From: ogorman@unix1.tcd.ie (Lucifuge)
Subject: Re: Merry Christmas Ashers!
Keywords: humbug
Organization: Trinity College, Dublin
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 18:51:47 GMT

In <1992Aug14.185144.1818@eskimo.celestial.com> alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler) writes:

>    A better perception might be
>A: There is a terrible situation that I cannot change.
>B: Why the f**k am I going to let situations outside my control affect
>   my emotions?  I can CHOOSE to feel any way I want to.
>C: Therefore I might as well feel good.

Bovine Scatology. One does not choose the way one feels, one FEELS the
way one feels. It's easy to stand outside and say you can feel whatever
way you like, but try doing it when the world has dropped a ton of shit
on you and then driven over it in a bulldozer to make sure.

>A: There is a terrible situation that I cannot change.
>B: There are also a lot of ok situations that I can enjoy if I want to.
>C: I will get involved in and enjoy the situations that I can.

Also bollocks. See above.
 
>A: There is a terrible situation that I cannot change.
>B: There are a lot of people a heck of a lot worse of than I am  (maybe not
>   the majority but even 1% worse off is 100's of millions of people)
>C: Why don't I stop moping around in this pool of self pity and get over it.

Again shite. I should be happy cause things might be worse. Give me a
break. When your heart has been ripped out you sort of lack that kind of
objectivity, compriS?

>   And some people spend an awful lot of energy convincing themselves that is
>true.  Why do you need to believe everything is awful so strongly?

Why do you need to believe it isn't?

Amazing how insulting implying someone is desperately clinging to a
false belief because they can't handle reality is, isn't it?

>   Yeah, bummer.  I know that wall.  When you crash into it, it really
>hurts.
>   I wish I could tell you ways around it.  I cant.  All I can say is
>that there are things you haven't tried.  And there are other ways of
>looking at things.  And you can give negative things less importance
>and give positive things more importance.  Even though it doesn't feel
>like it sometimes you really do choose how you feel and how you react
>to events around you.

Among the things I haven't tried are murder and suicide. Are you
suggesting I do so? Your belief system is very amusing..."I will assign
this experience this value...". So logical and precise and doomed.
 

>    If circumstances are beyond your control then why let them be so
>important as to control your feelings?  Why not let the circumstances
>that you can control be the ones that you react emotionally to?  Or
>why not let the positive circumstances beyond your control be the most
>important in controlling your feelings?  It sure sounds like it is
>a question of blame.  You are blaming shooganai on why you feel bad.
>Fate sucks!  So what?  What does that even have to do in the slightest
>with how you choose to feel?

Control the circumstances beyond your control? *laughter* 

>   It all depends on your definition of success.  Everyone can sure
>live an ok, fairly comfortable life that way.

And can have 3.78 kids, a loving wife, a dog, a house, a divorce, a
custody battle, a retirement, a pension and death. Not my definition of
success. Sorry dude.

>   Nobody can escape their circumstances.  That doesn't mean that
>circumstances need to have so much control over you that you are merely
>a puppet having your feelings and actions totally controlled by situations
>and others around you.  That is hardly an intelligent response.  I'll
>say it again.  You choose how you react to your stituation in life.  You
>choose how you respond to the actions of others.  You choose how you feel.

Ok. I'll say it again too. Bull. Mostly. 

I came down on you pretty hard cookie but you should really realise that
though your philosophy may work for you it certainly isn't universally
applicable. It doesn't do fuck all for me for instance...

Nothing personal.

Ollie/Lucifuge...
'White collared knights at boardroom tables, 
 Spin their own financial fables,
 Fight to make their interests larger,
 Mounted on their credit charges...'

Xref: sparky alt.suicide.holiday:1935 alt.personals:17721