HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jlw@mtuxo.att.com (Joseph L Wood, Iii)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: M1 Garand/M1A history & differences?
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:33:51 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <1535@wa3wbu.UUCP> wa3wbu!john@uunet.UU.NET (John Gayman) writes:
# 
# In article <1992Jul20.005012.4301@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>, tjohnson@xenon.stanford.edu (Ted C. Johnson) writes:
# 
# # And where does the M1A fit into the scheme of things?  It this a civilian
# # version w/lots of nice features (e.g., a "normal" clip instead of an "en bloc"
# # clip, and ???), or was the M1A actually used by the US Army?
# 
#     The M1A was not a real issue service rifle. It is the semi-auto 
#  version of the select fire M14 which was issued and used for a short
#  time in Vietnam before being replaced by the M16. The designation M1A
#  is actually a trademark of Springfield Armory in Ill.  
# 

You are correct in that the M1A is not a true service rifle, having
never been issued to US troops.  In the M14 family there were two
basic versions which are virtually identical except for two
teeny-weeny parts.  The M14 is the semi-automatic version and
the M14A1 has a selector switch.  At the upper rear of the receiver in the
M14 is a cylindrically shaped knob with one flat side about 3/8" in
diameter.  This is pinned to a shaft which extends through the receiver.
With this knob the shaft will not turn away from the semi-automatic
position.  The M14A1 replaces this knob with a T-shaped selector
lever (there's also a small spring for tension) which is also pinned
to the shaft.  Now the shaft turns 180degrees.  One position semi-
the other position full-automatic.  All that is needed for the change is
a mallet and drift.  I've made the change (disclaimer: I was in the service
at the time and everything was perfectly legal).

Since the change is really easily made, BATF will not allow DCM to
sell true M14s to civilians.  This is one case where the BATF is
correct in the that change <really> is easily made.  That is, if
you agree about full-auto bans.

The M1A has the rear part of the receiver full of metal, I expect -
never having inspected on with the stock off, requiring extensive,
precision machining to make the change.  There also may be some differences
in the trigger group.

Joe Wood
From: alexm@hpwarga.wal.hp.com (Alex McDonald)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Re: "Puff the Magic Dragon" (fwd)
Date: 27 Jul 92 21:37:22 GMT

# 
# 
# "Puff the Magic Dragon" was a C-130 cargo plane, specifically refitted
# to perform ground-attack duties.  
# 
# Weaponry typically coonsisted of:
# 
# Three (3) 20mm GE Gatling canon (max. rate of fire: 6000 RPM)
# Two   (2) 40mm Bofors fully-automatic AA canon.
# One   (1) 105mm howitzer (probably, only on a few)
# 
# All weapons were mounted so that they fired out of the aircraft's port
# side (for the nautically impaired, that's the left side); in firing
# misions, the aircraft would basically circle the target point and rain
# fire.
# 
# Does anyone have any corrections to this?
# 

"Puff the Magic Dragon"'s were first generation USAF close support
gunships, these were C-47 (DC-3) aircraft. In all configurations they
mounted one or more .308/7.62mm miniguns (8 barrel GE gatling gun).
While these were initially successful, most were either lost or badly
damaged in combat (if you're close enough to engage an enemy with a gun
that fires small arms ammunition you are close enough for him to shot
back). The success of the concept lead to the development of the current
generation of gunships.

The "AC-130" is the current generation of USAF gunship. These aircraft
are armored from the top of the left side through to the opposite side
of the aircrafts floor (The left side is used so that the pilot, who
sits on the left side of the cockpit, can see that target area. The
aircraft is equiped with the following:

 (2) 20mm GE Gatling canon (reduced rate of fire 600 rounds/minute)
 (2) 40mm Bofors, fully-automatic AA canon Manually loaded 5 round clips.
 (1) 105mm howitzer, Manually loaded about 5 rounds/minute

The AC-130 first saw combat in Vietnam and since then in Panama and the
Gulf war. These aircraft are usually used at night and are equipped with
low light tv monitors and nightvision equipment.
From: rboudrie@chpc.org (Rob Boudrie)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: New Boston Gun Policy
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:55:47 GMT
Followup-To: talk.politics.guns

[MODERATOR:  Followup to this alert should go to tpg.]

The Boston City council has unanimously voted to direct the Boston PD to
revoke the gun permits of anyone whom a restraining order is taken out 
against (in an effort to combat batterd women being killed, something that
this state has an unfortunate preponderance of).  They have also directed
the police to confiscate all guns from persons whose licenses have been
taken under this policy.

Side note:  The police can revoke the LTC (license to carry, needed to 
transport handguns outside one's home or maybe place of business) on a
discretionary basis, but may NOT (under Mass General Law) revoke the FID
(Firearms Identification Card - allows one to buy rifles & shotguns, or 
posess hadnguns at home) unless you commit an offense which would have
disqualified you from obtaining the card in teh first place (having a 
restraining order agianst you is NOT a disqualifying reason under Mass
Gen's Law).  This makes me wonder how the police are going to effect the
confiscation of guns, since the owners may still hold an FID card.  It
will be interesting to see if the Boston PD complies with the law which
requires them to turn guns confiscated for "permit revocation" reasons 
over to a designated (and properly licensed) party chosen by the owner
of the guns.

I'm not trying to trivilaize the matter of domestic violence, however, the
courts have a history of "erring on the side of caution" when issuing 
restraining orders in divorce/separation cases (since, unlike jail, the
court does not consider it a "hardship" for someone to have a restraining
order against them).  There have also been reports of cases where one 
spouse uses the "restraining order" technique to gain tactical advantage
(ie, take full posession of the house by banning the other party from it).

Effectively, they've just given ANYONE (male or female) romantically or
domestically involved with another person veto power over that person's 
gun rights.

Oh yeah - it's not a criminal offense, or even a violation, to have
a restraining order against you (it is a criminal offense to violate
one though).



Rob Boudrie
rboudrie@chpc.org
From: lvc@cbvox1.att.com (Lawrence V Cipriani)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: White Feather, Inc.
Date: 21 Jul 92 17:51:07 GMT
Organization: Ideology Busters, Inc.

None other than Carlos Hathcock was signing copies of "Marine
Sniper" at the OGCA gun show in Cleveland this weekend.  He
also had business cards with the following information.

White Feather Inc.
Jo Hathcock, President
GYSGT C. N. Hathcock II, U.S.M.C. (Ret.)
Sniper Consultant/Instructor
Phone 804-499-6659

He offers an intensive two week sniper course for police and
military only, as well as shorter courses for civilians.  He
will travel to your location.
--
In case you haven't heard, Hathchock is striken with MS.  It
was really sad to see someone, once in the top of their field,
hurt so much.  He seems to be in good spirits and likes to keep
busy training new shooters and traveling around the country.
-- 
Larry Cipriani, att!cbvox1!lvc or lvc@cbvox1.att.com
From: cramer@optilink.com (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: $5000 Shopping Spree
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:33:53 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA


In article <9207211127.AA12411@mimsy.cs.UMD.EDU>, C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob) writes:
# Guns magazine is currently running a contest in which the grand prize
# is a $5000 firearms shopping spree.  I thought this would be an interesting
# subject here.
# 
# If you had $5000 to spend on firearms and/or accessories, what would
# you buy?
# 
# Rob

Barrett Light .50.  No question.  You never know when blue whales
will come back on land, or _Jurassic Park_ will cease to be fiction.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
"Well, maybe the Holocaust was right *for that culture*." -- a moral relativist
with whom I work.
From: andy@sail.stanford.edu (Andy Freeman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: grab-and-run
Date: 29 Jul 92 11:51:57 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department,  Stanford University.

#I saw a news program recently about that problem. The commentator said the
#car rental agencies at the Miami airport had removed the identifing decals
#from their cars because their customers were being cased as 'out-of-towners' 
#and better hits.

In Florida, all rental cars have distinctive license plates.  (I think
the tag "number" always starts with "Y".)  That isn't changing.

While tourists may not know this, everyone else does.

-andy
--
UUCP:    {arpa gateways, sun, decwrl, uunet, rutgers}!cs.stanford.edu!andy
ARPA:    andy@cs.stanford.edu
From: pnr0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (PAUL N. RITTER)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Shooting in Dumps (was: Disconnector Malfunctions)
Date: 25 Jul 92 13:12:10 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

In article <9207220342.AA14667@gtephx.com>, forda@gtephx.UUCP (Andrew Ford @ AGC
S, Phoenix, Arizona) writes:
#In article <58989@mimsy.umd.edu>, gmk@falstaff.MAE.CWRU.EDU (Geoff Kotzar) writ
es:
## The tires, these stand about 5 feet tall, are very effective at stopping
## bullets. On diametral shots, the only bullets that will penetrate fully
## both sets of treads are Nosler Partition, of the soft points, or the
## more energetic FMJ's. The 7.62x39 and the .223 FMJ's will not do it. You
## can pick them up off the ground in the center.
##
## Since these are off-road construction tires, they are of a very soft
## composition and that may account for the lack of ricochets. Come to think
## of it I don't remember seeing any bullets lying up range of the tires like
## I used to with the older back stop materials, but there are a lot of bullets
## sticking in only to their bases.
##
#
#Hmmmm, wouldn't the base of a bullet be a pretty good surface for a
#ricochet?
#
#Wouldn't it only be a matter of time before a bullet strikes one of those
#bullets "sticking in only to their bases?"
#
#I wouldn't want to be around at that particular time.
#

     What about steel belted tires? Wouldn't they give enough "spring" action
     enough to send a bullet back at you?
From: markc@hpcvxjme.cv.hp.com (Mark Cook)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: An embarrassing question...
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:53:37 GMT
Organization: UTD-CV Corvallis, OR

In article <3752@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>, dcwst8+@pitt.edu (David C Winters) writes:
# 
# What is/are the primary name(s) for the semi-auto only, civilian
# version of the M14??
# 
# I _know_ that I should know this, so I'm now hiding my head in shame...

I imagine Springfield Armory produces something like what you're
describing.  However, the first weapon that leaped to mind for me
was the Ruger Mini-14.  Is that what you meant?

# RE: my mistakenly describing the AC-130H Spectre instead of the AC-47D
# Dragon Ship:  Ooops.     Which was the gunship that they called
# "Spooky?"  Was that the Spectre?

Ah,... no.  "Spooky" was the radio call sign for the AC-47D.  Given
the ROF of the 3 miniguns carried aboard, plus the fact that the
aircraft carried 15-18 thousand additional rounds for the guns (in
addition to the 1,500 already in each magazine), the Dragon Ship could
deliver a combined rate of fire on target of 18,000 rounds per minute.
This is why it was given the "Spooky" call sign.

BTW, I mis-spoke when I cited the "Arsenal of Democracy-III" as having
a 1977 print date.  That was the *original* print date.  My copy is
actually dated 1984.  (There are probably even newer versions out.)

Later,

        Mark F. Cook

USMail: Hewlett-Packard
        User Interface Technology Division - Corvallis (Tech. Marketing)
        1000 NE Circle Blvd.  Corvallis, OR 97330

INTERNET: markc@hpcvss.cv.hp.com
          markc%hpcvss.cv.hp.com@relay.hp.com
From: randy@tigercat.den.mmc.com (Randy Stafford)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Arguments FOR bearing arms
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:36:36 GMT
Organization: Martin Marietta Astronautics Group

Hello rec.guns,

I am new to this group.

I am considering acquiring a handgun for protecting my home and family.
There have been several recent incidents that have given me motivation to
do so, including prank phone calls to my wife while I was away on business,
suspicious cars in the neighborhood, media and acquaintences' accounts of
local break-ins/assualts/rapes, and a dispute with a former day-care
provider who has a felony record.

I am comfortable with the notion of owning and using firearms, having grown
up with and used my father's guns (pistols and rifles, but not shotguns or
assault weapons).  Unfortunately, my wife has objections and I want to 
convince her that bearing arms is necessary, safe, and comforting.

Can anyone in this group direct me to any literature, preferably research
results, that documents statistics such as: the percentage of break-ins in
which the intruder carries a firearm; the percentage of cases in which an
intruder has been successfully repelled due to the presence of defensive
firearms, and the percentage of cases in which firearms kept in homes have
caused accidental injuries (relative to the number of homes in which firearms
are kept).

This information would go a long way toward helping me to bring my
wife around to my point of view.

In addition, I would appreciate advice on good handguns/good ammunition to
select for home defense, as well as licensing/safety training information
(specifically for Colorado).

E-mail responses are preferred; if the volume of the responses is great
enough, and if requested to do so, I would be happy to post a summary.

Thanks in advance.

-- 
|===========================================================================|
| from:  Randy Stafford               |  Martin Marietta Astronautics Group |
| mail:  randy@tigercat.den.mmc.com   |  Denver, Colorado                   |
| voice: (303) 977-1069               |  The foregoing opinions are mine    |
| fax:   (303) 977-2326               |  and not necessarily my employer's. |
|---------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Words dissemble, words be quick, words resemble walking sticks.           |
| Plant them and they will grow; watch them waver so.                       |
| I'll always be a word man - better than a bird man.        --Jim Morrison |
|===========================================================================|

[MODERATOR:  Folks, I'm posting Randy's request for info here, but I think
some responses have the potential for sounding like "stuff" which we have
traditionally posted over in t.p.g.   How about posting responses to him off
line, or at least over in t.p.g.    Perhaps we can get Randy, in turn, to
collect and summarize what comes in for our use here later.]
From: acw@sbmsg1.UUCP (Alvin White)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Ricochets
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:54:10 GMT
Organization: Southern Bell - MSG  Atlanta, Ga

In article <199207220427.AA74433@ns1.CC.Lehigh.EDU> pnr0@ns1.cc.lehigh.
edu (PAUL N. RITTER) writes:
# BTW, since I posted the article about the BB hit in the nasal opening, I
# neglected to say that the BB is still there. A few years ago I went to 
#England and it set off the metal detector in BOTH airports. Try and 
#explain THAT to their security! I must admit that the security in 
#England were MUCH more relaxed than here. Here, weapons were drawn and 
#I was carted away. Not too cool.
                                                             
Weapons were drawn and you were carted away because you set off the
metal detector!!!?  I think that there must be A LOT more to this
story. I have been through airport metal detectors in probably 15
airports with much more metal than a BB and the only detector I didn't
get through was at Logan in Boston.  I never cleared that one.  I
emptied my pockets and finally was searched by an individual with a
hand held detector but there no weapons drawn or even any concern
shown.  What airport were you in when you generated that much concern
over a metal detector alarm?

Alvin White
From: raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Clip ejecting noise of M1 Garand
Date: 28 Jul 92 20:39:05 GMT


In <9207231930.AA03331@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu> I asked:
#So, anyone wished to claim having hear that "twinggggg!" from the other
#side?

And several netters claimed indeed to have heard the "twinggggg!" on
firing ranges some distances from the M1. In particular, one of them
claimed what he heard was this:
#I'm talking about the sound made by the clip itself ringing as it
#flies through the air_after_ the shot sound is over.
and from
#about 50-100 feet away
He also claimed that was not the sound of the clip hitting the
ground, which if included would make it sound like
"twwiiinnnnnnggg-clank".

So can any M1 users tell us their own experience?
From: cbl@uihepa.hep.uiuc.edu (Chris Luchini)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Gun List
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:10:13 GMT
Organization: High Energy Physics, University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign

In article <MARCEL.92Jul29152919@hpindvm.cupnews0>, marcel@hpindvm.cupnews0 (Marcel Burlet) writes:
#
#Hi:
#
#Does anyone out there have a source for "Gun List"?; Or for that

	Gun List
	1-800 258 0920
-Chris L
*1110 W. Green/Urbana IL 61801/217-333-0505/cbl@uihepa.hep.uiuc.edu 
* Remember, only mere mortals need sleep!
From: bobv@spike.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Bob von Buelow)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Clip ejecting noise of M1 Garand
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:10:04 GMT
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA

In article <1992Jul29.231008.5686@amc.com> reb@amc.com (Bob Brunjes) writes:
#In article <9207281914.AA04100@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu> raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man) writes:
##
##So can any M1 users tell us their own experience?
##
#bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-twinggggggg-plop
#
#[MODERATOR: Actually my last outing sounded more like
#	``bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-click-SH*T....''

I remember

bang-bang-twingggg-clack-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-bang-twinggg-plop

ah, the memories.  1000 yds with open sights.  rolling over and watching the
wake of the bullet in the spotting scope as it goes down range.  The smell of
burned cordite and carbide lamps.  the mosquito's in Beaumont, TX that were
so big they were required to file flight plans.  The dawn mist rising at
Camp Bullis, TX.

I was just a sharpshooter, but as one of my teammates said, "We can all
shoot X's, some just shoot more than others".

Best memory: winning a 300 yd rapid fire course, over all the masters 
Worst memory:  having my front sight fall off when they called "ready on the
right!"

Bob, 1968 Lackland AFB High Power Rifle Team

--
Bob von Buelow             Mars Observer Planning and Sequencing Element
bobv@quarky.jpl.nasa.gov         - standard disclaimers apply -
From: wilkin@lclark.edu (Brad Wilkin)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Colt 45 repair - options
Date: 28 Jul 92 21:41:51 GMT



I recently acquired my grandfather's Colt 45, Model 1911 pistol and was
getting all excited about going out to shoot it when I realized while
cleaning it that the slide is has a rather formidable crack in it.  The
fracture is 1/4 - 3/8" long extending down an interior ridge at the front
of the opening on top where the shell ejects (sorry, I don't know the
technical term for this, still very much a novice...).

I am wondering whether this sort of fracture is mendable and, if so, is
it a good idea?  Do I have other options without doing extensive
modifications to the gun?  One resource has told me it is unlikely that I
can get a replacement slide from Colt.  Is this accurate?  Another
potential obstacle is that the gun is army green, not black.  Is it likely
that I can get such replacement parts?

My interest in fixing up the gun is predominantly sentimental.  It was a
favorite of my grandfather's.  BUT, I really want to SHOOT it, not just
look at it.  :)  Any help you can give me is very much appreciated,

AdvTHANKSance,


Brad

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brad Wilkin                                 Lewis & Clark College
Systems Development Coordinator             Computing Services
UUCP: tektronix!reed!lclark!wilkin          Internet: wilkin@lclark.edu
From: lizard@hermes.chpc.utexas.edu (Tom Linsley)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: revolver handling
Date: 28 Jul 92 20:38:19 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas System CHPC

In article <1992Jul27.172938.3975@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>, tjohnson@xenon.stanford.edu (Ted C. Johnson) writes:
# 
# Is it necessary/advisable to keep an empty chamber under the hammer
# for modern revolvers (e.g., Ruger GP-100)?  Or is this just something
# that was required "in the old days", before revolvers were designed
# better?

Revolvers of modern design incorporate hammer blocks or transfer bars which
reduce the probability of an accidental discharge due to a blow on the hammer
to near zero.  I suspect that such safety mechanisms were developed as a
result of earlier mishaps involving revolvers such as the beautiful Colt
Peacemakers, which were always carried with the hammer on an empty chamber,
or (for the more adventuresome) with the firing-ping riding in a notch filed
into the back of the cylinder in the space between two adjacent chambers.

I would have no compunctions about carrying a GP-100 with all chambers
loaded.  However, if a revolver is a "house gun" which is kept constantly
loaded, the admonition about keeping an empty chamber under the hammer
should still be observed as a safety precaution in the event of a fire.
One hates even to consider such things, but cartridges can discharge as
a result of the heat, and if a round is in the chamber under the hammer,
it can fire through the barrel just as if the trigger had been pulled.
The explosion of rounds not in line with the barrel will merely blow the
gun apart, posing relatively little risk to firefighters and neighbours.

Regards,

Tom

-- 
Tom Linsley              tom@sparta.bus.utexas.edu  :  NRA  ILA  TSRA
College of Business Administration Computer Center  :  NFA     CCRKBA
The University of Texas, Austin, Texas 78712   USA  :  (512) 471-5446
From: baechler@lia.di.epfl.ch (Emmanuel Baechler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Sig P220 vs. Glock 21
Date: 25 Jul 92 00:29:29 GMT

# In article <fP4ayK2@quack.sac.ca.us> bweaver@quack.sac.ca.us (Brian Weaver) writes:
# #baechler@lia.di.epfl.ch (Emmanuel Baechler) writes:
# #
# ##The glock has  a double column magazine, with 13 shots and no safety nor any
# ##decocker. The Sig has a single column magazine with 7 shots and a frame mounted
# ##decocker. I tried a Glock in .45 twice and they were definitely excellent. All
# ##the .45 Sigs that I tried wre also excellent.
# #
# #  Well, since the Glock is never cocked until you pull the trigger, 
# #  it does not need a decocker lever. This is fine by me since I like
# #  simplicity and reliability.

You misunderstood me. I never said that the Glock should have a decocker. I
simply descrbibed the differences between the two types of mechanisms. I also
did not judge these two mechanisms comparatively. I simply said that I prefer
a thinner gun for concealed carry. Personally, I also perfer auto pistols which
have any form of external safety, except for the HK P7M13 with wich I feel very
safe. Thas's however not a claim agains the glock. It's simply the expression
of a personal preference.



-- 
Emmanuel Baechler.                        | Tel.: ++41-21-693-2732
Laboratoire d'Intelligence Artificielle   | e-mail: baechler@lia.di.epfl.ch
Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne  |     or: baechler@liasun6.epfl.ch
MA-Ecublens                               | Standard Disclaimer
CH-1015 Lausanne	Switzerland

Ban the bomb. Save the world for conventional warfare.