HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dlo@druwa.ATT.COM (OlsonDL)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,talk.politics.misc,alt.individualism,alt.activism
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Date: 30 Jul 92 21:01:55 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.151841.12557@amhux2.amherst.edu>, twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce) writes:
} In article <1992Jul26.183822.6063@cs.mun.ca> brian@odie.cs.mun.ca (Brian Paquet) writes:
} >Luh I hate to bust peoples buble, but white het males don't go around
} >organizing meeting on how to keepo  others down
} 
} What school do you go to?

I graduated from the University of Colorado.

} Who were your parents?

My father died when he was a janitor in a high school.  My mother teaches
the mentally retarded.

} Are you a member of
} the Elks, Lions, Masons?

No.

} Whether or not conspiracy is endemic to being a straight white male,
} it's amazing to see how common it is for straight white men to
} organize networks to keep others down.

What is amazing is how common it is among people, who have failed in
their own right, to believe the myth that these failures came as a
result of straight white men organizing networks to keep others down.
--
David Olson            dlo@drutx.att.com
"The American Republic will endure, until politicians realize they
can bribe the people with their own money."  Alexis de Tocqueville
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: homophobes sabotaging motss (was Re: There was this sign in the window...)
Date: 28 Jul 1992 17:12:09 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Jul28.052738.23387@reed.edu> 
nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:

> Does anyone know how often Cl*yt*n picks up a posting from soc.motss,
> (in this case, the ambulance driver thing), disagree with a basic
> tenet in it, quote the *entire* article and add his two sentences of
> nonsense, and then crosspost it into talk.politics.misc?

He was quiet for so long I thought he'd given up doing this.  
I don't see what he gets out of this.  After all, it's not like 
it's just people here who can't stand him.

[...]
> Special clue for the impaired - we don't *care* what homophobes think
> about discussions here. Furthermore, if we cared what
> talk.politics.misc thought about our threads, we'd post them there.
> Stop crossposting things maliciously.

My "gayspace" post was a deliberate intrusion into "straightspace".
So far I've received all sorts of nasty mail, almost all of it from
rec.arts.tv.uk -- are viewers of British TV particularly homophobic? --
and talk.politics.misc.  I've also received letters from half a
dozen readers of rec.arts.tv.soaps patiently explaining that they'd
be happy to discuss homosexuality as it is depicted on soap operas, 
but that they have no interest in the subject otherwise and they 
politely ask that I stop posting there.  Do motssisti react similarly
to these cross-posts?  Does anyone write a talk.politics.misc cross-
poster to tell him/her to stop posting "breeder shit" here?  

Arne




Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: henry@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch)
Subject: Re: Naval Aviator Thorne
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems; a div of Booz, Allen & Hamilton
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 04:55:39 GMT

remcke01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu (Richard McKewen) wrote: 
->If this is true, it is something to note.  Usually a "convicted" homo-
->sexual in the military is given an "administrative" discharge.  

this is neither the first nor the last time that this will happen.  it
ain't that remarkable.

--
# henry mensch / booz, allen & hamilton, inc.  / <henry@ads.com>
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: chas@netcom.com (Chuck Fisher)
Subject: Whither Perot Supporters?
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 18:00:26 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Keywords: '92 Election, Ross Perot, George Bush, Bill Clinton

A recent New York Times poll showed that people identified as Ross
Perot supports now favor Clinton over Bush by 3:1 (61% v. 19%.)  This
is not too surprising in that if the Perot supporters liked Bush there
would have been no reason to support Perot in the first place.
Clinton is at least seen as alternative to the current administration.
Whether these people will vote is another question...

* * * *

The San Diego Union reported that Clinton is favored over Bush in San
Diego County--the last time San Diego went Democratic was in '64
(Johnson v. Goldwater.)  And speaking of Barry Goldwater, he recently
gave support to a gay-rights ordinance in Phoenix.  It's these types
of events that makes me think that this country is starting to change
some of its attitudes towards GBLs.

* * * *

I've noticed that in the recent polls covered on network TV that they
now list Clinton first and Bush second since Clinton is currently
leading.  Also there have been a number of comments about how the Bush
campaign is in trouble as compared to all the enthusiasm generated by
the Clinton/Gore campaign bus.  Interviews with Perot supporters is
uniformly negative towards Bush.  This all seems to be a subtle shift
towards Clinton that wasn't there a month ago.

November is still a long off!

Chuck
-- 
Chuck Fisher                                  Work: (800) 359-7997 
chas@netcom.com  IP address: 192.100.81.100   Home: (415) 964-2819
{apple,claris,amdahl,tandem}!netcom!chas 
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com (Jake Coughlin)
Subject: Re: Well, God Damn It!  SPILL THE BEANS!
Originator: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 20:30:15 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

his@the-temple.East.Sun.COM (Howard Solomon - SunExpress Support Engineer):
> I have several stories I could tell,
> but I think I won't just now  (some never....).

weeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllll, where's the dirt, howard?  a true homo
JUMPS at the chance to dish.

-- 
Jason Coughlin ( jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com )
Queer Without A Cause!
"I find myself suddenly in the world, and I recognize that I have one
right alone: that of demanding human behavior of the other." -- Fanon
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center
Date: Saturday, 25 Jul 1992 21:56:46 EDT
From: <SECBH@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject:    re: those problem hets

thaaang@odin.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:

>hets such as Mara and Scooter and Ann who at least really *try* to
>empathize with what we feel are a rare exception, sadly, and though I

This observation really made me grin.  Having spent some time in person
with Mara and a bit of corresponding as well one of many things that has
struck me where Mara is concerned is that I have never felt that she
is *trying* to empathize.   (This isn't a flame, the remark just
struck me as quite funny.)

Perhaps the fact that I haven't noticed is a monument to her consumate
artistry, or perhaps it is a monument to my failed powers of observation.

I shall be watching her more closely as she forks into moo moo gai pan
at the next Sung Hai gathering of homos and lesbos to see if the company
raises a bead of sweat on her brow, but then it might be the hot mustard
sauce and I shall have found her non-PC when she may actually be cuisine-
challanged.

Oh, dear.....doubts, doubts.

Jack Carroll
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: akbar@cs.mcgill.ca (Alain BOUCHARD)
Subject: Re: French Tongue Twisters
Organization: SOCS - Mcgill University, Montreal, Canada
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 04:11:35 GMT

In article <1992Jul20.150422.1@ulkyvx.louisville.edu> 
remcke01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu (Richard McKewen) writes:

>This one's not hard to say, but sounds funny when spoken:
>
>Un vert vers va vers une verte verre en hiver.

ALERTE LINGUISTIQUE: HOMONYMES EN VERS `A L'ENVERS.

Corrections sugge're'es:

Un ver vert va vers un verre vert en hiver. <-- Premier choix
Un vert ver va vers un vert verre en hiver. etc.

ver = the worm (masc.)
vers = rhymes (?spelling) (masc.)
vers = direction, toward (pre'p.)
vert = green color (adj. ou pre'p.) 

>
>(A green worm is going toward a green glass in winter.
>

Two of my favourite tongue twisters include three skipping turtles on 
narrow sidewalks and six hundred six unsucessful bloodsuckers on someone's
breast. (Ayoye!)

Alain 


-------------
.sig wannabe

Je suis sur la berge du ravin, pas sur la verge du rabin.
From: key@soda.berkeley.edu (peter li'ir key)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: thanks and an announcement
Date: 29 Jul 92 14:30:01 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

thanks to everyone who answered about changing names legally.

the quick summary is there are two ways to change your name.
1) through usuage
2) through the courts.

i'm going to go with usuage.

one of the first manifestations is the change in email address
kimpl@soda.berkeley.edu
key@soda.berkeley.edu

peter li'ir key, who was once peter lee kim
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: roy@panix.com (Roy Radow)
Subject: Re: Don't write NAMBLA today
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 14:35:59 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

In <LJJ9NB3w164w@penn.Gwinnett.COM> bfbear@penn.Gwinnett.COM (Penn Collins) writes:
>lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>> In article <62364@cup.portal.com> Minotaur@cup.portal.com (Frank - Swilling) 

>> Q. Whats the difference between NAMBLA members and Catholic priests?
>> A. NAMBLA members ask first.

>        but- Catholic Priest DO have Health Care AND benefits....

>        does NAMBLA offer the same?

AND what about all that nifty clothes the prests and nuns get to wear ...

NAMBLA is run by unpaid volunteers- if we want a pretty tog we have to
go out and buy it ourselves. 

Yours in Liberation,

Roy


-- 
Roy Radow		roy@panix.com         ...rutgers!cmcl2!panix!roy
North American Man/Boy Love Association -For a packet containing a sample
Bulletin, publications list and membership information send $1.00 postage
to: NAMBLA Info,  Dept.RR,  PO Box 174,  Midtown Station,  NYC NY  10018.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: A New Boom and Bust Theory
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 05:59:40 GMT

In article <l7doltINNacj@mizar.usc.edu> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
>In article <92210.204707IO81409@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> 
>IO81409@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
>> well, *I* am interested in the size of wimmin's breasts...
>
>I realized today that I wasn't clear as to the nature
>of my objection.  The article was about how the size
>of women's breasts govern everything men think and do.
>I was offended by the hitherto unknown Ms. Levy's 
>presumption that sexist material would be welcome here.

We seem to have read different articles, then.  The article *I* read
didn't contain any references to the genders of those thus mammarily
influenced.  Perhaps the sexist material originated with the hitherto
known Mr. Adolphson ... ?

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "You mean there are TWO of you, Pierce?
\  / twpierce@amherst.edu      /  God help us all."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Major Charles Emerson Winchester III
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: A New Boom and Bust Theory
Date: 29 Jul 1992 09:56:31 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <breastfeed@vadier.gr.osf.org> 
emcmanus@gr.osf.org (Eamonn McManus) writes:
> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
 [My irritation at the cross-posting to soc.motss of 
  a "humorous" article concerning straight men's psycho-
  sexual responses to women's breast sizes and the
  possible political ramifications of such responses, 
  an article which, although it did make fun of straight men,
  managed still to treat women as slabs of meat *deleted*]

> I thought it was the funniest article I had seen on news for a long
> time, and I was glad it was crossposted to soc.motss because I would
> not have seen it otherwise.  Sod relevance.

Oh, goody.  Do you have any funny jokes about hooters to share
with us?  Maybe some jiggling boobs anecdotes?  I'd *love* to hear
them, as I'm sure a lot of here would.  

Oh, and don't forget to cross-post like crazy.

--Arne


Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: shore@dinah.tc.cornell.edu (Melinda Shore)
Subject: Re: There was this sign in the window...
Keywords: @$#!% NewsWatcher bug...
Reply-To: shore@tc.cornell.edu
Organization: Cornell Theory Center
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 20:56:36 GMT

[]
The question here really isn't whether or not these guys
were harassed.  The correct response to unwanted sexual
advances is *not* to stick a sign in a window announcing
your sexual orientation to all and sundry - the sign-in-
the-window response is clearly an answer to some other
question.  Presumably that question is "are you gay?,"
and since that question wasn't asked by The World, 
announcing the answer to The World seems awfully defensive
(and unnecessarily so) to me. 
-- 
       Melinda Shore - Cornell Theory Center - shore@tc.cornell.edu
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: homophobes sabotaging motss
Date: 29 Jul 1992 11:16:51 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Jul29.060529.5704@menudo.uh.edu> elee74l@Rosie.UH.EDU writes:
[...]
> So what's so bad about soc.motss's articles being cross posted.

There's nothing wrong in theory with cross-posting a soc.motss
article to, say, soc.bi, but I wouldn't do it.  The problem is that
articles from outside are cross-posted here.  It leads to hundreds
of articles reminding everyone in the world that Martin Moll, or is
it Mule? Mall? Malle? Mill?, well, whatever his name is played
a gay character on Roseanne, and who once -- in 1976? 1980? 1987? -- 
had his own funny funny show called, um, Franwood Today, or is it....
Now if any of these cretins had a single goddamned thing to *say*
about gay and lesbian characters on TV, I wouldn't be so intolerant.
But all they do is misidentify the actors, get the program titles
and years wrong, and quote doggerel which they claim are "classic 
lines" from the shows in question.

Of course the readers of rec.arts.tv.uk or alt.individualism or 
talk.politics.misc or any number of other newsgroups can post
things here directly if what they want is to engage some of us 
in conversation or, *much* more likely, argument.  There's always 
someone who thinks he or she has *the* argument to win over a phobe.
Self-delusion runs as high here as anywhere else, sad to say.

--Arne


Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com (Jake Coughlin)
Subject: Re: Gayspace
Originator: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 17:07:09 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson):
> Is there some
> connection -- I feel there must be -- between my puzzlement over,
> and irritation at, these 4 straight women and their reaction to
> gay men being themselves in gayspace, and the ways in which gay
> characters appear in TV programs?  What would that connection be?

context.  more specifically the division of context.  even more
specificially gay context versus straight context and the tension that
occurs when the contexts collide.

the straight women were in a gay context and brought in their own
context.  when they ogled and said, "*oh*my*god*, can you believe
*that*," they created a mini-straight context in the gay restaurant,
and this was inappropriate and offensive.

the exact opposite situation is gay characters in TV shows where the
cast creates a mini-gay context in a straight context.  like,
oh-my-god, all of a sudden this gay person magically appears and then
magically disappears with absolutely no connection with the continuum
of the show.  yawn.  it's like "i'll give you this chair as a present,
but it's got to stay here in my house where it matches my table."
-- 
Jason Coughlin ( jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com )
Queer Without A Cause!
"I find myself suddenly in the world, and I recognize that I have one
right alone: that of demanding human behavior of the other." -- Fanon
From: zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd)
Newsgroups: soc.misc
Subject: Chess
Date: 27 Jul 92 14:45:32 GMT
Organization: Manchester Computing Centre
Originator: netnews@uts.mcc.ac.uk

Apparently Bobby Fischer has signed a 2.6 million contract to play Boris 
Spassky in Belgrade!



+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  I don't take part in any sport that requires me to change clothes  |
|  Dave Budd, MCC, Oxford Rd, Manchester, England   (44)061-275-6033  |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Tuesday, 28 Jul 1992 17:46:20 MST
From: <ASUGM@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: soc.misc
Subject:               jobs in singapore

I am trying to explore the jobs in Singapore. If any one
can help me with any information, I will really appreciate it.
Thanks

 Umesh
From: gcf@panix.com (Gordon Fitch)
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Subject: Re: What's a female "Uncle Tom"?
Date: 26 Jul 1992 21:42:45 GMT
Organization: mydog in exile
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
Originator: muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu

ak104@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Robert Clark) writes:
|   I just started reading the book _Backlash:the Undeclared War
| Against American Women_, by Susan Faludi. I found myself astounded
| and infuriated by the twisted logic of some of the conservative
| women in the book. In the chapter, "The Backlash Brain Trust: From
| Neocons to Neofems", Faludi points out that the "back to the family",
| "back to traditional values" views that conservative women try to
| insist on other American women are blindly disregarded by themselves.
|   I think we need a term for such women who are blind to the fact
| they are reinforcing a second class status for other women.

I think we have enough deprecatory terms.  While they
are useful in the heat of battle -- I have invented a
few myself -- they tend to obscure the opponent.  It
is well to remember that one's opponent may have a few
good qualities, especially if one wants to prevail.  
In the case of "family values" and "traditional values",
a simple rejection will forego the opportunity of using
these ideas in favor of the things one believes in,
which they have a great potential for.  Notice that
Jesse Jackson and Mario Cuomo have no problem in 
developing "family values" and "traditional values"
into justifications for modern-liberal policies.  They
could not do this by merely calling people bad names.
On the contrary, they pat them on the head, smile,
and say, "Here's what you _really_ want...."

Ye must be wise as serpents and harmless as doves.
-- 
Gordon Fitch | gcf@panix.com | uunet!cmcl2!panix!gcf 
*       1238 Blg. Grn. Sta., N.Y., N.Y. 10274      *



-- 
Post articles to soc.feminism, or send email to feminism@ncar.ucar.edu.
Questions and comments may be sent to feminism-request@ncar.ucar.edu.  This
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article should be posted within several days.  Rejections notified by email.
From: tittle@alexandre-dumas.ics.uci.edu (Cindy Tittle Moore)
Subject: Re: Why she took my name/ narrow minded views..
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Date: 30 Jul 92 22:27:46 GMT

In <159kr0INNb1t@agate.berkeley.edu> et@madmax.aa.nps.navy.mil writes:

>You seem to be quite biased in your example and seem
>to miss the point.  I am sure that nobody calls a
>congresswoman or a woman CEO  or a woman teacher "honey".
>As far as I can see  women who hold certain "powers"
>or something to say/allowed to say in what they do  are
>usually taken as seriously as any other man.

Hah.  This is not true.  There are many, many counterexamples.  I
offer one from my own life: I was the head of the computer lab in a
class that I TA'd (the instructor gave me control of the lab section
of the course and made it clear to the students that he had nothing to
do with the lab and what I said went).

There was this fellow who wanted change his allotted hours for a
particular day.  He started talking to one of the (male) tutors who
said "Don't ask me, she's the one who does that."  The fellow then
went up to the (another male) tutor standing next to me and repeated
his request.  This time, I said "I'm the one you need to talk to."  He
ignored me and repeated his request to the male tutor again!

There were several similar incidents, another was where I had refused
some request made by another male student and his immediate response
was to snarl, "Well, YOU must be on the rag today!"  Yet another
refused to listen to me and went the instructor, who promptly referred
him back to me.

Mind you, these people's lab grades were determined by me, this was
not "empty power" that I held.

--Cindy
--
	"I myself have never been able to find out precisely what
	feminism is: I only know that people call me a feminist
	whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from a
	doormat, or a prostitute."  -- Rebecca West, 1913
--
Post articles to soc.feminism, or send email to feminism@ncar.ucar.edu.
Questions and comments may be sent to feminism-request@ncar.ucar.edu.  This
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From: farthing@leland.Stanford.EDU (ljf)
Subject: Re: men's issues vs. women's issues
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: 27 Jul 92 14:55:45 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.223314.528@ucc.su.OZ.AU> maxtal@extro.ucc.su.oz.au (John MAX Skaller) writes:
>	Another issues that are *womens* issues? Like sexual
>harassment! Your kidding if you think *that* one is a womens issue!
>IMHO men are currently suffering MUCH worse from the politicisation
>and emphasis on it---witness that I and other men attest that
>they haven't the faintest idea how to approach a woman
>safely (without fear of being accused of harasement)
>
>[Actually, I just say it is affecting men worse to stir: It affects
>everyone.]

It stirred me, that's for sure!  To say that hetero men are more
affected by sexual harassment than women because now they're worried
about how they come across is analogous to saying whites are more
affected by racism because they can't figure out how to act without
appearing racist.

Let me give you some examples of sexual harassment and see if they
measure up to your fear of not getting a date:

(1) A nurse bends over to check a patient and he grabs her breasts and
bites her neck.  No, the patient is not under the influence of
medication that affects his brain.  He just thinks she's cute.  When
she complains, he becomes indignant and says that she should feel
flattered.

(2) A female undergrad student takes a computer science course, where
she's the only woman.  She goes to the TA's office for help with an
assignment.  The male TA pinches her on the nipple.  She can't believe
that happened, so assumes it's an "accident."  The next time she has a
question, she tries to avoid being alone with him in his office.  She
can't.  Once again, he pinches her on the nipple and tells her how
pretty she is.  She drops the class and ends up taking the rest of her
cs classes out of sequence.

(3) A female grad student has a male advisor who likes to touch her
legs, thighs, breasts, bottom.  She complains, but he just laughs.
She asks her friends to be present when she knows she'll be by herself
in the lab or office in case her advisor comes by.

(4) An Army captain has a CO who tries to kiss her every time her
assignment changes and she leaves the base.  She knows she can report
him, but worries that he'll make her life miserable if she does.
After all, all he does is kiss her, right?  That's not so terrible.

These four experiences are true.  IMO, your fear of being accused of
sexual harassment for asking a woman out on a date is trivial compared
to their experiences.


--
Post articles to soc.feminism, or send email to feminism@ncar.ucar.edu.
Questions and comments may be sent to feminism-request@ncar.ucar.edu.  This
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