From: mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman)
Newsgroups: sci.environment,talk.politics.misc,alt.activism
Subject: Re: Idiotic Japan Bashing
Date: 30 Dec 92 01:36:45 GMT
Organization: Oracle Corporation
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In article <1hq206INNq1f@spim.mti.sgi.com> mpolen@suntory.mti.sgi.com (Mike Polen) writes:
>Michael Friedman) writes:
>|> Tom Leylan) writes:
>|> >mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
>|> >  >jgacker@news.gsfc.nasa.gov (James G. Acker) writes:
>|> >  >>but Japan supposedly has a 100-year enviro-industry plan

>|> >>I keep hearing this kind of bullshit.  Does anyone out there really
>|> >>believe it?  After all, can you imagine the hundred year plan that a
>|> >>business or company would have come up with in 1893?  

>|> >Michael, May I suggest that your difficulty in believing any particular
>|> >thing is due to more to your upbringing and environment than anything
>|> >else.

>|> You can suggest it, but youy will find it hard to convince me.

>|> >You take a trip to Germany and you sit yourself down in a brewery that
>|> >has been brewing beer for 600 years and you get yourself a sense of
>|> >continuity.

>|> So?  That does not mean that they can plan 100 years in advance.

>Sure it does.  They can say:

>	We will defeat the americans in basic manufacturing, even if
>	it takes 100 years.  We will enact special legislation, interfere
>	with their governmental and commercial organizations, undercut
>	them, steal their patents, and take advantage of their stupid
>	ideas about free international trade.  We will continue
>	to do this even if it takes 600 years until we beat them.

>That is a 100+ year plan.

Mike, please try to think things through.  It's not that tough and it
will prevent you from posting stupid things on the net.

You might begin by learning to read the posts you respond to.  The
original argument was about corporate plans, not national plans.  

>I am not saying this happened, but there is not reason to believe it
>couldn't happen.

Sure there is.

1.  When do you think they came up with this 100 year plan?  Some time
after WWII?  In that case, what happened to the previous 100 year
plan?

2.  Who, exactly, are the champions of this plan within Japan?  The
Liberal Democratic Party?  If so, then how will they convince
the political opposition to support this plan, or do you think they
intend to remain in power for the next 100 to 600 years?  If not, then
how, exactly, did they negotiate this with the other parties?

3.  Is this plan written down anywhere?  If so, then how do they plan
on keeping it secret for 100+ years?  If not, then how do they plan to
make sure that future generations understnad and follow it?  Word of
mouth?

4.  Many economists (we can argue over whether or not it is a
majority) honestly believe that the US ideas about free international
trade are more beneficial to us, in the long run, than any form of
protectionism can possibly be.  How do the people who made this 100
year plan intend to make sure that this view does not come to prevail
in Japan?

5.  Please define "Japan".  Does it include Okinawa?  What about the
NICs?

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