HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 00:03:25 -0500 
From: Andrew Lewis Tepper <at15+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Eight Treasures

In Larrouse Gastronomique (sp?), under "Monkey" they say that (I'm
paraphrasing) "Monkey brains are considered one of the eight treasures
of Hunan cuisine." My question is, what are the other 7??? (BTW, has
anyone actually had monkey brains? A video called Faces of Death showed
the ritual; it's pretty gruesome.)

Andy
From: jane@soave.swdc.stratus.com (Jane Beckman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Date: 13 Nov 92 03:35:34 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc., San Jose, CA

According to one of my old botany instructors, you can tap
just about any maple tree,but only certain types have enough
sugar in the sap to make it worthwhile.  He mentioned that you
can even get maple sugar from California Bigleaf Maple, but
you're going to have to boil down a LOT of sap!

I've heard to tapping birches, too, but the sap has a kind of
wintergreen undertone that might make it unattractive for a
lot of uses.
--
  Jilara   [jane@swdc.stratus.com]

"The field of pseudo-science hasn't progressed much in ten
years, except to gain access to the net." --from ca.earthquakes
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: julie@eddie.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Kangas)
Subject: HERBALISM (sort of, maybe):  Vodka
Summary: pickled germs
Keywords: hic!
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 16:57:08 GMT


Well, I know that herbalism is covered under the guidelines, but
what about medicinal uses of vodka?

I recently got back from a trip to Russia where, in addition to
serving vodka in the shops (I guess you buy more if you're tipsy), 
many people I talked to swore about drinking vodka to stop a cold.  
The story is that as soon as you feel yourself coming down with a 
cold, you should drink a small amount of vodka (about a medium shot 
glass' worth) and you won't catch the cold.

Anyone else hear about alchohol being used this way?  I would think
that in order to get a high enough concentration of alchohol in 
your bloodstream to kill the bacteria you would pretty well do
yourself in too.  But then, as anecdotal evidence:  as I was leaving
my old job this summer, one group I did work for took me out to
lunch on my last day.  This particular group was known for liquid 
lunches.  Now I had been coming down with a particulary nasty bug:
sore throat, cough, runny nose, etc.  Naturally enough, the beer
masked the symptoms of the cold but when the beer wore off my cold 
was still gone.  It never did come back.

If this is ever proven will we have to get prescriptions
to buy beer and vodka?

Julie
DISCLAIMER:  All opinions here belong to my cat and no one else.
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: silvert@cs.dal.ca (Bill Silvert)
Subject: Re: Bagel History
Reply-To: silvert@biome.bio.ns.ca (Bill Silvert)
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 12:53:11 GMT

In <Nov.11.21.43.57.1992.1837@gandalf.rutgers.edu> deatz@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Gregory H Deatz) writes:

>This is the history of the bagel:

>On the fourth day the bagel said: "Let there be grape jelly to add flavor and variety to my Cream Cheese."

Grape jelly?
-- 
William Silvert, Habitat Ecology Division, Bedford Inst. of Oceanography
P. O. Box 1006, Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, CANADA B2Y 4A2.  Tel. (902)426-1577
InterNet Address: silvert@biome.bio.ns.ca
From: burt@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Burt Voorhees)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Bagels
Date: 6 Nov 92 06:49:41 GMT

What about the two martians, who as we all know are only three inches tall,
 whose flying saucer landed in New York and, on landing, blew a tire.
So they set out to find a replacement and were feeling quite dejected until 
they came to a deli and saw bagels in the window.  Going in they hopped up onto
the counter and asked the proprietor for one of those "tires."  He responded 
that that was not a tire, it was a bagel.  So the matrians asked what was a 
bagel?  The proprietor said that they were for eating, and offered one as a 
sample.  After munching for a bit one martian turned to the other and said: 
"You know, this would go great with lox."
From: weir@cbmvax.commodore.com (Robert Weir - Manuals)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Bagel History
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:03:14 GMT
Reply-To: weir@cbmvax.UUCP (Robert Weir - Manuals)
Organization: Commodore Technology, West Chester, PA

I remember reading some article (when? where?) attempting to 
explain the bagel's origin. A C. European country was to be
visited by some foreign diplomat quite fond of horses. A 
local baker created the bagel symbolic of the diplomat's
stirrup in honor of the visit. 

Or maybe the bagel was invented by a guy named Skolnick who, to
escape the degradation of working in his father's bunting business,
invisioned himself as the N. American Bagel-Maven O'the Stripmalls.


Food and controversy, don't ya love it?



RSW
From: Alan Deacon
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Bagels
Date: 5 Nov 92 13:25:42 GMT
Organization: Bloomsbury Computing Consortium

bobw@csg.uwaterloo.ca (Bob Wildfong) writes:

>In article <BZS.92Nov3030246@ussr.std.com> bzs@ussr.std.com (Barry Shein) writes:
>>
>>Other than this I have no idea other than outside of NYC bagels appear
>>to not yet have a history.
>>
>>--
>>        -Barry Shein

>Except in the Engineering buildings at the U. of Waterloo where bagels and
>cream cheese have been the staple food of Eng students for countless years.

But remember "a topologist is someone who can't tell a bagel/doughnut from
a cup of coffee."

>Bob Wildfong                                       bobw@csg.uwaterloo.ca
>Waterloo, Ontario                                  bobw@csg.waterloo.edu
>#include <stddisclaimer.h>
--
	Alan Deacon
	Central Computing Service		Email: a.deacon@ucl.ac.uk
	University College London		Tel: +44 71-380 7359
	Gower Street, London WC1E 6BT		Fax: +44 71-388 5406
From: burt@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Burt Voorhees)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: HERBALISM (sort of, maybe): Vodka
Keywords: hic!
Date: 13 Nov 92 01:37:35 GMT

[re: booze as cold remedy]

To the extent that being uptight, stressed out, etc., contributes
to lowering your resistance to a cold, a bit of booze  might be
just the thing--loosens you up, ylou relax, revive with a happier
and more social out look on life, etc., and your immune system
gets strongr  sf
bv
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: dadams@cray.com (David Adams)
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Reply-To: dadams@cray.com
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 6 Nov 92 14:07:28 CST

In article 17568@bcars664.bnr.ca, hwt@bcarh11a.BNR.CA (Henry Troup) writes:
|
| City maples should not be tapped.
|

Why not?

|  It's best to
|tap on the south side.
|

Why?


Arn't we just full of questions?

|
|I haven't mentioned pipeline systems, Sunday buckets, or native American
|techniques.  If you want to know, ask.
|
Ok, we want to know.


---
--David C. Adams  Statistician  Cray Research Inc.  dadams@cray.com
___________________________________________________________________
       Old Sourdoughs never die.  They just ferment away.



Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: Ramon Tate
Subject: Re: Bagels
Organization: Computer Systems Lab., NIH
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 16:28:54 GMT

In article <burt.721032581@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca>
burt@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Burt Voorhees) writes:
>What about the two martians, who as we all know are only three inches tall,
> whose flying saucer landed in New York and, on landing, blew a tire.
>So they set out to find a replacement and were feeling quite dejected until 
>they came to a deli and saw bagels in the window.  Going in they hopped up
onto
>the counter and asked the proprietor for one of those "tires."  He responded 
>that that was not a tire, it was a bagel.  So the matrians asked what was a 
>bagel?  The proprietor said that they were for eating, and offered one as a 
>sample.  After munching for a bit one martian turned to the other and said: 
>"You know, this would go great with lox."
>
Truly an historic (read: *ancient*) joke....

tate@faxcsl.dcrt.nih.gov
From: hecate@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: re: Bagels
Date: 5 Nov 92 10:33:42 -0400
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

And don't forget the bagels from Montreal, whose
devotees swear they are the original 'manna from
heaven'.
A local store even flies them in from Montreal-
St. Viatur st., I beleive. 

Julia Holland
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: rferris@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Rebecca R Ferris)
Subject: Re: HERBALISM (sort of, maybe): Vodka
Keywords: hic!
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 13:34:23 GMT

my mother said that when she was a little girl in the thirties, her mother
(who otherwise allowed no liquor in the house--uncles had to drink "secretly"
by the barn) kept one bottle of whiskey in the house for--as they say--
medicinal purposes.  and the only time that bottle ever came out was when
she or her daughters had a cold.  then it was served up in a spoon just
like your (most) favorite cough syrup!
From: deatz@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Gregory H Deatz)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Bagel History
Date: 12 Nov 92 02:43:58 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

This is the history of the bagel:

In the beginning there was the bagel; and everything in the universe was the bagel. Until the bagel got lonely.

On the first day the bagel said: "Let there be fire, so that I may cook myself." And there was fire, and it was good.

On the second day the bagel said: "Let there be cream cheese to make me yummy." And there was cream cheese, and it was really, really good.

On the third day the bagel said: "Let there be poppy seeds to fall about me and cover me in their glory." And there were poppy seeds, and they made the bagel happy.

On the fourth day the bagel said: "Let there be grape jelly to add flavor and variety to my Cream Cheese."

DAY FIVE: BUTTER

DAY SIX: HUMANS (to eat the bagel)

DAY SEVEN: the bagel looked out on what it had made, and declared that the seventh day should be a day of rest and feasting--provided only that bagels were eaten.

you see, the universe is the shape of a bagel......
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: mad@cs.wm.edu (Michael A. Dritschel)
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Organization: College of William & Mary, founded 1693
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 19:52:09 GMT

Jilara [jane@swdc.stratus.com] writes:

   According to one of my old botany instructors, you can tap
   just about any maple tree,but only certain types have enough
   sugar in the sap to make it worthwhile.  He mentioned that you
   can even get maple sugar from California Bigleaf Maple, but
   you're going to have to boil down a LOT of sap!

Speaking from personal experience, at least this is possible with red
maples in the eastern U.S.  For several years while living in the
country near Charlottesville, Virginia, I tapped red maples (the most
common variety where I lived), boiling down the sap on top of a wood
stove used to heat the house where I lived.  It took between 40 and 50
gallons of sap to make one quart of maple syrup.  I used home-made
taps, which were short tapered dowels with a hole (these were made
from dogwood, though I imagine any nonaromatic wood would work).  I
attached to these plastic tubes which were then attached to plastic
water jugs (all rather primitive, but effective).  Every few days or
so I would make a round of the trees, collecting the sap, going more
frequently when the weather was sunny and a little above freezing
(this seemed to be when there was the greatest sap flow).  I tapped
the trees in February and collected sap for about a month or so.  Some
trees had noticably sweeter sap, and oddly they weren't all in sinc as
to when they had the heaviest outputs.  Also on large trees with
several taps, the rate would vary between taps, sometimes being
greater in one and sometimes in another.

Anyway, when I had finished cooking down the sap to syrup, I would
have a big breakfast party with lots of people eating waffles and
pancakes, and there would be little syrup left over after that.  But I
always thought it tasted better fresh and with good company.
-- 
Michael A. Dritschel          mad@cs.wm.edu

Department of Mathematics
The College of William and Mary
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: stcmille@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Stephen C. Miller)
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 20:59:06 GMT

I think it would be fun to hear about native american techniques.  After
all, they didn't have metal spiles.  Good word, spile.

Do any other trees produce sap sweet enough to boil down?  If not, why
are maples unique in this?  Can you speculate that there is some
directed evolutionary way in which humans have influenced maples to
increase the concentration of sugar in their sap?  What kind of sugar is
it, anyway?  Please, tell us more about the scientific side of this.

Oh.  Also please give me $20.

But seriuosly, if you want to tell us more about maple syrup I'd love to
hear it.  
-- 
--------------------
=
(former grad star turned rock student)
Steve Miller	 		    stcmille@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: jclose@chesapeake.ads.com (Jeff Close)
Subject: Re: Bagels
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems division of Booz, Allen & Hamilton
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 18:06:58 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.103342.8643@ac.dal.ca> hecate@ac.dal.ca writes:
>And don't forget the bagels from Montreal, whose
>devotees swear they are the original 'manna from
>heaven'.
>A local store even flies them in from Montreal-
>St. Viatur st., I beleive. 
>
>Julia Holland

YES!  We were in Montreal about a year ago and made it up to the old Jewish
section (great delis, btw).  They still make bagels by hand, very rapidly!

jeff
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
jclose@ads.com: ADS BA&H/1953 Gallows Rd #600/Vienna, VA 22182 703-902-7150

Anarchists don't believe in rules.  Surrealists make up their own.
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: 'Fundamentals' of Italian cooking ...?
From: sgl@aeg.dsto.gov.au (Simon Langsford)
Date: 13 Nov 92 14:14:18 CST
Reply-To: sgl@aeg.dsto.gov.au
Followup-To: rec.food.historic
Distribution: world
Organization: Aeronautical Research Laboratory

Hi all

A bit of a general question for you - and I need (any) answers as 
soon as possible - as part of an assignment discussing the 
influences of Italian immigrants in Australia their effects on 
"food" are to be considered - so as a starting point for that,
I was just wondering if anyone out there could describe 
fundamentals of Italian cooking and foods. That is, what
distinguishes 'traditional' Italian meals etc from that
of other nationalities, and how this has been introduced 
to other societies today. 

Thanks 

Simon
Email : sgl@aeg.dsto.gov.au
From: SCG107@psuvm.psu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Date: 9 Nov 92 22:54:19 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

In article <1992Nov6.140728.2196@hemlock.cray.com>, dadams@cray.com (David
Adams) says:
>
>In article 17568@bcars664.bnr.ca, hwt@bcarh11a.BNR.CA (Henry Troup) writes:
>|
>| City maples should not be tapped.
>|
>
>Why not?

My guess is that because trees growing in the city are already stressed because
of the less than ideal growing conditions, tapping them would hurt them too
much (it is hard on the tree, after all.)

>|  It's best to
>|tap on the south side.
>|
>
>Why?

Perhaps because in the Northern Hemisphere the south side gets the most
sunlight and is warmest, so the sap is flowing better?? (And the north side
is coolest, so the moss grows best there. :-) )

Your friendly neighborhood botanist!

--
Sarah Goslee                  "Common sense is what tells you that the
scg107@psuvm.psu.edu            world is flat."  -Principia Discordia
From: loosemore-sandra@cs.yale.edu (Sandra Loosemore)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Date: 13 Nov 1992 08:32:31 -0500
Organization: staff hacker @ Yale Haskell project
NNTP-Posting-Host: functor.systemsz.cs.yale.edu
In-reply-to: root@vinevalley.mc.xerox.com's message of Tue, 10 Nov 1992 21:03:25 GMT

root@vinevalley.mc.xerox.com (Operator) writes:

   >Do any other trees produce sap sweet enough to boil down ?

   Yes, actually any type of hardwood tree can be use.

Hmmm.  When I was a teenager living in Michigan, my brothers and I
used to make syrup from the trees on our woodlot.  Problem is, they
were mixed hardwoods, and without their leaves on it can be pretty
difficult to identify the sugar maples.  We used to joke about
how we'd probably tapped some "poison ivy trees" by mistake!

-Sandra
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: Norman.Miller@launchpad.unc.edu (Norman Miller)
Subject: bublichki/bagels
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 13:47:07 GMT


It's been suggested (sorry, I don't remember who) that bagels
are Ukrainian or Slavic in origin.  Maybe.  What's clearly 
needed is a chronology so that we can decide between the beugel/
bagel and bublik/bublichke hypotheses.

  
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: leighann@rocky.sybase.com (Leigh Ann Hussey)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Saxon Violins...
Date: 10 Nov 92 17:58:04 GMT
Organization: Sybase, Inc., Emeryville, CA

Greetings, all!

Well, I've been drafted to cook a Medieval feast for the investiture of a
prince in the SCA.  It's supposed to be a Saxon feast, so I've plotted out
a menu, but what I could really use is some Medieval recipes for this stuff
-- I only have one or two period cookbook redactions.  Feast is 30 Jan, so
please send your recipes soon!  Here's the menu:

FIRST REMOVE
 Chicken soup
 some kind of egg dish
 cheeses (I have recipes for these already; will also get some commercial)
 nuts, fruit (apricots, pears, apples), pickles

	SOTELTIE: Heorot (Hrothgar's hall, in _Beowulf_; gingerbread...
	 maybe a little Grendel stalking it...;-)

SECOND REMOVE
 roast salmon (don't really need recipe for this)
 eels (do want recipes; if I can get anyone to eat them!)
 roast goose
 something to do with many jointed chickens
 barley
 leeks (need recipes)

	SOTELTIE: something else with a Saxon theme -- help?

THIRD REMOVE
 whole roast pig (got this recipe already)
 venison/beef in coffyn (ditto)
 sausages (ditto)
 bashed neeps (ditto)
 fava beans (need recipes)
 cabbage (?)

	SOTELTIE: the Black Swan of Cynagua (individual marzipan feathers;
	  how do I dye them black in a period fashion?  No squid ink, thanks)

FOURTH REMOVE
 Sweets.  Here I need the most help, as I don't even have an idea what I
  want to put here.

Breads throughout -- probably including trenchers for the high table.

I wonder if I oughtn't to switch the second (fish/fowl) and third (flesh)
courses, so I'm not so much building up to the heavy stuff.  Unfortunately,
I don't remember off the top of my head what's the traditional order, though
I know I read it somewhile back...

Thanking you in advance...

	- Leigh Ann

---------------
Leigh Ann Hussey      
leighann@sybase.com        {sun,lll-tis,pyramid,pacbell}!sybase!leighann
"Turkeys, heresy, hops and beer / All came to England in the one year."
What year?  Under debate, but seems to be closer to 1523...
From: root@vinevalley.mc.xerox.com (Operator)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Date: 10 Nov 92 21:03:25 GMT
Reply-To: root@vinevalley.mc.xerox.com
Organization: Xerox


>Do any other trees produce sap sweet enough to boil down ?

Yes, actually any type of hardwood tree can be use. The sugar content of Maples is highest there fore the least amount of sap is required. As far as the amount of sugar content in the maples, I haven't seen anything to support an attempt at selection of Maple based on the sugar content. This would be very difficult because the variables that effect the syrup season to season is too uncontrolable. The main three factors are water and temperature and length of season. Since a tree planted 20 feet from anothe








r may have completely different amount of water available to the roots, there will be a difference in the amount of sap from each tree. Also the amount of direct sunlight and warmth will vary with location of the trees. This is why is is best to tap on the south side, when sap is running warmth will help to let the sap flow.

I do not know what type of sugar is in the sap. (  Sucrose I'd guess )


And the complete reason not to tap trees in the city as well as trees in the country near a roadway is because the lead level from car emissions seaps into the gound water and into the tree as a result.
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: mccoy@ils.nwu.edu (Jim Mccoy)
Subject: Re: Tapping Maples, making syrup (long)
Reply-To: mccoy@ils.nwu.edu
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 04:54:36 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.140728.2196@hemlock.cray.com>, dadams@cray.com (David Adams) writes:
> In article 17568@bcars664.bnr.ca, hwt@bcarh11a.BNR.CA (Henry Troup) writes:
> |
> | City maples should not be tapped.
> |
> 
> Why not?

Well, I would be hesitant even if Mr. Troup hadn't mentioned it.  The sap
you are collecting is what the trees have processed in the leaves.  I would
assume that this means you are going to get whatever gunk the leaves are
pulling in with the air, and then you are going to reduce this and
concentrate whatever else is in the sap....   Somehow the thought of
possibly pouring concentrated hydrocarbons on my pancakes just doesn't get
me going in the morning, but it may just be me.  :) 


> |  It's best to
> |tap on the south side.
> |
> 
> Why?

Less moss in the sap...   :)

jim
-- 
Jim McCoy          |  PGP 2.0 Key md5 hash:
j-mccoy@nwu.edu    |  61323c49024cb089337c78a05aafe8c6
mccoy@ils.nwu.edu  |  finger mccoy@ils.nwu.edu for public key


Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
From: feldstei@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Ronald F. Feldstein)
Subject: Re: Bagels
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 14:44:20 GMT

Russian sources attribute the origin of the bagel to the Ukraine.  The
Russian and Ukrainian word for bagel (bublik) is said to have an origi-
nal Slavic root (*bomb- > bub-), which means "bubble," and is attested
in Serbo-Croatian, Czech, Polish, etc.  The Jewish bagel apparently
also stems from the same Ukrainian region.  There is an idiomatic ex-
pression which I have heard in both Yiddish and Russian which refer to
the "a hole of a bagel" to sarcastically refer to "absolutely nothing
at all."
In Russian-Ukrainian baking, bagels are considered only one variety of
product which results from boiling the dough before baking it.  The
three main types depend on how much water is in the dough, with bagels
(bubliki) having the most (dough has 22-25% water), baranki having a
medium amount (14-19%), and sushki being virtually devoid of resulting
moisture (dough starts with 9-12% water).  Pretzels are also related,
but I have no information which indicates whether Ukrainian boiled
dough predates the Western European pretzel.
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic