HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz)
Subject: Re: info wanted on runes
Organization: International Computer Science Institute, Berkeley, CA, U.S.A.
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 16:49:53 GMT

radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz) writes:
>I want more info on the Anglo-Saxon runes, and I suspect there's enough
>interest for you to post it.

canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson) writes:
> 	Enough good things can hardly be said about R.I. Page's book
> _Runes_ which is the best introduction to runology I have seen.  It
> includes info on all the different futharks.

I have to agree.  As a matter of fact, I posted about it a while
back.  But I know that Page doesn't give the names of the Anglo-Saxon
runes (or of any but the Elder runes, for that matter).

Can anyone post the names of the Anglo-Saxon runes, or perhaps a source
for the Anglo-Saxon version of the rune-poem?

Blessings!

		-- radzy
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: ON Paganism in Maine...Are you there?
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 22:37:55 EDT
Organization: Ailanthus Project

IO20402@MAINE.MAINE.EDU writes:

> I've been in Maine for a few months now, at the wonderful University of Maine
> Anyway, I'm Scottish, and I would love to know if there are any followers
> of the old religion here close to the university who might be able to help me
> learn. I know very little about paganism and Wiccans, but I have decided that
> this will be one thing I will accomplish this year.
> On the whole though, I would just love to talk to people who think and act li
> I do...
>       All my wishes et Tak Car,
>                  Kerry

gee, what a coincidence.  i just finished at the wonderful, wonderful
university of maine, and currently live in brewer.  the bangor area is FULL of
pagans, but few of the groups realize that the other groups exist, and no
willing sucker has yet arisen (although i've considered it) to try to get
people together and talking.

if you'd started reading a couple of months back, i'd have still be posting
from my IO account, but i read news off of our BBS now instead...

                                                 -ailsa

p.s. if you're not homophobic, i'm willing to talk to you.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                    ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com
 I wish her insight to battle love's blindness            ________
 Strength from the milk of human kindness         Silence \      / Action
 A safe place for all the pieces that scattered      =     \    /    =
 Learn to pretend there's more than love           Death    \  /    Life
                                  that matters               \/
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: paul@sierra.com (Paul Stratton)
Subject: Re: subject?
Organization: Sierra Geophysics Inc.,  Kirkland, Wa
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 00:10:06 GMT

In article <DiZyPB1w164w@ailanth.UUCP> wang!ailanth!ailsa@ulowell.ulowell.edu (temporary) writes:
>AND they're going after gay people hard, not even bothering to disguise the
>hatred in clean linen.  i've been asking all my friends PLEASE to vote against
>bush, as MY life depends on it, even if their doesn't.  bush has spoken out
>lately very strongly against teh rights of gay parents, and damn i don't want
>to have to try to find housing and an internet connection in canada!
>
>                                           -ailsa

Ailsa, you should see the Washington state Republican platform.  It looks
like something out of Nazi Germany.  It (WA REP platform) wants to make
witchcraft, meditation, and being gay illegal...

I don't remember the exact wording.  It would be funny if wasn't real.
Every Republican candidate in the state has said, "Get this thing away
from me!."  Brought to by the official party of the Klan.

Paul


Sacraficial lines R us

-- 
Paul Stratton               -----   -----   -----    -----    -----    ------
Sierra Geophysics, Inc.    /          /    /        /    /   /    /   /     /
P.O. Box 3886              -----     /    /---     /-----   /-----   /-----/
Seattle, Wa.  98124            /    /    /        /   \    /  \     /     /
From: silver@brewich.hou.tx.us (Silverflame)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Pagan Fiction (MZB's Witch Hill)
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 12:59:15 CDT
Organization: The Brewer's Witch BBS, +1 713 272 7350, Brewich.Hou.TX.US

Donal, I couldn't agree more with your opinion about Witch Hill (your 
post #3557, 19 Aug 92 [sincere...more or less...apologies to anyone who 
cares, but I'm new to Usenet posting, and haven't yet figured out how to 
do those beautiful - almost mandelbrot - multi-tiered quotes upon quotes, 
so I guess y'all will have to look it up. Xin Loi.]), but alas...she did 
indeed write it. There was an interview with her in Green Egg sometime 
this last year (?), in which she said (to the best of my recollection - 
I'll look it up) simply that not all witches are "white" [no racism 
intended, and its my term, not hers], but that there are "wicked 
witches," and that Pagan fiction shouldn't ignore them either. No 
apologies.
Now, I don't remember the exact words of the interview right now, but 
that was the bare bones gist of her reply, as I recall it - because I do 
recall thinking that, while I did not like the book, MZB _did_ have a 
point. I'm sure that most of us know at least a few 
Witches/Wiccans/Pagans who, while they profess to follow the Witches' 
Rede (and other similar terminology), are on a power trip - overtly or 
not - occult or not. I know personally of one chap, who claimed to have 
been a SEAL in Vietnam and who bragged about throwing a scare into 
someone by threatening to pull the other persons heart out of their chest 
if they didn't get off of the first person's case...and he called himself 
(and I'm sure that he believed it) a Wiccan....
BTW...I still don't like Witch Hill!
Goddess Bless!
Silverflame


 > Not all Vietnam vets are Kill Crazy Psycho Nut Cases...
    Some of us are nice guys...and some of us are followers of Kali
      and some of us are all of the above...you pays your money and you
        takes your chances  :{>

------------------
silver@brewich.hou.tx.us (Silverflame)
(Alternate) silver%brewich@lobster.hou.tx.us
Origin: The Brewer's Witch BBS -- Houston, TX -- +1 713 272 7350
     "Silence is the voice of complicity" - Vote Early, Vote Often!
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Subject: Re: info wanted on runes
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 06:22:49 GMT

corun@access.digex.com (Corun MacAnndra) writes:

>Also, isn't the word Anglo-Saxon a combination of the names of two separate
>peoples, one of whom, the Angles, originated in Angleland (ie., England)?
>This would seem to make the Angles a Celtic people joined with the Saxons,
>a Celtic-German (by your definition) people. Three quarters Celtic is pretty
>close to all Celtic for most purposes.

Anglo-Saxon (Old English) is the name of a language.  It is the language which
came into being when the two Germanic peoples, the Angle and the Saxons, who
had come from the Continent to invade Britain, were merging in what eventually
became England.  That is, the island Britain had been Celtic (as the name
shows--from Brython, one of the major tribes of Celts).  During the first
millenium C.E., the Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Frisians, and some other Germanic
peoples invaded the southeast part of Britain, forming England.  It is my
understanding that the Germanic language people were of more northernly stock
than the Celts (though modern Germany is in territory which Celts once called
home).  All of these Germanic language peoples were on the continent until
sometime in the Common Era, while the Celts had been in the British Isles for
at least half a millenia before the Germanic invasions.

              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: lori@newssun.med.miami.edu (Lori Herrington)
Subject: Hurricane Andrew
Organization: University Of Miami, Medical School
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 19:58:03 GMT

Merry meet all,

I have been a reader of this news group for some time so I feel now I can call on all of you for assistance.

Miami, has been devistated because of this storm.  Although I personally was not hit bad and even now have electricty, family and friends of mine have lost homes, cars and all worldly possestions.  we are all thankfull to be alive.

I am pleading that you and your communities help the victims of this hurricane. Donate to the red cross,  send food and supplies, call your congress men,  pray for us.....everything will help and will be greatly apreaciated.  

Remeber hte next time you get a tank of gas or get groceries...you are doing 
something that thousands once also took for granted...and now have no home.

thank you for whatever you can do....

Lori

Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Subject: Templars not Masons <was: Re: Who/what is Baphomet?>
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 05:28:33 GMT

altheimm@nextnet.csus.edu (Murray Altheim) writes:

>A number of Templar gravesites have been found in Scotland, and their is 
>fair evidence that at the very least they were influential in the Masonic
>Temple, and participated in a number of battles against the English.

Umm, Masonry didn't exist back then, according to all the scholarship I've 
seen which is not obviously conspiracy theory.  Eddie, can you help us out
with a date for the origins of Masonry?

              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)
From: txdv1@isuvax.iastate.edu (Angela KAY Rolling)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: home made?
Date: 1 Sep 92 21:20:00 GMT
Reply-To: txdv1@isuvax.iastate.edu
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa

Home made video only looks chinzy whin you alow it to. With a proper set up
you can maksome all right vidios. The original Night of the LivingDead was
home brewed-the ultamit B-Move. There is a copitition that hapens every
election year if not every year for home brewed comershals.

ELF-KIN Your setting a pritdy low limit for your selves.
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde)
Subject: Re: Bailing Out (rant) (was: Re: Freedom of Religion as well as everything else)
Followup-To: alt.pagan
Originator: lunde@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
Reply-To: Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde)
Organization: Ministry of Silly Walks
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 13:07:05 GMT

In article <krikket.6837@meltdown.chi.il.us> 
krikket@meltdown.chi.il.us (D. 'krikket' Krick) writes:
>As a long-haired liberal with an earring who openly is a Pagan and has Gay and
>Black friends, I suppose this includes me too... :)
[...]
>I don't know if I'm lucky because of the part of the country I'm in (Chicago)
>or what, but I have yet to run into a lot of this fanactism that people have
>been talking about.  (Although I did get fired from a "Student Supervisor"
>position at a H.S., because <a> I listened to the students <b> was HONEST with
>them <c> was close to their age (about 3 years difference between me and the
>students) which caused rumors to start, when I didn't hide anything.  I was
>fired when the rumors came back that I was a (gasp) PAGAN!  Had to keep the
>school free from controversy, dispite the facts...)
>
>But that kind of thing would have been bound to happen given a High School
>enviornment, and me.  But I have yet to see anything resembling Hitler-Like
>attitudes around me.
>
>What parts of the country is this taking place in?  Anywhere besides
>California, Washington (state), and Oregon?  (Yes, I know that is a hell of a
>lot, and I want to fight that much, but I'm still wonder how widespread this
>is.)  Quayle and Bush have been quoted a lot here in regards to the
>hate-mongering, and I don't doubt it.  But I wonder what the sources are, so I
>can get some people in my area stirred up against them?

Well, I'm spending most of my time in Evanston and in a selected part of 
Chicago (Hyde Park) which are bastions of liberal politics by today's
standards, so I don't see rabid right on my doorstep so often.  But I
think they are there -- in the Chicago metro area. Evanston and Chicago
have gay rights laws and significant Jewish and Moslem populations
(which is useful if you want to contain the "Christian nation" types.)

Lookup the votes on issues like abortion and gay rights laws and you 
can see where you stand with elected politicians.

I grew up on the far Northwest side of Chicago -- that area has spawned
notorious politicians like Henry Hyde(anti-abortion), Walter Dudych 
(anti-flag-burning), Penny Pullen(anti-gay rights, forced AIDS testing).

You may not see the same kind of political drive as elsewhere as it is
harder to place binding referenda on the ballot in Illinois.

>This year I'm voting Libertarian.

Not, I hope, a straight ticket.  I would point to Carol Mosley Brown
as someone it would be strongly in your interest to elect to the Senate.

And for everyone -- I would also encourage you to join the ACLU --
they support a broad range of civil liberities issues.

-- 
 Albert Lunde         | Interfaith  |     *Y*Y*      "A branch on the
 Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu |  Bisexual   |      *Y*        tree of life"
 alunde@nuacvm.bitnet |  Feminist   |.......|.........................
From: lib1p@jane.uh.edu (Tammy Stark Blandino)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Houston Area (Texas) Pagans
Date: 29 Aug 92 00:55:00 GMT
Organization: University of Houston
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41


Looking to correspond with some pagans in the Houston Area.
Please e-mail me at:

LIB1P@jetson.uh.edu

Thanks in advance and always

Blessed Be.

Tammy
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Eyes (was Re: Chocolate (was Re: "gangway, folx"))
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 92 11:52:25 EDT
Organization: Ailanthus Project

cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:

> Again, if we are going to carry this to its rightful conclusion, which
> you have stated above by saying that all true and correct Pagans have
> eyes like mine, that means that any Pagans who can see their hands in
> front of their face without corrective appliances in anything but strong
> sunlight are not real Pagans.  Paganism is blind, and so is love,
> therefore love is Paganism.
>
> Blessings,
> Janis the Poorly Sighted but Okay with Corrective Lenses
>
yay!  i DO have proper pagan eyes after all!  the color may not be correct, but
they function the same.  but i wear glasses (i don't trust contacts, and my
eyes are sensitive).  read a lot in your youth, janis?  and how FAR in front of
your face?

                                          -ailsa

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                    ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com
 I wish her insight to battle love's blindness            ________
 Strength from the milk of human kindness         Silence \      / Action
 A safe place for all the pieces that scattered      =     \    /    =
 Learn to pretend there's more than love           Death    \  /    Life
                                  that matters               \/
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Pagan fiction -- compiled list
From: canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson)
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 16:28:35 GMT
Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, MA

In article <1992Aug25.194023.23153@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz) writes:
>	Eric the Viking, by ?

	Eric the Viking is by Terry Jones (of Python Fame, yes.)

Carl

Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: lib1p@rosie.uh.edu (Tammy Stark Blandino)
Subject: Re: Fundies
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 10:21:00 GMT

In article <aZueqB1w165w@fennec.sccsi.com>, popec@fennec.sccsi.com (William C. Barwell) writes...


...deleted.....
>Over the years I have kept a bible in my desk at work.  From time to time 
>we will get in the occasional evangelical Xian who will try to 'Witness". 
>Those who insist on being pests or arguing, get Higher Bible Criticsim 
>from me personally.  It is amazing how a few well chosen bible verses and 
>a few well chosen words can stop these pests totally.  I have actually 
>seen grown men break down and cry.  I do not do this lightly or for every 
>xian.  Just those who won't take no for an answer.  Those who are sure 
>that non Xians are stupid and are not xians because we have never had it 
>all explained to us.  

Could you post or e-mail an example of how you combat those
who just won't take no for an answer?

I think we should all work on a way of enlightening people.  And
as a group stand up against those who would convert us.

I once was waiting on a bus late at night in downtown Houston.
(This was back when I was a college student.)  Some Xtians
were walking down the sidewalk passing out literature and saying
"Jesus loves you".  I remember refusing the tract and the person
walked on.  The person walking in the rear made it a point to
tell me that "Jesus loves you".  I replied "I know, but do *YOU*
love me"?  That seemed to bring her up short.  She never answered
my question but walked on.

Just a thought.

Tammy
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe)
Subject: Re: Proof: God's seal in the Bible
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 18:03:46 GMT


Please do not respond to this in the newsgroup.  This person will not see
responses here, most likely.  The appropriate place for responses is in email,
so that it is certain that the author will see the response.  This saves on
both bandwidth and the patience of the people in this newsgroup.  If we ignore
all Christian preaching in the newsgroup and comment directly in email, people
are not going to get the sort of satisfaction they are looking for.  This is
the subversive way to deal with the situation. :-)

              Merry meet, merry part, merry meet again,
                               Br'anArthur

Queer, Peculiar, and Wyrd! :-)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: altheimm@nextnet.csus.edu (Murray Altheim)
Subject: Re: Who/what is Baphomet?
Organization: California State University Sacramento
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 17:36:28 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.145118.18041@burrhus.harvard.edu> canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson) writes:
>In article <1992Aug28.020535.20478@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> pciszek@nyx.cs.du.edu (Paul Ciszek) writes:
>>Baphomet is the name of a god that Knights Templar were accused of praying
>>to an idol of.  The name probably comes from a degeneration of "Mahomet".
>>There is no evidence that the Templars actually *did* worship such a deity,
>>mind you.  There are some books that claim that Templars were (present tense,
>>at the time of the book) doing so, but they were written after there weren't
>>any more Templars, and are therefor as reliable as a WWN Exclusive interview
>>with Elvis.
>
>	The theory goes that the story arose from Templars out there in
>"Outremer" that had gone native and might have become Muslims.  From there
>the "media" just exagerated everything.
>	The Templars caught a lot of flak because they were a powerful
>political and military force - and thus they annoyed other powerful
>political and military forces ...
>
>Carl

Actually, it's not conjecture. Mohammed -> Mahomet -> Baphomet is correct.
The spelling of Mohammed was "Mahomet" in certain languages of the period.

The Templars were a Christian order charged with guarding the Temple of
Solomon, and in guarding Christian pilgrims on their trek to the Holy Land.

At the height of their power, they are said to have numbered 15,000 armed
knights. In 1317, the Inquisition brought them to trial on charges of
sodomy, praying to another god, and some other _strange_ acts. The Templars
were among the most worldly and travelled people in Europe, so it's not 
surprising that their access to other cultures would influence their views.

Part of the mystery surrounding them is why there was no evidence of struggle,
they all just laid down their arms and/or disappeared. Their treasure was 
never found, and other than Jacques de Molay, no other leaders were convicted.

A number of Templar gravesites have been found in Scotland, and their is 
fair evidence that at the very least they were influential in the Masonic
Temple, and participated in a number of battles against the English.

For a bit of fun, Lawrence Durrell includes the hunt for the Templar treasure
as well as a fairly accurate history in two of his fiction series, both
in the Alexandria Quartet, and especially his Avignon Quincunx (four books
around a central fifth text). Some people might not like his style -- he is
an inveterate word-crafter and very "thick", but among _my_ favorites.

Blessings, 

Murray

-- 
Murray M. Altheim      "Ils ont l'orteil de Bouc, & d'un Chevreil l'oreille,
Instructional Consultant    La corne d'un Chamois, & la face vermeille
CSU, Sacramento          Comme un rouge Croissant: & dancent toute nuict
altheimm@csus.edu       Dedans un carrefour, ou pres d'une eau qui bruict."
From: mad@spirit.spirit.clearpoint.com (Michael Davis)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Fundies: expensive
Date: 1 Sep 92 17:35:11 GMT
Organization: Walking Dead Man Bar and Grille

On 31 Aug 92 19:02:46 GMT, PA142138@utkvm1.utk.edu (Nancy Proctor) said:

[deleted]

Nancy> Another good source is _Adam,_Eve,_and_the_Serpent_ and also
Nancy> _The_Gnostic_ Gospels_, both by Elaine Pagels.  She's a well
Nancy> respected historian and teaches up north somewhere (Princeton,
Nancy> I think).  She goes all into the various myths that were used
Nancy> by the Hebrews and early Xians, and also explores the social
Nancy> conditions and priorities that made certain stories more
Nancy> acceptable than others.

I also liked _Testament_, by John(?) Romer.  It is about the Bible as
a document, and gives quite a bit of history about the inadequacy of
the Bible as anything other than a collection of mistranslated
archives.

On a related note, can anyone remember/post the cynical quotation that
in essence says:  "The bible is is book that was written by many
people, torn up in little pieces, the pieces shuffled around, taped
back together, and repeatedly mistranslated.  Many people therefore
believe this is a fine basis for a religion."

[more deleted]

Nancy> Blessings and may the eyes of our enemies be opened,

Nancy> Nancy

Blessings and Peace,

--
-mad

Michael A. Davis		mad@spirit.clearpoint.com

Clearpoint Research Corp. / 135 Parkwood Drive / Hopkinton, MA 01738
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz)
Subject: Re: HEAVEN
Organization: International Computer Science Institute, Berkeley, CA, U.S.A.
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:58:53 GMT

system@korova.uucp (razorback) writes:
> you know, some people say that the saftey of animals depends upon the 
> fact that every sense is utilitarian. why, then, were we blessed with 
> imagination that gave us everything we have now, including religion and 
> such?

Because it *is* utilitarian.  Let's imagine that there's some kind of
possible danger.  If you're able to imagine it as a possibility, then
you're more likely to be prepared for it if/when it happens.  That's
enough of an edge to benefit the species.

Imaginative Blessings!

		-- radzy

------------------------------------------------------------
					|  An it harm none,
	T. O. Radzykewycz	     	|  do as ye will.
	The Incredible Radical Cabbage	|
					|  "Just pray for a
	radzy@cogsci.berkeley.edu       |  tough hide and a
	        			|  tender heart."
	        			|    -- Ruth Graham
------------------------------------------------------------
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