HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cjackson@adobe.com (Curtis Jackson)
Subject: Re: Problem with Grand Prix Maintenance Shop
Keywords: grand prix maintainance fraud
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated, Mountain View
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:58:05 GMT

In article <76164@apple.apple.COM> thompson@Apple.COM (Paul Thompson) writes:
}If you find more people with tales of woe it might make the BBB
}take notice.  It also might be worth writing to Yamaha, and 
}explain the situation - they are probably in a better position to
}do something.

I absolutely agree that Grand Pricks sucks rocks; they were the folks
who lost my business when I tried to buy the Seca II and they reneged
on a verbal offer. But I can also in no way condone the suggestion that
one go to the BBB. If anyone can outslime Grand Pricks, it is the BBB.

1) The Better Business Bureau is NOT a government agency, it is a
for-profit corporation.

2) The BBB operates in the following fashion (from personal experience):

a) Sends you a letter welcoming your new business to the community, and
inviting you to join the BBB.

b) Calls you and writes you and calls you and writes you, with the tone
of the contacts becoming increasingly more strident with threats that
are less and less veiled.

c) Eventually they tell you flat out that you had better sign up with
them, because if you don't their corporate policy is to log complaints
(but not accolades) about you anyway. When someone calls to ask about
your business and you have refused their extortion (I've done this),
they say something like, "Well, you know, we can't really tell you
anything about Business X because despite our efforts they wouldn't
agree to sign up with us. So legally we can't give you any details about
them, but we can tell you that we have received several complaints about
Business X, it's just that we can't give you any particulars."

They make themselves sound as official and suspecting as possible, and
many people think they are some government watchdog agency.

All of the above is from experiences with the Greensboro, NC, BBB about
ten years ago. Since then I have heard similar stories from widespread
sources. YEMV (Your Extortion May Vary),
-- 
Curtis Jackson			'91 Black Lab/Blue Heeler "Studley Doright"
cjackson@mv.us.adobe.com	'92 Collie/Golden "George"
DoD #721			'91 Hawk GT	'81 Maxim 650
"I'd rather die while I'm living than live while I'm dead." -- J. Buffett
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: rbp@netcom.com (Bob Pasker)
Subject: thanks!
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:02:45 GMT

thanks to reid ewing for hosting a wonderful breakfast!

and say hellow to JR and Bobby for me.



-- 
-- 
-- bob pasker
-- rbp@netcom.com
--
From: thompson@Apple.COM (Paul Thompson)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Problem with Grand Prix Maintenance Shop
Keywords: grand prix maintainance fraud
Date: 6 Jan 93 06:44:10 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

csk@wdl50.wdl.loral.com (Chuck Kuczaj) writes:

(story of Grand Prix trying to rip him off deleted)

I've never had them do any service for me, but I can't stand that
place just from trying to buy parts there.  I went there the other
day to buy a clutch lever for a late model dual purpose bike, and
they said they didn't stock it, and they'd have to special order
it!  Let me guess, no one has ever tipped over a bike in the dirt
before, right?!  The other time I went into the shop was 4 years
ago when I had my other Yamaha - I needed a float bowl gasket.  They
charged me something like $15 for one gasket, and it wasn't even a
factory part, it was a generic fit-all paper gasket.

>So, does anyone have any recommendations as to what an appropriate
>course of action might be (if any)?

I'm glad you had the savy to protect yourself against these guys.
As to a course of action I guess you could complain to the better
buisiness bureau, though I don't know how much good it would do.
If you find more people with tales of woe it might make the BBB
take notice.  It also might be worth writing to Yamaha, and 
explain the situation - they are probably in a better position to
do something.

-- 
Paul Thompson    Apple Computer    DoD #47    Would you remember a 1-line .sig?
From: txd@ESD.3Com.COM (Tom Dietrich)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Problem with Grand Prix Maintenance Shop
Keywords: grand prix maintainance fraud
Date: 11 Jan 93 04:10:39 GMT

lemay@netcom.com (Laura Lemay) writes:

>I've never bought anything at Yamaha Grand Prix, but just walking in
>there makes my skin crawl.  I don't know what it is about the atmosphere
>in dealers but Yamaha Grand Prix just ooozes slime.

>I've also head nothing but negative comments via word-of-mouth -- I
>woulnd't take a bike there if I was running on half a cylinder and
>no oil (I'd go to the Kawasaki dealer across the street. :)

Laura, I think that you may have the two shops confused. Grand Prix
is a Yamaha/Kawasaki dealership. The dealership across the street from
them is (I think) South bay Cycles. They area a Suzuki/Ducati
dealership, and (even though one of the guys that works there is a
friend/aquaintence) to me, positively oozes slime. By the way, I like
the service tha tI've gotten at Grand Prix.

*********************************************************************
'86 Concours.....Sophisticated Lady            Tom Dietrich             
'72 1000cc Sportster.....'Ol Sport               DoD # 055
^^^^^^^^^^^It *LIVES*^^^^^^^^^^^^^              AMA #524245
                                    Cool as a rule, but sometimes....
Two Jousts and a Gather, *BIG fun!*            (H. Lewis)
e-mail txd@Able.MKT.3Com.COM                   Ma Bell (408) 738-8301
Disclaimer: 3Com takes no responsibility for opinions preceding this.

*********************************************************************
From: alpha@w6yx.Stanford.EDU (Alpha Schram)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Can't I do better on insurance?
Date: 12 Jan 1993 19:50:34 GMT
Organization: Stanford University Amateur Radio Club, California USA
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: w6yx.stanford.edu

In article <1993Jan12.165455.20415@wdl.loral.com> csk@wdl50.wdl.loral.com (Chuck Kuczaj) writes:
>
>State Farm said they only cover bikes if you have your cage insured
>with them as well.
>
This must depend on the agent.  I just got my insurance yesterday from Jean at 
the State Farm office in Palo Alto and my VW cage is insured with AAA (who
won't even TOUCH motorcycles!).

Alpha 
-- 
Alpha Schram	    	ROMANI ITE DOMUM 	    alpha@w6yx.stanford.edu
1974 CB360 (Sexy Sadie)      "It's not a big motorcycle,
					 just a groovy little motorbike..."

Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: markt@cup.hp.com (Mark Thompson)
Subject: Re: Good place to buy Metzlers? Installation?
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 23:53:28 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Hewlett-Packard
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1scd1 PL4

Road Rider
or
Santa Clara Cycle Salvage

Mark
From: robinson@cogsci.Berkeley.EDU (Michael Robinson)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: does this count as lane splitting?
Date: 5 Jan 93 23:05:18 GMT
Organization: Institute of Cognitive Studies, U.C. Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: cogsci.berkeley.edu

In article <MGSMITH.93Jan5082026@hpl.hp.com> mgsmith@hpl.hp.com (Michael Smith) writes:
>Cool way to get squished!  How do you know that the cars are not
>going to turn right? 

Or suddenly open the passenger door to drop someone off (hey, it happens).

Be careful.  Be prepared.



-- 
  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Michael Robinson                          UUCP:   ucbvax!cogsci!robinson
                                        INTERNET: robinson@cogsci.berkeley.edu
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: does this count as lane splitting?
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 16:24:07 GMT

In article <1993Jan4.183325.24261@netcom.com> lemay@netcom.com (Laura Lemay) writes:

>First of all, congratulate me:  as of 8:24 this morning I passed my
>motorcycle road test.  I be a real motorcyclist now.

>Now, the question:

>If one is in the rightmost lane, and one wants to turn right, but all
>the cars ahead of you are going straight, how legal is it to zip up
>on the right side between the cars and the sidewalk to get up to the
>front so one can turn right?

>Does that count as lane splitting, or as riding on the shoulder?  

If you ARE in fact making a right turn, it is lane splitting. If you are 
just zipping up past a LONNNNNNNNNG line of cars (who? me?), it can be 
condsidered riding on the shoulder if the cop is in a nasty mood.

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - These opinions are not so much opinions, as pearls of wisdom. Any-
one disagreeing is obviously either a) a snivelling, whining, mentally-
deficient, weak-willed, inconsequential, namby-pamby tool of some vague but
conveniently defined conspiracy, or b) my wife.
From: kmac@cisco.com (Karl MacRae)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: FJ to trade for a cruiser
Date: 12 Jan 1993 21:53:13 GMT
Organization: cisco Systems, Menlo Park, CA
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: regal.cisco.com


	OK, so, I'm having trouble deciding what to do here.

	I like my FJ. IT's a bitchin' ride.

	But I also want a cruiser.

	But I don't wanna go through the headache of selling one and hunting
	the other.


		SO, here's the deal;


	I've got an 1990 FJ1200 worth about $5k.

	I'd like to trade for a cruiser of similar value (A Shadow,
	Virago, Invader or Vulcan).


		If you're interested, email me and we'll talk
	details..... 



			-Karl, Mr Undecided




  -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
  Karl Elvis MacRae	Software Release Support	Cisco Systems
  kmac@cisco.com -or- batman@cisco.com     415-688-8231   DoD# 1999  FJ1200
  -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
   "You can't upset us! We're the MTV generation;
				 	We feel neither highs, nor lows."
			-Lisa Simpson
From: wallich@ncd.com (Ken Wallich)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Kikustaatu-Do: The Way of Kickstart
Date: 6 Jan 93 22:32:17 GMT
Reply-To: wallich@ncd.com (Ken Wallich)
Distribution: usa

doc@webrider.central.sun.com (Steve Bunis) writes:

>Anyone know of any recently made bikes in the 750-1100 range that can have a
>kick start added?

Any model BMW R-bike can have a kickstarter added, including the ever
popular R100GS.  It's not cheap (They figured it would cost about $1k
to add one when I asked), and I was advised that kicking one of these
puppies over is nothing like kicking over my 'ol Honda CB550/4 or my
dearly departed GB500.  It's apparently quite an art to kick over one
of these German beasties without injuring either yourself or the bike.

I figured to save a grand, I could just do the 'ol running start,
considering the low probability of a BMW R-bike electrical system
leaving me stranded somewhere far from home ;-).


-- 
Ken Wallich

wallich@ncd.com ~ ken@wallich.com ~ kmw@al.org ~ [...]decwrl!vixie!amber!ken
From: wallich@ncd.com (Ken Wallich)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: does this count as lane splitting?
Date: 5 Jan 93 00:56:42 GMT
Reply-To: wallich@ncd.com (Ken Wallich)

lemay@netcom.com (Laura Lemay) writes:

>First of all, congratulate me:  as of 8:24 this morning I passed my
>motorcycle road test.  I be a real motorcyclist now.

If I must, Congratulations.  Now you can ride with passengers at night.
Look out world...

>Now, the question:
>
>If one is in the rightmost lane, and one wants to turn right, but all
>the cars ahead of you are going straight, how legal is it to zip up
>on the right side between the cars and the sidewalk to get up to the
>front so one can turn right?
>
>Does that count as lane splitting, or as riding on the shoulder?  

You mention 'sidewalk' so I assume you're talking specifically about
city streets and not the freeway.  The vehicle code specifies that you
can pull to the right (like crossing bike lanes and such) for a turn
50 feet prior to the intersection, both cars and bikes (no matter how
long the dotted line is, if there is one, BTW, new in '92, I think).

If you're in the city between a car and the sidewalk, I'd imagine the
citation would be 'passing on the right', or some such drivel, since
there is no 'shoulder', but I'm shooting in the dark here (although,
having been cited for passing on the shoulder on the freeway, I should
be better informed :-).

I'm (fairly) certain that it is not considered 'lane splitting', since
you are not in-between two lanes (the same way as passing someone on
the outside of the fast lane of the freeway is a big no-no), and
everything I've heard from the people who enforce the laws is that if
you are not inbetween two lanes, you are cruisin' for a revenue
enhancement certificate.

I am not a revenue enhancement officer, or a revenue enhancement court
official, however, so my interpretation is worth just what you paid
for it.


-- 
---
Ken Wallich

wallich@ncd.com ~ ken@wallich.com ~ kmw@al.org ~ [...]decwrl!vixie!amber!ken
From: robinson@cogsci.Berkeley.EDU (Michael Robinson)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Problem with Grand Prix Maintenance Shop
Date: 7 Jan 1993 00:49:08 GMT
Organization: Institute of Cognitive Studies, U.C. Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: cogsci.berkeley.edu
Keywords: grand prix maintainance fraud

In article <1993Jan6.013650.20656@wdl.loral.com> csk@wdl50.wdl.loral.com (Chuck Kuczaj) writes:
>I decided it would be a wise investment to purchase the genuine maintenance
>manual, a compression gauge, and a set of feeler gauges.

You are, however, to be commended for your resourcefulness.


-- 
  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Michael Robinson                          UUCP:   ucbvax!cogsci!robinson
                                        INTERNET: robinson@cogsci.berkeley.edu
From: strange@cats.ucsc.edu (Joseph Russack)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Right Hand Turns
Date: 6 Jan 1993 07:50:46 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: am.ucsc.edu


In article <1993Jan5.225850.5584@netcom.com> edg@netcom.com (Ed Greenberg) writes:
>My own _guess_ is that somebody important got caught at that corner and
>used some influence to get the shoulder restriped (actually, unstriped.)

  Actually, it's more possible that some irate citizen wrote to city hall. 
Aparently, it's not hard to petition to have small changes like that made.
Anyone can do it, and if your have more signatures, so much the better. So, if
you want smarter roads in your area, start innundating your local city hall.
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: cjackson@adobe.com (Curtis Jackson)
Subject: Good place to buy Metzlers? Installation?
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated, Mountain View
Distribution: ba
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 22:14:27 GMT

I am in the market for a set of Metzlers for my new Honda Hawk.
Assuming that I am not comfortable with removing my own wheels, and
would rather pay someone to do the full install, where is a good
place to purchase Metzlers, and where is a good place to get them
installed?

There really should be a FAQ specifically for ba.motorcycles.
If life ever slows down enough I might just volunteer to be
the keeper of such a beast.
-- 
Curtis Jackson			'91 Black Lab/Blue Heeler "Studley Doright"
cjackson@mv.us.adobe.com	'92 Collie/Golden "George"
DoD #721			'91 Hawk GT	'81 Maxim 650
"I'd rather die while I'm living than live while I'm dead." -- J. Buffett
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: georgew@hspice.portal.com (George Wu)
Subject: Re: Good place to buy Metzlers? Installation?
Organization: Meta - Software
Distribution: ba
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 01:47:01 GMT

In article <1993Jan9.221427.8555@adobe.com> cjackson@adobe.com (Curtis Jackson) writes:

>I am in the market for a set of Metzlers for my new Honda Hawk.
>Assuming that I am not comfortable with removing my own wheels, and
>would rather pay someone to do the full install, where is a good
>place to purchase Metzlers, and where is a good place to get them
>installed?

     I bought a set from Cycle Gear in Richmond.  I do not recommend them.
They were nice enough people, chatting with me and all, but their service
wasn't the best.  I got my bike back a couple of hours later than promised,
which meant I was standing around the shop for a long time.  The *kid* doing
the work was nice enough, but he wasn't very careful with his work.  My
painted rims got alot of scratches, not to mention the kid slipped more than
once leaning on the tire iron and almost brained himself in the process.  The
cost for an V.400R18 ME99 rear and 100/90R16 ME33 Laser front set me back
around $170 including tax and installation.

>There really should be a FAQ specifically for ba.motorcycles.
>If life ever slows down enough I might just volunteer to be
>the keeper of such a beast.

     I've been stockpiling what I deem to be content-rich postings about local
shops, but none yet on tire installation.  Also, I only read ba.moto, and not
all of it.

							George


-- 
----
George J Wu,  Superior Maker of Technical Snafus,  georgew@metasw.com
Meta-Software,  1300 White Oaks Road,  Campbell, CA 95008,  (408) 369-5400
Never be the first to believe.  Never be the last to deceive.  ---  Chess
From: txd@ESD.3Com.COM (Tom Dietrich)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Problem with Grand Prix Maintenance Shop
Keywords: grand prix maintainance fraud
Date: 11 Jan 93 03:50:27 GMT

strange@cats.ucsc.edu (Joseph Russack) writes:


>In article <1993Jan6.013650.20656@wdl.loral.com> csk@wdl50.wdl.loral.com (Chuck Kuczaj) writes:
>IN WRITING. Then, with estimate and a tune-up and evaluation by another more
>reputable shop, go to the BBB and show them. 
>They can advise you on other steps to take. I'd also write to citybike, 
>and (lastly, but most importantly) confront the manager. 

I wish that I had seen the initial article here so that I had a better
background. If you haven't talked to the manager, and have a problem,
certainly go and talk to him. Out of all of the shops that I've dealt
within the area, they have been the best. I don't deal with juvinile
machanics, always with the service manager. (I can't remember the
man's name right now) I've never had problems there, as a matter of
fact, he has "gone the extra mile" on a number of instances. 

As in any dealings with others, I'd avoid "confronting" the manager,
the term envokes a vision of a confrontational attitude that will not
do any good at all. Go in and talk. If you go in with an obvious chip
on your shoulder, chances are that you will have problems. It's that
way anywhere.

Does *anybody* have an absolutely *better* shop in the area? I haven't
found one. Sure, the parts droids are often idiots, and there's a high
turnover there. Sales slime are as always, sales slime, I'm convinced
that slime is a prerequisite. 

*********************************************************************
'86 Concours.....Sophisticated Lady            Tom Dietrich             
'72 1000cc Sportster.....'Ol Sport               DoD # 055
^^^^^^^^^^^It *LIVES* ^^^^^^^^^^^^              AMA #524245
                                    Cool as a rule, but sometimes....
Two Jousts and a Gather, *BIG fun!*            (H. Lewis)
e-mail txd@Able.MKT.3Com.COM                   Ma Bell (408) 738-8301
Disclaimer: 3Com takes no responsibility for opinions preceding this.

*********************************************************************
From: arturo@informix.com (Arturo Vega)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Good place to buy Metzlers? Installation?
Date: 12 Jan 93 18:26:34 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

karish@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Chuck Karish) writes:

>In article <C0prp4.8Cx@cup.hp.com> markt@cup.hp.com (Mark Thompson) writes:
>>Road Rider
>>or
>>Santa Clara Cycle Salvage

>Road Rider doesn't install tires.  Santa Clara Cycle Salvage
>and their sister store in Fremont do.
>--

They installed mine, but I had to take the wheels off the motorcycle
and bring them to the shop. (I guess you could bring your tools and
dismantle the bike in the parking lot :-)

>    Chuck Karish          karish@mindcraft.com
>    (415) 323-9000 x117   karish@pangea.stanford.edu

Later,

Art
arturo@informix.com
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: marc@dumbcat.sf.ca.us (Marco S Hyman)
Subject: Re: Winter Gloves (Was: Re: Attn all riders!!!)
Organization: MSH Software, Hayward, CA
Distribution: ba
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 04:20:57 GMT

In article <1ia757INNoqo@fido.asd.sgi.com> danac@morc.asd.sgi.com (Dana Crom) writes:
 > Paul is our local bike evangelist - too involved in pushing bikes to
                                                       ^^^^^^^
 > dream of giving false advice ;-).

The image I get is probably not the one you meant :-).  In any case I wasn't
doubting the advice, just curious.


Happy new year,

// marc
-- 
marc@dumbcat.sf.ca.us -- pacbell!dumbcat!marc
From: danac@morc.asd.sgi.com (Dana Crom)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Winter gas
Followup-To: ba.motorcycles
Date: 4 Jan 1993 20:51:47 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc., Mountain View, CA
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: morc.asd.sgi.com

In article <1993Jan3.225747.5114@netcom.com> avery@netcom.com (Avery Ray Colter) writes:
>thompson@Apple.COM (Paul Thompson) writes:
>
>>Not that anyone asked, but my mileage went down 15% with the new
>>gas.
>
>I was wondering why in hell my little Nighthawk's mileage went from
>80 mpg to 50 mpg.

Mileage on my 650 Nighthawk went from 50-51 MPG to 42-43 MPG.  Some of that
may be warmup time, but I am looking forward to summer gas again. If I had
a big enough storage tank, I would stock up for winter, but the idea of
50-100 gallons of gas sitting around the garage makes me a bit nervous.
-- 
-----------------------+------------------------+------------------------------
Dana Crom    DoD #0679 | Silicon Graphics, Inc. |  Smile - let them *WONDER* 
danac@morc.asd.sgi.com | (415) 390-1449         |  what you've been up to . . .
From: wgale@starchild.Eng.Sun.COM (Wendy Gale)
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
Subject: Wanted: Kawasaki Side & Top Boxes
Date: 12 Jan 93 20:52:17 GMT
Reply-To: wgale@starchild.Eng.Sun.COM
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: starchild

Anybody out there got some used side and top boxes for a Kawasaki Police
Special that they want to sell?

call Beth
(408) 243-1968
Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles
From: lemay@netcom.com (Laura Lemay)
Subject: does this count as lane splitting?
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:33:25 GMT





First of all, congratulate me:  as of 8:24 this morning I passed my
motorcycle road test.  I be a real motorcyclist now.


Now, the question:

If one is in the rightmost lane, and one wants to turn right, but all
the cars ahead of you are going straight, how legal is it to zip up
on the right side between the cars and the sidewalk to get up to the
front so one can turn right?

Does that count as lane splitting, or as riding on the shoulder?  



-- 
*********************************************************
Laura Lemay                              lemay@netcom.com
writer of trifles in shadows and blood
*********************************************************

Newsgroups: ba.motorcycles