From: lbarrass@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Mormons are not Christians
Date: 6 Oct 92 16:42:00 GMT
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

Gordon Banks writes in reply to my original posting

> So you are saying that anyone who rejects the virgin birth, for example,
> rejects God and therefore, despite any other profession of
> faith in Jesus (even as God) and throwing one's self on His mercy,
> is invalid, and that person is not a Christian?

  If you reject the virgin birth, you are rejecting a SINLESS saviour. To reject
Jesus as sinless, you are rejecting His ability to be a perfect sacrifice
without blemish.
 
>>        d) A Christian is somebody who: 
>>           - accepts that they are in a sinful state and are separated from
>>             God because of sin.
>>           - believes that Jesus was crucified, buried and raised from the
>>             dead thus breaking the law of sin and death.
>>           - believes that the only forgiveness for sin is through the blood
>>             shed upon the cross. That forgiveness is complete for those who 
>>             have accepted the free gift of grace from God.
>>           - believes we are save by grace through faith, and not by works. No 
>>             person can do anything in their own right to rid themselves of  
>>             the burden of sin. Being baptised, joining a group or following
>>             certain laws cannot save a person.
>>           - believes that when a person accepts Jesus as Lord, the Holy
>>             Spirit (who is God) dwells within them.
> 
> I know quite a few Mormons who would agree with this, although they
> don't use the protestant rhetoric.  This really isn't objectionable,
> although it isn't the emphasis I would use.  I would also remind you of
> the moral walk that Jesus emphasized as being critical
> to religion.  I recognize Paul downplayed that side of it somewhat.
> I think that Jesus would be a bit upset with so many Christians
> of today thinking of religion almost totally in terms of their
> own personal salvation and forgetting too often their
> Christian duties vis-a-vis their neighbor.


  My guess is that those Mormons you know who believe _all_ of these things are
believing different meanings to commonly held expressions. See the rest of my
original post regarding definitions. Do these Mormons believe in grace only or
grace AND works???


> 
>>           - has given their life "lock, stock and barrel" to Jesus!
> 
> 
> I truly doubt that there are many Christians then.  I don't know
> anyone that has really done this, though many may say they have.

  Yes, well we will only really know at judgement won't we!! Being a Christian
doesn't mean instant (or even gradual) perfection in this life. I believe that
I have given my life lock,stock and barrel to Jesus, but I still make mistakes,
I know I am still holding things back - but I ask God to show me what. I am
saved by grace through faith - and no more..

                                            
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                                               []   2Chron 7:14
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lbarrass@phillip.edu.au                     Lindsay     
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Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc