HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Ann.Bradford@f302.n321.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Bradford)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Gifted Education
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 92 10:03:42 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:321/302 - SpaceMet South 1, Holyoke MA

I was a classroom teacher (Gr. 2, Gr. 4) for 17 years and have taught G/T for the last 13 years.  All the time that I was teaching in the regular classroom, I knew that I was not truly meeting the needs of the Gifted child in my room -- 'though I certainly tried!  Surely, each person has special gifts -- and the people that we think are great are those who are thoughtful of others-- and, yet, I truly believe that there should be academic programs for those bright, bright young people.  And, as has been sai
d, there should be a time for them to get together with other bright young people "and know more truly who they are".  I teach a pull-out program that is interdisciplinary and we spend much time with affective issues.   One little boy said, "I never thought that  could draw until Mr. W. (an artist) came to work with us."  We do many adjunct things such as Future Problem Solving.  I also spend after school time with other students doing such things as Young Astronauts.  My husband and I have 4 grown childre
n -- 2 very bright and 2 who had many learning problems.  As a classroom teacher, I cared about all under my care (still do)   but want to see the needs of each child met.  However, I do believe that the gifted child is "gifted at all times"-- perhaps you meant something different.  We don't always act "at all times" the ways that would show our strengths.  Perhaps that is what you meant.  In Agawam, MA we have 13 years of evaluations -- some SO moving such as a 10 year old girl who said, "This is the firs
t time that I could be myself and not be ashamed to use my brain!"  It was good to read your letter.  Best wishes to you with your work!


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From: Stephen.Gillis@f2.n255.z1.fidonet.org (Stephen Gillis)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Re: TEACHER EDUCATION
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 92 22:34:04 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:255/2 - NEWBED, Fredericton NB

JOhn, I have a small group of bright 5th and 6th graders who 
would be keen to meet your group.  What are you folks up to these days?

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From: Harriett.Rubins@f680.n260.z1.fidonet.org (Harriett Rubins)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Gifted Education
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 11:23:00 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:260/680 - Gananda Central Sch, Walworth NY

 > met.  However, I do believe that the gifted child is "gifted
 > at all times"-- perhaps you meant something different.  We
 > don't always act "at all times" the ways that would show our
 > strengths.  Perhaps that is what you meant.  In Agawam, MA we
Hi!  Thanks for responding.  I really did mean that not all "gifted" 
students are gifted in all things at all times.  I also believe that 
identified "gifted" students are not gifted unless they do something 
with their gifts.  Until they develop their gifts they are just 
potentially gifted. That sounds pretty strong, I guess.  Our program 
is a mixed push-in, pull-out one.  We call it ESP - Exploring 
Student Potential.  We try to identify needs as they occur and meet 
those needs, as much as possible within the classroom setting.  In 
some cases, such as when a student has a burning interest, we pull 
out to help the student pursue his/her interests in depth.  
     My position involves researching materials for teachers, 
modelling lessons, teaming with teachers, providing resources, 
teaching small and large groups of students and writing curriculum 
and grants.  All projects are relatively short term, so that I can 
maintain a flexible schedule.  It is a very exciting, exhausting 
job, but also a rewarding one.       Harriett

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Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
From: van@teal.csn.org (Claude W. Van Horn)
Subject: Re: GIFTED ED.
Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 05:56:08 GMT

Gloria.Summers@f32.n272.z1.fidonet.org (Gloria Summers) writes:
: Hello.I am an 8th grader at an jr high.In your letter you asked how
: would you like your teacher to be to you..
: I would like to understand us from our point of view.I do not like it
: when our teachers put us down.Our math teacher always puts us down by
: saying how we dont know anything and yelling at us.

Gloria, you state the problem exactly.  Educators already know the material.
that's what they went to college for.  Just because the student is TAG (what-
ever that means) they think that means the student is omnicient.  

TAG means (if it means anything) that a student has shown a higher than
average ability to synthisize information.  An ability to do inductive and
deductive reasoning at the same time.  an ability to grasp the sense or things
"quicker than the average bear!"  

When I went through school, there was no TAG program.  If there had been, I would not have been in it.  I was an average student wioth a greater than average 
curiosity.  It was not until later that I found I had a high IQ.  I still
have not found any particular value in a high IQ other than as a measure
of how gross the mistakes I make can be.  (well that, and I have a peculliar
sense of humor).  I also spell badly.

Many TAG programs are atempts by frightened teachers to throw so much 
work at the student that they will be too swamped to figure out that the 
teacher is less tallented.  Hooey!  Most TAG kids I know could care less that
the teacher knows less or more than they do.  What they want is the time and 
access to materials that will allow them to expand their knowledge in the 
areas of their current interest.  

More and more programs are comming out now that recognize this.  I have seen
several postings by TAG instructors that lead me to believe things are
getting better.  I hope some of this material becomes available to your teachers.  Particularly the Math teacher you spoke about.  Don't blame him, he is 
eather a coach of some sport, or he was frightened by a gifted classmate
when he was in school and is spending his life trying to get even.

Van!!
:x

-- 
Claude Van Horn :  Magician, man about town, philosopher, Perot Supporter
                   Voice Mail Expert, and general good guy.
From: Jari.Battin@f93.n128.z1.fidonet.org (Jari Battin)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Newspaper program
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 92 17:00:00 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:128/93 - CSDB BBS, Colorado Springs CO

 > If you need any help in using HyperCard, I can help you. I've
 > been programing in HyperCard for about 5 years and have some
 > to learn it pretty well. if I can help gimme a reply!

 > --- Maximus 2.01wb
 >  * Origin: Grey Haven - Liberty High School; Colorado
 > Springs, CO (1:128/81)
Thanks!  I'll keep that in mind!  Haven't really got started yet!

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From: Harriett.Rubins@f680.n260.z1.fidonet.org (Harriett Rubins)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Re: TEACHER EDUCATION
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 11:04:00 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:260/680 - Gananda Central Sch, Walworth NY

 > "gifted" but had amazing artistic abilities and wonderful
 > imaginations.
 > You are quite correctin your observation, some ordinary folks
 > have 
 > wonderful gifts to share.
Hi!  Thanks for your response.  Our program is called ESP (Exploring 
Student Potential).  It is a flexible program aimed at identifying 
enrichment needs as they occur.  I am driving myself crazy trying to 
set up programs to meet these needs, since my position is K-12.  The 
rewards, however are worth it as I see the kids blossom.
Harriett

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From: Melanie.Locke@f80.n343.z1.fidonet.org (Melanie Locke)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: RE: TEACHER EDUCATION
Date: 28 Oct 92 16:03:21 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:343/80 - Auburn Ed-Net, Auburn WA

Hi Connie! My name is Melanie and I'm in a gifted ed class at Terminal Park Elementary. My teacher's name is Mr. Mickleson. I think that a gifted ed teacher shouldn't treat the kids like they're different because  that's the last thing I wanna be. On the other hand, some gifted kids like to be treated different, but if you do treat them different, don't do it in front of kids who aren't gifted. I hope that this letter has told you something about us that you need to know, and good luck teaching!          -


Melanie Locke


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From: Stephen.Gillis@f2.n255.z1.fidonet.org (Stephen Gillis)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Re: TEACHER EDUCATION
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 19:18:24 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:255/2 - NEWBED, Fredericton NB

Harriett, I would love to here some of the units, activities, sessions
you have been using.  I would be more than willing to send you
descriptions of the things the kids and I get into.
How in the world do you manage to accomodate kids k-12?
How many kids would you see in a week?

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From: James.Bannan@f369.n633.z3.fidonet.org (James Bannan)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: GIFTED ED.
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 92 17:50:14 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 3:633/369 - City Limits BBS, Boronia Vic

HR>Bravo, James!  From one experienced teacher of gifted and
HR>talented students, I can relate to your "dog" story.  Thank you
HR>for sharing your wisdom.      Harriett
Harriett,  sometimes the Gifted and talented are the most misunderstood group in a school.  We often focus generally on those below "the average" and having little or no training in dealing with those with exceptional abilities.
Cheers,  Jimbo Down Under


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From: John.C..Mickelson@f80.n343.z1.fidonet.org (John C. Mickelson)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: RE: TEACHER EDUCATION
Date: 26 Oct 92 22:14:49 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:343/80 - Auburn Ed-Net, Auburn WA

Connie,
 
I have been a teacher of gifted ed since the late 70's in a
self-contained program in Auburn, Washington.  I have been a public
school teacher since 1969.  In my opinion, the first thing a teacher of
bright students should be is a good teacher.  Gifted students are just
like students in the regular classroom, but more so.  A matter of degree,
perhaps.  They have all the problems and weaknesses, but if a bright
student is, say, manipulative, then that student can be incredibly
manipulative.  If the bright student eats up accelerated and enriched
work, then watch out, stay out of the way.
 
What I am saying is that gifted kids are just like regular kids, just
strong is identified areas.  All kids need good teachers, ones who can
see through ploys to avoid work and responsibility, and ones who can
motivate.
 
Do you want the opinions of my 50 bright fifth and sixth graders?  IF so,  please write back.


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From: Stephen.Gillis@f2.n255.z1.fidonet.org (Stephen Gillis)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Re: TEACHER EDUCATION
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 92 22:52:25 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:255/2 - NEWBED, Fredericton NB

Harriett, saw your message and thought I would respond.  I have 25%
of my teaching time dedicated to enrichment.  The term "gifted" was a bit 
confining, the more general term of enrichment allowed for the inclusion 
of a larger number of children.  I have worked with kids who were not
"gifted" but had amazing artistic abilities and wonderful imaginations.
You are quite correctin your observation, some ordinary folks have 
wonderful gifts to share.

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From: van@teal.csn.org (Claude W. Van Horn)
Subject: Re: Please respond to my Wild Poll!!
Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 04:52:57 GMT

Rob.Waite@f208.n326.z1.fidonet.org (Rob Waite) writes:
: DR> My name is Derek, and I am in the 2nd grade at Morningside Elementary.
: DR> My teacher gave us an assignment.  We are supposed to get people to
: DR> respond to the following questions.  Please help me out!

Derek, I have another question for you to add to your possible
discussion.  Is there any real difference between your "wild animal"
and a cow (which we harvest and eat) or a horse (which we harness and ride).

If there is a difference, does it benefit the wild animal which we harvest
or harness or use in medical experiments, or does it benefit the animal
which is bred to be used by man?

I do not know the answers to these questions, and am not a vegetarian
or animal rights activist, but your poll got me thinking.

van!!

-- 
Claude Van Horn :  Magician, man about town, philosopher, Perot Supporter
                   Voice Mail Expert, and general good guy.
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
From: van@teal.csn.org (Claude W. Van Horn)
Subject: Re: DOUG ADAMS... SUBJECT TO 
Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 05:00:46 GMT

The real trick is getting the carrot close enough to the horse's nose that
he gets banged in the face once in a while (to keep him/her interested)
but far enough away that the bait dosn't get eaten all up.

I think you are right in principle -- the real winners are those people who
can always keep the goal a little farther than their ability, and a little
closer than their threshold of loss-of-interest.

Van!!

-- 
Claude Van Horn :  Magician, man about town, philosopher, Perot Supporter
                   Voice Mail Expert, and general good guy.
From: Gloria.Summers@f32.n272.z1.fidonet.org (Gloria Summers)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: GIFTED ED.
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 92 19:37:46 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:272/32 - Acorn I BBS, Marlboro NY

Hello.I am an 8th grader at an jr high.In your letter you asked how
would you like your teacher to be to you.Now most kids would probably
respond with "no homework an never yell"but I think I should respond
with a more reality answer.I would like to be taught to but not so
quickly.Most of my teachers go so fast just assuming that you know
it.Nobody in my classes understand whats going on but we not going to
say it allowed.Now for homework!!We go to school from 7:30 till
3:30.Most of us have to babysit,go to CCD,sports.It is very diffulct to
finish all our homework.Theres 9 "40 min periods"in a day subtract lunch
and thats 8.We grt homework in every subject and can never do all of
it.I would like to understand us from our point of view.I do not like it
when our teachers put us down.Our math teacher always puts us down by
saying how we dont know anything and yelling at us.In fact I have to
leave to finish my homework so bye.I hope this was some help.Please
write back if you want to know anything else



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From: Louann.Alger@p5.f109.n321.z1.fidonet.org (Louann Alger)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.tag
Subject: Hi!
Date: Tue, 03 Nov 92 18:11:38 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:321/109.5 - Pioneer Valley PCUG, Amherst MA

AREA:K12_TAG

Hi, Ann!  I am sending this message via Mort in hopes that you get it.   It has been awhile since Adrienne and I have had full access to K-12.
 We have missed it and all of our acquaintances.  Adrienne is attending  the only gifted school in the state of Florida now and we are quite  pleased.  I hope to be able to communicate with you and all of the other 
 nice people here and share our experiences.  
                                     .....LouAnn Alger, Sarasota, FL.....


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Newsgroups: k12.ed.special
From: kbporter@sacam.OREN.ORTN.EDU (kay b porter)
Subject: k12.ed.special
Organization: Oak Ridge National Laboratory
Distribution: k12.ed.special
 
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 16:51:19 GMT


Hello! I'm Kay Porter and I am a Speech/Language Pathologist working at
Claxton Elementary School in East Tennessee. I am new to Newsgroups and to
the world of E-Mail.After looking through the Newsgroup lists, I have not
found one for Speech Therapists working in the schools. Does anyone know
if one exists? Most of what I found was about computerized/synthesized
speech. Thanks for any help. -Kay     kbporter@sacam.oren.ortn.edu
From: Soozi.Miller@p5.f17.n3400.z1.fidonet.org (Soozi Miller)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.special
Subject: Behavioral Objectives
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 19:58:01 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3400/17.5 - MET NET BBS, Helena MT

 > I have some excellent paperwork on behavioral objectives (
 > somewhere in
 > the house0 that I gleamed from one of my university courses. 
 > It keep me
 > out of trouble with our State Dept of Education (NM) and
 > noticed I was
 > one of a handful of special ed teachers who wrote correct
 > goals and
 > objectives. You know, mastery, measureable, etc....  if you
 > leave a real
 > live address I'll find them and mail them to you or anyone
 > who needs
 > them.  See ya!

 > --- * MjrFIDO/1.60

 > --- ConfMail V3.2
 >  * Origin: The ELECTRONIC Trib, Albuquerque, N.M., (505)
 > 823-7700 (1:301/200)F
Thanks for sharing this, I was hoping to spark a discussion.  Do you have any samples that you would be willing to put on this NET for people to look at?  Soozi Miller, Moderator.

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From: John.Chisholm@f2.n255.z1.fidonet.org (John Chisholm)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.special
Subject: Re: WHOLE LANGUAGE ???
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 92 21:57:03 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:255/2 - NEWBED, Fredericton NB


 > In a message you wrote in the K12 Language ECHO, you talked about 
 > how embrassing whole language had caused some "throwing out the baby 
 > with the bath water" situations....I suspect you were talking about 
 > skills.  How has whole language teaching affected Special Education? 
 >  What types of academic struggles do you see students having?  Any 
 > ideas or info would be welcomed.
 > How does it benefit the less able student?

Boy, you ask tough questions. I see students who need specific lessons 
sometimes are over looked as they are suppose to learn by using strategies 
when they don't have some of the basic skills. These students are the ones 
who are in the regular classes. If both skills and strategies are taught then 
I think the whole language approach is great. I think it is dangerous to 
ignore skills.

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Xref: sparky k12.ed.special:535 k12.ed.business:353 k12.ed.life-skills:186 misc.kids:28396
From: Soozi.Miller@f17.n3400.z1.fidonet.org (Soozi Miller)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.special
Subject: Mainstreamed Spec. Ed.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 20:53:18 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3400/17 - MET NET BBS, Helena MT


Mary, you mentioned this:
 > shot, arrested and now has been sent to our area to live with
 > a relative until his probationary period is over.  Just what
In our state, this situation would require either contacting the parent...where ever he/she is, or, if the state has custody...assigning a surrogate parent to represent the kid for sp.ed. programming.  Is this the case in Wash.?

 > classes.  We've gotten no records on him, so we are anxious
 > to see what the whole story is about this young man. He has
In Montana, we can place a kid temporarily through a phone conversation with the prior school...and then writing an "interim IEP".  Is this how you do it?

 > We take all kinds of BD kids, some are labeled ADD but for
Is ADD an approved label for sp.ed. in Wa.?

 >    We are setting up IEP conferences right now and it is
 > always a challenge to even get the parents to show up.  Many
 > want to just either run in, sign it and leave, others want it
 > sent home and they send it back.  Occasionally we get an
 > interesting parent who asks good questions and they usually
 > receive a good response from our staff.  We used to have a
Do you think the parents feel like they are a part of the process? Do you encourage parents to share what they want out of the program, and write these into the program?
 > months.  Plus she's 23, not elgible for funding, but could
 > attend school if the district would waive the funding.  We
 > only have one district in the area that services Moderates,
 > so transportation is a problem.  Anyone I talked to basically
 > ignored what I was saying and just kept bringing up Group
 > Homes.  Even though I said that was not even a concern at the
 > present time.  All I wanted was for her to go to a regular
 > school situation for one year, learning social as well as
 > academic skills in a structured environment.  She was denied
I thought this had all happened for you, sorry to hear that it hasn't.  I'm also surprised that your school districts decide who serves who.ie. Moderates. The ADA makes the local school in the local neighborhood the responsible party for everyone.  Montana districts have had to decentralize all of their programs to be in compliance with Federal law.  I don't think we're there yet.
    But on your daughter, I thought you'd have some trouble getting the district to assist.  Isn't there any other alternative?  Are Day Training Services..such as Easter SEals, or some other adult provider program, really out of the question?  There are good things to be reaped, really...and you don't have to put the person in the group home to have these services...but then that's my understanding.  You might want to explore finding information about Alaska's services for DD adults.  They are the leading

 state in this area and the ideas they use may be of help to you.  Soozi


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From: Tim.Ames@f734.n153.z1.fidonet.org (Tim Ames)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.special
Subject: Re: BEHAVIORAL OBJECTIVES
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 15:40:08 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:153/734 - ED-NET 9600, Vancouver BC

Soozi, I am a teacher at an alternate school in Vancouver, British Columbia. 
The alternate schools  [20 approx] in our school board have agreed to use 
IEPs for our students. It is a long form that includes behavioral objectives 
as well as specific info. on the skills and grades the students have 
acquired. Since we have put these IEPs on computer, I could upload a copy as 
an enclosure [I think I can do this] if you are interested in looking at it.
Let me know, Tim


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From: Soozi.Miller@f17.n3400.z1.fidonet.org (Soozi Miller)
Newsgroups: k12.ed.special
Subject: Speech Network
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 21:04:19 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3400/17 - MET NET BBS, Helena MT



 > I have not
 > found one for Speech Therapists working in the schools. Does
 > anyone know
 > if one exists?
I currently know of none.  I will look into this.  If anyone has an answer, hopefully they'll tell us.  Sure would love to have you spur conversation onf Speech topics here.  We're trying to build a chat that's interesting and varied! Thank you.  Soozi, k12 SpEd Moderator.
P.S. What is your primary caseload emphasis i.e.  Language development? and/or Articulation?


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