HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: djs55750@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (the man )
Subject: Re: MORE ON THIS SELLING OUT THING
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 06:26:50 GMT

Well, here goes..AGAIN.

I was the opposite (this is about Metallica by the way).  the new Metallica
came out and I was stoked and pumped, and was totally pleasantly surprised by
the slower tunes and stuff.  I really liked it.  Then I got tired of it just
because i heard it EVERYWHERE.  Radio eMptyTV, my friends who formerly
listened to bands like Journey, etc.  now this isn't my "selling out" poiint,
this is just the "I got tired of heairng the new Metallica" point.  Anyway, I
started out totally defending the Metalliguys saying "so, changing their
musical style means they are growing as musicians, blah, blah, blah".  This I
still believe...there is nothing wrong with change...musically.  Then came
the things that started to sway me.  i dunno if I have commited to the
"Metallica has sold out" club yet, but let's just say I have put them on
"probation".  See, the music isn't what I feel is a let down...change
musically is cool...I LIKE that...it's the rest.  the whole Bob Rock thingm
for one.  I admire a band that is so versatile and so "bonded" to their music
that they knew what they wanted and could produce it themselves, and that is
exactly what Metallica was.  Then came Bob Rock...who seemed to take a LOT of
creative control away from the boyz.  I read an interview that said howmuch
Bob Rock "did" for metallica...they let him sit in on rehearsals, change
things, blah blah blah....too much for my liking.  And besides, when I read
that Metallica liked the sound on motley Crue's "Dr. Feelgood" so much they
hired Mr. Rock, they IMMEDIATELY went on probation.  There's other things
too.  The rash of merchandising, the videos, the new videotapes, put out on
two seperate video tapes so extra money needs to be sent, etc etc.  THAT is
where the "selling out" comes from...not the music, the marketability of a
band.  I guess that's the whole thing for me.  So I am going to see if the
next album seems to cater to the newer fans, or if it stays hard/goes back to
their roots, etc.  Ok, enough for now....as always IMHO

							the man
From: veburst@contra.enet.dec.com (KSV)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Marty Friedman's "Scenes"
Date: 14 Dec 92 04:51:57 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <DALSTEN.92Dec14025346@blue.iesd.auc.dk>, dalsten@iesd.auc.dk (Per Dalsten Soerensen) writes...
> 
>>>>>> On Mon, 14 Dec 1992 00:51:19 GMT, some unknown man djs55750@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu said:
> 
> 
>The_man> veburst@contra.enet.dec.com (KSV) writes:
> 
>The_man> Well, what does it sound like...is it like classical guitar,
>The_man> or what.  Sorry, I have no idea who Kitaro is *blush*.  So if
>The_man> you could give a general style assessment, that would be
>The_man> cool.
> 
>Yes, maybe could somebody even compare it to Marty's first solo effort
>'Dragons Kiss'?
> 

	Sorry... I've never heard "Dragon's Kiss" so I can't make a
comparison...

>I just wonder if this is just another example of a guitarist giving up
>on good 'shredding', like Richie Kotzen and Tony MacAlpine, for
>instance. Remember the difference between Kotzens first and 'Electric
>Joy', and the difference between 'Edge of Insanity' and 'Eyes of the
>World' by MacAlpine?  Well, to be fair to MacAlpine his latest
>'Freedom to Fly' is way better than 'Eyes...'.
> 
	Ya got me....

	If you're at all familiar with the 'New Age' style of music, you've got
basically what "Scenes" sounds like... (at least to me)... It's a very
beautiful mix of New Age and Classical Guitar.  The friend whose copy of
"Scenes" I listened to before buying it for myself dubbed the tape as classical
guitar, but I think that's more because he isn't familiar with new age music at
all.

	"Scenes" shows off Friedman's talent as a composer, as opposed to just
a heavy metal guitarist (which he's damn good at, too). :)

-- KSV
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: veburst@contra.enet.dec.com (KSV)
Subject: Re: Dream Theater ???????????????????
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 20:17:30 GMT


In article <1992Dec13.192704.3246@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, gse9k@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU (Scott Evans) writes...
> 
>>I got him to send me Fates' Warning's Parallels and Dream Theater's Images and
>>Words.  I must say that DT's vocalist blows away Fates' Warning's.  Fates'
>>singer tries to sound like Goeff Tate too much, anyway.
>>
>>						  Big Al the Devil's Pal!!
> 
> 
>Gotta disagree...Parallels isn't the best example; go get _Perfect Symmetry_
>or _No Exit_ and listen to mind-boggling vocals.  On _Parallels_, Ray has a
>little more finesse, but I love his vox on his first two Fates' albums.
>And he is UNREAL live.  Hits every note and more.  Geoff, unfortunately,
>doesn't really do that anymore, although I still love his voice too.
>And I really really really don't think Ray's trying to sound like Geoff.
> 
> 
> 
>s

	James Labrie (Dream Theater's vocalist) has an absolutely incredible
voice... he has unbeatable talent and the whole group puts on an AWESOME live
performance... he also hits every note and more.... can't wait until January
9th to see DT at Chapter II/11 in Salisbury, MA!!!!!  I don't think I'll be
able to make it to the Axis show in Boston on December 16th, unfortunately...
from what someone else posted in alt.rnr.metal.heavy.progressive, the band adds
a new song to their set as a special Christmas treat... I would *LOVE* to hear
those guys whale on that selection.... *deep sigh*

-- KSV
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Thursday, 17 Dec 1992 12:41:01 CST
From: <U19807@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Motorhead
Distribution: na
 <92346.155142U19807@uicvm.uic.edu> <1992Dec12.134656.6083@news2.cis.umn.edu>


In article <1992Dec12.134656.6083@news2.cis.umn.edu>, donnell@tuna.micro.umn.edu
(BogusMan) says:
>
>A lot of the albums Strength? I am not sure what you are trying to say here.
>I heard and continue to hear a lot of complaints about how "It just isn't
>Motorhead without Fast Eddie" which I think is bullshit, pure and simple.

From what I can tell from the two _APD_ tracks on _No_Remorse_,Vic seems to've
mixed Lemmy's bass in such a way that it seems to be,er,compensating for
Robertson's rythym work. Don't get me wrong (listen to Thin Lizzy's _Live_and_
Dangerous_ double LP to see how great a guitarist he is),but I think that the
complaint isn't that Robertson is a great guitarist-he just didn't fit in with
Lemmy and Co.

> And he wasn't even an original member!

So?

>And Robertson can wipe the floor with him hands down, IMHO.

Maybe. Listen to the solos on "Overkill" (either off of _Overkill_ or _No_
Sleep_'Till_Hammersmith_) and get back to me on that one...once again,the
point is this: Brian Robertson is a great guitarist. I just don't think he
fit in well with the high-speed attack of Motorhead,since he (once again,
IMHO) seems to fit in a lot better with a more melodic/mid-tempo band like
Thin Lizzy.

>They are both weaker songs. I feel there are much better songs on the
>album.  Ever hear "Back At The Funny Farm"?

Nope. I don't have a copy of _APD_,but I do have "One Track Mind" on cassette,
though. I may have to pick _APD_ up....used,that is. The X-mas gift-buying
bug is gonna be a major plague on my wallet,as usual.

      ** Chris Krolczyk,esq.  * DISCLAIMER: My opinions are in **
      ** Maniac-at-Large      * no way endorsed by the Univer- **
      ** U19807@UICVM.BITNET  * sity of Illinois at Chicago.   **
      ** u19807@uicvm.uic.edu * So much for frivolous lawsuits.**
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: gse9k@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU (Scott Evans)
Subject: Re: Dream Theater ???????????????????
Reply-To: thrash@virginia.edu (Scott Evans)
Organization: or lack thereof
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 19:27:04 GMT


>I got him to send me Fates' Warning's Parallels and Dream Theater's Images and
>Words.  I must say that DT's vocalist blows away Fates' Warning's.  Fates'
>singer tries to sound like Goeff Tate too much, anyway.
>
>						  Big Al the Devil's Pal!!


Gotta disagree...Parallels isn't the best example; go get _Perfect Symmetry_
or _No Exit_ and listen to mind-boggling vocals.  On _Parallels_, Ray has a
little more finesse, but I love his vox on his first two Fates' albums.
And he is UNREAL live.  Hits every note and more.  Geoff, unfortunately,
doesn't really do that anymore, although I still love his voice too.
And I really really really don't think Ray's trying to sound like Geoff.



s
From: raj@zx.qsp.UUCP (Raj Dosaj)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: MORE ON THIS SELLING OUT THING
Date: 18 Dec 92 01:49:37 GMT
Organization: Quality Software Products, LA, CA

In article <1992Dec17.030300.14822@selway.umt.edu> sh666@selway.umt.edu (Dave) writes:
>Put yourself in this position...
>cash if you just alter your songs/playing style so that it might
>appeal to a wider audience.
>
>It would be extremely tempting, don't you think?
>							Dave

FUCK THAT!  You already have everything you need in life, what's the fucking point
(unless you want to use that money to help the world, and I don't here about Metallica
doing and good deeds).  Selling out your artistic talent for money is a pathetic 
excuse.  How many ferrari's do you need?

-Raj
From: st1h4@jane.uh.edu (Middlebrooks, Karl D.)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Fates Warning!
Date: 14 Dec 1992 16:26 CST
Organization: University of Houston
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: jane.uh.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

In article <1992Dec13.144512.4578@memstvx1.memst.edu>, mech14017020@memstvx1.memst.edu writes...
>I was wondering, what are some of Fates Warning's early albums? I understand
I believe there's one called _Night on Brocken_, or something 
like that.  They also put an album out called _Awaken The Guardian_
which is the only Fates Warning album I ever bought.  Those are
the earliest ones that I know of, though I think there might
have been a release between the two albums I listed. IMHO, the
early Fates Warning is not as impressive as what they put out
recently, beginning on the _No Exit_ album.  I've heard all
of it, since a friend of mine is a tremendous fan, but I like
the more recent stuff better.  It's worth checking out though,
and is by no means bad music.
From: caedmon@cats.ucsc.edu (Axeman)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Marty Friedman's "Scenes"
Date: 14 Dec 92 04:40:00 GMT
Organization: University of California, Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: am.ucsc.edu


veburst@contra.enet.dec.com (KSV) writes:
>Nick Menza on drums and Brian BecVar (Kitaro's keyboardist) on keys....  The
>whole album is *very* musically sound and beautiful to listen to... nice and
>relaxing....

ALas - how does it compare to DrAgOn's KisS?


-- 
,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,
,;';,   caedmon@ucscb.ucsc.edu               Jeff Ishaq          .,;';,
,;';,   I am a meatball:  Bite me.           Guitar withdrawal!  .,;';,
,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,.,;';,
From: opndick@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Dick Piechowicz)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Headbangers Ball?????
Keywords: it sucks
Date: 16 Dec 92 00:57:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Dec7.143625.4432@memstvx1.memst.edu>, mech14017020@memstvx1.memst.edu writes...
>In article <4DEC199215215994@phobos.ucc.umass.edu>, tpoulin@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (THOMAS J POULIN) writes:
>>     Why do they still call it The Headbangers Ball?????  The only
>> friggin' videos they ever play are either from Pearl Nice, or some
>> new gay band like Jackyl.  I watched the last show, and it was definitely
>> the worst one ever.  Rickey Rachtman stood there like the geek that he
>> is reading from hundreds of mail messages about his hair cut.  Every1 wanted
>> to know if he(which he did) cut his hair just because of pressure brought 
>> down upon him from that POLITICAL music network(MTV)?? heh heh heh.  His reply 
>> to this was, "calm down people it's just a haircut".  Then his replies to, "
>> Play some speed thrash metal", was, "Boy, I only wish I could."
>> 
>>    FUCK YOU RICKSTER!!!
>> 
>>    Old Music Played<----HB's Ball----->New Music Played
>>    ----------------                    ----------------
>>     Napalm Death                         Pearl Jam
>>     Old Metallica                        Wherever I may Roam
>>     Overkill                             Jackyl
>>     Iron Maiden                          Black Crowes
>>     Pantera                              ...
>>     White Zombies                        ...
>>     Obituary                             ...
>>     Sepultura                            ...
>>     Exodus                               ...
>>     Megadeth                             Foreclosure of a Dream
>>     Anthrax                              Many Other Panzies 
>> 
>> 
>> WHATS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE....
>> WHEN WILL VIDEOS BY THESE GOOD BANDS EVER BE PLAYED AGAIN!!!!
>> 
>> Whatever happened to the triple thrash threat  Rickster????
>> to heavy for you...
>> Oh I forgot its not Guns N' Roses.
>> 
>> Another pissed off viewer,
>> Tom
>> 
> 
> 
>I think they should call it 'The HeadGIVERS Ball.' I remember the good old
>days when they really played metal. Some Slayer here, some Sepultura there.
>Now it sucks. Although this past weekend there were two half-descent songs
>played by Biohazard and Cathedral. Short of those, it was a show made for
>the wannabees who were still hanging around after 'Yo! MTV craps.' Anyway,
>that's my opinion.
> 
>	Abandoning the quest for the perfect sig.
>		Troy T.
SHUT UP!!!!!!!!! some of us people DO like Pearl Jam, along with other really
heavy stuff. maybe you should watch more than just the countdown. during the
real headbangers ball (12am-2am) they still play iron maiden, queensryche,
megadeth, OLD metallica,ect. so next time PAY ATTENTION!!! instead of
sleeping!!!        
                                          yers truly,
                                                     Kay
p.s. Im using a friends account. so, please dont flame him.
From: donnell@tuna.micro.umn.edu (BogusMan)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: Iron Maiden's FEAR OF THE DARK
Date: 12 Dec 92 14:15:50 GMT
Organization: none

In article <1992Dec9.144258.1@hmcvax.claremont.edu> mulman@hmcvax.claremont.edu (Mike Ulman) writes:
>In article <1992Dec9.162151.9638@news.columbia.edu>, pw15@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Philip  Wang) writes:
>Well, I listened to Fear of the Dark ONCe and thought it was terrible. The
>lyrics are stupid (compared to say Powerslave) and the music isn't that great.
>I think Somewhere in Time was Maiden's last decent album. I saw them on the No
>Prayer tour and was very disappointed. I long for the days of D'Anno!
>
>Its strange I seem to like all the bands with their original make ups more:
>Sabs, Van Halen, AC/DC, Maiden...Well, I like Raise your Fist and Yell the most
>of all of Alice Cooper's stuff!
>
>
>Mike

if you were disappointed by the No Prayer tour, as I was, you should have 
seen them on this last one. Bruce's voice hasn't sounded that good since his
early days with Samson, I swear! Far less encouraging the audience to sing
in the difficult parts, and such. Hey, he nailed the opening scream to 
"Number Of The Beast" on that tour, and the whole band kicked major ass!
Janick is no Adrian Smith, but he seems to have a way of kicking the rest
in the butt! Never saw a band be that tight and have so much fun fucking 
around on stage, without missing a note!

Awesome!
					--Judex--
From: jnbienle@cip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Juergen Bienlein)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Re: SKYCLAD
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 15:09:07 GMT
Organization: Student Pool, CSD, University of Erlangen, Germany
NNTP-Posting-Host: faui09.informatik.uni-erlangen.de

rtsumn01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu writes:

>>
>>>Anyway, have Skyclad released anything else?
>>
>> Their second album is called "A Burnt Offering fo the Bone Idol" and is
>> pretty good. 

>I heard they came out with another EP, but I don't remember what it's
>called, I've never seen it (apparently it and the second one are only
>available as imports in the US) and it's not in any of my catalogues.

>--Semhaza

Their latest releaese is an EP with six tracks on,
called SONGS FROM THE WILDERNESS.
There are three live tracks and three new tracks (EMERALD f.e)
on this fine EP.
So just jeck it out ...
 
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: mschenk@research.ptt.nl (Mike Schenk +31 70 33 23926)
Subject: Re: Newer Black Sabbath
Organization: PTT Research
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 18:56:40 GMT

In article <1992Dec12.133847.5995@news2.cis.umn.edu>, donnell@tuna.micro.umn.edu (BogusMan) writes:
> In article <1992Dec12.012758.1@research.ptt.nl> mschenk@research.ptt.nl (Mike Schenk +31 70 33 23926) writes:
>>In article <Bz00xI.DL@acsu.buffalo.edu>, v096pz6l@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (HAVE YOU HAD YOUR SPAM TODAY?) writes:
>>> In article <ByzvDF.M35@math.uwaterloo.ca>, amgaudra@neumann.uwaterloo.ca (Alain M. Gaudrault) writes...
>>>>In article <1992Dec9.033153.24459@news.acns.nwu.edu> autopsy@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Gregory Baumgartel) writes:
>>>>	Born Again had Ian Gillan (of Deep Purple fame), Seventh Star featured
>>>>Glen Hughes.
>>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>>   Glen Hughes is also of Deep Purple fame.He played bass on the last couple
>>> of albums.He also was in the Butterfly Ball(??). He sang the Bat.
>>> It was a cool song for a childrens album.
>>
>>Wel he did not play bass on the last couple of Deep Purple 
>>albums. These featured Roger Glover again. But you mean the
>>Mark III & IV albums. These are not the last since the Mark II 
>>reunion and the one with Joe Lynn Turner.
>>
>>    Mike
> 
> No he doesn't mean Mark II or anythng. He is referring to the last few albums
> made before Deep Purple broke up the first time.
> 
> try listening to "Come Taste The Band" sometime...

No, he means Mark III & IV. But that's what I said or after 
reading it again, tried to say! Next time I should not post so 
late in the evening.

    Mike
From: S_TILLENBURG@iravcl.ira.uka.de (|S| Stephan Tillenburg)
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
Subject: Do Liegelord still exist ?
Date: 15 Dec 1992 17:40:16 GMT
Organization: University of Karlsruhe (FRG) - Informatik Rechnerabt.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: nz11.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.23

Hi to all
Is anybody out there who knows what happened to LIEGELORD
( from Hartford (Ct) ) and to the members of the band ?
Where has Matt Vinci (bass), Paul Nelson (guitar) disappeared ?

Thanx, Stephan
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: donnell@tuna.micro.umn.edu (BogusMan)
Subject: Re: Skyclad... info needed!
Organization: none
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 14:33:29 GMT

In article <1992Dec10.201527.1@ulkyvx.louisville.edu> rtsumn01@ulkyvx.louisville.edu writes:
>In article <Bz2AGs.9sK@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu>, mucds@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Corey D. Stinson) writes:
>>     I've been reading this and that about the band SkyClad, being
>> compared somewhat to Manowar.  Would someone like to post some reviews,
>> album lists, etc. about them.  I'm interested and may check them out.
>
>I've never heard Manowar, so I don't know if they compare, but I don't 
>see how they could be *nearly* as good. Skyclad is *awesome*!!! I only
>have their first album, WAYWARD SONS OF MOTHER EARTH, because the other
>two are only available as imports, but I'm going to get them as soon as
>possible.
>
>Imagine some intense thrash, with a violin thrown in. Now add in Martin
>Walkyier's voice. I don't know how to describe this guy's singing, I've
>never heard anything like it. It's sort of growley, but not in the way
>death metal bands sing. I think it has to be heard to be appreciated.
>Now here's the topper. Many of the songs have an environmental theme.
>Normally I hate that type of stuff. I'm an "Earth must die" type. But
>when these guys do it, it's great! They're *so*good* that it doesn't
>matter.
>
>Before Skyclad, Walkyier was in another band called Sabbat. He did two
>albums with them, HISTORY OF A TIME TO COME and DREAMWEAVER. The second
>is better quality IMO, also easier to find. It has a heavily anti-Christian
>theme; it's based on a book about a missionary's experiences with
>pagan Anglo-Saxons (it's easier to understand the album as a whole if
>you've read it). The first album has more Satanic overtones. Compared
>with Skyclad, I would say Sabbat is more intense but less polished. The
>guitars are faster and more intricate, with the result that Walkyier
>sounds like he occasionally has trouble keeping up with them. But they're
>still excellent.
>
>I strongly suspect Walkyier of being a modern pagan; many of the songs
>have pagan overtones, and the band picture looks like something out of
>a fantasy movie. Superb stuff; I hope you like them.
>
>--Semhaza

Semhaza, we rarely disagree, but I have to add a couple points.

1. Judging by some old interviews, Martin would like you to think that he is
a pagan/occultist/whatever, but he didn't know what he was talking about, at
least back then.

2. I hate his voice. The worst. I sold two Sabbat albums because of it.
This is strictly personal opinion.

3. Superb is too strong a word, I think. It's a good band, but a little 
immature for such high praise.

Ah well, this is just my ramblings. Take with large grains of salt.
Pax
					--Judex--

Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: amgaudra@neumann.uwaterloo.ca (Alain M. Gaudrault)
Subject: Re: Annihilator question...
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 11:13:30 GMT

In article <Bz4psI.E4B@news.cso.uiuc.edu> djs55750@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (the man ) writes:
>Hullo, fans,
>
>  I have never heard Annihilator, and was wondering if someone could give me
>  a frame of reference.  are they any good, what is their best, etc. what do
>  they sound like, who could you compare them to, etc.  Thanks all...
>
	Well, being Canadian, I suppose I should respond to this :-)  (Yes,
they're Canucks in case you were wondering).  I've got their two full length
albums (they have an EP, Phantasmagoria), _Alice In Hell_ and _Never Never
Land_.  Two different singers, two different sounds.  I MUCH prefer their first
album, although the singer takes MUCH getting used to, ie: he can't sing, but
you get used to him.  The music could sort of be described as (roughly) Metal
Church meets Malmsteen.  Jeff Waters (guitarist, band leader, song writer) is
an excellent axeman and comes up with some cool licks, but often not varied
enough.  Their second album disappointed me.  I can't stand the vocals;
completely uninspiring, which is a shame as they have potential.  If only
Waters could find someone that could sing as well as he plays ...  The songs
on _Never Never Land_ aren't bad, but nothing like _Alice In Hell_.  If you can
get used to a lousy imitation of David Wayne, check out AIH.

Razor blows the doors off Annihilator,
						  Big Al the Devil's Pal!!
                                                     __   __            
                                                    /  `-' /          ,,
                                                    |[====|||||||||||[::}
                                                    \__.-._\          ``
Newsgroups: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy