From: baresson@cbnewsi.att.com
Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian
Subject: Re: US presidential curse
Date: 11 Nov 92 07:57:14 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <Nov.5.02.47.41.1992.3290@geneva.rutgers.edu> baseball@catch-the-fever.scd.ucar.edu (Gregg Walters) writes:

>I believe that there is always some number of Christians who daily
>pray for the safety of the American President, with or without the
>knowledge of any curse that needs to be broken.  Such prayers have
>been and continue to be answered positively - in over 200 years of
>American presidents, only a tiny handful of days have been marred
>by the death of a president while in office.  I could easily say
>similar things for the leaders of all the other nations, past and
>present.

This is entirely scriptural, since we are told to pray for our
leaders. However scripture offers us examples of general prayers
(eg the Lord's prayer, John 17) and also prayers in specific
circumstances for a particular need. The gospels abound with
examples, but note for instance that Jesus rebukes sickness
or deals with demon posessed individuals by addressing a
SPECIFIC need: in Matt 17.19-21 his disciples ask him why He is
able to cast out a demon and they are not, Jesus replies that
the key is in prayer and fasting. 

>But let us consider the Lincoln assassination from another angle.  It
>is my understanding that Lincoln was a religious man, and I am certain
>that many prayed for his life before he passed on.  Do you believe that
>their prayers were answered negatively because they lacked a specific
>reference to this curse?

In what sense negatively? Lincoln's survival as president during
the civil war was presumably a positive thing. In the sense that they 
did not address the issue - then the curse was not lifted. 

A subsiduary question might be to what extent is a curse binding
on a Christian, since believers are freed from the elemental
spirits of the universe.

>Do you believe that all the other presidents under this curse (except
>Reagan) were not freed because, even though prayers were being offered
>for their safety, none specifically referenced this curse?

What is the power of a curse? The Bible is not silent on the
issue (see Deut 27-28, Psalm 109, Joshua 6.26, Gal 3.13, Num
22ff). It may be a fruitful exercise to do a word study on
the subject.

>As you understand it, what was the "prayer formula" that broke this curse?
>I am asking who was praying for who, and with what words, since your
>messages seem to suggest that this was significant.

It is not so much a "prayer formula" in the sense that
particular words must be said, but rather a specific prayer over
the individual to address the spiritual need, in this case to
break an occultic curse.

>How do we know that the presidents to be elected in 2000, 2020, ... etc
>have been freed from this curse?  Perhaps each such president must offer
>the same prayer as was offered by/for Reagan?

My understanding of the nature and power of curses is that they
can be broken for good, and that this was the case here.

The original posting was intended as a topical item. However the
subject I believe to be of general interest and I would welcome
other's opinions/ thoughts on the subject.

>Consider the following scenario which I believe to be analagous.  If a
>person prays for a sick person, and this disease has been plaguing people
>for ages, but the person praying does not know the name of the disease,
>do you mean to say that the sick person will die?

I think a better analogy is between a person praying that all people 
in a hospital will get better and a specific prayer addressing
the need of an individual patient.

>I am not yet ready to rebuke Prince,
>Lewis, and Hicks, but I would advise caution.

Incidently, Derek Prince was not the original speaker. He has a
specific ministry dealing with people's needs - including
generational curses, problems associated with dabbling with the
occult, the after-effects of wrong spiritual influences - but
I wouldn't say that he suffers from self-importance. And I would
say that he'd value your prayers more than a rebuke.  As for the
other two, all I know about them is that they have written a
book on the subject which, as you know, I haven't read.

>
>Gregg

Peace, Gregg. (Luke 11.20)

Barney Resson
"Many shall run to and fro, & knowledge shall increase" (Daniel)