HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: os360051@wvnvms.wvnet.edu (T. Kurt Bond)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Q: Orlando flying school/instructor recommendations
Date: 14 Aug 92 21:05:08 GMT
Organization: West Virginia Network for Educational Telecomputing

I'll be visiting Orlando 9/25-10/4, and will have a free day Thursday, 10/1.
I'd like local recommendations for a good flying school or free-lance instructor
for some ground and dual instruction in local procedures, some hood work, some
seeing of sights, etc.  I'll be travelling commercial (_this_ time!), so I'll
need to rent (prefer 172's).  I've heard the traffic patterns in that area can
be quite intimidating for the first-timer, so it seems like a good idea to go
up with a veteran first...

-- 
--
Phil Loftis, PP-ASEL (@135 hrs)
   PDL@mtnet2.wvnet.edu  
   os360051@wvnvms.wvnet.edu
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: joero@microsoft.com (Joe Robison)
Subject: Re: soaring near Seattle?
Date: 21 Aug 92 01:28:08 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.

In article <1992Aug20.090025.24303@microsoft.com> joero@microsoft.com wrote:
> In article <Bt53Cu.7rH@math.uwaterloo.ca> gamiddle@math.uwaterloo.ca wrote:
> > Are there any glider operations within about 2 hours drive of Seattle?
> > Thanks...
> 
> Yep, Evergreen Soaring is based in Arlington, about 45 minutes on I-5

I should mention a couple of others.

Chuckanut Soaring is a rental operation, based at BayView airport.
Bayview is on the road to Anacortes, just west of I-5, and about
30 minutes further north from Arlington (for a total of about 1:15
driving time from Seattle).  They have a couple of Grob 103s, which
are very nice, but prices are higher because it's a commercial
operation, not a club.

There is a club near Enumclaw, southeast of Seattle.  I know very little
about it and have never been there, though I know it is easily within
the 2hours' drive criteria you gave.

A little further afield, there is a club in Hope, east of Vancourver B.C.
That's about 3 hours drive from Seattle.  They're in the mountains, so
they do a lot of ridge and a bit of wave, but there's very little chance
for cross-country soaring.  In fact, if you want to do cross-country
anywhere around Seattle then your only real choice is Ephrata.

Getting completely far afield, there's a new operation in Golden BC.
That's closer to Calgary than Seattle, but since you're coming from
Ontario maybe it's on the way?  I've only flown through there in power
aircraft, but some of the pilots from Ephrata did some soaring up there
and the pictures they brought back were spectacular.  There's no
mountain flying like Rocky Mountain flying.
From: wsanders@ffeine.Sun.COM (Wiley Sanders)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Flames (and bumper stickers)
Date: 17 Aug 1992 17:28:07 GMT
Organization: Tradeshow Tech Support
NNTP-Posting-Host: ffeine.corp.sun.com

Unfortunately, the obscene and harassing responses to Margaret's
(and other women in other newsgroups) postings come through email, not
in postings to the net. There's no way to kill those.

This is a widespread problem that has driven several other women
I know off the net entirely.

Let's see, don't you have to be of "good moral character" to keep
your pilot's license? Would harassment by email be evidence of "bad
moral character"? Hmm, let's hope those that harass are merely
pilot wannabees and not REAL pilots themselves...

-wiley

"Real Naval Aviators treat their ladies with respect...."
     -letter to S.J. Mercury News from a Naval Aviator re. Tailhook :-)
--
"What a waste it is to lose one's mind, or not to
have a mind as being wasteful. How true that is."     -Dan Quayle
From: lihan@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Bruce G. Bostwick)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: DUATS question
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:47:18 GMT
Article-I.D.: ut-emx.77562
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <skip.123.713445342@mitre.org> skip@mitre.org (Skip Guild) writes:
>
>You may get an official answer from CONTEL as they monitor any message on 
>rec.aviation with DUAT in the title, but this is a first reply based on my 
>own experience:   You must be on file with the FAA as a certified flier to 
>get access to DUAT with no restrictions.  Whether this includes student 
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Is it possible to get access to DUAT with 'restrictions' if one is not
a licensed pilot (yet)?  If so, what are the restrictions and how does
one gain this access without a PP-ASEL, etc. ticket number?

Pardon if this is a stupid (or frequently asked) question, but I've
been sitting quietly curious about DUAT for a while and have been
wondering if there was a way for us poor broke fliers-to-be to check
out this service..




-- 
<BGB>
lihan@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu        /     "I can't complain,
(really Bruce Bostwick)        /   but sometimes I still do"
from the great state of TEXAS /         --Joe Walsh--
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: phil@eecs.nwu.edu (William LeFebvre)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: New ARSA question
Date: 12 Aug 92 21:22:05 GMT
Organization: EECS Department, Northwestern University

In article <1992Aug12.052121.25348@StarConn.com>, jpp@StarConn.com (John Pettitt) writes:
|> If ATC gives you `sqwak VFR frequency change approved' while you are
|> still in the ARSA (heading out but some says to go) are you legal ?

EXCELLENT QUESTION!  This very thing happened to me, but I was in a TCA!
My wife and I were on a return trip from Melbourne, Fla to Clearwater.
This is pretty much a straight shot, and I got a TCA transition that took
me right over the 9-27 runways at TPA.  But well before we were out of
the TCA (probably about halfway across the bay and at 2700'), the 
controller said "squawk 1200, contact St. Pete tower on 1XX.X".  "Well,"
I said to myself, "he knows where I'm at and he directed me to change
it, so I can't see arguing about it."  I did what he told me to.

		William LeFebvre
		Computing Facilities Manager and Analyst
		Department of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
		Northwestern University
		<phil@eecs.nwu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: Mark Milbourne <milbouma@esvax.dnet.dupont.com>
Subject: Re:Glider pilots : how many are you ??
X-Xxdate: Wed, 19 Aug 92 13:04:24 GMT
Organization: DuPont CR&D/Scientific Computing Div
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d7
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 17:00:27 GMT

>Subject: Re:Glider pilots : how many are you ??
>From: Rick Lafford, lafford@serum.kodak.com
>Date: 19 Aug 92 12:54:52 GMT

Rather than clutter the net with all the glider pilots posting an article
merely to be "counted", I suggest everyone send a quick e-mail to Rick
and he could post a list.  If Rick doesn't want to compile the list, I
would be willing to do so.

This might give the soaring contingent here in rec.aviation a better
sense of community, to have some sort of list or roster.  It might also
help us meet one another.  Glider pilots can't as easily come to fly-ins,
but we do get around, so a list would be helpful.  I have a personal
example of this:
 
I will hopefully next month be meeting (in person) Walt Martin (whose
news access was unfortunately recently cut off by his employer).  We met
through rec.aviation a while ago and have had some nice e-mail
correspondence about soaring issues.  I will be on vacation next month
near where he flys.  I hope to take the friends I am visiting for a ride
and Walt was helpful in providing directions to the field, as well as
current rental and tow rates.  He will probably be there that day so we
will try to meet in person too and do some "hangar soaring".  :-)

Maybe Geoff could include a line in his regular posting about the list,
or Rick or I could post it every other month which would also encourage
updates and additions.  Maybe other interesting info to include in the
summary would be total hours in gliders and which ones you have time in,
as well as the normal place you fly.  Also mention if you are a student
pilot, private, commercial, CFIG or tow pilot.

Here is a suggested format:
 Your name/email/rating (S,P,C,I[+T])/place your normally soar (name,
city state)/gliders owned or flown (space permitting)

The (S,P,C,I[T]) means use one letter for your rating (student, private,
commercial, instructor) and  add a T if you are also a tow pilot (or just
a T if you are a tow pilot only).

An example - using myself.
Mark Milbourne/milbouma@esvax.dnet.dupont.com/P/New Garden, Toughkenamon
PA/2-33,1-26

If this is too much for 80 characters, we could go to a two line format.

It would probably be best to wait for Rick to post that he's willing to
compile this.  If not send to me and I will do it.

Mark Milbourne
-- 
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: fskevin@mars.lerc.nasa.gov (Kevin R. Kirtley (SVER))
Subject: Re: MD88 ice detectors
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date: 12 Aug 1992 12:51 EDT  

In article <1992Aug11.175317.3450@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM>, hutton@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (ed Hutton ext. 6488) writes...
>       A friend of mine was recently flying as a passenger on an MD88.
>He noticed a small (6 inch) lanyard in a yellow triangle placed closed to
>the fuselage. He asked the aircrew what was the purpose of this device.
>The response was that they were for ice detection. Does anyone know how
>these devices work?
> 
 If if wiggles there aint no ice; if it dont wiggle yous got ice.

Kevin Jethro Kirtley
SWPL
From: phil@eecs.nwu.edu (William LeFebvre)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Where oh where is mpuckett?
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:59:39 GMT
Organization: EECS Department, Northwestern University

In article <1992Aug13.200750.3107@SSD.intel.com>, earlb@ssd.intel.com (Earl Brabandt) writes:

|> I hope Margaret doesn't mind if I relate this but I ran into her at OSH and 
|> I believe the flames awhile back were unfair to her and she's now kind 
|> of burned out (so to speak) on Rec.Av from them--thus no recent postings.  

And I don't blame her.  Not one little bit.  Some people on this list
acted absolutely DEPLORABLY during the spin discussion/argument/flame fest.
There seem to be some people on this list that are absolutely adamant
about expressing their own ideas as fact, and to hell with everyone else.
Well folks, flying knowledge and technique are important, yes.  But
another person's *feelings* are far more important.  Now a great
contributor to this list has taken leave of our "company".  Seems to me
that this has happened before, no?  Well maybe we can learn something
from it this time?  Somehow I doubt it.

Remember the "discussion" about continuting a night flight without an
alternator?  And now we have the developing flame fest over S turns and
360s (in which my flying abilities have already been indirectly maligned
with comments like "shouldn't be flying without an instructor").

And like margaret, I too am getting pretty sick of it.  No wonder there 
are so many lurkers out there.  Everyone is AFRAID to say anything for
fear of being royally toasted by those who think they know better.  There
is one incident which happened to me which I did not and will not post
about here, because I quite honestly do not want to put up with the
negative reaction that some may have to the decisions I made.

So much for "global hangar flying".  Seems like this list tends more
towards "global weiner roasting" at the expense of certain people's
feelings and emotions.

		William LeFebvre
		Computing Facilities Manager and Analyst
		Department of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
		Northwestern University
		<phil@eecs.nwu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: smp2@piper.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Steve Payne)
Subject: Speaking of DUAT - AGAIN
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 14:23:32 GMT

Sorry folks.  I'm new to rec.aviation AND my new Sun environment.  It has been 
pointed out that my posting had some shortcomings.  I will hasten to fix them
by reposting the article and then caring for some of the addressing problems.

Here it is.

Did you know that apparently DUAT sometimes edits NOTAMs? A month or so ago I was planning a trip to the air show at Atlantic City, NJ and DUAT had the standard airport closing 1 0r 2 liner.  After getting some contradictory info from some of the airshow participants, I decided to call the FSS.  They said the complete NOTAM actually said the airport was closed between certain hours AND that NO TRANSIENT PARKING would be available all day.  The end result - you couldn't fly in for the show!  The briefer sai

d they'd had a number of very unhappy pilots because of it. Does anyone know how common this editing is and do they edit stuff that could result in some safety problems?  This time the only consequence was my friend and I had to change plans at the last minute, but.... I wonder about the next time on some more crucial NOTAM!!!

Steve Payne
smp2@piper.bellcore.com    

ps: We ended up having another proverbial $100 burger.
 
ps2: While my domains are not identified, some of you,at least, got tome
      at the above e-mail address.

Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: cep@taligent.com (Christophe Pettus)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Flying to Oregon: Questions.
Date: 20 Aug 92 22:12:09 GMT
Organization: Taligent, a little subsidiary of two really big companies.

In article <176@simsol.UUCP> jimm@simsol.UUCP (Jim Morris) writes:
>In article <1992Aug20.010320.23589@sol.UVic.CA>, mvogel@sirius.UVic.CA (Mark  Vogel) writes:
>> The thought is to maybe clear customs in Portland and investigate a
>
>I would clear customs at Port Angeles or Boeing Field if I were you.  They are
>better equipped to handle customs arrivals.  Also, you might not want to land
>at Portland (see below).

Clearing customs at PDX was perfectly painless the one time I did it;
they were friendly, relatively efficient, and polite.  I'd definitely
not make a separate special stop just to clear customs elsewhere.
--
-- Christophe

"Be calm.  Look cute."
From: tpickett@auspex.com (Tom Pickett)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Flying/Driving Habits
Date: 21 Aug 92 23:44:36 GMT
Reply-To: tpickett@auspex.com (Tom Pickett)
Organization: Auspex Systems, Inc.  Engineering

In article <1992Aug21.170829.2887@linus.mitre.org>, gary@clarinet.mitre.org 
(Gary Bisaga) writes:
> How about: starting to pull back on the steering wheel when you reach
> rotation speed?  (Of course, this is probably not much of a problem if you
> fly 737s, but for us Cessna pilots ...)

I hate to admit this, but gosh I fly a Tiger and when I'm driving
I find I'm nervous whenever I get below 70.  It's getting kinda
difficult around town...:-)


Tom Pickett 
tpickett@auspex.com
SHO  GOZE
From: hdnea@usho92.hou281.chevron.com (David Neal)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: exit
Date: 13 Aug 92 19:33:06 GMT
Organization: Chevron

In article <1992Aug12.194555.1@pomona.claremont.edu> jhenderson@pomona.claremont.edu writes:
>Hello there,
>
>In light of recent postings about life insurance for pilots, I thought I'd
>share my recent findings with the net.
>
>First, some background about myself and my policy.
>
>I got my PP-ASEL last December, have about 75 hours as PIC, and have a
>whole life insurance policy with Farmers.
>
>Here's what my agent told me yesterday:
>
>. if you get your policy before you get your license, nothing changes.
>
>. if you get your policy after getting your license, you will have to
>  pay $2.50/$1000 coverage/year until you accumulate 100 hours as PIC,
>  then if you fly between 200 and 500 hours a year, the surcharge drops
>  completely. Less than 200 or more than 500 carries that same $2.50
>  as detailed above.
>

That's true for Farmers and Farmers only. Every company has their
own rules -- check with your agent and shop around for the best
deal.


My dad was an officer in the Armed Forces and so I can get insurance
through USAA. Their rider for pilots is ~.30/$1000. It's ~.60/$1000
if you want to fly aerobatics. And that's expensive. If I were
a fighter jock I think it would be ~.18/$1000. (Military folks
get big discounts with USAA)

Another company I looked at had a rider that was $3.50/$1000 but
went away after you got 150 hours as PIC.

The only definitive answer is shop around and ask questions.


>______________________________________________________________________________
>Javier Henderson, N6VBG         | Beat the 55mph limit (legally):
>jhenderson@pomona.claremont.edu | Learn to fly!


-- 
David Neal hdnea@chevron.com So... when... you... fly, stay as calm as the ocean
                             And watch what's going on, behind your shoulder
Quote from Ron Wanttaja      You know the air's not the place for deep emotion
 - prang@ssc-bee.boeing.com  And maybe... you'll get... a little older.
From: pierre@synopsys.com (Pierre Wildman)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Info wanted on Tradewinds Aviation
Date: 17 Aug 92 16:40:12 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: Synopsys

A friend of mine is considering buying an IFR 172, and leasing it back to 
Tradewinds Aviation in San Jose.  Does anyone have good / bad / 
indifferent information on Tradewinds for leasebacks, or just as a club?

Email response is fine.  I will summarize.

Thanks in advance.

Pierre Wildman
Seneca N29461
From: rfh3273@galileo.rtn.ca.boeing.com (Dick Harrigill)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Manuverability of 727
Date: 20 Aug 92 19:44:02 GMT
Organization: Boeing Commercial Airplane Group, Seattle

In article <1450@seqp4.sequoia.com> cantrell@seqp4.sequoia.com (Paul Cantrell) writes:
>He also verified what we've heard before on rec.aviation - that it's
>difficult to get consistently good landings on 727 because of the
>placement of the landing gear.

Dang - I knew we should've put those things on the
bottom of the airplane!

-- 
Dick Harrigill, an independent voice from:     Boeing Commercial Airplanes 
M/S 9R-49  PO BOX 3707                       Renton Avionics/Flight Systems
Seattle, WA  91824                                  Computing Support
(206) 393-9539    rfh3273@galileo.rtn.ca.boeing.com    CDP, PP-ASEL
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: yiannis@ccad.uiowa.edu (Yiannis Papelis)
Subject: Good speakers, fuel management. (was: Osh sig haps)
Organization: CAD-Research, University of Iowa, Iowa City
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 17:31:52 GMT

In some article  harlow@chinet.chi.il.us (Steven A Harlow) writes:
>
>FAA safety seminar.
>The speaker I remember only by his selfassigned title
>of "His Airworthyness".
>He is a Big Iron pilot who gave a humorous and practical talk on
>weather.

I watched a talk from this guy on fuel management once.  Very easy
to remember "His Airworthyness" but can't remember his namy, anybody
knows ?

He is a very good speaker, and uses humour very effectively and seems
to make perfect sense in his talks.  Quite a different flavor from
some of the other guys I've seen who try to throw in silly jokes and
end up looking pitiful.

His talk left a very strong impression on me regarding fuel management.
His logic summarized is this:

The airlines have profesional pilots, superb equipment for
fuel measurement in the tanks, superb equipment for fuel flow measurement,
extensive history and data on engine/airplane performance,
and precise flight planning capabilities due to knowledge of winds
aloft from reports of their own guys through a network of 
specialists BUT they still have a 45 min reserve rule.

In a general aviation cessna/piper/whatever you have low quality gages,
maybe non-existent fuel flow, unreliable data on engine/airplane
performance (especially renters, owners are better of), and generally
not very precise winds aloft information.  In addition, wing tanks
may not hold as much gas as advertised due to folding or sloppy line
personnel.  Overall, when compared to the way the airlines operate, the
general aviation fleet is less equipped but still has the same 30/45 min 
reserve which is very modest.

His recomendation for VFR is 1 hr plus 15 min for each member of your
family, thus a married person with 2 kids needs 1:45 reserve -:)
At the time it sounded funny but the more stuff I read in the net the
more I think it's valid.  I personally have never gone below 2:30
hours left in the tanks yet and I plan to never do.

-- 
Yiannis E. Papelis,            - Electrical & Computer Engineering, U of Iowa
Center of Computer Aided Design- Home of the Iowa Driving Simulator & future
e-mail: yiannis@ccad.uiowa.edu - home of the National Advanced Driving Simulator
From: dfr@usna.navy.mil (PROF D. Rogers (EAS FAC))
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Where oh where is mpuckett?
Date: 15 Aug 92 01:51:27 GMT
Organization: U. S. Naval Academy, Annapolis, MD

In article <1992Aug14.202919.27857@eecs.nwu.edu> phil@eecs.nwu.edu (William LeFebvre) writes:
!In article <1992Aug14.170920.6221@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU!, ginsberg@t.Stanford.EDU (Matthew L. Ginsberg) writes:
!
!I have talked with several people who won't post certain things to
!this group because they just don't want to deal with the potential
!criticism.  And there are now two well-known cases of prominent individuals
!dropping off of rec.aviation because others were too harsh with them.
!This indicates to me that there is something *seriously wrong* with our
!global hangar.  As one individual put it:  "some things I'd rather take up
!with my next checkride DE than post to the net."

I think there is a rather `nice' and effective way to handle unwarranted
or unreasoned criticism on the net. Simply ignore it and don't respond.
With no fuel the flames quickly die out.

Dave Rogers
From: dick.zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com (Dick Zeitlin) 
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: DME Questions
Date: 20 Aug 92 17:27:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Advanced Computer Concepts BBS, New Rochelle, NY 914-654-1981
Reply-To: dick.zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com (Dick Zeitlin) 

MC> .It is possible to id DME the same way a VOR or NDB can be handled.  I have
  > .several questions about this:

MC> .1) Why is it almost never done?

It is.  Or rather, it should be.  I do.

MC> .2) Is the ID on the same carrier as the VOR signal?

The ID is separate, but often (always?) combined with the VOR audio.
There's a cycle of idents.  Three come from the VOR, the fourth comes
from the DME.  If the DME ident is missing, you'll detect a gap in the
VOR idents.  It's also at a different (higher) audio freq.

MC> .3) Is the ID the same as the VOR signal, but at different rate?

Same ident.  See 2)

MC> .4) Is the lack of indication on a DME display a valid indication of
  > .   an unreliable signal and vice versa?

If there's no visible display on the DME, it's definitely unreliable!
<~>  If you mean, is the VOR unreliable if there's no DME display?
Nope.  They're independent.  The DME signal is UHF, the VOR is VHF.  And
lots of other differences.

Check para. 6 and 7 of the AIM.  (The WHAT?  <~> )

        D/

 * OLX 2.2 * Dick.Zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com
                                                                           
Newsgroups: rec.aviation