From: viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson)
Subject: Re: talk.politics.animals
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 04:35:39 GMT

In <Bw0xyx.4ny@wpg.com> russ@wpg.com (Russell Lawrence) writes:

	Two quick points here, Russ, for the edification of all.

>No, the issue here is whether your claims were well-founded.  How 
>much animal material does the average gorilla or orang consume 
>each day?  

>You said that vegans could eat their weight in food daily, but 
>still not get the necessary amount of B12 in their diet.  How do 
>gorillas and orangs get the necessary amount of B12 in their 
>diets?   By eating mock hamburgers on a Hollywood movie set
>perhaps???

	There has been filmed evidence of apes hunting, killing,
and eating monkees.  Always much smaller monkees, of course, but
every member of the tribe gets a piece of meat.  While I'm hardly
one to know just how B12 is used by the body, this suggests that
apes are still omnivores and must either 1) kill something every
now and again for some edification, or 2) they still eat some
meat to suppliment their herbivorous diet.  In addition, I suspect
insects are much better food sources than most plants, and as we
all know apes of all kinds tend to eat a lot of insects.

	If anybody has supporting or refuting information, I'd like
to see it.  I remember this coming up about six months ago, and I
cannot remember what the explanation was for this behavior.

>Please explain why it's ethically acceptable for dairy and cattle 
>groups to investigate transgenic cattle while still claiming that 
>their products are perfectly safe.   Why is it unethical, in your
>opinion, for PCRM to warn consumers about a danger that dairy industry 
>representatives apparently consider serious?

>According to the _Scientific American_ article that I mentioned, the
>dairy and cattle groups were exploring the possibility of transgenic
>cattle because they were concerned about the link between cow's milk
>and diabetes.   Do you believe their concerns are less farfetched than
>the concerns of PCRM?

	Dairy farming is an industry, Russ, and as in most industries
you must constantly strive to improve your product.  Just as the beef
producer strived for breeding programs that stressed lean meat with
better marbling and a carcass that was weighted to the more profitable
cuts, so does the corn grower strive for a crop better suited to his
customers.  This means hybrids that are suited for different climates,
soils, pest and disease resistance, and also for different seed
characteristics.  High-lysene corn is one such item, soybeans with
abnormally-high oil content are another.  To fault the dairy industry
for trying to improve the marketability of their product strikes
me as faulting a gun manufacturer for putting a safety on a single-
action pistol.  It might not help anything, but it can't hurt.

<Dan Sorenson, DoD #1066 |"I see angels on Ariels in leather and>
<z1dan@exnet.iastate.edu | chrome, Swooping down from heaven to >
<viking@iastate.edu      | carry me home."   ---    R. Thompson >
<ISU thinks I need more education, which they provide for a fee.>
Newsgroups: talk.politics.animals