From: dantz@igc.apc.org (Dantz Development Corporation)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.appletalk
Subject: Re: Does anyone have any experience wit
Date: 24 Jan 93 01:24:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:1993Jan13.193609.23763@ncar.ucar:-1807975547:cdp:1537600001:000:6266
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!dantz    Jan 23 17:24:00 1993


From Dantz Development:

The cost per node is really as Chris/Mike said:

Retrospect              $249 Suggested Retail/$160 Street 
(this is the main program that will backup any mounted volumes)

Remote 10 Pack      $249 Suggested Retail/$160 Street 
(this is the 10 extensions) approx. $16/node.

Remote 50 Pack      $1095 SRP/$650 street 
(same as above, but 50 extensions) approx. $13/node.

Retrospect Remote  $449 SRP/$260 street 
(this is Retrospect & the 10 pack bundled in a single package)

So in Tim's case with 100 Macs you'd need at least one copy of the application 
and 100 remote codes. That's a total of $160 for the application and $1300 for 
100 remote nodes, which is just under $15/node for all the software.

As Chris also pointed out Retrospect currently works with all Exabyte drives, 
except the loader drives. However, in Retrospect version 2.0 we will support the 
loader drives. 2.0 will be shipping in February.

As for the cables, I'd suggest checking with the two following companies, I'm 
not absolutely sure that they carry the type of cable that you're looking for, 
but they may be a good start:

Kres Engineering
La Canada, CA 
tel: (818) 957-6322

Rancho Technology, Inc.
8632 Archibald Ave., Suite 109
Rancho Cucamonga, CA 91730
tel: (714) 987-3966

NEW INTERFACE!!!: We do have a new interface in the upcoming 2.0 version of our 
software. I think that it will make a significant difference in how people use 
Retrospect. In earlier versions of Retrospect you would go through each of four 
windows to set up the software, in 2.0 all four steps are shown in an "overview" 
window. Within the overview window you can click on any of the four options to 
reconfigure your backup.

Retrospect currently supports about 68 different tape drives, as Mike says, do 
check which particular drive you have by using SCSI probe. With that information 
give me a call, or give our tech support line a call and we can tell you more 
information about our support for your particular device.

If you need information on the program, or need a demo disk, give our Customer 
Support line a call @ 510/849-0293. They can send you a demo, and some product 
literature.

Steve Darragh mentions "The bad part is that it is harder to restore files 
because you have to
check more catalogs and someone has to be there to switch the tapes,
you also have to reset the catalog with every new tape."

We've tried to address this in the 2.0 version by allowing you to search across 
multiple archives. So once, you've set up your search criteria, you can apply it 
to every backup you've ever made.

Chris Trimble mentioned that "You can't "OR" AND "AND" the different backup 
parameters. Like, I
       couldn't have a statement like "If this is in Chris's directory and
       it says "Temp" or this is in the tmp directory, then back it up"

You can do this Chris, though the logic of how we've set it up doesn't jump 
right out at you, it is possible. In your case you would make two selectors, one 
called "Temp files in Chris's DIR". This selector would "and" the two conditions 
together. You would then create a second selector called "Temp Only". This 
selector would consist of just the files named "Temp". You would then create a 
third selector to "OR" these two selectors together. Granted not easy to grasp, 
but it is possible. We've spent a lot of time on making the selectors in 2.0 
much easier to use, if/when you get it, I'd be interested in your feedback.

As for the calendar problems:
      " You can't have a "cron"-backup (i.e. "Calendar") that is something
       like "On the first Friday of every month, do level zeros"

We've changed this as well. You can now specify for instance that a full backup 
be done on the last Thursday of every second month, and that a normal 
incremental backup be done every other day. All of this within a single script.

Greg Ferguson made some comments about Mac Password and Retrospect 
incompatibility, we were not aware that there was a specific incompatibility, 
but I'll make sure that we take a look into it. Our extension that allows 
Retrospect to start running is based upon certain toolbox calls that may be 
different than FastBack Plus or MemoryBank. As for the large site compatibility, 
I'd say that there is no program that will back up to your satisfaction across a 
WAN. There is just too much information to force through a network when you are 
performing a backup to expect that any one backup station could be a solution 
for you. So, I would agree with Greg in that Retrospect is great in the 50-100 
Mac range. For example: Apple is using Retrospect under world wide site license. 
Their strategy is to have a backup "group" of a certain number of Macs, and have 
the net administrator for that group responsible for the backups. This beats one 
person responsible for 1000 Macs being backed up, as you are de-centralizing the 
task of the backups. It also keeps the net traffic that is generated during a 
backup specific to one particular area of the network, rather than attempting a 
backup across multiple zones, etc.

Lastly Chris Davis is correct in commenting on Bob Kubiak's question about how 
Retrospect determines which files should and should not be backed up.  When 
Retrospect scans a volume, it creates a hash table of all the relevant 
information on each file on that volume. It then compares this hash table 
against the catalog file to determine which files should or shouldn't be backed 
up. Within this catalog we keep a snapshot of relevant information for a 
particular volume. This snapshot contains a "picture" of what your hard drive 
looked like as of the last backup.  In order to recreate your drive should you 
encounter catastrophic failure, the snapshot allows Retrospect to pick and 
choose the files it needs from your tape in order to rebuild your hard drive. 
The catalog is not necessarily for each particular user, but rather for each 
"archive" in Retrospect. You may have a catalog that has 50 to 100 volumes 
backed up on to it. 

Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Bren Smith
Dantz Development, Inc.
1400 Shattuck Avenue
Berkeley, CA 94709
dantz.tech@applelink.apple.com
tel: 510/849-0293 
fax: 510/849-1708