From: gazit@duke.cs.duke.edu (Hillel Gazit)
Newsgroups: alt.feminism,soc.men
Subject: Re: Boycotts (was Re: Why are many low-income women fat?)
Date: 2 Jan 93 12:06:54 GMT
Reply-To: gazit@cs.duke.edu (Hillel)
Followup-To: alt.feminism
Organization: Nefolet shel nemushot (Fallout of Wimps)

In article <C058Cu.Fnv@news.cso.uiuc.edu> 
levine@symcom.math.uiuc.edu (Lenore Levine) writes:

>A clear definition works very well in more stable societies,
>but doesn't seem to work as well in more quickly changing
>societies. 

Has the changes, in your life time, been so quick?

>>>>E.g. finding out why NY has the highest state taxation on an
>>>>average family in the nation, but it gives lousy services.

>>>Alfonse d'Amato? You should hear my mother -- who lives in New
>>>York -- talk about him!

>>>(And let me be nonpartisan and mention David Dinkins...)

>>You see the problem as the people, I see the problem in the kind
>>of system that attracts those people.

>I actually see the problem (or some great component of it) as
>television...

Would you mind to elaborate?

(BTW was it the television fault that the dead people kept
voting for mayor Daley of Chicago...?)

>>In my opinion, part of "social justice" is reducing the power of the
>>government.  Do you reject this approach?  Can you give an example
>>where a powerful government stayed (more or less) "clean handed"?

>Hillel, can you give an example of any government which has
>stayed "clean handed"? 

\begin{sarcasm}
Feminists keep telling us about the "good" female-dominated societies
that were around 4,000-5,000 years ago; do you think that those 
societies had not "clean handed" governments?!
\end{sarcasm}

>I have mixed feelings about reducing the power of the government.
>I think it is often a good thing, in general. I am not in favor
>of it as a fixed ideology; 

A strong government is sometimes needed, especially in
emergency times, but I don't like that.

>and I also note that sometimes the
>government acts as a check and balance to the quasi-governmental
>power of big, bureaucratic corporations.

For that the government should be stronger than the big, bureaucratic 
corporations, but not much stronger.  The current situation where 
pushing the "right" tax laws, and getting government contracts, are 
the best ways for big companies to increase their profit actually 
helps those "big, bureaucratic corporations" at the expense of 
the smaller and younger ones.

>Lenore Levine

Hillel                                      gazit@cs.duke.edu

There were in this country two very large monopolies.  The larger of
the two had the following record: the Vietnam War, Watergate, double-
digit inflation, fuel and energy shortages, bankrupt airlines, and the
8-cent postcard.  The second was responsible for such things as the
transistor, the solar cell, lasers, synthetic crystals, high fidelity
stereo recording, sound motion pictures, radio astronomy, negative
feedback, magnetic tape, magnetic "bubbles", electronic switching
systems, microwave radio and TV relay systems, information theory, the
first electrical digital computer, and the first communications
satellite.  Guess which one got to tell the other how to run the
telephone business?