From: dougnews@access.digex.com (Doug Humphrey)
Newsgroups: dc.general
Subject: Re: Banks in Northern Va.
Date: 24 Jan 1993 16:01:10 -0500
Organization: Express Access Online Communications USA
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

In article <1jqj0nINN5dj@mirror.digex.com> adric@access.digex.com (William Johnson) writes:
>In article <1jqgj2INN1fp@mirror.digex.com> dougnews@access.digex.com (Doug Humphrey) writes:
>>Actually, the case that you cite happens all the time even today; 
>>when backend processing on a mainframe breaks down, and an ATM is not 
>>able to get account ballance data, many ATMs will have a set maximum 
>>limit that they will issue in cash without verification.  There are 
>>safeguards in place to prevent you from running from machine to machine
>>though; the proof is left to the reader as an exercise ;-)
>
>Safeguards?  How?  If the mainframe keeps track, and the ATMs are allowed 
>to dispense cash without direct communication with the mainframe?

You are making the assumption that the mainframe is the only thing
that can keep track and make decisions...

>And anyway, I just assume that when the ATM says "This terminal is not
>currently in service" that it either means the machine is out of money, 
>or that the mainframe is down/not connected.  I know my particular bank,
>Crestar, has told me on occasion that they can't process a certain transation
>for me because their computer is down.

If the system is down, then the ATM may be down, but if it is on one 
of the nets, then it would be dumb to turn it off just because it can't
deal with its homw bank; there are revenue generating transactions for patrons
of other banks that can be done without the host banks mainframes.

>>I will note that a bank ALWAYS charges you money for access to your
>>own money, in one form or another; That is what banks do.  
>
>Not exactly.  What banks do is make money using your money.  You give them
>your money, under pre-set conditions, and they go out and try to make more
>money with it.  But just because they are able to invest it and get 10%
>return while they are paying you 5% does not mean they are charging you
>money for access to your money.  They are simply making an arrangement
>such that they can take opportunities to make more cash that probably 
>wouldn't be available to you anyway.  For instance, how many people have
>enough disposable income to be able to afford to finance someone's 
>mortgage?  Few, I would imagine.  And yet at the interest rates charged
>(usually a good bit higher than what the banks pay out) it can be pretty
>lucrative, particularly since there is a much smaller risk than there
>is with, say, the stock market.

A difference which makes no difference is no difference; they are 
charging you money, because you could be out there getting that 10%
but rather than do that, and not have your money available, you choose
to take the 5%, give them 5%, and have the money available in liquid
form.

>One thing which DOES tick me off is the relatively recent moving away from
>accepting non-standard checks.  There was once a time when you could write 
>a check on anything, and as long as you included your signature, the
>account number, the bank name, and made it obvious that this was a check
>(say, the words Pay To The Order Of), you could write it all on a pair of
>underpants if you wanted, it was still a valid check.

This may have to do with the fact that most places deal with 
checks in automated systems, and non-standard checks will require
special handling, and that is expensive.

>Now most banks require pre-printed checks, which must conform to certain
>specifications, meaning that they get to charge you for checks, which IS
>charging you for access to your money.

In the cases where I have enquired, I have been told that there is 
no requirement to use the banks checks (which are priced very high),
because there are other places where you can order them to comply with
the same standards.  Still, don't expect the bank to make it a point
to inform you of this; I suspect that they make good money on them.

>(How's that, I'm arguing your case for you.)

Hey, stranger things have happened ;-)

-- 
Doug Humphrey    Express Access Public Access Internet   Voice (301) 220-2020
doug@digex.com   Dialup: (301) 220-0462 Login as "new"   Email info@digex.com
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