HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jodar@aludra.usc.edu (Nicholas Jodar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Report on Mujahideen in Bosnia
Date: 1 Oct 1992 18:05:50 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: soc
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu
Summary: $1 Million from Kuwait Amir...?

In article <BvG9BJ.H04@ucunix.san.uc.edu> minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas) writes:

>In article <5699@news.duke.edu> shafqat@neuro.duke.edu (Saad Shafqat) writes:
>>
[deletion]
>>Aren't the cash-rich Arabs helping Bosnia out ?

>Maybe individuals here and there, and some Islamic organizations, however, the
>arab governments don't give a damn. I must say howver that the amir of 
>Kuwait gave a million dollars, so maybe he is not so bad after all.

Ummm...  Didn't the Amir of Kuwait spend more than that during
the Gulf War?  A LOT more?  True, he was supposedly trying to
get 'his country' back, but even so, one million dollars is
peanuts for the Amir of Kuwait.  

You'll also notice that not one of the 'Islamic Countries,'
including Kuwait, has bothered to implement a government
according to Islam.  (Although quite a few are in the process 
of fighting for one....)

Let those of us who strive not forget the One we should be
striving for.

-AQ

Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: keserovi@latcs1.lat.oz.au (Goran Keserovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Percentage of Muslims
Date: 28 Sep 92 00:05:46 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia



In article <1992Sep25.045837.4457@tc.cornell.edu> stevan@alchemy.tn.cornell.edu (Stevan Vidic) writes:
>
>>  said --quote--  "15 % of the soldiers in the Bosnian Territorial 
>>  Defense forces are SERBS".
>>
>>  15% is NOT a negligible number.....            
>
>And pigs can fly, while tooth fairy and Santa Claus are for real, right? 
>Gorane, do you believe everything they tell you on TV?  Wake up!
>
>His Excellency Muhamed Sacirbey is an American citizen, who does not speak
>Serbo-Croat and has not lived in B&H.  How's that for facts and credentials? 
>Therefore, why should I believe him and not Mr. Radovan Karadzich, President
>of the Serbian Republic, who said that the number of Serbs fighting on the
>Muslim side is truly negligible.  The most prominent of them (and often quoted
>in support of that idea) is Mr. Jovo Divjak, a criminal who chose an alliance
>with the Muslims to avoid incarceration in a Serbian prison.
>

  Mr Sacirbey's credentials are a little better than Karadzic's.
  Yugoslavia has been thrown out of the UN , and Serbia has had a trade
  embargo placed on it because of the barbaric crimes of Karadzic and his
  fellow war crminals.
  Mr Saricbey is UN ambasador of an internationaly recognized country,
  whereas Karazdic is a WAR CRIMINAL.
  Karadzic is no position to have any information on how many Serbs are, or
  are not fighting with Bosnian TD.....Mr. Sacirbey is.

  Stevane, do you believe eveything that war criminals tell you?  Wake up!

>Moreover, the hypothetical Serbs fighting on the Muslim side would undoubtedly
>vanish from His Excellency's imagination after some of the most recent
>massacres that Muslim fighters committed against innocent Serbian civilians
>(Kukavice, Travnik, Novi, Vitez, Zenica, Kupres, Vares, etc., etc.).
>

  Firstly, it is not a Muslim side....the Bosnian TD is a Muslim, Croat
  and Serb side, as all three peoples are participating in the defence 
  of Herceg-Bosna.
 
  Secondly, Kupres is in SERB-Chetnik control and has been for a LONG time. 
 
  Get your facts right. 

  Don't bother us with this rubbish "poor Serbs are victims of Muslim 
  attrocities"......we have heard all those lies during the war in Croatia
  last year.
 
>
>May I suggest that you refrain from parroting and post some of your own words.
>Of course, I'll be no party to vile invectives posted ad nauseam.  Get a life.
>

  Yawn.....


  
  Regards, and

  -*=   ZIVJELA SLOBODNA HRVATSKA i BOSNA-HERCEGOVINA   =*-
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Friday, 2 Oct 1992 10:10:08 CDT
From: <U52148@uicvm.uic.edu> (Chicago Cro)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Proglavnik's Return

There will be a day my Croatian brothers and sisters when a
now departed leader of great honor returns to Croatia. Proglavnik
will return... Dzafer Beg his right hand man will return... General
Luburic will return... all the other fallen Croats who died under
UDBA to make Croatia free will return. We will take our brothers
and sisters who have died to make Croatia free again and bury them
with honor in our homeland.

Slava im.
-Chicago Cro
From: haq@ec.ecn.purdue.edu (haq)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: W. M. Evers on US involvement
Summary: Why not an Islamic State ?
Date: 26 Sep 92 18:02:37 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <1992Sep25.031030.2487@tc.cornell.edu> stevan@alchemy.tn.cornell.edu (Stevan Vidic) writes:
>In Article <Bv41K0.M75@acsu.buffalo.edu>
>khalak@acsu.buffalo.edu (Hanif Khalak) posts some of his preconceived thoughts
>in no way related to the original article:
>
>
>>These articles posted equivocating about military inter-
>>vention and all kinds of Chamberlain-style kowtowing
>>is making me sick.
>>
>>If Serbs kill Muslims and Croats, it has been implied,
>>they have justification, because of 'centuries of oppres-
>>sion' or 'fear of reprisal' or some other hogwash.  Because
>
>This is not implied anywhere in the original article.
>

Yes. The article does not imply this but almost all articles written on this
net outrightly reject an Islamic State. Why ? Why when others force western
style democracy or communism on Muslims it is OK but when the Muslims ask
for islamic system of government it is not at all accepted. I have'nt read
a single article saying " lets ask the people of B&H, what they want, if they
opt for an Islamic State let it be so ". I urge the netters not to get 
carried away by the media propaganda against the Islamic System. Most of 
these guys either dont know what an Islamic State is or they are threatened
by its existence. The threat is not to an individual but to the vested 
interests who control the capitalist and communist sytems where exploitation
of the weak is common.


>"There can be no peace or coexistence between Islamic faith and non-Islamic
>faith and non-Islamic social and political institutions".
>                     Mr. Aliyah Izetbegovich, leader of Bosnia's Muslims, in
>                     his book "Islamic Declaration"
>


It is an interesting qoute but I must say that you have totally
taken it out of context. If Mr. Izetbegovich is an Islamic leader and beleives
in the Islamic principles then he surely means to say the following :-

                 The Islamic ideology has very specifically layed out principles
for justice, human rights, social and moral values. There can be no compromise
with any other system that does not support Islam's fight against oppression
and exploitation. Thus any other system that is based on exploitation just
cannot co-exist with Islam. When you talk of Islamic faith it is not just a
beleif in a few religious myths, rather it is a total committment to acheiving
a perfect world where every individual is equally important. So the threat of
Islam is not to a faith (as understood in other religions) but it is to other
social and political systems which protect the unjust actions of the
powerful.

In the light of above I would again say that " There can be no compromise
of Islam with the forces of injustice and evil. They just cannot co-exist ".


Tanveer ul Haq.

--
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Report on Mujahideen in Bosnia
Date: 1 Oct 92 15:50:06 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: University of Cincinnati

In article <5699@news.duke.edu> shafqat@neuro.duke.edu (Saad Shafqat) writes:
>
>
>Radio Netherlands reported last pm (9/29/92) that Izzat Baig, the
>Bosnian leader, has recently been in Pakistan shoring up support.
>The Nawaz Sharif government has given a grant of $20 million, a
>credit line of $10 million and $400,000 in other forms of support
>for the Bosnian struggle.  In addition, Jamaat-e-Islami has diverted
>its arms traffic route from Afghanistan to Bosnia, where consequently
>many stingers and stinger-launchers have recently surfaced.  Several
>Jamaati-e-Islami activists have also actually left for Bosnia to
>participate in the war, much as they had done in Afghanistan.  May
>Allah be with them.  Quite noble of Pakistan to help out this way,
>I would think, given the overwhelming natural disaster it has
>just endured.  Aren't the cash-rich Arabs helping Bosnia out ?
>
>
>-- 

Maybe individuals here and there, and some Islamic organizations, however, the
arab governments don't give a damn. I must say howver that the amir of 
Kuwait gave a million dollars, so maybe he is not so bad after all.

zafar
From: abrodnik@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Percentage of Muslims
Date: 30 Sep 92 16:51:10 GMT
Organization: University of Waterloo

In article <1992Sep26.203734.15875@husc3.harvard.edu> stojanov@husc9.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic) writes:
>In article <1992Sep26.205911.23761@enea.se> sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog) writes:
>>
>>Or if Serbia is really that picky about criminals, why is Arkan
>>running free?
>
>BTW, Arkan served for everything he was caught, so he was a criminal ( not 
>that I like him ). 

Very well written, "Arkan served for everything he was caught"! But
don't forget that Interpol still wants to catch him for his criminal
activity!

Andrej
From: elkordy@acsu.buffalo.edu (Mohamed Elkordy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Report on Mujahideen in Bosnia
Date: 1 Oct 92 01:44:38 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: UB


>just endured.  Aren't the cash-rich Arabs helping Bosnia out ?
                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 It depends on which "ARAB" is having the cash.  But for sure, the fat
cats are holding back, may god host them for long ... long ... time in
hell.

 Quite impressive helps always come from the Pakistanies brothers ...
From: s902211@yallara.cs.rmit.OZ.AU (Zoran Kalenic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: hey SCUM: JEWS & USTASE
Date: 3 Oct 92 13:48:26 GMT

s924819@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (Stuart Vincent Davison) writes:

[...]

>	..........   ............ ...............
>	SAMO SLOGA SPASAVA SRBINA !!!!!!    we need no jews supporting us
                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Wrong way around.
 
[forged article deleted]

I believe the above student had forgotten to log out of a terminal at
RMIT (Royal Melbounre Institute of Technology) which consequently allowed
someone to post the original article.  Being a student at rmit, this happens
frequently but most articles are posted to local news groups only.  The above
person is by no means Serbian as the origianl author would like people to
believe.

I soon hope to receive a reply from Stuart stating whether he did write the
original article..  If no reply is received the article will be mailed to the
appropriate administrators who will remove his account.

Zoran.
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Monday, 28 Sep 1992 10:58:00 CDT
From: <U52148@uicvm.uic.edu> (Chicago Cro)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Drina II

 For Croats and Bosnians:

     Drinu treba pregaziti i Srbiju zapaliti

                 -Translation-

     The River Drina must be crossed and Serbia burned


  Love, Chicago Cro
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Friday, 2 Oct 1992 10:04:57 CDT
From: <U52148@uicvm.uic.edu> (Chicago Cro)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Raja and Papci (no more Yugo)

I have enjoyed the readings in Raja i Papci. I can believe that there
are Yugos because there is a Yugo country which is made up of Serbia
Montenegro. But don't try to include Croatia and BiH in any type of future
Yugo. WE will not be shackled and oppressed by Belgrade.

-I'm no Yugo... I'm CROATIAN!!!
-Love Chicago Cro
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: ddc@nyquist.bellcore.com (Daniel Chukurov 21324)
Subject: Re: Bosnet
Organization: Bellcore
Distribution: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 92 13:45:10 GMT

Give me a break, when and were did you get information on
existance of "BOSNIAN" language. The language can only be 
SERBIAN or CROATIAN and not BOSNIAN. Face it the muslims of
B-H are either serbian or croatians that converted to Islam,
and bosnian language never did nor will it exist.
Get it, you dummy.
Who are Bosnians?
		  BOSNIANS=MUSLIMS of B-H
or                BOSNIANS=PEOPLE of B-H
Anyhow you will never get the Cros or Serbs to say that they
speek BOSNIAN?, my god!
Redards.
From: jodar@aludra.usc.edu (Nicholas Jodar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Would you stop, already...?
Date: 1 Oct 1992 13:37:20 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu
Summary: Nationalism == Death
Keywords: Fascism

Assalaam 'Alaikum...

One would think, after so much pain and suffering due to the
artificial barriers of 'national boundaries,' that people would
wake up to the realization that nationalism/racism/class
distinction/etc. is  a) bad for your health, and  b) a display of
gross ignorance.

People are people, what happens in one part of the world affects
all others, and much more is accomplished by working together as
opposed to struggling against one-another.  It's Shaitan who
invented this garbage because he wants to see everybody dead.

The muslims have no excuse to be uttering anything resembling
either nationalism or fascism; they've been told over and over
again by Allah (SWT) what an evil that is.  Even the different
breeds of dogs know better than that....

As a side note, those who yell 'muslim fundamentalist/fanatic'
don't even know what they're talking about....

-AQ

[I beg Allah's forgiveness for my weakness and insufficiency in ]
['His' service, and I ask for his protection from Shaitan and   ]
[from my own Desires.  None can protect me except Allah.  If I  ]
[have made any errors, I beg Allah to bring them to my attention]
[so that they may be corrected.  If I have made none, then it is]
[only through the Grace of Allah and all praise is due only to  ]
['Him.'                                                         ]
From: s924819@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (Stuart Vincent Davison)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: hey SCUM: JEWS & USTASE
Date: 2 Oct 92 05:43:15 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre
NNTP-Posting-Host: minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au




hearing a jewish animal... lowlife such as yourself really makes me vomit

we had the chance to rid ourselves of you scum50 years ago..but no...


that zionists Hitler bastard fucked it all up..
i only wish the Deutsch had a leader that could finish off the job  properly and effiociently.!!!!!
 
 Q. Why do you call yourself Russian Jew... when you are a jewish low
 life animal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????????????????????
	 you are jewish not russian fuckhead !!!!
	
	..your just like those Croatians..who love themselves....why dont youz
	alll go fuck yourselves!!!!!!!!!!!
	..........   ............ ...............
	SAMO SLOGA SPASAVA SRBINA !!!!!!    we need no jews supporting us
	you and you fucking UN have tried to fuck up our people

	But remember... there is not one Jewish sole in Beograd or Knin

	nor will there ever be!
	
	You jewish arsehole dont try make fools of us  ZIVELA SRBIJA
	 
	 
	 
	 
	      GO SUPPORT tudjmans GREATER CRoatian JEWISH STATE
From: awair@igc.apc.org (Arab World and Islamic Resources)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Book by President of Bosnia
Date: 3 Oct 92 08:21:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:cdp:1708600001:000:1539
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!awair    Oct  3 01:21:00 1992


From: Arab World and Islamic Resources <awair>
Subject: Book by President of Bosnia


BOOK BY PRESIDENT OF BOSNIA

We have just received the book ISLAM BETWEEN EAST AND 
WEST written by the current president of Bosnia, 'Alija 'Ali 
Izetbegovic.  In his book Izetbegovic focuses primarily on Islam 
within the history of ideas.  He emphasizes the historical 
commonality and borrowing between three major monotheistic 
religions, Judaism, Christianity and Islam.  He puts 
forth a model of two elementary views of the world, religion 
and materialism, and in this dichotomy, which Izetbegovic asserts 
is part of the 'basic dualism of the world,' which in reality is 
never actually pure, Izetbegovic seeks a middle road pointing 
toward Islamic philosophy which he says was originally 
conceptualized to serve this middle path.  

This is a good book for seeking insight into the thinking of this 
Bosnian leader.  It is the latest edition published in 1989 by 
American Trust Publications, first published in 1984.  Both 
editions were published when Izetbegovic was still imprisoned 
under the former communist regime.

The book is not widely available in the U.S.  If you would like to 
obtain a copy, we are making it available for a reasonable cost 
which includes shipping.  (US$19.95 includes postage and 
handling.  292 pages, stiff paperback. You can send a 
money order or check to AWAIR, 2095 Rose Street, Suite 4, 
Berkeley, CA  94709.)  

Jennifer Smith
Arab World And Islamic Resources and School Services
awair@igc.apc.org
Xref: sparky soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:162 soc.culture.yugoslavia:8908
From: cicic@cc.uow.edu.au (muris cicic)
Subject: Re: Raja i Papci
Organization: University Of Wollongong
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 92 06:27:44 GMT

Dear Ana,

Thank you for fair discussion.  At last, we tried.  It is, probably, senseless
to continue, for there is a subtle line until we can go.  I am pleased with
your readiness to accept the part of my arguments.  Maybe I don't understand
all of your explanations.  Believe me, it is easier to be a pacifist, when
the bombs are falling on some other's heads.  I specialy would like to
understand what we Bosnians, except accepting the slave position, could have 
done to avoid the carnage.  Even official Serbian propagandists used to face
difficulties in production of some justified reasons for the attack on B&H.  
Everything they have manufactured so far is so infatile, all these 
jihad and mujahedin stories are so sheer.  Thus, 'all leaders and all sides'
explanation is broad enough to cover bad consciousness of all of you, 
refusing to acknowledge the "cuckoo's egg" on time, and trying to find the 
dignity eventualy.  Well, live with it if you can.  We have to try to survive,
and we will do everything, thrust me.  And don't tell me that we are in the
same position.

Muris
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar)
Subject: Bosnia Week - Islamic Society of Rutgers University
Organization: AT&T
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 22:08:48 GMT

Assalamu `alaykum,

  The Islamic Society of Rutgers University (ISRU) is organizing a Bosnia
week from October 5th to October 10th. This includes:

  - A series of films about Bosnia-Herzegovina detailing the ethnic cleansing,
    comparing B-H before and after Serbian aggression, showing Serbian
    mutilation of the bodies of Muslims, dead and alive, and showing what was
    done to Islamic places of worship.

  - An information campaign to make people aware of the war in B-H and of
    Serbian atrocities. This includes posters, flyers and articles in the
    school newspaper, the daily Targum.

  - An attempt to make people aware of the inhumanity of the embargo against
    B-H. This embargo was initially intended to decrease the threat of war
    but is being used to eliminate a nation. The ISRU is trying to generate
    support for President Izetbegovich's plea to lift the embargo so that the
    Bosnians can defend themselves.

  Events are scheduled in all campuses.

  May Allah (God) grant victory to the righteous.



  The ISRU would like to hear comments or suggestions especially from our
Bosnian brothers.



Assalamu `alaykum,

Mazen Mokhtar

Xref: sparky soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:226 soc.culture.african:5040
From: cicic@cc.uow.edu.au (muris cicic)
Subject: Re: Raja i Papci
Organization: University Of Wollongong
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 92 02:26:51 GMT


Anne's articles is an attempt to equalise victim and aggressor.  It would
be true, if you put the equation:
    Papci = Serbs
    Raja  = Svi ostali
This is to help identify current happenings, and not a general formula.
Chamberlaine-like considerations will only help Serbs to continue with their 
crimes.  I am not quite sure about Anna's intentions, but everybody must
understand that fascists can be disabled only military.  Any confusion is
just an excuse and factual support for continuation of bombardment of 
Sarjevo, Jajce, Bihac... 

Dear Anne, it sounds so attractive, being humanist and understand everybody.
Naturally, my family is mixed too.  Do you believe that should prevent us
to recognise HITLER, when he resurrects?  And, he appeared, does excatlly
what he is supposed to do, and you are claiming that everybody is guilty!
So patetic and stupid and silly, after more than year of shelling from 
Serbian side (Dubrovnik, Vukovar, Gospic), brutal agression from Serbia
(Bijeljina, Foca, Zvornik), ethnic cleansing (have you seen pictures?) as a
part of Serbian policy, theror of all regions (Sarajevo, Bihac, Jajce) as
an attempt to divide population and make pure Serbian regions.  After so 
many articles, news, and reportages about Balkan' Butcher on the top of 
Serbia, after Serbia's expulsion from all international organisations and 
bodies, after sanctions imposed against Serbia, you are talking about equal 
blame and bad guys everywhere!  We know that we are born same, so what? 

The principles of humanity are to protect innocent, punish the villains, and
recognise the good and the bad.  You may help to Serbian part of your family
to retain their dignity by fighting the evil, regardless from where it is 
coming.  It would be consistent with your article, if you just draw the 
correct conclusion in the end: the fact that madness appeared within Serbian 
nation, doesn't means that Serbs are immanentlly worse than other people.  
It is confusing for all of us that Serb are supporting that madness, and all 
behave in unacceptable manner.  But, that seems to be part of the game,
resembles the Germans in II world war.  And that any Serb, condemning that
madness, is more than simple human being: he is, like Thomas Mann, Villi
Brandt, or Bogdan Bogdanovic, ideal for all of us, the trial how to behave 
in "lead" times.

Muris
Newsgroups: soc.men
From: cgates@mitre.org (Curt Gates)
Subject: Re: We, The Persons
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 13:56:50 GMT

In article <1992Oct4.185207.10636@mr.med.ge.com> 
larry@ducktales.med.ge.com (Larry Landwehr) writes:
>  Mostly it is older people who know what
> has happened because they remember how people used to talk.

Yes, and they also remember how people used to *think*  and *behave*. Remember the connection between language, thought, and action?  In 
my memory, I can see bus-station signs for waiting rooms and drinking 
water that said, COLORED, and WHITE ONLY.  

> Now days, we have to keep such opinions to ourselves.
> Now we are forced to use the words "native
> american", "single mother", "sexual orientation", "african-
> american", "flight attendant", .....
> People have been deprived of the only tool useful in public discourse - 
words.

Nobody is *forcing* you to use any words against your will.  And nobody is 
forcing you to keep opinions to yourself.  Say whatever you want.  

Xref: sparky soc.men:17157 soc.women:17226