HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mcook@mksol.dseg.ti.com (mark k cook)
Subject: Help X novice with XtVaAppInitialize on CONVEX computer
Keywords: X CONVEX Xt 
Organization: Texas Instruments
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 01:45:20 GMT

Can anyone help me (I'm a novice with X).  Programs that seem to call
XtAppInitialize or XtVaAppInitialize will not run on our CONVEX computer.
It fails with:



XIO:  fatal IO error 11 (Resources temporarily unavailable) on X server "(null)"
      after 0 requests (0 known processed) with 0 events remaining.



The code compiles and links w/o any errors.  In fact, one example that won't
work is the xhello.c program of O'Reilly that works fine on my SUN.

Note that I DO have my DISPLAY environment variable set properly, other routines
work fine.  Specifying the resource at runtime with

		xhello -display mysun:0 

results in the same error.

I'd certainly appreciate any clues.

						Thanks,
						Mark
						(mcook@lvips0.dseg.ti.com)
Xref: sparky comp.windows.x.intrinsics:130 comp.windows.x.motif:5177
From: gross@speedy.ada.cci.de (Arno Gross)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.intrinsics,comp.windows.x.motif
Subject: TopLevelShell, ApplicationShell
Date: 23 Jul 92 12:37:51 GMT
Followup-To: comp.windows.x.intrinsics
Distribution: eunet
Organization: Competence Center Informatik G.m.b.H.

We want to open two or more windows from one application.
The application should be ended after closing the last window.
All hints are welcome.
Thanks in advance.

Arno Gross, email: gross@cci.de
Subject: RS/6000 Ctrl/Act key
Organization: University of Maine System
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.intrinsics
From:    michael@maine.maine.edu (Michael Johnson)
To:      NETNEWS@MAINE
Date:    Thu, 23 Jul 92 09:37:55 EDT

In case anyone is wondering, this key maps (with the R5 sample server) to
XK_Execute.

Michael Johnson, VM Systems Group                     michael@maine.maine.edu
"I will choose the path that's clear. I will choose Free Will." -- Neil Peart
From: vaisanen@joyds2.joensuu.fi
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Date: 17 Jul 92 14:14 MDT
Subject: X and MIME based mail readers?
Nf-ID: #N:1992Jul17.101452.9501@cs.joensuu:1202404807:001:433
Nf-From: joyds2.joensuu.fi!vaisanen    Jul 17 14:14:00 1992


Hi!

I short question:

What are the public domain X Window based mail readers that can handle MIME?
The platforms I'm interested in are SunOS 4.x (also Solbourne) and ULTRIX 4.x.


Thanks,
	Jarmo


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jarmo Vaisanen          vaisanen@joyds2.Joensuu.FI      (Internet)
University of Joensuu   JVAISANEN@FINUJO                (EARN, BITNET)
Computer Center
Finland

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: mouse@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu (der Mouse)
Subject: Re: How to create a window which stays in front always ?
Organization: McGill Research Centre for Intelligent Machines
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 00:30:49 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.155546.15858@widget!uunet.uu.net>, mahesh@widget.evb.com (B.G. Mahesh) writes:

> I have created a window using XCreateSimpleWindow.  I want this
> window to be in front of all the window at all times.  I don't know
> the exact technical term used for such a thing.

As far as I know there isn't one.

> I dont't want other windows to overlap this window.  How do I do this
> ?

You probably don't really want this, first; for example, it makes it
very difficult to debug the application.  It is also rather antisocial;
I certainly know any application that started doing that on *my* screen
would get XKillClient()ed fairly quickly.  (Suppose two such
applications happened to be placed partially overlapping; they will
flood the whole session arguing with one another over who gets to be on
top.)

The only sure way is to turn on override-redirect for the window.  But
this means that, in effect, you are temporarily assuming
window-management duties while your window is up, so you want to do
this seldom and only for very short periods of time.  (Pop-up menus are
the only really good example of override-redirect windows I've seen.)

Aside from override-redirect windows, it's up to the window manager.
Depending on your window manager, you may or may not be able to set
this up.

					der Mouse

			    mouse@larry.mcrcim.mcgill.edu
From: hwrvo@kato.lahabra.chevron.com (W.R. Volz)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Re: X: User simplicity vs code complexity
Date: 24 Jul 92 15:52:36 GMT
Organization: Chevron Oil Field Research Company

In article <TPAQUETTE.92Jul23134924@gumby.ita.lgc.com>, tpaquette@ita.lgc.com (Trevor Paquette) writes:
|> 
|>    I was talking to a cohort at work and we got to the subject of X and how
|>  many lines of code it takes to do things in X etc..
|> 
|>    I came up with "X is the perfect example of User simplicity is directly
|>  proportional to code complexity." Do you agree/disagree with this statement
|>  and why?
|> 
|>  To open up a window, create a button, attach a callback to that button
|>  when pushed, released and held, while tracking the mouse, takes up a alot
|>  of lines of code. (Granted that will take alot of lines in any GFX system
|>  but most likely more in X then any other)
|> 
|>    To know X and all the in/outs of it takes about 8 700 page manuals (O'Reilly
|>  & Associate) to learn. Is there ANYONE out there who knows EVERYTHING in
|>  these manuals? X is difficult to learn to program with, basically because
|>  you don't know where to start!! There are many calls that do basically the
|>  same thing (XAllocColor vs XAllocColorCells).
|> 
|>    How big is X going to get? When will it stop getting bigger? Who created
|>  this monster in the first place? Oh well.. back to those manuals..
|> 
I'm not sure about this. Perhaps an direct relation between complexity and
flexibility. The more flexible code is, the more complex it is. X is quite
flexible ==> it also complex. In your example of creating a pushbutton,
you either using Xt or Xm. What would you have to do to same thing with
straight X? Probably a lot more. Consider that Motif has a series of
*Simple creation routines. I wonder why? The flexibility of Motif and Xt
made things more complex. so they simplfied. When writing code, a cohort
of mine errs on the side of simplicity rather than complexity. He's usually
right.

======================
Bill Volz
Chevron Oil Field Research Co.
Exploration Research/Geophysics Division.
P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446
Phone: (310) 694-9340
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: swispl@solomon.technet.sg (SW International)
Subject: Xconfig problem...
Organization: National University of Singapore
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 13:57:42 GMT


Dear All,

My dear ol' PC with Consensys Unix Sys V Rel 4, with X11R5 is not
"talking" to each other! I've got a Tsenglabs VGA4065 SVGA card in my PC
but when I run X, the get 2 little screen images huddling in the middle
of the display unit! From what I can figure its something to do with the
Xconfig file. The card, uses a Tseng Labs ET4000 VGA Chip (rev F).

Can someone please help me, by explaining to me what the contents of the
DBMode entries are (ie. the columns), and where can I get the
information so that I can get X to run on my PC. Alternatively, if you
have any information regarding the settings for the above SVGA card, I
would appreciate the settings for it. I would like to obtain maximum
resolution from the card.

Upon exit, one of the messages I get on the screen is:

	VGA256: et4000 (mem:1024k clocks: 25,28, 33, 36, 40, 45, 32, 38)

Makes sense to anyone?

By the way what is "interlaced" mode?

Thank you in advance.

Regards,

Alvino...
--
SW International Systems Pte Ltd     |  "I've got a plan so cunning 
    14, Science Park Drive           | you could put a tail on it and
    Singapore Science Park           | call it a weasel".. Black Adder
    Singapore 0511                   | 
    Tel: (65) 778-0066               |
    Fax: (65) 777-9401               | swispl@solomon.technet.sg
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: da188@city.ac.UK
Subject: Re: X Window Security
Reply-To: da188@city.ac.uk
Organization: The Internet
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 11:29:44 GMT


Speaking of security in X - what about the use of the `magic cookie'
security mechanism as well as the host access facility? We haven't
used it ourselves, but some sites do. The fact that there hasn't been
a major 'cracking' (not hacking!) incident is more a testament to the
good nature of people who use X than anything else ;-)

Aj.
-- 
.----------------------------[ The Eno ]----------------------------------.
| "The trouble with New Age       | JANET : da188@uk.ac.city              |
|  music is that there's no       |         da188@uk.ac.city.cs           |
|  evil in it."                   | I-NET : da188@city.ac.uk              |
|  - Brian Eno                    | US : da188%city.ac.uk@cunyvm.cuny.edu |
`-------------------------------------------------------------------------'
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: cp78085@csie.nctu.edu.tw (Tan Koan-Sin)
Subject: Re: keyboard repeat rate in X11R5
Organization: Dep. Computer Science & Engineering, Chiao Tung U.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 08:00:41 GMT

martin@trchp.eas.asu.edu (Ross Martin) writes:
: Does someone know how to change the keyboard repeat holdoff and
: keyboard repeat rate on a Sun running straight X11R5?
: 

see man of Xsun -ar1 -ar2

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Tan Koan-Sin ( Chen Guan-Chen)             |e-mail :       
 Computer Center			    | cp78085@csie.nctu.edu.tw
 Dept of Computer Science & Information Eng.| freedom@csie.nctu.edu.tw    
 National Chiao-Tung Univ., Hsin-chu        | freedom@voltaire.csie.nctu.edu.tw 
 Taiwan                                     | tel: 886-35-712121 ext 6430   
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: castor@athena.mit.edu (Carlos A. Rabell)
Subject: athena widgets, problem with toggle.
Keywords: toggle athena widgets xt
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 20:47:57 GMT

Hi!

I have a little problem with an application I'm developing, here goes.
I have a radio group containing two toggles.  I want to set one of the
toggles to be the current one, and then switch back to the original 
position.  I'm using XawToggleSetCurrent(radio_goup,radio_data) and it
doesn't do anything.  Is this function supposed to be equivalent to
clicking on the toggle itself or not?  Any ideas? Please help...

Thanks,

Charlie Rabell
--------------
castor@athena.mit.edu
castor@media-lab.media.mit.edu
From: mouse@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Date: 18 Jul 92 17:09 MDT
Subject: Re: Twm
Nf-ID: #R:1992Jul17.143335.27609@syma.suss:1233664304:1992Jul18.130934.17668@thunder.m:-2001449044:001:489
Nf-From: thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu!mouse    Jul 18 17:09:00 1992


In article <1992Jul16.135236.14295@syma.sussex.ac.uk>, kierant@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Kieran Turner) writes:

> Just a quick query - anybody know if it would be _possible_ to make a
> patch for twm that could de-iconify on tty output to an xterm?

It is not.  twm has no opportunity to find out when output to an xterm
occurs.  You'd have to make the patches to xterm, not twm.

And yes, if you're willing to hack on xterm, it's possible.

					der Mouse

			    mouse@larry.mcrcim.mcgill.edu

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: chris@ods.com (Chris Atkins)
Subject: Re: Changing keymappings on a per-application basis
Organization: Optical Data Systems, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 18:48:34 GMT

fmrco!msommer@uunet.uu.net (Mark Sommer) writes:
: I would like to run a terminal-based application, requiring special
: keyboard keypad mappings, inside an xterm. 
: 
: Is there a way to change the keyboard mappings -- and later restore
: them -- for a single xterm? I would like to be able to do this from a
: script, but would settle for doing it from a program. It would also be
: reasonable to dedicate a particular xterm to running this application
: -- as opposed to an arbitrary xterm -- if that makes the problem
: tractable. If I can't do this, can I change/restore the mappings for all
: xterms? 
: 

XChangeKeyboardMapping changes the keycode to keysym mapping for all clients
on the server.  You might look at using XGetKeyboardMapping to get the original
keyboard mapping on enter notify events and restore it on leave notify events.

Chris Atkins
chris@ods.com
From: 81264@novell1.rz.fht-mannheim.de (Rainer Schiele)
Subject: PEX Documents
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 11:40:21 GMT
Organization: Fachhochschule fuer Technik Mannheim

Hello out there

I have the X11R5 Server with the PEX extension and wish to know how i can 
get on the Function to Draw and shade with phigs. What i need to do this? 
Gives it some Documents or something. Are the PEXlib requiered? I know a lot 
of Questions but dont't know where i get the answers !

Thank you Rainer
From: hersh@expo.lcs.mit.edu (Jay Hersh)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
Subject: Re: O'Reilly examples kick me out of X
Keywords: PHIGS, X
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:09:20 GMT
Article-I.D.: xenon.hersh.711907760
Organization: X Consortium, MIT Laboratory for Computer Science

najafi@hood.ee.umn.edu (Hossein Lari-Najafi) writes:

>I got the source code for the examples in the PHIGS Programming Manual, 
>Published by O'Reilly & Associates.  After compilation, when I run the
>programs, sometimes they kick me out of X.  Sometimes, when I use the
>xdbx and sigle step execute the program this problem goes away.

>If you had similar problems, know what it is, or have a solution for it
>please let me know.

>Thnk you so much.

>Hossein Larinajafi (Ph.D.)
>1054A 27th Ave. S.E.
>Mpls., MN, 554141

>E-mail(U of M)  : najafi@everest.ee.umn.edu
>E-mail(UWRF)    : mcf_lari@uwrf.edu

>Phone:  (612) 379-9031
>	(612) 625-2859


What do you mean "kick you out of X", does your connection to the 
server break?? Does your server crash?? Whose server are you running
and on what platform (if you're running MIT X11R5 it helps to know
what hardware)?? Whose PHIGS API are you using??

Sorry but you've provided virtually no useful info for folks out here
to try to help you. 

	Jay Hersh
	MIT X Consortium

--
Hopfen und Malz, Gott erhalts
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: khuhner@eng.auburn.edu (Kurt E. Huhner)
Subject: PHIGS 2.0 Performance???
Keywords: PHIGS 2.0
Organization: Auburn University Engineering
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 01:34:11 GMT


Why in the world is PHIGS 2.0 so SLOW??? I am running a simple 3D graphics
simulation and the screen paints terribly slow.  Any ideas, or if this is common place?  Please send me some info soon...

Kurt

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: jarl@hsr.no (Jarl Haugland)
Subject: Re: On-Line Reference for PHIGS functions/structs
Organization: Rogaland University Centre
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 13:12:47 GMT

In article <63918@hydra.gatech.EDU>, gt8166a@prism.gatech.EDU (DOERSCHUK,DAVID OAKES) writes:
> I am taking a graphical interfaces class, and the system being
> used is PHIGS on Sun ipc machines.  I'm having a difficult time
> of it, in part because the text ("A Practical Introduction to
> PHIGS and PHIGS PLUS", by T.L.J. Howard, et.al. c.1991) does not
> seem to use the same names for functions, structures, and #defines
> as Sun PHIGS does.  I'm told that our version of Sun PHIGS is the
> most recent, although I can't find the version number by grepping
> the .h files for "ersion" and "ev" ({V|v}ersion and {R|r}ev). 
> 
> Is there an electronic version of the Reference Manual, or at 
> least a detailed list of the functions/structs/#defines and
> their meanings/usage?  I'm using the phigsextern.h file as a
> syntax model for function calls, but at my level of competence
> thats not enough information.
> 
I've been using the same book as you refer, and have met the same problems.
Seems like you are using SunPHIGS, while I am using the PHIGS API supplied
with MIT's X11R5. As far as I know both of these use the same naming-conventions.

My solotion to overcome these problems has been to use the PHIGS reference
manual pages supplied with X11R5 (in the mit/doc/extensions/PEX/SI/PHIGS catalog).
Here you will find man-pages for every PHIGS-function, with description of
datastructures etc. If you put "underscores" in the function-names provided
in the "T.L.J. Howard..." book you get most of the names correct. See the man-
pages for details.

If you don't have the X11R5 code it might be ftp'ed from "export.lcs.mit.edu"

-- 
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
/ Jarl Haugland                  | E-mail: jarl@hsr.no   | The cost of living \
/ Rogaland University Center     | Tlf:    +47-4-874432  | hasn't affected    \
/ Stavanger, NORWAY              | Fax:    +47-4-874300  | its popularity.    \
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
From: chauffau@irisa.fr (Alain Chauffaut, Projet Siames, Bur. NB147, Tel. 7263)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
Subject: Re: c++ and PHIGS
Date: 28 Jul 92 08:16:33 GMT
Reply-To: chauffau@irisa.fr
Organization: IRISA, Rennes, France

In article 22379@news2.cis.umn.edu, najafi@hood.ee.umn.edu (Hossein Lari-Najafi) writes:
>>I am trying to use PHIGS for very simple animation in a c++ software
>>package.  Since the PHIGS header files do not follow the sintax of
>>c++, I am unable to integrate my c++ package and the PHIGS routins.
>>
>>I would very much appreciate any help in this regard.
>>
>>	* have used PHIGS in a c++ environment

In a current work -a mechanismes modelling system-, we mix C++, PHIGS et X11.

We use a french phigs version gphigs from
 G5G SARL P.A. Chateau Rouquey                
 BP 168 33708 MERIGNAC CEDEX (FRANCE)

We wrote a gphigs_C++.h to access phigs C functions from a C++ program:

extern "C"{
	void  popph(Pchar*,Plong);
	void  pclph();
	void  popwk(Pint,Pchar*,Pint);
	void  pclwk(Pint);
...


>>	* or, have a simple animation package

For X11, we use the Sun XView toolkit (a contrib to the X11 MIT distribution).
XView demos provide an example of animation using the unix signals.

---


	Alain CHAUFFAUT		|	Tel:	99 84 72 63
	IRISA/INRIA de Rennes	|		(Standard 99 84 71 00)
	Campus de Beaulieu	|	Fax:	99 38 38 32
	35042 Rennes Cedex	|	Tlx:	950473F
	FRANCE			|	@mail:	chauffau@irisa.irisa.fr
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: sbhatia@mary.fordham.edu (SABU)
Subject: PHIGS WORKSTATIONS AND phigs state diagrams.
Organization: Fordham University
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 14:55:00 GMT
X-Posted-From: mary.fordham.edu
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

Hi,

    I am very new to PHIGS, and as I continue to discover PHIGS I seem
to be getting very confused about what exactly is a workstation in
PHIGS. Is a workstation in PHIGS a physical resource such as a terminal,
or a remore system etc? If not what exactly is meant by "WORKSTATION".


Secondly in PHIGS we have-:
                   PHIGS,
                   WORKSTATION
                   STRUCTURE
                   ARCHIVE,

My understanding of the above mentioned is that in order to use
a wokstation we musty have phigs open similar is the case
with structure and archive. but what happens from workstation
downwards. Within each of the three subordinate states (W, S , A) can
we open an instance of any of the three state? I would appreciate
it if someone could explain to me the structure of these states and
their inter relationship, or indicate some resource (book, or ftp site)
where I can get some decent information.


regards,

sabu,

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
/   Internet:  SBHATIA@mary.fordham.edu                                /
/   BITnet:    SBHATIA@FORDMULC                                        /
/                                                                      /
/                                                                      /
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
From: lilleyc@cs.man.ac.uk (Chris Lilley)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
Subject: Re: On-Line Reference for PHIGS functions/structs
Date: 21 Jul 92 16:45:57 GMT
Reply-To: lilleyc@cs.man.ac.uk (Chris Lilley)
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Manchester UK

In article <63918@hydra.gatech.EDU> gt8166a@prism.gatech.EDU (DOERSCHUK,DAVID OAKES) writes:

>I am taking a graphical interfaces class, and the system being
>used is PHIGS on Sun ipc machines.  I'm having a difficult time
>of it, in part because the text ("A Practical Introduction to
>PHIGS and PHIGS PLUS", by T.L.J. Howard, et.al. c.1991) does not
>seem to use the same names for functions, structures, and #defines
>as Sun PHIGS does.  I'm told that our version of Sun PHIGS is the
>most recent, although I can't find the version number by grepping
>the .h files for "ersion" and "ev" ({V|v}ersion and {R|r}ev). 

You are using SunPHIGS 2.0 (or later, possibly). This was the first version
to use the recently released ISO C binding to PHIGS. Previously, there was
no standard binding to use PHIGS from C, so each vendor made up their own.

The Howard et al book was published in 1991, before the ISO C binding was
published. Therefore, although it uses SunPHIGS, it uses the previous
binding. The actual concepts in the book are still valid. In many cases the
function names have simply changed by having underscores added.

There is a script supplied with SunPHIGS2.0 to convert the old SunPHIGS C
binding to ISO C. You could run that over any examples that use the old
bindings. 

There are man pages for the phigs functions. So, for example, you can type:

man popen_phigs

and get a page of description. You will need to make sure your manpath is
appropriately set up, depending on where your system administrator has put
the PHIGS man pages.

>Dave Doerschuk
>Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
>uucp:	  ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt8166a
>Internet: gt8166a@prism.gatech.edu

Chris Lilley			lilley@cgu.mcc.ac.uk
Computer Graphics Unit, University of Manchester, UK
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: gad@kpc.com (Gerard Denga - Consultant)
Subject: MIT PHIGS <-> DEC PHIGS
Organization: Kubota Pacific Computer Inc, Santa Clara, CA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 16:55:40 GMT

	In the C binding, is there a set of functions or macros to
	allow use of functions named differently, eg: popen_phigs(MIT)
	as popenphigs(DEC)? Please reply to this newsgroup.

		Thanks.
			Gerard
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: najafi@hood.ee.umn.edu (Hossein Lari-Najafi)
Subject: O'Reilly examples kick me out of X
Keywords: PHIGS, X
Organization: University of Minnesota, Minneapolis, EE dept.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 20:53:51 GMT

I got the source code for the examples in the PHIGS Programming Manual, 
Published by O'Reilly & Associates.  After compilation, when I run the
programs, sometimes they kick me out of X.  Sometimes, when I use the
xdbx and sigle step execute the program this problem goes away.

If you had similar problems, know what it is, or have a solution for it
please let me know.

Thnk you so much.

Hossein Larinajafi (Ph.D.)
1054A 27th Ave. S.E.
Mpls., MN, 554141

E-mail(U of M)  : najafi@everest.ee.umn.edu
E-mail(UWRF)    : mcf_lari@uwrf.edu

Phone:  (612) 379-9031
	(612) 625-2859

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex
From: luj@ecn.purdue.edu (John Lu)
Subject: Re: PHIGS Call for Participation
Reply-To: luj@ecn.purdue.edu
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computing Network
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:19:45 GMT

Anything up for PHIGS during the coming SIGGRAPH at Chicago ?

-- 
-- John Lu 
   luj@ecn.purdue.edu
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.pex