HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jmc@huron.eel.ufl.edu (Jim Callahan)
Subject: Re: architecture is not art (!)
Organization: University of Florida
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 92 09:33:53 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.210459.9894@viewlogic.com>, brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg) writes:
|> 
|> In Webster's:
|> 
|> 1. The art or science of building; specif: the art or practice of    |> designing and building structures and esp. habitable ones 
|> 2. formation or construction as or as if as the result of concious act
|> 
|> This does not specify the application of the creative imagination (in 
|> this sense "art" is defined as the application of "skill") but 
|> neither is it ruled out.
|> 

(stuff removed -- see original)

|> Architecture does not have to be art, but it can be. To me, it should |> be. When art is left out of it, it becomes boring, it becomes       |> oppressive.  When there is no art, there is no delight. Since any   |> architect worthy of the moniker subscribes to the credo "firmness,    |> commodity, delight", all good architecture has to be art, IMAO (in my |> arrogant opinion). :-) 
|> 

Doesn't sound arrogant to me -- sounds like REASON.  Those who would remove creativity and "delight" in architecture should be doomed to live in a concrete block cube with white walls...

-- 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Jim Callahan                             Email: jmc@sioux.eel.ufl.edu |
| Student/Developer                        Phone: (904) 377 - 9023      |
| University of Florida                                                 |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: haynes@cats.ucsc.edu (Jim Haynes)
Newsgroups: alt.architecture
Subject: Re: On meaning and Ornament
Date: 5 Nov 1992 22:16:05 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: hobbes.ucsc.edu


In article <8eyKgHq00WBNQ3kpxe@andrew.cmu.edu> Paul M Mcelwee <pm3w+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>-- It would seem then that there is much less money to be made by
>carving ornate Corinthian capitals then in creating 5000 s.f. of flex
>office space...

Not to disagree, but there is an impression I get that in the peak of the
Art Deco skyscraper period there was sort of an attitude that the buildings
were temples of a secular religion of commerce, so the decor was
important to the concept.  And today there's the 5000 s.f. of flex
office space for the back office of some company; but for the office
the public sees they want it to be impressive, opulent.
-- 
haynes@cats.ucsc.edu
haynes@cats.bitnet

"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was!"
"No it aint!  But ya gotta know the territory!"
        Meredith Willson: "The Music Man"

Newsgroups: alt.architecture
From: mcgonig@eeserv.ee.umanitoba.ca (Gordon McGonigal)
Subject: Re: architecture is not art (!)
Organization: Dept. of Elect. & Comp. Engineering, U of Manitoba
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 22:56:13 GMT

brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg) writes:
>Not far away from there, you can look at the Guggenheim Museum, designed
>specifically to house what is unabashedly billed as ART. But it is not 
>limited to science and practice. The Guggenheim clearly is a work of art 
>itself. Whether you call it good art is another question, but I don't 
>believe anyone could have designed such a shape or space without employing 
>the creative imagination. It is, rather than ornamented architecture, an 
>ornament itself, and yet it is architecture. Drawings were made, engineers 
>and contractors followed them, and we now have architecture which is also 
>art and ornament and the result of science and the creative imagination
>all at the same time.
How well are some of these FLW creations still functioning as buildings?
Sitting in my armchair, I heard a rumor that some of them are crumbling
due to unsound construction.  No doubt this happens when art is more
imperative than science (engineering and proper testing).
--
                                   * * *
Gord McGonigal                                  mcgonig@eeserv.ee.UManitoba.ca
Dept. of Electrical & Computer Engineering
University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, CANADA (R3T 2N2)       phone: (204) 474-6295
From: thomat@vccsouth29.its.rpi.edu (Todd Michael Thomas)
Subject: architecture is not art? Phooey!
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 16:30:55 GMT

architecture is art ( infact, it is really and truly just sculpture with
big materials and tools and a large scale  =D =D =D), but aside from sheds,
quonoset huts, and pre-fab housing (not pre-fabrication but cookie-cutter
design) archtiure is design and imbibed creativity with a purpose and intent,
and regardless  of whether it is functional or not, or designed to be functional, it is STILL art!  As long as  passion and thought to CREATE an aesthetic,
functional, pleasing, or whatever space (modern architects while they may be
disaffecting ornament are still creating spaces with certain qualities) it IS
art!....           sorry for all the caps... touchy subject =D

todd thomas                =======
thomat@rpi.edu              @===@
                             | |
                             | |
                             | |
                             | |
                             | |
                             ===
                            =====     "Times may change, but design remains."

Newsgroups: alt.architecture
From: debaser@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Andy Ewing)
Subject: Re: architecture is not art (!)
Summary: Wright as an Engineer
Organization: Purdue University
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 03:58:50 GMT

In article <RANDOLPH.92Nov7165123@cognito.ebay.Sun.COM>, randolph@cognito.ebay.Sun.COM (Randolph Fritz) writes:
> Wright was a good engineer himself, as I believe a number of great
> architects have been.  His structures stand--the Imperial Hotel in
> Tokyo rode out an earthquake.  On the other hand, he had real problems
> dealing with climate--a lot of those flat roofs leak and the openness
> of the designs make them hard to climate control.
> 
> __Randolph Fritz  sun!cognito.ebay!randolph || randolph@ebay.sun.com

Hmmm, I'm not to sure about wright as a good engineer.  I think he was
a very intelligent man who learned what can be done and what can't be 
done over time.  A lot of his earlier houses and building had foundation
problems.  They usually settled too much.  And some of his ideas were 
not very feasible at the time.  For example, his studio in Oak Park 
contains iron chain supports instead on columns to support a gallery.
Today, the structure is not safe for a large load.  However, it is an 
interesting idea and today could probably be implemented with the 
improvement of materials.  Ah, I digress slightly, as an engineer, one 
should look at many facets of a structure i.e. analysis, cost,
servicablity, safety, and maybe not stressed
as much it should be, how it looks.  I believe, in his
early years Wright was not that well rounded.  He had the aesthetics sp?
down but he lacked refinement in the other skills.

Back to my original point, Wright developed to the point of knowing 
what would work (the Imperial Palace) and what wouldn't.  But if you
were to ask him why it worked, I'm not totally sure, you would recieve
a good answer.  

Not to Put Frank down, I like his archtecture ( I still like Victorian).
But I think he was a better architect than engineer.


Andy Ewing
debaser@sage.cc.purdue.edu
ewing@cn.ecn.purdue.edu

Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: scarrobi@shearson.com (Steve Carrobis)
Subject: Re: Help!!!!!!!!!
Reply-To: scarrobi@shearson.com
Organization: Lehman Brothers, Inc.
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 19:44:36 GMT

best thing to do is to get in touch with school book publisher houses and find out if they carry. that sort of book. sorry but thats the only thing i can think of. if i find out a definite i'll let ya know 

---
Steve C. 

 ==> A wise man once told me - There ARE NO Wise Men !
                             - Just fools who think they are.
---------------------------------------------------------------		
 I understand you need someone to do work.
 I don't do work, but, I know this guy who does.
    -Vladimir Taltos
---------------------------------------------------------------

   	


Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: thebo@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Michael Thebo)
Subject: Hankilunta (?sp)
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 08:58:48 GMT

I am searching for information and mythology related to a Finnish snow/winter
god named Hankilunta (? spelling) and would appreaciate any referances or
short blurbs that anyone could E-mail me (I don't ussually read alt.mythology)
my E-mail address is thebo@mentor.cc.purdue.edu
Thanx...

Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: scarrobi@shearson.com (Steve Carrobis)
Subject: Re: Who Was Homer
Reply-To: scarrobi@shearson.com
Organization: Lehman Brothers, Inc.
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 21:49:03 GMT

Homer was a fat slob who drank beer and was a numnut .. hehehe only kidding 
some people think HOMER was actually a group of people 
the 2 books appear to be written differently but how many writers can u name that change their style from time to time.
the answer this question is purely subjective. 
all answers are right. 
in my opinion.

---
Steve C. 

 ==> A wise man once told me - There ARE NO Wise Men !
                             - Just fools who think they are.
---------------------------------------------------------------		
 I understand you need someone to do work.
 I don't do work, but, I know this guy who does.
    -Vladimir Taltos
---------------------------------------------------------------

   	


Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: SMCMILLN@NUACVM.ACNS.NWU.EDU
Subject: Eshin-Fun
Organization: Northwestern University
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 14:25:38 GMT

This message was originally intended as e mail for Eshin-Fun, but it bounced
for some reason. Go figure.However, any help from anyone on this matter would
be greatly appreciated. I'm researching for an article on the history and
development of Voodou in New Orleans. Does anyone know of any source material
from actual practitioners. Most sources are from a decidedly ethnocentric
point of view. Does anyone know how I can get in touch with Luisah Teish. She
wrote a book called Jambablaya, and is a practitioner of Voodou in New Orleans.
Thanks in advance for any help. Send e mail to  smcmilln@nuacvm, or just post
on alt.mythology.
Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: scarrobi@shearson.com (Steve Carrobis)
Subject: Re: Marathon Runner's Name
Reply-To: scarrobi@shearson.com
Organization: Lehman Brothers, Inc.
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 21:45:41 GMT

speaking of runners my family name is that of an olympian runner .. 
CARROBIS .. i think its spelled with a K ... but unfortunately i dont know the history. my dad had a book with it but its since been lost for all eternity. kids used to make fun of me so he showed the name to me. 
made me feel so much better. if any one out there knows of what i speak and has documentation i would appreciate any feed back. 
since i and my brother (since my dads early demise) are the last of the line .. that we know of. he went to greece and found nada. but the family had migrated to naples 500plus years ago. so maybe all are in italy now.. 
thanx 

---
Steve C. 

 ==> A wise man once told me - There ARE NO Wise Men !
                             - Just fools who think they are.
---------------------------------------------------------------		
 I understand you need someone to do work.
 I don't do work, but, I know this guy who does.
    -Vladimir Taltos
---------------------------------------------------------------
From: karl_best@novell.com (Karl Best)
Newsgroups: alt.mythology
Subject: Re: Who Was Homer
Date: 9 Nov 92 14:45:38 GMT
Organization: Novell, Inc.

In article <BxD171.J4A@newcastle.ac.uk> unregistered@newcastle.ac.uk (R.P  
North) writes:
> 
>   Hiya, Classics-buffs! i am interested to your opinions on my favourite  
author  Homer. For instance, was Book XXIV of the superb "Odyssey", written by  
Homer?   Was Homer blind? 
>  Was Homer a woman? (Or a group of women?)
>  Was Homer a group of Dark Age poets living in a commune?
>  Were the "Iliad" and the "Odyssey" written by two different people?

I've always heard that the two books were not written by Homer but by another  
poet with the same name :-} (can't remember where I read this, but it has stuck  
with me for a long time). 

BTW, this wouldn't happen to be another of those class paper topics, would it?  
We seem to be getting a lot of those lately. Must have something to do with the  
time of year.

--
Karl Best                              Far away, across the field
Novell Tech Pubs           ...  __o    the tolling of the iron bell
Provo, Utah  801-429-3428 ..   -\<,    draws the faithful to their knees
kbest@doc.novell.com      ...(_)/(_).  to hear the softly spoken magic spell
karl_best@novell.com                      -Roger Waters, Pink Floyd
From: unregistered@newcastle.ac.uk (R.P North)
Newsgroups: alt.mythology
Subject: Who Was Homer
Keywords: HOMER
Date: 7 Nov 92 19:09:01 GMT
Organization: ST. AIDAN'S COLLEGE, DURHAM U.K. DH1 3LJ


  Hiya, Classics-buffs! i am interested to your opinions on my favourite author  Homer. For instance, was Book XXIV of the superb "Odyssey", written by Homer?   Was Homer blind? 
 Was Homer a woman? (Or a group of women?)
 Was Homer a group of Dark Age poets living in a commune?
 Were the "Iliad" and the "Odyssey" written by two different people?

        Any bright ideas or contributions welcome !
                     Yours,
                           Cytheria.xxxxx


               ( Who scurilously STEALS my terminal, deprives me of food
		 AND is really quite nice really )
From: 890707p@ace.acadiau.ca (GLENN G. PARSONS)
Newsgroups: alt.mythology
Subject: Prometheus - help???
Date: 7 Nov 92 15:07:17 GMT
Organization: Acadia University

I'm doing some research on the Promethean character, and am looking for 
depictions of the Promethean myth in literature or art, particularly in the 
Romantic Era of the Eighteenth - Nineteenth centuries.  I am aware of the 
original Heisod, and the Aeschylus, as well as Shelley's and Byron's works, 
but these are certainly the more famous ones.  Can anyone point out any 
others?  (Paintings etc... would be especially enlightening).
Also, any comments on the myth would be most welcome.  Just E mail me...
Thanks,
Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: evonne@ritcsh.csh.rit.edu (Evonne A. Austin)
Subject: inquiry
Originator: evonne@nick.csh.rit.edu
Organization: Computer Science House @ RIT
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 23:47:52 GMT


Newsgroups: alt.mythology
From: joann@unixhub.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Jo Ann Malina)
Subject: Re: Pagan and Jewish rituals
Keywords: Judaism, Paganism, rituals
Organization: Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 10:38:15 GMT

In article <1992Oct30.033216.21337@gmuvax2.gmu.edu> rlove@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Rebecca M. Love) writes:
>        I am writing a paper on the possible links between Jewish and
>Pagan rituals.  Similarities and possible origins of them.  Any book
>references or other such would be appreciated.

Which Pagans?  Jews were not always monotheists.  Try to get ahold of
a copy of "The Hebrew Goddess" by Rapahel Patai.  It goes in and out
of print but your library can probably help you.

*) *) *) *) *) *) *) *) *) *) *)!(* (* (* (* (* (* (* (* (* (* (* (* (*
Jo Ann Malina, Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
joann@unixhub.slac.stanford.edu  -or-  415/926-2846
Neither Stanford nor the DOE would be caught dead with these opinions.
Nor do they consult me when formulating theirs.
Newsgroups: alt.sect.ahmadiyya
From: rafiq@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (RAFIQ ANWAR)
Subject: Re: 15TH Century and Mujadid
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 19:58:25 GMT

ahussain@prism.poly.edu (Arshad Hussain) writes:

>In article <1992Nov3> rafiq@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (RAFIQ ANWAR) writes:
>>
>>Yes! You are right. The Mujadid for 15th century is 
>>Hazrat Mirza Tahir Ahmad
>>(Present head of the World-Wide Ahmadiyya Community in Islam)
>>
>   Good for you. Please do youself a favour. Tell this to Mian Sahib.
>   I think the poor soul doesn't know himself that he has been raised 
>   to this level by one of his followers.                 ^^^^^^^^^^^


Sir, you have been grossly mistakened. You are saying, I have raised
him to that level? He is even above that level. He is the Khalifa too!!
A Khalifa is a higher level than Mujadid. 


Regards;
ANWAR RAFIQ.
Newsgroups: alt.sect.ahmadiyya
From: ahussain@prism.poly.edu (Arshad Hussain)
Subject: Re: 15TH Century and Mujadid
Organization: Polytechnic University, New York
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 92 17:31:39 GMT

In article <1992Nov7.> rafiq@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (RAFIQ ANWAR) writes:
>
>A Khalifa is a higher level than Mujadid. 
>

You must be joking!!!
Khalafat has no Islamic base whatsoever. Same with Imaamat.
Abu-Bakar(Allah please with him) was Khalifa-tur-Rasul.
That's why Umar liked the title 'Ameer al-Mo'meneen' over 'Khalifa Khalifa-tur-
Rasul'.  'Khalafat-e-Rashda' is the title given to ruling period of 
Abu-Bakar thru Ali by muslim historians not by Allah. 
I know an ahmadi friend who only believes in  2-1/2 khalafat-e-Rashda.
Allah sends Mujadids. People ELECT khalifas or Ameers. 

>

Arshad Hussain
Newsgroups: alt.licker.store,rec.sport.basketball.college
From: oday@lobster.gsfc.nasa.gov  (Orin Day)
Subject: Re: Polls, polls, polls
Followup-To: alt.licker.store
Reply-To: oday@lobster.gsfc.nasa.gov  (Orin Day)
Organization: Goddard Space Flight Center
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:19:57 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.071044.15485@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu>  
franklir@helium.gas.uug.arizona.edu (Ryan J Franklin ) writes:

> (See, you're even getting ME to use capital letters and exclamation points.
> What a revolting development.  Sort of like Sun City, I guess.)

Aarrgh, the UMASS!!! disease has spread... 

--
************* "How about a little fire, Scarecrow?" **************
Orin Day, Code 664.1                    oday@lobster.gsfc.nasa.gov
Hughes STX/NASA       GSFC Laboratory for High Energy Astrophysics
*******"Think that this is NASA's opinion?   NO, NO, NO!!!" ******
From: VETTERS@vax1.elon.edu (Steve Vetter  )
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Subject: Help me People
Date: 10 Nov 1992 22:17:07 GMT
Organization: Elon College
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: vax1.elon.edu
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.22

I am sort of new to the net and I am constantly hearing about Bob.
I posted to alt.newbie and asked and they refferred me to alt.slack.
Now I am even more confused than before.  Please define the following 
terms:

1.  Bob
2.  the "slack" in alt.slack
3.  Subgenius
4.  frop
5.  some other word that starts with f 

A few other questions:
1.  It seems to me that this is some type of organized religeon.  Am I correct?
2.  If yes to the above, it Bob your "God"
3.  Someone told me of a book called "Two-Fisted tales of Bob" or something,
    is this like your "bible"  (assuming the answers to 1 and 2 are yes)

thanks
please email me the answers to 
vetters@vax1.elon.edu

also please forgive me for being so ignorant, we were all new to the net
sometime....

Steve

--------------------------------------+-----------------------------------------
Steve Vetter                          |  "When I get big, I'm gonna get
Elon College Computer Consultant      |   an electric guitar,              
The Metropolis of Elon College, NC    |   When I get real big..."              
vetters@vax1.elon.edu                 |        --Neil Young  (Live Rust)
I may very well be getting minimum wage to type this!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ajd@oit.itd.umich.edu (Arthur Delano)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Subject: Re: Help me People
Date: 13 Nov 1992 17:25:36 GMT
Organization: finchhaus
NNTP-Posting-Host: helen.oit.itd.umich.edu

VETTERS@vax1.elon.edu (Steve Vetter  ) writes:
] Please define the following terms:
] 
] 1.  Bob

   A bunch of dots.  Just a bunch of dots.  NOTHING MORE!

] 2.  the "slack" in alt.slack

   Pants.

] 3.  Subgenius

   MENSA wanna-be.

] 4.  frop

   A grey overcoat with wide lapels, made from a heavy
   flannel fabric.

] 5.  some other word that starts with f 

   Finch.  Nature's most perfect bird.

] A few other questions:
] 1.  It seems to me that this is some type of organized religeon.  Am I correc

   No.

] 2.  If yes to the above, it Bob your "God"

   Like i said, 'Bob' is just A BUNCH OF DOTS.  It
   means nothing, and has no value.  There are some
   folk who worship it, but then again people worship 
   spam, parlsey, brown stains on the wall, pizza,
   beer, tortillas with the face of Jesus burnt onto
   them, chaos, physics, money, women, and pretty much
   anything and anybody else.  Start a religion, have
   the believers worship the most absurd thing you can
   find, and you'll understand what i mean.

] 3.  Someone told me of a book called "Two-Fisted tales of Bob" or something,
]     is this like your "bible"  (assuming the answers to 1 and 2 are yes)

   It is probably somebody's bible, but it is not the 
   bible of anybody i want to know personally.

] also please forgive me for being so ignorant, we were all new to the net
] sometime....

   So true.

AjD
who never takes
advantage of anybody
-- 
                       ajd@oit.itd.umich.edu
'i have had my ups and downs but wotthehell wotthehell' -- mehitabel
Newsgroups: alt.slack
From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Subject: Re: Ways to annoy the entire Net
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 19:31:37 GMT

In article <17249@mindlink.bc.ca> Jeremy_Reimer@mindlink.bc.ca (Jeremy Reimer) writes:
>TOP TEN WAYS TO ANNOY EVERYONE ON THE NET
>
>10) Start a new cascade on alt.slack
>9) Ask the folk on alt.fan.douglas.adams if they knew that 6x9=42 (base 13)
>8) Start a discussion on the merits of piracy in comp.sys.ibm.pc.games
>7) Post the entire text of _Just The Words_ in alt.fan.monty-python
>6) Say something actually interesting on alt.fan.monty-python
>5) Crosspost everything to alt.ensign.wesley.die.die.die
>4) Ask "what's a FAQ?".  Crosspost to every newsgroup on the net.
>3) Quote a 20-page posted article entirely.  Add your one-sentence comment.
>2) Post a 20-page flame.  Leave out the actual reasons for your flaming.
>
>
>AND THE NUMBER ONE WAY TO ANNOY EVERYONE ON THE NET IS....
>
>1) Create a funky 156-line .signature file!
>
>

Jeremy, you forgot some good ones...

*	Post N-man to alt.slack
*	Post to alt.music.alternative explaining why REM isn't alternative
*	Post to alt.music.alternative explaining why REM is alternative
*	Cross-post articles from alt.evil and alt.slack to *.religion.*
*	Begin all your posts with, "This is probably in the FAQ, BUT..."
*	Refer to newsgroups as 'boards'
*	Cross-post an idiotic, flame-bait article all across the net
	with 'misc.test' in the Followups-to line 
*	Cross-post an article asking how to use rn 7 times in a row
	to the entire alt hierarchy
*	'accidently' post your .newsrc
*	Many terminals have special control characters to change 
	the terminal params on the fly.  Learn them.	<-- (nasty)

Ahh, the list goes on and on...
		

-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey						howard@netcom.com
		         Its in my brain now
_________/\______/\_____/\___/\__/\_/\/\/\/\................................