HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: yangze@acf3.NYU.EDU (Ze Yang, , , )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Sources on Tibet
Date: 30 Aug 92 23:20:00 GMT
Organization: New York University

mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Libucha) writes:

>	I especially welcome contributions from the following netters:

>	Yang Ze
>	Shi Chunde
>	Brian Lin

>	Thanks a lot. I'll be glad to forward a copy of the list to anyone
>who asks for it.

>Mark Libucha (mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu)

Hello, Mr. Libucha, I am so glad that you put my name at 
the first place (I guess that's because my stringent arguments win
your trust:-). Why don't you also want contribution from Mr. Carl?
The guy post more articles than me. Is that because You can 
tell his arguments are generally illogic?:-)), but 
I am a little busy now, I cann't give 
you much help on this matter. Why don't we play something easier 
for you, your e-mail address remainds me of one speech 
made by Abraham Lincoln(Abraham Lincoln is Ex president of USA-in case
you don't know this :-)), 
if you can give me satisfactary answers about this speech, I might
give you some advise on your project. 
First, there are two versions of the speech (appr.):
 "...At what point then shall we expect approch of danger? Shall
we expect some transatlantic millitary giant to step the
ocean and crush us at a blow? Never, all the armies of Europe,
Asia and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the Earth in their
military chest
and a Bonarpart as a commander, could not by force take a drink
from the OHIO river or set a track on the Blue Ridge , in a
trial of a thouscand years. If destruction ever reach us, it must spring
up amongst us, we must be its author and finisher, as a 
country of free men, we must live through all time or die by suicide..."
another version:
 "..Whence shall we expect approch of danger? Shall we assume
some millitary giant to step the ocean and crush us at a blow?
Never, all the armies of Europe, Asia and Africa, could
not by force take a drink from the OHIO river, or set a track
on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years, if destruction be
our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher, as a nation
of free men, we must live for ever, or die by suicide..."

(Please ignore misspelling, that is intentionally left for Mr. Carl, 
I am sure every time he find a misspelling or grammar error, he
is excited.:-) )

My questions:
1) Which is the original version (by Abraham Lincoln).
2) At what year Abraham Lincoln made the speech?
(Please don't post your answers before you have more that two
answers.)
If you cannot give me a satisfactory answer, I would say "
This guy is BULLSHIT, even don't know American History,
why bother to teach him our Chinese stuff."
By the way, you are not related to CIT at all, are you?
I am really concerned about this. (My taiwanese friends' 
club once visited by CIA personel, CIA offered help to them, 
I really cannot afford this).
Ze Yang.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: y0z8374@rigel.tamu.edu (ZHANG, YUEMIN)
Subject: Re: What About Tibet? (Re: What about China done to Korea)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 19:43:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.152736.66760@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu>, exl0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (Edwin X. Li) writes...
>In article <l9q4hgINNs00@aludra.usc.edu>, zyou@aludra.usc.edu (Zhongbai You) wri
>tes:
> 
>>
>>   Should Tibet gain independence in the future, Tibet will be similar to
>>those USSR states. But Tibet IS part  of China up to now, you should not
>>compare Tibet with those indepdent countries.
>>
>>   I am glad to hear that you are not promoting TI.
>>
>>
> 
>what carl trying to explain to you is that up until the end of last
>year, the entity called USSR does claim the sovereignty over a number
>of now independent states. your unable or refusal to comprehend this
>fact which may well happen in the future is beyond me. please go to
>a neurologist to check if you have a logic short circuit in your skull.
> 

Does USSR still claim the sovereignty over these states?
Be logical, USSR collapsed first, then 15 republics became indepandent states.
China does not collapse, and cannot see any signal of collapse in near future.
Therefore IT issure is irrelevent to former USSR case.
If IT depends on China' collapse, Please  be patient.
> 
>>
>>     International law regarding territory integrity. China's sovereignty
>>over Tibet is recognized by most nations in the world, including US.
>>
> 
>see the last paragraph above above.
> 
>>     Once again, you made a terrible mistake by comparing China to Japan.
>>Japan's invason of Taiwan is illegal, never recognized by other peace loving
>>countries.
>>
>>
> 
>once again you fail to grasp the fundamental of human decency.
>it is not a matter of recognition. when japan invaded china and
                                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^         
>taiwan in the 1930's, only private complaining from the heads of
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Read history book first.

>major powers instead of formal diplomatic protest was lodged.
>had the japan not invaded pearl harbor, who knows, maybe every
>'peace loving' contries would have recognized japan's anexation
>of taiwan and perhaps more.
> 
> 
>>
>>   Wait a second, I said that you are weak because you have  the
>>tendency to give up your rights which are evidenced by many of
>>your postings.
>>
>>   What is your reason for you to say me (us) 'oppress other people'
>> and 'under oppression'?   Is it because we are asking protection?
>                                            ???????????????????????
>> asking apology? Don't you realize that it is fighting for our own
>  ??????????????
>> goods.
>>
> 
>hmmm, interesting. if the goods are your own, how come you still
>want to fight for them? or could it be that the goods are stolen
>from others and you are fighting for the loot? asking protection
>to enjoy the loot. asking apology to show your patriotism. how
>convenient. as another netter pointed out: you yao dang biao zi,
>you yao li pai fang.
> 
>>
>>
>>
>>Z. You
>>
yz
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: ping@bnlux1.bnl.gov (Shiping Zhang)
Subject: Re: Protection bill
Organization: Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, NY 11973
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 01:59:49 GMT

In article <26AUG199218513820@phobos.ucc.umass.edu> s9874194@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (s9874194) writes:

>>>[...]
>> 
>>Why do you need to be protected?
>>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
>> 
>Very very good question !! Why do you need to be protected? What are you?
>Endangered speices? All of you who are looking for the "protection", if you
>can not stand on your own feet without somebody else's "protection", you
>doom to fail.

  Seems you were abandoned by your parents at your birth and survived
  by yourself. :-)

  And seems Bush's going to fail the election with all those guards.

  And seems all the sodiers are just either to kill others or to
  protect themselves.

  And seems ...

  
  BTW, isn't because of CCP's protection that Chinese are able to stand up,
  at last?

-ping
From: yong@minster.york.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Image of China 3 (sources only)
Date: 2 Sep 92 08:40:39 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of York, England

West Image of China (Part 3)
(some historical sources up to 1910 - publication dates)

16. Isabella L. Bird Bishop, "The Golden chersonese and the way thither",
(G. P. Putnam's Sons, New York, 1883).

17. Robert K. Douglas, 'China', "Encyclopoedia Britannica", (25 vols., Adam
and Charles Black, Edinburgh, 1875-89).

18. George Ernest Morrison, "An Australian in China, being the narrative of
a quiet journey across China to Burma", (Horac Cox, London, 2nd edition,
1895). 

19. A. H. Smith, "Chinese characteristics", (Oliphant Anderson and Ferrier,
Edinburgh and London, 5th revised edition, 1900).

20. A. Henry Savage-Landor, "China and the allies", (2 vols., William
Heinemann, London, 1901).

21. Henri Cordier, "Histoire des relations de la Chine aves les puissances
occidentales 1860-1902" (3 vols., Ancienne Librairie Germer Bailliere,
Paris, 1901-2).

22. Sarah Pike Conger, "Letters from China, with particular reference to the
Empress Dowager and the women of China", (A. C. McClurg & Co., Chicago,
1909). 

23. J. J. M. de Groot, "The Religious system of China, its ancient forms,
evolution, history and present apsect, manners, custom and social
institutions connected therewith", (6 vols., Brill, Leiden 1892-1910).
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: hong@doe.carleton.ca (Xia Hongxia)
Subject: test
Summary: test
Keywords: test
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 18:29:38 GMT

test
XSXC
--
Hongxia Xia
email: hong@doe.carleton.ca
phone: (613)-788-4048
       (613)-526-0196
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
From: dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby)
Subject: Re: News readers from ROT(Re: Hello from news reader in China)
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 14:31:02 GMT

rot@multisys.com (Republic of Taiwan) writes:

>Subject says it all. News readers from Republic of Taiwan.

Where is that????

Please see a psychologist, you are having wild hallucinations.
There is no such a place and never will.

Long live Unification of China.

-- 
1)-----------------------Rev 6:8 "... They were given authority over a quarter
of the Earth, to kill by the sword, by famine, by plague, and wild beasts."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)
Subject: Re: Chinese consumer spending
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 14:47:53 GMT

In article <714998486.18193@minster.york.ac.uk> yong@minster.york.ac.uk writes:
>Chinese Consumer yearly spending (1991?)
>
>cities in China		per person/per year		on food
>Guangzhou 		2,109.60 Yuans (US$383.56) 	Y1,473.97 ($267.99)
                                                             ********
                almost close to typical CSS spending on food during their
struggling time in U.S. pirce factor not even considered(10 times difference).
CSS worked like a dog, lived like a pig for around years, then...
From: yangze@acf3.NYU.EDU (Ze Yang, , , )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Sources on Tibet
Date: 30 Aug 92 23:05:00 GMT
Organization: New York University

mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Libucha) writes:

>	I especially welcome contributions from the following netters:

>	Yang Ze
>	Shi Chunde
>	Brian Lin

>	Thanks a lot. I'll be glad to forward a copy of the list to anyone
>who asks for it.

>Mark Libucha (mlibucha@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu)

Hello, Mr. Libucha, I am so glad that you put my name at 
the first place (I guess that's because my stringent arguments win
your trust:-)), but I am a little busy now, I cann't give 
you much help on this matter. Why don't we play something easier 
for you, your e-mail address remainds me of one speech 
made by Abraham Lincoln(Abraham Lincoln is Ex president of USA-in case
you don't know this :-)), 
if you can give me satisfactary answers about this speech, I might
give you some advise on your project. 
First, there are two versions of the speech (appr.):
 "...At what point then shall we expect approch of danger? Shall
we expect some transatlantic millitary giant to step the
ocean and crush us at a blow? Never, all the armies of Europe,
Asia and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the Earth in their
military chest
and a Bonarpart as a commander, could not by force take a drink
from the OHIO or set a track on the Blue Ridge , in a
trial of a thouscand years. If destruction ever reach us, it must spring
up amongst us, we must be its author and finisher, as a 
country of free men, we must live through all time or die by suicide..."
another version:
 "..Whence shall we expect approch of danger? Shall we assume
some millitary giant to step the ocean and crush us at a blow?
Never, all the armies of Europe, Asia and Africa combined, could
not by force take a drink from the OHIO river, or set a track
on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years, if destruction be
our lot, we must be its author and finisher, as a nation
of free men, we must live for ever, or die by suicide..."

(Please ignore misspelling, that is intentionally left for Mr. Carl, 
I am sure every time he find a misspelling or grammar error, he
is excited.:-) )

First question:
1) Which is the original version (by A.L.).
2) At what year Abraham Lincoln made the speech?
(Please don't post your answers before you have more that two
answers.)
If you cannot give me a satisfactory answer, I would say "
This guy is BULLSHIT, even don't know American History,
why bother to teach him our Chinese matter."
By the way, are you sure you are not related to CIT at all?
I am really concerned about this. (My taiwanese friends' 
club once visited by CIA, CIA offered help to them, I really
cannot afford this).
Ze Yang.
From: zhuh@athena.mit.edu (Hui Zhu)
Subject: Re: [FWD] IFCSS on Shen Tong
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 14:20:35 GMT

In article <wu239-040992011442@cinder.ncl.ac.uk>, unregistered@newcastle.ac.uk (Wu Dengxing) writes:
|> > *************************************************************** 
|> >          IFCSS Headquarters Office    Signature
||> >        
|> Who the fuck cares about Shen Tong? The shithead asked for it. 
|> Chinese Government clearly stipulated that student exiles are welcomed
|> to return to China as long as they do not participate in any activities 
|> prejudicial to the national interests. That implies that all the assholes
|> fucking around brandishing their notions of what is good for China 
|> should not return to China to organise stupid anti-Government activities
|> funded by foreign governments or agencies. It does not matter what
|> kind of banner you wish to uphold...democracy, bullshit, religious shit
|> etc. Shen Tong wished to fuck the system in the eyes of the world. The 
|> system fucks back! Few countries around the world would welcome agitators
|> to return to their home country to establish rebellion and overthrow of the
|> ruling government. S. T. knowingly fucked with the law. Let the law fuck
|> him. May not be the best law in the world but once the regulations have
|> been clearly established....it's not up to Shen Tong and his bunch of 
|> advisers to toy with the law and then cry foul afterwards when they are
|> implemented. No need for us all to sell our backsides as well signing all
|> these fucking pompous bullshit. Shen Tong will be news as long as 
|> western newspapers think he is newsworthy. No more call for Chinese
|> cunts for sale please. 


Tong4 kuai4!  
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:24411 soc.culture.taiwan:12669 soc.culture.hongkong:10310
From: wong@ux1.lbl.gov (wong)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: Hello from news reader in China
Date: 1 Sep 1992 00:51:10 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory
Reply-To: wong@ux1.lbl.gov (wong)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ux1.lbl.gov

In article <1992Aug31.204919.29642@leland.Stanford.EDU> claudius@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <92Aug31.144101edt.56@orasis.vis.toronto.edu> liuyh@vis.toronto.edu (Yuanhui Liu) writes:
>
>>not quite.  There are invasions, and they do settle down, for example,
>>look at Sichuan & Qinghai provinces, they all have a lot of mix races
>>living together, Tibetan, Han, Hui, MOngols, and quite a few smaller
>>nationalities.  
>
>How big is the Tibetian population in Sichuan? 

In the case of Sichuan, the situation is not of Tibetans moving and
settling someplace new, but of China setting the provincial boundary 
of Sichuan to include areas that are ethnically Tibetan. Historically,
the Han Chinese occupied the lowlands and foothills, while the 
Tibetans occupied the mountain areas starting at Kangding (Tachienlu).
The ethnic division has been remarkably constant over a thousand years.

> I will not concede, in the
>Quinhai case, that it's a migration into "China," since China had never
>actually had the control of Quinhai until the Chin Dynasty (yes, *that*
>dynasty again :-)) took it from (yes, you guessed it) the Dzungarian
>Khanate.  Before Dzungaria had it, it was a collection of loosely independent
>Mongolian and Tibetian tribes.

I assume you mean "Qing", the last imperial dynasty. Qinghai (Amdo
in Tibetan, Kokonor in Mongolian) was occupied by Tibetans down 
until the Ming period when Mongol tribesmen started moving in. 
Qinghai did not acquire a significant Han Chinese population until 
the 1920's when the Republican government declared it a province 
and added to it the Han area around Xining, which has since
been the provincial capital. Once again, it was more a case of
boundaries being moved around them than of Tibetans moving and
settling.

Joe Huang
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Cheap Airfares to Shanghai
From: yzhang@crcvms.unl.edu
Date: 26 Aug 92 10:19:02 CST
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln

I called many travel agencies across USA and did not find the reduced airfares
to Shanghai. Is there anybody who has the information and is willing to share
that with us?  I will greatly appreciate if you could either post on the net or
set me an e-mail.
From: yangze@acf3.NYU.EDU (Ze Yang, , , )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: What About Tibet? (Re: What about China done to Korea)
Date: 26 Aug 92 03:09:00 GMT
Organization: New York University

/* acf3:soc.culture.china / usenet@news.acns.nwu.edu (Usenet on news.acns) /  1:07 pm  Aug 25, 1992 */
In article <65500040@acf3.NYU.EDU> yangze@acf3.NYU.EDU (Ze Yang, , , ) writes:
> usenet@news.acns.nwu.edu (Usenet on news.acns) writes:
> 
> >First, It's great to see you expose your "lovely" personality more and more  
> >through losing your temper again and again. Good, keep going! Next, it seems  
> >that it is you who are poisoned by the old Chinese culture by looking at the  
> >way you debate with others. Your are really something that our ansester feel  
> >proud of.  
> How do you know I lost my temper, it's only a small CASE(remind you here
> fashionable taiwanese use this word very frequently |:-)).

Well, so you did not lose your temper. Good, in this case you were just  
quietly, calmly and patiently spitting your "gentle" words around the net. So,  
this is part of your habit, isn't it?! May I ask you a question? Were you from  
a bad neighborhood or you are just a very quick learner from your chemistry  
professor?


> >Also, it's interesting to see from your another post about your chemistry  
> >professor's choosing "gentel" words. It seem to me that you are a good  
student >of his. Let's pray that your professor will one day have a chance to  
read this >news group and amazingly find that he did not notice that he had a  
good  
> >student. Good luck and keep fit!

> What I want to say is that you are caring too many irrelevant things.
> "gentel" is only a type error(this show you great "personality" again by
> your theory),
> this remain me of "hui2 xiang1 dou4 de
> hui1 you2 si4 zhong2 xie2 fa3), still remember LuXun's story?
> 
> 
> Ze Yang

Oh, boy! You are tough! You know I am not good at "pinying", so you use pinying  
to fool me. Fortunately I got a friend from Beijing who is pretty good at  
pinying. I had to admit that it took him about two minutes to figure out what  
you tried to say. Both of us were very happy to solve a tough puzzle. Before my  
friend left, he made a comment on your pinying skill. He said "this Ze Yang's  
pinying is lousy! He simply doesn't know the tones."

I knew my friend made a terrible mistake. He shouldn't have commented on a  
culture elite's pinying skill. Also, I notice that you were curiously asking  
for people's real name around the net like a secret policeman. Fortunately, my  
friend and I are now in the US and we can have a bit of privacy. Sorry, Mr.  
Yang, I can not tell you his real name to protect him, his family and even his  
ancestor from possible denger.  But, well, I can give you some information to  
satisfy you curiosity: my friend was from Beijing Normal University, the same  
university Wuer Kaxi went. You won't lose your temper, will you?! 


/* ---------- */
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: liang@cs.scarolina.edu (Da Dong Liang)
Subject: Re: No Olympics 2000 for Beijing!!?
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date: 25 Aug 92 19:30:17 GMT

910575a@darwin.ntu.edu.au writes:

>In article <9957@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au>, anthony@cs.uq.oz.au (Anthony Lee) writes:
>> I don't think it is sour grapes.  Recall, the last Asian
>> games that was held in Beijing ?  Not only, did the people
>> of Beijing had to suffer Tiananmen square they had to either fork
>> out money or provide extra work to make sure the game started
>> in time.  Just think what the Chinese government will ask the
>> people of Beijing to host the Olympics :-(
> --

If you have the faith that the Chinese communist regime will collapse like 
USSR, why don't you look ahead into the future? Consider the 100 million 
signatures of the Chinese kids, who would like to see their desire go vanished?

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.taiwan
From: s9874194@phobos.ucc.umass.edu (s9874194)
Subject: Re: I'm very disappointed in Chinese
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 19:15:00 GMT

In article <la7ae0INNjel@spim.mips.com>, yhmok@hornet.mips.com (Yeuk-Hai -Shark- Mok) writes...
>>But deep down, I think most Chinese still would like to see China one day
>>becomes free, democratic, and wealthy nation. Now China surrounds by Japan,
>>Taiwan, S. Korea, HK, Singapore which have been economic powerhouses and
>>have hugh cash reserves and technology. These can be very helpful for her
>>economic development.
> 
>I'm also very disapponited in Chinese, even I'm Chinese.  Right now China is
>going through a lot of changes but its going too fast.  As a result, poor
>become poorer and rich becomes richer.  Tax system is almost non-exsitance.
>There are no respect to the trading and business laws.  Every thing is
>'connection', 'under table deal'.  Under the current system, democratic 
>society will not work.  I do like to see China become strong but I don't think
>I can see it in my lifetime (I'm only 24).  The selfishness and the corruptness
>is in the root of the culture and I don't think this can be changed in a short
>time (I don't think I can change this on myself).  China really need a slow
>and well planned reform.  May be in a spend of 50-100 years, instead of
>trying to catch up to the world in 20-30 years.  Then, we may have a China
>that we can be proud of.
> 
>	Shark ~{D*HtjX~} at SGI
I believe that moral as well as social problem could be solved as the
development of the economy. 
For a simple example, not too many people in the US would bother
to steal toilet paper (sorry, if you do not like the word I use). The 
reason? It is too cheap and everybody has the ability to get couple
dozen. But if you supply toilet paper freely in the restrooms in China,
what would happen? Not because Chinese are morally bad but because we do
not have so much supply and the price compare to the income is not
as cheap as here. So, people do care free toilet paper. It is still same
thing here. If what you have in the rest room was not just toilet paper
but also, say, $100.00 bills. Will people just take what they need, 
instaed of grab them all? I bet not. So, moral and social standard
do changes in accord with the economy. After all, if you believe
Marxism, "Jing1 Ji4 Ji1 Chu3 Jue2 Ding4 Zhang4 Zen2 Jian4 ZHu4".(Sorry,
I can not say it in English. I hope you can get it.) 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.taiwan