HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mesm@netcom.com (Mary E. S. Morris)
Subject: Re: Psychic Defence. Help needed
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 92 05:34:42 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

braca2@cspyr1.cs.adfa.oz.au (BRAY CHRISTOPHER) writes:
: Ok, I may be acting a bit silly but I feel that I may be the target
: of a sub/concious psychic attack of some sort.
: 
:
I'm not sure what clues make you think that you are. If you
could get something semi tangible, you can spend you time 
trying to redirect things back to the instigator(s).
Much like a martial art, turn thier force on them. But
two wrongs don't make a right.

Find a place that you can call a sanctuary. Go there and get
your self at peak energy. Once you are not weak, you
can try a few things

1) Confront them.

2) Role-play a confrontation in your mind. Recharge yourself.
Play out the confronatation again. Reenergize. Lather, rinse
repeat. This is called desensitization.
 
3) Study them as the predetor watches the prey.

One note here: Some of the things here I do not practice because
of my previous encounters with karmic cycles. It is better
for you in the long run if you deflect or dissapate their 
forces, than if you would attack them directly.

--
Mary E. S. Morris    |  The future exists first in imagination, then
mesm@netcom.COM      |  in will, then in reality. -- Galivan Burwell
=====================================================================
Netcom - Online Communication Services San Jose, CA
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 10:03:22 -0400 
From: Kerwin Yap Chua <kc3u+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Origins of Pentagram

>From: rmr@acsu.buffalo.edu (Richard M. Romanowski)
>Subject: Origins of Pentagram
>Date: 10 Sep 92 15:33:55 GMT
>
>
>	About the only thing I DID learn (besides modern Polish language)
>when I fried in Poland this summer was that extremely old excavations >in
>northern Poland showed the Pentagram and the hexagram (with a >central
>point inserted in the latter) on seals.  Also shown were various 
>swastikas, crosses, etc.  Did it ortiginate in Mesopotamia and get carried
>around Europe?  Or is it just a basic diagram that appeals to the human
>brain?.


As I wrote previously, yes I believe that the pentagram originated in
Mesopotamia, along with the myth of the flood, the promise of the
rainbow, the idea of original sin, and the suffering just.  The
pentagram was supposedly a symbol of the "Ancient Race" that mankind
evolved from.  It's not an uncommon idea for something in a religion to
have its origins in Mesopotamia, because theirs is the oldest religion
we have on record, and the Mesopotamians did have diplomatic relations
as far off as China and Egypt (inferred from the appearance of cuniform
tablets in Egyptian excavations, according to the late Dr. Edward
Chiera).  A trade of cultures and ideas would not be uncalled for.



Kendrick Kerwin Chua

kc3u+@andrew.cmu.edu    or
kendrick+@CMU.EDU

Cthulhu for President, 1992!
Xref: sparky alt.magick:4253 alt.satanism:1945
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Newsgroups: alt.magick,alt.satanism
Subject: Re: ritual curse against an enemy (help wanted :-)
Date: 4 Sep 92 20:30:50 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

tedrick@melody.Berkeley.EDU (Tom Tedrick) writes:

>Can anyone tell me (or recommend a source for) some ritual curses
>to use against enemies (assuming this is legal, are we still free
>to do this kind of thing these days?)

Well, I don't know about the legal aspects, but I can tell you that most 
practitioners consider hexing VERY UNETHICAL in *almost* all circumstances.
(I was involved in one action which can be considered a hex--there had been too
many rapes locally, so we simply said that we wanted them STOPPED, no matter
what effects that had on the rapists.  This decision was made in a council of
the Community I am involved in, and noone spoke against it, though some did not
fell able to participate in it.)  If you do use a hex, and any halfway competent
practitioner becomes aware of it, that practitioner is very likely to throw the
damn thing back in your face--often with interest!  Make sure that you are 
willing to deal with all the possible consequences of any magic you do.

>It's getting so you can't make a move without violating some law,
>and enemies endlessly interrupting and interfering with ones routines
>as if they have some divine right given by the state to step on you
>despite one not having initiated any kind of hexing or interference
>is getting out of hand.

You sound pretty paranoid to me.  I don't seem to have any trouble with
"enemies".  Maybe you are creating your own problems.  (And I am not talking
Newage here, just plain sense--you think everyone is out to get you, and people
are likely to start disliking you because you are being either sneaky and 
deceptive or confrontational and abusive.) 

I hope thigs get better with you.


              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)

******************************************************************************
Newage is hypoallergenic spirituality--
it's for people who are allergic to the word religion.
                                   --Jon Jay Obermark
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: mcmorris@vet.vet.purdue.edu (brandywine)
Subject: Re: about attacks and so forth as they pertain to empathy
Organization: Purdue University SVM
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 15:57:29 GMT

In article <JOSHUA.92Sep6071335@bailey.cpac.washington.edu> joshua@cpac.washington.edu (Joshua Geller) writes:
>
>In article <Bu4yBG.5u@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> mcmorris@vet.vet.purdue.edu 
>(brandywine) writes:
>
>>   In article <JOSHUA.92Sep4123934@dharma.cpac.washington.edu> 
>joshua@cpac.washington.edu (Joshua Geller) writes:
>
>>   >In article <Bu26w8.DyF@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> mcmorris@vet.vet.purdue.edu 
>>   >(brandywine) writes:
>
>>   >>   about attacks and so forth....
>>   >>   [lots of more than usually self-important stuff deleted]
>
>>   >what are you, about 19?
>
>>   why josh, I thoguht this was an open forum
>>   forgive me for trying to share....
>>   if by self important, you meant important to me... 
>
>no, that's not what self-important means.
>
>>                                                      it is
>>   but I shared it not to look good, but to make a point....
>>   thankfully, I am not so over sensitive that I will let your obvious
>>   *FLAME* 
>
>well, you are oversensitve enough to see a flame that isn't there. ask
>tagi or BA how I express myself when I flame someone. I asked you how old
>you were. I notice you didn't answer.
>

I am 22 years old...
Not that it matters...

>>   prevent me from posting.....
>>   nice try tho....
>
>now, whatever gave you the idea that I was trying to prevent you from
>posting. If I wanted to prevent you, or anyone else from posting. I
>would just do it. cancelling someone elses messages is trivial.
>
>regards,
>josh

perhaps I was oversenstive....
but reguardless, I don't see the point my age makes.
I would prefer to take this to email if you want to explain it to me...
-brandywine

Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: friday@netcom.com (Carol Anne Ogdin)
Subject: Re: just a question
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 92 01:39:36 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In <1992Sep8.235523.2763@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> tag@hermes.ecn.purdue.edu (Tony A. Gibbens) writes:


>listening to various friends and reading various post, I have a question.
>Is it possible for a person, without any training or conscience effort,
>to act as a magnet (lack of a better term) or what-ever for "unusual" events?

Sure.  Noticing that such a thing has happened is what got some of us
into this newsgroup in the first place.  Such kinds of things happened to
me and so I started wondering, "If I *understood* what I'm doing, could I
do it more often or better?"  Fortunately, I don't understand enough
more to diminish the purported ability...and I can't explain it in a way
that makes sense to anybody else, anyway...so no harm done!  :-)
-- 
---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---
    - Friday -                      "Practice random acts of kindness 
      friday@well.sf.ca.us                      and senseless beauty."
      (aka Carol Anne Ogdin@Santa Clara, CA)
From: dgd@csd.bu.edu (David Durand)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: The pentagram
Date: 10 Sep 92 22:18:45 GMT
	<BuAtD0.Ftp@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> <65566@cup.portal.com>
Organization: Roberstool Research Labs
In-reply-to: Tagi@cup.portal.com's message of 10 Sep 92 01:32:08 GMT

In regards to the "fundamentalism" or "orientism" of useing the terms
upright and inverted for pentagrams:
   Tagi, is seems that once again you are playing the game of using
your own (private) definitions of words and then complaining the rest
of the world doesn't follow them. In a traditional context (say GD for
example) the terms inverted and upright simply refer to the only 2
bilaterally symmetric ways to draw a penatagram. This convenient binary
opposition is said to correspond to certain types of forces
(spiritual/material). (Note that this orientation also corresponds to
the only way you'd get a pentagram-shaped talisman to stay upright if
you made one, so perhaps the temrinology is just "gravitationalist").

    A Christian fundamentalist claiming that the pentagram _is_ in
_all circumstances_ a symbol of Satan (construed only in terms of
his/her own fundamentalist mythology) would deserve correction. As
simple identifying terms they need not be corrected. If you really
object, you could simply use your preferred terms point-up/point-down
and let the magick of example work its effect. Posting like this seems
to give the lie to my own argument -- here I am wasting time on
something I claim is not worth discussion. But then again, so many of
your postings seem like nit-picking over common, relatively
unambiguous words.  But enough of them _are_ interesting that a
kill-file is inappropriate. So maybe you can calm down over other
people's terminology, when used without prejudice -- even if you'd
prefer another term for your own reasons.

    -- David Durand
From: amanda@INTERCON.COM (Amanda Walker)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Smalltalk
Date: 9 Sep 92 05:51:56 GMT

cal@otter.hpl.hp.com (Colin Low) writes:
> Anyway, I have flogged this horse enough. Smalltalk and Kabbalah have become
> inextricably mixed up in my head, and I can't program a Smalltalk system
> without a wide-eyed sense of wonder. I can't think about a reference
> counting garbage collector without a vision of death on a pale horse.
> Or Samael.

Anyone else who understands what Colin is talking about, and sees the 
parallels he pointed out, needs to read the Self papers (check the OOPSLA 
proceedings for the last couple of years).  Great stuff, and even more mind-
bending than SmallTalk was.  Think of the compiler as the unconscious mind...


Amanda Walker
amanda@intercon.com

Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: saucc00@DMI.USherb.CA (CHRISTIAN SAUCIER)
Subject: adresses of OTO
Organization: Universite de Sherbrooke -- departement Math-Info
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 05:18:38 GMT

I would like to have some adresses of the OTO in Canada, specially in
Toronto or Montreal.  I do have some adresses in California that I
could contact but I tought it might be faster to ask it here on the
Net.

You can Email me at saucc00@tohi.dmi.usherb.ca

Thanks,

C.

-- 
Above the gemmed azure is
   The naked splendour of Nuit;
She bends in ecstasy to kiss
   The secret ardours of Hadit
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath)
Subject: Re: ASTRAL PLANE
Reply-To: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 20:31:03 GMT

In article <83950140@otter.hpl.hp.com>, cal@otter.hpl.hp.com (Colin Low) writes:
|> Bill Eichman writes 
|> >  cal@otter.hpl.hp.com (Colin Low) writes:
|> >
|> >> OBE is an amazing experience, magical in every sense, and I'm surprised
|> >> how rarely it is mentioned here. For those who haven't experienced it 
|> >> I'll say the following:
|> >> 
|> >> I haven't a clue how to tell anyone how to do it. I think it is 80%
|> >> physiology and 20% psychology; if I don't get the physiological conditions
|> >> right, nothing happens. Mild fasting seems to help considerably in my
|> >> case.
|> >> 
|> >
|> >Maybe you could give more detailed descriptions about the when, how, and 
|> >what of the experience for us?
|> >
|> >What exactly led up to it, how long did it last, and how successfully 
|> >have you been able to recreate/reliably produce it??
|> >
|> There has been a lot written about it, and my experience tallies closely with
|> written accounts. 
[Fascinating account deleted]

As far as I know, some people have OBE's spontaneously, and some
get better and better at it (as CL apparently has).  Others never 
have them.  I have yet to find any convincing evidence that anyone 
can teach someone else how to have an OBE.  (I have received much 
advice, mostly boiling down to 1.  You have to really want to, and 
2.  Keep trying.)

Folks who have OBE's easily are sure everybody can have them too, 
but I'm not at all sure that is true.  Only about one in ten people 
seem to have OBE's spontaneously, and most of those have only one.  
Very few people have OBEs a lot, and few can have them whenever 
they wish.

I might also point out that evidence that anything actually leaves
your body during an OBE is very shaky.  The experience is fascinating
and scary for some people, CL comments, the world seen is not
an accurate rendition of the outside world.

I might also point out that Susan Blackmore, possibly the most
imporant student of this phenomenon today, says that to explain
the OBE psychology must explain the "In The Body Experience".
The IBE is not currently explicable by psychology, and neither
is the OBE.

By the way, Blackmore's classic book "Beyond the Body" is supposed
to be appearing (finally) in paperback about now.  Get it, read it
and don't leave your body without it!

-- 
  Robert E. McGrath
  Urbana Illinois
  mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
From: oispeggy@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Peggy Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Spirit in the house, and parents won't listen...
Date: 9 Sep 92 20:27:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <lasglkINNsvn@aludra.usc.edu>, eburke@aludra.usc.edu (Kethry) writes...
> 
>Thanks for the advice.  As for ignoring it, I do and it goes away, and

Exactly.  It gets bored when you pay no attention to it, so it 
leaves.

>then when I completely forget about it, it comes back....

Well, it just wants to see if you'll notice it again when your 
guard is down, and you do, so it stays around

Its feeding off you.  In fact, you probably created it in the 
first place.  Very common where spirits are concerned.

As in most relationships, you're probably getting something out 
of this too, however warped that may sound.  If you could get rid 
of it long enough, then you might outgrow it.

>I'll try the air permeable/spirit impermeable material...to do this I
>just believe that it is what I want while I am making it, right?

Yes, as long as you believe it will work, then it will work.

>Thanks...

Your welcome.

>Bright Blessings,
>Kethry

Let me know what happens.

- Peggy -
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: shava@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Shava Nerad Averett)
Subject: Re: Easter's date <was: Re: The pentagram>
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 01:11:06 GMT

In article <Bu2LIE.J40@news.cso.uiuc.edu> ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe) writes:
>As I said before, the date of Easter is based on the date for Passover--not
>any pagan calendar.  (Actually, I'm not sure that there were sustantial
>celebrations of the Spring Equinox in European or Middle Eastern paganism at
>the time.  The "Wheel of the Year" used by neo-pagans is artificial.
>
Remember that the seasons are considerably different in the southern medi-
terranean than in northern europe.  And Bran is correct: the date for 
easter is based on an approximation on passover, a jewish holiday.  In
the eastern orthodox church it is estimated using an algorithm that 
causes it to fall even closer to the date of the first day of passover --
the formula stated earlier is the roman catholic formula.

>BTW, substitute "the Spring Equinox" for "March 22".  The equinox moves around
>a bit.  Passover is, in one reckoning of it, the first full moon after the
>equinox.  I believe that modern Judaism uses a different new year, though, than
>was used for this reckoning.  

>Disclaimer: I am goy.  Jews are invited to correct any errors of detail.

If you were, you'd be 'goyishe' or 'a goy,' but you ain't no honkey, bro.
Just a gentile.  Be kind to yourself...;)

Elisheva Nerad Averett
Jewnitarian Pagan Eclectic
-- 
Shava Nerad Averett				shava_averett@unc.edu
/*  all materials (c)1992, Shava Nerad Averett, and have nothing significant
    to do with the University of North Carolina, a mostly owned subsidiary 
    of the NC Legislature, a mostly owned subsidiary of the DOT.      */
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: joshua@coombs.anu.edu.au (Joshua Geller)
Subject: Re: Authors not Crowley
Organization: Computer Services Centre, Australian National University
Date:  7 Sep 92 14:24:03 GMT

v085r6qm@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Erin D Markle) writes:


>Hello, all. I'm new to the networks... and to computers,
>really...(does anyone remember TRs 80 model 3?) ANYHOW,
>I am not anti-Crowley, or anti-ANYONE for that matter,
>I was wondering though why there wasn't more talk about
>other, less cryptically profound authors [see below(*)]

>                                        . I don't mean
>that there should be less talk about anyone, it's just
>that I've been catching up on old dialouge (as if you
>couldn't tell by my light-stepping due to the rather
>rational compulsion to avoid FLAMING,...whew..,) and

why would anyone worry about that? seriously. 
>[...]

>     Authors such as the late W.E. Butler, liberal Catholic
>priest/magician (and student of Dion Fortune) have been of
>much interest to me lately. David Conway (Magic: an Occult
>Primer and The Secret Wisdom) is another I would like to
>hear more about. If anyone is interested, I think that a
>thread about contemporary author/practioners would be a very
>useful refernce tool. 

please discuss these things if you wish to see them discussed.


josh
Organization: Freshman, MCS general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 09:44:48 -0400 
From: Kerwin Yap Chua <kc3u+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: ASTRAL PLANE


>Subject: ASTRAL PLANE
>From: harish.reddy@factory.com (Harish Reddy)
>Date: 13 Sep 92 19:10:00 GMT
>
>To be very concise, I am interested in the Astral plane and any info
>pertinent to it.  I truly want to experience astral projection and any,
>ANY information will be appreciated.
>

Please be more specific (although I'm sure you will have recieved many
anwers by the time you get this).  What information are you seeking? 
Why do you want to get where you are going?  Are you interested in
channeling or just travelling?  Somebody please come up with answers
because I'm interested too.

Kendrick Kerwin Chua

kc3u+@andrew.cmu.edu    or
kendrick+@CMU.EDU

Cthulhu for President, 1992!
Newsgroups: alt.magick
From: friday@netcom.com (Carol Anne Ogdin)
Subject: Re: anger
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 92 23:39:27 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In <lasld4INN9u7@news.bbn.com> dhardin@bbn.com (Dawn Hardin) writes:

>What would you suggest doing with anger?

Anger is a very powerful and very useful emotion, but it depends on the
appropriateness.  I can get very angry at the passivity of bureaucrats
when they stand athwart doing what they're paid to do, but it helps to
have the personal flexibility to transform that anger into a positive plan
of action that both gets my outcome and leaves them just the slightest
bit foolish-feeling (nothing wrong with being a fool, but in this culture
most people don't like it; I prefer that side-effect to something that
might actually 'harm' them).

I've gotten angry enough with our California elected officials to put my
energy (and green-energy) into seeing to it that they are recalled and/or
not re-elected.

In Sum:  Focus your energy.  Sometimes, when I REALLY get mad, I go through
100-or-so-rounds in my personal arsenal punching holes in a photograph; that
seldom fails.  Other ideas:  Martial arts, writing.

Focus that powerful energy; it may be the most powerful source of energy
you've got at times.  But focus it on something that either does some good
(for you, for another), and certainly don't simply re-focus it on another
else you get trapped in the web you cast.

>little smurf^H^H^H^H^Hwiccan, 

tee hee.
-- 
---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---   ---
    - Friday -                      "Practice random acts of kindness 
      friday@well.sf.ca.us                      and senseless beauty."
      (aka Carol Anne Ogdin@Santa Clara, CA)
From: oispeggy@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Peggy Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Spirit in the house, and parents won't listen...
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:07:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <las6ltINN812@aludra.usc.edu>, eburke@aludra.usc.edu (Kethry) writes...
>Hi there, it's me again....
> 
>Um, I have a question for anyone that could help me...There is a spirit
>in my house that is driving me absolutely buggy.  (I'm empathic and sen-
>sitive to spirits so that gives me a double whammy :-).) Anyway, I've
>tried burning yellow candles and that works quite well in the room that
>the candles are in, but the only room I was allowed to burn in was my
>room, which meant that I was very uncomfortable in the rest of the house...
>Well, one day my parents decided to say that I was not allowed to burn
>ANYTHING in the house, so there went my protections.  They told my sister
>that they don't like the fact that I don't believe in Catholicism like
>they do.  

Too, bad about your candles, but sounds sensible to me.  Many 
Catholic churches no longer allow burning candles for special 
intentions (you'd pay a quarter and light a candle on a rack of 
candles and it was supposed to help accomplish one's intention).  
Your parents are probably afraid you'll burn the house down.

>So, I tried building myself a shield of yellow light (like 
>the light sheilds from the Sheild thread) and tried to expand it to the con-
>tours of my room.  I forgot to leave an opening for the air duct, so 
>until I figured that out, my room was the stuffiest in the house until
>I put a hole in for the air duct.  That created another problem...the
>hole leaves an opening into my room for anything that wants to get in.
>The sheild worked perfectly until the hole was put in.  

Well, cover the hole with an air permeable/spirit impermeable 
material.  No big deal.
	
>My question is what can I do now?  The spirit hasn't manifested any nasty
>qualities, he's mainly a trickster, but I still have a very nasty feeling
>that anyone else who is sensitive can feel.  The only examples of his
>work in the mundane world are things that are basically pranks, but of
>the sort that my parents are blaming the three kids in the house (my 
>sisters and I).  I talked to another Wiccan as to the cause of these pranks
>mainly to confirm my own suspicions, and that person said that it was
>probably the spirit and that was about it.

I think it you just ignore it, it will go away.

>Ok, I'm done babbling now.  Any response would be appreciated.  E-mail
>me if you prefer at:  eburke@huey.csun.edu.  Thanks in advance...
> 
>Bright Blessings,
>Kethry

- Peggy -