From: pmk@prometheus.UUCP (Paul M. Koloc)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Logic and God (was: Young earth creationist logic NOT!)
Date: 3 Sep 92 08:52:48 GMT
Reply-To: pmk@prometheus.UUCP (Paul M. Koloc)
Organization: Prometheus II, Ltd.

In article <GERRY.92Aug31132145@onion.cmu.edu> gerry@cmu.edu (Gerry Roston) writes:
>In article <1992Aug28.145820.15124@acuson.com> lawson@acuson.com (Drew Lawson) writes:

>   Perhaps, but if God is not relevant to the question of the origin of
>   the world and the life thereon, where is God relevant?

>At present, god is not needed by the scientific community.  

Since science deals only with material three dimensional fields,
waves, particles, etc., it would have no capability to encounter
GOD for which it has no measure.  Science in its present primitive
state is restricted to myths and 3D.   Myths because, today's 
science names what it sees and identifies those things by behavior.  
There is a paucity of understanding of how things all fit together.  
Progress is being made .. but only slowly .. over centuries.  
There is so much more to relate.  So many centuries to go.   

Science doesn't know very fundamental things about the objects it
has named.  It doesn't understand how the information of which any
arbitrary object is composed is handled from moment to moment.  For example,
if you hold your hand in view and then move it behand your back out of 
view, the original view of your hand does not remain.  That information
no longer exists in view.  What role do the particles that compose your 
hand have to play in the processing of that and other information into 
and out of existence?  Could it be that nuclei by virtue of the protons
they contain are producing more information each time frame (rate /sec)
and that excess information flows as the vector A field which is to say
an electric field?  Then are electrons holes in space which act as drain
or holes in space through which this information flows out of existence
(or openings to a worm hole to flow elswhere?).  Ahhh!  electrons alas 
are just negatively charged particles of low mass that interact with the 
Lorentz force.  Are rabbits furry mammals or moving object that makes 
tracks in the snow like semicolon followed by LT.     

                        :<  :<  :<  :<  :<   

Now does that look like a rabbit??  How an electron moves in fields
doesn't really tell us what an electron is.  What really is charge??
Knowing that and how it relates to information of which reality is
composed could help -- maybe.    

>God,
>unfortunately, is still needed by politicians, etc, to help keep the
>masses in line.  

A little paranoia?    I thought they used your tax money and Japanese
purchased bond funds to do that.     :)  

However (being quite optimistic), in the next
>century, the need for god will diminish entirely as a humanistic code
>of ethics is developed...

I doubt seriously that having the most COMPLETE and WONDERFUL 
humanistic code will do much to stop mankind from engaging in 
activities that transmit AIDS, or lead to chemical addiction, etc,.

So how does having such a code say anything about the need for
GOD.  Perhaps striving to have such a code is a recognition in
a sideways fashion that GOD is needed because we NEED the code
to at least know that there are times when we NEED GOD.  

We are but fleeting photons on the screen of a night vision scope 
by comparison to GOD.  Of course maybe the world does revolve around 
us and we are after all little deities.  Gee without a big GUY to
compete with, we would be like little unchallanged kings of the 
universe.   Hmmm!    

>--
>Gerry Roston (gerry@cmu.edu)    | A man's ethical behavior should be based
>Field Robotics Center,          | effectually on sympathy, education, and
>Carnegie Mellon University      | social ties; no religious basis is
>Pittsburgh, PA, 15213           | necessary.  Man would indeed be in a poor
>(412) 268-3856                  | way if he had to be restrained by fear and
>                                | punishment and hope of reward after death.
>The opinions expressed are mine | Albert Einstein
>and do not reflect the official | 
>position of CMU, FRC, RedZone,  | 
>or any other organization.      | 


There are no more rewarding goals than to seek nature things and to 
discover therein some aspect of GOD.  
Albertle Einstein
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