From: stc7@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Steven T Chiang)
Newsgroups: rec.games.video,comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Video Games Superior on Consoles
Date: 17 Aug 92 23:27:43 GMT
Reply-To: stc7@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Steven T Chiang)
Organization: Columbia University

In article <34408@cbmvax.commodore.com> daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes:
>
>>The SNES CD-based addon will be available January 1993 in both the US and
>>Canada. The 14MHz 65816 chip is available now.
>
>Yeah, right.  Who would bother to make a 14MHz 65816 chip?  SNES is SNES -- 

	Why don't you stick to talking about stuff you KNOW something
about.  Othwerise you open your mouth, and look, well, stupid.  See below.

>Nintendo might offer add-ons, but they're not going to force add-ons, that
>would just as likely drive all video gamers over to Sega or NEC as it would
>attract folks to the SNES.  A CD-I add-on would require a 680x0 CPU, not a
>silly 6502 on steroids.  Finally, a 14MHz 65816 would need something like
>40ns memory to work.  No one's going to spring for cache-quality SRAM in a
>game machine, you need cheap-ass DRAM in any games machine.  Are you claiming
>you have actually seen a 14MHz 65816?  Made by who?  GTE made all the '816s
>for the Apple IIGeeWhiz.  They could make 'em run up to 4MHz, though the 
>specs written by the Western Design Center folks who did the actual design
>called out timings for up to 8MHz, but no one actually built any thatfast.

	Your calculations about sram speed is fairly correct,
congrats.  I can't answer that, but I can tell you a little about the
chip.

	Before the fast 14mhz chip, there were 8 mhz chips.
There are accelerators running at 7-10 mhz now.

	Sanyo reengineered the 65c816.  The result is a fast 14 mhz
65c816.  I know, I have one in my GS now.  Call up WDC now.  Their
number is 602-962-4545, ask for Deb.  She'll tell you about the chip,
if you don't believe me.

>C= has a CMOS 6502 variation that can go up to 10MHz in theory, but no one's
>used it that fast because the memory requirements are impractical, the ancient
>bus interface of this critter is just too inefficient.  For the same money
>you could get a faster modern CPU that works fine with standard DRAM.

	There's some truth to your statements, but on the otherhand,
why don't you explain these limitations to Nintendo?  There must be
some reason why they used the 65C816 in the SNES...

	Check out Desert Strike for the SNES when it is final in the
end of October.  It kicks ass (it's faster) on the Genesis version, and what
processor does that use?  Oh, an 8mhz 68000?  What was that you were
saying about CPU inefficiencies?  Or is that a comment on 68000
programmers?

	Anyway, more on Desert Strike.  It received a 31 rating from
Nintendo (out of 35).  Like I mentioned above in passing, the Genesis
version gets slow in certain areas, the SNES handles it much better.
What did the designer of the Genesis version say.  I didn't think it
was possible on the snes.

>Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Amiga 3000) "The Crew That Never Rests"

Steven Chiang                  Order - DreamGrafix:  The ONLY 16/256/3200
stc7@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu       color paint program for the Apple IIGS.
America On_Line:  DWS Steve
Genie:  S.Chiang4              Apple IIGS Forever!