From: echang@engin.umich.edu (Hsiou-Ping Chang)
Subject: Re: DATA: largest world economies
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 23:50:59 EST
Organization: The University of Michigan
Reply-To: echang@engin.umich.edu
Originator: changhp@fijan.engin.umich.edu


In article <1992Dec15.010436.3148@athena.mit.edu>, joe@athena.mit.edu (Joseph C Wang) writes:
> >My point is 
> >  Change name -> Gradually change Taiwan international status  ->
                    ~~~~~~~~~
> >	-> Change the cost/benefit 
> >	-> Change how other government treat us.
> How?
> 
> I think you are trying to have us believe that if "ROC" becames "ROT,"
> then foreign ministers across the world will suddenly say, "Let's
                                               ~~~~~~~~~
	The step is to show the whole world that we represent
Taiwan not China.  PRC represents China.  Taiwan is not part of
ROC or PRC.  Taiwan represents the people in Taiwan and practically
has nothing to do with representing China.  Even we don't get
any advantage for now, we have nothing to lose. 

 If we become more
and more active in the international society, more and more countries
will rethink their cost/benefit.  We have better chance than stick
to ROC, which implies Taiwan want to compete representation with PRC.
Taiwan should not compete the representation of China with PRC, so
the use of ROC is completely wrong.
> 
> Also, it's curious that you haven't responded to my evidence that
> indicates that the United States and Japan are willing to recognize
> both PRC and ROC.
> 
	Your evidence shows nothing to me.  If your evidence is true,
why there are no ROC embassies in US and Japan? 
Many countries agree with PRC that there is only one China, 
but not all of them agree that Taiwan is part of China. There are
a lot of chance out there.

> >
> >	I am proud of being a Taiwanese, so I would look at things
> >	from the point of views of a Taiwanese.
> 
> In order to get anything done in politics, you have to look at things
> from other people's viewpoints. 

	We have to be aware of what other people think, but the priority
should be clear:  think of what Taiwan needs before doing further.

> 
> >	In this case, Zaire might not want to admit Taiwan, but
> >	not every country in the world has this problem.
> 
> Let's be more specific.  Name the governments you think will recognize
> ROT but not ROC, and we can examine them one by one. 
> 
	Those who do not have the statement "Taiwan is a part of China,"
in the offical documents are potential candidates. 
It seems to me you have access to a lot of information out there; you
should not have any trouble finding the list.
   
Now it's my turn:
	Let's be more specific.  Name the governments you think will recognize
ROC but not ROT, and we can examine them one by one.   Don't tell me US and
Japan.

> 
> PRC can mess up Taiwan's economy really bad simply by closing
> Taiwanese factories on the Mainland.  
> 
	According to your cost/benefit analysis:
	Cost: PRC won't get any investment from Taiwan any more.
	      PRC scare other investors away.  
	      Consequently, PRC will slow down the growth rate.
	Benefit: NONE, Taiwan is still Taiwan.

> >People like ROC are mainly KMT.  People who don't care show
> >they want the government to act in Taiwan's interests, which is the same
> >thing as I am proposing. 
> 
> U.S. and Japan publicly
> stated that they are willing to recognize ROC if PRC has no objection.
> And if PRC does object, no amount of name changing will help Taiwan.
> 
	There is no evidence show that US and Japan will not support
the idea that Taiwan wants to represent Taiwan not China.  

> At the same time, while the benefits are marginal, the risks are
> great.  ROT may trigger a Communist invasion, and even if it doesn't,
> it will result in the Mainland taking away "special treatment" for
> Taiwan businessmen and punitive economic actions.
>
	You are trying to threaten me again.
Ok.	Tell me more about your Nuclear Weapons, Guilded Missles,
and try to convince me the Communist Imperialism can intimidate everyone
in the world to follow its wishes.

	Tell me more about special treatment you mentioned.  
I'd like to know if Taiwan businessmen cannot live without 
this special treatment.  Tell me more about punitive economic actions
and the consequences of it.  I'd like to know if Taiwan will suffer more
than China.  You are saying China is doing Taiwan a favor without any return.
That is not a very realistic point of view.	
	 
> >Is the use of ROC acting in Taiwan's interests?  NO!!! No way!  It cannot
> >prevent China from invading Taiwan, but only leave an excuse that Taiwan
> >is part of China and PRC can do whatever it want to part of its territory.
> 
> ROT won't prevent PRC from invading either.

	Since neither ROT nor ROC will prevent PRC's invasion, 
we are better off choosing the one to represent ourselves best---Taiwan -- and
we have chance to become one of the greatest country in the world instead of
being part of a country that we don't represent.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan