HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sgastete@stein.u.washington.edu (Sabina Astete)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: estupideses sobre sendero
Date: 8 Jan 1993 20:22:20 GMT
Organization: University of Washington
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: stein.u.washington.edu

Segun mis lecturas, el apoyo a diferentes medidas tomadas por Fujimori
varia dependiendo del tema, de la zona del pais, de la fecha en que se
toma la encuesta, etc.  Hace poco una persona que trabaja para una de las
compan~ias de encuesta reconocio que muchos de los encuestadores llenan
los formularios ellos mismos.  Los encuestadores reciben su sueldo
dependiendo del numero de formularios de encuestas que llenan.  Como la
economia esta muy mala en Peru, los jovenes encuestadores contestan a las
preguntas ellos mismos para asi obtener mas dinero.  

Un amigo que acaba de venir de Peru me ha prestado videos de noticias de
Lima.  Algunas de las imagenes muestra a un destacamiento del Ejercito
Peruano en la que todos los soldados estan portando ametralladoras y estan
entrando a las humildes casas de los pobladores de un pueblo joven (slum)
en un sector de Lima.  El periodista que acompan~a al destacamiento militar
le pregunta al humilde poblador mientras el soldado registra su casa:
@esta' Ud. de acuerdo con la politica del Presidente Fujimori?,  @esta' Ud.
de acuerdo con esta mision militar?  No se si el periodista es tonto, se
hace el tonto o es que tiene la cabeza un poco cuadrada.  Cualquier persona
sensible a la situacion y considerado con la seguridad personal de los
pobladores no haria una pregunta que pondria a la persona en un terrible
riesgo de ser arrestada o sen~alada como posible terrorista.  En la
situacion actual que esta el Peru que hasta politicos de la extrema
derecha como Borea del PPC, el militar que condeno a Abimael Guzman
(jefe de sendero luminoso) y muchos otros, estan pidiendo asilo politico en
las embajadas de Lima, co'mo se puede saber lo que la poblacion realmente
piensa!

Las elecciones para la nueva constituyente da verguenza.  Cuando se cuenta
los votos en blanco, votos viciados y los no votantes da un porcentaje de
alrededor de 40%.  El partido de Fujimori obtuvo alrededor del 40% del
60% restante, o sea mas o menos 24% de la votacion total.  @Que nos dice
eso????????  En Peru es obligatorio votar bajo pena de una multa de
una cantidad que es el salario minimo de un mes para un obrero.  Y como la
mayoria, la gran mayoria del Peru es pobre y gana un salario muy bajo si
es que tiene el "privilegio" de ganar un salario, cualquiera hace lo
casi imposible para votar.

Man~ana les doy las referencias a la informacion de arriba con numeros mas
exactos.

Y a pesar de todo, ahora hay "democracia" en Peru.  La poblacion tiene la
libertad de apoyar a Fujimori o a ser acusado de terrorista.  La poblacion
es libre de escojer estas dos opciones.  Si yo estuviese en Peru yo
ejerceria mi libertad escogiendo la primera opcion por supuesto, porque yo
aprecio mi vida mucho y no haria nada por arriesgarla. @Que' harian Uds.?

Sabina
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: avance@dagon.demon.co.uk (Amran Vance)
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16f (10.17.92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith
Organization: **None**
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 15:21:18 +0000

In article <20672@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu writes:
> Thanks for confessing that you are also one of those who believe that the ends 
> (the defense of the "revolution")  justifies the means (Castro's dictatorship). 
>  As to "facism" in Cuba, I suggest you read the latest "constitutio" written up 
> by Castro, and see how he now considers his government to be "nationalist and 
> socialist" at the same time.  The last government on earth that did this was 
> that of Adolf Hitler. 

This is nonsense Eldimiro. 

The fact that a constitution states that the country is to be governed
in accordance with both socialist and nationalist principles does not
turn it into a fascist state.  Many socialist governments have adopted
constitutional provisions designed to encourage national self-reliance and
pride. This is particulary true of those socialist states that emerged
after de-colonization.

Was Tanzania under Nyerere a fascist state? 

Amran

-- 

 Amran Vance                   | Internet: avance@dagon.demon.co.uk   
 East Ham                      |           avance@cix.compulink.co.uk 
 London                        |                                     
 England                       | Fidonet : 2:253/500.4
From: sanchez@iccgcc.decnet.ab.com (RAFAEL OVIDIO SA'NCHEZ LAMOSO)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Longy Winter Early Music Season Opening in Cambridge a Big Success
Date: 8 Jan 93 12:16:08 EST

In article <199212232252.AA29255@tuna.wang.com>, IMAGING.CLUB@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("Imaging Club") writes:
> CAMBRIDGE, MA--December 22, 1992--The Longy School of Music's
> Winter Early Music season opened last night with a big success.
> Their seven member Renaissance Wind Band opened the evening's
> "Music from the Old and New World," performing with the
> dulzian, sackbut, and shawm.  They performed El Cervel from
> Cancionero Palacio and # 83 (S'ogni mio ben havete) from MS.
> Lerma II by Alessandro Striggio (1540-1592).
> 
> Sopranos Christi Catt, Jeannette Hargroves, and Sandra Morales
> followed and sang well, doing 16th and 17th century Spanish songs
> by Capitan Mateo Romero, Clemente Imana, Juan Hidalgo, Diego Ortiz,
> and Luis De Narvaez.  Ruth McKay played the harpsichord and Lisa
> Willems the harpsichord and organ, accompanied by Paul Johnson (viola
> da gamba).  They were coached by Frances Fitch, the leading Boston
> harpsichordist and Longy faculty member, and Michael Collver.
> 
> After intermission, the Longy Lute Ensemble resumed with six
> villancicos from the court of Ferdinand and Isabella by
> Juan del Encina (1468-1529).  Members of the Renaissance and
> Baroque Solo Song Class followed that with works by Antonio
> de Salazar, Frei Francisco de Santiago and Gaspar Fernandez.
> 
> The enjoyable evening closed with the Longy Renaissance Wind
> Band again, performing Crequillon's Magna et Mirabilia,
> #76 from MS, Lerma II, and Roma's "O voy" from Cancionero
> Palacio.
> 
> The Longy Winter Early Music schedule resumes on Sunday,
> January 10 at 4:00 pm.  This performance will be followed
> by one on January 18 at 8:00 pm and another one on January
> 25 at 8:00 pm.  These popular concerts take place at the
> Longy Concert Hall next to Harvard Square, Cambridge.
> 
> Michael.Willett@OFFICE.Wang.com
From: wombat@physics.Berkeley.EDU (Gene P. Ledbetter)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: re: Pol Pot & Shining Path
Date: 9 Jan 1993 22:38:35 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

A Peruvian reader wrote:
 
>> The answer was already witnessed by a horrified world
>> after the fall of the K'mer Rouge and the Pol Pot regime
>> in Cambodia some years back. ... This is the nightmare
>> Peru will experience should Sendero Luminoso take over.
 
Comrade MIM replied:
 
> You will never find anywhere a published FACT that Comrade
> Gonzalo said he follows the ideology of Pol Pot. Nor will
> you find the words from Pol Pot's mouth hailing Comrade
> Gonzalo's Maoism.
 
I have not had the pleasure of reading the earlier 
discussions on this topic, but I believe that our reader is 
more concerned with similarities in the _behavior_ of the 
Khmer Rouge and the Sendero Luminoso than he is with 
differences in maoist doctrine.
 
The behavior of the Khmer Rouge was documented in a book[*] 
written by two Vietnamese journalists who entered Cambodia 
immediately after the Khmer Rouge were driven out.  The 
authors discovered that the KR had attempted to murder 
everyone who had any education or had been tainted by foreign 
influence.  Possession of books or eyeglasses or the 
knowledge of a foreign language meant instant slaughter.  
Under such a regime, Comrade MIM would be liquidated.
[* "Kampuc^io, la nigraj jaroj", Hanoi.]
 
On a slightly different subject, the Comrade mentions:
 
> On the other hand, you will find that the U.S. government
> has given concrete military aid to Pol Pot.
 
I could not believe it when I first learned that the U.S. 
government and Prince Sihanouk would side with the Khmer 
Rouge in order to oppose the Vietnamese.  I had a better 
opinion of Prince Sihanouk.
 
I find it curious that the U.S. government does not seem to 
be interested in the Sendero Luminoso.  Perhaps the Comrade 
or some of my fellow bourgeois reactionaries would care to 
comment.  As you may recall, the U.S. government is usually 
willing to fight communism everywhere in the world, 
particularly in Latin America.
 
Gene LEDBETTER / wombat@physics.berkeley.edu
From: rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo)
Subject: Re: Homophobia: US vs. CUBA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:32:30 GMT

In article <51172@shamash.cdc.com> rjv@a2.cim.cdc.com (Rene Valdes) writes:
>In article <2B4C706C.23805@news.service.uci.edu>, rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:
> 
>|>  Last night on "Nighline" they talked about the Colorado boycott, etc.
>|>  Martina was one of the guess. One of the things she insisted on was on their
>|>  "right" to adopt children. Now, I don't think it's in the best interest of
>|>  a child to be raised by a homosexual couple ....
>
>It has been shown that the sexual orientation of children does not depend at
>all on the sexual orientation of the person(s) who raise them.  I don't see
>why having a loving and caring parent, of whatever sexual orientation, can
>be against the best interest of a child.  You seem to judging based on 
>sterotypes about the so-called "gay lifestyle".  A point of agreement
>with Fidel Castro, no doubt.
>

 Well, I doubt Castro's government even allowed things to get to the point
 where gays were demanding the right to adopt kids, but maybe you know
 better than me 'cause I left in '62. Did things get that "advanced" in Cuba?

 If it was "shown" it must be true. Academia always tell people not
 to use common sense. Just like what the "studies" about drug abuse found
 in Zurich where they made legal the use of drugs and then everybody and
 their brothers were coming from all over Europe to get hooked on that shit!

 Maybe I agree with Castro on that*. The problem is that Castro changes his
 mind or says whatever he wants on a daily basis. He's now allowing both
 male and female prostitution in Cuba so not only the Canadian "johns" come
 in, but lots of gays too. I have no problem with gays doing their "thing", but
 I think we should give the kids the chance to grow-up in a normal** invironment.
 Just my opinion, ok? 

 * I also agreed with his initial propposal of a just and equitable agrarian reform
   too and a lot of the ideas he expressed at the beginning of the revolution
   were aceptable to me and most Cubans, no wonder I risked my life both before
   and after the triumph of the revolution!

   The problem was (as I'm sure you know) he gave a small parcel of land to
   some poor share croppers as a token and then he took everything back and made
   all the farmers work for the government by force without even allowing
   farmers to grow anything on their own small garden of raise a pig even. Of
   course, he never pay anybody for anything he took, -land, factories, livestock,
   etc.

   Just to be more in line with the subject you're disagreeing with me:
   Se la metio' a todos sin vaselina y lo que es aun peor, como los perros que
   se traban, todavia la tenemos adentro despues de 34 an~os!

 ** Yes, I know gays are "normal" too!

 Saludos,

--
Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million
Office of Academic Computing. Cubans who look around us in terror"
UC, Irvine.                 from the open letter to Castro by M.E. Cruz-Varela
From: wombat@physics.Berkeley.EDU (Gene P. Ledbetter)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Los nin~os que hablan esperanto
Date: 8 Jan 1993 23:38:34 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

Saludos a todos, Edelmiro Salas incluso,
 
Edelmiro escribio:
 
> Cuando encuentres los nin~os de 4 an~os que hablen
> esperanto y nada mas que esperanto, llamame.
 
!Vaya, hombre!  ?Quieres hablar con ellos?  Mas en serio, 
prefiero qu no sea nadie que hable esperanto y nada mas.  
Cuando hablamos espan~ol soy yo el extranjero.  Cuando 
hablamos ingles, hay otros que lo son.  Cuando hablamos  
esperanto somos todos extranjeros iguales, es decir ninguno 
de nosotros no lo es.
 
> Pues claro que lo es, [un verdadero idioma] de la misma
> manera que Pascal, C y Lisp son verdaderos idiomas; pero no
> son lenguas naturales ....  
 
Aquellas lenguas son naturales para sus compiladores.  
Digamos que Dios creyo el hombre moderno dentro de unos 
segundos, o Darwin lo creyo durante millones de an~os de 
evolucion; ?Cual de los dos es el hombre natural?  Yo diria 
ambos.
 
> Al menos el Latin, aunque no tenga hablantes nativos hoy
> dia, fue en una epoca una lengua natural.
 
Sin hablantes nativos, el latin era un buen idioma 
internacial; todos los hablantes eran iguales.  Pero habian 
almenos dos problemas:  el nacionalismo total de nuestro 
tiempo y la dificultad de aprender el latin.
 
> Eso lo entiendo, ya que el esperanto no puede, por lo que
> dije antes ser primera lengua de nadie
 
!Ojala que no!
 
> Ahora bien, aunque simpatizo bien con las ideas de cread
> una linguafranca en el mundo,
 
!Bravo!
 
> me parece imposible.  Primero porque no se pueden "crear"
> lenguas naturales, ....
 
No somos de acuerdo en los detalles, pero hasta ahora parece 
que tu tienes toda la razon.  No tenemos una linguafranca en 
el mundo.  No la quieren mismo los sen~ores en la ONU.  
Almenos tenemos nosotros, muchos amigos internacionales y yo, 
una linguafranca con quien comunicar entre nosotros.
 
> Proporcioname el nombre de los nios aqui:  ________________
 
Con mucho gusto caballero:  Fe, Esperanza, y Caridad.
 
Gene LEDBETTER / wombat@physics.berkeley.edu
From: ez000281@othello.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: CIA,Guzman? gimme a break man!
Date: 5 Jan 93 19:19:14 GMT
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Ricardo,

>But You think that the CIA and Mr Bush give a damm for Peru?

Actually, Ricardo, there are sectors within the "liberal" establishment that
would do just fine with the idea of having communist dictators administer
U.S. interests. It can be seen in the ongoing debate (which "liberals" have
partially lost) around the Cuban Democracy Act.  So, as for Peru, it should
not surprise you to hear from  influential politicians in the US proposing to
leave Peru alone, and actually appease the Sendero in the same way Stephen
Solarz let the Khmer Rouge devastate Cambodia simply on U.S.  geopolitical
interests.  I'm just waiting to  see how the liberaloids think about letting
Sendero take care of your country for a couple of years.  After all, they've
been happy with Castro for some time, as long as he protects their interests
on the islands, and black Cubans are kept on bay in the island-prison. In
contras, the Cuban Mayor of Miami announced yesterday that he supported
equal treatment for Hatians seeking asylum in the U.S.  This proves that
the Cuban community in Miami is very sensitive towards the plight of Haitians,
since they see in their suffering a reflection of their own, something which
cannot be said of the Anglo leadership of that State.

Edelmiro
From: julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Date: 5 Jan 93 23:24:32 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1993Jan4.210755.15487@wam.umd.edu>, aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) writes:

>     Maybe the Cuban-Americans and their friends can also show that
> the Jews were living in homes during WWII, or that they were taken tp
> concentration camps because of Fidel Castro.
> 

 	Not only that, they can prove Castro read "Mine Kaft" rather
	"Das Capital", comprende sen~or ? ( apologies for mispellings,
	I lost my e-dictionary).
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Julio , U of Penn, Philadelphia 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: estupideses sobre sendero
Date: 8 Jan 93 02:56:12 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pennsylvania


	A proposito del Peru. Una pregunta general. Aqui
	se habla de que Fujimori no es democratico, pero
	tambien se dice que 70% del pueblo respalda sus
	acciones. Es esto cierto ?

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Julio , U of Penn, Philadelphia 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo)
Subject: Re: Human rights in the USA.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Keywords: USA
Date: 11 Jan 93 21:10:41 GMT
Distribution: usa

In article <104094@netnews.upenn.edu> julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez) writes:
>In article <43169@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>, robarr@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Robert O'Barr) writes:

>
>	I haven't seen any good report on the situation in Haiti. I
>	know it's bad. It's clear they are trying to get out of there.
>	There is something bad in Haiti. I don't think people risks
>	their lives just to be "free" in an esoterical way, though.
>	I think they must be escaping their hopelessness. I don't agree
>	with Bush who is being hypocritical and coy. I don't think
>	all of them are persecuted for political reasons but I believe
>	all of them have the right to a refugee status while the legitimate
>	goverment of Aristide is put back in full control of Haiti.
>

  Well Julito, would you be so kind as to give the Cuban exiles/refugees
  the same fair opinion and admit there are lots of bad things happening
  in Cuba nowdays and for some 34 years now?

  By the way, don't blame us for the US policy on not admiting Haitians
  freely into this country. As Edelmiro said, even the Cuban-born Miami
  mayor is in favor on letting those poor people in, perhaps not a complete
  "open gate" approach, but something better than now. (?)


--
Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million
Office of Academic Computing. Cubans who look around us in terror"
UC, Irvine.                 from the open letter to Castro by M.E. Cruz-Varela
From: ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Equal protection under the law (was Homophobia: US vs. CUBA)
Date: 9 Jan 93 00:21:29 GMT
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Raul Baragiola writes:

>In article <21047@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu writes:
[...]

>>the Colorado propostion, for in our county, unlike Argentina perhaps,we have
>>a amendment in our Bill or rights which GUARANTEES "equal protection under
>>the law", I believe its the 14th amendment.

>That is a fantasy, nobody GUARANTEES that. At most, it is a statement of
>goals. One can see daily that the protection under the law depends on
>how much lawyer your money can buy (among other things).

Of course nobody guarantees anything to anybody in our system.  You have an 
obligation to stand for your rights.  We don't have paternal dictators patting 
our backs every minute to to this or that.  It all depends whether you know the 
rights you have been endowed with and whether you are willing to stand up for 
them when someone tramples over them.  Fortunately we have that piece of paper 
which James Madison attached onto our Constitution, further amended after the 
Civil War, which states that we are all equal under the law.  In Cuba you don't 
even have this clause, and what's worse, you don't even have access to an 
attorney in one day trials where executions are carried out a the next morning. 
I don't know what you mean by the buying a lawyer that guarantees your rights, 
since we have more attorneys than any other nation on earth, which every day 
guarantee equal access to thousands of people.  Perhaps I happen to be an 
attorney's son who has always been taught to stand for individual rights and 
personal liberties, while others simply hail the cinics who think there is no 
justice in our country since it is simply justice for the rich.  When people 
start telling us that we shouldn't have attorneys in society, and we shouldn't 
pay them, we should begin to be worried y.  For 
without attorneys the state can do what it wishes, and this obviously leads to 
a dictorship, where the only attorneys are those in the state's payroll.  .

Saludos,

Edelmiro
From: ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Homophobia: US vs. CUBA
Date: 7 Jan 93 07:27:14 GMT
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Alberto Pinkas writes:

>As far as I understand, Gays and Lesbians are asking for equal protection
>under the law and not for special rights.
>Also, I understand that it has nothing to do with Affirmative Action
>programs.

>Someone might want to clarify this.

Well Alberto, now that your asking for reinforcements, let me start setting up 
my minefield.  First, if you are right, then there was no need fight against 
the Colorado propostion, for in our county, unlike Argentina perhaps, we have a 
amendment in our Bill or rights which GUARANTEES "equal protection under the 
law", I believe its the 14th amendment.  Hence, any legislation which singles 
out a specific group for equal protection is redundant inasmuch as we are all 
insured on these matters, gays and straight people have equal protection under 
the law.  Secondly, to refresh our gay citizens which are equally protected 
under the law, the topic we were discussion was homophobia in Cuba, where there 
is NO equal protection under the law for anybody, especially, "maricas" (the 
word Castro uses for gay = queers), and where there are prisons set up 
especially for gays.  Thirdly, Affirmative Action programs are aimed at 
increasing representations of ecomically deprived ethnic minorities in the 
workplace, and to give them ADDED protection under the law.  These programs 
target the underpriviliged which have not had equal protection under the law, 
not people like Martina Naratilova.  When clauses such as "does not discrimate 
on the basis of race..." is placed on official documents, its because there are 
special enforcing agencies which make sure there is ADDED protection against 
racial discrimination.  Whether or not the people of Colorado feel that there 
is need to give ADDED protection to those who are potentially discriminated on 
the basis of sexual orientation is a matter for them to decide, for the courts 
already grants them equal protecion.  In fact, it could very well be argued 
that all affirmative action programs are unconstitutional since they privilege 
certain groups above others with respect to the law, and hence there is a 
violaiton of the 14 amendment.  This is precisely what the Supreme Court has 
decided in some actions on "reverse" discrimination cases.

Edelmiro Salas
From: ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Cuba/Drug Trade
Date: 6 Jan 93 23:00:41 GMT
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

Chandra  writes:

>And therefore, do you think that the US marine will land in Cuba to get  Fidel 
>and Raul Castro as they did to the ex-Panamenian president Gen. Manuel Norguega>?

You mean Noriega, the guy that soon to be in nearby Illinois?  Well if they
get sufficient evidence on Raul, it would certainly be a nice idea that we
should arrest this drug trafficker and give his a fair trial in the U.S., since
given contemporary Cuban criminal procedures it is doubtful he'll get a fair
trial in Havana.  Once they get the evidence I'm all in favor of sending out
an All Points Bulletin to the Marines.

Edelmiro
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america