From: patty@alpha.larc.nasa.gov (Patty Howell)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: History of Dressage v2.01
Date: 18 Dec 1992 22:08:25 GMT
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, VA  USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: alpha.larc.nasa.gov

Article: 11211 of rec.equestrian
From: jd@rust.zso.dec.com (John D'Addamio)
Subject: Re: History of Dressage v2.01
Summary: Balderdash!

>I have read the news notes on dressage with great interest and marvel.
>However, there are several bits of misinformation that have appeared in 
>the first 2 installments of this history of dressage and the arguments over
>whether dressage origininated in the military circles or the courts.

[...]

>John
.................................................

John, John, John, John.........

'Balderdash' to you, too.

Where should I start......_Ecole de Cavalerie_ means "Schooling
of the Horse" NOT "The Calvalry School" Have you ever read it?
Gueriniere's only comments regarding the military horse were
very short - not even included in the english translation I
have. ("significant parts" of the second section were published
in english) The only thing I know about Gueriniere's personal
life outside the manege was that, despite his expertise with
horses, he always seemed to be 'struggling in debt.' Whether
he was in the military or not - I have never read. His basis for
writing the book was not to discuss military training, nor to
get his methods 'adopted' by the military (what you refer to as 
every aspiring horseman's 'dream'), but to lay down the 
*principles* of dressage which he saw as a dying art (too many
horsemen of the time were beginning to use 'gimmicks' rather
than achieve what was right). He says this very clearly in the
beginning of his book. He also knew that laying down the
principles wouldn't be enough, so he went on to discuss *his*
methods.

o.k. You say *he* only taught in the courts, but he taught
noblemen, and noblemen were the officers of the military. True
BUT COME ON! Do you really think the King of France went into
battle? The nobility of this era was more concerned with who they
dined with at tea than military skirmishes.

Xenophon: Geez...you missed the whole point! MOST dressage
people don't even attribute Xenophon's knowledge with horses
as the beginnings of dressage - they reserve that accolade to
Grisone. They do attribute Xenophon the accolade of first 
(whose writings are preserved) horseman to 'educate' vs 'subjugate'
I, personally, attribute him with much more - the knowledge that a
horse should first be made handy with his balance BEFORE attempting
to school it in collection. 

I referred to Xenophon as a 'statesman' only because
he wrote many books, only one of which was about training horses.
Let me point out that I'm not the first to use that phrase.
Perhaps 'educated Greek' would have suited you better. "Checkered
military career" has nothing to do with dressage originating from
the military....if you had UNDERSTOOD Xenophon, you would realize
that he discussed training a horse in collection ONLY if 'you
are an admirer of such things' to look good in parades.
NOT FOR BATTLE. The book itself was written as a treatise on
horsemanship for his nephews (who were not even old enough to be
in the military), not as a military handbook.

Xenophon was obviously a bright, thoughtful (at least regarding horses)
man. You make him sound like a scoundrel! I really don't care
what he was personally.... his contributions to horsemanship
are what I want to study.

[I wrote this in a hurray....please disregard any spelling errors
or points I may not have responded too]

patty

p.s. Why 'interest and marvel'? because you enjoyed it or because
     you thought 'how could any one person be so wrong?'
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian