HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic

There has been a lot of discussion about name days - is anyone willing to
post a list?
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Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: tsahib@vipunen.hut.fi (Tero Juhani Heikkinen)
Subject: Re: Norway claiming NY (too late)
Keywords: Cry hammock! and let sleep the dogs of war
Reply-To: tsahib@vipunen.hut.fi (Tero Juhani Heikkinen)
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 19:14:19 GMT

In article <17t4unINN5j5@agate.berkeley.edu> tedrick@whistle.Berkeley.EDU (Tom Tedrick) writes:

>Anyway, New York is the closest thing I've seen to Hell on earth,
>so I can't imagine I will get the worst of the deal :-)

Trondheim is in fact pretty close to Hell. Nice place though.

tsahib, trying to show off my astounding geographical knowledge.



-- 
***  Tero.J.Heikkinen@hut.fi  ***********  Disclaimer wanted: Apply within  ***
"Well, I'm an accountant, and consequently too boring to be of interest."

Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: pekka@tmt.tele.fi (Pekka Ahonen)
Subject: Re: Stockholm Water Festival
Organization: PTT Finland, Telematics
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 07:46:58 GMT

In article <BtCqyp.38t@oceania.com> steve@oceania.com writes:
>
>pardon me if I'm jumping in kind of late, but when is the Water Festival?

Don't know about Stockholm, but here in Helsinki it was last weekend.
And yesterday was "the night of the arts", but that's another event,
but I think the most interesting event in Helsinki for tourists to
see.

Pekka
From: smyers@hpdmd48.boi.hp.com (steven myers)
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 07:12:24 GMT
Subject: Re: Immigrants and employment (Was: Re: nationalism...)
Organization: Hewlett Packard - Boise, ID
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic

	I can't help say something reguarding the employment of foreigners
in Sweden (I can't say anything about other nordic countries).  I spent two
years in Sweden, much of my time in Uppsala, as a missionary for my church.
I knocked on a lot of doors, and so got a rather unique opportunity to meet
the people, especially those at home during the day.  Many of these, espe-
cially the males, were out of work foreigners.  I don't get the impression
that most of them were lazy, but simply could not find a job, or were not
allowed to get one until they learned Swedish.  This seemed not to be a good
blanket policy, as many jobs require very little Swedish be spoken.  Many that
I knew could speak fairly good Swedish, but expressed dissatisfaction that
they had to go to school to learn the language, rather than working.  
	Also, there seems to be no effort to integrate them into the society.
They most often end up in low-income type housing with others from their
homeland.  They don't speak Swedish with their friends, so the language never
becomes second nature to them.  Having learned Swedish, I can relate with
the difficulty that they face.  These micro social groups knit tighter and
tighter together due to the common bond of language.  The Swedes get the 
impression that they don't want to fit in it seems.  While this is sometimes
the case, most of the utlaaningar just wanted friends, something made even
more difficult due to the Swedes' stand-offish behavior to strangers, whether
foriegners or fellow Swedes.  I have no suggestion to how this nature can be
altered.  Saying to a Swede that they should be more open and friendly is 
about as effective as saying to a smoker,"Just quit."  People find it diffi-
cult to change what they are, like breaking bad habits.
	My intent with this post is not to suggest reform or change, but to
act as a catalyst for understanding of a group of people trying to make a
new home for themselves, many of which are political refugees with horrors 
at home that they are trying to cope with.  I can't begin to relate all of
the awful stories that I have heard about the atrocities that these people
from all over the world have endured in their home countries.  So, to all 
Swedes out there, you have no idea how you will make an utlaanning's day
by just saying,"heysan."     

			Ha det sa bra!
			Steve Myers (former Swensk).
From: jafitv@termo.unit.no (Jan Arne Fagertun)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Hunting (was: Norwegians shot Swedish bear)
Date: 1 Sep 92 07:15:57 GMT
Reply-To: jafitv@termo.unit.no (Jan Arne Fagertun)
Distribution: soc
Organization: SINTEF, Norwegian Institute of Technology

In article <1992Aug31.152218.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi>, sutton@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:
|> 
|> This departs somewhat from the thread of bear killing, but I was recently
|> reading an article about reindeer (poro) herders in Lappland that mentioned
|> hunting to protect the herds.   The interviewer inquired if the herder 
|> supports hunting of dangerous animals, like bears and wolves, because of the
|> threat to the reindeer.  He replied no, that he loses very few animals to 
|> them; instead, the greatest killer was cars!   (This is because the
|> reindeer are raised on open land, they roam freely across the North.)
|> 
|> I found his observation very interesting, i.e. killing animals to
|> protect animals is nonsensical because the greatest slaughterer is
|> us.
|> 
|> 
|> Keith
--


I thinke you're right. But a bear or a wolf that is in the right mood
can kill quite a lot of sheep belonging to one single farmer. Something
has to be done to reduce the damage, but I don't think killing every
bear and wolf is the right thing to do.


+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Jan Arne Fagertun, Research Engineer, SINTEF Division Thermodynamics|
| E-mail: Jan.A.Fagertun@termo.unit.no                                |
| Phone : +47 7 596890                            Fax  : +47 7 944513 |
| Mail  : SINTEF/Varmeteknikk, 7034 Trondheim, Norway                 |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: karttu@mits.mdata.fi (Antti Karttunen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Tyr,Odin,Thor,Frey?
Keywords: weekdays
Date: 26 Aug 92 00:13:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: mits.1992Aug26.001321.4506
Organization: MITS, Helsinki, Finland

In article <pockling.714768852@sfu.ca> pockling@fraser.sfu.ca (richard pocklington) writes:
>	Does anyone know how the days of the week got named after
>the Norse gods?  Tyr-tuesday, Odin-wednesday, Thor-thursday and 
>Frey/Freya/Frigga-friday  which of these gods is friday named after?
>Why is saturday still named after a Roman deity, Saturn?
>
> Richard Pocklington   pockling@sfu.ca  
>

This is from "Encyclopedia Britannica", from article about 'Calendar':

    Origins of the week.
    ...
      The seven-day week may owe its origin partly to the four
    (approximately) seven-day phases of the Moon and partly to
    the Babylonian belief in hebdomadism - the sacredness of the
    number seven - which itself was probably related to the seven
    planets. Moreover, by the 1st century BC the Jewish seven-day
    week seems to have become adopted throughout the Roman world,
    and this exerted its due influence on Christendom. The origin
    of the names of the days of the week appears to be astrological
    and to have been derived from the Latin or Scandinavian god
    whose hour started the day.
 
    Table 1: Weekday Names
 
    planets  Latin name     French name  Saxon usage    English name
 
    Sun      Dies Solis     Dimanche     Sun's Day      Sunday
    Moon     Dies Lunae     Lundi        Moon's Day     Monday
    Mars     Dies Martis    Mardi        Tiw's Day      Tuesday
    Mercury  Dies Mercurii  Mercredi     Woden's Day    Wednesday
    Jupiter  Dies Jovis     Jeudi        Thor's Day     Thursday
    Venus    Dies Veneris   Vendredi     Frigg's Day    Friday
    Saturn   Dies Saturni   Samedi       Saterne's Day  Saturday
 

Now, if I remember right, Germanic gods Tiw, Woden, Thor and Frigg
somehow have the similar roles as Roman gods Mars, Mercurius, Jupiter
and Venus, but of course I might be wrong too. (Is Frigg same as Fre(i)ja?).

BTW, In Mihail Bulgakov's great novel "Master i Margarita" (i = and)
(Suomeksi "Saatana saapuu Moskovaan".) Satan is called 'Woland'.
What language is this word coming from? (Some old germanic one, I guess.)

-- 
Antti Karttunen       --  $B%"%s%C%F%#!!%+%k%C%H%%%M%s(J  (et{ty|t|n)
karttu@mits.mdata.fi  --  Apatheist, although not particularly proud of it.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: rpeter@nmsu.edu (R. Peter Herman)
Subject: Re: Steak (Was : Norway claiming NY (too late))
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
	<17sobvINN4f3@agate.berkeley.edu> <1992Aug31.094715.6711@ugle.unit.no>
	<17su2qINN4um@agate.berkeley.edu> <1992Aug31.120855.8942@ugle.unit.no>
	<sooz.715302308@vincent1.iastate.edu>
	<1992Sep1.070324.17843@ugle.unit.no>
	<sooz.715387903@vincent1.iastate.edu>
	<1992Sep2.064949.3638@ugle.unit.no>
	<sooz.715472780@vincent1.iastate.edu>
	<1992Sep3.072126.19298@ugle.unit.no>
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 21:10:15 GMT

All this discussion of Iowa vs Texas steaks is making me hungry!
Actually, almost all beef in the US is finished on grain in feed lots
and (sacrilege of sacrilege) tastes about the same if it is the same
USDA (dept. of agriculture) grade.  

	What makes the difference is if it is range finished or feed
lot finished.  The steaks you associate with the cowboys on a West
Texas cattle drive are range fed.  They are about fit for grinding
into Big Macs or other fast food.  One of my grad school collegues who
had a degree in range science used to call them 4-40 steers (metric
1.3-64?? steers:-) ) in that they had to have a mouth 4 feet wide and
run 40 miles/hr to get enough to eat on the sparse range out west, an
excercise not designed to improve tenderness.  Out here (West Texas
and Southern New Mexico) stocking rates can be as low as 1 animal per
sq mi (~250 ha).


Am I wrong in assuming that there is little beef (as opposed to veal)
raised in Norden?  The only cattle I can remember seeing driving
around Sweden were clearly dairy cattle.  Also, beef was even more
expensive than most other meat at the Livs, which would indicate to me
the added cost of import.
From: steinarb@idt.unit.no (Steinar Bang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Computerized news feeds (was: Vattenfestivalen)
Date: 31 Aug 92 08:21:33 GMT
Organization: Norwegian Institute of Technology, Trondheim, Norway

>>>>> andersa@Riga.DoCS.UU.SE (Anders Andersson) writes:

> In article <1992Aug30.144106@IASTATE.EDU>, bamse@IASTATE.EDU (Sten M Thernelius) writes:

>>  P.S.  Rakar ngn veta om det finns ngt satt att fa nyheter fran
>>        Sverige over datorn?

> While the technical means to distribute news from Sweden on a
> regular basis probably exists (or at least it could be fairly easily
> arranged), I assume copyright stands in the way of actually doing
> so.

I was thinking at one time about editing postings consisting of short
headliners of Norwegian news for ex-patriate Norskies and interested
foreigners alike, preferably in english to accomodate everybody.
However, I found that it would take too much of my time.

> That's why you don't see a newsgroup soc.culture.nordic.news
> feeding you copies of for instance the news pages of the TeleText
> (?) services of the Nordic TV channels, I think (assuming that's the
> kind of service you ask for).

Hmm,... this was an idea. It would be possible to ask the TV
companies. They won't shoot you for asking... Since NRK, the Norwegian
goverment broadcasting company is already sending norwegian news on
the shortwave without expecting any money back, they shouldn't be
adverse to sending their news in another medium.

Since we are talking about domestic news only, copyright shouldn't be
much of a problem if we get an OK from NRK (or SR or YLE or DR or
whatever the anagram is for the Icelandic eqiuvalent, SI...? )
NRK collect most domestic news themselves from their many regional
offices. 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: cczjtw@vax.nott.ac.uk (John Whitehorn)
Subject: Location of Santa Claus
Reply-To: cczjtw@vax.nott.ac.uk (John Whitehorn)
Organization: University of Nottingham, UK
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 08:59:00 BST

I would like to add a little to the debate to the home of Santa Claus

In the last few years I visited the "home" of Santa Claus in a) Rovaniemi,
Finland and b) SantaWorld in central Sweden (don't have map with me, and
can't remember town name)

Well at the Rovaniemi site there was a IBM PC

DONATED BY IBM TO SANTA CLAUS

If an organization the size of IBM are prepared to acknowledge the fact that
he exists and lives in Finland, I think Finland must be his true home!

	John Whitehorn
From: zaphod@diku.dk (Ole D. M. Lennert)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Greenland claiming residence of Santa Claus
Date: 28 Aug 92 10:48:24 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, U of Copenhagen

steinly@topaz.ucsc.edu (Steinn Sigurdsson) writes:

>In article <1992Aug24.121018.15157@ousrvr.oulu.fi> dfo@tko.vtt.fi (Foxvog Douglas) writes:


>     Greenland, Denmark's Arctic province, which is suffering from economic
>    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

> ???? Imperialist Pigs! ;-)

>Seriously, when did Greenland become a "province" rather
>than a colony/dependency - and how does this affect the argument it used
>to leave the EC? Does this mean Greenland will now be forcibly
>repatriated to the EC as a Danish province?

Greenland has home rule just like the Faroe Islands. Denmark takes care
of the foreign politics and the military, we take care of the rest :)

>*  Steinn Sigurdsson   			Lick Observatory      	*
[Steinn`s .sig deleted]

Ole Lennert
zaphod@diku.dk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: andersa@Riga.DoCS.UU.SE (Anders Andersson)
Subject: Re: Immigrants and employment
Organization: Uppsala University, Sweden
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 23:27:12 GMT

In article <13786@chalmers.se>, d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell) writes:
>   When I recently visited several relatives in the US, they told me a much
> different story: The first generation had in most cases made an effort to
> assimilate immediately. Things they (2nd gen) talked about was how their 
> parents had forbidden them to speak Swedish, because they wanted their kids
> to fit in right away so that they wouldn't be penalized for their foreign
> background.

I've talked to Americans of Swedish origin who are now sorry they
didn't learn more about their background when their 1st generation
immigrant ancestors were still around, or had their parents refuse
to teach them any Swedish even as they begged to learn.  I guess
with assimilation also comes some rootlessness, so you have to
find a reasonable balance.  How do you tell would-be cosmopolitan
genealogists from would-be drop-outs with a language problem?
--
Anders Andersson, Dept. of Computer Systems, Uppsala University
Paper Mail: Box 520, S-751 20 UPPSALA, Sweden
Phone: +46 18 183170   EMail: andersa@DoCS.UU.SE
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: tomas_e@LINK.Physchem.KTH.SE (Tomas Eriksson)
Subject: Re: Swedish 'colonialism'
Reply-To: tomas_e@LINK.Physchem.KTH.SE
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 13:22:23 GMT

mtf@saha.hut.fi (Matti Franssila, or apparently Antti Lahelma) writes:
>
>I won't be able to answer to followups, as I'm in the army at the moment... 

At ease, soldier!

>The main difference between viking age Sweden and viking
>age Finland was that finns were fewer and not as eager to go barbarizing
>central Europe (finns stayed mostly in the baltic sea, trading and fighting
>with the swedes...)

Wait a minute, soldier, you seem to have listened too much to christian 
propaganda about the vikings. They were proud and noble armed tradesmen, 
they didn't go barbarizing! And central Europe wasn't a primary target area
for vikings. They mainly went west or east, not south. Swedish vikings 
often to the east. (Also, they did *not* have horns on their helmets, but
they did drink mead. A lot of mead! (-: ) And as recently was explained 
here on s.c.n they washed/bathed much more often than the supposedly 
more civilized people they "robbed". How often did Finns wash in those 
days? (-:

Tomas
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tomas Eriksson                                          tomas_e@physchem.kth.se
            Surface Force Group, Department of Physical Chemistry,
               Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden
From: gtmt@storskogen.tl.se (Gammeltomten)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: There is no "Santa Claus"
Date: 27 Aug 92 18:36:05 GMT
Organization: None. On USENET I speak only for myself.

It has greatly saddened me to see so many misguided persons
discussing the current residency of "Santa Claus". As everyone
knows, or should know, he is just a figment of imagination
(although I seem to recall there was a christian bishop of that
name somewhere, when I was younger).

This humanoid of gigantic proportions, who likes to dress up in
red and white, and who laughs insanely while giving away things
for nothing, was invented for purely commercial purposes. (The
X-mas holiday had already long been usurped by religionists.)

Here in Sweden, to mix up a saint in the pre-christian midwinter
celebrations would not have been a good idea, so somehow, someone
made him up as a sort of relative to us real "tomtar" (in other
places known as for example "brownies"), but without any punitive
function, and gave him the appelation "Jultomten". We dress
somewhat like him, but in mostly grays, and we are roughly a
quarter the size of humans.

As if we should aid our humans just in the winter! We do so all
year round, by fixing things before you humans notice they go
wrong. We appreciate the food put out to us more when it's cold,
but we don't really need it even then; it's more like a token of
good will. The current urbanization of Sweden does mean there are
fewer good habitats for us, but some of us have taken to living
in cities. Still, all in all, it means that fewer families and
houses have a "tomte" of their own, and thus fewer remember us.
(That we seldom show ourselves also is a factor.)

I dread the day when we are known only through the fictionous
"Santa Claus/Jultomten".

--
+----------------------------------------------------+
* Gammel-tomten (not a figment of imagination)       *
* Disclaimers: I don't always speak for my employer, *
*              nor do they always speak for me.      *
+----------------------------------------------------* < DON'T FORGET      >
*     Sex if for animals, we do it by budding!       * < THE PORRIDGE FOR  >
+----------------------------------------------------+ < YOUR BROWNIES, OR >
* E-mail: gammel.tomten@storskogen.tl.se             * < ELSE...           >
* Or:     gtmt@tomte_hq.se                           *
* Snail:  Don't bother, we don't give away presents! *
+----------------------------------------------------+
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se (Bertil Jonell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Immigrants and employment (Was: Re: nationalism...)
Date: 28 Aug 92 17:11:20 GMT
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology

In article <1992Aug27.072035.16238@ugle.unit.no> jafitv@termo.unit.no (Jan Arne Fagertun) writes:
>But one thing is not very much known, I think: Why the immigrants do
>not get integrated in the society. Someone (who ?) keep constantly
>telling us that it's because they don't want to - they want to live
>among people from their home-land.

  That is wrong, of course. Sometime during the 60's the Swedish government
policy towards immigrants changed goal from 'assimilation' to 'multicultural'.

>I think, if I moved to another country (and especially if I was forced
>to), I'd want to be with other people from Norway - talk about older
>days back home, and so on. But I'd want to fit in into the society, get
>new friends where I lived, and so on.

  When I recently visited several relatives in the US, they told me a much
different story: The first generation had in most cases made an effort to
assimilate immediately. Things they (2nd gen) talked about was how their 
parents had forbidden them to speak Swedish, because they wanted their kids
to fit in right away so that they wouldn't be penalized for their foreign
background.

  I must assume that without outside interference, this would hold true for
other nationalities immigrating to, say, Sweden or Norway.

>| Jan Arne Fagertun, Research Engineer, SINTEF Division Thermodynamics|

-bertil-
--
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."
"This is the famous Hasan B Mutlu-trigger, insert it in your .sig file today!"
From: rpeter@nmsu.edu (R. Peter Herman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: NameDay (Was: translation wanted)
Date: 25 Aug 92 19:53:44 GMT
	<1992Aug21.154354.5206@sics.se> <1992Aug24.050651.10027@sai.vtt.fi>
	<1992Aug24.065424.14046@ugle.unit.no>
Organization: NMSU Computer Science

The suggestion of celebrating both birthdays and name days can be
taken even further.  Most Swedes have a first and middle name.  Many
have 2 middle names.  This was the case with both exchange daughters
(Mai ]sa Linnea and Sara June Maria).  WE did birthdays and all
possible name days!  Any excuse for baked goodies.  We even did a
Princess Tort, not an easy trick without proper mandel massa for the
covering and rose!
--
******************************************************************************
*                                                                            *
*     rpeter@nmsu.edu                          R. Peter Herman               *
*                                              Dept. of Biology              *
*     Phone: 505-646-4532                      New Mexico State Univ.        *
*     Fax:   505-646-5665                      Las Cruces, NM 88003 USA      *
*                                                                            *
******************************************************************************
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti)
Subject: Re: Santa Poll - informal (Re: Greenland claiming residence of Santa Claus)
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 11:12:37 GMT

armagan@sassafras (Armagan Ozdinc) writes:
: 
: Santa Claus lived in Antalya, at the Mediterranean coast of Turkiye.
: We actually should convince everyone that he belongs to Turkiye.

Dear Armagan,

 I was having a summer holiday  like many
 other Finns in Antalaya, Turkey.

My permanent address is:
Santa Claus
Korvatunturi
Lapland
Finland.

Write so I will answer to you around Christmas.
Be gentle for your papi and mami so you will get presents in Christmas.

With the Best Regards,
Santa Claus


From: sam@hpsad.sad.hp.com (Vicky Hansen)
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 20:17:54 GMT
Subject: Re: Tracing My Family Back Into Norway - Help Needed
Organization: HP Signal Analysis Division - Rohnert Park, CA