From: cramer@optilink.COM (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,sci.med
Subject: Re: Statement of President Clinton on Health Care Reform Task Force
Date: 28 Jan 93 18:10:47 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA

In article <1993Jan26.231247.9812@odin.corp.sgi.com>, zursch@whizkid.wpd.sgi.com (Jeffrey B. Zurschmeide) writes:
> In article <C1H6AK.2In@umassd.edu> pmsc13sg@UMASSD.EDU writes:
> >Yeah, that's right. The government should steal money from those who 
> >have it and give it to those who don't...
> 
> Spoken like a true University student. The only sad thing is that 
> University students are supposed to be idealistic and humanitarian,
> while you are merely grumbling over the thought that some of 
> daddy's money might have to go to taxes rather than to buy you
> some more CDs and a nicer car. 

Why do you assume that the costs of Clinocchio's plan will be borne
by the rich?  Most likely, it will be borne by the only major source
of taxable wealth -- the middle class.  (Not to mention that more of
Clinocchio's "advisers" are millionaires than Reagan or Bush.)

> The for-profit health care system
> in this country is manifestly broken. The insurance companies 

Actually, a big chunk of it isn't "for-profit."  Blue Cross/Blue
Shield, for example.  MOST hospitals, for another.  Of course,
the major funder of health care is this country is the U.S.
Government, through Medicare/Medicaid/Medical (in California),
and the Veterans Administration.

> providing "health care coverage" are little better than your average
> coke dealer. I've been steadily employed since leaving college and 
> I've never had more than the most minor occasions to use my
> benefits. (The odd wound requiring sutures or a trip to get my 
> prescription for my contact lenses updated.) And even though I
> belong to one of the better "self-funded" plans, I have yet to ever
> have the insurance company pay a claim without sending me 
> some kind of nasty note disputing the nature of the claim or
> my coverage under some small print. It's ludicrous.  

I've been steadily employed since I financial difficulties caused
me to drop out of college.  My family and I have made major use of
the medical care system, including two child births, and a few trips
to emergency rooms (par for the course with children).  We've had
almost no insurance problems at all, other than too much paperwork.

> I took EMT training a short while ago, and the guy who taught
> it was an ex-paramedic. He told us that he tries to get everyone
> he teaches or knows to get a medic-alert bracelet with their 
> insurance information on it, because without it, you simply will
> not get treated until someone plunks down a card for you. He said
> that this is especially important for non-white people, who routinely
> die in the ER for lack of care because they don't assume that you
> can pay or have insurance.

You mean, the law that requires emergency room treatment of any
life-threatening problem is simply not being obeyed?  I've seen
reporting of isolated incidents where this has happened, sometimes
because the life-threatening nature of the problem wasn't immediately
clear.

> The point is, you will pay for it one way or another. You can either

The problem is that Canada is a reminder that you may not pay for
it, and you may not get it, either.  Part of why Canada spends
less on medical care is that they get less of it.  Why did the
Quebec Premier come to the U.S. for treatment?  Why do wealthy 
Canadians cross the border for non-emergency treatment?  Why
are children dying of minor heart defects in Canada, that here
would get treated?

You are also assuming that the same bunch that can't buy a hammer
for less than $500, that delivers our mail, and operates a welfare
system that makes insurance companies look efficient, is somehow
going to do a better job on health care.  Why am I skeptical?

> Am I the only one who gets bored stiff listening to Libertarian 
> drivel all the time?  You'd think that we were living under maoism
> in this country the way these bozos whine about everything...Bill

You would think we were living in a free market with heartless
robber barons, the way the left keeps talking.

> Clinton starts talking about basic health coverage and they start
> going on like he's gonna come by and steal the food right outta
> their children's mouths. Get a grip and grow up, people.
> 
> JZ

Yes.  It's happened before.


-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
"When freedom destroys order, order will destroy freedom." -- Eric Hoffer
Not a goal, just a statement of reality.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.activism,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh