From: kuntal@mercury.cs.umbc.edu (survivor)
Subject: feuding by II's ? ... or IA's ??!!!!  attn : alok v.
Organization: University of Maryland Baltimore Campus, Computer Science Department
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 01:18:58 GMT


before I start my post, 
reproduced here are relevant portions of what alok@cbnewsi.cb.att.com wrote :

[i have the full text of that letter for reference, in case ...]

> >2) IAs generally have a positive view of USA and its culture, etc.
> >That is why they chose to reside here permanently or became the citizens of
> >USA. IIs on the other hand are usually bragging about India and condemning US
> 					^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> are you ashamed of being from India ?  (no underlying sarcasm here !)
> 

Yes, lately I have felt ashamed of being from INdia, with all these
human rights violations and suppression going on there.

And then there are things like poverty, malnutrition, sickness, diseases,
dirt, pollution, wide disparities between rich and poor, ever present social
problems etc. In summary situation is very dismal even if one hopes for 
economic revival. Nobody seems to be doing anything about it. Instead
they are busy feuding.

I am ashamed of the general attitude of the Indians (Not all). It is very 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
fatalistic or 'self-destructive'. There are few
bright spots and individual Indians (I have met) with right attitude.

> 
> >USA (Evidence SCI postings). They would rather stick to the old traditions 
> 			      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >and ancient culture of India. 
>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> I suspect this reeks of contempt. 


No, but I certainly am very disapointed with lack of pragmatism and vision.
It is as if people are very content with outdated traditions and culture.
They are so content that even after coming to USA, they are imposing them
on their children. They are making them an alien in this land. They
are violating the human rights of their very own children. It is 
disgusting.

> Were you not the person who was promoting
> the joys of touring Rajasthan some time ago ?

Sure, as I said there are few bright spots.  I still find Rajasthani
people being relatively sober. There are few conflicts there. There is lot of
history and culture to be proud of. People are very courteous and 
spirited despite harsh climatic conditions. They are not out to 'kill'.

Even in USA, I have seen them taking 'Indian' stand before 'Rajasthani'
stand. They don't portray themselves like 'Punjabi', "Gujarati', "Tamil', 
'Telugu', and blah, blah ... They portray themselves as Indians first
(now Indian-American first :-), and then as Rajasthani.

I have felt proud of them and I did enjoy touring Rajasthan, and hence
the series on Rajasthan.


Ofcourse the other objective in posting that series was to motivate some
'foreigners' (now country-mates :-) to visit INdia so that valuable 
foreign exchange could be earned in India.

> Now, are you trying to disown your roots ? 
> 
Not at all, but I am certainly questioning them.
> 
> >Furthermore they seem to suffer from feuding 
> >on the basis of caste, language, region, religion etc. even after coming to 
> >USA.
> 
> just like this feud about IA's and II's ? ;-)



my post begins now :

You said "I am ashamed of the general attitude of the Indians (Not all)."
You then say "I have felt proud of them ( Rajasthanis ) ..."

Please be in forthright in telling us exactly what are you trying to imply 
with these two statements !
I would love to put these on SCI and see what the people out there have to say 
on it ! But then we can do without more of bad blood, can't we ?

You say, "Furthermore they seem to suffer from feuding on the basis of caste,
language, region, religion etc. even after coming to USA"

You then say, "Even in USA, I have seen them taking 'Indian' stand before 
'Rajasthani' stand. They don't portray themselves like 'Punjabi', "Gujarati', 
"Tamil', 'Telugu', and blah, blah ... They portray themselves as Indians first
(now Indian-American first :-), and then as Rajasthani."

Now, Mr. Alok Vijayvargia, what do you have to say to this ? In one summary
statement you have tried to put almost all people except Rajasthanis in bad 
light ! 

And please don't hide behind the excuse that I have pulled your statements out
of context ! The letter is there for everyone to see !

I don't grudge you pointing out somethings undesirable in certain people. But 
then in the same breath you try to portray a particular class as being perfect
( or almost ), which is the same "feuding" that has so upset you !

Let me point out that when you say "there is a lot of history and culture to 
be proud of ...", the same laudable culture also bore mute
witness to Roop Kunwar's fate ! And in which child marriages are still 
patronized.

Before you rush to point out that these may be happening in other cultures too,
note the fact that I (* unlike you *) am not singling out any culture to praise
and a host of others to criticize ( directly or by implication ) !

So, try to stop being chauvinistic in your opinions. To sit in judgement on 
cultures of India and give personal opinions ( biased ones at that ) on a 
public net ( I hope it isn't your feifdom !) isn't exactly what a IA 
(by _your_ standards) should be doing in USA !!

I am a gujarati ( a class of people on whom you have put a blanket accusation
of being parochial or whatever !)
I don't want to contest that. Perhaps you chose to come in contact only with 
those gujaratis whom you now condemn.

And I have nothing against Rajasthanis. In fact (as my ancestry can be traced
to the border region of the two states ) I have many relatives who belong to
THAT category of people who do you proud ;-) !

regards,
Kuntal Sanghvi

Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian.american