HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ridder@zowie.zso.dec.com (Hans)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: What is htonl() ?
Date: 28 Dec 92 05:17:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: ninja.1992Dec28.051705.4435
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation - DECwest Engineering

In article <1107@blue.cis.pitt.edu> stern+@pitt.edu (Eric G Stern) writes:
>... while the (BSD) network specifications say that four byte objects
>(network addresses for instance) are stored and transmitted with the
>most significant byte first.

Just to clarify, the "network specifications" are not BSD's, but
actually Internet RFC's, which predate BSD.  BSD Unix is just one
popular implementation of the RFC's.

>				Eric Stern

-hans
-- 
  Hans-Gabriel Ridder <ridder@rust.zso.dec.com>
  DECwest Engineering, Bellevue, Washington, USA
  "I'd rather be writing MACRO-20!"
  Any opinions expressed are not those of my employer, honest.
From: ludde@cyklop.nada.kth.se (Erik Lundevall)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: New hardware reference guide?
Date: 28 Dec 92 11:15:14 GMT
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

In <1992Dec27.192924.2501@ugle.unit.no> mortene@Lise.Unit.NO (Morten Eriksen) writes:

>release a HRM for the AGA chipset. When amateur coders start programming (often
>inspired by the eurodemos or games) they want something to happen on screen with
>as little effort as possible. Coding dirty and directly to the hardware means 
>that the coder just have to know the basic principles of machinecode, the RAM-
>structure on the Amiga, the conversion between numbersystems and a few other 

Yes, when people start programming they want to make things happen fast.
That does not mean they have to start with assembler coding. Languages
like AMOS provides a starting ground for those kind of programs without
too much effort. 
I am not too fond of AMOS for various reasons (some of them have been debated
here not too long ago), but it is a better start for a beginning 
programmer than to dive into assembler directly. 


>things. Coding through the OS means, in addition to this, that him/her also must 
>know a great deal about the Amiga ROM, opening and closing of libraries, 
>allocation and freeing of memory, him/her needs documentation on the OS for loadsa
>bucks, _many_ lines of sourcecode has to be written just to display a rasterbar
>on a black screen e.g.(or how about making a text scroll across the screen), and 
>so on. And this is just to get started! Very tedious and offputting. Lots of
>talents would be waisted.

Knowing some basic things about hardware registers, assembler etc does not
make a good programmer. I agree that as a start some easy-to-use things
are needed, but banging the hardware in assembler is hardly the way to
go then. 


>Commodore Amiga has made, and makes, lots of mistakes. Deciding not to release
>a reference manual for the AGA-chipset would probably be one of their greatest to

On the contrary, I think it was a very good decision. Not hampering 
hardware development by enforcing register level compability is a good move.

>Morten
-- 
-Erik Lundevall             ludde@nada.kth.se           
                            ludde@adder.adsp.sub.org    
Your fault. Core dumped.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: chris@132.236.236.21 (Christopher A. Wolf)
Subject: Re: Getting a valid FileSysStartupMsg pointers.
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Nntp-Posting-User: tc13@cornell.edu
Reply-To: chris@alchemy.tn.cornell.edu
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Organization: none
X-Newssoftware: GRn-beta 1.16g (13.12.92) by Michael B. Smith & Mike Schwartz
Mime-Version: 1.0
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 06:12:14 GMT

In article <1h4db0INN4m0@nz12.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de> ry53@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de (Angela Schmidt) writes:
>
> RAM: will place $00000000 into dol_Startup, but _my_ RAD: has a normal
> fssm! So I can use DiskCopy with RAD: and my disk editor will also
> be able to access it. If your RAD: has no fssm in dol_Startup, you
> probably have a non-standard RAD:. BTW VD0: has a real fssm in dol_Startup,
> too.
>

You are correct.  My memory was wrong - RAM: but not RAD: has a NULL
in dol_StartUp.  Thanks for the info about VD0:

> I like devices with either a real fssm or $00000000 in dol_Startup... ;-)

Me too.

>     \ /&\   Angela Schmidt cand. inf. (Nessy@IRC) | Amiga //

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Christopher A. Wolf   mail: chris@alchemy.tn.cornell.edu   IRC: cwolf (#amiga)

The rec.arts.sf.starwars Frequently Asked Question List is available via anon.
FTP from the Star Wars archive site at wpi.wpi.edu. "May the FAQ be with you!"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.programmer:17706 comp.sys.amiga.hardware:21952
From: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Attn Commodore: You are making a Big Mistake (Hardware
Date: 22 Dec 92 15:10:10 GMT
Reply-To: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Organization: Flying Cat, Inc.

In article <38m5VB4w165w@lakes.trenton.sc.us> rock@lakes.trenton.sc.us (Rockerboy) writes:
>andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel) writes:
>
>> Copy protection is generally added by people other than those who
>> programmed the game.  Often, its added by programmers hired by
>> the game publisher.  Generally, those people seem to be those

>Oh, foul!  Copy protection is deliberate exploitation of nonstandard 
>system eccentricities to make it difficult for people to copy the 
>software.  By definition, it is hardware hacking!

Not foul in context;  you were 'wondering' why certain otherwise OS
compatible games broke on newer versions of the hardware or software...
the answer is the copy protection, which is not OS compatible.

You are right, though, copy protection is usually hardware hacking.

>But the fact that said coding was done 
>by democoders doesn't place the balme entirely on _their_ shoulders.  I 
>suggest that they simply did what the company asked them to do.  If 
>hardware hacking _may_ cause compatability, protection schemes are almost 
>guaranteed to do so...

>> (How do I know they were democoders ?  Easy.  Democoders _always_
>> sign their work :-)  )
>> -- 
>> andy finkel		andy@cbmvax.commodore.com
>
>But that doesn't mean they would have made such rude code had they not 
>been required to do so!  ;)

Sure they would.  Most game publishers don't really get into
the details of the 'hardware hacking' style copy protection schemes.
They hire a programmer, say "Protect this", the programmer does
the rest.  I doubt a publisher came up with  'quarter tracking' :-)

And, no matter what else you think of democoders, most have some
of the 'true hacker spirit'.  When they do a copy protection scheme,
they try to make an unbreakable copy protection scheme, using
every trick they know.  Since the goal is copy protection, the
rude code follows as a matter of course, with no instructions from
the publisher required :-)


			andy
-- 
andy finkel		andy@cbmvax.commodore.com

"Unix is the Operating System of the future, and always will be."

Any expressed opinions are mine; but feel free to share.
I disclaim all responsibilities, all shapes, all sizes, all colors.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: uphyf594@unibi.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de (Carsten Hammer)
Subject: Freezing for debugging 
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 13:41:29 GMT
Distribution: world 
Organization: Universitaet Bielefeld


 Does anyone know of a programm that dumrpbs the whole memory and all cia
 registers and graphic registers into a file and is able to load this 
 into memory so that you have exactly (or nearly) the same situation
 as you had before you dumped? I want to test a programm and need to have 
 very precisely matching configurations. 

 ciao

-- 
Carsten Hammer         UPHYF594@unibi.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de
From: Tony-Preston@cup.portal.com (ANTHONY FRANCIS PRESTON)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Access to BIX developer sections or Developer's Mailing lis
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 11:35:47 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <72132@cup.portal.com> <1992Dec22.033305.45847@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>
  <1h7ttlINNai8@klee.uni-paderborn.de>

I would be calling BIX long distance (plus paying telnet charges since
my nearest node is LD).  How could I, a US developer get access to ADSP?
From: cg@ami-cg.GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA (Chris Gray)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re:  Big mistake - A compromise (of sorts)
Distribution: world
Date: 22 Dec 92 22:52:42 MST
Organization: Not an Organization

In article <1992Dec21.063421.6309@desire.wright.edu>
fheitkamp@desire.wright.edu (Fred Heitkamp) writes:

[stuff from me about making high end and low end Amigas incompatible deleted]

>	IMHO, why don't you give it up?  Non of the OS vendors, even Microsoft
>	are not recommending hardware banging in the future.  Commodore is doing
>	you a favor by helping garrantee that your software has the best chance
>	of running on a future Amiga/Commodore.

I mostly agree (see my previous post, replying to Randell Jesup). The stuff I
do for the Amiga has been compiler, linker, multi-player games, etc. All stuff
that requires the full OS, and works on any of the machines (at least as far
as I know!) I'm just finally coming to see SOME advantage to having systems
that can run the neat demos and games. (Not that I've seen many, since they
won't run on this A3000, so I don't bother to try to get any of them.)

--
Chris Gray   cg@ami-cg.GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA
From: paulk@terapin.com (Paul Kienitz)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Attn Commodore: You are making a Big Mistake (Hardware Manual)
Date: 23 Dec 92 11:05:45 PST
Organization: BBS

> It seems you've forgotten what makes AmigaDos so appealing : the
> custom chips facilitate the job of the main processor
 
This statement tells me that you don't know much about how AmigaDOS
works.
 
Like I said before: 95% of AmigaDOS has absolutely nothing to do with
any custom chips.  They have no impact whatever on multitasking,
libraries, or any of the other cool stuff except, as I said, screen
sliding and speed of window drawing.
 
> you would never have seen multiple-screens on the same monitor with
> a Mac or an Atari.
 
This is the ONLY difference in functionality that such hardware would
bring about.  Everything else could work the same, only a bit slower.
That one feature sure aint much out of the whole system.
 
> If you really think what you say, just buy a cheap PC with OS/2,
> which isn't much different from AmigaDos.
 
Not much different from AmigaDOS except it can't hardly run in less
than ten megs of ram and is many times as complicated in areas where
AmigaDOS is straightforward ...
From: laire@klee.uni-paderborn.de (Ralph Schmidt)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Access to BIX developer sections or Developer's Mailing lis
Date: 22 Dec 1992 21:30:45 +0100
Organization: Universitaet Paderborn, Germany
NNTP-Posting-Host: klee.uni-paderborn.de

jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:

>In article <72132@cup.portal.com>, Tony-Preston@cup.portal.com (ANTHONY FRANCIS PRESTON) writes:
>> There is not way Bix is going to let you connect as a "guest" without
>> paying the fees.  I used to be on BIX.   I would be interested in a 
>> developer's new group or mailing list, It would be great.

>Perhaps someone could approach someone from CATS and make sure they
>wouldn't have a problem with something like a mailing list for now
>provided mail was encoded.  They could of course approve whatever
>encryption was used and maybe designate a weekly passwd or something.

>The ideal solution I think would be if C= would set up a small area on
>their VAX as a developer BBS where people could read AmigaMail and
>maybe some kind of newgroup there or something.  

>I don't see any need to support BIX or the other commercial BBS when
>developers and C= aren't getting anything in particular out of it, IMHO...
>-- 

The NON-US developer use ADSP, an UUCP network. Almost every land
in europe+australia with a CBM-department has a node the local
developers can call to get the ADSP groups and the Internet news
groups. Furthermore you can also download software.
Some weeks ago there was a discussion that all developers should
be connected in this network, so they can learn from
each other and to increase the information exchange level.
The main argument against ADSP in US by WC was that the US developers
must pay for long distance calls but that's the same for almost
every ADSP developer......


Regards...

-- 
Ralph Schmidt                                            laire@uni-paderborn.de
University of Paderborn (Germany)
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.programmer:17735 comp.sys.amiga.misc:18992
From: rlcarr@animato.network23.com (Rich Carreiro)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: SAS C6.1 datecmp bug [Was: Re: Advice to SAS/C 5.10b users]
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16f (10.17.92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:48:53 EST
Organization: The Other Side of Life

In article <BzMJJB.84z@unx.sas.com> jamie@cdevil.unx.sas.com (James Cooper) writes:
> Let's see... counting everyone at Commodore (U.S.), plus the people here, plus
> the regular poeple we recruited through other means, we had about 70 - 100
> people testing the heck out of 6.0.  We all thought that was enough...
> 
> Doug was correct.  Out of all those people, things can still slip past... for
> instance, one of the things fixed in 6.1 over 6.0 was not being able to compile

Slip past?  SLIP PAST?  How on earth did the MATH=68881 bug manage to 
"slip past."  Even though I admittedly don't use it much, I fail to
comprehend how any decent testing procedure could have let that fall through
the cracks.  It wasn't like it was a subtle, hard-to-reproduce problem.

-- 
Rich Carreiro                                  Home: (401)841-8514
rlcarr@animato.network23.com
uunet.uu.net!animato!rlcarr
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: walker@twix.unx.sas.com (Doug Walker)
Subject: Re: SAS/C 6.1 math=68881 BUG
Originator: walker@twix.unx.sas.com
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 13:54:28 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.


In article <1992Dec22.071245.6332@desire.wright.edu>, fheitkamp@desire.wright.edu writes:
|> 	While we're on this math option stuff:  What is the correct math
|> 	options to use on the '040 CPU?

Any of them will work.  MATH=68881 will give inline code for the
built-in math coprocessor, or at least it will after we fix it.
This will be the best bet when fixed.

|> Fred Heitkamp,  ** Not an organization **
|> 
-- 
  *****
=*|_o_o|\\=====Doug Walker, Software Distiller====== BBS: (919)460-7430 =
 *|. o.| ||                                          1200/2400/9600 Dual
  | o  |//     For all you do, this bug's for you!
  ====== 
usenet: walker@unx.sas.com                            bix: djwalker 
Any opinions expressed are mine, not those of SAS Institute, Inc.
From: jimomura@tndb.UUCP (Jim Omura)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Stupid C question
Distribution: world
Date: 28 Dec 92 09:23:36 EST
Organization: Not an Organization

In article <ad99s461.037k@sycom.mi.org> ad99s461@sycom.mi.org (Alex Deburie) writes:
>Okay, I've had SAS-C 6.0 for about 2 weeks and I'm very pleased. Between GST's 
>and the Workbench interface, I doubt I could ask for a better introduction to 
>C on the Amiga.
>
>However, I have one very stupid (simple?) question. HOW DOES ONE COVERT A 
>FLOATING POINT VALUE TO AN INTEGER???!!!  I see functions like modf(), but 
>still that returns the integral part of the number as a float. And casting 
>seems to always return a 0!

     "Casting" is the way to do it.  Post a short example of how
you're going about the cast.  It could be a compiler bug, but it's
more likely something to do with how you're casting.

--

Jim Omura, (416) 652-3880
'jimomura@lsuc'
From: paulk@terapin.com (Paul Kienitz)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Attn Commodore: You are making a Big Mistake (Hardware Manual)
Date: 23 Dec 92 10:10:03 PST
Organization: BBS

> > About the only "contraint" I can think of that you have by going
> > through the system is that copperlists can't be as fancy.
 
> You have all sorts of possible interference with the resources you
> need to use.
 
Well if the user tries to run the demo at the same time as something
else that needs the same resources, give an ERROR MESSAGE.  Duh.
Lots better than obliterating whatever else is going on regardless of
consequences.
 
> may be in use, or controlling the display registers and also trying
> to use the OS for double-buffering may be out of the question
 
I should think so.  Why try to mix both approaches at once?  That
gives you no advantages of either approach.
 
> You may also want to try and make it harder for people to rip your
> graphics or music.
 
You're talking about a kind of copy protection here, basically.  Like
whoeveritwas said, the object of copy protection is to allow as few
people as possible to run your program ... this is basically having
compatibility problems just for the sake of compatibility problems.
 
> This whole thing about trying to make demo coders use the OS is
> akin to trying to make all painters use crayons, IMHO.
 
All I said was that the alleged "constraints" that some say make
demo-like stuff impossible through the OS are largely mythical.
 
I don't mind demo coders doing whatever they want in their own
circles.  I just don't want that kind of stuff supported for
commercial developers whom the rest of us then have to end up staying
compatible with.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer,comp.sys.amiga.misc
From: dnavas@oracle.uucp (David Navas)
Subject: Re: Advice to SAS/C 5.10b users
Organization: Oracle Corporation, Redwood Shores CA
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 19:05:02 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

In article <BzGqrA.4qI@unx.sas.com> jamie@cdevil.unx.sas.com (James Cooper) writes:
>FYI, in general, it should NEVER be necessary to use CODE=FAR -or- DATA=FAR,

As long as you don't use SAS' included proto files that define the library
bases without the __far keywords.

:)

>you should still be able to compile without the "xxx=FAR" switches, in which
>case your code will be smaller and a bit faster than if you use the "xxx=FAR."

Actually, I've found it often helps, and very rarely ends up hurting.
These things seem to depend on what other options you are using....

Of course, most of my modules are less than 8k (when optimized), so there's
almost as much difference in the overhead of the startup than anything else....

David C. Navas						dnavas@oracle.com
Working for, but not speaking on behalf of, Oracle Corp.
From: jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Access to BIX developer sections or Developer's Mailing lis
Date: 24 Dec 92 15:54:09 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

In article <1h7ttlINNai8@klee.uni-paderborn.de>, laire@klee.uni-paderborn.de (Ralph Schmidt) writes:
> jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
> 
>>In article <72132@cup.portal.com>, Tony-Preston@cup.portal.com (ANTHONY FRANCIS PRESTON) writes:
> 
> The NON-US developer use ADSP, an UUCP network. Almost every land
> in europe+australia with a CBM-department has a node the local
> developers can call to get the ADSP groups and the Internet news
> groups. Furthermore you can also download software.
> Some weeks ago there was a discussion that all developers should
> be connected in this network, so they can learn from
> each other and to increase the information exchange level.
>
> The main argument against ADSP in US by WC was that the US developers
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> must pay for long distance calls but that's the same for almost
       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> every ADSP developer......

People pay for BIX too, and get alot less out of it when compared to
what is possible with internet.

I think if C= would benefit the North American developer community
greatly by organizing some alternative to the BIX groups.  BTW, how
does the mailing list sound?

> Regards...
> 
> -- 
> Ralph Schmidt
> laire@uni-paderborn.de 
> University of Paderborn (Germany)
-- 
jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
James Miller

_chicchai .sig no ho ga ichiban iin janai ka..._
             Enlightenment Happens?
From: lkv@mania.RoBIN.de (Lutz Vieweg)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Help with GCC and G++
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 10:13:03 GMT
Organization: The Funny Farm
X-Newsreader: Arn V1.00 alpha rel3

In article <1992Dec18.131626.834@fwi.uva.nl>, Valik Solorzano (I88 writes:

> I'm having problems trying to compile a C++ program with gcc on my Amiga....

I don't have such problems... GNU C++ works fine for me... :) but -
could you describe your problem a little more detailed?

What's exactly happening after you enter gcc yourprog.cc -lg++ ?

cu, Lutz Vieweg
From: d2hacker@dtek.chalmers.se (Magnus Hacker)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: AllocRemember - how does it work?
Date: 21 Dec 92 15:42:19 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology, Gothenburg Sweden

The subject says it all. That's what I want to know (and of course how
FreeRemember works, too!)

Are you supposed to give it some kind of pointer to a list somewhere, or
does it create this list itself?

What does it return, aside from a pointer to the allocated memory?

Loads of thanks in advance!!

--
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
_-Magnus Hacker,  Chalmers University of Technology, Gothenburg, Sweden-_
_-                   email: d2hacker@dtek.chalmers.se                  -_
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: jdickson@jato.jpl.nasa.gov (Jeff Dickson)
Subject: Re: How to write handlers?
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 21:27:27 GMT

Jesper_Jensen@iluvatar.bbs.bad.se (Jesper Jensen) writes:


> A> me at the time, but I may be wanting to write a handler soon. Where
> A> do programmers get information about handlers? I've glanced at the

>I don't know, if it's much help to you, but I saw an example in the RKM:
>devices for 2.0.

>It was something about switching the left and right mouse buttons in a
>window.

>Hope it helps you.

>Jesper, Radagast@iluvatar.bbs.bad.se
>---

That's an example of an input device handler. Not the same kind of handler
if I read this guy right.

There are a number of PD handlers on the fish disks. These would be a good
start. The AmigaDOS 2.04 Packet I/O specification is contained in volume II
of AmigaMail. Other than that - you're pretty much up you know what creek
without a paddle. Got a question. Ask here. DOS is not common knowledge. 

jeff
From: paulk@terapin.com (Paul Kienitz)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: LockIBase
Date: 29 Dec 92 00:22:35 GMT
Organization: BBS

> Well suppose one would want to write a commodity to activate the
> window under the mouse pointer on keypress.
 
That is a tricky one.  What DMouse does is try WhichLayer() on each
screen in turn until it finds the right screen.  Then there's further
trouble because the coordinates in the input event do not match the
X/Y coordinates of the screen itself, and translating them gets real
obscure when you have e.g. PAL and NTSC mixed together.  I ended up
working around this in my personal DMouse variant by grabbing the
MouseX and MouseY fields of the screen itself, so it activates the
window where the mouse was as of the PREVIOUS input event instead of
the current one.

Does anyone know a way (preferably forward-compatible) to convert
arbitrary input event coordinates to screen coordinates?
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer