HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pbd@runyon.cim.cdc.com (Paul Dokas)
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality,comp.misc,sci.psychology,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,comp.security.misc
Subject: Re: REPOST of Hacker Personality Characteristics
Date: 5 Jan 93 15:24:44 GMT
Followup-To: alt.psychology.personality
Organization: ICEM Systems, Inc.

This gem is an clip from the appendicies(?) of the Jargon file (aka
The New Hacker's Dictionary) by Eric Raymonds(sp?).

The Jargon file is available in ftp.uu.net:/packages/gnu/jargon*
The New Hacker's Dictionary can be found in the computer section
of better bookstores.

[IMHO, TNHD is well worth the ~$12]
-- 
#include <std.disclaimer>
#define FULL_NAME                          "Paul Dokas"
#define EMAIL                              "pbd@runyon.cim.cdc.com"
/*            Just remember, you *WILL* die someday.             */
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
From: jem@sunSITE.unc.edu (Jonathan Magid)
Subject: Friendship and personality
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 19:20:18 GMT

A friend of mine has the theory that friendship is based upon the second of the 
Myer's Briggs characteristics: Sensing vs. Intuitive.

Now, this doesn't make much sense to me, but as I ask friends what their types
are or try to guess the ones I don't know, I am finding that I have not a
single "Sensing" friend, and I am, myself 95% Intutitive (by several tests)


I have friends that are both extro and introverted, thinking and feeling, and 
judgement and perceptive, but only intuitive friends.

This seems to point that my friends theory is correct, but I see no real
explanation for it.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

jem (extreme ENTP :) )
-- 
Jonathan Magid     jem@sunSITE.unc.edu       sunSITE Administrator
Virtual pizza Delivery (tm)::faxed in 30 cycles or less or you get it
----------------------------------------FREE!!!-----------------------
From: scythe@hardy.u.washington.edu (The Grim Reaper)
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
Subject: Re: Myers-Briggs questions
Date: 4 Jan 93 18:17:24 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
NNTP-Posting-Host: hardy.u.washington.edu

In article <freek.726153155@groucho.phil.ruu.nl> freek@phil.ruu.nl (Freek Wiedijk) writes:
>drabe@uunet!tellab5!odgate (Daniel Rabe) writes:
>>A specific question on J vs P: if a person tends to plan everything
>>out and leave nothing to chance (J-behavior), but years for the
>>spontaneous and free, i.e. to be more P-like, would you consider
>>this person more a J or a P?
>
>I also wondered about this.
>
>There seem to be _three_ kinds of personality involved:
>
>  i  what you _are_
> ii  what you _think_ you are
>iii  what you _want_ to be
>
>In Daniel's example, (i) would be "J", but (iii) would be "P".
>
>What does the Myers-Briggs test measure?  Which aspects of a person's
>personality _can_ be measured with a questionaire?  Is it conceivable
>that all three kinds of personality are different?
>
>Freek
>--
>Third theory of Phenomenal Dynamics:  The difference between
>a symbol and an object is quantitative, not qualitative.

What it shows depends on how you answer.  There's no input except
how you answer the questions.  So what it shows depends on if
you answer about your real behavior, your imagined behavior, or
your ideal behavior =)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
When he goes swimming does he get wet, | The Grim Reaper
Or does the water get him instead?     | scythe@u.washington.edu
-They Might Be Giants, "Particle Man"  |
---------------------------------------+------------------------------------
Villager: She turned me into a newt!   |Lister, If two people came to you 
Bedevere: A newt?                      |for a job, and one of them was dead,
Villager: I got better.....            |who would you choose? -Rimmer
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality,comp.misc,sci.psychology,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,comp.security.misc
From: noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring)
Subject: REPOST of Pretty Labels
Summary: An answer to a sincere distrust of personality typing systems
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 00:47:03 GMT


For the new people to this group who may feel uneasy about personality typing
systems:


In article ppg@oasis.icl.co.uk (Philippe Goujard) writes:
>Are you guys aware of what you do when you glue pretty labels on the face
>of human beings?  I don't think so.
>
>People are not ENTP, ESFP, basher, digger, plant, shaper... or whatever
>classification you can imagine. People are not lemmings.  Using labels is
>dangerous but you couldn't care less since all you want is not understand
>personality it's just classify it.


How can we understand human personality unless we model it?  Look at all of
the scientific theories today - they are just models to help us to tie 
together in a logical fashion what we observe in nature.

Human personality is no different.  We observe it in other people, and then
use models to see how everything fits together.  The MBTI, among other
excellent typing systems, does a "reasonably" good job at doing this.  I'm
sure psychologists who work in the area of human personality can come up
with even better, more accurate models.

Once we have a model that works "reasonably" well, then we can use it like an
engineer would take scientific models and use them for practical purposes.  Of
course, in the analogy of the engineer, he/she could use the scientific
models to make weapons of mass destruction (not a good application, imho), or
he/she could use the same principles and come up with a new, better and
cleaner energy source.  Thus, the models themselves are not good or bad, it
is HOW they are applied that moves us into the realm of ethics and morality.

Philippe does correctly identify the potential misapplication of personality
models, and that is definitely a worthwhile subject to talk about in this
newsgroup (alt.psychology.personality).

Jon Noring


(p.s., are certain MBTI archetypes more likely to have a distrust or uneasiness
towards personality typing?)


-- 

Charter Member of the INFJ Club.

Now, if you're just dying to know what INFJ stands for, be brave, e-mail me,
and I'll send you some information.  It WILL be worth the inquiry, I think.

=============================================================================
| Jon Noring          | noring@netcom.com        | I VOTED FOR PEROT IN '92 |
| JKN International   | IP    : 192.100.81.100   | Support UNITED WE STAND! |
| 1312 Carlton Place  | Phone : (510) 294-8153   | "The dogs bark, but the  |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: (510) 417-4101   |  caravan moves on."      |
=============================================================================
Who are you?  Read alt.psychology.personality!  That's where the action is.
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality,alt.mythology,sci.anthropology,sci.misc,sci.psychology,soc.culture.misc,soc.history,soc.misc
From: cpshelle@logos.uwaterloo.ca (cameron shelley)
Subject: Re: Do Cultures Exhibit a Collective Personality That Changes With Time?
Organization: Evil Designs Inc.
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 00:37:53 GMT

I can't answer the question in detail, but it is an interesting one
with regard to mythology.  Certain psychologists, particularly Freud
and Jung, seemed to view myths as sort of the collective dreams of a
culture, and therefore amenable to dream analysis.  Oedipal complex,
anyone?  Jung's 'collective unconscious' would seem to mean something
like cultural personality.  If I recall, this was one of the points
that Freud vehemently disputed with Jung.

</dev/cam
--
      Cameron Shelley        |"In the beginning, there was nothing.  Then
cpshelle@logos.uwaterloo.ca  | God said `Let there be light', and there
    Davis Centre Rm 3147     | was still nothing, but youse could see it."
 Phone (519) 885-1211 x3499  | --Dave Thomas, SCTV:_Sunrise Semester_
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
From: ljz57640@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (l.j.z. )
Subject: Personality disorders?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:50:22 GMT

I have seen a lot of discussion about personality types on this
newsgroup, but precious little, if anything, about the generally-
accepted personality "disorder" types.  Is there anyone who can
give me some information in this area (i.e. tell me where I can go to
get some solid information)?  For example, I have been told that I
have what is known as "Borderline Personality."  That is all fine
and good in the clinical world of psychology, but what does it tell
me as a person (and as an INTJ)?  I'd appreciate anything that gets
thrown my way.

Thanx,
--L.


-- 
"Push the button, Frank!"
-----------------------------------------------------------------
laura j zurawski    juniper@uiuc.edu      visualize whirled peas
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
From: noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring)
Subject: I'll Be Reposting Some Material From This Newsgroup
Summary: Mostly MBTI.
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 23:17:40 GMT

Hello,

Well, the Holidays (tm) are over, and it is time to get discussion going on
this newsgroup.  Also, I know there are a lot of new people looking in on this
group waiting for something to happen.  Welcome!

Thus, I am reposting some of the more informative posts made to this newsgroup
since its inception.  Except for the Charter, all the rest of the posts deal
with the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator.

Enjoy.

Jon Noring

-- 

Charter Member of the INFJ Club.

Now, if you're just dying to know what INFJ stands for, be brave, e-mail me,
and I'll send you some information.  It WILL be worth the inquiry, I think.

=============================================================================
| Jon Noring          | noring@netcom.com        | I VOTED FOR PEROT IN '92 |
| JKN International   | IP    : 192.100.81.100   | Support UNITED WE STAND! |
| 1312 Carlton Place  | Phone : (510) 294-8153   | "The dogs bark, but the  |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: (510) 417-4101   |  caravan moves on."      |
=============================================================================
Who are you?  Read alt.psychology.personality!  That's where the action is.
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
From: glover@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Eric Glover)
Subject: Re: Another fun REPOST: Star Trek Characters Personality Analysis
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois, USA
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:27:56 GMT

>>   As for the literary interest, from my memory, the TOS Kirk didn't have
>>that much of outside interests other than boozing, fighting and sex.
>>(I may be wrong, but the only literary quote I remember Kirk making was
>>in Space Seed "rather rule in Hell" line.)

Kirk was also interested in 3D-Chess, and quite a bit literature
 in "Changeling" and "SpaceSeed" as well as the Old West as
 noted by "Spectre of the Gun."

In the movies Kirk was a collector of Antiques. As noted by his gift from
McCoy and Apartment wall mounts.

Xref: sparky alt.psychology.personality:434 alt.mythology:2226 sci.anthropology:1713 sci.misc:2004 sci.psychology:4959 soc.culture.misc:507 soc.history:10638 soc.misc:1120
From: rosch@cpdw.enet.dec.com (Ray Rosch)
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality,alt.mythology,sci.anthropology,sci.misc,sci.psychology,soc.culture.misc,soc.history,soc.misc
Subject: Re: Do Cultures Exhibit a Collective Personality That Changes With Time?
Date: 11 Jan 93 14:51:06 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1993Jan11.001235.20832@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU>, dabbott@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU (Derek Abbott) writes...
>>In article <1993Jan5.011653.14380@netcom.com> noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring) writes:
>>                       .
>>                       .
>>                       .
>>>Is it possible for cultures to exhibit an overall 'personality', somewhat
>>>akin to individual human personalities, and that these cultural
>>>'personalities' can dynamically and dramatically change over time?  For
> 
>I've often played with this idea and have for fun come up with the
>following conclusions:
> 
> 
>Germans - melancholic
>Italians, Spaniards - sanguine
>Australians - phlegmatic
>Americans, french - choleric
> 
> 
>Any other submissions?


	I take exception to the above.  To state that American and French
	have anything is common is an annoyance to the French and an insult
	to the Americans!


*
*	Opinions do not represent my employer
*
Xref: sparky alt.psychology.personality:383 comp.misc:4771 sci.psychology:4902 alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk:3860 comp.security.misc:2448
From: jem@sunSITE.unc.edu (Jonathan Magid)
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality,comp.misc,sci.psychology,alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,comp.security.misc
Subject: Re: REPOST of Hacker Personality Characteristics
Date: 5 Jan 93 19:12:47 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill

In article <2809067323@sunburst.nrl.navy.mil> boyd@sunburst.nrl.navy.mil writes:
>Hey Jon,  
>
>As you can see below, I apologized for not knowing the author of this gem.
>Of course I haven't the foggiest where I got it...

The gem was written by Eric Raymond (esr@snark.thyrsus.com I think) who
is the maintainer of the Hacker's Jargon file and editor of the book it was
made into _The New Hacker's Dictionary_. The posted profile is from
the appendix.

I reccomend the book and/or the file... (check /pub/gnu on sunsite.unc.edu)

jem.

-- 
Jonathan Magid     jem@sunSITE.unc.edu       sunSITE Administrator
Virtual pizza Delivery (tm)::faxed in 30 cycles or less or you get it
----------------------------------------FREE!!!-----------------------
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
From: bcollins@utdallas.edu (ARLIN B COLLINS)
Subject: Re: Friendship and personality
Organization: Univ. of Texas at Dallas
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:21:38 GMT

> kene@sequent.com (Ken Ewing) writes:
>I am a thoroughgoing intuitive.  I have many friends who are S-types, 
>but there seems to be a subtle difference between my interactions with 
>S's and with N's.  It's almost something of a game with me to see if 
>I can detect S's by simply talking with them.  When I interact with 
>N's, there's a deep feeling of *connection*.  I feel much more deeply 
>understood than I do with S's.  With S's, I almost feel like there is 
>some kind of mental "wall" that separates the inner person from me.  
>
>For me, the difference between talking to an N versus talking to an S 
>is almost like the difference between talking to someone face-to-face 
>and talking to someone over the phone.  
>
>This doesn't so much affect the quality of my relationships, it's just 
>a curious observation.  
>  Ken Ewing 
>
   I am an  ISTJ  [with a strong  T, also  computer analyst by education
   and work, and .... sorta identify with the HACKER profile in several
   ways]
   In response to Ken's comments, I just wanted to say that it seems
   to look the same from this side  of the  "wall".  I have several
   S and/or T  really close friends, it took us only a few hours/
   contacts to commonly realize the  "connection" and we formed
   very close and trusting friendships.  With strong N's, I feel like
   I am trying to play 20 questions to communicate with them,
   I regard myself as a very direct communicator, no prejudice,
   emotion or opinions...  "just the facts",  the  N's are always
   reading emotions and feelings into my words that ARE NOT THERE!,
   and when they speak to me, they are so vague that I get tired of
   trying to figger out if they are  "for it"  or  "agin' it"...

   .... just my observation....
   I've been reading the group for a few weeks, this is my first response.
   looking forward to more involvement...  if ya'll will accept an ISTJ  :-)


-- 
 Arlin B Collins    Wed 06 Jan   Sun   Civil  Naut   Astro
 bcollins@utdallas.edu   rise:  07:31  07:04  06:33  06:03
 lat N32.9 long W096.9    set:  17:36  18:03  18:34  19:04
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
From: gsroka@leland.Stanford.EDU (Gregory Sroka)
Subject: Re: Friendship and personality
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 06:02:44 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.193020.19144@sequent.com> kene@sequent.com (Ken Ewing) writes:
>In article <1993Jan9.090044.8296@leland.Stanford.EDU> gsroka@leland.Stanford.EDU (Gregory Sroka) writes:
>>
>>In article <1993Jan7.181320.20175@sequent.com> kene@sequent.com (Ken Ewing) writes:
>>>
>>>I know of one 
>>>extreme case where a particularly strong NF tended to label as S 
>>>anyone whom that person thought was "slow-witted".  (All it took 
>>>to be labelled as such was to display a minor habit pattern of 
   ...
>>
>>Let me suggest a different way to look at this. Could this person be
>>a J?  I tend to think that someone prone to "pre-judgement" like your
>>extreme case is making snap decisions with very little information to
  ...
>
>Suggestion noted, but it does not apply to this person.  The person 
>in question has taken MB a number of times.  The person consistently 
>comes out and ENFP, and consistently "pegs the meter" on all four 
>categories.  Your suggestion, though, points out how very difficult 
>it is to predict a person's type by interpreting outward behavior.  
>
Yes, this is the best advice. You can not tell a person's type by WHAT
they do, but by WHY they do what they do. This is what I was taught when
I first learned MBTI.

>May I make a counter suggestion to your suggestion...My experience 
>is that NFPs are extremely impulsive.  (I know several NFPs, and when 
>I was new to MB I pegged them as SPs because of their impulsiveness.)  
>A good friend of mine who is a professional counsellor told me that 
>ENFs are especially prone to "presume that others automatically know 
>what they're thinking."  Put all this together, and you get someone who:  
>
>  o  is very impulsive, 
>  o  is prone to losing patience with people who don't intuitively know 
>      what that person is thinking, 
>  o  and therefore, one who is not likely to be guided by well-thought-out 
>      principals, but rather one who impulsively reacts without stopping to 
>      question or to check out first to see if he/she has correctly 
>      understood before responding.  
>
>...which exactly describes much of the behavior of the person I'm using 
>as an example.  
>

Ah ha! My girlfriend in an INFP. Yes, impulsive. But because of the I instead
of E, I guess, she doesn't do the assuming or impatience part. Now I see ...

>>As an INTP I can also relate to this.  
>
>I'm an INTP also.  :-)  
>

Cool! The best, naturally.




-- 
Greg Sroka
Menlo Park, CA
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality,alt.mythology,sci.anthropology,sci.misc,sci.psychology,soc.culture.misc,soc.history,soc.misc
From: briand@anasazi.com (Brian Douglass)
Subject: Re: Do Cultures Exhibit a Collective Personality That Changes With Time?
Organization: Anasazi Inc Phx Az USA
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 03:34:39 GMT

From a political standpoint, I would say absolutely.

In a Democracy people elect those representatives that they think most
closely match their own values.  In the US, Democrats tend to vote for 
Democrats, Republicans for Republicans, etc, etc.  These Representatives then 
(in theory) exercise the people's will into laws and programs.  A these laws
and programs are explicity intented to affect society in someway, they do
affect the culture and it changes over time.

Look at the swings from Coolidge, Hoover, Roosevelt, Eisenhower, Reagan,
Clinton.  While it may be unclear whether the person or the change in
culture came first, clearly all of these men have/will propagate the
positions that got them elected.  

In a Dictatorship, like the former USSR, PRC, N. Korea, Cuba, the leaders
in power surround themselves with individuals of compatible ideology.  Without
redress by the populace, those at the top alone can and do shape the
culture of the country.  As evinced by Tiannemen Square, movements outside
of certain cultural/political boundaries will not be permitted.  Given the
decades that these leaders can remain in power, clearly the cultures MUST
take on the personality of the leaders, and exhibit that personality
through cultural expressions (or repressions most often).

So, Psychology asside, I would say countries absolutely exhibit
personalities.  Traveling recently in Europe, the difference in personality
between Brits, French, and Germans was quite obvious and startling.  Not
wishing to offend any friends that may be reading this from over there,
I'll just keep my observations to myself.  But almost always I could
classify each countries citizens by their personality traits.

-- 
"The best government of all is that government which governs the least."
	Jefferson
Brian Douglass		briand@anasazi.com 	602-870-3330 X657
From: srgcejb@grace.cri.nz
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality
Subject: Distribution of MBTI types in New Zealand
Date: Fri,  8 Jan 93 07:01:52 GMT
Organization: Industrial Research Ltd., New Zealand.
NNTP-Posting-Host: grv.grace.cri.nz

I have seen a lot of statistics in this newsgroup which are claimed to 
be typical of "Western" culture but which should more properly be 
attributed to "US" culture.  To put the record straight I would like 
to show some data I have on the New Zealand population, a "Western" 
culture but quite unlike the US. 

Based on a sample of about 8500 people: 

    ISTJ    13% 
    ISFJ    12% 
    INFJ     6% 
    INTJ     6% 
    ISTP     5% 
    ISFP     5% 
    INFP     8% 
    INTP     5%
    ESTP     3% 
    ESFP     3% 
    ENFP     8% 
    ENTP     5% 
    ESTJ     7% 
    ESFJ     6% 
    ENFJ     4% 
    ENTJ     4% 

In rounded-off numbers: 

    E 40%   I 60%
    S 55%   N 45%
    T 50%   F 50%
    J 60%   P 40% 

Also in rounded-off numbers the distribution of Temperaments are: 

    SJ 40%     SP 15%      NF 25%      NT 20%

However, our cultural stereotypes and popular (including fictional) 
heroes are male XSTPs (although females are ISFJ) and I suspect a large 
proportion of the population are in fact SPs.  SPs simply are not 
sufficiently interested in self-information such as the MBTI would 
give them and do not turn up in situations where the MBTI is used. In 
New Zealand the MBTI is used in two primary settings, in church groups 
for self-discovery and in business groups for career development and 
team building. SPs do not turn up in either of these settings.  
They're out there somewhere doing their thing away from the rigid 
organizational structures of church or business life. 

Conversely, I suspect that NFs are over-represented as they go out of 
their way to do something like the MBTI for self-development and 
actively seek out MBTI courses. 

SJs turn up in vast numbers in both church and business settings, 
presumably dutifuly doing the right thing that they should be doing as 
sold to them by their pastors/supervisors. 

Any responses on what all this might mean are welcome!

John Bathurst  ISTP 
Curator of New Zealand's MBTI database 

====================================================================== 
srgcejb@grv.grace.cri.nz       or        bathurst_e@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz 
---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
There is no point in being grown up if we can't be childish sometimes. 
                                                          - The Doctor 
====================================================================== 
Newsgroups: alt.psychology.personality