HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bauwens@acs.ucalgary.ca (Luc Bauwens)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: The Six-Year National Development Plan for Taiwan, "R.O.C"
Date: 13 Apr 92 03:41:17 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

In article <1992Apr13.005107.4173@cs.yale.edu> horne-scott@CS.YALE.EDU (Scott Horne) writes:
><
><Scott, if I understand you properly, you are saying that the
><treaty of Shimonoseki (sp?) was illegitimate?
>
>Yes, that's the correct spelling; and yes, I consider it illegitimate.
 
But then by the same token, perhaps the legitimate owners
of Taiwan should be the Netherlands :-)?

After all, Taiwan became a Chinese colony and ethnic Chinese
started moving to Taiwan only after Chinese invaded what had
up to then been an uncontested Dutch colony...

Furthermore, if it is true that Shiminoseki was imposed
upon China, if I recall correctly, Japan had not really been 
interested in Taiwan, but was offered Taiwan by China,
who didn't want to bother with *policing the strait*.

><Are you saying that the CCP was wrong in the thirties and
><forties when they considered Taiwan as not being part of
><China?
>
>No.

How could they be right then when they didn't see Taiwan
as part of China, and also right now when they claim it is?
What would be the intervening factor, except for the fact
that the old thug took refuge in what by then had become
his own colony?

><Do you also think that Tibet is rightfully a colony of China?
>
>Tibet is not and never has been a *colony* of China; it is and has long been
>a part of China.

Uh?  Seems to me that Tibet for at least a thousand years
had a strong, distinct identity, was an independent nation
for extended periods of times, but also periodically 
conquered and militarily occupied by China.

Of course, China claimed Tibet to be part of China, but
is that the key factor?
 
><A final question, what is your criterion for legitimacy
><of a government?  I get the strange feeling that your
><criterion may not be that different from the  ones that the
><most rabid KMT supporters would propose...
>
>You may be right.
 
So, you are saying that you don't believe in self-determination,
but in military fait accompli as the basis for legitimacy
of a government?  By that token, perhaps the old thug was
really the legitimate owner, then? :-)


(BTW, I think that there is a good case to be made
that the present prosperity of Taiwan occurred not
because of the KMT, but that at least initially, 
the KMT was an obstacle to development...

Why don't you stick to sensible points, rather than
making a fool of yourself and going to outer space...
Come on, Scott, I know that you have a reputation to
sustain, but still...

Don't you know as well as I do that these days their is
no ideological difference left between the fossiles in
Beijing and the crooks in Taipei?

Now, if you want a real good, polemic subject, what
about this?  Wouldn't dismemberment be the best thing that 
could happen in China?  Is there any change for democracy
without a split in smaller pieces?)

Luc
Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:7295 soc.culture.china:12674
From: yang@vsoph8.cern.ch
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Taiwan, Republic of China
Date: 11 Apr 92 01:43:00 GMT
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <kuc0djINNqb6@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM>, stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin) writes...
>In article <1992Apr10.202842.3466@nic.umass.edu> (Peter Hawkins) writes:
>>
>>yet another instance of the horne-insanity........ :)
>>
>>In article <1992Apr10.164432.3493@cs.yale.edu> (Scott Horne) writes:
>>><
>>>The government of Taiwan Province is the PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF CHINA.
> 
>A republic nation is a nation governed by the people.
>So, people's republic is a republic.
>The People's Republic of China is Republic of China.
>The government of Taiwan Province is under Republic of China.

   Steven, FYI, some netters are arguing what is true AHQ right these
 days.....
Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:7532 soc.culture.china:13117
From: bbs@medsys.rn.com (Public BBS System)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Gin Jong fans' chellenge!! (was Re: The Six-Year National ...)
Date: 16 Apr 92 00:11:52 GMT
Reply-To: bbs@medsys.UUCP (Public BBS System)
Organization: Med-Systems, Kingsport, Tennessee

In article <dyang.703295966@cunews> dyang@diana.carleton.ca (Dong Yang) writes:
>In <1992Apr14.034330.8899@medsys.rn.com> bbs@medsys.rn.com (Public BBS System) writes:
>
>>Scott is close to Shou4 Nan2 Shan1? It is very hard for me to put those
>>two characters together. I think the proper term to describe Shou Nan
>>Shan is Wei3 Suo3 while the proper term to describe Scott is ......
>>(I cannot come out with a good one.)   
>
>>Chou1
>
>
>Why not using 'Tao2 Gu3 Liu4 Xian1' to describe Scott? 

I thought about them but decided that Scott was not close enough to them.
Scott boasts a lot, just like TGLX (Remember four of the TGLX boasted that
they tore Ji4 Wu2 Shi1 into pieces when they did not even touch Ji's
clothes?) In this regard, Scott and TGLX are quite similar. However, TGLX
did shut their mouth up when Ping2 Yi1 Zhi3 told them not to speak. I have
yet to see Scott do that. (Maybe Scott has met his Ping Yi Zhi.)

Chou1
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: sworking@leland.Stanford.EDU (Scott Workinger)
Subject: Lecture & Workshop - Taoist Health Practice
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 92 02:10:49 GMT

                   
Education in Taoist Health Practice

In early China, Taoists were famed for their longevity.  This longevity 
was the consequence of health sciences developed in the various Taoist 
monasteries.  Three foundations of Taoist health practice are chi kung, 
diet, and meditation.  Chi kung builds the body's energy capacity and 
facilitates healthy circulation.  The science of diet tailors an 
individual's eating patterns to the person's individual character and 
current circumstances.  Meditation calms the mind, thus avoiding the de 
stabilizing effects of mental agitation.  

Unfortunately, access to Taoist health science has been very limited, 
especially in the United.States., and it is rare to meet individuals who 
are qualified to teach these practices.  Kwan Saihung will be offering
instruction in Taoist health practices in the San Francisco Bay area 
during the spring of this year.  

Kwan Saihung has pursued scholarly and martial studies through a long and 
eventful life.  Today, he occasionally emerges from retirement to teach 
Taoist health practices in the belief that the benefits of such practice 
should be made available to all individuals.


Lecture:  An Introduction to Taoist Health Practice

	Time:  Friday, May 8 at 7:30 PM. 
	Location:  Cypress Room, Second Floor, 
	Tressidor Student Union, Stanford University
	Cost:  Free

          
Workshop:  Foundations of Taoist Health Practice
	Beginning Taoist Yoga:  The Eight Brocades Exercises
	Diet:  Theory and Practice
	Chi Kung:  Basic exercises to open the meridians and strengthen 
		   the body
	Meditation:  Golden Light Meditation
	Time:  Friday, May 15 (evening), May 16, May 17
	Location:  To be announced (General vicinity of Palo Alto)
	What to Bring:  1) A black sash of polyester/cotton, 6 inches in 
			width and long enough to wrap around your waist 4
			times, 2) Water, 3) Notebook 4) Towel or pad, 
			5) Sitting cushion for meditation.
	
	Later workshops in the series will introduce progressively more 
	advanced theory and exercises.

Interested individuals may wish to review the book, "Scholar Warrior, An 
Introduction to the Tao in Everyday Life" by Deng Ming-Dao, 1990, 
HarperCollins.  The book, written by Kwan Saihung's senior student, 
describes several Taoist health practices.

To register for the workshop or to obtain further information, please 
contact:

	Mitchell Tsao	
	Tsao's Acupuncture and Herbal Clinic				
	36601 Newark Blvd.						
	Old Town Center #2						
	Newark, California 94560
	(510) 795-1410

	   <or>

	Scott Workinger
	Box 9767
	Stanford, Ca. 94309
	sworking@leland.stanford.edu



Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:7275 soc.culture.china:12621
From: xwang@ug.cs.dal.ca (Roland (Xinlei) Wang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Gin Jong fans' chellenge!! (was Re: The Six-Year National ...)
Date: 10 Apr 92 13:24:38 GMT
Organization: Math, Stats & CS, Dalhousie University, Halifax, NS, Canada

In article <1992Apr09.193512.31616@watson.ibm.com> TJFAN@WATSON.IBM.COM writes:
>In  <1992Apr9.125027.13109@cbfsb.cb.att.com>  ykhsu@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (yung-kao.hsu) writes:
>>      In addition, many roles in Gin Jong's novels have been projected
>>      to many politicans in recent history. Are there any one who want
>>      to do this for any well-known people today? To have more fun out
>>      of this, don't restrict yourselves to Chinese/Taiwanese (e.g, is
>>      there any role similar to Edward Kennedy?).
>>  
>Let me try the following:
> 
>CHARACTERS                       NOVEL TITLE             PROJECTION
>Shing1 Su4 Law3 Gwai4            Tien1 Long2 8 Bu4       Mao Tse-Dung
>Shing1 Su4's students            Tien1 Long2 8 Bu4       Red Guards
>Dong1 Fung1 Bu2 Bai4             Shiaw4 Au4 Jiang1 Hu2   Mao in his late age
>Yang2 Lien2 Ting2                Shiaw4 Au4 Jiang1 Hu2   Jiang1 Ching1 (Mao's wife)
>Tzuo3 (left) Leng3 (cold) Chan2  Shiaw4 Au4 Jiang1 Hu2   CKS
>Yue4 Bu4 Chun2                   Shiaw4 Au4 Jiang1 Hu2   Deng4 Shiaw3 Ping2           
I know you have read a lot of Gin Jong's ( am I spelling right? :-) novel,
but you really haven't know much about Chinese history, especially recent 
history in mainland China, so don't be too confidence of what you are told
in Taiwan, Hongkong, or somewhere else.


-- 
!  Xinlei (Roland) Wang              - Both name are given. HmHm... 8-|   !
!  Add: 3000 Olivet St. Apt. 103 Halifax, N.S. Canada. Phone:902-453-0565 !
!  E-mail Add: xwang@ug.cs.dal.ca or xinlei@ac.dal.ca                     !
!  DARK NIGHT GIVE US DARK EYES, BUT WE USE IT TO LOOK FOR SUN. -Gu Chen  !
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
From: dyang@aaron.carleton.ca (Dong Yang)
Subject: Re: Gin Jong fans' chellenge!! (was Re: The Six-Year National ...)
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 23:48:31 GMT

So many people have been trying so hard to find some roles, in Jin
Yong's novels, who could fit Mr. Scott Horne.  I doubt that Mr. S.H
has read these articles even once.  This fact is also interesting to
me.





Dong Yang



Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:7283 soc.culture.china:12645
From: chchang@acsu.buffalo.edu (Chun-Shi Chang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: "Innesent" (Re: The Six-Year ...)
Date: 10 Apr 92 20:17:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: acsu.1992Apr10.201707.2463
Organization: State University of New York at Buffalo/Comp Sci

I said:
Blah, blah, blah...

cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi) writes:
>I did find out that people from Taiwan tend to be old fashioned Chinese,
>little naive, innesent. No intension to be offensive.

Okay, you got me this time. What is "innesent"? I am too "naive" to
know this word. Thank you for an explanation.
-Chunshi
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
From: horne-scott@CS.YALE.EDU (Scott Horne)
Subject: Re: The Six-Year National Development Plan for Taiwan, "R.O.C"
Organization: Computer "Science" Dept, Yale University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 23:36:42 GMT

In article <1992Apr10.222249.12761@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>, thuang@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Tze-yau Huang) writes:
<
<So you says that the ROC state has been the legal government of Taiwan
<for about forty years in the first half of this century.

Yes.

<What is your answer to the following passage?
<
<	The "Republic of China" proclaimed on 1 January 1912 had never
<governed  Formosa.
[rest deleted]

The Japanese government was the *illegitimate* government of Taiwan throughout
most of the ROC (and a couple of decades before).  The ROC, which inherited
all of China's territory from the Qing dynasty, was the legitimate government
of Taiwan.  Now the PRC is the legitimate government of Taiwan.

Does that answer your question?

					--Scott

-- 
Scott Horne                               ...!{harvard,cmcl2,decvax}!yale!horne
horne@cs.Yale.edu      SnailMail:  Box 7196 Yale Station, New Haven, CT   06520
203 436-1848                Residence:  Rm 1848 Silliman College, New Haven, CT
ZANG4 HAN4 YI4 JIA1 / GONG4 JIAN4 ZHONG1HUA2!
Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:7166 soc.culture.china:12378
From: joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: One country, two governments ?
Date: 25 Mar 92 22:16:39 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Organization: McDonald Observatory, University of Texas @ Austin

In article <1992Mar23.192545.17994@zip.eecs.umich.edu> cyc@z.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes:

me>One TI argument goes:
me>
me>  Taiwan has a separate government from the Mainland.
me>  It is therefore a separate country.
me>  Therefore, Taiwanese are not Chinese.

>It's absolutely correct. Why don't you check any of the text books on
>fundamental political science to find out what is the DEFINITION of a
>country.

My whole point is that the way that TIers use the word country is
different from the way international lawyers use it.

International law recognized West and East Germany as different
countries (meaning states), yet every time I compare the current
relationship between PRC/ROC to West/East Germany, TIers object.

The only reason I can imagine for this is that TIers not only want
Taiwan to be a separate state, but that they also want something else
separate.
From: wong@cs.widener.edu (Ho-Wei Wong)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: just testing
Date: 14 Apr 92 16:16:53 GMT
Organization: Widener University CS Department, Chester PA
NNTP-Posting-Host: lisa.cs.widener.edu

In article <1992Apr14.160623.28001@acsu.buffalo.edu> stsai@acsu.buffalo.edu (Shuoh-Ren Tsai) writes:
>ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu wrote:  
>
>>iN article <1992Apr12.202156@IASTATE.EDU>, aamir@IASTATE.EDU (Mohammad Asif) writes:
>>> I wanna know how far the Taipei airport is from the Nationl Taiwan Normal
>>> University.
>>
>>
>>	** Take bus from the airport to downtown taipei.
>>	   Then take city bus Rt.#3 or Rt.#15
>>	   It takes about 1.5 hr.
>>                       ^^^^^^^^^^
>
>   1.5 Hours ?    
>   I do not think so.

Try 3 hours with traffics.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: adamy@milton.u.washington.edu (Erh-Chun Yeh)
Subject: NON-POLITICAL: Need Recommendations of Karaoke Machine!
Keywords: Karaoke
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 08:26:36 GMT

I am thinking to buy a Karaoke Machine for entertainment. The models
I am interested are Pioneer CLD-V720 or CLD-V820, is there anyone out
there getting some good deal from some places? Any recommendation will
be much appreciated.
Also, I would like to know where can I buy some cheaper LDs?

                               o    o
                              o    oo
___________________________oo___________oo_______________________
___________________________oo___________oo_______________________
Adam Erh-Chun Yeh          oo       o   oo    o
                           ooo         ooo   o           o
Energy Group                ooo       ooo   oooooo       o 
Dept. of EE, ft-10           ooooooooooo    o    o   ooooooooo  
University of Washington      ooooooooo     o    o   o   o   o
                                 @@@        oooooo   o   o   o
Tel: (206) 367-9360 Home         @@@        o        o   o  oo
     (206) 685-1306 Office       @@@        oooooo       o
     (206) 685-1607 Lab        IIIIIII      o    o       o
Fax: (206) 367-9360                         o    o       o
email: adamy@milton.u.washington.edu        oooooo       o
_________________________________________________________________
From: leewu@diva.Berkeley.EDU (Lee Wu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: work exchange/babysitter
Date: 9 Apr 92 17:00:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.s1t76INN1k4
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: diva.berkeley.edu

Hope this is the right group to post.

A Chinese couple are looking for an honest and responsible Chinese 
female as a babysitter to help take care of a two-year old boy and  
a one-year old girl.  Hours from 7:00am to 4:00pm Monday through
Friday.  Compensations are furnished room and board. 
Possible for allowance. Walk to El Cerrito Plaza BART station. 
This position is ideal for a University of California, Berkeley
female student who wants to attend evening classes.
Must love children.  
If interested, please call Mrs. Wu @ (510) 643-6928 leave a voice mail 
or reply to email at leewu@diva.  Mandarin or Cantonese speaking prefered.
Thanks for your attention.
From: syliao@athena.mit.edu (S Yi-Huang Liao)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: HSNU needs you!
Date: 17 Apr 92 18:23:58 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

In article <1992Apr17.132245.2970@vax.muskingum.edu>, ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu writes:
|>
|> 	   Assume there is no College Entrance Test, do you think all
|> 	   high schools would become the same or similar (like those
|> 	   in US)? At Ohio, may concerned parents (Chinese) are still
|> 	   eagerly try to find out: which high school is better? I bet
|> 	   people in your area are doing the same.

I have attended two high schools in the U.S.  They are NOT similar at all.
The quality of the school and faculty depends largely on the area in which
the school is the located.  You would not expect high schools in rural
areas to be the same as those in the urban.  Generally speaking, schools
in the *suburban* areas where well-to-do people live are better than those
in the countries or in the cities.

Stan Yi-Huang Liao                                  syliao@rle-vlsi.mit.edu
From: mcyang@pollux.usc.edu (Bien-Chao Yeun)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Control?! (The Six-Year...)
Date: 15 Apr 1992 11:54:50 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: pollux.usc.edu

In article <1992Apr14.223347.28251@sbcs.sunysb.edu> 
hsiang@sbhsiang.cs.sunysb.edu (J. Hsiang) writes:
- Of course Hsu and Huang didn't budge under KMT pressure.  It is a matter
- of principle and it also concerns the integrity of DPP as a party.
- But apparently he did realize that making TI the focal point will not
- lead to the goal of becoming government party.  So he shelved TI for the
- moment.  Lucky for Taiwan, Hsu is too intelligent to have an irreversible
- ideological hang-up like many of the people on the net.  

We are talking about two things here, one's ideology and a political
party's strategy to win a national election.

People on soc.culture.taiwan like to talk about and spread their
ideologies more than to win some "popularity contest" on the net. That's
the reason that there are many bitter ideological conflicts such as TI vs 
unification, capitalism vs. socialism, feminism vs male chauvinism ...etc.   
The way people use Internet to communicate with each other, somehow, greatly
increase the trend of using this type of communication.   

On the other hand, it's a totally different game in real life politics.  
And Hsu is a very intelligent politician.

In article <1992Apr14.223347.28251@sbcs.sunysb.edu>  
hsiang@sbhsiang.cs.sunysb.edu (J. Hsiang) writes:
- Ms. lko, you have been away from Taiwan for too long to see that Taiwan
- is not such a polarized society as you remember. If you really care about
- Taiwan, why not spend some time (say a year) there?  Then maybe you can get
- some better perspective and find something more substantial to argue about.

It really depends on how you make your judgement.   By looking at the recent
activities in the National Assembly and Legislature Yuan, it seems to me
that Taiwan is a very polarized society.

In article <1992Apr14.223347.28251@sbcs.sunysb.edu>   
hsiang@sbhsiang.cs.sunysb.edu (J. Hsiang) writes:
- With your qualification, I'm sure you can find a reasonable job there.
- Why not give it a try?

This is not a good way to argue, is it ?   Please stick to the subject.
From: hung@ee.tamu.edu (Tzu-Chien Hung)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: HSNU needs you!
Date: 15 Apr 92 15:41:10 GMT
Organization: Texas A&M University

In article <1992Apr15.001718.3341@athena.mit.edu* clin@athena.mit.edu (Chia-Liang Lin) writes:
*In article <1992Apr14.191044.269@watserv1.waterloo.edu* ptyshih@watnow.waterloo.edu (Paul T.Y. Shih (Taku or Pear)) writes:
**In article <1992Apr14.100425.2943@vax.muskingum.edu* ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu writes:
***In article <1992Apr13.202045.22500@watserv1.waterloo.edu*, ptyshih@watnow.waterloo.edu (Paul T.Y. Shih (Taku or Pear)) writes:
**** 
**** 	Greeting for the big day! And thanks, HSNU (the senior high
**** 	school of National Taiwan Normal University), for giving me
**** 	the best high school life I could get in Taiwan.....
**** 
**** 	Paul T.Y. Shih (H472)
***
***
***	** Hay, I think Jian Guo Zhon Hsieh is better than HSNU.
***	   People from Jian Zhon should have a better high school
***	   life. Shouldn't it? 
**	
**	Nope, Jian4-Zhon1 might have more hard-studying students,
**	more acadamical reputation, but HSNU is good at uniformly
**	devoloping students' personality, skills, maturity. I am
**	proud of being part of it.
**
**	Paul (H472)
*
*	I have something to say about "personality, skills, maturity". All
*of them are not easy to evaluate. However, there are some criteria that might
*be helpful for us to get a rough idea about the personalities, skills, and
*maturities of the students from a specific school. For instance: How are
*they involved in extracurricular activities? How do they achieve in 
*inter-school contests? How many of them enter the Hall-of-Fame in their
*own careers?
*
*	To the best of my knowledge, Jian4-Zhon1 is the high school in 
*Taiwan that has most extracurricular associations (in my high school
*days, there were around one hundred). Every year Jian4-Zhon1's students
*hold a music concert in Dr. Sun Yeh-Sen Memorial Auditorium and present
*a state-of-the-art performance which is considered far beyond what you
*can expect from high school kids. Just to name a few. Dig deeper into
*these aspects and you will have a better idea and be able to come up
*with a more convincing argument.
*
*Chia-Liang Lin
*Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
*Massachusetts Institute of Technology 

I still remember those good old days of the music concerts.
Usually, they are three concerts in one year, for freshmen, for 
graduating senior, for school ann. Too bad, I did meet my wife 
in high school. Hope someday, I can bring her to a Jian-Zhon 
music concert.
I still remember that some Taipei senators ask why Jian-Zhon can
have concerts hold in Dr. Sun Yat-Sen Memorial Hall every year.

BTY, is there any way to get the tickets for the Jian-Zhou music 
concerts?
I like to have two someday when we go back to Taiwan.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china