HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rich@genie.slhs.udel.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Shotgun Restoration
Date: 28 Jan 93 04:17:30 GMT
Organization: When Necessary

I recently came into posession of a Brazilian made single shot 410 shotgun
that's in pretty rough shape.  It's in such bad shape I can't even break
down the barrel to check the bore.  Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,
Rich

-- 
   ---------------------------------------------
  | Richard B. Schwartzman, RBS Communications  |
  |  Media Coordinator, DE. Libertarian Party   |
  |         rich@genie.slhs.udel.edu            |
  |              (302) 455-0354                 |
   ---------------------------------------------
From: cbl@uihepa.hep.uiuc.edu (Chris Luchini)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: FireStar 9mm for sale
Date: 26 Jan 93 01:51:18 GMT
Organization: High Energy Physics, University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign

I have a highly customized FireStar in 9mm for sale:

FireStar 9mm, Blue
Ambi-Extended curved carry safeties,
  about 7/8" long, and fairly thin.
Straight line checkered slide stop
  slimed and reduced for carry, but still
  easy to hit under stress.
  The inner bearing surfaces have been hardened.
  (the firestar slide stops wear out quickly,
  Interarms will replace them, but it's a pain
  to have to deal with them every few months)
Trigger job. 
Slide rails tightened slightly

Also comes with
2 extra magazines, both with finger Groove base
 plates (extra capacity, ie 8+1 instead of the
 standard which is 7+1)
Full custom carry holster with thumb break, and
 cut for the extended safeties.
Leather carry holster for an extra magazine.

This gun once was shot for about 3000 rounds
of cast bullet loads with out cleaning before
it had any problems. It's very reliable and
accurate with most any 147 grain load.


I want $560 for the everything.

BTW the reason I'm selling is that I have
a S&W 640 which I've fallen in love with as
a carry piece. The Firestar hasn't been out
of the safe for months, and I've gotten gun-lust
for other things.
*1110 W. Green/Urbana IL 61801/217-333-0505/cbl@uihepa.hep.uiuc.edu
From: ems@michael.apple.com (E. Michael Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: gun in an apartment
Date: 27 Jan 93 04:56:28 GMT
Organization: Circle 'C' Shellfish Ranch, Shores-of-the-Pacific, California

In article <1993Jan23.150733.21597@ke4zv.uucp> gary%ke4zv.uucp@mathcs.emory.edu (Gary Coffman) writes:

#Securing guns in an apartment can be a problem. A big 1000 pound gun
#safe works, but may be overkill for your needs. My suggestion is to
#have one of the lighter gauge, and cheaper, gun boxes *welded* to your
#bed frame. This does a good job of concealing the safe, makes it 
#difficult to move or attack with ordinary burglar tools, and makes no
#permanent changes to the apartment. 

Good idea!  I'd add a footnote:  Brazing is a lot easier to do for
a DIY application, and brazing is about as strong as iron welding.

You can braze with a propane torch, but a MAP gas tank works better.
It is still in the 'less than $20 and you can do it on the balcony'
range of difficulty...

-- 

E. Michael Smith  ems@apple.COM

'Whatever you can do, or dream you can, begin it.  Boldness has
 genius, power and magic in it.'  -  Goethe

I am not responsible nor is anyone else.  Everything is disclaimed.
From: truong@software.org (James Truong)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Chronograph advise/recommendation needed
Date: 28 Jan 93 04:17:01 GMT
Organization: Software Productivity Consortium, Herndon, Virginia


  Dear netters:

    I am in the market for an inexpensive chronograph.

    I have seen "Chrony Model F-1" advertised in SGN for about $70.

    Does any netter have advise/recommendation regarding chronograph in
    general, Chrony brandname in particular?

    Does any netter have Chrony's ordering number?

    Thanks in advance,

	-JimmyT-

------------------------------------------------------------------------
James Truong                         Internet: truong@software.org
Software Productivity Consortium     UUNET:    ...!uunet!software!truong
2214 Rock Hill Rd, Herndon VA 22070  Bellnet:  (703) 742-7121
From: bbx!bbxrbk!russ@unmvax.cs.unm.edu (Russ Kepler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Self defense hypothetical
Date: 28 Jan 93 16:09:14 GMT
Organization: russ at home in Albuquerque New Mexico

In article <1993Jan27.022736.6481@ncsu.edu> hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer) writes:
#In article <1993Jan26.143939.746@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> srinehar@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Shawn L Rinehart) writes:
## ...
##There won't be any fingerprints on the brass to even
##make you a suspect.
#
#  They are making this new wonderful type of handgun which doesn't
#throw brass all over the neighborhood.  Instead it retains the
#brass in the gun until you remove it.  There is even a handy
#"ejector rod and star" to allow you to remove all the brass at
#one time and control where it goes.

I heard also that you can get them in a variety of sighting radii and
number of rounds, allowing a choice of firepower and carryability.

Som,e even come with adjustable grips that you can shape to fit exactly
your hand.  All have positive safety.

#  I'd suggest a look into this modern technology.

Amazing stuff, no?

-- Russ "still want more plastic stuff..." Kepler
-- 
Russ Kepler, posting from home   russ@bbx.basis.com, bbxrbk!russ@bbx.basis.com
"It's better to be quotable than to be honest" - Tom Stoppard
From: C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: .357 a Baby?
Date: 22 Jan 93 23:40:02 GMT


#making any difference at all; the .357Magnum, while a fair piece more
#powerful than most handgun cartridges, is nobbut a baby in the Wonderful
#World of Magnum Pistols(tm). Put it up against a .44Magnum, or a .41Magnum,

.357 the baby?  Hmmmm, nah, I'd say .22 Mag is the baby, .32 Mag is the
older sister and .357 Mag is the older brother.  .357 Max is .357 Mag's
twin, but he worked out more often.

8-)

Rob
From: bercov@bevsun.bev.lbl.gov (John Bercovitz)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: hand shake
Date: 22 Jan 93 23:41:26 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, California

In article <9301211626.aa10989@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> dc@maths.tcd.ie 
(Daniel Carroll) writes:

#   What would you experrts out there recomend to someone with a slight
#shake in their hand.I myself suffer from this inheireted disease and i
#would like to know if there is a way of increasing the accuracy of 
#my shot.
# All replies would be greatly appreciated.  

This is really one for your doctor but Inderal, which I believe is a beta
blocker, has been proven to steady out the nerves for shooting.  Sorry
I can't remember the source; it was a long time ago.  One problem with
Inderal is that at first it makes you a little dopey, but with continued 
use you do get used to it.  It's a pretty cheap drug.  Other similar drugs 
do not cross the blood-brain barrier (Cor-gard (sp?)comes to mind) and 
hence tend to not make you dopey but I don't know if they also steady the 
nerves.  These variations are more expensive.  One other thing - these
aren't drugs you take as you feel the need.  These are drugs which you
take as a long-term regimen.  Getting on and off them frequently ain't
such a hot idea.  Obviously you want to stay away from caffeine, found
in coffee and soda pops. 

I'm no doctor. The above is given only as a pointer to get you to go
ask your doctor about these possibilities. 

John Bercovitz     (JHBercovitz@lbl.gov)
From: maxxon@swob.nullnet.fi (Mikko Kurki-Suonio)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: shooting under water?
Date: 22 Jan 93 04:01:07 GMT
Organization: Sweet Oblivion

tmoore@tinton.ccur.com (Tim Moore) writes:

# Maybe this is *another* dumb question (I'm sure someone will point that out:)
# but if all the air leaks out of my .45 acp cartridge while I'm space
# walking will the primer/powder still burn?

Yes, their chemical composition contains the oxygen they need to burn.
I don't know what filling the powder space with vacuum, or zero gee for
that matter does to reliable ignition though...


--------
maxxon@swob.nullnet.fi (Mikko Kurki-Suonio) Voice +358 0 8092681
Sweet Oblivion (+358 0 8092678, V.32bis 8N1) Official SRP Headquarters
SnailMail: Maininkitie 8A8 SF 02320 ESPOO FINLAND
From: jthst5+@pitt.edu (John T Haller)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Effectiveness of pepper gas
Date: 26 Jan 93 05:00:44 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


Hello all!

I hope this is not to far from the charter, but I've been wondering
about the effectiveness of the fairly new irritant  gasses containing
Oleoresin Capsicum.  I can envision circumstances where one of these
gas canisters would come in handy, as well as being very unobtrusive.
Particularly, I'm looking at a product called Punch II Mk2 manufactured by  
Aerko International.  It contains 5% Oleoresin Capsicum.  Anybody have any experience using this stuff? Is it really better than mace? Please email me if you wish to save bandwidth.     

[MODERATOR:  We haven't rehashed this recently, but recently enough.  Would
those who have ready responses sitting in their directories please respond
off line?  John, then perhaps, to get the recent newbies in the group up to
date, we might bug you to post a summary once the verdicts are in.  Thanks]


Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't
From: cash@convex.com (Peter Cash)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: [Pistol] Hi-Power question.
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:37:13 GMT
Organization: The Instrumentality

In article <C1GvxJ.56C@boi.hp.com> wes@hpbs2500.boi.hp.com (Wes Nielson) writes:
#Shawn L Rinehart (srinehar@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu) wrote:
#

	 I have a 1990 Browning Hi-Power 'Sport model' that might have a
	problem.  My gun will not eject an empty magazine once the slide is
	locked to the rear (as happens after it is empty). If the slide is
	forward, it will usually pop it

#This is normal. The pressure from the magazine safety is enough to hold
#the mag in place. When the slide is forward the pressure of the magazine
#follower on the underside of the slide is apparently enough the "pop"
#out the magazine. The only fix I know of is to remove the magazine safety.
#Any other ideas??

No, it ain't normal! My Browning (and several others I've tried) eject the
empty magazine partway no matter where the slide is. It's true that
removing the magazine safety will reduce the friction on the magazine, and
thus might be a kludge--but you're really breaking something to fix
something else that's broke.




-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
             |      Die Welt ist alles, was Zerfall ist.     |
Peter Cash   |       (apologies to Ludwig Wittgenstein)      |cash@convex.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: pauly@netcom.com (Paul Yoshimune)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock vs. Sig!?
Date: 26 Jan 93 01:52:06 GMT
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)

In article <9301250428.AA28006@zippy.cs.UMD.EDU> kgk@martigny.ai.mit.edu (Kleanthes Koniaris) writes:
#In fact, there seem to reasons to suspect that the Glock is *better*
#built: I have heard that the Sig has welding, rivets, etc.; the Glock
#has none.  I have heard that the Sig slide is cast (almost to shape)
#and then machined, while the Glock slide is cut from a solid piece of
#steel. 

Actually, the SIG slide is stamped steel.  It's cheap, but durable as hell so
far as I can tell...

#Of course, the Glock does have sloppy tooling marks, but the
#actual method of construction seems superior.

This may be true of the actual methods employed (cast vs. forged, etc.), but
there is absolutely no lack of quality in the construction of the SIG.  There
is no slop, no funny tooling marks, etc.

#I have heard that the
#Sig coatings tend to wear, and that the weapon is easily prone to
#rust.  (In a Glock?  Never!)

I've holstered and drew my P226 probably a bizillion times (IPSC matches,
practice, and dry-fire), and wear is just starting to show.  The bluing isn't
rubbed through, but you can tell it's seen some use.  I use a concealed carry
holster for all the matches and practice, and sweat all over the poor gun.
I've not seen even an inkling of rust or other corrosion on the gun, and I
don't tend to wipe down the outside of the gun at all...

#So, Sig owners, please be so kind as to post *why* the Sig is so good,
#and please be so kind, if possible, as to *compare* to the Glock.

So far as I'm concerned, the SIG's best virtues are its simplicity of
operation, ergonomic (probably the best) design, inherent accuracy, and most
importantly, utter reliability.  This gun cycles empty brass, extremely short
JHPs (like the CorBon 115gr +P), and quite long ones (147gr lead flat points
with an OAL of about 1.125).  The gun has never jammed - EVER.

I also don't like the fact that the Glock has a light trigger pull and no
safety, but that's something else entirely...

-- 
DVC,
  Paul
From: petekunz@iiic.ethz.ch (Peter John Kunz)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Sacramento Armory price on 7.62X39 ammo
Date: 28 Jan 93 04:15:12 GMT
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH

In article <1993Jan27.032543.11400@bbxrbk> bbx!bbxrbk!russ@unmvax.cs.unm.edu (Russ Kepler) writes:
###
###The Sacramento Armory price ($99 per case) for 7.62X39 (East German, 
###non-corrosive) posted to the net was for dealers. The normal price is
###$139 per case.
##
##is this the 1400 case? if so, beware that this is short range ammo, meant
##for a max of 100 meters. tracer is also available (at least here) at a 
##couple $$$ more. 
#
#I'm not sure what "short range" ammo would be (practice?  plastic
#bullet?) but the advertisment reads "1985 Manf. Non-corrosive. Steel
#case, steel core, ready for use in all 7.62x39 mm ... especially
#accurate in sks rifles".  This ammo is in 1480 round cases, in
#"original german issue packing".

well, it seems this is exactly what we get here at about $200.
the short range part is from teh gunsmith. he says the ammo is marked
'kurzbahn' which in my translation is short range. i guess what you would
call bore drop is acceptable to 100m and then dramatically gets worse.
kurzbahn max range is 100m, whereas i have shot aks at 300m with other ammo.

#As for tracer - for some reason a real premium is placed on tracer in
#the USA.  I've seen most tracer sold in units of 10 rounds at
#something like $.50 to $1.00/round - up to $10.95/pack of 10 rounds. 
#I've never seen it sold in case lots at a small markup over regular
#ball ammo.

another reason for another visit :-)


cu
-pete


-- 
Peter J. Kunz	Vogesenstr. 60	4106 Therwil	Switzerland
petekunz@iiic.ethz.ch	pkunz@amiga.physik.unizh.ch
From: n9020351@henson.cc.wwu.edu (James Douglas Del-Vecchio)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Target .22 Recomendations
Date: 27 Jan 93 04:56:31 GMT
Organization: Western Washington University


#Mountain Eagle.  I would appriciate any information regarding these 
#models or a recommendation of a good quality target .22 in the <$400 
#price range.

	The only ones are Ruger ~$200, and Browning, ~$200.  
Nothing else falls in that category (target quality, less than $400).

Ram line/Mag Research things are toys, the S&W are better but still
inferior, imo.
From: kdlin@advtech.uswest.com (David Lin)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Beretta vs Taurus ?
Date: 28 Jan 93 04:17:08 GMT
Organization: U S WEST Advanced Technologies

In article <1993Jan25.201605.3879@michael.apple.com> ems@michael.apple.com (E. Michael Smith) writes:
#What about Beretta vs Taurus?  They look to be the same design.
#The Taurus looks to be well made (to the extent that can be seen
#from the outside of the gun...).

They don't look the same to me at all. The finish is very different,
especially in stainless steel. The trigger pull is not the same
either. Grips are different too, among others.

#So how similar are they?  Can you swap parts from a 92 to whatever
#the Taurus equivalent is (like on real 1911-A1 clones) or are there
#subtile manufacturing differences that make them quite different?

Slide, frame, and magazines are all different. I don't know about
other parts.

#The local gun store asserts that Brazil nationalized a Beretta 
#plant and is basically building Berrettas on Beretta tooling
#under a different name.  Is this true?  

That is what I heard also. 

#(And did they start 
#cheapening the metals or quality of labor used ... or kept the same?)

I'll save it to more knowlegeable readers.

David
-- 
 K. David Lin, Ph.D.              | IEEE Member, NRA Member, HAM Operator
 Communication Services Research  | U S WEST Life Safety Team
 U S WEST Advanced Technologies   | Defend your life in STEREO - Beretta & SIG 
 E-mail: kdlin@advtech.uswest.com | Disclaimer: Only personal opinions
From: aeporro@ariel.lerc.nasa.gov (Bob Porro)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: RE: Is Winchester Made in USA? What others are?
Date: 25 Jan 93 14:00:25 GMT
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center

In article <1993Jan20.204255.10941@unislc.uucp>, unislc@unislc.slc.unisys.com (James Warren) writes...
##From article <9301201453.AA00704@zippy.cs.UMD.EDU>, by C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob):
## 
## FWIW, what major American gun companies are truely American?  Ruger,
## Colt, what else?
## 
## Rob
## 
# 
#I think that Savage is.

I believe that most of Savage's bolt action rifles are made in the U.S., but 
I know that some of the newer Model 99 lever action rifles are made in Spain.

About 1 1/2 years ago, I went to an outdoor range that was hosting a gun show 
of sorts where actual firearms manufacturers were invited to display thier 
wares.  You could even try out some of these firearms on the range for a 
nominal fee.  A Savage rep was there and had a brand new Model 99 present.  
I inspected it closely and saw that it was made in Spain!  I asked the rep 
about this, and the response given was that Savage was having some financial 
difficulties and could not afford to retool the U.S. Model 99 production at the 
current time.  Therefore, they had to import Model 99s from a gunmaker in 
Spain who Savage sold some of the production rights to years ago.

******************************************************************************
| Bob Porro                    || (The opinions expressed here are not       |
| aeporro@venus.lerc.nasa.gov  ||  necessarily those of the management ?\*!) |
|                              ||                                            |
******************************************************************************
From: DHORTON@ENGLISH.AS.UA.EDU (David A. Horton)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock vs. Sig?? Reloading for the Glock
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:38:46 GMT
Organization: University of Alabama English Dept.

Mike, James, et al,

I found the comment about the chamber of the Glock to be rather
interesting. While I never really considered it in any detail, I did
find that I had to seat my reloads just a tad bit deeper to ensure
proper feeding.
When I started reloading for my M17 I did have a jam about every
fourth or fifth round. Well, I hesitate to call it a jam, because all
I had to do was gently push the slide into full battery before
squeezing off the next shot. How'd I figure this out?? Well, on every
fourth or fifth round fired the recoil sounded different. I knew the
ammo I had loaded was good (no double charges, etc.), but it took me
about 50 rounds to see what was really happening because everything
LOOKED normal. Only upon closer inspection did I discover the slide
wasn't fully in battery sometimes.

I called Glock to ask about the reloads and they were quite nice.
Asked me about my loads, etc. They affirmed for me that it was a good
idea to seat the bullets a bit deeper than normal as the feed ramp in
the Glock is very tempermental. I asked them about the gun firing
when not completley in battery and they affirmed that this does
occassionally happen in the Glock -- there isn't any inherent danger
in it really. If the slide is far enough out of battery the firing
pin won't strike the primer anyway. Besides, anybody should be able
to clearly distinguish this under most circumstances. (Guess I'll
have to stop that night-time range practice!!). This makes sense to a
degree -- even the good 'ol 1911 will fire if not completley in
battery. I also was in the frame of mind to ask about factory loaded
ammo and why it feeds so well. Obvious answer: factory stuff is
loaded under stringent quality control control measures. My next
question is has anybody given thought to polishing the feed ramp?? I
haven't tried it , but this episode did make me think about it.
Anybody else have any similar experiences with loading for the
Glock?? Oh yeah, I only load jacketed stuff -- no lead.

David A. Horton
University of Alabama
From: ccrafton@daewoo.math.indiana.edu (c.crafton)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Change in Colt AR-15 Carbine Policy!
Date: 26 Jan 93 01:51:24 GMT



I just ordered a Colt CAR AR-15 A2 in .223.
Colt has changed their policy requiring a Police letterhead for purchase.
Now "legitimate stocking law-enforcement dealers" can buy 1 CAR in .223 and 1
9mm CAR for a one-time deal only. Thedealer price is $699 and $659 respectively.
For any dealers out there who qualify, I would jump and jump quickly.
From: leem@jpl-devvax.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Lee Mellinger)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: MP-5 question
Date: 22 Jan 93 04:00:59 GMT
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory (NASA)

In article <1993Jan21.010119.19041@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> pdalidow@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Pete Dalidowicz) writes:
:In article <9301191828.AA15820@bigguy.eng.ufl.edu> glock@chip.cba.ufl.edu (Joe
:Granto) writes:
:#I thought I read somewhere that the MP-5 has a 10mm version.  Is this true?
:
:Yes the MP5 comes in 9MM, 10MM and .40 S&W.  The MP5 SF will fire in 
:semi-automatic only but has the option of converting the weapon to full auto 
:
:                                       Pete D.
:
:[MODERATOR:  MP5?? In 10MM?????  Oooooooooh. I wish you hadn't told me that...]
:

The 10mm version was made at the request of the FBI and was a
significant part of the justification to retain and reissue the S&W
1076 10mm as the Bureau's standard sidearm.


Lee

"Mit Pulver und Blei, die Gedanken sind frei."

|Lee F. Mellinger                 Caltech/Jet Propulsion Laboratory - NASA
|4800 Oak Grove Drive, Pasadena, CA 91109 818/354-1163  FTS 792-1163     
|leem@jpl-devvax.JPL.NASA.GOV