HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rothberg@bimacs.BITNET (Danny Rothenberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Conversion Question
Date: 22 Nov 92 11:15:47 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <1992Nov19.062732.21597@cis.ohio-state.edu> khaikin@boa.cis.ohio-state.edu (dmitry khaikin) writes:
>In article <1992Nov18.215436.10666@guinness.idbsu.edu> holmes@garnet.idbsu.edu (Randall Holmes) writes:
>>
>>I wouldn't phrase it this way; if the Orthodox do know what God
>
>Would you kindly respect the Name of G-d and NOT write His Name like you
>just did. I can't even read the your article after this. It reminds of
>the way goyim write the name of ... on the walls of the toilet.
>

Surely the problem only occurs if one PRINTS out the name.  As it
appears on my terminal it is really a series of unconnected pixels
which the eye puts together to make a letter.  And even printed, if on
a dot-matrix printer there might be a similar 'dispensation'.

>>
>>--
>>The opinions expressed                |     --Sincerely,
>>above are not the "official"  |     M. Randall Holmes
>>opinions of any person                |     Math. Dept., Boise State Univ.
>>or institution.                       |     holmes@opal.idbsu.edu
>
>Thanks,
>Dima
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  "A word is worth one coin; silence is worth two."_____ The Talmud.
>  "Silence is good everywhere, except in connection with Torah."____ The Zohar.
>   khaikin@cis.ohio-state.edu (Dmitry Khaikin, Columbus Ohio, USA)


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Danny Rothenberg             |     ^
Bitnet:                      |  \-/-\-/  "He's not the messaiah.  He's a
rothberg@bimacs              |   X   X    very naughty boy."
Internet:                    |  /-\-/-\                        - Brian's Mum
rothberg@bimacs.cs.biu.ac.il |     V
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: pcompton@hebb.uoregon.edu (Paul E. Compton)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Tefillin?
Date: 19 Nov 92 00:32:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: pcompton.pcompton-181192162829
Followup-To: soc.culture.jewish
Distribution: world
Organization: Dept. of Psych - U of Oregon
NNTP-Posting-Host: pcompton.uoregon.edu

I recently purchased tefillin from an acquaintance who said that he
got them from a highly recommended source while in Israel.  Upon careful
inspection, it appears that the beit (box) is made of PLASTIC of all
things.
Is there any possible way that this could be proper -- or is there some new
process being applied to the "skin of kosher animals" which renders it to
appear to be plastic?

 
Paul E. Compton
Brain Electrophysiology Laboratory | Internet:  pcompton@hebb.uoregon.edu
Deptartment of Psychology          | Bitnet:    pcompton@oregon
University of Oregon               | AppleLink: COGNEURO.UOR
Eugene, OR 97403-1227  U.S.A.      | Phone: 503.346.6300   FAX:
503.346.4911
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 00:31:37 EST
From: andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Jonathan Pollard...

In article <1epnsaINNlpk@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, bc744@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark
Ira Kaufman) says:
>
>   I am not in the habit of breaking net ettiquite by a publicly
>posted piece of e-mail.  As a matter of fact, I never have.  But
>I recently received a piece of mail that had been so soaked in a
>bath of bigotry, that I had to share it with you.  It might be a
>bit embarrassing for the sender, but I frankly don't care.  When
>I looked at the subject("The Treasonist Jew Pollard"), I saw the
>handwritting on the wall.  The author did not disappoint me.  He
>lived up to the promise of a true anti-semite.
>
>Here a a few pearls...
>
>   "I consider Israel an enemy of the United States, and thus it is
>obvious that Pollard is a treasonist."
>
>   "The mossad is still the premier international terrorist group
>extant."
>
>   "Israel continues to buy it's way into the American treasury via
>AIPAC and the ADL."
>
>   And my favorite...
>
>   "Weinberger may be Episcopalian, but his grandfather was none-
>theless Jewish, which also makes Weinberger Jewish.  Remember, YOU
>CAN'T BE A LITTLE BIT JEWISH!"
>
>
>   These little tidbits were all in the same piece of mail.  The
>sender took umbrage with me have called him an anti-semite.  The
>same man who sent a letter entitled "The Treasonist Jew Pollard"
>could not understand why I called him an anti-semite.
>
>

Sounds anti-semitic. Surely this isn't someone who has publically posted
on the topic?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: er@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Elie Rosenfeld)
Subject: Re: Kosher Honey - Still no answer
Reply-To: er@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Elie Rosenfeld)
Organization: Bell Communications Research (Bellcore)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 17:10:13 GMT

The simple proof for the kashrus of honey is the well-known song that every
child in a good Jewish nursery school should know:

"Dip the apple in the honey, make a bracha loud and clear..."

From which it can be proven that honey is kosher, since if it were not, why
bother making a bracha?
:-)
-- 
Elie Rosenfeld      | "I am what I am, Leila -- and if there are self-made
Bellcore            |  purgatories, then we all must live in them.
Piscataway, N.J.    |  Mine is no worse than someone else's."
(908) 699-8800      |                     - Spock, "This Side of Paradise"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal)
Subject: Re: Not Techelet Again (Re: Prayer shawls)
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 21:07:32 GMT

>>>>>Andrew Solovay writes:
>>>>>>>Oh no! Not the Techelet thread again!
>>>>>Joel Goldberg responds:
>>>>>>  But it can't _be_ the authentic techelet thread...
>>>>In article <199211131251.AA14674@yfn.ysu.edu> <aa324@yfn.ysu.edu
>>>>(Marlene Miller)> adds:
>>>>>Nope, it's definitely _not_ the authentic techelet thread. In fact, it
>>>>>looks kinda grey on _my_ monitor!
>>>In article <1992Nov16.193732.824@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
>>>saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:
>>>>I would have thought that the source for the blue dye, not just its
>>>>appearance on a monitor was the knotty issue.
>>In article <1992Nov17.002430.2139@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>
>>jgoldber@todah.chem.utoronto.ca (Joel Goldberg) writes:
>>>  Mah ha kesher?
>In article <1992Nov17.141843.26304@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
>saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:
>>"Kesher"? "Kosher?" Wait!  I thought we were talking about threads, not
>>Kashruth.
In article <1992Nov17.192013.11532@umbc3.umbc.edu>
shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff) writes:
>The kesher is the kushya of mitzvot ha'taliyot ba'aretz.  Or
                                       ^^^^^^^^
>maybe the kasha that should go into the cholent?

Now we're back to how to spell/pronounce the plural of tallit?
-- 
Sam Saal      kingfish!saal OR saal@kingfish.att.com
	Vayiftach HaShem et Peah Ha`Aton
From: jlove@ivrit.ra.itd.umich.edu (Jack Love)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: goy
Date: 23 Nov 1992 16:39:40 GMT
Organization: /usr/local/trn/lib/organization
NNTP-Posting-Host: ivrit.ra.itd.umich.edu

In article <1992Nov23.071119.3812@cbnews.cb.att.com> ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet) writes:
>In article <92327.2342272893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>>In article <1992Nov23.040258.28472@cs.albany.edu>, mark@cs.albany.edu (Mark
>>Steinberger) says:
>>>
>>>Viewed another way, should we stop calling ourselves Jews because the
>>>word has had negative connotations for a number of non-Jews?
>>
>>WHAT!!!! Jew is not a derogatory word, goy is. Would you not object to words
>>like kyke, hymie, heeb etc?  Don't justify racist words by pointing at the
>>racism of others.
>
>Have you experienced people completely freeze, and their mouths shut
>and eyes harden when someone says I'm Jewish?
>

Yes I have.

>Have you met anyone who thinks "Jew" is the prefix to bastard?  Or
>suffix to %$#@!?
>

Yes I have.

>Or anyone who can literally spit the word "Jew" through clecnhed
>teeth, so viciously you'd think flames would start?
>

Yes I have.

>I have and I continue to, all the time.  And yet I would never
>suggest anyone stop using the word "Jew" in spite of the
>exceptionally negative connotations some people give it.
>

I too would agree that other people's racism and hatred is no
reason for me to change what I call myself and what my people
have called themselves for several thousand years. The problem
is with *their* racism, and does not lie with me. I don't understand
why this should be a legitimate excuse for one to use racist
or hate language about others. If we want to end hatred and
racism, we must begin with what we can control, and that,
among other things, is our own language.

>So should we assume that "goy" becomes a bad word just because
>some people may use it that way  If so, why the double standard?
>-- 
>Art Kamlet  a_s_kamlet@att.com  AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus

As I stated in my earlier article, the word "goy" is a little tricky
because it takes on its pejoritive character in the context of
the Yiddish language, and also depends to an extent on the tone of
voice. Those who know that they are using it in that fashion should be
called on it. And I don't think there is any double standard here.
Racism is racism and it should always be confronted.

Jack F. Love
From: lmk2@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: The First Time (was Re: Oral sex)
Date: 20 Nov 1992 05:36:52 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Nov20.002118.23987@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay) writes:
>>
>>But I have another question - Rashi (Ber 49:3) says that Reuven
>>resulted from Yaakov's first sexual act.  If Leah was a virgin (and we
>>know that we're supposed to assume that brides are), how did she
>>convceive?
>
>Clearly, Leah used tampons. These tore the hymen (hey, it
>happens).

Yeah, and this is another thing we were told in junior high school, so
we wouldn't do the _immoral_ thing of using tampons....

>Actually, if we presume the relevant data are literally true,
>then maybe Leah used the same trick that (Rashi says) Lot's
>daughters did, namely tearing her hymen beforehand. Why would she
>do this?  Perhaps she was worried how Jacob would react once he
>knew he'd been tricked... would he reject her? Divorce her out of

easy, she got pregnant the first time.  No trick necessary.
Believe me, it's happened to lots of women.






Leslie

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: The First Time (was Re: Oral sex)
Summary: 
Expires: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Keywords: 

In article <1992Nov20.002118.23987@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay) writes:
>>
>>But I have another question - Rashi (Ber 49:3) says that Reuven
>>resulted from Yaakov's first sexual act.  If Leah was a virgin (and we
>>know that we're supposed to assume that brides are), how did she
>>convceive?
>
>Clearly, Leah used tampons. These tore the hymen (hey, it
>happens).

Yeah, and this is another thing we were told in junior high school, so
we wouldn't do the _immoral_ thing of using tampons....

>Actually, if we presume the relevant data are literally true,
>then maybe Leah used the same trick that (Rashi says) Lot's
>daughters did, namely tearing her hymen beforehand. Why would she
>do this?  Perhaps she was worried how Jacob would react once he
>knew he'd been tricked... would he reject her? Divorce her out of
>hand? She might have thought he'd be more likely to stay around
>if she were pregnant with his child. She'd only get one chance
>with him before he found out who she was, so she wanted to make
>that one count.
>
easy, she got pregnant the first time.  No trick necessary.
Believe me, it's happened to lots of women.






Leslie

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: rda834x@nella10.cc.monash.edu.au (J. Zufi)
Subject: Looking for Hebrew Language learning progrm
Organization: Monash University, Melb., Australia.
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 03:36:59 GMT

Thanks for listening.
I am after a program for the Macintosh that can teach Hebrew. I have
looked around various sites but can't seem to find anything. I suspect
that there may be such programs at Hebrew U. and Bar Ilan, but I don't
have their addresses (if anyone has their anon. ftp address, would
also like a copy of those.)

Jonathan Zufi.

-- 
[  Jonathan Zufi                  | rda834x@nellads.cc.monash.edu.au   
[  Robotics & Digital Technology  | zuf@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au          
[  Monash Univeristy, Caulfield	  | "Why?" Topic on English Literature exam. 
[  Melbourne, Australia		  | "Why not?" Student answer, received 99%
From: gt7491a@prism.gatech.EDU (Morris J. Schwartz (gt7491a))
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Mathematical Proof of G-d?
Date: 22 Nov 92 16:03:25 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In <By3Dws.1KG@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> droth@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (David Roth) writes:

>Pi != Pi means, not Pi factorial equals Pi, but Pi is not equal to Pi.

>!= is a CS notation for not equal.

It actually means "Pi _is_very_equal_ to Pi"

>David
-- 
 _ _ __  _ _ _ _ .     __   ___  _ _ _     __  _ _ . ,__  *      Ask me
 | |   | | | | | |       |  , /  | | |       | | | | |  | *      about
 |/    | | | |/_/      __|_ |   _|/        | | |/_/  | _| *      JewishGT
 |    Morris J. Schwartz          gt7491a@prism.gatech.edu*
From: jlove@ivrit.ra.itd.umich.edu (Jack Love)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Prayer shawls
Date: 20 Nov 1992 14:31:40 GMT
Organization: /usr/local/trn/lib/organization
NNTP-Posting-Host: ivrit.ra.itd.umich.edu

In article <9L38KXR@math.fu-berlin.de> ring@inf.fu-berlin.de (Rod J. Ring) writes:
>
>"Talit" *is* feminine and has in fact *three* plural forms:
>
>"talitot" (which is the most commonly used one),
>
>"talehtim" and
>
>"taliot" (which is hardly *ever* used, because "taliot" is
>          also the plural of "talia", a female lamb).
>
>I don't know why the "tsitsit" is called "talit katan"
>(masculine), but it sure is, I never ever heard "talit
>ktana".  Probably Don's interpretation is right, and it is
>a Yiddish mistake absorbed into modern Ivrit.
>

Over the past few weeks I replied several times regarding this
thread with material similar to things I have seen in the last
couple of days. Are the current follow-ups the result of 
people disagreeing with me, or is it just a matter of their
not seeing my prior responses? The reason for my question is
that I am trying to figure out whether I should bother
reposting my original response due some sort of server or
Internet failure, or whether I should just leave things alone.
In at least one case I was rude to someone who informed me
by private mail that s/he had simply not received the original
material, and I apologized.

On the current thread I agree with what Mr. Ring states 
regarding the forms of the word talit and I believe it coincides 
with what I have earlier stated as well as a number of other
participants. With regard to "talit qatan" I stated in 
an earlier article that I believe it is a prepostional 
construct similar to the English "under-garment" and thus
the word "qatan" should not be construed as an adjective
modifying "talit." Let me hasten to add that I phrased this
as a suppostion, and I had hoped that perhaps someone more
knowledgeble than I would follow up.

Jack F. Love
From: nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss)
Subject: Re: American Antisemitism
Organization: NCR E&M Columbia SC.
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 19:47:39 GMT

In article <RaNLuB3w165w@valpso.hanse.de> tichauer@valpso.hanse.de (Manfredo Tichauer) writes:
>nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>
>> In article <1992Nov18.215314.14993@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> er@iscp.Bellcore.
>> >In article <1992Nov18.202837.1567@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>, stank@cbnewsl.cb.att.
>> >|> ROBERT WERMAN writes:
>> >|> >One in five adult Americans hold strong prejudicial attitudes against Je
>
>> 
>> Can you find out the percentage of Americans who don't like Arabs?
>> 
>> Nabil
>> 
>
>  Why should he? This is s.c.j.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  Manfredo Tichauer M.                       EMAIL : tichauer@valpso.hanse.de
>  Opitzstrasse 14                            VOICE :     (++ 49 40)  27.42.27
>  2000 Hamburg 60 - GERMANY                  FAX   :     (++ 49 40) 270.53.09
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Because he is a nice guy.

Nabil
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Subject: Re: Autopsy - Kahane and Rosenbaum
Reply-To: makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Organization: Arizona State University, Tempe AZ
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 00:16:37 GMT

In article <2850@israel.nysernet.org> warren@nysernet.org writes:

# dm = makowsky@enuxva.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
# a = 2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA (andy)
 
# a: If Kahane had lived, what would he have thought?
 
# me: I don't know what he would have thought (although I can make some
# me: uncomplimentary guesses).  But I imagine he would have said that while
# me: his followers had nothing to do with it, he does not condemn the act.
# me: This is what he used to say after other violent acts were committed
# me: against non-Jews.
 
# dm: I had nothing to do with the liberation of Jerusalem during the six
# dm: day war (which involved violence against non Jews).  I also do not condemn
# dm: the act.  I guess I am a racist.
 
# I supported the Six Day War, why ought I to condemn it?  If one loudly
# "doesn't condemn" something this seems to me to be indicating support.
# I always understood his "I do not condemn it" to mean "I would like to
# say I support it, but if I do I might get arrested for inciting
# violence.  So listen carefully: I (wink) do (wink) not (wink) condem
# (it) it".  Otherwise, why not say "I had nothing to do with it" -
# period?
 
	That is the point.  What the JDL did ought to have been supported.
Many former Soviet Jews can testify to that.

# me: Unlike him, I do condemn these acts.

# dm: What do you mean "unlike him"?  Because he is dead?  How do you
# dm: know what he would have dne or said.  That is a cheap shot.
 
# Why do you insist in seeing insult where there is none?  The
# difference to which I draw attention is not that he is dead and I am
# not but that extrapolating from his behavior during his life it is
# reasonable to assume that his reaction towards the violence at his
# funeral would have been "I do not condemn it" while I do.

	It is not reasonable since you did not extract from his life.
Either it was an insult, or you are speaking out of ignorance?  The
killing of a Jew in this egard is something he would have condemned.

# This path is being continued by his followers.  While I don't know who
# actually is responsible for the grenade in the Old City two days ago,
# both Kahana Chai and Kach were quoted in yestderday's papers as "not
# condemning it".  It might even be the case that neither of them had
# anything to do with it, but what I understand them to be saying is "we
# approve".

	What do you mean "quoted".  DId someone make a phone call and
claim to speak for them?

	By the way, are you the jerk (if you are not I apologize) who
claimed they showed up at the late Rabbis funeral justso they could be
a witness to vioelnce?  If so, remind the rest of us to do it at
yours, and to make sure there will be something known to provoke
(possibly planted) the violence there.
--
	There are three types of people in the world.  Those that are good
at math and those that are not.

makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Subject: Re: nothing to do with jesus of Nazareth
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 07:47:52 GMT

I want to thank Gideon for his contribution to my signature and his
excellent demonstration of how not to chas-veshalom make the mistake
of ahavat chinam.

On the other hand, I want to seriously thank Hillel Applebaum for ending
one of his articles "Adif shalom im hagolan mimilchamah bil'adav".
This is a *reasonable* response to my signature.  I even agree with
it.
-- 
/|/-\/-\          Adif tzav pinui metzav shmoneh.
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@         "Warren's slogan is an Anti-semite slogan."
/ nysernet.org 			    Gideon Ehrlich
From: ad980@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Paul S. Wolf)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Where do I go from here?
Date: 19 Nov 1992 01:32:13 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


You might also want to look into Cleveland, OH.

The Jewish Community is quite strong, 5 Conservative synagogues,
easy commuting, etc.

Paul Wolf
From: nmuller@ems.cdc.com (Nelson Muller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Religious freedom in Spain
Date: 18 Nov 92 15:31:08 GMT
Organization: Empros Systems International, a division of CDC


The following is an unauthorized copy of the Minneapolis Star Tribune newspaper,
and may be of interest to most readers of s.c.j.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saturday, November 14, 1992

Spain has declared Jews, Muslims and Protestants the legal equals of
Roman Catholics, 500 years after Queen Isabella and King Ferdinand ordered
Jews expelled.  The constitution granted religious freedom, but only
Catholics had an agreement on financial and legal rights.  Non-Catholics
now will be able to study their own theology in public schools, their
religious weddings will be recognized, and their places of worship will
have tax-exempt status.   (Page 4-A)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Does anyone know what religious freedom exists on other countries where
Inquisition took place?


Nelson Muller
nmuller@ems.cdc.com
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Subject: Re: Jewish Fundamentalism
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 00:24:46 GMT

In <1992Nov13.003405.1@vmsa.technion.ac.il> chr04ha@vmsa.technion.ac.il (Amitai Halevi) writes:

>Perhaps indeed. But then, need one stop with the Midrash?

One need not.  I'm not interested in what sort of amot Moshe was
measured in, or in what sort of days Bereshit describes.

I'll probably disappoint you however, when I tell you that I am very
much interested in the practical implications of the Jewish sources
that deal with obligations.
-- 
/|/-\/-\          Adif tzav pinui metzav shmoneh.
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@     
/ nysernet.org 			    Jerusalem
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: MASH@WEIZMANN.WEIZMANN.AC.IL (Michael Shimshoni)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Conversion Question
Date: 20 Nov 92 09:21:02 GMT
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs

In: <98287@netnews.upenn.edu>
weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener) states:

>In article <FAIGIN.92Nov18142024@soldan.aero.org>, faigin@aero (Daniel P. Faig
>>Religion (and that's what Judaism is, at the heart of it) is a matter
>>of belief.
>
>Yet another typical Reform borrowing from Christianity.

I wonder if Matthew could explain that claim of his.

Those Jews (unlike me) who are religious, be they C, O, R or whatever,
surely  base their  practices on  belief.  I  remember "vaguely"  that
Rambam  listed  13  principles  of  *belief* (does  that  make  him  a
Christian? :-) ).   If on the other hand Matthew  agrees with me, that
to  be a  Jew  does not  necessarily  mean that  one  believes in  any
religion,  than  I  still  do not  understand  how  Christianity  gets
involved.

>-Matthew P Wiener (weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu)

  Michael Shimshoni