From: exuptr@exu.ericsson.se (Patrick Taylor)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Anti-choice vs. Pro-abortion (was Re: Houston Defending Choice Coalition needs you)
Date: 19 Aug 92 19:53:48 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: Ericsson Network Systems, Inc.

In article <1992Aug19.015745.13019@tamsun.tamu.edu> wrr3118@tamsun.tamu.edu (Rick Russell) writes:
>In article <exuptr.320.714175652@exu.ericsson.se> exuptr@exu.ericsson.se (Patrick Taylor) writes:
>Well, I didn't see myself speaking up on this thread, but now I feel
>forced to...

>Pro-abortion and anti-choice are not equally derogatory terms. Those
>who support the traditional pro-life stance are, by definition,
>anti-choice, since in most situations they would claim that a pregnant
>woman should have the child, no matter what her personal choice is.
>Hence the term anti-choice. Choice is antithetical to the pro-life
>stance. Anti-abortion seems like an appropriate name for people who
>hold this view too.

Now who's being stupid?  Hypocrisy has got nothing to do with equal
amounts of anything.  You cannot preach about using derogatory terminology
and use one in the next (or previous or same) paragraph without being a
hypocrite.

But, your comments above, put from another viewpoint, would read:

Those who support the traditional pro-choice stance are, by definition, 
pro-murder, since in most situations they would claim that a woman wanting
an abortion should get one, no matter what the fetus might actually
experience.  Hence the term pro-murder.  Murder is antithetical to the
pro-life stance....

>(I can see it now; someone's going to speak up and say "I'm pro-life
>and pro-choice too!").

Why not?  Among other things, there's the fetus's choice.

>Pro-abortion, on the other hand, is a term specifically meant to debase
>pro-choice supporters. 

Like this is not the intention behind anti-choice.  Your hypocrisy is 
showing again.

>Pro-abortion suggests that the person in question
>not only supports the right to choose abortion, but also would personally
>encourage abortions or receive an abortion.

This, in fact, happens.  

>This is simply not the case. There are many, many pro-choice
>supporters who would never recommend abortion, encourage abortion, or
>get an abortion for themselves. 

By supporting choice, they are "recommending" abortion as an alternative.
Maybe not as *the* choice for a given situation, but it is an endorsement
of the activity as an option.  It just doesn't make sense for someone who
"would NEVER [emphasis added] recommend abortion, encourage abortion, or
get an abortion for themselves" to endorse this choice.

As for your liberal definition of pro-choice, I'm pro-choice also.  I
just don't think murder should be one of the choices.

>>anti-choice and anti-life, that must be it.  Some people just can't see
>>how they do what they judge others for...

>I guess I just never understood the pro-life position. Unjust death
>occurs in this country, and the world, all the time. 

And I'm not happy about that, either.  Why add to it?

>While induced
>death may seem somehow more... sinful?... than death by starvation,
>abuse, neglect, or poor prenatal care, there's nothing inherently
>worse about it.

But unless you can *prove* it will happen to an aborted one, aren't you
playing God?

>When pro-lifers can demonstrate to me that they

>1) Are ready to provide pre-natal care and appropriate post-natal care
>to all children, regardless of social, racial, or economic standards,
>and

I'm for it.  Really.  Not only that but child care.

>2) Would extend their hands to unwed, pregnant women with promises of
>comfort and help rather than accusations of sin and ostracism,

I'll do everything I can.

>then I'll be ready to help eliminate abortion from the world.

Personally, I think eliminating abortions with laws is far too slow a 
process.  It's gonna take personal intercession; each pro-lifer doing what 
they can to help a candidate mother make a choice for life, and then 
following through on the helps.

If you ask me, OR should be out there with certificates for free prenatal 
care, food stamps, or whatever they can legally offer to avoid the 
"necessity" of abortion.  In this country especially, it is appalling that 
anyone should ever think it "necessary"

You'll be hearing more about this...

 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "This must be Thursday.  I never could get the hang of Thursdays"
                                                       - D Adams
  - Patrick Taylor
    Ericsson Network Systems
    exuptr@exu.ericsson.se                       "Don't let the .se fool you"
    alternately, exuptr@ZGNews.Lonestar.Org