From: mcmillan@vf.jsc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: talk.abortion
Subject: Re: The christian perspective...?
Date: 12 Sep 1992 04:16:25 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Center

In article <24887@oasys.dt.navy.mil>, bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ron Bense) writes:
> In talk.abortion, mcmillan@vf.jsc.nasa.gov writes:
> 
>>I'm a pro-life Christian, but I did a lot of thinking about the topic before
>>I took my and.  What finally made it clear to me was this:  A man and
> [... about moving the days up and down the scale...]
> 
> about your accident... hell, I think probably more of us than we realize
> were accidents. I was first born, and defintiely unplanned, and my little
> sister was third (and last) and also unplanned. Am I happy I'm here?
> Naturally. Would I be unhappy had I been aborted? Of course not, as
> I never would have been here.
> 
I was an accident, too.  The result of a very cold winter and of a great way
to keep warm, so my Mom says.  Your Mom and Dad were probably glad you were
not aborted.  I imagine they loved you some as you grew up.  And I imagine you
would have been mighty unhappy *while* you were being aborted.
>
>>Choice?  Abortion is a choice of one or two grown people--the unborn baby is
>>given no choice.  That little human is literally ripped apart or burned to
>>death in a horribly painful procedure.  Imagine having your head torn off!  No
>>wonder abortion is a bloody procedure.  And remember, approximately 50% of
>>those unborn babies killed are girls, future women.  Talk about misosyny!
> 
> It is human life. Whether it can feel pain or not is mostly conjecture,
> although science tends to say no. And guess what? I have the ability
> to imagine getting my head ripped off, I have one, with a brain it in
> that functions reasonably well imo to have opinions and to imagine that.
> As for abortion being a bloody procedure, is birth not bloody? And just
> whose blood is that anyway that the baby spilt? Let's not talk about
> misogyny just yet, as so far this post was fairly friendly and not flaming
> anyone.
> 
Although I'm not an expert in this, as I'm sure you're not also, I believe 
you're wrong about the unborn not feeling pain.  If it can feel then it can
feel pain, I presume.  Ever touch a bump on your pregnant wife's stomach and
then have it move in response to your touch?  I have--the child felt me.  I've 
talked in detail with my sister-in-law about the unborn.  She's an expert-an
OBGyn, has worked on hundreds (or more) of pregnant women, delivered hundreds
(or more) babies.  She says they can feel pain.  That's her business.  I believe
her.

Being able to formulate an opinion is not the criteria for making it wrong to
have your head ripped off.  

Birth are messy, but not real bloody.  From the three that I've been present
for, most of the blood of the mother is from the incision the doctor makes to
open the skin around the vagina.  It heals.
>>There.  I tried to give my reasoning for being pro-life without going into the
>>Biblical side of it.  If you research it with an open mind, you'll find the
>>Bible (therefore God) solidly pro-life.  If you need any help, let me know.
> 
> You did fairly well, although here are a few questions for you:
> 
> 1) Do you realize that the fetus draws sustenance, minerals, water, etc
> from a woman and defecates into the woman, right?
> 
Not sure about defecation...I thought the baby's waste products were passed
through the umbilical cord and taken care of by the mother's waste system.
But even if that's wrong, that's one of the many wonderful things about a 
woman's body--they were designed to accomodate and nuture a growing baby.  
They automatically intake more nutrients to account for it.
> 2) Do you realize there are women who ob
ject to this invasion (that's the
> way they see it when they are subjected to this situation against their
> will) no matter how cute and cuddely the little mongrel might be?
> 
> 3) Do you realize that some women don't care to let a z/e/f use their
> bodies for 9 months?
> 
If these women are so opposed to ever having children, then they should
consider being made sterile.  This way they would never have to kill their
child by abortion.

> 4) Can you see why your vision and beliefs should not be enacted into
> law to prevent others from preventing this situation to unfold against
> their beliefs, which are most likely different from yours?
> 
> 5) Can you see how the pro-choice position lets you enjoy your beliefs,
> while allowing others to enjoy theirs? (Unless of course yours involves
> making decisions for others against their will.)
> 
If you were walking around and saw someone beating somebody a lot more   
helpless than they were, wouldn't you feel it was your duty to help (or
would you rather not get involved)?

If you were walking on a sidewalk and saw someone drowning in a backyard pool,
but there was a "No Tresspassing" sign on the grass, wouldn't you break that
law to go render aid?

> Ron
> 
Stokes 
Xref: sparky talk.abortion:35260 alt.flame:12565