HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: khaikin@boa.cis.ohio-state.edu (dmitry khaikin)
Subject: Re: Conversion Question
Organization: The Ohio State University Dept. of Computer and Info. Science
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 19:30:44 GMT

>
>Yes, I am from Russia and I am as Jewish as you are (oops! I'm not a Kohen :-).
Not being a Kohen does not make you less Jewish. In fact not being
religious does not make you less Jewish.

Thanks,
Dima
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  "A word is worth one coin; silence is worth two."_____ The Talmud.
  "Silence is good everywhere, except in connection with Torah."____ The Zohar.
   khaikin@cis.ohio-state.edu (Dmitry Khaikin, Columbus Ohio, USA)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: mgross@halibut.nosc.mil (Michelle K. Gross)
Subject: theological differences in O & C Judaism
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <mgross@halibut.nosc.mil (Michelle K. Gross)>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 20:50:18 GMT


If one reads Emet v'Emuna, the statement of faith published by 
the Jewish Theological Seminary, one will find a description of
Jewish beliefs. From an orthodox viewpoint (note the small
'o'), two points in this publication distinguish it from other publications:

(1) "Revelation continues in our day" (I'm quoting from memory from the 
	beginning of the booklet.)
(2) The committee members who published the statement were self-selected.

If scj'ers are going to discuss denominations in Judaism, I think that
these two points are a fair place to start and could provide a discussion
that illuminates Jewish history and the evolution of Jewish doctrine.

Respectfully submitted,
Michelle
mgross@nosc.mil
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: johnson@itzb.com
Subject: My interpretation and yours
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 16:52:52 GMT


You people are all such hypocrites.  You go on and on
about how legitimate you all are, while saying that I
am illegitimate just because you disagree with me.

All interpretations believe things that 200 years ago
would be called heresy.  That's no more true of me as
a M (Messianic) Jew than it is of an O or C or R Jew.
All the interpretations, M, O, C, and R, are all in
the same boat.

If you want to call my interpretation illegitimate,
give me a reason, otherwise stop complaining about
people calling you illegitimate while yourselves all
calling me illegitimate.

And don't worry: I won't scare you by posting the
reasons or tenets of my belief.  All I want to know is
why, from a Jewish perspective (about which I have
studied as much as any of you) you have the right to
call me illegitimate while you gripe about noone
calling you illegitimate.


David ben Yeshu ben Dovid HaMelech
From: tichauer@valpso.hanse.de (Manfredo Tichauer)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Bobby Fischer's anti-semitism
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 92 17:42:36 +0100
Organization: "The Private Site of Manfredo Tichauer"

d_ellis@ricks.enet.dec.com (David Ellis  20-Nov-1992 0830) writes:

> leonid@spss.com (Leonid Feygin) writes:
> 
> > Minor comment on Kasparov's ethnicity: Gary Kasparov is actually 
> > half-Armenian, half-Jewish.  (His late father was Jewish.)
> 
> Which makes him _not_ a Jew, according to Jewish tradition.
> 
> There is no such thing as "half-Jewish"....
  
  You are right. This was a nazi terminology but regrettably many people
  still use it unknowing its origins and  that either you are or you are
  not a Jew.

 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Manfredo Tichauer M.                       EMAIL : tichauer@valpso.hanse.de
  Opitzstrasse 14                            VOICE :     (++ 49 40)  27.42.27
  2000 Hamburg 60 - GERMANY                  FAX   :     (++ 49 40) 270.53.09
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: edelheit@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Conservative Leadership on the 21st Century
Date: 15 Nov 92 03:22:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: linus.1992Nov15.032241.13484
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, McLean, VA

Gedaliah's posting really struck home.  I was active in USY in the
mid-60's and my wife was active in the late 60's.  Over time, we have
found the C's movement to the left to be distressing.  Thus we have
found the Union for Traditional Judaism to be more consistant with 
where our beliefs have remained.  The answer to the question of where
the C movement is headed is pretty clear to me.  The traditionalist
will quit the USCJ (USA's new name) and will join UTJ.

Regards,

Jeff Edelheit		email:  edelheit@mitre.org
The MITRE Corporation	voice:  (703) 883-7586
7525 Colshire Drive	FAX:	(703) 883-1397
McLean, VA   22102
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: hayim@locus.com (Hayim Hendeles)
Subject: Re: Getting pregnant first time (Was Re: Oral sex)
Organization: Locus Computing Corporation, Los Angeles, California
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 20:10:42 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.163119.20293@shearson.com> esafern@shearson.com writes:
>In article 283@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca, jgoldber@todah.chem.utoronto.ca (Joel Goldberg) writes:
>
>>  Not to mention that according to (Yivamot? it was daf yomi in August)
>>   there is no possibility of pregnancy from a woman's first relations
>>   which would mean that one could never get started.
>>   (I wonder why the Amoraim excluded Lot's daughters. Anybody know?)
>
>There is a Rashi by this Maaseh which states that Lot's daughters
>removed the hymen by hand beforehand, since "one can't get pregnant the
>first time."  (This is from memory.)
>
> ...
>It is, unfortunately, totally false.  It is completely medically possible
>for this to occur.  It is not all that likely, however...
>
>If you don't believe me, cross-post to sci.med.


Your translation of Rashi follows the common translation of the word
"besulim". However, I am personally not convinced that this is a
correct translation, as there is a major discussion in the Talmud about
whom a Kohen Gadol may marry - all revolving around the Torah's term
"bsula" (virgin) implying there must be "bsulim".  There seems to be
some problems with an older girl (bogeres) marrying a Kohen Gadol,
because her "besulim" are not 100%. Now, if you accept the meaning of
the word "besulim" as hymen, I don't understand the difference between
a younger girl and an older girl. Therefore, I wonder if there might be
more to it, then the plain simple translation indicates.

If I am right, then this may serve as a key to deciphering your
problem.

>
>Anyway,  statements such as this cast doubt on Rashi being 100% divinely
>inspired, since he used a medical non-fact to complicate an issue which
>needed no complication.
>

As I mentioned before, I am not convinced that Rashi did err.  But,
noone claims that Rashi was anything but human - even Moses erred. So
while it may be possible that Rashi erred at times, it is also
possible, in fact far more likely, that you and I also err at times (no
offense intended). All in all, Rashi's track record is probably far
better than yours or mine.


>What this says about the Talmud requires further investigation.  Did they
>(unlike Rashi) qualify this at all???
>

As I commented earlier, since the discussion revolves around
the term 'bsulim', perhaps age might also be a factor as
the aforementioned Talmudic discussion implied.

Hayim Hendeles
Xref: sparky soc.culture.jewish:20801 soc.culture.turkish:11978 talk.politics.mideast:22454 talk.politics.soviet:9120 soc.culture.greek:10855 soc.culture.europe:9778 soc.culture.soviet:10192 soc.rights.human:4303 soc.culture.yugoslavia:9705
From: nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller)
Subject: Re: American Antisemitism
Keywords: antisemitism
Organization: Trinity College, Hartford, CT.
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 21:18:21 GMT

In article <leonid.722204101@spssig> leonid@spss.com (Leonid Feygin) writes:
>
>It comes to no surprise if you look at what has been going on for quite
>a while at the campuses of many American universities.  Take, for example
>abundance of openly anti-semitic materials in black-run college newspapers
>and magazines, or numerous virulently anti-semitic speeches of invited
>"guest speakers" representing various black groups.
>--
>Leonid Feygin     SPSS, Inc.     leonid@spss.com     (312) 329-3639

The situation is as described.  It's considerably less clear that the
propaganda is responsible for much of it, which of course implies that
getting rid of it might help: it won't.  Black anti-Semitism is going to
be with us for a long time and will _begin_ to subside only if/when the
structural bind that blacks find themselves in changes.  I doubt that
it will, but why is a long long story.

Norman Miller
nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu
From: goldberg@techunix.technion.ac.il (Jacques Goldberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: G-d or G*d?
Date: 18 Nov 92 13:01:34 GMT
Organization: Technion, Israel Institute of Technology

I would personally consider this as discussion of a solution in quest
of a problem. The reason not to spell the Name is definitely not respect
but attention paid in advance against possible erasing. The Name is fully
spelled out in texts which are handled so as to try prevent erasing, like
keeping them locked, etc...
If your hypothetical community had such texts, there is no reason why the
incomplete Name would become corrupted. If it had not, it is much more than
the Name that would have been corrupted; see for example a recent movie on
an almost lost community in Portugal, listen to the story of Moses and the
Exodus, the incomplete or complete writing of the Name is reduced to a very
high order negligible correction...
Yaaqov Goldberg
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: Just try a little harder <dkeller@ndlvax.enet.dec.com>
Subject: Help needed
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <Just try a little harder <dkeller@ndlvax.enet.dec.com>>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 09:23:12 GMT
From: dkeller@ndlvax.enet.dec.com (Dom Y. Keller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Help needed...Judaica...
Date: 20 NOV 92 09:51:43    
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Keywords: 
Summary: 
-Message-Text-Follows-
 Shalom,

 I'm scouting for Judaica holiday motives (I'm on a VMS system, so .eps or 
 image or sixel files would be perfect, I'm also running uudecode). Any help
 out there? I've NO ftp access...so ftp copies aren't possible.

 I'm also looking for good donation places in Israel, f.ex. a Yeshiva or
 social institute...

 Finally I need an address in Israel to place kosher wine orders...they must
 be willing to send to Europe. Maybe a place which is also selling kosher
 food...

 Thanks much...pls reply via E-mail

 Good Shabbos

 Dom Keller 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet)
Subject: Quiz
Reply-To: ask@cblph.att.com
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories,  Columbus, Ohio
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 18:53:02 GMT

Several years ago my wife received a 'quiz' at a national Hadassah
convention.  It's purpose was to demonstrate that many Jews are more
familiar with non-Jewish subjects than with Judiasm.

These are adapted from the 'quiz,' which was prepared by Rabbis Jack Reimer,
Steven Riskin, and Arnold Turetsky.


- Name three of the 4 Gospels.
- Name 4 books of the 5 books of Moses.

- Who was the mother of Jesus?
- Who was the mother of Moses?
  - (- if too hard, who was Moses' wife? 
          ok, ok, - name one of Moses' children )


-  To what town did the 3 wise men go?
-  To what town did Jonah go?

- Who was the first Pope?
- Who was the first king of Israel?

- Which of the following (if any) are from the Hebrew Bible?
  - The witch of Endor
  - Shadrack, Mishack and Abendigo
  - Satan
  - The (arch)angel Michael
  - The book(s) of Chronicles
  - These words from Handel's "Messiah" -
        "King of Kings" and  "Lord of Hosts"
        "The L-rd Shall Reign Forever and Ever"
  - Love your neighbor
  - Feed the hungry; clothe the naked

- Name the president of Egypt
- Name the president of Israel

- Under which astrological sign were you born?
- In what Hebrew month were you born?

- What does 'trinity' mean?
- What does 'midrash' mean?

- Who wrote "Gone with the Wind?"
- Who wrote "Guide for the Perplexed?"

- Joseph had two sons.  Name one.

- What are your parents' Hebrew names?

- How many lines in a sonnet?
- How many letters in the Hebrew alphabet?

- When did Socrates live?
- When did Rabbi Akiva live?

- Name 5 baseball players
- Name 5 of the 12 tribes of Israel

- Name 3 professional football quarterbacks
- Name the 3 major prophets

- What happened to Columbus in 1492?
- What happened to the Jews in 1492?  (This was an old quiz -
                                        prepared in the late '70s)

- Who am I?  I am one of the most famous and well-known  of
anyone mentioned in the Bible.  But I almost was killed as an
infant.  You see, where my parents lived, the king decided to kill
all male infants.  But my family got me away in time, and I
grew up to be very famous, indeed.  Who am I?

------------------------

As the authors of the original quiz stated, the answers aren't
offered here.  Nor are these particularly hard questions.
The incentive is to encourage Jewish study.

(But if you're really curious, I'll answer any questions I can on
request.)

As a guide here, if you are quite confident in your answers, you're
probably right.  If you are thinking, "what's the big deal, the
answers are all obvious"  there is a big deal:   as the authors of
the original quiz said, significant numbers of Jews will "flunk" this
quiz.   If you are Jewish, don't know many answers, and think this
is a dumb quiz, I encourage you to at least try to learn a bit more
about Judaism.  It can't hurt.
-- 
Art Kamlet  a_s_kamlet@att.com  AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,misc.headlines,talk.politics.misc,misc.legal
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Subject: Re: Say it ain't so
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 23:42:25 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.165926.3810@panix.com> eck@panix.com (Mark Eckenwiler) writes:
>In <1992Nov16.222719.5719@bony1.bony.com>, jake@bony1.bony.com sez:

>>Lemrick Nelson's lawyer used this mistrust in a highly theatrical
>>presentation to convince the jury that the police, by not recording
>>every single detail in a RIOT situation, had in fact made it all up
>>instead of living through it.  And the jury lapped it up.

>Golly, I completely forgot about the "riot exception" to the rule that
>the prosecution must prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.  I'll have
>to go back and reread _In re Winship_; can't imagine how I missed it.

I didn't say that the police are not required to follow procedures.  

I did say that a biased jury can take minor problems in a case in
understandable circumstances and then say that this casts "reasonable
doubt" over the evidence presented to them.  In both the Kahane and
the Rosenbaum murder cases, the jury prefered, instead, a fairly
far-fetched conspiracy theory without any supporting evidence at all.

-- 
Jake Livni  jake@bony1.bony.com              10 years from now, George Bush will
American-Occupied New York                   have replaced Jimmy Carter as the
My opinions only - employer has no opinions. standard of a failed President.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.jewish:20648 soc.culture.turkish:11864 talk.politics.mideast:22362 talk.politics.soviet:9057 soc.culture.greek:10786 soc.culture.europe:9720 soc.culture.soviet:10137 soc.rights.human:4260 soc.culture.yugoslavia:9641
From: rmt51@cas.org (Rick Turkel)
Subject: Re: goy
Reply-To: rmt51@cas.org
Organization: S.W.I.G.
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 20:48:47 GMT

In English communication, written or spoken, the word "goy" is problematic.
It obviously isn't English, and therefore something other than its simple 
meaning is implied by its user (otherwise, why not just say/write "non-Jew").
The same is true of "shvartze(r)" -- in a Yiddish context it is the only
correct term for a black person, but it is definitely derogatory when used
in English (on a par with "nigger" I would say), despite the protestations of
many of its users to the contrary.  There is no question that these words are
legitimate in their original source languages, with clear and specific
meanings, but when they are used IN ENGLISH there is more there than meets
the eye; it would take a lot to convince me that no pejorative is intended
by their use.  I absolutely never use the word "shvartze(r)" for this reason,
and carefully weigh the implications before using the word "goy" or its
derivatives.
-- 
Rick Turkel           (___  ____ _  _  _  _  _     _  ___   _  _ _  ___
(rmt51@cas.org)           )    |  |  \  )  |/ \     |    |   |  \_)    |
(rmt51@cas.bitnet)       /     | _| __)/   | __)    | ___|_  | _( \    |
			Ein navi be`iro.            |
From: simon1@bass.bu.edu (Simon Streltsov)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Kosher pork in the diabetic?
Date: 23 Nov 92 03:33:20 GMT
Reply-To: simon1@bass.bu.edu (Simon Streltsov)
Followup-To: soc.culture.jewish
Organization: Boston University

In article <1992Nov22.194539.1171@cbnews.cb.att.com> ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet) writes:
>>> Please CYLOR first, however.
>>
>>  What means CYLOR?
>
>In the context of this newsgroup,   CYL-R means:
>
>  Consult Your Local --------  Rabbi
>Art Kamlet  a_s_kamlet@att.com  AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus

Gevalt! Censorship!
But the test was good, thanks, Art!

(btw, number of dashes is equal to the number
of letters in Orthodox, R or C do not fit,
was it intensional? or Freidism? or what? (-:)

Simon Streltsov,
Boston University

"If you go on the road and come to a fork -
Take it!"


Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff)
Subject: Re: Not Techelet Again (Re: Prayer shawls)
Organization: Univ. of MD, Baltimore County
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:20:13 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.141843.26304@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:
>>>>Andrew Solovay writes:
>>>>>>Oh no! Not the Techelet thread again!
>>>>Joel Goldberg responds:
>>>>>  But it can't _be_ the authentic techelet thread...
>>>In article <199211131251.AA14674@yfn.ysu.edu> <aa324@yfn.ysu.edu
>>>(Marlene Miller)> adds:
>>>>Nope, it's definitely _not_ the authentic techelet thread. In fact, it
>>>>looks kinda grey on _my_ monitor!
>>In article <1992Nov16.193732.824@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
>>saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:
>>>I would have thought that the source for the blue dye, not just its
>>>appearance on a monitor was the knotty issue.
>In article <1992Nov17.002430.2139@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>
>jgoldber@todah.chem.utoronto.ca (Joel Goldberg) writes:
>>  Mah ha kesher?
>"Kesher"? "Kosher?" Wait!  I thought we were talking about threads, not
>Kashruth.

The kesher is the kushya of mitzvot ha'taliyot ba'aretz.  Or
maybe the kasha that should go into the cholent?



-- 
Eliot Shimoff                  |    n   n   n
   shimoff@umbc3.umbc.edu      |   X + Y = Z .  Easy to prove no solutions
Ashamnu, bagadnu, gazalnu ...  |   for n greater than 2.  Darn.  Can't fit
Better luck next year!         |   it into this little .sig file.  Oh well.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: cema@eng.umd.edu (Simon Hawkin)
Subject: Re: Belief and science (Einstein)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 01:12:14 GMT
Organization: Project GLUE, University of Maryland, College Park

In article <1992Nov12.174400.4716@guinness.idbsu.edu> holmes@garnet.idbsu.edu (Randall Holmes) writes:
>In article <emc.721579695@tomalak> emc@doe.carleton.ca (Eli Chiprout) writes:
>>In <BxJ4y8.5Bs@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> hrubin@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin) writes:
>>>Putting on my professional hat, when one examines the process of inference
>>>carefully, what is being done is using data to update beliefs.  That we do
>>>not carry this out explicitly, and in fact cannot, is due the the sheer
>>>size of the problem--massively larger than the size of the universe.
>>
>>>God knows His laws of the operation of the universe, but we are commanded
>>>to work at getting approximations to them.  It is only in this way that we
>>>can have mastery over haaretz.
>>
>>But you have come to this conclusion using the process of inference that
>>is incomplete, as you have mentioned.  So how do you stand above that 
>>incompleteness to propose the above as a fact rather than as a theory?
>>
>>I submit as well, that any being that knows the universe in its totality
>>would have to contain more information than the universe: MUCH, MUCH more.
>>But then we have just expanded the universe by that statement.
>
>It is mathematically provable that the class of all true sentences in
>a reasonable language is impossible to define in that language
>(Tarski's Paradox). 

	<...>

>	The solution to the paradox in its normal form (which does not
>mention God!) is as follows: an adequate language will be able to
>express the idea of a concept (by talking about sentences in the
>language and substituting names in the language for the variable x)
>and thus the only ingredient of the argument which is open to
>challenge is the idea that we can define truth for sentences of a
>given language in that language (which blocks the definition of C).
>This solution seems unsatisfactory for the theological form of the
>paradox.  God must know the truth or falsehood of any proposition.
>
>	Any suggestions?

May it happen that G-d does not *know*, but *believes* ?

Since I am no religious, this is nothing more but a joke. However,
what do the theologists think about that ?

Thanks for enlightening in advance.
-- 
---
This is Simon Hawkin from Merry Land.
From: faigin@aero.org (Daniel P. Faigin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Conversion Question
Date: 23 Nov 92 10:47:04
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
	<1992Nov23.131109.9113@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
	<FAIGIN.92Nov23074739@soldan.aero.org>
	<1992Nov23.180826.21081@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: soldan.aero.org
In-reply-to: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com's message of 23 Nov 92 18:08:26 GMT

On 23 Nov 92 18:08:26 GMT, saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) said:

> For the majority of the last 2000 years, the procedure to convert to
> Judaism has evolved in a particular line and (reletively) suddenly Reform
> comes along and changes the procedure, demanding it be accepted.  Isn't it
> encumbant on Reform Judasim to make sure this is understood?

What changes has Reform made to the *procedure*? There is still study; there
is still acceptance of the mitzvot (definition not procedural) before
witnesses; *most* Reform rabbis require circumcision or mikvah.. The problem
is not procedural; the problem is we differ on what the "mitzvot accepted"
are. And that brings the argument full circle, so let's not start it again.

FACT: Reform does have a different understanding of what the mitzvot are.

FACT: Some more traditional branches will not accept Reform converts without
reconversion or demonstration that the appropraite "yoke" was accepted.

Suppose you had a Reform convert who converted in front of proper witnesses
and had circumcision/mikvah, but whose understanding at the time of the
conversion was the Reform understanding of mitzvot. This person subsequently
became Baal Teshuvah and accepted the full yoke of the mitzvot. Would you
require reconversion?

Daniel


--
[W]:The Aerospace Corp. M1/055 * POB 92957 * LA, CA 90009-2957 * 310/336-8228
[Email]:faigin@aerospace.aero.org              [Vmail]:310/336-5454 Box#13149
		    "And as they say, the rest is compost"