From: v262xxve@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Timothy C Pitts)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Miami vs. ND, 1988
Date: 2 Sep 92 15:20:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Sep2.131326.13118@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, sschudt@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Susan E Schudt) writes...
#Furthermore, if you overturn one bad call (which wasn't, IMHO) in the game, you
                                            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
#have to overturn all of them.

Huh?  How could it not have been a bad call?  Either Gary fumbled and ND
recovered, Gary was down behind the first-down marker and the ball was
turned over on downs, or Gary passed the first-down marker and therefore 
gained the first down.  It may not have made a substantive difference in the
game (if one of the former two scenarios were true), but there is no way 
when only one of the scenarios I listed can be true and the ref calls them
all wrong that it is *not* a ``bad call.''  The ball was marked *beyond* the 
first-down marker (meaning a first down for Miami), and yet was said to be 
``turned over on downs'' (explicitly *not* a fumble, BTW).  Reconcile that 
with your statement above, please.

Additionally, there is no reason that because one blatant *mistake* should
be corrected that all *judgment calls* should be reversed.

#     The one that really comes to mind is Miami's 
#first touchdown - the guy (or the ball) NEVER made it into the endzone.

This is a judgment call:  on par with a personal foul call/non-call.  It
is something that without some sort of computerized system (or perhaps
an instant replay rule) we cannot always be sure of.  It is hardly on par
with the above *screw-up* by the referee.  I, too, can think of situations
where calls should have been made (e.g., the two-point conversion attempt
when the two Miami receivers were held off the line) that I don't hold to
as a reason why we lost.  If the call in question had been one of the
three calls that were possible in the situation, I would write it off as
a bad judgment call.

#  I 
#suggest that you watch the whole game again.  You will see at least five 
#terrible calls that didn't go Notre Dame's way.  These calls could have made a 
#big difference.

Perhaps you care to elaborate?  Were these hypothetical five calls *blatant*?
Was there obvious and incontrovertable evidence that they should have gone
another way?  Or were they simply poor (at least IYO) judgment calls?  The
call Jason refers to is, IMHO, on par with such major screwups in refereeing
history as the Colorado Fifth Down.  Whether it would have made a substantive
difference in the game is, just as in the Colorado case, a question that is
left to those of us that choose to argue the what-ifs to decide.

#Gee, if the refs hadn't screwed up that one call, Miami would have won...

Actually, though you might hate to admit it, this is a distinct possibility.
Miami would have tied the score with a td there.  ND was having trouble
moving the ball in the second half, and it is unlikely they would have
been capable of doing so after such a huge boost for Miami.

#Notre Dame beat Miami.  I know it's hard to accept.  Sorry.  :)

It's not hard to accept that Miami lost to ND, it's hard to accept you bozos
that attempt to paint the picture differently than what occurred.

___

Timothy C. Pitts             
Canada US Trade Center
Department of Geography
University at Buffalo        
V262XXVE@UBVMS.BITNET
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college