HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: EPLUS17@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (Richard Engelbrecht-Wiggans)
Subject: Re: New AC Rules
Organization: C.C.S.O.
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 02:13:49 GMT

In article <1ihuqqINNt19@male.EBay.Sun.COM>
jeffh@nonsuch.EBay.Sun.COM (Jeff Huntington) writes:
 
>In article 62524@cc.usu.edu, hal@kaos.declab.usu.edu (000200 Lynch) writes:
>> In article <lkk8ofINN59m@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM>, billc@sextant.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill Courington) writes:
>> |>
>> |>The crews might strike.  Sailing off the coast of San Diego
>> |>at night is a maddening business that all too often can be
>> |>summarized in a single (rather wonderful) word:  slatting.
>>                                                    ---------
>>
>> I give.  Whats slatting?
>
>Think of the worst thing you can experience in a sail boat (without putting the
>mast in the water or the keel on the bottom) and you have slatting. :-) ;-)
>
>Jeff Huntington
 
The worst thing that I can think of is, when in sufficiently cold
weather, your wet suit freezes so solidly to the boat that you can't
budge without tearing the suit to pieces.  I froze to my dinghy a
couple of days ago, and spent some time trying to chose between
1) risk tearing the suit or 2) bring the boat around and see if she
would stay upright with me frozen to the lee side.  A gust of wind
solved the problem for me; I instinctively reacted and became
unstuck without serious damage to my equipment.
 
Is this "slatting," or is there something even worse that can
befall me while sailing?
 
..Richard E+17
 
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: gerard@progress.COM (Gerard Bras)
Subject: Re: inverter and battery use
Keywords: inverter dc battery life
Organization: Progress Software Corp.
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 15:45:44 GMT

mshulman@genghis.borland.com (Michael Shulman) writes:

>Hello, all:

>My brother just took delivery of a Catalina 36 with 3 deep cycle 900 A/H 
>batteries and an inverter. Since he's interested in "Creature Comforts", 
>he's outfitted the boat with
>   color tv
>   vcr
>   microwave oven
>   AC track lights
>etc.

You didn't ask my opinion but it's New Years Eve. The hell with restraint.  IMO,
Barf, retch, gag, especially the track lights.

>I wanted to help him be able to estimate the amount of life he can expect 
>from his batteries. I told him that since P = I * E
>	where P is power in watts
>	and I is current in amps
>        and E is voltage,

You are forgetting power factor. 1/2 :-).  For purely resistive loads the power factor
is 100%.  For reactive loads it decreases.  The lights are purely resistive and the TV
and VCR are probably pretty close too, the nuker I'm not sure about.

>that his running his 600W microwave for 1 hr at 110V (which takes approx 6A/
>H, right), that if we estimate the efficiency of his inverter at 50% (pretty 
>conservative), that he should be able to run his microwave for 37 hours, 
>even using only half the charge of his batteries:

>         microwave takes: 6A/H
>         inverter 50% efficiency: 12A/H
>         battery (50% of total): 450A/H
>         so, you can get 37 hours.

>But then I thought, that can't be right. Intuitively, it seems like it 
>should be closer to 3 or 4 hours.

Your'e right, that's wrong.  But you do have sound instincts.

>What am I doing wrong in my calculations?

Forgetting that 1A @120V is roughly equivalent to 10A @@12V.  When you factor
the current conversion it come out to the three to four hours you expected.
One thing though, your'e not giving much credit to the inverter.  As I recall it
efficiency tends to be more lik 80-90%, some even better.

>And what items are going to be really expensive to run off the inverter?

All of them.  No kidding.  Appliances made for shoreside use are as a rule gross
power hogs.  Gear that's designed for battery or low voltage operation tends
to be *much* more efficient.  

cheers,
gerard
From: vour@wkuvx1.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Trailer for Catalina 22
Date: 11 Jan 93 16:59:06 CST
Organization: Western Kentucky University, Bowling Green, KY

     I have only recently discovered this newsgroup and now ask for your
assistance in a small dilemma. I am looking for a trailer for a 1984
Catalina 22 sailboat.  I would appreciate hearing from anyone who has
one for sale or knows of one that is for sale.  I would prefer that
the trailer be located within 350 miles of Nashville, TN.  

                                      Thanks,
                                      G. Vourvopoulos

U.S. Mail -- George Vourvopoulos
             Western Kentucky Univ.
             Dept. of Physics and Astronomy
             Bowling Green, Ky.  42101

EMail -  Vour@WKUVX1.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: thompson@atlas.socsci.umn.edu (T. Scott Thompson)
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Reply-To: thompson@atlas.socsci.umn.edu
Organization: Economics Department, University of Minnesota
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 19:31:37 GMT

youngqud@ucs.orst.edu (Dean Youngquist) writes:

>Regarding the recent grounding of a large oil tanker in (I think) the 
>Shetland Islands, how is it possible for a ship to be driven onto the rocks ?
>Was is actually driven into land while using maximum power and while attempting
>to travel directly away from land, into the swells and wind ?

My understanding is that the tanker had only one engine, which failed.
It was then driven onto the rocks by hurricane force winds before
local tugboats could get to it.  Apparently the captain did not
violate any of the local rules governing tankers, which require
tankers to be 10 miles offshore at that point.  I did hear one
commentator who questioned whether it was wise to take an older single
engine tanker into those waters under those conditions, since the oil
terminal was closed, and it may have been possible to weather the
storm more safely further out to sea.  (The tanker was arriving from
Norway.)  The pictures on television last night showed the tanker
apparently breaking up with its decks completely awash in 25 foot
seas.
--
T. Scott Thompson              email:  thompson@atlas.socsci.umn.edu
Department of Economics        phone:  (612) 625-0119
University of Minnesota        fax:    (612) 624-0209
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: steve@bcrvmpc2.vnet.ibm.com
Subject: Re: Chicago Boat Show
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:35:01 GMT
News-Software: IBM OS/2 PM RN (NR/2) v0.16 by O. Vishnepolsky and R. Rogers
Reply-To: steve@bcrvmpc2.vnet.ibm.com
Organization: IBM, Research Triangle Park, North Carolina

The Catalina 22 has a great rep and there are a million of them out
there.  You can find good used ones for about 3.5k and up ready
to sail.

I've read Practical Sailor's review on the Hunter 23.5 and
they said that it did not sail to windward very well and
in stiffer breezes it wasn't very stable.

I've also read the reviews on the Santana 2023 by Schock, it's
supposed to be a very nice boat in the same class as the Hunter
and Catalina, haven't seen one tho'

Steve                   Steve Weingart        IBM Boca Raton
                        steve@bcrvmpc2.vnet.ibm.com

It's bad enough that I think these things, please don't think it's
my employer's opinion too.
From: davea@hpscit.sc.hp.com (Dave Angelini)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:52:36 GMT
Subject: Re: Who's planning a cruise? Where and When?
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara, CA
Newsgroups: rec.boats


   My better half and I are off to Mexico this fall for a year on the   
Gold coast and Sea of Cortez. We have been planning this for two years
and the list is a still a mile long. The SF boat shows are this month so
we are busy buying the gear to finish the escape vehicle. After Mexico
we plan to transit the Panama Canal. We still don't know if we will
turn right for Venezsula or head to the West Indies.

Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: gilgan@ug.cs.dal.ca (Tommy Gilgan)
Subject: boat kits in CANADA
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 15:36:36 GMT

I am interested in building a small boat from a kit.
specifically, my dad gave me some old info he had
on the MIRROR class dinghhy. does anyone have an address
for them (the mirror sailing company(franchise)) in CANADA?
does anyone have an address of any companies
that have kits in Canada?.. I have some addresses in
the States but paying duty/shipping/etc... becomes a 
Huge hassle and a major expense as well.

anyone build any of these little kits?, I'd be interested in 
hearing from anyone who had.

Thanks,

Tom Gilgan


gilgan@ug.cs.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: dwl@watson.ibm.com (David W. Levine)
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1993 19:44:27 GMT
Reply-To: dwl@watson.ibm.com 
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM Thomas J. Watson Research Center

In article <1ihsv1INNo0s@gaia.ucs.orst.edu>, youngqud@ucs.orst.edu (Dean
Youngquist) writes:
|> Regarding the recent grounding of a large oil tanker in (I think) the 
|> Shetland Islands, how is it possible for a ship to be driven onto the
rocks ?
|> Was is actually driven into land while using maximum power and while
attempting
|> to travel directly away from land, into the swells and wind ?
|> 
|> -Dean

The tanker in question had a complete power failure and was driven onto
shore purely by the action of the wind and waves. Not terribly hard
to do, given hurricane force winds at the time of the accident. 

David W. Levine --  dwl@watson.ibm.com  -- IBM Thomas J. Watson Research Center
                   -- My Opinions, IBM's hardware. -- 
"Fanaticism consists in redoubling your efforts when you have forgotten your
aim" - George Santayana
From: bobp@cherise.UUCP (Robert Parkinson)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Date: 8 Jan 93 16:45:21 GMT
Reply-To: bobp@cherise.UUCP (Robert Parkinson)
Organization: S&R Software, Incorporated

In article <ZPOPE.93Jan7143856@sloop.osf.org> zpope@osf.org writes:
>In article <1ihsv1INNo0s@gaia.ucs.orst.edu> youngqud@ucs.orst.edu (Dean Youngquist) writes:
>
>>   Regarding the recent grounding of a large oil tanker in (I think) the  
>>   Shetland Islands, how is it possible for a ship to be driven onto the
>>   rocks ?  Was is actually driven into land while using maximum power and
>>   while attempting to travel directly away from land, into the swells and
>>   wind ? 
>
>In this case the ship had lost engine power.  The crew was already off by
>the time the ship hit the rocks.  I don't have charts of the area but from
>what I've understood so far the ship was in a channel 22 miles wide between
>the Shetlands and Scotland in some very nasty weather.  Don't know how or
>why it lost power.  
>=bill

On _All Things Considered_ last night they did a short piece on
the Shetlands grounding. All of the tanker's crew had been taken off
before the tug(s) arrived on scene. The tug capptain was critical
of that decision, because he was unable to get a line on the
tanker without any crew there, and felt that a skeleton crew
should have remained aboard. He also, I think, said he could have
saved her. I can see his point, although I'm not sure I would have 
liked to ride her down onto the rocks after seeing film of her on the 
news with decks awash.

Locally, a merchant ship recently went agound at the mouth of the Patapsco,
outbound from Baltimore. Some tugs pulled her off with a rising tide.
My understanding is that ships in the Chesapeake always have a pilot
aboard - anyone know if this is true? My worry about this is that
in reduced visibility, one tool I use to avoid being run down
by the 'Crush_you Maru' or one of her sisters is to stay well
clear of their channels. Now, if they're driving all over the
place, I feel less confident of sharing the Bay with them in fog
or at night.

Bob Parkinson
bobp@sandr.com
From: pavlov@niktow.canisius.edu (Greg Pavlov)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Date: 12 Jan 93 08:10:53 GMT
Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208

In article <29582@oasys.dt.navy.mil>, michaels@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Robert Michaelson) writes:
> In rec.boats, stefan@leland.Stanford.EDU (Stefan Michalowski) writes:
> >Some teeth are being gnashed over the abandonment of the Braer by her
> >crew. I wonder how many gnashers have experienced the terror of being
> >in a powerless ship during a really big storm? How many of them would
> >wave off a rescue chopper, knowing that it might be their last act?
> > ..........
> 
> AMEN!
> 
  To me, their is a fundamental problem with gratuitously calling the crew
  members "chicken" and otherwise blaming the disaster on their actions: the
  people who do so very neatly play into the hands of a shipping industry that
  has strenuously resisted implementing measures to avoid such accidents and/or
  to minimize/lessen the negative effects when they do occur.  If the general
  public can be convinced that nothing would have happened if only the coward-
  ly crew didn't abandon ship, it is unlikely to look at the reasons why the
  crew was put into that situation in the first place.


   greg pavlov
   pavlov@fstrf.org
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 21:03:48 EST
From: William H Parsonage <W5P@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: SAFE BOATING COURSE, STATE COLLEGE, PA.

SAFE BOATING COURSE OFFERED IN STATE COLLEGE, PA.

Fishermen, hunters, campers and all persons who enjoy
recreational boating--whether boating activity takes place
on inland lakes, rivers and creeks or on coastal waters, will
find that taking the United States Power Squadron Boating
Course is an investment in safe recreational experiences.

The eight (8) session course will be held on Thursdays,
starting February 4th from 7:30 to 9:30 pm at the High
School, South (south side of Westerly Parkway) in State
College.  There is no cost for instruction; however, there
is a nominal charge for text material.

Additional information, or to pre-register, call Arnie Becker,
Boating Course Chairman, 466-6413 or Squadron Education Officer
Phil Dolsen, 238-8914.
From: paulh@tekcae.cax.tek.com (Paul Hammer)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Coast Guard Boating Tax, NOT!
Date: 5 Jan 93 03:06:35 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

>The Coast Guard can board you whenever they want in US coastal
>waters. They have special rights which police, FBI don't have.
>>Does the Coast Guard Auxiliary have the same privileges? Also, in case

No.  The CG Aux. has no "enforcement authority".  And in most
cases they are smart enough to like it that way.

-rickf
From: cote@cs.ucsd.edu (Brad Cote)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Date: 8 Jan 93 01:51:50 GMT

pyron@skndiv.dseg.ti.com (Dillon Pyron) writes:

>Nobody drove the ship, it was driven by wind and sea.  The crew had already
>abandonded ship, without setting an anchor or waiting for a tug.  I hope the
>inquest smokes the master.

>BTW.  NPR reported this morning that winds were so strong that pastures two
>miles inland were being soaked with oil!!!

If the wind was that strong, no anchor would have held. I would have
gotten off the ship 'at the first opportunity' also. So would you.
They left when the British coast gaurd came to rescue them.

                                      Brad Cote'
                                      UCSD Stare Project

Snipe #19390
Laser #32150
From: distef@carson.u.washington.edu (Sandra Distefano)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Coast Guard Boating Tax, NOT!
Date: 5 Jan 93 00:58:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: shelley.1iamerINNc99
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: carson.u.washington.edu

pavlov@niktow.canisius.edu (Greg Pavlov) writes:

>In article <CARL.92Dec24152359@atlantis.Cayman.COM>, carl@Cayman.COM (Carl Heinzl) writes:
>> 
>> Except that the border patrol can only check you out when you're
>> crossing the border not when you're just approaching it.  
>> 
>> So, unless you leave US Coastal Waters, they (the Coast Guard) should
>> not be able to board you unless they have reasonable probable cause .....

The Coast Guard can board you whenever they want in US coastal waters.
They have special rights which police, FBI don't have.  They don't need
"probable cause".  They can stop and search you because they
want to search for drugs or safety violations.

Sandra
distef@u.washington.edu
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: dave@rsd.dl.nec.com (Dave Rogers)
Subject: New AC Rules
Organization: BINJFBA Society
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:28:24 GMT


In case ya'll didn't see it in the Jan 1993 issue of Crusing World.
There are some interesting developments in the offing for the next
America's Cup.  A joint committee of challengers and defenders has
issued proposed new rules to cover some of the oversights in the
previous AC.  These are not approved yet but it seems that they will be. 
They are mostly geared toward reducing the costs.  The major ones are:

	- max of two new boats
	- strict limitations on nationality of participants
	- ban on use of titanium
	- max weight of all sails on board limited
	- single jury for LV Cup and AC
	- max of 75 crew (ashore and afloat)
	- no keel skirting allowed
	- no espionage allowed
	- elimination of the Z leg
	- limitation on exotic designs 
	   (such as the new J Boats spinaker pole)
	

===============================================================================
Dave Rogers                    				       
M & R Software, Inc.
Internet:   dave@rsd.dl.nec.com
On contract to: NEC America, Radio Software Dept

Don't take life too seriously; you're not going to get out of it alive anyway.
From: jeffh@nonsuch.EBay.Sun.COM (Jeff Huntington)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Hudson -> Erie, etc. (was: Who's plann
Date: 6 Jan 1993 19:13:12 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: jeffh@nonsuch.EBay.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: nonsuch.ebay.sun.com

In article 13025@MorningStar.Com, dean@MorningStar.Com (Dean Schell) writes:
> >In article <1993Jan6.001931.23647@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> rpw@uvacs.cs.Virginia.EDU (Ray Wagner) writes:
> >>Speaking of crusing, if anybody has done the Hudson River,
> >>Erie Canal, Great Lakes, Ohio River, Mississipi and Ten-Tom,
> >>I'd like to have a chat. We'd like to do that one, but I
> >>think I might have to carry it from Erie PA to the Ohio...
> 
> Although Ohio at one time had a canal system that did allow canal boats
> to travel from Lake Erie to the Ohio, I know that today there is no way
> to get from Lake Erie down to the Ohio River using Ohio's rivers unless
> maybe you have a canoe and are willing to handle some long portages. 
> 
> However, I seem to recall reading somewhere that the Chicago River
> connects to the Illinois River which connects to the Mississippi and
> thence to the Gulf.  Although once again that route may be fit only for 
> a canoe.  Anybody know for sure?
> 
> -dean


I don't know all of the details off the top fo my head, but it is certainly 
possible to go by fairly large boat from the Hudson River, to the Great Lakes,
to Chicago, and then down the rivers to the Gulf.  I believe, however, that
the Mississippi is not the river of choice.  The people I know who have done
it have taken the Tombigbee (sp?), among other rivers.  This is part of the
trip we are planning to make in several years.

Jeff Huntington


Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: gybeho@engin.umich.edu (John Senger)
Subject: Bahamas cruising
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 93 10:13:24 EST
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

Just another posting about going cruising.  A group of us are
chartering a catamaran in the Bahamas the last week of February.
Since none of us have done any sailing there, I'm looking for
advice on good anchorages, snorkeling/dive sites, and any other
information/helpful tips people out there can give us.  Please
email responses to: gybeho@engin.umich.edu

Thanks and smooth sailing to everyone!


-- 
John Senger                     

May the seas be calm, the wind at your back, and the beer truck
not far behind
From: siegrist@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Frank Siegrist)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: New AC Rules
Date: 6 Jan 93 11:59:17 GMT
Reply-To: siegrist@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Frank Siegrist)
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In rec.boats, dave@rsd.dl.nec.com (Dave Rogers) writes:
>In case ya'll didn't see it in the Jan 1993 issue of Crusing World.
>There are some interesting developments in the offing for the next
>America's Cup....
>   stuff deleted

How about just setting budget limits, i.e. $X for hull, $Y for sails
$Z for electronics, etc.  This has the added advantage of bringing in
to the AC's a new class of people, the "Accountants".  So far the bean
counters haven't had any oppurtunity to really get involved and they
probably feel left out. :^).
			    Happy Boating in the New Year.
					     Frank
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: L629159@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Organization: Lockheed Missiles & Space Company, Inc.
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 93 11:29:04 PST

From: torsten@unisql.UUCP (Torsten Weirich)

   Regarding the recent grounding of a large oil tanker in (I think) the
..

Alcohol, equipment reliability, stupidity;-) ;-)

Torsten Weirich


  The above, of course.  However, some years ago, while living in Beirut,
I watched for several hours as a freighter tried to get off a lee shore.
The waves were so sized and spaced that as the ship went over the crests,
her stern came completely clear of the water.  Her screws did not
provide much thrust in air, naturally.  She was about three miles off
the coast when I noticed her at about 7:00 PM, and was aground before
dawn.  Moral:  Read the weather forecast carefully.  Give yourself
plenty of sea room.  An Engine is not a guarentee of safety on a lee shore.

Al Moore
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: M14031@mwvm.mitre.org (Alan Jacobsen)
Subject: Wanted: to buy 36' S2 + Information
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Distribution: USA
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:01:10 GMT


I have recently sailed a 36' S2 Center cockpit from Bermuda to US.  Very 
impressed with it's ability to weather storms.  Am interested in purchasing if price (and condition) is reasonable.  Center or rear cockpit OK.  If you have a boat on the East coast and a desire to sell, please contact me via e-mail or snail-mail at 5315 Massachusetts Ave Bethesda, MD 20816.

Also interested to hear from 36' S2 owners.  Likes, dislikes, advice desired.

Usual disclamer goes here!
From: cbarr@coyote.sw.stratus.com (Chris Barr)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Oil Tanker Grounding
Date: 8 Jan 1993 17:44:12 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Software Engineering
NNTP-Posting-Host: coyote.sw.stratus.com

In article <29996@castle.ed.ac.uk> ercn72@festival.ed.ac.uk (R.J.Hare) writes:

>   the reason for the choice of route was simply that this route would under
>   normal circumstances minimise fuel consumption on the trip.

>3) Unfortunately, despite what was said in another post, the vessel had every
>   right to be where she was. This channel is a normal shipping lane.

>4) My guess is that the ships officers delayed calling up the salvage tugs
>   just a bit too long (these guys charge big money), and by the time they did
>   call up the tugs, they had to abandon before the tugs got there.

A local Scottish official, very sympathetic to ecological concerns,
said the boat should have gone around the northern tip of the island,
the longer approach, because it had only one engine, which in
that weather could result in the current circumstance.  This was
on BBC radio the day after the grounding.  Apparently the oil
industry there has been very successul in implementing environmental
controls.