From: nicolson@odie.ee.wits.ac.za (James Nicolson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african,sanet.talk.politics
Subject: Re: Third force rides again
Date: 14 Oct 92 06:49:21 GMT
Organization: Wits Electrical Engineering (Novell Users).

In article <1992Oct13.092716.3421@ucthpx.uct.ac.za> gavan@elc.mth.uct.ac.za (Gavan Tredoux) writes:

>murrell@cc.und.ac.za (Kathy Murrell) writes:

>: I like asking questions?  When Matthew Goniwe and his companions were
>: murdered most people where aware that this was not a simple accident - 
>: someone in power was responsible for their deaths.  Although this has not
>: yet come to open court, I think most reasonable South Africans will 
>: recognise the methods used.

>Maybe Goniwe *was* rubbed out by the state, but that (reprehensible
>though it is) establishes nothing about the "third force". After all,
>you must start to establish how *much* violence this "third force" is
>responsible for and what their motives, organization, leadership, agendas
>are. Doesn't do to claim they're responsible for *some* violence which
>*may* be somehow linked to the *state*. Are th epeopl ewho rubbed out Goniwe
>the same people who launch train attacks? How do we know this?

Yes, but Kathy's point was more than this. When we live in a society that 
has subverted justice for so long, we get the situation, where a kind of 
'popular' judgement fills the vaccuum caused by a corrupt police force and a 
skewed legal system. 'Everyone' knows who killed Matthew Goniwe and David 
Webster. There is no evidence that will stand up in court - but that is not 
an indictment on the people who hold these views, but of the SAP. 

There is strong 'evidence' that a third force is behind the train violence:

  * Felix Ndimende's reports of recce involvement which were ignored by the 
    SAP  
  * Reports by commuters of portuguese speaking attackers
  * Court findings that police actually fabricated evidence and hindered
    investigation in train violence trials
  * The glaring lack of convictions in train violence
  * The captured train attacker who told hospital staff that he had 
    been promised R90 000 for his role in the attack

Sure this is not proof, but it is questionable to ask for proof when those 
who are expected to investigate are so heavily implicated and fail to 
follow up on very strong evidence. In the meantime, the majority of 
people (including many fairly conservative foreign politicians) believe that 
the state is heavily involved in the violence.

This is one of the weaknesses of Anthea Jeffery's 'Spotlight on 
Disinformation': that she demands this kind of proof from agencies whose job 
is not to convict people in court. (Her examples of shoddy reporting are 
true, but simply rejecting the third force theory out of hand is going to 
cost the SAIRR a lot of credibility.)

>And note too the recent death of Mr Andre de Villiers, supposedly at the hands
>of a state death squad. Turns out the ANC were behind it - or at least ANC
>cadres. However, robbery seems to have been the motive. That should teach the 
>lesson of caution here.
> 

Thats the problem. We need a proper legal system - but don't blame the 
people who cry _Hit_Squad_. There've been so many hit squad deaths, that 
this response is natural.
------------
James Nicolson, Department of Electrical Engineering
University of the Witwatersrand, South Africa
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african