HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:12:05 EST
Reply-To:     Tony Dugdale <CXAD@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA>
From:         Tony Dugdale <CXAD@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA>
Subject:      Us selfish peons :-(

Put my vote in also for a million thanks to Ken for being jdr.  I
suppose I'm guilty as charged for not showing my appreciation
before. I don't know too much about the politics of the internet,
but would a $15 _registration_ fee really be "against the rules"?
Charging per game would be too confusing, but what about yearly
dues?  If it goes not for profit but to repay the administrators
for their time, can it be that bad?  I for one would be more than
willing to put in $10-15 to keep it running.  I'm Canadian, but
can get hold of US$ pretty easily (though not in check form).
The precise logistics of doing this internationally would be
confusing.  Won't banks process foreign checks, though?

I am also for forbidding ALL partial press on non-gunboat games.
While it's nice to have it all tagged and easily sent, I have
found that it can also be problematic, and problematic for me
means major headache for whoever's running it.  I don't think it
would be a major inconvenience to put a few addresses into my
mail directory as "e-hastings", "g-hastings", "t-hastings" etc.

Lastly, I'll join in the self-imposed limit of 3 games once my
current games wind to a close.  And how about limiting the number
of non-moderated games (that jdr has to moderate by default if
something goes wrong)?  If people want more games, let them
moderate them (I'm one to talk...I should start moderating).

In any case, I'm glad this has been brought to my attention.  I
have to admit I was pretty ignorant that there was a problem, and
I for one can't imagine donating the enormous amounts of time
that Ken has without any compensation.  Thanks a million, and I
hope we can get it all straightened out!

Tolara
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Sat, 21 Nov 1992 17:38:21 EST
Reply-To:     Michael Baswell <EWN@CORNELLA.BITNET>
From:         Michael Baswell <EWN@CORNELLA.BITNET>
Subject:      ftp site

Could someone please email the ftp address for those maps?  I seem to have
misplaced it.

Thanks!
-MB
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:24:49 EST
Reply-To:     Rick Desper <desper@MATH.RUTGERS.EDU>
From:         Rick Desper <desper@MATH.RUTGERS.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Suez ....

Actually, making the change would significantly weaken Turkish
influence on Egypt, which I agree is not the best idea.  Egypt would
no longer be closer to Turkey than to Italy.  Italy is strong enough
in the region already.

I object to the Suez for esthetic reasons.  It makes the game
non-planar.  It is not as offensive as the off-board boxes in Africa
(I would suggest changing those) but it still bothers me.

Suez also bothers me because it is easily defended with merely two
units,  which makes for easy anti-(J/N/C) stalemate lines in a place
which would make it very hard for an Asian power to win with the
Youngstown map.  But this is not just the fault of Suez, as the
off-board boxes and Omsk must also take some blame.  While there are
similar stalemate lines on the regular map, it is a lot easier for
Turkey to get west of the Ionian, say, then it is for Japan to get
through the Suez or into the Atlantic.  Of course, this is no reason
to change the map, as no degree of minor tinkering can change this
flaw.

Does Jordan really have three coasts now?  Or is Jor-WC just another
name for Jor-SC?

				Rick
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Date:         Sun, 22 Nov 1992 11:04:05 MST
Reply-To:     bart staker <bstaker@NYX.CS.DU.EDU>
From:         bart staker <bstaker@NYX.CS.DU.EDU>
Subject:      youngstown

Hi,
I have a question regarding the youngstown variant.
Can an army move Jordan -> Egypt, or must it go
Jordan->Suez->Egypt
I'm pretty sure it is the former, but I would hate to try it,
and waste a turn if it didn't work.

thanks
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Date:         Fri, 20 Nov 1992 10:40:39 EST
Reply-To:     Nick Fitzpatrick <nick@SUNBURN.UWATERLOO.CA>
From:         Nick Fitzpatrick <nick@SUNBURN.UWATERLOO.CA>
Subject:      Re: How to install your own judge

	  Not that it seems to be a problem yet, but I think we should be careful about
	starting up a large number of judges.

Why, surely if we set up, say 5, judges, with each judge running
20 games or so . . ., then we would save burning out a lot of people?

	I'm currently working on getting one
	going with some help from the EFF and possibly getting another going with
	Josh. (Who's last name I do not recall at the moment, sorry!)

EFF?  I believe that Josh's last name is Smith.

Nick
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Fri, 20 Nov 1992 10:30:18 -0500
Reply-To:     David C Kovar <kovar@WORLD.STD.COM>
From:         David C Kovar <kovar@WORLD.STD.COM>
Subject:      Re: How to install your own judge
              20 Nov 92 00:41:52 GMT." <199211201453.AA27112@world.std.com>

  Not that it seems to be a problem yet, but I think we should be careful about
starting up a large number of judges. I'm currently working on getting one
going with some help from the EFF and possibly getting another going with
Josh. (Who's last name I do not recall at the moment, sorry!)

-David
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
From: hirai@cc.swarthmore.edu (Eiji Hirai)
Subject: Re: More appreciation of Ken Lowe
Organization: Information Services, Swarthmore College, Swarthmore, PA, USA
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 00:19:56 GMT

Rick Desper <desper@MATH.RUTGERS.EDU> writes:
:A perusal of the player lists for many of
:the Ken Lowe games will show you that many games with five or six
:players with 0 dedication ratings - a sign of newcomers.

One way to keep the database of players small is to expire any old players
after X days of idle time.

Keep a "last time an order was submitted" date for each player.  Once a week,
run a program that will delete players who have a date that's older then X
days (say 30 days).

--
hirai@cc.swarthmore.edu (Eiji Hirai)    :     :    :   :  : :: ::: :::: :::::
Unix Geek for Swarthmore College        :     :    :   :  : :: ::: :::: :::::
Information Services, Swarthmore, PA, US.       Copyright 1992 by Eiji Hirai.
I don't speak for Swarthmore College.                    All Rights Reserved.
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Date:         Mon, 23 Nov 1992 18:59:58 MET
Reply-To:     Grzegorz Albinowski <caius@II.UJ.EDU.PL>
From:         Grzegorz Albinowski <caius@II.UJ.EDU.PL>
Subject:      Re: Suez

> > > I have a question regarding the youngstown variant.
> > > Can an army move Jordan -> Egypt, or must it go
> > > Jordan->Suez->Egypt

The <map.youngstown> file from the washington judge says :
<mv> - possible movements for armies
<xc> - possible movements for fleets

Egypt,                     x egy
Jordan,                    l jor
Suez,                      w sue

egy-mv: pen jor sud fez
egy-ec: sue red sud jor/wc jor/sc
egy-nc: pen eme sue jor/nc

jor-mv: egy syr bag nej
jor-nc: eme syr egy/nc
jor-wc: egy/ec nej/wc red
jor-sc: egy/ec nej/wc red

sue-xc: egy/ec egy/nc eme red

Caius.




-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Caius ( =Grzegorz Albinowski )                  Internet : caius@ii.uj.edu.pl
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Via:        UK.AC.LEEDS.GPS; 23 NOV 92 17:34:48 GMT
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Mon, 23 Nov 1992 17:33:27 GMT
Reply-To:     amt5man@SUN.LEEDS.AC.UK
From:         amt5man@SUN.LEEDS.AC.UK
Subject:      Re: Question From bstaker

george@edu.cornell.cit.nr-tech writes


> I've only seen two sets of youngstown rules but both mention the
> special nature of the suez (that a fleet can occupy it while units
> march over it).

Hmm.  I know that the most popular Youngstown variant in the States is not
the same as the most popular Youngstown variant in the UK.  If I can find
my copy of the Youngstown rules I'll reread it but I think that my copy
is elsewhere...

HOpefully the person who asked the original question is reading this.

Mark
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Return-Path: <Eric_S_Klien@cup.portal.com>
X-Origin: The Portal System (TM)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Wed, 18 Nov 1992 00:08:13 PST
Reply-To:     Eric_S_Klien@CUP.PORTAL.COM
From:         Eric_S_Klien@CUP.PORTAL.COM
Subject:      Diplomacy standbys needed!

**********************************************************************
  I NEED STANDBYS  I NEED STANDBYS  I NEED STANDBYS  I NEED STANDBYS
**********************************************************************

           I have almost run out of standby players.

I need help in getting all Diplomacy games on Usenet running
smoothly.  Please volunteer if you can.

                                                            Eric Klien
From: nick@SUNBURN.UWATERLOO.CA (Nick Fitzpatrick)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Subject: FLASH***** Ken announces demise of judge
Date: 18 Nov 92 00:08:54 GMT
Reply-To: Nick Fitzpatrick <nick@SUNBURN.UWATERLOO.CA>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

I just received the following from Ken Lowe

Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 15:39:22 -0800
From: Judge Dash Request <jdr@u.washington.edu>
Message-Id: <9211172339.AA00189@dewey.cac.washington.edu>
To: nick@sunburn.uwaterloo.ca
Subject: The fate of the Judge

> I fear that if the load increases much more, that the judge will be
> unusable.

I fear that if the load remains the same it will be unusable.  I've
decided that I've had about all the Diplomacy that I can take for
this lifetime.  It was fun up until a year ago, but I've gotten a
case of burnout and am now ready to call it quits.  Other interests
in my life have taken priority and keeping up with the judge has become
a chore rather than a pleasantry.  I'm ready now to disable the create
command altogether and let the current games play to their conclusions
without my help.  End of an era, I guess.  I only got one tee-shirt and
four postcards from players (three of the postcards came from John
O'Regan) so the support I'm getting for my efforts is such that I don't
really feel too obligated to continue.

If other people want to start up their own judges, I'd say that now is
the time to start making them public if they're not already that way.

> Since about the end of September, the judge appears very slow during
> the day.  Is there other software running on blake that didn't used
> to be there?

No, the only thing that blake does is to process Diplomacy.  The judge's
databases were never really designed to handle the number of players or
games that are currently involved.  A lot of redesign would be necessary
to streamline it to support this many people easily.  I'm not prepared
to put in the effort to do that work.  Blake is only a little surplused
Micro-Vax II.  The judge currently averages 650 cpu minutes per day.
Yesterday's usage was a whopping 1078 minutes and that doesn't include
the overhead of sending out the mail.  1440 would be 24 hours.  I'd say
we're saturated here.

> I will not be assigning any more, from angel on... (hmm, angel, bible,
> christ, devil, ... god, hallelujah, ...  jesus ... :)

No; angel, bass, carp, dogfish, flounder ...  :)  I'm going to shut off
the generic games before we get past bass if I can code it that quick.
Games seem to be starting at the rate of 1 per day and it is increasing
geometrically.

-Ken

Ps: Please publish this in EP Ch 2 and/or DIP-L.
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Date:         Mon, 16 Nov 1992 21:40:26 EST
Reply-To:     Rick Desper <desper@MATH.RUTGERS.EDU>
From:         Rick Desper <desper@MATH.RUTGERS.EDU>
Subject:      slow judges

I've noticed that Judge has been exceptionally slow today.  Do you
think we ought to take note of this and collectively start forming
games on other Judges? Today is not the first time.
						Rick
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Tue, 17 Nov 1992 14:11:36 EST
Reply-To:     Tony Dugdale <CXAD@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA>
From:         Tony Dugdale <CXAD@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA>
Subject:      Opening in corsica

Excellent opening a game corsica:  Turkey with 9 centres
and a really nice ally in Russia (nudge, nudge, wink, wink).

This game started as a 1898 variant. England has been
eliminated and Austria & Italy have been reduced to one
unit each.  Turkey just had to resign for time-commitment
reasons, but I hope someone else can come along soon and
get the game back on track ...

Tolara of Russia-corsica
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Date:         Tue, 17 Nov 1992 12:26:13 TZONE
Reply-To:     Bart Staker <staker@U.WASHINGTON.EDU>
Comments:     Warning -- original Sender: tag was
              staker@CARSON.U.WASHINGTON.EDU
From:         Bart Staker <staker@U.WASHINGTON.EDU>
Subject:      No grey maps

A couple postscript maps without grey in the water areas (thanx to Thomas
Burglin) are now available from   ftp.u.washington.edu
 (or milton.u.washington.edu) via anonymous ftp
They are in  the same directory as the other maps
/public/misc

They are named:
ngloeb9.ps
ngmap.ps

So far only loeb9 and standard map are available without grey in water.
I would appreciate some feedback on wether or not everyone is able to
print these out, to make sure I have them in the right format.

peace
bart staker@u.washington.edu
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Fri, 20 Nov 1992 14:53:20 EST
Reply-To:     "Richard V. Lamb" <USER60T4@UMICHUM.BITNET>
From:         "Richard V. Lamb" <USER60T4@UMICHUM.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: How to install your own judge

nick@SUNBURN.UWATERLOO.CA wrote:
>EFF?  I believe that Josh's last name is Smith

EFF refers to the Electronic Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization
dedicated to protecting the rights of the denizens of Cyberspace (like you
and me).  Their domain name is eff.org.

Rich Lamb
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Date:         Sat, 21 Nov 1992 10:59:36 MET
Reply-To:     paffrath <paffrath@INFORMATIK.UNI-KOBLENZ.DE>
From:         paffrath <paffrath@INFORMATIK.UNI-KOBLENZ.DE>
Subject:      another player wanted

Wanted: Replacement for abandoned Germany in game "london".  "London"
is a No Press, Gunboat game, that is currently waiting for the Fall 1901
deadli, so that game is early and Germany still has lots of potential.

Notice: The above message is not my own. I am posting it as a favour and
	i am not involved in the game.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Sun, 15 Nov 1992 10:47:41 EST
Reply-To:     aa158@freenet.carleton.ca
From:         Les Casey <aa158@FREENET.CARLETON.CA>
Subject:      Email

Say I want to send a private message to several countries
in a game.

Presently, I can only get two or three addresses on the
"To:" line of my email message. Is there a way I can send
to a larger list of people. I think it is called a bombing run.

Any suggestions?
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dipl-l
Date:         Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:00:28 -0500
Reply-To:     David C Kovar <kovar@WORLD.STD.COM>
From:         David C Kovar <kovar@WORLD.STD.COM>
Subject:      Suez ....

>If you think about this for a while, it becomes clear that the Suez is
>ridiculous.  I think things would be better if Egypt did not border
>Jordan at all, which could then border the Suez.  If anybody wants to
>change the Judge code, I would suggest this revision.
>					Rick

  You just have to change the map.youngstown file, I think. However,
before I make the modification, I need some sort of agreement from
most of the people out there that a) they don't care or b) this
is how it should be.

-David
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Date:         Mon, 16 Nov 1992 08:56:03 -0500
From:         FAC_JCLARK@JMUVAX.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Reference Guides, cheap

Rick,

The one reference source I usually mention is _The Motion Picture Guide_... but
this is a very expensive multi-volume set ($600--check Books in Print), so
probably better as a library purchase if you can convince yours.  Basic set
covers through 1984 (incl. silents), then annual updates thereafter.  Someone
on this or a related list (Rick Provine?) once mentioned that the version out
on CD-ROM excludes the silent films because of some contractual snafu or
something.  Personally, I have a copy of Halliwell.  But I can't think of a
good source between that is reasonably comprehensive in coverage, has more than
minimal credits, various indexes for performers and personnel, and provides
synopses and short (often arguable evaluations), with longer commentary for
major pictures, this often including behind-the-production anecdotes that you'd
normally have to find in books directly about the films involved.  Jeff Clark
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.cinema-l
Date:         Mon, 16 Nov 1992 14:45:32 -0600
From:         CDOMS@UMKCVAX1.BITNET
Subject:      Re: vampire movies

How about asking people what are there favorite Dracula/Nosferatu or
Vampire movie?

I am a fan of both the original silent Nosferatu as well as Herzog's
remake.  As for Dracula, Bela's classic is still a sentimental favorite.
And I did like Frank Langella's (sp?) version as well.

Some lesser known vampire movies I have enjoyed are: _Sundown_ (the
Vampire High Noon/Vampire Western) with David Carridine and M. Emmett (sp?)
Walsh.

Another that I thought was interesting was a movie that I think was called
_After Dark_ or something to that effect.  It starred Lance Henderickson (sp)
Bishop of Aliens and Aliens3.  As a member of a roving band of vampires.

I have heard they have optioned to make George RR Martin's vampire novel
_Fevre Dream_.  Check out the book, it would make a great movie, IF done
right.

Carol Doms
University of Missouri - Kansas City
From: lcc@WIN.ICL.CO.UK (Kerr Avon)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.cinema-l
Subject: Re: Restored THE ABYSS coming out on LD!
Date: 18 Nov 92 18:18:17 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

>From: jester@IHLPM.ATT.COM
>
>>      A friend of mine with a laserdisk player told me the other night
>> that the long-awaited *full* version of James Cameron's THE ABYSS will be
>> coming out letterboxed on LD in CAV with 37 minutes of restored footage,
>> and a batch of behind-the-scenes stuff.  Thank God!
>>      Can a videotape (and theatrical?) release--letterboxing or no--be
>> that far behind?
>
>Yes.  It is unlikely they will do a video (or theatrical) release of this
>film, for the same reasons they didn't do so for the extended version of
>ALIENS.  Sorry.

Unless you are in the UK (and Europe?), since laserdisks are very rare.
So, what _are_ the reasons for not releasing the extended _Aliens_ on
videotape in the States?  Just curious...

                        Liam.
                        ====-
                                   *"That's a misprint."
     KERR AVON    |   Work: ICL,   *"A misprint?"
 aka Liam Cairney |Reading, England*"Yes, it should say, um... `eel'."
  All e-mail to:- | Home: Glasgow, *"Eel escolope?!?"
lcc@win.icl.co.uk |    Scotland    *      --  Basil Fawlty & a guest
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.cinema-l
Date:         Fri, 20 Nov 1992 12:40:19 EST
From:         Bill Felty <BILL.FELTY@UKWANG.UKY.EDU>
Subject:      Aladdin voices

I understand that the voice of Jasmine in _Aladdin_ is provided by Lea
Salonga who won a Tony for _Miss Saigon_ on Broadway.  Does anyone know
who provided the voice for the young male hero?
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.cinema-l
Date:         Thu, 19 Nov 1992 08:47:07 -0500
From:         Ens Alexander W Ellermann <ellerman@NORFOLK.NADN.NAVY.MIL>
Subject:      Re: A Few Good Men

Though I'm not a Tom Cruise fan, may I recommend seeing
All the Right Moves and Taps before you pan the guy completely?

They came out before someone told him he was cool, & puts good work into them.
                                     Alex
From: AMBLY@CLUST1.CLEMSON.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.cinema-l
Subject: Re: Malcolm X
Date: 18 Nov 92 21:41:00 GMT
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Scott:

Good one!  I'm a sharp cookie and it took me about "X" seconds to figure
out you were making a joke!  Carry on...

Adrian
Clemson
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Date:         Mon, 23 Nov 1992 15:56:57 -0400
From:         FISHERKJ@SNYONEVA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Windshields

>we are actually shown bullets going through that windshield...
>from the hitpeople that jumped out of the car in front of Santino's.
>The ballistic analysis is available on request :-) .

I'll defer to your clearer memory of a movie I haven't seen in a while.
Actually, I just felt the need to defend a great, if erratic, director
who's been taking a lot of hits for the "D" movie. Speaking of hits,
I imagine anyone who called a real mafioso a "hitperson" would get zotzed
within the hour. There's not much male Liberal guilt in the Brotherhood.

>PS: I'm a marxist too, but from the Groucho wing of the Party.

Then there's Lilith, from "Cheers," who said the other night:
"Ah, that Gummo. What a card." (or was it Zeppo?)

kjf-
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Date:         Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:44:00 EST
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From:         ELGFROEHRER@PSUCES.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Dracula

                  I N T E R O F F I C E   M E M O R A N D U M

                                        Date:     16-Nov-1992 04:42pm EST
                                        From:     Ellen L. Gfroehrer
                                                  ELGFROEHRER
                                        Dept:     Independent Learning
                                        Tel No:   (814) 865-5403

TO:  VMSMail User _IN%"CINEMA-L           ( _IN%"CINEMA-L@AUVM.BITNET" )

CC:  _AUVM.BITNET"::IN%"AFCOLYER@PSULIAS.BITNET"
CC:  _AUVM.BITNET":: IN%"BAO@PSULIAS.BITNET"
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Subject: RE: Dracula

I have a vague rememberence of Dracula being a broadway play and Frank Langella
playing the lead.  Does this ring a bell with anyone else?
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