From: nyikos@math.scarolina.edu (Peter Nyikos)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion
Subject: Re: I had an abortion two days ago
Date: 4 Oct 92 02:29:51 GMT
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science

In <1992Sep28.185424.11474@pwcs.stpaul.gov> chrisl@stpaul.gov (Chris A Lyman) writes:

>nyikos@math.scarolina.edu (Peter Nyikos) writes:
>> ren@Turing.ORG (Karen Prestemon) writes:

>>> As the subject line says, I had an abortion on Tuesday.  I guess I was about
>>> 8weeks along, I don't know.  I went to the clinic two weeks ago to have it
>>> done, but the pregnancy was so early that my urine test was negative.  I had
>>> failed two home tests, so that's how I knew.

>> A preliminary comment: from the description below it would seem that
>> anesthesia was not given.  I wonder whether this was a Planned Parenthood
>> clinic, and how much they charged for a miserable little urine test.

>Argumentum ad ignorantum again, eh Peter?  If it was a PP clinic, you should
>know that they have a sliding fee based on ability to pay.

I think you meant to say, "Argumentum *ab* ignorantium."  Anyway, I knew
about the sliding scales, I just did not want to go into details.  The
biggest "slide" of all (upward) comes if the insurance pays for it.
And guess WHOSE
insurance money pays for it?  Yours and mine and hers and everybody
else's, if we happen to be on the same plan.  

I lumped all this together, but I mostly had in mind how much OUR
insurance paid for it.

Now, if she had gone to a pro-life crisis pregnancy center, she
could have had the same urine test for FREE. 

So you see, without realizing it, you pro-choicers are forcing YOUR
values on US.

>> At the rates Planned Parenthood charges for these, one would think it
>> could give a blood test, reliable as early as two weeks after fertilization.

>Why make an issue over charges for medical procedures?  If you have a point,
>I'd like for you to talk to my dentist about the bill for my crown.

See my responses above.  Believe it or not, I made them before I saw this!

>>> I am not pleased with myself.  I am not posting this to brag.  For one
>>> thing, the abortion itself was the most physical pain I have ever felt in 
>>> my life (I'm sure there are some of you who are satisfied by that). 

>> I sure am not, it is one of the things I am angry at abortion mills for,
>> not offering anesthesia as a matter of course.  As one can gather from
>> my SUFFERING OF SOME... post and follow-ups, I care very much about
>> women going through abortion, and this post only reinforces that 
>> attitude.

>You still haven't proven that PP clinics do not offer anesthesia. 

Note, I said, *as a matter of course*.  They do make it an option, BUT
I would be surprised if there was anywhere near the range of options
one gets with childbirth: general, epidural, cervical, pudendal. 

> Remember
>making that assertion and then dropping it? 

I never made THAT assertion.  I said *some* PP clinics do not offer it,
then retracted even that statement, replacing it with the one you see
above.  You just never saw the retraction.
(I even made it in two different posts!)
  A pity, since you and 
Margolis have been claiming that I make all sorts of admissions I did
not make, then missing the one I DID make!

> Btw, the root canal therapy I
>underwent 10 years ago was the most excruciating pain _I've_ ever gone
>through, and that includes getting stitches without novacaine.  Shall we
>express some self-righteous anger at the dentistry mills now?

I have plenty of anger at dentists for all kinds of reasons, but
this is not talk.dentistry.

Peter Nyikos
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,talk.religion.misc,alt.atheism