HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: schwager@cs.uiuc.edu (Mike Schwager)
Subject: Chording Keyboards... BAT
Summary: Do you like it?
Keywords: keyboards bat
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 07:18:41 GMT

I'm looking for opinions on chording keyboards, especially the BAT (it's
the only one I've ever heard of).  How does it work for carpal
tunnel/just-plain-ol-sore-forearms?  I'm in the sore forearm stage, and I'm
growing concerned...
Thanks.
-Mike
From: albert@edison.seas.ucla.edu (Albert E. Chou)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Anyone heard of Power-Tech drives or V.I.P. Drives?
Keywords: hard disk drive Power-Tech V.I.P.
Date: 7 Apr 92 05:28:07 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: SEASnet, University of California, Los Angeles

I was looking through the ads in the May MacUser and found an ad for cheap
hard disks under the Power-Tech brand name being sold by a place in Florida
called V.I.P. Drives.  Has anyone ever heard of these names, and if so, are the
corresponding reputations good or bad?

Thanks in advance,
Al
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: mtmatt@wpi.WPI.EDU (Matthew Edmund Dreyer)
Subject: Re: Mail Order Macs - Good Route To Go?
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA 01609-2280
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 19:52:12 GMT


If I were an Apple dealer and you brought me a Mac not sold by me I think
I would react in the following way:

     First I would mutter a few things under my breath about other
     Apple dealers in the area not supporting what they sell (be it
     true or not).  Then I would point you in the direction of the
     service department.  In the service department they would be
     VERY happy to fix your Mac.  Since you are not a regular customer
     you won't be getting the speediest of service, and never mind
     the discount you might have received had you purchased the 
     system there.

As you may have guessed by now, I have worked for dealers in the past.
Now we may not be the most knowledgeable persons on the planet, but
for someone new to computers I think it is better to talk face to face
with someone that can demonstrate what they are talking about instead
of having phone conversation.

summary:

Dealers do have a place in this world.  If you are a guru, you might only
go to a dealer to see first hand what you are going to mail order anyway.
For some people a GOOD, RELIABLE dealer is the best friend in the world.
For others, dealers are the epitome of what computers shouldn't be.

just my buck and a quarter,

mtmatt

mtmatt@wpi.wpi.edu                  (Matthew Edmund Dreyer)
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We have a few chinks in our economic armour."    ---unintentionaly spoken by
						     a WPI history professor 
Matthew Edmund Dreyer (mtmatt@wpi.wpi.edu)          Views here are not my own
Xref: sparky comp.sys.mac.hardware:9110 comp.sys.mac.misc:9071
From: grenade@ozrout.uucp (Kate McDonnell)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware,comp.sys.mac.misc
Subject: Re: The LCII FUBAR
Date: 13 Apr 92 00:22:07 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Andre P. Ozrout

In article <11320@ksr.com> jfw@ksr.com (John F. Woods) writes:
>grenade@ozrout.uucp (Kate McDonnell) writes:
>>Another LCII question: The Macworld article states that the LCII
>>was designed in a less than optimal way in order to keep its
>>price the same as the LC. A call to my dealer this morning
>>elicited hoots and giggles at the very idea.
>
>What does "less than optimal way" MEAN?
>
>They apparently put as little engineering money into it while achieving the
>benefits of (1) a 68030, and (2) 4Mb soldered to the board, in order to
>achieve a machine they could sell for the cost of an LC which was faster.
>Sounds good to me.

I seem to have unwittingly stepped on a few toes with "less than
optimal". In fact, I'm thinking of getting an LCII myself, but
was confused only by the fact that although it had been
publicized as having the same price tag as the LC, I found this
wasn't true, and wondered if anyone could explain why this is so.
Hey, I agree that any computer must be the result of pragmatic
decisions about engineering versus expense: I can't afford a
Quadra either.



-- 
Kate McDonnell
grenade@ozrout.UUCP
(ozrout!grenade@netserv.sobeco.com)
From: eric@praxis.co.uk (Eric Nelson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Powerbook 100: monitor and quickdraw?
Date: 6 Apr 92 10:42:44 GMT
Organization: Praxis, Bath, U.K.

Hi all,

I am thinking of getting a Powerbook 100 but have a couple of questions
before I decide for certain. Any info appreciated.

I have been told they do not run Colour Quickdraw. Is this true and if
so, will it affect me? (I would be using the powerbook occasionally with
graphic programs such as Freehand and Macdraw Pro). Would it not just be
the same as say an LC with the monitor in B/W mode?

On a similar topic, I would also like in the future to connect an
external monitor. I followed a recent discussion, but it seemed to talk
about the 140 and 170. Can a 100 be connected to an external and in
particular can it drive the monitor in colour?

Any info from UK users about prices/experiences of connecting to a
monitor would be especially useful.

Thanks

Eric
From: jay@astro.as.utexas.edu (Jay Boisseau)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Re: LC II/IIsi Comparisons.
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:10:58 GMT
Organization: McDonald Observatory, University of Texas @ Austin

In article <D88-JWA.92Apr3210635@hemul.nada.kth.se> d88-jwa@hemul.nada.kth.se (Jon W{tte) writes:
>.pko.dec.com> davis@gauss.enet.dec.com (Peter Davis) writes:
>
>   Isn't the LC II a 16 MHz machine, and the IIsi a 20 MHz?
>
>That's true, but it's offset by the IIsi internal video coming
>from RAM, while the LC has VRAM. HOWEVER: the LC has only a
>16 bit data path, making it as slow as the Classic II; whereas
>the IIsi has full bus width, and might even be a little faster
>than the SE/30 (in b/w mode at least)


That's what I thought, so I was surprised when I read the "benchmarks" in the
LC II article (actually, it covered both the LC II and the new LW). In most
of the tests, the IIsi and the LC II were _very_ comparable. I thought the
IIsi should be _significantly_ faster since it's data path is twice as wide
(32 bits to 16 bits). Why is this?

Also, doesn't the IIsi have a FPU? Or is that optional? The Excel recalc test
was the only one in which either machine had a significant advantage, but the
IIsi was still not as much faster as I would have expected if it has a FPU.
It was only faster by the amount that I would expect from having a data path
twice as wide (which, as I said, made _no_ difference in the other tests).

Jay Boisseau
Astronomy Dept.
University of Texas at Austin

Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: atau@ccrma.Stanford.edu (Atau Tanaka)
Subject: Re: AudioMedia, SampleCell, Cubase Audio ?
Reply-To: atau@ccrma.Stanford.edu
Organization: DSG, Stanford University
Distribution: rec
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 92 16:59:59 GMT

Jon W{tte writes
> 
> How good is the SoundDesigner "simple" version that comes with
> this ? How good are the filters etc. on the SampleCell as compared
> to a S-750 ?
> 
> Can you run AudioMedia cards in tandem, or do you have to get the
> expensive SoundWhatever card for that ?
> 
Well, SampleCell has NO filters. But a very extensive matrix modulation scheme.  
Multiple AudioMedia cards are known to work with Opcode's StudioVision. I think  
it'll work with Cubase too.

Beware of the load time on the Sample Cell.

--
           Atau Tanaka
	   Center for Computer Research in Music & Acoustics
	   (CCRMA)

	   atau@ccrma.stanford.edu
	   
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: chuj@horton.Colorado.EDU (CHU JEFFREY)
Subject: Re: Want a Good, WELL Priced mac with Great Service? 
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 21:53:13 GMT

>Here's an example:
>
>LC II 4/40: $1299
>LC II 4/80: $1499
>IIsi 3/40:  $1989
>IIsi 5/80:  $2249
>App. 13" :  $649
>OneScanner: $999
>IIg:        $3400
>PB 170 4/40 w/modem: $3799
>DeskWriter: $399, DW-C: $649

Some of these prices at local stores in Colorado are the same as these mentioned, COMPUSA, the IIsi is similar ($1998.00).
DA*N also for me though, I paid $1498. for a LCII with 512KVRAM (4/40) the
first week they came out!!!  Oh Well.
From: stevem@hp-vcd.vcd.hp.com (Steve Miller)
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 00:21:51 GMT
Subject: Mail Order Macs - Good Route To Go?
Organization: Hewlett Packard, Vancouver, WA, USA
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware

In the back of magazines like MacWeek I see adds for mail order Macintoshs.
I would like to hear from people who've ordered Macs from these dealers.
If your Mac breaks, can you still get it fixed at the local computer store,
or do you have to ship it back to these supposably grey market dealers?

They certianly have some decent prices.

Steven Miller
From: bradk@wimsey.bc.ca (Brad Kollmyer)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Re: Epson Printers and Mac
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 92 16:28:07 PDT
Organization: Vital Consulting
Reply-To: bradk@wimsey.bc.ca
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v4


In article <Edpptne00XciI0jkRP@andrew.cmu.edu> (comp.sys.mac.hardware), "Stuart A. Siegel" <ss8d+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> Is there any hope of driving an old Epson RX80 with a Plus?
> I know of the Grappler product but I've been advised (by people who seel
> it!)  not to even try it because it would lead to more frustration than
> it was worth.
> Any other options?  If not, wanna but a RX80?

GDT Softworks should have a printer driver to support your printer.
Try sending them email at gdt.mkt@applelink.apple.com for more information.

Brad.
From: sarwate@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Sanjiv Sarwate)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: External Hard Drive Recommendations?
Date: 13 Apr 92 14:42:42 GMT
Article-I.D.: ux1.1992Apr13.144242.9970
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

I have a friend who is interested in purchasing an external harddrive for
his Macintosh II.  The drive is supposed to be for his teenaged son, so the 
son can keep his games on one drive while the "real" applications are kept
on the other.  Thus, he is not looking for a large drive.  Can anyone give
any recommendations (e-mail only please!) as to which hard drives of 100 MB
or less are most reliable, efficient, etc.?

Thanks a lot!



-- 
Sanjiv Sarwate		sarwate@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu	SANJIV@UIUCVMD
"We all thought one could treat history like one experiments in physics. The
difference is that in physics one can repeat the experiment a thousand times,
but in history, only once."  -Arthur Koestler, DARKNESS AT NOON
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware,comp.sys.mac.misc
From: heuring@csn.org (Vincent Heuring)
Subject: Large Color Monitors for Quadra
Organization: Universtiy of Coloardo, Boulder
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 03:07:45 GMT


I am in the market for a *good*, large color monitor for the quadra.
I intend to use the built-in video of the quadra.  I would like a 2page
display if possible.  But mainly I want a crisp, sharp image that I can stare
at for N hours per day and be pleased with my choice.

How about some observations on:

	20" Ikegami ($2398 w. 8-bit interface from MacDirect)
	20" Sony Trinitron ($1898 w. 8-bit interface, no monitor
			    mfr listed, from MacDirect)
	19", 20", 21" Radius monitors ($2069, $2729, $2845 from Club Mac)
	20" SuperMatch, 20" Supermatch Trinitron ($1679, $2519 from Club Mac)
	19"(?) E-Machines T19 ($2795 "with free 8bit Color Board" Express Dir.)
	21" Apple Color Monitor (No price available.)

Or any other 19-21" monitor you are familiar with.  Also any info on
Mac Direct, Club Mac, and Express Direct if you have it.

Many thanks...

-- 
---
 Vincent Heuring   Dep't of Electrical & Computer Engineering
 University of Colorado at Boulder      Boulder CO 80309-0425
 heuring@cs.Colorado.EDU   o) 303-492-8751    h) 303-449-8868
From: tony@scotty.dccs.upenn.edu (Anthony Olejnik)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Mac+ Accelerator (Brainstorm): How much? Where can I get it?
Date: 13 Apr 92 12:31:03 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pennsylvania


I`m interested in getting an accelerator for my MacPlus.
I`m thinking about the `Brainstorm Accelerator' (as advertised
in the 3-30-92 issues of MacWeek pg. 47).  

The ad indicates it can be obtained for $249 direct from
Brainstorm Products in Mountain View.

Can I get it cheaper?
If so, where and for how much?

Thanks in advance.

--tony
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: kucharsk@solbourne.com (William Kucharski)
Subject: Re: Floppy problems
Organization: Solbourne Computer, Inc., Longmont, CO
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 19:53:14 GMT

While reading article <1992Apr8.165318.278@newshost.lanl.gov>, I noticed that
davids@c3.lanl.gov (David Simmons) said the following:
 >Are these HD or DD disks?  Here is my understanding of the problem:
 >
 >An HD disk formatted 800K will not be recognized by an HD drive.
 >A DD Disk, formatted 800K should be recognized by any drive.
 >And of course an HD Disk Fomatted 1.4M will NOT be recognized
 >by a DD Drive (800K).

Of course there is the "standard" way to get around this problem, and that is
to cover the "extra" sense hole on the floppy with a piece of tape when using
it in a HD drive.

The real question of course would be "Why are you using HD disks in a 800K
drive in the first place?"
-- 
| William Kucharski, Solbourne Computer, Inc.     | Opinions expressed above
| Internet: kucharsk@solbourne.com   Ham: N0OKQ   | are MINE alone, not those
| Snail Mail: 1900 Pike Road, Longmont, CO  80501 | of Solbourne Computer, Inc.
| President, "Just the Ten of Us" Fan Club        | "It's Night 9 with D2 Dave!"
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: gregpen@crash.cts.com (Greg Penetrante)
Subject: Re: Sony 1304 Monitor Not All That Great
Organization: Crash TimeSharing, El Cajon, CA
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 06:38:17 GMT

In <IdsFcna00XQGI4hmlO@andrew.cmu.edu> jb6o+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jason Andrew Barshay) writes:


>I have a Sony 1304 multiscan HG monitor and like it very much.  I am not
>sure what your objection to it is.  I do not find the Apple 13" monitor
>to be all that amazing of a monitor.  I for one am a completely
>satisfied customer with the Sony monitor.

>Jason


....I AGREE WITH JASON.  And I disagree with the starter of this thread. The
Sony 1304HG (now in a "C") version with lower ELF emissions for the same price,
blows the Apple monitor out of the water in terms of weight, color fidelity
at dark and light areas, gamma control and focus.  The 1304 has also better 
supoort and repair facilities than the Apple RGB EVER WILL HAVE, IMHO.

The 1304 can also be tweaked to specific screen sizes, albeit like the 3fgx.
Furthermore, the 1304 is a multiscanning monitor, and thus offers theoretically
more flexibility in mixed platform environments, as the budget person only has
to buy many Sonys instead of Apples and Sonys in order to accomodate a multi-
platform lab environment.

Sony's monitor is also discounted at far below that of Apple's 13" display.

But perhaps the reason for buying this Sony in the first place is because of the
HUGE service network that Sony has to offer, as opposed to many Apple dealers
who don't know squat about the RGB monitors from Apple.  Granted, it can safely
be assumed that ALL techs in a commercial environment are ornery folk who think
they know MORE than the average consultant (and some do), and LAUGH in your face
when you ask, "please just tell me where the pot is and I'll adjust it myself."
HAHAHA.

>click<

-gregpen@crash.cts.com


Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: duane@blacks.jpl.nasa.gov (Duane Clark)
Subject: Re: Serial Port Programming
Organization: Image Analysis Systems Group, JPL
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 19:07:55 GMT

green@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Bradley Green ) writes:

>I know this is more of a software quest, but I posted to the programming
>group and had no responses, and thought that a few hardware hackers might
>know the answer.  

>I'm trying to run a distributed processing network, using a Mac as the 
>master controller, with dedicated microcontrollers at the oother nodes
>of the network.  What I want to do is to be able to run the Mac serial
>port at its maximum asynchronous speed, which I believe is 230Kbaud, but
>I haven't found any real info on how to program the serial port to do
>this.  Note that I don't want to use AppleTalk protocols, but just to
>send data byte-by-byte.

The easy way (relatively speaking) is to settle for 57600 baud, which
is supported by the Serial Driver manager. If you want to go higher,
you will have to talk to the hardware directly. This is a Zilog Z8530,
and is accessed at a base address of sccRBase to read, and at sccWBase
to write (otherwise known as 9FFFF8 and BFFFF9, respectively). You really
need Inside Macintosh III and specs on the Z8530.
Xref: sparky comp.sys.mac.hardware:8863 comp.sys.mac.misc:8822
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware,comp.sys.mac.misc
Subject: Re: The LCII FUBAR
From: stanger@otago.ac.nz (Nigel Stanger)
Date: 8 Apr 92 16:48:07 +1300
Organization: University of Otago, Dunedin, New Zealand

In article <64913@apple.Apple.COM>, bc@Apple.COM (bill coderre) writes:
[...]
> I simply don't understand this theory that Apple is somehow "ripping
> customers off" by "intentionally crippling" the design of the LC and
> LC II. If you want a machine with bigger cojones, there are plenty to
> choose from. Those that can survive with slightly reduced processing
> power get a price break.
> 
> Isn't that fair?

Hear hear! I don't know why people are so down on the LCs. I like
mine fine. Yes, I would like something faster, but I bought what
I could afford at the time. Hell, I use my LC for application 
development; it's a little slow, but since I can't afford a
Quadra (or even, for that matter, an si), I can live with it.
Like Bill said, if you don't like LCs you don't have to buy one.

-- 
See ya
                                Nigel.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nigel Stanger,                  Internet: stanger@otago.ac.nz
University of Otago,            Phone: +64 3 479-8179
Dunedin, NEW ZEALAND.           Fax:   +64 3 479-8311
"ACK! Pthptttt!" -- Bill the Cat, "Bloom County"
From: slater@acsu.buffalo.edu (Joseph C. Slater)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Keyboard troubles...
Date: 6 Apr 92 19:50:44 GMT
Organization: UB

I used to be able to press command-control-on to reboot my mac IIsi.
Just as the manual says.  However, it doesn't work anymore except when
the sun and moon are in the 'correct positions'.  A swaped keyboards with
a friend and this solves the problem.  I've switched cables and keyboards
enough to prove to myself that something funney (or not so funney) is
happening inside my keyboard.  Seeing as it's not under warrantee anymore,
I have no problem with going in with a soldering iron and solving the 
problem.  Just one question.  What is the problem?  By the way, in all
other key commands I use (i.e. control-z, command-., turning the machine on)
the keys always work flawlessly.  Hmmmm.  I'd love to hear any good
explainations.

Joe Slater
Mechanical Systems Lab
University at Buffalo
Buffalo, NY 14260
From: archetyp@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Joseph R Pickert)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: superdrive source needed
Summary: superdrive source needed
Keywords: superdrive
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:33:56 GMT
Article-I.D.: ux1.1992Apr9.163356.24804
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

The internal superdrive floppy on my mac IIcx no longer works.
Anybody have a good replacement source? The local apple
dealer wants $282 for one. This seems excessive to me.
Thanks.

Joe Pickert
archetyp@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
From: "Robert P. Humphrey" <rhumphre@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: Apple Dealers reliable? (was: MacWeek reliable?)
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 14:10:40 -0500

In article <1992Apr6.172543.28284@mdd.comm.mot.com> gix@mdd.comm.mot.com (Brian Gix) writes:
>Speaking of mis or half truths about apple dealers, I was wondering exactly
>how strict the Apple warranty is in regard to the inside of II series cases.
>An apple dealer here said I couldn't install my own memory in my new ci...
>Can I: install my own memory, install my own internal HD etc. or do I need
>to take it to a dealer for that 5-10 minute job?

	I work for a local Apple dealer, doing odd jobs, etc, and
according to the rules set aside by Apple, the 1 Year product warranty
does not have to be observed if the user/owner does any type of
modification his/herself, or has such a modification done by anyone
but an Apple authorized repairman at an authorized Apple repair
center.  These are not your local dealer's rules; they are Apple's
rules.  I put my own memory and drives in my SE/30, and am very
proficient at it, but my warranty was still voided the minute I opened
the case.  It is easy to prove that a compact Mac has been opened
because of the strange screws and the tightness of the case; marks and
scratches are easy to detect.  On the II series it is much harder to
tell, but it still voids the warranty if it can be proved that the
unit was "illegially" (for lack of a better word) tampered with.
	I have also noticed a lot of flack being set towards the Apple
dealers because of misinformation.  It is a common misconception that
the dealers get any information before you do, especially with the
internet around.  At our office we did not know of any price cuts
until they happened, knew that the LCII was coming out soon, but not
when or how it would be distributed in relation to the LC, and I found
out about the drive and 13" Monitor repair extensions here before we
found out at the store.  The dealers for the most part are not a part
of Apple; we just buy product from them at a bulk rate.
	I hope this helps.

	Bob

My place of employment and my school are not responsible for me
shooting off my mouth.
-- 
*******************************************************************************
       Robert Humphrey,       "It's easy to grin when your ship comes in,
       Gentleman Scholar      And you've got the stock market beat;
                              But the man worthwhile, Is the man who can smile,
   rhumphre@ucs.indiana.edu   When his shorts are too tight in the seat."
From: dmm@cfa.harvard.edu (David Meleedy)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: LC II
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:31:16 GMT
Reply-To: meleedy@cfa.harvard.edu
Organization: Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory, Cambridge, MA,  USA

Has anyone out there actually used an LC II yet?  If so, what are your
impressions?
-- 
=======
David Meleedy				Smithonian Astrophysical Observatory
meleedy@cfa.harvard.edu			60 Garden Street, MS 70
Phone: 617 495 7252			Cambridge, MA  02138  USA
From: ostroff@Oswego.EDU (Boyd Ostroff)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.hardware
Subject: Re: Monitor Opinion
Date: 8 Apr 92 14:29:37 GMT
Article-I.D.: oswego.1992Apr8.142937.21561
Reply-To: ostroff@oswego.Oswego.EDU (Boyd Ostroff)
Organization: Instructional Computing Center, SUNY at Oswego, Oswego, NY

In article <1992Apr7.211731.470@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> an780@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Travis Grundke) writes:
>
>Any comments on the new 16" Trinitron monitor?

I love it.  Got one a couple weeks ago at work.  It is very bright, excellent
contrast.  Fine text is completely readable.  It looks like the 13" Apple
Color but bigger.  It sits side by side with an E-Machines Z-21 (21" 8 bit
grayscale) and is far, far superior in terms of contrast, focus and brightness.

If I could afford one, I'd buy it for my cx at home.  Actually the edu
price is very reasonable, but I would also need a new video card.

.............................................................................
....Boyd Ostroff / Technical Director / SUNY Oswego Department of Theatre....
...............Voice: (315) 341-2987 /  Fax: (315) 341-3394..................
..............ostroff@oswego.oswego.edu / ostroff@cboard.UUCP................
Xref: sparky comp.sys.mac.hardware:8886 comp.sys.mac.misc:8839