HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 16 Oct 1992 08:15:20 EDT
From:         K=A*T <MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU>
Subject:      Re: THE LAW OF RETRIBUTION

From:         "NAME 'Robert E. McElwaine'" <MCELWRE@UWEC.BITNET>

>                           THE LAW OF RETRIBUTION

>              The man-made laws are NOT working.

>              What we have here is FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE!
>         Perpetrators remain IGNORANT of The Law--a universal, cosmic,
>         and spiritual Law--The "LAW OF RETRIBUTION" or "KARMA":

>              "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a
>         man soweth, that shall he also reap."  Galatians 6:7, KJV.

>              "He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity;
>         he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword.
>         Here is the patience and faith of the saints."  Revelation
>         13:10, KJV.

>              "What goes around comes around."

>              This LAW of the Universe is just as real as the physical
>         law that for every action there is an equal and opposite
>         REaction.

>         ....

Never before I realized the similarity between the physics law
governing actions and reaction forces and "the Law of Retribution."

My belief in the physics law has suddenly become a lot
stronger.   :-)

>                                  Robert E. McElwaine

Name 'KAT'
From: MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU (K=A*T)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: Aztecs- Playing Games
Date: 14 Oct 92 18:29:04 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

>        I thought it was quite clever, Carl!  Linda was probably in a bad mood
> when she wrote that -- it happens to all of us.

First Quayle shakes his moron image and now this.

--KAT (I agree, it WAS clever)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
From: jwales@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (jimmy donal wales)
Subject: Re: a lengthy precis
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 11:55:18 GMT

>>If that economics grad student wants to add anything now,
>>he should be my guest.
>
>mine too.
>

Mine too.

Let me get back to you all later today.  I'll write up a nice clear
explanation of Jamie's racism as convention idea in a version that
ought to satisfy Jason's concerns about individual maximization.

Just a quick note.  Jason agrees that it is every firm's self-interest
in Jamie's example to behave in a racist fashion.  But then he argues
that there would exist some firm which would want to break ranks.

Note well that Jason's grasp of the 'every' and 'some' quantifiers
leaves something to be desired!

--Jimbo
From: SABOE@VUVAXCOM.BITNET (linda)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: Aztecs- Playing Games
Date: 15 Oct 92 14:27:00 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"

>        Cheer up, at least I didn't say you were probably suffering from PMS.

groan.
chris, i was wondering....
pms sufferers have hormonal fluctuations as excuse for mood swings...
what's a man's excuse???

- linda
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
From: holzman@fnalno.fnal.gov
Subject: Re: Aztecs- Playing Games
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Lab
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 01:37:47 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnalno.fnal.gov
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <POLITICS%92101409410317@OHSTVMA.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>,         
"Carl A. Lahetta" <U952020@RUTADMIN.BITNET> writes:
> In my present example people are justifuing the actions of the
> Aztecs, even though we would consider their acts to be barbaric, and these
> people condem Columbus.  

Kindly produce a post defending the Aztecs.  or can you not see the difference
between defending the Aztecs and condemnig Columbus (and Cortez, and so on...)

Dan
From: ST402711@BROWNVM.BITNET (Tim Johnson)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Crisis in leadership
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:00:26 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

>I'm sure Tim simply misunderstood the intent of my comments (I'm confident
>he would not deliberately misrepresent our position :)).  No one is more
>likely to value and promote beer than someone who daily faces the
>consequences of restrictive beer policies.  No one will be more vigilant in
>protecting the rights of brewers, buyers, and drinkers of beer!

  Perhaps I did misunderstand the intent of the comments,
but one could hardly misunderstand the content.  There is
a beer crisis in Kerry's state - what I fail to understand
is why Kerry has waited 3 1/2 years to formulate a beer policy,
and why none of these policies have yet been submitted as
legislation.  Yes, there is a beer crisis in Kerry's state.
But the real problem is one of leadership.

                              -Tim
From: CMORRISO@SNYESCVA.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: RE: To Those Who Voted For Carter
Date: 13 Oct 92 15:58:00 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"


        Carl, why didn't you just say that in the beginning?  It was so
obvious what you were trying to do.  Are your posts goin to get nastier
and your -------------+ on the end of your signature longer as we get closer
to the election?  Used to be the -------+ got longer as you got nastier.

                                        Chris
From: IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU (macphil)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: The New Format
Date: 16 Oct 92 18:10:20 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@OHSTVMA.IUPUI.EDU>

On Fri, 16 Oct 1992 13:27:45 -0400 Rick George said:
>>Yesterday's Trib said she was the first minority female news anchor in
>>Chicago and this was probably why she was given the job...

>Oh sure, she's a member of a minority group and she got the job...therefore
>she got the job because she's a member of a minority group.  Wonderful
>logic.

So you don't think such things occur?

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The lesser of two evils is still evil." - Winston Churchill

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
From: andy@SAIL.STANFORD.EDU (Andy Freeman)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: clinton jams; bush rambles; perot advertises
Date: 16 Oct 92 19:15:18 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

>His answers were clear, in many cases specific, well thought out without
>sounding rehearsed, and he answered most of the questions that were asked,
>without veering away.  This was particularly evident on questions regarding
>gun control, defense, and the deficit.

Well thought out?  Clinton's answer on gun control was well thought
out?  It didn't make any sense and revealed only that either he
doesn't know what he's talking about or he's uninterested in showing
that he does.

The Brady Bill CAN NOT have a significant effect because few criminals
get their guns through the channels it affects.  He also confuses
"states that have set up instant-check systems" with "states that have
records ready to be used for instant checks".  (Guess why police have
radios in their cars and call in information.  Guess how long it
actually takes states that do checks to do them?)  Clinton's advocacy
leaves us with two options - either he's ignorant or he's pushing it
for other reasons.

His babbling about "assault weapons" was even less grounded in
reality.

I couldn't figure out what Bush/Perot knew from their answers.

Some choice.

Clinton is very good at giving answers that sound good to people who
don't know about the subject under discussion.  (BTW - The presidency
isn't a closed-book test, so ....)  Is he really that ignorant, or is
he playing to the ignorant?  This may be good politics, but ....

Frankly, I thought that the "questions from the people" format was
even worse than the "questions from journalists" format.  The "common
people" questioners were even more ignorant than the journalists
usually are.  Plus, they didn't follow up.

I agree that this is the future of presidental debates.  That's a
shame.

-andy's rule for listening to policy discussions by candidates is to
        ignore them when they're talking about things he doesn't know
        about, because "does he sound good?" isn't a reliable way to
        know whether or not said candidate makes any sense, and to
        grade them when they talk about things he knows about.
From: IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU (macphil)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: Where did everybody go?
Date: 15 Oct 92 19:53:14 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@OHSTVMA.IUPUI.EDU>

On Thu, 15 Oct 1992 13:06:00 EST <ZIMMERJ@WABASH> said:
>Is it just me, or did delivery somehow stop?  Is there a dead link somewhere?

>Consider this a test.

Do you really want to know your grade?

Unfortunately, almost anyone can learn to subscribe to a list, but
don't learn to be responsible by learning a few commands beyond that
of "SUB John Doe".  Rather than clutter the list, try a few status commands
which can be sent to the LISTSERV:

LIST
   - this will itemize the lists sponsored by that site and if the list
     has been held (too many messages, etc.) it will appear here
SHOW
   - show general information about the LISTSERV machine at that site.
     if nothing else, you'll know it's responding to you.

QUERY POLITICS
   - this will show you your subscription settings for POLITICS.
     again, it'll at least let you know the LISTSERV is functional and
     you are still subscribed.

INDEX POLITICS
   - in the list of files/archives, you can see the last update timestamp
     and know if messages have been sent out.

Arrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!


P.S.

gore Clinton in '92.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The lesser of two evils is still evil." - Winston Churchill

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Sun, 11 Oct 1992 22:43:51 EDT
From:         Tim Johnson <ST402711@BROWNVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: post-debate reaction: yes, my spirit is sn

>[Ross Perot's] approach was a common sensual one.
>Lance

  Excuse me, Lance?  What debate were you watching?
While Ross Perot may have appeared differently to
different viewers, I find it hard to imagine that
anyone viewed his approach to the debate as "sensual."
I mean, he's just gotta do something about the ears,
if he wants to make that kind of an impression.  (And
he's a short guy.  Never trust a short guy.  The
JohnsoN/OlsoN ticket, I'll remind you, controls the
height thing.  And, despite what the E ticket claims,
the Beer Thing.  And the Shoe Thing.  And the N Thing.
Really, there is no other choice.  JohnsoN/OlsoN.)

                                   -Tim
From: JPERRY@ERS.BITNET (Janet Perry)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: gun control, kinda'
Date: 15 Oct 92 11:51:34 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
              15 Oct 1992 07:25:04 EDT from <MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU >

KAT and Robert,
I must not be very good at this.  I started to write a reply to your
quilty/sentencing topic and wrote myself into a circle.
sigh.
Janet
From: FOXML@RHODES.BITNET (MARTIN FOX)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Authoritative answers
Date: 11 Oct 92 19:15:19 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Have you noticed the number of people asking us for political information?
With a name like POLITCS, I guess this seems reasonable.  Could it be that
our answers are authoritative.  Perhaps the U.S. Government is listening in
and asking us for info.  This could very well be the reason why it's so
screwed up....  Maybe we should put disclaimers on our postings. (Excepting,
of course Msr. McElwaine's, which are unquestionably accurate.)

-Martin (The opinons expressed herewithin are mine and mine only, and if expect
them to be correct, then you'd have to pay me.)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 9 Oct 1992 15:34:14 EDT
From:         Evelyn Duncan <R3EJD@AKRONVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: campaign politics -- uggh

On Fri, 9 Oct 1992 15:13:00 EST linda said:
>OK, HOLD ON A MINUTE...
>
>what's a bat-child?

A baby vampire?  Or maybe Michael Keaton's baby?
>
>and how come i never hear abt. these really important events?

I guess we're just deprived. ;)
>
>- linda  (first tim upsets me w/stupid reality and now kerry confuses me...is
>this anyway to treat an old beer devotee??)

Evelyn (have you noticed that the New Yorker doesn't look like itself
anymore?)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: politics@ohstvma.bitnet
X-VMS-To: IN%"politics@ohstvma.bitnet"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Tue, 13 Oct 1992 21:35:00 EDT
From:         welcome to the faith dome explosion <SWEDE@DRYCAS.BITNET>
Subject:      tall guys loom on beer issue (virtual election stuff)
Comments: To: politics@ohstvma.bitnet

>and we are solid on the bEEr thing (note not one N, but two E's),

This is a clear indication that our virtual opponents are not entirely clear
in their perceptions of the issues.  Beer is a liquid, not a solid.  An E
on your science report card...!

The tall guys are clearly aware of what state beer is found in (the cold
state).  We have done years of research sampling much beer and all of it -
all of it, mind you, turned out to be liquid.  Even when it is drank out of
a shoe. :)

Lance wanted to know the rundown on the virtual tickets.  Clearly, other
tickets exist - the duncan/valentine ticket, the saboe/steele ticket, the
unusually silent all-kerry ticket.  However, if you want a ticket that stands
tall for drinking the liquid of your choice, there's only one ticket -
the johnsoN/olsoN ticket.  Thank you, and remember - beer is fun in
moderation.  That's why the tall guy ticket recommends Norm PetersoN be
the moderator at the virtual debate.

>- linda suE saboE

Gary W. Olson                "My lips may promise but my heart is a whore"
SWEDE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU  - Nine Inch Nails, "Last"
21 days and counting down...
From: E7L8ALL@TOWSONVX.BITNET (Andrew Allen)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: the kErry tickEt
Date: 16 Oct 92 15:58:46 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Envelope-to: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET
X-VMS-To: IN%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

>I wonder if I could ask the candidates what their views were on the last
>series of the Cosby Show.  I need to know just what sort of taste in tv
>program my virtual vote is going towards.....

In the interest of reasonably full disclosure:

On behalf of the "stealth" candidates (The Y's Guys), I thought you
would rest easier at night knowing that at least half of the ticket
does not watch the "Cosby Show."

When this half of the ticket actually gets around to watching TV, my
taste in comedy lately runs toward shows like "Red Dwarf" (my current
favorite), "Saturday Night Live," and David Brinkley (they've got this
total idiot named George Will that just keeps me in stitches)

Other than comedy, I tend to watch MacNeil-Lehrer and Frontline whenever
I get a chance; and I am prepared to admit that I watch Star Trek on
occasion.


>james p mc bride

Vote Y's Guys
1-800-4NO-GOVT
-other Andy
From: MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU (K=A*T)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: On the death penalty once again ...
Date: 14 Oct 92 11:31:44 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
              13 Oct 1992 06:48:09 GMT from <2893684@QUCDN.QUEENSU.CA>

> Is it true that your's is the only nation in the world besides Iran that
> executes children and the mentally retarded?

Now, please don't insult Iran.   :-)

Children, maybe, but not mentally retarded.  On the other hand
they don't even bother assessing someone's mental capacity.

U.S. is more concerned in this area.  We first evaluate the
mental capacity, THEN execute them.

--KAT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Mon, 12 Oct 1992 10:45:42 EST
From:         macphil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
Subject:      Re: gun control, kinda'
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@OHSTVMA.IUPUI.EDU>

On Mon, 12 Oct 1992 09:54:00 EST linda said:
>>Now tell the class *why* it costs a factor of several times more to
>>convict & kill someone...could it be:  a lengthy and multi-layered
>>appeals process?  Can you see lawyers dreaming of $$$$s because they
>>manage to pull a publicity-laden case out of the fire and thus
>>gain a lifetime of business as a result?
>
>yes, macp., i agree that is a big factor in those figures ....and, that's why
>i don't think the "cost" to taxpayers for housing a lifer as opposed the a
>person condemned to death is a good argument for or against the death penalty.

But if it's not a factor, why is it brought up?

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The lesser of two evils is still evil." - Winston Churchill

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
From: CMORRISO@SNYESCVA.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: New York Presidential Poll
Date: 15 Oct 92 18:39:00 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"


        The same issue had an article on homlessness, but I am falling behind
on my reading with all the email.

                                                Chris
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Fri, 9 Oct 1992 18:45:30 GMT
From:         Andrew Flood <ANFLOOD@IRLEARN.UCD.IE>
Subject:      Re: gun control, kinda'
              9 Oct 1992 10:58:02 EST from <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>

In Ireland and also England there has been a whole rake of people
released recently who after long prison terms were found not to have
committed the crimes they were accused of.  The Birmingham 6 are probably
the best known example but there are several others as well.
Pickles, one of the leading English judges said at the time of the release of
the B6 that if they had been hanged none of this fuss would have  happened
and the judicary and establishment would have no such embaressment to deal with

There can be little dougbt that the Birmingham 6 would have been executed,
at their original trial the judge more or less said he regretted the fact
that the death penalty could no longer be applied.

The death penalty is no soloution to violent crime, violent crime (or most
of it) arises for social reasons.  It is no coincidence that the US has both
the highest crime rate and the gratest inequalities in its societies.  If you
want to get rid or greatly reduce murder I suggest you start by tackling the
economic inequilities of your own society, not looking around for a few
victims to carry out state murder on.  After all the record for murder in
1991 must fall to the US air force in Iraq.
From: CCHILDER@UNMCVM.BITNET (fred)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: abuse of office
Date: 15 Oct 92 21:07:25 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

Isn't it amazing that the state department could process an alleged
request from a reporter for Clinton's travel agenda as a graduate
student yet we cannot find out anything about Reagan/Bush activities
in government because it might compromise national security? Many
requests under the freedom of information act take months or years to
process and often involve court battles prior to the release of any
information. What makes this case special?

CBS news reported last night that during the 1988 campaign a person
involved in the Willie Horton ad listed a particular library as
their source for information. However, the newspaper or periodical
mentioned was not carried by that library. The person who made the
info public started out in the republican national committee and ended
up in a 100K/year position within the government. The position did
not exist prior to this person's arrival and could be seen as a
political appointment.

Let's have equal access to information. I would like to see some
diplomatic communiques dealing with Iran/Contra and economic aid
to Iraq during the past 12 years. How do we know that dan quayle
wasn't meeting with members of the cocaine cartel when he was in
south america? The american people are entitled to straight forward
answers on these questions.

fred
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Mon, 12 Oct 1992 09:38:00 EST
From:         linda <SABOE@VUVAXCOM.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: CAU$E$ OF WAR$

well, happy happy monday morning.
nice reading first thing.
all i have to say about this post is:  yeah, suuuure.

think i'll go do some stretching exercises now.

-linda
From: JPERRY@ERS.BITNET (Janet Perry)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: 2nd debate text
Date: 16 Oct 92 19:01:47 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

Damn, fat fingers.  Could someone send me the 2nd debate text again?
        Thank you.
--Janet JPERRY@ERS.BITNET
From: jwales@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (jimmy donal wales)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: No joke!
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:59:17 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

>I am the sysop of a bbs in Herrin IL and have developed a method for
>*gatewaying* messages between listserv discussion groups and the bbs.

You gotta love this.  I hereby move that we all adopt Herrin, IL
as our official POLITICS home town.

I hope that Jennifer and Mr. Roughneck the SYSOP will spread the
word in Herrin.

--Jimbo
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Tue, 13 Oct 1992 09:42:00 EDT
From:         "Peter J. Schledorn" <UNCPJS@UNC.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: and you thought quayle was bad....

> >        I meant attention in the media.  It might work like a smoke screen
> >in the last parb4Lh9QTz7Irt of the campaign.
>
>   Chris Morrison can't even spell "part" correctly!  Sheesh.
>
>   (I mean, I think a silent e is much more plausible
>    than a silent "b4Lh9QTz7I")

But Tim, what could it be BUT silent?

(If you can pronounce it, I don't want to hear it without a raincoat).

Best,
Peter

>                                -Tim
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Mon, 12 Oct 1992 23:09:00 EDT
From:         CMORRISO@SNYESCVA.BITNET
Subject:      Re: post-debate reaction

        I think the reason Clinton does not answer the questions more freely
about the trips and the demonstrations is he feels that the Republicans will
never be quite pleased enough that he has really answered all the questions,
or at least they will say that he hasn't, and every answer will be followed
by ten or twenty questions.  The press will say that he has acknowledged
that it's an issue, and we will be off on another tangent.  I wish he had
answered more completely earlier but if he had would it have been accepted or
would he have been written off in the media?  I don't know.

                                        Chris Morrison
                                        CMorriso@snyescva.bitnet