HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fred_s@netcom.com (Frederick Scott)
Subject: Re: An interesting question (any game)
Organization: Nerds On Parade
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 07:00:41 GMT

lerouxm@prism.CS.ORST.EDU (Markie Mark) writes: 

>Most of the responses to this thread have been questioning whether
>it is a good tactic to hurt an opponent in a good position to 
>prevent them from 
>winning.  However, I don't think the person who started this 
>thread wanted to discuss that problem.  I beleive the problem
>was that a certain annoying player when forced into an unwinnable 
>situation would spare no expense at destroying the other player's
>chances at winning.  This is meant to be a spiteful act that serves
>only to vent the annoying man's anger.

I disagree.  "Sparing no expense to destroy the other player's chances at
winning" is *exactly* what we're talking about.  What you don't seem to be
picking up on here is that this tactic can have a very useful and (many of
us think) legitimate function besides expressing anger.  The construction
of a reputation for vengence, particularly if it's effective vengence, may
make other players think twice about messing with you in future games.

>This discussion has nothing meaningful to add to this newsgroup.

Well, it might be more useful for you if you would actually *read* the posts -
which were a lot more clear about the point I made above than you were in
separating the two different points you were trying to make.

Fred
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: dutta@cognex.uucp (Paul Dutta-Choudhury)
Subject: Divine Right Auction Update
Organization: Cognex Corp., Needham, Mass
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 19:15:04 GMT

DIVINE RIGHT GAME AUCTION UPDATE:	1/8/93

To date, a total of 4 bids have been received.

----------------------------------------------------
Game			Min Bid		Current Bids
----------------------------------------------------

Divine Right		25.00		50.00	skrishna@mit.edu
					40.00	aristotle.ils.nwu.edu!mccoy
					35.00	fokus.gmd.de!wasserroth
					30.00	cs.utexas.edu!russw

A winner for this auction will be declared on 2/1/93.

Some people have had difficulty submitting bids via e-mail.  Here is my complete
e-mail address:

	cognex!scorgies!dutta@ai.mit.edu

Paul Dutta-Choudhury
Cognex Corp
Needham MA
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Tuesday, 12 Jan 1993 17:53:49 MST
From: <ICECW@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject:    Help with Metagaming's Chitin I

Hi!  I need a copy of the counters from Metagaming's Chitin I boardgame!
I will gladly pay any photocopy costs and postage involved!

Many thanks!
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: rlbell@babbage.uwaterloo.ca (Richard Bell)
Subject: Re: Help with Space Fleet
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:16:54 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.151514.150@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> jleitzel@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (James W Leitzel) writes:
>Hello all!
>
>	A friend of mine and I sat down to a nice pleasant game of Space Fleet
>last night, and we had an interesting (and annoying) situation arise. He
>was playing the Eldar and I was Imperial. He had 2 Wraithships and 2 shadow
>things (I forgot the name), and I had 2 Gothic class and an Ironclad.
>
>	On turn one, he opened up with all 4 plasma torps, and successfully
>wiped out a Gothic and the Ironclad. Ouch. Now here is the problem I have. The
>Plasma Torp rules seem to state that all hits are critical ones, so we were
>having the damn things ignore shields. This makes the plasma torp really nasty
>against the imperials. Even the Ironclad got nuked. Contrast this to the 
>Imperial Vortex torp, which (If it hits) does a d6 of damage, but no criticals
>unless you roll a 6 on a die. On a Power gaming level, the Eldar are definitely
>the way to go. Any Ideas, comments, of generals hints?

Just because a weapon always causes a critical does not mean that it ignores
shields.
>
>	Also, just as a side note, the Ironclad ignores any hit that the dice
>read a 3 or less. This means that only a 4, 5, or 6 will do damage. However, a
>6 will still do a critical. This seems to me to indicate that 1/3 of the hits 
>on an Ironclad will be a crit, as opposed to 1/6 for other ships. Same deal
>with the small Eldar Shadow(hunters?) with Holofields, they Ignore all dice
>that score less than or equal to their current speed. They can also potentially
>go at speed 6, which makes them invulnerable at that speed. (Admittedly, their
>maneuvering is limited at that time, but still...)

If you root through other GW products, and possibly Space Fleet as well, you
will find that a six has a fifty percent chance of being a seven.



Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: bmac@trifid.astro.ucla.edu (Bruce Alan Macintosh)
Subject: Re: SPI's Air War
Organization: UCLA Dept of Astronomy
Distribution: usa
Date: 4 Jan 93 11:08:59 PST

stanford@leland.stanford.edu (Scott Stanford) writes
>Anyone know what happened to SPI's boxed game Air War?  It was my
>favorite of the modern air combat simulation games since the scale was
>right (one turn = 2.5 seconds, one hex = 500 feet) and the
>charts/tables relatively easy to deal with.  Has anyone else played
>this game?

Air War is out of print. Justifiably so, IMHO. What you want is J.D.
Webster's "Air Superiority", which is a far better game than Air War.
J.D. is/was an A-7 driver, and the game does a much better job of
reflecting real physics than Air War - no different "turn modes",
for example; an F-16 doing a 7-G turn turns at the same rate as an
F-4 doing a 7-G turn; the difference is that the F-4 will lose all its
energy much faster.

Air Sup also has lots of nice chrome - being able to load aircraft
station-by-station, for example, instead of Air War's packaged
weapons loads. Since it's a more recent publication, weapons and
aircraft do a better (but not perfect) job of reflecting reality.

Only problem is that the basic version is out of print, since GDW
dropped it. (Still fairly easy to find in stores, though.) "Air Superiority"
covered air-to-air combat only, with the basic NATO/Warsaw Pact
modern plane types. "Air Strike" added (really good) air-to-ground
rules. A (very hard to find) package called "Desert Falcons" added
various planes for the arab-israeli wars.

Fortunately, the game has been reissued by "Clash of Arms". The
new version is called "The Speed Of Heat", and covers Korea-
Vietnam. It includes 2nd edition rules. I haven't actually played it,
due to lack of an opponent, but it looks to be even better than original
Air Sup.

P.S. I like AirSup's scale better than Air War too - 15 seconds/2000
feet or so. 2.5 seconds is too short a turn - no real pilot can continually
reasses the situation and completely change his plans in 2.5 seconds.
Also, the longer turn means aircraft can do a siginifcant amount of 
maneuvering in one turn, and games (even with 16 aircraft!) can be 
played in a reasonable amount of time.

Bruce Macintosh             bruce@bnkl01.astro.ucla.edu
UCLA Department of Astronomy Infrared Imaging Detector Lab
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: mdm@bnr.ca (Diane MacMartin)
Subject: Re: 1830: Track construction
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Ottawa
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 13:23:12 GMT

In article <1ibtl8INNu5@news.uni-paderborn.de> jerry@uni-paderborn.de writes:
>A question on constructing track:
>
>The rules say that the green tiles, once they are available can be used
>to REPLACE existing yellow track tiles.   Is it possible to use a green
>tile to construct NEW track?   Or do I always have to place a yellow
>tile first and then replace it by a green one (and perhaps later by a
>brown one) ?

Yes, yellow tiles must be placed first.  Which can be frustrating if
all the 'legal' yellows are in use, but you have the green tile you
want to place - you must then free up a yellow tile, which some other
alert player will now place on his track, so you must then replace
THAT yellow tile, which will again be used by someone else ...

It's part of the essentials of this game.

-- 
Diane MacMartin       Bell-Northern Research, Ltd     Ottawa, Canada
mdm@bnr.ca            Any opinions are my own and do not represent BNR.
=========>> If this is printed on paper, please recycle it <<==========
From: slouie@ocf.berkeley.edu (Shelley Louie)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: Winning isn't everything
Date: 12 Jan 1993 08:45:42 GMT
Organization: Bat Radar Studies, U.C. Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: sandstorm.berkeley.edu

"It is not enough that I win but that all of my enemies lose."

-Shelley Louie
From: mrose@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Opinions on Broadsides and BP's needed
Date: 6 Jan 93 14:10:08 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services







		I'd like some opinions on MB's out of print Broadsides
and Boarding Parties.	thanks

		Matt Rose
		Univ of Kansas
		Remote Sensing Lab
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: doko@cs.tu-berlin.de (Matthias Klose)
Subject: starting 183 pbem game
Reply-To: doko@cs.tu-berlin.de
Organization: Technical University of Berlin, Germany
Distribution: rec
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:35:27 GMT

Hello,
I am looking for three people to join a 1830 pbem game.

	Matthias
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: isopi@acf9.nyu.edu (Marco Isopi)
Subject: Re: ROR: Rules questions
Organization: New York University
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 01:38:09 GMT

nicholso@pioneer.arc.nasa.gov (Melvin H. Nicholson YBH) writes:

>In article <1993Jan4.185059.20399@digi.lonestar.org> jtisdel@digi.lonestar.org (J. Michael Tisdel) writes:
>>We recently played a game of Republic of Rome, and we had a few questions:

>No surprise there.  We all did.

>>(2) When can the intrigue cards be played?  Is there any general prohibition?
>>    Tribunes have prohibitions printed on the card and assassin cards fall
>>    under the assassination rules.

>It depends on the card.  Blackmail is clearly played during a persuasion
>attempt, the card where you steal someone else's card is (i think) the
>revolution phase, but I'd wait for someone else to confirm that, as it
>may be a "play any time" card. 

You are perfectly right is played in the revolution phase, so that anyone has
a chance to play a concession o statesman before it gets stolen.

P. S. Anyone organizing an e-mail game?

>Mel

Marco
From: doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: MB/GDW: HeroQuest & BattleMasters
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:22:33 GMT
Reply-To: doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu
Organization: Department of Chemistry, UCLA

In article <1992Dec27.010436.12344@u.washington.edu>, harmonix@stein.u.washington.edu (Chaz Stevens) writes:
>
>	I've recently seen two games from Milton Bradley working with GDW in
>my local toy store, namely HeroQuest and BattleMasters.  I am interested in
>knowing how playable they are.  Can someone who has seen or played one or
>both of these games give me a review of them?  E-mail or posted is fine.  
>Thank you!
>
>

Heretic!  That's GW, not GDW.  Go wash your mouth out with soap.
Those GDW folks must get pretty depressed being confused with Games Workshop
all the time.  On the other hand, I hear they're not a whole lot better these
days.

B^)

Seriously, though, HeroQuest is quite playable.  It's pretty fast moving and
requires little thought (though additional thought may make your life a bit
easier); great for when you want to spend an hour or so thumping on some
monsters with some friends.  CAVEAT:  If nobody wants to GM, this isn't a good
idea.  A series of 14 quests is provided, and to date four additional Quest
Packs are available, all with 10 additional quests.  These cost about $10 for
the ones that don't introduce significant quantities of new rules and
components and about $15 for those that do.  Also provided is a map intended
for photocopying (I haven't tried this, and make no claims as to whether the
colors used are actually photocopiable) to help you create your own quests. 
Considering that I was able to pick up the main game for $16.44 on sale at
Target, I think it's a fantastic buy.  Even at $30, it's a good deal.

Note also that GW sells a related game called Advanced HeroQuest, with entirely
different mechanics and more detail, but a similar flavor.  Advanced HeroQuest
will probably set you back more like $50 (because everything GW sells is
overpriced).

-Doug Gibson
 doug@abby.chem.ucla.edu

Neither UCLA nor the National Science Foundation has a clue what I am doing.
They just pay me to do it.

"We have to tear you to shreds because we care." - EAC
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: jennifer@jato.jpl.nasa.gov (Jennifer Schlickbernd)
Subject: Re: New Mayfair Games
Reply-To: jennifer@jato.jpl.nasa.gov
Organization: Jet Propulsion Lab - Pasadena, CA
Distribution: "na"
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:57:22 GMT

cjs@phy.duke.edu (Carl Schnurr) writes:

>In a recent catalog I saw that Mayfair Games is now importing (or
>has created) several games.  These include:

>Shark
Very good (although I sold it).  It's an Acquire variant.  I sold it because
I had too many Acquire variants, and we weren't playing Shark much.  It
was originnally released in 1988.
>Murphy
Really boring, wouldn't recommend it at all.  Supposed to be like Clue, but
we found it very slow and little control.
>Aladdin
Haven't seen nor heard anything on this.

>Does anyone have the word on these games?

>Thanks,
>-Carl
>-- 
>	Carl J. Schnurr					1-919-684-8256
>	Duke University Dept. of Physics        	cjs@phy.duke.edu
>	Durham, N.C.      27706			
-- 
Jennifer Schlickbernd  Technology Utilization Office  J. P. L.
jennifer@jato.jpl.nasa.gov or elroy!jato!jennifer@csvax.caltech.edu
72466.3413@compuserve.com  Voice:(818) 354-2241
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: bchapman@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA (Bruce Patrick Chapman)
Subject: Astronomy & Miami
Followup-To: 9005904@sscvax.cis.mcmaster.ca 
Organization: chaos limited
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:43:24 GMT

greetings all

1)  could someone please repost the name & location of the program which
	was discussed earlier that shows the night sky accurately?

2)  if there are any people from miami out there, could you please send me
	some information on the bourhoods of Bocaraton, Pompano Beach,
	Fort Waterdown, Hollywood, North Miami, Miami Beach, Coral Gables,
	Hialeah, <and the ubiquitous> etc...it's for a campaign game, and
	i'm trying to make it as realistic as possible...including the
	"flavour" of different areas...ie: Hollywood=coal mines...just
	dosn't work!

thanks!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This is forwarded mail.  Please send all comments etc. to the following
		address: <9005904@mcmaster.bitnet>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: wanted:Conquest of the Empire
From: cvalj001@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu
Date: 8 Jan 93 11:08:00 PST
Organization: California State Polytechnic University, Pomona
Nntp-Posting-User: cvalj001


   I'd like to buy a copy of Conquest of the Empire.  I ahve money now so send
me an offer!

-- 
                                                           
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                   Daemon E. Hobbs, C/LtCol, AFROTC
                 Senior, (Spatial Information Systems)
                          Cal Poly, Pomona
                            **Commander**
                602D Air Force ROTC Cadet Squadron (ATC)
                Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711

         "My ramblings represent no one's opinion but my own."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rbr@well.sf.ca.us (Bob Rossney)
Subject: Re: Dumb Moves By Game Companies 
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:11:31 GMT

In <1993Jan5.035135.751@netcom.com> mhall@netcom.com (Michael Hall) writes:

>Here are two annoying and unnecessary unrealistic aspects of the original AH
>Civilization game:

To criticize Civilization for being unrealistic is, I fear, to miss the
point of the game entirely.  It's a game, not a simulation.  For instance,
the whole point of the limited number of Mysticism cards is that this limits
the number of players who can select the peculiar predicament that choosing
Mysticism puts the player in, thus encouraging the players to have differing
objectives in the end game.  It has nothing at all to do with how civiliza-
tions develop.

Similarly, the trading in Civilization is not much of an attempt to simulate
Mediterranean trade; it's an entirely abstract mechanism designed to force
the players to grapple with one another, and it succeeds at this objective
admirably.

As a simulation, Civilization is a couple of pegs up from Monopoly.
Simulating the real world is not at all the point.

Bob Rossney
rbr@well.sf.ca.us
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: drac@uumeme.chi.il.us (Bruce Maynard)
Subject: Re: 1830 questions
Organization: UUMEME Public Access Xenix
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 09:25:23 GMT
Keywords: 1830

In article <63308@mimsy.umd.edu> rpfaff@umiacs.umd.edu (Ray Pfaff) writes:
>My gaming group finally got around to playing 1830 the other night.
>We liked the game quite a bit, but there were several questions that
>we had which were unclear in the rules.
>1. When you play the operating round, does each railroad play a token,
>set up railheads, ect. or do you alternate.  I.e. each railroad lays a
>token, when all are finished, each lays a railhead if desired, ect.
>
>2. Do the split tracks (tiles which have one track on one side and 
>two splitting off (no cities on it) count as two seperate rails for
>the purpose of determining routes?  In other words can I have two
>trains running routes over that tile?
>
>3. When the first railroad buys a 4 train, does only that railroad's
>2 trains get removed, or do all the 2 trains on the board get removed?

1) Each railroad does everything it gets that turn, then play moves on to the
     next railroad. Ie, lays token, then lays track, etc etc...

2) In the example given (1 track entering, multiple leaving a hex), the track
     may be used only ONCE per turn. The only times a hex may be used multiple
times in a turn are a)if trains are entering a city hex from different directions
     and b) if the 2 sections of track in the hex do not connect (yes, there are
     a few like that).

3) All the "2" trains are removed, from ALL railroads.

-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------+
| The above statements are the  | Bruce Maynard  (Da "drac") |
| delirious meanderings of a    | Hoffman Estates            |
| complete moro... er, MANIAC!! | IL 60194                   |
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: alsandor@Micor.OCUnix.on.ca (Michel Boucher)
Subject: Re: OGRE/GEV: is there a FAQ???
Organization: M.B. Cormier INC.
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 93 18:04:47 EST

sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan) writes:

> Mr. Jackson will once again have a magazine that covers Ogre
> Miniatures, at least.  Starting hopefully by mid-year, SJG will combine
> Roleplayer and Autoduel Quarterly into one journal, and add Ogre and
> Hot Lead coverage as well.  It will also feature reviews of non-SJG
> games.  The magazine will be called Pyramid, of course . . . more news
> about it later, I'm sure.

Steffan, interesting concept.  I was just thinking, as I purchased ADQ
10-3 recently, that it has probably reached a plateau and needs to be 
scaled down.  I presume the plan to go ahead with ADQ 10-4 and then
start the Pyramid sales?  Bwahaha...couldn't resist.  

Michel

C. Michel Boucher              | alsandor@micor.ocunix.on.ca
Private user                   |
Ottawa, Canada                 | member, Christina Amphlett fan club
CANADA                         |
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: goldman@orac.cray.com (Goldman of Chaos)
Subject: Re: GEV BBS: Alterative Minis, Bathroom tiles and Hoverblitz.
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 4 Jan 93 08:52:06 CST

In article <HCOBB.93Jan2123956@fly2.berkeley.edu> hcobb@fly2.berkeley.edu (Henry J. Cobb) writes:
> 123: Johansen miniatures
>  By: Steve Jackson  [2]
>Date: 20:57  1/1/93
>
>I've seen these. "Not nearly as nice as Ral Partha's" is, unfortunately,
>an understatement. They appeal mostly to the "save fifty cents now, have
>an ugly miniature forever" market. Which DOES exist.

Yeah, like the origional Ogre miniatures.  I found a bunch of them
next to the current Ral Partha miniatures and thought, "Wow, 4 Missile
Tanks per pack at the same price as 2 Missile Tanks.  What a deal!"
I'm really glad that you switched to Ral Partha to mold tanks and
stuff Steve.  Now if I can just find more GEVs and Howitizers.

Matt
-- 
Matthew Goldman              E-mail: goldman@orac.cray.com
Fax: (612) 683-3099                   Work: (612) 683-3061
      "Say George, I don't mean to interrupt, but 
       there's a glowing red dot on your forehead."
From: pete@chem.ucsd.edu (Peter Wotruba)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: Games for sale
Date: 12 Jan 93 15:14:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: network.1iun95INNhue
Organization: University of California San Diego, Chemistry
NNTP-Posting-Host: chedccf0.ucsd.edu

I bid $55 for Russian Civil War, and $10 for New World

Peter
(pwotruba@ucsd.edu)
From: shoham@ll.mit.edu (Daniel Shoham)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: Multi-Player Game Poopers
Date: 7 Jan 93 00:12:27 GMT
Distribution: rec.games.board
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory

In article <9692ck@rpi.edu> johnc@porsche.cs.rpi.edu (John Colasante) writes:

>Usually, but not always, its the player whose position is weak
>and/or threatened. Well, isn't that a surprise. I myself will
>always stick it out until the end so the others can complete
>the game even if there's no hope of winning. I just think this
>is gamers ettiquette. 

There are certain rules of good gamemanship that are understood to be in
force among regular game groups.

The fundamental problem is what is "good gamemanship" for a weak (or hopeless)
positioned player to do? If (as is often the case) only winning counts (as
opposed to "number of points", "money" or other quantative measures where
"losing big" is distinguished from being "edged out") then the "best"
strategy is to look and play for "1 in a thousand" shots (i.e. very high risk
for a moderate/high payoff). Routine play will tend to keep a losing player
in a losing position.
The problem is that such plays when they fail tend to randomly enrich one of
the contenders (and likewise when they work, to devestate one). Transforming
the game from that of strategy to one of luck. (Example: Titan; a hopeless
player decide to attack a much stronger player Titan-on-Titan. The randomly
chosen victim will either be knocked out of the game - by losing or being
stripped, or be made very powerfull - by winning cheaply, as expected).

In games where a resignation is possible (ex: Titan, Euro-rail and the like),
our group *ENCOURAGES* players with hopeless position to resign. The player
is expected to time the resignation to avoid skewing the game by it (for
example, in Titan, if a strong player had trapped your Titan and is about to
kill it, it is considered poor gamemanship to resign).

In games where resignations are not possible and winning is measured (18xx,
Acquire, etc.) A weak positioned player is expected to play to optimize the
final position - however hopeless (and hence avoid those randomizing plays).

Games where resignation are not possible and winning is all that count (civ,
etc.), weak player are expected to make it clear if they intend to follow a
high risk strategy well in advance. If they do, it is considered fair game
for other players to attempt and provide/avoid being the "victim". This is
not a satisfactory situation, but the best we can do.

-Note that some players consider all games to be non-measured, while others
find ways to measure every game.


Dan Shoham               shoham@ll.mit.edu
------------------------------------------------------------------------
The view presented are not necessarily those of my employer, etc.

Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Lincoln Laboratory
244 Wood Street
Lexington Massachusetts, 02173-9108
Office B-373
617-981-3515
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Newsgroups: rec.games.board