HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: grabenst@umbc4.umbc.edu (Mr. Michael Grabenstein; ACS (GUEST))
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Slide Locks
Date: 4 Sep 92 17:24:19 GMT
Organization: Univ. of MD, Baltimore County


	There is also another type of slim jim made for sliding
locks because (from what has been told to me) not all of the
slide locks can be opened with the standarded slim jim.

Later,
	Mike
	ZMEG@AACC.bitnet
	or grabenst@umbc3.umbc.edu
}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{
The universe -- The ultimate fractal. 
	--Personal theroy
From: Paul.Elkins@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Paul Elkins)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Slide Locks
Date: 3 Sep 92 19:31:51 GMT
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service

In article <20055@plains.NoDak.edu> stormoen@plains.NoDak.edu (Michael D. Stormoen) writes:
>I've been helping people get into their cars when they lock themselves
>out by using a slim jim.  I can get into quite a variety of vehicles, 
>(although it takes a while- I'm not too good at it).
>
>My problem is this:  I have to say, "I can't help you" to anyone who
>has slide style locks.  I have only "pulled" the type that move up and
>down.  If anyone has any information that might set me on the right
>track, or if you think I should give up, please post your insight.

Guess what I did today.  I locked my keys in my car that has slide style locks
It took the Sheriff about 30 seconds to unlock my car with a slim jim.
I spent the next half hour learning to do it myself.

I sat in the car; locked the door, and rolled the window down.  (I practiced
on the passengers side so there would be less inconvenance if I screwed it
up.)
With the window rolled down I could pull the weather stripping back enough
with my fingers to see down into the door.  I turned the key to see how the
mechanism worked.  After locating the right place, all that was needed was
a downward push.  (Actually there wasn't enough play in the passengers
side to push slowly, it had to be down quickly (what's the opposite of 
"jerk"?)).  It was even easier on the drivers side.

O.K. so now I can do slide locks.  How do you do normal ones.  How many
different basic types are there?




--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Xref: sparky alt.locksmithing:1569 alt.folklore.urban:22780
From: lawson@acuson.com (Drew Lawson)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing,alt.folklore.urban
Subject: Re: The lady with 7 locks
Keywords: locks, keys
Date: 2 Sep 92 22:02:13 GMT
Reply-To: lawson@aldia.UUCP (Drew Lawson)
Organization: ACUSON, Mountain View, CA

In article <BtwtCy.9w4@hatch.socal.com> richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich Greenberg) writes:

>Of course this assumes that the burglar can't determine that a given
>lock was already unlocked and his picking has locked it.

That is the part that gives me doubts.  Most, if not all, new locks
(changes may occur over time) lock and unlock in the same directions.
I don't have any handy, but if I recall correctly, locks in the US on
the left side of the door (from the outside) tend to lock clockwise and
unlock counterclockwise.

I specify the side of the door because the are exceptions to the norm
(which in the US is doors open into the room/house and have hinges on
the right when viewed from outside), and the rotation direction
probably depends on which way the bolt is going.

-- 
Drew Lawson                      If you're not part of the solution,
lawson@acuson.com                you're part of the precipitate
From: rdale@cstp.umkc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Libraries - anti-theft systems
Date: 30 Aug 92 01:59:45 GMT
Organization: UM - Kansas City, Computer Science

> The talk of a magneticaly encoded lock triggered a persistent question of 
> mine.  In our univ. library there is a security system to prevent books 
> being removed without being first, desensitised by the librarians.  

	Some software stores use a similar system.  If you look, you'll
	see a piece of clear tape-like substance with a dark band in
	the middle.  Apparently this can be magnetized or demagnetized.
	However, the software store which has these apparently doesn't
	use it -- I see no indication that they've run it over a
	demagnetizer.  It *could* be under the counter and activates
	when the sale is entered, but why the subterfuge?

	Libraries use the same system.  It's easy to hide that tape in
	a book.  Just open the book and put the tape toward the spine
	of the book.  Rumor has it, though, that due to the hassle
	it is only done on more expensive volumes: the large dictionaries,
	etc.
From: lance@wolves.uucp (Lance Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Libraries - anti-theft systems
Date: 1 Sep 92 02:34:39 GMT
Organization: Wolves Den Unix
X-Md4-Signature: 5e8e17147adcad6ce2cbdf1f6e3502dc

In article <1992Aug30.192804.10456@waikato.ac.nz> spt@waikato.ac.nz (Simon Travaglia) writes:
>In article <1992Aug30.022411.22557@wolves.uucp>, lance@wolves.uucp (Lance Brown) writes:
>> Well, the library at my old school used VERY thin ~1/8 inch wide magnetic
>> strips that they "magically" inserted into the bindings of books and
>> journals.  They even somehow managed to get these boogers in the 
>> "perfect bound" journals without apparent damage.
>
>
>Yeah, 3M used to make them, I'm not sure if they still do.  They'd be about
>so:
>	[@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@]
>
>And were double sided sticky.  Great stuff too, because you put it between
>a couple of pages, (at the spine of course) slam the book shut and sit on it
>for a while (Esp if you're a 50 stone weakling) and the pages just look like
>the glue on the binding seeped a bit.  The tape can be put anywhere on the
>book, behind "Date Due" labels, in the spine etc etc.  They look almost like
>a peice of tin foil, but are a tad thicker.
>
>Don't be a cheap shithead - buy the book.

Now where in my post did I advocate stealing books from libraries.  I am
a devoted reader and would never consider such a thing.  I was just
curious about how and where they hid those strips.

Lance
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: richard@sfu.ca (Richard Chycoski)
Subject: Re: Multiple locks, same key.  yes/no?
Reply-To: richard@sfu.ca
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:19:30 GMT

In article <BtwstL.9t9@hatch.socal.com> richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich Greenberg)  
writes:
> In article <1992Aug31.171816.8469@plex-1.ann-arbor.mi.us>  
cnmne@plex-1.ann-arbor.mi.us (Chris Ellinger) writes:
> >
> >(stuff deleted)
> > 
> >I have all locks keyed alike *except* the front door key-in-knob.  This way 
> >we can give that key to a relative/visitor/contractor and still be able to 
> >lock the front door deadbolt for privacy.  When the visitor is expected, we 
> >leave the deadbolt unlocked.  When no visitor is expected, we can leave the
> >key-in-knob unlocked, lock the deadbolt, and carry only one key.
> 
> I can see one possible flaw with this.  I also normally don't lock the
> knob, only the deadbolt.  But,  what happens if the knob accidentally
> gets locked, either by bumping it, or a well intentioned visitor on
> his/her way out.  This has happened to me several times, and I just
> unlock it with the same key.  If you don't carry the knob key, is your
> back door accessable from the street?  Mine isn't.

If you key the doorknob for both the deadbolt key as well as a unique key,
then you can give out the unique key that opens only the doorknob, but 
your deadbolt key will open the knob as well if someone "accidentally"
locks it for you...

After moving into a new house just recently, I removed the trash (Taymor)
"locks" (I use the term loosely here! :-) and installed new Schlage deadbolts
all round. The common locks in this area are Weisers, and the Schlage locks
are only a little more expensive, but they *look* a lot stronger, which should
hopefully convince would-be thieves to look elsewhere. My opinion is that
going to a more impressive lock, such as a Medeco is just an invitation
to break a window to find out what's worth protecting so well...

I had the locks (double deadbolts) keyed with a master that opens both
sides of every deadbolt (my wife and I carry masters), an 'inside' key
that opens only the inside of the deadbolts (I leave one in each lock 
when the house is occupied, for safety), a key that opens only the front
door, and a key that opens only the garage door. My main reason for keying
the front door separately is for key loss, since I don't give out keys to
someone that I don't trust in the house, but if someone does lose a key, I
only have one cylinder to rekey, not eight. The garage key is intended to be
used if we need to get someone to cut our lawn while we're away, but don't
need to let them into the rest of the house.

- Richard Chycoski
  richard@sfu.ca (don't believe the return address!)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing,misc.consumers.house
From: IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU (macphil)
Subject: Re: Multiple locks, same key.  yes/no?
Organization: IUPUI
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 20:44:51 GMT

In article <Btt5K1.IGM@hatch.socal.com>
richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich Greenberg) writes:
 
>I would like to collect some net.opinions.
>Given a typical suburban house with 2 locks on the front door (a key-in-knob
>and a deadbolt), and the same on the back door,  what do you feel is the
>proper number of keys?
>
>On my house, I have all 4 (plus the garage) keyed alike.  IMHO, this
>is the proper way to do it. *I* don't want to have to carry a bunch
>of similar keys, and have to fumble for 2 keys each time I open the
>door.  Other friends disagree, and want all locks different.
 
so these friends feel four keys = complexity = security?        :)
 
unless you have a method of barring access to various parts of the
house depending upon which entry you use, it shouldn't matter --
entrance to one is entrance to all.  The only time(s) I found it
convenient to have a different key for deadbolt & knob would be to
give someone access via the knob key but could bar them using the
deadbolt.
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing,misc.consumers.house
From: hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Subject: Re: Multiple locks, same key.  yes/no?
Keywords: locks, keys
Organization: NCSU Computing Center 
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 22:36:26 GMT

In article <Btt5K1.IGM@hatch.socal.com> richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich Greenberg) writes:
> ...
>Given a typical suburban house with 2 locks on the front door (a key-in-knob
>and a deadbolt), and the same on the back door,  what do you feel is the 
>proper number of keys?
>
>On my house, I have all 4 (plus the garage) keyed alike.  IMHO, this
>is the proper way to do it. *I* don't want to have to carry a bunch
>of similar keys, and have to fumble for 2 keys each time I open the
>door.  Other friends disagree, and want all locks different.
> ...

  What is accomplished by having the locks keyed-alike (KA) vs. keyed-
differently (KD)?  You mention that carying/using fewer keys is a benefit
of keyed-alike.  Why shouldn't one get this benefit - the major
possibility is a loss of security.  If an intruder has to work harder
to get two different keys vs. only one key, then you have a security
benefit from keyed-differently.  How do your KD friends keep their
different keys?  If they are on the same key ring, or in the same
pocketbook, then someone who obtains one key almostly certainly gets
both at the same time, negating this security approach.  (While if
the husband carried one key, the wife the other and they had to be
there at the same time to open the door there certainly would be an
increase in security, although perhaps an unbearable inconvenience. :-)

  If the intruder works by impressioning the lock, then the KA approach
does decrease (by a factor of 2) the amount of work needed to break in,
and so also decreases security.  However, I think that impressioning is
a fairly rare method of breaking in.

  My own opinion is that the convenience makes the KA approach very
reasonable.  It may also cause a small increase in security by
greatly decreasing the number of keys to be carried, and so perhaps
decreases the chance of your keys being stolen.  For what it's worth,
I have all of the key-in-knob and deadbolt locks in my home KA.

--henry schaffer  n c state univ
From: holland@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Rich Holland)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Libraries - anti-theft systems
Date: 30 Aug 1992 19:22:43 -0500
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

rdale@cstp.umkc.edu writes:

> Some software stores use a similar system.  If you look, you'll
> use it -- I see no indication that they've run it over a
> demagnetizer.  It *could* be under the counter and activates
> when the sale is entered, but why the subterfuge?

You can't sensitize/desensitize magnetic media (software).  

> Rumor has it, though, that due to the hassle [in libraries] 
> it is only done on more expensive volumes: the large dictionaries,
> etc.

Rumor's wrong -- at least at KSU.

-- 
Rich Holland              | INTERNET: holland@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
100 Jardine Terr, Apt A7  | BITNET  : holland@ksuvm
Manhattan, KS  66502-3357 | UUCP    : ...!rutgers!matt.ksu.ksu.edu!holland
"Jesus saves...but Gretzky gets the rebound!  He shoots!  He scores!!"
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Removing Best knobs (was: Re: removing cylinders & old question)
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 05:15:04 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.IBM.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In  <1992Aug26.010044.15598@ncsu.edu>  hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer) writes:
>
>   The principle is that many locks are made to be taken apart only
> when you have the key.  In a sense, posession of the key is the
> closest one can come to a mechanical 'authorization' to disassemble.
> Some locks, like the Best, require a special key.

Depends on the lock.  The standard Best KIK lock uses a flat stamped
throw member (the piece that you stick in the core which operates
the lock when the plug is turned).  This will let you pop the knob
by picking the core, turning it about 90 degrees, and depressing the
knob retainer through the poke hole.  The heavy-duty KIK locksets
generally have a round section on the throw member, so it has to be
physically removed from the lock in order to allow the knob retainer
to be pressed in.  To remove the knob on these (assuming you don't have
the control key, can't pick the control line, and don't want to drill
the core), you have to disassemble the entire lock.  On some models
this will let you remove the throw member; on others, you have to do
a little work with a Dremel.  If you're not going to replace the
throw member, it's a good idea to pick the core and rotate it before
notching the thow member, so that it won't be possible to later remove
the knob without a key.

Once you have the knob off, it's easy to shim the control line and
remove the core.

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: dkl@xcluud.sccsi.com (David Karl Leikam)
Subject: Re: Car Alarms. Advice Needed
Keywords: Car alarm
Organization: Greater Montrose UFO Appreciation Society & Data Haven
Distribution: alt
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 21:50:12 GMT


  [... request for advice on car alarms...]
 
  I dimly recall an article in (memory access wait) Consumer Reports, I
believe it was, about car alarms/security devices a few years back. The
general upshot then was that they're all pretty much worthless.
 
  THere's another factor to consider: where will the car be when you most
need protection?  If you were concerned about parking it in, say, our
parking garage, an alarm would be a waste of money -- there's hardly any
time I walk into the garage that I DON"T hear somebody's alarm going.
The garage is basically a suspension bridge structure, and shakes heavily.
Invariably sets of SOMEbody's alarm. We're all used to it, even the
security guards. Nobody'd NOTICE another one going off, thieves or no.
 
  By the time anyone figured it out, your car would be long gone.

Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: gjessing@mi.uib.no (Hakon Gjessing)
Subject: ABUS Granite
Reply-To: gjessing@mi.uib.no (Hakon Gjessing)
Organization: Department of Mathematics, University of Bergen, Norway
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 18:45:41 GMT


I have a lock for my motorcycle wich is manufactured in West Germany and
is called ABUS Granite Plus. I bought it some years ago when my bike had
been stolen and luckily recovered. 
The salesman told me it was the strongest lock available (as they often do!),
that it was protected against drilling and that it was virtually impossible
to pick. I myself have never seen any lock looking stronger than this one,
but this one is quite popular.
It has the usual U-shackle (very heavy), and a (even heavier) rectangular 
plastic coated bar across the opening. The keyhole is small, cylindrical
and no cylinder is visible. Apparently the lock mechanism is built by 
five or more disks on top of each other, each with a slot in the middle
for the key. The disks turn independently. 
The key is rectangular, but the part of the key inside the disks has been cut
at different angles rather than different depths as in a conventional key.
Probably this is to turn the disks the correct angles when turning the key.
It is not possible to remove the key when the lock is open.

My question is: Does anyone know this lock? Is it really impossible to pick?
(Of course it is possible, but without using several millennia?)
Is this the kind of lock that is easy to open using a car jack (or by
freezing it)? 
In short, is it as safe as it looks? 
If not, which lock is the safest for motorcycles?
Grateful for answers.

Hakon K. Gjessing, Dept. of Mathematics, University of Bergen, Norway.
From: SL500000@brownvm.brown.edu (Robert Mathiesen)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: ancient lock
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 14:15:24 EDT
Organization: Brown University - Providence, Rhode Island  USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: brownvm.brown.edu
News-Software: BNN via BNN_POST v1.0 beta

Indeed.  Such wooden locks are described in one of the _Foxfire_ books;
even today they are still made in Appalachia.  The design is Egyptian,
but they were used in rural Europe as late as the 18th century, and sur-
vived well into the 19th in Scotland and the outlying islands.

Robert Mathiesen
Brown University
SL500000@BROWNVM
Xref: sparky alt.locksmithing:1578 misc.consumers.house:11842
From: eliot@chutney.rtp.dg.com (Topher Eliot)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing,misc.consumers.house
Subject: Re: Multiple locks, same key.  yes/no?
Keywords: locks, keys
Date: 2 Sep 92 19:11:54 GMT
Reply-To: eliot@dg-rtp.dg.com
Organization: Data General Corporation, Research Triangle Park, NC

I used to be of the opinion that locks that can be locked by slamming the
door were worse than useless, in that they just gave a false sense of
security.  I had planned on converting our house to having a deadbolt on
each door, keyed alike, with knobs on the inside, and bedroom door latches
in place of the current standard knob-in-handle locks.  

Then we had a really weird thing happen, and it's revised my thinking a little.

Our son (Tommy) and a friend (Todd) were at another boy's (Andrew) house.
They were all back and forth between the back yard and Andrew's room.  Andrew's
father got an urgent call to work, so he hustled Andrew in, shoved some
dinner into him, got them both out of the house, locked it up, and took off.
Meanwhile, somewhere in there Tommy and Todd got into Andrew's bedroom and
were playing contentedly.  Andrew's dad of course thought the house was empty; 
Tommy and Todd were unusually quiet.  The whole neighborhood was looking for 
them (since we saw Andrew and his dad drive off), and they weren't found 
until they got bored, unlocked the front door, and wandered out onto the porch.
These boys are 4 and 5 years old.

A freakish situation?  Sure.  But I'm going to make sure that my kids can
get themselves out of the house with whatever locking scheme I end up with.
For example, the current deadbolts are too high for Tommy to reach.
Who knows, maybe I'll fall in the tub and Tommy will have to go for help.
(Sure, I know, teach him 911...)

Oh, keyed alike or keyed differently?  I can't see any point in keying things
differently.

-- 
Topher Eliot             Data General DG/UX Systems Administration Development
(919) 248-6371      eliot@dg-rtp.dg.com       {backbone}!mcnc!rti!dg-rtp!eliot
Obviously, I speak for myself, not for DG.
misc.consumers.house archivist.  Send mail to house-archive@dg-rtp.dg.com
"I opened an STR on myself and I had to reject it."  -- Paul McGrath
From: bthurman@uncavx.unca.edu
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: ancient lock
Date: 3 Sep 92 16:53:52 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina at Asheville
Nntp-Posting-User: bthurman

quick pansy: Did you know that several lines of Homer's Odyssey describe the
workings of a lock?  In 1962 a secluded cabin in western NC was secured by a
unique wooden lock that fits the operational description and its security was
never breached.
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: grabenst@umbc4.umbc.edu (Mr. Michael Grabenstein; ACS (GUEST))
Subject: Re: Libraries - anti-theft systems
Organization: Univ. of MD, Baltimore County
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 21:41:24 GMT

	This may be another type of system, or maybe not. But our
school (not umbc but AACC, where I work). Uses radio frequency check
mechanism. It is call Check Point security systems. The little sticker
is about 1 inch square and is ussualy behind the due date card.
	What happens is as you walk through the check point system
it is constatnly emitting RF. If you go through the system with an
un-shielded security sticker it causes a RF disturbance the machine
can pick up on and thus the alarm goes off. 
	It is very easy to get by. For one they did not install it
well in our school and you can avoid it as you exit the building.
But aslong as you shield the security sticker you can wlak right 
through.

Later,
	Mike
	ZMEG@AACC.bitnet
	or grabenst@umbc3.umbc.edu
}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{
The universe -- The ultimate fractal. 
	--Personal theroy
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing