HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bfoo_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Brian E. Foont)
Subject: Re: The difference between a chasid and a misnagid
Organization: University of Rochester
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 02:17:52 GMT

>Brody herem of 1772(?)

When I was in England last year I asked the head of the United Synagogue
Beis Din whether the cheremim against the Hasidim were still in effect.
His answer were definitely NO.  In addition, his reasoning was that a
cherem is not made indefintely, even Rav Gershom's cherem would run out
if it had not become standard practive.  A cherem can be terminated
by the person against whom it has been placed changes their ways.  The
Hassidim are quite different from what they were when the Cherem was placed.
It was placed because in the words of the Vilna Goan, "Torah would be lost
in Israel," i.e. they were not studying Torah, but rather telling stories
of the "Tzadikim."  This is not longer the case, while stories of the
tzadikim are still told, there is emphasis on Torah and Talmud study.

>other than Rav Shacht that Habad is heretical (kofar b'ikor).

This is also the "Rav" that stated, "Given the opportunity he would strike
Rabbi Scheerson down with a sword."  Given this, his distain for Chabad is
just that, only against Chabad.  He has not said anything about the other
groups of Chasidim being under Cherem.  Thus, if it were the fact that
Chasidim have Rebbes they would all be banned, this is not the case.

>
>Norman Miller
>

While I do not agree with the idea of having a rebbe, even mitnagdim have the
idea of having a rabbi, they get it from Pirke Avos, "Make for yourself
a Rabbi."  We must be careful to judge the value they place on their
rebbes.  As I see it the idea of the rebbe being a conduit is not quite
accurate, rather the rebbe is seen as the leader in all areas of life.

I can see the flames coming already.

Brian E. Foont
bfoo_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu

My opinions are my own, but you may share them.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: dkhaikin@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dmitry Khaikin)
Subject: Re: Homosexuals should be allowed into the military
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 20:56:01 GMT

In article <lexier.725574259@sfu.ca> lexier@fraser.sfu.ca (Mr. Spock) writes:
>
>Hello everyone,
>     Homosexuals should NOT be discriminated against.  Homosexuals should
>be allowed into the military.  I cannot comprehend why so many people discrim-
>inate against gays in the military.  
>     There are many different types of gay people, just like straight people.
>There are gays who are caring individuals, rabbis, charitable people in the
>community, teachers, fathers, doctors, and the list goes on.  In fact there are
>more straight people who rape and kill women than there are gay men who rape
>and or murder other men.  It is just in the news media where you get a different
>picture of gays.  They are always so ready to broadcast a sick faggot who raped
>and murdered ten young boys, yet they don't report good and honorable gays who
>have contributed to our community at large.
>     Gays are just like you and me.  Why discriminate against them?
> 

Gays are not just like you and me, but I do agree that they should not
be discriminated against. I personally believe that those people are
sick (whether it is in them from the time of birth or not), so, one
should not discriminate against sick people. (I am saying this without
any sarcasm!)

Thanks,
Dima
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  "A word is worth one coin; silence is worth two."_____ The Talmud.
  "Silence is good everywhere, except in connection with Torah."____ The Zohar.
  dkhaikin@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu  ( Dmitry Khaikin, Columbus Ohio )
From: ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Vijay Bhucha:, and Bill Gripp: JESUS IS NOT A MESSAYAH!
Date: 24 Dec 92 12:42:40 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <1992Dec22.140348.17495@bony1.bony.com>
billg@bony1.bony.com (Bill Gripp) writes:

>In article <4584@bimacs.BITNET> ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon
Ehrlich) writes:

>
>>>I hope you don't teach logic.  =|^)
>>
>>I do teach logic.
>
>I hope it's better than your Anglish.  =B^)
>Note to the humor impaired: This is sarcasm.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I think it is one more demonstration of Bill moral and hence one more
proof that jesus is not a messayah.

 His indirect argument about my logic is as valis as saying that Bill
logic is not better than his HEBREW !!!

>>It seemed that Bill do accept the validity of my proof as to the fact
>>that jesus is not a messayah.
>
>Your logic at work again?

Yes, and you should take my last statement as a complement, be happy
with that and get out this net.The faster the better.

Shalom   gideon Ehrlich


Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.soviet,soc.culture.turkish
From: colten@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (marc.colten)
Subject: Re: ACLU/AJC Menorah Police?
Summary: Miller - Jewish or not?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 15:45:23 GMT

In article <9212231344.AA16148@hrt213.brooks.af.mil>, tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil (Tim Miller) writes:
> On Wed, 23 Dec 1992 13:05:31 GMT, colten@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (marc.colten) said:
> 
> M> Police officials identified the man as David Miller, 44, of suburban
> M> Loveland.  He was arrested, charged with disorderly conduct and
> M> released.
> 
> 	[...]
> 
> M> Now, what is the public going to remember - that the Klan put the
> M> cross up, or (and I'm guessing here) that a Jew tore it down?
> 
> 	Who said he was Jewish?  Plenty of goys named Miller out there,
> I assure you.
> 

More than plenty.  As I said, I'm guessing. If someone comes up with
authoritative evidence one way or another - let me know.  I am
saying that unless Miller was black - it is more likely that he
is Jewish than not - to get that heated about it.

We'll see what the reaction is when more evidence is in. But my
point is still proven.  Chabad said they had the right to put up
a menorah.  The Klan used that right to put up a cross.  Some
people (more than one) decided they had the right to tear down
the cross (not a burning one, just a white Xian cross).  So
who are we going to complain to when someone decides to vandalize
the menorah, or to put up another cross?

marc colten
From: bb099@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Adam Trent Phillips)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Nazi Jokes (?)
Date: 24 Dec 1992 21:13:37 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc10.ins.cwru.edu


	Why did the nazi not change his kid's diaper for a week ?



	Becuase the box said "for up to 20 pounds"

-- 
A. TRENT PHILLIPS |" A mirror is a negative space with a frame and a place for
  also known as   | your face, it reveals what the rest of us see. It conceals
   WHITE  ROOK    | what you'd like you to be."--Blue Oyster Cult
-------bb099@cleveland.freenet.edu-----aa1439@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu-------
From: israel@unixg.ubc.ca (Robert B. Israel)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Hanukkah's significance
Date: 21 Dec 92 20:22:47 GMT
Organization: The University of British Columbia
NNTP-Posting-Host: unixg.ubc.ca

In <1992Dec17.175744.24913@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay) writes:

>In article <92352.084232YZKCU@CUNYVM.BITNET> Yaakov Kayman <YZKCU@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
>>I've been hearing a lot, especially lately, from fellow-Jews who describe
>>Hanukkah as a minor holiday. I find this disturbing.

>Okay, Hanukah's a great holiday. Nevertheless, I think we have to
>consider it a minor holiday, as compared to the holidays which
>are instituted in the Torah.

>Many (most?) Americans have heard of Hanukah and have never heard
>of Shavuout or Sukkot. Many Jews celebrate Hanukah and never
>notice Shavuot. I think it's a good idea to remind everyone that
>as Jewish holidays go, Hanukah is not one of the big ones.

That Jews celebrate Hanuka and not Shavuot, I agree, is a shame.  That
non-Jewish Americans (and Canadians) have heard about Hanukah and not
Shavuot is, to me, not so disturbing.  It has to do with the essence of
the holiday, and not just the proximity of that other holiday.

Uniquely among the Jewish holidays, Hanukah has the aspect of "proclaiming
the miracle", which is the point of lighting the candles.  They are placed
where they can be seen, not just by Jews, but by everyone.  Hanukah is
the time when we proclaim to the rest of the world, "We are still here!
We have been miraculously preserved, like that last jug of pure oil, and
we are still able to contribute our light to the world by following G-d
in our own way!"

>I think it's healthy to keep a sense of perspective.

Quite true.  

-- 
Robert Israel                            israel@math.ubc.ca
Department of Mathematics             or israel@unixg.ubc.ca
University of British Columbia
Vancouver, BC, Canada V6T 1Y4
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller)
Subject: Re: The difference between a chasid and a misnagid
Organization: Trinity College, Hartford, CT.
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 15:34:51 GMT

my.chem.utoronto.ca> <isaac.724902252@etrog>
Sender:
Followup-To:
Distribution:
Organization: Trinity College, Hartford, CT.
Keywords:

In article <isaac.724902252@etrog> isaac@etrog.se.citri.edu.au (Isaac Balbin) wr

ites:

>There is little doubt that today Rav Shach's followers are acting more like
>Chassidim when it comes to subservience as a means of complying with
>the so called `Daas Torah' (or as Professor Kaplan calls it Deos Torah!).
>
>PS. Even the Chosid should be happy when others adopt Chassidic concepts.
>    Most certainly there was no intention to offend.

Maybe Hasidim are pleased that their perversion of the relation
between Kahal and Rav has spread, but should the rest of us be?

Of course this doesn't _begin_ with dinosaurs like Shach; I have
in mind the Kheyfets Khaim and the Agudas Yisroel in prewar Poland.

In fairness to the misnagdim, however, they cannot be accused of
peddling the heretical idea of a Rebbe who --like the Church--
stands between man and God.  Hasidim have that field to themselves.

Norman Miller

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Subject: Re: Kahane's philosophy
Reply-To: makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Organization: Arizona State University, Tempe AZ
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 21:12:49 GMT

In article <2503@itexjct.jct.ac.il> warren@itexjct.jct.ac.il (Warren Burstein) writes:

# In <1992Dec28.145841.27491@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
 
# >	But he has controlled himself.  He has not killed anyone.  As to
# >seeking counseling, that is only necessary if he is about to do
# >something.  He does not need counseling just because he made that
# >statement.
 
# He most certainly does need whatever it takes to prevent him from
# making statements of this sort, lest someone take him literally and
# "kills any Arab who stands in our way".  I don't care if it's
# counseling, a neder not to talk to reporters, so long as it stops.

	I disagree.  If anyone does take him literally than that person
has problems that would not be helped by anything Binyamin would do.
The only difference is that the time and or target might be different.

	As for Binyamin personally, making those statements is certainly a
lot healthier than actually acting them out.

# From your point of view David, would it not be a desecration of the
# memory of his father for an act of murder to be attributed to his
# purported followers?

	Yes.  However, only an anti semite would pin something like this
on Binyamin unless Binyamin had something more to do with it than
uttering a very understandable feeling.

# Would it not be in the interest of those who
# truly understand his teachings to urge restraint rather than public

	Nope.  What should be urged are the proper actions.  However, any
Arab who is a threat should be prepared for the consequences.

# -- 
# /|/-\/-\
# |__/__/_/
# |warren@
# / nysernet.org


--
	There are three types of people in the world.  Those that are good
at math and those that are not.

makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu
From: Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Jewish Christmas Carol Hits
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 10:59:14 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

I never thought about this before, but after hearing Barbara Streisand
doing a christmas song, it occured to me that she's Jewish, isn't she?
So what are the biggest Christmas hits sung by Jews? I guess music is
music, and a buck is a buck. Was there ever a Hanakuh hit record?








Arthur_t_hu@portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: gertler@cyclone.sbi.com (Don Gertler)
Subject: Re: Talmud on determining sex
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <gertler@cyclone.sbi.com (Don Gertler)>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 19:31:45 GMT

ohayon@jcpltyo.jcpl.co.jp (Tsiel Ohayon) writes:

> I guess it is harder explaining with triplets and more :-)

Split decision by the judges.

-Don Gertler
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: mark@fenris.albany.edu (Mark Steinberger)
Subject: Re: ERETZ YISRAEL (was Re: deportation)
Organization: State University of New York at Albany
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 93 01:52:37 GMT

In article <1i4603INNicr@life.ai.mit.edu> gwydion@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Mercenary Programmer) writes:
>The fact that some Jews have always lived in the land of Israel
>from the time of Aaron does not change the fact that other Jews
>currently living in that area are colonists.

Colonists? What a bigoted thing to say!

For what country would they be colonizing? The only other Jewish
communities of any size are in America and Russia. The American Jews
have not wanted to go to Israel in any number, and the Russian ones
seem to want to leave en masse! Therefore, the Jews in Israel
represent no one but themselves.

Rather, the Jews who went to Israel have been immigrants and refugees.
And they were granted residence by the sovreign governments during the
times they came: first the Ottomans, then the British, and now the
state of Israel.

And the vast majority have been bona fide refugees from the countries
they left.

--Mark
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: lexier@fraser.sfu.ca (Mr. Spock)
Subject: Homosexuals should be allowed into the military
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 20:24:19 GMT


Hello everyone,
     Homosexuals should NOT be discriminated against.  Homosexuals should
be allowed into the military.  I cannot comprehend why so many people discrim-
inate against gays in the military.  
     There are many different types of gay people, just like straight people.
There are gays who are caring individuals, rabbis, charitable people in the
community, teachers, fathers, doctors, and the list goes on.  In fact there are
more straight people who rape and kill women than there are gay men who rape
and or murder other men.  It is just in the news media where you get a different
picture of gays.  They are always so ready to broadcast a sick faggot who raped
and murdered ten young boys, yet they don't report good and honorable gays who
have contributed to our community at large.
     Gays are just like you and me.  Why discriminate against them?
 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Lyle Lexier        | There should be no discrimination against any person   |
|lexier@fraser.sfu.ca | for his/her race, sex, or sexual orientation.          |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: isaac@etrog.se.citri.edu.au (Isaac Balbin)
Subject: Re: Urgent Appeal-Jerusalem Rabbi Mistakenly Arrested!
Organization: Collaborative Information Technology Research Institute
Date: 24 Dec 92 02:11:02 GMT

arens@ISI.EDU (Yigal Arens) writes:

>Sounds pretty fishy.

Hey moron. The floor plan was given to them by the daughter. 

You're fishy. We all knew that Yassir Arens was fishy.

How did he get past my kill file? I thought I had him on permanent

Kill.

>>  They're being help without bail because the police involved
>> think that they've arrested a Mossad hit squad.  One of the rabbis was
>> carrying a business card (in Hebrew).  On the card was a word they got
>> translated-- "mossad."  Mossad means group, and if they had bothered to
>> translate the rest of the card, they would have discovered that it was
>> referring to the local (Israeli) soccer team the rabbi is involved with.
>> Even so, doesn't it seem strange that a Mossad hit-man would carry a
>> business card to that effect?

>Do you really believe this?  If someone could read and translate
>'mossad', they could read and translate the whole thing.

Yes, but they could have that done later, Yassir.

>According to a report in the LA Times, the brothers were detained in the
>Palo Alto area on suspicion of shoplifting.  A subsequent search of
>their car revealed weapons, handcuffs, and a key and floor plans for
>some people's house.

Of course, Yassir, shoplifting! Sounds like they were out to rob a house!
No, perhaps Kidnap.

LADIES AND GENTS WHEN JEWS AND ISRAEL ARE HERE YASSIR ARENS WILL ALWAYS
FIGHT FOR THE GOY.

Ver Deharget Arens.
From: aliki@nova1.stanford.edu (Alexandra Schmidt)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Jewish Christmas Carol Hits
Date: 23 Dec 1992 23:45:42 GMT
Organization: Stanford University
NNTP-Posting-Host: nova1.stanford.edu

In article <1992Dec23.220540.15417@netcom.com> strnlght@netcom.com (David Sternlight) writes:
>
>Jan Peerce was a famous Chazzan as well as a famous opera singer.
>He also performed the Catholic Mass (as written by classical composers)
>so well he moved devout Catholics to tears.
>
>Peter, Paul, and Mary (are any of them Jewish?) did a Christmas show
>containing Chanukah songs as well. Both sets of material were very
>movingly arranged and performed.
>
>David

Peter Yarrow is Jewish.  My Yiddish choir did one of his Chanukah songs (in
English) for a performance last year. . .'Light One Candle' is not my
cup of tea, but I suppose one should not be too picky.

			. . .Alexandra
From: sg04@gte.com (Yechezkal Shimon Gutfreund)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Refuting Xian Missionaries (README)
Date: 28 Dec 92 15:45:45 GMT
Reply-To: sg04@gte.com
Organization: GTE Laboratories, Inc.

In article 3106@israel.nysernet.org, warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein) writes:
]bg = billg@bony1.bony.com (Bill Gripp)
]gf = friedenb@silver.egr.msu.edu (Gedaliah Friedenberg)
]
]gf: If a Christian missionary solemnly warns you that you will burn
]gf: in hell forever unless you accept Jesus, or if they try any other
]gf: type of psychological trick, calmly ask them for a logical proof
]gf: of their beliefs.  Insist on intellectual reasoning.
]
]bg: This is like asking a Jew why they believe the Tanakh.  Yes, it is based
]bg: upon the writtings accepted as scripture by the particular religion, but
]bg: whether you accept only the Tanakh or the "Old" and "New" Testaments is
]bg: ultimately a matter of faith, which is not subject to logic.
]
]I agree that this would be a reasonable question to ask of a
]hypothetical Jewish missionary.  Gedaliah did not suggest asking
]annoying questions of random Christians, only of Christian
]missionaries.

In general, I agree with conducting debates and discussion on a logical,
intellectual basis. However, those who attempt to do this with missionaries
should be aware of the following:

They find intellectualizaion and logical reasoning humerous when applied
to religion. In generally, X-tanity tends to sneer at Mishna, Gemorrah,
etc. as "mixing in intellectualism" into the beauty of "pure faith". There
are strong anti-intellectual tendancies in Xtianity. If one tries to use
such an approach on missionaries, they smile at you as some sort of poor
lost soul who cannot appreciate pure emotianal love. Anyone who has tried
to deal with Jews who have been captured with such cults verify these
observations for you.

---
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Yechezkal Shimon Gutfreund		 		  sgutfreund@gte.com
GTE Laboratories, Waltham MA			    harvard!bunny!sgutfreund
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: dkhaikin@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dmitry Khaikin)
Subject: Re: Mezuza question
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 20:40:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.183156.9334@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> seth@inst-sun1.tmc.edu (Seth Chazanoff) writes:
>Dima
>
>	Re: How and where to put up a Mezuza.
>
>	Thank-you for answering the Mezuza question.  My wife and I have also
>bought a new home and I was going to ask in a couple of weeks (after escrow
>closes).  I have another question though.  What are the rules for removing a
>Mezuza when you sell a house?  Can the old Mezuza be moved to the new house?
>
>			Thanks
>			  Seth

It depends on who is moving in. If you know that a Jew is moving in your
house then you should leave the mezuzot, unless the people that are
moving in want to put up their own mezuzot. If you know that a non-Jew
is moving in your house then you should take the mezuzot with you. The
reason for that is that they might be used inappropriately by non-Jews.
And if you don't know who is moving in then it is best to remove the
mezuzot and take them with you, since the people that are moving might
be non-Jews.

Thanks,
Dima
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  "A word is worth one coin; silence is worth two."_____ The Talmud.
  "Silence is good everywhere, except in connection with Torah."____ The Zohar.
  dkhaikin@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu  ( Dmitry Khaikin, Columbus Ohio )
Xref: sparky soc.culture.jewish:23920 soc.culture.arabic:5881
From: backon@vms.huji.ac.il
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Israel must return the deportees!
Date: 24 Dec 92 18:25:46 GMT
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem

In article <530@owl.ukc.ac.uk>, dat@ukc.ac.uk (D.A.Turner) writes:





> Second, I do not accept that Hamas are a terrorist organisation.  Up  to
> now they have killed only Israeli soldiers or policemen in uniform.

"ONLY" ????   By the way, you're wrong. Many civilians including women and
children have been brutally murdered.


>  For
> many years Israel has stood in illegal occupation of Palestinian  lands,
> and  several  thousand  unarmed  Palestinian men women and children have
> been killed by  Israeli  forces.

Several thousand ???? How about a few hundred ARMED Palestinians ? I'm sure you
wouldn't want to receive a fist size rock in your face since this *is* deadly.
A rock or a Molotov cocktail hurled at a passing vehicle can be quite lethal.
What are all these UNARMED Palestinians doing with automatic rifles, guns and
hand granades ? Practicing for the Olympics ? :-)




> When  Hamas  starts  killing  Israeli
> civilians


 Surprise !  They HAVE been killing Israeli civilians.

Between the Israelis being colossally incompetent in explaining their side and
the bias on the part of the media, no wonder you can spout such incredible
nonsense.

> they will have sunk to the level of the Zionist state, but up
> to now they seem to be operating on a higher moral standard.
>

Indeed ! A very high moral standard.

Josh
backon@VMS.HUJI.AC.IL
> David Turner
>
> (A Britsh Jew who does NOT support Israel.)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish