HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: v134rrxt@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (V134RRXT)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Diablo...
Date: 9 Apr 92 02:23:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Apr8.202241.24122@athena.mit.edu>, zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) writes...
>In article <1992Apr8.071100.18244@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> an512@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bruce Lee) writes:
>>
>>In a previous article, zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) says:
>>
>>>>That'll probably be the last time anyone sees it too...after all, didn't I 
>>>>read somewhere that the customs are only not allowed on the palace compounds??
>>>>Funny, buying a $2.1M car and driving it in your backyard!!! 
>>>>
>>>>If that's not classified as DUMB, I dunno what is, eh Zam??? (No need for
>>>>apologies Eme)
>>>
>>>	The joke is on you, dumbo!  The custom officers are not
>>>allowed on the Palace compound in case they are thinking of
>>>confiscating the car.  That is what it is supposed to mean.  If you
>>>are going to read between the lines, please do it when you are not
>>>suffering from dyslexia.
>>
>>
>>...That'll probably...didn't I read somewhere that "the custom officers
>>are not allowed on the Palace compound in case they are thinking of
>>confiscating the car"??? Anyhow I see it, there is still:
>>
>>		1 (one) bad sentence structure,
>>
>>		1 (one) DUMB SULTAN,
>>
>>		1 (one) DUMB Kelantanese on his Sultan's side.
>>
>>
>>Dumbo the Elephant.
>>-- 
> 
>	Definitely better than:
> 
>1) An unfaithful little bastard whose allegiance is with the PRC.
> 
>2) A guy who can't speak BM without that stooopid Chinese accent.	
                                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

> 
>3) A guy who makes "la" an art form.
> 
>4) A possible PKM recruit.
> 
>===------ 
>NorAazizam MohdAAsif	 
>The white man made many promises to us but they never kept but one; they
>promised to take our land and they took it.
>                                                        Red Cloud



	Umm ? Wonder what should i say to NorAaz ? 
Oh yes !  " Go fuck yourself " quote from NorAazizam.
From: zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Zam Again!
Date: 16 Apr 92 06:27:47 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

In article <1992Apr16.054541.27224@leland.Stanford.EDU> rezal@leland.Stanford.EDU (Rezal Adzly Abdul Rahman) writes:
>In article <1992Apr16.034044.2999@athena.mit.edu> zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) writes:
>>
>>
>>	I am sure you don't know the ones that I am talking about.
>>They have never been to any UMNO meetings, and their fathers are some
>>of the most influential people in Malaysia.  Let's just leave it at
>>that; I am not going to name names.
>
>So, the fact that a Malay does not go to any UMNO meetings makes him
>not worthy of being one?

	There are some misunderstandings here.  Kelab UMNO Boston is
not a political group, but rather a social one.  Every normal Malay
student would be a part of it; even students who live in Worcester and
have to drive an hour each way make it to the meeting almost every
time (not to mention the free food).  It is a social group that almost
all Malay students in Boston become a part of.  There are however a
small number of Malays in this area, who for some reasons or another,
never attends this social gathering.  While it is definitely their
rights to do so, when it is accompanied with "I don't mix the Malays"
comment, you know for sure that their unwillingness to attend the
meeting was not because they are anti-social, but because they do not
want to mingle with other Malays.  Like I said before, there is no
need to name names, as it will definitely put the little people like
myself in a very serious predicament.  This will definitely be my last
posting on this subject.

>If their dads are influential, so what?
>What has that got to do with them?
>Are you inferring that their lavish lifestyles are making them forget
>their Malay roots?
>At least they're not grouping together and interacting with a single race!
>Why all the presumptions?

	If their dads are influential, they can screw your lives
upside down.  End of the story.

===------ 
NorAazizam MohdAAsif	 
The white man made many promises to us but they never kept but one; they
promised to take our land and they took it.
                                                        Red Cloud
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: dlg6627@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Darmawan  Ludirdja)
Subject: Re: East Timor Communist ? NOT!
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 05:19:41 GMT

chuah@elec.canterbury.ac.nz (DanC) writes:

>In article <1992Apr16.175412.17545@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> dlg6627@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Darmawan  Ludirdja) writes:

>>>Yep, you are probably right.  There are no jails or slaughter houses.
>>>The army just shoots people in the streets, remember last November?
>>
>>Prove it!. Where did you find "rumors" tellling Indonesian army shoots
>>people in the streets. You need to know that there were 2 generals sacked 
>>for their responsibility in the November 12 accident.

>Just take a look at the various East Timor postings.  Look at the
>article I forwarded from SEASIA-L.  Read twhat the new commander in
>chief said.  After reading that come and tell me its all a rumour.

Hehehehe....Anti-govt. propaganda. The opposite of your reply below. :-)

>>>Govt. propaganda at the least.  I haven't seen a "free" newspaper in
>>>Indonesia before.
>>
>>I haven't seen any "free" newspaper either. Is there any in Malaysia?
>>For sure there is no free newspaper in Indonesia ever (as I remember).

>For sure.  There is *NO* "free" newspaper in Indonesia or Malaysia.
>They are all govt controlled to some degree.  That's my point.

Did you ever complaint to Malaysian Govt??? because of controlling
the news?

>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Dennis Chuah, BE (Elec)    | "One Country,  | Supporting the Malaysian 
>Te Whare Wananga O Waitaha | One People." - | Hockey team for gold in 
>Aotearoa.                  | Maori proverb. | Barcelona.
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>"Pencangkul Matahari" email: chuah@stargate.elec.canterbury.ac.nz


Darmawan
dlg6627@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
From: hmng@buengf.bu.edu (hockmin ng)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: To all you weenies....
Date: 16 Apr 92 12:51:07 GMT
Reply-To: hmng@buengf.bu.edu (hockmin ng)
Followup-To: soc.culture.asean
Organization: College of Engineering, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA


>>>  But knowing that you Chinese will do anything for the money,
>>>will you do your father, mom, sisters and brothers if someone offers
>>>enough money?  I bet you would...

>	In other words, you will pimp your mom if it furthers your
>causes, am I right?  Boy, you are predictable.  Tell me something:
>would you pimp your wife just so that you can get a promotion?  I bet
>you would...
>

>Eat shit you self-appointed wannabe know-nothing ass-licking
>dick-breath  cocksucking net-cop motherfucker...

>===------ 
>NorAazizam MohdAAsif	 
>The white man made many promises to us but they never kept but one; they
>promised to take our land and they took it.
>                                                        Red Cloud

    It simply amazes me how low somebody can sink!



*   *  ****   ****  *  *  Name        : Hock Min Ng 
*   * *    * *      * *   Voice mail  : 617-352 5573
***** *    * *      **    Snail mail  : 277, Babcock St. Box 1879,
*   * *    * *      * *                 Boston MA 02215, USA.
*   *  ****   ****  *  *  E-mail      : hmng@BUENGF.BU.EDU

( BOSTON UNIVERSITY - ELECTRICAL ENGINEERING )

  " I think, therefore, I am " - Descartes
-- 
*   *  ****   ****  *  *  Name        : Hock Min Ng 
*   * *    * *      * *   Voice mail  : 617-352 5573
***** *    * *      **    Snail mail  : 277, Babcock St. Box 1879,
*   * *    * *      * *                 Boston MA 02215, USA.
From: LAW40001@NUSVM.NUS.SG (Tay Edward Stanley)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: MAL: Special position of the Malays
Date: 7 Apr 92 00:12:26 GMT
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Unparsable-Date: Tuesday, 7 Apr 1992 03:44:04 SST +0800


Below is a quote from an article by the late Tunku Abdul Rahman, former
Prime Minster of Malaysia in 'The Star', 2nd March 1975:

--- Beginning of Quote ---

The Malays, on the other hand, are a simple and contended people, used
to their own way of life, their distinctive traditions, their deep
Islamic belief in God and the Hereafter, aand respect for their Sultans.
Sons of the soil aand sea, they lived close to Nature in a beautiful
land.  Why bother to work so hard? "Allah will provide" they would say.
So economically they could not hope to compete with the industrious
morn-noon-and-night Chinese for whom the hereafter is an extension of
the present so the better off you are on earth the more so it will be
in the world to come.

It was obvious, therefore, that the Malays might, without the protection
of the Constitution, find themselves at a total loss in the only
homeland they had.  This eventually might mean trouble as the outcome.
And who wanted that? Not the Malays, to be sure, and the chinese
neither; local "trouble" is not good for business.  So Singapore
vis-a-vis Malaya was not as simple a problem as leftists might think.

--- End of Quote ---

If I may read between the lines, this is possibly a justification for why
the Malays should be allowed to reap the fruits of the labour of the other
races; since one race doesn't like to work hard, let the other races work,
and merely use the law to make them share the benefits.

Makes me truly thankful Lee KY took the stand he took.  As it is, it is
hardly deniable that Singapore citizens as a whole are better off then
we would be had we continued to be part of the Federation (at least for the
average man, not for the extremely rich ones who are possibly better off
there).
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tay Edward S.                     | All views expressed are entirely
Law Undergraduate                 | my own and in no way reflects the
National University of Singapore  | opinions of the National Univeristy
----------------------------------| of Singapore, or any of its student
Email: law40001@nusvm.bitnet      | bodies.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: rezal@leland.Stanford.EDU (Rezal Adzly Abdul Rahman)
Subject: Re: Fwd: Good Things in Malaysia
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 00:43:30 GMT

>>Have a good day. Its snowing tonight, its cuckoo weather really.
>> 
>>Shakor Badaruddin.
>
>Have faith! The sun's coming out...
>
>-azleena salleh
>Carnegie Mellon Univ., Pittsburgh
>as5h@andrew.cmu.edu
>aurora@cmu.edu

Er, what's snow?

Probably something Azran and I don't experience here in sunny ole CA?

Am I missing something really fun here?

:)

-rezal
From: the@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (khe-sing.the)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: East Timor Communist?????
Date: 15 Apr 92 21:07:53 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T


In article <1992Apr15.173827.24853@eng.umd.edu> eduardo@eng.umd.edu
(Eduardo H. Guiraud) writes:
>I assume that you were born after G30S-PKI; otherwise, you know what happened
>the days after G30S.  Chinese people were chased and killed because they were
>thought as PKI members, which were just excuse for the "natives and some govt"
>to kill Chinese.

Please note that the target was PKI members.  Of course there
were some bad people taking advantage of the chaotic situation
for personal interest and hatred.  Many innocent Chinese as well
as native people became victims.  The government policy neither
included nor implied Chinese genocide.  

>If you are Chinese, why don't you ask your parents what had happened to Chinese
>at that time.

I was there.  I had quite a few friends and classmates whose
fathers were missing or presumably killed during that period.
None of them were Chinese.

--
Khe-Sing The
AT&T Bell Laboratories  <the@cbnewsg.att.com>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: kytan@mantra.fia.dmg.ml.com (Kok-Yong Tan)
Subject: Re: Assimilation by the Chinese in Malaysia....
Organization: Organised?  Here?  Hahahahahahahaha.....
	<1992Apr1.141444.54080@cc.usu.edu>
	<1992Apr2.003532.19211@athena.mit.edu>
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 19:13:51 GMT

In article <1992Apr2.003532.19211@athena.mit.edu> zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) writes:
   In article <1992Apr1.141444.54080@cc.usu.edu> fajack@cc.usu.edu writes:
   >In article <1992Apr1.175505.3511@athena.mit.edu>, zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) writes:
   >> 
   >> Excerpt from "CHINA AND THE ASEAN STATES: the ethnic Chinese
   >> dimension", by Leo Suryadinata. pp 17 - 18.
   >> 
   >> As was mentioned, some Chinese in the ASEAN communities have been more
   >> acculturated into local society than others.  Their degree of
   >> acculturation depends largely on the size of the Chinese community (in
   >> proportion to the non-Chinese population); the degree of religious
   >> similarities between the Chinese and the indigenous population; the
   >> readiness of the local government to accomodate the Chinese; and the
   >> readiness of the local Chinese to acculturate.  The Chinese in
   >> Thailand appears to be the most acculturated.  They are followed by
   >> the Chinese in the Philippines and Indonesia; THE LEAST ACCULTURATED
   >> ARE THOSE IN MALAYSIA.

   >I still believe the first two factors account mainly for the result of the
   >author's study.  So whenever you complain about "lack" of integration
   >of Malaysia Chinese into the society, read this book.  It will open
   >your mind much wider than it is now.

	   I am as open minded as a person next door, but when I see a
   clear-cut example of a group of people refusing to assimilate into a
   society just for the heck of it, it ticks me off...

You seem to only want to see the last sentence of your quotation.  What about
seeing and reading the second sentence (particularly the 2nd and 3rd phrases)?
It's amazing how you only see what you want to see and take everything out of
context, especially when your quote also presents other reasons why the Chinese
in Malaysia don't assimilate.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Asian Development Bank growth projections
From: C. K. Ng <ASCKN@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Date: Saturday, 11 Apr 1992 09:34:46 MST
Organization: Arizona State University

In article <57228@cup.portal.com>, hassan@cup.portal.com (hassan monu alam)
says:
>
>    Reuter, Manila, April 10 - The Asian Development Bank (ADB) gave the
>following projections for growth in real gross domestic product (GDP)
>and inflation for 1992 and 1993 (in pct):
>
>                              GDP             Inflation
>                       1991  1992  1993    1991  1992  1993
>   NICs                 7.3   7.1   7.1     7.7   7.2   6.6
> Hong Kong              4.0   5.8   6.0    12.3  10.5   8.5
> South Korea            8.3   7.3   7.1     9.7   9.4   8.5
> Singapore              7.0   6.1   7.0     3.4   3.0   3.0
> Taiwan                 7.3   7.5   7.7     3.5   3.4   3.7
>                               GDP             Inflation
>                        1991  1992  1993    1991  1992  1993
>Southeast Asia           5.9   6.7   7.1     8.8   8.1   7.1
>   Indonesia             6.4   6.7   7.0     9.2   9.0   8.0
>   Malaysia              8.6   8.5   8.0     4.5   5.0   5.0
>   Philippines          -1.0   2.8   4.3    17.7  13.0   9.0
>   Thailand              7.5   8.0   8.1     5.8   6.0   6.0

Dear Mr. H. M. Alam,
   A couple of comments here:  I guess we have to be real careful in
reading the growth of real GDP because very ofter included in its
computation is direct foreign investment.  If so, the so-called real
GDP can be real illusive of "domestic" growth in the sense that the
growth is initiated by foreigners who may upon termination of pionner
status privileges pull out their investment leaving very minimal
technological or wealth transfer to the local people.  Such is especially
so to countries that give "tax holidays" to foreign investment in which
the latter's major objective is to evade some tax code for their products
when exporting them to a bigger market, e.g., what the Japanese do in
Singapore, or S.E. Asia for that matter, for their products sold to U.S.A.
I refer you to Apr 8, 1992 "Primetime" show in ABC, in also the U.S.A.'s
The Wall Street Journal, 4/09/92, on how the Japanese evade paying tax to
the IRS of USA by capitalizing on "tax holiday" given to them by S.E. Asia
countries.

   How's the inflation computed?  Is it based on the relative change of the
consumer price index (CPI) and its projections?  If so, we have to be
careful again.  Different countries adopt different composite for inclusion
in their CPI's, and to make across-national-borders comparison may be
somehow biased.

  Lastly, the prospective growth in real GDP in S.E. Asia may be promising
now.  But, once Mexico and some Latin American countries can woo big-time
foreign investors to move their labor-intensive industries to these
nations, S.E. Asia's growth is expected to be dampened to a certain degree.

  Thanks for sharing the data with us.

Sincerely,
   **  Chee-Keong Ng, Ph.D.  **
   Assistant professor in finance and banking
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: The privileges of the Sultans
From: chuah@elec.canterbury.ac.nz (DanC)
Date: 13 Apr 92 12:25:16 +1200
Organization: Electronic and Electrical Engineering Department, University of Canterbury, New Zealand.

Zam writes,

>>	First of all, as pointed out by someone in the net, they have only
>>one and we have nine.
> 
> 	So what?  We should have had 11 Rulers, but the state of
                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Malacca and Penang did not have a ruler once they had become
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> predominately Chinese.  
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Judging from this statement, I say Zam does not know much about the
Malaysian history.  Penang was not an independent state.  The Brits
"loaned" in from Kedah and made it into a colony.  That is why
Penang did not have a ruler.  As for Melaka, you have the various
colonisers to thank for not having a ruler.  Both of these states
did not have a ruler because of colonial reasons, not because they
a Chinese majority.  FYI, one of the kings of Malaka married
a Chinese princess (did you, Zam, forget your "Sejarah" lessons).  
There are two more states which do not have rulers, Sabah and 
Sarawak, which do not have a Chinese majority.  Further, these 
states have a governer each, who represents the Agong.

So Zam, get your facts straight first before you write, or do you 
just lie?

> 	We have a lot of ingratitude people in Malaysia.  That is why
> ISA should always be in effect in our country.

So jail those who do not show gratitude, is that right?

>>	Finally, the monarchy in UK brings in a lot of money through 
>>tourism.  You will be surprised to see all those people during the
>>changing of the guard in Buckingham Palace.
> 
> 	Of course.  Brown-nosers...  At least our country no longer
> has to pay respect to that old-Lady.

Oh, Malaysia still respects the "old lady".  If we don't we would
be insulting her just like Zam insults the Chinese.  It is the 
Malaysian way to respect people, especially those who are older
than you.  (Zam, FYI, there is a word that describes people who
do not respect the elders, "Kurang Ajar" - Not enough Education).

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dennis Chuah  | "Pencangkul Matahari"  email:   
EEE Canterbury|  chuah@stargate.elec.canterbury.ac.nz  (SUN) <- preffered
New Zealand   |  CHUAHDC@ELEC.canterbury.ac.nz         (VAX)
---------------- CHUAH-DC@opheus.elec.canterbury.ac.nz (NOVELL) ----------
(bugs+flames) > /dev/null
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: amir@bigbird.bu.edu (Amir Samad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Matter of trust
Date: 7 Apr 92 22:38:31 GMT
Organization: Boston University

In article <1992Mar31.093655.25396@leland.Stanford.EDU>, yongwee@leland.Stanford.EDU (Yong Wee Dennis Lee) writes:

[stuff deleted]
|> 
|> However, Azran got me wrong on the "lazy" part.  I am trying to say that if
|> the govt helps the Malays by "spoonfeeding" them, wouldn't the Malays take it
|> for granted sooner or later, so that when this spoon is taken away, resentment
|> will build up from the Malays against their govt?  And if the govt don't take
|> the spoon away even when the Malays become more "on the mainroad", wouldn`t
|> that become unjustified preferential treatment?

1) No, I certainly don't take my scholarship from the Malaysian government for
granted. And I certainly hope not to rely on the government when I send my own
kids to college, as my government sponsored education will have enabled me to
stand on my own two feet.

2) Yes, if Malays still receive preferential treatment after being "on the
mainroad", it is most definitely unfair. Should this ever happen you should
indeed be unhappy, and I would agree with you.

|> 
|> ** What I am trying to say is that giving help to a particular race in a
|> country will be a road of no return.  Once given, this preferential treatment
|> can never be taken back.  Take it back and the people who benefits from it
|> will not be happy;

Again, look to history. This preferential treatment was implemented with every
intention of being removed when the Malays have acheived a suitable economic hold.
When it is removed, the Malays will have no cause nor excuse to be unhappy.
This is certainly not the case at the current time. Most Chinese believe it is
taking too much time, however I believe the results will be very apparent in the
next generation. The only thing to do right now is to wait and see.

Amir Samad
Boston University
From: v134rrxt@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (MALAYSIAN)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Zam Again!
Date: 16 Apr 92 17:59:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Apr17.031320.4738@csc.canterbury.ac.nz>, chuah@elec.canterbury.ac.nz (DanC) writes...
>In article <1992Apr16.062747.9077@athena.mit.edu> zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) writes:
> 
>>	There are some misunderstandings here.  Kelab UMNO Boston is
>>not a political group, but rather a social one.  Every normal Malay
>>student would be a part of it;                         ^^^^^^


	Are you sure every normal Malay  ?  Consider yourself, .....





> 
>Hang on, you mean even the social club there only accepts Malay
>members?  What a shame, it defeats the "social" emphasis, doesn't
>it?  I have not seen any social clubs here in NZ that limits
>its membership to only one race, especially an overseas students'
>one.
> 
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Dennis Chuah, BE (Elec)    | "One Country,  | Supporting the Malaysian 
>Te Whare Wananga O Waitaha | One People." - | Hockey team for gold in 
>Aotearoa.                  | Maori proverb. | Barcelona.
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>"Pencangkul Matahari" email: chuah@stargate.elec.canterbury.ac.nz
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean