HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Sun, 13 Dec 1992 21:32:48 MST
Reply-To:     Gene Glass <ATGVG@ASUACAD.BITNET>
From:         Gene Glass <ATGVG@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Subject:      SAS vs. SPSS: "Tastes great!" "Less filling!"

     So many people kindly responded to my request for ideas about
the relative merits of SAS and SPSS last week that I feel compelled
to share with all the results of the "polling." There was much
activity off the list on this topic. Many people wrote to say that
the question was miscast, that it was an apples and oranges
situation, that both SAS and SPSS were inferior to other libraries,
that teaching ought to be done with MINITAB or STATVIEW or DATA
DESK and the like. All of these points were well made and taken to
heart. But many people expressed an overall, general statement of
their preference, and I see no reason not to lay out the numbers:
     Of over fifty persons who expressed a preference for either
SAS or SPSS, SAS was preferred 2 to 1.

     This election was not as interesting or useful as the very
sophisticated analysis of the strengths and weaknesses of the two
libraries. SAS was lauded for data handling capabilities; some
insisted that SPSS was more teachable. SPSS handles survey analysis
well; SAS is better for other kinds of analysis, but BMDP has great
analysis capabilities. One person prepares data files with SAS, but
analyzes with BMDP. SPSS's clunky data handling features have been
improved in recent versions, some maintained. And so the commentary
goes.

     I excerpted and edited over 400 lines of good analysis of the
relative strengths of SAS and SPSS. Unfortunately, I compiled the
comments without attributing them to their authors; I hope no one
will feel slighted; it would have doubled the editing time. I am
reluctant to send it out over the several LISTSERVs to which I
posted the original query due to the ever-worrisome bandwidth
economies--but hey!, what's all this agonizing about bandwidth.
Have you read some of those USENET newsgroups like ALT.BACKRUBS or
ALT.MCDONALDS.KETCHUP lately? Who's telling them to get their
garbage off of our collective bandwidth? Forgive me...I digress.

     Rather than send the 400 lines of comments about SAS v SPSS to
everyone, I have archived the file on the LISTSERV at
ASUACAD.BITNET. It is simple for you to get a copy. Just send an
email letter to LISTSERV@ASUACAD.BITNET that contains the single
line
                          GET STAT NOTE

     The file will be sent to you within minutes. (If you are on a
BITNET node, you may send the message (GET STAT NOTE) to ASUACAD
interactively, via TELL LISTSERV AT ASUACAD on an IBM running CMS
or via SEND on a VAX.)

     Thanks to everyone for their help.

_______________________________________________________________________

GENE V GLASS                                    ATGVG AT ASUACAD.BITNET
COLLEGE OF EDUCATION                            ATGVG AT ASUACVAX.BITNET
ARIZONA STATE UNIVERSITY                        INTERNET ADDRESS:
Tempe, AZ 85287-2411                            ATGVG@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU
602-965-2692
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Return-Path: <sbaker@umassmed.UMMED.EDU>
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Thu, 17 Dec 1992 09:12:00 EST
Reply-To:     Stephen Baker <sbaker@UMASSMED.UMMED.EDU>
From:         Stephen Baker <sbaker@UMASSMED.UMMED.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Macintosh software
              Dec 16, 92 6:34 pm

>                                                ...  Can anyone point me in the
> direction  of  information  on  Mac  stat   packages,  or  if  you  feel  like
> recommending one  to me,  please let  me know.   Are there  any that  I should
> avoid?  Thanks very much.
>
I love Systat for the Mac, it was the first truely comprehensive statistics
package.  It is powerful and easy to use.

I bought Statview and Data Desk and was disappointed by both,though I've
heard they have both improved significantly.  Systat disappointed others when
it first came out because it originally wasn't too "mac-like", but they fixed
that quickly.



Stephen P. Baker                               phone:  (508) 856-2625
Lecturer in Biostatistics                              (508) 856-3131 fax
Department of Academic Computing                       (413) 253-3923 home
University of Massachusetts Medical School     bitnet: sbaker@umassmed.bitnet
55 Lake Avenue North                         internet: sbaker@umassmed.ummed.edu
Worcester, MA 01655                                rf:  -. .---- --. - --.-
From: STAN@VM.TEMPLE.EDU (Stan Horwitz)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Subject: Macintosh software
Date: 16 Dec 92 18:34:51 GMT
Organization: Temple University - Computer Services

Hello;

I recently purchased a Mac IIci to help me  with the work I am doing to earn a
masters  in educational  psychology.  Statistic  analyses is  my main  area of
concentration.  I  just completed  an intermediate  stat course  which covered
ANOVA with  a quick intro into  repeated mesasures ANOVA and  ANCOVA.  I would
like to buy a  good stat program for my Mac, but I  have no idea which program
to buy.  I want to get something that will help me as a learning tool and have
enough  capability to  do some  serious  work.  Can  someone point  me in  the
direction of any magazine articles which compare some Mac statistics packages?
I know SAS and  SPSS quite well and I can learn  new packages easily.  Someone
told me  that SPSS is available  in a Mac  version.  Has anyone used  it?  How
does it compare to other stat packages on the Mac?  Can anyone point me in the
direction  of  information  on  Mac  stat   packages,  or  if  you  feel  like
recommending one  to me,  please let  me know.   Are there  any that  I should
avoid?  Thanks very much.
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Mon, 14 Dec 1992 15:47:36 EST
Reply-To:     Lee Wolfle <WOLFLE@VTVM1.BITNET>
From:         Lee Wolfle <WOLFLE@VTVM1.BITNET>
Subject:      LISREL Workshop, April 11, 1993.

   Earlier, an interest was expressed about short courses in
structural equation modeling, aka, LISREL.

   At the annual meeting of the American Educational Research
Association, a presession is planned on the topic.

   The instructors will be Karl Joreskog, Peter Bentler, and
David Rindskopf.

   The dates and times are:

      Sunday, April 11, 9:00 am - 6:30 pm
      Monday, April 12, 8:30 am - 11:00 am

   The fees are $70 for members of AERA, and $90 for nonmembers.

   If interested, please contact:

          Training/AERA
          1230 17th Street, N.W.
          Washington, D.C.  20036-3078

                                        Lee Wolfle
                                        WOLFLE at VTVM1
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Mailer: Elm [revision: 64.9]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 16:52:13 PST
Reply-To:     Kirk Steinhorst <kirk@LAPLACE.MATHSTAT.UIDAHO.EDU>
From:         Kirk Steinhorst <kirk@LAPLACE.MATHSTAT.UIDAHO.EDU>
Subject:      no subject (file transmission)

Thanks to Dennis Roberts, Arnie Kahn, Frank Bokhorst, and Antoine Morin
for their responses to my query about WHAT CONCEPTS should be included
in the various flavors of intro course.

Dennis writes that we should start them collecting and looking at some
data, then let them discover statistical models/summaries.  Descriptive
statistics units which appear in the first unit of almost every intro
stat book would be moved down a bit.

This is an interesting thesis.  It raises the question of "What opening
gambit works best?"  I have talked to others who think starting with a
data collection exercise or a data exploration exercise is a dynamite way
to go.  I have also used Freedman, Pisani, and Purves opening gambit of
describing some interesting experiments, surveys, and observational studies
to capture the class' attention.  (Note.  FPP actually do not introduce
surveys until chapter 19.  However, those people that I have talked to in
the last year or so who use the book correct this oversight by including
an introduction to surveys along with experiments and observational studies.)

Bokkie asked if I meant anyone instead of everyone in my category 1.  Actually
I did mean everyone in the sense that there probably are some concepts that
we would like in every course - algebra based or calculas based.

This raises an additional issue.  What prerequisites should we require?  I
have implied that in some courses college level algebra should be required
and in others one should be able to take advantage of a calculus prerequisite.
Should we have a category of courses for ANYONE?  What does this mean?  High
school algebra, general math, walking and breathing (but not necessarily at
the same time)?

BRIEF SYNOPSIS of additional key phrases in the responses to date-- gauging
significance of differences, sampling, estimating variance, precision vs.
accuracy, statistical vs. practical significance, p values, power and relia-
bility of tests.

More responses welcomed.
Kirk Steinhorst    kirk@laplace.mathstat.uidaho.edu
Math and Statistics, University of Idaho, Moscow, ID USA
From: cotte@cs-acad-lan.Lakeheadu.Ca (Carol Otte)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Subject: Regression - Johnson-Neyman Technique
Keywords: regression
Date: 11 Dec 1992 19:43:01 GMT
Organization: Lakehead University


Please send e-mail replies to this query to FPSOCONN@THINK1.LAKEHEADU.CA

I'm looking for a program that runs the Johnson-Neyman test of regions of 
significance between two regression lines.  Thanks very much for your help.

Brian O'Connor, Dept. of Psychology, Lakehead U, Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Fri, 11 Dec 1992 14:39:14 EST
Reply-To:     Jay Allen <JALLEN@UGA.BITNET>
From:         Jay Allen <JALLEN@UGA.BITNET>
Subject:      Using Tutorials

The teaching of concepts vs cookbook formulas in the introductory
statistics course seems to be a hot topic right now.  If you
teach concepts such as 'normality', 'the general linear model',
the 'central limit theorem', 'power', 'interactions', 't & F
probability functions' in your course, you may wish to try a set
of computer tutorials called STATISTICS TUTOR which J. D. Allen
(me) and D. Pittenger wrote specifically for that purpose.  The
package includes a set of eight color graphic computer-
interactive tutorials, a fairly comprehensive set of statistical
programs, and a student's manual that guides the student through
each tutorial and quizzes him/her on the concepts in the process.
There is also an Instructor's manual that shows the teacher how
to use the tutorials as classroom lecture material, if a computer
and monitor are present in the room.  The package currently runs
on IBM platforms with color cards and is being marketed by John
Wiley & Sons at a cost of $21.95.  Instructor's packages are
available as demos through your local Wiley rep or by calling
Carolyn Henderson (212) 850-6386.  We both teach basic statistics
and methodology at our respective Psychology Departments and like
to program.  The tutorials evolved slowly over a 6-year period as
a way to get difficult statistical concepts across to the
students.  In my course, I first teach the concepts using the
tutorials in classroom and then assign them as home work to be
completed outside of class - a sort of double exposure principle;
however, the students get a lot more out of playing with the
concepts on their own time at their own pace.  The tutorials are
still evolving, and I would appreciate any suggestions
or evaluations that you may have concerning them.
*****************************************************************
Joseph D. Allen               E-mail: JALLEN@UGA.BITNET
Department of Psychology      Phone:  (706) 542-3100
University of Georgia         Fax:    (706) 542-3275
Athens, GA  30602
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
From: WRK0000 <WRK0@UNB.CA>
Subject: ON QUARTILES
Organization: The University of New Brunswick
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 13:46:09 GMT

Yes, a computer statistics package must get the calculation for
quartiles RIGHT.

But there are other concerns when teaching:

(1) Given encouragement, the number of formulae appearing in a
    statistics course wants to proliferate beyond reason.
    I'm glad to drop any I can, and this is a prime candidate.

(2) My class is taking 5 other courses.  My student has limited
    think time for my course,  and there are MUCH more important
    things in a statistics course to think about.

(3) One of those more important things to think about is this:
    The precision of the sample quartile is order  1/sqrt(N).
    so any K-th observation where K is within the span,
                  N/4 plus-minus constant * sqrt(N),
    is a reasonable estimate.  The assorted K's of the competing
    formulae as all within plus-minus 2 of each other.

(I accept any reasonable quartiles on an exam and tell this to
any student who inquires.)

   Bill Knight / University of New Brunswick / Canada


Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Sat, 12 Dec 1992 11:44:18 CST
Reply-To:     Larry Ries <C459006@MIZZOU1.BITNET>
From:         Larry Ries <C459006@MIZZOU1.BITNET>
Subject:      Node

     Prior to last June, my E-Mail address was

     C459006@UMCVMB

     At that time the bitnet node of the University of Missouri-Columbia was
changed to 'MIZZOU1'.

     I subscribed to this list under the old node name, and the old name
remaines a synomym for the current node name.

     Nevertheless, I would hope that someone could tell me how I could change
my node on this list.  I tried 'unsubscribing and then re-subscribing'
but I can unsub since 'c459006@mizzou1' isn't a subscriber.

     I sent a message to the listserv@ncsuvm but it was returned as
'illegal command format.'

     So if anyone can change my address, I'd appreciate it.

-- Larry Ries
   Dept. of Statistics
   University of Missouri
   Columbia

   c459006@mizzou1 on bitnet (formerly c459006@umcvmb.)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Thu, 17 Dec 1992 09:44:21 CST
Reply-To:     Alexis Grosofsky <grosofsk@BELOIT.EDU>
From:         Alexis Grosofsky <grosofsk@BELOIT.EDU>
Subject:      mac software

I sent this info to Stan directly but thought others would be interested:

A.M. Best and D. Morganstein have a lengthy review of stats programs for the
Mac in _The American Statistician_, 1991, Vol. 45(4), pgs. 318-337.  The
title of the article is:  Statistics programs designed for the Macintosh:
Data Desk, Exstatix, Fastat, JMP, StatView II, and SuperANOVA.  The detail
the features of each program and go on to discuss the programs' relative
strengths and weaknesses.

I haven't had a chance to read it yet but it looks very good.  The feature
comparisons are set up in a style similar to that used by _Consumer Reports_
except fully dark circles are good, not bad in their rating system (exactly
the opposite of _Consumer Reports_)

Alexis Grosofsky
Grosofsk@Beloit.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Subject: (no subject given)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Thu, 17 Dec 1992 11:02:47 EST
Reply-To:     UYU@NIHCU.BITNET
From:         UYU@NIHCU.BITNET

please remove my name from this list
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.edstat-l
Date:         Fri, 11 Dec 1992 12:15:37 CST
Reply-To:     ECO_GXC@SHSU.BITNET
From:         ECO_GXC@SHSU.BITNET
Subject:      trying to locate someones bitnet address

Can anyone tell me the bitnet address of
     Erhan Cinlar @ Princeton
     Stan Pliska @ Univ. of Il., Chicago
 or  Bill Pierskalla @ Univ. of Penn. ?

Thanks,

Gary Carson

ECO_GXC@SHSU.Bitnet
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Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Priority: normal
X-pmrqc:      1
X-mailer:     Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
Date:         Wed, 16 Dec 1992 21:35:18 -0700
Reply-To:     Info-Nets@Think.Com
From:         MMADU@BUSINESS.GMCC.AB.CA
Subject:      Re: Nearest you, in instructions
Comments: To: Info-Nets@Think.Com, INFONETS@uga.cc.uga.edu

please sign me off the infonets.  I don't know why I can't just sign
off.

        mmadu@business.gmcc.ab.ca
From: cudep@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Ian Dickinson)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
Subject: Re: Utility which is the reverse of nslookup
Date: 18 Dec 1992 15:29:00 -0000
Organization: Team Limpid's Meathead With Aptitude - Kunst und Wahnsinn
NNTP-Posting-Host: spatula.csv.warwick.ac.uk

In article <9212092057.AA29975@welchgate.welch.jhu.edu> Info-Nets@Think.Com writes:
>Is there a utlity/database which will take ip-numbers and
>give me the site names?  For example - if I fed it 128.220.59.13
>I would like it to tell me that the site is welchgate.welch.jhu.edu.

'host' does this a whole lot more - it's similar to 'dig' but easier to use.
Available from ftp.warwick.ac.uk:/pub/inet/host.tar.Z

Cheers,
-- 
\/ato - Ian Dickinson - NIC handle: ID17                   No-one is to molest
vato@csv.warwick.ac.uk  ...!mcsun!uknet!warwick!vato           the wombat when
/I=I/S=Dickinson/OU=CSV/O=Warwick/PRMD=UK.AC/ADMD= /C=GB/            anyone is
@c=GB@o=University of Warwick@ou=Computing Services@cn=Ian Dickinson  watching.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
From: istuart@nyx.cs.du.edu (Ian Stuart)
Subject: Infosites in Europe.
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 92 11:38:31 GMT

I'm looking for a list of information sites within Europe.
Scott A. Yanoff produces a good list of American sites, but I cannot find
one for Europe. 
If anyone knows of one, please could they Post it, or e-mail it to me.
If people wish me to compile one, please send me a *summery* of what you
offer, how to aquire it, and an address to mail queries to.

	example:
Lawnet		Telnet	sparc-1.law.columbia.edu or Telnet 128.59.176.78
Offers	Law/Judicial info and catalogs access		(login: lawnet)

I will compile a list over the christmas break, and post it in early January.

--
--- Kiz (aka Ian Stuart) istuart@nyx.cs.du.edu
	{ Chivalry is not dead! - Just the Horse }
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
From: xmpp@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Melody Paul)
Subject: Where can I find???
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 18:55:09 GMT

Hello,

Can someone tell me what sources will give me the following information?
  
1.  All the hospitals in Chicago?

2.  All the universities and colleges in Illinois?

3.  The top 100 companies in Illinois?

4.  The directors of the Human Resource department for each of the above?

Thanks in advance.
-- 
Melody P. Paul			Office:   708/534-0200
Technical Editor		Fax:      708/534-2042
Educational Computing Network	Internet: xmpp@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu
University Park, IL 60466	BITNET:   xmpp@ecnuxa
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 09:33:55 EST
From: Peter M. Weiss <PMW1@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
Subject: Re: Nearest you, in instructions

Here is yet some more info on the "nearest listserv" ...  these
instructions were abstracted from the return of information provided by
sending the HELP cmd to the listserv@NDSUVM1 (aka vm1.nodak.edu) and
are somewhat unique to that listserv (though certainly other Revised
Listservs might implement the /N option locally) --

/Nearest node <(options<<(>>>  Find the nearest LISTSERV to a specified
                               node.
           Options: Distance - causes the distance from your node to
                               target node to be stated.  This is the
                               default.
                    NODistan - does not cause the distance to be stated.
                    Prefer   - Allows you to specify a prefered node.
                    Backbone - will only search for the nearest server
                               on the backbone.
                    NOWeight - does not take link weights into account
                               when considering distances.  WEIGHT is
                               the default.

Thus if one wants to find the "closest" listserv(s) to bitnet node
UKANVAX --

> /n ukanvax (now
There are 2 LISTSERVs nearest to UKANVAX and they are 1 node away:
         UKANVM
         KSUVM    -  backbone server

/Pete (pmw1@psuvm.psu.edu)
--
Peter M. Weiss                     | not affiliated with psuvm.psu.edu|psuvm
31 Shields Bldg -- Penn State Univ.| "Connectivity is more than a Connection"
University Park, PA USA 16802-1202 | E. Michael Staman, _The Circuit_, Apr 92
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 09:52:52 EST
From: Peter M. Weiss <PMW1@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
Subject: Re: Nearest you, in instructions

Though I don't disagree with any followups to the original question,
one can "search" for Revised Listservs based upon the host site
description or country code.  If you send this to the "nearest" (oops,
we have a recursive definition here), I mean any listserv backbone
site, you will be able to find, perhaps, some geographically/polically
more desireable location:

--------------clip------------
//ListSrch JOB Echo=no
Database Search DD=Rules
//Rules DD *
SEARCH listserv_site_location_string IN PEERS WHERE COUNTRY xx
INDEX
--------------clip------------

If you send this to a NON-backbone listserv, it will tell you where
you should re-direct the SEARCH.

E.g., to search for all listserv sites in Sweden (assuming I lived
in Sweden) --

--------------clip------------
//ListSrch JOB Echo=no
Database Search DD=Rules
//Rules DD *
SEARCH * IN PEERS WHERE COUNTRY SE
INDEX
--------------clip------------

/Pete (pmw1@psuvm.psu.edu)
--
Peter M. Weiss                     | not affiliated with psuvm.psu.edu|psuvm
31 Shields Bldg -- Penn State Univ.| "Connectivity is more than a Connection"
University Park, PA USA 16802-1202 | E. Michael Staman, _The Circuit_, Apr 92
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 08:54:16 EST
From: Peter M. Weiss <PMW1@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.infonets
Subject: Re: Failed FTP connection to CNI.ORG

In article <9212181653.AA08425@Early-Bird.Think.COM>, Andy Stoughton
<LAS%SRU.bitnet@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU> says:

>We have a user who has been trying to FTP to CNI.ORG for a couple of
>days without success. (...)

>Is CNI.ORG a valid host (temporarily unavailable) or is it an
>invalid hostname? We're stumped and any help will be appreciated.

>Please direct any responses to me at LAS@SRU.

Though CNI.ORG may be valid for E-mail, it is NOT for FTP.  You
will have success if you use the hostname FTP.CNI.ORG.

/Pete (pmw1@psuvm.psu.edu)
--
Peter M. Weiss                     | not affiliated with psuvm.psu.edu|psuvm
31 Shields Bldg -- Penn State Univ.| "Connectivity is more than a Connection"
University Park, PA USA 16802-1202 | E. Michael Staman, _The Circuit_, Apr 92
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU