HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 01:02:00 GMT

In article <BvvH7v.B96@mach1.wlu.ca>, brea9430@mach1.wlu.ca (breadner kenneth c writes...

>> (repeat of my fair and honest summary of Canada)

>If this guy lives in Canada, he should be exiled.
> 
Oh, do you exile people who are critical of canada?  How very democratic and
tolerant!  In fact, I have voluntarily exiled myself from canada, and would
only consider returning when and if my claim against your farcical National
Research Council goes to court.  I would point out, however, that I did post
an earlier mail somewhere else that said the existence of Quebec and the
French-speaking Canadians was its only saving grace, but omitted to say that
to the Japanese guy.  I retract nothing - in fact I think I was extremely
restrained in my criticism on this occasion.
> 
As for an earlier post, I agree that London, England is an awful place, but
far superior to anywhere I saw in canada primarily because of the absence
of the very mediocre anglophone Canadians

>-- 
Laurence

Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
From: robinc@bnr.ca (Robin Collins)
Subject: Re: Individual Rights in the U.S. Constitution
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada
Distribution: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 20:50:33 GMT

In article <SMITH.92Oct15084144@gramian.harvard.edu> smith@gramian.harvard.edu (Steven Smith) writes:
>cthorne@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Charles E Thorne) writes:
>
>> Thus the Constitution did not define citizen when originally
>> written.  The 14th Amendment did, however, define citizen as all
>> persons born or naturalized in the United States.  If a state
>> denied voting to any "person" over 21 years of age, they lost
>> representation in Congress.
>
>Only when the right to vote is denied to male inhabitants (citizens,
>21 yrs), and only a proportion of representaion is reduced.
>


Actually I was being a little tongue in cheek here.
In fact all citizens have the same right: when they achieve the 
age of 21, they can vote. In this sense, all citizens are denied
the same right or achieve the same right, depending on how you look at it.

>
>> If the 14th Amendment clarified what a citizen was, ie all persons
>> born or naturalized in the US, why the need for the 15th/19th etc
>> Amendments?  Are they not redundant?  Or were slaves and women not
>> considered persons?
>
>All persons born or naturalized in the U.S. were citizens.  Not all of
>them had the right to vote.  

 
I don't follow this. If all citizens were defined, then why were not
all citizens given the right to vote in an amendment (if necessary)
rather than women specified as getting the vote. 
If there was a clause that said only male citizens had the vote, then
YES, an amendment was necessary to correct the clause.




>
>> (My point here is that the 14th Amendment should have been adequate to
>> use the courts to enforce the constitutional rights of all citizens, in
>> that citizen was finally defined.)
>
>The Fourteenth Amendment was very clear about who could not be denied
>the vote.  That's why the Nineteenth was necessary to provide (near)
>universal adult suffrage. 

I thought the 14th was about who a citizen was, NOT who could not be 
denied the vote. Which clause states who can vote?

If the 19th clarified that women were citizens (something I still
see as redundant) why do you say only NEAR universal adult suffrage
is provided.
Who's left out now?


Frank
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: |*| 50 years ago -- October 11, 1942 : The St. Roch |*|
Date: 12 Oct 92 23:06:46 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mountain View, CA  USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: teal

In article <1bcjd2INNqps@iskut.ucs.ubc.ca> hlee@unixg.ubc.ca (Henry Lee) writes:
>50 years ago on October 11th, 1942, the St. Roch completed 
>the Northwest Passage West to East and sailed into the port of Halifax.
>
>The voyage, taking 28 months, ensured Canada of complete
>sovereignty of east-west passage through the Arctic.

Well it was a good intention, but that sovereignty is in dispute,
as the U.S.A. frequently violates it by running its war ships through it.

>The St. Roch is now inside the Maritime Museum here in Vancouver.

	-Mike Eisler
	mre@Eng.Sun.Com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
From: marky@engin.umich.edu (Mark Anthony Young)
Subject: Re: I was going to vote yes, BUT NOW ....
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 15:38:08 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

knight@mrco.carleton.ca (Alan Knight) writes:
>In <t!8-KBA@engin.umich.edu> marky@engin.umich.edu (Mark Anthony Young) writes:
>
>>Now if this were the end of it, I would have no problem with the HoC.  Quebec
>>could go on being over-represented by two seats indefinitely without causing
>>me any distress.  But Quebec's 25% guarantee gets in the way.  I have posted
>>figures before to support my contention that by the middle of the next
>>century, Quebec will have only about twenty percent of Canada's population.
>
>According to the Journal, they predict in 20 years Quebec will be down
>to 24.3% of the population from [25.3%]. 20 years seems like a
>reasonable period to predict. 50 years is a long time. I'd be
>interested if someone would care to post population predictions 50
>years in advance from 1942. I rather doubt they'd be particularly accurate.
>
You're right.  I should learn to take more care how I say things.  I have
presented in other postings evidence that leads me to believe that Quebec
might well fall to 20% of Canada's population by the middle of the next
century.  I actually got a range of estimates from 19.1 to 23.3, with a 
median of 20.5 percent.  My calc'ns for 2011 range from 22.7 to 24.6 with 
a median of 23.5 percent, so I'm still in the ballpark at 20 years.

However, the (lack of) accuracy of my projection (if any) is not really a 
problem.  The number itself was derived by simply projecting current trends 
into the future.  It is thus a _plausible_ number.  The results of running 
the analysis with this number is a _very_ distorted HoC.

It's sort of like Russian Roulette:  you've got five empty chambers, so
everything will likely be fine; still, there is that one chance in six....

...mark young

BTW...I ran the same program on the 1941 data and got 1991 predictions
ranging from 22.3 to 35.4 percent, with a median of 25.2%.  Just a fluke,
but amusing, nonetheless....
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,rec.travel.air,can.general
From: dmarble@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Duane F Marble)
Subject: Re: Closed Flights
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 11:18:04 GMT

Years ago some helpful locals in Finland got me on one of these flights.
I was told "You have your passport, just go thru customs, etc., in
Helsinki with the others." Ah, the joy of attempting to enter Finland
when your previous entry permit is not matched by an exit permit...
-- 
Duane F. Marble			       E-mail: dmarble@magnus.acs.osu.edu
Department of Geography                Telephone: (614) 292-2250
The Ohio State University
Columbus, Ohio 43210                   Fax: (614) 292-6213
From: Desiree_Bradley@mindlink.bc.ca (Desiree Bradley)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Constitution/Economy
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:24:10 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

> Gerald Olchowy writes:
>
> In article <16267@mindlink.bc.ca> Desiree_Bradley@mindlink.bc.ca (Desiree
> Bradley) writes:
> >I have heard that if the referendum is passed the federal government and
> the
> >provincial governments will get to work on the economy.  But I have doubts
> >about that.
> >
>
> and Charlottetown has hamstrung the ability of the federal government to
> act in the national interest.
>
> Gerald


Considering what has gone on before, I doubt that I am the only person who
does not trust the federal government when it is acting in the "national
interest."  Remember the NEP (when oil prices were high in the 1980's?)  The
price of oil would have been allowed to go to world prices if the oil
deposits had been in Ontario -- or Ontario and Quebec.  But since the oil was
in Alberta oil prices were kept low.  National Interest = Central Canadian
Rapacity.

And that's why there have been more rows at Charlottetown.
Desiree Bradley
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU (Stewart Clamen)
Subject: Constitutional powers
Originator: clamen@BYRON.SP.CS.CMU.EDU
Reply-To: clamen+@CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 08:35:37 GMT


Here's a tricky question for you net.constitutional experts:


What are the powers/responsibilities of the Prime Minister of Canada,
as outlined in the Constitution Act, 1867 and the Constitution Act,
1982?


--
Stewart M. Clamen			Internet:    clamen@cs.cmu.edu
School of Computer Science		UUCP: 	     uunet!"clamen@cs.cmu.edu"
Carnegie Mellon University		Phone: 	     +1 412 268 2145
5000 Forbes Avenue			Fax:	     +1 412 268 5739
Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3891, USA
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Date: 9 Oct 92 17:45:00 GMT
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1

In article <BvuvHG.9KA@helios.physics.utoronto.ca>, mark@cita.toronto.edu                     writes...
> 
>| You have my sympathy - Canada is an extremely boring and mediocre country, and 
>| Toronto is extremely cold.  Could you not have chosen an 8 months period
>| that did not encompass the whole of winter?
>| 
>| For sights and lifestyle, cross the border and head south or west.  It's
>| much less expensive and has lots of interesting things to see.  East, west
>| and North of toronto is just a wasteland.
> 
>This has got to rank as one of the most ill-informed, misleading, and downright
>stupid things to have appeared in this newsgroup recently.  (And that's saying
>a lot, in view of some of the things that Kaldis spews out!)

It was not ill-informed - I lived in Ottawa for 2.5 years and visited Toronto often.
It was better than Ottawa but still awful.  I liked nothing about canada at all.

L
From: dgrenier@opemisca.ulaval.ca (Dominic Grenier)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: I was going to vote yes, BUT NOW ....
Date: 8 Oct 92 14:32:22 GMT
Reply-To: dgrenier@opemisca.ulaval.ca
Organization: Universite Laval

Dans l'article 1sv@sun3.vlsi.uwaterloo.ca, ward@sun17.vlsi.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Ward)
ecrit:
> In article <BvICIv.E05@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> dbowman@rainbow (Don A. Bowman) writes:
> >
> >Any majority of senators will be a majority of anglophone senators. Think
> >about it for a bit.
> 
> Not necessarily at all.  Suppose that 6 of the senators are francophone,
> and there are 62 in total.  The vote is 32 to 30, all six francophones are
> in favor - subtract them and you get a vote of 26 to 30.  The result is
> the opposite.  Think about it for a bit.


Cette derniere remarque n'est pas tres brillante. Si tous les senateurs francophones
s'opposent a un projet mais qu'une majorite relativement importante d'anglophones
sont d'accord, les 6 francophones ne pourront grand chose contre les 56 autres.
En consequence, le poids des 6 senateurs du Quebec (dont au moins un sera anglophone)
ne represente pas le poids demographique ce qui veut dire qu'un citoyen du Prince
Edouard Island aura une representation surestimee par rapport a un citoyen
de l'Ontario ou du Quebec, qui elle est sous-estimee. Cependant, le cas du Quebec
est plus tragique encore car elle est la seule province francaise (donc d'une
culture differente) et que son reflet se limitera a 1/10 et moins du senat.
Finalement, tout projet fortement endosse par les senateurs anglophones mais
largement critique par les francophones passera comme une lettre a la poste...
Pensez-y un petit peu.

D. Grenier
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: baljeual@uther.calvin.edu (Alan Baljeu)
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Organization: Calvin College
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 04:52:09 GMT

I hate to step into the middle of this conversation, but I am anyway.
(OK, I don't hate to step in-- you got me :)
No one has yet answered the question that was asked.  Something about what
to look for in Toronto?  Whatever.
<3-|
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Subject: Re: Canada's country code?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 18:30:00 GMT

In article <Oct.11.11.45.09.1992.27217@remus.rutgers.edu>, kaldis@remus.rutgers.edu (Theodore A. Kal writes...
>In article <8OCT199215252779@sscvx1.ssc.gov> godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:
> 
>>>> I doubt that the country code is '2'.  Where did you get this idea?
> 
>>> In Athens.  I had occasion to call Canada when I was there in 1990 and
>>> this was the country code I was told to use for that call.
> 
>> How braindead can you get?
> 
>The Greek telephone system is (arguably, but not very) a good example.
> 
>> Do you think a telephone system (even a Greek one) can distinguish
>> between 002 followed by the first two digits of a Canadian area code
>> and 002 followed by the last two digits of an African country code?
> 
>I'm not sure exactly how country codes work in Greece, but I would
>imagine that the first "0" is for international access and "02" is for
>Canada.  All I know is that I dialed "002 514 XXX XXXX" and the call
>went through correctly to Montreal (not to some mud hut in Ethiopia).
>"001" would probably cause the call to be routed through the U.S. --
>and probably incur extra long distance charges to the originating
>telephone account.
>-- 

I think your memory is defective.  00251(4 xx etc) would get you through
to a number in Asmara, Ethiopia, as 4 is the Asmara city code.  This is
easy to prove by dialing the international access code from canada (which
I believe is 011) followed by 2 514 etc.  Are you sure you can distinguish
between what you call a mud-hut in Ethiopia and Montreal?  Incidentally,
this may surprise you but people who live in mud huts do not, as a rule,
have telephones.  Perhaps there is no direct dialing to Canada from Greece,
so the call went through an operator who thought "it's that idiot Theo
trying to phone canada via Ethiopia again", and just switched you through.

As I type I am trying this from my London phone (where the exit code
is 010, by the way), and I find that I constantly get equipment busy
tone, suggesting that lines to Ethiopia are heavil;y used or not very
numerous (probably the latter). 

If anyone does manage to get through to a "mud-hut" in Ethiopia, perhaps
they would leave a message for Theo.  If we all do that then next time
Theo calls up from Greece he'll get all the messages.  Better still,
instead of spending $10 calling Ethiopia, why not just put the cash in
an envelope and send it to Oxfam.

Laurence
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: cpaulse@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Chris D Paulse)
Subject: Registration for the Referendum from outside the country
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 21:28:20 GMT

How do I register for the referendum from here in Ohio?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: cubric@cs.mcgill.ca (Marija Cubric)
Subject: Re: What about the Canadians?
Organization: SOCS, McGill University, Montreal, Canada
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 18:17:03 GMT

>>In article <=16-W3_@engine.umich.edu> marky@engin.umich.edu (Mark Anthony Young) writes:
>>[discusses how Russia backed off of land claims from the Ukraine, and
>>how the world does not support Serbia's land claims from Bosia-Hercegovinia]
>>How is Canada/Quebec significantly different from these cases?  How

>The major difference I see is that the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia were
                                                        -----------------
>essentially artificial unions whose peoples did not enter into on their
------------------------------------------------------------------------
>own free will.  The unions were involuntary and maintained by a force:
----------------
>communism. Once communism fell, nothing was left to keep them together,
>dissolution was natural. Canada is certainly an artificial creation,
>but arguably one that 6 out 10 provinces entered into freely, the other
>4 being created by the will of the original 5, but still the
>inhabitants of the 4 were supportive of Confederation. In the case of
>Canada, only one province appears to be seriously agitating for
>release, unlike the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia, were every nation but
>one wanted out. Certainly it is not a situation where every province
>but Ontario wants to leave Canada, at least not yet.

The above (underlined) statement is very often used as an argument
to point out the difference between Canadian and (ex) Yugoslav 
federation. But, the statement is false. The fact is: Yugoslavia was formed 
in 1918, by free will of all its constitutive parts Slovenia, Croatia and 
Serbia. Or at least, by the will of elected representatives of these three 
nations. 

If we want more democratic way to form a federation, then perhaps,
a referendum can be used. But, even Canada was not formed after 
Ontarians, Quebecers etc. decided on referendum to be in the same country,
or I am wrong?

Marija Cubric
	
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Subject: Re: UNIMPLOYMENT
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 21:33:00 GMT

In article <901003l.17.718469027@ace.acadiau.ca>, 901003l@ace.acadiau.ca (MISHA LEBLANC)    writes...
>Can someone please give me a comprehensive unimployment rate for Canada as 
>well as each province.
> 
>Can you include the numbers of persons not seeking work.
>		the # of persons working recieving less than $ 10 000. 
>		those who cant work.
>Finally can you give me sources.
>thankyou
> 
>Misha LeBlanc

What is an imployment?  Do you mean unemployment rate?  In that case the
figure is 25,000,000 and i have included those who don't do anything useful.

Laurence

Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: scottp@skyfox.usask.ca
Subject: Hypertext version of Consensus Report now available
Organization: University of Saskatchewan
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 16:47:35 GMT

I have created a hypertext version of the Charlottetown
Constitutional consensus report. It contains the non-legal text,
plus highlight and fact-sheet files. It is written to run under
MSDOS.

You can get it via anonymous ftp from:

access.usask.ca

in the pub/hytelnet/pc/extras subdirectory. It is listed as CONST.ZIP

Information follows, describing how to obtain CONST.ZIP from the ftp
site:

TO RETRIEVE CONST.ZIP:
At your system prompt, enter:               ftp access.usask.ca
      or                                    ftp 128.233.3.1
When you receive the Name prompt, enter:    anonymous
When you receive the password prompt, enter your Internet address.
When you are at the ftp> prompt, enter:     binary
At the next ftp> prompt, enter:             cd pub/hytelnet/pc/extras
Then enter:                                 get const.zip
After the transfer has occurred, either
   proceed with the instructions below to
   retrieve the UNZIP utility (which you
   need unless you already have it) or enter:   quit

CONST.ZIP is archived using a ZIP utility.  To unarchive it, you must be
able to "unzip" the file.  If you have the file PKUNZIP.EXE, it will
unarchive the CONST.ZIP file (see below for instructions). If you do not
have it, you may retrieve it with by following these instructions:

TO RETRIEVE PKUNZIP:
Use the above instructions for connecting to access.usask.ca
At the ftp> prompt, enter:                   binary
Then enter:                                  cd pub/hytelnet/pc
Then enter:                                  get pkunzip.exe
After the transfer has occurred, enter:      quit

TO UNARCHIVE CONST.ZIP:
Make a new directory on your hard disk (e.g., mkdir const)
Copy PKUNZIP.EXE and CONST.ZIP into the new directory
Make sure you are in that directory, then enter: pkunzip const
It will then unarchive CONST.ZIP.

PLEASE NOTE that I offer the above instructions as a service for those
who are unfamiliar with the steps required to download and use files
from network sources.  I cannot be responsible for any local variations
in these procedures which may exist.  Please contact your local computer
support staff if you have difficulty performing these tasks.

To change the colour scheme run HRK.EXE, which is included.

Peter Scott
Manager, Small Systems, University of Saskatchewan Libraries
scottp@skyfox.usask.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: parghi@cs.uiuc.edu (Amit Parghi)
Subject: Re: Does Canada sell immigration permits?
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Illinois
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 03:33:03 GMT

bkt@blacks.jpl.nasa.gov (Barrie Trinkle)  writes...
>[Nobel prize-winning economist Gary Becker]
>cites Canada as an example of a country which currently sells permits,
>"although in a partial and elitist fashion."  Does anyone know what he
>means?  Are immigration permits available for money in Canada, and if
>so, for how much and to whom and under what conditions?

For several years, it's been possible to get become a Landed Immigrant in
Canada in return for investing a non-trivial sum in Canada.  In this case,
"non-trivial" is on the order of a few hundred thousand dollars.  Your
nearest Canadian Consulate should be able to tell you more.  A fairly large
number of recent immigrants from Hong Kong have come to Canada this way.

I don't like it, personally.  However, it does help investment as well as
bringing in affluent immigrants who, for the most part, are decent folks
with a skill set that has been rather lacking in Canada in the past (by
which I mean entrepreneurial savvy).

Amit
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: 890758k@ace.acadiau.ca (WING HO KWAN)
Subject: testing
Summary: testing
Organization: Acadia University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 20:03:47 GMT

testing file
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada