HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.psycgrad
Date:         Fri, 10 Apr 1992 15:15:09 CST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Mike Babyak <HOPE@UKANVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Regression therapy
              10 Apr 1992 14:45:00 CST from <DJOHNSON@GAMMA.IS.TCU.EDU>

A quick comment on the therapy/empirical evidence issue, or
better yet, a few pertinent (I think) questions:
  By empirical evidence, what do we mean?
A second question, by what criteria (criterion) should we evaluate
our truths?  And finally, depending on how you define empirical evidence,
is it possible to arrive at truths through means other than
traditional empiricist/positivist means ie the stuff you learned in
first year methods course?

MIKE BABYAK UNIVERSITY OF KANSAS         *THERE'S NO PLACE LIKE HOME*
HOPE@UKANVM
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Date:         Sat, 11 Apr 1992 11:49:19 EST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Mona Oommen <oommen@PSYCH.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Professional societies

I'm actually on internet but have had no problem reaching APS on
bitnet.  Try:  apsklh@umuc.bitnet

Mona
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Date:         Fri, 17 Apr 1992 09:18:44 EDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Dev Butler <BUTLERD@FS1.PSY.EMORY.EDU>
Subject:      self disclosure, intimacy
X-To:         psycgrad@acadvm1.uottawa.ca

Patrick writes that he is looking for a scheme to code how
"intinmate" a subject's self-disclosure is. A word of caution-
intimacy is subjective- what is intimate for me to tell may not be
intimate for you. Perhaps a schema could be devised (or has been)
that takes this into account. Unfortunately, I know nothing about this
area.

Dev at Emory
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Date:         Mon, 13 Apr 1992 08:29:05 PDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         CGILBERT@IDUI1.BITNET

just breifly.  there is a form of psychotherapy in Spokane that
uses pseudo-freudian type work combined with massage (as you are
being "worked over" what are you thinking about and "where does
this take you?")  now, i for one do not condone this type of
therapy however the person advertises as a counselor not a psycho-
therapist and people state that they feel much better upon leaving.
i would like to pose two questions (eventhough i still have to
catch up on reading all the mail):  1).  do we have the right to
tell people that this therapy is ineffective because of lack of
empirical support and 2).  do we have the right to stop it?
christine of alaska in idaho
thesis in final stages
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Date:         Thu, 16 Apr 1992 00:14:15 CST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         "Tony Bottausci (306) 586-0160" <BOTTAUSC@MAX.CC.UREGINA.CA>
Subject:      Re: Legitimate therapies
              14 Apr 1992 14:44:00 CST from <DJOHNSON@GAMMA.IS.TCU.EDU>

     TO darryl (the Other Brother) Johnson:


     My axiom 'primum no nocere' was not meant to be the be all and end all
     of therapy. The central gist of the mail I sent was that any procedure
     that brings relief in terms of alleviation of suffering from the
     client's  perspective should be promoted. THEN i ADDED my axiom...
     as an adjunct, not as a main theme.

                                        Tony
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Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 14:44:00 CST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         "Darryl (The Other Brother) Johnson" <DJOHNSON@GAMMA.IS.TCU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Legitimate therapies
X-To:         PSYCGRAD%UOTTAWA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu

From: "Tony Bottausci (306) 586-0160" <BOTTAUSC@MAX.CC.UREGINA.CA>
"of suffering.  The principle of 'Primum no nocere' (above all do no harm)
should be a rule of thumb."

Getting paid for doing nothing should be the definition of
unemployment, fraud, or civil service jobs, not therapy.
What a slogan for the tombstone of therapy: "Well, at least
no one got hurt!"

<See .sig file below>

/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\
>   Darryl K. Johnson      (  "It is usurping life to do  <
>   Texas Christian         )  no more than simply avoid  <
>   University             (   doing harm; the dead do as <
>   Fort Worth, Texas       )  much, and exact nothing    <
>                          (   for it." - Prince de Ligne <
\-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-/
/ DJOHNSON@tcucvms.bitnet      DJOHNSON@gamma.is.tcu.edu  \
\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/
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Date:         Fri, 10 Apr 1992 22:30:00 EDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         ROBERT_BROCKMAN <CDBSDUC@IUP.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: ELIZA's native tongue.

If any of you own a Macintosh there is at least one version floating around for
that Machine. I don't know what the program itself was written in, but the file
it uses for its phrases, etc. is a simple text file that you can add, subtract
and otherwise alter.

Robert Brockman, aka CDBSDUC@IUP.BITNET
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Date:         Tue, 7 Apr 1992 18:35:00 EDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         ROBERT_BROCKMAN <CDBSDUC@IUP.BITNET>
Subject:      Answer for Matthew...

[Matthew: sorry, but I lost your personal address, so I'm sending this to the
general net.

For the rest of you, Matthew sent me a message to relay to Nancy Zemeriah, who
is at my program (IUP) and is running for member-at-large for APAGS. He asked
her about her opinion of PSYCGRAD and its possible place in APAGS and for
communication among psychologists in general. Is that about right, Matthew? As
I said, I no longer have any copy of your original message, so that's what I
remember you asking...]


Hello Matthew,

I am intrigued. I've talked to Robert a little about using PSYCGRAD - it sounds
very interesting and very under-utilized. Have you gotten any feedback from
APAGS? I guess the first big question is availability: is it conveniently
available to all students? It would have to be before it could become the
standard of communication. Any read on this? It seems like an interesting issue
for APAGS to consider.

Thanks!

NZ



NZ:rb
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Date:         Tue, 7 Apr 1992 09:26:49 HST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Denise Lajoie <DLAJOIE@UHUNIX.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: APS Rooms and Location
X-To:         "Psychology Graduate Students Discussion Group List"
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNE>

Loree,
    Hi there!  I think that your conference "clearinghouse" idea is terrific!
What info do you want from us?  I don't want to overload you with trivia. :-)

Yes, Dave, great job.

Denise @ Hawaii (where the whales are running)
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Via: sun3.nsfnet-relay.ac.uk; Thu, 16 Apr 1992 12:20:20 +0100
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Original-Sender: psp.dasilvaalvo@sequent.cc.hull.ac.uk
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.psycgrad
Date:         Thu, 16 Apr 1992 07:24:51 -0400
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         "psp.dasilvaalvo" <psp.dasilvaalvo@SEQUENT.CC.HULL.AC.UK>
Subject:      Hello everybody
X-To:         PSYCGRAD <PSYCGRAD@bitnet.uottawa>

 Hi to all of you.
 I am a Ph.D. student doing research in imagery and human motor performance.
 If any of you is interested or researching similar topic do let me know.
Bye for now.
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Jorge daS. Alvoeiro,                Tel:(0482) 465778
  Dept. of Psychology,                Fax:(0482) 465599
  Hull University,                    E_Mail: psp.dasilvaalvo@uk.ac.hull.seq
  Cottingham Road,
  Hull HU6 7RX,
  England
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date:         Fri, 10 Apr 1992 14:45:00 CST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         "Darryl (The Other Brother) Johnson" <DJOHNSON@GAMMA.IS.TCU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Regression therapy
X-To:         PSYCGRAD%UOTTAWA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu

From: Matthew Simpson <054340%UOTTAWA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
If you refuse the technique of exorcism simple because it is "exorcism"
and therefore must be illigitimate, then you also have to drop any
investigation in faith healing.  If you drop investigation in faith
     The person who brought up exorcism was arguing FOR more
     investigation, not LESS, as many people on here have been
     doing.
     It is not enough to simply judge something by its product.
     Consider the following two equations:
     X = (A+B)*100*6/100/6*4*9/4/9
     X = (A+B)

     Now if I did that without screwing up the order of operations,
     equation 2 is EXACTLY the same as equation 1.  But the second
     is more scientific, as it meets the Occam's Razor requirements
     of accomplishing the same thing with fewer variables and less
     mess.

     The above analogy points to the danger of going ONLY by the
     results, especially when the clients are not PAYING by results,
     but by TREATMENTS.  In essence, they could be paying MORE for
     each extra "variable" of treatment, but getting the same result
     that an "equation 2" therapy could provide.

     Finally, a warning: everyone step carefully around the subject
     of empirical research.  Many of us are experimental psychology
     students, NOT clinical or counseling.  While I may not know much
     about clients, I know the importance of empirical support.

/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\
>   Darryl K. Johnson      (  "Life does not cease to be  <
>   Texas Christian         )  funny when people die any  <
>   University             (   more than it ceases to be  <
>   Fort Worth, Texas       )  serious when people        <
>                          (   laugh." - Bernard Shaw     <
\-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-/
/ DJOHNSON@tcucvms.bitnet      DJOHNSON@gamma.is.tcu.edu  \
\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/
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Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 18:22:42 PDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Eric Vanman <vanman@GIRTAB.USC.EDU>
Subject:      My motives and regression
X-To:         PSYCGRAD%UOTTAWA.BITNET@VM.usc.edu
              9, 92 8:03 pm

Dear Matthew and All,

Unfortunately, I am leaving town (and therefore my computer) for a few days,
just as the Legitimacy of Therapy debate is heating up.  However, I would like
offer a short (?) rebuttal to Matthew's comments:

1. It is a fact (at least in the United States and especially here in L.A.)
that psychotherapists routinely charge on average $80-100/hour. In terms of
my lowly income, this is "megabucks." In addition, many forms of psychotherapy
routinely involve many months of sessions. For example, our noted Boston
regression psychiatrist had been seeing her client for at least two years.
Psychotherapy in this sense is considerably expensive, don't you agree?

2. It is also a fact that organizations like APS and APA are trying to
increase the collective RESPECT of our field in order to maintain influence
on policy, funding, and privileges.  So, my mention of a goal of respect was
not particularly personal, as Matthew suggested.  Nor can I claim a desire
for megabucks.  I don't even plan on a career in clinical psychology or
private practice.

3. What I did mean to convey was my outrage towards those in our field who do
charge megabucks for therapy, demand the respect of being a therapist by
holding a license, but do not question the legitimacy of their methods by
seeking out empirical support for what they do.  This is where the
discussion of ethics comes into play for me. I cannot accept the
suggestion Matthew appears to make that we should leave it up to each
individual psychotherapist to determine what is effective or appropriate
for psychotherapy.  Matthew, what is the point of our existence as members of
a scientific field, if we are not collectively constantly re-evaluating
our methods based on facts?  Shouldn't we all be striving to search for
the best methods possible to aid those who seek therapy (as well
as those who don't)?  And isn't the best way to make such evaluations
through the dialogues we have as scientists (who practice science)?

4.  Finally, I did not say that we should wait until a method is
thoroughly tested before it is used to help people. Now, I think that
regression therapy has had a good 80 years to be tested...it only helps
a few people out some of the time with some issues.  Whether
the same results could be obtained by having a mechanic talk
to the client for an hour each week, or whether success with regression
occurs more ofen than could be predicted by chance alone, we do not know
BECAUSE GOOD OUTCOME RESEARCH is not being done as much as it should.
The same could be said about other therapies as well. We (as psychologists)
should recognize these limitations and be constantly seeking better ways to
help clients, but more often than not, I think we don't.

Thanks for the reply, Matthew.

Eric
vanman@girtab.usc.edu
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Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 19:56:00 EST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         "David M. Fresco" <FRESCO@UNC.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Regression therapy

Matthew Simpson recently wrote:
> Therapies are not suspect to legitimacy, psychotherapists are.
> It is not the therapy that helps the client, the therapist and the client
> that help the client.  To offer an analogy, if a plumber works on a
> house using a monkey wrench, and the house's plumbing goes bad, the
> monkey wrench is not suspect.
>
In this case, I don't believe that monkey wrench therapy can have been
unequivocably advocated. I think that this monkey wrench threw a
spanner in the works of the client's life as much or more than the
plumber did.  If I may be so bold, the plumber in question acted as if
she was trained by the Howard, Fine and Howard School of Plumbing which
is fitting because the Three Stooges were more or less contemporaries of
Freud.
David Fresco
UNC-CH
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Date:         Wed, 15 Apr 1992 09:29:00 EST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         NANCY BRITON <BRITON@NORTHEASTERN.EDU>
Subject:      Re: summer in sight!!!!

Diana,
         What is the matter with Chicago's water?

nancy
(not your mom but enjoyed the mail anyway)
From: turner@webb.psych.ufl.edu (Carl Turner)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.psycgrad
Subject: APA mailing list?
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:44:19 GMT
Organization: Univ. of Florida, Psychology Dept.


Does the APA operate a mailing list for sources of research funds? Has
anyone heard anything about this? 

Any help greatly appreciated.
-- 
vxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxv
v  Carl Turner                            Psychology Department             v 
v  turner@webb.psych.ufl.edu   University of Florida, Gainesville FL 32611  v 
vxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxvxv
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Date:         Sun, 12 Apr 1992 19:38:22 CDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         C150630@UMCVMB.BITNET
Subject:      Assessment

I have been assigned a project and need some help.  I am to devise
a fresh and better approach to assessing student achievement
in a graduate level course.  Portfolios are one possible method.
If you have been involved in a course that used something other
than the usual testing procedures and/or term paper,
I'd like to hear from you.

Polly Brown
C150630@UMCVMB
Ed. & Cnsl. Psych.
University of Missouri
Columbia, Missouri
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X-VMS-Cc: GARYKATZ
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Date:         Sat, 11 Apr 1992 13:38:00 EST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         GARY <GARYKATZ@PITTVMS.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: ELIZA's native tongue.

Versions of ELIZA that I've seen about 10-15yrs ago were written in
BASIC... I've also seen early versions written in Z80/8008 assembly.

I think I have source code packed away somewhere... the problem is figuring
out which State I've left it in!

-gk
GARYKATZ@PITTVMS
GARYKATZ@VM2.CIS.PITT.EDU
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Date:         Tue, 14 Apr 1992 15:34:35 PDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Stephanie Fishkin <fishkin%girtab.usc.edu@USC.EDU>
Subject:      Tax Info
X-To:         psycgrad@acadvm1.uottawa.ca

Being that it is tax time, I thought that you folks might
find this useful for future reference:
This came from our department newsletter.

Stephanie (fishkin@girtab.usc.edu)


TAX

by Andrea Piccinin

	Tax time was made (literally) more palatable, thanks to Elizabeth
Cowin.  Elizabeth invited David Anderson, a representative of the IRS, to
speak on tax issues particularly as they relate to graduate students.  he
explained clearly, and candidly, the concept of tax law, the purpose and
perspective of the IRS, how to keep yourself out of trouble, and how to
understand the political nature of taxes.  Elizabeth also made sure the 15
or so who attended had plenty of good food to console ourselves with.

	IF YOU WANT TO REMAIN IGNORANT OF THE FACTS, STOP READING NOW!

	You DO have to pay taxes!

	As TAs or RAs, you are not able to claim books, supplies, etc. bough
for personal studies as deductions, because you can only claim job-related
expenses.  In other words, if you had to personally pay for al the
xeroxing you do for the students you TA, you could claim it.  The 3good2
news is that at USC, but not at all institutions, tuition is considered
some kind of 3gift,2 and is not considered payment for your work as a TA.
This means that the tuition money you never actually see is not taxable
(it is for some poor folks at other universities, apparently).

	Those people on straight fellowships (ie., money that is not for
labor compensation) are allowed to 3exclude2 (this is opposes to
3exempting2 or 3deducting2) the amount of their fellowship that is spent
directly on books, supplies, etc.  Since it seems that USC is, at least in
some cases, not reporting these to the IRS, it is up to the individual
student to let the IRS know how much was spent on items required for study
(not room and board), and how much was left over after that and is
taxable.  Always SAVE YOUR RECEIPTS!

	Some other tidbits:

	1)  Audits occur often two years after you file (though at this
point we are such 3small fish2 that I wouldn9t worry too much).

	2)  Three years after you file, the statute of limitations kicks in
and I guess you are 3safe2 (but I bet they watch you like a hawk after
that!).

	3)  Money obtained illegally IS taxable!  Al Capone, and others,
were not convicted of rum-running, but of non-payment of taxers.

	4)  As an illegal alien, you can get into more trouble evading taxes
than by being (and working) in the country illegally.

	A final note:  Thanks very much to Elizabeth for volunteering to
arrange this tax seminar.  Although we may not have left any happier, as
there are not currently any hoe for loopholes, we all left a bit wiser.
And for those of you who wish further information, check with your
friendly Tax Man at 1-800-829-1040, and be sure to have plenty of reading
material on hand as it could be quite a wait!
Hope your taxes are/were filed on time.
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Date:         Thu, 9 Apr 1992 15:58:20 -0400
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         "Stephen W. Jarrard" <jarras@RPI.EDU>
Subject: Re: research on animal models of alcoholism
X-To:         PSYCGRAD%UOTTAWA.BITNET@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu

Mona & All,
     One of the Professor's in our department does extensive
research in this area (Psychopharm/Addictions, etc.).  His name
is Dr. Larry Reid.  He works a lot with drugs (Cocaine, XTC, etc),
but has also done considerable ethanol work.  You could reach him
through the Department of Psych, RPI, Troy, NY 12180-3590.

                                |================|
                                | Steve Jarrard  |
                                | D/Psych - RPI  |
                                | (518) 276-8271 |
                                | jarras@rpi.edu |
                                |================|
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Date:         Sat, 11 Apr 1992 10:34:00 EDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Jim Lea <LEAJ@QUCDN.QUEENSU.CA>
Subject:      romantic relationships

Christi,

This isn't my area of study, but I have stumbled across some articles
that you might be interested in (assuming you haven't come across them
already).  Caryl (Carol?) Rusbult has done some work on applying
"investment" theories to the stability of relationships.  There's a good
article in the 1991 (maybe 1990) Journal of Personality and Social
Psych.  It's related to work on work commitment and satisfaction (I
think Rusbult and Farrell (?) had some articles in the early 80s).

Ted (?) Huston has also done some work on relationship style and subsequent
commitment (I think).  I saw him give a colloquium at U of Waterloo a
few years ago where one student seemed to suggest he and John Holmes had
conflicting ideas about whether or not a relationship would last (i.e.,
is it good to vent disagreement or is that just a sign that the
relationship won't last).

Good luck with your research!

- Jim
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Date:         Mon, 13 Apr 1992 13:42:23 EDT
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         NANGEL@FS1.PSY.EMORY.EDU
Subject:      Re: Legitimate therapies
X-To:         PSYCGRAD%UOTTAWA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu

    Interesting point about warning about legitimacy/efficacy of
therapies.
    Just the other day, one of our professors informed us that only
licensed clinical psychologists (and psychiatrists, I guess) are
bound by law to the ethical and professional standards of APA.
Apparently, non-licensed "therapists" or "counselors" are not as
easily held accountable for what they do -or not do- in their
professional practices, and can get away with a lot more than
licensed professionals.
    Pretty scary...
        Nangel
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