HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk (Mark Evans)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Re: Useless Bots
Date: 27 Jul 92 12:27:36 GMT
Organization: Aston University

asamonte@polyslo.csc.calpoly.edu (Just some loser...) writes:
: Personally I think channel opping bots are useless.  What is the point?
: Having a robot sit on a channel and only op certain people?  Now
: that is what I call elitst.  I've had so many problems$with channel opping
: bots in the past.  This is one of the reasons I don't like them.  Let's
: give a current exmaple.  #wicca, has a channel opping bot, now$the original
: creators of this channel (regular members) Are not even opped by this bot
: anymore.  And some new person has taken over the channel and imposed
: all these 'rules'  (once again, very elitist) .  I told them the
: best solution is to create a new channel.  They will probably do that
: but still.  What gives them the right to put a robot on a channel
: and have it only op certain people?
: Especially when they do vanity ops such as
: /mode #channel +ooo sameperson sameperson sameperson
Exactly
This sort of command makes a channel very noisy.
(both from the mode changes themselves and also due to people loosing the 
thread of what they were saying)
This command is also propergated to every server on IRC. (mode changes are
broadcast rather than routed)
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Evans                                   |evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 565 1979 (Home)                     |evansmp@cs.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 359 6531 x4039 (Office)             |
From: jvmg9796@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Doc)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Re: Top 50 Killers (12/7/92-19/7/92)
Date: 24 Jul 92 22:22:04 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) writes:

>Not really.  How many of the above would you really want to answer ?

I wouldnt mind helping out a newbie.  Sheez its not that hard to be 
helpful.

>Not only this, it is a waste of time for many people to have to wait
>for people to get through the "can I ask a question" phase. Why is it
>a waste of time ? Well some people IRC while they work on #tz.

People are only trying to use good manners when they ask that.  They
would think themselves rather due if they just joined the channel and
said "hey, how do you.....?"  so they try to introduce themselves by
asking if anyone can help them.  

>People who come onto the channel and ask questions which are to the
>point usually get answers quite quickly (if people are available and
>able to anwser).

Well I have followed the "rules" you listed, cam onto tz and asked
my question, waited...waited....waited.....nothing.  Or, the conver-
sation at hand continued as if I werent even there.  How could
people not get the impression that the channel was inhabited by
snobs with that kind of (non) response?
From: adean@weber.ucsd.edu (Anthony V. Dean)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Re: Patriot Games
Date: 23 Jul 1992 05:49:29 GMT
Organization: University of California at San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

gja@mullian.ee.mu.oz.au (Grenville Armitage) wrote :
>>gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) wrote :
>>  >On behalf of all Americans who agree with me, I'd like to apologise
>>  >for this bozo.
>	[..]
>>ps: I'd be pretty stupid to let you speak on my behalf anyway, so
>>apologize for yourself.
>
>It would appear that you are, in fact, pretty stupid.
>Given that you disagree with Greg, he has already excluded you from
>his apology. Your knee-jerk is functional, how about your reading?
>gja

My reading is fine, is yours? If you read it again the post script
is conditional. Now, who's stupid?

Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: hrose@eff.org (Helen Trillian Rose)
Subject: Re: Top 50 Killers (12/7/92-19/7/92)
Organization: The Evil Fascist IRC Admins From Hell, Inc.
	<1992Jul22.063803.19673@alf.uib.no> <CKD.92Jul22110054@loiosh.eff.org>
	<1992Jul23.181920.17926@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu>
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 19:11:35 GMT

Mandar> == Mandar Mukund Mirashi <mmmirash@midway.ecn.uoknor.edu> 

 Mandar> In article <CKD.92Jul22110054@loiosh.eff.org> ckd@eff.org
 Mandar> (Christopher Davis) writes:

>Ove> == Ove Ruben R Olsen <buboo@alf.uib.no> 
>
> Ove> Is this client using select () ; or fork () ; ?
>
>select().  The problems were in the screen interface handling code; on
>one occasion, the word-wrap module went insane and started sending
>output to the terminal as fast as it could.  Since it was on a local
>xterm process rather than a "real terminal", that was pretty fast.
>(Unfortunately so fast that the window manager was getting cycle-starved
>from all the updates the X server was trying to deal with.)
>
>Note to implementors: be very careful how you do word-wrap :)

 Mandar> I have been reading this newsgroup for some time now, and in
 Mandar> fact tried IRC only after I saw this newsgroup! But articles
 Mandar> like the one stated above continue to befuddle me. I am still
 Mandar> learning (and would like to learn more)...... There seems to be
 Mandar> an elite group of hackers (IRC ops?)  who know the very inner
 Mandar> details of the workings of IRC (like ping times, routing, hubs,
 Mandar> and stuff like in the article above). Could any of you "gurus"
 Mandar> please enlighten me, and perhaps suggest a book where I could
 Mandar> learn more of IRC, routers, etc. I can program in C, Pascal,
 Mandar> etc.

Don't take this the wrong way. 

RTFS. (Read The Fricken Source)

A small part of the irc workings are documented in the "Comms" file
that's packaged with the server source (avaliable at cs.bu.edu and other
places around the world). 

What Ruben and Christopher were mentioning above were comments about
client coding. Both of them have been/are involved in it and were
discussing ways of implementing certain features. 

IRC knowledge isn't documented in books. To learn more, stop by
#Twilight_Zone -- I wouldn't suggest talking, tho. Just sit back and see
what goes on.

--Helen

--
Helen Trillian Rose             	email eff@eff.org for EFF info
Electronic Frontier Foundation   	irc operators: operlist@eff.org
Systems and Networks Administration	Flames to: 
<hrose@eff.org, hrose@cs.bu.edu>	women-not-to-be-messed-with@eff.org
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: troy@cbme.unsw.EDU.AU (Troy Rollo)
Subject: Re: Useless Bots
Organization: University of New South Wales
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 12:26:09 GMT

From article <91963@bu.edu>, by jky@buengf.bu.edu (John Yu):
> done its join by maintaining #hk itself, anything else is extra.  Hey, we're
> not getting paid for this work and no one asks for this service, so for the
				     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> bot-writers sake, be patient.  Actually, HKServ has some built in user 
> functions in it yet the help screen hasn't been installed yet.

So why impose it on people?

IRC is a real time network. At any given moment it is there to serve the
users online at that point in time. Channel reserving robots serve only
to impose the will of somebody who is not online and thus ought not to
have any genuine interest in what is happening there.

--
__________________________________________________________________________
troy@cbme.unsw.EDU.AU	Overworked, overcommited and always multitasking.
From: evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk (Mark Evans)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Re: Perdition's Flames (was Re: IRC Rules)
Date: 22 Jul 92 16:08:26 GMT
Organization: Aston University

gen3002@husky1.stmarys.ca writes:
: Well, it was fun to read in the beginning, but now it grows tiresome.
: (A) Does it matter what people look like?
: (B) Does it matter what country people come from?
: (C) Does it matter who thinks what about whom?
: (D) Isn't it what's inside that's important?
: (E) Isn't it being true to yourself that counts most?
: (F) Aren't we all one big happy computer user community?
: (G) Isn't this group about IRC, and not 5000 petty personal arguments?
: No, I didn't think so either.
: Party on
: Jay
Maybe also the top 10 (?) stupid questions. (and some answers)
Q) what is your Major?
A) John, or maybe Norma.
Q) Where are you?
A) Earth, you know that small blue/green planet circling a pale yellow sun...
Q) Why can't I finger you?
A) You don't know me well enough yet.
Q) You claim to be Female, but your real name looks like a mans.
A) I'm using my Brothers/Fathers/Teachers/Husbands/Boss's ... account
(or vice versa)
Q) Whats the weather like at ...?
A) I havn't a clue I just use their server/client/dial-up
Q) What time is it?
A) Time you bought a watch.
Q) Does anyone talk about X here? (where X is something connected to the channel name or topic)
A) Why don't you then, it might cut down some babble.
Q) what does this command do?
A) go RTFM 
Q) why havn't you said anything, answered ...?
A) did you say something relevent?

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Evans                                   |evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 565 1979 (Home)                     |evansmp@cs.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 359 6531 x4039 (Office)             |
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: john@rtfm.mlb.fl.us (John Blasik)
Subject: Re: Call for submission on layout of stats.
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 05:44:20 GMT

thecure@ee.mu.OZ.AU (the cure) writes:
      ...

>                     TU-Muenchen.DE [0388] [0009] [0176] [0003]
>                           UCSD.EDU [0085] [0001] [0094] [0002]
>                          Uni-KL.DE [0026] [0000] [0078] [0002]
>                   Uni-Paderborn.DE [0095] [0003] [0082] [0002]
>                     aapo.it.lut.fi [0009] [0000] [0042] [0001]
>              adagio.fy.chalmers.se [0019] [0000] [0068] [0001]
>
>------------------
>
>At the moment, it's sorted alphabetically. I'd like to list the servers
>by the amount of work they do. What is the _best_ indicator of which
>server does more , etc, than another. (ie - vanity servers would come
>waaay down the bottom.)
>

Why not just send the list to Trillian and ask her to sort it?

-- john
From: S_TITZ@iravcl.ira.uka.de (Olaf Titz)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: FAQ - Re: Top 50 Killers (12/7/92-19/7/92)
Date: 24 Jul 1992 09:47:59 GMT
Organization: Fachschaft Informatik, Uni Karlsruhe
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: irav1.ira.uka.de
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.23

In <avalon.711947995@sorokin> avalon@sorokin.anu.edu.au writes:
...
>  and so on.  Some of them will make the channel so quiet, you would think
>  everyone was asleep :-) These are also listed in the FAQ (which appears not
>  often enough :) and are constantly brought up when people complain about
>  lack of help on that channel.

The fact is that I have not seen a FAQ here for months and thought that it
didn't exist, along with an impression I should post a request for someone
writing one (no, I won't do it). Is there really one?

MfG,
        Olaf
--
                                                             o
 Olaf Titz           \    s_titz@iravcl.ira.uka.de \        _/\
                      \   uknf@dkauni2.bitnet       \      _//|_.
y.a. comp.sc.student   \  +49-721-60439@voice        \    (_)`(_) 
Uni Karlsruhe, Germany  \ praetoriu@irc               \~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Future versions of 'grep' should refuse work when run on a file of newsgroups,
 as this usually serves no benign purpose.
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: asamonte@polyslo.csc.calpoly.edu (Just some loser...)
Subject: Re: Top 50 Killers (12/7/92-19/7/92)
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 01:30:08 GMT
Organization: Nothing worth mentioning...

avalon@sorokin.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) was telling me...
>asamonte@polyslo.csc.calpoly.edu (Just some loser...) writes:
>
>>hrose@eff.org (Helen Trillian Rose) was telling me...
>>>IRC knowledge isn't documented in books. To learn more, stop by
>>>#Twilight_Zone -- I wouldn't suggest talking, tho. Just sit back and see
>>>what goes on.
>>>
>
>>This is highly debatable.  I wouldn't suggest it.
>>But that's just my opinion.
>
>If you go there expecting to be lectured on IRC in a couple of hour /
>half-hour sessions, then forget it.  The combined knowledge of those on
>#twilight_zone about IRC is quite easily greater than that of all those who
>are not on it.  This is more a reflection of who is on that channel, not
>who isnt.  The amount of bugs that discussed or brought up on #twilight_zone
>is quite astonishing (mainly for IrcII but hey ;) and I doubt there is any
>other channel on IRC which has a similar content.
>Some things to avoid in #twilight_zone are asking:

No, Just expect #TZ to have the same content as operlist...and im not too
thrilled with that.  If anything it's most people just sitting there 
idling or /away until someone says something to start bickering about.

>
>*	"can I ask a question ?"
>*	"is anyone here ?"
>*	"how does irc work ?"
>*	"i want to learn about irc, can anyone help me ?"
>*	"i want to setup a server,  ''     ''    '' '' ?"
>

Just say no...

>>>Helen Trillian Rose             	email eff@eff.org for EFF info
>>>Systems and Networks Administration	Flames to: 
>>><hrose@eff.org, hrose@cs.bu.edu>	women-not-to-be-messed-with@eff.org
>>                                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>Hmm.  I'm gonna mail that and see if it works...<grin>
>
>It does exist and I'd be careful with what you send0it. They do mean
>business :-)

Well I mailed it...I'm still alive...for now...


-Alex

-- 
||||||||   Russ Teasdale -- rteasdal@polyslo.CalPoly.EDU  --  (Rusty)  ||||||||
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gentlemen, if we do not succeed, then we run the risk of failure." - D. Quayle
From: adean@weber.ucsd.edu (Anthony V. Dean)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Patriot Games
Date: 22 Jul 92 22:15:40 GMT
Followup-To: alt.flames
Organization: University of California at San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu


gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) wrote :
  avd>>Somehow I think only you damn Finns have nothing better to do than going 
  avd>>around bashing other ethnics. How do you like me now?
  >On behalf of all Americans who agree with me, I'd like to apologise
  >for this bozo. I have yet to meet a Finn who has bashed anyone without
  >being sorely provoked, and I have met many Americans who provoke.

Yes! The comment about the Finns was pretty offensive wasn't it?
But, WUMpuss, it was not put there as a real bashing. It was put there as an 
example of how stupid such a statement can be. You tell me the difference 
between the statement about the Finns, and the "psychic" statement and the
likes produced by SOME of our European friends on the net.

The issue is not whether they are being provoked or not. The issue is not 
who's bashing which country. The issue is people resorting to ethnic 
slandering for their alleged arguments. I don't have anything against the 
Finns or the Germans. I simply don't think the ethnic-bashing methods that 
SOME of the readers on here use for a lack of better thinking, are very 
useful and intelligent.

>Maybe we'll grow up someday, maybe not.
Let's hope so.

-avd
ps: I'd be pretty stupid to let you speak on my behalf anyway, so
apologize for yourself.
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: spidy@acca.nmsu.edu (Da Spidy-Mon)
Subject: Re: A bunch of prejudiced people.
Organization: New Mexico State University
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 15:27:34 GMT

Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: stumpf@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Markus Stumpf)
Subject: Re: FAQ wanted...
Originator: stumpf@hphalle0.informatik.tu-muenchen.de
Organization: Technische Universitaet Muenchen, Germany
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 09:45:38 GMT
Distribution: alt


In article <smr.711982505@hitks2>, smr@iti.org (S.Riehm) writes:
|> more to the point I want the address of a european mail ftp site that
|> has the sources for irc. ( which i assume would be in the FAQ, if
|> there is one )

write to 
	ftp-mailer@ftp.informatik.tu-muenchen.de

You can retrieve files with the command
	GET <file>
in the message-body.
The files are
	/pub/net/irc/irc2.7.2f.tar.Z	(385115 Bytes, irc-server and client)
	/pub/net/irc/ircII2.1.5g-271b.tar.Z	(299101, alternate and more
						 comfortable client)

Files will be sent uuencoded and in hunks (1000 lines each)
Ciao
	\Maex
-- 
______________________________________________________________________________
 Markus Stumpf                        Markus.Stumpf@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE
From: franklin@ug.cs.dal.ca (Steve "edified" Franklin)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: Re: A bunch of prejudiced people.
Date: 22 Jul 92 23:17:48 GMT
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada

In <1992Jul22.203330.22715@rat.csc.calpoly.edu> asamonte@polyslo.csc.calpoly.edu (Just some loser...) writes:


>All I have really seen here is how prejudice knows no boundaries...It's not
>restricted by geder, age, race, or national boundary.  Everyone is making
>generalizations about countries by a few peoples' reactions.

  You're kidding yourself if you think this is a prejudiced scenario we
are witnessing. This is blatant immaturity my friend. Something that IRC
is renowned for. Many are guilty of it, but only the geeks find it difficult
to leave immaturity behind when they're not playing. Clearly some 
individuals you encounter (many?) on IRC are less mature than you
might think but see IRC as a way to act like "who they should have been"
rather than "what they really are". Silly people who think they are
superheros and stuff 8)

steve
   SUPERMAN!
-- 
aasdSteveFranklin-Subliminal Psychology Major.ks;dlasBlueJaysRULEkasdfeahsdbfl
sd;lfaswoq[eBuyMeAQuadra!!!mbnZMXCNdfsba;KdSPAMiuroqiyetIBMSuxiweuryth'ewr;mxn
qpuepriuPartyOneqtuj;,n.,xnc,kjasFlameMeNot!;lkj;lkgkjd;askElvisLivesjhfquweru
zx.cfranklin@ug.cs.dal.ca,sk;t;lrut[Superboy@ac.dal.cav.zx,Physics!eq3rwkh;oHA
From: amadeus@opal.cs.tu-berlin.de (Axel Richrath)
Subject: Re: Useless Bots
Organization: Techn. University of Berlin, Germany
Distribution: fb20
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 20:01:02 GMT

this discussion is as ridiculous as the discussion about killing some of
these stupid and annoying psychological misleaded users. and the 'problem'
would be solved by the same means: 'JUST IGNORE THEM!' - i dont think these
bots are annoying. annoying are these ppl who have nothing else in mind
than always shouting 'we want our IRC kept clean' etc...

folks: IRC is not reality! don't u have other problems???

btw - as long as a bot doesnt produce dumps to channels continuosly it's no
problem - or what?

greetings, axel (aka macbeth)

ps: i miss InitServ in this list! he is the most stupid of them all, but
also very harmless and rather silent :)
From: asamonte@polyslo.csc.calpoly.edu (Just some loser...)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: A bunch of prejudiced people.
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:33:30 GMT
Organization: Nothing worth mentioning...


How sad...how really sad.  I've been reading both sides of
this 'My country is better than yours' argument and it has all the 
kick of the 'My computer is better than yours'$ 'My car is better than yours',
or 'My dad can beat up your dad'.  

All I have really seen here is how prejudice knows no boundaries...It's not
restricted by geder, age, race, or national boundary.  Everyone is making
generalizations about countries by a few peoples' reactions.

So where do we go from here?  Is any specific part of the US more moronic
than the others?  What about Europe?  Where do the really insane people
live there?  

If you people want to wage your petty bigoted and prejudicial flame wars
take it to email.  I would rather not see this (from either side)

-Alex


-- 
Guy Martin (Hackman) |  Life is soooo.. |Internet: gmartin@polyslo.calpoly.edu
                     |                  |UUCP: ucbvax!voder!polyslo!gmartin
"Blah, foo."         | <favorite word>  |Work: guy@library.calpoly.edu     
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: S_TITZ@iravcl.ira.uka.de (Olaf Titz)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: RTF[M,S] - Re: Top 50 Killers (12/7/92-19/7/92)
Date: 24 Jul 1992 09:44:28 GMT
Organization: Fachschaft Informatik, Uni Karlsruhe
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: irav1.ira.uka.de
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.23

In <avalon.711947810@sorokin> avalon@sorokin.anu.edu.au writes:

>  Since the manual is rather brief, RTFS.
>  Thats how to learn the inner details of the IRC programs.
>  The reast of the knowledge on routing, etc, comes from being
>  'net-aware' (having maps of networks, knowing where you are
>  in relation to everyone else, what is good/fast, what is slow/bad,
>  etc).
>  
>  Both take time.
>  
>  avalon

All that is true (exists a *manual*?), but I can tell that life for
client-coders (in this case) could be much easier if there were 
- a reasonably small, consistent IRC protocol and
- *documentation* on this (not just comments in sources about
'hopefully having grasped all messages')

I have heard that some folks are developing version 3 of irc, being
incompatible with 2.7. Please, at least *consider* writing an RFC
about it!

MfG,
        Olaf
--
                                                             o
 Olaf Titz           \    s_titz@iravcl.ira.uka.de \        _/\
                      \   uknf@dkauni2.bitnet       \      _//|_.
y.a. comp.sc.student   \  +49-721-60439@voice        \    (_)`(_) 
Uni Karlsruhe, Germany  \ praetoriu@irc               \~~~~~~~~~~~~~
He thinks too much, such men are dangerous. - Shakespeare, Caesar
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: aiken@netcom.com (The Nonborn King)
Subject: Re: Useless Bots
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 17:11:17 GMT
Organization: Flame Retardant Outfits 'R' Us

In article <1992Jul26.035708.8997@news.cs.brandeis.edu> oren@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Oren Kastner) writes:
>Wowowo, hold on a minute.  When you run a server it is NO business of yours
>how many users you have on the server and what/who they are -- UNLESS they
>cause problems (like harassment).  
...
>You are there to provide and manage a service, 

Uh...  here, allow me to lend you my asbestos suit.  You're going to need it.

Aik


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who then can warm my soul? / Who can quell my passion?         Enya & Roma Ryan
Out of these dreams - a boat / I will sail home to you.           'Exile', 1988
Newsgroups: alt.irc
From: rynes@slc3.INS.CWRU.Edu (Edward M. Rynes - M.E.D./P.o.D.)
Subject: Need Help With Server Crashes
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 19:15:56 GMT

I recently brought up version 2.7.2f of the IRC server but every 24-72
hours it dies for no apparent reason.  There are no messages in the log
file or any kind of error message anywhere on the system.  The server
just seems to stop running.

Does anyone have any suggestions for what might be the problem?  The
only oddity with the server is that it is a "private" server. (not
connected to any other servers)  It is running on a Sun SLC.  I have
a second IRC server running on the same machine (different port) and
it has never crashed.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks Much!
-- 
Edward M. Rynes  <rynes@INS.CWRU.Edu>              "Even in my drunken stupor
Information Network Services                I've got to admire your ingenuity
Case Western Reserve University               And I nod my head, oh so wisely
Cleveland, OH  44106-7072                      to the rhythm of your cruelty"