HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mforget@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Michel Forget)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: The Shadow Rising, by Robert Jordan, is available in Canada.
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 92 22:04:27 MDT
Organization: Edmonton Remote Systems #2, Edmonton, AB, Canada

At last!

It seems that _The Shadow Rising_ is available here in Canada.  I picked it up
yesterday (Oct. 10) at Greenwoods Books in Edmonton, Alberta.  The other stores
in Edmonton did not (and have not as yet) received it.  It did not seem to be a
specialty store or anything, so I am sort of up in the air about how the books
are distributed.  I would have thought that the chains would have gotten it
first.

The book looks great, but it has no prologue.  The illustrations, as usual, are
great.

Now all I have to do is catch up with the spoiler thread.

<<  ------------------------------------------  >>
<<        mforget@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca          >>
<<  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  >>
<<               Michel Forget                  >>
<<   The Key:  Spirit over mind over matter.    >>
<<  ------------------------------------------  >>
From: jmr5125@tamsun.tamu.edu (James Reed)
Subject: Re: Prince of Chaos the conclusion??
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 18:12:23 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.190324.725@skitzo.dseg.ti.com> dittman@skitzo.dseg.ti.com (Eric Dittman) writes:
>I was in the bookstore yesterday to pick up _Mostly Harmless_ when
>I noticed the paperback version of _Price of Chaos_ was out.  I read
>this when it was first released in hardback, so I was surprised that
>the cover of the paperback said PoC was the conclusion of the Amber
>series.  Did the publisher add this by mistake, or is Zelazny just
>going to leave the loose bits loose?

Not unless Zelazny has changed his plans (god, I hope not).  During a local
book signing (quite a while back, now), Zelazny said he was planning on taking
a long break from the Amber books (to work on other stuff), but there would be
a final Amber book -- in about 3-4 years <sigh>...  Maybe he changed his mind
and decided to give the whole series up.

jmr5125@tamsun.tamu.edu
From: dittman@skitzo.dseg.ti.com (Eric Dittman)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Prince of Chaos the conclusion??
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:03:24 CDT
Organization: Texas Instruments Component Test Facility

I was in the bookstore yesterday to pick up _Mostly Harmless_ when
I noticed the paperback version of _Price of Chaos_ was out.  I read
this when it was first released in hardback, so I was surprised that
the cover of the paperback said PoC was the conclusion of the Amber
series.  Did the publisher add this by mistake, or is Zelazny just
going to leave the loose bits loose?
-- 
Eric Dittman                  Texas Instruments - Component Test Facility
dittman@skitzo.dseg.ti.com    (214) 578-3575
Disclaimer:  Not even my opinions.  I found them by the side of the road.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: johnt@netcom.com (The Mad Croat)
Subject: Re: _Lord of Light_
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 20:45:23 GMT

In article <9210101627.AA25392@rutgers.edu> ANTHONYS@ucrvm2.BITNET ("Anthony R. Sanchez") writes:
>
>      I also read this book, and enjoyed it very much.  I had to read the
>Spanish version, which always looses some of the feeling in the book, but
>even so, I liked it a lot.  Sometimes the Spanish translators are SF fans
>so their work has quality, but unfortunatly it isn't always so.

	I hope they did justice to the line:
	"He appears somewhat mishandled."

-- 
  John Tomicich 				johnt@netcom.COM
       I joked with two men in a Harlem bar. Everyone suddenly
  felt happy because my laughter was unafraid. I thought I
  could borrow some money from them.
From: mcintyre@CPAC.WASHINGTON.EDU (Vonda McIntyre)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Basement Full of Books 6.0
Date: 8 Oct 92 22:45:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: yang.9210082245.AA12382


 
 
Revision 6.0 (1 October 1992) of the Basement Full of Books 
list of books by mail from their authors is now available by 
request from mcintyre@yang.cpac.washington.edu.
 
The new list contains books by: William Barton & Michael 
Capobianco, Bruce Boston, John Brunner, Jeff Carver, Valerie 
Nieman Colander, Gene DeWeese, Harlan Ellison, Sheila Finch, 
James Gunn, Joe Haldeman, Gwenyth Hood, Edward M. Lerner, 
Vonda N. McIntyre, Thom Metzger, Alexei & Cory Panshin, Bill 
Ransom, Robert J. Sawyer, Dave Smeds, John E. Stith, L.A. 
Taylor, Gene Wolfe, Jane Yolen, George Zebrowski.
 
Vonda
From: obrien@AERO.ORG
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: _Lord of Light_
Date: 8 Oct 92 17:09:12 GMT

Certainly _Lord of Light_ was both a Hugo and a Nebula winner the year
it appeared (I'm certain of the Hugo, less certain of the Nebula).  As
I recall there was pretty stiff competition that year, too.

I've recommended the book but haven't gotten the blank stares others
are claiming.  It used to be my favorite SF book as well, until I
hit Gene Wolfe's _Book of the New Sun_ (now, how about a _New Sun_
theme park?  Is that a scary idea, or what?).  THAT book, at least,
does not garner blank stares.  It seems to engender extreme distress
in just about all the people who read it.  Not for the masses, that one.

I, too, have been disappointed in Zelazny's more recent output.  He does
still occasionally pull off flashes, such as "27 Views of Mt. Fuji...",
but the days of _Lord of Light_ seem to be just about over.  Too bad.
--
Mike O'Brien
obrien@aero.org
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: cmeadows@nyx.cs.du.edu (Chris Meadows)
Subject: Re: Prince of Chaos the conclusion??
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 02:52:30 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.190324.725@skitzo.dseg.ti.com> dittman@skitzo.dseg.
i.com (Eric Dittman) writes:
>I was in the bookstore yesterday to pick up _Mostly Harmless_ when
>I noticed the paperback version of _Price of Chaos_ was out.  I read
>this when it was first released in hardback, so I was surprised that
>the cover of the paperback said PoC was the conclusion of the Amber
>series.  Did the publisher add this by mistake, or is Zelazny just
>going to leave the loose bits loose?
>-- 
>Eric Dittman                  Texas Instruments - Component Test Facilit

>dittman@skitzo.dseg.ti.com    (214) 578-3575
>Disclaimer:  Not even my opinions.  I found them by the side of the road



I REALLY hope he writes more.  I want to see what happened to Luke
after bleeding on the Pattern.  I want to see just who was behind 
those shadow storms.  I want to see how Merlin as ruler of Chaos
will interact with his uncle Random, ruler of Amber.  I WANT ANOTHER
BOOK!!!

--
---Chris Meadows  CHM173S@SMSVMA or CMEADOWS@NYX.CS.DU.EDU
        "Wish in one hand and do something else in the other, then 
          squeeze them both and see which one comes true."
                    ---Corwin, NINE PRINCES IN AMBER by Roger Zelazny
From: jasonr@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Jason F Ralph)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: julian may and Fury (*spoilers*)
Date: 15 Oct 92 10:52:29 GMT
Organization: University of Sussex
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

Denis is a viable candidate for Fury, but I do have reservations about
him. He has been close to Jack and I can't see that he could evade
detection for so long. I think that I shall have to go back to the
book... 

jasonr@central.sussex.ac.uk
From: jseaver@starbird.WPI.EDU (Jason John Seaver)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Next Rama Book?
Date: 8 Oct 92 21:21:47 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: starbird.wpi.edu

In article <1992Oct8.150216.20316@gdr.bath.ac.uk> mapmh@gdr.bath.ac.uk (M Hagger) writes:
>I don't know what everyone else thought but personally I thought that
>the original book was very good, it dealt purely with the strange
>technologies of the Ramans and the 'wierd' happenings on the ship.
>But the second book was a real disappointment, I found it unbelievable
>that the organisers of this trip were supposed to have picked a crew
>with so many personality hangups, dark secrets and general all round
>personality conflicts that the mission was a farce.  Imagine if in the
>original book commander Norton and his crew spent most of their time
>with a near mutiny on their hands, hell, it seemed to me that Norton
>and co. did a far better job than the so called experts!  Granted a
>few of the mysteries of the original mission were explained, but still
>whilst I would probably re-read 'Rama I', 'Rama II' gets a big thumbs
>down, which is a great shame as the concept behind the book is a good
>one.
>
>Mark

	I must disagree.  The differences between the crews can be explained:
Norton and his group were chosen for their personalities, being committed to
a long-term trip, whereas the crew in Rama II were chosen more for their
abilities (not to say Norton & co. weren't chosen for their abilities, but 
DIFFERENT abilities, not ones having to do with Rama directly).  I thought the
second book was more entertaining than the first, and while the third started
out as not-as-good, it really picked up speed in the end.  I may be in the
minority for liking the Clarke/Lee books.  I don't think I've ever seen
suspense kept high for that long before (I am almost NEVER able to tolerate a
blatant cliffhanger in books, but the ones in Rama II and ESPECIALLY Garden of
Rama were GOOD).

							-Jay
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: agc@bmdhh286.bnr.ca (Alan Carter)
Subject: Re: "A Fire Upon The Deep" by Vernor Vinge
Organization: BNR-Europe-Limited, Maidenhead, England
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 08:31:40 GMT

In article <1992Oct13.181911.19455@infodev.cam.ac.uk>, gdr11@cl.cam.ac.uk (G.D. Rees) writes:
|> I haven't been reading this group since June, so I may have missed a
|> thread or three on this, but I am surprised not to see
|> rec.arts.sf.written filling up with stuff about Vinge's galactic
|> network.  Here's what I said in a recent review of the novel (posted to
|> rec.arts.sf.reviews):
|>  
|>   The planets of the Beyond are connected by an
|>   information network that is so like a galactic 
|>   Usenet that Vinge must be a subscriber to the 
|>   Earthly version.  He has it all down pat:  the 
|>   meaningless message headers, the volume of 
|>   traffic, the arrogance of contributors ("Idiots 
|>   who don't follow all the threads in developing 
|>   news should not waste my precious ears with their 
|>   garbage") and the sheer weight of noise obscuring 
|>   a little signal ("It is not called the Net of a 
|>   Million Lies for nothing").  What a nightmare!  I 
|>   hope Vinge is wrong with this prediction, but fear 
|>   that he is correct.
|> 
|> The evidence is pretty convincing:  Vinge reads Usenet.  But does he
|> contribute?  Perhaps more knowledgable posters than myself can answer
|> this question.

Faintest whiff of spoiler...











































Very impressive novel. I think it's a different universe to 
_The Peace War_, as Della Lu went a *long* way, and never found 
the zones, but then again she probably wasn't carrying any 
Transcendant hardware to start working :-) His continuation of 
the idea of Singularity beyond where he left it in 
_Marooned In Real Time_ was a thing I was not expecting to see. 
The oddest thing about it was the scale of the thing. I don't think 
I've ever seen anything bigger, except the trippy stuff by Attanasio, 
which is hard to call hardcore at all (unless you've found out what 
he smokes and can get there too). Maybe the posting rate has been so
low because we are all still stunned. 

If you are reading rec.arts.sf.written, much kudos to you Mr Vinge.

Better get the .sig over before *everybody* is doing it,

    Death to vermin, Alan.
From: gerstel@quaker.admin.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: re: julian may and Fury (some spoilers)
Date: 12 Oct 92 23:38:36 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

I wonder about this Felice/Fury theory.  Remember the Great Carbuncle??  I know
the red thing Felice and Cull were sealed into was a cylinder, and The
Carbuncle is a sphere, but I still have my suspicions.

There are endless theories about Fury.  He could be:
    1. Victor
    2. Marc's stillborn twin Matthieu (remember the thing about Marc's CE helmet
in JtB??  One of his friends said something about a twin.)
    3. The alien "vampires" who the Lylmik mentioned during the investigation of
the first murder.
    4. Felice
    5. Any combination of the above.

How about investigating when _Diamond Mask_ is coming out, so we can find out
the truth?? (so to speak!)
From: davidba@carmel.technion.ac.il (David Ben_Ami)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Canticle for Leibowitz by Walter Miller
Date: 10 Oct 92 19:17:04 GMT
Organization: Technion, Israel Inst. of Technology

Hello fello Sf-fans,

    I just finished reading the book: "Canticle for Leibowitz" by Walter
  Miller. I was very impressed with the ideas in the book although its
  pro-Christianity was sometimes too much. Is this the only book that
  preaches for Religion and anti-science. 

    What attracted special interest for me was the Judaism bits
  inserted all over the book in the motive of the "Eternal Jew".
  I think that his treatment of the question of memory through the 
  centuries is quite succesful and thought-provoking and so of course 
  is the sad events that happen.

    Are there any books with close (or opposing) themes? by Miller?

Thanks in advance for the information,

  David.
-- 
=============================================================================
  David Ben-Ami (irc: bigdav)      |   "I can resist anything but Temptation"
  s2780369@Techst02.Technion.Ac.Il |       Oscar Wilde
  davidba@Carmel.Technion.Ac.Il  davidba@Moav.Techniona.Ac.Il
From: sascmc@unx.sas.COM (Christopher Mark Conn)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: SF-LOVERS Digest   V17 #498
Date: 15 Oct 92 14:04:46 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc., Austin, Texas


Is anybody else reading _Mostly Harmless_ (the fifth
book in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy trilogy)?

I'm really enjoying it, picked it up this 
weekend. What do you think? How does it compare to the
others?

_______________________________________________________________________________
Chris Conn                    It does not matter how slowly you go
sascmc@unx.sas.com            so long as you do not stop.
Austin, Texas                                          - Confucius
From: higgins@fnalf.fnal.gov (Bill Higgins-- Beam Jockey)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Heinlein's "Goldfish Bowl" timeless?
Date: 9 Oct 92 18:45:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: fnalf.1992Oct9.124505.1
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory

In article <1992Oct9.032838.3678@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu>, pciszek@nyx.cs.du.edu (Paul Ciszek) writes:
> All this talk of Heinlein's story "Goldfish Bowl" has reminded me of the
> fact that I can't think of any glaring anachronisms in this story.  How
> about it?  If this story were published as "new" today, would there be
> any givaways?  And how many SF authors can make similar claims?

Well, you don't see too many operational bathyspheres these days.

Bill Higgins, Beam Jockey              | "Treat your password like
Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory  | your toothbrush.  Don't let
Bitnet:           HIGGINS@FNAL.BITNET  | anybody else use it--
Internet:       HIGGINS@FNAL.FNAL.GOV  | and get a new one every
SPAN/Hepnet:           43011::HIGGINS  | six months."  --Cliff Stoll
From: Beth.Friedman@p5.f341.n282.z1.tdkt.kksys.com (Beth Friedman)
Sender: FredGate@tdkt.kksys.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Alternate History List (0/5)
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 13:21:24 -0600

 RS> Added to the list or published since the 11th posting 
 RS> were:
 RS> Bretnor, Reginald, "Old Uncle Tom Cobleigh and All"
  
I'm quite fond of this story, but it doesn't belong on an alternate history
list.  It belongs on a stories about time travel list.  The whole point of the
story, in fact, is that history isn't changed.

 * Origin: Beth's Point: Minneapolis, MN (1:282/341.5)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: clc@kepler.unh.edu (Llamist Lliason)
Subject: Re: Venus on the Half-Shell
Organization: Holy Church of the Llama
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 16:27:44 GMT

In article <01GPQQIM2PBQ90MUJL@VAX1.ACS.JMU.EDU> FAC_PDEIGL@VAX1.ACS.JMU.EDU writes:
>
>Kilgore Trout is a recurring character in the novels of Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.  He
>writes science fiction novels and one of these is called Venus on the Half-Shell.  In 1975 a book was published by Dell called Venus on the Half-Shell, written
>by Kilgore Trout.  The real author, however, is Philip Jose Farmer.  I have a
>few questions about all this and I would appreciate any information you have to
>share.  Why was the book written by Farmer and not Vonnegut?  What is the
>relationship between Vonnegut and Farmer?  How did the book come about and why
>was it written?  I have found little on the subject and would love to know more.

The book was written by Farmer as a parody/tribute to Vonnegut, and Vonnegut
was _not_ happy with the way he was satirized.
They're still at war, last I heard.

							Christian

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "There is more to life than chocolate. | Christian Claiborn, President,    |
|  Just not a whole lot more. "          | Regressive Student Society, UNH   |
|----------------------------------------| Return to the womb in 1992!       |
| Available at:  clc@kepler.unh.edu      | Evolution was wrong!  Outlaw it!  |
| Also at:  C_CLAIBORN@unhh.unh.edu      | Pat Robertson for Emperor!        |
| And aliased to:  Christian@unh.edu     | Get in touch with your past lives!|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: cpf@alchemy.TN.Cornell.EDU (Courtenay Footman)
Subject: Re: The Shadow Rising - Robert Jordan **SPOILERS**
Organization: /usr/local/lib/news/organization
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 21:09:13 GMT

In article <1b31h2INNlvv@agate.berkeley.edu> mjw@ocf.berkeley.edu (Marshall Wang) writes:
>In article <1992Oct8.111930.4628@desire.wright.edu> cse0080@desire.wright.edu (John C. Hansen) writes:
>>The Shadow Rising is a great read!
Agreed.
>>
>>Spoilers below!  
>>
>
>>pierce@seas.gwu.edu (Jeffrey S. Pierce) writes:
>>8. Lord Luc/Slayer (Lan's cousin?) what part does he play?  What happens
>>when Perrin goes in the tower he should avoid?
>
>	Slayer is Lan's cousin, Isam, whose name the Trollocs shouted
>during their last battle with Perrin.  He's supposedly converted by
>Ba'alzamon.  I still think that Luc is a separate person, probably
>Tigraine's brother (and Rand's uncle) since there's a line about his
>claim to the Andorian throne.  As to what his/their part(s) are, I
>have no idea.
It is fairly definite that Luc and Slayer are the same person:  Perrin
Give it a thousand years or so.
wounds Slayer in "DreamLand", and Luc winds up wounded.
>
>>9. Will the land return to its modern jo-car, ho-wing (?) state?
>
>	It would be interesting, but not likely.
Give it about a thousand years ...
The Ages do repeat, which is fairly depressing when you think about it.
>>12. Do the sad-chains get dumped in the ocean? Not likely.  Does Suroth
>>get them?  I hope not.  Why are they sad?
>
>	They supposedly absorbed all the emotions of both the chained
>and the chain-holder, which aren't pleasant most of the time, I'd imagine.
>But I agree that we've not seen the last of it, though I doubt we'll see
>it used on Rand.  Probably on the other False Dragon who escaped, the
>one who still hasn't been Gentled.
Note that the place were Doyle intends to dump them is right next to where
the Seancham are currently trying to figure out what to do next.  Personally,
I feel that we have not seen the last of these, but I hope that we have.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Courtenay Footman			I finally got back on the net.

cpf@alchemy.ithaca.ny.us		Now I will never get anything done
From: dgg@merlin.think.com (David Grubbs)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Venus on the Half-Shell
Date: 9 Oct 92 13:11:53
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.think.com
In-reply-to: FAC_PDEIGL@VAX1.ACS.JMU.EDU's message of 9 Oct 92 16:08:10 GMT

FAC_PDEIGL@VAX1.ACS.JMU.EDU writes:

> Why was [Venus on the Half Shell] written by Farmer and not Vonnegut?
> What is the relationship between Vonnegut and Farmer?  How did the book
> come about and why was it written?  I have found little on the subject
> and would love to know more. 

I believe VotHS was published in 1974 (my books are at home). This
question has shown up on the net somewhere about every 6 months since then.

There was a full interview with Farmer in an issue of Science Fiction
Review I have at home (sometime in 1974 or 5) just after Farmer was
"revealed" as the author.  There was a series of "revelations" printed in
Locus and this even is referred to in various "history of SF" volumes.  I
typed in a long summary of the interview about 15 years ago and it is
sitting in an archive on my home computer.  If I remember to do it, I'll
post it (or mail it) later.

A short explanation from memory:

Farmer arranged to talk to Vonnegut through an Editor at DELL who knew both
of them.  Farmer essentially begged to write the book.  Farmer felt that he
had a lot in common with "Trout".  (Vonnegut said that he did too, reducing
the strength of Farmer's argument.)  Vonnegut agreed on the condition that
his name appear *nowhere* in the book, in advertisements or anywhere else.

The book came out, some critics said "Must be Vonnegut.  Look at the
prose.", and Vonnegut became irritated.  Leslie Fielder, on television with
Vonnegut watching, said that he had talked to the author, who would have
written it with or without Vonnegut's permission.  Vonnegut exploded.
Farmer was already in the middle of the next book ( . . . Jimmy Valentine?)
and the deal fell through.  In one interview Vonnegut refused to use
Farmer's name, merely referring to him as "a meat and potatoes Science
Fiction writer."  In all, a medium amount of noise among fans of SF and
Vonnegut's books.

There were more details.

I read a few of Vonnegut's earlier books before I started reading a vast
amount of SF.  It only occurred to me later that Kilgore Trout was supposed
to be Theodore Sturgeon.  No arguments, please.  If the name was Billy
Smith, I might suspect a coincidence, but names like those are not related
by chance.
From: ca572@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark L. Stackpole)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Heinlein reference in Sturgeons "The Golden Helix"
Date: 7 Oct 1992 17:09:07 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Mike Norman writes:
	>Arson MacDonald WAS one of R.A.H.'s pseudonums...the 
	>editorial staff found out and asked him not to do this
	>anymore...
Actually, John W Campbell was more than happy to get his hands on
as much fiction Heinlein was able to produce: he needed a steady
source to fill his magazine every month.
The reason Campbell published some of Heinlien's fiction under
the name Arson MacDonald was that everything under the Heinlein
byline was part of the "Future History" series. 
This wasn't a secret. I think Campbell said as much when he
printed in Astounding Heinlein's Future History timeline/chart.