HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kte@INEL.GOV (Kathryn L Cook)
Subject: Re: More on the neurotic Dachshund. 
Reply-To: kte@INEL.GOV (Kathryn L Cook)
Organization: Idaho National Engineering Lab
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 14:24:05 GMT

I just read a short blurb in "Off Lead" magazine regarding the relationship
between spinal/back injuries and aggressiveness in dogs. It was just
3 or 4 lines, but gave a reference to the original study.  Basically they found
that dogs with spinal injuries where more likely to snap etc.  Also said
that most of these injuries were caused by neck jerks or constant straining
on leashes as I remember. As the subject dog is a Dachshund I thought this
might be of interest.  The whole thing makes sense to me, after being in
a head-on collision years ago and know suffering with chronic back pain,
I know how hard it is to be nice when you just can't get relieve no matter 
what you do. Yeh, that's it I'm grouchy because of my back, Yeh. I don't 
have the article handy, but if someone is interested in the exact study
I can get it next week or you might be able find "Off Lead" at your local
library.

Best to All,

-Kayti  
========== long legal disclaimer follows, press n to skip ===========

Neither the United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering
Laboratory or any of their employees, makes any warranty, whatsoever,
implied, or assumes any legal liability or responsibility regarding any
information, disclosed, or represents that its use would not infringe
privately owned rights.  No specific reference constitutes or implies
endorsement, recommendation, or favoring by the United States
Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory.  The views and
opinions expressed herein do not necessarily reflect those of the
United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory,
and shall not be used for advertising or product endorsement purposes.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: srlee@beta.lanl.gov (Stephen R Lee)
Subject: Re: Deer Whistles (was Re: Hearing ultraso
Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 18:14:36 GMT

In article <1go9bsINNm34@seven-up.East.Sun.COM> jfox@hooksett.East.Sun.COM writes:

[stuff deleted]

>I would tend to agree with you, but you must remember that a sample population
>of one is not statistically reliable. 

I agree, but I am not talking about a sample population of one.  Grated, I
am not talking about a huge sample either.  If the approximately two dozen
deer that were hit by locals in my area, only 2 were hit by people with
whisltes.  There were more deer (actually, deer and elk both) hit, but
I can only speak with certainty about people that are local to my area.
It is probably safe to assume that the other doezen or so were also hit
by people that did not have them.  At any rate, while this is not a large
sample, it does seem to indicate that, at least emperically, in my area
they are somewhat effective.  Maybe we have different deer and elk or
something. :-)

>However if you take the miles logged
>by every state trooper for a given state, and compare accidents with and
>without deer whistles, you have a much better picture of their effectiveness.

I agree.  Especially since it is over such a wide area.

>
>Again, I don't have the reference, but their findings were *less* accidents
>without the device than with. I imagine the number of miles they collectively
>drive a year is in the mid six-digit range. Shouldn't their conclusions
>carry a bit more weight than those of an individual?

I do not doubt that this is true.  It may, in fact, be true in general.
However, it does not appear to be true in my, highly localized, area.
Perhaps over the long term, and as more people start using them in
my area, we will see a change.  Most people are starting to use them.
All of the "official" vehicles in my area use them (highway department,
sheriff office, and so on).

I am not afiliated with any company that makes these things or anything.
Just pointing out that, at least in my area, they seem effective.  The
original question actually inquired as to whether or not they bothered
dogs in the vehicle, to which I said no.  Whether you use them or not
is purely up to you.  

>
>John
>

-- 
============================================================
Stephen R. Lee                 | 
OooWoo Racing Kennel           | I'd rather be driving sled
E-Mail: srlee@beta.lanl.gov    | dogs.
From: shaig@Think.COM (Shai Guday)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: BRO in MA
Date: 15 Dec 1992 15:21:46 GMT
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: galaxy.think.com

In article <1gk88bINN5pu@nigel.msen.com>, dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski) writes:
|> : %What is a BRO?
|> : A Breed Rescue Organization
|> 
|> Ok.  I wasn't sure if the b was for breed, boxer, bouvier, briard or whatever.
|> Does it have to be in MA?  Are there any particular breeds?

Well, I live in Boston so I would prefer something within a one hour
radius, if possible.  Of course my wife and I are notorious soft touches
when it comes to dogs so I doubt that an extra bit of driving would
make THE difference.

As to breed, we are currently debating that.  We have had a Belgian
Shepherd which we loved but her long hair was a problem - my shirts
came out of the laundry with clean black fur on them!
I think that we would prefer a shorter haired dog.  I myself am
leaning towards a German Shepherd (same family as the Belgian)
as they are intelligent, loyal, and large enough to shrug off
most of my toddler's attentions.  My wife wants a dog that she
can control, she had a Chow Chow as a girl and has distinct
memories of kite impersonations.

The matter is still undecided and will probably be determined
by availability of breeds if we don't settle this before long.

|> Karen
|> 

	Shai
From: dan@msen.com (Dan Sugalski)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Eagle Dog Food
Date: 16 Dec 1992 06:53:15 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, Michigan
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]


: >I look for a food without ethoxyquin, as I've had problems in the past with
: >itching and lousy coat.  I've been told that it is safe, but since the
: >only common denominator in the foods which I was feeding at those times
: >was ethoxiquin, I'll pass.

: Virtually every dry dog food has ethoxyquin, even if it is NOT LISTED 
: ON THE LABEL.   This is because if the fat in the food was bought
: with ethoxyqin already in it then the company is not required to 
: list it on the label!!!!!!!! 

Eagle renders their own fat.  I have also fed foods that specify no
ethoxyquin.  As I have said, it is the one common denominator.  It may be
that my animals which have had problems have an intolerance to it or to
something that results from its use.  I know vets who think it is safe.  I
also know vets who won't feed it.  For me, it hasn't mattered which food
it is.  At first we thought it might be a problem with soy, but that
turned out not to be the case.  Whatever it is, Eagle and Lick-Your-Chops 
have both worked for me.  I feed Eagle because it is easier to get, less
expensive and moves off of the shelves faster.

: Ethoxyquin is a very safe preservative and is also used to preserve
: foods eaten by humans.   All the talk about ethoxyquin being a problem
: is basically just an urban legend that has spread like wildfire through
: the dog world.   

I had never heard the "urban legend" until after I had done my elimination 
trials.  About 1 year after.

: Most likely your dog's itching and coat problems were caused by something
: else in the food he was on or something the food was lacking.  
 
One of my cats from another source came to me with warnings of allergies
to 2 foods, both of which have high fat contents and use ethoxquin to
preserve it.  While she lived with me, we only had a problem when I
couldn't find a premium food without it after a move.  I don't know about
Random, since I don't know a thing about her before I found her.  All the
rest of my cats have been raised on foods which don't contain the product.
OTOH, my parents husky can eat anything.  I'm not saying that the product
in and of itsel is bad, just that I have had problems, so I avoid it.

As far as foods go, I believe if it works, don't fix it.

Karen

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: rlt@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (r l taylor)
Subject: Christmas Puppies and Re: Snow Dogs
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 19:35:36 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.191050.11784@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> rlt@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (Magnum) writes:

>Hey, guys, this is great!  Must have something to do with it being
>Monday...all these humans are so busy grumbling that they leave their
>terminals unattended.

Silly dog!  Just cause his Dad was home yesterday, he thinks today is
Monday!  I've caught him now...

But anyway, I've been reading the Xmas puppy thread, and I got to
wondering.  If a shelter has a period of weeks when they won't adopt
out pets (generally a good idea, though I think they should judge
each case individually) how do they handle the overcrowding?  Do
any of them let a prospective adopter "reserve" a specific pet,
maybe pay board on it, to be sure it will still be there after the
holidays?  I can't imagine a bigger letdown that to go down to the
shelter on the first day of Adoption Season :-) and find out the dog
(cat, whatever) I had been dreaming about for 3 weeks, had been put
down while I was waiting.

Then there's the issue of individual cases.  As I said, I would hope
they would evaluate each potential case individually.  So many people
are alone at Christmas, many of them lonely and depressed, that a pet
could be a literal lifesaver.  I remember a couple of years ago, my
grandmother's ancient poodle had recently died, and she was terribly
upset.  Seemingly out of nowhere, a cat moved into her porch...and 
her heart.  She was so happy...kept saying how he's "exactly the color
of my poor little dog".  Despite repeated attempts to find his owner,
he's still there.  But I hate to think how sad her Christmas would have
been if he hadn't shown up, and we hadn't been able to get her a new
pet.  (I say "we" would have "gotten her" one because she's 100 years
old and couldn't very well get down to the shelter to pick one out
herself!)

Sigh...It's a tough job, placing pets.  Knowing when to approve, or
disapprove, an adoption.  Thank you, all of you who have taken on
such a task!

Roberta
...and the menagerie...
From: liza@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Liza Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Pano question
Date: 15 Dec 1992 19:55:38 GMT
Organization: Stanford Univ. Earth Sciences
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: pangea.stanford.edu

Susan Todhunter wrote to me privately and I can respond to her -- bounce
city.  So, since I thought it might be of interest to the group at large, I
went ahead and posted my response.  (Susan, sorry I couldn't get through to
you . . .)

>I was interested in what you said about pano sometimes persisting in adults.
>We have a 7 (almost 8) year old golden who, for the past 2 and a half years,
>has been experiencing bouts of limping in different paws.  Longer walks or,
>especially, longer periods of running after balls seem to bring it on--
>sometimes.
	Well, it could be adult pano.  But, I suspect it is more likely to
be arthritis or something along those lines, since it seems to have come on
in the last two years.  Since it doesn't seem to be a chronic problem, I
would just give him an aspirin or ascriptin (milder on their stomachs) when
he's having the problem and limit his exercise until the limpings gone.  If
long ball-throwing sessions bring it on, I'd try to cut them back to
shorter ones and see if it doesn't help.  Unfortunately a 7-8 year old
golden is getting elderly and will start to show signs like this.

	I believe that "adult" pano actually does persist.  In other words,
it continues from puppyhood and never goes away.  That's why I doubt that
your guy has pano.  If you are really concerned, I'm sure your vet could do
joint x-rays which should show whether or not there is any arthritis in the
joints.

	Anyway, I hope this helps.

Cheers,

Liza

ps.  I just love giving out vet advice over email! :)  I'm such an expert.
:)


------- End of Forwarded Message


----------

--
Liza Lee Miller         My dogs are labradorable!     liza@pangea.stanford.edu
Cibola Labradors            Field * Show * Fun                    415/326-5309
Cibola's Misty Mountain Hop--Hopper                   Mistypoint Kashmir--Kash
	            Campbellcroft Cibola Rosette -- Rosie
From: kkeating@acsu.buffalo.edu (Kelly Anne Hinkle)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Snow Dogs
Date: 16 Dec 92 19:17:11 GMT
Organization: State University of New York at Buffalo/Comp Sci

In article <kathy_buetow-161292093433@physio103-1.life.uiuc.edu>
kathy_buetow@QMS1.life.uiuc.edu (Double Stuff Buetow) writes:
>In article <BzBI0K.4yC@acsu.buffalo.edu>, kkeating@acsu.buffalo.edu (Opal Hinkle) wrote:
>
>1)  Where *exactly* is "Further, North" ?  (I figure it must be one of
>those
>Canadian Provinces because I couldn't even find a State called "North" on
>the
>map.)
>

Hi Stuffy...I can tell you where "Further North" is, because my Mom and Dad
are taking me...and that rotten little human thing too...up there Friday
night.  It's a place called Buffalo, and it's a place called Albany, both in
something called New York.  Don't ask me, just so long as I get to go in the
car too!  It won't be all fun and games, though.  Mom told me we're going to
visit Grandma, which is fine, but that she has an 8 month old Labrador puppy
named Molly.  Geeez, it'll be more trouble than the 9 month old Trouble Maker
Mom already has. *sigh*

>2)  Does Santa really see *everything* we do ?  (I mean, does he know that
>I snuck into the kitty's room last night to get a couple of "kitty crunchy
>logs"
>when mom wasn't looking ?)

He sees *absolutely* everything.  He found out that I had stolen the popcorn
off of the couch yesterday when no one possibly could have seen me do it!
Indisputable proof--watch out!

Merry Christmas anyhow...hope you get lots of cookies in your stockings!

Love, Opal
From: kmurphy@orangutan.cv.nrao.edu (Kim Murphy)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Australian Shepherds
Date: 19 Dec 92 22:08:37 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory

To the original poster inquiring about Australian Shepherds.  It seems everyone
gave you places to write for further info, but no one metioned
anything about their individual dogs.  While my Aussie wasn't a
purebred (she was mixed with Lab), she was a wonderful dog.  She
looked alot like a black lab with spots, and she most definitely had
the Aussie eyes (one was blue).  Her size was in between the two
breeds, and her temperament also came from both.  She was highly intelligent,
loyal, affectionate, and just the best darn dog I every had.

One time when I took her out to a friend's house who owned horses, she
instinctively righted a panicing horse.  I guess you could say, she was
the only dog I knew that knew how to herd animals and retrieve a
Frisbee.  I lost her close to three months ago and doubt that I can
find another quite like her.  I'm not sure whether I'll get another
Aussie (I personally like a little larger size), but if I find
another mixed with Lab, you can bet I won't hesitate.

Best, 

Kim Murhpy
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: feldman@cs.tulane.edu (Damon Feldman)
Subject: Re: Dog laws
Organization: Computer Science Dept., Tulane Univ., New Orleans, LA
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 03:38:34 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-20629]: venus


>The town I live in has a weird law about dogs, and I was wondering if
>this is common or not.  If you own more than 2 dogs over 6 months of
>age you have to get a "kennel license" -- this applies whether or not
>you are a breeder (which I am definitely not).  To get this license you
>have to ask everyone who lives within 100 feet of your property line
>to sign a petition saying they have no objections to your getting this
>license.  If 75% of these people sign it then you pay $25 for a kennel
>license which is good for one year.  This whole process, including the

>In any case, is this a weird local law or does this occur all over?  

There are a lot of laws around the country (USA) that just plain ban
too many dogs in the city or town.  Your town has a good idea to 
distinguish between nuisances and considerate owners -- ask the neighbors.

Damon

-- 
Damon Feldman                  feldman@rex.cs.tulane.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: cldavies@nyx.cs.du.edu (cindy davies)
Subject: Re: Traveling with Fido
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 92 23:59:30 GMT

In article <11DEC92.09254845@wums.wustl.edu> trimpe_b@wums.wustl.edu writes:
>Hi Netters-
>suddenly learn that they have a weight limit of 15 lbs.  After talking to the
>mananger etc. they agreed to let me bring him and all is fine there but what
>is the weight limit for?  I get very annoyed at that because I find that owners
>of small dogs have less of a tendency to train their dogs.  After all it's not
Insurance.  Very few people will sue the hotel if a small dog belonging to 
another guest bits them, but a big dog? Of course they'll sue.

Big dogs make bigger messes, so when their owners don't clean up 
after them ...

In fact, any problem you have with a small dog, you will have multiplied in
a big dog.  I would agree that the benifits of owning a dog (protection for
one) may increase with the size of the dog too.  I would love to own a 
large dog but just can't deal with the hassles right now. :(


--

TNSTAAFD -- There's No Such Thing As A Free Dog.

cldavies@silver.sdsmt.edu        cldavies@nyx.cs.du.edu
From: ch815@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Kenneth J. Plucinski)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Cairn & Westy Terriers
Date: 19 Dec 1992 15:13:04 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


I'm considering getting a westy or cairn terrier. Everything I've
read indicates that either would be a good choice for our
family. I understand that the two breeds are somewhat similar,
as they have a "history" together. However, I still have some
lingering questions:

 Are westies and cairns basically the same in demeanor?
 Is it true that westies (& maybe cairns?) are very prone to
  allergies?
 Are the breeds good with kids?
 What are the drawbacks of the two breeds?
 Is there anything special that I should consider before
  buying one?
 Etc.: Any experiences/impressions/opinions would be helpful.

Also, I've heard the importance of dealing with a reputable
breeder emphasized many times. But how can I make that
determination?  I can get a list of breeders from the breed
club, I can inspect the breeder's facilities, and I can
"check-out" the pups and its parents. Still, how does one
"check-out" the breeder, other than word of mouth, when it is
someout difficult to make contact with many owners of the
breeds?

    Ken Plucinski
    plucinski@fredonia.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Snow Dogs
From: RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Ruth Ginzberg)
Date: 16 Dec 92 10:08:45 EDT
 <1992Dec15.191050.11784@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> <BzBw13.MoK@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> <1992Dec16.135516.7320@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>
Distribution: world
Organization: Philosophy Dept., Wesleyan University
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20In-Reply-To: glb@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU's message of Wed, 16 Dec 1992 13:55:16 GMTLines: 22

Hi, dogs!  I'm Buffy.  I don't know why I'm posting on this thing;  I'd rather
chew it up & get it outta here.  My mommy spends too much time petting her
keyboard & not enough time petting me.

Anyway, just one more little snow hint for you fun-loving dogs:

You know those brown things that the humans push around with funny looking
sticks?  I think they call them "leaves".  Those humans pile them up in
wonderful play-piles, but then they don't even play in them!  I'll never
understand the mind of a human.  Anyway, when the cool white stuff covers up
those play-piles, whooo-boy!  Does that ever make for the neatest Digging!
First you dig through lots of the white stuff, & then you get to the brown
play-pile stuff, & (don't tell Mom) then you can KEEP DIGGING, all the way down
to the other side of the earth, practically, & Mom doesn't even realize that
you've hit pay-dirt!  I've made some Great Holes this way, & Mom just looks
amused instead of hollering at me.

Try it, you'll like it!

------------------------
Ruth Ginzberg <rginzberg@eagle.wesleyan.edu>
Philosophy Department;Wesleyan University;USA
From: kkv@inel.gov (Jamie J Ferguson)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: DOGS & CATS
Date: 14 Dec 92 18:06:37 GMT
Article-I.D.: inel.1992Dec14.180637.28841
Organization: Idaho National Engineering Laboratory, Idaho Falls, Idaho


As long as you are careful at first you should be able to adopt a kitten
without much trouble.  I had cats before dogs so my situation was a little
different, but my last cat came to live with us when I had an almost 1 yr old
black lab mix and he (the cat) likes our dogs much better than the older
cats (who probably remember the good old days...).  My newest cat was about 5
months old when he met our lab and he adapted very quickly.  I'm not sure
how young you want to go, though -- if your dog isn't used to cats you
might not want to get an 8 week old kitten.

People from rec.pets.cats might have suggestions also.

Good luck!


Jamie


========== long legal disclaimer follows, press n to skip ===========

Neither the United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering
Laboratory or any of their employees, makes any warranty, whatsoever,
implied, or assumes any legal liability or responsibility regarding any
information, disclosed, or represents that its use would not infringe
privately owned rights.  No specific reference constitutes or implies
endorsement, recommendation, or favoring by the United States
Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory.  The views and
opinions expressed herein do not necessarily reflect those of the
United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory,
and shall not be used for advertising or product endorsement purposes.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: A1.MHH@isumvs.iastate.edu (Mary Healey)
Subject: Re: Opinions on breed.
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 15:02:31 GMT

In article <kathy_buetow-171292153905@physio103-1.life.uiuc.edu>,
kathy_buetow@QMS1.life.uiuc.edu (Kathy Buetow) writes:
>
>BTW, for those of you who don't know, my 1,000 Square Foot appartment
>is currently inhabited by 1 adult Cattle Dog,  2 adolescent Cattle Dogs, 7
>4.5 week old Cattle Dog Puppies, 1 Cat, and a Rat (In a cage.  Yes, he was
>invited to live with us).  We also have a Flat-Coated Retreiver "friend"
>who is a frequent weekend visitor.
>
>Kathy
>======================
>Katwala Australian Cattle Dogs - Home of Oreo, Yonder, Double Stuff, Rowdy
>and 7 adorable little ACD monsters that are (thankfully) "just visiting"
>!!!
>Kathy_Buetow@QMS1.life.uiuc.edu

Another point in the "house vs. apartment" discussion - Kathy's
1,000 sq ft. apartment is considerably larger than my 600 sq ft.
2-bedroom house.  On a 50x150 foot lot.  With no fence.  With
4 (small) birds, 3 cats, 2 50-lb dogs (ACDmix and BCmix, and a 45
gallon aquarium (and a partridge in a pear tree :) !)  Come to
think of it, the last time I mentioned getting ANOTHER dog (ACD) to
my mother, her reply was "When are you moving?"

Mary &
Sam & Katie - the mutts
Emma, Gareth & Rhiannon - nearly 30 lbs of purr
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs