From: morgan@brewich.hou.tx.us (Morgan ap Rhys)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: men's spirituality (was Re: New Pagans and Reading)
Keywords: do it thineself
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 92 08:53:52 CDT
Organization: The Brewer's Witch BBS, +1 713 272 7350, Brewich.Hou.TX.US

ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:

> well, from where i stand, men can be as sacred and holy as they want.  but if
> there are to be men's mysteries, MEN have to create and support them.  i;m su
> not going to.  what do i know of maleness?  what does starhawk know of
> maleness?  most religions are kept going by women, but are run by men and are
> in worship of male gods.  wicca and dianism haev a goddess, and are most like
> STILL kept going by women.  so, a female focus is unsurprising, especially
> since there are no artificial structures to keep women out of the power
> structure.  me, i don't CARE about maleness, men's mysteries, gods, priests,
> high priests, heterosexual symbolism or great rites, phallic symbols, male
> initiation, etc.  not my thing, not my spirituality, doesn't move me at all. 
> have nothgin against YOU doing it, in fact i think the fact taht men are
> acquiring mysteries after all this time is rather nice, but i'm not doign it
> for you.  then they woudl be ailsa's mysteries.
> 
> people seem to overlook the fact that WOMEN are creating women's mysteries.
> women are creating women's spiritualiy.  a lot of work and love and creativit
> and time has gone into the quest, and it is OUR grail we are seeking.  we are
> not doing spirituality for you, we are doing it for us.  when i write we
> ritual, i write one that moves me, that makes ME feel closer to the divine.
> 
> if men want mysteries, if men want spirituality, if men want gods and male
> symbolism and male initiations, for christ sake CREATE THEM!!!!!!!  women
> created the dianic movement because it was what they wanted, what they needed
> something they could love.  if you want a dionysiac movement or whatever, get
> to work.
>                                                 -ailsa

I can agree with much of this, except the part where you say you don't 
care about men's mysteries, etc.  Perhaps I misread this (and if so, my 
apologies to you..) but I think it is everyone's responsibility to care.  
I may not be responsible for the mysteries and spirituality of women, but 
I do care about it.  It IS important to me for many reasons, not the 
least of which being balance.  Granted, I could never create women's 
mysteries, or even try... but I CAN encourage the women in my life to do 
so, and more importantly, give them room to do it.  Standing aside and 
simply saying "Just do it" does not always cut it... Active 
encouragement, support and whatever help we can give to our fellow Craft 
members is our obligation.  You see... I DO care about childbirth, 
women's sexuality, goddesses, priestesses, etc.  I may not be able to do 
much but wonder at them, but I can't help but be touched by them.. no one 
who lives with the opposite sex can help but be touched and moved by the 
mysteries thereof.  I have two daughters.  They live with me and not with 
their mother (who is christian in any event).  Anything about our faith, 
they will learn from me, a male.  I pray all the gods I am equal to the 
task of raising them and teaching them.  
 
<<end of rant>> :)
 
Blessed be...
 
Morgan
 
PS.. are you also the Ailsa on some of the Fidonet echos?


------------------
morgan@brewich.hou.tx.us (Morgan ap Rhys)
(Alternate) morgan%brewich@lobster.hou.tx.us
Origin: The Brewer's Witch BBS -- Houston, TX -- +1 713 272 7350
     "Silence is the voice of complicity" - Vote Early, Vote Often!