From: young@serum.kodak.com
Subject: Re: Interested in Calcium ?
Originator: young@sasquatch
Reply-To: young@serum.kodak.com
Organization: Clinical Diagnostics Division, Eastman Kodak Company
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 92 00:11:07 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.060520.774@abo.fi> abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT) writes:
>
>Thanks to Michael Traub, here is some information on CALCIUM.
>
>
>BONING UP ON CALCIUM AND OSTEOPOROSIS

[...PCRM presentation deleted for brevity...]

	The following is a re-post of some information originally posted
	by Krista J. Anderson:


Hah!  I'm ready for the milk-bashers this time, pre-written for a
moment like this:
Call me neurotic, call me obsessed, but I just can't resist talking
about calcium and protein.  Ok, there is evidence that too
much protein can deplete people's calcium.  So, how much is too
much, I wonder.  Or, more obsessively, what is the nutritionally
correct ratio of calcium to protein?  So, even though I don't think
the details of calcium and protein interactions are known, I tried
to estimate some "safe" numbers.  The phosphorus column can
probably be ignored.

(for the meats below, the 1 lb is the raw weight, but the chicken
weight after cooking and deboning is much less; I included meats
since they are undoubtedly the genuine culprit in the "too much
protein per calcium" problem)

Food             mgCalcium  mgPhos Calc-Phos  gmProt    mgCalc/gmProt
1 c. oatmeal          20    178                 6          3.33
1 c. br rice(dry)     64    432                14.8        4.32
1 c. skim milk       302    247      55         8.35      36.17
1 oz cheddar         204    145      59         7.06      28.90
1 oz Swiss           272                        8.1       33.58
1 c. dry cot ch       46    151                25          1.84
1 c. 1% cot ch       138                       28          4.93
1/2 c. prtskim ricot 337                       14.1       23.90
1 oz cream cheese     23                        2.1       10.95
1 egg                 28     90                 6.07       4.61 
1 orange              52     18      34         1.23      42.28
1 c. orange juice     27     42                 1.74      15.52
1 apple               10     10                  .27      37.04
1 lb steak            42    652                71           .59
1 lb chicken,lt       13    189                20.4         .64
1 lb haddock         104    894                83          1.25
1 c. asparagus        30     84                 3.4        8.82
1 c. lentils          50    238                15.6        3.21
1 c. dry garbanzos   300    662                41          7.32
1 c. kale            206     64     142         5         41.20
1 c. spinach          51     28      23         1.8       28.33
1 c. turnip greens   267     54     213         3.2       83.44
1 c. swiss chard     106     35      71         2.6       40.77
1 c. collards        220     57     163         3.9       56.41
1 c. broccoli        136     96      40         4.8       28.33
1 c. green beans      62     48      14         2.1       29.52
1 c. bruss sprouts    50    112                 6.5        7.69
1 c. celery           47     34      13         1.1       42.73
1 c. cabbage          49     29      20         1.3       37.69
10 dried figs        269    128     141         5.7       47.19
half cantaloupe       28     45                 2.34      11.97
corn                   5    127                 5.3         .94
-----------------------------------

Since the exact "ideal" ratio of calcium to protein is not known, 
let's at least calculate an acceptable ratio.
I'll use my own calorie limit for maintenance as a sample, and the
10% of calories from protein rule, and the RDA for calcium for an
adult of 800 mg.  (Children need 1200 mg.)

   0. 14 Kcal/lb/day * 125 lbs = 1750 Kcal/day
   1. 1750 Kcalories per day x 10% calories from protein = 175 Kcal/day
   2. 175 Kcal/day / 4 Kcal per gram of protein = 43.75 gm protein/day
   3. 800 mg Calcium/day / 43.75 gm protein/day = 18.29 mgCa/gmProt
(Just for interest, 175 Kcal / 9 Kcal/gm oil = 19.44 gm oil/day)

So, probably any food over 18.29 mgCa/gmProt is an acceptable
source of calcium, if the amount of calcium is also high to begin 
with, and assuming meat isn't eaten.  Naturally there are many
other reasons for eating or not eating various foods.

In the chart above, note that the orange juice given is not the
fortified kind; specific brands may differ.  Also, I don't know
what they do to cottage cheese, cream cheese and Neufchatel to ruin
them; for me, part-skim ricotta or feta may be better than cottage
cheese despite the greater amount of fat, I think, or maybe I'll
match them 1 for 1 in my next spanokopita, blintzes, etc.
Nowadays, I think there are ricottas with even lower fat, but it
would pay to check the labels.  As for the many cheeses that I
didn't list, most follow the pattern of the cheddar and Swiss.
However, gouda had a low calcium/protein ratio but edam was high;
feta was high; parmesan was high, romano not so high; brie was very
low; camembert was still acceptable.

For the fruits and vegetables, I generally listed a selection of
those that *do* have good calcium.  Grains and beans are not good
sources of calcium, but of course remain good sources for other
nutrients.

In article <1992Aug26.181926.1918@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu>, red_trek@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:
> 1)  The kind of calcium present in milk is apparently not in the 
> best form for your body to absorb it anyway (I'm not clear on this,
> someone please follow up to this and add more info:  is it something
> to do with the lactose and the fact that 3/4's of the population
> can't absorb lactose?  What the heck does lactose have to do with
> calcium?!!).

I checked out a book about calcium and it has the following chart: 

         Calcium Interactions
Nutrient     Effect        Why
fiber          negative     decreases intestinal absorption of Ca
protein        negative     increases urinary loss of Ca
caffeine       negative     incr. urinary and intestinal loss
sodium         negative     incr. urinary loss
phosphorus     neutral      decr. urinary loss, incr. intestinal loss
certain sugars positive     incr. intestinal absorption

Conclusions are that people on high-fiber diets need more calcium
as do people on high-protein diets.  The protein interaction is due
to the by-products of breaking down proteins that are not needed
for tissue replacement, i.e. excess protein.  "One of those
breakdown products is sulfuric acid, which draws some calcium out
with it when it is eliminated by the kidney."

Eating twice the recommended protein leads to a 50% increase in
urinary calcium loss.

     Thus, if a 120-pound woman were to increase her protein intake
     from 44 to 88 grams per day (not an unusual intake in the
     United States), her urine calcium loss would increase by about
     50-60 milligrams.  If her calcium absorption efficiency were
     in the range of 25-30 percent (as it commonly is in
     middle-aged women), she would have to increase her calcium
     intake by about 200-300 milligrams (equivalent to nearly an
     extra glass of milk each day)...

The story on certain sugars, namely lactose, is that it aids Ca
absorption in certain lab animals.  However, the authors feel that
the affect of sugars on Ca absorption in humans "makes little
difference".  They also have the point of view that eating should
be fun and worrying about excruciating details, like the fact that
spinach has calcium-binding oxalate, is not recommended.

The authors also feel that the interactions with phosphorus are
also not terribly important.  They site an FDA study in 1981 that
concluded that reported calcium deficiencies were not due to the
phosphorus in soda pop, but due to the fact that the soda pop was
being substituted for calcium-containing beverages like tap water.

Finally, they defend low-fat dairy products as good food.  My
irritation with vegans who bad-rap dairy products is mainly because
of my personal tastes; I get some of my few pleasures in life from
milk and cheese.

****If there are problems with the dairy and egg industries, I'd
rather work toward making those industries less cruel to animals
instead of boycotting their products.**** 

Reference
_Calcium and Common Sense_ by Robert P. Heaney, MD and M. Janet
Barger-Lux, NY:Doubleday, 1988.