HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ssj@ais.org (Stephen S. Johnston)
Subject: Re: How many undisputed heisman trophy winners can you come up with?
Organization: UMCC
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 19:41:47 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.214150.2803@a.cs.okstate.edu> cooperr@a.cs.okstate.edu (COOPER ROBERT BRYA) writes:
>After all of the fuss over Gino (I won because my team is good
>not because I am good) the heisman trophy winner.
>
>I began to wonder about how many heisman trophy winners we could
>think of that the vast consensus of fans don't have a disput with.
>Obviously, we (the fangs) don't have a consensus on Gino (despite 
>what the heisman vote was).   
>
>So who are the heisman trophy winners that you can remember where
>all of American footballdom said:  "Yeah, he deserves it."
>We can except the losing heisman trophy candidate fans from the
>equation since they obviously represent a minority.  But, if
>the vast majority of college football fans felt like the heisman
>went to the right guy, then he deserves to be on the list of     
>undisputed heisman trophy winners.
>
>Here is my list (I am only going to back to the winners I can 
>remember):
>
>Last one who deserved it (without dispute) and won it:
>	1988 	Barry Sanders
        1991    Desmond Howard
How could you not remember last year?  ;)
---
Steve
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: aggie@wealthy.ocean.fsu.edu (I R A Aggie)
Subject: Re: FSU and Miami
Followup-To: rec.sport.football.college
Organization: An Ol Ag surrounded by a bunch of unfriendly Seminoles
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 17:02:33 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.142303.24384@mlb.semi.harris.com>,
dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com (David Head) wrote:

> Along the same lines, if you judge who is best between two teams based on
> one game on one day, then clearly Iowa State must be better than Nebraska.
> If Miami is better than FSU for beating them, then anyone who claims this
> to be true is also saying by the same argument that Iowa State is better
> than Nebraska.  Sounds like we need a few straight jackets out there!

Boy, you FSU fans will do anything to get a MNC, won't you?

Unlike FSU, Miami does NOT define themselves in terms of FSU.
They've played a bunch of good (and some not so good) teams, and
have come out with an unblemished record. They did it at home,
the did it on the road, they came from behind, they've lead
from the start. BUT, they won all of 'em.

FSU has played, count'em all you rabid 'Noles, one outstanding
team, a few good teams, and the rest - not so good. Y'all are
crowing over winning the ACC this year, a year that saw the
normal ACC powerhouses have mediocre to bad seasons. You had
to come from behind to beat Clemson (5-6, 24-20) and GaTech 
(6-5, 29-24). You managed to get past UVa (7-4?, 13-6).

Do these teams deserve a rematch with FSU? They all lost by
a touchdown or less!! To be self-consistant with your argument,
they must!

Looking at the performance over the season, we can see that
Miami may well be superior to FSU, and IMHO have no need to
prove themselves. Looking at ISU's season, we can determine
that their victory over the Huskers was one of those anomalous
blips on the screen.

Pray the Huskers don't come out playing with a lot of heart. 
Streak's were meant to be broken, and there are two of 'em 
on the line in the OB: NU's losing streak in bowls, and
FSU's winning streak in bowls.

Look for an upset special in the OB...

James - go Big Red!
From: sl45z@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: A List I Missed
Date: 18 Dec 92 08:59:03 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

	Would anyone be so kind as to post me the top 10 rated QB's this year. 
I've seen references to it, but never the whole thing.  If it's a top 25, then
that's fine too.  Feel free to leave out Gino Tortilla.  We all know where he
fits in. (Tampa Bay ;)  Thanks 
				TC

-- 
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
     |	Travis L. Clements |   	With all the anger in the land
     |  N. Logan, Utah     |    How long before the judgement day?            
     ----------------------|    Before we cut the Fat Ones* down to size?
    * Miami, A&M, Michigan |    Before the Woofing Gods arrive?
    Notre Dame, Florida St |
|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+||+
From: gws6860@tamsun.tamu.edu (Gary Wayne 'Goober' Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Oranges in a Bowl of Fruits
Date: 18 Dec 92 17:49:13 GMT
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station, TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: tamsun.tamu.edu

In article <frank-181292091323@158.186.226.156> frank@mail.lds.loral.com (Ron Frank) writes:
->...Part of the
->excitement about college football stems from supporting your team and
->belittling the opponent.
->^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
-> ----------------------------------------------------
->|   F L O R I D A   S T A T E   S E M I N O L E S    |
-> ----------------------------------------------------

Somehow, it all makes a little more sense now.

- goober (clear as that new pepsi stuff) smith
From: sbscafg@sdd.hp.com (sbscafg)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Places to party in Dallas??
Date: 17 Dec 1992 23:58:17 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, San Diego Division
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpsdl141.sdd.hp.com
Keywords: Cotton Bowl

|> I would recommend the West End since most of the A&M/ND partying will be
|> going on around there.  I have not heard for sure but I imagine YELL PRACTICE
|> will be at Union Station (like last year) which is walking distance from
|> West End.  There are some good bars/clubs in Deep Ellum and on Greenville
|> Ave. but they are a little farther away and I don't know about you but I
|> don't plan on being in any condition to drive on that night.  There are
|> quit a few hotels (Hyatt,Fairmont,etc.) downtown but if you haven't already
|> made reservations you are probable out of luck.  BTW, I like your prediction
|> for the SB!
|> 
|> GIG'EM AGS!!!
|> 
|> Kevin Trapp - Class of '93
|> 

I received info from the Association of Former Students saying that
Yell Practice would be at the hotel where their (Assocation) headquarters
are for the Cotton Bowl.  Its the Sheraton(?) at Central Expwy (75N) and
Northwest Highway.  It said it was at midnight after some new year's eve
party they are having (and charging $20 each for).  I assume if the 
Yell Leaders are there, they can't be at Union Station, also.  I've
been to Yell the last few times at Union Station, and it never seems
to work out very well.  It was cold and rainy last year, and I still don't
know where the Yell leaders were.  I was about a mile away!!

But I agree with you, Kevin, West End will be the place to be, but I've 
heard you need to be careful.  Crime in Dallas is on the rapid rise, and
this many people would be a great target for muggings, rapes, car-jackings,
you name it.  Go with a group.  (I know I'm getting older when I start
to sound like my father!)

Go Aggies! Beat the class of '90 hell outta the fighting irishboys!

sbscafg
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: lein@cat.uucp (John Leinaweaver)
Subject: Re: How many undisputed heisman trophy winners can you come up with?
Organization: Bellcore, Piscataway NJ
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 23:07:37 GMT

In article <92351.073155LNF@psuvm.psu.edu> <LNF@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>The obvious choice:
>
>   The Rocket   1990
>
>Larry

Don MacPherson 1987


John L
From: Ray_Hines@dream.uucp (Ray Hines)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: SEC game schedules
Date: 20 Dec 92 20:55:54 GMT
Organization: DreamStates BBS & CyberNet HQ in G'ville, FL   1-904-331-4317

In a message dated Sun 20 Dec 92  6:33, Schmidt@lstc2vm.stortek.com (jon Sc
wrote:

>Sorry, Florida *is* the SEC Eastern Division Champion.  No Cos here .

 SS> Sorry, but in the eyes of the SEC Georgia and Florida tied for the
 SS> EasternDivision Championship.  The SEC used a tie-breaker formula only
to
 SS> determin which Eastern Division Champion would be the division's
 SS> representative in the SEC Championship Game.

Therefore, Florida is the Eastern Division Champion. :)

-- Via DLG Pro v0.995

* IF replying by MAIL, please reply to the addresses listed below...
--__-----------------------------------------------------------------------
 / /\     Raymond Hines              Internet: Ray_Hines%dream.uucp@ufl.edu
/_/  \  DreamStates BBS                    or: dream!Ray_Hines@ufl.edu
\ \  /   1-904-331-4317                  UUCP: uflorida!dream!Ray_Hines
 \_\/ FidoNet 1:3601/30  DreamStates: An Amiga supporting Amiga, Mac, IBM!
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: jewell@Data-IO.COM (Cal Jewell)
Subject: Re: Defunct Bowl Games
Followup-To: rec.sport.football.college
Organization: Data I/O Corporation
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 20:28:17 GMT

In article <14DEC199213533166@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov> acdendy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (ROGER DENDY) writes:
#I'm compiling a list of Bowls-that-Were-but-Ain't-no-More, and I need some 
#net.assistance.  I need to find a total of 13 with their locations, and so  
#far I have five and only one location, as follows:
#


Some corrections:

#Bowl			Location
#----			--------
#California Raisin	Fresno CA

Wasn't that in Sacramento, CA?

#Bluebonnet		??

Also known as the Astro-Bluebonnet Bowl. I think it was played in 
the Astro Dome in Houston, TX.

#Tangerine
now known as the Florida Citrus Bowl, played in Orlando, FL.

#Garden State
played in Trenton, NJ or perhaps at the Meadowlands?

#Cherry
played in Detroit, MI? at the Silver Dome?


And some additions:

Sun Bowl              El Paso, TX (now the John Hancock Bowl)

Pineapple Bowl        somewhere in Hawaii. Honolulu (sp?) I think.

Rubber Bowl           Akron, OH

Olympia Gold Bowl     Seattle, WA (PAC-10 all-stars vs Big-10 all-stars)
		      played in the mid-70s, only for one or two years.

And, if you really want to get picky, the Rose Bowl, when it was played
in 1942 at Durham, NC.

-- 
Cal...
                                    "Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball."
 jewell@Data-IO.COM
 ...!uunet!pilchuck!jewell
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com (David Head)
Subject: Re: Bowling Green
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 12:00:47 GMT
Reply-To: dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com
Organization: Harris Corporation, Government Aerospace Systems Division


In article 2b328109@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu, vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu () writes:
>'Nuff said (? :)
>
>I wish we had Blackney instead of Cooper. Oh well.
>
>(How did BG throw away 31 points??? Anyone see the game?)
>
>GO BUCKS BEAT G-E-a-ORGIA!!!!!!
>
>-Garrett
>
>
>


This was a great game to watch.  I was not really partial, but I started
rooting a bit for Nevada because they were simply overpowered in the first
half.  Bowling Green more or less moved the ball at will.  With the score
28-3 at half time, it looked like BG would win something like 49-6 or so.
But an entirely different Nevada team came out in the second half.  Their
QB was great.  Of course, BG's punting game (into the wind) fell apart in
the 3rd quarter.  One was partially blocked, another would have been
blocked and the punter had to eat it.  Great field position for Nevada
and a blitz of points in the 2nd half.  But Nevada made the crucial error
on a routine punt late in the 4th quarter leading by 6.  Punter muffed
the snap and one of his players had to fall on it, but it gave BG the
last shot from Nevada's 15.  BG had to go all 4 downs to score, but got
the TD and PAT.  Really fun game.

BTW, seems I heard one of the announcers last night mention that Nevada
was until recently (maybe just last year?) Div. 1-AA and just moved up
to 1-A?  If they did that and still got to a bowl, they have nothing to
be ashamed of!  Good job Nevada Wolfpack!

D. Head
Go NOLES!
From: lpc4@po.CWRU.Edu (Lawrence P. Colucci)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Div. I-AA PLayoffs
Date: 12 Dec 1992 23:11:07 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


Does anyone know who won the Youngstown game today?
From: mm42@prism.gatech.EDU (Mark Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Defunct Bowl Games
Date: 16 Dec 92 19:07:31 GMT
Organization: Ramblin' Wrecks from Georgia Tech

poore@dirac.scri.fsu.edu (David Poore) wrote:
}
}Ahhh...impressive, PDunn. It wasn't included among Mark Mitchell's list,
}but there was one, and I believe it was in Tampa, Fl. sometime in the
}40's. Sorry, no details.

The list I posted came from the _1991_NCAA_Football_, and it was
titled something like "Former Major Bowl Games".  I don't know how
they defined "Major", but perhaps the Cigar Bowl didn't make the
cut for some reason.

-- 
Mark Mitchell           Georgia Tech            mm42@prism.gatech.edu

           "You're living in your own private Idaho."
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: aggie@wealthy.ocean.fsu.edu (I R A Aggie)
Subject: Re: Crown Alabama as National Champions
Followup-To: rec.sport.football.college
Organization: An Ol Ag surrounded by a bunch of unfriendly Seminoles
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 17:14:46 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.135344.22955@mlb.semi.harris.com>,
dhead@comanche.ess.harris.com (David Head) wrote:

> Hey, anyone whose team doesn't play Miami has NO room to talk.  No room.  And

IMHO this is FSU's *biggest* problem. They define themselves in 
terms of beating Miami. Miami define themselves in terms...of
themselves. 

It's a pity that Miami plays only 11(12) games per year. They
really need to play 30 or 40 games - I think we can forget the 
teams at the bottom of the 1A rankings. But even then, on a 
bad day, Iowa State might be able to beat Miami.[*]

I'd love to see TAMU play UMiami. Maybe they'd get whipped, or
just lose. But they may learn to win the really hard games, too.

James - who's starting to like the 'Canes more and more

[*] Ok, maybe a *really* bad day! :)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: pfleming@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Patrick E Fleming)
Subject: Re: USC should drop the ND series
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 19:44:33 GMT

TJFAN@WATSON.IBM.COM writes:

>The overall record is ND 37-23-4, for the last 25 years is ND 11-6.
>It's not overwhelmingly one-sided but it is not close, either.

Look at the McKay/Robinson years at USC and you will find that USC was clearly 
dominant in the series over those years.  In fact, I would argue that USC was 
more dominant during that span of time than Notre Dame is now.  I would (and 
have) even gone so far as to say that USC in the 70's looked a lot like Miami 
(Fl.) in the 80's.  But I digress . . .  Recall that USC exherted their 
dominace over the Irish during that span over coaches the likes of Ara 
Parsegian and Dan Devine - two of only five coaches to win National 
Championships during their Notre Dame tenure.

What damaged the program at USC was not the resurgence of Notre Dame, but the 
rules breaking which occured under John McKay and John Robbinson.  This lead to
a three year probation which kept the Trojans off of TV and out of bowls for 
most of the probationary time.  This killed recruiting and aided (among other
things) the resurgence of UCLA in terms of compeating for top Southern 
California talent.

What USC needs is an inovative coach like a John McKay (but one who can keep 
the program within the rules.)  McKay learned quickly what was winning ball 
games in the early/mid sixties and started recruiting size.  He changed the way
that football was played at USC and installed an offensive system which lead to
several Heisman trophy winner running backs.  He did all this after getting 
waxed by Notre Dame (most notably in 1966.)

I have no doubt that USC will be back.  Notre Dame can't beat them forever.
And I think it would be a grave msitake on the parts of both schools to drop
the series.  It has lead to multiple cooperative accademic ventures which
strengthen both universities in addition to providing one of the most exciting
football rivalries in the college game.


     - Pat
-- 
- Patrick E. Fleming ----------------------------------------------------------
- Department of Chemistry ----------- Sometimes I see me as an old manatee ----
- Ohio Wesleyan University ---------- Heading south as the waters grow colder -
- pfleming@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu ------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: ajj@zycor.lgc.com (Andrew Jackson)
Subject: Re: Defunct Bowl Games
Organization: Landmark/Zycor   Austin, Texas
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 18:45:44 GMT

In article <14DEC199213533166@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov> acdendy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (ROGER DENDY) writes:
>I'm compiling a list of Bowls-that-Were-but-Ain't-no-More, and I need some 
>net.assistance.  I need to find a total of 13 with their locations, and so  
>far I have five and only one location, as follows:
>
>Bowl			Location
>----			--------
>California Raisin	Fresno CA

>Bluebonnet		??
                        Houston, TX

>Tangerine 		??
>Garden State
>Cherry
>
>Please post any additions you can come up with.
>
>R Dendy
>

A. J. Jackson
email: ajackson@zycor.lgc.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: jpd@austin.ibm.com ()
Subject: Re: Heisman Poll Update III
Originator: jpd@camino.austin.ibm.com
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 18:21:16 GMT
Organization: IBM Austin


>The same situation happened at BYU with Detmer.  All they did was pass,
>pass, and pass some more, while Detmer racked up a few 500-yard passing
>games.

>---Rsk

>Rob Jordan

This is a pretty cheap shot at Detmer (and the WAC in general).  Your post
kinda implies that the only reason Detmer (and BYU) passed so much was to 
get big numbers.  The fact is it wins games.  In the same year that you're
referring to, Detmer passed, passed again, and passed some more all the way
to a 28-21 win over then #1 ranked Miami.   Even with all that "depth", NU
couldn't even score a single point against Miami in last year's Orange bowl.  

-- 
===========================================================================
        Note: All opinions expressed here are entirely my own.
John Dodson                    internet: jpd@austin.ibm.com
IBM AWS                              vm: johnd at ausvm6
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: poutsmaj@mace.cc.purdue.edu (unknown)
Subject: Re: Northern Iowa/Youngstown St. preview
Organization: Purdue University
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 22:48:42 GMT

In article <michaelv.724367617@ponderous.cc.iastate.edu> michaelv@iastate.edu (Michael L. VanLoon) writes:
>In <1992Dec11.100011@mccall.com> scott@mccall.com (Scott D. Davis) writes:
>>In article <Bz2uJ8.Ftx@news.iastate.edu>, ongh@iastate.edu (IDonTcareSOyShdU?) writes:
>>>because of that ISU game you people at Cedar Falls are writhing in ecstacy and
>>>claiming state champion? i never once doubted the UNI panthers as a solid
>>>team, 
>>>
>>Hank, because UNI gets little in respect from ISU and Iowa.  If ISU and UI
>>would quit treating UNI like a little brother/sister, then maybe there
>>wouldn't be such a display of behavior.
>
>It must be the trickle-down theory in practice.  ISU gets the same
>treatment from the Schmuckeye loyal (90% of the state's population, it
>seems).  UNI gets it for a reason--they're a I-AA team.  Admittedly,
>they're one of the best 2A teams, but they are a smaller school.
>
>On the other hand, ISU is almost the same size as UIowa, and has a
>similar sports program.  But the whole state is constantly in a
>Hawkeye orgy.  It's just assumed that if you're a resident in Iowa,
>you must be a communist if you're not a Hawkeye fan.  I'm tired of
>hearing Hawkeye-this and Hawkeye-that, with only afterthought mention
>of the Cyclones if any mention at all (even moreso with the UNI
>Panthers, I'm sure).  I swear if I see another "I bleed Black and
>Gold" bumper sticker, I'm gonna hurl...
>
>
You and me both!  Luckily I now live in Indiana and don't see too many
Iowa bumper stix

-- 
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  Michael L. VanLoon                           Project Vincent Systems Staff
>  michaelv@iastate.edu              Iowa State University Computation Center
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
From: elsonliu@leland.Stanford.EDU (Liu)
Subject: Re: OSU - Cooper's Contract?
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 92 09:25:12 GMT

In article <1992Dec11.135734.6178@desire.wright.edu> demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man) writes:
>...
>	I was thinking more of the nine wins...as in it's been that long since
>we've won that many.
>	And that is from the era where 9-3 wasn't good enough :).  So 9-3
>(although it should have been 10-2,11-1,12-0 :) isn't good enough, nor will be
>9-2-1.
>	Okay, who can coach the Buckeyes to 10-12 wins every year?

Bill Walsh :-)  (woof!)

>Brett

.....Elson.....

Lines: 20
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 12:07:52 MST
From: zimms@gecko.ee.byu.edu (Stephen H. Zimmerman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Distribution: world
Organization: Brigham Young University, Provo UT USA
Subject: Re: Kansas loses 2 players to AlohaBowl


In article <1992Dec18.081024@mccall.com>, scott@mccall.com (Scott D. Davis) writes:
>
>Starting Off. lineman, Booth(Soph), and starting LB, H.Bailey(Sr),
>won't be going to the Aloha Bowl.  They broke team rules and got
>suspended.  Coach Mason wouldn't discussion any more than that, 
>as per his policy.
>--
>Scott D. Davis <scott@mccall.com>       The McCall Pattern Company
>(uucp: ...!widener!depot!mccall!scott)	615 McCall Road
>(800)255-2762, in Kansas (913)776-4041  Manhattan, KS 66502, USA


I really am sorry to hear that--but at least they weren't injured.  As you
probably know, BYU will be starting their 4th string quarterback (lost the
first 3 to injuries).  Maybe with this news we'll stand a chance :)

Merry Christmas (can you guess X-mas gift this byu fan wants?),

Steve
From: s243ap@gandalf.Berkeley.EDU (Dean Roberts)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Army = Larceny (Grand)
Date: 14 Dec 92 00:40:20 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, U. C. Berkeley

In article <1992Dec7.154459.19632@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> wcd2z@curry.edschool.Virginia.EDU (William Camden Daniel) writes:
>Ok, I realize that Navy let the bullet stoppers back into the
>game in the fourth quarter, but how can one justify the case of
>larceny on the one yard line.  It was obvious that the Army
>player had part of his body in the endzone before he had
>complete control of the football.  I can't believe the official
>who was standing behind the player's back, without clear vision
>of the football was allowed to make the call.  Looking back at
>that field position, and then the beneficial field position
>that Army got off Navy's punt, that one botched call by an
>official who was not in position to make it directly affected
>that outcome of the game.  

{stuff deleted}

This is true enough, but that wasn't the only bad call the official made.
On an Army fourth and one from the Navy sixteen, an Army man moved before
the snap so the play should have been whistled dead, giving Army a
fourth and six and letting them try the field goal.  The ref did throw
the flag, but he did not whistle the play dead.  So when Army didn't make
the first down, Navy was given the ball.  This might have cost Army three
points.  I think these two calls just about balance out.

Dean Roberts

Go Bears!!!! :)