HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brownr@hydra.rtp.dg.com (Randy Brown)
Subject: Re: Need advice to lower taxes
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 93 15:39:50 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: DG-RTP Graphics Group
Followup-To: misc.taxes

In article <dl.nec.com>, dillhoff@asl.dl.nec.com (Doug Dillhoff) writes:
|> 
|> I have a friend who makes over 100K/year and is looking for ways to
|> lower his tax liability. He is already maxed out in 401k. His house
|> is paid for so he only has real estate tax deductions. He is in his
|> 50's so he doesn't want something that is risky. Are there non-taxable
|> bonds of some sort where both the investment and the earnings are
|> not taxed? Please send advice.

What do other folks here think about single premium variable life insurance?
Donaghue (in one of his books I'm reading) suggests SPVL as an alternative
to long-term bonds, municipal or not, because of the tax-free-ness of them
and the reduced sensitivity to interest rates.  But, he says these are 
really only a good idea if you are willing to put 10K or more in as a lump
sum.  This would not reduce tax liability immediately but would shift a block
of earnings into a tax-free investment.

I'm not real clear on this, since I've always felt that 
insurance != investment, but he sounded pretty convincing.

Randy
From: shag@aero.org (Robert M. Unverzagt)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Fund basis?
Date: 5 Jan 1993 18:41:06 GMT
Organization: Organization?  You must be kidding.
NNTP-Posting-Host: aerospace.aero.org

In article <C0E5GA.Ip9@icon.rose.hp.com> alan@hprnd.rose.hp.com (Alan Berkema) writes:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have not found a good explanation of how to calculate the cost basis of 
> a mutual fund when it goes x-dividend in the current FAQ. I have included
> an explanation form a previous FAQ on mutual funds but it is still not clear.
> I have already requested the IRS publications mentioned.
> An example might help. 
> 
> ------------------
> 
> 10 shares with NAV = $10.00 per share
> x-dividend          = $1.00 per share
> taxable income     = $10.00
> 
> now have 11.11 shares at $9.00
> 
> What is the cost basis if I sell now?
> 
> What if I wait a few years before I sell and the process repeats?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Alan
> 

As I understand it, each share is considered independently,
kind of like each bet at the craps table, but that's a
different issue:

Share #		Basis
-------		-----
  1            $10.00
  2            $10.00
  3            $10.00
  4            $10.00
  5            $10.00
  6            $10.00
  7            $10.00
  8            $10.00
  9            $10.00
  10           $10.00
  11.11        $ 9.00

So if you sold today at $9.00/share:

shares 1-10:	10   * -$1.00 = -$9.00
share 11.11:	1.11 *  $0.00 =  $0.00
				-------
				-$9.00

You'd have a capital loss of $9.00.  Of course, you pay
taxes on a dividend of $10.00, so you're in the hole.
If you sold for a different price later, you'd do the same 
calculation.

Does anybody see a problem with this?

Shag

-- 
       Rob Unverzagt        |
  shag@aerospace.aero.org   |   The will to a system is a lack of integrity.
unverzagt@courier2.aero.org |                        - Friedrich Nietzsche 
   18348@rhodes.aero.org    |
From: jammer@eskimo.com (Lyle Harwood)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: < $5000: don't buy stock?
Date: 8 Jan 93 09:50:56 GMT
Organization: -> ESKIMO NORTH (206) For-Ever <-
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Barry Margolin (barmar@think.com) wrote:
: In article <kfGNgOa00WB=MLDEw=@andrew.cmu.edu> lv0e+@andrew.cmu.edu
(Lisa Laverne Vaughan) writes:
: >I have set as a goal for my $$$$ to amass as much principal (or
: >something that can be converted to principal) within the next 2 years
so that
: >I can use the interest to subsidize the considerably smaller income I
will
: >have in 2 years (i.e. I'm taking time off in 2 years).
: 
: Someone else mentioned that the "2 years" may have been a factor in
the
: advice you recieved, but he didn't expand on that.
: 
: Consider how much of a return on investment you would have to get so
that
: you will raise the capital you will need to take that time off.  You
didn't
: say how much time off you'll be taking, or what you'll be doing during
that
: time (if you'll be traveling, that's an extra expense).
: 
: While followups have mentioned enormous returns people have received
by

Hi. Lisa, thanks for asking your question. You've left the door
open for my entrance!  :)

Guys, let me ask you about what I want to do. I got hurt at work,
and now L&I rolls in, and I stare at walls.
What I mean is I have *LOTS* of time. Time to track down information,
time to ask stupid questions, time to stand on peoples desks untill
they answer said stupid questions, and then I have lots of time left
over. I am truely over stocked with time.

What I would like to do is invest in somthing incredibly fast paced,
as I alone of the people I know have the TIME to sit there and pounce
on anything that moves at anytime day or night.

What I don't have is information. Now, don't laugh. The amount I'm
talking about is less than Lisa's 5000. It is less than ONE thousand.
It is probably less than five hundred! I could prolly make five hundred,
but that would involve some political manuevering. (You know, with HER).
So.
Given that I can do absoloutly nothing else, 25 hours a day, but gather
information, pay attention, and am not faint of heart, where should I 
start? The doctors have recently granted me permission to sit in my
chair in front of my computer as long as I want.
This is good, it has saved our dog's life many times.
My ideal vision (fantasy?) is to sit in front of my c, and buy and
sell through the little curly wire in the back that I'm talking to you
on now. 


How do I get there from here? What should I read? What should I study?
How do I buy? How do I sell? Where and how can I LEARN?

Lisa, I apologize for interupting your question with mine, and thank
you again for opening the door.

Thank you all, many times, in advance.

Lyle
Organization: Bar-Ilan University Computing Center, Israel
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 12:28:14 IST
From: Hank Nussbacher <HANK@BARILVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Filenet - what happened?

Filenet (OTC) just went down 34% in one day (Jan 4).  I have not been
able to find out why yet.  What is going on in that company?

Thanks,
Hank
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: zliao@engin.umich.edu (Canhai Lai)
Subject: Question for Mutual fund, P/E ratio, Money Magazine, etc.
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 93 16:06:07 EST
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor
Distribution: usa


 I am a little confused about P/E ratio. From Money magazine, 
I found two mutual fund pretty attractive to me, but their P/E
ratio is so high(30-40) that it makes me nervous. Is high P/E ratio
equivalent to overpriced, or just realted to some small companies
who pay very little distribution?

 One article said Money is not good for stock pick, how about
mutual fund? Which magazine does a better job?
What's the best criteria to pick mutual funds?
One year performance, five year? Is a fund still worth to buy
which did a good job in five years but bad in 1992? 

 Thanks for your information.
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: pvonk@scott.skidmore.edu (Pierre VonKaenel)
Subject: Re: Electronic stock prices
Organization: Skidmore College, Saratoga Springs NY, 12866
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 16:54:55 GMT

In article <323@heimdall.sdrc.com> festeve@sgcpu1 (Steve Saunders) writes:
>I am looking for stock prices in electronic form.  I would like to get
>daily prices, and also historical data.
>

Compuserve info...

1.  Standard Pricing plan: $7.95/mo includes free current stock
quotes.
2.  Alternate pricing plan: $2.00/mo.  Current quotes are $.05 each
plus connect time ($.21/min) and tel. costs if not using a Compuserve
phone # (local).

For hist. quotes, $.05 each plus connect ($.21/min).  a new plan is
about to begin where for $9.95 you get quotes for $.01 (current and
hist.).

I use the alt. pricing plan since most of what you get in the standard
plan doesn't interest me.  There are software packages you can get
(some shareware) that do the quote stuff automatically (and fast).
I'm only looking into this now and don't have much info about these
programs.

There are of course other premium surcharges for various market
reports.



-- 
Pierre von Kaenel  |  Math & CS Dept | Skidmore College | pvonk@skidmore.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
1983 game ads from PC Connection : Temple of Apshai, Curse of Ra, Zork,
Deadline, Frogger, Call to Arms, Tigers in the Snow, Apple Panic; $15-$35
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: vvsvdoc@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (MICHAEL SEESE)
Subject: Re: Load Funds
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date:  5 Jan 1993 08:58 EST  

Something to keep in mind in all this discussion on load vs. no-load funds. 
While I personally hate spending money on something I don't have to, when 
choosing a mutual fund, also consider the fund's past performance.  In 
short, what would you consider to be a better investment: an 8% loaded fund 
that *consistently* has yearly returns of 30%, or a no-load fund that 
consistently returns 10%? 

It's your own decision (and of course, past performance is no guarantee of 
future performance).  Just something else to think about.
From: chang-mark-yan-ming@cs.yale.edu (Mark Yan-Ming Chang)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: load computed in performance?
Date: 7 Jan 1993 10:58:32 -0500
Organization: Yale University Computer Science Dept., New Haven, CT 06520-2158
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: na-gw.cs.yale.edu


Seems that load is not computed into the performance figures. For example, in
today's WSJ:

Fund			load	4th quarter performance
Magellan		3%	5.25%
Fidelity Denstiney I	8.98	7.11
United: Income		8.5	7.55

S&P500			0	5.02

I don't think the 4th quarter performance takes into account of the 
sales charge. If it is the case, then the figure is misleading.

What do you think?
-- 
--- Mark (changym@cs.Yale.edu, decvax!yale!changym, changym@YaleCS.BITNET)
From: jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: Morningstar
Date: 6 Jan 1993 04:12:17 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, shag@aero.org (Robert M. Unverzagt) says:

>In article <1icgbtINN936@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> jxs18@po.CWRU.Edu (Jerry Sy) writes:
>> I have read nothing but good comments about Morningstar here in
>> misc.invest.  and I have no doubt that it does a good job.
>> 
>> but should one be concerned because the fund review you are reading
>> can be up to 2 months  (actually 18-20 weeks old) old ? and a lot of
>> things could have happened during that time ?
>> 
>
>If you're not in for the long haul, you'd probably want some
>"hot fund".  Of course, todays hot fund could be tomorrow's
>dog -- the name of the fund escapes me (Mathers, maybe?), but
>a short while ago it was the one year return leader, and the
>next it was a dog -- the manager's high cash position helped
>him one year, and hurt him the next.
>
>If up-to-the day Morningstar data helps you pick the fund, you
>probably don't want a mutual fund anyway -- pick your own
>stocks!  If a change in the second decimal place will determine
>if you invest or not, you have a pretty fine tuned system.
>
>Shag
>
but the point is that if say a bond fund has great record, but interest
is beginning to rise, would you still buy the fund based on a good 3 month,
6 month record ? that's why I question the currentness of the information
in Morningstar.  

Its like you are saying since this fund performed well in the past 10 years,
then I should go ahead and invest.  But I'd rather go with the logic of,
although the fund performs well, why put my money in when the fund is
experiencing a decline (like flushing your money down the toilet).  and
instead put the money someplace where it will be safe before putting
it in the fund later on when it is a good time so that you will have a
good start.

comments ?

jerry
From: chedley@rigel.cs.pdx.edu (Chedley A. Aouriri)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: How can I profit by investing $20?
Summary: EE savings bonds
Date: 8 Jan 93 04:18:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: pdxgate.6671

In article <1993Jan7.031028.1533@walter.bellcore.com> jchen@ctt.bellcore.com writes:
>
>|> Hi Experts:
>|> 
>|> 	At this moment, I have just $20 in my pocket. I can not take
>|> 
>
Borrow $5, and buy a $50 face value EE-bond from the nearest bank. 
Currently, EE bonds yield about 6% (much better than savings accounts, 
T-bills or money market funds) and can be bought in minimum units of $25.
.CHEDLEY..  chedley@cs.pdx.edu
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Standard Disclaim: The above statements and opinions are strictly mine,
and do not represent any organization's position.
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: Dmerrill@bnr.ca (Dana Merrill)
Subject: Re: Misc.Invest sentiment
Followup-To: misc.invest
Organization: BNR
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:33:46 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.041308.7119@vela.acs.oakland.edu>,
temiraso@vela.acs.oakland.edu (thomas e mirasol) wrote:
> 
> In article <6chi03BSc8am00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com> fierro@uts.amdahl.com (Doug Fierro) writes:
> >In article <1993Jan10.005418.22005@leland.Stanford.EDU> bohnert@leland.Stanford.EDU (matthew bohnert) writes:
> >>Having read misc.invest for several years, I would like to add my
> >>two cents worth on a sentiment indicator. 
> >>
> >>IMHO, the number of new posts that involve ...`I'm new to investing,
> >>how do I get started in the stock market', or `...I'd think I'd like
> >>to trade stocks for the first time, how do I open an account...', etc., etc., 
> >>is hitting an all-time high in recent weeks.  I'm not trying to insult or 
> >>offend anyone, but many contrarians see the flood of newcomers to the market 
> >>as an indicator of peaks.  Perhaps just one more log on the fire, I guess.
> >>
> >>Of course, I could be wrong.
> >>
> >
> >  Could be attributed to a lot of things:
> >
> >  1) more people have net access now than a year or two ago.
> >
> >  2) interest rates on investments in which the principal is not
> >     at risk basically suck, and as more CDs come due, more people
> >     might want to find alternative investment possibilities that
> >     pay more than 3-4% a year (and willing to take the associated
> >     risk along with that decision).
> >
> >  3) More people in the technological industries are coming into
> >     money that they did not have to play with in the past- a
> >     possible indicator that the recession is/was not as harsh
> 
> >     on the people in those industries?  (since the net is not
> >     a real representative of the U.S. population, it's hard to
> >     say on this one).
> >
> >  4) People don't know what the hell a FAQ list is :-)
> >
> >   etc..
> >   etc..
> >
> >  Doug
> >-- 
> 
> Here's my two cents worth:
> 
> 1.  This may just be an affirmation that baby boomers are now more aware
>     and concerned about their future and their children's future and
>     are are now starting to think about investing for it.
> 
>     Just today, Comerica Bank in Michigan announced the acquisition  of
>     First of Michigan, a brokerage firm.  Just recently, the same bank
>     merged with Manufacturer's Bank (also of MI).  Radio reports said
>     that the bank foresees a boom in investments by  BBs.

OK, OK, so with all this new investment activity Charles Schwab's earnings
are going up, up, up!. Check out the trading volume in recent weeks!
 
EVERYONE BUY! . .    SCH   NYSE

(You guessed it, I already did, so lets push it on up!)

dam

==================================================================

Dana Merrill                                Bell Northern Research
DMerrill@BNR.CA                         Research Triangle Park, NC
==================================================================
Newsgroups: misc.invest,misc.taxes
From: acheng@ncsa.uiuc.edu (Albert Cheng)
Subject: Re: Need advice to lower taxes
Originator: acheng@shalom.ncsa.uiuc.edu
Organization: Nat'l Ctr for Supercomp App (NCSA) @ University of Illinois
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:09:55 GMT


In article <1993Jan8.122302.3646@hemlock.cray.com>, davew@willow03.cray.com (Dave Wagner) writes:
>
>What I don't understand (and correct me if I'm wrong), is that for a normal
>IRA (where you do *not* deduct the depoit's, only the interest is tax defered) -
>you can only invest $2000 per yr.  But you can open as many as you want.  Is
>this just a loophole that might be closed (i.e. the as many as you want).  If
>not why not get rid of the limit and make everyone's paperwork easier.  

You can have unlimited number of IRA's but the total contributions to
all these accounts cannot exceed $2000 per year.  Say, you have 4
IRA's, you can contribute $500 to each, totalling $2000.  If you
deposit more, you need to pay IRS 6% of the exceeding amount EACH year
until you have them withdrawn.  The total limit is the same whether the
contribution is deductible or not.  By the way, the limit does not
apply to rollover/transfer from IRA/pension/401K/etc.

Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: nenad@lagrange (Nenad Rijavec)
Subject: Re: Mutual Funds for Non Resident Aliens
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1993 17:31:04 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins

In article <Jan.5.17.31.31.1993.21895@gauss.rutgers.edu>, Rajesh Malhotra
(manmetha@gauss.rutgers.edu) asks about mutual fund investments for
nonresident aliens.

As far as I am aware, once you are classified as a nonresident alien for tax
purposes, it does not matter whether you actually live in the US or not.

I've been a nonresident alien (though living in the US) for a while (I am
thankfully changing to resident tax status for 1992). The best I've been
able to figure it out, the interest income for nonresident aliens in not
taxable. The capital gains are taxable at a flat rate (I think it was 30% in
1991). Nonresident aliens can invest in any mutual fund.

The major problem for someone not living in the US would be the lack of SSN
and the general pain of filing the tax return. Even though they may end up
paying no tax, I believe the return would still be necessary, as the funds
are obliged to withold from anything they pay out (even if the money is
reinvested).

I recommend strongly that you talk to someone at IRS. It may take you quite
a while to find someone who knows anything about nonresident aliens. I
worked all this out for the tax year 1991 when I started investing in mutual
funds, but bear in mind I am not an expert. If you find out anything
interesting, please post a summary.

Nenad
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nenad Rijavec, Department of Mathematics, Colorado State University,
Fort Collins, CO 80523, (303) 491-5803 or (303) 491-1303,
nenad@lagrange.math.colostate.edu
From: tbarnes@Teknowledge.COM (Terry A Barnes)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Re: 401K--to rollover or not?
Date: 6 Jan 93 02:37:47 GMT
Reply-To: tbarnes@teknowledge.com (Terry A Barnes)
Organization: Cimflex Teknowledge Corp., Palo Alto CA

>>A digress--what are the benefits of rolling an old 401K to a new 401K
>>when the money can be left in an IRA?  [...]
>
>Well, I can think of a few.  Most employers pay all the fees
>on their 401K plans so you can save the annual fees that many
>brokerages and banks charge for IRA's.  Also, some people might
>find it simpler to just have the one account.  A third reason
>might be that you can borrow against the 401K, but not the IRA.

Also, some funds will waive their loads for 401k plans but not IRAs.  For
example, I have load-free access to Fidelity Magellan Fund through my 401K
plan.
-- 
INTERNET:  tbarnes@teknowledge.com
  USENET:  {hplabs|sun|ucbvax|decwrl}!tbarnes%teknowledge.com
HARDCOPY:  Cimflex Teknowledge, 1810 Embarcadero Road, Palo Alto, CA 94303
   PHONE:  (415) 424-0500 x416     FAX:  (415) 493-2645
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: temiraso@vela.acs.oakland.edu (thomas e mirasol)
Subject: Re: Need address for Fidelity Investments
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester MI.
Distribution: misc
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 02:42:29 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.082250.5385@jpl-devvax.jpl.nasa.gov> bowles@shaula.is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Eric E. Bowles) writes:
>Would some kind netter email me the postal address for 
>
>	Fidelity Investments?  
>
>I've checked through their advertisements in magazines and can only find 
>an 800 number (which isn't of any use where I am).
>

82 Devonshire Street
Boston, MA 02109
From: USENET@proj.asmp.msk.su (Victor V. Agroskin)
Newsgroups: misc.invest
Subject: Payments by funds
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 93 00:36:04 +0300
Distribution: world
Organization: Association of Securities Market Participants
Reply-To: USENET@proj.asmp.msk.su

     Forgive me my totally noninteresting question, but you
are the only gurus available for me in my remote (from the
stock market, I mean :) country.
     Can you tell me what is an average frequency of dividend
payments among various funds in US? Are monthly payments common?
Can you chose fund with weekly distributions, or this is nonsense?
     With New Year wishes,
     Victor V. Agroskin              vvagr@proj.asmp.msk.su
     Moscow, Russia


Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: danj@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (Dan Jackson)
Subject: Re: IRA rollover rule changes for 1993?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 16:26:56 GMT

From article <1992Dec28.204605.13073@cc.gatech.edu>, by barrett@cc.gatech.edu (James Barrett):
> Question:  Does the 20% holding charge for rollovers of 401(k) which
> will take affect next week also affect transfers of one IRA account 
> to another trustee?

No.
The 20% withholding rule only applies to Employer pension plans.
That is, 401(k), pension, profit-sharing, KEOGH and ESOPs.  The
IRS requires the Employer to send 20% to the goverment as a credit
against taxes due.

The key to the new rule is really "who the check is made out to".
At no point can a check be made out to YOU.  All checks must be
made from TRUSTEE to TRUSTEE.
-- 

Dan Jackson            AT&T Somerset NJ, USA
danj@cbnewsg.att.com   (908)-805-1461
Newsgroups: misc.invest
From: peterhe@microsoft.com (Peter Henriksen)
Subject: Holding on to gains/losses (WAS: < $5000:don't buy stock?)
Date: 07 Jan 93 19:08:23 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Worldwide Products Group
Distribution: usa

In article <1993Jan6.152340.8004@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> keith@iscp.bellcore.com (Keith Hawkins) writes:
>   For example, putting only $700 dollars in a given issue would require
>   that the stock rise at least 10% before one reaches a break-even point
>   Why?  With a miminum commission of $35, the turn-around cost is $70.

Maybe I'm stupid, but I don't get it...  If you pay $35 in commission,
don't you start making money as soon as your stock has risen $35 (or 5-6%)?

>If one should be so fortunate as to have a stock rise 25-30%
>in price, one should raise the sell point to assure that one locks in
>some profits.   So if a stock is up 25%, one should say to oneself "if
>the price falls
>so that the gain falls from 25% to 15%, I will sell and take the 15%
>profit."
>Resist the urge to let it ride and hope it will go back to a 25% gain
>again.  More
>likely than not, you will watch a 15% gain become a 10% gain which will
>become
>a 5% gain which will become a 5% loss which will become a great source
>of irritation.

I don't necessarily agree with that.  If you have a stock that's posting
small, but steady, gains, 15% can be a solid gain on a couple of years, and
selling to take profits may be in order.  If, on the other hand, you have
a fast growing stock that's growing in leaps and bounds and is severely
undervalued (with good fundamentals, of course) when you buy it, 25% could
very well be a very small gain for that stock and bailing out too early
could mean missing out on much larger gains (several 100% is not unheard
of, although probably not over 2 years...).  Again, this depends on one's
appetite for risk and might produce all sorts of headaches while one hangs
on for the ride :-)

>-Keith
-- 
Peter Henriksen, Microsoft Int'l Products Group
uunet!microsoft!peterhe  peterhe@microsoft.uucp 
Newsgroups: misc.invest