From: platt@watson.ibm.com (Daniel E. Platt)
Subject: Re: led zep
Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1992 18:33:01 GMT
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

In article <rlbmlINNmjn@agate.berkeley.edu>, 190lentz@inca.qal.berkeley.edu (Greg Lentz) writes:
|> In article <1992Apr03.191846.23560@watson.ibm.com>, platt@watson.ibm.com (Daniel E. Platt) writes:
|> |> In article <1992Apr3.044719.16718@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>, feygin@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Alexander Feygin) writes:
|> |> |> 190lentz@lee.qal.berkeley.edu (Greg Lentz) writes:
|> |> |> }changes, and the result pisses off the band's fans.  The only group who
|> |> |> }ever lost a major component of their band personality and continued to
|> |> |> }succeed is AC/DC.  And even they would not fit into this category had
|> |> |> 
|> |> |> So you would say that Pink Floyd were not successful after the
|> |> |> loss of Syd Barrett in '68?
|> |> 
|> |> How about the Rolling Stones (while some might debate that they're
|> |> still great -- or ever were -- the question was about whether
|> |> they've continued to be viable...)
|> 
|> 	Actually, the question was about whether it was better to die a
|> quick death or to fade out slowly.  I would say that although Syd Barrett
|> was a major loss of the band's personality (kudos to the man who reminded
|> me of that), Floyd changed their personality significantly after that.  I
|> wouldn't give Brian Jones, Mick Taylor, or Ron Wood (especially) as having
|> that kind of impace on the Stones' personality.  Jagger and Richards hold
|> down that responsibility.

Point taken; 'viability' is not quite the same as whether its better to die
quickly or to fade away...  However, the idea that death must happen implies
that viability is a part of the question -- namely, how is viability lost;
along with that comes the issue of change... how much can a band change
before it either breaks (too brittle) or becomes something else.

Pink Floyd did change significantly...  They also became much more
successful...

The Stones changed significantly every time they replaced a guitarist.  I
would disagree with the idea that Mick Taylor didn't add a great deal to the
band.  I think they've been a lot weaker since Ron Wood joined them (that's
all personal taste; I won't argue taste, but I will say that their character
HAS been affected strongly).

|> 
|> |> Then, there's the Beatles.  They replaced a drummer, and shortly
|> |> thereafter they made it.
|> 
|> 	I wouldn't say that Pete Best was in any way a major component
|> of the Beatles' personality.

I wouldn't say Pete Best contributed much to the Beatles... he didn't live
long enough.  However, the Beatles went on to be very successful later :-)
  
|>  
|> |> Then there's Zeppelin -- there's no doubt that they had a lot of
|> |> that interpersonal chemistry that's very important.  Yet, they
|> |> were undergoing changes during the whole life of the band.  Their
|> |> last album was characterized by being 'uncomfortable,' so that
|> |> chemistry wasn't enough to guarantee that things would continue to
|> |> fit well in any of the previous molds...  It would seem
|> |> conceivable that they could have continued.
|> 
|> 	I'd say that In Through The Out Door was a turning point for
|> Zeppelin.  They were just getting involved with synthesizers and John
|> Paul Jones was taking a larger role in the songwriting.  But they were
|> a very tired band by then and between Bonham's drinking and Page's 
|> drug habits, they might have decided to hang it up soon after anyway.

Personal problems come and go.  Sometimes people end up being more 'solid'
after going into recovery.  But that's a sort of a side issue.

The band was changing.  They were moving much more into keyboards (as you
point out).  At the time, I was not particularly impressed with them, but
some of the things I'd heard might have been interesting.


Another band that sort of went in a similar direction was the Doobee (sp?)
Brothers...  that is, moving towards keyboards with major personel
changes... while it wouldn't have been Zeppelin in the same sense, I'd have
been curious what would have happened with some mixing and matching that
way...

Dan