HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: What is HAMAS
Summary: Yeeaakh!
Date: 30 Dec 92 06:07:45 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <1992Dec29.160417.12173@cbfsb.cb.att.com> mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar) writes:
>
>  Hamas stands for "Harakat al Muqawamat il Islamiyyah", which means, the
>Islamic resistance movement. It was founded by Sheikh Ahmad Yassin three
>or four years ago. It represents the Muslim Bretheren in Palestine. The
>founder is sunni. The organization is an Islamic organization whose aims
>include providing an Islamic support organization for Palestinians, resisting
>Israeli occupation, the liberation of all of Palestine and the establishment
>of an Islamic state.

It is nice to know the Muslim Bretheren support the killing of an unarmed
hostage without convicting him of any particular crime, *and* claim it is
Islamic!

Tamer Abdelgawad

P.S.  Happy holidays everyone :-)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: 7642
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 22:40:09 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.205623.21746@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso) writes:
|> 
|> Jews are not a race, Jews are a People.
|> You can be born a Jew, or Convert.
|> I was born Jewish.  My girlfriend Converted.
|> We will be Israeli citizens and live in Israel.

What you say is totally wrong. I knew some one whos father was Jewish and his
mother was dutch. He was not considerd Jewish since his mother was not. This
is fundamental Judaism, however Israeli law is no longer entirely based on
Judaism and therefore your girlfriend will be considered an Israeli citizen.

To be Jewish and Israeli citizen is not the same.

A.Faris
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: The U.N. votes to condemn Israeli Action
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1993 22:11:51 GMT

aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa) writes:

>In article <1992Dec27.162411.19604@nysernet.org> astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:
>>
>>Their plight is no less tragic because it is partially self-inflicted.

>Really?  You are very smart, Alan, masha'Allah.  But no one is fooled.
>Yes, the Arabs are partly responsible, but that does not allow the
>foundation for continuing to deny Palestinians their rights and dignity.
>Will you recognize the other self-infliction and pain that is being
>pressured or will you continue to shift the blame and reduce the severity
>of the Palestinian Plight?
> 

Let me just remind you that:

#1:  Arabs are in control already of about 3/4 of Palestine, the Jews
only about 1/4.

#2:  Israel has proposed, and the Arabs rejected, giving the Arabs
virtually full control over their daily lives in a majority of the
territories, giving them joint control over about 30% of the
territory--which is virtually uninhabited, and denying them control
over only about 8% of the territory--that which is occupied almost
totally by Jews.

Israel is trying to ease the plight of the Palestinian Arabs.  It is
not Israel's fault if the Arabs themselves are resisting.
-- 
Alan H. Stein                     astein@israel.nysernet.org
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6066 soc.culture.pakistan:18953 soc.culture.turkish:13697 soc.culture.iranian:11190
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.irasoc.culture.asfghanistan,soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Re: The vanquished always want to imitate the victor (Ibn Khaldun)
From: Lois White <LMWHITE@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Date: Monday, 28 Dec 1992 01:28:11 PST
 <Dec.25.02.30.02.1992.27719@pilot.njin.net><BzxqL4.Err@ucunix.san.uc.edu>
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center

In article <BzxqL4.Err@ucunix.san.uc.edu>, minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T
Minhas) says:
>
>in turkish, and that is the point, arabic based languages, like urdu, turkish,
                                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>farsi, etc. helped in shedding the shackles of race and nationalism, i am
>happy that i can go to indonesia and be able to read the things that are
>written.
>i am happy that i was able to go to afghanistan and be able to communicate at
>least in writing what i had in mind. when i went to the muslim areas of china
>though i couldn't understand what the hell was being said, i could at least
>read it and recognize some of the words. this was not cultural imperialism.
>it was pleasure.

I assume you mean that the writing system is "Arabic based"...because these
languages themselves are definitely not.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: Anti-Semitism
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 22:45:31 GMT

faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris) writes:

>May I recommmend for those militant Jewish supporters that when arguing with
>Arabic posters to use Anti-Jewish instead of Anti-Semitism. Afterall, how
>could Arabs be anti-Semitic when they are Semitic people.

This message shows an ignorance about the meaning of anti-semitism.
Anti-semitism refers to hatred of Jews, not semites, and it is indeed
possible for semites to be anti-semitic.
-- 
Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Subject: Re: PLO COVERUP
Organization: The Turing Project, Public Access Internet Host
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 22:51:20 GMT

Christopher Khoury <34I2NYW@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> writes:
>>
>>"The PLO will NOT become a political organization but will continue to
>>be above all an organization for armed struggle.  The PLO will not
>>cease its attacks on Israel in favor of a diplomatic initiative."
>>
>>        Voice of Palestine
>>        Lebanon, Oct. 8, 1979
>                          ^^^^
>OH COMON Mr. Carasso. Look at the date on this thing. Don't you think
>a few things have changed over the past... *13* years??
>For your info, the PLO has already said long ago that they support the
>peace talks. Where have you been?

My point is that I don't fully believe that the PLO is being honest
about its intent.  As recently as 1987 (my book is from 1988) yassir
arafat said:

	"the fires of revolution against these zionist invaders will
not fade out until our land --ALL OUR LAND-- has been liberated from
these usurping invaders."

No one doubts he means all of Israel when he says "ALL OUR LAND".

5 years is not a long time.  And parts of the plo still carry out
terrorist attacks.  I'll try to get more recent references...


Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:5921 soc.culture.turkish:13594
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Hamas
Date: 27 Dec 1992 02:49:56 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Alan Stien writes:

>cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah) writes:

>>That is what you love to have:

>>- Israeli caused problems to be solved by Arabs.
>>- Deported Palestinians are the responsibility of the
>>  Arabs not the deporters.

>If you recall, the present "problem" began is a result of increased
>terrorism and murder of innocent Israelis, about six in a week, by
>Hamas terrorists.

Don't falsify the facts:
The "about six in a week" were not innocent Israelis. Five of them
were "soldiers" who were enforcing occupation on Palestinian people.
And the other sixth was killed as a result of the Israeli government
failure to meet the demands of his kidnappers.  They mispredicted
what the results will be.
 
>  Were it not for that wave of killings, those four
>hundred or so Hamas terrorists would still be in their homes.

Were it not for "the israeli occupation, neither jews nor palestinians
would to be killed."  Ahmad Yaseen.

>Now, what do you prefer at this point:

>(a) Forcing those terrorists to suffer in Southern Lebanon where they
>are now, thus scoring propaganda points against Israel at their
>expense,

>or

>(b)  Giving them a place to live until they're allowed to return in
>six months to two years?

The latter is what all palestinians are after.  However the place is
to be the place which they were taken from.

Don't fool people by saying "six months to two years!"  The Israeli
government is trying to kill the matter and buy time by saying some
nonsense like this.
Some of the 66 previous deportees have been out of palestine since
the beginning of the Intifada (6 years.)  Have they been allowed to
return back?  None that I heard of.  They are all still accused of
being terrorists.

Jews are always annoyed about having arabs throwing them in the sea, 
but they themselves should not be annoyed if they throw palestinians
in no mans land and say let them die because they are not only human
beings, but garbage and animals.  Even as we see up to now, they've
been treated by Israel as worse than animals.  This has always been
the case inside Israel, however this time it is for the world to 
watch.
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: The U.N. votes to condemn Israeli Action
Date: 23 Dec 1992 15:33:28 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:

>I find it extremely interesting, and instructive, that the brethren of
>the Hamas terrorists temporarily removed from the territories by
>Israel are less concerned about the welfare of their brethren than
>about using them as a propaganda tool against Israel.

>Of course, that's nothing new, since if the Arabs really cared about
>the Palestinian Arab refugees, that problem would have been solved
>over four decades ago.

That is what you love to have:

- Israeli caused problems to be solved by Arabs.
- Deported Palestinians are the responsibility of the
  Arabs not the deporters.

I think you're losing logic my man!

-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:5934 soc.culture.turkish:13603
From: jk87377@cc.tut.fi (Juhana Kouhia)
Subject: Re: Arabic music on CD
Organization: Tampere University of Technology
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 09:28:09 GMT


In article <20DEC199217504753@utasys.uta.edu> zureick@utasys.uta.edu
(Rami Zureick) writes:
>In article <1992Dec20.090157.14498@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>,
>abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad) writes...
>>I would like to know if there is any Arabic music on compact disks.  If
>>so, are there any mail order houses in North America where they can be
>>bought?
>
>I picked up a couple of Arabic CD's from a place in Houston called "Video 
>International Center". The cost at the time was $16/CD, regular price is
>over $20. 


Also try verify following addresses.
Please, let us know if anyone of them doesn't sell
Arabic or Middle-Eastern music.

The list follows my signature ;-)


Juhana Kouhia
(Fake signature here, instead of the real at the end of article.)
Maintainer of the digested mailing list Middle-Eastern Music;
for discussions on Middle-Eastern and related music.
Subscriptions to middle-eastern-music-request@nic.funet.fi.


==========================================

Rashid Sales Co
191 Atlantic Ave.
Brooklyn, New York
phone: (718) 852-3295

Roundup Records
P.O. Box 154
N. Cambridge, Ma. 02140      
U.S.A.
 
Harold Moores Records & Video
2 Great Marlborough St.
London W1V 1DE
United Kingdom
Telephone: (071) 437 1576 (24 hours).

Nimbus Records Limited
Wyastone Leys
Monmouth NP5 3YZ
United Kingdom
Telephone: 0600 890682

Sterns US
500 Broadway, 4th Floor
New York, New York 10012
USA

Oriental Records, Inc.,
PO Box 1802,
Grand Central Station,
New York, NY 10017
(516)-746-0140

Private Music
220 East 23rd Street
New York, NY 10010
(212)-684-2533

==========================================
From: kaygee@hardy.u.washington.edu (Kevin Giansante)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: information needed: Amman
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:25:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: shelley.1hq8o7INN5oj
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
NNTP-Posting-Host: hardy.u.washington.edu

I have been offered a job teaching English in Amman, Jordan.  The
salary is $18,000 (U.S.) a year, with no tax liability.  I have no
idea what the cost of living is in Amman; can anybody tell me
whether that salary would be reasonable for a single person in
Amman?  Would I be able to save any money while living there?

I have never lived anywhere in the Arab world.  Any opinions
about Amman as a place to live?  How does it compare with
western cities?

Thank you.

e-mail to kaygee@u.washington.edu.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: All Arabs are guilty
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 03:10:17 GMT

eggertj@moses.atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert x6127 g41) writes:

>>   There are millions of square miles of Arab territory outside Eretz
>>   Yisrael, dwarfing the miniscule size of Israel (@8,000 sq miles) many
>>   times over.  There is no need for Arabs to immigrate to Israel, unless
>>   they want to drive the Jews out, while there is plenty of room in
>>   Israel to accomodate any Jew who wants to return to his or her
>>   homeland, without in any way harming any of the Arabs who live there
>>   now.

>This is racist propaganda.  The clear conceptual asymmetry of "Arabs
>can only want to kick Jews out, while Jews can only want to live with
>Arabs" is racist nonsense.

It's "Arabs want to kick Jews out, while Jews only want to live in
peace with their Arab neighbors."  And it is racist, but on the Arabs'
part.

>>   Of course.  The Israelis have always wanted to live together with the
>>   Arabs;  it has been the Arabs who have wanted to kick the Jews out of
>>   their homeland.

>This is more racist propaganda.

"I want to tell Carter and Begin that when the Arabs set off their
volcano, there will only be Arabs in this part of the world." --
Yassir Arafat, 1979

"We yet call upon the Arab inhabitants of the State of Israel to
return to the ways of peace and play their part in the development of
the State, with full and equal citizenship and due representation in
all its bodies and institutions -- provisional or permanent." --
Israel's Declaration of Independence, 1948

Notice any asymmetry?

-- 
Alan H. Stein                     astein@israel.nysernet.org
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Three troubling questions about Islam
Date: 22 Dec 1992 20:56:52 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu



jle@lear.bos.locus.com (John Elghani) writes:
>In article <42786@sdcc12.ucsd.edu> revans@euclid.ucsd.edu (Ron Evans) writes:
>><1h585iINNduk@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Sala
>>
>>>The crusaders took over Jerusalem over 90 years.  And the crusaders were
>>>backed by whole Euorpe at the time, as is the Israel now.  Did muslim
>>>gave up hope and said, "The cursaders are here to stay" and forgot about
>>>Jersalem and Palestine?  No my friend.
>>>After 90 years muslims liberated Jerusalem by Salah El-Deen.
>>
>>       Yes, the greatest of Kurds.  Now look how the Kurds have
>>       been rewarded.  They have no self-determination, and
>>       Iraq has obliterated over 4000 Kurdish towns and villages.
>>       Since Iraq continues to occupy and oppress Kurdistan,
>>       why is the existence of Iraq any more legitimate than that
>>       of Israel?

>TOO SARCASTIC.  According to the islamic accords, Islam does not
>differentiate between nationalities, colors, or races.  Therefore,
>regardless of the color of Salah Addeen,  he was a muslim.

>As to the obduction of the Kurds, it is not happening in the name
>of islam, it is happening in the name of nationalists such as
>Saddam and waht have you.

Well said John.  Jazaka Allaho Khairan!

>>
>>>Israel took over Jerusalem since 1967, it's been only 93-67=26 years,
>>>                - or in the best case -
>>>Israel existed since 1948, which is only 93-48 = 45 years.
>>>If you can't continue the journey, step a side and let other people do
>>>it while you're watching.
>>>Islamic history repeats itself.  Tatar came to Iraq and devistated most
>>>of the muslim world.  Did they last forever?  No.  Muslims came back
>>>and defeated them.  The same case with crusaders.  And now, Islam is coming
>>>back to do what it did before.
>>
>>>Is this unrealistic or is it not???
>>
>>       Some in this nuclear age might consider it a bit unrealistic
>>       to model behavior on the period of the Crusades.
>>

If Israel has a nuclear bomb, so does Pakistan!
And who knows, more to come....

Al-Hashr
{
 2. He it is Who caused those who disbelieved of the
 followers of the Book to go forth from their homes at the
 first banishment you did not think that they would go forth,
 while they were certain that their fortresses would defend
       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 them against Allah; but Allah came to them whence they did
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 not expect, and cast terror into their hearts; they
 demolished their houses with their own hands and the hands
 of the believers; therefore take a lesson, O you who have
 eyes!
}

>--
>Ron Evans (revans@math.ucsd.edu)
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: What is HAMAS
Summary: Still waiting...
Date: 1 Jan 93 10:19:56 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <MALEK.92Dec31163507@robroy.pi.titech.ac.jp> malek@pi.titech.ac.jp (Zidouri Abdelmalek 03/95) writes:
>
>Tamer> An extreme jewish posting irritates me much less than a posting which
>Tamer> I preceive as a misrepresentation of Islam and moslims.  I say what I
>Tamer> say in good faith, and I'm always open to conflicting opinions.
>                              ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Ya SalAm  Ya SalAm  Ya SalAm...Bravo 
>What about a moderate jewish posting what feelings do you get?
>
>Malek

Still waiting for a reply to my arguments that you conveniently omitted.
For a reminder as to what this discussion is about, read the subject line.

Tamer Abdelgawad
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:5973 soc.culture.turkish:13611
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: The U.N. votes to condemn Israeli Action
Date: 26 Dec 92 19:33:55 GMT
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.

cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah) writes:

>That is what you love to have:

>- Israeli caused problems to be solved by Arabs.
>- Deported Palestinians are the responsibility of the
>  Arabs not the deporters.

If you recall, the present "problem" began is a result of increased
terrorism and murder of innocent Israelis, about six in a week, by
Hamas terrorists.  Were it not for that wave of killings, those four
hundred or so Hamas terrorists would still be in their homes.

Now, what do you prefer at this point:

(a) Forcing those terrorists to suffer in Southern Lebanon where they
are now, thus scoring propaganda points against Israel at their
expense,

or

(b)  Giving them a place to live until they're allowed to return in
six months to two years?

Of course, using their brethren as propaganda fodder in their war with
Israel is nothing new to the Arabs.  Contrast their behavior in
forcing their brethren to live in refugee camps for over four decades
with Israel's welcoming of a similar number of Jewish refugees thrown
out of their homes in Arab countries.


-- 
Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: News from the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip.
Date: 23 Dec 1992 22:33:19 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu



astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein) writes:

>afm@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Santa Claus...) writes:

>>I have just learned that 9 Palestinians were killed by the Israeli army in
>>clashes in the West Bank and Gaza Strip over the expulsion of the 400
>>Palestinians. One of the victims is a 7-year old girl.
>>This news is not confirmed as yet. If anyone has heard anything like that,
>>please post.

>I have not heard this yet, although it's not inconceivable given the
>violence of the intifada.

You have not heard the news yet!  This was posted here 4 days ago.

>The question that comes to my mind, assuming it's true, is where were
>the parents of this child?  How did they let her get involved in
>violent clashes with army troops?  Don't they care about her welfare?

>If something like that happened here in America, the parents would
>probably get arrested for child abuse or some similar offense.

In other words, this jew is trying to tell us that Palestinians have to keep
their frustrated kids inside, and if they don't succeed, they will be
committing "child abuse" against their kids.

Sure this kid careless parents were playing gulf and left this girl outside
to get attacked by some outsider jewish criminals, who shoot any moving object
and who don't distinguish between animals and humans.
Taking this into account, who do we punish the criminals or the parents?

What if these kids' parents are in jail or one of these 418 deportees?
Are they accused of both being fundamentalists and child-abusers?
Or did the Israeli government substitute these families with new parents
to contain kids frustration?

Again you're losing logic!
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6159 soc.culture.jewish:24398
From: randy@halcyon.com (C. Brandon Gresham)
Subject: Religious intolerance?
Summary: Saudi Arabia executes Christian on Christmas Day
Organization: Northwest Nexus Inc. (206) 455-3505
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 10:29:41 GMT


Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Path:
nwnexus!van-bc!cs.ubc.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca!access.usask.c
a!sue!meena.cc.uregina.ca!emaruchi
From: emaruchi@meena.cc.uregina.ca
Subject: Saudi Arabia executed a Christain preacher on Christmas Day
Date: 26 DEC 92 15:13:28 GMT
Organization: University of Regina, Regina, Sask., Canada

>   Christmas is the day of love, peace, and
>  forgiveness. But a Philipino preacher, Oswaldo
>  Magdangal, was scheduled to be executed in Saudi
>  Arabia on this very Christmas day because the crime
>  he committed was teaching about Christain. This sad
>  news comes from bit.listserv.seasia-l. 

>          Thailand, although it is developing country,
>  no oil, and its politic is under military, it still
>  gives more freedom to the people. Not any one of any
>  religion preacher has been prosecuted on its soils.
>  We welcome any religion. Let's pround to be Thai.

                      Bunlur