From: gavigan@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Ryan P. Gavigan)
Subject: Re: What EAV said about # of anime fans & what is most popular anime ?
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 08:28:01 GMT

In article <lfula1INNcm3@ozona.cs.utexas.edu> andrean@cs.utexas.edu (Andre A. Nurwono) writes:
>
>So far so good, Anime seems to have gained momentum in the US entertainment
>media, e.g. LTV episodes.
>
Well, EPISODE of LTV anyway.  Just out of historical fact, the Colossal 
Pictures people watched and got interested in the anime shorts (and of 
course The Running Man in particular) when they watched Silent Mobius/Manie
Manie at an LA Animation Celebration.


>So far, not so good. No more references have I heard been made about
>popularizing anime by fans anymore. Looking at newsgroup statistics
>made me wonder. I even thought of wether its better to split this
>newsgroup, its getting to be a pain to follow the # of postings here.
>
Consider the rapidity of what little coverage there has been recently compared
to the past couple of years.  Pretty all there was about AC91 were trashy
newspaper articles (read 2) and a "they;re importing pornographic cartoons"
piece on a ET/Hard Copy clone-show that was so bad the show doesn't exist anymore.

There was a casual mention of Akira on MTV, (read big whoopee).


In the past several months however, anime has A)actually bitten into the rental
market, and grown from sales at an optimistic 1000-unit type level to sales
into 5 figures.
B) Actually got a review on Siskel & Ebert's TV show
C)Had two pretty publicized music videos made from them.
D)Had a CNN piece halfway positively portraying the subject (I DO disagree with
the other Ryan that this was another TYPICAL anime shock type piece , it could
have been better, but hey, it's heading in the right direction [but then again,
so was the Titanic 8)].)

The Sci-Fi BUZZ clip was pretty novicely done. (IE the show producers don't
have a clue and decided that a single source was enough, and when it's 
Streamline propaganda leading the way, it can tend to skew the issue a bit.)
(Also read that it's pretty much a ways off before we'd probably see anime
end up there if this is an indication of their knowledge of the material.)

>EAV (Electronic Animation Velocity) I read off bongo.cc.utexas.edu
>mentioned that there wasn't enough fans to go about having requests
>on getting anime to TV networks, etc, about fans being non-productive,
>etc.

Remember who IS EAV, RANDALL STUKEY.  The same Randall Stukey who said the
commercial subtitlers weren't going to make it because he figured no one
would pay the $40 prices and they wouldn't sell 500 copies.


Remember, there are very few things on networks that ever got on or stayed
on because of fans.  MILLIONS of people over some two years kept the 
original Star Trek alive, and the umpteen thousand fans (read 2 million)
couldn't keep Twin Peaks from taking the dive.  Fans aren't going to get
anime on TV (at least bye "requesting " it ).  Anime will get on TV when 
executives think they can get the ad $$ and publicity out of it. (and when
they get their heads out of their *****)


>From what I see, I think Anime fans have grown substantially since
>the writing of that article, and I really wonder wether it could
>grow as fast as it used to, given the limited resources and publicity
>it has. I wonder if it could really have gotten momentum so anime
>prices could be lowered, and make it become more popular.
>
I'm sure Robert W and AnimEigo have a bunch of neat graphs in their systems
of all sorts of price elasticity, market demand, sales distribution, etc
devices that have statistically shown them what has gone on so far in the 
three years since they started with Madox at the beginning of the US Anime
Renaissance.

The one thing they have in their favor as anime rentals expand into the 
scheme, the video store owners begin to see the return on investment of these
titles as compared to the $89-$99 rental price movies and even the B movies
(like Guyver, et al) that are likewise priced at $90 and see what potential
they have.  A store could pay for a tape in a month if it only rented 2-3
nights a week, which from some reports is extremely conservative.

The fans are very "productive" in this category in that many of the stores
that have anime, have it because fans kept bugging them about it.  That's
how "productive" fans are.

>So what's my point ?
>
>Well, I just posted to know what people thought would popularize anime more,
>or what YOU think would popularize anime to get more fans, etc.
>
I prescribe the great AnimEigo precept of building the market. Start from
the bottom up, continuing to grow the "gestalt" (Robert W's term) of anime,
building the little network of "spies" to invade the popular culture and
eventually burst into mainstream.

Against this is of course the Streamline, top-down, let's shove shit down 
peoples throats (and fairly substandard S*it too boot) until they say 'uncle'
theory  . (Well that's MY interpretation 8-)

>What anime do YOU think has a substantial number of audience,
>or would attract much more people who don't know anime.
>
That is a VERY difficult question to answer, as many anime tend to skew to
a particular audience.  i would tend to say that a light-hearted comedic
type of show like UY, or a show with a general comedic overtone in a semi-
serious plot like Maison Ikkoku or maybe Patlabor.  Unfortunately these are
also the most difficult types of show to translate (read most non fans won't
want to watch subtitles) and remain faithful enoughs not to piss US off.

>What audience do YOU think could be targeted by these anime...
>
Continue to target the audience it's reaching now, in the 18-40 age groups,
primarily in the 18-25 age group.  However, a serious attempt may be made
to garner a large female percentage of the audience.  Extreme strength in
an particular demographic is extremely important to TV-types. 
 
>What anime would YOU like to see in theatres ...
>
Wings of Honneamise, Patlabor the Movie

>What anime would YOU like to see as OAVs,
>
GIANT ROBO, Patlabor, Lodoss War

>What anime would YOU like to see replacing Tom & Jerry Kids on TV...
>
Patlabor, Maison Ikkoku, Ranma , Lupin III

>

>  What do people think of Video Girl Ai?

Well, Robert W did say he felt it wasn't quite mainstream enough of a story
	right now. (at time of AX92)

Ryan Gavigan
gavigan@gn.ecn.purdue.edu