HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dickwin@sequent.com (Dick Winningstad)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: kill files (again)
Date: 15 Aug 92 01:09:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Aug15.010952.21680
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.

How about settin up kill files for TRN users? or is the same as rn?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+Dick Winningstad                                                    +
+                    Italian Wines are Fine                          +
+          I'd rather be on a Moto Guzzi in eastern Oregon.          +
+          Fourth gear curves at 7000 RPM are the greatest!          +
+dickwin@sequent.com                                                 +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: brian@garfield.cs.mun.ca (Brian Paquet)
Subject: Re: Chinese Meet Romans?
Organization: CS Dept., Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 06:33:42 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.024445.16020@cactus.org> rlp@cactus.org (Robert Platt) writes:
>from the exhibit stated that had the Chinese and Roman empires met,
>the Romans would have been easily defeated.   I find this very credible,
>the Chinese were superior in weapons, tactics, logistics, and engineering.
>
Sounds to me like standerd exihibit Hype to me. They arn't gonna say
here lies some shmo who can't fight his way out of a paper bag.
The same goes for the 1 million man army you said earlier [sorry 
I went mad witht he delitions]. I don't think they could of
held a million men under arms *continuously* , I believe the ruff
rule of thumb is 7 soldiers per 1000, China around that time had 
about 50 million men.. about the same as the Roman empire..
BTW the Romans are world famous for enginer
engineering and logistics, I doubt the chinese could hold 
a candle to them in that area, of course there is a western bais
is history, so I could be wrong. Any empire can build if they enslave 
enough peasents..  Just my opinion, I ain't no PhD.. YET [hey new sig idea!]


Newsgroups: soc.history
From: cash@convex.com (Peter Cash)
Subject: Re: What is it with the Balkans?
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 23:49:31 GMT
Organization: The Instrumentality
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In article <1992Aug12.203346.4029@u.washington.edu> krzystek@milton.u.washington.edu (Jerzy Krzystek) writes:
>>In article <...>, cash@convex.com (Peter Cash) writes...
>>>In either case, it's hardly surprising. Remember, Eastern Europe and the
>>>Balkans have a long tradition of complex inter-ethnic hate and
>>>warfare--including virulent anti-semitism. Add to that the grievances
...
>Both of you, instead of writing things that ask for flame (deliberately?)
>why not go to a library and substantiate your claims? This would
>be a true contribution to this group.

>Some hints: could Mr. Cash list the mass expulsions of Jews from Western
>Europe which led to their settlement in Eastern Europe? 

I guess I've stepped on your toes. Let me assure you, it was not
deliberate. You seem to think that I've charged the Balkans with some kind
of monopoly on evil, though nothing in my post makes this claim. Certainly,
I did not make the dunderheaded assertion that anti-semitism during WWII
was found _only_ in the Balkans, or that it originated there. I was just
trying to find an explanation for something that we all know happened:
certain groups in Eastern Europe cooperated with the Nazis; certain groups
staged massacres of their own. If you deny this, I have no interest in
arguing about it with you. On the other hand, if you have interesting
information to add to our discussion of this subject, I'm always ready to
learn.

For what it's worth, if the subject under discussion had been genocidal
behavior in _Western_ Europe during World War II, then I might have
mentioned how the French collaborated with the Germans. But that would have
gotten yet another set of mutlus (note the new generic term) upset with me.

I'm beginning to think that nobody in this newsgroup can discuss anything
without getting hot under the collar about it.


-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
             |      Die Welt ist alles, was Zerfall ist.     |
Peter Cash   |       (apologies to Ludwig Wittgenstein)      |cash@convex.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
Subject: Re: Chinese Meet Romans?
Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
	<1992Aug20.024445.16020@cactus.org>
	<1992Aug21.092320.89839@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au>
Date: 20 Aug 92 20:33:39

Ah, if only we had a time machine so we could provoke a war between
the Romans and the Han dynasty Chinese.  With the Romans, we could
probably gimmick the auguries.  With the Chinese we might gimmick
the I Ching.  Then we would find out.  As it is we'll just have to
simulate them.
--
John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
*
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
From: fsars@acad3.alaska.edu (Allen R Sparks)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: It's useless!
Date: 19 Aug 92 19:04:46 GMT
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks

In article <86527@netnews.upenn.edu>, kkniaz@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Krzysztof W. Kniaz) writes:
> Few days, ago I sent a letter of complaint to postmaster of Mutlu's
> server. I have not received any response until today, thus I guess my
> (and others) action was futile. However, what if readers of soc.history
> (and other groups, where his venomous texts can be found) start flooding
> Multu's address with huge (written in binary cod, at best) messages?
> 
> It is relatively easy to write a shell program in UNIX , sending mail
> to Mutlu, say every 10 minutes. 
> 
> What do you think?

Bad idea.  Two wrongs don't make a right.  Also, Mutlu could very well
be on a server that charges Mutlu money for which he has the right to
post just about whatever he wants to post, where he wants to post.  I
checked all the addresses he's posted (the file I checked could be
slightly out of date) and it shows mostly *.com addresses.  He might
be forging those addresses, who knows?  

Your address shows you to be on a public institution's machine.  You
pay money, through your tuition, to use that machine for academic
purposes.  Since mailbombing Mutlu does not constitute an academic
function, your sysadmin would be well within his/her perogatives to
suspend your email/usenet priv's. Using a shell program in UNIX would
get you caught pretty fast, even if you were forging your addresses,
especially if you sent it every 10 minutes.  Once caught, the fact you
were using a shell script to harass Mutlu, might cause your sysadmin
to treat you as a sophisticated user who doesn't have a sense of
responsibility, thus making it harder to get your account back should
it be taken away.   ==== Al Sparks
********************************************************************************
MUTLU@Zeus.unomaha.edu (Ozcan Mutlu)    (May 11 92)
nucsrl!ddsw1.MCS.COM!hbm@uunet.UU.NET (Hasan B. Mutlu)  (May 21 92)
hbm@ddsw1.dell.com (Hasan B. Mutlu)     (May 1 92)
hbm@ddsw1.UUCP (hasan.b.mutlu)  (Apr 12 92)
<hbm@ddsw1.mcs.com (Hasan B. Mutlu)>    (Jun 1 92)
han@sarp.aic.com (hasan.b.mutlu)        (Oct 30 91)
han@sarp.utaaic.com (hasan.b.mutlu)     (Apr 12 92)
han@dho.nesve.org (hasan.b.mutlu)       (Oct 30 91)
han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu)        (May 11 92)
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: aa727@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Johnny Wu)
Subject: Histyory questions:
Reply-To: aa727@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Johnny Wu)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 22:11:48 GMT


I hope there's someone who can help me with these questions:

1. Were they any trading or travelling from China to the West in
   the year 200 A.D. to 250 A.D.?

2. Does anyone know the origin of the last names: Wu, Chan, Cheng, Chen,
   Rajic?

3. If there were trading or travelling during the year 200AD, how far
   did the Chinese travelled? 

Thanks in advance for any information.

-- 
No one is a failure... Keep up your dream and you will find it!
Ask always WISDOM from God!

Newsgroups: soc.history
From: military@att.att.com (Bill Thacker)
Subject: 50 Years Ago: Thursday, 13 August, 1942
Followup-To: soc.history
Organization: NCR Corporation - Law Department
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:17:29 GMT


From military@att.att.com (Bill Thacker)

Thursday, 13 August, 1942

The Pedestal convoy loses another cruiser and seven freighters to Axis
attacks.  An attack by Italian cruisers and destroyers is aborted when
their air support fails to arrive, and the British submarine Unbroken
torpedoes the cruisers Bolzano and Muzio Attendolo.

In India, riots continue.  Several war production factories are closed by
strikes.

German troops enter Elista, south of Stalingrad.

Three thousand Japanese engineers land at Gona, New Guinea.  Other Japanese
troops continue attacking toward Port Moresby.  

General Montgomery takes command of the Eighth Army and begins preparations
against a German attack.

--	--	--	--	--	--	--	--	--
Bill Thacker   Moderator, sci.military  military-request@att.att.com
(614) 860-5294      Send submissions to military@att.att.com

"There are, it might be noted, approximately 50,000 parts to a big bomber;
as many as 22,500 parts go into a smaller plane." - US Representative 
Dow W. Harter
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: diarmuid@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Diarmuid Pigott)
Subject: Re: England since 1688
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 07:51:52 GMT

jwp@panix.com (JongWoo Park) writes:
: PPS: What's the significance of year 1688 in England?

The Glorious Revolution - the overthrow of James II by the Parliament by
peaceful means (as opposed to what happened to Charles I (execution),
and the invitation of the Elector of Hanover to the throne (because of
his wife Mary), and hence the establishment of a truly parliamentaary system of
govt. in England.
From: frankt@cwi.nl (Frank Teusink)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: What happened in 1419?
Date: 21 Aug 92 15:47:06 GMT
Distribution: soc.history

jessica@pres.jsc.nasa.gov (Jessica Dickerson) writes:

>What happened in 1419?

- As somebody already mentioned, Vaclav IV (or Wenzel or some other
  interpretation), a german king, died on 16/8/1419.

- Vincentius Ferrerius died on 5/4/1419. Was a munk and is declared
  holy. Seems to have converted 8.000 Saracens, 35.000 Muslims, and
  100.000 heretics (I'm not sure of the word, but I mean the people
  they used to burn, if they couldn't be converted). Also seemed
  quite fond of self punishment.

- John the Bold of Burgundie died on 10/9/1419. He was killed on
  a bridge over the river Yonne, at Montereau, during a talk
  with his enemies, the Orleans (he had one of them killed a few
  years before). As a result, his son Phillips the Good turned
  over to the English.

- Sir Richard Whittigton (1358-1423) became Lord Mayor of Londen for
  the fourth time.

All in all, nothing much (even 1418 seemed more promising). As 
suggested by others, I'll take a look at 1914.

>Jessica
>dickerson@medics.jsc.nasa.gov

Frank Teusink
Newsgroups: soc.history
From: creps@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Steve Creps)
Subject: Re: Civil War:  Battle Hymn of the Republic
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 01:41:18 GMT


   Sorry I can't give any names, but I heard this interesting tidbit.
It seems the Battle Hymn of the Republic was written by a Southerner,
while Dixie was written by a Northerner.

-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
Steve Creps, Indiana University
creps@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
Newsgroups: soc.history,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.jewish
From: josip@src.umd.edu (Josip Loncaric)
Subject: Re: Irony continues in our history
Followup-To: soc.history,soc.culture.yugoslavia
Organization: Systems Research Center, Maryversity of Uniland, College Park
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 02:11:05 GMT

A response followed by a quote about a difference between Serbs and Croats:

In article <1992Aug17.195119.14829@husc3.harvard.edu> stojanov@husc10.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic) writes:
> [...]
>tell anyone interested where to find your response, and quit posting
>here.  Also, any intelligent human being should be aware that giving the 
>last word to the opponent in the discussion does not mean admitting that 
>one is wrong. 
>
>Regards
>
>Milan N. Stojanovic

Mr. Stojanovic, this is precisely what I'm going to do.  Anyone who
cares ought to consider reading soc.culture.yugoslavia -- and the
many articles you post there.  I'm not sure it's worth talking to 
you (after all I've told you already) so maybe I will not respond.

Here is a quote from the U.S. Government publication 
"Yugoslavia: a country study" (call number DR1214.Y83, 1992 edition)

  The deepest and oldest national rivalry in Yugoslavia was the
  one between the Serbs and Croats, who despite their shared language
  possessed different social and value systems and political
  cultures.  Two sayings illustrated these animosities and the 
  essential difference in the inherited political styles of both
  peoples.  The first says: The very way of life of a Serb and Croat
  is a deliberate provocation to each other.  The second, a
  self-complimentary Serbian stereotype, says: In a conflict with
  authority, the Serb reaches for the sword and the Croat for his
  pen.  The Serbian stereotype refers to the tradition of the _hajduk_,
  the idealized mountain renegade who responded violently to the
  oppressive anarchy of the Ottoman Empire during its last two
  centuries; the Croatian stereotype reflects the cultural influence
  of responding through the legal system to the Hapsburgs' highly
  bureaucratized infringements on national and individual freedoms
  in Croatia.

This paragraph, in broad strokes, explains why Croats try to negotiate
and prove their rights; and why Serbs stonewall and fight for theirs.
The outcome is, unfortunately, proving that a sword is mightier than
the pen.  This lesson should not be lost on anyone: war is still the
main principle by which this world is organized.

Josip


Newsgroups: soc.history
From: brian@odie.cs.mun.ca (Brian Paquet)
Subject: Re: Chinese Meet Romans?
Organization: CS Dept., Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 04:07:42 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.231319.23131@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> aa727@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Johnny Wu) writes:
>
>After reading this sig, I got a tiny question, is it true that the
>Chinese in Han Dynasty tried to meet the Romans? What about later on
>did the chinese travel to the west in 200A.D. to 250 A.D.?
>
Stay with the program dude. The chinese got as far as Parthia.
It is said they [the Parthians] prevented them from reaching
the Roman empire. This was in the thread. As for later travel
I don't know, considering the decline in that period within the Han
Dynasty, I would think any expeditions would not be offical.
Of course the real reason the Parthians didn't let the Chinese
go the the empire was becasue they were busy killing 2.5 million
Turkish and Kurd women and children :)


Newsgroups: soc.history
From: seraphim@ais.org (Henry Hardy)
Subject: Re: Chinese Meet Romans?
Organization: none
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 23:25:22 GMT

In a previous article, aa727@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Johnny Wu) wrote:
>
>After reading this sig, I got a tiny question, is it true that the
>Chinese in Han Dynasty tried to meet the Romans? What about later on
>did the chinese travel to the west in 200A.D. to 250 A.D.?
>
The route to China from Europe was known since the neolithic. Amber
from the Baltic was being traded into China by at least 20,000 BC.
In historical times, the citystate of Athens had an ambassador to
"Seroes" (China) by 500 BCE. I believe that China is mentioned by both
Herodotus and Strabo, and it appears also in Ptolomy's maps.
Nestorian priests had formed monestaries and churches in Mongolia and
in China by the 4rth century ACE. Before this, Buddhism, Zoroastrianism,
Mazaadism, and Manichaeism had spread to both the Roman Empire and China.
In the 6th century, Justinian sent two secret agents disguised as priests
(Nestorians) to steal the secret of cultivating the silkworm. They discovered
that they eat mulberry leaves and brought back a stock of silkworms in a
hollow staff. This story is recounted by Procopius (I think in Persian Wars)
and is also recounted by Robert Graves in Count Belisarius.
 
The merchants of Axum (modern Ethiopia) traded and had diplomatic relations
with both the Romans and the Chinese for many hundreds of years.

This is from memory, so someone please correct me on any details.

regards, --HH (seraphim@ais.org, hhardy@river.test.gvsu.edu)

"These plunderers of the earth, are now invading the seas because, having
devastated everything, they now have no more land. If their enemy is
wealthy, they are greedy; if he is poor, they will be after glory --
they whom neither east nor west have satiated. Alone among peoples, they
have looked with equal greed upon rich and poor alike. Stealing, murdering
and plundering they call government; and where they create a desert they
call it peace."
			--Prince Calgacus, 83 AD
From: kkniaz@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Krzysztof W. Kniaz)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: It's not funny anymore!
Date: 12 Aug 92 19:34:26 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

Dear Mr Mutlu,
Why are you flooding THIS PARTICULAR group with your postings? I can
safely stipulate, that most of the readers of soc.history know your
point (and your style) by heart. Insulting everyone, who happens to
have a different view of turkish,armenian,greek etc.. histories does
not help any (esp. turkish) cause. Why do you keep posting your 
stories? What objective you set out to achieve? Couldn't you just
delete THIS group from your _Newsgroups_ header? 

Sincerely yours
Chris

PS You don't have to include your usual dosis of quoatations.

--

Krzysztof Kniaz, University of Pennsylvania | If you can't learn  
Lab for Research on the Structure of Matter | to do it well,
Philadelphia, PA, 19104, USA                | learn to enjoy doing it badly.
Newsgroups: soc.history,soc.culture.nordic,alt.war,alt.drugs
From: dpe@inel.gov (Don Palmrose)
Subject: Re: Vikings (Berserkers, mushrooms,missile weapons)
Organization: INEL EG&G Idaho
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 19:07:17 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.162011.21930@nntp.hut.fi>, jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala) writes:
> 
> >The "berserker phenomenon" is a documented fact: sometimes, people under
> >extreme stress will acquire super-human strength, and will focus all their
> >attention on the task at hand--be it killing, or single-handedly lifting a
> >car off a child.
> 
> Adrenaline rush?
> 
> There are claims that PCP causes this by making people immune to pain
> and thus exceed their natural "stength limits" possibly at cost of
> breaking some muscle machiner, bones etc.
> 
> Followups directed to alt.war,alt.drugs.
> 
> //Jyrki
> 
> 

One of the reasons for the developement of the 45 cal. semi-auto pistol was
to give US Marine officers greater stopping power than the old 32 cal. 
revolver.  This was because during the Phillippine Insurrection after the 
Spanish-American War, Fillipino rebels (I can't remember the name they called
themselves) armed with swords would charge and go for the officers and leading
sergents.  The 32 cal. would mortally wound them but not stop them so they
would still kill or seriously wound the officer.  It was suspected that the
Fillipino attacker was "doped up" and not feeling the shots that hit.  Of
course, with the 45 once the attacker was hit they went down, period.

Thought you might find this of interest.

Don Palmrose











========== long legal disclaimer follows, press n to skip ===========

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Laboratory or any of their employees, makes any warranty, whatsoever,
implied, or assumes any legal liability or responsibility regarding any
information, disclosed, or represents that its use would not infringe
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United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory,
and shall not be used for advertising or product endorsement purposes.
From: sachs@lhasa.berkeley.edu (Rainer Sachs)
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: What happened in 1419?
Summary: a better year
Keywords: "we shall not see them relit in our lifetime"
Date: 21 Aug 92 03:00:04 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Math. Department.
NNTP-Posting-Host: lhasa.berkeley.edu

>>In article <jessica.20@pres.jsc.nasa.gov> jessica@pres.jsc.nasa.gov (Jessica Dickerson) writes:
>>
>>>  A while ago, someone mentioned that he/she remembered numbers by 
>>>interpretting them as dates.  Well, I friend of mine has just received
>>>a phone number which can be used as a (past) date. So...
>> 
>>>What happened in 1419?

>>  Good King Wenceslas died.


No.  This is a bad idea for three reasons.

1. Absolutely nothing happened in 1419, despite desperate
attempts by Cheng Ho to export some Chinese history
to Europe.  In September the whole year was cancelled.
Wenceslas is a red herring. 

2. Even if something had happened, how would that help
your friend, who presumably knows nothing
about the something, nothing about
1419, and nothing about the connection, remember?

3. By just reversing pairs you get 1914.  I assume
your friend knows 1914 as the famous year in
which England for once had truly superb summer weather
(well at least during May, June and July).

>>>Jessica
>>>dickerson@medics.jsc.nasa.gov

>>Larry J
Xref: sparky soc.history:7241 soc.culture.yugoslavia:7880
From: josip@src.umd.edu (Josip Loncaric)
Newsgroups: soc.history,soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: Croatian President on WWII victims
Date: 13 Aug 92 05:08:25 GMT
Organization: Systems Research Center, Maryversity of Uniland, College Park

In article <1992Aug12.201046.14676@husc3.harvard.edu> stojanov@husc10.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic) writes:
>
>This discussion started with Mr. Loncaric's claims about Croatian 
>President.
>
>I decided to post relevant parts of Pres. Tudjman's book. 

My claims were:

(1) Tudjman HAS stated that Ustashe had perpetrated the crime of the Holocaust.
(2) His book is about man's inhumanity to man through history.

Your posting, however incomplete or from whichever sources obtained, 
confirms what I said.

Josip