HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dickwin@sequent.com (Dick Winningstad)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Stainless question
Date: 22 Dec 92 15:05:51 GMT
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.


Does anyone have information on using a stainless brush to clean the
bore of a stainless gun?

Several people I have spoken with say there is no problem.
But it seems a little dangerous to use as the brush waould be as hard
as the barrel and would seem to be more prone to scratching the
inside surface of the barrel.

Any input?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+Dick Winningstad                                                    +
+                    Italian Wines are Fine                          +
+          I'd rather be on a Moto Guzzi in eastern Oregon.          +
+dickwin@sequent.com                                                 +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From: emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: MAC10 - open bolt v. closed bolt
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:17:53 GMT
Organization: Gannett Technologies Group

In article <199212172133.AA14686@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> gtao@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Greg ) writes:
#Having no personal experience with the MAC10, I decided to turn to 
#you netters.  I have always liked the MAC10, tho' I have never had 
#the occasion to fire one.  One recent dealer price I was quoted was
#about $300 for the closed-bolt model, and about $800 for the open
#bolt model.  Both were chambered in 9mm, and I guess the open-bolt
#model is about 10 years old.

If you ever fired one, your favorable impression might change.
The rock and roll model is fun, but the semi is a terrible 
pistol.

#I was wondering what the advantages are to owning an open-bolt
#MAC10?  I have heard that they are easily converted to full-auto, 
#but that is illegal in my state, and I have no intention of doing
#so.  Is the open-bolt any more durable?  Is it more accurate?  Is
#the price just a reflection of the fact that open bolt MAC10-style
#guns are no longer produced.  Without enough compelling reasons, I
#would tend to lean towards the Cobray, since I could get a new one.

The open bolt prevents cook off of a chambered round after a session
of rock and roll. It has a horrible effect on accuracy though because
the long time between pulling the trigger and the heavy bolt stripping
a round and slamming it into the chamber tends to throw your shots
wild. Full auto conversion is trivial which is why BATF stopped 
manufacture of the M10. The M11 Cobray goes for around $239 here,
but the factory is in town. I have one as a curosity, but wouldn't
select it if I needed to shoot something.

Gary
From: charlesg@cco.caltech.edu (Charles Grosjean)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Rem 700 box mag
Date: 29 Dec 92 01:49:41 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena

megatek!hollen@uunet.UU.NET (Dion Hollenbeck) writes:

##>>>> On 26 Dec 92 00:17:24 GMT, keith@scorpio.ic.cmc.ca (Keith de Solla) said:

#Keith> It is possible to modify a Remington model 700 (.308Win) to accept
#Keith> a box type magazine?  Is a kit available for such a conversion or
#Keith> would this require a gunsmith?

Talk to H-S Precision. They used to sell something called the KWIK-KLIP, but
it only works on long actions (at least at the time I talked to them).

Charles
From: bellcore!torque.bae.bellcore.com!sjs@uunet.UU.NET (Stephen Szymanski)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Norinco M14/Mini14/SKS
Date: 29 Dec 92 01:50:02 GMT
Organization: Bell Communications Research

In article <1992Dec24.152455.21328@MorningStar.Com>, chris@MorningStar.Com (Chris Miller) writes:
|> 
|> BTW, the internal parts of the action appear to be made without the
|> slightest ragards for any type of tolerances.  They appeared to be rough 
|> cast, still having seams and pits from the casting process. other parts 
|> appear to be made of heavy sheet metal punched out by automated 
|> equipment.  
|> 
|> Chris Miller
|> chris@MorningStar.Com
|> 
|> 
|> 
|> 


This is rather interesting in that I own a Mini-14 and can attest
that it is not exactly accurate, although at 50 feet it seems to
be quite able to group all the shots in a fairly tight pattern. :^>
A side question here, just how accurate is the M16 firing .223 at
similar ranges?

Also, mine has the bicentenial stamping on it, so I suppose
that the manufacture was in 1976 :^).  The quality
of the metal and workmanship seems to be much better than
described above.  Perhaps the quality went down over the years?

Just my .02 cents worth. 

Steve
-- 
******************************************************************************

Disclaimer:

The opinions expressed herein are solely my own and are not shared by Bellcore
nor any of its owner companies.

******************************************************************************

Steve Szymanski 
Bellcore 				RRC-1E222
444 Hoes Lane				(908)699-5026
Piscataway, NJ  08854			sjs@bae.bellcore.com
From: webdw@mvutd.att.com (Bruce D Woods)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: chinese 7.62x39
Date: 22 Dec 92 23:47:43 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <BzMD9t.D1r@apollo.hp.com> rielly_s@apollo.hp.com (Stephen M. Rielly) writes:
#
#I have shot a lot of suplus 7.62x39 in the past 3 years and
#the best that I have come by is the East German police ammo
#that is cuurently for sale. The chinese ammo is extremely
#corrosive (the stuff in the tins) and in about one day rust
#will appear on the gas tube of my rifle. The German ammo 
#(1100rds/$140) is a little more expensive but it is much 

CDNN Investments sells lead core, Berdan primed, non-corrosive for
$118/1200 rounds (+shipping); the total was about $140.  No cleaning
problems but, of course, I'm not going to reload them either.
From: grant.robinson@canrem.com (Grant Robinson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: airgun lubricant
Date: 22 Dec 92 00:00:22 GMT

for the seal.  Any experienced insight would be appreciated.
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: keith@scorpio.ic.cmc.ca (Keith de Solla)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Rem 700 box mag
Date: 26 Dec 92 00:17:24 GMT
Organization: Canadian Microelectronics Corporation

It is possible to modify a Remington model 700 (.308Win) to accept
a box type magazine?  Is a kit available for such a conversion or
would this require a gunsmith?

-------------------------------------------------------------------
| Keith P. de Solla, P.Eng |  "Be sure brain is engaged before    |
| CMC                      |   putting mouth in gear"             |
| keith@orion.ic.cmc.ca    |                                      |
From: scot@hpfcla.fc.hp.com (Scot Heath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Slug Compatible?
Date: 2 Jan 93 18:44:12 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Fort Collins Site

Give Remington's customer service @ (315)-895-7791 a call and they will be
happy to tell you.  My bet is they say yes but you may want to get a
larget tube just for acurracy.

-Scot
From:  (Mike J.)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Some Gold Cup Questions
Date: 23 Dec 92 22:59:37 GMT



# I bought a Colt Gold Cup 80 Series and it has this hokey trigger
# screw that fouls up every 50 or so shots. The screw is in the body
# of the trigger.  The screw pulls out forward and the trigger is 
# rendered useless. Currently the remedy is to insert a paper clip 
# in to the screw and screw it in.

# (2)  Has anyone else had this problem?  Will blue Loc-Tite fix
#      the problem with reasonably assured reliablity?

Sounds like the threadlocking compound is missing from your screw.  I think
the way your screw works is that the more you turn the screw "in" the less
take up you have.  If it "walks in" too far, you don't trip the sear.  On
the 2 GCs I've owned this screw is very stiff.  Yours must not be if you
can use a paper clip.

1) You can't use regular Loctites on the screw without some semi-serious
disassembly.  However, Loctite does make a "wicking" formula that doesn't
require disassembly.
2) The actual adjustment is NOT a no brainer.  If not adjusted correctly
you can damage the sear. After you adjust the screw to give the desired
results, with the unloaded gun pointed in a safe direction, pull the
trigger and hold it tight.  Then with your free thumb rock the hammer back
and forth.  It must move freely. Any binding or rubbing and you have the
screw adjusted too far in.
3) I would hold the screw with a small dab of Devcon 5 Minute Epoxy where
the male/female threads meet.  This will come off if you want it to. 
Otherwise, the  gun will have to come apart for conventional Loctiting or
you'll have to hunt around for the "wicking" formula.
 
# My questions are:
# (1)  What is this s*&t?!  Did I make a mistake in buying the 
#      lastest and safest 1911 from Colt?

You might have done better.  With moderate use, your front sight will
eventially go south and the rear sight pin will drift.  The collet bushing
is supposedly prone to breaking but I haven't broken one.  If you're
shooting hardball etc. install an 18 /12 lb Wolff spring and Shok Buffs. 
Good luck.

Mike J.
From: scot@hpfcla.fc.hp.com (Scot Heath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Clays powder, clean as they claim?
Date: 2 Jan 93 18:44:10 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Fort Collins Site

I have looked at a shotgun barrel after firing approximately 100 rounds with
clays powder.  It was as clean as they say.

I personally put zero importance in the cleanliness of powder.  My shotgun
barrels get cleaned first of all to prevent rust from the water in the
shells, second of all to get the plastic out of the forcing cone and choke
area and lastly to remove the "dirt" left by the powder.

Just my $.02 worth.

-Scot
From: cash@convex.com (Peter Cash)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Norinco M14/Mini14/SKS
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:01:49 GMT
Organization: The Instrumentality

#|> BTW, the internal parts of the action appear to be made without the
#|> slightest ragards for any type of tolerances.  They appeared to be rough 
#|> cast, still having seams and pits from the casting process. other parts 
#|> appear to be made of heavy sheet metal punched out by automated 
#|> equipment.  
...

#This is rather interesting in that I own a Mini-14 and can attest
#that it is not exactly accurate, although at 50 feet it seems to
#be quite able to group all the shots in a fairly tight pattern. :^>

You mean 50 yards, don't you? Yes, it's a lamentable fact that the Mini 14
is not a paragon of accuracy--I have to admit this, though I don't like
fessing up that any of my toys are less than wonderful 8^). I've found that
shooting from a rest with a scope, I can consistently shoot 1" to 1.5"
groups at 50 yards. At 100 yards...well, I don't like to think about it.

The problem appears to be partly in the thin "whippy" barrel. Also, this
barrel heats up rapidly, and so groups start to wander as you shoot up
a few magazines. As another poster noted, the trigger is just awful, and
lightening it helps quite a bit. You can get this gun rebarreled (at least
one place advertises this service), but it's not worth it--it'd be cheaper
to buy a new rifle.

#A side question here, just how accurate is the M16 firing .223 at
#similar ranges?

I haven't shot an AR15 enough to say I know from experience, but they say
that one should, in theory, be capable of MOA accuracy. I suspect this may
only be true of the heavy-barreled ("H-BAR") version. This gun isn't a
paragon of accuracy either--but it beats the Mini 14.

#Also, mine has the bicentenial stamping on it, so I suppose
#that the manufacture was in 1976 :^).  The quality
#of the metal and workmanship seems to be much better than
#described above.  Perhaps the quality went down over the years?

I've got a recent vintage of Mini 14, and can't really complain about the
quality. Sure, parts aren't polished where they don't need to be--but
that's what makes the gun relatively cheap; it's not relevant to
performance. "Tolerances" are as good as they need to be for dependable
functioning.

The only thing that really burns me about the Mini 14 is that Bill Ruger
doesn't see fit to sell large capacity magazines to us regular
folks--they're for "law enforcement only". Indeed, the Mini-14 seems to
have found some acceptance in law-enforcement circles, so I guess its
accuracy is considered acceptable for combat standards.

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
             |      Die Welt ist alles, was Zerfall ist.     |
Peter Cash   |       (apologies to Ludwig Wittgenstein)      |cash@convex.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: rr@dymaxion.ns.ca (Rod Regier)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: re: 9mmx19 powder choice?
Date: 2 Jan 93 18:44:05 GMT


rr@dymaxion.ns.ca (Rod Regier) writes:
#My favorite 9mmx19 powder is HS-6 (or its almost twin Winchester 540).
#Used it with bullet weights 88gr to 158gr, excellent performance.

n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:
#	I went to the store planning to buy some 158 gr LRNs one day
#to use in my 9mm.  The point of this whim was to minimize leading
#with low vel (but high recoil) and to see what these long slugs would 
#do in front of the 4.6 gr BE that I like to use with every load in
#every caliber.  %^)
#
#	Once there I decided they were too long and might cause
#feeding problems.  Yours work fine?  What was the OAL and vel?
#anyone else do it?
#
#	Later I decided that the idea was a waste of time and that
#there is nothing wrong with the 115-125 gr slugs that the gun is
#intended to work with.

I used 158g SWC lead bullets for my "extremely heavy" projectile
experiment in 9mm.  The pressure signs with HS-6 were acceptable,
but the mechanical problems with making it work are a BEAR.
I was using a NATO-spec throated barrel, or else it would have
been a totally lost cause.  Even then, the bullets have to be
seated so deep that the case sides bulge.  Many of those
cases had a large enough bulge that it was impossible
to get them to chamber.

If you are looking for accurate, funtionally reliable
loads in 9mm, stick with 115 to 124 grain projectiles.

I've tried a lot of different bullets,
and have had the least headaches with 124g lead and jacketed
projectiles in 9mmx19.

==>If there is some interest, I could go into more detail
==>about the mechanical aspects of 9mm load selection
==>and production...

Regarding using 4.6 grains of BE (?Bullseye) for all your loads:
If you hold a powder charge fixed and increase the bullet
weight, the pressures will go up.
Conversely, holding the power change fixed and dropping the
bullet weight will make pressures go down.

As long as your powder charge is under maximum for your
heaviest bullet weight, you can get away with it
(within reason).

I strongly suspect your 4.6g of (?Bullseye) with a 158g
lead projectile for 9mmx19 would have been OVER maximum.
Most of the 147g and above data for 9mmx19 uses slower
burning powders.
--
Rod Regier, Software Development                     bus: (902)422-1973
Dymaxion Research Ltd.,                              fax: (902)421-1267
Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada B3J 1R2            Internet: rr@dymaxion.ns.ca
From: emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: 9mm cheapo car backup
Date: 27 Dec 92 12:33:58 GMT
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems

In article <1hdrb3INN9ah@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> bz269@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (James D. Del Vecchio) writes:
##This gun (A-90 .45 in my case) is very accurate and reliable.  It can do
##tiny (~1") groups 25 yds.   I don't know what else you could be looking for.
#       ^^^
#	I must have been kind of delerious last night.	8-)
#
#	Looking at my targets, I have some one hole five shot groups at 
#	33 ft, and some one hole groups with a sloppy extra hole or two 
#	at farther distances (my shaking hands).   I've handed it to better
#	shooters to watch them do one hole groups at 33 or 50 ft.  It always
#	shoots where I point, and has always made tiny groups when rested

You're a better man than me Gunga Din, I'm impressed when I can make all
the holes *touch*.

Gary
-- 
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | gatech!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | uunet!rsiatl!ke4zv!gary
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | emory!kd4nc!ke4zv!gary      
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     | emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu
From: p00140@psilink.com (Gary A. Woodward)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: .17 vs. .223 for varmits?
Date: 2 Jan 93 14:17:51 GMT
Organization: Performance Systems Int'l

Well winter has settled in on us here in VA.  I've got permission to 
hunt several farms in the spring and summer to kill groundhogs (it seems 
a lot of hunters cannot differeniate between a street sign, a cow, and a 
ground hog).  I like the prices of the Remingtons, but I have a question 
about the benefits of a .17 cal vs .223 for long rang varmiting.  I do 
not choose to reload at least in the begining-so exotic calibres are 
out.  Also a recommendation for a good variable X scope would be 
appreciated. Thanks in advance. 

Regards.

Gary
From: emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: AMT backup .380
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:17:35 GMT
Organization: Gannett Technologies Group

In article <1992Dec16.224828.14992@phx.mcd.mot.com> mcdphx!systemname!gcall@enuucp.eas.asu.edu (Glen Call) writes:
#
#In article <0bD502c32fQT01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com>, efk00@cd.amdahl.com (Eddie Kieger) writes:
#|> 
#|> At risk of taking lotssa flak, I'll stand up for AMT (flame suit ON :-)
#|> 
#[stuff deleted]
#|> I also have one of their Hardballers. For those unfailiar w/ the 
#|> Hardballer, it is a stainless Gold Cup clone. [more stuff deleted]
#
#Anyone else out there have experience with the AMT Hardballer?

I have a Hardballer. It's a nice accurate gun, but it does have a light
hammer fall. I've had misfires with some WWII vintage .45ACP that fires
fine in my Star PD. A stiffer hammer spring is a definite must. The
Hardballer is tight, the finish is satisfactory, and except for the
light hammer, it's a stainless Gold Cup as far as I'm concerned. It
feeds any ammo I've stuffed in it from hardball to wadcutters to 
hollowpoints. It groups nicely, but not as nicely as the miracle Star.
With the PD I routinely get 3 shot cloverleaf groups at 7 yards. With
the Hardballer there is usually a definite space between the holes. Of 
course I wouldn't want to fire an entire match with the little Star, it's 
a bit light and the sight radius is a tad short. I'm *very* pleased with
it as a carry gun, however.

Gary
From: smpod@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Stefan)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Canadian gun laws
Date: 22 Dec 92 00:00:08 GMT
Organization: who knows

keith@scorpio.ic.cmc.ca (Keith de Solla) writes...
#Apparently, the magazine limits (5 rounds for semi-auto rifles &
#10 for handguns) that were to come into effect Jan 1st, 1993 have
#been delayed until July 1993.


Great!!!!!!!

I still can shoot my ole Ishapore FN!

Do you know why the limit implementation was delayed?
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: NEW Soviet Armor and Helmet for sale.
Date: 2 Jan 93 18:44:00 GMT
Organization: Chalmers Tekniska Lekskola, G|teborg, G|taland

In article <9212290458.aa15193@s.s.ms.uky.edu> miles@ms.uky.edu (Stephen D. Grant) writes:
#I have a friend with the following for sale:
#A NEW Soviet battle helmet (armor) with a bullet-proof 3/4" lexan (like)
#face shield. It also has KGB in the serial number. He wants $500 for it.

  Frankly this sounds as riot gear. The KGB marking doesn't contradict this
since the KGB handled 'interior disturbances'.

-bertil-
--
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."
From: PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: More newbie questions
Date: 29 Dec 92 01:50:06 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee

I don't think that you can KEEP kids from playing with toy "guns."  Keep you 
kid away from plastic guns and he will pick up a stick, point it, and 
holler "bang."

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
From: cash@convex.com (Peter Cash)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Hi-Power mag safety
Date: 1 Jan 93 14:38:43 GMT
Organization: The Instrumentality

In article <1992Dec30.225158.15666@henson.cc.wwu.edu> n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio) writes:
...

#The Browning standard with the molded grips seems like a good
#starter gun and very good gun in general, but I have a concern:
#
#1)  The standard has safety on one side only.  What models have the
#ambi safety, and how much extra work/cost is it to order an ambi
#safety for the standard model? 

I dunno about this--my HP came with the extended ambidextrous safety. It's
an assembled in Portugal job, the box says, "Mark III S". It looks to me
like you could turn the magazine release around pretty easily. (I haven't
tried it, though.)

#I was thinking that the most accident proof first pistol ought to have
#a hammer drop safety, but how many decent guns have this?

Yeah, that's a rarity in SA pistols. The HP does have a half-cock notch
that _should_ catch the hammer if it slips (but I wouldn't stake my life on
it). Interestingly enough, this model also has a firing pin block--and
should thus be safe to carry with one in the chamber. 

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
             |      Die Welt ist alles, was Zerfall ist.     |
Peter Cash   |       (apologies to Ludwig Wittgenstein)      |cash@convex.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: ters0003@student.tc.umn.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: .22 Auto Pistol
Date: 30 Dec 92 16:07:40 GMT
Organization: University of Minnesota

Looking to pick up a .22LR Autoloader pistol.  Considering a Browning Buck Mark and a Ruger 22/45 Mark II.  Both seem quite adequate for the task, general 
"plinking", and I kind of prefer the styling of the Browning.  Anyone have any
feedback or suggestions?       

Also how well do the Intratec TEC-22 or TEC-9 work.  They seem pretty cheaply
made but I can't seem to get a performance feedback besides that they're
"a blast to shoot".

Thanks, Chris.