HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tjw@vms.cis.pitt.edu (TJ Wood)
Newsgroups: rec.nude,soc.men
Subject: Re: New York, Nudity, and Women
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:20:46 GMT
Followup-To: rec.nude
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Jul23.032242.17785@leland.Stanford.EDU>, dkeisen@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dave Eisen) writes:


> I'm wondering how long it will be before some women decide 
> they like being topless but they shouldn't have to put up 
> with the gawking this can attract from some men.

I heard this comment on the news just the other day.  A woman was going on
and on about how she'd like to go topless, but the MEN were preventing her
by looking.

I'm sure it will take some time, but everyone will get used to it and the
novelty will wear off.  After all, I'm sure when women started wearing
skirts above the ankle they got some stares.

And of course women NEVER look at men.  Never. ;-)

Terry
From: middleto@poincare.ucsd.edu (Tom Middleton ; System Manager)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Re: 'Selling' nudism
Date: 21 Jul 1992 18:28:12 GMT
Organization: Institute for NonLinear Science, UCSD
NNTP-Posting-Host: poincare.ucsd.edu

In article <y_dm_fb.pdh@netcom.com> pdh@netcom.com (Phil Howard ) writes:
>Don't count on it.  The TV stations and networks can and *DO* refuse
>advertising they don't like.  

True but there is one way around this.  Run for political office on the
nudist ticket.  In the U.S. political ads can not be censored and candidates
do have the right for equal time. Some anti-abortionist took advantage of this
by running for office and showing fetuses in his ads.

Perhaps some day I will run for Mayor and have a series of ads done at Blacks
Beach!! :-)   :-)

-- 
	Thomas Earl Middleton
	middleto@poincare.ucsd.edu
	aka Happy Bare
From: jicsg21@cetus2c.cs.utk.edu (jicsguest21)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Any CO areas in East Tennessee?
Date: 27 Jul 92 11:55:55 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, University of Tennessee, Knoxville
Distribution: world
Reply-To: jicsg21@cetus2c.cs.utk.edu (jicsguest21)
NNTP-Posting-Host: cetus2c.cs.utk.edu

I am looking for CO recreation areas in East Tennessee.  Does anyone know of such areas?
Please reply directly since I rarely have access to this group.
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: raul@rs1.tcs.tulane.edu (raul zighelboim)
Subject: Re: A survey
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-4348]: rs1.tcs.tulane.edu
Organization: Tulane University, New Orleans, LA
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 05:08:39 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.050115.20369@samba.oit.unc.edu> Mark.Cornick@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Mark Cornick) writes:
>Recently a sex survey was posted to rec.nude. I would like the poster to
>explain what any of it has to do with rec.nude.
>
>
>--
>   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
>     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
>        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
>           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80

	Is there a CO beach in the Lousiana-Florida area?
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: ran@cbnews.cb.att.com (Robert A. Neinast)
Subject: The Topfree States
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 12:27:08 GMT
Keywords: NY Court Ruling Footnotes



Many thanks to Mark Eckenwiler <eck@panix.com> for typing in
and posting the full text of the NY court decision.  I found
particularly interesting one of the footnotes dealing with the
other states that allow topfree women.  Here's my (interpreted)
summary.

	Indecency statute prohibits exposure of "private parts"
	and breasts are not private parts:

		Ohio
		North Carolina
		Hawaii

	Indecency statute prohibits exposure of genitals only:

		Alaska
		California
		Colorado
		Idaho
		Iowa
		Kansas
		Kentucky
		Maine
		Missouri
		Montana
		Nebraska
		New Hampshire
		North Dakota
		New Mexico
		Oklahoma
		Oregon
		Rhode Island
		South Dakota
		Tennessee
		Texas
		Utah
		Wisconsin



Bob
-- 
                                                                  _
". . . and shun the frumious Bandersnatch."                 Nipetlahuini.
Robert Neinast (ran@cblpo.att.com)
AT&T-Bell Labs
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: davidws@phx.mcd.mot.com (David Seidner)
Subject: thanks for clearing it up
Organization: Motorola Computer Group, Tempe, Az.
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1992 18:33:59 GMT

>>>this a test

>> 		You people out there who test, test, test, test, etc.
>> 		May I ask what it is that you are testing??????
>> 		Please buzz me via email and let me know.
>> 		Maybe I'll start testing too, if I knew what to test for.

>SHEESH!  I thought that *everybody* knew what these people were testing!
>Ok, let me explain it to you.  To post an article in rec.nude, you MUST
>be nude.  So many "first timers" quickly rip off their clothes, post a 
>message and then throw their clothes back on.  Of course, when they *are*
>finally nude they have no idea what to post.  So here they are, "nekid
>as a jay bird" and they can't think of anything!  So they quickly type
>"test".

       |^^^^^^|        ______________________________
       |      |       /                              \
       |  _  _|      |  O.K. I admit it, I'm nekid as |
       | (o)(o)      |  a jeybird.  So what man.      |
      @      _)      '\______________________________/
       | ,___|     ,'
       |   /   ..''  
      /____\       

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
	davidws@bopper1.phx.mcd.mot.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: JW83HISW@MIAMIU.BITNET
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Looking for CO beaches in Toronto
Date: 23 Jul 92 14:23:12 GMT
Organization: Miami University - Academic Computer Service

Greetings all!
     Like the subject line says, I'm interested in any info on CO beaches
in Toronto or Ontario in general.  My fiance' and I are taking our honey-
moon to the Stratford Shakespeare Festival, and we're looking for other
fun things to do during the week.  If you could post/Email any info, I'd
really appreciate it.
     BTW - we'll be there during the first week of June; how's the weather
then?  Would it be too cold, or would it just depend?
 
Thanks!
Jim
===========================================================================
Body by Hammerstrength!  Mind by WCP!  Spirit by God!  Rock and Roll!
"Fate is for suckers!" - me.
===========================================================================
From: middleto@poincare.ucsd.edu (Tom Middleton ; System Manager)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Re: nude swimming question
Date: 31 Jul 92 18:04:52 GMT
Organization: Institute for NonLinear Science, UCSD
NNTP-Posting-Host: poincare.ucsd.edu

In article <> jlysagh@hubcap.clemson.edu (james joseph lysaght) writes:
>suit lake) and there were a whole lot of fish in this lake coming up
>nipping at me and at all the other people.  
>           ...                   If I were to swim nude in this lake I
>might find it rather discomforting if some of the bigger fish mistake my
>worm for a worm and go at it.  Anyone ever have a problem with this?  Do
>choose a lake that is low on nipping fish or what?  Is there something
>analogous to the "Bat Shark Repelent" to use?

I have swam naked in lakes, quarries and oceans.  I have never had a problem
with fish nibbling at my worm.  I suppose if a lake has hungry fish (or
piranha) you should avoid it or [gasp!] wear some protection when you swim
(but take it off on land).  Finding a lake where the fish aren't so hungry
or staying out of the water during the lunchtime are also possibilities. I
don't know of any repellants but I suspect they wouldn't like suntan lotion
very much.  You could also tie little hooks to your body and catch some dinner
as you swim.

Probably the best solution is to take as many friends as possible with you.
The fish probably will stay away if there are several people in the water.
Maybe create a decoy, a plastic makeup of a bigger fish that eats the fish
that nibble on you.  Sort of like the plastic owls they put on buildings to
keep away pigeons.

Good luck.

-- 
Thomas Earl Middleton				Camping Bares
middleto@poincare.ucsd.edu			P.O. Box 81589
aka Happy Bare					San Diego, CA 92138-1589
From: jp@moscom.UUCP (Jim Palmeri)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Re: Mail problems
Date: 31 Jul 92 17:40:51 GMT
Reply-To: jp@moscom.com (Jim Palmeri)
Organization: Moscom Corp., Pittsford, NY

Hey Stephane,

It was pointed out to a number of us by Lib that we did not read your name
right and thought you were a women.

My post to you and the group was not gender-dependent, and remains the same.
I wanted you to know that there were readers that understood your message.

If Lib wants to accuse me of brown nosing, that is her business.  As I said,
no matter what you post, there is always someone who is going to jump on you
for it, I guess I owe Lib a note of thanks for demonstrating my point.

-- 
Jim P.   (jp@moscom.com)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: steve@rtfm.mlb.fl.us (Steve Pierce)
Subject: Various (long)
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 22:57:35 GMT


This is a rather varied post to allow me to catch up on several subjects of
late.  Sorry if I'm beating some dead horses :-).
+++
NATIONAL NUDE WEEKEND vs NUDE WEEK
  My understanding (from TNS literature) is that TNS started the National Nude
Weekend celebrations.  ASA saw it as a good thing and joined in.  TNS seemed to
be the big push behind the extension to a week-long celebration (to give more
chance for publicity for the big weekend events that were usually reported on
after the fact).

LEGAL SUPPORT
  Someone mentioned contacting TNS or NAC for support.  The ASA will support
also.  (Don't flame me on this one - here in Florida, ASA is showing more
visible support than TNS;  I belong to both so don't say I don't know :-)

FAQs AND SUCH
  Of late, I have had several heated discussions on the FAQs, especially the
Free Beach Etiquette.  People, I didn't create this document.  I "borrowed" it
basically word for word from TNS.  I don't intend to argue it as right or wrong
(especially with someone who doesn't live in the US - things are different here
believe me!).  Most of the information in the FAQs is a group effort -- I post
it for the benefit of all.  I am not making the rules here, okay :-).

NUDIST CLOTHING DRIVES
  Several clubs have been sponsoring clothing drives.  TNS had some info in
NUDE & NATURAL about clothing drives in Europe for some of the refugees in
Yugoslavia and I believe several naturist groups were sending clothes overseas.
ASA sponsored a clothing drive during Nude Recreation Week.  Sanibel Naturists
(here in Florida) has received lots of good publicity for their drives over
the last several years (they have a food drive in conjunction with this, too).

SPEAKING UP AGAINST IMPROPER BEHAVIOUR
  The Free Beach Etiquette says that we should speak up for our rights.  When
common sense says "I may get hurt for speaking up", try to find several beach
regular to come to your aid and speak to the offending parties as a group.  It
worked at Playalinda!!

CLOSING THOUGHTS
  I have still not find time to put together the Beach and Hot Spring FAQ...
any volunteers?  I can put together a post on the advantages of TNS and ASA
membership if anyone is interested (I can also tell you how to get you group
affliated with both since I just recently did that for Space Coast Naturists).

  Playalinda will open Aug 1.  It may only be open one weekend though... rumors
of a 3-day turnaround on getting ANOTHER shuttle on the pad by the 3rd, with a
September launch date.
-- 
===========================================
Steve Pierce             Palm Bay
steve@rtfm.mlb.fl.us     Florida
===========================================
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: tcumming@netcom.com (Tom Cumming)
Subject: Re: The Topfree States
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 23:05:13 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Distribution: usa
Keywords: NY Court Ruling Footnotes

In article <1992Jul24.122708.10377@cbnews.cb.att.com> ran@cbnews.cb.att.com (Robert A. Neinast) writes:
>
>	Indecency statute prohibits exposure of genitals only:
>
>		California

    Well, I thought that it was illegal if you were exposing yourself
with intent to be offensive (or some such).

Tom C.
From: tjw@vms.cis.pitt.edu (TJ Wood)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Re: 'Selling' nudism
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:12:47 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <14kspmINN2ou@smaug.West.Sun.COM>, Richard.Mathews@West.Sun.COM (Richard M. Mathews) writes:

> Thus you better run for Congress.  And you still have to have enough
> money to be able to afford the ads.

I once heard a communications attorney speak about the subject of political
ads on TV.  He mentioned that there are special rates for political ads that
are substantially cheaper than the rates for commercial ads.  He said that
this was dictated by congress.  (Maybe it only applies for the incumbent. ;-)

In any case, be sure to check and see if you get a discount because you are
running for office.

Nightline (or maybe the ABC Evening News) recently showed some of the ads
that the pro-life candidates were running.  They had pictures of late term
aborted fetuses.  If they can show that, I'm sure you can appear nude on TV.

Terry

PS: What ever happened to the "Gentler, Kinder America" that George promised
us?  Wouldn't CO beaches be a first step in that direction?  Or is that
offensive to TRADITIONAL FAMILY VALUES?  ;-)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: Tom.Martens@f583.n107.z1.ieee.org (Tom Martens)
Subject: BEACHES IN NEW YORK, NEW JERSEY, NEW ENGLAND 
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/583 - Starship ][, Lyndhurst NJ
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 02:14:54 GMT

are you interested in the various nudist resorts or just beaches
there are some fine resorts let us know what you want    tom
--- GroupMail 2.18
 * Origin: Starship ][ 201-935-1485 (1:107/583@FidoNet) [520/583@AlterNet]
--  
=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=
 Tom Martens - Internet: Tom.Martens@f583.n107.z1.ieee.org
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: jlysagh@hubcap.clemson.edu (james joseph lysaght)
Subject: Re: sex vs nudity
Organization: Clemson University
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 12:46:42 GMT

In article <Bs8KoM.7I6@xrtll.uucp>, stephane@xrtll.uucp (Stephane Deschenes) writes:

> In article <1992Jul29.121113.15796@walter.bellcore.com> mdl@phelixsalt (Michael Lynch) writes:
> >>> In article <1992Jul26.212559.1@engr> s_mesbah@engr writes:
> >>> heterosexual to the core
 
So what... if you were 100% homo to the core you would just be this
stimulated over the nude men instead of the nude women.  

> >>> and if I went to a nudist beach I wouldn't be able to
> >>> control my sexual drive.  Being just inches away from penetrating a female
> >>> would drive me nuts!  Just curious
> 
So do like every other young kid that can't control his desire... go to
the mens room and tend to it in private in a stall.

> C'mon, Mike, wake up.  What Mr. Just Curious was suggesting in the posting
> was rape.  
No it isn't... He implies that being that close to a female would drive
him nuts because he would NOT be engaging in sex. What he seems to be
suggesting is that age old myth of blue balls and all the other myths
teenagers use to get there gal in the back seat of dad's oldsmobile.  He
does not seem violent or screwed up... just young and lacking education
and growth on such topics.  The education part he is getting a lot of
right here.

>                                        Some individuals cannot control their
> sexual desires and as a result either rape or molest others. 

No! this demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of the topic.
Rape rarely has anything to do with sexual desire, it is mainly a power
trip thing.  Rape is an act of violence, and an act of power, and an act
of extreme cruelty.  Some rapist do so out of sexual desire, but most do
it out of a desire to exert there power and strength over another person
and inflict mental anguish on them.

>  The treatement
> is usually either psychological or drug therapy depending on the cause.
>
This should be the treatment, unfortunately, all to often, the treatment
is a jail sentence that they never even serve a fraction of before they
get out and do it again.

I say all this because this is a sore topic with me.  I have known more
than one friend who became a victim of rape over the years.  And for
those of you who think rape is a womens pain, the one friend who was the
most permanently scarred by the experience was a male who was raped by
another male.

Jim
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: arnett@unixg.ubc.ca (Bill Arnett)
Subject: Very punny!
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 08:56:16 GMT

One things for sure, Gwen Jacobs and her supporters have certainly grabbed
a lot of media attention (some good, some bad) and the media's punsters
have gone wild with the issue.  Here's just a few of the headlines
appearing in the Vancouver Sun and Province newspapers over the last week:
(and more puns appear within the articles)

  "Topless march looks like a bust here"
  "Some women feel subject barely worth the exposure"
  "Showing glandular grandeur a bust with most women"
	      
For the most part the news stories seemed pretty balanced, and interveiws
with the public generally showed that people weren't very bothered by
bare breasts, but the editorials and headlines were very biased against
the Jacobs and her followers.  These editorials all focused on the idea
that "surely there are more important injustices to protest"  to which my
reply is "surely there are *real* injustices to be fought by our police and
courts!"

Nicole Parton (a local columnist and unsuccessful politician who I've
never had much respect for) in her column today (headline was the 3rd
one I quoted above) said in part:

  "...Keep your shirts on, ladies.  The world has plenty of burning
  issues and bras aren't one of them. [sic] ... Should women be given
  the choice [to expose their breasts]? Honey, you wanna re-enact your
  own version of King Leer and that's *your* business, but do it in
  the privacy of your own home or where patrons pay to see you. Don't
  do it in the supermarket, at the office, or at school, or I'll
  direct you to "exhibitionist" in the dictionary.
     "Indecent? Oh, how tedious.  No, women's breasts are not indecent.
  Which does, I admit, made it difficult to argue that baring it all is
  an indecent act.
     "But like it or not...western society sexually objectifies women's
  breasts."

I omitted most of the really insulting, demeaning, punny, and irrelevant
parts of this editorial.  Parton repeatedly associated all bare breasts
with Playboy and Penthouse---which she approves of, based on the quote
above.  She admits that breasts are not indecent, but concludes that
letting anyone see them (except paying customers) is indecent.
--------------
Locally, a group planned a topfree demonstration in Stanley Park, but
it attracted so much attention (from gawkers and media) that they changed
the plans and relocated to an unspecified location.  I haven't heard any
more about it.

The previous day (Friday), a group of about 10 women (and men?) marched
topfree down Commercial Avenue shouting slogans supporting gay rights.

Cheers. Bill.
-- 
Bill Arnett                            Internet: arnett@unixg.ubc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: arnett@unixg.ubc.ca (Bill Arnett)
Subject: Re: Nudity by Default
Organization: University of British Columbia, Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 07:32:09 GMT

In article <x4cmlzd.tcumming@netcom.com> tcumming@netcom.com (Tom Cumming) writes:
>>In article <59032@mimsy.umd.edu> egolub@cs.umd.edu (Evan Golub) writes:
>>>
>>>    I have a public forum question for you all.  Why is it that an
>>>ex-girlfriend of mine was very protective of my seeing her naked 
>>>below the waist (even though I had had my hand down there) and then
>>>proceeded to go to a Clothing Optional weekend resort, packing what
>>>she needed in one of those stupid waist-knapsack things?

Maybe this had less to do with her attitudes and more to do with *your*
attitudes.  She may have only felt comfortable revealing her body in
a non-sexual situation (this is much easier, in some ways) and may have
felt that you would be unable to view her body non-sexually.

>... I tend to agree. I had a girfriend once that "my beach" had become
>an issue between us. She said (and I quote) "The only time you take your
>clothes off around other people is to have sex". "If I took my clothes off
>at your beach, I would have to have sex with everyone there".  This attitude
>made me angry, and of course when ever the subject came up, I insisted that
>she come down to the beach so I could prove otherwise.

I had a girlfriend once who broke up with me the first time I visited a
nude beach while we were together.  She was convinced that the only reason
for being there *had* to be to "pick up" women.  When I said it wasn't
like that and refused to stop going she broke up.  When her friends,
coworkers, and family (including her mom) failed to support her
interpretation she relented and we got back together....with the under-
standing that she wouldn't worry about my choice of beach, but nor would
she ever join me.  (Breaking up was a standard part of her arguement
tactics, so it wasn't too traumatic to the relationship.)

Cheers. Bill.


-- 
Bill Arnett                            Internet: arnett@unixg.ubc.ca
From: hwt@bwdlh490.BNR.CA (Henry Troup)
Newsgroups: rec.nude
Subject: Re: Woman with bare breasts seen in NY city.
Date: 23 Jul 92 13:23:28 GMT
Reply-To: Henry.Troup@BNR.CA
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada

In article <1992Jul16.081134.12802@clarinet.com>, brad@clarinet.com
(Brad Templeton) writes:
|>unclothed human body for commercial purposes is immoral, when
|>the use of the clothed body is not?

In Ontario, specifically Kitchener-Waterloo, it's clear that the
unclothed female breast may only be displayed for the please (dare I say
titilation?) of males.  The same police force that arrested topfree
women for protesting has never interfered in the appearances of 'Lady
Godiva' during engineering school orientation.  Interesting double
standard, eh? But then Brad has met with UofW's notions of 'morality' before.
      
  Henry Troup - HWT@BNR.CA (Canada) - BNR owns but does not share my opinions
		      "Every absurdity has it's defender"
Newsgroups: rec.nude
From: scridd@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov
Subject: Re: Starting a Youth nudist group
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date: 23 Jul 1992 16:32 EST  

> 
>An aside -- When I was in high school back in the '60s, Regis Philbin (who
>worked for a TV station here in San Diego at the time) came to our school 
>and spoke on the evils of a magazine called "Teenage Nudists."
> 
From a title like that, it sounds like one of the horde of so-called
nudist magazines that appeared in the '60s following a Supreme Court
decision of 1958 that made it legal to send nudist magazines through the
mail.  After that decision a large number of magazines calling themselves
"nudist" appeared.  Some were legitimate.  Many were exploitative - just
an excuse to sell collections of pictures of naked people to those who
had a salacious interest in them.  Unfortunately this triggered a reaction
in the nudist community against nudist magazines in general, so nearly
all legitimate ones disappeared for a few years.  Eventually sexually
oriented material drove these other so-called nudist magazines out of the
market (with a few exceptions like some involving children).

Just a bit of history.

Jeff