HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: GC.SUL@forsythe.stanford.edu (Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Sentimentality
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 23:45:17 GMT



      linda@linda.intel.com (Linda Harbin) writes"
Subject: Re: sentementality

In article <1aq4acINNi9n@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, pallas@CEPHALO.NEUSC.BCM.TMC.EDU (Sarah Pallas) writes:
|> Sarah Pallas and Monty (my half-leased horse who is owned and loved by
                                                                 ^^^^^^^^
|> somebody else!)
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Don't you love him too?

This thread has really gotten me thinking.  My other horse, Asa, never gave
me the chance to put him down.  He died before the vet and I could make a
decision.  But now I have Reba who, many of you may remember, has bone spavins.
I am still riding her but if I want to get into serious riding, I am going
to have to look at getting another horse.  Since I cannot afford two horses,
I want to find a good home for her and will not look for another horse until
I have found a home for Reba.  The thought keeps crossing my mind that with
her bone spavins, I may not be able to find a good home for her and I would
rather put her down that risk her going to a bad home.

Now the hard question.  I do not want to start any flame wars but if I have
to put her down, do I have the vet do it or do I sell her to the meat
market and get some money out of her.  I know this sounds cold and I really
agonize over it.  I hear horrible stories of how horses are treated on their
way to the meat market, then I hear other people say the horrible stories are
just rumors and horses are not treated that way.  How do you know?

Like I said, I do not want to start a flame war, but does anyone out there
have any thoughts on this subject?

***************************************************
        Linda Harbin       Hillsboro, Oregon
        503-696-2261       linda@littlei.intel.com
***************************************************
--------------------------------------------------------------------

My friend had a really hard decision when her old Appy was diagnosed
with arthritis.  She could have the vet come out and euthanize the
horse and pay a backhoe to bury him (total cost of about $275)  WE
have no rendering plants close by so have to have horses buried in
our county.

She call a couple of auctions and found out that all the meat buyers
in our part of California would truck horses to Texas.  After
hearing the horror stories about condiditons, she called up to
Oregon and found a Slaughter House near Bend.  She talked to the
owner and decided to take the horse up there herself.  The owner was
really nice, and they arranged to have her drop off the horse on the
morning it would be put down.  She was content with the owner,
conditions and I guess got about $350 for the horse, which was used
to buy another horse for her kids.

Karen
From: ssr@cco.caltech.edu (Steve Scott Roy)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Riding in the Los Angeles area?
Date: 27 Sep 92 19:54:54 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: sandman.caltech.edu

I'm thinking of getting into riding, possibly jumping.  Is there a
good place for a beginner within a couple hours of Pasadena?

Steve Roy
ssr@ama.caltech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: kw@cbnews.cb.att.com (kathleen.m.wilber)
Subject: Re: Letting Run Loose
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 15:03:31 GMT

In article <1adm8kINN8n0@gap.caltech.edu> kloomis@cco.caltech.edu (Kate
	E. Loomis) writes:
>Other than that, it all depends on how the picking order "shakes out", as
>someone else mentioned. I'm not sure how one would aid this. Someone 
>said, if you have an idea where a horse will end up in the picking order, 
>it helps. How do you factor that into which pairs of horses to put 
>together first? Do you start with the horse that you think the new horse
>will be closest to? 
>
>Kate
>

One way I've seen it done is: If a good guess can be made that New horse
will end up between A and B, introduce New to A, then B: there will be
two pecking order sort-outs, resulting in A-New-B.
The remaining horses, if they accept A and B's assessment of the
situation, will sort themselves out on either side of New based on where
they stood compared to A and B, with minimal additional fuss.

Kathy Wilber
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: schlumpf@uimrl7.mrl.uiuc.edu ()
Subject: An Invitation to Model Horse Folks
Reply-To: schlumpf@uimrl7.mrl.uiuc.edu ()
Organization: Materials Research Lab
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 20:18:59 GMT


Hi everyone!

I thought as school has started up again and folks have had time
to get into the swing of things (and those of us who don't go to
school have, maybe, gotten out of the summer brain death :) )
that I would post a general invitation. A while ago (don't ask me
when, I've forgotten) I started a small informal e-mail mailing
list for model horse (principally Breyers, but also Hartland, 
Hagen-Renaker, and Marx, etc.) folks. We have collectors, 
remakers, showers, the works. And if anyone is interested in
joining us I encourage you to drop me a line. Or, if you are just
curious about the model horse hobby, ANY of us would MORE
than happily fill you in...and if you have any sitting around in
the attic or basement you want to sell, let us know too!!!

Hope to hear from some of you soon!!!

Kay   Schlumpf






Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: woit@qucis.queensu.ca (Denise Woit)
Subject: Re: sentementality
Organization: Computing & Information Science, Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 18:34:00 GMT


As a kid I rode some horses on a farm that was about a mile from a slaughter-
house that killed cows, horses and pigs. The slaughter-house had a *long*
driveway up to it, about 1/2 mile. The s-house owner said we could ride
on the trails behind the place if we wanted.

The funny thing was, we could never get the horses to go up his driveway.
They would turn themselves inside out not to go; they were truly scared.
We rode these horses everywhere, beside the highway, over bridges, swimming, 
etc; and we knew the difference between real fear and just stubbornness. 
They were scared.

Not that I know, but I always imagined that even if the ride to the 
s-house was OK, the horse would spend its time there (before being killed)
in a terrified state.

The farm where I rode the horses also had cows and pigs which they slaughtered 
on a regular basis--and this didn't seem to bother the horses one bit.
It's no wonder I became a vegetarian!!
							...Denise
From: mary@cloudpeak.tivoli.com (Mary Anthony)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Request for Horse GIFs
Date: 30 Sep 92 06:58:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: cloudpea.MARY.92Sep30155815
Organization: TIVOLI Systems, Inc.


Hello,

I missed the horse GIFs:-(.  If there is anyone out there with the time to send
them to me I'd appreciate it. 

Thanks


***************** Mary Anthony, TIVOLI Systems, Inc. *******************
*			mary@tivoli.com                                *
*    In the end...everything will be found to be true of everybody.    *
********************  Lawrence Durrell, Balthazar  *********************
  
--
***************** Mary Anthony, TIVOLI Systems, Inc. *******************
*			mary@tivoli.com                                *
*    In the end...everything will be found to be true of everybody.    *
********************  Lawrence Durrell, Balthazar  *********************
  
From: kris@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com (kris troxel)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 14:17:22 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: trucks? Now Trailers
Organization: Hewlett Packard - Boise, ID
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian

American Horseman Trailers are made here in Boise, Idaho by American Trailer
Mfg. Their phone number is 208-375-0019. The owner is Bob Evangelho, ask for
him if you call. He is a riding buddy of mine and would get a kick out of this.
I know that Bob makes a "light" trailer, that he advertises for mainly highway
travel, as opposed to the heavier type like mine. I pull my trailer over
some pretty rough roads, so it is made to withstand the abuse. Also mine is
double walled and fully enclosed with drop down windows on one side. This
adds more weight. Hope this was the info you were looking for.

Kris Troxel
From: donnag@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Donna Griffiths)
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 18:36:07 GMT
Subject: Re: Choices People Make (was Grooming, Ginger etc.)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian

SET an EXAMPLE!

Remember if you  DISAGREE  with the choices  others make to show, don't
quit!!  You MUST  continue,  even if you do not win, to make  sure some
body is aware of what YOU feel is "RIGHT"

If the show ring is  abandoned  to  "abusers"  then all show horses may
suffer.  If we  continue  to show  with  our  various  choices  made to
benefit our horses, we may still WIN out over the ginger-clip-rip group
in terms of having happy horses and showing.

If enough people stand up for what they feel is right the show ring may
become  the  place we would  all like it to be-- a fair  exhibition  of
humans and equine  friends and a good time for ALL.  Help new people to
see that not all show folks are  "cruel" and that some show  horses are
happy, or at least not miserable!

Otherwise  showing  is most  certainly  doomed  and new  people  may be
trapped into this, too.

Wasn't all this supposed to be FUN?


Donna "setting an example" G.

AA
From: tracy@scoraz.resp-sci.arizona.edu (Tracy Scheinkman)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: re: founder???
Date: 6 Oct 92 07:10:20 GMT
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ


	This is from the Equus magazine glossary,

	founder -- internal deformity of the foot, resulting from rotation
		of the coffin bone due to simultaneous detachment from the
		hoof wall and pull by the deep flexor tendon.

that won't really help you much without the next definition,

	laminitis -- disturbance  of the sensitive plates of soft tissue, or
		laminae, in the horse's foot.  Acute laminitis refers to a 
		disturbance with rapid onset and brief duration, while chronic
		laminitis is a persistent, long-term disturbance.  Either, in
		severe cases may result in founder.

Basically when a horse gets an inflamation of the sensitive laminae to the 
point where there is tissue death, the connection between the front of the
hoof and the coffin bone is lost and the coffin bone is pulled so that it
points downward, that is founder.  The causes are numerous, but basically
anything that causes the soft tissue of the foot to swell can cause it.  These
things include heat founder caused by riding in a very overheated trailer
or other being kept in an enclosed hot area too long, grain founder caused
by an overload of carbohydrates usually in the form of grain, impact founder
caused by too much impact on hard surfaces over a long period of time (many
horses who are recovering from fractures get this because of carrying too
much weight on one leg over a long period of time), grass founder
caused by eating too much early growth rich or wet grass, and toxicity
founder caused by the absorbtion of certain poisonous chemicals either
by eating or through the skin this is often seen with horses exposed to
hardwood shavings such as black walnut shavings or eating red maple leaves
or other toxic plants.  Laminitis and founder are a potential complication
to certain other illnesses such as colic and also complicated birthings
(caused in this case by a retained placenta).  Drinking too much water
too fast when very overheated can also cause founder though the mechanism
is not well understood.  By hot here we mean that the horse has just been
exercising and his or her muscles are still hot, breathing has not yet
returned to normal, and the horse is sweating profusely.  Most horses
are pretty smart about not drinking too much too fast, however it is wise
to allow a hot horse only five swallows at a time and then continue
walking the horse administering water in small quanitities while walking
until the horse's breathing and muscle temperatures have returned to
normal.  Not walking a hot horse after the horse has drunk seems very
much to be a component of this type of founder.  That's all the info
I have.  Hope this helps.

				Tracy and Bruce (beautiful man) and
				Cachet (7 year old Arabian mare, mother
				of Mithril) and Mithril (2 year old
				Arabian filly) and The Cats.
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: lbm@avs.com (Linda B. Merims)
Subject: Re: Letting Run Loose
Organization: Advanced Visual Systems Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 15:31:25 GMT
X-Posted-From: phobos.avs.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

My "Morgan Horse" magazine just came in.  It has an article on 
run-in sheds.  The article mentions some data from a series of
experiments conducted by Dr. Katharine Houghp (sp?) at Cornell
University (she is an animal behavior expert).

When left in a position to choose, horses choose to spend
85-95% of their daylight time outside.  These figures are not affected
by cold.  They are affected by wet.  In that case, the time
outside drops to an average of about 75%.  No data was given
for night.  Horses alone spend more time inside than horses
with companions.  The article said the "key thing" was that
the horse be able to see other horses.

The article also made the usual points that horses turned out
have fewer stall vices, fewer digestive ailments like colic (from
browsing all day rather than eating in lumps), and better overall
health, particularly respiratory, than horses kept largely inside.

Linda B. Merims
From: pxjones@crdec6.apgea.army.mil (Paulette Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Brenderup
Date: 1 Oct 92 07:00:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: crdec6.9210011036.aa21562
Reply-To: equestrians@world.std.com
Organization: BBN news/mail gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: news.bbn.com

I have a friend with a Brenderup trailer that needs the floor
replaced.  She can't find a phone number for a dealer near us
(Baltimore, MD).  Does anyone know any dealers within several
states (like even Pennsylvania, Virginia, Ohio)?  The trailer
is not very old (5-6 yrs) and she always cleans it after every
use (which is only 1 horse every other week to a lesson, usually),
so she is unhappy about the floor tearing up.  You can send
e-mail to:  pxjones@crdec.apgea.army.mil

Thanks.  Paulette & Nipper
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: rudy@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (avram.r.vener)
Subject: Re: leading
Organization: AT&T
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 16:17:06 GMT

In article <3030359@hpfcmgw.FC.HP.COM> wendy@hpfcmgw.FC.HP.COM (Wendy Milner) writes:
>
>First the horse needs to know what is expected.  The TEAM method
>
Oh yes, before I forget again... What does TEAM (or TTEAM) stand for?


--
Rudy Vener uucp: att!mtqua!rudy  internet: rudy@mtqua.att.com
From: melanie@cayman.amd.com (Melanie Typaldos)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Scrambling in the trailer
Date: 6 Oct 92 17:36:42 GMT
Article-I.D.: dvorak.1992Oct6.173642.14660
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc., Austin, Texas

In article <199210022145.AA26291@world.std.com> equestrians@world.std.com writes:
>I wonder if putting your scrambler on the inside stall of the trailer (ie
>on the driver's side) might diminish her scrambling.
[Stuff deleted]
>
>virginia
>athens, ga.

I'd like to thank everyone who responded to my original post about
a week ago.  There were some good points, which I'd like to 
summarize here:

  1) The type of trailer may make a big difference to how the 
     horse rides.  Some prefer stock trailers, others slant
     trailers.  My trailer is a two horse, side-by-side, and
     I don't want my truck to pull anything heavier.  Anyway,
     I already have it and it's still practically new!
  2) Horses prefer to ride facing the rear.  I've heard a lot
     about this but once again, can't be done in my trailer.
  3) The partition between the two horses shouldn't go all
     the way to the floor.  This gives the horses more room to
     move their feet around to balance.  At least I got this
     one right!
  4) The horses' heads should have a partition between them.
     My trailer has this, it's just bars though.  I thought
     it would seem more open and they might like to see each
     other.
  5) Smooth driving is very important.  I really work at this
     so I think I'm doing okay here.
  6) Non-skid floors help the horse to balance.  I have rubber
     mats which I put shavings on to absorb the moisture.
     Why do they always do it as soon as they get in?
  7) As stated above, some horses prefer one side of the
     trailer over the other.

As it turned out, I took my mare to a show on Saturday.  She
scrambled like crazy on the way up.  On the way back, I put
her on the driver's side and she was quiet the whole time.  So
that was it.  Luckily, my gelding hasn't been trailered enough
(remember he wouldn't get in) to develop a preference.  This
also explains why the scrambling problem seemed to escalate 
so suddenly. When I trailer only one horse, they always go on
the driver's side.  Since my gelding is still not the best
loader in the world, and my mare is, I always loaded him first
and so he was on the driver's side these past few trips.

Anyway, problem solved but these animals sure have their little
quirks don't they?

----Melanie
Melanie (Melanie Typaldos)        melanie@cayman.amd.com  
AMD 29K Systems Engineering
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: mary@cairo.watson.ibm.com (Mary McHugh)
Subject:  National HS, Nov. 3 thru Nov. 8 
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 92 13:31:38 GMT
Reply-To: mary@cairo.watson.ibm.com (Mary McHugh)
Organization: IBM TJ Watson Home for Tired Hackers

Well, I finally dug up the information on the National Horse Show,
so, here it goes:
National Horse Show, Meadowlands Arena NJ,  TUESDAY, NOV 3 thru SUNDAY, NOV 8

Special Features:   Budweiser Clydesdales, Petting Zoo & Pony Rides,
Girl Scout/Brownie Merit Badge Clinics, 2-time superhorse Rugged Lark,
Educational Program

Tuesday
8 AM	Hunters
1 PM	Fine Harness, 3/5-Gaited, Hunters
7:30 PM World Cup Grand Prix, 5 Gaited, Roadster Pony

Wednesday
8 AM	Hunters
1 PM	Intl/Open Jumper Speed Class, Fine Harness, 3-Gaited, Hunters
7:30	Hunters, 3/5-Gaited, 4 in Hand, Intl/Open Puissance

Thursday
8 AM	Hunters
1 PM	Open Jumpers, 3/5-Gaited, Hunters
7:30PM	Intl Team Jumping-Nation's Cup, $100K Breeder's Jackpot for
	Saddlebred Weanlings, 4 in Hand - Appointments

Friday
7:30 AM	Hunters (Pony & Junior), Side-Saddle, A-0 Jumper
11 AM	Lge/Med Pony Hunter U/S, USPC Mounted Games Championships (1st rnd)
1 PM	Hunters, Side-Saddle, AHSA Saddle Seat Medal Zone Championship
	Roadster Pony, A-O Jumpers 
7:30 PM	3-Gaited Grand Championship, Side-Saddle, Fine Harness, 5-Gaited
	Grand Championship, 4 in Hand - Timed Obstacle, Open Jumpers  

Saturday
7 AM	Hunters (Pony & Junior), NHS Good Hands Eliminations, USPC Mounted
	Games Championship (2nd rnd)
12N	Lead Line, USPC Mounted Games (3rd rnd)
1PM	Open Jumpers, Lead Line, 3-Gaited, NHS Good Hands Finals, A-O Jumpers
7:30 PM	Grand Prix of NY, 3-Gaited, Fine Harness, 5-Gaited

Sunday
7 AM	Rolex-Maclay Eliminations, NJ Parade of Breeds
1 PM	USPC Mounted Games (Final rnd), Maclay Finals, 4 in Hand

TICKETS:  EVENING Tues-Sat, 7:30 PM
	  DAYTIME Tues-Thurs, 8 AM - 5PM;  Fri 7AM - 5PM; Sat 7AM - 5:30;
		  Sun 7AM - 6PM

	Evenings	Evenings	Daytime		Daytime		Daytime
	(Tues-Thurs)	(Fri-Sat)	(Tues-Fri)	Saturday	Sunday
VIP 	$40		$40		$15		$35		$35
LOWER	$15		$25		$10		$20		$25
UPPER	$10		$15		$5		$15		$15

TicketMaster:  (201)-507-8900, (212)-307-7171, (609)-520-8383, (914)-454-3388
Ticket Info :  (201)-935-3900	National Horse Show Ticket Dept.,
Meadowlands 		                 Arena, P.O. Box 512, E. Rutherford, NJ 07073



Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: "D. McLellan-Savoie" <LS45@UNB.CA>
Subject: Re: sentementality
Organization: The University of New Brunswick
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 11:56:22 GMT

In article <Bvnt2A.3pC@knot.ccs.queensu.ca> woit@qucis.queensu.ca (Denise Woit) writes:
>In article <1992O> GC.SUL@forsythe.stanford.edu (Sullivan) writes:
>
>>                                              ...  My horse was
>>really my best friend for 7 years and I feel really sorry for the
>>way I let her down in the end
>
>This brings to mind an article I just read in the paper. The headlines said
>something about a guy stipulating in his will that his horses be shot when
>he died. Apparently its been a year since the man died, and the RCMP haven't
>killed the horses yet, and don't really want to. My first reaction was "good
>for them", but after reading the article, I saw that it wasn't so clear-cut.
>The following info is from the article.
>
>They are percheron horses. They were used, as apparently most percherons are
>in Newfoundland, to compete in pulling contests. Some believe these contests
>are cruel, because the horse is hitched to heavier and heavier weights, and
>whipped until they're so exhausted that they can't pull anymore. They win
>based on weight pulled per pound of horse; thus, it is supposed to be a
>common practice for people to try to starve weight off a horse before a
>competition (I know this sounds stupid, but that's what they said.)
>
>This man thought the contests cruel, so he bought three of the top prize
>winners himself, so that they would never have to endure these contests again.
>They became pets. He knew that when he died, the horses would probably
>eventually end up in these contests again (they are young.) So he wanted them
>put down when he died.
>
>
{part omitted}
>       ...Denise
>
>.
>.
This was actually in New Brunswick, and the last that was on the news
(one day last week), the horses are to be sent to Kings Landing, a
historical settlement in Kings Landing, where they should get quite
good care.
DMS

Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts,rec.arts.tv
From: burdickd@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Dakin Burdick)
Subject: Re: Kung Fu TV series
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 20:06:41 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.183527.24839@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> ddukhovn@nyx.cs.du.edu (The Great Harlequin) writes:
IN RESPONSE TO MY COMMENT (BELOW) RE: "CIRCLE OF IRON"
>>AIEE!  It always amazes me that people liked this movie.  I can see
>>that it might have been good with Lee, but with Carradine and his
>>blonde bohunk barbarian buddy, it is a real stinkeroo!  Danger,
>>Danger, Will Robinson!  Run Away!  Run Away!
>
>So, my friend, tell me what you though was wrong with it other than the fact
>that the two lead actors hadn't made any OTHER good movies.  What, pray tell,
>did it lack?  (This is not an attack...I truly am curious how someone could
>dislike this movie.)

Let's see...  no good fight scenes (usually the only redeeming part of
a martial arts movie), which leaves rotten acting, lousy special
effects, and a completely unbelieveable blonde barbarian hero in
loincloth (a He-man/Conan imitation of Kwai Chang Caine?).  As I said
before the plot had promise, but watching the movie is not the way 
to enjoy that (just get the book; you can buy it for 50 cents at most
used book stores).  Now, what did you like?  And how would you rank it
in comparison to other m.a. movies (Enter the Dragon, Karate Kid, Best
of the Best, Iron & Silk, etc.)?

Dakin
burdickd@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
From: garry@alice.att.com (garry hodgson)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Butterfly Knife
Date: 28 Sep 92 14:36:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.23740
Reply-To: garry@alice.UUCP ()
Distribution: world
Organization: AT&T, Bell Labs

In article <D26PRB2w165w@ziggys.cts.com> cobra@ziggys.cts.com 619/262-6384 (Ron Lee) writes:

   This is also being sent via Email to the author, but I thought others 
   might like to know:

   Try _The_Balisong_Manual_  and _The Advanced_Balisong_Manual_

   I think the books were written by Dan Inosanto, or some such 
   pretty-famous martial artist.  Look for it in general bookstores.

I think it was Jeff Imada.

-- 
Garry Hodgson			A slow winter day
AT&T Bell Labs			A night like forever
garry@alice.att.com		Sink like a stone
att!alice!garry			Float like a feather