HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: krissie@locus.com (Krissie Griffiths)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Yves Burger Burgers
Date: 17 Aug 92 19:12:17 GMT
Organization: Locus Computing Corporation, Los Angeles, California

In article <2920@voodoo.UUCP> das@voodoo.boeing.com (Deb Schwartz) writes:
>>
>I love the Wieners, especially the chili ones.  With whole-wheat wiener buns,
>organic sourkraut (sp) and relish, mustard and ketchup - great quick meal.  I
>take some with me whenever I go to a barbeque (although you really have to
>watch them carefully on a grill - they go from cooked to burned very fast), 
>and have persuaded several carnivore types to try them - responses have
>ranged from a surprised 'They're not bad!' to 'I like them better than real
>hot dogs'.
>
oh hold the phone, the best way i have found, is to cut them up in some
vege baked beans with a bit of b-b-q sauce.  hot dogs and beans!!!!!!!

i got my meat eating somone special (MESS tm) to eat them for dinner one
night and he was quite pleased.  of course that was a weekend when he was
forced to eat two vegan meals.  actually he is very good about it and almost
always enjoys his vegan meals.

and yes, dogs with sauerkraut and mustard are most definitely a staple.

i got some of the burger burgers this past weekend, i had them but the jury
is still out for me.  i think i will try another way of cooking them.  
perhaps in a teflon pan and dry fry, i nuked the ones i had saturday.  they
were ok, but it could have been that i punted and had them on bagels with
all the usual stuff, catsup, mustard and vegan mayo.  i think i should try
more traditional bread stuffs the next time.

i do think that yves does make some of the best vegan products.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Nutritional information
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:54:39 GMT
Reply-To: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Organization: COMANDOS Project, Glesga Yoonie

> According to the U.S. Department of Agriculture:
> 1 California avocado (173 grams without skin and seed) contains:
>	   4.5 grams of saturated fat
>	   19.4 grams of mono-unsaturated fat
>	   3.5 grams of poly-unsaturated fat
> 1 Florida avocado (304 grams without skin and seed) contains:
>	   5.3 grams of saturated fat
>	   14.8 grams of mono-unsaturated fat
>	   4.5 grams of poly-unsaturated fat

Non-portable nomenclature strikes again... are these what the rest of the
world calls Hass (small purple ones with knobbly skin) and Fuerte (large
green ones with smooth skin)?

-- 
--  Jack Campin    room G092, Computing Science Department, Glasgow University,
17 Lilybank Gardens, Glasgow G12 8RZ, Scotland   TEL: 041 339 8855 x6854 (work)
INTERNET: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk or via nsfnet-relay.ac.uk    FAX: 041 330 4913
BANG!net: via mcsun and uknet     BITNET: via UKACRL    UUCP: jack@glasgow.uucp
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: Rich & Michael
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 06:50:42 GMT

angelab@vcd.hp.com (Angela Byington) writes:

>Hello rec.food.veg,

. . . .
>I rarely read
>this group any more.  Why?  Because the group has gone sour.  Originally
>the source of inspiration, this group has become so filled with
>venom and ridicule that it causes me grief just to read it.

I am very sorry to hear that, but we should more observe
that only a few of our omnivorous friends are making the eristic, rude and
insulting remarks, most likely out of a needy defensiveness with respect
to their current unexamined habit of meat-eating.


>I think the thing that saddens me the most, is when I think of all
>the innocent people who tune into this group for the first time, to
>be shocked or disgusted into never coming back. They tune in for all
>sorts of reasons.  Guidance, curiosity, recipes, information, whatever.
>And we may not agree with those reasons.  But they *did* tune in, and
>I think that says something.

Very true indeed.


>I would hope that we are all mature enough to ignore the occasional
>trouble maker - without encouragement they usually go away.
>. . .

Unfortunately, this seems not to be the case.  Some people 
interpret our silence as some kind of consent by default.

Occasionally, a vegetarian has to make some comment about the 
interminable quibbling against the evident advantages of vegetarianism.
I also think that maybe we also have to at least make the attempt 
to point out to those who lapse into making rude remarks and outright
insults how very callow and uncalled for such remarks really are on
this conference.
e

>In the meantime, thanks, but no thanks.  I'm leaving this group to
>find a kinder way of spreading the word, and sharing food and experiences
>with people who share my ideal for a way of life.

Well, I am indeed sad to see you go; after all this conference 
is really for people like yourself and not for the begruding or
hostile meat-eater who cannot show due respect and civility towards
that which would seriously question this unexamined habit to consume
meat.

                              ted
.
From: dsouza@hplred.HP.COM (Roy D'Souza)
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 19:58:54 GMT
Subject: Re: more on fruitarianism
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg


Hi Gregory,

Is a fruitarian diet 'complete' or 'adequate' according to
the state of the art in nutrition?

Thanks,

Roy

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: hharley@athena.mit.edu (a goofy newfie)
Subject: Re: fat in butter and margarine
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:06:58 GMT


haven't read the intro to this discussion, but it seems to me from
the description of "grams of fat per serving" discrepancies between
butter and margarine that the difference arises because the amount of a
"serving" is left undefined - I bet butter companies say "4 grams of
fat per serving" thinking that a serving is 4 grams (ha!) and the margarine
people think a serving is 11 grams, or 6 grams, or whatever....
Heidi
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: traub@btcs.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub)
Subject: Re: Rich & Michael
Organization: BT Customer Systems, Brighton, UK
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 07:52:36 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.181641.15059@dircon.co.uk> uad1214@dircon.co.uk (Peter Cox) writes:
>McCartney book - yes, it's aimed at meat-eaters.  Many of
>the recipes are dairy-based - I wrote it several years ago
>now, and I actually went vegan during its writing, which
>made it more difficult to finish.  Its turned many people
>onto the vegetarian idea, so I'm still proud of it.

Well, I looked at it but couldn't find much of interest. Let me
know when you publish a Vegan Cookbook!

>The magazine - I started it, took the publishers the idea
>and was its editor for four months pre-launch.  They
>treated me very badly, I'm afraid, and I feel ripped off.
>It's become a very cynical thing, now.  The editor who took
>over from me wasn't even vegetarian.

That's bad, I was hoping the opposite was the case.

>My rec - don't buy!

Sorry, I've already bought the second issue:->



-- 
Michael Traub
From: jcbbalt@rocky8.rockefeller.edu (JCB Editor)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Wool Machines
Date: 19 Aug 92 14:43:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: rockyd.1992Aug19.104352.16535
Reply-To: jcb@rocky8 (JCB Editor)
Organization: Rockefeller Univ.,N.Y.C 10021

In article <CINDY.92Aug9191039@meshugge.media.mit.edu> cindy@meshugge.media.mit.edu (Cindy Blank-Edelman) writes:
>Anyone have advice on what other kind of clothing to wear which *is*
>cruelty-free and which provides the warmth of wool?
>
>Thanks.
>
>--Cindy Blank-Edelman

I have a terrible feeling that I am about to show myself as not too
bright...
I have always assumed that wool could be obtained in a non-cruel 
manner.
Could someone enlighten me, please.
E-mail if this is not relevant to the newsgroup.
carson
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: rfelix@netcom.com (Robbie Felix)
Subject: Re: calcium (was: Tofu, fat and protein)
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 92 15:55:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Aug21.142348.25636@news.eng.convex.com> tchrist@convex.COM (Tom Christiansen) writes:
>From the keyboard of abrams@binah.cc.brandeis.edu:
>:For people who don't drink milk, tofu is 
>:a great food.  Especially for women, who need lots of calcium to
>:prevent osteoporosis.  
>
>Could you please document studies correlating calcium intake
>with decreased bone loss?  The only studies I'm aware of
>correlate protein consumption with bone loss: the more protein
>you eat above what you need, the more calcium you piss out,
>because it's leached from your bones to metabolize the protein.

Most studies seem to indicate that excercise is the best way to
strengthen bones, the countries of the world with high osteoporosis
are the ones who consume the most calcium in the form of dairy
products.

The original poster, doing regular excercise, is less likely to need
to increase calcium than those more sedentary...

rf




>
>--tom
>-- 
>    Tom Christiansen      tchrist@convex.com      convex!tchrist
>
>The probability of someone watching you is proportional to the
>stupidity of your action.


Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: akcobb@amherst.edu
Subject: Good, no-fat soymilk?? (ignore first one)
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst Mass.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 01:01:03 GMT


Sorry, first post got garbled.  I tried asking about Soy-moo before, but
got no response.  How about a more general question about soymilk?

I am trying to go vegan, but am having a hard time finding a replacement
for skim milk.  All the soymilks I have found have a ridiculously large
amount of fat in them.  Edensoy light is the best I have found, but I have
no idea how it tastes.  Does anyone know of a NO fat soy milk that is
easily attained and tastes good?  Thanks thanks thanks for any help
on this at all.  Recipe to be posted soon, if I can figure this
mailer out!

Amy
From: saarinen@sp1.csrd.uiuc.edu (Sirpa Saarinen)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: I love red meat! I love sugar!
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:41:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: csrd.1992Aug12.164113.21981
Organization: UIUC Center for Supercomputing Research and Development

chandy@marais.inria.fr (Chandra SHEKHAR) writes:

>Simple. Visit the coronary ward of the hospital near you.
>Collect statistics on the number of persons under 50 in 
>the US who die of heart disease and diabetes every year.
>Find out how it feels to have a heart attack.

>What I am trying to get at is that in order to make any
>real, lasting change in your lifestyle, you have to be 
>highly motivated --- you should actually be able to *feel*
>the harm red meat, sugar, salt, etc. do to you. You should
>be able to visualise your blood thickening and your arteries
>choking each time you eat a hamburger or a steak. You cannot
>give up red meat (or cigarettes, or any other addiction)
>for the abstract goal of being "healthy". You have got to
>realize the prize you pay for unhealthy habits.

Yes, this is probably the way to go (I was able to drop the meat, salt & fish
in less graphical ways). However, I have another somewhat related 
question about arteries and eating fat. 

Is it so that every meal might contribute to the fat in the arteries and 
do also *slim* people have this problem? I.e. can you be slim *and* get 
clogged arteries? I have often thought about this, since people around me 
(in my office) eat hamburgers and junk food and still stay slim. Do their 
arteries also clog or not? Or is it a very long term thing?

thanks,
Sirpa Saarinen
saarinen@csrd.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: leel@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Lee Lawrence)
Subject: Re: more on fruitarianism
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 14:04:56 GMT

Here is an additional reference on Fruitarianism:

     "The No-Cooking Fruitarian Recipe Book" by Sheila Andrews (1975)
     Thorsons Publishers Limited, Wellingborough, Northhamptonshire 

     It includes roughly 180 recipes and two _brief_ appendices on 
     changing to fruitarianism, and fruitarianism for children.
     I don't know if this book is still in print.

Since I'm not fruitarian, and I don't really use the book, which
cost $5.95 originally, I'll sell my own copy for $5.00 shipping included
anywhere in U.S.

Lee Lawrence
leel@tigger.cs.colorado.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: sploke@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (;-})
Subject: Vegetarian: I don't like vegetables.
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 20:23:37 GMT


hi,

When I became a vegetarian, I always felt bad to call myself a vegetarian.
Why? Simple, I don't like vegetables and usually don't eat them, unless I 
have nothing else to eat. The most frequent asked question by my roomate 
was:" Why do you call yourself a vegetarian? You don't even eat vegetables"

Before, I had to deal with 2 kinds of questions:
-- Do you eat fish, chicken .....? 
-- Why do you call yourself a vegetarian ? You don't even eat vegetables? 

Now, I don't have to deal with both because I am a vegan. Whenever I tell
my friends that I am a vegan, I have to explain what vegan is. There you
go. So, nobody will ask me the questions aboved.

Does anyone have the same problem before?? You called yourself vegetarian
and everybody else expects you to like vegetables!! But by defination,
vegetarian simply means one does not eat meat. I eat salad only when I went
to restaurant and found nothing else that I want to eat. I eat vegetable 
( at home ) about once or twice a month on average. 


Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: Rec.food.veg's health warning.
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 05:28:59 GMT


>>>>Michael Traub writes:
>>>>In  an  attempt  to  keep  flaming  down  regarding  such individuals their
>>>>postings  would  simply  be  ignored  except for a small followup directing
>>>>gentle readers to the health warning.
>>
>>>Steve Dyer rudely replies:
>>>Well, if you stopped posting all together the problem would be
>>>solved rather neatly

>>Ted altar jumps in:
>>Well, I initially had my doubts and reservations about Michael Traub's
>>suggestion to help obviate flaming, but after reading your rude and
>>inapproate response I am beginning to now think that Michael Traub's
>>suggestion has some real merit and should be seriously considered.
>>It is regretable that such a "prophylaxis" would be required, but
>>I guess the sincere and inquiring reader deserves better than this
>>kind of pointless posting of rude and mean-spirited remarks that you
>>have here lapsed into making.

Steve Dyer:
>Duh.  It was sarcasm, responding to the obvious-to-most fact that
>Traub is in no position to be calling anyone else rude.  He's one
>of the rudest, especially when some of his beliefs are called into
>question.  Now, I don't happen to see that as a "problem" which needs
>a solution, but Traub does.  I offered a "modest proposal" as a solution.

An insult by any other name . . .

What you called a "sarcasm" is still a rude remark.  Michael Traub
presented a reasonable proposal to the real problem of flaming
and rude interjections by some defensive ominvores who are not able
to make a postive contribution.  What you offer is no solution
at all but merely an insult to one the most assiduous posters
who has benefited this conference with his ORIGINAL recipes,
his HELPFUL information, and even his SHARP remarks to those
who would attempt to undermine the purpose of this conference
to provide useful information about vegetarianism to fellow
vegetarians or to people who wish to seriously consider the advantages
of such a dietary change.  The purpose of your remark was simply
to be destructive and not to be constructive.  You are fooling
no one if you claim otherwise. 

                                         ted
.
.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: traub@btcs.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub)
Subject: Re: Between the Fats/Oils
Organization: BT Customer Systems, Brighton, UK
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 11:59:32 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.010312.23820@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>In article <1992Aug10.081755.4324@rtf.bt.co.uk> traub@rtf.bt.co.uk (Michael Traub) writes:
>>Actually all the available research seems to indicate that for a *vegan*
>>a *typical* (i.e. low percentage of saturates) high fat diet has no
>>nastier side effect than excess calories (and the general problems
>>of obesity).
>
>I don't think so.  A lot depends on your genes.

Yes, I should have said for a *typical* vegan (as I have already stated in
another article).

>>For some people a reduction of fat intake below 20% can give rise to
>>a number of skin complaints.
>
>???  I've never heard this.  People need very little linoleic acid
>(less than a tsp/day).

People  with  eczematic  conditions  may  require  more, though eczema is a
funny thing, what works for one sufferer does not work for another.

As  a  matter  of  interest what is the percentage of linoleic acid in say,
corn  oil?  How  many  tablespoons  of oil does that work out to? What does
that work out to in terms of fat/calories for a typical 2500 calorie diet?

>>What I am trying to say is that for vegans I don't think fat is an issue.
>
>That's much too strong an assertion.

I  don't  see  why.  I  have  not  seen  any  *proof*  that  consumption of
unsaturated fats is harmful to vegans.

>It's probably the case, though,
>that a vegan diet will be lower in fat, and especially saturated fat,
>than one with animal products.

Most  vegans  consume  a  goodly amount of fat. The average vegan intake of
fat  by  calories  is around 34% according to 'Vegan Nutrition, A Survey of
Research'  by  Gill Langley. In that case vegans should be just as prone to
many  of  the diseases associated with excessive fat intake as omnivores as
people  like  MacDougall  insist  that  more  than  10%  fat by calories is
dangerous.  This  does not however appear to be the case. I would postulate
that  the  typical  vegan  diet  which  consists  of  a large proportion of
unsaturated fats in terms of the total fat intake is not harmful. Any proof
to the contrary will be accepted.


-- 
Michael Traub
From: red_trek@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: hair thinning (off topic to rec.food.veg)
Date: 12 Aug 92 23:13:41 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

Kathy:  I am not a biologist/doctor/nurse/nutritionist etc,
so I'm not familiar with all the "side effects" of switching
to a vegetarian diet, nor am I neccessarily familiar with all the
possible causes of hair loss.  It seems to me concievable, though,
that you might have alopecia areata.

I'm a 22 year old woman, and I've been gradually eating less meat
only in the past year or so (though drastically cut down on "fatty"
meats -- red, pork, ham --since high school years).  I started losing 
some of my hair, however, when I was about eight years old, due to
alopecia areata.  The few bald spots I had soon grew in again, but
a while later I started getting bald spots again.  Ever since junior high,
I've been about 70-90% bald, and wearing a wig.

What happens in alopecia, essentially, is tht the body becomes "allergic"
to hair.  The body attacks the hair, making it fall out faster than it 
should, often in clumps (unlike male pattern baldness).  The hair follicles
(again, unlike male pattern baldness) are left alone.  The hair CAN
grow in again.  Then it can fall out again.

Alopecia can start in childhood or adulthood, and varies in severity.

About one million people in the United States has alopecia (assuming 
portions hold in the rest of the world, this works out to about 
twenty million ppl world wide).

Sometimes alopecia can be treated, sometimes not (in my case, not).  It cannot
be cured, however.  It may be genetic (about one out of five people with
alopecia also have a relative with the same condition; I have a cousin
who also has alopecia).

Sorry, I know this isn't really vegetarian related-- I got on the soap box
here :-).

Kathy, I'd encourage you to contact a dermatologist for a more expert
opinion.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: stvnolan@oneb.almanac.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Yoghurt Maker
Summary: Yoghurt maker suggestion
Date: 14 Aug 92 02:43:06 GMT
Organization: The Old Frog's Almanac, Nanaimo, B.C.

asathaye@pns.ece.cmu.edu (Archana Sathaye) writes:

> Hi,
> 
> I was wondering if any of you netters own a "Yoghurt Maker (YM)".
> If yes, I have several questions:
> 
>             o Which Brand?
>             o Where can I get it?
>             o Does the Yoghurt made in the YM taste the same always?
>             o How much does it cost?
 
I own a "Salton" yoghurt maker but hardly ever use it..  IMHO, the best 
yoghurt maker you're going to find is a stainless steel, wide-mouthed 
thermos.  Pour in the cultured "milk" and let sit for 10 hours.  Presto!  
(Incidentally, I use milk in quotes, as I'm vegan and make vast quantities 
of soy yoghurt rather than dairy yoghurt..)
 
 -Steve.

           stvnolan@oneb.almanac.bc.ca (Steve Nolan)
     The Old Frog's Almanac  (Home of The Almanac UNIX Users Group)    
(604) 245-3205 (v32)    <Public Access UseNet>    (604) 245-4366 (2400x4)
        Vancouver Island, British Columbia    Waffle XENIX 1.64  
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: cass8806@elan.glassboro.edu (KYLE CASSIDY)
Subject: Re: Ideas for a persuasive speech on vegetarianism
Organization: Glassboro State College, Glassboro, NJ
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 16:52:24 GMT

In article <46606@shamash.cdc.com> mdk@michael.udev.cdc.com (Mike D. Kail) writes:
 
>I ... have to give a persuasive speech.  I am thinking
>about doing it on the benefits of vegetarianism, but am having
>a hard time coming up with a main focal point....etc

rather recently i saw a single sheet of paper called "how to win an argument 
with a meat eater" it was filled with all sorts of neat facts. perhaps 
someone has a copy? if so, please post it, because i'd like one myself.

kc
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: krissie@locus.com (Krissie Griffiths)
Subject: Re: Are there any reasonably priced cruelty free products???
Organization: Locus Computing Corporation, Los Angeles, California
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:07:25 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.191742.14006@cci632.cci.com> agc@cci632.cci.com (Anupama Chathampally - co-op) writes:
>
>	I just went to the body shop yesterday and spent $16+ on a deoderant,
>and a tiny bottle each of shampoo and conditioner.  I love getting cruelty free

well the body shop is expensive, no doubt about it.

>products but I can't afford them.  I just looked through the FAQ list and saw
>a bunch of other places.  Before I write to these places does anyone have any
>recommendations on places that are more reasonably priced and have good stuff?

as for shampoo, i have used nature's gate herbal or rainwater shampoos for
years and years and years, and their herbal conditioner.  i love the stuff.

you should be able to get it at any health food store.  well at least here
on the west coast you can.  i seem to think i saw it in new england as well.

toms of maine makes a number of deodorant products, people on the net have
raved about them, watch for endorsements.

there are a lot of products that are much more reasonably priced but you
need to find a good health food/natural food store.

best of luck.

kg
From: prashant@cs.pitt.edu (Prashanth Cannanbilla)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Veg Cutlets.
Date: 18 Aug 92 15:18:45 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept., University of Pittsburgh


People:

Hi, Would any one out there be knowing how to go about making 
Veg. Cutlets? Also since the cutlets I have eaten (in India and U.K)
seem to be fried, if some one could provide a recipe where I could
Grill/Nuke/Bake instead of fry. I looked at the Univ Book stores but
failed to find anything on Cutlets. 

Thankx in Advance,
-P.
--
My .signature has been truncated due to government cutbacks.
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