From: hartigan@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: alt.atheism,talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: THE MIND OF THE BIBLE BELIEVER 
Date: 27 Dec 92 14:54:31 -0400
Distribution: world,public
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

Sorry to stick my nose in, but I thought y'all might find a few more
comments on this issue of minor interest....

In article <1992Dec26.032102.6648@en.ecn.purdue.edu>, muehlhau@en.ecn.purdue.edu (John Muehlhausen) writes:

> From everything I
> have seen, the Bible believer is generally a happier, more joyful,
> more hopeful, and more successful individual in life than the person
> who rejects Biblical advice and command.

Every BB one meets says this, I notice, but every ex-BB I meet says the
opposite. One girl in particular was quite fanatical, and made several
rather patronizing attempts to convert me. She beamed with apparent
happiness as she eulogized the life of the Bible believer, and smiled
at me with benevolent pity when she saw that my "pride" wasn't going
to allow me to accept J.C. into my heart. 

A year later, I met her again. She was very bitter. She had been treated 
rather shabbily by her BB comrades, and had a lot to say about the 
back-biting, selfishness and competitiveness ("who's the holiest") in
her group of ex-friends. I like her better as an ex-BB, personally.
She doesn't have that fake smile stuck to her face all the time, for one 
thing. She remains a Christian, but as of last time I saw her, she
was moving to a more moderate position, and was quite wary of hard
core BB's. She seems to feel you can't trust them.

> Where is the depression?
> I do not see it in my life or the lives of my fellow BB's.

I have seen it in the lives of all of the BB's I know personally. 
A couple in particular are miserable a lot of the time because of their
feelings of inadequacy. They try very hard to be good, but they are unable
to measure up to their more strong-willed compadres -- they feel like 
bad people. 
 
> If our
> "fake" joy is as much, it is more real than any offered by any other
> source, which makes me seriously question the motivation behind these
> postings. 

This is an interesting question. Is it "fake" joy?  I don't think so.
I think it is _cheap_ joy. When an actor plays a happy character,
he or she feels happy.  But when the play is over, the induced
happiness evaporates instantly. 

This is why the BB shames us with his lovingness and bliss one minute, 
and amazes us with his seemingly inexplicable indifference, his 
hard-mindedness and hard-heartedness the next. 

> If the whole world had Bible Believing minds, what would
> things be like? 

Not good, if the BB's I know are any indication. Of course, I can only
speak from my own experience.
 
> If their are Christians out there who live in fear
> and depression, then maybe you had better try the Bible Brand of
> Christianity! :-)

Hmmm...I gather they think that's exactly what they are doing...does Xianity
make no allowances for differences in temperament?

> _Is_ having the Mind of the Bible Believer damaging to the individual
> or society?  I have yet to see it.

I have seen it, I'm sorry to say. I have seen people I am fond of beat
themselves into the ground with guilt and feelings of inadequacy. I 
have seen people I'm fond of betrayed in rather nasty ways by friends
with the BB mentality. I've seen bright young minds become hardened and
fearful, I've seen talented people sacrifice their deepest wishes
for an ideological safety blanket that does not make them happy,
although they think it should, and so they _make_ themselves feel happy,
which has its ups and downs. A poor substitute, IMHO. For many BB's,
all the world is truly a stage.

> I am not qualified to comment on the psychological analysis
> presented, but even if it were right on, it is meaningless
> unless it can be shown that there is some other attainable state of
> mind that is superior from an end product view.

The final word on that has to be: if you can see no advantage in freeing
your mind, you'd be silly to do it. If you have to ask that question,
you ain't never gonna know the answer. 
 
> I thank you for presenting this view, penetrating as it is, but I
> hope you see what I am getting at.  

Your comments are interesting. You're indeed fortunate if your experience
of Bible believing is as good as you say. It seems reasonable to me that
some people might be happy as clams in that world. Alas, you are the
exception, rather than the rule, it seems. 

> John M.

Sean Hartigan
hartigan@ac.dal.ca
 
"...false castle
             suddenly
                  melted into fog

                  which imposed 
                    a limit on infinity..."

                                              - Stephane Mallarme
Newsgroups: alt.atheism