HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pmurphy@nrao.edu (Pat Murphy)
Subject: Re: Satellite view of Ireland
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory
	<PMURPHY.92Dec21222459@orangutan.cv.nrao.edu>
	<1992Dec22.085459.27988@bmers95.bnr.ca>
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:27:08 GMT

The files from that area on cumulus are (I think) mirrored to
wilbur.stanford.edu, directory pub/weathergifs.  I'm sure people in
North America would get better net bandwidth to that site.  

				- Pat
--
==========================================================================
| Patrick P. Murphy, Ph.D.                Scientific Programming Analyst |
| National Radio Astronomy Observatory    Net:       pmurphy@nrao.edu    |
| 520 Edgemont Road                       Phone:     (804) 296-0372      |
| Charlottesville, VA 22903-2475          VoiceMail: (804) 980-5889      |
|      "I don't believe in the no-win scenario"  --- James T. Kirk       |
==========================================================================
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8343 soc.culture.british:17878
From: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british,uk.politics
Subject: Re: UK unemployment figures
Date: 21 Dec 92 12:49:28 GMT
Reply-To: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U

In article <1992Dec18.094255.21415@dcs.qmw.ac.uk> mmh@dcs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach) writes:
>From today's "Guardian":
>
>Scotland         9.7%
>Wales           10.1%
>N.Ireland       14.6%
>
>England:
> East Anglia     8.2%
> East Midlands   9.3%
> North          11.8%
> North West     10.8%
> South West      9.7%
> South East     10.1%
> West Midlands  11.2%
> Yorks & Humber 10.3%
>
>Now arguing from these figures, and even forgetting the huge
>amount of personal debt suffered by people in the south-east
>and the fact that housing costs are still much higher there,
>can we still hear from all those people who are perpetually
>saying what a privileged place south-east England is, how
>deprived Scotland is, how the Tory party is the "South-east
>England Nationalist party" etc.


OK I'll bite :-) Somebody - GET OUT THE VIOLINS!


Whingeing Northerners are second only to dumbo americans in Matthews
bee collection.


It's typical that he sounds so triumphant, after all these years, because some
people in the SE have finally had a taste of what everyone else has had
to suffer for the last fifteen years or so. ie mass unemployment.

What does he  expect us to do? Divert food collections for Bosnia  to poor
neglected London? Gie's a break?

As for The huge amounts of personal debt sufferd by those poor
southerners. They voted in the party that fooled the stupid gits into
thinking they'd all become Millionaires from buying their council houses
in Docklands.

I lived in Aberdeen once and house prices crashed there in the early
eighties and many people were ruined. Londoners of course thought that
would never happen to them beause they neither know nor care what
happens elsewhere, stupid gits.


Is that the type of reaction you were hoping for?

M


-- 
Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 
	Thanksgiving For a National Victory (Robert Burns)
Ye hypocrites! are these your pranks? To murder men and give God thanks?
Desist, for shame! Proceed no further: God won't accept your thanks for murther.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8371 soc.culture.british:17931
From: fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Date: 22 Dec 1992 00:00:48 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

In article <1992Dec21.134731.5583@newstand.syr.edu> crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea) writes:
>In article <1992Dec17.182626.722@cm.cf.ac.uk> Robert.Evans@cm.cf.ac.uk (Robert Evans) writes:
>>|> Actually, considering when they were claimed by England, virtually
>>|> all these countries, with the exception of the far Eastern/Pacific
>>|> dominions, had an Elizabeth I, including Canada and everything in the
>>|> Western hemisphere...except Jamaica and Belize, I believe.
>>|> 
>>|> Chris the Smartass Imperial Historian
>>|> `
>>
>>What do you mean "claimed by England"?  England isn't a state and hasn't
>>been since 1707.  How can it claim overseas territory?  It doesn't have a
>>government or any national body that could make such a claim on its behalf.
>>Elizabeth of England (aka Elizabeth I) was Queen in the 16th Century before
>>most of those territories were "discovered".
>>
>>--
>>  Robert Evans, Department of Computing Mathematics,
>>  University of Wales College of Cardiff, Wales, UK.  +44 (0)222 874000 x 5518
>>  Robert.Evans@cm.cf.ac.uk                      (FAX) +44 (0)222 666182
>
>I notice you are a professor of Maths. That's nice. But that also indicates
>that you have no actual study of English history. 
>All the islands mentioned WERE claimed by England in the 1580's and    
>1590's by Elizabeth I. 

Since no permanent settlement was made anywhere outside of the
British Isles (except for the Somers' Islands, I think), until the
reign of James I & VI, this happens not to be the case.



>As England has not been a state since 1707 whatever precluded it from
>doing so in 1580? And if these islands were indeed undiscovered how
>was it that the Irish rebels of Tyrone's Revolt were sent to Barbados
>specifically in 1601 as sugar plantation slaves?   

Fascinating. And here I'd always thought that Barbados was settled
in the 1620s, and didn't become a sugar producer for more than a
decade after settlement.


>This is all to be found in the archives of the British state papers.

I'd love to see your source for the above assertion.



-- 
____________________________________________________________________
Dawn over the dark sea brings on the sun;                      
She leans across the hilltop: see, the light!
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8411 soc.culture.british:17993
From: nick@cs.hw.ac.uk (Nick Taylor)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Date: 23 Dec 92 11:54:54 GMT
Organization: Dept of Computing & Electrical Engineering, Heriot-Watt University, Scotland

In article <1992Dec20.210643.14936@newstand.syr.edu> crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea) writes:
>In article <BzFBq6.BM5@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib) writes:
>>
>>Speaking of heraldry...
>>
>>What's that flag you see often flying over Windsor
>>Castle that has the three red English lions in two 
>>quarters and the Irish Harp in at least one quarter?
>>Then there's Henry V's coat of arms - the lions on 
>>two quarters and gold fleur-de-lis on blue on the 
>>other two quarters?

>I believe that is the flag of the Royal Coat of Arms--the arms of the
>Monarch of the United Kingdom.

Just in case it wasn't clear in Frank Mahoney's very informative posting, the
flag described above (two quarters with the three lions passant, one with the
harp and one with the lion rampant) is the Royal Standard of England. There is
a similar one for Scotland which has two quarters with the lion rampant and
just one with the three passant critters. Is there one for Ireland too? If so,
I leave it to the reader to deduce its likely composition...

Nick.
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 09:03:43 EST
From: <REEVESJ@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Kilts
 <katherim.724960141@sfu.ca>

In Scotland one can change names at any time without going to court
or paying any money, as in some other cultures.  If you want to call
yourself Coffee Table, you simply do so.  You many go to the bank and
they will change your name on your forms.  You may also have as many
names as you like.  The only restriction is that one may not take
a royal title, like King, Queen, etc.  So presumably one may choose
an appealing tartan and adopt the name.  It might be wise to avoid
Campbell if planning to visit Glencoe...
From: Geraint.Jones@comlab.oxford.ac.uk (Geraint Jones)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Gaelic Translation and Pronounciation Please
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:34:29 GMT
Organization: The Universal Brotherhood of the Extra Mile and the Unturned Stone
Originator: geraint@clts1.comlab

halchuk@seismo.emr.ca wrote:
(  A post doctoral fellow from Scotland has offered special Scottish 
 ) delicacies (haggis?) for the correct pronounciation and translation
(  of the following phrase:
 ) 
(  "Nollaig chridheil agus bliadhna mhath 'ur"
 ) 
(  any help in translating this would be greatly appreciated

That would surely be `Nadolig llawen a blwyddyn newydd dda'.               /
That should teach you to ask for translations without saying              /
into which language you wanted the translation.                          / g
___
      Nadolig llawen, a blwyddyn newydd dda, i bawb.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
From: crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea)
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 13:47:31 EST

In article <1992Dec17.182626.722@cm.cf.ac.uk> Robert.Evans@cm.cf.ac.uk (Robert Evans) writes:
>|> Actually, considering when they were claimed by England, virtually
>|> all these countries, with the exception of the far Eastern/Pacific
>|> dominions, had an Elizabeth I, including Canada and everything in the
>|> Western hemisphere...except Jamaica and Belize, I believe.
>|> 
>|> Chris the Smartass Imperial Historian
>|> `
>
>What do you mean "claimed by England"?  England isn't a state and hasn't
>been since 1707.  How can it claim overseas territory?  It doesn't have a
>government or any national body that could make such a claim on its behalf.
>Elizabeth of England (aka Elizabeth I) was Queen in the 16th Century before
>most of those territories were "discovered".
>
>--
>  Robert Evans, Department of Computing Mathematics,
>  University of Wales College of Cardiff, Wales, UK.  +44 (0)222 874000 x 5518
>  Robert.Evans@cm.cf.ac.uk                      (FAX) +44 (0)222 666182

I notice you are a professor of Maths. That's nice. But that also indicates
that you have no actual study of English history. 
All the islands mentioned WERE claimed by England in the 1580's and    
1590's by Elizabeth I. 
As England has not been a state since 1707 whatever precluded it from
doing so in 1580? And if these islands were indeed undiscovered how
was it that the Irish rebels of Tyrone's Revolt were sent to Barbados
specifically in 1601 as sugar plantation slaves?   
This is all to be found in the archives of the British state papers.
If you desire historical grounding please consult Stephen Saunders
Webb, "The Governors-General" (1984).

Chris

Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8418 soc.culture.british:18018
From: fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Date: 23 Dec 1992 22:10:51 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

In article <BzqDr9.6t1@dcs.ed.ac.uk> smaill@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Alan Smaill) writes:
>In article <1992Dec21.173822.8195@newstand.syr.edu> crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea) writes:
>>In article <1h098aINNfmv@network.ucsd.edu> fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister) writes:
>>>I await the descent upon your head of the combined wrath of all
>>>Scottish, Welsh and (Northern) Irish readers.  
>>
>>Oh get off it! Whose monarchical family rules Britain? 
>
>
>I would like to hear more about this interesting reinterpretation of the 
>events of 1603. 
>
>
>
Not to mention those of 1689 and 1714.

-- 
____________________________________________________________________
Dawn over the dark sea brings on the sun;                      
She leans across the hilltop: see, the light!
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: louns@cs.washington.edu (Michael Lounsbery)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Cromwell
Date: 22 Dec 92 04:48:30 GMT
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle

>... graphic
>descriptions of how the people taking refuge in the Church were burnt
>alive, etc, etc, and that even now there was still a skull in the church
>(it actually belongs to St. Oliver Plunkett)...
			 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>--Cromwell wrath lives on----

This reminds me of a story about a professor I had.  He's American, and
Catholic, and was visiting Drogheda. He got into a cab, and asked to go to
the church of St. Oliver Cromwell.  Fortunately, the cabbie was a good sport
and thought his slip was pretty funny.

Michael Lounsbery
louns@cs.washington.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn)
Subject: Short courses at Sabhal Mor Ostaig (Scotland's Gaelic college) in '93
Organization: Digital Equipment Co. Ltd., Reading, England
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 09:41:12 GMT


All,

My first letter of 1993 was a package from Sabhal Mor containing their
short courses programme for 1993, a newsletter from the college (with an
article on Gaelic-l) and a brochure containing programme details and
transmission times of future Gaelic programmes. More on the TV brochure in
the next message.

There's quite a lot of info in the brochure, it's 11 A4 pages, so I don't
have time to type it in at the moment as we're in the middle of moving to
Scotland. Perhaps a summary will appear on Gaelic-l in the near future.
If you'd like your own copy of the brochures or to find out more,
please contact:

Gavin Parsons
Short Courses Administrator
Sabhal Mor Ostaig
An Teanga
Isle of Skye
Scotland
IV44 8RQ

Phone 04714 373
Facs 04714 383

or email the college on caoimhin@smo.ac.uk (although Caoimhin is generally
quite busy, so don't expect a quick answer!)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Craig Cockburn  (leaving Digital on 4th Jan)
New internet address: craig@smo.ac.uk (working now)
Voice after 7th Jan: +[44] 31 554 2926
Moving to Edinburgh, yahoo!
From: z_ablesrl@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Import/Export Research
Date: 28 Dec 92 00:13:57 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

Hello all,

	We are doing research on various items that international countries
would be interested in exporting and importing.  The items can consist of
anything from clothing to large machines.  Of course, they must be a legal
product to enter and exit the different countries.  These are some questions 
that we are trying to find the answers to:
 
1.) How would we gather information concerning the legal regulations on
	shipping to the Celtic countries? 

2.) Who would an individual contact in any of those country about shipping
	requirements?  

3.) What kind of licences or paper work does a company need to enter
	that foreign market place?


I really would appreciate any help concerning this matter.  Thank you very
much for your time and hope to hear from you soon.




Sincerely,


Ron Ables

********************************************************************************
Internet Addresses:
			z_ablesrl@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
       			    
				   or
			   
			   sfa1@jetson.uh.edu

**********************************************************************************           
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british,uk.politics
From: david@postman.gr.osf.org (David George)
Subject: Re: UK unemployment figures
Organization: OSF RI Grenoble
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 16:30:09 GMT

In article <BzM0yH.1KH@dcs.ed.ac.uk>, morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay) writes:
|> As for The huge amounts of personal debt sufferd by those poor
|> southerners. They voted in the party that fooled the stupid gits into
|> thinking they'd all become Millionaires from buying their council houses
|> in Docklands.

Hey, hold on there.  At the last election the Conservative party increased both
it's share of the votes and representation in Scotland.  When it comes to greedy
self serving bastards you can find them whereever you live.  Those two extra
Scottish seats mean quite a bit to a party with a very slim commons majority.

|> I lived in Aberdeen once and house prices crashed there in the early
|> eighties and many people were ruined.

So are we supposed to be crying about the Aberdonians too ?  Seems like they
displayed just the traits you so despise in the 'Londoners'. (see below).

|> Londoners of course thought that would never happen to them beause they
|> neither know nor care what happens elsewhere, stupid gits.

As a generalization that could be applied to anybody.  Personally I'm as
unsympathetic to greedy people as you, Morna but I also realise that for many
people buying a house is the only option if they want somewhere reasonable to
live. You should know that London has probably the highest number of homeless
in the UK.

Yes the streets are paved with gold, there are more opportunities than 
comparable cities such as Edingburgh or Glasgow but these are limited to a
fairly small section of the community.  Everybody else just has to make a living
as best they can, just like the rest of the country.

Matthew hardly springs to mind as some die-hard Tory, in fact he's probably
trying to scrape a living on some lecturer's salary in London and getting mighty
pissed off with some of the crap which seems to eminate from Edinburgh Uni.


David.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn)
Subject: The National Mod 1993 - Airdrie
Organization: Digital Equipment Co. Ltd., Reading, England
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 09:38:49 GMT


All,
	The National Mod this year will take place in Airdrie and will
 be the week of Sat 16th October to Sat 23rd October, with the finals being 
 on Fri 22nd October. I expect to be working at it, at the Comann an luchd-
 Ionnsachaidh stand, perhaps I'll meet some netters there who are keen to
 learn Gaelic!

	Craig

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Craig Cockburn  (leaving Digital on 4th Jan)
New internet address: craig@smo.ac.uk (working now)
Voice after 7th Jan: +[44] 31 554 2926
Moving to Edinburgh, yahoo!
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 08:59:09 EST
From: <REEVESJ@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Gaelic Translation and Pronounciation Please
 <1992Dec22.203429.15306@clts1.comlab.ox.ac.uk>
 <1992Dec23.171528.19370@gssec.bt.co.uk>

If the prize is a haggis, perhaps one ought to look up in the dictionary
to see exactly what that is.  In my experience, haggis tastes offal.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british
From: crdunlea@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Christopher R. Dunlea)
Subject: Re: The story of the Scottish flag
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 01:06:47 EST

In article <1ho1u1INNavu@network.ucsd.edu> fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu (Fragano Ledgister) writes:
>
>This is to reduce a historic event, the effects of which are felt to
>this day, simply to its first cause. Would you go on to define the
>Bolshevik Revolution as a semi-military coup? Or the French
>Revolution as an aristocratic revolt?
>
>A revolution is properly so called when it produces substantial
>changes in either the economic, or the social, or the political
>order, or in some combination of the above. An event which produces
>such changes is more than its proximate cause.
>

You are assuming that the Glorious Revolution was more than it really was. 
In the opinions of several historians of the age, such as John Childs, 
1689 was merely the culmination of the gains of 1649, nothing more. Both
the Russian Revolution and the French Revolution were grand starting events, 
but to see 1688-9 thast way makes no sense. The Bill of Rights (English)
is better seen in the context of the events of the 1640's than just of the
1680's, because constitutionally James II never existed--that is, William
and Parliament acted in 1689 to rescind all the acts of James II and return
the English Constitution to the days of 1681. 
(PS There were two French Revolutions of the 1790's--and yes, in the context of
the day, and in the term revolution, 1789 was simply an aristocratic coup
compared to what followed in 1792.)

>
>>There were certainly some interesting results of the Rev. William walked
>>a narrow line, in that he rehabilitated Puritans, but he also kept the 
>>imperial edifice erected by James II. Note that the power of the army 
>>had increased tremendously since 1640 (England now kept a standing army
>>of 110,000 and a fleet of 300 ships, as opposed to 10,000 and 50 ships).
>>William made an alliance with the Parliament and the results were the
>>constitutional changes you mentioned.
>
>
>And note that Parliament kept control of the army's purse-strings
>(not to mention its very existence) thereafter through the annual
>Mutiny Acts [general question to whoever may know: when exactly in
>the 1960s was the Mutiny Act replaced?].
>

Of course. The reign of James II was an imperial one in which taxes were
imposed arbitrarily by the royal executive. In any settlement Parliament
would demand the purse-strings back. But the realization that Parliament
must control the money was accompanied by the fact that England (and
with a few years, Britain) was an empire in 1689. Because of the hitherto
unknown size of the war machine (see figures above) new and larger taxes
needed to be imposed--and that could only come through cooperation with
the gentry, ie Parliament. 

>fledgist@weber.ucsd.edu  

By the way, Fragrano, are you at San Diego? What is your backgrond? Are you
a British historian? You are quite knowledgeable. This has been fun (never 
got into a real discussion on this net before  :-)  )

Chris
From: nsmca@acad3.alaska.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Online Celtic Dictionary
Date: 27 Dec 92 08:11:01 GMT
Article-I.D.: acad3.1992Dec27.001101.1
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks

Is there a celtic dictionary online? MEaning one that is in Irish or Scot
Gaelic or in Welsh or in some other Celtic Lingo..? 

I once created one for feudal english terms.


Michael Adams
Alias: Morgoth/Ghost Wheel 
nsmca@acad3.alaska.edu
Mother maiden name is Donavan.. 
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:8382 soc.culture.british:17949
From: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british,uk.politics
Subject: Re: UK unemployment figures
Date: 22 Dec 92 12:21:11 GMT
Reply-To: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U

In article <1992Dec21.153408.7221@infodev.cam.ac.uk> gdb15@cl.cam.ac.uk writes:
>
>I've just realized that this thread is cross-posted to three groups --
>the above only makes sense in the context of uk.politics!  Now, Morna,
>be honest and tell me which group you were posting from...

Three??
 
Oh I see.

I'm in s.c.c just now. I never visit uk.p and only sometimes
visit s.c.b.

What's this about a box? Do tell :-)

M
-- 
Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 
	Thanksgiving For a National Victory (Robert Burns)
Ye hypocrites! are these your pranks? To murder men and give God thanks?
Desist, for shame! Proceed no further: God won't accept your thanks for murther.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.british