HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nahst6+@pitt.edu (Nathan A Horstman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: trivia
Date: 4 Jan 93 03:13:12 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh


In article <C09CvD.IoH@law7.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> steve@law7.daytonoh.ncr.com (Steve Bridges) writes:
#
#The weapon U.S. Carbine, caliber .30 M-1 :-)
#
#The original military load was a 110gr jacketed bullet with 14.5gr Dupont
#military powder.  Muzzle velocity was 1900 fps.
#
#The case is a straight wall case with a slight taper from base to mouth
#(from .360" to .331").
#
#My reloading manual lists velocities from 1428 fps to 1950 fps for a 110gr
#bullet depending on powder and powder weight.
#
#There are reloading dies available, but with new ammo going for $7.50 per
#box of 50, you'd have to reload a whole lot to save any money.
#
#Steve
#
Is the ammo for the .30 Carbine THAT easy to find?  If I recall correctly,
I've seen the M1 Carbine advertised in SGN for @ $140 but could never find
any ammo advertised, so I figured that was why the price for the rifle was
so low.  Where can I find ammo?  For the price, would the M1 Carbine be a
better buy than the SKS at @$100 or the AK at @$200 ?

Nathan

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<-->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>       G  O       H  O  U  S  T  O  N 
<<      Nathan A. Horstman      >>  OOOO  IIIIII LL     EEEEEE RRRRR   SSSS  ||
<<   University of Pittsburgh   >> OO  OO   II   LL     EE     RR  RR SS     ||
<< in%"nahst6@vms.cis.pitt.edu" >> OO  OO   II   LL     EEEE   RRRRR   SSSS  ||
<<      nahst6+@pitt.edu        >> OO  OO   II   LL     EE     RR RR      SS ||
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<-->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  OOOO  IIIIII LLLLLL EEEEEE RR  RR  SSSS  oo
From: weba@batgirl.cs.hut.fi (Veijo Paavali L{nsikunnas)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: More newbie questions
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:02:08 GMT
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, CS lab

In <PA142548.530.725557991@utkvm1.utk.edu> PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:

#I don't think that you can KEEP kids from playing with toy "guns."  Keep you 
#kid away from plastic guns and he will pick up a stick, point it, and 
#holler "bang."

I think it is quite easy to keep kids away from toy guns. Just take them
shooting with the real thing and they are no longer interested in toy
guns. Well, this is my own experience. Before I got any affection to
toy guns my father took me and my brother shooting (at the age of six).
I've been kinda active shooter ever since. I bought my first toy gun
this year when I wanted to have mold for making a holster.

DVC//Veijo

---
Veijo Lansikunnas               If you are going to shoot, shoot. Don't talk.
weba@niksula.cs.hut.fi                                       - Il Brutto
From: emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Match, Wheel, Flint Locks
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:17:42 GMT
Organization: Gannett Technologies Group

In article <13684@optilink.COM> cramer@optilink.com (Clayton Cramer) writes:
#
#Wet weather, for obvious reasons, would significantly reduce the
#probability of successful firing by a flintlock.  The Battle of
#Fishing Creek, in which my great-great-great-grandfather fought
#on the Union side, was a Union victory at least partly because one
#of the Confederate regiments was armed with flintlocks, and the 
#wet weather made them inoperative.

There was a leather piece that was used to cover the frizzen and
flashpan of flintlocks for wet weather protection. I don't recall
it's name, but Clayton probably knows. Anyway it would protect the
powder in the pan, IE keep your powder dry, in all but the most
drenching of rains. Reloading any muzzle loader in a rainstorm 
is an exercise frought with peril. Much worse than a wet priming
charge is a wet main charge since you have to pull the bullet
to replace it. If the pan charge gets wet, you just snap the
frizzen open, wipe out the wet powder, and pour in fresh.

Gary
From: smpod@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Stefan)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Source for rifle sling
Date: 22 Dec 92 18:45:42 GMT
Organization: who knows

dege@umn-cs.cs.umn.edu (Dege Jeffrey Charles) writes...
# 
#   I've inherited a VZ-24, which was a licensed copy of the Mauser kar. 98.
#As I received it, it had a military-style sling (complete with elbow loop)
# ...
#   Does anybody know of a good source for this sort of thing?


Try Sarco or Springfield Sporters or any at-least-modestly sized gun show.
From: jdg00@ccc.amdahl.com (Josh Grosse)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Loading data accuracy?
Date: 1 Jan 93 14:38:54 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation



#You mentioned "Major load".  I'm assuming IPSC 175.  To do this safely in
#the .40 S&W and without risk of coming in Minor after a match, you really
#need access to a chronograph.  AA#5 should be fine.  I intend to work up a
#175gr LSWC load with it myself.  I'm currently using W231 but it's hot and
#I don't care to mention the charge weight.  Good luck.

Yes, I did mean ISPC Major.  I'd like a chronograph, but the ranges where
I currently shoot all have florescent lights -- I understand that a chrono-
graph may not function.

You mentioned some velocity innacuracies in the AA manual -- I noticed that
they say in their description of AA#5 that it will make Major at 150gr and
above in 40SW .... but not with my calculator and their velocity figures.
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Josh Grosse                                jdg00@amail.amdahl.com
Amdahl Corp.                               313-358-4440
Southfield, Michigan
From: ghm@sserve.cc.adfa.oz.au (Geoff Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Group Measurement
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:17:27 GMT
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy, Canberra, Australia

rigg@ssdt-tempe.sps.mot.com (Dana Rigg) writes:

#What is the correct way for measuring group sizes?
#1.  Using the two most-distant holes and measuring from
#a.      Outside edges
#    |-------------------|
#b.    Center of holes
#     |----------------|

Either a or b, as long as you say which you are using.
Method a is often easier to use and to visualise.
However, if the group is significantly non-circular
then (IMHO) that should also be noted, as should flyers
that were called by the shooter _before_ inspecting the
shots.

#c.      Inside edges
#        |-----------|
#     __               __
#    /  \             /  \
#    \__/             \__/

But the inside edges always touch :-)

Geoff Miller  (g-miller@adfa.edu.au)
Computer Centre, Australian Defence Force Academy
From: viking@iastate.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Black-powder, Pyrodex or ?
Date: 3 Jan 93 16:00:51 GMT

One trick I've found [to help simplify the cleanup task] is to
spray that silicone seal stuff on the brasswork after having
polished it to within an inch of its life.  Auto wax will work
fairly well, too.  Don't get something that cannot be scrubbed
off, but if your new BP pistol has lots of brass this will make
it clean with ease, and will remain brighter longer to boot.

< Dan Sorenson, DoD #1066 z1dan@exnet.iastate.edu viking@iastate.edu >
<  ISU only censors what I read, not what I say.  Don't blame them.  >
<  "Are you *SURE* he's worth a Harley-Davidson?" -- my grandmother  >
< to my girlfriend, about me.  "I'd better not say" -- my girlfriend >
From: se08+@andrew.cmu.edu (Seth Adam Eliot)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: slide wobble on SIG
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:02:43 GMT

I bought my SIG 228 over a month ago and have put about 300-400 rounds
throug it (none of them hot).

It seems to have devoloped a bit of looseness between the slide and the
frame.  Enough so that with the magazine out, I can feel it rattle when
I shake it.  (with a loaded mag in, the spring seems to stabilize it a
bit).

There seems to be some give in both the lateral and up&down directions. 
I tried to eyeball the lateral gap between slide and frame, and it seems
to total about 1/2 mm.

I rember some previous posts about some people having to send there gun
in for repair of this.  I was just wondering how much should I worry
about this?

-Seth

__________________________________________________________________________
"Why am I dangerous?...
                    ...because I'm right!"     -Rush Limbaugh

Seth Eliot                    Dept of Material Science and Engineering
                              Carnegie Mellon Univerity,   Pittsburgh, PA
ARPA    :eliot+@cmu.edu       |------------------------------------------
   or    se08+@andrew.cmu.edu |
Bitnet:  se08%andrew@cmccvb   |      
------------------------------|
From: towle@vssteg.enet.dec.com (Clark Towle Gunsmith)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: bounced email to Corky@vssteg re Astra A-90
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:02:10 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1hnoh1INNfub@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, bz269@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (James D. Del Vecchio) writes...
# 
#My letters keep bouncing, so I'll put it here.

 I got your mail but decided to answer here. :-)

#  The A-90 has a lug fixed to the underside of the barrel (diagonal jutting
#thing that slides into slot in frame, maybe "lug" isn't right word).  As
#near as I can tell, the barrel/lug are stainless, with a coat of black
#paint on parts of the outside.  The "chipping" or wear, is on the edges
#of the lug/appendage thing.  The edges are wearing down some, kind of
#unevenly.  The metal exposed by the wear looks like stainless, contrasting
#with the black finish.

 If all it is is the paint chipping it shouldn't be a problem. The new Astra 
guns are a good quality item so I can't see them building something where the 
metal on the barrel lug(s) chips off. My guess is that it is the finish thats 
chipping. If it has the type of finish ala the early CZ's with the baked 
enamel type finish this is probably the source and it shouldn't be anything 
to worry about.

#	The inside of the bore is hard to see but the chamber looks stain-
#less and the bore looks dark, sort of black with grey (lead?) streaks.

 Sounds like it needs a good scrubbing to remove the lead buildup.
Try a stainless 38 caliber brush to get most of it out then put a few rounds 
of jacketed ammo through it to remove the rest.

#It makes little sense that the chamber would be chromed but not the bore.
#Have you ever heard of black paint inside of a bore?

 Nope.. Its just firing residue not paint.
From: toby@stein.u.washington.edu (Toby Bradshaw)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: inside turning brass
Date: 22 Dec 92 15:05:22 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <BzMFsu.Fnx@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cbl@uihepa.hep.uiuc.edu (Chris Luchini) writes:
#I've got this barrel in a wild cat 6mm-284. My problem is that the
#neck thickness variation is 0.008-0.012.

Are we talking just thickness variation or neck wall runout (out-of-
round)?  If the necks are round, but vary in thickness, you can
outside neck turn or inside neck ream.  Outside neck turning
is preferred by benchresters for most purposes (I just turned
60 necks for my 6PPC; every time I think about neck turning
for a hunting rifle I remind myself how much I hate brass prep).
If you have 8-12 thou runout, the brass is junk.  It happens, though.

#Precision shooting claims
#that thickness variation only gets worse as one gets closer to the
#case head. I've thought of necking the brass up to basic size (ie
#making it a straight cylinder) and then forcing it into a
#die, and then inside turning it to a consistant diameter all the way
#to the head. Does anyone do anything like this to match brass?

Yes, the technical term is "masochist" :)

I bet it would be cheaper to find some good brass in the
big 6mm of your choice and have your rifle rechambered for
it than bore out existing cases and re-form them to 6/284.
You could take a ball mike to the local gun store and check
out the 284 brass they have.  _Anything_ but what you
have outlined would be cheaper.  I recently bought some
.270 brass (happened to be Winchester) for my Dad's rifle
and the worst case had less than .002 runout at the neck, and
all the cases were within 2 grains of being the same weight.
Commercial brass, at least some of it, is pretty damn good
right off the shelf.  The Remington .308 benchrest case could
be used for a checkweight on a balance if the stuff I looked
at is any guide.  Makes me wonder why I pay $1 apiece for PPC brass.

#The implication in some of the articles/letters in the Best of...
#was that something like what I describe above is done.

That makes benchrest machinists/shooters even crazier than
the typical Usenet reader ... scary :)

#Do you know of anyone who would offer this as a commercial service,
#for 284 brass?

Sure.  Mastercard and Visa accepted with suitable collateral :)

Toby Bradshaw
Department of Biochemistry and College of Forest Resources
University of Washington, Seattle
toby@u.washington.edu

"A well-educated electorate being necessary to the prosperity of
a free state, the right of the people to keep and read books, shall
not be infringed." Do you believe that all "inflammatory" books should be
stored in libraries, since no honest person needs such a book at home
where a child might read it?
From: bellcore!cereal.bae.bellcore.com!wind@uunet.UU.NET (Wind Chen)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: New Jersy Gun Laws
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:17:34 GMT
Organization: Bell Communications Research

In article <1992Dec21.172035.15644@ulysses.att.com>, les@ulysses.att.com (Leslie Johnson) writes:
|> 
|> #Ruger mini-30 (762x39mm), mini-14 ranch (.223 rem), 10/22  (.22 LR)  
|> Mini-14 not legal, Mini-30 okay, 10/22 okay
|> 
|> (Lines deleted)
|> 
|> All legal, as long as the magazines hold 15 rounds or less.
|> Semi-auto shotguns cannot have folding stocks or pistol grips, and
|> are limited to 6 rounds max.
|> 
|> --
|>   - Les Johnson  (les@ulysses.att.com) 1+908-582-5493
|>        "One Bell System - It Works"
|> 

The Mini-14 is LEGAL if 1) the magazine holds 15 rounds or less, and 2) has
no folding stock. 
Call NJSP (609) 882-2000 ext.2314 for details; or just go to Ray's at US 22
West to buy one :-).
-- 
_/   _/ _/ _/  _/   ____/
_/  _/ _/  _/ _/   _/
_/ _/ _/   _/_/   _/
_/_/__/     _/   _/                 Wind Chen
__/ _/ _/  _/ _/ ____/ _/           wind@bae.bellcore.com
From: harri@camelot.bradley.edu (Thomas Friday)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .17 vs. .223 for varmits?
Date: 2 Jan 93 18:44:11 GMT
Organization: Bradley University

In <2935028528.1.p00140@psilink.com> p00140@psilink.com (Gary A. Woodward) writes:

#Well winter has settled in on us here in VA.  I've got permission to 
#hunt several farms in the spring and summer to kill groundhogs (it seems 
#a lot of hunters cannot differeniate between a street sign, a cow, and a 
#ground hog).  I like the prices of the Remingtons, but I have a question 
#about the benefits of a .17 cal vs .223 for long rang varmiting.  I do 
#not choose to reload at least in the begining-so exotic calibres are 
#out.  Also a recommendation for a good variable X scope would be 
#appreciated. Thanks in advance. 

hmmm.. im kind of wondering what you mean by "long range", because if
you mean what most people mean, ( > 400 yards) i think very few people
would recommend .223 or a .17...  i believe there is only 1 factory
.17 caliber cartridge, but i could be wrong, im not a varminter.. 
the bullet weights for .17s are very small (25 grains is common i 
believe) so they dont retain energy well at long ranges.  the .223 
uses better weight bullets, but they are lacking in velocity even 
when fresh out of the muzzle.  the "hot" .22 calibers (.22-250 and 
.220 swift) are good, but most people would not use those if they 
thought most of their shooting was going to be at long ranges, again
because of lack of retained energy.. many bullets thats blow up very
well at short or medium ranges will not do so over 400 yards..
i believe for long-range hits most people would select something of at
least .25 caliber (.25-06 might be a popular choice, or maybe some 6.5mm
cartridges).. as far as more specific recommendations, i dont know
offhand as i am not an expert in these areas. i do recommend you find
Boyd Mace's _The Accurate Varmint Rifle_, as i believe Mace is
considered quite an authority  on such things. 

Also, as far as not handloading-- i dont think there are any varmint
hunters out there who would consider using factory ammo in thier guns
for hunting.  (Some rifles out there are so tight-necked that you
couldnt chamber a factory round if you tried!) There may also be
plenty of varmint hunters who would not consider hunting with a factoy
gun.. :-) Anyway, it demands excellent accuracy.. :-)  a good magazine
for anyone interested in bench rest, varminting, or just accurate
rifles in general is _Precision Shooting_ (dont have the address,
sorry)..

anyway, hope this points ya in the right direction.. 

--
harri@camelot.bradley.edu 
I'd rather be getting laid.
From: cyang@unixg.ubc.ca (Christopher Yang)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Custom Govt. Model Book
Date: 3 Jan 93 16:00:52 GMT
Organization: The University of British Columbia

Flipping through the Jan/Feb 93 American Handgunner, I came across an
ad for a book called _The Custom Government Model Pistol_ by Layne
Simpson.
It looks interesting, but before I rushed out to buy it, I was
wondering if anybody had any comments on it.  I have heard of
neither the book nor the author before and don't know whether the
book is useful or just another bookshelf decoration.

Happy New Year everybody! =)
Chris
From: hes@ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Lee vs. Omark (RCBS, Speer) feud continues!
Date: 23 Dec 92 03:35:44 GMT
Organization: North Carolina State University


  I just opened a new set of Lee Dies and on the instruction
sheet was the following statement in a box:

"Speer advises that Speer bullets should not be used
with certain Lee dies.  All other brands work great."

I suspect that this is a result of the big dispute over
the Lee "factory crimp" die for rifle cartridges.

--henry schaffer
From: fist@iscp.Bellcore.COM (Richard Pierson)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: .22 First Rifle
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:17:37 GMT
Organization: Bell Communications Research (Bellcore)

Was looking through the local Sunday paper and noticed
an advertisement for a "Daisy" .22 bolt action rifle.
Lancoe in Wind Gap PA is advertising these for $49.00.
Anyone have any expirence with them, Good, Bad or indifferent.
I am looking for a .22 for my 7(almost 8) yo son and
for my 6 (almost 7) yo daughter. They want something they
can fire without a rest (my mossberg 144 HB is too much)
and I want to plan now for the spring and not spend a 
fortune for something they will outgrow in 2-3 years.
When did Daisy start making real firearms ?

-- 
##########################################################
There are only two types of ships in the NAVY; SUBMARINES 
                 and TARGETS !!!
#1/XS1100LH	#2/10/10/92
Richard Pierson E06584 vnet: [908] 699-6063
Internet: fist@iscp.bellcore.com,|| UUNET:uunet!bcr!fist  
#include <std.disclaimer> My opinions are my own!!!
I Don't shop in malls, I BUY my jeans, jackets and ammo
in the same store.
From: tighe@convex.COM (Mike Tighe)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: AMT Longslide?  Any good?
Date: 22 Dec 92 23:47:36 GMT
Organization: Convex Computer Corporation, Richardson, Texas

efk00@cd.amdahl.com (Eddie Kieger) writes:
#In article <1992Dec21.190226.4408@convex.com>, tighe@convex.COM (Mike
#Tighe) writes:
##I used to own an AMT Hardballer. The happiest day I had with it was the day
##I sold it. It looked great, but it jammed constantly. I sent letters to the
##company asking some simple questions, and never received any replies. I
##would never own an AMT product again.

#Well, this is just the opposite from my experience with MY hardballer. 
#Great trigger, feeds anything (including lead semi wadcutters) 
#flawlessly. The adjustable rear sight is a little cheap, but whadda ya 
#want for the money?? It works OK for me, and the zero doesn't change, 
#so it's servicable.

Well, it didn't help that every time it jammed a friend I would go shooting
with would always say, "shoulda bought a Colt". And as you might expect,
his Colt never jammed.

#Maybe the reason Mike couldn't get any action on the letters is because 
#AMT has reorg'ed & moved a couple times, and they may not have gotten 
#his letters?? Just a speculation..........

Perhaps. This was over ten years ago. But even I know how to fill out a
change-of-address form.

Glad to here though that yours is working fine.
-- 
Mike Tighe, (214) 497-4206
tighe@convex.com
From: emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: AK-47
Date: 31 Dec 92 21:57:29 GMT
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems

In article <1hqapmINN55o@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> ai298@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jerry Cergol) writes:
#
#The SKS looks different than the Ak-47 types and seems to be cheaper...
#is it as good as the AK?

Depends on your criteria. It's a generation of military arms back from
the AK, but it is a rugged military weapon with good handling qualities,
and an adequate cartridge. The AK has a detachable magazine and a pistol
grip, questionable advantages in today's legal climate. Both are semi-auto 
in versions we can buy. The AK was designed to be a selective fire weapon 
while the SKS never was. That was militarily important, but moot to us 
civilians. With the SKS about 1/3 the price of the AK, I'd buy 3 SKS instead 
of one AK. But if you have the money, buy both. Neither will disappoint
you. I would advise buying as much of the currently available cheap ammo
as you possibly can. It probably won't be around that much longer.

Gary

-- 
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | gatech!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | uunet!rsiatl!ke4zv!gary
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | emory!kd4nc!ke4zv!gary      
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     | emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu
From: damiel@netcom.com (Paul Theodoropoulos)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Glock numbering.
Date: 2 Jan 93 23:31:46 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In <1993Jan1.180649.25245@ke4zv.uucp> emory!ke4zv!gary@gatech.edu (Gary Coffman) writes:
#In article <1259@blue.cis.pitt.edu> dcwst8+@pitt.edu (David C Winters) writes:
##     The first Glock to hit the market was the 17 - were numbers 1
##through 16 prototype models?

#The 17 refers to magazine capacity, a marketing ploy. A Glock 1 under
#the same system would be a single shot. The following numbers don't
#refer to magazine capacity. In true marketeering fashion, later models
#have to have higher numbers whatever their capacity. 

#The 18 is a full auto pistol, not available here.


you are misinformed. The model 17 is the seventeenth design patent that was
issued to Gaston Glock. The previous sixteen patents were for such remarkable
items as plastic hinges and doorknobs. The Glock model 17 was the first gun
ever designed by Mr. Glock, and in that regard, it is an extraordinary 
achievement.

if it were a marketing ploy, they could have just as easily called it the 
Glock 18, since that's how many rounds i carry in mine (17+1).

The model 18 *is* available here, but it is merely extremely difficult to
procure, for obvious reasons. i can say that i don't frequently see full-auto
pistols under the glass at my local dealer....however, certain law enforcement
agencies in the U.S. do have them.

-- 
paul theodoropoulos     damiel@netcom.com     (hooools@well.sf.ca.us)
       Cosysop - Threat Management Institute BBS 707 935 1713