From: adams@spss.com (Steve Adams)
Subject: Re: Homosexuality and Christianity
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:41:14 GMT
Organization: SPSS Inc.

hudson@athena.cs.uga.edu (Paul Hudson Jr) writes:

>In article <adams.703020573@spssig> adams@spss.com (Steve Adams) writes:
>>muehlhau@en.ecn.purdue.edu (John Muehlhausen) writes:

>>>For me loving God means listening to the rest of his Word.

>>Which I and others have done.  We're just not hearing the same things.
>>I *know* that I'm not 100% right.  Will you admit the same?
>>
>> -Steve

>This reminds me of another important point, the issue of faith in
>regard to conscience.  If there is any doubt in the Christians mind as to
>whether doing something is sinful, for example homosex (there should not be
>any.  Both New and Old Testaments are explicit that it is.)  then the
>person should not do it.  
Fine.  Assuming for the sake of argument that you are correct, then this is
true of any sin, not just homosexual sex.  As such, why are you so busy
condemning homosexuals when you should be looking to your own sins first.
(cf Matthew 7:3-5)  Unless and until you have removed all of your own sins,
do not attempt to remove the sin of another.

>I will quote two verses from chapter 14, (Romans)
>"22 Hast thou faith?  have it to thyself before God.  Happy is he that 
>condemeth not himself in that thing which he alloweth."

The NIV and it't notes say:

     "(22)So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself
      and God.  Blessed is the man who does not condemn himself by what he
      approves."

*14:22 The strong Christian is not required to go against his convictions
       or change his standards.  Yet he is not to flaunt his Christian
       freedom but keep it a private matter.

The example given previously about meat says that if a brother does
something, I should honor what he does to keep him from falling.  The
example given is eating meat.  But what of the homosexual Christian whose
convictions say that God has not condemned him?

>"23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of
>faith, for whatsoever is not of a faith is sin."

     "(23)But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his
      eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from
      faith is sin."

*14:23 The matters discussed above, namely, conduct about which there can
       be legitimite differences of opinion between Christians.

So, as such, it *is* possible that Christians will differ as to opinions on
Scripture, and thus, we are to allow for that.  How do these verses defend
your position?  The verses, and their footnotes in NIV seem to say that
where there is a difference of opinion, let each hold his own opinion so
long as it doesn't cause a brother to be led astray.

>This makes sense to me.  Anyone who takes a chance of sinning against God
>is sinning by his irreverent actions.  If homosex were a "grey area" 
>(which it is not.  It is clearly sin,) then anyone who practiced 
>homosex without considering his action to be "100% right" would be sinning.
So, if it's a grey area, and the gay or lesbian person believes he is 100%
right, then it's ok?  Exactly.  And it does appear to be a grey area.

Why?  Because Leviticus does not apply to Gentiles.  We're not covered by
that Law.  And as for Paul, my understanding of the texts is that the Greek
is unclear, and cannot be translated directly to 'homosexuality.'  Perhaps
one of the NT Scholars who does NT Greek can be of assistance here.

 -Steve
--
 The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
                        -------------------
     adams@spss.com                           Phone: (312) 329-3522
     Steve Adams                              Fax:   (312) 329-3558
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