HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sonic@artgate.cray.com (Curtis Swanson)
Subject: Re: T: To All MENSA Members...
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 27 Jul 92 11:54:16 CDT


In article <1992Jul27.000857.3203@ncsu.edu> sat@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott 
Andrew Tai) writes:

>     I think there is a major need for some kind of advocacy or activist 
>organization supporting intelligence.  Highly intelligent people are a 
>tremendous social asset.  From them society gets works of major importance
>that benefit all of us.  Yet for years we have been going through 
>anti-intellectual phases and anti-science phases.  Textbooks are being
>dumbed down and rewritten to accomodate social agendas.  Achievement tests
>are being de-emphasized or dropped for the same reasons.  Gifted programs
>in many counties are being dropped.  In primary and secondary schools,
>classroom groupings based on achievement and ability are being dropped
>under the theory that sacrificing the intelligent is fine because it's
>not fair that they're smarter.  Society seems to be slipping into an
>egalitarian phase and is denying differences exist.  If differences are 
>too great to pretend they're not real, then programs to level the 
>differences are initiated.  
>

Indeed, these are serious problems which need fixing.

>     The problem with MENSA is the 2% rule, and it should be dropped.
>

I don't follow how this action would help, or even apply to the afore-
mentioned problems.

[...]
>     So what needs to be done?  I think dropping the 2% rule would do 
>wonders.
[...]
>When it is discovered the 2% rule is gone [...] and that MENSA is now 
>living up to its full charter, MENSA's appeal will broaden enormously.  
>The quality of the people won't suffer, and may even go up, on average. 
>Members will now be active and motivated, and the attitude towards MENSA 
>by even non-members will become one of respect towards an organization
>fulfilling a goal important to society.
>

Again, it does not automatically follow that dropping the 2% rule would 
transform Mensa into an organization capable of sweeping changes in 
government policy over the objections of all those who disagree.  

I think basic attitudes of people towards other people must change before 
anything meaningful can be done about most of the problems in today's 
society.  However, I am at a loss at how to accomplish this.....
--
***  Curt Swanson  ***  sonic@romulus.cray.com  ***  IOTTMCO  *********
HOME:n - That mythical place where you can go and relax.......
I'd rather be in a coma.........
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper)
Subject: Re: Newsletter costs (was Re: Mensa national versus local)
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 03:39:11 GMT


I hate to be perceived as a pedant, but the money that
local groups receive from the national organization is not
called a "subsidy".  It is called a dues allotment.  Two
different things.
--
Jean L. Cooper    (BITNET: JLC5F@virginia.edu   CIS: 70253,1114)
"The true University of these days is a Collection of Books." 
                                           --Carlyle
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: IQ vs. Faith
Date: 21 Jul 92 17:24:58 GMT

In article <711712859.F00005@blkcat.UUCP>, Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson) writes:
> 
> hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:
> 
>  TP> Something to ponder:  Did Adam and Eve have navels? (-:{
> 
> "I don't know you from Adam!"
> 
> "Sure you do!  I'm the one with the belly button...."

Belly up to the bar, and button you're fly.
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: T/ T: To All MENSA Members...
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:27:30 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.021628.19341@ncsu.edu>, scott@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott A Tai) writes:
> 
> 
> In article <3762@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>, nick+@pitt.edu (Nick C De Mello) writes:
> |>In article <1992Jul23.213518.6135@ncsu.edu> tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us writes:
> |>>
> |>>MENSA is simply one more dangerous way in which one group of people
> |>>attempt to set themselves apart -- and by 'apart' one invariably finds
> |>>'superior', since few people desire to join an organization which
> |>>claims its members are 'inferior' -- from the rest of the populace.  Of
> |>>such "harmless" little groups are born the divisive philosophies which
> |>>feed nationalism, racism, and separate us from each other.
> |>>
> |>   No, I wouldn't join a group that claimed it's membership was inferior
> |>to others.  Neither would I join one that claimed superiority to others.
> |>I think you're right, either attitude breeds unnecessary conflict.  I'm
> |>quite satisfied with mensa, which claims only the third and unmentioned
> |>option of equality.
> 
> Hardly.  By insisting on a test score for membership, MENSA attempts to
> give the impression that its members are intellectually superior to the
> general population.  

If you are representative of the general population, you have proven that
we are.  However, I believe that the general population is vastly
superior to you, intelectually, so nothing is really proven.
From: clong@remus.rutgers.edu (Chris Long)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: A few questions for ISPE members
Date: 29 Jul 92 07:59:58 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <1992Jul24.164011.22998@bnr.ca>, Rodney Adams writes:

> 1) What are all of the recent difficulties that ISPE has been facing 
> recently (alluded to in reference to Betty Hansen's performance as
> President of ISPE)?  Has Scott Tai been pestering them too? :)

I'm a new member, so I don't really know, but it can't be that
bad since she's the only person running for president.

> 2) According to a letter from Chris Harding (ISPE's founder) in In-Genius,
> Mr. Harding has been unable to have his submissions published in Telicom.
> Why is this?  Was he involved in ISPE's difficulties?

I'd actually have to see what was rejected.  However, based on his
letter in In-Genius, it might be because his submissions weren't up
to snuff.
-- 
Chris Long, 265 Old York Rd., Bridgewater, NJ  08807-2618

"In a study of schoolboys, an educator discovered a correlation between size
 of feet and quality of handwriting.  The boys with the larger feet were,
 on the average, older."        Wallis & Roberts, _The Nature of Statistics_
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: shapiro@trade.enet.dec.com (Steve Shapiro)
Subject: Mensa Network Mailing List
Organisation: SKS Computer Consulting, Inc.
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation - Marlboro, MA
Date: 30 JUL 92 10:18:20 EST

Well, just a couple days ago I sent out the list I have been compiling. I have
received back a few responses that I need to update, plus some got bounced.

If you were someone who had provided me with your information and did not
receive a copy of the list, then it probably got bounced.

However, due to time constraints due to job obligations, I am no longer
continueing in my effort to maintain the list. My copy of my list has been
forwarded to all of the other people who are involved in the effort to maintain
a Mensa network distribution list and I will leave it up to them to continue in
this effort.

Thanks to all who responded.

Regards,
Steve.

/*********************************************************************
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* Steve Shapiro                 * All views and opinions expressed   *
* SKS Computer Consulting, Inc. * are my own and do not neccessarily *
* Specializing in:              * reflect those of my clients,       *
* DEC/VAX/VMS/ULTRIX, Unix & PC * employers or employees             *
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From: sya@pe1.pe.utulsa.edu (Syed Shibli)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Chess
Date: 28 Jul 92 00:28:49 GMT
X-Received: by usenet.pa.dec.com; id AA08437; Mon, 27 Jul 92 17:35:06 -0700
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zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd) writes:

>Apparently Bobby Fischer has signed a 2.6million sterling contract to play 
>Boris Spassky in Belgrade.  It's a woo-woo!

  The Boston Globe (7/26/92) says the winner will receive $3.35 million and 
  the loser $1.65 million. The 9-game match will start September 2, in 
  Yugoslavia. Personally, I think this is just a rumor commensurate with UFO 
  abductions, Elvis sightings, and the like. 
  
--
  Syed Shibli                           | Tel: +1 918 631 3257
  505 South Gary, #14, Tulsa, OK 74104. | ssr48327@vax1.utulsa.edu
From: smlacke@isrc.sandia.gov (Scott M Lackey)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: daylength
Date: 27 Jul 92 23:04:37 GMT
Organization: Sandia National Labs, Org. 1600, Albq., NM

From article <1992Jul27.183435.26646@alliant.com>, by werme@alliant.com (Ric Werme):
> In article <1992Jul26.141259.1989@brandonu.ca> mcbeanb@brandonu.ca writes:
>>In article <1992Jul25.084637.22322@cs.mcgill.ca>, mingmar@cs.mcgill.ca (Ming MAR) writes:
>>> In article <1992Jul22.145917.25486@ncsu.edu>
>>> gpowell@ent1.ent.ncsu.edu (Eugene Powell) writes:
>>>  
>>> }Consider time between sunrise and sunset inside the arctic circle.
>>> }The old Sol does seem to be motionless there
>>>  
>>> How is the sun motionless there?
>>>  
>>Because they're on top of the world...  Land of the Midnight Sun and all.
> 
> If you stood on the North Pole a few days before the start of spring, you
> would see the Sun rise above the horizon.  For a few days it would slide
> along the horizon before it finally clears it.  In the next few months it
> would continue to spiral upward until it reach an altitude of 23 1/2
> degrees (spending about 10 weeks above 20 degrees).  During the summer it
> would slowly descend until sunset soon after autumn begins.  Twilight would
> continue until early November, but the full moon will still illuminate
> the ice.  (Cresent moons would stay below the horizon.)
> 

	However, you would still be spinning at the rate of one revolution
	per day.

> -- or --
> 
> From the North Pole, the Sun is always due South.  Therefore it must be
> motionless.  :-)
> 
	
	From the North Pole, everything on Earth is always due South. 
    Therefore, the Earth is motionless.  Ptolemy was right!!!!!!
> 
> -- 
> | A pride of lions               | Eric J Werme                 |
> | A gaggle of geese		 | 77 Tater St			|
> | An odd lot of programmers      | Mont Vernon NH  03057	|
> | A Constitution of Libertarians | Phone: 603-673-3993		|
From: mike_steiner@qm.claris.com (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Admission to Mensa
Date: 29 Jul 92 17:32:29 GMT

In article <9207290114.AA02674@pe1.pe.utulsa.edu>, sya@pe1.pe.utulsa.edu (Syed Shibli) writes:

>   I apologize for the typo in my original posting. The SAT cutoff
>   was modified to 1250 in 1977, and not 1970. I'm not sure if they
>   renormed the scores or not, but from Mike's earlier posting on the
>   mean SAT scores for the past two decades, there wasn't much variation
>   in the mean scores on both sections.

According to an ETS employee on compuserve, ETS never renormed the scores.
He doesn't understand why Abbie changed the criteria in 1977.  Someone is
trying to find out from her.  Unfortunately, she doesn't telecommunicate,
so he can't send Email to her.
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: shapiro@trade.enet.dec.com (Steve Shapiro)
Subject: Re: IQ vs. Faith
Organisation: SKS Computer Consulting, Inc.
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation - Marlboro, MA
Date: 30 JUL 92 10:32:59 EST


In article <1992Jul29.181847.25964@ttinews.tti.com>, hollombe@polymath.tti.com
(The Polymath) writes...

>There are some people who can actually stop and restart their hearts.

In the situations you are aware of, what was the method used to detect
heartbeat?

Regards,
Steve.

/*********************************************************************
*                               *                                    *
* Steve Shapiro                 * All views and opinions expressed   *
* SKS Computer Consulting, Inc. * are my own and do not neccessarily *
* Specializing in:              * reflect those of my clients,       *
* DEC/VAX/VMS/ULTRIX, Unix & PC * employers or employees             *
*                               *                                    *
**********************************************************************
* Steve.Shapiro@f440.n101.z1.fidonet.org                             *
* FidoNet 1:101/440 (508) 664-6354                                   *
* The Contract Professional BBS, North Reading, MA                   *
*********************************************************************/

Organization: Sophomore, Chemistry, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 03:15:58 -0400 
From: "Stephen P. Marting" <sm6h+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: T: To All MENSA Members...

Excerpts from netnews.rec.org.mensa: 27-Jul-92 Re: T: To All MENSA
Members... by Scott Andrew Tai@ailab.n 
>      Personally, I have absolutely no doubt that blacks, Hispanics, 
> and other minorities are of equal intelligence, on average, to the 
> average white.  I do not want to accuse MENSA of racism here, but 
> how the hell do you explain these testing differences?  If you assert 
> that IQ and aptitude tests measure skills that are unrelated to 
> differences in education and social background (which is the position
> of all psychometric purists), you can come to only two logical 
> possibilities:
>  
>     (1) The tests are culturally biased towards white Anglo-
>         Saxon Americans, generally from the middle to
>         upper-class.  What they test is your linear
>         distance from the bias of the test-maker, who is almost
>         always white, male, and upper-middle class.
>     (2) Minority groups are less intelligent than whites, as
>         demonstrated by your beloved "measurements..."
>  
>      Sorry, but if you eliminate differences in education, social
> background, culture, "coaching," and upbringing as possible factors,
> you must conclude that #2 is the correct answer.  And if you do, you
> have just jumped into the pit with Hitler, Brigham, Laughlin, Galton,
> and a bunch of other cool dudes.  Enjoy the smell.
>  
>      And if you pick #1, then you must conclude that the college 
> selection system in America as well as MENSA's own membership criteria
> are both fundamentally flawed.  (If you find another possibility, I
> would like to hear it.)

Easy answer #1: The differeces in education, social background, culture,
"coaching" and upbringing ARE the difference.

Easy answer #2: Why the hell does MENSA have to "explain" things in a
test it doesn't create?  It only uses the test because there is
currently no better method.  [btw, it does currently accept at least one
"race-normed" test]

--
Spam is:               | This statement needs no qualifiers.
Steve Marting          | Most people never call me this.
spam+@cmu.edu          | A cute address that wastes computing resources.
sm6h+@andrew.cmu.edu   | Above and below are forwarded here.
R746SM6H@CMCCVB.bitnet | Extra storage space.
>>Coming soon?<<       | Mail to here is *anonymously* forwarded to me.
"Is 'Spam' a word?" - Parker Lewis Can't Lose
From: hellmond@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Peter H. Hellmonds)
Subject: Re: God and IQ
Originator: news@ernie.Princeton.EDU
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 02:17:51 GMT

In article <1992Jul14.022116.15829@ghini.engr.washington.edu> 
Jim Thompson (jimmy@ghini.engr.washington.edu) writes:
>That reminds me:  someone please tell me, how does one write a test to measure
>the intelligence of people smarter than onesself?  I've often wondered this.

I guess you would set a time limit to a time in which you yourself wouldn't
be able to finish the questions. Alternatively, ask a genius for some tough
questions. :-)

-- Peter

-- 
Peter H. Hellmonds - Princeton University - Princeton, NJ, 08544, USA 
Tel (609) 683-4893 (home) - (609) 258-4804 (off) - Fax (609) 258-2809 
Internet: hellmond@phoenix.Princeton.EDU ------ BITNET: hellmond@PUCC 
"If you think education is expensive, try ignorance".   --  Derek Bok
From: schin@pub2.bu.edu (neil schier)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Is there anybody out there? Is there anyone home?
Date: 28 Jul 92 00:27:57 GMT
Organization: Boston University, Boston, MA, USA
Originator: schin@pub2.bu.edu


All right! Now that I have your attention. I am trying to find the 
most recent whereabouts of the following people:

Vanessa Southern Hunter College High School '86 Stanford '90

Sarah Roff HCHS '86 Yale '90

Martin Strauss Space (uh Solomon Schechter Home for the Wayward '85)
Columbia '89

So that I do not annoy anyone, I will also post a message to this net with
the heading Hunter College High or Stuyvesant High '86. Quite frankly I am at
a dead end. In seeing that Hunter and Stuyvesant are intellectualle (I dig
Dan Quaylee okay) I am hoping that someone might have a clue. As for me,
I have been a member since my junior year in college, and I still do not
have a clue as to what the hell I am doing!!!
Regards
From: Craig.Wagner@p2.f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Craig Wagner)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: speed of light and age of the universe
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 10:44:31 -0500

  my> From: moroney@ramblr.enet.dec.com
  my> 
  my> 
  |> Does anyone happen to know much more about the "wobbles"?  Wobbles
  |> implies to me that it may increase *or* decrease slightly from time to
  |> time.  Yet we only ever *add* leap seconds, as far as I can recall.  Is
  |> this a semantic issue, perhaps, or is there more involved than that?
  |> 
  my> There are two variations that make "leap seconds" necessary:
  my> 
  my> Due to the action of tides, the earth has slowed slightly.  This by
  my> itself would make it necessary to add leap seconds at regular
  my> intervals.
  my> 
  my> Due to "wobbles" the earth speeds up and slows down irregurally.  Due
  my> to mass shifts within the earth I believe (a net motion of mass toward
  my> the axis of rotation would increase rotation speed and vice versa)  By
  my> itself this would require irregular addition and subtractions of leap
  my> seconds.
  my> 
  my> Add the two effects and you only have to add leap seconds, but at
  my> rather irregular intervals.
  my> 
  my> -Mike

Thank you for explaining that.  I hadn't thought to break it down into those two
separate effects.  (On the other hand, the tidal slowdown isn't really part of
"wobbles," and perhaps should have been mentioned separately from the start?)
From: jswthomp@milton.u.washington.edu (James Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Why GREENSleaves?
Date: 24 Jul 92 07:40:17 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <711950747.F00004@blkcat.UUCP> Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson) writes:

>Of course, the ultimate would be something that absorbed ALL colors (unless
>maybe there's some reason I'm missing).  So why didn't plants based on some
>black catalyst predominate?  Maybe they just didn't happen to happen - one must
>keep in mind the statistical nature of evolution and mutation.  Or maybe in
>spite of reflecting some colors, chlorophyll happens to work best of all the
>stuff that happened to happen.  The world may never know....

Nothing to do with plants or chlorophyll, but I remember reading in a book
about solar water heaters, that the best substance for painting the pipes was
not black, but happened to be either green or brown, I don't remember which.
It seems that there is more power available in the infrared portion of the
solar spectrum than anywhere else, and this particular substance absorbed
infrared better than most black paints do.  The difference was enough to
more than offset some slight inefficiency in the green wavelengths.  Could
be a similar tradeoff in chlorophyll?

Jim Thompson (jswthomp@u.washington.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: scott@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott A Tai)
Subject: T/ A CHALLENGE TO THE EVIL DR. TAI : )
Reply-To: tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 03:25:07 GMT


In article <1992Jul29.171201.1@ccsua.ctstateu.edu>, sousa_dab@ccsua.ctstateu.edu writes:
|>	Has it been mentioned and/or noticed that Mr. Tai's initials are SAT?
|>        Could this be a clue as to the identity of the nefarious Mr. Tai?

Nah... probably just coincidence :)

|>	I dare you, Mr. Tai.  Give us some positive ID that you exist (at least
|>that you exist as Scott Tai.) A Social Security Number.  A birth record. 
|>something verifiable.

Okay, here's a social security number:  235-07-6123
I've no idea whose it is, but if that's all it takes...

Want me to post a gif of my student id? :)

|>	As a measure of good faith I will first attempt to prove I exist.  You
|>may find my birth certidicate in Hartford.  My Birthdate is October 23, 1968. 
|>I was born in Hartford Hospital.

Okay, I'll drive up to Hartford right now to check!!!

-- Scott Tai
   tai@m-net.ann-arbor.mi.us

PS: It'll be another couple of months before I complete my PhD, so you 
    don't have to call me 'Dr. Tai' just yet :)
From: eager@eagercon.com (Michael J. Eager)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Mensa national versus local, New York City
Date: 31 Jul 92 03:45:56 GMT
Reply-To: eager@eagercon.com
Organization: Eager Consulting

In article 5590@ttinews.tti.com, hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath) writes:

>
>}I also beleive that national *SHOULD* be giving local groups enough money to
>}produce quality newsletters.  Ask 1000 mensans if they would rather give up
>}their local newsletter or the Bulletin.  I'll bet that 900 of them would
>}ditch the Bulletin.
>
>Whether AMC _should_ give local groups more newsletter money is a
>different issue.  I certainly wouldn't object.  I wouldn't even mind my
>dues subsidizing other group's newsletters (your mileage may vary).
>
>So, how does the rank and file get this issue before the AMC?  I'll
>mention it to Dave Felt next time I see him, but I don't know if that's a
>useful mechanism.

Try also the RVC.  I'd suggest a letter to the Bulletin, but those never
get printed. :(

It seems difficult to get the AMC to consider issues which the membership
feels is important, they are too busy with issues that they feel are 
important to notice.

---
Michael J. Eager		Michael.Eager@eagercon.com
Eager Consulting		(415) 325-8077 
1960 Park Boulevard, Palo Alto, CA 94306-1141
From: Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: speed of light and age of the universe
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 22:36:42 -0500

mike_steiner@qm.claris.com writes:

 MS> God@seanews.akita.com (Alpha and Omega) writes:
 [...]
 MS> Well, now we know that God isn't One.

Seen recently in Keshernet:

 Jews: God is 1!  Atheists: God is I!

(Note that the latter "works" with "I" capitalized or not....)
From: bharat@ccvax.ucd.ie
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: eternal life
Date: 21 Jul 92 09:54:19 GMT
Organization: University College Dublin

In article <1992Jul20.135359.14577@ugle.unit.no>, mortenaa@Lise.Unit.NO (Morten Aagaard) writes:
> If the paralell-universes theory is right, one could get eternal life
> in one of these while dying in another????
 
I have heard about anti-universe. But paralell-universe is new to me????
 
 o o
  |  ?
  =--U
 
- always curious

Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa