From: dhaggard@hughes.Sgi.COM (Dana Haggard)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: Donahue: Options for Kids
Date: 11 Jan 93 16:21:50 GMT
Organization: Hughes Aircraft of Canada Limited

In article <1993Jan9.005313.4854@porthos.cc.bellcore.com>, smile1@dancer.cc.bellcore.com (gray,david l) writes:
|> deletions
|> I used to work with abuse children so have have a lot of concern for
|> their welfare.  However, I think society is not doing it's job.  There
|> is no reason for adults not to know when a child is being treated poorly.
|> As adults we have failed to do it so now we tell children they can represent
|> themselves.  I think it is a bad idea for children to divorce their parents.

Dave, I strongly agree!  I was in a less than desirable situation growing
up but I really do not believe this would have *solved* it.   Even if they do
there is still *so* much for them to deal with.....

|> 
|> The court system deals with wining and lossing not right or wrong.  Divorce
|> cases are won by legal devices and financial pressure not by logic or fairness.
|> Children should stay out of that type of environment.

ABSOLUTELY!  This is kind of what I'm alluding to above......I don't believe
it is healthy for children to have to deal with these kinds of issues during
fundamental development....Can we really say with certainty that dealing with
this would not be damaging?  And how is it we measure degree?  How do we
look after these children during the process?

|> 
|> One last comment that I'm sure will get a lot of comment.  Man was made for
|> God, women was made for man, and children was made for parents and we are
|> all here to serve God.  I know some people have abused God's word but, that
|> is how he made things.  I strongly disagree with those who would say I support
|> parents owning their child and that they can do anything they want because
|> they kind of own them.  I do not feel that men own their wives either.  
|> So don't bother saying so because I don't feel that way.  But in
|> the order of things, parents and adults are responsible for children.
|> I find that society has been trying to settle out social ills
|> by reversing everything and it is not working well.  Men and women are 
|> responsibile for the welfare of our children.  If they don't do their job,,
|> we don't ask the 10 year old what to do.  We, as adults, with values step in
|> and do something!!!  I would never trust the welfare of a child to a lawyer.
|> Never!!!  Their only goal is to take a case and win.
|> 
I agree entirely!  I know I may be idealist, but I just don't think that children
are in a position to deal well with these kinds of issues, that is precisely
why they have parents IMHO.  Parents are meant to protect their children
from things they are not yet ready for - to open the door of reality at a
pace a child can benefit from.  I think it is high time we applied social 
pressure to making adults responsible for children, not children responsible
for themselves.  As someone who left home *very* young to survive, I *know*
I was unable to make alot of decisions for me, I just didn't understand the
big picture well enough to know what was best.  Yes, I figured it out, but I
also went through alot I would have should someone have taken 
responsibility for allowing me to be a child.  I think the most important 
thing we can do for children it let them be children.
Don't get me wrong here....I am *not* saying children should stay in
abusive homes rather than look after themselves.....not at all.  I am simply
agreeing that we as a society need to take responsibility again, we 
shouldn't be looking to the children to act on their own behalf - to be
active, productive, healthy adults its best to be active, productive
healthy children...then it's a natural process.  I just cannot agree that
looking out for your own interests at 12 will lend to this process.

|> I can understand if you have been abused that you will not feel this way.
|> You will want to see the child with their own choices.  You may be right
|> to feel that way because society did not step in for you when you needed
|> them.  I just feel real strong about society stepping up to their 
|> responsibility.  Protect our children now and in the future should not
|> be shuffled off onto our children.  They have enough to worry about without
|> trying to decide if they need a divorce or need to hang in..
|> 
Well Dave, guess I disagree on the main point.......I did go through that and
I do feel the way you do.  I don't have any answers, it is a *very* tough
problem.  I just feel that we, as a society, need to quit looking the other way.
Why do the children have to take the responsibility?  Neighbors, friends,
relatives, they all know what is going on to some degree but most often do
nothing.....after all, we've been taught not to interfere.  I guess what I am
saying is that yes, its really difficult to interfere, but isn't that better than
asking a 12 year old to determine their own future or just leaving them in
the situation?  Most often their biggest problem is that no one will listen,
no one wants to talk about their reality and so they doubt.....they doubt
themselves, their assessment of situations, *everything*.  And to
ask someone so young, so filled with doubt, to make their own choices
is not fair to them at all.....they are not ready for it....they are children.
Let's talk to them, let's reassure them that they *do* see what is
*really* going on, they are okay and then help to make their life
a process of development, instead of the cliff dive it often is.
Cheers,
..../Dana

|> Smile,
|> 
|> Dave

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dhaggard@hughes.scg.hac.com             |          
Hughes Aircraft of Canada Limited       |           
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