From: wood@eisley.UUCP (Ken Wood)
Newsgroups: seattle.general
Subject: More on music censorship in Wa.
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 92 22:14:02 PDT
Organization: Mos Eisley BBS (763-1986)


>Followup-To: chuan@milton.u.washington.edu

     How annoying.  It seems like all the UW posts do this.

chuan@milton.u.washington.edu (Chuan Lee) writes
>In article <1992Apr7.043045.7060@u.washington.edu> iho@cac.washington.edu write
>:
>>lamontg@milton.u.washington.edu (Lamont Granquist) writes:
>>> il@bambam.u.washington.edu (Il Hwan Oh) writes:
     < 12 lines of unnecessary quotes that everybody has read many 
        times before deleted >
>>That's very nice in theory, but how do you propose to teach a 6-year
>>old how to deal with everything he/she might possibly encounter in
>>the world?  I think parents nowadays need all the help they can get.

     How about by teaching them to actually THINK for themselves 
and not be sheep.  Yes it is possible to start this even at 6 and 
if the child is too young to learn than they are too young to be 
negativly influenced by "exposure" to questionable musical lyrics.
If the parents can't raise their kids they shouldn't rely on the 
state to do it.  It's the last place anybody should be looking for 
help.

     < 7 more lines gone >

>>How is this different from the existing rating system for movies?

     As has been pointed out before: 1) It is voluntary 2) Our tax 
money dosen't pay for it 3) Many of us still think this is wrong 4) 
this ONLY effects attendance at member theaters, not sales.

     < 10 more lines including a quoted .sig gone >

>I agree with >> >'s and >'s.

     Was it really necessary to quote all of this just to say that 
you agree.  Please use an editor in the future to delete the 
unnecessary junk.

>So what is the fuss about this "censorship"?  I wonder why was this law
>being labelled "censorship" at the first place?  How can it be a censorship
>if I can still buy the so-called censored record at the store, and that
>its contents are as original as it was recorded?

     It is censorship because only some people can buy it and if 
sales go down stores will stop carrying it ( some may anyway to 
avoide legal problems ).  Also bands, or more likely their 
producers, may resort to censoring the lyrics to avoid haveing 
their sales restricted.  All of this is censorship, and once you 
allow ANY amount of censorship you open the door to more and more.  
There is always someone out there who is sure that they know what 
is best for everybody else.

>Somehow my feeling is that those you-teach-your-kid-your-way-and-I-teach-
>my-kid-my-way forks just don't want to be responsible for things they or
>their kids do (more likely the former reason).  Do you think they care
>about kids?  No, they just hate being held accountable for WHAT THEY DO
>to the kids: sell them cigarettes, serve them liquor, lay a loaded gun
>casually at home, etc.
>
>Chuan Lee

     Now I have a reason to actualy be personaly mad at you.  
Before you go makeing inflamitory generalizations (sp) why don't you go 
get a clue and a real life to use it with.  It has been my near 
universal experience that the exact opposite is true.  The people 
who you are putting down are the ones who actualy take the time to 
TALK to their kids and teach them to think for themselves.  They 
are the ONES who care about their kids and are willing to put time 
into raising them.  What they DON'T want is for somebody else to 
TELL them how to raise their kids.
  
     In contrast the "regulators" want the government to do it for them.  
The people who want to turn over the care, education, and well being 
of their children to the government legislature are the ones who 
really don't care about their kids or they would take the time to 
teach them right and wrong, not to smoke, not to drink, not to play 
with guns, etc.  They are the ones looking for somebody else to 
blame for how the kids turn out.  

     Yes I just engaged in sweeping generalizations (sp) just as 
you did, and I'm willing to admit that this is not true of 
everybody on either side of this argument, but as I said before my 
personal experience on this topic supports my statements almost 100%.
  

     One other thing that really bugs me about this is the way it 
was run through the legislature fast and quite.  No body even heard 
about it till it was onto the gov's desk, and then it was too late 
to complain.  There was no opportunity for debate or for the public 
to tell their reps just what they think.  Somebody slipped this one 
through and we all got stuck with it.
 
     Ken Wood
 
     Who let the pigs play poker?