HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Subject: Re: Tim Chain Porn (Re: High School Athletes (lusher))
Organization: Unocal Corporation
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 19:00:06 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.172206.14782@spdcc.com> joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis) writes:
>rough and thick from all that woodchopping and VAX system management.
                                                ^^^
Most be a story about trolls.
There is a whole generation of 20-something computer hackers that have never seen a VAX.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas)
Subject: Re: Parent growing pains
Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 17:14:39 GMT

In article <1993Jan19.232717.29581@ultb.isc.rit.edu>, rrv6550@ultb.isc.rit.edu (R.R. Van gieson) writes:
> 	Parents can be so frustrating sometimes...They have known since
> November that I am gay, so they have had some time. 

  As Ry later states, and I concur, this is no time at all.

> They are not
> thinking about it, I guess that they don't have to deal with it as long
> as I am not in a relationship.

  You say that they aren't thinking about it two or three times. Why are
you so sure? It wouldn't really be all that suprising that they are all
consumed in thinking about it, but with no *outward* manifestations. Coming
out is a rather touchy situation for parents even in the best of situations,
and it is not particularly suprising that they don't have a lot to say
about it because they don't know *what* to think about it.

> 	If I tell them now I expect them to say that I should get out of the
> relationship and concentrate on my schoolwork, since last quarter I had
> a SO and did very bad in school. I also found out that they are not
> tinking about it, and haven't since I told them, I guess that having a
> gay son is O.K., but as long as he doesn't have a SO. I don't want to
> destroy their little world, but it's not always going to be that way.

  Well, would they be right in making that connection? Did your relationship
effect your school work? I know that *I* would be concerned if I were
a parent, irrespective of orientation. 

> 	So basically, if I tell them I will get the 'get out of the
> relationship' lecture, and if I stay quiet till March (when the quarter
> ends), I'll get the "why didn't you tell us" lecture. I don't know which
> is the lesser evil to deal with.

  My feeling is that honest, without agenda, is the best policy. Subtexts
of "I'm gay and this proves it" probably won't go over well. But denying
his existence is just as bad. It's a balancing act to be sure, but it seems
that the key is that you present this as "this is for *me*" rather than
"this is against *you*".
-- 

		Michael Thomas	(mike@gordian.com)
	"I don't think Bambi Eyes will get you that flame thrower..."  
		-- Hobbes to Calvin
		USnail: 20361 Irvine Ave Santa Ana Heights, Ca,	92707-5637
		PaBell: (714) 850-0205 (714) 850-0533 (fax)
From: gnn@cs.vu.nl (Guest GNN)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Year of the Queer
Date: 27 Jan 93 12:01:51 GMT
Organization: Fac. Wiskunde & Informatica, VU, Amsterdam

randyc@Autodesk.COM (Randy Clark) writes:
>	I don't know what films you're referring to here,
>	but it sounds like 70s material, not recent stuff.
>	The vast majority of recent porn seems to be filmed
>	in and around LA.  There's not a lot of SF-productions,
>	except for some series of bondage & stuff, and those
>	delightful punkfag/thrasher productions that feature
>	some guys I used to party with.

Yummm!  Oh sorry, it's just that I'm quite partial to those films
made in and around SF :->  It's bizarre seing people I know from there
in porn places several thousand kilometers away.

>	NGLTF is based in DC, isn't it?

I thought it was NYC, but I could be wrong.

>	I can't answer for NYC, never having been there myself.
>	I think you exaggerate the attitude we have about
>	SF, mostly because the media also exaggerates it.

I don't know...  I have to admit that I am a big fan of SF and tend
to preach about how cool a place it is if I don't watch myself.

>	I completely agree that it would be good to see more
>	about the rest of the country.  It would be good to
>	see more balanced and accurate gay reportage in general.
>	Unfortunately, the gay media is not great on any of
>	these issues, partly because it's produced on a shoestring.
>	Hard to find or keep good people for what is paid.

I personally think that the "gay media" suffers from some of the
same syndrome that "gay literature" does.  I.e. that they are neither
media nor literature.  The Advocate and rags of it's ilk are not
what I would consider unbiased, or even decent reporters.  As for what
is often passed off as Gay Lit., well let's just say that I have an
attitude problem about that.  This is not to say that there isn't good,
or even great gay lit. it's just that the bulk of what people currently 
consider gay lit. to be is just above the level of trash.

Later,
George
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rhayden@oracle.com (Ronald Hayden)
Subject: Re: Clue phone for William J. Clinton
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Belmont, Ca.
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 22:14:12 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <1993Jan26.000442.14043@bsu-ucs> 00bbharris@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu writes:

   A hint to Bill Clinton and the army-thingy...
   Hello, William....
   You run the army
   the army does not run you..
   Remember the army's reaction to desegregation of the army
   Remember the fuss?
   How hard is it to find a white guy and a black guy chatting in the barracks?
   Not too hard...
   Hmmmm....
   Clue phone for the President...
   Line 2.
   brandon

And here's a clue for you:  If Clinton passed an Executive Order
today, the congress would have the votes to overturn it.  Which would
be the worst possible course of events.

This MUST be done correctly, or we're going to be worse off than
before.

Change must start now, as all indications are that the opposition is
growing.  So an immediate halt to the investigations and to asking new
recruits about their sexuality is a good way to start that.  And it
will help defuse the argument that the military will fall apart.

But if Clinton simply waves a pen, it's gonna get waved right back in
our faces.

Sometimes the real world isn't so simple.



--

  - Ronald Hayden

    ----------------------------------------------------------------
   | Documentation Manager, Oracle Toolkit Group                    |
   | Co-chair of Oracle Lambda, Oracle's Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual group |
   | Writer, magician, and various other things                     |
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
From: stevenso@Apple.COM (David Stevenson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: safe sex question
Date: 26 Jan 93 20:23:32 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA

bcapps@agora.rain.com (Brent Capps) wrote:
>
>>I have the honour to remain
>>your obedient servant.
>
to which thaaang@cwis.uomaha.edu (john Dorrance) responded:
>Boundless JOY! I've heard a thing or two about you...
>
You know, in all the discussion, I never saw a detailed description
of how big his problem really is, exactly.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: brown@NCoast.ORG (Stan Brown)
Subject: Re: Fighting fundies
Organization: Oak Road Systems, Cleveland Ohio USA
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 20:58:35 GMT

In article <14037@optilink.COM> walsh@optilink.COM (Mark Walsh) writes:
>Do you really think that these hate groups are such a great
>cause that they will steamroll over the top of you?  I think
>not.  These groups are largely composed of morons, and will
>never be a sizeable percentage of the population.
>
>There is a much larger percentage of people, gay and straight
>alike, that believe in the concept of personal freedoms.  

I have a one-word answer:  "Colorado".

Is it more than coincidence that you're posting from optilink, whence
the infamous C.C. also posts?


-- 
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems                    brown@Ncoast.ORG
Cleveland, Ohio, USA
"Compared to my life, the last man on a chain gang is thoroughly
enjoying himself."                   __Holiday__ by Philip Barry
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams)
Subject: Re: Clinton is President, Bush is not even history
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, California
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 17:22:18 GMT

> mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
>I think I'm actually going to enjoy the new Chief Boob (after, that
>is, his negative tax break for the middle class takes effect).  Already,
>The Press has begun lampooning him.  It's refreshing to see a Donkey
>get flogged by journalistic wet noodles.  Why, just the other day,
>the New York Times ridiculed the "Religious Left's" reaction to
>certain members of the Presidential Party (dubbing it "beyond
>Politically Correct - in fact, Painfully Correct"). 

It was actually queer curmudgeon Fran Lebowitz who coined
the "Religious Left" phrase.  The New York Times merely
reported it.
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
rod williams -=- pacific bell -=- san ramon, ca -=- rjwill6@pacbell.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From:  David Christopher Rogers <drogers@msi.com>
Subject: text of letter sent to Senator Sam Nunn
Organization: RIACS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 03:17:43 GMT

[Note: this letter was sent to Sen. Sam Nunn.  Similar letters
were sent to Sen. Feinstein, GEN Colin Powell, and President Clinton.]



To: Senator Sam Nunn
Chair, Senate Armed Services Committee
Washington, DC



From: 1LT David Rogers
c/o General Neon Manufacturing
601 Minnesota St. #111
San Francisco, CA 94107



Sir:

I am writing to present you with my opinion on the issue of
discrimination against gay men and lesbians in the United States Armed
Forces. I strongly support lifting the ban against homosexual
orientation, and replacing it with regulations enforcing a uniform
standard against sexually harassing conduct. I strongly encourage you
to rethink your opposition to an effort that I believe will result in
a more just, and ultimately more effective, military force.

This is a difficult letter for me to write, as in it I must
acknowledge my position both as an officer in the United States Army
Reserve and as a gay man. Throughout my service I have been faithful
to my oath of office, and worked hard to be an exemplary member of the
infantry. I cannot claim that I am somehow special or unique; my
service is a single small example, and I felt it necessary to make
this statement not for myself but for those unable to speak because
they have lifetimes of service that will be immediately discarded if
they come forward.

In my oath of office I swore to defend the Constitution of the United
States from all enemies, foreign or domestic. In faithfulness to that
oath, I could not at this time remain quiet and retain my honor. I
will let the lawyers argue the nuances of the law, but I know in my
heart that this document promises justice for all; that these
Articles are not dead things, but must be fought for again and again;
that membership in the Armed Forces was one defence, and this letter
another.

I do not know what will happen to my commission after I send this
letter. I plan to send similar letters to President Clinton, GEN
Powell, as well as my own Senators. Any of the above could request
proceedings to remove me from service. While I respect your opinion
and believe you are not acting carelessly or casually, in this case I
respectfully claim you are very wrong, and that it is my duty to
inform you of my belief that a terrible mistake may be committed here
if the ban is not lifted; I accept with sadness that in presenting
this viewpoint I place myself at risk of discharge.  Until that
happens, I will remain faithful to my oath, my commission, my
superiors, and to my role as a military defender of the Constitution
of the United States of America.

I wish you strength and wisdom in a most difficult situation.




David Rogers
1LT, Infantry
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: japg0962@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (John Allen Phebus)
Subject: Re: The Fall(well) of the U.S.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 01:30:32 GMT


Fallwell is a real asshole.  He, Pat Roberston and other religious fundies
are just waiting to attack Clinton the first time he tries to moderate
any of the Reagan/Bush teams bigoted policy.  I hope as time passes more
and more people will tune out to these creeps dismissing their shrill
fanaticism for what it is.

Personaly, I don't understand why the government doesn't revoke Fallwell and
Robertson's tax exempt status.  Both are clearly engaged in non-religious
politically partisan lobbying.  Somebody ought to do something...



Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Good lord!
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 00:44:10 GMT

Accidentally sent my latest batch of unanswered mail to the
'=received' folder (I usually leave all unanswered mail at the main
screen until I slip up in this manner). It's been a while since I
last checked in there, so I thought I'd swallow my fear and see
exactly how frightening things were. When I did, I found *two*
*hundred* and *fifteen* messages stashed away! I think I've found
my next major project... (Why am I lying to myself? That's *been*
my major project for months, and I'm just failing miserably. My
apologies to everyone expecting mail. No offense, but please don't
mail me asking what's taking so long...)

--
thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu * John Dorrance * Disco Diva y Flamenco Chico
      You would be surprised at what resides in your insides.
	  S7/9 g++l+(+)y++z++/--(++!!!)o+(+)x+a++uv(++)j+
From: Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Last Song
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 93 17:15:32 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Just out of curiosity, what are the reviews of the new Elton John
"Last Song" which seems to be about a father who's come to the side
of a son dying of AIDS, perhaps after having shunned him for being
gay.

There is some mention of "thought I'd never lose" which might be a
reference to a reckless lifestyle, and a warning to those who think
they can't or won't get AIDS.

It's quite a moving video, and really goes out on a limb for a mainstream
video/song.
Xref: sparky soc.motss:57734 rec.music.cd:9066 rec.music.misc:30728
From: kc2@doc.ic.ac.uk (K Campbell)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,rec.music.cd,rec.music.misc
Subject: Re: Looking for YAZZ "Wanted" CD or tape
Followup-To: soc.motss
Date: 21 Jan 1993 11:35:17 -0000
Organization: Department of Computing, Imperial College, University of London, UK.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: oak23.doc.ic.ac.uk


In article <mattm-200193101630@mcmelmon.apple.com>,
       mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
|> In article <1993Jan20.164032.8596@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu>,
|> rosario@theory.lcs.mit.edu (Rosario Gennaro) wrote:
|> 
|> > Hello everybody
|> > I am looking for the only album of a group called YAZZ. 
|> > The album came out around 6-7 years ago and its title is "Wanted".
|> > The hit from that album was "Stand up for your love rights" a song 
|> > with some kind of gay motif in it.
|> > If anybody has it please contact me by email, thanks. 
|> 
|> In fact and without doubt, there are *two* albums by YAZZ(OO) -
|> the post-Depeche-Mode pre-Andrew-Bell with Alison-Moyet brainchild
|> of Vincent Clarke.  Very cool.
|> 

Nonsense, Matthew.  The YAZZ who gave the album "Wanted" has nothing at
all to do with Alison Moyet or Vince Clarke.
In fact, the group first billed themselves as Yazz & the Plastic
Population for their first hit, "The Only Way Is Up", which faired quite
well in the UK charts (No. 2 or 3 I think, although I'd have to get my
little brother to check that).
Recently, Yazz has been trying to make a come-back, after, I believe,
having a baby, so there may well be another album on its way.  There
was a single last year, but it didn't do as well as either of the previous
hits.  The album "Wanted" is still available from various record stores,
esp. ones which stock older stuff.  Chances are "Wanted" will be re-
released if Yazz's next album goes well.
-- 
        |   Kenny Campbell         ______     If at first you don't    |
        |   Imperial College       \    /     succeed, failure might   |
        |   London                  \  /      be your style.           |
        |   kc2@doc.ic.ac.uk         \/                 Quentin Crisp  |
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: ry@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (ryerson.schwark)
Subject: Re: Sexual harassment from queers
Organization: UNIX System Laboratories, Summit, NJ
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 15:08:27 GMT

In article <59172@dime.cs.umass.edu> doyle@freya.cs.umass.edu (Jim Doyle) writes:
>
>I tried hard and eventually got to know some pretty cool people ; but there
>was this group that was just utterly socially impenetrable and did NOT like
>or want bisexuals or 'straight-acting' people around. 
>
>I think it just goes to show ya that there are assholes everywhere..

Yeah, I guess so, well count me as one.  Bis are way neato, but every
time I hear somebody call themselves a straight acting queer, I want
to puke, because it really comes across as "Oh gross, I wouldn't ever
act like a girl, that's disgusting."  Or as R&P say "How straight can
you be, when you're down on your knees?"

People can act however the hell they want, but its insulting to queers
and women and just plain stupid, to celebrate stereotypical masculine
behavior as "straight acting", like your average male queer can't be
masculine, only straight men can, so if you act masculine, you must
be "straight acting". puke. and puke too to those straight acting fags
who can't cope with a little non-butch behavior from their fellow
gay men, and can't get how much they insult themselves and all of us
with the term "straight-acting".

Ry
ry@usl.com
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: hughes@dogwood.botany.uga.edu (Wayne Hughes)
Subject: Re: Clinton Gets Earful at Open House
Organization: Botany Department - U of Georgia, Athens
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 02:54:36 GMT

In article <1993Jan23.022927.19541@reed.edu> nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>In article <1993Jan22.200150.16444@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay) writes:
>
>>>"And I wanted to call my parents.  But they aren't talking to me for
>>>the last 11 years because I'm a lesbian.  I hope your Administration
>>>will change that."
>
>>I'm missing something.
>
>It's obvious - she wants Clinton to cure her.
>
>At least, that's the way I read it the first time. What's the
>technical term for this sort of sentence problem?

   Ambiguous reference (the pronoun "that" is too broad to zoom
   in on what it's referring to).

   Wayne

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Subject: Re: Wil Wheaton at MacWorld!!!!!
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 23:55:02 GMT
Summary: give it a rest, please!
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)

In article <mattm-210193121236@mcmelmon.apple.com> mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
>I hadn't realized how truly disadvantaged you were, Jezeboo.

"And one day the chicken woman had chicks, and everyone stepped on
them because they were sooooo ugly."
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                                    D is for lots of things
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Re: Blatant birthday information! : -)
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 20:08:14 GMT

joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis) writes:

>I was never so happy as when I turned from 19 to 20,

Why, for god's sake? I'll admit, after being there for a while I've
gotten cowed by the idea of havign been around for 2 decades, but it
seems to me like 20 is a dull period between important birthdays. 18
made me legal, 19 made me emancipated (I think that's the way it
worked; didn't really *matter* one way or the other, because I'd
been on my own for a year by the time it came around), and 20...
well, it made me only a year away from being an ADULT. I'm dying for
21, because (particularly in Omaha) it's pretty damn hard to get a
sense of community when the main community outlet is off limits.

>except when I
>turned from 29 to 30 (last September). I'll be in 7th heaven when I'm
>39 or 43, and when I'm 50 I'll be insufferable. It was interesting to
>be 21, but it got boring after about a year.

I'll believe that when I see it :).

John, who thinks it'll be cool to age, if only to see how he'll look
as an adult/old guy

--
thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu * John Dorrance * Disco Diva y Flamenco Chico
      You would be surprised at what resides in your insides.
	  S7/9 g++l+(+)y++z++/--(++!!!)o+(+)x+a++uv(++)j+
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: michaelh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Mike Hennahane)
Subject: Re: ST:TNG actors
Organization: CS Department, Stanford University, California, USA
Date: 24 Jan 93 02:36:10 GMT

drp@dosbears.UUCP (David R. Preston) writes:

>In article <1993Jan18.225036.13936@Princeton.EDU> spencer@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (S. Spencer Sun) writes:
[Brent Spiner...]
>>Anyone heard his album?  Yes, he _sings_!

>I hope he sings better than Shatner and Nimoy did on their
>albums....

i don't know that shatner singing "lucy in the sky with diamonds" or
nimoy singing "proud mary" on the golden throats album can be
adequately described in words.  simply amazing (in its own way).

--mike
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: ECL4JN2@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Jack B. Nimble)
Subject: Re: Military Ban on Gays/ FAX NUMBERS
Date: 27 Jan 93 10:19:50 PST

In article <38p3jt#@rpi.edu>, on 26 Jan 1993 21:25:49 GMT,
buckmr@rs6421.ecs.rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire) writes:

>
>tdbear@dvorak.amd.com (Thomas D. Barrett) writes:
>
>
>>Take time, compose your letter, FAX it, and then send the copy in the
>>mail.  There will be more issues for another day and we certainly want
>>the avenues of communication to be left open.
>
>Well, this is a VERY significant first issue for clinton to go to battle with
>conservatives on. If we lose this it will MOST DEFINITELY affect what kind of
>real progressive change can be accomplished later in his term.
>
Actually, we can be quite grateful that he's taking this one on earlier
rather than later. If he actually waited until he botches up the
economy with his ill-advised tax increases and governmental regulation,
he might become so unpopular as to be unable to accomplish anything.

    =Jack=
---

Jack B. Newsbaum             You have rights antecedent to all earthly
Library Information Systems  governments; rights that cannot be
University Research Library  repealed or restrained by human law.
ecl4jn2@mvs.oac.ucla.edu               - John Adams
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas)
Subject: Re: Tim Chain Porn (Re: High School Athletes (lusher))
Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 04:32:39 GMT

In article <1993Jan22.041513.5562@tc.cornell.edu>, shore@dinah.tc.cornell.edu (Melinda Shore) writes:
> In article <1jnfmlINNojb@spim.mti.sgi.com> dauber@tattoo.mti.sgi.com (Jeff Dauber) writes:
> >Well, when I was a kid, you had to boot the machine by flipping switches
> >on the front.

  [see Jeff, what did I tell you?]
 
> HAH!  When I was first started programming, Fortran was
> *brand* *new*.  My father used to bring home card decks and
> teach me and my sister to read the holes

  Ha! My mother use to make these hideous xmas decorations by
taking punch cards, folding two corners in, arranging a whole
bunch of them in a star arrangement and spray painting them
with gold and glitter.
  Truly Tacky. No wonder I'm a faggot; at six I had better 
taste then that.
-- 

		Michael Thomas	(mike@gordian.com)
	"I don't think Bambi Eyes will get you that flame thrower..."  
		-- Hobbes to Calvin
		USnail: 20361 Irvine Ave Santa Ana Heights, Ca,	92707-5637
		PaBell: (714) 850-0205 (714) 850-0533 (fax)
Newsgroups: soc.motss