HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Subject: Re: defense against a pogrom
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 08:12:19 GMT

In <1992Dec10.163631.2043@starbase.trincoll.edu> nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller) writes:

>Though both spellings are the result of tin ears (try meshiakh)

I checked my concordance, there are 7 places in the Tanach where
Mashiach or Hamashiach appears.  The first vowel is a kamatz, which
makes Moshiach the Ashkenazi pronounciation.

Assuming that you are using an 'e' in "meshiakh" to represent a sh'va,
while the other 32 uses of this word in the Tanach do have the first
vowel changed from a kamatz to a sh'va, they are all compound forms,
e.g. m'shiach Hashem, m'shicho.

I found no word (as opposed to a compound form) "meshiach" or "m'shiach".
-- 
/|/-\/-\          Adif tzav pinui metzav shmoneh.
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@         "WARENS statement in his signature express a Nazi idea."
/ nysernet.org 			    Gideon Ehrlich
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: jjsulliv@COLBY.EDU (Nice Young Lady(tm))
Subject: Re: HALVAH Recipies Please
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <jjsulliv@COLBY.EDU (Nice Young Lady(tm))>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1992 20:29:16 GMT

If the Halvah recipe has been posted, I missed it, possibly b/c of the fact that
I get the postings from a listserver via email and it is not always reliable.
Could someone please email me the recipe?  I need it for my collection.

JJ
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Subject: Re: Kahane's philosophy
Reply-To: makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)
Organization: Arizona State University, Tempe AZ
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 01:27:21 GMT

In article <3065@israel.nysernet.org> warren@nysernet.org writes:

# dm = makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky)

	[stuff about Aristotle deleleted because in my current exhaustive
condition it is over my head].

# me: And they are not to be "expelled" if they agree to surrender
# me: civil rights including the right to vote.  If another country did this
# me: to Jews, would we not protest?

# dm: 	We probably would protest.  However, Israel is a Jewish State.  It
# dm: seems to me as if (again, if I am wrong I apologize in advance but
# dm: please tell me why) you are willing to sacrifice that so as not to
# dm: bring in a condition that you would protest if it took place in
# dm: another country.  I have no prblem with keeping Israel as a Jewish
# dm: State even if it would mean creating that condition.

# If an action was objectionable when Jews were the recipient, it
# remains objectionable if another ethnic group is, with Jews those
# doing it.  Since I agree neither to the expulsion/disenfranchisement
# of Israeli citizens based on their religion/ethnicity, nor to the
# disbandment of the Jewish State, I prefer other solutions.

	I prefer other solutions also.  Unfortunately, they don't exist.
--
	There are three types of people in the world.  Those that are good
at math and those that are not.

makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: emc@doe.carleton.ca (Eli Chiprout)
Subject: Re: Why I became an Athiest
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 14:25:07 GMT

>In article <1992Dec9.212300.6618@netcom.com> madhaus@netcom.com (Maddi
>Hausmann) writes:

>>My religious upbringing was in Judaism.  I had a somewhat schizoid
>>upbringing in the faith, in that our family attended an Orthodox
>>synogogue, but acted more like the "Reform" faith at home.  We didn't
>>keep kosher.  We could have bacon in restaurants but not at home.  We
>>*did* keep kosher for Passover, however.  We went to synogogue every
>>Saturday, but we *drove*, which is not allowed; one should walk.

>>Needless to say, this "pick-and-choose Jewish Lite" faith led to my
>>asking an awful lot of questions.  When I asked my parents why we
>>didn't keep kosher (as I was learning how to do so in Hebrew School),
>>I was told it was "too much trouble."  The crystallizing events that
>>led me to atheism were:

saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal) writes:

>First of all, Maddi should stick to her excellent efforts moderating
>rec.humor.funny; at least there foot in the mouth ignorance doesn't mean
>much.

>If all you can do is view religion, espceially Judaism, as a series of
>"don't do's" you have missed out on more than just education.

>Ooops.  My mistake.  I didn't realize this was all a satire.  I'm relieved
>to know that her Jewish education is not as abysmal as this writeng, were
>it not satire, tends to portray.

Why do you feel that Maddi's posting is a personal attack that you 
have to lecture her about.  Do you think that another Jewish lecture
is going to help her get a better feel of Judaism?  Maddi is 
expressing real experiences that she has gone through, which you
have not.  

If you are happy with your standing viz-a-viz Judaism, then good for 
you.  But lecturing and putting down another from a more-righteous-
than-thou position is not much help to another's disillusionment.  You
can always relate your good experiences with Judaism rather than 
putting down and lecturing.

>Sam Saal      kingfish!saal OR saal@kingfish.att.com
>	Vayiftach HaShem et Peah Ha`Aton
--
Eli Chiprout                 
Dept. of Electronics, 
Carleton University, Canada
emc@doe.carleton.ca                                     
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: wouk@alumni.cs.colorado.edu (Arthur Wouk)
Subject: Re: Send Direct Email Back to Missionaries
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 01:44:53 GMT

In article <1992Dec14.185333.7662@cirrus.com> chrism@cirrus.com (Chris Metcalfe) writes:
>In article <1gaj10INNled@terminator.rs.itd.umich.edu> jlove@ivrit.ra.itd.umich.edu (Jack Love) writes:
>>It appears to me that this gentleman is conducting 
>>Christian missionary activities in scj. There ought to
>>be a way to discourage this, although I haven't been a
>>participant long enough to figure out how. Suggestions?
>>
>>Jack F. Love
>
>Since "Buchar" answered somewhat emotionally to the replies he received
>in scj, I think that everyone should send him email directly, expressing
>their dislike of his activities.  My guess is that he'll get the point.
>
>This should be a regular thing when the missionaries dump on scj.
>
>-- Chris Metcalfe

i have written to postmaster at his home address about this. i have
also started replying to bhuchar by returning his message preceded by
the following line:

you have been warned. please keep your nonsense out of s.c.j.


i think that the mail bombing is frowned uponh, so i took the liberty
of warning the postmaster before we all engage in such a campaign. it
will of course drive the sys-admin to distraction, and he should have
some opportunity to correct matters before  such an attack is
started.
-- 
arthur wouk 
internet: wouk@alumni.cs.colorado.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: billg@bony1.bony.com (Bill Gripp)
Subject: Re: Refuting Xian Missionaries (README)
Organization: LA&W RR
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 92 01:30:56 GMT

In article <1992Dec13.213230.5983@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> friedenb@silver.egr.msu.edu (Gedaliah Friedenberg) writes:

>Outline for refuting Chrsitian missionaries (pgs. 9-10):
>
>1.  If they quote from the Old Testament, then
>	b.  See if the verse has been mistranslated--you should 
>	    always try to look up every quote in the original Hebrew.
>	    If you do not know Hebrew, find a friend who dies.
                                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
A Christian will tell you that that friend is Jesus.


>2.  If a Christian missionary solemnly warns you that you will burn 
>    in hell forever unless you accept Jesus, or if they try any other 
>    type of psychological trick, calmly ask them for a logical proof 
>    of their beliefs.  Insist on intellectual reasoning.

This is like asking a Jew why they believe the Tanakh.  Yes, it is based
upon the writtings accepted as scripture by the particular religion, but
whether you accept only the Tanakh or the "Old" and "New" Testaments is
ultimately a matter of faith, which is not subject to logic.


>4.  Try to speak as clamly as you can.  Jesus freaks believe that only
                     ^^^^^^
I'd don't think too many Christians (or other people) understand clam
(or oyster).

>    faith in Jesus will make a person clam, and so your getting excited 
                                       ^^^^
They usually say saved.  Is this a new denomination/cult which preaches
clam?

>    will only reinforce them.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal)
Subject: Re: Jewish STEREOTYPES - the last time
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 12:54:52 GMT

In article <1992Dec18.022924.2851@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com
(Andrew M. Solovay) writes:

>>Aww, no fair.  I came here for an argument!

>I'm sorry, this is *abuse*! Arguments are in 7a, across the hall.


Vadizdis? rec.soc.humor.culture.jewish.monty.python?
-- 
Sam Saal      kingfish!saal OR saal@kingfish.att.com
	Vayiftach HaShem et Peah Ha`Aton
From: OWEN@vms.bgu.ac.il (David Owen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Masculine or Feminine
Date: 11 Dec 92 20:41:46 GMT
Organization: Ben-Gurion University of the Negev Beer-Sheva Israel, BGU
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.13

In <mannj.723922588@acf9> mannj@acf9.nyu.edu writes:

> CPLS13@email.mot.com (Steven_Cohn) writes:
> 
> >I am currently taking an beginning Ivrit class, and last night we were
> >talking about gender and numbers.  During the discussion the teacher gave
> >us
> >an example of a word that she (an Israeli) grew up always using as
> >feminine,
> >one of her 2nd grade students (my class is an adult evening class)
> >challenged her on - Gever (gimel resh vet - sock).  According to the
>                      ^^^^^
> you mean "gerev".
> 
> >dictionaries (several of them) this is a masculine word, but she (and all
> >the other Israeli teachers at the school) all grew up using it a feminine
> >word.  Does anybody know what the
> >story behind this is?  Is it really masculine?  Is it just a common misuse?
> 
> Note that the plural of gerev is "garbayim".  The "ayim" ending for the plural
> form of the noun is common to things that come in pairs, such as "einayim"
> (eyes), "yadayim" (hands), "raglayim" (feet), etc.  When I was a kid, I was
> taught that such nouns are always feminine, even though they don't have the
> usual feminine ending in the singular form.  This is true for "ayin" (eye),
> "yad" (hand), and "regel" (foot), and would explain why the teacher grew up
> thinking it's feminine.  But apparently such words can be masculine as well.
> (See Jack Love's piece about "shadayim" (breasts).)
> 
> >Steven Cohn
> --
> 
> Jordan Mann at NYU      (mannj@cims.nyu.edu)


I don't thing you can use GARBAYIM as masculine at all. I'll check it with
an Israeli gramer theacher here in Israel.
(I am an Israeli myself....).

 
 
Shlomo Zelkine,         E-mail:
3 Eilat St.
Afridar,                owen@bguvms.bgu.ac.il
Ashkelon,
Israel 78443            Shlomo.Zelkine@f4.n401.z2.fidonet.org
 
07-710286               zelkine@ilnet.net
 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay)
Subject: Re: Jewish STEREOTYPES - the last time
Organization: People's Front of Judea
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 20:08:06 GMT

In article <emc.724702935@tomalak> emc@doe.carleton.ca (Eli Chiprout) writes:
>And we don't insult one another...twit!
                                   ^^^^

One vowel away from a flamewar...
-- 
Andrew Solovay    
                "I know that, in America and under capitalism,
                 I am the freest woman in history."
                                --- Camille Paglia
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: emc@doe.carleton.ca (Eli Chiprout)
Subject: Re: Jewish STEREOTYPES - the last time
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:22:15 GMT

weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener) writes:
>mk568652@longs (Mitchell Kotler) writes:
>>I was deeply enraged at the fact that NO ONE, not one person,
>>supported my views against Jews mocking themselves.  What is wrong
>>with you people!

>We have big noses and we're cheap to a fault.

And we don't like to argue! (No, really!)
And we don't insult one another...twit!



--
Eli Chiprout                 
Dept. of Electronics, 
Carleton University, Canada
emc@doe.carleton.ca                                     
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Subject: Re: Peace for Peace
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 02:20:48 GMT

While a fair and just settlement would be peace for peace, with
perhaps part of eastern Palestine being transferred back to the Jewish
people to make the partition more equitable, as a practical matter
there is going to have to be some more territory given up by Israel.
-- 
Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: norm@helix.nih.gov(Norm Friedman)
Subject: Re: An experiment
Originator: scj@israel.nysernet.org
Reply-To: <norm@helix.nih.gov(Norm Friedman)>
Organization: Nysernet
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 14:18:32 GMT

>If the following text is readable, please let me know.
>
>						Dan
>
>                              .il ricedl `p jkqna d`ixwl ozip df hqwh m`
>
>			oc
Dan,
Cannot read.  Are you trying to send a Hebrew script.  Looks like when I
write in a Ivrit scripting and try to send, the mail goes out in Geneva or
some other font.  But, if the receiving person copies into word processor
with same font I used, it will then print out OK for him.
+--------------------------------------------------------+
   

   *    ***    **      *
   *   *   *     *     *
   *   *   *     *     *   
   *    ***         ***
   *   nison reuven b'R Shami             
   *   
   *   *  *   ***   ***   **  **
   *   ** *  *   *  *  *  * ** *
   *   * **  *   *  ***   *    *
   *   *  *   ***   *  *  *    *
       norm  "EVERYWHERE I GO, I GO TO ISRAEL!"
+---------------------------------------------------------+

Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: ask@cbnews.cb.att.com (Arthur S. Kamlet)
Subject: tradition
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories,  Columbus, Ohio
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 23:15:05 GMT

Cartoon in today's [ December 17, 1992 ] Wall Street Journal:

  Husband talking to wife who is on the telephone:


    "You can call it oral tradition if you want to,
       but I still say it's gossip."
-- 
Art Kamlet  a_s_kamlet@att.com  AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus
From: gpalo@digi.lonestar.org (Gerry Palo)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Entertaining suggestions for responses to "Merry Christmas"
Date: 15 Dec 92 19:20:01 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: DSC Communications Corp, Plano, TX

In article <1gdbuoINNh9t@gap.caltech.edu> peri@cco.caltech.edu (Michal Leah Peri) writes:
>aliki@nova1.stanford.edu (Alexandra Schmidt) writes:
>
>>on the receiving end of Christmas wishes
>
>You can pre-emp them by wishing people a Happy Hannukka.  After all, 
>Hannukkah comes first!
>

I would welcome such a wish.  My own attitude about wishing everyone a Merry 
Christmas is that the love and warmth Christians especially associate with
it is for everyone, without condition.  It is a cup that runneth over, and I 
hope that I can share the joy of my own heart with non-Christians, blessing
everyone, without having to bring up religion.

Something of this special sense of Christmas can be felt in Dickens'
"A Christmas Carol".  As far as I know there is no mention of Christ
in it at all, and yet the spirit of Christmas permeates everything.  
There are fundamentalists who condemn the book for this reason, but 
I think it keeps Christmas very well.

By the way, I do not use this greeting for someone I specifically
know to be Jewish, though I wish that mutual understanding were good
enough that I could do so in the sense given above without causing
offense.

So if your response to my Merry Christmas is "Happy Hannukah", I will say,
thank you indeed.  

Now, if somehow we could keep this up year round.

Greetings of the season.

Gerry Palo (73237.2006@compuserve.com)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
From: dfs@doe.carleton.ca (David F. Skoll)
Subject: Just what IS the e-mail policy?? (was Re: STOP Spreading...)
Organization: Dept. of Electronics, Carleton University
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 16:08:45 GMT

In <1992Dec17.154906.7914@wam.umd.edu> aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo
Pinkas) writes:

>In article <9212171534.AA08486@hrt213.brooks.af.mil>
tjm@hrt213.brooks.af.mil (Tim Miller) writes:

>>	I got mail back that contained a cited copy of my mail followed
>>by 16 repititions of "Fuck you."

>Then, why are you posting his "private" answer to your "private" mail
>here?

I always assumed that it was OK to cite the basic idea in an e-mail, unless
the sender specifically asked that this not be done.  I also assumed that
it was bad form to POST (not QUOTE) e-mail verbatim directly to the net.
"Andy" and I thrashed this out, you may remember. :-(

So, what's the answer?

--
David F. Skoll
From: rlk@underprize.think.com (Robert Krawitz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Intolerance (was SCJ HAS BEEN DECONTAMINATED!
Date: 17 Dec 92 09:17:45
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge Mass., USA
	<davidh.724518925@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
	<1992Dec16.223256.23296@midway.uchicago.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: underprize.think.com
In-reply-to: hasn@midway.uchicago.edu 's message of Wed, 16 Dec 1992 22:32:56 GMT

In article <1992Dec16.223256.23296@midway.uchicago.edu> hasn@midway.uchicago.edu  writes:

   In article <davidh.724518925@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>, davidh@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (David Klein) writes:

   > It truly makes me sad to see the spread of intolerance and hatred
   > regardless of which culture it springs from. It makes me even sadder
   > to see it come from our own culture. 

In general I'd agree, except that these messyantic types are attempting
to perpetrate a deliberate fraud, and as such run the risk of being
nailed when they're caught.  While I don't doubt that there are a
handful of sincere people in groups like that, I'd be quite surprised if
any of the more active people (such as Vijay) are not fully aware of
what they are doing, and fully aware that their claims of being "Jewish"
are bogus.  Chasing people like that out of this group, whether a
mitzvah or merely being practical, is roughly equivalent to chasing
birds out of one's roof gutters when they start clogging the downspouts.

Mind you, nonsense like this goes on elsewhere -- on alt.atheism there
is a regular invasion of evangelicals, and the more mainstream religious
folks who read that newsgroup are as annoyed by them as anyone else.

   I couldn't agree with you more.  Intolerance, within all of our
   cultures is definitely a negative.  I am muslim by birth but not by
   practice.  Yet I feel that I am still a "real" muslim regardless of
   my degree of following.  The final result of "judging and condemning"
   is indeed a depressing prospect.  I have been approached by both
   Christian and Jewish missions on the street and have also been
   visited at home.

I wouldn't be surprised if the "Jewish missions" you're referring to are
exactly the Jews for Jesus and related types we're so fed up with here.
--
ames >>>>>>>>>  |	Robert Krawitz <rlk@think.com>	245 First St.
bloom-beacon >  |think!rlk				Cambridge, MA  02142
harvard >>>>>>  .	Thinking Machines Corp.		(617)234-2116

Member of the League for Programming Freedom -- write lpf@uunet.uu.net
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 22:37:28 EST
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: If I were Prime Minister
 <1992Dec16.014536.5091@starbase.trincoll.edu>

In article <1992Dec16.014536.5091@starbase.trincoll.edu>,
nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller) says:
>
>In article <9212151426.AA29193@helix.nih.gov> <norm@helix.nih.gov(Norm        )
>Friedman
>> writes:
>>Re: the latest murder of an Israeli.  After hearing about the latest
>>kidnapping and murder of the Border Policeman, if I were Prime Minister for
>>the day, I would authorize the immediated PUBLIC HANGING OF THE SHIEK.

I see, the man has already been tried and sentenced but because of an external
event, you would suspend due process and execute him without legal cause. this
would help underscore the importance of rule of law in Israel?

Hint: if you look at history, the British did the very same thing to Irish
rebels, it turned these people into martyrs and helped fuel the Irish Rebellion
to the point of actual war. It's a pretty stupid policy.

>
>Don't you want to draw-and-quarter him first?
>
>Norman Miller
>
>
From: de@moscom.com (David Esan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Venison
Date: 20 Dec 92 01:57:39 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Moscom Corporation, Pittsford NY


The latest issue of Jewish Action (the OU magazine) has a note that there is
a place in NYC that is under OU supervision and has glatt venison.  I 
contacted them and got a price list.  Oy is all I can say.  Prices range
from 3.50/lb for the neck (good price, no meat) to $18.50/lb for the
saddle.  The whole carcass is $9.50/lb, a little steep for my budget.

Now the question is:  Is there another source for kosher venison? 

I have heard rumor that there is a place in Detroit, and I would bet you
could find one in Toronto, but I have no contacts in either place to 
research it.  If you have any information either post or email me, and I
will post a summary.

Thanks.


-- 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 -->     David Esan      de@moscom.com  
 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: warren@nysernet.org (Warren Burstein)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Cholov Yisrael
Date: 20 Dec 92 08:30:36 GMT
Reply-To: warren@nysernet.org
Organization: Mail to News Gateway at Wang Labs

In <102216@netnews.upenn.edu> weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P Wiener) writes:

>Ridiculous as it may seem, there are OU cholov stam cartons.

What does this supervision ensure?  Since the only ingredient in the
carton is milk, what is there to check other than the milk, and if the
milk is supervised, how is it not chalav yisrael?  I could understand
if it was chocolate milk and they checked the chocolate because milk
doesn't need supervision.
-- 
/|/-\/-\          Adif tzav pinui metzav shmoneh.
 |__/__/_/    
 |warren@         "WARENS statement in his signature express a Nazi idea."
/ nysernet.org 			    Gideon Ehrlich
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish