From: poser@vxdsyc.desy.de (Till Poser  -  ZEUS OFFLINE)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Neugermanischer Tribalismus, was Re: A-4/V-2 Jahrestag
Date: 12 Oct 92 20:58:24 GMT
Reply-To: Poser@vxdsyc.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA

In article <1992Oct12.005708.22127@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de>, 
lbs@tkmhp4.physik.uni-karlsruhe.de (Lech Borkowski) writes in 
soc.culture.german:

|> Let me make a few general remarks - they are not connected
|>with your posts but rather with the whole issue of V2 vs. Harris.
|>
|> I am trying to understand why in an accomplished society there seems
|>to be so much sentiment for celebrating V2. Does anyone outside
|>Germany doubt Germany's scientific and technological achievements? 
|>The names of those who worked on that project are in the books. So why
|>to make this extra effort and dance on the graves of the 20000 slaves
|>who lost their lives in Peenemuende?

Let me try to shed some light on this affair, since it developed on various
levels.

1) The Peenemuende-area is a severely underveloped area in already
   structurally deficient eastern Germany. It suffers additionally from
   45 years of neglect due to being declared a restricted zone and
   both a military encampment and a military waste dump. Something will
   have to happen there, eventually, to improve the economy of that
   area. Also, ecologically, that area _has_ to be cleaned up, it is a
   desolate wasteland.

2) After reunification, the Peenemuende-area, due to its history of being 
   an acknowleged birthplace of advanced rocketry, received quite a bit of 
   interest by tourists, in a rather haphazard way. The idea of the local
   authorities was to cash in on that interest by creating sort of a theme
   park dedicated to German rocketry, thus rubbing off a little bit of the
   "glamour" of rocket science on the area, with the A4 as one center piece, 
   and provide jobs directly and indirectly that way and incidentally clean 
   up the land in the process.

   That in itself is not at all a bad idea. It could be done tastefully,
   fully and suitably acknowledging what happened there, pointing out the 
   questionable side of rocketry, but also focus on the development after 
   the war and the peaceful application of which. The interest is there, 
   the people, and not only Germans, flock to this area already due to its
   reputation, so one could advantage of that, and nobody would think twice 
   about it. It would also prevent yet another reminder of our past of
   being obliterated by bulldozers.

3) However, as it emerges, the conception of the theme park seems to have
   shied away from the ugly spots in a most embarrasing way. What is more,
   the principal sponsors, of the idea the German Aerospace Industry, seem 
   to have tried to find some "worthy" date to commemorate to have some 
   sort of startup celebration and get this show on the road. The most handy
   occasion was the 50th "birthday" of the A4. Now, again, that in itself is
   hardly damaging, had they not tried to turn this into a song-and-dance
   affair, yet again ommitting the ugly parts of that business.

4) Both the downplaying of the crimes commited there and the unthinking and
   insensitve inception of a "cheering" party for a device which, while it
   did not do that much damage, caused the British inordinate amount of 
   anxiety and anguish in the war, of course raised a pluperfect ruckus, 
   first in Britain and then here in Germany and elsewhere. I have to admit 
   that I heard it first here on the net.

Understand that it is not so much the concept of having the theme park and
a commemorative occasion that caused the outcry, but the utterly insensitive 
way these things were planned and executed. To any outside observer, it must
appear like a completely transparent attempt at vindicating part of the war
machinery of the 3rd Reich while callously, or even contemptously, ommitting 
the victims it created one way or another. They focussed, for heavens sake,
on the glamour of a weapon!

What infuriates me even more is that the industry got their tame lame pet 
lapdog in the Ministry of Economics to play the "official" High Lord 
Protector for the proceedings, giving the appearance that the whole affair
was expressly sanctioned by the German government (which it was not, by the 
way). This guy should know better, and if he doesn't, he has bloody no 
business being in the position he is. What had me finally foaming at the 
mouth was the utterly contemptible winging and whining along the lines of
"Poooh li'l me, they're all picking on meee!" he put on when the shit hit 
the fan and he was questioned what the hell he was up to.

|> I understand Germans questioning the Allies' bombing of civilian
|>centers. The problem I see is in LINKING these two issues
|>directly: you made a monument to Harris, so now we will celebrate V2.

This was entirely an ex post facto vindication. The British press, already
having their hatchets ground to a fine point during the currency debacle, 
jumped into the fray with a will, justifyably Not Being Nice in the
process.

Pointing to Harris was logical but stupid. The commemorative statue to
him rankled quite a bit, here, since most people didn't realise that that
statue was commisioned out of private donations, partially from survivors
of Bomber Command. I'm told that _no_ British memorial to a specific soldier
is paid for by the British government.

After Germany, collectively, got a vicious reaming in the British press, 
quite a few Germans went into a pout and started pointing fingers. That
wasn't smart, just a gut reaction, and I posit that it was not malice
aforethought. The linking, however, is totally inappropriate, of course.

|> It seems so simple to me (maybe because I am neither British
|>nor German) to say: don't celebrate V2, you have plenty
|>of peaceful engineering and scientific achievements to celebrate.
|>Trying to justify the celebration of V2 by pointing that a monument
|>to Harris was unveiled earlier in London makes it even worse.
|>That is the logic of revenge that I called disgusting in my earlier
|>post. 

Quite. But what would You have said if the theme park was conceived and 
announced along the lines that I developed above and the "party" had been
a solemn commemorative affair, recalling the victims, acknowledging the
problematic side of technological advance, but also focussing on the 
positive aspects of the developments made there? It didn't happen, but I
think that that would have been altogether fitting, since it would have
reminded people of things they'd rather "forget".

|> It would make much more sense to me to criticize the bombing
|>tactics of the Allies WITHOUT linking it with V2. Of course,
|>you need SOME context within which to criticize the bombing
|>tactics, but once it came up when discussing the V2 celebration
|>I would rather take it to a separate thread, where the issues
|>of V2 and Harris would not collide.

I agree. It is only that since the linkage has been brought up, it is rather
difficult to untangle, though I tried to point out the inappropriateness
of the comparison in my postings. We should acknowledge that it was 
fumblefingered and unthinking lashing out that we got where we are now in 
this debate.

|> Lech Borkowski
|>lbs@neptune.phys.ufl.edu

       Till Poser         Internet: poser@vxdsyc.desy.de
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