HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: IO10781@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (Even better than the real thing.)
Newsgroups: alt.oobe
Subject: relax ... relax ... rel- zzzzz
Date: 9 Sep 92 14:16:03 GMT
Organization: University of Maine System


  Ok. I have a few questions that really need some answering. Here we go.
It seems that in order to reach a state in which an OBE is possible,
one must be totally relaxed (or dreaming). I have no problem relaxing
per se it's just that halfway through my relaxing routine, I tend to
fall asleep. My method involves focusing on a certain point on my
body and relaxing it until it won't any more. I start with my head and
work my way down my body, imagining the tension flowing out through
my feet. Could this be my problem? Starting with my head and thus
relaxing my brain and concentration in a way that makes it hard to
stay focused? I did consider this problem but haven't had any luck
trying to relax from the bottom up either. Only once have I had
success with total relaxation and I think this was only because I
had taken a nap previous to the attempt. But is it a good idea to
be fully awake when trying to initiate an OBE? It seems that all
the people who claim to have had them, had them after or during
what seemed to be a regular dream REM state. This would imply that
one must be asleep for an OBE to take place. Thus, would stimulants
such as cafeine or a nap prior to an attempt foil the try? Aslo,
upon becoming fully relaxed on this one successful attempt, I did
my best to simulate all the ideas involved in some postings which
told of simple ways to initiate an OBE. This included imagining
myself moving out of my body and such. According to the posting,
at some point the student may feel a sort of tingling sensation
throughout his body. This is supposed to be a precursor of an OBE.
About how long does it take for this tingling (or feeling of elec-
tricity) to occur? And how long afterwards does the OBE usually take
place for those who acheive this feeling?
   Come to think of it, what I did feel that night wa more like the
paralysis that many explain as being a precursor of an OBE. But
this ngiht paralysis I felt was more self incurred event. Like when
you've been sitting down for a long time and you try to move your arm
but it won't. Something along this line. Actually, I had read one
posting that said this was one way to acheive an OBE. A willing of the
spiritual body from the physical. Not being put off by the warnings
from later alt.oobe readers who said this might be dangerous, I tried
it. No luck.
   Does anyone have any ideas that might help me get somewhere in
this fascinating area? I am terribly interested, but being like most
Americans who eat fast food or go on Ultra Slim Fast diets, I want
some results and I want them NOW! :)
   Thanks in advance.

Captain Ugh.

.-----------------------------------------------------------------------.
| MST3000 * Monty Python * IRC * Ren&Stimpy * Erasure * Nirvana * Amiga |
| Calvin & Hobbes * SEX * The Muppets * Duran Duran * The Far Side * me |
| Douglas Adams * Fridays * toast * chocolate * IO10781@maine.maine.edu |
`-----------------------------------------------------------------------'
From: linebaug@barracuda.cps.msu.edu (Kurt P Linebaugh)
Newsgroups: alt.oobe
Subject: Re: Vibrations ??
Date: 11 Sep 92 01:35:23 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Michigan State University

I have noticed that many people are talking about vibrations.  I have been
trying to induce an oobe for four years and am not sure whether or not I have
experienced these vibrations or not.  It would be extremely helpful if someone
could describe these vibrations in a little bit more detail so that I might know
if I am on the right track :-]

I have only been following this news group for a couple of weeks and I apologize
if this topic has already been covered.
_

Kurt P. Linebaugh
linebaug@cps.msu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.oobe,alt.config,alt.dreams,alt.paranormal,alt.consciousness
From: gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us (Gary S. Trujillo)
Subject: alt.out-of-body newsgroup created!
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 07:42:14 GMT

I have just transmitted the control message which will create the new
alt.out-of-body newsgroup, to be used for discussing "out of body"
experiences (variously called "OBE"s and "OOBE"s).  I have included
in the control message a request to administrators that they create
an alias between alt.oobe and alt.out-of-body so that after I send
out a control message to destroy alt.oobe in a few weeks, any articles
posted to that newsgroup will automatically find their way to the new
newsgroup instead.

My suggestion is that everyone cross-post your articles to both alt.oobe
and alt.out-of-body once the latter newsgroup appears on your system.
Once we are assured that alt.out-of-body has been created on all systems
carrying the "alt." hierarchy, I will issue the control message to
destroy alt.oobe, and we will no longer need to cross-post.

Thanks again to everyone who voted, and to Jude, who helped me to count
the votes.

Gary
--
    Gary S. Trujillo                            gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us
Somerville, Massachusetts              {wjh12,bu.edu,spdcc,ima,cdp}!gnosys!gst
From: 9125113g@lux.latrobe.edu.au (Mitch Davis)
Newsgroups: alt.oobe
Subject: Re: Trouble relaxing eyelids
Date: 7 Sep 92 06:21:37 GMT
Organization: La Trobe University

In article <189ns4INNdkg@agate.berkeley.edu> marc@ocf.berkeley.edu (Marcelino Enriquez) writes:
>
>	experienced an oobe. My problem is that when I start to relax and
>	all of my body starts to feel numb, I begin to concentrate on staying
>	conscience. But as soon as I do this I have to force my self to keep
>	my eyelids closed.

Do what I do when I work on deep relaxation - leave your eyes open.
That is, let your eyes do what they want to.  If you become sufficiently
relaxed, then (within limits) it doesn't matter what is going on around
you - you still enter _that_ state.

Mind you, I don't have oobe's yet (thought I long for them).

I did a course which taught me how to enter a state of deep relaxation,
by accentuating the brain's alpha waves.  This is shown on an EEG (and
I've tried it) by the beta (ie, normal wakeful state, about 21-28 Hz) 
waves dropping markedly in amplitude, and being replaced by a big boost
in alpha waves (which are about 14 to 21 Hz).

[In the alpha state, your eyelids often don't want to stay still - they
like to flutter a little.  This is what causes the eye-fluttering during
REM]

This state is incredibly peaceful.  You are able to do some amazing
things - you can lose total awareness of your body, and in fact, even as
I look down now, it's as if someone else is typing on the keyboard.

This "alpha" state is great for pain relief, getting answers from
intuition, and getting quick cat-naps to pep you up during the day, and
all sorts of things.  I used it to give up smoking, and it was really
successful.  I also find that when I use alpha in lectures,  I don't
need to cudgel my brains out trying to understand the material - I just
sit back, and what the lecturer is saying goes in and doesn't come out.
It's great.

Now, what's this to do with oobes?  Well, I have no problem in enter a
state of very deep relaxation, but I can't seem to make the quantum leap
to oob.  I lose my body, rather than leave it.

Any ideas anyone?

Mitch.
Newsgroups: alt.oobe
From: ESRLPDI@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Ivan Ivanick)
Subject: Adolescent Questions
Date: 7 Sep 92 22:32:21 PDT

Hi -
  I just had a small synchronicitous experience (involving the list)
which made me start remembering some adolescent attempts at OOBEs.  No
success, then or now, but it reminded me that I had two ultimate goals
in trying for one :
1) Astronomically inclined as I was, I wanted a cheap way to travel to
   the planets & see what they were really like, as well as other celest
   -ial objects, and
2) I wanted to watch Denise Hausfeld get undressed for bed.  Sorry, but
   I WAS 13, after all, and my glands had the upper hand over my morals.
I'm curious what those successful voyagers do on their experiences - get
in free to movies, whatever, I'm curious.  And I don't recall reading
about interplanetary trips -- is this done/common/difficult?
Sorry if this is flip, I am honestly interested.  Thanks a bunch,
Ivan
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic,alt.astrology
From: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Subject: Re: Did Nostradamus predict the end of communism?
Reply-To: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Organization: Rosemount, Inc.
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 20:45:59 GMT

rpjday@cuug.ab.ca (Robert P.J. Day 277-3175) writes:
: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
: >Upon careful examination, Nostradamus will be found to have predicted
: >EVERY significant event. However, the prediction itself cannot be
: >understood, or even recognized, until after the event has occurred.
: 
:   Well, I wouldn't go quite this far.  He only wrote 997(?) quatrains,
: so, from anyone's point of view, he could only have predicted this many
: events, unless we allow quatrains to start doing double or triple duty.
: I think I would draw the line there.
: 

I have seen this happen -- the same quatrain is interpreted
differently and has been claimed to have predicted several events over
the last three hundred years.  Given the remarkable translational and
interpretational feats of N fans, I see no reason why the 4 centuries
couldn't have predicted every event that has ever occurred.

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  Should I start with the
Rosemount Inc.                                |time I SWITCHED personalities
                                              |with a BEATNIK hair stylist
grante@aquarius.rosemount.com                 |or my failure to refer five
                                              |TEENAGERS to a good OCULIST?
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic,alt.astrology
From: ata@hfsi.uucp (John Ata FSO)
Subject: Re: Did Nostradamus predict the end of communism?
Organization: HFS, Inc.
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 22:59:39 GMT

In article <92257.220503RVESTERM@vma.cc.nd.edu> <RVESTERM@vma.cc.nd.edu> writes:
>i thought i posted this before, but apparently it didn't work, so i'll do it
>again.
>
>i went out and bought myself a french-english dictionary.  how many of you
>true believers did the same? you can get one for about five bucks.  go ahead.
>see for yourself.
>
>here is my translation, with the dictionary aiding my meager french, of
>
>     nous sommes ici, mais ou sont tes amis, alice
>     la-bas, sur l'herbe
>     qui est le garcon en maillot rouge
>     c'est guy, mon cousin.  et le garcon sous l'arbre est son compain.
>
>     we are here, but where are your friends, alice?
>     down there, on the grass.
>     who is the boy in red tights?
>     it's guy, my cousin.  and the boy under the tree is his companion.
>
>as you can see, there is no man with a map on his forehead, no one rising,
>no one falling, nobody who was once a king, no one waiting in line, no
>toilet paper, no chicken feet, no old man, nobody riding anything, let alone
>a great eagle, no one calling anything an evil empire, no amount of years,
>let alone three-score and thirteen, and of course, no bleeding-heart
>liberals.
>
>i'm honestly curious: what made you so stupid that you would post the
>original french of what you know was a blatant mistranslation? i'm also

I took the whole thing as a satirical joke, but then maybe I got fooled..:)


-- 
John G. Ata - Technical Consultant | Internet:  ata@hfsi.com
HFS, Inc.		  VA20     |     UUCP:  uunet!hfsi!ata
7900 Westpark Drive	 MS:601	   |    Voice:	(703) 827-6810
McLean, VA  22102	           |      FAX:	(703) 827-3729
From: v085r6qm@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Erin D Markle)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: Skeptical of SKEPTICISM
Date: 7 Sep 92 00:13:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

I first will make no attempts to claim to KNOW anything.
I do, however, find the bickering that seems to permeate
all the computer networks I've been exposed to as somehow
misdirected.It appears to me that a lot of energy is 
expended on the conflict between the materialists and those
who wouldn't quite consider themselves as such. Perhaps my
view has been tainted by the "what a joke" thread, I DON'T
KNOW . 

      This is more a response to people like Branden of
"what a joke" fame. (I apologize if I spelled your name
wrong.) However, I didn't want to write this under the
"what a joke" because many people might not have endured the wh
-----ooops------  the whole thread. There are some books
that I think many might find useful in opening the "doors."
Yes, there is Huxley, but beyond him there is plenty to
keep personal reality maps ever-changing:
         Robert Anton Wilson-   COSMIC TRIGGER I and II
                                SEX AND DRUGS
                                ILLUMINATI PAPERS
                                (the list goes on)
         Terence McKenna-       THE ARCHAIC REVIVAL
                                THE INVISIBLE LANDSCAPE
                                         (w/ Dennis McKenna)
        avid Conway-          MAGIC; 
I HATE THAT!!!!!!!
         David Conway-          MAGICK: AN OCCULT PRIMER
                                    (that's w/out a "k")
                                THE SECRET WISDOM
This is a fairly modest list. The only one that is 
probably essential to changing one's reality map is
COSMIC TRIGGER---and it's fun reading for nearly all
the way through.

    Sorry about the computer splooge everywhere. (novice)
Hope to have interested anyone.
                          Swimming in pockets of larger
                                 pools of ignorance,
                                        Friend of Erin
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: cole@gaff.physci.psu.edu (Robert Cole)
Subject: Re: Experiments Wanted
Organization: Penn State University, Physical Sciences
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 00:57:51 GMT

In article <kdawson.25.715616477@AFIT.AF.MIL> kdawson@AFIT.AF.MIL (KEVIN D. DAWSON) writes:
>Hello "ALL"
>
>      I'm proposing a night out for my group over Halloween that would 
>include a trip to a cemetery. Once there I would like to set up some 
>experiments that would be evaluated the next day. 
>
>    Some ideas are...
>      Camera (iris open) in a light box.
>      Camera Long -exposure iris down.
>      Tape recorder, no mics or inputs.
>      
>Any other suggestions?
>
>Kevin Dawson

	Assuming such an experiment is viable, why a cemetary and why on
halloween?  A book that may interest you is called "The Dead are Alive"
by Harold Sherman who claims to be able to pick up spirit voices on tape
and explains how anyone can do it.  He claims, based on personal experience
through his communications,that the majority of the dead leave the physical
plane and are beyond our reach.  Some however, remain "earthbound" and these
are the ones we can contact.  These entities, according to him, are stuck
in our plane of existence because either they do not realize they are dead,
or because they are unwilling to give up their physical attachments.  They
are typically found in the houses they inhabited in life and may resent
intrusions of new families which would give rise to your classic hauntings.

	If Sherman is on the level and his recordings genuine, then the 
experiment you describe would probably be a waste of time even if spirits
frequented your cemetary.  According to him, it takes many attempts on the
part of the experimenter before he will be successfull.  Presumably it is
not the equipment alone which records the sounds but rather some interaction
of the experimenter and the equipment.  Somehow, one becomes "tuned" to the
spirits through successive trials.  In fact, Sherman claims that after much
experience, he became able to communicate directly with "earthbound" spirits
though the mind without the aid of the recorder.
-- 
-----------------------
Robert Cole            |
mail: r2c@icf.hrb.com  |
-----------------------
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: 00acearl@bsu-ucs.uucp
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
Subject: "Great Books," Indeed...
Date: 8 Sep 92 18:49:15 GMT

In article X-NEWS: bsu-ucs alt.paranormal: 4018, (Erin D Markle) writes,


\--Skeptic?
\--         Skeptic of Skepticism?
\--                                Tired of consensus reality?

\--These are some particularly cool books that tend to
\--blow holes in the realities of even the most resistant
\--materialists:

\--(especially this one) COSMIC TRIGGER (vols. 1 and 2)
\--                      SEX AND DRUGS
\--                              by: Robert Anton Wilson
\--        --- you'll probably find yourself blowing through
\--            vol. 1 of Cosmic Trigger in a sitting or two

\--                      THE ARCHAIC REVIVAL
\--                      THE INVISBLE LANDSCAPE(S?)
\--                              by: Terence McKenna
\--        --- Though I haven't read Landscapes (written
\--            with his brother, Dennis), by the way Archaic
\--            Revival went, i'ts sure to prove more than
\--            interesting.

\--                     MAGIC: AN OCCULT PRIMER
\--                     THE SECRET DOCTRINE
\--                               by: David Conway
\--       --- A real, live, practicing magician.

\--Hope someone will give them a shot..... especially COSMIC
\--TRIGGER
                    
I've read  "Magic:  An Occult Primer," most of Robert Anton Wilson's books and
quite a few more than I care to list and I can definately say that, if one 
thinks that these books punch holes in materialist points of view, then he or 
she should get off their lazy ass and learn how to think scientifically.  And I
don't mean to go out and get good grades in a science class or get hired by a
scientific firm (actions which too many people confuse with being scientists!). 
I mean to grab a book on deductive theory or something and learn how and why
the scientific method works, what it accomplishes and what its limitations are. 
I guarantee that notions like "concensus reality" will then be seen for the
shallow complaints which they actually are.

Aaron Christopher,
Ball State Univ.
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath)
Subject: Re: Request Info: Dudleytown, Conn.
Reply-To: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 21:36:40 GMT

In article <Bu9w3w.IE5@acsu.buffalo.edu>, v122pewm@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (C.S. Flunky) writes in part:
|> 
|> I am searching for info concerning the weird things that have been going on 
|> in Dudleytown over the past two hundred years.  
Huh?  What weird things?
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic,alt.astrology
From: stanley@verga.enet.dec.com (My name is...)
Subject: Re: Did Nostradamus predict the end of communism?
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 20:08:51 GMT


In article <1992Sep14.094222.3782@csd.brispoly.ac.uk>, as_radfo@csd.brispoly.ac.uk (AS Radford) writes...
>In article <1992Sep12.014030.26619@telesciences.com> msavasti@telesciences.com (Michael Savastio) writes:
>>
>>In article <1992Sep3.142519.21745@cs.ucf.edu> long@next1.acme.ucf.edu (Richard Long) writes:
>>> [...]                            Nostradamus' "Seventy-three years and  
>>>seven months" in quatrain B.44 may mean the duration of the communistic  
>>>regime in Russia.  [...]
>>> [...]                                       What does the original  
>>>quatrain say?
>>
>>
>>Here is the quatrain of Nostradamus which foretells the fall of
>>communism:
>>
>>Original French:
>>
>>   Nous sommes ici, mais ou sont tes amis, alice
>>   La bas, sur l'herbe
>>   Qui est le garcon en maillot rouge
>>   C'est guy, mon cousin.  Et le garcon sous l'arbre est son compain.
>>
>>My Translation:
>>
>>   A man with a map on his forehead shall rise and fall
>>   Once a king, now he waits in line for toilet paper and chicken feet
>>   The old man who rides the great eagle called it the evil empire
>>   Three-score and thirteen years, and now bleeding-heart liberals
>>      are calling it the same.
>>
> 
>This 'translation' is crap if my schoolboy French is still reliable -
>it bears no resemblance in mening to the alleged original - IS it an
>original, by the way?
> 
>>You'll have to forgive the lack of meter in my translation.  I believe
>>it is more important to capture the author's intent 
> 
>???
> 
>>than to make it
>>sound nice.
>>
>>As you can see, this quatrain (along with every other one written by
>>Nostradamus) leaves a lot of room for speculation.  
> 
>Not 'arf!
> 
> 
> 
> 
>-- 
>  Arthur Radford
>  University of the West of England      -------------------------------
>  BRISTOL, BS16 1QY, UK                	      Esperanto parolata
>  as_radfo@uk.ac.brispoly.csd            -------------------------------


You don't have much of a sense of humor... do you? :-)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal
From: shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk (Leo Smith)
Subject: Re: What a joke etc.
Reply-To: shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 09:35:00 +0000

"And the princess and the prince discuss, whats real and what is
not.."

"It doesn't matter inside the Gates of Eden"

Bob Dylan.


In respect of the poster who asked whether indeed his nextdoor
neighbour might well be a time travelling alien, as well as the
rationalist nerd who keeps saying that 'reason' discerns 'truth'...

Reason is a tool for arriveing at clear simple explanations of
already agreed upon phenomena in realtion to each other.

That is if we agree, in a consensus view that birds, and bird shit,
exist. We can come to some kind of explanation as to how the one is
associated with the other.  That is reason.

It is NOT true to say that 'birds exist' or even that 'birdshit'
exists. That is a semantic pre-requisite to our communication.

Now: In our current consensus view we can _concieve_ of time
travelling aliens. BUT it is not the most simple or elegant or
fitting explanation for why your next door neighbour wears luminous
green socks.

The truth is permanently inaccessible to reason. Reason and rationale
can merely help us make a VERY EFFICIENT and INTERNALLY SELF
CONSISTENT model of the world. So efficient and so internally
consistent in many ways that there is a strong temptation from recent
converts to the scientific faith, to call the models so produced
'real'


They aren't - not it the same way that the phenomena they attempt to
link are, and these phenomena in their turn are only our perceptions
of what is happening; That is out there something happens. We see
some phenomena which we interpret to group sensations into an 'event'
Enormous amounts of pre-rational interpretation have ALREADY gone
into the picture BEFORE WE EVEN 'SEE' the phenomenon.

..And then 'reason' takes over and starts looking for explanations,
and finally along comes some smart little know-all who will try to
tell you that the explanation he learnt at PhD school is the 'truth'.

Don't ignore him: He is mistaken, but his explanation is one of the
most useful things you can learn. What he has forgotten (or not been
taught) is that William of Occam many years ago made the point, and
had it adopted by science, that the business of science is not, and
can not, be the search for Truth.

It is the search for simple, consistent, efficient and useful
explanations and relationships between 'perceived phenomena'


What WE new age visionaries call 'consensus reality' is the area that
science is stumbling towards in terms of neural investigations:
Namely how the **** does a disconnected array of photo-receptors on
the retina ever manage to identify one set of stimuli as 'birdshit'.



Newsgroups: alt.paranormal