From: starbuck@ucrmath.ucr.edu (starbuck)
Newsgroups: alt.feminism
Subject: Women as Victims
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:03:35 GMT
Organization: University of California, Riverside

This was posted on soc.men but I feel that is is relevant to this group.
There was a time when feminists and I agreed.  That was a time when the
goals were for equal rights, eqaual status, and equal opportunity.  That
time is past.  I feel feminists have strayed from advancing socal change.
Their politics and philosophy have moved from advancing women and society
to a gender war.  It is quite clear that this is the case.  Several posting
have delt with this new aspect of defining women as the victims of men.
We may live with this trend for some years to come but I think it is the
death knell of radical feminism.

I think that it is very important to be able to know the difference between
women's issues ( Post-Feminist Views ) and the pure hate and fear that
comes form Radical feminism.  The Post-Feminist view is that men and women
can live together with mutual respect.  That women are not victims but
very talented, creative, thinking human beings.  That women and men can
and do work together in non-sexual endevors.  That men and women can be
friends.  And that love is neither mocked nor ingnored.

starbuck

TEXT FOLLOWS FROM SOC.MEN

From galaxy!network.ucsd.edu!sdd.hp.com!wupost!darwin.sura.net!jvnc.net!netnews.upenn.edu!msuinfo!news Wed Sep  9 08:23:09 PDT 1992

I just received a copy of Bob Black's _Abolition of Work and other  
essays_.  In particular I think that his essay "Feminism as Fascism" is  
relevant to this group.  Some excerpts.

========================================================================

As the title of a childhood classic points out, *Pigs is Pigs*-- and this  
regardless of the shape of their genitals.  Ilse Koch was a Nazi, not a  
"sister."

[...]

..Men (only) we are told in a feminist/Anti-Porn Movement (APM) diatribe  
in Toronto's _Kick It Over_ ,"have created the nature-destroying and  
women-hating culture."  If so then women have contributed absolutely  
nothing to this culture, or there is something more or something else to  
this culture than destroying nature and hating men.

[...]

For their own purposes  [some of which are as mundane as sexual rivalry  
with straight men for the women they both desire],  self-styled radical  
feminists actually reduce women to nothing but helpless, cringing  
near-vegetables, passive victims of male contempt and coercion.  This  
profoundly insults in a way which the worst patriarchal ideologies--the  
Jewish notion of women as the source of pollution, for instance, or the  
Christian nightmare of woman as temptress and uncontrollable sexual  
nature-force--fell short of.  They defamed women as evil but could hardly  
regarded her as powerless.  The new woman-as-victim stereotype is not only  
directly traceable to nineteenth century Victorian patriarchal attitudes  
reducing (bourgeois) women to inert ornaments, but denying to women the  
creative power inherent in everyone, it places women's demands on a par  
with those advanced for say, baby seals.

[...]

How to thwart femino-fascism?  That's easy:  just take feminists at face  
value and treat them as equals...then hear them howl!  The Empress has no  
clothes...and *that's* what I call obscene.

=========================================================================

_Abolition of Work and other essays_ by Bob Black
ISBN 0-915179-41-5
Published by
Loompanics Unlimited
PO Box 1197
Port Townsend, WA  98368
=========SunCat++++     | kamchar@ibm.cl.msu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.feminism