HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: s0xjg@exnet.co.uk (Xavier Gallagher)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Dworkin (was Re: Liberty)
Date: 27 Dec 92 14:08:37 GMT
Organization: ExNet Systems Ltd Public Access News, London, UK

In article <18220@autodesk.COM> owen@autodesk.com (D. Owen Rowley) writes:

>matri-focal in that children were the sole *property* of the mother.
>A males closest male realtives were .. brothers  born of the same mother 
>( womb-mates ), and your mothers brothers born of the same mother
>(uncles and cousins).
>
>Paternity may or may not have been known about but in either case was
>not a factor in the social scheme of social inheritance. ( Rhesus monkeys
>have this same matri-focal social structure BTW) In that culture, women
>also owned the hearth and home, and men could co-habit the home only at the
>sufferance of the women. ( in other words when she got tired of him, he got
>thrown out ) Men not cohabiting with women lived in common *mens houses*
>or  left the tribe looking for adventure or resettlement.

This is a joke, isn't it?

The 19th centuary was filled with myths.  I thought that most of them
had been laid to rest, obviously not.

1. There never was a noble savage.  The cultural primitivism practised
in the C19 is now projected onto children. Forget it. It never existed.


2.  There was never a time when women held power in society as described
above.  As anthropologists circled the world and historians researched
further and further back it became clear that this 'perfect' state
of female emancipation was receading further and further into
prehistory.

The myth is even contradicted by feminist writings.

Xave
-- 
** Xavier Gallagher                        ***********************************
** Genius, Plumber & Madman                ******* s0xjg@exnet.co.uk ********* 
** Part time Dark OverLord Of The Universe ***********************************
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: roger@quantime.co.uk (Roger Phillips)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: teeth
Date: 31 Dec 92 15:08:03 GMT
Reply-To: roger@quantime.co.uk (Roger Phillips)
Organization: Quantime Ltd, London (software for market research)

In article <C0325n.As0@cs.vu.nl>,
fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:
> I'm in this chair, this nice clean crisp dentist sits down beside me,
> starts working on my teeth, and at one point I find myself having to
> fiercely fight my tounge that wants to gently caress and moisten and
> care for and make love to his male fingers working in full
> concentration on my ivory. He asked me why I started to smile.
> I didn't answer, I couldn't anyway, not with a filling hardening.

Just how filling was your hardening?

-- 
Roger Phillips                            roger@quantime.co.uk
"The best way to find something you've lost is to buy a replacement."
-- Ann Landers
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: tdbear@dvorak.amd.com (Thomas D. Barrett)
Subject: Re: Diet differences with your partner?
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.; Austin, Texas
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 93 12:56:30 GMT

In article <1992Dec31.200958.850@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>In article <1526@dosbears> dosbears!mikel@pyramid.com writes:
>>I am an omnivore (if it can't run faster than I, it is in trouble).
>
>Wanna race?

I'm right behind you two and closing fast! :)

-- 
|Tom Barrett (TDBear), Sr. Engineer|tom.barrett@amd.com|v:512-462-6856 |
|AMD PCD MS-520 | 5900 E. Ben White|Austin, TX  78741  |f:512-462-5155 |
|"No is yes, And we're all free"   |CO made a #2 no-no... PU!          |
|My views are my own and may not be the same as the company of origin  |
From: tdbear@dvorak.amd.com (Thomas D. Barrett)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: When Lesbians Kiss
Date: 23 Dec 92 20:13:58 GMT
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.; Austin, Texas

In article <1gmm2cINNfar@roche.csl.sri.com> kmac@cisco.com (Karl MacRae) writes:
>	Heard on Rossane tonight:
>		"Whenever lesbians kiss, another angel gets it's wings..."

From a conversation that I was having offline... It would be way too
cool if the writers and the Arnolds would create a storyline in which
Darlene trys out lesbianism.  Roseanne could do all the seterotypical
stuff when an otherwise accepting person finds out that their
son/daughter is g/l... like coming after the Sandra B. character for
giving Dar ideas, etc.  After a few episodes, Roseanne can finally
come to accept that Dar has to do what she feels is right for her...
maybe a PFLAG meeting could be discussed?  As for Dar, she will leave
it open 'til next season :)

So... what does everyone think?


-- 
|Tom Barrett (TDBear), Sr. Engineer|tom.barrett@amd.com|v:512-462-6856 |
|AMD PCD MS-520 | 5900 E. Ben White|Austin, TX  78741  |f:512-462-5155 |
|"No is yes, And we're all free"   |CO made a #2 no-no... PU!          |
|My views are my own and may not be the same as the company of origin  |
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mhr@hpuerca.atl.hp.com (Mike Reaser)
Subject: Programmers Up the Butt
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 19:51:30 GMT
Organization: a stone mountain of Kudzu
Keywords: say what

I stumbled thru comp.lang.fortran earlier today, and saw mention of a
mail-order software shop called ... "Programmers Up the Butt".

Anyone have _any_ information on this business?  Or is this just an
insulting nickname for a more conventionally-named business?  The
visions dancing around my head ... 

<<slaps back of own wrist>>

Bad bear!  Keep your mind on business, bear!

--
=======================================================================
 Mike Reaser, Hewlett-Packard N. Amer. Response Center - Atlanta
 Internet:  mhr@hpuerca.atl.hp.com
 NBCS: B5 f t w g+ k s              I barely speak for myself, so
 #include <standard.disclaimer>       don't make me speak for HP
=======================================================================
From: dfs@lestat.bellcore.com (Deborah Swayne)
Subject: Re: Congratulating (het) parents on their new baby
Followup-To: soc.motss
Organization: Morristown Research and Engineering
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 16:21:33 GMT

ji@cs.columbia.edu (John Ioannidis) writes:
|> Every once in a while I'll read on the local bboards in the places I
|> have accounts at, that Mr&Mrs so-and-so had a brand new baby, vital
|> statistics of the baby follow, and the message ends with how the
|> father is proud and the mother is resting at the hospital. The message
|> is invariably congratulatory.
|> 
|> 1. Is it a het thing, and I just don't understand?

Undoubtedly.

|> 6. Should I really be working on finishing my thesis and not bothering
|> soc.motss with my morning (very late night, actually) bitchiness?

Certainly not.  Now I have an opportunity to be spiteful and petty,
too.  I actually don't get too annoyed about baby congratulations,
because I find babies pretty exciting.  The one that always gets my
goat is when straight people are, as they are invariably, 
enthusiastically congratulated for getting married.  I wonder why 
nobody is ever congratulated for having the courage or imagination 
or simple  unconventionality to remain single or to find some other
interesting way to live and build family.  Instead, they do this
thing that is nearly inevitable (for heterosexuals) in our culture 
and people act as though they've discovered something new and wonderful.

Of course I shouldn't post something that so clearly reveals my
own immaturity and envy, but what the hell.  :^)

Debby
dfs@bellcore.com
From: Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: soc.motss.*
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 20:35:48 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <thaaang.724731801@cwis> <BznGzr.GHI@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>  
  <thaaang.725058794@cwis> <72279@cup.portal.com> <thaaang.725134675@cwis>

Thaaang writes:
>>Now then, how about:
>>soc.lesbigay.plaid.flannel
>>soc.lesbigay.black.leather
>>soc.lesbigay.charcoal.latex
>>soc.lesbigay.grubby.union-suit
>>soc.lesbigay.chrome.studs
>
>Lovely! (Who was it that suggested s.l.grungy.jeans.with.10w40.splotches
>in email?)

I want to know this myself!  (Of course, for the purist, those
should be H-D.60wt.splotches....)

>>Tch, John.  Such a stereotypically exclusionary list you wrote.
>Well jeez. I was using International Male, gimmie a break...

I don't know whether to absolve you because your source is so
thoroughly fucked up, or to berate you for choosing such a 
revolting source in the first place.....  ;-)

 
() Re: International Male
() >>>>>Colorful?  Flashy?  "Stylish"?
() >>>>The word is "expensive."
() >>>The word is "ugly."
() >>The word is "fufu."
() >actually at work, we kiddingly call it Soft Porn....
() 
() Yes, you look at it and it makes you soft.
()      -- Rob Boldbear
-----
[> George D. Madison | NBCS: B8f+t+w-e+s+k+a!cv | Just say NO to razors! <]
[> It's a BEAR thing -- you wouldn't understand. <|> furr@cup.portal.com <]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rogerk@QueerNet.ORG (Roger B.A. Klorese)
Subject: Re: A Better Year Ahead
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 15:50:31 GMT
Organization: QueerNet

In article <18219@autodesk.COM>, owen@autodesk.com (D. Owen Rowley) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec22.003202.26314@macc.wisc.edu>, anderson@macc.wisc.edu
|> (Jess Anderson) writes:
|> What I'm asking is if there is *any* sort of official *usenet*
|> recognition that we can point to when and if some site 
|> blatantly disregards provisions of a chartered newsgroup
|> that has been officially voted into the soc. hierarchy?

(a) There is no such thing as a "chartered" newsgroup.  Moderated newsgroups can
have enforced policies; other cannot.

(b) Soc.motss was not "voted" into the soc. hierarchy in the sense that soc.bi
was.  It pre-existed soc., and was *reorganized* into it.
-- 
ROGER B.A. KLORESE                                              +1 415 ALL-ARFF
rogerk@unpc.QueerNet.ORG              {ames,decwrl,pyramid}!sgiblab!unpc!rogerk
"Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from."
                                                                   -- J. Foster
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: paul@psych.toronto.edu (Paul Hastings)
Subject: Re: Coming out at work - HELP!
Organization: Department of Psychology, University of Toronto
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 19:29:35 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.074006.12264@mic.ucla.edu> cjones@physci.ucla.edu (Chad Jones) writes:
>In article <19DEC92.15444939@enh.nist.gov> , aberson@enh.nist.gov writes:
>>It's a little too obscure for me at this point.  I've been looking for 
>>something obvious, like one which says "Queer" or "Faggot."  Anyone have
>>any suggestions?  One would think with all the witty t-shirts
>>around, a coffee mug wouldn't be so difficult.
>
>There's a store in West Hollywood called Don't Panic that has all kinds
>of confrontational t-shirts.  My latest favorite: "Due to the change in
>the administration, the light at the end of the tunnel will be turned
>back on."  
>
Here in Toronto, Out on the Street is the place for gayeT's.  For
Xmas I've received a 'Don we now our gay apparel' T-shirt.  But one
of my faves is still that from which sprang my .signature...
-paul

-- 
Aunt Em,                                 I think we better go get some-
     Hate you.  Hate Kansas.             thing to eat before we end up 
     Taking the dog.                     like the Donner party.
                        Dot.                             Buster Bunny.
From: rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: soc.motss.*
Date: 23 Dec 92 18:39:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1992Dec23.183925.13365
Organization: insert anything here

Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:
>Thaaang writes:
>>soc.lesbigay.black.velvet
>>soc.lesbigay.gold.lame'
>>soc.lesbigay.rust.gabardine
>>soc.lesbigay.faded.denim
>>soc.lesbigay.jade.silk
>>soc.lesbigay.fuschia.spandex
>>soc.lesbigay.leopard.mesh
>>
>Indeed.  At least "soc.lesbigay.faded.denim" is a good idea.

>Now then, how about:
>soc.lesbigay.plaid.flannel
>soc.lesbigay.black.leather
>soc.lesbigay.charcoal.latex
>soc.lesbigay.grubby.union-suit
>soc.lesbigay.chrome.studs
>

	Sure, SURE leave me out --- without

	soc.motss.armani.suit !!!


	:-)

BBC
P.S.  OK -- more honestly
soc.motss.i.would.not.know.an.armani.suit.if.it.bit.me.on.the.ass

PPS. Well, to be truly honest I have to admit I could become a teensy-
bit interestined fashion... My suit sportscoat I REALLY REALLY like
(I get to defend in it! - yay) but this is more a nod to Jess'
comment ages ago about clithes that never go out of style.
From: kenr@cabezon.uucp (Ken Richards)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Coming out at work - HELP!
Date: 22 Dec 92 01:09:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: cabezon.1992Dec22.010946.19364
Organization: Logic Modeling Corporation of Beaverton Oregon

aberson@enh.nist.gov writes:

>In a previous article, tdbear@dvorak.amd.com (Thomas D. Barrett) wrote:
>> 
>>And, if that ain't enough advertisment... rainbow coffee mugs are
>>pretty neat!

>It's a little too obscure for me at this point.  I've been looking for 
>something obvious, like one which says "Queer" or "Faggot."  Anyone have
>any suggestions?  One would think with all the witty t-shirts
>around, a coffee mug wouldn't be so difficult.

A place called The Pink Zone in Portland and Seattle has mugs with sayings
like: FAG COFFEE, QUEER MUG, DYKE COFFE, etc...

Ken

-- 
___________________________________________________________________________
   Ken Richards        |                | It's tragic that families can be 
 Logic Modeling Corp   |  kenr@lmc.com  | torn apart by something as simple
                       |                | as wild dogs.
Newsgroups: soc.motss,ba.politics
Subject: Re: How did you find soc.motss?
Organization: Jenny Agutter Fan Club
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 20:52:18 +0000

In article <1992Dec20.231739.8064@reed.edu> nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>How did you discover soc.motss? Did you find it at the same time you
>found Usenet, or later?

I think I found out about it just after the great renaming, but it was
a while before we got a full feed of it in the UK. I guess I picked
up the original references through cross-postings or comments in other
groups.

I've since written documentation for a public access system in the UK
that include soc.motss in the appendix on Usenet in a short list that
gives a 'sampler' of some of the groups available.

Nigel.


-- 
[Nigel Whitfield                               nigel@stonewall.demon.co.uk]
[For details on the uk-motss mailing list mail uk-motss-request@pyra.co.uk]
[*****  All demon.co.uk sites are independently run internet hosts   *****]
From: allemang@lia.di.epfl.ch (Dean Allemang)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Origin of the term "faggot"
Date: 31 Dec 92 09:54:41 GMT
	<1992Dec23.124020.5309@macc.wisc.edu> <1habdnINNnfi@fido.asd.sgi.com>
	<thaaang.725270129@cwis> <C019JD.EqC@hpuerca.atl.hp.com>
	<thaaang.725702896@cwis> <C0309C.A38@cs.vu.nl>
Organization: DI-LIA -- Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne
In-reply-to: fjvwing@cs.vu.nl's message of 30 Dec 92 16:53:35 GMT


In article <C0309C.A38@cs.vu.nl> fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:

  [lots of things in Italian deleted]

>   Dino, I think this is your cue. At least you'd know what you are
>   writing about.
> 
> 								   FJ!!


He, he, no, I only *pretend* to speak Italian.  And besides, everyone
knows that all the sounds don't really mean anything - the
communication is all done with the movement of the hands!

  - Il vostro Dino, 
      (chi cerca un nuovo nome in francese - any suggestions, Eamonn?)



(obligatory motss content - um, let's see, here it is - the Spartacus
guide says that the Dutch men literally `ooze' masculinity - in FJ!!'s
case, it doesn't ooze, it . . . oh, maybe I had better not continue).
From: smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: EE statements (was: Re: Attention Skiers Boycotting Colorado)
Date: 31 Dec 1992 01:12:35 GMT
Organization: Colorado Springs IT Center
NNTP-Posting-Host: fajita19.cs.itc.hp.com

snodgras@lclark.edu (Bil Snodgrass) writes:
> My insurance premium is higher because I have to pay heterosexuals 
> to have children.  So are the tax payers.

Would you feel better if people stopped having children?  Or if 
insurance didn't cover dependants?   Or if there was legislation 
that required a certain level of financial wealth before someone 
can have kids?  ie; what are you offering as a better way, or 
are you just pissing in the wind?  

> Married people all over the country are asking that their companies help
> with child care...they are pushing the U.S. government real hard on
> this one.  Again we have to pay for their children....

Would you feel better if companies ignored the needs of their 
employees families?  Do you think this would make the overall 
situation better? 

> This is wrong.  Why should companies give out welfare because people
> are married?

Welfare, eh?  Sure.  Ultimately, companies will do what they think is 
best for them.  Companies think paying married people more money, since 
they have more responsibilities, is good business; you evidently have 
a problem with that?  Would you like to be able to dictate that 
companies can't do that?  Sounds like plain old sour grapes...

> We also as a society have to pay to feed, clothe, house and render
> medical care to neglected children.....
> We have to pay for police protection to protect us from the teenage 
> gangs.......

And this from the guy who above was complaining about money for 
child care, so parents can take better care of their kids?  
Makes a lot of sense...or are you just lashing out at anything 
and everything? 

> But for some reason the traditional family who use to do everything on
> its own now has to have handouts from society and work to support their
> habits.....

Their 'child' habit..do you wish your parents had been 'cured' of 
their habit?  

Walter
From: cgross@jupiter.noname (Cary Gross)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Diet differences with your partner?
Date: 31 Dec 92 16:03:34 GMT
Reply-To: cgross@jupiter.noname
Organization: Informix Software


>
>I am a vegetarian, and find it difficult to deal with a lover who is not.  There
>are a lot of reasons...  How they (the lovers) taste and smell, cooking two 
>different meals, dealing with shopping issues (the smell of dead meat is rotten 
>smelling to me, and I have a hard time being around it).
>
>So...  How many GLBO folks *are* vegetarians out there?  How have you dealt with 
>this? It seems like more and more folks are moving towards vegetarianism, but it
>is just one more thing that makes it difficult to find that "special partner".

In the three years that my partner and I have been together, we've finally come
to an agreement over our respective diets.  I am a vegetarian and he is quite the
carnivore.  

I am vegetarian more for health reasons than because of ethical reasons.  We were
both brought up on meat and potatoes, so for him it has become a necessity. 

For our meals, its usually two entrees, one meat and one meat-less.  My dinner usually
becomes a side dish for him.  I am fortunate in that he does like his vegetables and
once a week will eat a totally meatless meal, but respect his desire for beef, pork.

Since this is more for health reasons, I have no problems in preparing our meals, and
once in a great while,  a good filet looks very tempting.

cgross@jupiter.informix.com
INFORMIX SOFTWARE
Lenexa, KS
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: tal@plts.uucp (Tom Limoncelli)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: My *sigh* ad in the Washington Blade
Date: 22 Dec 1992 12:17:33 -0500
Organization: P.L.T.S., North Plainfield, New Jersey, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: plts.uucp

Thank goddess that I keep soc.motss around for 30 days.  I can't
believe I just got a date to my HS reunion with this hunk!

Woooweeee!!!

Tom "Oh THAT Donald Agarrat!" Limoncelli

In <1992Dec7.160107.17721@wam.umd.edu> lovegod@wam.umd.edu (Donald Andrew Agarrat) writes:

>Well, here it is ...
>------
>IT'S CHRISTMASTIME in the city and this GBM, 22, has no one to  
>give his gift to.  Stoke the fire so we can snuggle warm in each  
>other's arms, as the soft slow of the flames illuminate us.   
>Surprise me with kisses; I'm unaware (yeah right) of the  
>mistletoe hanging above.  I'm looking for a mature man of color  
>who appreciates honesty and respect as do I.  Let's make love  
>underneath the flickering Christmas tree, giving ourselves to  
>each other.
>------
>*pulls the sheets over his head*

>Donald
-- 
Tom Limoncelli -- tal@plts.uucp (home) -- tal@warren.mentorg.com (work)
Heros falling to the ground / like hell's magnet / pulls me down / on my knees
/ I try to please his eyes / his idol eyes. / Jerking motions won't revive him
/ mouth to mount resusitation / I just lay down beside him / and idolize.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: tom@flood.com (Tom Chatt)
Subject: Re: What to do for NEW YEAR'S EVE in Los Angeles?
Organization: The Flood Group, Inc.  Torrance, Ca.
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 93 10:52:41 GMT

buckmr@rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire) writes:
| 
| What are other people doing for New Year's eve in LA?

Hanging out with a few friends at the Malibu beach bungalow
wherein William Randolph Hearst used to keep his mistress
(Marion Davis?); at midnight, toasting champagne, then
promptly stripping naked and plunging into the half-moon-lit
Pacific ocean in a ritual washing-off of the old year;
waking up New Year's Day in time to see the beautiful
sunrise; meeting a bunch of old and new Different Spokes
friends for a bike ride down the uncrowded beach path
from Will Rogers Beach to Manhattan Beach pier and back.

What did everybody else do?

-- 
Tom Chatt                        \   Don't take offense, take action.
Internet: tom@flood.com           \    Speak up. When we remain silent,
UUCP: ...!uunet!flood!tom        / \     we oppress ourselves.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: nigel@stonewall.demon.co.uk (Nigel Whitfield)
Subject: Re: soc.motss.*
Organization: Jenny Agutter Fan Club
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 20:38:22 +0000

In article <1992Dec21.141228.13237@bsu-ucs> 00daspeakman@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu (David Speakman, Ball State University) writes:
>
>WE need:
>*.politics
>*.activism

If you create both, they'll be a mire of crossposted messages - the
distinction between the two is blurred, to say the least.

>*.misc
>*.news

Those seem reasonable enough to me. I also like the suggestion of a group
for documentation or something similar. We've actually done something
similar in the past with the uk-motss mailing list, where a discussion
on the list has referred to a document available from the uk-motss mail
server, which prevented people having to wade through huge texts but made
them available to everyone.

>I, in turn, also support a change from MOTSS to either queer or lesbiangay.

Not queer, I think. Although I have no problems with it, it is a very
value-laden term, and one that many are uncomfortable with. lesbigay or
something similar is a good idea.

Perhaps it's also worth considering leaving the root name as it is but 
making sure that there is a regular posting about soc.motss sent to 
other key groups, like alt.sex, soc.men, soc.women and so on.

Nigel.
-- 
[Nigel Whitfield                               nigel@stonewall.demon.co.uk]
[For details on the uk-motss mailing list mail uk-motss-request@pyra.co.uk]
[*****  All demon.co.uk sites are independently run internet hosts   *****]