HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: vcf1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Victoria C Fike)
Subject: Re: CHAMPS: question on turn sequencing
Organization: Columbia University
Summary: small nitpick
Reply-To: vcf1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Victoria C Fike)
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 04:06:00 GMT

In article <rqlviINNhnv@caravan.ksu.ksu.edu> khise@caravan.ksu.ksu.edu (Martin Andrew Shobe) writes:
>
>In article <1992Apr6.165538.16825@ctr.columbia.edu>, vcf1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Victoria C Fike) writes:
>>In article <ro3ojINNnvp@festus.ksu.ksu.edu> khise@festus.ksu.ksu.edu (Martin Andrew Shobe) writes:
>>>
>>>In article <k6TqiB1w164w@seanews.UUCP>, caladan!seanews!monorail@seattleu.edu (Brannon Boren) writes:
>>>>
>>>>        Having the dodge end then, left the PC without the
>>>>benefit of a defensive move for a whole phase.  In the example
>>>>above, the hapless PC can be clobbered by someone after her
>>>>dex on segment 3, because she's no longer dodging.  This is
>>>>death for low speed PCs.  Letting the dodge continue gives
>>>>lower speed PCs a chance.
>>>>
>>>[stuff deleted]
>>>
>>>	No it doesn't.  She can always abort her next action to continue
>>>dodging.  Also, she can hold action to avoid having to abort in the first
>>>place.  
>>
>>No she *can't* abort.  She's already performed an action in that segment.  Held
>>phases and aborts notwithstanding, YOU CANNOT PERFORM TWO ACTIONS IN ONE 
>>SEGMENT!!  
>>
>She only performs two actions in the same segment if she aborts and her next
>action occurs in the same segment as her abort.  Otherwise the abort occured 
>in a previous segment and the one action per segment is NOT violated.

I know.  But the example given indicates that the character went in Seg. 3,
chose to dodge, and was then fired at by a lower dex, *in Seg. 3*.  Hence,
my statement....	

>Khise@matt.ksu.ksu.edu

Tori

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Victoria C. Fike                    |   "I heard a murmuring in the night
vcf1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu         |    Black swords hanging cold as ice
"If you have to be a hero, always   |    Will they lead me to Paradise?"
remember what the word hero means." |       --Hawkwind, "Song of the Swords"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: bret@technix.mn.org (Bret Indrelee)
Subject: Re: AD&D:  So what happens when ...
Organization: Technix Inc., St. Paul, MN, USA
Distribution: world,local
Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1992 23:55:34 GMT

[ Lots of posts on eatting a riding critter summoned by mount spell. ]

Most everyone says that eatting a horse summoned is a bad thing.

I would personally rule differently.  Instead, some poor unfortunate
horse owner has completely lost (rather than the horse running away
and returning) his horse.

There is nothing that says the mount summoned is not real.  It is just
as valid to rule that the mount was a real horse.  It came from somewhere,
just like the critters from Summon Monster or Summon Animal, and goes
back there after the duration is complete.

Supporting evidence is found under the third level spell, where it
mentions first level characters having suddenly disappeared caused
by a high level mage casting the summon monsters spell.

These are summoning spells, they don't have to be magical creations.

-Bret

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bret Indrelee		    |	Howe's Law:
email: bret@technix.mn.org  |	Everyone has a scheme that will not work.
I am not an employee of Technix, nor do I represent them in any way.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com (Brian Brunner)
Subject: Re: AD&D:  Dual Class Limits
Reply-To: brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com (Brian Brunner)
Organization: Space Systems/Loral
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 01:02:39 GMT

1st  ed players handbook talks about dual class, then (in Bard)
shows a three-class dual-class character class
	yup, I wrote it right
a three-class character class, whose progression path is
patterned on the dual-class rules.
Now...
Nowhere does it say that two (or three) is the limit.
It is called "Dual Class", because "Multi-Class" was taken.
Bard is a character class following the pattern of the dual class
that is a three-class dual-class character class.

So...
Starting off Fighter (good place to start, got to get to 5th
	 not more than 9th)
Switching to Monk   (to learn to master myself,
	got to get to 7th, not more than 11th)
Switching to Priest  ( found that Worship of Diety was necessary to
		experience Power to accomodate
		self-mastery, got to get to 9th,
		not more than 13th)
Switching to Mage (because God was stingy with the Power)
is a description for the Egoist class. Has to be lawful, has to abide
Monk property ownership limits. Never tried one. Never needed
this class to play an egoist. It comes natural.

2nd edition explicitly states that there is no limit to the number or
combinations of classes providing you got the stats and don't have
conflicting class requirements like Monk Barbarian or Druid
Paladin or Bard  Paladin.

So I rest my case.

--
HELP!! Somebody slapped a "stop payment" on my sanity check!!
brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com; Space Systems/Loral; Palo Alto, Calif.
Black Holes... the /dev/null of the Universe; the opinion of 65534.
From: steph@cs.uiuc.edu (Dale Stephenson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: AD&D Char Death < GURPS Char Death
Date: 10 Apr 92 00:40:10 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL

In <122920006@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> dlc@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Dennis Clark) writes:

>steph@cs.uiuc.edu (Dale Stephenson) writes:
[snip]
> 
>> TFT characters are extremely easy to lose to death.  That's why _Melee_
>> makes a better board game than RPG.
>  
>  I thought that Melee _was_ a board game?

It is.  TFT makes Melee (and Wizard) into a RPG.
(It's a darn fun boardgame too!)
--
Dale J. Stephenson |*| (steph@cs.uiuc.edu) |*| Gigabit Study Group 

  "It is considered good to look wise, especially when not 
   overburdened with information" -- J. Golden Kimball
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: mikec@jpl-devvax.jpl.nasa.gov (Mike Civita)
Subject: Re: ADND2: Help with Dual-Class
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory (NASA)
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 17:49:18 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.032919.3494@watserv1.waterloo.edu> alongley@cape.UWaterloo.ca (Allan Longley) writes:
>In article <1992Apr4.205331.27142@nevada.edu> wildcard@nevada.edu 
>( WildCard !!) writes:
>
>>My problem:
>>	There is a character who wishes to be dual-classed.  He has all the
>>	requirements met, but I don't understand something.  It says in the
>>	PHB that duals only get their hit points and statistics carried over.
>>	What about weapon and non-weapon proficiencies? 
>
>You've missed something that will help here.  For abilities that overlap,
>the character uses the better of the two.  So, for initial non-weapon
>proficienies (NWP), if the second class had more initial NWP then the
>character would gain the extra NWP, but could only take these extra
>proficiencies from the catagories appropriate to the new class.  For
>example, say the first class recieved 3 NWP and the new class got 4 NWP,
>then the character would get 1 more NWP.  This is also important for things
>like THAC0, the better THAC0 is used -- which THAC0 this is may change with
>level increases in the second class.  Also for spells, for example, a bard 
>switching to a mage would not be able to cast an extra first level spell
>until (s)he had more first level slots through mage advancement than bard
>advancement.  This rule (which is in the PH) sorts out a lot of the
>dual-classed headaches.  Hope this helps.

Dual class means you advance as a single class PC until you decide that
you are tired of being say, a fighter, and you have a calling from Ghod
and you'd like to join the preisthood. Your advancement in fighter stops,
and you start over in the new class, with a new  thac0, (in this case) no
weapon specializations, and basically, stop being a fighter and immerse
youself in your clerical reality. I know, you might ask, "how come I must
fight so poorly (thac0) when I fought so well before?" to which I, the DM,
would reply, "Your chuch demands that youi study fighting under their
weaponsmaster as part of your initiation, and learn our style of fighting,
using blunt weapons." Thin, but semi-plausible. I don't let ANY abilities
from the old class (w/ the possible exception for NWP) carry over, ESECIALLY 
the thac0. Only hit points (hitdice) are carried over, until the PC reaches
equal level in both classes, THEN they get full access to all their abilities 
in both classes. Why make it too easy on them, after all, how many first
level fighters have a mace+2, magical platemail, and 73 hitpoints?;-);-)

Mike

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: jwtlai@jeeves.waterloo.edu (Jim W Lai)
Subject: Re: SRUN: Silenced weapons
Keywords: None... its' silenced!
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 03:55:50 GMT

In article <kuou72INNchs@phakt.usc.edu> soholt@phakt.usc.edu (Timothy Soholt) writes:
>In article <1992Apr15.082324@kazoo.ssd.loral.com> 
>brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com (Brian Brunner) writes:
>>4: An automatic makes noise *without* a cartrige being fired...
>>    that damned noise is distinctive! Also, automatics work
>>    automatically by metal being spammed around by supersonic
>>    gas. The best method I know (Danger, Will Robinson! Wild
>>    Ignorance approaching rapidly on collision course!) is to use
>>    and automatic with the gas-drive welded shut... you reload
>>    by cocking the thing by hand.

Basically turn it into a single-shot, isn't that?  I've found hand-cocking
a pistol to still cause noise.  I would imagine that many "stock" automatic
designs might not load reliably if cocked too slowly.  I assume you're simply
operating the slide by hand in order to feed the next bullet.  And you still
have to worry about brass if you're dealing with "old-fashioned" cased rounds.

>Hmm. Then how would the nifty ol' Beretta Model 70 from the Street
>Sam catalog work? Maybe an electric cartridge-loading system? A
>small battery pack in the (specially designed, costs extra) maga-
>zine could provide the power. And of course, it being a closed
>system, you'd have to vent the chamber every once in a while.

With an electric system you'd still have to drive a motor to load the pistol.
Ultimately it has to drive a mechanical feed-mechanism, presumably at less
speed (and thus sound?) than the purely-mechanical system.  They may have added
extra parts to the pistol in order to dampen the sound of the round being
fed in the chamber as well.

I think we're forgetting that caseless ammunition is commonplace in SR, so
some of our assumptions don't apply, e.g. you don't need to cycle the slide
the same way since you don't have to eject any brass after firing a shot.
Caseless ammunition allows the system to be closed, without venting.  The
engineers of the real H&K G11K2 (caseless ammunition) apparently have solved
the problem of "cook-off", i.e. bullets going off prematurely due to heat.
And it'll only have gotten better by 2050.

This is all meaningless if we're talking about situations where the ambient
noise level is sufficient to cover the cycling of an automatic.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu (Chris Siebenmann)
Subject: Re: SRUN Second Edition
Organization: Ziebmef home away from home
Date: 15 Apr 92 17:26:33 GMT

jwtlai@jeeves.waterloo.edu (Jim W Lai) writes:
| And I prefer my grunts with high int and will.  (Well, ok, I prefer
| them with top priority stats.  The rest can be made up for later, if
| he/she lives.)

 Starting razorpeople have no edge but this, longterm. And *everything*
else can be made up, with time; stats are forever. Buy them when you
can, especially for people who are going to be using them a lot.
Personally, I think this distorts the character creation system a lot;
I'd rather figure out some appropriate costs or limits for long-term
characteristic raising than clip it at one increase per stat.
 
| Oh, sure he's not cybered much, but it's a nasty surprise for mages
| who assume he's got no will cuz he's not shooting sparks.

 Unless you go wild on alpha and beta grade stuff or very high cost
gear (like high levels of skillwires), there's a fairly low limit on
how much money one can spend on useful cyberware. I haven't done a
character building attempt recently, but I believe that priority 3 tech
(400k nuyen) is enough.

--
"The Law of Software Development and Envelopment at MIT:

 Every program in development at MIT expands until it can read mail."
		- greg@math.berkeley.edu
cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu	           ...!{utgpu,utzoo,watmath}!utgpu!cks
From: rhr9081@hertz.njit.edu (Ray Rich)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Color Me Clueless
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:05:49 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.


	Well, color me clueless.  Sorry everybody, but I must have fallen
for every single April Fool's Joke on this group.  I apologize to anyone to
whom I sent mail regarding the pranks in question.  If there's a sucker born
every minute, I got dibs on 11:47 pm Nov. 2, 1972.
					    Clueless,
						Ray
					aka Raythrax
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: smayo@wang.com (Scott Mayo)
Subject: Thanks for story review
Organization: Wang Labs, Lowell MA, USA
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 92 18:16:33 GMT

Thanks for all the folk who read my story and offered commentary on it
(too many of you to list). I appreciate the effort.

The story, uncut, reflecting the changes and suggestions made by some of
you, is still available under my mail daemon; set the subject line to
    @daemon info story
to get it. This is the uncut, 10,500 word version. The DRAGON wants
fiction to run to less than 8,000 words, so I have some serious cutting
to do... The cut version, which will change (and shrink) every few days is
available via a subject line of
    @daemon info cutstory
Again, if you take copies of these stories, it is strictly for review
purposes -- no one will buy a story that has already been released 
somewhere else -- and you agree not to keep it permanently or distribute it.

People with suggestions on what to cut are encouraged to write me
directly.
--
These are only my opinions.  You should hear my convictions.
smayo@wang.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: jjohnson@ccscola.Columbia.NCR.COM (Jeff Johnson)
Subject: Re: Herb List Needed
Organization: NCR CCSD, Columbia, SC
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 92 14:46:18 GMT

In article <1992Apr14.085808.18288@odin.diku.dk> klaus@diku.dk (Klaus Ole Kristiansen) writes:

>vanhalewyns@ccc.govt.nz writes:

>>Hi there all you fine upstanding citizens.
>>I'm aftr a list of herbs for roleplaying games, anybody know where I can
>>pick up some such thing.

>If you want a detailed list made for roleplaying, I recommend
>Character Law/Campaign Law. It has a list of herbs, whith prices,
>terrain found, rarity and effect. The effect is listed for Rolemaster,
>but should be easy to convert to any system. As for prices, one
>Rolemaster silver piece is about two AD&D gold pieces.

>Klaus O K

Also, the little-used role-playing game called Powers & Perils (from Avalon
Hill, I believe) had a very long list of "natural" magic items, including
herbs, gems, animal items (wolfskin, dragon's blood), etc.  The game system
left a lot to be desired, and the stats given would be difficult to convert
systematically.  But for ideas, it's a good sourcebook.  I also prefer their
treasure-generating system to AD&D (1st ed.)'s.

e-Mail me if you'd like more info (or I'll post if other people want info
on P&P).

--
Jeffrey H. Johnson
jjohnson@ccscola.columbiasc.ncr.com

		"More human than human is our motto."
			-- Dr. Eldon Tyrell
From: brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com (Brian Brunner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: AD&D 2ed. Weapon Specialization
Date: 7 Apr 92 07:07:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: kazoo.1992Apr7.000727
Reply-To: brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com (Brian Brunner)
Organization: Space Systems/Loral

The Official Rules and Our House Rules vary...
but if the Official Rule is that only one weapon can be specialized in,
that means just onee. If that is free we are talking about granting
a free weapon proficiency slot (or two if you choose bow).
But not two weapon specialzations.

We allow double specialzation from Unearthed Arcana and specialization
in as many weapons as you care to, if you are JUST a fighter.
Choose your milage. Its' in the rules.

--
HELP!! Somebody slapped a "stop payment" on my sanity check!!
brunner@kazoo.ssd.loral.com; Space Systems/Loral; Palo Alto, Calif.
Black Holes... the /dev/null of the Universe; the opinion of 65534.
From: fts5792@zeus.tamu.edu (SRONCE, FRANK T)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: "Rules of the Shadow" in Amber RPG
Keywords: amber
Date: 16 Apr 92 07:43:00 GMT
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

>>	I was wondering about how various shadow specific rules affected
>>Amberites. I know that Amberites will adjust to varied time streams. (I.E. If
>>Arthur, prince of Amber, goes to a world where the time is 1/2 that of Amber,
>>he slows to their time rather than seeing everyone walk arround slowly. Magic
>>and Tech also work on various levels in various shadows.
>>
>>	Some worlds have more esoteric "rules" that are followed in their
>>shadow. For those that play the TORG RPG, they are best expressed as World
>>Rules. Would a rule that "Everyone in the Shadow Speaks Backwards" affect an
>>Amberite. Or "Everyone in the Shadow acts in a Theatrical Manner." I believe
>>that they would. What are other opinions?
> 
>Hmm....  I think this is apples and oranges, actually.  Differences in time flow
>are fundamental physical laws, and the Amberites adjust for it.  Funky patterns
>of speech and action are psychological/social laws, and I would think that they
>would not affect Amberites, though the local would think the Amberites to be
>insane and, possibly, vice versa.
> [deletia]
>esper@ima.umn.edu
>Lochinvar of Amber, Prince and Heir of Terolon

In your TORG system, "funky patterns of speech and action" may be required by
the local laws of physics. The locals would have difficulty conceiving of 
anything that could violate those laws, and would not be able to produce one.

For instance, you could argue that our Earth has a World Law that "No one can
ever be COMPLETELY good or completely evil."  We can just barely conceive of 
such a person, but you won't find one. (of course, some people will argue that
I'm wrong, and that completely evil people DO exist; I just don't believe it)

A completely evil being from another world might find itself experiencing 
moral qualms if it were moved to our world. (see the Fish Police comic book 
series for a good example of what happens to "stereotypical" heroes and villains
when they suddenly gain free-will)

Of course, many people simply HATE the idea of things like morals being 
restricted by natural law. Certainly, the concept never appears in the Amber
series, at least not that I've noticed. 

The only real value to the World Laws is that they are necessary to produce 
"genre universes" that aren't consistent with the real world. A "Dick Tracy", 
the heroes are always noble, the girls are always innocent, and the villains
are all hideous universe just isn't compatible with our universe unless you
have World Laws or some-such to make it feasible.

Major Kiz
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: bh967@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Greg Weller)
Subject: Lich Killing Advice Needed
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, (USA)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 92 11:45:01 GMT


Our party seems to be in a *whole* lot of trouble and I was
hoping that someone could e-mail me some ideas.  Here's the
situation-there's 5 of us, all around 5th level.  We just got
through an adventure where we seriously pissed off a Lich--and
a psychotic one at that--of about 2oth level or so.  Our DM told
us that he only would have played with us a little bit, until we
got the idea to steal all his spell books and spell components
and trash his magical lab and throw holy water over everything...
now he's really mad.  Anyone got any good ideas about how to
kill a lich?? We were thinking of having a fire sale and selling
off all of his magical stuff to raise enough money to hire an
NPC wizard to help us...we figured that he was already mad at us,
so what if he even gets madder because we're selling his stuff...

Thanks in advance,

Greg <somewhere in the multiverse with a pissed-off lich at his 
heels>

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
From: huesmann@wam.umd.edu (Joseph Edward Huesmann)
Subject: AD&D2 Stuff For Sale
Originator: huesmann@rac2.wam.umd.edu
Organization: University of Maryland at College Park
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 03:34:51 GMT


Hi. I'm selling some of my 2nd Ed. AD&D books. I have most of the hard
bound books and sourcebooks. If there's something you'd like, please
e-mail me. They're all in like-new condition. Thanks for any offers!

Joe
huesmann@wam.umd.edu
From: engjs@wombat.newcastle.edu.au (James Smith)
Subject: HELP: Games Trivia Needed
Organization: University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 23:11:08 GMT

Some time ago Steve Jackson Games (I think--I could very well be
wrong) published a book listing errors that have appeared in various
games.  One such error that was discussed in detail last year allowed
that two pedestrians colliding head on in Car Wars had a very good chance
of killing each other. I do not know the name of the book, and while
I would dearly love a copy, I do not have access to one. I am currently
editing a newsletter for our local Gamers Society, and the next issue will
highlight our Trivia Night.  To this end I am looking for snippets of
trivia to scatter throughout the newsletter, and quotes from this book
would fit the bill admirably. If anyone reading this has a copy of
this book, could you please skim it for say the ten best entries and
email them to me?  I will collate any replies I get and post them to
the net after the newsletter is published.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Jim
-- 
James J Smith             | One of the biggest obstacles to the future
School of Engineering     | of computing is C. C is the last attempt
Newcastle University      | of the high priesthood to control the
engjs@cc.newcastle.edu.au | computing business. It's like the scribes
--------------------------+ and the Pharisees who did not want the
masses to learn to read and write.                  -- Jerry Pournelle
From: jacobus@symphony.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp
Subject: Re: GURPS Spellcasting question
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:42:52 GMT
Reply-To: jacobus@symphony.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Organization: Purdue University

In article <1992Apr10.061712.18320@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> npb41275@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Noah Ban) writes:
>
>  I have a question about Spell-casting in GURPS.  Some non-Enchantment
> spells need an outrageous amount of mana to cast--e.g. Resurrection (300!).

>Well, you get the picture.  My questions is, is there any way I'm missing
>for a single PC to cast powerful spells like that, no even after years
>of learning the spell?  What about spells with 30-50 mana cost or so?
>
I believe that was the intent.  Some spells simply CANNOT be cast, under the
book rules, by a single character.  Whether or not this is the case in
an individual campaign is 100% up to the GM.  I, myself, do not allow this.

Some magicks are just too great for a single being to perform, no argument,
no possibility of argument.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp