HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brayl@nyx.cs.du.edu (Bill Rayl)
Subject: Re: A new perspective on 8bit piracy.
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 17:23:27 GMT


Adam, 

I follow your point about buyig an original from a friend, but I don't
condone cpying commercial programs, even if the company "isn't around
anymore."  If the company had folded, the softwar reverts back to the
author.  A lot of comapnies that aren't in the Atari market anymore are
still around.  The best thing, would be to get the company to release
the old commercial game into the public domain.  If a company isn't
around (ie alive), we should tr to get ahold of the author, andsee if 
he/she will release the program into the PD.  Who knows who wrote 
Paperclip, for example?  Wouldn't it be nice to get software out into
the public domain, and maybe if we get lucky, source code could come with
it, for someone like Bob Puff to make an update.

That's the solution, not piracy.

                Pattie Rayl (Atari Interface)
From: moon!cyberden!phbill@well.sf.ca.us
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: APAC Object Editor!
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 17:30:02 PDT
Organization: Indescribable Creations

HEY ALL!  I'm working on a program that allows you to edit 8 x 8 x 256 
characters!  Yes!  8 x 8 x 256.  Just like normal character sets, but in 
256 colors!  Of course you loose a LOT of characters per set (1024 
bytes), but you have unlimited characters avaliable to place onto the 
screen.  The program is written in TurboBASIC XL (of COURSE...) and so fa 
all I've got it to do is edit one character and change it into "TEXT"able 
characters.  (Say you have an 8 x 8 block in GR.9/GR.10/GR.11/APAC mode- 
it would take up 4 x 8 bytes, or 4 normal character-set characters.  If 
you were to place a character onto the screen, you'd do something like 
this:
COLOR 1:POKE 87,8 (this would probably be set all the time)
POKE 756,CHC:TEXT X,Y,"ABCD" (CHC is the character set base..)
POKE 756,CHL:TEXT X,Y+96,"ABCD" (CHL is the chbase + 512 (or 1024), and
                                 contains the luminence data... CHC cont-
                                 aining the color data)


As soon as I get the editor done, I'll upload it to the archive and 
commense work on a Galaga clone!!!  :)  (my FAVORITE game of all time!)

Hopefully TBXL can keep up.. it having to TEXT onto the screen twice for 
every enemy.  (8x8x256 looks mighty nice!!)


Any comments or ideas are GREATLY appreciated.
                                                                Bill

Say|____________9_year_veteran_ ||| __
Hi |PhBill: Bill Kendrick      / | \
if |moon!cyberden!phbill@well.sf.ca.us
in |__________________________________
NJ!|                     July 29, 1992
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
From: ultron@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Andrew H Krieg)
Subject: WANTED: Atari 800/XL/XE games
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 18:59:32 GMT

I am trying to collect as many commercial games for the 8-bit as possible.  
If you have anything you're looking to get rid of, drop me a line.  I am
interested in cartridge and disk games only (sorry cassette people).
-- 
=     Andrew Krieg	| 						=
= krieg@titan.med.ge.com|  Treguna   Mekoides   Trecorum   Satis   Dee	=
=	   or		|						=
= krieg@point.cs.uwm.edu| 				    - Astoroth	=
From: Jim_Johnson@abcd.Houghton.MI.US (Jim Johnson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Re: A dumb question!
Distribution: world
Date: 28 Jul 92 19:53:22 EST
Organization: Amiga BitSwap Central Dispatch

In a message dated Tue 28 Jul 92 13:24, Bruck@brachot.jct.ac.il (itay Chami
wrote:

 BC> Alot of times I ask myself the question: How was the Rev A OS
 BC> written? I mean,
 BC> the Atari assembler wasn't out yet, so did they use calculators? And
 BC> how was
 BC> Rev A BASIC created? And how was the Atari Assemler/Editor written?
 BC> Were all the Rev A bugs (both in the OS and in BASIC) there just
 BC> because they
 BC> were written in unreliable ways? (not using an assembler?)
 BC>                                                                 -Itay
 BC> --
 BC>                            ****************
 BC>                            * Itay Chamiel *
 BC>            bruck@brachot.jct.ac.il  OR  bruck@147.161.1.1
 BC>                            * The Parasite *
 BC>                            ****************
 BC>         Calling to YOU from Jerusalem, Israel! (a cozy place)

By now someone will have answered this, but in case they haven't...
All the complex tools in the world have been built the same way, that is by
preceeding generations of simpler tools.  The Atari OS, et al, were built
by a 6502 cross assembler.  That is to say, another computer (in this case
a mainframe (archaic by now)) ran an assember that generated machine
language code for a different processor (in this case a 6502).  Mind you,
this is more complicated than writing ML code programs for the Atari,
because everyone who writes for the Atari uses routines already written in
the OS.

If you think about it, this is the way all the game cartridges for the
Atari Lynx, Nintendo, Sega, etc. are built.  After all, none of them come
with program development capabilities.

I have heard of many cross assemblers for MS-DOS machines to program 
nearly every commonly used processor ever produced (including mainframes). 


Jim Johnson - Laurium, Michigan, USA (near Lake Superior where 6-8 meters
of snow falls every winter)...


-- Via DLG Pro v0.995

Jim Johnson-
*** Remember, they're only tools - Not a way of life! ***
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
From: hill@spot.Colorado.EDU (Michael Hill)
Subject: Re: Ben Poehland's post
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 00:49:19 GMT

So I got a bit riled up...  I admit, if I had it all to do over again, there's
one word of my previous post that I would change.  But I think I have a
right to be upset with Darek's immature attitude, because at least I post
worthwhile stuff and contribute to this group once in a while; I've only
seen whining and complaints from Darek.

(And besides, he hasn't ever given ME anything.  I can't think of a single
piece of software for the 8-bits with his name on it.)

Still standing by all but one word of my previous post,

			--Michael

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael Hill   <><  Isaiah 9:6 | "Don't you forget now that Somebody died for
hill@spot.Colorado.EDU         |  you/ I'm tellin' you the truth, man, I ain't
Ball Aerospace Systems Group & |  gonna lie to you/ Good guys, bad boys, we're
University of Colorado@Boulder |  all the same/ Saved by grace is the name of
$ mv net.flames /dev/null      |  the game."            --Allies, "Burden Down"
-------------------------My boss is a Jewish carpenter!------------------------
Did you ever notice that everybody in favor of abortion has already been born?!
From: UJ1G@DKAUNI2.BITNET (Marek Tomczyk)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Alternate Reality - The City (codes)
Date: 21 Jul 92 19:03:21 GMT
Organization: University of Karlsruhe, Germany

Hello,

browsing through old magazines I've found some cheating codes
for Alternate Reality - The City.
To make use of these codes you have to have a kind of freezer.
(A kind of hardware or software that lets you interrupt a game
or a program by pressing a hotkey and then lets you poke around
the memory).

Some memory locations follows:

$8ab6-$8ab9, $8aba-$8abd ---> HP
$8aad                    ---> Level
$892e,2f,30              ---> Strength
$8937,38,39              ---> Intelligence
$8940,41,42              ---> Wisdom
$8949,4a,4b              ---> Skill
$8952,53,54              ---> Stamina
$895b,5c,5d              ---> Charisma
$8aa6-$8aa9              ---> Experience
$8ac6                    ---> Copper
$8ac0                    ---> Gold
$8ac2                    ---> Silver
$8aca                    ---> Gems
$8ace                    ---> Jewlery

I haven't tried them yet and probably won't try them at all.
I want to play such a great game like AR without tricks.
(IMHO)

Marek Tomczyk
uj1g@dkauni2.bitnet
From: hill@spot.Colorado.EDU (Michael Hill)
Subject: Re: A dumb question!
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 00:47:58 GMT

In article <15470eINN7lp@agate.berkeley.edu> deaven@physics.Berkeley.EDU (David Deaven) writes:
>I still write Atari assembler on a workstation. A cross-assembler in a
>UNIX environment is a very nice thing -- I use a small one which I've
>written in C and you can imagine how much easier it is
>to go through the edit-assemble-edit cycle.  I can download the binary
>straight to the Atari via RS-232 over a 2400b modem (or just right off
>the port on the workstation, if I bring in an xl machine on the
>weekend or at night). This is all very much simpler for me than the
>old Atari Macro Assembler or (even worse) the Assembler/editor cartridge.
>But then I have a pretty low-tech system; no hard drive and none of my
>machines have more than 48K. My main use for these beautifully
>engineered machines is for incorporation in to electronic projects
>which require a brain, and some small ``home computation'' tasks.
>-- 
>David Deaven (deaven@physics.berkeley.edu)

Say, pal, any objection to sharing the cross-assembler?  :^)  Sounds
pretty nice, but to write my own would be way too big of a project -
I don't have one tenth the time that would require!

Which workstation are you on?  I'm on a SPARC 2.  (I wouldn't expect any
hardware-specific stuff in your cross-assembler, tho.)  Seriously, would
you mind sharing?  That might just be the ticket that would get me back
into hacking assembly on my trusty 800!

Thanks,

			--Michael

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael Hill   <><  Isaiah 9:6 | "Don't you forget now that Somebody died for
hill@spot.Colorado.EDU         |  you/ I'm tellin' you the truth, man, I ain't
Ball Aerospace Systems Group & |  gonna lie to you/ Good guys, bad boys, we're
University of Colorado@Boulder |  all the same/ Saved by grace is the name of
$ mv net.flames /dev/null      |  the game."            --Allies, "Burden Down"
-------------------------My boss is a Jewish carpenter!------------------------
Did you ever notice that everybody in favor of abortion has already been born?!
From: jeff.molofee@outlan.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Jeff Molofee)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: RE: ALTERNATE REALITY--UN
Date: 21 Jul 92 12:45:00 GMT
Reply-To: jeff.molofee@outlan.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Jeff Molofee)
Organization: Outland BBS-UUCP

Copy the disk with a hardware copier, or hack the code yourself.  That's
what I did... I remember the first time I tried cracking it, it seemed
to play great, but then some cops would jump out, show you their badge
and kill you.  (no escaping)... I eventually did get it copied though.
From: Rick_Michael_Cortese@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Re: alt real dungeon: stuck
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 09:04:14 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Well I wandered around "The Dungeon" for a little while yesterday so what
follows are a few tips. Stop reading if you don't want any.
Sequence should go something like this: Trade a piece of clothing to the
Clothes Horse for the Mirrored Shield on level #2 I believe. It's usefull
for 2 encounters. If you get the Iron Palm Salve on level III, it's helpfull
but not required. Use it before you go to the Gargoyle 'cause he'll teleport
you to the Basilisk when you answer his questions right. Answers to the
questions in order are SHIPWRECK, ORACLE, BLOODSTONE, SHINGOR. (You have
taken the reforged ring & tossed it in the Oracle by now right?) If you use
the Mirrored shield & bare hand you should be able to defeat the Basilisk. I
took him on after casting dexterity, shadowmeld, & speed W/O the shield &
lucked out [Temporial F., wack, Temporial F., wack, ...] You get the
Bloodstone after winning the battle. You also have access to the stamina
fountain in the SE corner of that level. You're supposed to give the
Bloodstone to the Dragon next door to the Gargoyle, but I carried it around
for a while since it helps restore hit points. If you chose to fight the
Dragon, be ready for a major fight. I think he(she?) has 800-900 HPs. I
managed to win one by having 2 or 3 gold horns, a dozen crystals, wands, &
a fully charged guild ring, but I used EVERYTHING up & only had 20 or 30 HPs
left myself. You get so much loot after the battle you can't carry it all, so
dump everything in your guild locker before you take him on, what's left over
won't be there when you return. You should have the PAC card by now if you've
been following the hints in the game, so the only thing left to do is equip
the Mirrored Shield & go down to the 4th level to met your destiny.
From: moon!cyberden!phbill@well.sf.ca.us
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Re: Looking for patches
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 20:43:56 PDT
Organization: Indescribable Creations

ac742@yfn.ysu.edu (Joe Perkins) writes:

> I have all fo these in a form which will allow me to copy them to 
> the HD, but each one has it's own drawbacks when you try to use
> it ( reading only drive one, looking for support files on drive one,
> etc.)
> 
> Can anyone tell me how to go about patching these suckers?

Do these access "D:" as drive one or "D1:" as drive one?  (some 
programmers are lazy and assume that you're using DOS 2.5 or something 
close in which "D:" could ONLY be drive one)  
If the program DOES access "D:" then it's just a simple case of changing 
the working directory "CWD <dir>" in SpartaDOS - not sure about SDX tho; 
or in MyDOS use [R] (or was it [Q]?) to "pick default directory."  In 
both cases whenever "D:" is accessed it acts like how it's set.  (oops.. 
BTW: in SpartaDOS, just type "Dx:" to change the drive NUMBER and "CWD" 
to change DIRECTORIES.  In MyDOS the same command does both)
Anyways.  From there whenever you're prompted from within the program for 
a filename, if it's smart it'll stick a "D:" in the front of it if no 
drive is given.  This means all your working files for this program are 
in it's directory/on the same drive.  If you DON'T want this, just add a 
"Dx:" at the beginning.

IF, however, the program DOES use "D1:" (waste of 1 byte every time it's 
used!!! ;) ) then my best feeble suggestion would be to get out a good 
old sector editor (which, BTW: I am without!!!) and change all occurences 
of "D1:" to something like "DD:" or "Dx:" (x being your new drive/hard 
drive number...remember it's unchangeable unless you go around editing it 
every time... just use SpartaDOS or MyDOS and "DD:").  I've only tested 
"DD:" with MyDOS.  I used BobTerm to play with it while I was online.. so 
don't trust this 100%.  Play with it first.  If it works, go in and edit 
your program (SAVE THE ORIGINAL!!!!!!!!!).  

I do think, however, that most programmers were lazy enough ;) to say 
"D:" instead of "D1:" back in the good old days of non-directory DOSes...

    "Be seeing you!"
Say|____________9_year_veteran_ ||| __
Hi |PhBill: Bill Kendrick      / | \
if |moon!cyberden!phbill@well.sf.ca.us
in |__________________________________
NJ!|                     July 25, 1992
From: jeffh@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jeff Hunsinger-MUX_Tech)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Old software
Date: 23 Jul 92 21:33:57 GMT
Article-I.D.: oakhill.1992Jul23.213357.28919
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.

Remember when there was a big movement to see if the old games had been
released into the public domain (or to get the companies to do so)? Well,
my results after contacting numerous companies were:
No reply.
No way.
Thanks for the suggestion, but it is not feasible.
And finally, (from Sierra): we would have to support them still, so we will
not do so. However, our first adventure is in the public domain. (I don't
remember the name of it.)

So... it looks like you won't get any condoned copying. However, I wouldn't
let that stop you. These companies obviously aren't making any sales to this
arena anymore, so it doesn't make any difference.

If you can find it for sale, buy it. If not, copy it.
I hope to establish a "clearinghouse" for orphan software RSN...

Jeff
From: Amos.Jackson@f47.n282.z1.tdkt.kksys.com (Amos Jackson)
Sender: FredGate@tdkt.kksys.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Old software
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 21:08:00 -0600

I must agree with your statements, due to the fact that I for one have spent
since my intorduction to the Atari 8-bit over $1200.00 in all types of software
and still keep up with vendors who are selling the software to try to keep
something alive for the Atari 8-bit.  I've also made MANY purchases at my local
user group and they have aided me greatly in being able to purchase software.
 
Amos Jackson

 * Origin: FlightLine BBS Mpls,MN USRdual 612-544-5118 (1:282/47.0)
From: moon!cyberden!phbill@well.sf.ca.us
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Re: 1450xld
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 92 14:02:06 PDT
Organization: Indescribable Creations

As to the 1450xld...well first time I saw one of those was in an old 
Atari Age magazine..

the only other time was in my BEST catalog :)

    "Be seeing you!"
Say|____________9_year_veteran_ ||| __
Hi |PhBill: Bill Kendrick      / | \
if |moon!cyberden!phbill@well.sf.ca.us
in |__________________________________
NJ!|                     July 20, 1992
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
From: mfolivo@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Mark Newton-John)
Subject: Re: Dos 3
Keywords: Well, name those bugs!
Organization: Sacramento Public Access Unix
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 07:53:58 GMT

In <1992Jul17.132105.28617@neb> bbs@neb (BBS System) writes:

>Dos 3 had so many bugs that even Atari corp. dropped support of it
>shortly after releasing it. Why anyone would use that OS is beyond
>me.

You know, I have heard that (I think) piece of bull for years. In
ALL of the years I've used DOS 3, I have NEVER encountered any bug,
lost information, or anything. Hell, I even asked Atari on their
BBS and they couldn't tell me of any bugs or even fixes. If there
any true, documented bugs, I'd like to know.

I've used various terminal programs, Express, Amodem, etc. with DOS
3 and.... no problems. AtariWriter, AT8GIF, ARC, GIFNCODE,
GIFDCODE, nothing. The only time I use DOS 2, is when I am using a
protected program that uses DOS 2, or a custom format program, like
SynStock.


-- 
#############################################################
# Scaramento Public Access UNIX     sactoh0.SAC.CA.US       #  
#  (916) 649-0161, 722-6516 & 722-5068    E-Mail & USENET   #
################## default .signature file ##################
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
From: darekm@microsoft.com (Darek Mihocka)
Subject: Re: Old software
Date: 24 Jul 92 19:59:17 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <1992Jul23.213357.28919@oakhill.sps.mot.com> jeffh@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jeff Hunsinger-MUX_Tech) writes:
>Remember when there was a big movement to see if the old games had been
>released into the public domain (or to get the companies to do so)? Well,
>my results after contacting numerous companies were:
>No reply.
>No way.
>
>So... 
>
>If you can find it for sale, buy it. If not, copy it.
>I hope to establish a "clearinghouse" for orphan software RSN...
>
>Jeff

Amazing. Not only are you offering to pirate software and telling other
people to do so, but you're actually offering to do this for people.
Not for free, I'm sure. How much do you plan to charge people for this?
Do you plan on sending any of the profits to the original companies
like Sierra or are you gonna bag all the profits yourself.

Hey, I have another profitable idea for you. Break into warehouses
and storage lockers and steal the merchandise and re-sell it. Heck,
go and break into people's home during the day when they're not there.
After all, they're not using at the moment. They don't need the stuff!

Let's forget the fact that the people will come home and want to use it.
Let's ignore the possibility that this software may at some time be
repackaged or brought to market again. Let's forget that somebody still
owns the rights to that code.

And give me a break. You 8-bit users are all pirates anyway, even though
only Jeff here will admit it in public. You want me to believe that
your typical Joe 6 Pack Atari user will be able to _only_ pirate software
that is no longer in production and refrain from pirating software
that is. Like your average user will _know_ which software it's "ok" to
pirate and which it isn't.

BULL****!!!! You are a complete disgrace to the Atari community. I hope
you not only get sued by every 8-bit software developer past and present
but that you lose your net privilidges as well. You're also pretty stupid.
By blatantly offering your piracy services in public, you're opening yourself
for all sorts of trouble. Moron.

- Darek


-- 
/----------------------------------------------------------------------------\
| darekm@microsoft            | What the above looked like to Homer Simpson: |
| Views expressed are my own. | Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah |
\----------------------------------------------------------------------------/
From: Rick_Michael_Cortese@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.8bit
Subject: Re: Piracy, morals and Microsoft employees
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 09:33:44 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Jul27.065138.6150@dartvax.dartmouth.edu>

Soap Box Attack, so you can stop reading now. Copyright laws were written
at a time where novels like Moby Dick were being written. It was concievable
that writting the "Great American Novel" could set you up for life as well as
your heirs. There was also a need for trade mark, brand name protection since
a company may well be in existance for decades. IMHO: These laws are being
wrongly applied to software. If a special case for software is not created,
then it should be a case of patent law where it would be valid for 17 years.
Patents were originally concieved as an exclusive use for a fixed term in
exchange for divulging the technology behind the invention. It gets me PO'ed
that software writers that that they deserve a better deal then the invertors
of the laser, telephone, powered flight (whoops! inveNtors above),
integrated circuit, etc, etc. Take Ben & I as examples from the
pharmacuetical field. If we come up with something there is a lag time of
at least 7 years before a product can be introduced while testing & FDA
clearance is being sought. So you end up with a mere 10 years of an exclusive
market. Does that stop development of drugs in the US? I do ack software is
being copyrighted & even though it is a mistake to copyright it in the 1st
place they are entitled to protection under the law. Just as an example
(& I'll ack my figures may be off) Lotus 123 does about $300 million/year
in sales. 17 years means a $5.1 billion gross. Software developers are
blind if they think any other technical person thinks of them as "Artist"
deserving perpetual exclusivity on their work. It's just code! not the
freaking Mono Lisa.