Newsgroups: bit.listserv.hellas
Date:         Mon, 6 Apr 1992 01:42:00 EDT
Reply-To:     PXP111@PSUVM.BITNET
From:         PXP111@PSUVM.BITNET
Subject:      etymol MAKEDONIA (agglika)

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                  EIS MNHMHN MANOLH ANDRONIKOY  apo tn lista
                  Afierwmevo stov Megalov syvovomatotov mou..
                  me tis mikres mou gvwseis gia oti agapouse
                  kai me tnv eyxn va xrnsimeysei kapws.......
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THE GREEK-SLAVIC DISPUTE OVER THE WORD "MACEDONIA" IS NOT THAT COMPLICATED

Is Macedonia a Greek word? It is definitely not a slavic or (Yugo) slavic
         one, for these waves came in the Balkans relatively recent.  Not
         of course as late as the Turks from Central Asia,  but far after
         the collapse of the Western Roman Empire...  sometime in the mid
         Byzantine Era.
           Generations of kings: Perdikkas,Aeropos,Steropns,Philipos,Ale-
         xanders,Amyntas,ets  had ruled under these names again and again
         (and of course the one philosopher Aristotle)...   and all these
         along with  the descendants  of their descendants's  descendants
         had called themselves  Macedonians and Greeks,  participating in
         the Olympic Games with the rest of Greeks   - even from the time
         when their capital Aige was not even considered a village by the
         Athenians, Plataians,Sybaritans,Korianthians... (probable excep-
         tion the Spartans...but what would the Spartians consider a vil-
         lage  was a "joke" in Greece back then)...
          All the above dated centuries before the Roman legions ever as-
         sembled in the brinks of the Tiber...
           The Oxford Dictionary of  Ancient Greece and Rome acknowledges
         that apart from the main Greek body (that got separated in north
         Greece while the Achaians-Aeolians,Ionians,Dorians moved south),
         there were some tiny independent tribes scattered in the region.
         We also meet the Illyrians (ancient Albanians?)  near the Adria-
         tic Sea  and the the Odryssai with the Paions occupying the val-
         leys from the Prespa lakes to Belgrade... Never-the-less accord-
         ing to the source mentioned above  the royal dynasty of Argeidai
          was a hellenic one as the main core in Aige and Argos Orestikon
         (note the similarity between Argos And the Argeidai).
           Could it be possible that not these Hellenes, but other people
         named  "Macedonia"  the area expanding from the  Prespa lakes to
         Olympus and the river Strymon?  Probably not. These other tribes
         used to speck different languages  and thus, would probably  use
         their own term...In fact "Macedonia" has no meaning in any other
         language, but only in Greek...

Mechanism of Greek Names: The language of the  ancient philosophers  has
         this characteristic:  Every  greek word  breaks down to its  ba-
         sic "key-notions": Demo-cracy, Eco-nomics, Aero-nautical, Philo-
         sophy, Pyro-maniac, Geo-logy, Photo-graphy... you name it.
         "Macedon" as all Greek names is no exception to this rule for it
         denotes the forth Greek branches that headed eastwards  (remain-
         ing in north Greece),and not southwards as the Achaians-Aeolians
         or the Ionians and Dorians.  Both parts of the word are very old
         even for the Greek standards and one may find them very "crude".
         It is another indication on how early the Greeks used the term.

"MACOS" is the old doric-makednic word the  Spartans (Dorians too)  would
         use as a "vocabular root" also to denote: "high" in the sence of
         long and large...Random words used in different fields may illu-
         strate my point better: Macro-biotics,Macro-economics,Macro-cosm,
         acro-scopic,Macro-cytosis,Macro-lepidoptera, Macro-pterous,Macro-
         photography, mac-aroni...All of them have tis "root".

"DON": a suffix denoting the area/land of origin of people,even offspring
   -->  Examples? Well the famous  Myrmi-don:  the name of the "tribe" of
        Peleus and Achilles (ancestor & idol of  Alexander the Great Mac-
        edon who also carries a Greek name). The component "Myrmi" has a
        story of its own...but this is irrelevant right now.
   -->  other words with similar roots are: the indoeuropean "den" (land-
        valley-fertility):"den(drys)" for tree, Den-metra (the Greek god-
        dess of land), Demetrios, Dimitri, Danae, Daphni,  Dias (name of
        God Zeus of Olympus, the famous Macedonian mount). Check them in
        a dictionary!

MACEDON(ian), so is the "Higlander" (not the movie) for the rest coastal
        or islandic Greeks. Opening a map can only convince you on his...
        The Scots  aren't the only ones  that used such a  term  for the
        northern mountainous branch of their nation. The Greeks too used
        a similar concept in their language.  This is a valid conclusion
        concerning the origin of the disputed word.


SENTIMENTS :The Macedonians offered the Hellenes some of the most glori-
        ous moments in their history uniting them and transplanting the
        Greek culture from the coasts of Libya to the frontiers of China
        & Armenia, from distant Afghanistan to the frozen Danube.In addi-
        tion to this,one must consider the sense of family name,pride and
        respect for the achievements of ones ancestors that is still very
        strong in Greece (as in other parts of the Globe).  I hope the a-
        bove lines offer some answers to the reader on why the sentiments
        and temper run so high in Greece and mainly Thessalonica (that is
        named after Philip's daughter),Edessa,Kastoria,Florina,Serres...


THE PROBLEM: Actually, the Macedonians continue to feel "robbed" & deprived
        from all the above ever since the of announcement of a state using
        their own name, the emblems of Thessalonica in its foreign bank-
        notes... They understand that the explosive situation in the Bal-
        kans is such that dictates recognitions as soon as possible and
        maps to be drawn to control all this killing...  The also under-
        stand that the rest Europeans and the rest of the World cannot
        let people to die only because the "Skopjans" ridiculously insist
        on a name they don't own. In addition, they understand why this
        breaking-away Slavs want to stick to this identity (so that they
        can appear different from the Serbians). Yes,the Greeks definite-
        ly know this humanitarian objective which unfortunately does not
        help their cause (which is not a matter of physical survival).
        They  counter proposed a bunch of other names that had been used
        to denote this Slavic territory even from the time of Homer...
        but nothing changed.
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kai eis periptwsn pou n apeuktaia "avagvwrisn" epel0ei as gelasoume ligo:

It is funny: For their own reasons some of the South Slavs (Yugoslavs)
        that occupy ancient Paionia,(exactly at the frontiers of ancient
        Macedonia) want to adopt the Greek name of the Highlanders (Mace-
        donians).In other words,they want to USE an adjective & be CALLED
        something like: "north Highlanders" in Greek.  Amazing, isn't it!
        Here are some people that not only use the  greek-based  cyrrilic
        alfabet, but also want to call themselves in Greek... A very nice
        hellenization! Maybe a bit superficial if they don't LEARN Greek;
        but let us try to see the whole thing under this different light:

They don't distort the name:  The effect and  worldwide  INFLUENCE  of the
        Hellenic civilization is alive & apparent when  even the neighbors
        PREFER to use the GREEK TERMS versus their own words...   And the
        Greek terms with their historic meaning prevail as: Europe, Asia,
        Anatolia,  Aegean, Adriatic, Atlantic ocean,  Cyprus, Marseilles,
        Georgia, Syracuse,  Crimea,  Napoli,  Monaco, Nice, Trabzon... My
        Greek friends,  bitter though right now,  should probably  try to
        smile a bit with the situation north of their borders:  Here they
        have a people that insists on using the FULL Greek name (even for
        all the  wrong reasons and under a bit perverse a way...) and not
        distort it as the Turks did with "Is tan (Constantinou) Poli".

It is obvious to whom it belongs: The name NOT being DISTORTED allows the
        greek origin of Macedonia to be TRACTABLE at any instant. History
        can not be rewritten thus. The possible mispercertion that may be
        caused to the less educated civilians of distant countries is NOT
        irreparable: For some reason the may get the confusing impression
        that the proud descendants of Alexander III & Philip II converted
        to a slavic speaking people.....and that somehow left their other
        cities and Thessaloniki, moving to considerable northern territo-
        ries...towards the center of the Balkans..!And if you don't think
        that this is funny then you are really depressed.
          Anyway, this missperception will not occur to the educated and
        that is vital.  Actually, THAT IS ALL; because far from being in
        the  Middle Ages (where books could be burnt),this no longer can
        happen! The ancient scripts that survived time cannot be oblite-
        rated. Serious publications along with the palaces & other  monu-
        ments excavated by Dr.M.Andrinikos at Pella, Aiges, Diaion, have
        their own voice  (whereas, not a single Alexandrian coin was ever
        found in Skopje!)  The Greek name  Macedonia  in addition (and by
        not being distorted) makes the things crystal clear.

                                   * * *

                                                              CONCLUSION

The modern Macedonians of  Thessalo-niki, Olympus, Argos Orestikon, Serre
& Phil-ippi as well as their famous ancient "highlander" forefathers that
named the places such,  aren't that much threatened by this  imititation.
Even if claimed, the name Macedonia by itself, as those of Alexander III,
Philip II,etc  are by definition Greek and found in Homer. The Greek name
MACEDON proves the history of the region and that is all.

                                                       Andronikos Romanos
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