From: ahmed@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
Subject: Re: RE: MEN OF EASTERN ORIGIN
Date: 30 Jul 92 00:58:22 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.132955@daffy.mc.ti.com>, a726226@daffy.mc.ti.com
(savithri) writes:

> I have recieved several E mails from people who want
> to know the reason for my outburst and bitterness. Since
> I do not have the time to respond to each one, I decided
> to reply to them in SCI.  
> 
	I usually avoid sci for the insane and ridiculous discussions.
This post by Savithri is indeed ridiculous, but does seem to have
some valid points.
> First of all not ONE reader read my posting without jumping
> ahead. In my sweeping generalization, I had quoted 98% of the
> men are SCUMS (I would say I am being optimistic, considering
> the staggering population in those areas!).  As for giving reasons
> I am at a loss as to where to start.  The first incident occured when
> I was in the fifth grade and a father (in a convent) grabbed me and
> tried to kiss me!(Please don't sart religious wars here!).  I was afraid
> of relating this to my folks for fear of punishment. 
> 
	I will leave this alone. it only suffices to say that more
than 90% of the Indian girls are immune to this.

> Several of my girl friends, my sisters and I (in college days) used to 
> exchange our horrible experiences on the roads and buses.  The
> humiliating things that we were subjected to in terms of being 
> made passes at etc.  I used to enjoy the circus as most kids do. 
> However, after the one I went to in my seventh grade, I decided that I
> would never go to any area where there were such a multitude of human
> animals on the loose.  I still bitterly recall the several brushings and
> fingerings from the sleezy characters who are in complete charge
> because of their sheer number.  
> 
	I agree that this does happen and I know people (who `seem'
to be okay otherwise) who used to brag about it. But, this is only a
small %. However, they appear everywhere. I am sure it is not 98%.
If your criteria is an interest in girls, 98% makes sense.

> I have travelled alone here and in europe alone on several ocassions and
> I have never been humiliated even once.  However, even in my last visit
> (1990) to India, I was not spared (next time I will have a stun gun).
> If one wants to put down such behaviour
> as being the result of illeteracy, then I have news for you.  Recently there
> was a posting by a Mr. Natrajan from AT&T who proudly (in all his male
> arrogance) claims that they used to taunt girls as a passtime.  Perhaps it
> hasn't gotten into their thick-heads that just PERHAPS girls don't care
> to be taunted.  It is just like stating that women loved to be raped and
> if they don't, too bad they have no choice.  Perhaps if something happened
> to their near and dear ones it may sink in ( which I hope does not for the
> women's sake).  Some people have said that time will bring about changes.
> I must disagree, TIME never solved anything.  Humans create the problem and
> only humans can solve the problem.  The first step in solving is in recognizing
> that it exists, no matter how painful it may be.
> 
	I am not saying there isn't a problem, there definitely is but
98% .. gimme a break!!

> Just as the scums on the road get their cheap thrills (from brushings etc!)
> the more learned (?) get it from harassing or subjugating their wives to their
> will.  I have spent a considerable portion of my time as a student trying to 
> understand why women tolerate such atrocities.  All too often it is purely 
> for economic reasons.  As it is the unemployment rate among the educated is
> fairly high.  On top of that think about the millions of women who were not
> fortunate to recieve any (especially in poorer sections where the parents
> do everything in their means to give the best for their male children).  These
> women have no hopes for anything other than spending their life on this earth
> under the tyranny of their husband and produce off-springs.  It is imbibed
> in their blood that the male species is the superior one (having seen it
> in their household from day one) and hence they go ahead and perpetrate the same
> evil in the society.  Men have no intention or desire to change anything
> since the society works to their advantage. 
> 
> Coming to the middle and upper classes, if one sees a happy couple who have
> respect for each other, then the unhappy ones quip, " oh! he is a jorooh-ka-
> gulam" (for those who do not understand the term, it means a hen-pecked
> husband).  Just as a side note: for all you people who concluded that I am
> a frustrated female who has been dumped or cannot find a good guy, I am sorry
> to burst your bubble.  I have been happily (if that is  possible when one sees
> the silent and hopeless sufferings of women) for more than 12 years and guess
> what, that too to an INDIAN guy.  It pains me to see that men and worse still
> the women who are blind to all this evil in those socities.  I am fully aware
> that there are numerous problems in this country, but having been a volunteer
> for several years in a battered women's program, I know that there is always
> help available here for women who want to break away from the abuser and
> start a new life.  The welfare system together with counseling and jobs outside
> have helped innumerable women. 
> 
	Glad to hear about your happy life. Actually, how many people
would say their life sucks? :-)

> If even the less than 1% of the Indians guys and girls (out of the total Indian
> population) cannot recognize or are unwilling to open their eyes to the prevailing problems in those socities, then there is NO HOPE! 
> (The main problem I see here is that they have not looked beyond their noses to see the true situation.  The less than 10% of women in professional fields cannot represent the true status and then even among those the problems at home are little known t

> 
> I will not go into the horror tales from the women of other middle eastern 
> countries or into bride-burning and dowry deaths in our backyards.
> Suffice to say that I maintain my original position
> that more than 98% of the MEN of EASTERN origin are SCUMS.
> 
	Where, in heavens name, did you get this 98%?

> p.s.  Recently the postings on Are we that intolerant, Have you noticed that
> in all the  cases mentioned, it was the MEN who were acting insufferable?
> It is some chemical imbalance on that side of the hemisphere that seems to target the male species.
> 
> savithri

take care ... khaleel