HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fontenot@comet.rice.edu (Dwayne Jacques Fontenot)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: To Drop Or Not To Drop ( was: Re: To buy or not to buy ? )
Date: 28 Jan 93 16:10:47 GMT
Organization: Rice University

In article <199301260022.AA05338@cherokee.advtech.uswest.com> kdlin@advtech.uswest.com (David Lin) writes:
#
#In this posting, I'm not providing a solution. Instead, I have a
#similar but worse problem. I'm considering to drop her because of
#her attitude toward my guns/security plans. Let me tell my story 
#and you guys can give me suggestions.
#
#I have been seeing this girl for a short while. She grew up in a Michigan
#rural area and is an attorney ( not my favorite type though ). Recently,
#I found out that she used to a DA ( the anti-gun type ) and still has
#a *VERY* strong prejudice against handguns. 
#
#She even hates my security alarm and comments that I'm paranoid to
#have all these things installed. Her reasoning is that no one is going
#to bother me, and my guns will only hurt myself. She claims that she has
#shot .22 rifles before. ( So, taking her to a range will not help at all. )
#She points out that I'm living in my own "jail" by having all these
#motion sensors and by having the "fantasy" of arming/defending myself.
#
#So, do I have a solution to this problem? Guys?

She is wrong, irrational, and IMHO not very intelligent. How else can anyone
who has had as much access to the relevant data as she has hold these opinions?

How can any rational person (other that a criminal) dislike a security
alarm?

If anyone is in a fantasy world, it is her.

I suggest you take stock in your situation. If you like her enough to
change your way of life, do so and stay with her.

If not, get as far away from her as fast as you can.

All IMHO, of course.

Dwayne Fontenot

#David
#-- 
# K. David Lin, Ph.D.              | IEEE Member, NRA Member, HAM Operator
# Communication Services Research  | U S WEST Life Safety Team
# U S WEST Advanced Technologies   | Defend your life in STEREO - Beretta & SIG
# E-mail: kdlin@advtech.uswest.com | Disclaimer: Only personal opinions
From: scylax!tiglath@uunet.UU.NET
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock vs. Sig!?
Date: 27 Jan 93 19:56:50 GMT
Organization: ScylaxCorp



kgk@martigny.ai.mit.edu writes:

#I have an old Glock 17 (which I bought in 1986), with 1992 Trijicon
#sights.  While I *love* my Glock, I am thinking of a second pistol;
#perhaps a collection of one pistol is too small, and our beloved
#Moderator's mantra is taking its toll (``Buy them all'' :).
#
#Anyway, given all of the "Sig, Sig, Sig," talk that I hear, I was
#considering a Sig P226 with K-kote and Sig-lights (Sig's tritium
#sights [which are also from Trijicon?]), in 9mm.  But then, in a
#moment of lucid thought, I realized that for the price of a Sig, I
#could almost get two Glocks.
#
#The natural question comes to mind, is the Sig better than the Glock?
#If so, why?
#
#I know quite a bit about Glocks (I've even read Peter's book :), but
#relatively little about Sig's.  Could a Sig lover provide *technical*
#reasons for why the Sig is as good as/better than a Glock?  I don't
#want to hear "my Sig looks so pleasing that I stare at it all day, but
#the Glock is ugly that I recoil in horror, therefore the Sig is
#better."
#
#In fact, there seem to reasons to suspect that the Glock is *better*
#built: I have heard that the Sig has welding, rivets, etc.; the Glock
#has none.  I have heard that the Sig slide is cast (almost to shape)
#and then machined, while the Glock slide is cut from a solid piece of
#steel.  Of course, the Glock does have sloppy tooling marks, but the
#actual method of construction seems superior.  I have heard that the
#Sig coatings tend to wear, and that the weapon is easily prone to
#rust.  (In a Glock?  Never!)
#
#So, Sig owners, please be so kind as to post *why* the Sig is so good,
#and please be so kind, if possible, as to *compare* to the Glock.


I have a Glock 21 and a SIG 228 and although I find the SIG very pleasant
and it has good ergonomics it offers less value for money.  Every
time I shoot them in comparison the Glock licks the SIG hands down in 
accuracy.  The SIG has developed a lateral wobble in the slide which
every dealer tries to make me believe is normal, but I find it 
unpleasant and out of place for a gun of that price.  I suspect it
may also contribute to its lesser accuracy.  I prefer the Glock
also because of its feel and superior design.  

If you have a Glock you shouldn't expect to be overjoyed with the difference
a SIG will make.  Those who have neither may.
From: gt4458c@prism.gatech.edu (John Stephens Cronin)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: BATF regs and SKS modifications - what's the deal?
Date: 22 Jan 93 04:00:23 GMT
Organization: Common Container Liberation Front


Hi,

I have not seen this mentioned in depth before, and I apologize in
advance if this was hashed out in detail and I missed it.

A friend of mine has purchased a recent manufacture SKS (he says 1992,
is this possible?).  He wants to add a detachable magazine (5 rounds,
for hunting, plus larger capacities for plinking and defense), and a
folding stock, but he is worried about the BATF laws regarding these
mods.  I think I saw somewhere that these mods are OK on SKS's imported
before 1986, but are a felony offense if done to SKS's imported later.
Can somebody confirm or clarify this for me?  Another problem: how can
you determine the date a 1960's manufactured SKS was imported to the USA?
Were they all imported prior to 1986 (I would tend to doubt it myself)?

Thanks in advance, reply by email if you wish and I will summarize.

John Cronin
-- 
John Cronin	Internet: gt4458c@prism.gatech.edu	Phone: (404) 876-1419
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Live each day as if it's your last.  One day you'll be right.  -- me
Lighten up, you're gonna die whether you have fun or not.      -- me again
From: cower@csli.stanford.edu (Richard Cower)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: How much ammo does the footsoldier carry?
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:38:02 GMT
Organization: CSLI, Stanford University


How much ammo does the Army footsoldier take with him/her (?) these days?
How quickly can they get more? Does the amount being carried vary depending 
on the branch of service (ie...does the Marine carry more/less?)? I can 
imagine it going pretty fast at three shots every trigger pull.

thanks...rich cower
From: erudnick@pica.army.mil (FSAC-SID)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock Defense (Re: Glock vs. SIG!?)
Date: 28 Jan 93 04:16:48 GMT



James P. Callison writes:
#Who's frothing? I am now, and was then, perfectly rational. Glocks are
#decent guns, and I really do like them, but they are not, IMHO, in the
#same class overall as the SIGs. That's my opinion, get yer own.

Well put. In terms of value and overall suitability for use as a service
handgun, the Glocks are in a class above the SIGs.


##It seems you've compared your SIG to farm equipment...interesting.  I'm a
#
#No, I didn't. I was using the example to show that welds are not necessarily
#a "Bad Thing"(tm pending).

True, but but welds and steel stampings are definitely a "low cost" thing,
like the molded plastic frame of the Glock, which is not reflected in the
excessive price of the SIG.


#Also try demand, supply, and importing fees.

Funny that only SIG-Sauer seems to have these problems.


#Citation: _SIGARMS_Quarterly_, "100m Hits with the P226", Vol. 4, Summer,1992.

Definitely an unbiased source for SIG information.


All in fun, with beaucoup :)s, SIG-Sauer fans. This will be my last posting,
as some SIG fans are humorless, and have let me know via E-mail.


Ed Rudnicki     erudnick@pica.army.mil     All disclaimers apply
Protect the Second Amendment - boycott Ruger products
Geordi: "...it's like the laws of physics went right out the
window." Q: "And why shouldn't they? They're so inconvenient."
From: cvalj001@vmsb.is.csupomona.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: SPAS-15?
Date: 28 Jan 93 04:15:42 GMT
Organization: California State Polytechnic University, Pomona


  Anyone ever heard of a SPAS-15?  Could you give me some specs?

Thanks in advance!
                                                           
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                   Daemon E. Hobbs, C/LtCol, AFROTC
                 Senior, (Spatial Information Systems)
                          Cal Poly, Pomona
                            **Commander**
                602D Air Force ROTC Cadet Squadron (ATC)
                Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711

         "My ramblings represent no one's opinion but my own."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: calspan!schabel@uu.psi.com (Dave Schabel)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: What do gunsmith's charge?
Date: 23 Jan 93 15:59:50 GMT
Organization: Calspan Advanced Technology Center


I have a Ruger MK-II (.22) that I shoot in competition.  Actually,
two of them between my wife and I.  I believe that I've gotten
to the level of competence that would justify my wanting to
get the trigger pull lightened up somewhat.  Does anyone know
what is involved, and what a gunsmith might be expected to
charge for doing this?

Also, I have recently purchased a Colt Gold Cup Series 70.  Used,
of course.  I would like to get some parts "tightened up", as I
suspect that, while extremely well-kept, some parts are showing
signs of aging, and hence not shooting groups as tight as 
it is capable of.  What parts, if any, should I have replaced?
(No, it's not just me -- I can shoot it from a bench rest and
not have it group as well as the original test target which
the previous owner had passed along).

Thanks much.

				Dave Schabel



-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave Schabel         | Opinions and comments contained herein are mine and  |
schabel@calspan.com  | do not necessarilly reflect those of Calspan Corp or |
                     | its customers.                                       |
From: jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: hand shake
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:39:49 GMT
Organization: Dixie Communications Public Access.  The Mouth of the South.

rigg@adtaz.sps.mot.com (Dana Rigg) writes:

About eliminating shaking, I use the aspirin trick, which my father,
a shooting champion in the 40s, taught me many years ago.  It works
by slowing the heart rate and lowering blood pressure.
That does not cure the random shakes but for me, blood pressure
pulsations dominate.

#if it helps.  The gun is only a few months old, and I have not been
#able to shoot anything for over a month because of a silly little
#softball injury that resulted in my doctor drilling a steel pin into
#my finger.  I only have to wait another 5 or 6 weeks!  I try to say
#that cheerfully, but I'm suffering on the inside.  Anybody know
#a cure for shooting withdrawal? :-(

yeah!  Shooting :-)

Hey Dana, looks like the perfect opportunity to work on your weak
hand techniques :-)

73 John
-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC               |Interested in high performance mobility?  
Performance Engineering Magazine(TM) | Interested in high tech and computers? 
Marietta, Ga                         | Send ur snail-mail address to 
jgd@dixie.com                        | perform@dixie.com for a free sample mag
Need Usenet public Access in Atlanta?  Write Me for info on Dixie.com.
From: leem@jpl-devvax.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Lee Mellinger)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock vs. Sig!?
Date: 26 Jan 93 16:25:00 GMT
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory (NASA)

In article <C1FDD9.3Bp@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> callison@kittyhawk.ecn.uoknor.edu (James P. Callison) writes:
:	Accuracy (suffers due to rifling design)
:
:James P. Callison       Microcomputer Coordinator        OU Law Library 

If you are referring to the polygonal barrel rifling, that does not
affect the accuracy of the pistol.  The HK P7 also uses polygonal
rifling and it is the most accurate 4" pistol I have ever shot.


Lee

"Mit Pulver und Blei, die Gedanken sind frei."

|Lee F. Mellinger                 Caltech/Jet Propulsion Laboratory - NASA
|4800 Oak Grove Drive, Pasadena, CA 91109 818/354-1163  FTS 792-1163     
|leem@jpl-devvax.JPL.NASA.GOV
From: wes@hpbs2500.boi.hp.com (Wes Nielson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: [Pistol] Hi-Power question.
Date: 26 Jan 93 16:25:05 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard / Boise, Idaho

Shawn L Rinehart (srinehar@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu) wrote:

:      Hi there again,

:      I know that this question has been asked before but, it was before I 
: bought my Browning so I didn't pay attention.

:      I have a 1990 Browning Hi-Power 'Sport model' that might have a problem.
: My gun will not eject an empty magazine once the slide is locked to the rear 
: (as happens after it is empty). If the slide is forward, it will usually pop it
: out either 1 inch or all the way. It depends which magazine I use.

:      Is it supposed to push the magazine out if the slide is locked to the 
: rear? Mine doesn't at all.

:      What can I do to fix mine so it does?

This is normal. The pressure from the magazine safety is enough to hold
the mag in place. When the slide is forward the pressure of the magazine
follower on the underside of the slide is apparently enough the "pop"
out the magazine. The only fix I know of is to remove the magazine safety.
Any other ideas??

Wes Nielson
wes@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com
From: lvc@cbvox1.att.com
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: FFL Application Form Question?
Date: 26 Jan 93 01:50:07 GMT
Organization: Ideology Busters, Inc.

In article <WES-220193083204@wsmith.ssc.gov> WES@SSCVX1.ssc.gov (Wes Smith) writes:
#I received an FFL application yesterday in the mail.  The BATF people seem
#real adamant about the FFL being issued for business purposes, rather than
#personal use (my intentions).

That's what the FFL is for.  You cannot use it for personal use.  If you
do not have any sales on your books and are audited you are probably going
to lose your license and have some explaining to do.  If you want to risk
the wrath of BATF this is a good way to do it.

#They insist that you have regular business hours

True, just list something minimal.

#and be open to the public.

No, this is not true.  There is a separate question asking "Will you be
open to the public ?"  Answer "No."  The followup question asks, "If not,
please explain."  Just say, you will sell only to your friends and persons
known to you, not the general public.

If the application wording has changed let us know.

#Is this some attempt by the Feds to limit the FFLs being issued?

Of course it is!  If everyone had an FFL it could not be used to restrain
trade, which was the original purpose of it.

#It seems unreasonable to me that they would attempt to limit issuance to
#business organizations only.  Or did I miss a real obvious answer for
#the hobbyist?

I think if you provide the answers above you will be okay; that is
unless the "new" BATF under Herr Clinton decides to screw the small
time FFL.  Actually, they'll probably just raise the license cost from
$30 to something outrageous, like $300, /and/ make it /retroactive/.
This happened to machine gun dealers a few years ago, that license
went from $300 [I think that was the old number] to $500 per year,
and you had to come up with the extra money or you /lost/ your license.

By the way, there are special Form 4473's you must use if you sell
less than 50 guns in a year.  Be sure to get the correct forms.
-- 
Larry Cipriani, att!cbvox1!lvc or lvc@cbvox1.att.com
From: boardman%cancer.unm.edu@lynx.unm.edu (Bob Boardman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: RE: Is Winchester Made in USA? What others are?
Date: 22 Jan 93 04:02:53 GMT
Organization: UNM Cancer Center

In article <1993Jan20.204255.10941@unislc.uucp>,
      unislc@unislc.slc.unisys.com (James Warren) writes:
#
#Burris is the only scope totally made in the USofA.
#
  I believe Shepard scopes are totally made in the USA, and there are probably
  others, like the Leatherwood ART? (absolutes are always dangerous ;-})

  -Bob

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
|**I _AM_ a member of a well-regulated militia - self-regulated, that is!!!!**|
| Bob Boardman,Albuquerque,New Mexico - NRA LIFE, NMSSA, Zia Rifle&Pistol Club|
|        internet:boardman@cancer.unm.edu    bitnet:BOARDMAN@UNMB             |
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
From: jmd@cube.handheld.com (Jim De Arras)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Suggestions for small hands
Date: 26 Jan 93 01:52:11 GMT
Organization: Hand Held Products, Inc.

In article <9301190425.aa15509@s.s.ms.uky.edu> miles@ms.uky.edu (Stephen D.  
Grant) writes:
# Check out the Sig Sauer P228!
# 
You're kidding, aren't you? Nice gun, but monster grip!  Bigger than the .45  
P220.

Jim
From:  (MJ)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Seagal's Firearms handling
Date: 26 Jan 93 16:24:37 GMT


I have heard from a relieable source that Seagal was doing everything he
could to get a "carry permit" in Mexico, the site of his next movie.  As
you may know Mexico has no such thing even for its own citizens.  Seagal
was hoping the US government might be able to help him.

MJ

[MODERATOR:  Aside to MJ.... will you contact the moderator off-line?
I'd like to talk with you about getting your From fields set up right, 
thanks.]
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock vs. Sig!?
Date: 26 Jan 93 01:52:36 GMT
Organization: The Cat Factory

In article <9301250428.AA28006@zippy.cs.UMD.EDU> kgk@martigny.ai.mit.edu (Kleanthes Koniaris) writes:

}The natural question comes to mind, is the Sig better than the Glock?
}If so, why?

This is partly idiosyncratic.  I don't shoot well with Glocks.  This isn't
necessarily Glock's fault.  I'm sure there are plenty of Glock fans who
can shoot one hole groups at 25 yards, but I'm not one of them.  I shoot
better with the SIG.  Go figure.

}... Could a Sig lover provide *technical*
}reasons for why the Sig is as good as/better than a Glock?  ...

IMHO, the SIG is more reliable.  When renting Glocks I had a number of
jams.  Worse, when the Glocks jammed they locked up so tight the range
staff had to beat on them to get them apart and functioning again.  In my
experience, SIGs don't jam, period.

(Technical note:  In another thread someone recently noted the SIG's feed
ramp is designed to be perfectly positioned for feeding the next round
when the slide is back and barrel is tipped.  This is supposed to explain
their unparalleled reliability, including the ability to feed empty
cases).

}... I have heard that the Sig slide is cast (almost to shape)
}and then machined, while the Glock slide is cut from a solid piece of
}steel. ...

My understanding is the SIG slide is made from two heavy stampings welded
together and machined.  This process supposedly retains strength and
integrity while being cheap to manufacture.

}... I have heard that the
}Sig coatings tend to wear, and that the weapon is easily prone to
}rust.  ..

Any coating will wear, given enough use.  After a year and 1500+ rounds my
K-koted SIG is still 99+% with no signs of rust anywhere.

}So, Sig owners, please be so kind as to post *why* the Sig is so good,
}and please be so kind, if possible, as to *compare* to the Glock.

Accuracy, reliability and ergonomics is what sold me on the SIG.  Your
mileage may vary.

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@polymath.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                "If you can't stand solitude,
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483  perhaps others find you boring
Santa Monica, CA  90405                        as well."  -- Mark Twain
From: petekunz@iiic.ethz.ch (Peter John Kunz)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: home protection concerns
Date: 26 Jan 93 16:24:45 GMT
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH

In article <1jpr52INNo9@mojo.eng.umd.edu> chuck@eng.umd.edu (Chuck Harris - WA3UQV) writes:
#
#All my spent brass looks the same.  How would you determine that the cartridge
#wasn't a factory load?  If you point a gun at someone, you damn well better be

i htink this is pretty easy to prove. the lab can collect evidence such as
case make, powder type, bullet model, add it all up and quickly determine
if this is available off teh shelf or homemade. and if there's a press in the
basement, it will make the task even simpler....



cu
-pete



-- 
Peter J. Kunz	Vogesenstr. 60	4106 Therwil	Switzerland
petekunz@iiic.ethz.ch	pkunz@amiga.physik.unizh.ch
From: tmi@netcom.com (Peter Alan Kasler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock Carbines (was Re: MP-5 question)
Date: 22 Jan 93 14:08:31 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In <1993Jan21.174711.7856@netcom.com> pismobch@netcom.com (Ed Devinney) writes:

#With all this talk of 10mm MP5s, and all the drool being spilled from here
#to Maryland, apparently, I'm curious if anyone knows the progress of
#Glock's carbine project.  

	I just spoke with one of the more credible factory sources the
other day and evidently there still is nothing concrete about when the
carbines will appear. Glock is so media-shy after what the gun press
did to them regarding the Models 20 and 21 that they are unlikely to
give out much of anything until they are pretty certain of dates, etc.

	On another subject, I learned that while Glock has not
officially committed to which calibers the new ultra compact pistol
will be produced in, the Austrian factory recently acquired a "large
quantity" of .380 ACP ammunition.
-- 
     Peter Alan Kasler                            Fax: 707-939-8684
     Threat Management Institute                Voice: 707-939-0303
     800 West Napa Street                     TMI BBS: 707-935-1713
     Sonoma, CA  95476                     Internet: tmi@netcom.com
From: jdigroup@ccmail.orst.edu (Jim Ingle's Research Group)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Air gun postal matches
Date: 22 Jan 93 14:08:33 GMT
Organization: Chemistry Department, OSU, Corvallis, OR  97331-4003

For those who wanted addresses for air rifle and pistol postal matches:

	Papio Air Gun Club
	833 So. Harrison
	Papillion, Nebr. 68046

I shot in their matches this summer, well run and a lot of participants.

	Donald V. Williams
	17446 S.W. Granada Dr.
	Beaverton, Oregon  97007
	(503) 642-5873

I'm competing in Don's current match- well run and efficient.

Anybody got a nice Anschutz 1813, 1913, or 2001-2 (air)? If you have been 
lusting after the 2013 and want to unload your old rifle, I need both .22 
and air for USISC this year...

If you have info on rifles for sale, email at:

jdigrp@chem.orst.edu and put TRENT in the subj. (If it bounces, try 
jdgroup@..... sometimes one of the two is indigestible to our server.)

Trent Hering
Soon-to-be-Chemist
Oregon State University
From: gwyn@smoke.brl.mil (Doug Gwyn)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Kitten's Firearms handling (was:Seagal)
Date: 27 Jan 93 19:56:41 GMT
Organization: U.S. Army Ballistic Research Lab, APG MD.


In article <26JAN199309245186@ariel.lerc.nasa.gov> smpod@ariel.lerc.nasa.gov (Stefan) writes:
#Supposedly, "Sniper", also, has shots of the camera following bullets.
#	[MODERATOR: Well, it was done following arrows in "Robin Hood,
#	 Prince of Thieves", so I suppose it was only a matter of time...]

I only read the referenced article because I thought it was going to
discuss how Kitten handled her, um, weapons, but there was no mention
of her.  Anyway, I dimly recall one movie opening looking toward the
muzzle of a pistol being fired, with the bullet spinning nicely
toward the camera (I guess if it wasn't faked then they must have used
a mirror so as not to shoot the camera!).  Does anybody remember the
title of that movie?