HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jhardono@ucs.indiana.edu (JUMAHADI HARDONO)
Subject: Muslims, Munafiqin, Kafirin
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 02:46:27 GMT

My brothers and sisters,
	Muslims are muslims who are 'mukmin'. 'Mukmin' means that people who
are believing that "There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is Allah's 
Messenger" without hesitating anything. Everything mentioned in Al Quran
and explained by Rasulullah SAW is accepted and followed by Muslims
who are mukmin. These people accept all of the messages in the Quran and
try to follow as much as they can.	
	Munafiqin - the dangerous group in Muslim society - are muslims
but not mukmin. This means that they say they are muslims but they ignore
and try to degrade intentionally teachings and words of Allah in AL Quran.

	to be continued...
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Arab U N I T Y
Summary: We are sooo different!
Date: 19 Nov 92 02:33:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: galileo.1992Nov19.023350.10156
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <1edu1iINN1kc@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah) writes:
>
>One note about your name Abdelgawad should be written as AbdelJawad,
>if you are a true muslim!
>

I was going to respond by saying: "I pronounce my name AbdelGawad, my parents
pronounce my name AbdelGawad,  all my friends in Egypt call me AbdelGawad, and
every Arab, Muslim, Christian, Jew and Bhuddist I know call me AbdelGawad! So
why should I listen to a presumptuous idiot like you telling me I am not a
true Muslim?"  but then I thought, it's not worth it!

>>You rule out race, language, and political stance.  I agree.  By similar
>>arguments, I rule out religion (otherwise, we would have to include muslim
>>republics in the former USSR, muslims in Afghanistan, Bagladesh, India,
>>Iran, ...). Do you agree?
>
>            ***     W h y    N  O  T  ?   ***
>
>If you look back in history, all the western Arab countries were not
>Arabic speaking countries, i.e. Algeria, Marraco, Tunisia, Moritania,
>even Swdan and Egypt.  Egypt was ruled by Qubts who were not speaking
>Arabic.  And after Islam came to these countries, people started to
>speak Arabic language as it is the language of Islam and Quran.  Arabic
>language was the original language of the Arabian peninsula.  An Arab was
>whoever talked Arabic and lived in arabia desert.
>
>When Islam spread, people changed their mother toungue language to
>Arabic and later on were called Arabs not because they were from the
>Arabian penisula but rather because they speak ARABIC.  A christian
>or jewish arab are people who lived or live in arab countries.
>
>Therefore if I find a muslim from USSR who speaks Arabic better than
>somebody who is from any where in the middle east, I, as an arab,
>would say I have much more to share with the one from the USSR.
>Therefore there is nothing worng to get all muslims any where in the
>world to be united under one government.
>
>The point is it doesn't matter what the people race is, what matter is
>what their common grounds are.
>-- 
>                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
>                 (______   _  |   _  |_
>_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |

Are you aware how different Muslims in Russia are from Muslims in Egypt, and
how different those are from Muslims in Morrocco, or the USA?  Are you aware
how different Sunni and Shi'aa are?  Can you imagine the Pan-Muslim congress:
"The distinguished gentleman Mr. Gamal Gouda can now speak"
"Jamal Jouda you westernized infidel! Why I oughta'..."
We are simply too different.

Tamer Abdelgawad

P.S.  I thought Egyptians spoke Arabic since the days of the pharoahs, at
      least that's what they show on T.V.!  But wait, in the Ten Commandments
      they were speaking English, and so were the Jews.... Now I'm confused ;)
From: skywalke@dino.qci.bioch.bcm.tmc.edu (Timothy B. Reynolds)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: U.S. Banking regulations (Lebanon)
Date: 17 Nov 1992 21:20:16 GMT
Organization: Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Tx
NNTP-Posting-Host: dino.qci.bioch.bcm.tmc.edu

Does anyone know the U.S. laws on moving money in and out 
of Lebanon ? 

E-mail response please.
Thanks
T
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: Arab Unity
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 22:12:45 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.173200.25476@cs.umb.edu>, ahmad@ra.cs.umb.edu (Ahmad Hashem) writes:
|> 
|> Excuse my ignorance, Aziz, but what does CLAO mean?

I beleive it stands for Commitee of Lebanese American Organisation.

|> 
|> 
|> Interesting.  But imagine that in 10 years we have peace treaties with Israel
|> who becomes formally recognized by all etc.  Don't you think you will have
|> more in common with a Moroccan or Gulfian than you do with an Israeli or
|> European etc.?  If your answer is "sure", as I expect it to be, then don't
|> you think this unifying element that you have in common with ANY Arab
|> should somehow be employed to the benefit of all Arabs?  I don't necessarily
|> mean one unified Arab country from muHeet to khaleej, but some sort of 
|> confederation or something a la EC.
|> 
|>                                                        Best Ahmad

Ahmad this is precisely my argument, I beleive the best way to achieve unity
economicaly, politicaly, and militarily through the Arabic League. The
Arabic League can serve a fantastic purpose in bringing people together
and distribute the wealth of the Arabic nations among the countries that are
less fortunate and at the same time foster cultural exchanges. The Arabic 
League could have served the purpose of the Western forces that have bombed
Iraq to the stone ages and drained the Arab resources. I beleive such an
approach is much easier to implement and will not lump people into one nation
that could create more problems later on.

We have been Arabs for a very short period of time, and we do not know how to
deal with all the problems we are facing. Imagine now putting every one in the
same pot, and the problems multiply.

A.Faris     
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: ilyess@ECE.Concordia.CA (Ilyess Bdira)
Subject: Re: Arab  U N I T Y
Organization: ECE - Concordia University
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 15:11:03 GMT

In article <1992Nov20.210838.2308@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad) writes:
>>         
>>>The people of Iraq, Syria, and Egypt
>>>developed writing, religions, Literature, architectures, and world scale
>>>economies thousands of years ago. They have done it while the Europeans, who
>>>control every thing we do now, were still food gatherers. Do you know anything
>>>about history?.
>>
Then...
>
>This 'ignorant idiot' (that's me) would like to point out that there were
>neither Christians nor Muslims involved in any conceivable way with the
>civilizations referred to above.  (Hint: B.C. means before christ :-))
>
>Tamer AAbdelgawad

Those Egyptians who identify with "Firaoun" rather than with being
ARabs first of all don't know what they are saying, and second are nothing
but westernized individuals who took from the western civilization nothing
but its most ugly side (the worship of power).

From an Islamic point of view, those so called civilizations above were
states of savagery where there is a king, his army, and the rest are slaves.
this is true of all precivilized societies (Roman, Indian, Persian, Egyptian,
and others).

Malik Ibn Nabi (a prominent philosopher) mentions that societies go through
three stages:
1)Precivilization
2)Civilization
3)Post-civilization (decay)

In my opinion here is a comparison between the Muslim and western worlds:
Region:		Middle East	Europe/America	
Stage 1		Pre-Islam	Pre-renaissance
Stage 2		Varies          about 1800's
Stage 3 	From 1400's	1960's and on

The degree of civilization here is measured in terms of
1)The status of the the general population (social, psychological,
intellectual, and economical). Here, a negligible minority will not
grant the whole population "civilized status'
2)The effectivity of the use of all available resources (human and
natural) for the advancement of the above mentioned status.
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Western Puppet
Summary: I'm surprised you bothered to respond
Date: 19 Nov 92 03:18:46 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <1eeii2INNkjf@uwm.edu> bashar@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Bashar Khairi Abouseido) writes in response to Jumahadi Hardono:
>->From news Wed Nov 18 16:58:40 1992
>->From: jhardono@ucs.indiana.edu (JUMAHADI HARDONO)
>->Subject: Western Puppet or Western Regimes
>->
>->	Everybody knows the western puppets in the middle east. Let me
>->list you those puppets :
>->
>->	Egypt : Hosni Mubarak and his regime
>->	Jordan: King Hussein
>->	Turky : Sulaiman
>->	Iraq  : Saddam
>->	Saudi  : Fahd
>->	Kuwait : Emir
>->	Tunisia: ? Can you tell me...
>->	Bangladesh: ? Can you tell me...
>->	Pakistan ( half)
>->
>->I believe that  these puppets will be toppled down by Mujahiddeen , the holy
>->fighters, insyaAllah...
>->
>
>Don't you have something else that you can say more than just talking 
>about the governments and the presidents of the middle east and 
>poiting to them as the only reason of our problems. And whose these
>poeple that you were refering to as " Mujahiddeen ", are you talking
>about " Mujahiddeen " like those who fight each other in Kapol. Or like
>those " Mujahiddeen " in Iran. I think we need actions not loudy voices,
>we need the poeple here and there to start thinking in constructive way 
>how to change the situation  back in the middle east, not by force but
>by peaceful and constructive way.
>
>
>-- 
>University Of Wisconsin Milwaukee    ______        _____
>Computing Services Division         /     /       /    /          Computer Science
>bashar@csd4.csd.uwm.edu            /-----/       /___ /       bashar@miller.cs.uwm.edu
>bashar@convex.csd.uwm.edu         /_____/ashar  /    /bouseido       

Dear Bashar,

Some posts you just should not bother responding to:
Clear flames that have no content.

Trust me, it's a complete waste of time.

Sincerely,
Tamer Abdelgawad
From: nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Bulbul)
Subject: Re: Arab U N I T Y
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:25:56 GMT

In <1992Nov17.063918.17594@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad) writes:

" I guess this implies we either have to kick all the Christian Arabs out
" of the Arab world, or simply force them into an Arab unity based on Islam
" (since we can't convince them!)

   Everybody is kicking butt, why not us? But we don't have to do it anyway. Xians
who do not like it can sell their property and immigrate to the States where it is
already better than Arab/Muslim countries, so they won't lose. Again Xians can stay
in a Muslim country, even if they don't like it, God expected:
       "wa lan tar.dA ^anka lyahOdo wa la Na.sArA .haTA taTabi^a miLatahom."
If you want to please them, convert. 
   And why do you have to force them? What will they lose, compared to today's
situation?

   Arab unity based on the Arab race is very hard to achieve. There is no way to
discern if someone is Arab or a foreigner who lived for generations and mixed with
the Arab society. If you want to base it on the language and culture, there are
nonArabs who speak the language and practice the culture more than some Arabs. And
if you want to base it on political stance then it is obvious to be funny, what do
you consider Somalis/Moritans/etc.? It is hopeless. do"i ya maZIkah!

" After all, Islamic tyranny would be much better than other types of tyranny!

   Your fear for belly dancing is unwarranted; you can marry a gorgeous gal and let
her belly dance for you day and night. Also my problem is greater than yours; I
prefer exotic dancing/striptease because it is more creative and artistic. I guess
I am too old for belly dancing (-; (Sometimes I like to wink with my left eye!) 

   But answering your literal remark, Islamic tyranny is the worst of all, especially
if the tyrant is a relative or descendent of the Prophet (MPBUH). Look at Abbasids,
Fatemis, and modern relatives of the Prophet. hAt ilmizjwiz yA ^aBOd.

   By the way, Tamer, what is your opinion? You've just been participating negatively.
What do you suggest? (Other than belly dancing ;-))

" Tamer Abdelgawad

** bismiLAh iTa.hadnA.
                       From a UAE song

** You give me reason to live.
                       From "9 1/2 Weeks"


Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:4922 soc.culture.lebanon:5051
From: ziad@eng.umd.edu (Ziad K. Cheiban)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.lebanon
Subject: Re: ARAB UNITY
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:03:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: eng.1992Nov16.170324.13292
Organization: Project GLUE, University of Maryland, College Park

In article <18037.9211121000@thor.cf.ac.uk> scemg@thor.cf.ac.uk ("M.G") writes:
>Many articles have been written about ARAB UNITY
>I beleive that ***NO WAY THAT THE ARAB WILL UNITE***
>as long as :
[reasons deleted]
>
>THE ONLY SOLUTION IS THE ISLAMIC UNITY
>
>
>M.G.
>
>CRDIFF,WALES, U.K.

That would also include Turkey, Iran, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Bosnia
A number of ex-Soviet republics, etc...
Is this the way to A R A B unity?

The sad thing is that a lot of people will agree with the original poster.
There does not seem to be an Arab indentity, when we want to look for the
roots of Arab nationalism we always seem to go back to the golden age of 
I S L A M. I don't believe there will be any kind of unity until the Arabs
themselves decide whether they want to be in a nation for all Arabs
or in a nation for all Moslems. If you choose the latter, don't forget
the Chinese provinces that are Moslems. We have a lot in common with
them and we certainly wouldn't mind getting in a war with China to get
those people to join us. (Hey it's just a simple H-Bomb nothing to worry
about.)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso)
Subject: Re: PALESTINIANS
Organization: The Turing Project, Charlottesville Virginia.
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 23:20:58 GMT

oueichek@imag.fr (Ibaa Oueichek) writes:

)  Well, what's your point exactly behind this question ?. And even if
)Palsetinian weren't a "people" but rahter a subset of Arabs, does that
)legitimize the occupation of Palestine by Israel ?

It might in that if the palestinians have no racial or cultural
differences to arabs in general, then the need to preserve their
identity becomes non-existent.

)the confiscation and expelling of most of the population who lived
)there ?. I hope you can put this idea in your head : Palestinians
)EXIST, all the world call them Palestinians, you like or not, It's a
)FACT. Israel grabbed continuously every inch possible of land by
)force, and any peaceful agreement must be based on the recognition of
)Palestinians' rights.

90% of Israel proper was *bought* by Israel.  Further, of that 90%,
70% was from large Arab land owners.  Further I don't know why you
think it is Arab land..  It was Jewish land 1900 years ago, and
turkish, and british, and others.

Sometimes it seems so futile for us to argue like this.  There are
major philosophical things to discuss.  For example, does might make
right?  I mean what does it mean for the land to be jewish land or
arab land.  Land is land and whomever can control it for the time has
it.  I mean ultimately that is the way it will be, always.  

My basic understanding is that there is plenty of arab land and no
jewish land, aside from israel.  I hope you see why jews feel a need
for a land of their own.  I hope you also understand that palestine up
until 1947 was defied as israel + transjordan (jordan).  Why can't
jordan be the palestinian state.  It's population is 2/3 palestinian?
Aren't the palestinian's upset at king hussain?  You talk about
apartheid.  He's a british transplant from the royal family of saudi
arabia.


roger

Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Subject: Re: Arab U N I T Y Flames by Abdelgawad and Salah
Summary: An apology for those who missed it, and a final defense of Gawad.
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 03:40:32 GMT

In article <nabeel.722209013@oracle.sce.carleton.ca> nabeel@sce.carleton.ca (Nabeel(Bulbul)) writes:
>
>   If that was true, you would have erased that gibberish. Do you know why Egyptians call you Abdelgawad? Because they can't do better than that. Do you 
>know why nonEgyptians call you Abdelgawad? Because you told them so, so how 
>genius of you to use this excuse! We, nonEgyptians, spell our names as they
>originally must be pronounced. So if someone is called "gasim" or "asim" in 
>Jordan, he spells his name in Arabic "qasim" not "ghasim", "asim" or whatever,
>and he spells it in English "Qasim" or "Kasim" because of the lack of "qaf" in
>English.
>
>   I did not see any "presumptuous idiocy" on Hamaza's part, but he might have
>made a mistake. You could have replied by the way your parents taught you or
>did you? 
>

I was out of line when I called Mr. Salah an Idiot.  I apologized in a 
previous post, and for those who missed it, I apologize again:  Mr. Salah,
I am sorry.

As far as my name goes:
1) I assume most people do not object to the use of local dialects in
   speech.
2) In the 'Alexandrian' local dialect, people pronounce my last name   
   'Abdelgawad'
3) Since the primary connotation of the word 'Abdelgawad' to me is my
   last NAME, as opposed to the actual reference to a 'slave of god', 
   which we all are, and since a name, by definition, cannot be wrong,
   I am completely justified in *saying* my name is 'Abdelgawad' and
   writing it that way.
4) Since it is highly unlikely I will change my position on this, please
   do not waste your or my time by trying to convince me.  If anyone
   insists on persuing this line of discussion, *please* post it under
   another topic than 'Arab U N I T Y', so I can Kill it in my newsreader.

Thanks,
Tamer Abdelgawad



From: robbo@hprpcd.rose.hp.com (Dave Robinson)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 05:07:41 GMT
Subject: Re: Re:CONVERSION US & INTERN'L VIDEOTAPES
Organization: HP Roseville Site
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic


	You can also get your tapes transfered to/from the NTSC format(USA) 
to/from the PAL or SECAM format from:

	RVT
	1911 Douglas Boulevard #85
	Roseville
	CA 95661
	(916) 773-3705

	They offer VHS (and  PAL 8mm, including Hi8) transfers. The approximate
cost is around $25 for 2 hours including tape and return shipping.
CA residents have to pay tax at 7.5%. They have a 24 hour turn around time.

	Of course you can buy a machine from Panasonic called the AG-W1 
to do your own. This machine is not cable/TV ready. It is a dedicated VCR
recorder/playback/standards convertor, so it might be expensive for the 
occasional use - listed at $2400. I did read that there are some machines
coming on the market aimed at consumers that will playback different
formats but not record them. The AG-W1 is listed as a professional machine -
hence no tuner!

Hope this helps!

Dave Robinson.
From: oueichek@imag.fr (Ibaa Oueichek)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Arabs in Latin America
Date: 16 Nov 92 11:51:21 GMT
Organization: IMAG Institute, University of Grenoble, France
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

Ibaa Oueichek (oueichek@imag.fr) (it was me) wrote:
: walid@dhvx20.csudh.edu wrote:
: : Salam
: : If anyone knows the answers to these questions please post.
: : 1. Where are the large arab communities in Latin America besides
: : Buenos Aires Argentina?
:   Sao Paolo, Brazil. The mayor is of a Syrian origin and there's a big Syrian
: community there.
   Sorry, i should have written Syrio-Lebanease community.
:   
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: mok@artemis.cs.wayne.edu (Mohammad Kanaan)
Subject: Re: Israel Apartheid????
Summary: Jews in Syria
Organization: Wayne State University, Detroit
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 18:09:55 GMT

In article <1992Nov19.165250.2371@island.COM>, green@island.COM (Robert Greenstein) writes:
> In article <MIKE.92Nov18012100@guam.vlsivie.tuwien.ac.at> mike@vlsivie.tuwien.ac.at (Michael Gschwind) writes:
> >In article <1992Nov10.203328.5784@island.COM> green@island.COM (Robert Greenstein) writes:

[....Stuff deleted....]

>>   It may not be valid to talk about how Jews were treated in Germany in the
>>   context of the Middle East, but it is most certainly valid to discuss how
>>   Jews are treated in Arab countries. It ain't pretty.
>>Depends on the country - historically, Muslims have treated the Jews
>>better than have the Christians, I have to observer though - many Jews
>>from Spain fled to Fez, for example ...
> 
> Historically this is true, but can't we please talk about how things are now?
>Life's just a bowl of cherries for Jews in say, Syria, for just one example?

>Robert Greenstein           Orthodoxy is the death of intelligence.            

Mr. Greenstein if you have never been to Syria how can you pass
jugement on how jews are treated?. Is it just here say or is it how
you were tought how to hate since you were young.

To your benefit, I come from Aleppo in Syria and lived in a small
nieghborhood that is 80% Jewish; I still remember that lady who
asked me to walk into her house to open the refrigerator for her on
a saturday and I gladly did. Jews in my niegborhood had their weekly
meeting outside where they talked and laughed and eate ice cream. I
am not aware of any incidents. This is on the personal level, as for
the national level are you aware that religion exams for the national
high school diploma are always done on a saturday so Jews would not
have to violate their relegion and do you know that Jews and
cristians do not have to take that exam and its grade does not count
so the minoreties would not feel excluded. As for them feeling left
out of the decision making process, I think all Syrian feel the same
way Muslims, Jews, and Christians.

To those of you who fall for these lies and distortions I want to
emphasize that we Arabs and Muslims are not against Jews or
Judausm(sp) we only are against zionism, the political movement that has
implecitly and explicitly stated its determination to achieve
greater Israel on the expense of its nieghbors.


Mohammad
mok@cs.wayne.edu