HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Damian McGuckin <damianm@eram.esi.com.au>
Subject: Re: About the ACK ANSI compiler... [not the
Originator: mmdf@louie.udel.edu
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 18:07:11 GMT

In defence of ast, I also have NO complaints about the cost,
although I hope there is some documentation with it, just for my own peace
of mind.  As long as the thing compiles and behaves according to the manual
entry, it sounds OK to me. The major worry is that I do not have the source
code but there are probably legal reasons. Also, if you add the problems of
upgrading to 1.6.24 from patches pulled down the Internet and getting the
compilers from elsewhere, then this whole exercise is getting extremely awkward.
Mind you, we are trying to do a retarget of Minix to another piece of hardware,
so masochistic me, I am only adding to my problems - why did I choose now to
do this retarget?

I have to admit it is somewhat painful getting these compilers from either the
US or Europe - they are 12000 miles away so the cost goes up.  I never
understood why Prentice Hall could not handle these too but I cannot understand
many things in life, so why should this be any different.  Maybe what we need
is to be able to pay for such things with some plastic money and then get a
password so we can pull these things across the Internet automagically.  My life
needs to be simpler!

Hey on a side issue, what things are likely to change getting to 2.0, now that
this event is closer?  Is it purely the POSIX compliant stuff or are new things
going to happen? A question for ast? Are the chapter headings for the new Minix
book available so we can see what it is intended to cover?

- Damian
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Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: torvalds@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Linus Torvalds)
Subject: Re: ACK ANSI Compiler
Keywords: ACK, ANSI, compiler
Organization: University of Helsinki
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 11:55:27 GMT

In article <1i5nm6INN40n@werple.apana.org.au> hock@werple.apana.org.au (Warwick Hockley) writes:
>
>I think the main point is that most people feel that the 3 compilers should
>be unbundled, and the price for each reduced appropriately.

The problem with this is probably ACK itself: ACK is a general compiler
generation package, so in fact giving three compilers away for the price
of one is not such a problem, while selling just one compiler for a
third of the price is probably not something ast & co want to do. 
Remember, it's not really three different compilers, as most of the code
is probably the same in all of them.  So the $200 can probably be
thought of as the price of one compiler, with the others thrown in for
free (or something close to that).  ast?

I also wonder what people really need the new compiler for? On a 68k
minix box or a 386, you are probably better off using gcc anyway if you
have the memory for it, and if you don't it's probably cheaper (and
easier) to buy memory than the compiler.  Alternatively you can use the
smaller CvW compiler that seemed to work quite well the one time I
tested it (but no, I don't think it's ANSI - but unprotoize should
probably work with it).  For PC's, there is also Bruce Evans' compiler
for both 16- and 32-bit code (unprotoize...). 

The only people I see using the new ANSI compiler extensively would be
people with old PC/XT's, and if they can put up with that kind of
hardware, thay should certainly be able to put up with an older release
of the compiler as well (*).  It's not as if you could port many
standard unix programs to a 64+64kB machine anyway, so the lack of ANSI
shouldn't be that bad an experience: you'd just have to write your
programs using K&R. 

		Linus

(*) It's a joke guys.  Well, mostly.  Tongue in cheek, you know. 
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From:     Postmaster@vsdec.nusc.navy.mil
Subject:  Undeliverable Mail
Originator: mmdf@louie.udel.edu
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 08:14:17 GMT

Bad address -- <thanos>
Error -- %MAIL-E-OPENOUT, error opening SQQ89_USER1:[THANOS.MAIL]MAIL.MAI; as output; -SYSTEM-F-IVDEVNAM, invalid device name

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  Date: 29 Dec 92 03:09:00 EST
  From: INFO-MINIX@UDEL.EDU
  Subject: minix registration
  To: "thanos" <thanos@vsdec.nusc.navy.mil>
  
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  Comments:     Warning -- original Sender: tag was info-minix-request@UDEL.EDU
  From:         Samuel Bayne <seob@ESKIMO.COM>
  Subject:      minix registration
  Comments: To: info-minix@udel.edu
  To:           Multiple recipients of list MINIX-L <MINIX-L@VM1.NoDak.EDU>
  
    I have been testing a friend's minix demo, and decided I'd like
  to have a copy of the full version.  I need the address for whoever
  sells it.  The amiga version, if it matters.
          thank you in advance,  Seob@eskimo.com
  

End of returned message
-- 
Mail System (MMDF)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: bde@runx.oz.au (Bruce Evans)
Subject: Re: About the ACK ANSI compiler... [not the
Organization: RUNX Un*x Timeshare.  Sydney, Australia.
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 92 00:05:17 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.052435.28478@udel.edu> Damian McGuckin <damianm@eram.esi.com.au> writes:
>
>We just got GCC 2.3.2 and LIBG++ 2.3 off the Internet.  It works beautifully
>on our SUN and when we sort out the include directories in between all the
>Christmas drinks, we have been told it should work quite well on BSDI.
>
>I noticed that minix on a 386 is one of the supported systems.  Are we a chance
>to getting 1.6.?? up and running with GCC? I think I have that quaint technique

The 386 (in 32-bit mode) is not officially supported.  However, I have been
using gcc-1.39 through gcc-2.3.2 under Minix 1.6.1 through 1.6.16 over the
last 2 years.  It works better than on Suns because the headers are already
mostly ANSI conformant.  There is an old port of gcc-1.39 or 1.40 in the
Minix archives (a complete package with binaries.  The old binaries should
still work under 1.6.any).

>called ARLD on my 1.5 system - yuk! I think I read that the new release uses

asld.

>the more conventional way of handling libraries and loading objects, - ar & ld.
>Does the new minix come with the source of both its AS (assembler), AR
>(archiver) and LD (loader) or will I have to get the GNU equivalents

The ANSI compiler (available at extra cost) uses a separate as and ld.  These
are completely incompatible with gnu as and ld (being for 16-bit code).
-- 
Bruce Evans  (bde@runx.oz.au)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: Chris Person <chrisp@cephb.cephb.fr>
Subject: Re:  minicom
Originator: mmdf@louie.udel.edu
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 22:48:20 GMT

 
I will be also interested in features in MINICOM and would like to know
where to ftp it.

Happy new Year

Regards

Christophe


  0---------------------------------------------------------------------0
 /|\   Christophe PERSON - Human Polymorphism Study Center (C.E.P.H)   /|\
0-0-0  CEPH databases manager - System and Network Administrator      0-0-0
 \|/   27 Rue Juliette Dodu - 75010 PARIS - France                     \|/
  0---------------------------------------------------------------------0 
o-|    tel: 33-1-42-06-07-17                 Email: chrisp@cephb.fr     |-o
  0---------------------------------------------------------------------0

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Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: "Henrik Schultz, Production Systems Group" <HENRIKS@odin.uniras.dk>
Subject: Re: system call addition
Originator: mmdf@louie.udel.edu
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 13:09:49 GMT

>This may be a really naive question, but it seems (at least outwardly) that
>a simple way of adding a new system call would be simply to assign the name
>of the call (in caps) in <minix/callnr.h> (preferably against an unused slot,
>so as not to have to alter the maxm. # of system calls allowed) and assigning a
>corresponding function in the table.c (of fs, mm. etc., depending on what the
>function of the call is and where I would like to add it) (against of course
>the same number).

In my eyes it seems the way to do it. I've just implemented an older
set of routines that allow for a HALT, SHUTDOWN and REBOOT command for
MINIX 1.5.10.
These commands makes use of a REBOOT system call, implemented in mm in
exactly the way that you've described. I just had to recompile mm and build
a new image, and it worked first shot. This call took over an (unused) slot
in the command table though (#51 which is for accounting which probably nobody
ever uses :-)

Henrik

(henriks@odin.uniras.dk)
-- 
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Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: ast@cs.vu.nl (Andy Tanenbaum)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: Re: ACK ANSI Compiler
Keywords: ACK, ANSI, compiler
Date: 3 Jan 93 14:22:55 GMT
Organization: Fac. Wiskunde & Informatica, VU, Amsterdam

In article <1i5nm6INN40n@werple.apana.org.au> hock@werple.apana.org.au (Warwick Hockley) writes:
>I think the main point is that most people feel that the 3 compilers should
>be unbundled, and the price for each reduced appropriately.

That doesn't work out economically.  If we were to remove the Modula and Pascal
front ends, the amount of stuff on the distribution disk would only decrease
slightly, and the number of disks required wouldn't change at all.   The amount
of overhead in processing the order wouldn't change, nor would the shipping 
cost.  In effect, we threw in the Pascal and Modula front ends for free.

And for the n-th time, although using an ANSI compiler is definitely the way of
the future, I have gone to great effort to continue to support the old compiler
so you do not have to get the new one.

Andy Tanenbaum (ast@cs.vu.nl)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: cs902125@ariel.yorku.ca (SHUK C YIP)
Subject: Amiga version MINIX
Organization: York University, Toronto, Canada
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 05:24:46 GMT

I'm really disappointed by MINIX. (even v1.5)

1. no 020/030/040 supports
2. no MMU supports (certainly)
3. no hard drive supports
4. no AGA machine supports
5. no OS 2.x/3.x supports

Come on! Why people don't do the right thing on upgrade? There is no way
to find the selling point of MINIX for Amiga.
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: kjb@cs.vu.nl (Kees J. Bot)
Subject: Re: strange behavior(?)
Organization: Fac. Wiskunde & Informatica, VU, Amsterdam
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:03:30 GMT

Rory <cfctech%opusnet%opus@ph.gmr.com> writes:

>Hello all! 

>Can someone fill me on on why ls has this behavior?  I'm using Minix 1.5.10.
>	If more than 5 partitions are mounted, "ls -l" will "stumble"
>	every time it comes to a file with a different owner or group.

With five mounted partitions your block cache becomes crowded with bit
map blocks.  Each time ls has to print another user name it calls
getpwnam(3), which reads /etc/passwd, that is no longer in the cache...

>I'm getting a little frusterated with the long delays in ls when trying to 
>upgrade to 1.6.23.  (I know, just don't mount the extra partitions... but that
>kind of defeats the ability to access what I want when I want -- which is 
>often.) 

Build user/group name caching into ls.  With a little bit of luck it
will grow to a size that the old compiler will choke on more reliably.

(I do hope I got that/which correct a few lines back, I still don't know
the difference.  (Dutch only has one word for it (ignoring gender)).
Anyone got a good rule?  One they use to teach the kiddies?)
--
	                        Kees J. Bot  (kjb@cs.vu.nl)
	              Systems Programmer, Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: Rory <cfctech%opusnet%opus@ph.gmr.com>
Subject: strange behavior(?)
Originator: mmdf@louie.udel.edu
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:50:47 GMT

Hello all! 

Can someone fill me on on why ls has this behavior?  I'm using Minix 1.5.10.
	If more than 5 partitions are mounted, "ls -l" will "stumble"
	every time it comes to a file with a different owner or group.

	From this statement, you can draw the conclusion that when 5 or fewer
	partitions are mounted, this behavior does NOT exist!

I'm getting a little frusterated with the long delays in ls when trying to 
upgrade to 1.6.23.  (I know, just don't mount the extra partitions... but that
kind of defeats the ability to access what I want when I want -- which is 
often.) 

Thanks for any help that you can offer!

-Rory Savageau	<opus@opusnet.mi.org>

-- 
Mail System (MMDF)
From: ishwar@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Ishwar Rattan)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: elvis under Minix 1.5 and alarm clock message
Keywords: Minix 1.5, elvis, alrarm clock bug
Date: 21 Dec 92 21:52:21 GMT
Followup-To: ishwar@cs.wmich.edu
Organization: Western Michigan Univ. Comp. Sci. Dept.

hello minixers

i am being bitten by the alarm clock message in elvis
which results in terminating the program and hangs the machine.
if i recall right there was a fix posted for this bug which
went something like (in command in elvis?)
	set keyboard 0 (???)
please e-mail me the info /if/ you have it around.
thanks in advance,

- ishwar
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: samw@bucket.rain.com (Sam Warden)
Subject: Re: About the ACK ANSI compiler... [not the
Organization: Rick's Home-Grown Un*x
Date: 31 Dec 92 04:56:53 GMT

yee@mipg.upenn.edu (Conway Yee) writes:

>About using GCC, I am under the impression that you need the MINIX 386 
>extensions in order to use it.  The limitations of out-of-the-box MINIX 
>is far too restrictive.  I note that the out-of-the-box LINUX will run
>GCC and other freely-redistributable tools quite happily.
 
What I find curious is that those of us who are still stuck with
XTs and ATs to run Minix on are precisely the people who cannot
afford $200 for _anything_.  :-/  It seems ironic (at least) that
there's a plethora of "free" tools at the high end and not at the
low.
 
A related complaint is that much of the "Minix" application code
that I need in order to move away from MSDOS seems to be 386-only
(I'm thinking especially of the ZIP utility) but is not identified
as such in the archives.  It's very disappointing to track down
something, ftp it, download it, and _then_ find out it's stuffing
longs into pointers and running the ACK compiler out of memory.
Oh, well...

-- 
 
samw@bucket.rain.com (Sam Warden) -- and not a mere Device.
From: seob@eskimo.com (Samuel Bayne)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: minix registration
Summary: looking for address for minix registration
Date: 29 Dec 92 01:43:16 GMT
Organization: -> ESKIMO NORTH (206) For-Ever <-


  I have been testing a friend's minix demo, and decided I'd like
to have a copy of the full version.  I need the address for whoever
sells it.  The amiga version, if it matters.  
        thank you in advance,  Seob@eskimo.com
From: daryl@monty.apana.org.au (Daryl Tester)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Distribution: world
Subject: Re: minicom
Organization: APANA South Australia - State mail hub
Date: Sat,  2 Jan 93 18:44:00 +1030

newton@monty.apana.org.au (Mark Newton) writes:

> Now, why couldn't the original getty have been written like this, instead
> of depending on something as unreliable as line breaks for switching
> baud rates?

The reason is "tradition"; Version 7 (and probably before, but who can
remember back that far? :-) gettys and their ilk have always used
line breaks to cycle between various speeds (I believe it used to
be supplied as a parameter to /etc/getty when it was invoked from
the relevant entry in /etc/ttys, but don't quote me on this :-).

 - Daryl
   daryl@monty.apana.org.au
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: hall@crash.cts.com (Robert R. Hall)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: Version 1.6.24b upgrade problems
Date: 28 Dec 92 22:21:33 GMT
Organization: CTS Network Services (crash, ctsnet), El Cajon, CA

> Please report bugs on the net.  After the dust settles, I will fix any remaining
> bugs and then make this the official version for a while.
> 
> Happy Holidays.
> 
> Andy Tanenbaum (ast@cs.vu.nl)

Ok here is what I have encountered so far. I match all the CRC's
given in the file MANIFEST, thus I believe I have a good copy
of the minix/1.6.24b directory but I find the files:
ansi.sh and stdio.sh  to be short at lot of cdiff files as
after unpacking them my CRC's for the directories:
  src/lib/ansi and src/lib/stdio 
still have my ver 1.5 CRC's.

Also I can't find the share file for the directories:
 src/lib/em  src/lib/float  src/lib/math

Beware the files syscall.ansi.sh and syscall.kr.sh did
not get compressed so don't try to uncompress them.
The file name syscall.ansi.sh exceeds the 14 character
limit and gets truncated to syscall.ansi.s

Robert R. Hall (hall@crash.cts.com)
From: news@hrd769.brooks.af.mil (InterNet News)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: Re: Is MINIX much better than LINUX?
Date: 21 Dec 1992 10:11:55 -0600
Organization: Armstrong Lab MIS, Brooks AFB TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: hrd769.brooks.af.mil

In article <1992Dec20.235535.4281@klaava.Helsinki.FI> torvalds@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Linus Torvalds) writes:
In article <1992Dec19.162027.1604@frmug.fr.mugnet.org> archer@frmug.fr.mugnet.org (Vincent Archer) writes:
In article <...>  Lots of other people wrote...

OK,  OK, break it up.  This is getting personal again (just like last time).

Linus wrote a good 386/486 operating system based on SysV.  
  If you have a [3-9]86 and want SysV compatibility (more or less), Linux
is an excellent choice.

The Jolitz's wrote a good 386/486 operating system.
  If you have a [3-9]86 and want BSD compatibilty (more or less), 386bsd
is an excellent choice.

Andrew Tanenbaum wrote a good general purpose operating system.
  If you have one of the many machines that Minix runs on (Atari, Mac, <386)
minix is an excellent choice.

  None is better than any of the other.  THEY ALL SERVE A PRIMARY MARKET.  
The question shouldn't which is better (which is deliberately inflammatory,
as it was probably intended to be), but which is the right FOR YOU.  I thought
that was the net.conclusion last time, and it SHOULD be the net.conclusion
this time. 

  The '*86 is a good CPU, the 680*0 is a good CPU, the Z-80 is a good CPU.
They all do what they are supposed to do.  The BEST CPU is the one you 
have (or maybe want) for your applications to run on.  
  Think about it.  Is a hammer a better tool than a wrench?  Don't limit
yourself to the scope of 'driving nails' or 'turning nuts', but leave it
open.  That is what this O/S question is all about.  And it is just as
impossible to answer as the the hammer/wrench question. 

Now that the sermon's over, would you open your hymnals to Page 450...

Besides, I'd rather read a dozen posts about the possibilities of RPC 
to share the wealth and make installable driver easier than watch this
go by again.

Thank you for hanging in there.

TSgt Dave Burgess.

P.S.  What is the difference between 'efficient' code and 'effective' code? :-)
From: little@carina.hks.com (Jim Littlefield)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: Re: macminix 1.6.24
Date: 21 Dec 1992 16:48:51 GMT
Organization: Hibbitt, Karlsson & Sorenson, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: carina.hks.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]

Joseph R Pickert (archetyp@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu) wrote:
: Contrary to what I have said in the past about not doing an update to
: Macminix until 2.0, I just got 1.6.24 (== IBM 1.6.24) running and have
: decided to post it after the holidays. 

Who says there's no such thing as Santa Claus? ;-)
--

Jim Littlefield <little@hks.com>
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: meulenbr@ce.philips.nl (Frans Meulenbroeks)
Subject: Re: missing/incorrect lib files in 1.6.23
Organization: Philips Consumer Electronics, Eindhoven
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 13:18:17 GMT

powers@asd.enet.dec.com (Bill Powers) writes:
>Hi,

>     I am attempting to upgrade to ST Minix 1.6.23.  I started with
>1.5.10.  I ftp'd from ftp.thp.uni-koeln.de all of AST's 1.6.23 upgrade
>files for the IBM PC.  Also, I had all of Frans's posts from comp.os.minix
>for 1.6.23.  All source trees look good after patching except for the
>lib tree.  I am missing a number of the subdirectories off of /src/lib
>as well as having completely wrong CRC's from what is in AST's crc list
>he provided with his upgrade kit.  For example I am missing many of the
>files in the ansi subdir, and those that I have the CRC's for, are
>completely wrong.  AST had an upgrade file ansi.sh for the ansi subdir,
>but it only had the source for signal.c in it.  Does anyone know where
>the correct patches/upgrade files for the lib tree can be found at?
>Here is what appears to be missing or is wrong.

>/src/lib/ansi     - Missing some files, and most files have wrong CRC.
>/src/lib/em       - Missing these [ are these pc files? ]
>/src/lib/float    - Missing all files. [ are these for ansi compiler? ]
>/src/lib/math     - Missing all files. [ are these for ansi compiler? ]
>/src/lib/rts      - Missing all files. [ are these for ansi compiler? ]
>/src/lib/stdio    - Missing all files.

I don't think you are missing something.
lib/em is pc specific. The atari stuff is in lib/em_68000, which was in
my post.

For the other dirs use the 1.5 versions. 
Andy's crc list probably contained the ansi cc versions. 

If you follow the upgrade path I decribed in the doc, and take the
posted messages also into account (e.g. first build and install cv)
it is possible to upgrade using your tree.

Good luck,

--
Frans Meulenbroeks		Philips Research Laboratories
preferred email address: 	meulenbr@prl.philips.nl
From: las@camaro.uucp (Laszlo Herczeg)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: minicom
Date: 28 Dec 92 17:06:44 GMT
Distribution: comp.os.minix
Organization: camaro

Hello everyone,
I have heard of a program called MINICOM which is a comm program for MINIX.
 
Could someone tell me if it is available for ftp and if so, where?
 
Also, if you are using this program, can you tell me about its features and/or
bugs. (The assumption being that what is for one a feature can be a bug for 
another. )    
 Any pointers will be appreciated.
Laszlo
 
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
From: Fuerwitt <fuerwitt@winx04.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de>
Subject: unsubscribe
Originator: mmdf@louie.udel.edu
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 13:42:16 GMT

Please unsubscribe me! I tried the usual way, but it didn't work.
-- 
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From: mika@olis.isc.north.de (Mika-U. Kirschke)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: UUCP with GCC V 222
Date: 27 Dec 92 19:11:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: olis.3025
Organization: Oldenburger Informations - System, FRG



Hello * !
I'am looking for someone, who compiled a UUCP with the
GCC version 2.2.2 on a Minix-St .This UUCP should run also
with 19200 bauds . I have here a GCC compiled
UUCP that crashes sometimes without a error message and
I can't find the error in the source. It is the UUCP of
Will Rose version 1.2 .

Please mail me: mika@olis.north.de

                  MIKa