HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Clayten_Hamacher@mindlink.bc.ca (Clayten Hamacher)
Subject: Re: *HEY! BROADCAST OF AGRIPPA TONIGHT!!*
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 10:28:38 GMT

What's all the fuss about something Gibson wrote? He's not even a very good
author and you guys are contemplating spending over $600 to get a copy of
something he wrote which can supposedly only be read once...

First, if the computer can decode the information to display it then so can
someone going through instruction by instruction. There's no such thing as a
disk that will boot, yet is uncrackable.

Second, isn't the whole thing about cyberspace (in the sense that you all
seem to interpret it) sharing of information, especially something like this
that isn't going to hurt someone if released (such as private hospital
records etc..).


This is REALLY pathetic, everyone says Gibson is the 'father of Cyberpunks'
so you all rush out and buy his books and drool over every word he says. Why
don't you all quit whining about what a REAL cyberpunks is and use the nets
for what they were meant, information transfer, not immature posing.

Grow up, go find an author whose work you like, be it Gibson, Heinlein,
Sterling, Asimov, or any other, just so long as you like their work and
respect their ideas for your own reasons, not because someone else tells you
that 'Real Cyberpunk's like Gibson's work'.

There's more that can be said but I'll leave it at this, I suppose I'll be
yelled at by everyone because I broke a taboo..Gibson's writing is like the
Emperor's new clothes, don't mention it/they suck/are non-existent and maybe
nobody will notice.
From: marti@granit.unice.fr (Marti Philippe)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: HELP ME!
Date: 11 Dec 92 15:22:39 GMT
Organization: University of Nice - Sophia Antipolis
NNTP-Posting-Host: granit.unice.fr

In article <Macbeth.42.723434261@cardinal.sc107.wesleyan.edu>, 
Macbeth@cardinal.sc107.wesleyan.edu (Macbeth) writes:
|> 
|> I am replying because you asked me to but, no, I don't think the computer 
|> underground is nowhere near this group. For that matter, I think many people 
|> who post here belong to the computer underground, to the industrial 
|> movement, and to the "real" cyberpunks. However, they will not openly say "I 
|> am a Cyberpunk," they don't want to be part of the self-proclaimed group. 
|> They realize their situation and chuckle at the futile atempts of other 
|> people to "belong." 

I agree with you completely.

|> 	Second, some Cyberpunk also implies cyberimplants, cosmetic surgery, 
|> etc, etc... While cosmetic surgery is rather common these days, not so cyber-
|> surgery. I can but laugh at the people who talk about neuro-connected arms 
|> and such because it is obvious that they have never faced a similar 
|> operation. Most of these people think that cyber-cosmetics / electronic body-
|> replacements are a romantic idea. Not for me. I have to deal every day for 
|> the rest of my life with a @#$@!@ electric kneecap on my right leg. I don't 
|> have it there for speed or for extra-power. I am lucky I have it, though, 
|> because if I didn't I would have lost my leg! But I would give much in this 
|> life to have my original kneecap back. 
|> 	I guess self-proclaimed Cyberpunks are, to some extent, Cyberpunks 
|> just as self-proclaimed schizophrenics are schizophrenics and self-
|> proclaimed werewolves are werewolves. It's all in the mind, I say.
|> 
|> 							Greetings,
|> 
|> 							Macbeth

I think you've got it, Macbeth, a "real" C-punk is not like that because he
wanted to. Nobody is self-destructive because its fun or because its a must.
Nobody is an anti-hero because its easier to pick up girls this way. Nobody
has cyber enhancement because "it's so nice to hear my prostetnic arm making
noise while I rub my girlfriend"...
CP is not a fashion to follow but a bad, real bad wave to surf on. And real
C-punks will never argue "it's fun and I wanted to be like that since I was
8 years old"...
IMHO a CP is a man who is obliged to "live with his decade" if he wants to
survive and take the pleasure were he can gets from...

If you are not really convinced, reread the originate CP litterature and forget
all the trashy commercial CP-heroes who enjoy hacking for fun...

Remember the word which stands for a man who wants to be a CPer : WILSON.

Take it easy et au revoir.

Philippe.

-- 
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk,sci.electronics
From: george@delta.ee.ufl.edu (George L)
Subject: Lets end this thread of the thread! (was Re: Caller ID block?)
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 92 21:27:40 GMT

In article <92345.132750RHASKINS@UMAB.BITNET> Robert Haskins <RHASKINS@UMAB.BITNET> writes:
>Ratner writes:
>> Unlike using an answering machine to screen calls, one can't hear
>> what the call is about before choosing to answer. (What if sister
>> was calling about an emergancy, and not just to chat?)
>
>If it were an emergency -- a real emergency -- I would imagine
>better numbers to call.  But that's a good (and important) point.
>If it were very late at night and a loved one called, I would
>answer -- but I'd check my caller id first.
>
>> This thing could be a lot of trouble while people try to decide what
>> to do with that information.
>
>Other than a loved one not being able to get help in an emergency,
>what are the other myriad problems?

Listen, if you don't answer, then she will get your answering machine
and you will have exactly the same situation as when you didn't have
caller ID. You will then hear her voice, her plea her help, and be 
able to make the decision to answer the phone.

In fact, Caller ID will even make this situation better. Suppose she 
is so desparate that she gives up on you (or is cut-off) before you or 
your answering machine gets a chance to pick up the phone.

Without Caller ID, you won't have a clue as to why your phone woke you at 
3:00 in the morning. Who was it? A Mis-Dial? A Wrong Number? A Prankster?
A Friend in Need? If so, who? And where are they?

With Caller ID, you can check back with the number that called you and find 
out what is up. 

So let us eliminate this non-issue from future discussions, and concentrate 
on more valid issues (like requiring all telemarketers to use a special 
prefix so we can choose to ignore them).

Just my opinion,
George Larson             |
george@alpha.ee.ufl.edu   |           "Remember, we're all in this together!"
University of Florida     |             -Harry Tuttle ("Brazil")


Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: Michael.Kohne@launchpad.unc.edu (Michael Kohne)
Subject: Re: Electronic media losing it's value for artist
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 03:30:30 GMT

In article <LmwRVB1w165w@angus.mi.org> thx1138@angus.mi.org writes:
>Robert Hall, 
>
>  You are wrong about an electronic medium that is can be copied losing
>  it's value for the artist.  Cassette tapes for musicians can be copied.
>  Albumns can be copied onto them, and CD can be copied to DAT.  All of
>  these are easy to copy and distribute ("Hey, can I have a copy
>  of your new Front 242 tape?") yet, somehow, musicians make money
>  off ot them. 

Yes, they can all be copied, but none perfectly. (even CD to DAT can't be
perfect-they have diffent sample rates, and there is usually an analog stage
in between, reducing quality with each generation of copy). 

I think if perfect copies of music could be made, then you'd have a lot less
profit. Of mabey not, many people want to own the original album for the neat 
stuff in the little CD booklet, as well as the music. 


>THX
>Boy, it's 7:30am and I just reread the message.  The sementics may be 
>off,
>but the idea is there...
>
>
>--
>Scott Abfalter (thx1138@angus.mi.org)
>North Star BBS, Royal Oak, MI --------------------------------------------+-


--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: a7657@mindlink.bc.ca (Stephen H. Kawamoto)
Subject: WAS Re: HELP ME! NOW IS: computer criminal bored or laid?
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 19:30:21 GMT

Well i think the potential occurs at birth.
but due to not getting enough love and attention, they resort to computer
crime. it's prolly oedipal :)

after reading about kevin metnick and him getting married, i think
subconsciously he was only using his wife (she worked at a phone company).

ref: cyberpunk, hafner and markoff.

--
Stephen Kawamoto <a7657@mindlink.bc.ca>
    "It is the very mind itself
     That leads the mind astray;
     Of the mind,
     Do not be mindless."
     (an old Japanese folk song)
From: morpheus <morpheus@entropy.mcds.com>
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: getting a life
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 92 12:22:16 EST
Organization: the pickle factory at Langley, Virginia

gpeel@mta.ca writes:

>  To all of the repressed nerds, I have carefully sifted through this trash 
> and have come to the conclusion that all of you need serious psychological 
> treatment or try getting ount in the real world. In short get a fucking life!

Yeah, all you repressed nreds should all get lives and become unwanted critics.


morpheus@entropy.mcds.com ("morph")   |   A name changes toys into tools..
Obsolete diety for hire.  Cheap.      |          - Skinny Puppy
From: corleyj@helium.gas.uug.arizona.edu (Jason D Corley )
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: Freaks
Date: 13 Dec 92 20:27:10 GMT
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson

In article <1992Dec13.172219.25227@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca> hgray@mta.ca writes:
>You guys are a bunch of fucking freaks.  Get a life, or a job.  what kind 
>of morons sit around and pretend that they are someone else?  I'll tell 
>you who, losers with no self confidence, or any dignity.  You people 
>should get a grip on reality, and quit living in an imaginary world.
>Role the dice you fucking homos!

REASON NUMBER 82732666372 NOT TO LEAVE YOUR TERMINAL LOGGED ON

Brought to you by the American Liquor Council, who remind you that
booze really heals.

	Jason
	Ono-Sendai R&D
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: bambrose@pomona.claremont.edu
Subject: Re: Freaks
Organization: Pomona College
Date: 13 Dec 92 21:04:03 PST

In article <1992Dec13.172219.25227@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca>, hgray@mta.ca writes:
> You guys are a bunch of fucking freaks.  Get a life, or a job.  what kind 
> of morons sit around and pretend that they are someone else?  I'll tell 
> you who, losers with no self confidence, or any dignity.  You people 
> should get a grip on reality, and quit living in an imaginary world.
> Role the dice you fucking homos!

Sigh.  Where do you people come from anyway?  I have this terrible desire
to send automated mail to your address, about 1000000 copies to be exact.
I wait and wait and wait for your kind to go bathe in generous concentrations
of hydrchloric acid, but to my great chagrin this has yet to happen.  Homonyms
are really tough to use... (I know the feeling man, 4th grade was just a
killer, nearly didn't pass...)  Undoubtedly you or the people like you who
pop up every week or so will not read this, and i'll just end up wasting space
as the 1000 or so people before who reply to these little kid posts.  For those
with at least of streak of maturity, I apologize for this waste.  I'm not
even going to comment on the homophobe aspect.  Fuck-sticks like you are in
need of full-body flaying.

long long long sigh,
ME
(Bret Ambrose - bambrose@pomona.claremont.edu)

Get so tiiiiirrrrrreeeeeddddd o' this
From: news@newcastle.ac.uk (NEWS system)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
Subject: Re: AGRIPPA
Date: 16 Dec 92 16:12:54 GMT
Organization: Computing Laboratory, U of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK NE1 7RU.

In article <1992Dec15.031833.15672@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu>, ahawks@nyx.cs.du.edu (man without a conscious) writes:
>Re: all the requests to post/send Agrippa....
From: n0an7@turing.newcastle.ac.uk (H.S. Doyle)
>
>It is on ftp sites...it is available via auto-mailers....
>
>The real version is propagating, the incorrect version does not seem
>to be.  Thus, there is no reason to publically, obviously subject
>onesself to obvious copyright violations if it is not necessary.
>
>--
>
>    ahawks@nyx.cs.du.edu	        FutureCulture:  In/f0rmation
>    ahawks@mindvox.phantom.com		future-request@nyx.cs.du.edu

Which FTP sites?

Harry.
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: ratner@owlnet.rice.edu (Logan Joshua Ratner)
Subject: Re: Electronic media losing it's value for artist
Organization: Rice University
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 21:06:31 GMT

In article <LmwRVB1w165w@angus.mi.org> thx1138@angus.mi.org writes:
>Robert Hall, 
>
>  You are wrong about an electronic medium that is can be copied losing
>  it's value for the artist.  Cassette tapes for musicians can be copied.
>  Albumns can be copied onto them, and CD can be copied to DAT.  All of
>  these are easy to copy and distribute ("Hey, can I have a copy
>  of your new Front 242 tape?") yet, somehow, musicians make money
>  off ot them. 
>
>
>THX
>Boy, it's 7:30am and I just reread the message.  The sementics may be 
>off,
>but the idea is there...
>
>
>--
>Scott Abfalter (thx1138@angus.mi.org)
>North Star BBS, Royal Oak, MI --------------------------------------------+-


The "Great Compromise" reguarding DAT's (and similar tech like DCC)
insures that the artists (distributers, publishers, etc.) continue
to make money.  It is assumed in advance that every digital tape
you purchase WILL be used to copy copyrighted material.  Therefore,
a portion of the purchase price of every DAT machine or tape goes
into a fund that is treated like royalties and distributed at the end
of each year (I think by ASCAP) in shares based upon album sales percentages.

Therefore, if you buy a DAT, go ahead and copy albums with it.  You've
already paid for it.  In fact, if you use it to record your own stuff,
you're being ripped off.

This raises an interesting point, though.  As you have paid this fee,
are you really violating copyright laws?

ratner
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: gpeel@mta.ca
Subject: RE: GET A LIFE; FREAKS; NEW IDEA
Reply-To: gpeel@mta.ca
Organization: Mount Allison U, Sackville, N.B. Canada 
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 22:45:12 GMT

In article <168BDAAEB.SMCMILLN@NUACVM.ACNS.NWU.EDU>, SMCMILLN@NUACVM.ACNS.NWU.EDU writes:
>It appears that MAT is starting a branch office of the Confederation
>of Fascist Assholes. Where the hell do these people come from and
>what kind of upbringing can produce such twisted little monsters?
> 
>"Pity the rabid dog, but put a bullet in his brain anyway."
>                                              -- Me
> 
>                                              Saint Morphine


	It's Mt.A not MAT butt-head.
Xref: sparky alt.cyberpunk:6780 sci.electronics:21225
From: chelf@lunatix.uucp (Chad Helfenberger)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk,sci.electronics
Subject: Re: Caller ID block?
Date: 20 Dec 92 15:49:31 GMT
Organization: Lexington Public Access Unix. -KY- (606) 255-9121

In article <BzIyAp.J4t@ns1.nodak.edu> csmith@plains.NoDak.edu (Carl Smith) writes:
>>
>>The only problem I see with the kill list idea is that most businesses have 
>>multiple phone lines, and I'm pretty sure (not certain) that the kill list 
>>will have a limited memory.
>
>Well, at this time I am not aware of any currently marketed product that
>does what I want (different rounting decisions based on number and time of
>day, to the phone or answering machine.  If one does not exist when caller
>id becomes available in my area, I plan on putting my electronics experience
>to work and design one.  In that case, the number of calls I could put
>in the kill list would be limited only by the amount of money I want to 
>invest in memory chips...  :)  And, like I said before, it wouldn't be a
>"kill" list, it would be a "Always dump these calls to the answering
>machine without even ringing the phone" list.

Sounds like a reasonable plan.  I'm sure you know my views on CNID, anyway, 
so I won't get into any of that.

>Well, like I said, I would have to build my call router so that the callers
>could get around it in case of an emergency.  So, if they follow the
>instructions, "press 1 if this is a real emergency," all the important
>calls would get through.  But undesireables could abuse that and press 1
>to get me on the phone even if it wasn't an emergency.  So the usefulness
>of it all depends on how honest the telemarketers are...

All I have to say is I wouldn't place my money on the telemarketers being 
honest.

>>This is where we disagree, I think.
>
>I suppose it all depends on how much the telemarketers annoy you, and how
>much it angers you to answer the phone at 3am to hear "sorry, wrong number"
>as soon as you say hello...

I suppose.  Maybe if I allowed my number to go everywhere, I would have this 
problem also.

>To clarify how my proposed ID system would work:
>
[description of ID system deleted]
>
>Gee, my call router system gets more complicated the more I talk about it.
>:)

Doesn't EVERYTHING? :)

>
>-- Carl D. Smith Jr.
>-- csmith@plains.nodak.edu


-- 
Chad Helfenberger
(chelf@lunatix.uucp) 
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: steve@mikejag.wimsey.bc.ca (Steve (PrettyBoy) Barclay)
Subject: Re: Gibson's a fake!
Organization: mikejag (mike) is a private system in Vancouver, BC, Canada
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 05:19:30 GMT

In article <1992Dec10.153034.24649@kth.se> TordM@VanA.PhySto.SE writes:
>In article <1992Dec10.082435.1@tesla.njit.edu>, kpm8447@tesla.njit.edu writes:
>
>>I think Gibson is a farce!  He's just bullshitting us!  C'mon, oh! it's soo
>>wonderful that he makes Agrippa, and it disappears and so do the pictures.
>>He's just getting "art-sy" and making money.  Yeah, he's actually having
>>fun with cyberspace, but I don't think he's so special.  Basically, he's
>>got (almost) everyone here by the balls with rumors and such.  It seems
>>that's about the only thing cyberspace is good for, releasing rumors very
>>fast.
>
> I agree. W.Gibson "died" after releasing "count zero". He should've been
>satisfied with "Neuromancer", but I think he got greedy, and so called
>cyberpunk freaks are so easy to trick for money, so why not? the memorial
>of W.Gibson will be great, of course, but would've been greater should
>he have stopped with "Neuromancer".. he's nothing special anymore...
>
>
>
>
Oh give me a break!  He's just a writer, not God!  So he wrote one book that
didn't meet your standards.  BFD  That's no reason to write the man off.  Hell
all the greats of Sci Fi are guilty of putting out the occasional dog of a
novel.  It amazes me that Bill Gibson generates such passion.  People either
hate him or love him but there seems to be no middle ground.  I've met Bill
a couple of times at the Vancouver Science Fiction Convention, and he's a
neat guy to talk to but he most certainly did not appear as the burning 
bush!  Hell, the last time we met up we were both too hammered to carry on
a decent conversation and ended up listening to U2s latest and muttering
"U2...Great album..." repeatedly until we tottered off in opposite directions.
This is the guy people are committing computer crime in the name of?!?  Give
me a break!  To quote Douglas Adams "He's just this guy, y'know".

STeve

-- 
###############################################################################
# You have been listening to the erotic daydreams of an earthworm as it was   #
# sucked backwards through a French milking machine.  - George Carlin         #
###############################################################################.
Xref: sparky alt.cyberpunk:6594 sci.electronics:20667
From: curt@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Curt Welch)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk,sci.electronics
Subject: Re: Caller ID block?
Date: 14 Dec 92 15:19:14 GMT
Reply-To: curt@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Curt Welch)
Followup-To: alt.cyberpunk
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In alt.cyberpunk, mcovingt@aisun3.ai.uga.edu (Michael Covington) writes:
>On receiving a call with caller ID blocked, one thing you could do is pick
>up the receiver and say, "If you want to talk to me, call back without
>blocking caller ID," and hang up.
>
>But could you distinguish (a) a caller who has deliberately blocked
>caller ID, from (b) a caller from a place that simply doesn't have it yet?

The phone system tells you.  If you have caller ID service, then you
get Caller-ID info on every call.  It includes the date and time
of the call as well as the phone number.  If the call comes from an
area that doens't supply the number, then you get an "out of area"
message (along with the date and time).  If the caller-id info is blocked
you get a message something like "private" (along with the date and
time).

My caller-id box stores something like 50 phone calls.  It's nice because
even if the person is calling from out of the area, I know the date and
time of their call.  I have a voice mail service from the phone company,
but even if the person doesn't leave a message, I know they called.  I
think it's great.

Curt
Xref: sparky alt.cyberpunk:6724 sci.electronics:21018
From: curt@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Curt Welch)
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk,sci.electronics
Subject: Re: Caller ID block?
Date: 17 Dec 92 22:03:56 GMT
Reply-To: curt@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Curt Welch)
Followup-To: alt.cyberpunk
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In sci.electronics, chelf@lunatix.uucp (Chad Helfenberger) writes:
>WHY in the HELL would you want to give out your number to
>anyone you called?

Lets try to cool down here.  This is turning into an abortion
argument.  There is no right or wrong here.  Just like with the
abortion issue, no amount of analogies will prove either postion to be
right or wrong, and arguing your position is not likley to make someone
change their stand on this issue.

Caller ID obviosly does two things.  When someone calls you, it gives
you information you couldn't get before - This is good.  When you call
someone else, the system gives out priviate information whether you
want it to or not - this is bad.  There have been lots of intersting
thoughts in this thread about the good and bad issues of this, but each
of us will end up deciding for ourselfs if the good outweighs the bad.
Obviously, the people that like Caller ID think it does, the people
that don't like Caller ID think it doesn't.  Neither is right or
wrong.

>Why don't you Caller ID freaks put yourself on the other
>end of the line for a minute.

The Caller ID freaks obviosly have though about what happens when they
place a call.  They don't care that their number is being given out.
Just accept this fact and get on with your life.  The reasons why they
like it have been listed many times in this thread already.

And all you (me included) Caller ID freaks that are trying to convence
people like Chad that Caller ID is "good" - give it up.  Just accept
(and respect) the fact that he feels differently about the subject.

Curt
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: jmilhoan@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (JT)
Subject: Re: Gibson
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 06:18:55 GMT

In article <1992Dec12.010218.24753@quake.sylmar.ca.us> Damian.Turner%bbs@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Damian Turner) writes:
>Has anyone heard of William Gibson's new thing?  Short story on disk
>which erases itself after ONE reading?  And when will we find it
>readily available?  Limited editions only now, very very expensive.

hmm.. the lights are on, but nobody's home...

try scanning back for the thousands of headers that contain the string "agrippa".

Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk
From: gpeel@mta.ca
Subject: Re: Freaks
Reply-To: gpeel@mta.ca
Organization: Mount Allison U, Sackville, N.B. Canada 
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 15:37:16 GMT

In article <18496@mindlink.bc.ca>, Clayten_Hamacher@mindlink.bc.ca (Clayten Hamacher) writes:
>I think someone has two accounts.... Either that or MTA is filled with a
>bunch of dumb jocks.
>


	No I don't have two accounts! But I look forward to meeting Mr. Gray,
as it seems that we have something in common.  You should know that the only
jocks we have are on the football team. 
Newsgroups: alt.cyberpunk