HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Date:         Tue, 25 Aug 1992 15:03:59 EDT
From:         Ken Koester <MAINT2@ERS.BITNET>
Subject: Re: THEORY

On Wed, 19 Aug 1992 17:19:00 GMT OUT, OUT - YOU'LL NOT FEEL THE FALL-OUT... said
>        Jazz simply ignores, or at least changes, some of these rules. Its
>structure is much freer. And I remember a famous pianist say that often,
>when an orchestra must play something like "Rhapsody In Blue" by Gershwin
>(which is more or less considered "classical music"), the clarinet players
>have to be borrowed from the world of jazz, because classical musicians
>usually do not know how to play those wild glissandos or, at least, their
>performance is not so satisfactory.
>        This is an opinion, of course, and not even mine. But I believe it
>gives a hint of the enormous complexity of this subject; and, also, that
>a line between classical music and jazz should be drawn. Hell, maybe a dot-
>ted line, but it actually draws itself... :)
>
>        Ciao, Marco "how strange my body feels impaled upon the arrow"

There was a time, about 4 centuries ago, when *every* musician was an
improviser.  Even amateurs could take "figured bass" (ie, the bass line +
indications of 1st/2nd inversion, 7ths, 9ths, Neapolitan 6ths, etc.) and
inprovise 4-part harmony to it; to professionals, that was falling-off-a-log
stuff.  Dance bands *had* to improvise--how else could you keep fresh, playing
the same weary melody a dozen times in a row?  Heck, what A was changed depend-
ing on what town you were in--A440 is a 20th century invention.  If you played
the top line, you were *expected* to ornament the repeats and pretty damn
freely; none of it was written in.  Try figuring out how to notate "notes
inegale", for that matter, when you've got dozens of ways to feel it (and it
isn't going to be the same, nor used in the same kinds of pieces, when the
Italians get ahold of it; the Germans aren't going to like it at all).  Paper
was expensive back then; you don't think people were actually going to go to
the trouble of *printing* music, do you?  Most printed music was for amateurs.
Professionals passed much of it on by ear.

How "classical" music lost this character is sad, but understandable; try a
100 piece orchestra improvising a Beethoven symphony, if you see what I mean.
Still, good performers were improvising their own cadenzas in sonata or solo
pieces right up into the 2nd half of the 19th century.  I know a pianist who
still does so when he concertizes.  If there is a line to be drawn, it has to
be one of specialization.  It isn't easy playing together with a 100 other
people without turning everything to mush.

However, not everyone has to stay on his/her side of the line.  Early music
lovers are accustomed to improvisation, I can assure you.
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Date:         Thu, 27 Aug 1992 11:06:00 GMT
From:         "OUT,
              OUT - YOU'LL NOT FEEL THE FALL-OUT..." <OLIVOTTO@ITNCISCA.BITNET>
Subject: Re: THEORY

Ken Koester writes:

>How "classical" music lost this character is sad, but understandable; try a
>100 piece orchestra improvising a Beethoven symphony, if you see what I mean.
>Still, good performers were improvising their own cadenzas in sonata or solo
>pieces right up into the 2nd half of the 19th century.  I know a pianist who
>still does so when he concertizes.  If there is a line to be drawn, it has to
>be one of specialization.  It isn't easy playing together with a 100 other
>people without turning everything to mush.

        Yes, this is absolutely true. Obvious, if you think. I even read a
line by a famous American composer/arranger whose name I forget, who baldly
claimed that "it is impossible to have a large string section playing swing
decently". 'impossible' is maybe a heavy term, but surely it is very awkward.

>However, not everyone has to stay on his/her side of the line.  Early music
>lovers are accustomed to improvisation, I can assure you.

        The philosophical question is whether we have gained or lost something
nowadays. Reasonably -- something was gained, something was lost. It's the
same old idea: when a child grows up, does he mostly learn or forgets his
most basic insticts? :)

        Ciao, Marco "Socrates and Milhous Nixon
                     both went the same way through the Kitchen".

P.S.: re the famous quote which Leonard posted. Was it of our fave white
      soubrette :), Michael son-of-a-Jack? Well, either he was short of
      oxygen or the snake had refused his favours to him if he dared say
      such things. By the way, why4 didn't he drowned in the river he mentions?
      (I'm a pacifist, but can get obnoxious in a Jackson infested area :))...
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Date:         Tue, 25 Aug 1992 15:34:30 CDT
From:         U17801@UICVM.BITNET
Subject:      Re: the ROCKER file

On Tue, 25 Aug 1992 16:14:24 EDT Jon Epstein said:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>I have put the ROCKER01 ZIP file on the LISTSERV.  To get the file, you
>can issue the command:
>
>TELL LISTSERV AT KENTVM GET ROCKER ZIP
>
>or send a message to LISTSERV@KENTVM with the following line in the
>mail body (not in the subject line):
>
>GET ROCKER ZIP
>
>For the internet people, it is not certain whether they will get a good
>copy or not.  It depends on the gateways that the file passes through
>whether it gets translated or not.  It is a binary file, so it shouldn't
>be translated or messed with in any way.
>
>For people to get automatic distribution when the file is updated,
>they need to send the command:
>
>TELL LISTSERV@KENTVM AFD ADD ROCKER ZIP
>
>or put
>
>AFD ADD ROCKER ZIP
>
>in the body of a mail message.  The file name needs to stay the same
>for this purpose, that's why I didn't put in the version number 01
>at the end of the filename.
>
>Let me know if you have any question.
>
>Christine Shih
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Date:         Wed, 26 Aug 1992 14:03:57 CDT
From:         "Leonard Watkins" <ISTS024@UABDPO.BITNET>
Subject:      success

With music & business like it has become how do you suppose a performer
measures success record sales, air play, concert gross, or self satisfaction

The rolling stones have been billed as the greatest R&R band ever would you
dispute this and who would you say is INHO (german R&R excluded)
From: MASUDA@SJSUVM1.BITNET (Michael M. Masuda)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Subject: Fretless Bass Question
Date: 31 Aug 92 22:51:32 GMT
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I have some queries to throw out amongst the upper eschelon
of the bass playing community.

How many guitar/bass companies make fretless basses?
Who makes really good fretless basses at an affordable price?
Does the body wood really matter that much, in comparison to the
  material the neck is made from?
Which sounds better: a wood neck or a graphite neck?
  (better may be to vague--how do the sounds compare?
Are there any inexpensive basses out there that have the
  characteristic Pedulla buzz bass sound?
Pedullas have coated fingerboards--do other companies have a similar
  process?
Is it possible to get a buzz bass sound from a cheap fretless bass that
  has its fingerboard finished with the same process and has Bartolini
  pickups installed into it?
Is ebony a better wood than rosewood?
Why do some fretless basses use maple fingerboards?

If I had the money, I would buy a Pedulla, but they are REALLY expensive
(almost two thousand sockaroonis for the one I want)
so I was thinking maybe I could buy a cheaper bass (a Fender PJ or a JJ) and
take it to a guitar repair shop and have them take the frets out, put on
a resincote fingerboard, put in some EMGs, Bartolinis or some other actives
and have a reasonable facsimilie.


What do you think?  Ask your friends who play fretless and get their opinion.
I really appreciate any help on this subject.

Mike Masuda

BTW: Who is the fretless bass player for Kate Bush on "Hounds of Love" album?
     What bass does he/she use?
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
From: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer)
Subject: Re: Rap
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 13:14:41 GMT

In article <870FF881E0805D9F@SLUVCA.SLU.EDU> WILLIACG@SLUVCA.SLU.EDU writes:
>My last question is: Has anyone listen to the last Miles Davis album?
>And What do you think of it?

I got it, and yes, Miles was nailing it.  There are some killer grooves
too, but the rap part seemed to me to be pretty sophomoric.  Stupid raps
kissing Miles' ass.  But all in all, it was just enough to make you
wonder what Miles would have done with rap had he lived longer.  Could
he have done to rap what he did to rock in the 70s?   Considering how
much room for developement there is in rap.  Could he have found some
players to do the job?

Jeff
From: birchall@pilot.njin.net (Shag)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Subject: DIGEST: Queensryche ("Screaming in Digital")
Summary: If you don't like ads, don't read this.
Keywords: Blatant Plug for incoming freshpersons and other new readers
Date: 23 Aug 92 23:11:55 GMT
Followup-To: alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive
Organization: Screaming in Digital, the Queensryche Net Digest


	* Things to do if you're a Queensryche fan * 

* Beware of night, for we all know he's loose again.
* Ride to a place beyond our time, reach for the edges of your mind.
* Throw down the chains of oppression that bind you.	   
* Please take my hand, don't be afraid.
* Please don't keep me from dreaming.
* You might see the nation's eyes, don't hide ... it's you.  
* Just watch the television, yeah, you'll see there's something going on.
* Make something of your life boy, let me into your mind.
* Speak the word.
* Tip the power balance and tear down their crown.
* Stop the madness.
* Wipe away the teardrop from your eye.
* Read between the lines, criticize the words they're selling.
* Think for yourself and feel the walls become sand beneath your feet.
* Read "Screaming in Digital" every Monday, for your weekly Queensryche-fix.

 -subscriptions : queensryche-request@pilot.njin.net
 -submissions   : queensryche@pilot.njin.net
 -administration: queensryche-owner@pilot.njin.net 
-- 

     Freedom belongs to only those without video screens for eyes and mouth.
		- Queensryche
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Date:         Wed, 26 Aug 1992 21:52:49 -0400
From:         "The Chrome-Plated Megaphone of Destiny"
              <ALEVIN@RCNVMS.RCN.MASS.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Forever Autumn
X-To:         ALLMUSIC@AMERICAN.EDU

>The album War of the Worlds is one of those so-called "concept albums" that
>sprang up in the '70's--composed and produced by Jeff Wayne (who also produced
>a Hayward solo album which doesn't include Forever Autumn). All songs on WOTW
>are sung by Hayward; all narration is by Richard Burton.
>I looked through 18 months of Crawdaddy issues to try to find a review, w/out
>success. (I didn't try Rolling Stone.) I assume that the album is based on
>H.G. Wells, but couldn't verify that.
>I've heard neither the song nor the album, but I have serious doubts that I
>would appreciate it, although my girlfriend of the late '70's no doubt had
>it in her collection and thought it was incredibly profound.
>Rick

I have a little more info on it from Roger & Martyn Dean's _Magnetic Storm_
(Roger did the artwork for the majority of Yes, ABWH, Asia album covers, and
Martyn designed Yes' stage sets in the 70s). The project was originally was to
be a musical interpretation of the book. Roger suggested a combined book and
record album. The contractual procedures were too complex to resolve so Jeff
and Roger went their separate ways. Roger, Martyn, Tim White and Richard
Clifton-Dey designed alien machinery based on Welles' descriptions in the book.
These were to be built for a stage show. The original designs and a number of
other paintings  which work quite independently now form the nucleus of a
wholly new project. Roger took them into discussions with Paramount Pictures;
with SF model expert Martin Bower; and with other film-makers and
screenwriters. Consultations continue on a film development of the material;
not another screen version of The War of the Worlds, but something intriguingly
different.

The above is paraphrased from the book, which was released in 1984. The only
War Of The Worlds film I remember since then was a TV series a few years back
(88/89?). I don't know if it used the material Magnetic Storm created as I only
watched the horrid thing once.

-Adam
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Organization: Universite du Quebec (siege social)
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Date:         Thu, 3 Sep 1992 10:42:22 EDT
Comments:     Adresse alternative de l'envoyeur: <UQPSGFB@UQUEBEC>
From:         Francois Boulet <UQPSGFB@UQSS.UQUEBEC.CA>
Subject:      Gabriel/Zappa/Eno
X-To:         allmusic@american.edu

Bonjour!

This is my first contribution to ALLMUSIC. My name is Francois.
I'm from the constitutionnal controversy of the north of north
america (Quebec, Canada)

about Peter Gabriel: due out in canada on september 29th

on Zappa: he hired a dance company from Montreal, La La La Human
Steps, for a serie of shows with himself and a philharmonic
orchestra. must be weird stuff, still!

and Eno, when will this record will be out?
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Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 1992 14:59:00 LCL
From:         Kevin Sonney <KEVIN.DAVINCI@MHS.UNC.EDU>
Subject:      RE: Blind patriotism -- no OMC
X-To:         "Leonard Watkins" <ALLMUSIC@auvm.american.edu>

Loenard -

Let's face  it - the people in power want to stay in power. "land
of the free" is the ideal we want to have, but can *NEVER* become
truth while there  are people left  in the world  who crave power
over  others.  At least  I don't need  a permit to  walk down the
strret,  which *IS* the case in some countries. At least I can go
where I want,  when I want,  without having to  get permision. At
least I  have the option  of saying "I  don't WANT this guy to be
president, I WANT this gentleman." And I can say things like this
in PUBLIC goddamn it. And for that I'm glad.

You have  a  right to your  opinion. I'm not  disputing that. I'm
saying things could  be a helluvalot  worse. Just ask some of our
eastern European Friends.

The only way to change the current order is not to talk about it,
but to  get out and  do something about it. If you don't like the
way your  government works, don't  just sit there  and bitch, get
out and do something about it.

I'm egtting off  my soapbox now,  and heading back  to the music.
That's what this place is supposed to be about, anyway....

-=Kevin=-
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Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 1992 08:58:46 CDT
From:         "Leonard Watkins" <ISTS024@UABDPO.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Blind patriotism -- no OMC

On Fri, 28 Aug 1992 08:32:00 CDT <CV01@SWTEXAS> said:
>>Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 1992 07:10:39 CDT
>>From:         "Leonard Watkins" <ISTS024@UABDPO.BITNET>
>>Subject:      Re: Nugent/Patriotism
>   Blind jingoism solves nothing.  Blind jingoism was what Hitler got from
>his people.  We are supposed to have advanced further than that.  The ones
>who are "behind the times", are the folks like the Rayguns and Bushes and
>their fanatic right-wing counterparts who would have us believe that we
>live in some Norman Rockwell painting.  "There is nothing wrong with our
>country -- except for those nay-saying, baby-killing, homo-loving,
>non-white, godless, commies."
personally i'm not a homo-loving, baby-killing, godless , but i'm not a
racist either and I believe reagan did a fine job and bush was fine too
would you like to name a democrat who has done anything worthwhile in the
last few times they were in office. Tke your time i'll wait. Alos i'm sorry
politics entered into this i'll refrain from anymore comments in this area
Reagan or Bush did less harm to ethnic groups than the so-called leaders
of those groups Jessie,Al,....etc they have set race relations back many years
remember Twana Brawley nothing happened to anyone involved thats racism.
Skin color should never be an issue or an escape from justice.
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Date:         Mon, 31 Aug 1992 08:19:25 EDT
From:         Ken Koester <MAINT2@ERS.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: politics
              30 Aug 1992 15:46:59 -0400 from <me1f+%ANDREW.CMU. EDU@CARNEGIE>

On Sun, 30 Aug 1992 15:46:59 -0400 Matthew Keith Egan said:
>
>Can anyone name any truly political bands that are conservative?  It
>always seems to me that art in general and music in particular lean very
>strongly to the left.
>
The last statement is only partially true, and only over the last 200 years at
that.  Before the decades leading up to the French Revolution, much art--maybe
most art--would have been politically neutral or conservative.  Even during the
19th century, there is considerable conservative art/music.  One notes in
passing the identification of Wagner with Nazism, for example, and there are
any number of conservative playwrights, poets, etc.
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
From: smills@news.weeg.uiowa.edu (MuffinHead)
Subject: Re: Fretless Bass Question
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 08:56:30 GMT

MASUDA@SJSUVM1.BITNET (Michael M. Masuda) writes:

>I have some queries to throw out amongst the upper eschelon
>of the bass playing community.

How 'bout a drummer who likes basses? :)

>How many guitar/bass companies make fretless basses?

I think a lot more companies than you think make fretlesses. (fretli?)
I've seen some and was surprised when I saw the brand name. Can't think
of any examples at the moment other than Fender and Steinberger.

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Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 1992 16:58:00 CDT
From:         S_YECK@TWU.BITNET
Subject:      RE: Independent/Alternative Music Reviews

For Henry--

Just for your own information, Klause Schulze is a former member of the band
Tangerine Dream.  I didn't know if anyone knew that or not!!

Toodles,

Meshel
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Date:         Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:14:11 EDT
From:         Rick <MMLRICK@UBVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Forever Autumn
              26 Aug 1992 19:23:26 GMT from <POELSB@QUCDN.QUEENSU.CA>

On Wed, 26 Aug 1992 19:23:26 GMT Ben Poels said:
>In the late 70's one of the Moody Blues (Hayward or Lodge?)
>had a solo hit with a song called Forever Autumn. I want
>to get a copy of it. Now, I have found it listed on a
>release called _War of the Worlds_. I would assume that
>this is the HG Wells story but I don't know if it is a
>movie score or a musical? Is anyone familiar with it?
>Is it any good? Does this song occur on any other releases?

It was Justin Hayward. The single Forever Autumn (Columbia 10799) hit the
top 100 on 10/7/78; stayed there 12 weeks; peaked at no. 47. (Cf. Joel Whit-
burn's Top Pop Singles, 1978.)
The album War of the Worlds is one of those so-called "concept albums" that
sprang up in the '70's--composed and produced by Jeff Wayne (who also produced
a Hayward solo album which doesn't include Forever Autumn). All songs on WOTW
are sung by Hayward; all narration is by Richard Burton.
I looked through 18 months of Crawdaddy issues to try to find a review, w/out
success. (I didn't try Rolling Stone.) I assume that the album is based on
H.G. Wells, but couldn't verify that.
I've heard neither the song nor the album, but I have serious doubts that I
would appreciate it, although my girlfriend of the late '70's no doubt had
it in her collection and thought it was incredibly profound.
Rick
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
From: ujwb@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Jeff Beer)
Subject: Re: clarinet list
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 13:15:40 GMT

In article <ALLMUSIC%92090218464495@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU> MCINTYRE@MSUPA.BITNET writes:
>forwarded without permission from NewList:
>
>KLARINET on LISTSERV@VCCSCENT.BITNET - Clarinettist's Network

Dophy! 


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Telephone:                 768-8074/8180
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Date:         Sat, 29 Aug 1992 22:28:32 KST
From:         DMetcalf%IC-LOG@WALKER-LTT.ARMY.MIL
Subject:      SECOND OPINIONS
X-To:         allmusic%auvm.american.edu@vm1.nodak.edu
X-cc:         dmetcalf@Walker-LTT.Army.Mil

Got to mulling over friend Henry's reviews of my tapes a little more,
& th' upshot of it all, for me, is equal time... so, from the great
halls of England & 'zine publisher Geoff Wall (Stick It In Yer Ear
'zine) comes an 'alternative' view of a couple of the tapes Henry
reviewed for me...


SAGAN/ZZAJ "Unborn Baby"  available from Dick Metcalf,
HQ, 19th SUPCOM, Unit 15015, PO Box 2879, APO AP
96218-0171, USA  C90

Continuing with his series of splendid tape collaborations,
Dr Jazz's atmospheric synthetics are the perfect showcase
for the writing of Miriam Sagan.  DJ states that the idea
of reading a woman's works about a womanly experience
appealed in a strange sort of way, & certainly the ironic slant
has unearthed a rare gem here.  It keeps track on a bewildering
array of emotions & atmospheres in an alternately reflective &
urgent mood!

KRAMTONES/ROTCOD ZZAJ - "Emotional Circus" available from Dick
Metcalf, HQ, 19th SUPCOM, Unit 15015, PO Box 2879, APO AP
96218-0171

"Loop Thing", with its jazz-like synthesizer motif dancing over
the impassioned vocals, you know that this is going to be a
tape to treasure.  Dr Jazz & Harlan Mark Vale have forged music
that is heavily rythmic, sad & surreal.  It perfectly demonstrates
that mail collaborations can produce near-perfect musical short
stories.  The effect is disconcerting but ultimately very moving.
Recommended!

I can't find the other reviews of "Critical Mass" done by a couple
of the other 'zines I'm frequently reviewed in, but they're similar
in tone... just to point out that viewpoints are always different,
& I suppose a bit in 'defense' of my music!

ROTCOD ZZAJ
From: STEV@MCO.BITNET (Steve Rife)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.allmusic
Subject: Underground/Progressive Music
Date: 28 Aug 92 17:32:49 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU


     I was just wondering and figured this list would be the perfect place
to bring up this topic.

     What bands of today are considered Underground and how would you
describe this form of music (if it still exists).

     What bands of today are considered "Progressive" and how would you
describe this form of music (again if it still exists other than in
Yes and ELP).


Steve Rife
(STEV@MCO)
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Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 1992 14:19:00 EST
From:         MCINTYRE@MSUPA.BITNET
Subject:      Siouxee and the Banshees

During lunch hour today I spotted the early Siouxee and the Banshees
albums as American CDs on Geffen.  _The Scream_ is the English album;
i.e. it does not have "Hong Kong Garden" on it, but "Hong Kong Garden"
is available on the singles collection.

John McIntyre
Physics - Astronomy Dept
Michigan State University
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