HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dave@gergo.tamu.edu (Dave Martin)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: DS9: Who will write? (was Re: DS9: Who will star?)
Date: 4 Sep 92 21:48:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: gergo.4SEP199215485829
Organization: Geochemical & Environmental Research Group, Texas A&M University
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <92248.091606KELSEY@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, KELSEY@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (KELSEY, Michael H.) writes...
}In article <65271@cup.portal.com>, Peter_A_David@cup.portal.com says:
}>
}>Just to get it straight early on, the Avery Brooks character is spelled
}>"Sisko."
}>
}>PAD
} 
}On a related topic, is there any chance we will get some _good_ writers
}for DS9, perhaps even Mr. David himself, as opposed to the current crop
}of Hollywood writers do TNG scripts?

Yeah -- when do we get to see PAD turn Worf into the 24th Century version
of the Hulk? :)

(Picard: Worf, how many times do we have to warn you about leaping down
         to the planets from the bridge?) 

 -                                                                     -
 - Dave Martin - Geochemical & Environmental Research Group, Texas A&M - 
 - DAVE@GERGA[GERGO,GERGI].TAMU.EDU - BROOKS@TAMVXOCN.BITNET - AOL:DBM -
 -                                                                     -
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
From: nlazar@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nicole Alana Lazar)
Subject: Sexism in STTNG
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 23:42:52 GMT

In article 9388, jeffo@uiuc.edu (J.B. Nicholson-Owens) writes:

>On the topic of sexism in ST:TNG, ever notice how even the women in
>high ranking positions are addressed as 'sir'?  I think that's
>exceptionally offensive; as if ST:TNG is saying that women can
>(finally) be in the service *with* (as opposed to 'of') men, but
>nobody will recognize them as women.  Instead we shall choose to
>recognize them as men.  If they wanted a neutral term, neither 'sir'
>nor 'madam' should have been used.  Actually, it's obvious who is
>speaking and being spoken to in all circumstances that I can recall
>where anyone has addressed anyone else on the show as 'sir', hence
>another reason why neither 'sir' nor 'madam' is necessary.

Actually, this *isn't* sexism in ST:TNG - referring even to women officers as 
"Sir" is a matter of military protocol in modern armies, too (Speaking as an
ex-officer myself). So, if anything, this usage reflects the mores of our own
(admittedly sexist) society!

  Nicole.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
From: choffman@adobe.com (Charles Hoffman)
Subject: Re: Sexism and Plunging Necklines (Was Re: What would you do ... ) 
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 17:44:12 GMT

In article <Bu0swH.Fsv@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> jeffo@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu writes:
>
>On the topic of sexism in ST:TNG, ever notice how even the women in
>high ranking positions are addressed as 'sir'?  I think that's
>exceptionally offensive...

Sigh, here we go again.  From Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary 1976

Sir <- sire <- senior : A person of higher standing or rank

Ma'am <- madam <- my lady : A form of polite address to a woman

"Sir", while long associated with men only, is actually gender neutral and 
expresses a relationship between two people. "Ma'am" has been used historicaly
for women in positions of power, but the subtle distinction was not lost on
those who used it.  Titled women who wished to hold the powers of their office
strived to be refered by the honorifics of their office: "your grace", etc.  
Madam was used only by close friends and as a put down by their foes.

Use of "ma'am" is says that you recognize that the most important thing
about the person to whom your are speaking is that she is a woman.  Use of 
"sir" says that you recognize that the most important thing about the person
is that she is your superior officer.  (This skips the polite custom that
all officers may refer to each other as sir.)  

It's true that the modern military/society tends to use Sir/Ma'am as equivalent
but gender specific honorifics.  The Great Bird was (and still is) trying to 
make a point.

Charles Hoffman           | You are not judged by how much you love,
choffman@mv.usa.adobe.com | but by how much you are loved by others. - G.P. Oz
From: pierrot@milton.u.washington.edu (The Pierrot)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Sexism and Plunging Necklines (Was Re: What would you do ... )
Date: 29 Aug 92 20:54:50 GMT
Organization: The People Who Brought You BEEEEEEER MILKSHAKES!

In article <1992Aug27.172754.20248@bnlux1.bnl.gov>, schroede@bnlux1.bnl.gov (gary l. schroeder) writes:

>> [Models]  ...  starve themselves
>> for this effect in order to wear clothing invented by twisted _men_ who
>> have some fantasies about what women should look like.

>> [Star Trek's] costume designers go out of their way to accentuate [Marina
>> Sirtis' breasts] as much as possible.
>> I'm glad to see that in Roddenberry's Wonderful World of the Happy
>> Future, male cheauvenism is still tolerated.  If Marina's never
>> complained about the plunging-neckline uniforms she's been given to
>> wear, she has every right to.

	Let's see, who's being more sexist here -- some drooling
	fanboy getting his jollies over Marina's outfits, or you 
	for assuming that there's no such thing as a female 
	clothing designer??  I personally find it entirely 
	plausible that Deanna might dress like that to make 
	*herself* feel attractive, not to slavishly gain the 
	approval of men; and, judging by how Ms. Sirtis dresses
	for television interviews, she might actually do the
	same herself.  

Michael J Montoure / pierrot@milton.u.washington.edu / Keeper of Red Dwarf FAQ
    "Dehydration - 34%.  Recollection of previous evening: 2%.  Embarassment  
     factor: 91%!   Advise repair schedule:  Off-line for 36 hours, re-boot  
     startup disk, and replace head.  I've got to stop reading Usenet ... "
From: K.Haigh-Hutchinson@bradford.ac.uk (K.HAIGH-HUTCHINSON)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: Prime Directive
Keywords: Kirk, Breaking
Date: 2 Sep 92 11:40:57 GMT
Distribution: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Organization: University of Bradford, UK
Originator: s1497@bravo

Off the top of my head ( my library of Blish script adaptations is at home)

1)  Encouring the natives to rebel against their god and destroying the
god itself in "The Apple"

2)  Destroying the Computer Landru and freeing its society in "Return of
the Archons"

3)  Destroying a computer and bringing two civilisations to the edge of
interplanetary war " A Taste of Armageddon"

4)  Freeing all the Thralls and encouraging the Protectors to aid their
development instead of using them for amusement "The Gamester's of 
Triskellion"

5) Spock's Brain was so bad I've tried to forget it. But I believe Kirk
destroyed that culture when he reclaimed the "Controller"

6) Ending a coup by saving the life of a baby in "Friday's Child"

7) Bringing the "Yangs" and "Coms" together in "The Omega Glory"

8) Encouraging the Companion to lose her immortality and become human
in "Metamorphosis". True she did it for love, but the situation had
existed for 200 years unchanged until Kirk and Co showed up.

Then there is corrective interference in
"A Private Little War","A Piece of the Action","Patterns of Force"

I am not sure how the society was affected by the Enterprise in
"For the World is Hollow and I have Touched the Sky",
"Plato's Stepchildren".
"This side of Paradise" ( The one where he marries Miramanee)

Then there is the episode where they find all the colonists are invaded by
spores that give them perfect health and a lifetime of dreaming. He evacuates
the colony. Since it is one of "ours" anyway this is probably not interfence.

Not bad for a selection out of a total of 78 episodes. 
It seems the only societies not affected by the Enterprise were the established
enemy (Klingon and Romulan) and more technologically advanced societies.
Other societies were either moulded or an announcement was made in the end that
they would develop along the right lines if left alone.
These latter include
"The Cloud Minders","Bread and Circuses"
I think it is an easier question to ask
"Is there any episode where 
1) A society existed that was radically different to ours
2) It was left to develop in its own way 
3) The Enterprise was able to intefere but chose not to because of the
Prime Directive"
If you append to this
4) It was in the personal interests of the Enterprise to intefere 
then I believe the answer is NONE.

I do not see Kirk as the upholder of the Prime Directive.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
From: stanaway@ssd.comm.mot.com (Chris Stanaway)
Subject: Re: STAR TREK II - The Wrath of Khan
Reply-To: stanaway@ssd.comm.mot.com
Organization: Motorola LMPS
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 20:43:38 GMT

In article 3003@ringer.cs.utsa.edu, lipscomb@lonestar.utsa.edu (David S. Lipscomb) writes:
>In article <1992Sep2.152337.15989@gserv1.dl.ac.uk> atb@gserv1.dl.ac.uk writes:
>>Hi
>>
>>I was watching my tape of TWOK over the weekend, i think its the best
>>of the films as its the *best* film as a piece of SF (I was a SF fan before
>>I became a Trekker). Anyway, when the big E goes off on the training cruise
>>with Admiral Jim along for the ride its only supposed to last 3 weeks.
>>(Sulu's comment on the shuttle from Spacedock to the big E).
>>When Jim gets the news about trouble at the Regulo 1 (sp) lab (Genesis lab)
>>he is ordered to take over and investigate as they are (rather conveniently)
>>the only ship in the sector. When Jim takes over he tells Scotty that he
>>wants to go at WARP SPEED, Sulu says *so much for the training cruise* (one of
>>the best lines in the film) and presses the appropriate button and the big E
>>warps off to the rescue.
>>This implies that before Jim takes over they weren't going at warp speed,
>>i.e. they were moving at sublight speed.
>>Now three weeks at sublight speed wouldn't really get them anywhere, they'd
>>be at the edge of the solar systems cometary Oort cloud thats all. I have
>>severe doubts that Starfleet had no other ships between Earth and Regulo 1.
>>
>>So why (apart from dramatic reasons) did the Enterprise go to Regulo 1?
>>
>>I know, get a life!  :-)
>>
>Maybe Kirk was chosen because of the past relationship with the doctor.

Who says that they were travelling on impulse power for the entire three
weeks???  They could have recently dropped out of warp for some engineering
maintiance training.  That would explain why Kirk told Scotty that he needed
warp speed.

To say that they sent to Regulo 1 because of Kirk's past relationship with
the doctor doesn't make any sense.  We were told that they were the only
ship in the area and I find it had to believe that Starfleet makes decisions
based on their captians' personal lives.

---

+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|J. Christopher Stanaway	|Motorola, Inc.			|
|stanaway@comm.mot.com		|Land Mobile Products Sector	|
|Voice:	(708) 576-4956		|IL02 Room 4413			|
|FAX:	(708) 576-6150		|1301 E. Algonquin Road		|
|				|Schaumburg, IL  60196		|
+---------------------------------------------------------------+

Why do people drive on parkways and park on driveways?
From: edc@evolution.bchs.uh.edu (edward s. chen)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: how can you read the starlog date?
Date: 30 Aug 92 04:28:25 GMT
Organization: Little to none, or maybe not......

In article <yZ67PB4w165w@berry.Cary.NC.US> pat@berry.Cary.NC.US (Pat Berry) writes:
>andy@rocky.gte.com (Andrew Busa) writes:
>
>1. 100 years passed between "Journey to Babel" and "Sarek".  (Sarek's age
>   is given in both episodes.)
>

Good so far, TNG season 3 = 2366 (since 1season = 1 year, "The Neutral Zone"
is in 2364). Therefore JtB is in 2266.  (The aforementioned 100 years)

>2. 15 years passed between "Space Seed" and "The Wrath of Khan".  (Kirk
>   says so.)
>

Kirk and Khan have never been the most reliable of sources ;-)
Paramount says TWoK takes place in 2285, or 19-20 years later then
Space Seed.  Not a big difference.

>3. "Journey to Babel" and "Space Seed" are both first-season episodes,
>   so we can be pretty sure that they're separated by, at most, a few
>   months.
>

Actually, "Space Seed" was a first season episode (#24), and "Journey to
Babel" is a second season episode (#44)

>4. Therefore, 85 years pass between "Wrath of Khan" and "Sarek".
>

Space Seed: 2265
Journey to Babel: 2266
TWoK: 2285
EaF: 2364
Sarek: 2366

<ESC>


-- 
..You either kiss the future or the past goodbye...
                          -- Ringo Starr (written by O'Deherty / Velez)
From: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu (Michael Rawdon)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: Stardates--from the horse's mouth
Date: 4 Sep 92 14:52:06 GMT
Reply-To: rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Dept., Madison, WI

[Cynicism alert:]

In <1992Sep4.080333.20285@nntp.uoregon.edu> eisimps@cie.uoregon.edu (Eileen Simpson) writes:
>If you are thinking of submitting a script, they suggest these guidelines
>to have the best chance of selling.

>AVOID (or NO):
>-Stories that rely on lots of action or special effects.

Ghod forbid that TNG should be exciting.

>-Stories depending on a prior relationship.

Especially since they went to all that effort to set up the Riker-Troi
and Picard-Dr. Crusher relationships early in the series.

>-Stories about the guest star, not the cast.

Since TNG frowns on characters who could change and evolve during the course
of an episode, or exhibit Treknically Incorrect characteristics.

>-Stories that could be on any other drama (drugs, AIDS, Divorce...)

Drugs ("Symbiosis"), homosexuality ("The Outcast")...

>-Stories without a personal aspect.

<kaff, kaff>

>-Stories about the supernatural, swords & socery.

Like Q?

>-Stories "high on the hoke scale" ("Troi kidnapped by space pirates, sold
>into slavery." (Sort of sorry to hear they feel this way. If they don't get
>her back, it could be one of my favorite shows!))

Like "Qpid"?  ("Guest star captured by the Sheriff of Nottingham!  Picard
and his Merry Men rush to the rescue!")

>The reason for many of these rules is $$.  It is a disappointment to find
>that the reason there are so darn few planet shows and so little action is
>that they have a script policy that discourages it!

You'd think these guys had never heard of location shooting before. :-)

>If you have a chance to attend one of these seminars, and you hope to write
>a script, DO IT.  Do it before you write your draft and save time.  I had
>a really neat idea for a show to get them off that damn ship, then found
>out those stories are not wanted.

"We spent all this money on those darned sets, so we're going to use them
as much as humanly possible!"

Sheeeeeesh.  Every time I think of writing a TNG episode, I suddenly am
informed of Ten Good Reasons Not To.

-- 
Michael Rawdon				 rawdon@colby.cs.wisc.edu
University of Wisconsin Computer Sciences Department, Madison, WI

"Beauty... survives."
				- James T. Kirk, "That Which Survives"
From: gbrach@galaxy.gov.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: Jack Crusher
Date: 31 Aug 92 15:19:31 -0700
Organization: BC Systems Corporation

In article <MecIJa_00WBKI3a4MC@andrew.cmu.edu>, Archie Lee Moberly <am4v+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> We know from "Encounter at Farpoint" that Picard may have brought the
> body back (I don't exactly remember if that happened).  However, we did
> learn from this episode that Picard at least was the first person to
> tell Bev and Wes personally that Jack had died.

This is confirmed by the scene (Beverly's nightmare) from _Violations_:  she
and Picard are going to the morgue to identify Jack Crusher's dead body
 
Gabor.
-- 
    g  b    gbrach@galaxy.gov.bc.ca   "Ye canna change th' laws of physic,
gggg   b    Victoria, B. C.	       Laws of physics"
g  g t b    (God's waiting room)       Ye canna change th' laws of physic, Jim"
ggggtttbbbb  							The Firm
   g t b  b 		"Am I the witness, or am I the crime
g  g t bbbb		 A victim of history, or just a sign of the times"
gggg  tt        				J. Clegg
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
From: jeffo@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (J.B. Nicholson-Owens)
Subject: Re: Sexism and Plunging Necklines (Was Re: What would you do ... ) 
Reply-To: jeffo@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 20:57:38 GMT

pierrot@milton.u.washington.edu (The Pierrot) writes:
>	I personally find it entirely 
>	plausible that Deanna might dress like that to make 
>	*herself* feel attractive, not to slavishly gain the 
>	approval of men;

Yeah, right. That doesn't explain that her position (ship's counselor)
is not to be attractive or not, but to counsel the people on the ship.

Women's breasts are kept secret and propped up with such unnecessary
items like Deanna Troi wears in order to keep the breasts sexually
exciting to men.  In other words, the fetishes of men are controlling
how women dress in this regard.  I disapprove of it entirely.  I see
no reason why Deanna Troi can't wear a regular shirt like a lot of
other people on the show do.  I've seen passers-by (always women)
wearing mini-skirts and low-cut items and I find them equally against
the idea that in the future portrayed by the show, these crew members
can just do what they were meant to do: seek out and explore strange
new worlds.  In no way is it necessary for those strange new worlds to
be explored while Deanna Troi sufficates while being compressed in a
tight shirt.

On the topic of sexism in ST:TNG, ever notice how even the women in
high ranking positions are addressed as 'sir'?  I think that's
exceptionally offensive; as if ST:TNG is saying that women can
(finally) be in the service *with* (as opposed to 'of') men, but
nobody will recognize them as women.  Instead we shall choose to
recognize them as men.  If they wanted a neutral term, neither 'sir'
nor 'madam' should have been used.  Actually, it's obvious who is
speaking and being spoken to in all circumstances that I can recall
where anyone has addressed anyone else on the show as 'sir', hence
another reason why neither 'sir' nor 'madam' is necessary.
-- 
-- Jeff (jeffo@uiuc.edu)
-- No NeXTmail please
From: cfbdb@ux1.cts.eiu.edu (Brett Bensley)
Subject: ST:TNG trading card hologram misprints?
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 20:08:37 GMT
Organization: Eastern Illinois University
Followup-To: cfbdb@ux1.cts.eiu.edu

I have a few hologram cards from the STAR TREK :The Next Generation
inaugural edition that do not have the H designation...they have the card
numbers that corespond to the regular issue cards (i.e. the Klingon
Battleship is card number 033).  Is this a misprint or has anyone else
found these cards  (I am missing one to make the four set, and have a
duplicate...offers anyone?)

Brett, cfbdb,ux1.cts.eiu.edu

Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
From: tomcat@cwis.unomaha.edu (Jeffrey S. Jo)
Subject: Re: Which one is "Cost of Living"?
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 04:43:18 GMT

bandy@aplcen.apl.jhu.edu  writes:
> It seems that everyone agrees that the Cost of Living episode sucked.  Can
> someone refresh our memories and briefly describe the plot for that episode?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 	Mike Bandy
> 	Johns Hopkins University / Applied Physics Lab
> 	bandy@aplcen.apl.jhu.edu

	Oh gosh!  The wonderful episode opens with the *Enterprise* destroying
an asteroid.  Okay, crisis solved.  BUT....a lifeform that eats or digests
neutronium (?) invades the ship.  In the meantime, Lxwana Troi beams aboard
and informs the crew of her wedding to a man she has never met.  Step in
Worf and son, who are having problems, again.  Deanna tries to solve the 
conflict by a contract between father and son.  WELL, Mother Troi takes
Alexander (Little Warrior) and shows him a fun time on the Holodeck. Father
angry, Deanna frustrated.  Meantime, invaders cause havoc on ship.  Systems
are going down all over the ship.  Back to Mother Troi.  She's sad and alone,
that's why she's getting married, but not the traditional Betazoid manner 
(naked).  She goes into a 5 minute speech about being lonely (I feel for
Majel Barret since this was made after the death of her husband).  Data saves
ship, father and son are happy, and Mother Troi walks into wedding stark 
naked.  Wedding canceled, Worf, Little Warrior, Troi and Mother go for a
mud bath.  End of show, thank you, sorry I dragged it on, but that's how
the show felt like it was going.
-- 
|Jeffrey S. Jo                  |	       U.S.S. Enterprise              |
|Computer Operations		| Galaxy Class - Starfleet Registry NCC-1701-D|
|University of Nebraska at Omaha|        Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards, Mars    |
|tomcat@cwis.unomaha.edu        |             Launched Stardate 40759.5       |
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
From: ira2p@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Iain Robert Asplin)
Subject: Re: Prime Directive
Organization: University of Virginia
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 03:09:06 GMT

In article <25800@dog.ee.lbl.gov> drucker@csa1.lbl.gov writes:

The Prime Directive applies only to Starfleet personnel, not civilians
at large.  Reference: "Angel One" where Riker wants to remove the survivors
from the planet, but they refuse, and Data reminds Riker and Yar that
since the survivors were not Starfleet personnel, they are not bound by
the Prime Directive.

If you want another reference, how about the oath everyone talks about,
you know, the one that all the crew have sworn to and will die to defend
to protect the Prime Directive.  A private citizen need not take an oath
I would think.
From: mwiz@mpd.tandem.com (Marc Wiz)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Star Trek VI Pfaltzgraff buffet sets still available
Date: 31 Aug 92 14:57:00 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Do you really want to know?
Originator: mwiz@medha

I just called the Marshall Fields 800 number and there are still a few
of the Trek VI Pfaltzgraff buffet sets available.  They did not show
up on the computer but they are available.

The number is 1-800-292-2450.

Disclaimer:  I'm just a fan informing the rest of "Trekdom" that the
sets are available.

Marc
-- 
Marc Wiz			Yes that really is my last name.
MaBell:				(512)244-8780
Internet:			mwiz@mpd.tandem.com
The views expressed are my own.  Mine all mine!
From: Sem_Hoelscher@hb.maus.de (Sem Hoelscher)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: Feinbergers
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 16:00:00 GMT
Organization: MausNet
X-Gateway: MausGate/News 1.11

Shacha Catherine!

[cb] Did anyone notice if Mr. Feinberger did props for this one??
I don't know, since I usually do not look who did these things, but reading
this name reminds me: When I started to read the novels, I found it there,
something like "And he took out his feinberger". >8-) Fortunately, then I
had already contact with other Trekkers here, otherwise I would have sat
there and thought "What the d**** is that?", grin. There are some other
things like that, but I can't find a page or a novel, where it was. (Now
I mark such lines, but then I didn't.) It was too funny! (BTW: I knew, who
he is from the Compendium by Asherman.)
And what may Feinberger think, that he is even in the novels? >8-)

Oyori - Sem [grinning in finally rainy Northern German]
From: pat@berry.Cary.NC.US (Pat Berry)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.misc
Subject: Re: how can you read the starlog date?
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 23:21:35 EDT
Organization: Berry Communications

lenin@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Alejandro Perez-Pulido) writes:

> How can you tell the date by the log entries date of the captain?

You can't.  All the stardate tells you is what season the episode is in
(that's the second digit).

> wouldn't that clear the question on how many years passed since ST and STTNG?

No, because we still wouldn't have any dates for the original series.

However, we do know one thing: 100 years passed between "Journey to
Babel" and "Sarek".  Sarek's age (in Terran years) is given in both
episodes.

-- 
Pat Berry - Cary, North Carolina, USA   | Dave Barry for President
pat@berry.Cary.NC.US                    |  "He Probably Won't Use
**** Happy user of OS/2 2.0 ****        |     Nuclear Weapons"