HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jornmoe@fredrik.atari.no (Joern Moe)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Organization: Atari Corp. Scand. AB (Norway)
Subject: Re: Falcon BUS..
Reply-To: jornmoe@fredrik.atari.no
X-Software: HERMES GUS 1.03 Rev. Apr 14 1992
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:22:44 MET

In <H.WTkwfzCLUbE@fredrik.atari.no>, Joern Moe writes:

I'm realy sorry about the original posting, cause it contained some realy 
confusing errors. I realized it when browsing through the Motorola 
documentation on the DSP56001 and a article in ST Computer.

The folowing is complete nonsense:
>The DSP does communicate with the rest of the world (including 68K bus) 
>through serial interfaces. The serialinterface to the 68K bus is a full
>duplex ~1Mbit/s interface, as is the communication with the external
>dsp port (wich howewer is multiplexed into 8 slower channels).
>Just a comment to this: As long as the data rate the DSP uses to 'fetch' data
>from the 'real world' (external port) is the same (or less than) the datarate
>between the DSP<->CPU/memmory, there is realy no reason to complain!

The corect information is:
The 68K bus <-> DSP communication goes through a Byte wide (8bit) DMA (on the 
68K bus that is) channel and at 1Mbyte/s speed. The external DSP conector is
a serialinterface capable of 1Mbyte/s speed. If there's no hidden restrictions
on this serialinterface (e.g. fixed multiplexing into 8 channels) one could use
this to do upto 500Khz 16Bit one channel sampling or a 8Mbps modem (gee, wish
the phonesystem could handle this:-)

The rest of the original posting was, to my knowledge, corect!

-- 
  _______________________________________________________
 / Joern F. Moe /  All above is my own personal opinion! \
/ Oslo, Norway /  Any lack of opinion above is also mine! \
-----------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
From: CASTAN@bonnie.physik.uni-stuttgart.de ()
Subject: Re: 16 Bit RAM access on Falcon
Organization: Physics Dept, University of Stuttgart, FRG
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 10:01:42 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

Peter Missel asked me to send this:
--------------------------------snip----------------------------------------

From:	MX%"Peter_Missel@k.maus.de" 13-NOV-1992 08:31:12.41
To:	CASTAN
CC:	
Subj:	Re: 16-bit RAM Access on Falco

Kommentar zu A14548@HB in der Gruppe CS.ST.TECH
C>The truth is: the F 030 has a internal RAM port with 16 data and 24 address
C>pins. (i've seen the specs and I've seen the layout)

(looking at the developer specs... Ah! Found.)
Right, this is an expansion slot, carrying data bits 16-31 only. This is not
the CPU bus!
This expansion slot is meant to be 68000 compatible, therefore the limitation.

C>On the other hand a german magazine has tested, that the processor accesses
C>the RAM as if it was a 32 bit memory.

This is right.

Please post this answer to the public in CS.ST.TECH, as I have no access.

- Peter -




##############################################################################
internet: CASTAN@bonnie.physik.uni-stuttgart.de
##############################################################################
Real Name:          # Einem Land, dessen Sprache das Wort "Kultur - Beutel"
Gerd Castan         # hervorgebracht hat, ist nicht zu trauen.
Hoehbergstr. 16     #                 (Luisa Francia)
D-7000 Stuttgart 60 #

Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
From: mack@deci.cs.umn.edu (Dan Mack)
Subject: How to become an Atari developer
Summary: How does get 'developer' status with atari
Keywords: develop, atari, st, tt, falcon
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 17:16:01 GMT

How does one become an offical Atari developer?  Should I contact
Atari?  If so, what's their number?

Thanks and I'll summarize of course,

Dan

--
-- -- -- --- --- --- ---- ----  ___  ---- ----- ----- ----- ------ ------ -----
Dan Mack                       / | \   	  "We're not hitchiking anymore... ..
University of Minnesota        \/_\/           We're riding!"  -Commander Hoek
Minneapolis, MN 55403     ----- ----- ----- ---- ---- ---- --- --- --- -- -- --
From: grier@bnr.ca (Brian Grier)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Re: Falcon BUS..
Date: 5 Nov 92 14:20:17 GMT
Organization: Bell Northern Research

> 1) What is the speed of the Falcon's memory (Somebody said it had 0 wait
> states which seems to imply 16MHz, but they may have been wrong)

The memory, as I said, is claimed to be 0 wait state memory. The question
is is the memory syncronous or asyncronous?


> 4) Is the data bus between the memory and the 68030 16 or 32 bits wide (There
> seems to be an argument going on about this).

Atari claims 32 bit wide memory.


> 5) Why does the benchmarks that I have seen posted here only indicate an
> approx 3x speed increase and real-world tests (excluding any disk access)
> only twice as fast?  If the data bus is twice as wide, the memory twice as
> fast, the processor at least twice as efficent and running at twice the clock
> speed it should be more like 10 times the speed.

My best guess is that when people get to the Falcon in the REAL world
they increase the number of bits per pixel, causing a lot of extra time
to be spent drawing things, like letters and numbers. You will pay a big
price in performance for more bits per pixel on Atari systems. Refer to
the description of pixel memory in either the developer docs or the Abacus
internals guide.

On an unrelated topic...

Yesterday I said  would see if you could drag a HD icon to a floppy icon
under NeoDesk. The answer is yes. NeoDesk informs you that it can only
perform a file copy, sector copy is not available. I do not have access
to a floptical so I can not verify if NeoDesk will recognize that a 720K
or 1.4meg floppy in a floptical has the same format as it does in a 
standard floppy drive.


Brian, WS1S
Bell Northern Research
Research Triangle Park, NC
From: mforget@elfhaven.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Michel Forget)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Raster Copy [for window scrolling]
Summary: Please help me with window scrolling/raster copies.
Keywords: raster-copy, window, scroll, fast
Date: 10 Nov 92 06:43:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: elfhaven.H.KtV1EXXhvs6
Reply-To: mforget@elfhaven.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca
Organization: Electric Storm
X-Software: HERMES GUS 1.00 Rev. Jan 16 1992

Hi!

I am having a problem with a program I am writing.  I need to display
a text file inside a window.  Now, the actual process of setting up and
writing the information to the window is not a problem.

Scrolling the window (fast) is the problem.

The only method I know of (that I have been able to use) is to redraw the
entire window when a scroll was needed.  This is, to say the very least,
extremely slow.  I know that there are faster ways to do this, one of
which would seem to be a raster copy.  After all, would it not be faster
to simply move the last twenty lines up two lines, and then draw the
new information at the bottom of the window?

In short (long?) I would be grateful to anyone who could share with me the
secrets of window scrolling.  The faster, the better.  To keep things legal,
though, I imagine only VDI calls should be used.

I have also heard that the speed of output to the window can be increased
by aligning the window on a sixteen bit boundary?  How would this be done?

 
-- 
<<  -----------------------------------------  >>
<<    mforget@elfhaven.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca    >>
<<  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  >>
<<               Michel Forget                 >>
<<   The Key:  Spirit over mind over matter.   >>
<<  -----------------------------------------  >>
From: baffoni@phakt.usc.edu (Juxtaposer)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Re: Falcon BUS..
Date: 6 Nov 1992 14:29:36 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: phakt.usc.edu
Keywords: Falcon 68030 bus memory

In article <1992Nov5.202240.26716@beaver.cs.washington.edu> bgilbert@cs.washington.edu (Ben Gilbert) writes:
>In article <1992Nov5.114927.14711@dcs.warwick.ac.uk> leo@dcs.warwick.ac.uk (Leo Hendry) writes:
>>I asked questions similar to these a month or two ago, but nobody answered.
>>Perhaps somebody knows the answers now.

>>1) What is the speed of the Falcon's memory (Somebody said it had 0 wait
>>states which seems to imply 16MHz, but they may have been wrong)

>I'm not sure, but doesn't it have to be 16 MHz if it is on the same bus?

	Not really.  How do you think they get memory to work for 25MHz+
machines?  Its not because they use 20ns memory (which is just cache ram)
but rather because their memory controllers insert "wait-states" to handle
slower memory.

>I should know this because I had a computer architecture class last
>quarter, but they didn't go into specific implementations.

	Bum class.  You'd think they'd go into basic memory handling....

>>2) How does the DSP access the main memory (Somebody said it is not connected
>>to the data bus, in which case I suppose it must be some kind of serial link)

>Don't know on this one, but I think you're right in that it's not
>connected to the data bus.  I guess the link must be sufficient if the
>Falcon can grab true-color off the hard disk at 24 frames per second and
>display it in real time.  :-)  Although maybe they didn't use the DSP for
>that...   

	The Falcon's DSP is integrated with the SDMA hardware.  Just from the
name, I'd hazzard the guess that the SDMA chips DMA information directly from
memory (or wherever) and place it on the private DSP bus (or more likely into
the DSP's 96k memory).  Since it is DMA, it is not likely to be a serial link
(EEEWwwwww!) but a full blown 32-bit data path.  The only serial data I know
about is the DSP connector is a high-speed serial connection (from what I hear,
its around 1MB/s!).
[stuff deleted]

>>Thanks,
>>Leo
>
>Cheers,
>-- 
>Ben Gilbert				e-mail : bgilbert@cs.washington.edu
>Department of Computer Science
>University of Washington

-Mike
From: herborth@ (Chris Herborth)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Re: MiNT and *.XFS files
Date: 12 Nov 92 14:57:23 GMT
Reply-To: herborth@pinot.waterloo.ncr.com
Organization: NCR Canada Ltd., Waterloo, Ont.

In article <annius.721499343@freyr> A.V.Groenink@research.ptt.nl writes:
}grier@bnr.ca (Brian Grier) writes:
}
}>Basically what ".XFS" modules are available in the public domain?
}>Also what is the basic template for creating a ".XFS" file?
}
}The 'alias drive U as drive O' is the only one I've seen so far.

I'd really love to see a SCSI tape drive XFS driver...  It'd be really
nice to mount a tape device in /dev and use tar for backups...
-- 
----------================= _   /\ =================================----------
Chris Herborth              \`o.0'             herborth@pinot.Waterloo.NCR.COM
Information Products Co-Op  =(___)=
NCR E&M Waterloo               U        Laura Palmer: "Bob"'s favourite snack.
From: hrs@aber.ac.uk (Herbert Martin Sauro)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Scrollable list boxes
Date: 12 Nov 92 14:08:16 GMT
Organization: University of Wales, Aberystwyth

I am writing an application were I need scrollable list boxes in dialog
boxes (eg. like the file selector list). Rather than write my own I was
wondering whether anybody has any code already written to do this? Failing
that what is the best strategy for writing a scrollable list? I have worked
out that in order to make the scrolling fast and smooth I need to do some
blitting, i.e.\ blit n-1 of the entries (n=no of items in scroll window)
and write out the new line either at the top or bottom of the
list. And what is the best strategy to write a smooth moving slider which
will sit next to the list box? I have managed to write a relatively
smooth moving slider but it's not perfect.

Once I've written it I'll send the source to a.a

Herb
-- 
/******************************************************************************
Herbert Sauro                                   e-mail: hrs@aber.ac.uk
Biological Sciences                              phone: +44 970 622353
Univesity College of Wales                                                    
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
From: raist@rmece02.upr.clu.edu (Ricardo Hernandez)
Subject: Re: Falcon BUS..
Organization: UPR-Mayaguez--ASEL Lab
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 09:04:26 GMT

In article <H.CERjFbwM9dE@fredrik.atari.no>, jornmoe@fredrik.atari.no (Joern Moe) writes:
|> In <1992Nov11.203921.11068@rmece49.upr.clu.edu>, Ricardo Hernandez writes:
|> [stuff deleted]
|> 
|> >  So the Falcon can't do any processing when a DMA is taking place?
|> 
|> The 68030 has a cache, so it might do some processing while DMA occures on the
|> bus!
|> 
|> >[more deleted]
|> 
   Looks ok there, although there would be a lot of situations where the
68030 will run out of cache memory and will stall waiting for the DMA
to finish.  I guess that someone has to do actual performance benchmarks.

   Also what we need to determine how likely will the 68030 stall is 
how many cycles it takes for the DMA stuff to take place for bytes moved
to RAM.

|> 
|> -- 
|>   _______________________________________________________
|>  / Joern F. Moe /  All above is my own personal opinion! \
|> / Oslo, Norway /  Any lack of opinion above is also mine! \
|> -----------------------------------------------------------

- Raist
From: pjj@cs.man.ac.uk (Pete Jinks)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Re: Hi-res monitors
Keywords: SM144, SM146
Date: 4 Nov 92 16:55:15 GMT
Organization: Dept Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K.

I wrote:
>[I was told] 144s suffer from distortion in one corner and so is being
>discontinued and replaced by the 146. I have never seen a 144...

sheppard_r@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz replied:
>the SM144 is sold for ST,STE, Mega STE as it has a SPEAKER fitted,
>the TT has its own speaker so does not need a monitor with a speaker,
>its that simple...

I use a SM146 with a Mega STE and hear keyboard clicks & music etc. with no
problems. The SM146 has a volume control and speaker, just like the SM124 &
SM125.

Does anyone have a better story as to the differences between the SM144 and
the SM146?
From: trs@doc.ic.ac.uk (Thomas R Stiemerling)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Upgrade to 1040ST ?
Date: 9 Nov 92 10:43:33 GMT
Organization: Department of Computing, Imperial College, University of London, UK.
NNTP-Posting-Host: peaberry.doc.ic.ac.uk

I have recently aquired a 1040STf to use for midi stuff. I have a couple
of questions regarding the machine.

1) What does the f mean ?
2) How can I find out which version of TOS it has ?
3) Is it possible to upgrade the memory to 2 or 4 Meg ?
4) Is it possible to connect a non-atari hard disk ?
5) What type of disk controller does the atari expect to see ?
6) Is there a hard disk driver in the TOS bios ?
7) Is it possible to connect any colour RGB monitor ?

I'd appreciate any answers to the above via email.

Thanks.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
From: cbbrowne@csi.uottawa.ca (Christopher Browne)
Subject: Re: Extended characters with printf()
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, University of Ottawa
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 92 04:35:10 GMT

In article <HyewTB4w165w@sys6626.bison.mb.ca> marco@sys6626.bison.mb.ca (John Perry) writes:
>Does anyone know how to use the extended character set with printf()? For 
>example, how would I go about printing the "arrow" symbol?

Well, the "simple but probably wrong" answer is:

The "right arrow" is character #3 (in hex, octal, or decimal).

Try something like:
   printf("\003");

(which assumes an octal argument.)

Unfortunately, \003 does something else that I don't recall offhand,
since it's one of the ASCII control codes.

I expect that what you REALLY want is some sort of XBIOS call.  I'd
love to hear what the correct call is for this purpose.

-- 
Christopher Browne                |     PGP 2.0 key available
cbbrowne@csi.uottawa.ca           |===================================
University of Ottawa              |  The Personal Computer:  Colt 45
Master of System Science Program  |  of the Information Frontier
From: baffoni@aludra.usc.edu (Juxtaposer)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: My problems with MiNT
Date: 9 Nov 1992 19:20:39 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

 
	Hello all,

	Well, using the debug_1, and printing it out, I have found something
that might be causing my problems with MiNT.

	Using MiNT .95, with _just_ it running in the autofolder, from the
desktop I run CoNnect1.80 and I get one "pid 2 (GEM): malloc: out of memory"
and then the rest (about 11) are "pid 3 (CONNECT): malloc: out of memory"
except towards the end there is a "pid 3 (CONNECT): Bconmap: mapin failed".

	So does anyone know why I am getting all these failed mallocs?

-MikeB
From: marco@sys6626.bison.mb.ca (John Perry)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Checking if the printer is ready for input...?
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 92 20:16:59 CST
Organization: System 6626 BBS, Winnipeg Manitoba Canada

How can I check to see if the printer is ready for input? I tried using 
Bcostat(), but it returns -1 (which is supposed to mean I can send the 
printer data) even when the printer was turned off!

Thanks for any info.

    *********************************************************************
    *   John Perry, Winnipeg, Manitoba    |       GEnie: J.PERRY13      *
    * INTERNET: marco@sys6626.bison.mb.ca | Data Phone: (204) 772-7349  *
    *********************************************************************
From: mbaffoni@skat.usc.edu (Michael Baffoni)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Re: Problems with Mint .95 and TCSH
Date: 5 Nov 1992 23:50:12 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: skat.usc.edu

In article <1992Nov4.212202.9285@sfu.ca> gordonf@monashee.sfu.ca (Gordon Farrell) writes:

>Where'd you find "less"?  I've looked at a.a, but the only less I found was
>really old and hung when it reached the end of a file under MiNT (using 
>mintshel in a TOSwin on a TT).

	That is the "less" that I am using, but I am using tcsh right now.
I'm still having MiNT problems so I haven't been able to test whether it
has those same problems.

>Thanks in advance.

- Mike



Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
From: hyc@hanauma.jpl.nasa.gov (Howard Chu)
Subject: Re: My problems with MiNT
Organization: SAR Systems Development & Processing, JPL
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 07:48:35 GMT

In article <1dn9q7INNk52@aludra.usc.edu> baffoni@aludra.usc.edu (Juxtaposer) writes:
>	Using MiNT .95, with _just_ it running in the autofolder, from the
>desktop I run CoNnect1.80 and I get one "pid 2 (GEM): malloc: out of memory"
>and then the rest (about 11) are "pid 3 (CONNECT): malloc: out of memory"
>except towards the end there is a "pid 3 (CONNECT): Bconmap: mapin failed".
>
>	So does anyone know why I am getting all these failed mallocs?

I would ignore those messages; as I recall from reading the source code (I
noticed these messages a while ago myself) the reason is that when MiNT
intercepts the Malloc system call, it first tries to execute the Mxalloc
call which currently only exists in the TT's TOS. This call fails on any
non-TT, which causes the "malloc: out of memory" message. Then MiNT calls
the regular TOS Malloc routine, and that usually succeeds. Likewise for
the Bconmap failure, that call also only exists on new TOS. (Of course, if
you're actually running on a TT or with TOS 2.06 or 3.06, then I'd guess
the failures are genuine... You didn't specify what machine you have.)
-- 
  -- Howard Chu @ Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA

All true wisdom is conveyed in one-line witticisms.
From: rincewind@discworld.oche.sub.org (Rincewind                      alias Michael Schwingen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Organization: This is the Discworld, which travels through the space on the
	back of four elephants which themselves stand on the shell of Great
	A' Tuin, the sky turtle.
Subject: Re: 520ST MMU pinout?
Summary: need pinout for 520ST MMU
Reply-To: rincewind@discworld.oche.sub.org
X-Software: HERMES GUS 1.03 Rev. Apr 14 1992
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 18:16:08 MEST

In <721294779.23635@hitech.com.au>, Clyde Smith-Stubbs writes:
>Can anyone give me the pinout for the MMU in a 520ST (1986 vintage)
>I want to add another RAM bank, and need to know where to get the
>second bank RAS signal.
>
Here you go:
    43        27
  44++++++++++++26
    +          +
    +          +
    +          +
    +          +
    +     *    +
  60++++++++++++10
    61    1    9

Pin   Signal
------------
 1     D4
 6     /CAS0H
 7     /CAS0L
 8     /RAS0
10      Vcc
18     /RAS1
21     /CAS1L
22     /CAS1H
23     /WE
27      GND
44      Vcc
61      GND


cu
Michael
-- 
Michael Schwingen, Ahornstrasse 36, W-5100 Aachen, Germany   voice: 0241-876165
Univ.: michaels@pool.informatik.rwth-aachen.de    <--- use this for long mails!
Home:  rincewind@discworld.oche.sub.org            Maus:  Michael Schwingen@AC3
IRC: Rincewind
"The only way housework could be done in this place was with a shovel  or,  for
preference, a match."                           Terry Pratchett, Witches Abroad
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
From: sjg@phwoof.ph.kcl.ac.uk (Simon Gornall)
Subject: Re: MiNT and *.XFS files
Organization: King's College London Image Processing Group
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 20:15:40 GMT
X-Posted-From: dogmatix.ph.kcl.ac.uk
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <annius.721499343@freyr> A.V.Groenink@research.ptt.nl writes:
}grier@bnr.ca (Brian Grier) writes:
}
}>Basically what ".XFS" modules are available in the public domain?
}>Also what is the basic template for creating a ".XFS" file?
}
}The 'alias drive U as drive O' is the only one I've seen so far.

There's also the minixfs driver. Allows you to have a minix (read: unix-like)
partition on your hard drive. Ah the beauty of .how.many.dots.you.want files!

Simon.
From: cs90ijr@brunel.ac.uk (Ian J Ray)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: RE: Raster Copy [for window scrolling]
Date: 12 Nov 92 09:57:40 GMT
Organization: Brunel University, Uxbridge, UK
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

The function you require is vro_cpyfm(), it _will_ copy overlapping blocks
to/from the screen or memory buffers. Example:

	WORD pxyarray[8];
	MFDB src, dest;		// Memory Form Definition Block


	/* pxyarray contains the VDI rectangle
	 */ 
	pxyarray[0] = src_x1;
	pxyarray[1] = src_y1;
	pxyarray[2] = src_x2;
	pxyarray[3] = src_y2;
	pxyarray[4] = dest_x1;
	pxyarray[5] = dest_y1;
	pxyarray[6] = dest_x2;
	pxyarray[7] = dest_y2;

	/* fd_addr is the address of the 'form' buffer
	 * if it is NULL then the VDI fills in the other information
	 * in the form structure
	 */
	src.fd_addr = NULL;
	dest.fd_addr = NULL;

	/* perform the raster copy
	 * in this example, a block of screen is moved to some other
	 * (possibly overlapping) part of the screen
	 */
	vro_cpyfm(handle, &src, &dest, pxyarray);

Hope this helps.

.Ian.
cs90ijr@brunel.ac.uk
From: y0000028@rzab0.rz.tu-bs.de (Kielhorn)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st.tech
Subject: Gulam Shell
Date: 10 Nov 92 13:59:42 GMT
Organization: TU-Braunschweig

Hi there,

according to the discussion about GULAM there must be some folks using it without
problem, as I can't.
Sometimes (I can't reproduce it) Gulam throws 3 bombs when leaving the buildin
editor. My developing cylce looks rather like
edit - reboot - compile - test - edit
with I don't like 8-(
I'm using Gulam beta 1.00.00.02 dated 11.02.87 which seems to be a rather old
version, but it's the newest I can access. My mashine is a 4 MB STe using TOS
2.05 (german).
I would like to know about the actual version and how to obtain it. (ftp ?)

Axel Kielhorn
TU-Braunschweig
y0000028@rzab0.rz.tu-bs.de

It is better to have loved and lost
	than just to have loved.