From: Terri Buchman <buchman@osf.org>
Subject: Re: Working with Women vs. Working with Men
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A75DDA3FAE010811@alimac7.osf.org>
X-Xxdate: Wed, 23 Dec 92 08:56:31 GMT
Organization: Open Software Foundation
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d16
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 13:55:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec23.000023.20408@wam.umd.edu> Robert Stephen
Rodgers, rsrodger@next10csc.wam.umd.edu writes:

First of all, it is refreshing to read some direct comments
from someone that specify the differences in organization and
style that men and women often bring to problem solving.  I
find it somewhat sad that you had to couch so much of what you
had to say in "but I like, respect, admire, etc women" speak. 
A forum like this should welcome free speech and the
opportunity it brings for the exchange of ideas without making
someone feel that they are subject to silly flame attacks for
ideas they are not advocating.

You stated that you have great difficulty working with women
(primarily, but some men also) because of the way in which they
go about analyzing and solving problems.  While you readily
admit that methods other than your own have worked, you state
the difficulty you have working with people who employ other
methods.   At this stage their are a few choices that you have
to lessen your sense of frustration:
	1.	Choose different partners.  Try and find someone whose
style meshes better with yours.  There is absolutely nothing
wrong with trying to find a project partner with whom you feel
comfortable working.  You have learned something about
yourself, learned what conditions are optimum for you, what
type of people work best with you.  Use that knowledge.

2.	If choice is not an option (as it may well not be in a work
situation) then you and the other person are going to have to
do some hard communications work setting up the guidelines and
conditions that you will work under.   Tell your partner in
advance that you are serious about wanting sincere criticism
and then back it up with an example.  Tell your partner that
you expect input at every faze of the project and that you
appreciate getting ideas 'on the fly'.  Tell them that you
would prefer to get the work done first and socialize later (or
never).  Then listen to what the other person has to say. 
Could be that you will need to compromise on what methods you
will employ, could be that the other person will find your
candor refreshing.  Establishing your expectations up front
should help you establish a more comfortable working
environment and will lesson the chance of trouble.

3.	There are people that you will find either extremely
difficult or impossible to work with.  In many of these
instances you should take steps to sever the relationship. 
Speak to your teacher and let the teacher know that you have an
imcompatibility.  Couch your complaint in the language of
difference (after all, it is the truth) and mention that you
feel that your working styles are so different that you cannot
get along.  In work, talk to your boss and mention that
although you respect the other person you can't work with 'em. 
Sometimes this will help.  Sometimes the teacher or boss is
going to say, in effect, tough luck.  Then you have to decide
whether or not the project or job is worth it.  

>	Screw that.  It has nothing to do with "power"--it has to do
>	with the willingness to sit down and get to work.  "So
serious"? 
>	There isn't room in the job market for people who aren't. 
This
>	is *precisely* my point--women (in my humble experiance) seem
>	unable to *commit* to getting the job done.  They see a bunch
>	of possible solutions and are content to sit down and figure
>	out more possibilities--but not pick one, get behind it and
>	push.  Anything else is useless dillydallying.

I do have some problems with your reasoning here.  In the
business world I have lived in, people are often hired based on
compatibility with existing employees.  Many companies are
'downsizing' and are creating business structures that are team
and not hierarchy based.  You may have a problem in this type
of an environment.  Decision making is becoming more and more
team based.  In this type of a situation, the person next to
you may have been hired because their approach to problem
solving is more innovative and free form than what used to be
the norm.   I have found many people who find non-linear
approaches to problem solving not serious.  However, often
times the non-linear approach produces the solution that works.
 You may have to prepare yourself for a work world in which
many different approaches are valued.  I am not saying that
your way is not valid, it obviously has worked for you.  But
the business world may demand that you work with people whose
style is very different from yours.  Adaptability is becoming a
very valuable business skill.

>
>	The fault isn't with me.  
          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This is the language of blame.  I don't think that either you
or the other person did anything wrong and neither or you
deserves blame.  As you have stated elsewhere, this is a
problem of style and communication.   Assigning blame gets you
into a lose lose situation where you start assigning fault to
another based on the fact that they are not you.  It might be
more helpful to assess that other person's abilities and figure
out how best to use them to your advantage.

>  Let me try another parallel: suppose
>	your refrigerator breaks, and you have a repairperson come 
>	over to fix it.  Well, the repair person gets to work, but 
>	stops every few seconds to watch the football game for a
minute
>	or two, then gets back to work--on the whole getting very
little
>	done.  Would you be pleased?  Is this a power issue?  No, 
>	it is a courtesy issue.  

This is an apples and oranges argument.  Elsewhere in your
original argument you stated that you have seen alternative
forms of logic and problem solving work.  It is the style that
is irritating.  I know people who work best when they put a
problem on the back burner of their minds and go do something
else for a while.  They return to the original problem when a
possible solution has arisen.  This style variation can be
extremely annoying to others who prefer to work non stop until
a solution arrives.  Remember to keep in mind the goal at hand,
solving the problem.  Both styles work to that end.  

It is never easy learning to accomodate others.  It can also be
extremely irritating to constantly have to watch out for
communication errors or mishaps with others. But, I haven't
seen any other solutions to this problem that work.

TerriB.
Newsgroups: alt.feminism