HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil (Tim Miller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: * Jesus Christ? *
Date: 2 Oct 92 16:04:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: hrt213.9210021604.AA01212
Organization: The Ohio State University

On Fri, 2 Oct 1992 07:05:24 GMT, JHIATT@130.187.170.178 (JOHN HIATT) said:

 J>   How does Jesus of Nazareth fail to be the messiah?

	I think that dying without leaving a son behind kind of
disqualifies him.  The Messiah will be, above all, a man-- with a wife
and kids, too (sooner or later).

	But start with the obvious: things didn't get any better after
the Nazarean was born.  The Messianic Age will 1) come to pass in *this*
world (the Nazarean claimed it would be the next [John 18:36]); 2) will
be marked by redemption of all oppressed peoples; 3) will be marked by
an era of peace and prosperity.  None of these have happened in the last
2000 years.

	The Messiah will gather Israel back to our land.  In 70 CE, the
Romans put down a rebellion and scattered us.  Pretty big failure there,
IMHO. 

-- Cerebus <tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil>
"Rabbi just addressed in last week's lecture over brunch..."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: daw@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Dave Webb)
Subject: PLEASE!  I need your help!  Help me keep this love alive!
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 14:45:50 GMT

I desperately need some help and advice.  I have been dating a Jewish girl
from New York for the past 2 months and have developed a wonderful relationship
with her.  We have spoken of marriage and spending the rest of our lives 
together.  We see each other as often as possible, I've been to New York several
times, she's been down here (Baltimore) and we went on vactation together to
Florida.  The problem we are now facing is her parents.  They are conservative
jews and forbid her to date non-jews.  Well, too late for that.  The problem we
now are facing is when and how to tell her parents.  She confided in her sister
(she has three) and the one sister she confided in told her that the news of her
dating a non-jew would kill her parents.  She said that they would never accept
me and for her just to end it now before things get any more serious.  She also
mentioned something to her father directly.  The exact words were, "Dad, what 
would you do if I dated someone who wasn't je
					     wish?"  Her father's response was,
"I'd throw you out of the house"  (She is 24 and is living with her parents
until she finishes school next May)  Well that was that.  So now the choice she
is forced to make is between her parents and myself.  She has already told me 
that she can't give up her parents because they've always been there for her
and she can't hurt them after all they've done for her.  She is very confused
and needs some direction.  She loves me and doesn't want to leave me either..
the feeling is mutual.  I hurt for her because of everything she has to go
through.  We kind of broke up this weekend because she didn't want to hurt me
more later.  It was a very sad time.  That really wasn't what she wanted, so
we decided to continue our relationship as it was.  I need to hear as much
advice and suggestions as you all can come up with.  Things I've decided:
She should contact her rabbi and have HIM help her break things to her parents,
We need to come up with a very positive way to introduce me to her parents.
I've thought of conversion and her sister thinks that even that wouldn't do any
good for her parents acceptance.  Anyway, I'm very in love with this girl and
can't stand the thought of losing her... especially since things are going so
well.  PLEASE help me!!!  What choices do I have?  What choices does she have?
Suggestions? Hints?  I'm DESPERATE!  Help me to keep this love alive!  PLEASE??

			Thanx in advance,
					Dave Webb

        je
From: rlk@underprize.think.com (Robert Krawitz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: PLEASE!  I need your help!  Help me keep this love alive!
Date: 6 Oct 92 14:14:32
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge Mass., USA
	<1992Oct06.143454.37494@watson.ibm.com>
	<RLK.92Oct6124924@underprize.think.com>
	<1992Oct6.171457.6413@cbnewsl.cb.att.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: underprize.think.com
In-reply-to: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com's message of 6 Oct 92 17:14:57 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.171457.6413@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:

   In article <RLK.92Oct6124924@underprize.think.com>
   rlk@underprize.think.com (Robert Krawitz) writes:

   >If organized Judaism is going to take a hard line toward people who
   >intermarry, and parents of someone who intermarries are going to go
   >through the whole mourning routine, it's not going to make Judaism look
   >very attractive.

   Using other (additional) reasons, of course, but isn't that one of the
   things Christians, Moslems, idol worshippers, etc. have been saying
   about Judaism for the past couple thousand years?

Never actually heard it from anyone who wasn't involved in this
situation fairly directly.  Besides which, in this case (unlike most of
the other "criticisms" of Judaism) there's some truth to it.
--
ames >>>>>>>>>  |	Robert Krawitz <rlk@think.com>	245 First St.
bloom-beacon >  |think!rlk				Cambridge, MA  02142
harvard >>>>>>  .	Thinking Machines Corp.		(617)234-2116

Member of the League for Programming Freedom -- write league@prep.ai.mit.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Subject: Re: Using vacation days for the Jewish Holidays
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: 25 Sep 92 06:11:58 GMT

In Israel, you get vacation for all the holidays.
-- 
/|/-\/-\       New signature will appear "acharai hachagim"
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@     
/ nysernet.org 			Jerusalem
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren)
Subject: Re: Hebrew origin of some English words
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 03:48:33 GMT

boaz@lcs.mit.edu writes:

[Nice examples of similarly sounding words in Hebrew and English]
#
#does anyone have some more ?

Illusion = approx. "ILU-ZE-HAYA" (if it was)!?

-Danny.



Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: petrel@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism
Date: 1 Oct 92 22:12:03 -0300
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

In article <1992Sep30.182713.12255@scubed.com>, hap@scubed.com (Hap Freiberg) writes:
>>
> Having read most of this drivel for the past week, I have a question.
> 
> Why is the band space being wasted? Trying to discuss anti-semitism
> 
> with these Polish patriots is analagous to trying to discuss historical
> 
> revision with the B-cpu bigots.
> 
> My $0.02
> 
> Shana tova...
> 
> Hap

Having read most of this drivel for the past week, I have a question.
 
Why is the band space being wasted? Trying to discuss anti-polonism
 
with these Jewish patriots is analagous to trying to discuss historical

revision with the B-cpu bigots.
 
My $0.02 

Chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie...

Piotr
Xref: sparky soc.culture.jewish:16710 soc.culture.polish:2895
From: pawel@tethys.ph.albany.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism
Date: 28 Sep 92 18:10:11 GMT
Reply-To: pawel@tethys.ph.albany.edu
Organization: SUNYA School of Public Health, Albany, NY

In article <1992Sep28.153900.28617@Princeton.EDU>, roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
>In article <matthew.717472103@munna> matthew@.cs.mu.oz (Maciek Blasikiewicz) writes:
>>d89-mor@nada.kth.se (Monika Orski) writes:
>
[...]
>
>Nope, sorry, the presence of the book in his church is first-hand
>evidence -- circumstantial ,but pretty strong, like the trout in the
>milk.  Besides, the charge of anti-Semitism isn't made lightly in Poland.,
>now, is it?
>
[...]
>
>Roger
>

  ANY kind of accusation shouldn't be make lightly, I hope you'll agree
with this.  In particular if you use word "anti-Semitism" indiscriminately
it will loose all meaning.

                                      Pawel Penczek
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.polish
From: dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren)
Subject: Re: On Polish and Jewish nationalism
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 13:56:12 GMT

michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper) writes:
#Danny Keren writes:
#
#I'm far from being fan of Islam, or the "Islamic Jihad".  Firing
#schoolbuses is a disgusting crime.  The more if they were doing it
#before their country was occupied.  Which does not change the fact
#that actually Israel is the oppressor and the occupation of foreign
#lands is always lawlessness.

You have a point there, but one has to remember that Israel is not
in an easy situation. The occupation of the West Bank cannot be
compared to British colonialism or similar types of conquest. Israel
is a very small country, surrounded by much larger countries which
used to share the goal of exterminating it (and some of them still
do). 

If Israel returns the West Bank, it will be 9 miles wide at its
waistline. Sexy, but not very healthy from a strategic point of
view. Also, one has to remember that the Bank belonged to Jordan
before the '67 war, a fact which did not prevent then PLO leader
Shukairy to announce "after the war, the surviving Jews will be
allowed to go back to Europe, but my estimation is that non will
survive". Many Israelis find statements like these a good reason
to fear returning the territories.

Nobody likes what is going on now, but a solution has to be found
which will make certain that Israel will not be in grave danger
again. I suggest you to switch to talk.politics.mideast for
discussion of these issues, as they don't belong in scp and scj.

-Danny Keren.



Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.polish
From: aleks@cray.com (Aleksander Mazur)
Subject: Re: On Polish and Jewish nationalism
Date: 6 Oct 92 09:43:29 CDT


In article <1992Oct5.222351.24812@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de> lbs@tkm.physik.uni-karlsruhe.de writes:
>In article <1992Oct5.025745.6727@sarah.albany.edu> mark@fenris.albany.edu (Mark Steinberger) writes:
>>In article <1992Oct4.232059.9296@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de> lbs@tkm.physik.uni-karlsruhe.de writes:
>>> Think, Roger. Your argument can be reversed: whenever a Pole
>>>would criticize the treatment of Palestinians in Israel and 
>>>occupied territories, a Jew would say "but what about the Polish
>>>rabid anti-Semitism?"
>>
>>It is interesting.
>>
>>So far, those Poles whom I have noticed to have expressed an opinion
>>with regard to the Israel/Palestine question seem almost by reflex to
>>assume that Israel is in the wrong.
>
> Not me. I wanted to point out that Roger could react in a different
>way and could use different arguments. Roger's arguments
>to which I reacted are not the best ones, in my opinion. Instead of 
>addressing Michal Szleper per "idiot" he could suggest discussing 
>the Palestinian issue in a separate thread. That is what I suggest
>to those who are interested. 
> Myself, I don't know enough about the Palestinian-Israeli conflict 
>(details, background, history) to express clear opinions, much less 
>to take sides. 
>
>>--Mark
>
> Lech Borkowski
>lbs@neptune.phys.ufl.edu
>

I disagree. The world is simply not perfect, people are not perfect.
There is no country without crime. Therefore if we want to evaluate
specific country or society it is always necessary to evaluate
relatively to other countries or societies. Let's say that someone
was burglarized in specific country and since then announces
that picked society as pick-pocketing. In order to find out
if he is right it is necessary to compare crime rates with other
countries. We should always do that if we want to be at least
close to truth. And comparing situation of Jews in Poland
and in the rest of Europe then can say something - whether
it was really so bad as it is presented. Comparison with
situation of Palestinians in Israel now can say even more
about tolerance of Jewish and Polish community if somebody likes
to talk in general terms. I do not think that treatment of Jews
and Palestinians can come even close in such an evaluation.
Especially that rougly three quarters of century elapsed and now
there are completely different standards regarding human rights
and rights of minorities.

A. Mazur
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff)
Subject: T'filat Zakah
Organization: Univ. of MD, Baltimore County
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 17:20:25 GMT

IMHO, the most absolutely moving and emotionally-wrenching
prayer of the liturgy is T'filat Zakah, found in many machzorim
just before the start of Kol Nidre.

If you have never recited it, check your machzor.  If you don't
understand enough Hebrew (the language is beautifully clear),
the translation alone is worth the price of an Artscroll.

May each of us be a little better in the coming year than we 
were in the past year.  Observe a few more mitzvot with a little
more sincerity, devote a little more time to Torah study, and
be a little more careful about potentially inflammatory postings.

Gmar Tov.

-- 
Eliot Shimoff                  |    n   n   n
   shimoff@umbc3.umbc.edu      |   X + Y = Z .  Easy to prove no solutions
Ashamnu, bagadnu, gazalnu ...  |   for n greater than 2.  Darn.  Can't fit
Better luck next year!         |   it into this little .sig file.  Oh well.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: pawel@cs.UAlberta.CA (Pawel Gburzynski)
Subject: Re: WWII Poland - A Jew should know....
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 00:07:33 GMT

From article <1992Oct2.190359.22149@cbnewsj.cb.att.com>, by avr@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (adam.v.reed):

> I must confess to feelings of embarrassment and shame at seeing a
> fellow Jew post the above to the net. The Polish posters were
> taught a grossly censored version of history in Polish schools;
> the only good we can to, to help them repair the dammage that
> their social and political culture has suffered in the last two
> centuries, is to get them to read what was censored out. To do
> this, our postings must be solidly anchored in fact.

Oh, thank you very much. Please do carry out your mission of an intelectually
superior Jew and enlighten us stupid Polacks so that we can finally
learn our history. You see, we have been kept in total darkness for forty
years. Isn't that horrible?

I really appreciate your politeness and patience so far. After all, you had to
go through all these stupid postings, knowing better all the time.

Yes, I am sure that the only way for us to find our way in the darkness is
to read carefully the postings of the Jewish population in this newsgroup.

==========================================================================
    Pawel Gburzynski, Associate Professor, Department of Computing Science
           University of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta CANADA  T6G 2H1
    e-mail: pawel@cs.ualberta.ca, tel: (403) 492-2347, fax: (403) 492-1071
==========================================================================
Member of the League for Programming Freedom --
write to league@prep.ai.mit.edu
==========================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.polish
From: pindor@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca (Andrzej Pindor)
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism
Organization: UTCS Public Access
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 19:45:27 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.040127.4106@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> stank@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (Stan Krieger) writes:
>Maybe the following question can lead to an answer-
>
>	To ethnic Poles (or Polish Catholics or whatever the right
>	phrase is), are (were) those people whose religion is
>	Judaism but who have roots in Poland for 800 years also
>	Poles, or are they some different group?
>
Could you first clarify your question by answering the following:

1. Do you suggest that 'ethnic Pole'='Polish Catholic'?
2. What you mean by 'whatever the right phrase is'?  'Right' for whom?
3. What criteria are you suggesting yourself for deciding  whether someone
   is a Pole, a Jew  etc.?
(My personal criterion is that you are what you feel you are).

>	For the record, at least in my family, we feel that Poles
>	treated us as outsiders and not your countrymen.
>	
Do you feel that _all_ Poles treated  you as outsiders? And did you want to
be treated as Poles?  If not, then what is your problem? If yes, why? 
>-- 
>Stan Krieger                 All opinions, advice, or suggestions, even
>UNIX System Laboratories     if related to my employment, are my own.
>Summit, NJ
>smk@usl.com

Andrzej Pindor

-- 
Andrzej Pindor
University of Toronto
Computing Services
pindor@gpu.utcs.utoronto.ca
From: backon@vms.huji.ac.il
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Hebrew origin of some English words
Date: 5 Oct 92 06:57:38 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Hebrew University of Jerusalem

In article <1992Oct5.064954.602@vms.huji.ac.il>, backon@vms.huji.ac.il writes:
> In article <1992Oct5.012828.24658@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu>, boaz@concerto.lcs.mit.edu (Boaz Ben-Zvi) writes:
>> We all know that Hebrew gave English words like camel, behemoth, leviathan,
>> amen, hallelujah, cane, etc.  I have collected some other English words,
>> each with a Hebrew word similar to it in sound and meaning. The Webster




> Some of these and many THOUSANDS of others appear in the book: THE WORD: THE
> DICTIONARY THAT REVEALS THE HEBREW SOURCE OF ENGLISH by Isaac Mozeson and
> published by Shapolsky Publishers Inc., 135 West 22nd St., New York NY 10011.
> The book's ISBN is 0-933503-44-X.
>

Whoops !  Sorry, that should be  136 West 22nd St.
                                   ^

Josh
backon@VMS.HUJI.AC.IL








> The book has gotten excellent reviews.
>
> "THE WORD is a challenge to linguists. The parallels traced seem beyond the
> range of coincidence, and call for a reexamination of our etymologies. Etymon
> (truth) must be the quest".
>   Dr. Joseph Shipley
>   author of THE DICTIONARY OF WORD ORIGINS  and THE ORIGIN OF WORDS
>
>
> "What I have seen of Mozeson's work suggests a far wider sharing of the world
> regarding the monogenesis of language and the primacy of Near East culture."
>   Professor Louis Feldman
>   Chairman of Classical Language and Literature Departments, Yeshiva University
>
>
> I had shown the book to my father, an expert in German philology, who had
> taught at Yale and Columbia. At first he thought it was pure nonsence until I
> convinced him to read it. The third reading convinced him and he actually came
> up with two dozen German words which are pure and unadulterated Hebrew.
>
> I suggest that anyone with a *very* good knowledge of Hebrew take the list of
> proto-Indo-European roots that appear in the back of the American Heritage
> dictionary and look for Hebrew sources. It's uncanny.
>
> Interestingly both Scientific American and The Sciences (of the NY Academy of
> Sciences) had review papers on the monogenesis of language in 1991 and this
> does strengthen Mozeson's thesis.
>
> I strongly recmmend reading this book which is available in many public and
> university libraries.
>
> Josh
>
> Dr. Josh Backon
> backon@VMS.HUJI.AC.IL
>
> Disclaimer: Isaac Mozeson and I went to the same yeshiva high school
> (Maimonides in  Brookline MA) in the 1960's.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: * Jesus Christ? *
Date: 5 Oct 92 23:51:01 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1992Oct5.194446.5203@island.COM> green@island.COM (Robert Greenstein) writes:
>
>I also find the timing of such questions interesting. We don't see so
>many of these questions around say, Xmas, or the Fourth of July.

Inconclusive. Judaism gets more press this time of year, so goyim are
more likely to notice it. Once they do, they might start wondering
about their longstanding questions about Judaism. Ergo, they post.

I say we give'em the benefit of the doubt. To wit: if the post isn't
inhgerently offensive, assume it was meant respectfully (even if the
poster has made some bad posts in the past). Of course, this
toleration can be disearned (like if Robert Applegate posts
something...)
-- 
Andrew M. Solovay       "Work is the curse of the drinking class."
solovay@netcom.com			--Wilde

#include <disclaimer.h>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: ward@sun17.vlsi.uwaterloo.ca (Paul Ward)
Subject: New Year
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 12:59:04 GMT

Have a good year.
From: faigin@aero.org (Daniel P. Faigin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: T'filat Zakah
Date: 30 Sep 92 11:12:10
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: soldan.aero.org
In-reply-to: shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu's message of Wed, 30 Sep 1992 17:20:25 GMT

On Wed, 30 Sep 1992 17:20:25 GMT, shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff) said:
> May each of us be a little better in the coming year than we 
> were in the past year.  Observe a few more mitzvot with a little
> more sincerity, devote a little more time to Torah study, and
> be a little more careful about potentially inflammatory postings.

In my opinion, there's a very easy way to avoid inflamation. Remember to state
things as your opinion, or as a statement from this movement or t'other
movement, not as absolute right or wrong. In other words:

		       Traditional Judaism believes ...
				       
			 Reform Judaism believes ...
				       
			  It is my opinion that ....
				       

as opposed to
				       
			   You are wrong if you...
				       
			     It is invalid to...
				       
			     Judaism says that...
				       

A little care in your postings can alliviate a lot of flame wars.

L'shana Tovah,

Daniel
--
[W]:The Aerospace Corp. M1/055 * POB 92957 * LA, CA 90009-2957 * 310/336-8228
[Email]:faigin@aerospace.aero.org              [Vmail]:310/336-5454 Box#13149
   "You can't be a rationalist in an irrational world. It isn't rational!"
	       Dr. Rance, in Joe Orton's "What the Butler Saw"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: hillel@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (hillel.e.markowitz)
Subject: Re: Y'hi Ratson at the Table
Organization: AT&T Federal Systems
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 18:08:03 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.171336.6807@umbc3.umbc.edu> shimoff@umbc4.umbc.edu (Eliot Shimoff) writes:
>The Shimoff Rosh haShana table was graced by the presence of Dan
>(shdan@tudor.com), coprocessor Gayle, and spawned process Tani.
>
>Naturally, discussion turned to the Y'hi ratson prefaces to the
>various special Rosh haShana foods.  To which we add:
>
>Gefilte fish: Y'hi ratson she'yimale [gefilte] mishalot libenu,
>
>and
>
>Techina: Y'hi ratson she't'kabel t'chinatenu.
>
>May the coming year be mitzva-full and flame free.
>
>
>
>-- 
>Eliot Shimoff                  |    n   n   n
>   shimoff@umbc3.umbc.edu      |   X + Y = Z .  Easy to prove no solutions
>Ashamnu, bagadnu, gazalnu ...  |   for n greater than 2.  Darn.  Can't fit
>Better luck next year!         |   it into this little .sig file.  Oh well.


Of course since many of the Yehi Ratzon's are based on the
vernacular name of the dish (as in the gemoro) we also have the
modern one based on the leafy green salad with dried grapes.

Lettuce half a raisin celery.

May this year be the one in which we see postings from
bendavid@bait_malchus.

_______________________________________________________________
| Hillel Markowitz        |    Im ain ani li mi li             |
| H_Markowitz@att.com     |    Veahavta Leraiecha Kamocha      |
|_________________________|____________________________________|
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish