HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Telemark skis
Date: 14 Oct 92 21:17:24 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Computer Science Department

In article <DAVIS.92Oct14102259@adenosine.lugg.utah.edu> davis@lugg.utah.edu (Darrell R. Davis) writes:
>
>It's all relative.  Just depends on what you consider a good skier, my
>definition of a good tele'er has no problem keeping up with
>downhillers.

OK.  Against my own better judgement, I guess its time once again for what
is becoming an annual, ceremonial, ritual celebration of the near arrival
of winter: my debunk the telemark-myth post.

I'm sorry, I just don't believe that a good telemarker can ski compatibly
with equally adept downhillers.  I have skied with telemarkers who are
better skiers than me, but they could not keep up and were therefore not
much fun to ski with.  It's just not true.

I would extend an open invitation to all you hot-shot telemarkers to prove
me wrong, but I don't want to end up skiing by my self all day at some
down hill area.  (I used to enjoy that, but not any more.)

That said, let me clarify that I have the deepest respect for the telemark
sport, and for those who master it.  (Oops, I think I'm pulling a Clinton
again; don't tell Dan.)  Some of you guys are truly phenomenal.  But let's
cut through the Bullshit.

>I am more
>comfortable on downhill equipment, but can usually "keep-up" on pins.

That is an exemplary, reasonable statement.

>It takes more skill on pins, but that's the whole idea.  A lot of
>skiers that have downhilled from birth take up pinning for the
>challenge.

No argument there.

>I have equipment that allows me to ski any terrain that I
>would ski on downhills, but tele'in the same run is still a lot
>harder.

Precisely my point.

-- 

-Wayne Trzyna
 trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU
From: william@castle.ed.ac.uk (William Warburton)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Where to go in France...
Date: 14 Oct 92 08:49:26 GMT
Reply-To: W.Warburton@ed.ac.uk
Organization: Edinburgh University Computing Service

In article <1992Oct13.110043.2575@bristol.ac.uk>, smee@bristol.ac.uk (Paul Smee) writes:
|> 	   ...  Is there something 'wrong' with the Porte du Soliel area,
|> or is it just that no-one knows about it?

 Altitude.


 When the snow is good it's fine. Huge skiing area with lots of variety.
This introduces its own problem: you can spend quite a bit of time
getting to where you want to ski (ie cruising blues). It is so big that
a good guide is a big plus especially since (s)he should be able to
dodge the bottlenecks in the lift system & put in a few interesting
off-piste runs to keep the excitement going.

 Check out the heights of the resorts you'll be passing through and
then weigh up your odds for booking early. The year I went there (1990)
we booked a week before departure and managed to catch one of two weeks
in the season when the snow was good.

hope this helps,

	W.

 PS. Would you be kind enough to forward me the replies you have
    received. I am also wondering where to go (& am currently favouring
    Chamonix or Serre Chevalier).
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: philba@microsoft.com (Phil Barrett)
Subject: Re: Smart Ticket
Date: 13 Oct 92 20:48:29 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <5429@balrog.ctron.com> tavares@ctron.com writes:
>
>I must say that I am in favor of the "smart" ticket system.
>My wife and  I skied at Mt. Ste. Anne outside of Quebec in 
>March, and they employ the system there.
>We only skied 1 day, and I was not aware of their ticketing
>policy, or I might hae bought a point-based ticket instead
>of an all day. 
>
>My wife and I did not have any of the problems mentioned in this
>thread: Confusion at the turnstile, ticket snapping in my face.
>I guess if you place the ticket on a pocket zipper and keep the
>ticket in your pocket like we did, there wouldn't be a problem,
>although.
>
>I know that if my favorite place to ski (Sunday River) gets this
>smart ticket system, I am going to buy the maximum point tickets,
>more points/dollar, and use them all season long.
>I am not 1 of the most organized people in the world, but I think
>I can manage to keep track of a lift ticket!
>

I never said I thought the systems were hopeless but I still have my 
reservations.  Did Mt Ste Anne give a big break when buying lots of
points?  Batchelor didn't last year. In fact, I couldn't see much benefit
to buying the 60 point version (vs the 30) since it only saved a buck
or two.  Unless you are only going to do a few runs each day, the point
tickets at batchelor are very expensive per run.  What was the break-even
point for Mt Ste Anne for an unlimited ticket? The people I saw that
had bought the point tickets invariably ran out in the early afternoon.
We bought unlimited tickets and got between 15 and 20 runs each day
otherwise we would have been in the same situation (you get 10 rides on
the high-speed quads).  We aren't very agressive skiers and quit a bit
early. Its a fairly simple calculation you make in the morning -- am I
going to make more than the break-even number of runs today. If the
weather is truely bad, you might consider a point ticket.  Maybe a weak
or fairweather skier could benefit.

As for the confusion.  I am sure they can work the kinks out of the
system but it will take a lot more space and real committment.  For
example, they really need to give people more room to regroup after
exiting the ticket gate and they need to avoid turns just before the
gate so people can go through more or less together.  I just don't have
a lot of faith that they will do this.

Overall, it sure doesn't seem like a very cost effective solution to
the problem.  In fact, I'm still not sure what problem they were trying
to solve.  I think its a marketing gimmick.

Phil Barrett
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: People who looklike skiers but aren't
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 05:32:46 GMT

In article <15021@auspex-gw.auspex.com> johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:
>If she spent all day standing, walking and talking she couldn't
>have brought that much money into the local economy.

Part of that was sarcastic, but part was that she DID buy the lift ticket.

>in walked "Mr. Perfect".

A good story.

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Associate Editor, Software and Publication Reviews
  Scientific Programming
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Seeking Books to buy:	Bongard, Pattern Recognition
			Imhof, Cartographic Relief Presentation
			Books on or by Benjamin Whorf
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From:  vlad@inavex.neoaci.msk.su (Vladimir D. Korovkin)
Subject: Russian women skiers are looking for sponsor to participate pro competitions in the USA
Reply-To: vlad@inavex.neoaci.msk.su
Organization: INTERNATIONAL AVIATION INDUSTRY EXCHANGE
Date: Fri,  9 Oct 92 15:13:21 +0400 

Russian women skiers are looking for sponsor to participate commercial
competitions in the USA.
Four or two skiers + two coaches:
     1.Lodzinja Ulla (1971).
          Madonna di Kampilio - the 3d
          Europa Cup - the 2d
          Steamboat-Springs - the 4th
     2.Loginova Olga (1992).
          The USSR (CIS) 1992 - champion
     3. Tichvinskaja Marina (1970)
          The USSR (CIS) 1992 - the 2d
     4. Pupysheva Svetlana (1971)
          The USSR 1990,1991 - champion
     Coaches: Tajanov
              Kurisyn
--------------------
Moscow, Russia
Tel.(voice/fax): (095)361-6473
E-mail: vlad@inavex.neoaci.msk.su
-- 
----- * phone (095) 361-6473 * Korovkin Vladimir * INAVEX * -----
From: tgorb@rrc.chevron.com (Joe Gorberg)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Where to stay at Brechenridge?
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:40:29 GMT
Reply-To: tgorb@rrc.chevron.com
Organization: Chevron, Richmond, California


Four of us are looking to vacation in the Summit area and would like to 
stay at Breckenridge and get say a 5 of 6 day lift ticket good at Breck,
Copper, Keystone... The question is where to stay.  There are many places
listed in brochures I've picked up.  Does anyone have a suggestion or a 
favorite place to stay at Breckenridge?  Know of any discount packages?
We'd like either a 2bedroom condo/house or comparable.

Thanks for your suggestions.

Joe.
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: mka@tko.vtt.fi (Kauppi Matti)
Subject: Voile release kit for 3-pins
Reply-To: mka@tko.vtt.fi (Kauppi Matti)
Organization: VTT
Distribution: rec
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 10:56:01 GMT



Hello,

I need a release kit and brake kit for my telemark 3-pins. The first races are
held after 6 weeks and I don't want to brake my legs because of the lack of
bind releasers. 

I know that at least Voile makes them. Voile brake kit plus release kit cost
$77 (Canadian Dollar) at Mountain Equipment Co-op in Canada. Does any of you 
know other places where I can buy equipment via post? Of cource, I'd appreciate 
if the place you suggest were cheaper than Mountain Eq.


Thanks,
Matti
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: beutel@chdasic.sps.mot.com (Jim Beutel)
Subject: Sunrise, AZ Accomodations Wanted
Reply-To: beutel@chdasic.sps.mot.com
Organization: Motorola SPS ASIC, Chandler, AZ
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 18:52:00 GMT

Hello,

I reside in Phoenix, AZ presently. Althought I would 
prefer Alta or Purgatory, Sunrise is not to bad for 
so called local skiing. And in Arizona even... Plenty 
of double black dimonds. The last two years i have stayed
in cabins at Pinetop or Sholow. My question is: Does anyone
out there know, have, stayed, or otherwise can direct me to
economic accomodations in either Greer, Springerville, or
even Pinetop....? Something clean, but heck I am only sleeping
there, does not have to cost a fortune....

Thanks.
Jim


---
Jim Beutel	

Motorola SPS ASIC            beutel@chdasic.sps.mot.com
1300 N. Alma School Rd       Computer Operations 
M/S CH290  AZ50              office:  (602) 821-4967
Chandler, Arizona 85224	     telefax: (602) 821-4963


Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: My first experience with a Texas Skiie
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 92 22:59:20 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.215045.18424@javelin.sim.es.com>
bgeer@javelin.sim.es.com writes:
>Gawd, if they only *would*.  Thanks to your "Idaho doesn't exist"
>postings, they are starting to come to Utah after being thrown out of
>CO & NM, instead of becoming an equal opportunity infestment.

Don't Texans drink a lot?  Real(tm) men/skiers have lots of bravado
and drinks lots?  Well, maybe not the Bible belt ones.
Turn on the LDS.  Or refer them to Park City.

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Acting Associate Editor, Software and Publication Reviews
  Scientific Programming
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Seeking Books to buy:	Bongard, Pattern Recognition
			Imhof, Cartographic Relief Presentation
			Books on or by Benjamin Whorf
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: Telemark skis
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 00:08:06 GMT

In article <Oct14.211724.91665@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>
trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna) writes:
>OK.  Against my own better judgement, I guess its time once again for what
>is becoming an annual, ceremonial, ritual celebration of the near arrival
>of winter: my debunk the telemark-myth post.
>
>I'm sorry, I just don't believe that a good telemarker can ski compatibly
>with equally adept downhillers.  I have skied with telemarkers who are
>better skiers than me, but they could not keep up and were therefore not
>much fun to ski with.  It's just not true.

Not a rebuttal.
It reminded me of a trip to Oregon one winter.  We were skiing down one of the
volcanos.  Dave was pinning, and I had my Ramers.  Beautiful new fallen
snow on a sunny day (sort of, it was snowing by Noon again).  I made this
sharp left turn onto the top of a cirque headwall (ABOVE the bergschrund,
the crevice (Wayne knows this) separating the permanent snow fields from
the moving part of the glacier).  Dave followed.
I started linking turns down toward an area with a snow bridge but
behind me, I heard this: "!WWWAAAaaa!"  Dave decided to crash into the
new snow.  He had suddenly realized he was on this steep slope, above
a glacier, crevaces below him, and he really wanted to take a look at what
he was getting into.  He later did ski down it (one crash).  I took a photo
of the first crash and subsequent descent.

It's sort of like the difference between surfing a long board and a newer
short board.  Well, maybe not, surfing is harder.

>That said, let me clarify that I have the deepest respect for the telemark
>sport, and for those who master it.  (Oops, I think I'm pulling a Clinton
>again; don't tell Dan.)  Some of you guys are truly phenomenal.  But let's
>cut through the Bullshit.

Hey, I'd vote for you.  What precisely are you pulling?

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Acting Associate Editor, Software and Publication Reviews
  Scientific Programming
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Seeking Books to buy:	Bongard, Pattern Recognition
			Imhof, Cartographic Relief Presentation
			Books on or by Benjamin Whorf
From: johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Telemark skis
Date: 16 Oct 92 00:23:19 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Inc.

In article <Oct15.031507.60154@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna) writes:
|
|But seriously, under what circumstances is the tele position an advantage?
|
When some hot lookin' swedish babe in lycra that has a thang for yodeling
and is impressed with someone that can manipulate those skinny skis in
that position is riding the chairlift above you.
 
|If you answer this question, then maybe I'll leave you alone, grab
|my spinning rod, and go harrass the fly-fishing purists over in
|rec.outdoors.fishing.  (But no promises.)

We're *waiting*.


>-Wayne Trzyna
> trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU


-- 
+==========================================================================+
| John Fereira        | Auspex Systems | "Ask me about my vow of silence." |
| johnf@auspex.com    | Santa Clara CA |                                   |
+==========================================================================+
From: klaus@ced.utah.edu (Klaus Biggers,MEB 3140b,581-6499)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Telemark skis
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:13:44 GMT
Reply-To: klaus@ced.utah.edu
Organization: Center for Engineering Design

In article 92Oct15144154@hawk.is.morgan.com, steinman@is.morgan.com (Jan Steinman) writes:
> If the outside ski is somewhat ahead
> of the inside one, and you can slide a credit card under the inside
> heel, it's telemarking

Not according to the race judges. :)  One second penalty! Which seems
to verify Wayne's point. If the telemark were faster, they would
penalize the telemark turn.. no?

The tip of the trailing ski must pass at least the midpoint between
the tip of the ski and the front of the binding. At least in races.


-klaus                                              klaus@ced.utah.edu
From: wilhelm@mcst.ae.ge.com (Roland Wilhelm)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Opinions on Wolfcreek, CO
Date: 9 Oct 92 13:35:20 GMT
Organization: GE Aircraft Engines

I have an oppurtunity to go Wolfcreek, CO but I know nothing about it.
Is it a decent area?  Responses to my mail address would be appreciated.
Thanks!
From: jonw@hpgrla.gr.hp.com (Jon Wade)
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 15:12:57 GMT
Subject: Re: Colorado Skier - Trivia 2 - Who gets the most!
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Greeley, CO
Newsgroups: rec.skiing

In rec.skiing, glenb@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Glen Baker) writes:


>>  ??????????  Who was the skier and what other ski flics has he appeared in?

> Given the hint I'll assume it was Plake.

> ..glen "with one n and normal hair"


Come on , not even close, his initials are D.M. he's short and stocky, and does a lot of flips in the bumps like they were nothing.

try again you have to be a pretty devoted connoisseur of ski flics to know
this one

10" on top of steamboat!
jonw
From: launce@apollo.med.utah.edu (Tri-Ungulate)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: "Ski Mountaineering" (?) advice wanted.
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:41:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: apollo.LAUNCE.92Oct13094151
	<SSH.92Oct12093847@snow.boulder.ibm.com>
Organization: Trifurcate-Hooved Ruminant Surveyors, Inc.

In article <SSH.92Oct12093847@snow.boulder.ibm.com> ssh@snow.boulder.ibm.com (Steve Hultquist (347-3994)) writes:

>   Hey, Chris!  I've been thinking about using some of the new, lightweight
>   snowshoes to hike up, then switch to skis to come down.  Any thoughts?

Friend of mine did that last season.  Had a great time "jogging" past
the poor 'pinners like myself slogging up the slope.  Managed to get
at least two runs in for every one of ours PLUS first tracks.  He was
on a snowboard.

Drawbacks:  1) the new lightweights don't look like they'd work too well
in deep soft stuff, though I don't know from experience - perhaps
somebody can enlighten me. 2) the expense of buying a new set of toys
puts that option out of my range for a little while.

| _, launce gouw * internet: launce@apollo.med.utah.edu * ooniversity of ootah 
|(_) medical center * department of human genetics *   palace of the brine
___) we apologise for the previous opinions. those responsible have been sacked
Xref: sparky rec.skiing:6369 soc.culture.polish:3094
From: aodyniec@orion.oac.uci.edu (Alex Odyniec)
Subject: Skiing in Tatra Mountains, Poland?
Summary: Is it any good?
Newsgroups: rec.skiing,soc.culture.polish
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Keywords: skiing, Poland
Date: 10 Oct 92 03:41:44 GMT

I'll be in Poland around X-mas and I'm wondering whether it's worth
going to Zakopane for a week of skiing, or should I stay in Warsaw
instead and drink hot spiced mead at the Old Town taverns ;-)
     Does anyone know how big that ski area is, what's the vertical
drop, and what kind of terrain (I am an advanced skier). Also, what
are the weather patterns in that part of Europe -- what's the average
annual snowfall in Zakopane and do they normally get a decent base by
the end of December? Lastly, what's the typical quality of snow on the
scale from Sierra cement to Utah powder?
     I remember being there when I was a kid and Kasprowy looked
awfully steep; then again, even a Christmas tree seemed huge at that
age :-)

Alex Odyniec
From: hudgens@enh.nist.gov
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: RE: Skiing areas around Pittsburgh
Date: 14 Oct 92 13:46:14 GMT
Organization: NIST

In a previous article, df2q+@andrew.cmu.edu (Derek Ting-Kwok Fung) wrote:
>Hi there!  Does any know anything about skiing areas around Pittsburgh? 
>Are there any at all?  I would greatly appreciate any information you
>might have.


The closest area to Pittsburg is probably Hidden Valley and then
Seven Springs. Both are OK for day skiing, but the dork factor at
both areas gets pretty high on weekends. Seven Springs boasts the
largest snowmaking system in the world--and oddly enough, it may be.
A recent article in one of the clone Ski Mags pointed out that 7S can
lay down the deepest snowdepth over its entire slope in the shortest time 
as compared to any other area. 7S's vertical drop has varied over the years.
I think that it is about 870 feet from the highest lift tower to the base
lodge's sump-pump.  Its best asset is that it handles crowds better than
most any other area I've been too--from the entrance, parking, and on
slope.

Hidden Valley is maybe 500 vert ft. I've skied one icy day there but wouldn't
return after the base lodge food service people treated my wife and I like
people-from-Mars when we came in one morning looking for breakfast food
service.  They didn't so much as sell coffee until 10:30 am.

Laurel Mountain used to be a viable area near Pittsburg but shut down 3 years
ago. I've heard that the area was used as part of a land fraud deal. Its
future seems uncertain. Too bad, it could have been expanded into a limited,
but good 1000+ vert drop area.


Blue Knob is probably the only other close area to Pittsburg. This area is
well-named; coldest area I've ever skied--always feels 10 deg colder than]
the thermometer.  The area has one of the only true expert runs in the 
mid-Atlantic. The run is Extrovert, 800 vert drop of good moguls. Even in the
west this run would be regarded well but in the mid-Atlantic it's unique.
Best skied in spring. BTW, last year Blue Knob had some of the best snow I
skied on--east or west. It closed in late March with deep snow depth. 

   If you go to Blue Knob, pack your lunch. The food service has the expense 
of Aspen and is of the lowest quality.  BK has a 1050 vert ft drop.

All these areas are accessed from the Penn Turnpike at either Somerset or
Bedford exits.

Jeff Hudgens
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: waw@emba-news.uvm.edu.UUCP (Wesley Wright,Waterman 113C,6561254)
Subject: Re: What, Raichele SWEDISH? (Re: Boots recommendations wanted)
Originator: waw@griffin
Organization: University of Vermont -- Division of EMBA Computer Facility
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 22:01:08 GMT

From article <BvpEIH.6uB@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu>, by mkoechli@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Marco Koechli):
> In article <dogar.718299024@opal4> dogar@rtsg.mot.com (Haroon H. Dogar) writes:
>>
>>
>Some other Swiss brands (at least skiis) are; Authier and Lacroix,
> both of these are relatively expensive. I've only seen them over there.

Expensive yes, but Lacroix is a French ski, handbuilt by Leo Lacroix, an
old buddy (and one of the few to beat him in the world cup downhill) of
Jean Claude. Lacroix are available here and there in the US. I bought two
pair in Vermont once -- big cities and big resorts like Snowbird carry them,
too.

Skimeister Wes
From: smee@bristol.ac.uk (Paul Smee)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Where to go in France...
Date: 16 Oct 92 16:06:10 GMT
Reply-To: P.Smee@bristol.ac.uk (Paul Smee)
Organization: University of Bristol

In article <f4Yk02Zl25qZ01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> czw70@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com (CA Whitfield) writes:
>In article <1992Oct13.095149.134@bristol.ac.uk> P.Smee@bristol.ac.uk (Paul Smee) writes:
>>If the snow is really good, the Trois Vallees.  You get into religious
>>arguments about which bit is best to be based in.
>>
>I won't bite.  ;-)

Very restrained. :-)  If I recall correctly, Charlie prefers Meribel,
which I said was my least favorite bit.  (Is that 'lower' Meribel, or
Meribel Mottaret, that you recommend?)  Meribel (particularly Mottaret)
does have the advantage of being right in the middle of the area.  I
just don't find it as appealing.  

-- 
Paul Smee, Computing Service, University of Bristol, Bristol BS8 1UD, UK
 P.Smee@bristol.ac.uk - ..!uunet!uknet!bsmail!p.smee - Tel +44 272 303132