From: garvin+@cs.cmu.edu (Susan Garvin)
Subject: Re: WILL THE REAL MISOGYNISTS PLEASE STAND UP? Case 1.
Keywords: decay@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (dean.kaflowitz)
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 02:22:26 GMT

In article <nyikos.715538128@milo.math.scarolina.edu> nyikos@math.scarolina.edu (Peter Nyikos) writes:
#In <1992Sep2.071341.3020@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> smgarvin@nyx.cs.du.edu (susan garvin) writes:
#
##I agree with rocker.  This case has nothing to do with Nyikos'
##own misogyny.
#
##As an aside, this Charles Wysong that Nyikos keeps thanking
##is, if I'm not mistaken, head of a charming little group
##called the American Rights Coalition.  This group passes
##out little cards outside clinics that list "abortion
##complications" and ask that women call if they have any
##of the listed symptoms.  (One listed symptom is "headaches.")
#
#The full text of the card: (address, advertising, phone number omitted)
#
# 	The following may indicate abortion related damage.
#                      ^^^
#	1. heavy or continued bleeding
#	2. severe cramping
#	3. elevated temperature
#	4. intense headaches
#           ^^^^^^^
#	5. depression, suicidal tendencies
#	6. hallucinations, nightmares, etc.
#	7. in general, any unusual physical or emotional sensation
#
#	  Abortion may be legal, but malpractice, misrepresentation,
#	and fraud are not.
#	  If you need help, call us.
#          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Fine.  I was quoting from memory.  "Intense headaches,"
then.  

I will point out that this list is much shorter and less
specific than that provided by clinics to all abortion patients.  

##If a woman does call them, they don't offer medical advice,
##they offer referrals to their pet lawyers. 
#
#This surprises me, since the other side of the card says:
#   MEDICAL * LEGAL * EMOTIONAL HELP
#Or could it be that they don't offer medical advice or legal advice
#or emotional help, they give referrals to doctors, lawyers, and
#support groups?  You wouldn't be making selective deletions, now, 
#would you, Susie?  

No, Petie, I wouldn't.

I did a test run myself.  I called them.  As I said, I gave
my first name and they asked me if I had had an abortion.  I
said yes, and that I had a fever.  They asked if I was willing
to pursue a lawsuit.  At no point did they offer a medical
referral.  When I asked, the man I was speaking to told me
to return to the clinic which did the abortion.

#Oh, no, I shouldn't be misled by your deletion
#of the word "intense" [ask any migrane sufferer if you don't know
#the difference], nor by your claiming that they should call if they 
#have "any of the listed symptoms," nor by your leaving out the fact
#that these cards are part of a package of pro-life materials, but lots
#of women simply won't take bigger bundles of information (some of which
#lists help at local crisis pregnancy centers, post-abortion support
#groups, etc.) but will take a small card with a toll-free number on it.

Especially if the sidewalk harasser tucks it into her coat
pockey, huh?

My memory was in error.  (I find it interesting that you assume
that I don't know the difference between an intense headache
and a garden variety headache, but assume that other women who
have had abortions can tell the difference.)  


#
# The group also
##produces a flier called "The Abortion Injury Report," which
##supposedly reports on such complications, but often engages
##in the sort of speculation that Nyikos loves.  (One that
##caught my attention was a claim that Gilda Radner's ovarian
##cancer was caused by an abortion. 
#
#The text of the article, taken directly form the _Atlanta Constitution_
#review of Gilda Radner's autobiography:
#
#	"Even before Gilda Radner was diagnosed with cancer,
#    she had an abortion, became bulimic while on `Saturday
#    Night Live', tried desperately to get pregnant after 
#    marrying Gene Wilder, only to have two miscarriages, and 
#    suffered from recurring bowel problems, all written about
#    in explicit detail."
#	"Then in 1986, she was told she had ovarian cancer.
#    She had a hysterectomy, a grapefruit-sized tumor was 
#    removed, and months of grueling chemotherapy and radiation
#    therapy began."
#
#The only support for Susan's claim comes from the clumsily worded 
#title itself: _Actress's Cancer Points to Abortion Complications_.
#Not clear even which direction the cause-effect relationship, if any, is 
#supposed to run.  

The headline is misleading.  There is absolutely no evidence
that Ms. Radner's cancer was related to her abortion.  I asked
my onocologist, who reminded me that women who have never
been pregnant are more likely to have ovarian cancer than 
are women who have not.  He also stated that there is no
evidence of even a correlation between ovarian CA and
abortions.

(And, Nyikos, "cancer points to" is fairly clear as to which
direction the implied causal relationship goes, isn't it?)

#Another abortion-cancer connection: Minnesota abortionist Mildred Hanson
#was sued in 1990 by a Native American whom she strongly urged to have
#an abortion.  After this Native American refused, Mildred waited *ten
#months* to tell her that a pap smear that was taken during this same
#visit showed she had cervical cancer.

There is no connection between abortion and cancer in your
tale, Nyikos.  I can see why you admire Wysong.

(I strongly doubt that you have any evidence of this claim.
It's a fairly common tactic among anti-abortionists to 
cite lawsuits and not report the outcome of the case.)

By the way, your use of Dr. Hanson's first name is more evidence
of your misogyny.  

Susan
Newsgroups: talk.abortion