HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Grand Pennsic
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 20:12:00 -0500

> It strikes me that renaming the Pennsic War the "Pennsic Grand Tourney"
> in order to avoid hostility on both sides is rather like telling people
> who've been doing this for twenty years that we're all a bunch of daft
> buggers who can't tell the difference between reality and a game unless
> the _name_ of the thing is changed.  This is patently absurd and
> profoundly insulting on the face of it. Surely there have been an
> occasional hothead or two, but to think that this is a solution for that
> is positively Orwellian newspeak.
 
Thank heavens, a kindred spirit!  Someone too dense not to recognize what we do
at the war as *friendly* competition wouldn't have a *clue* no matter *what* we
called it...
 
> Deeply saddened at the repudiation of twenty years of tradition,
 
Perhaps saddened, but I have no doubt the monarchy meant well.  I just hope
their successors recognize the error and don't do it again...
From: bookworm@milton.u.washington.edu (Kathleen Marshall)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Riders to Crown
Date: 20 Aug 92 23:35:35 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Aug20.233535.24778
Reply-To: bookworm@u.washington.edu
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Riders to Crown
Summary: 
Reply-To: bookworm@u.washington.edu
Followup-To: 
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Keywords: 

  Greetings unto the Rialto! Please forgive the waste of bandwidth,
  but I promised a friend ...
  An Tir's September Crown Tourney is being held in the Barony of
  Borealis (mka Edmonton Alberta). The Barony of Madrone (mka
  Seattle WA) is organizing a vanpool to save time, money and gas.
  We are looking for at least four more riders; the more people we
  have, the less cost per person. You need not be from Madrone; all
  are welcome. If you are interested in joining us, please contact
  Sior Brand MacLiam (mka GregRobin Smith) at (206) 784-3866 ASAP.
  Thank you all for your very kind indulgence!

					Saewynn Silfrhrafn
					Barony of Madrone, An Tir
					bookworm@u.washington.edu
  "Yoicks! and away!" <CRUNCH>--D. Duck
From: Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Combat Archery
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:46:44 -0500

krogers@javelin.sim.es.com (K. Rogers) writes:

KR> The archer stands all of 3 feet away and shoots it.

Is 3 feet considered the minimum combat archery distance?  If not, then this
ignores the effects of air resistance, which is considerable with marshmallow
heads, golf tubes, etc.  True, it errs on the side of safety, but maybe by a
large amount anyway.  It could be compensated for somewhat, but the effects
vary widely, so compensation would be rather difficult to figure correctly.

OTOH, it does ensure better that you get a good solid hit on the meter!

KR> Hummm, it just occured to me you also have to have a scale to weigh
KR> the arrows as well.  However, you have to have this piece of equipment
KR> no matter what method you use for measuring speed/momentum.

Unless you do it more directly, as by spring compression.

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mdewis@esk.compserv.utas.edu.au ( Mark Richard Dewis)
Subject: Re: Combat Archery
Organization: University of Tasmania at Launceston
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 04:24:11 GMT

>>had. Lochac started out from a Sydney Univerity Medieval/Role Playing group,
>>encountered the SCA at Aussiecon and decided to join with the Society. Thus
>
>Hang on, Innilgard and Ameala were formed a while after Rowany 
>in 1982CE, and Aussicon 2
>was 1985CE.  Aussiecon 1 was 1975CE, long before the Tolkon
>where the Sydney mob started playing with medieval type stuff.

Oops! I meant Tolkon! (I shouldn't have given the impression that I was
there; I sometimes get wires crossed about what I've been told by folks
that were - sorry)

>Selfran, who has been around all that time and is still confused...

-- Richard, who hasn't, and sometimes confuses the issue ;)

-- 

mdewis@pieman.compserv.utas.edu.au ... but you can call me Richard.
Forma Propositum Perpetuo Praecedit. 
From: Victoria.A..Smith@f114.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Victoria A. Smith)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Grand Pennsic/Lillies/arrows & safety
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 08:24:24 -0500

Greetings again from Anne of Corbridge.  I had a good and fun and busy time at
Pennsic.  I'm sorry that I couldn't stay longer at the Rialto party Tuesday
night...
     On the unwar:  It seemed to me that, once people knew that we 
were having a fair and not a war, there was a lot more vigor expressed in the
side tourneys than in the battles themselves.  My thanks go to Mellitus of
Calontir (do I have that right?) and his waterbearing allies and friends for
keeping me from crisping up on the field before the "Tourney points" started. 
There did not seem to be the level of injuries from the Tourneys that there have
been in past years: the Bridge battle was so tranquil (at least from the
viewpoint of this chirurgeon, who just pushed liquid into the fighters) that the
animal poppets decided to liven things up on one bridge and started attacking
each other!  Or are we all just, as a whole, getting older and/or slower and/or
wiser and/or getting acquired by gentles who will chide you if you crisp up or
break up?
     The weather also probably was a factor.  We were frantically 
pushing water, and Gatorade, and trying to refill as needed, Monday to
Wednesday; then we had cloudy-and-cool "chirurgeon's weather" for most of the
battles and per-capita consumption dropped.  On Saturday morning, I clad myself
too thinly and nearly turned into a crispy chilled chirurgeon (try saying that
three times quickly!)
     Do not fear, though; there is a War still on!  At the Unknown 
Court Saturday evening, the Kings of the East and Middle declared that they
would fight Western kingdoms in Calontir at Lillies (I understand this to be the
third weekend in June), and invited other Eastern Kingdoms to join them.  Since
there are other alliances (ie. Atlantia/Ansteorra), most other kingdoms decided
to wait to declare their alliances.
     Arrows- I was dumb a while back and shot someone without full 
face protection in the head at a Markland event with a Markland arrow 
(a well-padded version).  I raised a great bruise (with a short-drawn 
30-pound bow), but it could have caused great damage.  Golf tubes are safer, but
they really don't fly worth a fewmet!




Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: carl@silver.lcs.mit.edu (Alexander of Kiev (mka Carl Alexander))
Subject: Re: Pennsic in brief
Organization: The Rialto
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 18:08:56 GMT

Nicholas van Leyden writes:
 
>Arval (Josh Mittleman) writes:
>
>>The weather sucked green rocks.... The rest of week alternated among
>>dreary rain, dank overcast, bitter-cold nights, and steamy sunshine.
>
>You should have been at the Ansteorran-Trimaran War, where the temperature
>hovered around 100.  (And yes, I still wore Tudor and Elizabethan.)
                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Ah -- I now understand many of Nicholas' posts far better.  Poor lad;
not his fault if he's irrational:  the heat, you know.  ;^)
 
Personally, I found the weather far more comfortable than I recall
from Pennsics past (as I've mentioned elsewhere, this was my first
Pennsic in nine years).  I was able to run around in one or two layers
of cotton tunics most of the time, adding my light-weight wool tunic
on the cooler mornings and evenings.  I only recall wearing my cloak
on two or three evenings, and only wore my heavy wool poncho during
the Storm of Great Ferocity and on a couple of occasions when the
sky fell in what turned out to be a far more mild manner.  Of course,
my perspective may be influenced by the fact that I arrived on
friday (the 7th) and was able to pitch my tent on dry, level ground --
thus enabling me to take a rather detached view of the Storm.
 
I carried a tightly folded nylon poncho in my belt pouch throughout
the war.  I used it only once or twice, but was constantly glad of
its presence.  However it crossed my mind that it might be possible
to do better with regard to emergency rain gear:  I seem to recall
reading somewhere that fairly light-weight, water-repellant silks
were developed in period.  If this is correct, then a silk rain
poncho might be period, and would probably have the advantage of
packing even smaller than a nylon one.  I'd appreciate hearing from
anyone who knows anything about period water-repellant silks, or
who has any suggestions about what sort of silk I should look for
in the fabric store for such a purpose.  And if anyone actually
has documentation for a light-weight, water-repellant silk over-
garment, I'd especially like to hear about that.
 
Alas:  the mud, my trick ankle, and the premature dissipation of 
my boots' waterproofing, seem to have conspired together to 
destroy my boots.  I am now seriously considering having a pair
of period boots custom made (after paying off some more urgent
bills).  I'd appreciate any information at all about bootmakers
who are experienced both with making good, sturdy period footwear
and with orthopedic work.
 
Alexander of Kiev                       Carolingia, East
 
Carl Alexander                          Harvard Square, Cambridge, Mass.
carl@silver.lcs.mit.edu
 
P.S.  Sorry if you're seeing this twice:  my machine had a seizure 
while I was editing the message and just may have posted it prematurely.
From: boris@sys6626.bison.mb.ca (boris)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: How to fold/wear gre
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 00:54:30 CST
Organization: system 6626 BBS, Winnipeg MB

Joe.Bethancourt@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Joe Bethancourt) writes:

> 
> Some points: the pouch/sporran should be worn -on- the belt, not from the
> more modern chain affair, and the Skean Dubh was worn under the armpit or
Do not wear a sporran. It grew out of the english drawstring belt pouch. 
I doubt if it's even period.  use something along the lines of the 
english of your century.

;--- (boris) a user of sys6626, running waffle 1.64
;E-mail: boris@sys6626.bison.mb.ca
;system 6626: 63 point west drive, winnipeg manitoba canada R3T 5G8
From: ewright@convex.com (Edward V. Wright)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Pennsic in brief
Date: 19 Aug 92 15:53:17 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

Arval (Josh Mittleman) writes:

>The weather sucked green rocks.... The rest of week alternated among
>dreary rain, dank overcast, bitter-cold nights, and steamy sunshine.  

Steamy sunshine?  Why, I doubt it went above the low 80's all the
time I was there!  You should have been at the Ansteorran-Trimaran
War, where the temperature hovered around 100.  (And yes, I still
wore Tudor and Elizabethan.)

-- Nicholas van Leyden
From: Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Agincourt ???
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:51:46 -0500

salley@niktow.canisius.edu (David Salley) writeth:

DS> Hadrian writes:
DS> > The Heavies at Agincourt probably didn't have too much fun :-}
DS> > The next time they went out to play and saw a host of archers
DS> > they probably went home.

DS> The NEXT TIME ????  What next time?  There was NO next time for them!
DS> They were dead, finished, kaput, pushing up daisies, la morte, gone to
DS> that great big battlefield in the sky.  ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)

"If their feet hadn't been nailed to the stirrups they'd have fallen off the
horses!  They were ex-heavies!"

"No, no, no, they're just pinin' for the Pyrenees...."
From: CLINDSAY@vma.cc.nd.edu
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Pennsic, Some Thoughts
Date: 19 Aug 92 14:25:40 GMT

Greetings from Katherine Lenge (sometimes known as "of Constantinople").
I think one reason Pennsic may have seemed subdued to you is that (at
least this is my impression) there weren't as many merchants.  I think
the reason for this is that the restrictions on merchanting have gotten
more strict.  Last year, merchants strecthed far down the road past the
Chirurgeons and Heralds all the way to the end of that road to the
solar showers!
And it seems to me that the number of merchants around the barn and
behind it was lower too.
I don't have any numbers, this is just my impression.
Peace, Katherine
From: bnostran@ds5000.DAC.Northeastern.edu (Barbara Nostrand)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Clueless Classes
Date: 21 Aug 92 19:53:58 GMT
Organization: Northeastern University, Boston, MA. 02115, USA

Nobles!

Master Arval suggests a mechanism for screening those who teach classes
at Pennsic.  While the ultimate goal (higher quality classes) is laudable,
the mechanism may in fact be counter-productive.  Some time ago, I had
a discussion with another gentle concerning an A&S survey issued some
time ago.  It placed a heavy emphasis on SCA awards, SCA A&S competitions
and SCA apprenticeships.  I noticed when studying the form that it made me
seem woefully umprepared, ignorant, incompetent, etc. in areas which I
have actually studied formally for several years.  The situation with
the gentle with whom I corresponded was even more sevear.  (As I recall
he merely had a mundane graduate degree in his subject.)  Thus, care
should be exercised when screening A&S lectures so that genuine research
and genuine knowledge is not excluded for lack of SCA brownie points.

					Your Humble Servant
					Solveig Throndardottir
					Totally Ignorant
From: D020214@univscvm.csd.scarolina.EDU ("lisa mcdavid ", cecily de catton)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: subscribe
Date: 17 Aug 92 18:55:57 GMT
Organization: The Internet

I'm an SCA member who would like to be added to the list, please.
From: aboz@egf-bbs.uucp (Aboz the Untidy)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: To Sir Corwyn ap Rhys Greyrider
Date: 8 Aug 92 18:00:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: egf-bbs.1992Aug8.180017.4695
Distribution: usa
Organization: EGF, MN Public Access Unix

Unto Sir Corwyn ap Rhys Greyrider doth Berwynn Aethelbryght sent greetings.

First i must apologize to the general readership of the Rialto for using
this public forum.

Noble Sir, I thank you for your recent response to my inquiry on the
Royalty, and wish to correspond with you and others who reside in
Nordskogen.  Unfortunately, your address was deleted when I read your
message, and would much appreciate it if you could e-mail it to me.  My
address may appear above, but if not, I have been somewhat successful in
recieving mail at  plains!egf-bbs!aboz  , although I still have not
figured out all the intricacies of addressing mail on this system.

Perhaps you have seen me, as I have been to the recent Crown tourney, also
RUM, and Silfren Mere's camping event.  I am the one with the fondness for
small furry creatures, particulary a racoon which I subject to various
vexations.

I anxiously await your reply.


-- 
Berwynn Aethelbryght, Pursuivant of the Shire of Elverod, Grand Forks, ND
                BKA (Known on the BBS as) Aboz the Untidy
From: del@babel.DIALix.oz.au (D Elson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Combat Archery 
Distribution: world
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 12:40:27 GMT
Organization: 


In article <1992Aug17.000449.14394@cam.compserv.utas.edu.au> mdewis@esk.compserv.utas.edu.au writes:

  > Greetings from Richard of Dunheved!

Greetings

  > On the subject of Heavies tap-dancing on arrows, the only solution I can
  > offer is education.

A simpler answer that we have found in Aneala (since many heavies do not
respond to education -- said while wearing flameproof vest) is to use
a rule where a heavy can wave his foot or weapon over an arrow/bunch of arrows/
javelin/axe/etc, rendering the arrows "useless".  The marshal watching will
note that the weapons have been destroyed, and can not be re-inspected for
re-use.

-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------
D Elson                            |  del@DIALix.oz.au del@adied.oz.au
-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------
Master Delbert von Strasburg.      !  15 Errinbee St, Riverton WA 6148
Aneala, Lochac, WEST.              !  Australia.
-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mjc+@cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio)
Subject: Re: Kids, Halflings, Goslings, Smalls...
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 05:17:58 GMT

>Still, I think it's a great idea that paid babysitting be available at
>events.  I'd even be willing to sign up for it in advance.  And bring
>toys.  And an apple for the teacher.

There's a simple solution, then: bring a paid babysitter *to* the event.
Many groups have members who are short on cash and like kids; pay the event
fees for one of these in exchange for watching the kid during the tourney,
and see if anyone bites.  You may start a trend.  Or you may find other
parents who are willing to pay a fair share of the cost to have *their*
kids watched too.  Private enterprise will likely work better than anything
centrally organized by the SCA, so give it a try.

Do be aware of daycare laws in your area, though.  At a certain number of
children, and this varies from state to state, you move from babysitting
to daycare.  Daycare services usually have to be licensed and maybe insured.

Ellisif
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mjc+@cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Opinions wanted: Pennsic land allotment
Date: 20 Aug 92 03:37:01 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

This year's land allocation person, Johan von Traubenberg, is seeking
feedback on this year's land grab so he can summarize what worked and 
what didn't in his report (due in October, I think).  If you have opinions,
please send them to:
	John Kasper
	5631 Wellesley St.
	Pittsburgh, PA 15206

Comments emailed to me will be forwarded, but I do not have the time to
act as a go-between, so make sure you include your name and address if you
want an answer.

Ellisif
From: Bob.Upson@f333.n142.z1.fidonet.org (Bob Upson)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Pennsic Update (End)
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 20:10:00 -0500

> The final attendance count was just under 7300 (I think) and the
 
Bummer.  There must have been many 'holes' in the sequence this year as the
highest badges issued went over 8200...
 
> East "won" the Grand Tourney, taking both Champions' battles,
> the Field Battle, the Woods Battle, and both archery points.
 
Errata, we took all *three* archery points, champions, clout, and barbarians. 
The archers of the east both outshot and outnumbered the archers of the mid this
year.  Of note however were the *outstanding* archers fielded by the mid in the
champions' battle -- of three champions contests, the mid took one and gave the
east a real run for a second.  Vivants and Hoobahs for all!
 
> The Dark Horde had contracted to guard the gates of the Eastrealm
> camp...  And nothing in the contract said _where_ they had to guard
> them...  So the gates ended up in Horde Camp, making them _much_ easier
> to guard...
 
One of the high points of the week... <G>  One should never hire a mongol
without checking the fine print...
 
> Someone or some group constructed a picture of an early period horse
> the size of a football field on the side of the hill overlooking
> the battlefield...  It looked like the "lines" were drawn with
> 60"-wide white fabric of some sort and the effect was quite impressive.
 
Pity some &*#@%$ vandalized it before the aerial photos were taken... :(
 
> correct interaction," among others.  In my opinion, "springing" the
> "Grand Tournament" on attendees, rather than "publicizing" it was
 
Not to mention 'springing' it on the allied kings at the last minute -- yes, it
was *that* much a last minute idea (and not a good one, IMHO, even if I am a
royalist).
From: bnostran@ds5000.dac.northeastern.EDU (Solveig Throndardottir)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Seishin-ryuu Muhekian
Date: 17 Aug 92 06:09:05 GMT
Organization: The Internet

Nobles!

On two nights at Pennsic small groups of gentles gathered to experience the
taste of tea.  Any gentle interested in tea, may contact me at this address.
As always, warm and sincere thanks to all who chose to attend and participate
in these small gatherings.

						Your Humble Servant
						Solveig Throndardottir
						Totally Ignorant
From: ewright@convex.com (Edward V. Wright)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Pennsic, Some Thoughts
Date: 19 Aug 92 15:38:02 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

Arenwald von Hagenberg (Arnold N Pears) writes:

>>Lighting is another consideration.  If you expect people to be doing things 
>>after dark, well, tiki torches and firelight just aren't adequate for fine
>>work like embroidery and sewing.

>Does this mean that all such work in the period we are concerned with 
>was accomplished during daylight hours?

No, it means that people damaged their eyes by straining them in 
bad light.  Like using live steel on the battlefield, this is an
aspect of period life we don't wish to recreate. 

-- Nicholas van Leyden
From: leino@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Antti Leino)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Drachenwald to be kingdom
Date: 22 Aug 92 20:50:09 GMT
Organization: Shire of Aarnimetsa, Drachenwald, East

Gretings to the good gentles of this Rialto from Pietari Pentinpoika Uv.

Lord Seamus wrote:

>                                   Whereas the bulk of our population is now
> native (vivant Nordmark) the vast majority of our principality officers
> are American (and a good proportion of those are married to each other).

Well, yes.  However, this does not mean that the central administration
of Drachenwald will collapse if (or when) the US armed forces withdraw
from Europe.  We do have competent native people, too.  It just happens
that currently it is convenient that many of the great officers live
near to each other.  Even this might change, depending on what kind of
administrative structure we are going to have as a kingdom -- and if it
doesn't, the administrative centre might well shift to Nordmark.  Having
more and more officers on the net helps with the communication, too. 

> 	I'm sorry. Given that our Shire receive 3 times as many visitors from
> the East Kingdom than from Drachenwald we're not at all keen at seeing them
> elevated to a higher status. 

Well, this is a genuine Drachenwald problem.  The distances themselves
are about the same as those inside the USA, but psychologically they are
quite a lot bigger.  There are about half a dozen sovereign countries,
most of which are separated by seas.  This adds to the costs, too -- it
wouln't be all that much cheaper for me to travel to one of your events
than it would be to Pennsic. 

This will probably lead to Drachenwald being a very heterogenous
kingdom, with mundane countries as clearly separate regions. 
Bureaucratically, this would make quite a deep structure if we stayed as
a principality; as a kingdom this just means that we have a lot of small
regions instead of a couple of bigger ones.  In terms of group identity
this means that people will think of themselves as members of their
native group rather than subjects of the Drachenwald crown.  In my
opinion, this is not necessarily a problem. 


        Pietari

PS. I don't consider myself a wet blanket; on the contrary, I'm quite
    enthusiastic about our becoming the 13th kingdom.  Of course
    there'll be some initial difficulties, but that is to be expected
    with a change of any kind.

-- 
Antti Leino                                     "The notion of code-switching 
University of Helsinki Computing Centre          presupposes that there are 
Antti.Leino@Helsinki.FI                          codes to switch."
Organization: Doctoral student, Industrial Administration, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA