HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ddm@wpi.WPI.EDU (David D Marshall)
Subject: Re: Duct Tape (please let this time work...)
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 19:50:47 GMT

In article <1992Sep3.202237.1@d0msu7.fnal.gov> jerger@d0msu7.fnal.gov writes:
>
>In article <Bu0psM.49o@wpi.WPI.EDU>, ddm@wpi.WPI.EDU (David D Marshall) writes..
>.
>>Back in '88 there was a rumor (considered common knowledge fact then) that
>>BD's snare line used duct tape to 'quiet' the dirty players in the line.
>>The rumor was that about three or four (out of the 10) a year had the old
>>tape job (even '86).  The pit people from '88 ran into a guy who played
>>with Spirit until the end of winter rehearsals when BD called and he left.
>>Anyways, they casually asked to see his bottom head, and he had the tape job.
>>My question is:
>>(1) did they do this, and
>
>        I think I remember BD's snares being a little weak in '88, so I don't
                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^
>know for sure, but I wouldn't doubt it - a friend/old instructor was on
>Dev's snare line in 82 & 83, and that's where *I* learned it from. Although
>I think the first resort is through playing with the snare tension to lessen
>the response, while duct tape is pretty harsh on the volume and the ego. I'd
>like to hear what Brad has to say - he seems to have the most experience
>with top 12 snare lines.

What about them marching only four basses because of an attitude problem
with one bass drummer.  This was not a shinning moment in the BD percussion
scrap-book.  Most good high schools march 5 basses.  Why didn't they get
a cymbal player or pit person to fill the spot.  The pit could obviously
play battery since they wheeled out those rock toms or whatever for the 
solo.

>						Steve
>						jerger@msupa.pa.msu.edu

--David
p.s. sorry for two posts to respond to one article, but I forgot this point.




-- 
 Spirit '88      |"So get off your butt and ride."      |     _,-~o     |
 ?????? '93      |"It's the motor that wins the races." |    _-\_<,     |
                 |               E-mail ddm@wpi.wpi.edu |   (*)/'(*)    |

Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: robertt@vcd.hp.com (Bob Taylor)
Subject: Re: Drum corps and the Media
Organization: Hewlett-Packard VCD
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 21:35:59 GMT

holt_c@cubldr.colorado.edu wrote:
: In article <81797@bcsaic.boeing.com>, cdoser@bcsaic.boeing.com (Cathy Doser) writes:
: > 
: > What might be a good avenue is to start writing to Ted Turner and
: > promote it as a family oriented show that he would want to cover
: > on TBS or such. He could conceivably carry the regionals too! What
: > 
: Family oriented?  With what BD did this year and what Phantom did with their
: closer last year. :-)  

gag -  I'm getting tired of this.  The stuff in BD and Phantom's shows
the last couple of years is so incredibly tame compared to "pop" culture
(TV, movies, newspapers, etc.) it isn't funny.  The only thing it 
"violates" is a perception of "military demeanor".  Swimmers in the
Olympics wear less than what the Blue Devils wore - are the Olympics
"anti-family" too?

: 
: 					Charles Holt
:

Bob "I liked the Blue Devils this year" Taylor
HP Vancouver
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: ddm@wpi.WPI.EDU (David D Marshall)
Subject: Re: VK's next frontier
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 15:16:40 GMT

In article <Qed0sCC00iUy87zWMO@andrew.cmu.edu> df1y+@andrew.cmu.edu (David James Foremsky) writes:

>P.S.  I am considering of discontinuing Off The Line.  It seems like
                                         ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>almost everybody has moved here.  To argue for or against this, please
>send me email.  Do not post here

What is "Off The Line"?  Should we (alt.drumcorps) be familiar with it.
Forgive my ignorance, but I just recently subscribed to this group.

--David


-- 
 Spirit '88      |"So get off your butt and ride."      |     _,-~o     |
 ?????? '93      |"It's the motor that wins the races." |    _-\_<,     |
                 |               E-mail ddm@wpi.wpi.edu |   (*)/'(*)    |

Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: ddm@wpi.WPI.EDU (David D Marshall)
Subject: Re: Original Corps Compositions (was: Drumcorps Sandwich)
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 17:46:50 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.181214.628@vela.acs.oakland.edu> bfhalls@vela.acs.oakland.edu (HALLS BRADLEY F) writes:
>In article <1992Aug26.013447.13553@beaver.cs.washington.edu> dci@cs.washington.edu (Donald Chinn) writes:
>
           (stuff deleted)

>>I felt that Prof. Cambell's little introduction to the percussion section
>>in the PBS broadcast to be very informative and interesting.  I suspect that
>>drum corps is fairly close to the cutting edge of percussion techniques,
>>but I could be wrong (drum corps is probably not on the cutting edge when
>>it comes to keyboard instruments).
>
>This is a debatable and fairly controversial subject amoung musicians.
>Drum corps has long had a reputation as a "bastard" idiom, and not worthy of
>the respect of "serious" musicians. People like Jim Campbell (Cavaliers,
>University of Kentucky), Fred Sanford, Tim Salzman (Cavaliers, Univ. of
>Washington), John Madden (Phantom Regiment, Michigan State University), and
>many others are working hard to give drum corps the reputation it deserves
>as a legitimate musical idiom. There are many, though, that would disagree
>with this. :-( Part of the problem is that Drum Corps percussion sections
>have a unique approach and instrumentation, and cannot be compared to modern
>percussion ensembles with any degree of accuracy. (IMHO)!

After marching in Spirit's drumline in '88, I started taking lessons from a
great percussionist from ASYO.  The first few months where spent fixing my
playing style that I had learned from Spirit.  Playing techniques of drum
corps are VERY different from playing orchestral music (for percussion at
least).  I would guess then that the reason that drum corps gets knocked is 
that it does no good for the "real" styles of playing.  BTW, this guy
marched Spirit in '81 so he wasn't hard on corps he was just truthful.

>
>--Brad
>
>-- 
>^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
>Brad Halls                                "Still looking for witty quote."
>Computer Science Grad Student              -me         
>Oakland University
>Rochester, Michigan
>bfhalls@vela.acs.oakland.edu
>
>^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^

ddm
Spirit '88
?????? '93

-- 
       |"So get off your but and ride."         |     _,-~o     |
       |"It's the motor that wins the races."   |    _-\_<,     |
       |               E-mail ddm@wpi.wpi.edu   |   (*)/'(*)    |

Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: ddm@wpi.WPI.EDU (David D Marshall)
Subject: Duct Tape
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 19:50:46 GMT

Back in '88 there was a rumor (considered common knowledge fact then) that
BD's snare line used duct tape to 'quiet' the dirty players in the line.
The rumor was that about three or four (out of the 10) a year had the old
tape job (even '86).  The pit people from '88 ran into a guy who played
with Spirit until the end of winter rehearsals when BD called and he left.
Anyways, they casually asked to see his bottom head, and he had the tape job.
My question is:
(1) did they do this, and
(2) if they did, wouldn't the judges know and therefore not give the same
    amount of points he would if a line of 10, playing, where clean?
(3) Also, this just doesn't seem quite fair to the lines who marched seven,
    eight, or even ten and who all played?  These lines would have to
    water down their book more than BD.

--David

-- 
 Spirit '88      |"So get off your butt and ride."      |     _,-~o     |
 ?????? '93      |"It's the motor that wins the races." |    _-\_<,     |
                 |               E-mail ddm@wpi.wpi.edu |   (*)/'(*)    |
From: dci@cs.washington.edu (Donald Chinn)
Subject: Star's contras in Amber Waves (was Re: POPCORN)
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 18:05:36 GMT

In article <1992Sep3.034442.23961@hubcap.clemson.edu> rwberry@hubcap.clemson.edu (Robert W Berry) writes:
>cdoser@polari.online.com writes:
>
>>dci@cs.washington.edu (Donald Chinn) writes:
>
>(Somebody writes ... it has to be entertaining or it's not
>effective....)
>
>(Donald basically disagrees...)
>
>( Donald praises Star's contra line...)
>
>>(Side side note: what contras? 16 and no volume level! And no, to others
>>out there, I'm not advocating loud rasty contras. It's just that 16 of
>>those horns usually produce more. It was said that the horns were a bit
>>restrained this year.)
>
>Oh no, here it comes.  Cathy, I agree with you here.  I really don't
>think Star has ever had a contra line on par with the rest of their
>hornline.  I really sensed no presence from their contra line at all.
>

Oh no!  The universe as I know it is breaking at the seams!  What kind
of universe allows Cathy and Bob to agree?!  :-)

It's not clear that I was praising their contra line.  I actually was referring
just to the last couple measures of the Amber Waves part of their show where
the contras had a spine-tingling few notes.

To Jim Prime's defense, I think that arrangers (at least arrangers such
as Jim Prime) are less into "showing off" particular sections of the horns
and are more into what kinds of sounds they can achieve by mixing various
ensembles.  Not to put words or thoughts into his mouth/head, but maybe he
would consider it a success that no one really noticed the 16 contras
(musically, that is; hard to miss them visually).

BTW, did you know that Star got a perfect 15.0 in GE Brass and a perfect
10.0 in Ensemble Brass?

And, as to my claim that the Cavaliers' horns sounded as good as the
Blue Devils' horns (as if anyone remembers ...), I think the Cavaliers
were 0.1 better than BD in GE Brass, but 0.4 worse in total brass (field
+ ensemble).  These last figures may not be exactly right, as I may have
the semis and finals scores mixed up here.

-- Donald
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: ddm@wpi.WPI.EDU (David D Marshall)
Subject: Re: Percussion Techniques (was: Re: Original Corps Compositions)
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 19:56:17 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.183156.6559@beaver.cs.washington.edu> dci@cs.washington.edu (Donald Chinn) writes:

>Anyway, one of the things the article talked about was how there are
>two kinds of drum rolls for snare: the concert roll and the military
>roll.  The basic difference is that in a military roll, the stick strikes
>the drum head twice for every stroke, whereas in a concert roll the
>stick strikes the head an indefinite number of times per stroke.  The
>article basically said that percussion instructors usually teach one
>kind of roll or the other, but that the student will only be able to
>do that kind of roll.  The article then went on to suggest a method
>of teaching both kinds of rolls so that students could do both.
>
>For you drum corps percussionists out there: how difficult was/is it
>for you to learn how to do a concert roll (or, rather, "unlearn" the
>military roll to be able to do a concert roll)?

There are a lot more differences in drum corps style and concert style.
In drum corps (or at least Spirit and most of the top corps that I've
taken the time to look at), the basic style is crisp and very uniform
hitting of the drum.  This leads to a deadening of the sound eminating
from the concert snare (however the marching snare doesn't use resonation
and therefore doesn't need to worry about it).  Also, with the advent of
the K-flam and other non-destructable type heads, there is a big difference
between the feel of a marching head and a concert head.
These are just two differences off of the top of my head.  I'm sure I
could come up with more, and go into more detail, but I believe this should
suffice; however, I can continue on e-mail.

>
>I personally would like to hear more concert rolls in drum corps
>performances, even though it would be less impressive visually.

It's very tough to get the concert roll sound on a marching drum because
the heads are so tight.  That's another reason some "real" percussionist
don't like corps, some people tune their concert drums as if they where
on the marching field.

>
>BTW, there were/are plenty of other good articles on percussion in the
>Instrumentalist over the last couple years.  There was some article on
>the N basic percussion rudiments (trivia quiz for percussionists: what
>number is N?)
>
>-- Donald


-- 
       |"So get off your but and ride."         |     _,-~o     |
       |"It's the motor that wins the races."   |    _-\_<,     |
       |               E-mail ddm@wpi.wpi.edu   |   (*)/'(*)    |
From: sradeker@nyx.cs.du.edu (scott radeker)
Subject: Re: Well, what about HS marching...
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 19:11:33 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.143346.28306@hubcap.clemson.edu> rwberry@hubcap.clemson.edu (Robert W Berry) writes:
>
>MBA Grand Nationals.  There are bands from all over there.
>
>Maybe not a TRUE national championship, because a lot of good bands
>don't attend.  But every bit as legitimate as the first couple of DCI
>championships.
>
Hmmm, I never went to MBA in HS, because my band director didn't like
they way they judged, etc...  I am not sure how it worked or exactly
why he didn't like it, just that he didn't.

On another note, now that's it's fall:  how does your respective 
state handle marching contests, or do they even have them?

As an example, Florida has what we call FBA (florida bandmasters
association) host the state contest.  It's done by district (that is,
each of the bands go to select areas to compete) and is run
like a festival, not a contests.  You just get rated.  When I was in
HS, all the schools had to go to FBA, if they wanted to performs
outside of the sate of Florida.

Anyway I would be interetsed in know how other states do it.  I know
how Tenessee does it and Texas, but what about other ones?

Scott


--
              ________   ________         gt1293c@cad.gatech.edu
       |   | (___  |__)   | \  /      Box 24860 Georgia Tech Station 
       |_|_|_____) |  \___|__\/__         Atlanta, GA 30332-1001
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: rwberry@hubcap.clemson.edu (Robert W Berry)
Subject: Re: POPCORN
Organization: Clemson University
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 18:02:00 GMT

xklh@kimbark.uchicago.edu (Krista Lyn Haggert) writes:

< ... discussion deleted ... >

>THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!
>I'm glad that I am not the only one who would
>like to have a discussion without someone
>criticizing my personal opinions.

Well, I hate to criticize your opinion here (;-)!), but I personally would
rather have a *real* dicussion in which: points are made, fallacies are
pointed out, opinions are discussed, opposing viewpoints are made
public, etc.  What you are suggesting will turn into a good-ole-boy
let's all say the same thing and pat each other on the back.

(Kind of like listening to the discussion at a tailgate party before a
home football game, everybody feels the same and the discussions get
pretty bland pretty quick.)

My father always said, you won't get very far in life if you expect to
agree with everybody - so don't let people think you agree if you don't.

Everyone knows I have strong viewpoints (which are often the opposite of
other readers, Cathy are you out there?) but I *like* when people
challenge what I say.  A lot of times these challenges won't change my
mind, but they do let me know that other people feel differently and
why.  And I like to think that's part of what make the world an
interesting place.

Later,
Bob 
-- 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-=- Bob Berry -=- Net-Guru's Inc.        ! rwberry@hubcap.clemson.edu   -=-
-=- Teach them quick, before they think. ! 803-654-7623 || 803-656-1076 -=-
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
From: eputnam@vax1.umkc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
Subject: Re: Entertainment and Effectiveness III
Date: 3 Sep 92 18:11:58 GMT
Organization: University of Missouri - Kansas City

In article <Bu0F9r.45w@solbourne.com>, halk@solbourne.com (Hal Koshak) writes:
> In article <1992Sep3.005018.1@vax1.umkc.edu> eputnam@vax1.umkc.edu writes:
>>
>>Okay, I give up...  What is so darn special about a stupid company front?!?
> 
> You answered your own question... ;-)
> 
>>front which was a wall of music being shoved at the audience.  I am sure that
>                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

As I said, the only corps that has actually achieved this effect for me is the
Velvet Knights.  What's even more amazing is that when they did it it happened
so fast that most of the audience couldn't get their applause in as the line
formed.  As I said in my post, VK is an exception not the general rule (but
we all knew that anyway  ha ha).  Most corps have a wall of music being NUDGED
towards the audience.
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: afo@apollo.HP.COM (Aaron Oppenheimer)
Subject: Re: Cadets '86 closer
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 15:50:09 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Chelmsford, MA

In article <92238.142718MHUGHES@MIAMIU.BITNET>, MHUGHES@MIAMIU.BITNET writes:
|> I agree with the above assessment of the '86 Cadets....the closer totally
|> destroyed the program.  I wonder how many in this group remember the piece
|> that the Cadets originally had as a closer that year...
|>  
|>   Bernstein's "Prelude, Fugue and Riffs"  (the closer used in 1991)
|>  
|> Rumor was that the chart was so difficult that it had to be scrapped in
|> mid-season, hence the ugly closer (which was still Bernstein, though).
|> Did anyone in the group see Cadets perform PF&R in 1986 before they chucked
|> it?
PFR was never actually performed in public; it was scrapped in the spring.
  
|> Another rumor was that Cadets participated in some celebration in New York
|> in July 1986 (perhaps it was a Statue of Liberty celebration) and the closer
|> they ended up with was originally intended just to be performed at the
|> NY gig.
Not true; the Statue of Liberty thing was in the middle of the season, long
after the final version of the show had been settled on. I think, though, the
corps. might have played something at the SoL performance that wasn't in the
show. Or planned to. America the Beautiful? Shenandoah? I don't remember
exactly, but we ended up being cut short. I think my mom still has it on tape,
if anyone really cares. It was a long time ago.


The '86 closer, btw, was "Christopher Street" and was (as pointed out by
someone else) supposed to be something of a spoof. The 'parade' section, the
concert formation complete with cheesy 'soprano mouthpiece in the contra' trick, etc. It wasn't (IMHO) too well thought out, and the corps. didn't really
feel too comfortable with the show. It was a weird summer.

We in the pit had a cool verion of PFR worked up in '86. We had wanted to go to
I&E with it, but it didn't happen - I don't remember why not.

|> Mike Hughes

Aaron (Garfield 83-86)

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Aaron Oppenheimer                             Multimedia Technology Lab
Email: afo@apollo.hp.com                                Hewlett Packard
Phone: (508) 436-5693                                  300 Apollo Drive
"Please Be Fabulous"                               Chelmsford, MA 01824
From: cdoser@polari.online.com
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
Subject: Re: POPCORN
Date: 1 Sep 92 07:15:29 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Seattle Online Public Access Unix.  (206) 328-4944 (all lines telebit-equipped)

I'm here Bob.   :)

                                                        _ _ _         /|
                                                        | | |        / |
____________________________________________ (|----------------- ___/  |
| Cathy Doser        *     Black Watch       (|---____________  \ __   |
| P.O. Box 69271     *      1972-1978             / /   | | |  \ |  \  |
| Seattle, WA 98168  * 1978 Class A Champions    | |   =|o| |= | |   \ |
|                    *  'You are what you are,    \ \_________/ /     \|
|                    *  or what you want to be!'   \___________/
|_____________________________________________________________________|
|      cdoser@atc.boeing.com    |   cathyj@f104.n343.z1.fidonet.org   |
|_____________________________________________________________________|
From: cdoser@polari.online.com
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
Subject: Re: Impressions--DCI Finals
Date: 1 Sep 92 07:30:36 GMT
Organization: Seattle Online Public Access Unix.  (206) 328-4944 (all lines telebit-equipped)

The whole reason for the decrease in competing time was basically so
that they could fit more corps onto one side of a record. There was
also a reason given that shows were too long, but I don't buy that,
as the entire show was always that long, and there weren't major
complaints in my time of marching. I think there might have also been
the reason of fitting 6 corps into the 2 hour broadcast too.
Entertainment had little to do with the decision, as far as I know.

                                                        _ _ _         /|
                                                        | | |        / |
____________________________________________ (|----------------- ___/  |
| Cathy Doser        *     Black Watch       (|---____________  \ __   |
| P.O. Box 69271     *      1972-1978             / /   | | |  \ |  \  |
| Seattle, WA 98168  * 1978 Class A Champions    | |   =|o| |= | |   \ |
|                    *  'You are what you are,    \ \_________/ /     \|
|                    *  or what you want to be!'   \___________/
|_____________________________________________________________________|
|      cdoser@atc.boeing.com    |   cathyj@f104.n343.z1.fidonet.org   |
|_____________________________________________________________________|
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps
From: streuer_d@cubldr.colorado.edu
Subject: Re: POPCORN
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 16:15:48 GMT

To Willard, my respond to your remarks TYPED IN ALL CAPS, was not meant
to be shouting.  I used all caps so as to have my remarks standout in
all the extracted comments.  Geez.....

I'll have to get back to you on your comments......I really thought this
news network was suppose to provide an opportunity for people to express
their opinions about particular subjects and be able to 'hear' others
views.  I didn't realize people would be psycho-analyzing your statements.
Get real, asking the definition of true fan.  It's probably just semantics
and I should have used 'hardcore fan' instead.  The problem is you missed
the *essence* of what I was saying or trying to say.  So, I guess that explains
why you could never accept input from the fans for performances that have
entertainment value - you don't comprehend the intangible. 

Streuer_D (pronouced 'Destroyer')
Newsgroups: alt.drumcorps