HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: karen@hal.COM (Karen Muldrow)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Handling Sexual Acting Out by Child
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:52:47 GMT
Organization: HAL Computer Systems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: zeno.hal.com

My husband and I recently adopted two children (a boy, age 6, and a girl,
age almost-5).  Although our son was in foster care with us from age
23 months to 4 years, 3 months, he was separated from us for a year and
a half before we got him back.  Based on his behaviour - we feel that
he has been sexually abused at sometime in the last year and a half.
He has been acting out at school (two "serious" incidents) and has some
covert behavior at home (fairly minor so far - we are working on it).
We have learned (in the last two days) that he once rubbed on his sister's
(clitoris) through her clothing - before they moved in with us this fall.
She is a very self-confident little girl and told him "no" - to which
he responded that he would do it to someone else then (She also stated that
she thought he was doing it because she saw him do it to a friend at
school).  We were surprised that anything had happened between the two 
children - because we had discussed sexual abuse openly (they come from a
family that has experienced sexual abuse for several years).  So far we
have no reason to believe that our daughter has had any other "sexual" contact -
but I guess, based on my surprise at her recent story, that I could easily
be wrong.

I don't know how I SOUND so far in this note - but I really don't feel
calm about tackling this issue.  It is NOT something we expected to be
dealing with.  We wonder whether we will be worrying about his behavior for
the rest of our lives (by the way, we also have a two year old and a
9-month old - both boys).  We wonder WHAT we should be doing.  I KNOW we
are supposed to be "constantly on alert" - but that is very stressful, and
virtually impossible in our family (we are a two-working-parent family - and
I am often alone with the children due to my husbands schedule).

Please let me know if you have any suggestions.

Thanks.
From: anon-1534@twwells.com (Suzanna)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Recurring nightmares
Date: 8 Jan 93 01:18:18 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com
X-Email-Accepted: yes

Nancy writes:

   I don't think it's denying your own memories to change the outcome for
   a dream....You can remember that the outcome went a certain way
   in the real world, and still decide that at certain times you'll 
   let your imagination generate other outcomes.I'm trying to get at
   an idea that memory has two sides--it's a reflection of the real
   world and it's also an event in a mind.

That is a splendid idea, that memory has two sides. I think maybe a
physical and a mental side to describe them? Or are you thinking of an
objective/subjective differentiation? I'm sorry, those are the only
two possibilities I can think of.

   You have a model of behavior that's based on "getting things
   right". I'm going to propose a model that says that a lot of what
   goes on between people has *nothing* to do with "right", but rather
   with power relationships. For various reasons, people want to
   control each other a lot of the time. This can be from fear or
   anger or for material gain or because controlling people is a
   rather creepy sort of fun.

Oh. That doesn't sound very nice.

   I believe that the people who raised you (excuse me--I can't remember if
   you were raised by your parents) taught you to accept a submissive position
   because it was convenient for them, not because it was good for _you_.

I'm sorry, I should have been clearer with the information I've been
sending. I was brought up by my parents.

   This is a non-expert opinion, but I believe that you were severely and
   unnecessarily frightened and bullied when you were growing up and that
   good families treat their children with more respect. 

Is that why children are noisy? They run around and yell and scream
and do all sorts of things. I never did anything like that, I wasn't
allowed, but I didn't think it would be bad not to. 

   >You have been very nurturing to me, as have the people who have sent
   >me email. I thank you. I am glad I found this newsgroup. I am too used
   >to being lonely.

   Thanks---I don't want you to be in such pain, but I worry that I'm writing
   to you in a way that reinforces your efforts to be "right". (I realize that
   trying to be "right" is a strategy you depend on a lot.)

I'm sorry, I'm not sure what you mean by "strategy you depend on a
lot". I always try to be right, but most of the time I get things
wrong and that's bad.

Suzanna



--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for an automatically returned help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: anon.645@pax.tpa.com.au
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Test
Date: 11 Jan 93 20:15:13 GMT
Reply-To: anon.645@pax.tpa.com.au
Organization: PAX - Public Access Unix (Adelaide,South Australia) - Anonymous Service
NNTP-Posting-Host: flash.pax.tpa.com.au



As the header reads...


--
** Anonymity & Privacy by PAX - Public Access Unix (Adelaide,South Australia) **

anon.admin@pax.tpa.com.au (a human)   anon.info@pax.tpa.com.au    (for help)
anon.ping@pax.tpa.com.au  (get alias) anon.key@pax.tpa.com.au     (register key)
anon.###@pax.tpa.com.au   (reply)     anon.post.grp@pax.tpa.com.au (post to grp)
anon.list@pax.tpa.com.au  (to mailing list about anonymous mailers)
anon.subscribe@pax.tpa.com.au         anon.unsubscribe@pax.tpa.com.au

For dialup Unix access phone +61-8-235-9010 - online registration.
From: anon-1531@twwells.com (Stella Rico)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: working
Date: 4 Jan 93 11:48:59 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com
X-Email-Accepted: yes


  I am not working very well.  I have a lot to do and I can't concentrate at 
all.  Things are piling up very badly and I am feeling bad about myself for 
not getting anything done.  I am feeling spacy and distracted.

  I have had some scary flashes recently, not really flashbacks because they 
aren't complete memories, but overwhelming feelings of being scared and hurt 
and abandoned.  I have been just letting it happen and crying when I feel like 
crying but I really need to get some work done and I don't know how to snap 
out of this.

  Does this happen to anyone else?  What do you do about it?  Do you have any 
clues to help me concentrate?  Please post the net if you can so others can 
benefit but if you don't like that then tell me personally.  Thank you.

  Stella 



--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for an automatically returned help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: arodgers@dcs.qmw.ac.uk (Angus H Rodgers)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Wallow and a story,too
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:07:54 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, QMW, University of London

In <1993Jan11.171316.6535@fuug.fi> an5055@anon.penet.fi (Dziga) writes:

>Mister Bear has an alternate personality that no one but me knows about.
>He is quite fearsome when provoked and he watches over me with an
>eagle eye. If anyone comes near me when I am sleeping, he attacks them
>ferociously with his  tremendous fangs.

>It may seem ridiculous to have a stuffed bear to protect you, but I
>can prove that it works.  Ever since Mister Bear and I have had one
>another, no one has ever bothered me again.  He is a good friend.

It's not ridiculous (except to anyone who chooses to see it that way).

I had a good friend-in-healing, a woman who'd been abused by her brother,
and she taught me all about stuffed toys (although, of course, you shouldn't
call them that in their presence, unless you whisper it quietly, because
they'd be hurt!). She died, unfortunately, and most of her toys passed on to
me, to join the ones I'd bought when I knew her. Now they've all passed on 
to my daughter (1 year old), and I'm sure they'll help to keep her safe from
all the Nasties. (Fortunately she doesn't have to be kept safe from her Daddy
and Mummy.)

Our favourite toys were Dumbo and Eeyore.

We had one Eeyore each, and everyone who saw them - all the nice people,
that is -- wanted an Eeyore for themselves. Eeyores form a secret
communication network among themselves -- a bit like a.s.a.r. -- helping
their owners to stay in touch with each other (and themselves, too).

I am quite convinced that Dumbo's facial expression was as variable as
that of any human being. He's been more static, though, since Pauline
died; perhaps his new mistress will wake him up, when she's old enough.
--
Gus Rodgers,  Dept. of Computer Science, | Cinema's worst romantic dialogue? --
Queen Mary & Westfield College, Mile End | "Mechagodzilla's brain is  installed
Road, London, England.   +44 71 975 5241 | in my stomach!" "I don't care if you
E-mail (JANET):   arodgers@dcs.qmw.ac.uk | are a cyborg  --  I still love you!"
From: cloister@stein.u.washington.edu (cloister bell)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: confrontations
Date: 9 Jan 1993 22:30:29 GMT
Organization: University of Washington
NNTP-Posting-Host: stein.u.washington.edu

anon-1540@twwells.com writes:

>ANON-name: Hillary

>I'll try to keep this short and to the point.  This is my first time 
>posting although I've been reading for a while now.  I have a question
>about confronting your abuser(s).  Everything I have read and been 
>told in a 12-step support group I am member of tells me that I MUST
>confront my abuser (my father and, indirectly, my mother) in order to 
>begin to put the pieces of my life back together.  

hillary, welcome to asar!  *hugs* for you if you want them.  you seem like a
strong and smart person to me, so welcome welcome.  may you find help and
healing here.

[ history deleted for bandwitdh ]

as to your question, i think the answer is no.  for some people it helps, for
some it's a waste of effort.  before you decide whether or not to confront your
father and mother about this, try asking yourself these sorts of questions:

   what do you expect to gain from the confrontation?

   are those gains something you can get on your own?

   how will you react to their various responses to your confronting them?

   will you be ok if the confrontation goes completely badly?

the point being, i suppose, to help you determine just exactly what your
purpose, hopes, and realistic expectations are for such a confrontation.  then
based on the answers you can decide whether to confront them, just send them a
letter telling them how you feel, or leave it alone.  even if you don't
confront them, the exercise is a helpful one which may do you as much good as
fonfronting them would have.

take care, and good healing!
-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
From: lmann@jjmhome.UUCP (Laurie Mann)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Convicted, Incarcerrated Rapist to Wed 17-year-old?
Date: 10 Jan 93 02:47:42 GMT
Distribution: alt

I heard a VERY troubling rumor tonight.  And since it's just
a rumor, I don't want to include the names of the people involved.

A man in his 50s was convicted of raping a young woman over
a period of years.  He was sentenced to 3-5 years in jail.
He's serving his time at the Norfolk House of Corrections in
Dedham.  Rumor is he may be getting married soon to the 17-year-old 
cousin of the woman he was convicted of raping.

It's pretty appalling that a convicted rapist could be getting
married at all, much less to a teenager.  Has anyone heard
anything about this?  Is this legal in Massachusetts????

*     NeXT: lmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com * GEnie:  Laurie.Mann     *
*  In Germany they first came for the Communists, and I didn't speak  *
*  because I wasn't a Communist.  Then they came for the Jews, and I  *
*  didn't speak because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade  *  
*  unionists, and I didn't speak because I wasn't a trade unionist..  *
*Then they came for me---and by that time no one was left to speak up.*
*       Martin Niemoeller     Why to March on Washington, 4/93        *
From: lmann@jjmhome.UUCP (Laurie Mann)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Anonynoyus Snail Mail from "Ms. X" and an FMS Theory
Date: 10 Jan 93 02:43:13 GMT
Distribution: alt

I got anonymous snail mail this week from a "Ms. X," postmarked
from Boston.

The snail mail was a copy of the Jan/Feb Mother Jones article on
allegations of sexual abuse made by a woman against her family
and then what happened.  The article read like something from
the FMS machine, even including a quote from Loftus without
identifying her as an FMS mouthpiece.

It included a very short and rather patronizing letter. 

I'm beginning to develop a theory about the False Memory Association.
That it is filled with perps is reasonably well-known.  But I think
some of it goes worse than encouraging perps in their denial---some people
like Loftus are only in it for the money.  Some of them see that there
are therapists and lawyers making money over helping abuse survivors.
So they figured they could make money by helping the other side.

*     NeXT: lmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com * GEnie:  Laurie.Mann     *
*  In Germany they first came for the Communists, and I didn't speak  *
*  because I wasn't a Communist.  Then they came for the Jews, and I  *
*  didn't speak because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade  *  
*  unionists, and I didn't speak because I wasn't a trade unionist..  *
*Then they came for me---and by that time no one was left to speak up.*
*       Martin Niemoeller     Why to March on Washington, 4/93        *
From: sonia@joliet.berkeley.edu (Sonia Marx)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: stuffed bears
Date: 12 Jan 93 06:39:00 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley

In article <1issh0INNctt@flash.pax.tpa.com.au> anon.33@pax.tpa.com.au writes:
<
<
<<It may seem ridiculous to have a stuffed bear to protect you, but I
<<can prove that it works.  Ever since Mister Bear and I have had one
<<another, no one has ever bothered me again.  He is a good friend.
<<
<<Affectionately,
<<
<<Dziga
<
<it is not ridiculous 
<it is beautiful and rare
<and i am glad you have found Mister Bear
<and asar
<welcome to you
<
<poohbear, who knows very well the secrets and power stuffed bears have
<

I have stuffed dragons.  A green sea-dragon with a twisted tail named
Dolphin.  A multi-colored knitted dragon I made out of yarn my grandmother
had when she died.  A much-worn lavender winged dragon that I slept with
all through college.  And a baby white dragon with tiny powder-pink wings
that plays "Puff the Magic Dragon" and makes me feel a sniffly three-year-old.

I *like* stuffed animals!
From: anon-1546@twwells.com
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: re: coming out as MPD
Date: 12 Jan 93 00:16:59 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com

Hi. I'm not MPD, though I firmly believe it could have happened to me. I
want to share a few thoughts about your question, though.

I read "The Three Faces of Eve" and "Sybil" at an early age and found them
both fascinating, so the idea of multiple personalities has been a familiar
one for a long time.

In my own recovery I have become aware of more than my inner children. I've
discovered distinctions among aspects of my personality, and have given
them credence for the first time in my life. I call them "parts" and I give
them names. There's Guardian, Fearful One, The Yippee Kid, just to name a
few. Any one of them by themselves would have a hard time of it, I think,
but since we work together, we're getting along pretty well. To my mind,
MPD is the same thing, a little more intense. The divisions are stronger.
So where my Guardian doesn't say "yippee" because she's far too serious,
she knows who can say that for her. In the case of MPD, I guess it's
possible that some of them don't know about the others, or don't co-operate
with them. At the opposite end of the spectrum is the totally integrated
personality (does it exist, I wonder?) that allows these aspects to flow
freely all the time.

Well, like I said, they are just some thoughts. I hope they help.

As regards coming out, you have to gauge your audience. Close friends might
be relieved to have an explanation for some unexplained behavior; others
are liable to think you're nuts. (People can be awfully cruel.) Also, stuff
like this travels really fast. And you can't expect that everyone who knows
will be helpful. They might not know how.

Just a few thoughts, us peoples. You've told us on asar. If you're
wondering whether you should tell others, maybe you should wait until you
know the answer.
Courage.




--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for an automatically returned help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: stephen@def.bae.co.uk (Stephen Paynter)
Subject: Re: Religion and a Support System
Reply-To: stephen@def.bae.co.uk
Organization: British Aerospace (Dynamics) Ltd
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 93 13:22:51 GMT

Hi TJ,

	(**** Christianity spoiler ****)
	

	I am a Christian (I'm happy to accept the additional appellation, "evangelical"
as well), and while not being a survivor (or victim), I am a regular reader of ASAR.

	I really know what you mean about the superficiality of many church groups.
Someone once described Christian's as being people who bounce off each other like
billiad (pool?) balls. I know that when I was younger, and more intense, I used to long
for someone to talk with about my failures. Partly I found that outlet when I met my
wife, and partly, I gained a more balanced view on life.

	From my experience with churches in the UK, which sound the same as in Australia (is that where you are?), I wouldn't hold out too much hope for finding
a whole church that understands. I suspect that your best bet is to develop some
Christian friendships, preferably outside of the Church environment. Away from church
most Christians revert to being human!!

	I agree with Ed that there ought to be more preaching of Job. Disasters befall the best of people, and are not indicative of sin. People with problems don't need lecturing, but friendship. 
	
	Basically there needs to be a more realistic appreciation of what it means to be human in our churches. Regeneration is a major, fundamental change - but it does not
remove all your problems. Nor does it kill all sinful inclinations. Paul certianly had
struggles according to Romans ch8. I think that calls for holiness and declarations of 
"victory" in Jesus are often presented in an unbalance way, which lead to the 
impression that Chrisitians should never have problems.

	God's blessing on your healing.
	
	
		love in Christ,
		
			Stephen


===============================================================================
S.E. Paynter, BSc, AMIEE                | "This must be a Tuesday, I never
Applied Research Software Engineer      | could get the hang of Tuesdays"
British Aerospace Defence Ltd.,         |                     Douglas Adams
Dynamics Division,                      |======================================
FPC 450, P.O. Box 5, Filton,            | These views are mine and do not
Bristol, BS12 5HD, England.             | necessarily reflect those of my
                                        | employer, nor yours either! Of course
Email:  stephen.paynter@def.bae.co.uk   | I'd change my mind if someone
Telephone: (UK) 0272 316108             | demonstrated a causal relationship; 
Fax: 0272 318092                        | no point in being intransigent about
                                        | these things. 
===============================================================================

Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: an4617@anon.penet.fi
Subject: Relationships are complicated!
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 21:51:36 GMT


> >    I was just reading someone else's post about being lonely and shy
> > and it struck a cord with me.  I think I have a more complex problem.
> >  I at one time was *not* shy or introverted, in fact, I was quite the
> > opposite (call me "social butterfly").  Somehow during my past
> > relationship all of my emotional energy got transfered to my SO, so
> > that now that that relationship no longer exists, I am having a
> > difficult time learning how to be with other people again.  The sad
> > thing is that during my extroverted times in the past I ended up
> > getting into relationships with men that were based on purely
> > physical intimacies; they were really lacking in the emotional and
> > intellectual intimacy that I now seek.  Now it seems like I can sort
> > of find the latter, but the men that can relate to me in this way are
> > not physically attracted to me.  From my standpoint, it is the
> > emotional connection that makes a man physically attractive to me.
> > Why is it that I just can't get what I really want, which is both
> > things (emotional and physical connection)?
> > Phoenix

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
To find out more about the anon service, send mail to help@anon.penet.fi.
Due to the double-blind system, any replies to this message will be anonymized,
and an anonymous id will be allocated automatically. You have been warned.
From: sonia@joliet.berkeley.edu (Sonia Marx)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: dysfunction
Date: 12 Jan 93 06:59:53 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley

In article <1993Jan12.011012.26720@fuug.fi> an4617@anon.penet.fi writes:
>[Talk about deciding to face abuse deleted for band-width]
>... I'm *really* terrified... I'm afraid of losing my mind, of
>being out of control, of losing my job, of getting so depressed I
>won't be able to get out of bed in the morning... I just don't feel
>as if I can postpone looking at this stuff any longer, you know what
>I mean?
>
>Phoenix


Firstly, congratulations on having made that hard decision!  It's a big
accomplishment in itself, to decide to experience the pain.  Stop for a
moment and feel proud of yourself...

I know exactly what you're talking about with being scared of losing 
control.  I've been regaining wrenching, terrifying memories for the
past year and a half, and I keep wondering when I'm going to lose it
entirely and be committed.  But slowly I've noticed that, while a
memory can make me depressed and listless, it can't actually come out
and make me fall apart until I explicitly give it permission.  As long
as I'm thinking "Oh my god what is it now I'm scared go away I won't
believe any more no one will believe me now" [etc.] the memory stays
hidden.  I have to actively think and feel "I want to know" before it
comes forth.  So remember that you *do* have control.

Good luck to you!

Sonia