HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Subject: Re: How about reaction to Perot's first TV show?
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc
Distribution: tx
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 13:36:50 GMT

In <1992Oct9.185702.7308@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> curt@ekhadafi.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch 903 2F021 curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com 512-838-2806) writes:

>wrr3118@tamsun.tamu.edu (Rick Russell) writes:

>> - Not self-serving. Perot didn't push his candidacy; he didn't claim

>agreed

Well, perhaps not self-serving with regard to his candidacy, but from
watching it (and his recommendation that you buy his book), I suspect
he's going to make a net profit out of it.

>I think the guy is a real patriot.  He's showing the people what they
>need to see.  I just hope it sinks in.

Well, let's not get carried away here.  Perhaps what we're lacking is
a definition of 'real patriot' (as opposed to 'unreal patriot', I
presume?). 

>Those graphs won't look any better four years from now if Clinton
>increases spending by 200,000,000,000 dollars like he says he will.

Yes, and even H. Ross states that his plan CANNOT BE PUT INTO EFFECT
in the current economic situation, because it assumes a healthy and
growing economy to start with; what that means is that you would have
several years of a Clinton-like plan before any of the things Perot
talked about would even start to be addressed.

Did anyone notice during the debate that Clinton and Perot really
don't seem all that far apart (except for some details) when you start
getting down to what they're actually talking about doing and why they
think it needs to be done?

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
Xref: sparky tx.politics:6026 alt.politics.bush:8992 alt.politics.clinton:10195
From: curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch/131072)
Newsgroups: tx.politics,alt.politics.bush,alt.politics.clinton
Subject: it's time for a clean sweep
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:27:55 GMT
Reply-To: curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch/131072)
Followup-To: tx.politics
Organization: IBM AWD, Austin, TX


The Federal Government is gridlocked and "We the People," want to take
it out on George Bush.

These sentiments are understandable.  But if you're honest you have to
agree that Congress is at least *part*, if not most, of the problem.

And since they're part of the problem, then shouldn't dumping them be
part of the solution also?

Be fair this November.  If you're voting for Mr. Clinton, vote against
Congressional incumbents too, regardless of their party.

Send a message.  The closer an incumbent comes to losing, the more he
is likely to wake up.

--
curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt L. Finch) | AIX NFS/NIS Field Quality 
My views are unrelated to those of IBM     |       Austin, TX
 -If you vote against Bush, be fair and throw out Congressional incumbents too-
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: johniac@johniac.austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Subject: Re: Bush Vetoes Stupid Education Reform Bill
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 19:36:21 GMT
Distribution: tx
Reply-To: johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Organization: IBM Advanced Workstations and Systems, Austin, TX

In article <exuptr.759.719097031@exu.ericsson.se>, exuptr@exu.ericsson.se (Patrick Taylor) writes:
|> Cool enough.  Then get the humanist "do-so" classes out of public
|> school!

I don't know what "humanist 'do-so'" means.  Could you give me an
example?  I think to the religious right, "humanism" means "doesn't
teach Christianity". 

|> See above response.  Religion is not the only quasi-factual subject in
|> school.  Hell, what about Art classes?  Maybe the best approach is to
|> include religion, and cover all of it (all faiths, etc...).  Then again, 
|> maybe not.

*All faiths*?  Do you realize that there are thousands?  There's not
enough time to even do this, much less teach Math, English, History,
etc.

-- 
John Iacoletti       IBM AWS Austin       Internet: johniac@austin.ibm.com
        My opinions do not reflect the views of the IBM Corporation
"When you're following an angel, does it mean you have to throw your body off a 
 building?" -- TMBG
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Subject: Re: gun(s) for carry in a car
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc
Distribution: houston
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 14:24:26 GMT

In <11OCT199212340358@jetson.uh.edu> schieber@jetson.uh.edu (Schieber, Jay D.) writes:

>I would rather move to Canada with much more strict gun control,
>and ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE less murder (by guns or other means).
>But, I will not get into the pointless debate about gun control.
>:-)

Orders of magnitude?  Please post numbers showing that the murder rate
in Canada is less than 1% of that in the United States (which is the
largest it can be and still be "orders of magnitude" less than ours).
Better still, why don't you go to Mexico, which has even more
stringent gun laws than Canada, and a murder that is much higher than
ours to go with it.

There is NO CONVINCING EVIDENCE for the correlation you appear to be
trying to make here.

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch/131072)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Teacher Labor Union Against Reforms in NYC
Date: 12 Oct 92 21:13:20 GMT
Reply-To: curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch/131072)
Distribution: tx
Organization: IBM AWD, Austin, TX


*11  MANHATTAN:  SCHOOLS COULD SECEDE FROM CITY SCHOOL SYSTEM
     Borough President Ruth Messinger yesterday began circulating
a plan under which Manhattan would operate its own schools
(Berger, N.Y. TIMES).  According to the TIMES, Messinger's plan
would be an effort to free Manhattan schools "from the Board of
Education bureaucracy," and would entitle Manhattan schools to a
20% increase in state operating funds for five years.
     Manhattan schools comprise approximately 100 elementary, 30
junior high and 21 high schools, all of which would answer only
to a "boroughwide committee that would appoint the Manhattan
superintendent and to smaller community school districts,"
according to Messinger's plan.
     The State Legislature must approve the five-year pilot
project.  If it is a success, other boroughs might also "declare
their independence from the NYC school system."
     The proposal was met with some reservations.  Sandra
Feldman, president of the United Federation of Teachers said:  "I
don't think having totally separate school systems in the
boroughs is necessarily going to be good for kids given the
mobility of our kids." (10/10)

--
curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt L. Finch) | AIX NFS/NIS Field Quality 
My views are unrelated to those of IBM     |       Austin, TX
 -If you vote against Bush, be fair and throw out Congressional incumbents too-
From: jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Bush Vetoes Stupid Education Reform Bill
Date: 8 Oct 92 13:07:10 GMT
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Distribution: tx
Organization: River Parishes Programming, Austin, Republic of Texas

In article <1992Oct07.235351.42551@watson.ibm.com> johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti) writes:
>In article <21680@rpp386.lonestar.org>, jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II) writes:
>|> Most private schools are NOT associated with churches.  Most of them are
>|> just PRIVATE schools.
>
>Number of private schools grades K-12, 1987-88
>[source: National Center for Education Statistics, U.S. Department of
>         Education]
>
>Number of schools (total): 26,836
>Catholic:                   9,527
>Other religious:           12,132
>Non-sectarian:              5,177 

Religious and associated with a church are NOT the same thing.  A school
does not get a tax deduction simply because it has "Episcopal" or "St.
Andrew" in the name.

>|> Of the churches that DO have schools, many of the students have parents
>|> who don't attend that church.  My Episcopal wife has never given a dime to
>|> the Catholic school she attended.
>
>Free tuition?

Not in the collection plate she hasn't.  That was your remark - that being
a church funded school was a great way to indoctrinate future collection
plate givers.
-- 
John F. Haugh II           [  TSAKC  ]       UUCP: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151    [ DoF #17 ]            Domain: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
From: jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Teacher Pay Redux
Date: 10 Oct 92 19:49:37 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: River Parishes Programming, Austin TX

This is from the Libertarian Party News, a newspaper from the Libertarian
Party.

Writing about the continuing growth in public payrolls -

	Volume 7, no. 10, pg. 11

	"Not only haven't jobs been cut, but salaries haven't been
	 adjusted.  The Bureau [ of Labor Statistics ] reports that 
	 in March 1992, state and local employees cost an average
	 of $23.49 an hour in wages and benefits, 46 percent more
	 than private workers.  Admittedly, public wages are
	 inflated by the high number of professionals like teachers.
	 Yet public school teachers' average wages and benefits
	 have hit $34.45 an hour, compared with $25.20 for private
	 professional workers, and $29.42 for private executives,
	 administrators and managers."

Ho-hum-de-dum.  Adjusted for a full 52-week work year, that means the
total compensation for teachers is $71,656 ...
-- 
John F. Haugh II                  [  TSAKC  ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151           [ DoF #17 ]        @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Subject: Re: How about reaction to Perot's first TV show?
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc
Distribution: tx
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 14:26:02 GMT

In <1992Oct14.051049.18041@NeoSoft.com> hari@NeoSoft.com (Doug Andersen) writes:

>In article <1992Oct12.133650.15005@mksol.dseg.ti.com>, mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
>> Did anyone notice during the debate that Clinton and Perot really
>> don't seem all that far apart (except for some details) when you start
>> getting down to what they're actually talking about doing and why they
>> think it needs to be done?
> 
>Oh I don't agree at all.  I think Perot and Clinton are years apart on
>their platforms.  They do agree strongly that Bush needs to go, and Perot
>seems to be willing to take it easy on Clinton in order to achieve this
>goal.
> 
>Perot's primary goal is to reduce the national debt and to
>cut federal spending drastically.  Clinton has no such inclination,
>nor for that matter, does Bush.

Not as a primary goal, certainly.  Not wrecking the economy, for
example, probably ought to have a higher priority.  In fact, Perot
himself recognizes that in the current state of the economy his
proposals shouldn't be implemented.  Perot calls for a smaller cut in
Defense and much larger tax increases than does Clinton (in particular
the $0.50 gasoline tax, which I think is a bad idea -- even though I
preferred Paul Tsongas to Clinton, and he proposed the same thing).
Other than that, the primary differences between them seem to be
minor, insofar as policy prescriptions go.

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: johniac@johniac.austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Subject: Re: Bush Vetoes Stupid Education Reform Bill
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 92 22:31:38 GMT
Distribution: tx
Reply-To: johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Organization: IBM Advanced Workstations and Systems, Austin, TX

In article <1518@airgun.wg.waii.com>, miller@hmsp04.wg3.waii.com (Griff Miller X7114) writes:
|> If a church member does something charitable, his church is doing something charitable,
|> because the church is its members; no more, no less. One does not say, "okay, everybody,
|> this charitable thing I'm about to do has nothing to do with my church."

Are you saying that you wouldn't be charitable if your church didn't
make you?

|> Everything a 
|> Christian does he does (ideally) as a member of the church.

Really?  When you take a crap, do you do so as a member of your church?

|> Maybe not enough non-itemizers were using it to justify it. Maybe in their efforts to simplify
|> the tax return, they axed it. Besides, anybody can itemize if they want to. 

If your itemized deductions are less than the standard deduction,
you'll pay more tax if you itemize.  If you take the standard
deduction, you won't get to deduct your charitable contributions. 
This wasn't the case before 1986 or so.

-- 
John Iacoletti       IBM AWS Austin       Internet: johniac@austin.ibm.com
        My opinions do not reflect the views of the IBM Corporation
                "Fight the real enemy" -- Sinead O'Connor
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: mcmahon@owlnet.rice.edu (Michael G. McMahon)
Subject: AI (was: Re: Chinascam)
Organization: Rice University
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 22:14:07 GMT

In article <21678@rpp386.lonestar.org> jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F.
Haugh II) writes: 
>
>Amnesty International is practically worthless as an organization
>dedicated to finding violations of "Human Rights".  

Hypothesis registered.

>For example, murderers, in AI's view, have more rights than their
>victims.  

False example discarded.  Perhaps you are over-reacting because the
organization has upset you in some way.  It may be a foreign concept to
you, but all people can have equal rights. 

>Does AI support capital punishment?  No.  Murderer's "Human
>Rights"? Yes. 

   I see. They disagree with your stance on capital punishment.  They
must be a bad group.  
   It's _so_ evil to assert that someone accused of murder still has
basic rights as a human being...  Or, yes, even someone convicted of
murder.  At least recognize that yours is a radical stance.




-- 
There is a level of cowardice lower than that of the conformist:
  the fashionable non-conformist.   -ayn rand
Xref: sparky tx.politics:5904 alt.politics.clinton:8904
From: jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II)
Newsgroups: tx.politics,alt.politics.clinton
Subject: Re: Good Teachers in Public Schools (Was Re: Clinton ... (was Re: Theft))
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:19:52 GMT
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Organization: River Parishes Programming, Austin, Republic of Texas

In article <1992Oct06.185842.10585@NeoSoft.com> hari@NeoSoft.com (Doug Andersen) writes:
>I don't agree.  It may be more commodity-like than some professions, and
>we may have chosen to price it that way, but it's not.
 
Not to argue just for the sake of a arguing, but what exactly leads you
to believe that teachers aren't a commodity item?  I mean, I know plenty
of people who've become teachers with non-education backgrounds (though
most of them teach at the college level).  Teaching is a basic skill.
At others jobs moreso than my current, I've had to "teach" plenty of
people about systems we were using, etc.  Many parents teach their
children at home ("Home Schooling").  Others teach non-academic subjects
or offer tutoring.

>I think your facts are a bit off.  Accountants out of college get paid
>more than most non-technical degrees (i.e., everything except engineering
>and computer science).  I was just looking at some numbers recently, and
>at about 28K/year out of college, that puts them ahead of most business
>school graduates in finance, marketing, management, etc.  And pretty much
>on parity with MIS.  That puts them well ahead of liberal arts and most
>natural sciences.  Best of all, accountants can actually find jobs.  (No,
>I'm not an accountant).
 
BA in accounting or CPA?  I'd like to know the source for that number
since I find $28K for a BA in accounting to be kinda high.  I know
people with experience and that degree who don't make that much.  Perhaps
I could tell them where to get new jobs ;-)

>I think there are plenty of engineers, however, who have a very good grasp
>of science and mathematics who would do a much better job than your
>average science/math teacher nowadays.

Sure, and teaching high school math and sciences doesn't require Statics,
Mechanics, Dynamics, Analytic Geometry, Differential Equations, Nuclear
Physics, Organic Chemistry, Developmental Physiology, etc. ...

Once you figure out how many courses high school teachers DON'T need,
you'll find that the number of people who have taken courses or who have
experience that they DO need is quite large.

Like I said, you or I could teach high school math and science.  But I
challenge the averge high school math or science teacher to design a new
operating system ...
-- 
John F. Haugh II           [  TSAKC  ]       UUCP: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151    [ DoF #17 ]            Domain: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
From: jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: The blame game
Date: 14 Oct 92 12:52:17 GMT
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Distribution: usa,tx
Organization: River Parishes Programming, Austin, Republic of Texas

In article <1992Oct13.152623.1896@NeoSoft.com> hari@NeoSoft.com (Doug Andersen) writes:
>That simply isn't true.  Japanese markets are some of the most competitive
>markets in the world.  The markets for Japanese packaged goods make US
>markets look like a Little League game.  In fact, the Japanese are so
>competitive that the US isn't even willing to play their game.  That's why
>anytime the Japanese start selling for even close to cost the US
>manufacturers scream and demand the government protect them.
 
No, it is true.

As for "selling at cost", the Japanese government regularly investigates
Japanese companies for selling in the US for LESS than they sell in Japan.

>Right.  Just a passing fad, huh John?  Reminds me of Ken Olsen railing on
>about how PCs were just a fad and they would soon pass.  

Japan is currently in a recession.  Are we?
-- 
John F. Haugh II                  [  TSAKC  ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151           [ DoF #17 ]        @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
From: davidc@montagar.com (David L. Cathey)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Teacher Pay Redux
Date: 11 Oct 92 18:36:36 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: Montagar Software Concepts, Plano TX

In article <21703@rpp386.lonestar.org>, jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II) writes:
> This is from the Libertarian Party News, a newspaper from the Libertarian
> Party.
> 
> Writing about the continuing growth in public payrolls -
> 
> 	Volume 7, no. 10, pg. 11
> 
> 	                    ... Admittedly, public wages are
> 	 inflated by the high number of professionals like teachers.
> 	 Yet public school teachers' average wages and benefits
                                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 	 have hit $34.45 an hour, ...
                         ^^^^^^^ 
> 
> Ho-hum-de-dum.  Adjusted for a full 52-week work year, that means the
> total compensation for teachers is $71,656 ...

	Whoa, let's take a reality check!  Creative math, John!  That assumes
they work 2080 hours/year (40 hours per week for all 52 weeks of the year). 
Since they only work 9 months out of the year, and 37.5 hrs/week (used by
Richardson ISD), that brings compensation to $50,383/year.  Since that is total
compensation (including benefits!), they probably only receive about 2/3's of
that (there are all kinds of things in determining the dollar amount of
compensation), or $33,585 as actual wages on average.

	This also does not take into consideration hours off for holidays,
leave/sick time, etc in my calculation of average wage, but is probably
included in the hourly rate of teachers (Since it appearently is to make it
as high of a figure as possible).  So hours worked, therefor wages, are
probably a little less.  Heck, the extra two weeks of Christmas vacation are
worth $3,971 in compensation.

	Ho-hum-de-dum, I'm sure...  
> -- 
> John F. Haugh II                  [  TSAKC  ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
> Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151           [ DoF #17 ]        @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
David L. Cathey		                |INET: davidc@montagar.com
Montagar Software Concepts              |UUCP: ...!montagar!davidc
P. O. Box 260772, Plano TX  75026-0772  |Fone: (214)-618-2117
From: davidc@montagar.com (David L. Cathey)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Football Failures at Bowie Force end of Season
Date: 15 Oct 92 09:12:52 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: Montagar Software Concepts, Plano TX

In article <1992Oct14.135714.16950@mksol.dseg.ti.com>, mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
> In <4709@d75.UUCP> curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch/131072) writes:
>>     "I am not a proponent of no-pass, no-play ... I believe it
>>is imperative we emphasize academics, athletics, activities --
>>the three A's.  They are all juxtaposition, side by side," said
>>Bowie Principal Paul Strelzin (10/9).
> 
> Now this sounds like a man who needs to find a different line of work.
> Perhaps he should open Club Med schools or something?

	Surely.  I agree with Fred on this.  No-pass, No-play was assumed
when I went to school.  I think that this principal needs to remeber way back
when the schools actually worked.  They taugh the three R's: Read, Riting, and
Rithmetic (spelling could be ignored :-)

	So just what are "activities" in his mind?  I figured out the first
two...  Is he trying to run a Club Med for students?

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
David L. Cathey		                |INET: davidc@montagar.com
Montagar Software Concepts              |UUCP: ...!montagar!davidc
P. O. Box 260772, Plano TX  75026-0772  |Fone: (214)-618-2117
Newsgroups: tx.wanted,houston.wanted,misc.wanted
From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva)
Subject: Re: Amiga Equipment 4 Sale
Keywords: Amiga Video Toaster
Organization: Taronga Park BBS
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 12:40:54 GMT

In article <1992Oct08.204045.10508@NeoSoft.com> martink@NeoSoft.com (Martin Koistinen) writes:
> Keywords: Amiga Video Toaster

Sounds good, but where is the toaster in the list of hardware you provided?
-- 
Peter da Silva, Houston, TX            `-_-'
Segodnja volka obnimal?                 'U`
Du er ikke min vejviser. Min vejviser var tobenet.
Newsgroups: tx.wanted,houston.wanted,misc.wanted
From: martink@NeoSoft.com (Martin Koistinen)
Subject: Amiga Equipment 4 Sale
Organization: NeoSoft Communications Services -- (713) 684-5900
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1992 20:40:45 GMT
Keywords: Amiga Video Toaster

 
Amiga 2500 Video Computer
	44 MByte HD
	5 MByte 32-Bit RAM
	1.3 Kickstart ROM
	$1695.00
 
Amiga 2000 Video Computer
	1.2 Kickstart ROM
	$895.00
 
SuperGen (Ext)
	Genlock and Overlay
	RGB & Composite TO RGB
	$495.00
 
All prices excluding shipping from Houston (if applicable)
Call Mr. Tracy Evans directly at:
	(713) 499-6419 Home or
	(713) 963-0397 Work

-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Sorry, but I can't think of a signature that is so clever that I need  |
|  to waste bandwidth with. ** Martin Koistinen - martink@neosoft.com ** |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: tx.wanted,ba.forsale,bu.wanted,ca.forsale,chi.forsale