HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pauls@icecreambar.css.itd.umich.edu (Paul Southworth)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Do frames wear out?
Date: 8 Sep 92 17:44:11 GMT
Reply-To: pauls@umich.edu
Organization: University of Michigan

| In article <1992Sep8.150512.18492@daimi.aau.dk> legolas@daimi.aau.dk  
(Anders Jacob Truelsen) writes:

..

| >CrMo (and Hi-Ten) _do_ change stiffness through use. The fatigue will  
make the frame more flexible. You can test the 'softness' of your frame by  
placing your foot on the pedal and press it inwards (sidewards). 

That's a great way to totally screw the alignment of the bottom bracket
shell on a quality bike.  In practice of riding, NEVER is such force  
applied to the bottom bracket shell--you're putting maybe 100lbs of  
pressure laterally twisting the shell.  Bikes with thin-walled tubing can
be easily bent by such practice.  I've seen it on the alignment table, and  
I cringe every time someone does that to a decent bike.

Eric Praetzel writes:
| It is highly doubtfull that you will even be able to tell if a weld has
| partially broken.  I have come back from rides and afterwards my friends  
have
| noticed a broken frame but it was not something that they noticed on the  
ride

I've seen that happen too.  Many times people don't notice severely broken  
frames until you point it out to them.

Them:  "why does my front derailleur rub so much now?  I just had it tuned  
up."

Me: "Hmm, could be because the seat tube has separated from the BB shell."

or else...

Them: "My front wheel is loose.  What's the problem?"

I open QR and see dropouts fall on the floor <tink tank>

Me: "Ah so... perhaps it is not your hub after all..."
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: praetzel@marconi.uwaterloo.ca (Eric Praetzel)
Subject: Re: Do frames wear out?
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 16:42:35 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.150512.18492@daimi.aau.dk> legolas@daimi.aau.dk (Anders Jacob Truelsen) writes:
>harry@cv.hp.com (Harry Phinney) writes:
>>jeff@is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Jeff McAffer) writes:
>>: Do frames wear out?  
>>In general, yes.
>>When it breaks.  There is no other definition of "wearing out", at least
>>for frames constructed of metals.  The metals will not change stiffness
>                                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>through use, but can eventually suffer fatigue failure (i.e. it breaks).
>^^^^^^^^^^^^
>CrMo (and Hi-Ten) _do_ change stiffness through use. The fatigue will make the frame more flexible. You can test the 'softness' of your frame by placing your foot on the pedal and press it inwards (sidewards). 

Hey neat.  One line.  Anyway.
Nobody has been able to measure any change in the modulus of elastiscity of
steel upto failure.  This was rehashed last week and every odd week before that
for the past umpteen years.  A steel frame changes "stiffness" when it breakes.
It is highly doubtfull that you will even be able to tell if a weld has
partially broken.  I have come back from rides and afterwards my friends have
noticed a broken frame but it was not something that they noticed on the ride
(broken seatstay at the seattube).
  "A worn out frame can often be fixed with a new coat of paint."
  - Eric 
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: josh@Happy-Man.com (Joshua_Putnam)
Subject: Re: mtb: suntour microdrive cassette compatibility
Reply-To: Joshua_Putnam@happy-man.com
Organization: Happy Man Corp., Vashon Island, WA 98070-7399
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 20:23:49 GMT

In <Bu7uAC.7yo@acsu.buffalo.edu> camlau@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (**bj**) writes:

>Is anyone out there knowledgable about suntour cassettes?  Specifically
>does anyone know if the microdrive freehub can accept a standard
>suntour cassette? What about the other way around? Can a standard 
>suntour freehub accept microdrive cassette?

Sorry, don't remember this, but:

>Can you imagine:  a 20 tooth microdrive granny chainring coupled to
>a 28 tooth standard cog to give a 18.5" gear!  Talk about climbing
>ability!

You could just use a microdrive crank for the tiny rings,
and use a standard hub for the standard cog ranges.  This
would be less expensive, since you won't be paying the
newness premium on microdrive equipment.  You also would
not need to use a Suntour freehub/cassette setup if you
prefer freewheels or other brands of hubs.
-- 
 Joshua_Putnam@happy-man.com    Happy Man Corp.  206/463-9399 x102
 4410 SW Pt. Robinson Rd., Vashon Island, WA  98070-7399  fax x108
 We publish SOLID VALUE for the intelligent investor.  NextMail OK
Info free; sample $20: Send POSTAL addr: Solid-Value@happy-man.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: bschwart@gath.cray.com (Robert J. Schwartz)
Subject: Re: Removing frozen freewheel
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 10 Sep 92 17:23:37 CDT

If you can't exert a lot of force on the remover, you've got to find a
surface you CAN exert a lot of force on.

 1. Open the freewheel up as if you were going to clean it. If it's an older
    wheel then there are probably two holes on a plate on the face, like the
    holes on the face of the BB adjustable cup. Park makes a remover for this
    plate. It's been a while but I believe you turn clockwise.

 2. Pull the outer of the two rotating cylinders that makes up the freewheel.
    This should leave the inner cyclinder that screws onto the hub.

 3. Remove this with a pipe wrench.

 4. Pitch the entire mess. You may someday break another spoke.

Bob Schwartz
bschwart@cray.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: detlef@iw.uni-hannover.de (Detlef Adolph)
Subject: drum brakes
Reply-To: detlef@iw.uni-hannover.de
Organization: Institut fuer Werkstoffkunde, Uni Hannover
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 13:47:13 GMT

Keywords: 

At the University of Hannover we want to construct a new hydraulik drum brake, eventually with "integral function" of front and back wheel.
Therefore we would like to get some answers to the following points: 

1) We need drawings and material information of good drum brakes
2) Who has experiences with the use of drum brakes
3) What do you think about hydraulic in connection with drum brakes?

Thank you bicycle fans, we will summarize.

Bye, Detlef!
From: maarrrk@seidel.ucsb.edu (Mark Erickson)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: MTB Bar Ends vs Scott Bars
Date: 12 Sep 92 22:26:09 GMT

Scott MTB handlebars (the ones with the integral bar ends, like
the AT-3) appear to be much lighter than the combined weight
of regular bars and bar ends.  

Anybody have a good reason to go with regular bars/ends rather than
the Scotts?

--maarrrk
From: pauls@icecreambar.css.itd.umich.edu (Paul Southworth)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: drum brakes
Date: 10 Sep 92 21:30:45 GMT
Reply-To: pauls@umich.edu
Organization: University of Michigan

Detlef Adolph writes
| Keywords: 
| 
| At the University of Hannover we want to construct a new hydraulik drum  
brake, eventually with "integral function" of front and back wheel.
| Therefore we would like to get some answers to the following points: 
| 
| 1) We need drawings and material information of good drum brakes
| 2) Who has experiences with the use of drum brakes
| 3) What do you think about hydraulic in connection with drum brakes?

Drum brakes are very much out of fashion, since just about all of them  
tend to overheat too much.  With the development of mountain bikes,  
cantilevers suddenly got all sorts of attention from designers, and  
quality of cantilevers rose dramatically.

The highest quality rear hub brake that I know of is not a drum but a disk  
-- the Phil Wood Disk Brake.

As far as coordinating front and rear brakes together, this is generally a  
mistake, since the brakes for front and rear wheels need to be applied at  
different times.

I have no idea what a hydraulic drum brake would work like.  Sounds  
interesting.  Currently the only hydraulic brakes I know of are the Magura  
hydraulics, but they act on the rim, not the hub.  They work pretty well,  
but most people agree that they are (1) overkill, and (2) a pain to work  
on.
From: jaw38638@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jason Andrew Weber)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Loose Headset?
Date: 15 Sep 92 19:43:25 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

naru@eng.umd.edu (Naruhisa Takashima) writes:


>Riding this morning I noticed that when I apply light steady brake in front,
> the fork snaps back and forth slightly and makes a klunk klunk sound.
>Does this mean my headset is loose, or is this a natural thing? 
>The bike is Cannondale R400.

>I've tried the two methods for finding loose headset ( applying the front
>brake and moving the bike back and forth, and raising the front wheel and
>dropping it listening for loose sounds.) and it seems to be OK
>; although, when I rock it back and 
>forth the fork seems to flex a little.

>Thanks in advance,
>Naru Takashima

I have had a loose headset ever since I destroyed a front fork about
three months ago.  The guys at the bike shop don't know what to do, and
neither do I.  It just seems to loosen up very quickly as compared to
my original headset.  I check for this by grabbing the top tube in one
hand and the stem in the other.  Then I wiggle it forward and backward 
If it feels loose, I tighten it.  During races if I have to tighten it,
I just wait until I get to an unridable part, and tighten it by hand 
while climbing up cliffs etc.

I'm going to try the guerilla headlock probably as soon as I get the money.
I'll keep ya posted, or if anyone has any comments on the guerilla, I'd
like to hear em.

Jason
weber@eac1.cecer.army.mil
jaw38638@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: pauls@icecreambar.css.itd.umich.edu (Paul Southworth)
Subject: Re: Removing a frozen stem
Reply-To: pauls@umich.edu
Organization: University of Michigan
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 14:43:28 GMT

Adrian Cox writes
| I can't afford a new commuting bike, so I'm resurrecting a bike that's
| been left standing in a shed for three years.  Everything is going
| smoothly, except that I can't get the stem out.  The expander bolt is
| missing and I can see the wedge nut rattling around loose inside.  I'm
| pretty certain that the stem and forks are rusted together, and the
| penetrating oil I've put inside has had no effect.  So far I've
| thought of two possible approaches, and I'd like some comments or new
| ideas for freeing it.  It's a fairly basic steel frame, but I'm still
| nervous about both of these options.
| 
| 1> Use a blowtorch to heat up and expand the tubes, freeing the rust.

Will have relatively little effect since there are two tubes and a gap of  
air separating you from the quill of the stem.

| 2> Hit it harder with a larger hammer.

Yes, but first:

a. flip the bike over, remove front wheel
b. pull out the stem bolt, and plug the hole in the end of the stem
   (cover with tape or whatever to prevent undue mess)
c. get a can of liquid wrench or other penetrating solvent
d. soak the stem by pouring the solvent in through the hole in
   the fork crown.
e. repeat soaking three or four times over 24 hours.
f. clamp the fork crown in a vise -- NOT the blades -- between two
   blocks of wood.
g. take your steroids, go watch "Pumping Iron" I and II while you
   wait, and then wrestle that thing outta there.
From: cwright@mickey.WPI.EDU (Charles R. Wright)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: "Clunk" from bottom bracket - thanks
Date: 12 Sep 1992 18:30:58 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: mickey.wpi.edu


Thanks to all who responded to my query about that "clunk" noise I got
while pedaling hard.  One person convinced me that this was not
something to let go, so I immediately took the bike to my favorite
bike shop where a loose bearing cup was confirmed and the BB is now
being overhauled.

Too bad, too, 'cause it's a beautiful weekend for riding here - hate
to see it go to waste.  I guess I'll have to take up running for
exercise - UGH!

Thanks again,

Charles Wright
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: brian@wucs1.wustl.edu (Brian)
Subject: Re: Difference between Shimano RX100 and 105 components
Organization: Washington University, School of Engineering, St. Louis MO
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 15:30:26 GMT

Reply-To: brian@wucs1.wustl.edu (Brian)

In rec.bicycles.tech article <1992Sep2.135614.14176@cci632.cci.com> you  
wrote:
> 
> When I was recently shopping around for components to build a new set of  
wheels,
> I had several discussions with the owner of a local bike shop.  I was
> considering 105 components (hubset, specifically) and he recomended  
RX100 as
> he felt they were basically the same quality, without the fancy finish  
of the
> 105 stuff.  The problem was that for individual components, RX100  
components

I have 105 on my bike, and I actually think it has one of the ugliest  
finishes around.  It may have changed, but last summer when I got it, it  
was a kinda almost-light greenish grey metallic ugly color.  On the small  
parts (deraillers, brakes) it doesn't look that bad, but the cranks are  
butt-ugly.  I was gonna put a 105 rear derailler on my rockhopper, butthe  
color is so gairsh that I will probably go with a rx100 derailler.

brianosaurus


Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: CMSC28@maccvm.corp.mot.com (Mark Hickey)
Subject: Re: Helmets?
Organization: Motorola
Date: 14 Sep 1992 13:13:44 CDT

------------------------- Original Article -------------------------
>Had my first head crunching accident this week.
>Had a minor concussion.
>I got a spare $50, but lack serious motivation to buy and wear one.
>
>Anyone out there have a few horror stories?  Maybe I got lucky
>or maybe these things are just not possible to protect one's self againt..
>(the accidents).
>
>All types of stories would be appreciated.  Hearsay, etc... welcome.
>Thanks.
>
>Still struggling with the "survival thing" in indiana.

How about .... My fiancee (just back from a 800+ mile trip across
Montana and Canada) and a good friend of ours (just back from a
West to East crossing of the U.S.) and myself (not having gone
anywhere) had just gotten done with a bone-crushing workout, and
were cooling down on a bicycle path (20 ft. wide and billiard-
table smooth) at about 15 MPH when a squirrel darted in front
of our friend who swerved just enough to put his left pedal in
my fiancee's front tire.  Needless to say, they pretzelled, and
I got to watch him spin off his bike. and "whip" the back of his
head into the asphalt.  "Luckily" all he got out of it was a
concussion, but it just goes to show you.... it's when you least
expect trouble that you need a helmet the most.  (The same guy
went over his handlebars at 30+ MPH during a sprint and landed on
the helmet he wouln't have been wearing except for the aforementioned
crash.) Nuff sed?

Mark (Safe if not sightly) Hickey
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: skon@gecko.cis.ohio-state.edu (james paul skon)
Subject: Re: Cateye mount repairs
Keywords: Cateye Vectra, repair
Organization: The Ohio State University Dept. of Computer and Info. Science
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 16:59:16 GMT

>Due to a recent mishap, I need to repair the pickup wire on my
>Cateye Vectra computer.  The wire was cut about 2 inches from the
> 
>Would it be best to try to splice the wire or should I try to 
>reconnect the free end inside the mounting unit?

I broke the wire on my Cateye Mirco.  When I tried to splice them
I could not get the computer to work.  I found that the metal wires,
although copper, are covered with some insolating paint of some sort.
I had to "clean" the wire off with a fine file before soldering to
get a connection.  Also, after erratic performace due to water, I removed
the unsightly black tape, and used heat shrinkable tubing purchased
at Radio Shack.  Works good so far!
From: hallstro@solan.unit.no (Lars Hallstr|m Eriksen)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Spoke breakage
Date: 7 Sep 92 14:18:20 GMT
Organization: Norwegian Institue of Technology

In article <1992Sep4.121450.1@utxvms.cc.utexas.edu>, ccfa001@utxvms.cc.utexas.edu writes:
 > Over the last two months, I've had two spokes break at the angled area where
 > the spoke connects to the hub flange.  The bike is about 1.5 years old and
 > has been used primarily for commuting (a DB Apex).  Could this be a problem
 > with the DX hub, or is it typical for gobs of spokes to wear out at the 
 > same time?  The rim seems to be in good shape (rear wheel).  If the spokes
 > are indeed on their last legs, would it be worth it to replace all of them,
 > or should I also replace hub and/or rim?  I don't expect everyone to agree
 > as to solutions, but perhaps others have had experience with a sudden
 > plethora of spoke breakage.  Oddly enough, though I've had occasional spoke
 > failure on my 700c road bikes in the past, I've never experienced chain
 > reactions of this nature.
 > 
 > Curt
 > 
 > BTW, the two spokes which have failed (so far?) did so during normal city
 > street riding ... nothing a decent mtb shouldn't be able to handle.

My experience is that spokes do NOT tend to break all about the same time. 
Despite one or two spokes breaking, the rest are likely to last much longer.  Two
breakages within a short period of time can easily be a coincidence.

I can't imagine the hub being a problem, and not likely the rim either.  But if
you find it hard to true the wheel (i.e. some spokes have to be very tight while
others must be slack for the wheel to be true), the rim has probably been bent. 
Changing it can be a good idea, because the tightest spokes won't last very long. 
I once had this develop with no known major impact to the wheel; I suspect metal
fatigue in the rim itself (aluminium).
--
Lars Hallstroem Eriksen                    | E-mail:     hallstro@solan.unit.no
Student of Mechanical Engineering          | Paper mail: Stud.post 44
Norwegian Institute of Technology (NTH),   |             N-7034 Trondheim-NTH
University of Trondheim (UNIT)             |             NORWAY
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: sjlt@leland.Stanford.EDU (Sean Lev-Tov)
Subject: hubs
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 92 22:09:39 GMT

>>   I have a Specialized Sirrus with RX100 stuff.  About a month ago I
>>   was hit broadside by a mountain biker and both wheels were trashed.
>>   When I cut the hubs out of the wheels (for rebuilding), I was
>>   surprised that the holes in the flanges were egg-shaped.  The
>>   spokes were actually pulling through (about 3500 miles were on the
>>   wheels).  Since this is my first pair of wheels that has been
>>   destroyed, I don't know if this is normal or not.  If it's not
>>   normal then I'd stay away from RX100 and 105 hubs.

>Perhaps it would be a good idea to not give advise when you "don't
>know" what you are talking about.  I'm not trying to abuse you or
>anything, but am just pointing out that opinions with no basis in
>experience and knowledge are often worse than useless.
>
>I do admire you for stating your actual -experience- and background,
>quite unlike so many usenet flamers who present nothing but their
>uninformed opinions which they expect to be taken as gospel.
>
>If you had much experience with wheels, you'd know that deformation of
>the softer aluminium alloy or hub flanges by stainless steel spokes is
>not only normal but actually a feature.
>
>Please resist the opportunity to post messages at the slightest
>provocation.

Well, after my original post about my RX100 hub experience, I got the above
friendly email.  Now I'm curious.  Is it really a feature that the hub deform?
If it is, I'm surprised.  If it is desireable, then why?  I'd really like to
hear an explanation.  Thanks.

Sean

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: etxorst@eos.ericsson.se (Torsten Lif)
Subject: Hydraulic "cable" flexibility
Reply-To: etxorst@eos.ericsson.se
Organization: Ericsson Telecom AB
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 11:14:42 GMT

I have been considering putting Magura hydraulic brakes on the rear
wheel of my bike (a Linear LWB recumbent) but I'm worried about the
flexibility of the brake lines. Since the Linear is folding, the brake
lines would get subjected to quite a lot of movement, bending and
twisting. Does anybody have experience and/or opinions on this?

To forestall the questions of "Why?" and "Hydraulics are no good", the
weight distribution of a LWB 'bent is such that the front brake is
mostly for decoration purposes. Even the cheap sidepull brake that came
with the bike is enough to lock up the front. The rear is an entirely
different matter. In fact, so much of the braking needs to be done by
the rear wheel that I perceive the friction losses of the cable as a
significant part of the work. I currently have a cantilever brake on
the rear, but getting rid of the cable friction would be of great
benefit to me.

/Torsten

---
 Torsten Lif                          |   The only reason NOT to wear a
 Ericsson Telecom AB, EO/ETX/TX/AD    |   cycling helmet must be if you don't
 S-126 25  STOCKHOLM, SWEDEN          |   feel you have anything worth
 Tel: +46 8 719 4881                  |   protecting inside your skull.

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: piltch@ariel.lerc.nasa.gov (Nancy Piltch)
Subject: Re: Cateye mount repairs
Summary: repair of cut mount wire--possible?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords: Cateye Vectra, repair
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date:  8 Sep 1992 11:54 EST  

In article <1992Sep3.235545.6963@tamsun.tamu.edu>, glp7584@tamuts.tamu.edu (Gordon Lee Powell Jr) writes...
> 
>Due to a recent mishap, I need to repair the pickup wire on my
>Cateye Vectra computer.  The wire was cut about 2 inches from the
> 
>Would it be best to try to splice the wire or should I try to 
>reconnect the free end inside the mounting unit?

I've spliced the wires on different bike computers and had no trouble. The
others (and I'm guessing the Cateye Vectra) have 2 conductors; you'll have
to solder each one and then wrap each connection separately in electrician's
tape. The wires are quite thin and easily broken (as you've found out...)
so be gentle with the wire strippers.


Nancy Piltch            piltch@ariel.lerc.nasa.gov
NASA Lewis Research Center, Cleveland Ohio 44135
From: dahls@fhydra.dnet.unit.no (Joern Yngve Dahl-Stamnes)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Question on Headsets!!Help
Date: 8 Sep 92 13:21:50 GMT
Reply-To: dahls@fhydra.dnet.unit.no (Joern Yngve Dahl-Stamnes)
Organization: University of Trondheim, NORWAY

Thus spoke the keyboard of Allen W Kim <ak3q+@andrew.cmu.edu>:
>	I have a problem.  My headset keeps loosening up during rides and the
>threads on the fork tube is beginning to strip due to the constant
>adjustments that I'm making.  Any suggestions on how to really tighten
>down on the headset?  The threads are almost bare now.  Thanks.

Try Locktite. I got the same problem on my racing bike last year. I
disassembled and de-greased my headset with a strong solvent. Then I
regreased the headset and maked shure the grease was only on those
places that I want it to be. Assemble the headset again. Before you put
the locking ring on again, apply some Locktite on the threads and then
adjust the headset properly.

Let the bike stay for at least 24 hours before you ride it. If you ever
need to readjust the headset you have to heat up the headset a bit (use
a gas burner for 10 to 15 seconds, a hair dryer will also work) before
you try to move the locking ring and the headset.

Hope this help.

+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+-+-+-+
* I went back to my mother,           * Joern Yngve Dahl-Stamnes           *
* I said, "I'm crazy ma, help me!"    * University of Trondheim            *
* She said, "I know how it feels son, * The Norwegian Institute of Tech.   *
* 'cause it runs in the family."      * Division of Physical Electronics   *
*       - The Who, Quadrophenia       * e-mail: dahls@fhydra.dnet.unit.no  *
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Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech