From: dames@cs.uiuc.edu (Raymond Dames)
Subject: Re: Big Ten Bowls
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 00:44:39 GMT

In rec.sport.football.college you write:

>In article <By4zzo.H60@cs.uiuc.edu> dames@cs.uiuc.edu (Raymond Dames) writes:
>>      Now, there may be some complaints about Illinois' bowl-boundedness,
>>especially from Big10 bashers, but, as an Illini fan, I will defend them
>>here:  of their 4 losses, one was by 1 pt. to Minnesota in the dome, where
>>Colorado nipped the Wolves 21-20 early in the season.  Another was by an
>>amazing 3TD 4th quarter comeback to the surprising NU Wildcats, 27-26.
>>A third was at the Astrodome to the Houston Cougars early in the season; the
>>same team and place at which the #3 Aggies were challenged (38-30 win) two
>>weeks back.  The 4th was a pitiful 24-14 loss to Iowa at home, for which I
>>am somewhat embarrassed.  However, Illinois defeated OSU in Columbus 18-16,
>>and tied Michigan in Ann Arbor 22-22.  Illinois was not blown out by any team
>>this year...
>>The point that I am asserting is that Illinois plays to the level of its
>>competition; consequently, the Illini often upset teams and are also often
>>upset themselves.

>       I nearly choked this morning when I heard Tepper say "We're only
>       5 points away from the Rose Bowl, but we'll take the Holiday Bowl".
>       So much for humility.  As "strong" a case as you make above, I
>       can make an equally strong one for Illinois doing much worse than
>       6-4-1.  I'll give you the Minnesota and Northwestern games back.
>       That's 8-2-1.  Then, I'll take away the Michigan tie and the OSU
>       win (2 pts, loads of OSU choking), the Wisconsin win (1 pt, Bucky
>       blew it in the fourth), the Purdue win (3 pts, the Boilers had
>       this one), and the MSU win (MSU shot itself in the foot early and
>       late).  By that tally I come up with 4-7.  The only differences, in
>       my opinion, between 6-4-1 Illinois and everyone from Michigan State
>       to Purdue are some late Jason Verduzco heroics and some sloppy
>       ballhandling by the opposition...

        The mere fact that these teams choked and Illinois didn't (they did against
NU, though) is what separates teams like Illinois from the other Big10 teams, teams
like Miami from teams like Syracuse, and teams like Florida State from teams like
Georgia Tech.  Lots of games can go both ways...fate favors the better team.  Not
to say that these games prove Illinois a better team, but then again 12 games
doesn't provide for a very accurate season anyway...go with what the facts suggest.

>       Was there a more fortunate team in the Big Ten this year than Illinois?

        I agree, as I said, the Illini have karma on their side.  But I'm not
trying to make a point for Illinois being 8-2-1 or deserving a Rose Bowl, or
anything like that...my point is that I've heard alot of complaints against the
proverbial '6-5 Big Ten Team that doesn't deserve a bowl game' and I sense that,
although the Illini are 6-4-1 and the only 6 win team in the Big10 to go to a bowl,
some people, particularly Big10 bashers, will be angered that the Illini are going
to a bowl game due to the Big10's overall weak showing this year.  I was merely
trying to point out that the season could've taken a very different turn...you've
tried to do the same.  But the fact is Illinois is 6-4-1 and that's that--don't
take anything away and don't give anything back--stick with the reality of the
situation.  I don't think it's fair to use logic such as 'the Big Ten sucks so
6-4-1 isn't a good enough record'-- the losses were close, the wins were close.
No outsider has the right to take (or give, which I wasn't trying to do) anything
away from their record.

>       Concerning Houston, 31-13 may not have truly represented the game,
>       but 24-13, without the last-play TD, did.  Verduzco had a terrible
>       day...  Consider also that the only winning team Illinois won
>       against was Ohio State.

        They didn't lose to a winning team this year, though, going 1-0-1 against
OSU and Michigan ON THE ROAD...the only teams above .500 that they played.  They
were 5-4 against losing teams...this was, for the most part, my point about Illini
playing to the level of the competition.  I feel that this tendency alone makes a
strong case for the Illini deserving a bowl game.

>-------------------------------
>| Randy Peppler               |
>| Illinois State Water Survey |
>| peppler@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu    |

                                                        Ray Dames
                                                        dames@cs.uiuc.edu


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