HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pepke@ds1.scri.fsu.edu (Eric Pepke)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Re: Men Are Not Cost Effective
Date: 13 Apr 92 23:27:27 GMT
Reply-To: pepke@ds1.scri.fsu.edu (Eric Pepke)
Organization: Florida State University, but I don't speak for them

In article <1992Apr7.221221.16046@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> pprior@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Paul A Prior) writes:
>>Or an authoress who lives in Napa County, California.
>
>Welcome to alt.politics.correct

Interesting comment. 

Actually, "authoress" is the traditional term, like waitress, actress, and
poetess.  

-EMP
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.women
From: michaelc@oz.plymouth.edu (Mike Clark)
Subject: Re: Q the fake
Reply-To: michaelc@oz.plymouth.edu (Mike Clark)
Organization: Plymouth State College - Plymouth, N.H.
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 92 12:43:33 GMT



But on the other hand, we're used to women faking so I guess Q must be
a woman....
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.women,talk.abortion
From: barry@netcom.com (Kenn Barry)
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Vanilla Sex in Canada (was Re: Japanese Women's Lib)
Date: 14 Apr 92 17:20:55 GMT
Organization: QQQCLC

In article <1992Apr14.054215.20104@unixg.ubc.ca> schultz@unixg.ubc.ca (Stewart Schultz) writes:
>The notion that pornography is degrading to women as a class is
>of course the hallmark contribution of Andrea Dworkin and Catherine
>MacKinnon to American culture.  Anyone thinking these two are
>mere popcorn farts in the winds of social change ought to consider
>their impact on Canadian freedom of expression.

	Now, now, Stewart, credit where credit is due. Canada has always
been more inclined to censorship than the US, and Dworkin and MacKinnon's
proposals may well have been based on a Canadian model in the first place.

	Canada, you see, has long had anti-hate-speech laws, and these
provided the legal fulcrum on which the sexual censorship gets its
leverage: the notion that it's possible to slander large and vaguely
defined groups of people like Jews, blacks or women. To a lawyer, it's
all the same. The camel's nose has been in Canada's tent a long time.

						Kayembee
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.women,talk.abortion
From: rawdon@cabrales.cs.wisc.edu (Michael Rawdon)
Subject: Re: pro-choice == pro-(womens' only) choice?
Reply-To: rawdon@cabrales.cs.wisc.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Dept., Madison, WI
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 18:57:15 GMT

In <1992Apr06.160847.22990@sdd.hp.com> regard@hpsdde.sdd.hp.com (Adrienne Regard) writes:
>It's really quite simple.  BOTH people have responsibility for things that
>our society has determined BOTH people to have responsibility for -- for
>example, cohabitation in common-law states, assets in community property
>states, children in all states.

>SINGLE persons have responsibility for single things that our society
>has determined single people shall have responsibility for -- for example,
>EACH person's own body.  EACH person's own actions.  EACH person's own
>thoughts, etc.

All of which completely and totally misses the point.  This is EXACTLY the
same as saying "Women have a responsibility not to do those things that our
society has determined that they have a responsibility not to do."  Such
a list may very well include abortion in the near future.

We're not (well, some of us aren't) discussing what IS here; we're discussing
what we think SHOULD BE.

My interpretation of your statements above is that responsibility is
something which is forced upon a person against his will.  Yes?  No?

-- 
Michael Rawdon
rawdon@cabrales.cs.wisc.edu
University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Department, Madison, WI

"I am a cat, and I keep my own counsel."
					- "A Dream Of A Thousand Cats"
Newsgroups: soc.men
From: TRINGHAM@usmv01.usm.uni-muenchen.de (Tringham, Neal)
Subject: Re: Smelling The Roses
Organization: University Observatory Munich, FRG 
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 15:42:38 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <2681@unisql.UUCP> wrat@unisql.UUCP writes:

> 	I'm actually sorta confused, though...  This all started out with
> "Your company should pay for women to take a year or so off to have babies
> because they deserve it", and my pointing out that a place like Unisql
> *can't* pay salaries to people who aren't producing - we don't have that
> kind of cushion yet - then moved to a bunch of pissing and moaning about how
> companies should support Family and Apple Pie and all that stuff even if it 
> means they go out of business because Family and Apple Pie and all that stuff
> is what's **really** important anyway and ended up with a bunch of sour grapes

At the risk of repeating myself yet again... I agree with everything you've
said about companies. So surely child support is an obvious candidate for
a state-provided benefit? Unless, of course, you are unwilling to see
your taxes blown on such a pointless enterprise...

Neal Tringham
From: cnh5730@maraba.tamu.edu (Charles Herrick)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Oh no, We're back to "What is Pornography?" again (was: SNUFF FILMS sighted in TIME MAGAZINE!!! (Dworkin and MacKinnon, too)
Date: 15 Apr 92 21:12:34 GMT

In article <STEINAR.92Apr14194103@otello.solan.unit.no>  
steinar@otello.solan.unit.no (Cindy Kandolf) writes:

Charles Herrick writes:
 >What about all the pornography where the women are obviously  
enjoying
$ >themselves?
$ >Or do the feminist really want to imply that all females, like  
them,
$ >are sexually disfunctional and unable to enjoy healthy sex?
 
$ There is, i think, an obvious difference between soft-core porn, in  
which
$ all parties involved are (or for the sake of the picture pretending  
to be)
$ enjoying themselves, and hard-core porn, where violence is involved  
and
$ not all involved are (seem to be) enjoying themselves.


The canonical definition of soft-core porn is that which shows no  
penetration, while the canonical definition of hard-core porn is that  
which shows penetration.

Note that no mention is made of violence one way or the other.

It is patently obvious that the feminazis would like to ensure that  
every erotical picture whose contents contain a woman, even the  
traditional "tool calendar," be banned from open public access and  
display.

Cindy Kandolf complains about equating to feminists with nazis. I  
have no problem whatsoever with this at all.

Personally I don't care what you do in Norway (I'm sure the men over  
there will react suitably when you come around with your cans of  
gasoline and matches and start demanding they let you burn whatever  
you happen to be calling "pornography" at the time) but damned if the  
RadFems are going to burn any of my books, including the ones with  
pictures.
From: kurts@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Kurt Strain)
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 16:24:51 GMT
Subject: Re: SIDS as population control?!?!
Organization: Milky Way Galaxy
Newsgroups: soc.men

In soc.men, deja-q@access.digex.com (Lin Yon Q) writes:


>   Yeah, RIGHT!  The US has no problem at all.  Ever tried to drive the DC
>   beltway?  Naw, there's no overpopulation here! 

And the world is infinite, too.
Newsgroups: soc.men
From: bhv@areaplg2.corp.mot.com (Bronis Vidugiris)
Subject: Re: Japanese Women's Lib 
Organization: Motorola, CCR&D, CORP, Schaumburg, IL
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 05:19:58 GMT

In article <1992Apr14.015028.591@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> ash@sumex-aim.stanford.edu (David Ash) writes:
)In article <ngxjk-=.sheaffer@netcom.com> sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
)
)>In any case, keep this in mind: the feminism we are so propagandized
)>by here is a PURELY American phenomenon. There are women who call
)>themselves "feminists" elsewhere, but the intensity
)>and degree of male-bashing we are accustomed to exists NOWHERE else.

)Feminism is just as strong in Canada if not more so.  Especially in the
)wake of the Marc Lepine shootings in Montreal.  In fact the NDP, the left
)wing party which really separates Canada from the U.S., has a policy of
)favoring women in selecting its candidates, and it has gained in power in
)recent years.  The NDP is therefore a powerful feminist force lacking any
)counterpart in the U.S.

Aside from Canada, the French feminists are active on purely theoretical
grounds.  Their ideas seem to me to be mostly unconnected to any sort
of measurable reality - of course, measurable 'reality' is really a male,
patriarchial idea, and not to be compared with the True Light of 'Feminist
Science' which is beyond such male concepts as 'measurability' and
'testability' (but is still somehow 'science'.  :-) (??).
From: baba@samadhi.Tymnet.COM (Duane Hentrich)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Re: The Gender Lie
Date: 9 Apr 92 21:51:21 GMT
Organization: BT North America (Tymnet)

From my point of view (son, father, brother, friend, voter, philosopher),
homosexuality is a non-issue.

-- 
d'baba Duane M. Hentrich	...!hplabs!oliveb!tymix!baba
                                         baba@Tymnet.Com
Warning: Expicit Thoughts
From: cnh5730@maraba.tamu.edu (Charles Herrick)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Mixed Couples -= racism lives =- (was: Older men and younger women (advice needed)
Date: 9 Apr 92 17:03:35 GMT

Janet M. Lafler writes
> Some types of relationships (e.g. gay
> or lesbian relationships, interracial relationships, relationships in  
which
> there's a big age difference) are not socially approved, and you can get  
real
> flak about this - sometimes from total strangers.  


This is very true. For a while I was dating a Korean female (actually, I  
never date American females anymore, but that's another story :-), and I  
never ceased to be amazed at how puposefully-rude people were willing to  
be. 

Especially American females, who would when walking by, refuse to make  
room on the sidewalk, or waitresses in restaurants who would give bad  
service.

I had a Chinese girlfriend for a while and noticed the same thing.


Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.women,alt.flame,alt.fan.q
From: hrose@eff.org (Helen Trillian Rose)
Subject: Re: Q the fake
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
	<1992Apr14.002615.16530@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 00:50:10 GMT

 Mikeey> == Mikeey J. Lin <mjln_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu> 

 Mikeey> 	I would like to see this "Q" character in person.
 Mikeey> Hmmm... I wonder what size shovel he's using?

I'm curious to know why so many people believe "Q" is a male. Is it
because Q has a similar posting style to many of the male.bozos on
soc.women, or just because of gender bias?

Think over carefully before answering....

--Helen
--
Helen Trillian Rose             	email eff@eff.org for EFF info
Electronic Frontier Foundation   	irc operators: operlist@eff.org
Systems and Networks Administration	Flames to: 
<hrose@eff.org, hrose@cs.bu.edu>	women-not-to-be-messed-with@eff.org
Xref: sparky soc.men:8333 soc.women:8865 talk.abortion:14681
From: annan@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.women,talk.abortion
Subject: Re: pro-choice == pro-(womens' only) choice?
Date: 11 Apr 92 17:23:17 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAXcluster

Lots of stuff has been written here about whether men should have any rights
over the unborn child to go with their unavoidable legal responsibilities,
basically noting that they don't. Well, a story that might interest you....

In Oxford, a few years ago, a female student got pregnant. She wanted an
abortion, her boyfriend did not because of his christian beliefs (mind you, if
he was really a christian, what was he doing sleeping with her anyway? But
that's not the point). He went to court to try to prevent the abortion. He
lost. Fair?

-- 
James Annan.
           [--------------------------------------]
           [  "The only good Tory is a lavatory"  ]
           [--------------------------------------]
From: bhv@areaplg2.corp.mot.com (Bronis Vidugiris)
Subject: Re: Maternity Leave and Child Benefits
Organization: Motorola, CCR&D, CORP, Schaumburg, IL
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 16:44:25 GMT

In article <1992Apr3.184034.22749@news.lrz-muenchen.de> TRINGHAM@usmv01.usm.uni-muenchen.de (Tringham, Neal) writes:
)Apr2.222008.6898@lmpsbbs.mot.com>
)Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1992 18:40:34 GMT
)X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20
)Lines: 33
)
)In <1992Apr2.222008.6898@lmpsbbs.mot.com> bhv@areaplg2.corp.mot.com writes:
)
)> In article <1992Mar31.175844.21243@news.lrz-muenchen.de> TRINGHAM@usmv01.usm.uni-muenchen.de () writes:
)> 
)> 
)> )What does `really can't afford them' mean in this context? In a mixed 
)> )economy (and we ALL live in a mixed economy) no-one gets an absolute, 
)> )`real' wage which reflects their value in a completely unambiguous way. IMHO,
)> )naturally... 
)> 
)> IMO, what this reflects is that even a small number of people cranking out
)> 1 child per year can overwhelm any sort of support system, given enough
)> time.  The keyword is 'exponential growth'.

)But that doesn't happen. There are lots of places that have systems like this,
)and (as Celia Winkler pointed out), many of them have population growth
)rates below replacement. Of the ones that have rates above replacement, 
)there is no evidence that their populations are growing exponentially. The 
)usual tendency is for the birth rate to fall. 
)
)I don't even think it's that hard to guess that that won't happen.
)How many women really enjoy being continuously pregnant and
)having to take care of twenty kids for at least part of the time? Even if
)they get enough money so that they don't have to work to support them?
)Assuming (for the purposes of argument) that there are some, in order for
)us to see truly exponential growth that overwhelmed the system most of those 
)children would have to have
)lots of kids and never work themselves. I find this hard to believe, and it
)isn't borne out by any social studies I've ever seen. Honest. 

It seems to be happening in third world countries.  One poster points out
that maybe low (or at least reasonable)  birthrate causes prosperity,
rather than the prosperity causing the low birth rates.  I still feel that
there may be a problem here.  Also, bribing people not to have kids just
doesn't seem 'right'.  The idea of some minimum level of social support for
everyone does have some attractions, but I'm really curious as to
how Sweden makes it work - and has a higher average standard of living
than the US to boot.  Is it more productivity?  A lack of defense and
'Foreign Aid' spending?  A less skewed distribution of wealth?  What?
From: jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Women for Nerdy White Males?
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:50:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: netlink.Ry2BJB1w164w
Organization: NetLink Online Communications, San Diego CA

For all you nerdy white males out there, here are some services
that might be of interest (advertised in a southern californian 
 "singles" tabloid -- can't vouch for these folks):
 
 
Meet ladies from the orient for love, romance, marriage.
$2 brings photos and information.  
The Friendship Office
Box 5248
STN. "A" 
Calgary, Alberta, CAN
T2H1X6
 
Traditional oriental wives.  Successful marriages since
1984.  "Hi!  I'm Victoria Elkington, co-owner of 
"The Asian Experience".  If you are interested in 
corresponding with marriage minded ladies overseas
please write or call me."
Box 1214NJ
NOVATO, CA 94948
PH 415/897-2742
 
Unspoiled feminine lovely latin ladies seek men of all ages
for friendship and marriage.  
InterAmerican Club 
2726 Shelter Island Drive
San Diego, CA 92106
PH: 619/482-8544 anytime day or night.
 
Exotic Pacific Island Ladies seek correspondence.  The
most desirable and loving ladies live in the Pacific Islands
and they are waiting to hear from YOU.  For free details
and photo brochure contact Pacific Island Connection
PO box 461873
LA CA 90046
PH 213/650-1994
 
Asian women desire romance.  Overseas sincere attractive.
World's number 1 service.  Free details and photos.
Sunshine International Correspondence
Box 5500-EW
Kailua-Kona, HI 96745
PH 808/325-7707
 
Meet women worldwide.  Free 32 page photocatalogue from 
america's most respected correspondence service since 1974.
Cherry Blossoms
190SS 
Rainbow Ridge, Kapaau, HI 96755
PH 808/961-2114
 
Japanese women and other attractive ladies in asia are 
seeking friendship and marriage with american men.
Write or call for free details and photo brochure.
The Pacific Century Club
110 Pacific Av.
#208-ER
San Francisco, CA 94111
816/942-1668
 
Attractive Oriental Ladies seek marriage minded men.
Learn more about these loyal asian beauties.  We have
the best information package available for complete
introduction and immigration service since 1984.
Life-Mates
PO Box 56953
Phoenix, AZ 85079
Free information 602/973-9676
 
Meet oriental ladies!  Free color brochure.  Over 250 listings.
Chinese, Philipina, malaysian, and other faithful marriage-
minded sicnere beautiful (overseas) ladies.
Double-Happiness
Correspondence SErvice
PO Box 2347-LAD
Melborne, FL 32902
PH 407/728-2642
 
 
A couple of interesting observations:
 
1)  A similar ads section in the "National Review" had mostly
"educated professional women" from the Philippines, Europe
and Russia, whereas the above ads are almost all from asia.
 
2)  Most of the horror stories I've heard about "mail-order
brides" has involved the types advertised in the "National Review".
 
3)  Most of the romance stories I've heard about "mail-order
brides" has involved the types advertised in the above ads.

--                    
INTERNET:  jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery)
UUCP:   ...!nosc!ryptyde!netlink!jim
NetLink Online Communications * Public Access in San Diego, CA (619) 435-6181
From: gazit@duke.cs.duke.edu (Hillel Gazit)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Re: Japanese Women's Lib
Date: 5 Apr 92 04:51:59 GMT
Reply-To: gazit@cs.duke.edu (Hillel)
Organization: Nefolet shel nemushot (Fallout of Wimps)

In article <HaqqiB1w164w@netlink.cts.com> jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery) writes:
>How and why do American males feel about the increasing liberation 
                         ^^^^^
>of Japanese women?
             ^^^^^

Would you mind to repeat the question using non-Politically-Correct terms?
From: stricher@masig3.ocean.fsu.edu (Char Aznabul)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Re: Companies can afford it, right?
Date: 8 Apr 92 23:32:57 GMT
Distribution: na

Wes Kranitz 4-6857 MRCE writes

+ With as many people here as those that express those feelings, there won't be
+ any shortage of slave labor.

Wes [and others out there experssing similar opinions]

Please can it. Wharfie and the rest of us are big folx, and we can take
care of ourselves. Don't try telling us how to live our lives. You object
vocficerously when someone does that to you. Please try to be consistent.

K'Char
Xref: sparky soc.men:8452 soc.women:8969
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.women
Subject: Re: pro-choice == pro-(womens' only) choice?
From: rivero@mdcbbs.com
Date: 14 Apr 92 09:55:51 GMT
Organization: M&E (Division of EDS), Cypress CA
Nntp-Posting-User: mdhc

In article <1992Apr11.182317.5404@vax.oxford.ac.uk>, annan@vax.oxford.ac.uk writes:
> Lots of stuff has been written here about whether men should have any rights
> over the unborn child to go with their unavoidable legal responsibilities,
> basically noting that they don't. Well, a story that might interest you....
> 
> In Oxford, a few years ago, a female student got pregnant. She wanted an
> abortion, her boyfriend did not because of his christian beliefs (mind you, if
> he was really a christian, what was he doing sleeping with her anyway? But
> that's not the point). He went to court to try to prevent the abortion. He
> lost. Fair?
> 
> -- 

  We're missing a couple pieces. Were they married or intending to get married?
Did they decide, prior to sex, that they WANTED a child? If not, then
the case was fair, as he shouldn't force his morality on her through law.

  However, if they were married or engaged, and children were explictly part of
the arrangement, then his losing was NOT fair, as she should be bound by her
committments the same way that he is.



<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
|  Michael Rivero rivero@mdcbbs.com Homo Cyberneticus-Computational Man  |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Newsgroups: soc.men
From: kranitz@mr.med.ge.com (Wes Kranitz 4-6857 MRCE)
Subject: Re: Companies can afford it, right?
Organization: GE Medical Systems
	<8124@sun13.scri.fsu.edu>
Distribution: na
Date: 9 Apr 92 11:26:53

Char,

I suppose your right. To that end, "Listen up everyone. Do what the hell you
want to!!!!". That's fine with me. We're just trying to point out that unless
you own the company, your really nothing more than a means to an end. If you
see me around in 20 years, let me know if you have the same opinion as you do
now!!!!

The following general comment is directed to everyone:

And one more thing. I really find the lack of compasion expressed by many of
the people here in this group appalling. Especially when it comes to the
health and welfare of employee's. <sarcasm> Is that why we have some companies
making record profits and cutting employees bennefits at the same time??? I pity
your employees if any of you ever own a business. I suppose you all will be like
the owner of one company I worked for: "The client is expecting you tomorrow for
that week of discussion. Your father on his death bed is not important enought
to cancel it. And neither would his funeral be. If you don't go, your fired".
I only lived an hour away. He died and was cremated while I was away. And what
did the owner say when I got back???? "I own this company and all I'm concerned
about is you stay on schedule and be a team player. Your thanks for doing a good
job is that you get to keep your job". How many of you have the same feeling????
A lot, I bet. Based on what I've heard here. Too bad. People are a companies
greatest asset. Most businesses haven't learned that yet!

Wes
From: TRINGHAM@usmv01.usm.uni-muenchen.de (Tringham, Neal)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Re: Maternity Leave and Child Benefits
Date: 11 Apr 92 15:31:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.1992Apr11.153130.4618
Organization: University Observatory Munich, FRG
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <6573@skye.ed.ac.uk> ken@aiai.ed.ac.uk writes:

> 
> In article <1992Apr6.193638.8243@news.lrz-muenchen.de>
> TRINGHAM@usmv01.usm.uni-muenchen.de (Tringham, Neal) writes:
> 
> >as far as I know no British government has EVER cut the (real) amount
> >of money devoted to the NHS. It usually goes up, under both Tory and Labour
> >governments. 
> 
> 
> Harold Wilson (Labour) cut the hospital construction budget in 1968 [??]
> See `Britain in balance' by W A P Manser (Penguin) for more about this. 
> 

Did he cut the NHS budget as a whole, though? I think hospital budgets have 
fallen in real terms at times in the last thirteen years, but the overall
NHS budget has increased.

Um, having got this far, it occurs to me that if you want to reply it had
better be either by email or in talk.politics...

Neal Tringham
From: stricher@masig3.ocean.fsu.edu (Char Aznabul)
Newsgroups: soc.men
Subject: Re: pro-choice == pro-(womens' only) choice?
Date: 9 Apr 92 11:49:45 GMT
Distribution: na

Beverly Huntsberger writes
+ In <1992Apr8.012627.16082@ucsu.Colorado.EDU> lundquis@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (Jill  
Lundquist) writes:
+ 
+ 
+ >I am not a lawyer, but the idea that a man could renounce all
+ >rights and responsibilities toward a fetus or child for the
+ >same period of time that a woman is allowed to abort in that
+ >state seems a quite reasonable solution to me.  Please note
+ 
+ 	I get queasy over the linking of these rights.
+ 

+ 	We CAN change the laws, but we have to get
+ 	there. In the meanwhile, nothing is more
+ 	important to me, than to do whatever I can
+ 	to insure that those FEW white men who have
+ 	the power to change the laws that govern
+ 	ALL OF US will keep the government out of
+ 	my body. This is what is important because
+ 	it is so endangered and those of us being
+ 	affected are so disenfranchised.

Hang together or hang seperately. The choice is of course yours to make.
But no rights exsist in a void, and they are all interlinked. 

K'Char
Xref: sparky soc.men:8454 soc.women:8972