HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: west@inmet.camb.inmet.com (Brian West)
Subject: Re: Bulls sign top pick
Organization: Intermetrics Inc, Cambridge MA
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 20:11:00 GMT

>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>Chicago Tribune reported that the Bulls signed Byron Houston to a
>>multi-year contract Wednesday.  <incredible salary stuff deleted>
>>
>>He is expected to be tried at both forward positions <more stuff deleted>
>>
>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>    I just don't see how he can play power forward with 6-4 in the NBA.

>  	 Charles Barkley
                          (listed at 6'6" but shorter, 250 lb but lighter)
Larry Johnson (6'5.5" on draft day but now listed at 6'7", 250 lb.)
Mark Aguirre (listed at 6'6" but shorter, 232 lb.)
Adrian Dantley (6'5", 210 lb.)

Each is incredibly strong and quick.  Although they are 4s at the
offensive end of the court, they usually match up against the 3s on
the defensive end.

From what I've seen of Byron Houston, he is definitely strong enough
but may lack the quickness to be in the caliber of the above mentioned
players.  He may have a good career at Chicago as a 7th or 8th man,
averaging less than 15 minutes a games.  I don't see him getting any
more minutes because he will be a defensive liability; not quick enough
to guard a 3 and not tall enough to guard a 4. 

Brian West

I got the listed heights and weights from my trusty TSN Pro Basketball
1991-1992 Yearbook.
-- 
west@inmet.inmet.com (or west%inmet@uunet.uu.net)
============================================================================
STANDARD DISCLAIMER: No one is responsible. 
My Astral-Projection did this, if you get my drift.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro,rec.sport.basketball.college
From: hiew@cs.uwa.oz.au (HIEW Hong Liang)
Subject: When's Larry's jersey gonna be retired?
Organization: Dept. Computer Science, University of Western Australia.
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 06:14:05 GMT

When is Larry Bird's No. 33 gonna be officially retired by the Celts? I
assume it'll be during one of their home games. Which one?

While on the subject, when's his jersey gonna be retired by Indiana
State?

Thanks.

hiew.
From: fzchen@othello.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Blazers sign Dave Johnson
Date: 4 Sep 92 06:08:06 GMT
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Hmmm...I still don't see how this works out. Is Smith really a true
center (i.e. a guy big enough and tall enough to guard a center).

I like Cliff Robinson at Center but sometimes he's just not big enough.
If Duck is the only true center, I'm worried (or confused).  Duck is,
after all, still Duckworth.  He could come back to fall camp in the 
greatest shape of his life, but psychologically he won't be any different.
And, all the working out in the world ain't gonna give him longer arms
or better hands.  If there is no other center and no other roster spots
there must be a trade a comin'.  

If I'm wrong please set me straight.  I'm a displace Blazer fan and
I need all the news I can get.

-MeatHead

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks)
Subject: Re: Compiling List of Jordan Awards
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 92 19:03:06 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Vmark Software, Inc.

In article <1992Sep3.150102.9739@cbnewsk.cb.att.com> lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor) writes:
>In article <1992Sep02.130520.46085@uvmark.uucp> davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks) writes:
>>So, the question is, which of the various "awards" in college basketball are
>>considered the Heismann equivalent??  
>I don't know, but it shouldn't be an award given by a commerical
>publication. How did TSN come up with the winner? with the editor throwing
>darts?
>
>At least the other organizations derive the winners from polls.

Well, TSN also uses "polls" to determine things as well.  I don't see this 
being any worst than any of the AP/UPI "polls" that have so much support in
college football.

>
>>I have never heard Sampson mentioned 
>>as a 3 time POY winner, in any reference, though it seems he won the award 
>>3 times in 4 different polling organizations.  
>That's NOT the justification of Sampson being a 1-time POY winner and
>Jordan being a 2-time winner, just because you never heard of it.
>And Jordan as a two-time POY is only deceptive media hype. It's a total
>whitewash of Sampson's dominance in his senior season.

Never said it as so, just never heard it stated.  And though Sampson was
clearly the college ranks best center, he didn't "dominate" in the sense 
like others have in their collegiate careers.  Lew Alcindor "dominated"...
Pete Maravich "dominated"...  etc.. Sampson had a great career at Virginia,
but others have done even more.

>
>If we have to chose ONE POY in 1983, who would be the logical choice?
>Jordan who won the TSN? or Sampson who won the AP/UPI/USBWA/NABC/Wooden/
>Naismith?

I agree, in some ways, that Sampson is probably more deserving due to the
shear number of awards, but, like the Heismann, if their is the "one" award
that is above all others, it doesn't really matter.  
-- 
David T. Meeks                    ||" We are jigsaw pieces, aligned on the 
VMark Software, Inc.              ||  perimeter edge, 
uvmark!davem@merk.com             ||  interlocked through a missing piece"
davem%uvmark@merk.com             ||" ...This world is totally Fugazi"
From: edrury@3cpu.rain.com (Ed Drury)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Jordan >= Magic && Bird
Date: 27 Aug 92 20:03:38 GMT
Reply-To: edrury@.UUCP (Ed Drury)
Organization: Garden Lane Software

In article <1992Aug27.135621.50590@uvmark.uucp> davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks) writes:
>In article <4218@3cpu.rain.com> edrury@.UUCP (Ed Drury) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug26.232647.23645@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> rda455w@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au (H. Nguyen) writes:
>>
>> Refresh my memory. Which year(s) did Michael win the all-star game MVP and
>>which year(s) was he entered in the 3 point contest?
>
>1991, MVP AllStar Game.  

 Thanks, I found with all the lists I do have I don't have a list of MVP's
 or all star game stats. My poor memory had Barkley MVP that year, but it
 must have been the year before.

>1992, entered in 3pt contest.

 That is, I assume, when he "almost won it"? I don't even remember him
in it but I was in Hawaii at the time and caught up on things via tape.
I thought you had to either be in the top ten in the league in 3 point
shooting or a previous champion to even be in it? I didn't realize he'd
shot that many to qualify. Or did they change the criteria?

>-- 
>David T. Meeks                    ||" We are jigsaw pieces, aligned on the 
>VMark Software, Inc.              ||  perimeter edge, 
>uvmark!davem@merk.com             ||  interlocked through a missing piece"
>davem%uvmark@merk.com             ||" ...This world is totally Fugazi"


-- 
   __
 /--   __/
(___, (_/rury@3cpu.rain.com
From: IOR@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Thomas Hyer)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Australia vs. NCAA teams
Date: 28 Aug 92 21:51:56 GMT
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center


  How many NCAA teams could have beaten the Aussie
olympic squad?  How would they have done at the
NCAA tournament?

  My best guess is that Australia could field a
borderline top 20 team.  Let's think about it:

Vlahov:  rode behind Lichti into the NCAA, then
behind Keefe to an NIT championship, which is
probably good for about a #40 ranking.  A solid
college player on an OK team.

Longley:  absolutely cannot keep up with NBA
competition; gets his butt kicked whenever he
turns around.  But at the college level, he
is an above-average center; this team will beat
teams which lack a respectable inside game.

Gaze:  don't know much of anything about him,
but I'm going to assume he's a decent imitation
of Steve Alford.  Well, that's a very good thing
to have in the NCAA.  Any NBA player can shut
down Gaze; teams must have a near-NBA guard to
put on defense.

That demands a fairly solid team, not the one-
dimensional ones that often squeak into the NCAA.
Alabama, for example, would probably beat Australia
only with some difficulty; they were ranked about
20th, as I recall, but match up well (if Sprewell
lives up to his defensive reputation) and are
athletic enough to make Longley dizzy so he'll
fall down.  Michigan or Duke would stomp all over
the Down Under boys.

I predict Australia would miss the sweet 16, but
narrowly; they'd have a fighting chance of getting
in with a favorable seed (and then running into a
top-5 school and losing by 15).

Tom Hyer

By the way, could someone mail me `Dream Team vs. Church Team'?
I lost my copy.

Thomas Hyer                   _____________________
                             /Half the time, even  \     words
-S---L------A---------C-----< _I_ don't share my  / \     support
                             \  opinions.        /          like
                              -------------------          bone...
From: IOR@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Thomas Hyer)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Jordan >= Magic && Bird
Date: 1 Sep 92 18:51:58 GMT
 <1992Aug31.145910.5582@inmet.camb.inmet.com>
 <1992Aug31.230144.44724@uvmark.uucp>
 <1992Sep1.164040.1448@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center

In article <1992Sep1.164040.1448@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>, kbowers@esrc1.uucp (Ken
Bowers) says:
>
>In article <1992Aug31.230144.44724@uvmark.uucp> davem@uvmark.uucp (Dave Meeks)
>writes:
>>
>>look at the play that, probably more than any, lives in peoples mind about
>>Bird...  Stealing the inbound pass against Detroit.  Ironic that it was a
>>great defensive play will be remembered.
>
>Anyone else think that steal says a lot more about Isiah at that time
>than Bird?  There are lots of NBA players who look great on defense
>when opponents make really dumb passes.

If someone has videotape of this and can check, they'll surely
become heroes... :)

My recollection is that Thomas didn't really telegraph the pass,
he just didn't watch the court well enough; Bird
> FLAME RETARDANT ON
read his teeny little mind and
> FLAME RETARDANT OFF
knew where the pass was going by watching the court.

Smart play on DJ's part, too; by the time Pistons realized what
had happened, Johnson was off and running.

Anyway, does anyone have the videotape and willingness to
watch it again :) ?  I'd be interested to hear what anyone
can tell me about what Isaiah was thinking/looking at before
he made the pass.

Tom Hyer
From: sheyn@csa.bu.edu (Igor Sheyn)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Celtics? (was Re: Boston Celtics' Rick Fox)
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:23:03 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA
Originator: sheyn@csa


Barry is a shooting guard with SOME passing skills but not a point guard.
He was meant to be a back-up to Reggie.
From: msmiller@Rational.COM (Mark Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Jordan >= Magic && Bird
Date: 28 Aug 92 18:58:05 GMT
Organization: Rational

In article <4223@3cpu.rain.com>, edrury@3cpu.rain.com (Ed Drury) writes:
|> 
|>  So what year *did* Michael win the All-Star MVP? Given that Magic won
|> 1992 and Charles won 1991, I don't have stats for All Star games so I'm
|> actually asking. You guys follow MJ, know his stats and all. I'm just
|> looking for the answer. Remember, there is a seeker born every minute. :-)
|> 

It was the year the All-Star game was in Chicago.

Bird made sure Jordan got the ball so he could win MVP on his home
court.
________________________________________________________________________
Mark S. Miller                                     msmiller@Rational.COM
"Life is a 4-letter word."                        msmiller@world.std.com
[ insert tedious disclaimer drivel here ]                           IV-Q
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: jds@sequent.com (Jerry Simmering)
Subject: Blazers sign Dave Johnson
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 16:29:11 GMT

  The Portland Trailblazers held a press conference yesterday to announce the
signing of their first round draft pick Dave Johnson. That means the Blazers 
now have 12 players under contract. Adelman still insists (as he does every
year) that the 12 best athletes at fall camp will make the team. Not sure
how that all works out with the salary cap since Johnson supposedly filled
the last salary slot left open (a 500K slot this year). 

  This is how the roster shapes up as of today:

  Centers:    Duckworth - Reggie Smith
  P.Forward:  Buck Williams - Cliff Robinson (plays 3 positions) - Mark Bryant
  S.Forward:  Jerome Kersey - Tracy Murray - Dave Johnson
  Off Guard:  Clyde Drexler - Mario Ellie
  Pt. Guard:  Terry Porter - Rod Strickland  

  Other possibilities:

  Lamont Strothers
  Robert Pack
  Ennis Whatley
  Marcus Kennedy




-- 
Jerry Simmering                 | GO Portland Trailblazers! 1992 W.C. Champs
Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.  | GO Atlanta Falcons! 
Beaverton, Oregon.              | GO Georgia Bulldawgs!
                                | GO Atlanta Braves! 1991 NL Champs!    
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: edmunds@vaxr.llnl.gov
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Clippers/Knicks/Orlando trade
Date: 1 Sep 92 15:17:50 GMT
Organization: LLNL_LIS


  > 
  > snguyen@orion.oac.uci.edu (Son Nguyen) writes:
  > |> Since noone has mentioned it...
  > |> 
  > |> I saw a blurp on ESPN last night stating that the Clips will get
  > |> Stanley Roberts and Mark Jackson, the Knicks will get *Charles Smith*,
  > |> Doc Rivers and Bo Kimble, and the Magic will get some draft picks
  > |> (don't remember what/when...).  I'm not sure if it's a done deal or
  > |> just a rumor.  Anyone has more???  If it goes thru, looks like NY
  > 
  adam@research.nj.nec.com (Adam Porter) writes:
  > What??  Can anyone confirm this?  (At least the report, if not the
  > trade?)  I don't understand.

  The SF Chronicle reported today that the deal was 1) the Knicks sending
Mark Jackson to the Clips 2) the Knicks sending 1st round picks in 93
and 97 to the Magic; 3) the Clips sending Charles Smith, Doc Rivers, and
Bo Kimble to the Knicks; 4) the Clips sending a 1st round pick (unnamed year)
to the Magic; 5) the Magic sending Stanley Roberts to the Clips.
  So, as I read it, the Magic get three 1st rounders for Roberts (good),
the Knicks get Smith, Rivers, and Kimble, plus they get rid of Jackson
(very good), and the Clips get Jackson and Roberts (hmmm).

  BUT, of course, this is all moot, since Roberts exercised his no-trade
clause and vetoed the whole deal.  One would think he might be excited
about leaving Orlando for L.A., but the article said that he is angry
that the Magic didn't inform him that they were working on a deal.

-- Dave Edmunds
From: msmiller@Rational.COM (Mark Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Jordan >= Magic && Bird
Date: 31 Aug 92 22:17:11 GMT
Organization: Rational

In article <92243.210121U14540@uicvm.uic.edu>, U14540@uicvm.uic.edu writes:
|> >
|> >You also "somehow" missed the question about how Jordan scoring 50+
|> >points show skills which are "*much* better" than Bird or Magic
|> >scoring 50+ points. I wonder why ...
|> 
|>    I'll tell you why. Jordan scores his 50 with 2 or 3 people covering him.
|>  Bird and Magic do it with 1 sometimes 2.

You ARE kidding, right?

"Sometimes?"

Oh brother.

Enjoy your fantasy. I give up.

________________________________________________________________________
Mark S. Miller                                     msmiller@Rational.COM
"Life is a 4-letter word."                        msmiller@world.std.com
[ insert tedious disclaimer drivel here ]                           IV-Q
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: jdt29225@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jazzy J )
Subject: Re: Lloyd Danielsd (was Re: Spurs Update)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 16:00:50 GMT
Keywords: Spurs

kbowers@esrc1.uucp (Ken Bowers) writes:

>Why? After all, someone has to be at the bottom (or is it top?) of
>the list. Feeling kind of guilty, Russ?

>If Daniels turns into an NBA player, then who would the "most 
>recruiting hype to never do diddley" mantle fall to? Larry Bird?

	Larry Bird?  U must be confused!

	Anyways, the "most recruiting hype to never do diddley" could
	fall upon a lot of players.  Tito Horford is a great choice.
	Chris Washburn as well.  One player that has got to be mentioned
	is Delray Brooks.  He was named HS player of the year his senior
	year, but then went on to non-descript seasons at Indiana and
	Providence.  He's currently now an assistant strength coach
	(to former UK alum Reggie Hanson) at Kentucky.  All from a 
	former POY.

	Jazzy J

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  "I am human and I need to be loved,            | Jazzy J                   |
|   just like everybody else does..." - The Smiths| jdt29225@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu | 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rsmith@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Russ Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Spurs Update
Keywords: Spurs
Date: 26 Aug 92 18:59:54 GMT
Organization: Olivetti ATC; Cupertino CA, USA

In article <1992Aug26.150235.1052@microsoft.com> paulg@microsoft.com (Paul Goode) writes:
>Re Daniels, Jerry Tarkanian expects to play him a lot. The Shark
>says that if a guy has talent, you give him the PT. That's great
>if you're on a youth movement, but this team is supposedly 
>a title contender. 

The key with Lloyd is conditioning. I've written a lot of negative
things about him on the college group, but as a pro player they no
longer apply. Every pro stint he's had(CBA, WBL etc.) he's been accused
of being out of shape and lazy. You can't play for Tark and be lazy.
The skill is obvious when you watch him, he's smooth, passes and 
dribbles like a much smaller player. His shot is iffy, as is his defense.

I kind of hope he does well so his name doesn't go down in infamy as
the guy with the most recruiting hype to never do diddly.




Russ Smith
*******************************************************************************
"A bank is a place where they lend you an umbrella in fair weather, and ask
for it back again when it begins to rain."
                                          Robert Frost
********************************************************************************






>Paul
From: bender@riscee.pko.dec.com (Patricia Bender)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Memories of Magic, Larry, and Mike
Date: 31 Aug 92 16:39:49 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation, Maynard MA

In article <1992Aug28.141246.4531@newstand.syr.edu> bewillia@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Maj. Devon McKnight) writes:
>	Some memories that always seem to stick out in my mind are these:
>
>	1. Celtics at Mavericks.  Celtics down two with, oh, fifteen seconds 
>	   to go.  Bird is on a 1-on-3 break, and calmly lofts a running
>	   trifecta in the face of some generic Maverick or another.  What
>	   makes this memory stand out is seeing the look of utter disbelief
>	   and anger on the face of Derek Harper, who had been standing
>	   underneath the basket as all this happened.  It really summed up
>	   how some opponents felt when Bird performed some of his late-game
>	   magic against their team.
>
>			- Dev


Slight corrections from my memory:
Mavs up by two with about seven seconds left.  Celtics inbound the ball at
the far end of the court to Bird.  Bird dribbles the ball up the court AND
NOBODY IS ON HIM!!!  Bird throws up the three with time running out from
about three feet behind the three point line while Perkins (someone finally
realized someone should be guarding Bird) makes a mad dash at him.  Shot is
good.  Celtics win.  AARRRGGGHHH!  Harper's look of disbelief and anger 
reflected what the rest of the crowd was feeling about no one guarding Bird.
We (my dad and I) were talking about the &*#@ idiots' stupidity all the way
home.  This will probably be the one play of Bird's that I will always 
remember (but not with much joy).  BTW, the shot was a great shot, but a 
little defense would have been nice.

patricia
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: grubin@virga.rap.ucar.edu (Rick Grubin)
Subject: MIGHTY NUGGETS sign 3 free agents
Keywords: K.Upshaw  T.Watts  K.Johnson   free agents
Reply-To: grubin@virga.rap.ucar.edu (Rick Grubin)
Organization: Research Applications Program/NCAR, Boulder, CO
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 21:22:46 GMT



Apologies, I couldn't resist posting some actual basketball news
(as it were).  Damn, where is T-Bone when you need him?

The MIGHTY NUGGETS have signed three free agents, no terms or such
were announced.

The three are:  Kelvin Upshaw, a 6-2 guard from Utah, and a 5-year
                NBA veteran (120 games for 6 different teams).

                Tony Watts, a 6-2 guard from Mississippi State.

                Ken Johnson, a 6-8 forward from Michigan State.  He
                played the past two seasons in the Spanish League,
                where he averaged 15.8 ppg.

Both Watts and Johnson participated in the Nuggs rookie camp in July,
where Johnson played rather well.

--
Rick Grubin     grubin@ncar.ucar.edu
From: Richard.S.Miyara@dartmouth.edu (Richard S. Miyara)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Jordan >= Magic && Bird
Date: 31 Aug 92 18:13:04 GMT
 <1992Aug26.213743.16703@uvmark.uucp> 
 <1992Aug27.121712.21182@brtph560.bnr.ca> 
 <1992Aug27.213226.3160@cs.ucla.edu>  <BtpDDC.Bsx@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

In article <BtpDDC.Bsx@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
zell@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Joseph Zell) writes:

>  Michael did have one good year(in which he shot 3's all summer)
> which is the the year he qualified for for the three point contest.  He has
> proved that he CAN shoot the three, if he practices, but right now he'd
> rather play golf.  Yes, it is a weakness, but he has proven that he can over-
> come it if he practices it.

I guess this is one of the reasons I like(d) Bird so much - basketball
was his life and he practiced and played 110% all the time.  It has
been noted that Larry was often the first to practice and the last to
leave.  While he may not have the physical talents that Michael has, he
compensated for that with practice and effort.   While Bird did have a
great deal of talent around him I believe he elevated the play of those
around him by example.  I heard an interview a few years ago with DJ,
where he said that it was hard not to give it his all when the
"franchise" was practicing longer every day and diving after balls.  I
think that the example set by Michael is that golf is more important
than basketball - not exactly inspiring.

Rich Miyara
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: lej@pdn.paradyne.com (Leo James)
Subject: Re: Bird Bids Aloha!
Organization: AT&T Paradyne, Largo, Florida
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 14:13:55 GMT

As a Knicks fan, I don't have a lot of love for the Celtics,  but
I had the utmost respect for Larry.   Even now,  the guy is a bit
surly for my taste, but no more feared shooter ever played in the
NBA.  No guy was better suited to beat you with the pass.  No one
was a better competitor.   Larry is defineately  a starter on the
All-Time All-Star team.
--
+---------------------+-----------------------+-----------------------+
|Leopold E. James     | "A heart, a soul, AND | AT&T Paradyne         |
|ph: (813) 530-8425   |  a mind are terrible  | P.O. Box 2826, LG-132,|
|lej@pdn.paradyne.com |  things to waste."    | Largo, FL 34649 (USA) |