HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rsmith@pearl.tufts.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: CoC was CHEAP
Date: 2 Jan 93 19:02:26 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA

In article <qcBqwB1w165w@infopls.chi.il.us>, honeydew@infopls.chi.il.us
(David Cohen) writes:
 
> Also, the "land mines" didn't make much sense to me, either.  And I did 
> not appreciate the redress of the 20th century navy buoys which they've 
> already used as transporter test objects and other things (I might be 
> wrong on this).  They don't really have the right shape or structure to 
> be something which would latch itself to a ship or make a sizeable 
> explosion.

Well, Jellico ordered **500** mines, but there were only about ten cylinders
in the shuttle (I didn't count, so that's "ten plus or minus five" :-) ).
The only way I see to rescue the show's continuity from this is to postulate
that those cylinders are just storage modules, each capable of holding fifty
or so mines.  This makes sense to me, since they were *antimatter* mines,
and even a little bit of antimatter can make quite an explosion, so they
could presumably be rather small.

> Picard was instantly back to his old sparkly, happy-go-lucky self
> within minutes.

I agree.  Between being taken over by the Borg, living an entire simulated
lifetime on an alien planet, losing his memory in a couple of episodes,
being turned into a child, being tortured by the Cardassians, and probably
other things, Picard should be a blithering idiot by now.  Presumably the
24th Century has some pretty good psychological techniques to prevent
this, but that's one area of Star Trek science and technology they've
neglected in a BIG way.

					--Rod Smith
					  RSMITH@PEARL.TUFTS.EDU
From: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu (Michael Rawdon)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Female CO for the E
Date: 25 Dec 92 18:28:20 GMT
Reply-To: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Dept., Madison, WI

In <1992Dec19.201557@cs.bham.ac.uk> pxf@cs.bham.ac.uk (Pranath Fernando) writes:
>I think it's a real shame that the script-writers/directors etc can't find the
>courage to set an example.

>Although they do appear infrequently, it's just not good enough.

>Oh well, I suppose we have a bit of a wait ahead of us !

One thing that bugs me about this whole thread is the assumption that Star Trek
is "supposed to" or "should" set some sort of an "example".  People seem to
forget that Star Trek is intended 1) To make money, and 2) To reflect the
artistic interests of those who create and produce it.  If those in control of
happen to find some particular male character more interesting as the captain
than a female character, then they're going to go with the one who is more
interesting to *them*.

For instance, Gene Roddenberry has claimed that his two creations - Kirk and
Picard - reflected himself and/or his interests at different stages of his
life.  Given that he is male, it seems reasonable that he would choose males
to reflect that.

The creators of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine may have had similar feelings, or
have simply come up with a black male character who interested them.  (I
couldn't say for sure, of course.)

If Star Trek gets to the point where it is driven by the need to "set
examples", I probably *will* stop watching.  REAL LIFE leaders are the ones we
need to set examples.  This is fiction.

-- 
Michael Rawdon				  rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Department,  Madison, WI
( Now in the Boston, Massachusetts area! )

"I think that (one of) TNG's problems is that it considers lacking action,
 humor and character interplay to be interchangable with cerebral (just like
 it often considers civility and lack of conflict interchangable with
 friendship)."
			- Atsushi Kanamori on rec.arts.startrek, 7 July 1991
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: jeffb@audiolab.UWaterloo.ca (jeff bamford)
Subject: Re: Hers one wores in CoC I
Organization: Audio Research Group, University of Waterloo
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 03:14:50 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.174638.29106@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> ckt0@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (CHARLES KEITH TESSLER) writes:
>Pecard and the new ass hole incharge duccuss the misssion in 10 foward hardly
>a sucure location. any one of a the people could have hure them not to mention
>what some hight tech bug could have picked up. They at least could have spoke
>in code words. But they just said everthing. Someone have to teach both of
>them a thing about espongae.
>-- 
>
>                                  Keith Tessler
>                                  Tel # (215) 758-1364

Isn't it a shame when cousins marry!




-- 
****************************************************************************
*   Jeff Bamford      jeffb@audiolab.uwaterloo.ca                          *
*  UW 519-885-1211 ext. 3814  Office: PHYS 206  Local: 519-664-1463        * 
****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: ac999239@umbc8.umbc.edu (ac999239)
Subject: Re: Data Watch
Organization: University of Maryland, Baltimore County Campus
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 04:44:30 GMT

> In Chain of Command part II, Data was wearing a red uniform.
> He was also in Riker's chair on the bridge.   How come Dr. Crusher, Data,
> Geordi, or Dianna never sit in the command chair? They're all the same rank
> as Riker.   And they also take orders from him, maybe it's because of his
> uniform colour, or maybe because he's Picard's right hand man?

Because they have not been trained for command except for Data and Geordi,
and only Crusher is the same rank as Riker. Only thing is Crusher and Troi
aren't even in the chain of command or not at the top of it. I'd trust Ro
before I'd trust Crusher or Troi since she is trained for command and
USED to be a Lt *heh*...

Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: lesnyd@monsanto.com (Larry E. Snyder)
Subject: Re: Troi had at least one good line! (CoC episode)
Organization: DSC
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 16:04:32 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.161910.16223@zip.eecs.umich.edu>, charles@zip.eecs.umich.edu (Charles Jacob Cohen) writes:
> 
> 
> Spoilers Ho...
> 
> 
> 
> From Chain of Command, in refence to the new Captain
> 
> Riker:  I'll say one thing for him, he's very sure of himself.
> Troi:  No, he isn't. <--- in a very calm almost non-chalant voice
> 
> *This* to me is how she should be used.  She can see right past people's
> facads and tell how they really feel, how they probably will act and why.
> She was also useful in negotiations, being someone the others will trust
> more easily than the Captain.  - Chuck

Uh, well, this line is completely useless and insignificant to the plot,
as it turns out in part II!
 
Jelico turns out to be competent and successful. Another astute observation
on the part of our Betabimbo!
From: lpeters@postmaster@hq.af.mil (Leslie D Peters)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: do we need rec.arts.startrek.dsn?
Date: 22 Dec 92 12:42:43 GMT
Reply-To: lpeters@marge.hq.af.mil
Organization: 7th Communications Group

In article <1992Dec19.211357.18709@umbc3.umbc.edu>, ac999239@umbc8.umbc.edu (ac999239) writes:

|> The startrek header could be left out on the DSN since it isn't Startrek at
                                                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|> all...I would leave out the current and info on ST:TOS since due to the fact
   ^^^
I would argue that point, based on the DS9 "It Waits for You" snippets I saw during
CoC I.  As it was exclaiming.....

   S T A R   T R E K
   -----------------
   DEEP  SPACE  NINE

*I* would consider it Star Trek, even xxx the fact that TNG characters are/will be "visiting"
the station if not moving there outright.
-- 
/============================================================================\
|                                            |                               |
|                    ___                     |                               |
|       ___....-----'---`-----....___        |   I haven't lost my mind --   |
| =========================================  |                               |
|        ___`---..._______...---'___         |    it's backed up on          |
|       (___)      _|_|_|_      (___)        |           tape somewhere.     |
|         \\____.-'_.---._`-.____//          |                               |
|           ~~~~`.__`---'__.'~~~~            |   lpeters@marge.hq.af.mil     |
|                   `~~~'                    |                               |
|                                            |     Les Peters                |
\============================================================================/
From: abhalla@infopls.chi.il.us (Arun Bhalla)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Troi in "Chain of command"
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 92 22:48:17 CST
Organization: INFOPLUS support, Wheeling, IL

> >
> >A simple Yes or No will be good. Yes means Yes, I want to see more Uniforms
> >and less Bodys suits. (i.e. more blue, less purple). No means back to the
> >body suit.
> >
> >Send to:   cboerm48@Calvin.edu
> >
> >So I'm even going to try. And if you don't like it,|
> >Tough!   (Thank you had have a nice day)             |    cboerm48@calvin.ed
> >
> 
>   N  N  OOOO  !!
>   NN N  O  O  !!
>   N NN  O  O
>   N  N  OOOO  !!
> 
> JL

Y    Y     EEEEEEEE       SSSSSSSS
 Y  Y      E              S
  YY       EEE            SSSSSSSS
  YY       E                     S
  YY       EEEEEEEE       SSSSSSSS


**************************************************************************
*  Arun Bhalla  *     Star Trek, FS4, Simcity, PCs, BBSs, reading, etc.  *
* Write me for  *   And other multiple interests!!!                      *
* my BBS #      * Prodigy: VXWF62B   Internet: abhalla@oaknet.chi.il.us  *
*               *                              abhalla@infopls.chi.il.us *
**************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: 2020211@SAPHIR.ULAVAL.CA (Sylvain Chamberland)
Subject: Re: Picard's garbled dialogue (was Re: Lynch's Review of CoC2)
Reply-To: 2020211@SAPHIR.ULAVAL.CA
Organization: CTI, Universite Laval
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 07:51:38 GMT

In article <1hkh70INNsoi@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, rfd@po.CWRU.Edu (Richard F. Drushel) writes:
>
>In a previous article, tlynch@cco.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) says:
>
>>--Could someone with a closed-captioning decoder please let me know what 
>>Picard's final lines are after "You cannot hurt me!"  I've gone over it 
>>several times, but damned if I can make it out...
>
>	I don't have a closed-caption recorder, but I did recognize
>what he was saying...he was singing in French, the same song he was
>singing to himself earlier while reminiscing about his childhood.
>
[deletions]
>to throw in French words and phrases).  So please no language flames :) :)
>
>	Sur la pont
>	D'Avignon
>	Loni danse, loni danse
>
>(On the bridge of Avignon, people dance, people dance)
>
>	French scholars please feel free to supply the remainder of
>the song, and to correct the spelling :)

Well, I'm not a French scholar, but as a French-speaking person, I can say it's

Sur le pont
d'Avignon
l'on y dance, l'on y dance

But I can't remember the rest!   (I can memorize the weight of chemical
elements, all the phone numbers of friends I haven't seen in years, the social
numbers of all members of my family, but impossible to remember words of a
song! Maybe I should try memorizing ascii numbers instead...  ;-)  )

>Richard F. Drushel ****** Ph.D. in Developmental Biology as of 4:45 PM 9211.20
>rfd@po.cwru.edu ** Cleveland FreeNet ** Co-Sysop, Coleco ADAM Forum ** Go Z80!
>"The bright and blinding sunlight shines so hotly on the trash-heaps that mere
>undigested food and snotty Kleenex flow as rivers of milk and honey." - c.5253

Sylvain Chamberland
2020211@saphir.ulaval.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu (Michael Rawdon)
Subject: Re: Troi Smut????
Reply-To: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Dept., Madison, WI
Distribution: world,local
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 18:14:05 GMT

In <30DEC199217233428@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov> afdenis@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (Stephen Dennison) writes:
>In article <1992Dec30.131812@ece.arizona.edu>, evans@ece.arizona.edu (Glen Evans) writes...
>>Why doesn`t someone post these .gif files?

>.. and here we go again ... 

>{Flame Retardant Suggestion}

>Post them to alt.binaries.pictures or alt.binaries.pictures.erotica

Well, it's perfectly acceptable to post them here (or, rather, over in
r.a.s.misc) since it *is* Star Trek-related material.  Moreover, many sites do
not receive alt groups.

-- 
Michael Rawdon				  rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Department,  Madison, WI
( Now in the Boston, Massachusetts area! )

"Beauty... survives."
				- James T. Kirk, "That Which Survives"
From: ph9991_manfr@rivers.acc.uwrf.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Replacement for Picard
Date: 3 Jan 93 01:32:32 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin - River Falls

> Yes, this has been discussed a lot recently on this group.  To summarize,
> there are basically two reasons why many people don't think Riker would make a
> good captain:
> 
> 1) They don't like Jonathan Frakes, or at least don't think that he or his
>    character are stong enough to be the center of the show.

People used to think Kirk was irreplaceable (some still do).  
Put in the captain's seat, I think we'd see a lot of other shades to Riker's
persona than we see now because he won't have to be as aggressive once he's
Captain because he'll have rank behind his opinions.  As it is now, if
someone disagrees with him, and Picard does too, all he can do is shout.
> 
> 2) It's unrealistic for command of the Federation flagship to be given to
>    someone who has never held a regular command of his own.  More likely,
>    command would be given to an experienced Captain, and Riker would be
>    offered the captaincy of a smaller ship.

The Enterprise's flagship status has always seemed to me to be an honorary
thing tied only to her name.  There are/were at least five other Galaxy class
ships which should have the same abilities as the Enterprise.  
Additionally, I think Riker's superb performance in "The Best of Both Worlds"
proved to all that he definitely is the man to beat for the big chair should
Picard ever accept promotion.  He did with the ship he already knows well
what 39 or 40 other starships couldn't do (or perhaps I should say he did
it with the crew).  The crew would certainly like him to be next I'm sure,
and if Picard gets a word in Starfleet's ear about his replacement, I think
it likely he'll pull for Riker.  

> 
> -- 
> Michael Rawdon				  rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
> University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Department,  Madison, WI
> ( Now in the Boston, Massachusetts area! )
> 
Steven.K.Manfred
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
(Smail3.1.28.1 #7) id m0n6pG2-0000yEC; Tue, 29 Dec 92 14: 17 PST
From: bwoolf@pro-woolf.cts.com (Bev Woolf - Sysop)
Subject: DS9 on WDCA Channel 20, Washington, D.C.
Organization: ProLine [pro-woolf] The Woolf's Den BBS
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 15:20:40 EST

The premiere episode for DS9 will be shown on Monday evening, January 4
from 8-10.  Thereafter, the show will air every Monday evening from 8-9 and
be repeated on the following Saturday from 6-7.  

This according to whoever answered the phone at the station. ;)

System Operator of Pro-Woolf       (A ProLine BBS)
--------------------------------------------------
ProLine: bwoolf@pro-woolf       AO: bwoolf@aol.com
        Internet: bwoolf@pro-woolf.cts.com         
           UUCP: crash!pro-woolf!bwoolf
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: jess@engx25.trt.com (Jess Alvarado)
Subject: Re: RIKER: What a Class A Jerk
Organization: TRT COMMUNICATIONS
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 16:17:45 GMT

>And, after all of it, Jellico was 100% right about everything he did.
>Every guess was correct. How he handled the Cardassians was correct.

I'd have to disagree with you.  Where was it shown that all the changes
and modifications to the Enterprise's systems was justified.  Perhaps 
if an actual confrontation between ships had occurred this justification
would have been made clear but as it was all the "E" had to do was lay
a few dozen mines in the nebula.  Hardly justification for the hell
Jellico put the crew through.  Please don't misunderstand me. Though my
initial reaction to Jellico in CoCI was negative, after reading different
views on the NET, I was willing to except his behavior as necessary.  And
I still might have had the writers created a conflict that would have 
demonstrated a need for all the changes.  This in my opinion was not done.

Your earlier comments about Riker I agree with entirely.  His behavior was
way out of character.  Though I did enjoy the exchange between him and 
Jellico.  I felt that under the circumstances they were both RIGHT.
Riker was insubordinant and Jellico was errogent and uninspiring.  But I
still think Riker is a fine 1st officer and Jellico is an excellent 
captain.



Jess


-- 
| Jess Alvarado                  |         E-mail:  jess@trt.com      |
| TRT COMMUNICATIONS, INC.       |         UUCP:    uunet!engx25!jess |
| 1352 NW. 40th Ave.             |         Voice:   (305) 797-3167    |
| Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33313       |         Fax:     (305) 797-3323    |
From: uhs@jab.tucson.az.us (Rob Macomber)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Re: Galaxy-class Starships
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 19:17:27 MST
Organization: Just Another Bbs. Tucson, AZ

boell@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Donald P Boell) writes:

> >Begging your pardon, but I believe the ship that blew up in the
> >"Conspiracy" episode was an Ambassador class starship, not Galaxy.
> 
> Wrong, the ship was the E's sister ship - the Yamato.

Wrong again, that was "Contagion" (sp?).  The one in "Conspiracy" was 
never seen, but I *think* that it was stated as being Ambassador class.

                        Rob Macomber
                         uhs@jab.tucson.az.us
From: L697187@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: TNG: Troi in uniform
Date: 23 Dec 92 16:34:04 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Missiles & Space Company, Inc.

------------------------- Original Article -------------------------
>>However, she is an OFFICER and has been refered to in many instances as such
>>(see Disaster for proof).  Therefore, she is as military as the next OFFICER
>>and should have to wear a uniform.  If she is a civilian then she should NOT
>>have free access to the bridge.  Other civilians don't.  She should be in
>>uniform while she is on duty.

I can't remember the name of the episode, but it was the one where Troi took
command on the bridge.  Someone on the bridge (Data I think) clarified her
position within starfleet when Ensign Ro challenged her authority.  If I
remember correctly (and I seldom do) she is a civilian advisor who has been
given the rank of ACTING Lieutenant-Commander.  The same thing is done for
chaplains in the military (although they wear uniforms).  I still say, let
her go naked if she wants.  She's not subject to their rules...

    \    /\
     \  /__\
Scott \/an  \rtsdalen
PP-ASEL, MCP
From: jadc@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (JUDITH A. DIAMONDSTEIN)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Lwaxana - Who plays her?
Date: 23 Dec 92 21:52:26 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

In article <1992Dec20.132407.1349@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>, helene@dcs.warwick.ac.uk (
Helene Blankespoor) writes:
>In article <1992Dec20.130609.1123@dcs.warwick.ac.uk> helene@dcs.warwick.ac.uk (
Helene Blankespoor) writes:
>>In article >>
>
>I just thought, isn't she the same actress that played No 1 in the first pilot
>.
>
>Helene
>

Yes, she did play #1 in the first pilot as well.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: rwmech@uumeme.chi.il.us (Robert W. Mech)
Subject: Re: Troi is capable of wearing a uniform (SPOILERS)
Organization: UUMEME Public Access Xenix
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 13:16:21 GMT

In article <BzMoxv.qM@monitor.com> michael@monitor.com (Michael Johnson) writes:
>In article <1992Dec20.145036.22652@uumeme.chi.il.us> rwmech@uumeme.chi.il.us  
>(Robert W. Mech) writes:
>> I know I would want a professional looking crew behind me, rather than
>> people who obviously cant follow regulations.
>
>I always just assumed Troi's outfits were regulation-acceptable alternatives  
>to "standard" uniform for someone in her role on ship.  Assuming this to be  
>true, the intention was either that Cap'n Jello is very inflexible and wants  
>everything to exceed regulation specs (like the drive efficiency levels,) or  
>the writers just stepped on the older dress convention because it made a good  
>line.  I often suspect the writers aren't as careful of existing conventions  
>as the viewers.

True.  The uniform may be acceptable as far as somone in a less appointed 
position.  What I mean here, is that you sometimes have seen Geordi and 
Data in "Engineering Jumpsuits" but you dont see them on the bridge dressed
as such.  It may be a regulation-acceptable alternative, but I dont think
that would include being on the bridge.  Lets face it here, you dont want
everyone on the bridge dressing in all diffrent "regulation-acceptable
alternatives" they would look silly dont you think? :-)  I think Jelico is
just being proper, where Picard just dosent care as much.

-- 
:*: rwmech@uumeme.chi.il.us | Owner/Adminstrator UUMEME Public Access Xenix :*:
Those who would sacrifice essential liberties for the sake of temporary
               safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ph9991_manfr@rivers.acc.uwrf.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Saturday Night Review - "Chain of Command Part II" SPOILERS!
Date: 28 Dec 92 17:57:57 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin - River Falls

In article <92362.223738BRUNO@NDSUVM1.BITNET>, BRUNO@NDSUVM1.BITNET (Tony Bruno) writes:
> --Regarding the reply to my comments on COCII --
> 
> Hmm.  Your reply was both insulting and arrogant.  I like that
> in a writer. :)
> 
> 
> 2.  Ah, the old "this is the 24th Century!" argument.  What bunk.
>     Ever read _Lysistrata_?  Ever read Plato's _The Apology of Socrates_?
>     Ever read anything by Chaucer, Balsac, or Rabolet? (SP?)  Judging
>     by your prose, I believe you have.  If so, you should recognize the
>     remarkable similarity of humanity described in the above works to
>     the mankind of today.  This is spanning nearly 2,000 years of
>     literature, mind you.  If 2,000 hasn't made a significant
>     difference, than another 300 certainly won't.  Gene L. Coon understood
>     that humanity would expand into space, faults and all.  Gene Rodenberry
>     was the one who touted our "growth beyond our failings."  Poppycock!
>     It's our STRUGGLE with our failings that keeps us alive.  Expansion
>     to the stars will not change those things.  They will always be within
>     us.
> 
>     Besides, this *is* the 20th century, and TNG is a television show
>     on for TODAY's audience.  Frankly the "new, improved" human race
>     of TNG is boring.  I don't tune in to be preached at; I tune in
>     to be entertained.  Not too surprisingly, TNG doesn't do EITHER well.
> 

I didn't say I liked this treatment of humanity in the future, I just said
that that is what TNG is about.  I agree with you, this treatment is rubbish
and isn't going to happen in a mere four hundred years no matter what 
technology does.  We'll perhaps become more peaceful in military terms
(the side of TNG I can agree with), but people are still going to get on
each other's nerves and there will still be people with edgy personalities.
This is something that has improved as Roddenberry's control relaxed, but
the first season was decidedly guilty of that.  Deep Space Nine may well
turn out to be just the sort of thing you're looking for.  
I treat this mistaken view of humankind's future as just another thing to
"accept" in the same way I "accept" a warp drive or a transporter without
much justification.  But it is something that stretches the credulity a bit.

Steven.K.Manfred