HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: appel@xcf.Berkeley.EDU (Shannon D. Appel)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: JSA cancellation [Was Re: DC Rumours!!!!!!!!!]
Date: 20 Aug 92 23:51:05
Organization: csua
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: branwen@cerebus.ccc.amdahl.com's message of 20 Aug 92 18:46:38 GMT

> >	I just read in Bill Hayes' Comics List that James Hudnall confirmed 
>>rumors that GL:Mosaic, Justice Society of America and Aquaman has been 
>>cancelled!!!!!!!!

According to Len Strazewski, JSA has been cancelled not because of low
sales [sales are apparently moderate to good], but rather because the people
in charge of the DC superheroes [Archie Goodwin, Danny O' Neil and Mike Carlin]
have decided that it does not match the "new image" of DC comics.  Between
this, and the stories of an upcoming DC/Image crossover, it sounds like it
has been decided that DC is going to try and compete directly with Image
and Marvel, in their juvenile superhero genre, rather than continuing to
put out relatively mature comics, like DC comics has for some time.

I sent a letter to DC yesterday [specifically to the above three group editors]
saying that there were making a grave mistake, specifically in cancelling a
comic that was actually making money [JSA], but even more generally in
abandoning those readers.  I might suggest others do likewise.

Shannon
Xref: sparky rec.arts.comics:22304 rec.arts.comics.misc:1506
From: boyes@forty2.enet.dec.com (Mark Boyes)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics,rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: Constantine knock-offs (was Re: DC: Hellblazer/Swamp Thing query)
Date: 23 Aug 92 11:03:11 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1992Aug15.134627.23463@oracle.us.oracle.com>, wkaufman@us.oracle.com (William Kaufman) writes...
>    Now that's interesting (I never read _Firestorm_).  How many
>versions of JC are there?  There's also Kipling in _Doom_Patrol_, and
>(arguably) Wilkerson in _Sandman_.  Any others?  (I'd be surprised if
>Marvel didn't have one,...)  Are there enough for, say, a new comic
>book--_March_of_the_Constantines_, or something?

Occasionally writers, such as Phil Foglio and Grant Morrison, apply to their
editors to use Constantine, are turned down, and have to create their own
analogues. In 'Angel and the Ape' Foglio's version suggested there is an
organisation of magicians where they "give you a raincoat, take away your
razor". 

It was mentioned in Swamp Thing that Constantine would be appearing
in Firestorm: Rasputin must have been the result after the editor was informed. 

> 
>                                           -- Bill K.
> 
>Bill Kaufman,          | "Hush my darling / Be still my darling /
>Corporate Lackey       |  The lion's on the phone,..."
>wkaufman@us.oracle.com |              -- "The Guitar", They Might Be Giants

`Marky' Mark Boyes | Psychological Profile: Ace Rimmer meets Sean Hughes
Basement Flat      | Mantra: You can dance or you can sit and stare at the floor
28 Walton St.      | Mail: boyes@com.dec.enet.forty2   | Kinsey rating: Nobody 
Oxford, UK         | Day: 0734 206708 Night: 0865 53868|  knows I'm straight.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
From: jed@matilda.vut.edu.au (Jed Bowtell)
Subject: Re: Image
Organization: Victoria University of Technology
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 08:13:56 GMT


>>In article <1992Aug14.145444.15510@urbana.mcd.mot.com> asoto@dacapo.urbana.mcd.mot.com (Anthony Soto) writes:
>>>thing has been true of all of the Image books (except Youngblood) so far, the
>>>coloring is phenomenal. I've been very impressed with the job that's been done 
>>>on the coloring of all the books. The coloring in Brigade even made Liefeld's
>>>artwork appealing to my eye.

The coloring in Youngblood #1 (havent seen #2) was ok. Looked better
than the coloring in WildCATs.

Jed
From: prec@ellis.uchicago.edu (bruce lyman precourt)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: Re: Batman Encyclopedia?
Date: 20 Aug 92 15:19:46 GMT
Reply-To: prec@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations

In article <1992Aug18.083030.19556@midway.uchicago.edu> lf7z@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <86361@netnews.upenn.edu> fritz@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Katie Fritz) writes:
>>
>>Perhaps you are thinking of The Encyclopedia of Comic Book Heroes, Volume 1:
>>Batman.  If so, it's by Michael L. Fleisher, copyright 1976, Collier Books.
>>It is indeed a large-format book, 387 pages.  I'm pretty sure it's out of
>>print, but can be had at fine used bookstores or mail-order used book
>>dealers.  (Fleisher never got beyond Volume 2: Wonder Woman, unfortunately.)
>>I have a copy, but I'm afraid I can't part with it.  :-)
>>
>I'm fairly sure there was a volume on Superman as well, but I can't remember
>how the numbering went.

The Batman one is labelled Volume 1.

The Superman volume is volume 3 - but this is not immediately apparent.
You see, the title on the cover says "The Great Superman Book", but on
the title page it is subtitled "The Encyclopedia of Comic Book Heroes,
Volume 3". (That makes WW volume 2, the only one I don't have)

The revised cover, as I recall, was done to tie in with the release
of the Christopher Reeve-Superman movie.
From: bxp1628@hertz.njit.edu (Brian Perler)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: Re: Marvel 2099 titles (Jester)
Date: 17 Aug 92 13:25:13 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <3468@babcock.cerc.wvu.wvnet.edu> husty@cathedral.cerc.wvu.wvnet.edu (Steve Husty) writes:
>	Punisher 2099 - Haven't heard anything about this one.  My guess
>			is that Frank is old and even more pissed off 
>			because he can't litter anymore!!  No, I really
>			think that there are going to be gangs like in 
>			Batman Legend of the Dark Night, that emmulate 
>			the Skull-Vigilante!!

Oh, please.  Valentino did that in Guardians of the Galaxy.  And it 
sucked big time (just like the majority of his run on that book - and
Shadowhawk isn't much better).  Of course, he's off the book as of the
recent issue (#28 or #29, I'm not sure).  Maybe they'll get someone
to write it who doesn't feel the need to change every character every
five issues for no apparent reason.  But knowing Marvel, I doubt it.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly)
Subject: Re: Wild C.A.T.S. = X-Men? NOT!<--YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 23:23:18 GMT

daq@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Doug Quarnstrom) writes:

>I don't want to risk bursting your bubble, but I think Marvel probably
>OWNS image comics. 

*Ring* "Clue phone, it's for you." Marvel doesn't own Image.

>And everything image has done so far still panders to a sixth
>grade literary sensibility.

Well, considering most of the people writing for Image came from 
Marvel, I'd say that's why they write like that.

Most monthly comics are analagous to a weekly television show. Recurring
casts limit the writers to such a degree that most regulatr comics aren't
going to be great art.

Axly

********************************************************************************
*   Axly      *  "Is Axly tough? Yes. Talented? Yes. Brave? Oh, certainly.     *
* Red Sword   *   He is also erratic, irresponsible, accident-prone, and a     *
*   Targa     *   constant threat to public safety. The trick is to keep him   *
*             *   pointed in the right direction. "                            *
*             *         -Niki                                                  *
********************************************************************************

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
From: lf7z@ellis.uchicago.edu (glenn alan carnagey jr)
Subject: Re: Black Orchid
Reply-To: lf7z@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 07:51:11 GMT

In article <cwang.7.713823508@gsb.columbia.edu> cwang@gsb.columbia.edu (Chris Wang) writes:
>Does anybody know anything about the comic Black Orchid by Gaiman? I saw the 
>TPB in the store the other day and wasn't sure if it was any good. The art 
>looked nice. Any and all opinions are welcome.

I liked it a lot, but most of our fellow netters disagreed when I said so
not so long ago.  A lot of the criticism was directed at Dave McKean, the
painter on the book, so if you liked the art, that helps.  IMNSHO Gaiman's
best work has been with McKean, I think Gaiman's tone has a good deal with
to do with whom he's collaborating with, and the tenor of the Gaiman-McKean
stories are all similar, subdued with more of a "day-in-the-life" feel.  So if
you've read and liked "Hold Me" (Hellblazer #27), the Mister X A-1 story,
Violent Cases (my personal favorite Gaiman work) or anything else they did
together, chances are good you'll like the story, but it's nothing like
Sandman, really.  It's more a slow ride with attractive scenery, a lot of good
characterization and plot built slowly with very little action.  With
gratuitous Batman and Swamp Thing crossovers.  Well, not completely gratuitous,
but with definitely more profit than plot value.

Pax ex machina,
Glenn
..............................................................................
Soon I discovered that this rock thing was true, Jerry Lee Lewis was
the Devil, and Jesus was an architect, prior to his career as a prophet.
All of a sudden, I found myself in love with the world, so there was
only one thing I could do:  ding-a-ding dang, my dang-a-long ling long
    --- Ministry
g-carnagey@uchicago.edu
..............................................................................




From: daq@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Doug Quarnstrom)
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 18:32:34 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: Wild C.A.T.S. = X-Men? NOT!<--YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics

In rec.arts.comics, mcmahan@cs.unca.edu (Scott McMahan -- Genesis mailing list owner) writes:

> I'd rather fund Image's growing company than keep pouring money down
> Marvel's drain for second-rate books. I think Marvel is appealing
> to the lowest common denominator (6 year olds?!) or something with the
> stuff they try to pass off as comics. At least Image is giving us
> some semblance of talent.

I don't want to risk bursting your bubble, but I think Marvel probably
OWNS image comics. 

And everything image has done so far still panders to a sixth
grade literary sensibility.

> The Uncanny X-Men is unreadable to me -- *terrible* art - the 
> Morlock Blobs - unimaginitive story - basically, in a nutshell,
> ruining great characters by trash.

Msr Roquentine in Sartre's _Nausea_ is  great characther.
X-men characters are not (and never were) even well enough written to be
considered charicatures.

doug
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
From: stantbat@iastate.edu (John S Sinnott)
Subject: Re: Valiant, hello anyone out there?
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 20:42:28 GMT

In <BsyHLo.8vn@news.udel.edu> lmlc@brahms.udel.edu (Carolyn M Chandler) writes:

>well thats all from this fanitical Valiant collocter (50 valiant books a month)

>-morgan

Umm, I'm incredably thick-headed today, but Vailant does not put out 50 books
a month, it's more like ten.  Was that a joke, or do you buy 5 copies of
each book? 

-John Sinnott
From: rdippold@cancun.qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: Re: Marvel 2099 titles (Jester)
Date: 12 Aug 92 22:33:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: cancun.rdippold.713658824
Organization: Qualcomm, Inc., San Diego, CA

husty@cathedral.cerc.wvu.wvnet.edu (Steve Husty) writes:
>	Doom 2099 - Again, no real words on this one.  My guess is 
>		    our favorite Latverian Leader has kept himself 
>		    alive using some of his Black Magic, and this 
>		    is how he's doing in the 21st Century.

Nah, it's got to be more escaped Doombots, since they're in infinite
supply. 
-- 
"Well, if that ain't just like a woman of your sex!" -- Popeye
From: oliver@Software.Mitel.COM (Oliver Postlethwaite)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: Re: Youngblood #2
Date: 12 Aug 92 04:02:50 GMT
Organization: Cosmic Monsters Inc.

>>After reading Youngblood #2 there is no doubt in my
>>mind that Rob Liefeld is the greatest comic book
>>writer ever!
>>					Trevor
>
>You're a bit late; someone's already done the "Liefield is a God" flamebait 
>post. And he misspelled more words than you did. 

Yeah, and if you'd have paid attention you would have recognized that it
was this Trevor character who started THAT waste of bandwidth! 

I think he's being **VERY** sarcastic...whou could seriously say that?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
oliver@Software.Mitel.COM - "Rather be dead than cool." - K.C.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: Re: Wild C.A.T.S vs X-MEN
From: asoto@dacapo.urbana.mcd.mot.com (Anthony Soto)
Date: 21 Aug 92 16:05:20 GMT
Reply-To: asoto@dacapo.urbana.mcd.mot.com (Anthony Soto)
 > <170qrvINN30e@network.ucsd.edu> <171dqpINN2e0@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>
Organization: Motorola Computer Group, Urbana Design Center

In article <1992Aug20.125454.9112@sserve.cc.adfa.oz.au>,
whijv2@cspyr1.cs.adfa.o
z.au (WHITAKER JASON) writes:
|>
|>     I don't know why most of you people out there collect X-things, but
|> I do it for the characters. The art and story, while they help, are not
|> the be all and end all of a comic. I read them to follow the characters,
|> not to look at pretty pictures.

Hmm, here's a tough call... I collect the X-Men because I have a VERY
big run of
the book (I only need 4 issues and I'll have the entire series minus the
reprints between 66-93). The reason I started reading the book was becuase of
the STORIES about the characters. Believe it or not it was the "Fall of the
Mutants" that got me started with the X-Men. I started looking for back issues,
and luckily, the first run of back issues I got was the Phoenix Saga, a great
STORY.

I think I'm still reading the books because I have hope. I figure that with
the group of characters that are on the team there's no way a bad STORY can
be written. Unfortunately, I'm wrong. I want a good STORY. I want the family
back. I want the group of characters that sucked me into comics.

|>     For those of you who hate the X-men now because of dangling plots
|> or bad art, where is your loyalty to the team? So they are going through
|> bad times graphically, they will pull through. Ask yourselves this,
|> "If I am reading this book for the art or just a good story, do I deserve
|> to read it at all?" You people have no loyalty/feelings at all.

Ask yourself this, "Do you think we are all complaining about the direction of
the X-Men because we ARE loyal to the team?" We don't want/like the drivel
that is written in the books these days. I don't hate them for dangling
plots... Actually, it's just the opposite. I hate the way they are tying
up Claremont's dangling plots by killing anyone involved in the
danglers (Hellfire Club, Hellions, Reavers, Morlocks, etc.).

The X-Men weren't just a group of characters to me. They were a cohesive group
that had very good (here's that word again) STORIES written about them. They
have all that potential, and no one has been able to tap into it since
Claremont left. Others on the net might hate the X-Men, but I don't... I just
miss them.

|>     Me, I will never flame a comic on principle. Comics are to be
|> coveted, not insulted.

Good comics are to be read (I don't know about coveted), bad comics are to be
insulted.
					Tony
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics,rec.arts.comics.misc
From: cwelsh@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Craig Welsh  8823239)
Subject: Re: DC: Hellblazer/Swamp Thing query
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 12:34:01 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.180637.8444@news.nd.edu> mkelly@twain.helios.nd.edu (michael kelly) writes:
>lis@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Elisabeth Riba) writes:
>>I know somebody posted this earlier, but...
>>he Hellblazer GN ends with Swamp Thing confronting John Constantine.
>>In the intro, Delano says that the plot continues on in Swamp Thing.
>>Which issue of Swamp Thing or Hellblazer should I read next?
>
>Tefe is conceived in Swamp Thing 76, when Swampy is in possession of 
>JC's body. Swampy also has a tattoo of a conifer placed on John's
>rear end, which does show up later in Hellblazer.
>
>Here's Shannon D. Appel's list of JC appearances (it is a few months
>out of date.)
>
>Books of Magic: #1-4
>Hellblazer: #1-47, Annual #1
>Sandman: #3
>Swamp Thing: #37-40,44-51,65-67,70-77,84,88-90,99,114-115
>
For the ultra completist out there, there is a minor JC appearence that
you are missing. It was in an issue of Green Arrow, I believe it was in
the 20's. Ollie goes to Sherwood forest to investigate a mystery and
stops off at a pub to ask questions. One of the questions spooks the
locals (of course) and he is getting ready to leave when a nice English
fellow pulls him aside and warns him about poking his nose into this
matter. 3 guesses who it was? It is not actually said to be JC, but the
look and the mannerisms were there.

Hope this helped.

*************************************************************************
* Craig Welsh                  *    "I'm a few bricks short of a       *
*                              *     load, but a full load always      *
* cwelsh@morgan.ucs.mun.ca     *     hurt my back."                    *
*                              *     "Crazy" - Barenaked Ladies        *
************************************************************************
* "Homeboy from Hell." Screw that. I'm the Waiter from Hell.           *
*  You figure out which is scarier.                                    *
************************************************************************
From: husty@cathedral.cerc.wvu.wvnet.edu (Steve Husty)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics
Subject: Marvel 2099 titles (Jester)
Date: 12 Aug 92 17:36:49 GMT


	Here is some of the scoop on the Marvel 2099 stuff.

	Spiderman 2099 - Not bitten by a radioactive spider, but changed(?)
		     	 into a spider-like creature - PERMANENTLY (AHHHHH)

	Ravage 2099 - "Mercenary Garbage-Men Executioners" The Earth has
		      had its fill of garbage (excuse the pun), and garbage
		      men carry BIG-GUNS to shoot offenders (litter-bugs).
		      Stan Lee is actually doing this one.

	Punisher 2099 - Haven't heard anything about this one.  My guess
			is that Frank is old and even more pissed off 
			because he can't litter anymore!!  No, I really
			think that there are going to be gangs like in 
			Batman Legend of the Dark Night, that emmulate 
			the Skull-Vigilante!!

	Doom 2099 - Again, no real words on this one.  My guess is 
		    our favorite Latverian Leader has kept himself 
		    alive using some of his Black Magic, and this 
		    is how he's doing in the 21st Century.


	If any one out there in net-land has more info or specultation
	on any of this stuff feel free.  Please differentiate between 
	the two.  I'm speculating on the Punisher and Dr. Doom, but I
	pretty sure I'm right on with Ravage and Spidey.

				Jester
				"Any other fool would be a simple idiot"
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
From: djdaneh@pbhyc.PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Subject: Re: LSH Massacre
Reply-To: djdaneh@PacBell.COM (Dan'l DanehyOakes)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 16:23:32 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.001123.28439@afterlife.ncsc.mil> acadams@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Arthur C. Adams) writes:
>In article <m79ml4#.dani@netcom.com> dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:
>>I don't have any details on this (actually, some details were given,
>>and I promptly forgot them), but it appears that the entire LSH team
>>is gone except for Tom and Mary Bierbaum.

>Except for the Bierbaums?
>
>Jeez, that's kind of like saying "I'm going to clean the apartment today,
>except I'm not going to get rid of the dust."


Well, no, not really.  If I understand things properly, though it's co-plotted,
Giffen has the final say-so on plotting, while T&MB are in charge of the final
script.  Thus, I'd say that Giffen is to blame for the large-scale stupidities
that have taken place in LSHV4.

If this is true, it may also explain the rather offputting defensiveness the
Bierbaums have taken toward people pointing out the stupidity of, eg., the
Exploding Moon Saga.  They've seemed like honest and nice people; I'd guess
that they're stuck in the middle here, having to take the rap for stuff that
isn't their fault, and opting for loyalty to the guy who created some of their
favorite stuff (you know, "Great Darkness Saga" and all that).

This could all be hogwash, of course. . .

. . . anyway, I'd guess that Giffen going and T&MB staying would likely be
a Good Thing.


		My baby is a Martian,
		What can I do?
		I'm in love with a giant insect,
		I got them Exoskeletal Blues
			-- Visual Purple

Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, Net.Roach
My opinions do NOT represent Pacific Bell,
Professional Development, or anyone else.
But I'm willing to share.
From: mkelly@twain.helios.nd.edu (michael kelly)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: News from San Diego
Date: 14 Aug 92 16:56:02 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Notre Dame, Notre Dame


 jerry@teetot.acusd.edu (Jerry Stratton) writes:
>The Cutting Edge: Vertigo
>Report from the San Diego Comic-Con
>Captain Video

Thanks for this report!

>Hellblazer: Garth says that Steve Dilolin (huh? That's got to be wrong. 
>I was typing in the dark) will be taking over as artist in 5 issues. 
>Constantine will have family trouble with his sister, on or before his 
>48th birthday party. Then things go horribly wrong. He ends up sleeping 
>on the streets of London with no friends. 'Another Garth Ennis feel-good 
>story.'

Holy time warp! Didn't JC just celebrate his 40th back in 1991? Is this
a case of reverse-Kitty Pryde syndrome? Lets see, 48 in 1993 puts his
birthday in 1945. He would be 38 around the time of the Faulklands, and
a decidedly old punk rocker during his time with Mucous Membrane in the
mid-late seventies. Oh well, I guess Ennis had to finally do something
that I don' like....of course, I can always hope that Jerry got the
age wrong.

--
+               Mike Kelly, Notre Dame Department of Physics                +
+                                                                           +
+ mkelly@happy.helios.nd.edu       If you crumple your money into little    +
+ mkelly@undhe5.hep.nd.edu           balls, it will never stick together.   +
From: hcheng@Auspex.COM (Howard Cheng)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Re: The Care and Feeding of Comics
Date: 14 Aug 92 00:18:48 GMT
Organization: Auspex Systems, Santa Clara

In article <BswHLL.72x@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> hucke@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Matt Hucke) writes:
>
>I often get free plastic bags when buying comics, but throw them away...
>-- 

If you actually throw them away, why not give them back to the store? They'll
give to someone else and you won't be wasting the natural resources that went
into making that bag.

h.

Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc