From: lsmith@peca.cs.umn.edu (Lance "Squiddie" Smith)
Subject: Re: Vertigo Marketing
Organization: Hellfire Squids of the Poor
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 02:38:53 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.002508.1725@news.ysu.edu> ah185@yfn.ysu.edu (Christopher L. Tumber) writes:
>
>Steve Weide writes:
>> The problem with adding these "mainstream" titles is that DC i
>> the Vertigo titles out of the "mainstream".  They don't want t
>> added problems of keeping Sandman, Shade, etc. in the main DC 
>> think that it would be a liability to have to keep all the Ver
>> in line with the other DC titles. 
>
>As it is NOW when was the last time Swamp-Thing showed up in Doom
>Patrol? Or Sandman in Animal-Man?

>Never! None of these books have any real connection (except maybe Sandman/Constantine) except they're all horror/occult/weird.

They do have Hell in common. Really. Swamp Thing and Hellblazer have both
used the changes in Hell that Gaiman established in Sandman. (So has Stanley
and his Monster.) Of course, this argument would require that The Demon
appear as a Vertigo title too. (Etrigan has appeared in Sandman.)

The other connection you can make is that Cain and Abel and John Constantine
all spent some time in Swamp Thing. Constantine got his start in Swamp Thing.
And Constantine has appeared in Sandman once. Lady Johanna Constantine is
another matter and a different poster.

>For that matter, Sandman Mystery Theater looks just as mainstream
>superhero as the other titles I mentioned except written (supposedly)
>for adults. Oh, yes, of course, they're hoping to cash in on the
>Sandman tie...even though there's no REAL connection...

The last time we saw Wesley Dodds was in JSA #1, wasn't it? Given his
Golden Age background he is as DC as any character. He has, however,
made two brief appearances in the other Sandman. Gaiman has gone so
far as to link them. 

>Vertigo doesn't imply Merry Marvel X-overs (Would you really WANT
>Vertigo to be run like Marvel?)

No, not unless that meant PAD got to do some Vertigo stories.

>Look, the point is, is Vertigo an 'adult' line or a horror/occult/wierd
>line? As it stands, it is just a horror/occult/wierd line which may or
>may not be appropriate for adults. DC however DOES also publish
>other adult comics why not include them in Vertigo?

I don't think you really want to gut DC just to promote Vertigo. As it
is, my number of DC titles will drop drastically after this week. If 
you were to cut out all the adult stuff, and I think it would be hard
to decide what goes and what doesn't, then DC would lose its ability
to attract older readers. 

Ideally, what you want from the split is two entities that still function
well. Then you can still use them both to promote the products of the
other group. If you have another title like Dark Knight coming up, you
can promote it in the Vertigo titles. You can use ads in The Demon 
and The Spectre to promote Hellblazer or Sandman. That way you might
attract people with the virtues of one group and then get them to try
a few of the titles in the other group.

Of course, I'd guess some of the politics within DC wouldn't allow all
the non-weird adult to migrate to Vertigo. Would you want to be the one
left in charge of the "kiddie division?" Not good for your self-esteem.
 
>I don't THINK DC's motive is to establish the DC universe and the
>Vertigo universe and never the two shall meet. If you ask me, Swamp
>Thing, Hellblazer, Shade, and Animal Man MAY all exist on the same
>Earth, Sandman probably doesn't, and Doom Patrol CERTAINLY doesn't!

There's a tenuous connection even to Doom Patrol. Doom Patrol did make
a brief cross-over into Justice League Something in the Breakdowns 
series. Since Martian Manhunter has appeared in Sandman and John 
Constantine has appeared in Sandman...

Personally, I think continuity across books is overrated. It's neat when
it works, but I can live without it.

-----------------------------
  Lance "Cr2O3.2H2O" Smith  | "SandPeanut? HellGoober? Peanut Patrol? Is this
    (lsmith@cs.umn.edu)     |  some kind of a joke? I'm calling security! 
  Innovative!   Dangerous!  |  No, I have a better idea. You're going out the 
  Provocative!      Dizzy!  |  window!"         _Mr Peanut meets Karen Berger_
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