HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: The word 'homophobia'
Date: 21 Dec 92 18:19:09 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss,alt.politics.homosexuality
Organization: Apple Computer, Inc.

In article <1992Dec18.075716.18901@reed.edu>, nelson@reed.edu (Nelson
Minar) wrote:

> There is at least one case where "homophobia", as in "fear of
> homosexuals", is exactly right: to describe people who recognize their
> own homosexual tendencies (even mild tendencies) but are afraid of
> them, and so they take out their fear or prove their straightness by
> harassing/hurting queers. This response is motivated by fear, fear of
> their own sexuality.

This is almost certainly true, and his perhaps the origin of
the term.  The fear is, perhaps, more a fear of the ostracism
that homosexuality may bring, rather than a fear of sexuality.
But it is a fear based on potential harm, and makes 'sense' as
a 'phobia.'

*X*
From: an3360@anon.penet.fi
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Motss pix
Date: 27 Dec 92 11:33:00 GMT
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: soc.motss

I checked out the motss pix just yesterday, coincidentally just before Steve
Dyer posted his listed of most frequently downloaded images.  I just grabbed
the familiar names, or at least the names I remember seeing most often in the
short time I've been reading this group, and hey, there seems to be a decided
preponderance of extravagantly ursine types!  I suppose I shouldn't be 
surprised, but where does that leave those of us who are pretty much the
opposite?  (That does not imply I regard myself as a twinklike!)  Is this 
newsgroup monopolised by ex-groupies for the Grateful Dead?

Yours muffinistically (I don't suppose one's first anonymous posting qualifies
one for demuffinisation)
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From: gklein@uoft02.utoledo.edu (Gary Klein, bear-at-heart)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: 50 most popular motss.pix photos 10/21-12/26/92
Date: 29 Dec 92 14:35:33 EST
Organization: Univ of Toledo

In article <1992Dec28.220415.23867@PacBell.COM>, rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams) writes:
>> dauber@tattoo.mti.sgi.com (Jeff Dauber) writes:
> 
>>How many pictures of me are there out there?  Sheesh, people will think
>>that I get around or something...
> 
> Don't forget your *faaabulous* boots have a co-starring
> role in *my* portrait...
> 
> Rod (in a shameless bid to make the next Top-50 list :-))

     Well, Jeff's boots have a co-starring appearance in the photo which Steve
Dyer took on MY camera, enlargement of which is hanging on the file cabinet
which serves as a door to my cubicle.

     And YES this is another shameless plea to make the Top-50 list, since I
made it in there last time, with only one photo of me in the archives (also
captured by Steve).

     "Thanks for the memories"
-- 
"Not your average Leathered Librarian"
      * * * *          Gary Klein,   Business Librarian,   Univ of Toledo
       *   *                     P.O.Box 12650 / Toledo OH 43606
        * *            WORK:   419-537-2629            HOME: 419-243-2740
         *             BITNET: fac2813@uoft01           FAX: 419-537-2726
  B4 t+ w- g s+ k              INTERNET: fac2813@uoft01.utoledo.edu
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rhayden@oracle.com (Ronald Hayden)
Subject: Re: EE statements (was: Re: Attention Skiers Boycotting Colorado)
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Belmont, Ca.
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1993 23:57:21 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <1hthopINNaa0@hp-col.col.hp.com> smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith) writes:

   Has anyone put together a way to for companies to code this, that 
   would provide coverage for 'couples', without leaving them open 
   to roomates or just anyone a person wants to put on the insurance? 
   I may be ill-informed (please, let's not all snicker at once..:-)
   about it, but I was under the impression homosexual marriages were'nt 
   'legal'.  If they were, then this issue would be a lot easier to 
   deal with. 

We've discussed this, Walter.  There is no more fraud that occurs with
domestic partners than with people becoming married (or pretending to
be married) for fraudulant reasons.  The numbers (which I've given
you) don't bear it out.  If you have statistics that say otherwise,
please list them.  I have access to many reports on this subject, and
it has NEVER been a problem.
--

  - Ronald Hayden

    ----------------------------------------------------------------
   | Documentation Manager, Oracle Toolkit Group                    |
   | Co-chair of Oracle Lambda, Oracle's Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual group |
   | Writer, magician, and various other things                     |
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Changing standards of female beauty (was Re: Ageism)
Date: 28 Dec 92 01:22:59 GMT
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <mattm-271292142120@mcmelmon.apple.com> 
mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
> Calm down, Dolphie... 

Did I sound upset?  I wasn't.  Irritated, perhaps, at a 
stupid joke with no basis in fact, but not upset.

> You are getting *too* predictable. 

Ahem.  Well, the same could be said about you.

> It seems
> I can provoke you even easier than hairless twinks can provoke that
> GDM fellow.

Yeah, well, I take this stuff as seriously as that humorless
fellow from Glendale takes hair and cigars.

> I am not seriously trying to suggest that "sexually 
> frustrated old men" are responsible for turning fashion models into
> 13 year-old boys. 

I wouldn't argue against *that* point if you were to talk about
fashion post Penelope Tree and Twiggy.  But you were talking
about the 1930s through 1960s, and the look for women during those
decades was preponderantly large breasted, wide hipped, fleshy.

> In an earlier age - perhaps a couple of months
> ago - I would relish the opportunity to carry on with you (or rather,
> against you) over this; but, sadly, I find myself almost beginning
> to like the extent of you fashion queen-li-ness.

Eegads!  What have I done to deserve this?

> Besides, the New Year is upon us, and perhaps it is time for a
> kinder, gentler _Splat Ex Splaticus_.

Oh dear.  If the New Year weren't upon us I'd take the time
to point out that "ex" is followed by the accusative, not the
nominative.

Arne
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams)
Subject: Re: EE statements (was: Re: Attention Skiers Boycotting Colorado)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, California
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 21:12:21 GMT

> smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith) writes:
>> rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams) writes:

>> They're EE issues if the company professes not to discriminate
>> on the basis of marital status, don't you think?  Or are you
>> using the term EE to apply only to federally-mandated stuff?
>
>I'm using it in the area of equal opp. hiring; hiring 
>minorities as well as wasp's.  If you use as an example of 
>EE cases things like you're describing, it becomes something 
>other than what it is meant for.  You might just as well say 
>that if the ladies room has a bigger vanity than the mens 
>room, then that is EE discrimination based on favoritism 
>to women.  Generally, EE is a much more narrow focus. 

I think not.  It certainly covers conditions of employment
(sexual harassment comes to mind) as well as hiring and
promotion practices.

>> Those companies and organizations that have implemented
>> Domestic Partner benefit plans have come up with numerous ways
>> to determine who is a valid DP
>
>Progress...anyone have any examples of some?  Maybe identifying 
>companies that do *not* yet have them, but who show evidence 
>of not discriminating based on SP, and sending them samples of 
>how other companies have solved the problem would cause more 
>companies to offer DP benefits? 

Thanks for the suggestion.  Some of us have already been
doing exactly this for some time...
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
rod williams -=- pacific bell -=- san ramon, ca -=- rjwill6@pacbell.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: allemang@lia.di.epfl.ch (Dean Allemang)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: The Foreskin-Impaired (was Re: Drooling over...)
Date: 23 Dec 92 13:55:18 GMT
	<1992Dec19.014916.15129@oracle.us.oracle.com>
	<1h6fivINNp1n@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> <1992Dec22.192904.18544@netcom.com>
Organization: DI-LIA -- Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne
In-reply-to: solovay@netcom.com's message of 22 Dec 92 19:29:04 GMT


solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay) writes:
>In article <1h6fivINNp1n@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> comrade@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Peter Cooper) writes:
>>
>>BTW:  are all Europeans uncircumcised like the film implies?  It's not
>>like Australia ;-)
>
>I think that circumcision only recently (past few decades) came
>into widespread vogue. Among those who were adults during WWII
>(whether European, Australian, American, whatever), I think
>circumcision was very uncommon, except among those with religious
>reasons (e.g. Jews & Moslems).

In my experience at safe-sex parties in Amsterdam, Berlin, and other
places, I stand out as being one of very few circumcised participants.
We usually have a discussion of this afterwards or during the break,
about how `the americans' are.  However, I don't know if I am spotted
as an American because of that, or because of my abominable accent
when I speak German.

But these are men who range in ages from 20-40;  certainly not adults
during WWII.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik)
Subject: Re: soc.motss.*
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 11:33:14 GMT
Organization: (getting there)

bcapps@agora.rain.com (Brent Capps) writes:

 >One time I was behind by *4000*
 >messages and just had to mark them all read.

Here is clear evidence of insufficient devotion.  If there were a
cabal it would have to address this matter.


-- 

  Mara Chibnik
  mara@panix.com                Life is too important to be taken seriously.

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay)
Subject: Re: The Melmon Method (was Dworkin)
Organization: People's Front of Judea
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 19:53:44 GMT

In article <1haaafINNml2@fido.asd.sgi.com> pauli@sgi.com (Paul Isaacs) writes:
>In article <mattm-221292152459@mcmelmon.apple.com> mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
>>
>>The feministas have been tripping over themselves to come up with
>>these inane - yet 'controversial' - gimicks.  My favorite: 
>>
>>  A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle.
>>
>
>Where did this line come from?
>[...]
>Does it have a prior history in the "feminista" movement? 

I've heard the line attributed to Gloria Steinem. It certainly
goes back long before the U2 song. I think the canonical form is
"A woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle". Matt
Groening (in _Life_in_Hell_) paraphrased it as "A man without a
woman is like a fish run over by a bicycle".


-- 
Andrew Solovay    
                "I know that, in America and under capitalism,
                 I am the freest woman in history."
                                --- Camille Paglia
From: Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Changing standards of female beauty (Is: the empowerment of
Date: Sun,  3 Jan 93 18:34:28 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1993Jan3.014408.18528@toolz.uucp> <1i6201INNo03@mizar.usc.edu>
  <1993Jan3.152358.7218@macc.wisc.edu>

Jess Anderson writes:
>So what's to be done?  All of us in natural cotton, no dyes,
>no design, no frou-frou, sensible shoes, dirty skin, no
>toothpastes, no hair conditioners, no (god forbid!)
>haircuts.  Not only: where does it all end, but also: where 
>does it all start?

Sounds like a *damn* good start to me.

Though, I concede, I wouldn't get rid of soap -- just the idea
that a body that has been recently washed with it needs to be
doused in some horrific synthetic odor to avoid "smelling bad."

I wouldn't get rid of toothpastes -- just the idea that one's
breath simply must smell like a patch of mint 24 hours a day.

I wouldn't get rid of shampoo and conditioners -- just the idea
that one will make you sexier than another.

Definitely no haircuts or razors, though -- for anyone. [Except
by prescription, perhaps.]

 
() Washes and razors for foofoos....for me freckles and a bristling
() beard.
()      -- Walt Whitman
-----
[> George D. Madison | NBCS: B8f+t+w-e+s+k+a!cv | Just say NO to razors! <]
[> It's a BEAR thing -- you wouldn't understand. <|> furr@cup.portal.com <]
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: How did you find soc.motss?
Date: 22 Dec 92 10:42:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Dec22.104217.18245
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <BznADy.FGy@unix.amherst.edu> twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce) writes:
>Wow .... How did you folks post way back then?  Flipping front panel
>switches? :-)

But of course, that's why motss used to have less volume: even if you
were really good you could only toggle in 5 words per minute. Jess had
to keep himself down to 15k a day :-)

Nelson, whose never even seen a front pannel switch, or for that
matter a card reader.
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/     In a totally sane society, madness is the only freedom
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: crombie@iisat.alt.ns.ca
Subject: Re: Capitalization (dubious MOTSS content)
Organization: Public Access UNIX
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 1993 02:17:04 GMT

In article <C03FEL.I7H@fig.citib.com>, glp@fig.citib.com (Greg Parkinson) writes:
(about a problem with capitalization)> 
> I refer to certain documents - the Business Requirements
> Specification is one of them - by one of:
> the name: The Business Requirements Specification
> the initials: The BRS
> the short name: The specification
> 
> It's the last one that has me stumped.  There are no
> other specifications (so no ambiguity) but it somehow
> doesn't seem right to have the short name as lower case.
> 
Oh a style question! I love style questions!
It is standard Canadian Press-Associated Press style to capitalize
only the full proper name. Subsequent short form references are
lower case, except in very specific circumstances -- such as referring
to Congress, the House etc etc.

Of course, you may not wish to follow our style. But the CP style book
IS a bestseller in Canada, and the most widely referred to editing text
in the country. 

It's the bible. I sleep with under my pillow.

I have to. I work there.


-- 
Kevin Crombie		Public Access Unix
UUCP:  {dalcs,ulowell}!iisat!crombie
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: marco@sdf.lonestar.org (Steve Giammarco)
Subject: Re: Cramer is our problem too.
Organization: Best lil' ol' Pubnix in Texas
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1993 16:46:59 GMT

In article <72676@cup.portal.com> Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:
>>We created the group, we set the tone...
>We control the vertical, we control the horizontal.... ;-)

Actually, it's:

"We control the horizontal. We control the vertical.
 We can chamge the focus to a soft blurr, or sharpen it to crystal clarity.
 For the next hour, sit quietly and we will control all that you see and hear."

Sorry. I _loved_ that show.  But you're right. Amerikkka would be OK for
Cramer if he had the same imaginary control as... The _OUTER_ _LIMITS_.

Ta Ta Daaaa Daaaaaaaah   <crash!>

 

-- 
Steve Giammarco/5330 Peterson Lane/Dallas TX 75240
marco@sdf.lonestar.org
loveyameanit.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik)
Subject: Re: Brooklyn Bishop Lays an Egg
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 20:12:38 GMT
Organization: (getting there)


Once in a while I re-read these.
mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik) writes:
 >It is so blatant
 >a lie that we sat their stunned 
Sorry about that.  "There."


-- 

  Mara Chibnik
  mara@panix.com                Life is too important to be taken seriously.
From: smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Private antidiscrimination policies in CO (was Re: Attention...)
Date: 31 Dec 1992 20:34:46 GMT
Organization: Colorado Springs IT Center
NNTP-Posting-Host: fajita19.cs.itc.hp.com

glp@fig.citib.com (Greg Parkinson) writes:
> I don't understand it, but I don't understand fundamentalist
> Xtian hate, either.  The point is not why it happens, the point is that
> it does happen.  Why do the Armed Forces kick out their top performers
> *just* because they are gay?

To be honest, I'm not sure about the military thing; I've seen 
good arguments for both sides.  I see the military as a special 
case, that is not likely to be resolved until the issue is 
resolved furthur in society as a whole.  

One thing I would like to understand better:  why do you think 
people *do* discriminate against gays?  What is the motivation? 

Walter
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: How did you find soc.motss?
Date: 28 Dec 92 05:02:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Dec28.050223.12789
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

my last message seems to have generated some confusion. I was posting
that anonymously for another person - I did not write it myself. I
should have made sure my signature wasn't included..

ObMotss: Thanks to the folks who pointed me to Chiron Rising. I agree
with Steve - the photography isn't all that great - but it's still a
pleasant little magazine.
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                        The switches set you free my friend
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: an3360@anon.penet.fi
Subject: Can nonbears have bear codes?
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: soc.motss
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 17:23:00 GMT

To be honest I'm still not exactly clear what a bear is, but since quite a 
lot of people who post here include their classification, I thought I would
offer the following, rather pathetically non-bearish set.  Betcha don't
see some of these too often!

B1 f-- t-- w-- g k- s- h

I think this makes me at best some kind of ursa minor (if not Virgo - huh?)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: DLM
Subject: Re: Ageism
Organization: University of Missouri
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 17:10:15 CST

In article <mattm-231292130250@mcmelmon.apple.com>
mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
>One of my design instructors complained along much the same lines.
>His argument - partly humorous and partly serious - was that
>sexually frustrated gay fashion editors began "doing everything they
>could to make the adult woman into a thirteen year old boy."
>
> I should point out that this thirteen-year-old-boy
>transformation has not only hurt and alienated older gay men;
>but it has been a constant source of torment to that much larger
>segment of the population:  women who sexually frustrated
>gay fashion editors would *not* find in the least bit attractive.
>
>*X*
 
I *knew* it!!!! The moment I saw my first pair of culottes (oh god
let me forget) or those mutant 'gaucho' split-skirts, or the Edsel
of fashion, the midi-skirt, I *knew* that these designers did *not*
love women!
I guess it would follow that the *true* designers of Nehru jackets
and leisure suits were RadLesFems (tm)? :-)
 
Diane (who is feeling a lot older than 13 at the moment...)
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Posting Styles
Date: 1 Jan 93 16:28:02 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison

In article <C06KJr.LsE@panix.com> mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik) writes:

>thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:

> >Now see? That's what I hate the most about living in podunky ol' Omaha.
> >I'm always so *cheerful*! Noone ever comes here, so I have no chance to
> >get good and miserable like the people in New York, who always have
> >strange and exotic people coming from all over the United States to make
> >them feel unhappy. I haven't been depressed by a visitor for months. It's
> >just not fair.

>I understood (from some conversation at that dinner) that you'd been
>invited to go depress the Minnesotans but that you'd snubbed them.
>(I hope your fathers are attending to this.  I think they ought to
>attend to your upbringing.)

I had intended to invite the Guru of Om-aha to sample the
tasties of Madison, but alas, I was whisked away to Ann
Arbor for various festivities, and it would have been
extremely rude to abandon the poor thaaang in this
dreadfully cold town.  Why, the temp on this first
bright day of the new year has risen all the way to
6 (that's -14 for you celcians).

Perhaps when the daffodils are in bloom.  Hm, mayhap
I will be in Californication at about that time.

-- 
[Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin]
[Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson]
[Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888]
[---------> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <---------]
From: tal@plts.uucp (Tom Limoncelli)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Austin, TX joins Colo. Boycott
Date: 1 Jan 1993 17:44:49 -0500
Organization: P.L.T.S., North Plainfield, NJ, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: plts.uucp

In article <SCANNON.47.724688375@novell.com> SCANNON@novell.com (Steve Cannon) writes:

>Yesterday the City Council of Austin, TX unanimously approved a boycott of 
>the State of Colorado.  In brief, it stated that no city funds would be used 
>for travel to or in Colorado.

Does anyone have the exact wording of the motion?  I'm trying
to do something similar here (for an organization, not for
a town) and would like to see what others are doing.

Tom
-- 
Tom Limoncelli -- tal@plts.uucp (home) -- tal@warren.mentorg.com (work)
Heros falling to the ground / like hell's magnet / pulls me down / on my knees
/ I try to please his eyes / his idol eyes. / Jerking motions won't revive him
/ mouth to mount resusitation / I just lay down beside him / and idolize.
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Changing standards of female beauty (was Re: Ageism)
Date: 28 Dec 1992 18:06:06 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <17742@umd5.umd.edu> 
jns@roissy.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:

A new email address, hunh?

[ ... ]

> If it weren't that the New Year is upon us, I might
> pause to wonder just who to trust when it comes to
> getting the latin correct:

Watch it, Jeff!

> Matthew, who wrote (previously): 
> > I think, however, that a casual jaunt through Vogue, et. [sic] al. 
> > during the period in question ....
>
> or my own sweet Arne, who corrected Matthew's
> aesthetic analysis, but not his latin:
> > Well, I have indeed taken casual jaunts through Vogue, et. [sic] al.
> > during the period in question, and what I've seen ....

Mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.  I did notice the "et.", but when I
copied Matthew's phrase word for word I neglected to correct it.
Forgive me?

> On the whole, since the New Year is upon us [and
> goodwill seems to be bustin' out all over], 

I don't know about anyone else, but I'm favorably disposed to 
just about everyone this week.

> I think I'll just check with Isaac and hope he whispers the
> answer in my ear....

Isaac is a sensible sort, so I'm not worried that he'll
get this wrong.

Arne
Newsgroups: soc.motss