HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk (Clive Grace)
Subject: Double Bass for Sale
Reply-To: cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 15:57:00 +0000

Subject: Double Bass for Sale
=============================

[For UK post only: Sorry my mailer can't automatically do UK 
distribution posts.]


3/4 size Double Bass for sale. Blonde, carved Zeller model, includes 
soft case. A-mazing sound, but sadly I'm moving to smaller premises 
that only allow for my bass guitars.

Two years old, never gigged, never left my house and it's in 
absolutely pristine condition. Cost #670. Want to sell for #550 
o.n.o.

Please don't follow up in this newsgroup, please Email me for more 
information and I'll post you my telephone number if you';re 
interested.

Thank you

Clive Grace
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: lungtt@gus.ecn.purdue.edu (Terence T. Lung)
Subject: Re: So exactly what's wrong with Bolero, anyway?
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 04:50:04 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.035244.16097@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> clavazzi@nyx.cs.du.edu (The_Doge) writes:
>In article <C0ILLv.EsB@world.std.com> kaya@world.std.com (Kaya Bekiroglu) writes:
>>
>>Pardon my ignorance of classical music, but what is wrong with
>>Bolero?  I have heard only a portion of it, and it sounds alright
>>by me.. I happen to like it.

I think the question is where does it start and where does it end?
If you've heard a portion of it, you've heard all of it.
You can take the same portion and play with the volume and you've done it.

>	There's nothing inherently wrong with it, I suppose; it just doesn't
>wear all that well after repeated hearings.  And if you've been listening to
>concert music for any length of time (over 30 years in my case) you just flat
>out get *tired of hearing it*!  Ditto for many of the "top 40 classics", for
>that matter.
>	Besides, Ravel himself regarded it as rather minor stuff, as I recall.
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: new method of cataloging Beethoven's music?
Date: 11 Jan 93 23:30:21 GMT
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Distribution: rec
Organization: Princeton University
Originator: news@nimaster

In article <LYNN.93Jan11114716@ives.urbana.mcd.mot.com> lynn@phx.mcd.mot.com writes:
>
>Last night I was at a piano recital (Oleg Volkov, in Scottsdale AZ),
>where the artist opened with Beethoven's 32 Variations in Cm. Rather
>than listing the usual opus cataloging number, it was specified with
>the number WoO80. I'm not familiar with this cataloging system. Does
>someone out there know what it's about?

Not that new, but necessary.  It stands for Werke ohne Opuszahl: works
without an opus number!  

And, indeed, that piece has no such number.  Good, though!

>I thought maybe it was a posthumous work, and perhaps it is, but I
>remember hacking on that piece myself many years ago, and don't recall
>that it was ... I probably would have remembered.

No, he wrote it while he was alive!  8-) 

>email replies preferred, please, since I barely have time to scan the
>headers on group now and then.

Roger
Z
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: Frank2.Simon@arbi.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de (Frank2 'Biber' Simon)
Subject: Beautiful songs for piano solo !?
Organization: University of Oldenburg, Germany
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 12:19:37 GMT

Hi,

I hope to are able to contact to other piano-player on this way:
I want to start a list of the most popular and most beautiful songs
playable on piano solo.
Of course I know that most popular and most beautiful is very individual
but I only want suggestions. I think every piano-player knows the trouble:
You want to learn a new song but not knowing which one. Just in this time
where the advertising recognize the piano again you always hear beautiful
songs not knowing how named and of whom composed. The songs haven't to
be very difficult (for example everybody know "FUER ELISE" of L.v.Beethoven
and it isn't difficult), haven't to be old (everybody knows RICHARD
CLAYDERMANN)...they only have to be beautiful (for anyone).

So I hope to get more songs for piano, more songs I want to learn and
more songs I love.

Please add the following list all songs missing there in your opinion !!!

Maybe some other player like this idea too and get new songs for him/her.

Thanks in advance
Frank

COMPOSER             NAME
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Albeniz, Isaac      | Asturias, Leyenda
Bach, J.S.          | Praeludium C-DUR (Ave Maria)
Beethoven, L.v.     | 5th.Symphonie, changed for PIANO solo, OP 67
Beethoven, L.v.     | Sonate OP 27, No.2 (Moonlight-sonate)
Brahms, Johannes    | Walzer
Chopin, Frederic    | Praelidium, OP 28. No.6
Chopin, Frederic    | Praelidium, OP 28. No.15
Chopin, Frederic    | Praelidium, OP 28. No.20
Chopin, Frederic    | Marche funebre, OP 35
Grieg, Edvard       | To the spring
Haendel, G.F.       | Sarabande
Haendel, G.F.       | Largo, of XERXES
Mendelssohn         | Song without words, Op 19, No.1
Mozard, Amadeus     | Rondo alla turca
Rachmaninoff        | Praeludium
Satie, Erik         | Gnossienne
Schubert, Franz     | Moment muisical, Op 94 No.2
Schubert, Franz     | Impromptu, OP 142, No.2
Schubert, Franz     | Two german dance
Schumann, Robert    | Romanze, OP 28. No.2
		    |
		    |
		    |


-- 
FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT242FRONT
    E-MAIL-ADDRESS:      ~       I am       ~      MAIL-ADRESS:
    Frank2.Simon@arbi.   ~       because    ~      Frank Simon
    informatik.uni-      ~       somebody   ~      Alexanderstr. 156
    oldenburg.de         ~       dreams me  ~      2900 Oldenburg
From: eng10406@nusunix1.nus.sg (TAN KAR GEE)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Opinions of Rachmaninoff's Third Concerto
Date: 9 Jan 93 02:18:02 GMT
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

I would like to find out how people rate my favourite concerto,
Rachmaninoff's Third and their favourite versions. Incidentally, my
favourite version is the one by Andrei Gavrilov (not the one on EMI), on
the Melodiya label. It has yet to appear on CD.
   Incidentally, those who are interested to join the Rachmaninoff
Society (based in England) can mail to me for the address.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: furufuru@ccsr.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Furue Ryo)
Subject: Re: who is the concert master of berlin phil?
Organization: Center for Climate System Research, Univ. Tokyo, Japan.
	<1993Jan8.234725.9175@newsgate.sps.mot.com>
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 13:00:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.234725.9175@newsgate.sps.mot.com> dwong@chopsuey.pico ( paganini's admirer ) writes:

:In article 93Jan8214054@kongming.ccsr.u-tokyo.ac.jp, furufuru@ccsr.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Furue Ryo) writes:
:
: (stuff deleted)
:
:>>>:  paganini's admirer (dwong@chopsuey.pico) wrote:
:>>>:  does anyone know?  and is he asian??
:
: (a lot deleted)
:
:>I think BPO has more than one solo violinist; one plays as the
:>concert master in a concert, another plays in another concert.
:>And one of them is a Japanese. Yasunaga is his surname.
:
: (deleted)
:
:Thanks for the info.  If Yasunaga is one of the concert masters, what did he do to
:deserve such a high position?  It looks kind of funny that in the last concert there
:were no Asians in any other seat of the orchestra, except the highest seat!?  The TV 
:camera was constantly focused on the guy behind Yasunaga.  That was the reason I want
:to find out more detail on the orchestra.

Berlin Phil. is something special: it is a SUPER orchestra and only a
SUPER  player can enter it. I suppose Yasunaga really deserves his
position WITH HIS MUSIC AND TECHNIQUE, though I have not ever heard him
playing in solo.

By the way, I remember another story: VPO (Vienna Philharmonic
Orchestra)  made an audition to employ a viola player. During the
audition, the examiners (or the members of the screening committee)
listened to the candidate players playing on the other side of a curtain
or a screen, in order to judge them only by their music and technique,
not by their appearances. As a result, the player the committee selected
was an Asian. However, she (the player) did not become a member of VPO
because the Austrian government (I think I heard so) did not want a
non-white player to enter VPO.

The situation is steadily changing: there are more and more Asian players in
German major orchestras, maybe also in Austrian ones...

Ryo FURUE
furufuru@ccsr.u-tokyo.ac.jp
From: bcc@tools8teradata.com (Brian Cantin)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: RFV: BRUCKNER RE: THE BEST
Date: 4 Jan 93 19:10:49 GMT
Organization: NCR/Teradata Business Unit

If the question must be put to the test, I will vote for Bruckner.  In particular,
the 4th, 7th and 9th.

However, arguing about the worth of a composer is perfectly useless.  The words used to 
praise or denigrate the music have little on nothing to do why we listen.  Nobody is ever
convinced by any of the arguments, so why bother?
-- 
Brian Cantin
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: mccomt@aix.rpi.edu (Todd Michel McComb)
Subject: Re: My Christmas CDs
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 22:17:46 GMT

In article <0igVwB3w165w@student.business.uwo.ca> Richard Smith writes:
>All given to myself, unfortunately. Nobody else even tries anymore.

Same here.  I used to ask for CDs, but never got any.  This year I
didn't even ask.

>Perotin                         Organum (Hilliard Ensemble) Gorgeous

Indeed.

T. M. McComb

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ridgway@athena.mit.edu (Lee Ridgway)
Subject: Re: music of jehan alain
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:50:47 GMT

There is an Erato CD of M-C playing a selection of Jehan's works. As I remember
it includes the Trois Danse and Litanies. More recently, she has recorded a CD
that includes music of Jehan and their father Albert (plus one or two other
composers, I think). The interesting aspect of this recording, other than M-C's
wonderful playing, and the music, is that the organ is the house organ built by
the Alain's, father and son. It has been moved to a former convent in
Switzerland, and restored. This is its first recording. I don't remember the
label, but I got the recording at Tower. 

Many of Jehan's pieces were conceived on this instrument, which is a real oddity
as far as specification is concerned. Talk about authenticity!
From: 92636828s@csghsg5a.bitnet
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Skriabin: Etudes op. 8
Date: 5 Jan 93 09:24:06 GMT
Organization: University of St.Gallen, Switzerland

Does anyone know if a recording on CD of Skriabin's Etudes op. 8
exists?
Please reply ba email.

					David-Michael Lincke
					92636828@csghsg5a.bitnet

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cstringe@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Chuck Stringer)
Subject: Re: Huenter Kradaken CDs
Organization: Indiana University, University Computing Services
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:44:45 GMT

etlanar@yogi.ericsson.se (Alan Arthur) writes:
| 
| I think some people are maybe getting a bit carried away with Kradaken's biographical
| accounts, so lets try and restrain ourselves a bit. 
| 
| To change track a little, has anyone been able to find any performances of Kradaken's
| work on CD? Ive checked every CD catalogue I could lay my hands on, but couldn't find
| any references to him. If someone could point me in the right direction I'd be grateful.

There's a small record shop near the Loyola campus that has a special
section of Huenter Kradaken's works. They even have an original sketch
of his famous Kradaken Pigeon.  

| Please reply in e-mail, dont post.

Sorry, my newsreader screws up the headers

Chuck Stringer
From: m1wrp99@milo.uucp (William R. Palenske)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: mozart's ignominious deposit
Date: 12 Jan 93 21:40:51 GMT
Organization: Federal Reserve Board, Wash, DC

Mark Basinski writes:
>In article <18742@fed.FRB.GOV>, m1wrp99@milo.uucp (William R. Palenske)
>wrote:
>> ....
>   I seem to recall hearing or reading (perhaps even in Robbins-Landon's
>"1791: Mozart's Last Year"?) that it was a fairly common thing for people
>to be buried in common graves in Vienna at that time (unless they were
>quite wealthy) and as such our modern view of this as "a pauper's grave"
>is somewhat inaccurate. Anybody care to support or refure that?

don't know about vienna and  don't know about refutation [ more of an 
existence proof;]  but i like to read inscriptions on old [ 17 th - 19 th
century ] tombstones and a lot that i've seen indicate a humble occupant.
they may not have been dirt poor; but they weren't wealthy; and they had a
gravestone.  these are British and Colonial American graves so maybe there's
a different continental tradition.

>> i've also heard / read this story ....

>   Haydn's head was stolen - I don't recall the entire story off the
>top of my head (HA!) but his head was indeed missing for many years, 
>and finally was found/discovered/returned only rather recently, i.e.
>in the last 30 years or so - I believe the head was reinterred with
>the rest of Haydn's remains at Esterhaza in the 50s (?) or sometime
>around there....

how'd they know it was haydn's ?


-- 
   Bill Palenske            Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System
   m1wrp99@fed.frb.gov      Washington, D.C.  20551
   uunet!fed!wrp            DISCLAIMER: MY OPINIONS ARE MY OWN.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbrooks@osf.org (David Brooks)
Subject: Re: There's nothing wrong with Bolero
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 22:21:09 GMT

zornow@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Claudia Zornow) writes:
| > Snare-drummers have a dislike for the feeling in the wrists after 17
| > minutes.  That's if they haven't suffered muscle spasm and dropped the
| > sticks by then.
| 
| Is Bolero ever performed with multiple snare drum players trading off,
| or is that considered undrummerly?  That would at least give the three 
| extra percussionists something to do.

Well, I can't say if it is ever, or never, performed that way, but I
haven't done it.  I have had a drummer on warm standby, though.  If the
first horn can do it, so can we...

To be frank, it's not all that physically hard to keep going, but it
takes a lot of concentration to keep every tap exactly rhythmical.

Actually, Ravel calls for a second drummer to be *added* about
two-thirds through (I think it's at rehearsal 20, but the memory is
vague).  It does add a nice extra punch if it's done.  This brings the
official count to 5 percussion, 1 timp.

Or, if you've seen the movie of the same name, about 40 drummers, all
naked to the waist.  Hmmm...
-- 
David Brooks					dbrooks@osf.org
Open Software Foundation			uunet!osf.org!dbrooks
Shine out, fair sun, with all your heat!  Black winter freezes to his seat...
The boneless fish close quaking lies...the stars in icicles arise!
From: caf@omen.UUCP (Chuck Forsberg)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: French Baroque Chamber Music
Date: 4 Jan 93 23:58:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: omen.1993Jan04.235816.2929
Organization: Omen Technology INC, Portland Rain Forest

In article <1993Jan4.175700.6742@midway.uchicago.edu> pkbockus@gsbphd.uchicago.edu (Keith Bockus) writes:
>Since Tower Records storewide sale, is just a week or so
>away, it's time to make up my shopping list and I'd like
>to solicit your help.  I'm looking to expand my collection
>of French (and perhaps Italian) baroque chamber music.
>I've got some Rameau, Marais, Forqueray, and Leclair.
>For the Italians, I only have the standard Corelli.
>Who should I be seeking out?

Don't forget Lully.  You might find the operas of Rameau and Lully
enjoyable, even if you don't know French and/or don't like most opera.

-- 
Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX          ...!tektronix!reed!omen!caf 
Author of YMODEM, ZMODEM, Professional-YAM, ZCOMM, and DSZ
  Omen Technology Inc    "The High Reliability Software"
17505-V NW Sauvie IS RD   Portland OR 97231   503-621-3406
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: furufuru@ccsr.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Furue Ryo)
Subject: Re: Favourite Organ Work Survey
Followup-To: rec.music.classical
Organization: Center for Climate System Research, Univ. Tokyo, Japan.
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 09:57:26 GMT

My favorites are:

  Franck: Choral No. 3 in A minor
  Boellmann: Toccata from Suite Gothique
  Bach: "O Mensch, bewein' dein' Suende gross!"
        from Orgelbuechlein

Ryo FURUE
furufuru@ccsr.u-tokyo.ac.jp
From: etlanar@yogi.ericsson.se (Alan Arthur)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Anyone heard of Huenter Kradaken?
Date: 5 Jan 93 10:58:04 GMT
Organization: Ericsson

In article <1993Jan5.062622.19032@cheshire.oxy.edu> dementia@cheshire.oxy.edu (Daniel Steven Reinker) writes:
>Has anyone heard of this very obscure composer? I have heard his
>third symphony, which is also called "St. Peter and the Four Dragons"
>and would like to know if he has done anything else. (Assumedly
>he has done at least two more symphonies, but despite searching I
>have yet to find anything.)
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Steve

If it is the composer that I am thinking of, he worked in Moscow, but was not from
there originally (not sure of birthplace, can anyone trace the name?) He died in the
late 1930's, and I believe he wrote seven symphonys, although there has been talk of 
other works recently discovered which are being accredited to him. 

I do have some of his work which I can send you if you're really interested.

Does anyone have any more biographical info?
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: McIntyre for Weikl in Meisteringer
From: Ken Sherrill <KSSHC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Sunday, 10 Jan 1993 17:05:48 EST
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

I've noticed that Donald McIntyre, announced the other week as the opening Hans
Sachs in the Met's new Meistersinger is now scheduled for all performances
through the broadcast, at least.

Does anyone know what happened to Bernd Weikl?
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: chrisi@lloyd.Camex.COM (Chris Ischay)
Subject: Re: Conductors, interpretations and fluffy nonsense 
Organization: Camex Inc., Boston MA
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 11:55:08 EST

In article <1993Jan9.005318.15578@hubcap.clemson.edu>
epohl@hubcap.clemson.edu (A replicant) writes:

>   1)  What (and try to supply me with some objective ideas) 
>       is the difference between a "bad" or a "weak" conductor
>       and a "good" or a "strong" conductor?

I got no idea what you mean by objective ideas, when what we are talking
about is a matter of judgment.  Chasing after music that is "objectively
good" will make you crazy, or else it will make you dogmatic.

I suggest thinking about this question in familiar terms.  How about
performances of the Star Spangled Banner, for example?  Most of us are
familiar with that.  Ever heard a really good or really bad version?  I
don't mean the oddball ones for alto sax, tambourine and ballpark organ.
Just regular ones with orchestra or band.  What makes you sit up and take
notice about one and not another?  Whatever your answer, those qualities
probably translate to Mahler or Beethoven fairly well, except you may not
be as familiar with the music.

A good way to experience this is to take a reasonably popular classical
piece and listen to several different performances, on record or even
better in person.

>   2)  Can a "good" conductor making a strong but unusual  
>       interpretation of a work come out sounding worse
>       than a "bad" conductor making a typical interpretation
>       of the same piece?

Roger Norrington's Beethoven comes to mind.  In a slightly different way,
something like Karjan/BPO doing baroque pieces also promises unpleasant
results.

>   3)  Why do some recordings get thrown into the bargain bin
>       at music stores for $3-$9 and others get placed in
>       a real shelf and are appraised in the $10-$19 range?

Marketing is part of the answer.  But among the cheap disks I've seen, a
good portion of them are by artists who are less interesting too.  We might
not all agree on the criteria or ranking, but it *is* possible to rank
performers, orchestras, conductors, at least by broad categories.

>   1)  Name the recording you think best exemplifies
>       how an interpretation of a work can really make
>       a good and noticeable difference.

Oh no, I'm not falling into that trap.  %^)
(well, ok.  Toscanini's Falstaff.)

Chris Ischay
chrisi@camex.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: lungtt@gus3.ecn.purdue.edu (Terence T. Lung)
Subject: Re: Violin/Viola Duos
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 18:13:37 GMT

In article <rainer.726838720@moolah> rainer@fml.tuwien.ac.at (Rainer Staringer) writes:
>Hi!
>
>My friend and I are looking for some interesting (but playable...)
>pieces for violin and viola. We already know - and love! - the two
>Mozart duos. Are there any other pieces which are equally beautiful
>and fun to play?
>
>Thank you in advance for any suggestions!
>
>	Rainer
>--
>Rainer Staringer                   | rainer@fml.tuwien.ac.at
>Financial Markets Lab, TU Vienna   | +43 (1) 58801/8138

I am familiar with a violin-viola arrangement for Bach's
two-part inventions.  They're interesting and playable but
nowhere near as flashy as the two Mozart duos.

Terence

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,ny.general
From: conrad@brahms.udel.edu (Jon Conrad)
Subject: Re: Pittsburgh Symphony Wins New York Times Award
Organization: University of Delaware
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:06:10 GMT

In article <C0Hryn.K8E.1@cs.cmu.edu> acid+@cs.cmu.edu (Christopher Colby) writes:

>In article <1993Jan7.102115.609@nuscc.nus.sg> smoliar@iss.nus.sg (Stephen Smoliar) writes:

[In response to Chris's report that a friend who works for the Met told
him that the Pittsburgh Fidelio was roundly panned:]

>>Now that you have clarified your source, I think we can take an inside opinion
>>for what is worth (particularly when you consider the quality of their own
>>FIDELIO)!

>I must not have been clear.  The source was not my friend's personal
>opinion, but rather his report of what was (supposedly) in the papers.


No, we got that.  The point is that his report was apparently shaped by
his personal opinion -- i.e., what he *wanted* to be true.  People (me
included) are wonderfully capable of picking out the one negative
sentence in a favorable review, if that's what they'd like to believe.

Jon Alan Conrad
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: When did Ives stop composing?
From: phoogenboom@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Date: 12 Jan 93 14:50:09 EST
Organization: Wesleyan University

In article <will.726251330@ogre>, will@ogre.cica.indiana.edu (William Sadler) writes:
>>b-grant@nwu.edu (Barry Grant) writes:
>>: I was speaking with someone from our music school who said he though Ives
>>: stopped composing music at age 29. This doesn't seem right to me. Does
>>: anyone know the facts?
> 
> Look at Peter Burkholder's _Charles Ives: The Ideas Behind the Music_.
> Basically Ives stopped composing after the fourth symphony but continued
> to revise and "tinker" (as Peter phrases it).  He did decide to not
> pursue music as a career and go into insurance, which is what your
> friend may have been thinking of.
> 
> Will

Ives decided upon graduating from Yale that his responsibility to his family
precluded an a musical career, with all its attendant job insecurity.  He
pursued his insurance and musical careers simultaneously therefore.  His
compositional activity was a night/weekend thing.  Eventually all this activity
led to severely deteriorated health (he had a breakdown), and he was forced
into retirement in Connecticut to keep what health he had left.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: gustavo@dent.uchicago.edu (Gustavo Comezana)
Subject: John Holloway
Organization: Dept. of Mathematics, U. of Chicago
Distribution: chi
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:08:31 GMT

I understand that early music violinist John Holloway will be playing
at Northwestern U. sometime this month. Does anybody have info on date of
concert and program to be played? 

               Thanks

                            Gustavo

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical