HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us (Gary S. Trujillo)
Subject: Baldwin survey
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 18:52:18 GMT

Those members of the NativeNet mailing lists who have posted articles
may soon be receiving an announcement of a survey being done by a
sociologist by the name of George Baldwin, himself an American Indian
(Osage/Creek).  Dr. Baldwin is conducting the survey for the purposes
of his own research, and not on behalf of NativeNet itself.  Your
cooperation with this survey is purely voluntary.

It is not clear at this point whether Dr. Balwin's objectives in
conducting his survey coincide with those I outlined recently in my
article on the subject.  My objectives are to get a better idea of
what people using the NativeNet mailing lists and affiliated electronic
conferences and newsgroups want from those lists, as well as some bio-
graphical information to help us get to know one another better, while
Dr. Baldwin's survey appears constructed primarily to learn something
about the patterns of usage of the networks principally by American
Indian users, if I understand it correctly.  We had at one time talked
about doing a survey jointly, but never came to any agreement on the
matter.

I have no objection to the Baldwin survey, but want to make it clear
that it is not the same as the NativeNet survey I announced recently,
though some of our objectives may overlap.

Gary
--
    Gary S. Trujillo                            gst@gnosys.svle.ma.us
Somerville, Massachusetts              {wjh12,bu.edu,spdcc,ima,cdp}!gnosys!gst
From: ecologycntr@igc.apc.org (Ecology Center)
Newsgroups: alt.native
Subject: Re: Rights for Rocks!
Date: 28 Sep 92 16:09:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #R:cdp:1308200071:cdp:1308200072:000:111
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!ecologycntr    Sep 28 09:09:00 1992


>polling animals or running them for office...

Doesn't sound like too bad an idea, this year, does it?

Chris
Newsgroups: alt.native
From: waddell@cs.scarolina.edu (Jeff Waddell)
Subject: Re: NativeNet Chat's Direction
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date:  2 Oct 92 21:46:38 GMT

Colombus Legacy=500 Years of Racism & Stolen Land <beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!ucs.indiana.edu!DSOTO> writes:

>Original-Sender: Colombus Legacy=500 Years of Racism & Stolen Land <ucs.indiana.edu!DSOTO>

>One question what groups will be considered North American Indians
>That Mexico be considered among the North Americans, that Central America
>will be part of it. I find dificult when I tell people that I'm American
>native, they tell me no, you are a Costarican Native.
>Daniel Soto

Well Daniel I would guess that it is because people who are from the United
States of America consider this country to be ALL of AMERICA.  You and I
know that this just isn't so, but it is hard to convince an American of 
that.  I should have said most American because although I'm American I
consider Canada, as well as Mexico, Costa Rica and the rest of Central
America to be part of North America--then of course there is all of the
South American countries.  You are considered a Costarican Native because
the person involved doesn't realize that Costa Rica is part of North America
which makes you a North American Native.  Anyway, I apologize if I'm 
confusing, but this whole issue is confusing.

	Jeff

Newsgroups: alt.native
From: ccuppern@s.psych.uiuc.edu (Cyndi Cuppernell)
Subject: Native American ancestor search
Organization: UIUC Department of Psychology
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 02:48:39 GMT


For as long as I can remember, my grandmother has told me that one
of my ancestors was a Native American.  Specifically, she was my
grandmother's great grandmother (or my 3rd great grandmother), who
lived in New Haven, Connecticutt in the late 1700's or early
1800's (I don't have my papers with me).  While searching for
information on that line, I found a book that lists families of New
Haven.  Not only is she in that book, the information we found
pushed her line back at least 5 generations on each of HER
ancestors.  Some lines went back 11 generations from her.  Many of
the surnames were found in great abundance.  As a result, I am
inclined to believe that this woman was not a Native American.  I
don't think so many of her family would be listed in municipal and
church records, which were the source of these names and dates. 
My suspicion is that either my grandmother had her great
grandmothers mixed up, or that my grandmother is incorrect
entirely.  

Does anyone have any experience with searching out geneology
records for Native Americans?  Are there many records?  It has
always been a source of pride in our family that we at least have
a trace of Native American ancestry, and my family is anxious to
trace this down if possible.  It may be that it was actually a
different great grandmother was the Native American, but if that's
the case, I am not sure where I would find records.-- 
                 
         ________________________________
         |                              |
         |          WARNING             |
         |                              |
         |   .sig UNDER CONSTRUCTION    |
         |                              |
         |         PLEASE USE           |
         |       ALTERNATE ROUTE        |
         |                              |
         | (ccuppern@s.psych.uiuc.edu)  |
         |______________________________|
From: Colombus Legacy=500 Years of Racism & Stolen Land <beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!ucs.indiana.edu!DSOTO>
Subject: Re: NativeNet Chat's Direction
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 02:40:18 GMT

Original-Sender: Colombus Legacy=500 Years of Racism & Stolen Land <ucs.indiana.edu!DSOTO>

One question what groups will be considered North American Indians
That Mexico be considered among the North Americans, that Central America
will be part of it. I find dificult when I tell people that I'm American
native, they tell me no, you are a Costarican Native.
Daniel Soto

Newsgroups: alt.native
From: ph9jba@nestor.uucp (82222-anglum)
Subject: The Last of the Mohicans
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 92 15:40:07 GMT

Saw "The Last of the Mohicans" Friday evening--what a movie

The cinematography rivals "Dances with Wolves" and Russell
Means steals the movie.

Go see it.

Jeannine Crowfoot
Newsgroups: alt.native
From: beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!cats.UCSC.EDU!guiller
Subject: Re: inclusion, exclusion
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 04:54:28 GMT

Original-Sender: guiller@cats.ucsc.edu (Guillermo Delgado)

Although emailing to our Indigenous brothers and sisters in South, Central
and Mesoamerican, the Abya Yala (Kuna language=land of life), is hard to
say the least, and definitevely so far impossible, The South & Mesoamerican
Indian Information Center does monitor nn.chat@gnosys. We agree with
kuhub.cc.ukans.edu, and the fact that Indianness is a world experience.
Sami people have a lot to share with the Aymara, the Mapuche, the
Guarani, the Kuna, the Guaymi or the Lenca. Din'eh people have been to
South, Central and Mesoamerica. This sharing of info is an on-going
activity, it is a process of re-cognition. And this is what these brothers
and sisters say. Silvia Rivera Cusicanqui has recently visited the
Univ. of Calif-Davis for a weekend of Continental Indigenous Workshop on
Racism, Bilingualism and Economics. What SAIIC needs is to be able to
continue the production of radio-cassettes with news on recent developments
on Indian Lands (everywhere). Our new issue is coming out next week. As
you see the networking is an on-going process, and it never stops. You are
more than welcome to give us a hand so to continue on with this work.
SAIIC, 1212 Broadway, Suite 830, Oakland, CA 94612
Peace


Newsgroups: alt.native
From: Peshewegunzh <beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!mthvax.cs.miami.edu!mamia!peshe>
Subject: Re: Mixed blood and culture
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 00:57:09 GMT

Original-Sender: Peshewegunzh <mthvax.cs.miami.edu!mamia!peshe>

I think in regards to this, that it is important to think in terms
of nationalities, not an imaginary selection based on the illusion
of "race."  In whatever context such a concept is used, it has
unproductive consequences. Either one gets hung up on who is racially
"pure" or "superior" evoking echoes of other disastrous historical
events, or one wastes a tremendous amount of time searching for the
unquantifiable and unmeasurable.

Each person living is closely related, and there are certain familial
traits associated with nationality, which overlap, even to the extent of
such traits appearing within differing nationalities.

Such concepts sadly occurring among Indians is an example of flawed ideas
transplanted from the philosophies extant among the European
nationalities, especially over the last century and a half.

"Mixed blood" could only realistically refer to the recipient of a
blood transfusion. The imaginary concept of race leads inexorably
to racism, in one form or another, since it implies a genetic
separation between groups of people that simply does not exist to such
an extreme degree. It was first coined in tandem with justifications
for one nation to oppress others, by that one nation.

The bottom line is that being a member of any sane community does
not consist in laboratory analysis of tissue samples being a
prerequisite. That's a case of reductio ad absurdum.

I personally don't feel there's any big problem to figuring out
what kinds of information and issues will serve American Indians (I
guess those residing in the Americas, but primarily in Canada and the
U.S. and partly in Mexico) and don't see any big problem with who
will participate. I would think quite a few of those who look at things
in a purely academic way might fade away as their interest wanes in what
we would be talking about. We might not even be "Indian enough" for some
of them looking for naive children of the forest!

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peshewegunzh

peshe%mamia.UUCP@mthvax.cs.miami.edu
mthvax.cs.miami.edu!mamia.UUCP!peshe
peshe@mamia.UUCP
mthvax!mamia!peshe

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroups: alt.native
From: clong@remus.rutgers.edu (Chris Long)
Newsgroups: alt.native,alt.discrimination
Subject: Indian Boy Suspended from School for Wearing Long Hair
Date: 28 Sep 92 17:59:12 GMT
Followup-To: alt.native
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

>From clari.news.interest:

	MESQUITE, Texas (UPI) -- The school district in Mesquite, near Dallas,
has temporarily suspended an Apache Indian boy from kindergarten school
because he wears his long hair in a braid in the traditional American
Indian style.
	Itsa-Lichii Gomez had been granted a waiver of the school district's
policy in August so that he could start the academic year at the
McWhorter Elementary School. But the waiver was good only until school
officials decided whether to grant exceptions to students who had
religious reasons to keep their hair long.
	The suspenison came Friday after the school board earlier in the week
decided that there would be no change in the district's 25-year-old
grooming code. That code requires boys' hair to be ``neatly trimmed or
styled to stay out of the eyes and above a dress shirt collar.''
	The young boy was suspended for three days. But Mesquite schools
spokeswoman Dixie Parris declined to speculate on what would happen if
Itsa-Lichii's hair wasn't cut by that time.
	``I hope it doesn't go that far. I hope the parents choose to comply
with the dress code by that time,'' she said.
	But Gregory Gomez, the child's father, said his son's hairstyle won't
change.
	``We have discussed it with him, and he doesn't want his hair cut,''
the father said.
	``We are not withdrawing our son from school. If they choose to, they
will have to expel him.'' He said he doesn't know what his family would
do if Itsa-Lichii is expelled. He said litigation is a possibility.
	Like his son, Gomez also wears a long braid.
	The child's mother, Cathy Gomez said she informed Richard Havercamp,
the school principal, that the action against her son was wrong.
	``I told him this is just not right. This is racist, this is
discrimination,'' she said.
	John Horn, superintendent of Mesquite shools, said he understands the
mother's feelings but that making one exception would open the way for
others to challenge the policy.
	Long hair is an integral pat of the cultural and religious beliefs of
traditional American Indians, said Barbara Ash, an administrative
assistant at the native American Rights Fund in Boulder, Colo.
	``For many Native Americans, the only time they cut their hair is
when they're in mourning. It's not insignificnt,'' she said.
-- 
Chris Long, 265 Old York Rd., Bridgewater, NJ  08807-2618
From: sd00+@andrew.cmu.edu (Steven Denson)
Newsgroups: alt.native
Subject: Newly Subscribed
Date: 1 Oct 92 18:41:20 GMT
Organization: Masters student, Urban and Public Affairs, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


Hello,

I am Steven B. Denson, a citizen of the Chickasaw Nation, one of the
Five Civilized Tribes of Oklahoma and a second year master's student at
Carnegie Mellon's Heinz School of Public Policy and Management.  I am
very interested in the postings I have seen and look forward to
continually interesting and relevant discussions on this b-board.

Thanks,

Steven
From: beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!em.lanl.gov!ANDERSON_DAVID_A
Subject: FIVE VIDEOS ON NATIVE AMERICANS
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 17:45:00 GMT

Original-Sender: em.lanl.gov!ANDERSON_DAVID_A

	Based on a memo I received form Steve Brock, I believe his reviews
were well-intentioned.   He simply adopted the rhetoric to be found in
some quarters of the Native movement.  This rhetoric has found its was into
print via "Lakota Woman" by Mary Ellen Crow Dog and "The Spirit of Crazy
Horse" by Peter Matthiesen.

      	Both these writers used "mixed blood" in a pejorative sense.  By
their definition, Dick Wilson would be "mixed blood" but Dennis Banks
would not be.  Genetically, both are mixed bloods.  But these writers use
the term in a political way to label enemies.  Of course, both provide
explanations of what they are doing in the use of these terms.  But
simply providing an explanation does not justify this provocative and
prejudical use of terminology.

       It is wrong ideologically because it is equivalent to taking a
legitimate ethnic designation and using it as a negative label.  For
instance, one could take the term "Chicano" and apply it negatively to those
who are political enemies.  Then a brief explanation could be given that
one does not mean all Chicano's but only those evil creatures that one
hates.  And then, with this brief apology, one would persist in using
"Chicano" pejoratively.  This would be an outrageous and unfair
condemnation of all Chicanos.

     It is wrong because Crow Dog and Matthiesen bury their explanation
of this verbal trickery in their text and it may be easily overlooked by
a casual reader, someone who does not read every page.  For this type of
reader the impression is created that "mixed bloods" are to be universally
condemned.  Many quotations could be lifted from these books to
substantiate this as a viewpoint of the authors.  The effect of this is
clearly propagandistic.  If these authors do not intend to condemn mixed
bloods, they should have used other terminology.

     The result of this is a lot of offense and confusion.  Near the end of
her book, Crow Dog proclaims that she has finally become a "full blood."
This is utter nonsense.  Genetically she was a half-breed at the beginning
of the book and she was genetically a half-breed at the end of the book.
The only thing that changed was her political viewpoint, perhaps.  But because
of this confused terminology, she does not have the words to accurately
express what happened to her.  She can only lamely refer to herself as a
"full blood."  A distinct undercurrent here is her shame at being a mixed
blood and the denial of her identity.

     Any literature that perpetuates this type of misunderstanding does a
great diservice to Native Americans and engenders division along racial
lines.  It is schizophrenic and ironic that this rhetoric seems to
originate with mixed bloods who cannot accept what they are.  You would think
that Louis Riel would have taught us something.
From: rchilder@us.oracle.com (Richard Childers)
Newsgroups: alt.native,talk.environment,ca.environment
Subject: Re: NEWS: Harshest Salmon Laws Yet (But Sharks Doing Better?)
Date: 1 Oct 92 21:09:15 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Memes-R-Us
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

>Harshest Salmon Rules Yet
>
>by Tim McKay
>
>On the heels of no commercial salmon season off the Humboldt
>coast, and the shortest ocean salmon season ever, rules imposed
>on in-stream fishing on the Klamath River will be the toughest
>ever.
				...
>
>                        "It's Sea Lions"
>
>Seymour then volunteered that the salmon decline was due to
>federal protection for sea lions, and went on to blast the
>Endangered Species Act.

Heck, everyone knows that salmon were an endangered species until us
humans came along and started protecting them from sea lions ...

(-:

-- richard

-- 
=====
-- richard childers		rchilder@us.oracle.com		1 415 506 2411
         oracle data center  --  unix systems & network administration
                    Klein flask for rent. Inquire within.
Newsgroups: alt.native
From: beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!kuhub.cc.ukans.edu!ece!PSHINOGEE
Subject: inclusion, exclusion
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 14:14:53 GMT

Original-Sender: kuhub.cc.ukans.edu!ece!PSHINOGEE

I disagree with the people who think that Native American does
not include Mexicans, Central and South America and Canadians.
As exploited indigenous people, all have something in common.
In an article in "Report on the Americas" by Silvia Rivera
Cusicanqui, it states that people define "Indianness" through a
Eurocentric attitude.

Indigenous people have a universal worldview and believe in
co-existence not separateness. In both North and South America,
when the colonizers set boundaries between the Indians and
themselves, the Indians thought they had a mutual agreement
of recognition of "sovereignty". The colonizers thought that
since the Indians didn't want to conform to western civilization
then they must be savages, barbarians, etc. The only rights
the Indians had was a right to sell their land.

The Eurocentric attitude toward Indians, is linear, chronological.
But if you look beyond that and see Indians, traditional, urban
or educated, you see that they adapt differently to modernity.
Some traditional Indians drive pick up trucks, have tvs and some
have a college education. Just because Indians perception of
time and space is different doesn't mean they can't govern themselves.
It's just different. The Indian Reorganization Act by Collier in the U.S.
didn't work because Indians don't govern themselves like that.
The authority of leaders comes from age, wisdom and respect.

The questions now are how does a society exist that respects
diversity? How do Indians overcome the discrimination that
besets them when they do organize? The politics, the conflicts,
the tensions seem endless.
From: fescobar@nyx.cs.du.edu (Fabio Escobar)
Subject: property in native american societies of the past
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix (sponsored by U. of Denver Math/CS dept.)
Disclaimer1: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University of
Disclaimer2: Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
Disclaimer3: control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 92 17:00:42 GMT

As far as I know, and unfortunately I do not have a source on this,
indians in the US did not have a conception of property as we have one
today.  However, they did believe that they had ar right to utilize the
land.  THey also believed that anybody else had that same right, as long
as they did not get in each other's way.  So when the contracts were    
signed regarding sales of land, they felt  they were getting a deal.  In
fact, they believed they were getting paid to allow somebody to work a
land they did not even own in the first place and that was already open 
to everbody.  However, they were very surprised to come back one day
find that most of their land had been fenced in. 

nd
?s
\
{
9
Newsgroups: alt.native
From: gdsimpso@unix.amherst.edu (GILBERTO DANIEL SIMPSON)
Subject: Latino E-Mailing List
Organization: Amherst College
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 02:20:09 GMT
From: rnt@drutx.ATT.COM (Diane Thomas)
Newsgroups: alt.native
Subject: Five Videos on Native Americans
Keywords: mixed-bloods
Date: 26 Sep 92 03:16:45 GMT
Organization: AT&T -- 1200 W. 120th Street, Westminster Colorado



>    "Mixed blood" has a genetic meaning.  It does not mean
>"non-traditional" or "anti-AIM."  To use this term for political purposes
>is highly prejudicial and passes blanket judgement on the largest Native
>Nation in North American: the mixed bloods.  If the video Brock refers to
>perpetuates this racism, it is neither "historically correct" nor "perfect
>for the classroom" but, rather, another indignity heaped upon Native
>Americans.

I don't ever remember reading anything on the Net that made
me want to stand up and cheer - until now.  As a
mixed-blood, I am very happy to hear someone else say this.

This issue truly does make people schizophrenic.  I've had
an identity crisis over this for as long as I can remember.
(I'm one-quarter Standing Rock Sioux).
Natives (as far as I know) are the only ethnic group
required by the government to keep track of its members' degree of blood.
What if you don't know?  Does my degree of blood make me
more or less a member of my tribe? my family? my neighborhood?

If Natives are people living on the outside of the U.S. mainstream,
mixed-bloods are living outside of the people on the outside
- if that makes any sense.  The true irony is that there are
more mixed-bloods than full-bloods.
 
Diane Thomas
Denver, Colorado
From: thurman g. williams <beaver.cs.washington.edu!gnosys!KSUVM.KSU.EDU!STALLION>
Subject: Re: Mooney book finally reprinted!
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1992 18:26:00 GMT

Original-Sender: thurman g. williams <KSUVM.KSU.EDU!STALLION>

to whom it may concern

I find it objectionable for the belief systems of a people to be taken in a
worthless way, whether it be christian or Cherokee. Being of Cherokee/Choctaw
descent, i was angered to see the religion of my forefathers referred to as
'New Age Stuff.' Perhaps i'm not in the majority in having these feelings,
Though when i see fraudulent 'medicine men' capitalizing upon as well as
demeaning the belief systems of a nation of peoples i feel i a justified. It
was no coincidence that this 'new age stuff' came from North Carolina as
opposed to Oklahoma.


                                                   Coyote


Newsgroups: alt.native