From: demi@MOENG2.MORGAN.EDU (Demi Greene)
Newsgroups: alt.irc
Subject: "Gender Flags" -- The end of the thread.
Date: 1 Sep 92 05:02:21 GMT



The gender flag option does NOT have to be a "sex thing" -- it can be whatever
you need it to be, and, ideally, it can be "switched off" if you don't find 
it useful, find it offensive/annoying, or whatever, so that not only are you 
not employing that extra character MFN, but you *don't see it* either: for you,
it would be as if it were not there.

Metaphorically:  Here is a lightbulb that can be switched on and off.  For
those who wish light, turn it on.  For those who do not, turn it off.  Are
there really going to be those who object to the *existence of the bulb*?

I hope not.

Reading on...
In article <9224114.18554@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> gja@mullian.ee.mu.oz.au (Grenville Armitage) writes:
>
>In article <berthiau.714967102@iros1> bunny@gnu.ai.mit.edu writes:
>	[..]
>>Just why are so many people preoccupied with what 
>>sex a user is?  [..]
>>Does it really matter? 
>
>Oh, no! I can see it now....
>
>"We are not real people, with real lives, and real experiences which
>are often shaped and affected by our gender. We are all net.entities,
>free to be the persona we choose."
>
>So net.geeks have their interests in your gender?
>
>Net.decent.folk probably do too, as a means of establishing possible
>areas of mutual experiences or interests. You know, the sort of stuff
>'nice' people try and do in real life (yeah, when the terminal is off)
>conversations.
>


 Yes, yes, yes, yes.  Thank you.  I hope everyone reads and understands this.
 

 Why does everyone assume that the only reason for knowing gender is sex? 

("Because it's the norm for people on IRC to be interested in sex.")

 Well what about folks who are not just interested in sex?

("Then go to the extra effort of asking the person their gender.")

 You know what this means?  It means the sexcrazed creeps get to set their 
 rules, and the innocents (e.g. myself.  I am engaged in RL, and have no
 real interest in introducing sex aside from entertainment/discussion)
 have to bend to them.

 More, the sexcrazed creeps won't go away, regardless of one's
 decision to employ the gender flag option.  Those who choose to use the
 gender flag option are (obviously) willing to deal with the presupposed
 consequence of being 'bugged' or 'annoyed.'  Those who don't use the
 gender flag will also have to deal with them--look at us now: we don't
 have gender flags and we're bugged to hell anyway.  The "watch out for 
 sexcrazed creeps" arguement is no good.

 I can, and have, and will deal easily with 'gender-benders' or people
 who wish to pretend, or claim to be, the opposite gender.

 But why is it so horrible for me to have the option of observing someone's
 chosen (yes, it's chosen, they get to choose MFN, and they can lie if
 they like) gender?

 Why can't *I* *personally* *decide* that gender matters?
 *YOU* don't have to think it matters--the *majority* of people don't have to
 think it matters--the majority of people, in fact, can decide the gender
 flag doesn't exist--they can switch it off--but why must *I* be told as if
 it were FACT, that the flag is not useful, and that gender doesn't/shouldn't
 matter at all?

 I am living proof that that is NOT TRUE.  I do think gender matters, and when
 I see an androgenous person on the street, I feel uncomfortable.  I do
 think the flag would be useful, because I find it unnatural to inquire
 about someone's sex. 

 You might not, but I do: who says your feelings are stronger than mine,
 and so much stronger that a ruling on an IRC option should be based on 
 yours instead?  

 
 Now?  Now let's get practical, shall we?  The only real reason for rejecting
 the gender flag option idea is because it isn't worth the effort of having
 the "server gods" edit their source code, redistribute their source code,
 recompile their source code, and reinstall their source code.  The only real
 reason for rejection doesn't have anything to do with gender, sex, or
 preference, but rather with the time and effort spent on actually implementing
 the flag as code.  

 The end, I hope.


 ~ Demi


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Demi Elizabeth Greene                          demi@moeng2.morgan.edu
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Newsgroups: alt.irc