From: seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Subject: Re: A question on aging.
Date: 13 Dec 92 14:31:16 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh
Originator: seawasp@unixd1.cis.pitt.edu

In article <78214@hydra.gatech.EDU> ccoprdj@prism.gatech.EDU (Jorge Diaz) writes:
>In article <579@blue.cis.pitt.edu> seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:
>>	Demons are part of a race... But you just agreed that they don't 
>>die.

>Are they?  I've never considered demons a race.  They're beings, but
>I don't consider them a race.

	Depends on your demons, I guess. Mine certainly are. The ones in
the Shannara series (Elfstones of Shannara) seemed to be. There are other
examples in the literature.

	Suppose it depends on what you call a "race". My definition:
a group of beings capable of reproduction of others of their kind.
(Yes, intelligent robots with factories of their own qualify).

>According to the histories, they were born, correct.  But I've never
>understood that.  They're born.  Then, suddenly, one day, they'll stop
>aging.  Why?  What determines what they will look like when they stop?  How
>long until they stop?  Why do they stop aging suddenly, when they've been
>aging for years.  Didn't make any sense to me.

	Huh? Does it make sense that you stop growing one day? Come on.
They stop aging at MATURITY, at the point at which they have reached their
full development. This is something that even biological systems, unenhanced
by magic, can sense. Magical ones, like gods, can do even more complex things,
like stop aging on individual parts of you when they are at their peak (none
of this BS that us humans go through, where our brains peak at 18, male
sex drive at 16-20, female sex drive at 30, male muscular development at
30, etc...), and of course a god can CHANGE their appearances to suit that
which they see in themselves.

  Made more sense if they
>were "born" that age.  Which of course precludes birth in a "normal" sense.

	It was made pretty clear in the Greek myths that this was NOT the
normal  way for deities to be born (Athena was considered quite noteworthy
in that she was born  by springing, full grown and in armor, from her father
Zeus' forehead). The Norse, as well, had children who grew to maturity and
stopped.

	I don't see anything ridiculous in this. How do we know when to
reach puberty? How does the body stop growing at 17-21? and so on. Add
in magic, and how can you gripe about it?

>Like demons.  What's a demon?  A damned "soul"?  He's never born.  He's
>just there one day.  No birth to speak of.

	As I said above, depends on your demons. In many stories, the demons
are NOT the souls of the damned. The truly evil MAY become demons (be
transformed), but Demons are a race unto themselves. 
	(I use the term Demon and Devil pretty interchangeably; some
people do the same, others draw a sharp distinction.)

>>(note that I use "immortal" to mean "does not die without help", not
>>"indestructible".)

>Yes, I mean the same thing.  Even elves can be destroyed.  ;-)

	Elves get killed just as often as any other race. Sure, they have
advantages, but they have disadvantages too. If I'm going up against a
monster (like the classic AD&D Ghost) whose main attack is aging, damn
right I want to be an Elf! On the other hand, I sure don't want to be
an elf when the opposition has Ethril weapons (black mithril), or
Tolkienian Orcs (loathe elves, no chance of talking your way out),
and so on...

				Sea Wasp
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd