HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Organization: Samford University
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 20 Aug 1992 13:46:31 CDT
From:         Renee Autry <SRAUTRY@SAMFORD.BITNET>
Subject:      Questions for educators at home

Dear listmembers that are involved in education at home (or interested in this)


I am attempting to compile some information regarding the practice of home
schools (this is not official, nor to be used in any type of paper or
publication, but simply for my information).  Since I have had very little
luck finding persons involved in this in my area, I address my questions to
the listmembers that are knowledgable of the subject.  For those who do not
mind sharing their experiences, I am curious about the following:

1. What made you choose education at home over public or private education
facilites?

2. Who is the primary instructor for your children?  What, if any, is their
training?

3. Does the curriculum include most things that would be taught in an
average public high school, or are their exclusions (ie., evolution, some
books of literature, etc.)?

4. Does your child(ren) participate in extracurricular activities (music,
sports, etc.)?

Many thanks to those that respond.  In order not to fill disk space for all
the listmembers, private e-mail is preferred.

Grace and peace,

                Renee Autry (SRAutry@Samford)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 11:24:56 -0500
From:         "j.b. cormier" <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: what to do about people asking for money

I think that in Memphis(not really sure though)
that there is a program, where local businesses
give out vouchers/coupons, which local restaurants
support and co-sponsor, to their employees and customers
to give to panhandlers when asked for money
for food.  I'm not sure how well it is working, but
it is favoured by everyone I've heard talk about it.

Jason
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Date:         Fri, 14 Aug 1992 10:03:00 -0700
From:         MARK DRAKE <DRAKE@ASUCHM.LA.ASU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Did Jesus respect beliefs?
X-To:         CHRISTIA@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU

>>  a) Some believe that God is responsible for, and actively controls,
>>     everything.  God made Adam eat the fruit; God is the author and source of
>>     all sin.  I consider this blasphemous.
>
>This is an interesting straw man.  As stated, I don't agree with it.

[Sorry, I deleted the name.  I think this is from Joe]

This may be a straw man with respect to your beliefs, but it does match my
understanding of what others have said.

[Aslo, God does not cause moral evil in Job, rather causes physical "evils' -
sickness, death, disaster etc.  That God causes such things wouldn't be
considered blasphemous in the sense of a) above.]

Mark
drake@asuchm.la.asu.edu
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Date:         Fri, 14 Aug 1992 08:40:00 +1000
From:         Ken Diefenbach <DIEFENBAK@TOPAZ.UCQ.EDU.AU>
Subject:      Re: Scouting
X-To:         CHRISTIA@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU

----stuff deleted ----
Alison wrote
>
> >
> > Considering that, according to a study in England (I don't recall the exact
> > source, but American stats seem to agree) the vast majority of child
 molesters
> > are heterosexual men (usually a relative), wouldn't you be more uneasy about
> > sending your kids into the woods with a straight scoutmaster?
> >
> > -Alison

Then Joe Moore responded
> Molestation is not my only concern.  I would not want a scoutmaster
> who is a womanizer, either.  Adultery and homosexuality are both
> wrong (not according to me---according to scripture).  If someone
> openly practices either they should not be role models for our kids.
>
> Joe Moore
>
Which is saying what I wanted to say better than I did.
Thanks Joe
Ken D.
k.diefenbach@ucq.edu.au
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Sat, 22 Aug 1992 02:21:00 EST
From:         "David J. Moreau" <DMOREAU@DRUNIVAC.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Biblical meaning of church

>I'm wondering about the Biblical meaning of "church."

The Church is the body of our Lord Jesus Christ. (col 1:18)  It is
where God adds those who are being saved.  Is the Church what saves?
No, but you must be in it to be saved.  Who built the Church?  CHRIST
HIMSELF (Matt 16:18).  The chief cornerstone of the Church is none
other than our Lord Jesus Christ.  To be saved we must enter Christ
(John 10:9).  We are baptized into this one Body (I Cor. 12:13).  Are
we save by baptism?  No - for first we must hear the words of God,
and believe.  And once we are in the Church of Christ, are we assured
of salvation? No, we must endure until the end (matt 24:13), and we
must hold firmly unto the Gospel (I Cor 15:1-2).
    There is One body of our Lord Jesus Christ (Col 3:15), and thus,
ONE Church (I Cor 12:12) with many members (Rom 12:4-5).  Why is it
important to be gathered in Christ's one body?  Because it is God's
will (Eph 1:9-10).

>It seems to me that the church began at Pentecost, and that Jesus
>existed before that (even from the beginning of the beginning!)

Did it not begin when Christ Himself built it? (Matt 16:18)

>not from the church itself.)  Someone said that Christ required the
>church to (correct me if I'm misinterpreting what was said)
>enable Christ to forgive our sins.  I don't see how this can be
>the case if Christ died before the church existed and if
>the Plan was in effect even before that.

God could of had Christ do whatever God wanted.  But God already made
it law that we each die for our own sin (Deut 24:16).  But Christ did
not break this law, because He and His Church are one new man, with
Christ as the head, and the Church as the body - which is why it is
important to be in the body of Christ.  Christ saved his Church, his
body - not the world.  The world will perish.

>Christ
>did not need the church; the church needed Christ.

I agree.  But we need both.

>         ---Kerry

David Moreau
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Date:         Fri, 14 Aug 1992 14:07:29 CDT
From:         Jesse Carnes <NOTJIC@LSUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      To Dave on Absolutes

Dear Dave ;

I guess that post DID have you rattled.
However, as a proponant of the inerrant, Divinely inspiredWord of God,
let me say that your antagonists leaves a zillion epistemological questions
unanswered ... i.e., how does that guy "absolutely KNOW" for sure that HIS case
is so?

We all have starting points of faith, whether it is faith in Christ or faith
in the devil, etc.
The ultimate problem with this guy  who rattled you is that he offers no proof
for his case, nor is he ever able to do so, because only the BIBLE answers
ALL of the epistemological (HOW we know what we know for sure) questions.
He sure has not been skeptical of his ideas, but states them as ABSOLUTES.
Get the idea?
In the first place, only the Scriptures answer ALL of these "E" questions and
does so in harmony with what reality indicates.
Only the Sctiptures shows WHO man is, WHAT he is, WHY he is, WHERE he is, is
ANYONE out there?, what is GOOD and EVIL?, why do we DIE?, and so fourth.
All other faith systems but Christianity have "HOLES" in their fabric some
where.  Only the Word of Godis consistent ... and THAT, my friend, is the
ABSOLUTE, ULTIMATE "acid test" of any presupposition that one holds to by
faith.




We can talk more, if you wish to ...
In Christ;


Jesse Carnes    NOTJIC AT LSUVM... (my E-mail address)
LSU at Baton Rouge
(504) 383-8134
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Date:         Thu, 20 Aug 1992 15:59:11 EST
From:         Ian Williams <iwilliam@AU.ORACLE.COM>
Subject:      Re: They can too pray!
X-To:         CHRISTIA@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU
              at Aug 19, 92 8:37 am

>
>By the way, yoga is perfectly good, too.  A child can be taught to
>disregard the mystical parts easily and accept the healthful parts.  This
>is good training for it will teach them to discriminate between good and
>evil, something they will need to do all their lives.
>
>Dan Graham
>

Excellent idea, and while they are at it, they can get into ouija boards,
tarot cards, guided imagery, etc etc and disregard the mystical aspects
of them as well.. Of course they might not be doing a whole lot seeings
as the above list PLUS yoga is BASED on mysticism...


---------------------+-------------+-----------------------------------------
Ian Williams         |    _--_|\   |      Internet: iwilliam@au.oracle.com
Oracle Systems       |   /      \  |	  Phone	  : +61 8 239 3900
Adelaide, Australia  |   \_.--*_/  |
                     |         v   |
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 13 Aug 1992 09:41:04 CDT
From:         Joe Moore <CC19@SDSUMUS.BITNET>
Subject:      Scouting

>
> Considering that, according to a study in England (I don't recall the exact
> source, but American stats seem to agree) the vast majority of child molesters
> are heterosexual men (usually a relative), wouldn't you be more uneasy about
> sending your kids into the woods with a straight scoutmaster?
>
> -Alison
Molestation is not my only concern.  I would not want a scoutmaster
who is a womanizer, either.  Adultery and homosexuality are both
wrong (not according to me---according to scripture).  If someone
openly practices either they should not be role models for our kids.

Joe Moore
cc19@sdsumus
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Subject: Re: dates
From: comjohn@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Mr. John T Jensen)
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 20:10:23 GMT
Organization: University of Auckland, New Zealand.

Lora Harris <LHARRIS@UPEI.CA> writes:

>...The best info. I've seen on Revelations suggests that
>it wasn't written until around 90 AD.  I don't know of * any * Christian
>writings from AD 50 - most of the NT even wasn't written then.

Not EVERYone believes that.  I think, mostly on internal evidence, that
Revelation was written in the late 60's and predicts the razing of Jerusalem
70 AD.  I think the whole NT was complete before 70.  Yes, well, I COULD
look up some references and post if really pushed.  Might have to write a
letter first.  Don't think these dates are a matter of orthodoxy or
anything.  Just MHO.  None of this has anything to do with early references
to Mary (concerning which I am ignorant), just the date of Revelation.

jj

John Thayer Jensen                      64 9 373 7599 ext. 7543
Commerce Computer Services              64 9 373 7437 (FAX)
Auckland University                     jt.jensen@aukuni.ac.nz
Private Bag 92019
AUCKLAND
New Zealand
From: talaga@E5SB.OSDHW.SYR.GE.COM (dave talaga x2752)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: Is the Bible Absolute Truth?
Date: 14 Aug 92 18:55:39 GMT
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>
> Okay now.  I have been accused of being fundamentalist by many people.  But it
> is simply not true that the Bible is 100% correct in all ways.  Inerrant
> in faith and morals, maybe, but certainly not in history, or science.
>
> The Bible is not a set of logical propositional truths.  In order
> to adequately prove this I will follow up with a posting from
> talk.religion.misc containing a large number of contradictions and scientific
> errors in the Bible.
>
> We must realize the context of these books to understand them.  We cannot
> just read them with our 20th century minds and blindly apply them.  They
> were the inspired words of people writing to churches, to other people of
> the time.  The Bible is not "complete."  It does sufficiently describe
> the way to salvation.  However it doesn't tell you everything you will ever
> need to know; if you think so look forward to dying next time you don't
> get a miracle to cure your appendicitis, etc.
>
> The fact is, we do not have "Absolute Truth" (tm).  We have a set of fairly
> reliable books that we believe God was speaking through in order to
 communicate
> certain things about himself.  We must acknowledge the doubt.  Remember the
> lesson of Thomas.  We believe without 100% absolute certainty.
>
> -Ernest
>

I know this thread is dying on the net, but this post has me rattled.

If the best we can say about the bible is "it's fairly realiable," then aren't
 we in a bit of trouble?  If the power behind scripture dosn't understand things
 like science, history, et al, then how can it save us from it (after all, isn't
 all this stuff going to be replaced at some time)?  Or has the fear of God, and
 the subsequent knowledge and wisdom become subordinate to the aformentioned
 disciplines.

If it is true that the scripture, the living word of God, is in error in one
 place, then God himself is no longer perfect, His understanding of creation is
 suspect:  the consequences are astounding.   Yet, I wonder, if scripture is not
 accurate in things like history and science, how did the disciples, apostles,
 prophets or Jesus himself cure the sick and raise the dead?  How did the Flood
 come to pass? or the Red Sea part? or the 5000 get food?  How did God manage to
 bring about the historical events necessary to fulfill ancient prophecy--even
 the life and death of Christ--let alone an individuals salvation?

As for "absolute truth," I guess I'm a bit confused between that and just plain
 ordinary truth, but I suspect whatever "absolute" means that that is what Jesus
 had in mind when He said: "Iam the way and the truth and the light..."
 Afterall, isn't that the truth that we are betting our lives on?

Dave Talaga
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 21 Aug 1992 11:15:44 CDT
From:         Tom Brewer <NOTTMB@LSUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Anti-Catholicism: "Saul, Saul,

   I guess you can call this an open letter to Brad:

>Date:         Fri, 21 Aug 1992 10:18:46 CDT
>Sender:       CHRISTIA@ASUACAD
>From:         Brad Kaiser <bradk%isdgsm@RTSG.MOT.COM>
>Subject:      Anti-Catholicism: "Saul, Saul, why ..."
>To:           TOM BREWER <NOTTMB@LSUVM.BITNET>

>This is an open letter (and a very short one) to Tom Brewer, Jesse
>Carnes, Dan Graham, and anyone else who has reacted in a violently
>negative fashion to Elizabeth's posts.

"violently"????? Say, Brad, lighten up dude. You're the one making all the
conclusions here. I asked a question yesterday (Thurs); I didn't attack
anybody with some "violent" words. Today (Fri) I agreed with Dan Graham and
quoted to verses of God's Word.  Wow!

> Why don't you try a little tolerance of a differing view?  You are not
> Jesus, either.  If he didn't come into the world to condemn the
> world, why do you?

Obviously you don't have to show any tolerance of a differing view. If
someone differs with Catholicism you immediately conclude they are the
intolerant ones, and from the above it seems you can't tolerate that.

I certainly did not claim to be Jesus; please be real. Nor am I condemning
you or anyone else. Furthermore, if you truly are in Christ, there is no
condemnation for you period.

> Besides, if you open your heart and mind, you might learn something
> from what Elizabeth is saying.  God's ways are not mine, nor hers,
> nor yours.  Why are you so quick to judge?

Of course anyone disagreeing with you is close-minded even though he/she
takes the time and is open-minded enough to read your material. Right now
my friend, I think you are pretty quick on the draw to judge as well.

Tom Brewer NOTTMB@LSUVM
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Date:         Wed, 19 Aug 1992 13:43:50 EDT
From:         Bernice Tennant <U1A9A@WVNVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Drunkard/alcoholic

James or Marty,

Isn't there an incident where the diciples were asked for money and they
did they offer prayer or something?
From: A16905@ITESO.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: Q: Origin of the term "mass".
Date: 12 Aug 92 17:18:26 GMT
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Lora,

English 'mass' is equivalent to spanish/latin 'misa' The term was used at
the end of Eucharist by the first christians:

'Ite Misa est' = 'Go, Mass is finished'

I don't know the extact meaning of the word.

Shalom,
Memo.
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Date:         Mon, 17 Aug 1992 17:00:19 EDT
From:         Marty Helgesen <MNHCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Something more on Revelation

On Mon, 17 Aug 1992 13:12:02 -0500 j.b. cormier said:
>>It  was written by both !  The Holy Spirit and John.
>
>>Shalom,
>>Memo.
>
>How do you now this?
>
>The Holy Spirit hasn't rapped my knuckles yet for my position.
>
>Jason

That is not conclusive.  Many atheists will be happy to tell you
that God has not struck them down, nor even rapped their knuckles
for denying that He is exists.

Like Brad I know that the Bible is inspired by God because the Catholic
Church tells me so.  The argument that the Bible is inspired because it
says it is inspired, and we know it must be true when it says that because
it is inspired by God is circular.  (This is not to say that this is
the only argument for inspiration that non-Catholic Christians use.  I
am not discussing the others.)  The argument that the Church guarantees
the inspiration of the Bible is not the same circular argument with
the Church inserted in the circle.  It is not We know the Bible is
inspired because the Church says so, and we know the Church has the
authority to say so because the Bible say it does.  In apologetics
we prescind from inspiration and consider the Bible, especially the Gospels
and the other books of the New Testament, as ancient documents.  They tell
of a man named Jesus who did and taught various remarkable things.  The
most remarkable thing He taught was the He was God incarnate.  Catholic
apologetics then goes on to show that Jesus founded His Church as a
specific organization with the apostles as the first leaders (bishops)
and St. Peter as the first leader of the Apostles (pope).  This
Church, the Catholic Church, then uses the teaching authority given
it by Jesus to guarantee the inspiration of the Bible.  The argument is`
not a circle but a spiral.

I write this to outline the Church's approach to apologetics,
especially as regards the Bible, not to argue all of the points in it.
I am aware that non-Catholic Christians interpret the texts involved
differently.

Marty Helgesen
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Date:         Tue, 18 Aug 1992 22:55:29 EDT
Comments:     Converted from PROFS to RFC822 format by PUMP V2.2X
From:         Angela Zimmerman <AMZIMM01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU>
Subject:      Something I found in my bible

Item Retrieval Assistant, DADS
Phone: 588-6757

Ok, it wasn't *my* bible, it's my parents', but this is the one that's
closest to my computer and the one I use when I'm at home.  Anyway, I found
this in my parents' bible and thought some of you might be interested in
it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Food for Thought In Planning Your Day


The greatest sin....................Fear

The best day........................Today

The most agreeable companion........One who would not
             have you any different from what you are

The greatest deceiver.........One who deceives himself

The greatest invention of the devil.............War

The greatest secret of production.......Removing waste

The best play...........................Work

The greatest comfort................The knowledge that you have
                                    done your work well

The greatest mistake....................Giving up

The most expensive indulgence..............Hate

The cheapest, stupidest and easiest thing......Finding fault

The greatest trouble maker........One who talks too much

The greatest stumbling block..........Egotism

The worst bankrupt..........The soul that has lost it's
                            enthusiasm

The cleverest man.........One who always does what he thinks
                          is right

The most dangerous person............The liar

The greatest need................Common sense

The greatest puzzle................Life

The greatest mystery...................Death

The greatest thought.................God

The greatest thing, bar none, in the world........Love

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

There you go.  I don't necessarily agree with the whole thing, but I thought
I'd send it out for everyone.  It's rather old...it looks like it's been
sitting in this bible for many, many years.  There's no date on it.
Enjoy!
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Date:         Wed, 19 Aug 1992 11:29:06 EDT
From:         Bernice Tennant <U1A9A@WVNVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Homosexuality
              Richard.Campbell@MVS.UDEL.EDU

God bless you Rich!  I praise God for you.  You were called for his glory and
he will give you peace!
From: FACN34B@SAUPM00.BITNET (zane of daharan)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Absolute Truth
Date: 15 Aug 92 05:07:14 GMT
Organization: King Fahd University of Petroleum and Minerals, S.A.
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Jesse,

    Come on Jesse, I know you are trying to defend the Absolute Truth of
the Bible, and I commend you... but, what in the world (or heaven for that
matter) is absolute truth, other than a Person... not a thing. (Sorry, my
"question mark key isn't working on this terminal.)
    We can know Christ and not know everything about Him.  How can we know
everything (absolute) about Christ who is the Son of God when we don't even
know everything (absolute) about ourselves.
    The Bible can be absolutely true, inspired, inerrant, etc... and still
be less than the Absolute Truth.  Maybe I am misunderstanding your use of
the term absolute, eh.
                                                love you Jesse, Zane.
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Date:         Mon, 17 Aug 1992 08:17:40 EDT
From:         AISARMSTRONG%IST%VMI@IST.VMI.EDU
Subject:      Prayer Request for families of Cancer victims
X-To:         CHRISTIA@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU

I would like a moment of silence for those families who lost love ones because
of cancer.
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