HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Through a looking glass, darkly
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 12:53:43

    His Royal Highness of Meridies wrote:
 BS> Reply-To: bwilson@eng.auburn.edu

 BS> The tradition comes from a Border raids with the Middle 
 BS> many years ago, sort of
 BS> a "south rising again thing". It is all in fun.

 The South rise again? Nah, they had enough trouble getting it up the first
 time...


    8-)

 * Origin: Herald's Point * Steppes/Ansteorra * 214-699-0057 (1:124/4229)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mittle@watson.ibm.com (Josh Mittleman)
Subject: Re: SCA geography (was: through a looking ...)
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 15:03:57 GMT
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

Greetings from Arval!  Axel Rose made some comments about his experiences
with the SCA.  

> 	Of course, the followup from my perspective is, "If we can have
> people from non-European backgrounds, why can't we have personas from
> fictional backgrounds?"

Because that's not the game the SCA is playing.  One organization cannot
encompass every possible interest.  The SCA provides a broadly defined
framework within which people can have fun and learn about our period of
history through re-creation.  Fantasy role-playing can be fun.  So can
baseball, rock concerts, and modern art.  Those are also things that the
SCA is not here to do.

On the other hand, if someone told you that you _can't_ come to an SCA
event and pretend to be a half-elf or a ninja, then he is wrong.  Many
SCAfolk may feel that your choice of persona is inappropriate, and
depending how you use it some people may dislike you for it, but it is a
matter of taste.  I suspect that most of people are only trying to help;
what they are really saying is that you will have more fun by playing the
game with us, instead of bringing in something that doesn't fit very well
with twhat everyone else is doing.  Playing frisbee in the middle of a
baseball game is not likely to be great fun for anyone.  In the final
analysis though, the SCA is open to anyone who behaves courteously and
makes some effort at medieval garb.

> 	My point?  Maybe I don't have one.  Maybe I'm so frustrated at
> the SCA and the Kingdom game that I came online to rant & rave and see
> just how many people flame me. 

You may be pleasantly disappointed: Flame wars are extremely rare on this
forum.  Happily, most of the participants bring to the Rialto the standards
of mutual respect and basic courtesy that make the SCA work pretty well
most of the time in most places.  Unfortunately, there are exceptions and
you may receive replies from some of them.  I'd count it a friendly favor
if you'd keep any resulting angry exchanges to private mail.

===========================================================================
Arval Benicoeur                                       mittle@watson.ibm.com
From: sherlock@sleuth.eskimo.com (Jonathan Marsh)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Ferriting for answers.
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16e (7/4/92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith
Date: 18 Dec 92 10:33:24 PST
Organization: Perpetual Motion Machines Ltd.

    Hi, in getting the bugs worked out in my new feed, rec.org.sca was
discovered much to my delite. But so far, there's been no local posting to whom
I might contact by Email in the quest to discover more about joining the SCA.
    Should you know someone here in Seattle whom I can contact please email me.

                            My Humble Thanks
-- 

    sherlock@sleuth.eskimo.com           Phone 206-782-4359
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr)
Subject: buying chainmail links by the pound
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 20:50:55 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

A while ago someone posted regarding a merchant who sold
chainmail links in bulk. The links were produced and cut on some
sort of machine. 

I have need of such links, and need to contact this merchant.

can anyone help?

Carolus Malvoix
Montengarde An Tir
-- 
Within the span of the last few weeks I have heard elements of
separate threads which, in that they have been conjoined in time,
struck together to form a new chord within my hollow and echoing
gourd. --Unknown net.person
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: bwilson@eng.auburn.edu (Brian Scott Wilson)
Subject: Re: Through a looking glass, darkly
Reply-To: bwilson@eng.auburn.edu
Organization: Auburn University Engineering
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 16:49:20 GMT


>4.  However, since the subject has come up, it would be nice if the people
>at the Pennsic War who decorate their campsites and vehicles with Confederate
>flags would PLEASE QUIT IT.  IT SPOILS MY WHOLE DAY!!!
>

I must appologize than for this next pennsic because I have commissioned a
new Meridian Battle flag. I doubt that it will meet your approval.  For us it is 
an interesting way to bring our rather "different" culture to Pennsic. There 
has never been any intent to upset anyone. So far as I no none of the black
people I know have voiced any problem with it (and most of the black people I 
know in the SCA are as opinionated as the rest of us). I think I will ask Tomeki
next time I see him and as far as that goes If a certain new Knight in the
middle will drop me a few lines I will take it under advisement.

The tradition comes from a Border raids with the Middle many years ago, sort of
a "south rising again thing". It is all in fun.

Brian
Princeps Meridies

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr)
Subject: Re: Heraldic questions...
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 20:52:18 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

In article <a7510c93@nudity.UUCP> vnend@nudity.UUCP (David W. James) writes:
>parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr) writes:
>> Please understand, I *do not* want to see that happen. ButI also
>> don't want to get involved with an organaization, the COA, that I
>> feel is actively preventing SCAdians from practicing good
>> heraldry.
>
>	Do you have any examples of this?  You've thrown down a gauntlet; I'm
>calling your bluff.  Let us hear some examples of this "good heraldry"
>that the CoA is preventing people from practicing.

Three of my local friends have had devices bounced.

"gyronny of six from canton or and azure, a catamount dormant
argent"
      ---Bounced because of conflict with a catmount on a
         different field.

         Plenty different by medieval standards. Now, it is true
         that a cadet branch of the family might select arms with
         the same charge and a different field (or any of another
         dozen variations on the theme), but it is also true that
         a totally unrelated family might bear such arms.

"azure, a martlet volant argent, in chief three mullets of four
points or."
  
       ---Boounced for mundane conflict with Lang, of england.
          Langs was a dove, and the thre mullets were as i recall
          re[laced by crossed crosslets.

          Plenty different by medieval standards.

I don't have time for more right now, but I'll see what I can dig
up at council tonight, perhaps we can run with these for now?

Carolus Malvoix
-- 
Within the span of the last few weeks I have heard elements of
separate threads which, in that they have been conjoined in time,
struck together to form a new chord within my hollow and echoing
gourd. --Unknown net.person
From: Ruth.Woodring@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Ruth Woodring)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: A&s documentation forms,
Date: 11 Dec 92 14:52:40 GMT


 DP>  documentation; my prepared documentation for almost any piece takes
 DP>  an entire page, sometimes with half-inch margins all around.
 Mine for the dance I entered was 20 pages, including the translations, and  didn't even discuss the actual way to do dance steps.... The queen commented
 "Excessive documentation" -- I was amused....

 DP>  To all of the people who are horrified that we want to know the name
 DP>  of the entrant: I actively -want- to know as much as possible about
 DP>  the person who made this. Given their name, I have a better chance
 DP>  of knowing how long they have been doing calligraphy & illumination,
 DP>  whether they have received any awards for it (sometimes they haven't

 We might also want to make the point that Ansteorra has been using a system  whereby each artists has a separate display -- we're interested in the entire
 body of works of the artisan, not just seeing all of the calligraphy thrown
 together on one table.  The artisan stays by their table, and is thus  available to answer qustions and receive feedback.  It feels good to hear
 people say "This is really beautiful." and a lot more will do that than will  fill out a commenting form.  It also allows for the artists and the judges to
 exchange ideas and techniques.  

 I know, I know -- having helped develop the concept of artist display I do 
 tend to proselytize it a bit much, but I'm still enthusiastic about the 
 results!  Did you know there's one at Estrella War next year?

 ---- Vashti




 * Origin: Herald's Point * Steppes/Ansteorra * 214-699-0057 (1:124/4229)
From: x89hall34@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Phighting and Physics
Date: 17 Dec 92 13:22:02 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

Unto the good folk at the Rialto,
Greetings from Johannes Adelbart von Pels.

I am sending a request to other natural philosophers here on the bridge
for references and information on the topic of "The physics of martial
arts"  both the human and the weapon aspects.  Id est the physical 
principles involved in moving the body to effect a blow and analyses
of the weapons and what properties they have that make them effective.

I will be a guest speaker at an area high school where I am a regular
substitute math and science teacher (so I DO appreciate the technical
analysis over the vague "well I think it has something to do with something
..." kind of statement).  My topic will be "The physics of martial arts and 
dancing."  Unfortunately, most of the articles I have found on dance seem 
to deal with ballet rather than the English country dance that I teach.

Any reference to published texts or articles would be as appreciated as your 
own research.  E-mail here to the rialto or to this (borrowed) address 
or snail mail it to me at

John Krueger
615 W. Cedar 
Kalamazoo, MI 49007
TX# 616-381-6942

thanks for your interest,  my blessings to you at this Christmas season,\


Lord Johannes Adelbart von Pels, ADG, CSO, Andelcrag Champion, Shield Herald
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 12:21:22 EST
From: <AKP102@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: garb

HI, anybody out there know of any good places for garb patterns, particularly f
or late 15th century France?  If you do I would appreciate it if you would e-ma
il them to AKP102@psuvm.psu.edu.  since I'm leaving for Christmas break tomorro
w.  Much appreciation....Gisele Coeur de Lion
From: cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Through a looking glass, darkly
Date: 15 Dec 1992 17:11:44 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Dec15.051335.16251@newsroom.utas.edu.au> u883161@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Alex Tewes) writes:
>
[Why so few black people in the SCA?  Surely we don't discriminate?]

The SCA was once, semi-facetiously, described as "_Roots_ for white people."
(In case you don't recognize the reference, _Roots_ was a book and TV
miniseries about a black man who, starting from old grandmothers' tales,
traced his ancestry all the way back to a man who had been captured in
Africa and transported as a slave.  Then he went back to Africa, found
his ancestor's tribe, and discovered that they still remembered him.)

By and large, we do European history.  If we're of European ancestry, we're
researching the deeds of our ancestors--or at least, of our ancestors'
contemporaries.  People of African ancestry (those who have the historical
itch at all; many people don't) are going to research Africa; they don't
generally feel that European history has anything to do with them.

But there are people here and there who get interested in somebody _else's_
culture, and some of them do it in the SCA.  I don't know if you've
got enough cultural diversity in Australia for it to show up.  But in
America we've got people of every conceivable ethnicity and background,
and sometimes you see a Danish-American who does a Viking persona, and
sometimes one who be a Italian or a Byzantine or ...  The combinations
are just about endless.  Examples: William de Corbie, mundanely Swedish,
French in the SCA.  Cariadoc abu Patri, mundanely German-Jewish-American,
a North African Islamic Berber in the SCA.  To take it even further,
I knew a man once who was _Peruvian_ mundanely, Welsh in the SCA.  To
say nothing of all the Asian Vikings and blue-eyed Samurai.

And sometimes you'll find a black person who for reasons of his/her own
has gotten interested in medieval Europe and gets into the SCA.  There's
no reason such a person couldn't take a North African persona and invent
a story of how he got to Europe; but just as often he'll take a European
persona and run with it.  Goodness knows we don't care; to my eyes at
least a chocolate-colored Viking is no more contradictory than, say,
Dorothea of Caer-Myrddin, supposedly living in the ninth century, who
survived the Sack of York and has spent most of her time either on the
run or subsistence farming somewhere --and who weighs two hundred and
fifteen pounds, say WHAT?

So that's my answer to your question; most African-Americans aren't
interested in our game.  Those who are, are welcome.


Dorothea of Caer-Myrddin		Dorothy J. Heydt
Mists/Mists/West			UC Berkeley
Argent, a cross forme'e sable		cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu

Disclaimer:  UCB and the Cozzarelli lab are not responsible for my
opinions, and in fact I don't think they know I have any.


Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: ARCHER@utkvm1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Subject: Re: Another forbidden weapon
Organization: University of Tennessee 
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 23:01:45 GMT

In article <92Dec14.192915.25310@acs.ucalgary.ca> parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr) writes:

[snip]

>See again the paragraph above. It's dangerous. So is mountain
>climbing...As long as the spectators are safe, and the menace
>is to those who have chosen to participate, it is our duty to
>let them play their game without interference.
>

I agree.  Some people think we're nuts to but on armor and hit each other 
with sticks, and in fact think that we should be forbidden to do so, for our 
own good.  Fortunately, they are few, and don't hang around with us.

While "we shouldn't do it 'cause it's dangerous" is not a reasonable 
argument, we shouldn't do it because it will torp our insurance" DOES hold 
more weight with me.  Until a waiver that STICKS can be written in this 
country, I don't think it's going to happen.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
From: kuijt@umiacs.umd.edu (David Kuijt)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Too Light Blows (was Re: Face-thrust force/Picts)
Date: 15 Dec 92 21:58:27 GMT
Distribution: world, na, usa, local
Organization: UMIACS, University of Maryland, College Park, MD 20742

Greetings to the rialto from Dafydd ap Gwystl,

Carolus Malvoix writes concerning his...

>... current peeve, which is people who are taking my
>*garbage* shots as good. They are not good. I know, I threw
>the shot, and it would not cleave denim, let alone chain,
>but they want to take it because it was "clean"...This may be
>even worse than the Rhinos who wouldn't take your blow if you
>were wielding live steel.
>
>Carolus Malvoix
>Montengarde, An Tir

This is the first time I've seen someone who seemed angry
about others taking light.  Why do you think it might be
worse than Rhinos?  I'm inclined to believe this is hyperbole,
as I can't imagine how Fragiles (to coin a term) could cause
any of the negative affects that Rhinos do in our combat game.



	Dafydd ap Gwystl			David Kuijt
	Barony of Storvik			kuijt@umiacs.umd.edu
	Kingdom of Atlantia			(MD,DC,VA,NC,SC)
From: pwr@jab.tucson.az.us (Patrick Reed)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Search for somebody
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 92 00:18:58 MST
Organization: Just Another Bbs. Tucson, AZ

Is there anyone from the Shire of Black Lake or the Barony of Bonwicke, 
Ansteorra on the net?
 
Does anyone out there know Master Giles Hill?
 
If so, get back to me.  I have lost contact with the above mentioned 
people.
 
Lord Volfred Thorgrimsson
Barony of Tir YSgithr, Atenveldt
From: doconnor@sedona.intel.com (Dennis O'Connor)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Forms of Address
Date: 17 Dec 92 08:26:17
Organization: Intel i960(tm) Architecture
	<DOCONNOR.92Dec16090456@potato.sedona.intel.com>
	<1992Dec16.201320.27611@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: potato.intel.com
In-reply-to: tip@lead.aichem.arizona.edu's message of 16 Dec 92 20:13:20 GMT


tip@lead.aichem.arizona.edu (Tom Perigrin) writes:
] In article <> doconnor@sedona.intel.com (Dennis O'Connor) writes:
]
] O'Connor (If you wonder at my lack of an honorific, I would merely like to
] point out that he has excoriated me in email for attempting to be polite
] to him and getting it wrong.  I publically apologize for my feeble attempts
] to be polite to him.  I admit that was definately a mistake.)

Not a problem. As a general rule, the most fool-proof way to address
someone is to use whatever name appears in the either the "From"
or "Reply-to" fields of the header, or to use whatever name is
in the signature. So I would use "Tom Perigrin" for you, and you
could use "Dennis O'Connor" for me. Liberal use of pronouns helps.

If someone uses their SCA name use that. If they include their
SCA title(s), use them.

Getting familiar (i.e. calling me "Dennis") for ME is okay
if the tone of the letter is congenial. On the other hand,
calling me "Dennis" as part of a "flame" I find annoying.
Other people may feel differently about familiar address.

The basic principle is : call people what they wish to be called.
It's only polite.
--
Dennis O'Connor			doconnor@sedona.intel.com
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: troll@sug.org (A. Newman)
Subject: Happy Holidays
Organization: Sun User Group
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 19:42:05 GMT


Fondest greetings to you all, in this, the season of winter holidays;

Two apologies:

-	there are no non-modern languages on the list
-	I don't mean to offen any non-Christians by repeated use of
	the word 'Christmas'

Whatever you call them, my hopes that your's are happy.

I remain,
	your obedient servant...and angel,
	Aleksandr Yevsha, House Sinister
	Guildmaster, Worshipful Company of Carolingian Storytellers

	troll@bridge.sug.org
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Join the Storytellers Mailing list!  storytellers-request@world.std.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


English:  Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year

Polish: Wesolych Swiat Bozego Narodzenia i Szczesliwego Nowego Roku
Lithuanian: Linksmu sventu Kaledu ir Laimingu Nauju Metu
Latvian: Priecigus Ziemas Svetkus un Laimigu Jauno Gadu
Estonian: Roomsaid Joulu Phui ja Uut Aastat
Finnish: Hyvaa Joulua ja Onnellista Uutta Voutta
Hungarian: Boldog Karacsonyl es Ujevl Unnepeket
Russian: Pozdrevlyayu sprazdnikom Rozhdestva Khristova is Novim Godom
Ukrainian: Veselykh Svyat i scaslivoho Novoho Roku
Bulgarian: Tchestito Rojdestvo Hristovo. Tchestita Nova Godina
Czech: Prejeme Vam Vesele Vanoce a stastny Novy Rok
Slovak: Vesele Vianoce.  A stastlivy Novy Rok
Serb-Croatian: Sretam Bozic.  Vesela Nova Godina
Slovene: Vesele Bozicne.  Screcno Novo Leto
Gaelic-Irish: Nolag mhaith Dhuit Agus Bliain Nua Fe Mhaise
Gaelic-Scot: Nollaig Chridheil agus Bliadhna Mhath Ur
Welsh: Nadolic Llawen. Blwyddn Newdd Dda
Spanish: Feliz Navidad y prospero Ano Nuevo
Italian: Buon Natalie e felice Capo d'Anno
Azeri-Azerbaijan: Tezze Iliniz Yahsi Olsun
Romanian: Sarbatori Fericite.  La Multi Ani
French: Joyeux Noel et heureuse Anne
Portuguese: Feliz Natal e propero Ano Novo
German: Frohliche Weihnachten und ein Glueckliches Neues Jahr
Dutch: Zalig Kerstfeest en een Gelukkig Nieuwjaar
Swedish: Glad jul och ett gott Nytt ar
Norse-Danish: Gledlig jul og godt Nytt Aar
Icelandic: Gledlig jol og Nyar
Basque: Zorionstsu Eguberri. Zoriontsu Berri Urte
Greek: Kala Khristougena kai Eftikhes to Neon Etos
Turkish: Yeni Yilnizi Kutar, saadetler dilerim
Singhalese (Sri Lanka): Subha nath thalak Vewa.  Subha Aluth Awrudhak Vewa
Hebrew: Mo'adim Lesimkha
Armenian: Shenoraavor Nor Dari yev Pari Gaghand
Rapa-Nui (Easter Island): Mata-Ki-Te-Rangi.  Te-Pito-O-Te-Henua
Korean: Sung Tan Chuk Ha
Chinese-Cantonese: Gun Tso Sun Tan'Gung Haw Sun
Chinese-Mandarin: Kung Ho Hsin Hsi.  Ching Chi Shen Tan
Japanese: Shinnen omedeto.  Kurisumasu Omedeto
Indonesian: Selamah Tahun Baru
Tagalog (Filipino): Maligayamg Pasko. Masaganang Bagong Taon
Samoan: La Maunia Le Kilisimasi Ma Le Tausaga Fou
Hawaiian: Mele Kalikimake me ka Hauloi Makahiki hou



Mike
From: dickeney@access.digex.com (Dick Eney)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Primitive Firearms
Date: 21 Dec 1992 03:32:52 GMT
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

RE: Primitive Firearms

Golly, has everybody forgotten that Brother Berthold's dire
invention was certainly known in period, since the English used
cannon at the battle of Crecy?  And the final clashes in the
Hundred Years' War were settled by cannon -- the final fight in
Normandy, for instance, was won when a couple of French culverins
arrived and started potting the English from beyond bowshot.  (The
fight was a little more complicated than that sounds: the English
charged the cannon, the French infantry mixed it with them, and the
whole tangle rolled back onto the English lines.  With the archery
thus neutralized or their fire masked, the French cavalry closed
and delivered a decisive charge from melee range.)  The first brush
of the War of the Roses was also an exchange of long-range cannon
shots across the flooded Stroudwater (I think it was) before King
Henry VI put in an appearance and York's troops -- who had been
told that Henry was dead and they were enforcing the claim of the
rightful heir -- started to desert.
From: Mike.Andrews@f1077.n147.z1.fidonet.org (Mike Andrews)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP