From: kane@buast7.bu.edu (Hot Young Star)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,ca.politics,ba.politics
Subject: Flowcharts for the Logically Challenged (WAS Re: Why "Child Abuse Causes Homosexuality" Really Doesn't Fly
Date: 16 Oct 92 20:16:23 GMT
Followup-To: talk.politics.misc
Organization: Astronomy Department, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA

Folks, this will be my last post on this subject in this newsgroup. I prefer
to conduct any further discussion via e-mail, for two reasons. First, I can
handle the time to respond to specific e-mailings, but I can't get enough time
to carefully wade through all of the net postings. Second, I feel the least
I can do for the *.politics.* newsgroups is to free up some bandwidth for real
political discussion, seeing that there are less than three weeks to the
election!

ALL FOLLOWUPS TO ME:

In article <12745@optilink.UUCP> cramer@optilink.UUCP (Clayton Cramer) writes:

>the circumstances that cause a molestation victim to become a pedophile
>are apparently quite specific.

I thought I would do the following to illustrate why homosexuality does not
have to be a part of the victim-abuser cycle: Post flowcharts! (After all,
I AM a computer semi-geek! :-)

This will come in handy for those who wish to continue the debate in e-mail
or in another, more appropriate newsgroup. I would recommend printing out
this article so that the "graphics" don't get misaligned by the automatic
response indentations, etc.


Cramer Scenario:
__________
|  girl- |
| abuser |<------- ??? WHAT CAUSES MEN TO ABUSE GIRLS ???
----------
    |
    v
__________       ___________________	   _______________
| victim |------>| low self-esteem |------>| promiscuity |
----------	 -------------------	   ---------------
    ^			  |
    |			 ???<---isn't the causal relationship reversed ???
    |			  v
----------	 -------------------
|  boy-	 |	 |  homosexuality  |
| abuser |	 -------------------
----------		/   \
    ^		      /      \
    |		     v        v
-----------	---------  ----------
| ego -	  |     | gay   |  | lesbian|-------->  ???
| dystonic|<----| male  |  ----------
-----------     ---------   ________________
		    |	    |self-accepting|
		    ------->|gay male	   |----->only way for male out of
		    	    |--------------|	  the loop

=============================================================================

Kane Scenario:

___________________			      _____________________
| "plastic brain" |	  _____________	      |	genetic/ 	   |
|  (natural	  |------>| sexuality |<------| prenatal/	   |
|  bisexuality)   |	  -------------	      | family environment |
-------------------		|	      ----------------------
			       ---
			     /    \	      ________________________
			   /	   \	      | cultural / religious |
			  v	    v	      |	   condemnation      |
      ________	   -----------	------------- ------------------------
      | not  |<----| hetero  |  | homo / bi |------------>|
      |abused|     -----------  -------------		  v
      --------		|	      |		-------------------
		________v____  	      >	------->| low self-esteem |<--- ???
		|    low    |     ----^-----	-------------------
	??? --->| self-estm.|<----| victim |		/  \  \___>promis-
	       /------|------	/ ----^-----	      /      \     cuity
promiscuity<_/ _______v_      /       |		     v        v
	       | girl- | ___/	 boy- |     ------------   ---------------
	       | abuser|	  abuser<---| ego-     |   | eventually  |
	       ---------		    | dystonic |   | self-accept |
					    | male     |   | (not abused |
					    | (probably|   | necessarily)|
					    |  abused) |   ---------------
					    ------------
==============================================================================

Note that in both scenarios, the way out of the male victim-abuser cycle is
through self-acceptance. (Which is a good argument for promoting open
acceptance of adult homosexuality!)

Clayton's theory doesn't address how girl-molesters are created. It also
doesn't take into account cultural and religious condemnation of homosexuality.

My scenario can explain both types of pedophiles, given that low self-esteem
can be caused by a multitude or reasons, not only sexual abuse. Likewise,
gay men can suffer low self-esteem due to cultural and religious reasons, and
not necessarily only from being abused.

My explanation of what actually CAUSES sexuality is left open, as no one
actually knows. It could be either of the two factors which I have "flowing"
into a sexuality.

Brian
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
kane@{buast7,astro}.bu.edu (Hot Young Star) Astronomy Dept, Boston University,
Boston, MA 02215. True personal salvation is achieved by absolute faith in
ones true self.
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