From: maillet@cs.dal.ca (Andre' Maillet)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.pern
Subject: Re: Questions of Internal Consistency
Date: 25 Jan 93 19:18:04 GMT
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada

In article <C1ExGs.D8s@newcastle.ac.uk>, Mark.OLeary@newcastle.ac.uk (M.D. O'Leary) writes:
|> In article <1jn1daINN12n@anise.csv.warwick.ac.uk> pyuaq@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr G S Sutherland) writes:
|> >In article <C17tux.MBG@newcastle.ac.uk> Mark.OLeary@newcastle.ac.uk (M.D. O'Leary) writes:

	[debate on time paradox deleted.]

|> Now on to the other matter.
|> >+> Third, fire lizards are supposed to be capable of living for thou-
|> >+> sands of years, right?  Well, how come--Oh, guess I'd better mark 
|> >+> this as a spoiler for those who haven't read ALL THE WEYRS OF PERN
|> >+> yet.
|> >+
|> >+ No: just as long as their owner when impressed. No comment is made as to 
|> >+ lifespan of wild FLs, Their 'group mind' retains memory for thousands of 
|> >+ years, but that is extra-corporeal intellect, not long lifespanned 
|> >+ individuals... But, then again, we hear of nothing that preys on adult FLs..
|> >+ Maybe they just get careless eventually, and mis-visualise a between jump. 
|> >+ That way, having a 'share' in a human mind (by impression) would explain how
|> >+ they manage to continue for so long...
|> >
|> >There are references in both the Dragon Lover's Guide, and also in DragonsDawn
|> >that state that Fire Lizards have no `built in obsolecence' or aging. This 
|> >suggests that they do not get old. Indeed Anne states that one pair could
|> >ultimatly repopulate Pern should the need arise from their own clutches.
|> 
|> 1. Estimate wild FL population on Pern: say 1 queen and fair for every 3 
|> beaches on Southern? that gives many thousands of queens...
|> 
|> 2. Estimate rate of breeding: 1 clutch per turn? (this is implied, but lets not 
|> take it as gospel- say one every ten turns, to allow for queens being rare)
|> 
|> 3. Now take this population and let it breed at that rate for oh, 500 turns 
|> should be enough to get a mass of FLs equal to the mass of the planet...
|> 
|> Seriously: wild FL population seems to be stable. So, they *must* be dying 
|> somewhere and the infant mortality rate at hatching isnt enough to account for 
|> this. Biological immortality is a feasible strategy only if the selection 
|> pressure from the environemt is immensely high, not when there is hardly any 
|> (ie no predators and foolproof escape mechanism)... But I agree, Anne states 
|> that FLs have biological immortality, so, they *must* be suiciding in some way
|> whether accidentally or for real...
|> 
|> >I assume that Thread and Wherries are the prime cause of Fire Lizard deaths.
|> >I don't remember of hearing of any dying Between anywhere in the books.
|> 
|> Wherries can only get thm in the first halfhour of life. thread cant get them 
|> (remember the wil;d ones in DD actually joined in and helped flame thread at 
|> the first fall: they werent scared of it!). For a stable population, we 'd have 
|> to have 100% infant mortality!!! We know that that doesnt happen, too. So they 
|> must die somewhere....
|> 
|> Suggestion: the biological immortality developped to allow the popuilations to 
|> survive the 50yr passes, when raising a clutch would be quite difficult (as 
|> eggs cant dodge!).
|> 
|> Anyway. as I say, FLs must be dying somewhere, or we';d drown in them. We don't 
|> know of anything that could catch or kill 'em on planet, so they must die 
|> in*between*. How, I dont know...
|> 
|> >		    -Dante, J'man Seacrafter.
|> -Raphe again.

	It seems to me that we are ignoring a major form of natural selection.
It is stated that without near constant oiling of the hide of draconic beings
(FL, dragons, etc.), the hide will flake and can crack *between*. Apparently, 
this is almost always fatal to the victim. Dragons are incapable of oiling 
themselves without human help. I would assume that FL wouldn't be able to oil
themselves more than partially, certainly not thoroughly. Therefore, we have 
natural selection. With human intervention (thorough oiling), the FL wouldn't
have this problem and would live as long as the human would.

Andre'
--
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Andre' M. Maillet    | "Wouldn't it be nice if Education got all the money |
|maillet@ug.cs.dal.ca | it needed and the Air Force had to hold a bake sale |
|djtas@ac.dal.ca      | to buy a new bomber." - from a bumper sticker       |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
DISCLAIMER: The views of Dalhousie University are not necessarily those 
expressed by myself. Therefore, I will completely ignore the university's 
opinions and say whatever the hell I want to.