HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ST701852@brownvm.brown.edu (Carole E. Mah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Inter-racial dating
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 15:53:07 EST
Organization: Brown University - Providence, Rhode Island  USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: brownvm.brown.edu
News-Software: BNN via BNN_POST v1.0 beta

On Tue, 15 Dec 1992 13:48:35 EST ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu) said:
>Hmm, is race that well-correlated with socio-economic class?
>And is there a marked difference in the classes of Asian-American men
>and Asian-American women, explaining the markedly non-random ratio
>of AAF/WM couples to AAM/WF couples?  How about in the gay community?
>(Very early on, I heard about the some-white-guys-with-Asian-fetish
>from gay friends.  cf. "Rice Queens")
   Well, this is a complicated question.! no, I do not think
that race and class are so well-correlated, nor do I think
there is a marked diff. between men and women (AA). I was
not trying to generalize about the population as a whole.
However, your question is an interesting one.
(In general, I fail to see why people get so worried about this
marked difference in number of AAF/WM couples to AAM/WF or AAF/AAM
couples.  I really like Aileen's post ... she, and all of us,
should be able to love, marry, etc., whomever we wish, without being
judged for that.)
   Yeah, there are a lot of "Rice Queens" just as there are a lot of
white men who are way into black men because they believe this myth
about black=bigger. or whatever (?!).
  But there are also white guys who date asian (& etc) guys because they
are tired of a lot of the posturing and backbiting among
the gay white community.  Again, I am only talking about
what I have seen first-hand, this is not a generalization about
the community nationwide.  On this campus there
seem to be a lot of interracial couples but there are also
AAM/AAM and AAF/AAF couples (four or five that I can think of offhand),
as well as three or four African-Am. M/Afr-Am M and corresponding
female couples, and one well-known AAF (bisexual) who is dating
an African-American man.
  We did have this community forum one year where the white folks
were supposedly going to be honest about fetishizing people of color,
but all they did was sit around and say "yeah, I know I am supposed
to be all liberal and understanding about racial stuff cuz i am gay,
but I am not, I am really racist" but no one at this forum
seemed to be able to get past the guilt in order to do some
constructive thinking about how to alleviate racism in the
gay white community. It was kinda weird.
  Overall, yes, at least here, there is also  a markedly disproportionate
number of AAM/WM couples.  Probably the same (unexplainable ?)
phenomenon as the huge number of AAF/WM couples.
Carole
--- Thelma and Louise in '92! ---
carole elaine mah
st701852@brownvm.bitnet
st701852@brownvm.brown.edu
Carole_Mah@brown.edu
---------------------------------
From: ST701852@brownvm.brown.edu (carole e mah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: racism on campus and off: the police.
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 18:52:15 EST
Organization: Brown University - Providence, Rhode Island  USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: brownvm.brown.edu
News-Software: BNN via BNN_POST v1.0 beta

REcently on our campus there was a huge debate about whether
or not to arm the campus police with guns.  People argued
against it on the grounds that the police already harrass
people of color, gays and lesbians, and anyone else who
doesn't fit their image of a "good guy" enough as it is,
without guns.  With guns, violence would only escalate,
and some poor cambodian immigrant or some black teenager
with an umbrella or something that LOOKED like a gun
would get a bullet in the back just because he looked
"suspicious" to the campus cop.
  I agreed with this reasoning. Black friends of mine get
stopped all the time by the police and asked for their ID's
because if you are black, in many cops' eyes, you have
to be a criminal and you CERTAINLY can't be an IVY LEAGUE
STUDENT -- you must be some drug dealer or young
ruffian from the high school up the street.
  Similarly, while they claim arming the police will make
it easier for the cops to "protect" the students, what
are they protecting us from, and who is "us" ?
  For example, two years ago an Asian-American student
here was beat up and the response was meagre.  Gay people
get stones thrown at them all the time and the response
is mostly lip service. Black students get told that
they are "Aunt Jemimas" and "Uncle Toms" at parties,
and that they are "disturbing the peace" when in fact
THEY are the ones being harrassed by the police.
Women who have been raped call the police and get told
they were "Asking for it" or they are laughed at.
  And what about the judicial system? How much time
did Vincent Chin's murderers get? And what about Rodney King's?
And how about Dan White, who murdered Harvey Milk,
the openly gay member of San Francisco's Board of Supervisors?
  People think campus issues and the "outside world"
are separate and separable, that somehow, campus police
and the campus disciplinary system are inherently
more just than the system at large.  I have been
watching this stuff go on for years and most of the evidence
seems to the contrary.
  I Ask: What are racial relations like between Asian-Americans
and the police on your campus (if you are a student, as most
people seem to be)?  If a white student were to
beat up an Asian-American student because he hated asians,
and the crime was provably racially motivated, what kind of a
punishment could he expect to receive?
  Carole
--- Thelma and Louise in '92! ---
carole elaine mah
st701852@brownvm.bitnet
st701852@brownvm.brown.edu
Carole_Mah@brown.edu
---------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: mday@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu (Mark Day)
Subject: Re: sincerity and preference (was Re: Asian males aren't attractive?  (was R
Organization: MIT Laboratory for Computer Science
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 04:28:24 GMT

   (defensio libertatis) writes:

   I would not fault them if they said quite honestly and openly that
   race was an issue in their dating choice; they like the look of
   European men and feel attracted to them. I like European men too for
   their features.

   Instead I hear vague opinions like: "I like my white boyfriend because
   he is real nice and I'd date anyone even if he were purple or even
   checkered!"

   That kind of pretension to being completely color-blind when dating
   someone strikes me as difficult to believe. Call me a pessimist but I
   think race is much more of an issue in the dating ritual than some
   people are willing to admit, especially in light of such glaring
   evidence that AF/CM relationships are more numerous than AM/CF
   relationships by a ratio of four-to-one (or whatever they came up
   with)

From what I've seen, it's worth distinguishing initial attraction from 
long-term relationships.  

There really are some people whose initial attractions show no racial
bias: they are just as willing to date a white as a black as a brown
as a yellow as a purple person.  These people, however, are
exceedingly rare. 

Much more common is a person whose initial attractions are based on
features that are present across races: for example, someone who likes
brown eyes and dark hair may date both whites and blacks but will
simply find blonds unattractive.  

And there are many people who really only find one racial group
attractive, whether it's their own or another.  As you observe, these
people are not usually honest about their preference; it would be
difficult for anyone to express such an opinion without sounding at
least a little racist, at least at this point in time.

However, all of these are issues of initial attraction: whether to ask
for a date, whether to accept a date, what first impressions are
formed, and the like.  Among people who have enough mutual interest to
actually pursue a long-term relationship, it seems to be common for
the partners to come to see the "racial differences" as insignificant.
So even if they initially came together partly because of racial
preferences, they may be completely honest in saying that race had
nothing to do with getting married or staying together.

--Mark Day

mday@lcs.mit.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: rpark@stam.QE.Bell.CA (Richard Park)
Subject: Re: Blond Men and Asian Females ( was Re: Asian males aren't)
Reply-To: rpark@stam.bell.ca
Organization: CER, Bell Canada
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 19:02:31 GMT

In article <15030005@iftccu.boeing.com>, ladd@iftccu.boeing.com (Bob Ladd) writes:
|> 
|> 
|> 
|>    I have noticed this Blonde CM - AF phenomonon also, both from
|>    observations and through various acquaintances.  I have no
|>    statistical data on this subject.  I do however, have data
|>    on other aspects of WM/AF relationships.
|> 
|> 							   Bob Ladd

I don't see this up here in Ontario. I don't recall seeing a blond male with
a asian female. All the WM-AF couples I know are dark haired men. Maybe it
is the weather.



-- 
Richard Park	
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: jtteh@borland.com (J.T. Teh)
Subject: Re: Asian males aren't attractive? (was Re: OFWM....)
Originator: jtteh@genghis.borland.com
Organization: Borland International, Inc.
Distribution: soc
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 23:40:18 GMT

berthiau@iro.umontreal.ca (Eva Chan)  Reply-To: bunny@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Eva Chan) writes:

>As for my parents, they don't mind us girls dating Caucasian 
>men as long as we don't date African-American men (don't ask me
>why) and that my brother find himself a nice Chinese girl.  Of
          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Why is that so? Why can't your parents be as open minded towards
daughter-in-laws as they are to son-in-laws? Is it because
the son will have to carry the family name and musn't "taint"
the family line? My dad didn't mind my brother marrying a
caucasian but my mom did. However, she has now accepted it.

>-- 
>= Eva Chan 		| Never lose my youth, I hope it never ends. =
>= bunny@gnu.ai.mit.edu	| Hope I never lose my wallet!               =
>= on IRC: bunny 	|	- Bosstones			     =
>=			| 					     =
>--
>	Andre Berthiaume 	 |  "Sometimes you're the windshield,
>				 |   Sometimes you're the bug"
>    berthiau@iro.umontreal.ca    |			
>				 |	       Dire Straits, The Bug

- JT
----------------------------------------------------------------------
J.T. Teh      Borland International Inc.     jtteh@genghis.borland.COM
                                                       MCI Mail: JTTEH

                " WILL  CODE  FOR  CAR  PAYMENTS ! "
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,ca.politics,soc.motss
Subject: Re: More AIDS absurdity - 1Billion AIDS cases
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 11:18:19 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

HA! GOTCHA!

Daniel Tarantolla, who is with Harvard's Global AIDS Policy Coaltion gave
me a call to tell me I was wrong to tone down the seriousness of AIDS in
Asia. But he also told me an excellent example of numbers that ARE wrong
was the guy who threw out the number of 1 Billion infections. "He must
have misplaced a zero somewhere, that's obviously completely absurd".

So is there anyone out there who knows enough about AIDS epdemiology to
still believe that anyone who is gullible enough to believe 1 billion
knows anything about AIDS?

The only way that my wife, myself, or my son can contract AIDS are by
means with extremely low probabilities since we don't engage in anal sex
with multiple partners, any other kind of sex with multiple partners,
swap needles. That's why we're effectively immune from AIDS (unless some
kook decides to jab me with a syringe with infected blood in revenge for
such an outrageous statement), and anyone else that refrains from high
risk activities. What's wrong with abstaining from high risk activities?
Is sex THAT important?

The SF Young Mens' survey showed that even men who ALWAYS used condoms had
HIV+ at just as high a rate as those with 20+ partners. Safe sex is NOT
safe, there is no documented evidence that use of condoms is related to
to a recorded zero HIV infection rate.
(If there is evidence, I want to see it)

Safe sex 100 times is still a million times more unsafe than monogamy or
abstention.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: ...or purple
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 15:25:31 GMT

In article <BzA9wu.AM6@cs.uiuc.edu> watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu (Larry Watanabe) writes:
>ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu) writes:
>
>>The simple fact, though, is that AAF/WM relationships outnumber
>>AAM/WF relationships by a huge margin.  (From marriage records,
>>4:1 in San Francisco, 8:1 in Sacramento)  It doesn't take a statistical
>>genius to surmise that something very strange is going on.
>
>What I'm curious about is, are there 4 or 8 times as married
>AAF as AAM? If not, who are all the AAM marrying? (unless it's
>each other :)
>
>-Larry Watanabe watanabe@cs.uiuc.edu

  How about nobody... :-(  I think that's why the concern and angst!
  All male Asian-Americans in my family are unmarried.  All female
  Asian-Americans in my family are married or have been married
  (mostly to white guys).  Most elders in my family are "concerned"
  about the sons, to say the least...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: caryho@cis.rand.org (Cary Ho)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Kristi Yamaguchi
Date: 20 Dec 92 00:42:51 GMT
Distribution: usa


  Hi people, I've been a reader of this group for sometime but never
  posted before.  I remember awhile back there was some talk about
  Kristi Yamaguchi not being asian enough so I just have to share this
  with you when I saw this ad in the L.A. Times today 12/19/92.  This
  ad depicts a picture of K.Y. in a pair of color contacts that is not so,
  shall I say, asian-ge.  The caption says, and I quote:

   "When I want a little change I go green, violet or gray.  DuraSoft Colors
    can change your eye color in a wink of an eye even if you don't need
    visual correction.  With 18 shades ranging from subtle to dramatic,
    you'll find DuraSoft Colors that are right for you."

  I don't know whether to laugh or feel sad or happy that K.Y. is making
  money from this ad.   Just something for you all to ponder.

  No flame please.  Just reporting.


***************************************************************************
 Cary Ho                       *   Still trying to catch up on my
 caryho@cis.rand.org           *   reading so I can quote somebody!
***************************************************************************
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Clarifying Marraige Statistics (Re: ...or purple)
Supersedes: <92350.185254U58402@uicvm.uic.edu>
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Tuesday, 15 Dec 1992 19:01:16 CST
From: <U58402@uicvm.uic.edu>


In article <1992Dec15.221945.22626@leland.Stanford.EDU>,
underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) says:
>
>I say that we should use Oriental to refer to Oriental to avoid confusion.
>Furthermore, the statistics that he sights refers PREDOMINANTLY TO CHINESE-GE
>WOMEN AND CHINESE-GE MEN, not other Orientals.

I don't suppose it would be too much trouble for Mr. Joe to cite his
source for this contention. Mr. Joe has had a history of fabricating
stats and facts to support his arguments. Until he does, I wouldn't
believe a thing he says.

Kind of a waste of 15 minutes, then, isn't it?

By the way, the correct usage is "cites".

Wilbur Pan                                  u58402@uicvm.uic.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------
This article does not represent the opinions of the Deans of the
College of Medicine of the University of Illinois at Chicago.
They're not that clever.
From: judyy@ocf.berkeley.edu (Judy Y. Tseng)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Asian VS. Asian (was, Re: more stuff)
Date: 13 Dec 1992 22:42:45 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: maelstrom.berkeley.edu

In article <1gb5irINNkka@agate.berkeley.edu> wltsai@ocf.berkeley.edu (Wei-Lun Tsai) writes:

Hey, Wei-Lun. Rumors sure do spread fast.

>On a side note, I have heard stories that recently during the student govern-
>ment senate elections (ASUC senate election) here at Cal, a white student
>candidate

The candidate was an Asian (Chinese) American woman.

>(from a party supposedly w/ predominantly white liberal-arts
>students)

The party (which I ran with, BTW) is almost all non-whites. We had
Chicanos, African Americans, Asian Americans, and a Native American
running last month. Most of us are liberal arts majors.

> insulted another candidate (whose party, appropriately named
>the Gold (=yellow) Party, made up with all Asian and AA students) and

The Gold party was formed last spring by 4 brothers with the last name
Au. I don't think they chose the name "Gold" because of any racial
correlation.

>made fun of him because his party was all-Asian.  So argument broke out

The woman also asked why the Gold party (conservative compared to
her party) did not run on any Asian American issues.

>between the two of them but the "confrontation" was broke off before
>it got physical.  Like I said, if a guy comes up to me and insults me like

Some shoving got started and the Asian woman's boyfriend came close to
punching the guy from the Gold party.

>that the first thing I will do is break off his nose before he can say
>"Sweet and Sour Pork" and teach him a lesson
>about the stereotype that Asian guys are quite, passive, and weak.  "Hey,

The Asian American woman and her boyfriend sure broke that stereotype.
I think it was more of an ABC vs FOB conflict. But then again, the
Gold party guy is an ABC; he just seems a lot more Chinese. And the
Asian American woman is an immigrant; she seems more "Americanized"
than the ABC. Hmmm...

Just wanted to clear things up.
Judy
Xref: sparky soc.culture.asian.american:11049 alt.politics.clinton:18943
From: timlee@netcom.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,alt.politics.clinton
Subject: Mortgage Acceptance Re: Political Power--Why the quotas?
Date: 20 Dec 92 05:34:08 GMT
Reply-To: timlee@netcom.com (Timothy J. Lee)
Followup-To: soc.culture.asian.american,alt.politics.clinton
Distribution: usa

dnm9@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (David Neal Messina) writes:
|gwangung@carson.u.washington.edu (Roger Tang) writes:
|>	I think that this behavior comes from SUBSTANTIALLY more than a
|>tiny fraction of the population (see, for example, the data on mortgage
|>lending, matched employment pairs, etc. The studies have flaws, but they
|>suggest that there are things going on out there that many people
|>are not comfortable with).
|
|                                                              Would
|you have it that, since AAs represent 3% of population, 3% of mortages
|must be reserved for AAs?

Data published in the Wall Street Journal indicates that Asian American
people have a slightly higher rate of mortgage acceptance than European
(or Latin or African) American people.  However, Asian American applicants
tend to have significantly higher income and wealth than applicants from
the other groups and apply for mortgages on more expensive houses (probably
due to Asian American people living in areas where houses are expensive),
which makes it difficult to draw conclusions here.

Mortgage applications have the usual race of the applicant question;
if the applicant does not say, the loan representative is supposed to
say so.  The latter method might actually make more sense in terms of
trying to track racial discrimination; after all, determining whether
racial discrimination exists at a particular lender depends on what race
the lender thinks the applicant is, not what the applicant says s/he is.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee                                        timlee@netcom.com
No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee                                        timlee@netcom.com
No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Asian-male stereotyping, how?
Keywords: asian american, media
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Distribution: soc.culture.asian.american
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 15:38:45 GMT

In article <1724@rwja.umdnj.edu> jpark@rwja.umdnj.edu (John Park) writes:
>Raven - this was a television series on NBC some time this year!  Opening show:
>A caucasian ninja, whose parents are brutally killed by asian ninjas.  His
>japanese wife presumed dead, and his son missing.  He saves a portly japanese 
>businessman's life, and then his gorgeous daughter.  The japanese ninjas, all
>virile young men (and therefore a threat and villains to boot), are out kill
>him and his son.  Boy how much more evil can these villains get!  In order to
>save his daughter or make peace with the japanese ninjas, the business man wimp
>figuratively stabs Raven in the back, by betraying him, even though Raven
>saved his life.  His daughter condemns him, etc...  Gee not even one 
>asian male was portrayed as non-scum evil back stabbers in the dark, in this
>flick, and it was in prime time on NBC television for Pete's sake!  NBC got 
>away with sheer hate inspiring racism on national television, and I didn't
>even hear a whimper of complaint!  I was scared to hell.  Millions of people
>could be watching this.  My neighbors could be watching this.  The college kids
>down the hall could be soaking this up. 

  There was also an episode of "PointBreak?" or something with Michael
  Knight as a lifeguard where this evil Asian guy is trying to kidnap
  Michael Knight's son, and steal his blonde girlfriend.  The evil
  Asian guy kidnaps them both and leers evily at the girlfriend who
  shudders in disgust.  Evil Asian guy knows martial arts, of course
  and is out to kill Michael Knight, but he punches the lights out
  of Asian guy and sends him into the water, where he can't swim
  and grovels for help.  Of course, since Michael Knight is a lifeguard,
  he rescues whimpering Asian man and hands him to the police.  Gag!!!!
  My husband was watching it and I pointed out how negative this was.
  He just shrugged his shoulders like so what?

  Another episode depicts Mexican-American gang-bangers being rehabilitated
  by Michael Knight who punches out the father of one of the kids.  The
  father is totally stereotypical with motorcycle, tatoo and knife.
  Argh!
>
>
>Demeaning caricatures of any group should no longer be acceptable.
>
>
  Agreed!
  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american