HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: News From the Front -- Boulder
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 92 01:41:26 GMT


In article <1dc98gINN2er@marvin.solbourne.com>
misek@solbourne.com (Steve Misek) writes:

>After three attempts to demuffinize myself, they've finally rewired all the 
>soft links and this might actually get posted.

Hey Misek, you made it!  Hurray!  Talk about a sight for
sore eyes!  This place is lookin' up!

Sounds like the stuff you're doing is empowering, which is
really good to hear.  Actually, when the news first popped,
you were one of the first friends in CO I thought of.  There
are going to be lots of people out here, living in places
that aren't quite so hellish (yet!), trying to help people
there.  Stay in touch, now that you're here.  Let us know
what we can do.

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
<>  <>  <> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <>  <>  <>
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: New Republic editor openly gay
Keywords: New Republic, mainstream press, magazines
Date: 13 Nov 92 19:09:58 GMT
Organization: International Irony League -- Death before smileys!

In article <1992Nov13.160931.26328@PacBell.COM> rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams) writes:
>> rrizzo@BBN.COM (Ron Rizzo) writes:
>
>>I just heard on NPR that the magazine The New Republic now has an openly gay
>>editor, Andrew Sullivan!
>>
>>Has anyone heard more about this?
>
>Where have you *been*, Ron?  He's been there for at least a
>year.  He's young (twentysomething?), British, catholic and
>opposes "outing."

He was also out before they made him editor-in-chief; that is, it
wasn't a surprise for them. He'd written a bunch of gay-related
articles for TNR when he was an associate editor (e.g. the cover
story "Gay Life, Gay Death" in the fall of '90).

And we've practically got the same name...
-- 
Andrew Michael Solovay    

"We know that Solovay is a misogynist and an idiot..."
		--Melinda Shore
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay)
Subject: Re: Orange County Went Democrat?
Organization: International Irony League -- Death before smileys!
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 19:06:06 GMT

In article <1di0oqINNiu1@mizar.usc.edu> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
>In article <1992Nov8.020730.9980@netcom.com> 
>solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay) writes:
>
>> OC went for Bush, though not overwhelmingly. Clinton campaigned
>> there (heavily) and got a good reception. They don't seem to like
>> Bush any more then anyone else does.
>
>Clinton did not campaign heavily in Orange or any other
>California county.  He almost didn't campaign here at all.

I meant "heavily for a Democrat". He made several appearances
there, and few Democrats would have dared show their faces at
all.
-- 
Andrew M. Solovay	    "Until there was rock, you only had God."
					--Ziggy Stardust

#include <disclaimer.h>
From: markm@ogicse.ogi.edu (Mark Morrissey)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Mouse Balls
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:52:10 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.45619
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute (formerly OGC), Beaverton, OR

In article <mattm-101192100521@mcmelmon.apple.com> mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:
>In article <1992Nov9.224941.15326@midway.uchicago.edu>,
>elle@kimbark.uchicago.edu (Ellen Keyne Seebacher) wrote:
>
>> Very old, very tired.  Haven't been on Usenet long, eh, Matthew?
>
>Since January, darling.  Guess you're too cutting edge for me.
>But tell me, Ellen, if the 'memo' is very old, and very tired,
>and you were in the know long ago:
>
>  what does that make you?

Informed?

A terrific person with lots of friends who share?

I can think of lots of other things which Ellen is, but I think
that these two differences between you suffice for now.

--mark
--
Mark Morrissey           One Hatred to rule them all.  One Hatred to find them.
markm@cse.ogi.edu        One Hatred to bring them all and in the darkness bind
                         them.  In the land of Bigotry where the Shadows lie.
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: ***Accessories!!!***
Date: 11 Nov 92 16:13:45 GMT
Reply-To: ailanth!ailsa@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Organization: Ailanthus Project

thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:

> What's your favorite kind? Handbags? Belts? Shoes? Watches? Jewelry?
> Any favorite pieces?
>
> John, trying to make Arne's soc.motss.real.world a better place
> (and who's been drooling over shoes'n'jewelry lately)
>
> (motss-relevance: puh-LEASE!!!)
>

favorite accessories.  leather jackets.  black studded armbands.  my
silver snake ring (whihc my beloved is wearing now an i miss it
terribly *waaaah*).  symbolic earrings.

i would love to get a watch with a labrys or a pink triangle on the
face plate or whatever they call it...

                                             -ailsa

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
                    ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com
                                                        ________
I don't care what consequence it brings,        Silence \      / Action
I have been a fool for lesser things.              =     \    /    =
                                                 Death    \  /    Life
                                                           \/
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.politics.homosexuality,co.politics
From: gary@isis.cgd.ucar.edu (Gary Strand)
Subject: Re: Colorado Amendment 2: The First Fatality
Organization: Climate and Global Dynamics Division/NCAR, Boulder, CO
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 17:14:28 GMT

hb> Howard Black
gs> Gary Strand

   [No gay group or organization has ever been interested in quotas.]

gs> Any proof?

hb> It is not up to Tim to prove that gays have not been interested in quotas.
    If you assert that they have, it is up to you to prove it.

  If you hadn't jumped the gun so quickly, you would see I dropped the matter
  of proof:

gs> Actually, I suppose they wouldn't, because then their sexuality would be
    known to others. Then, of course, if your employer doesn't know that you
    are gay, how can she use that as a reason to fire you, and secondly, as
    I've stated many times before, just because she *can* fire you for being
    gay doesn't mean she *will* fire you for being gay.

hb> Nope, it doesn't mean that she will. But, so many *have*, that it is in
    our interests to make it specifically illegal.

  *Whose* interests? Gays? Well, of course. If I could make it illegal to fire
  Gary Strand, I sure would try. But, if I had to give up the right to fire
  others, (which is what would rightfully be done, in that I can't ask for a
  right that I won't give to others) it's in my best interest to drop the pro-
  tection for myself so that others can't use the same right against me.

  People, gays in particular, who demand protection from being fired because
  of their orientation should take into consideration that one day, they may 
  want to fire someone for that exact reason. Would you really want to be
  denied the right to fire (say) Will Perkins because it's illegal to discrim-
  inate on the basis of sexual orientation? Or, would you make up some other
  reason to fire him, thus eliminating the anti-discrimination law, meaning
  we're back at square one?

  One has to be careful when trying to deny the rights of others. Doing so may
  come back and bite you on your own rear-end.

--
Gary Strand                      Opinions stated herein are mine alone and are
strandwg@ncar.ucar.edu            not representative of NCAR, UCAR, or the NSF
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.politics.homosexuality
From: jtroxel@carson.u.washington.edu (Joseph Troxel)
Subject: Re: Letter from OCA post-election: real or hoax?
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1992 03:34:45 GMT

In article <1992Nov13.225924.4393@netcom.com> solovay@netcom.com (Andrew M. Solovay) writes:
>In article <1992Nov13.153622.10267@spdcc.com> rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue) writes:
>>	I would have no problem seeing it printed in pro-GBLO* things
>>with ellipses placed in strategic locations.  After all those-who-hate
>>have no problem twisting our words...
>
>They also have no problem with beating us up with clubs. Would
>that make it right for us to do it to them?
>
>I, for one, prefer to hold myself to a higher standard.

Agreed.

>-- 
>Andrew Michael Solovay    
>
>"We know that Solovay is a misogynist and an idiot..."
>		--Melinda Shore

In that case I'm on his side.

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: ECL4JN2@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Jack B. Nimble)
Subject: Re: CO-2 Ammendment
Date: 11 Nov 92 13:47:19 PST

In article <1992Nov10.194623.1904@netcom.com>, on 10 Nov 1992 19:46:23 GMT,
onr@netcom.com (D. Owen Rowley) writes:

>If only the heterosexuals in our society would stop trying to legislate
>queers into second class citizenship, or demonise queers as outsiders,
>the leftist agitators wouldn't be able to sucker queers into thinking
>they have any remedys for the social ills of our world.
>
Exactly! 

>LUX ./. owen
>
>--
>Do What thou wilt shall be the whole of the law
>Love is the law , Love under will.
>
>Every Man and every Woman is a star.
>
        =Jack=
---

Jack B. Newsbaum             You have rights antecedent to all earthly
Library Information Systems  governments; rights that cannot be
University Research Library  repealed or restrained by human law.
ecl4jn2@mvs.oac.ucla.edu               - John Adams
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: raffin@fhr.ma30.bull.com (Patrick Raffin)
Subject: Re: Ageism and Not-Ageism
Organization: Bull HN Information Systems Inc.
Distribution: usa 
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 21:57:22 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss 


Do you think that a 16 year difference is enough to be in this thread ?

I'm almost 40, and my lover has just reached 22 years; he is in the French
Army (yes, it's legal in France !), and we are in a monogamous (or should I
say mono-androus?) relationship since almost 6 years (age of consent: 15 years
in France). We are *very* much in love, I just received from him last week
the most wonderful love letter I ever received !

On family events, we usually are invited by both his and my family.
His mother seems happy to see him with me (although she is rather poor,
she gives us some gifts now and then !); my mother, however, would prefer
to see me with someone my own age (but she welcomes us).

We live in a house in a very small village in the French countryside
(600 persons), and there is no visible hostility (the mayor asked me:
"do you have children ?", wanting to know if my lover was my son !!).

Not everything is pink and beautiful however: I'm concerned about ageing
and so being a weight on him... but it's so wonderful to be with him :-) :-)

--
Patrick RAFFIN, raffin@fhr.bull.com 
  __       Just a French tourist,
  \/       doesn't speak English, nor Unix
From: beezer@cc.utah.edu (BEEZER)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: [REGARDING]: Marky Mark and Calvin Klein (was Re: Scott Masden)
Date: 13 Nov 92 02:42:00 GMT
Organization: Salt Lick, UT
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1

In article <1992Nov12.163612.6127@wam.umd.edu>, lovegod@wam.umd.edu (Donald Andrew Agarrat) writes...

>Why do Gay men make it a point to focus on so many superficial  
>material things?  Out of the people I know, I would say that  
>lesbians aren't caught up in it as much and are *much* more  
>mature and educated about GLB issues.  I've never seen a lesbian  
>say "Damn, she has a good body" without adding either "but she's  
>a homophobe ..." or "and she's very Gay-positive! *smile*  
>*flirt*".

Uh-oh, political correctness strikes again!

Sorry, Donald - but I have a life, and I enjoy a man grabbing
a fist full of his crotch (or mine) in erotic expression.

If Mark has said anything homophobic, and I don't now about it
yet - then I'm not going to worry about it much until it's
a real affector.  And if/when I do find some such out, I won't
feel much the fool either... I can't know ALL things, just
take appropriate action and make better choices after the fact.

In the mean time, I'd like to indulge (for the first time in
public forum) in saying that those ads gave me a pleasant tingle...
From: kane@buast7.bu.edu (Hot Young Star)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Mouse Balls
Date: 13 Nov 92 16:41:35 GMT
	    <1992Nov11.183039.9652@midway.uchicago.edu>
	    <mattm-111192143246@mcmelmon.apple.com>
Organization: Astronomy Department, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA

In article <mattm-111192143246@mcmelmon.apple.com>
mattm@apple.com (Matthew Melmon) writes:

>In article <1992Nov11.183039.9652@midway.uchicago.edu>,
>elle@kimbark.uchicago.edu (Ellen Keyne Seebacher) wrote:

>> Now turn on the fan, and insert your head.  

>Which head should I *insert* - Dear?

Insert the one which has less impact on your body's proper functioning.

Maybe you can even figure that one out, dreary.

Smooches,
Brian
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
kane@{buast7,astro}.bu.edu (Hot Young Star) Astronomy Dept, Boston University,
Boston, MA 02215. True personal salvation is achieved by absolute faith in
ones true self.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Colorado Letter
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 92 18:27:33 GMT


Dear Sir or Madam,

For many years I have enjoyed the extraordinary natural
assets of Colorado as a special enticement to visit your
state.  The mountains, the forests, the great wilderness
areas, the wonderful skiing and camping facilities and all
the other outdoor marvels Colorado offers are unique
treasures, properly the envy of people from all over the
country and indeed the world.  In the course of the past
quarter-century, each of my many trips there to enjoy these
treasures has been wonderfully rewarding.

However, the passage this past Tuesday of Measure 2 means
that I could not in good conscience consider visiting
Colorado again until such time as the citizens and
government of the state firmly and lastingly reject any such
legislation based on hate and discrimination.  Free people
do not discriminate against others.  Not being an elector
there, my only recourse is economic, to let you know that I
will spend none of my (substantial) disposable income in
Colorado, nor will I knowingly purchase products
manufactured in the state or marketed by businesses having
their headquarters there.  In addition, I intend to use what
powers of persuasion I have to urge others to serve similar
notice.

Sincerely,

Jess Anderson
-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
From: mdrayton@sr.hp.com (Mike Drayton)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Gerbiling and acceptance of other peoples' info. !!
Date: 6 Nov 92 19:02:02 GMT
Article-I.D.: scd.BxB67E.78E
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara Division
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1.1 PL5

Eugen W. Schmidt (gsmith@clio.uucp) wrote:
                       [getilgt]
 
        Eugen:

        Irgendwie hat man deinen "Login Name" falsch geschaffen.  
        Wahrscheinlich soll es "eschmidt" oder "eugens" sein.  
        Zweifellos kann dein Sysadm helfen, alles richtig zu
        machen.

        Dein,

        Michael
From: mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: A question of plenty (was Re: discrimination at CMU)
Date: 13 Nov 92 00:31:39 GMT
Organization: (getting there)


I'm skipping most of the CMU debate, because the case seems unproven
to me from what I've read, but still:

anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
 >But looking out into the real world of acting, one certainly
 >sees plenty of "effeminate" men and plenty of "overweight"
 >women, all employed and doing fine jobs in their profession.

Does one, really?  

Not "plenty" by my standards.  Certainly not "plenty" of
"overweight" women.  And although it is possible for a 
certain kind of very pretty young man to find happiness
on stage or before the cameras, these are not men I'd
describe as "effeminate" myself.  (Of course, that's not
an adjective I use much unless I'm discussing what it 
means.)

I am particularly surprised at Jess's contention that there
are plenty of overweight women in the profession.  Of course
it's easy to name (say) a dozen of them.  But they constitute
a very much smaller percentage of the world that actors present
to us than they do of the world in which we spend our lives.
I consider this discrepancy largely responsible (directly and
indirectly) for the unrealistic body images that lead women
(especially) to anorexia and bulemia.  I'm not prepared to have
the problem dismissed quite so cavalierly.

I'd be interested to hear analogous arguments with regard to
effeminate men.




-- 

  Mara Chibnik
  mara@panix.com                Life is too important to be taken seriously.
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Scott Masden
Date: 11 Nov 92 18:49:12 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison


In article <74428@hydra.gatech.EDU>
danny.ingram@business.gatech.edu (Danny Ingram) writes:

>Another short respite from the CO2 war...

>     Does anyone remember Scott Masden, [...]
>Marky Mark may be nice, be
>he can't hold a well-sculpted candle to Scottie.

Assuming that *is* Marky Mark in the Calvin Klein ad in this
month's GQ (and even if it isn't), he can hold his
well-sculpted whatevers against me anytime he'd like.  Scott
says hi to all his fans, by the way.

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
<>  <>  <> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <>  <>  <>
From: laura@hoptoad.uucp (Laura Creighton)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Social Democracy
Date: 5 Nov 92 01:43:19 GMT
Reply-To: laura@hoptoad.UUCP (Laura Creighton)
Organization: Nebula Consultants in San Francisco

In article <19921101222156ECL4JN2@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU> ECL4JN2@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Jack B. Nimble) writes:
>In article <1992Oct28.235837.8622@reed.edu>, on 28 Oct 92 23:58:37 GMT,
>nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>
>>
>>In article <19921028145315ECL4JN2@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU> ECL4JN2@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Jack B. Nimble) writes:
>>>First, my use of the term "Tinkerbell" is no more homophobic than
>>>is any other group-referential designation that we are wont to use
>>>such as "queer", "queen", or "fairy".
>>
>>darn, and I was all ready to take Laura's explanation that this was
>>some ironic reference to slurs of the 60s. Oh well.
>>
>>Maybe Jack B. Nimble is just a stupid faggot.
>>
>Since Laura's explanation is fanciful but off the wall, there is
>the possibility that Nelson Minar is a just a stupid faggot who is
>truly clueless as to which decade Joe McCarthy actually flourished.

It's not fanciful.  I have a Goldwater speech from 1961 which
accuses the remnant of Roosevelt's New Deal Democrats as
being `tolitarian tinkerbells'.  But it was a slam against
all of the most liberal in Congress, not queerfolk.

Laura

-- 
    Since Ryan White was buried in April 1990, his grave has been vandalized
    *more than* four times.

    (this news courtesy Phil Paxton ipwp400@indycms.bitnet)

Laura Creighton 
toad@toad.com
hoptoad!laura
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Re: ***Accessories!!!***
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 04:52:48 GMT

My favorite pair of shoes lately has been my big butch black
boots. I got them a couple of months ago, and have been wearing
them almost constantly because they're very warm. They're my
butchest pair of shoes, but any masculinity gained by wearing
them is cancelled out because they make me walk like a huge
fairy; I take longer strides and my butt just *swoops* around
like a funky diva. It's really fun.

--
John Dorrance        * Sexyfunky Motherfuckerdiva *   thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu

		I bet if you threw that ass into the air
			It'd turn into sunshine!
Newsgroups: soc.motss,pnw.motss
From: mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas)
Subject: Re: Post-election depression
Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 17:23:35 GMT

In article <1992Nov4.235502.3344@reed.edu>, nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
> Feeling down today, depressed, sad? You're not alone.
> 
> Most of the lesbigay folks I've talked to today (here in Portland, a
> few on the net) have been depressed. Me too. I snapped at some guy
> when he said "gee, Nelson, aren't you HAPPY!", and almost took the
> head off of another person who told me "you shouldn't be glum."

  Sounds like post partum depression. You all have just given birth
to a major victory, and labor was hell. Don't get to carried away 
and kill the kid like some woman down here did though...
  :-) 
-- 

		Michael Thomas	(mike@gordian.com)
	"I don't think Bambi Eyes will get you that flame thrower..."  
		-- Hobbes to Calvin
		USnail: 20361 Irvine Ave Santa Ana Heights, Ca,	92707-5637
		PaBell: (714) 850-0205 (714) 850-0533 (fax)
From: rizzoe@FASECON.ECON.NYU.EDU (Emily Rizzo)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: ok, let me try this again
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:04:35 GMT
Organization: New York University

In article <1992Nov10.180920.29554@Princeton.EDU> 
spencer@shine.Princeton.EDU (S. Spencer Sun) writes:

>IMHO, soc.motss should be for gay-related conversations.  I interpret
>that to mean conversations which, in substance, are gay-related.  This
>article by Mr. Dorrance does not strike me as falling into this
>category.  It further strikes me that since the newsgroup hierarchies
>seem to be designed to provide guidelines for conversations (which is
>all I'm trying to do, encourage people to stay closer to the
>guidelines), and there are music-related groups, that such a thread
>definitely belongs in one of those groups than in soc.motss.

Let's not forget time constraints.  Since I'm supposed to be working here, 
soc.motss is the only major newsgroup I follow and that takes a minimum of 1 
hour a day and considerably more on Monday mornings.  Because of this, I 
tend to rely on it as a source of information on all subjects, not 
just motss related.  While John Dorrance's attempts to counter the grim
Colorado postings with a little levity may take up even more of my time, 
I enjoy the change of pace, and I never would have learned Arnold Zwicky's
great recipe for yams if he had been following the rules!

Emily
Newsgroups: soc.motss