HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: shore@dinah.tc.cornell.edu (Melinda Shore)
Subject: Re: Support the boycott (was Re: Don't boycott all of Colorado)
Organization: Cornell Theory Center
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 02:38:57 GMT

In article <Nov19.020457.19357@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> wallsj@CS.ColoState.EDU (jeffrey joel walls) writes:
> I know first hand (FIRST HAND) that blacks are *still* discriminated
> against. 

Nobody is saying that they aren't.  It's no longer legal,
however, and doesn't have the patina of respectability that
gaybashing does.  While an end to bigotry is obviously
desirable (and necessary), when African-Americans lose
their jobs or are denied housing because of their race,
they have legal recourse.  And *that*, friend, is a 
direct result of the civil rights movement.

>>And for those (straight and gay alike) who are not
>>participating in a boycott, I think it would be great if
>>you all would write or stamp "GAY $$$" on your paper money
>>(no, it's not illegal) and write it on your checks if you
>>spend money in Colorado.

> No, that would imply that I am gay, and I am definitely straight!  

What, precisely, would be wrong with someone thinking that
you're gay?  If you received a $20 bill with "GAY $$$"
stamped on it from the bank or as change, what would you do
with it?  Would you refuse to spend it, lest some grocery
clerk think that you're (shudder) a homo?
--
           Hate is not a family value.  Boycott Colorado

       Melinda Shore - Cornell Theory Center - shore@tc.cornell.edu
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: What Gay Sex (was Re: How Many Homosexuals?)
Date: 15 Nov 92 20:29:56 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison


In article <1e69nsINNl94@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>
ai888@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Thomas Flesher) writes:

>anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:

>>Part of the whole dilemma here, I guess, is that you are
>>seeking precision of some certain kind, whereas I am
>>deliberately avoiding that.

>Yes, that's the problem. 

Just part of the problem, I said, not "the problem."

>You're deliberately avoiding precision 
>("of some certain kind" you say; of any kind, I'd say), 

I think there was plenty there for you to get a grip on, if
you chose to.  If you don't, well, you don't.

>and I 
>cannot hope to understand you if you won't even try to be precise.

Again, your proclivity to distort what others say into your
own mindset is showing; I wrote what I wrote for a reason.
I was exactly as precise as I knew how to be, and I said
why.  You seem to think only precise things are
comprehensible.  In that case, what would music "mean?"  This
question may seem far afield to you, but I assure you it's
quite on the topic, sex and music having a lot in common.

<> "Number Seven" opened last night.  It was misnamed by five.
<> -- Alexander Woollcott
-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
<>  <>  <> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <>  <>  <>
Newsgroups: soc.motss,soc.bi
From: mlloyd@westmark.Stanford.EDU (Mike Lloyd)
Subject: Re: Oprah 11/19
Organization: DSO, Stanford University
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 16:42:41 GMT

seamus@ravel.udel.edu (James G Dilmore) writes:
: robertl@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Robert Lodenkamper) writes:
[Is nature or nurture correct?]
: >Probably.  But it doesn't matter.
: >
: >- Bob
: >
: In order to apply Jeffersonian government to the movement,
: It does matter.

(Jeffersonian == the only way to set standards of government) NOT!
The "n vs n" question is effectively insoluble just now, so if you need
an answer for any purpose, tough.  Time to replace your framework so you
don't need an answer any more.

hugs
Mike, humming REM's "Jefferson I think we're lost"
-- 
Mike Lloyd, B0/1 h- f- t w- g+ k+ s m- e? |    "Bloody nose and burning eyes
      Retro-hippy, music nut, bi and      |  Raised in laughter to the skies"
          backrubber of devotion          |                 - Bruce Cockburn
               --The end of confusion is the beginning of death--
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Re: Gays in the Australian Military
Keywords: newspaper report
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 23:37:09 GMT

Are the sexual connotations of 'buttering up' an actual basis
of the phrase's use, or are they just a happy accident?

--
John Dorrance        * Sexyfunky Motherfuckerdiva *   thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu

		I bet if you threw that ass into the air
			It'd turn into sunshine!
Newsgroups: soc.motss,soc.bi,alt.homosexual
From: Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde)
Subject: Re: Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual Relatives?
Followup-To: soc.bi
Originator: lunde@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
Reply-To: Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde)
Organization: Ministry of Silly Walks
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 22:48:08 GMT

In article <92328.053515U60145@uicvm.uic.edu> <U60145@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
>     I was wondering, how many of you have relatives that are also
>gay/lesbian/bi?  I myself am bisexual and have an aunt that is lesbian,
>and one of my good friends who is gay has a gay uncle.  I seem to meet
>alot of people with this same situation.  It just seems to me to bring
>the conclusion of genetic choice, not personal choice.

I think I've got a 2nd cousin who is lesbigay, however with the number
of cousins I've got this could well be random chance.




-- 
 Albert Lunde         | Interfaith  |     *Y*Y*      "A branch on the
 Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu |  Bisexual   |      *Y*        tree of life"
 alunde@nuacvm.bitnet |  Feminist   |.......|.........................
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Subject: columbus motss-gathering
Summary: if you're in the neighborhood...
Organization: stanford, outil, osu, lsa,...
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 19:04:58 GMT


you are invited to a (motssish) gathering
  at arnold zwicky and jacques transue's house -
    63 w. beaumont rd., columbus, oh 43214 -
  on friday 4 december, from 5 to 7 or so,
to celebrate the end of fall quarter classes
and to say goodbye to jacques and me before we set off
  for our usual winter in palo alto.

you are welcome to bring guests.
if you think you'll be coming to the gathering, 
  it would help us plan things if you'd let me
  know - by e-mail to zwicky@ling.ohio-state.edu
  or by phone to (614) 262-3017 (messages can be
  left on the answering machine).
we'll supply light things to eat and drink.  if you
  want to bring something, that would be nice, but
  don't feel that you have to.

         - arnold


Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: buckmr@vccnw05.its.rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire)
Subject: Re: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 00:11:38 GMT

Did you know that Marky Mark has THREE NIPPLES?

-- 
RON BUCKMIRE
Fundraising Committee for the Procurement of a mesh tank-top for LL Cool J
11 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735
uunet!rpi.edu!buckmr||buckmr@rpitsmts.bitnet||buckmr@rpi.edu||+1 518 276 8910
Xref: sparky soc.motss:48385 rec.pets.cats:13859
From: barlow@prodigal.psych.rochester.edu (Rebel)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,rec.pets.cats
Subject: Re: gayfolk and cats
Date: 19 Nov 92 03:59:13 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

Brent,
I don't care what anyone else thought about your story but it brought
tears to my eyes :-) Thanks so much for the uplifting moment, it really
helped make a long night at work a little brighter.

Take care,
Jen
Xref: sparky soc.motss:47657 ne.motss:584
From: rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,ne.motss
Subject: Re: NY motss dinner
Date: 15 Nov 92 18:24:09 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1992Nov15.182409.2252
Organization: insert anything here

mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik) writes:
>
>The pro-Chinese-food faction will convene Saturday evening,
>November 28, at 7pm at Sung Hai (West 10th St. and West Street)
>for our autumn roundup.  

	We'll *try* to be there...  really this time.

BBC

P.S. I really *do* like your mitochondria....
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Pink dollar, red circle slash...
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 15:27:16 EDT
Reply-To: ailanth!ailsa@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Organization: Ailanthus Project

thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:

> ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
>
> >am i a stereotypical dyke yet?
>
> Do you:
>
>    o Hate men?

well, when i'm in a bad mood...  strayt boyz make such an easy target.
but i am trying not to scapegoat anymore...

>    o Own an icepick?

nope...

>    o Have a strap-on to intimidate poor defenseless straight
>      women with?

not YET...  *big grin*

>    (big fat smileys all over the place)
>
> >p.s. i ahve a picture to put in the motsspix archive, but not the
> >address to send it to.  could some kind person (bracing myself for a
> >flood of mail) send me the address?
>
> I hope Katy's in the photo, too...
>
not in this one.  just me and the wall of Purgatory Chasm (somewhere in
massachusetts, dunno where).  but when i get a good picture of me &
katy, i'll send it...

                                             -ailsa

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                    ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com
                                                        ________
I don't care what consequence it brings,        Silence \      / Action
I have been a fool for lesser things.              =     \    /    =
                                                 Death    \  /    Life
                                                           \/


Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: gandalf@dworkin.ccs.northeastern.edu (Thomas M Farrell)
Subject: Re: Homosexuals raising children
Organization: College of Computer Science, Northeastern University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 15:13:50 GMT

In article <BxxH8E.D2t@scd.hp.com> mdrayton@sr.hp.com (Mike Drayton) writes:

   Chris Black (black@lester.sybase.com) wrote:
   > In article <BxM8Cz.Jp0@scd.hp.com>, mdrayton@sr.hp.com (Mike Drayton) writes:
   > 
   > |> I finally said "I'm gay" to my 9-year-old son...
   > 
   > One thing you should be aware of (we should all be aware of;  it's
   > pretty horrible) is that a lot of kids today use "gay" as an all-purpose
   > synonym for "bad".  They'll say "that's so gay" in a situation where I
   > and my friends in our youth might have said "that's so stupid".  So
   > maybe it's partly about the associations the word has in his circle.

   Yeah, I imagine so.  I haven't heard things like "that's so gay" in 
   person when I'm around kids that age, but I heard this morning that

I don't know about you, but I've heard it from just about all ages. I heard it
from some kids that looked like they belonged in kindergarden on the way home
from work one day... I spoke to their mother about it and she reprimanded them.
I hear it periodically from some of my closest friends... who are using it
less and less because they're coming to realize that whenever they use the
words "that's so gay" in a negative manner I'm going to chew them out about
sensativity to minorities for the next hour. Last year at Thanksgiving dinner,
one of my aunts (who was the hostess that year) said it, and I looked her
in the eye and told her that she should not say offensive things like that.
She apologized. (She did not yet know I was gay, either.) 

My point is that yes, people say these things often, and it desensatizes our
kids and dehumanizes us. However, it has been my experience that polite but
firm statements that this is not acceptable behavior or speech can have a
positive effect on those around us.

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: Not Enough Sucking on Keanu
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 92 22:00:15 GMT


In article <mattm-151192115055@mcmelmon.apple.com>
mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:

>(who remembers now that Keanu isn't a particularly gifted
>actor;

Not having seen the latest, but based on "Idaho," I'd
call this an understatement of prize-winning proportions.

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
<>  <>  <> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <>  <>  <>
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rhayden@oracle.com (Ronald Hayden)
Subject: Re: Letter from my father
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Belmont, Ca.
	<1992Nov18.055342.4959@macc.wisc.edu>
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 04:57:31 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <1992Nov18.055342.4959@macc.wisc.edu> anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:

   In article <1992Nov17.204906.23339@oracle.us.oracle.com>
   dgilly@us.oracle.com (Daniel Gilly) writes:

   >Yesterday I received a long, surprisingly personal letter
   >from my father, who has recently returned from 5 months in
   >Europe.  I thought I would share the relevant part of it,
   >since the topics raised might be of interest to many people
   >here.

   I'm certainly glad you did this.  I was prompted by it to
   think about my own father, who's been dead for nearly 30
   years, and my mother, who died this past summer, and how
   greatly they contrast one with another in *my own* mind wrt
   my being gay.

   [lots of stuff about his mother and father]

Just wanted to say I really appreciate a message like this.  I learn
more from it than from any hundred messages of people sniping at each
other, and it is the reason I wade through the other hundred
messages...
--

  - Ronald Hayden

    ----------------------------------------------------------------
   | Documentation Manager, Oracle Toolkit Group                    |
   | Co-chair of Oracle Lambda, Oracle's Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual group |
   | Writer, magician, and various other things                     |
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
From: mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein (was Re: Scott Masden)
Date: 16 Nov 92 01:38:11 GMT
Distribution: na,uk
Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA

In article <1992Nov16.005955.8860@pellns.alleg.edu>, mccombj@alleg.edu (The Great Gazoo) writes:
> In article <1992Nov15.172253.29546@spdcc.com> rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob  
> Donahue) writes:
> > >I know a lot of gay people and I respect them,
> > >and you don't have to worry about getting stuck up by a gay dude.
> > >Yo, if you're gay you're in the house, just don't do that shit
> > >around me! Don't try to fuck me!...
> > 
> > 	THIS is *SUPPORT*?
> 
> "Don't try to fuck me" does not imply a lack of support; it only states  
> that such is not _his_ orientation.

  After reading it about three times, I think you're probably
right. It is, however, incredibly crass though. I guess it
is just an artifact of being from Boston though. Right Bob? :-)
-- 

		Michael Thomas	(mike@gordian.com)
	"I don't think Bambi Eyes will get you that flame thrower..."  
		-- Hobbes to Calvin
		USnail: 20361 Irvine Ave Santa Ana Heights, Ca,	92707-5637
		PaBell: (714) 850-0205 (714) 850-0533 (fax)
From: chuck@fourier.ssd.kodak.com (Charles S. Collins 726-9461)
Subject: Re: Sunday N.Y. Times
Organization: Eastman Kodak
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 18:35:21 GMT

In article <rizzoe.444.721927183@FASECON.ECON.NYU.EDU> rizzoe@FASECON.ECON.NYU.EDU (Emily Rizzo) writes:
>Two articles caught my eye in the Sunday New York Times of 11/15
>(in addition to their lead editorial supporting Clinton ending the ban on 
>gays in the military):
>
>2)  And some not so good news:
>
>After more that a decade of trying, a church composed mostly of gay 
>and lesbian congregants has again been rejected in its bid to 
>establish ties with the National Council of Churches, the 
>nation's largest eceumenical organization.
>
>In a 90-81 vote on Thursday at its annual convention in Cleveland,
>the top policy-making body of the National Council of Churches chose
>not to grant observer status to the church, the Universal Fellowship
>of Metropolitan Churches, a denomination that has 50,000 members in 
>264 congregations around the country.
>    


At the risk of seeming self-contradictory (rf. earlier postings), I can't
help but notice the double whammy here.

First we are told by mainline churches that we are not welcome there.
So we form our own churches (MCC), and they choose not to us.

I guess the NCC really wants us all to burn in hell.
-- 
Chuck Collins				Product Software Engineering
chuck@pixel.kodak.com			Eastman Kodak Company
(716)726-9461				901 Elmgrove Road
					Rochester, NY  14653-5811
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jeh@aplcenmp.apl.jhu.edu (Jim Hubbs)
Subject: Re: Homosexuals raising children
Organization: Johns Hopkins Continuing Professional Programs
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 20:40:22 GMT

dgilly@us.oracle.com (Daniel Gilly) writes:

>Again, I applaud your son.  I'm reminded of a foursome (two
>men, a girl, and a boy) I saw marching in the San Francisco 
>Gay Pride, each wearing a white T-shirt with different labels:
>1)  Gay Father
>2)  Other Gay Father
>3)  Gay Father's Daughter
>4)  Gay Father's Daughter's Boyfriend
>Kinda makes you wonder if there shouldn't be a kids' group
>to complement P-FLAG.

There is such a thing.  It's called: Just For Us and it is associated
with the Gay and Lesbian Parents Coalition International.  They
have local chapters in cities in the US and Canada and publish a
newsletter.  

--
Jim Hubbs
Johns Hopkins APL
From: ktfizazi@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Kamal Tayeb Fizazi)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Colleges
Keywords: ivy league, queer positive
Date: 23 Nov 92 02:07:37 GMT
Followup-To: colleges
Distribution: all
Organization: Princeton University
Originator: news@nimaster

In article <1992Nov23.013334.3785@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jlamb@nyx.cs.du.edu (Jeff Lamb) writes:
>I was wondering if anybody out there goes or knows about any of the
>following colleges:
>Lewis & Clark College, Portland OR
>Evergreen State College, Olympia WA
>Western Washington University, Bellingham WA
>Earlham College, Richmond IN
>
>I'm transferring from this school because it is too conservative.  Also, if
>anybody has any suggestions on small & liberal schools, I'll take them.
>
>Thanks a lot,
>Jeff
>
>jlamb@linfield.edu             jlamb@nyx.cs.du.edu
>
what about ivy league schools?


-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=| D (unya) => the world
al-Sayyid Kamal al-Tayib al-Fizazi al-Idrissi :^)| H (anyah)=> is easy/restful
(I must admit, my baraka is still quite dormant!)| S (ma)   => the sky
(would someone help me rouse it? anyone? anyone?)| S (afyah)=> is clear/pure
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: schiles@valentine.us.oracle.com (Suzanne Chiles)
Subject: Re: discrimination at CMU
Reply-To: schiles@us.oracle.com
Organization: Oracle Corporation
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 19:53:58 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

I've been reading this thread with both dread and amusement.  As I spent
my first career as a professional designer and stage manager in both
academic and professional theater, I'd like to add my 2 cents to the
discussion.

I've known and worked with *lots* of effiminate actors and there has
been and always will be roles for them.  Not necessarily "leading man"
roles, but characters roles in abundance.  I've seen some delicious,
quirky, and wonderful performances by effiminate actors, and the theater
would be a sadder place indeed if the drama schools began to turn out
homogenized leading men.  

Suzanne 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Suzanne Chiles				schiles@us.oracle.com
415-506-6194				Oracle Corporation
		      Honor Diversity
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Re: My nervous little boy
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 22:09:26 GMT

adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

>What makes _Cucina Fresca_ so good for a beginning cook
>is that the recipes are for simple (but *very* tasty) Tuscan
>dishes that are meant to be eaten at room temperature.  So
>if you're nervous because you don't know what you're doing
>anyway, you don't have to worry about cooking two or three
>things at once. 

Tuscan? Do Tuscans wear pink? I just don't know about this...

>> But... Joan! What about Joan! She was your mentor! How... what...

>It was time for me to cut the umbilical cord and, free at last,
>soar into the stratosphere.  (OK, so I mixed my metaphors, but
>you get what I mean.)

Oh dear; now Dad's got an afterbirth jet stream. I'm so ashamed...

>> >pollo tonnato.

(Pop! Pop! Dad's speaking in tongues! Call a doctor!!!)

>...sheer heaven.  Homemade bread crumbs
>fried in extra virgin olive oil and tons of garlic.  Garlic,
>red pepper flakes, and olive oil.  Tomatoes and garlic.  Pasta.
>It's *magnificent*.

Oh god; and me in the house with nothing but pb&j to keep me
company. Sigh...

>I'm sorry, Johnny-boy, but I just don't eat that stuff
>any longer.  But we can still cozy up and bond around 
>shrimp in a spicy lime marinade. 

Well, I just don't know. 

>> John, world crumbling to Bac-o's around him

>Arne, wondering what to cook for himself tonight.

Send food.

--
John Dorrance        * Sexyfunky Motherfuckerdiva *   thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu

		I bet if you threw that ass into the air
			It'd turn into sunshine!
From: bcapps@agora.rain.com (Brent Capps)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Scott Masden
Date: 12 Nov 92 15:06:18 GMT
Organization: Open Communications Forum

jpt@telecaster.think.com (James P. Taylor) writes:

>In article <74428@hydra.gatech.EDU> danny.ingram@business.gatech.edu (Danny Ingram) writes:


>   Another short respite from the CO2 war...

>	Does anyone remember Scott Masden, the deliciously androgynous Soloflex
>   model who changed America's vision of the perfect male body and graced the 
>   walls of gay apartments from NY to LA?  I wonder why we haven't seen any more 
>   of his curvasceous form in the advertising world?  Marky Mark may be nice, be
>   he can't hold a well-sculpted candle to Scottie.

>While I agree with the rest of the post and I sure do remember him
>[..except he doesn't grace my walls -- sigh] why do you say he was
>andorgynous?  He weren't no bear, but ...

A former boyfriend of mine who lived near him at the time ('84-85) claimed 
Madsen had acquired something of the status of a celebrity around gay 
parties in New York.  I can't vouch for this, it may have been just another
bar bio.  I do know, however, that Soloflex was very supportive of us
in the campaign against the OCA; I spent part of election evening at
their headquarters in Hillsboro, OR doing last minute get-out-the-vote
phone banking, surrounded by posters of really hunky guys...not enough 
body hair, but I wouldn't kick 'em out of *my* bed.

Last I heard Madsen was living with his sugar daddy in the LA area.
This, of course, could also be a groundless rumor.  But a fun one, as
rumors go...
-- 
Brent Capps                          | Shackles and handcuffs 
bcapps@agora.rain.com (gay stuff)    | and bullwhips that sting
bcapps@atlastele.com (telecom stuff) | these are a few of my favorite things
Newsgroups: soc.motss