From: frank@D012S658.uucp (Frank O'Dwyer)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion
Subject: Re: The answer!!!
Date: 6 Nov 1992 13:44:26 GMT
Organization: Siemens-Nixdorf AG
NNTP-Posting-Host: d012s658.ap.mchp.sni.de

In article <1992Nov4.183330.8464@coopsol.com> gordons@coopsol.com (Gordon Storga) writes:
><1992Nov2.224040.8360@iscsvax.uni.edu> clifton9220@iscsvax.uni.edu said:
>>We all hurt from the pains of this world.  Well, we won't get over the pain
>>till we see the problem
>>
>>The problem is not women's rights.  Under current law women can do all that men
>>can.  This real problem is getting everyone to use the law correctly.  We don't
>>need more useless words.  We need to educate the people.
>
>I see the problem this way:  if people would allow others to live their
>lives *their own* way there would be a lot more peace in the world.  If
>people respected others rights we'd be much better off.  Of course,
>education is the only way to achieve this solution.

Be careful.  I get worried when people (including myself) start talking
about "education being the only solution".  It's the kind of phrase which,
if said with the right intonation and phrasing, would make a nice echo now
in Nuremberg.  How do you suppose people can be educated for freedom?  

However you want to do it, prepare to be disappointed.  The military won't
like you putting any notions of freedom into people's heads, and the churches
won't thank you either.  Most governments have a vested interest in the
suggestibility of people too - so don't expect much support there.

>>The problem is not the death of unborn children(they are not cats or dogs, you
>>know).  
>
>They are also not children.

They are not _legal_ children, but they _are_ _unborn_ children.  And the
entities we are talking about here mostly turn into children, which cats and
dogs have yet to do.  Nothing to do with abortion of course, but remember to
be free.

>>        It is the lack of respect for life.  
>
>Are you a vegetarian?  Are you suggesting everyone should become a
>vegetarian?

I guess he meant human life.   Remember those things that are free?

>>                                             The counter for this is the
>>lifestyle of the mother.  Ok!  Let's work on that.  Let's make it so that
>>women's lifestyles are good enough to have children(sorry birth control use of
>>abortion is still out).
>
>Why not allow the woman to choose her own lifestyle?  Don't you think they
>are capable of deciding things for themselves?

Don't they need to be educated for freedom first?

>BTW, abortion is the *only* birth control method, technically.

Get up the yard.

>>The real problem in the world is the debates of people not really looking for
>>the answer.  
>
>We wouldn't need an answer if we didn't have a problem, now would we?

Education wouldn't be the solution if we didn't have a problem, now 
would it?

>>             The answer in my opinion(you may have others) is Jesus for he can
>>help with the bad times and give us more of the good times.
>
>He doesn't appear to have done much toward this end.  Could it be that he
>is not aware that there is any problem?  Seriously, why do you think a myth
>is going to have any power to help when there is no evidence that he can?

There is _some_ evidence, just not _sufficient_ evidence.  Again, get up the
yard, and stop insulting Christians.  Jesus had a go at education for freedom
too - and it seems to me that he has a better chance of finally succeeding
than you have.

Also - as many wicked things have been done in the name of science, pragmatism,
economics, and freedom as have been done in the name of religion, many of them
in living memory.  It's all the same problem (and I have no idea what I mean
by that, so there's no point in asking :-)  ).

(oh, and Jesus was once a zygote too :-)

I better add my standard disclaimer again:  A woman has the right to choose,
no matter what I say.  Not void where prohibited by law.  Learner
pro-choicer, poster under instruction :-)

>Gordon

-- 
Frank.ODwyer@ap.mchp.sni.de   "You take slaves when you make us free,
                               when you make us free your way"
                             World Party - 'Ain't going to come til I'm ready'
                   
Newsgroups: talk.abortion