HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tan@lynx.msc.cornell.edu.UUCP (David Tan,Box 219 Baker Lab,54810,2720402)
Subject: Re: bar-end shifters
Originator: tan@msc2.msc.cornell.edu
Organization: Cornell-Materials-Science-Center
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 15:06:11 GMT

From article <1992Aug24.102514.8467@vax.oxford.ac.uk>, by ftgcdj@vax.oxford.ac.uk:
> The problem of incompatability between Dura Ace and Ulterga, with regard to
> shifters and rear mechs, is due to the position of the pivot points of the rear
> mechs. The pivot point for the Dura Ace is in a slightly different position, so
> that you get the same movement in the rear mech with less cable travel than
> that of the Ultegra (and most other Shimano rear mechs). 
> 
> It's not designed to shaft people who want to upgrade to Dura Ace, but is
> designed for top-class road racing, where riders don't want their levers to
> travel through a large arc. 
> 
Just out of curiosity, why should non-racers want their levers to move in a
large arc, and is it so difficult to maintain at least this much compatibility
across lines?

Dave

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: peterwu@microsoft.com (Peter Wu)
Subject: consumer report rating
Date: 27 Aug 92 15:21:14 GMT
Organization: mc
Distribution: pnw

I want to buy an medium quality mountain/city bike but am relunctant
to spend months researching which bike to buy (by then it'll be winter).

Last year's consumer report rated some bikes. The recommended mountain
bike was Giant Iguana, and the city bike was Jazz Voltage.

Can someone comment whether the way they rated bikes were valid?
Or if you have experience/knowledge with the above bikes, can you
comment on the + and - sides?

The Iguana is on sale for $300, is it a good price?
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: rkohli@aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu (Suffering Socutash!)
Subject: KONA Mtn Bikes
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Oklahoma - University Computing Services
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 02:04:00 GMT

Greetings all,
      In my search for a new mountain bike I tried out the KONA Fire Mountain.
Seems to be a resonably good mountain bike. Has anybody heard good/bad things 
about the brand? Opinions, experiences will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
:-) ranjan 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     	      The vain attempt to avoid errors by inactivity.
                               Ranjan Kohli.
                       Student Software Consultant,
                          University Of Oklahoma.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: rlewis@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca (Robert Lewis)
Subject: Re: Dual pivot calipers (?)
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 00:19:03 GMT

BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM writes:

>Robert Lewis writes:

>Quoting from Bicycling:

>> 1989, and Shimano launches a dual-pivot brake in its 105 groupset...

[deleted section]

>Leave it up to our eminent bicycle rag to not investigate this with their
>own measurements and research but to merely add "groupset" to the discussion.

Please note that I did not quote from "Bicycling", as I remember it I made
it clear that I was quoting from "Cycling Plus", a British cycling
magazine which, from what I can tell, has no link to "Bicycling".  I
repeat the quote is not from "Bicycling" and if I indicated that it was
then I made an error in doing so.


Robert M. Lewis
Department of Sociology
University of Alberta
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
From: bcripe@hpcvxba.cv.hp.com (Brian E. Cripe)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Custom dropout for Burley trailer hitch?
Keywords: Burley, trailer, dropout
Date: 25 Aug 92 19:28:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: hpcvusn.1992Aug25.192800.25769
Distribution: na
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA

|> If anyone has seen a frame attached to a trailer in a custom way and
|> can give me any help, either in tracking down the maker or in imitating
|> the design, please let me know.

A member of the local bike club (Mid-Valley Wheelmen in Corvallis, OR) has a
tandem he built himself that has a custom attachment for his Burley trailer.
It looks real nice (they even redid all the nylon on the trailer to make it
match the colors of the tandem), and it has a lot of miles so I assume it
works well.  They have replaced the standard Burley flag with a large (24"?)
stuffed Big Bird, so they are easy to spot.

Email me (bcripe@cv.hp.com) if you want his name and number.  I prefer not
to post it to the world without his permission.

	Brian Cripe
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: josh@Happy-Man.com (Joshua_Putnam)
Subject: Re: top five innovations
Keywords: flickstand
Reply-To: Joshua_Putnam@happy-man.com
Organization: Happy Man Corp., Vashon Island, WA 98070-7399
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 22:37:38 GMT

In <Dqg6PB1w163w@gcarter> gcarter!gcarter (George Carter) writes:

>When
>off the bike, it seem to me the following choices are 
>available:

>1. Lie the bike down
>2. Lean the bike against something without a flickstand
>   type device and risk a much higher probability of the
>   bike falling.
>3. Use a kickstand.
>4. Lean the bike against something with a flickstand.

>For me, choice number 4 is clearly the best.  So, what is 
>beef with flickstands?

I have nothing against flickstands for those who like
them, but they won't work on a bike with sensible fenders.

The old-fashioned technique of putting a bungie cord or
spare toe strap through the wheel and around the frame
just above the shifters works well enough for me, and
costs nothing since I already have plenty of bungie cords,
old toe straps, and spare hunks of inner tube.

In most cases, I just set the bike down gently on the
non-drivetrain side, since then even a clueless pedestrian
kicking it won't make it tip over.  This isn't as
convenient when the racks and bags are covered with
fragile stuff.

-- 
 Joshua_Putnam@happy-man.com    Happy Man Corp.  206/463-9399 x102
 4410 SW Pt. Robinson Rd., Vashon Island, WA  98070-7399  fax x108
 We publish SOLID VALUE for the intelligent investor.  NextMail OK
Info free; sample $20: Send POSTAL addr: Solid-Value@happy-man.com
From: khe@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Keith Erskine)
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:05:37 GMT
Subject: Re: Numbness during extended bicycling & other overuse injuries
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
From: ronf@panther3.panther.mot.com (Ron Feigen)
Subject: Re: Trek 5x00 Frame Change For '93
Organization: Motorola Panther Project, Chandler, AZ
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 16:26:36 GMT

In article <16190414@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> chapman@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Larry Chapman) writes:
>
>The  only  change  being  made to the Trek  5x00  frames  next  year is the
>addition of an aluminum cover on the chainring  side of the bottom  bracket
>to protect against shifting off the small ring etc.
>
>Trek is planning to retrofit existing 5x00 frames.
>
>-- LSC

Are there any other changes to the 5x00 bikes, gear, even color.  I am in the
process of ordering a 5200 and some friends are buying (2) 5500s.  Any info
would be appreciated

-- 

>
Ron Feigen
ronf@panther.mot.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: Hyperglide chain replacement: suggestions wanted
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92 04:41:26 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <4cjk02ry205501@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> msw10@nepenthe.as writes:
>
>>BTW: a friend told me that he tried using the Sedis SL (hollow link)
>>chain and that the links started breaking after about 4 to 6 months
>>of use. Anyone know anything about this?
>
>I think you're confusing a Sedis SL with a Regina SL (hollow link), which
>aren't recommended for HG. I have 2 friends that have tried them (Reginas), one with
>a Regina freewheel and one with a DA Uniglide, and both experienced poor
>shifting performance. The tradeoff is weight (~60g).

Right you are. However, I just bought a Regina SL and it said that
it was hyperglide compatible. I'm using it on a Super Record group
so it isn't going to get tried, but that's what it said.
From: ftgcdj@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: bar-end shifters
Date: 24 Aug 92 09:25:14 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

The problem of incompatability between Dura Ace and Ulterga, with regard to
shifters and rear mechs, is due to the position of the pivot points of the rear
mechs. The pivot point for the Dura Ace is in a slightly different position, so
that you get the same movement in the rear mech with less cable travel than
that of the Ultegra (and most other Shimano rear mechs). 

It's not designed to shaft people who want to upgrade to Dura Ace, but is
designed for top-class road racing, where riders don't want their levers to
travel through a large arc. 

A friend of mine has just bought himself a Dura Ace rear mech for his road bike
and was hoping to cannibalize his Ultegra bar-end shifters from his tandem. No
such luck!!

-------
Charles

ftgcdj@uk.ac.oxford.vax
 
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: steveha@microsoft.com (Steve Hastings)
Subject: Re: consumer report rating
Date: 29 Aug 92 23:15:34 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Applications Division

I have been very happy with my Dahon Mountain Gold.  It is a mountain bike
that can be folded up, small enough to fit into a car trunk.  I have mine
tricked out for my commute to work, so I have road tires instead of
knobbies, and a cargo rack and some mudguards.

I even have Scott/LeMond clip-on aero bars; to fold the bike small I must
unclip them, but that is quick.

The bike cost about $450 and I think it was well worth it.
-- 
Steve "I don't speak for Microsoft" Hastings    ===^=== :::::
uunet!microsoft!steveha  steveha@microsoft.uucp    ` \\==|
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: alant@donner.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Alan Tragarz (JD))
Subject: Re: Championship of Zuerich - results?
Keywords: bicycle racing
Organization: NCR Corp., E&M San Diego
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 20:11:56 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.121154.37021@watson.ibm.com> ams@watson.ibm.com (Aaron
Shtromas) writes:
>
>-- 
>
>Does anybody have the results of the Championship of Zuerich results?
>It's a World Cup race, and should have taken place on 23rd of August.
>
>aaron

Viatcheslav Ekimov won the race, followed by Lance Armstrong. They beat out
the likes of Mark Madiot, Guido Bontempi and Jan Neveens. Thats all I know.

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: J105270@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: Group Split Yet?
Organization: Lockheed Missiles & Space Company, Inc.
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 22:00:30 GMT

Has this group split into all those that were voted on yet?
I figured I would see from the menu but I won't know for certain
if my menu never changes...
From: ehousey@urbana.mcd.mot.com (Ed Housey)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: LeMond's Restaurant in MN
Date: 1 Sep 92 12:34:49 GMT
Organization: Motorola Computer Group, Urbana Design Center


I am planning on being in the Minneapolis area soon, and would like
to see LeMond's restaurant.  Anyone happen to know the name of it,
and where it's located?  I've seen on a map that Wayzata is about 12
miles west of Minneapolis.

Thanks in advance,
ejh

ehousey@urbana.mcd.mot.com
From: rpo@trsvax.tandy.com
Date: 31 Aug 92 13:26 CDT
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: ADVISE sought: WIFE doesn't wear he
Message-ID: <2600012@trsvax>
Nf-ID: #R:zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu:5:trsvax:2600012:000:259
Nf-From: trsvax.tandy.com!rpo    Aug 31 13:26:00 1992


Give her a good kiss before every ride. Tell her that
you want one to remember her by, 'cause kissin' vegetables
isn't much fun.

(Maybe tasteless, but I'd be a vegetable now or dead if I
hadn't been wearing my helmet when I did a <10mph header.)

Paul Opitz

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: freytag@seas.gwu.edu (Richard Freytag)
Subject: Re: Recumbents-tell me about 'em
Followup-To: freytag@seas.gwu.edu
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 23:16:18 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.221419.14770@news.cs.brandeis.edu> dkw@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (David Wittenberg) writes:
>
>Recumbent vendors and prices are covered in the FAQ.  It may be a
>little out of date, but probably not badly so. 
>
You mention that there probably isn't a underseat handlebar equipped recumbent
with a short wheelbase.  There are actually three:

The ATP-R20, two 20" wheels, $1350.00 for assembled bike, one size really does 
fit 6'5" to 5'3".  Advanced Transportation Products: 206 771-3719.  

The LB-E, 16" front and 24-26" rear wheel, three frame sizes
sold as a frameset for $395.00.  Turner Enterprises 213 383 0030
Turner is also selling the LB-2000, approx same wheel sizes and frame sizes,
comes assembled, approx. $1100.00, Contact Turner Enterprises.  

>Bad points:  I have a long wheelbase recumbent, and it's longer than
>diamond framed bikes, so it can be a nuisance getting it in and out of
>the house, up stairs and so on.  I had to slightly modify my car's
>roof rack to handle the recumbent.  

This is much less of an issue with the short wheelbase varieties mentioned 
above.  They also have a much small turning circle (making them according to
some more difficult to track straight; to me they handle more like a diamond
frame).  

--- Richard Freytag
From: BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: What to rename "clipless" pedals?
Date: 26 Aug 92 16:55:19 GMT

Joel Plutchak writes:

> Perhaps we should stick to the subject of bicycling, eh?
>
> Joel Plutchak, Research Programmer/Analyst
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Perhaps this hasn't a lot to do with anything, either bicycles or for that
matter net news.  I suppose titles and job description give more weight to
your opinions in the eyes of some readers.  I am not impressed.  You might
try letting your words rest on their own merit.

jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com
From: BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@hplomg.hpl.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: FAQ for new subgroups?
Date: 29 Aug 92 22:00:05 GMT

> Before I go thru the work of splitting the FAQ up into separate FAQs for
> each new subgroup in rec.bicycles,

Please don't even think of it.  The file would be useless because the
reader often doesn't even know what to look for and therefore would never
find the item in some cases.  Besides, where do you cut?

jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: cwright@tensor4.WPI.EDU (Charles R Wright)
Subject: Re: Wearing street shoes on clipless pedals
Keywords: clipless pedal accessory gadget
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 14:26:50 GMT

In article <17d90eINN23p@early-bird.think.com> Robert Schwartz writes:
>In article <BtInBA.KL4@wpi.WPI.EDU>, Charles R Wright writes:
>|> <stuff deleted> 
>|> Do they exist?
>|> 
>|> What are they called?

(More stuff deleted)

>
>Of course its quite simple to make your own if you have an extra 
>set of cleats and clips/straps.
>
>Bob Schwartz
>Thinking Machines Corp.
>Cambridge Ma.


Thanks to all who replied concerning this gadget.  I finally found them
in the nth local bike shop.  For clarification, these were adapters so
you could wear street shoes in Look pedals (as opposed to SPD pedals).

What I found was the Windwood InStep, for $20 (American).  My first
reaction was that I could have built the same thing myself, as Bob has
suggested above.  However, lacking spare parts needed, it would cost
just as much or more for cleats, toeclips and straps, and then I'd
have to get them put together in a non-annoying manner.

One person mentioned that if I had SPD pedals, I wouldn't need this
thing because you can walk around like a normal person with the shoes
that SPD pedals take.  Oh well, I already had the Look pedals...

Other people mentioned seeing a very expensive gizmo (~$80),
apparently used by some triatheletes.  Creeping gadget-itis.

In case anyone else is interested, they work ok, but not great.  The
problem is trying to get them right side up so you can stick your foot
in them.  The bottoms of my Shimano pedals don't provide any
toe-holds.

Also, they don't grip your feet very well, although I have some ideas
how to fix this.

Anyway, they are adequate for my needs.

Thanks again,

Charles Wright             Research Assistant, Machine Vision Lab
cwright@ee.wpi.edu         De facto system manager for an IBM RS-6000
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: bobb@ico.isc.com (Bob Bundy)
Subject: Re: HG Chain vs. Sedis ATB
Organization: Interactive Systems Corporation, Boulder, CO
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 19:34:53 GMT

From article <16190413@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM>, by khe@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Keith Erskine):
> In rec.bicycles, mjohnsto@jenny.shearson.com (Mike Johnston) writes:
> 
>> It seems to me that the Sedis chain is not nearly 
>> as 'snappy' when it comes to shifts and it certainly sounds noisier and 
>> feels sloppy. 
> 
> Mike, your experience matches mine exactly.  Upon advice of the net I 
> tried several Sedis chains and I found they didn't shift nearly as well 
> as an HG-90 hyperglide chain.

I did an informal survey of the net and queried a few bicycle mechanics
about the HG chains and posted the results to the net.  This may be
one of the references Keith is referring to.  There was general consensus
that the HG chains were unreliable, required extra care to replace, and
cost more (especially if you consider the cost of the extra pins).  I
talked to a mechanic at Rim Cyclery in Moab who got livid at the mention
of the HG chain.  He had been replacing chains for years without problems
until the HG chains showed up.  He has a slightly different perspective 
from most of us since he has to deal with irate customers that have had
to walk many miles in the desert following a chain failure.  I think 
you'll agree that the most prudent course in his case is to use the most
reliable chain, despite any improvement in shifting performance.  Most
people I talked to recommended the Sedis ATB chain, which is what I now 
use.

> They are difficult to put back together without they special replacement
> link, which costs $2-3.  They can be put back together without the special
> link but it is tricky.  Use a Hyperglide or gold Cycoli chain tool.
> They do seem to break more often than other chains, I hate to admit.
> I've now broken 4 hyperglide chains in 3 years.  2 of these were due
> to pilot error in rejoining the chain without the special link.
 
I think Keith's experiences are typical.  In cases of installation error
it is difficult to know whether to place the blame on the installer or
on the engineer who designed a system that is so prone to installation 
error.  My son broke three of these chains in a couple of months.  Two
broke at the black pin that he had replaced and one broke at a regular pin.
Lack of careful installation can be a problem, but I think these chains
less reliable, even with proper installation.

By the way, I think the Shimano HG chain tool is much better than the
gold Cycoli.  The Cycoli pins seem to bend and mushroom, especially when
pushing the black HG replacement pins all the way in.  The Shimano tool
costs significantly more, however.

> Overall I think the improved shifting makes the HG chain worthwhile,
> in spite of the increased failure rate.

Since I don't notice any significant difference in shifting performance,
the choice for me is easy.  Others may make different trade-offs in
deciding which chain to use.
 
> Keith Erskine

Bob Bundy
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,rec.bicycles.misc
From: hlk5268@ultb.isc.rit.edu (H.L. King )
Subject: Where is the FAQ?
Followup-To: poster
Originator: hlk5268@ultb
Keywords: help w/simple questions
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 17:17:04 GMT


Hey everybody,

	I have a few basic questions I'd love to get answered, but in the
spirit of net.ettiquete I'd just assume check the FAQ list first.  Can
anyone enlighten me as to its whereabouts?

Thanks in advance
-Heidi

hlk5268@ultb.isc.rit.edu
From: chandler@wc.novell.com (Mark Chandler)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: 700c knobbies
Date: 3 Sep 92 15:56:24 GMT
Organization: Novell, Inc. - Walnut Creek

In article <laakinINNquu@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> billyg@lahonda.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>
>Hi folks,
>
>I have a tire question.  I ride my trusty touring Cannondale to work
>over some pretty rugged terrain (Windy Hills off Skyline, for those of
>you in the Bay Area...).  Most would consider this pretty rugged
>mountain bike terrain, but I find that the IRC V-Claw on my front wheel
>does an admirable job of hanging on to the hardpack and gravel.

These are nice tires.  I have a set of the 700x41C version that measure
pretty close to their actual size.

>My problem is that the chainstays on the Cannondale don't accommodate
>the 38c V-Claw (too narrow).  I'm using a Michelin Touring tire on the
>rear.  While this setup works fairly well, I do find situations (mostly
>uphill) where I would like a bit more bite on that rear tire...
>
>Can anyone recommend a good 700c X 35c tire designed for off-road use?

Look for the Continental CountryGrip tire.  It measures about 33-34mm
even though it's marked 700x37C.  LIke most Conti's, it has a nice ride
and wears well.

Also check Bianchi's cross terrain tires.  These are usually made by IRC,
National (aka Panaracer), or Cheng Shin.  They have some pretty good tires
and are usually pretty reasonable in price.  Check you local Bianchi dealer.

>Thanks.
>
>--B


--
Mark Chandler               Novell, Inc.          510/975-4522
chandler@wc.novell.com      Walnut Creek, CA      510/938-2562 FAX
==================================================================
     The opinions expressed above are mine, not my employer's.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: cabizon@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (THOMAS BIZON)
Subject: Performance CM500 Computer
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date:  1 Sep 1992 12:08 EST  

Questions about the CM500...............

I have heard that this computer DOES NOT have an auto start/stop
feature for average speed when the bike is not in motion (in other
words, it averages in 0 mph at red lights, etc).  Is this true????

Also what is the resolution......1 mph or 0.5 mph?????

Thanks for the info.
Tom
              _   __o
            ___  `\<,
              -  O/ O
From: ra_novy@DAL.MOBIL.COM
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Damn REDNECK nailed me in Woodside!
Date: 31 Aug 92 19:39:40 GMT

Let's see if I've got this straight.

Jobst Brandt writes

>I guess it's Tom's tone that gets me.  I agree that there are guys in
>motor vehicles who are rude and others that are dangerous to my life but
>the response should not be in the Clint Eastwood fashion.  Our national
>heroes are, unfortunately, people like John Wayne, Oliver North, and the
>prosecution of Desert Storm, in which justice is taken into ones own hands.
>It is an invitation to Sarajewo.  Reminiscent of "Lord of the Flies" where
>primitive law takes over.

This apparently advises victims to rely on the justice system to mete out a
penalty for bad behavior.  But gee, I don't want our national heroes to be Alan
Alda, Teddy Kennedy, or Phil Donahue, either.



>Unfortunately the Sheriff and his deputies (of San Mateo Co.) are themselves
>John Wayne types to a large degree and even with a report of a license number
>nothing would happen if this incident were reported.  It requires damage and
>evidence or a group that was threatened and will testify.  Any other action
>is but dust in the wind.

This means that a single bicyclist who was merely threatened cannot count on
the justice system to dole out punishment.


So what's the solution (if any)?  Sounds to me as if bicyclists might want to
pursue the fashionable course of being branded a traditionally-oppressed group,
which would allow us to draw upon hate-crime legislation.  Motorists have a
long history of mistreating bicyclists, so a minimum of evidence should be
required to prove guilt. (Heavy sarcasm here.)

No?  Then I suppose we must simply ride defensively (as Jobst concludes) and
HOPE that fate does not cross our paths with those of the nutcakes.  And we
should just enjoy good health while we've got it.

Bob Novy
ra_novy@dal.mobil.com
Dallas, TX

Good research need not be difficult; it must be useful.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles