HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hlynka@server.uwindsor.ca (Myron Hlynka)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Radio stations in Quebec, Western Canada
Date: 13 Aug 1992 02:37:28 GMT
Organization: University of Windsor, Ontario, Canada

In article <CLAMEN.92Aug12212036@BYRON.CS.CMU.EDU> clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU writes:
>
>Although allocation of radio spectrum is currently an exclusively
>federal power, that might be changed soon.  In any case, there is
>probably nothing unconstitional with Manitoba setting up
>provincially-subsidized German and Ukrainian radio networks.  Quebec
>and Ontario, for instance, have provincially funded French language
>networks.

The provincial government of Manitoba is being perfectly fair to 
all groups by not funding ANY group for radio and TV. It is the 
federal government which is being unfair in Manitoba by funding 
one minority  group and not funding larger minorities. I see
no reason for the Quebec government to fund English language
radio or TV stations, or for the Ontario goverment to fund 
French ones (it does partially fund TV Ontario's French 
service). The Italian Canadian population in Toronto is considerably
larger than the French population there.

                                     Myron
From: steven@spxtech.qc.ca (Steven C. Potter)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Labatts/Molsons
Date: 16 Aug 92 12:11:40 GMT
Distribution: can
Organization: Securiplex Technologies Inc., Montreal, Canada
X-Bytes: 906

From article <1992Aug15.161937.14936@rose.com>, by chris.davis@rose.com (chris davis):
> 
> Date Entered: 08-15-92 12:12
> TO: ph3@unixg.ubc.ca
> Subject:  Molson/Labbatts
> 
> P(> 
> P(> (Really, why would anyone drink a beer whose only qualities they feel safe in
> P(> advertising are the bodies of the models and the fact that you should drink it
> P(> cold. Sheesh.)
> P(> 
> I may have missed the point of this statement, but advertising wise, 
> this is all they are legally allowed to show.


  They COULD talk about the ingredients and the production process.

  Ask yourself why they don't!

-- 
  ///==================================================================\\\
  ||| Steve Potter:         steven%spxtech@CAM.ORG                     |||
  ||| Expertise/Experience: Computer Systems Engineering / Real Ale /  |||
  |||                       Politics in Education in Quebec            |||
Newsgroups: can.politics
From: smd@uunet.ca (Sean Doran)
Subject: Re: Governors-General, Now the will of the people.
Organization: UUNET Canada
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 07:16:36 GMT

yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Dave Shariff Yadallee) writes:

>  I believe the days of Patronage is coming to an end!!

I belive the sky is turning bright pink.   

Dave, this takes the cake.  While many people might also hope to 
abolish patronage, the end of political appointments is not nigh.

With the latest set of deaths and resignations from the Senate there
are now enough vacancies in the upper house to begin a large binge of
appointments.  You can bet that if there is no final deal on Senate
Reform, the Prime Minister will be filling up the empty seats in the
Upper House.

You can also bet that the P.M. will continue to hand over embassies to
his old chums, even as his current Clerk of the Privy Council appears
to be favouring professional civil servants to the P.M.'s friends when
it comes to appointing deputy ministers.

You can also bet that none of the three parties would feel comfortable
telling its workers that there would be no reward for its staffers and
bagmen other than warm fuzzy thankyous and a good conscience.

In short, you can bet that patronage is coming to an end, and I can
bet that Mulroney will go public and ask the remaining loyal Tories
not to vote for him in the next election.  The odds are about the same
in either case, although I think I have a slight edge.

>  It should up to the people, NOT the patronizing-appointing PM,
>to decide who should be our Queen's Representative!

This is a big turnaround for you.  I'm surprised that you missed the
obvious argument that the Qween ought to choose who represents her in
Canada.  This is, after all, the status quo.  The only difference
between now and a hundred years ago is that the Qween is beholden to
the advice of the elected Canadian government rather than her elected
British government, when choosing someone to keep Rideau Hall warm.

For all his many faults as a Cabinet Minister, I have no great gripes
about Hnatyshyn as a Governor General.  His only failing is that he is
too cosy with the PM; some ideological tension between the PM and the
GG has been useful in the past, and is (imho) generally desirable,
especially as the PM and GG of the day always tend to work in rather
close quarters on many things.  Like patronage appointments, for example.

	Sean.

- --
>God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!

Let's waive the queen, and dress us all.  After we have a reasonable
standard of living for everyone, we can start talking about jewellery
and concordes.
From: steven@spxtech.qc.ca (Steve Potter)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Access to French schools in CHQ etc.
Date: 18 Aug 92 13:20:42 GMT
Organization: Securiplex Technologies Inc., Montreal, Canada
X-Bytes: 1656

From article <CLAMEN.92Aug17175759@BYRON.SP.CS.CMU.EDU>, by clamen@CS.CMU.EDU
 Stewart Clamen asked:-

> In article <1992Aug17.123937.3161@spxtech.qc.ca> steven@spxtech.qc.ca (Steven C. Potter) writes:
> 
>    > Interesting numbers.  Thank you very much.  Could you please explain
>    > to us the difference between the values in columns (b) and (e)? 
> 
>       I am back at my office so I don't have the reference to hand but
>       I am pretty sure that (b) is number of students actually enrolled
>      (in minority language programs) and (e) is number of students who
>       are legally entitled to access to minority programs (where numbers
>       warrant, notwithstanding ?).
> 
> Oops.  I meant columns (c) and (e).
> 

   (c) = Minority population (6-17 years) - this doesn't inlude ALL
         the students eligible according to the provisions of the law.
        (Section 23 of the Can. Chrtr of Rts. & Frdms.)

   (e) = Eligible enrollment - this includes (c) (except in Quebec where
         s.23(1)(a) [the mother tongue provision] does not apply) - s.23
         provides for children whose parents received an education in the
         minority language. This is not necessarily their mother tongue.
         

   If you need further clarification I will dig the reference up again
   at home and post more explanatory details. 

-- 
  ///==================================================================\\\
  ||| Steve Potter:         steven%spxtech@CAM.ORG                     |||
  ||| Expertise/Experience: Computer Systems Engineering / Real Ale /  |||
  |||                       Politics in Education in Quebec            |||
Xref: sparky can.politics:5963 soc.culture.canada:5796
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
From: norman@cs.toronto.edu (Norman Wilson)
Subject: Re: Republicanisn vs. Monarchists
Organization: University of Toronto
Date: 16 Aug 92 21:49:38 GMT

My friend Mark V. Shaney, who cannot post directly here, asked me to
forward his comments on the present discussion:

 I respond to issue an invite' and the throne.  For the USA and mail,
 send to reign, you cannot be rebuffed.  Tories do anything right!  Note
 as Spain sided with them!!  No really, James II of the COntenient would
 bow down indeed.  Not very undemocratic.

 Mr Smith, you must have the American developments.  Not bad, methinks
 me sense a nation to your articles.  No really, James II accended to
 preserve the USA: labellers, esp. anyone who fought in the Republican
 influence of England was tossed out for the contrary, the same country
 that it has to your articles.  Mr Smith, you are proof.  This person is
 more friendly than the Aboriginal people.

 On the French soldiers who does NOT agrre with Bonzo?  This person is
 from the American developments.  Canada is to reign, you cannot be
 rebuffed.  The above statements are proof.

 Now, I doubt you leave out for breakfast Steve, exlax?  Go ahead, leave
 out for the throne.  In order to preserve the pertinent issues, mate.
 Also, thanks to annex Canada.  Not bad, methinks me sense a colony.  Go
 ahead, leave out important details, see why.  Laugh all you have for
 being very undemocratic.  I see why.

 Now, I wish i could say Have a nation to preserve the L.A. riots.
 Now, I can Mr. Smith.  We are a dictionary coming on.

 I will concede the pertinent issues, mate.  On the North Pole.  Maybe
 you here that?

 Next!!
From: CZ94@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CZ94)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: "F/E" versus "Bienvenue/Welcome": Update
Date: 20 Aug 92 15:00:50 GMT
Organization: McGill University

In article <1992Aug19.181916.26651@pandora.matrox.com> thood@corvus.matrox.com (Thomas Hood) writes:
>
>Steve, if "Bienvenue/Welcome" has been ruled to be legal because
>it is a non-commercial message, then all sorts of other signs must
>be legal as well.
>
>For example,
>
>      "Flower Shop"        (with "is what I should be allowed to call
>                            this establishment" in small print, beside it)

This possible loophole has already been pointed out by Don Donderi,
a McGill University psychology professor.  I think someone has been
found to test it out.  I don't know if a prosecution is under way
yet.

I'm not at all enthusiastic about this way of opposing the sign
laws.  I'm not a lawyer, but it seems to me that this *is* a
commercial message, with just a thin veneer of political content
added to try to make it legal.  There's a risk that this approach
could lead to the banning of *real* political messages in languages
other than French.

Tom Box
CZ94@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
From: jstewart@alfred.carleton.ca (John Stewart)
Subject: Re: Mike Harcourt....
Organization: Carleton University
Distribution: can
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 15:52:24 GMT

In <LABACH.92Aug20084801@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca> labach@acs.ucalgary.ca (Terence Michael Labach) writes:
>Speaking as an Albertan, no one is as big an idiot as Don Getty...

Getty has plenty of company -- several other premiers also have low 
approval ratings and thus cannot be said to truly represent the people of 
their province.  
-- 
John Stewart -- Computing and Communications Services, Carleton University
Internet: jstewart@ccs.carleton.ca or Mr.Canoehead@algonquin.carleton.ca  
"Why can't we just forget about our constitutional problems and go canoeing?"
Xref: sparky can.politics:6142 soc.culture.canada:6017
From: beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard)
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
Subject: PQ vs Liberal nationalism
Date: 22 Aug 92 23:52:06 GMT
Organization: Institut de recherche d'Hydro-Quebec, Varennes, Canada

A definition of the difference in nationalism of Quebec major political
parties:

PQ is actively nationalist (propose change, progressive) 
Liberal is passively nationalist (react to change, conservative, compromising) 

Inspired from La Presse

-- 
  \_\    Denis Beauregard  *  internet:beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca
 /   \   Genealogiste officiel : Beauregard/Jarret/Jarest/Vincent
J   __>  Vient de paraitre : Andre Jarret et ses Ancetres
\_.-===  En vente par l'auteur                      Opinions ? Et pis non !
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
From: michele@dgbt.doc.ca (Michele Guillet)
Subject: Re: Income tax rate in Canada?
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 15:56:40 GMT

In article <jstewart.713711705@cunews> jstewart@alfred.carleton.ca (John Stewart) writes:
>In <1992Aug13.074819.11448@sq.sq.com> dave@lsuc.on.ca (David Sherman) writes:

>themselves unemployed.  Nowadays it also 
>
>   1) acts as a welfare system for people who are seasonally unemployed
>      every year.
>   2) provides maternity benefits.
>   3) provides benefits to newly retired workers (this last benefit seems
>      so bizarre I won't even attempt to figure it out).
>
    4) provides short term disabilities benefits


-- 
Michele Guillet 			The Communications Research Centre 
3701 Carling Avenue, Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA, K2H 8S2	tel:613-998-2384
Internet: michele@dgbt.doc.ca
From: thood@corvus.matrox.com (Thomas Hood)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: "F/E" versus "Bienvenue/Welcome": Update
Date: 19 Aug 92 18:19:16 GMT
Organization: Matrox Ltd.


Steve, if "Bienvenue/Welcome" has been ruled to be legal because
it is a non-commercial message, then all sorts of other signs must
be legal as well.

For example,

      "Welcome"            (Without the French)
      "Flower Shop"        (with "is what I should be allowed to call
                            this establishment" in small print, beside it)
      "Pharmacy next door" (Each business posts a sign for its two neighbours)

... and so on.  A major loophole.  Use your imagination.

--
Thomas Hood                                                    thood@matrox.com
From: robert@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Robert Meunier)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: The tentative agreement of August 19th
Date: 22 Aug 92 15:33:02 GMT
Reply-To: robert@ireq.hydro.qc.ca
Organization: Hydro-Quebec (IREQ)


Comme d'habitude, c'est la folie pure ici.

Suite aux negociations, les Quebecois sont tres sceptique
par rapport aux contenus alors que les TROC considerent
que le Quebec a tout eux et crient a l'injustice.

Cela ne changera jamais. Rien que l'independance pourra 
regler cela un jour

M'enfin, voila les resultats de la derniere ronde


- 3 juges quebecois sur 9 a la cour supreme
- Garantie d'avoir 25% des deputes provenant du Quebec
- 6 senateurs du Quebec comme pour la plupart des provinces
  mais le senat n'a pratiquement plus de pouvoir. On aurait
  tout simplement du l'abolir.
- Un troisieme palier de gouvernement gere par les Autochtones.
  Ils sont fous ces romains
- Repatriement des pouvoirs. Cela est une vrai blague. Les pouvoirs
  ne sont pas reellement rapatrie mais on donne seulement un droit
  de retrait aux provinces. De plus, les pouvoirs en question sont
  deja suppose etre des pouvoirs strictements provinciaux mais
  le gouvernement federal s'amuse en les empietter depuis un siecle.
- Droit de veto. Ce point n'est pas tres claire. Selon BouBou, 
  on en a maintenant 5!

---
Robert Meunier                     Institut de Recherche d'Hydro-Quebec
Ingenieur                          1800 Montee Ste-Julie, Varennes
Internet: robert@ireq.hydro.qc.ca  Qc, Canada, J3X 1S1 
maintainer: BASIC mailing list request to basic-request@ireq.hydro.qc.ca
Xref: sparky can.politics:6068 soc.culture.canada:5933
From: beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard)
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Absolute Madness... Naturally.
Date: 20 Aug 92 17:31:28 GMT
Organization: Institut de recherche d'Hydro-Quebec, Varennes, Canada

In article <1992Aug20.083954.28846@spxtech.qc.ca> steven@spxtech.qc.ca (Steve Potter) writes:
>
>     WATCH THIS SPACE!!
>
>
>     There will be no referendum in Quebec -
>
>     Bourassa will likely call on election instead.
>
>
>     The other possibility, which I think far less likely, is a
>     Canadian referendum on the package.
>
>  ||| Steve Potter:         steven%spxtech@CAM.ORG                     |||

Good!  With the stupid agreement they announced yesterday (the only
use of a minimum 25% of seats for Quebec corresponds to a racist
behaviour of stopping almost completely immigration), Bourassa will
loose the elections.  I can't see any advantage of only 8% of senate
seats excahged again some .5% more seats at common.  And if the EEE senate
is actually operative, French speaking are loosing power.

Anyway, the way the politics is played, the parties, not the provinces,
make choices.

-- 
  \_\    Denis Beauregard  *  internet:beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca
 /   \   Genealogiste officiel : Beauregard/Jarret/Jarest/Vincent
J   __>  Barthelemy Jarret (1471) -> Andre Jarret, sieur de Beauregard (1665)
\_.-===   -> Denis Beauregard (1992)                  Opinions ? Et pis non !
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
From: steven@spxtech.qc.ca (Steve Potter)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Labatts/Molsons
Date: 18 Aug 92 13:07:21 GMT
Distribution: can
Organization: Securiplex Technologies Inc., Montreal, Canada
X-Bytes: 1946

From article <WARKENTI.92Aug17141543@syscad8.CAE.Mitel.Com>, by warkenti@CAE.Mitel.Com (BJ Warkentin):
> chris davis writes:
>    P(> 
>    P(> (Really, why would anyone drink a beer whose only qualities they feel safe in
>    P(> advertising are the bodies of the models and the fact that you should drink it
>    P(> cold. Sheesh.)
>    P(> 
>    I may have missed the point of this statement, but advertising wise, 
>    this is all they are legally allowed to show.
> 
> Things like taste, ingredients, process, tradition, aging... come to
> mind as "selling" points. Of course the average Canadian beer drinker,
> who insists on drinking the stuff at 34 F, probably cares more about
> the trendiness of his/her brand of choice than the taste and assumably
> the movers and shakers in the corporate brewing industry understand
> this. The biggies are out to make great money, not great beer... The
> end result is that we get advertising crap that shows lotsa flesh or
> perhaps goes the sophisticated route and blathers on about "cold
> filtered" or a light beer with three type of "malt" (I forget their
> word but the magic three are probably rice, corn sugar and <gasp> a
> teeny tiny bit of real malt)
> 
> The solution: - buy from micro breweries
>               - brew your own
>               - buy imported 
> 
> If enough people and hence buying power boycotted the biggies, their
> offerings would change. Simple supply and demand.
> 
> BJ...warkenti@CAE.Mitel.Com    |   XJ650K and DoD#0255
> Kanata, Ontario, Canada        |   I want a new toy...
> I really didn't mean it quite that way, or did I :->



            AMEN!


-- 
  ///==================================================================\\\
  ||| Steve Potter:         steven%spxtech@CAM.ORG                     |||
  ||| Expertise/Experience: Computer Systems Engineering / Real Ale /  |||
  |||                       Politics in Education in Quebec            |||
From: hlynka@server.uwindsor.ca (Myron Hlynka)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Official languages (was Re: Radio stations...)
Date: 16 Aug 1992 01:28:48 GMT
Organization: University of Windsor, Ontario, Canada

In article <14AUG92.10646917.0069@VM1.MCGILL.CA> CZ94@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CZ94000) writes:


>Surely it hasn't escaped your attention that Canada is not governed
>by referendum.  The Liberal government won a majority in the 1968
>election.  Its position on language rights was well known.  Why
>would this not give them a mandate to legislate on language
>as on other matters?

You are correct that this is the way Canada operates. And it is 
too bad that the votes of Ontario and Quebec can effectively 
pass legislation concerning Western Canada that is against the
wishes of Western Canada. Perhaps if the senate of Canada had
equal representation from every province, as is done in the 
United States. No. That would never get approval of Ontario and 
Quebec. 

>
>What solution are you proposing?  That there should be one official
>language?  Why would this be any less "discriminatory" against
>all the non-official languages?  Or do you want the federal
>government to use every language spoken in Canada?  That'd be
>less discriminatory, but hardly practical.

First, I would abolish the term "official languages". The abuses that
have occured from the term should be justification enough for that. The 
federal parliament should function in English and French with 
translators available. (This already exists.) Provinces should be given
their own choice of language usage in provincial matters. For those 
provinces that prefer English, the Federal government should offer
federal services in those problems in English only. For those
provinces that prefer French, the federal government should offer 
services in French only. For those that prefer both, the federal 
government should offer services in both. 

Of course, there may be some situations that have to be clarified
(what if an Air Canada flight flies from Montreal to Winnipeg ?, etc.
etc.), but it shouldn't be too hard. If the federal government wants
to hire me as the head of a royal commission, I can work out the 
details. 

                               Myron Hlynka



Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
From: nadeau@bnr.ca (Rheal Nadeau)
Subject: Re: Absolute Madness... Naturally.
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 20:09:01 GMT

Hmm.  Denis and Gerald are both complaining loudly about this deal.
Maybe it does strike the right balance between the conflicting
claims?  (After all, a deal that would satisfy one would be totally
unacceptable to the other.)

The Rhealist - Rheal Nadeau - nadeau@bnr.ca - Speaking only for myself
From: beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: That pathetic "includes Quebec" slogan.
Date: 18 Aug 92 12:13:46 GMT
Organization: Institut de recherche d'Hydro-Quebec, Varennes, Canada

In article <CLAMEN.92Aug16232609@BYRON.SP.CS.CMU.EDU> clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU writes:
>
>Quebec and Newfoundland have something in common.  Only they have ever
>voted to be part of Canada.
>
>--
>Stewart M. Clamen			Internet:    clamen@cs.cmu.edu
>School of Computer Science		UUCP: 	     uunet!"clamen@cs.cmu.edu"
>Carnegie Mellon University		Phone: 	     +1 412 268 2145
>5000 Forbes Avenue			Fax:	     +1 412 268 5739
>Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3890, USA

Actually, in 1980, the question was not "Do you want to be part of Canada"
but do you want a new kind of federal deal (in a very long sentence).
And the No party was said that a No would give anyway a new deal!

-- 
  \_\    Denis Beauregard  *  internet:beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca
 /   \   Genealogiste officiel : Beauregard/Jarret/Jarest/Vincent
J   __>  Barthelemy Jarret (1471) -> Andre Jarret, sieur de Beauregard (1665)
\_.-===   -> Denis Beauregard (1992)                  Opinions ? Et pis non !
Xref: sparky can.politics:6118 soc.culture.canada:5985