From: traynor@fnala.fnal.gov
Newsgroups: soc.history
Subject: Re: THE DIVINE MASTERS, THROUGHOUT HISTORY
Date: 26 Jan 93 13:01:11 -0600
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Lab
NNTP-Posting-Host: fnala.fnal.gov

In article <1993Jan25.175857.3305@cnsvax.uwec.edu>, mcelwre@cnsvax.uwec.edu writes:
>           
> 
>                       THE DIVINE MASTERS, THROUGHOUT HISTORY
>       
>                Most Christians would agree, and correctly so, that 
>           Jesus Christ was a perfect living Master, and a projection of 
>           God into the physical world, God Incarnate. 
>           
>                But there are some very important related facts that 
>           Christians are COMPLETELY IGNORANT of, as are followers of 
>           most other world religions. 
>            
>                First, Jesus Christ was NOT unique, John 3:16 NOTWITH-
>           STANDING.  There is ALWAYS at least one such perfect living 
>           Master (God Incarnate) PHYSICALLY ALIVE in this world AT ALL 
>           TIMES, a continuous succession THROUGHOUT HISTORY, both 
>           before and after the life of Jesus. 

Proof, please.  At the very least, some kind of plausibility argument.
And, who/what determines who these are?

>     
>                The followers of some of these Masters founded the 
>           world's major religions, usually PERVERTING the teachings of 
>           their Master in the process.  Christians, for example, added 
>           THREATS of "ETERNAL DAMNATION" in Hell, and DELETED the 
>           teaching of REincarnation. 

Added to what/deleted from what?  Are you implying that some form of
Buhddism(sp?) is the 'real' religion that all others are drived from
or perversions of?

>        
>                Secondly, and more importantly, after a particular 
>           Master physically dies and leaves this world, there is 
>           NOTHING that He can do for ANYbody except for the relatively 
>           few people that He INITIATED while He was still physically 
>           alive.  (That is simply the way God set things up in the 
>           Universes.) 

And you simply know this....
 
>                Therefore, all those Christians who worship Jesus, and 
>           pray to Jesus, and expect Jesus to return and save them from 
>           their sins, are only KIDDING THEMSELVES, and have allowed 
>           themselves to be DUPED by a religion that was mostly 
>           MANUFACTURED by the Romans. 
       
The same Romans who persecuted Christians for 280 years.  That is NOT to
say that many facets of Orthodoxy/Catholicism/Protestantism are not
related to Roman society or culture, but MANUFACTURED is quite a bit of
a stronger term.

>                And emotional "feelings" are a TOTALLY DECEIVING 
>           indicator for religious validity. 

I guess then YOUR thoughts are wholly based on reason and facts.  If so,
kindly provide them.
     
>                These things are similarly true for followers of most 
>           other major world religions, including Islam. 

1.5 billion Christians', 1 billion Muslims' faiths, just wiped away in one
sentence.      

>                Thirdly, the primary function of each Master is to tune 
>           His Initiates into the "AUDIBLE LIFE STREAM" or "SOUND 
>           CURRENT", (referred to as "THE WORD" in John 1:1-5, and as 
>           "The River of Life" in Revelation 22:1), and to personally 
>           guide each of them thru the upper levels of Heaven while they 
>           are still connected to their living physical bodies by a 
>           "silver cord". 
>     
>                True Salvation, which completes a Soul's cycles of 
>           REincarnation in the physical and psychic planes, is achieved 
>           only by reaching at least the "SOUL PLANE", which is five 
>           levels or universes above the physical universe, and this 
>           canNOT be done without the help of a Perfect LIVING Master. 

So the Word means nothing without someone's physical presence.  
     
>                One such perfect Master alive today is an American, Sri 
>           Harold Klemp, the Living "Eck" Master or "Mahanta" for the 
>           "Eckankar" organization, now headquartered in Minneapolis, 
>           (P.O. Box 27300;  zip 55427). 
>     
>                Another perfect living Master is Maharaj Gurinder Singh 
>           Ji, now living in Punjab, India, and is associated with the 
>           "Sant Mat" organization. 
>       
>                One of the classic books on this subject is "THE PATH OF 
>           THE MASTERS" (Radha Soami Books, P.O. Box 242, Gardena, CA  
>           90247), written in 1939 by Dr. Julian Johnson, a theologian 
>           and surgeon who spent the last years of his life in India 
>           studying under and closely observing the Sant Mat Master of 
>           that time, Maharaj Sawan Singh Ji. 
>     
>                Several of the Eckankar books, including some authored 
>           by Sri Paul Twitchell or Sri Harold Klemp, can be found in 
>           most public and university libraries and some book stores, or 
>           obtained thru inter-library loan.  The book "ECKANKAR--THE 
>           KEY TO SECRET WORLDS", by Sri Paul Twitchell, is ANOTHER 
>           classic. 
>     
>                Many Christians are likely to confuse the Masters with 
>           the "Anti-Christ", which is or was to be a temporary world 
>           dictator during the so-called "last days".  But the Masters 
>           don't ever rule, even when asked or expected to do so as 
>           Jesus was. 
>     
>                People who continue following Christianity, Islam, or 
>           other orthodox religions with a physically DEAD Master, will 
>           CONTINUE on their cycles of REincarnation, between the 
>           psychic planes and this MISERABLE physical world, until they 
>           finally WISE UP! 
>     

So Jesus' command to preach the Word to all humanity was a waste of time--
and He must have know this.
           
>     
>           RE-INCARNATION
>           
>                The book "HERE AND HEREAFTER", by Ruth Montgomery, 
>           describes several kinds of evidence supporting REincarnation 
>           as a FACT OF LIFE, including HYPNOTIC REGRESSIONS* to past 
>           lives*, SPONTANEOUS RECALL (especially by young children, some 
>           of whom can identify their most recent previous relatives, 
>           homes, possessions, etc.), DREAM RECALL of past life experi-
>           ences, DEJA VU (familiarity with a far off land while travel-
>           ing there for the first time on vacation), the psychic read-
>           ings of the late EDGAR CAYCE, and EVEN SUPPORTING STATEMENTS 
>           FROM THE CHRISTIAN BIBLE including Matthew 17:11-13 (John the 
>           Baptist was the REINCARNATION of Elias.) and John 9:1-2 (How 
>           can a person POSSIBLY sin before he is born, unless he LIVED 
>           BEFORE?!).  [ ALWAYS use the "KING JAMES VERSION".  Later 
>           versions are PER-VERSIONS! ]  Strong INTERESTS, innate 
>           TALENTS, strong PHOBIAS, etc., typically originate from a 
>           person's PAST LIVES.  For example, a strong fear of swimming 
>           in or traveling over water usually results from having 
>           DROWNED at the end of a PREVIOUS LIFE.  And sometimes a 
>           person will take AN IMMEDIATE DISLIKE to another person being 
>           met for the first time, because of a bad encounter with him 
>           during a PREVIOUS INCARNATION. 
> 
>           *[a way to obtain EYE-WITNESS ACCOUNTS of historical events!]
> 
>                The teaching of REincarnation also includes the LAW OF 
>           KARMA (Galatians 6:7, Revelation 13:10, etc.).  People would 
>           behave much better toward each other if they knew that their 
>           actions in the present will surely be reaped by them in the 
>           future, or in a FUTURE INCARNATION! 
> 
> 
> 
>           "2nd COMINGS"
> 
>                If a Perfect Living Master physically dies ("trans-
>           lates") before a particular Initiate of His does, then when 
>           that Initiate physically dies ("translates"), the Master will 
>           meet him on the Astral level and take him directly to the 
>           Soul Plane.  This is the ONE AND ONLY correct meaning of a 
>           2nd Coming.  It is an INDIVIDUAL experience, NOT something 
>           that happens for everyone all at once.  People who are still 
>           waiting for Jesus' "2nd Coming" are WAITING IN VAIN. 
>     
>           
>           
>           PLANES OF EXISTENCE
> 
>                The physical universe is the LOWEST of AT LEAST a DOZEN 
>           major levels of existence.  Above the Physical Plane is the 
>           Astral Plane, the Causal Plane, the Mental Plane, the Etheric 
>           Plane (often counted as the upper part of the Mental Plane), 
>           the Soul Plane, and several higher Spiritual Planes.  The 
>           Soul Plane is the FIRST TRUE HEAVEN, (counting upward from 
>           the Physical).  The planes between (but NOT including) the 
>           Physical and Soul Planes are called the Psychic Planes. 
>     
>                It is likely that ESP, telepathy, astrological 
>           influences, radionic effects, biological transmutations [See 
>           the 1972 book with that title.], and other phenomena without 
>           an apparent physical origin, result from INTERACTIONS between 
>           the Psychic Planes and the Physical Plane. 
>     
>                The major planes are also SUB-DIVIDED.  For example, a 
>           sub-plane of the Astral Plane is called "Hades", and the 
>           Christian Hell occupies a SMALL part of it, created there 
>           LESS THAN 2000 YEARS AGO by the EARLY CATHOLIC CHURCH by some 
>           kind of black magic or by simply teaching its existence in a 
>           THREATENING manner.  The Christian "Heaven" is located 
>           elsewhere on the Astral Plane.  Good Christians will go there 
>           for a short while and then REincarnate back to Earth. 
>           
>           
>           
>           SOUND CURRENT vs. BLIND FAITH
> 
>                The Christian religion demands of its followers an 
>           extraordinary amount of BLIND FAITH backed up by little more 
>           than GOOD FEELING (which is TOTALLY DECEIVING). 
>        
>                If a person is not HEARING some form of the "SOUND 
>           CURRENT" ("THE WORD", "THE BANI", "THE AUDIBLE LIFE STREAM"), 
>           then his cycles of REINCARNATION in this MISERABLE world WILL 
>           CONTINUE. 
>     
>                The "SOUND CURRENT" manifests differently for different 
>           Initiates, and can sound like a rushing wind, ocean waves on 
>           the sea shore, buzzing bees, higher-pitched buzzing sound, a 
>           flute, various heavenly music, or other sounds.  In Eckankar, 
>           Members start hearing it near the end of their first year as 
>           a Member.  This and other experiences (such as "SOUL TRAVEL") 
>           REPLACE blind faith. 
>     
> 
> 
>                UN-altered REPRODUCTION and DISSEMINATION of this 
>           IMPORTANT Information is ENCOURAGED. 
> 
> 
>                                            Robert E. McElwaine
>                                            2nd Initiate in Eckankar
> 
> 
I have no difficulty in your believing what you believe, and I have no 
desire to attack your worldview/belief structure.  I do have strong
reservations on how you are going around making strong accusations
of my and others' without any definitive arguments to back the 
accusations up.

				-Mike Traynor

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Newsgroups: soc.history