HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer)
Subject: CMU-Lisp on 486 running Mach ?
Organization: Private UUCP, Martin Cracauer, Norderstedt, Germany
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 92 13:26:04 GMT

I wonder, if one can bring up the CMU Common Lisp from the sources on
a PC running Mach.

Anybody there, who knows ?

An e-mail address of someone at CMU, who likes to respond, would be
good, too.

Thanks
	Martin
-- 
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Martin Cracauer,    cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de
Waldstrasse 200, W-2000 Norderstedt, Germany
Tel.: +49 / 522 18 29, Fax.: +49 / 522 85 36
From: barmar@think.com (Barry Margolin)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Re: *READ-SUPPRESS* and #P syntax
Date: 11 Nov 1992 17:33:48 GMT
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: telecaster.think.com

In article <1992Nov11.014902.6585@kronos.arc.nasa.gov> philpot@kepler.arc.nasa.gov (Andrew Philpot) writes:
>Should *READ-SUPPRESS* be obeyed when reading literal pathnames using
>#P?

I think it's a reasonable suggestion.  Please submit it as a public review
comment.

>One would imagine that the intent of using READ-SUPPRESS to implement
>the *FEATURES* idea was to avoid signaling errors associated with just
>this kind of implementation-specific extension.

Note that *READ-SUPPRESS* can't possibly satisfy all syntax portability
problems.  As you've discovered, it can only help when the
implementation-specific syntax satisfies the expectations of those of us
specifying *READ-SUPPRESS*.  When *READ-SUPPRESS* is true, the reader still
has to be able to parse expressions sufficiently to skip over them.

>However, strictly speaking, this behavior is allowed by pp. 522 ff. of
>CLtL2.  It appears that the appropriate section of the new dpAns spec
>agrees with CLtl2 in this matter.  I couldn't swear I got to the right
>section, but there was one in dict-reader.tex that mirrored 22.1.2
>pretty well, and I didn't find any reference to #P there.

Basically, the problem is that when we added #P syntax we never updated
*READ-SUPPRESS*.  The definition of #P is that it's followed by a string,
not an expression.

>Is it the intent of dpAns that
>
>  (defvar my-path
>      #+EXCL #P(:type "lisp")
>      #+LUCID #P".lisp"
>      )
>
>can cause an error?

As currently written, yes.  I think it was the original intent of #+ to
allow this kind of code, though.

Of course, you can always work around this by calling MAKE-PATHNAME rather
than using a pathname literal:

(defvar my-path
  #+EXCL (make-pathname :type "lisp")
  #+lucid #p".lisp")
-- 
Barry Margolin
System Manager, Thinking Machines Corp.

barmar@think.com          {uunet,harvard}!think!barmar
From: pk@cs.tut.fi (Kellom{ki Pertti)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Re: Lisp WEB
Date: 9 Nov 92 16:30:43
Organization: Tampere Univ. of Technology, Finland.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: talitiainen.cs.tut.fi
In-reply-to: nholtz@cascade.carleton.ca's message of Thu, 5 Nov 1992 21:09:10 GMT

I've used a program called SchemeTeX, which does basically what people
have already described: let code live in a verbatim environment, and
format the comments as normal text. It appears that with Scheme there
is rarely need to move text from one place to another, mostly because
Scheme source usually consists of several small procedures that can be
given to the interpreter or compiler just about in any order. Also,
displaying code in some fancy manner (as in displaying a = in C code
as a backward arrow) does not work all that well with Scheme, or lisp
in general.

I've modified SchemeTeX a bit to use the GNU Latexinfo format, which
is somewhere between Texinfo and LaTeX. This enabled me to make an
Emacs info file out of my source code. With some Elisp hackery I got
automatic indexing of functions etc., which was quite nice. There was
one (rather serious) drawback: in order to modify a procedure in the
info file, one had to modify it in the original file, run the
SchemeTeX->info converter and reload the file. This is not practical
during the inital development phase of a program, although it would be
nice afterwards.

I do not use SchemeTeX anymore, but that does not mean that there was
something wrong with it. Maybe if I had put more effort into the tools
I built, things might be different. As of now, I really don't have
anything that I could distribute.
--
Pertti Kellom\"aki (TeX format)  #       These opinions are mine, 
  Tampere Univ. of TeXnology     #              ALL MINE !
      Software Systems Lab       #  (but go ahead and use them, if you like)
From: toma@sail.LABS.TEK.COM (Tom Almy)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Re: Lisp for the PC
Date: 9 Nov 92 15:52:41 GMT
Reply-To: toma@sail.labs.tek.com
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

In article <83212@ut-emx.uucp> dmonroe@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Darrel Monroe) writes:
>In his post of 5 Nov 1992, Hinrich asks:

>H> Is there anybody out there who can tell me where i can get a
>H> compiler for Lisp on PC's

>and in his post, also of 5 Nov 1992, Eugene Melehov asks:

>EM> I need LISR->C translator and/or LISP compiler to native code and/or
>EM> fast interpreter 

>Hopefully this will help both.  I like Xlisp-Plus for the PC.  I believe that 
>you will be able to find it on wuarchive.wustl.edu in the [...]
>It seems to be a very good  implementation of Common Lisp.

Well thanks for the compliment (I distribute it), but XLISP-PLUS does not have
a compiler, it is strictly interpretive. It also is not a full Common Lisp
implementation. It is reasonably fast, however, and might serve Mr. Melehov's
needs.


-- 
Tom Almy
toma@sail.labs.tek.com
Standard Disclaimers Apply
From: rcosc@yabbie.co.rmit.oz.AU (Simon Cleary)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Symbolics get-defstruct-description in Common Lisp?
Keywords: Symbolics,get-defstruct-description,Common Lisp.
Date: 13 Nov 92 06:25:47 GMT
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre
NNTP-Posting-Host: yabbie.co.rmit.oz.au

Hi,
	I'm currently using CMU Common Lisp and was wondering whether
	there is simple way of implementing Symbolics 
	get-defstruct-decription function in Common Lisp.

	I would like to not have to redefined the defstruct
	macro,  If I have to I will.

Thanks in Advance.

Simon Cleary
Lecturer, Unix Networking Consultant

Simon.Cleary@co.rmit.edu.au  

PHONE:  +61 3 660 3237              FAX: +61 3 662 1060

Department of Computer Systems Engineering,

Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology,
P.O. Box 2476V,
Latrobe St, Melbourne, 3000, Australia
Xref: sparky comp.lang.lisp:2871 comp.lang.scheme:2581 news.answers:3958
From: marugg@urz.unibas.ch
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Re: Lisp for the PC
Date: 10 Nov 92 21:26:58 MET
Organization: University of Basel, Switzerland

In article <12858@sail.LABS.TEK.COM>, toma@sail.LABS.TEK.COM (Tom Almy) writes:
> In article <83212@ut-emx.uucp> dmonroe@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Darrel Monroe) writes:
>>In his post of 5 Nov 1992, Hinrich asks:
> 
>>H> Is there anybody out there who can tell me where i can get a
>>H> compiler for Lisp on PC's
> 
>>and in his post, also of 5 Nov 1992, Eugene Melehov asks:
> 
>>EM> I need LISR->C translator and/or LISP compiler to native code and/or
>>EM> fast interpreter 
> 
>>Hopefully this will help both.  I like Xlisp-Plus for the PC.  I believe that 
>>you will be able to find it on wuarchive.wustl.edu in the [...]
>>It seems to be a very good  implementation of Common Lisp.
> 
> Well thanks for the compliment (I distribute it), but XLISP-PLUS does not have
> a compiler, it is strictly interpretive. It also is not a full Common Lisp
> implementation. It is reasonably fast, however, and might serve Mr. Melehov's
> needs.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Tom Almy
> toma@sail.labs.tek.com
> Standard Disclaimers Apply

There's also a FTP-site in Germany, which has a very nice implementation of
CLtL 1 for ATARI and DOS. It's a full interpreter/compiler and can be upgraded
to a mini-CLOS with the file 'closette.lsp (from Xerox), which is included in
the library EXAMPLES.ZOO.

FTP:  ma2s2.mathematik.uni-karlsruhe.de 
Library: /pub/lisp/clisp

I did not test the DOS version, but on an ATARI (!) CLISP works just fine.

Silvio Marugg
marugg@urz.unibas.ch

From: ted@hpkslx.mayfield.HP.COM (Ted Johnson)
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 01:39:28 GMT
Subject: CPS-conversion for better performance?
Organization: HP Response Center Lab
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp

Does anyone know of any journal articles or other research which 
comment on the effectiveness of using CPS (Continuation Passing Style) 
conversion to reduce memory requirements of Lisp code?

The basic idea is to take a (huge) generic Lisp program, pipe the source
through a CPS-conversion program, which emits an equivalent CPS-style  
Lisp program, and then running that, while enjoying a reduced memory usage.
[The CPS-conversion converts "normal" recursion to tail recursion.]

Rather than reinvent the wheel, I thought I'd first see if anyone has
done any experimentation in this area.

Thanks!

-Ted
From: chyde@pecos.ads.com (Clinton Hyde)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Re: Is lisp easy to learn?
Date: 5 Nov 92 20:13:31 GMT
	<TED.92Oct22102353@lole.nmsu.edu>
	<1992Oct22.200657.16177@linus.mitre.org> <7848@skye.ed.ac.uk>
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems, Mountain View, CA 94043, +1 (415)
	960-7300


jeff's original prefix version:


   defun equal x y
     or eql x y
	and consp x
	    consp y
	    equal car x car y
	    equal cdr x cdr y

worse than this even:

     eql x y or
	 consp x and
	 consp y and
	 car x equal car y and
	 cdr x equal cdr y

this is gibberish without the parentheses...

 -- clint
--

Clint Hyde		"Give me a LispM or give me death!" -- anonymous

Advanced Decision Systems/BAH	Internet:  chyde@chesapeake.ads.com
1953 Gallows Rd, Suite 600
Vienna, VA  22182-3934		(703) 902-7130
From: jeff@aiai.ed.ac.uk (Jeff Dalton)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Re: LISP for PC
Date: 6 Nov 92 13:39:54 GMT
Organization: AIAI, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

If you're willing to use a non-DOS OS, there's a version of AKCL
that works with 386BSD (the free BSD for 386).  It shouldn't be
too hard to make it work on BSDI's system too.

-- jeff
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
From: jones@ils.nwu.edu
Subject: New Ph.D. Program
Organization: institute for the learning sciences
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 20:04:36 GMT

T h e   L  E  A  R  N  I  N  G    S  C  I  E  N  C  E  S    P h. D.   P r o g r
a m


Preparing individuals for productive work and a   high quality of life in
today's society is a complex  challenge for schools and corporations. To meet
this challenge, Northwestern University has established a unique Ph.D. program
in the Learning Sciences. Its purpose is to advance the research and
development of innovative educational structures and technologies.

Research in the Learning Sciences is aimed at creating environments that offer
all students a rich variety of opportunities for learning to think effectively,
both within and outside of formal learning settings. Graduate student and
faculty research efforts are supported by a multimedia, networked computing 
infrastructure and an unusual commitment to developing technologies that
function effectively within their intended settings. 

The Learning Sciences is a synthesis of computational and social science
disciplines including artificial intelligence, cognitive and developmental
psychology, educational research, linguistics, computer science, anthropology
and fields that develop strategies for teaching complex subject matter. 

Through research, field work and apprenticeships, the Ph.D. program will
prepare its graduates to assume leadership roles in advancing the scientific
understanding and systematic practices of learning and teaching.

Students are eligible for competitively-awarded multi-year funding. To qualify
for financial aid, candidates should apply by January 15, 1992. Applications
received after that date may be  considered. Individuals with relevant teaching
experience or a strong academic  background in a field related to the Learning
Sciences are encouraged to apply. For  application materials or for further
information, contact:

Professor Roy Pea
Ph.D. Program Chair 
The Learning Sciences 
Northwestern University
1890 Maple Avenue
Evanston, IL  60201
phone: 708-491-8152
fax:    708-491-5258
email: jones@ils.nwu.edu
 
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
From: philpot@kepler.arc.nasa.gov (Andrew Philpot)
Subject: *READ-SUPPRESS* and #P syntax
Organization: NASA/ARC Information Sciences Division
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 01:49:02 GMT

Should *READ-SUPPRESS* be obeyed when reading literal pathnames using
#P?

Siutation: My code was trying to read in some files which contain
references to pathnames using the #P syntax.  Lucid and Franz have
different syntaxes for the object following the #P.  Lucid allows only
a string, whereas Franz supports both strings and lists in this
position.  Lucid signals an error when given an expression of the form
#P followed by a list, since that violates its #P reader.

So far, so good.  However, in (lucid) lcl4.1b, you can't avoid
signaling this error when reading a Franz-derived #P pathname.
Putting a #-LUCID or #+EXCL qualifier in front of the form doesn't
seem to work; it reads enough to signal the error anyway.

One would imagine that the intent of using READ-SUPPRESS to implement
the *FEATURES* idea was to avoid signaling errors associated with just
this kind of implementation-specific extension.

However, strictly speaking, this behavior is allowed by pp. 522 ff. of
CLtL2.  It appears that the appropriate section of the new dpAns spec
agrees with CLtl2 in this matter.  I couldn't swear I got to the right
section, but there was one in dict-reader.tex that mirrored 22.1.2
pretty well, and I didn't find any reference to #P there.

Is it the intent of dpAns that

  (defvar my-path
      #+EXCL #P(:type "lisp")
      #+LUCID #P".lisp"
      )

can cause an error?

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------
		     philpot@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov
From: dmonroe@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Darrel Monroe)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Lisp for the PC
Date: 8 Nov 92 06:10:30 GMT
Reply-To: dmonroe@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Darrel Monroe)
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX
Originator: dmonroe@huey.cc.utexas.edu

In his post of 5 Nov 1992, Hinrich asks:

H> Is there anybody out there who can tell me where i can get a
H> compiler for Lisp on PC's
H> I mean FTP-Server or something else.

and in his post, also of 5 Nov 1992, Eugene Melehov asks:

EM> I need LISR->C translator and/or LISP compiler to native code and/or
EM> fast interpreter . Sorry ,but I can't buy  this products because
EM> I'm student from Russia and havn't $ etc.

Hopefully this will help both.  I like Xlisp-Plus for the PC.  I believe that 
you will be able to find it on wuarchive.wustl.edu in the 
systems/ibmpc/msdos/xlisp directory.  The file will be named something like 
XLISP21D.ZIP.  The version I use is 2.1d.  It seems to be a very good 
implementation of Common Lisp.

Happy Lisping

Darrel Monroe
dmonroe@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: johnson@NADC.NAVY.MIL (R. Johnson)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Incorporation of Fortran CSCI into Ada system
Date: 6 Nov 92 22:10:50 GMT
Organization: The Internet


As part of an effort to add new functionality to a large real-time 
embedded Ada system, we wish to incorporate an existing FORTRAN CSCI 
into this system.  Does anyone know of any similar efforts - past, 
present, or planned?

- Russ Johnson
  Software Engineer
  Code 1032
  Naval Air Warfare Center
  Aircraft Division - Warminster
  P.O. Box 5152
  Warminster, PA 18974-0591

  (215) 441- 1223
  Autovon 441-1223

  johnson@nadc.nadc.navy.mil
From: jrt@hawk.dsto.gov.au (John Terry)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Re: MIL-STD-1553 interface?
Date: 5 Nov 92 16:58:21 GMT

rlk@VisiCom.COM (Bob Kitzberger) writes:

>Recently, someone posted a pointer to some work being done on developing
>a standardized Ada API interface to the MIL-STD-1553 bus.  I didn't save
>the pointer...

>Can someone e-mail me a reference?

>Thanks!

PLEASE!! ME TOO!!!

-- 
John R Terry					    jrt@aeg.dsto.gov.au
Head, Avionic Computer Systems,			    Ph:  +61 8 259 6982
Air Operations Division, DSTO Salisbury, S.Aust.    Fax: +61 8 259 5507
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: sakkinen@jyu.fi (Markku Sakkinen)
Subject: Re: Who uses Ada??
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 09:51:50 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.182444.28936@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov> robichau@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov writes:
>In <EMERY.92Nov6111557@Dr_No.mitre.org> emery@Dr_No.mitre.org (David Emery) writes:
>
>>>the estimated difference in lifecycle cost (i.e. the total delta over
>>>the estimated 30-year life of a particular system) was $45 million
>>>HIGHER if Ada was the development language?
>
>>I'd very much like to see a reference/citation for this, as it flies
>>in the face of both deeply held religious beliefs and also most of the
>>available data (e.g.  Reifer studies, AFATDS preliminary data, etc).
>
>The prediction was for a somewhat higher startup cost (including
>retraining, buying expensive Ada compilers (as though there were any
>other kind), and so on), and I suspect what happened is what you
>wrote: the higher startup cost was iterated over the program lifetime.
> ...

Thus the whole estimate was bogus!
I.e. the people who made it did not understand (or believe) at all
that investing in better tools at the beginning will save costs
at later stages, not increase them.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Markku Sakkinen (sakkinen@jytko.jyu.fi)
       SAKKINEN@FINJYU.bitnet (alternative network address)
Department of Computer Science and Information Systems
University of Jyvaskyla (a's with umlauts)
PL 35
SF-40351 Jyvaskyla (umlauts again)
Finland
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rlk@VisiCom.COM (Bob Kitzberger)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Re: Who uses Ada??
Date: 13 Nov 92 05:22:21 GMT

michaeln@cs.uq.oz.au (michaeln) writes:

> Is there an FAQ that might give some clues as to what aspects of Ada
> provide programmers with a sense of freedom

Sorry, folks, software isn't here solely for your mental gymnastics
and personal fulfillment.  I know it sometimes seems that way at
school...

If you want reasons why Ada helps you build reliable, large, nay,
_huge_ software systems, then crack open Booch's Software Engineering
with Ada, or Shumate's Developing Large Real-Time Systems in Ada.

	.Bob.

p.s. Does painting on oil and canvas limit an artist's expressive power,
     or does it provide focus for their expression?  Michaelangelo's
     Sistine Chapel and Chagall's ceiling of the Paris Opera show what
     genius can do when constrained by his medium (i.e. painting on a
     ceiling).  Various works by uncsonstrained contemporary artists
     show what kind of horrid stuff can result when you impose no 
     limitations at all.
     

----------------
Bob Kitzberger          VisiCom Laboratories, Inc.
rlk@visicom.com         10052 Mesa Ridge Court, San Diego CA 92121 USA
                        +1 619 457 2111    FAX +1 619 457 0888
From: beidler@guinness.cs.uofs.edu (Jack Beidler)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Re: Help me with Educational Use for Ada on Sparcs
Date: 6 Nov 92 02:26:33 GMT
Organization: Department of Computing Sciences

In article <1992Oct28.001306.21569@beaver.cs.washington.edu>, pattis@cs.washington.edu (Richard Pattis) writes:
|> Is there anyone out there that works for SUN and is interested in Ada for
|> educational use?  I could use some help.
|> 
|> I was contacted by an instructor at a small school who doesn't have great net
|> access, and wants to teach Ada in CS1/CS2 using Sparcs. According to him, SUN
|> will sell him the Ada compilers for about $1K per machine (he has 6-12) but
|> that Ada is not considered an "Educational Product" so support costs an
|> additional $1.6K per machine, which prices it out of his range.
|> 

Tell him/her to contact Verdix and/or Meridian.  It has been our experience
that they are willing to talk about site licensing for a lot less than
$1K per machine per year.

-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  John (Jack) Beidler				                   |
|  Prof. of Computer Science Internet: BEIDLER@JAGUAR.UOFS.ED      |
|  University of Scranton              beidler@guinness.cs.uofs.edu|
|  Scranton, PA 18510	      Bitnet : BEIDLER@SCRANTON            |
|                                                                  |
|          Phone: (717) 941-7446	 FAX:   (717) 941-4250     |
+------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: rlk@VisiCom.COM (Bob Kitzberger)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Re: Fun survey! (was: Re: An admittedly biased Ada/C++ comparison, by Ed Schonberg)
Date: 5 Nov 92 19:09:06 GMT

> 1) What is your native language (ex. English, French, Spanish, et.al.)
 
	English (American)

>  1b) What computer language did you learn (in order) ?

	BASIC, 8080 machine code, Z-80 assembly, Pascal, COBOL,
 	Concurrent Pascal, JOVIAL J73, FORTRAN, C, Ada, 680x0 assembly,
	Perl, C++, (plus various shells, LEX, YACC, JCL, DCL, etc.)
	
>  2) What was the first computer language that you wrote programs in?

	Wang 2200 BASIC

>  3) What assembly/macro assembly language did you first learn?

	8080

>  4) To your personal knowledge, what compiler would you buy for your
>     personal computer if cost is not a problem (you have unlimited dollars
>     to use)?

	Borland C++ for OS/2 (Ada9x doesn't exist yet, and when it does,
	it'll probably be a while before Windows NT or OS/2 support is
	provided, sad to say.  But, if I had unlimited dollars, I suppose
	I could commission a vendor to write one, eh? ;-)

>  5) To your personal knowledge, what compiler would you buy for your
>     personal computer if cost is a problem (you have to buy the cheapest)?
 
	Alsys Ada

----------------
Bob Kitzberger          VisiCom Laboratories, Inc.
rlk@visicom.com         10052 Mesa Ridge Court, San Diego CA 92121 USA
                        +1 619 457 2111    FAX +1 619 457 0888
From: btk@aber.ac.uk (Benjamin Thomas Ketteridge)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Re: More Ashamedness of Ada - this time OBJECT WORLD
Date: 11 Nov 92 14:28:08 GMT
Organization: The Cottage of the 2 Bears, Aberystwyth.

from message by jessop@ljohub.enet.dec.com (Class Dinosauria):
> Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

   .. stuff deleted ..

> DEC makes THE best Ada compiler and library system (as far as I'm concerned).

Isn't it rather obvious that the author of this message is likely to support
DEC Ada, (I wonder his boss reads comp.lang.ada :-) :-) )

But seriously: I would agree that the DEC Ada compiler is pretty good - I use it
every day. I would prefer to use the Alsys Ada compiler, but that is no longer
supported by our local support team :-( the DEC Ada compile-time messages are
very good, but it suffers from C-like run-time error-messages (this is not
surprising since the main program of DEC Ada programs is actually in C!)

The DEC Ada libraries are good, tho' I haven't tried using the X binding yet.

ciao
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|    _|--|_    | Disclaimer: I know nothing! Do you really know anything?  |
|     (\/)     +-------------------------------+---------------------------+
|      vv      | We've a Gremlin in the works! |      btk@aber.ac.uk       |
+--------------+-------------------------------+---------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada