From: roy@ecgcurly.UUCP (Roy Kern)
Newsgroups: rec.games.video
Subject: Re: Will Street Fighter II kill Genesis?
Summary: But wait, there's more...   and a Lynx tidbit at the end.
Date: 6 Apr 92 14:46:41 GMT
Organization: Motorola Cellular Cad Group

In article <1992Apr3.191802.8295@ringer.cs.utsa.edu>, mjbrown@lonestar.utsa.edu (Marc J. Brown) writes:
> In article <1468@ecgcurly.UUCP> roy@ecgcurly.UUCP (Roy Kern) writes:

>>What (EGM) facts?

>Facts, such as the fact that the pics provided in their 15-page review were
>from the not-yet-completed (but nearly so) SNES SF2.  Another fact: The

Like their April Fools pic?  Was that a fact?  Like their pics from Shining
Force?  Where those facts as well?

>gameplay is so acute so as to allow complex combos (truly one of the easiest
>ways of expressing how identical the gameplay is... better than saying "Well,

Are your complex combos the same as theirs?  They said they could do a complex
combo and now you conclude the gameplay is identical?  Did they try all the
possible combos on the final version of SFII to be released?  They're just
giving you their preliminary hype and you take these as  "facts" about the
final version?  There was a preliminary "fact" that Checkered Flag for the
Lynx was going to have a track editor, but yet it was taken out of the final
version.  So I guess anything is possible.

>version instead.").  No, it was not a finished version... now you're probably
>going to suggest that Capcom will turn around and re-install the flicker
>and slowdown, because the version EGM played wasn't the completed one, right?

Wow.  I was just going to suggest Capcom will turn around (a full 360) and
re-install the flicker and slowdown, because the version EGM played wasn't the
completed one.  And then I was going to suggest that with every Capcom version
you buy, they will include a free super gun.....  Incredible.....
We are one....

>>You repeatedly say you've seen the pics in EGM and that is a fact that the
>>graphics are near identical.  Have you seen all the pics possible?

>Yes, I've seen every pic available to me (not just in EGM, but in GamePro
>as well [as if that's of consequence]).  Even some in a "Die Hard" ad which
>EGM did not show.

No, not every pic available, but every pic *possible*.  Try being a bit more
attentive.

>>Let me use a quote of yours:
>>"I can say it's near-verbatim because I've seen the pics"
>>And you weren't talking about near-verbatim graphics.

>Don't cut out material for the sake of your argument.

I'll cut out material and you'll like it.


>I also made mention
>of the other sources of information I have (like personal friends who saw
>it for themselves.  I know they wouldn't hype it up because they despise
>Nintendo with a passion).

So they've seen the final version as well?  Man, everyone's seen it but me.

>>How do you know how painful this was for Capcom?  Do you work for them?  Maybe
>>they secretly contracted out and it didn't hurt them a bit?  Maybe it was
>>pretty easy?

>It was difficult, on a comparative basis.  Capcom has spent a long time
>(longer than normal) developing the technology for the 16-meg + soundchip
>cart, and then porting over the various aspects of the game (graphics
>being the hardest, as they have to modify backgrounds and such quite
>extensively).  You always resort to "You worked for them."  No, I did not,
>but I'm more in a position to know what I'm talking about because audio/
>graphical/coding-related subjects are fun to me and because I have information
>and second opinions to back me up.  I didn't jump in and try to force any
>opinions on people (much less via insulting mockery).

Comparative to what?  How can you say they are or are not struggling with
something if you aren't involved, or know people who are on the actual
conversion team?  You're just speculating based on some info you've obtained.
Which is fine, but you're telling everyone as if it were gospel.  Maybe
it wasn't difficult at all and they're just letting the hype develop?
You didn't force your opinions?  You're drawing conclusions from suspect
sources and you're "guaranteeing" the SNES version will be nearly identical
to the arcade version?  This will always be speculation until the final
version comes out.  Insulting mockery?  I ask some questions and you throw a 
name-calling tantrum?  Where was my head?
Oh, and you are more in a position to know because these subjects are fun to
you?  Man, how can I argue with such scientific foundations as "fun to me".


>I'll go into a little detail, if that's okay... I have seen more than 80 pics
   (edited)
>Much of the rest I've already said in my original review.

Fine, you've seen 80 still shots.  There are far more than 80 possible still
shots, but this is decent enough to enough to warrant hope that the graphics
will be similar.  This still does not "guarantee" "nearly identical graphics".

>No, I haven't.  And I have given a review.  I'm afraid that if I give
>ANOTHER review I'll end up in another argument with another anti-Chop-Socky
>fanatic (deny it if you will; you're either that or merely like to annoy
>people).

How can you give a review of a game that to date doesn't exist?  If this were
for Atari, Rauser would go ballistic on you.  How can you say I'm
anti-chop-socky?  Have you seen my cart collection?  Have you seen what games
I play at the arcade?  I'll tell you what, I'll give you $100 for every
anti-chop-socky post of mine you dig up.  Feel free to peruse the archives
and grep on my name.  Please show me some of my anti-chop-socky posts.

>>Yeah, that's me.  Ruthlessly mugging every single pro-chop-socky post out
>>there.  I'm such a bully.

>WHY did you do it in the first place?  There was NO reason to do it!  You
>didn't prove a point, you didn't offer any useful information.  You must have
>just been in a bad mood that day and now you're carrying it on for the fun
>of it.

Sigh...  My only problem with you, Marc, is you came out in all your glory
guaranteeing that the SNES version of SFII would be virtually identical.
Sure you had some background info, but what you did is no different than
what EGM does and that is to "hype".  Until you play the final released
version, you can only speculate how close the conversion will be.  Does this
not make sense to you?  If you would have said you "think" it will be
identical, or you "predict" it will be identical, I never would have said
anything.  No.  You "guaranteed" it.

>>> >I actually do hope it is a good port, for all you SF2 fans out there, but
>>> >this is ridiculous.
>>>
>>> *Translation: "As if you couldn't tell, I hope this game turns out bad, but
>>> I'm not fooling myself, so all I can do is bash any supporters of it... and
>>> then I turn around and pretend to hope the game's a good port."
>>>
>>
>>Hmmmmm.  Strange.  It sure looks like my sentence is in English.  Are there
>>certain words you're having trouble with?

>Nope, I gave the translation perfectly... of course, after you carried on
>for so many messages, I guess there was no good reason to translate your
>quote; NOBODY out there is naive enough to believe that you really do hope
>it turns out well.

You gave a perfect translation of my words?  No.  You gave your paranoid
whimperings for whatever reasons.  There are enough wretched games out there;
why would I want to add another to the list?  There are a lot of people who
are really looking forward to this release.  Why would I want them to get
screwed?  I've been disappointed by many conversions in the past, yet by hoping
this is another failure, I'm only voting for continued incompetence.  Grow
up will you?  I do, even, hope the version is identical for your sake,
especially since you've put so much effort into researching it.

If the SFII conversion is a success, hopefully it will lead to better (and
more) conversions in the future.

Roy "call me skeptical for waiting until the final product before I believe"

------------

On a different note, for you fellow Lynxers out there, I saw my first Lynx
TV commercial yesterday during prime time.  It was during Married With
Children on Fox last night.  Hopefully this will continue.