From: n8442349@henson.cc.wwu.edu (The Matriarch)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Clive Barker's book "Imajica" (warning: spoilers)
Date: 14 Sep 92 23:06:48 GMT
Article-I.D.: henson.1992Sep14.230648.27783
Organization: Western Washington University

In article <1992Sep14.191437.19088@dsg.cs.tcd.ie> cjmchale@dsg.cs.tcd.ie 
(Ciaran McHale) writes:
>
>There are a few aspects of Clive Barker's book "Imajica" which I want to
>discuss. If you plan on reading this excellent book then you might want
>to kil this thread since I'll probably be giving a few spoilers.

	Excellent book!  I really enjoyed reading it.  So much so, in
fact, that I would be perfectly content if Mr. Barker never went back to
horror.


    (spoilers follow)

>A few notes of interest:
>
>	o Although the mystif is mosty often referred to as a genderless
>	  "it", I found it difficult to think of it as anything other
>	  than "he". Perhaps this is because we are first introduced to
>	  the mystif as a male and this first impression stuck with me.

	I found myself thinking of the mystif as 'he' as well.  If I
remember correctly, this is how Gentle sees it after he originally
mistakes it for Jude, as a black male.

>	o Thus I tended to view the relationship between Gentle and the
>	  mystif as a motss relationship rather than a relationship
>	  between a man and an "it".
>
	Pie (the mystif) and Gentle's relationship definitely had a motss
flavor to me.  But I _would_ characterize the strength of feeling between
them as being equal to that between Jude and Gentle.
 
>I was wondering if my non-acceptance of the Gentle-mystif relationship
>was due to (i) internalised homophobia on my part, or (ii) a lack of
>ability on the part of the author to write convincingly about non-motos
>relationships. As far as possibility (ii) goes... there is a minor
>motss relationship in the story (that of Clem and Taylor, a gay couple)
>which I found much easier to accept than that between Gentle and the
>mystif. Then again (a) Taylor died quite early on and afterwards was
>a spirit inside Clem's head (and hence give them an emotional but
>non-physical relationship) and (b) Clem came across a bit like a
>stereotypical overly nice, charming queen; so combining (a) and (b), I'm
>not so sure if I accepted their relationship or just felt warm fuzzies
>for Clem as a nice character.
>

	I can't really speak to (i) above, but  I found both sets of
motss interactions (Gentle/Pie and Clem/Taylor) to ring true.  

>"Imajica" is a long book (about 1140 pages) and it took me
>approximately two weeks or more to read it. I noticed that I felt
>uneasy reading the book and I don't think this was entirely due to me
>not being used to reading such long books (I'm used to reading 300 page
>novels which are a paced a bit faster). I think that part of my
>discomfort with the book was internalised homophobia which expressed
>itself in not being able to fully accept the androgeny of the mystif
>and its relationship with Gentle.

	At least you recognize this possibility.  Perhaps your discomfort
was also related to the story being in part a retelling of the story of
the Messiah of Judeo-Christianity?  And the implications that the son of
god was bi?  Although that could fall under internalized homophobia as
well.  

>Comments from anybody else who has read the book?

	Now I'll have to go reread it... ;)

>Ciaran.


-- 
Joy Ralph
n8442349@henson.cc.wwu.edu

- I am the electric messiah - the AC/DC _GOD_