Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Date:         Tue, 26 Jan 1993 09:59:38 CST
From:         Paul Heroy <HEROY@LSUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      the The/borrowing/labels/alternative

First, thanks to the various folks who chipped in with information on the The
after my posting which erroneously called it "Johnny Marr's band".

>From:         Jeff Beer <ujwb@UXA.ECN.BGU.EDU>
>Subject:      Re: Take-home exam
>
>The thing about Schittke's statement that what he has  been talking
>about is as old as the sun.  Bartok, Stravinsky, Ives have all drawn on
>folk source material.  Mahler too, I believe.  You probably could go
>further back, but my music history is not so hot there. Duke Ellington would
>have his Far East Suites, Latin America Suites, Afro Eurasian Eclipse
>and the Nutcracker.

Mozart had a composition or two based on Gypsy tunes, and I'm sure he used
other prosaic musical forms of the day as inspiration. I bet our resident
early music maven could tell us even more. This begs the question of whether
borrowing did ever *not* exist. If you go back to the proverbial cave-persons
:-) sitting around the campfire banging sticks and rocks, nature itself must
become an inspiration (have we come full circle with some of the New Age
stuff?). That reminds me of something someone said on Jazz-l about hearing the
music of ??? (Ornette, Zorn, Zappa, someone like that) and that it made him
see and hear music in everyday places and things he never would have seen
before. Um, what was the question? :-)

>From:         TBUCK@KNOX.BITNET
>Subject:      The Prisoner (Herbie Hancock)
>
>Secondly, a more general topic. I have yet to purchase or hear a Bluenote CD
>that I wasn't completely satisfied with, and I'm starting to think that (at
>least for what they pick to rerelease on CD) Bluenote is the "perfect" record
>label - well, obviously this is only as far as jazz, and I suppose I should
>also say that I'm limiting myself to Bluenote stuff recorded before say, 1970.
>I'm sure there are some real klunkers in the last couple of decades of stuff,
>and especially the 80's and 90's.

At one time a few years ago, I was buying virtually any Blue Note CD I could
find. I had just gotten into 'real' jazz and knew of BN's reputation. Some of
their more recent stuff, especially in the early days of their revivification,
was so-so. I picked up a CD from Bill Evans - no, not *the* Bill Evans (and I
did know enough that I wasn't just confused :-), a sax playing dude - that's
pretty lame commercial fusion stuff. But yeah, as for their albums from the
late 40's to mid 60's, it's pretty tough to go far wrong.

>Maybe the question might best be put this way: If you were stranded alone on
>an island, and you could have the complete catalog of only one record company,
>which one would it be and why?  :-)

Good question! You've already got Blue Note (which would have been my choice),
so let's see - damn, I hate to say this, but CBS. I'd like to pick some really
cool little label like Black Saint or something, but the choices would just be
too limited. CBS has a *huge* catalog of all different types of music. They
may not have the best and/or coolest of a particular genre, but they also
wouldn't limit my listening to a particluar genre. I can't survive on jazz
bread alone. :-)

>From:         Robert Garret Gruhn <1418@EF.GC.MARICOPA.EDU>
>Subject:      Music diversity
>
>This is my first post to this list...so be gentle...;)

Welcome!

>I like a majority of different styles of music, I find something worthy in
>every type of music out there.  I mostly listen to what people deem
>"Alternative" (i.e. Smiths, Concrete Blonde, Depeche Mode, Pet Shop Boys,
>etc...), but I've been known to like groups and artists diverse such as
>Amy Grant, Mary Chapin-Carpenter, Pink Floyd, and Metallica.

I tell you gently: ;-) this is only a small start for 'diverse music'. Where's
the blues, jazz, classical, not to mention various ethnic musics you'll hear
mentioned by various list members? "Music" doesn't equate to just "rock music"
in this neck of the net, so be forewarned!

It's interesting though, as Rev. Bob pointed out - the market has become so
fragmented that you can't say "I like rock" or even "I like metal", you have
to say which sub-sub-genre you dig, and then people say "I have really diverse
tastes" if they like multiple sub-genres, as if the other genres don't really
enter into their awareness. Weird. (That's not meant to be directed to you,
Robert, just a generalization based on comments from lots of folks.)

>The reason for my post is this.  Do you think that the genre refered to as
>Alternative is taking over the mainstream?  I know many people who find
>every group that makes it to mainstream a "sell-out".  I'd just like to
>hear your opinions as to this.  Thanks.

Without jumping into the argument over the label "Alternative", this seems
to be a trend in popular music - something starts underground with a few
musicians and fans/friends, establishes a small but intensely loyal following,
and slowly (or maybe nearly suddenly, sometimes) becomes popular and reaches
a mass audience because it has something vital and different from the current
sound. At this point there's usually some dilution and self-caricature that
is introduced, and much of the vitality and freshness is lost, creating a new
opportunity for the next sound (or retread of an old sound). I'm sure that
most of the list members (I know I'm one) can identify with the feeling of
excitement, and let's face it, superiority, of being more or less part of a
secret club of worshippers of a really cool unknown band. When the great
unwashed masses become aware of the secret deity, it's a betrayal, thus the
cries of 'sell-out'. It sometimes is justified because a band has changed its
sound, and sometimes not, because a band is just doing something good that is
recognized. I'm sure you can find numerous examples of both cases.

Paul
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