HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tedebear@leland.Stanford.EDU (Theodore Chen)
Subject: Re: Tire width question
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 93 10:28:09 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.121921.585@doc.bmd.trw.com> ohlwiler@doc.bmd.trw.com writes:
>In article <1993Jan21.170825.24144@novell.com>, 
>chandler@wc.novell.com (Mark Chandler) writes:
>> In article <1993Jan21.152633.18381@mcc.com> spencer@mcc.com (Steve Spencer) writes:
>>>I recently purchased a touring bike and I would like to install wider tires on it. 
>>>It currently has 27x1 inch tires on Mavic MA40 rims. What is the widest tire that
>>>will fit on this rim? I would like to put Michelin Hi Lite touring tires (27x1 3/8)
>>>on it. 
>> 
>> Let's put it this way, "How much clearance do your frame and brakes have?"
>> You can run 700x45C tires on these w/o problems (Bruce Gordon has been selling
>> bikes with this combination for years).  Mountain bikes used very fat (2"+)
>> tires on these rims also.  The Hi-Lite Tours (good tires, by the way) will
>> be no problem.
>
>Mark has been a source of valuable information in the past.  In this instance
>his experiences do not mirror mine.
[stuff deleted]

not to mention that the original poster has 27 inch wheels and the
response talked about 700C tires.  there shouldn't be any problems
using the 27 x 1 3/8 tires - my friend has been using MA-40 and
specialized expedition tires in 27 x 1 3/8 for quite a while.

-teddy
From: rafael@flash.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Ralph Grundler)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: New Onza Cranks
Date: 26 Jan 93 23:30:48 GMT
Distribution: rec.bicycles.tech
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]

Kurt Cannon (cannon@virus.kyoto-u.ac.jp) wrote:
: Not that I will ever have the money to buy a set of the new Onza cast
: titanium cranks anytime in the near future, but I wonder if the Physics
: masters would mind comparing the strengths/weaknesses of this girder
: design with tubular cranks and comenting on the future of cast titan.

	I almost resisted the urge to comment but here it goes.  I first saw a prototype out of aluminum in Summer of '91.  I looked strange but they worked well.  They were machined by hand and I was wondering how Onza was going to make them.  I never thought they would have cast them out of Titanium!  

Since I moved back to the Bay Area I had not followed the cranks evolution since '91.  So I gave my friend who machined the prototypes a call.  He told me that the cranks were getting hairline cracks near the peadal. He did not tell me what the problem was but I could make some asumptions.  The biggest problems I see with the cranks are 1) They are cast. 2)They are tapered from bottom bracket to pedal.

The pedals are lost wax cast using 6Al/4V Titanium.  The alloy is good but lost wax casting as any artist knows is easly flawed.  The cracks could have been from flawed casting.

The other problem is that the cranks are tapered from the bottom bracket (the width, not the thickness) to the pedal.  What this does is put the most stress near the pedal and the result was cracking.  A tubular type of crank will distubute this force evenly over the lenth of the crank.

I would not put these cranks on my bike.  Cold forged cranks are much better.  There are many other reasons notch factor of titanium, heat treatment from casting ect.

Save you money untill you see all the racers using them.

Ralph Grundler 
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: zrwv05@hou.amoco.com (Rod VanKoughnet)
Subject: Re: Pinging noise
Reply-To: zrwv05@hou.amoco.com
Organization: Amoco
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 13:02:37 GMT

I seem to notice that pinging noise most as the air and road temperature are increasing on sunny days.  I always assumed it was some kind of spoke or wheel thermal expansion thing.  However, Dick King's post regarding boogered up front wheel bearings is a	strong possibility, since I know for a fact that my cones are wasted (though they've got new bearings).	

Rod
From: ehouse@Apple.COM (Eric House)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: WD-40 To Clean Chains???
Date: 28 Jan 93 18:03:05 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA

In article <C1IonI.Hup@cs.uiuc.edu> tthiel@cs.uiuc.edu (Terry Thiel) writes:
>T0FG000 <T0FG@UNB.CA> writes:
>>Basically, I apply WD-40 before every ride and anytime the chain
>>becomes wet.  Ordinary oil doesn't seem to do as good a job as the
>>spray WD-40
>>though it could be just the way I apply it.
>
>Can't be much of a lubricant if you have to apply it before every ride.
>
>>I am wondering what the rest of you do to lube your chain?  Any
>>other silly people applying this non-lubricant to their chain?
>>Will.
>
>You tried one silicone lubricant and consider yourself informed enoug
>to refer to people who don't use WD-40 as "silly".  Get a life.

Terry:

Rather than recommending that someone else "get a life" why don't you
get yourself a CLUE first.  Reread what Will said above.  In particular,
take a look at whom he's calling silly.  If you still don't understand,
email me and I'll explain what the simple English is saying.

We all make mistakes.  But people who are gratuitously rude ought to be
more careful.
-- 
****************************************************************************
Eric House			"My employer doesn't share its opinions with
RAAM in '93?		   	 me, so I can share only mine with you"
From: cs92mjd@cen.ex.ac.uk (M.J.Davis)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: The Future of the Bike
Date: 22 Jan 93 13:16:53 GMT
	<1993Jan20.054527.17190@beaver.cs.washington.edu>
	<11781@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au>
Organization: Computer Unit. - University of Exeter. UK

In article <11781@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au> harold@cs.uq.oz.au (Andrew Wood) writes:

   >Hmmm... Now there's an idea... the yo-yo bike.
   >It stores the kinetic energy from going down hills and releases it to 
   >power you up the next hill!
   >Now all we have to do is implement a gyroscope that will still let you
   >corner like Lemond...

How about something like a big watch spring attached to the front wheel and 
fork via a slipping clutch? The spring winds up as you descend, the clutch
begins to slip as it becomes fully wound, and then you let it unwind again
on the next climb, thus transferring it's stored energy into the wheel
and towing you up the hill.

Alternatively use a very very heavy rear wheel, and leave it in your
shed all night attached to a big electric motor to spin it. Then you use
the bike the next morning to travel in a straight line with no effort. Don't
even think about stopping/cornering, though...

Mikey D
From: ehouse@Apple.COM (Eric House)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Phil Wood sealed BB in a MTB?
Date: 22 Jan 93 17:44:39 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA

In article <1993Jan21.170045.4296@viewlogic.com> greg@mobius.viewlogic.com (Gregory Larkin) writes:
>
>Hi there,
>
>My mountain bike is having some BB problems, so
>I would like to replace it with a sealed Phil
>Wood BB.  I happen to have a spare frame with
>a Phil BB already in it.  
>
>Can I swap the BB out of the road frame and put
>it into the MTB frame, or do I need a BB with
>a longer axle?  I think the one I have might be
>a 108mm axle.  Does that sound right?  I'm pretty
>sure that the Phil BB has axle lengths up to 113mm.
>
>Altermately, does anyone have a different brand
>of sealed MTB BB that they would recommend?

I doubt a road-width BB would work for your MTB.  You'll need to accomodate
both the extra width of the triple crank and the wider BB shell.

Phil makes BB spindles in an unbelievable variety of lengths (I've seen one
well over 8" long, though I think it was made as a joke).  If the shop
you're buying from says a given length isn't available it probably means
they want to sell you what they have rather than order something new.  Try
another shop or contact Phil Wood directly.

The current Phil BB, which hasn't been changed in years, has to be sent
back to the factory when the bearings wear out (though it appears that you
could replace them yourself if you are fairly creative.)  If this bothers
you you might want to wait until the new model, which will be "field
servicable," comes out.  No date has been set, and last time I asked they
said it's on the back burner right now.
-- 
****************************************************************************
Eric House			"My employer doesn't share its opinions with
RAAM in '93?		   	 me, so I can share only mine with you"
From: ilh@lcs.mit.edu (Lee Hetherington)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: LX DX XT XTR Confusion
Date: 22 Jan 93 10:12:23
Organization: MIT/LCS Spoken Language Systems
	<C18GsM.E8B@cs.uiuc.edu>
Reply-To: ilh@lcs.mit.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: chicago.ai.mit.edu
In-reply-to: tthiel@cs.uiuc.edu's message of Fri, 22 Jan 1993 02:12:22 GMT

In article <C18GsM.E8B@cs.uiuc.edu>
tthiel@cs.uiuc.edu (Terry Thiel) writes:
   You forgot to mention that LX is not as well finished or durable as DX or XT
   either.  Of course if you have an LX bike then thats a strong incentive to
   defend it...
   -Terry

Terry: ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH!

I'm really getting tired of your "DX is better than LX because its not
painted and because that's what Bridgestone puts on my bicycle"
attitude.  The other day you stated how '92 LX sucks (unqualified).
I'm sorry, but I have '92 LX on my bicycle because that's all I could
afford and I bought it in '92.  I think its ridiculuous that you're
running around bashing the equipment of others, and, quite frankly,
I'm offended.  Maybe many of us can't afford better than LX.  Maybe
you think the price difference between DX and LX is worth it.  Maybe
others think the price difference between XTR and XT and DX is worth
it.  Maybe we don't have as much money as you.  Maybe we have more
money than you.  Maybe...

Terry, in case you haven't noticed, because you own a Bridgestone,
you're always the first to defend/worship them.  (And, because you own
DX, it has the ultimate price/performance tradeoff.)  You'll be happy
to know that my wife bought a Bridgestone this fall.  But, alas, it
only has an Exage drivetrain.  According to you, Bridgestone doesn't
put junk on their bicycles.  According to you LX sucks.  If

	Exage < LX <<<<<<< DX

than what in the world is Bridgestone doing even messing with anything
less than DX.

Sorry, Terry and the rest of you, but I just boiled over.  Wow, I feel
a lot better know.
--

                                Lee Hetherington
                                ilh@lcs.mit.edu
From: sdexter@pike.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (scott dexter)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: LX DX XT XTR Confusion
Date: 21 Jan 93 19:44:48 GMT

In article <25294@galaxy.ucr.edu>, sdexter@pike.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (scott dexter) writes:
|> In article <christog.727485603@sfu.ca>, christog@fraser.sfu.ca (Christopher William Goodman) writes:
|> |> I am confused over the differences between LX, DX, XT, and XTR
|> |> components; Can anyone help me out?   Thanks... Chris
|> 
|> 
|> There is an article in a recent (Jan?) issue of either Mountain Biking or
|> Mountain Bike Action  (great help, eh?)  that discusses the performance
|> differences between Deore LX and XTR.
|> 
|> Basically, save the $$$$ and buy LX.   <-- no!

  I'm SOOOOO sorry-- I meant DX         

Scott
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: les@SAIL.Stanford.edu (Les Earnest)
Subject: Re: The Future of the Bike
Reply-To: les@cs.stanford.edu
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
	<1ju6luINN782@sauna.cs.hut.fi>
Distribution: inet
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 00:59:40 GMT

Otto-Ville Ronkainen writes:
   How about reserving the word 'derailleur' for French (or European)
   derailleurs? Such feats of mechanical engineering as the Shitmano
   Positron could be called 'derailures', whereas your average
   Japanese derailleur would be called simply a 'derailer'.

Be careful about making suggestions like this -- you are likely to
anger the same conservatives who were offended by my suggestion in
r.b.racing that the abbreviation of "International Cycling Union"
should be ICU instead of the traditional UCI.
--
Les Earnest           Phone:  415 941-3984    Fax: 415 941-3934
Internet: Les@cs.Stanford.edu              USMail: 12769 Dianne Drive
UUCP: . . . decwrl!cs.Stanford.edu!Les         Los Altos Hills, CA 94022
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: ruhtra@turing.toronto.edu (Arthur Tateishi)
Subject: Re: Wheel Wonderings
Organization: CSRI, University of Toronto
Date: 24 Jan 93 20:52:34 GMT

In article <1460062@hplred.HPL.HP.COM> jbrandt@hplred.HPL.HP.COM (Jobst Brandt) writes:
>  If you don't use esoteric rims that
>have unusual cross sections and stay with a reasonable number of
>spokes for your weight, no spoke locking method is needed.

I've been considering getting a second set of lighter wheels for
races(tri's). I've been using a set of Ambrosio 36 hole clinchers with
20mm tires that have stayed nice and true as long I don't hit a big
pothole.

I'm 175lbs with a 53cm frame.(Should be down to 160lbs before my first
race) Am I just looking for trouble if I go with a set of 32 hole
clinchers and 18-20mm tires? Does anyone have any words against aero
rims?

arthur
-- 
"The first fact to face is that UNIX was not developed with security, in any
reliable sense, in mind; this fact alone guarantees a vast number of holes."
    -- "On the Security of UNIX", Dennis M. Ritchie
Arthur Tateishi                 ruhtra@turing.utoronto.ca
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech,rec.bicycles.misc
From: seanodon@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Aragorn)
Subject: Re: Experience using Cannondale Overland Panniers?
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 93 15:51:20 GMT

In article <PIAW.93Jan27153802@peoplesparc.Berkeley.EDU> piaw@peoplesparc.Berkeley.EDU (Na Choon Piaw) writes:
>Does anyone have any experience using Cannondale Overland Panniers for
>touring?  Did you like them?  Were they worth the money?  How durable
>were they?
>
>Reply by e-mail and I'll summarize.
>
>Thanks,
>Piaw

I have an old pair of Cannondale Overlands (2500 cu in) and have been
fairly pleased with them.  The only problem I have ever had was with one
of the compression springs.  The model I have uses compression springs
mounted in a thick vinyl tube to keep the panniers on.  About a year
after I bought them one of the springs broke.  I sent a letter to
Cannondale about this and within a month i received SIX replacement
spings free of charge.  I haven't had any other problems.  

Overall they are quite nice.  The main pouch is amply big, and the
smaller side pouches allow for easy access to tools or other
necessities.  They stay mounted on the rack very well.  The only time
one came off was when I crashed and flipped.  There is also available a
locking bar for heavy touring, so that once it is engaged the panniers
will _not_ come off.

Need any more info, give me a yell

Aragorn
-- 
***seanodon@ecn.purdue.edu***********************************************
*  Man-in-Black: "You mean you'll put down your rock and I'll put 	*
*		  down my sword, and we'll try to kill each other 	*
*		  like civilized people."	_The Princess Bride_	*
From: mackinto@oasys.dt.navy.mil (David Mackintosh)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: LX DX XT XTR Confusion
Date: 21 Jan 93 17:28:05 GMT
Reply-To: mackinto@oasys.dt.navy.mil (David Mackintosh)
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In rec.bicycles.tech, paynter@bnr.ca (Stuart Paynter) writes:
>I think that CX is the hybrid-specific groupset (if my memory serves me
>correctly).

This is correct, but I wonder what the price is or whether parts will
be available individually.  The CX crank is polished and looks almost
as good as XTR.  The brakes are similar to LX but silver, much better
looking.

David Mackintosh
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: T0FG000 <T0FG@UNB.CA>
Subject: Re: WD-40 To Clean Chains???
Organization: The University of New Brunswick
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 00:49:37 GMT


Hi, all.

I am one of those misguided souls who uses WD-40 as a chain
'lubricant'.  I have done so for years, and have not experienced
problems with my chain disintegrating, collecting excessive dirt, or
otherwise becoming difficult to use due to the presence of WD-40 on
it.

At one time, I did try a commercial silicone based lubricant, but
found it attracted so much dirt that a couple days ride would
accumulate so much dirt on the chain, that shifting became
difficult.  I have since seen a post that silicon lubricants attract
dirt... at least I know what ingredient was doing it now.

Basically, I apply WD-40 before every ride and anytime the chain
becomes wet.  Ordinary oil doesn't seem to do as good a job as the
spray WD-40
though it could be just the way I apply it.

I am wondering what the rest of you do to lube your chain?  Any
other silly people applying this non-lubricant to their chain?

Will.


---------------------------------------- William Burrow
Internet:  t0fg@unb.ca                      |
           will@1.f14.n255.z1.fidonet.org   |
Fidonet:  1:255/14.1                        |
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
From: paynter@bnr.ca (Stuart Paynter)
Subject: Re: WD-40 To Clean Chains???
Reply-To: paynter@bnr.ca (Stuart Paynter)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 93 13:09:09 GMT

In article <C1Gw0u.85t@javelin.sim.es.com>, bgeer@beorn.sim.es.com (bob geer) writes:
|> alanb@sdl.ug.eds.com (Alan Braggins) writes:
|> >... and the WD-40 is cheap (5 litle bottle and a hand squirt,
|> >not aerosols).
|> 
|> Do you mean "litre" instead of "litle"?
|> 
|> I've never seen WD-40 available in bulk quantities -- only in the
|> aerosol cans here in the USA.  Has anyone?

I have seen it here in Canada in 4 (5?) litre jugs for about $14-15.  I 
am surprised that it would be here and not in the US.  An automotive
supply shop or Price Club should have it.

Cheers...Stuart
From: ccsdhd@sunlab1.bath.ac.uk (Dennis Davis)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Tandem crossover rings.
Date: 22 Jan 93 13:34:34 GMT
Organization: Bath University Computing Services, UK

In the referenced article, praetzel@maxwell.uwaterloo.ca (Eric Praetzel) writes:
>  Since the chain always has an even number of links (ie they are always in
>pairs so there has to be an even number) and if the sum of the number of teeth
>is odd then there will be a rotation of the chain around the rings while if
>the sum is even there will be a different pattern.  I am not sure how
>different until I solve:
>  .
>  .
>  Either way it does not make much difference in real life unless you are 
>staying in one gear all the way up a multi-thousand mile hill.
>As you can see there are only very rare combos that lock into a quick
>repeating cycle (ie 106 links, 53 teeth ...).  But there is generally no
>significant difference between even and odd combos as you can see.

There is one esoteric case where this might make a difference.
That is on tandems fitted with a crossover chainset.  A suitable
choice of crossover rings can ensure that the chain gradually moves
around the rings.  As you often have a limited choice in the number
of links in the chain, a good bet is to have crossover rings with a
prime number of teeth.  It took me a long time before I realised
why my secondhand tandem came equipped with crossover rings of 43
teeth.  It seemed such a peculiar choice.  Other good choices would
include 37, 41, 47 and 53.

The only case where this falls down is if the number of links on
the chain is an exact multiple of the teeth on the chainrings.
This is shown neatly in Eric's table:

>  # links     # teeth    # rev to rpt.    # links     # teeth   # rev to rpt.
>  .
>  .
>     108,         19,        108             108,         20,         27
>     108,         21,         36             108,         22,         54
>     106,         53,          2             106,         52,         53
>     106,         39,        106             106,         42,         53
>  .
>  .

As Eric has pointed out, with crossover rings of 53 teeth and a
chain of 106 links the chain isn't going to gradually move round
the rings even though 53 is a prime number.  Instead you end up
with a quick repeating cycle.
-- 
Dennis Davis, BUCS, University of Bath, Bath, BA2 7AY, UK
D.H.Davis@bath.ac.uk
From: grubisichjas@bvc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: HELP PEDAL CONFUSION
Date: 22 Jan 93 08:46:31 CST
Organization: Buena Vista College, Storm Lake, IA

Pedal Question-

      I have been considering adding clipless pedals to my Trek 970.  Yet I 
am confused to wich brand to purchase.  What do you recomend?
From: jbrandt@hplred.HPL.HP.COM (Jobst Brandt)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Selle Italia Flite saddle
Date: 27 Jan 93 17:11:21 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories, Palo Alto, CA

Chris Moll writes:

> Perhaps I misunderstood - are you saying you didn't notice the
> difference between the Flite and your regular saddle?  If so, that
> is a testament in favor of the Flite, since the whole idea is that
> it offers the _same_ comfort with less weight (despite its
> cheeklessness).

I guess the logic is subtle but if you fail to notice the saddle, it
is so agreeable that you forget to make a comparison.  When you get
back from a long ride and never noticed your saddle you have a good
saddle.  In contrast, I had no trouble noticing the Flite saddle
while riding it.         

David Casseres writes:

> Sorry, Jobst, but as you once said to me, it won't wash.  You have
> no evidence that the Flite "has a tendency to break"; you have
> only a scattering of reports from the Net.  Furthermore, you have
> perhaps made the Flite bottom on the seat post, but you have not
> made the same test on significant numbers of other saddles.  There
> is no science here, and no engineering; only smoke.

I'm sure your sorrow is sincere so let me augment my "scientific"
publication as follows:

Being a regular visitor at Palo Alto Bicycles where many bicycles
are sold and serviced, it came to my attention that Flite saddles
had broken on several occasions.  Other steel frame saddles
outnumber these saddles by a substantial number and have not had a
noticeable failure rate.  That is, the mechanics could not recall
the last failure of a steel frame on major brand saddle.

I have tested the Flite saddle long enough to know that is bottoms
because it is merely a hammock strung between the ends of the rails
and has little structural strength in the shell.  This is the same
as swallow saddles that I also tested years ago.  I hope this helps
complete your washday.

> More smoke.  Are you really trying to tell us that the bike is
> kept upright by the rider pushing on the side of the seat with the
> back if his leg??????  Really, Jobst.

That's a pretty large jump from what I said.  So let me just suggest
that the cheeks of a conventional saddle show substantial wear and
that this wear does not arise from sprinting or time trial riding.
In contrast the Flite saddle, not having these appendages, causes
welts on the legs where they contact the truncated portion of the
saddle.

jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech