HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: s9242932@win4.vut.EDU.AU (WildStar)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: WHy is this newsgroup supposed to be gone?
Date: 7 Oct 92 23:18:40 GMT
Organization: Victoria University Of Technology, Melbourne, Australia

Why the hell is this newsgroup supposed to be gone???
Where are we supposed to post ShadowRun stuff?
I wanna a alt.games.shadowrun
or similar ...torg had one, why cant we, were bigger than that pathetic game


---------------------------------
Skeeve, President. (drdoom@skaro.xx.rmit.oz.au)
Tusra Inc.
(The United ShadowRunners of Australia)
P.O Box 120
Highpoint City, 3032
Victoria, Australia.
Email Tusra@skaro.xx.rmit.oz.au

*Tusra Inc will soon have it own internet machine running irc, bbs and ShadowRun Muds. 

"I fear the magic will take me oneday."
			Diablo - Elven Scholar and ShadowRunner.
Xref: sparky rec.games.frp.misc:6735 rec.games.frp.advocacy:2760
From: proberts@castle.ed.ac.uk (P Roberts)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp.advocacy
Subject: Re: Newbie System?
Date: 9 Oct 92 09:53:53 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

I would recommend Pendragon as a good starting game.  The background is
one that most people are familiar with to some degree: King Arthur and
the knights of the round table.  The mechanics are very simple with
skill rolls and combat being based on the same system.  There is a nice
little introductory adventure included in the basic book and there is a
lot of commercially available supplementary material available if you
decide you like it.  N.B. you don't need any of the supplementary
material to play you can manage quite happily with just the basic book
which costs about L14 over here ($20 over there?).  
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan)
Subject: Re: New From SJ Games!
Reply-To: sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan)
Organization: Plymouth State College - Plymouth, N.H.
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 03:48:33 GMT

irvine@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Brent Irvine) writes:
[writing about the new SJG GURPS Bunnies & Burrows:]

>Yikes!  That is from an old-ish game by the same name published by 
>(probably extinct) an old company called FANTASY GAMES UNLIMITED.

Not quite extinct, but quiescent.

>The game was first published in 1976 (same time as _Watership_Down_)

Watership Down was published in 1972.

>I have a copy from 1982 (second edition).
>
>I wonder if they give credit to the original publishers?

Not only credit, but royalties.  SJG bought the license from the
copyright holder listed in your version, and is paying him a
percentage of each copy sold - so you can buy a new copy with a clean
conscience.

Dennis Sustare, author of the original, was kind enough to read the
first draft of the GURPS version and thank me (the author of the new
version) for sticking close to the original spirit while expanding on
the concept.

-- 
  - Steffan O'Sullivan		         sos@oz.plymouth.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Newbie System?
Reply-To: sos@oz.plymouth.edu (Steffan O'Sullivan)
Organization: Plymouth State College - Plymouth, N.H.
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 92 18:34:03 GMT

seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:
>
>	Of course, I suppose that depends on what your definition of
>"learn" is. If you mean, "can roll the dice on command with a vague
>clue as to what might be going on", okay, I'd agree. But I think any
>system can be taught to THAT extent in 15 minutes. If you mean what
>I mean by "learn" -- know where everything you need is in the books,
>be able to create characters quickly and efficiently, know the pitfalls
>and advantages of the system -- then I doubt you can learn GURPS or
>any other MAJOR system in less than several months.

No, I don't mean all that by "learn."  I mean understand when you need
to roll the dice, against what skill or attribute, how to play your
disads and advantages, how to roleplay the character and understand
what a roleplaying game is all about.  And, no you can't necessarily do
that in every system - I played AD&D six times and NEVER understood
what my character was capable of, when to roll what, which actions
would be better than others, etc.

I don't think "learning" a system for a *player* has anything to do
with looking things up in books - players never need to look things up
in my games.  That's the GM's job.  Admitted, a player should
eventually be able to make a character, but that's not necessary to
really learn a system well enough to play it and enjoy it and know
what's going on.

-- 
  - Steffan O'Sullivan		         sos@oz.plymouth.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: uldry@eig.unige.ch
Subject: Where is 'Net.Book.Riddles (2/7)' ????
Organization: University of Geneva, Switzerland
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 07:53:35 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.183701.1233@aio.jsc.nasa.gov>, mark@erin.JSC.NASA.GOV (Mark Manning/Metrica) writes:
> 
> This is file: net.book.riddles( 7/ 7)
>  
	But... But.... WHERE IS PART 2 (OF 7) ???????????????????????????????

	The Great & Gna Gna Gna & Gna Gna Gna.... FU
	ULDRY@EIGA.UNIGE.CH
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: singley@helix.nih.gov (Erick Singley)
Subject: Re: VAMPIRE: Various
Organization: (National Institutes of Health, Bethesda, MD)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 19:56:50 GMT

Upset about drinking blood? Good! You've got the right mentality already.  This
is a game where you are dead.  don't feel dead? well you have no heartbeat and
get burned by sunlight- no daydeam. A real 'living' nightmare. How are you going
to deal with it? You need blood to survive- you've got two choices: DIE or get
blood somehow.  Animals? A trusting friend? (you only need a little bit a day
unless you really push yourself healing/being stronger) Complete strangers?
Get creative?
Yes- be uncomforatble.  Being a vampire is not a plesant idea for the average
population- if only because of the streotypes.  As a vampire you get to find
out how true those stories really are (at least accodrding to how the game system present them.

Mail list? (tap.tap. tap. waiting for the other terminal to give him Mail so he 
can say-) Ah! Yes- ask to subscribe to vampire@math.ufl.edu and they talk about
all sortsa stuff.

Erick
--
singley@clinpharm.niaaa.nih.gov
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: tgt33358@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Deus Imperator)
Subject: Re: Werewolf & Hunters Hunted?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 02:10:43 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.203800.3049@ncsu.edu> jmkaraka@eos.ncsu.edu (JOHN MARTIN KARAKASH) writes:
>	Ix-nay bub!  Hunters Hunted (locally known as the Munchkin
>Handbook II) has stuff to let 'normal' humans have a fighting chance
>against the supernatural.  Giving a Garou this stuff is like the old
>AD&D mega-classes that kept popping up (Paladin/Magic-User/Cleric/
>Assassin/Plumber/Archer-Rangers!).  

How so?  I bought the Hunters Hunted, and was thoroughly impressed by 
the product.  Are you implying that humans should not be allowed to 
fight back?  I do not understand what the big hangup is.  Even with
the bennies the Hunters Hunted provides, the average hunter is still 
fighting an uphill battle. 

>                                     Besides, all storyteller game
>systems are intended to simulate a slice of the horror genre.  I've
>never seen a werewolf whip out a cross and hold off a pack of vampires.
>
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are _dreamt_ of 
in your philosophy."  You make the common error of assuming that True 
Faith only works for Christians.  As the Hunters Hunted points out, faith
in any religion of a sufficient intensity is grounds for TF.
This can be the worship of Gaia.  Uncommon, but not impossible. 

-- 
I don't mind being the smartest	    / Thanatos, DeathUrge, Master of Unknown
man in the world...I just wish it   \ Time and Space tgt33358@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu 
wasn't this one...	       	    / "No, I don't know how much unknown is... 
	-Ozymandias 		    \	...THAT'S THE POINT!"
From: mkkuhner@phylo.genetics.washington.edu (Mary K. Kuhner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SR:  Spider Totem
Date: 11 Oct 92 16:31:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Oct11.163103.7782
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <1687D465E.MHART00@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU> mason writes:
 
>Re:  your objections to the nature of insect totems.  It has
>been argued that the irrational fear of insects displayed by
>most people is an instinctive one.  Why?  Srun offers the
>insect totems as a possible explanation.

I have no problem with the existence of malevolent Insect spirits, but it
seems to lose some possibilities for doubt, fear, and confusion if you
can count on all Insects being of the same predictable type.  It's also
worth noting that not all cultures dislike all insects, by any means.
Spider Grandmother is honored by SW Amerind tribes, and Anansi the
Trickster (also a Spider) by Africans.  Bees are a positive symbol in
many cultures, though one can also imagine very sinister Bee Spirits in
the pattern of the FASA material.

A character of mine was given a Spell Focus by an African Spider Shaman,
and spent a good deal of the campaign wondering whether it was safe to
use it.  She was afraid, with good reason, that she'd become entangled
in his plans and lose her free will; but she needed the help, and she
knew they had a common enemy....The difficulty I have with FASA's
interpretation of the Insect Totems is that once you know what they're
like, you'll never have this kind of uncertainty again; it's *always*
bad to deal with them.

The classical totems can also be interpreted in more ambigous ways.
Raven is inquisitive and a busybody, a Trickster and a thief; but he is
also Odin's ravens who brought divine inspiration from the lands of
darkness, and the Morrigan's ravens who picked the eyes of the slain.
Snake is even more ambiguous; the Snake totem presented is very true to
some NA patterns, but what if you met a Snake Shaman who came from a
Middle Eastern tradition--the serpent who tempts and poisons?

I like to keep people guessing.

Mary Kuhner mkkuhner@genetics.washington.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: mark@cheers.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark Manning)
Subject: Re: Where is 'Net.Book.Riddles (2/7)' ????
Organization: Simulacron I
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 17:58:15 GMT

Book parts 1-7 were posted.  If, for some reason, you did not manage to get
all of the parts, then send me some e-mail on it.  I'll e-mail them
directly to you.  :)

Am I the only one who now sees all of the Net.Book.Riddles postings?
Let me know via e-mail.  Thanks!  :)
From: tdunn@ecst.csuchico.edu (Tim Dunn)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Newbie & Premade characters
Date: 9 Oct 92 20:14:39 GMT
Organization: California State University, Chico
NNTP-Posting-Host: cscihp.ecst.csuchico.edu


SeaWasp and I seem to be on opposing sides again.  No new situation.

I've run a few games at conventions (getting in for doing something
I love beats getting by paying money I earn doing something I don't 
like easily) and don't classify them as tournaments.  There was a
impetus to get the group together, and there was a problem, but if
the group didn't solve it, I wouldn't feel let down or berate them.
So long as everyone has fun, it works out.

As for premade characters, I have found a middle ground for me, 
especially in con-reg games.  I make up the portion of the character
that I need, and make sure to leave some part of the character unmade
for the player to add in.

Specifically, I'm thinking of heroic Hero games (150 pts and under.)
I leave between 10 and 30 points, so that once the players choose the
characters closest to what they want, they can modify it even closer.
I am under no illusions that it is exactly what they want, but it's
a compromise.  I don't have to worry about munchkins sneaking rules
dodges or loopholes, and I think the players get more invested in
their characters.

That's the mechanics side of it.  The background I do much the same
way.  I've found myself and other gamers resenting the part of the
game if the referee forces us to meet and introduce each other as
wasted time.  I'd just as soon establish that the characters know
each other.  Any background is up to them.  I will listen and be
alert for ways to tie in other facets of the game on their histories
so it's not wasted breath.

Oh, and having at least two character per player is mandatory.  I 
usually try to have at least that many, and as diverse as possible
(especially including ones I wouldn't play, but I try especially
hard to write them up as if I would so as not to shaft their pro-
spective user.)

It worked a few times before.  I'll probably continue to use it.


-- 
All I ask of life is a constant and exaggerated sense of my own
importance.
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: fshaver@eng.auburn.edu (Leech)
Subject: Re: Vampire
Reply-To: fshaver@eng.auburn.edu
Organization: Auburn University Engineering
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 21:42:25 GMT

> Mitchell E French writes:
> >John Martin Karakash writes:
> >>Different POWERS is fine, but a different RULE MECHANIC for each one!
> >     I've been trying to figure this one out.  Where do you get it?
> >     As far as I recall, there's one basic rule mechanic:  Roll an Attribute
> >plus another stat (skill, discipline, whathaveyou), and count successes.
> >The successes mean different things depending on what you're doing.
> >     Where's the problem?
> 
We finally broke down, got out a sheet of paper, made a column for the Disciplines,
a (big) column for the Attribute + (whatever), and a column for the target number.
This made running easier, and also clued in the players as to what Attributes and
Abilities would be good for them to raise.

Tim Dunn writes: 
> See, you have to remember which stat, which modifier and how to apply
> said modifier.  The stats changing is fine, that's the aspect of the
> system I like.  The modifiers seem to me to be arbritarily determined,
> and are not intitutive, thus seeming like a different mechanic.
>
I agree that the modifiers sometimes seem arbitrary.  So do the combinations of
Attributes + (whatever).  We finally decided that the combinations given in the rules
were adequate guidelines, but that often the character might be using a different
combination than the book's suggestion.  Our kind Storyteller <grovel> allowed us to
use different combinations, say Manipulation + ____ instead of Charisma + ____ 
(especially for Animalism powers).

Sidenote:  Animalism is a clan discipline of the Nosferatu.  If memory serves, one of
the powers of Animalism calls for Appearance + ____, and the Nosferatu clan have an
Appearance of zero.  The rules-lawyer judge could visciously stick to this and make
un-life difficult for the Nosferatu, or he could allow for some other Attribute to be
used.  Now, assume the kind ST allows some other Attribute to be used.  How about the
Gangrel who has a low Appearance?  Shouldn't he also be allowed to use a different
Attribute?  To be fair, yes.  And this was how we convinced our ST that the Attribute
+ (whatever) system basically SUCKS and we would have more fun picking more logical
combinations.  Score one for the players!

						No sign-off.
PS.  This holds true for Werewolf, too.
From: s903609@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (ACE)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SR Karma Pools
Date: 7 Oct 92 05:56:01 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre
NNTP-Posting-Host: minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au

mehawk@agora.rain.com (Michael Sandy) writes:

>How about have a 1 karma Karma Pool cost 10 karma?  Increasing it
>to 2 would cost 10 Karma.  Increasing that to 3 would cost 20 more
>karma.  Getting to a 4 Karma Pool would cost _70_ karma.
>Thus, you can build a _lucky_ character who doesn't boost his
>skills/stats/spell knowledge...  
>An enchanter _might_ be able to get some of the karma spent on
>a Focus back.
>Comments?

This would be VERY expensive, and not all that useful, unless you are VERY
lenient with the Karma Pool. It could be interesting to allow a character to
purchase his Karma pool instead of having it as a fraction of earnt karma, but
at the rates you suggest it just would not be worth considering that auto
successes are INCREDIBLY expensive, and most of the time you need the base
skills anyway. One idea would be to allow the player to purchase EXTRA points
in the Karma pool at the same cost as a general skill. This would be on top
of any karma already earnt. This would not be very powerful, although it
would be useful. It would allow basically an extra die on ONE action in an
encounter. If this seems powerful, you should probably not even have a Karma
pool in the first place, as it already allows this sort of thing for FREE.
Ah well, food for thought. Happy running, chummers.

>-- 
>Michael Sandy
>mehawk@agora.rain.com
>michaels@m2xenix.psg.com
>"The above does not reflect the views of any organization."

			       ACE
                   s903609@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au
	        " How deep is the ocean ? " - Eric
" No Silicon Heaven ? But where would all the calculators go ? " - Kryten
      " Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast." - Hero Rimmer
From: leifmk@Lise.Unit.NO (Leif Magnar Kj|nn|y)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Post-Apocolyptic GURPS
Date: 12 Oct 92 16:10:06 GMT
Organization: Norwegian Institute of Technology

In article <1992Oct11.004738.59599@cc.usu.edu>, sl9b4@cc.usu.edu (Deep Six) writes:
 > In article <70732@hydra.gatech.EDU>, (Sub Zero) writes:
 > > I'm contemplating setting up a post-apocolyptic GURPS campaign. Anybody got
 > > and PA rules?
 > 
 > I use a lot of conceptual stuff from Twiltight:2000. In fact, I wanted to 
 > play T2k, but I was introduced to GURPS by a friend who was running a 
 > fantasy campaign. I won a GURPS Basic Set 3rd Ed. at a convention here at 
 > my school, and that got me thinking. I just adapted everything possible 
 > from T2k, added some of my own ideas and made up my own world.
 > 
 > One thing that I haven't really made rules for is radiation. My apocolypse
 > was not a nuclear one, but I plan on making up or adapting some kind of 
 > rules for radiation some time in the future.
 > 
 > Other than that, I think setting up a world which isn't covered under
 > a certain supplement is time consuming, but not all that hard. It's more
 > a matter of concepts and ideas, not hard and fast rules (unless there's
 > something REALLY unusual about the world, I guess).
 > 
 > Okay,
 > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 > Chadd VanZanten SL9B4@CC.USU.EDU + ``Charlie don't surf!'' --Big Duke in
 > Francis Coppala's Apocolypse Now

I believe there are rules for radiation in GURPS Space.  At least, I've seen 
references in other books where specific amounts of rads are mentioned, as are
the radiation protection factors of certain space suits in Ultra-Tech.  I haven't
got hold of Space yet, but I will soon.....

Leif Kjxnnxy
leifmk@lise.unit.no
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: 900667c@ace.acadiau.ca (GERALD RICHARD CAMERON)
Subject: CHILL: Using Other Creatures with Vampires
Keywords: Chill, vampires, scenario design
Organization: Acadia University
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 00:02:36 GMT

I am currently in the process of starting a Chill campaign where the main 
thrust will be thwarting and/or hunting down vampires (give your players 
what they want, right?).  I've got to keep them on their toes, too, though.  
How would you integrate other creatures of the unknown into such an 
adventure?  I'll even listen to the obvious ones, eg. Onaqui, Bat Lord, 
Werewolf.

Also, what are some of the more atmospheric places to set such adventures?  
Obviously Transylvania comes to mind, as does New Orleans, but what other 
places lend a little mystique of their own to the vampire legend, and how 
can this be exploited?

Thanks in advance.

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp.marketplace,rec.games.frp.advocacy,rec.games.frp.dnd
From: dutech@reseau.Berkeley.EDU (Groupe ELEVES)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: WereVamp->Ars?
Date: 15 Oct 92 08:46:22 GMT
Reply-To: dutech@reseau.Berkeley.EDU (Groupe ELEVES)

In article <BvKB7K.D4B@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
(SilverFang Ahroun) writes:
> 
> >The difficulty system is too contingent on the referee's whimsy.  Is it a 
> >6 or a 5?  No, wait, it's written in here _somewhere._  Look in the book,
> >I'll look through the _Player's Escalation Guide._  This brings up another
> >point -- has anyone noticed the severe power disparity that the Player's
> >Book introduces?  It's as bad as Champs3.
> 
> That's the way it is SUPPOSED to be. Yes, difficulty numbers are supposed
> to come from the storyteller, not from a chart. You decide how hard it
> is to do something, and using 6 as the average target, adjust from there.
> Storyteller whimsy? Yes, that's exactly right. Much of Vampire/
> Werewolf/Ars Magica depends on the players just shutting up and letting
> the Storyteller work.     

  I strongly disagree here : Storytelling, IMO, is not made with
"players shutting up and letting the storyteller work." It's a story
co-run by all, each putting his/her little $0.02. I mean, the players
make suggestions, hypotheses, speak to people, interact with the world.
They are in the story as much as the GM.

  In essence, it's almost like Amber storytelling : only difference, you
are entitled to roll dice.   

 						- Redwing -
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: nexus@ylum.cgd.ucar.edu (Jeff Berry)
Subject: Re: Post-Apocolyptic GURPS
Summary: Aftermath
Organization: Climate and Global Dynamics Division/NCAR, Boulder, CO
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 18:47:59 GMT

In article <Bw0u5v.1ox@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> tbarnes@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas wrentmore barnes) writes:
>Aftermath (ignore the obscenely complex rules system, use the really
>good campaign seed ideas, the neat monsters [master rats anyone?] and
>the good equipment lists. If you can wade through it there is some
>interesting stuff on hazards, armor creation and weapon generation).


Not that it has anything to do with GUPS, but, I like Aftermath.  And the
rules aren't obscenely complex, only vulgarly complex:-)  Of course, one
needs to add house rules for disabling hit locations, but everything else
works fine.

	For those who are unaware, the heart of the Aftermath system is this:
Attributes are divided into effect groups. So, for example, a STR of 15 is
effect group 4, and 25 is effect group 5.  The groups have associated
dice.  For EG 4, it is 1d10, for 5, 2d6.  Then in many cases, like HtH
combat, the EG die are rolled to detemine effect, with the result modified
by equipment.  The problem being that the equipment modifiers are
multipliers.  So if I hit you with my Rapier, I roll (for example) 2d6
and multiply the result by 1.8 for the rapier to determine damage.

	See, not hard at all!  But it is the only game where a calculator
is pretty much required during play.


badger                                      Don Alexandre Lerot d'Avigne
Jeff Berry                                  Seneschal of Caer Galen, Outlands
               nexus@ncar.ucar.edu
NCAR doesn't tell me what to think, and I return the favor.
"You're a notch and I'm a legend"-------Alice Cooper
"You're still doing the things that I gave up years ago.."-----Lou Reed

Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc