HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: pnw.motss,soc.motss
Subject: Pomo Afro Homos in Portland
Date: 10 Jan 93 22:26:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1993Jan10.222658.29245
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

The Pomo Afro Homos are a group of three gay black men performing
about issues concerning being black and queer. There's an description
of them in the January 1 Just Out, page 23.

Anyway, they are performing next weekend (the 15th and 16th) at 8PM at
the Echo Theatre. Tickets are $12 in advance from Ladd's Edition and
Fred Meyer Fastixx, and $14 at the door.

I want to go. Anyone else planning on going? I haven't gotten tickets yet.
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/          Days go by, endlessly pulling you into the future
From: fyl@ssc.com (Phil Hughes)
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Organization: SSC, Inc.,  Seattle, WA
Distribution: pnw
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1993 17:30:15 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Robert Sipe (robs@bcstec.ca.boeing.com) wrote:
: 
:   So what is the general opinion regarding the hanging of Dodd?  Will it
: happen or will the ACLU be successful in obtaining clemency?  

The ACLU wasn't asking for clemency.  They felt that hanging was "cruel
and unusual".  Lethal injection was always an option, no matter what the
court dedided on hanging.

: -- 
: Statement made by Oliver North when asked to comment on Clinton's draft
: record.  "I would rather vote for Jane Fonda than Gov. Clinton!  At least
: she has been to North Vietnam."

North is such a jerk.  It makes at least as much sense as wanting Daniel
Ortega to replace North as at least Ortega had been to Nicaragua.
-- 
Phil Hughes, SSC, Inc. P.O. Box 55549, Seattle, WA 98155  (206)FOR-UNIX
>>> Publishers of pocket references for UNIX, C, VI, Emacs, Ksh, MS-DOS, ... <<<
     ...!ssc!fyl or fyl@ssc.com            (206)527-3385
From: monaghan@cac.washington.edu (Tracy Monaghan )
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Danger!!!
Date: 7 Jan 93 23:08:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: shelley.1iid63INNopi
Organization: UW Computing
NNTP-Posting-Host: red1.cac.washington.edu

From an ad in the U of Washington student newspaper:

It's a DISCO PARTY with DISCO LIGHTS DISCO MUSIC and a VILLAGE PEOPLE film.
From: batie@agora.rain.com (Alan Batie)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 5 Jan 93 16:15:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: agora.C0E2I9.Bwr
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Open Communications Forum

allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren) writes:
>I find it
>ironic how the State will perform the execution in a manner in which
>Dodd himself killed his victims:  by hanging.

He had the choice of hanging or lethal injection.  He chose hanging
because he had used that method on one of his victims and apparently
felt it fitting.

I've got no problem with the killing of people proven to be a menace to
others.  Let those who want them to live pay for their lifetime room,
board and guarding.  And when the killers get paroled, or escape, and
kill again, let those people explain their position to the survivors.
-- 
Alan Batie                               \
batie@agora.rain.com                      \       Sometimes they fool you
+1 503 452-0960                          / \      by walking upright...
45 28 59 N / 122 43 20 W / 440' MSL     /   \
From: scott@hpcvccl.cv.hp.com (Scott Linn)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 6 Jan 93 01:48:54 GMT
Article-I.D.: hpcvca.1993Jan6.014854.1108
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA

dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts) writes:
: 
: So the Magic Efficency Dust is scattered more selectively than I
: thought.

It certainly was in the Dodd case.  He pleaded guilty to the murders.
He wanted the death penalty.

No uncertainty.  The wrong man was not executed.

Or, do you think otherwise?


Scott Linn
scott@hpcvccl.cv.hp.com
From: mikeq@freddy.CNA.TEK.COM (Mike Quigley)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 5 Jan 93 17:02:06 GMT
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Redmond,  OR.

In article <C0CGA6.CnH@bcstec.ca.boeing.com> robs@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Robert Sipe) writes:
>
>  So what is the general opinion regarding the hanging of Dodd?  Will it

As noted by one TV reporter, many of those gathered outside the prison
to SUPPORT THE HANGING where CHRISTIAN FUNDAMENTALISTS and RIGHT TO
LIFERS!

So much for thou shalt not kill and sanctity of life!

Mike
From: bright@nazgul.UUCP (Walter Bright)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Bill Clinton won't send his daughter to public schools
Date: 7 Jan 93 19:21:24 GMT
Reply-To: bright@nazgul.UUCP (Walter Bright)
Organization: Zortech, Seattle

In article <MS-C.726280864.1103527590.mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin) writes:
/Well, the hypocrisy of the Clinton administration has already started.  The
/Clintons are sending Chelsea to an expensive private school.  So much for the
/great and gradiose promises.
/Bill Clinton knows perfectly well what sending his daughter to public school
/in Washington DC would mean.  After years of ``just throw more tax money and
/all problems will be solved'' mismanagement, public schools are a nightmare; a
/lot happens there, but not very much education.

Of course, we all know what will happen with socialized medicine. Those with
political power will be attending 'special' hospitals that don't have long
waiting lines and incompetent care. It will probably look like the two-class
system used in Communist countries, special stores and hospitals for elite
party members, and the not-so-special stuff for everyone else.
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: robs@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Robert Sipe)
Subject: Dumping on public owned lands
Organization: Boeing
Distribution: pnw
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 00:33:28 GMT

I knew it would happen.  In fact in a previous post
I predicted it.  Now it is in the front page of the
Everett Hearld's Sunday paper.  As the costs of 
garbage dumping sky rocket the amount of midnight
dumping in old loggin roads increases.  

When the county decided to restrict access to land fills
by raising the cost of dumping the dumping became cheaper
in the hills.  It was so obvious.  When I can put $20.00
dollars into my truck (not me mind you but some low life 
character) and drive out of town, unload my vehicle full
of trash, drive back into town with $10.00 gas left in
the tank why wouldn't I.  The cost of cleaning up these
unauthorized land fills is extimated in the millions of
dollars.  Let me rephrase that.  The cost of cleaning
up these unauthorized land fills is estimated in the millions
of TAX PAYERS dollars.

Quite a method of encouraging recycling.  When will you
people realize?!?


-- 
A town that had their Nativity scene thwarted by the ACLU placed a banner
saying "The ACLU is jealous of our Nativity scene for the fact that they
don't have 3 wisemen and a virgin in their organization".
From: markz@ssc.com (Mark Zenier)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Seattle City Light vs. Puget Power
Date: 11 Jan 93 04:12:14 GMT
Article-I.D.: ssc.1993Jan11.041214.2820
Organization: SSC, Inc.,  Seattle, WA
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Mark Crispin (mrc@Ikkoku-Kan.Panda.COM) wrote:
: If Puget Power were allowed to charge customers what it really cost to provide
: them with service, people in places like Bremerton would see a bit cut in
: their rates, people in places like Bainbridge Island would see a moderate cut
: in their rates, and people in the boonies would see such a massive increase in
: rates that they'd no longer be able to afford electricity.

In my observation, people in the boonies are served by PUD's 'cause
Puget Power doesn't go there.

Mark Zenier  markz@ssc.wa.com  
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: bill@Celestial.COM (Bill Campbell)
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Organization: Celestial Software, Mercer Island, WA
Distribution: pnw
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1993 17:13:33 GMT

In <1773@tekgen.bv.tek.com> tkpowell@tekgen.bv.tek.com (Terry Powell) writes:

:In article <1icp8fINNd2p@shelley.u.washington.edu> monaghan@cac.washington.edu (Tracy Monaghan ) writes:
:->In article <C0CGA6.CnH@bcstec.ca.boeing.com> robs@bcstec.ca.boeing.com
:->>(Robert Sipe) writes: >>
:->>  So what is the general opinion regarding the hanging of Dodd?  Will it
:->
:->Barbaric and anachronistic, IMHO

Isn't killing children pretty barbaric?  I find it ironic that
the criminals who show their complete contempt for the law use it
to their advantage to prevent appropriate punishment.  Of course
the lawyers always get paid (talk about the true bottom feeders).

I was also interested in the news coverage on this.  Channel 5
news had the protests as their ``Top Story'' devoting the entire
section (about half the show) to it.  They didn't present a
single item from anyone except people against the death penalty.
It reminded me of the pre-election coverage where they would give
10 seconds to Bush (generally unflattering), and 10 minutes to
Clinton.

:Too bad Dodd didn't put a better fight when captured.  He might have
:gotten his neck broken then which would have saved everyone a lot of anguish.

But then the arresting officers would have been crucified for
police brutality.

Bill
-- 
INTERNET:  bill@Celestial.COM   Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!bill   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!bill   Mercer Island, WA 98040; (206) 947-5591
SPEED COSTS MONEY -- HOW FAST DO YOU WANT TO GO?
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: markz@ssc.com (Mark Zenier)
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Organization: SSC, Inc.,  Seattle, WA
Distribution: pnw
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1993 18:08:23 GMT
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Robert Sipe (robs@bcstec.ca.boeing.com) wrote:
:   So what is the general opinion regarding the hanging of Dodd?  

Given his deliberate refusal to appeal, I have to consider it
a suicide.

Mark Zenier  markz@ssc.wa.com
From: scott@hpcvccl.cv.hp.com (Scott Linn)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Incredible Universe
Date: 7 Jan 93 01:23:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: hpcvca.1993Jan7.012324.16274
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA

andrew@frip.WV.TEK.COM (Andrew Klossner) writes:
: Incredible Universe is controversial here because they won't let you in
: without a membership card, which they issue.  The application form
: requires you to give quite a bit of personal information.  You must use
: this card each time you make a purchase, so IU can keep a complete list
: of everything you've bought.  Speculation is that they turn this
: information into targeted marking lists.

Before we went in, we asked about their policies.  They assured that they
would not sell/give our names out to any other mailing lists/marketers.

Scott Linn
scott@hpcvccl.cv.hp.com
From: mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Bill Clinton won't send his daughter to public schools
Date: 5 Jan 93 08:41:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: Tomobiki.MS-C.726280864.1103527590.mrc
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: tomobiki-cho.cac.washington.edu
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Well, the hypocrisy of the Clinton administration has already started.  The
Clintons are sending Chelsea to an expensive private school.  So much for the
great and gradiose promises.

Bill Clinton knows perfectly well what sending his daughter to public school
in Washington DC would mean.  After years of ``just throw more tax money and
all problems will be solved'' mismanagement, public schools are a nightmare; a
lot happens there, but not very much education.

It's very nice for the Clintons that they can afford to send their child to an
expensive private school.  Too bad their supposed constituency -- the poor and
middle class -- don't have the same luxury.  Too bad liberals have vehemently
opposed giving the poor and middle class that luxury.

I wonder if it's time for a Constitutional Amendment forcing all children of
government officials to attend public school?  That'd get changes made!!
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: bill@Celestial.COM (Bill Campbell)
Subject: Re: Trust Me - I'm from the Government to help you
Organization: Celestial Software, Mercer Island, WA
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1993 19:28:12 GMT

In <4155@master.CNA.TEK.COM> mikeq@freddy.CNA.TEK.COM (Mike Quigley) writes:

:In article <2440@shaman.wv.tek.com> alanj@endeavor18.tek.com (Alan Jeddeloh) writes:
:>
:>I might point out that the overhead in the Medicaid program is currently
:>estimated at 4%.  The overhead for private insurance averages 7%.  I recall
:>the figures from Time magazine.

:According to figures I got from St. Charles hospital in Bend, and
:verified by a friend who is a claims adjuster in Portland, private
:insurance overhead runs anywhere from 25% to 40%! Yikes! No wonder
:they fight to preserve the status quo. They're cutting a fat hog
:at our expense!

This is all a bogus argument, because ALL expenses of an
insurance company except for the money paid to providers, and
sales commissions is overhead.

One problem is that our medial ``insurance'' has evolved so that
it isn't insurance at all, but a method to pay regular medical
expenses (sort of like buying food insurance to pay your bills at
the grocery store).  When I sold health insurance in (1965-1966)
there were Major Medical policies that were designed to cover
unexpected medical expenses.  The whole idea of insurance is to
cover unusual events, not the day-to-day normal expenses.  This
way the cost of the unusual events is spread out over a larger
group of people so the cost is lower per person.  Using medical
``insurance'' to pay normal bills is ridiculous since it costs at
least $40 to process every claim (that's why there are
deductibles on auto insurance -- to elimnate the small claims).

King County Medical just refused to renew two employees in our
group plan because they had the misfortune to get sick!  This
then made our number of eligible employees fewer than required to
qualify for group coverage so we had to switch insurance
companies requiring new waiting periods and all the garbage about
pre-existing conditions.

This really pisses me off because I pay out much more in premiums
each year than I've incurred in medical expenses in my life!  The
reason I pay the premiums it so that I have coverage if I really
need it.  Now I find out this isn't going to happen.

Bill
-- 
INTERNET:  bill@Celestial.COM   Bill Campbell; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!bill   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!bill   Mercer Island, WA 98040; (206) 947-5591
SPEED COSTS MONEY -- HOW FAST DO YOU WANT TO GO?
From: crystal@glia.biostr.washington.edu (Crystal)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 6 Jan 93 23:36:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: glia.crystal.726363362
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: glia.biostr.washington.edu

In <1781@tekgen.bv.tek.com> tkpowell@tekgen.bv.tek.com (Terry Powell) writes:

>In article <1853@rwing.UUCP> pat@rwing.UUCP (Pat Myrto) writes:
>>
>->I found it more than a little curious how the ACLU could claim 'cruel
>->and unusual' punishment for Dodd, seeing as that was what he REQUESTED...
>->Kinda makes one wonder if the motive was more to get headlines than any
>->concern for the nature of the punishment...  the selective defense of
>->the Bill of Rights, replete with 'creative' interpretations, depending
>->on how it fits their agenda and how much free publicity it will garner is
>->a well known practice of the ACLU.

>I believe Dodd requested hanging because he didn't want to spend the rest
>of his life in a 5 X 12 cell.  To him that was worse punishment.  If
>punishment was what we are really after, confining him to a tiny cell
>might have been the best way to go.  I, however am glad they hung the
>little scum.  Seemed appropriate to me.  The ACLU actions seemed
>appropriate. Hey they're lawyers too.  Just playing the legal game.  Do
>you think they have a lock on creative interpretations of the Bill of
>Rights?  I think not.

Maybe their approach should have been that since he REQUESTED to die, that
that is the same as attempted suicide, and since suicide is illegal, he 
shouldn't have been able to have the state assist him with it...

Just a random thought.

Crystal 
   ;>
From: dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 5 Jan 93 17:06:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: shelley.1icf6gINNrve
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: hardy.u.washington.edu

dxxb@hardy.u.washington.edu (David Barts) writes:

>    Curious.  Perhaps the Tooth Fairy comes and sprinkles magic Efficiency
>    Dust (R) over the Corrections Department in her off hours.  Or maybe its
>    the Easter Bunny who does that.

Okay, I'll admit it - this was flame bait.  But you get my point
- I simply can't trust the government (or anyone else that matter)
completely enough to give it that kind of life or death power.

-- 
David Barts  N5JRN                      UW Civil Engineering, FX-10
davidb@ce.washington.edu                Seattle, WA  98195
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: jrm@pgroup.com (John R Mudd)
Subject: Re: Bill Clinton won't send his daughter to public schools
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 03:38:21 GMT
Distribution: pnw
Organization: The Portland Group
Followup-To: pnw.general

In article <1993Jan6.214611.9776@tessi.com> allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren) writes:
>I agree with you John, but is Chelsea going to put Bill and Hillary in debt?
>Doubt it.  Besides, I said it was a *family* decision and that Chelsea had a
>major say in the decision. 

One other person pointed that out to me in email.  And I agreed with him
that Clintons are not going to go into debt over this issue.  However,
the Clintons do not have an average American income, either.  

My objection was to the apparent attitude in the original posting of "my
kids can choose whatever school they want and I, as their parent, should
pay for it."  I cannot agree with that mentality, and I have seen parents
who have thought just that way (and didn't have the financial resources
to back it up).  To take a loan out for your child's primary education
(we're talking normal circumstances here, people) is a little ridiculous,
IMHO.

Obviously, that wasn't the case.  My apologies.

... John
From: donn@brat.wa.com (Donn Pedro)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 6 Jan 93 20:09:58 GMT
Distribution: pnw
Organization: Tandemonium, Kent, WA

In article <4142@master.CNA.TEK.COM> mikeq@freddy.CNA.TEK.COM (Mike Quigley) writes:
:
:As noted by one TV reporter, many of those gathered outside the prison
:to SUPPORT THE HANGING where CHRISTIAN FUNDAMENTALISTS and RIGHT TO
:LIFERS!

Someone, not me, said that it is funny that "CHRISTIAN FUNDAMENTALISTS 
and RIGHT TO LIFERS" only care about what happends *until* birth.
After that, unless you are in thier class, you are on your own.



         Donn Pedro ....................a.k.a. donn@brat.wa.com
	
	       "You talk the talk.  Do you walk the walk?"

		    There are no ordinary moments.
From: daveike@sumax.seattleu.edu (Eickerman)
Newsgroups: pnw.general
Subject: Re: More about Wes
Date: 7 Jan 93 11:08:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: sumax.1iir81INNlcg
Organization: Seattle University
NNTP-Posting-Host: sumax.seattleu.edu

In article <4152@master.CNA.TEK.COM> mikeq@freddy.CNA.TEK.COM writes:
>According to the autopsy report, Dodd died of strangulation (slow) rather than
>by his spine being snapped (quick).
>
>Mike

The news reports also said that Dodd was immediately unconscious by the
neck snapping, so he shouldn't have felt anything during the time for vital
functions to cease operating.
 
John
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: davevh@microsoft.com (Dave Van Horn)
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 07 Jan 93 04:16:42 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation
Distribution: pnw

Erik Hedberg writes:

>Further clouding the issue is the fact that "life without parole" is
>*cheaper* than execution.

Six times cheaper, on average, according to CBS News.
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren)
Subject: Re: Bill Clinton won't send his daughter to public schools
Organization: Test Systems Strategies, Inc., Beaverton, Oregon
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:46:11 GMT

jrm@pgroup.com (John R Mudd) writes:

>In article <1993Jan6.165538.27667@tessi.com> allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren) writes:
>>I can see that you're very irate at Clinton on this, but both Bill and Hillary
>>said that Chelsea had a major say in what school she wanted to attend.  I
>>would give (and will, in the future) the same choice to my boys.  It would
>>not be right to *force* a child to go to a school they don't want to. 

>I would claim that it is also not right for parent(s) to put themselves
>into debt simply because their child doesn't want to go to a particular
>school.


I agree with you John, but is Chelsea going to put Bill and Hillary in debt?
Doubt it.  Besides, I said it was a *family* decision and that Chelsea had a
major say in the decision. 

allen
Newsgroups: pnw.general
From: davidst@microsoft.com (David Steckler)
Subject: Re: Wesley A. Dodd
Date: 07 Jan 93 17:24:15 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <4146@master.CNA.TEK.COM> mikeq@freddy.CNA.TEK.COM (Mike Quigley) writes:
>In article <MS-C.726270852.377401575.mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU> mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin) writes:
>>Mike Quigley writes:
>>
>>> many of those gathered outside the prison
>>> to SUPPORT THE HANGING where [sic] CHRISTIAN FUNDAMENTALISTS and RIGHT TO
>>> LIFERS!
>>
>>So what is Quigley trying to prove?
>
>Just this.
>
>Why do Christians preach love, understanding, forgiveness, sanctity of life,
>etc., etc., while they practice hate (OCA, Dodd hanging), murder and
>rape (Bosnia), fear and greed (pick your favorite TV preacher), 
>violence (against pro-choicers, even their own children), etc., etc.?????????
>
>Seems to me 180 degrees from what was taught in the Sunday school I
>attended.  But, then again, I flunked out of Sunday school early.
>Must have missed these graduate courses.

While I agree with some of your assertions (about the OCA and TV preachers,
for example), getting back to the subject at hand, the death penalty, in
my mind at least, has nothing to do with hate. It has to do with a 
cost/benefit analysis of the situation. From my perspective, it costs
society more to keep Dodd alive, in terms of lives of innocent people. By
keeping him alive, we risk the lives of prison guards even if he doesn't
escape (he even said he'd kill a prison guard if given life). And if something
does happen and he gets out, we risk the lives of every young boy in the 
area.

I agree that the death penalty is not a deterrant. I agree that it costs more
money, on average, to execute someone rather than lock them up forever.
But I'm not willing to risk innocent lives on the possibility that, in
the next 50 years, a prison guard turns his back and gets strangled or 
someone does something stupid, Dodd escapes and young boys start disappearing
again. The death penalty is a permanent solution to the specific problem
of a specific heinious murderer. It's not an ideal solution. It doesn't
address the problem of preventing people from turning into WADs, but it does
cure the specific symptom.

In my view, that has nothing to do with hate.

	...Dave

P.S. I'm not arguing with your assertion that many Christians (or Muslims
or Jews or whatevers) don't practice what they preach; I'm just arguing with
your assertion that the death penalty is necessarily and act of hatred.