Newsgroups: rec.aviation

> In rec.aviation, rosinski@neit.cgd.ucar.edu (Jim Rosinski) writes:

Hi Jim!  Gonna have the beast in time for OSH?

> General conclusions:  Cessna 172 or 182 would seem to come closest to
> meeting the above criteria.  182 burns alot more fuel and is much more
> expensive to maintain/overhaul however.  Grumman Tiger is alot faster
> than a 172, and has the advantage of being currently in production (the
> perceived advantage is parts availability, no way can I offord a new
> one).  But its altitude capability is marginal at best for the western
> mountains.  Some of the Piper aircraft are perhaps worth consideration,
> but I've never piloted them and know next to nothing about them.
> Perhaps a 172 with 180-hp conversion is the best bet.  The resultant
> ceiling increase and speed enhancement would be most welcome.  I read
> with interest the recent thread here on 180-hp conversions, and most
> people seemed happy with it.

> Again, comments/criticisms are welcome.

Caution.  The 172 is not a mountain airplane.  A 172/XP is, a regular
172 converted to 180 hp is usually short on tankage and does not have a
constant speed prop (you lose in descent, because you have to throttle
back to avoid overspeed...  this costs time=money).  When you fly over
the mountains it is a long way down from cruise and back up (relatively
expensive too), just because you couldn't carry the necessary next 10
gallons to make your destination in one hop.

Having said that, I have flown 172s in the Colorado mountains for the
past 15 years and averaged getting weathered in or turned back by the
>wind< three times a year, when the weather is good enough to launch.
Usually it us just overnight, but I have spent 3 nights out before when
a C-182 would have made the trip ok (excess thrust).  I no longer fly a
straight 172 in the mountains it can not reliably cope with the lift and
sink generated by 15 knot winds at mountain top level.

If you have sufficient mountain experience in a 172 and know that you
only want 2 people and a small amount of gear and 1/2 tanks, then a 172
marginally, just marginally, may work for you.

My recommendations are first a C-182, straight leg, no turbo, then a
Piper Cherokee 235 (PA-28-235), then a Piper Cherokee 181 (PA-28-181).

The Piper Arrow (PA-28-200) is an ok plane in the mountains for 2 or 3
people, but the retractable gear just costs too much unless someone else
is paying part of your costs (poor bang for the buck for a mountain
airplane, ok for a cross-country machine).

You might consider buying into a partnership in one of these craft, fly
it for a few years and decide your likes/dislikes vs cost at that time.
Buying a too-small airplane will cost you twice...  buying it the first
time, selling it, then buying what you really needed in the first place,
but were originally shy to spend the money on.

Why do I think I know?  I owned 2 airplanes, a 1956 Beech Musketeer,
200hp fuel injected (a C172 flys better and cheaper).  A 1971 Piper
Arrow, too slow for the maintenance costs, should have had a C-182, sold
it to buy a house (mistake).

If you (or others) have < 300 hours in the mountains or < 500 hours
total time, or just want to, I recommend the Colorado Pilot's
Association "Mountain Flying Course".  I am a member of CPA and hope to
be teaching for this course someday.  :-)

Subject: CPA Mountain Flying Course, in Denver

Colorado Pilot's Association has just announced that they will putting
on the: "CPA Mountain Flying Course" in Denver this summer.


This is a nationally recognized mountain flying course designed to give
those who want to fly in the mountains preparation to do so safely!


Ground School:  Centennial Airport (APA), south of Denver, Colorado
                Clarion Hotel (across the street from Denver Jet FBO)
                July 17, 1992  1200-1800

Cost:           $125 ground portion
                $125 flight instruction in your airplane
                flying July 18 or 19, or later, depending on Wx.

More information contact:
                Bill Standerfer, 229-9442 Home
                bills@hpisla.lvld.hp.com

There is always something to be learned about the winds, weather, local
terrain factors and local practice in the mountains.

I have flown search and rescue for Colorado Civil Air Patrol since 1978
and I'm still learning more about flying in the mountains.

Jer/ Eberhard, (SLASH), HAM = N0FZD     | Hewlett-Packard - MS99, 1UP10,15'East
Pilot: COMM, INST, CFI-Airplane & Glider| 3404 East Harmony Road (303) 229-2861
CAP CFI, Check & Mission, Pikes Peak 218| Fort Collins, Colorado  80525-9599 
EMAIL:  jle@fc.hp.com or Jer_Eberhard@fc.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.aviation