HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: On Signing....
Date: 10 Oct 92 04:57:23 GMT
Reply-To: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:124/2120 - Fingers Talk, Irving TX
X-Fidonet: Silent Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24829

[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 CC> I fully understand what your saying.  Took ASL-1 and
 CC> English 101 as a first year college student, quite an experince
 CC> to say the least.  Most of the deaf students have one heck of a
 CC> time getting through the English classes, and after taking ASL
 CC> I can understand why.  I was lucky I didn't start losing my
 CC> hearing until after High school, still going back to school at
 CC> 52 even using a Phonic-Ear, English is not one of the easier
 CC> subjects.  The deaf do need a lot more help in their younger
 CC> years.

I agree English is a very difficult language but I've always enjoyed
it.  Even though I was born profoundly deaf, I've never needed to
use ASL/SEE/PSE as I've always been able to communicate orally.

I think the younger the deaf children are, the easier it is for
them to learn English.  Many of the public schools nowadays are
starting classes for deaf pre-schoolers in hopes of them learning
English before they go into the 1st grade.  I do feel they should
be given a first shot at oralism and go with SEE/PSE if needed.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!124!2120!Ann.Stalnaker
Internet: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org
From: Lynn.Rosenberg@f207.n260.z1.fidonet.org (Lynn Rosenberg)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Vacation Spots For The Bd
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:21:28 GMT
Reply-To: Lynn.Rosenberg@f207.n260.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:260/207 - The Recovery Room, Rochester NY
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24923

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

I would like to propose the following questions.  I did the same on
another echo and the questions weren't answered.  Has anybody attended
the Lighthouse resourt in Barnaget New Joursey?  If so, how are the
housing conditions, do they treat you like adults, and if so are the
activities structured or non structured etc.  I have been going to Lake
Joseph Centre in Canada for the past several years and its basicly like
a regular resourt but designed for blind people but their is no
pampering etc. like most of the vacation spots for blind people and the
activities aren't structured like most other places and you can go as
long as you want to as long as you have the money to pay for it.  My
friend who also lives in Rochester feels the same way as I do, and he
has attended other places.  Any comments.  Lynn

 * SLMR 2.1a * I'm in shape ... round's a shape isn't it?

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Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!260!207!Lynn.Rosenberg
Internet: Lynn.Rosenberg@f207.n260.z1.fidonet.org
From: Steve.Bauer@f7.n291.z1.fidonet.org (Steve Bauer)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: RS Calculaotr
Date: 14 Oct 92 15:27:46 GMT
Reply-To: Steve.Bauer@f7.n291.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:291/7 - Union Station, Wichita KS
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24955

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

Has anyone else bought the new talking Calculator from Radio Shack?

I'm still pretty impressed with it.

My only problem is I try to go too fast and my fingers screw up.

Steve

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Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!291!7!Steve.Bauer
Internet: Steve.Bauer@f7.n291.z1.fidonet.org
From: Bob.Hay@p3.f54.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Bob Hay)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: How to get on other bbs
Date: 13 Oct 92 04:24:16 GMT
Reply-To: Bob.Hay@p3.f54.n105.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:105/54.3 - JOBS BBS, Portland OR
X-Fidonet: Silent Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24887

[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 > IMHO, our problem is that hearing aid manufacturers do not perceive
 > hearing aid users as their market.  The manufacturers sell to the
 > hearing aid dealers, so that is the bunch they cater to - not us.
 > The dealers are interested in a simple product they can sell quickly for
 > a huge markup, one that does not require they invest in expensive
 > fitting equipment.  Until the marketing situation changes, I doubt we
 > can expect significant technological progress.

I think you have some good points there.  Contrast that with the eyeglass
industry which is very sensitive to user desires and as a result there are
many options.  Granted some of them are glitz, but there are a lot of choices.

Maybe the average hearing aid buyer just isn't very demanding.  When i got my
first aid, my audiologist showed me the options, i picked one that seemed good
and i am still wearing it 12 years later.  Now, when i go back to pick out
number three i will be much more picky and do some serious shopping around for
features.

A good aid, i think, should not only give good performance but also minimize
the number of weirdies you need to deal with everyday (feedback from something
moving in close proximity, using the telephone, exposure to bursts of noise,
etc. ).  These things, if poorly handled, can cause stress which we try to
ignore but is there nontheless.

bh.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!105!54.3!Bob.Hay
Internet: Bob.Hay@p3.f54.n105.z1.fidonet.org
From: Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Carla Campbell)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: chatting online
Date: 14 Oct 92 15:33:07 GMT
Reply-To: Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/89.0 - BlinkLink, Pittsburgh PA
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24987

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

 RD> I keep thinking there's got to be a better way, and everyone
 RD> say there is, but I
 RD> haven't made it work right yet.  I've never participated in an
 RD> online conference

Well, there are some ways to deal with the problem of live chat
where the person on the other end is typing onto your screen
character by character.  Depends, of course, on what speech
software you're using, how it can be helped.

Flipper has a "Delayed Time-Out for Listening to Remote Typing"
option which makes the other person's typing come out in "chunks"
which result in pronounceable words for your synthesizer.

With Vert, you can set the End of Word Delay Verbal Option up to
some ridiculous number and that usually works for me.

I think most of the other screen readers have some way of handling
this.  Review Mode, of course, also works. ;-)

Most live conferencing systems where there are more than two people
chatting at once do not work the way a SysOp's "chat mode" works.
Text is typed in at each user's terminal, but not sent until he or
she presses <return>.  That way, it is all sent at once, and,
therefore, is printed to your screen all at once, not character by
character, as it's typed.  Usually, the user's name is printed,
then what he or she has said.  You don't really "take turns"
talking-- people just type in and everything everyone says just
gets printed to your screen (and theirs) in the order in which  it
arrives at the central computer.

Cheers!
                                                 --Carla

... Read what I mean, not what I write!

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.0!Carla.Campbell
Internet: Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
From: Ann.Sab@f603.n322.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Sab)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Howdy!
Date: 10 Oct 92 04:57:31 GMT
Reply-To: Ann.Sab@f603.n322.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:322/603 - Alphaville, Worcester MA
X-Fidonet: Silent Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24830

[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

i'm deaf-blind user--the only deaf-blind one to use bbs's in my
area and already i'm very popular. i already madde friends here and
had a few sysops vist me. so dont be shy--just try it. i cant
waleither--am wheelchair bound. and yet i know how to conduct
myself.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!322!603!Ann.Sab
Internet: Ann.Sab@f603.n322.z1.fidonet.org
From: Curtis.Delzer@f9264.n203.z1.fidonet.org (Curtis Delzer)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: Artic Transport
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:20:06 GMT
Reply-To: Curtis.Delzer@f9264.n203.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:203/9264 - Your BBS, Sacramento CA
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24914

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

*** Quoting Sanford Alexander to Steve Bauer dated 09-11-92 ***
> I am also a fan of the Artic Transport.

It is a good product but cost toooooooooooo "___damn___" much
money!!!!  Why is it these companies figure that since they make a
product for a market of which people in it get most of their money
from agencies that they must charge two arms, two legs and your
lights besides?  It is a completely ridiculous price they charge
for that product and their software.  I say that, being a
demonstrator for artic/vision and the Xerox/Kurzweil personal
reader.  I am bleeping sick and tired of telling my purspective
customors the prices for such equipment when I know the true cost
of production couldn't be more than 20 percent of what they're
paying because of all the mark up caused by vocational
rehabilitation agencies which continue to pay and pay to support
their bloated pocketbooks, and to think Artic/vision hasn't
upgraded their product in nearly 2 years is thoroughly
exasperating!  Now, you talk about a product like Tinytalk and
Vocal-eyes who are more representative, and I am good listener,
although vocal-eyes still is toooooo expensive!  Eric
definitely has the right approach, and supporting the interface to
the sound blaster which is the most economical approach seen to date.  I
wonder how many of us are using that way to read their messages in
this echo right now, compared to paying almost a thousand dollars
for Artic's package and actually hearing better quality speech?
Come on!  I ask you!  You've fired my ardor by your comment about
it being a good product, damn right it is along with the
screen reader but again, I ask you, is it worth over a thousand
bucks to make a portable box to plug into your friend's or a work
location computer?  It certainly might be if totally necessary for
the better survival of a job, but it isn't!  This is not any kind
of personal attack on you, just getting it off
my chest about our "high" prices and the organizations who continue
to line the pockets of the other organizations who make the equipment
available for our use.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!203!9264!Curtis.Delzer
Internet: Curtis.Delzer@f9264.n203.z1.fidonet.org
From: Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Eric Bohlman)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Codes on Status Line in WordPerfect
Date: 10 Oct 92 05:02:48 GMT
Reply-To: Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/89.3 - BlinkLink, Pittsburgh PA
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24856

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

 ST> My friend and I have both called WP and asked if it might not be
 ST> possible to have the legends (bold), (cen) and (und) appear on the
 ST> status line when any of these features are turned on, much in the way
 ST> that (typeover) and (block on) and (control block) already do.

I'm sighted and I'd find those changes useful myself, as I'm sure
others would.  The bold indication is hard to see on a mono monitor
if the brightness is turned up.  On a color monitor, the attributes
used for the "Pos" marker don't bear any meaningful relation to the
features that are turned on, and I often find myself going into
"reveal codes" just to make sure I have the right ones.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.3!Eric.Bohlman
Internet: Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
From: Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Eric Bohlman)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Tinytalk and Echo Package Info
Date: 7 Oct 92 15:43:06 GMT
Reply-To: Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/89.3 - BlinkLink, Pittsburgh PA
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24712

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

We're at:

OMS Development
1921 Highland Ave.
Wilmette, IL  60091
(708)251-5787

NOTE TO ALL:

The introductory pricing on the Echo PC ($105 alone, $175 with Tinytalk) has
been extended through the end of September.  After 9/30, pricing will be
$129.95 for the Echo ($200 with Tinytalk).

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.3!Eric.Bohlman
Internet: Eric.Bohlman@p3.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
From: janina@netcom.com (Janina Sajka)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: Braille N Speak Comp
Date: 13 Oct 92 04:04:14 GMT
Reply-To: janina@netcom.com (Janina Sajka)
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24864

You're quite correct -- I mis-stated.  I did not mean to say Z
Modem.  I have been unable to use Y Modem with PC Plus.  I was told
by David from Blazie today to turn off the "keep aborted downloads"
option in PC Plus to get Y Modem to work.  Have not yet had the
opportunity to try this .
From: Jack.O'Keeffe@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Jack O'Keeffe)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: speech recognition
Date: 14 Oct 92 15:50:53 GMT
Reply-To: Jack.O'Keeffe@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/89.0 - BlinkLink, Pittsburgh PA
X-Fidonet: Silent Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 25004

[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 DR> Speech Recognition: is anybody out there experimenting
 DR> with this technology on their home computer? I know
 DR> that speech recognition has a long way to go yet, but
 DR> perhaps there are some rudimentary forms that would be
 DR> useful, especially for the hearing impaired, like myself.

Speech recognition may be closer than you think, Doug.  I attended
a conference last year in Cambridge, MA, sponsored by the Regional
Bell Operating Companies, on speech input/output.  Patricia Flynn
McKenzie of Dragon Systems told us that Dragon was now demoing a
continuous sppech recognition system with 10,000 word vocabulary.
Said they were waiting for faster hardware (which has since become
available).  She predicted availability in two years, and that was
almost a year ago :-)

Frank Whitney, who is active in the 'Abled echo, is a serious user
of the Dragon speech input system.  Post a message to him and I'm
sure he will give you more information.

Jack O'keeffe
--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.0!Jack.O'Keeffe
Internet: Jack.O'Keeffe@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
From: Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Carla Campbell)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: Different Strokes!
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:20:25 GMT
Reply-To: Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/89.0 - BlinkLink, Pittsburgh PA
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24916

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

 WW>      Like I said, I just didn't want anyone thinking that a
 WW>  tugging dog is a bad guide dog, for that isn't what I was ever
 WW>  lead to believe by Seeing Eye...

Agree with you there, Willie.  Chance always leaned hard into the
harness and I like a good steady pull. I cannot imagine working with a
dog which did not "pull" steadily.  Seems like they'd be harder to
follow.  But that's me and what I'm used to.

A steady pull is *very* different from a nervous pull, too.  A nervous
"stop-start" pull would be very hard to work with, so far as I'm
concerned... and I wouldn't want to feel "out of control" as I think I
would with a dog with a nervous pull.  but a good, enthusiastic,
confident lean into the harness is mind kinda guiding. I *like* walking
4 miles and hour and whipping around obstacles. It's the race-car driver
in me...

<gulp> who knows. I may have the opportunity, in a month, to do a bit of
compare and contrast in working styles, myself. I'm just thankful
there're likely to bee half a dozen little old ladies in my class who'll
need the slow dogs. <grin>

... Read what I mean, not what I write!

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.0!Carla.Campbell
Internet: Carla.Campbell@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
From: Robert.Gilchrist@f715.n153.z1.fidonet.org (Robert Gilchrist)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Everest Announcement
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:17:32 GMT
Reply-To: Robert.Gilchrist@f715.n153.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:153/715 - The BandMaster, Vancouver BC
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24900

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

NOW RELEASED
Everest, affordable interpoint!

Interpoint
Everest braille embosser prints on both sides of braille or regular
paper at 100 characters-per-second.

Single sheets
Everest prints on single sheets. Its integral sheet feeder holds 100-150
sheets of braille paper.  When it finishes printing, your document is
ready to go--no bursting, tearing or collating.

Grade 2
Everest has the Duxbury Grade 2 braille translator built in.  That's
right--automatic Grade 2 braille!

Easy-to-use
Everest talks to you!  Select Grade 2 braille or any other setting with
digitized speech feedback.

Versatile
Everest prints braille from MS-dos, Mac and Apple II computers.  It
prints text and graphics on the same page.  It prints multiple copies
and has a 400,000 character buffer.

Compact
Everest takes up very little desk space, has carrying handles, and
weighs just 25 pounds.

TeleSensory knows braille printers.  Choose TeleSensory and you get 30
engineers, dedicated sales consultants, and over 20 years of customer
commitment.

Call today for a free braille sample:
800-227-8418 U.S.A.
Canada: British Columbia, Alberrta, Yukon and The Northwest Teritories
800-561-6222
Aroga Marketing Group
International 415-960-0920

TeleSensory
455 N. Bernardo Avenue
Mountain View, CA 94043

Robert Gilchrist
Technical Support
Aroga Marketing Group

... OFFLINE 1.35 * I like my QWK OFFLINE reader!

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!153!715!Robert.Gilchrist
Internet: Robert.Gilchrist@f715.n153.z1.fidonet.org
From: 34AEJ7D@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu (Bill Gorman)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: Newspaper for people with disabilities
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:50:16 GMT
Reply-To: 34AEJ7D@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu (Bill Gorman)
Organization: Olivetti AFD
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24690

I'd like to know too, but I recommend that anyone who subscribes
to such a publication do it through a PO Box.

W. K. Gorman
From: Ron.Denis@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org (Ron Denis)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: blinks and psychedelics
Date: 10 Oct 92 05:02:58 GMT
Reply-To: Ron.Denis@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:129/89.0 - BlinkLink, Pittsburgh PA
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24857

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

WW>  what can we assume about someone who has
 WW>  never had sight? That is, even if their optic nerve and visual
 WW>  cortex is totally intact, can we assume whatever is stored in
 WW>  that area of the brain is indeed what we call visual perceptions?
 WW>   I sincerely doubt there is anything like built in memories,
 WW>  although I suspect Jung and a few others may disagree with me,
 WW>  and without a visual memory, I just can't see how a visual
 WW>  hallucination could take place.

     I was once consulted by a psychiatrist with a totally blind patient who was

having "vivid visual hallucinations."  It was some time back and memory ain't
what it used to be, but I believe this person never had vision.  The
hallucinations were to my mind more "visualized" than visual and were elegantly
constructed from data collected over the years.
     Memories of blind toddlers are formed in pieces parts which are eventually
fused together into a coherent generally useful whole.  Much of this is done
without any conscious reflection.  In hallucinations, the same kinds of
processes seem to occur when blind people are having "visual hallucinations."
The reason I view these as "visualized" rather than purely visual is that the
descriptions seem to be overly elaborated and verbalized.
     Having said this much, I should add that I haven't run across this
phenomenon more than a couple if times and further haven't dealt with that many
blind persons having any kind of hallucinations.  It isn't that all blind people

are inordinately sane, they just don't wind up in my neighborhood.
     The norm, I am told, for blind persons on psychedelics is to experience
auditory and tactual phenomena.  One description I recall is of being able to
"reach out and touch things at enormous distances, being able to feel
everything in the room from where you are."  I would guess this is at least as
much like looking around the room as swinging that dog by the tail was.

Ron Denis

... A chicken is an egg's way of producing more eggs.

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Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!129!89.0!Ron.Denis
Internet: Ron.Denis@p0.f89.n129.z1.fidonet.org
From: Carol.Ashland@p0.f319.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Carol Ashland)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Re: Welfare Mentality
Date: 14 Oct 92 15:29:21 GMT
Reply-To: Carol.Ashland@p0.f319.n105.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:105/319.0 - Mostly Mail, Aloha OR
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24967

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

Hi Mike,

In regards to the NFB and all that:  Yes, I think we can agree to
disagree.  I used to feel pretty much like it really didn't matter, but
the issue of exit rows just did it for me.  I think that is such a silly
issue!  I don't think anyone with any kind of physical disability should
sit in those rows.  Aside from that, I was appalled when people held up
planes to make their point about that.  What kind of an idea does such
demonstrating leave with the employees of the airplane companY?  When
they think of a blind person, they will just think "oh yeah, one of
those radicals who held up the planes for two hours."  I think a
*realistic* approach to the limitations of blindness is more important.
There *are* limitations, regardless of what anyone says, and aside from
the obvious ones.  When I was in the NFB, the state leaders made all the
decisions, and expected the rank and file to just rubber-stamp their
ideas.  They were not amused when there was dissention.  *I* was not
amused by their dictatorial attitude.

I did receive your netmail, and attempted to reply to it.  I only hope
you get it.  The "to " line said it was to go to "UUEC," or something
like that.  I put your name in instead.  Maybe I messed it up that way?
Anyway, I explained about the job situation in that message.

Carol

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Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!105!319.0!Carol.Ashland
Internet: Carol.Ashland@p0.f319.n105.z1.fidonet.org
From: Phil.Scovell@p0.f810.n104.z1.fidonet.org (Phil Scovell)
Newsgroups: misc.handicap
Subject: Electronic Dictionary Use
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:18:38 GMT
Reply-To: Phil.Scovell@p0.f810.n104.z1.fidonet.org
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/810.0 - Electronic Library, Denver CO
X-Fidonet: Blink Talk Conference
Originator: wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com

Index Number: 24907

[This is from the Blink Talk Conference]

Matthew,

The RFB has lots of electronic text now and I hope they are continuing to
add to their library.  The dictionary is just one of over 200 titles they
have or at least I heard they were over 200 books now.

Phil.

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Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!104!810.0!Phil.Scovell
Internet: Phil.Scovell@p0.f810.n104.z1.fidonet.org