From: rpitts@emperor.gatech.edu (Richard Pitts)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: I'm God.
Date: 7 Oct 92 16:54:05 GMT
Organization: CERL-EE, Georgia Institue of Technology

In article <ksand-061092184223@wintermute.apple.com> ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik) writes:
|In article <WIGGINS.92Oct6141351@lilac.cs.odu.edu>,
|wiggins@lilac.cs.odu.edu (Samuel E Wiggins) wrote:
|> 
|> I think the Romans and Jews didn't write of his miracles, etc. because they
|> were predisposed not to believe he did them, weren't they?  For one thing,
|> I doubt too many Romans knew Jesus except by hearsay, and probably blew off
|> what they heard. And the Jews, many of whom had the opportunity to see Jesus,
|> didn't want this guy upsetting *their* religion and rivaling them.  It's no
|> surprise not to see much about him except from those who believed him.  Yet,
|> he *is* mentioned by Roman and Jewish historians.  Even the Roman Emperor
|> heard about him.  So, I assert that his affect on people was incredible, and
|> news about him spread like wildfire.  But why?  Either he actually did do
|> miracles or he was an excellent magician/con-man/cult leader.
|
|You know, if there was a white bearded man that rose people from the dead,
|at least National Inquirer and a couple of TV shows would report it 
|immediately. Such events are real news! As there are no such stuff
|mentioned in the Roman and Jewish scriptures, it's clear that we didn't

The communication age is more recent than the time of Christ.  I do
believe if it had happened to day, the Inquirer and such would have
been there.

|have any such happenings. And that Christians wanted to make the man
|bigger than what he really was in order to justify their faith in the
|cult leader. This happens daily, remember all the miracles the old

Here you assume that what they say is false and so you make your claim.
If it is not false or if you didn't presuppose that it was false, 
then why couldn't the people be explaining what they saw and knew?

|Sci-Fi writer by the name of Ron Hubbard did to his followers. History
|repeats itself. As for an excellent and famous cult leader, there were
|many other Messiah wannabes that were recorded, Jesus was one of the
|many trouble makers Romans had to deal with.

Again, Jesus rose from the grave and never died again.  Name another
that never died again, even it you claim they rose from the dead - many
rose from the dead at the hand of Jesus and at his resurrection, but
Jesus stands above them all - he ascended into heaven - he is alive and
with the Father today.

|> Like anything, it's easy to blow off what you haven't seen for yourself.
|
|True, it's also easy to blow things out of proportions if you haven't
|been on the scene.

It is easy to say things are false, when you presuppose they could not have
happened.  John and Peter both walked with Jesus and wrote of His life.
Peter confirms the transfiguration of Jesus of which Matthew and Luke write.
 
|> BTW, in the gospels, there are different geneologies given.  One comment I
|> read says that the one gives the ancestral line through Mary and the other
|> through Joseph.  Another I read says that "begot" may not mean "the father
|> of" but "an ancestor of" -- big difference, meaning both are right but give
|> different ancestors (whoever the writer thought important to mention).
|
|Evidence, man, evidence about this statement that the geneologies are
|different due to Mary and Joseph. At least the Gospels won't say that,
|or what.

Evidence - Luke says that Jesus was "the son of Joseph, SO IT WAS THOUGHT."
He didn't say Jesus was Joseph's son.  Luke starts with Jesus and goes
backwards - each of the names could be seen to be an ancestor of Jesus
and not of Joseph.  Matthew starts at Adam and says that the names were
begat (which I believe means father or direct ancestor) the next name.
Matthew ends with Joseph, as the end of the line, who was the husband of
Mary, who begat Jesus.  Note Mary begat Jesus and Joseph was her husband
but not Jesus' father.  (The NIV puts it Joseph the husband of Mary, to
whom was born Jesus.)

For Christ and His Kingdom,
Richard Pitts
-- 
rpitts@cerl.gatech.edu       |    
Atlanta, GA                --|-- 
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