HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cwe34361@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (cE!)
Subject: Re: What is industrial music?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 09:15:11 GMT

Wow.  This is the third post I've added to this thread.  But it's so exciting,
I can hardly stand it.  And I never can resist following up to S&F's posts,
because he makes it so easy for me to advertise:

tll6551@zeus.tamu.edu (Scholar and Fool) writes:

>easteee@wkuvx1.bitnet writes...
>>What exactly is 'industrial' music?

>That's a good question - and one that people who listen to 'industrial' 
>music can never seem to agree on either.

I know.  It's really too bad that bands never seem to fit exactly into our
little boxes.  :)


>My stab at a fair definition: a type of music based a lot on beats and 
>rhythms. Usually synth-based. Typically has a prominant bass-line.
>Usually involves some sort of distortion on instruments and/or vocals.
>Attitude tends to be agressive to hopeless. 

But not always!  Even so, Chris says he thinks the gWs album is depressing.


HEY YOU!!!!
I HOPE YOU GO OUT TO BUY THE violet burning ALBUMS BEFORE JANUARY, BUT IF NOT,

THEN GET THE globalWAVEsystem ALBUM, _LIFE EQUALS DEATH_, FROM BLONDE VINYL
RECORDS, WHILE YOU'RE AT THE STORE.  BUY ONE FOR EACH FAMILY MEMBER.
Sorry about the capitals.  Order your copy today, if you can.
This is industrial.  Like Skinny Puppy, but we have a clue about eternity.


>I've got the single-release by Under Midnight. Sounds pretty good.

(Ugh.)

>$%&^%$&($%^&@$#%!@#%^&#$%*^%__!_$%^*$#%^@#$%^@#&%#$^%*@$%^@#%&#$%^*#$%^&#$%$%
>@  (%&    *$@    )*&%&(  # /_/\/\  |    Terry Leifeste, Scholar and Fool    $
>&  $#% #& (&* (@ $%^$@*  & \_\  /  | TLL6551@ZEUS.TAMU.EDU  TLL6551@TAMZEUS &
>#  ($%    #$*    @#*     @ /_/  \  -----------------------------------------@
>*  @#$*$%&*$@%^@&#%*()@  * \_\/\ \   "Who do you think started Christian    %
>(  @#$^$*%^#$%&#$*       %    \_\/  rock? I did!" -Lew Siffer (Chick Tract) $
>$%&^*$%&$#%^@$%&#%^*#%^@#$#%&^*$%&)($#&@#%$^&#$^*($^$*(V3.3)*#@)!%^*$#%^*$%@&

But I never really could beat your .sig, Terry.  I'll just add our piddly one:

christian E! / globalWAVEsystem
If we put out garbage we'd be globalWASTEsystem (one of our friends thought
this was the name for a while).

============================================================================
g    l    o    b    a    l    W    A    V    E    s    y    s    t    e    m 
l    i    f    e      e    q    u    a    l    s       d    e    a    t    h
         1                  9                  9                  3

w           a            k            e                       u            p
f   e   n   c   e   r   i   d   e   r  g   r   e   y   s   c   a   l   e   r  
y  o  u  r     t  i  m  e      h  a  s      c  o  m  e      t  o     d  i  e  

B   l   o   n   d   e      V   i   n   y   l       R   e   c   o   r   d   s
============================================================================
From: robertt@vcd.hp.com (Bob Taylor)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: VECTOR: Where are they now?
Date: 11 Nov 92 17:45:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: vcd.BxKBz9.Jpt
Organization: Hewlett-Packard VCD
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

James Roy Smith jr (smith@casbah.acns.nwu.edu) wrote:
: In article <1992Nov10.235342.29197@nmsu.edu> mwalls@nmsu.edu (Commander Keen) writes:
: ->Vector (to my knowledge) is no more.  However, 2 members of the group
: ->I can give you info on.
: 
: 	i was just over at True Tunes in Wheaton this past weekend and i
: happened to but Mannequin Virtue/Please Stand By on cd -- a 20 track disc
: for $14.  pretty nice.  at true tunes, they had a stack of vector's new
: (latest?) cd that was a foot and a half tall.  there was also a concert
: t-shirt hanging on the wall.  i'm sorry i don't remember the name of the
: album but i think it was released within the past year (1992 release if my
: memory serves me correct).

This is probably "Simple Experience" which is a (1989 I think) independent
release.  It's essentially a Steve Griffith (bass & vocals) and Jimmy
Abegg(guitars) project.  From what I hear (from a guy who used to work
here & was a good friend of Jim's), Vector really doesn't exist anymore -
Steve has a job in California (doing video production, i think) and 
Jimmy is in Nashville doing solo stuff, studio work, and painting.  There
essentially was no money in Vector - they didn't have a big enough
audience.  I think Steve Griffith has done some production for some
Christian alternative bands, but I'm not sure about this.  Simple 
Experience was really a temporary project (Steve had writtem some
songs - he and Jim threw them together on an 8 track in about a week).

Somebody also commented that they liked Mannequin Virtue better than
Please Stand By - I'll disagree (just for the heck of it).  Actually,
I thought alot of the keyboard stuff on Mannequin Virtue was kind of
forced - Please Stand By seemed more natural to me.  Charlie Peacock and
Vector both made much better music after Charlie left - IMHO.

: 	so, something tells me that Vector might still be but i am not
: completely sure.  maybe someone else can clarify...

i don't think so - not in any real form.
: 
: ->Craig
: -jim
: -- 
:  Jim Smith	 o   o	 Student Consultant	        /   o  /\ /\
:  jrsjr@nwu.edu	   <	 ACNS			    /  /   /  / |/ |
:  708.332.4566	 \___/	 Northwestern University    \_/   /  /  /  /    ez.

Bob Taylor
HP Vancouver
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: ajw@cbnews.cb.att.com (andrew.j.whitman)
Subject: Re: What is industrial music?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 13:37:04 GMT

In article <1dpbr1INNfn4@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> pearsodc@HYDRA.ROSE-HULMAN.EDU writes:
>taken from the sig of somebody whose name i prematurely munched:
>
>>| "What about Headman Shabalala? Doesn't anybody care about justice?"-AA |
>
>that's from the song "worldwide" off of the new adam again album.
>
>what the heck is gene trying to say?

I haven't heard the Adam Again song, so this could be completely off 
base, but . . . 

Headman Shabalala was the leader of the wonderful a capella South
African group Ladysmith Black Mambazo.  If you've heard Paul Simon's
"Graceland" album, then you've heard their incredible vocals.  They
also recorded about a dozen albums of their own music, most on the
Shanachie label, and most of them are dominated by traditional
South African hymns and praises to Jesus.  It's beautiful, uplifting
music, and I highly recommend it.

At any rate, Shabalala was killed about a year ago when rival Zulu
and ANC factions engaged in a gun battle in Soweto Township.  
He was an innocent bystander and got caught in the crossfire.  I'm
guessing that Gene's lyric is a comment on that event.  

>clueless chuck
>pearsodc@rosevc.rose-hulman.edu

Andy Whitman
AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus, Ohio
att!cblpn!ajw  or
ajw@cblpn.att.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: magnum@cs.tu-berlin.de (Magnus Niemann)
Subject: Help! I need P&W-CD's
Organization: Technical University of Berlin, Germany
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 15:03:48 GMT

Hello brothers and sisters (and so on) out there!
 Well, I'm leading the worship in a very small service just here in
Berlin (Germany) and I am looking for fine new Praise&WorshipSongs all
of the time. Problem: It takes a very very long time to have a new
song being translated into german language (and even then, in most cases
 the original is much, much better...) and so I am interested in
brandnew songs directly from the U.S. and the U.K. Could someone tell
me the best CD's (and from where I can get them)?
 Please pardon my bad english, but the only english I'm speaking is
CS-English like WHILE, PROCEDURE, IF/THEN and other primitives. If
christians in germany or overseas are more interested in my person,
mail me... (magnum@cs.tu-berlin.de or mackaide@zrz.tu-berlin.de).
 Thank you, Magnus

PS: Sind irgendwelche Christen aus Deutschland auch an Anbetung und
-leitung interessiert?! Mail an s. o.
From: darenm@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Daren McClearnon)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: VECTOR: Where are they now?
Date: 9 Nov 92 17:15:02 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Rosa, CA

Almost ten years ago, I really liked a group called "Vector".  They 
had two albums that I know of, "Mannequin Virtue" and "Please Stand 
By".  I have "Please Stand By" on vinyl, but would like to have both 
(preferrably on CD) if they are still available.

* Are these guys still around?  
* Are these old recordings available on CD or are they out of print?  
* Failing that, are the albums available (new or used)?
* Recommendations on mail order places (with address & phone numbers) 
  on where I might be able to obtain same?

Thanks in advance,

Daren McClearnon
darenm@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: dlovely@meaddata.com (David Lovely)
Subject: Re: drums and worship
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:10:29 GMT
Distribution: usa

|>    This is my first time posting on ANY news thing, and I've tried
|> twice already, so bear with me.
|> 
|>    I am a relatively new drummer for our church and would like to generate
|> discussion about the use of drums in worship.  Although drums and cymbals
|> have been mentioned in the OT in conjunction with praise, it seems to me
|> like some churches feel like drums are more distracting than other more
|> conventional "worship" instruments (e.g. guitar and keyboards)  Specifically,
|> what are some steps that I can take to minimize distracting effects and
|> maximize the additive effects of drums?  
|> 
|>    Also, I would like to make an open call to all ye drummers out there:
|> I'd really like to set up some sort of email list so we can share ideas
|> from time to time.  Feel free to send your address to me, and maybe
|> a brief intro about your involvement with drums and worship...

As a fellow church drummer, let me share some of my own experiences:

I have played in 2 different churches, both of which are Southern Baptist.
One of them used drums with traditional hymns & a small orchestral ensemble.
My current church is a more contemporary and upbeat 5-piece band that plays
"modern" praise/worship songs.

The most difficult aspect about drumming is with acoustic drums.  Unless they are
VERY heavily damped (2-ply or oil-filled heads, etc.)  The echo that most church
auditoriums (especially those with brick/stone facades) exhibit will override the
rest of the band/orchestra.

The solution my current church adopted is an all-electronic kit, even the cymbals
& hats.  The pads/triggers are hooked into a "brain" such as our Allessis D4.  The
output can be piped directly into the PA for mixing at an appropriate level.

The only drawback to this setup is that you can't do cymbal rolls or other acoustic
"subtilties", but otherwise, the sounds are very realistic.  As an adden bonus, you can
change kits between songs by just the turn of a knob.  :-)

Hope this helps!


-- 
*******************************************************************************
David P. Lovely						    I can't believe it!
Mead Data Central			  We just elected another Jimmy Carter.
Dayton, Ohio						       Vote KEMP in 96!
		NO DISCLAIMER NEEDED (Nobody claims me anyway!)
*******************************************************************************
From: iba@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Wayne Iba)
Subject: Re: Rachel,Rachel, (Kansas, POKR, Kerry Livgren, etc.)
Organization: NASA/ARC Information Sciences Division
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 21:05:21 GMT

Tom Moellering <moeller@convex.com> writes:
>>[Regarding Rachel, Rachel's cover of Kansas' "Carry on wayward son"]

>Well, Denes, Kerry Livgren wrote the song, after his conversion to Christ,
>I believe.  I don't want to bore you with what you already perhaps know,
>but from that album (Point of Know Return) on the themes of his songs
>were quickly diverging from the rest of those that were on the Kansas albums.

A correction:  Carry on is on "Leftoverture", not PoKR.
Also, Kerry didn't become christian until around Monolith (I think).

From Kansas' first album, a significant fraction of the songs had
themes involving spiritual things and searching.  Kerry's book
"Seeds of Change" chronicles his personal search and conversion.
The book is not particularly well written (par for christian publications)
but does contain the detailed information if you are interested.

Finally, it is a shame that Kansas' music deteriorated after they became
popular and also after several became christians.

--wayne (iba@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Chasing kangaroos
From: jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu (jason 'Think!' steiner)
Date: 11 Nov 92 01:43:15 EST
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

burtp@rs6304.ecs.rpi.edu (Philip Nason Burt) writes:
> proud men build holy shrines; wise men wonder

..Bugs Bunny dug to china
I guess i'll go down under
Choir, Choir, pants on fire
it's alright to laugh out loud
If the night is uninspired
Fear the ghost, forgive the crowd

One day i'll be in a trench
working for (Bill) the builder guy
If Sydney is my destiny
I guess I'll dig until I die
Shovel go deep, heart beat true
Chase the Kangaroo

> i just don't know--- but i love this album

dittos.

> sometimes i think it is my favorite tape of all time

it's mine.

> i'm surprised it hasn't worn out yet!

i wore mine out. it's the reason i bought my CD player. i want
to be able to listen to this album for a long time to come.

jason

--
                       The Conspiracy continues: 
                  "Sliced grapes!" - Nine Inch Nails
           "Mozzarella! Fists in the air!" - Front Line Assembly
`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,`,` jsteiner@anwsun.phya.utoledo.edu ,`,`,`
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: drice@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Keith Rice)
Subject: Re: Mister Mister Christian?
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 04:01:46 GMT

In <1689ABFA1.AVERNON1@ua1vm.ua.edu> AVERNON1@ua1vm.ua.edu (Andrew Vernon) writes:

>In article <davej.42.0@gmuvax2.gmu.edu>
>davej@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (David F. Juraschek) writes:
>>Was it just me or did anyone else get the impression (from lyrics and
>>subtle gestures/imagery in videos) that Mr. Mr. may have really been a
>>secular group but made up of Christians?
>I get that impression too. Mr. Mister frontman Richard Page has worked
>with Amy Grant a couple of times. Quite a few Christians are making a
>living in secular music (aside from Amy and Smitty's crossovers), including
>Michael Omartain (Who has turned the knobs for Peter Cetera and Rod Stewart)
> 
>>By the way, what happened to them anyway?
>I don't know, but I would suspect they are probably writing or recording
>either as a group, or as session musicians. (sheer conjecture)
> 
The following taken from _Modern_Drummer_ magazine's Update column in the
December, 1992 issue.  

	"Pat Mastelotto can be heard on the Rembrandts' new album,
	and on tracks for Jude Cole, Michael Penn, and Peter Kingsley
	(which he coproduced).  Pat is also doing live dates with
	the Rembrandts."

Pat Mastelotto was the drummer (obviously) for Mr. Mister.

--
_____________________________
__-----____--___--__-----____	D. Keith Rice
__--__--___--__--___--__--___	University of North Texas
__--___--__--_--____--___--__	Department of Computer Science
__--___--__----_____--__--___	Denton, Texas, USA
__--___--__--_--____--_--____
__--__--___--__--___--__--___	drice@ponder.csci.unt.edu
__-----____--___--__--___--__            - or -
_____________________________   drice@cs.unt.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: rabanes@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Greg Rabanes)
Subject: HyperCard stack archive of r.m.c
Organization: University of Hawaii
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 13:40:42 GMT


hi ho :)

now that I don't IRC anymore I have lots of time to spare :) so I decided
to write a very simple HyperCard stack that would let me sorta archive the
stuff that goes on in this newsgroup. I really need some ideas on what kind
of features I should program into the stack, so if anyone wants to try the
stack out please e-mail me and I'll mail you a copy :)

bye ho,
Greg
From: tford@convex.com (Tom Ford)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: drums and worship
Date: 13 Nov 92 18:22:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.1992Nov13.182246.8534
Distribution: usa
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

I'm am a worship leader not not a drummer.  But, here are some of my opinions 
and experiences.

I think for upbeat songs, you have to have some kind of percussion to have
a full sound.  For slow songs, the drummer has to be very sensitive and
not overpowering.  The drummers at our church us chimes and cymbal rolls 
tastefully in slow worship songs.  

We have a wall around the drums to keep them from overpowering the room.  The
wall has about 3" of insulation facing the drums to dampen the sound and 
plywood on the outside.  The wall is solid from the floor to just above the top
of the toms and has 2' of plexiglass above that to block the cymbals.   It
works well, but I think it is overkill, personally, especially since he now 
have to mic the drums and our mic setup is limited.  It is better than a solid
plexiglass wall since the insulation absorbs the sound rather than reflecting 
it back at the drummer.  And the top part being plexiglass allows the drummer 
to see out.  We got the idea for the design of the wall from an acoustic 
consultant if that means anything.  The drummers don't like it though since it
separates them from feeling the congregation.  But, with the size of our 
meeting room, we had to do something about the sound.

In article <1992Nov13.081029.9284@meaddata.com> dlovely@meaddata.com (David Lovely) writes:

>The solution my current church adopted is an all-electronic kit, even the cymbals
>& hats.  The pads/triggers are hooked into a "brain" such as our Allessis D4.  The
>output can be piped directly into the PA for mixing at an appropriate level.
>
>The only drawback to this setup is that you can't do cymbal rolls or other acoustic
>....

Could you tell me more about your electronic drum setup?  How much did
it cost?  How well would it work to use real cymbals and a snare with the
rest being electronic?  

>*******************************************************************************
>David P. Lovely						    I can't believe it!
>Mead Data Central			  We just elected another Jimmy Carter.
>Dayton, Ohio						       Vote KEMP in 96!
>		NO DISCLAIMER NEEDED (Nobody claims me anyway!)
>*******************************************************************************

Tom Ford
tford@convex.com
Convex Computer Corp.
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: pmoloney@maths.tcd.ie (Paul Moloney)
Subject: Re: "We Will Stand" stolen by Clinton
Organization: Somewhere in the Twentieth Century
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 12:58:32 GMT

malee@miavx2.ham.muohio.edu writes:

>	As for your defense against Clinton, at least Bush voiced his aversion
>to the slaughtering of children.  Abortion is murder!

Bush voiced his "aversion" to the "slaughtering" of "children" because he
thought it would get him votes. The hypocritical scumbag was pro-choice
until he decided he wanted to be Vice-Pres with Reagan, and has to do
a U-turn.

>WARRIOR FOR CHRIST    	 EPHESIANS 6:11		TIME 2 B A2J!!

I assume Warrior for Christ also ties in with Bush's "return to morality",
ie the slaughter of 100,00 Iranians. Oh, but of course, they're not white
foetuses, so they don't count.

P.
-- 
moorcockheathersiainbankshamandcornpizzapjorourkebluesbrothersspikeleepratchett
clive  P a u l   M o l o n e y    "I'm pretty witty and you're itty bitty    pe
james  Trinity College, Dublin     And isn't it a pity the city can't see?   vr
brownbladerunnerorsonscottcardprincewatchmenkatebushbatmanthekillingjoketolkien
From: markc@eomer.hw.stratus.com (Mark Christensen)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: What do you do when your child thinks Metallica is cool?
Date: 13 Nov 92 14:06:37 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: eomer.hw.stratus.com

Romans 12:1-2
"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present
 your bodies aliving sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your
 reasonable service.  And be NOT conformed to this world: but be ye transformed
 by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and
 acceptable, and perfect, will of God."

Philippians 4:8
 "Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest,
  whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are PURE, whatsoever things
  are LOVELY, whatsoever things are of GOOD REPORT; if there be any VIRTUE,
  and if there be any praise, think on these things."

I just subscribed to this newsgroup yesterday and I've already read stuff
about "Christian night clubs" and christian rock music, and drums in 
church services, and secular rock being okay as long as you don't listen
too much to it, etc.  Am I the only reader of this who finds these attitudes
sad.  C'mon people.  The verses above are just TWO of many areas in the Bible
that instruct true believers to be espouse personal separation from the world.
"...be not conformed..." as the verse above says.  Why is it that some
Christians find it necessary to conform their music style, instrumentation, 
dress, etc to the world.  Only the lyrics change. If some of these Christians
were to be placed next to some secular band and everything but the lyrics
presented, no one would know the difference.  That's sure letting your
light shine before men!  Be just like the world!  And please don't present
the argument that you need to attract others to Christ by being like the world,
otherwise they might not come.  I Samuel 15:22 says that "...to obey is better
than sacrifice..."  Disobeying commandments and principles about being
separate and holy because your motives are good (that being to win others
to Christ) is NOT acceptable to God.  He expects obedience...and through
that obedience will bless you.  he doesn't need your worldly approach to win
people to himself.  I'm sure I will get flamed for this...there was a time
in my walk where I thought differently.  But as I grew in the Lord and
grew in sanctification through reading His word, I realized just how
wrong this Christian rock movement is.  Please, I don't mind the flames,
but if there is one person out there who will look closely to God's
word and be convicted in this area, I will have accomplished something.
Thanks

mc
 
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian