HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nancy@genie.slhs.udel.edu (Nancy Lebovitz)
Subject: Re: spoiler?
Organization: UDel, School of Life & Health Sciences
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 21:10:34 GMT

In article <1h17egINNfea@flash.pax.tpa.com.au> anon.30@pax.tpa.com.au writes:
>
[....]

>we think we know some more of why we are so scared.  we wrote poem to mother
>and sent it to her.  and we wrote letter to high school about being sexually
>abused there & sent it to th em.  and we wrote letter to Ellen Bass saying how
>invalidating to people who were sexually abused by women her intro to 
>_I Never Told Anyone_ is, and we sent it.  maybe we're scared from all that.
>
Maybe? I'd be fucking terrified.

>and we're scared of our friends and we're scared of having friends and we're
>scared of being multiple and we're scared of being friends with multiples and
>we just really scared and I keep thinking about doing bad things to myself and
>I don't want to do them but can anybody tell me what I'm supposed to do instead?
>because I really don't know.  help please.

My best guess is to pay attention to the fear--maybe write or draw about it.
If you've got anything comfortable/pleasant/nurturing you can do for 
yourself, do it. 

>we tried calling one friend.  that didn't work.  but we arne' close tot him
>anyway and it was particially talking to him that got us upset in the first
>place because we feel real ambivalent about that relationship and he was 
>trying to get us to commit with spending time with him before the vacation
>and we dont' want to and we don't want to say that we don't want to spend 
>time with him because that isn't necessarily true, we dno
>' tkow sorry soryr
>sorry 
>
>ireallyhatemyselfsometimes
>
>ireally shouldj't say that
>but we do 

Telling the truth is always a good start.

>maybe we don't whave to be in college.  maybe that would be okay.  we don't 
>know.  we are really really sorry we really want to hurt self and we keep 
>not doing it but we don't know how long we can and we are afraid to wake
>friend up and we wish housemate would get home -- but the thing is -- we don't
>really think that having any people here would actually help.  but I still
>don't know what to do.

Paying attention to your breathing and posting to asar seem like good
bets.

>and my throat hurts.  and my sinuses hurt from crying.  and i feel like a 
>failure.  i tought I could do it this semester and I was wrong and it has
>been really really hard and i feel so bad but it isn't me that is bad it
                                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
>is what was done with me, all that stuff I won't let myself remember
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Jackpot! Bingo! Yes-yes-yes!

[details of abuse deleted]

>we don't know what happened or if anything did but we think something did and
>we dont' want to know we don't want to remember.

I think something happened, too. I am very sorry that you're suffering so.

Nancy Lebovitz
nancy@genie.slhs.udel.edu
From: anon-1506@twwells.com
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Introducing myself
Date: 19 Dec 92 16:46:15 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com

I read asar once, a long time ago.  I got burned by the flamewars and I left,
but I've come back to give it another try.  I'm not sure if it's a good 
idea or not, but here I am...  This place was once very helpful to me.  I 
hope it can be again.


For now, just sign me
Someone Out There



--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for an automatically returned help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: krikket@meltdown.chi.il.us (D. 'krikket' Krick)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Abandonment *Spoiler*
Date: 13 Dec 92 20:31:30 CST
Organization: The Meltdown - A Team Star BBS

More rambelings of a general nature that need a

***SPOILER WARNING***

attached...

Shit.  I feel fucking abandoned right now.  Yesterday I turned to my mom again,
this time via a typed up letter (its easier for me to write on the computer
than via hand).  Got yet more of a "well, nothing is wrong.  You're imagining
things" reaction.  Bullshit nothing is wrong.  I can't sleep right, my emotions
and thoughts are a giant turmoil, I have started feeling suicidal again... 
Somethings wrong all right!  Just because I'm interested in finding the cause
rather than trying to ignore the problem and hope it will go away...

Fuck that shit.

There are some friends of mine who have stated repeatedly that if I need a
place to turn to, I can go there anytime.  Period.

Well, I needed to turn to someone today.  Just felt like shit in general,
nothing specific, but the general stuff was becomming more than I could bare
alone...

Stopped by to see the first person, and she was out of town.  :(  Shit happens,
will see her later on.

Stopped by to see the 2nd person, and she was too fucking busy with her SO to
be bothered with me.  And I couldn't get out of the picture politely without
offending her mom (Mother and daughter live together, and I have a friendship
with both of 'em.  But I wasn't up to chatting with the Ma...  She doesn't know
the shit I've been facing.)  So I had to listen to her chatting my head off
about shit she knows I couldn't care less about...  :(

Tried to stop by the 3rd person's home, but I didn't know the exact adress... 
And no one was answering the phone.  Then I find out (after I get home, about
an hour away) they they were home, but the phone was taken off the wall
hook...)   :(

If I knew how to face this shit alone, I wouldn't be so bad off, but without
someone there to use as a bull board/whatever, I can't quite get in touch with
the release valve for my emotions.  :(

I just want to crawl into some corner and die quietly, where my decomposing
body won't be a bother to anyone...  This shit isn't worth it!


Krikket (a.k.a. Doug Krick)  ---  krikket@meltdown.chi.il.us
#include<std.disclaimers>    ---  an294@anon.penet.fi

   "Gone serious and shy, and they can't figure out why."
                --Suzanne Vega "Bad Wisdom"
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew Fields)
Subject: Re: SPOILER: My Story (long)
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 20:40:21 GMT

Thank you, Scott, for some very clear testimony on what exactly we're dealing
with here.  For all those who JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND, let me put it in simple
terms, so I can take all the remaining risk instead of leaving it all on
Scott.

I will check for this article periodically, and if it gets cancelled, I will
resend it.

The balance of the testimony is that T.William Wells is criminally
insane, and is using ASAR both as a source of therapy and as a way to
express his power issues, at the expense of the perceived privacy and
safety of other survivors of sexual abuse.

Because of the anarchical structure of USENET, it is extremely difficult to
send him off line.

However, most newsreaders implement KILL files (get a sysop to teach you
how to make one for your system) which allow you to skip objectionable
messages based on sequences of characters in the messages and/or the
message header.

I have tested the following unix rn commands in a Kill file, and found them
an effective way of cutting out all but indirect references to Wells and
his service:

/tww/a:=:j
/Bill Wells/a:=:j

By this technical means, it may be possible to limit the damage done by Mr.
Wells;  network action at his upline site may be more effective.  I don't
know of any way of convincing him to stop net-administrating and get treatment,
nor do I know of any way to force him to do so, although somebody with better
legal connections might have some ideas.

The issues raised by Ed Carp's standing here and by Kenn Frankel's
misdeeds do not in any way denigrate the importance of Scott Kelley's
testimony, nor of Darella's testimony from last summer.

Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@stein.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: Dear Sir/Madam:
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 20:53:17 GMT

anon-1489@twwells.com writes:

>Dear Sir/Madam:

>	I am very much intereseted in posting my situation in the 
>news group alt.sexual.abuse.recovery, and am also interested in 
>receiving responses from other subscribers.
>	Would you please let me know how to do it anonymously.

>Thanks for your help.

>Raj

raj -- you should probably read the section in the FAQ list (which should be at
your site by the time you read this) about anonymous posting services.  it is
section 1.2, near the top of the list.
-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
From: anon.30@pax.tpa.com.au
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: anon services
Date: 17 Dec 1992 01:52:13 +1030
Organization: PAX - Public Access Unix (Adelaide,South Australia) - Anonymous Service
Reply-To: anon.30@pax.tpa.com.au
NNTP-Posting-Host: flash.pax.tpa.com.au


This anon server is *considerably* faster than the others available...
my posts are showing up on ASAR within 1 or 2 hours of my sending them.
just for you alls information, since I know a lot of us [us meaning ASAR
folks] are looking around and using different anon services

us peoples


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** Anonymity & Privacy by PAX - Public Access Unix (Adelaide,South Australia) **

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Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@stein.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: asshole
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 18:43:04 GMT

anon-1280@twwells.com (Alaska) writes:

>From: anon-1383@twwells.com (Apple)
>>and Alaska, real nice post about Enigma.  

>oh myg od, i nevernevernerever meant to hurt anyone

we know that.  like enigma herself posted, it was *her* problem to deal with,
not a problem you thrust on her.

>>I nominate you for asshole of the month award.....

>yes youre right

no, apple's wrong.  wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong.  like the rest of us, you're
just trying to do your best.  i'd say "everyone makes mistakes," alaska, but i
really don't think you made any mistakes here.  who to believe: enigma, who
knows best what her own problems and their sources are, or apple, who doesn't
know either of you.  hm, i know whom i'd believe...

>>but I guess your brain gets frozen all the way up in Alaska....
>>that is where you are from I take it.

what a rude comment.

>no but thats where im goiing

come back soon, ok?  

><sob>

*hug* *hug* *hug* *hug* *hug* *hug*
-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cloister@stein.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Subject: Re: asshole
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 20:33:50 GMT

anon-1280@twwells.com (ReachingOut) writes:

>Alaska is ReachingOut to those who care, to those who don't judge,
>to those who don't blame, to those who support, to those who
>encourage, to those who hug.

ReachingOut, i reach out to you.  not all the hands are cold; some are warm and
friendly.  some want to help.  take the warm ones, let the icy blue hands be by
themselves.
-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
From: sonia@joliet.berkeley.edu (Sonia Marx)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: goodbye for now
Date: 14 Dec 92 18:54:20 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley

In article <Af85p9y00awVQXjVAb@andrew.cmu.edu> tm3j+@andrew.cmu.edu (Tariq Andre Mahadeo) writes:
>
>i don't know if anyone is actually going to bother to read this
>the way it seems now
>the only people left on asar
>only seem to concentrate on this aps/forgery mess
>
[stuff deleted...]
>
>tariq

Well, Tariq, (and the rest of you that have left or are thinking about
leaving), I'm still reading, and I skip any article having to do with this
mysterious flame war.  I don't even really know what it's about.  (And don't
want to, thanks!).  I don't respond much because I read from work, and don't
have the time.  But remember that the flame war will blow over, and this
group will go back to being supportive.  If you skip all the articles about
the war, it doesn't affect you...

Hugs to all who want them.

Oh yes, and Krikket?  Are you there?  I just wanted to say that you should
forgive yourself and go on.  I'm struggling with some similar memories, and
all I can say is that I think much more highly of someone who agonizes over
two long-ago incidents, than of the many abusers out there that rape and
murder and sow despair without ever caring or noticing.  You're okay!!

Sonia
From: anon-1489@twwells.com
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: none
Date: 14 Dec 92 20:10:35 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com

Dear Sir/Madam:

	I am very much intereseted in posting my situation in the 
news group alt.sexual.abuse.recovery, and am also interested in 
receiving responses from other subscribers.
	Would you please let me know how to do it anonymously.

Thanks for your help.

Raj



--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for an automatically returned help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: fields@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Matthew Fields)
Subject: Re: i get it now
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 21:50:37 GMT

In article <1992Dec9.131134.4679@penet.fi> an1749@anon.penet.fi writes:
>im really glad i got to see this stuff
>happen. now i know that this group isnt
>safe and will never be safe.

For what it's worth, the following line of ed code works fine when it appears
in a kill file, and has the effect of removing most references to twwells.com
from your input stream:

/tww/a:=:j


Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: cjohnson@lars.acc-admin.stolaf.edu (Carrie L Johnson)
Subject: Well, here i am, what now?
Organization: St. Olaf College; Northfield, MN
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 01:32:19 GMT

I posted an article in talk.rape a bit ago, to try to spark a little 
discussion (it of course didn't work) and was refered to this here 
news group. So, here i am.  I'm coming here, not to spark discussions but
to help myself along with my recovery.  I've come a long way so far but,
i have to admit any more help, and support is always welcome.

For those of you interested here's my story, and where i'm at.  

At the age of nine and male neighbor (17) began severly abusing me. After
awhile i told my parents, they chewed him up and it stopped.  We left town 
for a year then and after returning, it started all over again.  I blocked
most of these esperiences out until around a year ago and am getting to the 
point now where it's easy for me to talk about, and it doesn't bother me
that much anymore.

Later in my life (i'm19 now), i started dating a man much older then myself.
He turned out to be abusive in everyway possible, including sexually.  He
raped me violently three times and as fdar as I'm concerned everytime i 
slept with him it was rape, cause i never wanted it.

Since then, i have come out to the world as lesbian (i knew i was then too...
but).  I've had good relationships, and one with a womon who had been 
severly abused as well.  Both of us had problems with sex and in a way
used each other to "find love" that way everytime we slept together (her
more then myself).

Right now, I'm not involved in a relationship, though i wouldn't mind one.  My
only problem is sex scares the shit out of me. 

I've been trhough counseling and still am, and have a good grip on the
issues surronding my abuse.  The thing is, at times i find it popping up 
everywhere.  For example just a few days ago a male friend of mine was
extremly invasive with his touch, not so much as it was overwhlming,
but nevertheless it scared me to death.  Since then i have hardly let a single
person touch me.  

Sex scares me becuase i want it to be something i want, and enjoy, not 
something that i'm doing because i feel the other person needs it or 
would enjoy it.  

I dont' knwo i'm babbling, thanks for listening.....
respond if you care to but....if not thanks for reading...
it's good to talk about theses things sometimes 
though i'm very open about it and talk much about it...i don't talk
about how i feel much......

so thanks,
carrie l johnson

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Freedom is never voluntarily given by the opressor; it must be
demanded by the opressed"
                Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. in his book _Why We Can't Wait_
Be good to yourselves!                                 PRIDE=POWER
cjohnson@stolaf.edu                                    cjohnson@carleton.edu
ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE YOU JUST HAVE TO BELIEVE IT!
From: anon.31@pax.tpa.com.au
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Still Wondering
Date: 20 Dec 1992 09:38:08 +1030
Organization: PAX - Public Access Unix (Adelaide,South Australia) - Anonymous Service
Reply-To: anon.31@pax.tpa.com.au
NNTP-Posting-Host: flash.pax.tpa.com.au


Liam here again.

In article <1992Dec19.081257.26673@netcom.com>
hal@netcom.com (Hal Wine) says:

>>I'm having a hard time believing that I was sexually abused.  There was
>>abuse of other kinds--emotional starvation--but my parents were decidedly
>>non-physical.  I can't remember that they ever touched each other.
>>
>>The idea that either of them would physically abuse me in
>>any way just isn't consistent with my memories of them.
>
>I used to view my folks as "perfect", as I could never remember a
>fight or even raised words between them.  All their friends saw their
>marriage as "perfect".

Yes, I know how that is.  I used to feel guilty because everyone told
me how wonderful my parents were, and I thought there must be something
wrong with me because I didn't feel that way about them.

>My folks weren't publically affectionate.  (Public meaning outside of
>their bedroom -- maybe not even there.)  I didn't used to remember
>them doing anything to me.
>
>Now, though, I have remembered enough to know that my "ideal" parents
>weren't.  (Both of them abused me.)
>
>This may or may not be the case for you.  I just wanted to say that
>it's not uncommon for survivors to only remember good things about
>their perp.

At this point there's no way of knowing whether it's the case for me.
As has been pointed out here, there could be other reasons for my
aversion to being touched, and my rage when someone wakes me up. 
No one can really say; I'll just have to wait some more and see what
emerges as I continue therapy.  Frankly, I'd prefer not to learn that
I was sexually abused.  The emotional abuse was enough.

Incidentally, I can't seem to find a group that deals with the
residual effects of emotional abuse during childhood.  While it
may not be as traumatic as sexual abuse, it does leave some pretty
deep scars, and some decidedly inappropriate behavior patterns.
Maybe alt.support would support some discussion of this if I start
it out.  Any other suggestions?  I don't want to dilute the 
discussions in this group with stuff that's not relevant to its
principal purpose.

Liam


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Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: hal@netcom.com (Hal Wine)
Subject: Re: all me of us's wish list
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 06:27:37 GMT

In article <Bz4qKo.FAF@news.iastate.edu> N1.AAS@isumvs.iastate.edu (AZIZ SABRI) writes:
>Since working with multiples is a fairly new area in therapy, IMO it is
>unlikely a good therapist would suggest that you AREN'T multiple. If s/he is
>worth her/his license, s/he would be eager to explore with you
>why you think you are a multiple.  That's why the questions

This would be wonderful, if it were the situation!  Unfortunately, I
know of at least one organization that is totally focused on child
sexual abuse treatment that does not believe multiplicity exists!

The group does good work, so they are "worth their licences", but they
don't address the needs of multiples, including just validating that
multiples exist!

So, the moral is caveat emptor.  I think it's *very* important to
assertain a therapists attitude towards multiplicity *before* starting
any long term therapy.
-- 
Hal Wine
Internet: hal@netcom.com		Compuserve: 72267,3346
From: ftlao@acad3.alaska.edu (OSSANDER LINDA A)
Subject: Molest again..
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41.UAC
Organization: University of Alaska - Fairbanks
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 04:57:00 GMT

Hello everyone..

I have just found out my neice was molested by my brother's wifes boyfriend. 
Talk about shoving my own molest back in my face.  I started out having to be
strong for my brother.  Then I got angry and wanted to scream "Doesn't the shit
ever end!" 

I talked to a very dear friend and maybe lover soon about it.  He was the one
who saw the anger and saddness in me.  He tried to talk me thru it and it did
help a lot.  We talked a lot and cried about it.  He was the one who pointed
out to me that it was not my fault and I should not feel guilty about it but
damnit I want it to stop!  I want the cycle to be broken.  I know it is with me
but the rest of my siblings have not nor will they work on it at all.  They
figure if they don't talk about it it will go away.  

What I would like is some advice on how to best help my brother thru this. I
told him he was smart to have taken her to a doctor and a psychologist but I
know he also needs help to work on his own anger.  I had to tell him not to go
near the guy let the law take care of it. I told him this because I do not want
to see him lose his kids or go to jail. Although my personal feelings is I
would like to shoot the bastard!  I know that is my anger showing and I am
working on it bigtime right now believe me.  But I don't think I can talk him
into going to a counselor.  He will come up with all kinds of excuses just like
he did when I was going to counselors so much working on my own healing.

Thanks for any input you may have on this as I want to wish everyone a good
Christmas.

                               -LindA-