HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kholland@hydra.unm.edu (Kiernan Holland)
Subject: Re: Len Stys <-> Jeff Young? The same person? Secret lovers?
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 07:46:31 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <1992Aug13.002912.17407@microsoft.com> iank@microsoft.com (Ian Kennedy) writes:
>In article <1992Aug11.143048.4819@usenet.ins.cwru.edu> aa399@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Len Stys) writes:
>>I didn't e-mail you anything.  If I did, I meant to post it.
>>
>>I think YOU should do more growing up while I find out how to get
>>your access removed.
>
>I should let folks know that I already apologized to Len
>for my unwaranted slam on him several days before I recieved this
>post at my site. I was in a bad mood and just felt like cheering
>Skip on. I got out of hand. Sorry about that. That's what
>using/testing/hacking Windows all day will do a person. :)
>
>Also if you are going to try and get someones access stripped
>just because they offended you, you are definitly in the
>wrong newgroup. If you want informed discussion and debate go
>to CSA.MISC. If you want unwaranted flamage and atomic human
>barbeques, then C.S.A.ADVOCACY is the place to be.
>
>Finally, Jeff Youg is just pissing people off. His posts
>are often mis-informed or just plain obnoxious. Why does he
>post here? We Amiga users could  care less about the Atari Falcon.
>I'm not in the atari groups raving about the AA chips and how they
>will crush everybody and be fastest video chips in world.
>
>Ian.
>-- 
>/* IanK@Microsoft.com		*/
>/* I want my 32bit chip set	*/
>

I read some old articles about Jay Miner. He said that 
a lot of programers in the early days of Atari 
were never treated well, and eventually most of them 
left becuase Atari wanted to hog all the profits. 
He also said that even though CBM has been slow in thier support
for the Amiga's (this was an article written in 1987 which I got this)
they have kept to all their promisses, which Atari did not. 
that is why Jay left Atari! 

And the reason why the Amiga was built to be a video 
game machine was that at the time it was being planned      
(around 1982-1983) the video game industry was 
the biggest money maker. Later in 83 it died out and Miner 
was left with a machine that would not make any money. 
He got some funding from Atari to continue work, 
only if by 6 months he'd pay it back; Otherwise, Atari would 
get the Amiga and run. CBM payed Miner, Miner payed Atari. 
So CBM saved Miner's life (as he said in the article). 
Additionally, CBM shelled out 50 million dollars on the machine.
That was how the Amiga was started. 

Actually, Atari didn't even have a ST in the works when Miner was designing the Amiga.

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn)
Subject: Re: OS/2
Organization: Qld Dept Primary Industries
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 10:33:29 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.200207.2549@ucsu.Colorado.EDU> chuj@horton.Colorado.EDU (CHU JEFFREY) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug11.132522.20628@cbnewsm.cb.att.com> benw@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (bennett.weber) writes:
>>>
>>>If you ask the average "JOE" what operating system his computer uses,
>>>he'd probably answer "Wordperfect".
>>
>I guess I did give the average "JOE" or "JANE" more
>than average, oh well, it reminds me of a story that I heard.

One of the problems of this forum is that it's a little elite - we're pretty
much all either computer/engineering professionals or are studying CS/EE.  So
it doesn't suprise me that people here have no clue about "average" users, at
home and in business.  Can't be helped, I guess.

>It goes like this:  A lady in the lab wanted to transfer her data
>from a 5 1/4" disk to a SPARC station which had a 3.5" floppy drive.
>What she did was folded the 5 1/4" disk and stuffed the disk into
>the drive.  Well that was the end of her data on the disk and possibly
>the drive as well(don't know what happened to the drive if it was ok or not).

We're well on the way to starting a folklore thread here...

This story of your's reminds me of a classic software telephone support tale:

Someone was having trouble getting some software, which came on several disks
installed.  They explained that they followed the instructions in the manual -
Insert Disk 1, press <Enter>, then Insert Disk 2, press <Enter>, and so on.
They're problem was that, after disk 3, they couldn't fit any more in the
drive!

That one's probably apocryphal.  This one's true - happened to me two weeks
ago.

Some meat inspectors were sent a computer from head office - these guys had
hardly even seen a computer before, let alone use it.  They were told to get
it set up.  They had a go, but they couldn't get the printer working, so they
got me out to look at it.  Seemed alright, except for one minor detail - they
hadn't realised that they needed a cable between the computer and printer!
What was it supposed to use, telepathy??

Here's another one (from a couple of years back now):

One of our office typists got an error when she went to save her work in
WordPerfect - the hard disk was full, as I recall.  This was a BIG document,
so she couldn't save to floppy.  I was about to shell out to DOS to delete
some files, when she suggested that, since the document was still on the
screen, couldn't we just plug it into a different "hard disk" (her terminology
for the box the monitor sits on) and save it on that?

And people wonder why I want to give up PC support...   :-)


-- 

David Meiklejohn                  | Internet : davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au
Computer Systems Officer, QDPI    | Fax      : +61 70 92 3593
Mareeba, Australia                | Voice    : +61 70 92 1555
From: eas3714@ultb.isc.rit.edu (E.A. Story )
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Atari Falcon Discount Supermachine  Re: Sydnes is gone?!!
Date: 20 Aug 92 07:46:12 GMT
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Originator: eas3714@ultb

In article <kiLRPB3w164w@cellar.org> darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling) writes:
>bn@mndcrme.uoknor.edu (Bo Najdrovsky) writes:
>
>Atari is not "finally coming out" with 16MHz 68030.  The Atari TT, a 32MHz
>68030, has been around for two years.  This new machine is for a different
>price range and user base.
> 
>> I must say that I concur with Gregory on his assesment of the Falcon. I
>> don't think that the A4000 has anything to worry about.
>
>Do you think the Falcon is supposed to compete with the A4000?  Couldn't you
>buy 2-3 Falcons for the price of a 4000?

Sure, 0+0+0 == 0 bucks.  Since neither the Falcon, nor the A4000 are
being sold at any price right now, I think this is an accurate
estimate :) :)  Seriously, we know not whether the Falcon will sell at
$700 or $2000 or $1000 or anything.  Similarly, we dont even know if the
A4000 exists.

>
>> Also, how does a company expect to seriously compete in the PROFESSIONAL
>> market when their top of the line computer has an OPTIONAL hard drive???
>
>How many professional USERS do you think want to be stuck with a
>pre-packaged hard drive?  The Falcon is designed for (ex.) DTP and pro music
>applications.  If you're doing DTP on it, you might want an 80 Meg drive. 
>If you're doing digital audio recording/editing, you might want 660 Megs
>and/or an external SCSI 88Meg removeable.

Machines without HD's are the machines that become
the lowest common denominator..  It just looks unprofessional to sell a
machine without a HD of some sort (at a decent size, of course).  The
current state of Amiga entertainment software typifies this situation.
(altho this is changing because of the HD becoming standard lowend
hardware... ie. A600HD and an increased base of HD users in general).

According to the release posted on this net in the amiga (atari?)
groups, Atari seems to be going after the multimedia/video market with
their machine.  The release tells of pioneering features such as video
overlay, TV scan rates, multitasking, etc.. Another Tramiel "inovation"?
I'm sorry, but if the AA chipset specs for the new Amiga's are right,
Commodore will again wipe the floor with anything Atari can hope to
produce.

-- 
"THAT is a DRY turtle.  That turtle is NOT moist!"
Ezra Story, a student at RIT, and
eas3714@ultb.isc.rit.edu, his trusty(?) mailing address.
From: jalkio@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: DREAM TEAM ==> Lynx, Falcon, Jaguar
Date: 17 Aug 92 14:43:27 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <1992Aug17.043307.28926@wam.umd.edu>, gcasa@wam.umd.edu (Gregory John Casamento) writes:
> In article <1992Aug11.145249.1@cc.helsinki.fi> jalkio@cc.helsinki.fi writes:


>>
> will loose downward compatibility.
> 
> As for the FALCON being a very different machine from the ST.  You can bet
> your butt that the FALCON will not be compatible with the ST at all.  And if
> it is it will likely not be 100% compatible.
> 

Well, even if the Falcon is quite different from the STs, Jack Tramiel
claimed that some major ST software already runs on the Falcon, like
Calamus and Cubase. Falcon is said to be MORE ST compatible than the TT
is. And I have understood that you can multitask normal ST software on
the Falcon.

> -- 
> Gregory John Casamento  --  gcasa@wam.umd.edu
> **** The opinions expressed in this article are the of Greg's Amiga ****
> **** And not of Greg himself.  He is currently being forced by his  ****
> **** Amiga (at gunpoint) to write this article.  :) :P B) BP ;) :O  ****

					Jouni Alkio
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:22104 comp.sys.amiga.misc:12923
From: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: Atari Falcon Discount Supermachine Re: Sydnes is gone?!!
Date: 21 Aug 92 17:09:29 GMT
Reply-To: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <u894776.714264773@bruny> u894776@bruny.cc.utas.edu.au (James McCoull) writes:
>skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:

>>Too bad the Falcon doesn't really have an OS.  

>Please tell me when the Amiga gets an OS, i bought mine in 1986
>and am still waiting for an OS.

You should have read the manuals.  The OS is on those funny looking 3.5"
roughly squarish things that fit in the front slot of the A1000.  But you
really don't want those, you want some updated ones.  Or perhaps a couple
of CS courses so that you at least understand the basic concepts of "OS",
"kernel", "DOS", "program loader", and other such technoid banter.

-- 
Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Amiga 3000) "The Crew That Never Rests"
   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh      BIX: hazy
	"Work like a horse, drink like a fish"	- Psychefunkapus
From: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: amiga rules!
Date: 20 Aug 92 13:47:26 GMT
Reply-To: andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel)
Distribution: comp
Organization: Flying Cat, Inc.

In article <1992Aug20.040919.24292@wam.umd.edu> gcasa@wam.umd.edu (Gregory John Casamento) writes:
>In article <1992Aug17.044919.16387@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> gfm@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (George Francis McBay) writes:
>>	I never owned a C128, so I can't comment on the incompatability..
>>But..
>>    The C64 used a 6510, not a 6502, and using a 6510 if the 64 DID have
>>a 6502, which it didn't, shouldn't be a problem, as I'm pretty sure the
>>6510 is a superset chip, basically a 6502 with a couple more IO commands
>>or some such thing.
>>
>>
>>
>
>Being a former C128 owner, I can say the there was some incompatibility.  
>The reason I say this is because there were a couple of games, whose names
>escape me, which would work fine on my C64, but not on my C128 in 64 mode.
>
>Also,are you sure that the 6502 was never in the C64??  Maybe in older models
>or something?

The 6502 was never used in the C64.  It was always a 6510.  The only
difference between the 6502 and 6510 is that the 6510 has an on-board
IO port.  (controlled through location 0 and 1).  In the C64, this IO
port is used to control the memory maps.  (ie MAX mode, ROM on/off, etc).

So its quite possible that software docs refered to the chip as a 6502
since everyone knew what a 6502 was, and from a software point of view
there was little difference.

>Gregory John Casamento  --  gcasa@wam.umd.edu

			andy

-- 
andy finkel		{uunet|rutgers|amiga}!cbmvax!andy

"Some people think MS-DOS is a necessary evil.  They are wrong.  MS-DOS
 is _not_ necessary."


Any expressed opinions are mine; but feel free to share.
I disclaim all responsibilities, all shapes, all sizes, all colors.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington)
Subject: Re: DIR
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 22:09:57 GMT

ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene) writes:
>	Not to mention the fact that the 040 Amiga is selling for $5100.
>    I'll bet you will be able to get a loaded 486DX2-66 for a lot less
>    then that.

Of course, but that is useless of one wants AmigaDOS.

-- Gerald
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
From: das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A)
Subject: Re: Atari Falcon Discount Supermachine  Re: Sydnes is gone?!!
Organization: University of Southwestern Louisiana
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 05:13:23 GMT

Has it occurred to anyone that even if if the Falcon were given away free,
nobody but music-o-philes and other nondescripts would care?

Not that I dislike competition form a new machine, but that I am
so surprised at all the posts about the 'Falcon'
--
*Dan Stephenson   das9674@usl.edu 
*"It reminds me of something Cally said. 'He who trusts cannot be
*betrayed, only mistaken.' It was a saying of her people.... Cally is
*dead. So are most of her people." -Avon, from _Rescue_ (Blakes 7)
From: slbfn@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re:  DREAM TEAM ==> Lynx, Falcon, Jaguar
Date: 13 Aug 92 11:38:26 MDT
Distribution: world
Organization: Utah State University

>>	C64
>>	C128
>>
>>	A2000
>>	B2000
>>	A500
>>	A500+
>>	A600
>>	A3000/16
>>	A3000/25
>>	A3000T
>>	A3000T/040
>>	A3000UX
>>
>>	486 Towers
>>	486 Desktops
>>	386/486? Laptops
>>	386/486? Portables
>>	286 systems?
>>
>>	But they did make the Amiga 1000? Or didn't they? Maybe Amiga Corp
>>	made all of the above machines and sold the whole line to CBM.
>>
> 
> You forgot:
> 
> 	386 Towers
> 	386 Desktops
> 	A2500
> 
  And let's remember:

        1950
	1960  monitors
	2024

	CDTV
	A1500   computers

	A501    ram expansion
	2080

	2091    scsi controller

	2630    accelerator

        AmigaVision
        AmigaDos 2.05
	UNIX
	Amiga LOGO
	TCP/IP Networking Software

	A10 Stereo Speakers
	A1010 Floppy
	A1680 1200 BAUD modem
	A2232 MultiSerial board
	A2286/386 BridgeBoards
	A2320 DisplaEnhancer
	A520  Composite Adapter

        Ohh, and let us not forget the huge amount of A570s availible in the US

-- Travis Carter

	


	
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: Amiga 4000/Atari Falcon
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 19:30:43 GMT
X-Posted-From: connection.prospect.com
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

ata@hfsi.UUCP (John Ata FSO) writes:
>
>Sigh, once again when one poster's experience doesn't match the experience of
>another poster, the tendancy seems to be questioning the posters motive,
>veracity or anything else other than trying to figure out why the experiences
>are so different.  Why do we do this?
>

Are you trying to deny that PC shortcomings are vastly exaggerated on this
newsgroup?  When every PC horror story posted here involves the fastest of
PC hardware performing worse than atrociously, forgive me if I refuse to
believe.  You may extract from these stories what you wish; I merely stated
my own opinion.  It's amazing how every PC story posted here -- about
performance, expansion, etc. -- is diametrically opposite from my experiences.

>
>Well, I'll ask you this question again.  What "functionality" does
>OS/2 2.0 provide that is not present in AmigaDOS?  I already know
>about VM and MP but what else is present?  Does it perhaps support
>multiple users like Unix, or multiple processors?  Please back up claims
>such as "faster" file systems with objective comparisons.
>

Here we go again.  DIG.  Resource tracking.  A graphics system that supports
splines, paths, non-rectangular clipping, 2-D transformations, Adobe scalable
fonts, etc.  Multithreading.  Named pipes.  Queues.  Binary compatibility with
DOS and Windows executables.  Want more?

>
>John G. Ata - Technical Consultant | Internet:     hfsi!ata@UUNET.UU.NET
>
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: mkoch@amisys.UUCP (Mike Koch)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Pournelle (and Byte) strikes again!
Date: 20 Aug 92 03:12:22 GMT
Organization: AMiSYS Consulting
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16e (7/4/92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith

In article <1992Aug19.000858.22985@cheshire.oxy.edu> leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt) writes:
> Hmm... not too bad of a hack job.  Of course, if he had any sense, he'd
> have asked someone who owned an Amiga about CD-ROM software... I know of
> at least three different systems.

I don't think he was talking about CD file system software, since he did
mention that he had viewed a few pics from CD.  More likely, he was referring
to the data retrieval software that is included on a lot of IBM and Mac CDs,
which provides those systems with a front-end to the rest of the data on the
disc.

I found it amusing (in a sad way) that he seemed to infer that all Amigas
prior to the 3000 required the two-disk, kickstart-workbench method to boot
up.  Hasn't he seen any Amigas since the 1000?
-- 

=============================================================================
Mike Koch       rehab1!amisys!mkoch@cbmvax.commodore.com      CI$: 70017,2677
From: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Sofware Piracy & Software Prices
Date: 17 Aug 92 22:51:25 GMT
Reply-To: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <1992Aug16.003218.25242@doug.cae.wisc.edu> kolstad@cae.wisc.edu (Joel Kolstad) writes:
>In article <1992Aug16.045420.13697@usl.edu> das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A) writes:

>>Aye, $65 for SNES Chessmaster...good grief! I wonder if this cart is
>>comparable to Chessmaster 3000 for PCs.  Anyone know?

>Anybody know WHY the cartridge and console prices for Nintendos, SNESes, 
>Genesises, etc. are ALL THE SAME!?  

Nintendo controls the manufacture and pricing of all their cartridges.  I
imagine, if they're making any money in the business, Sega and Atari do
likewise.

>Whatever happened to COMPETITION?!?!  There's LOTS of computer software
>competition, why not cartridge software?  

Computer software is a free market, game software isn't.  Anyone can write a
program of any quality and sell it for any price.  You don't need MS's 
permission to write a Windows program or C='s permission to write an Amiga
program.  You not only need Nintendo's permission to release a NES game,
but they have to make it for you and they tell you what it costs and how
much you get to make on it.  That's where they make their money -- the console
is sold at around cost in most markets.  That's the whole reason Nintendo
did so well.  NES wasn't any better than other 8-bit game boxes, but they were
the first to figure out how to make money on the carts.  You know, just like
the razor blade folks, you give away the razor to sell blades.  Atari and the
others got beat up on the hardware for price and the software for quality,
since games houses could easily outprogram them for each class of game.

>What they're doing, it's a darn good business practice from the money making
>point of view.  Too bad some consumers lose out, though.

Well, consumers don't have to buy games consoles.  You seem to have a real good
argument for game computers here.  You ultimately don't care much about the cost
of the console, since the cost of the software will outrun the cost of the 
console severalfold before you're off to bigger and better toys.  The games
consoles trick the consumer with low introductory pricing, but get them on the
incremental cart costs.  Computers are just the opposite -- you have to pay
more for an A600 than an SNES or Gemini, but most games are much cheaper.
-- 
Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Amiga 3000) "The Crew That Never Rests"
   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh      BIX: hazy
	"Work like a horse, drink like a fish"	- Psychefunkapus
 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gerber@orion.astro.uiuc.edu (Richard A. Gerber)
Subject: A3000T ad (was: Re: New A3000T ?!?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 19:38:52 GMT

In <9208181730.AA00580@aitgw.ge.com> BYRNE@MUPPET.dnet.ge.com writes:


>        Sorry if this has been kicked around before but I don't get the news
>anymore since amiga-relay went away.  I was looking through the Sept. '92 
>issue of Amiga World and I saw an ad for the new A3000T.  I didn't
>notice at first but there was a picture of an '040.

This was an amazing thing about the ad: you had to read the fine print
to figure out what in the heck was being advertised! A dorky cartoon of some
character straight out of Amiga World's 'Last 'Licks' column with a
knife and fork in his hand is supposed to sell the high end Amiga?
--
-------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Gerber
Grad Student Physics
gerber@rigel.astro.uiuc.edu
University of Illinois @ Urbana-Champaign
-------------------------------------------------------------
From: pepin@CAM.ORG (Jean Pepin)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: CDTV is dead.
Date: 15 Aug 92 18:36:03 GMT
Organization: Club Amiga Montreal

peterk@cbmger.de.so.commodore.com (Dr Peter Kittel Germany) writes:

>In article <1992Aug12.171044.17186@CAM.ORG> Jean@Ringo.CAM.ORG (Jean Pepin) writes:
> >
> >It's easy to be right with the no comment politic.
> >
> >Is Gail Wellington is out now, right or wrong?
> >If right, is it related to CDTV fiasco sale, right or wrong?
> >Is the new chips specs are rigth or wrong?
> >Is the new AA machine will show to Pasadena, rigth or wrong? 
> >etc.
> >> >If you reply that, we will have substance to judge.

>No way. *NO* serious company would answer such questions about relations
>with its staff or future politics in public. And yes, I use the word
>"serious" together with this company. In my eyes, anyone who demands
>something different is not serious. Also look at your use of tendencious
>(sp?) words like "fiasco": not serious.

The question is, it's right or wrong, not serious non-serious. I know CBM 
associates non-democratic to serious. Did you think i was expecting an answer?
You are just confirm than we can only receive information by respectable
people like Marc Barrett, who try to retablish democracy. Personnaly i think a
society with free information is most advanced than under military secret
politic for security (paranoia?) serious. Finally "fiasco" is not a serious
word because it's not in usage in politician vocabulary, Apple IIgs, Next and
CDTV are not fiasco because serious company never admit it, this is a rethoric
form called "SERIOUS".
 
>-- 
>Best regards, Dr. Peter Kittel  // E-Mail to \\  Only my personal opinions...
>Commodore Frankfurt, Germany  \X/ {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmger!peterk
>				   or  peterk@public.sub.org
Sorry for the black eye, Jean Pepin
-- 
\***  CCC AAA M   M  CLUB AMIGA MONTREAL           ------- Internet -------  
***   C   A A MM MM  C.P. 621 Succursale Victoria |   jean@ringo.CAM.ORG   |
***** C   AAA M M M  Westmount, Quebec H3Z 2Y7     ------------------------
 ***  CCC A A M   M  (514) 738-5173                Jean Pepin -- PRESIDENT