HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: IS30124@OTAGO.AC.NZ
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Re: Desired deafness in offspring
Date: 5 Nov 92 22:17:00 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: DEAF-L%SIUCVMB.BITNET@pucc.Princeton.EDU
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Perhaps because the baby will grow up with the same perspective of deafness as
the mother? I'm not too sure of that. Or that the mother understands how she
can help the baby cope with deafness?
They are only attempts to answer your question.
Cheers,
Barry Kirkland.
IS30124@otago.ac.nz
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
From: amm1428@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Subject: Re: Survey for Gallaudet Graduate Class
Reply-To: amm1428@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 01:46:24 GMT

In article <01GQYRHDZYTE8WZ0UV@gallua.bitnet>, 11CWATT@GALLUA.BITNET (Keith Watt - Gallaudet Dept. of Education) writes:
>Hello everyone -
>
>   This is a survey I developed as part of a requirement for a class I'm
>taking here at Gallaudet.  I thought it might be interesting to post it
>here as well and see what kind of responses I get from the net.  If there
>is enough interest, I'll post summaries of the results after the project is
>finished.  Your responses will kept in strictest confidence (I'll remove the
>headers as soon as they come across the net).  There are only three
>questions, and really only two that require any thought.  Let me know your
>thoughts!
>
>Thanks,
>Keith
>
>==============================================================================
>
>DIRECTIONS:  Please answer the questions which apply to your hearing status.
>Please be as specific about your feelings and/or concerns as possible.
>
>
>1. Where did you attend high school? (Choose one)
>x  - Public high school with no special services
>   - Public high school with special services (such as notetakers,
>      interpreters, etc.) but never in self-contained special ed class
>   - Self-contained special education class (full- or part-time)
>   - Day program at school for the deaf
>   - Residential program at school for the deaf
>   - Other (please describe)
>
>
>If you are hearing:
>
>2.  How would you feel about attending a residential school for the deaf your
>    entire four years of high school?
>
>
>3.  How do you think the deaf students would and/or should feel about your
>    attending their school?
>
>
>
>If you are deaf or hard-of-hearing:
>
>2. How would you feel about a hearing student attending a residential school
>   for the deaf for his or her entire four years of high school?
>
>  It really doesn't bother me.
>3. How do you think the hearing students would and/or should feel about their
>   attending your school?
	Uncomfortable at first, then becomes very interesting to interact with
them. Soon, they'll be begging for more communtications....

-Anthony
From: askwersk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Re: 60 Minutes, Angels and Outcasts, etc
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:56:01 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
              10 Nov 92 14:35:25 -0500. <9211102045.AA14499@Athena.MIT.EDU>

Lets get something straight here about cochlear implants effectiveness:


It should NOT depend on anything other than the nature and extent of the
child's deafness. The family scene has NO impact on how well the implant
works. It could be a poor, rich, deaf, hearing, white, black family, but it all
comes down to the person who is actually getting the implant.

In my opinion, the only affect that the family has is whether or not the child
gets an implant. This sometimes turns out the be ONLY reason why the child
gets the implant (because a parent so desires it).

I once talked with Harlan Lane, and I asked him if he was against implants.
He said that no, he wasnt against implants, he was against putting them in
people who didnt have the power to choose. This includes deaf children since
they dont full comprehension of what the decision means.

Now I can understand the parent wanting to implant as soon as possible
because the child learns so much when it is young, but I can understand
that a parent could also be misled about whether to implant or not.

My suggestion is to get multiple *objective* opinions from both clinics AND any
some sort of community lab. I was tested at MIT and they told me an implant
would not do me any good.


Adam Skwersky
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
From: fak9957@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Frank Kruppenbacher)
Subject: Re: Close Caption Decoder
Reply-To: fak9957@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 14:20:04 GMT

In article <DEAF-L%92110315490901@SIUCVMB.BITNET>, 
/PN=BRENDA.L.MONENE/O=DEAFTEK/ADMD=TELEMAIL/C=US/@SPRINT.COM writes:

>Zenith has had T.V. Decoders built into their sets for a year now.  You can
>see them in any shop that carries Zenith T.V.
>
>Brenda

I learned from one deaf person who bought this TV that it broke down about a
month after he got it.

I also found out that stores are not aware that Zenith has this kind of TV
available.  Apparently, this model is sold with or without the built-in
decoder.

From my point of view, Zenith should be commended for being the first and so
far the only major TV manufacturer to sell a decoder-ready TV. However, I am
not crazy about the larger caption font size.  Plus the non-smooth roll-up
captions bother my eyes. Finally, the yellow-colored captions to indicate
emphasis on particular words takes some getting used to.

fk

Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 16:35:50 GMT
From:         Bosco Keown <keown@VNET.IBM.COM>
Subject:      deaf wish

Ref:  Stephen Kotchen's posting of Tue, 10 Nov 1992 10:56:30 EST

>  I am second to Joseph.  I am tired of Lew's and Bosco's pervert. I am
>truly sick of the Cochlear Madness.  Deaf people have accomphish with
>Their life.  They still don't get it yet.  I guess they are perfectly
>example "Deafphobia".  I am in hurrying now and will lecture on this
>issue soon.
>
>--Stephen Kotchen

Mr. Kotchen -- this is periliously close to a personal attack, and
has no rational basis. I was expressing an opinion which was nothing
to do with "Cochlear Madness", and I do not have the slightest phobia
of Deaf people. I may have a thing about babies, wishing for them to
be perfectly healthy, but let's not call it perversion.

The *real* perversion is in *wanting* an unborn child to be deaf.


Bosco.

Bosco Keown,
CICS/6000 Development,         | VNET     : KEOWN at WINVMC
IBM UK Laboratories, Ltd.,     | IBMIPNET : keown@harpo.hursley.ibm.com
Hursley Park,                  | Internet : keown@vnet.ibm.com
Winchester, England.           | BITNET   : KEOWN at VNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
From: pepper@shell.portal.com (Angelique N Wahlstedt)
Subject: Re: deaf wish
Organization: Portal Communications Company -- 408/973-9111 (voice) 408/973-8091 (data)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:31:26 GMT

In article <DEAF-L%92111012363119@SIUCVMB.BITNET> Omer Zak <XLACHA1@WEIZMANN.WEIZMANN.AC.IL> writes:
>I agree that it is perverted to wish that your own child which is born
>to you and your spouse be deaf.

>If you and your spouse are Deaf, what would you rather adopt?  A normally
>hearing child or a deaf child?

I don't know if it's perverted to want your baby to be deaf, though I
certainly would consider it *perverted* to want my baby to be, say,
mentally retarded. (For some reason, I've always considered deafness
and disability to be mutally exclusive subjects. Yes, I know that deaf
people have a weensy-teensy problem communicating with "hearies", but
what the heck. :-)

But if I want to adopt a child, I definitely would like to adopt a deaf
kid. For one thing, I'd have an easier time communicating with a deaf kid
than a hearing kid. And since I've been deaf all my life, I certainly am
more qualified than a hearing parent (who has never had any experience with
deaf people) to raise a deaf kid.

-- Ms. Pepper

--
                    Angeli "Ms. Pepper" Wahlstedt
 
Portal: ms-pepper@cup.portal.com
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 23:13:00 CDT
From:         CONLEY%MSUVX2@MEMSTVX1.BITNET
Subject:      Re:60 Minutes

        Hello gang!

>From:         "(Tilak Ratnanather)" <tratnana@EUREKA-GOLD.WBME.JHU.EDU>

>Can anyone who watched the '60 Minutes' documentary this
>evening (Nov 8th 1992) on the controversy of cochlear
>implants please advise me on how to get the transcripts
>of the program. I am told that CBS offer a transcript
>service.

>As I missed the program, I am not in a position to
>comment on it. However, from what I have heard from
>my friend I have to say that the NAD must find a
>better and more rational argument against cochlear
>implants for deaf children. To say that the doctors
>go for it because they want the dollars is an insult
>to the dedicated otolaryngologists in the United States
>and abroad.

>Regards

>Tilak

          I saw this '60 Minutes', unfortunately didn't record it,
        but wished I had.  Tilak, maybe you can call your local
        CBS Station affiliate and ask them for the address to get
        transcripts.
          As I said, I saw the show and personally found it to be
        rather influencing to me.  I have always been a strong
        believer in A.S.L. and the Deaf culture and I will continue
        to be; I have learned things that only 'special' hearing
        people, like myself, simply because I "stuck with it"
        and learned and continue to learn sign,  and with
        this experience I've found a rich and interestingly
        different culture; one that continues to fascinate me.
          As for the cochlear implants, the article was about a young girl,
        who lost her hearing at 3 (?) from an attack of meningitis (sp).
        Her parents, to say the least, were devastated, (which, IMHO,
        is narrow-mindedness). (Sorry, I'll stop flaming now).
        Anyway, the show continued with an analysis of how the implant
        is surgically implanted and what all is involved, including
        finances costing up to $20K.  Anyhow, "To make a long story short",
        at the end of the article, the interviewer asked the girl,
        if she had it all to do again, would she decide to
        get an implant or not........she replied, that she would.
          For my own safety and well-being, I will not flame as to my
        personal beliefs about this issue; I see pro's and con's
        on both sides; cochlear implants or Deaf culture?  Who decides?

                                  Opening those proverbial "can o' worms",
                                  Any comments?
                                  Bye for now.
                                  Steven Conlee
                                  CONLEY@MEMSTVX1.MEMST.EDU
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:51:50 -0500
From:         "(Sergio Martinez)" <xta@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject:      deaf wish

Is it just me, or am I the only one who keeps misreading the "deaf wish"
that keeps popping up on subject lines lately as "death wish" ?

:)  :)  :)  :)

Not that this is a reflection of any kind on the contents of those particular
posts.

Sergio E. Martinez
From: riolo@COR4.PICA.ARMY.MIL (Joseph P. Riolo)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Re: deaf wish
Date: 11 Nov 92 00:45:29 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

Omer,

      Please do not judge people by how they wish for their children.
Wishing is one thing.  Making your wish come true is other thing.  I
oppose any man-made efforts to make your wish come true.  For example,
I oppose any genetic selection that will allow parents to have deaf
child by looking for eggs and sperms that have genes for deafness.
I oppose the idea that parents who want deaf children can give up
hearing children for adoption just because they are not deaf.

      Is it wrong for parents to wish to have hearing children?  No.
But, is it wrong for parents to give up deaf child for adoption just
because their wish has not been fulfilled?  I would like to know
your answer to this question.  Say in the future, a test is developed
that will let parents know if a baby inside womb is deaf or hearing.
If baby is deaf, they will have an option of aborting it just like
what has been happening to baby with Down's Syndrome.  Do you oppose
this testing?  Do you think that it is ok for parents to have this
kind of test so that their wish can be fulfilled?

      Wishing is just playing with ideas in your mind, making an
image of world you want to live in.  When a wish involves children,
parents must understand that they must accept children regardless
of whether wish comes true or not.

      Wishing is one thing.  Trying to fulfill your wish via man-made
or artificial means is other thing.

                                        Joseph P. Riolo
                                        <riolo@pica.army.mil>
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sat, 7 Nov 1992 14:48:02 EST
From:         "Cathy Brandt" <CBRAN00@UKCC.UKY.EDU>
Subject: Re: Remarks from the teacher
              5 Nov 1992 15:12:47 EST from <LND%NIHCU.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>

On Thu, 5 Nov 1992 15:12:47 EST Paul Daniels said:
>Since you had mention about many parents from other county trying to
>enroll their kids into your county program for the Deaf, what's wrong
>with Kentucky School for the Deaf, which is located in Danville, not

I am very familiar with KSD.  There are so{me very fine educators and admin-
istrators there.  However, the education program is somewhat diff{erent than
what we offere here in Fayette C{ounty.  These parents want the child to live
at ho{me and not attend a residential school.  Also, the parents{ want the
child to{ be in a strong Signed{ English program.  Therefore, this is the
program wher{e they feel their child's needs can best be met.

Cathy - teacher of children who are dissapointed Clinton won the election.

O{.k{.  I agree, my viewpoints ARE rubbing off{ on these kids.  But, even my
co{-teacher who voted Clinton said I did an excellent job at being unb{iased in
my presentation of that unit and lessons{!                               {
                                                                           {
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 10:23:21 -0500
From:         Cynthia Clark <cclark@CNRI.RESTON.VA.US>
Subject:      Re: Bio of a Bit Basher
              05 Nov 92 18:57:27 GMT." <9211051932.aa23838@CNRI.Reston.VA.US>

Mike Heney> DEAF ACTIVITIES:  I participate with my wife in MCAD (Montgomery
 County
Mike Heney>                   Association of the Deaf) Activities.  We're the
 only
Mike Heney>                   two hearing folks in the MCAD bowling league.
 Also
Mike Heney>                   worked on the MCAD Haunted Woods astour guides
 this past
Mike Heney>                   Halloween, and attended the party (440 people, 95%
 deaf!).


Mike,

Welcome aboard !

If you are referring to the Halloween party at
Clarksburg, Maryland, I was there, too !!  Well, I was
one of a few last people leaving the party, I heard
it was way over 600 people !!  It was a huge success!
It was one of the "most talked about party of the year".
I'd wish to congratulate these people whoever did
organize that event.

They gave out 20 (or 15?) prizes for these costumes.
I actually won a prize as "a friendliest ghost in town"-
I wore the ghost white mask which did GLOW during the whole evening.

My other deaf brother, Kevin, also won a prize as the
"tallest guy in the whole world" with a serious spooky mask -
over eight feet tall ! He had "a special machine" that
could make himself shrink down to a normal size and then
increase his height up to eight feet tall.  It was really spooky
especially when you turn around finding him very tall instantly
like a boom.  Ha, ha, ha

Cynthia Clark
A born-deaf Reader
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Subject: (no subject given)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 14:41:33 EDT
From:         6751T534@KENTVM.BITNET

I am a hearing person and was wondering how much those who are deaf rely
completely on lipreading?  Also, is there any way those people with hearing
can help make the deaf understand better what they are saying?




jennifer
6751t534@kentvm
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Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 19:44:55 -0500
Comments:     Warning -- RSCS tag indicates an origin of 11SRUST@GALLUA1
From:         "Scott A. Rust" <11SRUST@GALLUA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Telnet address at Gallaudet

        I should also add, Notes is not an e-mail discussion group as we
know it here in DEAF-L land. The Notes is similar to groups like
rec.humor, misc.computers, soc.religion.christian and rec.nude where you
can post to the group, but it doesn't reply to you. It doesnt send the
post to everyone on a "subscribers" list. For lack of a better
description, you "log" into notes, read the topic directory, choose the
one you think will be interesting and jump in.

        Scott
        11srust@gallua.gallaudet.edu
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Subject: (no subject given)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 14:21:06 EDT
From:         Jennifer <6751T534@KENTVM.BITNET>

Hello!  I am a sophomore speech pathology and audiology major at Kent State Uni
versity in Kent, OH.  I subscribed to this list first of all for a class and se
condly to get a better feel for the needs and concerns I should be aware of in
helping the deaf.  I chose this field because my aunt is deaf and I have always
 been amazed at what she has accomplished in her life especially since they tol
d my grandmother she would not turn out to achieve much of anything.  Can't wai
t to hear from all of you!

                                       Jennifer Tarle
                                   6751t534@kentvm



P.S. If anyone has another list I could subscribe to I would greatly appreciate
 the details and hopefully directions.
From: LND@NIHCU.BITNET (Paul Daniels)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Re: Remarks from the teacher
Date: 5 Nov 92 20:12:47 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

Since you had mention about many parents from other county trying to
enroll their kids into your county program for the Deaf, what's wrong
with Kentucky School for the Deaf, which is located in Danville, not
far from where your school is located? I had figured that this school
has not met many parents's expectation, so they prefer to send their
to mainstreamed schools over KY School for the Deaf. I do agree with you
about Bush's voucher idea to allow parents to choose best school program
for their kids. This should help many schools to improve their programs
to compete with better schools. This would hit KY School for the Deaf and
force them to upgrade their program. I am aware of this school since I
lived in Louisville, while I went to a Jefferson County high school over
20 years ago.
             Paul Daniels <LND@NIHCU.BITNET>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 10:56:30 EST
From:         "Stephen J. Kotchen" <CASK@CATCC.BITNET>
Subject:      deaf wish

Lew and Bosco

  I am second to Joseph.  I am tired of Lew's and Bosco's pervert. I am
truly sick of the Cochlear Madness.  Deaf people have accomphish with
Their life.  They still don't get it yet.  I guess they are perfectly
example "Deafphobia".  I am in hurrying now and will lecture on this
issue soon.

--Stephen Kotchen


> Ref:  Joseph's posting  of Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:21:11 EST
>
> >It is just sad - very sad - that you continue to think that deafness is one
> >of the causes of these problems and that deafness is an added burden to a
> >person who has it, family, and society.  But, again, you have the right
> >to think the way you want to think.  You have the right to set up your
> >system of values to guide your thoughts and life.  I do likewise.  So...
> >live and let live.
> >
> >                                        Joseph P. Riolo
> >                                        <riolo@pica.army.mil>
>
> The real sadness, Joseph, is in wishing for a *baby* to be
> born deaf. You are talking about a *person*, by which I assume
> you mean an *adult* who has overcome the burden of deafness.
> However much you deny it, deafness *is* a burden. Moreover,
> we all know that this burden can be overcome, even to the point
> where it is no longer too much of a burden, but this is not
> the point Lew is getting at. He is talking about a *baby* that
> is just beginning life. There is a good chance that the child will
> sail through life if it has perfect hearing and will be able to fit
> into both the hearing and Deaf world. So why feel the need to confine
> the child only to the Deaf world by wishing it is born deaf? It
> makes absolutely no sense at all.
>
> I can't think of a worse thought than for a parent to wish for
> a deaf child. I'm sorry, but it absolutely, utterly sickens me that Deaf
> people should be so selfish that they want to create children
> that fit their own image and culture, to the exclusion of others.
>
> I've rewritten this posting a copule of times...the originals
> were unprintable, even in rot13. :-) But this topic is very sensitive,
> and it does arouse a great deal of passion and anger in people.
>
> Bosco.
>
> Bosco Keown,
> CICS/6000 Development,         | VNET     : KEOWN at WINVMC
> IBM UK Laboratories, Ltd.,     | IBMIPNET : keown@harpo.hursley.ibm.com
> Hursley Park,                  | Internet : keown@vnet.ibm.com
> Winchester, England.           | BITNET   : KEOWN at VNET
From: IS30124@OTAGO.AC.NZ
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Going off soon.
Date: 5 Nov 92 03:01:00 GMT
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X-Envelope-to: deaf-l%siucvmb.bitnet@cunyvm.cuny.edu
X-VMS-To: IN%"deaf-l@siucvmb.bitnet"
X-VMS-Cc: IS30124

Dear Everyone,
I will be getting off DEAF-L sometime next week as I am leaving Dunedin to
work in Wellington for the university holidays. I don't know if the computing
services centre here will expire my usercode or I catch the train to
Christchurch (then by plane to Wellington) first. Either way, I will be sorry
to miss reading the postings of DEAF-L.
Thank you everyone for the contribution, big or small, you have made to DEAF-L.
I have enjoyed DEAF-L. If anyone wants me to comment on any issue before I go
off DEAF-L, I will be glad to do so. Perhaps I will get back onto DEAF-L next
year when I do my fourth year of commerce honours studies.
I hope that people on DEAF-L have found my postings informative and
 interesting.Cheers,
Barry Kirkland.
IS30124@OTAGO.AC.NZ
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