HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: galbrth@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Canada, 2 nations.
Date: 12 Apr 92 19:58:30 GMT
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

rwood@alfred.carleton.ca (Richard Wood) writes:

| galbrth@ac.dal.ca writes:
| 
| >rwood@superior.carleton.ca (Richard Wood) writes
| >>   There will never be a united Canada.  What I want is a united TROC.
| >
| >Oh pleeeeease.
| >Guess you've never travelled east of Ontario, have you?
| >or North of Ottawa?
| 
| Been in every Province and Territory, many times over.
| 
| >This idea that TROC is a well defined `english Canada' is utter BS.
| 
| I certainly don't think TROC is a well-defined 'english Canada'.  But I do
| believe that the alternative to unity is disintigration, and since Quebec
| won't play, we in TROC will have to do it ourselves.

You don't, do you.  Yet you conveniently deleted what you said prior:

> schamber@watserv1.waterloo.edu (CHAMBERLAND S - BIOLOGY) writes:
>> >   For us, there is no such thing as "the nation of Canada". there is 2
>> >   nations, and as long as TROCians won't recognize this, sorry, but
>> >   there will be troubles...
>> 
>>   My opinion exactly.  There are two nations, but TROCers are determined to
>> press ahead with the pretence that there is only one Canada, requiring that all
>> 10 components must be equal.  The end of this road will probably be something
>> like a Commonwealth of Independent Provinces.
>>   Quebec is not the same and should, I think, stand apart from the other 9 with
>> some form of independence (with a TROC equally independent of Quebec).
>>   There will never be a united Canada.  What I want is a united TROC.

2 nations: Quebec and TROC.
Yeah right.  If you are happy with separation on the basis that Quebec is
`different' and that TROC is a unique nation, then you're in for more trouble
down the line.

You'd do better accepting different but equal parts, than to believe the
9 other provinces (and territories) are homogeneous.

Start being tolerant now, or close your eye and believe that all non-Quebecois
Canadians are just like you.  If you base this new TROC country on the basis
that you are one nation, you're in for a disapointment.

| >It's posts like this that make my stomach turn.
| 
| Maybe you should try EX-LAX.

Maybe I should.  'Cos I have no intention of letting you spread misconceptions.
I sure don't believe you.
 _____________________________________________________________________________
 Peter Galbraith       [Phone: (902) 494-7007] |  GALBRTH@AC.DAL.CA (InterNet)
 Dept. of Oceanography,  Dalhousie University  |  GALBRTH@DALAC     (BitNet)
 Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada, B3H 4J1         |  rhogee@dalcs      (UUCP)
From: sbo@vlsi.polymtl.ca (Stephane Boucher)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Quebec & the Algonquin - comments from DRUMBEAT
Date: 4 Apr 92 17:13:08 GMT
Followup-To: can.politics
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique de Montreal, Canada

In article <1992Apr03.083946.1200@oneb.wimsey.bc.ca> kmcvay@oneb.wimsey.bc.ca (Ken Mcvay) writes:
   [...article of mistreatment of natives in Quebec...]

   The long article concludes with an interesting comment, considering
   the opinions voiced here often wrt how well Quebec treats its Native
   population.... 

Not quite accurate. In some article that summarised a study, it was said
that Quebec treated its Native better than in TROC. The study also said
that it didn't mean they where well treated. 

You might be exagerating when you say that Quebecers often said: "...well
treated in Quebec..." I think it is more  like: "...better treated...".

So, what was your point? To show that Natives have their share of
mistreatment in Quebec? If so I think you lost a lot of time to show
something that most Quebecers know already? ... Unless you where trying to
make another point.
--
  ,                          ,                           ,
Stephane Boucher, ing. jr. | Ecole Polytechnique de Montreal
sbo@vlsi.polymtl.ca        | 
sbo@info.polymtl.ca        | (514)340-5950
From: beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Separation?
Date: 9 Apr 92 04:07:09 GMT
Distribution: can
Organization: Hydro-Quebec

In article <1992Apr08.032810.17326@bmerh2.bnr.ca> nadeau@bnr.ca (Rheal Nadeau) writes:
>In article <1992Apr7.082314.23749@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>>
>>The same question could be asked in reverse...on what grounds could
>>Quebec deny Quebec citizenship to any resident of Ontario or British
>>Columbia or....
>>
>>The way I look at it, two new countries would be created, and every
>>citizen of the old one would have to choose citizenship in one of
>>the new ones...choosing both "New Canada" and Quebec would not be
>>allowed.
>
>And what would I choose?  I am a Canadian, and an Ontarian.  I am
>also a francophone.  How could I decide, ahead of time, which of

Mon grain de sel.

J'ai l'impression que la double citoyennete aurait pour but de
faciliter l'acceptation par les anglo-quebecois de la secession du
Quebec.

C'est-a-dire que les anglos seraient invites a rester pour au moins
savoir qu'on ne tient pas a les martyriser!  Avec une double citoyennete,
ils pourraient retarder leur depart et voir que ce n'est pas si pire.
Le referendum de 1980 a ete dechirant, mais, on s'en est releve'.

Quant aux francophones hors-Quebec, on peut soit s'attendre a une
periode d'immigration sans condition (10 ou 20 ans, par exemple),
soit a une immigration inconditionnelle aux natifs du Quebec et
a leurs enfants, eventuellement aux descendants qui ont toujours
conserver le francais.

Le defi, comme je pense l'avoir deja dit, c'est de faire la secession
sans crise.  Pour cela, il faut bien demontrer que c'est d'abord le
desir de vouloir regler nos problemes entre nous, sans intervention
etrangere (peu importe le sens du mot etrangere), qui prime sur le
rejet du Canada anglais.  Mais, dans plusieurs articles venant
de nouveaux-venus dans ce groupe, on ressent souvent un fond de
haine ou de peur, qui s'avere par la suite plus de l'ignorance que
de la mechancete.  Et je pense que ceci est representatif de l'opinion
du TROC.

Evidemment, tant qu'on vehiculera l'idee que le nationalisme moderne
des Quebecois est fonde sur un racisme, on ira dans le mauvais sens.
Par exemple, je pense que l'antisemitisme reproche a Groulx provient
davantage du fait qu'il etait membre du clerge (et bien avant la
Nouvelle-France, le clerge catholique etait anti-semitique et anti-
protestant; et meme plus anti-protestant puisque le massacre de ls
St-Barthelemy visait seulement les protestants) que parce qu'il
etait Canadien-francais.

Pas besoin de reprendre la discussion sur la loi 178.

-- 
    Denis Beauregard       _ _ _ _  Collecting Beauregard/Jarret/Jarest/Vincent
beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca | * | * | Promoting use of QC as Quebec Postal Code
  Andre Jarret, sieur de  |===|===| Mes opinions?  Oui, oui, les miennes!
   Beauregard 1642-1992   |_*_|_*_| My opinions?  Yes, yes, mine!
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada
From: pkern@utcs.utoronto.ca (pkern)
Subject: Re: Queen of Canada
Followup-To: can.politics
Organization: University of Toronto Computing Services
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 16:08:51 GMT

In article <29EE22EB.D6@telly.on.ca> evan@telly.on.ca (Evan Leibovitch) writes:
> > >Je propose que le Canada choisisse un elan comme chef d'etat.
> > >I propose that Canada choose a moose as head of state.
> >How about Cornelius the rhinocerous from the Granby zoo?
> >He does need a job, since his party folded....
>I doubt he thinks much about a job, since he's dead.
>However, I wouldn't let a minor detail like that keep him out of
>consideration.
>If you must pick a live being for monarch, I propose Celine Dion.

Oh geez, not her!  If you looking for a Quebec-based entertainer then
pick Mitsou or Sass Jordan.  Or how about Gilles Vigneault(sp)?
Or Pierre Bourgeaux(sp)?  Could either of them use a *real* job?

Anyhow, who said a head of state had to be an animate object?

How about Bluenose II or the CN Tower or Mount Robson or Hudson's Bay?
From: galbrth@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Alberta Conservatives & Bilingualism
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:23:47 GMT
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

Adrian Ashley in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada <adrian@splunge.uucp> writes

>Peter writes:
>>If you never create a climate where french canadians are welcomed to
>>Alberta, where they can find french services from the federal government
>>and French schools, then they will never settle there.  So much for an open
>>country.  Granted you can't have emoty school waiting there, but you must
>>have the flexibility to provide them quickly for a limited number of people.
>
>But why must we "create a climate where french canadians are welcomed",
>as opposed to creating a climate where EVERYONE is welcomed??  Arguing
>that services should be provided in French in Alberta because someday
>a significant number of Francophones might move there is silly.  You
>could apply the same argument to any other linguistic group.

If Italians formed 25% of the population of Canada, I'd agree.

My point is that our country is falling apart.  What do you want to do 
about it?  I'd want people to be encouraged to move around freely.  A prof
here often tells me he'd like the fed. gov. to set up a nation-wide system
of student exchange, on a very large scale.  You can't help but feel
differently about other Canadians when you've travelled a bit.

I'd like to make it `possible' for a french Canadian to go work in Alberta
for 5 or 10 years, 10 years from now.  Keep a friendly climate alive, or
start one now if it doesn't exist. 

It's a lot easier for an anglophone to go to Quebec than the reverse.
We have to change that, otherwise Quebecers will never get a Canadian
identity and we'll be in trouble again some day.

>>I thus argue that French is then different from other minority languages
>>because they should be encouraged to move around and keep their language
>>and culture alive, instead of assimilate.
>
>Why on Earth should the Francophones be encouraged to keep their language
>and culture alive, while others should not??  What's wrong with everyone
>doing so?

See above.
 _____________________________________________________________________________
 Peter Galbraith       [Phone: (902) 494-7007] |  GALBRTH@AC.DAL.CA (InterNet)
 Dept. of Oceanography,  Dalhousie University  |  GALBRTH@DALAC     (BitNet)
 Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada, B3H 4J1         |  rhogee@dalcs      (UUCP)
From: warkent@ltisun11.epfl.ch (Ken Warkentyne)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Alberta Conservatives & Bilingualism
Date: 17 Apr 92 14:49:31 GMT
	<1992Apr11.203132.26421@splunge.uucp>
	<WARKENT.92Apr13110454@ltisun9.epfl.ch>
	<1992Apr16.012028.4268@splunge.uucp>
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne---Laboratoire de
	Teleinformatique
In-reply-to: adrian@splunge.uucp's message of 16 Apr 92 01:20:28 GMT

Adrian Ashley asked:
AA1> Why, apart from sheer numbers,
AA1> should we treat French differently than other languages?

I replied:
KW>Because French is an official language of Canada.

AA rebuts:
AA2> Circular argument.  "French should be an official language because it
AA2> is an official language, and therefore important enough to be made an
AA2> official language."

No circular argument.  French and English are Canada's official languages
because Canada was founded by French and English speaking people.  What
do they teach in history class these days?
--
Ken Warkentyne - warkent@ltisun.epfl.ch
                 Laboratoire de Teleinformatique, EPFL, Suisse.
Newsgroups: can.politics
From: schamber@watserv1.waterloo.edu (CHAMBERLAND S - BIOLOGY)
Subject: Re: Stephane et les noms...
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 04:42:46 GMT

In article <1992Apr04.055926.5586@bmerh2.bnr.ca> nadeau@bnr.ca (Rheal Nadeau) writes:
>In article <9668@s3.ireq.hydro.qc.ca> beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard) writes:
>>In article <1992Apr3.194527.9780@watserv1.waterloo.edu> schamber@watserv1.waterloo.edu (CHAMBERLAND S - BIOLOGY) writes:
>>>
>>>En general, chez les franco-quebecois, il n'y a qu'un prenom. Pour tous les
>>>franco-quebecois je crois, l'usage de deux prenoms par la culture anglophone
>>>est curieux: "pourquoi deux prenoms si un seul est utilise?"...
>>
>>Le sujet du 2e prenom a ete aborde sur soc.roots (genealogie).
>>Il semble que la pratique soit typiquement americaine dans son origine.
>
>Bon, moi, j'ai deux prenoms - Rheal Joseph.  Mon frere a aussi
>Joseph comme deuxieme prenom, et mes deux soeurs portent Marie.
>Je doute que mes parents aient ainsi subit l'influence americaine -
>ils ont tout deux ete eleves dans de petites communautes francophones
>assez fermes dans le nord de l'Ontario.  (Ma mere n'a appris l'anglais
>que longtemps apres ma naissance, et je crois que c'est elle qui a
>choisi les deuxieme prenoms.  Ma mere elle-meme portait plusieurs
>prenoms - Marguerite Georgette Aldea.)

Es-tu sur que tu ne confonds pas avec l'extrait de bapteme???

Sur mon extrait de bapteme, je suis inscrit au nom de "Joseph Gaston Sylvain".
Joseph, c'est le nom du pere de Jesus Christ, Gaston, c'est le nom de
mon parrain. (coutume franco-catholique, je suppose)
Pour les femmes, ca serait "Marie nom_de_la_marraine nom_legal".

Mais mon nom legal, c'est "Sylvain"...

En tous cas, le fait d'etre seulement 10% en Ontario doit influencer sur
les coutumes...


Sylvain Chamberland
Dept. of Biology
University of Waterloo
Waterloo, Ontario
Newsgroups: can.politics
From: robinson@mdivax1.uucp (Jim Robinson)
Subject: Re: Queen of Canada
Reply-To: robinson@mdd.comm.mot.com (Jim Robinson)
Organization: Motorola - Mobile Data Division; Richmond, BC
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:08:51 GMT

warkent@ltisun9.epfl.ch (Ken Warkentyne) writes:
>
>The beaver and the maple leaf are positive symbols. But what about the Queen?
>When I think of the Queen, I see a benign old lady who represents: a
>shameful colonial past;  class discrimination;  inherited privilege;
>and boring but nasty gossip in Fleet Street rags.
>
>Yes she is our Queen. Pity.

And don't forget that there seems to be a hint of sexism there. I don't
recall anyone being terribly concerned about whether Charlie was a virgin
or not, but as for Di: call out the royal physician.

I understand that a great many Canadians do think the monarchy is a
wonderful thing; but as far as I am concerned it is exactly what Ken thinks
it is. Indeed, I would add that it hints ever so slightly at modern day
imperialism given that the Queen of Canada is not a Canadian citizen.
-- 
Jim Robinson
robinson@mdivax1.mdd.comm.mot.com
{ubc-cs!van-bc,uunet}!mdivax1!robinson

Newsgroups: can.politics
From: robinc@bnr.ca (Robin Collins)
Subject: Re: French in france
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada
Date: Thu, 09 Apr 92 13:39:16 GMT

Rheal:
yes, your ancestors are somewhat typical of Quebec/Canada settlers.
(sorry, old chap)
Check out that Atlas.
Most came form Normandy and Paris, almost all from the North.
Your point about the elites being the historical literary record is
well taken.
One might think that all early medieval peoples were monks, otherwise, eh?

Frank.

Newsgroups: can.politics
From: nadeau@bnr.ca (Rheal Nadeau)
Subject: Re: Separation?
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada
Distribution: can
Date: Wed, 08 Apr 92 03:28:10 GMT

In article <1992Apr7.082314.23749@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>
>The same question could be asked in reverse...on what grounds could
>Quebec deny Quebec citizenship to any resident of Ontario or British
>Columbia or....
>
>The way I look at it, two new countries would be created, and every
>citizen of the old one would have to choose citizenship in one of
>the new ones...choosing both "New Canada" and Quebec would not be
>allowed.

And what would I choose?  I am a Canadian, and an Ontarian.  I am
also a francophone.  How could I decide, ahead of time, which of
the new entities (given the number of scenarios proposed, these
entities might or might not be full countries) would be best for
me?  My first reaction would be to stay where I am - but what if,
two years later, I decide an anti-francophone backlash is making
life here impossible?  Would I be welcome in Quebec, with full
citizenship, or have to submit to immigration rules?

Actually, if things got that ugly, I think I'd look for an entirely
different country to move to.  And I do not believe, by any stretch
of the imagination, that things will ever go that far.

(Mind you, there is something a bit absurd in the conflicting
separatist claims that Quebeckers don't feel like Canadians, but
that they would remain Canadians after separation.  Well, are they
Canadian, or aren't they?  Or can they only be Canadian outside
of Canada?  Weird.)

The Rhealist (Rheal Nadeau)                 |  Bell-Northern Research
Internet:  nadeau@bnr.ca                    |  Ottawa, Ontario, Canada 
BNR neither endorses nor censors my views   |  (613) 763-4266
From: migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Queen of Canada
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:25:08 GMT
Distribution: can
Organization: CSRI, University of Toronto

In article <1992Apr15.130754.17153@bnr.ca> dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton) writes:
>True, but a lot do, like Britian, Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa.  I

South Africa has not been part of the commonwealth for years.

-- 
Mike Godfrey   	           		"Either that wallpaper goes, or I do."
Dept of Comp Sci, UofT      	         	-- allegedly, the last words
migod@turing.toronto.edu			   of Oscar Wilde
Newsgroups: can.politics
From: admiral.uucp!skyjuice@uunet.uu.net (mark feller)
Subject: HELP for CANADIAN NEWSGROUPS
Reply-To: admiral.uucp!skyjuice@uunet.uu.net (mark feller)
Organization: The Grid/Waffle BBS, 203-661-2873, -1279, -0450, -2967
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 12:31:47 GMT

Hello again--
        Thanks to all who helped me with my last request for USENET sites 
in Ontario and Quebec, so I decided to interrupt again and ask *ANOTHER* 
question:       Could someone forward me a list of Newsgroups that one 
might find interesting to stay up on events in Canada.  I realize that 
this request is somewhat vague and that by its very definition, 
any response would be necessarily incomplete, but as an American who is 
very much interested in what is going on up north (and actually do get to 
visit 4-5 times a year), I would appreciate having the opportunity to 
browse through various Newsgroups that concern matters affecting Canada.  
        Please respond by e-mail and once again, Thanks !!!

                        Mark

--
admiral!skyjuice@uunet.uu.net (mark feller) <uunet!admiral!skyjuice>
The Admiral's Public UNIX - Greenwich, CT - System Administrator: Doug Fields
(HST/V32) (203)661-2873 -- (PEP/V32) -1279 -- (V32) -0450 -- (V29/MNP6) -2967
>FREE!< Unix shell accounts, Usenet access, and Internet-style mail available
From: beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: On Exaggeration
Date: 9 Apr 92 04:13:45 GMT
Organization: Hydro-Quebec

In article <11389@std-2> audetf@Software.Mitel.COM (Francois Audet) writes:
>
>I found an interesting letter in the newspaper on the allege
>antisemitism in Quebec.
>
>It says that in 1832, the jews in Canada were not allowed to have
>cimetaries or synagogues. In 1832, the deputies of the Patriote party
>(under Louis-Joseph Papineau) voted the first Charter of Rights, that
>got these rights (synagogues & cimetaries) for the jews.
>
>The letter also said "Au surplus, le Quebec serait le seul pays au
>monde, a part Israel, ou la communaute juive a le droit et les fonds
>publics pour gerer ses ecoles et ses services sociaux."
>
>-- 
>Francois Audet

Je me rappelle d'un reportage televise sur les Juifs au Quebec.
Au tout debut (apres 1760 parce qu'avant, on n'admettait que les
catholiques), les Juifs devaient aller se marier aux Etats-Unis
et y faire enregistrer (ou baptiser?) leurs enfants a cause justement
de cette absence de synagogue.  Il y a eu un livre sur le sujet.


I remember about a TV report on a book about Jews of Quebec.
At the beginnings (after 1760 since before, only catholics could
settle), Jews had to go to USA to be married and register (baptism?)
their children because there was no synagogue.

   

-- 
    Denis Beauregard       _ _ _ _  Collecting Beauregard/Jarret/Jarest/Vincent
beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca | * | * | Promoting use of QC as Quebec Postal Code
  Andre Jarret, sieur de  |===|===| Mes opinions?  Oui, oui, les miennes!
   Beauregard 1642-1992   |_*_|_*_| My opinions?  Yes, yes, mine!
From: michele@catnix.UUCP (Michele A. Simond)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: O Canada, O Quebec  - reaction
Date: 16 Apr 92 17:29:49 GMT
Organization: Rhinoceros, chargez!

schamber@watserv1.waterloo.edu (CHAMBERLAND S - BIOLOGY) writes:
>
>At a more peaceful time, maybe people would have seen some truth in it
>and be more prepared to change the faulty attitudes...

Il est bien la` le drame : en temps de crise, les gens ont
tendance a` perdre toute objectivite', a` se sentir attaque's,
voire "perse'cute's".  Pourtant, ce grain de ve'rite' que les
gens seraient peut-e^tre pre^ts a accepter en temps de "paix",
il est le me^me.  Il ne pe`se ni plus lourd, ni moins.


--
Michele Simond ...... Traductrice ......  B.P.: michele@catnix.UUCP
(514) 671-8820				   OU :	michele%catnix@cam.org
From: plante@IRO.UMontreal.CA (Frederic Plante)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: On Exaggeration
Date: 10 Apr 92 01:38:18 GMT
Reply-To: plante@IRO.UMontreal.CA (Frederic Plante)
Organization: Universite de Montreal

In article <29E44CAB.1A16@telly.on.ca> evan@telly.on.ca (Evan Leibovitch) writes:
>In article <9694@s3.ireq.hydro.qc.ca>
>	beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard) writes:
>
>>In article <11389@std-2> audetf@Software.Mitel.COM (Francois Audet) writes:
>
>>>The letter also said "Au surplus, le Quebec serait le seul pays au
>>>monde, a part Israel, ou la communaute juive a le droit et les fonds
>>>publics pour gerer ses ecoles et ses services sociaux."
>
>This statement is full of crap. Until you can offer some evidence that
>its conclusions are correct, I'll offer some first hand experience to the
>contrary.
>
>(Was the letter written by a Jew? Or by someone else who looks from
>afar about how well the Jews have been treated? You must bristle when
>you read from Anglos who say that Quebecois have been treated fairly.
>Certainly only the Quebecois can describe how well the Quebecois have
>been treated. Why, then, do you accept the word of non-Jews who
>describe how Jews have been treated while disputing the experiences of
>the Jews themselves?)

I have read a letter in "La Presse" saying the same thing, and it was
written by Nancy Neatman, an anglo-jewish montrealer.  She is well-known
in the south-west of Montreal.

Frederic Plante
From: evan@telly.on.ca (Evan Leibovitch)
Newsgroups: can.politics
Subject: Re: Queen of Canada
Date: 17 Apr 92 00:59:22 GMT
Organization: Somewhere just far enough out of Toronto

In article <1992Apr15.152233.2299@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>
	migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:

>>Je propose que le Canada choisisse un elan comme chef d'etat.
>>
>>I propose that Canada choose a moose as head of state.
>
>How about Cornelius the rhinocerous from the Granby zoo?
>He does need a job, since his party folded....

I doubt he thinks much about a job, since he's dead.
However, I wouldn't let a minor detail like that keep him out of
consideration.

If you must pick a live being for monarch, I propose Celine Dion.

-- 
 Evan Leibovitch, Sound Software Ltd., located in beautiful Brampton, Ontario
         evan@telly.on.ca / uunet!utzoo!telly!evan / (416) 452-0504
              If it's tourist season, why can't we shoot them?
Newsgroups: can.politics