From: wilf@niksula.hut.fi (Johan W. Wikman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Finnish Defense
Date: 17 Dec 92 19:41:25
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
NNTP-Posting-Host: blob.cs.hut.fi
In-reply-to: ryyti@jyu.fi's message of Wed, 16 Dec 1992 08:09:16 GMT


I wrote:

> : This was not at all what I was asking you about. I would specifically
> : like to have a comment on "The danger is the 5th colonna of Finlandswedes".

Jarmo answered:

> So I spesify the danger of the 5th colonna of Finlandswedes.
> 
> I see it following way:
> 
> For example: When speaking for instance about skandinaviska as an official
> language of EC in the future for all the nordics, the finlandswedes eagerly
> support the idea once the Swedenswedes propose the idea.

As far as I know any country is free to choose (among the languages
supported by EC) which language it uses at the meetings within EC.
So, would skandinaviska become an official language of EC, I can't see
how it could harm you or Finland in any way. I would consider it a
great shame, though, if Finland would use english instead of 
skandinaviska. Somehow I get the impression that for you it is more
important that skandinaviska is not an official language than e.g.
that finnish would be one.

It seems like you are a very eager supporter of the finnish language 
and culture, and that I admire. But how come you find it perfectly
ok, for you to support your cause e.g. by attacking your fellow
countrymen (which you are doing your article) and outrageous when 
Finlandswedes try to protect their language and their culture (which 
to its biggest part is the very same as the Finnish culture anyway).

> The same way  the importance of skandinaviska as a
> lingua franca of Norden is supported by the finlandswedes eagerly if
> the swedes of Sweden once so propose.

I'd say the finlandswedes support the idea of skandinaviska as a
lingua franca of Norden, period. With or without Sweden. 
Your biggest misconception is that you draw an equalsign between 
Swedes and Finlandswedes. But I believe it is a misconception
you like, because with it you can support your opinions.

> I think this kind of development is bad for Finland and the finns. 
> : 
> In this sence I see Finlandswedes as a 5th colonna.

I see. Well then, could you define a Finlandswede for me, so that I
can recognize a member of the "5th column" when I see one, and even
find out if I myself am a member of this sinister bunch.
I have a few alternatives here, perhaps you can give me some more?

Finlandswedes ?
---------------
1) Every person with a swedish name. Sounds reasonable, but that 
   would include several presidents of Finland (Svinhufvud, Relander, 
   Sthlberg), and you cannot call them traitors, can you?

2) Every person with swedish as mothertounge. That would include
   persons like Eugen Schauman, C.G.Mannerheim etc. Are they members?

3) And what about people with finnish names who still consider
   themselves as Finlandswedes.

4) And persons with swedish names whose mothertounge is finnish, to
   which group do they belong? Traitors or not?

Or could it perhaps be so that anybody who doesn't share Jarmo
Ryyti's opinions is a member of this "5th column"?
  
> One should remeber that the political party of Finlandswedes is not named
> Finlandswedish Party but Swedish Party. It supports my humble theory
> of 5th colonna inside Finland.

This is nonsence, and you know it. "Svenska" in SFP (Svenska
Folkpartiet) refers to the language, not to Sweden. (Just for the
record, I'm not a member of SFP, nor do I vote on them.)

> I hope you are satisfied with the answer, so you could answer my questions:
> 
> 1.Why there is no single swede demanding for the Swedenfinns similar rights
> as Finlandswedes have? Do you know any such a liberal person?
>
> 2.Why Sweden is not bilingual like Finland?

Questions like these have been beaten to death several times in this
newsgroup so I won't annoy everybody else by answering them. I might 
mail you my opinion, however. In fact I think we should move this entire
conversation to mail.

> regards,
> jarmo ryyti

Merry Christmas,
    Johan

    
--
wilf@niksula.cs.hut.fi
Johan Wikman

Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic