HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: vsh@etnibsd.uucp (Steve Harris)
Subject: Re: boots
Organization: Eaton Corp, Semiconductor Equipment Div., Beverly, MA
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 21:11:53 GMT

re: boot recommendations.

I believe you can buy Bean's Maine Hunting Shoe with a Vibram sole.

Since you're posting from Brown, I assume you live in New England --
you really should visit Peter Limmer & Sons bootmakers in Intervale, NH
(just up the road from North Conway).  They're open on Saturdays, but
NEVER during lunch hour (12 to 1, as I recall).  Call ahead (sorry, I
don't have the number handy).

They have been cutom making their boots for many years; "Limmers" are
the boot of choice for the AMC trail crew and hut workers.  They're
quite reasonably priced for a custom boot.  However, the lead time may
be a deterrent, last I heard it was about 8 months.

Some people claim that Limmers are just an Austrian work boot with
vibram soles -- that may be so, but I wouldn't trade mine in for any
number of so-called "hiking" boots.

Even if you don't buy a pair of Limmers, you really should visit the
shop if you're in the area.

-- 
... Steve Harris - Eaton Corp. - Beverly, MA - uunet!etnibsd!vsh
From: spollock@milton.u.washington.edu (Steven Pollock)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Skiing Crater Lake
Summary: Looking for info...
Date: 4 Sep 92 17:22:46 GMT
Organization: University of Washington


Anyone ever done a winter circumnavigation of Crater Lake?

We're planning on going this December, and there are some things that
would be real useful to know -  like f'rinstance, is it likely there'll
be enough snow by early December?! How many days seem reasonable for the
trip? (we're figuring 3-4) How hilly is the route - would skins be
useful/critical?  Any other handy tips? Thanks in advance - and please
email directly (I'll summarize if I get much information)

Steve Pollock - pollock@ben.npl.washington.edu

Obl. stolen quote: "Free your heels, and your mind will follow"
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: buick@belay (Patrick D. Buick)
Subject: Re: Svea 123R
Keywords: memories of Svea
Organization: Belay Enterprises Inc. Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 00:53:39 GMT

In article <1992Aug29.211714.3682@darwin.ntu.edu.au> daryl@rt2.menzies.su.edu.au (Daryl Webb) writes:
>In article <1992Aug28.212201.16339@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu> tom@afthree.as.arizona.edu (Thomas J. Trebisky) writes:
>>
>>Also at a swap meet bought this big Primus/Optimus stove.
>>It is box like with a brass tank cylinder inside.  When you open the box
>>up, this hinge section in front moves forward and the tank slides forward
>>along with it.
>>
>>Anybody know what this is?
>>I did fire it up once, but now it is waiting in my shed for some group
>>camping venture when I think I need it's "firepower".
>>Someone told me I can get exchangeable tips for it and burn everything
>>from white gas, to kerosene and diesel feul.
>
>Sounds like an Optimus 8R to me, big solid blue case, brass tank etc.  Used
>to call them CHOOFERS, cause thats what they do. *(-: 
>
>You need to be careful using big pots on them.  If the brass tank gets too
>hot the pressure relief valve in the fill cap releases and you end up with a
>very impressive roman candle (and singed eyebrows).  Same as a blow out on
>SVEA's and 00's.  I think they run Kero but I'm not 100% sure.  If you cant
>find out else where  E-mail me and I'll look it up.
>

Hmm.. I just looked in my '84 catalog (yes, I keep them).. and 
It could be an 8R, but if it is *big* it could be an Optimus 111
or Optimus 199.  The 8R is 13x13x8 cm, the 111 is 18x17x10 cm and
the 199 is 12x12x10 cm (packed sizes).  The 111 and 199 use triple
fuel being: White Naptha, Kerosene, or Alcohol.

I'll plagiarize the old catalog for you:

Optimus 111 and 199 Triple Fuels.  These two classic Optimus stoves
are now fitted up with a new burner which allows use of white gas, 
kerosene or alcohol.  This obvious convenience is somewhat counterbalanced
by the additional weight.  Also, our tests indicate that the burner
is optimised for kerosene, and that the heat output of the new system
is lower than that of the older models.  Finally, note that extended
use of alcohol requires an air restrictor (included) and special jet
and the tool to change it (optional) for best efficiency.  The 111TF
comes complete with large volume tank and built-in pump; the 199TF
includes the Optimus Mini-pump.

There you go...
Patrick
-- 
==========================================================
Patrick D. Buick EMT, EET  | Internet: buick%belay@uunet.uu.net
Belay Enterprises Inc.     | Internet: buickp@cuug.ab.ca
Calgary, Alberta, Canada   | UUCP:...!calgary!pixel!belay!buick
From: phil@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com (Phil English)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: LOS PADRES INFO WANTED
Keywords: LOS PADRES INFO WANTED
Date: 2 Sep 92 13:51:25 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Santa Cruz, CA.


	Am looking for a nice place to go in the Northern Los Padres 
Forrest, South of Monterey, California. Any information about specific 
trails or camps is appreciated. Please EMAIL resp.
					-Phil
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: marty@amaterasu.physics.uiuc.edu (Marty Gelfand)
Subject: Re: Exploding fuel bottles
Organization: Dept. of Physics, Univ. of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 06:37:37 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.200246.895@ncar.ucar.edu> sheehan@pagosa.scd.ucar.edu (Tim Sheehan) writes:
>A friend recently told me that Sigg fuel bottles are not 
>reinforced at the bottom and as a result, have been known
>to explode. She told me that MSR fuel bottles are reinforced
>and that I should switch.
>[...]
  Just some more fuel bottle miscellany: plastic fuel bottles can be
chewed through by marauding porcupines (as well as boots, of course).
I learned about this during a recent trip in Rocky Mountain NP.
Aluminum bottles are safe from this threat, I trust?

marty gelfand  marty@amaterasu.physics.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: AS.MSW@forsythe.stanford.edu (Marc Whitney)
Subject: Re: boots
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 16:55:07 GMT

In article <Sep03.012255.63196@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>,
trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna) writes:
>And don't believe anything a sales-clerk in a mountaineering store tells
>you.  Just yesterday one of them told me when I asked for PVC coated
>rain-wear, and I quote, "Coated nylon isn't really waterproof.  It's
>water resistant.  If you want waterproof, then Gortex is really about
>the only thing that works."  I looked at him and thought about the two
>weeks I'd just spent in the rain, about sitting in a puddle of water
>in my inflatable kayak floating among the giant logs, root balls,
>and other flood swept debris rumbling over the river rock, about how
>I'd wrung my gortex out like a sponge, and about taking all my clothing
>off and going nude whenever I had to leave the tent briefly,
>rather than wear the gortex, as that brought the least moisture back
>into the tent with me.  I thought about how to respond.  Then I just
>walked away and found the PVC garments myself.
>
Ah!  Another Gortex skeptic.  A number of years ago Patagonia came
out with non-breathable rain gear.  They seem to have taken a lot of
heat because of the non-breathability.  I wore this stuff for two
weeks in northern England when they had one "summer" storm after
another come in off the the north Atlantic.  (I haven't figured out
yet how the ground got wet as the rain came in hoizontally -- we
spent days leaning at 45 degress just to stay upright.)  Result was
that I could care less about breathability.  To me water proof now
means impenatrability under pressure.  The Patagonia stuff passed
the test.  BTW, at the time the price was about half of the
equivalent Gortex product.  Since then Patagfonia has certainly
changed its pricing strategy.
From: tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Water treatment article from Am J Pub Health (1989)
Date: 2 Sep 92 18:14:53 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: cairo

ed@titipu.meta.com (Edward Reid) writes:
> 
> A survey of sizes ... from the June 1992 issue of Backpacker.
> 
>     1.0   micron    *** Pur filter pores
>     0.6   microns   large virus
>     0.4   microns   *** First Need filter pores
>     0.4   microns   smallest bacteria
>     0.2   microns   *** Katadyn filter pores
>     0.004 microns   smallest virus

Certainly .4 microns for the smallest bacteria is a mistake.  Microbiology
textbooks say that E. coli can be as small as .3 microns, and there are
other bacteria (not necessarily harmful) just as small.  E. coli can cause
gastroenteritis, and are transmitted by livestock.  This is one reason why
we stopped using First Needs (clogging is the other reason).

Also, I doubt that any virus is as large as .6 microns.  Maybe a virus
attached to a cell, but not the virus itself.  My impression is that many
viruses are not visible using optical microscopes.

So I'm satisfied that the Pur filter removes giardia.  But given the long
contact times required for iodine to kill giardia (see the AJPH article),
what's to make anybody think similar contact times are not required for
iodine to kill bacteria and viruses?  I don't understand how water passing
quickly thru an iodine matrix could have sufficient contact time.
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: molnar@Bisco.CAnet.CA (Tom Molnar)
Subject: Top notch outdoor gear in SF?
Organization: UTCS Campus Access
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 15:02:32 GMT


Greetings.  Would some kind soul point me at some of the best outdoor
gear stores in San Fransisco?  I may get a chance to travel down there
and I'd like to check out the better stores.  I'm looking for backpacking/
hiking/climbing/canoeing clothing & gear.  Which stores have good prices
on patagionia, TNF etc?

Thanks,
Tom Molnar
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Re: Water treatment article from Am J Pub Health (1989)
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 23:06:32 GMT

On 1 Sep 1992 22:26:40 GMT, tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill) said:

Bill> Has anybody seen the H20K, the Pocket Filter, or the Pocket Purifier
Bill> in action (or more precisely, in inaction)?

I have an H2OK.  We use it in conjunction with iodine in third-world
countries.  Iodine to kill eveything and then filtering to get rid of
the iodine and the rest of the stuff.  It works quite well and I'm
very pleased with it.

We've never gotten anything from the water using it.

It's not small, though.  Something like 3 in. in diameter and maybe
7 or 8 inches high.  I just put it in a suitcase and have porters
and bellmen everywhere, so I don't much care.

--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "There's no kill like a guns kill." LCDR "Hoser" Satrapa, gunnery instructor
                       "A kill is a kill."  Anonymous

Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: allen%asylum.cs.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Allen Sanderson)
Subject: Re: Exploding fuel bottles
Date: 27 Aug 92 10:42:31 MDT
Organization: University of Utah CS Dept

In article <1992Aug26.220119.15768@ncar.ucar.edu> chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu writes:
>The bottom of my Sigg bottle, that I use with my MSR Whisperlite,
>"blew out" (i.e. like a frozen soda).  I think this was from leaving
>the bottle pressurized all the time, with constant 5000' elevation
>changes & 40 degree temperature swings.  The integrity of the bottle
>seems fine, but it will not stand up on the bottom.
>

I have a Sigg bottle with same anominally, mine got its from being full
of fuel and being at 35,000 feet.  Good thing it did not explode since
I probably be in jail (or dead) right now.  (It is illegal to transport
fuel on comercial airplanes)

Allen


Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: leonam@vccsouth28.its.rpi.edu (Marcus B. Leonard)
Subject: Re: Thread Sizes (was: Exploding fuel bottles)
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 13:37:52 GMT

In article <BtovH7.810@fulcrum.bt.co.uk> igb@fulcrum.bt.co.uk (Ian G Batten) writes:
>> On 27 Aug 92 16:09:44 GMT, gascan@dcst16.dc (Bill Gascoyne) said:
>>  Anyone else notice that, along about a year or two ago, MSR changed the thread
>>  size on the Whisperlite and their fuel bottles, so you can no longer buy a

>Could someone confirm this?  I have had a Whisperlite for a few years
>and was planning to buy a second one for when I want to cook something
>more interesting (when we are boot-packing (truck-packing to the
>Americans)).   If the threads are different --- so I'd have to label the
>fuel bottles to use them with the ``right'' pump --- it would be a
>severe pain.

   I bought a Whisperlight International and a Sigg bottle at REI three months
ago, and they fit just fine.
   However, if you are going to carry two stoves, you may want to consider two
different models.  I spent 51 days canoeing in Canada last summer, carrying the
Whisperlight and a Peak 1.  The Whisperlight was for boiling things, while the
Peak 1 was for simmering, cooking biscuits, and other tasks that required more
temperature selection between 'off' and 'too damn hot'.

				Marc Leonard
				leonam@rpi.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: paulxxxx@leland.Stanford.EDU (paulastya gupta)
Subject: boots info?
Keywords: asolo 
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 92 16:15:59 GMT

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone had any experience with Asolo's AFS Ridge boots.
It is an all-purpose on and off trail plus mountaineering boot, partly plastic
and partly leather.
They are expensive but are they worth the steep price tag?

Also, any other suggestions for a multi-purpose boot?
Thanks!
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: sheehan@pagosa.scd.ucar.edu (Tim Sheehan)
Subject: Exploding fuel bottles
Organization: NCAR/UCAR
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 20:02:46 GMT

A friend recently told me that Sigg fuel bottles are not 
reinforced at the bottom and as a result, have been known
to explode. She told me that MSR fuel bottles are reinforced
and that I should switch.

Does anyone know anything about this. My guess is that it
could happen with a pressurized fuel bottle (one that is 
being used as the fuel tank such as with an MSR Whisperlite)
but I have my doubts that this would happen with a fuel
bottle that is just used to carry fuel.

I use an old Svea 123 stove which has its own fuel tank, so
I never pressurize my fuel bottle. So, do I need to worry
about blowing up on the trail?

Any info is appreciated.
-- 
-Tim-

sheehan@ncar.ucar.edu
From: masticol@cadenza.rutgers.edu (Steve Masticola)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Svea 123R
Date: 27 Aug 92 14:30:29 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

Perhaps, then, the prudent Svea user should put a little piece of
rubber hose around the end of the filler cap when the stove is not in
use, to prevent it from getting dinged. And replace it at the first
sign of any dents, and carry the original cap on trips, just in case.

Svea 123R - primitive, noisy, nasty, reliable. I love mine :-)

- Steve (masticol@cs.rutgers.edu).
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: dadams@cray.com (David Adams)
Subject: Re: No dogs in Natl Parks
Reply-To: dadams@cray.com
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 26 Aug 92 15:30:28 CDT

 ecologycntr@igc.apc.org (Ecology Center Fund) writes:
|
| What I was referring to was
|the sense of satisfaction that comes from seeing a track of a canine and
|_knowing_ it's wild. If you've felt this you'll know what i mean, and if
|you haven't, I feel sorry for you.
|

Yep them's the tracks of wild mongrel dogs alright.  ;^)


---
--David C. Adams     dadams@cray.com
___________________________________________________________________
       member--Minnesotans for Global Warming.
From: buick@belay (Patrick D. Buick)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Saranac Lake Islands camping
Date: 30 Aug 92 16:17:24 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Belay Enterprises Inc. Calgary, Alberta, Canada

In article <1992Aug25.152548.8802@bnr.ca> Tim Dudley <dudley.chi@xerox.com> writes:
>Just got back from a week of camping on the Lower Saranac lake, 
>and thought I'd warn people off of it.  The lake is gorgeous, with 
>campgrounds on the islands, but the lake is/was full of power boats,
>water skiers, and bass boats, most of the time at speed.  One cluster
>of four bass boat owners had a generator running most of the night
>(in order to light their party, I guess), and spent considerable time
>during the day having races.
>
>All in all, it was without question the noisiest week I've had outdoors
>ever, anywhere.  I'd strongly recommend that, unless you're into
>power boats, that you avoid the place like the plague.
>
>Tim
>
>"Sink the Bass Boats!"
>Me, after a week on Lower Saranac Lake

There isn't a clue in your posting or headers as to where Lower
Saranac Lake is... I might want to make a not of it if I were to
be in the area in the future, but.....
-- 
==========================================================
Patrick D. Buick EMT, EET  | Internet: buick%belay@uunet.uu.net
Belay Enterprises Inc.     | Internet: buickp@cuug.ab.ca
Calgary, Alberta, Canada   | UUCP:...!calgary!pixel!belay!buick
From: chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu (Chris Webster)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: No dogs in Natl Parks
Date: 27 Aug 92 16:44:10 GMT
Reply-To: chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu
Organization: Research Aviation Facility, NCAR, Boulder, CO

nancy@jpl-devvax.jpl.nasa.gov (Nancy Feagans) writes:
>
>This thread brings to mind another consideration about taking dogs into
>the backcountry.  What would you do if you were backpacking in a remote
>area and your dog was seriously injured?  

What would you do if a person in your party was seriously
injured?  This does not apply to just dogs.

--Chris
From: deannab@hpmwtd.sr.hp.com (Deanna Bergstrom)
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 22:46:54 GMT
Subject: Re: WAS: Mono Pass...     BEARS! (Oh my!)
Organization: HP Santa Rosa Site (NMD MTA MWTD)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry

My boyfriend, an experienced backpacker, went on a 1-week trip from
Tuolome Meadows in late May.  On the first night,he carefully hung his 
food on the
appropriately sized branch (one too small to support a bear's weight), 
out a ways from the trunk.  He woke up to some noise and climbed out of
the tent to see one bear taking off with his food and another bear just
coming out of the tree.  He yelled at them but lost his food.  The bears
are getting smarter all the time...now they're working in teams!

He spent the next day returning to civilization, ending his trip
6 days early, trying to figure out how to get back at the bears.....or
at least discourage them next time.  Perhaps a packet of red pepper flakes
in the food bag would be negative reinforcement, if a bear DID get at
your food....
From: karlm@sequent.com (Karl Maerz)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Oregon Wallowas...pack animals
Date: 26 Aug 92 23:50:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Aug26.235043.1875
Distribution: usa
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.

tucker@shiva.UUCP (George Tucker) writes:
 | Horses are ok in their proper place, but the central Sierra is not 
 | their place.  The space is small and heavily used, the trails are 
 | steep and rocky, and vegetation is sparse and fragile.  

I agree that horses (or other stock animals) are inappropriate in
fragile environments.  I think a valid exception might be if the
area must be passed through to get somewhere else, but with strict
conditions (ie, through travel only, no camping, no nothing).

Heavy use is an issue by itself.  You can't blame horse people 
because an area is popular.  And simply banning horses from said
area without taking other measures to reduce use impact is not
only grossly unfair, but ineffective as well.

 | Keep the horses in the plains and hills and deserts and lush 
 | meadows, and off the major backpack trails even there. 

In an ideal world hikers, equestrians, bikers, etc., would have
their own trails and not have to worry about other classes of
user.  In Oregon there are many trails which are marked explicitly
for hiking and/or equestrian use.  I don't ride my horses on trails
where I am officially uninvited and try to avoid crowded trails
for much the same reasons anyone else does -- I can get crowds
at the mall, thanks.  As a horseman, I must also consider the
safety factor of trying to negotiate congestion with my horse.  So,
you see, I don't particularly like having a lot of people around
either.  Nor do I know any other horsepeople who do.

In areas where there are explicit hiking and equestrian trails I am 
more than happy to stay on my turf.  I must also mention that the
explicitly marked horse trails seem to be popular with hikers, too
(not to mention mountain bikes, which are officially uninvited from
them).  I encounter at least as many hikers as other horses when
I ride these trails, so I conclude there are at least some people who 
don't object to equines... :)

Sometimes, though, the major hiking trail is the *only* trail, and 
in those cases we're just going to have to share.  I see no reason
why this has to be an unpleasant experience for anyone.

 | You can get your meaningful experience where it doesn't ruin mine.

Very true, and I am more than happy to do so.  Just keep in mind
that if we do run into each other and it ruins your whole trip,
well, frankly, its your problem, not mine.

 | 	 George Tucker        tucker@tcville.hac.com

Karl Maerz
karlm@sequent.com
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: ssnyder@sunai.er.usgs.gov (Steve Snyder)
Subject: Re: Svea 123R
Keywords: memories of Svea
Organization: Who me??  
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 18:55:35 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.144403.17552@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com> toddl@ecs.comm.mot.com (Todd Leigh) writes:
>The second person I ever went backpacking with owned a Svea 123.  He called
>it his possessed stove because at times it would "flame on" and he couldn't
>ever figure out why...  He got himself an MSR XGK and never went back.
>[stuff]
>Most of the stories I've read here about the Svea sound like parents fond
>of a troublesome child swapping stories of its exploits.
>
I have personally witnessed the self-destruction of a Svea 123. Flames
2-3 feet high, quite impressive actually.

Steve

From: edb@hpgrla.gr.hp.com (Ed Beshore)
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 20:40:21 GMT
Subject: Re: Merrell balks, REI Refunds!
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Greeley, CO
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry

In rec.backcountry, jahn@guinness.Idbsu.EDU (Greg Jahn) writes:

>I wonder. I was told by a fellow in a local shop (NOTE NOTE NOTE: This
>means maybe true, maybe just rumour????), that one of the two types of
>Biwell wax-stuff that you use to treat leather MAY react with the barge
>cement between the sole and leather uppers in such a way as to cause
>the sole to peel off.  The guy suggested trying to keep the wax away from
>the crease.  Has anyone else heard this?  If it's true, I'm surprised
>the boot manufacturers aren't mentioning it ... it'd be to everyone's
>best interest to know.

I haven't heard this about the Bi-Well class applications, but some
of the spray Silicon waterproofing agents have been suspected for some
time by folks in this forum.