From: bkannan@ha06.eng.ua.edu (Balaji Kannan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil
Subject: Re:Linguistic barrier ?
Date: 28 Jul 1992 23:50:50 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu


espdm@warwick.ac.uk (RANGANATHA RAO GURURAJ) writes:


                [some stuff deleted]

>They might adept at japanesing words. But the question remains...
>Why do they do it..? Does that not highlight the need for maintaining
                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>science education and research in local language ?
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


    Certainly. I have never opposed education in the vernacular
    tongue; be it Science or Liberal arts. The biggest fallout
    of vernacular education would be the larger populace that
    it can reach out to. This will not only go a long way in
    eradicating illiteracy, but help in cultivating the much
    needed Scientific temper among the people. In the case of
    Tamil Nadu, where mysticism, mumbo-jumbo etc. are rampant
    this should be a major first. Scientific and Technological
    Research would be helped in the long run.

    Seriously though, the effect of "Science in the Native tongue"
    is being overestimated. Meaning, I don't see any quantum leap
    in the quality of Scientific and Technological Research merely
    because of a switchover. This is where,I think, one is unfairly 
    attributing the Technological/Economic success of nations to
    vernacular education. It ain't that simple.

    BTW, the reason I pointed out the Japanese example to you was 
    because of the opening statement in your earlier post- "Japanese
    has Science in it." 
    

>I think u are trying to trace the roots of language in use today. Kanban
         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>and Poka -yoke have been copied for their concepts and the words have


    Trace the roots & you'll know if languages had science in them :-)


>just migrated from Mfg Pundits. Definitely one should have heard
                                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>of fool-proofing and Pull -systems in the mfg side in place of these
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Japanese words.....
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


    Oh sure!! JIT [Just in Time] is another one of those English equivalents-
    a revolutionary Japanese concept that discards mass-production pioneered
    by Ford. It appears that the Japanese words are the ones in vogue though.


>My question is slightly different. Forget which language is dominating..
>Do we require a language that can reach everyone in the country at all
>stages of education to be effective?


    This touches at the core of the language problem. Do we need a common
    language? Science education or not. As I said earlier, a National
    language is something that has to/will evolve if need be so - whenever
    that be so :-). But when you try to impose an alien tongue on a population
    that doesn't see a need for one, other than this nation-building
    theory used by its proponents, you see a hysterical reaction to stall
    even some of the not-so-dirty measures of the Central Government.
    Linguistic homogenizing has this real danger of backfiring.
 
    You are talking of education from the point of view of the Central
    Govt. But the State has an equally[larger] imporatant role to play. 
    Thus each state will try to promote [rightly] its own language as a
    MOI. Apart from winning votes, this also seems sensible to me. In right
    earnest, Research institutes should also be set up with local tongue 
    as the medium. But English should be made a core course in all these
    Institutes of higher learning in the States and that alone can serve
    as a link language.[I see merit in such a move.] 

    The Central Govt though should continue to promote English as a medium 
    of Instruction [for the benefit of those that work for the C.Govt.]
    in the Science/Research Institutes funded entirely by the Centre.


>It is not the question of Hindi, in particular being made the common
>language. It is having a common language for the country.. Do u have
>any other language in mind which can do the job better, incidentally
>considering the population and the variety of languages
>across the country ?

     I don't have any other language in mind nor do I see any reason for 
     have a National Language. Touchy issue, you see. Language is like
     religion to Tamizhs [Well, don't accuse me of lipservice :-). Kinda
     like  "Mother of all Dravidian Languages".]  So there is a fierce
     and passionate zeal to preserve the language against "alien" invasion.
     There is a continuing fear of cultural/linguistic imperialism from
     within.

     English, I guess, can serve as a link language between different states
     of the Union. But the situation now is getting a little ticklish. The
     North Indian politicians (BJP particularly) see English as a vestige of 
     Colonialism and would like to see its back soon. But down South, English
     is seen as the lesser of two evils [the British having already been booted
     out] and Tamizhs particularly would prefer English-pervasiveness to Hindi,
     for politically English has been defanged. 
   
     Like it or not, English is here to stay. Oh Yes, even the ranks of the 
     Hindi-buffs in Tamil Nadu are swelling. Who knows....... ??
   
     About acceptance of Hindi in other states, I cannot say much. But it
     appears that people in the other Southern states are more favourably
     disposed towards Hindi than the Tamizhs.
  
>At this stage, do you mean that English should continue as the
>common link or not ? It is not very clear....

      Oh Yeah!! I would love that despite all the paranoia about this
      Mommy-Daddy Syndrome. [An aside: Strangely, most of these Mommy-Daddy 
      language-sheriffs wouldn't mind living in the land of Mommies and
      Daddies, lusting after the Mommy-Daddy Culture while lecturing the
      rest about the evil-effects of the same. Talking thru both sides of
      the mouth!!!. 

      A Metaside: Equally funny is the way some of these language Sheriffs
      lament about Sanskritic influence and its dialectical derivatives. One
      person even calls this a fad. Huh Huh!! Maybe Tamizhs will be charged
      a fine for syaing "ammaa, appaa" [not even Sanskritic] instead of "thaai
      thandhai" in the future or better still resort to that brilliant
      method of [penalizing] a bozo in Kerala. High time we had an 
      Academe DeSanskritize a la Academe Francaise.
 
      Paranoid Prescriptivists!! Chee Chee!!!]

>The points that need to be clarified are :

>1. Considering the impact of English on science and vice verza,
>does fostering English education sound right ?

> My opinion:


           Yes, as a core course at State Level
                           &
           as a MOI itself by the Centre.

                                      MOI = medium of instruction

>2. If yes, then what purpose do local languages serve, just poetry
                                                        ^^^^^^^^^^^
>and jokes...?
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^

      Also. But even if it were just poetry, jokes and stageplay
      that would be fine. Whether people use language to chant mantras
      [invoking the Spirits] or to churn out villupattus or to write
      E = M C**2 depends on what they want, like and delight in. It 
      It would be good though if  Science/Math got into the picture.
      For a change.

>Mikka Nandri
>R Gururaj
>_______________________________________________________________
>"Tamizhukku Eedu inai Yedhum illai"
>---------------------------------------------------------------
     
      Well, if I continue any further now, I'd be accused of being an 
      armchair-reformer by PbBr :-)  So let me stop.

  Anbudan,
  Balaji Kannan



Newsgroups: soc.culture.tamil