MI
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 15:01:16 GMT

I would suggest that the UPA give out phone numbers only to
individuals who are registered UPA members. No further information
should be given out. If the person is new, then they should be asked
to join the UPA, that is send them a form and info. Then once they
are registered, they can have access to a local phone number.

Ultimate seems like such a friendly sport,
I certainly don't mind the odd phone call from players moving
from annother area, I'm ever so happy to help someone get their 
fix in Ann Arbor. I hope paranoia does not keep someone from
feeling their plastic in a new or temporary location.
-- 
     /^\ + "Make things as simple as possible, but no simpler."      +
    /___\ +                   -  A. Einstein                         +
   //zzz\\ + Gene McNay: University of Michigan Aerospace Structures +
  //  z  \\ +  email:      yancm@caen.engin.umich.edu                +
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: fontes@astro.psu.edu (Chris Fontes)
Subject: Re: Albuquerque Cuervo Quali
Organization: Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics, Penn State University
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:51:03 GMT

Ahhhh, Eric's explanation  of the Satori lineup explains why I didn't
see some familiar faces, and why they were beaten so badly.
Chris Fontes -- Los Alamos Ultimate
From: Eric.Simon@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Eric Simon)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Ultimate in Colorado Spr
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 09:33:00 -0500

CB-SB>I'll be in Colorado Springs for awhile and would like to play with
CB-SB>an area team if possible. I've already called 1-800 UPA-GETH and
CB-SB>gotten the contacts that they have listed (only one and the number was
CB-SB>disconnected).
CB-SB>I'd appreciate any info you can give me and my number and email address
CB-SB>are listed below if you just want to give it to someone and have them
CB-SB>contact me. TIA

Well, our first hypothetical in action, I'd say.  I see 13 people on the
UPA list that live in Ft. Collins.  Many on this net say I shouldn't
pass them on to you due to privacy.

Well gang, what do y'all think?  Chuck's a responsible person, been
playing for years, and I've even played against him in Nationals
(Masters '91).

Is Chuck out of luck?


 * SLMR 2.1a * If this were an actual tagline, it would be funny.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: oldenbur@mdd.comm.mot.com (Steven Oldenbur)
Subject: Re: One handed catches
Organization: Motorola - Mobile Data Division; Richmond, BC
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 20:51:55 GMT

In article <3746@sapwdf.UUCP> Bill Wohler <wohler@sap-ag.de> writes:
>In article <1992Jul27.094619.3107@desire.wright.edu> antioch@desire.wright.edu writes:
>>
>>Also, just because people I've gotten different answers: Is it best to grab a
>>hammer with just one hand?	MattKelly@antioc.antioch.edu
>> 
>
>  guts: one hand
>  ultimate: two hands
>
>Bill Wohler <wohler@sap-ag.de> <sapwdf!wohler>
>Heidelberg Red Barons Ultimate Frisbee Team

Hammers in guts?  I haven't see many of those.  Maybe you are thinking of 
thumbers? 

Is guts making a comeback?  There is a fair bit of interest locally and we
managed enough to put on a demo at a local festival.  The crowd definately
liked the game.  

Are there any cities that have a league?  When I was in Oslo playing guts
for the first time against the Americans (bad, bad, place to get introduced
to the game) one of the guys said that there used to be a 40 team league 
in Texas.  One team would play the game with a beer inbetween their legs because
if you couldn't guard your beer what kind of a guts player were you anyway?  

I love the game and when I develop my pot belly a little further I think 
I'm going to take it up as a transition game between Ultimate and golf :-)

Steve Oldenburg - Vancouver Vertigogh Ultimate
From: guin@mars.senecac.on.ca
Approved: news@is.morgan.com
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 19:56:43 GMT
Munged: news-gateway (is.morgan.com: $Revision: 1.8 $)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Organization: Morgan Stanley & Company, Inc.
Distribution: world
Subject: Something to do in August in the Northeast

Hopefully this will make it onto the bulletin board ...

Noticing a particular drought in ultimate tournaments in the Northeast. 
(With the exception of the Nationals near the beginning of the month for 
the more serious Canucks) ... 

Tentative plans are being made to have a "Hat Tournament"
(Everyone's name goes into a hat and teams are made up on the day of the 
tourney -  it is co-ed, a great way to meet new people, and usually 
results in some of the best spirited games you will play in a long time)
in Toronto around ... hmmm ... how about August 22nd Weekend?

Keep this time slot open - anyone and everyone is welcome - advanced to 
beginner - male or female

Individuals from the U.S. are particularly welcome.  Don't worry if you 
haven't got a team -- nobody does until it starts.

Anyways ... Confirmation of details & dates will follow

	- Ran Guin	Toronto Canada \
			(416) 234-9548
			email: guin@senecac.ca

 'A disc is a ball whose shape has lost a redundant dimension
  but whose motion is determined by two completely new ones'

From: Nelson.F..Steele@p807.f70.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Nelson F. Steele)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: DBMS key
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 16:52:51 -0500

On 7/29/92 Daniel C. Ziskin said to All: 

   DC>p.s. DON'T FORGET
  DC> THAT THIS WEEKEND IS THE ULTIMATE MARATHON AT GALLAUDET UNIV.

Unfortunately our monday night league was rained out this week, so no message
could get out to people.  I hope to see Barry tonight and will bring it up if I
do.  Perhaps you've already spoken to him?
From: dks@Apple.COM (dk smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: unique identifiers
Date: 23 Jul 92 17:07:26 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

In article <1992Jul23.125823.18445@schaefer.math.wisc.edu> mueller@schaefer.UUCP (Carl Mueller) writes:
>OK, I'm not a member of the UPA, and maybe I've missed something, but there's
>clearly a problem with using SSN's as ID numbers.  What I don't understand is
>what exactly is wrong with 0000001 0000002 0000003 0000004 ...?
>
>Just my two cents.
>Carl Mueller (mueller@math.wisc.edu)

Figures, doesn't... a math major.
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
dks@apple.com           |   Play   |              \ These opinions are mine /
Office: 408 974-1275    |   More   |               \  and are not endorsed /
AppleLink: ULTIMATE     |   Disc   |                \  by Apple Computer. /
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: snyder@voodoo.utcc.utk.edu (kim snyder)
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Question
Organization: University of Tennessee Computing Center
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 17:05:29 GMT

>I wanted to know whether I will be able to find Ultimate leagues in any of
>the following:
>
>	1. Huntsville, AL
>	2. Charlottesville, VA
>	3. RTP-area, NC

Huntsville, AL  -- Men yes, women no - closest women is Birmingham
Charlotesville, VA  --i *think* there's a mens team (UVA) but no womens team.
RTP -- yes! yes!  Ring of Fire (men) and Grits (women)

kim

----------------------------------------
Well begun is half done.  - Mary Poppins
From: ziskin@climate.gsfc.nasa.gov (Daniel C. Ziskin)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: DBMS key
Keywords: computers
Date: 29 Jul 92 14:47:17 GMT
Organization: Climate and Radiation Branch

In article <daemon.92Jul29040259@is.morgan.com>, Frank Revi <71551.2461@CompuServe.COM> writes:

|> With these in mind, any others you might suggest, what would make a good
|> key?  What about something  a little more algorithmic?
|> 

Is there a problem with just automatically changing the first digit of the 
SSN to 8 whether the UPA member cares to do so herself or not?
Does this offer enough security?  If not, could the first series of
three numbers be replaced by some sequence like 872-??-???? (UPA-*)?
Another approach could be some simple encryption.  I don't think
it has to be uncrackable.  Perhaps when the SSN are entered into the
UPA database, the first and last digits are exchanged, or something like that.

Moving onto another computer issue...
I think the pick-up schedule database is an excellent idea.  Before 
too much time and effort is invested I would like to make two suggestions:
1) If possible, make it in some type of spread sheet format, so
searches are easy and the information is presented uniformly.
2) Include a 'confirmation date' column so that people have an idea
how reliable the information is.  

                    -'tastes great with tobasco sauce and lemon',
                             Oyster

p.s. DON'T FORGET THAT THIS WEEKEND IS THE ULTIMATE MARATHON AT
     GALLAUDET UNIV. 


-- 
Daniel "OYSTER"  Ziskin             | 'Now you stand there expecting me to
(w)  301-286-9136  (h) 301-422-8619 |  remember something you forgot to say...'
ziskin@climate.gsfc.nasa.gov        |     -- Dylan
From: fulton@copper.ucs.indiana.edu (Ben Fulton)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: Tips on catching
Date: 29 Jul 92 16:10:44 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

In <daemon.92Jul29040247@is.morgan.com> Frank Revi <71551.2461@CompuServe.COM> writes:

>When stakes are really high, stand up straight, catch the hammer one-handed
>(top edge), while placing the other hand on your hip.  This is GOOD FORM, for
>catching the disc is like sipping a glass of fine champagne.  *How very
>elegant* is an appropriate remark when someone executes such a catch.

'Round these parts, we insist that one must stand on one leg, the other 
bent at the knee, toe pointed gracefully, in order to earn full style points.
Is Cower a local phenomenon, or is it played nationally?

ben
fulton@copper.ucs.indiana.edu
lemon curry?
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: jal41820@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Smiley)
Subject: Re: SOTG / Travelling
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 15:16:44 GMT

stegerc@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Carsten Steger) writes:
:)Imagine the following: A player catches the disc with nobody within 10
:)meters around him. He then throws off a long huck downfield. In the
:)act of doing so he drags his pivot foot maybe 20 centimeters or so.
:)Someone who is 20 meters away from the throwing player calls
:)'travelling'.
:)In my opinion it is against the spirit of the game to call a travel

Since you want opinions...   :)

I'd have to agree with you. It's basically trying to cover for getting
caught by stopping the action. I mean, the person who's calling it has
every right to do so, but I think everyone on the opposing team would
simulatneously think "what a jerk" if he did.

-- 
        Josh Laff              #     #      
email to: smiley@uiuc.edu     _       _     Hello! I am a signature virus!  
      (217) 356-6079         |#\_____/#|    Join the fun and copy mo*#(*&^!>.
                              \#######/     
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: stegerc@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Carsten Steger)
Subject: Need addresses of Ultimate Teams in Australia
Organization: Technische Universitaet Muenchen, Germany
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 11:12:00 GMT


Hi!

I am planning to go to Australia in Sep./Oct. Could someone out there
please inform me about teams / pickup-games esp. in NSW and Qld.

Thanks

Carsten

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carsten Steger, Mir San Mir Ultimate Team Muenchen
Kleiststr.2, 8057 Eching, Germany, Ph.: +49 89 319 43 07
EMail: carsten.steger@informatik.tu-muenchen.de
From: nolan@pi3.lbl.gov (david nolan)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: 10 vs Stall
Date: 29 Jul 92 19:35:11 GMT
Reply-To: nolan@pi3.lbl.gov (david nolan)
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.140.149

In article <1992Jul28.170328.14378@sco.com> kevinpo@sco.COM (Kevin Pondy) writes:
>
>What is the big deal with saying "Stall" versus saying "Ten".
>I understand that by saying "Stall" people could think that the
>thrower was stalled and stop playing.  However, in reality, I
>don't see this happening.  It is like a pick call, you should
>never stop going to the disc.  
>What I don't like is that people actually say that they weren't
>stalled because the marker said "Stall" instead of "Ten".  A word
>is a word and by the spirit of the game they were rightfully stalled.
.....
>Spirit Rules,
>++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
>Kevin Pondy  kevinpo@sco.com   Palo Alto Spin Doctors
>  "Spins on Me" - Spin Doctors
>++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

The big deal is that many people use the word "stall" to create the one
second interval required BETWEEN counts, as in "stall one, stall two..."
If these people call "nine STALL!" then they've only counted
9 1/2 seconds.  A turnover occurs only after ten seconds, as in 
"stall ten."  On the other hand, some of us just wait one second between
counts.  If we say "stall" instead of "ten," it appears as if we had 
just switched to the previous system.  Either way, saying "ten" one whole
second after saying "nine," whether you say "stall" in between them or not
is consistent.  Being consistent is a way to prevent people from thinking
you are cheating or rushing.

Dave Nolan
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: pbrown@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: PULLS!  How in the hell....?
Organization: Nokia Telecommunications.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 16:40:39 GMT

Ok, I don't know how easy this is gonna be to do in words, but I'm
willing to try and understand, if you're willing to try and explain...

What I'd like to know is this:

*HOW* does one learn to throw pulls?  (Note:  I've gathered that "pull"
is the right term for the "throw-offs" after each point?)

I've tried to watch a few videos closely to see what those guys are
doing, and tried to imitate their movements, but I'm not getting anything
out of it.  Any hints?

,sknahT

luaP 

-- 
/************************************************************************/
/* Paul V. Brown                 *   "I kid thee not"                   */
/* pbrown@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi   *        -Nicolas Cage                 */
/*                               *            "Peggy Sue Got Married"   */
/************************************************************************/
From: garry@alice.att.com (garry hodgson)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
Subject: Re: One handed catches
Summary: good training
Date: 29 Jul 92 16:00:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.23351
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill NJ

In article <4871@tuegate.tue.nl>, peter@blade (Peter Korsten) writes:
> nolan@pi3.lbl.gov (david nolan) writes:


> No, seriously. You're right about this, though during training I catch
> about any disc single handed. During games, however, I (and every else
> in my team) am told to catch double handed, because it's much safer.

Here, too.  Another thing I like to do in practice:

I try to always catch with my weaker hand ( I'm right handed,
so I use my left ) when we're just throwing around.  You need to do it
enough that it becomes second nature.  This makes a big
difference in games, where it is much easier to rescue bad throws
that go behind you when you're cutting.  When I started doing this
I was amazed at the number of catches I was making that I might 
previously have missed by reaching across my body with the wrong hand.
It's often the case that you can snag one thrown behind by slowing down
slightly and reaching back.


Garry Hodgson

No Passing Zone		(real season)
Grey Matter		(summer league)

-- 
Garry Hodgson			A slow winter day
AT&T Bell Labs			A night like forever
garry@alice.att.com		Sink like a stone
att!alice!garry			Float like a feather
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: taernst@dial.Princeton.EDU (Ted Ernst)
Subject: Re: 10 vs Stall
Originator: news@ernie.Princeton.EDU
Organization: Clockwork Orange Ultimate 
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 22:07:01 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.170328.14378@sco.com> kevinpo@sco.COM (Kevin Pondy) writes:
>
>What is the big deal with saying "Stall" versus saying "Ten".
>I understand that by saying "Stall" people could think that the
>thrower was stalled and stop playing.  However, in reality, I
>don't see this happening.  It is like a pick call, you should
>never stop going to the disc.  
>What I don't like is that people actually say that they weren't
>stalled because the marker said "Stall" instead of "Ten".  A word
>is a word and by the spirit of the game they were rightfully stalled.
>But it seems that there are a lot of lawyers out there that want
>to get their clients off on a technicality; "The rules say you must
>say TEN, not STALL, therefore you didn't stall me."  Bogus and anti-
>spirit.  
>It is similar to when the stall was changed to "stalling zero".  
>People have "stalling one" burned into their brain for years
>and it is hard to change.
>I would like to see the rule modified so that these lawyer types
>can't take away a near-perfectly good stall.
>
>Spirit Rules,
>++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
>Kevin Pondy  kevinpo@sco.com   Palo Alto Spin Doctors
>  "Spins on Me" - Spin Doctors
>++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-


You don't know if it's a stall until after you say "ten."  The way I
look at it if I say "ten" in a calm voice (without getting too excited
yet) I have a much better chance of seeing whether the disc is still in
the thrower's hand or not.  If it is I can then say "STALL."  The
thrower is also much more likely to agree if s/he hears "ten" in a
normal voice that it was indeed a stall.  Almost everyone I know gets
defensive when "STALL" is yelled at them.  I play because I love the
game.  I love a good stall.  I don't need to get excited, though until
I'm sure.

Peace.

ted
clockwork orange

Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc
From: kevinpo@sco.COM (Kevin Pondy)
Subject: Re: 10 vs Stall
Organization: The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 00:10:27 GMT


nolan@pi3.lbl.gov (david nolan) writes:

>In article <1992Jul28.170328.14378@sco.com> kevinpo@sco.COM (Kevin Pondy) writes:
>>
>>What is the big deal with saying "Stall" versus saying "Ten".
>>I understand that by saying "Stall" people could think that the
>>thrower was stalled and stop playing.  However, in reality, I
>>don't see this happening.  It is like a pick call, you should
>>never stop going to the disc.  
>>What I don't like is that people actually say that they weren't
>>stalled because the marker said "Stall" instead of "Ten".  A word
>>is a word and by the spirit of the game they were rightfully stalled.
>.....
>>Spirit Rules,
>>++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
>>Kevin Pondy  kevinpo@sco.com   Palo Alto Spin Doctors
>>  "Spins on Me" - Spin Doctors
>>++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

>The big deal is that many people use the word "stall" to create the one
>second interval required BETWEEN counts, as in "stall one, stall two..."
>If these people call "nine STALL!" then they've only counted
>9 1/2 seconds.  A turnover occurs only after ten seconds, as in 
>"stall ten."  On the other hand, some of us just wait one second between
>counts.  If we say "stall" instead of "ten," it appears as if we had 
>just switched to the previous system.  Either way, saying "ten" one whole
>second after saying "nine," whether you say "stall" in between them or not
>is consistent.  Being consistent is a way to prevent people from thinking
>you are cheating or rushing.

>Dave Nolan


OK.  Two people have told me that the big deal is that there are people
out there who use the word "stall" between each number.  I was not 
aware of this and I can now understand the reasons.  
But this does bring up another question which is 

How many people actually use the word "Stall" between numbers.  I have
played all over the Central Region, Parts of the South and East, and
now play in the West.  And for all the tournaments I have played in and
people I have heard stall, I really cannot remember any that have
counted "stall one stall two stall three stall four..." 
I don't have the best of memories, so I could be unobservant, but
but I have checked with several other people and they have never heard
anyone use stall between there numbers.  So where do this mystery
players play.
Which brings me back to the fact that for 99.99% of the players out there
"stall" and "ten" should both be a stalled disc.
++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Kevin Pondy  kevinpo@sco.com   Palo Alto Spin Doctors
  "Spins on Me" - Spin Doctors
++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Newsgroups: rec.sport.disc