HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: phantom@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (James Choi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: woman's fate?
Date: 14 Oct 92 03:01:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.1992Oct14.030105.16049
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.

Maybe there wasn't enough time yet.  But the lack of response for Mr.
Daeshik Kim's posting (which included some serious accusations such as "sick
mind") serves as a living example of the way Korean women were trained to
act.  "just take it" is what they have been taught, and you are seeing it
in action.

The only female response I have seen as of now is from Ms. Yongmi Kim who
is self described as not so traditional Korean, or who got out of the
system because she could not stand it.

So, a traditional Korean female getting into a discussion like this is a
contradiction in terms.  On the other hand, a traditional Korean male
getting into this dicussion of the "women's fate" is a redundant statement.
That said, allow me to express my view.

In article <1992Oct13.172234.17552@eng.umd.edu> dskim@eng.umd.edu (Daeshik Kim) writes:
>I feel that unless this mentality of female changes, there'll
>be no equal treatment - this wouldn't come easy even they want it
>desperately but with this kind of attitue, no way.

I tend to have simplistic views on events.  I am one of those who see
complex events as a sum of simple ones.

In this case of "woman's fate", I attempt to categorize it to another case
of "supply and demand."  In that light, do not blame the women because they
are doing exactly what the market dictates.  Women's mentality will change
even against any obstacle if the demand of the market changes.  The same
goes for men's mentality.  The notorious domestic dictators, also known as
Korean men, will change their behavior if more women walk out on them
and/or get a divorce.  Or better yet (in the spirit of preventive
maintenance) if women do not marry who would not "do the dishes and mob the
floor" so to speak.

As it is the case in any social issue, the cause and the consequence is not
clear.  But there is something both men like Mr. Dae Shik Kim and women
like Ms. Yong Mi Kim can do today.  For men, do not get married to women
who do not have her independent life and only degree she wants is Mrs
degree.  For women, either "vote with foot" as Ms.  Kim did, or just refuse
to take an ornamental post of the man of your choice.

When there is enough of these people, the balance will shift, and as it is
the case with most stuff in Korea, it will be TRENDY to be independent.
Then, you have got it made. 

Then again, if any change is this simple, I would have cured the world
hunger by now.

>	Daeshik Kim

James Choi
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: dskim@eng.umd.edu (Daeshik Kim)
Subject: Re: woman's fate?
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 11:17:09 GMT
Organization: Univ. of Maryland, College Park

In article <7673@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> hnkst2+@pitt.edu (Hanhwe N Kim) writes:
> 
>The lifestyle portrayed in the TV drama fits only a wealthy 
>minority of Koreans. Even for many families who were better off, women have
>had to work in order to save enough for more decent housing and to
>ensure a decent education for their children.  Many women have had to 
>work whether they wanted to or not.

	We all know the real & unreal boundary of TV drama;
	however, what really bothered me was not the story
	line or the actor's behavior, but the tone that
	took those as usual/granted matter, 'fate & happiness
	of woman', 'being successful career woman == being single',
	'Mother/Father teaching their son/daughter in this way' - I
	think this is kinda brainwash.

	Out of the line, would you hire young single woman right
	out from College if you know she'll resign after marriage;
	or would you promote young single female worker into important
	position if you know she'll resign after marriage, if you
	are in position who can decide above matter?

	I won't w/o written contract that she won't resign only due to
	her marriage; even it would be same for male if he does the same.
-- 
	Daeshik Kim	H: (703)273-1517 O: (703) 689-5878
	/PN=Daeshik.Kim/O=SprintIntl/ADMD=Telemail/C=US/@Sprint.com
	dskim@eng.umd.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin)
Subject: Re: Jungshindae
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 19:16:56 GMT

In article <1992Oct10.084821.16228@husc3.harvard.edu> plee@husc10.harvard.edu (Paul Lee) writes:
>means, I would recommend reading this article.  In fact, if there is
>a call for an on-line posting of the article, I will take the time to
>keystroke it in.  I would only caution that it is disturbing.  I almost
>cried.

Do us a favor of typing it in.  I would like to read it.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: jhao@hila.hut.fi (Jixiang Hao)
Subject: Re: Soc.culture.china (was Re: Roh visits china)
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 16:33:09 GMT


In article <1992Oct10.205314.9706@news.cs.indiana.edu> jysuh@moose.cs.indiana.edu (Suh Jung Yul) writes:
>If one has to assert one's nationalism by subjugating and oppressing other
>ethnic group in the name of rescuing them from feudal yoke (that is what
>some Chinese says, "liberating the Tibetans"), This is beyond the nationalism
>                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>as in "loving one's country".

I sincere suggest you to read some historic book,   Pal.  :-(

Or simply because I was brain-washed so you could not make me understood ?

CCP's slogan was liberation the whole country.  PLA stands for People's
Liberation army.  Or was that my poor understanding which has shown from
very beginneng ?

>Chinese expands by populating occupied land with Chinese.

 So were every expantionists.

> While this
>cannot provide you with fast expansion, it is surest and irreversible.
>If you add 30 million Chinese to 3 millon natives, natives will be a
>minority in their homeland and eventually disappear by assimilation.

Do you suggest that every readers of USENET is using their dear mam/dad's
account ?

>It is known that Chinese regime pressure Tibetan to marry Chinese,

 Very new to me.   May I ask the source ?   Don't bother to tell me if
 it's from *wisdom publication house*.

>brought in many Han-Chinese to Tibet, and relocates Tibetans neighboring
>Chinese provinces.
>This kind of systematic policy is no different than what Japan tried to
>do during their occupation.
>And this policy can be effective basically to neighoring countries, of
>which Korea is the one.

 Do you suggest that we should compare what Chinese doing to ethnic Korean
chinese in China with what Japanese doing to ethnic Korean Japanese in Japan ? 

I am sorry, I have not gotten my PH.D yet. So you tell me the comparation.

>>The ultra-nationalists on soc.culture.china are probably the
>>least of the worries.  
>The point, however, is that they do seem to reflect the majority view of
>Chinese in the net, which are probably best educated of Chinese.

It is getting higher and higher, I am sure this days.

As China graduatly become somebody's lying bed or lying target.


Regard,


Hao Jixiang
From: v100ra7t@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (O.G.)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: This is only a test, so please ignore.
Date: 9 Oct 92 15:37:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: acsu.Bvv22B.52
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

Hi.  I've been having problems posting for a while, so I'm just testing.
From: mk568652@longs.lance.colostate.edu (Mitchell Kotler)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: western culture suck shit!!
Date: 15 Oct 92 18:31:37 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO  80523

In article <1992Oct15.135307.21049@udel.edu>, shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin) writes:
|> >>In article <Oct09.225605.98314@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> mk568652@longs.LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Mitchell Kotler) writes:
|> >>>       THAT'S WHAT DENNY WONG WROTE.  HEY , IT SEEMS LIKE YOU DON'T
|> >>>KNOW YOUR HISTORY!    EVERY COUNTRY ON THIS PLANET IS GUILTY OF SOME
|> >>>SORT OF RACISM, ESPECIALLY KOREA.  IN KOREA, JAPANESE PEOPLE   ARE  HATED
|> >>>IN  SOME PLACES.  THAT'S RIDICULOUS.   WE CAN'T GO ON LIVING  WITH  THE  PAST
|> >>>IF  WE ARE  EVER  GOING TO HAVE PEACE  IN THIS WORLD!   WE ARE  ALL GUILTY,
|> 
|> I wrote:
|> >>Mister, what do you know of living with the past?  
|> 
|> In article <1473700044@igc.apc.org> An-Ly Yao <anlyyao@igc.apc.org> writes:
|> >Monsieur, quite aggressive, isn't it?
|> >By the way: not to know about living in the past is bad, but still to live
|> >in the past is worse.
|> >
|> >Goetz
|> 
|> Not sure what's so aggressive but quite true that living in the past per se 
|> could be far worse.  But one needs to distinguish what to forget and what 
|> to remember and how to do it for what purpose.
|> Koreans look forward for future for our own good.  Period. But Koreans do 
|> not forget the past because symbolisms of militaristic Japanese imperialism 
|> is alive and well in Japan and *not* *being* *fully* *accounted* *for* (for 
|> example, last thing was that Japanese government concluding that Japanese 
|> government could not determine how 'comfort girls' were taken to their fate), 
|> and forgetting past for the sake of forgetting it simple insanity.  
|> 




I guess that means that you have the right to hate ALL Japanese people, 
whether they live in Japan , the U.S., or Brazil. That's right, hate them 
all, even the ones who aren't raised in the Japanese culture and are as
American as you.  Hate the ones who know nothing about current 
Japanese imperialism.    You know, you're one smart dude.
From: lim@rani.chem.yale.edu (Dongchul Lim)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: Visiting Korea
Date: 9 Oct 92 17:06:26 GMT
Organization: Yale University
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

tcheung@cc.uow.edu.au (teresa cheung) writes:
: I will be visiting Korea in December of this year.
: 
: Can anyone give me information on affordable accomadation in Pusan
: and Seoul, such as YWCA, YMCA or youth hostels.  
: 
: Also, I am interested in information about cites and attractions.
: 
: Thank you, Teresa.

Gee, in December it'll be too cold to go sightseeing. Nevertheless
in Seoul, the places I liked most were "KyungBok Palace" and 
"Biwon (= Secret Garden)". These are part of Yi Dynasty's palaces.
In Pusan area, KyungJu city, where was once the capital of Silla
Kindom (1500-2000 years ago), is likely to be the place you should
see. 

-dcl

--
********************************************************************
* Dongchul Lim                   | Phone (203) 432-6288            *
* Dept. of Chemistry, Yale Univ. | Email: lim@rani.chem.yale.edu   *
* 225 Prospect Street            |            (130.132.25.65)      *
* New Haven, CT 06511            |                                 *
********************************************************************
From: anlyyao@igc.apc.org (An-Ly Yao)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: western culture suck shit!!
Date: 9 Oct 92 14:01:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:netnews.upenn.edu:92211:cdp:1473700043:000:368
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!anlyyao    Oct  9 07:01:00 1992


I am quite careful to speak about "Eastern" culture. Also "Western"
culture comes in different variations.

However, in your critizism on "Western" culture you selected a "Western"
language and then only a quite low level subset from that language. Perhaps
you also have an similarily limited understanding for the "Western" culture
itself.

Goetz
anlyyao@igc.apc.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: phantom@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (James Choi)
Subject: Re: American open system
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 05:13:26 GMT

I wrote:
I would like to see this kind of open system succeed than a tightly
garded, through-personal-connections-only type of system.

In article <81480@ut-emx.uucp> btlee@emx.cc.utexas.edu (Mr. Byungtae Lee) writes:
>Thanks for your reply. However, you seem still sarcastic.

I am very frequently sarcastic and cynical.  But I was not when I mentioned
above.

> You imply that
>Korea has "through-personal-connections-ONLY type of system.". Well, that
> is fine and to some extent, it is the case and the significant problem.

Nepotism, I think it is called.  That's how the computer company "Wang" is
going down, I was told.  That's how every major corporation in Korea
operates, and it remains to be seen how it is going to go in a long run.
Most big companies are still fairly young.  They are barely onto their
second generation management, I think.

>But I'd like to point out the causality between social success and its
>system structure.   For me, Japan seems to stick to your "personal-connec
>tions-Only" type of system. In that sense, Japan is worse. But, many
>people think they already got success.  

I think Japanese companies are young as well.  For that matter, many U.S.
companies are young such as HP, Apple, Microsoft, etc.

>It is not easy for me to identify
>any exclusive-everlasting true causality in social/organizational
>behavior.  I think we must be caureful to link the results and its causal
>factors.  When we talk about the more advanced countries, we have such
>pitfalls. 

The only reason I advocate open system is very selfish.  I have no strings
to pull.  The only way I can make it to anywhere is by merit-based
free-competition.  That is the only reason I favor open system.  And it
sounds fair as well.

>In addition, your delight from American open system absorbing
>may be other coutry's sacrifices only because historically, economically
>they can not afford to prove personal benefits to its own brains as much
>as U.S.

Indeed, many countries have suffered "brain drain" because of the U.S.
Most of the significant scientific programs in the U.S. have been headed by
brains that were drained out of someplace else.  For that matter, most of
the population was lured from someplace else.  Sounds like free market
competition to me.

>Suspicious everything in America.
>Byungtae

Deprived of any strings to pull.
James Choi
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: henstock@ecn.purdue.edu (Peter V Henstock)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Info on KS-Code or ISOCODE Encodings
Date: 12 Oct 92 17:53:33 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

I have been browsing through the various FTP sites in search of
information on these character encodings.  I find various
references to the standards of KS-#### and ISOCODE-## and some
programs which convert between them.  

Does anyone know where I can obtain a copy of these standards?  I
am looking for any tables of the characters and codes as
well as the corresponding romanization for each of the font
characters/character encodings.

Thanks.

--Peter
From: txwizard@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (txwizard)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Korean Women and T.V. Drama
Date: 15 Oct 92 22:05:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: ut-emx.81723
Reply-To: txwizard@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (txwizard)
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX
Originator: txwizard@bashful.cc.utexas.edu

Article 9047 of soc.culture.korean:
From: hnkst2+@pitt.edu (Hanhwe N Kim)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: woman's fate?
Date: 15 Oct 92 04:04:48 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


Contrary to popular belief and TV drama portrayls Korean women have 
not been helpless and dependent housewives but have been working outside 
to make ends meet for generations. 

-Han
#######################################################################

I agree with that statement.  some of those dramas are really 
in another world.  they only reflect the lifestyle that less than 
20% of the population may enjoy.  might be even less
than 20% depending upon a more accurate gini coefficient.

i met many korean women while i was at yonsei who were ambitious
and eager to work.  the helpless and dependent housewives are
everywhere not just in korea.

mike kim
From: btlee@emx.cc.utexas.edu (Mr. Byungtae Lee)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re:American open system
Date: 10 Oct 92 19:59:32 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin; Austin, Texas


 phantom@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (James Choi) write:
 
>Many engineering department cannot function without foreigners.
> I was told
>French literature department in France will collapse without foreign
>students!  I think it is vital for the U.S. to absorve brains
>from outside.
>I think that's what makes this country innovative.
 
>I would like to see this kind of open system succeed than a tightly
>garded, through-personal-connections-only type of system.
 
Thanks for your reply. However, you seem still sarcastic. You imply that
Korea has "through-personal-connections-ONLY type of system.". Well, that
 is fine and to some extent, it is the case and the significant problem.
But I'd like to point out the causality between social success and its
system structure.   For me, Japan seems to stick to your "personal-connec
tions-Only" type of system. In that sense, Japan is worse. But, many
people think they already got success.  It is not easy for me to identify
any exclusive-everlasting true causality in social/organizational
behavior.  I think we must be caureful to link the results and its causal
factors.  When we talk about the more advanced countries, we have such
pitfalls. In addition, your delight from American open system absorbing
may be other coutry's sacrifices only because historically, economically
they can not afford to prove personal benefits to its own brains as much
as U.S.
>James Choi
Suspicious everything in America.
Byungtae
From: kim@cs.arizona.edu (Kyung Soo Kim)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: Hangul word processor
Summary: Hangul word processor is copywrited commercially sold product
Date: 8 Oct 92 19:42:30 GMT
Distribution: usa

In article <97788@bu.edu>, kgtjan@cs.bu.edu (Gi Kim) writes:
> I have a couple of questions regarding Hangul word processor for PC.
> I have hangul 1.50 from Hangul and Computer Co., and it is not a laser 
> version.  Is there ways to create Postscript files from the Hangul files?
> I just wanted to print files created using Hangul thru a laser printer
> which is connected to the unix main frame.
> 
> If any of you have laser version of Hangul, Can I have a copy of it?


  Yes, there are people have the laser version of Hangul.
  I just want you and (maybe) other people know that Hangul 1.50
  from Hangul and Computer Co. is COPYWRITED AND COMMERTIALLY SOLD
  PRODUCT in Korea.  You may not illegally make copy of the product
  without proper permittion.

kenny

Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: dskim@eng.umd.edu (Daeshik Kim)
Subject: Re: korean films
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 23:10:57 GMT
Organization: Univ. of Maryland, College Park

In article <NMWRB91J@cc.swarthmore.edu> sepste1@cc.swarthmore.edu (stephen epstein) writes:
>There are several good Korean films which occasionally make it around to
>film festivals in some of the larger markets or at universities.

	I'm really expecting the movie 'Kyeol-Hon-I-Ya-Gi' 
	(about Wedding or Wedding Story or whatever in English)
	come down to tape so that I can rent it out.
	I've heard it is pretty good; any review or comment?

>.. "The General's Son" is a truly fascinating, engaging film ..

	Hmm... I don't know; I never liked it since I knew what'll
	happen; and that really killed the fun.
-- 
	Daeshik Kim	H: (703)273-1517 O: (703) 689-5878
	/PN=Daeshik.Kim/O=SprintIntl/ADMD=Telemail/C=US/@Sprint.com
	dskim@eng.umd.edu
From: mkim@husc3.harvard.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: Japanese Koreans/ Koreans in Japan/info wanted
Date: 13 Oct 92 23:48:36 GMT
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

In article <1992Oct11.142733.19883@yang.earlham.edu>, peterp@yang.earlham.edu writes:
> 
>   I am writing a resurch(sp) project on Koreans in Japan/Japanese koreans
> but I am have a difficult time getting any curent info on this particular(sp)
> subject.  Basiclly I have only found a few articles, if any one has any info
> that might be of help, I would greatly apreciate(sp) it.
>   thanks P.
>  

There's actually a number of books on this topic you might try.

Richard Mitchell, Korean Minority in Japan, 1967. a kind of general survey of 
Korean relations up to late 1960s when the book was written.  The author
is kind of condescending towards Koreans in my opinion, but fairly
straightforward book.

Lee and De Vos, Koreans in Japan: ethnic conflict and accomodation 1981.
Haven't seen it, although people often cite this in their works.

Arata Fuju, Koreans in Japan, 1986.
Haven't read this one either. Although I suspect that this book is a
treatment of some of the legal issues involved, civil rights etc.

Michael Weiner, The Origins of the Korean Community in Japan, 1910-1923.
An account of the historical circumstances that led to the massacre of
Koreans after the Kanto Earthquake of 1923. Weiner makes the argument
that the prejudices against Koreans was a byproduct of post Meiji
events, and not the result of traditional animosities and ideas on
Japan's uniqueness.  Most people say this is probably the best 
documented of the lot but it's also presents a simplistic argument that
seems hard to fault but don't know if I agree with it.

Hope this helps.

Michael Kim
From: cho@wdl1.wdl.loral.com (Il Hyung Cho)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
Subject: Re: Korean Films
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:37:57 GMT
Distribution: all
Organization: LORAL - Western Development Labs

In article <1992Oct15.144746.28622@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, cyj9h@csissun12.ee.Virginia.EDU (Charles Y. Choi) writes:
> 
> Does anybody here know of any interesting films by Koreans or about
> Korean culture?
> 

A couple of years ago I saw a short movie call "Hal-mah-ni"  It 's quite interesting
check it out.

Il Hyung Cho
LORAL - Western Development Labs
cho@wdl1.wdl.loral.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: mk568652@longs.LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Mitchell Kotler)
Subject: Re: Visiting Korea
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1992 22:41:35 GMT
Organization: Colorado State U. Engineering College
Keywords: tourism

>>I will be visiting Korea in December of this year.

Can anyone give me information on affordable accomadation in Pusan
and Seoul, such as YWCA, YMCA or youth hostels.  

Also, I am interested in information about cites and attractions.

Thank you, Teresa.



Yes! You can stay at the BANDO Youth Hostel in Seoul in the Bando
district.  Actually , there are thousand of "yogwans" or inns which
offer cheap accomodation , Korean-style.   They are everywhere and
they all have this fire-like symbol next to the words  "yogwan" in Korean.
I was stationed in Korea (OSAN AB) and I made the best of my year 
abroad as I spent many weekends in Seoul in these inns.   

Have a good time, I did!

Anyong i kaseyo
Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean
From: shin@krusty.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin)
Subject: Re: western culture suck shit!!
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 12:11:07 GMT

In article <Oct09.225605.98314@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> mk568652@longs.LANCE.ColoState.Edu (Mitchell Kotler) writes:
>	THAT'S WHAT DENNY WONG WROTE.  HEY , IT SEEMS LIKE YOU DON'T
>KNOW YOUR HISTORY!    EVERY COUNTRY ON THIS PLANET IS GUILTY OF SOME
>SORT OF RACISM, ESPECIALLY KOREA.  IN KOREA, JAPANESE PEOPLE   ARE  HATED
>IN  SOME PLACES.  THAT'S RIDICULOUS.   WE CAN'T GO ON LIVING  WITH  THE  PAST
>IF  WE ARE  EVER  GOING TO HAVE PEACE  IN THIS WORLD!   WE ARE  ALL GUILTY,

Mister, what do you know of living with the past?  

Newsgroups: soc.culture.korean