From: baylor@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Baylor)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Formal programming education
Date: 23 Jul 92 05:43:19 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

>One thing that has not been mentioned yet in this thead (at least not so far 
>as I've seen) is that if you want to be a programmer, you should have a 
>degree, but not necessarily a CS degree.  I am currently a Math/Physics major
>and I routinely (about five or six per year) get job offers looking for 
>programmers.  This includes offers from game companies.  Apparently, a lot of
>companies are looking for more than just CS majors.


	Oh yeah, well i can beat all of you. I have only been using 
computers for a year and a half, am working on getting a degree in
history and Native american studies and have done decently doing
computer consulting and contract-programming (working often through
another computer geek my age who is a drop-out english major). I'm
even shooting for my CNE soon.
	Several people i know make money without degrees, but they are
often those people who got in when there were few CS programs and the
micro field was new (or before); many have army experince. Heads of the
depts here at the university of texas don't have CS degrees, and some
fairly famous programmers/analysts here don't have CS degrees or degrees
at all (the senior mac person is bereft, the next in line is an
english major, yet another is a dentist). ANd we do some fairly
important work here.
	However, the down side (i considered droping out to support
my wife  and get the hell out of austin):
	it is gtting harder by the day to get somewhere without a degree,
big companies won't look at you (i got a pleasent response from origin
and BSG but IBM spit in my face). Most of the work friends and i do 
is niche work (find a small company who knows nothing of computers
and build clientel - my freinds gryphon systems now specializes in 
point of sales systems and lans for law offices - yuch)
	further, it takes MUCH longer to get somewhere. Our head mac
guy had to apply 4 times for a bottom-level job here, and it took him
4 times as long to rise to his current senior programmer position
despite ample qualifications and published software, just because 
he had no degree. You could get a job, but it's much harder to get
advancement, and your own company realistically may only pull in the
bucks for a couple of years.
	On the bright side, my boss tells me that when he hires,
degrees and gpas are irrelevant - so long as you have one. It 
proves, as he tells me, that you can put up with lots of shit to
get what you want (degree). Kinda like an abuse-measure. And he loves
masters because it proves your a maschoist. History goes over well
(proves you can research) and english seems popular, but he says
5 years after your outa school the degree content itself doesn't
matter.
	Just without it, pray for luck and be prepared to get the
less prestigious jobs.
	As for games, several of my friends work for origin. All are,
without exception, english majors. Some do research, some do play testing,
some game design. The top-type brass there (well, someone high up there)
is best known for his work on the DM guide. The programmers (at least 
one is 18) are fairly young. Games do not always require CS degrees.
	Always the bright note :)
-- 
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Baylor Wetzel    baylor@cc.utexas.edu        Hang Tyson 
Free Leonard Peltier
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Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer