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From: gdavis@CCWF.CC.UTEXAS.EDU(Grant R. Davis)
Reply-To: torg@MORTICIA.CNNS.UNT.EDU(Torg Mailing List)
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To: torg@MORTICIA.CNNS.UNT.EDU
Subject: Re: Infiniverse #27
Cc: @ccwf.cc.utexas.edu

QUIT
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: oakes@nmt.edu (David Oakes)
Subject: Re: Mechanical repair
Organization: New Mexico Tech
Distribution: alt.games.torg
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 17:38:25 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.174714.7762@zia.aoc.nrao.edu> jogle@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim)) writes:
>In article <mumble> bchoinsk@nyx.cs.du.edu (Burton Choinski) writes:
>>The realm runner template gives scholar (Mechanic, but there is no
>>indication of how this is used.
>Which is of course why they say you use the appropriate vehicle skill
>to repair the vehicle (I remember that this was mentioned in the
>rulesbook so I have no idea of what use Scholar (Mechanic) is.)

yes, any repairs (from changing a tire to replacing a wing) are made
with the appropriate vehicle skill
(and a damn good thing that land vehicles is unskilled use,
 considering the way WEG goes through tires in the LL...)

i would assume that scholar(mechanic) is purely the book learning
on how to repair things, without the practical applications
(a high land vehicle skill with no scholar would know how to fix a car,
 but couldnt name a single part under the hood.  a high scholar
 could identify the problem blindfolded, but couldnt fix it)
(dont you just love binary skill systems?)
(one thing we have done in the past, is that if two complementary skills
 could both be used in a situation - NON COMBAT - then the skill adds
 combine according the the rules for combining)

as for "are there parts?" obviously this is dependant on the situation,
with nothing in the LL, but maybe nothing primative enough in the CPapacy 
(if it is important, require a connection or legwork -
 if not, just let it happen, and say time passes)

>I actually haven't had to use these rules yet so I don't know how well
>they work, but I guess I could always damage the party's car and see
>how it goes....

you do and you'll be sorry (im Prated - i can commit an evil act)

Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: jogle@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim))
Subject: Re: Burnt Out GM who needs help with New Adventure IDEAS
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Socorro NM
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 06:15:58 GMT

Brian writes:

>	As a GM who has been gming Torg every week since the Aysle sourcebook
>has came out I have now hit the point....  What do you run after you run every
>west end game adventure(even the bad ones)?????

Do you have the "Cassandra Files" module-thing?  It's got a lot of
ideas in it.  And there's always the option of stealing from other
sources (comic books are good for the Nile, AD&D modules can be
converted to Aysle adventures, bad martial arts movies can lead to
unusual Nippon adventures, etc).

>	What is even worse I can almost never run anything out of the 
>Infiniverse for when you GM a fellow GM (B. Schomburg who is finaly getting
>some of his stuff published in the infiniverse, yeah!!) who gets the
>infiniverse I can't very well use it........

That is a bit of a problem (and if he's got "Cassandra Files" that
kind of kills that idea too).

What's he getting published in Iverse?

>	If you have some adventure that you have run or thought of just send to
>me or send it up to the list I think most people would enjoy the ideas...
>
>	PLEASE HELP A BURNT OUT GM.  DONATE AN IDEA TO THE BURNT OUT TORG GM
>FUND.  YOUR IDEA COULD SAVE A LIFE...

Save a life?  I guess I'd better do the Good (tm) and Honorable (tm)
thing and get some story ideas posted soon.

Um, your GM friend doesn't read this newsgroup or subscribe to the
mailing list, does he?  That could invalidate any ideas that people
post!  

>To players:What ever you do make sure that your GM never send in a section of 
>your campaign as a rumor... What happens when your group's activity(ok ok West
>End Game changed a few words so it sound totaly evil instead of questionably 
>evil) that took a month to create was sent into the Inferverse that happed a 
>few months before turns out to be false(okay okay it is 18 not totaly false it
>still has a month left...) I just can't imagine why anybody vote down an 
>island created by a Weird Scientist and an Occultist...  "Island of Doom" I
>don't think we created that name ;-).

Hey, at least you got your rumor published!  They've completely blown
off mine so far....  8-(

-- 
Kansas Jim (Jim Ogle, TORG guru)                               /|
jogle@aoc.nrao.edu (NRAO-VLBA, Socorro New Mexico)           o| |-
"I'd be apathetic if I cared."                              /| \|
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: agreene@mta.ca
Subject: Reality Storms
Reply-To: agreene@mta.ca
Organization: Mount Allison U, Sackville, N.B. Canada 
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 18:27:40 GMT

Aye, yes, it's another question from me.  Anyway, I've another problem
in Torg (though this is just minor).  When invoking the Everlaw of One
and creating a reality storm, a SK in his home cosm gains a +2 to 
his Reality checks, right?  What if he was in another cosm, but before
invoking the storm the SK created a Reality bubble:  would he then
gain the home cosm advantage.  My players tried this on me, and I
was not quite certain what to do.

While I've got your attentions, I might as well ask about tapping
eternity shards.  One of my players insists that he can spend a
posibility while tapping a shard.  Does one gain extra rolls from
posibilities and for Up results when trying to tap?  In the above
instance, a player generated a damage total of 118 with his sword,
reducing a dragon to a pile of tiny, bloody bits of spam.  He did this
by spending the possibility and a Hero card (while on an Up result) on
the tapping, and he gained about 7 possibilities from it; the next
round (after a Core Earther used his Seize Initiative to keep the
Up result), he spent the 7 possibilities and a Drama card.  The effects
were incredibly dramatic, but certainly not clean.  I actually do
not frown on this use of tapping a shard (though the shard's never
been the same since           tommorro
(oops, scratch that last line)
been quite the same since losing nearly half it's possibilities).
However, I would like to get a more educated opinion on whether this
move is legal.
From: clay@vortech.com (Clay W. Luther)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: A Yawn and a Stretch
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:38:55 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b


Morticia is once again kicking and alive and the list software appears to
be none the worst (of course, the list manager sends silly test requests to
the Torg list and not the Requestor...go figure).

The Black Marble Wombat has patiently tracked down and utterly obliterated
the four Nile Mathemagicians who were responsible for the temporary
interuption in communication.  It was also so kind as to leave the guts,
neatly piled, on the doorstep this morning.  Nevertheless, without
Huntingdon's Philostonizer and a six pack of gum, Blake Johnson would never
had ever had a chance against the four moogladomes which popped out from
behind the low car door.  He remember at that very moment the story of the
Ancient Priests of Bag-Zhai, who, during special times of the year, would
create boxes made of the tender wet bones of freshly killed adolescent
males.  The boys would be lead to the top of a giant tree which looked much
like a great phallus, where a vine was looped around their neck.  Stripped
naked, the boys would then be pushed off the phallus-tree falling almost to
the ground, at which time the vine would come tight and snap their necks
with a lovely "kirak."  Once cut down, the priests would descend on the
bodies with sharp traingular pieces of metal called O-o and slice away the
warm moist bones.  With these, they would build singular boxes into which
they would place their pregnant women and carry them to the top of a
mountain where existed peculiar rocks that gave of a blue glow.  They would
leave the women in the boxes near the rocks for an hour.  Most would die,
but those that survived produced the most horrible monstrousities.  These
deformed and hideous offspring were worshipped as gods.


---
Clay W. Luther                               clay@vortech.com
Software Engineer                            Vortech Data, Inc.
Office (214) 994-1377                        Fax (214) 994-1310

Well, it had been 987 years in outer space time when I got back.
Couldn't seem to find any of my friends to tell my interesting
stories to.
From: usenet@transfer.stratus.com (Mr. Network News)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Infiniverse #27
Date: 16 Oct 92 15:14:07 GMT
Reply-To: Dave_Wetzel@vos.stratus.com
Organization: Dave_Wetzel

In article <gatemail1.0b2882045362@morticia> jogle@aoc.nrao.edu (Ks. Jim) 
writes:
> "Berlin Rezoned", also by John Terra, comes out in May.  Tharkold
> plans on invading Berlin but Mobius interferes, uprooting one of the
> Tharkold stelae and replacing it with one of his own.  "Berlin turns
> into a twisted mixture of heroes, villains and techno-horror.  Major
> Havoc and his comrades battle the bloodlust of the Tharkoldu and the
> darkness within their own souls in this powerful new book."
> 
> (How can Nile heroes have "darkness within their own souls",
> considering how the Law of Morality works?  At least this should get
> Major Havoc off the Grant Man's case for a while. 8-)

I beleive the theory is that once tharkold drops a stelae in berlin, the 
are will become a mixed zone: Tharkold/Nile.  The atmosphere created might 
be very close to the Batman movies: heros with that near-pshycopathic bent.

And not all of Major Havoc's friends are Nile Empire either.

[Ninja Penalty and bonus]

I have played a ninja with that penalty and let me tell you it is severe.  
My character never invokes Reality Storms, has difficulty reconnecting 
(and when your tag skill is supported only in NT and CE, that's a 
penalty), never shares in group powers (everyone else can shift 
possibilities), and has suffered serious losses of PP in crossing reality 
storms.

On the other hand, I agree that allowing the ninja a dex of 16 is silly.  
I wouldn't use the 3 ability points to get a 16 dex anyway.  A ninja needs 
good Tou, Str, and Dex.

--------------
Dave_Wetzel@vos.stratus.com
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Re:  Earthquakes in Cairo
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:43:25 GMT

Chris writes:

> I'm surprised that no one has remarked about the large earthquake that
> struck in Cairo recently.

Hadn't heard about it.

> So what do YOU think Mobius is up to?

He's obviously perfecting that Earthquake Bomb of his (recently used
against Japan, according to Iverse a few months back).

Or is it something more dire, something related to his Darkness Device
and the Land Below?  Hmmm....


Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: jogle@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim))
Subject: Re: Reality Storms
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Socorro NM
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 92 00:12:32 GMT

In article <mumble> agreene@mta.ca writes:

>Aye, yes, it's another question from me.  Anyway, I've another problem
>in Torg (though this is just minor).  When invoking the Everlaw of One
>and creating a reality storm, a SK in his home cosm gains a +2 to 

Actually, its a +3 bonus.

>his Reality checks, right?  What if he was in another cosm, but before
>invoking the storm the SK created a Reality bubble:  would he then
>gain the home cosm advantage.  My players tried this on me, and I
>was not quite certain what to do.

I would not allow it simply because a reality bubble is not the same
thing as being in your home cosm - in your home cosm the Everlaw of
One is on your side to remove the other person (because he's a
contradiction).  A reality bubble is just strengthening the connection
to your home realm, not actually putting you inside a bubble of your
home realm.

Besides, what's to prevent the other person from doing the same thing
and cancelling out the +3 bonus?

>While I've got your attentions, I might as well ask about tapping
>eternity shards.  One of my players insists that he can spend a
>posibility while tapping a shard.  Does one gain extra rolls from
>posibilities and for Up results when trying to tap?  In the above

Yes, extra rolls can be used when tapping a shard.

>instance, a player generated a damage total of 118 with his sword,
>reducing a dragon to a pile of tiny, bloody bits of spam.  He did this
>by spending the possibility and a Hero card (while on an Up result) on
>the tapping, and he gained about 7 possibilities from it; the next
>round (after a Core Earther used his Seize Initiative to keep the
>Up result), he spent the 7 possibilities and a Drama card.  The effects
>were incredibly dramatic, but certainly not clean.  I actually do
>not frown on this use of tapping a shard (though the shard's never
>been quite the same since losing nearly half it's possibilities).
>However, I would like to get a more educated opinion on whether this
>move is legal.

It is legal.  Most eternity shards (at least the ones WEG has
published) have some kind of limitation on how its Possibilities can
be spent though, so depending on the shard using them for combat
purposes may not be allowed (for example, the Possibility Chalice
would not allow its Possibilities to be tapped for combat) - note that
that just means it becomes more difficult to tap, not impossible.

However, if the shard does not restrict its Possibilities from being
used in combat, then there's no problem (but since a shard cannot
be recharged with PE once its out, the players may not want to do that
trick too many times!)


-- 
Kansas Jim (Jim Ogle, TORG guru)                               /|
jogle@aoc.nrao.edu (NRAO-VLBA, Socorro New Mexico)           o| |-
"I'd be apathetic if I cared."                              /|\\|
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: jogle@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim))
Subject: Re: FTP sites
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Socorro NM
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 19:49:35 GMT

In article <mumble> tbrowne@jarthur.claremont.edu (T. Erik Browne) writes:

>I repeat, will someone please tell me what is necessary for running the
>mailing list.  I'm sure I couldn't convince anyone to let the ftp site rest
>here, but I have no idea how hard it would be to get the mailing list here.
>
>For the utterly clueless, I'm willing to try to set up the mailing list
>here, if the BMW isn't coming back, but only if someone first gives me some
>facts!

The problem is that the person who knows the facts about what it takes
to run the mailing list is Clay, and since his account was on the
deceased computer he has no newsgroup or email access....

Unless someone else out there has experience with running a mailing
list and can provide some info!



-- 
Kansas Jim (Jim Ogle, TORG guru)                               /|
jogle@aoc.nrao.edu (NRAO-VLBA, Socorro New Mexico)           o| |-
"I'd be apathetic if I cared."                              /| \|
From: cluther@morticia.cnns.unt.edu (Clay Luther)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Test
Date: 13 Oct 92 19:47:41 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

This is a test to make sure the gate software is working. (mail->news).

-- 
Clay Luther
cluther@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: oakes@nmt.edu (David Oakes)
Subject: Re: The homosexuality thing...
Organization: New Mexico Tech
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 17:26:12 GMT

In article <2801300658@dwetzel.mis.stratus.com> Dave_Wetzel@vos.stratus.com writes:
>> While the social axiom can't dictate actions, it has a mjor effect on 
>> attitudes... which is what would cause this shunning of homosexuality.

[note: the social axiom doesnt dictate attitudes either - 
 even at the high end where "evil" is impossible, it doesnt say what evil is.
 WL might be able to define "evil" but not the social axiom.]

>Well, except that social axiom tends to be a bit fuzzy on these kinds of 
>issues.  Some societies what were otherwize "primative" (Sparta, Roman 
>empire, feudal Japan) accepted homosexuality better than we do today.  At 
>what soc level does homosexuality become tolerated?  And why would the 
>Roman Empire, which otherwize would have a relatively low Soc axiom get a 
>higher Soc axiom that the US in Core Earth?
>
>But I think that's more a problem with the concept of a Soc axiom than any 
>particular application of it.  (which is why Tharkold has that bizzare: 
>Soc 20 for military organization, but Soc 11 for all other purposes.)

the problem is the assumption that controls HOW people think.
it doesnt - it controls HOW COMPLEX the thought, not what people think about it
(communism and capatalism are equivalent [level] concepts in TORG -
 it required government to make one "the evil empire")

since a very high social axiom = complete tolerance (by the book),
we assume that intolerance is therefore characteristic of a low social axiom,
and therefore the more intolerant, the lower the social axiom, and vis-versa

if this were true, the LL would be a police state!  no tolerance at all!
(so, this is obviously not true)
sex itself is very likely controled by the social axiom
(since it is interaction between individuals)
but whether or not you like sex is your own problem...

dave "that proves it - socorro has a world law..." oakes
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: sjs28257@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Steve Stelter)
Subject: Re: Burnt Out GM who needs help with New Adventure IDEAS
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 01:25:46 GMT

acs_mogged@rivers.acc.uwrf.edu writes:


>	As a GM who has been gming Torg every week since the Aysle sourcebook
>has came out I have now hit the point....  What do you run after you run every
>west end game adventure(even the bad ones)?????

>	What is even worse I can almost never run anything out of the 
>Infiniverse for when you GM a fellow GM (B. Schomburg who is finaly getting
>some of his stuff published in the infiniverse, yeah!!) who gets the
>infiniverse I can't very well use it........

>	So can anybody tell me some good ideas for a adventure, act, scene, 
>or even just a round idea......   The idea can be action-filled, comic, horror,
>etc just as long as it fits and adheres to the CURRENT TORG UNIVERSE!!!!

I don't know if WEG has plans to follow up on this, but it always struck me
as rather unfair that Decker gets cut down by the Wild Hunt at the end of
"The Nightmare Dream."  I've often toyed with the idea of doing an adventure
series in which the PCs, at the request of Julie Boot, work out a way to 
bring Decker back.

A creative GM or player could probably think of about a dozen ways in which
Decker could be brought back, but the plotline I thought up followed these
lines: After Decker was killed by Wotan, his (Decker's) spirit was incorporated
into the Wild Hunt, while his body was delivered to Uthorion as a tribute.
Uthorion cremated the body and now uses the ashes in an hourglass in his
throne room.

The PCs, therefore, must first sneak into Uthorion's HQ and steal the hourglass
and then travel to Tharkold, the only place where medical technology is
advanced enough to allow the cloning of a human being from ashes (at least,
that's how I see it).  In the Tharkold cosm, Race scientists manage to make
a Decker clone.  A la "Star Trek III," the PCs must now take Decker's newly
reconstituted body and reunite Decker's spirit with it--and that means a
confrontation with the Wild Hunt, and probably a duel with Wotan while a
Storm Knight mage tries to cast a spell to draw Decker's spirit out of the
Wild Hunt and into his body.


                                --Steve Stelter
                                  sjs28257@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
From: cpearce%nemesis@nemesis.acs.unt.edu (Chris Pearce)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Bounced ninja post
Date: 16 Oct 92 21:37:24 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

This bounced.  I'm trying again.

> > [Ninja Penalty and bonus]
> 
> > I have played a ninja with that penalty and let me tell you it is severe.  
> > My character never invokes Reality Storms, has difficulty reconnecting 
> > (and when your tag skill is supported only in NT and CE, that's a 
> > penalty), never shares in group powers (everyone else can shift 
> > possibilities), and has suffered serious losses of PP in crossing reality 
> > storms.
> 
> The restricion is quite annoying... especially since ninja don't really
> have great SPI to begin with. For Dakota, I've spent considerable effort
> upping the reality, just to make sure he isn't immediately toasted if he
> enters a reality storm. And while it says that a ninja can't spend a PP
> on a reality total, it doesn't say anything about cancelling your opponents'
> PPs.
> 
> So for reality storms, the disadvantage is not *too* bad, but it still means
> entering Reality combat at a severe disadvantage.
> 
> As for disconnection, it's fruitful to consistently use tools lower than Tech
> 24 so that you get a bonus on reco. Especially since when I disco (actually,
> not that often) with my Martial Arts, Clay has me use the Tech axiom of
> the weapon I'm fighting with instead of the Soc/Spi axiom for reconnection.
> I think it's probably a mistake on his part, but I'm not complaining.
> 
> > On the other hand, I agree that allowing the ninja a dex of 16 is silly.  
> > I wouldn't use the 3 ability points to get a 16 dex anyway.  A ninja needs 
> > good Tou, Str, and Dex.
> 
> I nearly had a cow when I saw the ninjas in the LA sourcebook! Keep in mind
> that these ninjas are supposed to be the castoffs from the ninja pits...
> their technique is supposed to be "fatally flawed." Sheesh, if I were the ninja
> master that threw these guys out, I would have my head looked at.
> 
> I thought Dakota was pretty hot stuff until I saw these guys.
> 
> > Dave_Wetzel@vos.stratus.com
> 
> -- 
> Chris Pearce -- cpearce@nemesis.acs.unt.edu
> 


-- 
Chris Pearce -- cpearce@nemesis.acs.unt.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg