HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jwest@weevil.frc.ri.cmu.edu (Jay West)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: DD's need improvement!
Date: 22 Jan 93 17:22:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: weevil.JWEST.93Jan22122227
Reply-To: jwest@frc2.frc.ri.cmu.edu (Jay West)
Distribution: rec
Organization: Field Robotics Center, CMU

Just one more opinion about DD's and ship types in general (skip to
end if you just want to hear my suggestion).

In a straight out dogfight with equally skilled opponents, I would
expect:

BB's beats CA's beats DD's beats SC's.  The lighter ship must always
give ground to the heavier ships.  AS's are something of an anomoly -
not very many people dogfight in these.  I would put it somewhere
just below a CA.

This has been expressed before, and I have found this to be generally
true.  I usually play CA's, and can kill DD's and SC's or force them
to retreat, but I must give ground to a good BB player.  Don't know
about a DD-SC dogfight.  When in a scout, I have another task in
mind and avoid dogfights.  I rarely play DD's.

Increasing the firepower of a DD in order to put it on equal footing
with CA's in a dogfight is a mistake - all ships are not created
equal.

So why play ships other than the best dogfighter?  Because netrek is
not about dogfighting.

BB - last planet defense, where you are just sitting by the planet
waiting for takers.  Its tremendous firepower is very useful.
Sometimes used for ogging.  For other purposes, it's too slow to be
effective.

CA - my favorite ship.  Good general purpose ship, has DD's and SC's
to pick on for easy kills.  It can ogg, bomb nearby planets, scum kills,
and take planets effectively.

SC - very effective at scout bombing.  It can quickly getting past a
defense, fake and drop 2 armies.  SC's can also be effective at ogging
- no one can run from you.

AS - ship of choice for that all important initial bombing run.  Good
at taking heavily defended planets, but you had better have escorts.

DD - I don't play these very much - haven't found a good role for
them.  Tried ogging, taking planets, and bombing with DD's, but there
better ships.  Speed advantage over CA's is not significant.

So what can be done about DD's?  I like ZZ's idea of reducing max
armies DD's can carry to 2 and give it warp 11.  This would turn it
into a fast penetrator.  It might also become a good ogger (perhaps
too good?).

West
HARM
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: books@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu (Roger Books)
Subject: Re: DD's need improvement!
Organization: FSU nuclear physics
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 93 15:03:07 GMT

In article <4fNTuIG00VpHF8J0oN@andrew.cmu.edu> Sean Christopher Simmons <ss72+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 26-Jan-93 Re: DD's need
>improvement! Roger Books@fsunuc.physi (893)
>
>> >Cruiser;    Torp Damage: 40    Torp Speed: 12
>> >Battleship; Torp Damage: 40    Torp Speed: 12
>>              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> Is this true?  If it is this is bogus.  No wonder battleships are worthless
>> in a real game.  A battleship torp should hurt more than a Cruiser torp.
>> Either that or they should cost the same to fire.  And as for the "My
>> ship is better than yours," I've only ever seen one or two semi-clued
>> or better players fly BB's under normal circumstances.
>
>
>	The numbers listed are correct.  Also of interest. . .
>
>Cruiser;    Phaser Damage: 100  Phaser Cost: 700
>Battleship: Phaser Damage: 105  Phaser Cost: 1050
>
>ZZnew guy

I was expecting to be flamed because BB's phasers are so much better than
CA's.  The above means I second my original post about the bogosity of
the BB.  My fear of the BB just went to somewhere around -1.

Cirdan

Roger
books@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu
From: v119matc@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Claus Schwinge)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: More Questions on the Cutting EDGE
Date: 26 Jan 93 21:46:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <C1H5IL.4sn.2@cs.cmu.edu>, hill@norman.vi.ri.cmu.edu writes...
>Brian Paulsen writes
> 
>> Sit at warp 0?  How many people have warp 0 mapped to anything?  The 
>> only way I can get to warp 0 is by hitting repair.
> 
>I also.

Yeah, I think it's outrageous that I would be forced to move my hand from
it's "home" position and hit the '0' key, especially if I'm doing nothing.

I assume that this discussion was about automatic repair at warp zero?
I'm all in favor of having a ship automatically repair when at warp zero, 
and stop repair when the ship changes direction, gains speed, fires, 
raises shields, tractors or pressors.  Just leave the 'R' key doing the 
same thing it does now.

Along the line or mods, I'm also in favor of the 1 sec pop clock, (more
"granularity" not needed IMHO).

As far as poping while beaming down or bombing, I think it should be left 
alone, luck is part of the game.  If a planet pops just as you are putting 
down, it's just bad luck.

-Halfdane
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: bdhall@hansen.ecn.purdue.edu (Brian D Hall)
Subject: Re: HELP!!!!  Server Problem
Keywords: port logfile
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Distribution: US
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1993 22:16:03 GMT

In article <e4Ji03bMc8ot00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com> fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden) writes:
>In article <1993Jan14.223517.1962@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> bdhall@schmied.ecn.purdue.edu (Brian D Hall) writes:
>>>	I need some assistance.  Here is my problem:
>>>
>>>	The logfile for fife is growing too big too fast and is filled with
>>>bad connection messages.
>
>You can keep the size down by abbreviating the messages.  It doesn't solve
>the problem, but it makes it less of one.
>
>>>Connecting to mentor.cc.purdue.edu through 4208
>>>I cannot connect through port 4208
>
>The part of the code which prints this is connectToClient(), which I believe
>only happens after a ghostbust.  If the network got nuked, then recovering
>after a ghostbust is going to fail, hence the message.
>
>The "cannot connection through port" is misleading; it's just a failed
>connect() call.  The port number is probably irrelevant.
>
>(I reserve the right to be wrong... haven't looked at this stuff for a while.)
>
>-- 
>fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
>[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]



	Problem solved.  The file input.c was incorrect.  If a ghostbust 
occurred, then it would try to reconnect forever, each time printing a message
to the LogFile and also holding the port captive.


   Brian Hall

Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: danny@cs.su.oz.au (Danny)
Subject: Re: Halftime
Organization: Basser Dept of Computer Science, University of Sydney, Australia
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 01:05:09 GMT

In article <1993Jan25.190243.23729@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> von@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Steve Von Worley) writes:
>As Felix Gallo said before: NETREK IS NOT BRIDGE.  NETREK IS A NASTY
>POLITICALLY INCORRECT SIMULATION OF WAR.  In war, you stick together
>and talk to each other or die.  It has been, and always should be, the
>same in netrek.

Ummm...  You try playing bridge and not sticking by your partner or not
talking to them!  I've seen people get a lot more worked up about bridge
than about netrek.  (And has anyone ever been shot over a game of netrek?)

Danny.
(Who just failed to make the Australian Youth Bridge team, which would
have got him a free trip to Denmark with a stopover in the US to play
netrek)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: books@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu (Roger Books)
Subject: Re: Clueless games
Organization: FSU nuclear physics
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 93 14:58:05 GMT

In article <1jq97sINNja8@matt.ksu.ksu.edu> hendric@matt.ksu.ksu.edu (Richard Hendricks) writes:

>Sadly, I think there might be a conspiracy of clueless people
>here(not necessarily newbies).  I have sat next to, and watched,
>someone logon to the 'clue' server, send the message to himself,
>and promptly _turn_off_his_message_window!  I asked him, and he
>said, 'oh yeah, first time I played, I noticed that message.  I
>just send the thing to myself and turn it off.'  Evenually, I
>noticed about four of his friends do the _same_thing.  I asked
>them about clue, and he said something about he is a good player.
>I then asked about the messages, and he said he ignored them!!
>SOme people need to taken to places far away and shot.  So far,
>in the quest for clue, message reading, and responding to
>messages seems to me to be the most important part. 
>
>Richard Hendricks
>Offical Newbie Twink

Here's a suggestion for clue checking. Initial message as now. Keep track 
of time since last post for each player.  If they have no posts for X 
minutes they would get another clue check.  You wouldn't even need to let
people know how many minutes it waits.

I don't know how hard this would be to impliment, but it should fix the
above problem.

Cirdan

Roger
books@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: keith@majestix.cs.uoregon.edu (Keith Steiger)
Subject: The University of Oregon's RSA public key
Summary: RSA key for new client
Keywords: RSA client
Organization: University of Oregon Computer and Information Sciences Dept.
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 09:01:49 GMT

I have grabbed the bronco.final.tar.Z file from ftp.cis.ksu.edu, added in the
RSA 2.0 code from pittslug.sug.org, and modified it to interface with the
trekhopd daemon from charon.amdahl.com.  Thus, I have built a client (for
sun4's) that is nothing more than an RSA and trekhopd version of the bronco
client.

This client will only be used at the University of Oregon to get through the
firewall that our network of sun4's is behind.  I swear that this client will
not be used outside of the .uoregon.edu domain, that I will never let anyone
else see the keys.h file, and that I will never use the key to create a borg
or bot of any variety.  If I need to officially proclaim anything else to
meet with the needs of the Server Gods(tm), just let me know.

And now, as per the instructions in the "rsa" help file on gs69.sp.cs.cmu.edu,
I am posting a uuencoded copy of the keys.dat file.  The key this was built
from was generated using "genkeys".

begin 644 keys.dat
MP4^-J0,5?<R7E:SJA80W'5N<^3.W$QLY_=[CO4`ED++A>G:M&T##!R"(V[L+
3&X"&+^3*[9R-N*M)=.#99D;OJ#.W
`
end

By the way, the sun4 uuencoded this keys.dat file into a format with spaces in
it.  Both machines uudecoded the other's output correctly, so I decided to post
the version without unusual spaces.

	Keith Steiger
	(who misses bronco and wants to upgrade and base on sturgeon)
	"Is there anything else I need to do to get this client to fly?"
From: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James Hawtin)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: European wants to play in an INL team
Date: 22 Jan 93 13:21:08 GMT
Reply-To: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk
Organization: School of Computer Science, The University of Birmingham, UK

Mee Too I wanna play in the INL perhaps we can get a whole 8 in the whole of europe?

				James

Commodore wibble 
   ^ ----- That must make me a rank scum :-)
Xref: sparky rec.games.netrek:12026 alt.flame:19005
From: echeverr@scf.usc.edu (SCRIMMAGE US NOW)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek,alt.flame
Subject: Re: New Sturgeon Style Server
Followup-To: alt.flame,misc.test
Date: 21 Jan 1993 23:35:49 -0800
Organization: Will Ogg For Food
NNTP-Posting-Host: phakt.usc.edu

In article <y4j3+5g@rpi.edu> colles@vccnw06.its.rpi.edu (Grey Knight (Shawn Collenburg)) writes:
>echeverr@scf.usc.edu (5150) writes:
>>In article <1jehq6INNs8g@champ.ksu.ksu.edu> scottwb@champ.ksu.ksu.edu (Scott W Butler) writes:
>>>I dont understand why every one loaths sturgeon so much, its a conspiracy.
)>Well, hell's bells.  I enjoy playing on experimental servers.  But, say,
>                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
)>hockey doesn't attract weenies, or make weenies out of good players. Sturgeon
)>turns you into an egotistical runner scum, and that's the worst kind of 
)>player in regular netrek.  Want to play sturgeon?  Fine.  Just don't go play 
)>anywhere else; at least, not on my team.
>I'm not one for impoliteness, but F* you. I "enjoy" playing on sturgeon,
>since I can play the "egotistical runner scum" there. Anywhere else,
>you do that, and you loose. Sturgeon gives me a change of pace from
>the demands of teamwork.

I'm not one to stand impoliteness, you F*head.  Since you enjoy playing on
sturgeon, and can play there as an ERS, fine and dandy w/me.  I did mention
that i'd rather you not play regular netrek on my team; i never said you
couldn't be an ERS.

Anyways, if you can't stand teamwork, why play netrek at all?

5150
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: How to sign up for the Spring INL
Date: 28 Jan 1993 09:55:41 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <106950@netnews.upenn.edu> botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle) writes:
)In article <1k589i$383@agate.berkeley.edu) tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) writes:
))
))INL name		Most recognizable name
))Heath Bar Crunch	Mojo Riser
))Cherry Garcia		Spaceace!
))etc.
)
)can I be Blueberry Cheesecake ;)
)
))
))The INL Council reserves the right to approve all weird names.
)
)huh?

That's just a safeguard against teams like

IllIlIllI
IlIllIllI
IlIllIlII

etc.
 -Tom
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: server instalation
From: owen@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu (tom owen)
Date: 22 Jan 93 15:24:49 EST
Reply-To: owen@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu
Distribution: world
Organization: The University of Toledo

  Just attempting a stealth installation of Netrek on a local server here... is it
at all possible if you DON'T have root priviledges?
   
  Keeps shrieking about not being able to connect to port, etc...  weird.

                                           thanks,
                                                  -=>me.
From: mummert+@AUK.WARP.CS.CMU.EDU (Todd Mummert)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: More Questions on the Cutting EDGE
Date: 26 Jan 93 06:16:42 GMT
Article-I.D.: AUK.MUMMERT+.93Jan26011642
	<106549@netnews.upenn.edu>
Reply-To: mummert+@CS.CMU.EDU
Organization: Carnegie Mellon


Brian> I have this change in my borg.  I think that's how the change
Brian> should stay.  How hard is it really to raise shields to get out
Brian> of repair mode?

Creeping featurism.  How hard is it to maintain a phaser lock after the
initial hit?  I have this change in my borg.  I think that's how the
change should stay.

)For the NBR it might be worthwhile to totally automate repair at the
)server level; that is, as long as a player sits at warp 0 with
)down he or she would automatically be repairing; as
)soon as the player moves, shoots, raises shields etc then repair
)mode would be lost.

Actually, if at any time you could go into repair mode and not lose
any abilities then the server should do it.  When decreasing speed from
a higher warp to a lower warp and you're not at that moment firing nor
do you require the use of your shields then the server should just drop
you into repair mode until you reach your desired speed.  Of course, the
server should do this when you're orbiting a planet too, especially under
heavy fire, since *YOU* need all the fuel you can get, but you shouldn't
have to think about the tradeoffs necessary to come into/ get out of repair
mode.  

Netrek for Morons....coming soon to a server near you.

BP
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Another scum wannabe
Date: 24 Jan 93 18:49:01 GMT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <cfMaCHK00Vox813Fgi@andrew.cmu.edu>, gc2n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Greg K Chung) writes:
>> Server: paradise.declab.usu.edu, port 2592 (New server)
>>   Type Rank       Name              Login
>> F1 DD  Ensign     Twink             brandon@petersboro
>> F5 DD  Ensign     guest             brandon@petersboro
>> Fh BB  Ensign     M5                Robot@Nowhere
>> Fi BB  Ensign     M5                Robot@Nowhere
>> R0 CA  Ensign     Lynx              brandon@petersboro
>> R2 DD  Ensign     guest             brandon@petersboro
>> R3 DD  Ensign     guest             brandon@petersboro
>> Kj BB  Ensign     Guardian          Robot@Nowhere



	(snicker)

	He, he....

	Sheesh, I can't even scum on my own server without getting caught...!
(how else am I supposed to test mods...?)


		-Lynx



...Now look!  You made me spill my drink everywhere when I burst into
laughter...
Organization: Sponsored account, School Of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 02:36:51 -0500 
From: Sean Christopher Simmons <ss72+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Yea, tho' I walk through the valley of the shadow of Red Shirt
	<books.192.0@fsunuc.physics.fsu.edu>

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 20-Jan-93 Re: Yea, tho' I walk
throug.. Roger Books@fsunuc.physi (1805)

> You left out my comment about tractors.  You lines are only good if you
> can get that tractor lock on me.  Of course, since I normally play with
> 250+ms lag you should be able to tractor me quite easily.  Dodging your
> opponents moves long before they are made really sucks.


	Tractor is very important.  It is also longer range than phaser, so if
you can hit with phasers, you can lock  tractor (unless your foe is
cloaked).  It is, in fact, much easier to hit with tractors.  As I've
said before, when you're severly lagged, the tractor is the only weapon
that you can depend on.



> Useless stats?  What does 3.0+ bombing
> 			  0.8  defense
> 			  0.3- offense

	Hard to tel much from this.  It does say that your bombing probably
comes from actually bombing, not Ogging.  You look sort of like an
overeager (Or over-lagged) SC bomber.  Planet rating?

ZZnew guy
From: feng-thomas@cs.yale.edu (Thomas Feng)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SC-DD battle or DD-CA battle
Date: 27 Jan 1993 18:17:44 -0500
Organization: Yale University Computer Science Dept., New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: monkey.zoo.cs.yale.edu

Brian Paulsen writes:
>Pick any DD team you want - you get first choice.
>
>Since I'm letting you pick the top 8 players, I get to decide whether
>you face an all CA team or an all SC team, and then I'll pick my 8
>players.
>
>Brian
>
Seems that no matter what you just want to win your bet?  CAs are not
particularly relevant here...

Ensign Galois Theory
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Halftime
Date: 26 Jan 93 02:27:33 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C1Fw5z.1q7.2
Reply-To: hill@norman.vi.ri.cmu.edu
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Tom Holub writes
> Halftime was not my idea.  There are a lot of people who like it.

Certainly true.  I do think it should be able to be superceeded by a  
captain approval.

> )Please remove the pause feature, then.  A pause inserts a random, 
> )disturbing inhomogeneity (is that a word?) into the flow of the game.
> )Especially when people use it for conveniences like going to the
> )bathroom.

> Oh, God forbid that anyone actually have to go to the bathroom some
> time in a 2.5 hour period.  If you think netrek is more important
> than going to the bathroom you need some perspective.

No...I like the pause feature, but please make it stop taking game time.   
And write a guideline for pause etiquette.  In my opinion, when subs are  
available it is inappropriate to ask for a pause so someone on your team  
can go to the bathroom.  Pauses in the INL often are unneeded, and only  
suck a few minutes out of the otherwise, enjoyable game.  

> )Shorter game?  Why?
> 
> Because--get ready for a bulletin here--some people think the games
> last too long.  They are grueling and they don't really give an underdog
> a chance for an upset.

I think decreasing game length furthur will put additional emphasis on  
initial-bombing and less on true-netrek talent.  Get more than 8 people to  
play on your team if you think the games are too long, and sub  
accordingly.

> )One of the attributes of a great netrek team is the ability to stay
> )cohesive under pressure.  This means the ability to maintain roles,
> )follow orders, etc., even when things look hopeless.  Another
> )quality is that the team can communicate well, either verbally or
> )via messages, even in the face of seemingly negative odds.
> )
> )One might say that the two attributes above distinguish a good team
> )from a mediocre one.
> )
> )Unfortunately, halftime reduces the importance of the two attributes
> )mentioned above, since there is a period recuperate from loss-induced
> )spazzing.
> 
> One of the attributes of a good basketball team is the ability
> to stay cohesive under pressure.  This means the ability to maintain
> foles, execute plays, etc., even when things look hopeless.  Another
> quality is that the team communicates well on the court, even in the
> face of seemingly negative odds.
> 
> One might say that the two attributes above distinguish a good team
> from a mediocre one, all else being equal.
> 
> So should the NBA go to one 48-minute period?
>  -Tom

Tom has so many stupid sports anologies.  I hope one day he runs out...but  
I doubt he will.

Rob
aka Spaceace!
From: bellew@pixmap.seas.upenn.edu (Douglas V Bellew)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Proposal for Clue Check
Summary: (A little faulty math)
Date: 25 Jan 93 16:45:13 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1993Jan23.182932.3475@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> wk5w@brain.med.virginia.edu (William Katz) writes:
:>My criteria for ejection would be the following SESSION stats:
:>
:>(Bombing < 0.1 * # enemy planets) &&
:>(Offense < 1.0) && 
:>(Planets < 0.1 * # enemy planets)
:>where # enemy planets = # planets CURRENTLY held by enemy.

All I have to say to this is...
Insert enemy planets = 29.
Ouch.

:> Vlad da Lagged
:> Vlad da Outta Fuel
:> Vlad da Annoying

Doug
Vampyre
From: v119matc@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Claus Schwinge)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Halftime
Date: 27 Jan 93 22:01:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1k54u0$2lr@agate.berkeley.edu>, tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub) writes...
>In article <1k49a5INN35s@hadrosaur.cis.ohio-state.edu> mdm@cis.ohio-state.edu (Michael Moore) writes:

>These people are burning out.  The games are too long and take too much
>concentration.  We're in this to have fun, not to prove who's the biggest
>netrek ironman.
> -Tom

Yeah, but ANYTIME you have an ongoing competitionof this sort there will 
be people who WANT to be the best, it's human nature.  I could cite several 
sports, etc etc etc etc, and one thats really comes to mind is the pig 
borg method of drawing cloakers (It connects to other pig borgs in the game
and averages the position info of the cloaker.  I think most servers now 
send the same randomized position to everyone, is this true?)

The solution is to have seperate leagues, an A and a B league, where one is
for competion, the other for fun.  People who want cut-throat competion will
join the league labeled for such, people who want a fun (but still 
compeditive) game will join the other.

I know another league is a huge headache, I know it won't form anytime 
soon, but shortening the game by 1/2 hr won't do much to get rid of the post
game headaches of most players.

-Halfdane
From: echeverr@scf.usc.edu (5150)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Comparing Ship Types
Date: 24 Jan 1993 18:13:13 -0800
Organization: <censored>
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu

In article <1jtfmbINN4a8@aludra.usc.edu> jimmyhua@aludra.usc.edu (Jimmy Huang) writes:
>5150 can use a DD very well, I can too (when I get out of the mentality

Why thank you.

>that I usually have when flying a AS - eat torps, kill). For this reason,
>i think DD's don't need to be improved.  Because people can naturally
>take advantage of its capabilities.  Maybe the CA needs to be downscaled...
>hm. 

If i had a hand in it, the only ships that i would 'improve' (and i use that
word loosely) would be the AS and the BB.  The BB needs to go on a diet, and
the AS needs more effective fuel to be able to defend itself against an ogger.

5150
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek