From: rjc@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Ray)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Unreal demo!
Date: 4 Sep 92 20:31:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: mintaka.1992Sep4.203121.18091
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <1992Sep3.214359.23695@usl.edu> das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A) writes:
>In article <1992Sep3.190823.5325@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> rjc@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Ray) writes:
>>In article <1992Sep3.005629.13793@usl.edu> das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A) writes:
>>>In article <jbickers.0els@templar.actrix.gen.nz> jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz (John Bickers) writes:
>>>>Quoted from <1992Sep2.052244.7893@usl.edu> by das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A):
>> The MODs in hardwired alone beat Unreal's butt.
>
>So...computer demos somehow....compete with one another?

   Amiga Demo parties are usually held bi-annually in multiple locations
in Europe. These parties typically have >600 people at them. Demos
are presented to the crowd and voted on. The priczes for 1st,2nd, 3rd
place are usually in the hundres, if not thousands of dollars.
Demos are a _very_ serious thing on the Amiga.  A good demo can get
you hired at Psynosis or other game companies.
   The Amiga demo scene is fiercely competitive. The pressure is constantly
on to produce better and better.

>>  Instead of messing around with Unreal, get REND386,a virtual
>>reality renderer system. It does something the 486 is good at,
>>lots of vector transformations, instead of faking something it's can't do,
>>lots of playfields w/bobs and parallax scrolling.
>
>I like messing around with UNREAL!  That's what these things are FOR:
>the look at with jaw dropped for a few times and then delete them from
>your hard drive.  That IS exactly what you do, right?

   My jaw didn't drop when watching Unreal, but I did delete it.
I don't delete good demos.

>>>>> Is this the sort of thing commonly found for Amigas?
>>>>
>>>>    Yes, and not so big... :)
>>
>>   It's the type of routines that are so old and easy that Amiga
>>demos don't use them any more. Sine Scrollers are _OLD_. If anyone
>>used them in a modern demo contest they would be laughed out of the room.
>
>O. K.  So they are old.  So freaking old i had never ever ever seen them
>before.  I thought it was kinda neat.  What I asking for your opinion...
>at any time?

   This whole thread started when someone said "Unreal is just as good
as any Amiga Demo." I wouldn't have posted at all if this claim
wasn't made.   Just think what would have happened if I claimed
"ProWrite is as good as any Mac or IBM word processor".  I would have
been flamed to a crisp.  The IBM doesn't have the "demo scene" that
the Amiga does. Fiercly competitive european teenagers (who
typically can't afford a computer that costs more than $400)
who program a piece of hardware well suited for demos.  
If PC users wish to claim that Unreal is a _REAL_ demo on par with
Amiga demo technology, then I claim EMACS is a _real_ word processor
on par with MS Word.

>>  But don't take my word on it alone, ask some of the
>>hardcore demo collectors in alt.sys.amiga.demos and they will tell you.
>>Plain Filled vectors are fast becoming old too. Now most demos do 
>>rubber vectors, real-time image mapping onto polygons (voyage demo), 
>>shadows,  Glenz/Blenk vectors (morphing vectors and transparent polygons),
>>spline vectors, etc.  As I said in another post, if Unreal
>>had been written in 1989, it might have stood a chance of making the
>>top ten.  If Unreal is the best that PC demo coders can come up with
>>(pushing the hardware to its limits) than the PC demo scene has a long
>>time to go.
>
>Well, like I said, I'm not gonna collect this baby.  It is merely amusement.
>It is amazing what people do to entertain themselves, isn't it?

   Fine, collect it.  That's what demos are for. Just don't claim
Unreal is anywhere near as good as Amiga demos, because it's not.
If you don't believe, find someone with an Amiga and I will
personally upload you some demos that will make your jaw drop off.

>--
>Dan Stephenson                                           das9674@usl.edu
>" BERLIN WALL FALLS.  3 BORDER GUARDS LOSE JOBS.  CLINTON BLAMES BUSH! "
>        -George Bush, '92 Republican nomination acceptance speech
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy