From: bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ron Bense)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity
Subject: Re: Germany Abortion Law and (was: Observations)
Date: 8 Sep 92 13:31:44 GMT
Reply-To: bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense)
Followup-To: talk.abortion
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In talk.abortion, beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver) writes:
>In article <24588@oasys.dt.navy.mil> bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense) wri
>tes:
>>In talk.abortion, beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver) writes:

>>>Try Germany, for example.  The zygote is a person at implantation,
>>>legally defined as 14 days after conception, and is then entitled
>>>to protection under the German constitution.  The debate has been
>>>over whether the mother has rights superior to the unborn child's,
>>>not whether the zygote is a person or not.

>>This statement is incorrect.  The German law was changed about two months
>>ago to reflect its new constituency.

>Have you read the text of the new law?  I'm not so sure it states
>that the fetus is not a person; rather, it would be consistent
>with the West German constitution to continue to regard the fetus
>as a person, but now to say that the woman's rights supercede the fetus's.

I have not read the text, only others interpretation of it, and the
brou-ha-ha that has followed it. Whatever else it says, it basically
allows a woman access to abortion, should she so desire. The religiously
mired folk, who, if I happen to remember correctly were primarily from
the southern Bavaria region, are the same folk who were the primary
section of that favorite group the SS. I don't know about you, but anything
that curtailed their influence, I would be in favor of.

>In any case, this law is still the subject of intense debate,
>and it is by no means beyond repeal.  Kinder-Kirche-Kuche
>(children-church-kitchen, for women) still runs strong, along with a
>pervasive xenophobia.  Have you seen any decisions handed down

This goes hand in hand with the previously mentioned ideals and beliefs
of that of so Catholic group. Ever wonder why the *only* organization
not to be pillaged in WWII was the Catholic Church? I say separation
of church and state is a definite ideal, and should be enforced to such
an extent that someone who is ruled only by his religion be barred from
any political office. (asbestos lined suit on:)

>Germany also provides extensive, constitutionally-guaranteed support
>for mothers (can you say, "bounty"?), as well as extremely female-oriented
>custody laws, to discourage abortions and encourage ("Aryan") population

Some of this I think is actually good, as I don't believe a mother should
be forced into poverty because she had a child. ANother thing you don't
mention is that Germany has a zero to negative growth rate, and because
all economists appear to be short-sighted morons who believe in infinite
growth, this worries governments who base their economic policies on
this premise. They really should look into maintaining a zero-growth
population and related economy. As for the Aryan stuff, that both worries
me and appears to be justified, esp. in light of this weekend's violence.

Ron

Potassium Benzoate included as a preserver.
Newsgroups: talk.abortion