From: dcrosgr@uoft02.utoledo.edu
Newsgroups: talk.rape
Subject: Re: Rape in any form ...
Date: 27 Jul 92 17:26:46 EST
Organization: University of Toledo, Computer Services

WARNING! To answer a question I must go into details of rape fantasies. DO NOT
READ if you are sensitive to this.

Bail out of the message now.



In article <SYNTH.92Jul27122914@deepthought.unm.edu>, synth@deepthought.unm.edu (Synth F. Oberheim) writes:

> dc>
>> Is this like the third time I've had to correct you on this?  Re-read
>> the articles that you yourself have posted -- the scientific community
>> does not KNOW if it is "normal" or "okay" to fantasize about rape.
>> Please stop contending that it is.
> 
> dc> It would be real hard to state that having rape fantasies is not
> dc> normal.
> 
> Nor am I trying to.  But by the same token, it's unscientific and
> irresponsible for you to contend that they are.  You can draw your own
> personal conclusions, but I object to you stating them as fact.

As I have stated--the studies indicate this is normal. The experts agree it is
O.K. What basis do you have to indicate otherwise??? I am specifically asking
you WHAT makes you think the studies are invalid?

A hunch?

You are taking scientific evidence and dismissing it with a wave of your hand,
but not giveing a reason why you cinsider your action of overturinging accepted
studies and reports as a valid action. All you ever do is say is that is not
established.

No, but the experts accept it as valid!

> 
> It would waste a lot less bandwidth if you took the time to *read* my
> post before following up on it.  Nowhere was I contending that fantasy
> needs to be separated from reality -- our previous discussions show
> that we both already agree on that point.  And nor was I ever looking
> for reasons to call this fantasy in this circumstance "bad" -- by my
> own admission numerous times we don't know if having rape fantasies
> are good or bad.  So you should really be asking yourself, "what the
> hell is he talking about?"

I do ask that. ESPECIALLY after I post reports and studies that say this is all
fine for someone to fantaszie about. What do you want? GOD himself to appear
and personally tell you it is O.K.?

> 
> To answer this I refer to you a portion of my previous post that you,
> for some reason, completely ignored:
> 
> ----
>> dc> ... It may even be something as extreme as just one, really
>> dc> humiliating that (nasty word for a female here) who dicked you
>> dc> over and felt no remorse about stringing you along while she slept
>> dc> with other guys.
>>
>> The key element I was looking for was how you have already experienced,
>> through the other females in your life, the "reality" elements of
>> trauma and horror, and then continue to indulge in the fantasy after
>> being educated first-hand.  My guess is that your fantasy of humiliating 
>> your ex is really just simple revenge, and does not involve some sense
>> of satisfaction in giving her lasting emotional and psychological
>> scarring, loss of intimacy or sociability, recurring nightmares, etc.
>> (Or does it ...?)  

Wrong Synth. The asnwer as to why I enjoy this fantasy is every bit as simple
as why you enjoy ANY of your sexual fantasies.

Speaking of which, since explaining over and over is failing, why DO you enjoy
YOUR sexual fantasies? When you can answer that one, you'll understand mine.

> ----
> 
> DC, the door is wide open:  I'm asking for your *personal* input on a
> question posed *to you* about the goings-on in *your* mind.  Are you
> going to answer it, or are you afraid to share this?  If you are, just
> say so and I'll drop it.
> 
> 

Afraid? I'll tell you in intimate detail. I'll let you know every lurid detail.
I have told details. You want exact plot? It varies. Sometimes just me,
sometimes some associates help. (Never friends. Curious. Maybe I'll ponder that
one next lifetime.) Sometimes it involves me tricking her into a bad situation,
sometimes it is sheer force that puts her down. Soemtimes it as simple as her
coming back to me (technically I did dump her, but it was probably mutual) 
and I spite fuck her.

The only thing that remains the same is that she does not want it to happen
while it is happening, and she hates it having happened afterwards.

Trying to figure out a constant theme is like trying to figure out why you
enjoy fantasizing about various positions with one's girlfriend.

Synth, fantasizing about rape, after having seen and experienced the effects of
it, is no harder than fantasizing about anything else. It ALL has very negative
connotations if you know the subject well enough. You can not name a fantasy,
sexual or not, that someone can't find a dark side to. Provided you don't want
to ever do it to anyone, enjoy life and worry about non-existent problems the
day after you die.

What makes rape fanatsies any different?

DC 

PS. I have explained it as much as possible. Perhaps you must simply accept
that just like a blind man will never know what 'green' means, you will never
understand how one could enjoy a rape fantasy.


Newsgroups: talk.rape