From: woodhous@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Joe P Woodhouse)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: the "oh" experience - LONG
Date: 23 Aug 92 10:00:58 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia


   Folks, I'm afraid this is a very long flame. I get quite heated. 

   Just so you know.


kamal@specialix.co.uk (Kamal Mortoza) writes:
>Hang on! I never said I had any problems with it - just that most couples
>we've met do.

   Let's see what you said.

%But we found that the sharing 
%experience was more important than plain fooling around seperately - which
%all too often can cause jealosy, no matter how hard one tries to control it.
%We always take the approach that if a third party gets involved with us, they
%get the total package - both of us as a complete entity.

%If you try to seperate multiple relationships
%some one will always get hurt because your'e taking the attitude of wanting the
%cake and eat it. When we meet an intresting person, we make sure that both of
%us find he/she intresting and attractive as well as he/she finding both of us
%attractive.

%I believe, and this is borne out by experience, that polyamory
%only works well if it's in a sharing context. Going seperate ways will always
%raise the suspicion of deception - even if there isn't any.

%I'm not convinced that extra-maritual "private" lovers
%do not raise the danger of one simply abandoning the lover that is down -
%for whatever reason, preferring to disappear with the perceived "good time"
%lover.


   I think it's fairly clear you said you have some problems with it.


>I really don't react to any relationships my wife has seperate from me, as
>long as she's enjoying herself - knowing full well that I'm the main person
>in her life.

   Apparantly you do react quite strongly. Read your quotes above again.


>In your enthusiasm for your way of life, you have fallen into the
>same trap that you accuse me of falling into, YOU PERSUME TOO MUCH!

   Well, let's check the record again.

%If you try to seperate multiple relationships
%some one will always get hurt because your'e taking the attitude of wanting the
%cake and eat it.

%I believe, and this is borne out by experience, that polyamory
%only works well if it's in a sharing context.

%This - I still maintain -
%does not apply to new forming relationships where the trust element has
%yet to be proven.

%You must however
%accept that with one as young as piglet sounded, the possibility of a
%deep stable trusting relationship - although not impossible - is unlikely
%simply because there hasn't been enough time for one to form.


   From where I am, yeah, it looks like Elf's not presuming too much
about you. You've given him plenty of statements to work with.


>I've known enough couples who used you approach - especially when we were
>young. All - without exception, apart from us "insecure types" have split
>up.

   Well, here I am. An exception. Elf & Omaha are another. I'm sure we
don't have to look too far to find others.


>How can you presume so much about a relationship between people you don't
>even know.

   followed by :

>Anyone that can say they are completely certain that
>they will maintain their main relationship in the face of additional private
>relationships are not being honest.

   You're starting to look a bit inconsistent.

   Well. I am completely certain I will maintain my main relationship in the
face of other additional relationships. Unless you're going to back down
from your rather remarkable assertion, you will now have to call me a liar.


>Hey - I was relating what worked for us - with the added sugestion that
>one should experiment with our approach before dismissing it.

   Go read your quotes again above. Doesn't look like it.

>I was expecting
>a discussion - but certainly did'nt expect this kind of barrage from some-one
>with a whole bunch of preconcieved notions about other peoples relationships.

   Come now - you generalize, you make blanket assertions, you deny the
experiences of people like Elf & myself and our various loves, you judge,
you whine, and you try to get out of the statements you made. I think all
in all you've gotten off quite lightly!


>If your SO is only one of many - then you are just playing around and
>dont possess the anchor of a base relationship that will always be there.

   You have the gall to protest being flamed and then go on to say something
like this?!? @#$%! you.

   I don't claim to have the One Right Answer. But apart from the fact
that you and your wife fuck people together, I haven't heard anything
that suggests to me that you fit *my* idea of what polyamory's about.

Joe.

  / Joe Woodhouse        / I'm just a sweet bisexual...   / Hello, there.
 / Latrobe University   /    (think - Rocky Horror)      / Threesomes are fun.
/ Melbourne, Australia / Music. Magic. Mathematics. Me. / I like cats! (miaow!)
Newsgroups: soc.bi