HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Michael F. Kamprath <kamprath@space-grant.sprl.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: Dougie Howser, Quincy
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 92 13:29:54 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan, Aerospace Engineering
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A6FB3A743302C4FC@sprl-mac2016.sprl.umich.edu>
X-Xxdate: Fri, 9 Oct 92 13:32:36 GMT

In article <1992Oct9.150951.1514@u.washington.edu> Roger Tang,
gwangung@carson.u.washington.edu writes:
>In article <67390@cup.portal.com> Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com writes:
>>Chris Wa of microsoft says Quincy was based on a controversial Asian Am
>
>	You really are pretty ignorant, aren't you.....
>
>	You don't need to have an authority to know Quincy was
>based on Thomas Noguchi....
>

I guess I am just a poor, ignorant soul too.  

The criticisms you get for stating an "ignorance" kind of makes you want 
to not find anything out so that your ignorance will never be revealed and 
thus no one will ever criticise you for being ignorant.

I guess I am kind of ignorant about run-on sentences :-)

Lord, have mercy!

========================================================================
| Michael F. Kamprath                   | The University of Michigan   |
|   kamprath@space-grant.sprl.umich.edu |      Aerospace Engineering   |
|   kamprath@engin.umich.edu            |                              |
+---------------------------------------+------------------------------+
| This country is a _democracy_.  It is NOT a "Two Party Sytem."  DO   |
| NOT believe The Lie that not voting Republican or Democratic will    |
| waste your vote.  Vote for who ever you please, and let the          |
| politicians find out what a democratic government is all about.      | 
========================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 15:38:25 EDT
From: <SXS30@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Discourse on Race in Modern China
 <Bw4zuK.A7F@acsu.buffalo.edu> <1992Oct15.172154.21559@cs.UAlberta.CA>

In article <1992Oct15.172154.21559@cs.UAlberta.CA>, mark@cs.UAlberta.CA (Mark
Green) says:
>
>In article <Bw4zuK.A7F@acsu.buffalo.edu> dtwei@acsu.buffalo.edu (Danielle T   )
>Wei
>writes:
>>In article <1992Oct14.152915.25211@unocal.com> stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard
>Ottolini) writes:
>>>Have you lived in China?  I have and was a racial minority there and felt
>>>the sting of prejudice.  Many people assumed I was a dumb tourist
>>>and wouldn't understand what they were saying behind my back.
>>
>>Sure I've lived in China.. I was born there and I've lived there long enough
>>to speak the language fluently.. As for racism, I didn't see a thing, and
>>I lived in MANCHURIA-a region that was traditionally never fully under
>>Han control.. As a matter of fact, I'm partly Manchu myself
>>
>
>Of course you didn't see any racism, you're chinese.  There is no

 So, all American didn't see any racism ???

>racism against chinese in China, but this is definitely not the case for

 If there were, against whom?

>non-chinese people.  Your statement about no racism in China is the
>same as a white person in North America saying there is no racism in
>North America, you are just not in a position to experience it.  A member
>of the majority race is very rarely in a position to experience racism
>in their own country, so they often think it doesn't exist.  When someone
>from another race claims that racism exists, they get very upset for
>two reasons:
>
>1) They've never seen racism, so they don't believe the claim
>
>2) Indirectly they are being critized.
>

 This is absolutely ridiculous! Since we have this problem here, everyone
 should have this problem too. What a logic!!  _0)

  If you read dtwei's post carefully, you will find he is speeking as a
  minority Chinese, not the majority.

  I am also a Chinese with a minority ethnic background. I hardly experienced
  any racial discrimnation in China. Point your finger to other won't solve
  you own problem.
From: timlee@public.btr.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Discourse on Race in Modern China
Date: 16 Oct 92 06:39:54 GMT
Reply-To: timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee)
Followup-To: soc.culture.asian.american

dtwei@acsu.buffalo.edu (Danielle T Wei) writes:
|stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini) writes:
|>Racism is very high there, particularly for dark skinned people.
|
|Your name sounds Italian
|Besides, what kind of dark-skinned people can you find in China??
|Tourists from Ethiopia??

Actually, one incident that managed to hit the news here (USA) was that
some male black African students studying at a university in China
were found to be dating local Chinese women.  The result was a large
protest against the students, including signs that translated to mean
"beat the black ghosts" (or something like that).  This was a few
years ago, perhaps a bit before the Tiananmen incident.
 
|>press tries to promote this.  I find it amusing that non-Chinese would
|>believe the propaganded that Uighers and Han are intermarrying in large
|>numbers.  The idea is abhorrent to most Hans I know.
|
|Uighers?? I admit I've never heard of them before,

Homeland is in the area now known as the Xinjiang Autonomous Region.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee                 timlee@btr.com  ...!decwrl!btr!timlee
This message comes with no warranty, not even an implied warranty of
fitness for any particular purpose.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: gk31@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gag-Lae  Kim)
Subject: Re: Is it in the Genes?
Reply-To: gk31@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gag-Lae  Kim)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 23:26:45 GMT

In article <MDAY.92Oct8164317@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu> mday@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu (Mark Day) writes:
>   gk31@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gag-Lae  Kim) writes:
>
>	   I guess the ultimate question is, what is science, and how
>   should scientific data be interpreted.  Every scientific "facts" are
>   based on assumptions, assumptions that are commonly accepted with or
>   without knowing.  So what can be more scientific categorization?  If
>   you believe that there's no difference between what people call race,
>   then I accept your point (although your theory came about by
>   disproving other's theory, not by "scientific and objective facts").
>   But many scientists who assumed the existence of difference in race,
>   will tell you that there are significant difference among difference
>   race.  Of course all these facts were produced based upon assumption,
>   but what isn't?
>
>I don't think I have to answer "what is science" in order to
>distinguish between "scientifically useful" and "scientifically
>useless" distinctions.  (Just treat these terms as primitives and
>ignore the "science" in the root).

	I did not ask the question "what is science" to distinguish
between "useful" and "useless" science.  As it is with our ecological
ecosystem where one's waste is vital source of other's life, "useful"
and "useless" science is a relative term based on different
assumptions.  I asked that question to learn what you mean by "real
science."  Real science means useful science.  But for whom? For what
purpose?  Don't you think quite of bit of these are determined by
cultural aspects of approaching science?

>A useful distinction is one that has the properties I've outlined
>before: it is defined in a way such that almost all of the time, every
>observer gets the exact same answer, and that answer has some
>connection to a phenomenon of interest.  If you can put "race" into
>that sort of framework, go for it.  (But please spare me the "what is
>science" digression.)

	I hope you don't think my asking you that question as a
digression from our topic of discussion now.  I was merely trying to
understand your point of view which is difficult at times. (not
because it's you, but in general...)

	Kurtis Kim
	gk31@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu
From: robohen@ocf.berkeley.edu (Henry Robertson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Hoyt Sze will be on TV!
Date: 7 Oct 92 07:08:16 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: headcrash.berkeley.edu

Well I sure as hell am glad Hoyt is not around Cal anymore--i don't have to
feel like the victim of some condemned type of relationship, given that I
am half-Asian.  Hoyt has made sweeping statements against half-Asians before,
such as that no half-Asian in their right mind willfully condones Asian roots.
This freedom of speech business at Cal has too often been translated into
a freedom to offend people who do not fit into clear-cut politically correct
categories.  Hoyt needs to get his banana ass around the world more before
he opens his reeking mouth.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: interracial dating-black asian?
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 92 00:15:16 GMT

In article <1avfh4INN1vf@agate.berkeley.edu> robohen@ocf.berkeley.edu
(Henry Robertson) writes:
>...
>Asians, at least Japanese, do not have a guilt complex about racial
>prejudices, for they never imported slaves and they have no obligation to
>Judeo-Christian ethics.
>...

Westerners have a universal sense of right and wrong.  The individual
is central, and there is the notion of having done something wrong to a
person who is not in your group.

The Japanese do not have a universal sense of right and wrong.  The
individual is not the central unit; the group is.  Right and wrong are
defined relative to the group.  It is possible to do something wrong,
in the Western sense, to an individual who is not in your group,
but that "something" would not be considered wrong in the Japanese sense
simply because that individual is _not_ your group.  (In layman's terms,
you can screw somebody outside of your group with a clear conscience
because that person is not your group.)

By contrast, the Chinese have _no_ sense of right and wrong, relative to
anybody or anything.  To a large extent, a Chinese does not admit that he has
committed anything wrong even when what he has done is wrong in the Western
sense.  Apologies are also hard to come by.  When they do occur on those
rare occasions, they are usually meaningless.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seikatsu no imi wa nan desu ka.            \|  |`      | Don't buy from Toyota;
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.          | -+-      | especially, don't buy
                                           /| / \      | from Capitol Toyota in
Copyright 1992.                 Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3 | San Jose, California.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,soc.culture.asean,soc.culture.korean,soc.rights.human,alt.individualism
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Sex, Power and the Decline of the White American Male [LONG]
Reply-To: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Organization: The Bates Motel
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 16:46:55 GMT

clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>shaw@au-bon-pain.lcs.mit.edu (Andy Shaw) writes:
>>Now, you'll have plenty of people of all races willing to say that 
>>they find Prince or Janet Jackson attractive.
>
>  For attractive, try Whitney Houston...  though she just got married.
>  I can also think of plenty of men more attractive than Prince.
>  Denzel Washington comes to mind...

Add to that, Mario van Peebles (my youngest sister puts him in her top 10
list of media hunks, along with Patrick Humphries (white) who plays Jake 
on E.N.G., a CTV show that has appeared in America on Lifetime).

For females, I vote for the supermodel with the heart-shaped face in the
J.Crew and Victoria's Secret catalogues ... (no, not Naomi Campbell; the
woman in question looks "Caribbean", if you know what I mean ...)

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare				
> gld@cunixB.cc.columbia.EDU		Oct 26/92: Just say "OUI!"
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			(Let's worry about the economy!)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.usa
From: Michael F. Kamprath <kamprath@space-grant.sprl.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: Blame that Asian!
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 15:42:35 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan, Aerospace Engineering
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A6FF4E111A01C4FC@sprl-mac2016.sprl.umich.edu>
X-Xxdate: Mon, 12 Oct 92 15:45:21 GMT

In article <Bw0rqE.BrC@news.cso.uiuc.edu> George Shay, shay@osiris.cso.uiuc.edu writes:
>But this is not the point. Suppose there was a British soldier named
>Paterson who did a lot of burnings and killings, those Chinese were
>scared when they heard this name Paterson and they called barbarians
>Patersons. 

Sounds reasonable.  Study the origins of "vandalism."  Watch the Simpson's
and learn what "pulling a Homer" is.  

It is not a race issue, it is an "shared experience" issue.  The culture 
that experienced the invasion of the Vandals have used their name to 
describe like actions in others.  Words merely so not just represent
literary meanings, they also represent experiences.  To truly understand
what is being said, you must also understand the culture of the person who
is saying it. 

Did you ever see the episode of Star Trek TNG where the Enterprise encountered
a superior race (technologically) yet could not understand what they wanted?
There inability in communication arose from the fact that the aliens spoke
in metaphors and allusions that only people who understood their culture
would understand.  The Enterprise originally thought they were threatening 
them when in reality they just wanted to be friends.  The same concept,
IMHO, can be applied to this discussion.  (oh, yes, of course Capt. Picard
saved the day by figuring it all out.)

To say that the use of the word "Hun" to describe aggressive enemies is racist 
probaly reflects more on your understanding of the metaphor than the bigotry of the
speaker.

>
>What do you think?
>

If you are trying to bait a racial discussion, this topic won't do.


========================================================================
| Michael F. Kamprath                   | The University of Michigan   |
|   kamprath@space-grant.sprl.umich.edu |      Aerospace Engineering   |
|   kamprath@engin.umich.edu            |                              |
+---------------------------------------+------------------------------+
| This country is a _democracy_.  It is NOT a "Two Party Sytem."  DO   |
| NOT believe The Lie that not voting Republican or Democratic will    |
| waste your vote.  Vote for who ever you please, and let the          |
| politicians find out what a democratic government is all about.      | 
========================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak)
Subject: Re: No more ``sour grapes'' please!!!
Summary: Love is color-blind
Reply-To: jpak@manute.sps.mot.com
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 19:09:26 GMT

In article <92283.220111ZQH@psuvm.psu.edu> <ZQH@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>[...]  In the Xinjiang Autonomous Region of Mainland China, there are many
>AM/CF marriages (according to a recent article in the People's Daily, there
>are more than 140 AM/CF couples from ONE county participated in a local
>study about interracial marriages, no CM/AF was mentioned there).  Just FYI,
>those Caucasians are Turkic origin whose ancestors migrated to Xinjiang
>after Han Dynasty took that land 2100 years ago.  After the birth, those
>Caucasian-Chinese and Han-Chinese in Xinjiang live together, go to the same
>school system, watch the same TV shows and speak the same Mandarin, and thus
>develop the common languange/culture background across races.  The situation
>is similar to the one between the 2nd-plus-generation Asian-American
>and the European-American.  Since the Han-Chinese is the mainstream
>in China, some of those Caucasian-Chinese would want to marry into
>the mainstream.  So the same thing happens to those Caucasian-Chinese
>there as to Asian-American in U.S. --- more female outmarriges than
>male outmarriages.

No, no, no, James.  The reason there are more Caucasian female outmarriages
than male in Xinjiang has nothing to do with wanting to marry into the
"mainstream."  Absolutely nothing at all.  The *real* reason is that the AMs
and WFs are individuals who just happened to fall in love with each other.
Race and mainstreaming have *NOTHING* to do with it.  Right, y'all?  Correct?
If it's true in America, why should the reasons for the comparable "phenomena"
be different in China?

Gee, I'm kind of surprised how many of you WMs and AFs out there who have no
problem acknowledging the lack of racial influence on relationships didn't
pick up on this immediately and instead waited for someone like me to point
this out.

Hmm.  Why don't those Xinjiang Caucasian men want to "mainstream" too?
Perhaps they get too "wrapped up" over the "color" of their mates.  Somebody
needs to tell those guys that true love is colorblind...

He he he.

Jim (sorry, I couldn't resist :-) )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: shimkevi@buchmf.bu.edu (Sergey Shimkevich)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Blame that Asian!
Date: 15 Oct 92 18:53:03 GMT
Organization: Boston University Chemistry Department

In article <Bw4KAn.J5w@inews.Intel.COM> awu@mipos3.intel.com (Allen Wu) writes:
>In article <98363@bu.edu> Sergei Shimkevich <shimkevi@buchmf.bu.edu> said:

//Tatars (Mongols) should be viewed as barbarians because they raped and
//pillaged Russia for three hundred years, bringing unimaginable suffering to
//its people.

>Considering the pillagings committed by the Russians in their course of
>conquest to build their empire, I guess the Russians should be viewed as
>barbarians according to your logic.

Before or after 1917? 

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Ryan: What is it to you, demon?       //// Sergei Shimkevich             //
// Lune: It is Sir, Demon to you, worm!  //// shimkevi@buchmf.bu.edu        //
// -Phantasy Star III                    //// shimkevich@A1.tch.harvard.edu // 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: Western Culture suck Shit!
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 17:47:00 GMT

On the balance sheet, I see no superior culture.  All suck.

Each little one has its beautities.  The Westerners have
some nice advantages on the rights of man, but for more concrete
concepts they have borrowed lots (like other cultures) in mathematics.
It has been interesting reading on the development of math in
China and Japan (from the "Pythagorean theorem to calculus").
Eastern cultures have some attributes while be important now that
we (humans) have populated all continents and are quickly filling up
open spaces things having to do with island cultures and mentalities,
but we have past skeletons in closets.  The question is whether
Eastern cultures adapt sooner than Western cultures.  But either way,
it's going to happen in the US first.  If it doesn't fly here, it
won't fly in the rest of the world.

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Acting Associate Editor, Software and Publication Reviews
  Scientific Programming
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Seeking Books to buy:	Bongard, Pattern Recognition
			Imhof, Cartographic Relief Presentation
			Books on or by Benjamin Whorf
From: paulko@lynx.cs.washington.edu (Paul Ko)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Interesting (suprising?) Fact.
Date: 9 Oct 92 19:58:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: beaver.1992Oct9.195852.22495
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering Dept., Univ. of Washington, Seattle
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Danielle T Wei (dtwei@acsu.buffalo.edu) wrote:
: In article <1992Oct8.223707.13013@beaver.cs.washington.edu> paulko@lynx.cs.washington.edu (Paul Konasewich) writes:
: >ZhiZhong Zhang (zzhang@soliton.rutgers.edu) wrote:
: >: when they are here. Now the interesting part, usually the girls who can 
: >: get chinese dates don't date Americans. Most of the times, only those
: >: who cannot date Chinese or Taiwanese date Americans. No offense to anyone
: >
: >Maybe for a small portion of Chinese women, this is true, but overall, I
: >just don't buy it. Maybe it's the part of the country that you live in,
: >but on here on the West coast, I've seen lots of very attractive Asian
: >women with Caucasian men. I find it hard to believe that these women
: >can't get dates with Chinese men.
: 
: A few possibilities here Paul:
: 
: 2> You're from Washington State, as far as I can remember, there are not
: a lot of schools out there and therefore does not attract very many Chinese
: (especially young Chinese males/students)

On the contrary, there is a very large Chinese and Chinese American population
at the University of Washington. The two largest student organizations are
Chinese Students Association (a majority of the members are Chinese American)
and another Chinese group in which most of the members are from China. If you've 
ever been to the UW, you can quickly see that Asians (and Chinese) are no small 
minority here.


: 3> I believe ZZZ is talking about Chinese-born girls/students here in the U.S.
: Naturally they prefer Chinese men 

I agree with this much, on a cultural basis ...

: (unless they're really desperate for a gcard)

But this "Green Card" theory of Chinese and American inter-cultural relationships
really bothers me.


: 4> american men do not understand beauty :)

Eye of the beholder, buddy.


: >On the other hand, maybe these women are OPEN MINDED and date by
: >PERSONAL QUALITIES and not COLOR and RACE.
: 
: Doubt it. trust me on this one: most (99%) chinese girls who date american men
: do it for: greencards/money/get into the american mainstream
: (no offense to the other 1%, which includes all of you guys)

Without statistics showing that a significant percentage of such marriages
are dissolved soon after the Chinese woman attains citizenship, and furthermore
stats which take into account the failure rate for any given marriage in the US,
I just don't believe this statement.

: 
: >Sincerely, Paul Ko.
:  ^^^^^^^^^ yeah right


I am endlessly annoyed by people who can hardly see further than color.


And for the record, the only Chinese girl (she grew up in Beijing) that I
ever dated already had US citizenship.

Oh yeah, and I'm not American. And I don't have money. And I'm not mainstream.

So go figure.


Very sincerely, Paul Ko.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.asian.american:9522 soc.culture.japan:8711