HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ignaz@chiron.astro.uu.se (Ignaz Wanders)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Re: Opeenvolgende medeklinkers
Date: 17 Aug 92 14:44:19 GMT
Reply-To: ignaz@astro.uu.se
Organization: UDAC, Uppsala, Sweden

In article <14037@chorus.fr>, mm@cloche.chorus.fr (Marc Maathuis) writes:
->In article <1992Aug14.083255.1@uwovax.uwo.ca>, gerard@uwovax.uwo.ca (Gerard Stafleu) writes:
->
->  | > 'Sammschtig' betekent gewoon zaterdag. 
->  | 
->  | Wat is daar nou gewoon aan?  Heb jij ooit zoveel medeklinkers gezien op 
->  | zaterdag?
->
->A propos, in het Nederlands heeft het woord 'angstschreeuw' acht
->opeenvolgende medeklinkers. Wie breekt het record?
->
->-- 
->Marc Maathuis                           Tel:    +33 (1) 30 64 82 57 (direct)
->Chorus systemes                         Fax:    +33 (1) 30 57 00 66
->6, avenue Gustave Eiffel                E-mail: mm@chorus.fr 
->F-78182 St. Quentin en Yvelines Cedex

Het record had ik al gebroken met 'slechtstschrijvend' maar misschien is
dat nog niet over de hele wereld doorgekomen. Natuurlijk bestaan ook
zachtstschreeuwend, zachtstschreidend en waarschijnlijk nog wel enkele
andere. Negen medeklinkers dus. 

Maar nu we hier toch met Opperlands bezig zijn. Wat zijn de langste
medeklinkerstapelingen in andere talen? Zijn er nog meer talen (vast wel)
waar je negen medeklinkers op een rij kunt zetten?
Ik kan vast verklappen dat dit in het Zweeds niet kan, bij lange na niet
zelfs. Zes is geloof ik het record hier, maar zeker ben ik niet.

En wat betreft klinkerstapelingen in andere talen? Het Nederlands kent
kraaieeieren en papegaaieeieren en het Opperlands kraaieeiooiuieaaier en
dus ook papegaaieeiooiuieaaier. 
Het boek Operlandse taal en letterkunde door Battus (pseudoniem voor
Hugo Brandt-Corstius) is overigens warm aan te bevelen voor een ieder
die van het langste woord houdt, graag e-legendes leest, lettergreep-
stapelingen leuk vindt etc. etc. 

Overigens krijg ik wel eens van mensen te horen dat ze 'slechtstschrijvend'
geen goed nederlands woord vinden. Vaak zijn dit mensen die zelf met
angstschreeuw lopen te leuren en het jammer vinden dat het record verbeterd
wordt. Maar slechtschrijvend is goed nederlands, evenals slechterschrijvend
en dus ook slechtstschrijvend. Denk maar aan het door een ieder goedgekeurde
trio hardlopen, harderlopend, hardstlopend.

Wie komt met tien medeklinkers aanzetten?


de welgemutstste Yeti

-- 
Ignaz Wanders                 * Tel: +46-18-515208, FAX: +46-18-527583
          * Astronomiska observatoriet, Box 515, 75120 Uppsala, Sweden
            * Ignaz@astro.uu.se (Internet); 21619::laban::ignaz (SPAN)

   "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists 
elsewhere in the Universe is that none of it has tried to contact us"
                                            --- Calvin ---
From: jacek@edstar.ucsb.edu (Jacek Smits)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Re: Origin of "Dutch doors"?
Date: 17 Aug 92 23:38:03 GMT
Organization: UCSB Graduate School of Education

sandee@Think.COM (Daan Sandee) writes:

>Dutch farms, and even other houses in rural surroundings, typically have
>back doors like these. (The front door of a farm house, if at all present,
>is only used for funerals, of course.) The idea, I believe, is to have fresh
>air come in while keeping the animals out. Nowadays you will see few freely
>roaming animals on Dutch farms, but the Dutch door is still in common use.

This only explains why some people go to the effort to cut their
doors in half, but not why they are called *DUTCH* doors. It's
easy to assume that some English farmers saw it in the Netherlands
while on vacation (????) and therefore etc. etc. etc. But it is not
so easy to assume that not a single English farmer thought up this
reasonable solution for keeping their live stock out of the living
room. 

So, the question is still "Why are they called DUTCH doors"?

Jacek
From: ignaz@astro.uu.se (de yeti)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Re: Slchtstschrvnd
Keywords: Onzinwoorden
Date: 18 Aug 92 11:12:28 GMT
Reply-To: ignaz@astro.uu.se
Organization: UDAC, Uppsala, Sweden

In article <bron.27.714128061@let.rug.nl>, bron@let.rug.nl (R.J. Bron) writes:
->Eureka! Ik heb een woord gevonden met 14 medeklinkers achter elkaar: 
->slchtstschrvnd! Je kan er over van mening verschillen of dit een correct 
->Nederlands woord is maar het wordt in deze streken veel gebruikt. 
->Er zijn ook provinciegenoten die menen dat het hier eigenlijk om zeven 
->woorden gaat die aan elkaar geplakt zijn (dat zouden dan de woorden sl-ch-ts-
->ts-ch-rv-nd zijn) maar dat lijkt me een onhoudbare stelling. Het 
->bijvoegelijke naamwoord kan in verschillende contexten gebruikt worden, zo 
->heeft men het wel over een "slchtstschrvnde bejaarde" maar kan je ook in een 
->restaurant iemand treffen die een "slchtstschrvnd biefstukje" bestelt. 
->Sportcommentatoren maken het soms wel een beetje te bont door te spreken 
->over een "schitternd gelopen slchtstschrvde race". Dan halen wij taalkenners 
->meewarig de schouders op en denken "een slchtstschrvnd" mannetje, die Heinze 
->Bakker.
->
->Robbert Jan
->

Sssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssst!
Niet verder vertellen. 69 medeklinkers.

yeti.

--
From: mm@cloche.chorus.fr (Marc Maathuis)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Opeenvolgende medeklinkers
Date: 17 Aug 92 12:19:57 GMT
Reply-To: mm@chorus.fr
Organization: Chorus systemes, 6 av. Gustave Eiffel, 78182 St. Quentin en Yvelines Cedex, France

In article <1992Aug14.083255.1@uwovax.uwo.ca>, gerard@uwovax.uwo.ca (Gerard Stafleu) writes:

  | > 'Sammschtig' betekent gewoon zaterdag. 
  | 
  | Wat is daar nou gewoon aan?  Heb jij ooit zoveel medeklinkers gezien op 
  | zaterdag?

A propos, in het Nederlands heeft het woord 'angstschreeuw' acht
opeenvolgende medeklinkers. Wie breekt het record?

-- 
Marc Maathuis                           Tel:    +33 (1) 30 64 82 57 (direct)
Chorus systemes                         Fax:    +33 (1) 30 57 00 66
6, avenue Gustave Eiffel                E-mail: mm@chorus.fr 
F-78182 St. Quentin en Yvelines Cedex
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
From: pieter@prpa.philips.com (Pieter van der Meulen)
Subject: Little Thumbkin (Klein Duimpje - deel I)
Keywords: humor, dutch english, curacao
Organization: Philips Research Palo Alto
Distribution: soc
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 22:47:46 GMT


Escaped from the language-lab
-----------------------------
through R. Cowsbrook

(For H.Burnt Crustius)

---------------------------Part I--------------------------------------

There was once a poor woodchopper. This woodchopping, he said one day
to his woman, there sits no dry bread in it. I work myself an accident
the whole day, but you and our twelve children have not to eat.

`I see the future dark in,' his woman agreed.  `We must see to fit a
sleeve on it,' the woodchopper resumed; `I have a plan: tomorrow we
shall go on step with the children, and then, in the middle of the
wood, we'll leave them to their fate over.'

His woman almost went off her little stick when she heard this. `What
is there with you on the hand?' she cried, `aren't you good sob?'

But the woodchopper wasn't brought off his piece by her wailing, he
gave no shrink. `It cannot differ to me what you think,' he said.
`There sits nothing else on, tomorrow we leave them in the wood.'

Little Thumbkin, the youngest son, had listened off his parents'
conversation. The next morning before day and dew he went out and
filled his pockets with pebbles. During the walk into the woods he knew
unmarked-up to drop them one by one.  Then the parents told the
children to gather some wood, and shined the plate.

When the parents didn't come for the day any more, the children
understood that they had been left in the stitch. Soon the waterlanders
appeared.  But Thumbkin said: `Don't sit down by your packages, I will
sorrow for it that we all get home wholeskins.' Thanks be the pebbles,
he was able to find his way back.

`By God,' the parents said as they came to foreshine, `how have you
ragged him that?' - `No art on,' said Thumbkin and he explained what he
had done.  `If you want to be rid of us you will have to stand up a bit
earlier.'

That is just what the parents did. This time there came no pebbles on
to pass, all Thumbkin had was a piece of dry bread. He decided that his
bread there then but must believe to it.  He left a trail of
breadcrumbs but he didn't have it in the holes that they were being
made soldier by the birds...

---------------------------Part I--------------------------------------

And now, you "M.", will HAVE to reply for the exciting conclusion of
Little Thumbkin...
-- 
Pieter S. van der Meulen	pieter@prpa.philips.com
Philips Research Palo Alto
4005 Miranda Avenue #175
Palo Alto, CA 94306
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
From: fijma@cs.utwente.nl (Duco Fijma)
Subject: Re: Discriminatie Limburgers (was: Re: dialekt /taalverarming/afkorting)
Organization: University of Twente, Dept. of Computer Science
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 14:24:13 GMT

In article <1992Aug14.113421.21105@cbfsb.cb.att.com>, fvkoele@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (f.p.vankoelen) writes:
|> Beste Edgar, ben je zelf soms ook limbo-er ?
|> 
|> Bij ons in Hilversum hebben we trouwens al een Limburger in dienst !
|> 
|> Frans van Koelen
|> fvkoele@hvlpa.att.com
|> 

In het integratie-project, samen met een gehandicapte, een Turk en een
herintredende vrouw?

Duco
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
From: bartjan@cs.kun.nl (Bart-Jan Bouwers)
Subject: Re: voetbal.1e divisie
Organization: University of Nijmegen, The Netherlands
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 01:11:07 GMT

In <92230.151511MWB6@psuvm.psu.edu> MWB6@psuvm.psu.edu writes:

>Ik schrok me het apezuur: wat is er met FC (waarom is het niet gewoon VC) Wagen
>ingen aan de hand????? Is de club gepromoveerd of overleden.  Het leek me
Overleden... Te weing liquide middelen...
Hetzelfde geldt voor VCV Zeeland.

Geroet,

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bart-Jan J. Bouwers       | phone:    +31-80652551      |   |\  |\
Dept. of Computer Science | internet: bartjan@cs.kun.nl |   |/_.|/
University of Nijmegen    | bitnet:   U055025@HNYKUN11  |   |\ ||\
The Netherlands           |                             |   |/ ||/
                                                              /
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
 "Quit dreaming this is real life baby,                       
 Real life is the only life what's it all about" - Simple Minds
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
From: wats@next11csc.wam.umd.edu (Bryan Paul Wats)
Subject: (English) Re: Job  
Keywords: USA, allegiance, going abroad
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 15:55:11 GMT


	I am posting this in English on purpose, so it will be more  
accessible to people. Hopefully a meaningful discussion follows.

	In a previous post Wim <SPWIM@MARS.LERC.NASA.GOV> raised the  
question if a person should give up his citizenship to go work in a  
foreign country and enjoy the financial benefits. With other words, what  
is more important, the money or allegiance.
	A more important question would be "am I going to live a happy  
live over there? That's a tough one to answer, because happiness and  
success is something different for every individual, not to mention the  
people that are dependent on you. As he points out, there are many factors  
that influence this, like fitting into a society etc. I hereby pointed out  
the personal nature of the problem.
	What Wim might be afraid of is to be looked/frowned upon as a  
traitor, for not being loyal to your own country. I would think twice  
before I made such a statement, although it is rather obvious that good  
athletes go to Italy, Spain, USA for the BIG bucks :-(. Don't give me the  
crap that local competition is peanuts, because that's the reason. When we  
get them all together again to compete at international level, dan kunnen  
we de hele wereld aan, niet dan? Btw, this is an excellent example where  
we see Dutch nationalism. 
	What you might want to look into is seeing how easy it would be to  
get your Dutch citizenship back. After all, you do have the right of  
birth.
	Another thing to consider is how secure your job really is. The  
JNHS is definitely not a guarantee for success. 
	This considerations might ease the decision of going abroad. If I  
were you, I would enjoy the experience of a different culture and try to  
make the best out of it. At least you are given the chance (like me) and  
not everyone can say that.
	Greetings from the JNHS,
					Bryan.
wats@wam.umd.edu        
=====================================================================
|'Is it true that in Holland all the windmills wear clogs?'           
|'No,but sometimes we have to put a tulip in the dike.'
From: gpvos@cs.vu.nl (Gerben 'P' Vos)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Re: a bit of english once in a while?
Date: 14 Aug 92 11:06:07 GMT

Gary Cook schrijft:

>         ALSO ... how many English/American/... ( non-Dutch ) find
>that English speaking Dutch-people speak with a slight American
>accent ? I've found this alot ... I geuss its all those American films.
>My girlfriend when first in England sounded like a typical 
>english-speaking-european-with-american-accent .. but after a month 
>sounded like English ( suprise suprise ) and also picked up most of
>the local dialect ( in fact, she speaks more dialect than me ).

OTOH, what we are taught at school is more or less British English. Probably
the films have more influence than school...

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . G e r b e n   V o s   <><
Aconet: 8500/104!Gerben Vos  Internet: gpvos@cs.vu.nl
This .signature is a Usenet Olympic Record holder. Copy it now!
From: dubuf@sicsun.epfl.ch (Hans DU BUF)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Re: hollanders, alpen, heeeelp
Keywords: zwitserland-oostenrijk
Date: 14 Aug 92 09:23:27 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne

Ik had onderstaand art gepost: 

>> Pfiat di ??????
>> ZMN (zegt me niets)
>> AEIOU was me niet opgevallen, een nieuwe kulturele aanwinst zoals SO en JNHS?
>> Ik wacht met spanning af, vermoedelijk een slapeloze nacht, Karel je wordt
>> bedankt!

Helaas nog geen verklaring van Karel Stokkermans gekregen. Dat wordt een
slapeloos weekend...

Hans
From: klink@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (steven.r.klinkner)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: Re: Job (baan)
Summary: US vs NL
Date: 18 Aug 92 19:43:29 GMT
Organization: AT&T

spwim@mars.lerc.nasa.gov (Wim Degroot) writes:

>[suppose you have to change citizenship to get a job] 
>your Dutch citizenship). I guess that it depends on the foreign country the 
>offer is from (knowing many Dutch citizens are not favorably inclined towards 
>the lifestyle in the US, including yours truly) and the way a person fits into

That's a fairly general statement, and doesn't really agree with what I 
have seen (many Dutch seem to like it here).  I would like to know what 
you think "the" US lifestyle is (and what the Dutch don't like about "it").  

I hate to state the obvious cliche, but...the US is a big country with all 
kinds of people from all over the world living all kinds of different 
'lifestyles'.  There is naturally a common sub-culture which unifies 
people to an extent, but I think one generally has more freedom here to 
live as one pleases than in most places (nobody FORCES you to watch 
American TV ;-)

>not very proud of their origin (at least not as much as for example the US, but
>than, no country is as fanatic in that respect as the US) till they are pushed.

I didn't realize that I was so fanatic!  (let us compare during the next 
Nederland-Duitsland football game ;-)  You certainly have some interesting
impressions of the US... 

One aspect of lifestyle that many people come to the US to enjoy is 
economic opportunity (certainly a big, but not necessarily THE most 
important part of a 'lifestyle').  

So, for the sake of discussion, here is my brief list of relative
ECONOMIC benefits of the US/NL that I would consider (based on my 
(limited) knowledge): 

US: 
    - low tax on wages (greater disposable income) 
    - low cost of housing purchases (low population density) 
    - cheap personal transportation (cars & gas)  
    - lower taxes & regulation in general (lower cost for air transporation, 
      telephone services, greater access to imported goods, et cetera) 
    - large, integrated economy (economic opportunity, access to mass-market
      goods, travel within US without passport or currency exchange) 
    - fewer social services (means generally better life for the educated
      middle class due to lower taxes) 
    - better university educational opportunities 
      
NL: 
    - greater availability of public transporation 
    - greater social services (enhanced unemployment, sick leave, health
      benefits, but at the expense of higher taxes)  
    - low cost of housing rentals (for residents only?)  
    - more holidays and vacations 
    - smaller economy (means smaller farms, shops, and businesses are 
      more common, sometimes providing better quality, often at 
      higher cost) 
    - better pre-university education 

Ok, argue away :-) 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Klinkner                AT&T Bell Labs                 srk@mink.att.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
From: koos@meaddata.com (Koos Vanderwilt)
Subject: Re: dialekt /taalverarming/afkorting
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 22:16:30 GMT

In article <6922@charon.cwi.nl>, frankt@cwi.nl (Frank Teusink) writes:
|> peter@blade (Peter Korsten) writes:
|> 
|> >Wat die opmerking over 'Hollander' betreft: in Limburg heet je Hollander
|> >als je wel uit Nederland maar niet uit Brabant of Limburg komt (zoiets
|> >als bij de Belgen ook aan de hand is). Maak je geen zorgen, Duitsers
|> >heten nu nog 'Pruisen'.
|> 
|> Da's is pas discriminerend! *Limbo* discrimineert alleen de Limburgers.
|> Jullie *Hollander* discrimineert Zeelanders, Utrechtenaren, Gelderlanders
|> Overijselnaren (?) Twentenaren, Groningers, Flevolanders en Friezen.
|> Bah! :-)
|> 
|> >						Peter.
|> >Peter Korsten, in real life peter@stack.urc.tue.nl
|> 
|> Frank Teusink

Eh, niet om het een of ander, hoor, en ik zit hier hard elk smoesje om
niet te werken (it's goof off time!!!) aan te grijpen, maar is dit
allemaal niet wat overdreven???  Ik bedoel maar, het lijkt me
nauwelijks vol te houden dat een Limburger te vergelijken is met een
verkracht meisje, een gediscrimineerde Turk, een onheus behandelde
Surinamer enz. , behalve als de Limburger in kwestie een volkomen
paranoiede, overgevoelige, van achtervolgingswaanzin bezeten, de grens
tussen grapje en echte diskriminatie en 'good-natured ribbing' niet
meer kunnen inderscheidende basket-case is. (Loopt deze zin nog??)

Ik bedoel maar, nou moet je ophouen, zeg! Wat een grote onzin. Op het
zielige af, om je als Limburger solidair te voelen met een verkracht
meisje.  Als je de opmerkingen van Maarten niet leuk vind, dan post je
toch gewoon iets over schonkige domme aardappelneuzen in Twente zonder
Bourgondische levensvreugde, of een houterige boerenkultuur zonder
savoir-vivre op de Veluwe???? Of over Nerderlanders die zoooo
onwensbaar zijn dat ze alleen een Amerikaanse vrouw kunnen vinden? (Ik
ben daar zelf ook bijna ingetrapt) Jezus!

Mijn beste Nederlandse vriend is Limburger, een nooit opdrogende reden
voor grapjurkerij.  Aangezien ikzelf op de Veluwe geboren ben, slaat
hij terug met mopjes over boeren, die overigens veel flauwer zijn dan
mijn mopjes over Katholiek Limburgers. (Laten we protestant/katholiek
ook meteen maar in de strijd werpen, ja gezellig!!)  Maar niet met
psudo-progressief geauwehoer over Surinamers.  

Zoals m'n oma altijd zei: "je mot tegen een grapje kenne". Of
misschien zei ze dat wel nooit, maar dan had ze het moeten zeggen.

He, wat heerlijk om je hier even af te kunnen reageren.

Met hartelijke groeten,

-Koos.
From: kstokker@risc.uni-linz.ac.at (Karel Stokkermans)
Subject: Re: Sesamstraat (Was: Re: OZS en Studio Sport)
Keywords: Tika
Organization: RISC, J.K. University, Linz; Austria
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 14:20:36 GMT

rob@watney.eng.ohio-state.edu (Rob Carriere) writes:
>In article <1992Aug12.100041.22552@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at>
>kstokker@risc.uni-linz.ac.at (Karel Stokkermans) writes: 
>>Is er dan helemaal niemand die zich Tita tovenaar herinnert? Mijn 
>>eerste liefde :-) 
>
>We herinneren ons TTT nog wel, maar hebben er niet over, omdat het heel gewoon
>is (maar je staat er toch van te kijken.)
>
>SR
>PS Eerste liefde?  Tika of Grobelia?  :-)

Inderdaad!

-- 
-- Karel Stokkermans, RISC-Linz, Schloss Hagenberg, Austria, Europa
 -- email: kstokker@risc.uni-linz.ac.at (or k314070@edvz.uni-linz.ac.at)
"O hoe vergeefs / des doelmans hand / zich strekte naar de bal    [  21-6-88,  ]
 die 'een minuut / voor tijd de Duitse / doellijn kruiste..."     [ J. Deelder ]
From: "colin perkel" <colin.perkel@canrem.com>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.netherlands
Subject: job (baan)
Date: 15 Aug 92 20:45:26 EST
Reply-To: "colin perkel" <colin.perkel@canrem.com>
Distribution: soc
Organization: Canada Remote Systems

Wim de Groot writes...

-> I'd like to start another serious threat in this newsgroup ...
                                         ^^^
                                       Seriously now ... :-)

   Citizenship has its merits, such as a passport and right of
residence. I've always considered it something of a technical formality.

-> Suppose you get a very good job offer in another country (being a
-> Dutch citizen), and the only way you can accept that job is by
-> becoming a citizen of that country (and in doing so lose your
-> Dutch citizenship).

   I've kept my Dutch citizenship for that reason (mostly pragmatic
rather than sentimental).

-> I'd like to know how many people are willing to give up their
-> nationality for a career and associate economic benefits, and what
-> are your thoughts about it?

   It depends really on what you have to give up to become, doesn't it?
It also depends on what you have to give up to stay what you are. If
you're a starving Bangladeshi offered a position as a rocket scientist
in the U.S., you may be very well tempted to chuck the Bangladeshi
passport and kiss the country goodbye.
   As a Dutch citizen, the choice becomes harder, perhaps, because you
chuck a lot overboard. It depends essentially how good the new prospects
are, how long term and whether you want to go back to NL. I guess.

Col
 ---
Via Silly Little Mail Writer - Me

Internet: colin.perkel@canrem.com
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario/Detroit, MI
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044