HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Starting an alternative medicine newsgroup
Keywords: alternative medicine
Date: 7 Oct 92 15:16:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1992Oct7.151623.26749
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <0m59RB3w165w@sound.cts.com> markr@sound.cts.com (Mark B. Reinhold) writes:
>I to wonder want is making people react so quickly. One person said
>visualization is quackery. Does this mean then that Yale medical school
>is a Quack school? They have classes in taught by Dr. Bernie Seigel.

Gee, if someone who teaches at Yale says something stupid, it _must_ be
correct!  I would be quite surprised if that guy ever said something
like the following in a class at Yale Medical School--he'd be driven
off the campus.  Of course, these schiester-meisters of feeling good
are just revivalists repackaged-- they'll say anything in front of an
ignorant crowd.

>I realize some people think that he is a quack, but his 16 aids pt.s who
>were tested HIV postive and are now HIV negative have a different view.

People who test positive for HIV do not become HIV negative as a result
of their "visualization" or their good feelings.  They might become HIV
negative because theirs was the earliest of the early tests which
registered a false positive.  Visualization and warm thoughts work very
well in such situations.

This is the dark side of the new age tripe which gullible people are
swallowing wholesale.  It's just a repackaging of sin, guilt and
forgiveness in a secular wrapping.  Nowadays people who die of cancer
or AIDS or other diseases don't work hard enough.  You sort of wish
these creeps who push such nonsense could somehow be forced to confront
their mortality every morning.

>So do all his ECAP pt.s who are experiencing remissions of their cancer.

How lucky for them.

>So do I. I have had a remission of Systemic Lupis now for 21 years.

I guess that this is not unusual with lupus doesn't have much to do with it.

>There is a lot of stuff in the alternative med areas that I would
>question greatly. There is a lot of "scientific" medicine that I also
>question greatly.

How can someone "question greatly" anything without faculties and
knowledge to make a reasonable judgement?

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: cam@castle.ed.ac.uk (Chris Malcolm)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Put up or shut up  (was: alternative medicine newsgroup)
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:00:45 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

In article <1992Oct9.094313.12019@vms.eurokom.ie> mdebuitlear@vms.eurokom.ie writes:

>I believe that a certain type of photograph (the name eludes me, I'm afraid)
>shows up the electrical fields in and around the body.

Kirlian photography. The evidence of Kirlian photography for these
fields was due to careless experimental control and interpretation by
people who didn't understand static electricity. The so-called fields
are artefacts of the method of photography.

>In fact, after the amputation of say a leg, the energy 
>continues to flow uninterrupted for quite for some to where the leg used to 
>be.

No Kirlian photograph ever showed this. They showed this effect when
parts of vegatables were amputated, and the experiementers generalised
from this to supposing that it worked for animals. But in fact the
vegetable effect was an artefact of poor control of the photogrpahic
process, which is very sensitive indeed to microscopic -- not visible
to the naked eye -- contamination of the charged plates.

Kirlian photography is a wonderful example of what can happen when
people who do not understand the design and control of experiments
start making "experiments" with a technology they do not understand
either.  Despite the fact that it was all simple nonsense dreamed up
by people who had been asleep during their school science classes,
books are still being written about this wonderful "evidence" simply
because the photographs look very like what auras are supposed to look
like.

>In addition, a before and after photograph proves that the flow of energy 
>changes after a session of acupuncture.  

It proves nothing of the sort. First of all the Kirlian process is so
sensitive that it is very hard to get two photos the same; secondly
the slight changes in local moisture distribution and skin resistance
which are an inevitable result of sticking pins in a person will
produce great differences in the before and after photographs.

>Btw, how would you provide a placebo in acupuncture - pretend to stick the 
>neddles in ?

Since the exact location of the needles is very important, why not
simply stick them in the wrong places?

There may actually be something in acupuncture, as some careful
studies have suggested. Unfortunately acupuncture is severely
discredited because so many people who believe in it do so for the
kind of totally unbaked reasons displayed in this posting. With
support like this acupuncture needs no enemies.
-- 
Chris Malcolm    cam@uk.ac.ed.aifh          +44 (0)31 650 3085
Department of Artificial Intelligence,    Edinburgh University
5 Forrest Hill, Edinburgh, EH1 2QL, UK                DoD #205
From: James_S._Bright.wbst129@XEROX.COM
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Pt 1, RADIOACTIVE MEAT, MILK & PRODUCE
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:53:45 GMT
Reply-To: JBright.Wbst129@xerox.com


>One day in the spring of 1984, a teenager in eastern Oklahoma's
>Muskogee County took his BB gun and went hunting at a pond by
>Rabbit Hill Farm.  He shot a frog that had nine legs.

I seem to remember an episode of the Simpson's about this fish that had three
eyes! Apparantly living in a pond next to the nuclear power plant caused this
abnormality. Wow! I never took it seriously until just now!  :)

Anedote: I've lived within 5 miles of a nuclear power plant most of my life.
Never seen or heard of a two headed anything in Lake Ontario or around this
area yet. (RG&E's power plant is right on the lake and uses (I believe) some of
the lake's water to cool the reactor)

I, for one, really don't care to see the other parts of this tread. If I did,
I'd go to alt.conspiracy.

jbright.wbst129@xerox.com

disclaimer: These views are strictly my own, are not meant to represent
Xerox, its associates, my parents, my school, nor my dog's.
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: bhjelle@carina.unm.edu ()
Subject: Re: MEDICINE SLOWER TO CATCH UP
Date: Wed, 07 Oct 92 23:27:22 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <1992Oct7.194609.4806@sr.com> dks@srhqla.sr.com (Dave K. Sprow) writes:

>What brought this to my attention again is today's reports on CNN and
>the newspapers that margarine is bad for you (yes, worse than butter)
>and that is likely causes heart disease.  
>
>"The Agriculture Department has now confirmed the Dutch study."  The
>particular culprit is trans fatty acids.

This idea has been tossed around in the medical/scientific community
for years. Now someone apparently is claiming that an ill effect
has occurred, by doing a (presumably) standard, controlled study.
Another triumph of Western medicine!

>Again, my only point is to ask the ridiculous, i.e, for the medical and
>scientific communities to put more of their research dollars into
>their own research from claims from more alternative approaches of
>health care rather than just debunking everything from some superior

Eh? I don't recall this particular issue being a cause among
the "alternative medicine" crowd. In fact, I think few have
enough chemistry background to realize that hydrogenation
can produce the "unnatural" trans-fatty acids in margarine.

>self-serving attitude.  Honestly, as far as I can see, these alternative
>approaches seem to be about 20 years or so ahead of established
>medical thinking. Medicine does a lot.  It would great if they could
>be more open-minded and at least *consider* some of these things.  We
>would all be better off if they people with the most money would put
>some of those research dollars into this kind of research... with some
>commitment to thr truth, not protecting special interest.

Ho-hum. While this looks superficially to be another witless
diatribe against the great medical-establishment conspiracy,
I can't agree more that biomedical research should be funded
at far higher levels than it is now.

So write your congressman. Ask for more money for NIH.

Brian
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: res4w@galen.med.Virginia.EDU (Robert E. Schmieg)
Subject: Re: Pancreas Anomaly
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 14:39:57 GMT

   There are several anatomical anomalies of the pancreas that
are of clinical concern.  Understanding the embryological
development of the pancreas is extremely helpful in understanding
these anomalies.  The pancreas forms from two buddings from
the duodenum at about the 4th week of gestation (one ventral,
one dorsal).  The ventral bud is smaller, is closely
associated with the developing common bile duct, and
eventually becomes the major portion of the pancreatic head.
The major pancreatic duct, or duct of Wirsung, forms from this
ventral bud.  The dorsal bud is larger, and eventually becomes
the pancreatic neck, body, tail, and superior aspect of the
head, thus making up most of the bulk of the adult pancreas.
The ductal system of the dorsal bud becomes the minor
pancreatic duct, or duct of Santorini.

   Between weeks 4 and 8, the ventral bud migrates dorsally,
and at about week 8, the two buds meet and fuse.  The ductal
systems also fuse, and the duct of Wirsung becomes the major
drainage system of the bulk of the pancreas.

   So how can things go wrong?  Several ways:
1) heterotopic pancreas tissue - pancreatic tissue develops
outside of the body of the main gland, and can be found
submucosally, usually in the stomach, duodenum, small bowel,
or Meckel's diverticulum.  Complications include
intussusception, ulceration, and hemorrhage; chronic
pancreatitis is NOT a major associated complication as far as
I know.

2) pancreas divisum - the ventral and dorsal buds fail to fuse
together.  The bulk of the pancreas, from the dorsal bud,
drains its exocrine secretions from the duct of Santorini
through the minor papilla.  This anomaly is seen more
frequently in patients with chronic idiopathic pancreatitis,
but whether a causal relationship exists is still
controversial.

3) annular pancreas - (rare) - normal pancreatic tissue
encircles the duodenum; may be due to the ventral bud
failing to rotate clockwise around the duodenum, possibly due
to abnormal fixation of free end of ventral bud.  This can
result in varying degrees of obstruction of the duodenum.
Presentation in childhood is usually the case, with symptoms
of duodenal obstruction; other congenital anomalies associated
with this include intracardiac defects and intestinal
malrotation.  Some people with these anomalies may have no
symptoms in childhood, but rather present in adult life (about
4th decade) with symptoms including upper gastrointestinal
obstruction, peptic ulcer, or chronic pancreatitis.

   The case of which you were talking could fit into the
annular pancreas or pancreas divisum categories from the
complaint of chronic pancreatitis; a CT scan would probably
only pick up the annular pancreas anomaly, which might appear
more as two seperate major pancreatic masses around the
duodenum, with attenuated organ tissue completing the
encirculation of the duodenum
From: ray@philmtl.philips.ca (Ray Dunn)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Starting an alternative medicine newsgroup
Date: 8 Oct 92 18:28:20 GMT
Organization: On the Brew.

In referenced article, km@cs.pitt.edu (Ken Mitchum) writes:
>Sorry, but for me it's a matter of guilt by association: I really do not
>want to post to a group where most people feel equally comfortable getting
>their medical information from the National Enquirer as from legitimate
>sources.

Yes, then I think you have a _real_ problem, because a significant
proportion of your everyday patients probably fall into that category too.
But you do the group an injustice.  Most of the readers are just as capable
of rejecting the bogus as you are. 

Why do you think another group will make the fringe leave sci.med?  _They_
are just as interested in spreading their views as are yourself, Dyers,
Banks etc. are compelled to counter them.  No all another group will do is
create an audience for the fringe views.

>I wash my hands after every posting, by the way, and pray that
>my colleagues never discover this disgusting habit.

Bizarre this compulsion to post to the net against all instincts, isn't it?
That's clearly another problem.  But at least it gives us some insight into
other compulsive behaviour, doesn't it.
-- 
Ray Dunn at home        |  Beaconsfield, Quebec  |  Phone: (514) 630 3749
ray@philmtl.philips.ca  |  dunn@cam.org          |  uunet!sobeco!philmtl!ray
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: jkenton@world.std.com (Jeff Kenton)
Subject: Re: Centigrade (was: What body temp for cardiac surgery?)
Organization: Kenton Systems Corporation, Weston MA
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 17:29:49 GMT

In article <1687B77B5.M20614@mwvm.mitre.org> M20614@mwvm.mitre.org (Hugh Pritchard) writes:
>In article <BvrzH5.I3M@news.fai.com>
>luisg@hadar.fai.com (Luis Galleguillos) writes:
> 
>>... The normal body temperature is
>>around 28.7 I think. I am assuming that by C we mean Celsius orCentigrades.
>>Are all the remaining figures correct ? The freezing point
>>of water is 0 C. 18 C is pleasant ambient temperature and 28 C is hot.
>>One can withstand tempreature of up tp 50 C for brief periods.

The Guinness Book of Records shows people withstanding far higher
external temperatures than this.  Well above 100 C.

> 
>Um, I disagree with your figure for human body temp in degrees C.
> 
>  F      C
> ---    ---
> 212    100    Water boils
>  98.6   37    Human body temp
>  68     20    Room temperature
>  32      0    Water freezes
>   0    -17.8  Sea water freezes
> -40    -40    Temperature where degrees F is the same number as degrees C

		. . . and mercury solidifies.  Time for a new thermometer.


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
=			Jeff Kenton	(617) 894-4508			=
=			    jkenton@world.std.com			=
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Friday, 16 Oct 1992 13:28:55 CDT
From: Yakof <U50701@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: PDR software

Hi, would anyone happen to have a copy of Physician's Desk Reference on a disk
for IBM, old copies (not older than 1989) are fine.
Thanks
From: tbachman@hamline.edu. (Toni Bachmann 6412947)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Testing
Date: 16 Oct 92 13:06:53 GMT
Organization: Hamline University, St. Paul, Minnesota. [The Little U]

Sorry - just testing something.
Newsgroups: sci.med
From: kjc7435@ultb.isc.rit.edu (K.J. Cater)
Subject: Re: acne treatment?
Originator: kjc7435@ultb
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 15:20:21 GMT

Hi. I had very bad acne for years (age 16 to 21) and tried just about
everything for it.  Had it all over my back, my chest, my face...
even had spots on my scalp and some on my buttocks.  I tried
OTC medicines (made my skin dried out), prescriptions (Retin-A made it
even worse), sulfur topical apps. (worked for a while but stunk up my
clothes REALLY badly), and a liquid erythromycin prescription which
worked really well on my back (the whiteheads there were awful, esp.
each summer).

I found something that worked--Kiehl's Cosmetics. I am NOT trying to
solicit products over the net; I am trying to tell you what worked for
me--my skin cleared up and they have a variety of skin and beauty
products available for ALL skins for all ages.  if you are interested,
please e-mail me at: "kjc7435@ritvax.isc.rit.edu".

The other thing that really worked for me.  I was diagnosed with
hyperthyroidism (have been treated since) earlier this year and my skin
cleared up even more.  You might consider having your endocrine system
checked (blood test) to see if this is causing the problem.

If you know anyone in England, also tell them to get you a few bars of
coal tar soap.  That helped my facial acne considerably and over time
got out the worst of the blackheads on my nose and forehead.

Good luck!!

Miss Kerry Cater.

Newsgroups: sci.military
From: hhtra@usho21.hou281.chevron.com (T.M.Haddock)
Subject: Re: New IR Jammer on Apache helicopters?
Organization: Chevron
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 02:43:02 GMT


From hhtra@usho21.hou281.chevron.com (T.M.Haddock)

In article <Bvq4q8.DJH@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM>, mccd@rosie.uh.edu (R. Golshan (713)-743-1540) writes:
|> 
|> From mccd@rosie.uh.edu (R. Golshan (713)-743-1540)
|>       I went to the Houston airshow this past Saturday.  Apparently the Apache 
|> helicopter is now  equipped with a new IR jammer.  I asked one of the pilots
|> about the device that was installed on the top of the helicopter, and was told
|> that they have installed the device on the helicopter about  one week ago.  I 
|> was told that the device is a Radar Jammer, however, due to the way it appears 
|> I beleive it is more likely that it is a new IR jammer.  It was a relatively 
|> small cylinder which had ten mirrored sides, and had three mirrors on each 
|> side(A total of 30 reflectors).  It looked exactly like a Disco light!  It 
|> seems like a new counter measure against Stinger missiles.


  It's a IR or Laser DETECTOR!

  It lets the pilots know that they are either being scanned by active
  IR or Laser. It may even detect the IR signature of an approaching 
  missile.

  You can't jam IR! 
  Well... I quess ya could.  What you'd need is a big bottle of liquid
  nitrogren and a spray nozzle mounted on top.  Then, when threatened,
  simply spray the liquid nitrogren all over you and presto...
  no more IR!


  TRAVIS
  hhtra@hou281.chevron.com





Newsgroups: sci.military
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: WWII -- Why didn't Japan invade Hawaii?
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 16:33:37 GMT


From ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)


From ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)

In article <BvxDur.MEG@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson) writes:

|	Does the phrase "sacrifice fly" mean anything to you outside
|of baseball?  When the zeros were done with the torpedo planes, they
|were low on fuel, ammunition, and the carriers were taking them
|aboard.  The dive bombers (Douglass SBD's if I'm not mistaken) had a
|clear initial run and took advantage of it.


It also takes a heckuva long time to climb from 1000 feet to 15000. It
would have been difficult to intercept the bombers any time before their
bomb runs if you're down there on the deck.






-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !

Newsgroups: sci.military
From: merlin@neuro.usc.edu (merlin)
Subject: Re: Uzi SMG: Desert Performance
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 15:23:08 GMT


From merlin@neuro.usc.edu (merlin)

In article <...> swkmorri@nuscc.nus.sg (Perry Morrison (Dr)) writes:
>The Uzi submachine gun was developed by the israelis and by most
>account was most successful in combat and as an export item. 

My friends in the IAF tell me the Uzi is a generally unattractive 
weapon for desert warfare.  Combat soldiers tend to favor a folding 
stock weapon called the Gallil (sp?) which is far more accurate and
perhaps more devestating in terminal effects.  While I was traveling
in Israel I saw many M-16's in the hands of young trainees, Gallil's
in the hands of experienced soldiers, and only a few Uzi's.  Some of
the M-16's were equipped with underbarrel 40mm grenade launchers.
From: pshyvers@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Peter Shyvers)
Newsgroups: sci.military
Subject: Re: WWII -- Why didn't Japan invade Hawaii?
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:35:49 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA


From Peter Shyvers <pshyvers@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com>


In article <Bw2JHB.AD4@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> mat@mole-end.matawan.nj.us writes:
>
>From mat@mole-end.matawan.nj.us
>
>In article <BvxpGr.1nJ@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM>, Charles.K.Scott@dartmouth.edu (Charles K. Scott) writes:
>> 
>> From Charles.K.Scott@dartmouth.edu (Charles K. Scott)
>
>> No wonder the title for the book "Miracle at Midway".
>
>> ... the Japanese withdrew slowly, turning back several times to attempt
>> battle but could not catch the American fleet which cannily backed off in
>> an almost prescient fashion under the orders of the now in charge Admiral
>> Raymond Ames Spruance.  ...
>
>Does anyone have more information, or a good reference on Spruance?  _MaM_
>mentions that he was a gunship admiral who took over a carrier fleet and

I don't recall Spruance coming up for such praise again. My recollection was
that he came off of cruisers; maybe it's post-war legend, but he was chosen
for a pattern of aggressive action with undersized forces...
Newsgroups: sci.military
From: chadwemy@wpi.WPI.EDU (Chad Barret Wemyss)
Subject: Re: New Carrier Plan
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 21:47:24 GMT


From chadwemy@wpi.WPI.EDU (Chad Barret Wemyss)

In article <Bvq4E3.Cyw@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> chf0@harvey.gte.com (Curtis Fennell) writes:

>If it were up to me, every service would lose some, but the Air Force
>would lose the most.


Just out of curiosity, why?

Chad Wemyss
Worcester Polytechnic Institute
From: ummorea0@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Gene Moreau)
Newsgroups: sci.military
Subject: Re: Question about aircrew bailing out
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:40:27 GMT
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada


From Gene Moreau <ummorea0@ccu.umanitoba.ca>


From Gene Moreau <ummorea0@ccu.umanitoba.ca>

In <Bw0os0.LtK@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> barrongj@cs.curtin.edu.au (Greg Barron) writes:


>From barrongj@cs.curtin.edu.au (Greg Barron)

>Curtis Gibson <curt@quest.uucp> writes:


>>From Curtis Gibson <curt@quest.uucp>
[original bail out question deleted]

>My brother is an AEA in a P3c and I asked him about this a while ago.

>I'm pretty sure that they don't have chutes. He said that if something
>goes wrong over the ocean they would ditch the plane becuase it
>contains everything they would need for survival ie water, rafts etc.

That's funny, I went ona tour of P-3C and every little hole that didn't have
equipment in it had parachuted jammed in.  It may have just been for the 
air show though.


-- 
Gene Moreau                 | "Morning comes far to early when it's cold
University of Mantitoba     |  outside and there is a maniac on the loose"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada  |    - unknown
ummorea0@cuu.umanitoba.ca
Newsgroups: sci.military