HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tprzepio@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Tomasz Przepiorkouski)
Subject: Prosba o e-mail adres
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 19:43:03 GMT

Poszukuje e-mail adresu do SGGW ( Szkola Glowna Gospodarstwa Wiejskigo ) w 
Warszawie . Moj adres : tprzepio@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Z gory dziekuje ...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: ins548h@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au (Mr M.S. Popkowski)
Subject: ******* Making friends ******
Organization: Monash University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 02:01:07 GMT

    Czesc!
Nazywam sie Mirek, jestem na 2 roku Computer Science na Monash Uni, Melbourne
Australia. Probowalem do Ciebie wyslac email, ale cos nic z tego nie wychodzi.
Moze to dlatego ze Monash nie jest podlaczony do BITNET? Za bardzo nie mam 
czasu teraz pisac, za chwile zaczyna mi sie tutorial. Sproboj wyslac do
mnie mail, napisz co u Ciebi ciekawego, jak dlugo jestes w Stanach?
Czesc. Mirek
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: js2061@bgsu.edu. (jim saxa)
Subject: MANY THANKS FOR POLISH WORD HELP!!!
Followup-To: soc.culture.polish
Organization: BGSU
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 17:23:43 GMT

I would like to take this time to thank all of you who have helped me out
with my word.  No longer will I have to listen to stupid arguing!!  The
number of responses was overwhelming.  It was nice to see so many people
willing to help out.

                            Appreciatively,

                                          Jim Saxa (freshman-BGSU,ohio)
From: rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu (Jeff Bytof)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Stanislaw Lem
Date: 14 Oct 92 16:56:26 GMT
Organization: ucsd
NNTP-Posting-Host: lutherlab.ucsd.edu

I am looking for an electronic FAQ for Stanislaw Lem, if such 
a thing exists.

------------------
Jeff Bytof
rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu
Xref: sparky soc.culture.polish:3057 soc.culture.jewish:17295
From: avr@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (adam.v.reed)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Jews under Soviets in Eastern Poland, 1939-1941
Keywords: Persecution by Soviet secret police, and facts vs. myths.
Date: 8 Oct 92 17:48:12 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.polish
Organization: AT&T

Krzysztof Kniaz writes:
> ....
>- What would happen if the situation were reversed, i.e. the
>  Poles were the persecuted minority, and the Jews were largely
>  tolerated? Would the Jews behave differently? This is not quite an 
>  abstract question as a similar situation developed in the eastern part
>  of Poland after it was taken over by the Soviet Union in 1939.  The 
>  experiences were not encouraging.
> ....

I'm affraid that the above comment about the relative situation of
Jews and non-Jewish Poles under the Soviet occupation may be
based on yet another counterfactual myth. So far, the most
comprehensive available study of that occupation is

Jan T. Gross: Revolution from Abroad: The Soviet Conquest of
Poland's Western Ukraine and Western Byelorussia. Princeton:
Princeton University Press, 1988; ISBN 0-691-09433-0.

I also recommend the same author's

Gross, Jan Tomasz, and Irena Grudzinska-Gross: W czterdziestym
nas matko na Sybir zeslali. London: Aneks, 1983.

In a footnote to page xx in his preface to RfA, Gross cites a
1944 memorandum of the Polish Foreign Ministry in London,
compiled from personal files at the Polish Red Cross in Teheran,
giving a statistical breakdown of Polish citizens deported by
the Soviet secret police to the Siberian Gulag, where most of
them died. Of the deportees, 52% were non-Jewish Poles; 30% were
Jews. At the time, Jews accounted for about 11% of the population
of eastern Poland; non-Jewish Poles, about 41%.  I.e., a Jew
stood two to three times the non-Jewish Pole's chance of being
arrested by the secret police and sent to death in the Gulag.

To quote a popular American saying: It's not the things you don't
know; its the things you know that aren't true that hurt you.

				Adam_V_Reed@ATT.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: aleks@cray.com (Aleksander Mazur)
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism (Take 2)
Date: 8 Oct 92 10:24:50 CDT


In article <92137@netnews.upenn.edu> kkniaz@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Krzysztof W. Kniaz) writes:
>
>Male apropo's "zydowskich" idiomow i wyrazen. Po glebszej analizie
>doszedlem do wniosku, ze nie znam zbyt wielu zwrotow w naszej pieknej
>mowie , ktore w taki czy inny sposob wykorzystuja stereotyp Zyda.
>
>Osobiscie slyszalem o - sprytnym (lub chytrym)
>                      - madrym
>                      - smierdzym
>
>Mozna jesc jak Zyd (tzn z nakryciem glowy). I wiecek nie pamietam!
>
>Ostatnio dowiedzialem sie , ze np w Hiszpanii uzywa sie okreslenia
>"kopnac Zyda" na otwarcie butelki wina.
>
>Czy szanowni czytelnicy s.c.p. mogliby sie wypowiedziec w tej sprawie?
>--
>
>Krzysztof Kniaz, University of Pennsylvania |Due to circumstances beyond
>Lab for Research on the Structure of Matter |your control, you're master of 
>Philadelphia, PA, 19104, USA                |your fate and captain of your soul

Ja kiedys jadlem karpia po zydowsku. Taki sobie, nie moge powiedziec,
zeby mi zanadto smakowal, ale tez nie byl niesmaczny. Ot , taki sobie.

A. Mazur
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: avr@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (adam.v.reed)
Subject: Re: Ryszard Kuklinski
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 01:47:25 GMT
Summary: Not the first time...

In article <1992Oct12.105015.7321@walter.cray.com>, aleks@cray.com (Aleksander Mazur) writes:
< W prasie amerykanskiej coraz wiecej artykulow obecnie ukazuje sie
< na temat Kuklinskiego. Dosyc ponuro sprawa sie przedstawia jesli chodzi
< o wymiar sprawiedliwosci w Polsce, i to nie komunistycznej, ale obecnej.
< Kuklinski dumny jest, i slusznie, z wyroku smierci wydanego przez sad
< komunistyczny. Zarowno on, jak i dziennikarze amerykanscy nie rozumieja
< jednak, jak sad w pokomunistycznej Polsce mogl zamienic ten wyrok
< na 25 lat wiezienia. To jest tak, ze ten sad za rzadow Mazowieckiego
< uznal Kuklinskiego winnym i skazal go na 25 lat. Tymczasem Kuklinski
< robil to, co kazdego polskiego oficera powinnoscia powinno byc
< w czasie sowieckiego zniewolenia. Dostarczyl np. informacje o przygotowywanej
< inwazji sowieckiej w grudniu 1980 r. i Carter podjal odpowiednia
< inicjatywe, ktora prawdopodobnie tej inwazji zapobiegla. Przekazal tez
< informacje o przygorowywanym stanie wojennym. Dzialal wyraznie przeciw
< Sowietom dostarczajac plany i tajemnice Ukladu Warszawskiego.
< Jak najbardziej dzialal w interesie zniewolonej Polski. Gdyby teraz
< jakis oficer wspolprcowal z obcym wywiadem, taki wyrok bylby zrozumialy.
< Dodajmy do tego, ze nawet pojedynczy oprawca z lat stalinowskich
< nie zostal postawiony w stan oskarzenia, i mamy obraz obecnego stanu
< sadownictwa w Polsce. Obecnie w dalszym ciagu Kuklinski sie ukrywa
< pod zmienionym nazwiskiem wraz z cala rodzina za to, ze zyciem ryzykowal
< dla dobra Polski, a mordercy spokojnie chodza sobie po ulicach. Nie bral
< przy tym zadnych pieniedzy gdyz pozycje zajmowane wowczas zapewnialy mu
< dostatnie zycie, zrezygnowal nawet z awansu generalskiego chcac
< miec staly dostep do informacji. 

Wonder of wonders: a posting by Aleksander Mazur I can fully
agree with. Of course, this is not the first time that a Polish
patriot was branded a traitor to Poland for exposing the crimes
of its Communist rulers. In some of his previous postings, Mazur
appeared to give credence to the Communist disinformation
produced by the Moczar clique in the wake of Swiatlo's exposure
of the crimes of the UB. Will A.M. be willing to reconsider the
facts about Swiatlo, now that he's seen identical techniques at
work in the case of Kuklinski?
				Adam_V_Reed@ATT.com
From: feliga@sscvx1.ssc.gov
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: video system help request
Date: 14 Oct 92 20:17:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: sscvx1.1992Oct14.141739.1
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory

Arek,
Kup polska gazete w polskim sklepie.  Tam znajdziesz ogloszenie jezeli nie firm
ktore to robia to wypozyczalni Video. Na pewno uzyskasz pelna informacje.
Jest to drogie 25 - 40 dolcow niestety, jedna tasma.
Pozdrawiam,
Andrzej z Dallas

In article <92285.163544U21569@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U21569@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
> I would much appreciate if you could give me your advise where to give
> 
> my video tapes recorded in the American system to change them for
> 
> the European one. And how much would cost a system that converts
> 
> tapes from one system to another?
> 
> Thanks very much
> Dziekuje bardzo
> Arek Goetz
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: aleks@cray.com (Aleksander Mazur)
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism
Date: 14 Oct 92 07:36:16 CDT


In article <1992Oct13.203744.20060@Princeton.EDU> roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig) writes:

>>Especially that even it is difficult to notice special discrimination
>>like one that can be found in other countries that still are
>>called nowadays democracies. As an example I can bring example of
>>law that prohibits Palestinians from occupied territories to spend single 
>>night in Israel even when they are employed there. Sometimes they 
>>can get permission however.
>
>Noted.  However, Israel is at war, please remember; and several 
>Palestinian organizations call for the destruction of Israel even
>today.  The measures passed in Poland in the 1930's were not wartime
>measures.
>
>Roger
>

Not exactly. Israel occupies territories. Inhabitants of occupied
territiries did not ask for occupation. Israel isn't and shouldn't be
at war with population living under occupation. We had some complaints about
military promotions in Poland. In Israel based on national origin
groups of people are excluded from military service at all. That
is also discrimination.

Aleks
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.jewish
From: rmt51@cas.org (Rick Turkel)
Subject: Re: reading "Shoah"
Reply-To: rmt51@cas.org
Organization: S.W.I.G.
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 16:28:26 GMT

In article <1992Oct9.072534.11133@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de>,
lbs@tkmhp4.physik.uni-karlsruhe.de (Lech Borkowski) writes:
|> 
|>  I looked into the text that accompanies the film and was
|> surprised to find many names of people and places misspelled.
|> 
|>  Lech Borkowski
|> lbs@neptune.phys.ufl.edu

The names were "misspelled" according to standard Polish orthography, but
not according to Yiddish pronunciation and orthography.  My family came
from Bendin, near Katovitz; you may know them as Bedzin (that's a nasal
"e") and Katowice.
-- 
Rick Turkel           (___  ____ _  _  _  _  _     _  ___   _  _ _  ___
(rmt51@cas.org)           )    |  |  \  )  |/ \     |    |   |  \_)    |
(rmt51@cas.bitnet)       /     | _| __)/   | __)    | ___|_  | _( \    |
			Ein navi be`iro.            |

Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper)
Subject: Polish (Re: Do Michala)
Organization: Warsaw University Physics Dept.
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 20:07:13 GMT

lbs@tkm.physik.uni-karlsruhe.de writes:

>>	  Any single Pole is equally Polish as a million
>>of them.
>
>Czyli roznie rozumiemy slowo Polish.

A jak Ty rozumiesz slowo Polish ?  Wszak milion to 1+1+1+1+1+.....

+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|     My opinions are my opinions.   But facts are those of everyone.     |
+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+
|     Michal~ Szleper                |     "All you need is love, love,   |
|     (michals@fuw.edu.pl)           |      Love is all you need..."      |
+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+

Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: lawera@stat.rice.edu (Martin Lawera)
Subject: Re: A personal experience in Poland
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, Rice University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 19:48:12 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.152525.6577@discus.technion.ac.il> s1495926@techst02.technion.ac.il (Danny Kreindler) writes:
>I just returned from a trip to Poland where I tried to find
>remnants of Jewish life. There's nothing left, even the
>cemeteries were destroyed. Poland is one big Jewish
>graveyard.  There are hardly any Jews left in Poland, yet
>anti-semitism is quite alive. It was a very depressing sad
>experience for me.
>     In the Polish tourist town of SANDOMIERZ a large
>painting depicting in full detail the process of religious
>Jews killing Christian children for their blood to be used in
>religious rituals is permanently displayed in the town's
>Cathedral.
>     The painting shows a Jewish woman enticing children to
>come into the place where they are killed by the men. An
>unmistakable rabbi figure is seen collecting the blood into
>an urn. At the bottom of the painting another man throws the
>bodies of the dead children to the dogs.
>     In 1957, 43 Jews were murdered in Kielc (Poland) when a
>rumor spread that a Christian child had been killed for its
>blood.
>     Can anyone suggest what steps should be taken to remove
>that dangerous and offensive painting from the walls of the
>Samdomierz Cathedral?
>
>     Any comments will be appreiciated- to the s.c.j. or to
>the above address.
>
>
>     Yaakov Gladstone.


Before we all go ballistic about it: how about if we just ignore
our friend Yaakov?
Obviously, he is trying to start a flame-war.

Martin
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper)
Subject: Re: To Roman Budzianowski
Organization: Warsaw University Physics Dept.
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 08:01:26 GMT

> You certainly can say anything you want, but others are free to criticize
> your statements. 
> I disagree with your statement that "any single point of view of mine
> is also a Polish one". Note, that "Polish" means something quite
> general, related to a large number of people (majority of the
> population?! A lot of people simply don't care much about politics or
> have quite different views). 
> Based on my experience your original statement is in no way representative. 
>
> Lech Borkowski
> lbs@neptune.phys.ufl.edu

Absolutely right.  But I never said I was speaking in name of *all*
Poles.  I said "I'm affraid it so and so", which was based on my
own experience.  You may have a different experience, I accept that.
I would only rather disagree that the term "Polish" refers necessarily
to any majority.  Any single Pole is equally Polish as a million
of them.

+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|     My opinions are my opinions.   But facts are those of everyone.     |
+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+
|     Michal~ Szleper                |     "All you need is love, love,   |
|     (michals@fuw.edu.pl)           |      Love is all you need..."      |
+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+

Xref: sparky soc.culture.polish:3054 soc.culture.jewish:17273
From: saal@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (samuel.saal)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism (Take 2)
Keywords: Invectives
Date: 8 Oct 92 17:30:45 GMT
Followup-To: poster
Organization: liver ---> spleen

In article <91929@netnews.upenn.edu> kkniaz@eniac.seas.upenn.edu
(Krzysztof W. Kniaz) writes:

>Indeed there're few Jews left in Poland, however two quite picturesque
>Jewish figures are still in use: "the shrewd Jew" and "the wise
>Jew". Again both relate to everyday life in countryside - 
>peasants were selling products to Jewish merchants, who
>naturally tried to make some profit. Therefore one had to be
>careful, when dealing with them. On the other hand, those
>Jewish merchants knew "world" (if you had never left your hamlet,
>the "world" could have been a next town), knew "other peoples" -
>so Jewish merchants were sometimes the only source of information
>about the outside world. They were "wise".

Thanks for posting one of the most bowdlerized pieces I've ever seen.  The
blatant rationalizations here would make the worste propogandists proud.
-- 
Sam Saal      kingfish!saal OR saal@kingfish.att.com
	Vayiftach HaShem et Peah Ha`Aton
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren)
Subject: Re: Answer to Aleksander About '67 Arab-Israeli War (was: Polish..)
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 19:11:21 GMT

aleks@cray.com (Aleksander Mazur) writes:

#dzk@cs.brown.edu (Danny Keren) writes:

##I apologize for posting something which does not really belong
##in SCP. I suggest to Aleksander to switch the discussion to
##talk.politics.mideast.
#
#I don't think you need to apologize. On the other hand such a suggestion
#is slightly suspicious - why on s.c.p. issues involved Israel, Jews,
#or other nations couldn't be discussed? 

I am not saying they couldn't be discussed, just pointing out that
there is a special newsgroup for these issues, and that most
people interesed in these issues would see them there.

#It was quite surprised for me
#when I noticed on s.c.j. statements, that issues involving Palestinian-
#Israeli conflict should not be discussed there. That would be similiar claim
#as that Polish-Jewish relations should not be discussed on s.c.p.

Well, its relations between *Israelis* and *Palestinians*. On the
other hand, there is no special newsgroup dedicated to Polish-Jewish
relations.

#So far I did not hear even suggestion of that. How come such an interest
#to limit topics discussed on s.c.p. ?

Now lets not get paranoid...

##It is a great achievement for Arab propaganda to claim that Israel
##shares the responsibility for the '67 war. However, it is not supported
##by reality. Egypt blocked a vital waterway for Israel, fully knowing
##it will bring war. The witness for that is no other than the
##late Egyptian president,
#
#As I mentioned before my feeling is, that everybody can discuss those
#issues that concern him. 

We can discuss whatever you want; it was you who mentioned the
'67 war. I was answering your poster.

#For me it is quite strange that Israel
#for 25 years has been occupying territories supposedly having nuclear
#arms and still brings justification of security concerns. 

1) Don't forget that the Sinai was returned.
2) Nuclear arms are not a magic solution. Israel (if it has them)
   will use them only a last resort. A weak Israel enlarges
   the danger for that happening. 

#Of course
#somebody else can have different concerns and I fully respect that.
#Because I do not respect collective responsibility or guilt therefore
#just for me whatever Nasser said or Sadat is not fully relevant in that
#context and does not explain need for continued occupation that brings
#misery not only for occupied population but also for citizens of Israel.
#Thats why I skipped the rest of that post but if somebody else is
#interested in discussing it should be absolutely free to do that.

You have a point there. I *am not* claiming that because the Arabs
initiated the `67 war they have to bear the guilt forever. I
believe that the current situation is bad, and I hope that the
Palestinians will get an autonomy and even a state (although I
think it has to be demiliterized). On the other hand we can't
just toss the past beihnd our backs and disregard its lessons.

-Danny Keren.


Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
From: dobo@cs.UAlberta.CA (W. Dobosiewicz)
Subject: Re: On Polish Anti-semitism
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 05:43:16 GMT

roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:

>In article <1992Oct14.100620.2377@walter.cray.com> aleks@cray.com (Aleksander Mazur) writes:

[...] Rhetoric on both sides.

>On the other hand, I'm *still* not sure what this has to do with the history   
>of Poland.

>Roger

And can only add my support to this statement. Israel is a very special
country and should be judged using very special rules. There is no point
in trying to equate the state of Israel with Poland, even in 1920, when it
faced an aggression that threatened her destruction.
After all, until the Nazis, all the invadors of Poland were not into
"racial cleansing".

Thus, let us  detach the dark sides of Israeli politics from the dark
sides of Polish history. They are not to be mixed.

On the other hand, detaching Polish/Jewish relations from any historical
context is equally silly. Those who forget about it might overlook such
gems as the "one Jew is too many" which was the guiding principle of
Canadian immigration officials in the '30s.

W. Dobosiewicz
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.jewish
From: dobo@cs.UAlberta.CA (W. Dobosiewicz)
Subject: Re: On "standard" books
Followup-To: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.jewish
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 05:26:01 GMT


In the last few weeks, I became engaged in a serious discussion over
Jewish/Polish relations. I think it was beneficial to al involved.
Now the news: my opponents (or should I say "discussion partners")
constantly refer to books by "Celia Heller" and "Lucy Dawidowicz" (the
latter must be some relative of mine, based on name :-)).
Tonight, I went to my public library, and guess what?
You guessed it: Celia Heller is not listed at all; ther are some scholarly
works by D., unrelated to antisemitism (like something about Mexico, etc.)
as we discussed here.
What gives? I wonder! I hear that in the USA, Heller is mandatory reading,
so its absence here is most puzzling. Any explanation, folks?

As a background: Edmonton is the capital of the province of Alberta and
has a population of 650,00 plus suburbs, totalling some 3/4 million
people. Not New York, but not a village, either.

W. Dobosiewicz

P.S. To Adam: I am working on it: as soon as I get something more than a
claim "Heller said so" I will oblige.

P.S.2. Heller is not highly regarded for credibility, as pointed out by
Mendelson:
[...]
malkodet. Yehude Polin 1935-1939" (1982). The most influential work 
of this kind is Celia Heller's "On the Edge of Destruction" (1977), now 
available in paperback and required reading in many courses on Jewish 
history in the United States. The title of this book expresses very 
clearly the author's belief that interwar Poland was a disaster area for 
the Jews. She believes, and so do other adherents of this camp, that the 
years 1919 - 39 were a rehearsal for the Holocaust period. The Poles 
pushed the Jews to the `edge of destruction', and the Nazis (with 
Polish help) destroyed them.

[...]

The basic attitudes expressed by Heller and other members of the 
Jewish camp have recently been challenged by a number of scholars. 
An example is the recently published book by Joseph Marcus, a Polish 
Jew, which is certainly the best single-volume treatment of Jewish 
history in interwar Poland [2]. Marcus's book is, among other things, a 
[...]

These quotes were extracted from a recent posting of an article writtem by
Mendelson some time ago. (Posted under my name)
[To Roger: you asked where to start; how about Marcus?]