From: jcmarx@bnr.ca (JC Marx P825)
Subject: Re: handguns (?)
Reply-To: jcmarx@bnr.ca
Organization: Bell-Northern Research
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 12:58:45 GMT

In article <ATAYLOR.92Aug18141642@gauss.nmsu.edu>, ataylor@nmsu.edu (Nosy) writes:
|> <In article <1992Aug18.120226.18553@brtph560.bnr.ca> jcmarx@bnr.ca (JC Marx) writes:
|> 
|> <In addition to what DC has already said, handguns are not normally as
|> <accessable as a small container of mace. 
|> 
|> 	This is false. Small revolvers and/or pistols can be
|> 	carried safely in a number of ways that make them just
|> 	as easily reached as any chemical tool.

Hmm. A mace canister attached to a set of car keys can be openly exposed and
ready in public (a mall). It can even be in the ready position while carrying
an armload of packages without throwing fear and panic into the masses around
you. That's great if your state allows you to handle your hand gun just as
easily.

|> 
|> <Mace is legal 
|> 
|> 	No, it isn't. It is prohibited in some Eastern U.S. states,
|> 	may be illegal in some provinces of Canada (I have conflicting
|> 	information) and requires a weapons permit in Massachusetts.

I don't know for sure, but logic would suggest that for each given state in
which mace is not legal, hand guns, too, are illeagal.

|> <and can be attached to one's car
|> <keys, which are quite often already in one's hands anyway. Probably wouldn't
|> <do to have a woman, who thinks she is being stalked through the mall, to have
|> <her handgun ready, esp if a) no bullet is breached, and b) she is carrying
|> < several packages. 
|> 
|> 	"Wouldn't do"? Excuse me, there are at least 2 methods
|> 	of concealed carry which allow a person to put hand on
|> 	firearm in "ready" position (finger off trigger) while
|> 	not exposing the firearm to view.

Which would require a bullet in the chamber. I can just see mommy contending
with her child (or daddy) while keeping her hand on her unexposed, ready to
fire hand gun. Do you have any idea how many accidental shootings occur in 
this nation each year? Carrying a gun with a bullet in the chamber with
children regularly nearby is an accident waiting to happen.
|> 
|> <Beside, IMO, most woman aren't as vengeful (sp) as men. If 
|> <some guy(s) tried to rape me, I would definately be trying to kill them. Woman
|> <don't normally have this thirst for blood and simply wish to escape the
|> <attacker, which frankly, makes much more sense.,
|> 
|> 	Since you are not a woman, this comment isn't particularly
|> 	useful.

Incorrect. My statement revolves around the theory of something called "The
Killer Instinct". It is a well proven much documented fact that women do not
have the same inborn instinct to kill as (most) men. Some men do not even
possess it.

|> Suffice to say, women constitute the fastest growing
|> 	category of firearms owners in the U.S.

<Chuckle> But men remain the number one killers IN THE WORLD (even with war and
self defense excluded).

|> <In addition to the above, one must be trained to use a handgun effectively - 
|> <no training required for mace. 
|> 
|> 	This is incorrect as well. Basic training in proper handgun
|> 	use can be done in as little as 5 or 6 days.

As I have previosly mentioned, 5-6 days of training DOES NOT EVEN COME CLOSE
to preparing one for the use of a deadly weapon under stress.

|> Women generally learn *faster* than men do, because they don't have their
|> ego to get out of the way.

But since you're not a man, you don't know about 'ego', so this isn't
particularly useful.
|> 
|> 	Mace and other chemical sprays *do* require training to use
|> 	properly. AWARE in Massachusetts regularly offers training
|> 	in the proper use of these tools.

Okay, ready for your mace training? Here goes - point the red arrow at the
target and push the button on the top. The end.

|> <Mace goes in the face (an easy target in most
|> <instances), however, a bullet must be aimed with precision. 
|> 
|> 	Sorry, mace to the face isn't as easy OR as reliable
|> 	as you seem to think. 
|> 
|> 	Women who defend against rape attempts with firearms are
|> 	most likely to succeed, according to FBI reports.
|> 	Note that "defend" in most cases does NOT mean shots
|> 	fired.
|> 
|> <If the woman
|> <hesitates, even for a second, her own gun could be turned against
|> <her. 
|> 
|> 	A good point in favor of proper training in use and
|> 	retention of firearms.

<sigh> You have a grave misunderstanding of "proper training" (I have detailed
this on a previous post).

|> 
|> <She is more likely to make that deadly hesitation while aiming a handgun.
|> 
|> 	Since you aren't a woman, this is not particularly
|> 	interesting.

Touchy, touchy; I used the word 'she' to be consistent with my scenario. ANY
person, male or female, who is engaging in (potentially) deadly combat with
another human (possibly armed as well) is likely to hesitate. If handling the
weapon is not second nature (which DOES NOT come with 5-6 days training),
there is likely to be at least a second of deadly hesitation.
|> 
|> <Lastly, a small container of mace is several times cheaper than a handgun.
|> 
|> 	Not necessarily.

<sigh again> "Not necessarily"???? What exactly does that mean? Oh, you know
where I can buy an effective, reliable hand gun for less than thirty dollars -
PLEASE TELL US.

JC