HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: crosmun@crosmun.rtp.dg.com (William Crosmun)
Subject: Re: Education Regarding Alternative Family Units (Re: The Analogy Be
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 13:52:44 GMT
Organization: Data General Corporation, Research Triangle Park, NC

In article <tpvaa3v@Unify.Com> ceb@dbrus.Unify.Com (Caroline E. Bryan) writes:
>In article <q182wB1w165w@major.panix.com> dos@major.panix.com (Dave O'Shea) writes:
>>keith@balrog.dseg.ti.com (Keith A. Schauer) writes:
>>
>>> What state do you live in that you can't send your children to the school
>>> of your choice?
>>
>>Almost any. Parents have their assets confiscated, and possibly their
>>children, if they attempt to refuse to pay tribute to the local school
>>board, and use the money to send their kids to a real school.
>
>There's a profound difference between sending one's children to the school of
>one's choice while simultaneously complying with the laws and regulations of 
>the region one lives in, and trying to send one's children to the school of
>one's choice while simultaneously breaking the laws and regulations of the
>region one lives in.  However, the difference does NOT involve the question
>of whether one is allowed to send one's children to the school of one's
>choice.

How about this scenario.  Two school districts, District A and District B, exist
side by side.  District A is the world's worst and District B is the world's best.
Anyone in District A who cares would choose to send their children to District B and
however, in (possibly) every state, only those parents who live in District B can
send their children to District B, so those parents stuck in District A cannot send
their children to the school of their choice. 

But the whole question of school choice is based on one undeniable fact:  the
taxpayers of this country are paying for a world class school system but we aren't
getting one.  While educators and legislators and unions and parents argue about how
to fix the problems kids are going through the system without getting an education.
School choice may cause "chaos" in the public school system, but as William F.
Buckley points out, this is like worrying about dropping a few hand grenades in
Hiroshima the day after the atomic bomb had already levelled the place.

>
>
>Carrie		ceb@rechenau.unify.com		x 6244  ----------------+
>|  I don't belong to any organized political party:  I'm a Democrat.	|
>|						-- Will Rogers		|
>+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+


===============================================================================

William Crosmun
crosmun@dg-rtp.dg.com

===============================================================================
Princess Diana has announced that she wants to withdraw from public life.  Toward
this end she is pursuing a role in the new series The Hat Squad.
   
                                                 Jay Leno - 1993
===============================================================================
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: laurel.schippers@hal9k.ann-arbor.mi.us (Laurel Schippers)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
Subject: TOLERATION
Date: 4 Jan 93 10:09:00 GMT
Reply-To: laurel.schippers@hal9k.ann-arbor.mi.us (Laurel Schippers)
Organization: HAL 9000 BBS, W-NET HQ, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

-> Why is wrong to rob a grave, have sex with animals, children, would
-> it be wrong to spike a pregnant mothers drink with RU42 (or whatever
-> it is), why is blackmail wrong and taxation not?  Fact is that we
-> have to make moral decisions and when it comes down to it, you have
-> to assume something.  If I choose to believe the Bible and find it to
-> be a workable basis for me then why don't you practice some of that
-> toleration
->
->                                Craig

It helps if your beliefs have some sort of internal consistency. If
you want to turn to Christianity for your moral beliefs, great. But
in this country, your right to do so is just as important as my
right not to do so.

(Taxation is OK because the Government does it, of course.)
  
----
+------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+
| HAL 9000 BBS +1 313 663 4173 or 663 3959 | Four 14.4k v.32bis dial-ins |
| Public Access QWK-to-Usenet gateway      | With PCBoard 14.5aM & uuPCB |
+------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
From: wbralick@afit.af.mil (Will Bralick)
Subject: Re: Chelsea's school ...
Organization: Self-similar
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:01:10 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.185341.14427@b30.ingr.com> dash@skyy.b30.ingr.com writes:
|
| Look.  If you get taxpayer money in the form of vouchers accepted by
| private (religious) schools, then they should also abide by government 
| (and supreme court decisions) regarding school prayer. Don't like them
| apples, then don't accept vouchers.....

Bzzt.  Sorry, but do you restrict social security pensioners (or other
transfer payment recipients, for that matter) from contributing money 
to churches from their social security checks?  

Thomas Jefferson authorized federal money to be paid to religious
schools in the Louisiana territory.  I will look up a reference on the
subject if anybody needs it (I would have to dig it out).


Regards,

-- 

Will Bralick			          Speaking _only_ for myself.

Standard disclaimers apply.            Void where prohibitted by law.
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
From: mykes@shell.portal.com (mike myke schwartz)
Subject: Re: Social (in)Security (was: Re: Chelsea's school ...)
Organization: Portal Communications Company
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 13:10:51 GMT

Will Bralick (wbralick@afit.af.mil) wrote:
: In article <1993Jan9.180054.14308@leland.Stanford.EDU> kellyj@leland.Stanford.EDU (Kelly Johnson) writes:
: | In article <1993Jan8.185408.5547@afit.af.mil> wbralick@afit.af.mil (Will Bralick) writes:
: | >
: | >I would phase in a replacement for social security that would be a true
: | >annuity and would represent real property for the future social security 
: | >recipient.  I guess that I would maintain mandatory participation in the
: | >program, otherwise those who pull out today might well be back in 40
: | >years with their palms up and a demand for their ``fair share.''
: | >
: | 
: | I guess saying "Sorry, you made your decision years ago...Accept
: | responsibility for your actions is just tooooo politically incorrect"????
: 
: Well, I think that it would not work in practice.  Didn't Ben Franklin say
: something to the effect once that if the people learned they could vote
: themselves bread and circuses it would be the beginning of the end for
: our democracy?
: 

I don't know about Franklin, but Karl Marx sure did say that when a capitalist
society figured out that it could vote itself money out of the government
coffers, it would be the beginning of the end.  Sorry I don't have the exact
quote handy.

: Regards,
: 
: -- 
: 
: Will Bralick			          Speaking _only_ for myself.
: 
: Standard disclaimers apply.            Void where prohibitted by law.
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: rww@mugwump.cl.msu.edu (Richard W. Wiggins)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Chelsea's school ...
Date: 11 Jan 93 23:13:47 GMT
Organization: Michigan State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: mugwump.cl.msu.edu

In article <1ise7cINNl4r@apache.dtcc.edu> bob@hobbes.dtcc.edu (Bob Rahe)  
writes:

> >Try another analogy: do you think someone who supports soup 
> >kitchens for the poor is hypocritical if he ever eats at a
> >nice restaurant?
> 
>     Ahhh,  Ummmm, do you guys READ what you say.  What a damning analogy.
> A very good reason FOR a voucher system, you are damning the public school
> system with your own words(!).  If it is what you say, why not give 
> EVERYONE the privilege of getting out, at NO ADDITIONAL COST!


Look for the log in your own eye, bub.  Are soup kitchens inherently
publicly financed?  And what did this post say about the school system
anyhow?  I'm just saying that advocacy for improving a system is not
rendered inappropriate if you choose not to partake of their services.

Let's try yet another analogy -- do you think the gummint should give
vouchers to the populace to be spent on health care as they choose?
Guess what?  That's very close to the managed competition model Clinton
espouses to replace our current sorry mess of health care funding.

Look, I hold no brief for the current state of public schools.  In
many places they're a mess.  In general, though, the voucher system
is an excuse to provide taxpayer funding for religious schools.
Xref: sparky alt.rush-limbaugh:13094 alt.politics.clinton:19664 alt.politics.bush:15588 alt.politics.homosexuality:9009 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:11639
From: dos@major.panix.com (Dave O'Shea)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush
Subject: Re: Education Regarding Alternative Family Units (Re: The Analogy Be
Date: 8 Jan 93 13:15:37 GMT
Organization: Department of Redundancy Department

keith@balrog.dseg.ti.com (Keith A. Schauer) writes:

> >Better yet, SCHOOL CHOICE.  This way we can choose the school which best 
> >reflects our children's needs.  Note, BTW, that I (rather than the state)
> >have decided what those needs are.  I call this "parenting".
> 
> 	I don't understand.  What state do you live in that you can't
> 	send your children to the school of your choice?  Maybe you 
> 	should move.

Almost any. Parents have their assets confiscated, and possibly their
children, if they attempt to refuse to pay tribute to the local school
board, and use the money to send their kids to a real school.


--
"To call something 'Public' is to define it as filthy, inefficient and
dangerous. The public toilet is the epitome of social spending."
                                                 - P.J. O'Rourke
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: merlyn@digibd.digibd.com (Merlyn LeRoy)
Subject: Re: Sexuality
Organization: DigiBoard, Incorporated, Eden Prairie,MN
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 21:20:15 GMT

dostalik@epcot.spdc.ti.com (Bill Dostalik) writes:
>Instilling basic Judeo-Christian values in schoolchildren is hardly a threat to
>their freedom:

Not a threat to their freedom, it's an actual violation of their freedom.

---
Merlyn LeRoy
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
From: jmfuchs@unix.amherst.edu (jesse fuchs)
Subject: Re: using the bible to advance bigotry
Followup-To: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
Organization: Amherst College
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 10:12:10 GMT

rlc1028@zeus.tamu.edu wrote:
> In article <1993Jan5.174811.3015@porthos.cc.bellcore.com>, wgb3@pyuxf.uucp (25336-buoni) writes...
> | 
> |I'm sorry you feel this way.  My point was not to discuss the existence/
> |non-existence of God.  I know he exists, you seem to doubt it.  We'll one
> |day learn the answer if I am right, and never learn the answer if I am wrong.
> 
> 	Well, I don't know.  If you're wrong, that still doesn't mean
> there's not G-d, or that there's no afterlife.  Zeus might be up there
> ready to zap us all for being wrong.  
	Hear, hear! When people ask what religion I belong to, I usually 
tell them "All of 'em. I'm hedging my bets." 
> Y-hw-h could be up there ready to
> zap all the Christians, Jesus could be ready to judge the Jews and Moslems
> and everyone else.  Who knows, Bill?
> 
> Gadson
	See you in Hades,
		jesse

--

"Where imagination is sucked out of children by a cathode ray nipple
 T.V. is the only wet nurse that would create a cripple
 On television, the drug of a nation
 Breeding ignorance and feeding radiation."
				-Disposable Heroes of Hiphoprisy
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: jsue@ncsa.uiuc.edu (Jeffrey L. Sue)
Subject: Re: God is intolerant of sin!
Originator: jsue@mars.ncsa.uiuc.edu
Organization: The Dow Chemical Company
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 22:35:36 GMT

In article <dlhanson.27.726175240@nap.amoco.com> dlhanson@nap.amoco.com (David L. Hanson) writes:
>Some forget that God is intolerant of sin; He is a God of love AND
>JUSTICE. More of the Lord Jesus Christ's words follow: 
>
>Mt 7:23 And  then will I  profess unto them,  I never knew  you:  depart
>from me, ye that work iniquity.
>
>Mt 13:41  The Son  of man  shall send  forth his  angels, and they shall
>gather out  of his  kingdom all  things that  offend, and  them which do
>iniquity;
>
>Mt 23:28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within
>ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
>
>Lu 13:27 But  he shall say,  I tell you,  I know you  not whence ye are;
>depart from me, all [ye] workers of iniquity.
>
>Mt 23:33 [Ye] serpents, [ye] generation of vipers, how can ye escape the
>damnation of hell?
>
>Lu 12:5 But  I will forewarn  you whom ye  shall fear:   Fear him, which
>after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto  you,
>Fear him.
>
>Mt 13:40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire;  so
>shall it be in the end of this world.
>
>Mt 13:42 And  shall cast them  into a furnace  of fire:   there shall be
>wailing and gnashing of teeth.
>
>Mt 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart  from
>me, ye  cursed, into  everlasting fire,  prepared for  the devil and his
>angels:
>
>Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and  is
>withered; and men gather them, and  cast [them] into the fire, and  they
>are burned.
>
>How not to suffer the wrath of God for sin? Simple.
>"Jesus saith unto him, I am THE way, THE truth, and THE life: NO MAN
>cometh unto the Father BUT BY ME"
>"Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved"
>=========================================================================
>David L. Hanson       Internet --> dlhanson@nap.amoco.com
>Amoco Corporation     X.400    --> A=attmail,P=amoco,S=Hanson,G=David,I=L
>Any opinions expressed are my own!

What's your point, David.  I really doubt one can truly "follow" every
word written in the bible without living a hypocritical and/or contradictory
life.  "Let he who has never sinned cast the first stone."

BTW, God may be intolerant to sin, but that's HIS judgement to make,
not man's.  I do believe that the bible also says something to the effect
that it is blasphemous for man to profess to know the mind of God.  Thus
we can never know how God will judge.  For all you know, He may see some
good that outweighs all the bad you see.

-- 
-----
Jeff Sue   
 - All opinions are mine -       (and you can't have any, nya nya nya)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality,talk.religion.misc
From: albrigh@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas g albright)
Subject: Re: Sexuality
Keywords: Hitler
Organization: Indiana University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:21:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan7.230322.914@galileo.physics.arizona.edu> krueger@galileo.physics.arizona.edu (Ted Krueger) writes:
>
>Please, state the name of one Christian who has killed a homosexual.
>
>Ted

Adolph Hitler!
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
From: mvp@netcom.com (Mike Van Pelt)
Subject: Re: Chelsea's school ...
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 02:41:09 GMT

In article <3705.97.uupcb@hal9k.ann-arbor.mi.us> laurel.schippers@hal9k.ann-arbor.mi.us (Laurel Schippers)  writes:
>Oh, and his wife is the one with the bucks. She makes about $300K a
>year at a real, nongovernment job.
           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
NOT!  She's a lawyer.
-- 
Mike Van Pelt          | What happens if a big asteroid hits Earth?
mvp@netcom.com         | Judging from realistic simulations involving a
                       | sledge hammer and a common laboratory frog, we
                       | can assume it will be pretty bad. -- Dave Barry
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
From: nate@psygate.psych.indiana.edu (Nathan Engle)
Subject: Re: Chelsea's school ...
Organization: Psych Department, Indiana University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:21:27 GMT

mike@execu.execu.com (Mike McCants) writes:
>Nathan Engle writes:
>>    Actually in Indiana there's a program that's just started which will 
>>allow parents to choose to send their kids to a "magnet" school.

>Yes, magnet schools are a very small form of competition.  But they
>are restricted to students that are much more intelligent than
>average.  They are "elite" and subject to attack.  Even "honors"
>classes in the regular schools are now subject to attack.  Why
>should the smart students be allowed a class of their own where
>they can get even smarter?

    I thought that the whole goal of the voucher system was supposed to 
be that smart and motivated parents could pull their smart and motivated 
kids out of the Very Nasty public system so that they could go to classes 
at private schools where they would presumably get smarter. Are you trying 
to question the priciple of separating students based on their skills, 
or is this just an attempt to slam something smart that public schools 
are doing which might make your proposals unnecessary?

>Riding a bus an extra hour a day to get to the other side of
>town to a school that would otherwise be all black is one "cost"
>of such a school.  But without this possibility, even more of
>the intelligent sudents would go to private schools.  Very few
>of the high school students in the math/science magnet school
>are minorities.  Only 50% survive 4 years.

    If it was so easy that everyone could make the grade then it wouldn't 
be worth very much, now would it? Practically every day I hear Rush rant 
and rave about lowering standards, so surely you're not arguing that magnet 
schools should lower their standards to jack up their graduation statistics.

>>    The reason I think that it would be a bad idea is that our public 
>>schools are a "safety" net into which most of our "disadvantaged" students 
>>are placed.

>For whose benefit?

    Theirs.

>Are they really learning?

    I went to public schools and I didn't think I'd turned out all that 
rotten. If they want to learn they can learn. 

>Disadvantaged in money or disadvantaged in motivation?

    Money.

>If half the students went to private schools at half the (public) cost, 
>there would be twice as much money to try to teach these disadvantaged 
>students.

    Not the way I figure. Say you have 10 students that draw $4000 each to 
their public school ($40,000 total), and 5 of them grab their $2000 
vouchers ($10,000) and buzz off to private schools, leaving the public 
school with 5 students and a grand total of $30,000 (50% more per student, 
not 100%, and that's not counting any fixed costs).

--
Nathan Engle                        Software Juggler
Psychology Department               Indiana University
nate@psygate.psych.indiana.edu      nengle@copper.ucs.indiana.edu
Xref: sparky alt.rush-limbaugh:13482 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:12074 alt.politics.clinton:19968 alt.politics.bush:15759 alt.politics.homosexuality:9252
From: smithmc@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Lost Boy)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: God is intolerant of sin!
Date: 9 Jan 93 21:26:14 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center

In article <dlhanson.27.726175240@nap.amoco.com> dlhanson@nap.amoco.com (David L. Hanson) writes:
>In article <1993Jan4.152437.28128@news.DKRZ-Hamburg.DE> k206027@smog.DKRZ-Hamburg.DE (Bakayaroo Banzai) write
>	 
>>>your bible is that your bible fosters intolerance. It is a misogynistic,
>>                                       ^^^^^^^^^^^
>>"Love your neighbor as yourself"
>>
>>"If your enemy is hungry give him something to eat"
>>
>>"Judge not, lest you also be judged"
>>
>>"Without Love I am nothing"
>>
>>>homophobic book. It preaches intolerance of all that do not believe in it.
>>>Sometimes it does so rather directly, as with all the smiting that goes on 
>>>in the old testament. Sometimes it is somewhat more subtle, as when saying
>>>that non-believers will go to hell. Why should I put up with your belief
>>>that I am inferior to a christian? If you don't believe that, then have
>>           ^^^^^^^^
>>"There is no one who does good, not one"
>>
>>"All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God"
>>
>>>some backbone and reject the church.
>>                   ^^^^^^
>>Not all of us are labouring under such a warped and distorted view of
>>the Bible as you seem to be. 
>>
>Some forget that God is intolerant of sin; He is a God of love AND
>JUSTICE. More of the Lord Jesus Christ's words follow: 
>
> [Bible quotes deleted]
>
>How not to suffer the wrath of God for sin? Simple.
>"Jesus saith unto him, I am THE way, THE truth, and THE life: NO MAN
>cometh unto the Father BUT BY ME"
>"Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved"

I'm glad to see that SOMEONE posted Biblical passages which demonstrate the
loving nature of Christianity. Now, if only that loving nature could be
better expressed, then we wouldn't have anti-gay Christians making asses
of themselves.

Lost Boy
Xref: sparky alt.rush-limbaugh:13302 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:11903 alt.politics.clinton:19850 alt.politics.bush:15692 alt.politics.homosexuality:9182
From: tip@lead.aichem.arizona.edu (Tom Perigrin)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Homosexuality is unnatural?  So what?  CIVILIZATION is unnatural!
Date: 8 Jan 93 06:10:47 GMT
Distribution: usa, world
Organization: University of Arizona UNIX Users Group

A lot of people seem to think that homosexuality is bad because it
is "unnatural".  They leap through a lot of hoops to ignore homosexual
behavior amoung animals, and perform other post hoc rationalizations to
excuse their prejudice.

But, if I grant the proposition that ALL "unnatural" acts are bad,
then I would like to ask them how in the world they condone the use of
unnatural things like fire, tools, houses, clothing, commerce, makeup,
SOAP, shampoo, radial tires and all those other unnatural things that 
seperates mankind from the animal kingdom?

Or maybe they don't use soap? 
Xref: sparky alt.rush-limbaugh:13582 talk.abortion:55156