HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pmmst8@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Paul M Mweene)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct,soc.culture.african
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Date: 17 Apr 92 04:40:41 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <viking.703149779@vincent1.iastate.edu> viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson) writes:
>In <1992Apr13.040702.16143@wpi.WPI.EDU> padutton@wpi.WPI.EDU
> (Peter Alan Dutton) writes:
>	I'll take this one step further and claim that it wasn't white
>people who were responsible for slavery, but a few individuals, their
>color having nothing to do with the morality of their actions.

Wrong, slavery was motivated by the demand for labourors in the new world. It lasted for 400 yrs, a period of time far ecxceeding the life span of a normal man,
even your few indivduals. The above is nothing but a vague, obscurantist statement.
>
>>Slavery has existed in EVERY culture. No culture is immune.
>
I see, do you have any proof of this ?

Makala
Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1429 alt.politics.correct:3630
From: guillory@crhc.uiuc.edu (Stanford Guillory)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Date: 10 Apr 92 07:25:44 GMT
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
NNTP-Posting-Host: bach.crhc.uiuc.edu

v070km6q@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (John B Schutkeker) writes:

>Perhaps they should be required to stay at home and raise the children
>that they fater out of wedlock and to the marry the mothers of those
>children instead of leaving them to go onto welfare.

Well gee, John, given that white females make up the vast
majority of welfare receipients (~70%), maybe we should
hold those horny white males to the same standard, huh?

Heres a question for everyone. How much of every tax dollar
I spend on welfare would I save if they got those lazy, whining
white people off of welfare? (Hint: 70 cents). How about
blacks? (Hint: 25 cents). Which lazy group is costing us the most
money? You figure it out.


Stanford S. Guillory
sguillor@pcocd2.intel.com
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct
From: dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson)
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois
Distribution: world,local
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 21:35:37 GMT

In article <1992Apr15.182440.14103@midway.uchicago.edu> gross@befvax.uchicago.edu writes:
>
>And I think that you are just wrong.  A vast majority of whites?
>You mean that 80% of whites "do all they can to insure that AfAms
>and Native Americans don't have equal access to things that they should
>have as citizens of this country"
>
>Do ALL THEY CAN?  Don't white people have anything better to do? 
>
Well if you watch the news...apparently not.

>There is no conspiracy, and your kind of rhetoric borders on paranoia.

Paranoia ??? If you knew anything about African American history you
would know that its not merely paranoia but facts that are the basis for 
this paranoia if you want to call it that. I choose to call it being 
aware of you surroundings.

>The year is not 1950, and we don't live in the deep south.
>
This is another problem. If blacks aren't being lynched and having dogs
put on them then .... Oh my ! How things have changed ! We aren't as bad as 
we use to be. The truth is ..is that racism is STILL alive and well and
not much has changed. Yes some things have but not alot.

>This is propaganda, not a description of white American at all.
>Your views of white American are extremely negative, and border on racism.
>I suggest you pay less attention to Louis Farakkan.
>
I suggest you stop trying to base your opinions on the status of race 
relations based solely on what you THINK the situation is. Why don't
you listen to what someone who is going through the problem has to
say. No one would ever say that what a woman who has been raped says
she went through is not true but when it comes to race and what
blacks have to say .....Seems like alot of white people don't 
want to beleive what they have to say. WHY ??? Maybe you should pay
more attention to Farakkan.

Dowdy Jackson

Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1434 alt.politics.correct:3633
From: v070km6q@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (John B Schutkeker)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Date: 10 Apr 92 15:50:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <guillory.702891197@bach.crhc.uiuc.edu>, guillory@crhc.uiuc.edu (Stanford Guillory) writes...
>v070km6q@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (John B Schutkeker) writes:
> 
>>It shouldn't be necessary to pass laws so that people "know" things that
>>will give them self-respect.  That's what mommy and daddy are supposed to
>>teach them when they're little.  Laws can't substitute for mom and dad.
> 
>But what about when Mommy and Daddy don't teach this?!? This is
>the whole fucking point! Have you ever SERIOUSLY thought about
>this?!?!?

Just because mom and dad don't teach the children something doesn't mean
that passing laws *can* teach this.  You might be surprised at the damage
done to ordinary fellows by all of the male-bashing feminism going around.
There are a lot of men out there ashamed to be what they are because they
read in the newspapers every day that men are just a bunch of rapist scum
who are less than human.  That's why the men's movement is getting
so popular lately.  Becase feminism is a form of opression that is just
a caricature of the oppession of felales that has gone on since pre-historic
days.

And there's no need to shout and swear.  We can debate like mature adults,
can't we?

					-- John Schutkeker
Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1453 alt.politics.correct:3644 soc.culture.african:1769
From: pmmst8@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Paul M Mweene)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct,soc.culture.african
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Date: 11 Apr 92 02:10:12 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Apr9.181844.21589@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.230013.24086@anasaz> best@anasaz (Mike Best) writes:
>>
>>
>>  Second, the only way you could believe this would be if you, Dowdy,
>>  were willing to be personally responsible for the actions of your
>>  great grandfather/mother.  Are you willing to suffer the sins of
>>  your relatives?  Naturally, most people would _not_ feel responsible
>>  for they themselves had not committed the action. 
>>
This is the problem. Most whites don't see that not much has changed for
AfAms in this country. Just because you don't see AfAms being beaten and 
ynched as much now days doesn't mean that the attitudes and enviornment
which breeds such behavior has changed. 
     The Native Americans are in the situation they are in today because
whites don't see that the plight of the Native Americans is due to the 
actions of whites over the years not just recent actions. The same is true of AfAms.

>>  Liberals believe in group rights and group responsibility (social is
>>  the operative prefix to a well known "ism" here) and I don't like
>>  being held responsible for something I didn't do.
>>
Maybe YOU didn't do it but what are you doing to change it. In a robbery
situation YOU may not have done the robbery but you are held responsible
for being an accessory.

>>  I also suggest that if compensation is handed out that the continent
>>  of Africa is also held responsible for the AF-AMs own "brothers" 
>>  were quite involved in obtaining the unfortunate future slaves of
>>  the New World.  Address this!
>>
Well first of all europeans enslaved Africans and transported them to America,
not Africans. Europeans seperated families, worked the slaves to death and
killed them...not Africans. African slaves worked for this country for centuries
>and made it what it is today via FREE labor due to the european slave traders
and masters... NOT AFRICANS. There were jews involved in the capture and murder of other jews in the jewish holocaust but no one would dare imply that the
jews were responsible or played a major partin the murder of their own people.
This would only try to diminish the resposibility of the nazi's role. This is 
true when whites try to say that Africans enslaved Africans for the slave trade.

Dowdy Jackson
Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1624 soc.culture.iranian:3470 soc.rights.human:1448 talk.politics.mideast:10884 talk.religion.misc:7206
From: hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,soc.culture.iranian,soc.rights.human,talk.politics.mideast,talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Minority Religions in Iran (was executed baha'i)
Date: 15 Apr 92 17:01:37 GMT
Reply-To: hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem)
Organization: North Carolina State University

In article <1992Apr15.034724.4509@gboro.glassboro.edu>,
kilroy@gboro.glassboro.edu (Dr Nancy's Sweetie) writes:
> 
> Benham Sadeghi wrote that:
> > I personally think that relatively speaking a Jew is more respected in 
> > Iran than a Muslim is in the U.S.
> 
> and, to quote Mr Bierce, "there hath been brave disputation".
> 
> The Philadelphia Inquirer recently had an article on the Iranian elections,
> and here are some of the details from it:
> 
> Religious minorities -- Jews, Christians, Zoroastrians and Baha'is (who make
> up 1% of the population) -- are guaranteed five seats in the Majlis.  There
> are 270 total seats in the Iranian parliament, so the influence of those five
> is probably rather limited.
> 
> In the face of the apparent tokenism, one Jewish election worker said that
> "Iran is the only country where the Jews have their own representative in
> parliament.  Even in the United States, Jews aren't guaranteed a seat. [...]
> They have recognised the Jewish minority's place with a seat."
> 
> A Zoroastrian took a more cynical view of things: "This election doesn't make
> any difference.  It's only symbolic, so they can say we have freedom."  The
> reporter notes that the Iranian government does not permit Zoroastrians to
> publish their religious books, but says nothing about other religions.
> 
> And finally, the Christian, Jewish and Zoroastrian houses of worship that the
> reporter went to all included a portraits of Ayatollah Khomeini -- probably
> not voluntarily.
> 
> 
> How does this compare with Muslims in the US?  Well, everybody can publish
> their books and I've never seen a portrait of a President on the wall of any
> religious building.  Whether this is a good trade for a guaranteed
seat in the
> parliament you'll have to decide for yourself.
> 
> 
> Darren F Provine / kilroy@gboro.glassboro.edu


Things seem to be changing. I have personally seen a Zoroastrian
calender which was published in Iran for the last calender year which
contained notes for religious holidays and historical events, etc.. The
shortwave service from Tehran regularly broadcasts such items as poetry
from the Shahnameh and discussions about such works which are based in
Persian history rather than Islamic history. I think many Iranians who
are living abroad would be surprised what kind of things are being
broadcast from Iran these days.

Brad Hernlem (hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU)

BTW, I would tend to agree with Behnam Sadeghi's statement. All the
Iranians that I know seem to have a deeper empathy toward people than
most Americans. It is my opinion that Americans are far quicker to
stereotype people.
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct
From: bohnert@leland.Stanford.EDU (matthew bohnert)
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 92 23:26:01 GMT

>>
>>| Why shouldn't they receive some sort of compensation ?
>>
>>Because 'they' have not been enslaved and the victims
>>of this 'compensation' didn't do the original enslaving.
>>
>>
>Maybe not but "they" are still perpetuating a system set up by the
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>slavemasters. Seems to me not much has changed.

This is the one I love.  Would one of the above posters please
define who 'they' are?  All whites?  Are blacks somehow immune to
perpetuating the 'system', whatever that is?  The interesting part of
this argument to me is the calculation of exactly how much I 'owe', and
to 'whom'.  Please wait for a moment while I get my checkbook....

Now then....

My father's ancestors were German immigrants who settled in Kansas and
Nebraska around 1900.  Most where either farmers or preachers.  The details
on my mother's side are a bit more sketchy, but most of her clan seems to
have come out of the Ozarks around the same time.  I have no idea of the
exact details of their arrival in the USA, but it's quite possible that
the first one to ever see an African-American was when my grandfather took
a position in St. Louis around 1950 as a pastor.  
My father and mother were married and
moved to Carbondale, Ill, where I was born while my dad was a grad student.
He moved to Chicago to teach geology at a small college when I was 3.

SUBTOTAL #1 : Please compute the total number of oppressive/future retribution
	points (referred to from now on as O/FR's)
	consistent with the above biography.

SUBTOTAL #2 : Double O/FR's for every 1/64th ancestor who owned a plantation
	in the South and enslaved blacks.  In my case, I'm pretty sure that's
	zero.

SUBTOTAL #3 : Deduct 10% off of O/FR's for each 1/128th descendant that was
	an abolitionist.  Again, probably zero.

SUBTOTAL #4 : Possible additions/subtractions for mixed ancestry.  For every
	Native-American/African-American 1/128th, subtract 10% to O/FR total.
	No idea in my case..., probably a few Native-American 1/128ths, from
	my grandfather's stories.

Now, if I add the above subtotal and multiply by $ per O/FR, I arrive at
a figure that I 'owe'.  Who do I make the check out to?

Matt Bohnert


Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1630 alt.news-media:249 soc.culture.iranian:3489 soc.rights.human:1452 talk.politics.mideast:10902 talk.religion.misc:7261
From: simon@acsu.buffalo.edu (Patrice A. Simon)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination
Subject: Re: Whites Critical of African-Americans
Date: 10 Apr 92 02:02:36 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: UB

In article <1992Apr9.002153.24300@acsu.buffalo.edu> arocho@acsu.buffalo.edu (Vance A. Arocho) writes:
>
>**** And their skin color was never a 'disadvantage' for them. Also, were guns
>and drugs as rampant then as they are now, in the inner cities? Was crack in
>existence back then? 
>***** 

	Oh, come on! You've got to stop basing your thoughts purely on skin 
color! After all, certain European ethnic groups did experience problems when
they first came to the US in record numbers - part of the eqaution was their
state of poverty too. They had to fit in by purging their identities (names,
language, etc.) 
	I am in no way relating this to African Americans - however the fact
we're dealing with skin color does not automatically mean that no one else
experienced hardships in the US! Living standards (among other things) were
just as bad relatively as drugs and guns are today. I am not defending any-
one, just making sure you're aware.

>Vance Arocho: arocho@acsu.edu (SUN)/V068PZYD@ubvms  (VAX)


-- 
Patrice Simon
simon@acsu.cc.buffalo.edu			v5097ucd@ubvms.buffalo.edu
opnsimon@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1391 alt.politics.correct:3619
From: v070km6q@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (John B Schutkeker)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Date: 8 Apr 92 23:17:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

pattisan@midiline.la.ca.us (Patti Hayes) writes...

>  NO YOU'RE STUPID!!!!! Then why were women left OUT of the constitution???
>Why didn't women get the vote til the 20's????
>  How many laws do we need before everyone KNOWS they are equal with each 
>other? 

Patti San -

It shouldn't be necessary to pass laws so that people "know" things that
will give them self-respect.  That's what mommy and daddy are supposed to
teach them when they're little.  Laws can't substitute for mom and dad.

But giving women the vote was more than just long overdue, and it's a sad
reflection on human character, both male and female, that it took so long.

						-- John Schutkeker
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.news-media,soc.culture.iranian,soc.rights.human,talk.politics.mideast,talk.religion.misc
From: root@ncube.com (Operator)
Subject: Re: PROMINENT IRANIAN BAHA'I EXECUTED
Organization: nCUBE HeadQuarters
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 21:41:07 GMT

gross writes:
>There was also a resolution of the *United Nation Human Rights Commission*
> deploring the opression of Bahai's in Iran.
> This treatment has included executions, confiscation of property,
> annulment of marriages, etc.

I heard one of my dad's friends got all his belonging( house, car,...).
He has disclaimed to be Bahai. His grand father was Bahai. The 
government doesn't accept his disclaimer.


Captain Zod...
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct,soc.culture.african
From: dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson)
Subject: Re: Sexist African Males
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 01:09:09 GMT

In article <1992Apr11.230025.26846@midway.uchicago.edu> gross@befvax.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <204751@unix.cis.pitt.edu>, pmmst8@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Paul M Mweene) writes:
>>In article <1992Apr9.181844.21589@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson) writes:
>>Well first of all europeans enslaved Africans and transported them to America,
>>not Africans. Europeans seperated families, worked the slaves to death and
>>killed them...not Africans. African slaves worked for this country for centuries
>>>and made it what it is today via FREE labor due to the european slave traders
>>and masters... NOT AFRICANS. There were jews involved in the capture and murder of other jews in the jewish holocaust but no one would dare imply that the
>>jews were responsible or played a major partin the murder of their own people.
>>This would only try to diminish the resposibility of the nazi's role. This is 
>>true when whites try to say that Africans enslaved Africans for the slave trade.
>
>Your comparison simply does not work.
>The Jews in Europe were under Nazi occupation, which means that were already
>sentenced to death.  They gained nothing personally by cooperating.  Those 
>who cooperated were often deported and/or killed as well.
>
>From what I understand, the Africans who participated in the slave
>trade made money from the transactions, and were not themselves
>subsequently sold as slaves.
>
>So every Jew in Nazi occupied-Europe was a victim, whether they 'cooperated' 
>or not.  But not every African in Africa was a victim of slavery, and some 
>who were not victims benefited personally from it.
>
>Leon Gross
>I'm not an actor, but I play one on TV.
>
>
>>Dowdy Jackson


Where are you getting your information from ? You are making statements about
something that you know nothing about ! Every African was at risk of being
enslaved by the european slave traders ! I have relatives and written accounts
in my family that talk about these kinds of things. It just angers me to
think that white people just don't want to own up and admit that THEY are
responsible for enslaving Africans ! NO ONE ELSE. My comparison about the jews
was not from me but from a holocaust survivor ! NO one would blame the
jews or say that the jews played a role in the murder of their own people
but when it comes to African Americans...well anything goes. Thats bullshit.
The comparison also shows that whites can not prove that Africans 
enslaved Africans for the slave traders. Tell me where you are getting
your information ? Souds like it is from the David Duke book of AmeriKKKan
history.

Dowdy Jackson
Xref: sparky alt.discrimination:1594 alt.politics.correct:3691
From: Neil Hull <goid@zooid.guild.org>
Subject: Re: RESPONSE: "Eyewitness
X-To: DAN BOYD
Organization: The Zoo of Ids
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 00:40:00 GMT

DB>In article <gate.1ew8HB1w164w@b-cpu.UUCP> ralphw@b-cpu.UUCP (Ralph Winston)
writes:
DB>> Shmuel Krakowski is archives director for Yad Veshem, which is the
DB>> international center for Holocaust documentation in Jerusalem.
DB>> Krakowski states that more than 10,000 "eyewitness" testimonies about
DB>> German atrocities against Jews have been shown to be false at Yad
DB>> Veshem alone!

DB>I think this part of the posting is a lie.  Note that no source is
DB>provided to show where and when, and in what context, Krakwoski (if he
DB>even exists) ever said this.

DB>Note that the one lie is presented in such a way as to make you think
DB>that it is stronger than it is: note the clause 'at Yad Veshem alone!'
DB>which falsely implies that there are other such centers which have
DB>found eyewitness testimony to be false.  (After all, if there were
DB>other such centers Ralph would have said so and named them, to make
DB>his argument appear even stronger.)

DB>Also, Ralph leaves out the context in which Krakowski siad what he
DB>said.  A typical Ralph tactic is to leave out damaging context; for
DB>instance, he reposted the Bradley Smith ad 'The case for open debate
DB>on the Holocaust' with the header, "FROM THE DAILY NORTHWESTERN" --
DB>to make you think that the Daily Northwestern agrees with him.  It was
DB>a paid ad, which was surrounded by editorial refutations.  But that
DB>didn't fit his thesis, so he ignored it.

Cheers!!!   Now THAT is a very good refutation!

It specifically attacked what Mr. Winston said, rather than calling him
a "racist liar" (well...I think that you did something like that too, but
at least you explained yourself!)

(And I am NOT encouraging people to "let's attack Ralph". For the ninetieth
time, I am neutral, and by the way, did I mention that I am neutral, and...)

I OUGHT to apologise for seeming to "get on a high horse" and be seen as
trying to "show you all how to debate"...  I realise that the probability of
this being said is VERY likely, so I will just say that I am NOT claiming
how anyone ought to be debating.

I am only saying that if there is a debate going on, it should be fought with
FACTS and ARGUMENTS, and NOT name-calling.

W.

 * SLMR 2.1a * 
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination
From: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
Subject: Re: By the Time I get to Arizona...
Organization: Johns Hopkins University CS Dept.
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 22:14:04 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.171751.14139@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson) writes:
>Its not African culture but white folks trying to prevent us from having
>an African identity. The Jews nor the Italians were beaten and killed for
>trying to maintain their heritage but the Africans bought over here as slaves
>were.

Of course Jews at least were beaten and killed for trying to maintain their
heritage.  What makes you believe otherwise?
--
This is a newer version of the memetic .signature infection.  Now that's an
idea.  Copy it into your .signature today!

Ken Arromdee (UUCP: ....!jhunix!arromdee; BITNET: arromdee@jhuvm;
     INTERNET: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.news-media,soc.culture.iranian,soc.rights.human,talk.politics.mideast,talk.religion.misc