From: boserj@netcom.com (Jeffrey Boser)
Newsgroups: rec.games.design
Subject: Re: game system
Date: 9 Nov 92 04:09:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1992Nov9.030215.25285@trl.oz.au> s.mathers@trl.oz.au writes:
>|> Advancement can also happen by training (like real life folks).  A trainer
>|> is found and hired (for money).  This is a way to regulated skill levels.
>|> Just charge a huge amount of money for training up a skill.  But remember,
>|> this is open-ended in skill levels and stats.  The reason for this is that
>|> I dont think there should be limits.  I think there should be swordsmen that
>|> blurr when you watch them fight, thieves who can pick pocket you without
>|> you knowing it, mages who dance on the balance of power.  If done right,
>|> players should try to keep a general set of skills at decent levels (like
>|> combat skills), and then specialize in their field and stats (a mage will
>|> improve his intelligence at cost to others, cause *all* his spells will
>|> improve, a priest the wisdom, fighter str, con, or dex)  This also means
>|> that a balanced game can use their weaknesses to keep it interesting
>|> and challenging.
>
>When I sat down to design a skill aquisition system, I at first
>introduced job and training rules.  Then I thought about it some more,
>and dropped the whole concept.  I think its better to just let the
>player design his character given a certain amount of points.  Here's
>why.
>
>When you sit down to `roll-up` a character for a given game, you
>generally have in mind the type of character you would like to play
>during this particular session.  Today I would like to play a sword
>weilding maniac, you say to yourself.  Or today I would like to play a
>wandering vagabond jack-of-all-trades type.  Then you sit down, and try
>like hell to get the system rules to churn out this character for you.
>Now in a teacher/job system, where you generally have to roll for stats
>and getting fired from a job or whatever, it is frustrating in the
>extreme if the system hinders you in your quest to roll up 'your'
>character.  You generally cheat by re-rolling dice, or starting again.
>Now why bother?  what does this system do for you?  You can easilly make
>up whatever background you like for your character, and justify whatever
>skills he/she has.  Having the system hobble your freedom is just a
>waste of time and effort.  Let the players design whatever character
>they want, without folloiwng some arbitary learning mechanics.
>
>Its quicker, involves less reading of rules for the players, and the
>players will be happier.  I cant think of one reason to do it any other
>way...can you?

But Steven, I thought it obvious that this is exactly why I did it
this way.  Given a certain amount of money, a player is free to
acquire any skill he can find a trainer for (roll-ups assume anything
you want you can get, but during game a sword master would be hard
to find in a villege, or maybe not).

I decided to do it this way so that a player has complete freedom to
roll player as he or she sees fit, magic, combat, myth..  a character
can have one or two or all.  The only limits are money and availability.

I *hate* it when a game imposes absolutes on a character..  I figure
if Im a mage, and have enough strength, and can find a teacher, I should
be able to learn how to swing a longsword without hurting myself.
Or a fighter pick up a spell or two along the way.

I mentioned in my post that there are *no* classes.  I do provide for
some standard rolls with background for the races in the game, as well
as some religions rolls (I made a typo, I figure a healer that goes
around not healing people doesnt deserve the skill and it will degrade,
unknown to him).

In every game I have ever mastered, I have thrown the rules (carefully)
out the window frequently.  Some of the best times I, and many others,
have had were when no rules ever did apply.  (like the time I was playing
an ugly gnomish priestess drinking an Ogre under the table, and the
time our Fighter picked up our dwarf at a dead run and threw him accross
the river before he could protest).

With a good master, the players should work with him/her to create the
world as they go, and I see no reason at all why either should have
to roll that stupid 20 sided die to make sure that the hero leaping
through the remains of the door, sliding under the door, and skewering
the evil sorcorer will hit him.  This is fantasy for god's sakes!
(that, btw, can be fun too...  gods are great for messing around
with their minds.  sometimes religion can be a <grumble> pain in
the butt.)

imagination is easy.  anybody can picture cities on the edge of the
world, or ripples in magic viewing glasses, or evil-shrouded corpses
coming up from the ground.

creativity, weaving imagination into something you can share with others,
is much harder, and takes as much effort by the listener as by the
teller.  A tree falls in the forest and no-one hears the sound, does
it matter?  But that dwarf who was walking by, who had the tree fall on
his head and pound him like a stake into the soft forest ground..  now
it matters to him, dont it?

.....jeff