From: willm@igd.fhg.de (Matt Will)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Subject: Re: Intercommunion
Date: 28 Sep 92 16:28:39 GMT
Organization: Zentrum fuer Graphische Datenverarbeitung, 6100 Darmstadt, Germany

I previously said:

mw>Doesn't it say "there is one faith, one baptism"? Are there any reasons why the
mw>faith of a non-RCC should be less valid than RC faith? 

John Ocallaghan replied:

jo> It says that.  We certainly all have faith in the one same Lord Jesus Christ. jo> But do we all believe the same things about that one same Lord?

Of course not...our beliefs are *heavily* influenced by our limited, subjective
perception. So I dare to say that Catholics do not all believe the same things
about our same Lord (your faith is likely to be different from mine, although
I am sure we'd be able to find a gcd, but that's not the issue here...)

mw> I consider myself as belonging to the "hidden Church", i.e. the
mw>community of Christians which is not limited to one church or one denomination.

Let me elaborate on this, since obviously I wasn't very clear:

I believe the church was one when it was founded by Christ. The NT books after
the four gospels tell us about the founding of local churches (however being in
spiritual unity). Although I am aware that Peter was given authority by Christ,
I do not subscribe to the view that this was meant as the beginning of papal
primacy. However, I don't want to elaborate on this, since this has been
discussed before. I do believe in this one church, however it is not limited
to the Catholic church any more. What I meant to say is that those who follow
Christ are united in this all-encompassing church.
       
jo> What are the "signs" of this church.  The signs of the
jo> Church as RC's understand them are that it is "one", visibly manifested to all
jo> in the apostolic, and in particular the primacy of the Petrin office

I hope you don't mean to say that those like myself, who don't adhere
to the papal primacy, are not part of the church founded by Christ.

jo> "holy", i.e. the Holy Spirit dwells within it giving it life

HS dwelling within the church == HS dwelling within those who form the church?
If yes, I fully agree with that.

jo> "catholic", i.e. encompasses all of the people of God,

This is actually what I meant by "hidden Church". There is only one Christian
Church, but several denominations. For me, following Christ equals being part
of God's people.
            
jo> "apostolic", i.e. the authority given by Christ to the apostles remains with
jo> the Church, again signified visibly by the laying on of hands at the        
jo> consecration of a bishop by a previously consecrated bishop. 

This again would exclude a number of christian denominations from having Christ's
authority. Contrary to this, I adhere to the view that every Christian
believer is given authority by Christ.

mw>BTW (and this may puzzle some of you) I belong to both the RC and the Lutheran
mw>church, since both a Catholic and a Lutheran priest were 'performing' my mw>baptism.

Again, let me elaborate. I was also confirmed into the RC church later, as well as into the Lutheran church. Thus I belong to both the Roman Catholic and Protestant Church. I am currently attending a Lutheran church, but I'll go to a
RC church anytime.

I think I didn't quite get what you meant by the following sentence:

jo> Comunion of faith and sacramental life with the RC church makes you an RC.

Peace,
Matt Will <igd.fhg.de>
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