HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,soc.roots
Subject: city name translation needed
Date: 6 Sep 92 22:41:41 GMT
Organization: CompuData Inc.

Anybody know what the former town of Preussisch-Eylau is now called.  Used to
be East Prussia.  Site of the first battle (1807) in Prussia that Napoleon did
not win.  He had 600,000 men lined up against Russian and Prussian troops.
Wound up to be pretty much of a draw.  Grandfather Max Louis Robiller was born
there in 1872 and I need to find whatever I can about him, etc.

Fred

-- 
W. Fred Rump 	office:	   fred@COMPU.COM     'mans feet have grown/so big 
26 Warren St.   home: fred@icdi10.compu.com  that he/forgets his littleness'
Beverly, NJ. 08010                          		Don Marquis 
609-386-6846    bang:uunet!cdin-1!icdi10!fr
From: carl.camurca%travel@wugate.wustl.edu (Carl Camurca)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Aussiedler
Date: 9 Sep 92 10:01:00 GMT
Reply-To: carl.camurca%travel@wugate.wustl.edu (Carl Camurca)
Organization: Travel Online, St. Louis, MO

PAB>>AC>Aber, was sind dann die Aussiedler ? Sind sie deutsch oder nicht ?
PAB>>AC>Haben sie eine doppelte Staatsangehoerigkeit ? Wer wird als deutsch
PAB>>AC>empfunden? Ist das mittels der Grenzen von 1937 bestimmt ?

PAB>>Jeder, dessen Familie einmal einen Deutschen Schaeferhund hatte.
PAB>>Natuerlich nicht laenger als 300 Jahre her.

PAB>Hmmm... ist mir neu, dass die Sowjets Leute mit deutschen Schaeferhunden
PAB>zur Arbeit in Arbeitslagern (nach Ende des Krieges) verschleppt hat.
PAB>Sie haben natuerlich ganz pingelig auf die 300 Jahre geachtet.

[Ironie off]

Seufz, das ist ein Missverstaendnis. Ich leugne nicht, dass es wirklich
verfolgte Deutschstaemmige und Leid unter ihnen gegeben hat.
Ich sehe nur nicht ein, warum verfolgte _Menschen_ mit 17 verschiedenen
Massstaeben gemessen werden.

PAB>Peter

Greetinx, Carl.

 * OLX 2.1 TD * Hey, don't pick up that dogW..NO TERRIER
From: meggers@memyam.UUCP (Markus Eggers)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Der Herr der Ringe...
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1992 16:30:05 GMT
Reply-To: meggers@SEMyAm.DinoCo.DE
Distribution: world
Organization: semyam - branch office play-room :-)
X-Newsreader: Arn V1.00 alpha rel3

In article <2374.178.uupcb@wugate.wustl.edu>, Carl Camurca writes:

> An die Anderen: Schon 'mal aufgefallen, dass die Boesen bei Tolkien in
> der Regel dunkel sind, im Osten und Sueden wohnen, dass "das edle Blut
> der Koenige von Arathorn durch fremde Einheiraten geschwaecht wurde",
> ganz zu schweigen von dem urgermanischen Reitervolk der Eowin (oder so
> aehnlich)?

   DAS  bestreitet  Tolkien  ja!   Diese  Aussage  wird  ihm nur IMMER
vorgehalten,  wenn  es  um  den  "Herr  der Ringe" im Zusammenhang mit
Faschismus geht.

   Aber  es passt halt immer so schoen in's Konzept:  Die boesen leben
im Osten (Aha!) und im Sueden (Aha!).  Die guten sind Blond (Aha!) und
die Boesen dunkel (Aha!) usw.  usf.  DAS nervt!

   Schoen  einmal  ueberlegt,  dass die Frage der Hautfarbe vielleicht
UNSERER  Welt angelehnt ist.  Im Sueden sind die Menschen ueberwiegend
dunkelhaeutig und haben nicht gerade oft helle Haare.

   Und  noch  eine Frage an euch.  Das Gute kaempft gegen das Boese um
das  Ueberleben.  Wuerde der Ring nicht zerstoert, so wuerde das Boese
die  Macht  ergreifen.   Wuerden  die  Guten nicht gegen die Boesen in
Helms  Klam  (ich  kenne  leider  nur  die  deutsche Uebersetzung), so
wuerden  sie  umgebracht.   Was  ist  daran faschistoid?  (Bitte nicht
wieder  das  Argument  mit  den  hell  und dunkelhaeutigen Wesen!) Sie
kaempfen  doch  nicht  darum,  dass  eine  andere "Rasse" (Orks o.ae.)
ausgerottet wird, sondern kaempfen um ihr UEBERLEBEN...


   Naja.  Ihr werdet schon wissen, was Tolkien mit dem Herrn der Ringe
ausdruecken bzw.  bezwecken wollte... :-)


gez. Markus

P.S.: Ich  will  auch die Zitate von Tolkien MIT Quellenhinweis sehen,
      die  seine  faschistoiden  Absichten  mit  dem  "Herr der Ringe"
      beweisen.   Bitte  keine  Zitate, in den von irgend jemand etwas
      hineininterpretiert wird bzw.  wurde!!!

--
\\   Markus Eggers, Max-Slevogt-Str. 1, D-5000 Koeln 91, FRG   //
 \X/            e-mail: meggers@SEMyAm.DinoCo.DE             \X/
From: carl.camurca%travel@wugate.wustl.edu (Carl Camurca) 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: "Undeutsche" Kultur
Date: 4 Sep 92 12:04:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Travel Online, St. Louis, MO
Reply-To: carl.camurca%travel@wugate.wustl.edu (Carl Camurca) 

HC>root@chamber.in-berlin.de (Patrick Wendt) schreibt

HC>Patrick: [...] aber wenn ich in der U-Bahn ca. 90 Prozent Auslaender
HC>Patrick: habe, nachts Angst haben muss, auf die Strasse zu gehen, und
HC>Patrick: z.B. in Berlin durch Kreuzberg renne, und nur noch tuerkische
HC>Patrick: Schrift, tuerkische Laeden und teilweise sogar tuerkische
HC>Patrick: Strassenschilder sehe, dann frage ich mich, wo ich bin ...?!

Wenn ich in Ostberlin auf die Strasse gehe, frage ich mich auch, wo ich
bin. Ich habe nachts Angst, in der U-Bahn oder S-Bahn zu fahren. Aber
nicht, weil ich Auslaender sehe (die beruhigen mich, sie koennten mir
gegen Skinheads helfen), sondern weil Deutsche Hohlkoepfe darin sein
koennten. Ich fuehle mich wesentlich sicherer auf der Strasse in
Kreuzberg (geborgen ist das Wort!), weil mich dort NIEMAND wegen meiner
Hautfarbe anmacht. In Wilmersdorf, Charlottenburg und Zehlendorf ist das
nicht so sicher, ganz zu schweigen von Frohnau.

HC>Wo Du dann bist? In Kreuzberg -- es ist doch allgemein bekannt, dass
HC>es in Kreuzberg viel tuerkische Einfluesse gibt.

Und ist es nicht wundervoll? So billig kann man sonst nirgendwo in
Deutschland Urlaub in der Tuerkei machen! Ich wage gar nicht an die
Berliner Kultur ohne "Doener" und "Gyros" (ich weiss, ist griechisch,
keine flames) zu denken! Sogar die Republikaner, die ich einst an ihrem
Info-Stand traf, wollten das zu Mittag (achachachach).

HC>Die kulturellen Unterschiede innerhalb Deutschlands sind teilweise
HC>spuerbar groesser als die zu anderen Nationen. Als Norddeutscher fuehle ich
HC> hier im Sueden fremd, und fuehle

:-)

HC>mich z.B. naeher an Holland als am Saarland. Ich habe in Bremen in
HC>einem Viertel mit relativ hohem tuerkischem Anteil gewohnt, und mich
HC>sehr gut daran gewoehnt. Ich hatte nie das Gefuehl, Angst haben zu
HC>muessen -- doch, bei Fussballspielen, wenn deutsche Schlaegertrupps
HC>durch das Viertel zogen (auf dem Weg vom Bahnhof zum Stadion).

sic.

HC>                        Hans Crauel     crauel@math.uni-sb.de
HC>                        Saarbruecken

gruss, Carl.

 * OLX 2.1 TD * No matter where you go, there you are. - B. Bonzai
                         
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: petsch@sylt.informatik.uni-kl.de (Petsch Wolfram - PA Meybrink)
Subject: Re: re:Annexation
Organization: University of Kaiserslautern, W-Germany
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 14:02:07 GMT

In article <2714.178.uupcb@wugate.wustl.edu> carl.camurca%travel@wugate.wustl.edu (Carl Camurca)  writes:
>TA>   Could you tell me then, what is left from the achievements (yes, there
>TA>   where some) of the GDR society?
>
>TA>I see - wasn't this called "But Hitler built the motorways" some time
>TA>ago?
>
>Now I go on shaky ground. They still were motorways. Germany is
>benefitting from its famous "Autobahn" to this day.
>Would you close them, because they were a Nazi invention? As far as I
>recall, there were not build with blood.
>Moreover, comparing the totalitarian GDR Regime with the Nazis is a bit
>strong, isn't it?
>Again, there were social achievements. Where are they?
>
>TA>Thorsten Altenkirch             LFCS, Edinburgh
>
NO NO!
The Autobahn was not invented by the Nazis. The Plans were made in the
early 20th. (for experts Hitler came to power in 1933!) The Project
was superwised by the Reichsbahn. So Autobahn is mostly paralel to the
Railtracks.
Hitler forced the construction of the Autobahn when he came to power.
He used it to put people to work again. So he did exactly the same
thing as the USA at that time. 
A lot people think the Autobahn was only built for military purpose.
As Germany never had bigger sources for oil the Autobahn was for the
german army useless. 

Wolfram Petsch


-- 
petsch@sylt.informatik.uni-kl.de (Wolfram Petsch)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,soc.culture.polish
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: common Polish-German action (was: Nazi Cam
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 15:16:30 GMT

In article <18599.2aac868f@levels.unisa.edu.au> etad@levels.unisa.edu.au writes:
>In article <1992Sep2.174854.3371@Princeton.EDU>, roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
>> In article <18466.2a9df70b@levels.unisa.edu.au> etad@levels.unisa.edu.au writes:
>>>In article <1992Aug25.234246.7745@dgbt.doc.ca>, ted@dgbt.doc.ca (Ted Grusec) writes:
>>
>>>> Prejudice against the Jews in Europe is well documented and nowhere
>>>                                                              ~~~~~~~~~~
>>>> was this worse than in Poland.  The nazis capitalized on the situation
>>>  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>> but I think responsibility for the death camps has to shared by the
>>>> whole of Europe and especially by those areas where prejudice was most
>>>> widespread.>

>>>Are you off your mind or what? Are you trying to say that Polish antisemites
>>>made Nazis exterminate Jews? I agree that the history of that time is
>>>reasonably well documented. Why don't you read something, then, before writing
>>>crap on the net?
>>
>> Why not read a little yourself?  Poland's many anti-Semites certainly didn't
>> oppose the German murder of their fellow citizens, and indeed quite a few
>> actually assisted in the effort.  Resistance to the Holocaust existed in
>> many countries; there was very little of that sort of thing in Poland.

>No doubt, you have an active interest in the topic. One can also see that you
>read. But is reading equal to a decent, unbiased study of the topic? Where do
>your sources come from? To me, they smell with Rabbi Waiss and the likes.

Who is Rabbi Waiss?  And why does he smell? And who are his likes?

>Or, maybe you were born in Poland before the II WW and lived through all this
>yourself?

No, but my father and his whole family were.  They come from Upper 
Silesia, some of which was German in 1937, some Polish.  They came
from both parts.  

Now, as others in this discussion have pointed out, there *was* quite a 
bit of Jew-hatred in the Poland of the 1930's, from high clerical and 
governmental authorities on down.  

I would like, at this point, to apologize for some incorrect statements
I made: about Polish guards in death camps, for instance (evidently,
there were none).  However, the reactions to my postings that suggested that
the Nazis could not have done their work alone anywhere in Europe, including
Poland, continue to astonish me (and, in one case, one of the outlandish
statements I was responding to wound up being attributed to me).  I bear
no special animus toward the Poles, or toward any people; it is individuals
who commit crimes of hatred, one by one.  

This is what we must remember, and we must also note when governments
encourage this kind of hatred.  

Roger
>Reagards
>--Arek Dadej


Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,soc.culture.australian
From: andrewt@watson.ibm.com (Andrew Taylor)
Subject: Re: German-Australian Dual Citizenship
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1992 17:22:28 GMT
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

In article <1992Sep8.051033.29249@ptcburp.ptcbu.oz.au>
michi@ptcburp.ptcbu.oz.au (Michael Henning) writes:
>2) Be born in Australia, with a German parent. You get Australian
>   citizenship because Australia bestowes citizenship by birthright,
>   and you get German citizenship because Germany applies inheritance law.
 
>   To get the German citizenship for him, I had to apply for his
>   citizenship on his behalf sometime before his 18th birthday

I'd recommend doing this. I've a friend who didn't because she considered
herself only Australian. She has since regretted it because a German
passport would have very useful in her travels. Quite a few countries
demand (slow to obtain and/or expensive) visas from Australians but not
from Germans.

Andrew taylor
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: lilly@nhmfl.fsu.edu (Leonhard Lilly)
Subject: Re: Priv. Autoexport von den USA nach Deutschland ???
Organization: Department of Physics, Florida State University, Tallahassee
	32306, USA
Date: 14 Sep 92 19:18:04

In article <1992Sep13.183208.19978@riscsm.scripps.edu> collet@scripps.edu (Thomas Collet) writes:

> Hat jemand hier schon einmal versucht, einen Wagen von den USA
> nach Deutschland zu bringen? Der Behoerdenweg scheint ja da ganz
> schoen kompliziert zu sein. Wenn das jemand schon einmal erfolg-
> reich hinter sich gebracht hat, waere ich interessiert, von ihm/
> ihr zu hoeren.

Ich auch!!!

> Tschuess,
>
> Thomas           COLLET@SCRIPPS.EDU
Leo
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Leonhard Lilly                     Internet:  lilly@theory.nhmfl.fsu.edu
Department of Physics                 Phone:  (904) 644 - 5075
FSU - NHMFL          
Tallahassee, FL 32306
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: kring@efes.physik.uni-kl.de (Thomas Kettenring)
Subject: Re: Wahlsinn ( was Re: SPD-Vorstand fuer GG-Aenderung im Asylrecht (leider)
Organization: FB Physik, Universitaet Kaiserslautern, Germany
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 21:11:14 GMT

In article <lbc7veINNi4p@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM>, silber@orfeo.Eng.Sun.COM (Eric Silber) writes:
> Die SPD hat nicht nur Deutschland entta"uscht, sondern auch viele
> Menschen im ,,Ausland'' die sie einst fu"r eine Partei der
> Gerechtigkeit hielten.  Was sagen jetzt die Greise Brandt und Schmidt
> zur engholmschen Anpasungspolitik ?[..]?

Vor allem wuerde mich interessieren, was Willy Brandt jetzt so denkt.
Schliesslich war er selber mal politisch verfolgt und hat unter falschem Namen
in Norwegen gelebt.  War da nicht so eine Klausel in einem Entwurf, dass
Fluechtlinge, die nicht ihren richtigen Namen angeben, direkt abgewiesen werden?
Naja, das ist wohl nicht so vergleichbar, da Norwegen von den Deutschen besetzt
war, aber trotzdem... wenn ich an seiner Stelle waere, wuerde ich einen Austritt
erwaegen (na gut, er weisz besser Bescheid als ich, und er tritt nicht aus.
Tut mir leid Leute, war nur so ne Idee von mir).

-- 
thomas kettenring, 2 dan, kaiserslautern, germany
Science is like democracy - it's not perfect, but it's the best thing available.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.german:6570 soc.culture.french:6792 soc.culture.usa:7283
From: jamshid@socrates.ucsf.edu (J. Naghizadeh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,soc.culture.french,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Bundesbank Moves to Reassure French
Keywords: interest rates, french referandum
Date: 14 Sep 92 20:29:24 GMT
Organization: UCSF Computer Graphics Lab

A New York Times front page article (Sept. 14) describes the
Bundesbank move to lower interest rates as politically motivated
and linked to the impending French referendum on Maastricht Treaty.
The move is likely to have negative influence on the referandum.
It may reinforce the French fear of German economic domination.

Excerpts from the article follow:

After days of turmoil on Europeans money markets, Germany promised tonight
to lower its high interest rates, a move that is expected to strengthen the
slipping dollar and take pressure off the troubled economies of Britain,
France and other European countries.

Word of Bonn's decision, announced by prime Minister Guiliano Amato
of Italy in Rome and the European community in Brussels, immediately 
drew sighs of relief from Paris and London. France and Netherlands
are expected to respond by lowering their interest rates making it
easier for businesses to borrow money and thus inject some sense of
movement into the European economy.

Significantly Germany's decision, made in tandem with an Italian
agreement to devalue its currency, was announced just a week before
the French vote on a referandum on European political and economic
unity. For months Germany has resisted pressure from its allies and
trading partners to cut its interest rates, and only last week, the
President of the Bundesbank said the bank saw "no room for maneuver
to lower rates."

.....
-J.N.
From: simon@lia.di.epfl.ch (Simon Leinen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Author unknown
Date: 15 Sep 92 12:31:23 GMT
Organization: DI-LIA -- Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne
In-reply-to: 00rgyoung@bsu-ucs.uucp's message of 14 Sep 92 18:51:18 GMT
X-Md4-Signature: 06cc0a21dc2aa9e9ec95080fdd54edc5

In article <1992Sep14.135118.9528@bsu-ucs.uucp> 00rgyoung@bsu-ucs.uucp writes:

	 Drei Sonnen sah ich am Himmel stehn,
	 hab' lang und fest sie angesehn,
  [...]

This is from "die Winterreise", a sequence of twenty-four poems of
similar style which has become famous because Franz Schubert composed
a version for voice and piano.  The best known of these songs is
probably "der Lindenbaum" ("Am Brunnen vor dem Tore").  Your poem
("die Nebensonnen") is the second to last song unless I'm mistaken.

The author is otherwise pretty unknown and I think he is called
Wilhelm Mueller.  If you are interested in the complete text of the
Winterreise, it is probably easiest to buy a record of the Schubert
lieder cycle with lyrics (at least the CD version of the
Fischer-Dieskau/Brendel recording has them).  And you also get the
beautiful music.
-- 
Simon.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: schieber@jetson.uh.edu (Schieber, Jay D.)
Subject: Re: Violence update: 4 Sept 1992
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 17:23:00 GMT

In article <MYO65HD@math.fu-berlin.de>, dww@inf.fu-berlin.de writes...
>It was a rather quiet night, it seems. Must be because there was a prime-time
>TV show on "From Potzdam to the Spreewald" showing overweight Germans enjoying
>cake and coffee on a boat while listening to German Schlagersaenger lip-syncing
>good old German Heimatmusik.
>("Kein schoener Land in dieser Zeit, als der die unsre weit und breit,
>wo wir uns finden, wohl unter Linden, zur Abendzeit...")
> 
>Updates:
> 
>- The detonation of the Jewish momument in Berlin appears to have been
>done with military dynamite. The police only have 5 leads and have made
>no arrests. There has been no group that has claimed responsibility.
> 
>- One of the youths that burned down the home for asylum seekers in Brandenburg
>near Potsdam has confessed. Seems the villagers and the asylum seekers were
>on very good terms (people brought by toys for the kids and clothes, etc.). The
>youths were from a neighboring village and do not seem to belong to a right-
>wing organization. They set the fire "just for fun", and since there had been
>no threats to this home there was little police protection needed. A pregnant
>woman suffered a nervous breakdown when she returned and saw that the few things
>she had brought with her had been burned. 
> 
>- A fire-bombing was reported in Hohenschonhausen, an eastern district of Berlin,
>last night. 2 youths (20 and 21 years old) broke a window in a home for Vietnamese
>guest workers and threw burning rags in. Witnesses doused the flames, called police
>and described the youths. They were arrested as they stood on the sidelines
>watching what was happening. [Three cheers for the witnesses that DID something!]
> 
>- The usual polls "if-Sunday-was-election-day-who-would-you-vote-for" brought
>surprising results: 14% of the WESTERNERS would vote for DFU or the Republicans
>(the extreme right wing), "only" 9% of the Easterners would. 
>-- 
>Debora Weber-Wulff                       dww@inf.fu-berlin.de
>Institut fuer Informatik                 +49 30 89691 124
>Nestorstr. 8-9                           (INCLUDE "standard.disclaimer")
>D-W-1000 Berlin 31                       (PRINTN (WITTY-MESSAGE TODAY))


Dear Debora, please keep those news items coming--they are informative
and very well edited.  I also enjoy the humour.
From: alti@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Thorsten Altenkirch)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Rostock, Berlin, usw.
Date: 8 Sep 92 13:01:24 GMT
	<4021@elwood.prz.tu-berlin.de> <1992Sep7.140411.18180@cs.tu-berlin.de>
Organization: LFCS, Edinburgh
In-reply-to: net@cs.tu-berlin.de's message of 7 Sep 92 14:04:11 GMT

In article <1992Sep7.140411.18180@cs.tu-berlin.de> net@cs.tu-berlin.de (Oliver Laumann) writes:

   jost@speedy.prz.tu-berlin.de (Jost Weinmiller) writes:
   > schon mal davon gehoert, dass das ziemlich unwichtig ist, ob man 
   > gross oder Klein schreibt?

   Wohl kaum.  Was ist der Unterschied zwischen

      ``Er kaufte Eisen und stahl''

   und

      ``Er kaufte Eisen und Stahl''?

Wei\3 nich, habe nie eisen gekauft noch stahl gestohlen, aber das
erinnert mich an die zeit, wo ich in Berlin liebe genossen hatte...

T.
--
************************************************************
Thorsten Altenkirch		alti@dcs.ed.ac.uk
LFCS, Edinburgh
Scotland
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: psima01@convex.zdv.uni-tuebingen.de (M. Maisack)
Subject: to F.Rump: Preussisch Eylau = Bagrationovsk
Organization: Comp. Center (ZDV) U of Tuebingen, FRG
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 07:12:13 GMT

well, it's all in the header, isn't it?

depending on preference, I guess the "v" can be replaced
by a "w"

Michael
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: mhs@fokus.gmd.de (M.Schmeil)
Subject: Dollar / Neger klatschen
Organization: GMD-Fokus (Berlin)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 11:22:59 GMT

eine frage und ein kommentar (und zur freude aller beamten in
kleinschreibung).

frage: ist hier irgendjemand banker oder bwl-ler der mir sagen
kann, ob der dollar demnaechst (2-3 wochen) wieder faellt oder
weiter steigt? ich hab naemlich vor in einem monat nach ami-land
zu fahren und aergere mir die hucke voll, dass ich den 1.37 kurs
verpennt habe.

kommentar: unabhaengig, der 'politisch motivierten' (?) tat der
leute die den angolaner gekillt haben (in berlin und umgebung
werden auch deutsche von deutschen oder deutsche von auslaendern
mal einfach so totgeschlagen): in sat1 blick (oder irgendwas 
anderem) wurde die strafe der leute (zwischen 2 und 4 jahren)
als 'hart' bezeichnet. gab's da mildernde umstaende? ich kenn
leute die wegen pruegeleien (kretin vs. kretin) 2(?) jahre
eingefahren sind. 2-4 jahre gleichbedeutend mit einem
'harten' urteil: wundert mich doch sehr!
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
From: rcl3r@helga2.acc.Virginia.EDU (Robert C. Lewis)
Subject: Octoberfest information request
Originator: rcl3r@helga2.acc.Virginia.EDU
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 13:36:23 GMT


-- 
Internet rcl3r@Virginia.EDU           Nothin' left to do but :-) :-) ;-)
BITNET   rcl3r@VIRGINIA
UUCPNet  ...!uunet!virginia!rcl3r
I have /Re:/ in my KILL file, so reply directly to me if you want a response
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,soc.culture.australian
From: miw@cc.uq.oz.au (Mark I. Williams)
Subject: Re: German-Australian Dual Citizenship
Organization: Prentice Centre, University of Queensland
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1992 01:57:16 GMT

peta@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu (Peter Whaite) writes:

>The constitution is obviously antiquated and, like the ban on Australian borns
>holding dual citizenship, should be changed.

This so-called 'ban' is as a result of an international convention to
which most countries, including Canada, have subscribed. It is also
relatively recent (mid-seventies?), so I don't know how you can call it
antiquated.

cheers,

--
Mark Williams         The University of Queensland       miw@cc.uq.edu.au
+61 7 36 54012   (w)  Prentice Centre
+61 7 36 54477  (fax) Qld 4072  Australia
Nullum magnum ingenium sine mixtura dementiae fuit.  -- Seneca