From: fscll@acad3.alaska.edu (Chris Lott)
Subject: Re: Maple vs Hyok round 2
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 06:27:40 GMT

In article <1992Apr14.211347.1331@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, jks2x@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Jason) writes:
> In article <1992Apr12.211911.1@acad3.alaska.edu> fscll@acad3.alaska.edu (Chris Lott) writes:
>>In article <1992Apr12.204838.2949@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, jks2x@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Jason) writes:
>>
> 	Oh, so you're saying that you said things like (No, I don't 
> remember your exact words, so I'm not going to quote you.) hey people 
> on alt.r-n-r let's post g-n-r things on .heavy and .metallica because 
> the people there don't like it.
> 	How can ypu possibly say that you weren't trying to get a reaction
> out of people???

I posted those for exactly the reasons I stated: when people learn that it is
not their place to determine who posts what in an unmoderated newsgroup, and
therefore are able to just ignore the psots which offend them, then the posts
will disappear spontaneously. you are right that I was pissed when I told
everyone to post to .metal.hard.... but I will continue to defend my, and any
other's right to do so. If people do not want to hear it that;'s tough. If
they don't CARE then it will die of its own accord. If you recall I have NEVER
posted an article about Guns and Roses or any band but Metalica on this group,
only responded to assholes that think theuy KNOW what is right... 

> 	Yes - I expect you to listen to me.  As I've said many times 
> before (and evidently need to say again) cross posting g-n-r articles
> here is a waste of time for you and the readers.  People here don't want
> to read them.  So keep them in the groups where you'll find other g-n-r
> fans.

see above.. you are getting repetitive here.

> 
>>bands that try to be metal and people that try to say they like metal but
>>aren't and don't right? So if GnR isn;t metal, and I don;t say they are metal,
> 
> 	If you say they aren't metal WHY POST ABOUT THEM IN A METAL 
> NEWSGROUP!!!!!  This has been my point all along.  Thank you for backing
> it up.  
> 

Split up my argument to suit your own end. Again, see my first response.

>>and you don't either, then you are using the word poser to reflect your view
>>of the group and your OPINION of their listeners. All of which has nothing to
>>do with it being metal, and all of which is EXACTLY my point. 
> 
> 	I left the part of my post you were refering to in so that you could
> show me where I called you a poser.  I consider a poser to be a MUSICIAN
> who POSES as something he/she isn't to get money/fame/laid.  Hence the word
> POSER.  I consider g-n-r to be posers.  'Appetite' was a good album.  'Lies' 
> was ok, but the new ones were written to sell.  That is my definition
> of a poser: someone who writes music JUST to sell records.  I prefer to
> listen to music that is written to say something, to make me think.

Here we go... what was behind anyone's music but your own is only speculation.
you don't know what the songs on ANY album were written for, whether to sell
or because that was the best music they could make... thus your definition of
POSER is completely subjective and holds no water with anyone but your
proponents. Not me. I think GnR are musicians... I think Metallica are
musicians for that matter. And nothing you can say makes them not musicians...

> 
>>Thanks for digging your own hole, lying in it face down, AND handing me the
>>shovel. You are awfully nice to do all that, but I had you buried in the first
>>place.
> 
> 	YOU had ME burried?  I'm sorry to inform you that I'm not the one
> running around flamming people for posting.  I asked you no to post g-n-r

I didn't flame you personally, I flamed your simple, obvious, somewhat
repetitive and very predictable arguments. 

> messages here because I don't like them much and I don't want to read about
> them.  I was just trying to point out that there are different groups for
> different reasons.  People here are here because they don't want to read 
> about warrant, and bon jovi.  You said you realize this, yet you encourage
> people to post here about hose non-heavy metal groups anyway.  Talk about
> burrying yourself and your argument. 

Burying only has one 'r' by the way.. but more importantly.. I admitted that
I was rash in asking people to post here... BUT, I STILL have NEVER posted an
article about any of the bands you so want to cut down! I have only responded
to would be judges in the way they should be responded to. Quickly and from
the heart.

> 	If you would stop immediately insulting people for their posts
> you might acually see that we come close to agreeing.  I just have a 
> problem with people posting articles that they know don't belong in the
> group.

I don't think we come that close if you think about your opinionated
definitions of POSER or whatever term you want to use and your mighty
arrogance in deciding who is a 'musician' or not.... As I have said. If I WANT
to post about Guns and Roses here, I WILL. But I don't WANT to or see the need
to. And if I ever did, it would be up to you to ignore it if you feel it
doesn't belong because in the end that is all it is.. YOUR feeling... 

As for Metallica, my point is they gained a reputation on HARD metal which
they don't play any more... their last two albums have been very soft, and as
long as they have the allegiance of metal-heads or whatever they wasnt to call
themselves when their music doesn't live up to it, then I can call them
posers. That is MY definition, and every bit as good as yours.

Good idea on the sigs
-- 
 __________________________________________________________
|  Christopher L. Lott  --- Poet and Pauper                |
|__________________________________________________________|___
|  fscll@alaska                | "And now what shall become of |
|  fscll@acad3.alaska.edu      |  us without any barbarians?   |
 ------------------------------|  Those people were a kind of  |
                               |          solution."           |
                                -------------------------------