From: symanzik@egr.msu.edu (PUT YOUR NAME HERE)
Newsgroups: alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.politics.usa.constitution
Subject: Re: U.S. Bill of Rights today
Date: 14 Sep 92 12:27:36 GMT
Reply-To: symanzik@egr.msu.edu (PUT YOUR NAME HERE)
Organization: Michigan State University
Originator: symanzik@frith.egr.msu.edu

In article <1992Sep11.154055.30629@m.cs.uiuc.edu> kadie@herodotus.cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
>symanzik@egr.msu.edu (Ed Symanzik) writes:
>> If "uphold the Constitution" means to interpret the Constitution the
>> way the Founding Fathers intended it to be read, then I agree.

> And yet the word "God" appears no where in the body of the 
> Constitution

If the Constitution is to be upheld to the letter, we can make it say
anything we care to and it would therefore be a worthless document.
But, since you insist, how about a document that is even more basic 
than the Constitution - say, the Declaration of Independence?

    "the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God"
    "that they are endowed by their Creator"
    "with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence"

You'll likely dismiss it but since we are getting picky about words -
I just noticed that after the end of article VII of the Constitution 
it does say:

    "in the Year of our Lord"

> and the only mention on religion is the ban on religious tests.

Of course we all know the First Amendment.  But it's not part of the 
original Constitution you say?  Well, the Amendments were done soon
after and by the same men; surely the beliefs of all of them didn't 
change instantly upon the signing of the Constitution.

> Moreover, while many of the founders were Christian, others were not.
> Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Paine, for example,
> were deists who believed that formal religion was superfluous.
> Jefferson rewrote the New Testament removing all references to the
> divinity of Jesus.

I wasn't aware of that last point.  He must have been a very religious
man to spend so much time reading and rewriting the Bible, don't
you agree?  This quote from his "Notes on the State of Virginia" 
seems to.

    And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have
    removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the 
    people that these liberties are of the gift of God?  That they
    are not to be violated but with His wrath?  Indeed I tremble
    for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice
    cannot sleep forever.

Benjamin Franklin was a representative from Pennsylvania.  Here is 
a requirement from that state:

    Frame of Government, Section 10.  And each member, before he takes
    his seat, shall make and subscribe the following declaration, viz:
    "I do believe in one God, the Creator and Governour of the universe,
    the rewarder of the good and the punisher of the wicked, and I do
    acknowledge the Scriptures of the Old and New Testament to be
    given by Divine Inspiration."

Not the oath of an atheist, is it?

    With no more than five exceptions (and perhaps no more than three),
    they [the members of the Constitutional Convention] were orthodox
    members of one of the established Christian communions: approximately
    twenty-nine Anglicans, sixteen to eighteen Calvinists, two Methodists,
    two Lutherans, two Roman Catholics, one lapsed Quaker and sometime
    Anglican, and one open Deist - Dr. Franklin, who attended every
    kind of Christian worship, called for public prayer, and contributed
    to all denominations.
	Bradford, A Worthy Company, p. viii-ix.

This is a Christian nation founded by Christians.  They could not have
intended to supress Christianity.

> When the First Amendment was enacted _no_ state had an established
> state church or supported one religion over another.

Until 1786 the Church of England was Virginia's only legal church.
Jefferson wrote the "Virginia Bill for Religious Liberty" to give other
denominations equal recognition.  This is also what the First Amendment 
was written to prevent, that one denomination be given preferential
treatment.

--
Ed Symanzik
Michigan State University
symanzik@egr.msu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.politics.usa.constitution