HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: misc.kids

>Whether to start a child in kindergarten "early" always has to depend
>on the child.

Thank you for the posting and glad to see there are still young and
smart children out there whose parents think they are ready eventhough 
they are born after the kindergarten cutoff date. 

I was irratated by the "he was ready intellectually and emotionally
but why not let him be the largest kid instead of the smallest kid" 
attitude when I was looking into kindergarten last year. It seemed
like nobody believed in stimulation and challenge anymore. When we
sent our 4.75 year old daughter to kindergarten last fall, we were
criticized as "pushing her" and unwise for giving up a year of so
called "advantage". 

I understand that recent research favors "late" than "early". But it
is really not fair to the children when some parents apply it 
to the extreem. I have seen bright and able 5 year olds who are 
perfectly capable of kindergarten being held back simply because 
their parents want them to be superior to their peers, and bright 
and able 5 year olds who would do perfectly fine if not being   
intimidated by some over age over size classmates. Now their
parents began to wonder whether they did the right thing by 
sending them to kindergarten. They should have been held back too.
This could go on and on and eventually the early six year olds are
the youngest in class, until either the curriculum is adjusted 
accordingly or the state steps in to impose mandatory enrollment.
Everyone loses. The children who hurt most are the ones who
truely need another year to mature.  

When children are ready to move on, nothing will stop them. You
postpone their entrance to K, they will skip grades or they will
cause problem because they are bore. I sincerely hope that parents  
put their children's best interest first when facing kindergarten
decision and do not predetermine that they are going to keep them
for an extra year before knowing their children's ability. 


Vivienne Poon
poon@hpcc01.corp.hp.com
From: pgallant@cvbnet.prime.com (cvbnet)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Gymboree clothes
Date: 15 Apr 92 18:18:18 GMT

From article <92105.154526CLH7@psuvm.psu.edu>, by CLH7@psuvm.psu.edu:
> My son got a few outfits from Gymboree as baby presents.  We like the style
> and color of them, but I haven't seen them locally and they must be one of
> the few mail order catalogs that haven't found my name yet.  Does anyone
> know if they can be bought through the mail and how I can get a catalog?
> Also, does anyone have any experience with these clothes?  How do they
> compare to others?  My guess (given who they came from) is that they are
> fairly expensive, but well-made.
> Thanks for your help.
> Chris Himes, CLH7@PSUVM.PSU.EDU


I love gymboree clothes.  They are fairly expensive, but they're good
quality and really cute styles.  They're sized so that you can get the
most wear out of them.  I selfishly give them as gifts to my nephews
knowing that my son will get them as hand-me-downs.  Sorry, I don't
have any catalog information, but there are stores you can visit.  Here
in the northest, I've seen them at several malls.  I would call for the
stores nearest you.


 ___| Pamela Gallant               |________   ___   *
|   | Computervision, Bedford, MA  |  [ ]   | | []|__II
|   | (617) 275-1800 x4707         |  [ ]   |_|        |
 OO-| pgallant@cvbnet.prime.com    |OO----OO  OOO----OO >
From: wendy@milton.u.washington.edu (Wendy Grant)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Inderal, pregnancy, & migraine (was Re: Headaches in pre-pubescent girl)
Date: 17 Apr 92 18:46:58 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

>> ...
>Now that I'm pregnant, though, I feel a LOT less "migrainey." I hear
>that migraines can go away during pregnancy (I wonder if they come back
>after the birth?) I need to ask my doctor whether Inderal gets into
>breast milk, and if so, explore alternative migraine control
>medications after Lena/Isaac is born.
>
  My neurologist told me that some women's migraines get better and
some get worse during pregnancy and he couldn't tell which group I
would fall into. Inderal does absolutely nothing for me; I take
fiorinal for pain (works most of the time) but haven't had a migraine
yet during pregnancy (but then again, I'm only 5.5 weeks pregnant.
We'll see....)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: holly@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com (Holly Wise)
Subject: ONLY CHILDREN
Summary: SHE'S UPSET BECAUSE SHE HAS NO SIBLINGS
Keywords: DAUGHTER, 8 YEAR OLD, ONLY CHILD
Organization: Lockheed Santa Cruz
Distribution: USA
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 92 23:34:52 GMT


My 8 year old daughter is very upset because she has no sister or brother.  
My husband and I can't have any more children.  She doesn't really want a 
younger brother or sister anyway.  She wants a twin or someone to play 
with.  Anyone have any experience either with having an only child or being 
one that I could use to make her feel better?
-----
holly@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com
From: llf@alice.att.com (alice!llf)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Seeking information about Tuboplasty
Date: 10 Apr 92 18:39:24 GMT
Reply-To: llf@alice.UUCP (alice!llf)
Organization: New Jersey State Home for Bewildered Kittens

In article <tsrjdfp.valentin@netcom.com> valentin@netcom.com (Valentin Pepelea) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.155520.22401@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>
>lauraf@notavax.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom) writes:
>>
>>Yes! Another offensive post by Eric Lee Green. It seems like whenever I see
>>his name on a post I can expect it to be mean spirited. In the last few weeks
>>...
>>Am I alone in feeling this way?
>
>I have no doubt that you are not the only one, but I certainly hope that you
>are in the underwhelming minoroty.

I was going to ignore this, but....

Eric has a lot of interesting information, and he is more than willing to
post with that information, along with his opinions.  Yes, he is incredibly
opinionated, frequently lacks tact and empathy, probably has no
long term experience in raising kids or living with them.  He sometimes
writes about things he knows nothing about (don't we all?).  A lot of what
he says is "theoretical", and I have frequently wanted to strangle those child
development theoreticians.  (What do they know?  Their WIVES raised their
kids! :-) )  But writing on the net tends to magnify all those things because
there are none of the normal interpersonal cues going on.

However, I hope that he continues to post, because after wading thru the
chaff, there are a lot of interesting things he has to say, and it's always
pertinent to misc.kids (unlike some of the other recent cross-postings).
And who knows, we all learn through our mistakes.  Better he learn it here
than while working with real kids.

Lynda
-- 
					Member HASA, Atheist-Scum Division
"The One Horseman and Three Pedestrians of the Apocalypse" - Terry Pratchet
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: judy@locus.com (Judy Leedom Tyrer)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Working full-time out of choice
Date: 11 Apr 92 01:43:43 GMT
Organization: Locus Computing Corporation, Los Angeles, California

In article <15161@optima.cs.arizona.edu> bweiss@cs.arizona.edu (Beth Weiss) writes:
>A parent (who works):
>|> >>a. A happy, fulfilled person makes a better role model and
>|> >>   a terrific parent.
>|> >>b. A child needs to learn that the whole world does not
>|> >>   revolve around them.  His/her needs are very important, but
>|> >>   they do not COMPLETELY take precedence over other people's.
>
>Another parent (who presumably stays home):
>|> I think you need to take some Child Psychology courses, b/c obviously,
>|> you don't understand at all the developmental stages your son is
>|> going through.
>
>This is _exactly_ the kind of nastiness that we ought to be
>avoiding---it seems to be based on the premise that "I analyzed the
>situation, came up with a particular choice, and anyone who doesn't
>come up with the same choice has something wrong with them."
>
Beth, I think you are reacting to something that wasn't intended.  I think
the comment about not understanding the phases of a child's life was in
reference not to choosing to work, but in thinking that a young child,
especially an infant, should grow up thinking the world does not revolve
around him.  Now, you may disagree with standard child psychology, but what
a child begins believing the world revolves around him and this is healthy.
Children are extremely ego centered in their early years.  It usually isn't
until they reach adolescence that they discover that, "wow, parents are people
too".

The infant believes he is his primary caretaker, what our teachers called the
"I am YOU" stage.  Then they hit the twos and enter the "You are ME" stage.
You know, this is MINE, that is MINE, the other is MINE.  (I remember the first
time Mitchell talked in his sleep was about age 2 - he was screaming "my ball,
my ball").

Trying to teach a child he is not the center of the universe at this age is
counter productive.  It's like trying to teach a 6 mo. old how to ride a bike.


-- 
"This is just a test.  Had this been a real life, you would have been given
further instructions on where to go and what to do."
							Judy Leedom Tyrer
Newsgroups: misc.kids,alt.kids-talk,alt.parents-teens,misc.education
From: mmeyer@m2.dseg.ti.com (Mark Meyer)
Subject: Re: Minors right of access to contraceptives?
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc. - Plano TX
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 21:50:35 GMT

In article <2531@keele.keele.ac.uk> csz55@seq1.keele.ac.uk (Christopher Wrigley) writes:
> A G A I N S T
>      ii)  The matter should be discussed _in_the_home and is not the
>  schools responsiblilty nor is it their right to address such issues
>  or practices in the school setting.

	Well, maybe if parents got off their respective behinds and
TOOK the responsibility, then schools wouldn't feel the need to take
drastic steps.  Something has to be done, and the parents
(collectively) aren't doing it, so...

>       v)  Giving condoms to children _encourages more sexual activity.
>  It was felt the children would be more likely to abstain if the free
>  condom opportunity was not available.

	Yeah, that's true.  And fire extinguishers only encourage
people to start fires.  And air bags in cars only encourage people to
have head-on collisions.

P.S.  Somebody please E-mail me if you see this.  Thanks.

--
Mark Meyer                                               | mmeyer@dseg.ti.com |
Texas Instruments, Inc.                                  +--------------------+
Every day, Jerry Junkins is grateful that I don't speak for TI.
         Vique's Law:  A man without religion is like a fish without a bicycle.
From: sdavis@nike.ColoSpgs.NCR.COM (Susan Davis)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Chickpox in Pregnancy -- Update
Date: 7 Apr 92 16:46:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: ncr-mpd.1625
Reply-To: sdavis@nike.ColoSpgs.NCR.COM (Susan Davis)
Organization: NCR Microelectronic Products Division

I posted last week about a good friend who got chickpox while pregnant.
I talked with her this morning and she is feeling positive.

She saw her doctor (OB) who then referred her to a specialist.  An
ultrasound showed her to be about 10-11wks (due date is 10/30).
This is considerred to be a very high risk period for the baby 
because there is such rapid development ocurring.  The specialist
said that the baby has an additional 3% risk of having birth
defects (the average risk is 3% so hers is 6%).  The posibilities
ranged from blindness to limb defects to severe brain damage
(incomplete formation of the brain).  She was told the second
trimester chicken pox actually is a great risk to the mother
(she said something like 5% fatality but she was unsure if she
rememberred right).  And as others have said, chickpox just
prior to birth has a high fatality rate for the baby.

She will have another ultrasound at 17 weeks.  They should be able
to get a better idea of any physical defects at that time.  Her
biggest fear is of brain growth problems.  Again, she is very
optimistic and she feels that the odds are still in favor of a
healthy child. 

Also, she was given a shot (chickenpox vacination).  Although it
was too late to help her, the doctor felt that the vacination may
pass the placenta and provide some benefit to the fetus.  Her OB
actually had 2 OB patients with chickenpox at the moment even 
though it is rare in adults and even rarer in pregnancy.  Her 
daughter has not gotten them yet (she is 1 year old today).
The good news is that my friends chickenpox was a mild case!

I think that the vacination ought to be regularly available to
women who plan to have children but have never had chickenpox.
I think that they are "high risk"

-- Susan Davis (Mommy to Ryan -- He'll be 1 on 4/13!)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|Susan P. Davis, Design Services |  >>>>                 Susan.Davis@ncr-mpd |  |NCR Microelectronics  (AT&T)    | >>>>         Susan.Davis@ColoSpgs.NCR.COM |  |Colorado Springs, CO            |>>>>(719) 596-5795 x435 VOICEplus 463-0435 |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky misc.kids:13107 alt.satanism:1364
From: rhr9081@hertz.njit.edu (Ray Rich)
Newsgroups: misc.kids,alt.satanism
Subject: Re: The Satanic Purpose.
Keywords: Purpose.
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:52:47 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <1992Apr8.195034.27317@en.ecn.purdue.edu> muehlhau@en.ecn.purdue.edu (John Muehlhausen) writes:
>In article <1992Apr8.152043.21643@panix.com> rdr@panix.com (Reuben Radding) writes:
>>
>>A Satanist must appease no god but himself.
>>A Satanist's only purpose is to live his/her life as he/she
>>sees fit.
>>
>>A Satanist chooses to doubt, rather than believe.
>>
>
>Sounds more like a humanist to me -- whats with the shock value?
>
>John M.

	Humanism is not a religion.  It is a philosophy.  Also, a Satanist
(at least me, I do not seek to speak for all Satanists) does stand opposed to
the ideas of Christianity, namely the restrictions on behavior based on faith
alone.  I don't wantonly slay people, not because it's "bad" or I'll burn, but
because I stand with nothing to gain from it, and will have to suffer if
caught.  Considering that a Satanist puts himself and his own welfare above
all else, this is counterproductive.
	As for shock value, there is much to be gained by having an enemy.  I
believe Christianity created the concept of "evil" to have such an enemy.  Thus,
Satan (conveniently depicted as popular Pagan deities such as Pan) is the
common enemy of Christians, and gives them a reason to band together if
nothing else.  It works both ways.  Satanists often hold Christians and their
beliefs in contempt, especially when forced on others as their religion demands.

						Raythrax
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: lauraf@notavax.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom)
Subject: Re: Need gate advice
Keywords: gate
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 20:44:36 GMT

In article <1992Apr7.144428.29825@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu Ayala) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.023848.22431@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> rdc8@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Robert D Castro) writes:
>>Hi fellow netters!
>>
>>I can use some misc.kids advice on type of gates used.  Which ones are
>>the safest, most easiest to use, gives the most flexibility as to
>>moving gate from place to place of different widths of passage to
>>block, portability. Good points and bad points to keep an eye out for.
>>Any suggestions on makes, models and places to purchase (including
>>mail order - OK) would be appreciated.
>>
>>Rob C.
>
>
>  Please send me some advice.  I am interested in hardware mounted
>  (without those rubber pressure sensitive knobs).  The doors at
>  my mother-in-law and in my apartment are not parallel, thus
>  I cannot get the gates to stick.  I wasted money on a Gerry,
>  because even though you could hinge mount it, it turns out that
>  you mush use pressure to keep the gate closed.  I just want one
>  that mounts on hinges on one side, and has a latch on the
>  other side.  I can't seem to find them in the store, since
>  all they sell are pressure-mounted gates.  My 14 month old
>  thinks it is fun to push the gate over (even though he falls).
>

For a good mail order source try Safer Baby Company. They have an 800 number,
so you can get the number from 800 information (1-800-555-1212). I had a gate
that I bought locally, but is also available thru them. It is wood and has
vertical slats. On each side of the door frame you connect two eyebolts. Then
there are three hooks (2 on one side, one on the other) that hook into the
eyebolts. Then instead of a hook for the forth eyebolt there is a little clamp
thingy that keeps the whol thing from being taken off too easily. You can remove
the whole gate easily (and with extra eyebolts - use it in more then one
location), or you can disconnect the side with the clamp and swing it aside,
You can even collapse it in a bit. The come in two sizes. One fits most
standard doors, and the other size expands up to 96(??) inches. I used the
larger one to seperate the living room from the dining room. Worked great.

I am not good at describing this sort of thing. 

Laura Floom

P.S. I think it is made by Cosco, but dont hold me to it.
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: aharvey@fwhnm02.fwrdc.rtsg.mot.com (Anne Harvey)
Subject: Norplant
Organization: Cellular Infrastructure Group, Motorola, Inc.
Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1992 16:31:47 GMT

 
I am considering using the Norplant implant system of contraception.
I've discussed this with my gynocologist and was given a brochure to
read.  There does not seem to be any contraindications (I do not want
to get pregnant for at least the next several years.  I have no
personal or family history of liver disease, blood clots, breast
disease, heart disease, high blood pressure, elevated cholesterol,
etc.)  However, I am breastfeeding my 5 mo. old daughter and would like
to continue.  My dr.  tells me Norplant will not cause me or the baby
any problems, but I am slightly skeptical.

I'd like to hear any personal experience with this type of
contraception, especially those who have breastfed while using
Norplant.

thanks, 
anne
-- 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|             Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a bannana.          |
|                                                                             |
|                                  Anne Harvey                                |
|                 Internet:aharvey@hpmail1.fwrdc.rtsg.mot.com                 |
|              The opinions contained herein are strictly my own.             |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Xref: sparky misc.kids:13045 alt.kids-talk:638 alt.parents-teens:674 misc.education:1933
From: csz55@seq1.keele.ac.uk (Christopher Wrigley)
Newsgroups: misc.kids,alt.kids-talk,alt.parents-teens,misc.education
Subject: Re: Minors right of access to contraceptives?
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:36:09 GMT
Organization: University of Keele, England

From article, by s8486534@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (S8486534):

=> X writes, y writes....
=> 
=>        The discussion of condoms in schools belongs on Oprah Winfrey, not
=> in a forum devoted to education.  When are you people going to grow up!

And when are _you going to grow up to what's going on in the world
today, where the *education* of our children is vital to their survival.

It appears that you are obviously too grown up, where you feel
traditions and ideals of the past will fit in today's society. Would you
sleep better at night if these issues were not discussed in your forum
devoted to education.

I know I wouldn't.
			Chris
__
Christopher  Wrigley           "Have not children the right to keep the
University of Keele, England      secrets of their hearts from you?"
JANET - csz55@uk.ac.keele           (Lindkvist - Strindbergs "Easter")
BITNET - csz55%seq1.keele.ac.uk@ukacrl
Xref: sparky misc.kids:13051 alt.kids-talk:640 alt.parents-teens:676 misc.education:1938
Newsgroups: misc.kids,alt.kids-talk,alt.parents-teens,misc.education
Subject: Re: welfare (was: Minors right of access to contraceptives?)
From: abel@vax.sonoma.edu (dan abel)
Date: 15 Apr 92 14:58:11 -0800
 <4dv4rCi00UhBM25yAD@andrew.cmu.edu> <shqksINNq3t@agate.berkeley.edu>
Organization: Sonoma State University

In article <shqksINNq3t@agate.berkeley.edu>, bh@anarres.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Brian Harvey) writes:
> jh4o+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jeffrey T. Hutzelman) writes:
>>user Carl Reimann@auvm.americ writes:
>>>Wisconsin has decided that in the case of

[LOT'S OF STUFF DELETED HERE, some of which I agree with]
 
> It's absolutely true that the people on welfare tend to have kids on welfare.
> One reason for that is that school budgets are allocated by the wealth of the
> individual school district.  The children of the rich are trained for the
> high-paying jobs.  The children of the poor are trained for poverty.  Tinkering
> with the welfare payment formula doesn't address that!  Meanwhile, the formula
> should make sure that nobody starves.  That's why people are "paid to have
> children"--so that the children don't starve.
> 

I realize that this net is worldwide, but the above poster is posting 
from Berkeley, California; at least according to the address.  I live 
in California, and I'm going to talk California stuff.

Over 90% of the local public school budget is ADA (average daily 
attendance).  Only 3% is lottery money.  The rest is special money 
for transportation, gifted, reading, etc.  This means that most of 
the budget is completely based on how many students attend how many 
days of school.  By state law, the yearly ADA per student may not 
vary more than $100 between the poorest and richest districts.  My 
wife was on the district budget committee which recommended a budget 
for the last two years, so these numbers are accurate, if just for 
this district.  I'm curious as to where you got your information.

I don't have any figures about welfare mothers.  I would appreciate 
someone posting some real numbers about how much they get paid for 
having another child.  I wonder sometimes if this story is "urban 
legend".  I have three children, and I can tell you from personal 
experience that I would want quite a bit of money to have a child if 
I didn't already want to have one.  They can be quite expensive, 
especially as they get older.

I am sure that there are welfare "cheats", and people who are on 
welfare out of sheer laziness, but I doubt that we can do much 
without doing even more hurt to people who really need the help.

> Only to people who want to blame the victims is this complicated.

I disagree.  I think that it *is* complicated, and that your post 
doesn't reflect everything (but then who wants to read a book?).
Newsgroups: misc.kids