HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi,soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Multiuser Multitasking Magazine
From: rleberle@vax1.umkc.edu
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 06:11:22 GMT
Organization: University of Missouri - Kansas City

In article <199210082121.AA07925@tuna.wang.com>, MICHAEL.WILLETT@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("Michael Willett") writes:
> I found out that it is indeed possible to get a sample copy of
> iX Multiuser Multitasking magazine.  All you have to do is send a
> letter requesting a sample copy (Probeexemplar) to Verlag Heinz
> Heise, Vertrieb, Helstorfer Strasse 7, 3000 Hannover 61, Germany.
> Hannover is the site of the world's largest computer show each Spring,
> Cebit.  I presume this is published only in German, but I'm not sure.
> 
Try it. In my opinion it's the best german UNIX magazine. 
You can also reach them at post@ix.de

			Inland		Ausland
Abonnement              81.-DM		88.80 DM
Studenten		71,40 DM	79,80 DM
Versandkosten           16,20 DM	28,20 DM (Luftpost auf Anfrage)

(aus Impressum iX 9/92)
----
Rainer Leberle               			rleberle@sparc2.cstp.umkc.edu
University of Kansas City, MO
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
From: ta@ontario (Lu Ta)
Subject: Data rate of SCSI on PC/WorkStation query
Organization: Xerox
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 22:02:15 GMT

Hi,

Can anyone tell me the range of data rate on SCSI disks 
on  PC(386), Macintosh and Workstations(Sun, HP, Appolo, etc..)

Please copy me in when you answer. Lta.wbst311@xerox.com

Thanks in advance.

Lou Ta
From: brb@falcon.is (Bjorn R. Bjornsson)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Re: SCSI bad sector handling
Date: 10 Oct 92 04:33:54 GMT
Organization: Gagntaekni/Bijective Tech.

strike@steam.rome.ny.us (Strikemaster) writes:
>How do you tell when a SCSI hard disk is developing problems?  It's been
>three years now since this ST296N was installed, almost nine months of
>non-stop running in the last twelve, and not a peep as far as bad sectors.

You will see failed reads/writes.  Whether you receive further explanation
depends on your OS.

>Given that SCSI drives handle errors internally without the OS being
>informed,

I think there is a common misconception here.  It is not true
in general that SCSI drives handle errors internally (ie. reallocate
bad blocks automatically).  The operative word is that they CAN
do this processing automatically, it's a software selectable user
option.  It is also an option whether or not to notify the user
(post error) when an error (recoverable in one way or another) occurs.

Most (read all that I've checked) of they drives I've seen have
automatic reallocation (read and write) disabled by the manufacturer
or vendor.

Besides, you can't always easily tell whether the drive is going bad
or something else is going wrong.  For example I've seen drives develop
bad blocks because of marginal power connectors.  You may reclaim
such blocks by reformatting the drive or possibly by rewriting the
block.

>I'd like to know of impending doom before the smoke begins to
>roll out of the cage.

Basically your drive will fail in one of three ways:

	1) HDA (Head Disk Assembly) goes bad,
	   head crash, surface defect, wear, etc.
	2) Power and motor control circuitry fails.
	3) Disk controller and/or SCSI interface fails.

2 & 3 are quite likely to leave you with a drive that is dead.
1 will start giving, lots of bad blocks all at once(head crash),
or steadily increasing bad blocks (spreading surface defect due
to particle contaminition, I would guess).

You may accumulate the occational bad block without worry over years
of use.  In my experience this is rarer, than the case where a drive
works flawlessly for a period of time and then degrades to complete
unusability in short order (minutes, hours or days), or dies outright.

If you see your drive failing, back it up immediately. If your
religious and don't have a back up: pray.

I'm not religious,

Bjorn R. Bjornsson
brb@falcon.is
From: dcrocker@cisco.com (Dan Crocker)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Re: SCSI, FastSCSI, SCSI-2: What are the differences?
Date: 14 Oct 92 20:46:13 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

fred j mccall 575-3539 (mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com) wrote:
: 
: I've run mine under DOS both with and without the ASPI driver
: installed.  Runs fine either way, as long as there isn't a second SCSI
: controller or more than 2 drives involved.

So what's the date on your BIOS ROM?  Mine said 1988 when it started to run
but that may be just a copywrite date and not the actual date of the code.
Your EISA card may have a more recent version of the BIOS or maybe it's quite
different (considering yours is a different card on a different bus).
I don't know any of this, of course; I'm just guessing.  My point is that
just because your EISA host adapter works in a 486-50 doesn't mean that the
ISA version doesn't have this (or any other) kind of problem.

It's a shame I don't have it anymore because I would have loved to figure this
out (as if I don't have enough stuff to do already :-)).  My original question
was answered, I guess, since no one has come out and said they had the same
problems as I did.

By the way, the ROM on my Ultrastor also is supposed to have the code to deal 
with the DMA services (virtual to physical address conversion) that you need 
for MS-Windows (my adaptec didn't).  This means that I don't need to load 
their driver unless I have more than two disks.  I have been loading it 
however for performance reasons (running from the 8-bit rom is a little 
slower I think).  If I figure out how to shadow the ROM, I should be able to 
save that memory. 

Dan
From: aris@unisup1.uucp (Aris Stathakis)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Re: DAT vs. 8mm
Date: 12 Oct 92 09:25:56 GMT
Organization: Lasernet (pty) Ltd.

In <1992Oct5.213835.14131@fasttech.uucp> zeke@fasttech.uucp (Bohdan Tashchuk) writes:

>In <BvMMzw.Ayn@ddsw1.mcs.com> karl@ddsw1.mcs.com (Karl Denninger) writes:

>>QIC type drives sound nice, but until they get the media to a reasonable
>>cost I'll not be making them my next choice.

>>I'm looking into the new Archive Python DAT series (the ones with "Turbo
>>Dat") which include data compression.  It appears those can be had in the
>>$1500 range.

>DAT's the way to go. Companies like 3M and Tandberg are pushing QIC (probably
>because they don't have DAT or 8mm), but they're beating a dead horse.

>QIC is 70's technology, pushed far beyond where it should be.

>Is anybody out there actually BUYING the 1 GB QIC drives? If so, why?

1GB+ QIC drives have their place if you need high density backup _AND_
backward compatibility with your old 60/150/250/525 MB backups.  Most 1GB+
QIC drives do support reading and writing of the older formats (at least
the the Archive QIC 1.35GB drives suppport writing of 150/250/525 and reading
of 60/150/250/525 tapes authomagically).  The QIC drives (I can only speak
of the Archive) have a phenomenal data rate - 36Mbye/min for the Archive
Anaconda 1.35GB QIC as opposed to 11 Mbyte/min data rate of the Archive
Python 2.0GB DAT drive.

Otherwise I agree - DAT is the way to go. The tapes and smaller, hold more
data and are cheaper, but some people just need that backward compatibility.

Aris

-- 
Aris Stathakis        Tel +27 11 887 4220 |Gimme a beer and money sandwitch -  
SCO Unix Support      Fax +27 11 887 1141 |Hold the bread. - Waldo D.R. Dobbs
UniNet - A Division of Lasernet (Pty) Ltd |_________________________________
P.O. Box 78446, Sandton, 2146, R.S.A       Internet:   aris@unisup1.UUCP      
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
From: ghenniga@NMSU.Edu
Subject: TK50 & Adaptec 1542B?
Reply-To: ghenniga@NMSU.Edu
Organization: New Mexico State University - Electromagnetics Group
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 05:06:11 GMT



	Is there any way to run a DEC TK50 SCSI tape drive on a PC equipped
with an Adaptec 1542B? I'm running OS/2 2.0 and have a serious need to do
a backup but with no money I thought I could borrow one of our old TK50's
from the University! Good idea but will it work???

Thanks in advance,
Gary Hennigan
---------
PhD Student, Computational Electromagnetics
New Mexico State University
email: ghenniga@NMSU.Edu
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
From: martin@unislc.uucp (Martin Cryer)
Subject: Re: eisa scsi host adapt
Reply-To: martin@unislc.UUCP (Martin Cryer,D1Z01,5754)
Organization: Unisys, Salt Lake City
Distribution: comp
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 21:05:38 GMT

In article <1992Oct15.638.758@ALMAC> terry.harris@almac.co.uk writes:
>Hi Mike + All
>
>Mike Lainhart wrote:-
>
>Hassle with the EISA config never coming back with what I set in enhanced

I cannot (and won't) comment on the rest of this, but we use the 1740
and 1740A controllers. I remember (I think) that the config never coming
back in enhanced mode was due to a bad overlay program.

I think you need the newer ADP0000.OVL program. Adaptec BBS may be some
help in getting the later OVL (and perhaps download code if you have a 1740).
I cannot remember if I had to update the download code at the same time as
the OVL file.

See, this is what alcohol does to the memory!!!

The work around for the ENHANCED mode stuff not coming back was
due (once again from memory) to the previous correctly set data
being loaded back into the memory by the overlay program, 1
byte out of alignment. Anyway, as long as this info is correct
when you actually save it, it gets written OK, you just have to
redo it subsequent time you modify the parameters so once again
it will get saved correctly.

>Cheers Terry...
>---
> ~ OLX 2.2 ~ terry.harris@almac.co.uk
>--
>ALMAC BBS Ltd. 0324-665371
>Dos based USENET access,  call for details!

Martin Cryer
UNIX SVR4.0/MP Development
UNISYS Salt Lake City

All opinions are my own and NOT those of my employer. All suggestions
are for amusement purposes only. Backup everything before doing
anything. It will all end in tears anyway....
From: jrr@jukes.eslvcr.wimsey.bc.ca (John Robertson)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: SCSI Bus Extenders
Date: 14 Oct 92 04:58:59 GMT
Organization: John's Jukes BBS, Vancouver, BC (604) 872-2010

To: All

I have received some mail looking for SCSI Bus Extenders so here is the 
dope on it.
PARALAN Corporation
7171 Ronson Rd.
San Diego, CA 92111
(619)560-7266
Fax:(619)560-8929

This is from a letter dated April 8, 1992
"The PARALAN SCSI Bus Extenders enable you to place SCSI peripherals up
to 1000 feet from the host using coaxial of fibre optic cable. These extenders are completely transparent to the hardware, software and the operator and there
is no loss in data throughput even in the SCSI asynchronous mode. You can use 
the SCSI drivers you are currently using."
I suggest that any interested parties call for latest info.

--  
 jrr@jukes.eslvcr.wimsey.bc.ca     John Robertson
-->>regular Mail<<-- not UPS!! 
 John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., 
 Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
  Old pinballers never die, they just flip out.
Xref: sparky comp.periphs.scsi:4940 comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware:26695 comp.sys.mac.wanted:9410 comp.sys.mac.misc:17696 comp.sys.mac.hardware:18858
From: tdslotte@mcs.drexel.edu (Dave Slotter)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware,comp.sys.mac.wanted,comp.sys.mac.misc,comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Wanted: Toshiba 105 hard drive controller cards
Date: 12 Oct 92 15:26:16 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Drexel University, Dept. of Math. and Comp. Sci.

I have two dead drive controllers for two identical Toshiba 105 hard drives.
The model number of the drives are FKM324.  I don't know too much more about
them, but I need to know where to find them.  Can someone give me some help?
If anyone has any for sale, I'd be willing to buy one or two.  If anyone knows
of who I can call or go to to get a replacement/repair, please let me know.

(I'm talking about the pcboard which is directly attached to the hard drive
mechanism and which you aren't supposed to remove from the drive unless you
know what you're doing.)

Please reply via email or leave a message at 215-895-2573.  Thanks in advance!

-Dave Slotter
-- 
tdslotte@mcs.drexel.edu (preferred)      | SysOp ,The DUsers (World's first MUG)
slotter@gnu.ai.mit.edu                   | James Creese Student Union Complex
DAVE.SLOTTER@p9.f922.n273.z1.fidonet.org | 3210 Chestnut Street
215-895-2573 voicemail 215-895-2579 BBS  | Philadelphia, PA  19104-3412, USA
Xref: sparky comp.periphs.scsi:5025 comp.unix.bsd:7558
From: paoletti@cps.msu.edu (David Paoletti)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi,comp.unix.bsd
Subject: dump parameters for 6250 tapes?
Date: 17 Oct 92 03:32:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: msuinfo.1992Oct17.033244.7007
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Michigan State University
Originator: paoletti@canidae.cps.msu.edu

I'm using a Wangtek 5150ES drive with 386BSD, and need
to know what parameters to use for a dump.  Could I use
208 for the B (number of 1024 byte blocks) parameter?
Or should I specify density & feet?

Thanks!
  Dave Paoletti :)
Xref: sparky comp.periphs.scsi:4987 comp.sys.amiga.hardware:17192
From: jdp@caleb.UUCP (Jim Pritchett)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Quantum PRO-105S problem
Date: 15 Oct 92 02:23:00 GMT
Followup-To: comp.periphs.scsi
Organization: is sometimes desirable

Recently I posted a query about a problem I had with 2 Quantum PRO-105S drives
that worked fine separately, but would generate intermittent SCSI errors when
used together on the same controller (GVP 030 SCSI.)  The first time I called
Quantum, the guy assured me that there was no problem with the drives.  I called
again today and another guy told me that there is an updated ROM which should
fix the problem.  He promised to send me the new ROMs.  I hope this information
helps someone out there.


                                                Jim Pritchett


UUCP:  rwsys.lonestar.org!caleb!jdp
 or    utacfd.uta.edu!rwsys!caleb!jdp
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
From: geirp@mekker.uio.no (Geir Pedersen)
Subject: (Industry) standard for Scanner on SCSI ?
Organization: Center for Information Technology Services, University of Oslo,
	Norway
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 21:52:20 GMT


Many scanners may be connected to a host over SCSI. I presume this is
done using the standard SCSI or SCSI-2 commands. Are these vendors
using the commands according to some standard, or is the usage vendor
specify? 

Any information on this would be appreciated. 

Thanks,

Geir Pedersen
University of Oslo
From: ye01@uk.co.gec-mrc (Andrew Crisp)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Where can I but scsi 2 drive ?
Keywords: scsi2
Date: 9 Oct 92 11:00:32 GMT
Distribution: uk
Organization: GEC-Marconi Research Centre, Great Baddow, UK

Help !

 Could someone please tell me of any outlets for scsi 2 hard drives.
 Or who makes them and their address.  

					 Cheers 
						  Andy.

-- 
Andrew Crisp, Computer Resources | Tel: +44 245 73331 x 3226 
GEC-Marconi Research Centre      | Fax: +44 245 75244 Telex: 995016 GECRES G
GEC-Marconi Ltd, Great Baddow    | uucp: <world>!ukcnet!gec-mrc!crisp
Chelmsford,Essex. UK CM2 8HN     | Other: crisp@gec-mrc.co.uk
From: kolbe@cellwar (Andreas Kolbe)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: EISA or MC SCSI boards with NCR 53C710/53C720 ???
Date: 7 Oct 92 09:50:30 GMT
Organization: Cellware Breitband Technologie GmbH, Berlin, Germany

Hallo  !


Currently I investigate the programming capabilities  of the SCSI controllers
from NCR  53C710 / 53C720 (especially with the help of the high level 
SCSI SCRIPTS from NCR).
Now I looking for a EISA or MC SCSI board with one of these SCSI controllers.
NCR offers only a SCSI development board for a ISA bus !
I will develop a own SCSI driver for a research project, but we want Fast SCSI
and the ISA bus will be the bottleneck.   

Who can help to find a manufacturer, which offers a EISA or MC SCSI adapter 
with integrated NCR 710 / 720 controller ? 


Thanks, 

Andreas

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Adress: Andreas Kolbe
	CELLWARE Broadband Technology Company
	Gustav-Meyer-Allee 25
	W-1000 Berlin 65, Germany
	E-Mail: kolbe%cellwar.uucp@Germany.EU.net
From: mark@hpcpbla.bri.hp.com (Mark Simms)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Re: DAT vs. 8mm
Date: 8 Oct 92 15:03:41 GMT
Organization: HP Computer Peripherals Bristol, UK

>> The streaming speed on this drive is also better than the  
>> 187 I quoted earlier.  "Sustained transfer 366-732 K/sec"
>> Why the range, I don't know.  That may be using  
>> compression, and hence the write to tape is constant.   
>> Perhaps someone from HP would care to comment.

As you said, the data rate to tape is 187kbytes/sec.  Add two to four
times compression and you get the range of transfer rates.

Mark Simms

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Opinions expressed are my own and are not intended to be an official
statement by Hewlett-Packard Company
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Name:         Mark Simms
Profession:   Software Engineer
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Computer Peripherals Division
Unix-mail:    mark@hpcpbla.bri.hp.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
From: ajchuah@mtu.edu (Low Profile)
Subject: More OS..possible or problems??
Reply-To: ajchuah@mtu.edu
Organization: Michigan Technological University
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 00:20:21 GMT




	I am currently running OS2 and DOS with my IN2000 SCSI Controller.
So far, no problems.  I now plan to install BSD(a free version of 
Unix for PC).  My questions are:

1) What kind of boot manager should i use?  Any good stuff out there
   that works with SCSI and Unix?

2) If i partition my HD, can the other OS(DOS and OS/2) recognize 
   the HD?  Would there be problems in reading data?  Would the Unix
   OS be able to read only its formatted partitions or would it be
   able to read from all partitions?

3) How should i arrange my HD?  Should i put the Unix partition last
   or the OS/2 partition last?

4) What happens when if i plan to remove Unix...do i have to low-level
   format my HD in order to use it for DOS and OS2?  If i have
   to low-level format, would that destroy teh rest of the
   partitions?  Or would they still be ok?

5) Any advice on the above idea would be useful.  Please post as soon
   as possible as i will be installing this next week.   Thanx.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|                           |    *BARK* *BARK* *BARK*  In Love with OS/2      |
| Alex J Chuah              |    38640Trident8900Cw1MViewSonic6ESVGAMonitor   |
| ajchuah@mtu.edu           |    64Kcache8MBof70nsOkidataML93onLPT1           |
| ajchuah@mtus5.cts.mtu.edu |    80MB+1.3GBHDAlwaysIN2000SCSIController       |
|                           |    ATIetc/ionCOM2Identity256GSScanner           |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ace@acelab.re.open.de (Andreas Fatum)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Re: Help wanted installing 2nd SCSI in PC.
Distribution: world
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 92 02:13:01 GMT
Organization: Me? Organized?

Hi Claude!
> Because of drive bay layout in my Middle Tower, the Seagate (5.25") is in 
> the middle of the cable, Maxtor (3.5") is at the end.  Terminating resistors
> removed from Seagate.  I have tried many combinations of SCSI IDs on both
> drives.  They work fine by themselves.  FDISK never gives option of selecting
> 2nd drive.
Any clues?
I had the same problems installing my Wangtek SCSI Streamer not long
ago. To cut a long story short: The cable was nuts since the company
where I got it put on the connector the wrong way. I didn't check out if
the red ribbon was located to pin 1 because I trusted the cable and
you can only connect that in one way. So after 1 hour of changing
SCSI IDs, terminator-packs and so on I borrowed another cable
from my neighbour and it worked at once! 
Hope it helps.... just a hint....

cu,
Andreas

---
    Andreas Fatum   ///   ace@acelab.re.open.de   ///   Fido: 2:245/32.19

Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
From: ashah@eos.ncsu.edu (AJAY  SHAH)
Subject: Test.
Organization: North Carolina State University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 00:45:21 GMT

This is a TEST - IGNORE it ...
From: henry@geo.ucalgary.ca (Henry Bland)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Archive python DAT switches
Date: 9 Oct 92 14:50:29 GMT
Organization: Geology & Geophysics, University of Calgary, Canada

Does anyone have an explaination of the dip switch settings
on the Archive python 4330XT or 4331XT.  These switches are located
on the underside of the unit under the plastic cover.

-Henry Bland
University of Calgary
From: dcrocker@cisco.com (Dan Crocker)
Newsgroups: comp.periphs.scsi
Subject: Re: SCSI, FastSCSI, SCSI-2: What are the differences?
Date: 12 Oct 92 03:27:15 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Frank Hoffmann (fh.pad@sni.de) wrote:
: dlparker@dlpinc00.rn.com (David L. Parker) writes:
: 
: >In article <56460@olivea.atc.olivetti.com> dcrocker@cisco.com (Dan Crocker) writes:
: >>
: >>As for the AHA1542B, don't bother with it in my opinion. It is about 5 year
: >>old technology and doesn't support any of SCSI-2.  Also, I bought one and
: >>had lots of trouble with it.  There's been a lot of discussion here about
: >>
: 
: >You didn't specify OS, but I've used the 1542B fairly extensively under both
: >MS-DOS 5.0 and ISC UNIX SVR3, ver 2.2 & 3.0, and have never had any trouble.
: 
: Same experience here ... We use 1542B extensively with DOS 5.00 & 6.00, SCO
: ODT 1.1 & 2.0 and AT&T V.4. By now we had only one problem with 1 controller
: which wasn't very happy if we disconnected the external jack during runtime.

This is interesting since I was never able to figure out why I had so much
trouble.  I was using it with DOS 5.0 with an Orchid 486-50 Superboard
(OPTI chipset with local bus video).  The biggest problem I had was the 
fact that the system wouldn't boot reliably (sometimes hung and had to be 
powered off; not even reset would work).

I have always suspected that this problem had something to do with the speed 
of my processor.  It wouldn't be the first time that some software didn't 
work at 50Mhz. The system seemed to run fine after the aspi driver was loaded.
Of course, I couldn't load it util I booted.  It wasn't the speed of the bus 
since I have it set up to run the bus at the standard 8Mhz speed.  Anyone out 
there have success with a 486-50 system and this board?  By the way, I have 
not had any problems with anything else in this system besides the adaptec.

What I found out from the experience was that, for whatever reason, Adaptec
was not in a position to help me figure out what was happening.  I can't
say that Ultrastor's support is any better, but I know for sure that adaptec 
was worse than most.

Dan
Newsgroups: comp.periphs
From: bryan@jeep (Madeleine Bryan)
Subject: Recommendations on color printers
Keywords: printers
Organization: Trident Data Systems
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 21:58:38 GMT

Information on printers.........

I need reccommendations on COLOR printers that do the following:

1) Simulaneous Connection to UNIX and MAC (Ethernet TCPIP and Appletalk)
2) Lotsa Colors including Pantone ( I do not know alot on unix color )
3) Postscript Type I and II
4) Ability to increase memory (like over 8???)
5) Not alot of Cartrige changes from Black/White to Color but not alot 
   of Cartridge replacements either

Can some one reccomend brands / vendors in the LA area?
We have been looking at

  Tektronix PXi
  QMS 210
  NEC (no TCPIP???)
  ColorPoint ???
 
How does anyone feel about RasterOPs???  

Price range may get to high in the Dye sublimation arena (even though they  
are AWESOME) but we also are not going really really cheap either.  Some 
where with good quality and connectivitiy and speed.
 

Thank You in Mesozoic time []:)<--- blockhead

Madeleine MADDOG Bryan
bryan@tds.com (NeXT Mail Accepted)
----- don' need no stinkn' disclaimer or quote.