HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 03:46:15 -0400 
From: Rick <stimpy+@cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Strength Rating of INL Teams (8/11/92)
Distribution: na

Yes, those of us in AA noticed we had the hardest schedule when
they were announced. Being as arrogant as we are, it didn't really
bother us. The way he figured out the strength of schedules seemed
pretty self evident to me...
Of course, thanks to Bert, we ended up scrimmaging and defeating
every team in the SINL except Golden Bears and Conforganized Disfusion.
(And those two teams lost to teams we beat.)

our motto: "We are better than you."   (and we backed it up)
half our starters won't be around this weekend, but don't worry,
"Our subs are better than you, too."

--Rick
"Bronco Netrek Server. You will never find a more wretched hive of
scum and villainy." -- Admiral Kenobi (aka Terence Chang)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: mrh0631@zeus.tamu.edu (Mark Hesidence)
Subject: Re: At Large Teams
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 16:42:00 GMT

In article <Bt0tK3.144@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig) writes...
>While at-large teams do need an advantage of some sort to compensate for the
>school teams being all in the same room, tiebreaker advantage may not be the
>fairest way to do it.  Head-to-head record should be the first tiebreaker.
> 
>I think a fair way to deal with at-largeness would be :
> 
>1) All games involving an at-large team should be played at a nuetral site (to
>minimize lag differences).  This is because there is no way for an at-large
>team to ever have a home game (a big disadvantage) - they shouldn't get the
>double penalty of giving their opponents the homefield advantage 1/2 the time.
>A rule like this would zero out the lag disadvantage of at-largeness.

   This seems completely reasonable to me, would anyone (probably from
   CMU) care to point out why this would not be fair.  And please don't
   post that with UDP this is not needed, you still get lag with UPD.  
   If you don't believe me send me mail and we'll dogfight on my local 
   server. 

> 
>2) In an at-large vs. school game, the at-large team should get first choice of
>race.  There's no good way to totally make up for not having your team in the
>same room, but this would help some.
> 

   This part isn't as critical as the your first point, besides  school teams
   (read CMU) will whine enough over the first point.
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: rjones@sulaco.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Ray Jones - Perp)
Subject: Re: YAR.C (yet another reserved.c)
Reply-To: rjones@dsd.es.com
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 18:01:31 GMT

In article <16go6nINNhcv@moe.ksu.ksu.edu>, bav@hobbes.ksu.ksu.edu (Brick Verser) writes:
>
>At the same time, authentication technology is supposedly ok to export.
>So I think the reserved.c stuff will be exportable.  But I would be
>more comfy finding alternate non-RSA ways of doing public key authentication.
>It'd be a shame to code a nice solution only to have lawyers pouncing on
>Ray (who can ignore them if he likes) *AND* on every university which dares
>to carry an anonymous FTP archive (which we can't ignore).

I don't think they need to worry that much... I doubt that the people with
the patent are going to be willing to traipse though every Public Access
archive, just to find copies of what may or may not be a netrek client.

But, if people think they will, I won't put it out on them.  Tehre are
other ways of distributing it.

>--Brick

-- 
                                          Ray Jones
                                          rjones@dsd.es.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: fortony@sonne.cso.uiuc.edu
Subject: Re: SINL playoffs
Originator: fortony@murphy
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 21:45:19 GMT

spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves) writes:

>>>>>> On 14 Aug 92 06:24:14 GMT, tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) said:

>Tom>  12 AM, Team Rankscum, and Team Crackpot all ended  the season at
>Tom> 3-1.   12 AM wins  the tie-breaker because   they are an at-large
>Tom> team, so they are the third seed.

>this is utter bullshit.  Crackpot played 12AM and creamed them.

Not this again.

the 12AM/CP match was hardly a game of netrek, and we weren't getting
'creamed' even though we were getting 'brutally lagged'.

In any case, according to the INL rules, we're 3-1, CP is 3-1, and
all tie breaks go to the at large team.  Guess CP shouldn'ta lost
that match!
>-- 
>			consume
>Scott Draves		be silent
>spot@cs.cmu.edu		die
-- 
a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
Felix Sebastian Ortony	fortony@murphy.gis.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SINL playoffs
From: "Robert W. Hill" <rh3b+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 03:34:10 -0400 
Organization: Sophomore, Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 14-Aug-92 Re: SINL playoffs
fortony@sonne.cso.uiuc.e (827)


> the 12AM/CP match was hardly a game of netrek, and we weren't getting
> 'creamed' even though we were getting 'brutally lagged'.

> In any case, according to the INL rules, we're 3-1, CP is 3-1, and
> all tie breaks go to the at large team.  Guess CP shouldn'ta lost
> that match!

> a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
> Felix Sebastian Ortony	fortony@murphy.gis.uiuc.edu


I think the at-large tie break advantage should be removed.  The point
of having "playoffs" is to see who the best team is.  The best teams
SHOULD go to the playoffs.  Crackpot is clearly better than the angry
men, they SHOULD have gotten a playoff berth.  As the rules presently
stand, 12 AM,  did get their playoff berth (as short lived as it was
:-)).  

Long live at large teams!  

Rob
aka Spaceace!
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig)
Subject: Re: 3rd space planet taking
Organization: Indiana University Astrophysics, Bloomington, IN
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 13:44:19 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.112907.12440@cis.ohio-state.edu> amueller@trout.cis.ohio-state.edu (andrew j mueller) writes:
>
>>people to stop.  Finally, someone who bombs a neutral looses the chance to
>>refuel/repair at the neutral planets for the rest of the game - a pretty harsh
>>penalty.
>> 
>>	Entropy
>>
>
>	NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO  NO
etc...

How many time do I have to apologize for the same error!  I was wrong!  PLease
read the whole thread before flaming!!!

	Entropy

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: mmoore%peruvian.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Michael Moore)
Subject: Re: Tiebreakers in the INL
Date: 15 Aug 92 21:51:02 MDT
Reply-To: mmoore%peruvian.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu
Organization: University of Utah, CS Dept., Salt Lake City

In article <MeXPWve00Vom848CtC@andrew.cmu.edu>, "Joseph E. Beck" <jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> 
|> Sunscreamer: 
|> >What makes Team CP better than
|> >us playoff-wise, except for the fact that they're from CMU?
|> 
|> 1:  CP was winning when the ghostbusts began.
|> 2:  12 AM were genocided by AA, and CP lost to AA by 12-8 2 (i
|>      think)
|> 
|> any other questions?
|> 
|> 	joe
|> 	Purple haze


	Before the ghostbusts there was lag.  The planet advantage was 
slight.  

	The team AA played was not the same as the original 12AM.

	-Michael

-- 
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+Michael D. Moore     Office : (801) 582-5847x4721  Home : (801)359-6552  +
+Software Q&A Programmer   Evans & Sutherland     mmoore@dsd.es.com       +
+Student                   University of Utah     mmoore@peruvian.utah.edu+
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From: amrk@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Andrew Markiel)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: NEW NETREK LEAGUE
Summary: maybe we should split the INL into parts
Keywords: INL tournaments discussion
Date: 21 Aug 92 04:40:59 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

I was thinking that a good idea might be to set up several different divisions
in the INL. Since it's fairly well recognized that INL teams vary quite a bit
in ability, we could try to gather teams of similar skill together.

My idea is that there would be two or three divisions. The first would contain
the best teams, the second the middle level teams, and the weakest teams in
the last division (i.e., very similar to the way NCAA football is done). Teams
could enter whatever division they felt they could compete in, although they
would be encouraged to put themselves at an appropriate level (no AA's in
division III :-)

Now, while all teams should play each other as much as possible, the schedule
can be chosen so that a team plays *all* of the teams within it's division
(which shouldn't be a problem, if the division is only 1/3 of the INL), so
that teams would spend a lot of time playing other teams of similar skill,
although they would sometimes play both better and worse teams, as it has been
said that playing better teams makes one's own team better.

I see a couple of advantages:

1) It becomes easier to balance the schedules. Now, you can insert the
requirement that every team must play the same number of games *against each
division* as every other team in their division. Since the skill levels will
vary less over one division than over the whole INL, the schedules should be
more uniform among teams in the same division.

2) Multiple playoffs. The multiple divisions thing can work with or without
playoffs. In any case, the best teams will be fighting for the victory in
division I, but teams which are not quite as good (or whose players aren't
quite as experienced), but who still played better than expected, will be
recognized with the championship of a lower division. As teams improve, they
can move up into higher divisions.


As for teams who would like to play, but not necessarily in the INL tournament
setting, it seems perfectly reasonable to me to have teams, outside the INL,
who scrimmage against anyone interested. There are enough people who enjoy
playing good games of netrek that teams should be able to have fun and good
games even if they aren't official members of the INL.

Comments?

-Grey Elf
From: mikey@sgi.com (Mike Yang)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Netrek across SLIP?
Date: 18 Aug 92 08:45:25 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

In article <22222@venera.isi.edu> dstrout@isi.edu (David Strout) writes:
>Anyone tried running netrek across SLIP?  I could set up back-to-back
>Telebit T2500s if it would be playable

My T2500 slip connection has round-trip ping times over about 330ms.
Not really great for netrek, even with UDP.

I'm hoping for a good improvement when I get my v.32bis modem...

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
                 Mike Yang        Silicon Graphics, Inc.
               mikey@sgi.com           415/390-1786
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Playing with lag
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:11:18 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

ERic Mehlhaff writes
> I'd been contemplating something along these lines for some time. My  
idea
> was more like a 'time-warp', where the 'lagged' player disappears from  
the
> map as soon as the server realizes he is gone.  When the net's back, the 
> player mysteriously reappears where they disappeared, exactly as they  
were
> before.  
> 	The primary abuse I can see from this is that their opposition  
might
> realize this and be waiting for them to reappear at that point.  Obvious
> solutions to that are to displace randomly (if enemies are near? ).
> 
> What'cha all think?
> 
> ERic mehlhaff					Hoser at large

I don't like it.  If I were going to die with 20 armies, I could simply  
close my client.  I think the playing with lag concept is entirely  
overrated.  I can play pretty much anywhere in the US now with UDP.  Lag  
sometimes become unplayable during the day, but other than that, who  
cares?  I think the real problem is ghostbusts.  What can be done to  
PREVENT people from being ghostbusted, not what to do after they are  
ghostbusted.

Rob
From: spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SINL finals
Date: 15 Aug 92 18:26:24 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Originator: spot@HOPELESS.MESS.CS.CMU.EDU


Tom> I will do whatever I can to make sure that no more than one CMU
Tom> team (or from any other school, for that matter) makes the
Tom> playoffs in the fall.

the INL is unlucky to have such a fuck head as its founder and leader.
you have ruined what could have been a good thing.

-- 
			consume
Scott Draves		be silent
spot@cs.cmu.edu		die
From: stimpy+@cmu.edu (Rick)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SINL finals
Date: 15 Aug 92 10:49:50 GMT
Organization: Freshman, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from rec.games.netrek tom@soda.berkeley.edu:
# Well, you don't have the right to call the SINL championship a tie, but
# I suppose CMU players are always looking for new and improved ways to
# be weenies.

Well, we could have just started a server, and had both teams orbit
Orion for two and a half hours. Then the game would OFFICIALLY be
a tie. Why not end with some sportsmanship? We already defeated
Rank Scum, and now both teams are missing their best players. We
just see no need to play a final game between subs.

We are better than you.

--Rick
"Bronco Netrek Server. You will never find a more wretched hive of
scum and villainy." -- Admiral Kenobi (aka Terence Chang)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig)
Subject: YANNBRS (server "login" banner)
Organization: Indiana University Astrophysics, Bloomington, IN
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 16:44:41 GMT

Here's YANNBRS (Yet Another Nifty Next Big Release Suggestion).

On most computers, there's a login banner when you first connect : something
like the

> IBM AIX Version 3 for RISC System/6000
> RISCGS1 at the MACRO experiment in L'Aquila, Italia.

here (you all know the type of thing I'm talking about).
I believe that there's even a standard unixy funtion to return the login
banners at remote sites (although I can't think of it's name offhand).

What if servers used this kind of scheme to return what was happening to an
asking program (like the wait queue window, the metaserver, or even the
client's shell where it says "Got Connection").  Useful stuff to say :

"Server closed till 6:00pm"
"Borg Hour"
"Hockey is being played here"
"3 race war tonight"
etc.

This way, all would be aware where to find whatever netrek fix they needed just
by looking at the metaserver report, and not by browing possibly out of date
archive files, converting time zones, etc.

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: schuetz@iacrs2.unibe.ch (Martin Schuetz)
Subject: ignore it
Reply-To: schuetz@iacrs2.unibe.ch
Organization: University of Berne, Switzerland
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 12:15:52 GMT

just a test

-- 
Martin Schuetz                              Phone: +41 31 65 42 40
Institute for Physical Chemistry            FAX:   +41 31 65 44 99
University of Berne
Switzerland                                 schuetz@iacrs2.unibe.ch
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen)
Subject: Re: Removing old characters
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 17:40:28 GMT

[bezier god writes:]
>>>Recently, I've been considering removing all the old characters from
>>>the bezier (formerly sequent) database.  Does anyone have any
>>>objections to this?  Also, does anyone have a tool which removes old
>>>characters *and* updates the .global file accordingly (trimscores just
>>>uses the old values)?  I expect that everybody's defense will go up if
>>>I remove characters from the pre-ogging days.

hey, wait a second.  i haven't played all summer because i haven't
had access to a workstation.  but i have every intention of playing
when i get back to school in a few weeks.  i've had my character on
sequent/bezier for years.  my character is a captain (or is it flight capt?
memory fails me) and probably won't advance any more because i learned
to play netrek with him and never reset my stats.  but i play for the
fun of it, not to get high rank.  he's an old friend.  i thought i had
lost him before when sequent went to that great machine room in the sky.
much to my joy, i found him on bezier... i beg you, spare him.
at least wait until everybody gets back in the fall before you start
wasting characters.  that way, i'll have a chance to save him from
the horrible trimscores monster.

in all seriousness, i think it would be good to wait for people to get
back to school before you start axing characters.  some of us aren't
playing because we don't have access over the summer, not because we
don't care.

-teddy
gryphon
res judicata
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Honorary CMUer
From: tvangod@ecst.csuchico.edu (Skud the Great)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 10:19:19 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico

In article <16u0fsINNik0@agate.berkeley.edu> dawson@garnet.berkeley.edu () writes:
>In article <16svidINNetm@agate.berkeley.edu> labc-4aa@web-2h.berkeley.edu (CS 60C Lab Assistant) writes:
>>
>>Honorary CMuer?????????????
>>
>>
>>DON'T THINK SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>Hmmm....The Duck using Mojo's new slogan...could it be that there
>will be a united, anti-CMU, Berkeley Superteam forming for the
>fall? *gasp* (inquiring minds wanna know)
>
>>Duck
>Cow
>

Who says all great players must be from CMU or Berkeley??

Growl.............

A perturbed Skud the Great.
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SOLUTION TO FILLING UP ALL SERVERS
Date: 16 Aug 92 22:16:22 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <l8tjsdINNaid@alcor.usc.edu) rone@alcor.usc.edu (Ron Echeverri) writes:
)In article <Bt2zMv.8t7.1@cs.cmu.edu) jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick) writes:

)Makes sense.  Perhaps the Q should be limited to 6 people, to add on in case
)of a major ghostbust or whatnot.

Ok, so I'll make a script that dials up the server every minute.  Really 
useful, eh?

)
)5150
)tired of seeing so many empty servers

Hector
it's not the solution... hacking the queue to allow messaging is (assuming
you can get the idiots to agree - if you don't you probably don't want to
play with them).
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: rjones@sulaco.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Ray Jones - Perp)
Subject: Re: Wait Que Solution????????
Reply-To: rjones@dsd.es.com
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 14:34:17 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.130112.8544@news.uiowa.edu>, tabraun@icaen.uiowa.edu (Terry A Braun) writes:
>
>
>This may be a totally irrelevant and stupid question, but how
>difficult would it be to implement something such that the
>people in the wait que could send messages to each other?
>I know next to nothing about how the wait que is set up or
>works so be nice if this question is not even worth asking.

This is possibly in the suggested enhancements of the Official NBR.
Leonard?  

It is going to go into the re-write I am working on, in some form.
Probably allowing the equivalent of ALL and personal mesages, along with a
basic player list.  The gory details will be worked out RSN.

-- 
                                          Ray Jones
                                          rjones@dsd.es.com
From: hadley@thoth.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley)
Subject: Left direction harder?
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Organization: UC Irvine Department of ICS
Keywords: mouse, keyboard, positions
Date: 21 Aug 92 09:22:54 GMT
Distribution: rec

   I find it much harder to dogfight, ogg, or base left then any other
   direction.  Anybody else have certain directions they dislike or prefer
   over others?

   My favorite direction to fight is up, followed by down and right.  Left
   just feels awkward for some reason, no matter how many times I play it.

++
   Tedd Hadley (hadley@uci.edu)

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jasonp@cunix4.Prime.COM (Jason R. Pascucci)
Subject: Re: MetaServerII v0.1
Organization: Prime Computer, Inc.
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 00:20:53 GMT

Clever suggestions:

How about a more 'formatted' port? Something which gives,
basically, all the data of 1 and 4, with some nice
easily parsable format. (I note that, currently, #3 has a header,
and things like 'player list not available' are extraneous for
a programmatic interface.) Also, although this is a little
less useful, how about a port which gives all the infomation
in 5 in a more parsable format.

I was thinking something along the idea of:

S: <servername>
I: <inet addr?>
P: <port>
C: <short comment>
D: <date checked>
#: <number of players active?>
W: <number of players waiting?>
P: <player info>
P: <player info>
P: <player info>
S: <servername>....
....

With additional information on another port, perhaps
B: <borgs? YES/NO/MAYBE>
H: <Hours, in a nice format>
T: <contact name>
1: <comments>
9: <more comments>

Now that I think on it, perhaps with this amount of terseness,
only one 'machine-port' which gives all the information is
okay.

Just a few ideas...of course I'm thinking for future functionality with
regards xnetrekm.

Steele

-- 
Jason R. Pascucci
jasonp@primerd.prime.com

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: esj@cs.brown.edu (Eugene Santos Jr.)
Subject: Re: Mucus... how good is he?  (was Re: I will assault MUCUS(and he will not respond))
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:27:17 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.203717.5544@dsd.es.com> mmoore@itchy.dsd.es.com (Michael Moore) writes:
>In article <86018@netnews.upenn.edu> botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle) writes:
>>
>>A score is 20.  Scores implies )= 40.  However, I'll let you off the hook
>>if you can name 10.  No, make that 5.  I'm serious.  Of course, this is
>>very subjective, but that's the way it is.
>>
>
>	spaceace, amazing, ginger lynn, duck dodgers, freekill, hector,
>red shirt, mergatroid, videodrome, zznewguy, gadfly, mojo, wreck,
>mr. wizard, quodavis, sandia, spaceman spiff, eek, yea boy!!!,
             ^^^^^^^^
>washout, ayeser, d'spayre, drewskii, luri, mind crime, rjones, 
>darkhorse, fillintheblank, old nick, icarus, bav, spaceghost, beck,
>balton, helix, sunscreamer, and myself.
>
>
>	-Michael (Ged)
>--


Who's "quodavis"?  His anagram's first claim to fame. Sigh...


ensign Huh?_


uucp:	...!{ihnp4,decvax}!brunix!esj		Eugene Santos Jr.
bitnet:	esj@browncs.bitnet			PO Box 1910, Computer Science
arpa:	esj%cs.brown.edu@relay.cs.net		Brown University
csnet:	esj@cs.brown.edu			Providence, RI 02912
From: dawson@garnet.berkeley.edu (dawson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Left Direction Harder?
Date: 21 Aug 1992 16:28:46 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu
Originator: dawson@garnet.berkeley.edu


In article <2A94B5EE.4202@ics.uci.edu> hadley@thoth.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley) writes:
>
>   I find it much harder to dogfight, ogg, or base left then any other
>   direction.  Anybody else have certain directions they dislike or prefer
>   over others?
>
>   My favorite direction to fight is up, followed by down and right.  Left
>   just feels awkward for some reason, no matter how many times I play it.

Maybe it's the Republican nature in you that is affecting you
subconsciously.

Me.


Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA