HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: Here we go...
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 92 10:16:01 GMT

In article <16879B225.EUCLID@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu> EUCLID@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (Elizabeth Kupfer) writes:
>In article <1992Oct7.064806.21224@leland.Stanford.EDU>
>underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>Why is it that I never meet ladies--in real life outside of this newsgroup--
>>that are as open minded and intelligent as the ladies on this newsgroup?
>    Mebbe you scare them away.
>  But seriously, think about it.  Sue is in Colorado, Psycho Kitten is on the
>East Coast, Our Lady of the Ruby Claw is in Hawaii...the list goes on...and
>*you* are at Stanford.
>THREE POUNDS OF FLAX!  KWAATCH!!

What does "FLAX" and "KWAATCH" mean?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seikatsu no imi wa nan desu ka.            \|  |`      | Don't buy from Toyota;
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.          | -+-      | especially, don't buy
                                           /| / \      | from Capitol Toyota in
Copyright 1992.                 Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3 | San Jose, California.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: a cheap holiday in other people's misery
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 23:32:26 GMT

In article <Bw0KD8.7wG@news.cso.uiuc.edu> dennis@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu
(Thomas A. Dennis) writes:
>...
>I think that you've hit on the thing that bothers me most about some (not all)
>of the activity in this group--the suicide-as-melodrama thread running through
>some of the posts.  Maybe there should be an 'alt.suicide.serious' group for
>people like myself, whose experience with successful and attempted suicides 
>just doesn't square with the way the subject is treated

Really?  Then, please identify the differences.

>--dare I say,
>romanticized--in this group.
>...

I certainly see nothing romantic about suicide.

But I do think that governments should recognize a person's right to
take his/her own life.  Do you object?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seikatsu no imi wa nan desu ka.            \|  |`      | Don't buy from Toyota;
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.          | -+-      | especially, don't buy
                                           /| / \      | from Capitol Toyota in
Copyright 1992.                 Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3 | San Jose, California.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: guild@ecr.mu.oz.au (Luke_Thomas WILLIAMS)
Subject: Re: Columbus Day: Start? Winter Depression Season
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 15:48:07 GMT

In article <92287.231952U56503@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U56503@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
> In article <9228810.20170@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU>, guild@ecr.mu.oz.au (Luke_Thomas
> WILLIAMS) says:
> 
> >        What about us poor bastards in the southern hemisphere - constantly
> >out
> >of sync with all the rest of you - surely I'm not the only one who's
> >just leaving winter with the prospect of a long,glorious summer ahead
> 
> I'd say you misspoke!  I'd say you are *lucky* bastards.
> 
> Say--How *was* winter?  Were you depressed?  What do we have to look
> forward to?   As the earth tips. . . .
> 
	Was I depressed????!!!!  Umm, just a little bit - the real question
is will the advent of summer actually help?

	Luke Williams      | "I'll never understand you, son," Mrs Zimmerman
	guild@ecr.mu.oz.au | used to sigh - and she was right, she never did.
			   | 		Ben Elton, `Stark'
	
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: dsteinbe@nmsu.edu (David Steinberg)
Subject: Re: Ok, Ok...
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
	<1apkhiINNe9l@seven-up.East.Sun.COM> <1ar3obINN7vl@agate.berkeley.edu>
	<Bvr1vz.Jn3@NCoast.ORG>
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 04:34:56 GMT

In article <Bvr1vz.Jn3@NCoast.ORG> brown@NCoast.ORG (Stan Brown) writes:

   If one talks about committing suicide, there is a very real risk of
   being locked up in an instititution "for your own good".  Even
   if 29 of your 30 friends will be saddened but believe that you have a
   right to do as you choose with your own life, the 30th can go to the
   police, or a psychiatrist, and get you involuntarily committed.  (Laws
   vary by state, but here in Ohio it takes one psychiatrist's word, just
   one.  If you protest involuntary commitment, they don't even have to
   bring you before a judge for 72 hours -- during which time you're still
   locked up in the loony bit -- and the judge then sets a hearing date
   that's supposed to be in the next 30 days but may not be -- during which
   time you're _still_ locked up in the loony bin.)



This kind of reminds me of those good ol' days in high school.  I was
at a party, and continuing a previous conversation I had with
someone, was talking about killing myself.  Pretty soon, I had a bunch
of people around me telling me not to do it.  O.K., I thought, end of
story... Not end of story.  The following Monday my advisor (don't ask
me why my high school had advisiors...) wanted to talk with me.
Someone had told her about me being depressed.  Then the guidance
counsler (sp... sorry) told my grandmother, at the same time I was
asking my advisor not to tell my family.  MMMMMMMMM helpful.  So I had
to deal with a quasi-hysterical grandmother and two trips to a
psychatrist.  (I stopped going when, after my second trip, I found
myself crying hysterically in the hallway.  "This is supposed to HELP
me?", I thought.)  So, I didn't get locked up, but I had to go through
hell.  (Although, I am curious as to who cared enough (and I do think
this was a caring act) to go behind my back and tell my advisor.
True, it made a bad situation worse, but s/he couldn't have possibly
have known that...)
-David "ZZYZX" Steinberg
**********************************************************************
*"There's a dog in the station  *"I can't believe I'm a junior and a *
* With a bad reputation         * film major, when all I really      *
* That's a sign of the nation's * wanted in this life was to marry a *
* Decay"                        * lobsterman and cook fish."         *
* -Phish                        * -a letter from Christie Searing    *
**********************************************************************
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
Subject: Re: Here we go...
From: emiddlec@mora.gac.edu (Eric Middlecamp)
Date: 11 Oct 92 22:29:29 -0600

In article <1992Oct9.101601.21269@leland.Stanford.EDU>  writes:
>In article <16879B225.EUCLID@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu> EUCLID@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (Elizabeth Kupfer) writes:
>>In article <1992Oct7.064806.21224@leland.Stanford.EDU>
>>underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:

>>>Why is it that I never meet ladies--in real life outside of this newsgroup--
>>>that are as open minded and intelligent as the ladies on this newsgroup?
>>    Mebbe you scare them away.
>>  But seriously, think about it.  Sue is in Colorado, Psycho Kitten is on the
>>East Coast, Our Lady of the Ruby Claw is in Hawaii...the list goes on...and
>>*you* are at Stanford.

Hmm.. because you are seeing a disproportionate cross-section of the population.
example: 10% of people are open-minded, yet 40% of those on the net are open-minded..
From: EUCLID@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
Subject: # 50
Date: 16 Oct 92 14:17:34 GMT
Organization: C.C.S.O.

Mitchell, please,
If you can hear
Your daughter's strong!
And loves you,still.
But wants to know why you have gone.
I cannot bear to tell her that
You left of your own will.
 
                e.k. 10/92
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: dsteinbe@nmsu.edu (David Steinberg)
Subject: Greetings from Las Cruces
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
Distribution: alt.suicide.holiday
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 03:44:07 GMT

Greetings from Las Cruces, town of nice (but boring) weather and nice
(but boring) people.  Yes this town, among other things, is full of
people who go on and on about how odd they are.  Yet one is always
stunned by how normal they are.  I wish that these people, for just
one day, could know what it's like to actually be a freak.  Being a
freak is knowing that most people will barely give you the time of day
because you're annoying.  Being a freak is spending signicant amounts
of time seriously worrying about your sanity.  Most importantly, being
a freak means- at most times- not even noticing that you're being odd.
I can't count the number of times that I've said something that I
thought was a cute joke (or something like that) only to have a
roomful of people react as though I just killed their mother.  Of
course, we do tend to stick together, but see my first sentence.  If
my creativity is a stone wall, Las Cruces is like a leaky faucet,
wearing me down- drip by drip by drip....

Have a NICE day :@$

-David "ZZYZX" Steinberg
**********************************************************************
*"There's a dog in the station  *"I can't believe I'm a junior and a *
* With a bad reputation         * film major, when all I really      *
* That's a sign of the nation's * wanted in this life was to marry a *
* Decay"                        * lobsterman and cook fish."         *
* -Phish                        * -a letter from Christie Searing    *
**********************************************************************
 
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: Psycho Kitten
Subject: Re: sdf.lonestar.org: /u/df/suicide_quux
Originator: awatson@pecan.cns.udel.edu
Organization: The Eternal Order of Chaos 
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 01:31:53 GMT


	Awww... I was just giving you target practice Lucifuge...

	No, I don't think "society" is out to get anyone (or that it is
an entity in it's own right).  I was just hoping to show how daft some
of his remarks were... (without coming out and saying it of course) 

	(I also accidentally hit the 's' instead of the 'e' key...)

	My thoughts on crushing people (or snuffing out life) don't
quite fit this group... I'm still waiting for the creation of alt.assassin,
alt.wannabe.reaper.grim and/or alt.psycho.kitten.  

	Sorry, but I've been around people who don't want people (me
included) to commit suicide because it would either mean losing control
or having to clean up after the dead body.  There is love in the world...
but it's definatly in limited supply (or distribution).

	Echo What Who  (childhood alias)
	Psycho Kitten
 


-- 

Psycho Kitten   \ zaphodb@brahms.udel.edu    \ Check my .plan \ Just a Grim
Angela M. Watson \ awatson@pecan.cns.udel.edu \ for more info  \ Reaper wannabe
From: jprovo@Gnu.ai.mit.edu (The Wandering Pedestal of Angst)
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
Subject: Re: a cheap holiday in other people's misery
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:15:22 GMT
Organization: Russel Street UN*X and Caffeine

G.I.West@bradford.ac.uk (Graham West) writes:
>I think you've got a good point here - there are quite a few people who seem
>to like melodrama 
damn - this is an irritant, eh?
Waste of energy; I know many people who are perfectly 'happy' who seem to need 
to live in a soap opera-reality of earth-shattering moment after 
earth-shattering moment...and be observed doing so.

I am perfectly aware of the auto-motivation tactic of deadlines and other
Emergentile methods, but what of the vacuum-headed need for *others to validate
one's existance*, eh?  Talk about lack of security....

...maybe it is a mirror image of the insecurity that causes people to try to
control other people's lives - validating their existance thru externals
again...hmmm....

....now, having eliminated a portion of the human race from consideration, let
us turn toward those who validate their existance via internal action...

joe, going somewhere with all this, but can't sleep coz my bed's on fire...

-- 
Disclaimer: "I'm the only one foolish enough to claim these opinions as mine."
jprovo@gnu.ai.mit.edu                                       jzp@gene.ummed.edu
    Russell Street UN*X Consultations and Development     (NIC handle: JZP)
                            Rev. Dkr. Nick LaRG0, ASC
From: brown@NCoast.ORG (Stan Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
Subject: not orighinal with me, more's the pity
Date: 11 Oct 92 14:20:37 GMT
Organization: Oak Road Systems, Cleveland Ohio USA

In my occasional program of reading acknowledged classics that I never
read in school, I've begun _Faust_ (in Louis MacNeice's translation).
Yesterday I ran across these lines, which seem a propos:
 
The pain of earth's constricted life, I fancy
Will pierce me still, whatever my attire;
I am too old for mere amusement,
Too young to be without desire.
How can the world dispel my doubt?
You must do without, you must do without!
That is the everlasting song
Which rings in every ear, which rings
And which to us our whole life long
Every hour hoarsely sings.
   ...
And so existence weighs upon my breast
And I long for life and death--life I detest.
 
BTW, the poem reads surprisingly easily.  And I was surprised to learn
that Faust was not a bad guy, at least not at the start.  The poem opens
in heaven, where God points out how Faust is one of his and accepts a
bet from Mephistopheles that the latter can get Faust to turn away from
God.  (Sounds like Job, eh?  There is nothing new under the sun.)

-- 
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems                      brown@Ncoast.ORG
Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: jprovo@Gnu.ai.mit.edu (Genetic Jones)
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday,alt.finals.suicide
Subject: Re: Old fogeys
Date: 11 Oct 92 19:23:07 GMT
Followup-To: alt.suicide.holiday
Organization: Russel Street UN*X and Caffeine

In article <1am794INNgnn@bigboote.WPI.EDU> megazone@dolomite.WPI.EDU (MegaZone23) writes:
>In article <jgs1.718168064@Isis.MsState.Edu> jgs1@ra.msstate.edu (jimi strickland) writes:
>Where have you been man! I never left. :-) I remember when WPI almost took
>over this group; crimson, needles, wildone, mark, fmeyer(RIP), and myself...
>(I know I forgot people...) It was great when people asked what was so bad
>about WPI that half the ashers were students here... hehehe But I stayed
>sane.... Bwahahahaha....
[deleted]
>>               -jimi  Co-Overlord of A.S.H. now that Mega is here-
>
>Why thank you, I'm flattered...
>
>I'm pretty sure mark@wpi still either lurks or drops in from time to time,
>I wonder if any others from the dark days of ash are still out there? hello?
>anyone out there? Any a.f.s people?

well, hell, I'm not crimson anymore but i poke my nose in now & again....
[sigh]
I hooked andrea up with access in hawaii after she moved out there - she
still 'round these here parts?  Bleah.....I'm fairly sure mark [now mjs@gnu]
pokes in from time to time....

...if there's ether into the netherworld, fnord is here....

...joe, maybe even winding up for some poetry....

-- 
Disclaimer: "I'm the only one foolish enough to claim these opinions as mine."
jprovo@gnu.ai.mit.edu                                       jzp@gene.ummed.edu
    Russell Street UN*X Consultations and Development     (NIC handle: JZP)
                            Rev. Dkr. Nick LaRG0, ASC 
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: ssalimb01@cc.curtin.edu.au
Subject: Re : *thunk*thunk*thunk*
Organization: Curtin University of Technology
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 03:22:47 GMT

In article <1992Oct4.011504.5072@udel.edu>, psycho.kitten@a.dark.place writes:
> 	
> 	...just me tapping, gently rapping, quickly tapping at my
> 		keyboard...
> 
> 	I'm too depressed and emmersed in self-hatred and loathing to
> 	write much now...
> 
> 	I wish I had someone I could talk to... but that will never       
> 		happen...
> 
> 	...back to playing UMoria (for one) on my Mac... a new toy to
> 	keep me from my studies...> 
> 
oohhhhh...... pleeeeaasseee, your article really depresses me.  I've got my 
exams coming up next month.  Thanks for nothing!!!

(grinning)  Now I have got an excuse for my F grades.
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: EUCLID@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu
Subject: Re: Here we go...
Organization: C.C.S.O.
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 17:40:01 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.064806.21224@leland.Stanford.EDU>
underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
 
>Why is it that I never meet ladies--in real life outside of this newsgroup--
>that are as open minded and intelligent as the ladies on this newsgroup?
    Mebbe you scare them away.
  But seriously, think about it.  Sue is in Colorado, Psycho Kitten is on the
East Coast, Our Lady of the Ruby Claw is in Hawaii...the list goes on...and
*you* are at Stanford.
THREE POUNDS OF FLAX!  KWAATCH!!
 
euclid
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: nadja@jetsun.weitek.COM (Nadja Adolf)
Subject: Re: a cheap holiday in other people's misery
Organization: WEITEK Corporation, Sunnyvale CA
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 21:25:04 GMT

In article <Bw0KD8.7wG@news.cso.uiuc.edu> dennis@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Thomas A. Dennis) writes:

>I think that you've hit on the thing that bothers me most about some (not all)
>of the activity in this group--the suicide-as-melodrama thread running through
>some of the posts.  Maybe there should be an 'alt.suicide.serious' group for
>people like myself, whose experience with successful and attempted suicides 
>just doesn't square with the way the subject is treated--dare I say,
>romanticized--in this group.  Until then, someone--not necessarily myself--
>should still pop up from time to time to remind the more morbid a.s.h.ers that
>someone's suicide is not an occasion for "a cheap holiday in other people's 
>misery."

Try alt.recovery or something. I've been depressed for 29 years, and
I enjoy black humor immmensely. This is just not the place to look for
someone to give you support not to kill yourself. In the tradition of scot
davis who used to post from Butterick (BTW, anyone know where he went?), some
of us find the possibility of our own deaths not unpleasant.


-- 
The Earth Pig Bourne....

nadja@node.com (prefered email address)
nadja@weitek.com
From: dsteinbe@nmsu.edu (David Steinberg)
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
Subject: Re: sdf.lonestar.org: /u/df/suicide_quux
Date: 15 Oct 92 15:25:51 GMT
	<1992Oct13.013153.3798@udel.edu>
Organization: NMSU Computer Science

In article <1992Oct13.013153.3798@udel.edu> Psycho Kitten writes:

	   My thoughts on crushing people (or snuffing out life) don't
   quite fit this group... I'm still waiting for the creation of alt.assassin,
   alt.wannabe.reaper.grim and/or alt.psycho.kitten.  
                                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

What a great idea.  Let's get this off the ground soon...
(Just trying to avoid studying for my analysis test.  Nothing quite
like a test that- when we ask what is going to be on it- she gives us
four pages of notes.  I would have studied last night but got
engrossed in the playoff game.  Procrastination- nature's way of
telling you that you don't really want to be in grad school.)
-David "ZZYZX" Steinberg
**********************************************************************
*"There's a dog in the station  *"I can't believe I'm a junior and a *
* With a bad reputation         * film major, when all I really      *
* That's a sign of the nation's * wanted in this life was to marry a *
* Decay"                        * lobsterman and cook fish."         *
* -Phish                        * -a letter from Christie Searing    *
**********************************************************************
 
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: euclid@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (Saint Joan of Arc)
Subject: Re: sdf.lonestar.org:/u/df/suicide_quux
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 16:34:27 GMT

It isn't necessary that a person have nefarious motives for doing something
which causes or enhances the pain in someone's life....though i suppose in
many cases it is a sound explanation for someone doing something.
  One may, for instance, have perfectly good intentions by taking a small
child's hand and firmly planting it into to sand beside a cactus plant, the
idea being to postion the child to take a photograph.  I witnessed such an
incident once....i'm sure the mother didn't realize the sand hid some cactus
spines, which pierced the boy's hand and judging from his scream was painful.
 
  That (most) societies condemn suicide could be the result that those that
don't die out.  No moral judgment here, only an application of meme theory.
It also hold for individuals; those with firmer desire to live than those that
don't and off themselves are the ones left over to reproduce.

 e.k.                         

--
St. Joan of Arc ,euclid@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (preferred)
standard disclaimers apply
Hold fast to the center --Tao Te Ching
Newsgroups: alt.suicide.holiday
From: brown@NCoast.ORG (Stan Brown)
Subject: Re: Ok, Ok...
Organization: Oak Road Systems, Cleveland Ohio USA
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 11:43:08 GMT

In article <1ar3obINN7vl@agate.berkeley.edu> jaffray@beirut.berkeley.edu (Alan Jaffray) writes:
>
>But it does sort of disturb me when I think about it.  I mean, from the
>article you can clearly see that this was a person who still had a strong
>sense of humor, and wasn't too distressed to not be able to make rather
>intricate plans, and yet he still became *so* depressed as to decide that
>life wasn't worth living.  It bothers me in two ways, first in that he
>probably appeared in good spirits to others, his acquaintances might well
>have never seen it coming, 

This is necessary.

If one talks about committing suicide, there is a very real risk of
being locked up in an instititution "for your own good".  Even
if 29 of your 30 friends will be saddened but believe that you have a
right to do as you choose with your own life, the 30th can go to the
police, or a psychiatrist, and get you involuntarily committed.  (Laws
vary by state, but here in Ohio it takes one psychiatrist's word, just
one.  If you protest involuntary commitment, they don't even have to
bring you before a judge for 72 hours -- during which time you're still
locked up in the loony bit -- and the judge then sets a hearing date
that's supposed to be in the next 30 days but may not be -- during which
time you're _still_ locked up in the loony bin.)

Talking about suicide is rightly regarded as a cry for help, because it
carries a good chance that you'll be prevented from carrying out your
intention (or any other intention).  I'm not saying that suicide is good
(or bad), but that it is horribly wrong to deal with it in the coercive
ways that are considered the norm (at least here in the U.S.).

As in so many ways, our society is screwed up about this.  It's
dangerous to ask for help because the result may be incarceration rather
than any real help.  (I am not speaking out of theory here, but from a
situation that came very close to home last year.)
-- 
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems                      brown@Ncoast.ORG
Cleveland, Ohio, USA