HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gallamore@g24mac1.nswc.navy.mil (Michael Gallamore)
Subject: Re: SUPERMAN RETURNS AS FOURSOME CONFIRMED BY DC ON ET
Followup-To: rec.arts.comics.misc
Organization: NSWCDD
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:29:50 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.025610.13358@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>,
dvandom@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dave Van Domelen) wrote:

>      Pa Kent dies, and meets Kal at the Gates Of Whatever.  The two draw on 
> each other's strength and love for each other and return to the land of the 
> living.  But there must be a difficulty in Kal's return because:
>      Four people (Teenager, Steel Worker, Warrior and Alien Cyborg) with 
> Superman-level powers surface, each claiming to be Supes.


  Ooooooo! DC say it ain't so!!
  Boys and girls the word for today (WFT) is STUPID.  Please use it
whenever possible when refering to what DC has done to Superman.  Now don't
get me wrong.  I think they have done some good things also.  In
particular, I liked the idea of him being engaged to Lois.
    Although I thought killing Superman was a bad idea, it could have been
worse. If Marvel had done it, every issue would have been polybagged, and
cost $2.95.  BTW, we all knew that he could not stay dead, because Batman
kills him in the future.  Frank Miller said so in the "Dark Knight
Returns", and we all know that DC would "never" muck up there own
continuity.  I just hope that they wrap the storyline up quickly, and that
it is well written, because right now this sounds very (WFT).
  They could have explored what happens to Kryptonians at death.  Waverider
could have seen that this was not supposed to happen, and gone back and
changed the event.  The eradicator could have come back again, and sensed
that it had to save the last Kryptonian.  Maybe I am wrong.  Maybe there
are worse ways to bring him back, but right now I cannot think of any.  
  I've got it.  The best storyline would be for Lobo to give him some tips
on how to come back from the dead.  Granted, Lobo only came back as one
person at a time.  All Superman would have to do is mention Lobo's name,
and they would give him anything he wanted.
  Well, as Lobo might say: "DC, this is Fraggin' STUPID *&^%$$%!!"

Michael Gallamore
NSWCDD
gallamore@g24mac1.nswc.navy.mil  or
gallamore@mv5.nswc.navy.mil
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: panda@Micor.OCUnix.on.ca (Elizabeth Holden)
Subject: Re: LSH: Legionnaires method of determining the Leader
Organization: M.B. Cormier INC.
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 93 07:42:39 EST

tyg@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Tom Galloway) writes:

> According to the Legionnaires and LSH article in the most recent CBG,
> Legionnaires' leaders after the first one will be determined via vote
> of the readers ala the old series.

Huh?  WHAT CBG article?  ...Oh, the one that didn't come in here last 
week.  The one I missed. Right.  (Good stuff, and I miss it.  Grumble.)

> 
> All together now...Tenzil. Tenzil. Tenzil. Tenzil. Tenzil. Tenzil. Tenzil.
Tenzil!  Tenzil!
He's the best!
Let's see Tenzil
Lead the rest!

Tenzil.  Tenzil.  Tenzil.  Tenzil.

Namaste,
Elizabeth



Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: tyg@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Tom Galloway)
Subject: Re: When was the destruction of Daxam?
Keywords: daxamites, glorith
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 21:51:32 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.115616.10995@griffin.itc.gu.edu.au> rosser@kraken.itc.gu.edu.au (Brad Rosser) writes:
>In the latest issues of DC's Wonder Woman several references are made in
>the narration to the fact that there are no longer any Daxamites (other than
>Lar Gand and 'Julia') living 'now' in the 20th century.
>However, I thought the Daxamites were wiped out by Glorith in the *30*th
>century?  Last year's LSH annual (or was it '91) said that this was the
>Is this a contradiction?  What have I missed?

*You* missed nothing...several DC editors and writers on the other hand...
Yep, destroyed in the 30th century, and I've no idea where the WW crew
is coming up with the idea it was killed off in the 20th (particularly
given that Daxam liking us is the only reason Invasion failed, so if
Daxam is gone, Earth is in deep trouble). But then I'm also starting to
suspect that they've replaced Wm. Messner-Loebs with a pod person.

"People unclear on the concept..Grand Champion: 'Look, Hon, it's from the IRS.
I wonder what we won this time?!'" --Mister Boffo
tyg   tyg@hq.ileaf.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: royd@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Roy Daniel)
Subject: Re: Best Death? (Was Re: Random thoughts on Supes)
Organization: Universite de Montreal
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 14:55:33 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.114128.13553@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jelmore@nyx.cs.du.edu (John Elmore) writes:
>I'd have to say that Cypher's death in NEW MUTANTS was the best for two
>reasons:
>
>a) It wasn't a noble sacrifice or had any "special meaning". He got shot,
>and died. Like that.
>
>b) It's one of the few Marvel deaths THAT HAS STAYED #@!#$ING PERMANENT!
>

You're sure? Don't you remember X-Force Annual #1? In there, we get to see 
Douglock, wich is probably a guess that he would come back later.

Guess Claremont was right when he said that no one is really ever dead at the
big M.

Daniel Roy


-- 
Mr. Cole's axiom:
	"The sum of the intelligence on the planet is a constant;
	 the population is growing."
Organization: Senior, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Date: Thu,  7 Jan 1993 03:25:16 -0500 
From: Vernon H Harmon <vh00+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Presidents in comics
	<1993Jan6.185022.21192@news.nd.edu>

Don't forget that appearance by President Reagan in Captain America
where the Viper tried to turn all of DC (Washington, that is) into
snakes......talk about blatant symbolism! :)

--Vernon.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: jelmore@nyx.cs.du.edu (John Elmore)
Subject: DOOM 2099
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 93 11:19:59 GMT

By god, I'm gonna beat everybody over the head with this until you _all_
are DOOM 2099 fans! :)

>is garbage, I have heard nothing but negatives on Punisher and I won't
>collect Doom. The writing is okay, but it still doesn't strike me as how
>Doom would behave.

That's part of the mystique about Doctor Doom: through the unfortunate
fact of there being multiple Doom-bots running around, _each_ of them
believing themselves to be the REAL Doctor Doom (except in the presence of
each other or the true Doctor Doom), we really have _no_ idea how Victor
Von Doom will act.

As of DOOM 2099 #2, we learn that Doom "danced on the graves of both
enemies and allies" and that he "remember[s] being old". Because of some
apparent ailment, he began travelling through time/other dimensions. He
only remembers intense pain, and then he re-materializes in the ruins of
his castle in 2099. Having little idea of what has gone on in the
intervening time, it would make sense for Doom to be a little cautious,
and to take the time to learn about his new world. He tried confronting
Tiger Wylde directly, and it almost cost him his life.

As for why in DOOM 2099 #1 he looked younger, there are two things that
spring to mind: a) he is a clone (having only seen Doom's "pristine" face
in SECRET WARS, I can only assume that's what he would look like
without the scars), or b) he is some poor schmoe, a la the guy from the
FANTASTIC FOUR tie-ins to SECRET WARS II. He uses the "mind-switching"
talent the Ovoids gave him to transfer himself into a younger body.
(Considering Doom's vanity, I'd suspect it was a clone.) As for Doom's
concern for the Gypsies, it would make sense to Doom to acknowledge old
family ties and relationships. I always thought (the pre-Simonson) Doctor
Doom had a touch of class, and could be the gentleman he imagines himself
to be.

As for the writing in general, again maybe it's because I'm a cyberpunk
fan, but this aspires to a slightly more select audience than your usual,
say, DeFalco FANTASTIC FOUR issue. The technology is razor, the attitude
is raw, and the market is up for grabs.

So CONVERT NOW! Become ardent DOOM 2099 fans or face the wrath of Von Doom
when he regains his former power and glory!

Jay (=
From: khale@camilla.Eng.Sun.COM (Abhijit Khale)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: DC: misc stuff
Date: 8 Jan 1993 23:45:06 GMT
Organization: Sun
NNTP-Posting-Host: camilla

In article <1993Jan8.022832.19492@netcom.com> dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:
>
>>Hellblazer: this is one of my favorite DC titles. It's consistently very good
>
>It's inconsistent.  Royal Blood was a major disappointment, as were Ennis's
>other attempts at blood-and-gore, such as that silly laundromat story.  But
>"Dangerous Habits" was the best this title's ever been.

As others have pointed out, the laundromat story wasnt done by Ennis, but by 
John Smith (who's also done Statesmen and other stuff). I can understand people
being confused though : in a lettercol commenting on this story, at least
one person asked if John Smith was real or just an alias used by someone else. 

Also, to be fair, the laundromat story had almost no blood and gore. In fact,
that was one of people's complaints. I liked the story a lot myself : it had the 
best build up of mood I can remember in a comic story. Starting with a normal 
everyday scene  in a laundromat (although those places are creepy enough when
you come to think of it), the story builds up horror incredibly well, until even 
JC decides he has enough and leaves. I thought it was a nice change
of pace : not every issue has to involve  a pitched confrontation between
JC and someone else. 

I agree with your other points though : Royal Blood was bad as was the story 
which dealt with firing bullets into corpses (you know which one I mean).
Dangerous lives was good, as was John's meeting with the Lord of Vampires and
the Diary of Danny story. 

Abhijit

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: pautler@ils.nwu.edu (David Pautler)
Subject: Re: DC: Vertigo Preview
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:09:12 GMT

>>[David Pautler:]
>>What else has Kent Williams done?

>Greg Clow:
>Let's see.  Most recently, he did the TELL ME, DARK hardcover GN for DC... 
>it's pricey, but well worth it.  A truly amazing piece of work.  He did a 
>long line of covers for HELLBLAZER.  He did either MOONSHADOW or 
>SILVERHEELS for Epic in collaboration with Jon J. Muth... they've both 
>been collected as trade paperbacks, so you should be able to track them 
>down and check which it is.  Also with Muth, he did some X-Men limited 
>series thing.  And he did a wonderful 4-issue series for Epic called 
>BLOOD: A TALE that's been collected as a trade paperback as well.

Hmm.  Would you compare the writing in _Tell Me, Dark_ to an average issue
of Sandman, an average issue of Hellblazer, or something less?  I'll buy
a book just for the story, but not just for the art.

     -dp-

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: dhenry@plains.NoDak.edu (David R. Henry)
Subject: Re: DC: misc stuff
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 07:57:43 GMT
Organization: North Dakota Higher Education Computing Network

>>Hellblazer: this is one of my favorite DC titles. It's consistently very good
>
>It's inconsistent.  Royal Blood was a major disappointment, as were Ennis's
>other attempts at blood-and-gore, such as that silly laundromat story.  But
>"Dangerous Habits" was the best this title's ever been.

While I agree in principle with Dani's comments (the one's on the bottom,
for you latecomers), Ennis didn't write the laundromat story. I remember
this only because I'm oddly fond of that story.

Of course, I have no idea who really did. I leave it to those annoying
netters with both memories and easy access to their comics collections
while netting to fill in the blank.

"You've got to be an originator." --Richard Darwin

-- 
David R. Henry - Rogue Fan Club - "I have a pullchain in my head." -- RIII
My mind is a jackal.--Richard Darwin // What was the question? --Kate Bush
"All you of Earth are IDIOTS!"-P9fOS // Thanks... for the memories.--Rogue
dhenry@plains.nodak.edu * ud137927@ndsuvm1.bitnet * ud137927@vm1.nodak.edu
From: royd@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Roy Daniel)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: 7 Jan 93 21:49:54 GMT
Organization: Universite de Montreal

In article <1iero9INNdsa@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu> albert@chain.ssctr.bcm.tmc.edu (Rick Jones) writes:
>
>	What do you think Sleepwalker is?  According to rumors, spread by
>Neil G. himself that Marvel was ready to make a Sandman-ish comic, with
>a real Brit writer and stuff, but DeFalco finally got around to read an
>ish of Sandman, and though it was boring.  Just people talking and stuff.
>So now we have Sleepwalker, that paragon of drekdom.

Rick, PLEASE tell me this is a joke. You mean, DeFalco actually read Sandman, 
and found it boring? You mean he actually think Sleepwalker is an IMPROVEMENT?!

Sandman being boring, I can understand. I personnally think it is pure genius, 
but being boring or not is a subkective statement, and it is normal for some 
people to find it boring.

But to think Sleepwalker is an improved Sandman... shessh!

Excuse me, I have to puke.


Daniel Roy,
of the "Voyageurs sans Permis"


-- 
Mr. Cole's axiom:
	"The sum of the intelligence on the planet is a constant;
	 the population is growing."
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Comics-L Mailing List Address
From: Ernie Oporto <EAO102@psuvm.psu.edu>
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 09:38:54 EST
Organization: The Pennylvania State University

comics-l@unlvm.unl.edu
---
"Not entirely stable?  I'm glad you're here to tell us these things!
 Chewie take the professor in the back and plug him into the
 hyperdrive!"
  _____)           ______        _)       _)  EAO102@PSUVM.PSU.EDU
                               __       __    OPORTO@CORVETTE.ECE.PSU.EDU
______    ______            ___      ___      Ernie "SHOKK" Oporto
                               __       __    Computer Lab Attendant
(_______ _      _ ________ _     _) _     _)  for PSU's CAC Department
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: blr3r@Virginia.EDU (Brian L. Rust)
Subject: Re: Sandman: Lucien's Library
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 03:04:10 GMT

Some titles I'd like to read:

Elric, the Redeemed
		-Michael Moorcock's happy ending
"SPOON!"  the Tick Phonebook
		-collection of issues 1-40
Doom, the Wandering Years
		by Walt Simonson and Peter David
Splendour and the Grass
                -Allan Moore's Swamp Thing run, issues 75-150
Do Androids Dream of Electric Beer?
		-Douglas Adams's "Cheers" episode script
A Tumult of Tricksters
		a Loki/Puck/Anansi/Cerebus/John Constantine crossover
		by Neil Gaiman and Dave Sim

	There's also a VCR in one corner with the Mystery
Science Theater "IT" episode loaded and ready to play:-)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: tpjg9663@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Tom Johnston)
Subject: Re: True Believers (Marvel's religious comics)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:14:13 GMT

For tasteless religious superheros, a friend of mine once
suggested Crucified Kid.  Basically a Capt. Marvel ripoff.
A boy who speaks his magic words ("Eloi, Eloi, Lamas Sabac
Thani" or something similar; from the Bible, meaning "My
Lord, My Lord, Why Hast Thou Forsaken Me?") he finds
himself suffering on a cross.  He fights crime by
hopping around on it (kind of like a pogo stick :-))
and twirls in circles to hit criminals with the plank
his arms are attached to.

Although we were all greatly offended by this proposed
character, and we considered it one of the most offensive
ideas we'd ever heard, we agreed that Marvel would
probably be successful in milking it for 3 monthly titles
if they ever learned of the concept.

:-) for the humor-impaired

Tom
From: lis@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Elisabeth Riba)
Subject: DC:  Showcase '93
Organization: Brandeis University
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 13:14:51 GMT

Once upon a time, Showcase was DC's tryout book and introduced many of
the best Silver Age characters.  Now, DC has ressurected the book,
this time as a home for serial stories 

So far, three stories have been told in two issues (only one is
complete)

1)  Catwoman:  Every issue of Showcse is to feature a Batman family
character, and this focuses on Catwoman.  I like the post-Crisis
Catwoman and wish there were more stories with her.  When someone
steals a painting Catwoman was paid to swipe, she starts
investigating and gets a little deeper than is safe.

2)  Blue Devil:  I've never read his book, but if it's as entertaining
as this story, I'll rescue it from the quarter bin.  This is just
plain fun.  The story so far has gone from a movie set to another
world to the JLHQ.  Who knows where it will go from here

3)  Cyborg:  I used to be a huge Titans fan.  Definitely a past-tense
statement.  The last time we saw Cyborg, he was brain-dead, more man
than machine.  This story focuses on the attempt to remedy it and
suffers from the STUPIDEST computer programming I've seen (and I was a
pretty poor programmer, myself)  I have to explain this--at the end,
after a ^L:

Well, 2 out of 3 isn't bad.  Next issue a Flash story takes over
Cyborg's slot.  I recommend it andhope it lasts as long as the original.


Cyborg spoilers:

Cyborg and Red Star go to a secret fortress where Cyborg's backup
memory is stored.  Then, a few other people show up and things go
haywire.  Apparently, the computer is designed to self destruct if
anyone other than Cyborg shows up (don't want this information in the
wrong hands!)  Well, why didn't that start when Red Star entered?  And
shouldn't there be some failsafe for people that Cyborg brings with
him?  This self-destruct also lets loose a virus to destroy the
computer records--which also wipes out Cyborg's memory.  Pretty poor
planning, huh?
-- 
--------------->Elisabeth Anne Riba * lis@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu<---------------
   Do not meddle in the affairs	    |  Usenet is like Tetris for people
   of cats, for they are subtle     |  who still remember how to read.
   and will piss on your computer.  |	  So many newsgroups, so little time...
From: jml12@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Jonathan M Lennox)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Cerebus #165
Date: 10 Jan 93 09:51:20 GMT
Reply-To: jml12@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Jonathan M Lennox)
Organization: Columbia University

In article <1993Jan8.221442.7983@netcom.com> dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:
>...The Cirinists' interpretations of what is happening are unreliable.

  "Women" is thematically "High Society," right?  The Cirinists'
interpretations seem very similar to HS's _The History of the Election
of 1414_.  We see all the characters muddling through, doing things
for purely personal or emotional reasons, and then the analysts spend
enormous amounts of time second-guessing what's going on, creating
utterly fictional deep agendas for everyone involved.

>Those voices in the dark appear to be the voices of the people, behind
>their various closed doors.  The grapevine is actually doing a fairly good
>job of keeping people informed -- without too much misinformation.  Where
>people differ is on their answers to the burning question of "what's the
>best way to assure that I live through this?"

  But we're seeing the same facial features again and again, no?  The
gap-toothed one looks especially familiar (I can't really dig out my
old issues right now, though.)  Didn't at least one of these people
claim last issue to be an illusionist?

--
Jonathan Lennox
jml12@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: conty@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (E. Kontei)
Subject: Re: (WS) Does anyone read Japanese comics?
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 16:07:25 GMT

> >tal691@huxley.anu.edu.au (Tonio Loewald) writes:
> >
> >>Hello folks,
> >> 
> >>I was just wondering... is there anyone who actually reads the
> >>translated Japanese comics, by Viz, Dark Horse, etc.?  I don't
> >>mean readers who are anime or manga fans, but comics fans,
> >>whose experience of Japanese comics is minimal.

Well, the problem is that as soon as someone finds out there's an anime
based on the manga (which is often the case), they become anime fans.  :-)

My experience with translated manga started with NAUSICAA OF THE VALLEY
OF THE WIND and the Epic AKIRA.  Then I saw AKIRA at a local art cinema,
and was blown away by it.

> >>The reason for posting this is wanting to know whether Japanese
> >>comics are making inroads into the American market,

Given the increasing amount of translated manga being
sold, I'd say the answer is "yes".
-- 
			    E n r i q u e  C o n t y
			       Master of Science!
			      jester@ihlpm.att.com
		    Disclaimer: You're not dealing with AT&T
From: mgq@inel.gov (Michael G McKellar)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Why Vertigo? Was: Marvel copies DC... again
Date: 6 Jan 93 23:15:36 GMT
Organization: Idaho National Engineering Laboratory, Idaho Falls, Idaho

In article <1993Jan6.145905.13727@schbbs.mot.com> Chagnon_A@msm.cdx.mot.com (Andrew Chagnon) writes:
>
>Given the discussion that last month Sandman was ranked #75 in sales and
>Hellblazer wasn't in the top 100, why is DC creating the Vertigo line?
>
>There doesn't seem to be a sound business reason to do it from my viewpoint.
>Are there a large number of 'mature audience' readers out there that DC is
>tapping into, or are they hoping to create a new market of Vertigo readers?
>
>Judging from the sales stats, it seems that market does not exist, and DC is
>hoping to create one. 
>
>Any thoughts?
 
The market is there.  Around here, if you don't have a  reserved copy
of Sandman, you won't get one if you wait any more that a week or two.
This was also the case in Indiana when I lived there.   The comic
shops owners that I've dealt with usually just buy enough of the Mature
titles to fill their orders plus a extra copy or two.  My current shop
says they have to order a few issues more of sandman every month because
the demand is increasing.  I don't know how well Hellblazer is doing, but
I think the market is there.  Another thing to consider is Sandman is 
sold only at specialty shops.  Most of the other top sellers are found
in newsstands as well.  

Just a few thoughts.

Mike McKellar (mgq@inel.gov)


========== long legal disclaimer follows, press n to skip ===========

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