HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jeffp@netcom.com (Jeff)
Subject: A letter to Clinton/Gore
Organization: BeHereNow
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 07:45:28 GMT


Below is a letter I have written to President elect, and Vice President
Clinton/Gore regarding UFO secrecy. I would appreciate any constructive
comments...
Anybody figure out how to reach H. Winkler yet?
Jeff-



Clinton Gore Transition Team 
75300.3115@compuserve.com

Jeffrey M. Papineau 
jeffp@netcom.com

Nov. 16, 1992

Dear Mr. Clinton and Mr. Gore,

This is not a letter of congratulations on your win of the
presidency, but I do congratulate you, and  wish you great success
in the years to come.

The reason I am writing to you is to inform you that as a regular
member of UFO discussion groups on USENET and other electronic
media, there is growing awareness that the US government has
systematically hidden the truth of regular UFO radar sightings at
military installations, UFO crashes and recoveries, and possibly
even extraterrestrial (ET) visitation, communication, and
agreements made with races from beyond our planet.

I will not define or argue these charges, since they are well
documented in books such as Timothy Good's "Above Top Secret",
Michael Lindemann's "UFO's; Six Viewpoints" and William Hamilton's
"Cosmic Top Secret" as well as dozens of other literary works of a
similar nature.

What I do call for you to do during your administration is wipe
clean the veil of UFO secrecy that has existed in this country
since 1945, and declassify all information relating to UFO
sightings, ET visitation and contact, and any communication or
agreements made with such beings.

The American people have a right to know the truth regarding their
place in the galaxy; and the government, being "of, for, and by the
people" has an obligation to US citizens to make the truth known,
and stop hiding it behind the false curtain called "National
Security".

If you truly believe that the American people deserve an honest
government, then the "Secret Government", the lie that UFO's do not
exist, the truth about US government involvement in drug dealing,
money laundering, black projects intended for defense against alien
races or space/world domination; all must be brought out into the
open and laid bare before the people, so that we can take our
country back from the CIA, the NSA, and the other agencies that
would usurp our constitutional rights.

I was very glad to hear of your recent meetings with Mr. Bill
Moyers, and I do believe this is a great statement on your part
that you intend to help the american people and create and honest
government. I call upon you to rid us of the Secret Government, to
tear-down the wall of deciet that has separated the people from the
truth for so many decades, and make the US a truly
democratic society, and the world, a better place to live.

We will be watching, waiting, and hoping, that you will live up to
the greatness that is within you, and protect liberty and
happiness for us all.

Jeffrey M. Papineau
From: jmv@grip.cis.upenn.edu (Jean-Marc Vezien)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Mind Control of UFOs
Date: 20 Nov 92 16:56:37 GMT
Organization: GRASP Lab

In article <69882@cup.portal.com>, John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
> Yey Sir: You people listen to this man Joseph. He's telling the truth. 
> So help me Bibo.
> John Winston.



Bibo ? I thought it was Kibo the Bobbit.

BTW, anybody seen the simpsons yesterday ?
They told the truth about BigFoot ;)



JM.
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: mccreary@sword.eng.hou.compaq.com (Ed McCreary)
Subject: Re: The Phobos II Incident
Organization: Compaq Computer Corp.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 20:26:17 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.195743.10689@ryn.mro4.dec.com> randolph@est.enet.dec.com (Tom Randolph) writes:
>
>Oh, please. Been reading Hoagland, eh? Gawd, it just grows and grows. Last I
>saw, he and someone else had formulated a unified field theory from the two
>Viking photos of the Cydonia region. There seems to be no limit on the amount
>of new scientific breakthroughs we can get out of those two grainy photos.

Ha!  And the Face is responsible for the crop-circles in England too.
(Hoagland actually claims there are connected.  He found a few angles
that seem to match.  Of course, you just have to keep looking until
you find a pair you like...)
>
>How many pictures: thousands. How many released: all of them. They're available
>on CD ROMs. Get them and look for yourself. But of course, this must be another
>government lie...
>

Just to clarify, not all are available on CDROM, only a selection.  I haven't
gone through all of them yet, I've only had them a couple of weeks, but I'm
almost certain that the two Cydonia pictures aren't on the disks.  The
two face pictures, 35a72 and 70a13, are from the early phase of the
mission.  The disks contain images from the later phases.  

All of the images are stored on tape at the National Space Science Data
Center (NSSDC).  I'm not sure how to go about get access to them, but
it is possible.


--
====
Ed McCreary                                               ,__o
mccreary@sword.eng.hou.compaq.com                       _-\_<,
"If it were not for laughter, there would be no Tao."  (*)/'(*)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: randolph@est.enet.dec.com (Tom Randolph)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Phobos II Incident
Date: 18 Nov 92 22:48:12 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <davidj.722042573@wrs.com>, davidj@wrs.com (David Jones) writes...
>Bzzzt!  Wrong.  There seems to be ample information to conclude that, indeed,
>not  only are there ancient ET cities on Mars, but underground cities as well
>and, according to a U.S Army General (retired), that I was with, he said that
>there  is  clear  evidence  of mechanical devices on the surface of Mars, and
>that they are moving.  Tell me, how many pictures did Viking take?  How  many
>have  been  released  to the the public (we paid for them didn't we?). Again,
>the real issue is a government that lies to it's people.  If they would  only
>tell the Truth...
>  David W. Jones

Oh, please. Been reading Hoagland, eh? Gawd, it just grows and grows. Last I
saw, he and someone else had formulated a unified field theory from the two
Viking photos of the Cydonia region. There seems to be no limit on the amount
of new scientific breakthroughs we can get out of those two grainy photos.

So where's this clear evidence? And what does a US Army general know about
Mars, anyway? Why not go over to sci.astro and ask the people at JPL who ran
the Viking missions?

How many pictures: thousands. How many released: all of them. They're available
on CD ROMs. Get them and look for yourself. But of course, this must be another
government lie...

-Tom R.   randolph@est.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: sbooth@lonestar.utsa.edu (Simon E. Booth)
Subject: Re: Our Friend, John_-_Winston
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 05:19:23 GMT


pardon me is this is a FAQ, but who is this John Winston character?
(besides somone who apparently plagarizes sci-fi novels)

Simon

Organization: Sophomore, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 17:16:38 -0500 
From: Andrew Todd Weinstein <aw2s+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: about the previous post


in that news clip I posted above, I wonder what they meant by "national
security"
being threatened.  Hmmm, I wonder what could be so top secret that NASA
could be keeping secret from everyone, maybe ufo's and aliens? Just a wild
guess
From: peter@stycx.hacktic.nl (Author)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Visits etc.
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 92 07:11:29 PST
Organization: River of Doom. Running through Central Holland

Seems there is a lot of talk going regarding the indentity of that what 
is unindentified. Most people somehow have the idea that all form of live 
would answer to the laws of the manifest order (explicate). A feeling 
which keeps creeping up in my mind, is that many, commonly regarded as 
unreasonable observations, should be seen in the context of, for example, 
Shambalah a kingdom which can be visited by those who are ready for it. 
Recently I read that accoording to the current Dalai Lama, who by the way 
is a very educated person, Shambalah is a fact. Now the idea of a hidden 
kingdom, somewhere on this Earth is evidently becoming increasingly 
unlikely. There are however some striking similaritis between the tales 
of those who were ready, reached the required level of spirituality, to 
visit the hidden kingdom, and those who for some reason or the other were 
selected for a close encounter with UFO's. The question is now whether it 
is reasonable to supose that, this readiness, is in fact  the level to 
which the person is prone to halucinations, or to which the person
reached an awareness wich allows her/him to interact whithin a higher 
actuality.
I would be very interested in the opinions concerning these questions 
are.
Greetings peter@stycx.hacktic.nl

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
peter@stycx.hacktic.nl (5W)
Crawling out from the river of darkness into your own private pinball machine 
Call STYCX  (Waffle 1.65) from 23:00 to 06:00  Central European Time  
Number +31-3404-59551               Newkid Intown the nastiest Sysop arround  
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
From: 9001786@sunvax.sun.ac.za (Fem)
Subject: SETI
Organization: UoS
Distribution: All
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 19:51:18 GMT

Hi I am a new guy that belief in inteligent life elsewhere in the universe 
and would like to hear some of your oppions on this matter.
From: peter@stycx.hacktic.nl (Author)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Monuments of Mars
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 92 05:41:37 PST
Organization: River of Doom. Running through Central Holland

esi102@cck.coventry.ac.uk (The Magician) writes:

> 
> 
> >In article <1992Nov4.160042.25890@engage.pko.dec.com>, stanley@verga.enet.de
> 
> >Well, that's really silly.  Why would anyone in their right mind carve faces
> >in the side of a mountain??
> 
> To confuse the hell out of anyone who see's it?
> Some strange vortex effect of the martian wind (a la crop circles)?
> Someone got there before us ?
> Mass electronic phycosis/hysteria ?
> 
> Who can say !
> 
> Tim.
> esi102@uk.ac.cov.cck 
> Dreams fade, but nightmares live forever. 

Well to be perfectly honest, the question as why somebody would carve 
faces in mountains should not be that difficult to answer considering the 
we carved the faces of some presidents into a mountain side. Now it is 
not that I'm saying that we are looking at the face of some Martain 
President, or do we.
I think that the main question is are we looking at a face or are we 
seeing something we wish to see. To me , after looking at some pictures, 
unfortunately in a book, I we tend to believe that the image is to clear 
to be explained as a halucination or a projection of our desire to hook 
up with an alien civilisation. 
Personally I would like to obtain some better data on the subject, if 
somebody out there could get me just that I would be most happy.

Greetings peter@stycx.hacktic.nl

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
peter@stycx.hacktic.nl (5W)
Crawling out from the river of darkness into your own private pinball machine 
Call STYCX  (Waffle 1.65) from 23:00 to 06:00  Central European Time  
Number +31-3404-59551               Newkid Intown the nastiest Sysop arround  
Newsgroups: alt.california
From: CSMSETS@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU
Subject: Re: Bally's Health Club SUCKS Read this...
Date: 16 Nov 92 15:12:43 PST

In article <1992Nov13.170515.8890@walter.cray.com>,
Ken.J.Taylor@cray.com (Ken J.  Taylor - Huntington Beach) writes:

>I was a member of Holiday Spa, Bally, for three years.  I did not renew
>the membership this year (although at $96, very cheap) because:
>
>        1. The facilities were unsanitary (I have seen people urinating
>        in showers, spitting into pools, hot baths and onto carpeted
>        exercise areas.  Sweaty exercise machies were not cleaned.)
>
>        2. Other clients were rude (hogging circuit training stations,
>        becoming beligerent when asked let others take their turns on
>        stations, ignoring request to stop urinating in showers)
>
>        3. Service nonexistant and rude (complaining to the staff about
>        unsanitary conditions and wasted waiting time caused by station
>        hogs were met with "nothing we can do" or "you should have done
>        this, you should have done that (and not we could have done
>        this)" or "we don't want your kind as a member")
>
>        4. Overcrowded facilities.
>
>In summary, at Bally facilities, quality of service is secondary to
>offering memberships dues that are cheaper than the competition's.
>Money would be better spent investing in your own health equipment.
>You probably can avoid some of the above problems by joining more
>expensive quality-oriented clubs but not the inconvenience of sharing
>equipment and of not getting your money's worth when you cannot use the
>facility (sick, vacation, business travel, busy.)

This is strange since I haven't had these problems at my gym (Holiday
Spa, Bally - in Canoga Park). I think one of the reasons I haven't
had such problems is because there are several other gyms within
six miles of the one I go to and they can't get away with it (two
of which are also Holiday Spa's, two are Nautilus Plus, now owned
by Bally, and a World's Gym, and three other large facilities). This
Holiday has been very good about rude clients (to the point of calling
the police to have them bodily removed and canceling their memberships).

I think alot has to do with the local management.

           --Ed
From: 6500baer@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu (Amanda Baer)
Newsgroups: alt.california
Subject: Re: Northern California
Date: 24 Nov 92 01:08:38 GMT

In article <1992Nov23.001016.22894@lclark.edu> mason@lclark.edu (Paul Mason) writes:

>Not that I mind, but I am kind of tired of reading about LA. 
>Let's have more bay area and northern coast stories.

Agreed!

Here's one: having a picnic at the Glen Ellen Winery in Sonoma
Valley is one of the most pleasant things I have done in Northern
Cal. Yes, it's a very yuppy thing to do, but in the fall, the winery
is one of the most beautiful places in the world. (pardon my gushing)

enjoy,
amanda

******
stuck in So Cal...

(but at least its not LA)
From: steiny@steiny.com (Don Steiny)
Newsgroups: alt.california
Subject: Re: relocation
Date: 20 Nov 92 05:33:09 GMT
Organization: Don Steiny Software

cs67+@andrew.cmu.edu (Christopher M Stanley) writes:

>The auto and steel industries shot themselves in the foot - in a big
>way.  Both industries became big lumbering giants.  They thought no one
>could touch them.  They also felt they had the right to tell their
>customers "what they were going to by".  

	No kidding, when Bush made his ill fated trip to Japan one of the
car companies, I believe Chevrolet, said that they did not make right-hand
drive cars for the Japanese market and that the Japanese should by left-hand
drive cars for "status."

-don
-- 
Don Steiny
Don Steiny Software
Santa Cruz, CA 95060
(408) 425-0382
Newsgroups: alt.california
From: danco@titan.ucc.umass.edu (DANIEL F COHEN)
Subject: Re: Term Limits, NOT (was Re: relocation)
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 20:20:35 GMT

In article <1992Nov16.164459.1834@newsgate.sps.mot.com> jeffh@pisces.sps.mot.com  (Jeff Heilner) writes:
>Our founding fathers did not intend for politics to be a career. It was  
>meant to be a place where those who enjoyed and benefited from the  
>freedoms and liberties of this country could serve the public for a  
>LIMITED time, and then return to their private life.
>
>Term limits preserves this idea. 

I think you've got the intent of the FF's right.  I also don't think it really
bears on the issue at hand.  The complexities of modern American politics
seem to require a class of professional legislators.  Even if it doesn't,
the original intent of the FF's isn't what should decide the issue one way
or the other.

>
>I have doubts about the thought that term limits would weaken a state's  
>representation.  However, if this is a concern, several have proposed the  
>perfect solution: Amend the constitution to limit the terms of all states'  
>congressmen/women. All states would then be on equal footing. 
>

Here you've framed the issue precisely, although I don't know why you have
any doubts that term limits weaken a state's representation on the hill.
Seniority is everything in committee assignments, and a state with
nothing but first or second term congressfolks has a lot less juice than
a state with a team of nth-term vets.  Ask Ted Kennedy.  Or Jesse Helms.

I'm not sure I'd like the idea of a Constitutional amendment, but if
term limitations are to be established, they need to be uniform for all
states, otherwise the states with such limits are going to be left
with second-class representation in Congress -- which is probably
very close to the basis of the Constitutional challenge which will
inevitably be made to the term-limitation laws in the near future.

Be interesting to see what happens.

--Dan







Newsgroups: alt.california
From: mason@lclark.edu (Paul Mason)
Subject: Northern California
Organization: Lewis & Clark College, Portland OR
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 00:10:16 GMT

Not that I mind, but I am kind of tired of reading about LA. 
Let's discuss our favorite northern California spots.  One July 4 I spent in
the hills east of San Jose.  Our friends house there had a pool and a hot tub,
and we watched all the different fireworks shows from around the bay.  
Pretty cool.
Let's have more bay area and northern coast stories.
Thanks.
Paul.
	"another displaced Californian"
--
From: mike@inti.lbl.gov (Michael Helm)
Newsgroups: alt.california
Subject: Re: relocation
Date: 21 Nov 1992 00:20:48 GMT
Organization: N.I.C.E.
Reply-To: mike@inti.lbl.gov (Michael Helm)
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.128.82

carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU writes:
other>that there is a polictical spectrum are right or left wing extremists
other>but don't want to admit it.

>Wrong, jackass.  Trying to cram everything into a single dimension is
>absolutely stupid.  The only people who do that are those with an axe to grind
 [examples omitted]
>Now, tell me, turkey, just how do you manage to order these positions in a
>single dimension?  Convers, et. al. tried, and when they discovered it didn't

Now I understand your position, but I think maybe you share a little
of the misunderstanding.  Dimension & vector & concepts like that
are mathematical abstractions.  "Right" & "left wing" are metaphors;
the metaphor comes down to us from parliament or a public body
like that, yes?  What you see, when you look at this deliberative
body, is a large group of people, split with a block on your right, &
a block on your left.  Not a linear array.  There's no reason to
think there would be.  Clearly, tho, the term "political spectum",
another metaphor, is guaranteed to bring up ideas of sequence
along a single dimension -- at least to a scientist.

I think you are certainly correct that divvying things up to r & l
wings just doesn't work out in politics as we experience it nowadays,
but it is nowhere as simple a concept as you've made it out to be.
From: jampel@cs.city.ac.uk (Michael Jampel)
Newsgroups: alt.california
Subject: Re: location (with extreme trepidation)
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:02:02 GMT
Organization: City University

Dear All,

I do not know the etiquette of 'alt' newsgroups. May I humbly
suggest that the political discussion moves out of this newsgroup?

No offence to any of the contributors, but from where I am sitting
(London) I want to hear about california, not politics.

Agree or disagree, I do not want to start a whole new thread. Either act
on this or don't; flames to /dev/null.

Regards,

=====================================================================
 Michael Jampel         Dept of Computer Science, City University, 
 jampel@cs.city.ac.uk   Northampton Square, London, EC1V 0HB, England
                        Tel +44 71 477 8449, Fax +44 71 477 8587
From: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: alt.california
Subject: Re: Favorite part of los angeles
Date: 21 Nov 92 00:41:23 GMT
Reply-To: carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol1.gps.caltech.edu

In article <1992Nov20.200620.16964@lclark.edu>, mason@lclark.edu (Paul Mason) writes:
>I visited the La Brea Tar Pits on a family vacation when I was a child.  It
>was really cool.  But when my sister and I went rolling down a grassy hill, 
>she got tar stuck in her hair.  It was very messy and difficult to get out.

Yes, that is a problem when you visit The The Tar Tar Pits.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: CARL@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXen and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
Newsgroups: alt.california
From: pbray@envy.reed.edu (Peter Bray)
Subject: Hiking etc.
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 22:56:43 GMT


Hey.. crazy idea...
who would be interested in going camping/hiking in the santa barbara  
mountains sometime in early january?  god it is really beautiful up  
there... last time I went i saw a mountain lion rambling slowly through  
the hot hot yellow wild flowers.   a beautiful sight!  lots of bees  
buzzing.  lots of 'em.  good thick hemingway land if you ask me; spain.

--
"Art is the Tree of Life; Science is the Tree of Death."
-- W. Blake
From: markp@pro-palmtree.socal.com (Mark Panitz)
Subject: Re: Bloody English Weather???(You have it easy)
Organization: The Palmtree BBS - 310/453-8726 - Santa Monica, CA
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 04:41:00 GMT

Hi  there, cherro!
Newsgroups: alt.california
From: ostubble@agsm.ucla.edu (Otha Stubblefield III)
Subject: Community College Fees for Spring
Date: 19 Nov 92 11:42:21 PST


I saw this notice at West Los Angeles College, yesterday, announcing the
new fees structure for Spring 92.  This was also reaffirmed by a bulletin 
for the LA Community College Instructional TV Program that charges the same
fees.

*  There is no longer a flat fee after taking a certain number of units.
   Before, there was a flat fee ($60) if you took 10 or more units.  This is
   no more.  Your fees will strictly be X * the number of units you are 
   taking, plus special campus fees (see below). 

*  If you DO NOT HAVE a bachelor's or higher degree, you pay $10/unit.

*  If you HAVE a bachelor's or higher degree, you pay $50/unit.

*  If you are classified as a non-resident of California, you pay $123/unit.

Beginning in Spring, the LA Community Colleges (West, Southwest, City,
East LA, Valley, Pierce, Mission, Trade Tech and Harbor) will begin 
charging a mandatory $7.50 health insurance fee.  The flyer that I saw
stated that waiving this fee would only be based on finanacial need, and
no mention was made about your having other coverage.  This fee is
already in effect at El Camino and Santa Monica (I think), and my friends
that go there have said they had to pay it even though the had other
coverage.
Newsgroups: alt.california
Subject: Re: Favorite Places in L.A.
From: Matthew Duncan Walker <mw5d+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 01:07:44 -0500 
Organization: Freshman, CIT general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

The Tommy's on Whittier Blvd. in Pico Rivera is the best- I go to school
in Pittsburgh, but I'm from L.A.  The thing I miss the most is Howard
Stern in the mornings.  My favorite place is the Natural History Museum.
Olvera Street is also a great place to go.

Just one more displaced Californian,
Matthew Walker
Newsgroups: alt.california