HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: phill@bohra.cpg.oz.au (Phill Solomon)
Subject: 9th World Moot (Was: Rovers)
Organization: Computer Power Software
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 22:35:28 GMT

krisw@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Kris Woeppel) writes:
>Hi.  I am the vice-mate of the 1st Northern Alberta Knights of the
>Silver Tip (KOST).  I am new to this news group (I had to find a source
>for my system administrator), and am interested in making contacts with
>Rovers throughout the Internet.  Since the subject heading was there, I
>figured it would be as good a place to enter this news group as any.

>I did not see the first message in this subject, but I am also
>interested in a dialogue about the issues and concerns of Rovering.  I
>know there are "many" Rovers out there who have computer access, and
>would like to hear from them.  

>Yours in Rovering,

>Kris Woeppel
>krisw@cs.athabascau.ca

Hi Kris, and welcome to the group.

About 170 Australian Rovers have just (a month ago) returned from the 9th World
Moot, how did everyone find it ? I missed out but have heard good reports.

Yours in Scouting,

Phill Solomon
Secretary - Council for Yarra Battman Area Rovers
Activities - Yehudi Rover Crew
3rd Doncaster West Scout Group.
-- 
Phill Solomon.                              ACSnet : phill@bohra.cpg.oz.au
TODAY IR&D                                  UUCP   : uunet!munnari!bohra!phill
CP Software Export Pty Ltd. (ACN.006640133) FIDONET: 3:633/363 Swinestud 
Division of the Computer Power Group - Melbourne Australia Voice: +61 3 8230222 
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: hunter@master.lds-az.loral.com (Bill Hunter)
Subject: Re: Standards  (Was: More on God)
Followup-To: rec.scouting
Organization: Loral Defense Systems - Arizona
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 19:37:52 GMT


>    No, the high standing of the troops  are 
> gained individually, and most deserve it.  It isn't becuse of the membership 
> rules, it's becuse of the structure of the program itself, which teaches
> maturity, leadership,a nd caring.  etc....

I agree, as a Scoutmaster myself and former District Commissioner, I have
found that the reputation of the unit in a local community is what drives
boys to Scouting.  The great reputation of Scouting at the national level
has never kept at bad troop operating.  Anyway, most people have only a
very general understanding what Scouting is all about unless they've been
personaly involved.

Scoutmaster, The Vertical Edge
Loral Defense Systems - Arizona
1300 S. Litchfield Rd.
Goodyear, AZ  85338
PH 602 925 7929  Fax 602 925 6988
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: mayne@phi.cs.fsu.edu (William Mayne)
Subject: Re: Standards  (Was: More on God)
Reply-To: mayne@cs.fsu.edu
Organization: Florida State University Computer Science Department
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 18:41:44 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.180440.3706@blaze.cs.jhu.edu> arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee) writes:
>In article <1992Nov5.171513.14303@sei.cmu.edu> rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito) writes:
>>>>..The recognition of God as the ruling and leading power in the universe and
>>>>the grateful acknowledgment of His favors and blessings are necessary to the
>>>>best type of citizenship and are wholesome precepts in the education of the
>>>>growing members.
>>> And people claim this isn't teaching bigotry?
>>You sir, have not recently read the definition of "bigot".  Nowhere above is
>>intolerance for diverging views presented.  ...
>
>It is said that a particular diverging view (atheism) is an automatic
>disqualifier from "the best type of citizenship".  This is bigotry.

Correct except that its condemnation is not limited to a particular
diverging view, i.e. atheism. It disqualifies any view which doesn't accept
their particular concept of God "the ruling and leading power in the
universe", i.e. a polytheistic religion in which there is interaction among
a community of gods, with no one supreme ruler, or the belief that though
God exists he isn't involved and concerned with the day to day lives of one
species on one planet, or doesn't grant "favors". Note that many beliefs in
abstract cosmic powers (like Gravity, from another post) fit into the latter
category. The Buddhist belief in karma (shared with some other eastern
religions) is quite specific that there aren't any cosmic favors. The
powers of the universe are indifferent to our happiness or wishes and
no grand design or purpose is postulated. From this point of view it is
ludicrous to "acknowledge His [singular, masculine, corresponding to
a proper noun] favors and blessings." (I am describing orthodox Theravada
Buddhism here. It gets more complicated if considering the whole spectrum
of Buddhist beliefs.)

Bill Mayne
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: jce@cs.scarolina.edu (James C. Evans)
Subject: Re: More on God
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Distribution: usa
Date: 10 Nov 92 16:02:10 GMT

pnsf01dw@UMASSD.EDU (Dennis J. Wilkinson) writes:

>I'm not really certain where I read this (probably one of the weekly newsrags
>like Time or Newsweek) but, when all of the controversy broke (most recently)
>over the BSA's religion policy, a higher-up (Love?) in the BSA program was 
>quoted as saying "The BSA's definition of 'God' is so loose that a boy could 
>mistake Michael Jackson for the Messiah and still be eligible..."

Gosh, then the religious/spiritual component of scouting must
be something that we should try our darndest to preserve. 

Chris Evans
jce@ocean.geol.scarolina.edu
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: krisw@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Kris Woeppel)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Rovers
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:46:33 GMT

Hi.  I am the vice-mate of the 1st Northern Alberta Knights of the
Silver Tip (KOST).  I am new to this news group (I had to find a source
for my system administrator), and am interested in making contacts with
Rovers throughout the Internet.  Since the subject heading was there, I
figured it would be as good a place to enter this news group as any.

I did not see the first message in this subject, but I am also
interested in a dialogue about the issues and concerns of Rovering.  I
know there are "many" Rovers out there who have computer access, and
would like to hear from them.  

Yours in Rovering,

Kris Woeppel
krisw@cs.athabascau.ca
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: jfarmer@fraser.sfu.ca (Jason Michael Farmer)
Subject: Re: Rovers
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 17:58:10 GMT

poli2031@waikato.ac.nz writes:
>I am an ex-ARSL of an Open Crew in Malaysia.  I have not been active in
>scouting for 6 years now.  I am glad to see that there are posting about
>rovering and would be glad to contribute.
>JUAY

Welcome!  There is half a dozen of us who are following this thread so if
you want to post your opinions or experiences on anything, go right ahead.

Jason Farmer
11th Sur-Del Rovers "Errant Knights" Rover Crew


-- 
Jason Farmer                 |  Daisemi'in rhhaensuriuu
jfarmer@fraser.sfu.ca        |      meillunsiateve
Simon Fraser University      |           Rh'e Mnhei'sahe yie ahr'en:
Burnaby, British Columbia    |  
Canada                       |   Mnahe afw'ein qiuu;
                             |      rh'e hweithnaef
                             |           mrht Heis'he ehl'ein qiuu.
From: silk@mcl.ucsb.edu (ken mencher)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: BSA and its attitude toward religion, or the lack thereof.
Date: 6 Nov 92 07:33:48 GMT
Distribution: usa

RE: the feeling that the G-d in the scouting is strictly the christian
deity.  If so, then why are there all the other religious medals??

ken mencher
Eagle Scout '90
T627, Cypress, CA
From: rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Standards  (Was: More on God)
Date: 9 Nov 92 19:45:14 GMT
Article-I.D.: sei.1992Nov9.194514.26667
Organization: The Software Engineering Institute


In article <2m+q_+g@lynx.unm.edu>, Dominick V. Zurlo writes:

>   Now, as far as the membership standards, they really don't have an impact 
> on the organization being so good...

OK, let's change them so that only unrepentant convicted felons are eligible
and see what happens.

Rich
From: rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: BSA and its attitude toward religion, or the lack thereof.
Date: 5 Nov 92 17:30:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: sei.1992Nov5.173055.14986
Distribution: usa
Organization: The Software Engineering Institute


In article <68922@cup.portal.com>, Daniel Golding writes:

|> I disagree that the "God" the BSA refers to is strictly Christian in
|> nature. As a scout I felt very comfortable being Jewish and even 
|> Jewish religous activities at scouting events. 

It doesn't bother my Jewish son, or Buddist neighbor's son, either.

Rich
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: wizzard@wam.umd.edu (The Wizzard)
Subject: Re: Attention Deficit - Hyperactivity Disorder
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 04:06:31 GMT

In article <1992Nov3.181912.17023@tamsun.tamu.edu> wjh0265@tamsun.tamu.edu (William Hobson) writes:
>I have an interesting problem and I thought I would seek the wisdom of the
>audience of rec.scouting.  I am a 1st Year Webelos leader and one of my boys
>suffers from Attention Deficit - Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD).  He has the
>characteristic short attention span, poor self-esteem and lack of ability
>to handle the over-stimulating environment of Webelos activities.  His motor
>skills are behind his peers and often suffers from the "I can'ts."  He is
>quite disruptive at times and demands a great deal of my attention to help
>him stay on task and out of trouble.  Much to my regret, I have had to send
>him out of the room during meetings because of his behavior.  I am seeking
>to provide him with the consistent environment that he needs.  Sometimes
>I get very frustrated trying to do anything in our den meetings.  However,
>I love this Webelo Scout dearly, because he is also my son :-).  If this
>were an ideal world, I would be the Assistant Leader or Cub Master and
>would be able to come to his den meetings and work with him one on one.
>But alas, if I weren't the leader, there would be no den, so that is not
>an option.
>
>I know from previous posts that several of you have boys with ADHD.  What
>recommendations can you give?  What have you found that works?  I am
>certainly open to suggestion.
>

I am not a psychologist,  but at our summer camp,  I was helping in  the 
"new scout" area this summer and one of the scouts seem to have the 
symptoms associated with ADHD as I understand them.  What I noticed is that
if there is a person who can work one-on-one with the scout, and who has
a lot of patience, the scout can learn a lot.  What may be helpful is to
have another leader, who is not the parent, work with the scout.  In general,
I have noticed most scouts are more comfortable if their father is not hanging 
over his shoulder all of the time.  This may also work for your scout.
I hope that this suggestion helps.

As I said I am not a psychologist (I am studying computer engineering) so
I am not an expert on this subject.

Signed,
  Shawn Scoles
  Eagle Class of 1988
  Assistant Scoutmaster of Troop 299, Hyattsville, MD
From: j_butler@ponil.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Sad News - Green Bar Bill is dead
Date: 12 Nov 92 22:45:15 GMT
Reply-To: j_butler@ponil.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


William "Green Bar Bill" Harcourt passed away November 9, 1992.
He was 92 years old.

May the Great Master of all Scouts...
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Coming Full Circle?
From: ceichel@eis.calstate.edu (Charles L. Eichelberger)
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 02:52:19 GMT
Organization: Calif State Univ/Electronic Information Services

fogarty@sir-c.jpl.nasa.gov (Tim Fogarty) writes:
> Its not that they are not admitting homosexual leaders, its that they are
> kicking out leaders that BSA find out to be gay.  Often against the wishes
> of the local troop/pack/post.
> 
> If the local orgainization has no trouble with a leader, why should national
> BSA step in ?
> 
> In addition, the issue is whether BSA troops/packs/posts have to obey local,
> state and federal non-discrimination laws.  This depends on whether BSA 
> is a private or public organization, which depends on whether it receives
> public funds.  There is no clear answer.  Various courts have ruled in both
> directions.
> 
> However, it is immorral for BSA to teach boys that gays are second class
> citizens, and fair game for hate and discrimination.
> 
Excuse me?! Just how does the BSA teach this? By exclusion? No, the BSA
does not teach that gays are second class citizens at all. About all the
reference made about gays that I have seen on a local, district and
council level has been that the BSA does not want gays in Scouting. No
other bashing at all. 

Charles Eichelberger
ASM - Troop 119
Unit Comissioner
From: greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Violation of Netiqutte (was: Stan - Hat
Date: 13 Nov 1992 00:21:04 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: greg@antizen.EBay.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: antizen.ebay.sun.com

John,

I'm sure you're not as careless as you just appeared to be. If you had
read the posting to which you have just replied, you would have seen
that the argument WAS on e-mail and that the issue here was that it
was posted to the alias without one of the participant's approval.

Now, by flying off the handle inappropriately, there will be another
spin-off discussion regarding MY reply to you.

Where one may consider Dominick to be inconsiderate and maybe a bit
mean spirited, it must be desirable to the way you just made yourself 
look....



In article Ix2@apollo.hp.com, johnf@apollo.hp.com (John Francis) writes:
> In article <1992Nov12.210927.20324@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> stank@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (Stan Krieger) writes:
> >As all you netnews readers see from the header of Dominick's posting,
> >what he did was to take private email from me and, without my
> >knowledge or consent, publically post it.  Such behavior is a total
> >violation of netiquette, and Dominick knows it.
> >
> >I especially resent the use of the word "hatred" in the subject of
> >Dominick's unauthorized posting of the email.  I simply do not agree
> >with certain gay rights agenda assumptions.
> 
> Oh for crying out loud!  Can't the two of you stop this ceaseless
> bickering (or take it to email), and let those of us who care about
> scouting get on with our lives.  I don't care to see any more of
> the name calling - it is patently obvious to all but two people
> that this discussion has gone far beyond the point of useful return.
> Neither of you will convince the other, so what is the purpose?
> -- 
> John Francis                                 johnf@apollo.hp.com
> with 9 cats to feed, I don't have time to think up a clever .sig



Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: mayne@pi.cs.fsu.edu (William Mayne)
Subject: Re: More on God
Reply-To: mayne@cs.fsu.edu
Organization: Florida State University Computer Science Department
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 16:19:19 GMT

In article <Bx5LxK.8tv@umassd.edu> pnsf01dw@UMASSD.EDU writes:
>I'm not really certain where I read this (probably one of the weekly newsrags
>like Time or Newsweek) but, when all of the controversy broke (most recently)
>over the BSA's religion policy, a higher-up (Love?) in the BSA program was 
>quoted as saying "The BSA's definition of 'God' is so loose that a boy could 
>mistake Michael Jackson for the Messiah and still be eligible..."
>
>That's it... brief blurb... 

If this is true why the insistence on the {\em word} "God"?

Bill Mayne
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: pnsf01dw@UMASSD.EDU (Dennis J. Wilkinson)
Subject: Re: BOA
Reply-To: pnsf01dw@UMASSD.EDU
Organization: UMASS DARTMOUTH, NO. DARTMOUTH, MA.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 16:47:01 GMT

>ceichel@eis.calstate.edu (Charles L. Eichelberger) writes:
>A member of the District Advancement Committee present for Life and Star??
>Humm, according to what I have here is says:
>
>"The board of review is comprised of not less than three nor more than six
>members of the unit committee. Parents or guardians of the Scout being
>reviewed, the unit leader or assistant unit leaders (Scoutmaster, Choach
>or Advisor) do not sit on teh board. The Unit Committee member in charge
>of advancement or the unit committee chairman serves as chairman of the
>board and is responsible for keeping the review moving smoothly,
>completing the Advancement Report and turning it into the Council office"
>
>Nowhere does it mention a District Advancement person sitting on a Star or
>Life BOR. This is not the same for Eagle though.
>
According to our Council's Advancement committee, those are the requirements. 
Turns out that some Councils require a higher degree of participation from
the District Advancement comm. on BOR's higher than First Class.

Double-checking with your Council Advancement people never hurts...

----------------------------------------------------
Dennis J. Wilkinson, II  (pnsf01dw@umassd.edu)
University of Massachusetts Dartmouth - Design/CS Project

The opinions reflected in this post are MINE!!!! ALL MINE!!!!!
From: rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito)
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Re: Stan, Stan, Stan.....
Date: 13 Nov 92 16:45:57 GMT
Article-I.D.: sei.1992Nov13.164557.12423
Distribution: usa
Organization: The Software Engineering Institute


In article <1992Nov13.045230.17022@col.hp.com>, Dan Kary writes:

|> ...It turns out that when you receive postal mail it is your
|> property to do with as you wish.

I think that this is not the case.  For First Class mail, a LETTER is the
property of the sender, and not the recipient!  You may be thinking of
unsolicited goods, etc., and no letters.

You always have inherent title to your words when expressed in private, and
no one has the right to make them public unless to a court for the purpose of
preventing harm to himself or others, as in the case of threats.

Furthermore, most providers of email service (your institution) have
non-disclosure and privacy policies which support the above.  Please check it
out before you divulge email -- it not only is impolite, but might result in
termination of your acess to the net.

Note:  I am not taking a position on the contents, and refuse to read
published email as a matter of practice.

Rich
From: bob.kenyon@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Bob Kenyon) 
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
Subject: Identification
Date: 10 Nov 92 20:16:00 GMT
Reply-To: bob.kenyon@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Bob Kenyon) 
Distribution: world
Organization: Freddy's Place BBS - Edmonton, AB - 403-456-4241

I have been reading the messages in this echo for about two weeks now,
and find them really interesting. I only have one problem. Would it be
possible for folks to identify themselves better?

Often the header of the message doesn't clearly say where they are
entering their messages from. Maybe if folks could add this to the
bottom of their message, or, for off-line readers, use the tagline
function.

---
 . SLMR 2.1 . Bob Kenyon - Service Scouter, Edmonton, AB. Canada
                                      
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: rsd@sei.cmu.edu (Richard S D'Ippolito)
Subject: Re: Standards  (Was: More on God)
Organization: The Software Engineering Institute
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:42:02 GMT


In article <1992Nov5.180104.941@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, William Mayne writes:

> Read it again. It implies exactly what I said it implies. "X is necessary
> to Y" then without X you can't have Y. It further says that "the best type
> of citizenship" is impossible for Buddhists and members of other religions
> outside the Judaic/Christian/Islamic fold.


C'mon, guys.  If you don't belive that one can hold an opinion on what is
"best" without being a bigot, then there is no discussion possible.

Rich



Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: phill@bohra.cpg.oz.au (Phill Solomon)
Subject: Re: Rovers
Organization: Computer Power Software
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 01:47:07 GMT

jfarmer@fraser.sfu.ca (Jason Michael Farmer) writes:
>Are there any Rovers out there? (Gary, I know your floating around here        
>somewhere) 

>I'm a squire with the 11th Sur-Del "Errant Knights" Rover Crew in Delta, BritishColumbia.  What I'm looking for is discussions on activities of Rovers, 
>Rovering's future, etc.

>Jason Farmer
>11th Sur-Del "Errant Knights" Rover Crew

>-- 
>Jason Farmer                 |  Daisemi'in rhhaensuriuu
>jfarmer@fraser.sfu.ca        |      meillunsiateve
>Simon Fraser University      |           Rh'e Mnhei'sahe yie ahr'en:
>Burnaby, British Columbia    |  
>Canada                       |   Mnahe afw'ein qiuu;
>                             |      rh'e hweithnaef
>                             |           mrht Heis'he ehl'ein qiuu.

G'day Jason,
yes there are a few of us out here.
How is the Rover movement in Canada ?
  
I am a member of Yehudi Rover Crew, we have around 10 members. The crew
has been around since 1986, so we are young crew compared to others here
in Melbourne Australia. 

What does your squire trainning involve ?

Yours in Scouting,

Phill Solomon
Secretary - Council for Yarra Battman Area Rovers
Activities - Yehudi Rover Crew
3rd Doncaster West Scout Group.

-- 
Phill Solomon.                              ACSnet : phill@bohra.cpg.oz.au
TODAY IR&D                                  UUCP   : uunet!munnari!bohra!phill
CP Software Export Pty Ltd. (ACN.006640133) FIDONET: 3:633/363 Swinestud 
Division of the Computer Power Group - Melbourne Australia Voice: +61 3 8230222 
Newsgroups: rec.scouting
From: anthropo@carina.unm.edu (Dominick V. Zurlo)
Subject: Resica Memory 5
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 92 23:46:22 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

SO here we go again with yet another anecdote.  
I'm going to retell a story that my director (now a pro-scouter
in Penn. somewhere0 used to tell at campfires. 

THere was this boy who was walking through the woods, 
and he saw a bright light up ahead of him on the old 
trail.  He continued forward until the light got brighter
and brighter, almost blinding.   He finally reached a 
field in the woods, and realised that the blinding light 
was emanating from the gorund of the fiels.  He looked and 
saw diamonds, thousands of diamonds all over the ground.  
Suddenly, a voice called to him from the air "Take as many 
home with you as you can carry."  SO the boy filled his 
pockets and turned his coat into a pouch, and scooped up as 
many diamonds as he could, but still leaving thousands 
behind.   When he got home, he realised he had enough 
diamonds to last a lifetime, but he felt sad that he had to
leave so many behind, becuse the fewer he had, the fewer he 
could give away to help other people's lives a little easier.


This story is about scouting, each of the ideas are a diamond, 
and as we walk through the field we can carry as many diamonds
as we can, but we will still leave many behind.  The more we 
carry home, into our hearts, the more we can spread to other 
people.  So learn as much as you can in scouting, and you'll 
be rich with many diamonds....


This was told to our first year campers if I remeber correctly,
and it was always a nice quite way to settle into taps.   
I hope y'all enjoy.

WWW
In Brotherhood
Dominick V. Zurlo
Eagle Scout '87
blacklisted '88

Newsgroups: rec.scouting