HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bdb@becker.GTS.ORG (Bruce Becker)
Subject: Re: RFD: alt.ethnic-war
Reply-To: han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu)
Organization: G. T. S., Toronto, Ontario
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 18:31:48 GMT

In article <9208160157.A7466wh@anadolu.michigan.com> han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu) writes:
|
|<ZN7JPB5w165w@willard.UUCP>
|dawson@willard.UUCP
|
|>Boards???  Ah, that's what happens when you let the unwashed masses into the
|>Usenet.  Perhaps the problem really lies with allowing PCBoards to gate Usenet
|
|Personally, I'd reserve judgement before accepting 'Pol*'s drivel as
|true. 'Pol*' has been known to fabricate and lie when it serves his 
|interests to do so. Besides, he is a historical revisionist and a 
|genocide apologist.



$    $
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$   $    $       $       $                  $    $    $     $    $    $
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 $$$$$   $$$$$      $    $    $  $$$$$$  $                $$$$   $    $   $$$$$
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                                $     $
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          $$$$   $              $     $  $$$$$$  $    $   $$$$    $$$


  $$$$    $   $   $$$$     $$    $$$$$   $    $     $    $    $
 $         $ $   $        $  $   $    $  $$  $$     $    $$   $
  $$$$      $     $$$$   $    $  $    $  $ $$ $     $    $ $  $
      $     $         $  $$$$$$  $    $  $    $     $    $  $ $
 $    $     $    $    $  $    $  $    $  $    $     $    $   $$
  $$$$      $     $$$$   $    $  $$$$$   $    $     $    $    $



Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,soc.culture.greek,talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.europe,soc.history
From: bdb@becker.GTS.ORG (Bruce Becker)
Subject: Re: RFD: alt.ethnic-war.greeks-turks
Reply-To: han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu)
Organization: G. T. S., Toronto, Ontario
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:01:08 GMT

In article <9208121716.A3543BV@anadolu.michigan.com> han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu) writes:
|
|<SMITTIE.92Aug12121631@beach.csulb.edu>
|smittie@beach.csulb.edu (Smittie)
|
|>Of course, I guess the possibility exists that Mutlu is being paid by some
|>terrorist group to propagate their, and his, propaganda via this medium.
|
|Your consciousness is so raised you float. Let me give you a terrorist
|tone.



@@@@@@                    @@@
@     @   @@@@   @    @   @@@     @@@@@          @@@@@    @@@@    @@@@    @@@@@
@     @  @    @  @@   @    @        @            @    @  @    @  @          @
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@     @  @    @  @  @ @             @            @@@@@   @    @       @     @
@     @  @    @  @   @@             @            @       @    @  @    @     @
@@@@@@    @@@@   @    @             @            @        @@@@    @@@@      @


  @@@@@  @    @     @     @@@@            @@@@   @@@@@     @@    @@@@@
    @    @    @     @    @               @    @  @    @   @  @   @    @
    @    @@@@@@     @     @@@@           @       @    @  @    @  @    @
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                        @     @
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    @     @@@@          @     @  @@@@@@  @    @   @@@@    @@@

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@     @   @   @   @@@@     @@    @@@@@   @    @     @    @    @
@          @ @   @        @  @   @    @  @@  @@     @    @@   @
 @@@@@      @     @@@@   @    @  @    @  @ @@ @     @    @ @  @
      @     @         @  @@@@@@  @    @  @    @     @    @  @ @
@     @     @    @    @  @    @  @    @  @    @     @    @   @@
 @@@@@      @     @@@@   @    @  @@@@@   @    @     @    @    @




-- 
  ,u,	 Bruce Becker			Toronto, Ontario
a /i/	 Internet: bdb@becker.gts.org	Uucp: ...!web!becker!bdb
 `\o\-e	 "We want the worm, and we want a cow!"
 _< /_	 	- More Jimison, ordering drinks for his table
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,talk.politics.mideast,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.greek,soc.history
From: jisrawi@PHYSICS.RUTGERS.EDU
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Algeria Vs. the US hypocrisy -From NYT-
Date: 18 Aug 92 17:06:36 GMT


                     *********************************
                     *                               * 
                     * New York Times editorial page *
                     *         7/24/92               *
                     *                               *
                     *********************************

When Algeria's army staged a coup in January, heading off an anticipated 
Islamic electoral triumph, Washington, like other Western governments, winked.
 
Apologists for the coup warned of frightening consequences if Algeria's 
Islamic Salvation Front had been allowed to compete. Though the Front's 
official leadership had promised conciliation and economic reform, apologists 
argued that radicals would soon have swept aside these moderates. Further 
elections would have been banned, foreign policy radicalized, market reforms 
diluted, human rights of non-believers abused.
 
It is of course impossible to know what would have happened had democracy been
permitted to run its course. Given the record of Islamic rule in Iran and the 
Sudan, such fears can scarcely be dismissed.
 
But there is no need to speculate about what's happened since Algeria's coup.
Elections remain suspended; elected local councils have been disbanded. Human 
rights have been trampled; thousands of Islamic militants spent weeks in 
desert prison camps (does this mean it is no more the case?). 
The army's strong-arm tactics have embarrassed, even discredited Islamic
moderates. And the Salvation Front has been radicalized. Last month's
Algeria's provisional president was assassinated, perheaps by Islamis militants
perhaps by army dissidents. His successor has just appointed a Socialist
planner to run the government.
The new prime Minister is known for his vocal criticism of free-market 
economics and of the International Monetary Fund.
 
In sum, the coup has accomplished almost everything the West did not want to 
see happen. Yet Western democracies remain silent. The new Algerian regime 
still welcomes foreign investment. The Islamic militants it persecutes are 
unlikely to seek refuge in Europe, as the Westernized elements might have 
under Islamic rule.
 
The West's attitude is remarkably shortsighted. Algeria's Islamic majority 
won't go away, nor will it become more democracy-minded when its electoral 
majorities are treated with contempt. Meanwhile, political instability is 
increasing.
 
The surest way out is an early return to the ballot box, with all parties free
to compete. America's Algeria policy needs to be revisited.
From: mikie@ocf.berkeley.edu (Michael C. Wu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Model X-Soviet Republic
Date: 15 Aug 1992 21:15:29 GMT
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: whirlwind.berkeley.edu


       I have done months of research on the Soviet Republics and
     have tracked down their paths towards independence.  My findings
     conclusively show that Armenia has satisfied all of the
     makings of a true democracy.  Armenia is the only nation in the
     Caucasus where a Government has not been overturned by a coup
     d'etat.  Armenia provides freedom of expression, press, and religion,
     not only to its Armenians but also to its minorities (Kurds, Yesedis,etc.)
       In addition, Armenia has proved itself as a nation full of economic
     potential, by providing its people with some of the fastest reforms in
     the CIS.
       Politically, and diplomatically, Armenia has handled itself in a
     manner in which even its neighbors (ie: turkey) can learn from.
     Armenia has between 100 and 150 nuclear war-heads, and has shown
     much restraint, even if often provoked, in the Azerbaijani (north of Iran)
     instability and chaos.  Azerbaijan has shown its willingness to be
     incorporated into turkey, and is currently trying to occupy southern
     Armenia for that end.  Indeed, Azerbaijan will then be connected to her
     fatherland.  Armenia, though, has held off declaring war on Azerbaijan
     as she recognizes the need to keep the CIS a workable unit.
       I salute Armenia and its people for showing to the world that
     nations can and should aspire to the American ideal of Democracy.

     Ictenlikle sizin,

     A Human
Xref: sparky soc.culture.turkish:8800 talk.politics.mideast:18519 talk.politics.soviet:6931 soc.culture.greek:7449 soc.culture.europe:7227 soc.history:7275
From: ptg2351@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Panos Tamamidis )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Mr. Mutlu, what is your point?
Date: 20 Aug 92 03:34:14 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.Bt9J92.K2F
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap) writes:

>In article <m0mKiO5-000MSVC@ddsw1.mcs.com> hbm@ddsw1.mcs.com (Hasan B. Mutlu) writes:
>>Source: Professor Stanford J. Shaw, 'The Jews of the Ottoman Empire and 
>>        the Turkish Republic,' New York University Press, New York (1991).

>[almost 500 lines of quote deleted]

>You seem to post tremendous amounts of material from Professor Shaw's
>book.  Are you trying to sell it?  Or are you looking to get sued for
>copyright infringement? (I think you'll have posted the entire book in
>another week!)

>And you never state what purpose you have in quoting all this
>material.  It seems to be pro-Jewish history, but then I see this
>signature at the bottom:

>>                     'Kill Turks and Kurds wherever you find them 
>>                      and in whatever circumstances you find them. 
>>                      Turkish children also should be killed as 
>>                      they form a danger to the Armenian nation.' 
>>                                     (Hamparsum Boyadjian - 1914)

>and I wonder what your real purpose is.

 Recently, Turkey has tried to improve its relations with Israel.  Mutlu
 got his order and material from his boss to start posting material 
 "proving" that Turkey has protected Jews, while Greeks have tried to
 "eradicate" from Greece.

 In the mean time, some propaganda about Armenians, Greeks, and Kurds, is
 in his program ...

>-- 
>   |)  David Charlap          


-- 
---> Panos Tamamidis
     University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
From: han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish,talk.politics.mideast,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.history
Subject: Re: What kind of people are Germans?
Date: 16 Aug 92 22:13:39 GMT





<1992Aug17.195334.24991@dscomsf.desy.de>
poser@vxdsyc.desy.de (Till Poser  -  ZEUS OFFLINE)

>soc.culture.europe have turned into. Actually, I remember reading responses
>by Turkish posters to M*u's drivel that were derisive and ridiculing. But
>those small signals, I suppose, were lost in the vast noise.  

Well, it's not for me to pass judgement on how you handled your grief
and lies. But it is for me to say that I am touched and comforted in a
strange way. Remember, 'Nazi Armenians?'


Hasan B-) Mutlu

                     'Kill Turks and Kurds wherever you find them 
                      and in whatever circumstances you find them. 
                      Turkish children also should be killed as 
                      they form a danger to the Armenian nation.' 
                                     (Hamparsum Boyadjian - 1914)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: isin kotu Irfan !
From: Hakki_Kocabas@kcbbs.gen.nz (Hakki Kocabas)
Date: 21 Aug 92 21:37:55 GMT
Organization: Kappa Crucis Unix BBS, Auckland, New Zealand

isin kotu Irfan, isin kotu..
now is the time for you to cry the agit:

"Gecti isyan ile omrum, ney halin varacak.
"Beni zebaniler elinden, simdi kim kurtaracak.

|-| /-\ |-< |-< |||

Xref: sparky soc.culture.turkish:8892 soc.culture.europe:7324
From: luciano@athos.Berkeley.EDU (Luciano Lavagno)
Subject: Re: Demostration in front of the White House (Re: AT's Head (UK)'s message to SERBS)
Followup-To: soc.culture.italian
Reply-To: luciano@athos.Berkeley.EDU (Luciano Lavagno)
Organization: UC Berkeley IC CAD Group
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:05:51 GMT

In article <415@ub-tky.UBSPD.CO.JP>, tobac@ub-tky.UBSPD.CO.JP (Bach Frederic)
writes:
>In article <BstGy8.Hyo@ecf.toronto.edu> blazic@ecf.toronto.edu (BLAZIC Joseph
>R) writes:
>
>Who gives a shit : stop the cross-postings (Please...)
Many do. And the topic is relevant to ALL the countries whose newsgroups are in
the distribution list. Learn to use the kill file.
And stop the abuse.
Luciano

-- 
Luciano Lavagno            luciano@ic.Berkeley.EDU            +1-510-642-5012
Dept. of EECS, 207-69 Cory Hall, Univ. of California, Berkeley, CA 94720, USA
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 17:33:48 EDT
From: <ITF@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: RE: Zaporozh Cossacks, etc

Dear Timur:

Thank you for your response.  My original question generated a lot of answers,
and I am very appreciative to everyone who took time to answer.  I guess my las
t posting was not written well, I understand that the respondents being intervi
ewed (and at the moment they are all women) are not Cossacks.  But the Cossacks
 play interesting roles in the historical memory and cultural motifs (did I spe
ll that right?) of the respondents.  I understand that the way this term is use
d varies (greatly between Jewish and Ukrainian respondents) and that the
historical realities may vary greatly from these images.  It is for this reason
 that I am interested in these images, and the role they play in the worldview
of the respondents.  I have also read some articles about the resurgence of "co
ssacks" (Russian, Ukrainian, other) in the republics of the former USSR and was
 interested in understanding this phenomina.  The correct use of the term "Coss
ack," or "Sich" is all the more important so that we can trace how these images
 became more generalized in different populations.  Again, thanks for your resp
onse.

Allen (itf@psuvm.psu.edu)
From: ken@Bridge.COM (Ken Hardy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet,talk.politics.soviet
Subject: Air controllers' strike may be postponed
Summary: Talks in progress
Keywords: air travel strike
Date: 14 Aug 92 14:50:40 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.soviet
Organization: Planet Earth

Vitaly Kovalev, first-class air traffic controller, is quoted by ITAR-
TASS today as saying, "It is quite probable that the strike will be
postponed for a month."  The situation is expected to be clarified only
after talks between the air traffic controllers union and v.p. Rutskoj,
which began this morning.  The only agreement reached so far is on the
controllers' demands on the creation of a state committee for the use
of air space and air traffic control; Rosaeronavigatsija.

This according to a report published by ITAR-TASS.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
From: yholbroo@nyx.cs.du.edu (Yash Holbrook)
Subject: Re: Email Access in Moscow
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 00:19:22 GMT

In article <ceWLz=q00VsDMPxldu@cs.cmu.edu> Katherine.Cox@cs.cmu.edu writes:
>
>Hi,
>
>I am going to be living in Moscow from Sep 92
>through May 93.  Can anyone tell me how I might
>get email access while I am over there.  I will

try mailing a guy named Vladimir Shliemen at Relcom.  He is a very
friendly journalist and technical editor of the POISK magazine's 
computer supplement.  He has helped me hunt down some info before
and has said he is willing to do more.  Relcom, BTW, is their main
computer network, w/gates to the Internet.  Vladimir's address is:
nev@renews.relcom.msk.su

Tell him you got this info from Yash.  Vsego khoroshego!

Yash

Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
From: jhl@naif.jpl.nasa.gov (Jay H. Lieske)
Subject: Re: Russian (and ex-Soviet) calendar
Reply-To: jhl@naif.jpl.nasa.gov
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 00:06:28 GMT

In article <rsakella.714183236@p4.cs.man.ac.uk> rsakella@p4.cs.man.ac.uk (Rizos
Sakellariou) writes:
>
>Which calendar is currently used by Russia and the other
>ex-Soviet states ?
>
>... in a book published in 1986, I read that :
>
>"...In the S.U. they use an even more accurate calendar introduced
>in October 1923. All years are ordinary years except those which
>when divided by 9 leave either 2 or 6 as remainder..."
>
>According to this calendar, 1991 and 1995 were leap years but 1992
>was not.
>
>I wonder whether this calendar is still in use...
>
>
>--rizos
>

	I believe the statement should be as follows, based upon what's in a book for
astronomers entitled "Explanatory Supplement to the Astronomical Ephemeris and
the American Ephemeris and Nautical Almanac" published by H.M. Stationery
Office and commonly known as the "Green Book" because of its color:

	[p.413]:  "At a meeting of a Congress of the Orthodoc Oriental Churches held
in Constantinople in May 1923, the Julian calendar was replaced by a modified
Gregorian calendar in which CENTURY years are leap years only when division of
the century number by 9 leaves a remainder of either 2 or 6...."

	The key phrase is that pertaining to whether or not century years are leap
years.

Jay H. Lieske                                            jhl@naif.jpl.nasa.gov
From: dleschin@FEDS66.PRIME.COM (Dmitri Leschiner)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: C T P A H A   Y   H A C  -  H A   K A P T E   T b M bI
Date: 14 Aug 92 22:51:22 GMT
Reply-To: "soc.culture.soviet via ListServ" <SCS-L@indycms.iupui.edu>

>Date:         Fri, 14 Aug 1992 15:57:13 GMT
>From: Igor Sheyn <sheyn@CSA.BU.EDU>

>In article <9208141535.AA18491@feds66.Prime.COM>, dleschin@FEDS66.PRIME.COM
> (Dmitri Leschiner) writes:
>|> |>>>!In article <1992Aug12.143824.5396@watson.ibm.com> galina@watson.ibm.com

>|> | (Galina Kofman) writes:
>|>
>|> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>|> Vazon                                    vazasi@ZASRI.NASRI.SRI.COM
>|> Zasiandze                        1917 Sovoc st.,Palo Alto, CA 94545
>|> --------------------------------------------------------------------

>Kuda nuzhno lyubit' this particular devushku, v kakuyu imenno chast'?
>Esli zadelalsya gruzinom, dogovartivay.

Ax, daragoj, nu shto tebe vse ab`yasnyat' nuzhno da? Ti sam ni panimaish' da?
Pavsyudu nada this particular devushku lyubit', pavsyudu, panimaesh' da?
Pa vsem chastyam devushek lyubit' nada, ti ne znaish' da? Vo vse chasti
devushek lyubit' nada znaish' da? Ti shto devushek nikagda ne videl da?
Ne panimaish' daragoj?


--------------------------------------------------------------------
Vazon                                        vazasi@ZAS.RINA.SRI.COM
Zasiandze                        1917 Sovoc st., Palo Alto, CA 94545
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: libkin@saul.cis.upenn.edu (Leonid Libkin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: Don't show off!(Re: a final word)
Date: 12 Aug 92 17:33:53 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Aug12.154322.27086@watson.ibm.com> bil@burka..aix.kingston.ibm.com (Igor Belchinskiy) writes:
>BTW, as this is s.c.s - who in Russian literature were close to absurd
>tradition except Gogol (whom Nabokov loved, not hated)? In modern?

I am not in a position to speak about absurd tradition in 19th century
(frankly, I believe it didn't exist until this century, but maybe
those people in literary theory departments who need some bs topics to
spend the taxpayers money invented a new theory and call Gogol an
absurd writer - I don't know). In this century - certainly Harms and
Vvedensky. Harms' play "Elizaveta Bam" often resembles Beckett's "En
attendant Godot" and Ionesco's "Rhinoceros" and "Exit the king" (and
it was written some 30 years earlier). And I wouldn't be surprised to
find out that a student in Slavic languages in Alabama Lousy College
already wrote his thesis about it.


>Igor Belchinskiy

LL
From: dleschin@FEDS66.PRIME.COM (Dmitri Leschiner)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: C T P A H A   Y   H A C  -  H A   K A P T E   T b M bI
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:46:11 GMT
Reply-To: "soc.culture.soviet via ListServ" <SCS-L@indycms.iupui.edu>

|Date:         Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:48:03 GMT
|Comments:     Warning -- original Sender: tag was %watson.ibm.com@PRESTO.IG.COM
|From: Igor Belchinskiy <bil@BURKA..AIX.KINGSTON.IBM.COM>
|
|In article <86108@netnews.upenn.edu> sergei@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Sergei
| Borodin) writes:
|>!In article <1992Aug12.143824.5396@watson.ibm.com> galina@watson.ibm.com_
| (Galina Kofman) writes:
|>!>Zhenya, thank you for your permission to post the poem.
|>!>================================================================
|>!>
|>!>  C BOCTOKA - BOHb. 3AKOH COBKA
|>!>
|>!>    C T P A H A   Y   H A C   -   H A   K A P T E   T b M bI,
|>!>    K A K   C K O P O   C B E T   Y 3 H A E M   M bI ?
|>!>
|>!>
|>>>                                Evgeniy  Fedyunkin.
|>!>================================================================
|>!
|>!
|>!			3AME4ATE/\,HO!
|>
|>
|>   DEPbMO .
|
|DEPbMO, HO 3AME4ATE/\bHOE. HO DEPbMO.


HE 3AME4ATE/\bHOE, A |^|P|/|ME4ATE/\bHOE.
From: patricia@cco.caltech.edu (Patricia M. Schwarz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: a final word
Date: 15 Aug 92 07:12:43 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena

>There are also plenty good things to keep. How do you know what to choose?
>Say some smart people, like Pope, thinks that women should find happiness
>in family. (That one of few things which I almost agree with religious people :

*Choose* is the important word here. How does anyone know what to *choose*?

To me, my feminism is just the extension of humanisn to include women. We
should have the same right of self determination that anyone else should have.

And I don't think the Pope is so smart being against birth control in
a finite volume world.

Nobody can tell anyone else what they *should* find happiness in. Well,
they can try. Lenin and Stalin tried but it really didn't work, did it?

We are all human beings. We all have dreams. And we rebel when we get tired
of someone putting arbitrary restrictions on our dreams. Especially when
they reinforce those restrictions with violence and insults. This happens
to women, this happens to Jews, this happened to everyone in the Soviet Union, almost. We all share this type of suffering. I can't understand why
we divide ourselves along this feminist/anti-feminist line or this
Jewish/Christian line when we have so many frustrations in common.

-patricia