From: wdo@TEFS1.acd.com (Bill Overpeck)
Subject: Re: Whose Values?
Organization: Applied Computing Devices, Inc., Terre Haute IN
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 21:05:31 GMT

In <1992Jul16.010915.4180@Cadence.COM> phz@cadence.com 
   (Pete Zakel) writes: >
In article <1992Jul7.212145.17720@acd4.acd.com> wdo@TEFS1.acd.com 
   (Bill Overpeck) writes: >>

>>When an *adult* risks participating in casual sexual activity, many 
>>people seem to think that they should be exempted from the natural 
>>consequences of that behavior by permitting easy access to abortion.  
>>Why do we teach our children about consequences, yet insist that 
>>adults be exempt from experiencing them?  Seems like a double stan-
>>dard (and lousy role modelling) to me. 

>So getting an abortion is not a big deal, huh?  

I didn't say that, nor did I mean to imply it (though it's undeniably
true for some people I've met).

>It seems to me that
>many (if not most) women are troubled enough by the idea of abortion
>that they would NOT get one lightly.  Of course, there are exceptions
>to everything.

No disagreement.

>I've even heard some pro-lifers claim that abortion is far more traumatic
>to the (ex-)mother than going through a full-term pregnancy and giving up
>the child for adoption (I dispute this, but I've seen this argument used).

It probably is for some people, but I doubt it works that way for most.

>In any case, an adult has the right to try to avoid (legally) the
>consequences of "casual sexual activity" (note, though, that not all
>abortions are a result of "casual sexual activity").

The term "avoid" isn't correct.  "Redress" or "undo" might work, but 
"avoid" implies that abortion is the equivalent of a birth control 
technique and I doubt that you wish to make that comparison.

>>Now, this is *not* about punishment.  This is simply about being an 
>>adult.  For example, if I as an adult, decide to have an affair, I 
>>risk the possibility that my wife will leave me if and when she finds 
>>out.  In that scenario, leaving doesn't constitute punishment (despite 
>>its devastating effects), it's simply a natural consequence of deeply 
>>violating the trust of another.

>Yes, but if you are successful in hiding the affair, you may never have 
>to face the consequences.  

I would argue that for most people there are other (personal) consequences 
of such behavior, but that's tangential.

>Of course, I think that people who deliberately violate the trust of 
>marriage are mostly slime-balls (not all, but most), but that's neither 
>here nor there.
>
>In any case, being pregnant is not the same as having an affair.

No analogy goes very far in this debate.

>And I still hold that a pregnant woman is the ONLY person who has the
>right to decide the future of the possible future child that is growing
>within her body.  If she decides to abort it, it is and should be her
>decision alone to make.  

And we're quickly back to the basis for such a right which, without
the sanction of the state, must appeal to some transcendent belief
in the importance of individual autonomy.   

>And any compassionate human being would support her in that decision 
>and help her with the healing necessary afterward.

I didn't think abortion was significant enough to require any 
subsequent "healing".  You guys need to make up your minds.

Bill
Newsgroups: talk.abortion