HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: primeaux@carlsberg.cs.utk.edu (David Primeaux)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: On the breeds' original purposes
Date: 21 Dec 1992 15:43:22 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee, Knoxville - Department of Computer Science
Distribution: world
Reply-To: primeaux@carlsberg.cs.utk.edu (David Primeaux)
NNTP-Posting-Host: carlsberg.cs.utk.edu

In this newsgroup I have frequently seen references to the original purposes
of various breeds.  Usually these references are about hunting breeds and either
state or imply that to breed dog X which demonstrates poor Y instinct is bad since
to do such would "harm" the breed.

Toss up for discussion:  Are the original purposes of the breed so sacrosanct
that they can not evolve to match today's purposes of the breed?

For the record:  I do not believe they are, but I am interested in hearing
other perspectives -- particularly those which go beyond "but where do you 
then draw the line on allowing change in breed specification?"

Since I own dalmatians, I offer a (rhetorical) followup question:  If my 
dalmatian is a wonderful example of the breed in every respect except that
she will not (or can't) run for long distances alongside a carriage (her breed's
original job), would breeding her harm the breed? Note that the question is 
entirely rhetorical, since she is spayed.

And a Merry Christmas, Happy Chanukka, Best New Year to all!
david
primeaux@cs.utk.edu
From: sparkle@access.digex.com (Pat)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Paw problems
Date: 31 Dec 1992 19:23:57 GMT
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

In article <1hv6fkINN4cm@crcnis1.unl.edu> jorr@hoss.unl.edu (John Orr) writes:
>In the last few weeks, though, he's developed sores between
>the toes of both his back paws. The sores are in the same position
>on both paws; on the inside side of the second toe from the middle.
>
>When I took him to the vet the first time, the vet thought it 
>was a skin infection and gave him antibiotics. This didn't do 
>any good, and on a second visit he didn't suggest any treatment 
>at all. 
>
>--John

Could you possibly take him to another vet?  There should be 
a solution to your problem.
 
I'm afraid that I wouldn't rest until I had an expert opinion
WITH a workable treatment.  

The poor guy is probably extremely uncomfortable.  A good vet
should be able to help.

Pat
From: mlhb@mammoth.dr.att.com (Sky Warrior)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Netiquette
Date: 21 Dec 92 17:33:05 GMT
Reply-To: mlhb@drutx!att.com
Organization: Bell Labs, DCTT, Denver, Co.

In article <9212182326.AA2182@f723.n202.z1.fidonet.org>, ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org writes:
|> 
|>  > Really Elaine?  Inadvertant?  Nobody will believe that for a
|>  > moment as we
|>  > all know the rn program and email are two distinct programs
|>  > and you would have to
|>  > specify the file name.  Perhaps your system is different, but
|>  > I doubt it.
|>  > 
|>  > Look, maybe I haven't made myself as clear the last time I
|>  > emailed a gentle
|>  > warning, but nobody likes a self-righteous snob.  Your
|>  > information is many
|>  > times errroneous and sounds like it should be taken as the
|>  > gospel truth.  Most
|>  > people, including myself, tend to tone our advice down as
|>  > just that: advice.
|>  > Think of all the damage you will cause if a new person who
|>  > comes on r.p.d
|>  > with a problem and you give them your diatribe which is
|>  > actually opinions in
|>  > the guise of facts.  If you haven't noticed, I usually give
|>  > them my opinion
|>  > and say that my advice has worked for me in the past, but I
|>  > also tell them to
|>  > consult a professional (vet, trainer, etc).
|>  > 
|>  > Just a thought.
|>  > 
|>   God help the person with minority opinions, huh?  So now in
|> addition, I am also a liar.  Yeah, that's it.  I'm Lying when I tell
|> people that I have only limitted access to net mail.... that from
|> here, it's not private by any means, and it passes through several
|> hands before it every reaches the newgroup.
|>   So it Couldn't Possibly be that there is more than one way to look
|> at things.  No, that couldn't be right, 
|> 'cause now in addition to All my other shortcomings, I am also a liar.
|> --- FMail 0.92
|>  * Origin: HILLCREST COMMUNITY BBS, SAN DIEGO: HST 619-291-0544 (1:202/703)


Gee, Elaine, thanks for posting a PRIVATE E-MAIL MESSAGE across the entire
net.  I decided to send you a private message in case I was wrong,
and you post it to the whole universe.  Obviously, I can't trust you to
obey simple netiquette.  You're in my author kill file from now on.

-- 
-----------------------------                                              
SKY WARRIOR aka MLH Bonham  | "Good tea.  Nice House." -- Lt. Worf
mammoth!mlhb@druhi.att.com  |----------------------------------------------
mlhb@drutx.ATT.COM          | SKY WARRIOR RACING KENNELS - Coming to an
                            | Iditarod near you!
-----------------------------
From: CBARNES@tamvm1.tamu.edu (Chris Barnes)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: On the breeds' original purposes
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 15:25:09 CST
Organization: Texas A&M University
NNTP-Posting-Host: tamvm1.tamu.edu

In article <1h5965INN2v1@CS.UTK.EDU=>
   primeaux@carlsberg.cs.utk.edu (David Primeaux) writes:
 
=> The "in effect serving the same purpose" seems a bit slippery to me, despite
=> the example Chris gives.
 
Well, that's always the problem with hypothetical senerios - the examples
frequently don't quite fit.  Alas, I tried....  :-)
 
 
=> Let's get back to dalmatians, for example. And let's
=> for the sake of argument that the original purpose of the breed was to run for
=> long distances alongside a carriage.  Being a carriage dog is perhaps a trifle
=> archaic, agreed?  So we have a breed whose original purpose is passe. Some might
=> argue that the breed is no longer needed (I won't, and apparently Chris won't
=> either -- although I hesitate to put words into his mouth).  Others might argue
=> that the breed is needed so long as someone somewhere is willing to still get in
=> a carriage and run these dogs so that they can be tested (with regard to original
=> purpose) for fitness to breed.  Another alternative is the one that I *think* Chris
=> might champion is that they should be tested in performance of some task that is
=> "in effect serving the same purpose."  Running alongside cars is one such task
=> that comes to mind.  In my mind this would present a clear and evident danger to
=> such dogs, I don't want to be unfair about the issue.  What would a safe, suitable
=> task "in effect serving the same purpose" be for a dalmatian?
=>
=> My opinion:  if the original purpose of the breed is archaic and the breed is
=> still valued for other purposes -- such as disposition or color or size or whatever
=> -- dogs of that breed can and *ought* to be bred with those values in mind.
=>
=> My opinion, one step further:  if the original purpose of the breed is archaic
=> to some people but they still value the breed for other purposes (as above),
=> -- dogs of that breed can and *ought* to be bred with those values in mind.  I point
=> out (*not* to start a flame war, but only to illustrate with a controversial example)
=> that some people consider hunting archaic (I have been known to hunt, so don't
=> bother flaming me for this observation.).
 
You make a compelling argument, but it has a serious flaw.....ANYTHING
a dog could do COULD be considered to be archaic.  I might find very
little use in having a dog that runs beside a carrage, but far be it
from me to prevent someone else from doing something they enjoy.  After
all, if I do that, someone may do it to me someday......!
 
And with hundreds of different breeds to choose from, surely there is
one that already suits a particular function without having to change
another.
 
      -----------------------------------------------------
Chris Barnes            |   President - Bryan/College Station
cbarnes@tamvm1.tamu.edu |         Retriever Club.
(409) 846-3273 (home)   |   "Dedicated to the betterment of
(409) 845-4437 (work)   |               the retrieving breeds"
Organization: Arizona State University
Date: Wednesday, 30 Dec 1992 09:15:03 MST
From: <IDMLH@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject:    Bad Beagle Problems

My husband and I have a 1 yr. old female Beagle who is to say the least
an obnoxious child!  Since going into her first heat about 6 months ago
she's actually gotten better, but we're still having tremendous problems
disciplining her.

She prefers not to listen to our commands.  She will go out into the back
yard at 10pm and bark for 10 minutes straight and will ignore our commands
unless we insert the "t" word (treat).  There are many, many other instances
and examples I could write...but I don't want to write too much!  So,
if anyone has any suggestions as to what to do...please tell me!!!!
From: deniseo@hpmwtd.sr.hp.com (Denise O'Connor)
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 22:22:12 GMT
Subject: House/Pet Sitting Pay?
Organization: HP Santa Rosa Site (SRSD MWTD)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs

 Pet Sitting:
 I am planning on taking a two week vacation and am
 trying to figure out what to do with my pets while
 I am gone.  Its been so long since I took a real
 vacation that I haven't had to deal with this problem.

 I have two house dogs (Rotts), a house cat, 2 llamas, and 
 lots of mice (the mice are easy, just spill some llama
 grain).

 I was wanting to have someone house sit for me and
 take care of the animals.  I have someone in mind
 but what should I pay them?

 Any suggestions on what the going rate is for paying
 house/pet sitters?
From: trimpe_b@wums.wustl.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: RE: biking with a dog
Date: 3 JAN 93 16:02:17 GMT
Organization: MIT PLASMA FUSION CENTER
NNTP-Posting-Host: msnews.wustl.edu

In a previous article, laird@stable.ecn.purdue.edu (Kyler Laird) wrote:
>I don't have it too handy, but I've seen an ad for a device that
>attaches to a bike and a dog (for running the dog).  It looks like
>a piece of serpentine spring steel.  Is that it?  A spring?
>I'd like to fashion one this weekend; it doesn't necessarily need
>to be like the commercial model.  If anyone has suggestions or can
>tell me what some problems encountered when biking with a dog are,
>I'd appreciate the help.
>(I assume the obvious one is getting yanked into the ground, but
>that seems more of a training point.  Having the leash get tangled
>in the pedals/spokes is more the type of problem I'm trying to avoid.)
>Thanks!
>--kyler 
>BTW, what I'm currently considering is a long coil spring attached
>to the seat stem.  The lead would attach to the end of the spring.
>I'm tempted to use a body harness, but that might encourage pulling.
>I'd rather not use a choker, but have thought about attaching a
>piezo buzzer to the harness such that it would sound when pulled on.

I'm not sure I have any good engineering suggestons but the phone
number for the SPRINGER is 1-800-BIKEK9S.  THE marketed version is aobut 55$.  
If I recall correctly one of the important points is to not only have the 
dogs direction of movement "buffered" by a spring but also to have that
movemment(force, vector) closer to the ground.  That is -the height at which
the dog is attached to the bike (on the bike) is important.  Am I clear as
mudd?
Bt
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: Valaria_Vorlop@mindlink.bc.ca (Valaria Vorlop)
Subject: Re: dogs and computers
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 20:45:51 GMT

> Evelyn S. Hlabse writes:
> I am curious as to whether anyone has a dog who recognizes the
> noises made by computers.  Whenever I am working (playing?) on my
> computer at home, Digory comes in and lies under the table.  As
> soon as I start to shut down for the evening my Mac makes some
> strange noises and Digory immediately gets up and heads either for
> his bed or my bedroom whichever room I happen to be headed to.  He
> seems to be able to sense which I am going to do.  Does anyone else
> have similar experiences?


Yup! The dog's are up before I am when I switch the computer off. Sometimes I
have to do a cold boot and I confuse them :) If I get up for a drink without
switching off, they don't move 'cos they know I will be right back.

--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *   ********************************************
Valaria_Vorlop@mindlink.bc.ca   *For YEARS I wondered what ceiling wax was.*
or:      a4080@mindlink.bc.ca   ********************************************
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *                        *******
Date: Wednesday, 23 Dec 1992 13:42:11 MST
From: <AOAFF@ASUACAD.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Flexi Tie-Out: Does it work?
 <BzMLFH.I6t@well.sf.ca.us> <1h5pktINNp6i@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>

In article <1h5pktINNp6i@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, ce293@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Gail
E. Brookhart) says:
>
>Look instead for plastic coated aircraft cable.  I have seen it come as
>strong as 1000 pound tensile strength and that is what I bought for my
>Airedale.  His muscles are nearly as thick as the one between his ears
><grin> and he has not been able to damage the cable.

Overhead it is probably fine, but my lab broke this 1000 pound aircraft
cable, when used on the ground. My guess is that the plastic coating and
stranded wire inside cracked and frayed from kinking and friction against
a cement edge. Sure surprised me, and I never noticed any fraying.
I think the tensile strength just applies to pulling strength, and can
be misleading when you consider other forces such as curling and friction.

This time I went to a hardware store and bought medium sized link chain.
It is heavier but I'm sure it will never break. Allen
From: ALI00JEV@UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU (Judith Van Noate)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Flexi Tie-Out: Does it work?
Date: 21 Dec 92 21:35:22 GMT
Organization: UNC Charlotte

In article <BzMLFH.I6t@well.sf.ca.us>
casey@well.sf.ca.us (Kathleen Creighton) writes:
 
>
>
>>attach (tether to overhead line) to dog's *buckle* collar
>
>No way.  Harness only.  Have you ever seen a running dog hauled up by
>the neck?  Very scary.  Why not be safe?
 
I put my runaway Cheska (GSP) on a chain attached to a non-restrictive
tracking harness which I bought from RC Steele.  She unfortunately
is currently (only when I'm at home) chained *inside* the fenced in
yard.  I give her yard freedom when I'm out there to watch her.
This harness is adjustable so can be used on different sized dogs--
I think I got a medium.  It is very sturdy and looks quite comfortable.
I would like to try the overhead "trolley" and would like more info
on the kind of wire you (sorry I don't remember who) said you got at
the hardware store.  Can you get it in varying lengths?  You said wire
covered with plastic.  Is it really sturdy?  I understand about the
metal ring.  How exactly do you attach the wire to the tree?  Cheska
basically just sits in one place when she chained up but I really don't
trust her at all not to escape.  I just had a terrible episode with her
last Saturday night--it took an hour to catch her in the dark in the
woods behind my house.  I live on a busy street in front and am
terrified that she is going to get smashed.  In this case she
jumped out of my van, but from now on she will be instantly crated
when she's put in the van.  I wholeheartedly second the idea of the
harness.  This particular one--made by Coastal--is just great.
Judith
From: szeff@informix.com (Sharon Zeff)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Opinions on breed
Date: 28 Dec 92 20:04:41 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.
Originator: szeff@chico


> Item #2 is incompatible with #3 and #4.  #3 because a good hunter will
> require lots of excersise - and that means more than just a walk after
> you get home from work.  Staying in an apartment/crate all day will not
> give the dog the excersise it would need (even for small hunting dogs).
> #4 is incompatible simply because I would consider it cruel to keep a
> large dog in an apartment all day (actually, I wouldn't sell ANY breed
> of dog to someone that lived in an apartment).
>  
> .soapbox off

Sorry, this is the first time that I have ever felt compelled to post
a flame, but you have to be kidding.  I have a greyhound and live in
a condo, no backyard or anything.  Everyday I take my dog for a five
mile jog, every evening after work I take the my dog for a long walk
1-2 miles, before bed we go on a walk again.  When I can, I take her
to an off leash area.  My dog is pure muscle.  Oh, I almost forgot
our evening playtime, which last as long as she does.  She has free
run of the condo at all times, on nice days she has access to the 
balcony.  I know of other dogs in my complex who also seem to be
doing just fine.  I think the living space is somewhat irrelevant if the
dog is properly exercised and cared for.   I know of dogs that are kept
only in the backyard and I know beyond a doubt those dogs are not as
happy as mine is, better to be in a loving home with someone to take
care of you then pushed off to a backyard with no one to play with.

I feel better now.

Sharon
szeff@informix.com
From: drg@biomath.mda.uth.tmc.edu (David Gutierrez)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: SPCA Ethics, Am I Overreacting?
Date: 22 Dec 1992 20:45:15 GMT
Organization: Univ. Texas M.D. Anderson Cancer Center

In article <1992Dec21.201025.850@dracut.keps.com> sue@dracut.keps.com (Sue
Klimowicz) writes:
>I
>personnally am not impressed with the SPCA and prefer the Humane Societies

Here in Houston, we have the opposite situation. The SPCA is pretty good and
the Humane Society is the poorly-staffed, under-funded outfit. They have about
8 wire cages for dogs, which are jammed into the cages past their capacity.
Every so often, the SPCA "rescues" dogs from the Humane Society.

David Gutierrez
drg@biomath.mda.uth.tmc.edu

"Only fools are positive." - Moe Howard

Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: ALI00JEV@UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU (Judith Van Noate)
Subject: Re: Is She Done Growing?
Organization: UNC Charlotte
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 14:55:47 GMT

In article <1hriunINNdps@gw.home.vix.com>
shedevil@vix.com (Anne P. Mitchell JD) writes:
 
>
>
>So, our *newest* foundling [what?  I haven't told you all about Nika
>yet??..oh dear..I must do..she is an incredibly sweet lab/akita
>cross...
>the poor thing's name was *Potlicker*..but now it is Nika.  She
>was an outdoor-back-up-in-the-mountains dog until now..she seems to be
>*very* happy to have a nice warm loving (and dry!) home to sleep in,
>and she and Tazi have become fast friends in the space of about 2
>hours]
>..anyway, Nika is about 8 months old, and as I mentioned, she is a
>lab/akita cross...her mother is the lab...her father is a 100lb akita.
>
>She is already about..er..I think it was 64 pounds...both her previous
>owner (for whatever *that's* worth) and a fairly dog-knowledgable
>friend of mine seem to think that Nika is done growing.  *I* think
>she has a ways to go yet, if the paw/body ratio is a true indicator..
>her paws are still quite large compared to the rest of her body...
>her ears, which are lab-style, seem to be in proportion.
>
>So what I'm wondering, is there some kind of general rule of thumb, or
>even some kind of breed-specific rule of thumb, as to when a dog will
>have pretty much stopped growing by?
>
Large breed dogs take longer to mature and grow than small ones.  So
she probably will put on a few more pounds, maybe twenty pounds more
and an inch or so in height.  Just guessing, it could be more.
 
>
>Also, if she *is* possibly still growing, what should I be feeding her?
>Right now I am feeding her what I feed Tazi [who is about 18 months
>old or
>so], which is Science Diet Light Maintainance, along with some kind of
>moist chunk things and some milk or broth mixed in during the dinner
>
I would definitely put the pup (I know she doesn't look like one) on a
higer protein/fat diet--a puppy diet or an active/performance diet until
she is at least a year old.  But do be careful not to let her get fat.
Labs are genetically prone to put weight on easily, so if she got the
lab gene for being an "easy keeper" she might be prone to overweight later
in life.  Anyway, pup needs puppy food for now IMO.
Glad you got her and can give her a good home.
Judith
>
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: lfarrell@lfarrell.src.utah.edu (Laura Farrell)
Subject: Royal Size Poodle??
Organization: University of Utah
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 18:09:45 GMT

Royal size poodle (bigger than a standard), is there such a thing?

I was looking for a standard poodle a month or so ago (I now have a
fantastically fun toy poodle pup named Scooby), but could not find
what I was looking for.  I was basing my search on a standard poodle
my parents had several years ago, and Ginger was big.  I am not sure how
many inches, but here siblings were champions so they must have been
within AKC standards.  In comparison all the poodles I looked at durning my 
search seemed very small, they stood nowhere near as tall as our Ginger 
did.  Another indicator that the standards were smaller was that I know for 
sure that Ginger was 70 - 75 lbs, and she was no porker, very 
well built and good weight, but the standard poodles I hear about and I saw 
were only 45 - 60 lbs (?).

Anyway, someone mentioned to me that there is a Royal size in poodles,
28" - 30" or something like that.  Has anybody heard of such a thing? 
Would a poodle of this size be showable?  Unfortunately the breeder
we got Ginger from in Las Vegas is no longer breeding.  Does anyone
know of a breeder of Royal or large standard poodles?  I am really
curious.  

Thanks for any info.

Laura and Scooby
From: shazam@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Coon Hunting
Date: 3 Jan 93 07:02:29 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club

In regards to the question about Coon hunting......I can only relay
to you *my* personal experiences with Coon Hunting, but here in
the South *smile*, in Mississippi.....when I was a little girl 
growing up, that was....and still is today, a big sport in Jasper
County.  And so is Fox Hunting.....neither require or use horses.
*smile*  Anyway......for Coon Hunting the coon is treed and that is it.
My uncles are the ones who loved it so and they never killed the
coon or cut down the trees.  I have read that some do.  But I wanted
to tell you that that is not a *common* practice, at least not here.

Fox Hunting is a different story.....here, and most everywhere I 
have read, the hunt goes on until the dogs either finally catch the 
poor, tired fox, or the sly one gets away, whichever happsn first.

Hope that helps some....but I bet you will get different stories
from different areas of the country...this is one from the South 
for you...Mississippi to be exact.  *smile*

Suzanne
From: gailh@aupair.cs.athabascau.ca (Gail Humphreys)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: vacationing with dogs
Date: 1 Jan 93 18:56:51 GMT

I am planning a winter vaction for myself, two other people and two frisky
medium sized dogs.  We would like to go somewhere warm and remote, where
the dogs could hike with us off the leash.  A rustic cabin in the
desert of southwest US would be very appealing.

Does anyone know of warm and relaxed vacation spot where dogs would be
welcome?

Thanks in advance.

Gail Humphreys,
Athabasca, Alberta, Canada
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: naortega@nmsu.edu (ORTEGA)
Subject: Looking for a pomeranian/pekinese
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
Distribution: rec.pets.dogs
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 22:09:18 GMT

Well, the subject line says it all.  I am interested in finding
a small dog, preferably a pomeranian or pekinese.  Does anyone 
know of any breeders in New Mexico, or in the El Paso, TX area?
Any help would be appreciated.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs