From: kassover@rumsey.crd.ge.com (David Kassover)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: God's view of children (and adults)
Date: 29 Jul 92 16:09:55 GMT
Organization: GE Corporate R&D Center

Note: I may have munged the attributions.  Apologies in advance
In article <92211.125359P85014@BARILVM.BITNET> P85014@BARILVM.BITNET (Anthony Waller) writes:
>In article <1992Jul27.160503.27610@ttinews.tti.com>, reid@metis.tti.com (Reid
>Kneeland) says:
>>
>>In article <1114@kepler1.rentec.com> fcaggian@rentec.com (Frank Caggiano)
>>writes:
>>>Ok, point out these 'numerous older religions that condoned or
>>>even demanded infanticide'.
>>
>>Well for starters, there's a very old (ca. 3000 years) religion which
>>holds that infanticide is called for in certain extreme circumstances.
>>
>>This religion is called Judaism.  Don't believe me?  Ask an orthodox
>>rabbi about "kiddush hashem".  It dates back to the defeat of Israel by
>>the Babylonians in the 6th century BC.  The gist of it is that it is
>>better for children to die by the hands of their parents than to fall
>>into the hands of pagans (sorry, ailsa) who might abuse them or
>>sacrifice them to their gods.  Though this set of circumstances is
>>unlikely to occur today, the law is still "on the books".
>
>
>  I think your answer Reid, is misleading.  I am not an Orthodox
>Rabbi, but I am an orthodox Jew.
>
>  Firstly, please refer to Leviticus 18,21 and 20,1-5.  One of the
>primary concerns of the Torah (5 books of Moses) is to guard against
>idol-worship and practices associated thereof.  One of the most
>horrendous practices was the offering of children to the moon-god,
>Molech.  The Torah is uncompromising in its outlawing of this
>atrocity.
>
>  Secondly, you mention "kiddush hashem" which translates as
>"sanctification of the Divine name."  Part of sanctifying, or
>making Holy the name of G-d is the obligation to be killed rather
>than perform certain forbidden actions, viz: murder, idolatory and
>incestuous sexual relations, i.e. if someone says to you either kill
>Joe or I will kill you, then you must forfeit your own life.
>
>  I find that your use of part of this law (and I fear your post was
>inaccurate  but I don't want to make this too long) to prove that
>Judaism is one of the "numerous older religions that condoned or even
>demanded infanticide"  highly offensive!

I'm by no means a regular, practicing Jew, Orthodox or otherwise,
now.

However, I do wonder if they still tell those stories about the
woman who threw her numerous children, and then herself, off a
wall rather than acknowledge  the temporal authority of the
Greeks?

And how about the story of Abraham, who, according to the story,
was commanded to offer his son as a sacrifice, and was only
stopped at the last moment of the test, merely performing a
circumcision and agreeing to perform circumcisions, as a sign
that god would never ask such sacrifices again?

I must also say that Orthodox Judaism of current times is much different
from the Judaism of 3000 years ago, or the faith of Abraham 5800
years ago.





-- 
David Kassover             "Proper technique helps protect you against
uupsi!khazad!kassover	          sharp weapons and dull judges."
kassover@aule-tek.com                   F. Collins
kassover@ra.crd.ge.com
Newsgroups: misc.kids