From: jcopelan@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (The One and Only)
Newsgroups: alt.atheism
Subject: Re: Dealing with annoying e-mail: A real life example!
Date: 15 Dec 92 22:34:54 GMT
Organization: The Ohio State University

Another way to deal with annoying email is to post it here for all to shred.
So please send your responses, with an attached copy of the FAQ to this person.

Now, I know posting email is contrary to netiquette, but I don't have time
to respond personally right now, and much of his writing is covered by the FAQ.

Just to set his email in the right perspective, he first sent me unsolicited
email (about my "keep christ in christmas" post) stating that removing religion
from public life (schools, governments, etc.) would promote Atheism.  I 
responded by explaining that religious neutrality is not the same as 
pro-Atheism.  This is his response:


From ldh@eedsp.gatech.edu Fri Dec 11 10:52:37 1992
Reply-To: "Lonnie D. Harvel" <ldh@gauss.eedsp.gatech.edu>
Subject: Re: "Keep Christ in Christmas" 
Organization: EE/DSP Georgia Tech 
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 92 10:52:00 -0500
From: Lonnie Harvel <ldh@eedsp.gatech.edu>



Atheism is not a religion, it is a religious belief.

Defining <atheism> with Webster-Dictionary.
--------------------------------
athe-ism \'a-the-,iz-em\ n
[MF athe'isme, fr. athe'e atheist, fr. Gk atheos godless,
     fr. a- + theos god]
(1546)
1a: a disbelief in the existence of deity
1b: the doctrine that there is no deity


Beliefs and doctrines are a matter of faith.


I will agree that, as a rule, public funds should not be used
for religious purposes.  But to exclude religion, from events
which for thousands of years have been religious, is to promote
the idea or religous belief that there is no god.  The only
REAL alternative is to just not have any celebrations during
the time period.  Remove the lights, they  are connected to
the Christian, Jewish, and Hindu celebration.  Remove the
trees, they are part of the Christian and Pagan celebration.
You can keep the songs like "Let it Snow", but you have to
lose "Winter Wonderland" because it makes reference to
"Parson Brown."

Houston High School District, 1992 - the Thanksgiving/Pilgrim
package made no reference to Church, Religion, or God.  The
term Pilgrim was defined as "Travelers escaping political
persecution.  This removal of religion promotes an atheistic view.

Fort Lauderdale, Broward County Schools, 1980 - the history
text made absolutely no reference to God or Relgion in the
entire "Founding of America" section.  The physics text said,
"Before mankind became eductated enough to discard the 
superstitous belief in a Supreme Being..."  Obvious promotion
of atheism

University of Georgia, 1984 - the biology text says,
"... instead of maintaining the ridiculous notion of a
Supreme Being, science has advanced to the more enlightened
view which places no faith in theism."  Obvious promotion
of atheism

And this is only a few of the ones that I have encountered
personally.  It is incredibly naive to think that the 
removal of religion from schools and public functions, but
allowing statements opposed to religion does not support a
RELIGIOUS veiw that their is not god.


I am NOT in favor of school prayer, for the same reason.  It
implies that the childred SHOULD be praying.

Freedom of religion means that any religion is free to practice
its faith, without persectuion.  Separation of Church and State
was to keep the state from imposing its views on religion, 
or creating a state religion.

By your views, 60% of the population can not have their children
sing songs at their schools, or town functions because 5% of the
population doesn't like the meaning of the texts, and 20% of the
population doesn't agree with the text.  But 5% of the population
can have their view of religion expressed whenever and however
they please.  Give me a break.

And Atheism is a religion by the following definitions:

"a personal of religious attitudes, beliefs or practices."
  
   - there is no proof for the non-existence of god, therefore,
     it is a matter of belief.

"a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to by faith."



The definitions come from Webster.



----------------------------------------------------------------
     The comments and spelling herein are mine and nobody
                     else lays claim to them.
================================================================
Lonnie D. Harvel                 |  ldh@eedsp.gatech.edu
School of Electrical Engineering |  
Georgia Institue of Technology   |  "quisque suis patimur manis" 
Atlanta, GA  30332-0250          |  Virgil


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