HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: carroll@cs.uiuc.edu (Alan M. Carroll)
Subject: Re: News re Lee's 'Malcolm X'
Organization: Technophiles Inc. - Engineers with Attitude
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 23:47:50 GMT

In article <stovall.715383490@ficus.cs.ucla.edu>, stovall@ficus.cs.ucla.edu (Steven Stovall) writes:
> carroll@cs.uiuc.edu (Alan M. Carroll) writes:
> The studios are obviously in business to make money.  The science of
> predicting gross revenues is notoriously inexact, but the claim is that
> WB should have every reason to believe that X will recoup a $35 Million
> investment based on Spike's track record, the volatility of the material,
> and the extraordinary anticipation accompanying the opening of the film.

It's not just a matter of recouping. There's only so much money
available, and if one has to choose between breaking even and bringing
3 or 4 times the original, which one is going to be selected?

Of course, you and Mr. Barnhart has a point that judging expected
receipts is much more guesswork than science and an executive's
opinions could easily be influenced by their own predjudices.

I guess what I was arguing about is that it's almost never "one
thing", e.g. racism or money or power. While it's quite plausible
that racism played a role in the amount of financing available to Mr.
Lee, profit was certainly right up there also.

> BTW, your numbers are way too high for domestic gross expectations:

Yes. I should have specified I meant overall grosses, including
foreign and secondary merchandising revenue. Both of these now
constitute large fractions of expected returns.

-- 
Alan M. Carroll          "Weren't there yams involved, too?" - J. Ockerbloom
Epoch Development Team   
Urbana Il.               "I hate shopping with the reality-impaired" - Susan
From: helfman@aero.org (Robert S. Helfman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Daughters of the Dust??
Date: 31 Aug 1992 20:24:03 GMT
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aerospace.aero.org

In article <31AUG199209342615@venus.tamu.edu> eah0065@venus.tamu.edu (HASKIN, EDWARD ARTHUR) writes:
>Could anyone tell about this movie production? Where can I see or get a copy
>to view??
>
>

The film, by Julie Dash, concerns a family of Gullah people, African-Americans
from the Sea Islands off the coast of Georgia/South Carolina, just prior to
their migration north. The film is filled with mysticism and questioning of
'old-time' values, the need to hold onto family ties, with some of the
antipathy held by mainland blacks for the 'geechee' blacks of the
offshore islands (and vice versa).

It's a beautiful film. The accents are sometimes a bit hard to
understand (some of the cast was locally recruited on the Sea Islands, some
are regulars that have worked with Ms. Dash before). 

The film was shown recently on PBS. along with an
interview with Ms. Dash.

Since it was in the theaters about six months ago (I wanted to see it
at the Baldwin here in L.A. but it appeared for a week and vanished),
I expect it will make it onto video sometime soon.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: News re Lee's 'Malcolm X'
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 17:58:21 GMT

In article <17lh6fINNpsm@debussy.crhc.uiuc.edu>,
guillory@crhc.uiuc.edu (Stanford Guillory) writes:
>Why exactly does Malcolm need to be supported? When a man has been
>dead over twenty years, I think he pretty much doesn't care about
>support anymore.
.
.
.
It's Malcolm's ideals which are being reaffirmed in the
African-American community.  Apparently, Spike believes that one way
to support Malcolm is to support Spike's movie.  While I am sure
many Afro-Ams disagree with that, we do support Malcolm X's legacy:
for the community to strive for economic, political, cultural and
spiritual self-determination, something which needs resounding
action here and now...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: frankli@seq.uncwil.edu (william carter franklin)
Subject: Re: 8-Trey Gangsta Madness
Organization: Univ. of North Carolina @ Wilmington
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 15:11:56 GMT

cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher Morton) writes:

>As quoted from <1992Aug31.141215.12210@seq.uncwil.edu> by frankli@seq.uncwil.edu (william carter franklin):

>> 
>> 
>> 
>> >I heard a group of Blacks interviewed on NPR regarding the Denny beating a few
>> >months ago.  Let me tell you, with one notable exception, you could have sworn
>> >it was a bunch of White bigots justifying the King beating.  It was truly 
>> >pathetic.  If you reversed the racial terms, the conversation could have easily
>> >taken place in an ethnic bar in Howard Beach, NY; Parma, OH or Cicero, IL.
>> 
>> >Sorry, there are enough WHITE Klansman.  I don't think we're benefitting 
>> >ourselves in any way by acting like Black ones....
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Newsflash:
>> 
>> Sunday StarNews Sunday, August 30, 1992
>> 
>> Police Blotter
>> 
>> 
>> 	A racially motivated violent incident was reported to have

>Of course to be really relevant to the issue at hand, some otherwise law-
>abiding citizens would have to "explain" how this was a good thing....



>-- 
>------------------------------------------------------------------  

>"Well whose opinions did you THINK these were...?" 
>------------------------------------------------------------------  


HUH?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: On the use of a racial epithet
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 00:57:33 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.225250.10465@ncsu.edu>,
dsh@odin.ece.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
>In the newsgroup talk.abortion, we seem to have a little controversy
>over someone's use of the term "fat black ass".  I've always thought
>this term was highly offensive, and I remember hearing that the term
>"black ass" had some sort of hidden meaning attached with it.  I can't
>remember what the hidden meaning was, but I was hoping that someone
>might be able to come over to talk.abortion and post an explanation.
>I was going to post this to alt.discrimination, but I saw so much junk
>posted there I figured that nobody would see it.  I apologize
>if this is not the correct newsgroup to raise this issue.
>
>Below is the original article which started the controversy:
>(Stephen Chaney, the person who the comment was directed to,
>has stated that he is an African-American).

[everything else deleted for the sake of brevity]
.
.
It's offensive, whether a white or a black says it.  It should not
have been used, even in a "civilized" conversation.  Using it is
bound to cause flames...I hated my own mother for using the term
which is not one of endearment, babies.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: Lee: Skip work to attend Malcolm X
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 00:34:04 GMT

In article <1992Aug31.151504.11069@ntmtv>,
wattsww@ntmtv.UUCP (Warren Watts) writes in response to Zafar's
homophobic number against Terrance Heath..
>>
>>Spike Lee hates 'em, Malcolm X couldn't care for 'em. And I'd like to beat
>>one up.
>>
THUSLY:
>
>You don't see the face until the eyelids drop
>you don't hear the screaming until it stops
>
>Disposable Heroes of Hiphoprisy
>
>I hope if you put your words into actions you get the same treatment as
>your counterpart in this song.  I'd like to blow your brains out.
>
>Die in agony, M.F.,
.
.
.
You know, I can't tell who is being flamed here, Zafar or Terrance.
I will say this, I agree with Terrance. All brothers wrestle with
the idea of what is a man--for themselves.  Being a black man is not
entirely connected with heterosexuality.  Watching "School Daze," I
was put off by Spike's "Gamma, gamma, gamma" number, and other
evidence of his black woman hating--the sorority sisters me-owing
and the young woman forced to have sex with another man by Big
Brother Almighty...puh-leese.
.
I didn't see "Mo Betta Blues," because I got tired, you know. I saw
"Jungle Fever" just to see what the brother was offering...which
was only a bit more than what I already knew.
.
At the least, I'll see what Spike has to say.  He deserves that
much. However, he does not deserve to go off scott-free on what
myself and others perceive as his detriments.
.
As far as Zafar is concerned, he hasn't moved from boxer shorts to
bikini g-strings YET in my most humble opinion...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: News re Lee's 'Malcolm X'
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 16:25:32 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.002738.1@mscf.med.upenn.edu>,
mills_j@mscf.med.upenn.edu writes:
>
> HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels) writes:
>> More on Spike Lee's "Malcolm X..."
>> .
>> I read today in the Chronicle that Time-Warner execs saw the
>> finished product, 3 hours and 20 minutes, and are pretty shook up.
>> Get ready for some more fireworks re freedom of expression.  After
>> the "Cop Killer" Ice-T controversy, these dudes are scared.
>
>[repetitive stuff deleted here...see previous posts]
>
>
>     I was reasonably impressed with Time-Warner re: their handling of the
>whole Ice-T Body Count flap.  Basically, they seemed to be standing by his
>right to say what he wanted, despite bomb threats from various renegade
>anonymous police sympathizers and despite several major record chains' yank-
>ing of the title from their shelves.  And in the end, when they stopped re-
>lease, it was Ice-T himself who made the announcement.  Of course, he might
>have been privately pressured, but if you read the interview with him in
>a recent Rolling Stone, he actually seemed happy with T-W.
.
I think little Stevie Stovall weighed in a few posts ago that Ice-T
basically wanted a movie career so he was willing to make the
tradeoff with Time-Warner, thus making them look good and making a
instant profit once all the non-deleted albums were sold off.
.
>So I guess it'll be interesting to see how T-W will handle Mr. Lee's latest
>offer.  BTW, what's the case for the argument that T-W came down harder on
>Lee's budget problems than they would have on a white producer/director?
>Just asking, not looking for flames, thank you.
.
.
Why should a black-made film be conveniently low budget?  Lee's film
was only $5 million over budget, making the accountants squirm
unnecessarily. I'm sure they don't mind major outlays for films like
"Terminator 2," or "Hook," or "Apocalypse Now"...I mean, it's
something that can be worked out at Spago's.  There are very few
films that are brought in under or at budget in Hollywood-land.  If
they don't make the returns back immediately at the box office, it's
either made back in European and African and Asian rentals, on cable
and in video tapes.
.
I say these accountants and execs are just freaked at Spike Lee's
continuing audacity to hurl, as it were, right back at them at the
double standards for putting together films and personnel.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: 8-Trey Gangsta Madness
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 22:16:49 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.191758.9509@athena.cs.uga.edu>,
heath@athena.cs.uga.edu (Terrance Heath) writes back to
<1992Aug28.162118.22444@aero.org> helfman@aero.org (Robert S.
Helfman's) piece:
.
>>Although I agree that these guys will have a hard time getting
>>a fair trial, I feel it's a righteous prosecution. SOMEBODY beat the
>>shit out of Reginald Denny and somebody should do time for it.
>>
.
Terrance says:

>SOMEBODY? Yeah, the same mofo's sho pulled the man from his truck and
>were captured on videotape (really, the irony of this whole thing is
>incredible), should serve serious time for it.  I cannot believe that
>there are people who are actually supporting these guys. If they were
>captured on videotape damn near beating a man to death, without
>provocation, then what the hell is there to support?
.
.
.
Frankly, I feel sick at the double standard being practiced re the
4 cops and the three young brothers.  More attention is fastened on
the white guy being beaten to the inch of his life than on what
happened to Rodney King.  I am going to admit: yes, Rodney is crazy:
alcoholic and then some.  But no one deserves what Rodney got from
representatives of the state.
.
I don't condone the brothers.  I don't think most of those who are
supporting them do.  I think they are mostly doing the cockeyed
thing: supporting the hoods because Rodney was dissed and that
attention should be focused on police violence.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: wattsww@ntmtv.UUCP (Warren Watts)
Subject: Re: Ignorance about skin color and sunburn
Reply-To: wattsww@ntmtv.UUCP (Warren Watts)
Organization: Northern Telecom Inc, Mountain View, CA
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 02:05:53 GMT

In article <1992Aug22.222014.264@mtechca.maintech.com> foster@mtechca.maintech.com writes:
>
>Until now, I had no way of finding out what was true, though, because 
>I didn't dare ask anyone who would know (ie, a black person) for fear 
>of more Grievous Flaming in Person. I could find no reading material 
>that would answer my question - magazine articles and newspaper opinions 
>only wanted to discuss poverty, crime, racism and affirmative action, 
>not things like sunburn and tanning. I didn't know s.c.a.a. existed at 
>that time; and even now I fear I may be misusing it by asking this 
>question. Like someone wrote in disgust a couple of months ago, s.c.a.a. 
>is supposed to be a forum for African Americans to talk to each other, 
>not for European Americans to flaunt our ignorance.
>
>So when ~was~ I an ignorant white m*th*rf*ck*r? Before my freshman 
>year, or from my freshman year until now, or from now until I die? 
>
Probably until you learn not to make theories and talk about them with
out any data.  You probably won't get flamed by anyone if you ask them
without presenting your wild theories first.  I have been able to
discuss this with Blacks, East Indians, and Vietnamese people by
tactful letting the subject arise in normal conversation with out ever
being called an ignorant white mutherf***er.  If you lay in the sun
until you blister, the topic will probably come up naturally with your
darker friends and acquaintences. ;)                       
 
 Peace,
	   Warren Watts


Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: minor@rtsg.mot.com (Kevin Minor)
Subject: Re: Women Bashing
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 21:26:41 GMT

mjcarpen@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Michael J. Carpenter) writes:

|>I think we kicked this one a few months ago over on alt.rap. I *assumed* that
|>most of the rap listeners knew the difference between what should be taken 
|>and discarded, and what lyrics might lead to a better undertstanding about
|>things.

Not when there are listeners out there that are pre-teenagers.
They don't always have that ability to discern what needs to kept and
what should be thrown out.
-- 
	/~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\
	|	Kevin Minor	UUCP: ...uunet!mcdchg!motcid!minor	|
	|			Mail: minor@rtsg.mot.com		|
	\~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~/
From: ph111-bx@violet.berkeley.edu (;;;;7202)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Johns vs. Carpenter
Date: 3 Sep 1992 04:56:07 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: violet.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Sep3.002953.20449@morrow.stanford.edu>
HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels) writes:
>On top of all those cultural strictures are ceremonies and rituals,
>including cleansing, blessing and praying.  Hormones would
>definitely be calmed down by the time all that transpired and then
>the real stuff would begin.

But that's just it.  The ceremonies and rituals are all *part of*
the culture.  It is within the context of all that that the "real stuff"
takes place, and not simply whenever someone has the urge.  The culture
is dictating when sexual conduct is appropriate.

>Ever hear of the rape of the Sabine women?  And the biblical story
>about how one tribe of Israel was decimated except for its women and
>one another tribe took them by force?  Hormones, issues, my eye.

You're confusing inter-tribal wartime behavior with intra-tribal culture.
Two tribes at war may invade each other's territory and rape each other's
women, but that doesn't mean, as a matter of practice, they ravage and
rape their own women with the same wild, destructive abandon they war on
their enemies.  That is, unless they wanted to commit cultural suicide.  So
that in the interests of maintaining itself, a culture has rules governing
when sexual behavior is appropriate, and these may require the cleansing,
blessing and praying you mentioned. Even a culture that brutally subjugates
its own women will have rules that say what is allowed and what is not.
And if an individual, driven by hormonal desire, runs counter to these
rules, the culture will have to discipline him, so that order, and itself,
is maintained.
From: brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder)
Subject: Re: Lee: Skip work to attend Malcolm X
Organization: Quake Public Access
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 03:28:28 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.144350.24659@rock.concert.net> bing@jazz.concert.net (Carter E. Bing) writes:

>		Lee: Skip Work to Attend Malcolm X

>		LA - Spike Lee has called on Africans and 
>		African Americans to forgo work and school
>		to attend the opening Nov 20 of his epic film
>		Malcolm X.

Gee, I wonder whether he thinks that whatever truths Lee thinks are embodied
in his movie would be good for non-blacks too.  I also find it interesting
that Lee considers his movie to appeal to people on the basis of their 
skin color rather than their political ideology.  Perhaps he doesn't believe
black republicans exist.

>		"We're telling them they've got to turn out to 
>		support this film and support Malcolm," the AA
>		director said in an interview in Wednesday`s 
>		Los Angeles Times.

What about those who think that Malcolm was wrong?  Or even evil?  Surely,
skin color shouldn't cause someone to have more solidarity with MX than
ideology does, should it Spike?

>		Lee has refused to shorten the film, which runs
>		about three hours, and said he won`t change an
>		opening title sequence featuring a burning American
>		flag in the shape of an X.

At least it helps deliver a clear message about what MX was up to.

>		He also said he won`t be editing out footage of the beating 
>		of a African American man, Rodney King, by white police
>		officers in Los Angeles in March 1991.

It seems interesting that the fotage is included in the biography of
someone who has been dead for a long time, but I suppose there's some
relevance.

--Brian
From: bstring@mainz-emh2.army.mil (BOB STRINGFIELD)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Notes From the Motherland....
Date: 2 Sep 1992 02:41:36 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu


----- Forwarded message # 1:
Date: 01 Sep 1992 12:24:01 +0200
From: SBNSAN01@Uctvax.UCT.AC.ZA
Subject: Joining network
To: Afriqnews@Athena.MIT.EDU
Message-Id: <01GO9QG3SV0I8WXXS8@Uctvax.UCT.AC.ZA>
X-Envelope-To: Afriqnews@Athena.MIT.EDU
X-Vms-To: IN%"Afriqnews@Athena.MIT.EDU"

My name is Sanele Sibanda .I am persently studying at University of Cape
Town in South Africa .I am doing a BA degree mojoring in politcal studies
.I am very interested in being on your network as the Afrcan iissue is of
great concern to myself.

Thank you  and I await to hear from you  soon .My address is as follows
sbnsan01@uctvax.uct.ac.za

--Boundary (ID QrgJRv1fin0FMbEXSbd7MQ)--

----- Forwarded message # 2:

From: SBNSAN01@Uctvax.UCT.AC.ZA
Subject: Re: Hello
To: bstring@mainz-emh2.army.mil

Hello Bob .Great to see that I have managed to reach the outside world. 
Where did you get my address ?Is this to say Afrique news is that quick?
What are you doing in the army? When some of us are wasting away in 'varsity
in the racist replic of South Africa. 
Oh by the way I am Zimbabwean and  only study here.Well till I hear from you
CIAO

----- End of forwarded messages
Organization: Central Michigan University
Date: Wednesday, 26 Aug 1992 11:47:51 EDT
From: <3ZASIB3@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: *Need Help with Blak History Month!!* (am I alone??)
Distribution: world
 <1992Aug25.114032.3110@memstvx1.memst.edu>

One person that readily comes to mind is Patricia Collins the author of
Black Feminist Thought.  She is somewhat familiar with the MSU scene.
She is at the University of Cincinnati.  If you want someone to deal with
black presidential politics, try Ron Walters at Howard U. Political Science
Dept.  Check out Aldon Morris at Northwestern, if you want someone on "the
movement".  My last suggestion: Abdul Alkalimat or Ron Bailey at Northeastern
University Black Studies (Boston).  Good luck.  These are all academic types.
If you've got big bucks go for Nikki Giovanni.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.asian.american,talk.politics.misc
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: News re Lee's 'Malcolm X'
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 01:32:06 GMT

In article <stovall.714864949@ficus.cs.ucla.edu>,
stovall@ficus.cs.ucla.edu (Steven Stovall) writes to moi,
>HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels) thusly regarding:
>
>>More on Spike Lee's "Malcolm X..."
>>.
[It would be repetitive, so I cut it...]

>In the LA Times today, Spike didn't seem to think WB would dare tamper
>with the intro after the earlier screw-up when he went overbudget
>(35 Mil? I think "League of Our Own" cost 40 :-)
>
>He also said he wants every African-American to skip work and school
>on Nov 20 and attend the premiere of the picture. Lack of game aint
>one of his problems :-)
.
.
No lie.  And I know some folks would do it just on GP, since it's
in November and near the turkey holiday anyway...
.
I just hope the folks running theaters are not going to oversell
their tickets just to make the 11:00 p.m. news like when "Boyz in
the Hood" and "New Jack City" opened. That shit is TIRED.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher Morton)
Subject: Re: 8-Trey Gangsta Madness
Reply-To: cmort@ncoast.org (Christopher Morton)
Organization: North Coast Public Access *NIX, Cleveland, OH
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 15:16:04 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.african.american

As quoted from <1992Aug31.141215.12210@seq.uncwil.edu> by frankli@seq.uncwil.edu (william carter franklin):

> 
> 
> 
> >I heard a group of Blacks interviewed on NPR regarding the Denny beating a few
> >months ago.  Let me tell you, with one notable exception, you could have sworn
> >it was a bunch of White bigots justifying the King beating.  It was truly 
> >pathetic.  If you reversed the racial terms, the conversation could have easily
> >taken place in an ethnic bar in Howard Beach, NY; Parma, OH or Cicero, IL.
> 
> >Sorry, there are enough WHITE Klansman.  I don't think we're benefitting 
> >ourselves in any way by acting like Black ones....
> 
> 
> 
> Newsflash:
> 
> Sunday StarNews Sunday, August 30, 1992
> 
> Police Blotter
> 
> 
> 	A racially motivated violent incident was reported to have

Of course to be really relevant to the issue at hand, some otherwise law-
abiding citizens would have to "explain" how this was a good thing....



-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------  

"Well whose opinions did you THINK these were...?" 
------------------------------------------------------------------  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american