HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: zaphod@src4src.linet.org (Steve Wechsler)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house,rec.aquaria,alt.aquaria
Subject: Re: "humid" environment materials?
Date: 5 Jan 93 15:05:34 GMT
Organization: The Source for Source

In article <1993Jan4.072552.27876@netcom.com> oleg@netcom.com (Oleg Kiselev) writes:
>I am planning to build a "fish room" to house a large number of
>aquariums in the (uninsulated) garage of our house.  The fish room will
>have to be insulated and the materials, obviously, able to resist high
>humidity levels.  Ideally the structure will also be cheap and easy to
>build and easy to remove.  Some sound insulation would be desirable, too.

>From the reading I have done, it seems that the simplest approach would be
>to use metal framing (like the stuff used for office wall construction in
>modern office buildings), with drywall on either side of for the frame,
>fiberglass insulation between the drywall layers and plastic film glued 
>to the exterior surfaces of the inner shell to keep the humid air away from
>the dry wall.  I planning to anchor the framing to the exposed 2x4 
>framing of the garage walls.  The fish room walls will not be used to
>support much weight -- the fish tanks will be placed on free-standing shelving
>units.

I think 2x4s are easier to use, and they cost about the same as metal
framing (at least at Home Depot on Long Island).  It's really a
personal preference, though...they'll both be strong enough.  Metal
studs have the advantage of not warping when they dry out, and they
have pre-drilled holes for running wires, but using 2x4s lets you put
nails into the studs (may or may not be a consideration).

You might want to look into using greenboard instead of sheet rock.
Greenboard is water resistant sheet rock normally used in bathrooms.
It costs more than sheet rock, but gluing sheet plastic to sheet rock
sounds kludgy, and gives the advantage of holding paint better (plus,
it won't tear the way plastic can).  Consult with your home
improvement store to see if greenboard would be appropriate.

-- 
Steve Wechsler | zaphod@src4src.linet.org    |    Call Lady Hawke's Castle BBS:
Please respond to my posts via e-mail (post also if you like) |  (516) 226-4630
because my site purges news much faster than I can keep up with it.
"Watch??  I'm gonna pray, man!  Know any good religions?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house,misc.legal
From: whs70@dancer.cc.bellcore.com (sohl,william h)
Subject: Re: Zoning Question
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 93 15:04:42 GMT

In article <bhayden.726732231@teal> bhayden@teal.csn.org (Bruce Hayden) writes:
>mr@ogre.cica.indiana.edu (Michael Regoli) writes:
>
>>][
>
>>I live in a subdivision that has about two dozen lots.  We're all
>>zoned 'agriculture' (the land used to be a vineyard).
>
>>I recieved a certified letter today from our realtor (who is the
>>seller's agent for the subdivision) letting us know that he is
>>requesting an amendment to the zoning maps to rezone from agriculture
>>to residential the entire subdivision (supposedly to allow less
>>stringent setback reqirements and to be consistent with the
>>subdivision's covenants).
>
>>Should we be concerned about this? He informed us of the hearing time,
>>place, etc.  What would this mean for us?  We've already built and met
>>every requirement of the covenants and restrictions...  I see this as
>>somehow benefiting the owner of the subdivision (who has about 12-18
>>more lots to sell) and certainly not us.
>
>>Can our taxes increase due to a reclassification in zoning?  
>
>Yes - in many states a residential zoning is much more expensive 
>than agricultural. Check with your local assessors office. This
>information is public record.
>Bruce E. Hayden

Bruce's answer is true, only to the extent that a lot in an
agricultural zone is not yet developed.  Once there's a home
built, that home is assessed as any other home in the community.
The benefeit to agricultural/farm assessment is usually only applicable
to a working farm.  Here in NJ, the land must produce a crop every
so many years to keep the lower "farm" assessment otherwise it
reverts
to a higher assessed value as vacant land.

However, just to be sure there isn't some tax quirk that might occur
in your case, do check with the local tax assessor's office also just 
to be sure of your situation.

Standard Disclaimer- Any opinions, etc. are mine and NOT my employer's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Sohl (K2UNK) BELLCORE (Bell Communications Research, Inc.)
Morristown, NJ             email via UUCP      bcr!cc!whs70
201-829-2879 Weekdays      email via Internet  whs70@cc.bellcore.com

Xref: sparky misc.consumers.house:16608 misc.legal:22373
From: davek@informix.com (David Kosenko)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house,misc.legal
Subject: Re: Zoning Question
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:12:55 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

sohl,william h writes:
>The benefeit to agricultural/farm assessment is usually only applicable
>to a working farm.  Here in NJ, the land must produce a crop every
>so many years to keep the lower "farm" assessment otherwise it
>reverts
>to a higher assessed value as vacant land.

Yes, but the definition of "crop" is quite liberal.  I know of at least
one "gentleman farmer" who plants a small crop of corn (sold at the curb)
to keep his "farm" zone.  This is not unusual for former "estates",
at least in my area( Monmouth Cty).

I believe there is also provision for livestock, which helps to explain the
large number of small horse farms in my area.

Dave
-- 
Disclaimer: These opinions are not those of Informix Software, Inc.
**************************************************************************
"I look back with some satisfaction on what an idiot I was when I was 25,
 but when I do that, I'm assuming I'm no longer an idiot." - Andy Rooney
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: eliot@chutney.rtp.dg.com (Topher Eliot)
Subject: Re: Quality bathroom fan?
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 93 19:52:50 GMT
Reply-To: eliot@dg-rtp.dg.com
Organization: Data General Corporation, Research Triangle Park, NC

I saw a thing yesterday saying that Broan has come out with a line with
humidity sensors to keep them running until the bathroom drys off.

Note that Broan, Nautilus, et. al. sell multiplie lines of these things, quiet
and loud.  Also, sometimes the same things are sold under different brand
names, but right now I can't cite any specifics.

-- 
Topher Eliot             Data General DG/UX Systems Administration Development
(919) 248-6371                                             eliot@dg-rtp.dg.com
Obviously, I speak for myself, not for DG.
misc.consumers.house archivist.  Send mail to house-archive@dg-rtp.dg.com
"Ask me about my vow of silence."
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: gagen@andy.bgsu.edu (kathleen gagen)
Subject: Re: Patching Ceiling Plaster Cracks
Organization: Bowling Green State University B.G., Oh.
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 18:31:06 GMT

richard@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
> 
> He took simplex roofing nails -- the ones with the big plastic disks (used for
> attaching roofing felt) -- and replaced the nail with a drywall screw.  He
> drove the things into the loose plaster, reattaching it  to the lath.  Then, he
> applied several coats of drywall mud to mask the screw and disk.  Where there

There is a product sometimes called plaster washers.  These are metal washers
of 3/4 in diameter.  They are attatched to the plaster and lath with drywall
screws.

-------------
Kathi Gagen
gagen@andy.bgsu.edu
-- 
 Kathleen Pausic Gagen                              ...!osu-cis!bgsuvax!gagen
 Dept. of Biological Sciences                        gagen@research1.bgsu.edu
 Bowling Green State University             gagen%bgsu.csnet@csnet-relay.arpa
 Bowling Green Ohio 43403               gagen%andy.bgsu.edu@csnet-relay.csnet
From: Edward_Engler@transarc.com
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Monitored security system for home
Date: 12 Jan 93 04:07:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: transarc.kfIh2j70BwwD411vIQ
	<C0p5w2.ICu@news.rich.bnr.ca>
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


I have talked to several security companies, and at least one has an
option for a radio link to a nearby telephone pole to overcome wire
tampering.  I now forget which company offered the option (perhaps
Vector, formerly Westec).

Ed Engler
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: patter@dasher.cc.bellcore.com (patterson,george r)
Subject: Re: Security Systems: Do I need to wire windows on 2nd Floor?
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 93 19:53:43 GMT

I tried mail on this one, but it didn't make it, so -

In article <C0Jtut.M6K@icon.rose.hp.com> you write:
>
>The second story should be fine without any sensors. I would think that a theif
>would rather use a lower story door, or hit another ouse, than put up a ladder
>and work on a second story window. 

Many thieves prefer to head for the second story because these windows
are frequently left unlocked. If there's a good chance of this happening
in your house, you might put a sensor in the upstairs hall. You're right
in that a thief usually won't break a second story window if he can work
on the ground floor stuff more easily, but they won't break in at all
if there's a window unlocked.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
                    |
George Patterson -  | Basic research is what I'm doing when I don't
                    | know what I'm doing.
                    |                            Werner Von Braun
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: menna@spike.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Randall Menna)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Plumbing Questions
Keywords: advice, toilet
Date: 9 Jan 93 00:02:42 GMT
Reply-To: menna@hal.com
Distribution: na
Organization: HaL Computer Systems
NNTP-Posting-Host: spike.hal.com

I am considering remodeling my master bathroom, and while I was
successful in gutting and rebuilding my kitchen I discovered that
plumbing is not my forte.

As part of the bathroom remodel I would like to swap the positions
of the toilet and sink.  This would in effect move the toilet
three feet to the left of its current position.  My questions are
what is involved in moving a toilet?  If a plumber was hired to do this what
could I expect as a price range?  Is this something a "plumbing hacker"
could be exected to get working correctly?

Thanks in advance for any help.

-randy

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Randy Menna					menna@hal.com
HaL Computer Systems				(408) 379-7000 x1303
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: smosher@big-bass.East.Sun.COM (Steve Mosher - Sun USOPS WSU PCA TEST ENGINEERING)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Drywall Repair Questions
Date: 5 Jan 1993 16:10:33 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: smosher@big-bass.East.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: big-bass.east.sun.com




In article 25222@adobe.com, vonzelow@adobe.com (Jon von Zelowitz) writes:
>In article <1992Dec29.143654.12316@nynexst.com> smierch@fun.com writes:
>>2) In a couple places where drywall sheets butt together, the horizontal
>>   joint is visible as a raised line on the wall.
>
>I believe this is an example of why some people say not to hang the
>sheets horizontally. Since you can only fasten those horizontal edges
>every 16", and there is nothing holding the panels down except at
>those points, there is more chance of bumpy joints.
>
>   Jon von Zelowitz   vonzelow@mv.us.adobe.com   ...uunet!adobe!vonzelow


I've hanged sheetrock both ways and either way you will always have butt edges.
Ed's problem is that it was a bad mud job, all he needs to do is to feather out
the mud farther. 

as to which way to hang sheetrock, horizontal is easier and you have less
joints to content with, though the joints are longer. 16" spacing on the screws
is more than adequate. Bumpy joints are the sign of either not dimpling the screws enough or a bad mud job.



Steve


---
Steve Mosher
Sun Microsystems               Steve.Mosher@East.Sun.COM
From: btwomey@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (William J. Twomey)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: When does it make sense to reduce the pricinple of your home loan?
Date: 11 Jan 93 19:56:49 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Attack Tribble Training

In article <MACRAKIS.93Jan11121449@lakatos.osf.org> macrakis@osf.org (Stavros Macrakis) writes:
>In article <1993Jan7.165935.619@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> btwomey@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (William J. Twomey) writes:
>
>   The gain/loss from investing instead of paying down is a piddling
>   amount for mortgages rates found today and investments returns that
>   can reasonably be expected....
>
>Basically, I agree.

Thanks.

Here is something to consider:
Finance advisors suggest that you have six months of your salary as
a cash reserve.  If you put your cash into you mortgage, instead of
a short term bond fund, what will you do for cash when you need it
quickly?  Typical home equity loans will lend you up to 25% of the
equity in your home.  If you don't have the equity, what do you do
for cash?  Refinance?  Even if you do have lots of equity, what
do you do when mortgage or equity loan rates are really lousy?  The
piddling dollars you lost having your money in a less than optimum
investment is cheaper that the cost of re-financing and maybe
cheaper than the cost of an equity loan.  It is also available much
more quickly.

BTW: I ran the numbers for an $80000 mortgage at 8.75% and
investment returns of 9 to 15% .  I got a couple thousand bucks,
at most, difference for the life of a 30 year mortgage.  Another
BTW, pretend your investment is after tax return, it makes your
calculations simpler.  

>   Meanwhile 10-20 years from now your salary and cost of living will
>   have doubled, and your real estate taxes will end up being more
>   than your mortgage payment!  (How many peoples' parents see this
>   now?)
>
>This of course has been true for the past 25 years or so.  However,
>there is no guarantee of continued high inflation.  Doubling in 10
>years corresponds to 7% inflation.

I said, "10-20 years."  I don't think we disagree, do we?  Your
money doubles or halves in 17 years 8 months years at 4%. 
I agree, high inflation is not to be expected, for this year at least.

I think 4% is the average of inflation over (mumble) years.
The S&P 500 has historically returned close to 15% per year.
Bonus "BTW":  How long it takes ot double (halve) your money.
               Years     Rate
                4.96    15.00%        
                6.00    12.25%
                7.00    10.41%
                8.00     9.05%
                9.00     8.01%
               10.00     7.18%        
               11.00     6.50%
               12.00     5.95%  
               13.00     5.48% 
               14.00     5.08%
               15.00     4.73%   
               16.00     4.43%  
               17.00     4.16% 
               17.67     4.00%
               18.00     3.93%
               19.00     3.72% 
               20.00     3.53%

Inflation in the U.S.A dipped into the 3% - 4% range during our recent
recession.

Bill Twomey
-- 
bt@violin.att.com
908 615 4162
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house,misc.invest.real-estate
From: macrakis@osf.org (Stavros Macrakis)
Subject: Re: When does it make sense to reduce the pricinple of your home loan?
Organization: OSF Research Institute
	<1993Jan7.165935.619@cbnewsj.cb.att.com>
	<MACRAKIS.93Jan11121449@lakatos.osf.org>
	<1993Jan11.195649.26532@cbnewsj.cb.att.com>
Distribution: na
Date: 12 Jan 93 11:02:14

In article <1993Jan11.195649.26532@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> btwomey@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (William J. Twomey) writes:

   Typical home equity loans will lend you up to 25% of the
   equity in your home....

AND will not lend on the last N% of equity.  Around here, home equity
loans at non-usurious rates require you to keep at least 25% equity in
the house after all loans.

	-s

Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: eliot@chutney.rtp.dg.com (Topher Eliot)
Subject: Re: bathroom fan summary
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 17:51:55 GMT
Reply-To: eliot@dg-rtp.dg.com
Organization: Data General Corporation, Research Triangle Park, NC

In article <1993Jan8.220105.2390@cs.unca.edu>, Archer Gravely <gravely@unca.edu> writes:
|> My thinking is that brand name is not important in selecting a
|> bathroom fan.  
Absolutely, especially since some of the manufacturers make cheap fans and
good fans.

|> What matters is noise level and power to remove
|> air.  
Right.  But also look for the HVI (Home Ventilation Institute) certification 
sticker.  This shows that they used standard test techniques, and didn't
dream up their own test rigs.

A company called 'FanTech' makes a family of in-line fans (you mount them
in the ductwork).  You can get a low-end model that might be appropriate
for a bathroom for ~$80 from Radon Mitigation Inc. (sorry, no phone # handy;
they advertise in Fine Homebuilding and/or the Journal of Light Construction).
Since you mount it in the duct (presumably in the attic), the sound level
shouldn't matter much (right?  anyone have any real experience with this?)
They also sell a ceiling grill to stick in your bathroom ceiling.  You have
to buy the ductwork and whatever you want to use to go through the roof or
outside wall at your local HVAC supplier.

-- 
Topher Eliot             Data General DG/UX Systems Administration Development
(919) 248-6371                                             eliot@dg-rtp.dg.com
Obviously, I speak for myself, not for DG.
misc.consumers.house archivist.  Send mail to house-archive@dg-rtp.dg.com
"Ask me about my vow of silence."
From: ken@wybbs.mi.org (Ken Jongsma)
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Tying 2 Switches to Common Load?
Date: 5 Jan 93 20:37:18 GMT
Reply-To: jongsma@benzie.si.com
Distribution: na
Organization: Smiths Industries

Does someone with access to the NEC know if it's within spec to drive
a common load with two switches?

I'm thinking about using a common exhaust fan for two bathrooms. I'd
like either switch to turn the fan on and was thinking that all I'd
need to do would be to wire the fan and both switches in parallel.
The net effect would be that either bathroom switch would be able to turn
on the fan, but both would have to be off for the fan to go off.

Both switches are on the same breaker, with the breaker being the
GFI type.

The drawback that I can see is that the black wire of the switch
not engaged has the potential for being "hot" even though the switch
is off. Not a problem unless someone is messing with the wiring at
a later date, right? 

Does the fact that a GFI breaker is involved change things?

Insights appreciated.

Ken
-- 
Ken Jongsma                                     jongsma@benzie.si.com
Smiths Industries                                    ken@wybbs.mi.org 
Grand Rapids, Michigan                      73115.1041@compuserve.com
From: tomb@atp.serum.kodak.com (Tom "USA" Bullinger (x37419))
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
Subject: Replacement Zone Valves?
Summary: Need quality!
Date: 4 Jan 93 13:18:53 GMT
Reply-To: tomb@serum.kodak.com
Organization: Clinical Diagnostics Division, Eastman Kodak Company

Hi there! 
   My zone valves continue to crap out on a regular basis. I'd like
   to replace them with something more reliable, but I haven't a
   clue as to which one I should buy. Anyone have any experience
   they would like to share?

   My current zone valves are from 'Flair'. They consist of a rotating
   butterfly valve driven by a clock motor. A rotary switch and relay
   fire-up the boiler. I've looked at several different brands, but the
   store doesn't have any feel for which is best. The simplest seems
   to be the TACO (that's tay-co), the most complex is the White-Rodgers.
   Naturally, the TACO is the most expensive, the White-Rodgers the 
   least. There are also some intermediate models. 
   Also, what will I need for thermostats? Do they need to match the
   zone valves, or will my present ones work?
   
   Many thanks for everyone's help on this subject, I can't continue
   my repairs until I have more info. 


         ------------------------------------------------------
        | tomb@serum.kodak.com                                 |
        |                                                      |
        | "How can he remember well his ignorance -- which his |
        |  growth requires -- who has so often to use his      |
        |  knowledge?"     Henry David Thoreau                 |
         ------------------------------------------------------
From: wlp@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Bill Pherigo)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 17:00:19 GMT
Subject: Thermostat wiring question
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house

    I'm trying to hack the interface to my furnace to allow it to be controlled
by my PC.  My thermostat, A Chronotherm III, has 5 wires going to it.  I was
able to to deduce from looking at the schematic for the furnace that one wire
is a common, one is to turn on the Fan, and a third is either to turn on the
flame, or to turn on both the flame and the fan (not sure).  The A/C was added
to the furnace as an option, and I can't locate a schematic for it.  I would
expect there to be a single wire to turn on the A/C compressor.  This leaves
that 5th wire that I can't figure out.  I would think that this is a standard
interface that someone in net land could tell me about.  Any help?

Bill Pherigo

Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house
From: slk1@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (stephen.l.kay)
Subject: Need advice on furnace flue condensation
Keywords: furnace
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:28:03 GMT


I've got the following problem. The exhaust flue for the  gas furnace in my basement
runs in my crawl space for about 25 feet before entering the masonary chimney on
the side of my house. When the temperature outside gets below 25 degrees F, the
water vapor in the exhaust condenses in the flue of the chimney and drips back
down into the crawl space. 

The house is a year and a half old. Last winter I got the contractor to install
a flue liner in the chimney. This succeeded in eliminating condensation until the
outside temperature gets below 25 degrees (not cold enough for Chicago). Since the
warranty on my house expired at one year, I now own this problem. 

My first thought was to insulate the flue that runs the length of my crawl space. 
This would  keep the exhaust gas hotter and hopefully lower the temperature at
which the condensation starts. Does anybody have any suggestions on the best way
to insulate the furnace flue? Any other suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Steve Kay

Newsgroups: misc.consumers.house