From: jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns
Subject: Re: No charges filed in SWAT killing
Date: 19 Aug 92 06:53:14 GMT
Organization: Dixie Communications Public Access.  The Mouth of the South.

viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson) writes:

>	I fear the same thing, but I extend this fear to Tony.  If his
>briefing stated the occupants were armed and dangerous, would he not be
>pumped full of adrenalin and in fear of his life?  I extend this analogy:
>In a neighborhood known to be full of armed punks, you awake to find a
>burgular in your house.  You grab your shotgun and call the police.  The
>perp barges through the door.  You fire.  Are you justified if the perp
>did not indeed have a weapon?  As I understand it, Tony is justified in
>shooting if he feels his life, or the lives of others, is in grave danger.
>This doesn't mean the woman had a gun, it means he was fearful of her.
>Not knowing the situation when she appeared, I can't pass judgement on
>this, and prefer to let a board if inquiry and a jury sort it out.

Whatever happened to the concept that the police are supposed to lay their
lives on the line if necessary to protect innocent life?  The gestapo in
blue storming a house on the basis of an anonymous tip is NOT the same
as a private citizen protecting his property from mauraders.  

This is not a war.  Even if Stalin had been in that house, our
law  nominally regards him as innocent.  That means he as as
much right to expect not to be murdered by the pigs as does you
or I.  There is NO JUSTIFICATION EVER for a cop to kill an 
innocent.  Period.  When it happens, the cop should be charged
with first  degree murder and executed.   Those cops who cannot take
the risk of those consequences should get a real job.

There is simply NO REASON, PERIOD, for the cops ever to storm
the house in the middle of the night except to rescue innocents.
If the cops need to capture a person in a house, they can do it
the old fashioned way by staking out the house and capturing the
perp coming or going.  

>	As for the police, most have my respect, and SWAT teams have my
>respect, but like any group there are individuals I don't respect.  Tony
>may be one of them, or he may be innocent of intentional wrongdoing.  I
>prefer to let those who are fully informed decide.

You know, you really ought to find someone who lived in Germany in the 
late 30s and see how much your attitude parallels that of "good German
citizens" during the rise of Nazism.  The jews were gradually built up 
to be the same boogeyman enemy of the state and all the normal people
as are the evil, assault drug merchants of death today.  Extraordinary,
supralegal means of ridding the country of the menance was justified 
back then using the same logic being used today to justify state-sponsored
murder.  We have not yet seen the modern day Krystalnaught (sp) but it
is coming.  

Let me ask you this, Dan.  Today government-sponsored terrorism is aimed 
at the evil, mostly foreign drug lords and their lackeys.  That may be
fine with you since you obviously buy off on the party line that drugs 
are inherently evil and thus must be destroyed.  But what are you going to
do tomorrow or the next day when the new target of the State is something
you are involved in?  Suppose tomorrow it is guns or copying machines or 
fax machines or radios or whatever the government determines is the next
Enemy of Society?  Are you willing to live in fear of your life against
the threat of armed goon squads dressed in black storming your house
and machine-gunning you or your family?  It is only a small stretch of
twisted logic to go from anthromorphizing chemicals to doing the same
thing to other objects in your surroundings.  Fighting a military war
of terrorism on drugs today makes just about as much sense as fighting
the military war of terrorism against unclean races did in the 40s in
Germany.

Think about this a bit and if you still think Good Ole Tony is a
reasonable person who just made a little mistake, you are a blithering
idiot.  

John

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