From: et@madmax.aa.nps.navy.MIL
Subject: Re: Why she took my name/ narrow minded views..
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Date: 25 Jul 92 06:11:30 GMT

In Article: 4484 of soc.feminism
cindy@ncar.UCAR.EDU (Cindy Blank-Edelman) writes:

> .....
> To clarify: let's say that an organization has instituted
> participatory democracy and consensus-style decision making.  Yay.
> The organization has a meeting.  Because of their previous positions,
> all of the women at the meeting are referred to as "secretaries", and
> called by their first names, while all of the men are referred to as
> "bosses" and called "Mr. Last Name".

In such an institution there would be no "bosses".
However, years of workplace "tradition" of referring
someone "Mr/Ms Last Name" might continue for sometime
without interfering with the workplace democracy.

> Is this situation really conducive to consensus or equal
> participation by all?  I don't think so.  The people in the
> organization won't be on an equal level until the titles are dropped
> and people are referred to in the same way (either with first or
> last names).  Until that symbolic name change occurs, insidious
> inequality will persist.


This is just your assumption and you are not
supporting it with any reasonable argument.  I can
easily imagine that in such a workplace where all the
workers involve in decision making and have "equal"
rights,  no one would be compelled to show any extra
"respect" to anybody else by calling them "Mr/Ms" and
expect something in return. Yet, some would still
refer to others with their "Mr/Ms last names", some
with first names just because everybody has a
different "taste".


> I think it is the same thing in marriage.  In the effort to be more
> equal partners in our marriage, and make decisions by consensus, we
> made sure the symbolism of our names would not hold us back.  Now,
> what's wrong with that? :-)

Nothing. All my argument was that if "last name" is
still a controversial issue in the society, it must be
due to men having still not realized why oppression of
women in a society or in a family has been
destructive/unproductive/unhappy experience in
general. It must be due to us being not completely
ready, without any reservations, to participate in
non-authoritarian, non-hierarchical environments. It
must be due to us being not aware of  how subtle forms
this oppressive, authoritarian behaviors can take.

It is quite clear to me that if family members  are
quite sincere in and conscious of their consensus
seeking efforts, their names neither would be any
problem nor would hold anyone back.

It is very easy to test if the lack of your name would
really hold you back.  Why don't you drop your maiden
name for a year and see how much of "equality" you
loose in your domestic life:-) I bet, the only
difference you would ever notice would be how easy it
is to sign your name.  Otherwise you are just showing
off:-)

Ismail




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