Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Sergiu Celibidache
From: dgold@basso.actrix.gen.nz (Dale Gold)
Date: 5 Sep 92 01:09:52 PST
Organization: New Zealand Symphony Orchestra

Quoted from <1992Sep2.180530.15315@spang.Camosun.BC.CA> by dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker):
> In article <CB.92Aug31115103@tamarack13.timbuk> cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster) writes:
> >
> >I've been interested in Celibidache mainly because of his reputation.
> >(His uncompromising image always makes his name look to me like a
> >cognate of "celibate", though I doubt his asceticism goes in that
> >direction.)  So what recordings *do* exist, to give us a sense of why
> >he's so revered?
> 
> Hardly any. he had a dreadful experience recording the Brahms Violin
> Concerto (with Ida Haendel) in around 1956 for SMI I think, and vowed
> never to return to the studio again, and I don't believe he has. 

I have to laugh.  I just played with Ida Haendel a few weeks ago, and we're
talking about one difficult woman!  Violinistic qualities aside, when we
were trying to fly out of Wellington in horrific weather conditions, she
caused a great uproar amongst the airline staff when she insisted on a
*private bed* at the airport to have a nap while hundreds of stranded
travellers waited in the airport.  When we finally got onto a plane and
were about to leave, she decided that the aircraft was not suitable and
terrorised the crew insisting to be let off just as the plane was about to
take off.

Could it be that the unusual career of the legendary Celibadache was begun
as a result of an experience with this unusual woman? :-) :-)

> There are a fair number of 'pirate' live recordings around. 

I refrained from responding to earlier postings due to a lack of facts.  I
was surprised to see a list of his recordings since I thought that he
refused to record at all.  It seems that he has refused to record since
sometime in the 50's and that there are pirate recordings available cince
then.

> The set of
> Brahms Symphonies with the RAI Turin (?) orchestra from around 1959/60
> is 'interesting', but shows that even *he* couldn't get every
> orchestra to play well. 

Even HE?  Look, a good conductor can stand in front of a good orchestra 
and give a wonderful performance of a Brahms symphony with an hour or two
of rehearsal.  A good orchestra knows the piece at sight, and a good
conductor (having good technique, musicality and the strength of his/her
musical convictions) can produce real magic in a very short space of
rehearsal time.  The musicians know their parts, they know how to play
together, and they can respond quickly to a conductor's intentions on the
spot.

Celibadache has certainly got the strength of his convictions working for
him.  He's also got financial realities working against him:  very few
orchestras can afford to pay the bills for 20 rehearsals of a standard
work.  Don't forget that we are only looking at roughly 1/3 of a concert
here...  London orchestras routinely consider an hour or maybe two to be
sufficient for just about anything.

I have read wonderful reviews of a concert he did with the Curtis Institute
of Music Orchestra in New York some years ago which the hardened NY critics
said was far better than that of the same work by the Vienna Phil in the
same month.  But we are looking at a group of young performers who by
definition are extraordiinary, and who by the fact that they are nearly all
less than 20 years old, have not had much experience with the works
performed.  Compared to a great orchestra that may be tired from jet-lag,
over-work and other considerations which the critics don't know about.

Do Celibadache fans think that orchestral musicians are stupid?  Let's
grant him 20 hours to prepare Brahms 1st.  Surely his ideas about Brahms
will be clear to the musicians by now.  How long will he need for the 2nd?
10? 5?  How long will he need for the 3rd?  5?  2?  What is the audience
doing in the meantime?  Off to a Michael Jackson concert, I guess :-)

In spite of this, Celibadache is one conductor I would dearly love to work
with, if only to put this into perspective...

Cheers,
Dale
--
- dgold@basso.actrix.gen.nz
- Korokoro, New Zealand