From: chaneysa@nextnet.csus.edu (Stephen A Chaney)
Subject: Re: Why we go for non-black women:
Organization: California State University Sacramento
Distribution: world 
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 01:55:35 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.212911.19991@athena.mit.edu> femibyte@athena.mit.edu (Olufemi G Anthony) writes:
>In article <1993Jan4.230304.7767@csus.edu>, chaneysa@nextnet.csus.edu (Stephen A Chaney) writes:
>|> In article <1993Jan3.231519.11455@athena.mit.edu> femibyte@athena.mit.edu (Olufemi G Anthony) writes:
>|> >In article <1993Jan1.155419.25716@csus.edu>, chaneysa@nextnet.csus.edu (Stephen A Chaney) writes:
>|> >|> 
>|> >
>|> >I am amazed at your display of narrow-mindedness and stupidity in making such
>|> >blanket statements. 
>|> 
>|> Da, Komrad. 
>|> 
>|> 
>|> >These are the rantings of a frustrated man. Are you frustrated at your 
>|> >inability to date black women? :-)
>|> 
>|> I can date them, but I don't want to. Who wants to date an Amazon?
>
>I *really* pity you, this is stark evidence of self-hatred...

Self-hatred? There is no self-hatred here. It's called
self-protection. It's called knowing where the majority of your
problems lie, and then avoiding them. 

I get into a circle of racially-overconscious blacks, and there are
problems. I leave and join a circle of attitude-over-race conscious
blacks, who are increasing in number, and life is suddenly so much
better. 

You show me a black woman who does not think a black man has to answer
to them for who they date, and I'll tell you up-front that she is the
kind of person I respect. No, wait - I've been confronted by such
women via email. (Those of you who have emailed me with this, please
tell the net how I responded. Do I lie?)


>|> And while we always hear about black women faulting black men for
>|> "Jungle Fever"..
>|> 
>|> WHY IS IT THAT THEY DON'T THINK WHOOPI GOLDBERG OR TINA TURNER OR
>|> DIANA ROSS ARE INADEQUATE?  
>|> 
>|> After all, they don't date black. 
>|> 
>|> It always seems to be that when black men don't date black, you folks
>|> jump out of the woodwork to swing off trees and talk b.s. 
>|> 
>|> Well, bud, I've come to start the b.s. in your home town now, and
>|> I'm calling your bluff. Defend your intolerance.

Well, sounds like you did not want to address this issue. I knew you
couldn't address this hypocrisy. I predicted your non-response to this
exactly. 


>|> >Any black man who the hates black woman, as this one does, hates himself
>|> >and hates his mother as well. Go check your head, fellow.
>|> 
>|> I hate attitude, not people. The problem is, bud, the attitude is
>|> mostly to be found among sisters. 
> 
>You make gross generalizations and oversimplifications. This is evidence of
>someone who is just plainly stupid or just fu*ked up. 

Tell that tale to your friends. The same people who say that black men
who date outside their race, "are just curious about white". If that
is not a generalization, I don't know what is. I've read articles in
Ebony Magazine that were less than friendly towards this kind of
activity. And as we know, Ebony Magazine is the flagship of the black
press. I won't even count as credible evidence the READERS' letters in
response to these reports - some were not only generalizing, but quite
unfriendly. 

The fucked up people aren't the ones who openly admit what they're all
about. The ones you have to worry about are the ones who hide it. In
my case, as you know, all that I feel on this issue is out on the
table - good or bad. 


>|> >You are such an idiot that I don't think you should be taken seriously. BTW I 
>|> >consider myself a conservative, but I don't liken myself to people like Clarence
>|> >Thomas. They certainly do not represent Black conservatism for me. Try reading 
>|> >Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X, or maybe Malcolm was too anti-white for you.
>|> 
>|> And YOU are an intolerant Stalinist asshole. I only wish you were one
>|> of those hardnosed razor-tongued sisters so I could really
>|> enthusiastically blast you on this newsgroup. But as it stands, dude,
>|> conservatism means judicial restraint and that's what Judge Clarence
>|> Thomas is all about. 
>|> 
>|> It is also about not putting up reverse-racism as a second wrong to
>|> make a right. 
>|> 
>|> Malcolm X? Come on, isn't this the same fool who said the white man is
>|> lower than the black man? I have abhorred white men saying that about
>|> us, only to hear someone from our race saying that about someone else?
>|> It makes no difference, except the color of the person saying it.
>|> People who say that should wear a Black hood analogous to the KKK
>|> (maybe they do - they're called the Black Panthers).
>|> 
>|> All this Sister Soulja b.s... THAT'S black-ness? Hah, what a joke. I
>|> laugh in their faces and yours, too, despite that you label yourself
>|> as apart from her attitude by calling yourself conservative. 
> 
>I never said a word about Sister Souljah. Stop displaying your ignorance and
>stupidity and try to engage in some serious debate. 

Welcome to some serious debate. 

You mentioned conservatism and I addressed that issue more in depth,
yet you seem again to be unable or unwilling to address what I said.
You locked onto the sound bites "ignorance" "self-hate" and
"generalization", and lost track of the substance that is appearing in
my arguments. 

The Souljah issue is just one (I admit) part of the militant, ongoing,
hatemongering movement that is passed over. Other examples abound:
Jesse "Welcome to Hymietown" Jackson, for instance. All this hate and
bigotry and advocacy of lawlessness, and no one cares because they are
black. 

Conservatives don't play by those rules. That helped attract me. Our
likes or dislikes are not based on race - they're based on attitude or
ideology. Race is unimportant - if it were important, Clarence Thomas
and Thomas Sowell wouldn't be in our ranks.  
 

>|> >Femi.
>|> >(This is coming from a black man who has been "dissed" and treated badly by black
>|> > women before for many of the reasons as the idiot who made the origional posting, but 
>|> >but hasn't decided to hate them as a result.) You are fu*ked up.
>|> 
>|> No, I just decided to fight. 
>|> Black women who see the results of this attack, may think twice.
>|> 
>|> I think that any black woman who complains about 2 Live Crew, should
>|> look at herself, too. I can complain about the men's bad attitudes
>|> towards black women because I'm not the one referring to them as
>|> girls, "Baby's Got Back," and whistling at them down the street, etc.
>|> 
>|> The problem is, your all-might-sound-thinking sisters can't appreciate
>|> that. They call it "nerdy." 
>|> 
>|> Well, I'll repeat myself: Kiss my a#!.
>|> 
>
>You know, in the days of slavery there were 2 kinds of slaves the house slave and
>the field slave. You are worse than the house slave! You are really messed up!
>I can't believe that someone could exhibit such self-hatred. I might as well
>label you for what you are  : a psychologically fu*ked up, pitiable black man. I
>won't even call you an Uncle Tom or an oreo, at least such persons don't hate
>who they are. It's people like you who can't bear to look in the mirror every
>morining for fear of realizing that they are black. The power of
>subliminal propaganda is really amazing.

Again, you flew RIGHT over the substance in my argument. You just
dodged the logic and sense, claiming to be reasonable yourself, and
went for the sound-bites. At least *I* am not f*cked up enough that
when someone posted a response that appealed to logic, reasoning, and
a middle ground, I couldn't see it. I saw it and I responded. 

The slave you obviously want me to be is the one that never steps out
of line, and never differs from the Agenda. You take my
clearly-defined abhorrance of attitudes, and turn it into an
abhorrance of black women. Well, you had help in the form of my
subject header, and I'll admit that. But for the second time, I will
say: I hate bad attitudes. And as you can read, I'm changing mine. But
if deciding not to answer to black people for who I date, is being an
Uncle Tom or a house slave, then so be it - you have no power to make
life worse for me no matter who I date. Hopefully, other blacks will
look at this and realize that fact, too, and take away your power to
inflict hurt on them when you accuse them of not being black because
they date interracially. 

The propaganda that comes from your end of the spectrum is subliminal,
overt, and with some people, fierce. 

And it was only when I decided that I did not have to answer to the
Reverend Louis Farrakhan for who I dated or what attitudes I do not
like, that I could look at myself proudly in the mirror. I was able to
look at myself proudly when I realized I would no longer be afraid of
thinking differently from the blacks who are so-called correct
thinkers. THAT is freedom, and if other blacks read this and catch
THAT fever, I've fulfilled my purpose. THEN, I can smile broader when
I look at myself in the mirror.


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