From: anson@netcom.com (Anson Kennedy)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.urban
Subject: Re: that'd be in the butt, bob
Date: 24 Jul 92 13:35:27 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

twcaps@tennyson.lbl.gov (Terry Chan) writes:

>artn@bert.eecs.uic.edu (Ellyn Sandor) writes:

>  +> OK, cutting through the noise of what constitutes "proof" or not,
>  +> A friend of mine whose truth and memory I trust claim to have seen the
>  +> episode.  He estimates the date between 1986 and 1988, 

>I was never able to keep up with TV schedules, but when did the Newlywed
>Game go off the air?  My recollection of these stories seemed to circulate
>from the 1970s, but it's pretty damn hazy.

>   [...deleted...]

>Then ahill@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com writes:
>  
>  +If so, then this is a case of life imitating UL, since I heard the Newlywed
>  +Game "in the butt" story long before the 86-88 timeframe (like, during the
>  +late 70's), and it probably started l-o-o-o-n-g before that.

>Thanks for posting this observation, Andy.  BTW, Anson, I don't have 
>your post anymore, but how does Andy's and Ellyn's timeframes jive with 
>when you recall seeing that episode?

I saw it in the 86-88 timeframe, see my follow-up to Ellyn's article for
more details.

>This brings up several issues.  While the question of whether urban

[stuff deleted]

>an examination of the tapes of the program.  The mind is an odd duck,
>at times.

No question about that.

>The brusque manner in which snopes taunts Anson (and others) is
>disconcerting at times, but there is some validity on his point that
>there is nothing to suggest that the comment was actually televised
>on TV.  Many posters have commented on this thread and others that
>"I can believe it happened, given XXXX."  This is not surprising.
>Many urban legends have that quality of plausibility; it helps make it
>a great story.

I don't mind being told that, just because *I* say so doesn't mean it really
occurred.  My memory could be faulty, I could be confusing two separate
events, etc.  Heck, I use that argument against people who report UFOs all
the time [So I shoulda known better before writing here, I know].  However,
I don't use that as an excuse to make fun of the people making the reports.
Ridicule never wins an argument.

>Again, not all urban legends are false, and this one could still be 
>true (for instance, if a tape of such emerges); but since many, if not
>most urban legends are false, and the fact that this story has multiple
>recollections of conflicting times, details, and very similar parallel
>story that supposedly took place in Zimbabwe as posted by Mark Stobbs 
>will make it quite difficult for many to accept it just on the basis
>of one's personal recollection.

I was unaware of the history behind this UL when I posted my first message.
My fault, I should have done some checking before writing.

>Finally, if I recall correctly Anson, you responded strongly to
>snopes and said something to the effect that you were not impressed
>by Brunvand's "proof" and methods of inquiry based on some of those
>books you read.  But I hope that you don't mean to say that just
>because someone researching in an area uses methods that you don't
>respect doesn't mean that you won't try to support your position
>with the best that you can.

It was not I who responded strongly to snopes about Brunvand's "proof."
I will readily concede that Brunvand's research is more than adequate.
The problem is that it contradicts an event of which I have a pretty vivid
memory (I recall telling coworkers about the segment the next day; I saw
it when I was home sick).

So now I intend to do some more checking.  I have an hypothesis about what
might be going on with the story (at least with the version I saw), but I
want to get some corroborating evidence before I stick my neck out any
further. :-)
-- 

Anson Kennedy                                                   anson@netcom.com
Secretary of the Georgia Skeptics (but don't even THINK I speak for them!)

"If you don't watch the violence,    \           "If I had been the Virgin Mary,
you'll never get desensitized to it."  \                I would have said 'No.'"
-Bart Simpson                            \  -Margaret "Stevie" Smith (1902-1971)