HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ertas@athena.mit.edu (Mehmet D Ertas)
Subject: Re: Accident in the Aegean sea
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 13:51:37 GMT

In article <6603.3248.uupcb@factory.com>, michael.polymenakos@factory.com (Michael Polymenakos)  writes:
|> 
|> 
|>   My tax dollars at work. Based on my IRS return, I give $8.72 every
|> year to Turkey, and over $6,000 to the Pentagon so that they can go out
|> there and play games like that. All this in one of the most travelled
|> closed seas of the world. This could have very easily been a commercial
|> ship, with hundreds of civilians aboard. Unfortunately, Ankara and the
|> Pentagon do not seem to care, just like they don't seem to care about
|> the lifes of all the Turkish sailors who were killed in this incident,
|> and in the incident 5 years ago when two Turkish landing boats collided
|> in the Aegean 5 or so years ago.

What are you talking about? How about the Greek Navy, who also took part in this
exercise? What if the hit ship was Greek, would you post the thing above
replacing "Turkish" with "Greek"? I agree that the practices of NATO 
in the Aegean are pointless to the point where it's harmful, but why
do you put all the blame on non-Greek sides of the issue? All NATO members
are equally responsible for this incident; maybe the US even more. This destroys
my whole belief in your sincerety about the worries that you
have about these practices, in a seemingly "humanitarian" context.



Oct. 2'nd from BBC news 
>-------------------------------------------------
......
> The US and Turkish vessels involved in
> today's accident were taking part in
> "Display Determination 92", an annual
> Nato exercise.
>
> It usually involves vessels from the
> US, Turkey, Greece and Italy.
>
> The USS Saratoga is a conventionally
> powered aircraft carrier commissioned
> in 1956 to launch jet aircraft; it is
> believed to have fired Sea Sparrows,
> anti-aircraft missiles.
....


|> 
|>   Meanwhile, while the turkish fleet is annually endangering the lifes
|> of its own crews and countless civilians in the Aegean, they want Greece
|> to demilitarize the Eastern Aegean isles, based on creative
|> interpretations of unrelated treaties. What the EEC 12 described as
|> "[Turkeys] reluctance to apply the principles of international law to
|> its differences of opinion with Greece" (Brussels 18 Jun 87) is the
|> primary cause behind these accidents, and all this needless loss of
|> life.

I will not comment on this, these isssues have been overly discussed to the
point of flaming on this net before. 

|> 
|> Michael.
|>                                                                                                  

Deniz Ertas.


Xref: sparky soc.culture.turkish:10511 talk.politics.mideast:20932 talk.politics.soviet:8371 soc.culture.greek:9557 soc.culture.europe:8831 soc.history:8870 soc.culture.yugoslavia:9055 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:282
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,talk.politics.mideast,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.history,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: "wieneramus the racist" is back.
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 92 18:19:03 EDT
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <717880079@locust.cs.duke.edu> wiener@duke.cs.duke.edu (Edward Wiener) writes:

>Subject: Fascists on the net

Coming from a self-admitted racist x-Soviet Jew, this is rather
amusing. Well, still anxiously awaiting...

The article below is taken from The Sunday Times, 1 March  1992, a
British Weekly, written by Thomas Goltz, from Agdam, Azerbaijan.

    ARMENIAN SOLDIERS MASSACRE HUNDREDS OF FLEEING FAMILIES.

    The spiralling  violence gripping the  outer republics of  the former
Soviet Union gained new impetus  yesterday with cold-blooded slaughter of
hundreds of women and children in war-racked Nagorno-Karabakh.
    Survivors  reported that  Armenian soldiers  shot and  bayoneted more
than 450  Azeris, many of  them women and  children, who were  fleeing an
attack  on their  town. Hundreds,  possibly thousands,  were missing  and
feared dead.
    The attackers  killed most of  the soldiers and  volunteers defending
the women  and children.  They then  turned their  guns on  the terrified
refugees. The few  survivors later described what  happened:" That's when
the real  slaughter began," said  Azer Hajiev,  one of three  soldiers to
survive. "The  Armenians just shot and  shot. And then they  came in and
started carving up people with their bayonets and knives."
    " They were shooting, shooting, shooting", echoed Rasia Aslanova, who
arrived in Agdam with other women and children who made their way through
Armenian lines. She said her husband, Kayun, and a son-in-law were killed
in front of her. Her daughter was still missing.
    One boy who arrived in Agdam had an ear sliced off.

    The survivors  said 2000  others, some of  whom had  fled separately,
were still missing in the gruelling terrain; many could perish from their
wounds or the cold.
    By late  yesterday, 479 deaths had  been registered at the  morgue in
Agdam's morgue,  and 29 bodies  had been buried  in the cemetery.  Of the
seven corpses  I saw awaiting  burial, two  were children and  three were
women, one shot through the chest at point blank range.
    Agdam hospital was  a scene of carnage and terror.  Doctors said they
had 140 patients who escaped slaughter, most with bullet injuries or deep
stab wounds.
    Nor were they safe in Agdam. On friday night rockets fell on the city
which  has a  population  of 150,000,  destroying  several buildings  and
killing one person.

Serdar Argic

                     'This war quickly developed into one of extermination. 
                      We closed the roads and mountain passes that might 
                      serve as ways of escape for the Tartars [Turks] and 
                      then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)
From: gt0702a@prism.gatech.EDU (Muzaffer Kayhan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: World Cup Qualifying Round Results From Turkey's Group
Date: 14 Oct 92 22:48:42 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

Norway continued on with its successful pursuit to qualify and was able to

force a tie with England in Wembley. With today's score of 1-1, Norway has

three wins and a draw and is currently leading the group.



Holland and Poland were also tied with a score of 2-2 in Holland.


-- 
Muzaffer Kayhan
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
uucp:	  ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt0702a
Internet: gt0702a@prism.gatech.edu
From: hpzg0650@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Hale P Zengingonul)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Re: MEB bursu borc odemesi
Date: 8 Oct 92 16:00:16 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

ksahin@oscar.UUCP (Kamil Sahin) writes:

>Herkese iyigunler,

>Aranizda MEB'den burslu gelip daha sonra borcunu odeyenler varsa ogrenmek
>istedigim bir sey var:

>Bakanlik kendilerine olan borcumu bildirdi ve benden bir odeme plani istiyor.
>Fakat gonderdikleri yazida taksit miktarlari icin hic bir sey belirtilmemis 
>("borcunuzla orantili taksit miktari" ifadesi disinda). Bu durumda ne kadarlik
>bir miktar onermem mantikli olur ? Odeme suresinde herhangi bir limit var mi,
>kriter nedir, herhangi bir teklifi red etmeleri soz konusu mu ?

>Bu konuda bilgisi olanlar email adresime yazarlarsa memnun olurum.
>Simdiden tesekkurler...

>Kamil Sahin
>ksahin@oscar.hns.com

  Bu konuda bilgisi olan varsa lutfen nete yazsin ben de odemeye baslamak
icin ne gibi islemlerden gecmek gerek vs., turu seyelri ogrenmek istiyorum.
						Pinar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.greek
From: cc433336@LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Constantinos A. Caroutas)
Subject: Re: Typical Greek Foreign Policy
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1992 21:43:41 GMT
Organization: Colorado State U. Engineering College
Keywords: Display Determination, NATO, Warsaw

In article <1b340uINNme8@agate.berkeley.edu>, sadi@physics3 (Sadi Turgut)
writes:
> The Greek government is not participating in the Display
>Determination exercises since May 8th, 1981. The Greek
>reasoning is a childish attempt to legalize the re-militarization
>of the islands within NATO at least, in spite of the
>international treaties that clearly bind them. They

It was explained repeatedly that the islands may be militarized.

>demand that the island of Lemnos should be included
>within the exercises since it is completely armed.
>However, NATO, determined not to yield to the childish
>games of the Greek government, has proclaimed the island
>as a disputed area and has excluded the island from the

It's not disputed. It is Greek territory.

>declaration. Given such a history of intrigue, perhaps one
>should ask why NATO needs Greece anyway.

Considering that Russia wants to join NATO, one should ask why NATO needs
to exist.
--
Constantinos A. Caroutas

"It's easy to make mistakes when others will be held responsible."
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 03:49:21 EDT
From: <FL1@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: News...


NEWS 10/8/92              PAGE  1 OF  3

   Economic Blockage Latest Tactic
     In Clash Among Rival Kurds
                 ---
    ANKARA, Turkey - Turkish warplanes
Wednesday bombed northern Iraqi bases
operated by Turkish Kurdish rebels.
    Rival Iraqi Kurds continued their
offensive to drive the Turkish Kurds
out of Iraq, and the Turkish rebels
retaliated by imposing an economic
blockade on northern Iraq.
    The move forced thousands of
Turkish truckers to halt illegal trade
with the Iraqi Kurds.

NEWS 10/8/92              PAGE  2 OF  3

    Turkish warplanes attacked bases of
the Kurdistan Workers Party, or PKK, at
Hakhurk and Durji, about 6 miles inside
Iraq, witnesses said.
    The air strike was a routine opera-
tion as part of daily reconnaissance
flights in the area, said a Turkish
military official who spoke on
condition of anonymity.
    He said initial intelligence showed
that the Turkish Kurds were fleeing
toward Syria and Iran.
    There was no immediate word on
casualties.

NEWS 10/8/92              PAGE  3 OF  3

    Iraqi Kurds began a major military
offensive against the Turkish Kurdish
rebels on Friday.
    In retaliating with its economic
blockade, the Turkish Kurds said in a
statement that the embargo was the
''best response to that treacherous
group.'' ''All truck trafficking and
... trade must come to an end,'' said
the statement, which was obtained by
the AP.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.turkish:10638 soc.culture.greek:9718
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.greek
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Re: Sinek yokken ortada neden kuyruk sallar "tamtamlar".
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 18:42:52 EDT
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <pnevmati.719091735@cs.wisc.edu> pnevmati@milhouse.cs.wisc.edu (Dionisios N. Pnevmatikatos) writes:

>>  Afto to anekdoto den to akousa prin.  Ksereis pou egrapse o kosmos
>>  thn kybernish otan tou zhtouse na mhn kanei thn diadilwsh sthn
>>  0essaloniki, e?

>[stuff I can't understand deleted].

Trick or treat...

>OK, one article in turkish in scg could be a mistake, but two starts
>getting annoying. 

I am sorry to hear that.

>Please, either write in a language we can understand,
>or don't crosspost in social.culture.greek.

There is no doubt in my mind that if "paliks" stopped posting
Greek garbage to sct, there would be no more Turkish articles 
posted by sera to scg. 


Serdar Argic

                     'This war quickly developed into one of extermination. 
                      We closed the roads and mountain passes that might 
                      serve as ways of escape for the Tartars [Turks] and 
                      then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 04:11:55 EDT
From: <FL1@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: News...

NEWS 10/9/92              PAGE  1 OF  3

   Turkey Conducts Air Raids
     On Turkish Kurds In Iraq
                 ---
    ZAKHO, Iraq - Turkish jets and
artillery have joined Iraqi Kurds in a
5-day offensive to dislodge Turkey's
Kurdish rebels from northern Iraq,
officials on the attacking side claimed
Thursday.
    Turkish Defense Minister Nevzat
Ayaz confirmed his jet fighters
attacked camps of the rebel Kurdistan
Workers Party, or PKK, according to
Turkey's Anatolia news agency.

NEWS 10/9/92              PAGE  2 OF  3

    Ayaz said F-104s and F-4s flew more
than 25 sorties over 2 days from bases
in southeastern Turkey, adding that
Turkey would continue its help for as
long as the Iraqi Kurds request it,
Anatolia reported.
    State Department spokesman Richard
Boucher in Washington defended the
raids, saying the U.S. ''supported the
Turkish government in its efforts to
fight against terrorism.''
    Sunday, Iraqi Kurds began attacking
the rebel Turkish Kurds, who seek
autonomy from Turkey.

NEWS 10/9/92              PAGE  3 OF  3

    More than 5,000 people have died in
the 8-year guerrilla fight.
    Iraqi Kurds resent the guerrillas'
presence in northern Iraq because
Turkish military actions against them
cause civilian casualties.
    The Iraqi Kurds also are anxious
not to alienate Turkey because the
Western force protecting northern Iraq
from Saddam Hussein's army uses Turkish
bases. Turkey also is a crucial source
of supplies and transit route for the
area of northern Iraq under their
control.
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,talk.politics.mideast,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.history
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Local Armenians and Greeks started a pogrom against Jews immediately...
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 92 22:50:49 EDT
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <qX10RB4w165w@cybernet.cse.fau.edu> lyrvas@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (vassilis lyroudis) writes:

>Dear Sadik, it is not that difficult to understand us.  500 years of 
>Turkish occupation and the fact that every Greek family lost a number
>of its members to the Turks.  Add the bitterness for the land you 

Then you became "redneck ignorant palik" and "pinko egghead joker".

Source: Professor Stanford J. Shaw, 'The Jews of the Ottoman Empire and the
        Turkish Republic,' New York University Press, New York (1991).

 page 203:

  <<In 1865, immediately after enactment of the new Organic Statute for the
  Jewish community, and just as Jewish capital from Europe was beginning
  to have an effect in Istanbul, local Armenians and Greeks started a pogrom
  against Jews immediately across the sea of Marmara at Haydarpasa, terminus
  of the Anatolia railroad, with three hundred Jews massacred and many more
  beaten and raped before the disturbance was stopped after the Sultan sent
  his personal guard across the bay to protect the Jews [39].>>

[39] El Tiempo, 28 April 1926; Galante, Istanbul I,185; Galante, Documents V,
     340-41.

Serdar Argic

                     'This war quickly developed into one of extermination. 
                      We closed the roads and mountain passes that might 
                      serve as ways of escape for the Tartars [Turks] and 
                      then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Net-bandit running short of words
From: Hakki_Kocabas@kcbbs.gen.nz (Hakki Kocabas)
Date: 9 Oct 92 00:00:39 GMT
Organization: Kappa Crucis Unix BBS, Auckland, New Zealand

 
Mikhail Zeleny is already running short of words :->
Answering public messages by private threats:->:->:->
 
> In article <10292279.77102.19750@kcbbs.gen.nz> you write:
> >
> >  
> >> It is to be hoped that Mr Rushdie, as well as some of his numerous Western  
> >> defenders, in this forum and elsewhere, will see fit to contribute towards  
> >> the elimination of the continued threat against his life, which also  
> >> constitutes a menace for the cardinal principle of Western culture, the  
> >> idea of freedom of expression.  I sincerely hope that all participants in  
> >          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^  
> >  
> >Hey Mikhail!  
> >you should very well know by now that the idea of "freedom of expression"  
> >is just another idea out of basketfull of ideas for us unless you reveal   
> >more about the machinary behind it. We need MORE REVELATIONS from YOUR BOOK   
> >of BOOKS Man! BRING YOUR BOOK ! so that we can compare it word to word,   
> >and see how far you can endure exercising your "freedom of expression"...  
> >Yes Mikhail, I am challenging you :->Don't forget to bring by the  
> >revelations of Rushdie with you.  
> 
> Well, send me your seconds then.  Pistols at 75 meters is my choice.
 
Hey Mikhail, how can you silence words by pistols Man ! 
What happened to your:->
 
;->->> the cardinal principle of Western culture, 
;->->> the idea of freedom of expression.  
 
> >Here you are Mikhail, throw your artifacts like the magicians of Pharoah..  
> >Here is your once in a life time chance....don't miss it Man !  
> 
> I assure you that I won't miss.
> 
> >> the current debate would agree that this action makes the situation more  
> >> fair and equitable.  
 
> >> mikhail zeleny@husc.harvard.edu  
 
ya pipi, ya pistol ha ?
 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
From: hilmi-er@vall (Hilmi Eren)
Subject: Sen Nesin Be Aziz?
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, NADA
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 11:37:19 GMT


Yok Ataturk kendi adini kendi almista,
imzasi kopyaymista,
Turk halkinin atasi degilmiste,
Sen Nesin Be Aziz?


Turk halki enayiymiste,
Kahraman degilmiste,
Savastan kacarmista,
Sen Nesin Be Aziz?


Marksismin dagildi mi desem?
Dinzisligin carpti mi desem?
Yalnizligin bunalti mi desem?
Sen Nesin Be Aziz?


Syleyim mi Sen Nesin Aziz?
Sen soyadini aldigin gunki kararsizligin icerindesin,
Nerde olursan ol, Kim olursan ol geri dn Be Aziz Nesin!





Hilmi Eren
Department Of Coputer And Systems Science
Stockholm Universty, Sweden
Hilmi@dsv.su.se
Xref: sparky soc.culture.turkish:10515 talk.politics.mideast:20936 talk.politics.soviet:8375 soc.culture.greek:9561 soc.culture.europe:8835 soc.history:8874 soc.culture.yugoslavia:9059 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:286
From: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,talk.politics.mideast,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.history,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Followup-To: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: "wieneramus" will not get away with the Turkish genocide's cover-up.
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 92 18:23:28 EDT
Reply-To: sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic)
Distribution: world

In article <718396007@locust.cs.duke.edu> wiener@duke.cs.duke.edu (Edward Wiener) writes:

>      Silly boy, my given name is Eduard, but I've used Edward

Nope. Your given name is "wieneramus the self-admitted racist". Armenian 
government got away with the genocide of 2.5 million Turkish men, women 
and children and is enjoying the fruits of that genocide. You, and those 
like you, will not get away with the genocide's cover-up.

Source: "Men Are Like That" by Leonard Ramsden Hartill. The Bobbs-Merrill
Company, Indianapolis (1926). (305 pages). 
(Memoirs of an Armenian officer who participated in the genocide of 2.5 
 million Muslim people)

p. 202.

"We closed the roads and mountain passes that might serve as 
 ways of escape for the Tartars and then proceeded in the work 
 of extermination. Our troops surrounded village after village. 
 Little resistance was offered. Our artillery knocked the huts 
 into heaps of stone and dust and when the villages became untenable 
 and inhabitants fled from them into fields, bullets and bayonets 
 completed the work. Some of the Tartars escaped of course. They 
 found refuge in the mountains or succeeded in crossing the border 
 into Turkey. The rest were killed. And so it is that the whole 
 length of the borderland of Russian Armenia from Nakhitchevan to 
 Akhalkalaki from the hot plains of Ararat to the cold mountain 
 plateau of the North were dotted with mute mournful ruins of 
 Tartar villages. They are quiet now, those villages, except for 
 howling of wolves and jackals that visit them to paw over the 
 scattered bones of the dead." 

Serdar Argic

                     'This war quickly developed into one of extermination. 
                      We closed the roads and mountain passes that might 
                      serve as ways of escape for the Tartars [Turks] and 
                      then proceeded in the work of extermination.'
                                                       (Ohanus Appressian)


Xref: sparky soc.culture.turkish:10642 talk.politics.mideast:21121 talk.politics.soviet:8446 soc.culture.greek:9722 soc.culture.europe:8945 soc.rights.human:3903
From: kutluk@ccl.umist.ac.uk (Kutluk Ozguven)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.greek
Subject: Re: Typical Greek Foreign Policy
Keywords: Display Determination, NATO, Warsaw
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:45:02 GMT
Organization: Manchester Computing Centre

In <1992Oct13.011032.267@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU> 8800529@hydra.maths.unsw.EDU.AU writes:

> In few occasions has a country been so isolated like Turkey.

Someone please e-mail this man the current situation on this planet
before I tell him that  Turkey is the president of the Council of
Europe, vice president of CSCE, and one of the main supporters of
NATO. These are the western organizations. In the East liberated
Turkic republics are naturally as warm to us as we are to them. In
Balkans and the Caucasus, as well as Russia proper, Turkey is an
economic aid provider and assists the development in all aspects. In
the last Bosnian crisis and pressure on Serbia, the
diplomatic-oriented efforts of Turkey have been fully backed by all
the Muslim countries  first time in the history.   

Does Greece has any friends other than the genocidal Serbian
government and Milosevic's financial launderette South Cyprus ?

Kutluk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
From: TEX5HAD@CMS1.LEEDS.AC.UK (Haluk DEMIRBAG)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Secon Success: RIFAT OZBEK IS BRITAIN'S TOP DESIGNER
Date: 13 Oct 1992 13:43:33 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
Reply-To: Turkish Cultural Program List <TRKNWS-L%USCVM.BitNet@pucc.PRINCETON.EDU>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

RIFAT OZBEK IS BRITAIN'S TOP DESIGNER

RIFAT Ozbek was named Designer of the Year at the British Fashion
Awards gala in London's Grosvenor House Hotel last night, *writes
Hilary Alexander*.

Mr Ozbek, 38, who previously won  the title in 1988, received his
award from the Duchess of Kent.

Turkish-born Mr Ozbek was picked  from a shortlist which included
Vivienne  Westwood,  winner for  the  last  two years,  Catherine
Walker,  dubbed  the  favourite dress  designer  of  the Princess
[Diana]  of  Wales,  Arabella   Pollen,  Nicole  Farhi  and  John
Richmond.

But his place  on the shortlist led to criticism  of the criteria
on  which the  term  "British  designer" were  based  and to  the
withdrawal of Jasper Conran and Paul Smith.

Mr  Conran, withdrew  because, it  was said,  he felt  that Ozbek
should not  be eligible as  he was now  based in Italy.  Mr Smith
disagreed with the "self-congratulatory" nature of the event.

THE DAILY TELEGRAPH - London, October 13, 1992
            _
|-| /-\ |_ |_| |< {Turkish Culture (c) copyright!}