From: glenm@bnr.ca (Glen Martin)
Subject: Re: Disc. against singles esp. men (was Re: FIRST TIMER REPORT. )
Reply-To: glenm@bnr.ca
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 17:08:04 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.181340.2840@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>, ash@sumex-aim.stanford.edu (David Ash) writes:
|> In article <9868@ncrwat.Waterloo.NCR.COM> tjgerman@53iss6.Waterloo.NCR.COM (Trevor German) writes:
|> 
|> >	for a deluxe (havn't seen in one of these). Daily visiting
|> >	rates are $20-men $15-women $20-couple. Annual membership is
|> 
|> Clearly this club discriminates against single people, especially single
|> men, and having been a regular reader of this group for a little while,
|> I don't think this club is by any means unique.  I have two comments on
|> this:
|> 
|> 1. As a single man, I don't know that I feel such discrimination should be
|> legal.

I don't belive there is any law saying that you can't discriminate
against your customers. It is perfectly legal to target a business
at a certain segment of the population.

|> I say that another possibility needs to be considered--that it is 
|> the careful
|> selection of participants which results in the more relaxed approach, 
|> and that the nudism has little to do with it.
|> 
|> Another related point:  you folks say there are fewer young people on nude
|> beaches because young people are less comfortable with their bodies.  Maybe
|> so, but in catering to couples, one needs to realize that young people are
|> more likely to be single, and older people are more likely to be married or
|> in long-term relationships, so again there's a selection process involved.

Before I begin, let me say that I too find discrimination against single
males a problem. An interesting point here, though, is that many clubs
don't allow single males at all.

The club owners who have these policies are trying to fight a very
real problem: For some reason (which isn't itself important), many
women are uncomfortable around a predominance of men. It is felt by
these owners, and perhaps many of their members, that the only way
to get women to participate is to keep the (numbers of) male
members down. 8-)

But to answer your question about whether this policy influences the
attitude towards nudity, it may. However, I haven't noticed a large
difference in this regard between the clubs (which have the restriction)
and the beaches (which don't). It remains the case that the CO beaches
I am familiar with are far less 'pick up joints' than the textile
beaches.

Personally, though, I think it would be better if women weren't
brought up in fear of men, or their bodies. This is the real
evil here. Yes, I know, before someone jumps down my throat,
many women have every right to be afraid of men. Yes it's all
the men's fault. So, a change in society is needed.

Coming back to your comment on singles: I don't think this is directly
related. Most people in their 20s are coupled - at least, those in my
acquaintance. I think many of them haven't come to grips with bodies,
yet. Also, for most, it simply has occurred to them to find a beach
or club or whatever, or they don't want to go to the trouble. And a lot 
is self-perpetuating - there are few other people there in a similar 
age group, with whom they can relate.

Interestingly, the participation rate of 20-30 year olds in Europe,
where beaches are far more accessible, is reputedly much higher than 
here.

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Glen Martin              Bell-Northern Research          Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Phone : (613) 763-7299   Fax: (613) 763-2626             Internet: glenm@bnr.ca
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Newsgroups: rec.nude