HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cicic@cc.uow.edu.au (muris cicic)
Subject: Re: Me, the Serb extremist
Organization: University Of Wollongong
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 92 09:55:08 GMT

sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog) writes:

>Those who have followed s.c.yu since its creation know that I have
>had several combats with Serbian netters, about Kosovo and other
>things. Seldom, if ever, have there been an agreement between us.
>And after all, what do we get?

>Senad Arnautovic (arnsenad@me.utoronto.ca) writes:
>>I am surprised you, who usually promotes pro-Chetnik (Serb extremists)
>>views, posted this article.

>This statement is so completely ludicruous that I find it useless
>to even consider elaborating on my standpoint. Obviously, the
>principle that if you are not with us you are against us, is effect    
>here in the most absurd way.

You deliberatelly avoid the argument.  It is not question of being with us,
the point is in thruth and humanity.  You always have had understanding for
ridiculous claims by Serbian fascists, despite of apparent lack of thruth in
them.  Just recently you repeated "ludicruous" alibi about "Serbs from Bosnia"
fighting there!?  That means, you disagree with UN findings, the sanctions
against Serbia are unjust and inappropriate.  Thou, Serbia is not aggressor
in Bosnia?  You see, you quite agree with Milosevic, Karadzic, and handfull
of lunatics on network, it is planetary plot against bastion of freedom on 
Balkan.  

As I already told you, you appears to be fairly happy with current level of
killings (100,000 people, guess who), raping (50,000 women, guess again), 
2 mil. displaced (Serbs, maybe).  Therefore, you are against intervention or
lifting arm embargo (guess who is unarmed).  You are for peace, but Bosnians
are discontent, they enjoy to bomb their own people, inflict the fights when
they are without chances to win, level their own towns, mosques, etc.  Silly
people, those Bosnians.  Your ludicruous position doesn't deserve comment,
indeed.  

>With people like this, there will be never peace in the Balkan
>until everyone is dead.

And you say that to one Bosnian?  You ignorant idiot, shame on you.

>Erland Sommarskog - ENEA Data, Stockholm - sommar@enea.se

Muris
From: wickerhauser-victor@math.yale.edu (Victor Wickerhauser)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna,soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Vigil for Bosnia-Hercegovina
Date: 19 Nov 1992 00:43:15 -0500
Organization: Yale University Mathematics Dept., New Haven, CT 06520-2155
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: golem.math.yale.edu


Thursday (tomorrow) beginning at 10 PM there will be a candlelight
vigil for Bosnia-Hercegovina at Washington University in St. Louis,
sponsored by several student groups, taking place at the student
center on campus.  Come by and sign the petitions, pick up some
information, and hold a candle for the dead and for the living.

Victor
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: brg6080@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Rasputin)
Subject: Re: History of BiH Re: Who was in 'power'
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 00:14:07 GMT

<U52148@uicvm.uic.edu> (Chicago Cro) writes:
>Look Rasputin, If you have a book tell me and I'll read it.

That's not the point.  YOU posted an article claiming to 'prove'
that Bosnian Muslims are really Croats.  I posted some other
quotes from the same book showing how full of shit and unreliable
it is.  (Just to remind you, it said: Pavelic was an 'outstanding
political leader', Bosnian Muslims are Croatian and all of B-H
is part of Croatia, the Orthodox in Croatia are not Serbs,
and the Serbs taught the Croats to swear.)

>But why
>can't you get me a book to read on Chetnik (Serb) History? Because there aren't
>any!! Ha! Ha!

Now you're trying to change the argument.

Anyway, I don't know what you mean by 'Chetnik History'.

>As far as the accuracy of my book... you are just pissed that
>the sources of my book are also cited in other western sources. I'll bet that
>in Budapest or Vienna, Cro history is documented like our book.

Yeah, I'm sure they say the Serbs taught the Croats to swear as well.

>So don't
>come and cry over a book.

Dude, nothing you could say could make me cry.

>Another thing, why is it that the book bothers you
>so much? Is it because you've finally read Cro history?

It doesn't 'bother' me.  It's just obviously not the credible reference
you claim it to be.

>I also wonder
>where in the Beogradski Pashaluk you must be from.

I'm from Chicago, dipshit.

>Is it that you MIGHT
>be from the short-lived Krajina region? I listen to Chetnik Radio. I hear
>your Fascist songs one of which is "Crna Gora, Srbija, i Lika" I mean how
>much more Fascist can you be?

Try the Ustashi songs they play on the radio at Tomislavgrad, B-H,
as played on NPR's (National Public Radio (US)) Morning Edition.

>Does Cro history bother you THAT much? Does
>the fact that when we were writing literature, and being western-oriented,
>you guys were in a Pashaluk and were acting like cigani.

You're going way off the subject now.

>The Serbs still do
>act like cigani.

I'd rather act like a Cigani (Gypsy) than an Ustashi-sympathizer
like you.

>The Cheniks are sissies...
>                                __
>          )|(    -----      |__|__
>          ---    -----       __|  |
>          )|(

>                ...as well as Fascists...


>-Cro...A Western Oriented Person...

Crow, there's a post for you on soc.culture.yugo.  Check it out.


--Branko
Xref: sparky soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:579 soc.culture.europe:9693 soc.culture.usa:8618
From: elkordy@acsu.buffalo.edu (Mohamed Elkordy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: A letter to the members of Congress and Senate
Summary: A letter to the members of Congress and Senate
Keywords: A Letter to the members of the Congress and the Senate
Date: 20 Nov 92 17:36:43 GMT
Organization: UB

Here is a form of a letter that we are using here in the school to mail
to the members of the Congress and Senate, the letter was written by 
a Poltical Sciences Professor, and edited by me.  Feel free to edit the
letter, mail it to whoever is appropriate.




                 An Open Letter To The Senate and Congress Members

      Forty five years ago, president Truman, facing Soviet aggression in 
Europe, urged Congress and the American people to live up to their ideals of
human rights and freedom.  He stated that:

      America could not and should not let those free countries (Greece and
Turkey) stand unaided.  The ideals and the tradition of our nation demanded 
that we come to their aid .....the risks are great ..... but the alternatives 
would be disastrous to our security and to the security of free nations every 
where.  

Today, we are witnessing a tragedy that is once again setting a precedent of 
savagery.  In Bosnia, tens of thousands have been mercilessly massacred in what
is abhorrently called "ethnic cleansing". In fact, it is religious cleansing as
hundreds of thousands of Muslim Bosnians are killed and driven out of their
homes.  All UN resolutions have been ignored, numerous cease fires have been
futile and the Serbian carnage has continued.  The time for the United States 
to act is long overdue.  As a leader of the free world and the only super
power, it has the responsibility and indeed the duty to intervene forcibly to
stop the inhumane policy of Serbia.  

      As president Truman said:

      If we falter in our leadership, we may endanger the peace of the world and we shall surely endanger the welfare of our nation.

We therefore, urge the Congress to act in a non-partisan resolution 
demonstrate our determination and resolve to mobilize world public opinion and
the power of the UN to put an end to the slaughter in Bosnia.  

WITHOUT COMMITTING AMERICAN FORCES the least we can do is to lift the arms
embargo so that the outnumbered, outgunned, Bosnians can have the means to 
defend themselves. Time is running out, winter is getting harsher.  The United
States should lead the world before the flames of this conflict spread to
engulf not only the Balkan nations, but the Middle East and possibly the world.

      We urge the Congressmen and Senators to take immediate and resolute 
action, for the stakes are high and the denting of the free nations is at 
stake.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna,soc.culture.afghanistan
From: endevour@next03csc.wam.umd.edu (Afghan)
Subject: Re: DEMONSTRATE at the UN for BOSNIA
Organization: Workstations at Maryland, University of Maryland, College Park
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 17:03:04 GMT

In article <102411@bu.edu> khalid@bu-bio.bu.edu (Rasheed A. Khalid)  
writes:
> I agree that whatever means one has at one's disposal, one should
> make use of them and act, rather than just talk about it, even though
> that's what I am doing myself, in this article.  I strongly urge all
> Muslims in whose power it is, to go and join any such demonstration
> as is planned for Bosnian Muslims.  If any situation warrants the
> declaration of Jihad, this one certainly is a good example.  The ones
> in Iraq and in Afghanistan (still ongoing) were very weak cases for
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> the declaration of Jehad.  In those cases, the issue was nationality
> whereas in Bosnia, the Muslims are being pounced upon and literally
> torn apart into pieces, solely due to the fact that they say
> Rabbunallah (Allah is our Lord).
> 
> Here in the United States, Ted Koppel gave two consecutive "nightline"
> programs on Bosnia on the ABC network, giving graphic details as to
> what is going on there.  I wept like a kid (I rarely do) when
> watching it, as I did when I used to watch the plight of Iraqis and  
Kurds
> who took refuge in Jordan under the complete embargo.  The plight of
> Muslims is severe. 




Mr.Weeping-Tom, Rashid A. Khalid, seems to have the arrogance and  
self-righteousness to tell us, the Afghans, that our Jihad was a "WEAK"  
one. Seems to me that he missed quite a few weeping session on the plight  
of Afghan nation. On the contrary, the Afghan Jihad ( mind you not the  
current Afghan Government ) should serve as a source of strength and hope  
for our Bosnian brothers and sisters because if the formidable army of the  
a super power like the former Soviet Union could not crush the faith and  
patriotic will of a small and poor nation like Afghanistan on the same  
line the Serbs, through their fascist and inhuman acts,  will never ever  
succeed in their evil designs against our Bosnian brothers and sisters.

With regards 

An Afghan from soc.culture.afghanistan
From: U15231@uicvm.uic.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Bosnian Serbs propose changing name of towns
Date: 16 Nov 92 01:21:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: uicvm.92320.192158U15231
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago


I would just add to this article, for the readers that are maybe not so
familiar with Islamic cultural influence in this part of the world, that
both the leader of Bosnian Serbs and leader of Sebs in Croatia have names
of Islamic or Turkish origin!!!

So, Karadzic (Radovan Karadzic, leader of Bosnian Serbs, born in Montenegro,
successful war criminal and Milosevic's pupet) has its root in Turkish word
kara=black.

Also Hadzic (Goran Hadzic, leader of Croatian Serbs and Milosevic's
pupet as well) refer to the word "hadzija" in Bosnian language, used for
people that visited Islamic holly city Mecca in Saudi Arabia. It was a great
honor to be hadzija years ago, so some people had been given that family name.

According to the measure of Institute for Preservation of Serbian Culture those
two Serbians should change their family name. In addition, chetnics, as a part
of serbian folklore, could have another material for their highly "cultural"
body carnages if Institute prove Muslim genes in Karadzic and Hadzic.


Sad and funny, but not unexpected, from Milosevic regime that feed itself from
destruction of Muslims and Croats, their cultural heritage, homes and
lives. Watch, before dies that regime will destroy Serbia!!!

Zlatko Sijercic

   ------------
   |\ \*   *  |    LONG LIVE INDEPENDENT
   |* \ \     |
   |  * \ \ * |  BOSNIA AND HERCEGOVINA !!!
    \   * \ \/

Put putuje Latif-aga
sa jaranom Sulejmanom
moj jarane Sulejmane
jel' ti zao Banja Luke
banjaluckih teferica,
kraj Vrbasa aksamluka.
From: miha@proteus1.UUCP (Sinisa Mihailovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: who was in 'power' in BH (was: Re: Call It Anything but Peace)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 19:16:59 EST
Organization: Proteus Communications, Washington D.C. * node 1

sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog) writes:
 [deleted]

 Stojanov answered the question quite clearly, it would be useless to
repeat it because I would have answered very similarly.

> >Oh, yeah. My heart is in what was Yugoslavia. You people destroyed it.
> 
> Who are "you people"? Senad Aranautovic, to whom you replied? Croats,
> Slovenes and Muslims in general? Do you think the Serbs are innocent?
> Do you think you are innocent?

That "people" was addressed to Slovenes, Croats and Bosnians muslims who
were  for  the secession and therefore for the destruction of Yugoslavia
or what was left of it.
 The  point  was  to  show him how the views may vary from the different
perspective.  Since  I am from the mixed  marriage, Yugoslavia was truly
my country and I can say that.
 So Yugoslavia doesen't exist  anymore, people simply don't want to live
together.  Fine,  but why should that be different in the case of Bosnia
and Bosnian Serbs? As for the innocence, answer is Yes;
I really think that I did what was in my power (which is regretfully not
much) to avoid all of this. How about you? Do you feel guilty as part of
the western  civilization because of the sanctions against Serbia (based
on testimonies and accusations without evidence, false reports, etc..) -
or as an individual supporting them, for each Serbian child that will die
or already died of freezing and/or hunger in Serbia this winter?
  Do  you  think  that if this postings have any influence in forming of
someone's opinion, and if you are wrong that you are not responsible for
the consequences, no matter how big your contribution was?
  I  didn't  want  neither  to  insult you nor to patronize you, just to
remind you that there are all kinds of questions, and these are just two
of them.

-- miha
From: U15231@uicvm.uic.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: The New York Times Editorial - Nov. 20
Date: 20 Nov 92 20:27:24 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago

Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 13:46:26 EST
From: BOSNET@math.lsa.umich.edu
Subject:    The.New.York.Times-editorial-Nov.20
Reply-To: Iztok.Hozo@math.lsa.umich.edu
Organization: BOSNET (Bosnian Electronic Network)

Contribution by: SII



   The New York Times said in an editorial on Friday, Nov. 20:
   At Sea, Still, on Bleeding Bosnia


   It took six months and 100,000 deaths in Bosnia for the United
Nations finally to order a maritime blockade, backed by NATO, on
Serbia, the aggressor against beleaguered Bosnia. This resort to
arms, while welcome, ought not to be confused with effective
action. Even with this naval blockade, the West is still at sea.
   The belated tightening of economic sanctions is no substitute
for forceful pressure to stop the bloodletting in Bosnia. And it
won't stop Serbia from blowing up more of the Balkans. It's only
one of several strong steps the world needs to take, inside Bosnia.
Serbian planes still attack unprotected Bosnian cities, in defiance
of ano-fly order declared by the U.N. When will the West bestir
itself long enough to enforce this order?
   Bosnia is having trouble even trying to defend itself because of
a superficially neutral U.N. arms embargo that Serbia has no
trouble running. When will the West stop enforcing ferocious
unfairness?
   Serbian-sponsored ethnic cleansing still drives Muslims from
their homes in northern Bosnia, swelling the tide of refugees. Safe
havens, secured by a U.N. force, would keep them secure against
further Serbian aggression. At least armed convoys are now
protecting desperately needed relief supplies, previously held up
by rival gunslingers.
   And finally, U.N. troops could be deployed in Kosovo and
Macedonia before the war spreads southward, even beyond the borders
of the former Yugoslavia.
   Aggressor regimes in Serbia and Croatia now press for peace on
the assumption that outgunned Bosnia will soon collapse, allowing
them to carve up the remains. While the U.S. contemplates backing
U.N. resolutions with steel, European governments cravenly shrink
from armed intervention in the vain hope that peace is at hand.
   But the struggle is far from over. Many Bosnians are now aroused
and armed. They have begun a guerrilla war in Serb-held areas that
won't be readily suppressed. The war could easily spill back into
Croatia if its dictator, Franjo Tudjman, double-crosses his Bosnian
ally and cuts a deal with the Serbian strongman Slobodan Milosevic.
   Worse, this could soon become a holy war, with ramifications far
beyond Central Europe. Bosnia's Muslims, Croats, and Serbs are, for
the moment, fighting side by side. But if the West won't help,
Bosnia's Muslims, radicalized by ethnic cleansing and abandoned by
the Croats, will turn to other Muslims for support.
   Western governments have long been paralyzed by the risks of
action to save Bosnia. How long will it take them to understand the
price of inaction? Meanwhile Bosnia bleeds.
From: damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: who was in 'power' in BH (was: Re: Call It Anything but Peace)
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 92 21:52:11 CST
Organization: INFOPLUS support, Wheeling, IL

blazic@ecf.toronto.edu (BLAZIC Joseph R) writes:

> Mr. Stojanovic's response to me has expired here, so I'll do my best to
> answer from memory.
> 
> First of all, spare us from meaningless slurs like "Tudjman and his 
> black shirts".  Now, to the issue of "free voting", there is a difference
> between lobbying the public to vote this way or that way, and lobbying
> "your people" to not even be seen walking into the polling station.  
> Karadzic boycotted the referendum in Bosnia-Hercegovina on behalf of 
> all Serbs.  He could just as easily not done so and encouraged "his people"
> to vote "no".  There was a reason he did not want them to vote at all.
> With Serbs being a very large minority in a state that was ethnically
> mixed, and where its people had been living in harmony for 50 years,
> one wonders how many Serbs would have voted "yes" in the referendum.
> 
> Joe Blazic

"Tudman and his black shirts"
  This is exactualy what the current situation in Croatia is like.  
The fact is that Hrvatska has not yet freed herself from the communist 
cancer that has infected her since the fall of N.D.H. in WW II and the 
creation of Jugoslavija in 1945.  The same "udbasi" that ruled Croatia 
for the past 45 years are still ruling.  One can NOT convert an 
individual who has considered himself a "Jugoslaven" untill the very day 
of Croatia's declaration of independence, into a Croatian nationalist.  
This is not possible.  And this is exactly what our Croatian communists 
have attempted to prove possible. In my view, they are still capable of 
recreating a 3rd Yugo in some form or another.  How can anyone justify 
giving amnesty to barbaric Cetnik hords, while our land has not yet been 
returned?!?!  At the same time, the current Cro government is persecuting 
the Croatian Party of Rights and members of H.O.S  (such as Jastreb) who 
fought back the JugoCetnik bandits!  Zagreb is still infested with 
communists\Yugo trators.  Untill we rid ourselfs with that garbage, we 
will never wittness a true Independent Hrvatska, nor will we push back 
the Serbian bandits in B-H.

Damir

--
damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Infoplus BBS, +1 708 537 0247, v32bis. Home of Infoplus.
From: "Frank S. Folwell" <pl0127@psilink.com>
Subject: THE NEW YORKER magazine, 11/23/92
Organization: none
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 23:36:14 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink-DOS (3.3)

Subscribers to this news group may find interesting an article in this 
week's NEW YORKER magazine (November 23, 1992) entitled LETTER FROM 
BOSNIA: ORIGINAL VIRTUE, ORIGINAL SIN by David Rieff.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:557 soc.culture.arabic:4960 soc.culture.pakistan:16848 soc.culture.afghanistan:1246 soc.culture.iranian:10056 soc.culture.bangladesh:6048
From: khalid@bu-bio.bu.edu (Rasheed A. Khalid)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna,soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.afghanistan,soc.culture.iranian,soc.culture.bangladesh
Subject: Re: DEMONSTRATE at the UN for BOSNIA
Summary: ARE MUSLIMS SLEEPING?  WAKE UP AND ACT!!
Date: 18 Nov 92 06:02:07 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Organization: Biology Department, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA

I agree that whatever means one has at one's disposal, one should
make use of them and act, rather than just talk about it, even though
that's what I am doing myself, in this article.  I strongly urge all
Muslims in whose power it is, to go and join any such demonstration
as is planned for Bosnian Muslims.  If any situation warrants the
declaration of Jihad, this one certainly is a good example.  The ones
in Iraq and in Afghanistan (still ongoing) were very weak cases for
the declaration of Jehad.  In those cases, the issue was nationality
whereas in Bosnia, the Muslims are being pounced upon and literally
torn apart into pieces, solely due to the fact that they say
Rabbunallah (Allah is our Lord).

Here in the United States, Ted Koppel gave two consecutive "nightline"
programs on Bosnia on the ABC network, giving graphic details as to
what is going on there.  I wept like a kid (I rarely do) when
watching it, as I did when I used to watch the plight of Iraqis and Kurds
who took refuge in Jordan under the complete embargo.  The plight of
Muslims is severe.  If people who are sympathetic to Muslims remain silent
on this day, it will be a moral and physical offence.  If Muslims
themselves who are in peace at this time remain silent, it will be not
only these, but also a spiritual offence for which they will be accounted
for, on the Day of Judgement.   I have done what I could, in terms of
financial help (including for Somalia).  Please, please, do something, as
such chances of getting the blessings of Allah are few and far between.

May Allah save the Muslims of the world from the sufferings they
are being made to go through and May He arrest the hands of the
wrongdoers.  Ameen!

Regards,
Rasheed.