HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tr@samadams.princeton.edu (Tom Reingold)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Commuting on a Bicycle
Date: 14 Apr 92 17:14:29 GMT
Organization: Noo Joizy, USA

There is brand of toiletry products with an image of natural and
cruelty-free in the US called "Tom's of Maine".  (In fact I think they
explicitly make a claim to being cruelty-free.)  They make an unscented
deodorant that is based on coriander.  They claim that this spice kills
the bacteria.  My wife tried it and it works.  Maybe you can visit a
spice shop and make some deodorant for yourself.

Oddly, my perspiration doesn't seem to smell.  I would have to go three
days without a shower before anyone might begin to notice.  I would be
uncomfortable before this point.  And I don't use antipersperants or
deodorants.
--
        Tom Reingold
        tr@samadams.princeton.edu  OR  ...!princeton!samadams!tr
        "Warning: Do not drive with Auto-Shade in place.  Remove
        from windshield before starting ignition."
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,ba.forsale
From: rgoldstone@OAVAX.CSUCHICO.EDU (Robin Goldstone)
Subject: Thule upright bike carrier for sale
Reply-To: rgoldstone@OAVAX.CSUCHICO.EDU
Organization: California State University, Chico
Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1992 14:51:41 GMT

For sale: upright bike carrier for Thule rack system.  With locking knob.

Price: $50 plus 1/2 shipping  (retail is $80-$90 for this rack)

***********************************************************************
Robin Goldstone, Systems Software Specialist
California State University, Chico  Computing Services
rgoldstone@oavax.csuchico.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.autos.driving,rec.motorcycles
From: shenry@cs.rice.edu (Sam Henry)
Subject: Re: Car vs Cycle vs Bike vs Ped--The Main Point
Organization: Rice University, Houston
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 15:45:58 GMT

In article <5408@otc.otca.oz> elson@otc.otca.oz.au (Elson Markwick)
writes: 

>...  However, most of the drivers I see drive on the correct side of
>the road, 

most cyclists I have observed do the same.

>most signal their intent to turn clearly,

lets' see, while I was in the early years of my driving career in San
Antonio, Texas, USA, I constantly marveled at the number of people who
got in the center lane, turned on the right blinker, and turned left.

for the last 10 years I have been driving in Houston, Texas, USA, and
its environs.  I am now convinced that the auto manufacturers have
contrived to save money by removing the signal levers from all autos
shipped to this area for sale--or the local area dealers have
maliciously conspired to improve the profit margins in their body
shops by removing the things before selling the cars.

>most are illuminated driving at night, 

again, I am amazed at the number of Houston drivers who pull out of
shopping center and convenience store parking lots without lights, and
then blithely ignonre all the people flashing their lights at the
unlit driver.

most sensible cyclists are illuminated at night, but then there are
idiots on cycles and idiots in cars and idiots on motorcycles.

>most do *not* drive on the footpath (is riding on the footpath
>illegal in the States?  It is here.), 

wait, i am rapidly becoming confused.  First, we are not wanted on the
streets and byways, now we are warned off the footpath/sidewalk.  I
guess that leaves the velodrome.  Ooops.  I don't have a track bike.

>most don't run red lights 

I willing to bet that if you pull away from a traffic light in Houston
the instant it turns green, you will be broadsided.  

>and so on.  

ad infinitum.  the point being that there are people operating
vehicles of all types who probably shouldn't have a license to walk.
you have to be careful out there.  As my Daddy used to say:  "Drive
like every other sombitch out there is out to get you personally".
That goes for every kind of driving.

>I see a *much* higher proportion of cyclists breaking those rules.  ...

If they are steady breaking rules, they probably aren't cyclists.  Or
won't be for long.

>And I'm sure that bike riders break speed limits whenever they can too....

I only wish that able and can were more often coincident.

>Cheers, Elson

-- 
sam henry <shenry@rice.edu>
Wanna ride?
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: don@island.COM (Don Hermes)
Subject: Re: Recumbent for the Alps
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 16:33:59 GMT

In article <9204012144.AA16053@hplomg.hpl.hp.com> BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM writes:
>I was reading earlier postings by Dave Wittenberg and Torsten Lif when
>it occurred to me that this is probably a good time to get a recumbent
>for my tour in the Alps this year.  I decided on the Infinity with a
>Spenco Gel recliner.  To take full advantage of the aerodynamics I
>ordered it with a Zipper fairing that sweeps up from ahead of the
>front wheel to just in front of the seat.  To make trail riding over
>such passes as the ancient Septimer pass easier I'm equipping it with
>Panaracer Smoke tires and 28-34-40 triple CW and an 13-38 eight speed
>Shimano XTR hub.  I decided on front wheel panniers to keep the weight
>low for high speed descending.
>
>I noticed while test riding the demonstrator that looking back over
>my shoulder wasn't as easy as on my old bike so I'm putting a 3rd Eye
>mirror on my helmet.  The hydraulic Pro Stop brakes should give
>amazing stopping power and improve my descending, according to the
>brochure.  I also noticed that I needed sun glasses to take the edge
>off of the glare while riding in such a laid back position so I bought
>some Oakley rainbow Eye Shades.
>
>Not having much experience with recumbents, I was not sure on what
>crank length I should get so I thought it best to ask net readers what
>their experience would suggest, I normally use 172.5 mm cranks.
>
>All in all this should be a great tour, I'll be reporting in detail
>when I return.  I'll be off on 17 June for four weeks.  Eat your hearts
>out but,
>
>Ride bike!
>
>jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com


Jobst on a recumbant ? On Smokes ? Climbing the Alps ? In Oakleys ?
I see three possibilities here:
	Someone put LSD in Jobst's coffee.
	Somoene forged Jobst's posting.
	Jobst is funning us and his smileie key is broken.

don
don@island.com
From: kasha@twolf6.CE.YALE.EDU (Dan B. Kasha)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: how many calories do I burn?
Date: 9 Apr 92 00:46:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.1992Apr9.004658.2914
Reply-To: kasha@twolf.ce.yale.edu
Organization: Yale Dept of Electrical Engineering

Obvious question, but is this on a fat tire mountain bike on hard pack dirt
or on road?  Or is it street bikes?  The upright position indicates it could
be that?
Dan

In article <1510315@hpsad.sad.hp.com>, jpat@hpsad.sad.hp.com (Jeff Patterson) writes:
|> The following table appears in the '92 Schwinn ATB catalog which references
|> Bicycling, May 1989:
|> ---------
|> Speed
|> (mph)    12   14   15   16   17   18   19
|> Rider 
|> Weight         Calories/Hr
|> 110     293  348  404  448  509  586  662
|> 120     315  375  437  484  550  634  718
|> 130     338  402  469  521  592  683  773
|> 140     360  430  502  557  633  731  828
|> 150     383  457  534  593  675  779  883
|> 160     405  485  567  629  717  828  938
|> 170     427  512  599  666  758  876  993
|> 180     450  540  632  702  800  925 1048
|> 190     472  567  664  738  841  973 1104
|> 200     495  595  697  774  883 1021 1159
|> 
|>  (flat terrain, no wind, upright position)
|> 
|> Hope this helps.
|> 
|> -Jeff
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: harpel@mitre.org (Craig Harpel)
Subject: DiamondBack comments wanted
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, McLean, VA, USA
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 18:34:25 GMT

Does anyone have any strong opinions either way about DiamondBack bikes?
Are they worth the price?  I just bought a DiamondBack Approach hybrid for
my wife for around $300 "on sale".  Although I like the way it handles and
the grip-shift feature, the paint job on the frame is pitiful.  I was told
a new one could be ordered, but chances are, the frame would not be perfect
on the new one either.  My Trek 800 was only around $50 more than the DB, and
its' frame is perfect; not a mark on it.  Am I just being nit-picky, or is
the poor finish on the DB an indication of the overall quality of the bike
(no insinuation intended; just an honest question)?

-- 
My opinions are strictly my own and in no way reflect
those of either MITRE or Planning Systems.


Craig Harpel			harpel@mitre.org
Planning Systems, Inc.		linus!mitre.org!harpel
on site contractor at
The MITRE Corporation
7525 Colshire Drive		
McLean, VA 22102
From: brad@cup.portal.com (Paul B Anders)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Cupertino Bike Shop Swap Meet April 26th(Silicon Valley)
Date: 8 Apr 92 15:29:33 GMT
  <1992Apr7.231856.17715@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Personally, I like to know about such sales and events. While probably
not the best use of Usenet, it is at least as informative as topics 
such as "Training Drunk", or "Why Shave Legs".

Brad Anders
brad@cup.portal.com
Sunnyvale, CA
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: les@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (Les Earnest)
Subject: Re: USCF Cat 4 & 5 Mix
Organization: Computer Science Department,  Stanford University.
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 20:31:59 GMT

RICHARD PAULOS writes:
>What is the ruling on cat 5 field limits when mixed?
>Does this rule apply?
>Les?  Could you interpret/explain/inform?
>Obvisouly my rule book does not cover this & the CUSA articles are
>don't cover these points either.

The 50 rider field limit applies only to development races such as
Public races and those open only to Cat. 5 riders.  See Bylaw L,
Section 1, paragraph (l) and Racing Rule 1F5.

>[.  .  .]   Hopefully the mixing rule will be 
>recinded next year when there are sufficent number of riders in both cats.

Not likely -- it wouldn't work in small districts.

--
Les Earnest                                  Phone:  415 941-3984
Internet: Les@cs.Stanford.edu              USMail: 12769 Dianne Drive
UUCP: . . . decwrl!cs.Stanford.edu!Les         Los Altos Hills, CA 94022
From: sulli_t@pyramid.unr.edu (Tim Sullivan)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Paris-Brest-Paris
Summary: Pamela (?) had lots of info on this
Date: 13 Apr 92 21:20:11 GMT
Reply-To: sulli_t@pyramid.unr.edu (Tim Sullivan)
Followup-To: rec.bicycles
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Nevada, Reno  Department of Computer Science


A while ago, someone named Pamela posted a series of interesting articles
about the preparation and riding of the PBP.  A friend of mine is starting
a training program for this and is interested at this point in the quali-
fying rides.  

If anyone saved the articles, or if Pamela herself could reply, I'd appreciate
it.

Tim Sullivan (sulli_t@cs.unr.edu)

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.motorcycles
From: fester@island.COM (Mike Fester)
Subject: Re: BICYCLE CRASH
Organization: /usr/local/rn/organization
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 17:57:59 GMT

In article <ku2l5eINNfm2@bovina.cs.utexas.edu> varvel@cs.utexas.edu (Donald A. Varvel) writes:
>In article <3216@tegra.COM> hull@tegra.COM (Andy Hull) writes:
>
>>jackson@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Bruce Jackson(sysadm)) writes,
>
>   drunk drivers).  Nearly all accidents occur at intersections.
>   Vehicles approaching intersections in a traffic lane will
>   be seen by anyone paying the slightest attention to
>   traffic.  Vehicles approaching intersections in the gutter

Most motorcyclists will assure you that there is a considerable contigent of
drivers who do NOT see you approaching an intersection, whether or not
you are in the left, right, or center of the lane. And those who DO pay
attention, WILL see you no matter where you are in the lane.

>   on on the sidewalk will seldom be noticed.  In addition,
>   riding (or driving) too close to parked cars will eventually
>   result in a collision with an opening door.

Preferable to having a car swerve in front of you to get into traffic.

>elsewhere.  In all states bicycles are vehicles or have all
>the rights and responsibilities of vehicles (some word it one
>way, some the other).

You'll have to explain this a bit. Are you saying that in all states. bicycles
are treated the same as motor vehicles? This is assuredly NOT true.

>I hope I have used sufficiently small words.

Maybe next time, you can type in all uppercase.

Mike
-- 
Disclaimer - These opiini^H^H damn! ^H^H ^Q ^[ .... :w  :q  :wq  :wq! ^d  X ^?
exit X Q  ^C ^? :quitbye  CtrlAltDel   ~~q  :~q  logout  save/quit :!QUIT
^[zz ^[ZZZZZZ ^H  man vi ^@  ^L  ^[c  ^# ^E ^X ^I ^T ? help  helpquit ^D  ^d 
man help ^C ^c help exit ?Quit ?q CtrlShftDel "Hey, what does this button d..."
Xref: sparky rec.bicycles:9053 rec.skiing:4153
From: gell@henry.ece.cmu.edu (David E. Gell)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Bike&Ski at Tuckermans Ravine
Date: 9 Apr 92 18:36:49 GMT
Organization: Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon

In article <1992Apr09.135332.16663@convex.com> bannan@convex.com (Bill Bannan) writes:
>
>  I've been considering the feasibility of doing a combination 
>Bike & Ski trip into Tuckermans Ravine sometime later this spring.
>The general idea is that I would bike up until I reach the snow,
>lock the bike to a tree and continue on skis. I've biked most of the
>gaps in Vermont and a few good hills in the Adirondacks also I've been
>up the Tuckerman's Ravine trail on skis&skins before so I think I'm
>up to it, however I have 3 questions that I need to have answered before
>I attempt this. One is, How bikable is the Tuckermans ravine trail?
>I've only seen it when it was under a foot or more of snow so if its
>extremely rocky I'd be hesitant to do this. The other question is
>are there many points where one could get through (bushwack?) from 
>the Tuckerman trail to the Sherburne (sp?) ski trail? Since your
>suppossed to go up one & down the other I would want to leave the bike
>near a good crossover point, if there is one. And of coarse I would
>have to time this right to get the optimum mix of good biking conditions
>on the trail up and good skiing on the headwall. Getting the skis,poles,
>etc. on the bike is not a problem, it looks a little odd ( especially to
>my neighbors ) but it works quite well.               
>  Suggestions, comments & ridicule are all welcome!
>-- 
>__________________________________________________________________________
>Bill Bannan * bannan@convex.com * Albany NY office of Convex Computer Corp
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Wow, sounds like a blast.  I don't want to dampen your enthusiasm, but have 
you checked to see if mountain bikes are allowed on the Tuck. trails?  As an avid mtn biker myself, I hate to see restrictions on trail usage, but only by 
compliance with established rules do we have any chance to get more land access for bikes.  Hope everything works out.
	- Dave
From: corfmanr@gtephx.UUCP (Russ Corfman)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Cat 4/5 mix is bullshit!!
Date: 7 Apr 92 16:20:31 GMT
Organization: AG Communication Systems, Phoenix, Arizona

In article <1992Apr6.110415.54224@cc.usu.edu>, sl3vx@cc.usu.edu writes:
> 
> 	I have a complaint of sorts to be aired to the news net.
> 
> I'm a cat. 4 and love to go racing on the weekends at the local races here in 
> Utah.  Under the new rule that Cat. 5 can ride with Cat. 4 a lot of problems 
> have come up.
> 
> [whine, whine, whine about crashing...]

> [whine, whine, whine about prizes...]

Quit your whining. If you started racing this year instead of last you
would be a cat 5 too. If the USCF didn't create the cat 5 this year then
all the cat 5s would be cat 4s. What's the difference? If you raced before
last year, why the heck are you still a cat 4? Upgrading by experience is
allowed...

Ciao,
-- 
Russell Corfman
AG Communication Systems; Phoenix, AZ
UUCP: ...!{ncar!noao!asuvax | att}!gtephx!corfmanr
Internet: gtephx!corfmanr@asuvax.eas.asu.edu
(602) 581-4403
Xref: sparky rec.bicycles:9133 rec.autos.driving:2296 rec.motorcycles:12812
From: tom@ocf.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.autos.driving,rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Car vs Cycle vs Bike vs Ped--The Main Point
Date: 10 Apr 1992 13:37:09 GMT
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: monsoon.berkeley.edu

In article <5408@otc.otca.oz> elson@otc.otca.oz.au (Elson Markwick) writes:
)
)I think the point Mike was making is that *most* drivers obey *most* road rules,
)whereas *most* bicyclists break *most* rules.  Speed limits is the obvious
)exception - many drivers break that one.  

This is true.

)However, most of the drivers I see drive on the correct side of the road, 

This is true, but most wrong-way cyclists are young cyclists with
no training (and whom often have been instructed to ride on the
left or on the sidewalk).

)most signal their intent to turn clearly,

This is not true.  It's reasonably true for left turns, but it's
rarely true for right turns and even more rarely true for lane
changes (at least around here)

)most are illuminated driving at night, 

This is true, and this is one area where even adult cyclists need a lot
of work.  

)most do *not* drive on the footpath [a.k.a. sidewalk]

Again, sidewalk riders are usually children; if 8-year olds were allowed
to drive cars, car drivers would do a lot more really silly things.
 -Tom
From: nick@jksclub.scol.pa.us (Nick Simpson)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Vegtarion shoes??  Is that it??
Date: 8 Apr 92 21:56:23 GMT
Organization: The Clubhouse, Bellefonte, PA


Why do you want 100% synthetic shoes??
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: jeffw2@cfsmo.honeywell.com (Jeff Walberg)
Subject: Re: Touring equipment: tents
Reply-To: jeffw2@cfsmo.honeywell.com
Organization: Honeywell, Inc.
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:41:07 GMT


In article 28443@Princeton.EDU, martin@morticia.princeton.edu (Carlos Martin) writes:
>Several weeks (months?) ago, there was a thread on
>lightweight tents on this group.  If anyone saved
>the info, could you please e-mail a copy to me?
>
>Additionally, I would appreciate any info/feedback on the
>Sierra Designs Clip Flashlight and Eureka (?) Cirrus 2 
>tents from anyone who has used them.  
>Any other recommendations are welcome.
>
>

I shopped around a great deal last summer and settled on a Clip-3 
which is the three-man version of the Clip Flashlight.  My main
considerations were that it be light enough and small enough to
tour with, but also be roomy enough to sleep two COMFORTABLY.  I
think the key is to actually try out the tents on the display floor
prior to purchase.

I found that many of the two-man tents (the Clip Flashlight and all of
the North Face models in particular) were so confining as to be
undesirable.  The Clip-3 is wider and taller than the Flashlight, yet
still weighs in under 5 lbs (4 lbs, 14 oz I believe) and packs
surprisingly compactly.  It also has "no seeum" mesh panels in the roof,
entry, and foot which are great for ventilation.  I really have nothing
but good things to say about it and am very happy with my purchase. 

If small size and light weight are a bigger consideration for you,
the Flashlight is a great choice.  North Face makes some incredibly
small tents, but I think they are a little heavier than the Sierra
Designs models.  I don't have any experience with Eureka, but I was
told by REI and other quality stores that they are somewhat inferior
to SD, NF, etc, especially in regards to the floor leaking.

Jeff

*******************************************************************
*The spring wind blew my list of things to do away.  - Greg Brown *
*******************************************************************
From: jks2x@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Jason)
Subject: Re: Kill a Biker, Go to Jail. NOT!!!
Organization: University of Virginia
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1992 16:33:25 GMT

In article <1992Apr3.151959.9313@cbfsb.cb.att.com> ashaw@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (andrew.shaw) writes:
>From article <1992Apr3.003313.6485@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu>, by dabowsky@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu (Kamron):
>[unfortunate story of biker friend killed when car pulled out in front]
>>    Anyway, the driver claimed the same lame story as everyone else,
>>    "It was an accident, I didn't see her.."
>
>Why is it a lame story?  Do you think the driver deliberately tried
>to kill her?  Accidents *do* happen.  For this reason motorcycles are
>known to be dangerous.

It's lame because drivers of ANY motor vehicle (or a bicycle for that 
matter) are supposed to be _aware_ of their surroundings.  Making
a turn like the one described in the post is not as simple as most
people think.  The story leads me to believe that the visibility
around the turn was not exemplary so the driver should have taken EXTRA
caution to avoid hitting a biker or another car or even a pedestrian.
	Yes, accidents do happen, but a staggering number of them can
be easily avoided if people were just more careful.

>> 	I believe he got off with the UK equvilant of an 'Illegal left turn'
>>    charge, and some punitive damages to her family (which I'm sure insurance
>>    took care of.) If you ask me, it's not just in the US, it's all over the
>>    world. But alas, who are we to try to change things. *shurg*
>
>Well, not to belittle your point, but I don't understand why the
>person taking the risk is supposed to be completely blameless when
>the accident happens.  What do you want to do to the poor driver,
>execute him?

	At least take his license!  The biker may not have been
blameless, but that doesn't change the fact that the driver was 
very much at fault.  Anyone who makes that kind of error doesn't
deserve the responsibility of a vehicle other than a skateboard.
(and even those are too much for some people.

>	Andrew

-Jason

--
"One day I'll get what's mine through the persistence of time"
						    -Anthrax 'Time'
From: frankb@hpsad.sad.hp.com (Frank Ball)
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:15:51 GMT
Subject: Re: Off road trails near Philadelphia
Organization: HP Signal Analysis Division - Rohnert Park, CA
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles

*From: GU7@psuvm.psu.edu
*Date-Received: Sun, 5 Apr 1992 00:35:52 GMT
*Subject: Off road trails near Philadelphia
*
*I'm going to be spending a long Easter vacation back home in
*the Philadelphia suburbs, Montgomery County.  Does anyone have
*any recommendations for good riding off-road type trails in the
*area?  

Fairmount Park *in* Philadelphia has lots of excellent trails.  They 
take off from "Forbidden Drive" along the Wissaican (sp?) Creek in the
Northwest corner of the city.  Forbidden Drive is a gravel road that is
closed to cars, but has lots of people, bikes, horses, and police (in cars 
and on horses).  Most of the single track side trails are deserted. 
Excellent riding area.

Frank Ball   2LR-D             frankb@hpsad.sad.hp.com
Hewlett Packard                pyramid!hplabs!hpsad!frankb
1212 Valley House Drive        (707) 794-4168 work  (707) 538-3693 home
Rohnert Park CA 94928-4999     KC6WUG Seca 750 XT350 IT175 I'm the NRA.
From: sasmjw@laverda.unx.sas.com (Martyn J. Wheeler)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Bicycles & liability insurance
Date: 8 Apr 92 17:39:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: unx.1992Apr8.173946.1665
    <00958CAF.8A1CDAC0@FHYDRA.FYSEL.UNIT.NO>
Reply-To: sasmjw@unx.sas.com
Organization: SAS Institute Inc. Cary NC
Originator: sasmjw@laverda.unx.sas.com
X-Bytes: 789

Would you people in rec.bicycles please be so kind as to check your
newsgroups line when you post?  A lot of your stuff is now (clearly
unintentionally) being cross-posted to rec.motorcycles.

Thank you,

Martyn
-------------sasmjw@unx.sas.com----(Martyn J. Wheeler)----DoD #293------------
SAS Institute, Inc: (919) 677-8000 ext.7954    H: (919) 839-0092 (Raleigh, NC)
          "If you spin, you deserve to die" -- Mike Hawthorn
       "I love competition, but I hate conflict" -- Alain Prost
-- 
Martyn
-------------sasmjw@unx.sas.com----(Martyn J. Wheeler)----DoD #293------------
SAS Institute, Inc: (919) 677-8000 ext.7954    H: (919) 839-0092 (Raleigh, NC)
          "If you spin, you deserve to die" -- Mike Hawthorn
       "I love competition, but I hate conflict" -- Alain Prost