Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: bburgar@cix.compulink.co.uk (Bill Burgar)
Subject: Shotokan misconceptions... - And Punch Power Measurement
Reply-To: bburgar@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 20:21:21 +0000



>I saw *really* big guys taking one huge punches, and only registering
>a mediocre score, even when they hit it dead centre. From what I can gather,
>it looks to be based on the focus of the punch. Seemingly a short, sharp
>punch will get as good, if not better reading, than an exaggerated, drawn
>back ,full bodied, gyaku complete with blood curdling kiai. So, basically
>yes, it looks to be based on focus, which means size doesn't matter. :-)


I'm pleased/releived to hear that it is measuring focus and not just
the sluggers.


>The annoying thing is the two parallel flat beams that come out from the
>base of the stand for the pad, which you have to stand on whilst performing
>the punch. Now, if the punch is very forceful, you'll see the competitor
>come off the floor as the pad tilts back, and angles the beams he/she is
>standing on.


If I have understood the description of the device correctly, I would
think that the only reason that the beams would come up off the floor
would be because the karateka is throwing his weight at the pad rather
than kicking his back leg downward into the floor. Therefore, I would
think that those who you see doing this would be achieving lower scores.
Am I right? If not I may have to rethink my ideas on what makes a
strong, penetrating punch, and I would hate to have to do that!


>Basically, I wouldn't bother too much with it. It just seems to be a gimmick
>which will die off eventually.


That's a shame, I rather liked the idea of encouraging all rounders.
I see Linden Huckle is doing rather well - now there is a difficult
opponent, a first class fighter, kata man and he hits *very* hard.






And on the subject of stances


>   Just my two cents on straight/bent leg training and depth of stances.
>My first Shotokan instructor (frosh year of college, 1988), trained
>under Sensei Stan Schmidt of South Africa and taught long, very low
>stances, back leg locked.  Then, one of our members went to Japan to
>train there (1990?), and came back with the idea of bent back leg, but
>only in hanmi (hips half-facing) position.  Stances were still supposed
>to be deep, and the leg was supposed to be straight in shomen (hips
>front-facing) position.  This bent back leg caused a pretty big stir in
>our club.  Some of us (like me) thought it gave the stance a lot more


We had exactly the same situation when Dave Hooper returned from Japan
(and we also started training with Kato Sensei at about the same time).
Only our chief instructor said "there shalt be a change to bent back leg
in hanmi" and lo there was a change throughout the association. So we
didn't have any disputes about which way was right.






>   Now, I know Okazaki Sensei came to the US in the 1950s, so he would
>count as the "earlier generation."  My guess is that bent back leg is
>a relatively recent innovation that is slowly propagating through the
>Shotokan network.  However, I agree that you need to train in low
>stance, straight back leg to be really effective with the bent leg.


Yes, Okazaki is certainly from the "earlier generation", infact as
I urstand it he played an important role in setting up the JKA
instructors class. Do you know if he taught straight back leg when
he first started teaching in the USA?




>   Someone gave me an article by Dave Lowry from _Black Belt_ called
>"The Great Stance Debate."  I can try and dig it out, if there's
>interest.


Yes I would be *very* interested.


>   Unsu is the kata with the huge 360 degree jump.  One of the greatest
>video clips I've ever seen was Sensei Yahara(who does Unsu in Sensei
>Nakayama's _Best Karate_ series), Sensei Osaka (_Best Karate_ Vol. 5 --
>the whole thing), and I think Sensei Asai (Empi in _Best Karate_) doing
>a team Unsu.  Seeing the three of thump andland completely in unison
>was humbling.


I've seen the video - ***WOW***


>   BTW, Bill, are you currently training with Sensei Enoeda?  ("Must USE
>STOMMMAAAAACCCCCCHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Stomach!! Stomach!!! Must
>use stomach!!!!!" :-)


Thanks Ed . You noticed Enoeda Sensei's favourite phrase then.
Unfortuanatly I haven't trained with him for some time now, but I will
be trying to get up to Marshall Street again soon, even when Enoeda
Sensei is not there you get Ohta so it is well worth the trip. Now it
you want to see stances - Ohta Sensei is just the business! The last
time I went to Marshall Street Ohta taught the lesson and then when
everybody started leaving he started his training session - Jion - such
smooth power, it was a joy to watch.




Bill Burgar.