From: davidal@comm.mot.com (UK702 DavidAlexander)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.eastern
Subject: Re: means and expression
Date: 11 Nov 92 22:06:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.45827
Distribution: world
Organization: Motorola Land Mobile Products Sector

[ < 80 cols, please!  I usually don't mind reformatting posts, but tonite
I'm on a very cranky phone line and the process is particularly
error-prone! -a]

In article <45664@ogicse.ogi.edu>, mw%ki.fht-mannheim.de (Marc Wachowitz) writes:
|>  Thyagi Morgoth NagaSiva
|> (still seeking for good names? :-) posted a beautiful signature:
|> 
|>  "White people are doing things in reverse.
|>  They think that by going into the sweatlodge
|>  or buying drums and rattles, they will become spiritual.
|>  Not necessarily.  Instead, if you live in a good way,
|>  you are spiritual.  Then, the ceremonies come
|>  as a means of expression." -Rolling Thunder-
This is a sentiment worthy of repeating.

|> 
|> Now if people could understand meditation in a similar way ---
|> though not very likely when looking at all this stress of methods and goals.
The computer industry is full of methods and goals. I would imagine that,
like myself, many people find a 'no method approach toward enlightenment' 
and 'workplace methodologies' a contradiction (if not a conflict).

|> [And how many interpret "in a good way" as emphasizing good works?]
and how many misinterpret this to excuse evil. (Note: I do get the subtle
qualifier -emphasizing- )

|> Just wondering about the art of life ...
I was giving some thought to 'inner beauty' the other day. Inner beauty 
in a celtic/Irish sort of a way rather than anything more etherial.

Combining this with the idea of folk memory I came upon something along the lines of 'culture passes on enlightenment through tradition'.

I appreciate what Rolling Thunder is getting at but I feel that by considering
persons who attempt to gain enlightenment through a culture with which they
have little empathy that he misses the importance of tradition in his own
upbringing. (This is a bit of an assumption concerning the biography of
Rolling Thunder).

While watching a TV programme the other day (on indian music) I came across a
succinct concept of teaching/development. It ran something like
copying-emulation-improvisation. If ceremony is not 'spiritual copying'
what is it?

It is ironic a Western-materialist-agnostic/atheistic (white-man ;-) ) 
society is so impoverished that it has to go looking to a culture on which 
it is committing genocide. (Rather like the Chinese turning to Tibetan
buddhism in 50 years time)

The arguements I have put forward are an attempt to build on Blue Thunder 
not debunk him. I have intentionally made no attempt to justify what I say 
through quotation of scriptures (eastern or otherwise) but don't let that 
stop you.

TTFN
DA

P.S. you might like to play guess David's religious affiliations (always good for a laugh).
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