HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jfjones@intvax2.cs.sandia.gov (James F. Jones)
Subject: Re: Opinions on pots...
Organization: Sandia National Labs, Org. 1411, Albq., NM
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 16:42:27 GMT

From article <1992Apr13.220123.16758@r1info.intel.com>, by jreece@sousa.intel.com (John Reece):
> In article <1992Mar31.184309.18617@fs7.ece.cmu.edu> schaefer@young.ece.cmu.edu (Roland Schaefer) writes:
> 
>>Putting aside my fear of opening another hornets nest in trying to elicit
>>peoples opinions on a subject matter, I have this question...
> 
>>What are the advantages of Aluminum vs. Stainless Steel pots.
> 
> Aluminum is lighter and a much better conductor of heat.  Unless stainless
> is the expensive stuff that is very thick, heavy, and clad with copper it 
> will tend to develop hot spots that cause food to stick and burn.
> 
> Some people believe there is a causal link between aluminum and 
> Alzheimer's disease.

I heard that the consern (regarding Al pots & Alzheimer's) was with cast
pots.  As opposed to the exturded pots like we use for backpacking.  If
this is not true somebody let me know because I've been using the Al
pots for uhhhh.  Let's see. alot of uh years, yea years that's it.

--- Red
From: richh@TIGGER.JVNC.NET (RICHH)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: test
Date: 14 Apr 92 18:35:42 GMT

thanks
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: mark@csi.jpl.nasa.gov (Mark Webster)
Subject: Re: Abandoned places
Originator: mark@dumbo
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 15:59:25 GMT


Here in Pasadena, there is the Sam Merrill Trail (or a fire road from the top
of Chaney Trail Road) out of the old Cobb Estate that goes to the top of Echo
Mountain.  There are extensive ruins of a LARGE luxury hotel on top of the 
mountain.  Around the turn of the century, this was a resort that was reached
by an incline railway from Rubio Canyon down below.  Rubio had a stop of the
extensive LA trolley system ( which was really bought up and scrapped by a 
conglomerate put together by the car companies a la Roger Rabbit and is now
being partially replaced for a couple of billion dollars).  A railway then went
from this resort to the Alpine Tavern near Mt. Lowe.  I read about this before 
I saw it but I wasn't prepared for the rush of imagination when I saw the
carved main staircase of the old hotel leading up to some brush covered ruins.
I could just see people in old pin striped suits, bowler hats and long skirts
climbing these stairs.  The view from up there is pretty good, on the less
smoggy days.

Mark
From: luong@naxos.inria.fr (Quang-Tuan Luong)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Telemark Randonne
Date: 6 Apr 92 17:36:32 GMT
Reply-To: luong@sophia.inria.fr
Organization: Inria Sofia Antipolis

In article <1992Apr6.142031.29893@dxcern.cern.ch>, hordvik@suca01.cern.ch (Ulf Hordvik) writes:
|> With 'randonne' bindings one can fix 'snow-knives' (freely translated 
|> from french: couteau a neige), to use when it's too steep for your skins.

To be more precise, you use them when the snow is too hard, so that 
you are uncomfortable during traverses. They help a lot !

|> I've tried to find something similar for my Telemark skies, but with 
|> no success. Does anybody know about such a system to use with Telemark 
|> skies?

Now all randonnee bindings such as Petzl, Emery, Silvretta, come together
with specific snow-knives that are very quick to put on and to get off and
that are reliable. It is not generaly possible to adapt them on telemark
skis. However, there was a time were those specific knives didn't exist, so
that pepole used Weber snow-knives: a lateral view.

           ----       ----
           |  |       |  |
           |  |       |  |
   /--------  --------   -------------
  /                                  |
  |  /|    /|    /|    /|    /|     /
  --/ |---/ |---/ |---/ |---/ |----/

There are two knives for each ski. and here is a top view of the ski:

           L          L
          ----       ----
        _|    |_   _|    |_
----------------------------------------------------------------






----------------------------------------------------------------
     -|    |-   -|    |-
       ----       ----
        R           R

You understand how the knives hold. It explains why this system was abandonned.
Knives are quite hard to place and to remove, otherwise you can lose them
easily. A trick to avoid this is to attach them together with a little chord.

However, it is the only system that you can adapt on telemark skis, and it
works very well. I don't even own telemark skis but just the Fisher E99.
 The only precaution is to shift the pieces L and R, as telemark skis are 
usually less strong than randonnee skis.

Tuan.
From: mich@aci_1.aci.ns.ca
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: re: Clip Flashlight - ** Summary **
Summary: summary of information on flashlight clip
Keywords: Flashlight, tent, sierra designs
Date: 8 Apr 92 13:26:05 GMT
Organization: Atlantic Computer Institute

In regards to my request, for informaation on the clip flashlight yesterday 
I got several replies, and one request for a summary, so here it is.  
Apparantly this model has been around since forever, so some people have had 
them for a longtime and feel that the flashlight is very durable tent.  (One 
person's had a flashlight seven years and it is still going).  No complaints 
on leaks, condensation, or reliabilty in a storm.  One word of warning 
though, it's a bit cramped for two.  However as a couples tent it could be 
considered "cozy".  The Clip 3 may be the solution to the cramping problem, 
but as a bigger tent has obvious weight drawbacks.  One personal peeve with 
the design is the small vestibule, the TNF tadpole and mayfly have much 
larger vestibules.  However one of those big orange garbage bags are always 
handy to have along on any hike and make a lightweight alternative to  a 
large vestibule.  
  	The price is also much nicer than that of the 
competition.  In Canada the Flashlight is anywhere from $70 to $100(CAN) 
than any comperabe TNF tent.  Sombody said that REI has a "clipless version" 
on sale for $100(US) I'm expecting to buy the clip for $155(CAN) or the clip 
3 for $177(CAN), but this is a one time deal.

	I've decided to go with the flashlight beacause most of my time in 
the tent will be solo or with my girlfriend, and the price right now is 
right.  The tent is extremely light.

-thanx for all the input
-M. Himmelman
-Halifax, Canada 
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: mpb@troy.uucp (27331-bunz)
Subject: Re: tent (?) question
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 92 19:42:01 GMT

In article <1992Mar31.183258.1@amherst.edu>, jkwatson@amherst.edu writes:
> A friend and I are planning to hike a good portion of the AT this summer.  I've
> been given a copy (1974 edition) of _The New Complete Walker_.  Fletcher
> suggests quite forcefully that if one is going to be backpacking in the summer,
> not to use a tent.  I was wondering what people thought about this suggestion,
> as I'm not the most experienced of backpackers.  He says that you'll do a lot
> better with just a rainfly over your sleeping bag, in almost all situations.
> Any comments?  A reply to my email address or posted would be appreciated.
> Thanks!
> -- 
> _______________________________________________________________________________
> John Watson			|  "Just because I don't know what I'm talking
> jkwatson@amherst.edu		|   about doesn't mean that I'm lying!"
> jkwatson@ksuvxd.kent.edu	|  "Where your eyes don't go, a part of you is
> ________________________________|   hovering.  It's a part of you you'll never
> Beverly Hills, 90210, dude.	|   be discovering."
> _______________________________________________________________________________

Tents have CHANGED since 1974, course so has the rain fly.  Personnally,
I HATE flying things and ticks.  When you couple that with rabies getting
out of control in PA, NJ, and NY, the idea of sleeping in the
open is less appealing as well. 

Anyway, in 74 most tents were canvas, and heavy.  Today's tents are made
from nylon and ripstop plastic and don't weigh much.  Now, most of the
weight is in the poles, so I'm considering going to the low tech end
of the tent spectrum, and use an el cheapo 5x7 pup tent, and my hiking
stick for the pole.  The problem with the cheap tent is that it has 
no ventalation in wet weather, so I'll through in a 10 x 10
nylon fly (weighs just over a pound).  This way, I don't have a lot
of weight, but am protected from rain and bugs.

Marc
From: rmuller@fremont.hampshire.edu (Richard Muller)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Grand Canyon backcountry permits
Keywords: permits, Grand Canyon
Date: 15 Apr 92 20:14:03 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Hampshire College, Amherst, MA

In article <1992Apr15.004235.19114@unocal.com> stgprao@xing.unocal.com (Richard Ottolini) writes:
>In article <1992Apr14.223102.10200@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> wade@osiris (S.Wade) writes:
>>
>>I will be hiking in Grand Canyon National Park soon.  Via mail
>>I asked for a backcountry permit to backpack down to the river
>>at Phantom Ranch and camp there.  I asked about two months ago,
>>and was told that there were no more available permits for the time
>>I will be there.

[material deleted]

>
>For the novice in the canyon, beware of the trip down.  A several hour downhill
>is when people mess up their feet and knees, particularly if you aren't used
>to your pack or shoes.   This can make the rest of the hike miserable.

Amen to this!!

>Also be prepared for snow and ice on top.  The rim is 8000' mountain altitude
>in late winter now.

Not quite -- at least, if we assume he's headed for the South Rim.
That's closer to 6500 feet than 8000, depending on which trail head
we're talking about.  The cautionary advice is well-taken, but given
the warm weather out that way the last week or so, I'd guess the snow
and ice are pretty well gone, perticularly from the Hermit Trail,
which dries out quickly up at the top.  If snow _is_ an issue, one can
rent instep crampons from various outfitters in the tourist traps in
GC village.

Rich



-- 
Rich Muller
School of Communications and Cognitive Science
Hampshire College, Amherst MA 01002 USA
(413) 549-4600 ext 501; rmuller@hamp.hampshire.edu; rmuller@hampvms.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: rob@rips.UUCP (Rob Savoye)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: tent (?) question
Date: 8 Apr 92 16:05:22 GMT
Organization: Raster Image Processing Systems, Inc.

jkwatson@amherst.edu writes:

>A friend and I are planning to hike a good portion of the AT this summer.  I've
>been given a copy (1974 edition) of _The New Complete Walker_.  Fletcher
>suggests quite forcefully that if one is going to be backpacking in the summer,
>not to use a tent.  I was wondering what people thought about this suggestion,
>as I'm not the most experienced of backpackers.  He says that you'll do a lot
>better with just a rainfly over your sleeping bag, in almost all situations.
>Any comments?  A reply to my email address or posted would be appreciated.

  On many parts of the AT there are three walled shelters you can stay in. On
weekends they fill up fast if they're near a trail head but generally during the
week you can squeeze in (literally). During many of my trips on the AT I used
only a bivy-sack and a tarp. I have a hip-hugger frame pack and I would tie
the tarp to it (since it stands up by itself) to give me enough space to cook
in a downpour. The bivy sack is very light and only a problem if you decide to
wait out a storm. I usually just keep hiking if it rains. I imagine a good tarp
would be OK too, my only problem with tarps is that in a heavy storm they leak
underneath cause they have no floor. Also wind becomes a problem. Also on
parts of the AT it can still get cold at night. I also chose the bivy sack
cause at the time I always used a down bag. Now that I have a synthetic summer
bag the bivy sack would be less nessasary.

+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Rob Savoye                                             rips!rob@solbourne.com
RIPS (Raster Image Processing Systems)           uunet!solbourne.com!rips!rob
4665 Nautilus Court South                    << KERNAL: Panic, core dumped >>
Boulder, CO 80301                         Darkstar crashes, pouring its light 
(303) 530-2910                              into ashes, reason tatters, ...
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: ss@panix.com (Steve Steinberg)
Subject: External Frame Backpacks: What do *you* think?
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 22:25:58 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

I need suggestions for a backpack.  It should be external frame and
large!  I do some camping with the local Boy Scouts, and they have
asked me to do some high adventure with them (3-4 days backpacking)
in the fall.

Jansport packs look nice, the D-2 is about $180 (Campmor Summer '91)
but I was wondering if the flexible frame works.  $180 is as much
as I would spend (maybe too much).

Your help is appreciated,

Yours in Scouting,

Steve Steinberg
Assistant Cubmaster, Pack 139
Howard Beach, NY
Tomahawk District, Queens Council
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Call the Stone Mountain BBS, The world's first BBS dedicated to
Scouting.  (718) 641-1351, HST DS, 300->14,400 bps V.32, V.42
-- 
=====================================================================
=== Steve Steinberg   ==  ss@panix.com  == {cmcl2,apple}!panix!ss ===

              (The space below intentionally left blank)
From: hall@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Hal Lillywhite)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: If You get Lost
Date: 16 Apr 92 14:37:39 GMT
Organization: Tektronix Inc., Beaverton, Or.

In article <92107.100654ACROWSON@ESOC.BITNET> ACROWSON@ESOC.BITNET writes:

>One brief comment from the European perspective: in Britain and the alpine
>countries, I have always learnt that the "universal" distress signal is SIX
>whistle blasts, flashes etc. (this should be repeated at one-minute
>intervals). The _rescuers_ should answer this with three whatevers.

Interesting.  It ain't what you know that gets you into trouble,
it's what you know than ain't so.  I've always been told that three
of anything is a universal distress symbol.  Can it be that this
"universe" is confined to North America?  I may have to re-evaluate
what I thought I knew.

What about people in other parts of the world (eg. down under)?
What do you folks use as a distress symbol?
From: jones@pyrite.cs.uiowa.edu (Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Rules for Rails to Trails
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:35:21 GMT

I've been asked to post this (I sent it by E-mail in response to an
earlier posting).

I wrote the Hoover Nature Trail's Trail Guide and Map booklet, and
in it, I included the following rules for trail users:


1) Leave the trail at least as clean as it was before you came.
    Do not litter.

2) This is a trail, not a road.  No motor vehicles are allowed.

3) Respect the rights of property owners adjacent to the trail.
    In most places, the trail right-of-way is 100 feet wide;
    beyond that is private.

4) Do not disturb trailside vegetation.

5) Be careful around signals and bridges.  Climb on signals or
    under bridges at your own risk.  Be particularly careful where
    bridges have been removed.

6) Beware of poison ivy (in trailside woodlands) and wild parsnip
    (in open areas).  These can both cause painful rashes.

7) Both the railroad and other previous property owners have left
    dangerous and unsightly messes along some parts of the trail.
    It will take time to clean these up; please be careful and be
    patient.

8) Trail membership or payment of a trail use fee is required.


These rules weren't specifically approved by the HNT board; they were the
result of spur of the moment writing (the draft copy of the trail guide
needed a rules section, so I wrote down some rules that made sense and
nobody objected to them when I submitted the draft to the board and asked
if they thought such a guide would be a good idea).

					Doug Jones
					jones@cs.uiowa.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: jfjones@intvax2.cs.sandia.gov (James F. Jones)
Subject: Re: tent (?) question
Organization: Sandia National Labs, Org. 1411, Albq., NM
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 18:59:51 GMT

From article <1992Mar31.183258.1@amherst.edu>, by jkwatson@amherst.edu:
> A friend and I are planning to hike a good portion of the AT this summer.  I've
> been given a copy (1974 edition) of _The New Complete Walker_.  Fletcher
> suggests quite forcefully that if one is going to be backpacking in the summer,
> not to use a tent.  I was wondering what people thought about this suggestion,
> as I'm not the most experienced of backpackers.  He says that you'll do a lot
> better with just a rainfly over your sleeping bag, in almost all situations.
> Any comments?  A reply to my email address or posted would be appreciated.
> Thanks!

The correct answer to this question is:  There is no correct answer.  It
all boils down to personal preference.

Personally I like a tarp instead of a tent if: it is summer time, there
is no real worry about masses of flying irritating or crawling nasty
things, and I will be well below the tree line. 

I like the tarp for backpacking because it is light, gives 
adiquate shelter and it is
much more interesting to sit under the tarp and watch it rain than it is
to lay in a tent and listen to it rain.  In other words I don't feel so
closed in.

A tarp does have certain disadvantages such as offering less protection
than a good tent during wind blown turenchal downpours etc. (referance
above). 

So do what ever makes the most sense to you.

--- Red
From: oopcv@Msu.oscs.montana.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Backpacking Entertainment
Date: 17 Apr 92 22:02:19 GMT
Reply-To: oopcv@Msu.oscs.montana.edu
Organization: Montana State University

In article <1992Apr17.194942.7695@ncar.ucar.edu>, chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu (Chris Webster) writes:
>>I just remembered another game, but I forget the name. Also I was
>>wondering if anyone know about it and can provide me with more
>>"games" (I am not sure of how to word this, but more lines to
>>play with).
>>
>>Example: There is a dead person lying on the side of the road with
>>a pack on.
>
>It's called a Riddle.
>
>The ones I know are:
>
>1) There is a man lying dead in his living room with 52 bicycles scattered
>around.   What are the circumstances of his death.  A: Cheating in cards.
>
Let's see if I can phrase this correctly:

A man puts on his suit to go to work.  He steps out the door, looks down, sees
a hole in his suit, and dies.  What is his occupation?
From: geof@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (geoffrey.a.myers)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Backpacking Camara
Date: 10 Apr 92 13:24:28 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

In article <PHR.92Apr3113031@soda.berkeley.edu> phr@soda.berkeley.edu (Paul H. Rubin) writes:
>In article <1992Apr1.155657.25319@netfs.dnd.ca> mercer@ncs.dnd.ca (David Mercer) writes:
>
>   >Some of the new cameras are made of plastic and are quite light.  The
>   >Canon EOS Rebel springs to mind.  Very light but not too compact.
>   >(~$390 with 35-70 zoom)
>
>   After trashing a Minolta 5000i with lenses (I took a spill in the
>   Elbow River) I dont think I would ever take an electronic camera
>   backpacking again.
>
>   Had I been carrying a mechanical camera, I would have been a simple matter
>   of desicating and cleaning, but instead all the electronics were toasted
>   and the unit was beyond economical repair.
>
>I'm not sure I agree with this wisdom, but if a lightweight mechanical
>SLR is what you want, consider the Konica TC-X.  It has
>shutter-priority autoexposure with trap needle metering and a
>mechanical shutter.  It is all plastic and has the mechanical finesse
>of a Victor mouse trap.  It is VERY light, maybe half the weight of my
>Nikon FM.  The optics are not bad.  You can get them cheap.  It
>doesn't seem very rugged, but light and rugged generally don't mix.
>
>I had one of these for a while several years ago and while I wouldn't
>recommend it as the basis of an SLR system, I felt it did well as a
>high quality manual-focus point-and-shoot.  I've never seen an
>electronic AF point-and-shoot that made pictures of the quality of an
>SLR.  (I'm not counting fancy "bridge" cameras).  I don't know if the
>problem is worse optics, imprecise focusing, or what.

Just a note.  I once took a tumble from my canoe into the Buffalo River (Ark.)
with my Minolta SLR.  Once I got back from my trip I was talking about the
loss of a good camera.  A women I worked with told me to take it to this
particular shop and this 'miracle worker' could possibly save my camera.  I
took the camera by that day.  This guy told me for $80 he could clean it up
and it would work, but no guarantee on how long.  I took the gamble.  This was
at least 8 years ago and this camera is still working.  This guy told me that
the best thing to do with a camera that has been dropped in water is to take
the batteries out and keep the camera emersed in water until you get it to
a shop to get it fixed.  He said that this would stop it from rusting up.
Now this is heresay, but the guy did fix my camera.  I don't remember the
guy's name but I would think that any good camera shop could do the same.
Again this was 8 years ago and I know that cameras have advanced quite a bit
since then, but my Minolta was electronic so I suspect this suggestion may
still work.

-- 
Until later, Geoffrey Myers	404.750.5247	cbnewsm!geof

gamyers@attmail.att.com	...!att!attmail!gamyers
geof@green.att.com	...!att!green!geof
From: brit@wagner.Physics.McGill.CA (Dave Britton)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: If You get Lost
Date: 16 Apr 92 22:40:33 GMT
Organization: McGill University Computing Centre

In article <9423@vice.ICO.TEK.COM> hall@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Hal Lillywhite)  
writes:
> In article <92107.100654ACROWSON@ESOC.BITNET> ACROWSON@ESOC.BITNET writes:
> 
> >One brief comment from the European perspective: in Britain and the alpine
> >countries, I have always learnt that the "universal" distress signal is SIX
> >whistle blasts, flashes etc. (this should be repeated at one-minute
> >intervals). The _rescuers_ should answer this with three whatevers.
> 
Well two points: In UK I was taught not 3 not 6 but 10 blasts once a
minuite. Part of the rational is to give the searchers time to stop
and get quiet in order to locate the source of the signal. Three blasts
or flashes hardly gives much time.

The second point is that is doesn't really matter whether there is
an "internationally accepted signal" becasue  most people would
investigate ANY repeated signal to see if it was a distress call 
and this is doubly true for searchers.  

Dave.
From: mpb@troy.uucp (27331-bunz)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: If You get Lost
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:00:38 GMT
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ

In article <9423@vice.ICO.TEK.COM>, hall@vice.ICO.TEK.COM (Hal Lillywhite) writes:
> In article <92107.100654ACROWSON@ESOC.BITNET> ACROWSON@ESOC.BITNET writes:
> 
> >One brief comment from the European perspective: in Britain and the alpine
> >countries, I have always learnt that the "universal" distress signal is SIX
> >whistle blasts, flashes etc. (this should be repeated at one-minute
> >intervals). The _rescuers_ should answer this with three whatevers.
> 
> Interesting.  It ain't what you know that gets you into trouble,
> it's what you know than ain't so.  I've always been told that three
> of anything is a universal distress symbol.  Can it be that this
> "universe" is confined to North America?  I may have to re-evaluate
> what I thought I knew.
> 
> What about people in other parts of the world (eg. down under)?
> What do you folks use as a distress symbol?

Good question.  From a practical stand point, I'd hope that we could
get a universal agreement to THREE.  While blowing a whistle isn't
that taxing, if you want to really give it your all, I'd think you
might start to hyperventilate going for six blows in fast succession.
Even more importantly, trying to keep 6 fires burning would keep you
busy.

What rational is there of choosing 6?

Marc