From: rogue@cellar.org (Rachel McGregor)
Newsgroups: alt.feminism,soc.men
Subject: Re: Choice for men: moving beyond anti-feminism
Date: 27 Sep 92 15:17:37 GMT
Organization: The Cellar BBS and public access system

beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver) writes:

> In article <1992Sep21.184943.4215@panix.com> gcf@panix.com (Gordon Fitch) wri

GF>One of the things these men may not want to put up with is
GF>any kind of responsibility for contraception which impinges
GF>on them.
> 
DB> Actually, it appears to me that many women don't want to put up
DB> with contraception that "impinges" on them, such as IUD's.

For males, there are two forms of contraception available - condoms and
vasectomy.  A vasectomy is major surgery which removes the reproductive
capability from the male (but still does nothing to prevent transmission
of STDs) and is understandably shunned.  Its counterpart for women is
tubal ligation.  Condoms are cheap and do not interfere in any way with
the health or reproductive function of the wearer.  (Except in a small
number of cases where a man or his partner may be allergic to the 
lubricant used.)

Compare condoms to the 'variety' of contraceptives available to women,
all of which are physicaly or chemically invasive.  "The pill" interferes
with a woman's hormonal cycle, and may cause health problems - including
cancers - in women who cannot tolerate the synthesized estrogens used.
Intrauterine devices are often uncomfortable, sometimes painful, and carry
not only a greater health risk (witness the number of women killed or
maimed by toxic shock syndrom brought on by the Dalkon Shield) but a 
lower rate of prevention than condoms.  


GF>Consequently, while the
GF>American model has been improved with respect to bells and
               [ ^ condom --rkm ] 
GF>whistles (e.g. textures, colors and perfumes) it has not
GF>been improved with respect to the essentials (sensitivity 
GF>and reliablility).   Why bother, when the market is
GF>controlled?
> 
DB> This seems to be feminist-driven in part: men must be educated to
DB> know the female body and give pleasure.  Hence textures are
DB> important, because a man dare not ignore a woman's pleasure.
DB> Sensitivity and reliability don't seem to concern the woman much
DB> (he's a man, he'll get his pleasure anyway; if it's unreliable, 
DB> she's free to choose an abortion).
 
For how long, O Wise One?  If you're at Penn State, you should know even
better than I the kinds of restrictions that state governments, especially
Pennsylvania's, can place on a woman's access to abortion.  Have you ever
considered the physical and emotional pain a woman getting an abortion has
to go through?  Have you ever seen a woman go to a health center, pay
hundreds of dollars*, and then lie on a gynecologist's table while the 
fetus is removed?  Have you ever read the description of a D&C?  

* Abortion isn't covered for women on public health plans, and many private
  health insurers won't pay for it either.

I personally don't get overly excited by imagining different colors and 
textures on condoms.  I just want them to work.  And the 'excitement' 
isn't directed only toward women to begin with - many condoms are textured
on the *inside* to increase the pleasure of the man wearing them.

GF>It is quite possible that a similar process is taking place
GF>with oral and implant contraceptives for men.
> 
DB> The male reproductive system is fundamentally different.
DB> There was an interesting interview on NPR of one of the 
DB> "discoverers" of the Pill, who explained that people always
DB> asked him why he didn't develop a Pill for men.  The female
DB> reproductive system has many vulnerabilities, easily interfered
DB> with by hormones; the male reproductive system is much harder
DB> to affect or control without shutting it down completely.
DB> It's not a matter of sexist research.

Granted, in part.  But it shouldn't take more than another ten years (yes,
I'm being optomistic - why not?) to find a pill that can safely shut down 
sperm production without interfering with a man's endocrine system or his
ability to sustain an erection.  Whether you call it sexist or not, the
pharmaceutical companies are working harder to get it 'just right' for men
than they ever did for women.

           
    Rachel McGregor (rogue@cellar.org)  research contractor, modem junkie
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
 The Cellar BBS: 215/654-9184: quickly becoming the Net's most infamous site
 If you don't believe that, look for rogue, darling, richh, techie, or revpk
Newsgroups: alt.feminism