HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu (Michael Rawdon)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: Create a killfile? AAAAAAAARGH!
Date: 13 Oct 92 15:08:14 GMT
Reply-To: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Dept., Madison, WI

In <nrp.718964610@reading> nrp@csug3.cs.reading.ac.uk ("Mischievous bee will-o'-the-wisps" Neilski) writes:
>Remember also that outside the US it can be difficult to find a Unix BBS.
>This is a global network.

Is it impossible to write software for non-UNIX systems?  If there are enough
people outside the US to make the globalness of USENET a factor at all, then
maybe they ought to pool their resources and write some good software for
whatever systems they're using out there.  In the long run, such an effort
will serve them (and us) much better than hacking up newsgroups...

-- 
Michael Rawdon				 rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Department, Madison, WI

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
From: gtd543a@prism.gatech.EDU (death)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.binaries.ms-windows moderated
Date: 12 Oct 92 02:36:36 GMT
Organization: Fool's Paradise
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

death (gtd543a@prism.gatech.EDU) wrote:
: I quite agree.  I didn't think about my answer there - I have no way
: of knowing the situation there at c.b.i.p.  Anyway, so that a moderator
: like that doesn't come up, I'll volunteer my services as moderator.

Regardless of the moderator, I think there should be an established site
for the archives to be deposited (like c.b.os2 has hobbes.nmsu.edu), I
think (this is a biggie) that the posts should have checksums and all that
good stuff included in them for verification.  Nothing is worse than
an unprofessional uuencode, where you have no way of verifying the post's
accuracy...
-- 
Jeff M. Garzik                    |
25861 Georgia Tech Station        | "Only sheep need a leader"
Atlanta, GA  30332                |                       - Nomeansno
E-Mail: gtd543a@prism.gatech.edu  |
From: aj834@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Scott A. Maehner)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.games.mecha
Date: 13 Oct 1992 20:36:42 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


I heartily approve of this new group, but I have a
question/suggestion/nitpick...what about other anime/anime-realted games? 
I'm in a group that uses Teenagers From Outer Space as the system of choice
to mix characters from Ben Dunn's _Ninja High School_ _Ranma 1/2_ _Maison
Ikkoku_ and others...it would be great if anime-related stuff could either
be included in the charter or if it might be possible to have a
rec.games.anime, but I suspect many would see it as duplication.  I'll
support rec.games.mecha in any case though...just my 2 cents adjusted for
inflation, see you in the manga papers.

-- 
Internet: aj834@cleveland.freenet.edu
Bitnet: aj834%cleveland.freenet.edu@cunyvm
My opinions are my own, but they can be yours for a small down payment and a
reasonable monthly rate...Credit terms available!
From: atkinson@itd.nrl.navy.mil (Randall Atkinson)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.windows reorganization
Date: 7 Oct 92 12:09:21 GMT
Organization: Naval Research Laboratory, DC


  This is purely an unneeded gratuitous reorg Peter.  I know that you
are fond of reorgs, but there is no reason to do this one.

  Please let's drop this particular proposal now.
From: jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu (Larry Jewell)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.archives.msdos.announce moderated and comp.archives.msdos.d
Date: 12 Oct 92 20:38:39 GMT
Organization: Purdue University

In article <1992Oct12.185658.1491@rei.com> fox@rei.com (Fuzzy Fox) writes:
>brown@NCoast.ORG (Stan Brown) writes:

>>c.a.m.a.d is needed, because where else do we report bugs?

>They should be sent to the authors of the various programs.

 Good idea, we can do that as well as posting to c.a.m.d. to notify other
people that are using the package of a problem without having to wait for
the author to respond (you were assuming that the author has an e-mail 
address, weren't you?)  I'd really like to know if a package has a problem
if I'm running it on my machine, ASAP.

>-- 
>#ifdef TRUE        | Fuzzy Fox (a.k.a. David DeSimone)       fuzzy@netcom.com
>#define  TRUE   0  |
>#define  FALSE  1  |   "If you can't take the heat, you haven't learned
>#endif             |      a damn thing from USENET!"  -- Rao V. Akella

Larry J

-- 
#L.W. Jewell Moderator at the Veterans Information Site (veteran@cc.purdue.edu)#
#& WWII-L Listowner: "Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange,#
#sudden and wholly unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all   #
#phases of life." "Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41  #
From: woody@castle.ed.ac.uk (I Woodrow)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: QUESTION!  Is there a group discussing terrorists ?
Date: 13 Oct 92 09:24:39 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

YES, just that.  Is there a newsgroup or list discussing terrorists and     
terrorism ?  NO I'm not looking for hints and tips.   :-)



-- 
W@@DY_______________________________________________________________________
 /Ian Woodrow, Computing Service, Uni of Glasgow, GLASGOW G12 8QQ, Scotland \
*  <Dog 'n' Bone:  041-330-4800         | e-mail: woody@udcf.gla.ac.uk>      *
 \__________ FAX:__041-330-4808_____________________________________________/
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: RFD: comp.archives.msdos.*
From: f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin)
Date: 15 Oct 92 02:54:36 MST
Distribution: world,local
Organization: University of Arizona
Nntp-Posting-User: f67700241

In article <1992Oct13.223221.2@rei.com>, fox@rei.com (Fuzzy Fox) writes:
> I believe in newsgroups where the information is concentrated in one
> place, so that new users can find the information when they want to.
> I feel that comp.os.msdos.* ought to be the place where people go to
> talk about programs that run on MS-DOS machines.  Why does the method of
> the program's distribution make it so that it should actually be talked
> about in cbip.d, or cama.d?  Why do we need more newsgroups when the
> traffic will be the same as that posted in other newsgroups?

My opinion is that the traffic currently in the cbip hierarchy is
different fundamentally from the traffic in comp.os.msdos.[apps,misc].
The talk is specifically about freeware/shareware/PD files available
via ftp sites or c.b.i.p postings.  It would do no good to mix the
messages of this type with messages about Stacker, PC Tools, MS DOS 6.0,
misformatted floppy disks, and other MS-DOS topics.

But, I've been thinking about your statement that "discussions of msdos
programs belong in comp.os.msdos.whatever".  That position makes a lot
of sense to me, so much so that maybe shuttling the cbip hierarchy off
to comp.archives doesn't seem like such a great idea.

How about this proposal:

Create comp.os.msdos.ftpsites.announce
	(Announcements of MSDOS FTP site file uploads.)
Create comp.os.msdos.ftpsites.d
	(Discussion of uploaded software, the ftp process, "looking-fors.")

A clause to permit deletion of comp.binaries.ibm.pc.archives upon passage
would be OK, as would a replacement of "ftpsites" with "archives" in the
name.

This proposal would (1) give the upload announcements a home in the msdos
hierarchy, where they belong; (2) discourage off-topic questions about disk
drives, programming, Stacker, etc. by the groups' proximity to the better-
suited programming, apps, and hardware groups.

Samuel, what do you think of the idea?  Is it too late?
-- 
Greg "Mockingbird" Franklin      Interviewer: "Sir, how do you spell relief?"
f67700241@ccit.arizona.edu               Dan: "R-O-L-A-I-D-S-E."

"[George Bush is] the most ruthless white man in the history of the planet."
	-- Richard Ben Cramer, author of _What It Takes_
"The President scores much better than Bill Clinton."
	-- Dan, comparing Bush's record of marital infidelity to Clinton's
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.os.386bsd
Date: 15 Oct 92 14:47:46 GMT
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC

In article <1992Oct13.173346.755@pegasus.com> richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) writes:
> Minix is not a Unix clone.  Linux isn't either, thought it may be
> turning into one.

Minix is *definitely* a UNIX clone. The interface is basically V7 UNIX with
some limitations. Linux and every practical Mach system I've seen are too.
What's under the hood is irrelevant, that's the whole point.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                         `-_-'
Ferranti Intl. Ctls. Corp.                              'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012           "Heeft u vandaag al uw wolf geknuffeld?"
+1 713 274 5180                       "Tjener, denne ret er stadig levende."
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: not everybody uses UNIX to read news
From: demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man)
Date: 8 Oct 92 16:45:58 EST
Organization: Demonic Possesions, Inc.

In article <9210070049.AA26858@vtserf.cc.vt.edu>, jfurr@vtssi.vt.edu (Joel Furr) writes:
> rpwhite@ac13.cs.nps.navy.mil writes:
> 
>>jfurr@vtssi.vt.EDU (Joel Furr) writes:
>>
>>>Somewhere in the news.announce.newusers files that get posted, there's a
> note
>>>to the effect that it's bad manners to assume that everyone reads news on a
>>>UNIX box somewhere.  
>>
>>Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzztt!!!!!!!!
>>
>>What that note really says is that it is bad manners to read news on other
>>than a UNIX box. It's even worse manners to discuss your software
>>shortcomings on the net.
> 
> Gene Spafford (spaf@cs.purdue.EDU) writes in news.announce.newusers:
> 
>>11. Usenet is not a UNIX network.
>>
>>    Don't assume that everyone is using "rn" on a UNIX machine.  Among
>>    the systems used to read and post to Usenet are Vaxen running VMS,
>>    IBM mainframes, Amigas, and MS-DOS PCs.
> 
> Thus, as we can see, rpwhite is not only misinformed and has chosen to post
> about it to the net so we can all smile tolerantly at his failings.

	Rp is just trying to get a rise out of people.  Ignore it.

Brett                                                      
_______________________________________________________________________________
Proconsul Computer Consulting                                        CHA-CHING!
Better, Cheaper, Faster					       (Pick any two :)
Disclaimer:								   NOT!
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.windows reorganization
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 20:14:57 GMT

In article <381@ulogic.UUCP> hartman@ulogic.UUCP (Richard M. Hartman) writes:
> If you're reorganizing, shouldn't we allow for MS-Windows, Windows-NT and
> OS-2 (whatever they call their windowing system?)

See, this is part of the problem. Why didn't you include GEM, Desqview,
and Intuition in there?

In any case, (a) they already have their own groups, and (b) they're all
single-OS systems (as are the three I named).
-- 
Peter da Silva                                         `-_-'
Ferranti Intl. Ctls. Corp.                              'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012           "Heeft u vandaag al uw wolf geknuffeld?"
+1 713 274 5180                       "Tjener, denne ret er stadig levende."
Xref: sparky news.groups:19100 chile.grupos:17
Newsgroups: news.groups,chile.grupos
From: javier@cs.toronto.edu (Javier Pinto)
Subject: Re: Cual es la razon?
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Date: 13 Oct 92 13:15:18 GMT

chip@tct.com (Chip Salzenberg) writes:

>According to erodrigu@dcc.uchile.cl (Eduardo Rodriguez):
>>In article <2AD57E64.555A@tct.com>, chip@tct.com (Chip Salzenberg) writes:
>>> Hace sentido tener grupos distintos para otros idiomas.  Quiza's seria
>>> u'til tener grupos "esp.*" en vez de "paiz.*".
>>
>>Chip tiene razon, sin embargo [...] NADIE ha mostrado interes alguno por
>>hacerlo :-(

No estoy muy seguro.

>De verdad, la cosa primera is _crear_ la hiera'rchia (del?) esp.*.
>Es mas fa'cil distribuir una cosa cuando esa cosa existe.  Necesitamos
>decider cuales grupos deben copiarse a esp.* primero, por supuesto.

Me parece bastante poco claro que sea ventajoso tener una jerarquia esp.*
en vez de chile.*, argentina.*, etc.

En particular, yo estoy muy interesado en tener acceso a un foro en el cual
se discutan temas (en cada subgrupo) que de alguna manera sean de interes
para los chilenos, o para los no chilenos interesados en Chile. Esto no
quiere decir que una jerarquia esp.* no sea buena idea, pero el proposito
seria levemente diferente. Me parece que una cosa (ej. chile.*) no quita la
otra (esp.*). 

Javier.
From: dawson@willard.UUCP
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.marching vs rec.arts.marching
Date: 9 Oct 92 02:59:18 GMT
Organization: Willard's House BBS, Atlanta, GA -- +1 (404) 664 8814

fath1@husc8.harvard.edu (Michael Fath) writes:

> In article <1992Oct4.151911.16327@vdbsan> dawson@vdbsan (Willard Dawson) writ
> >gordons@CS.ColoState.EDU (vahl scott gordon) writes:
> >
> >Really, that's a bit carried away, but you get the ideas, surely?  At the
> >risk of pissing on your (collective) parade, the drum corps community has
> >long had a fallacious idea that they were doing something significantly
> >different from the band crowd.  That's just plain wrong.  Why should we
> >continue to foster this misconception?  Drum and bugle corps are, in the
> >simplest of analyses, just one of many kinds of marching band, which are
> >in turn a flavor of military musical performing group.  To what degree
> >they are military is another matter, best left for later discussion...
> >
> 
> Willard, 
> 
> Having marched in competitive hs marching band, corps style college band, and
> drumcorps, I find your comments to be inaccurate.  Drum corps and bands do 
> share many elements in common with marching bands but only to a point.  Most
> hs and college bands exist largely (if not solely) to support the school foot
> ball team and provide spirit and light entertainment to a football going
> audience.  

Michael,

I've marched in competitive HS marching bands, both corps-style and non-c.s
university bands, and with a top-12 DCI corps.  I'm not convinced that
drum corps are anything other than just another kind of marching band.
Nothing you've put forth has changed my opinion.

It does not matter what motivates a band, nor does it matter that a band
practices more or less than another band.  A band is still a band.

> With the evolution of BOA, many hs bands are entering into the competitive ra
> and producing fine programs.  Still, hs band is NOT a full time endeavor for
> those that march in it.  They still have classes and other significant 
> outside obligations during their marching seasons.  Thus, they are limited in
> the degree of attention they can spend on their marching shows.

How does this affect the fact that both play music and march?  These are the
only two requirements for a marching organization to be called a "marching
band," IMO.  Thus, drum corps are indeed a subset of the larger hierarchy...

[...more argument that has nothing to do with hierarchical classification...]

> Speaking from experience, all three (hs band, college band, and drumcorps) ar
> GOOD experience,  and they are also very DIFFERENT ONES.

Speaking from experience, I must disagree 100% with your assertions.

> -- 
> MM   MM FFFFF 	Michael Fath		fath1@husc.harvard.edu
> M M M M F	Dept of Microbiology and Molecular Genetics
> M  M  M FFF     Harvard Medical School         
> M     M F       Boston, MA 02115				**Enjoy life!              


-- 
dawson@willard.UUCP (Willard Dawson)
Willard's House BBS, Atlanta, GA -- +1 (404) 664 8814
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.windows reorganization
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 14:30:22 GMT

In article <1992Oct9.190158.5575@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil> rdc30@nmrdc1.nmrdc.nnmc.navy.mil (Code-03 LCDR Michael E. Dobson) writes:
> Sigh, how soon people forget.  This whole problem with MS-windows users
> posting to the c.w.misc, etc groups is a direct result of the split/reorg
> which moved comp.windows.msdos to comp.os.ms-windows.*

No, it's not. That move, in fact, was an attempt to resolve the ongoing problem
of Microsoft Windows users posting MS-specific questions to comp.windows.misc.
The problem long predated the move.

Sigh... how soon people forget.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                         `-_-'
Ferranti Intl. Ctls. Corp.                              'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012           "Heeft u vandaag al uw wolf geknuffeld?"
+1 713 274 5180                       "Tjener, denne ret er stadig levende."
From: jimkirk@news.uwyo.edu
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.crafts.metalworking
Date: 14 Oct 92 15:40:41 MST
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Wyoming - Laramie, WY

I would like to propose a change of name for the proposed newsgroup
rec.crafts.metalworking, to simply rec.metalworking.  Apparently,
UseNet is attempting to place more structure on the hierarchy, so that
instead of rec.*, you have rec.group.*.  I question whether this
is necessary, and/or whether implementation demands that existing
groups be forcefully changed to meet the new guidelines rather than
all being grandfathered.

1.  I note that, at least on our system, there are 3 "crafts" groups
    and 306 non-crafts groups.  Not an overwhelming response to the
    new rules.  On the other hand, the rules are relatively new.

2.  Symmetry with the strongly-related group rec.woodworking.  Unless of
    course they decide to change to rec.crafts.woodworking.  Perhaps
    they get to be grandfathered, being an old group?

3.  The existing group is trial.rec.metalworking, not
    trial.rec.crafts.metalworking.  All we want to really do is dump
    the "trial."  It has been pointed out, though, that the rules
    have changed since the trial group was formed, hence "crafts."

4.  In e-mail, some have complained to me that "crafts" is a demeaning
    add-on, implying the group is for discussion of things like how to
    weld five beer cans together into the shape of a schnauzer, and the
    like.  Metalworking is considered (by those I have corresponded with)
    a technical art, a profession, and/or a high skill.  Handwork is
    craft, machine work is not.

As a more general point, I wonder if the further pigeon-holing of
newsgroups is like the US' failed attempt to go metric.  Nobody seemed
to want it, and nobody was forced to convert, so it failed.  Likewise,
if older groups are not "forced" into the new scheme, their sheer number
will likely cause the new naming to fail, because there are more exceptions
than proper names, and in the end nobody will care.  Susan B Anthony dollars
also come to mind.  Why give us something we don't want?

More specific to metalworking, it is my impression that if the discussion
comes to a consensus that "crafts" be dropped, we might get away with it
(even though it is contrary to current guidelines).

So please voice your opinions/concerns, and correct me if any of my
impressions/facts are hosed up.

Jim Kirkpatrick
jimkirk@corral.uwyo.edu
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: Create a killfile? AAAAAAAARGH!
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 19:19:27 GMT

In article <nrp.719060916@reading> nrp@csug.cs.reading.ac.uk writes:

>twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce) writes:
>
>>In article <N3LDsB4w164w@jwt.UUCP> bbs-jwelch@jwt.UUCP writes:
>
>>>Thanks Joel, yes people, some of us CANT use a killfile..
>
>>Sucks to be you.
>
>Well, that's a really useful attitude to take.

No less so than "some of us CANT use a killfile.." [sic]

Frankly, if you don't use the tools that have become de facto
standards for the medium, WHETHER OR NOT it is by choice, people are
not going to bend over backwards to accomodate you.  If you are
reading news on an Atari ST or an Apple II which doesn't have software
with KILL file support, then I sympathize, but I can't say that I'm
under any obligation to cripple my own software so that we'll be in
the same predicament.  It's just a fact of life.

I'm not complaining, for example, that there don't exist free
Unixesque platforms for my 286.  386s are cheap enough for people not
to bother with catering to a near-dead architecture; if there isn't
software conforming to my current needs, that's too bad for me.

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "You are just naive and repressed because
\  / twpierce@unix.amherst.edu /  penis envy is here and it's now and it's
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /  all around you." -- Neal C. Wickham
From: ray@philmtl.philips.ca (Ray Dunn)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: use a KILLFILE
Date: 10 Oct 92 04:00:46 GMT
Organization: Not Philips

In referenced article, eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya) writes:
>Change the interface.  Hack the code, skip the files one does not want to
>read, create a moderated news group, write FAQs.  Many of those other OSes
>are dead meat, dinosaurs waiting to die.  This is a computer network.
>Be computer people.

I think usenet has left you behind Eugene.  It's almost certainly the case
these days that most readers of usenet are *not* computer people, they're
only using computers as a tool.  If not most, then at least very many.

>"When your tool is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail."

When was the last time you hacked a hammer into a screwdriver so you could
drive a screw?

Not that I approve of the whining about not having a killfile, he made his
point in his first posting, all the rest has just been noise, but a hell of
a lot of users have little option except to use the supplied available
tools.
-- 
Ray Dunn at home        |  Beaconsfield, Quebec  |  Phone: (514) 630 3749
ray@philmtl.philips.ca  |  dunn@cam.org          |  uunet!sobeco!philmtl!ray
From: shibuya@mailhost.bl.cad.slb.com (Hiroto Shibuya)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.windows reorganization
Date: 17 Oct 92 00:42:30 GMT
Reply-To: shibuya@mailhost.bl.cad.slb.com
Organization: Applicon; Billerica, MA (USA)

twbrown@PE-Nelson.COM (Tom W. Brown) writes:

>   Anyway, I think a reorganization would help avoid the problem (since I think
>   it is just a confusion about the group name).  I like the "comp.gui" better
>   than the "comp.windowing" suggestion and would opt for the following:
 
I like the term windows or windowing better since I think it represent
more wider range of technology which manipulate the metaphor "window"
on computer screens.  It can be used as a media to interact with
users, but it can be simply used for presenting graphical output.  It
was particulary odd to see "pex" as comp.gui.pex, because PEX strikes
me as 3D graphics system and not GUI system.  Of course you can argue
that it is system for user to interact with 3D graphics, but it sounds
a little far fetched since that is narrower aspect PEX.  I think your
intention of the term GUI is to make it more generic, but I think it
will exclude large part of the discussion which have something to do
with these windowing systems but not particulary UI.

I don't really have preference either way for windows and windowing,
but don't see much of merit over the hustle of chaging it.  Also I
find pronousing "windowing" a bit awkward. 

					Hiroto Shibuya
			
					Applicon Inc.
					Billerica, MA