From: osmith@acorn.co.uk (Owen Smith)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Opinions sought (long)
Date: 21 Jul 92 13:27:46 GMT
Organization: Acorn Computers Ltd, Cambridge, England

In article <23944@castle.ed.ac.uk> elee52@castle.ed.ac.uk (W Gammie) writes:

>In article <16919@acorn.co.uk> osmith@acorn.co.uk (Owen Smith) writes:

>>I encountered two big problems that evening. The first was that some of my
>>friends just couldn't cope with me being in drag - mainly the women

>    I'm surprised by that.  Usually I find that women are much less
>  put out by cross dressing than men.

[stuff deleted]

>I really don't know about your female friends.

A lot of them are serious born again Christians, in fact there is a good
correlation between the Christians and the ones who were freaked out (with
the notable exception that the one who laughed when I entered a room for
months afterwords is not a Christian). So I am doubly surprised, since their
attitude was not very Christian. But then, I count myself a Christian yet I
seem to have a different view on what that means than most people. To me
stuff like going to church, converting "heathens" ie. destroying their
culture, believing everything written in the bible, and even believing in
God are not pre-requisites for being a Christian. Christ preached about
being good, kind and helpful to people, and to me that is what Christianity
is about - being a good person. Maybe I should start a new religion? :-)

Another point to bear in mind is that this party was held by under-
graduates. I'm 26, most of them were 18 to 21. On the other hand since
they're at Cambridge Univeristy they're supposed to be intelligent - I would
have thought that went hand in hand with the ability to see through the veil
of society-imposed stereotypes, but obviously not.

[lots deleted]

>    Welcome to the other half's view on men.  The first time a man
> put his hand up my skirt I just stood there foolishly, wishing this
> wasn't happening to me and hoping it would stop soon.   Men (some
> men only) do this sort of thing all the time.  They wouldn't dream
> of doing it to another male figure but since you were presenting
> a female image he felt it was ok to treat you the same way as he'd
> treat a woman.  It obviously didn't matter to him how uncomfortable
> you felt as long as you gave in and slept with him.   This abuse
> and oppression is much easier to perpretrate if there is a
> perceived power imbalance.  Your mode of dress implied (to him) such
> an imbalance.

I'm assuming in your case that the man who put his hand up your skirt
thought you were a woman. In my case he most definitely knew I was male (if
none of my friends had recognised me they wouldn't have let me in to the
party for a start). Are you claiming that even though he knew I was male,
because I projected a female image he could treat me badly? What a horrible
thought! Reminds me of the hell women have to go through in rape cases eg.
crap about them being provocatively dressed and thus "asking for it". (I
think this thread is drifting rather here!) 

>      Remember, you always have the option of your male strength
>      to draw on but I would be reluctant to get in a fight - you
>      could always lose.

Being a basically non-violent person, I'm not keen this option but surely
even if you lose the fight and get a black eye or whatever for your
troubles, you'll still have put the guy off. If he continues at this point
then you are clearly in a rape situation, and you have bruises from the
fight to prove it. Plus other people will have seen the fight. So if you
don't mind ruining your clothes and losing some teeth (really nasty for a
brass player like me) then this a viable option :-) :-).

Owen.

The views expressed are my own and are not necessarily those of Acorn.
Newsgroups: soc.bi