HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: stafford@msus1.msus.edu
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Raise bars on BMW.. CANCEL POST
Date: 30 Aug 92 19:23:17 -0600
Organization: Minnesota State University System

CANCEL with aplogies!

	I Posted that BMW query here BY ACCIDENT.

	No flames, please! 

	Damn, is my face red.

 john (who became what he beheld)

Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: karish@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Chuck Karish)
Subject: Re: Miscellaneous Performance Questions
Organization: Mindcraft, Inc.
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 19:33:30 GMT

In article <1992Aug31.032325.21200@acd4.acd.com> mgr@sedv1.acd.com
(Martin Rivers) writes:
>
>3.) Why can't harleys compete head to head with the Japanese bikes in
>the drag circuit.  Engines sure seem large enough and there are
>definitely nitro breathing Harely's.  I was at Indianapolis last
>weekend at a drag bike event and didn't seem to be a single harley
>(except those specators were riding, myself included).  Is the
>weight/power ratio tilted in favor of the Japanese bikes?   Do you need
>the higher RPM's Japanese bikes put out?  Is it something else?

For a given state of tune, power output is directly
proportional to RPM and directly proportional to
displacement.

So if we compare, for example, an 80-inch Harley to an
80-inch Suzuki, the Suzuki has at least a 40% power
advantage because it can rev that much higher.  Modern
multi-cylinder bikes have some other advantages, too:

 - More valve area, so it's possible to get more fuel-air
   mixture into the cylinders (and get rid of the exhaust).

 - Smaller combustion chambers, which are conducive
   of more complete combustion and more efficient
   scavenging of spent gases.

>5.) Are there some good sources of books one might find at the library
>regarding high performance engines not requiring Mechanical
>Engineering or Chemical Engineering degrees.  Seems like there
>is an enormous amount of knowledge out their at least from the four
>wheeled engine builders.  Does any of it get written down or is it
>just stuck in engine designers and tuners heads?

The guys who do well write down what they're doing.
A few of them have published some guidelines.

Stefan Fielding-Isaacs (sai@formula1.corp.sun.com) has put
together a bibliography on how to build fast bikes and how
to ride fast.  His focus is on road racing, but many of his
book recommendations should work for drag racers too.

He posts the book list regularly on the 'race' mailing list
(race@formula1.corp.sun.com).

--

    Chuck Karish          karish@mindcraft.com
    (415) 323-9000 x117   karish@forel.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: Sportster Belt Drive Failure
From: Stafford@Vax2.Winona.MSUS.EDU (John Stafford)
Date: 26 Aug 92 09:13:12 -0600
Followup-To: rec.motorcycles.harley
Distribution: world
Organization: MSUS

In article <BtK8rs.2nA@cmptrc.lonestar.org>, neal@cmptrc.lonestar.org (Neal
Howard) wrote:
> 
> This message is primarily intended for those who own '91 and later
> Sportsters with the belt drive secondary but probably applies to all
> belt drive models. [good info specifically regarding the Sportster
omitted.]

For the record, this is not an inherent problem with belts.  I've been
running a Karata primary belt on a Big Twin for over 11 years.  No
problems.
From: ramarren@apple.com (Godfrey DiGiorgi)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: hd non-cruisers
Date: 29 Aug 92 14:51:27 GMT
Followup-To: rec.motorcycles.harley
Organization: Apple Computer

In article <JET.92Aug28161445@win30.nas.nasa.gov>, jet@win30.nas.nasa.gov
(J. Eric Townsend) wrote:
> 
> Hm.  I guess I was thinking on a bigger scale than belt drive and
> working engine. :-)  I'd love to see a sportster-based GS-killer or a
> fatboy based PD-type bike.
> 

AMF bought Harley-Davidson as a cash cow and tried to milk it dead. They
managed to push Aermacchi into the ground in that effort; very very sad. 

Harley obtained a reputation for being complete horseshit after the AMF 
takeover: zero quality control and utterly stagnant technology. This 
after a long history of being considered one of the world's best made
motorcycles.

The redesign of the engine into the Evo was a major feat for a small 
company after they bought themselves back from the AMF scum. The continued
improvement in frame and suspension technology, the fact that a current
FatBoy or Sportster can actually be considered a pleasant, good handling,
reliable machine ... I disagree with john stafford's negative feelings 
towards the company at this point. While the poser and silly shit they 
get into is garbage, the bikes are the best they've ever made. 

They do make world class touring rigs as well as the cruiser things. The
XLCR was a cool piece from a styling viewpoint, but if you want a rare and
superb real Harley masterpiece from late '70s/early '80s, buy an XR1000. I
always wanted one but couldn't afford it then ... or now most likely. 

The future? There's just so much investiture into the Vtwin engine, 
the style and the 'culture' (I hesitate to call it such :). Should a 
little company with a limited research budget try to break out of its
established marketing niche? Ducati tried that time after time and nearly
bit the dust (or actually did bite it and got resurrected). This year, 
HD has the largest market share on new bike sales in the USA. But I doubt
they have the capital resources to match heads with Honda/Yamaha/etc.
on the racetracks or squid set, even if they wanted to.

I'd like to see Harley-Davidson stick around and keep improving what
they make. I'll need a nice rumbly ride for my old age too.   ]%^)
========
Godfrey DiGiorgi | ramarren@apple.com | DoD #0493
"Logic may be the beginning of wisdom, but logic never bought
 me a Ducati."
 Rule #1: Never sell a Ducati.
 Rule #2: Always obey Rule #1.
Honda VFR700 Interceptor 1987, "Bright White" 
Ducati 750GT             1975, "Thunder"
Ducati 250 Mk III Diana  1966, sleeping beauty
Toyota MR2               1985, "VSSC"
========
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Death forces sale
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 21:43:08 GMT


I don't know anything about this at all, except that I saw it posted
on the bulletin board here at Dryden.  Someone said that the owner was
"that deputy that died" and we have LA County deputies here instead of
police.  It's been on the board for a little while, so OBO might work.

1992 Harley Davidson FLHTC Black
Stereo AM/FM Cassette  full dress
Cargo rack and driver's backrest
307 miles  purchased 5/22/92
$13,500 OBO
Death forces sale.  (805) 256-3983 ext 3886

--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "There's no kill like a guns kill." LCDR "Hoser" Satrapa, gunnery instructor
                       "A kill is a kill."  Anonymous

Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: randolph@est.enet.dec.com (Tom Randolph)
Subject: Re: somebody 'splain please
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: 27 AUG 92 12:40:26    


In article <2305@devnull.mpd.tandem.com>, joe@woody.mpd.tandem.com (Joe Senner) writes...
>I know what the 883 sportsters look like, and I can recognize the
>springer, but only because of full page layouts in MC rags. if you
>had a lot full of Harleys I couldn't pick out the FLHT to save my
>life. what is a shovelhead and why? which ones have belts? etc, etc.
>-- 
>Joe Senner                                          joe@zx11.cactus.org
>Tandem Computers Inc.                               joe@mpd.tandem.com

Ok, I'll give it a shot:
Sportsters you know - smaller, slimmer, final drive on right hand side, tranny
is integral with the engine.
Flavors: Evo Sporty - aluminum engine, valve covers similar to Evo big twin
         Iron Sporty - iron engine, valve covers look similar to shovelheads
         K           - old timer, flathead, you probably won't see very many
Model letters are all X: XL for street, XR for racing

Big Twins is all other Harleys. Large framed, final drive on left hand side,
tranny is a separate box from the engine, may have dual tanks, full dress
fairings/bags/etc...
Flavors: Evo - 80s-90s, aluminum engine, easily recognized from the right by
               the pushrods going up through the top few fins on the heads
         Shovel - 60s-80s, Iron engine, valve covers are sort of a "U" lying on
                   its side with the opening on the left side
         Pan - 50s-60s, Valve covers look like a cake pan upsidedown, very
               obvious
         Knuckle - 30s-50s, Harley's first OHV engine, valve covers are bulky,
                   roundish things with two great big hex bolt heads stuck out
Model letters are F: FLH-old style swing-arm frame, the big full dressers
                     FLST-new style softtail frame, easily recognized once you
                          notice how the rear suspension is layed out, many
                          different permutations (anything with ..ST on the
                          end)
                     FX-Cruiser style, the "factory chopper", first appeared
                        early 70s, basically an FLH with narrow Sporty forks
                        grafted on
                     FXR-newer frame, recognizable by triangular frame layout
                         beneath the seat, rubber mount engine, known as one of
                         the best handling Harleys

-Tom R.   randolph@est.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: mtrost@convex.com (Matthew Trost)
Subject: Re: Fork Locks (Re: Dealing with the Dealer)
Organization: CONVEX Computer Corporation, Richardson, Tx., USA
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 17:51:39 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In <1992Aug31.170359.21825@hubcap.clemson.edu> wstef@hubcap.clemson.edu (W. Gregg Stefancik) writes:


>As a locksmith I recommed that one use something along the lines of an
>American Lock Company 700 series lock.  These can be purchased at
>Home Depot for about $15.  They are a rather tough looking lock and
>fairly difficult to pick.

>I do imagine that most bike thieves just come up to the bike in question and
>lift it into the back of a truck no rolling required.  In this case they can
>deal with the lock at their own pace.  Given the time all locks will yield to
>force.

>-- 
>W. Gregg Stefancik
>wstef@eng.clemson.edu

Interesting.....
I almost bought one of these, but apted of the Master locks because I could
re-key them to have one key fit all my locks. (1 for the Sporty, 1 for the
FLH, and 1 for the chain I secure it to a parking structure)

Are the Master locks easy to pick? I think 420 is the model.
Can you re-key the American locks to do the same thing???...1 key fits
several locks?

Matthew

Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: shz@garage.att.com (Keeper of the 'Tude)
Subject: Re: somebody 'splain please
Organization: Office of 'Tude Licensing
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 14:15:55 GMT

In article <1992Aug31.112159.29336@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, groh@omicron.cs.fsu.edu (Jim Groh) writes:
> Seth is right of course, however (just trying to save face ), The 
> fxstc has the spindley, 39 or is 41 mm forktubes, the fls' have the 
> massive covers and tires,

They make kits to dress up the front of an FXSTC like the FLST.  A mere
few hundred bucks...

> oh well, didn't say I was perfect.

No, but you were a decent guy to drink a beer with at the RCR...

Seth
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: Springer front
From: Stafford@Vax2.Winona.MSUS.EDU (John Stafford)
Date: 26 Aug 92 08:56:18 -0600
Followup-To: rec.motorcycles.harley
Distribution: rec
Organization: MSUS

In article <KRL.92Aug26092748@robocop.hut.fi>, krl@niksula.hut.fi (Keijo
L{nsikunnas) wrote:
> 
> 
> Couple of weeks ago I saw a panhead (late 50's or early 60's) with a
> brand new springer (the same kind that is used in softtails). The
> question: is it available in one piece or do you have to build it from
> 'scratch'? If it is available I would also appreciate hearing the
> price.
> 
	You can purchase these in one piece from Harley.  Ask your dealer.
	If he seems ignorant, try another dealer.  I wouldn't mind seeing
	a thread on springers.  I run a stock '46 springer and have been
	into them for about 20 years.  There are few which can take a disc
	brake, a major disadvantage since the drum brake for the stock
	HD's never worked.
From: elef@smarmy.Corp.Sun.COM (elaine 'BEANO' leffler)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: A humorous story....
Date: 26 Aug 1992 19:55:47 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Distribution: world
Reply-To: elef@smarmy.Corp.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: smarmy.corp.sun.com

In article 714854548@convex.convex.com, mtrost@convex.com (Matthew Trost) writes:
>Zak (the youngest...about 3 at the time) asked his father very quietly:
>"Dad? Does Jesus ride a Harley" ?????
>Brian told me he couldn't contain himself.
>I guess kids just call it like they see it. Zak must have associated the
>long hair, and the beard, with riding Harleys.

actually, jesus rides a goldwing, and has a vanity plate that identifies 
Himself as the ORIGINAL two-wheeled saviour.  paul and i saw Him
on our way back from the '91 Feed. 

He's kinda pokey, too.

elef "i have seen the light"


  **...........................................................**
     Elaine 'beano' Leffler     North American Solution Center
         elef@smarmy           Sun Microsystems Computer Corp.
    elef@smarmy.corp.sun.com	       (415) 336-5142
  **...........................................................**

    your sweet little cupcake, baked with the batter from HELL....

   "...technology marches on - and makes 150-mph motorcycles for
    15-mph beginners'  brains."	_motorcyclist_
From: behanna@phoenix.syl.nj.nec.com (Chris BeHanna)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: Chroming, powder coating, lower ends
Keywords: $$$ ???
Date: 27 Aug 92 04:38:56 GMT
Followup-To: rec.motorcycles.harley
Organization: NEC Systems Laboratory, Inc.

In article <1992Aug25.022857.7035@ucsu.Colorado.EDU> dormont@spot.Colorado.EDU (DORMONT WILLIAM  M) writes:
>      First: How much does chroming cost? My rocker covers need it. Is it
>worth it to rechrome, or should I just buy new ones?

	Caveat:  chromed parts hold heat.  They hold a LOT of heat.  I was
admonished by a friend of mine who has chromed rocker covers on his Super
Glide to not chrome mine--just polish the shit out of them.  If you do chrome,
make damn sure to install an oil cooler--you're bike will need it.

>  This bike is basically stock in appearance (I may put a fatbob tank on it),
>and has a 4 3/4" S&S flywheel set. At .050 over, I calculate 91 cu. in. 
>I have the stock (74 in.) flywheels, but I think I'll go for the stroker.
>   Any info via posts or email will be greatly appreciated.

	Yeah, sure, tease me.  My bike has STD cases, but for all I know it's
a stock 80 incher.  The cases should allow me to stroke with impunity (hey,
keep your mind out of the gutter :-), provided I balance and don't overrev.
I'm looking forward to that, hopefully next year (this year is mostly
cosmetic and accident repair--upgrade to belt primary and possibly electric
start this year though.  May go to a dual disk front end and 21" wheel if the
$$$ are available).

Good luck with it,
-- 
Chris BeHanna	DoD# 114   1983 Harley-Davidson FXWG Wide Glide (She lives!)
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com	   (I need another bike for this space!)

Disclaimer:  Now why would NEC agree with any of this anyway?
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: neal@cmptrc.lonestar.org (Neal Howard)
Subject:  Best Oil for Evo's
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 17:38:13 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: CompuTrac Inc., Richardson TX

Has anyone out there had any experience with using AeroShell or Mobil-1
synthetic piston-engine aviation motor oil in Harley engines? I have used
Harley brand oil exclusively and I'm getting the urge to experiment. I
have a friend who's an aircraft A & P mechanic who had completely rebuilt
a '49 panhead from basketcase to showpiece and swears that the aviation oil
is better than Harley oil for both lubrication properties and resistance to
thermal breakdown for about the same cost. Any comments????

Thanks in advance,
Neal Howarda                      | '91 XLH-1200
neal@cmptrc.lonestar.org          |                                       
===============================================================================
From: DHANSEN@cmsa.gmr.com
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: Waving!
Date: 1 Sep 92 14:13:22 GMT
Organization: GM Research Labs

In article <31AUG92.03033570@vax.clarku.edu>
fdeignan@vax.clarku.edu writes:

>
>When I rode foreign bikes I always waved to other motorcycle riders ...
>didn't matter what brand they rode ... I waved to them because we shared
>an interest ... riding motorcycles!
>
additional significant comments deleted..........

I concur.  I have always waved, regardless of brand & I'm tired of hearing
that because I switched from Yamaha to H-D, that "suppose you'll be stuck
up now 'n quit waving to other bikes unless they're Harleys".  What a crock.
I still wave to all.. & this is my observation:

least often wave back - Gold Wing riders
next least often      - sport bikes, regardless of brand
next least            - H-D riders in groups of 8 or more

This tells me that there is some justification for the H-D no wave flap,
but how come there's nothing said about all the Wing riders with their
'tudes?  I know why sport bike riders don't wave; all their body weight is
on their hands & they can't shift weight fast enough to free up a hand to
wave, but Wings?

The answer here is a secret not generally discussed, but widely known -
Wing riders have MUCH BIGGER 'TUDES but are less conspicuous in their
expression of (freedom?).

Pass this on to any & all Wing riders - I wave to ALL, if you don't wave
back you're missing the point & can go sit on a fence post.

>Are there THAT many bikes on the road now that we can limit our waving to
>only riders whose mounts are the same brand?  I doubt it.
>
>Courtesy is contagious!  Wave to every biker you see pass you on the road
>because they're sharing the same experience you are!  They might be on a
>Harley, or a Suzuki, or a BMW, but they're still looking at the road over
>a pair of handlebars.  And let's not forget that.
>
Right on! And if YOU don't wave, why not?

Dave Hansen    -   91 FXRS
From: dehahn@strokr.shr.dec.com (chris dehahn)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: HI
Date: 26 Aug 92 18:47:50 GMT
Reply-To: dehahn@strokr.shr.dec.com
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation



Re: sporty gearing

A sprocket won't do you much good, there will still be a gap between 3rd and
4th. You need
a close ratio gearset. Andrews makes top quality gearsets.

CdH

<<<<<<<<<<<<   Ninety eight....don't be late  >>>>>>>>>>>>
Chris deHahn....CdH....Digital Equipment Shrewsbury MA USA
dehahn@strokr.shr.dec.com
From: woofy@sgi.com (Wolfchild)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
Subject: Re: Springer front
Keywords: springer front ends
Date: 26 Aug 92 15:07:24 GMT
Followup-To: rec.motorcycles.harley
Distribution: rec
Organization: Fair to middling-neater than some, sloppier than others

In article <Stafford-260892084519@stafford.winona.msus.edu> Stafford@Vax2.Winona.MSUS.EDU (John Stafford) writes:
>In article <KRL.92Aug26092748@robocop.hut.fi>, krl@niksula.hut.fi (Keijo
>L{nsikunnas) wrote:
>> 
>> Couple of weeks ago I saw a panhead (late 50's or early 60's) with a
>> brand new springer (the same kind that is used in softtails). The
>> question: is it available in one piece or do you have to build it from
>> 'scratch'? If it is available I would also appreciate hearing the
>> price.
>> 
>	You can purchase these in one piece from Harley.  Ask your dealer.
>	If he seems ignorant, try another dealer.  I wouldn't mind seeing
>	a thread on springers.  I run a stock '46 springer and have been
>	into them for about 20 years.  There are few which can take a disc
>	brake, a major disadvantage since the drum brake for the stock
>	HD's never worked.

Yup.  The whole thing (minus brakes) is available from Harley.  It's shown in
the '92 accessories catalog for about $2200.  Prices (in CA) have gone up about
15-20% from the prices in the catalog, depending on which dealership you talk
to.  It seems to me that if you plan on putting this on something other than a
softtail you'd better pay close attention to duplicating the softtail front end
geometry.  Also, I think I've heard tell of aftermarket kits with longer spring
and rigid forks to extend the springer front end.

For those of you with older springers; how do they differ from the front end on
the softtail?  I just picked up my '92 Springer this past Saturday and I've
gotta say that springer front end is about the best thing since oral sex-
doesn't bounce when you stop and doesn't lift (much) when you accelerate.
Nice lookin' too.  I wish I could put one on my SO's Kawasaki.

(Sorry, just kidding ;-})

Andy

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Fabans                                                
                                                                 
   /\ /\        woofy@yorgi.csd.sgi.com (Wolfchild)       
    o o                                                        
    \ /             The trouble with being punctual is that people think you
     *              have nothing more important to do.     - Anon
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: jcombs@nrchh023.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Jim Combs)
Subject: re:re: EVO carb
Keywords: 
  
Organization: northern telecom,  richardson, tx	
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 19:26:15 GMT

Thanks for the feedback.  Neal Howard,  where in Richardson are you?  My XLH-1200
sits at the corner of Arapaho and Glenville during normal business hours.  Your
info on spark plugs sounds real good.  The service dept at H-D of Dallas (Garland)
is the group of folks feeding me the shit about super-unleaded=bad.  They were 
claiming ny plugs were getting fouled because I was running the bike while it was
fucked up from the "bad" gas.  How have your dealings (if any) with those folks
been?  I bought the bike at H-D of Texas (Bedford) because it was the shortest
wait for dlvry (remember the factory strike in early 91?),  but have been using
the folks in Garland because it is more convenient.  I am now considering using
Bedford for future service dealings.  Competence is worth traveling out of my
way for.  
  
                     Once again,  to Hell with the disclaimer shit.
                     ============================================== 
                     
                     Jim Combs
  


Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles.harley
From: mtrost@convex.com (Matthew Trost)
Subject: A humorous story....
Organization: CONVEX Computer Corporation, Richardson, Tx., USA
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:42:28 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

My younger sister, her husband and two sons still live in Milwaukee, where I
am from. Anyway a few months ago she told me this story.

First a little briefing:

My Brother-in-law rides a '87 full dresser, my sister packs with him. Brian
is a paramedic, so he doesn't really have long hair.
Anyway, one Sunday morning Brian, Nancy, and the two boys were in church.
Zak (the youngest...about 3 at the time) asked his father very quietly:
"Dad? Does Jesus ride a Harley" ?????
Brian told me he couldn't contain himself.
I guess kids just call it like they see it. Zak must have associated the
long hair, and the beard, with riding Harleys.

I still laugh when I think about it.

Ride, Jesus ride!!!!

Matthew