From: pshane@andromeda.rutgers.edu (Ana M. Shane)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia
Subject: Re: Calling a spade a spade
Date: 3 Jan 93 09:24:45 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

abrodnik@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca writes:

>In article <Jan.2.02.51.54.1993.20821@andromeda.rutgers.edu> pshane@andromeda.rutgers.edu (Ana M. Shane) writes:

Ana (before):
|>> YES, EVERYONE
|>>WITHIN THE LEADERSHIPS OF DIFFERENT COUNTRIES OF FORMER YUGOSLAVIA
|>>IS TO BLAME. How much? What for? Well each one individual and
|>>official structure, for what they have exactly done. Not more,
|>>and not less. That would be only just, wouldn't it?

Andrej:
>I completely agree with Ana here, though I'd add, following the same
>logic, why don't blame then also other leaderships? Leaderships of
>other countries? They are guilty as well? Why don't also blame other
>people with power? Why don't blame other people? Why don't blame also
>you, Ana, and me? Right? Don't you see that such an approach is
>somehow leading to complete anarchy? Is this what we want?

Not an anarchy. Other world governments who could have had some influence
and probably did have *SOME* influence, could be also "blamed" accordingly.
(Depending on What kind of influence they had and how much - Did they
sell arms to non-official groups or after the embargo on arms? Did they
actively push for separations before the conflicts are settled peacefully?
Did they promise support they later didn't give? or did they "just" vote
for some resolutions in the U.N.? etc)
Similar argument can be constructed for other people with power - foreign
ambassadors to ex-Yu, various intelligence officers in ex-Yu (who must have
known that should this country start to fall appart without previous
settlements as to how to divide it, it will lead to a war) and their
suppremes. etc...

As for you and me. I don't know about you, but I suspect you coudn't be
blamed, (not much, at least :-) ). And I have always tried to point out
to everyone I know in Yu the same things I am writing here. I have not
lost a friend yet even when we disagreed. I have tried, but who asked me?
Still I feel guilty a bit, just because I am one of all those who
have left Yu (brain drain) to the mercy of such vicious, stupid people.
Even though I know that I couldn't have changed anything.

So, I don't think that my previous argument doesn't stand. I said:
"ACCORDINGLY" - everyone to be blamed exactly for what they have
done.

Ana (before):
|>>First, I am not blaming CROATIA AND SLOVENIA, but Croatian and Slovenian
|>>leadership.

|>>Second, I am not even "blaming" but just laying out the irrefutable facts.

Andrej:
>So, Ana, are you blaming or not?-)

Ana (now): Read further

Ana (before):
|>>(Take the official press releases from: Serbia, Croatia, Slovenia and
|>>Kosovo for years 1980-1987 and after 1987, and tell me whether you can
|>>or cannot conclude that
|>>"Croatian and Slovenian *leaders* had used the Kosovo conflict to,
|>> on one hand, support the most extreme secessionist Albanian leaders, 

|>>and 

|>>on the other hand, to prepare their own populations for hatred, satanization
|>>and demonization of all Serbs. (analyze the style of writing up the news).
|>>(here I'll also add, that the Serbian leadership equally used the said
|>>political events occuring in Kosovo prior to Milosevic and even more
|>>after he came to power, to equaly satanize and demonize Croatians and
|>>Slovenians and Albanians).

Andrej:
>Hm, we are going the same way as we did so many times already. First
>question which needs to be answered is whether pointing out on
>problems on Kosovo is act of "hatred and satanization of all Serbs"? I
>don't think so, or you need to blame for this also Helsinki Watch and
>Amnesty International. So was there other writting (in Slovenia
>particularly) which had as a goal what you wrote above? It happened to
>be that in most of eighties I used to live in Ljubljana and hence also
>read and listen (also) Slovene sources (what I sincerely question if
>you did in original language) and I have to say that no such emotions
>were spread around. On the other hand I agree with you, that Serbian
>side was constantly accusing Slovenia of such acts and, especially, of
>not understanding of Serbian position on Kosovo. The next problem, as
>I saw it, was that Serbs were angry because Slovenes were (also)
>listening to Albanian side. The culmination happened when Slovenes
>declined to allow "a rally of truth" in Ljubljana. Serbs said, at that
>moment, that Slovenes do not want to hear their side of story. But
>they completely forgot to mention that Slovenes were willing to give
>them prime time on TV and radio (to their representatives) to explain
>their position. Is this again the "demonization of Serbs"? I'd rather
>turn the question around. What if Serbian authorities have shown their
>people that others (Slovenes) are "preparing their own populations for
>hatred, satanization and demonization of all Serbs"? The rest of
>conclusions are left to the reader.

Ana:
I agree completely that the Serbian authorities have, as I said above,
started to spread their propaganda about Slovenes, based half in truth
and half in lies. But about the "Kosovo case" there are a lot of
things that I really still don't understand. And I think I don't
understand them because there are really not a lot of solid and
truthfull information about how this whole "case" has started and
developed in post WWII times. For instance:

1. Is it true that the Serbians from Kosovo were forbidden to return
to their properties after the war?

2. Is it true that there was a substantial (10.000? more?) number of
refugees from Albania (proper) who were given asylum in Kosovo and
who were also given the abandoned Serbian property? (Or is it just
Serbian authorities propaganda?)

3. Is it true that since WWII until 1990, the whole population of
Yu had been specially taxed for "underdeveloped regions" and that
the biggest such region was Kosovo and Metohija?

4. Is it true that the constitution of the SFR Serbia until 1987
was such that the representatives from the two autonomous regions
(Vojvodina and Kosovo) had a veto power over every republican decision
regardless of the region it applied to, but that at the same time
Serbia Republican authorities did not have similar powers over the
policies of the authorities of the autonomous regions? Which created
an impossible situation for the government of Serbia?

5. Is it true that before 1981, the Albanians in Kosovo had as a nation
all freedoms to develop nationally (schools, a university, various
daily papers, journals, radio and TV stations, cultural institutions,
etc) and have not in any shape or form been "dominated" by Serbs.
They had their representatives, as mentioned before in the Serbian
parliament, with the power of veto (a power not given to any representatives
from other Serbian regions, except Vojvodina). They had also 
been represented in the federal government.

6. Is it true that the Albanian leaders have even under such favorable
conditions for their nation kept their people and the whole
region "undeveloped" and poor, using at the same time the most
dangerous form of propaganda against Yu and Serbia - textbooks and
curricula imported from Enver Hodxa's openly anti-Yugoslavian Albania.


7. Is it true that over the course of at least 20 years (1968-1987)
there has been an "unofficial" but very strong pressure on the
Serbian population in Kosovo to move out of there (a form of "ethnic
cleansing" if you wish). This pressure ranged from positive (offering
a lot of money to buy out the property from the Serbs), to the very
negative - all forms of problems in finding employment to grave
cases of murder or murder attempt.

8. Is it true that in their many attempts to secede from Serbia
officially (even before the police and military regime in Kosovo
had been instituted by Milisevic) Albanian leaders were strongly encouraged
by Slovenian and Croatian leaders?

9. Is it true that Albanians from Kosovo had organized meetings "of
truth" in Slovenia, protesting against the imposed Serbian government
regime?

10. Is it true that the same opportunity had been denied to the
Serbians from Kosovo by the Slovenian authorities?

etc.

I know that I am missing something. Something in the development
of the situation before 1987. Because I can't understand the logic
of Albanian autorities and of Serbian autorities. Nor of the
Communist autorities. Nor of the Slovenian and Croatian autorities.

I just can see from this that I know that the victims in all these
political decisions were both the Albanian and the Serbian people of
Kosovo. They were kept in poverty despite all the taxes collected over 50
years especially for their development, they were turned against
each other by their respective leaders and by a series of unjust, even 
criminal decisions on the part of the leadership of Yugoslavia.

If you ask me, what would be the best to do with Kosovo NOW, and if
I had any say, I would warmly recommend that it be given to the
people who live there. I would just have one condition: that the
culturally and historically important monuments (monasteries, churches,
graveyards, etc) be given some kind of protection or a special
status (like the ones in Greece), and that the Serbian inhabitants
be guaranteed safety and protection by the authorities.

But who asks me?

>Regards,

>Andrej

Regards, and as always I wish you PEACE
Ana
Xref: sparky soc.culture.croatia:192 soc.culture.yugoslavia:10218 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:929