From: ira2p@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Iain Robert Asplin)
Subject: Re: Further suggestive lines, Gallifreyans...
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 22:36:59 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.142421.9989@bsu-ucs.uucp> 00bwanderson@bsu-ucs.uucp writes:
>In article <1992Sep30.142730.4386@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>, mflt_cif@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Mongoose) writes:
>> In <BvDvtx.22H@wm.estec.esa.nl> pisherwo@wm.estec.esa.nl (Phil Isherwood) writes:
>> 
>>>There IS an underclass on Gallifrey! If I remember correctly, this theme
>> was explored in 'The Invasion of Time'. I believe that Leela actually left
>> the city of the Time Lords and met some of these people; they may even have
>> played an active role in the foiling of the Sontaran invasion. Anyone out
>> there with a novelisation of 'The Invasion of Time' wish to expand on this?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> You are half-right.  Those people who lived outside Gallifrey were there
>> because they relenquished their rights as Gallifreyans and emigrated outside
>> the city.  This is a permanant status, and many of them held some status
>> when they were in the city.  They weren't exactly a lower class, rather,
>> 'no-class' because they held absolutely no rights becasue they chose to
>> waive theirs.  Keep in mind that the ultimate punishment to a time lord was
>> to banish them from the city.
>
>
>Hmmm...he's half-right, and so are you.  The Shobogans weren't *JUST*
>Gallifreyans-they were *EX-TIMELORDS* (this from Jean-Marc Lofficier's
>Programme Guide) who had left the City...
>That's all the dirt I can dig up on them.  Guess I'll have to go back and watch
>the show again and see what else I can find out...8^)  Torture!!! 8^)
>
>Spock out...
>
>-- 
>.sig?  We don' need no steenkin' .sig!
>
>Bruce Anderson: A tradition of Chaos and Disorder since 1967
>spock@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (unix)	00bwanderson@bsu-ucs.uucp (VAX)
>Don't look at me in that tone of voice!  BSU disclaims me, and I disclaim them.

And you know what Bruce, you are half-right too!  I guess that makes this
posting one-eighth right by now?
Right.  First of all, anything anyone reads in a book is non-canon, the
Programme Guide included, and this ic a classic example of why,
because *NOWHERE* in the televised story is that group of Gallifreyans
called "Shobogans." 

Here's the deal.
Ace, eight, jack of spades, (sorry, couldn't resist a "deal joke.)

Right.
Leela and Rodan leave the Citadel, and once outside meet a group
of "primitive" warrior/hunters who tell them that they were once
Time Lords who got sick of the "cozy little world" inside the Citadel
and decided to leave for the good old outdoors.
This group of people never get a name to identify them by.  Perhaps
we should just call them the people in hides.
Are these people still Time Lords or aren't they?  Technically I would
say they are, and going by Nesbin's attitude when asked this question
I think he knows technically he still is too, but since theor lifestyle
is so diametrically opposed to the Time Lord norm, they would rather
not think of themselves as Time Lords.  Say, for example, a person
from a country being run by a dictator emigrates to your country.
Technically, that person is still a native of their original country
and always will be, but most likely that person would like to think
of themselves as a member and citizen of their new country.  Much the
same case, I think.


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