From: payner@netcom.com (Rich Payne)
Subject: Re: The Perennial Piracy Debate (was Re: Bilestoad)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 14:10:37 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <bazyar.712366277@teal> bazyar@teal.csn.org (Jawaid Bazyar) writes:
>payner@netcom.com (Rich Payne) writes:
>
>>In article <bazyar.711852801@teal> bazyar@teal.csn.org (Jawaid Bazyar) writes:
>
>>Wow, you know each and every pirate personally and can verify this?
>>Do they also drive Mercedies? You need to learn to read. 
>
>  I'm telling you from personal experience, and from talking with a number
>of IIgs software pirates, many of whom run BBSs.  Again, even if a
>particular person is too poor to afford a $30 game (very unlikely),
>does this mean that it is okay for him to pirate it?

I've said it several times, but you ignore it and edit it out every time.
I AM NOT AGRUING PIRACY AT ALL, you are. But not with me, with youreslf.
And you do it by taking my post out of context and misreading. Chill out.
 
>>I need to check some numbers, but I bet that the claimed lost profits
>>exceed the expendable income of America. If this is the case, the argument
>>cannot be valid.
>
>  Why is that?  Let's say that Microsoft has sold 5 million copies of Windows.
>Let's say that there are 40 million pirates copies in use.  That's $400mil
>right there that morally and legally belongs to Microsoft.  Now, start
>adding up all of the other heavily pirated packages for machines and
>yes, I can see how you might very well achieve a number that exceeds the
>amount of money Americans have to spend.  Does this mean then that since
>technically it's not lost profits that these pirates aren't doing any harm
>by pirating?  In addition, there's still a lot of money that Americans
>_do_ have to spend that isn't going where it belongs.

This is what I am arguing, the "lost profits" argument, as presented by the
software industry. Any agrument which claims losses beyond expendable
income in bogus. The money does not exist, and never did, how could it
be lost?

Piracy is another issue, which I will not argue about, and have -not- been
talking about. 

And who the hell are -you- to judge that "there's still a lot of money that 
Americans _do_ have to spend that isn't going where it belongs"? You have
every right to make your own financial decisions, and less than no right
to make them for others. It is none of your business.
  
>>And it is also your issue, not mine. If you want to talk about the lost
>>profits argument, I will be glad to. As for the rest, you go non-linear,
>>and seem to think that I said and implied tons of stuff that I absolutely
>>did not say or imply. You even went as far as to edit out the line where
>>I said that I am not defending piracy, just attacking the lost-profits
>>argument. And I did not mean in general, but as it is being used by the
>>software industry, specifically, and only.
>
>  Okay, fine.

Do we have a connection? I do not want to argue this. Arguments have
in the past solved nothing, and caused a lot of bad feelings. Can we
just drop this?
 
>>Is this really Jawaid? This is the first time I have seen you rant. And
>>it is really sad that you went so far beyond what I had said to do so.
>
>  Yes, it's really me.  I got off on a tangent, one that's becoming 
>very important to me.  I apologize if I insinuated anything about you
>in particular, but it's sad to see any IIgs enthusiast _not_ come
>up in arms against piracy.

Yeah, just like the crusades. It is just as wrong to do evil in the name of
fighting piracy as is to pirate itself. BTW, piracy did not kill the Apple //,
Apple did. 
 
>-- 
> Jawaid Bazyar              |   Ask me about the GNO Multitasking Environment
> Procyon, Inc.              |   for the Apple IIgs!   
> bazyar@cs.uiuc.edu         |   P.O Box 620334
> --Apple II Forever!--      |   Littleton, CO 80162-0334   (303) 933-4649


Rich

payner@netcom.com