From: poser@vxcrna.cern.ch (Till Poser   ZEUS Offline)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: German Blood
Summary: A lot of questions asked
Date: 11 Apr 92 18:49:17 GMT
Reply-To: poser@vxdsyc.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA

In article <L371F6E@math.fu-berlin.de>, weberwu@inf.fu-berlin.de
(Debora Weber-Wulff) writes in soc.culture.german:

Factual information, at last! There is a distinction, however. The
following is true mainly for non-Germans (whatever that is) living in
Germany and applying for citizenship. Part of the discussion is about
"ethnic Germans" returning, as it were, to Germany. By now they have to
apply for immigration at the German embassies and consulates in their
country of origin.

|> One does not quite get a German passport "on demand". You have to 
|> have (at least) the following:
|>
|> - have lived in Germany legally for at least 10 years (5 if you are
|> married to a German)
|> - have a "Fuehrungszeugnis" in good order (there's a limit to the
|> amount of fines and jail time you are allowed to have, you have to be 
|> "unbescholten" in your "Lebenswandel")
|> - have a place to live
|> - be able to feed your family (i.e. have a job and not live on
|> public assistance)
|> - have to show a "freiwillige und dauernde Hinwendung zu Deutschland",
|> to know about the German govermnent and to pledge oneself on the basis
|> of the free and democratic basic order
|> - speak and write German well enough
|> - not be addicted to alcohol or drugs
|> - petition the parliament to become a citizen - this costs up to
|> 5000 DM (2500 DM if married to a German citizen)

All of the above don't strike me as being too unsusual. Don't the US
demand reasonable equivalents of all of the above?

|> - revoke all previous citizenships.
|>
|> The last one is the killer - if you want a German passport, you must
|> revoke all others, if your German parents give birth to you in
|> the USA you have the American and the German citizenship, no problem.

In my opinion the irrevocable severing of ties to Your place of origin
has been used as a deterrent. I suppose it was seen as a token of
allegiance to Your new nationality. I agree, however, that this is one
of the most problematic parts of our immigration policy.

One other problem is the favouring of those who are recognised as ethnic
Germans.
 
|> You do not have the right to become a citizen, it is a privili
|> that is conveyed at the whim of the civil servant in your township.
|> Some states are lenient (especially when it comes to politically
|> active persons), some are very strict.

I think the debate focusses on this, rather than on the list You've
outlined above. I think in France You acquire citizenship after 5 years
of legal residence (can somebody coroborate?).

Now, here are some questions I'd like to pose, not only to You, but also
to all the others here:

1) How would You define the "right to become a citizen" here. Obviously
   You take it a step beyond the "right to apply for citizenship". Would
   You rather make it automatic, as in France(?)?

2) How would You define the right of the state (country, whatever) to
   demand certain qualities of the prospective citizen? As far as I know
   Canada and Australia have quotas for certain professions, and others
   need not apply. Are there specific points which rankle You
   specifically in the list You've compiled above (apart from the last
   point, obviously).

3) Most states have concepts for naturalisation which include the legal
   resident or immigrant. How would You define the latter in this
   context. How would You define, say, the 2 million Russlanddeutsche in
   this context.

4) Should Germany emulate other immigration countries and have some kind
   of quota or lottery system for immigrants and prospective citizens?
   If so, how would that take into account countries with which we have
   a negative or neutral balance of immigrants? 

5) How would You differentiate between a refugee/asylum seeker and and
   immigrant? The former had to leave hir home country probably at the
   point of a bayonnet with just barely the shirt on hir back. Se needs
   some place to go, or else se'll perish, but normally se'll go back
   when the situation allows it. The latter wants to partake of our
   wealth, our culture and the opportunities offered here, and se wants
   to stay here. Now quite a few of the latter pose as the former, since
   seeking asylum is less of a problem than being allowed lawful entrance.
   How should this dilemma be resolved?

6) How much allegiance is the right of a nation/people to demand of
   those who would become members of it? Has it the right to demand that
   the new members are loyal to their new nation _first_ and to their
   older cultural affiliation a strong second?

There are probaly quite a few questions which might pertain to the
problem and which I didn't ask. The discussion has to start somewhere,
though.

|> It's so crazy, I'm sure there wouldn't be so many problems between
|> Germans and Auslaender if it was easier to get German citizenship,
|> especially for the children of "Guest workers" that were born here.

I'm afraid that this is wishful thinking which ignores the other causes
for resentment, the economic uncertaincies of these days being the most
important. France's track record, for instance, is none too enviable, if
You allow this comparison. On the other hand, the overt resentment
fostered by German immigration policies, as evidenced in the case of
Mutlu, makes it utterly necessary to revise this legislation to prevent
a violent, and rather understandable, disaffection within this component
of our population. 

|> Debora Weber-Wulff                       dww@inf.fu-berlin.de

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