HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 11:58:25 -0400 
From: "Mark A. Baxter" <mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: SR, Wimping out wizards

   I'd like to piss off a lot of people (well, not like to, going to) by
discussing the possibility that Mages might be a little bit too powerful
in SR.
It's been hinted at a couple of times in different posts, but I'd like
to get it specifically discussed.  I've already mentioned in a previous
post (Blood'n Guts) my feeling that characters in SR are too
specialized.  Well, I would like to qualify that; except for the mages
the characters are too specialized.  Mages are the most flexible
characters in the game.  And often they're more effective in various
facets than the characters for whom this is a specialization.  When I
ran Kid Thunder, my hermetic mage, he was the best fighter in the group,
(around four opponents downed per mana blast), best scout (can't hide
from astral form), best information gatherer (mind probe, no need for
nast interrogator skill), and that was only two spells and a mage
ability.  He had numerous other spells and the ability to protect the
team from magic to a limited extent (magic pool).
    How can the abilities of mages be limited to such an extent that
they are on par with other characters in effectiveness?  If someone has
any ideas on this, if they have experience such that they agree or
disagree, or if they just want to post, please respond.     
   Also, as an aside, could someone tell me if they've fixed the
mechanical problem in the rules such that it makes more sense for me to
buy all my spells at force two to four, and get eight spells, rather
than force six, and get four or five.  I rarely cast above force two or
three, particularly for high drain spells, because the target numbers
get too high to resist fatigue.  And I can just toss most of my sorcery
pool in for the extra power I'd otherwise use force for.  
                       net.hug.mark
Mark Baxter              |One is for sorrow,
<mb8p+@andrew.cmu.edu>   |Two is for joy,
ext #4690                |Three for a girl,
                         |Four a boy,
         I               |Five is for silver,
       Have              |Six is for gold,
         A               |And Seven's a secret
      Secret             |Never to be told.
From: gray@visix.com (Gray Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Cyberpunk (armed deckers)
Date: 27 Jul 92 15:31:07 GMT
Reply-To: gray@visix.com (Gray Jones)
Organization: Visix Software Inc., Reston, VA

Remember, in SR (or any other system), player characters are adventurers.

The decker archetype is not just some random computer geek.  Typically they
have genius intelligence (6 is the MAXIMUM human Intelligence) and exceptional
athletic ability (Quickness of 4 is above average, most characters have 5 or 6).
They also tend to be light weights (Strength and Body of 2 or 3).

If you are a 120 pound athletic genius, wouldn't you want to be quick with a
gun or maybe learn some akido or something?  Wouldn't you be able to do it
too?

If you don't have the skills to make it outside the matrix, you either get "hired"
by a corporation (good money, nice benefits, you'll learn to like it, really you will)
or you get geeked.

IMHO
--gray
  
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: PCHEM14@Zeus.unomaha.edu (FALL88)
Subject: Re: Best Super system
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 18:02:43 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.11

seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu writes:

> 	V&V, like all games, has its holes, but they can be easily 
> patched. It holds up ASTONISHINGLY well for a game its age. (As opposed
> to its contemporary, Superhero 2044... GOD, what depths people sank
> to...)

Superhero 2044 was V+V's *predecessor*, by 2 years.  It wasn't very good,
but it was first.  (SH2044: 1977.  V+V: 1979.)  It may even be the father
of them all, I'm not sure.

-james
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: ins769v@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au (Veltyen)
Subject: Re: Huge Robots as weapons, are they valid?  Does it matter?
Organization: Monash University
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 03:17:41 GMT

There is one valid reason that seems to have been missed on this thread.
Psychology.

Think about it, which is better to cow the natives.
  a) a box on wheels (or treads etc)
  b) a vaguely humanoid mean son'o'bitch.

Look up adeptus titanicus for this sort of idea expounded.
Of course this is only really effective if the "natives" are
quite superstisious.

*****************************************************************************
*Veltyen   ....GM from Hell        *" As a child I always wanted a puppy,   *
*ins769v@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au *  then again, we were starving anything *
*ins769v@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au   *  with meat on it would have done."     *
*veltyen@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au	   *      Captain Vimes, City Watch         *
*****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc,rec.games.frp
From: bbk3@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Bradley B Kohn)
Subject: GURPS spells
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 04:23:31 GMT

     I tried this before, I don't know if it got out...
     I am compiling a list of GURPS spells to put out on the net, college
by college. I tried, and failed, to get GURPS digests and Net.GURPS.Spell.Book,
so I'm doing it myself (hopefully with the help of all you GURPS fans out
there :)). I started with 3 articles of spells from the SJG-BBS, and
seperated then into the colleges of magic. Anyone with interesting or unique
spells that would like to see them included in my compilation, please send
their text to my e-mail address below.
     Thanks,

     Bradley
     bbk3@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
From: ahankin1@cc.swarthmore.edu (A. Luke Hankins)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: melee polearms (was Re: Throw away your greatsword!)
Date: 30 Jul 92 19:52:10 GMT
Organization: Swarthmore College

inb@creare.COM (Ian Brown) writes:


>Personally, unless I was looking for a Conan-style character, I rarely use
>heavy weapons.  I tend to prefer characters who rely on their intelligence and
>skill to defeat opponents, rather than brute strength.  This makes a weapon
>that is somewhere between a rapier and the standard FRP longsword much better
>than something as unwieldy as a greatsword.

agreed

>[ ... ] I tend to restrict the use of the heaviest hand-to-hand weapons
>(which does *not* include polearms - more on that later) to those with greater
>than average (for PCs - which means strong) characters...

hmm...

>In general, heavy weapons, including polearms, are most effective if used in a
>general melee or as part of an organized unit.  In a one-on-one situation, the
>decreased mobility will probably make the weapon less attractive.  Something to
>keep in mind that wasn't mentioned; the extra length will make the weapon
>dangerous at a distance, but will make it unwieldy in a tight situation.  For
>something like a polearm, if your opponent gets inside the effective range of
>the weapon, you end up with a giant quarterstaff - without the staff's
>manueverability.

slight disagreement...

>Most polearms were designed for unit tactics, especially from horseback or
>against those on horseback.  A pike, for example, was specifically intended to
>negate the effectiveness of a cavalry charge (and was quite successful at it,
>in the hands of a trained foot soldier.)  As GM, I suspect that I would give
>someone wielding the pike one chance to strike their opponent, after which that
>person would be inside their reach.

whoa! with a pike thisw is understandable, considering pikes often start at
8' and work there way up (or out). there are many polearms, however, that
are still effective within that range, being 5 - 7 feet long. with these
you can keep your preferred hand back and still use it effectively. i will
agree that this is not the weapon's ideal distance.

 following this, however, is the intimidation... at the ideal range, isn't
it possible to keep a person from getting too close by arcing it or (at
least) interposing it? how would this consider into the rules of play?

>This is getting rather rambling, so I think I'll close it now.
>-- 
>Ian Brown
>inb@creare.com

same here...

-- 
______________________________________________________________________
===Starman-* 		|	ahankin1@cc.swarthmore.edu
			|	tnx luke
________________________|______________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: cassidy@cps.msu.edu.cps.msu.edu (John J Cassidy)
Subject: Re: Dark games
Originator: cassidy@indian.cps.msu.edu
Reply-To: cassidy@cps.msu.edu.cps.msu.edu (John J Cassidy)
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Michigan State University
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 19:41:14 GMT

In article <76674@ut-emx.uucp> dfn@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (David Nalle) writes:
>Dark Games?
>
>No, they're not allowed.  I guess this gives me an excellent opportunity to
>quote from TSRs guidelines handed out to writers and to companies wishing to
>advertise in their publications.  To quote:
>
>1: GOOD VERSUS EVIL
>Evil shall never be portrayed in an attractive light and shall be used
>only as a foe to illustrate  a moral issue.  All product shall focus struggle
>of "good versus injustice and evil," casting the protaganist as an "agent of
>right."
>
>6: MONSTERS
>For the purposes of this code, the term "monster" is defined to mean non-human
>creatures and/or violent beasts whose primary purpose is destruction and/or
>criminal activity/  As foes of the protagonists, their evil should be defeated
>adn the criminal punished or destroyed.
>
>Anyway, ther'es more to this little document, or 'code', but this should
>give you an idea of what TSR wants to turn RPGs into.  Those dark genres are
>right out, and for that matter anything which isn`t totally black and white
>good vs. evil is out.
>
>I think it makes RPGing rather barren as a source of entertainment.
>
>Dave
>e
>ri

ONLY IF YOU ARE STUPID ENOUGH TO FOLLOW TSR'S LEAD!!!!  OMIGOD TSR HAS
GOT A STANDARD AND I DON'T AGREE WITH IT!!!  IT'S 1984 ALL OVER AGAIN!

John J Cassidy
From: ratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri/Stainless Steel Rat)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Military Mechs? Hexapod
Date: 29 Jul 92 14:18:42 GMT
	<55239@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> <1992Jul28.181651.18578@nmsu.edu>
Organization: 3WA, Boston Office. Or Nu Meta Chi. Take your pick.
In-reply-to: wcalderw@nmsu.edu's message of 28 Jul 92 18:16:51 GMT
X-Get-A-Clue: Have two, they're small.
X-Signature-Virus-Protection: Version 1.51
X-Posting-Software: GNUS 3.14.1 [ NNTP-based News Reader for GNU Emacs ]

>>>>> On 28 Jul 92 18:16:51 GMT, wcalderw@nmsu.edu (William A. Calderwood)
>>>>> said:

WAC> Insectoid Mechs:
WAC> (low profiles, streamlined) hmm sounds like a tank to me.
WAC> (more armot and heavier weapons) more legs more weight can be
WAC> supported. But why do this when all ya have to build is a tank.
WAC> (getting a system to cordinate all those leg movements and supply
WAC> enough power to keep the whole thing moving might slow it down in the
WAC> end)

Take a look at the Hexapod program funded by the US military. The ultimate
goal is to build a six legged "tank" that can walk at 35 mph and step over
tank traps. Right now the testbed framework and software has it "running"
at around 10 mph and it can climb steps with two meter risers.

A walking tank has the benefit of being able to step over obstacles that
would stop a tracked tank.

--Rat

||||| | | | |  |  |  |   |   |    |    |    |   |   |  |  |  |  | | | | | |||||
                                                   __        ___ 
Richard Pieri, Northeastern's Stainless Steel Rat/   | /| / /   | The Worlds
Internet: ratinox@meceng.coe.northeastern.edu   /__  |/ |/ / /| | Welfare Works
    UUCP: ...!northeastern.edu!splinter!ratinox/   | /| / / / | | Association:
  BITNET: UA_RLP@NUHUB{.BITNET}               /__  |/ |/ / /  | | I will solve
  USNail: 14 Westdale RD  Holbrook, MA 02343 /   | /| / / /___| | any problem
 ICBMnet: 42 deg 1 min N, 71 deg 0 min W    /    |/ |/ /_//_____| for you.
From: dfrancis@tronsbox.xei.com (Dennis Heffernan)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: GURPS: Alien races -- Too powerful?
Keywords: GURPS Aliens Space
Date: 31 Jul 92 16:32:03 GMT
Organization: Xanadu Enterprises Inc.

In article <1992Jul30.040400.4964@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu> gil@smtc21.engr.scarolina.edu (Gil Young) writes:
|What about *realism*?  It would be easier for a gormelite to work his
|ST up to 17 with a base +4 than for a human.  GURPS promises reealism,
|for tthe most part, delivers.  If I want an abstract art deco alien race
|system, I'll play Champions, thanks.  What I was asking about was ways
|to keep the realism and make it game balanced.  And I think my way
|works.

	It is neither more nor less realistic to make the Gormelite pay the
correct price for his ST 17 than it is to give him a discount.  Point costs
do not determine "realism".

	It is, of course, realistic that Gormelites should have higher ST
scores than humans, but I accomplish this by simply regulating the minimum
attribute levels for nonhumans (and maximums in some cases, of course.)
This accomplishes the same thing while removing mathematical incentives.

|But then you've got a human with wierd stats.  I want to play an alien,
|thank you, and no alien race in my campaign is "Humans in cat suits."

	They are ALL humans in funny suits.  It is catagorically impossible for
humans to represent a nonhuman mindset.

dfrancis@tronsbox.xei.com   ...uunet!tronsbox!dfrancis     GEnie: D.HEFFERNAN1
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"That's a very healthy attitude...it just sounds strange coming from you."
					-Corky Sherwood-Forrest
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: gray@visix.com (Gray Jones)
Subject: Re: SR: Bone Lacing 
Reply-To: gray@visix.com (Gray Jones)
Organization: Visix Software Inc., Reston, VA
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 92 17:33:00 GMT

In article <1992Jul16.040208.18435@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au>, ins894r@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (Aaron Wigley [Wigs]) writes:
|> Bone Lacing: The Essence and Nuyen costs given are for the full body/skeletal 
|> treatment. It is possible to get a limited treatment, for reduced essence 
|> and cost:
|> 
|> 	region			essence/nuyen modifier
|> 	-----------------		-------
|> 	Pelvis+Spine			20%
|> 	RibCage				20%
|> 	Skull				10%
|> 	Arm (each)			10%
|> 	Leg (each)			20%

It's a cool idea, but what about effects?

What are the benfits to just lacing your head or chest?

Lacing Hands/Arms:  Unarmed Damage Bonus (see bone lacing entry in ShadowTech)
Lacing Skull:  Armor bonus (0 for plastic, 0/+1 for aluminum, +1/+1 for titanium (or whatever
it says in ShadowTech))
Lacing Pelvis/Spine: ?????
Lacing Rib Cage:  Body Bonus??
Lacing Legs:  ???

what about breaking it into fewer parts like torso, head, arms, legs?

Any thoughts??

--gray
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: kieran@cmatter.physics.indiana.edu (kieran)
Subject: Re: WANTED: frp map maker
Organization: Indiana University
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 15:29:54 GMT

In article <1992Jul26.172657.221042@cs.cmu.edu> 
       mfp+@CS.CMU.EDU (Michael Polis) writes:

>I would have posted this earlier, but I was sure somone else would mention it.
>
>The universal simulation mailing list archive has a couple of terrain
>generating programs, fractal.c and plates.c.  Both generate terrain on a
>square grid, but if you shift every other column up 1/2 square, you should
>get a reasonable hex map.  Fractal.c generates nicer looking results.
>
>This is the entry from the RPG ftp sites post (from the the last time I saved
>the post).
>-----
>Name:           Universal Simulation Mailing List (usml) ftp site
>Address:        topgun.agps.lanl.gov (192.12.184.4)
>Status:         Apparently Defunct

    Note that the status is "Apparently Defunct".  I tried to ftp there
this weekend and could not get through.  Is there another archive that 
has this material?

    Could the keeper of the FAQ check to see whether the archives listed
there are in fact still running?

                 Kieran Mullen

                 kieran@cmatter.physics.indiana.edu
From: canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Genres
Date: 21 Jul 92 18:15:19 GMT
Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, MA

In article <1992Jul20.152742.8776@uoft02.utoledo.edu> steiner@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu (jason steiner) writes:
>canders@isr.harvard.edu (Carl E. Anderson) writes:
>> 	But I like to add as much realism to things as I can.  Does anyone
>> have any ideas about improving the 'science' in BattleTech to make it a bit
>> more realistic?

>start by chucking BattleTech & buying Centurion. anthropomorphic
>combat machines are nowhere -near- as efficient as tanks. and the
>"We can build & maintain particle beam weapons, but geez *scratch
>head* a spotting laser is way beyond us!" idea is just silly.
>
>yes, yes, if you go to Centurion you have to swallow gravity warping 
>technology and a lack of anti-armor devices we already have. but the 
>former is pretty cool as far as game mechanics & it's -really- easy to
>add any kind of weapon you might want.

	So who makes "Centurion"?  Is it liable to be in local gaming
stores?

Carl
From: dv52151@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Axly)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SRUN: New totems request.
Date: 24 Jul 92 15:47:20 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.BrwH6x.4H9
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

mkkuhner@phylo.genetics.washington.edu (Mary K. Kuhner) writes:


>A Spider shaman who shared an enemy with our party gave my sorceress,
>Channa, a spider-silk spell focus to use against them.  I thought that
>was a distressingly Spider way to deal with the problem--a gift to
>ensnare the user, baited with power against the common enemy....She
>used it with great reluctance, but she did use it, and I imagine sooner
>or later Spider will get a line on her as a result.
>I find totems more interesting if they aren't straightforwardly good or
>evil.

Oh, that's wicked. *grin* This is the sort of thing I like seeing in SRun,
the power games that the ultrapowerful play with the characters live. 
All too often, when the megapowerful of the SRun world manipulate in a 
FASA run, they do it with a rather heavy hand. This light touch is IMHO a
really cool thing.

Axly
From: floyd@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Mark Kobrak)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Mr. Fantastic in Champions
Date: 28 Jul 92 21:24:22 GMT
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.

In article <RATINOX.92Jul28161731@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu> ratinox@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu (Richard Pieri/Stainless Steel Rat) writes:
>>>>>> On 28 Jul 92 18:15:00 GMT, aq061@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Scott Devine)
>>>>>> said:
>
>SD> I have been trying to convert my favorite Marvel characters into the more
>SD> detailed game of Champions but I ran into some trouble with Mr. Fantastic
>SD> and his unstable molecules.  I don't know how I should set it up, if any
>SD> of you know a way please post or send me mail.  Thank you.
>
>The tough part, I assume, is the "elastic" body.
>
>Elemental Control: Elastic Body, Powers include Stretching, Shapeshift, a
>limited Desolid (to get through cracks in doors and windows). Damage
>Reduction is a possibility (and needs a GM okay to go into the EC). Extra
>Limbs might be nice, but it's so cheap it wouldn't go into the EC.

Don't forget Area Affect on STR (outside the EC, of course!); a friend of
mine made Mr. F. in Champs with this ability, and found that it was the
most efficient agent-beating machine ever made (AE on 40 STR -> 12d6 Hay-
maker on 4 hexes (or more, if you take +1/4 advantage), which is actually
a decent measure of how the player fights.

--floyd
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
From: gwills@maths.tcd.ie (Graham Wills)
Subject: MWWG Scenario, anyone?
Organization: Dept. of Maths, Trinity College, Dublin, Ireland.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:37:53 GMT

I have just written a short (five hours playing time) MWWG Scenario. If anyone
is interested enough and has a copy of Clarisworks for the Mac, I'll post it.

Just before I consign it to the "old scenarios" folder.

-Graham Wills
 TCD, Ireland
From: mkkuhner@phylo.genetics.washington.edu (Mary K. Kuhner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: SR: essence focus
Date: 25 Jul 92 05:51:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Jul25.055151.3442
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

JENKINS@agvax2.ag.ohio-state.edu (Kent Jenkins) writes:

>I also think that Essence is defined as a phsysical condition, so maybe you'd
>want to think about a Heath spell that would increase Essence (by .1 per
>success?) by helping convince the body that this cyberware is really part of
>the system.  Maybe it'd be a Manipulation spell.
                            
>			-Kent Jenkins
>			("Thenomain")

Mm, what a wonderfully evil spell.  Convince the body that this
cyberware is really part of the system?  With *magic*?  That ought
to have interesting side effects, especially if you keep it up for a
long while.  Flesh growing into the cybered parts, or metal invading the
flesh...partial animation of inanimate structures...with luck you could
set off a goblinization reaction and get *really* wholesale revision of
the body image.

The villains of our last campaign were into things like this.  It was
one of the few games I've ever seen where the party's inevitable
reaction, upon capturing magic items or cyberware from the enemy, was to
destroy them immediately.  We broke three or four small foci that way.
The GM was pleased and amused.

Don't forget psychological effects, either.  One character in that
campaign ended up with a rather disturbing tendency to treat computers
and people in the same way--affectionate and possessive--it's not clear
she was really aware of the distinction by the end.  Sure, cyberware is
'just like part of your body'.  But is it really?  When the hairs on the
back of your neck prickle, do the spurs slide from their sheaths?  Do
you unconsciously go hunting in headware memory--or worse, a radio link
to the 'Net--for that word that's on the tip of your tongue?

(I think it should be a Health spell, by the way.  Manipulation is
overused.)

Mary Kuhner mkkuhner@genetics.washington.edu
From: jacobus@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Kirsten C. Jacobus)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Best Super system
Date: 23 Jul 92 02:45:02 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center



Uh, I made one error:

When I was screaming about DR in GURPS Supers having a three to one ratio
in cost vs. damage, I goofed.  It is actually a 1.5:1 ratio, which is still
pretty darned high, and tends to make it very difficult to design characters
who can withstand any sort of real attacks.
From: dlaird@terapin.com (Delbert Laird)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Fantasy Genre...
Date: 25 Jul 92 10:50:55 PST
Organization: BBS

The spells are "purchased" as components.  The game system in which they spell
laws would take place also use a point-generation system.  In the precluding
system so far, there are three catagories of components:  Control, Subject,
Modifier.......No spell may have more than one Control, but may use multiple
Subjects and Modifiers.

An example:    Create  Fire   Range   (Character may create/apply fire at      
                                range..ie Fireball or Pyrokinesis.)

Now that the spell caster has purchase the 3 componens listed above, he may
then use them with any further components he/she purchases....That is, there is
no finite spell (as in AD&D or D&D)...The creation of a spell is dependant on
what components the character has available.

My theory on spell casting is that while some players are indeed satisfied with
systems that already have spells created/structured and you must be a certain
level to learn/cast.....I'm willing to bet that others want a system rid of
spell levels.

This system allows for a great diversity of spells between various sorcerors
due to various factors:  Personal preference and Component Cost.  It may not be
the BEST system available, at least it should be classified as the most
versatile.  :)

dlaird@terapin.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc