HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mzimmers@netcom.com (Michael Zimmers)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Re: Divots.....
Date: 29 Aug 92 03:23:01 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <4901@balrog.ctron.com> spillane@olympus.ctron.com (Jim Spillane) writes:

>I disagree!  I happen to take a few practice swings at each hole.
>I like to, and it makes me feel more confident.  Anyone playing in
>a group behind me who tries to rush me just may end up eating
>one of their own clubs (I wouldn't treat mine so badly).
>I mean it, too, so let someone try.  I pay my greens fees every
>weekend just like everyone else, and have the right to play at `
>my own pace.  If that includes practice swings on each hole, or even
>if I decided to mentally adjust myself for a few minutes with silent
>contemplation, that's my own choice.  Interfere with that at your
>own risk.

I knew this newsgroup's attribute of being devoid of jerks like this
was too good to last forever...

Jim, I may be wasting my breath, but try to clue in, please.  When
you're playing on a public or semi-public golf course, you're renting
a space on the playing rotation, and you're participating subject to
the rules and regulations of the course.  One such rule is to play
without delay.

You're entitled to multiple practice swings, and that usually isn't
where the time goes anyway.  But this nonsense that you "have the right
to play at my own pace" has got to go.  It is your express obligation
to do all that is reasonably possible to avoid delaying other groups
on the course.  Some (but not nearly enough) courses will give you a
warning, then an escort off the course for demonstrating the kind of
selfish arrogance you've demonstrated in this post.  Your attitude,
and likely you, have no place in golf.

Take up bowling -- it seems better suited to you.
-- 
Michael Zimmers                                    |  Home:  408 996 1984
SoftHelp                                           |  Work:  408 996 1965
Software Solutions for Open Systems                |  Data:  408 996 1974
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: bhoughto@sedona.intel.com (Blair P. Houghton)
Subject: Re: Rude, Rude, rude
Organization: Intel Corp., Chandler, Arizona
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 18:04:23 GMT

...you shoulda planted that wedge up his crack...

				--Blair
				  "Ohhhh, I'm a lumberjack
				   and I'm o-kay..."
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: john@sequent.com (John Vander Borght)
Subject: Re: handicaps
Keywords: undefined,cheats
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: sqnt
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 16:18:46 GMT

rcw@crosfield.co.uk (bob wilson) writes:

>	I currently have a 5 handicap, this has been arrived at over
>the last year or so by submitting all cards, competition or not,
>in which I play a full medal round. Good or bad! This seems to work ok
>if everybody does it, and I believe is the intention of handicap
>system.
>	This usually translates to me playing to my handicap about 25%
>of the time, and the range being anywhere in general from -1 to +14,
>with the average about 7. Now, alot of people think that their
>handicap is one that they should nearly always play to. The amount of
>players coming in after medal rounds who are pissed off at having 
>shot nett par is amazing.
>	So enough ranting. What percentage of the time do you think
>you should play to your handicap? and how do you think it should be
>calculated (slope stuff accepted and excepted).

A lot depends on how consistent you are.  You seem to be like me and can
shoot numbers all over the map.  My rounds have varied from 76 to 91 during
the last year and since I play a course with high rating and slope, my
handicap index is 4.5 right now.

If you are inconsistent, you would expect that you should only shoot your
handicap about 25% of the time.  Remember that it is the average of your
top 50%.  Top 10 of 20 and then average (I know there is also the
multiplier in there to lower it further.)   Also, handicaps are figured
with equitable stroke control and if you are truely counting every shot, you
might not even get that close.

BUT, if you were a very consistent golfer and shot +/- 2-3 shots for most
of your rounds, you might even get it around 50% or so.

As an example, here are my last 20 differentials (sorted):
 1.49  3.05  3.05  4.70  4.70
 4.99  5.53  6.20  6.35  7.18
 7.18  7.77  8.00  8.88  9.49
 9.65 11.30 12.12 12.12 15.16

Notice that I only actually beat my index on 3 occasions.  My top ten range
from 1.5 to 7.2, but the other 10 go from 7.2 to 15.2.  This means that I
probably only shot to my handicap, about 3-5 times during that period (15-25%.)

One of my goals is to get all my differentials below 10.  I almost did it
before last week, but I had a few bad rounds so now I've got to get back on
the track.

Also, yesterday, in the USGA Mid-Amateur Qualifying round that I officiated
at, only about 25% actually shot better than the 5.4 index that is required
to play in the event and most of them have significantly lower indexes than
that.  There were a few rounds in the high 80s.  Only 2 players broke par
and only 3 others came within 2 shots of it.

John Vander Borght
john@sequent.com
- Member of Pumpkin Ridge, home of the 1996 US Amateur -
-- 
"Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty!"
John Vander Borght
john@sequent.com
From: ksb@adm.csc.ncsu.edu (Kelvin S. Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: First lesson
Date: 30 Aug 92 01:05:10 GMT
Distribution: rec.sport.golf
Organization: Adm.csc.ncsu.edu (Administration machine NCSU Dept. Computer Science)

I finally took the advice of so many good 
(and bad) players in this group and took
a lesson from a golf pro.  Of course my swing
is completely different now but I feel
like I am on my way!  I can't wait to get out 
on the driving range (it used to
be a depression session).  If you are a beginner 
like myself, don't waste another
dime on additional equipment or trips 
on the driving range until you take a few lessons
from a QUALIFIED instructor.  I have 3 more lessons 
and mucho practice to go...

ksb.
-- 
******************************************************************************
Kelvin S. Bryant     NCSU Computer Science Dept. 
Box 8206             Internet: ksb@adm.csc.ncsu.edu              
NCSU                 Voice: 919-515-7173
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: bohdan.kiszczuk@rose.com (bohdan kiszczuk)
Subject: Avoiding big hooks
Organization: Rose Media Inc, Toronto, Ontario.
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 21:33:00 GMT
X-Gated-By: Usenet <==> RoseMail Gateway (v1.70)


Date Entered: 08-31-92 16:26
W > From: warren@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (warren.a.montgomery)
W > Subject: Avoiding big hooks on low loft clubs?
W > Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 13:57:59 GMT

W > I generally hit straight or with a slight fade, but I sometimes
W > get a big left turn with a loft club (driver or 2-iron), usually
W > when there is trouble to be had on the left.  I'm not talking
W > about a pulled shot or a slight draw, but something that looks
W > like it would bend around and come back at me if it didn't usually
W > hit a tree or a house first.  It never seems to happen with any
W > other clubs, and it's clearly some kind of mental mistake that
W > gives me that kind of line, Any suggestions on avoiding boomerang
W > hooks? 
W > 

       Boy does that sound familiar. In my case it's simply "trying" 
to swing harder than I usually do. My tempo gets all screwed up and I 
end up with my upper body stuck on my right side along with felling 
like I'm I'm moving away from the ball on the down swing. The club 
comes way inside and low and behold big hook. There's one hole on a 
golf course I play often where I ALWAYS hit a big hook of the tee. 
It's a 210yd par 3. Instead of taking a 2 iron I try to smash a 3 
iron.
      Rather than go into mechanics; this is obviously a mental 
error. In a nutshell; take enough club, beleive in it, and make your 
NORMAL swing. 
---
   RoseReader 1.70 R001028: ======== bohdan.kiszczuk@rose.com ===========
   RM 2.00 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: jimv@dadd.ti.com (Jim Vahsen,VAHZ,)
Subject: Re: Rules
Reply-To: jimv@dadd.ti.com
Organization: Texas Instruments, Inc.
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 12:33:44 GMT

In article 20412@m.cs.uiuc.edu, hasker@m.cs.uiuc.edu (Rob Hasker) writes:
>pgreen@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Philip Green) writes:
>
>>Where can one obtain a copy of the Rules?
>
>You can call the USGA:
>
>> From rec.sport.golf Mon Jul 27 09:17:48 1992
>> From: ilh@lcs.mit.edu (Lee Hetherington)
>> Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 13:53:01 GMT
>> Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
>> Subject: USGA Rule Book (Free)
>> 
>> While watching the US Women's Open I saw an add by the USGA to get a
>> free copy of the Rules of Golf.  Just call 1-800-345-USGA (8742).  I
>> don't know if this is a limited time offer.
>> 
>(it's not; at least, I was able to order a copy a few weeks ago.)

Well, I ordered the book _many_ weeks ago, and have had no response yet.
I'm sure it'll get here by the 8th week, like they said...   8(

---
===========================================================================
|  ____    ____    _____     __     __   _______                          |
|  \   \  /   /   /  _  \   |  |   |  | |___   /       Jim Vahsen         |
|   \   \/   /   /  /_\  \  |  |___|  |    /  /        jimv@dadd.ti.com   |
|    \      /   /  /___\  \ |   ___   |   /  /         Texas Instruments  |
|     \    /    |  |   |  | |  |   |  |  /  /__        ASIC CAD GROUP     |
|      \__/     |__|   |__| |__|   |__| |______|       (214)997-3607      |
|                                                                         |
|           Samuel Adams - Brewer, Patriot.  (Damn Fine American Beer)    |
===========================================================================
																				

Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Subject: Re: Practice Swings (wAS : re: Divots.....)
Reply-To: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Organization: Rosemount, Inc.
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 17:13:41 GMT

par@teak18.cray.com (Peter Rigsbee) writes:
: 
: You are making the assumption that slow play is caused by new or
: poor golfers.  (Other people stereotype women golfers in this same
: manner.)  This, like most stereotypes, is often *not* the case; it
: really is more a case of personal attitude.  I know poor/new golfers
: who play quickly, and better golfers who play slowly.  It usually is
: an issue of paying attention, planning ahead, and doing what makes
: sense.
: 

EXACTLY!  I've played with plenty of high handicappers who play at a
good pace, and with plenty of low handicappers who couldn't keep up
with my grandmother.

The key to keeping up is PAYING ATTENTION and thinking a little.  Pick
your club and take a few practice swings _before_ everybody is
standing there waiting for you.  Line up your putt while somebody else
is hitting theirs.  Look to see where the next tee is and set your
clubs down on that side of the green.  When somebody in your foursome
takes a king size divot from behind the ball resulting in a 10 yard
shot, offer to take care of the divot for them so they can walk up and
take their next shot.  For god's sake add up your strokes on the way
to the next tee, not standing on the green after the last player has
putted out.

And probably the most important and difficult thing to learn is to
watch where your (and your opponent's) ball goes so that you can walk
right to the correct spot.  If you can't find the ball within 1 minute
of reaching the spot where it should be, then drop another one and get
on with it.  It's a round of golf, not an easter egg hunt!

Enough ranting, eh?

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  The SAME WAVE keeps
Rosemount Inc.                                |coming in and COLLAPSING like
                                              |a rayon MUU-MUU..
grante@aquarius.rosemount.com                 |
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: warren@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (warren.a.montgomery)
Subject: Re: 3 Club Tournament--Which Three?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 13:27:04 GMT
Summary: Another odd tournament format

I've never played in one of these but would almost certainly take
a 3 iron, 6-7 iron and wedge.  As others have said, this lets you
get to the green in regulation with reasonably normal shots on
anything other than monster par 4's (which most of us can't
predictably reach even with all 14 clubs), which is no doubt the
key to success here.

The club my parents played in had a goofy tournament with a
somewhat different format.  You played in teams of 4, each person
had one club, and you played in strict rotation, meaning that when
your turn came you had to hit it with your club.  I don't recall
if the team got to pick their four clubs or not.  Someone became
famous for sinking the longest "putt" after getting a hole in one
while teeing off with a putter.  There were cases where it was
good strategy to miss a short put, so as not to leave your
team mate trying to manage a long carry over water teeing off with
a wedge.  Not golf, but interesting fun.

-- 

	Warren Montgomery
	att!iexist!warren
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: davet@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (Dave Tutelman)
Subject: Re: GOLF CLUBS FOR SALE!!!
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs - Lincroft, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 11:27:36 GMT

In article <12948@lupine.ncd.com> stacey@grant.ncd.com writes:
>
>These are clubs for a lefty player. This is a men's set that comes with
>a nylon bag with a VERY padded carrying strap. The set includes
>a 1 and 3 wood with head covers, and one each of a 3,5,7 iron.
>Also a pitching wedge. We are looking for about $150 for the set,
>but negotiable. My work number is 415/691-2717.
>Shipping is possible. Call between 7:30 - 4:30 PDT.

Just a data point for comparison.  (I don't know whether it's relevant,
because the model, age, and condition of the clubs isn't mentioned in the
article; a serious oversight.)

About three years ago, I bought a used set of clubs for my son, who's a
lefty.  They were older, non-cavity-back clubs.  (For all I know, Stacey's
clubs are Pings.  But I suspect they're also older models, or the point
would have been made in the ad.)  The clubs were in good condition, and
were nearly a full set: 3-9 irons, wedge, three woods, and a putter.
No bag was included, but I've seen lots of used bags at yard sales for
under $10.  (I paid $4 this year for a bag similar to the one in the ad.)

I bought them from a store, where I've learned to expect to pay more than
for a private sale.  But he's a lefty, and private sales of lefty clubs
aren't frequent.

I paid $100 for them.  Comparable sets today from the same store are
between $100 and $150.  I'd say the __short__ set in the ad is overpriced
by a factor of two, unless they're UNUSUALLY good, new clubs.  (And
unless a matching nine iron is available separately; the lack of a nine
to go with 3-5-7 is a serious shortcoming.)

I also sold, within the past two years, a couple of older sets.  Each was
more complete than the advertised set (by a lot), and in excellent
condition (I do my own work on clubs), and they went for $70 and $110
respectively.

Just my opinion, but I'd hate to see a beginner to this fine sport
wind up not liking it because of a bad deal on his/her first clubs.
And this is not a flame, just a couple of data points.

Dave
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: maceache@fox.nstn.ns.ca (Tim Maceachern)
Subject: Warning about game summary sheet
Summary: Warning -- game summary sheet prints 40 copies
Keywords: summary, warning
Organization: NSTN Network Operations Centre, Nova Scotia, Canada
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 20:00:06 GMT

As pointed out in another post, the game summary sheet that I posted
prints 40 copies of the sheet.  Sorry about that.  To avoid printing
40 copies, if you just want to see one copy, edit line 5 which says:
    /#copies 40 def
and change the number to 1 (or delete the line entirely).

Once again, my apologies for anyone who was stuck with 40 copies, 
furtively looking around for the boss....

*******************************************************************
*         Tim MacEachern         * Tim_MacEachern@hawk.nstn.ns.ca *
*     Software Kinetics Ltd.     *  or maceache@hawk.nstn.ns.ca   *
* Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada *                                *
*           Opinions expressed are the author's only              *
*******************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: fragante@unixg.ubc.ca (Gv Fragante)
Subject: Re: videos
Keywords: golf videos
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 18:40:58 GMT

In <1992Sep3.224938.2136@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> jaspreet@ec.ecn.purdue.edu (Jaspreet Singh) writes:

>I have just started golf and am considering some of the Golf Videos
>to try to get some ideas on improving my drives.  Is that a good
>idea or should I just keep hiting.  I would like to know which
>videos ( Wally Armstrong etc. ) are good for learning.

I personally think the best videos worth watching are:
- David Leadbetter's Vol I and II
- Greg Norman's Vol. I and II

Since you are starting, I would suggest the Leadbetter series. Norman's tape is
generally aimed for the experienced golfer.

Also, you might want to see "The Master System to Golf" starring Tom Purtzer
on iron-play and Fred Couples on rhythm and tempo. Tom has the model swing on
the tour - really pretty swing to watch. Freddy, as everyone knows, has one of
the sweetest tempo.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: lekberg@screwdriver.Prime.COM (Paul Lekberg)
Subject: Re: Hogan Tour
Reply-To: lekberg@screwdriver.Prime.COM (Paul Lekberg)
Organization: Prime Computer R&D
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 13:18:52 GMT

The Hogan Tour is equivalent to baseball's triple A league. 
i.e. Not quite ready for prime time but still some great
playing.   The top 5 finishers from the Hogan Tour are
presented with a PGA tour card.   I believe the Hogan
golf company will no longer sponsor next year's tour
but Nike plans to pick up the tab.  Nike Tour???

Another tour worth mentioning is the T. C. Jordan tour
which is equivalent to baseball's double A league.  There
are some really good players on this tour also.   I was
reading in Golf Magazine about some player on the Jordan
Tour who shot 65, 66 his first two days and was 11 shots
behind the leader.   Someone shot, can you believe this..
a 59, 61 !  Even if they are playing on municipal courses,
these are truly remarkable scores.    

-Paul
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: hotsenp@seq.uncwil.edu (Hotsenpiller Chanda)
Subject: Re: Practice Swings (wAS : re: Divots.....)
Organization: Univ. of North Carolina @ Wilmington
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 21:35:35 GMT

john@meaddata.com (John Manion) writes:

>In article <1992Aug28.103545@screwdriver.Prime.COM>, lekberg@screwdriver.Prime.COM (Paul Lekberg) writes:
>|> |> 
>|> |> It is all personal preference, what makes you comfortable on the course, and
>|> |> hey if you want to take 5 practice swings, go for it, who cares.  Relax.
>|> |> 
>|> |> -- 
>|> 
>|>   I'm not against taking a practice swing or two but taking more 
>|> than two will invite slow play.   There is nothing more aggregating
>|> than watching someone take 2,3,or 4 practice swings and then proceed
>|> to hit it sideways or just beyond their shadow.   If you are not
>|> a good player, don't waste your time and others (especially those
>|> behind you) by taking all those practice swings.  "Grip it and
>|> rip it".
>|> 
>|> Paul


>If you're in hurry, don't come out and play.  I think it's time we all realized
>that the sport of golf is growing very rapidly.  Everyone out on the course
>is not a low handicapper, give em a break, they need time to learn the game as
>much as you and I did when we started.  

>If you want to bitch about slow play, bitch to the course owners, pros and 
>managers who send groups off at 3-5 minute intervals.  They're the ones 
>causing the problems, not me and my practice swing!

	I would have to agree here.... However some golf courses do have two
courses.... One for those who have low handicaps and one for players
that might be learning the game and people with high handicaps...
This way the low handicapped player are scheduled in five minute intervals
where as the other course is scheduled on 10 - 12 minute intervals....

		However if you do not have this option..... Remember what it was
like for you to learn play.... All those hundreds of shots that made you
a good player -------- did it also turn you into a critic and an
incentive one at that???? 


	REMEMBER.... We want people to learn the game and to enjoy it... BUT,
don't they even get a chance to learn it.... So what if they take several
practice swings.... All they are asking for is a chance to learn the game..



		Chanda Hotsenpiller
		hotsenp@seq.uncwil.edu

Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: fragante@unixg.ubc.ca (Gv Fragante)
Subject: Re: sybervision
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 18:47:28 GMT

In <Sep04.021728.57751@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> wayman@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Jeffrey Wayman) writes:


>Does anyone know if Sybervision still makes their golf tape?
>Does anyone have one they'd like to get rid of?  Thanks!

You referring to the one of AL Geiberger ? I saw that one and didn't make much
sense or impact. Supposed to be some sort of subliminal programming or
subconscious mind training, but the music quickly put me to sleep.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: nlaffra@cue.bc.ca (Neil Laffra)
Subject: I'm goin' Dutch. Where to play!?
Summary: Leaving for Netherlands soon  and seek courses to play.
Keywords: Holland golf suggestions
Organization: Softwords Research International Ltd., Victoria, B.C., Canada
Date: 23 Aug 92 11:39:56 GMT

Like the Summary stated, I am headed off to the Netherlands to visit
family and friends but also hope to hit a few balls into real canals.
Can anyone recommend any decent locations to try.I will try to just visit 
the best even if only to collect a blank scorecard,in case they may
not welcome "outsiders" (even though I am one of their "countrymen").
	By the way, what's Dutch for "FORE!!!!!!!!!  RIGHT!!! "?
From: ckuznia@aludra.usc.edu ( Ckuznia)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Re: Keeping Pace
Date: 31 Aug 1992 14:00:06 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

I play at a course that began charging an extra $.50 for enforcement
of a "Keep Pace" program.  When they began the program the rangers
were very motivated, telling us about three times per round to speed
up, no matter how fast/slow we were playing.  It resulted in some very
fast rounds <4 hours.

One time I was 230 yards or so out with folks on the green and the
ranger told me I could hit.  I used a 3-wood to put it on the front of
the green, bouncing past the people putting.  I caught hell from that
group and rightly so.  I was very pissed at that ranger, who didn't
say another word.  I don't even think he yelled fore when I yelled.

Charlie
From: jaspreet@ec.ecn.purdue.edu (Jaspreet Singh)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: videos
Keywords: golf videos
Date: 3 Sep 92 22:49:38 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

I have just started golf and am considering some of the Golf Videos
to try to get some ideas on improving my drives.  Is that a good
idea or should I just keep hiting.  I would like to know which
videos ( Wally Armstrong etc. ) are good for learning.

Thanks


Jaspreet Singh
PURDUE UNIVERSITY
jaspreet@ec.ecn.purdue.edu 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf