From: gal502@huxley.anu.edu.au (Graeme Lindsell)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: RQ: illusions
Followup-To: rec.games.frp.misc
Date: 12 Jan 1993 05:53:16 GMT
Organization: Australian National University
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.36.92

In article <loren.241@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu>, loren@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu
(Loren Miller) wrote:
 
> My real problem is with other uses of illusions which are common in the 
> literature and folklore. For instance, say someone who can cast visual 
> illusions wants to hide behind a closed door, and conceal the door so it 
> looks like part of the wall. It would require about 18 points for the size 
> of the doorway (an 18 Size person can fit through it) and an intensity of 10 
> to appear opaque. Total cost is 27, requiring 27 free int to manipulate this 
> spell, or very powerful and expensive spell matrices, plus lots of magic 
> points somewhere. On the other hand, in D&D it's a level 2 spell and in 
> other games it's always a cheap effect.

 I agree, the current point costs are way too high for both sorcery
and divine magic. I wonder if the designers had bad experiences
with the Phantasmal force spells in D&D, which could be very
powerful or almost useless depending on the interpretation
of the short description, and decided to make the RQ illusions 
much more carefully defined. I also wonder whether the current
rules were ever playtested, given the recent relevations about the
shaman rules. As a player, I've never been tempted to play an
illusionist, either as a sorcerer or as a priest.
 
> >both the divine and sorcery _generic_ illusion
> >spells are extremely flexible and extremely powerful,
> 
> Please give me examples of powerful uses of generic illusion spells which 
> don't require at least 20 points of intensity and/or multispell (which 
> is supposedly a rare skill).
> 
 Where does it say that Multispell is rare?

 And no, I can't think of any cheap, powerful uses of generic spells. This
is a pity, since I think illusions are a very "magical", evocative ability
for a magician to have: qualitatively different from the various blasts and
lightning bolts that some people think magical. Deception and subtlety are
qualities I like magicians (even genuine ones) to have, but in most games
they are just used are subtitutes for technology.

 In my previous post in this thread, I proposed (rather off the top 
of my head, and it showed) a hallucination spell for sorcery. I
have since recalled the Trickster Hallucination spell, which allows
the caster, and no-one else, to see the illusions. I later realised 
that few games distinguish between illusions that are "real" (call 
them images), and those that take place in the mind of the victim
(hallucinations). RQ illusions are just the first type - essentially
solid holograms. D&D and The Fantasy Trip have illusions that are
an undefined mixture of the two ( they affect every viewer but can
be "disbelieved" ). How do other games deal with this? I have ICE,
GURPS and Torg but can't recall since I don't play them often. Can
you think of mythical illusionists and their abilities. The
only one I could think of was casting hallucinations, since only
some people in a group could see them.

 If you have both types in the game, they would have quite different
qualities. The hallucination would have to be cast on a particular
victim or group, and have a saving throw (MP vs. MP in RQ). The image
would need a lot more power to give it multiple properties (vision,
sight, solidity) but has no saving throw.  


 Here is my Hallucination spell after a bit more thought:

Hallucination (Ranged, Temporal, Active/Passive)

This spell allows the caster to controls the victim's sensory
experiences depending on the intensity of the spell. The caster
must overcome the victim's MP, and the effect is determined by 
matching the intensity versus the POW (not MP) of the victim:

i) Intensity more than 10 points lower than targets POW: No 
   effect.

ii) Intensity greater than POW -11 but less than POW - 5: The
caster may change the appearance of a single object/person. The
size/mass may be doubled/halved, as can the appearance of a 
person. The particular object to be affected by the spell must
be decided when the spell takes effect. The hallucination must
still be recognizable as the original object i.e. it might be
a little, ugly person, but its still the same person. With
active concentration the caster can vary the hallucination after
it is cast, but it will remain on the same object.

iii) POW -5 <= Int <= Pow +5: Can create a single completely
illusionary object/person, or can completely change the 
appearance of an existing object/person. Active concentration 
is needed to change the particular hallucination or to keep
it moving ie if the hallucination is of a horrible broo, active
concetration is needed to make it attack: otherwise it will
remain frozen in its last position.

iv) Int > Pow + 5: Can totally control the victims sensory
input. This can include simply turning off all sensory input
for the duration of the spell.

 Note that this spell affects all the victime senses, unlike 
illusion spells. If the last effect seems to powerful, calculate
the MP needed: 18 for a typical (POW 12) victim. Put into a 
Venom spell, the same magic points will kill the victim stone dead.

 Disbelief: the victim will behave as if the hallucination is real
unless given some reason to disbelieve ie someone shouting 
"What Broo?". If given a reason, an INTx3 roll will allow the victim
to realise the hallucination is unreal,and act accordingly, but won't
make the vision dissappear.  This roll may be altered if the
vision is very convincing or unbelievable. ("What's the Crimson Bat
doing Pameltela?").How distracting the vision is is left to  
the GM's discretion, and  the effort of the caster. The hallucination 
does no direct physical damage.

Optional Rule: While the victim is asleep the intensity is increased
by five for determining its effect. This allows one to manipulate
dreams. The hallucination won't be remembered unless the victim was
actually dreaming while the hallucination was in effect. This might 
be too useful ("A message from Orlanth! Ralzakark is not evil! This
is just bad press spread about by the Lunars").

You can do whatever you like with this. I can't stop you.


> +++++++++++++++++++++++23
> Loren Miller              LOREN@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu
> Time am I, wreaker of the world's destruction, matured, grimly
> resolved here to swallow up the worlds.             -- Krishna

Graeme Lindsell a.k.a gal502@huxley.anu.edu.au
Research School of Chemistry,
Australian National University
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc