HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sjk@kepler.unh.edu (Stephen J Kenny)
Subject: Re: Private space ventures
Organization: University of New Hampshire  -  Durham, NH
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 15:29:18 GMT

>
>Come on get real...there are MUCH larger problems that need solving 
>on this planet before trying to get peoples private wealth for space 
>purposes..
>
WHAT?? Did I miss something here?
I see nothing at all wrong with cultivating and/or harvesting
private peoples' wealth for space development, exploration
etc. Considering the APPALLING state of the funding game
in D.C., it's amazing NASA gets anything done at all.
My god, we could even make NASA a tax shelter...just think
of the revenue generated from corporations alone.

Furthermore, you are correct in sayng there will always be 
problems "on this planet". But when in the entire course od
history have we, as a race, EVER  tidied up our yards before
trashing our neighbors. Human history is replete with such
examples.

Space for space sake is fine by the way. Curiosity and
the subsequent search for knowledge are more than justification
for investigating....
-------------------------------------------------------------
"Away..we go...so fast...."  | sjk@kepler.unh.edu     
        	- Autosexual | s_kenny@unhh.unh.edu      
	       Be Bop Deluxe | Stephen J. Kenny   
-------------------------------------------------------------



Newsgroups: sci.space,talk.politics.space
From: aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer)
Subject: Re: Soyuz as ACRV
Followup-To: talk.politics.space
Organization: Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 17:44:44 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.134030.8206@ke4zv.uucp> gary@ke4zv.UUCP (Gary Coffman) writes:

>Yeah but I'd rather have an operational space transporter than higher
>VA benefits.

That's not the choice. Gary, your model of the political process and
budget allocation just isn't correct. We DO have some clout. We have
enough clout to get about $15B per year for NASA. NASA is a popular
agency within the government and if savings where found, most if not
all would be allocated back to NASA.

If space opponents where as powerful as you say, then Freedom would
have been killed long ago. Traxler would have been successufl in
killing it instead of going down to an embarasing defeat.

Even if you where correct, we would still be better off with the
money in VA since the alternative makes the space market far larger
(enough to pay for HLV development and almost double the number of
MLV launches) and cheaper. This encourages greater activity which is
now stifled by a space program (and supporters) who don't consider
cost an important factor.

  Allen

PS. Note followups.
-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Allen W. Sherzer | "If they can put a man on the Moon, why can't they     |
|  aws@iti.org     |  put a man on the Moon?"                               |
+----------------------246 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
From: roelle@uars_mag.jhuapl.edu (Curtis Roelle)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Re: Capsule location list (at last!)
Date: 13 Aug 92 21:33:08 GMT
Organization: Johns Hopkins University

matulka@convex.com (Jerry Matulka) writes:

>In article <1992Aug11.173251.12960@mcs.drexel.edu> gcmastra@mcs.drexel.edu (Chris Mastrangelo) writes:
>>In 1988-89 I visited the campus of the University of Nebraska in
>>Lincoln and was surprised to find a genuine Apollo capsule sitting
>>on display outside the Nebraska State Museum of Natural History
>>not far from the Cornhusker's football stadium. I think it had
>>been there at least since 1985 because it was outside exposed to the
>>elements which had taken their toll on the white paint which was
>>flaking off in places where the clear plastic was not protecting
>>the exterior. (The plastic was mostly around the heat shield area
>>through which you could see the effects of reentry.)
>>
>>Unfortunately I don't recall which Apollo number it was, but it
>>could have been Apollo 14, which evidently didn't make it to
>>Rockwell, or was donated to UNL after 1985.
>>
>>Can anyone else confirm or deny this??
>>
>>- Chris Mastrangelo
>>                                                      

>It is definitely not Apollo 14's Kittyhawk.  The command module that was
>at the University of Nebraska was from an unmanned flight of some sort.  It
>has been (I assume it's still there) at UNL for a considerable amount of time
>before 1985.  I think it's been there since about 1975 actually.  I think the
>reason that it wound up sitting outside was that it wouldn't fit through the
>doors of the museum, and they didn't want to or didn't have the funds to make
>a larger doorway.  Sad but true.  I'm sorry that I don't remember the exact
>lineage of this craft, but I don't think the newspapers back in 1975 even had
>it straight.  This command module not only was involved in a flight, but they
>conducted some sort of drop test on it afterwards, putting a fair dent in the
>heat shield.

I lived in Lincoln from about 1960-1980, and attended UN-L from 1975-80.
Don't remember when said capsule appeared, but it was in the mid-70's,
and a thrill for local space buffs.  As to its designation, I recall the
plaque gave a mission designation as "004".  My memory of 12+ years ago
isn't too precise, but this may have been the first Saturn V flight test.

C. Roelle
roelle@sigi.jhuapl.edu
From: rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu (Jeff Bytof)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: NASA SETI
Date: 19 Aug 1992 20:59:07 GMT
Organization: sio
NNTP-Posting-Host: lutherlab.ucsd.edu
Keywords: SETI Microwave Observing Project

Is NASA's Microwave Observing Project still dead in Congress or
have they managed to revive it?  
Newsgroups: sci.space
From: aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer)
Subject: Re: Inflatable Space Stations - Why Not ?
Organization: Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 14:20:59 GMT

In article <1992Aug21.135325.18668@ornl.gov> geg@ornl.gov (GILES JR G E) writes:
>The LEO environment contains lots of trash.  Thin skins might not
>survive in this environment.

by itself the kevlar skin of an inflatable station isn't strong
enough. However, a shield can be included without much loss of
volume. In addition, leaks are easially repaired if they happen.

The LLNL design has two envelopes for added protection. The outer one
in pressurized at 3.5 PSI and the inner envelope (where the crew
resides) is at 7 psi.

  Allen

-- 
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Allen W. Sherzer | "If they can put a man on the Moon, why can't they     |
|  aws@iti.org     |  put a man on the Moon?"                               |
+----------------------245 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
From: sinenmaa@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: handheld astronomy
Date: 13 Aug 92 12:35:38 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

GREETINGS all Aliens and Earth's Beings !!

Have you run into the Phobos or other Heavenly Objects lately ?
You haven't !
Ok, It's good because I was downloaded my program in to the News Group
COMP.SOURCES.HP48. Its name is TYKO and v=3.0. And by the help of this
program you can easily locate those objects so there are no difficulties
to take your bearings in time or space.

Some features;

   8.5 planets, Moon, Sun, 21 stars and available coordinates;
   Rising  times      Visual magnitude            Ecliptical (Geo or Helio)
   Setting  #         Apparent #                  Equatorial
   Color index   Geocenric distance               Horizon
   Heliocenric distance  Semidiameter  Diameter Nutation in everywhere
   Obliquity of the Ecliptic  Equation of Equinox Sidereal times Universal 
   time Ephemeris transit times Perihelion dates Mean anomaly Mean
   longitude Elongation Phase Calendar Easter Sundayes and ...  so on.

   And the input can be both the Calendar date -- either Gregorian date or
   Julian date -- and Julian day. For instance; you can put the date
   January 2. 3456789 and time 12.36 in the form 1264287318.02 (TZ=0,
   Calendar=Gregorian) and you will get excatly the same results
   ( the accuracy can be a little questionable ).

  And all This from your Handheld, you do not need to drag those
  exhausting, not VERY Personal, Computers with yours when you are
  e.g. on the lake in rowboat or having lunch with other aliens from
  Pleiades.

I have also some HP48sx pictures, are called GROB-picts, 
so if you want to see them ...  mail please. 
I compined and converted them into three GIF-picts.

PS. The DOC file has been written in VSL so be patient -- pleeez !
The latest version is 3.01, if you got 3.0 please replace it.
regards,
kati
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.astro
From: baalke@kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke)
Subject: Magellan Update - 08/13/92
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4   
Keywords:  Magellan, JPL
Reply-To: baalke@kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 04:31:57 GMT

Forwarded from the Magellan Project

                     MAGELLAN STATUS REPORT
                        August 13, 1992

1.  Magellan continues to operate normally, performing only
    starcals (star calibrations) and desats (desaturations of
    the reaction wheels).

2.  A week from now, Transmitter B will be  turned back on and
    the temperature gradually raised into the range of 50 to
    60 degrees C.  It is hoped that this operating mode which
    will allow the return of radar data at 115 kbps in order
    to fill the only significant gap in Magellan's global
    coverage of Venus.

3.  The critical period, a 10-day mapping segment at the end
    of the cycle, begins on September 3 and is included in the
    M2247 command sequence.

4.  The International Colloquium on Venus was concluded
    yesterday at Caltech. The meeting included over 120
    technical papers on Venus research, many based on Magellan
    data.  The colloquium ended with six "summarizers" who
    emphasized the areas for further Venus research and a
    panel discussion of prospects for future missions.  It was
    generally agreed that the highest priority was for a
    continuation of the Magellan mission and continued funding
    for research using the Magellan data.

5.  Magellan has explored Venus for 734 days.
     ___    _____     ___
    /_ /|  /____/ \  /_ /|     Ron Baalke         | baalke@kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov
    | | | |  __ \ /| | | |     Jet Propulsion Lab |
 ___| | | | |__) |/  | | |__   M/S 525-3684 Telos | You can't hide broccoli in
/___| | | |  ___/    | |/__ /| Pasadena, CA 91109 | a glass of milk - 
|_____|/  |_|/       |_____|/                     | anonymous 7-year old.

Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.geo.geology,sci.astro
From: klaes@verga.enet.dec.com (Larry Klaes)
Subject: Will LAGEOS 2 Earth satellite have a plaque too?
Keywords: LAGEOS, Earth, earthquakes, plaque
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 14:39:03 GMT

         Will the LAGEOS 2 satellite - scheduled for launch on the
    Space Shuttle STS-52 mission - have a plaque of some kind on it
    as the craft's predecessor did in 1976?

	 To explain, LAGEOS 1, launched in 1976, was designed to help 
    scientists measure the movements of continental plates.  Since
    LAGEOS 1's orbit would keep it in space for eight million years
    before plunging back to Earth, Carl Sagan had a plaque designed to 
    help future explorers understand the purpose of the satellite.

	 Briefly, the LAGEOS 1 plaque depicted three views of Earth's
    continents:  As they were 250 million years ago when all the land
    masses were combined into one called Pangaea; as they appeared in
    1976 (launch year); and as they will probably look in 8 million A.D..
    The plaque also contained a diagram of the satellite and a simple
    picture of Earth orbiting Sol to explain the concept of one year.

         You can read more about the LAGEOS plaque in Carl Sagan's 1978
    book MURMURS OF EARTH, which also discusses the VOYAGER 1 and 2
    gold records and the PIONEER 10 and 11 plaques to extraterrestrial
    intelligences (or humanity's future space explorers).

         Your information is appreciated.

         Larry Klaes  klaes@verga.enet.dec.com
 		      or - ...!decwrl!verga.enet.dec.com!klaes
    		      or - klaes%verga.dec@decwrl.enet.dec.com
                      or - klaes%verga.enet.dec.com@uunet.uu.net

              "All the Universe, or nothing!" - H. G. Wells

         EJASA Editor, Astronomical Society of the Atlantic

Newsgroups: sci.space
From: bhill@stars.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert S. Hill)
Subject: Re: Parsecs?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: Hughes STX Corp./NASA Goddard Space Flight Center
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 15:57:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.024141.4913@utdallas.edu>, 
bcollins@utdallas.edu (Arlin B. Collins) writes...
 richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin) writes:
>>|> Please forgive my ignorance, but what the heck is a parsec?
>>|> Richard.
> A star with a parallax of 'p' arc seconds is at a distance
> 'd' parsecs, given by  d=1/p (accurate up to distances of about 30pc).
> One parsec equals  30.857x10**12 km, 206265 astronomical units, and
> 3.2616 light-years.

Fun facts:  206265 is also the number of arcsec in a radian
            1 km/sec = approx. 1 parsec/million years

Robert S. Hill                  
bhill@stars.gsfc.nasa.gov
From: amon@elegabalus.cs.qub.ac.uk
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Why is this on SpaceDigest (or sci.space)
Date: 13 Aug 92 11:10:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.1992Aug13.111111.169111
Distribution: sci
Organization: [via International Space University]
X-Added: Forwarded by Space Digest
Original-Sender: isu@VACATION.VENARI.CS.CMU.EDU

I really don't see the reason for the massive list of cross postings.  
If you are going to relate this to how societies approach space, or  
the formation of extraterrestrial politico-economics systems, fine.  
But this seems more like a straight poly-sci argument.

Be more selective in your cross-posting.
From: gary@ke4zv.uucp (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Re: Energiya's role in Space Station assem
Date: 16 Aug 92 13:57:54 GMT
Article-I.D.: ke4zv.1992Aug16.135754.19274
Reply-To: gary@ke4zv.UUCP (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Gannett Technologies Group

In article <1992Aug14.123208.13141@iti.org> aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes:
>In article <1992Aug13.225903.5705@ke4zv.uucp> gary@ke4zv.UUCP (Gary Coffman) writes:
>
>>Name *one* major military procurement that
>>proceeded on a fixed price basis with *no* adjustments. 
>
>The ATF prototype
>LACE
>RME
>DC-X

None of these are *procurement* contracts. They are R&D proposals.

>>Congress is
>>notorious for "stretching out" procurement in a way that saves money
>>this year, but adds horrible extra costs in the "out years" if the
>>full procurement ever is actually filled.
>
>Not a problem here since I'm not asking the government to spend anything
>for development. You still seem to have problems understanding that.

No, you seem to have problems understanding the difference between
development, a one time cost, and procurement, a recurring cost.
When the government decided to buy only 16 B2s over the next 10
years instead of 120, the cost per each skyrocketed.

NASA currently can't sign a guarrantee that it will buy a fixed number
of anything over a multi-year period because Congress only funds 
NASA year by year. Therefore procurement costs are highly variable
depending on the whims of Congress.

Gary
Newsgroups: sci.space
From: rbunge@access.digex.com (Robert Bunge)
Subject: GOP space platform text
Organization: Express Access Online Communications Service, Greenbelt, Maryland USA
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 21:09:01 GMT

As received by FAX from Houston:

GOP Platform on Space
 
We are a pioneer people. Today's telecommunications revolution
began with the first satellites of the Eisenhower years. So too,
what we now do -- or fail to do -- in space will determine the
future for generations to come.
 
That is why President Bush established the National Space Council
under Vice President Quayle. Together, they rescued a floundering
space program, revamped NASA, opened up competition, and engaged
the best minds of academia and research in a twofold mission for
mankind. Mission to Planet Earth will define and perhaps mitigate
effects on our fragile environment. Mission from Planet Earth will
open space for science and industry.
 
Especially in this Columbian year, we hail the President's decision
"to return to the moon, this time to stay, and then a journey to
tomorrow, a mission to Mars."
 
Investments in space, though aimed at the future, pay dividends
right now -- in research and medicine, in international
competitiveness and domestic opportunity. This must not be diverted
to political pork barrels. The journey to the stars used to be a
bipartisan adventure, but many Democrat officeholders have jumped
ship.
 
Republicans, by contrast, are determined to complete Space Station
Freedom within this decade. Our agenda is to lower the cost of
access to space, and to broaden that access to the private sector,
with a family of new launchers; to build and fly sensors for the
global environment; and to advance cutting-edge capabilities like
the National Aerospace Plane and single-stage-to-orbit rockets, so
technological breakthroughs can be quickly exploited. We will
promote space-based enterprise, not a restricted preserve for
government. We will continue international cooperation in space
ventures and welcome Russia's cosmonauts and citizens of other
nations to fly for freedom.
 


Bob Bunge
rbunge@access.digex.com

Xref: sparky sci.space:11859 talk.politics.space:1075
From: kjenks@gothamcity.jsc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: sci.space,talk.politics.space
Subject: U.S. Go'vt Procurement (was: Energiya's role in Space Station assem)
Keywords: procurement
Date: 15 Aug 1992 20:39:09 GMT
Organization: NASA/JSC/GM2, Space Shuttle Program Office
Originator: kjenks@krakatoa

In article <1992Aug13.225903.5705@ke4zv.uucp> gary@ke4zv.UUCP 
(Gary Coffman) challenges us to:
>                         Name *one* major military procurement that
>proceeded on a fixed price basis with *no* adjustments. Congress is
>notorious for "stretching out" procurement in a way that saves money
>this year, but adds horrible extra costs in the "out years" if the
>full procurement ever is actually filled. Recent examples include B1B, 
>B2, and Seawolf. ATF is travelling down the same road.

FAR be it for me to defend the procurement system with which Congress
has saddled the rest of the U.S Government, but you do get a very
skewed view of the process by reading about it in the Press.  The Press
is only interested in stories that are "news," and procurement actions
which are on-time and under-budget are not considered newsworthy.

Challenging us to name a "major military procurement" which worked
"properly" is quite a challenge, since we never hear about them if
everything goes well.  I'd point to NASA's recently-completed $2B
purchase of OV-105 (Endeavour), but since NASA did the final work on
the new Orbiter at KSC, it's debatable whether Rockwell really did come
in on-time and under-budget.  (It's hard to tell when the rules change
in mid-contract, and they always change on a big procurement.)

The U.S. space program operates under the same procurement regulations
that DoD and the Department of Agriculture do.  Whether it's rockets
or bullets or tractors, it's the lowest qualified bidder, or you'd
better have a darned good JOFOC (that's Governmentese for Justification
for Other than Full and Open Competition).

Dan Goldin, in a recent press release, announced that he's going to
reform NASA procurement practices.  I don't know how, since NASA is
bound by the same laws as everybody else (except Congress).  I applaud
him for the effort, but true changes can only come from Congress, and
they have so much crap built into the procurement rules, they'll never
get rid of it all.

On the sunny side, it looks as though Dan Quayle, Friend of the Space
Program, may come to the rescue.  His "National Council on
Competitiveness" is taking a serious look at procurement reform.  I
doubt he'll be able to get anywhere, either, but at least he's trying.

Let's take this to talk.politics.space where it belongs.

-- Ken Jenks, NASA/JSC/GM2, Space Shuttle Program Office
      kjenks@gothamcity.jsc.nasa.gov  (713) 483-4368

     "Better.  Faster.  Cheaper." -- Daniel S. Goldin, NASA Administrator
Newsgroups: sci.space
From: mjensen@herman.gem.valpo.edu (Michael Jensen)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Re: What is the ASRM??
Date: 12 Aug 92 18:20:58 GMT
Distribution: world

In article <5586@m1.cs.man.ac.uk>, fortuna@cs.man.ac.uk (Armando Fortuna) writes:
|> >In article <1992Aug4.140921.19282@aio.jsc.nasa.gov> pettengi@ial1.jsc.nasa.gov 
(James B. Pettengill) writes:
|> 
|> >>the asrm program is dead for now but not for long. it should be resurrected
|> >>latter this year or next.
|> 
|> >Don't count on it.
|> 
|> >>fred can't get off the ground without asrm.
|> 
|> >Unless they use Energia.
|> 
|> >  Allen
|> 
|> >-- 
|> >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|> >| Allen W. Sherzer | "If they can put a man on the Moon, why can't they     |
|> >|  aws@iti.org     |  put a man on the Moon?"                               |
|> >+----------------------262 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
|> 
|> Or unless they use a Saturn V rocket. Rumors say that NASA is thinking
|> about "resurrect" the Saturn V to launch fred in fewer flights than
|> it would take by using the Shuttle.
|> Of course, rebuilding the launch pads for the Saturn, and getting the
|> original contractors to build the parts, would not be easier, and one
|> may say cost-effective.
|> 
|> Armando


	If I hear my info correctly, you are partially correct.  There is a study 
going on to try and use the new NLS (National Launch System) if it get's built in 
time.  The "mothballed" Saturn V vehicles would cost too much to bring back to
operating condition, hence requiring complete reconstruction of the vehicle.  The 
NLS would be much more cost effective, and I beleive this is the direction they plan
to take.


-- 
Michael C. Jensen				mjensen@gellersen.valpo.edu
Electrical Engineering				jensen@cisv.jsc.nasa.gov
Valparaiso University				mcj0716@exodus.valpo.edu
"I bet the human brain is a kludge." -- Marvin Minsky