From: b790zcd@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Subject: Re: Martha & slang
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords: Get a real slang
Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington
Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1992 05:53:00 GMT

In article : <1992Apr4.225339.9151@athena.mit.edu>
             ekundayo@athena.mit.edu (Enuma Dayo Ogunyemi) writes...

EDO>This exposes the invalidity of your responses from this point on.  People are not
EDO>necessarily "immersing" themselves in hip-hop culture.  It is not something that
EDO>you have to jump into. Some people actually (believe it or not) are a part of the
EDO>culture and both reflect and effect its evolution.  


So what is the point. What has hip-hop ever done to further the cause of
the black community. Seems to me that things are worse off than they were
23-30 years ago. Hip-hop is just another in a long line of black entertaining
white enterprises. You can argue that whites become educated when listening
to PE or BDP but, either enough aren't getting the message or the message is
forgotten as soon as the next tape is put in the tape player.

EDO>Your view of making a difference is assimilation?  If you can't understand that
EDO>this net is a place where a lot of people get away from Amerikka and as such do
EDO>not have to compensate for Amerikka's refusal to learn our dialect of English,
EDO>then you probably won't understand that your amusement at our dialect is not at
EDO>"our expense" as your simplistic views have no deeper effect on the way we live
EDO>our lives.


Assimilation is only part of the answer. You can't take a seperatists veiw and
expect to make a difference in the modern world. You have to work within the
system to make the system more equitable. Just what exactly does your so-called
'dialect of English' represent? Brothers like M.C. Ren driving around town in
expensive cars, wearing expensive jewelry, bragging about how many white cops
he shot last week and bragging about how many women he slapped in public. This
is what it represents to me. If you want to live your life like a rap star
by emulating his slang you are certainly not going to make any positive 
difference. On the contrary, you will just be contributing to the new black
stereotype that portrays a culture concerned only with material possesions,
concerned only with empty status, concerned only with style and not with
substance.

EDO>If you *paid* any attention in your English classes, or got beyond SHakespeare
EDO>and Chaucer to African-American Women's literature, African and Carribean
EDO>literature, you would understand the significance of the development of 
EDO>distinctively black dialects of english.
EDO> 
EDO>	From West African pidgin english to Jamaican patois and African-American
EDO>"black english", our manipulation and conversion of the Queen's English has served
EDO>black people in resisting and defeating colonisation and slavery.
EDO> 
EDO>	If you read the works of great  African (in the truest form of the
EDO>word) authors like the Nobel laureate, Wole Soyinka of Nigeria, Chinua Achebe,
EDO>John Pepper Clarke, Ngugi wa' Thiongo, Alice Walker, Ama ata Aidoo, Flora Nwapa,
EDO>Adaora Lily Ulasi, Mongo Beti, Bessie Head, Buchi Emecheta, Ayi Kwei Armah,
EDO>Cyprian Ekwensi, Oliver Tambu (I include names so you can educate yourelf further)
EDO>you would observe a tendency of this authors to switch into the fore-mentioned
EDO>dialects.  JP Clarke, Wole Soyinka and Cyprian Ekwensi (to give examples) have
EDO>lauded works written entirely in dialect!


So has does the hip-hop slang do any of the above ? The above people *were*
concerned with making a fundamental difference in the societies they were in.
What fundamental change is hip-hop making ? Rap stars are concerened first
and foremost with making money and any that is all they will ever be concerned
with. Are you telling me that 20-30 years from now that a rap stars lyrics
will be recognized as works of a 'great African author' ? I'll grant you that
a few musicians working in rap are approaching 'art', but do you hear them 
using slang to the degree that the youth of today are using ? Every KRS-1
interview I've seen comes across as a proud man presenting himself in a
positive manner minus the slang, but, that is beside the point. If, you
want to choose someone to base a new culture on why choose a rapper. Why
not choose a leader. If you want to use slang, use the slang of someone
who stands up for the black community every day and not just when it is time
to make a record. If you want to emulate a role model emulate a black doctor,
a black lawyer, a black businessman, or a black business owner, but, please
don't emulate a rapper or an athlete. However, my complaint is not with you,
you obviously have a good sense of ethnic pride. I applaud you knowledge of
great black authors and true black culture and I hope you meet with sucess
in your studies.

>>Somebody had to bring some reality into this discussion,
>>
>>George.

EDO>Unfortunately, you're not the one.  Before you talk about reality you must delve
EDO>deep into your history.  It isn't even sufficient to know your history, you must
EDO>know your roots and *culture*.  I'm from Nigeria and I can bet that your
EDO>knowledge of Nigeria and other *specific* African countries is apalling.
EDO>Thus we are paraded with individuals who claim to be teachers and
EDO>*scientists*[dialect] but whose concept of reality and making a difference is
EDO>assimilation.  Even KRS-1 boasts of being number one in countries all over the
EDO>world yet mentions only Japan, France and other non-African countries.  THe few
EDO>references he and other *humanists* members of the rainbow crew (Brother J),
EDO>treat AFrica as if it were one political unit.
EDO> 
EDO>I tell you, I think you better think about it.

I have thought about it and thought about it often. Why build a new road if you
can repave the old one. If you think that, by seperating yourself from 
mainstream America, you can achieve equality, your in for disappointment.
Knowing ones own culture is good, but, when trying to achieve a goal in someone
elses culture it is better to know that culture as well. Why should 'Amerikka'
be concerned with your dialect, 'Amerikka' controls the dialect, 'Amerikka'
dictates what dialect is spoken. Why try to get away from that ? Running from
a problem is not going to solve it and speaking in a slang that is nothing
more than an updated version of Hollywood 'nigga-speak' of the 30's-60's is
certainly not going to help anything. What do think is going to happen to the
hip-hop slang ? Like so many other things, it is going to be swallowed up by
the white culture until it is indistinguisheable from the same. It is already
happening every day, whites buy more and more rap music every day, every
month another 'black' film (see _Juice_) comes out of Hollywood  and is
attended by whites. Why not forgo this drawn out cycle of whites taking a 
predominantly black form of expression and making it their own and blacks
coming up with something new (usually peddled by white vendors) and start to
take white culture and make it black ? Note, I did not say forget ones own
culture in the process. It is ridiculous to call hip-hop a black culture.
Who controls the record companies ? Who controls the merchandising ? The
same people that have always controlled them. If you think that by speaking
in rap slang you are expressing yourself in a uniquely black viewpoint, you
are sadly mistakened. What you are really doing is playing in the hands of
those who wish to control you. Perhaps I was wrong in phrasing my dislike
of rap slang in terms of 'laughter', now that I have thought about it my
dislike is more 'anger', the comedy of fools eludes me now.

EDO>-Selector Dudublack (fi real!)

Oh and please forgive any errors in syntax, I don't have time to proofread
my post.

George.