HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jmartin@ntmtv.UUCP (Jeff Martin)
Subject: Re: 87 Crash (was "Market efficiency")
Originator: jmartin@cleomed
Organization: Northern Telecom Incorporated
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 15:28:00 GMT

From article <1992Dec19.011019.1485@gumby.dsd.trw.com>, by suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com (Maurice E. Suhre):
> In article <BzE43t.D4t@cs.uiuc.edu> watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu (Larry Watanabe) writes:
>>* Oct 19 1987. During the weekend, Baker tells the world
>>  that we are going to let the dollar go, because the
>>  Germans aren't loosening monetary and fiscal policy
>>  as Baker demanded. That Monday, the stock market drops 508 points.
> 
> Richard Mogey, I believe, argued that you can
> get some handle on what the markets are going
> to do by watching the capital flows around the
> world.  When Baker announced that the dollar wouldn't
> be supported, the capital fled the country and the
> market crumbled.
> 

Lets remeber that the for 1987 the market (S&P 500) was up
3%. The so called crash was a correction for huge run-ups
in stock prices earlier in the year. Moreover the "crash"
actually began on Friday Oct. 16 with a 100+ point drop.

Jeff Martin
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: pjweaver@ralvm29.vnet.ibm.com (Paul Weaver)
Subject: Help with closing prices
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 15:53:25 GMT
Reply-To: pjweaver@ralvm29.vnet.ibm.com
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

I've noticed that when I see closing prices in the Wall Street Journal, or
Investors Business Daily, they often don't match those of my broker (Waterhouse).
This usually occurs on the OTC market. For example, on 12/21, Waterhouse and our
local paper say that Vertex Communications (VTEX) closed at 14-3/4, but the WSJ
and IBD (online version in americast.ap.financial), list the closing as 15-1/2.
Anybody know why there's a difference?
-- 

===============================================================================
Paul J. Weaver                 | "It is well that war is so terrible, or men
pjweaver@ralvm29.vnet.ibm.com  |  should grow too fond of it"
-------------------------------|       General R. E. Lee
I speak only for myself        |       Battle of Fredricksburg, VA  Dec. 1862
From: clong@romulus.rutgers.edu (Chris Long)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: High-load Funds (was Re: Mutual Funds???)
Date: 4 Jan 93 03:47:35 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <1992Dec29.183850.13083@engage.pko.dec.com>,
  sullivan@brandx.enet.dec.com writes:

> ditto on Primerica.  They might actually charge 8.5% front-end load.

And people actually go for it?  Unless God is the portfolio manager,
I can't see what it could have going for it.
-- 
Chris Long, 265 Old York Rd., Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2618

Score: 0, Diff: 1, clong killed by a Harvard Math Team on  1
From: jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: IRA's and Fundwatch Online (Q)
Date: 30 Dec 1992 18:47:51 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Can a person have a 401k plan and IRA at the same time ?

Compuserve has money magazine's Fundwatch Online, is this a good source
of info ? and when will it be next updated ?  it cost $12.80 + $15 per hr.
to use.

jerry
From: rlcarr@animato.network23.com (Rich Carreiro)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Institutions vs. Individuals (TAX question)
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16f (10.17.92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith
Date: 23 Dec 92 21:12:26 EST
Organization: The Other Side of Life

In article <1992Dec23.025623.13344@microsoft.com> mattsq@microsoft.com (Matthew Squires) writes:
> You are forgetting the other tax consequence of mutual funds, a
> consequence a lot of us are discovering this time of year - a mutual
> fund must distribute most of its capital gains to its shareholders
> every year.

Not quite.  Only *NET REALIZED* capital gains are distributed (and
dividend and interest income, of course).

In other words, if the fund doesn't realize a net gain (i.e. it didn't
sell any stocks, or the ones it sold were balanced out buy sells for losses)
there is no distribution, even if the stocks in the fund soar.  For an 
example, check out 20th Cent Ultra's 1991 return and it's 1991 cap gain dist
(it was $0.00/share, in case you were wondering).

-- 
Rich Carreiro                                  Home: (401)841-8514
rlcarr@animato.network23.com
uunet.uu.net!animato!rlcarr
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: etpeters@dal.mobil.com (E. T. Peterson(Eric))
Subject: Re: Oil Futures
Organization: Mobil Exploration & Producing Technical Center(MEPTEC), Dallas. 
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 14:43:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec23.011346.27653@gumby.dsd.trw.com>, suhre@meltami.dsd.trw.com (Maurice E. Suhre) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec22.211705.16019@shearson.com> jmemon@shearson.com (Janine Memon) writes:
|> >I do not believe, when investing in oil futures that it is possible to 
|> >invest only $100. 
|> 
|> I think you can purchase *options* on *futures contracts*.  This means
|> that you can get into the futures game and limit your downside risk to
|> 100% of your investment, just like stock options.
|> 
|> Since I don't do options on commodity futures, I don't really have any
|> other details.  I would suggest talking to your broker.  But the option
|> route seems to me to be the cheapest way to get in.  Of course, profits
|> are not guaranteed, but losses are limited to the original investment
|> (using the word investment loosely -- perhaps "bet" would be better :-)

Yes, you can purchase options on oil futures (I have done it several times
in my futures account). However, futures firms require a $5000 minimum
deposit to open a futures account.  Also, $100 will only buy you an out of
the money call with a short time (a month or two) til expiration.  Very high
probability that it will expire worthless, unless oil goes up several dollars
per barrel in a couple months.  If you have that accuracy in your predictions,
call me!

By the way, my latest margin sheet says $1620 is required to trade an oil
futures contract (1000 barrels).


*********************************************************************
Eric Peterson                  The sooner you fall behind,
Research Geophysicist          the more time you'll have to catch up!
(214) 951-3251
etpeters@.dal.mobil.com
*********************************************************************
From: jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: another question regarding multiple IRAs
Date: 31 Dec 1992 22:47:16 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


thanks to the people who responded to my previous post.

now that I know that I can open as many IRA accounts as I want but
limited to $2000 contributions, I'd like to know if it is possible
for me to say, transfer funds from one IRA account into another,
combine 2 or more IRA accounts into one ?

thanks
jerry
From: quan@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Suu Quan)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: benefits of accounts under child's name ?
Date: 23 Dec 92 20:18:39 GMT
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server


  I would like to put some money aside for our 2 daughters in the form
of monthly deposits in a Mutual Fund.

  What are the benefits/disadvantage of having the fund in their names
and social security #s ?
From: bakken@cs.arizona.edu (Dave Bakken)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: ~~~~~~~ CHINA ECONOMY GROWTH: 12% ~~~~~~~
Date: 1 Jan 93 09:54:57 GMT
Organization: U of Arizona CS Dept, Tucson

In article <1992Dec31.225252.13444@fcom.cc.utah.edu> jli@bingham.utah.edu (Jianliang Li) writes:
>
>	The Salt Lake Tribune reported today that the economy growth in 
>	mainland China is 12% for 1992.  A 5-10% growth rate for the next
>	few years are expected IF political stability is not a problem.

Of course, that is a big if, as you recognize.  They have all those
octogenarian leaders dying off and the next generation supposedly
no nearly as hard line, and booming capatalism allowing
people to no rely on the government so much and to make their
own decisions.   Thus, it is hard to see how they could *not*
have political instability in the near future, but it may well
be 5-15 years away or it may be sudden.

BTW, though I'm no great fan of Pat Buchanan, I *loved* it when he
called Deng something like ``an 82-year-old, chain-smoking,
communist dwarf.''  :-}
--
Dave Bakken                               Internet: bakken@cs.arizona.edu
Dept. of Computer Science; U of Arizona   Voice:    +1 602 621 4098      
Tucson, AZ 85721; USA                     FAX:      +1 602 621 4246
The fact that you're paranoid doesn't prove they're *not* out to get you.
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: mzwick@vitro.com (Morris J. Zwick)
Subject: Re: E-TRADE - anyone using this - comments???
Organization: Vitro Corporation
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 13:13:47 GMT

In article <BARAD.92Dec24141913@chartres.ee.tulane.edu>
barad@chartres.ee.tulane.edu (Herb Barad) writes:
>Is anyone using E-TRADE based in Palo Alto?  Their commission savings
>over other brokers is substantial.  It seems like all (or at least
>most) of the trading is all done electronically, not via a human.  Has
>anyone had experience with them?  Are they trustworthy?
>
>Please post or email replies.  Thanks in advance.
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Herb
>--
>Herb Barad	[Signal & Image Processing Laboratory]
>		[Electrical Engineering Dept. - Tulane Univ.]
>INTERNET:	barad@ee.tulane.edu
>

Our investment club uses E*Trade. Initially, service was a little rough, and it
did take 1-2 months to get everything set up properly. Since then, we've had no
problems. Once our account was set up properly, there has been no interaction
with humans (a blessing or a curse??).

         ___________________________________________________________________
        /  Morris J. Zwick	                 Internet: mzwick@vitro.com
__     /   Vitro Corporation	             Voice:    (301) 231-2784
  \   /    14000 Georgia Ave.                ___________________________
   \ /     Silver Spring, MD 20906-2972      |"I don't want the world; |
    *                                        | I just want your half!" |
                                             |  - They Might Be Giants |
From: mincy@mjolnir.dev.think.com (Jeffrey Mincy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Mutual Funds or I.R.A.'s?????
Date: 30 Dec 92 10:46:06
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mjolnir.think.com
In-reply-to: loszewski_im@hnrc.tufts.edu's message of 30 Dec 92 14:35:05 GMT

In article <1992Dec30.093506.585@hnrc.tufts.edu> loszewski_im@hnrc.tufts.edu writes:

   From: loszewski_im@hnrc.tufts.edu
   Date: 30 Dec 92 14:35:05 GMT

   ...I would like everyone's opinions on one other thing.
   Being 23, which would be better to invest in, mutual funds, or an I.R.A.??
   -Rob

Both.  They aren't mutually exclusive.  Get in the habit of doing both early.

Start off small (if you have to).

BTW, you can open IRA accounts with lots of mutual funds.

--

-- jeff
mincy@think.com
From: crr4574@zeus.tamu.edu (LARUE, CHARLES L.)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Real Estate IRA?
Date: 31 Dec 1992 16:05 CST
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: zeus.tamu.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

I have a few questions which I can't seem to find the answers to.  I live in a
college town which has a pretty bad housing shortage.  Oddly enough, real
estate prices are pretty low right now and I am trying to buy some investment
properties with as small an out of pocket expense as possible.  My questions
are:  Can you use money which is currently in an IRA to put a downpayment on a
condo or a duplex which is to be used as an investment property?  If so, does
all the profit from the rent maintain its IRA status if, for example, I put it
back into a mutual fund (This is currently where my IRA is located)?  If all of
this is out of the question, are there other ways to avoid having to put down
the 30% downpayment my real estate agent says will be required?

Thanks,

Charley


Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: gail.ridley@cs.utas.edu.au (Gail Ridley)
Subject: Fixed Rate Loan Period Advice 
Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 04:49:20 GMT

Basically it's an exercise in crystal ball gazing.  However, I need to decide
the type of loan for a residential investment mortgage.  I would appreciate 
your comments, particularly from people with appropriate expertise.

My first choice is between a variable or a fixed rate loan.  I prefer to 
take a fixed rate loan.

Next I need to choose the period of the fixed rate loan.  (At the end of the 
loan period I can renegotiate another loan.)  My options are listed below:-

1 year			8.50% PA
2 year	 	9.75
3	year		10.50
4 year		11.00
5 year		11.25

Please note that I'm outside the US so the interest rates may seem surprising
to you.

My question is, what is going to happen to interest rates over the coming five
years?  I would prefer direct email responses to me.  I'm happy to post a 
summary of the replies.

Thankyou,
Gail Ridley
From: pcs$1703@altair.selu.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Insurance
Date: 23 Dec 92 08:45:46 -0600
Organization: Southeastern Louisiana University


 When you buy a house from a agent or home owner and there's a few
unknown problems, is there insurance you can buy to protect you ?

 Is there insurance that would cover roof, structer, and appliance
problems ?

	Thanks

Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
From: alexg@austin.ibm.com ()
Subject: Re: Secured Loans,Mortgages and Liability
Originator: alexg@madrid.austin.ibm.com
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 14:45:38 GMT
Reply-To: alexg@austin.ibm.com
Organization: IBM Austin



To your luck California is not a deficiency judgement state. That means
lenders can only come after the collateral specified in the Deed of Trust 
to secure a note. If there is a deficiency after they exercise the 
foreclosure sale they can't come after you personally,
that's after your other assets.

Not so in deficiency judgement states. For example, in Texas after the real
estate crisis of mid 80s, a lot of lenders foreclosed on commercial real
estate borrowers right then. Foreclosure auctions did not satisfied the lien
thereby creating a deficiency. But those lenders waited for several years 
until now before exercising there right to come after defaulted borrowers
for the amount of deficiency.

There is an excellent book on legal pecularities of real estate financing
from "The First Tuesday" titled "Real Estate Financing". Probalbly most 
comprehensive book on the subject written by an attorney. It has a lot of
staff common for the U.S. lending, but also a lot of specifics for 
California.

"First Tuesday" also has a superbook "Real Estate Taxation Aspects", a must 
reading for any real estate investor.

I bought them a couple of years ago in Mission College book store in 
Santa Clara. 

- Alex Gurevich     alexg@austin.ibm.com
From: alvin@zany.mti.sgi.com (Alvin Oga)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Re: Secured Loans,Mortgages and Liability
Date: 24 Dec 92 02:44:22 GMT
Reply-To: alvin@zany.mti.sgi.com (Alvin Oga)
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: zany.mti.sgi.com

In article <3939@key.COM>, rburns@key.COM (Randy Burns) writes:
|> With the California real-estate market going down the toilet,
|> I'm getting concerned about what might happen to my assets other than my
|> house. My home equity has already evaporated(i.e. the 30K I used to buy
|> out my partner, my 24K down payment and 10K of out of pocket expenses I 
|> used to fix the place up now translates into 10K of equity). What I'm 
|> now concerned about is whether my other assets can be attached in the event 
|> that I can no longer meet my mortgage payments. My largest remaining assets
|> are in a money-purchase pension plan.
|> 
|> 
|> Now, what is likely to happen in the event the maket goes down another
|> 20%. My understanding is that if I surrender the house to the bank, my
|> debt is not completely canceled(i.e. the bank could still attach my other
|> assets). Am I correct in this understanding? Thanks! I'm also a little 
|> confused about the situation regarding  exemption of pension  assets from 
|> forclosure in California.

Regarding foreclosure of residential properties in California:
a.  the lenders only have one recourse in CA. 
	ie they can only take your house away from you.

b.  If you signed additional collateral to get the loan or equity line of credit
	that was secured with your 'pension plan asset', then since it
	was pledged as additional collateral, the lender can take that too.

c.  most of the local lenders don't give you the loan unless the property had
	the equity in it to begin with, and usually (90% +/-) of the time 
	won't be asking for the additional collateral.

d.  However, on the other hand, most commercial lenders ask for personal
	guarantee and additional collateral for the commercial loans.
	Furthermore, they are NOT limited to just one recourse.
	They can come after your checking account,  cars, furniture, etc

FYI, a lender already tried to get all the assets of the borrower who had
defaulted, by taking the home and the checking account.  They went to court
and the lender had to give back the  (sizable) checking account balance.

Don't worry...you're not the only one in this predicament....Nothing you can
do about it....Don't borrow any more money secured by the house....

GOod luck,
alvin		alvin@mti.sgi.com
From: rburns@key.COM (Randy Burns)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: Pre-Payment Mortgage Questions
Date: 21 Dec 92 23:18:01 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Advanced Systems, Fremont CA

What are the rules regarding pre-payment of specific payments on a 
mortgage. What I would ideally like to be able to do it to pre-pay my
mortgage a few payments ahead of time, instead of leaving the money in a
checking account at a low rate of interest. This problem is that as a 
contractor, my money tends to come in chunks-and I get the feeling that a
bank might balk if I said "ok, I'm 10 grand ahead, I won't be making any
payments for the next 4-5 months". Are there any institutions that have
provided a degree of flexibility in this regards? I'd prefer to not simply
establish a credit line because of the tax implications(i.e. I'd like
the flexibility to allow the loan to go through a temporary period of 
negative amortization-just enough to get back onto its original payment
schedule).

Thanks.
Xref: sparky misc.invest.real-estate:1142 misc.forsale:34216 misc.rural:2677
From: re_sims@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.forsale,misc.rural,osu.for-sale
Subject: Re: SE Ohio Farm, $89,900. 80 Acres, FREE gas
Date: 28 Dec 92 23:24:06 GMT
Organization: Muskingum College

Sorry about the wrong price in Header in 
original post, the correct price
is $89,900.00, it was correct in the list.



> 80 ACRE FARM FOR SALE
> 
> located in Eastern Ohio, 75 miles
> E. of Columbus, 125 miles South of
> Cleveland, 90 miles West of Pittsburgh, Pa
> 
> 2 Bedroom 2 Bath house, fireplace, Glassed in
> front porch, Deck with nice view over looking
> pastures, large country kitchen,
> FREE GAS FOR HEATING & COOKING, 1400 square
> feet, 
> 
> Large concrete floor and wall barn, with 
> large hay loft above, using it for garage
> and vehicle storage now.
> 
> Pole barn, with stalls for horses, small
> calf barn, round bale storage shed, garage,
> 
> 80 acres is mostly cleared, in fact, I baled
> 62 large round bales from only 2 of the fields
> last year and that was 1 cutting.
> also square baled 2 other fields.
> 
> lots of pasture and some woods, with many 
> hardwood trees. Nice back to nature place
> with many types of birds and animals.
> 
> Spring water to house, running creeks thru property,
> many springs, pond, 
> 
> On this farm, heating, cooking, and hot water are 
> FREE, also spring water is free except for pump.
> 
> Our only utilities are Electric and phone.
> 
> BTW, I am sitting in my study writing this!!
> Computers and modems are wonderful.
> 
> This farm is only 1 mile from US 40, 2 miles
> from I-70 and approx. 4 miles from I-77, easy 
> to get to most anywhere from here.  We drive 
> to Columbus in just over an hour.
> 
> Our selling price is only $89,900, taxes run 
> about $500 a year because it is agriculture.
> 
> Contact:
> 
> James K. Sims sr. at (614) 439-2177 ps. I have an answering box.
> 
> or e-mail is ok at:
> 
> re_sims@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
> 
>
From: kennb@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Ken Berger)
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate
Subject: New construction delay
Date: 22 Dec 92 16:46:07 GMT
Reply-To: kenb@vice.ico.tek.com
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tektronix Inc., Beaverton, Or.

Our new house won't be ready by the date called out in
a signed construction contract between us and our builder.

Now he and the real estate agent want me to sign an addendum
to the contract to extend the date another 4 weeks.

What things should I be aware of before I sign the addendum?
Would it be a good time to negotiate the price of our add-ons?

I don't want to rock the boat too much with the builder since
overall we are pleased with his work.

Thanks in advance.
Ken
Xref: sparky misc.invest.real-estate:1140 misc.forsale:34193 misc.rural:2672
From: re_sims@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate,misc.forsale,misc.rural,osu.for-sale
Subject: SE Ohio Farm, $89,00, 80 acres, FREE gas
Date: 28 Dec 92 17:16:35 GMT
Organization: Muskingum College


80 ACRE FARM FOR SALE

located in Eastern Ohio, 75 miles
E. of Columbus, 125 miles South of
Cleveland, 90 miles West of Pittsburgh, Pa

2 Bedroom 2 Bath house, fireplace, Glassed in
front porch, Deck with nice view over looking
pastures, large country kitchen,
FREE GAS FOR HEATING & COOKING, 1400 square
feet, 

Large concrete floor and wall barn, with 
large hay loft above, using it for garage
and vehicle storage now.

Pole barn, with stalls for horses, small
calf barn, round bale storage shed, garage,

80 acres is mostly cleared, in fact, I baled
62 large round bales from only 2 of the fields
last year and that was 1 cutting.
also square baled 2 other fields.

lots of pasture and some woods, with many 
hardwood trees. Nice back to nature place
with many types of birds and animals.

Spring water to house, running creeks thru property,
many springs, pond, 

On this farm, heating, cooking, and hot water are 
FREE, also spring water is free except for pump.

Our only utilities are Electric and phone.

BTW, I am sitting in my study writing this!!
Computers and modems are wonderful.

This farm is only 1 mile from US 40, 2 miles
from I-70 and approx. 4 miles from I-77, easy 
to get to most anywhere from here.  We drive 
to Columbus in just over an hour.

Our selling price is only $89,900, taxes run 
about $500 a year because it is agriculture.

Contact:

James K. Sims sr. at (614) 439-2177 ps. I have an answering box.

or e-mail is ok at:

re_sims@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Newsgroups: misc.invest.real-estate