From: ajpg1322@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Angelo J. Paguia)
Subject: Re: help for a questioning couple
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 08:59:10 GMT

John Weitzel <weitzel@CIRRUS.SEAS.UCLA.EDU> writes:

>beyond the Sunday liturgy (one priest).  She is now wondering whether to leave
> the church for what she sees as
>the "excitement of the local evangelical churches".

>My questions to you are:

>1. What in general  would you advise this woman, couple, family?

>2. Are there any books, videos, etc that you would recommend for them?

>3. Do you see this as a recurring situation?  That is, in my studies of

>So far I would suggest Marriage Encounter Weekend or Cursillo or some
>related spiritual/personal endeavor, reading scripture, and finding
>time for personal/private and family/couple prayer.  

>They are extremely
>busy and find it difficult to find time to be together with GOD.

What you have described, John, is the same situation that is very common
to college students nowadays (perhaps even in the past), maybe even
more acutely in the Bible Belt (where I am and I've seen this firsthand).
This disturbs me quite a bit (Okay, I'm a disturbed person :*) ). The
"exciting approach" that Evangelists use include offers of fellowship--
as in church as a social activity(friends, coeds !)--, solution to 
personal problems from the Bible (panacea), and the proof that the 
Catholic Church is not based on the Scriptures but on "dogma as mere 
human precepts" which means that they'll all go to heaven while the
Catholics are merrily led away to the fires of Gehenna.

I often wonder if the Church hierarchy realizes that such a massive
exodus of Catholics is happening in the late high school/early to mid-
college years. Of course, these are the educated (intelligently 
persuasive to less-educated people, also will be financially-capable
and hence, less money for the Church: no wonder the Church is going
bankrupt and the evangelicals are getting rich!) youth that will be
the future leaders of the world.

I would like to give some suggestions to your friends but also solicit
some comments on the above paragraphs.

I was born and raised Catholic (and don't know if I would have found
the Church had I not been so) and feel that I am still in it by the 
grace of God and the faith that His works in my life have instilled.

But there are things that I have found that have kept me constantly
Catholic.

1. Prayer. I remember having family rosaries when I was growing up.
In my restless youth, I found these to be extremely boring. Imagine
how attractive the evangelicals' claim is that the rosary is both
idolatrous (to Mary) and going against Scriptures (some Scripture
passage warns against repetitive prayer). However, looking back,
these rosaries kept not only our family together ("The family that
prays together, stays together," --Fulton Sheen) but kept our faith
undimmed and unwavering. I have tried to learn more about the Church
in my later years and found both evangelicals' claims as non-faith
based. The prayer of the Consecration to the Sacred Heart is also
an extremely powerful prayer, both in its spiritual gifts to the
family of faith and in its words of submission and hope. To this day, 
this prayer never fails to make me figuratively fall on my knees at the 
Cross of Christ.

2. Retreats. Although your friends are very busy people, they will
still have to give time to their spirituality, whether they stay in
the Catholic Church or convert to the Evangelicals'. This is also true
for the busy college student. They will find time because it is a time
of searching for the meaning of life. Let them realize that they will
give time to the Spirit in either Church, so converting will not save
them any personal time (Gosh, has it all come to this ?)

There is nothing like spending a solid block of time devoted solely
to the Lord that helps conversion. I've found, personally, that one
must not look for the big fireworks and magic in the conversion process
but for that inner quiet and peace that is not of this world. My brother's
experience with Cursillo, while it may not be the norm, was like having
a dose of caffeine: it was an ecstatic, instant, magical conversion,
which lasted about a couple of hours, followed by a dullness of spirit
which is most dangerous (and resulted in the opposite for my brother).
My life has changed dramatically since my last retreat which I took
during a time of great tumult, finding conversion in the calmness of
awaking in Jesus Christ, so very much like when Jesus quieted the storm.

3. Church, including organizing Bible studies, fellowships, community
retreats, community newsletters on religious matters, or workshops,
say on Vatican II.

My own catechetical education has been quite lacking, but my family 
has made me realize this. However, many people, especially the ones
who went to Catholic schools don't realize this until they are 
confronted with so-called "Biblical errancies, fallibilities, and
the lack of teaching authority of the Catholic Church". This point
was driven home to me when two co-workers, on-the-fringe-Catholics,
and I were confronted by our evangelical coworkers. On the one hand,
there is nothing that can give a theological "adrenaline-rush" like
being confronted with the "faults" of the Catholic faith. This is why
I have been studying Church Tradition, history, Theology for a while
now. On the other hand, this is the moment that gives the nominal
Catholics the chance to question their Faith and opt for conversion.
To the uninformed, the Catholic Church is just like any other church.
For somebody who has not studied the Church and Scripture intensively,
how do you explain the primacy of the Church, especially dulled by
the uninformed's view from Second Vatican's Ecumenical directives ?
These are real-life situations that I would like to see this newsgroup
discuss more.

The idea to take from the previous paragraph is that your friends 
could take the "Evangelical challenge" and provide "the Catholic
response", through the ideas listed in number 3. I am sure that
your friends are not the only ones in their parish that are being 
confronted with these considerations.

For my situation, I had to start explaining from the primacy of the 
Church. How else was I to prove the truths of Sacred Tradition ?
To organize an educational workshop for the rest of the parish to 
respond to the obvious evangelical serenades would be something
that would be time-consuming but very rewarding. My own response to
learn about the Church, I feel, has set my soul on fire, for I now
understand Scripture a lot more as enlightened by the Church's life
and teachings, and partake of the Spirit's gifts of spiritual growth
given to the Church as a whole (for example, the saints' teachings
on spirituality, prayer, and theology--something the evangelicals
don't have). Whereas I had to explain the primacy of the Church from
first principles (and I stood on very shaky ground), I can now
explain this primacy from the truths given to the Church and not to
the evangelicals. I can also understand Second Vatican's statement 
that the other Christian churches do not hold the complete truth.

I do not want to sound like the very evangelicals that I am trying
to respond to. If I have talked like I have all the answers, please
forgive me, for I do not have all the answers. I am just speaking
from my conversion experience (Oh, no! Not a born-again Catholic.
NOT !!!)

Learning about Church teachings, Tradition, etc., comprehensively
is already a lifetime task that should keep your friends occupied
and excited, I pray. In fact, let us all pray for them.

As this is already long, I would just like to point out that your
frieSecond Vatican's. The transition has not been easy for anybody.
But, perhaps, it would all give us an incentive to realize that
Vatican II has challenged the laity to become involved. To coin a
commercial phrase, but in a serious manThat we may be one.),

Angelo


The Fulfillment of the Father's Will, the Peace of Christ and the 
Strength of the Spirit be with us all (


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