HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher Morton)
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating
Reply-To: cmort@ncoast.org (Christopher Morton)
Organization: North Coast Public Access *NIX, Cleveland, OH
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 03:39:26 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.african.american

As quoted from <1992Oct14.162432.24022@athena.mit.edu> by femibyte@athena.mit.edu (Olufemi G Anthony):

> males) has been damaged to a large extent. I am not advocating that
> people do not have interracial relationships (whatever they do is their
> business), but in my personal opinion, given the state of America today,
> I feel that we as black men should be looking for ways to uplift the
> status of the race as a whole, not running after white women. If this

I'm not going to uplift anybody or anything by dating somebody I don't have 
anything in common with, regardless of their race or ethnicity.  I WILL make
myself miserable, but then that seems to be an end in itself for some people.

> find one he liked), that's lame. If a black man can't find a black woman
> who is right for him, then something must be wrong with him, not black
> women. Many of us are always trying to find excuses when it comes to
> that area.
> 
If a Black man can't find a Black woman who is right for him, maybe he just
has the misfortune to be in an area where there aren't any that are
right for him.  How large of an area should he comb in search of this alleged
"right" Black female? 

I happen to live in the Greater Cleveland area.  I find it difficult to find
women of ANY race who are interesting to me here.  The culture here is quite
distasteful to me and I find the inhabitants of all sexes and races infused by
it.  You'll excuse me if I don't spend large amounts of time and money on
people with whom I find it painful to associate.

PS - I don't let Whites impose any sorts of racial "duties" upon me.  I'll be
damned if I'll let another Black man or woman do so.  By far, racial "duties"
usually seem to be of a kind with the type the David Duke applies to Whites.
Sorry.  I'm not interested.



-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------  

"Well whose opinions did you THINK these were...?" 
------------------------------------------------------------------
From: dc4l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Dean Calloway)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Pessimism
Date: 10 Oct 92 13:33:05 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.soc.culture.african.american: 10-Oct-92 Re:
Pessimism by ;;;;7202@violet.berkeley 
> has gene flow occurred throughout and between populations in Europe
> and Africa for many centuries, but it is impossible to define the
> features of a Caucasian or African in any scientifically precise
> way.  Continuous gradations of features from one extreme to another
> simply preclude any notion of racial purity.

In order to make a statement either way, you'd have to first define
racial purity... perhaps in generations... four?  five? seven?...

For all practical purposes however, there are a great many whites who
are "white..."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: kautaj@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (kauta)
Subject: Re: motorcycles
Organization: Indiana University, Department of Mathematics.
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 21:51:08 GMT

In article <1992Oct11.141630.1@opie.bgsu.edu> bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu writes:
>	I have to agree with your friend Clarence; I have never seen a sister
>                                        ^^^^^^^^
>on a motorcycle.  I am very sure there are some, but they are few in numbers.
>
>Sorry but I had to tell the truth
>
>				CL Hill
                                   ^^^^
>				BGSU
>

Is this Clarence as in Long D. Silver of the High Court? And are you, CL Hill,
related to Anita?? Just *VERY* curious!!

J.K.


-- 
Internet: kautaj@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
Bitnet:   kautaj@iubacs.bitnet         
Uucp:     kautaj@iubacs.uucp           
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: interracial dating
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 01:27:49 GMT

Wanda, since I couldn't privately mail this back to you because of
address problems, I'm doing this up front.



Sister, if the Portuguese honorary brother is alright with you,
fine.  I'm not saying folks should stay with black no matter what
their inclination.  As I tried to put out, it's who you choose and
how you are treated by the person.  I've also tried to say that
sometimes, in my view, there is a element in brothers and sisters
dealing with each other which is missing in a b/w relationship.
.
I'm saying you should not exclude your own, which some black folks
deliberately do because of their own head problems. I've already
named some names in that direction as to culprits.
.
Otherwise, go for it.  Congratulations and good luck.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu
Subject: Re: Carl
Organization: Bowling Green State University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:20:12 GMT

Thanks for the diagnosis Sigmund Freud how much do I owe you?  I have no
inferiorty complex.  Just took a test in PSYCH 201 did'nt you? Like I said my
perceptions of non black females that date interracilly are based on my
experience.  It's that way in my home town Cleveland and it's been that way
from coast to coast.  By the way I spent some time in the military so when I
say coast to coast, I mean coast to coast.
 I thought the main reason for this news group was to give constructive
critcism, not to call people dumbasses, so please let me give mine.
From: bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Abe Lincoln
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:00:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: opie.1992Oct13.130024.1
Organization: Bowling Green State University

I am very touch by your letter of Lincoln quotes.  I for one no another side of
Abe Lincoln:
              (1) the one who was for colonlization
              (2) the one who said that we(blacks) were not their equals and
                  that we might be lost "puppies" upon freedom
              (3) the Lincoln who said in his own words that he was not for
                  blacks having the same political and social rights as whites
              (4) the same Lincoln who paid white union soldiers twice as
                  much as he paid black union soldiers 
              (5) the one who was against interracial marriage!!!!

Please see the following books for more info:
              (1) Lincoln and the Negro by Benjamin Quarles
	      (2) Lincoln: Speeches, Letters, Misc
From: dc4l+@andrew.cmu.edu (Dean Calloway)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Pessimism
Date: 10 Oct 92 13:30:31 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.soc.culture.african.american: 10-Oct-92 Re:
Pessimism by Local Genius@kepler.unh. 
> [....]
> >Keep in mind, though, that Africans and Europeans exchanged genes for
> >centuries   before the discovery and settlement of America.  Therefore,
> >there are no pure Caucasians or pure Africans anyway.
>            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> I beg to differ....this is a sweeping statement which is not
> necessarily true....
>  

Undoubtedly.  This is highly misleading and overly simplifies Gregor
Mendel's inheritance laws...

DCAL
From: krw@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (keith.r.smith)
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 14:11:13 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.014145.2522@athena.mit.edu> femibyte@athena.mit.edu (Olufemi G Anthony) writes:
>In article <1992Oct11.145256.1@opie.bgsu.edu> bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu writes:
>>	I am a 22 year old college student who is very much against interracial
>>marriage and dating.  Just the other day my best friend and I were discusing
>>the very topic with four other boys(white).  I explained to them my opposition
>>against dating interracial and gave them reasons why.  I said that black women
>>come in all different shapes and colors so why should I date outside of my 
>>race.  I also said that I am not physically stimulated by white females.  It
>>seems as if everyone agreed with my opinion except for this one guy.  He said
>>that for me not to see every female as one color was typical of a bigot, and he
>>called me a racist.  Being called a racist hurt me very much, but it hurt even 
>>more being that this guy was my BEST FRIEND.  It shock me very much that my 
>>best friend, who is black, was calling me a racist because I won't date outside 
>>my race.  I go to an "all-white" college in Ohio, and I am approached by white
>>females everyday should I start dating outside my race or what?  Do you
>>consider me a racist?  I want to know.
>>
>>                           Chris Hill
>>                           BGSU
>
>No I don't. In fact I believe that a most of the black male -
>white female relationships today come about largely due to curiousity or some
>psychological factor - black males feel a sense of powerlessness/sense
>of inferiority and feel that getting a white woman will somehow make up
>for that. Most white females go with black men because of the stereotype
>that we black men are somehow more sexually potent.

	[stuff deleted]

What I am reading between the lines in both of these postings is the
concept that, in an interracial relationship, the "races" of the partners
is at the crux of the relationship, ie., the idea that a black man would
date a given white woman because he wants/prefers white women, as opposed
to the idea that people are people, and a given man and woman could meet
and see something, each in the other, that they are attracted to, where
"race" is a non-issue.  Personally, I would have my doubts about a person
who, by their dating habits, shows a distinct anti-preference for their
own "racial"/ethnic group, but, outside of that, love is where you find it.
I also think that anybody thinking about entering into an interracial
relationship really has their work cut out for them.  I am not talking
any special problems in dealing with a partner of another "race", but in
dealing with some other folx who see you together and don't like it.

Keith
From: spiff@bert.eecs.uic.edu (Jason Leigh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Jason Leigh <-- wow look I'm on the news!
Date: 13 Oct 92 02:01:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: bert.1992Oct13.020129.14310
Organization: University of Illinois, Chicago

In article <1992Oct12.113215.1@opie.bgsu.edu> bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu writes:
>I think to blame black-male and white-female relationships on Jim Crow laws and
>slavery is ridiculous.  I don't think black men date white women because
>they have some subconscious feeling of inferiority as a result of slavery and
>Jim crow laws--thats absurd.  I said I was against dating interracially because
>I am only attracted to black women.  Do I need to explain this?  I am also
>against interracial dating because it is not excepted in today's society. 
>Also the majority of girls of different races that date black men seem to be
>whores and sluts.  They also tend to exclude themselves from dating anyone else
>but black men.  I don't know about you, but I refuse to date a girl who is very
>promiscuous.  These girls (on the average now!!!) also seem to try and act and
>be black.  They only listen to rap and R&B music and talk just as black as you
>and me.  In other words these girls are fake. To see a non-black person trying
>to act black is like watching a 1920's motion picture where a white man, with
>his face painted jet black, is portraying a black man.  These are just my
>reasons for being against interracial dating.  I can care less on why other
>people date outside their race.  It's their life, so I have no comment.  I get
>the feeling that you are not honest on your position.  You don't have to put up
>a front; It won't make you less of a black man to me!!!!!!!!!!!!

AH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Jason Leigh
-- 
---------------------------------------------------------  ___
| The opinions expressed above are necessarily those of | \\     \\  | \\
| the Electronic Visualization Laboratory, NAAAT!       |  \\---  \\ |  \\
| Send Replies to: spiff@bert.eecs.uic.edu (Jason Leigh)|   \\____ \\|   \\____
From: bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Ronald (Dating)
Date: 15 Oct 92 18:04:06 GMT
Organization: Bowling Green State University

No I am not gay.  No I have never been turned on by a white girl.  I have never 
dreamnt about dating or "fucking" a white girl.  I don't know why?  I may be
prejudice after all?  Why must I justify this?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: djohns@elm.circa.ufl.edu (David A. Johns)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: is power needed for racism?
Date: 9 Oct 92 09:22:42 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: University of Florida, Gainesville

In article <ISBELL.92Oct5092147@panther.ai.mit.edu> isbell@ai.mit.edu (Charles L Isbell) writes:

# The *real* problem we have to deal with is the inertia of the
# oppressive system.  On average, White folx can't help but to
# benefit from the system (men can't help but to benefit from the
# system) because of the way its geared and because the historical
# inequity generates present inequity.  It is very difficult to get
# people to see this because they infer it as charge of
# "guilt"--something folx are always ready to resist.

I'm not sure which people are doing the "inferring" here, but I think
I agree.

An example.  One of the major problems of inertia is that most jobs
are not offered to the public and granted to the best applicant.  It
has never worked this way.  Most jobs are given to someone who is
related in some way to someone who already works for the business,
a relative, or whatever.  I suppose this system evolved because
character is more important than qualifications, and a personal
reference somewhat guarantees character, or maybe just because it's
easier than reading applications and conducting interviews.  In any
case, the result is that new employees tend to be like old employees.

But when blacks refer to this system as racist, it simply baffles the
whites who are benefitting from it.  They sense no racism in their
decisions.  The charge is too abstract.  As you point out, it feels to
them as if someone is simply trying to make them feel guilty for the
sins of their ancestors, and that's not a very effective technique.

Affirmative action has a similar effect.  White managers can't simply
start accepting black applicants -- they have to completely change the
methods they use to find and evaluate applicants.  This is not a
trivial task in a small company, and doing it wrong could mean
disaster.

I'm sure this is why blacks are currently doing much better in large
businesses and government agencies than in small businesses.  These
outfits come closer to the impersonal style of hiring than small
businesses do, and they can better absorb a mistake.

In any case, it seems to me that what blacks should be doing is
offering *specific* solutions to specific problems.  This is the sort
of thing I had in mind when I wrote about training and placement a
couple of days ago.  Offering solutions to the white managers on a
platter would also short-circuit the law-of-the-jungle economists who
see no self-interest in helping blacks achieve parity.

David


Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: Word On X: Sensational
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 17:05:10 GMT

In article <92289.111131FKR@psuvm.psu.edu>,
<FKR@psuvm.psu.edu>  Fred Rozenblad writes:
>
>
>Here's something else I would like to you know. The record store where I buy my
>jazz stuff has a 2 CD piece on Malcolm X. It's done as an opera thing. I,
>unfortunately, can't stand opera, but I'll forego this prejudice if the CD is
>any good. Anybody know anything about this? Sorry, I don't have the name or
>title of the author. I'll get it later and post it.
.
.
Get the CD.  It is a jazz opera by the (the name of the cat
escapes me) brother of Thulani Davis (who also collaborated on the
piece, I believe).  I think it was also called "X" and I think it
was staged somewhere on the East Coast a couple of years ago (and
thus got the jump on Spike).
.
I also suggest you try to find "Treemonisha," the ragtime opera by
Scott Joplin, on Deutsche Grammophon.  If you can't stand white
opera, try a black one.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Subject: Re: The Issue is Race
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 23:53:51 GMT

In article <92287.165034FKR@psuvm.psu.edu>,
<FKR@psuvm.psu.edu>  Fred Rozenblad writes:
>
>Anyway, the subjects they talked about were right on time and no punches
>were pulled. I don't know if anyone else (out there) saw the beroadcast.
>I wanted to mention it sometime before, I forgot about it. I had many
>things to do w/ classes and all. I would like to know if there will be
>more broadcast w/ Phil Donahue, and the panel as well as the guest.
>
.
Probably not race, but another issue.  Apparently, Phil's been
doing the PBS number for a while.  Sister Souljah...honey...the girl
walks it like she talks it.  I have to admire her for that.
>
Why would anyone want to get a PhD in Chemistry?
.
Search me, but more power to you!
From: krw@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (keith.r.smith)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Interracial Dating
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:03:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbnewsk.1992Oct14.190332.18112
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T

In article <1bhp06INN2po@agate.berkeley.edu> ph111-bx@violet.berkeley.edu (;;;;7202) writes:
>In article <1992Oct14.162432.24022@athena.mit.edu> femibyte@athena.mit.edu
>(Olufemi G Anthony) writes:
>>
>[...]
>>            why are white men not dating black women in equal numbers?
>>Statistically one should expect that...
>
>I wonder about this too.  'Round Oakland and the East Bay, interracially,
>it's almost exclusively black male/white female and white male/asian female.
>On the Berkeley campus, in fact, you almost see as many white men with
>asian women as you do white men with white women.  It's fairly rare to
>see a white man with a black woman and *extremely* rare to see an asian
>man with a white woman.  At least, that's what I've observed.

I have not taken a poll, but from casual observation in my corner of the
world, I have not seen any marked disparity in the relative numbers of
BM-WW vs. WM-BW IR couples.  I am on the east coast, if that means anything.
I spent four days in San Francisco on business, the year before the last
'quake.  What struck me was that I remember seeing only one _black couple_
the whole time that I was there.  I suspected that they were visitors there,
as I was.  It seemed that every other person that I met there was from
someplace else.  Every other couple that I saw that included a black person
included just one.  I asked of some locals that I met there, sorta' half
jokingly, if there was some kind of local ordinance about that.  It was eerie
to me.  Even there, I did not note any particular disparity in BM-WW vs.
WM-BW couples.  Does anybody have observations from other parts of the country?

Keith
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: dem@engin.umich.edu (Darryle E Merlette)
Subject: Re: Happy Columbus Day
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 14:26:23 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu writes:
>WANTED: Articles on wether we should glorify Christiopher Columbus or not?
>        I'm kind of suprised that nobody has posted an article on this subject
>        since Columbus Day has come and gone.  I planned on posting one about
>        two weeks ago, but it slipped my mind.  I plan on posting one pretty
>        soon though.  Please be precise and supportive of your arguments.
>        Please don't be overly wordy either.  I tend to overlook very long
>        respsonses.

I think Columbus has received as much attention on this newsgroup for his
so-called holiday as he deserves (ie. none at all). However, if you must
post anything about him, be true to his greedy/murderous legacy and 
don't glorify him. The destruction of indigenous peoples and laying the
foundation for slavery is nothing to celebrate. 
	Darryle
From: simon@acsu.buffalo.edu (Patrice A. Simon)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: motorcycles
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:11:31 GMT
Organization: UB

In article <1992Oct11.141630.1@opie.bgsu.edu> bc205cs@opie.bgsu.edu writes:
>
>	I have to agree with your friend Clarence; I have never seen a sister
>
>on a motorcycle.  I am very sure there are some, but they are few in numbers.
>
>Sorry but I had to tell the truth
>
>				CL Hill
>				BGSU


	Go to Bermuda, which is two-thirds black, and almost everyone has to
use mopeds or motorcycles...I know a few who use the latter (and get many
tickets :-)



-- 
Patrice Simon
simon@acsu.cc.buffalo.edu			v5097ucd@ubvms.buffalo.edu
opnsimon@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: SBEHC@CUNYVM.BITNET
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Are there Any "Good white Folk"?***
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:52:08 GMT
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

---------------------------------------------
==>Although originally I was not going to respond to these post I see that
==>are going to be the only response that this post is going to get and poor as
==> they are they deserve a response, if only to clear things up.
==>**********************
==>ARTHUR  writes that he thought that Malcom no longer believed that europeans
==>were devils.  I can only suggest for you to get some of his speeches before
==>his death as well as some of the works on the life of Malcolm.  What you
==>know will effect what you read and what you read will effect what you know
==>be very carefull.  As far as Malcolms death is concerned againg I strongly
==>suggest reading and perhaps you could get the Gil Noble,"Like It Is" show
==>that foucuses on the life and death of Malcolm.
==>*************************
==>SPINOZA If you do not know the historic reasons that African, and indigenous
==>people would consider europeans devils there is nothing I can do for you.
==>Before anything else you must remove the european historical blinders from y
==>your eyes and then mabey you will see my point in that statment.  As far as
==>the NAACP is concerned you really need help if you think that because some
==>european got a medal named after him by an orginization that has always had
==>very anti-African intrest is representative of the good of europeans then
==>I think you should redifine good.  Read Crisis of the Negro Intellectual, by
==>Harold Cruse it might help.