HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: IO81409@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: "Giving up" Marriage
Date: 18 Aug 92 02:26:07 GMT
 <1992Aug12.165850.29867@midway.uchicago.edu> <36790@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>
 <1992Aug13.110602.15017@news.acns.nwu.edu>
Organization: University of Maine System

the statement that marriage is a necessity if you haev kids is
total bullshit.  my daughter is five and a half.  i was married for
(effectively) about a year and a half of her total lifetime.  i
noticed no difference in ease of raising her between marriage
and cohabitation, and actually found raising her much easier
living alone than while living with my spouse.

what about MARRIAGE, as opposed to COHABITATION, is supposed
to be so necessary to childrearing?

i think marriage as a state-sponsored concern shoudl be
abolished, as it is a personal matter between individuals.
just getting the same christian model extended to gay people
is insufficient.  what if you don't want to be married, but
rather handfasted for a year and a day?  why shoudl that be
unofficial and unrecognized while someone else's marriage
till death do us part gets all the tax breaks?  why can't
elf marry both of his spice?  (old joke: the plural of
spouse is spice.)  why shoudl one have to pay the state for
permission to get married, and then pay again, through the
nose, to get unmarried?

get government out of the relationship business!

                                    -ailsa
Xref: sparky soc.bi:11011 alt.polyamory:959
From: jbl@mesaadm.cre.nt.com (JB)
Newsgroups: soc.bi,alt.polyamory
Subject: Re: alt.personals and enforced monogamy
Date: 19 Aug 92 14:57:00 GMT
     <1992Aug18.132217.17592@bcrka451.bnr.ca> <36981@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>
     <whitlock.72.0@vaxb.gbus.virginia.edu>
Organization: NT/BNR
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1b3

In article <36981@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> John Clark, jclark@sdcc3.ucsd.edu
writes:
>One of these days even in SD I expect there will be sections like,
>men looking for other romantic men, couples looking for romantic
>others, women looking for other romantic women, etc.
>
>But then you'd knock the bottom out of the 'swinger mags'.
>
>And for the bible belt, I did see an ad in local Atlanta news,
>Older couple, 50's, looking for young male for friendship. (Or something
>to that effect).

Our local mag with personals has sections Men Seeking Women and vice
versa, and Other Personals.  This sections includes married people openly
seeking diversions, gays, and couples seeking.  Although there was a fury
of letters to the editor, the mag stands by its policy.  Their
corresponding "ask Esther" even set up three different singles meets,
hetero, femme-femme, and male-male.  And all this from the bible belt
yet!  There is hope.
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: ptd2@po.CWRU.Edu (Palmer T. Davis)
Subject: Re: Bisexuality and DEC PDP's... is there a link?
Reply-To: ptd2@po.CWRU.Edu (Palmer T. Davis)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 19:30:11 GMT


In a previous article, elf@halcyon.com (Elf Sternberg) says:
>In article <1992Aug11.202233.28951@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>
>     ptd2@po.CWRU.Edu (Palmer T. Davis) writes:
>
>>But S$=SYS(assorted magic arguments) is now all Linear B to me....)
>
>   You want scarier still?  I'm sure if I saw your SYS statement, I
>could probably tell you what you were doing; 

So could I, back then.  (Ou sont les hacks d'antan?)  Oh well, at least 
now I can honestly claim to have forgotten more than most MIS types will
ever learn, and actually not be exaggerating.  :-)

>I was writing _worms_ in Extended Basic.  

A couple friends of mine wrote a security system.  :-)  Friday nights were
our "free for all" nights; we had a scratch RK07 that we mounted in place
of the production volumes, and occupied ourselves with worms, JOBKIL wars,
crashing the system, and other assorted mindless adolescent amusements.
But getting the privilege bit was so trivial using nothing more than PIP
that I never saw much point to writing worms or suchlike.

>They were actually more efficient in EB than they were in Oregon Pascal!

Aha!  So there *was* a way to do SYS calls from Oregon Pascal!  I never
used our Pascal compiler until taking AP Computer Science junior year;
during spring vacation of sophomore year, our system administrator/
chemistry teacher abruptly left, and the guy who took over control of
the system promptly locked away all the documentation.  :-(  So we had
to rely on memory and what was available in HELP.  Since no one had
done any system development in anything other than Extended BASIC, we
were stuck using only that for any further system stuff.  After learning
about things like data structures and non-spaghetti code, I switched to
Pascal cold turkey and just wrote games.

Followups to comp.os.rsts.bi?  Or alt.folklore.computers?
-- 
Palmer T. Davis      ___
<ptd2@po.cwru.edu>   \X/   cthread.  cthread_fork().  Fork, thread, fork!
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: pclary@mushroom.csc.calpoly.edu (Ellen Clary)
Subject: Re: queer marriage - personal problem
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 17:27:24 GMT
Organization: Cal Poly, San Luis Obispo, CA - aka Barnum & Bailey

moselecw@elec.canterbury.ac.nz (C.W. Moseley) wrote...
>[mock marriage ceremony]
>I have tried to talk about this to `Q', but she is pretty determined.
>At least she isn't lying, but still is expressing pretty strong
>disappointment that I won't take part in the ceremony. And is trying
>to persuade me that I should take part. 

I know this is a terribly obvious thing to say but...
Remember that 'I don't want to' is really all the reason you
need for not doing something.  You shouldn't have to feel
bad for honouring your own ideals, especially since in this
case your actions will not hurt anyone else (no matter what
Q says).  She may be disappointed, but I think she can live
with it.

You say that you are interested in Q.  If I understood your
post correctly, then you are probably afraid that Q will
reject you if you don't take part in the mock ceremony.
I know this question will sting, but do you really want to be
with someone who would reject you on that basis?   You have
differing political views on this topic, but that shouldn't
necessarily mean that your potential relationship is over.
In a sense, your self-esteem is at stake here, would
you be happy with yourself if you took part in the ceremony 
just to please Q?  Or would you just resent Q for conning
you into such a thing?

Ellen
pclary@nike.calpoly.edu
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: kamal@specialix.co.uk (Kamal Mortoza)
Subject: Re: the "oh" experience
Organization: Specialix International, London
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 09:56:40 GMT

elf@halcyon.com (Omaha Sternberg) writes:

>   Not only that, but DeWolf and I have a SEPERATE relationship going as
>well. DeWolf is the only person I have found who can physically force me to
>be a bottom, as it were. I'm not the type to just fall to my knees when a
>top tells me to...she/he better have a damn good reason! Like physically
>forcing me to. DeWolf and I have a wonderful time doing this, and its
>something that Elf doesn't like that much(he's so DELICATE, giggle). Anyway,
>as Elf says, we can't really function well if we're always in on each
>other's sexual lives. It adds an air of mystery, trying to imagine what
>DeWolf might be doing to Elf right now.

But doesn't this air of mystery, with many people, turn into something
dark after a while, as they imagine their spouse in sexual situations with
a third party? For many - especially if the relationship hasn't matured in
terms of trust and dependability, it WILL play on their minds untill it
starts to become something destructive.

>   Hey, Elf chill out babe. I mean, after all, many times YOU presume to
>have the answer to everything.


>   Uh, no, I don't think that he, or many others for that matter, want your
>"rude, crude, and socially unacceptable blanket statement." on his marriage.
>Besides, aren't YOU the one lecturing him on making blanket statements about
>things? And as for security, if that's the way he and his wife want their
>relationship, then three cheers for them. They have every right to have it
>that way if its comfortable for them, just as having our relationship our
>way is right for us because its comfortable for us. Piglet, as I said in the
>other post, expirement, and find the relationship that's comfortable for
>you, not what everybody else THINKS is comfortable for you. After all,
>you're the only one who will really know. The only thing that asking
>opinions is good for is to try it out, then throw away if it doesn't work
>for you.

No argument here - your right ofcourse. Only piglet can experiment and find 
what's right for her. But it is a difficult path - finding lovers who will
have sympathetic attitudes to doing this. Most people have hangups, wether
they admit to them or not.

>   I can't stress this point enough...WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU IS WHAT YOU
>SHOULD DO...NOT WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE SAYS SHOULD BE DONE.


>   Omaha Sternberg
>-- 
>Elf Sternberg    __   |     I have looked into the abyss, and the abyss
>elf@halcyon.com  \/   | has looked into me.  Neither liked what we saw.
>elf@polari.online.com |                              - Brother Theodore
-- 


=============================================================================
			|
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Introduction
Date: 21 Aug 1992 10:21:44 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <44dpbn6f@cck.coventry.ac.uk> 
idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid) writes:
> In article <l959e3INN77i@mizar.usc.edu> 
> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
> >I swear this will be my last posting in this tedious thread.
>
> In that case you can reply to me by email.

I've decided to respond *out* of soc.motss, where this is
really little more than a flamefest.

Some background for those of you unfamiliar with this soc.motss
thread.  Someone suggested that the people who regularly post 
there should take the time to introduce themselves for the benefit 
of people who've just started reading the newsgroup.  He then
posted a long autobiographical article.  I replied rather nastily
and suggested that people new to the group should be forced to
catch up.  Then someone else said that this (the posting of 
introductory autobiographical essays by the regulars) was done
in various other groups, soc.bi among them.  

> >The soc.bi regulars periodically post introductory autobiographical
> >essays for the benefit of people who've just started reading the
> >newsgroup?  That, I remind you, is what I thought was ludicrous about 
> >the suggestion that began all this.  If people new to soc.motss would 
> >like to introduce themselves, or demuffinize themselves, that's great.  
> >But what are the people who've been here for some time supposed to do?
> >Post their bios monthly?  Quarterly?
>
> Hey now, hold on a minute... the soc.bi regulars?  People like me and
> Tim and Ciaran and Olaf and Sara and Ellen and Graham - I guess we're
> regular enough - "regularly post introductory autobiographical essays"?
> Well, not on the soc.bi that I read and write to we don't.  

I wouldn't have thought so.  

>  We do, now
> and then, mention in articles something that has happened to us in our
> lives, but it's rare - very rare - that anyone posts anything that
> could even begin to be considered autobiographical.  And, when they do,
> it's as an individual article, and nearly always done as a demuffining
> (or, more accurately, Invocation of the Welcome Wagon). 

And this is true of soc.motss.  I welcome these articles by 
the newcomers -- they're usually refreshingly honest and 
uncalculated and, that rare commodity, *interesting*.

[...]
> Actually, I don't think that it's such a ludicrous idea at all, if it
> were modified a little.  Posting these things is so wasteful; far
> better either to have a central site from which they could be FTPed,
> as with the GIFs on spdcc (heck, my life would be less bytes than my
> GIF), or mailed on request by the biographee.

Not a bad idea, actually, but I don't know how many people would
follow through.

Arne

Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: pmm7@ellis.uchicago.edu (peggy boucher murphy (you had to ask?))
Subject: Re: Hetero/bi/homophobia (Was: Lesbian denial)
Reply-To: pmm7@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:04:48 GMT

In article <55977@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> wattsman@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Chris Timmers) writes:
>
>Community? What community? Where in Indiana can a possibly-soon-to-be-
>declared bi like me go to meet other bis, conbfused or otherwise?

indiana?
<giggles...> <attempt at solemnity> wise queers escape
indiana asap.  or leave at every possible vacation.  ;)  

where to go, you ask?  <smug smirk>  why, chicago, of 
course!  

peg
-whose memories of trying to live as a queer in indiana
is *still* the stuff of nightmares... <shudder>

>Alright, who was supposed to buy the Jello???

as long as it isn't green....  ;) 

*****postscript***** 
indiana queers *please* do not flame me!  i haven't lived 
there in over 10 years (and don't miss it) and i truly 
hope it is better now!  

Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: johnf@uhheph.phys.hawaii.edu (John Flanagan)
Subject: Re: Gender difference?
Organization: University of Hawaii, Dept. of Physics & Astronomy
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 06:33:10 GMT

In article <24891@castle.ed.ac.uk> angi@festival.ed.ac.uk (Angi Lamb) writes:
>A less obvious gender difference occurred to me.  After i've been
>vaginally (mine that is) intimate with someone, I am physically aware of
>the penetration for up to 2-4 days afterwards.  I did a quick survey. 
>The women agreed.  The men hadn't heard of the lingering effects before
>and it didn't happen to them. 

Are you talking about when men aren't the receptive partner?  If so, 
that's odd.  I know that whenever I am the bottom for anal sex, I can
definitely still feel the penetration for a couple of days afterwards.
If I've just been fucked by someone I really like, I especially enjoy
still being able to feel them the next day whenever I sit down.  It
gives me a delicious intimacy to feel as though they are still with me
while I'm at the office or some other public place.  It's a secret,
private treat.

Now when I'm not the receptive partner, it is true that the physical
feeling doesn't last for very long.  There are other things that can
linger, such as the smell of my partner's cologne, or the smell and
feel of dried cum and astroglide on my skin, but of course these don't
last past the next shower.

>I got to wondering what emotional effects this could have.  I wonder if
>that explains why men (in general) find it easier to compartmentalise
>the different parts of their life than women do? If you can feel the
>physical effect of a lover days afterwards, thoughts of them are bound
>to surface more readily. 
>
>Any comments?

I _think_ I know what you are trying to say, but could you explain
more what you mean?

--John


-- 
John Flanagan                          ||
johnf@uhheph.phys.hawaii.edu           ||"Well, the orgasm was implied."
U. of Hawaii, Dept. of Physics & Astro.||                 -- Ken Jones.
2505 Correa Rd., Honolulu, HI 96822    ||
Xref: sparky soc.bi:10941 soc.motss:35516
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.bi,soc.motss
Subject: Re: queer brains?
Date: 18 Aug 1992 00:49:08 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <28@ravel.ati.com> duncan@ravel.ati.com (Jim Duncan) writes:

> ...  an elaborate documentary in three one-hour segments on
> their summer "Witness" series.  Presented was luxuriant, detailed
> research demonstrating that sexual orientation, indeed one's gender 
> outlook, was substantially a biological phenomenon having to do with a
> jillion interelated factors. Clearly, the presence of certain physical
> hardware configurations is just one of a huge variety of indicators
> that place a given individual on a seemingly infinite gender continuum.
> The point of the entire documentary is that there are endless gender
> outlook possibilities - all perfectly natural and primarily biological
> in origin!  ....

Heavens.  Any biological "hardware configurations" (please pay 
closer attention to your metaphors) that would go to explain
the gender outlooks/sexual orientations of: Gertrude Stein, 
J. Edgar Hoover, Christopher Isherwood, Pat Califia, Tallulah
Bankhead, Pol Plancon, Tobias Schneebaum, Roy Cohn, Catullus,
Eleanor Roosevelt, Jack Wrangler, and me would to be seem 
capable of explaining *anything*.  

Arne
From: chris@unicorn.resun.com (Chris Von Hendy)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: The War Between Us (Long)
Date: 19 Aug 92 22:02:21 GMT
Reply-To: chris@unicorn.resun.com
Organization: Metalogic, S.a r.l.
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v3


In article <AAG.92Aug12232938@artemis.aber.ac.uk> (soc.bi), aag@aber.ac.uk (Angela Gilham) writes:
> So surprise us! Gaylaxicon is in Chicago next year, and there are
> people on this side of the Atlantic pondering holidays in the US
> next year, with Gaylaxicon as one of the points of reference ;-)
> 

Could someone send me information on getting to Gaylaxicon?  After all
Chicago is on my wish list for a trip.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Von Hendy            "If we shadows have offended,
Escondido, California       Think but this, and all is mended,
ncr-sd!blkhole!chris  or    That you have but slumbered here,
chris@unicorn.resun.com     While these visions did appear." Puck
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: My Impending Hiatus
From: dsolis@koko.csustan.edu (Djelrik Solis)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 10:26:32 GMT
Organization: CSU Stanislaus


	"My Impending Hiatus" sound too much like something in need of a
good erection cream.  But enough of that.

	I may not exist for several days, in the next few weeks, because
we are moving, and I may not have email access for a few days.  

	In my nonexistent state (which won't really be a state at all), you
(anyone) should feel free to post appropriately bizarre stuff to soc.bi
using my name in the "From:" line.  This will help, enormously, to create
an image of being and participating which, in this reality, typically does
not identify me.  Nevertheless, it may be amusing upon my return to this
existence, so don't be timid.  

	And for those of you who *absolutely must* have some reference here
to things bi,

	When I was 11, my best friend (boy) and I would take turns pretending
to be the girl that the other liked, while we were nude and with the lights
off.  Quite fun, that :)

_____________________________________________________________________________
Djelrik Solis

fishheads, fishheads, roley poley fishheads
fishheads, fishheads, eat them up, YUM!

	(just for you, Porsupah!)
From: bethan@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Bethan Davies)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: hot bi babes
Date: 16 Aug 92 16:02:26 GMT
Followup-To: soc.bi
Distribution: soc.bi
Organization: Centre for Cognitive Science, Edinburgh, UK

In article <1992Aug14.234330.28719@midway.uchicago.edu> pmm7@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <10296@scott.ed.ac.uk> bethan@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Bethan Davies) writes:
>>With the ex-SO its fine as long as I don't
>>_talk_ about it, and behave like the het female he thought I was (ha!).
>>This probably involves not wearing lycra and Doc Martens - Fat Chance!
>
>doc martens, yeah, but...
>straight women don't wear lycra?!?!?!?!?!
><peg stops to think>
>does this mean that all the women i see wearing lycra 
>are queers?!?!?!?! <note the evil light in peg's eyes...>
>

Hmmm... nice thought, but I think it involves wearing both _at the same
time_ .... and I _was_ thinking of a very particular pair of lycra
leggings when I posted that <grin>. They're...umm... *impressive*.
The ex-SO (Ted) gave me a 'you don't _seriously_ expect me to walk
around with you in _public_ when you're wearing that' look. I did.
He suffered.

>
>peg
>-who's off to women's workout world...
>>;->

And was this for exercising the body or the mind....<evil grin>


                         Bethan
From: asuccop@milton.u.washington.edu (Annemarie Succop)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: the "oh" experience
Date: 20 Aug 92 22:15:53 GMT
Organization: University of Washington

elf@halcyon.com (Omaha Sternberg) writes:

> So when Elf spends time with his lovers, all I
>imagine is the scenes they might be doing.

	I've never heard anyone else say this.  I remember once when I
	was (emotionally/physically) broken up w/my former honey, I was
	*very* jealous of his bf, & used to get really really upset at the
	thought of them sleeping together.  Then something happened & I made
	up w/the former honey & we were considering becoming lovers again
	& suddenly, the thought of them together was very very charged in
	an erotic way.  What was both neat & disturbing was that in both
	the 'jealous' and the 'eroticised' situations, I had basically
	the same feelings of agitation/arousal, just with different
	frames/words/feelings attached.

	Just a neat observation...

	Annemarie
	asuccop@u.washington.edu

>                                 Omaha

>-- 
>Elf Sternberg    __   |     I have looked into the abyss, and the abyss
>elf@halcyon.com  \/   | has looked into me.  Neither liked what we saw.
>elf@polari.online.com |                              - Brother Theodore
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: jclark@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (John Clark)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Iverson Notation (was: The War Between Us (Long))
Keywords: Just a harmless little old survey...
Date: 13 Aug 92 03:27:34 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego

In article <BswCCy.Kr7@news.larc.nasa.gov> kludge@grissom.larc.nasa.gov ( Scott Dorsey) writes:
+In article <5709@m1.cs.man.ac.uk> dente@els.ee.man.ac.uk (Colin Dente) writes:
+>
+>So Scott, do you fancy a trip to Manchester to try out out 11/750?
+
+No, I'd rather use a bed, thank you.

Isn't that a bit direct..
-- 

John Clark
jclark@ucsd.edu
From: chris@unicorn.resun.com (Chris Von Hendy)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Iverson Notation (was: The War Between Us (Long))
Date: 19 Aug 92 22:02:30 GMT
Reply-To: chris@unicorn.resun.com
Organization: Metalogic, S.a r.l.
X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v3


In article <1992Aug13.043022.27363@midway.uchicago.edu> (soc.bi), pmm7@ellis.uchicago.edu (peggy boucher murphy (you had to ask?)) writes:
> 
> well, um, actually...
> way back when the only computers i knew were original
> apples amd apple 2's (i had no idea what to do with
> anything other than a pc sized machine, and barely that!)
> i dated (and later married) a devoted computer geek.  he
> worked on pdp 11 somethings.  it was hot, the computer 
> room was air conditioned...
> let's just say, kay, that you are *not* alone.  
> why do i always find myself in the kinky minority?  

Mmm, such memories this brings back.  Cold computer rooms can make for
rather hot sex.

Chris (who is now trying hard to drag her mind back to the present)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Von Hendy            "If we shadows have offended,
Escondido, California       Think but this, and all is mended,
ncr-sd!blkhole!chris  or    That you have but slumbered here,
chris@unicorn.resun.com     While these visions did appear." Puck
Newsgroups: soc.bi