From: conrad@brahms.udel.edu (Jon Conrad)
Subject: Re: Wagner's Ring: Solti still unrivalled?
Keywords: wagner ring solti
Organization: University of Delaware
Distribution: rec
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 12:55:20 GMT

In article <1992Jul31.063641.10042@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> kaf8f@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Keith Andrew Falconer) writes:

>In article <1992Jul30.140049.18839@tellab5.tellabs.com> young@tellabs.com (Craig Young) writes:

>>In the current thread discussing the extant recordings of Wagner's Ring
>>cycle, the idea of "original" versus "modern" brass instruments has been
>>used to explain differences in sound quality between the various orchestras
>>involved. 

>Yes, and you are right in thinking that the distinction isn't
>entirely appropriate.

Actually, I think it was just one person using those terms.  I'd call it
simply an honest (somewhat mistaken) attempt to get at the timbral
differences between orchestras, and I now regret belaboring the terms in
my response.

>The Vienna Philharmonic may be exceptional in this case, but the rotary-
>valve trumpets I've seen have medium-large to large bores and produce
>a somewhat heavy sound. I think moGerman-speaking trombonists, a play
>instruments with a fairly large bore,  do most players elsewhere in
>Europe. The truly extraordinary exceptions are in Russia, particularly
>in Leningrad, where the old 'peashooter' trombones are still in use
>(or they were ten years ago). Some French players may also still use
>relatively narrow-bore instruments, though I think American influence
>has changed much of this.

And yet there are a lot of individual differences too.  I'm thinking of
the Dresden State Orchestra, which itself has a long tradition.  Its
brass tone is round and full like Vienna's (their horns used to have a
hint of Russian-style vibrato, but I don't hear this any more), but also
clean and transparent; a fairly unique combination.  On their RING
recording the Wagner tubas sound different than on any other recordings
I've heard, but that may be just the particular instruments used --
there are probably not many sets of these instruments in existence, and
there may well be little uniformity in their manufacture.

>>Therefore, orchestras such as the VPO and Concertgebouw, which also use rotary
>>valve trumpets sound much different than English or American orchestras that
>>use piston valve instruments.

>I wasn't aware that the Concertgebouw regularly used rotary-valve 
>trumpets - it doesn't sound at all 'teutonic' to my ears. 

Interesting.  It does to mine.  In fact it doesn't sound exactly like
any German orchestra I know (it lacks that piercing oboe sound, a plus
in my book), but it has a dark, massive, "woody" sound that I would
classify roughly as Teutonic.  Maybe I'm thinking sloppily.

>I look forward to the day
>when I can buy an 'original instruments' recording of the 
>original version of the planets - sarrusophones and everything!

More details on this please!  I own a study score of The Planets (the
newer corrected/authentic edition), and have never heard of sarruophones
having a share in the piece.  Do you know when/what they played?  When
were they removed?  (I do know that there's a bass sarruosphone part in
L'Heure Espagnole.)

Jon Alan Conrad
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical