HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: red_trek@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: cruelty-free unsale
Date: 3 Sep 92 21:32:13 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

I've been meaning to post this for a while -- in
ref. to the discussions there were a while back on what to 
do with non cruelty-free products still in your possession after
you become vegetarian/vegan.

Here's a suggestion you can take or leave or whatever:

Have a "Cruelty-free Unsale."  Get out all your leather, furs,
 coral, ivory, animal-fat based soaps, animal-tested make-up,
canned tuna, etc. and offer them for sale in you rfront yard.
Write up index cards or one-page papers explaining why you want
to get rid of each item, and encourage curious shoppers to read them
before agreeing to buy anything.

Even if you fail to sell *any* thing, you'll have educated the
public about your concerns.

If you *do* sell anything, it'll probably to to a person who 
doesn't care about environmentalism/animal rights etc, and thus
might have bought a brand new equivalent (thus further supporting
the market for that item) if not for your sale.

Include environmentalism arguments when possible -- people not
interested in animal rights might be swayed by environmental
concerns.

Lemme know if you think this idea is half-cocked, decent, brilliant,
idiotic or what.  thanx.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: nealf@mdd.comm.mot.com (Neal Friedman)
Subject: Physics trivia, or Colon Cleansing in an old light...
Organization: Motorola, Mobile Data Division - Seattle, WA
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 23:39:46 GMT

This I got from a buddy, who happens to be an anesthesiologist.  I present it
for general ammusment, hoping to lighten up this bit about colon cleansing.


What we today call an "enema" or "colon cleansing" was once referred to as
a "physic".  The person performing this procedure was called a "physician",
("physic" + "ian").  If you needed teeth pulled or surgery performed you went
to the barber (the red stripes are for blood, the white ones for bandages:
remember most folks couldn't read so signs had to be literal back then.  The
blue strips came later.  Thank Betsy Ross :-).  If you have elderly relatives
(or are old enough yourself) who lived in parts of Eastern or Central Europe 
last century or early in this one, the term "physic" may still be familiar
to them.  I also know some physicists who joke about explaining to their
grandparents why they had to spend 7 years in grad school getting a PhD in
order to administer an enema...


Things have since changed, and now physicians don't give physics anymore,
but neither do barbers pull teeth or do surgery (well, not intentionally :-).

The above facts are brought to you by one bored vegitarian hacker who wishes
flames were conducted by Email, applogies weren't necessary and I could be
outside in the sun instead of inside hacking...
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: des@helix.nih.gov (David E. Scheim)
Subject: Re: Hi, I'm new.
Organization: NIH
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 20:08:04 GMT

In article <1992Sep2.144806.6930@cgrg.ohio-state.edu> leslie@cgrg.ohio-state.edu (Leslie Bishko) writes:

>I've resisted reading news because it eats up hours of valuable time,
>however...

>I've been a vegetarian for one year and have lately been somewhat
>distressed by meat cravings!  My vegetarianism evolved through saving
>money by living on tofu, eventually becoming revolted when in the
>meat department at the grocery store.  One day I ate meat, felt sick,
>and decided to make the switch official.  I'm 95% non-dairy, mainly
>for health reasons, and I've been known to eat fish, but I don't buy
>it.  So, I'm a little fuzzy when it comes to fitting into a category.

>Folks, I'm posting here because I need support!  BBQ'd ribs are
>calling!  Relatives think I'll separate the meat from the vegetables!
>Restaurants offer limited selection and nutriciously deficient
>alternatives!  Also, no matter how long I cook 'em, I can't seem to
>prepare a good batch of soybeans.

>Thanks in advance,
> - L.





>-- 


>               Leslie Bishko
>               leslie@cgrg.ohio-state.edu

All power to you in your vegetarian quest and search for support, but don't 
panic if you end up eating meat on infrequent occassion, such as some family 
gatherings where the offering is especially tantalizing and the alternatives 
are meager.  I've been stable and content avoiding meat for more than 10 
years, except about once every 2 months when I wind up in proximity to 
kosher meat with such a craving.  I may eventually become more of a purist, 
and I'm not putting my example up as a model, but just want to encourage you 
not to give up the quest if you can't quite do it 100%. 

/*********************************************************************/
/*                      --- David E. Scheim ---                      */
/* BITNET: DES@NIHNEI31                                              */
/* INTERNET: desl@helix.nih.gov          PHONE: 301 496-2194         */
/* CompuServe: 73750,3305                  FAX: 301 402-1065         */
/*                                                                   */
/* DISCLAIMER: These comments are offered to share knowledge based   */
/*   upon my personal views.  They do not represent the positions    */
/*   of my employer.                                                 */
/*********************************************************************/
From: moser@sw.stratus.com (Tom Moser)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: There used to be someone called Michael Traub
Date: 2 Sep 92 20:59:17 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

I have only posted once to this group before. It was a response to Mike Traub
telling the 'lurking omnivores' that we were simply 'snarfing recipes'.

I did not appreciate his message or the way he presented it and I resent
the fact that omnivores are treated with some derision by many posters
to this group.

I am posting now to point out that I very much appreciated the recipes
posted by Mr Traub and I also gleaned useful information from some
of his other posts. I too would like to see Michael Traub return.

The vile, belligerent and uninformed posts in this group seem, lately,
to be coming from the omnivores. One of the most vituperous diatribes
of late was directed against the woman who gave us the first hand
account of bowel cleaning. I believe that the poster refered to
her as "mean as a snake" - nice guy huh? - well reasoned argument there.

So come back Michael - I miss the recipes, the information and of late
I miss your putting these *folks* in the proper perspective.

-Tom
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: sbhattac@wissel.GBA.NYU.EDU (Shankar Bhattacharyya)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Version 2 of who is who on rec.food.veg (still not serious)
Date: 3 Sep 92 00:17:40 GMT
Organization: NYU Stern School of Business


In article <CINDY.92Sep1182740@meshugge.media.mit.edu> cindy@meshugge.media.mit.edu (Cindy Blank-Edelman) writes:
>I repeat my objection to this "directory."  And I ask again that my
>name be removed from any such list or posting -- including a "category
>4".  I do not want my name to be included at all.  Thank you -- I
>appreciate your cooperation.

I second that sentiment, and make the same request. I don't want my name
on a list at all, not even as someone who does not want his name on a list.
Even though I am listed in quite innocuous fashion.

One list is potentially entertaining, but this is not a joke which wears
well. We are now in version 3. Now, I don't want to make too big a deal of
this. People are free to post whatever they want, including lists of
reliable and unreliable people, but I think this is a bad idea.

I suspect that it takes some sense of history to find lists objectionable
on principle, and I will not pursue such an argument, but I do object on
principle. Lists smell of repression.

I think it is inappropriate to protect people from having to make up their
own minds. What are we afraid of? That people will reach conclusions
different from our own? And who are these poor people, too dumb to think,
that we smart folks will protect from themselves? That may not be the
considered intent, but otherwise why create such a list?

If you have an argument with a post, argue with it. If it blows up into
flames, too bad, but even that is better than the perpetual flame inherent
in a list.

I have little doubt that people's biases are of interest to others in
deciding how seriously to take opinions. But there is no regression formula
for credibility. There are jackass omnivores. There are also jackass
vegetarians. Ultimately all you have is what people post.

- Shankar
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: popetz@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Clinton C. Popetz)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: an idea
Date: 26 Aug 92 22:57:34 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us (Valerie Mates) writes:

>Anybody interested in considering splitting rec.food.veg into two
>groups, one for discussion about vegetarianism and the other for
>recipes and cooking tips?
>-- 
>----------
>Valerie Mates
>popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us


YES YES YES!

|^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^|^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^|
|    Clinton C. Popetz   | "I want to know how God created the world.  I am   |
| popetz@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu|  not interested in this or that phenomenon, in the |
|    The University of   |  spectrum of this or that element; I want to know  |
|         Illinois       |  his thoughts; the rest are details."              |
|     Champaign-Urbana   |                    -A. Einstein                    |
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: cindy@meshugge.media.mit.edu (Cindy Blank-Edelman)
Subject: Re: Who is who of rec.food.veg - Version 1
Organization: M.I.T. Media Laboratory
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 00:17:57 GMT


> A directory of this newsgroup's posters/participants is
> a good idea. To start with, here is one. It is not very
> serious, but we can improve on this one. Please correct
> me if you are in the wrong category, and don't expect n
> answer till 13 September. More people need to be listed
> as well.

I find this "directory" to be unnecessary, and bordering on offensive.
If we are going to place people in "categories" and describe them, we
at least should do it more democratically, and let everyone describe
her/himself.  This is neither informative nor fair.  I formally
request that my name be excluded from any such list in the future.

--Cindy Blank-Edelman
Organization: University Libraries - Technical Service, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Date: Tue,  1 Sep 1992 16:27:49 -0400 
From: Ruthann Schmidt <rs57+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: The problem of summer pets
	<CC.92Sep1135658@arran.dcs.ed.ac.uk>

>In article <1992Aug31.131154.3022@abo.fi> abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay
Bulsari VT) wr
>ites:
>   In this country where I  live,  many  people take  pets for summer and
>   discard/abandon  them at the end of  summer. I  read  this in  a local
>   newspaper, on  the very  day I  found an  abandoned cat in  the common
>   kitchen, a few days back.
> 
>   Is this normal in many places or is it just the Finns who do this ?
> 
>It used to be a frequent occurence here, but at Christmas time, not in the
>summer.  People used to give cats and dogs to children as Christmas presents;
>if the children lost interest, the pets would sometimes be abandoned.  Animal
>care charities have been fighting a big publicity battle against this every
>winter, so maybe it doesn't happen so much any more.
--
>	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)

A lot of rabbits are given as gifts to children around Easter. (I'm
speaking of the US.) Many of the bunnies get abandoned, or they are
neglected after the "novelty" wears off. A friend of mine has 3 rabbits,
2 of which she adopted. The 2nd one was an "Easter" bunny, & he was let
out onto the city streets of Pittsburgh as a 5 month old rabbit. Yeah,
like he could have fended for himself. Her 3rd rabbit was given to her
by a child who "could no longer keep him." 

Ruth Ann
Organization: Fifth yr. senior, English, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Date: Fri,  4 Sep 1992 00:04:24 -0400 
From: "David F. McWade" <dm3o+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Pledge

I PLEDGE TO SIMPLY IGNORE *ATTEMPTS* AT INSULTS, REAL OR IMAGINED FROM
NOW ON BY ANYONE.  

We can only take responsibility for ourselves.

David McWade
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: eli@cisco.com (Steve Elias)
Subject: Shiny Silly People in rec.food.veg
X-Disclaimer: The views expressed in this message are those of an
	      individual at SRI International, and do not necessarily
	      reflect those of the company.
Organization: cisco Systems
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 18:47:52 GMT

 abulsari@abo.fi (AbhayBulsari VT) writes:

(first, let it be known a vermonter is a good thing to be.)

Abhay Bulsari, Vermonter of Finland, at my personal behest
i request that ye 

          R E N T  A  L I F E

your list of food.veg participants is very silly.
maybe even sillier than my comments to you!  

now, i must send HEART APPLAUSE and HUZZAHs and KUDOs
and Rebeccas California Vegan Mighty Muffins to those technoveggies
who insistently present real science when it flies in the face
of the more absurd alternative medical techniques.  

yours for rec.food.veg.tech,

/eli

ps:  

   Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Path: csl!nntp1.radiomail.net!uunet!mcsun!news.funet.fi!aton.abo.fi!abulsari
   From: abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT)
   Organization: Abo Akademi University
   Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 06:59:34 GMT
   Lines: 62

   I got this in the mail this morning. I have not corrected
   any mistakes I have noticed in it (e.g. Michael is vegan, not
   just vegetarian).

posting OPE (other peoples email) is really obnoxious ya know!

   It  is odd 

   Why  are  these  defensive omnivores here?  What is  their  purpose in
   degrading what often could be  an intelligent and interesting dialogue
   into a  mere  flame? 

one of the central questions plaguing usenet.theologians for decades.

check out the movie Eating Raoul -- there's the omnivore mentality!  

 Do only  a few vegetarians  recognize that  this
   conference is being undermined not by  fellow vegetarians but by those
   few defensive omnivores with their interminable quibbling, mean-spirit
   and destructive remarks, and outright insults?

nobody expects the SPANISH INQUISITION.

next, the soft cushions

really, A. Bulsari, consider that rental option i mentioned above.

Monsieur Traub, aw c'mon, stick around, be a veggiemensch!
you're not one of the colon cleanser roto rooter high colonic advocates
are you?  even if so, stick around and enlighten us with either
science or anecdotes, whatever you like.

peace!

/eli

--

/* eli@cisco.com */
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: mece1xg@Rosie.UH.EDU (purna)
Subject: how accurate is your sense of smell/taste?
Reply-To: mece1xg@Rosie.UH.EDU
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 00:30:17 GMT

howdy all!

i have an interesting anecdote/stoery that occurred to me.  i have
been a lacto-ovo veggie all my life (ok, there WAS that time in
camp...but that's another story :)) and had an interesting run-in
a couple of months ago.

a bunch of us went out to a comedy club one night and afterwards
we went to "grab a bite" at the local restaurant (a Bennigan's-type
place).  in the group were 2 veggies (including myself).  well,
when it came time to order, the selection (as usual) was very limited.
however, as i was not alone in this endeavor, i consulted with
my "veggie-buddy" and we decided to do the cheese-brocolli
soup with a salad side dish (albeit, not the HEALTHIEST meal...but
hey, i was hungry!).  so, they brought the food.

well, as i went down to take that 1st sip, i smelled an....odor.
it smelled VERY MUCH like bacon bits.  however, to see if i was
going crazy or not (we had given the waitress EXPLICIT instructions
about no meat, chicken, fish, etc.) i decided to wait.  the next
thing i know, my veggie-buddy is giving me this really strange
expression (actually, it was one of total disgust) and asked me
if i had tried the soup.  i acknowldged that i had SMELLED it and
it smelt like bacon.

well, by this time, the others around us decided to check for themselves.
each and everyone one of them took a whiff, and made a decision.
here's the incredible part.  NONE of them said there was any meat,
or meat-type products in the soup!!  we (the 2 veggies) kept INSISTING
there was something, but we couldn't convince them.  then, the
waitress came back WITH THE COOK!  they both informed us that
there was absolutely NO MEAT in the soup!

i was/am perplexed by their tenacity.  has anyone else had this,
or similar type problem?  or, am i REALLY going crazy?

peace,
-purna
From: red_trek@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Veg. food at Orlando
Date: 4 Sep 92 18:20:31 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

About four people contacted me with information regarding vegetarian
food at Disney World/Epcot Center.  Many thanx.

Information summarized below:

A couple of people who haven't been to Orlando for 1.5-3 years 
were very negative, pointing maily to refried beans at a Mexican
fast food place at EpCot and a chhese pizza somewhere, plus
one resturant that had exaclty one lacto-vegetarian dish.
Just about everyone emphasized the need to *MAKE RESERVATIONS*
to eat at resturants *EARLY* in the day, or you'd be stuck with
hotdog stands, etc.  Ick.

HOwever, more recent travelers seemed to imply things have improved
for vegetarians--somewhat.  Go to any info desk, or consult 
a brochure of resturants and food stands distributed from Magic
Kingdom, or ask customer assistance or the reciptionist at the 
desk of your hotel, and you should be able to get good inforamtion.
Info desks will have listings  of resturants for those on "special diets";
the menus from thiese resturants will be available, with the food ontents
described.

Call up resturants in advance:  some may offer to make something special
for you if nothing on teh menu appeals.

People at Disney World/Epcot Center are reputedly *very* helpful.
So consult them for help!
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: masonp@physun.physics.mcmaster.ca (Peter Mason)
Subject: Spaghetti Sauce
Organization: Dept. of Physics & Astronomy, McMaster University
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 00:18:22 GMT


Here is a spaghetti sauce recipe that I have been fighting with for
awhile and that I finally got to taste really good.  I hope others
like it too (it's a miracle I wrote this down as I made it):

Process the following vegetables (I like them chopped not too fine):

7 large celery stocks
5 medium cloves garlic (crushed)
5 medium oinions
2 green peppers
1 bunch green onions
as many mushrooms as you like
Optional: 1 red pepper, 1 hot pepper (I recommend this!)

Saute these vegetables until softish.

In a large pot put:

7 chopped fresh tomatoes (or more or less-- see how it works the first time)
optional: 14 ounces of tomatoe paste or one can tomatoe sauce
2 cakes of pressed tofu

Add the sauted vegetables, a cup of water, bring to boil.
Add:

1 tbsp each:  oregano, basil, worcesterschire sauce
1.5 tsp each: thyme, allspice, black pepper, hot pepper flakes, tobasco, salt
3 bayleaves.

Simmer with tilted lid for about 2.5 hours.


Maybe more oregono if you like.  If you find this too spicey you can cut
down on the hot things.  I find the recipe quite forgiving as I'm usually
missing some stuff.  It makes quite a load too which is good if you happen
to live in a house with five very active vegetarians.  Don't skimp on the
garlic!

Good luck.

peace,


Peter
-- 
Peter Mason
masonp@nukie.physics.mcmaster.ca
Hamilton, Ontario (ack! pthhht!), Canada
-displaced Nova Scotian
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: young@serum.kodak.com
Subject: Re: an idea
Originator: young@sasquatch
Reply-To: young@serum.kodak.com
Organization: Clinical Products Division, Eastman Kodak Company
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 18:45:57 GMT

In article <SHAFER.92Aug27093118@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov> shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) writes:

>On Thu, 27 Aug 92 12:04:24 GMT, young@serum.kodak.com said:
>
>young>....a newsgroup moderated by Mary Howard, ....
>
>That's Mary Shafer (shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov) and she's a 
>doesn't-eat-much-meat-to-reduce-the-fat-in-her-diet omnivore who is
>sympathetic to vegetarians.

	Oops.  Wrong Mary.  Sorry about that!  It's the thought that counts,
	though.  Right?  :-) :-) :-)


-Rich Young (These are not Kodak's opinions.)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: des@helix.nih.gov (David E. Scheim)
Subject: Insulting remarks re vitamin D
Organization: NIH
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 12:44:48 GMT

Yesterday, someone who I won't name posted some arrogant and offensive 
remarks concerning a posting on vitamin D.  The person who so replied 
otherwise appears to be a knowledgable person who has reasonably expressed
disagreement in other forums.  It is too bad this reply was so weird 
because it had some interesting information that I might otherwise have paid 
attention to.

There's a big difference between heated remarks concerning 
scientific subjects or political parties -- these can spice up the debate 
occasionally -- that show respect for individuals.  One can strongly 
disagree with a point of view without insulting the presenter.

Perhaps people should not put up postings if they are in such a bad mood or 
have so little time to think that they must insult people in the course of 
disagreeing with their views.  I hope the posting in question was an 
aberration and look forward to the knowledgable and respectful remarks this 
person usually makes.

/*********************************************************************/
/*                      --- David E. Scheim ---                      */
/* BITNET: DES@NIHNEI31                                              */
/* INTERNET: desl@helix.nih.gov          PHONE: 301 496-2194         */
/* CompuServe: 73750,3305                  FAX: 301 402-1065         */
/*                                                                   */
/* DISCLAIMER: These comments are offered to share knowledge based   */
/*   upon my personal views.  They do not represent the positions    */
/*   of my employer.                                                 */
/*********************************************************************/
From: proberts@informix.com (Paul Roberts)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Down, how is it made?
Keywords: meat-eaters
Date: 4 Sep 92 17:42:35 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <1992Sep4.092321.9913@ennews.eas.asu.edu> guncer@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (Otomatik Portakal ) writes:
>In article <16760@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu>, kuan@taquito.engr.ucdavis.edu (Frank Kuan) writes:
>> 
>> How is silk made? Specifically, I'd like to know what degree silk
>> worms are inconvenienced, and whether they are killed
>> to facilitate mass production of silk. I'm a vegetarian for ethical
>> reasons, and I'd like to know so I can alter my wardrobe accordingly.
>> Thanks in advance.
>> 
>> - Frank
>> 
 [...]
>
>What is done to produce silk, however, is to heat the cocoon once it 
>completely covers the worm and kill it. So silk is by no means a 
>cruelty-free product. 
>
 [...]
>
>Selim Guncer

Similarly, what about down (as in sleeping bags, down jackets, etc)?
I am pretty sure that they kill a lot of geese to get enough down for
a sleeping bag, but maybe it is "harvested" like wool - I don't know
for certain.

Can anyone clarify?

Thanks ...

Paul