From: dci@cs.washington.edu (Donald Chinn)
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
Subject: Re: The Star of Indiana, HATE
Keywords: The Star of Indiana, why do they hate them?
Date: 18 Aug 92 18:58:48 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle

In article <1992Aug18.161926.5924@midway.uchicago.edu> xklh@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <1992Aug18.145415.15414@sunova.ssc.gov> jbaron@dirac.ssc.gov (Jeff Baron) writes:
>>Christopher E. Hagen writes:
>>-   Why, exactly, do you hate the Star of Indiana?
>>- 
>>-  (or, love them/like  them/respect them/etc.)
>>- 
>>- 
>>-        I'm just itting here reading all the hatred of them, and I heard all
>>- the booing, etc, all season. WHY? Is it just because we have corporate
>>- sponsorship, and will allow all types of people into our corp, based on their
>>- abilities not their pocketbooks? (sorry, couldn't help but ask that question
>>- since someone told me "The Star of Indiana" was filled with low-class people))
>>
>I really didn't want to get into this subject but since
>you asked.  Most corps, big and small, had (have) to work
>to get started and to get new members and good instructors.
>Star *stole* the best instructors all around the country
>by flashing money.  And yes, Star is talented, but they
>have the best instructors for the wrong reason.

I'm a little confused.  What exactly are the right reasons for
an instructor to work for a particular organization?  It seems
to me that if I were an instructor or designer and I wanted
to have my drill or whatever realized, then I would go to a corps
that offered me some money, especially if I were a starving artist
trying to go to school and make ends meet, etc.

I probably would not want to work for a corps whose environment is
not conducive to being creative or where egos amonsgt the staff
gets in the way of being productive.  I probably wouldn't work for
a corps whose management or philosophy advocates the slaughter of
whales, etc. (so far what I have said applies to any kind of work,
not just drum corps).  But there's nothing about Star (yet) that I
violently object to.

From a corps management point of view, why not offer lots of money
to get talented people?  I'd do it if I were running a corps, because
if I didn't, I'd be robbing my kids of a better musical experience by
not exposing them to great instructors.

I don't get this "underdog" mentality, where we (the generic "we") think
that because some corps works twice as hard to get where they are that they
deserve first place.  No one can take away the achievement of any of the
corps, no matter what their final placement.  Judging and the final rankings
are supposed to be about the performance, not about the behind the scenes
stuff.  Now I realize that nowhere in the post is there mention that
Star should not have won (all that was said was that you hated Star), but
it does seem to be implied.

>Star does not let all people of all shapes and sizes into
>their corps.  You have to be a certain weight and height.
>And your ever so precious wonderful staff told me that!!
>Also, how much to Star members pay a year in dues?  Could
>it be only $200?  YES!  You don't work for the money
>you get.  Mr. Cook just hands it over.  That is not
>drumcorps.

This is a situation where the idea of drum corps as a youth activity
and drum corps as a music education medium comes into conflict.  At the
top levels, drum corps have to be extremely selective, which means not
only do they have to be able to play an instrument or spin a flag well,
they even have to have a uniform look for the right visual effect.

This may sound a bit racist, but I find it hard to believe that a white
person could make it big as a rapper.  I'll believe it, however, when I
see it.  This is where the "look" can make a difference in the final
product.  Maybe in drum corps, the "look" is not or should not be that
important.  But the staff and management has made that decision, and you
can disagree with it (I personally do not like the idea of selection
based on weight/height).  But to HATE them for it?

As to members not paying enough money, I don't think there is a kid or
parent of a kid who would not like to have smaller corps fees (given
that they march in the same corps).  I can imagine paying $50 more
to march in a corps I really liked, but I can't imagine wanting to
pay $50 more to march in the same corps.

>
>Yeah, yeah.  I know that you Star people think that everybody
>else is jealous.  Well, that is not it.  I wouldn't march
>in Star if they paid me, which I understand is not all
>that uncommon.  Every single person that I ever tried to
>speak to from Star was rude and walked around with this,
>"I am better than you" attitude.  Which is really a shame
>because it would be nice if DCI could be one big happy
>family.

I doubt if EVERY single person in Star is like this (although I do not
know this first hand).  And if you go from corps to corps, you probably
get a significant number of kids who think that they are hot shit because
of whatever.  These are kids being kids.  What's worse is that these
attitudes are propagated by (guess who) the parents and alumni.  A vicious
circle indeed.

I don't think drum corps can be one big happy family unless the competitive
aspect of drum corps is de-emphasized.  It exacerbates the hostile feelings
we already have and stifles constructive discussion about how to make the
activity better.

-- Donald