X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Date:         Wed, 27 Jan 1993 08:45:18 EST
From:         "Donald J. Magee" <djm@TRENT.ATT.COM>
Subject:      Re: condemnation of homosexual acts is (un)necessary...
              27, 93 6:57 am

>
> You aren't listening.  "Sacred Scripture" at one time or another, allowed
> for slavery, the slaughter of your enemies, and countless other atrocities.
>

Slavery was marginally ok in scripture, not promoted as a good.  The
development of Christian faith, inspired by the Holy Spirit has moved
mans heart to treat all men with respect.

Homosexual acts were and are an abomination in the eyes of God.  It
was and is sinful.

> Does that make these things right?  You can not blindly accept the words of
> Scripture, Church tradition, or Church law.

Can. 750 - All that is contained in the written word of God or in the
tradition, that is, in the deposit of faith entrusted to the Church
and also proposed as divinely revealed either by the solemn
magisterium of the Church or by its ordinary and universal
magisterium, must be believed with divine and catholic faith; it is
manifested by the common adherence of the Christian faithful under the
leadership of the sacred magisterium; therefore, all are bound to
avoid any doctrines which are contrary to this truth.

Can. 752 - A religious respect of intellect and will, even if not the
assent of faith, is to be paid to the teaching which the Supreme
Pontiff or the college of bishops enuniate on faith or morals when
they execercise the authentic magisterium even if they do not intend
to proclaim it with a definitive act; therefore the Christian faithful
are to take to to avoid whatever is not in harmony with that teaching.

Can. 753 - Although they do not enjoy infallible teaching authority,
the bishops in communion with the head and members of the college,
whether as individuals or gathered in conferences of bishops or in
particular councils, are the authentic teachers and instructors of the
faith for the faithful entrusted to their care; the faithful must
adhere to the authentic teaching of their own bishop with a sense of
religious respect.

I don't know about you, but I see thse as pertaining to scripture,
tradition and law.

>
> Scripture is by definition a historical account.  Church tradition and
> law are made to be changed.
>

Church tradition and law *may* be changed by the bishops, not by you or
me, unless of course you are a bishop and I am unaware.

>
> The question is not "Is this what I am told is right?"
> but "Is this what I belive to be right? and "what is the Spirit calling
> me to accept?"

Cafeteria catholicism.

>
> My twelve years of Catholic Education taught me much, including the fact
> that the Spirit calls in the hearts of all, not just to
> priests and bishops and popes.

Twelve years, so what?  I have twenty years of Catholic ed, and I am
not so presumpsious as to think I know better than the likes of St.
Augustine, St. Basil, St. Gregory, St. Gregory Nanzianzen, St.  Andrew
of Crete, Tatian the Syrian, St. Maximus, St. Cyril, St. John
Damascene, St. Aquinas, and others.

>
> Christ taught : "You shall love the Lord your God
> with your whole heart, with your whole soul, with your whole mind.
> This is the greatest and first commandment.  the second is like it:
> You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
> On these two commandments the whole of the law is based,
> and the prophets as well."  MT 23:37-40.
>
> This is the measure of all Church tradition and law.

Now you sound like a Protestant proof texting.
You forgot the other scriptural references against homosexual acts, or
is that not convenient to mention in this discussion?  Remember I
originally commented on your proposition that the spirit might be
moving the Church to accept homosexual acts.

>
> Can you deny to another the basic human dignity you would hold for
> yourself?  If you do, you break the Spirit of the law and declare yourself
> a hipocrite.
>
> Steve Otlowski-
>

I deny no one basic human dignity.  I defend the teachings of the
Church.  Homosexual acts are immoral.  The scriptures say it.  Holy
tradition says it.  The bishops have said it.  I believe it.

Don Magee
trent!djm@jolt.att.com
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Subject: (no subject given)