From: slzm9@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Lee:Skip work to attend Malcolm X
Date: 4 Sep 92 15:29:39 MDT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Utah State University

In article <stovall.715534629@ficus.cs.ucla.edu>, stovall@ficus.cs.ucla.edu (Steven Stovall) writes:
> What is this, the "Culture War"??
> 
> HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels) writes:
> 
>>I say:
> 
>>So why can't El Hajj Malik El Shabazz be pansexual as well as the
>>other folk interviewed for the book?
> 
> El Hajj Malik cant be, but Detroit Red can be. 

   BULLSHIT!!! I don't care about your holier-than-thou attitude but
even MUSLIMS can succumb to the temptations of the flesh. I have
witnessed it. So the man you call "El Hajj Malik El Shabazz" could
have a homosexual encounter and still be that man. However, he
may have "sinned" against your and his code. People do things they
might not agree with morally because they are HUMAN.
   They might also seek forgiveness from some god at a later time. To
soothe their troubled soul, or conciousness, or whatever. But please
don't imply that no muslim ever sinned against the teachings of the
Qu'ran because you are wrong. I have seen it done. Now I didn't
see this particular man commit what you would call a sin but to state
"El Hajj Malik cant" commit a sin implies he is not possible of 
sinning, according to the Islamic code, that my friend is BULLSHIT!
Even muslims can make a mistake.

> It would just have to
> be asserted by a "credible" source. I doubt if such a source will be
> forthcoming (in particular, I doubt that the source in question is such
> a source). In the meantime, this smacks of West Village revisionism.
> 
>>Steve says:
> 
>>>Whatever the truth of this allegation, by the time he entered public life
>>>as a minister of the Nation of Islam, Malcolm *was* the seminal blackman
>>>and was *not* the depraved Detroit Red.

   Steve, "depraved" is your adjective according to Your and other muslim's
code. But we don't all live by that code. So just give us the caveat -
"In my opinion the 'depraved Detroit Red' ." And we'll leave you alone.
 
>>I say:
> 
>>Was he also depraved for being a male prostitute?  Receiving or
>>giving the smallest affection or pleasure as a young adult?  The
>>fine line ain't always so fine...and ain't even a line at times.
> 
> Pimps, hustlers, dope fiends are depraved. But redeemable.
> 
>>By the time he was Minister Malcolm he was certified "straight."  So
>>is this necessarily good? And the Nation of Islam is a very
>>"straight," conservative institution. Malcolm went from one extreme
>>to another.  Perhaps he was trying to reach for the center.  We'lll
>>never know for sure.
> 
> Life in the Nation of Islam is a definite improvement over hustling.
> 
> Trust me.
> 
>>Steve concludes:
> 
>>>Understand that homosexuality is explicitly prohibited by the Quran.
>>>Al Hajj Malik Shabazz was a Muslim who believed la ilaha il Allah
>>>(there is no God but Allah) and Muhammedan Rasullulah (Muhammed is
>>>the Messenger of Allah), not to mention the Angels, the Prophets,
>>>the Quran, the Last Day...and that trangressors will be roasted
>>>at hellfire.
> 
>>I say:
> 
>>Jeez, Steve.  Calm down.  Pull up the stakes and send those wagons
>>of wood home.  Ain nobody burning anyone tonight, or any other
>>night.
> 
> Hey, dont blame me. 

   Steve the only thing I would like to blame you for is inflicting
your code on all of us. We don't all believe the same way you do
and even if your code suggests that we will all be subject to
Your code someday, some of us think that we are not subject to
your code and will never be. I personally think we will all be
subject to our own code, whatever that is when you die, regardless
of all the muslims, christians, and mormons that would tell me, respectively,
I'm going to "roast in hellfire", "burn in hell", and "never see the highest
heaven."

> These are the words of Allah in the surah "The Event"
> (English by Pickthall) about the events of the Last Day:
> 
> 	But if he is of the rejectors, the erring,
> 	Then the welcome will be boiling water
> 	And roasting at hellfire.


   Finally, Steve please stop thinking that your way is the only One
True Way for all of us. For you, ok, think it if you want but ...


   DON'T INFLICT IT ON THE REST OF US. WE DON'T NEED THAT BULLSHIT!


Peace, but not without justice,


Zip

P.S. Now your going to respond that it isn't just your way but also the
way of the man some of us call Malcolm X. I know that for some of his
life he followed that philosophy; may have even died with it. But,
I interpret history differently than you because I allow for forgiveness
and humanness. It is your interpretation and self-righteousness
that I can do without. Try to keep it out of your commentaries. If you
can't at least prefix your comments with "In my opinion." Thank you.