HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sun, 6 Sep 1992 18:23:11 EDT
From:         Harold Johnson <HJOHNSON@KENTVM.BITNET>
Subject:      focus for teacher preparation

I am a new member to this listserve group, so I hope that the following
request is both appropriate and well received.  I am a fast learner and
would appreciate your comments.  The following message was also posted on
SpecialNet via the Deaf.Ed bulletin board [I am the editor of the board].

September 6, 1992
Kent, OH

	Submitted by: Harold Johnson

	"A question of Focus"

	I am the director of a large, deaf education teacher training
program.  At the present time, there are over 100 undergraduate and
graduate students in the Program (Kent State University).  Our Fall
semester has just begun and I am once again faced with the challenge of
preparing my students to become effective teachers of the deaf.  The
purpose of this message is to request your assistance in relation to
that preparation.  I would be very interested to your answer to the
following question:

	"What are the primary problems that teachers of the deaf
	should be prepared to address?"

I will use the responses to this question to guide my work this year.
Please send your replies to me via one of the following means:

	SPECIALNET address: OHIO.HIP
	BITNET address    : HJOHNSON@KENTVM
	INTERNET address  : HJOHNSON@KENTVM.KENT.EDU
	FAX #             : (216) 672-3715
	Office address    : Harold Johnson
			    401 White Hall
			    Kent State University
			    Kent, OH    44242-0001
	Office phone	  : (216) 672-2477 [voice]
			  : (216) 672-2396 [TDD]

I will also share the summary results of responses to this question
via this network.

Thank you for your help in this matter.  Together we can make difference,
separate we can do little.
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Fri, 4 Sep 1992 16:07:27 JST
From:         KAERI Kim YongChe <yckim@SORAK.KAIST.AC.KR>
Subject:      Re: Korean
              4, 92 12:13 am

Annie,

  ** Korean is not a tonal language. **

Thank you for the time and effort. I am now relieved
to see the matter staightened. Will you further do me
a favor settling whether Japanese and Vietanmese are
tonal languages?

Yong Che  <yckim@sorak.kaist.ac.kr>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Fri, 11 Sep 1992 23:51:52 EDT
From:         -- <sipb7@ATHENA.MIT.EDU>
Subject:      words & phrases
              03 Sep 92 16:31:00 -0500. <9209040020.AA04735@Athena.MIT.EDU>

        Steve Conlee says:
        Would it be more correct to say that ASL "words" are actually
        English phrases?

A language is an intimate part of a culture.  In the minds of its
speakers, each word of a language is connected with a complicated
network of ideas that are important to the speaker's culture.

Even within American English, the word "family" could mean different
things to a black man at an extended-family reunion, a lesbian couple
with an adopted child, and a fundamentalist Mormon man with four
wives.  If these three people were to meet in a bus station and strike
up a conversation about their "families", and were not aware of the
different meanings they had for the term, they might not communicate
clearly.

Turning to ASL: the ASL sign HEARING cannot be translated
word-for-word into the English word "hearing".  (For instance, "Boston
Public Library" is sometimes signed "BOSTON HEARING LIBRARY".)
HEARING is connected to various ideas in Deaf culture about what it
means to be HEARING or DEAF--ideas that are *not* so connected in the
mainstream culture.

This works the other way, too.  For example, the Gally and NTID alums
I've met tell me there is no ASL sign for "thesis" (as in "bachelor's
thesis").  If I wanted to talk about my bachelor's thesis to a Deaf
person who didn't know the English word, I would have to explain it
with an ASL phrase.  (I believe there is a common way of doing this:
sign "T-H-E-S-I-S, QUOTE, [explanation]", or something like that.)

--
seth gordon ... sign-impaired ... the learning center for deaf children
<sipb7@athena.mit.edu>        ... old, nearly obsolete e-mail address
<sethg@silver.lcs.mit.edu>    <== new, improved e-mail address -- use it!
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sat, 12 Sep 1992 00:47:37 EDT
From:         -- <sipb7@ATHENA.MIT.EDU>
Subject:      bi/bi
              05 Sep 92 21:57:40 -0400. <9209060220.AA02682@Athena.MIT.EDU>

    Harold Johnson says:
    Initial Questions/Concerns:  Who else belongs to this listserve
    group?  Who is involved in microethnographic research on the impact
    of Bi/Bi?

I'm working as an overnight dorm counselor at a bi/bi school.  I'm not
sure if I'm doing "microethographic research", but I'm trying to
figure out What The Hell Is Going On between and among the hearing and
deaf staff.  My ASL isn't good enough for me to work in the academic
program or have extended discussions with the kids about their
schoolwork, so I can't directly observe how the bi/bi approach affects
the kids' performance.

--
seth gordon ... sign-impaired ... the learning center for deaf children
<sipb7@athena.mit.edu>        ... old, nearly obsolete e-mail address
<sethg@silver.lcs.mit.edu>    <== new, improved e-mail address -- use it!
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: deaf-l@SIUCVMB.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"deaf-l@siucvmb.bitnet"
X-VMS-Cc: SG1787
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Mon, 14 Sep 1992 23:11:00 EDT
From:         "Men are like eggs: Fresh, rotten,
              or hard-boiled." <SG1787@ALBNYVMS.BITNET>
Subject:      Introduction

Hi!

I wanted to introduce myself to the members of the list.  Usually I'd wait
to see what the "flavour" of the list is like before posting, but I haven't
received enough mail to tell.

Ack - how to describe myself and say what I mean without talking gibberish -
I'm tired.

I'm a temporarily delayed college student, planning to earn a degree as a
Certified Nurse Midwife.  Because of several reasons, including deaf relatives,
an interest in languages, a belief that a Health Care Professional should be
multilingual and free tuition at a local college, I took 2 semesters of
college level ASL here in Albany.

Now, I find that I am forgetting what I learned for lack of practice.

Does ANYONE know anyone in ALbany, NY area who would be willing to help
a good student along?

I'm friendly, and promise that I'd be a lot of fun to be with.,,

I look forward to email,
Sarah
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Fri, 11 Sep 1992 23:56:23 EDT
From:         -- <sipb7@ATHENA.MIT.EDU>
Subject:      eyebrow
              04 Sep 92 08:58:23 -0400. <9209041314.AA22037@Athena.MIT.EDU>

    Esther Paris says:
    Everyone knows that Star Trek's Mr. Spock is intrigued or incredulous
    when he raises that one eyebrow.  How does he do that?

I raise one eyebrow when I am intrigued, but it's an involuntary
motion; I can't consciously raise only one eyebrow.

Bernard Bragg has a mime routine about an orchestra conductor whose
arms freeze up, and the conductor proceeds to waggle his eyebrows back
and forth.

Some lucky people are just more coordinated than others.  At least I
can roll my tongue.

--
seth gordon ... sign-impaired ... the learning center for deaf children
<sipb7@athena.mit.edu>        ... old, nearly obsolete e-mail address
<sethg@silver.lcs.mit.edu>    <== new, improved e-mail address -- use it!
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Mon, 14 Sep 1992 09:15:27 +1200
From:         Dave Moskovitz <mosko@MATAI.VUW.AC.NZ>
Subject:      Unlocking the curriculum

Stephen Kotchen recently asked for more information on "Unlocking the
Curriculum".  The Winter 1990 issue of Sign Language Studies (number 69)
was dubbed "A Special Extra Length Issue: Simultaneous Communication,
American Sign Language, and Other Classroom Modes Using Signs".  It contains
two articles specifically about "Unlocking the Curriculum", as well as
several other interesting articles.  I highly recommend it to anyone who
wants to follow this important debate.

David Moskovitz
Technical Editor
Dictionary of New Zealand Sign Language
mosko@matai.vuw.ac.nz
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Fri, 11 Sep 1992 23:59:27 EDT
From:         -- <sipb7@ATHENA.MIT.EDU>
Subject:      Re: VSex vs XSex
              02 Sep 92 00:15:46 -0400. <9209041631.AA04098@Athena.MIT.EDU>

      Dave Windley says:
      The SEX that the other poster is referring to [XSex] seems to be SEX
      as in GENDER, not SEX as in INTERCOURSE [VSex].  I think that may be
      the source of confusion.

Up here, the X-handshape SEX can mean "sexual intercourse" or
"gender".  If you use the V-handshape with the same location and
movement, it means "virgin".

Your dialect, of course, may vary.

--
seth gordon ... sign-impaired ... the learning center for deaf children
<sipb7@athena.mit.edu>        ... old, nearly obsolete e-mail address
<sethg@silver.lcs.mit.edu>    <== new, improved e-mail address -- use it!
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sat, 12 Sep 1992 11:19:28 EDT
From:         "Stephen J. Kotchen" <CASK@CATCC.BITNET>
Subject:      re: SIMCOM teaching

>       I would like to address the issue of mainstreaming with a
>       focus on one specific facet of the educational process.  A
>       detailed report was produced by a research team at Gallaudet
>       University some time ago, entitled "Unlocking the Curriculum".
>       In this report, a teacher like yourself taught a mixture of
>       students using spoken English and sign language.


    I am interested to get more information about "Unlocking the
Curriculum". If you have a book, pls inform me the arthor.

                                        Thanks

--Stephen Kotchen
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sun, 13 Sep 1992 02:21:21 EDT
From:         "(Annie Senghas)" <annie@PSYCHE.MIT.EDU>
Subject:      still torturing small animals

BTW, Heather, must you mention torturing small animals in your .sig?
Especially after someone has mentioned that she finds it disturbing?
I too find it gratuitous and offensive.  I hope, in the interest of
kindness, courtesy, and compassion, that you will remove it.

Annie
(annie@psyche.mit.edu)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: DEAF-L@SIUCVMB.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"DEAF-L%SIUCVMB.BITNET@vaxf.colorado.edu"
X-VMS-Cc: CAREY_B
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sun, 13 Sep 1992 15:46:00 -0700
From:         "Bryce Carey, CNS,
              Admin. Sys. Group" <CAREY_B@CUBLDR.COLORADO.EDU>
Subject:      Re: still torturing small animals

From Carey_b@cubldr.colorado.edu

Heather Garvey replies:

>"(Annie Senghas)" <annie@PSYCHE.MIT.EDU> writes:
>>BTW, Heather, must you mention torturing small animals in your .sig?
>>Especially after someone has mentioned that she finds it disturbing?
>>I too find it gratuitous and offensive.  I hope, in the interest of
>>kindness, courtesy, and compassion, that you will remove it.

>       Actually, I never received such a comment from anyone.
>It must not have made it to Usenet.
>       But obviously you've never had the occasion to deal with
>Cleveland Freenet or you'd understand how it could drive a nice
>man like my Math prof to such a statement.:) Which is meant to be
>humerous. If you don't like it, don't read it. No one is forcing
>you to read the .sig file along with the article.

>--
>       " ...dealing with Free-Net makes me very angry  | Heather "Moose"
>and gives me thoughts of breaking things and torturing  | Garvey, Biochem 93'
>small animals. "   --  Bruce Ikenaga <bxi@po.cwru.edu>  | <hlg@po.cwru.edu>

Heather,

I believe it was Miriam Clifford who first objected.

I understand the attempt at humor. I have no problem with the part
about torturing small animals. Obviously something small and relatively
defenseless DESERVES to be made to suffer to relieve the distress caused
to Mr. Ikenaga by Cleveland Free-Net. Perhaps in extreme cases he
could substitute "beating my wife and abusing small children."

It's the breaking of things that disturbs me. I would simply not trust
a man who derives psychological relief and humorous enjoyment from the
thought of destroying perfectly innocent inanimate objects.

Why not address this anger at the actual cause of the anger, namely
the designers and operators of Free-Net? Presumably they deserve to
be beaten and tortured in retribution for systemic failures. That'll
teach 'em a lesson.

The trouble with your suggestion that people simply not read the .sig
file is that it is a catch 22 situation; we have to read what you say
before we can form an opinion that we would prefer not to read what you say.
The alternative is to delete all unread messages from Heather Garvey,
but you make too much sense, most of the time, for me to want to do that.

-Bryce
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: DEAF-L@SIUCVMB.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"DEAF-L@SIUCVMB.BITNET"
X-VMS-Cc: SG1787
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 15 Sep 1992 01:05:00 EDT
From:         "Men are like eggs: Fresh, rotten,
              or hard-boiled." <SG1787@ALBNYVMS.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Introduction

Hi!

I was so afraid that people wouldn't want me on this list because I'm not
deaf or hard-of-hearing, but I guess I was just being paranoid, as usual.

Eventually, should my skills become proficient enough, I'd like to become a
lisenced medical interpreter.  This seems like a good way to put myself
through school - by offering a needed ability while helping people and keeping
up my own signing.  What I want MOST of all, is to be in a position to not need
an interpreter.  No matter how accurate and quick, it's not the same as
talking for yourself.  My uncle and I had a long talk about it (he's been
deaf since birth) and he agrees that it is a valuable thing to know how to do,
and as my ASL teacher said, "Deaf women have babies too!".

To get a degree as a midwife, first you need an RN, then eiteh
sorry - either a certificate program or a master's degree to get the
CNM (Certicied Nurse Midwife)

I forgot ehat else your letter said... sorry, I'll end this, and if I
missed anything, I'll post again.

I forgot to say in my intro that for anyone who might be interested in
meeting with me: I am a 23 years old who enjoys computers, animals,
cookine, games (board, computer, role playing) and many many more things.

Sarah
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sat, 5 Sep 1992 09:12:54 -0400
From:         Miriam Clifford <DMIMI@ECSVAX.BITNET>
Subject: Re: LGB ed vs Deaf ed

Alan:

Your point about the choice of labels and that the majority will pick the
label it wants to is well taken.  Your example, however, is a little less
accurate--to nit pick a little.  Caption decoders are being used by the
illiterate and foreign language speakers who want to learn English as well
as by the hearing impaired.  They sure aren't hearing impaired--or at least
most of them aren't.  :-)

dmimi@ecsvax.uncecs.edu  dmimi@ecsvax.bitnet
Miriam (Mimi) Clifford; 2535 Sevier St, Durham, NC 27705; 919-489-4821
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 8 Sep 1992 17:02:36 EDT
From:         "Cathy Brandt" <CBRAN00@UKCC.UKY.EDU>
Subject:      Re: personal bio
              2 Sep 1992 11:54:00 BST from <DDBT23@UPVAX.ULSTER.AC.UK>

Martin,

I am a teacher of the deaf/hearing impaired.  We're studying communication this
year!

Would you send us a brief note so we can learn about you and receive a post
from your beautiful country?

Thanks!

Cathy Brandt
cbran00@ukcc.uky.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sun, 6 Sep 1992 17:11:13 EDT
From:         Harold Johnson <HJOHNSON@KENTVM.BITNET>
Subject:      info. re. DEAFTEK
              6 Sep 1992 12:46:28 -0600 from
              </PN=BRENDA.L.MONENE/O=DEAFTEK/ADMD=TELEMAIL/C=US/@SPRINT.COM>

Brenda, thanks for the offer to send me information re. deaftek.usa.

My address is as follows:

  Harold A. Johnson
  Associate Professor
  401 White Hall
  Kent State University
  Kent, OH    44242-0001

  (216) 672-2477 (voice)

I look forward to your information.
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sat, 5 Sep 1992 17:51:50 IST
From:         Lew Golan <LEW@TAUNIVM.BITNET>
Subject:      ear tags, etc.

Mimi says that for a hard of hearing person, it helps her understand the
speaker better if he gets closer to her ear.

     For me, as a deaf person, it's just the opposite. Getting closer is
counterproductive, because it puts the speaker's face out of focus (I wear
glasses) or even out of sight.
     In a noisy situation such as at a party, people keep moving closer
(just as they do to hearing people) -- so I am constantly pushing them back
(yes, Bryce, physically -- I take them by the shoulders and push them back)
to put them into focus.
     This is a major reason why the labels "deaf" and "hard of hearing" are
necessary -- not because of ideology or vanity or whatever, but because
they make an important functional distinction that helps people communicate
with Mimi and me according to our distinct needs.
     I have no problem with the use of "hearing impaired" to cover the
total population of people with less-than-normal hearing. But I do have a
problem with its application to me as an individual, because it does not
tell the speaker that I can't hear AT ALL and that he's got to stay where I
can see his face in focus.
     That's why I tell people I'm deaf, not hearing impaired. And that's
why I think Cathy's description of herself as a teacher of the hearing
impaired is equally appropriate and descriptive of her function -- assuming
that her students include both deaf and hard of hearing children.

Lew Golan, Tel-Aviv University <lew@vm.tau.ac.il>
From: garvey@skybridge.SCL.CWRU.Edu (Heather Garvey)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Re: still torturing small animals
Date: 13 Sep 92 17:01:03 GMT
Organization: Smith Undergrad Lab, CWRU, Cleve. OH
NNTP-Posting-Host: marina.scl.cwru.edu
X-Post-Machine: marina.scl.cwru.edu

"(Annie Senghas)" <annie@PSYCHE.MIT.EDU> writes:
>BTW, Heather, must you mention torturing small animals in your .sig?
>Especially after someone has mentioned that she finds it disturbing?
>I too find it gratuitous and offensive.  I hope, in the interest of
>kindness, courtesy, and compassion, that you will remove it.

	Actually, I never received such a comment from anyone.
It must not have made it to Usenet.
	But obviously you've never had the occasion to deal with 
Cleveland Freenet or you'd understand how it could drive a nice
man like my Math prof to such a statement.:) Which is meant to be
humerous. If you don't like it, don't read it. No one is forcing 
you to read the .sig file along with the article.

--
	" ...dealing with Free-Net makes me very angry  | Heather "Moose"
and gives me thoughts of breaking things and torturing  | Garvey, Biochem 93'
small animals. "   --  Bruce Ikenaga <bxi@po.cwru.edu>  | <hlg@po.cwru.edu>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sun, 13 Sep 1992 02:15:18 EDT
From:         "(Annie Senghas)" <annie@PSYCHE.MIT.EDU>
Subject:      Re: LGB language

I am sorry I used the word "queer" to begin with.  It slipped in,
because it is firmly part of my vocabulary, but I was using LGB
in order to avoid this debate on this list.  This debate does not
belong on this list.  This debate belongs firmly within the
LGB-TS-TG-TV communities.  (That is, Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual,
Transsexual, Transgenderist, and Transvestite.)

The word "queer" is as debated within these communities as adamantly
as "hearing impaired" is debated among the deaf.  I would not encourage
a debate on the gaynet about the words "hearing impaired" either.

The word "queer" does not mean the same thing as "homosexual."  Most
people that I know who identify as queer (which is many) are not,
in fact, homosexual.  "Queer" is a cultural term.  It denotes certain
people who choose to be marginal.  Not all homosexuals choose to be
marginal.  Not all LGBs are queer.

"Queer" means different, strange.  It does not, in itself, mean bad
or wrong.  However, in much of the mainstream, it is bad or wrong
to be different or strange.  To those of us on the fringe who embrace
our marginality, it is good and wonderful to be different and strange.
It is good and wonderful to be queer.  One hopes it helps force us
to be more conscious.  One hopes it spares us from lemmingdom.  (Plus
all the other goodies I mentioned in my a marginal perspective" entry
from eons ago.. was it last June?)

Uh oh.. here I am, getting drawn into the debate myself.  Let's hope
it ends soon.  Let's move it to the gaynet where it belongs.  In fact,
we don't need to.  It is being debated there already, as you read.
In fact, I'd be willing to bet the conformity vs. diversity debate
exists on almost every list, in some form, especially with respect
to naming groups.

Annie :+(  (today I am a sad clown)
(annie@psyche.mit.edu)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 9 Sep 1992 09:05:42 EDT
From:         "Joseph P. Riolo" <riolo@COR4.PICA.ARMY.MIL>
Subject: Re: Hebrew langauge

Bryce,

       I intended to answer your "why" question but I did not know
the answer.  So, I gave you the history instead.

       I never thought of your question.  When I tried to remember what
I was reading, I did not think that there was any good answer to your
question.  We may speculate forever why Hebrew (as well as some other
Semitic language like Aramaic) language does have letters that stands for
vowels only.

       There is another interesting question.  Why does the first alphabet
has only 22 letters, nothing more or less?  Greek alphabet has 24 letters,
by the way.  Why doesn't it add five more letters for vowels?  Also, we
still do not understand fully how the alphabet was first developed.  One
may argue that it is based on Egyptian hieroglyphic.  Other may argue that
it is an independent development - in other words, a new invention.

>I am wondering if the reason that vowels are not so much needed is
>that if people 'sound out' the consonant letters they must put
>in vowels anyway and they can just put in the correct vowels
>because the word is familar. In other words, (no pun intended!)
>the way it sounds is remembered, and not the way it looks. ...


       Let me tell you a little more about Hebrew language that
will invalidate your speculation.

       A lot of basic words in Hebrew language have three consonants.
Some have only two consonants.  Few have four.  For example, the
word 'nathan' which means gift has three consonants:

                   n - th - n

If you want to use it as a noun, you have to put two 'a's:

                   n - a - th - a - n

which means "gift".  But, if you want to use it as a verb, you have
to put (if I remember correctly) 'a' and 'e':

                  n - a - th - e - n

which means "give".  And, if you want to use it as a modifier (like
adjective in English), you have to use other vowels which I do not
remember right now and it means "giving" like in "giving man"
or it means "one who gives".

      Not only for this specific set of consonants, it also works
for many other sets of consonants.  For example, k - t - b which
stands for the idea of 'writing': k - a - t - a - b for "writing",
k - a - t - e - b for "write", etc.

      So, Bryce, I think that we should speculate that one is able
to know the vowels not just by how the consonant sound but also by
how the words are placed in a sentence ("the way it looks").

                                        Joseph P. Riolo
                                        <riolo@pica.army.mil>