HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mark@fenris.albany.edu (Mark Steinberger)
Subject: Re: On Polish and Jewish nationalism
Organization: State University of New York at Albany
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 92 13:50:06 GMT

In article <1992Oct5.095857.12587@fuw.edu.pl> michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper) writes:

>>This despite the fact that the PLO and Hamas have these nasty habits of
>>killing random Israeli women, children and men, seemingly every chance
>>they get.

>Mark, and why do you think they do it?  For fun?  No Mark, they
>are fighting for the freedom of their country.

This doesn't wash.

Why were they murdering Jews in 1929, then?

No, there's something more going on. But it's too easy for you to
ignore it and substitute the rhetoric of liberation movements as if
that explains what is going on.

And fighting for freedom does not necessitate genocide of women and
children in any case. If you look at it, the Israeli response to these
murders has been quite restrained. That is why such knee-jerk support
of the Palestinians and their terrorism is so repulsive and looks so
much like personal hatred for some ethno-cultural group to which the
Israelis belong.


--Mark
Xref: sparky soc.culture.jewish:17142 soc.culture.polish:3011
From: michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: On Polish and Jewish nationalism
Date: 6 Oct 92 08:28:13 GMT
Organization: Warsaw University Physics Dept.

Danny Keren writes:

>Oh so touching. But how does firing Bazookas into schoolbuses etc help
>free "their country"? And why were they doing it before their
>country was occupied? And why did the "Islamic Jihad" recently 
>state that it will continue the struggle till "every Jew in the
>world is dead"?

I'm far from being fan of Islam, or the "Islamic Jihad".  Firing
schoolbuses is a disgusting crime.  The more if they were doing it
before their country was occupied.  Which does not change the fact
that actually Israel is the oppressor and the occupation of foreign
lands is always lawlessness.

+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|     My opinions are my opinions.   But facts are those of everyone.     |
+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+
|     Michal~ Szleper                |     "All you need is love, love,   |
|     (michals@fuw.edu.pl)           |      Love is all you need..."      |
+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+
From: silverm@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Jeff Silverman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: PLEASE! I need your help! Help me keep this love alive!
Date: 1 Oct 92 07:16:07 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle

Let me tell a little bit about my story, and you see if anything that has
happened to me strikes a chord with you.

My grandparents felt much the way your lady's parents feel.  I married a woman
who had converted for ideological reasons.  My cousin married a man who did
not convert.  My grandparents came to my wedding.  They didn't go to hers,
although they did come to some of the other parties.  I should point out that
I live in Seattle and they live in Omaha.  We both had children.  The grand
parents come to visit from time to time.  They play with the great grand
children.  My wife and my grandfather argue religion.  My grandfather and
my cousin in law don't.  My grandfather and my cousin in law go fishing:
they both like that.  I go but I don't fish because, quite frankly, I don't
like to fish.

Life goes on.  Some days my wife and I argue vehemently.  Some days, we're
very close and and quiet.

One of the things I have learned from watching my wife struggle with concepts
like "ethical monotheism" (she used to be Catholic) is just how different
Judaism is from Christianity.  If you are going to convert simply because you
love this girl, then I would question your motivations.  Quite frankly, you
are contemplating embarking on a strenuous intellectual journey.
Let me pose the question a different way: how are you going to feel/respond
when your children are the victims of anti-semitism?

Think about it.

If you want to chat, I can be reached at silverman@ilvxd0.fteil.ca.boeing.com.

Jeff Silverman
Boeing
From: ckinberg@milton.u.washington.edu (Clare Kinberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Holocaust memorial destroyed in Berlin
Date: 29 Sep 92 19:01:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Sep29.190155.22306
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <1992Sep27.161326.1120@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> friedenb@boswell.egr.msu.edu (Gedaliah Friedenberg) writes:
>
>From the Detroit News/Free Press; Sunday, September 27, 1992:
>
>BERLIN -- A memorial to Jews killed in the Sachsenhausen Nazi 
>death camp was destroyed in a fire, police said Saturday.  
>They wouldn't rule out involvement by neo-Nazi elements, who
>have fire-bombed and stoned homes for foreign refugees 
>virtually every night for more than a month.
>
>
>Gedaliah Friedenberg
>-=-Department of Mechanical Engineering
>-=-Department of Metallurgy, Mechanics and Materials Science
>-=-Michigan State University
>
For those who didn't get the message in a previous posting, I want to
recommend checking out the daily postings from Debra Weber-Wulff
(dww@inf.fu-berlin.de) on soc.culture.german
Her daily "violence update" includes many incidents not reported in the US
press.
From: arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: PLEASE!  I need your help!  Help me keep this love alive!
Date: 2 Oct 92 03:17:22 GMT
	<1992Sep28.152040.14175@wam.umd.edu>
	<1992Oct1.130720.4695@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
Organization: USC/Information Sciences Institute
In-reply-to: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com's message of 1 Oct 92 13:07:20 GMT

In article <1992Oct1.130720.4695@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:
>
> In article <1992Sep28.152040.14175@wam.umd.edu> aap@wam.umd.edu
> (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) writes:
>
> >Parents do not own their children. Children are individuals, with their own 
> >life to live. Parents cannot stop them from living their lives. And, parents
> >cannot stop their kids from being happy based on some old tradition or tale.
> >I am sure that the basis for all the Jewish tradition is no more than the
> >search for happiness. So, be it.
>
> Mr. Webb
>
> If you're reading this newsgroup for followups to your article,  please
> understand that Alberto's post is _entirely_ in keeping wiht his usual
> rationalizations of his own break with Jewish tradition (and law) and in
> keeping with his sentiments about his own intermarriage.

I'm curious as to your reasons for believing that Mr. Pinkas's views on
love between Jews and non-Jews are any more a "rationalization" than are
your views on the same subject.

Or do you claim that your views on Jewish/non-Jewish relations can
somehow logically be proven correct, independent of the fact that you
have been indoctrinated from infancy into what you now (unsurprisingly,
considering) believe to be Jewish tradition?
--
Yigal Arens        "You'd think [Bush] was running for First Lady instead
USC/ISI            of for President."     Bill Clinton, commenting on GOP
arens@isi.edu      attacks on his wife.   LA Times, 8/20.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay)
Subject: TaNaKh via FTP?
Summary: Anyone know where I can get a machine-readable Bible?
Keywords: bible ftp tanakh
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 22:55:02 GMT


Does anyone know where I can get a machine-readable Bible (or portion
thereof) via anonymous FTP? Plain text files would be fine, but more
bells & whistles might also be nice. I'd prefer a Jewish translation,
but if you only know about Christian ones, tell me (I'll just read
with a grain of salt).

For that matter, a machine-readable Rashi to go with it might be
nice... ;-)

-- 
Andrew M. Solovay       "Work is the curse of the drinking class."
solovay@netcom.com			--Wilde

#include <disclaimer.h>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: The two days of R'H and the shofar on Shabbos.
Date: 1 Oct 92 20:58:29 GMT
Reply-To: weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener)
Organization: The Wistar Institute of Anatomy and Biology
In-reply-to: jgoldber@todah.chem.utoronto.ca (Joel Goldberg)

In article <1992Oct1.191423.22173@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, jgoldber@todah (Joel Goldberg) writes:
>  I'm still confused. In the time of the Sanhedrin, the day after Elul
>  29 was always kept as Rosh Hashana, whether or not it turned out to
>  be Elul 30 or Tishrei 1. If we are bound by minhag avoteinu, then we
>  should do the same thing.

Yes, but just what was the minhag?  It varied.  No melacha was done on
30 Elul, but the shofar was not blown, nor the musaf offered.  Exiles
kept 1 and 2 Tishrei, naturally, except sometimes it was 30 Elul and
1 Tishrei.  With the fixed calender, they made a fixed choice, namely
1 and 2 Tishrei.  And remember, our minhag today regarding two days
even in Israel is from exiles in Israel who would not rely on the local
heter for Shabbos shofar blowing.

>						    Is it not true
>  that our present Elul is 29 or 30 days according to the actual
>  lunar behaviour?

No.  Elul for now is always 29 days.  The only months with leap days
(ie, they are 29 or 30 days) are Cheshvan and Kislev.  Somewhere there
is a Jewish version of "30 days hath September"--don't ask me!
-- 
-Matthew P Wiener (weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: goldberg@techunix.technion.ac.il (Jacques Goldberg)
Subject: Re: Using vacation days for the Jewish Holidays
Organization: Technion, Israel Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 09:19:22 GMT

backon@vms.huji.ac.il writes:

>In Israel, the *whole year* is a vacation :-)

 and the *whole life* is a honeymoon :-)
 
 Yaaqov Goldberg
From: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: PLEASE!  I need your help!  Help me keep this love alive!
Date: 2 Oct 92 20:18:29 GMT
Organization: Johns Hopkins University CS Dept.

In article <1992Oct2.152611.20469@umbc3.umbc.edu> shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff) writes:
>The second reason may be more compelling, and is rooted in biology
>(e.g., Richard Dawkins "Selfish Gene") and anthropology (e.g., the
>cultural materialism of Marvin Harris).

It is a common misconception that because there are biological or
anthropological reasons for something, that these reasons therefore translate
into moral imperatives.  They do not.  There are sociobiological explanations
for prejudice and hatred too; surely you would not claim morality for them on
these grounds.
--
"the bogosity in a field equals the bogosity imported from related areas, plus
the bogosity generated internally, minus the bogosity expelled or otherwise
disposed of."  -- K. Eric Drexler

Ken Arromdee (UUCP: ....!jhunix!arromdee; BITNET: arromdee@jhuvm;
     INTERNET: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: Larry Israel <VSLARRY@WEIZMANN.WEIZMANN.AC.IL>
Subject:      Re: Using vacation days for the Jewish Holidays
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <Larry Israel <VSLARRY@WEIZMANN.WEIZMANN.AC.IL>>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 08:08:34 GMT

An amusing thing happened here at WEIZMANN several years ago. I am omitting
the name of the protagonist. He was a visiting Professor from America who was
giving a course here. He was planning to return to America at the end of the
school year, and was keeping two days holiday (at least as far as working
on the second day).

I was sitting in on a course, and just before Shavuous he announced that the
next class, scheduled on Isru Hag (the second day of Shavuous for him) would
be cancelled. He added that in America he had to cancel his classes because
of the Jewish Holidays, but never thought that that would happen to him
in Israel.
From: tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil (Tim Miller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: PLEASE!  I need your help!  Help me keep this love alive!
Date: 2 Oct 92 16:17:14 GMT
Organization: The Ohio State University

On Fri, 2 Oct 1992 15:49:40 GMT, aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) said:

 A> There is a vialble solution for this problem: To tear down all
 A> traditions that keep some people blind.

	...and there won't be a Jew left in the U.S. inside a century. 

	C'mon, let's all recite the statistics together..."3 generations
after intermarriage the children are lost to Judaism."

-- Cerebus <tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil>
"Word of the Day: Plew."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: eric <eschramm@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: Sukkahs in Boston?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 21:30:34 GMT



Greetings--I am going to be in Boston the first two days of Chol Hamoed 
Sukkos, staying in the Harvard area. Could someone please let me know
(via email) where the Harvard Sukkah will be?  Also, is the Milk Street
Cafe in Cambridge still open and under hashgacha?  What other kosher 
places to eat are in the area--and do they typically build Sukkahs? 
Thanks in advance for any info.

Eric Schramm (eschramm@magnus.ircc.ohio-state.edu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: norm@helix.nih.gov
Subject: Matt Rosenblatt.Where are you?
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <norm@helix.nih.gov>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 14:30:21 GMT

Today I came across the name of Matt Rosenblatt.  I am interested to know
if this is the Matt that resides in RAndallstown, Md. and davens at
Randallstown Shule.  Reply please!!
+--------------------------------------------------------+
   

   *    ***    ***   *   **
   *   *   *     *   **  *
   *   *   *     *   * * *   nison reuven b'R Shami
   *   *   *         *  **
   *    ***         **   *
   *  
   *   *  *   ***   ***   **  **
   *   ** *  *   *  * **  * ** *
   *   * **  *   *  ***   *    *
   *   *  *   ***   *  *  *    *

+---------------------------------------------------------+
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Using vacation days for the Jewish Holidays
Date: 1 Oct 92 08:54:52 GMT
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs

In <1992Sep30.210600.587@vms.huji.ac.il> backon@vms.huji.ac.il writes:

>In Israel, the *whole year* is a vacation :-)

The trouble is that you have to have your vacation at the office
(unless you're out waiting on line at another office).  While the
office does come equipped with coffee/tea and a telephone, there's
usually nowhere comforatable to sleep ...
-- 
/|/-\/-\       New signature will appear "acharai hachagim"
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@     
/ nysernet.org 			Jerusalem
From: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal)
Subject: Re: here we go again....
Organization: liver ---> spleen
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 13:41:49 GMT
Keywords: CAMERA PBS propoganda

In article <1992Oct05.135516.4687@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM>
nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:

>You had a monopoly on the media for the past 40 years. Is it too much
>if the Arabs side presented their case now?

Don't forget the banks.  Jews controlled all those, too.  We also
controlled all the bakeries, and swimming pool cleaning franchises.
-- 
Sam Saal      kingfish!saal OR saal@kingfish.att.com
	Vayiftach HaShem et Peah Ha`Aton
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: jgoldber@todah.chem.utoronto.ca (Joel Goldberg)
Subject: Re: meaning of Yom Kippur
Organization: University of Toronto Chemistry Department
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 15:17:51 GMT

In article <1992Oct05.223935.651385@locus.com> hayim@locus.com (Hayim Hendeles) writes:
>Although in general, the new-moon (or more precisely the Moled) signals
>the 1st of Tishri, there are some cases where the Talmudic Sages
>instituted a practice of postponing Rosh Hashana (aka 1st of Tishrei).
>
>These practices were instituted by the Talmudic Sages. Yet, to my
>knowledge, *all* Jews observe Yom Kippur on the same day. (At least
>those Jews who observe Yom Kippur.) For one who accepts the authority
>of the Talmud, the Talmud itself discusses the validity of these
>practices. However, for those who do not accept the authority of
>the Talmud as binding, it seems inconsistent (to me, at least) to
>accept the Talmud in regards to the calendar. Why don't they observe
>Yom Kippur on the mathematically determined day?
   Because causing a split in clal yisrael is an ethical
   transgression!!
From: krulwich@zowie.ils.nwu.edu (Bruce Krulwich)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: A thought about Yom Kippur
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:23:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: zowie.KRULWICH.92Oct5132332
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences, Evanston, IL


[Please e-mail any comments to me, as I don't read SCJ these days.]

The following thoughts are adapted from memory of a drosha given by Rabbi
Ahron Levitansky on Neilas HaChag [the closing of the holiday] of Pesach
[Passover] in 1990.  All mistakes are mine.  Hopefully people will see it
before the start of Yom Kippur, but it will also be relevant afterwards.

The name of the closing service of Yom Kippur (which is also discussed in
regard to other holidays) is "Neila," which means "closing."  As we say in
the service, the Shaarei Shamayim [gates of heaven, roughly] are closing and
we use the Neila service as our "last ditch effort" to repent before Yom
Kippur ends and our judgement for the past year is sealed.

What can we learn from the name of the Neila service?  The word Neila is not
the regular way to say closing, which would be Segura.  What can we learn
from the use of the more obscure word?

Consider a very common word which is of the same root, the word "naalayim,"
which means "shoes."  There is a unique aspect of the closing of shoes.
When shoes are sitting on your floor, or in general are not being worn, they
are not kept closed, they are kept unlaced, unbuckled, or in general, open.
The only time that shoes are closed is when they are being worn, when the
wearer wants to take them with him or her.

The same is true about the Neila service.  The Shaarei Shamayim are closing,
the day of repentance is ending, and we are making our final declarations of
teshuvah [repentance].  When the service is over, when Yom Kippur has ended,
we don't just close the book and put away our repentance until next year.
Rather, we want to take our teshuvah with us, after Yom Kippur, back into
the rest of the year.  Only by doing this can our teshuvah and tefila
[prayer] from Yom Kippur truly have an effect on our lives.  Only by taking
our teshuvah with us can the Yom Kippur service have meant anything.

At the end of Neila, after a day of fasting and praying and repenting, after
the Shaarei Shamayim have closed, take some time (maybe while eating) to
consider the aspects of your teshuvah that you can take with you into the
rest of the year.  The teshuvah of the Neila service is not meant to be
closed off after the holiday, rather, like shoes, to be taken with us into
the rest of the year.

G'mar Chasima Tova, and Tzum Kal,

Dov (Bruce) Krulwich
From: waldo@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Todd J. Dicker)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Help me keep this love alive...
Date: 3 Oct 92 17:30:20 GMT
Organization: Cybernet BBS, Boca Raton, Florida

I reject your notion that religion is what is keeping people apart.  I 
agree with Professor Norman Roth of the Department of Hebrew and Semitic 
Studies, University of Wisconsin, who insists that Judaism is not a 
religion, it is a culture.  It has a common religion, to be sure, but 
there is so much more that distinguishes Judaism as a culture.  When we 
express concern over intermarriage, it is for fear of losing our culture. 
Intermarriage cannot preserve this culture, and in fact destroys it.

Todd (A Jew-dating kinda guy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: bferguso@techbook.com (Robert Ferguson)
Subject: Rabbinical Literature
Organization: TECHbooks of Beaverton Oregon - Public Access Unix
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 23:53:05 GMT

Can anyone help me with some questions I have about Rabbinical Literature?
I read a few encyclopedia articles and want to make sure I have a clear
understanding of what the differences in the literature are. I would also
like to know what editions are currently in print.
The oral traditions/laws (Halachah) were written down and were called the
Mishna. Interpretations (or commentary) on the Mishna are called Gemara;
which together with the Mishna make up the Talmud. Is this correct? Due to
ambiguities in the articles I read, my understanding (or lack thereof) this
may seem like a repetitive question, but when you buy the Talmud, are you
getting the Mishna with the Gemara? or the Gemara only?
The Midrash is (quoting from the article), "...the elaboration of law
(Halachah) and a technique of preaching (Haggadah)...a literary compilation
of Midrashic material." Is this "compilation" the same material as the 
Talmud, or is it something else?
What are the differences between the Palestinian/Jerusalem Talmud and the
Babylonian? The information I read said the Babylonian waas later and more
authoritative, is there anything else?
I am aware of several english versions of the Talmud; one edited by 
Isidore Epstein, The Babylonian Talmud, 18 vols. (1961), is this still in
print? Also, a current one by Rabbi Adin Steinsaltz, which according to a
description I have seen is in 5 vols. (I assume this is a work in progress)
how long to completion? is this the Babylonian? Are there any other english
editions available? Is there any site on the Internet accessible via Telnet,
with an electronic version of the Talmud?
Does anyone know of any good resources for buying Jewish/Rabbinical
literature through the mail? espeacially ones with used editions?
What other literature is profitable for background information in Judaism,
biblical history (OT, NT), eschatology, theology, etc etc etc, from the
Jewish viewpoint?
To all who reply, thank you in advance, your help is greatly appreciated.

-- 
Internet bferguso@techbook.com | "Man that is born of a woman is of few
GEnie    b.ferguson8           | days, and full of trouble," Job 14:1.
FIDOnet  1:105/369             | What the heck! "don't worry, be happy"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: shdan@tudorct.com (Dan Shimoff)
Subject: Re: Hazzanut (was Re: Synagogue Financing)
Organization: Tudor Investment Corporation, CT
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 13:47:53 GMT

>>words of the tefila?
>   When I was growing up, it was "Baruch shenatan, shenatan torah." Now
>   it's "Baruch shenatan torah, torah." Everyone should recognise this
>   very standard melody, which has always had a repetition in it. I've
>   never heard anyone use "Baruch shenatan tora-a-a-ah."

One who says Torah, Torah is doing in the custom of "Meenus" and it should
be frowned upon.  If the Hazzan says this, we stop him immediately and 
replace him.  :-)


-- 
Dan Shimoff           
Phone: (212) 602-6798  
Address: shdan@tudor.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: goldberg@techunix.technion.ac.il (Jacques Goldberg)
Subject: Re: "SALEM" (Peace) means "MURDER"
Organization: Technion, Israel Institute of Technology
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 07:12:32 GMT

ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich) writes:

>The police arested 3 Israeli citizens of the Arabian farm SALEM
>( means: Peace).
>Yesterday morning they drove the car they stole to their neighbour
>Farm GADISH  near Afula , on the edge of YIZREAEL valley.
>They arrived to the kindergardn but they realized that some adult are
>in the area, So they drove to the field of that farm. They found
>Abraham Cohen working in his sun-flower field 2 miles out of the farm.
>They shot him with their automatic guns.They were not so good sharp
>shooters so he Abraham was hitted by 2 bullets only: one entered  his
>neck the other his stomack.
>Abraham - 35 - was strong enough to pass the 2 miles distance to his
>farm. He was taking in a severe condition to the Afula hospital.

>Shalom    Gideon

     UPDATE: they had stolen their own car. 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish