HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: whs70@dancer.cc.bellcore.com (sohl,william h)
Subject: Re: Cars, tape recorders, and the police...
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 92 17:37:02 GMT

In article <1992Dec11.091959.20501@u.washington.edu> tzs@carson.u.washington.edu (Tim Smith) writes:
>linley@netcom.com (Bruce James Robrert Linley) writes:
>>While swapping police harassment stories with some friends we came up with
>>an interesting idea: place a hidden tape recorder in the car with three
>>microphones (one in the front of the car, one in the back of the car, and
>>one inside the car). The tape recorder will be activated by a single switch
>>under the dash. Now, when the red & blue lights start flashing behind you,
>>you casually flip on the recorder and record everything that happens in and
>>around the vehicle. The question is, can anything you record be legally 
>>used against the cops (without telling them they're being recorded)?
>
>Why not have a second tape recorder visible on the front seat?  *Tell*
>the cop that you are recording, and point to that tape recorder.  My
>guess is that you are now safe from any laws against recording without
>telling the other party.

I don't recall ever seeing any restriction/law that would prohibit
recording as asked about by James Linley.  Most recording prohibitions
have to do with telephone conversations.  The police routinely "wire"
informants and undercover cops all the time.  Even if the recorded
conversation might not be admissable as evidence, just hand it over
to the newspapers and see how quickly the police chief and/or mayor
jumps on avoiding an embarresing sitution.

Standard Disclaimer- Any opinions, etc. are mine and NOT my employer's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Sohl (K2UNK) BELLCORE (Bell Communications Research, Inc.)
Morristown, NJ             email via UUCP      bcr!cc!whs70
201-829-2879 Weekdays      email via Internet  whs70@cc.bellcore.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: wwein@scott.skidmore.edu (warren wein)
Subject: Re: Four wheel drive Autos
Organization: Skidmore College, Saratoga Springs NY
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 06:24:02 GMT

Rafael Vidaillet (rvn@icd.teradyne.com) wrote:
: >From feinberg@icd.teradyne.com (Mike)
: >From my own experience: I did 11K miles last august in Subary Legacy and was 
: >very comfortable all the from Boston-DC-Atlanta-NewOrleans-Dallas-SantaFe-LA-
: >Rt1-Seatle-YellowStone-Boston. Mitsu Eclipse, on the other hand, is a bit more 
: >sporty (if you get a turbo 4wd model) but I can hardly make a trip from Boston
: >to Vermont (120 miles) without backcramps. I am 6'2'' and swim for the last 8 
: >year - the car just does not have enough leg and shoulder room for me. 

: 	Hey that is my car you are complaining about!
: 	
: 	Well I'm 5'11" and find the car very confortable (more than my '90
: Honda Prelude), and I kind of like the laid-back seating position.  
: This car is great on the snow (I'm sure the other 4wd's are too).  We
: just had over a foot of snow outside of Boston and we (mike and I) had
: a BLAST in the snow.  This thing is AMAZING!  And to think it is also 
: a sports car (I auto-cross and Time-trial during the summer... Hopefully
: I will do some ice-races too..) We'll see if any other 4wd car can
: keep up with this little beast..( Unless you spend more than 2x the $$$ 
: for a 3000GT VR4...)

: _RV
	Odd.  I've heard similar complaints about the Eclipse, but I'm
6'4" and I feel as if the car was tailor made for me.  I never get
cramps no matter how long the trip.

	wwein@skidmore.edu
: ---
:  ______________________________________________________________________
: /                                                                      \
: |                 He who dies with the most toys wins!                 |
: |______________________________________________________________________|
: | Rafael Vidaillet--MS: H71|   Internet:  rvn@dewey.icd.teradyne.com   |
: | Teradyne Inc.            |                              _            |
: | 321 Harrison Ave.        |   Voice:   (617) 422-2422   |_) \  /      |
: | Boston, Ma. 02118        |   Fax:     (617) 422-2837   | \  \/       |
: \______________________________________________________________________/



-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In no sense?  Nonsense." AON

"Female Cathons pick their mates by the size of their balls" -TN
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: chohan@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Harpal Chohan)
Subject: Re: Stretch Hyundai
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 04:13:43 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.185927.90589@watson.ibm.com> anand@watson.ibm.com () writes:
>I saw an amazing sight here in  NJ a while back:  A stretched Hyndai
>Excel. Looked quite cool. Jet black and tinted windows. I suppose a

Saw a stretch Yugo in the Columbus Dooh Dah parade this year. Looked
pretty cool too...

-h
From: Larry.Mc.Donald@ofa123.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: immobilising a diese
X-Sender: newtout 0.02 Nov 17 1992
Date: 17 Dec 92  12:17:02

 
 eddie@cstr.ed.ac.uk 
   (Eddie Rooney) asks:
   
> Is there an easy way of immobilizing a diesel engine, in 
> the same way as you might
> remove the rotor arm on a petrol engine, or disconnect the coil?  Any
> ideas appreciated.

   Sure. Just pour water in the tank. I love diesels. 

   (Long time convertible and motorcycle driver.)


   


... Larry.Mc.Donald, N6ZMB, Fullerton, California!  <cough, cough>
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10

--- Maximus 2.00
From: cew6@po.CWRU.Edu (Carlin E. Wiegner)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Can't find any Lotus Espirit SEs.....
Date: 14 Dec 1992 21:19:13 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


If you have seen any Lotus cars (other than in DuPont) please
email me where. My father and I would like to buy two and can't
find any newer then '85....Cleveland Plain Dealer is not the 
preferred advirtising spot for these cars! Thanks for the tips!
:-)
CW
From: awds_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Adam Edwards)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Cited again!(kinda)
Date: 14 Dec 92 22:47:42 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

-Had a nice 'run in' with a police officer yesterday afternoon.
I was driving on 390N just South of Rochester, 4 of us in my black
T-Bird.  Traffic was moving very briskly, close to 70 I'd say.
I was in the left lane, creeping by cars to my right, when I pulled
up behind a white Mercury Grand Marquis.  It was stock looking,
save the visible rear stabilizer(larger), and was totally unmarked.
No lights on the rear deck, no antennae, etc.  The teardrop spotlight
usually tips me off, but this had nothing.  So the driver pulls to the 
right to let me by.  Not liking lurking in people's blind spots, I accelerated
past the car, and pulled in a few cars ahead.  Upon passing, I looked over to
see a man in police uniform, wearing a portable.  Oooops...
He immediately followed(tailgating very closely) me, so I pulled over
to the right lane, to see if he needed to get by.  No such luck.
After he tailgated me for a bit, I decided to pull over to see what the
problem was, why his lights werent on, or why he wasn't even gesturing
me to pull over, just sitting inches away from bumper sticker.  Finally,
a little red light appeared on the dash, and wig-wags came on.  
After coming to a stop, I placed my hands on the steering wheel
Conversation as follows:

Officer:"let me see your drivers license."
(I obliged, pulling out my wallet)
Officer:"What's that California ID I just saw in your wallet Mr. Edwards?"
Me:"I lived there for four months the summer before last.  Would you like
to see it?"
Officer:"No.  Do you know what the speed limit is here?"
Me:"Yes, Sir, I'm sorry I was speeding....We have finals this week, and I 
was in a hurry to get my three friends back so we could study"
Officer:"Let me see your registration and insurance card."
(I obliged)
Officer:"Thank you Mr. Edwards, you're ok to go.  In the future, if you're goingto speed, DON'T do it in front of a cop!.  (pointing back to his car), That's
OBVIOUSLY a cop car, okay?"
Me:"Thank you Officer."

Everything went be rather quickly, and I didn't even catch what kind of officer
he was.  Uniform was navy, so it wasn't a State Trooper, I didn't think RPD 
cruised the 390.  Anyway, I guess I got lucky, 75 in a 55 would be a 4 point violation.  Maybe he was impressed that I didn't frantically rip my radar detector
from my visor...


-- 
		'Fast...
				...what to drive '
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech
From: (Eric Youngblood)
Subject: Re: Do SPOILERS Really Work??? no.
Reply-To: Peon w/o Email priv (Eric Youngblood)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Richardson, Tx
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 08:03:32 GMT

In article <bob1.724442495@cos>, bob1@cos.com (Bob Blackshaw) writes:
|> In <1gg7c6INN8h0@uwm.edu> malc9336@miller.cs.uwm.edu (Brian Malcolm) writes:
|> 
|> >(Eric Youngblood) writes:
|> >>Wings have to be designed with enough surface area to generate a negative lift
|> >>force. Imagine an airplane with narrow wings, it will never generate enough 
|> >>lift to get off the ground.
|> 
|> Boy. I'll bet this has come as a shock to the guys who flew the old
|> Liberators in WW II. The high aspect ratio wings allowed the Lib to
|> get to pretty high altitudes for that day. BTW, ever look at a glider?
|> 
|> 
|> >Which is one reason the wings of airplanes are swept.  This way, the air 
|> >passing over them views the wing as being much wider.
|> 
|> >-brian
|> 
|> Bob.
|> 
|> 

I see your point Bob, my comparison to aircraft wings doesnt really apply
directly to auto wings.  But, considering the wingspan of a glider makes
me wonder how a 5" wide spoiler can have *any* noticeable effect at typical
highway speeds.  Another thing to consider is that the air flow passing
over the rear of the car has already been disturbed and will be turbulent.
The more turbulence the less effective an airfoil will be. 

I guess all this depends on the design of the vehicle and the intent of
the wing.  The wing may help by smoothing the disturbed air, but downforce
is what is really needed.

$0.02 

Ericy 


      *---------------------------------+---------------------------*
      | Eric Youngblood                                             |
      | Bell-Northern Research    _                                 |
      | Richardson, Texas 75082 _| ~-                               |
      |                         \,  _}                              |
      |                           \(    +---------------------------|
      |                                 |   Peon w/o Email privs    |
      *---------------------------------+---------------------------*
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: bowmanj@csn.org (Jerry Bowman)
Subject: Re: WHAT GM to Buy?
Organization: University of Colorado Boulder, OCS
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:03:30 GMT

In article <1gt0jkINNbd6@uwm.edu> qazi@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Aamir Hafeez Qazi) writes:
>In article <1992Dec18.025053.1@vax.sonoma.edu> oberland@vax.sonoma.edu writes:
>>I need help.
>>
>>My father has a friend who is in her 70's(should be around for 10-15 more
>>years, though).  She wants a nice car.
>>Problems:
>>She will only consider GM cars.
>>V-6 is a plus
>>Luxury cars are OUT, as she wants to spend as little as possible.
>>Small cars are out as well, a are sporty cars(she's no rece-car driver,
>>BUT she still drives competantly.
>>
>>She needs a vehicle that will last 10 years, or about as long as she will.
    Small cars are out? Wants it to last? Ever look around at what the
    taxi companies use?>>
>>15-18K is an acceptable range.(not including tax and such)ie:price without
>>a ton of options/avg price
>>
>>Anti-lock brakes and Air-bag are a MAJOR plus to her.
>>
>>Must be able to get out of its own way, but no hot-rod.
>>
>>Any suggestions?(I told her to get an import or a 1-2 year old Volvo sedan)
>>She won't buy an import, and won't buy anything but GM.
>>
>>Thanks, and I need ideas before the 24th(vax here goes down for 2 weeks).
>>Joe
>
>
>--Too bad.  She's throwing out the Taurus and the LH out the window.
>  What a mistake.  
>
>  She could go with a Chevy Corsica V6, which comes with the airbag, but
>  I don't know if it can be equipped with ABS.
>
>  The GM10's (Lumina/Cutlass Supreme/Regal/Grand Prix) don't have airbags,
>  I don't think.  This car could be a good bet if they do.
>
>  The next model up is the Olds 88/Buick LeSabre.  This is the best choice
>  if she is willing to pay $18-20K.
>
>  The Buick Century/Olds Ciera are large, reliable, and cheap, but they are
>  older designs, and I don't know if they come with ABS or airbags.
>
>--Keep trying to convince her to look at the Chrysler LH's.  The GM cars
>  listed are compromises in comparison.
>
>--Aamir Qazi
>-- 
>
>Aamir Qazi
>qazi@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
>--Why should I care?  I'd rather watch drying paint.


Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: sharen@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com (Sharen A. Rund)
Subject: Re: Elvis in HotDogMobile!!!
Organization: Lockheed Missiles and Space Co.
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 92 20:18:18 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.223246.7467@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> awds_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Adam Edwards) writes:
>I saw something very interesting this afternoon on campus.
>An Oscar Meyer Mobile pulled up in front of a dorm! 
>Has anyone ever seen one for real, or is it just the fact that
>I'm a young'n and wouldn't remember such a thing from the past?
>I do remember a car magazine article roadtesting one of these
>however.  Sounds like excellent group transportation!
>
>Adam
>awds_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu
>
>-- 
>		'Fast...
>				...what to drive '

yeah, the Oscar Meyer WeinerMobile has been around for a long time -
they were used to help promote Oscar at fairs, etc

-- 
________________       __        ________________   "They that can give up
\_________      \     /_ \      /      _________/  essential liberty to 
 \_________      \_____/  \____/      _________/  obtain temporary safety
  \___________________      __________________/  deserve neither liberty 
                     /______\                   nor safety."  
ALL disclaimers apply ....                           --Benjamin Franklin
	  
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: paul@NeoSoft.com (Paul Hutmacher)
Subject: Re: 4x4 Newsgroup
Organization: Greater Montrose UFO Appreciation Society & Data Haven
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 01:16:29 GMT

In article <11DEC92.13420848@wizard.colorado.edu> murray_t@wizard.colorado.edu writes:
>Can you explain what this off-road mailing list is all about?  I might
>be interested.


Uh, it's about offroad vehicles, four wheel drive trucks and such, and the
care and feeding of them.
-- 
Paul Hutmacher                Houston, Texas               paul@NeoSoft.Com
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: morton@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Brent Morton)
Subject: Re: 1990 Audi 100 S...
Organization: Computer Science Dept., Univ. of Western Ontario, London, Canada
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 03:29:18 GMT

In article <UfB_V8200iV081Ib0S@andrew.cmu.edu> "Joseph D. Mazza" <mazz+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>As to the 100LS engine, the inclined, straight 5 cyl (Or was it 4? Can't
>remember.) was originally developed and abandoned by MB.  Good thing. 
>It was a dog.  Anyway, the salesman placed great importance on that fact
>during his pitch.  Audi in those days was marketed as the small MB that
>MB didn't build.  It's no accident that the number "100" was used -- it
>fit nicely right below the "200"s at the bottom of the MB line.  In
>fact, even the size and style of the numbers were the same as those on
>the MB.  They were even in the same place on both cars -- right side of
>the trunk lid.  Coming from a salesman, I was of course skeptical.  (Not
>quite skeptical enough, unfortunately, since I bought it.)  But I have
>read the same thing at least once since in a car magazine.

Interesting that people would consider Audis as small cars that Mercedes-Benz
didn't build. Daimler-Benz AG owned Audi from 1958-1965. When the 100 came out
in 1968, it would have made no sense for Volkswagen to "position" the car at
the bottom of another manufacturer's model line. The number 100 was a natural
progression from the existing 80 and 90. The reason that the "middle pressure"
ohv four was so important at the time (1963) was that DKW was anxious to 
switch to four-stroke engines.

Additionally, you'll find that the cars of Mercedes-Benz have their "numbers"
on the left side of the trunk lid.

-- Brent
morton@artifis.gaul.csd.uwo.ca

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: hsd@swl.msd.ray.com (HERBERT DASILVA)
Subject: Re: To: Barry Drodge,Herb "Mopar Maniac" DaSilva - new question...
Keywords: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRGH!
Organization: Raytheon Company, Tewksbury, MA
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 18:18:47 GMT

chinh@sequent.com (Chi'nh Duc Dang) writes:

> virgo@metter.fmpmis.metter.com (P. Virgo) writes:

>>Well,guys, new cars aren't always perfect...
>>
>>My Acclaim,which I LOOOVVE, has developed "early" wear--basically, after
>>about 7 months ownership/16.5K miles, she has developed premature disc
>>pad breakup--resulting in one screwed up rotor...
>>
>>Chrysler says that this is "regular wear/tear"...and the warranty(7/70)
>>doesn't cover it...
>>
>>I don't buy it...any suggestions???
>>
>>d.j. NetBoy

  Sounds like a dealer squirming out of a lousy few $$$, instead of just
  owning up to a bad pad and tossing a new rotor and pad on there (for a total
  cost of what, $40?).  I'd take the following poster's suggestion to heart,
  and take your business to another dealer.  If the other dealer treats you
  better, write a letter to the first dealership telling them why you'll be
  buying your next vehicle and taking all your service dollars to the new
  dealership.  Just to let them know that lack of good will can cost a
  dealership more than a lousy $40.

>  Take your car to a different Chrysler/Plymouth service department.  My '92
>Voyager had a engine belt and speedometer sensor replaced for free at 15K.
>They said it's no big deal since the van'd just passed bumper to bumper
>warranty.
>  I bet not all dealer service departments have this kind of service.

  Now that's good will.  I'll bet this dealer does a ton more repeat business
  than the first...

> Chi'nh Duc Dang

	Herb "Mopar Maniac" DaSilva
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: cka52397@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Slartibartfast)
Subject: Re: Honda Del Sol
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 20:26:47 GMT

In article <BzBCwJ.21sy@austin.ibm.com> adil@austin.ibm.com (Adil Soofi) writes:
>
>I am considering buying the new Honda Del Sol. Any words of wisdom from 
>rec.autos readers?
>
>
>-- 
>Adil Khan Soofi		IBM Software Consultant. Austin, Texas

	Buy a Miata or 240SX convertible.


-- 
 Chintan Amin  The University of Illinois, Urbana Champaign  c-amin1@uiuc.edu
  "Public speaking is very easy!" <-- Quayle 10/88  ;-)
  "Unfortunately, the people of Louisiana are not racists" <-- Quayle, 10/12/90
NeXTMail Accepted  Go Illini *Holiday Bowl* Go Capitals Go Tarheels Go Cowboys
From: tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Subaru Legacy??
Date: 16 Dec 1992 22:54:46 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: cairo

qazi@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Aamir Hafeez Qazi) writes:
> 
> Amazingly, for $12,000 plus TTL you can get a new '92 Subaru Legacy L
> with air, cassette, cruise, and power windows/locks/mirrors - a fully
> loaded, reliable Japanese sedan the size of an Accord which sells poorly,
> but is nearly as good as the Accord LX, which is the comparable model.
> Forget the Sentra and the Mazda - this is the car to be looked at.

Consumer Reports liked this car, because it "isn't like a Subaru" [Legend].
The Legacy is not often compared with Accord/Taurus/Camry, though perhaps
it should be.  If you test drive one, please let us know what you think.
My wife rejected the Legacy because it has motorized seat belts.

The general consensus on Subarus seems to be that they're OK if you need
4WD but can't afford a Jeep Grand Cherokee or Ford Explorer.  However, I'm
not sure that the Legend is available with low range, which is absolutely
essential for off-road driving.

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mchaffee@ux4.cso.uiuc.edu (Real Life?!?! HA!!)
Subject: Re: Ox sensor origins
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 05:05:08 GMT

Larry.Mc.Donald@ofa123.fidonet.org writes:


> mark@wdc.sps.mot.com 
>   (Mark Shaw) asks:

>> While digging through some of the literature on emissions, there is a 
>> definite changeover to closed-loop systems around 1982 using the
>> Lambda (OX) sensor technology.  What I cann't seem to find is the early
>> origin of this device.

>> I suspect that it was invented by Bosch in the 1970's, but have no 
>> direct reference to that.  I do recall seeing it on an Audi
>> development car around 1980.  Anyone out there got the history on who
>> invented, first produced this device?

>   It first appeared on Volvo cars as a standard item in the late 
>'70s (1978, I believe). You might write to them where they got 
>the idea, they were using a Bosch fuel injection system at the 
>time (some form of Bosch fuel injection has been standard on 
>Volvo engines since 1971, kinda makes me laugh at new cars with 
>'Fuel Injection' emblems on them, like it's some kind of big deal 
>these days.).

Unless I am mistaken, there are no longer ANY regular production cars with
carburetors.  Does anybody know of any?  Of course, anybody who has ever dealt
with the fuel system on an emissions-controlled carbureted car will agree
that FI is a boon for emissions, in terms of simplicity, as well as function.

And speaking of needless badging on cars, I think my favorite has to be some of
the Japanese and American cars that say things like "Automatic" or "Wagon"
on them.  As if I cared, or couldn't figure it out for myself.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael T. Chaffee        | mchaffee@ux4.cso.uiuc.edu  |  ______    
                                                       |  \    /   HATE
"I chased a rainbow down a one-way street.  Dead end." |   \  /  is not a
     - S. P. McCall                                    |    \/  FAMILY VALUE
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: vetter@mtu.edu (STEVEN J. VETTER)
Subject: Re: 89 Mustang GT
Organization: Michigan Technological University
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 16:48:55 GMT

Joe@ohiont.fidonet.org (Joe Dzurinda) writes:
>I hope someone has an answer for this one.  
>I recently removed the battery cables from the battery to clean them for a better connection.  Everything went fine until I drove the car.  Now whenever I start the car the radio loses the time and all it's stations.  It started doing this intermitantly but seems to do it all the time now.  I double checked all the connections and made sure pos was connected to pos, neg to neg.  Anyone got any idea what's causing this?
>
>--- msged 1.99S ZTC
> * Origin: OHIONet Express - Parma, Oh (1:157/512)
>--  
>
>  "May fortune favor the foolish."  -  Admiral Kirk, STIV-TVH
>
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>   From the North Coast      Joe Dzurinda, Sysop of OHIONet Express
>   _____   of America...._-! Home of the Cleveland Opus/Usenet Gateway
>  !     --___       ___--  !          (since November, 1987)
>  !          ------(*)     !
>  !          Cleveland     ! Usenet: {.....}!usenet!ncoast!ohiont!joe
>  !                        ! Internet: joe@ohiont.fidonet.org
>  !       O  H  I  O      !  Fidonet: OHIONet Express, 1:157/512.0
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------


  Try replacing them.

  
-- 
Steve Vetter     DISCLAIMER-  The opinions expressed here are not those of
vetter@mtu.edu                my employer,  because I don`t have one yet.  If  
                              you wish for these opinions to be your company's,
Damn it's Cold!!!             or not, send e-mail to :  vetter@mtu.edu