HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey)
Subject: Fiction vampire list, version 1.0
Reply-To: aaron@space.ualberta.ca
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 23:26:25 GMT

Okay.  Here's what I have gleaned so far from postings to this group and my
own memory, which is pretty bad.  () encloses the name of a series, and the
books that follow are meant to be the books in that series, in order.  Feel
free to correct me.  (Re: the Saberhagen books, I'm going by John Wenn's
listing of Fred Saberhagen books, which does not mention "Vlad" or "Tepes" at
all.)  The questions marks are missing information...

For corrections and additions, either post here, where I should see it, or
mail me at aaron@space.ualberta.ca.  Thank you for your attention, and I hope I
can help make alt.vampyres a more organized environment for you.  (Do we have
an FAQ yet?)


Nancy Collins
   Sunglasses After Dark
   In The Blood
   Tempter

Patricia Elrod
   ???

John M. Ford
   The Dragon Waiting

Barbara Hambly
   Those Who Hunt The Night

Tanya Huff
   Blood Price
   Blood Trail

Stephen King
   'Salem's Lot

Robert Lory
   ???

Brian Lumley
   (Necroscope)
   ???

T. Chris Martindale
   Nightblood

Richard Matheson
   I Am Legend

Robert R. McCammon
   They Thirst

Byron Preiss
   The Ultimate Dracula [anthology]

Garfield Reeves-Stevens
   Bloodshift

Anne Rice
   (The Vampire Chronicles)
   Interview With The Vampire
   The Vampire Lestat
   Queen of The Damned

Michael Romkey
   I Vampire

Alan Ryan
   Vampires [anthology]

Fred Saberhagen
   (The Dracula Files)
   The Dracula Tape
   The Holmes-Dracula File
   An Old Friend of The Family
   Thorn
   Dominion
   A Matter of Taste
   A Question of Time

Jeffrey Sackett
   Blood of The Impaler

??? Skipp & ??? Spector
   The Light At The End

Bram Stoker
   Dracula

Whitley Strieber
   The Hunger

F. Paul Wilson
   The Keep

Chelsea Quinn Yarbro
   (The St. Germaine Chronicles)
   Hotel Transylvania
   Blood Games
   The Palace
   The Saint-Germaine Chronicles
   Tempting Fate
   Path of The Eclipse

???
   Darker Than You Think
???
   The Delicate Dependency
???
   Vampire Tapestry

--
---Alfvaen(Canadian SF Quasi-Activist)
"What have I done to piss the gods off?"  ---Terence Trent D'Arby
Current Album--Pink Floyd:A Nice Pair
Current Read--John Updike:Rabbit, Run
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: kaveh@ms.uky.edu (Kaveh Baharestan)
Subject: _Darker_Than_You_Think_
Keywords: Vampires
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 18:39:23 GMT
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences

So has anyone else read this gem?
I loved it.  Probably the best (short) vampire
novel ever written.  Anyone agree, disagree?
-- 
/-  Kaveh Baharestan                               -==================|>=====o\
|"Though your lips are tempting, They're the wrong lips, They're not her lips |
| but they're such tempting lips That if some night you're free, Dear...      |
\______________________________________ -Cole Porter__________________________/
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: kklai@napier.uwaterloo.ca (Curtis D)
Subject: Re: Being made...
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 20:27:53 GMT

In article <1992Sep9.131036.17282@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> kmoore@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kyle E Moore) writes:
>
>     Just a sidenote... I found it amusing in Stoker's book, and in so many 
>other interpretations, that it was necessary to use the *Christian* emblems of
>the Cross and the Host to ward off the evil spirit.  What if the guy was 
>Jewish?

Didn't they do something like that in that vampire movie with Roddie
McDowell? One of the characters was Jewish (if this is the movie I'm
thinking about, that is) and used a Star of David to ward off the
vampire.

I believe the rational behind it is that the symbol is a religious one,
not necessarily a Christian one. As long as the person wielding the 
symbol truly believes in it, the symbol will be effective, regardless
of its religious denomination.

========================= Fluffy the Wonder Bunny ============================
       Sex is not the answer, sex is the question. Yes is the answer.
==============================================================================
     The U.S. has George Bush, Johnny Cash, Bob Hope, and Stevie Wonder.
         Canada has Brian Mulroney, No Cash, No Hope...No Wonder.
==============================================================================
      The other night I was lying in bed, looking up at the stars, and
              I wondered, "Where the FUCK is my ROOF ?!?"
================== cadesjardins@descartes.waterloo.edu =======================
  Hi! I am a .signature virus. Copy me into your .signature and join the fun!
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: cgc2646@usl.edu (Cech Claude G)
Subject: Re: We need a list of Vamp[iy]re Movies
Organization: University of Southwestern Louisiana
Distribution: alt
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 19:01:24 GMT

In article <Bu38Cz.H9L@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> mancinis@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (steven mancini) writes:
>
>There was also one of those Chinese-Fighting flick with a vampire villian
>as the major theme.
>

Ah, yes, the Martial-Arts Vampire Film:  There are, I think, a bunch of these
out of Hong Kong, but the one I recently say was Vampire Meets Dragon, directed
by Leoung (I've probably misspelled that name!).  We howled through the film;
great fun!  If you rent it, be SURE to wait for the previews that come on
AFTER the film is over:  The come-on for Master Shaolin Thunderkick is a
classic!  On the other hand, having just come through hurricane Andrew at
the time, we were also probably not quite in our normal frames of mind ;-)

		- Claude
From: rodgers@maxwell.mmwb.ucsf.edu (R. P. C. Rodgers, M.D.)
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: We need a list of Vamp[iy]re Movies
Date: 5 Sep 92 02:40:47 GMT
Distribution: alt
Organization: UCSF Computer Graphics Lab

The best all-time vampire movie has to be the spoof which Roman
Polanski did in the late 60s, "The Fearless Vampire Killers."
A film with a sad connection in retrospect, as it was in making this
film that Polanski met his future wife, Sharon Tate, who was subsequently
the victim of the Charles Manson clan.

I haven't found this film on video tape, but it would be one of the few
videos I would actually buy if it were available.
--
R. P. C. Rodgers, M.D.         (415)476-8910
UCSF Laurel Heights Campus     UUCP: ...ucbvax.berkeley.edu!cca.ucsf.edu!rodgers3333 California St., Suite 102 Internet: rodgers@maxwell.mmwb.ucsf.edu
San Francisco CA 94118 USA     BITNET: rodgers@ucsfcca
From: JAL137@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: The "vamp" disease (was:Vampyres/Origins too)
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:58:58 GMT
 <D86-EMH.92Sep5005314@dront.nada.kth.se>
 <1992Sep6.034738.6006@coe.montana.edu> <8SEP199219060277@amarna.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Organization: Penn State University

Greetings,
   I  strongly recommend the book _American Vampires_.  It offers some good,
 concrete, scientific facts about the overhyped "vampire disesase" (which I
 can't remember how to spell right now).  The disease which you're referring to
 would be highly unlikely to cause people to attempt to drink blood (the blood
 can't be absorbed into the bloodstream via the digestive tract), etc...
                                                           -Jonathan
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: dand@Turing.ORG (Dan 'Bart' Duncan (KD4IGW))
Subject: Re: _Rockula_, Yarbro, porphyria, and questions
Organization: The Turing Project, Charlottesville Virginia.
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 02:33:22 GMT

In article <1992Sep7.181441.1@opie.bgsu.edu> jdraper@opie.bgsu.edu writes:
>This may be getting a little long, but I have just one more request: Does 
>anyone know any methods of becoming a vampire *without* being bitten by one?
>I'm writing a story that turns on this point. I seem to remember reading 
>somewhere that suicide under certain conditions can do it, but I need more
>details.

You can drink the blood of a vampire, but I've seen several different
outcomes.  Some sources say this makes one a vampire, but Stephen
King's _Salem's_Lot_ says it just marks you for other vampires as 
"untouchable."

-DanD

-- 
# Dan Duncan dand@turing.org     dand@cscns.com               
#  KD4IGW     dbd2x@virginia.edu   IRCNICK=Installer 
# "Your beauty is in your mind, not your skin."  -Acoustic Junction
From: moon!cyberden!jwlhyfer@well.sf.ca.us
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: werewolves
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 15:25:44 PDT
Organization: Indescribable Creations

that angry guy <IO20557@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:

> Just wanted to bring up the thread and see what info you folks had on the
> topic  -TC

This is Alt.Vampyres, and while occassionally the two do mix, if you are 
asking us to discuss it here, lets keep it to when it has relevance to 
vampires. Otherwise, try alt.horror..
Of course, I'm refering to your question about werewolves..

__________________________________________________________________________
   |       /         |\
   | H E   \ Y B E R |/ E N       [ moon!cyberden!jwlhyfer@well.sf.ca.us ]
From: umage@mcl.ucsb.edu (androgyny)
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: Anne Rice
Date: 5 Sep 92 16:21:59 GMT

Yea, i enjoyed Rice's vampire novels.
I like the first two best tho, the last one was sort of `pulpy' to me..
 
In fact, i went on a small Ann Rice reading spree (very small) and read some 
of her other works like Exit to Eden, which is an attemp to reconcile
True Love and S & M. (more or less successful)
and Oh Heck, one i can't recall the title of which was historical fiction
revolving about a grup of young mulatos in post reconstruction New Orleans,
and is a very good book.
 
Have you read her other SF like the mummy.. ?

--
-----------------------eom------------------------------
The facts and opinions presented here are not mine. They
belong to the U C Regents, who take full responsibility.
----------t---h---e----r--e---a---l-----eom-------------
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: fabbott@athena.mit.edu (Freeland K Abbott III)
Subject: Re: Vampiric human relationships
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 00:03:31 GMT


In article <1992Sep11.172149.26165@reed.edu> mfunk@reed.edu (Michele Funk) writes:
>I've spent considerable time thinking about "psychic vampires".  I imagine
>to be the sort that symbolically sucks the blood (life) out of his/her
>victims.  What is most interesting to me is that the mythological vampire

Just for the sake of argument, what I think of as a healthy
relationship (i.e. dream) has a good chunk of vampirism... it just
happens to be two-way: I get in trouble, I draw from her.  She gets in
trouble, I bleed back.  Just an irelevant point...

As a possibly more-relevant point, I've also heard (and made) comments
on the symbolism of vampires to human sex drive and domination
stereotypes: When did you last see a vampire without an excess of sex
appeal...or, for that matter, whose victims weren't normally the
opposite sex?  I've heard that there exists a movie about a gay
vampire (played by Mr. Skywalker, supposedly), but the fact that this
was seen as adequate schtick seems to support my case....  And the
vamp is *always* in control, right up until the end: usually very much
in control...

--
Freeland K. Abbott              fabbott@athena.mit.edu
104 Madison Ave.                now working for Cambridge Technology Group
Arlington, MA 02174             "And I thought 14-hr days would be over now"
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: tag@hermes.ecn.purdue.edu (Tony A. Gibbens)
Subject: Re: Vampire mythology and reality
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 15:57:30 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.172149.26165@reed.edu> mfunk@reed.edu (Michele Funk) writes:
>I've spent considerable time thinking about "psychic vampires".  I imagine
>to be the sort that symbolically sucks the blood (life) out of his/her
>victims.  What is most interesting to me is that the mythological vampire

I'm sure that I lived with a female form of this type of vampyre a few
years back.

>(tall, dark, powerful, alluring) is so different from what the original
>vampires were conceived as (short, bloated, ugly, rank).  My hypothesis is
>that we have seen in our time the evolution of a myth.  The concept of the
>vampire, i.e. one who sucks blood, has been adapted to fit our image of one
>who "feeds" on the life of others.
>
>If this is sounding weird, it's because I tend to thin is very
>metaphorical/symboic terms.  By life I do not mean the actually phycial
>life, but the spiritual essense of a person.  My background is in pschology
>(with tendancies toward Jungian) and I've had several personal experiences
>with psychic vampires.  I'd be most interested in hearing, either on this
>newsgroup or in replies directly to myself, what others think of this notion
>that mythical vampires have evolved to suit what we know of people who feed
>off of others.

Well, she did her best to suck the life out of me.  I guess that she didn't
count on my essence being darker than her's

>
>Michele Funk
>mfunk@reed.edu


--
There are no absolutes, and even that's a maybe.
tag@ecn.purdue.edu (Tony A. Gibbens)
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: mm459504@LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Michael Miller)
Subject: Re: Movie List
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 1992 18:12:08 GMT
Organization: Colorado State U. Engineering College



Definately: Fright Nite, and Fright Nite II

bestest scary,campy,funny good vamp films I've seen, the sequel is equally as
goo as the first one.

Mike


--
"You seem ah decent fellow.  Ahd hate to keel you." - I. Montoya
"Well, you seem a decent fellow.  I'd hate to die." - Wesley
mm459504@longs.lance.colostate.edu
From: gairns@ccrs.emr.ca (Jamie Gairns)
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: The idea behind alt.vampyres
Date: 12 Sep 92 23:41:29 GMT
Organization: Canada Centre for Remote Sensing, Ottawa

In article <20272@plains.NoDak.edu> bohlman@plains.NoDak.edu (Daemon) writes:
>Just out of curiousity, (I want to hear some other ideas about this...)
>What is the best way to destroy a vampire and be _sure_ that it won't come
>back?


	I believe the Slavs have always used decapitation and purging by
	fire to accomplish that.  That doesn't account for any non-
	corporeal components, however. ;-)

	Seamus
From: ygoland@edison.seas.ucla.edu (The Jester)
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: Being made...
Date: 12 Sep 92 19:16:50 GMT
Organization: The Hacker Conference

>grabbed her by the neck and screamed in pain.  She was wearing a Star
>of David necklace, which burned his hand.
>
>So my question then becomes, what does an atheist or an agnostic do?
>In my case, nothing, since it's sort of a fantasy of mine, but for those
>who have no interest in vampirism, what would they do?
>
Oh thats easy!!!!! Being an Atheist, I'd grab a gun! I have faith in
Smith and Wesson! =)




				The Jester



-- 
                    The Jester
"It's because somebody knows something about it that we can't
talk about physics. It's the things that nobody knows anything
about we can discuss."- Richard Feynman
From: bole@hmivax.humgen.upenn.edu (Greg Bole)
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: Re: Some info on upcoming vampire films
Date: 8 Sep 92 23:41:29 GMT
Organization: HHMI/Human Genetics, Univ of Pa.

In article <1992Sep4.174224.1978@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu>, 
jae@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:

> For those curious about upcoming vampire films (and especially 
> Francis Ford Coppola's _Dracula_) I gleaned the following from
> the July logs of VAMPYRES@GUVM.

One upcoming movie I haven't seen mentioned was _A Vampire's Tale_
starring Julian Sands.  (Who in my book would be the perfect Lestat)
This film tries to avoid most "typically Hollywood" stereotypes of Vampires.


And to all you who want to *be* vampires...the closest thing I can suggest is
play one on a MUD (Multi-User Dungeon).  Read the rec.games.mud.* family of 
Net groups for more info.  They are interactive games that you can telnet to.

I am a 12th level "Master of Mists" in a vampire guild on a MUD named Nirvana.
It's great fun to "be" a vamp.  I love the drama and the mystery of it.  We 
also wield great powers.  My name is Mordred, son of Arthur.

Greg Bole                             "Traitor, now thy death-day has come!"
bole@hmivax.humgen.upenn.edu          King Arthur as he slays his son Mordred

Dad never knew I was already dead...
<Mordred grins evilly, exposing his fangs>
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: forman@fraser.sfu.ca (Pamela Catherine Forman)
Subject: Buffy was great - NOT.
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 19:16:52 GMT

Just got back from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.  My friend said it was
great.  OK, but NOT great.  Had some good humor in it and I
particularly liked Paul Rubens.  He makes a great vampire!  

Can anyone figure out what audience this was for?  There were a ton of
small kids there but very little laughing.
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 02:01:25 EDT
From: James Klingler <JRK123@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: another vamp film

Hello all ...


    I can't believe that that great comedy effort from down-under "The Wicked"
was not mentioned.
    Some excellent lines in that one !!!


Jim Klingler (JRK123@psuvm.psu.edu)
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Wednesday, 9 Sep 1992 22:35:01 EDT
From: that angry guy <IO20557@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
Subject: werewolves

Just wanted to bring up the thread and see what info you folks had on the
topic  -TC
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: mattox@cs.uiuc.edu (David Mattox)
Subject: Re: Anne Rice
Reply-To: mattox@kbesrl.me.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 21:16:50 GMT

In article <umage.715710119@mcl>, umage@mcl.ucsb.edu (androgyny) writes:
|>  
|> Have you read her other SF like the mummy.. ?
|> 


I have and I enjoyed it very much. It has a lot more romance in it than her vampire novels (for those of you who like that sort of stuff). My wife liked "The Mummy" better than the vampire books.

-- 
dave mattox
mattox@kbesrl.me.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: kklai@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu (Curtis D)
Subject: Re: Fiction vampire list, version 1.0
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 16:49:04 GMT

In article <1992Sep9.232625.3990@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca> aaron@space.ualberta.ca writes:
>
>Patricia Elrod

P.N. Elrod
	BloodList
	Blood Circle
        ??? (this one escapes me at the moment)
	Art in the Blood
	Fire in the Blood
	??? (the new one)

>Anne Rice
>   (The Vampire Chronicles)
>   Interview With The Vampire
>   The Vampire Lestat
>   Queen of The Damned
   	her new one -- The Thief of Bodies (????)

John Steakley
	Vampire$


========================= Fluffy the Wonder Bunny ============================
       Sex is not the answer, sex is the question. Yes is the answer.
==============================================================================
     The U.S. has George Bush, Johnny Cash, Bob Hope, and Stevie Wonder.
         Canada has Brian Mulroney, No Cash, No Hope...No Wonder.
==============================================================================
      The other night I was lying in bed, looking up at the stars, and
              I wondered, "Where the FUCK is my ROOF ?!?"
================== cadesjardins@descartes.waterloo.edu =======================
  Hi! I am a .signature virus. Copy me into your .signature and join the fun!
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: dkl@xcluud.sccsi.com (David Karl Leikam)
Subject: Re: Being made...
Organization: Greater Montrose UFO Appreciation Society & Data Haven
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:25:24 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.015904.26923@midway.uchicago.edu> wag5@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <g1tnw8j.catcher@netcom.com> catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco) writes:
>>In article <1992Sep9.131036.17282@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> kmoore@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kyle E Moore) writes:
>>A number of years ago when I was reading comic books there was a story
>>in the X-Men involving Dracula. ...
>>
>
>	Well, I don't know how to answer your question without exploring
>the entire nature of the vampire, but I would like to say that there
>was a very entertaining comic series I think from the 70' about
>Dracula.  It may have been Marvel.  Anyway, I remember some things
>about bizarre undead children and wives and whatnot.  There was a group
>hunting him down, of mortals as well.
>

	Wondered when we'd get to this genre. You definitely don't want
to miss Marvel's adult series, "Hellblazer" (Not to be confused with
Clive Barker's "HellRAISER". Not the same thing at all.)  In particular,
issue #50, "Remarkable Lives", was a vampire story, and a good one.
 
    Don't blame me if this addicts you to John Constantine. While you're
in the comic store (or wherever) you might also want to glance over Neil
Gaiman's "The Sandman". Just happened to win the World Fantasy Award for
best story last year. 

Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: zippy@cs.mcgill.ca (Fotis XIPOLITAKIS)
Subject: Re: Buffy was great - NOT.
Organization: SOCS, McGill University, Montreal, Canada
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 04:04:50 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.191652.169@sfu.ca> forman@fraser.sfu.ca (Pamela Catherine Forman) writes:
>Just got back from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.  My friend said it was
>great.  OK, but NOT great.  Had some good humor in it and I
>particularly liked Paul Rubens.  He makes a great vampire!  
>

	You just gotta love Paul Rubins death scene... I split a gut! I
	didn't think Rutger Haur was up to scratch in this film though.

zippy@binkley.cs.mcgill.ca


Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: ingmarsl@bcarh136.bnr.ca (Ingmar Slomic)
Subject: Vampire Story...
Keywords: Brian Lumley, Vamphri
Organization: Bell-Northern Research
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 16:57:54 GMT

Hey all...

I am very distressed over the fact that no one has mentionned Brian Lumley's Necroscope series. Now there are some awesome vampires. My girlfriend and I both read Anne Rice's stuff, but I prefer the Vamphri (Lumleys vampires) since they are REALLY evil. Big time bad guys!

Now, the Necroscope series consist of five books and doesn't concentrate on vampires exclusively. There is a lot of science fiction / fantasy and MUCHO HORROR.

If you're interested just in the intense vampire story, you may like to start with the third book NECROSCOPE III - THE SOURCE. The books I have are from the old publishing company and I believe that they are now on TOR HORROR.

Happy reading...

The BIG Ig
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres
From: steinman@me.utoronto.ca (David Steinman)
Subject: Re: Vlad Tepes, a defense
Organization: UofT Mechanical Engineering
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 04:53:06 GMT

blowfish@carina.unm.edu (rON.) writes:

>I want to defend, yes, defend Vlad Tepes. He wasn't that despotic as people
>continually play him up to be. Oh, sure, I admit the given facts- he did
>drink blood, and didn't get the title 'Vlad the Impaler' because he liked
>shish-ka-bob :) but he was mostly just a product of his times- the middle
>15th century. What with Europe just recovering from the ravages of the Black
>Plague, France and England beating each other up for 100 years, the Germans
>(Hapsbugs) trying to dominate the interior and the final pressure (to which
>that entire area finally fell), the Turkish Ottoman Empire (to which Tepes
>and Rumania fell in the late 1460's).

>Tepes and his methods were no worse than those around him, just much more
>memorable. :)

While Vlad was probably no worse than, say, Caligula, apparently he was a
bit atypical for his times.  Colin Wilson, in "A Criminal History of
Mankind" (great book, btw), describes Vlad as "one of the most appalling
monsters in history, deriving tremendous pleasure (undoubtedly sexual) from
watching people die slowly."  Wilson's subsequent paragraph-long tally of
Vlad's crimes seems to indicate a guy exceeded his contemporaries, such as
Ivan the Terrible.
--
Dave!
Newsgroups: alt.vampyres