HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ins712r@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (Heng Chiang)
Subject: Re: KanjiTalk on LC
Organization: Monash University
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 04:13:51 GMT

sasaki@physics20 (Yutaka Sasaki) writes:
: 
: Just get latest version of KanjiTalk (6.0.7 or 6.0.7.1).  It will let 
: your LCs read and write Japanese!
: 

Er, how about telling all us poor people where you got it from?  Thanks.

    Heng.

--
Heng Chiang                    Internet: ins712r@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au
STRESS - The confusion created when      ins712r@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au
the mind overrides the body's urge       dgentley@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au
to choke the living daylight out of          RULE 1 - The female is always
some deserving people. - Unknown                      *right*?  - Somebody
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: smithc@mari.acc.stolaf.edu (Christopher A. Smith)
Subject: Re: Bad F-line instruction?
Organization: St. Olaf College, Northfield (aka Cow Country), MN   USA
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 03:19:11 GMT

In article <wingo-220792114453@zardoz.apple.com> wingo@apple.com (Tony Wingo) writes:
>
>One other suggestion:  Use the Heap Check facility in TMON to monitor the
>state of the System Heap.  It slows things down terribly, but given the
>fact that your problems doen't seem to be occurring in one specific
>application I suspect that the system heap is getting trashed.
>
>-tony
>
>>>ususal disclaimer<<


Just looking at the "About this Mac" shows the System memory usage to
be fluctuating faster than the Dow Jones index, and each time I boot
up a different number shows up.  Never seen that before...  Even with
all INITs turned off...

Thanks,
Chris

  ==================================================================
			 Christopher A. Smith
       German & Mathematics -- St. Olaf College, Northfield, MN
		     Internet:  smithc@stolaf.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: milbouma@esvax.dnet.dupont.com
Subject: "Get Info" reports different size when file is moved
Followup-To: comp.sys.mac.system
Reply-To: poster
Organization: DuPont CR&D/Scientific Computing Div
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 14:19:56 GMT

This subject has come up before, I think, but I need a refresher, prompted by a
question from a curious fellow Mac support person.

How does the Finder and Get Info calculate/report the amount of disk used by a
document?

The specific situation.
----------------------
Mac with system 7 is used to create an MS-Word file (with one word in it).
Get Info reports file is:		3K (2048 bytes used)

Document is transferred to floppy.
Get Info reports this copy is:	2K (2048 bytes used)

Floppy put into system 6 Mac, Get Info shows same as previous (2K)

Document copied to system 6 Mac's hard drive (a large drive ~1.2GB)

Get Info reports this copy is:	17K (2048 bytes used)
----------------------
Why would 17K of disk space be needed to store a 2K document.  I know there is
some overhead with format info, directory info and pointers, but
a 17:2 ratio?  Would sectors on a large capacity drive be much larger (some
minimum greater than 2K)?  Or does it relate to a difference in the way system
6 and system 7 handle these things?

Inquiring minds want to know :-)  !!

Thanks - email or post as you deem appropriate.

-- 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: Mike Brudenell <pmb1@tower.york.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Command Key speeds file deletion...
Organization: The Computing Service, University of York, UK
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 07:52:10 GMT
X-Posted-From: pippin.york.ac.uk
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <76298@ut-emx.uucp> David T. Croley,
ifab407@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu writes:
>OK, after reading that holding down the command-key when deleting files
>speeds up the process, I tried it and it has an amazing effect.
>
>The next logical question, of course, is what does it do?  Is it removing
>some sort of delay, or is it not verifying deletion, etc?

I don't know about this generally having an effect, but it CERTAINLY does
if you are using Norton Utilities' FileSaver.  Its description in the
manual mentions that it can be temporarily disabled (I think that's the
phrasing?) by holding down the Command key as the Wastebasket empties.  I
presume it stops FileSaver squirreling the deleted file information away
into its personal storage spaces.  If so the speed increase is at the
penalty of less robustness in file recovery in the event of a disk
failure.
From: rgonzal@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Ralph Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: Looking for print spooler for Imagewriter under system 7
Date: 22 Jul 92 19:25:42 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

jdb1@kepler.unh.edu (Jonathan D Baumgartner) writes:

>	What about PrintAid?  It's not a full-fledged spooler (lets you
>do anything you want but work with the app that's printing), but it
>helps a bit.  I don't know if it works with system 7 or not, though.

I tried PrintAid (with Sys 7) and couldn't get it to work with any
of my apps, though I guess they're not so mainstream: WriteNow,
RagTime.

-Ralph

-- 
Ralph Gonzalez, Computer Science, Rutgers Univ., Camden, NJ
Phone: (609) 757-6122; Internet: rgonzal@elbereth.rutgers.edu
--
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: Randy Hardy <hardy@mighty.facs.fccc.edu>
Subject: Re: Bad F-line instruction?
Organization: I.C.R., Fox Chase Cancer Center
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 18:30:50 GMT


Regarding Bad F-Line errors on a IIci:

I had scads of these when I added a cache card to my IIci (it was an older CI
before Apple started putting them in); turned out to be a bad card and swapping
it out with another fixed the problem.  Before that I tried just about
everything else (re-installing system, reformatting disk, swapping disk,
changing video config, etc.).  One other thing, when re-installing system, make
sure to DELETE the old SYSTEM file.  Otherwise a corrupted file can be updated
and stll cause problems.

Good luck!

R. Hardy <hardy@mighty.facs.fccc.edu>
I.C.R., Fox Chase Cancer Center, 7701 Burholme Ave., Philadelphia, PA 19111,
USA
voice 215-728-2463   fax   215-728-2412
From: judson@watnxt2.ucr.edu (Michael Judson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Dvorak Keyboard Questionaire
Date: 22 Jul 92 23:18:51 GMT

I have switched now to the Dvorak keyboard and in about a week or so brought
my speed up to nearly 70 wpm (on QWERTY I type about 90 wpm) but my speed is
consistently increasing.
However, I wanted to know how popular Dvorak is and how soon (if it all)
keyboards will change to the new layout.
From: glen@Cayman.COM (Glen B. Glater)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: renaming hard drive
Date: 21 Jul 92 21:29:15 GMT
Distribution: comp.sys.mac.system
Organization: Cayman Systems Inc., Cambridge, MA

I know that this is a FAQ, but I've tried the standard things and can't
this to work...

How do you change the name of a Hard Drive under Sys. 7.0? 

I've shut sharing off.  If you look in the Sharing setup window it has 
Name A, but the actual name of the drive is Name B.  We want to get
rid of Name B.  

Any ideas?

Glen
--

	*************************************************************
	Glen B. Glater				Phone: (617) 494-1999         
	Technical Support Engineer		Fax:   (617) 494-5167         
	Cayman Systems Inc.			Internet: glen@cayman.com     
	26 Landsdowne Street			AppleLink:  CAYMAN.TECH	      
	Cambridge, MA   02139            SneakerNet:  3rd cube on the left
From: ph@physiology.oxford.ac.uk (Patrick Haggard)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: Mac IIfx, VM, 32-bit addressing, & EtherTalk freeze-up
Date: 29 Jul 92 07:12:55 GMT
Organization: Physiology Department, Oxford University, Oxford, UK.


I had a similar freeze-up when I turned on 32 bit addressing.  In this
case it seemed to be one of my extensions, though, since I could boot
by keeping the shift key down.  My feeling is that one will have to
go through the boot sequence one item at a time to find a reliable
method of getting up in 32 bit mode.

------------------------------------------------------------

Patrick Haggard,
Oxford University Laboratory of Physiology,
Parks Road,
Oxford,
OX1 3PT
England

Tel. (0865) 272116
Fax. (0865) 272469
Email (JANET): ph@uk.ac.ox.physiol
------------------------------------------------------------
From: ifab407@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (David T. Croley)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Command Key speeds file deletion...
Date: 21 Jul 92 14:08:23 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

OK, after reading that holding down the command-key when deleting files
speeds up the process, I tried it and it has an amazing effect.

The next logical question, of course, is what does it do?  Is it removing
some sort of delay, or is it not verifying deletion, etc?

-- 
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
:David Croley            : Texas... They got big long roads out there.  :
:ifab407@ccwf.utexas.edu :                                  - Chris Rea :
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: short@microcom.com (Todd Short)
Subject: Re: Windows NT (Not a flame.)
Reply-To: short@microcom.com
Organization: Microcom, Inc.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 12:36:32 GMT

This is not a flame, the Mac needn't worry:

Just because they are charging $69 for the PRE-BETA SDK, in many
trade rags, the rumored price of Windows NT will be in the $500
range.  That may be fine for a DEC (Alpha) customer, or maybe
for an RS6000.  But for PC's it's unreasonable to ask a non-
corporate user to shell out $500 for an OS!  DOS itself can be 
had for $60 with Windows adding another $100.  OS/2 can be had
for $150 ($49.95 for Windows users until 7/31/92!)  (less than 
DOS/Windows!).  Most OS's are packed with their systems, and the
user is not (usually) charged for them (the Mac for instance).  
Only if an OS is "bundled" with a system will it do well.  Look 
at many other computers, and see what I mean.  I'm not saying NT
will be a bad product (considering it's Unix heritage), but 
paying more for an OS than for the apps to run under it is 
ridiculous.  In addition, unless it can truly run 16-bit Windows
(likely) AND DOS (unlikely, OS/2 2.0 has some problems with 
these, I've heard) applications, it won't do well.  Look at how
many Unix like OS's are out there that come with machines.

In addition have you heard the requirements for Windows NT? It's
worse than OS/2, few machines have that setup. Those who are 
able to bundle an OS with a machine can make sure that the OS 
will run on the machine they make. DEC, Apple, IBM non-PC's,
Sun, etc.

OS		Machine Bundled with		Successful?
-----------------------------------------------------------
DOS		IBM PC's & compatibles		YES!
Windows		Some IBM PC's & compatibles	YES
CP/M		Z80 & 8080 PC's			YES
OS/2		None				Barely
MacOS		MacIntosh's			YES
A/UX		None (I think)			Barely
VMS		Dec VAX				YES
Ultrix		Dec VAX				YES
Unix & like	Many machines			YES

In many situations, simple economics decide the fate of OS's. 
(Remember OS/2's pre-v2.0 price?!?)

-Todd Short
/* short@python.eng.microcom.com */
/* I don't own a Mac, but I'd like to play with one on TV. */


Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: matsb@tdb.uu.se (Mats Bredell)
Subject: Re: Installing Multiple Language Scripts
Organization: Dept. of Scientific Computing, Uppsala Univ.
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 12:09:53 GMT

jenkinsj@blowfish.taligent.com (John H. Jenkins) writes:

: Yep, that will work, too.  I guess I'm less than enthusiastic about that as
: a solution because it has a higher disk overhead and really isn't necessary
: *if* you can successfully install Hebrew or Arabic in your English system
: (as apparantly not everyone can do :-( ).  Right now, I can move back and
: forth between English, Hebrew, and Chinese just by hitting command-space. 
: It's rather nice.  

How did you install the foreign scripts (why doesn't it work on my machine???)

I thought that dropping the script, the keyboard layout and the fonts into the
system file was enough. Oh yes, that little INIT that complains during startup
too ...

/Mats
-- 
Mats Bredell                                   Mats.Bredell@udac.uu.se
Uppsala University Computing Center (UDAC)
Department of medical systems                  Ph:  +46 18 187817
Sweden                                         Fax: +46 18 187825
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: wingard@b11.ingr.com (Steve Wingard)
Subject: Hairlines dont work with HP DeskWriter 3.1?
Reply-To: wingard@scw.b11.ingr.COM
Organization: Intergraph Corp.
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 22:18:08 GMT

Someone at work asked me about this -- when I tried it at home,
it didn't work for me either.  I figured I'd ask you folks about it.

Neither of us is having any success printing a graphics document that
uses hairlines.  In my friend's case (using SuperPaint), the line
comes out looking more like 1pt. than hairline.  In my case
(ClarisWorks), nothing prints out at all -- in my test, I got a blank
page!  In both cases, everything looked great when we switched back to
the DW 2.2 driver.

Has anyone else experienced this problem?


-- 
Steve Wingard
Intergraph Corp.
wingard@scw.b11.ingr.com
From: wilde@hri.com (Scott Wilde)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: new inside Macintosh?
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:17:29 GMT
Distribution: usa

In article <70207@apple.Apple.COM>, bc@Apple.COM (bill coderre) writes:
|> 
|> 		COST PER POUND
|> K&R "C" manual		$60 	(1/2 lb @ $30)
|> Inside Mac "dictionary" $9.38 	(8 lbs @ $75)
|> 
|> 		COST PER PAGE
|> K&R			$.15	(200 pages @ $30)
|> Inside Mac		$.0625	(1200 pages @ $75)
|> 

On the other hand, by that sort of reasoning:

	COST PER MEG
Quantum 105  $4.09
Wren 1.2G    $1.75

So why doesn't everyone own a 1.2 Gig drive?

*prices for ext. drives from APS ad,April 92 MacWorld

|>somewhat satirical, but these are facts

Scott Wilde
wilde@hri.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: urban@stout.atd.ucar.edu (Art Urban (PROFS))
Subject: Dvorak Keyboard, how?
Organization: Atmospheric Technology Division/NCAR Boulder, CO
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:37:25 GMT

Okay, so let's say I want to try and learn the Dvorak keyboard. How, exactly,
do I go about reconfiguring my keyboard? Is there some freeware keymap
available; shareware tutorial?

--
Art Urban 					       urban@stout.atd.ucar.edu
===============================================================================
 "What's Next? Chasing bunnies on a motorbike until their hearts explode? -Crow
===============================================================================
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: new Inside Mac : Pascal or C ?
Date: 21 Jul 92 19:47:22 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.162000.740@cnedcu51.bitnet>, ifstadelmann@cnedcu51.bitnet (Patrick Stadelmann) writes:
> 
> 
>  Hi
> 
>  Does anyone know if the new Inside Mac will be written in C or in Pascal ?
> 
> 					Thank you 

It will be written in English.

Seriously, I believe that sample code will be in both Pascal and C.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: moofie@gallant.apple.com (Steve Klingsporn)
Subject: Re: PowerOrgasm [help needed]
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 20:41:25 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA


I personally think it's a funny hack, and people are way too sensitive.
Talk about a repressed society, geez...

My point is this:  Who gives a shit??  It's funny; leave it at that.


Bothered,

Steve Klingsporn
Collaborative Systems Development

Disclaimer:  These are my opinions only, of course.  They don't represent Apple.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: Michael Babin
Subject: Finder changes alias icon
Organization: Texas Instruments
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 20:19:15 GMT


Thought I'd share an interesting piece of Finder behavior that I encountered
the other day.

First, I have a disk (call it "System") which is mounted and appears on my
desktop.  It's shown using its "default" B&W icon.  I select System and choose
"Make Alias" from the File menu.  "System alias" now appears on my desktop with
the same default B&W icon as System.  So far, so good.

Now I assign a custom icon to "System alias".  In this case, it's the colorful
icon from Spaceward Ho! (a great game from Peter Commons & Delta Tao, btw).
I then select "System alias" and choose "Make Alias" from the File menu.
"System alias alias" now appears on my desktop with the colorful SH icon.
Again, so far, so good.

Here's the strange part.  If I now double-click on "System alias alias", which
opens the disk System, the colorful icon for my "alias alias" is altered.  In
this particular case, it becomes the outline of the B&W icon through which I
can see the clipped portion of my colorful SH icon!

OK, that's the simple, anyone can reproduce description of the problem.  At a
more detailed level, it appears that the Finder is copying the icon information
from the disk (the driver in this case) to the alias file using the resource ID
of the "secondary custom icon", -16496.  The "secondary custom icon" ID was
already
used, thank you very much, by the Finder for the SH icon when it created the 
"alias alias". Thus, the information gets overridden.  In this particular case,

you end up with a mismatched icon family since the icon information for the
disk 
is not as complete as that of the SH icon (missing members of the family, icl8,

icl4, etc.).  If the original (the System disk, in this case) had a complete
icon 
family, the icon for the "alias alias" would be changed to match that of the
original.

I strongly suspect that this is a bug.  Why would you want to change the icon
of an
alias to match that of the original?  If you did want them to match, why not
just
assign the correct icon when the alias is created?  If this behavior is
considered
a "feature", could anyone explain why?

On a related note, what is the best way to bring a problem you've encountered
to the
attention of the proper person at Apple who can fix or explain it?

Later,

Mike Babin
babin@ra.csc.ti.com
From: Laurie Carlson <honoluluweek@igc.org>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Date: 24 Jul 92 17:01 PDT
Subject: Re: A very *WEIRD* problem
Nf-ID: #R:1992Jul17.015347.27764@news.colu:437715046:cdp:1364900041:000:367
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!honoluluweek    Jul 24 17:01:00 1992



...etcetera deleted...

the moral of the story is, SUITCASE 2.*.* >SUCKS<. not only does it crash,
i have heardof several instances where it has done wierd things to the
font suitcases themselves. I used it for a >DAY< and had to restore all
my fonts from backups (thank goddess i had THOSE backed up! :)

Take it from me, stick with Suitcase II 1.2.11

alohas
mats
From: sho@gibbs.physics.purdue.edu (Sho Kuwamoto)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: System 7.1 : What is going to be in it?
Date: 24 Jul 92 07:51:25 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Physics Department

In article <nerm-200792103739@90.10.20.86> nerm@apple.com (Dean Yu) writes:
>  This is a pretty liberal paraphrase.  OCE, GX, and AppleScript have
>nothing
>to do with 7.1, aside from the fact that they all use 7.1 as the base
>system.
>Other than that, they're all seperate products.

Let me get this straight.  We're going to have to *pay* for
these?  OCE I can sort of understand.  Not everyone does
mail.  AppleScript, I can almost understand.  Not everyone
needs scripting.  Quickdraw GX I cannot understand.  Why
would Apple create a new imaging model and then guarantee
its lack of acceptance by forcing users to pay for it?  

When Apple first announced that it would be asking users to
pay for certain enhancements to the system software, I
was worried that this would lead to stagnation as users
refused to shell out.  Now, my fears have doubled.

-Sho
--
sho@physics.purdue.edu
From: sstai@ocf.berkeley.edu (Samuel S. Tai)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: Appleshare and sys7?
Date: 23 Jul 1992 22:13:24 GMT
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: headcrash.berkeley.edu


This sounds like a good addition to the FAQ list!

1.  AppleShare 3.0 is the _network server_ software.  It includes
    both network & print spoolers, as well as _print server_ software.

2.  The AppleShare Chooser Extension in System 7 allows individual
    Macs to connect to a server or to other Macs on which File Sharing
    is active.

The two are different!  AppleShare 3.0 is recommended for network
setup & administration -- its performance is *MUCH* greater than
System 7's File Sharing.

Yes, you need both 1 & 2 to use AppleShare 3.0.  3.0 runs on the server
& the Chooser Extension runs on the clients.

No, if you just want to get a "quick & dirty" network going, you
don't need AppleShare 3.0.  System 7 File Sharing should serve as an
interim solution.

For a more complete discussion of the relative merits of the two,
feel free to post on comp.sys.mac.comm (networking Macs in general),
or comp.protocols.appletalk (in-depth technical discussion of the
particulars of AppleTalk).


-- 
-----------------------+-----------------------------------------------------
Samuel S. Tai          | Wisdom is supreme, therefore get wisdom.
sstai@ocf.berkeley.edu | Though it cost you all you have, get understanding.
                       |                                -- Proverbs 4:7 (NIV)
-----------------------+-----------------------------------------------------
From: landis@ltpsun.gsfc.nasa.gov (David Landis)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Replacing the Trash Can in System 7?
Date: 28 Jul 92 19:27:20 GMT
Organization: NASA/GSFC

I am looking for a way to replace the trash can icon in System 7.0.1.
I had a nice recycle symbol in my System 6.0.7 computer, but when I
upgraded to a color S7 machine, I could not find the trash can icon
in the Finder. Where is it? I am familiar with the use of ResEdit, so
how can I find and replace the icon?

Thanks in advance.

Dave Landis
landis@ltpsun.gsfc.nasa.gov
From: trimper@edsi.plexus.COM (Greg Trimper)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: Re: Someone should start a recall drive against Gov. Wilson
Date: 28 Jul 92 02:59:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: edsi.1992Jul28.025928.25342
Distribution: comp
Organization: Enterprise Data Systems Incorporated, Appleton WI
Followup_to: hellhole.dev.null

lkimes@alshain.usc.edu (Lance 'Moof' Kimes) writes:

>In article <CHET.92Jul24120216@jupiter.Advansoft.COM>, chet@Advansoft.COM (chet wood) writes:
[A REPOST OF THE ENTIRE ARTICLE]

>I know this is obvious, but............
>save it for someone who cares.........
>and post it to the proper newsgroup next time.
>Lance Kimes

I Know THIS sounds obvious:

Don't quote an entire article for a 2bit reply.  PLEASE.  DOn't flame
others unless you are free of flame yourself.

Greg Trimper   trimper@edsi.plexus.com    
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
From: dewey@centerline.com (Devan F. Dewey)
Subject: AppleShare 3.0 Backup Suggestions Sought
Followup-To: comp.sys.mac.system
Organization: CenterLine Software, Inc.
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 15:24:53 GMT


We recently experienced a bad sector on the system partition of our
AppleShare server. This was very bad. Lots of problems restoring. The
version of Sum II Backup we use doesn't preserve priviledge information. We
want to move into the real world, and get a tape/disk unit the will back up
our 3.0 file server, the QuickMail server, and a few other Macs on the
network. We're also considering a mirror for the server disk.

Here are the questions:

1. How do mirrors work? How about the ones that come online instantly?

2. Any knowledge of the Memory Bank product line?

3. How do network-based back up solutions work in the real word? Anyone
actually get this to work with QuickMail 2.5???

4. What is your best suggestion for backing up, 3 AppleShare 3.0 servers, 3
QuickMail servers, and 75 or so macs??

e-mail responses are great, but I'll check the net in case you have
something you think everyone needs to hear.

Thanks in advance.

-Devan

                             
               Devan F. Dewey | Senior Systems Analyst
          CenterLine Software | dewey@centerline.com
            10 Fawcett Street | "Leme esplain - no dere is
          Cambridge, MA 02138 | too much. Leme sum up."
                                       -Inigo Montoya
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system