From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Football Failures at Bowie Force end of Season
Date: 5 Nov 92 03:08:24 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc

In <1992Nov04.000705.24201@watson.ibm.com> johniac@johniac.austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti/100000) writes:

>In article <1992Oct30.143402.13737@mksol.dseg.ti.com> mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
>>You have a lot of nerve insisting how we need to fix the educational
>>system and then demanding that we leave the things that are broken
>>about it alone.

>You have a lot of nerve axiomatically stating what's broke, and demanding that
>I adhere to your assumptions.

You have a lot of nerve axiomatically claiming that something isn't a
problem and then demanding that others adhere to YOUR assumptions.

>>If you can show me how EXTRA-CURRICULAR FOOTBALL is
>>going to result in a better citizen, even though the person in
>>question is flunking all those classes that are expected to make them
>>basically functional in society, then perhaps I will change my mind.

>Show me that the purpose of public education is to create "good citizens" and
>perhaps *I'll* change my mind.

Examine practically ANY serious discussion of the establishment and
rationales for public education and why it is a 'good thing' for all
of us to pay for it, instead of making each parent buy their own.

>>Until then, you have no convincing argument at all for why a school
>>should allow a student to participate in EXTRA-CURRICULAR ACTIVITIES
>>ASSOCIATED WITH THE SCHOOL when they are not performing adequately in
>>the CURRICULAR ACTIVITIES.

>Because that's the only way in the current system to choose a career in
>professional sports.

Well, it's certainly the most likely way out of all of them, and even
using that the chances are vanishingly small of success (except if the
kid doesn't go to math class, he doesn't understand how small his
chances are).  But there ARE other ways.  Are you saying that the
purpose of the educational system in this country should be to act as
farm clubs for pro sports teams?

>>If you think all that education is 'superfluous', you must not have
>>any clue as to just what the odds are of someone being able to
>>actually get a job in professional sports OR a clue that they need to
>>be just a bit more than semi-educated animals.

>It doesn't matter.  Who decides?  The person whose life it is, or Fred J.
>McCall?  Many of those so called "semi-educated animals" are doing quite well
>regardless of your judgmental attitude.

Well no, they aren't.  If you're talking about the pro athletes (the
ones who are "doing quite well", they GOT their educations.  Who
decides?  SOCIETY decides, and society has held for as long as there
have been public schools that their function is to EDUCATE so as to
produce better and more productive citizens.  That is why things like
football are called EXTRA-CURRICULAR activities.  Because they're over
and above the primary function of the school.

>>Why should they not do well in school?  High school is EASY.  Given
>>the standards of today, it is DESIGNED that way.  Should I be able to
>>tell my boss that there are just some parts of my job I'm not good at,
>>so I don't have to do them and he should just excuse that fact?

>School isn't a job.  It's an opportunity, and should be freely accepted or
>rejected.

Fine, then let them reject it.  But they DON'T have the right to
reject it and then stick around to play football.  If they want to
play football, let them get on a church or neighborhood team.  School
teams are for people who are going to school, not those who are
rejecting it. 

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
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Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.