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Date:         Thu, 17 Dec 1992 08:26:32 -0400
From:         RICK GEORGE <RIGEORGE@VASSAR.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Spike Lee and Racism

[definitions of racism deleted]
>
>Ok Let go back to English, although this is a politics discussion. Words can
>have connotations and denotations. You have quoted denotations of words. Good
>we have that out of the way. They (these denotations) have very little to do
>with this conversation. Now connotation can be affect by context, we were
>talking about discrimination, racial, in fact. I, in context of our
>discussions, assume that humans are not programming languages, they can make
>connotational judgements based on context. They can also make conceptual logic
>"jumps".

I hold to my statement that discrimination and racism are not synonyms
and that racial discrimination is not always racism.

[my agreement with the statement that racism is not a good thing and
more about connotations and denotations deleted]
>
>Does
>U Berkeley "discriminate (racial)" against Asians by setting the admittance
>standards higher for that racial group than any others. I believe so.

If you are asking me whether selective college admission is discriminatory,
I would say yes.  I gave that as an example in my previous post.

[example of valid race-based discrimination deleted and examples of what
Kirk and I would teach children]

>Really. This isn't the same thing.  Do you have the concept yet? Then why do
>you say, as does most of our "civil rights leaders"(NOT ALL OF THEM): (I quote
>now)
>
>"I'd rather teach them to get along with people who look different
>than they do. "
>
>Why not just teach them to get along with everybody? The point here is the
>"concern", if genuine, is not pointed in one direction. We are not concerned
>about minorities, we are concerned about people, some of whom are minorities.
>(Nice how that works out, isn't it?)

OK, let's try to teach kids to get along with everybody, including those
who look different than they do.  I hope I have the concept.

>I know that massive RACIAL discrimination occurs in the US. In all directions
>believe it or not. As a minority, (White, male, American living in Europe), I
>experience it daily, and we don't have laws to protect our interest here the
>way minorities have in the US. You can refuse to rent me a house for no reason,
>you don't have to serve me in restaruants. I have been refused before. I would
>like equality. Equality of opportunity, anything more is patronizing, I don't
>need that, thank you.

I'll bet even if you did have laws to protect your interests, some of those
European landlords and restauranteurs wouldn't follow them.  Then you
wouldn't have equality.

>If we want to eradicate racism and (racial) discrimination (for people who do
>not understand connotations, see above) we must relish the differences in us
>but first we must emphasize the similarities. We are all in this together.
>Let's not form (more) us again them thoughts now. I believe the Spike Lee
>contibutes to the emphasizing the differences.

Are you sure that Spike Lee isn't just relishing the differences?

>One last thought, I don't need a dictionary to define Racism or Discrimination.
>I live in Germany, we are having a problem with this right now (as I'm sure you
>are aware 26000 incidents in the last month). I get to watch it happen.

It's horrible.  You must be outraged.

>Kirk

Kirk...

As much fun as this is, I'm off travelling for the next several days
and won't be in the office, I hope, until after the holidays, so you
can have the last word.  Enjoy, and happy holidays.  Or as Spike
might say, Merry X-mas.

...Rick
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