HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Israel Apartheid????
Summary: Reply to Alan Stein
Date: 13 Nov 92 02:02:13 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <1992Nov11.024301.28996@nysernet.org> astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:
>
>There are numerous other "peoples" with far greater claims to
>self-determination than the Palestinian Arabs--the Kurds quickly come
>to mind--who nobody seems to care about.
>

First, "greater claims" is a value judgement.  Second, even if there
are "peoples with far greater claims", does that mean we can't discuss
the Palestinian situation until all other "greater" problems are solved?

>If the Palestinian Arabs really want self-determination, rather than
>the destruction of Israel, they might start with some confidence
>building measures, like ceasing to stab innocent Israeli civilians in
>the back, and start negotiating seriously.  They might also talk to
>the guy in charge of 3/4 of Palestine, you know, that little king.
>-- 
>Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org

If the Palestinian representatives at the negotiating table in Washington
endorse these stabings, then you have a point.  But since they don't, you
don't have a point.  
And what does king Hussein (if that's who you're referring to) have to do
with this?

Tamer Abdelgawad
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: ahmed@dsg.cs.tcd.ie (Ahmed El-Habbash)
Subject: Re: Israel Apartheid????
Organization: DSG, Dept. of Computer Science, Trinity College Dublin
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:15:10 GMT

In <1992Nov10.054605.5623@nysernet.org> astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:

>ahmed@dsg.cs.tcd.ie (Ahmed El-Habbash) writes:


>>I don't know what would you describe this situation when people who are
>>born in Palestine are driven out to be replaced by people who never seen
>>that land before.

>I would describe such a situation as a figment of your imagination and
>anti-Israel propaganda.

You can describe it the way you describe many other situations.

>The Arabs who left Israel in 1948 left of their own volition.  Those
>who heeded the pleas of the Jews to remain became full citizens of
>Israel, with more rights than their fellow Arabs have anywhere else in
>the Middle East.

Why did those Arabs leave there cities, towns and villages, and live in
camps as refugees under very miserable conditions. Why they are not
given the chance to go back home ?

>Alan H. Stein 

Ahmed
From: aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Israel Apartheid????
Date: 12 Nov 92 04:09:01 GMT
Organization: University of Colorado at Denver

In article <1992Nov7.030329.18909@cs.brown.edu> dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:
>
>1) The law of return has no relation to race, only to religion. you
>   better check out before you make such accusations.

And what religion, specifically, is that Danny?  Singling out groups
because they don't meet the criterion of a *religious* group IS infact
racist.  Before you start defending these policies, you'd better face
reality first that discrimination on the basis of *race*, *religion*,
and *gender* IS NOT DEMOCRATIC!  Case in point:  Nazi Germany.

>2) The law does not treat non-Jews in any racist way, because no
>   country in the world just lets anyone come in. It does give
>   Jews a special benefit in that they come to Israel without any
>   restrictions. Considering the fact that Jews have been

Well, actually, it does have its restrictions:

	"Israeli AIDS policy provokes anger"

"JERUSALEM -- An Israeli decision to bar entry to some Jewish
immigrants and foreign workers who have the AIDS virus has provoked
angry protests from those who believe the policy violates a
fundamental tenent of the Jewish state.

"The new rules announced this week would require AIDS testing of
some groups of Jews and all non-Jewish foreigners planning to stay
inside the country for more than three months."

Perhaps they have enough problems with the AIDS epidemic from the
immigrants who brought their trade skill from Russia.

Vat a country!

Anisa
From: wmuhanna@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Waleed A Muhanna)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Arab Unity
Date: 10 Nov 92 23:57:30 GMT
Organization: The Ohio State University

In article <1992Nov10.214206.21065@trl.oz.au> a.Faris@trl.oz.au  writes:
>In article <1992Nov8.231340.2208@cs.umb.edu>, ahmad@ra.cs.umb.edu (Ahmad Hashem) writes:

[a few paragraphs deleted]
>...
>I do not think that Pan Arabism will solve any problems, and stand to create
>new ones. The Arabic people are not uniform in culture and geopraphically
>separated by deserts and seas.

I disagree.  Let me put it this way: the similarities between the Arab
people, IMO, far outweigh the differences which may exist in reality 
(perception is a matter entirely different).  I submit to you that Arabs 
in Syria have MUCH, MUCH MORE in common (in terms of heritage, language, 
culture, experience, and destiny) with Arabs in Saudi Arabia and with 
Arabs from Morocco, THAN, say blacks in Alabama have in common with 
Hispanics in southern New Mecixo or the Irish in Massachusetts.  Those good 
people too are separated by thousands of miles, many rivers, and even 
desert, and yet these things are hardly seen as obstacles.

Here is another example: What does an Indian from, say, Bangalore have in 
common with his fellow countrymen from, say, Asam?  Very little -- not even 
language!  Yet that does not mean they cannot all benefit from and derive a
great deal of common strength from unity, gains that each cannot achieve
alone.

I could go on and on with examples.  But, even if Arabs were as culturally 
diverse as you and others claim, my response is to say: so what?  
Everywhere, the problem, my friend, does not lie in diversity; it lies 
in tribalism and rotten attitudes towards diversity.  And, no one does 
a better job of keeping the Arab people isolated and ignorant and 
emphasizing particularism than the dictators and one-party regimes 
that rule the various Arab states -- it is they who have a vested
and selfish interest in preserving the status quo.

>A.Faris 

Waleed Muhanna

-=-
  "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people
   to do nothing."  -- Edmund Burke
From: nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Bulbul)
Subject: Re: Mr Bulbul, Thank you but No
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 00:07:33 GMT

mmg@doc.ic.ac.uk (M M Ghanem) writes:

>Dear Bulbul,

>I have no interest in exchanging private e-mail messages with you.

>If you have anything to say, say it HERE. 

>If you want to discuss things objectively and "calmly" we must agree
>on how to do it first.

>Moustafa


   I do not have anything to say.


** hoWa yi'oLI wAnA `oLoh wi .kuLu.sna lkalam koLoh
                                                    Umm Kalthoum
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Arab Unity
Summary: cultural similarity/dissimilarity not relevent.
Date: 13 Nov 92 04:04:31 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <nabeel.721542002@oracle.sce.carleton.ca> nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Normand Arthur Beeline) writes:
>abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad) writes:
>
>>As discussions on 'Arab Unity' continue, I want to point out that 
>>there are at least two very different senses of the word 'Unity':  
>>Political unity, and Economic unity.  A little reflection should 
>>convince most people that we do not want 'Political Unity' in the Arab 
>>world (witness what happened in the former Soviet Union and 
>>Yugoslavia).  
>
>   A closer example to support your claim is UAR, United Arab Republic.
>And another to refute your claim is USA, United States of America.
>

I should qualify my comment.  I have no problem with political unity
that arises endogeneously and democratically, as was the case for the 
U.S.A..  But you'll notice that when the states decided to become the
'united' states, they were relatively young entities without much 
historical or cultural uniqueness.  The situation is quite different
in the Arab world.

>>The more successful models in today's world emphasize the second, 
>>Economic, sense of the word 'Unity' (e.g. the EC, NAFTA,...).
>
>>If what I say is true, then what does cultural/social similarity have 
>>to do with unity?  To put it more forcefully, why does the word 'Arab' 
>>have to be attatched to the word 'Unity'?  
>
>   For the same reason the letter 'E' is attached to 'C', or the 
>letters 'NA' are attached to 'FTA'.
>

Perhaps I shouldn't have "put it more forcefully".  My point is that
much of the discussion on Arab unity in this news-group involves 
arguments of the form: 'We have so much in common, therefore we should
unite'.  Unless these arguments refer to 'political unity', they are
irrelevent.

>*norm* talAta, talata baS, talAta, ^aLimni Ru'.s!
>       How about disco dancers e.g. Amit Batchan? *norm*
>
>  Probably you like belly dancing because you just relax like that
>1967 night and enjoy a glass of something. Why hurt yourself and
>try to shake that body of yours on the disco floor and break a sweat?
>
>*norm* /|\ Long live aerobics \|/ *norm*

Hate to disappoint you, but in 1967, I wasn't born yet. Besides, I 
thought *norm* was one of your 'nice' alter-egos!

Tamer Abdelgawad
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: ilyess@ECE.Concordia.CA (Ilyess Bdira)
Subject: Re: Hossni Mubarak Jokes.
Organization: ECE - Concordia University
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:21:52 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.183744.7396@ugle.unit.no> tarek@solan.unit.no (Tarek Ali Yousef) writes:
>
>	I have been away from  Egypt for a while  now and I was wondering if any
>of you out on the net could breif me on the latest Mubarak Jokes.
>
One more thing that is common between Egypt and Tunisia is the fact that when
they have a big problem, they joke about it instead of doing something
about it. The two people developed a mechanism that helps them live and
tyranny without need of explosions. The abundance of political jokes
and comedies in both countries help people feel good in getting their
revenge in the fantasy world of art.

In the Economist, the latest joke about Mubarak is of course related
to the earth quake:
Question: why did Mubarak interrupt his visit to China?
Answer1 : Because he wants to be close to his people in their calamity.
Answer2 : Naa! Because he knows that his cabinet is getting all they can
get from International aid, so he wants to get a piece..

This is the latest joke Egyptians say about Hosni..    


>
>
>
>	Thank You in advance,
>
>		Tarek
From: chafiq@enp.umd.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Want info on Morocco
Date: 12 Nov 92 06:04:08 GMT
Reply-To: chafiq@enp.umd.edu
Organization: U of Maryland, College Park, Md.

H,there
You weren't very specific about the kind of information you want about Morocco
But one would assume that you want to know  more about the social side of
life down there..
O>k Morocco an "Arab " country in the sense that there  is not much 
to say about its arabic nature.
Islam is the "official" religion but it is not very popular down there 
Moraccan people are very upfront and they move a lot around the globe 
because political life in Morocco is very "arabic", in the sense
that the king is there  to stay and who ever doesn't like the idea 
would have to leave.
Morraccan women are good cook
The national dish is The so called "cous-cou"
I think that will give you roughly a picture about that place
                                            Mr.moore
In article <1992Nov5.212925.7147@research.nj.nec.com>, adam@research.nj.nec.com (Adam Porter) writes:
>                              
>Hi everyone...
>
>I'm an American man, and I've recently started dating a woman from
>Morocco.  I know the library is the best place to look, but could
>someone point me towards information via the net on Morocco and
>Moroccans?  I can't seem to find a newsgroup like soc.culture.morocco.
>
>Thanks...
>
>-- 
>--								-Adam
>==========================================================================
>Adam Porter, Assistant System Administrator       adam@research.nj.nec.com  
>NEC Research Institute:609/951-2568  4 Independence Way,Princeton,NJ,08540
From: oueichek@imag.fr (Ibaa Oueichek)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Arab Unity
Date: 6 Nov 92 17:44:13 GMT
Organization: IMAG Institute, University of Grenoble, France
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Jafr bin Haza (y41@aix320a.urz.uni-heidelberg.de) wrote:
: Keywords: 
: 
: 
: Kaf Halek?
: 
: Can someone tell me why lebanese have their own newsgroup?  How can
: Arabs stick together with such nonsense?  The last time I checked
: Lebanese were Arabs????  

 You know that usenet is a free forum. Anyone can create a new newsgroup
as long as the official procedure (vote) is respected. I won't call the
creation of soc.culture.lebanon a nonsens given that most of the discussions
going there are really very local to Lebanon (and most of them concern the
internal conflicts, that most of other Arabs seem to ignor and restrict them
to a "Christian vs Muslims" war). I definitly agree that Lebanese are Arabs in
the cultural sens of term (after all, there shouldn't be any other meaning of
that term given the mixture of ethnic groups we have in the middleeast).
 I won't see it as if "Lebanese have their own newsgroup" i think it's rather
a forum where they can discuss issues that many other readers of s.c.a (if
There are any serious readers in this group) wouldn't feel comfortable with.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Bulbul)
Subject: Re: Arab Unity
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 00:18:22 GMT

y41@aix320a.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (Jafr bin Haza) writes:

>Keywords: 


>Kaf Halek?

>Can someone tell me why lebanese have their own newsgroup?  How can
>Arabs stick together with such nonsense?  The last time I checked
>Lebanese were Arabs????  

   Lebanese are Arabs, but due to the ordeals they passed through they
have different issues to discuss. Also traffic on s.c.l. is probably
higher than here. (In fact most other Arabs developed email national
nets because they do not have access to an individual newsgroup.)
   Finally because Arabs usually do not care about the Lebanese 
situation Lebanese this way made it easier for them to ignore. I do not
see anything wrong with that. By the way, if you are using a decent
news reader you can merge those groups into one and read them all up
together.


** kayda l^oZAl ana min yoami.


Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: Oct 1973: Yom Kippur War (To Husam)
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 02:38:57 GMT

faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris) writes:

>If Israel had a choice,...

But they didn't.

> I wonder why they have chosen to paint such a grim
>picture of the Arabs and their culture so that the west feels a pitty for
>Israel and make the Arabs look like warmongers.

Israel didn't paint that picture, and the Arabs have acted like warmongers.
-- 
Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org
From: badrulv@angelo.amd.com (Badrul Vajihuddin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Arabic lessons for Kids
Date: 13 Nov 92 06:03:36 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Santa Clara, CA


Looking for somebody proficient in Fus-ha arabi to teach kids at 
1st and 3rd grade , and also for adults too
Anyone ----- leads are welcome
ps: Place preference South Bay
voice 510-792-5694
email badrul.vajihuddin@amd.com
From: beshir@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Abubaker Ali Ibrahim)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: ARABIC COMPUTER MAg-address
Date: 7 Nov 1992 23:47:50 GMT
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Distribution: usa[D
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4
Originator: beshir@csd4.csd.uwm.edu


                    Arabic Computer Magazine
                    ------------------------
               
     Alam Al-Computer(PC world Middle East)
          ARABIC/ENGLISH
          Multifax Integrational Inc,
          218 North Chales Street #1903
          Baltimore,MD 21201-4021
          Tel 410-727-0164
          Fax 410-727-0241
     ---------------------------------------
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          ARABIC/ENGLISH
          UK head office Printlink International
          P.O. BOX 923 Stony stratford
          Miltonkeynes,Bucks,MK11 1yuk
          tel 0908-56-1444
----------------------------------------------
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          Arabic
          United Arab Emart(UAE)
          P.O.BOX 791
          Abu Dubbi
     tel 455555
     fax 451653
-----------------------------------------------
     Asr alcomputer
          Arabic
          12 Shahab street
          Al Mouhandsin 
          Cairo
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          Computer guide (***)good
          Published by Mona khater publishing Co, ltd.
          8 street 78
          P.O. BOX 639
          Al Maadie code 11728
          Cairo, Egypt
          Tel 3514565
          Fax 3518626
-------------------------------------------------
     ARAB MAC 
     The Only Mac magzine is published in
     Beruit
     I don't have the add
-----------------------------------------------
Please add any others
IBRAHIM BESHIR
beshir@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
From: ayoub@globey.cs.wisc.edu (Nabil Ayoub)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Hossni Mubarak Jokes.
Date: 10 Nov 92 20:42:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.1992Nov10.204229.15912
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison -- Computer Sciences Dept.

In article <1992Nov10.183744.7396@ugle.unit.no> tarek@solan.unit.no (Tarek Ali Yousef) writes:
>
>I have been away from  Egypt for a while  now and I was wondering if any
>of you out on the net could breif me on the latest Mubarak Jokes.
>
>	Thank You in advance,
>
>		Tarek 

FYI, there was a big earthquake in Egypt that left 600 dead and 10,000
injured, and 1000's homeless.  Which is more important now, how to help
Egypt in this tragedy or talk about the latest jokes about Mubarak ??!!

Nabil

          .-------------------------------------------------------------.
         /  Nabil Ayoub                        ____/   __  /    ____/  /
        /  Engine Research Center             /       /   /    /      /
       /  Dept. of Mechanical Engineering    ___/    __  /    /      /
      /  University of Wisconsin-Madison    /       /   |    /      /
     /  Email:ayoub@erctitan.me.wisc.edu  _____/ __/   _|  _____/  /
    '-------------------------------------------------------------'
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: _\!/_ Ohm Salam _\!/_
Date: 11 Nov 1992 14:49:03 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Ohm Salam writes:

>>"Some people work to live, others live to work, and others live to
>>be martyrs."  HS

>Who is HS?
  It is Hamza Salah.

>(I like the quote though ... and your .sig line - nice work :-)
  Jazeka Allaho Kheir Ohm Salam for your compliment!
         
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.jewish
From: nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Nabeel Ghuzlaan)
Subject: Re: King Hussein is dying
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 05:10:32 GMT

andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:

>I read a report in yesterday's Globe and Mail that King Hussein of Jordan has
>cancer of the urinairy tract and is not expected to live longer than 18 months.

   It's old news, but I hope and think he will live longer.
My expectations are based on Horowitz algorithms.

   If in other countries, they speculate that the ruler's
successor is worse, here I am positive.

** ya .hsaini .hiNA, .hiNA ^azwitak!

** rAyAtoka ta.kfiqo filqiMah  yA .sAni^a 'amjAdi l`oMah


Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.lebanon
From: nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Nightingale)
Subject: Arab Migration
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1992 21:03:57 GMT

   The last issue of the London-based Sorakia weekly magazine--issued 
by colleague Ghassan Zakariya--had an editorial by colleague Khalid 
Sharif that can be abriviated and translated to:

   This century witnessed the migration of large numbers of Arabs to
   the six directions. At the beginning of the century, they escaped
   the Ottoman plight. Next others escaped the colonisation. Then many
   escaped the independence era. And last, the oil era destroyed
   whatever remained of them.
   Next century, there will come some time when the only people 
   remaining in the Arab world are the rulers and intelligence 
   officers. And there will be monetary prizes for citizens to return
   home so that the rulers may have enough slaves to excercise their
   mastery upon.
   
   Colleague Khalid was very close to reality, but how would you like
to read the literal reality? The reality is that in the Arab world
exists a majority of masochists who can't live without being publically
humiliated and punished. Those people enjoy the feel of heavy boots
crushing their heads and grinding their noses into paste. If those were
pulled from humiliation and indignity, they would die like fish out of
the sea.
   My expectation is that in the next century there will only be those
masochists living outside jail and whatever remained of regular people
will live in dungeons. It is ironical, masochists living outside the
dungeons and regular people living inside, both denied their pleasure.
There is no worry about the future of our leaders and there is no
reason to bother those who appointed them.


** "The so-called 'trial' is another middle finger rooted in the guts
    of every Jordanian."
                                                    --N. Beeline


Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.afghanistan
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: Oct 1973: Yom Kippur War (To Husam)
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 20:36:22 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.040241.2030@nysernet.org>, astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:
|> 
|> Really!  What a deal?  Israel got to spend billions each year for oil
|> they had previously pumped themselves, from fields they had developed,
|> and spend billions more to replace the defense bases they evacuated
|> from in the Sinai.
|> 
|> A few more deals like that and they'll go bankrupt.

Israel is backed up by fort Knox, how could yoy go bankrupt?. Also the oil
supply that Israel gets from the US is propably cheaper than pumping it from
the Sinai. Besides, the oil reserves in the Sinai are only 1-2 Billion barrels
which will run out in a few years.

|> 
|> How'd I miss out?  In fact, none of my Jewish relatives got a penny of
|> that 200 grand per Jewish family you mention.
|> -- 
|> Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org

Maybe they did not live in the Sinai.

A.Faris
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic