HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: c34657b@saha.hut.fi (Tuomas Viljanen)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Camouflage painting opinions needed!
Date: 28 Jan 93 05:40:52 GMT
Organization: The Nibelungenlied Incorporated

In article <1k1hbqINNqp5@slab.mtholyoke.edu> pscotto@MtHolyoke.edu (Peter J. Scotto) writes:

>However, on the actual  aircraft and vehicles I have seen, the
>lines of demarcation between colors seem pretty distinct and should be
>more so on the smaller scale model.  So what's going on here?
>Is this a case of the tool driving the modeller?
>
>Specifically, I'm working on an A-10 now with a three color
>camouflage pattern (dark green, medium green, and dark grey).
>When I look at the plans, what I see represented are distinct
>patches of color, but when I look at the box, I see this indistinct
>feathery stuff.  My inclination is to mask and use the airbrush or
>use a brush.

Actually, IMHO, it is a question of an illusion. The wiever knows there
are soft demarcation lines on the real thing - he waits to see them also
in the model. To make things clear, the demarcation lines must be exagger-
ated in the small scales to look realistic: compare with the highlighting
and shading of the miniature figurines. Therefore demarcation lines are
airbrushed on the model to appear as soft, and they do look like ones
on the real thing - although they are grossly out of scale. Sharp edges,
like those obtained with an ordinary brush, just don't create the same
illusion - they don't resemble the real thing.

To reduce the feathery edge, but still leave it to look like brushed, one
good solution is to use mask. I have two solutions: either I use 3M Post-
It patches cut in form (the yellow billets, you know) or ordinary carpenter's
tape with the edges rolled up for about 1-2 mm. To obtain thin line, one should
have VERY dilute paint (I use 1:3 - 1:4) AND high pressure (2-2.5 bar).
Xtracolor enamels and Tamiya acrylics are good for this.

And also, if you want hard edges, just press the mask edge firmly onto the 
model. Also, an airbrush is an enormous timesaver - you'll do the same job
in fifteen minutes you'd be using 2 h with a hairbrush (a pun intended !)
and the coat is even - no flocks, brush marks etc. For a serious modeler
an airbrush is, IMHO, a must.

And, with the T-bolt, the demarcation lines on the real thing are RREALLY
coarse, I'd use an airbrush freehand to paint the blotches.




--++ Tuomas Viljanen                     ++ For a battle like Crecy, you do ++
  ++ Lahderanta 20 A 19                  ++ not need a military genius like ++
  ++ SF-02720 Espoo FINLAND              ++ Edward III. All you need is an  ++
  ++ 358-0-592175 or c34657b@saha.hut.fi ++ idiot like Duke of Alencon.     ++
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: obrien@netcom.com (No parking EXCEPT FOR BOB)
Subject: Re: F117 Gold windows
Organization: Not lately - this place could sure use some!
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 09:01:41 GMT

danl@col.hp.com (Daniel Lockhart) writes:
>Has anyone done any gold windows such are used on the F117?  I'm
>about to waterdown some gold paint and airbrush them, just want to
>check on other ways first.

This gave me an idea I just *had* to try.  So I just got out my Testors
F-19 Stealth Fighter (the pretty fiction, not the ugly truth), my
collection of SnJ Spray Metal products, and some Q-tip swabs.

I took a Q-tip, and dabbed it into the gold polishing powder, then
rubbed it onto the canopy.  The result?  I *really* had to do a
polishing job on that canopy - this stuff showed up flaws in the
surface like a microscope!  So I polished rather heavily with the
SnJ powder itself, went through a couple of Q-tips and a few tissues, but
the powder I'd already spread on did the polishing, too.  Then I
wiped it off of the outside, and dabbed some more on the inside - a bit
mottled, but careful work with the Q-tip as a 'powder puff' on the inside
while looking thru from the outside, and in less than half an hour *total*,
I had a look that I like.  I made it a bit heavier at the front and 
lighter toward the back, like "gradient" sunglasses.

What I've done is to essentially use the powder as a dry pastel.

Try it!  Worst case, you polish it out & wipe it off, "wasting" a little
of your SnJ.

A variation of this would be to put on a clear-coat first, and polish
the gold into that - harder to wipe off and restart, but more permanent
and smudge resistant when it's done.  A clear-coat over what I've already
done could work, too.  I *might* try this with some Future acrylic,
but not tonight X-}


	Bob   IPMS#4157
From: obrien@netcom.com (No parking EXCEPT FOR BOB)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Advice on painting road grime
Date: 21 Jan 93 10:28:24 GMT
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)

Here, too, dry pastels may be just what you're looking for.

Unless your models get a lot of handling after completion.

	Bob
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: brndlfly@athena.mit.edu (Matthew T Velazquez)
Subject: Re: Advise on 1/48 F-117 Stealth
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 19:23:54 GMT

wesm@mbunix.mitre.org (Miller) writes:

>I'm looking to build an F-117 in 1/48th scale. I know at least Monogram and
>Testors have kits. Is there anyone else and in your humble opinions, who make
>the better kit. Thanks.

	As far as I know Monogram and Testors are the only guys that make
readily available kits.  Testors' kit was released a little too early, I think.
The nose section by the FLIR port is not done right (although lots better than
their 1/32 kit), and the kit does not include a prominent shelf in front of the
intakes.  The landing gear is comparable on both kits, as are the cockpits.
If you want to build a nice looking Nighthawk, get both kits.  There are
advantages and disadvantages to both.

				-T

				T Velazquez
				MIT Aero/Astro
				brndlfly@athena.mit.edu
"Crayolas are one of the few things the human race has in common."
				-Robert Fulghum
From: akwong@gundam.Eng.Sun.COM (Anthony Wong)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Tamiya Paint Spray
Date: 22 Jan 1993 18:02:50 GMT
Organization: Sun
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: gundam

In article <1jnjp5INN5va@sal-sun10.usc.edu> williamc@usc.edu (William W. Chan) writes:
>	Is there anyone know where I can find the Tamiya color spray
>in the California??
>
>-- william
>
>
It is very expensive to import aerosol spay cans into the U.S.  I remember
about two years ago, D&J Hobbies had a rack of racing car spray colors,
(I forget the brand, MODELER'S?).  They were very nice colors, like Ferrari
Red, Lotus Green etc.  Well they were retailing for $9.00 per can!!
What really hurt the store was the stupid ban on aerosol propellant.  All the
cans were gone never to return again.

Later,
Anthony Wong

******* No relation to D&J or the paint company. ********
From: phalcon@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Wild Weasel ECM pods
Date: 28 Jan 1993 00:04:04 -0600
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: matt.ksu.ksu.edu

     I am preparing to build an F-4G Wild Weasel, the only problem is
that I would like to build an aircraft that has the ALQ-184 ECM pod.
The models seen on most shelves come with the older ALQ-119 ECM pod
unfortunately they did not use these in the Gulf War.  I know that 
besides the 184 pod, they also used the ALQ-131 ECM pod.  My question
is: Does anyone know where I can get an ALQ-184 pod, or am I stuck
trying to convert the old 119 pod?
    
                                       John Gabor
                                       phalcon@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
From: ss@wpi.WPI.EDU (Scott Streeter)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Klingon Bird of Prey
Date: 26 Jan 93 23:24:41 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA 01609-2280
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpi.wpi.edu
In-reply-to: ss@wpi.WPI.EDU's message of 26 Jan 93 08:41:56

>>>>> On 26 Jan 93 08:41:56, ss@wpi.WPI.EDU (Scott Streeter) said:

>>>>> On Mon, 25 Jan 1993 14:29:33 GMT, assaf@acad2.alaska.edu said:

assaf> I have been trying to find a decent model of the Klingon Bird
assaf> of Prey.  The only one available is in the AMT/ERTL kit and it
assaf> is trash. While reading some the posts on the Enterprise
assaf> someone mentioned a scratch built Bird of Prey.  Could someone
assaf> tell me which magazine and issue.  I am also looking for a
assaf> decent Excelsior and Reliant.  Could someone please help

ss> There were 2 seperate articles in Fine Scale Modeller on how to
ss> scratch build a BoP. Now Star Tech in Texas has one, but it's
ss> about $75. They have a Reliant for about $85 and an Excelsior for
ss> over $100 I think. E-mail me if yu want the address. I don't have
ss> it right now...

Ok. The address is:

Star Tech
P.O. Box 456 
Dunlop, TN 37327

Be warned these kits are vaccu-form kits, and really aren't worth the
price if you ask me (I have the Reliant kit. My all time favorite Trek
ship).

I was wrong about Star Tech being in Texas. Sorry. Also the issues of
FSM which show how to build a BoP are March 1989. It describes how to
build a 1/200 scale version. The December 1990 issue shows how to
build a 1/535 scale version which is in scale to ERTL's Enterprise kit
(kit #6675DO). Good Luck.....



--
 Scott Streeter                             Visit the Star Wars Archive at
 ss@wpi.wpi.edu                             wpi.wpi.edu       130.215.24.1
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: peterco@eff.org (Peter Cohen)
Subject: Re: Advice on painting road grime
Originator: peterco@eff.org
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 00:20:53 GMT

So let me get this straight- you use a piece of wire to bisect the spray? 
That's an interesting concept.  I might try that!


-- 
+-----------------+------------------------------------------------+
| Peter A. Cohen  |   No, I don't reflect my employer's opinions.  |
| peterco@eff.org | Heck!  My employer doesn't even know I'm here! |
+-----------------+------------------------------------------------+
From: augustho@aludra.usc.edu (August Horvath)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Camouflage painting opinions needed!
Date: 26 Jan 1993 09:56:55 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

In article <1k1hbqINNqp5@slab.mtholyoke.edu> pscotto@MtHolyoke.edu (Peter J. Scotto) writes:
>OK, I realize that airbrushes produce a really great finish,
>but I've got a problem with some of the stuff I've seen.

>When I see models with say, RAF bi-color patterns or modern
>American tri-color patterns, I see alot of this feather edge
>freehand stuff, where one color kind of feathers off into another.

>However, on the actual  aircraft and vehicles I have seen, the
>lines of demarcation between colors seem pretty distinct and should be
>more so on the smaller scale model.  So what's going on here?
>Is this a case of the tool driving the modeller?

You're exactly right!  And there are 2 related problems.

1. If you look real close at the actual aircraft and vehicles, there
   is often a soft demarcation, but not nearly as soft as that often
   painted on models.  The problem is airbrush technique.  In 1/72
   scale, it's almost impossible to paint freehand and get a tight enough
   demarcation line to look accurate.  Even in 1/48 or 1/32, you need
   an a-brush with a nice fine nozzle and considerable skill to get the
   lines tight enough.

   The solution is "soft masking"--laying down tape but lifting the edge
   a millimetre or two, producing a soft line but much tighter than is
   obtainable freehand.  This can take a hell of a long time, especially
   on, say, sand-and-spinach schemes where there are so many little patches
   of color to mask, and you have to make sure all the tape edges stick up
   just the same amount or there will be variation in the line softness.
   Freehand is a lot more fun!

2. Modellers sometimes assume soft demarcation lines where there are none.
   For example on Brit a/c circa WW2, usually the lines between the upper
   camouflage colors are soft, but that between the upper and lower colors
   are hard.  On the other hand, when a/c were built by the US for the 
   British and painted at US factories in Brit camouflage, often the line
   between upper and lower surfaces was painted soft as well. 

August Horvath <augustho@usc.edu>
From: franceschi@pasadena-dc.bofa.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: F-117 Gold Windows
Date: 25 Jan 93 08:30:02 PDT
Organization: Bank America Systems Engineering, Pasadena, CA

Regarding the comment on using reflective house window plastic sheet
to simulate the gold coating on the F-117.

I haven't tried it but it sounds like a good idea. But I have used
the sheeting on my house windows and have a comment.

The plastic must be applied to a **flat** surface or else air pockets
will show between the window and the plastic sheeting.

The sheeting has a clear protective plastic that must be peeled off.
The window is wetted with water and a drop of detergent. Next, peel
off the protective plastic and apply the covering to the plastic.

When I applied the sheeting to my house windows, I thought I had
"screwed up". I could barely see through the windows and it looked
like a real mess. But after a couple of days, the water evaporated
out from between the window and the sheeting, and the windows still
look fine after 12 years.

If you try this, give the F-117 windows a week to dry before you
evaluate whether or not this technique works.

Good luck,

Fred Franceschi
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: thorn@phoenix.radonc.unc.edu (Jesse Thorn)
Subject: Re: Clear finishes
Organization: Radiation Oncology, NCMH/UNC, Chapel Hill, NC
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 17:15:11 GMT


Folks in my model club use automotive lacquers for clear gloss
finishes on their models.

-Jesse
From: ss@wpi.WPI.EDU (Scott Streeter)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Klingon Bird of Prey
Date: 26 Jan 93 08:41:56
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA 01609-2280
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpi.wpi.edu
In-reply-to: assaf@acad2.alaska.edu's message of Mon, 25 Jan 1993 14:29:33 GMT

>>>>> On Mon, 25 Jan 1993 14:29:33 GMT, assaf@acad2.alaska.edu said:

assaf> I have been trying to find a decent model of the Klingon Bird
assaf> of Prey.  The only one available is in the AMT/ERTL kit and it
assaf> is trash. While reading some the posts on the Enterprise
assaf> someone mentioned a scratch built Bird of Prey.  Could someone
assaf> tell me which magazine and issue.  I am also looking for a
assaf> decent Excelsior and Reliant.  Could someone please help

There were 2 seperate articles in Fine Scale Modeller on how to
scratch build a BoP. Now Star Tech in Texas has one, but it's about
$75. They have a Reliant for about $85 and an Excelsior for over $100
I think. E-mail me if yu want the address. I don't have it right
now...


--
 Scott Streeter                             Visit the Star Wars Archive at
 ss@wpi.wpi.edu                             wpi.wpi.edu       130.215.24.1
From: augustho@aludra.usc.edu (August Horvath)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: KIT REVIEW: Arii 1/72 Beech V35 Bonanza
Date: 21 Jan 1993 20:58:47 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

KIT REVIEW - Arii 1/72 Beechcraft V35 Bonanza, Kit #A703-300

Being interested in diversifying my 1/72 collection beyond
the usual fighters and bombers, I was gratified to notice
Arii's Bonanza kit on the shelf, and at $2.99, the price was
right.  I don't know if this is a new kit, but it isn't
widely known so I thought I'd review it for anyone on the
newsgroup who might be interested in small-scale general-av
types.

The Arii Bonanza consists of 34 opaque parts, plus 7 clear
parts and a 3-piece display stand molded in dark blue.  The
parts are not quite molded in white; they're actually a very
pale blue-grey, noticeable enough that the model should be
painted white.  The surface detail is finely inscribed and
restrained, with the corrugated control surfaces well
rendered.  There was quite a bit of flash on the kit I
bought, especially around the antennae.

Cockpit detail is good, with a floor, an instrument panel,
two separate control wheels and five nicely rendered seats.
Some more detail should be added on the inside of the
fuselage walls, but a nice cockpit (considering the scale)
can be done without too much trouble.  The parts fit pretty
well.  The windows and windscreen, predictably, are a bit
thick, tending to distort the view of the interior, so
making acetate replacements is a good idea.

The instructions contain clear diagrams, which is fortunate
because the text is almost entirely in Japanese.  The only
advice offered in English takes the form of some often
misspelled and always unhelpful comments such as, "CEMMENT
PARTS RIGHTLY."

The worst thing about the kit is the decal sheet, which
bears little resemblance to the box art and even less
resemblance to the Beech factory paint scheme.  The fuselage
striping is totally wrong, and the N-numbers are done in a
strange font unlike anything that will be seen on a
production aircraft.  The decal sheet also provides a
misspelled placard ("BEECHECRAFT") for the display stand.  I
can't comment on the adherence or other qualities of the
decals, which I did not even contemplate using on the kit.

Despite the useless decals, the Arii 1/72 Bonanza is a very
nice kit that makes a handsome little model.  It is a member
of a series that also includes the Cessna 172 and Skymaster,
so I'll be watching to add more of these gen-av types to my
collection.

August Horvath <augustho@usc.edu>
From: rray@lookout.it.uswc.uswest.com (Randy J. Ray)
Subject: Re: F117 Gold windows
Organization: US WEST Communications, Inc. -- Denver, CO
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 20:49:38 GMT

In article <1jp4iuINN7ub@hp-col.col.hp.com>, danl@col.hp.com (Daniel Lockhart) writes:
> Has anyone done any gold windows such are used on the F117?  I'm
> about to waterdown some gold paint and airbrush them, just want to
> check on other ways first.

I would be inclined to think that heavily-thinned Tamiya Clear Yellow would
be the best approach. I remember Verlinden explaining in "The Verlinden
Way III" how they simulated the tinted windows on an S-3A Viking by airbrushing
gloss clear laquer tainted with a few drops of India Ink.

Randy
-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Randy J. Ray -- U S WEST IT/CSD                 rray@lookout.it.uswc.uswest.com
                                                           Phone: (303)595-2852
"It's not denial. I'm just very selective about the reality I accept." --Calvin
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: gse@ida.liu.se (Goran Sedvall)
Subject: Re: F117 Gold windows
Organization: CIS Dept, Univ of Linkoping, Sweden
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 08:18:53 GMT

danl@col.hp.com (Daniel Lockhart) writes:

>Has anyone done any gold windows such are used on the F117?  I'm
>about to waterdown some gold paint and airbrush them, just want to
>check on other ways first.

>thanks
>daniel

I think Gunze Sangyo have transparant gold paint and it is buffable too.
But I'm not 100% sure.

Goran
From: akwong@gundam.Eng.Sun.COM (Anthony Wong)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: Re: Whither Lunar Models?
Date: 26 Jan 1993 01:48:49 GMT
Organization: Sun
NNTP-Posting-Host: gundam

In article <hall-250193153903@halftone.mv.us.adobe.com> hall@adobe.com (Ed Hall) writes:
>The latest address and numbers I have are (these are about 6 months old):
>
>    Lunar Models
>    5040 Grisham #102
>    Rowlett, Texas 75088
>
>    phone: (214) 475-4230
>      fax: (214) 475-4984
>
>Thanks,
>
>Ed Hall
Well here is the latest from their flier.....

LUNAR MODELS
106 Century Dr.
Celburne, Tx 76031
(817) 556-0296

Seems before/during/after the move they lost many of their files on the
computer.

Here is a summary of their flier before you ask....

Rocketship XM		$139.95
The Crawling Eye	$174.95
Jupiter 2 - 24"		$150.95 (sale)
Rocky Jones		$69.95

ALEX figure w/base	$109.95

CenterFold Girl		$99.95

STAR TREK:
Bridge Update		$54.95
Pilot Conversion 1st	$24.95
Pilot Conversion 2nd	$24.95
TV Conversion		$24.95

Future releases:
1/8th scale LIS figure
Attack of 50ft woman
Commando Cody
Republic Robot
Angry Red Planet creatures
1/72nd Gemini 12 launch site

** Disclaimer....not related to Lunar Models, not really a satisfied customer.**
From: danl@col.hp.com (Daniel Lockhart)
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
Subject: F117 Gold windows
Date: 22 Jan 1993 15:41:18 GMT
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpcsqm.col.hp.com

Has anyone done any gold windows such are used on the F117?  I'm
about to waterdown some gold paint and airbrush them, just want to
check on other ways first.

thanks
daniel

Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: spiff@netcom.com (Mark Schumann)
Subject: Re: Klingon Bird of Prey
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 16:38:59 GMT

In article <SS.93Jan26084156@wpi.WPI.EDU> ss@wpi.WPI.EDU (Scott Streeter) writes:
>There were 2 seperate articles in Fine Scale Modeller on how to
>scratch build a BoP. Now Star Tech in Texas has one, but it's about
>$75. They have a Reliant for about $85 and an Excelsior for over $100
>I think. E-mail me if yu want the address. I don't have it right
>now...
>
IMHO, the commerically available BOP resin kit bites.  The proportions 
are wrong, and the detailing is non-existant.  Fortunately, I got to 
examine one of these kits at a con before I bought one.

As for the $100+ Excelsior kit, well, it bites.  A friend of mine bought
one, and assembled it, and we immediately realized the following: The
modeller based all his detailing and proportions on the one 3/4 view of
the Excel from STIII.  Therefore, if you only look at it from a 3/4 view,
it looks fine.  But if you look at it from any other angle, errors appear.
Such as: The phaser banks on the top and bottom of the primary hull dont
line up, like they're supposed to.  Like: the primary hull and connecting
dorsal dont line up properly in the back.  Like: The warp engines are about
a foot too short.  And more.

Unfortunately, the best proportioned and best detailed models of the BOP and
Excel out there are the lead minitures FASA produced.  The BOP is excellent
in proportion and detail, while the Excel is ok in detail but the correct
proportions.

If you want larger models than these, pick up the back issues of FSM and
scratchbuild them.  IMHO.


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- 	Mark Schumann			-	"Out here on the perimeter    -
- 	spiff@netcom.com		-		there are no stars    -
-  Conqueror of the Cosmos and the 	-	Out here we is stoned -	      -
-  	Endpoint of History	 	-		immaculate."	      -
-					-			-J. Morrison  -
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.models.scale
From: d88-jli@nada.kth.se (Jouni Lindqvist)
Subject: Gulf war carrier ships
Keywords: Carrier ships
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 14:44:09 GMT

Hi again!

Does anyone know if there is plastic Model of any carrier ship or any other
ship that was involved in in the Gulf War equipped with Tomahawk missiles
and the right versions of F-14, F-18 etc ... ?

That is, carrier ships the way they were in the Gulf war.

Jouni Lindqvist.


Newsgroups: rec.models.scale