HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ronan@codon3 (Karen Ronan;161 GPBB;x2-0884)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: What constitutes a best friend?
Date: 8 Apr 1992 14:49:06 GMT
Organization: University of California
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: codon3.berkeley.edu
Keywords: friends, emotions, honesty, space

In article <1992Apr8.022836.29840@cbnewsi.cb.att.com> rhw@att.com (Robert Wentworth) writes:
>
David writes:
>>   Someone who is there, willing to listen when you need someone
>>   Someone who is not afraid to show you they love you
>>   Someone whom you are willing to listen to when they need someone
>>   Someone you can have fun with
>>   Someone you can be honest with completely
>>   Someone who is willing to give you some advice or ideas or help you
>>     find the answer if they can
>
>No one person is likely to be able to give you every thing you need.  Given
>that you (entirely legitimately) need a lot right now (but then, who
>doesn't), I think it would be sensible to diversify as much as possible.  It

       I find this to be a sensible way of looking at it. We would
all *like* to find one person who will be all of the above, all the
time, because it would make life very beautiful, convenient, and
like having a parent but that parent could no longer do all the authority
things that a real parent could do.
       Diversifying is not only realistic, considering that the
responsibilities and reasons for friendships reflect all the different
facets within ourselves, but it is also less fraught with demands
and expectations that might put a strain on *one* friendship providing
everything.
      In fact, when we put one friend in the position of taking care
of our needs completely, we do make that person into an ersatz parent,
and they sometimes become a "bad parent" or an "authoritarian parent"
or a "pitying parent" or any number of undesirable archetypes. We
start projecting our fears/desires/hopes onto them. It's a risky
kind of relationship. Even if we have one very special friend, I
think it's wise to allow that friend to be who he/she really is,
our equal, and someone who has his/her own problems and issues.
     Great post, Bob.
     -Karen

"Ubi caritas et amor				Karen Ronan
Deus ibi est."					ronan@codon2.berkeley.edu
(Where there is compassion and love,
God is.)
Newsgroups: alt.support
From: edsall@iastate.edu (David M Edsall)
Subject: Thank you very much
Keywords: support,friends
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 06:31:12 GMT




   Several things that I wish to say. First of all, I wish to thank all of the
people who responded to my post. It was very very touching. It brought me up a
lot as well as validating my feelings and making me feel more normal. I may
have made some new friends out of this, which is a very nice bonus. I am still
working on replies. Between preparing for the prelim and preparing to go
overseas, I have been, to underestimate, busy. 
   A few things have happened to me this past week. The first is that my
friend Susan and I are close friends again. Yay!! :=}  I had an oral
preliminary examination scheduled for this Tuesday. My advisor took me out to
dinner on Wednesday and quizzed me at dinner. He and I both realized that I
was not ready. So I expected to get canned or that my trip to Geneva would be
postponed. Surprise, surprise! My prelim was postponed but not the trip. I
leave for Geneva in three weeks for a two year stay. My prelim is now in
December. 
   Susan and I had agreed to talk after my prelim. So I talked to her on
Friday. I was very scared that she would think I was an asshole or that she
wouldn't want back in. I was wrong ( Thank God! ). She missed me as much as I
missed her. She was as depressed as I was. She still loves me and I still love
her. 
  I have learned a lot in the past two weeks. I have learned where my fear
comes from. I am starting to accept that I was an abused child. I never
realized that I was until I started to explore where the fear in me comes
from. I am learning how to calm myself down. I am learning the importance of a
friendship as well as the importance of communication about ANYTHING in a
friendship. I am learning that other people are not different from me. They
have the same fears, the same problems and need me as much as I need them. I
am definitely going to try to be a better friend from now on.
   Anyway, I feel much better. I thank you people so much. I will keep coming
back. It works if we work it.


   Dave

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| David M. Edsall       |        INTERNET:        |  Ask Iowa State why they |
| Physics Grad Student  |   edsall@iastate.edu    |  are censoring my USENET |
| Iowa State University | BITNET: edsall@alisuvax |  feed.  You are not      |
| Ames Iowa             | HEPNET: isuhep::edsall  |  allowed to read this.   |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: alt.support
From: junod@oasys.dt.navy.mil (John Junod)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: Friends
Date: 9 Apr 92 22:07:56 GMT
Reply-To: junod@oasys.dt.navy.mil (John Junod)
Distribution: na
Organization: David Taylor Model Basin, Carderock Division Hdqtrs, NSWC

In alt.support, joannee@sco.COM (Joanne Eglash) writes:
>...how do I initiate friendships? Where can I go?
>
>Ideas welcome!
>
>Joanne

Hi Joanne,

    Well, I remember reading some ideas like:

1) Take a course  (Anything...local night stuff or a college)
2) Volunteer (Teach someone to read, work with an Alumni club,
....You might say: "How can I meet some one?" I would say that
become involved with the infastructure of the organization
3) Join a Club (Anything...workout, sailing, bicycling, .....)
4) Church (Visit till you find one with people you would like to
get to know and "feels" right).
5) Have a party at your place
6) I hear grocery stores and libraries afford meeting people but
I don't know how the system works...I couldn't do it.
7) Join your local community theather group...if you don't want to
be an actress then work as a "techie" backstage.  You will learn
alot and meet both the cast and the other techies.  They may be
a bit odd but they are some great people.
8) Ask someone to lunch...  Remember, co workers do have friends
and older coworkers may know someone closer to your age.

You probably will not meet someone at a movie but don't be afraid
to go alone (don't ignore appropriate precautions) ... it really
can be fun to "take yourself out".

9) That reminds me...take your time picking out your next video -
maybe you'll "bump" into someone.

Hope this helps,

John
From: cohill@vtserf.cc.vt.edu (Andrew M. Cohill)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: Friends
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:05:39 GMT
Organization: Fire in the Mountain

One thing about feeling a little short in the friend department is that
it's easy to assume that everyone else has'em, and you don't.  

What most people have a lot of acquaintances, and by that I mean people
that they interact with socially but the relationship never goes any
farther than that.  When people in this group talk about friends it
seems to me that they do not want acquaintances, they want people with
whom they can have fun socially but *also* talk about more important
stuff, like feelings, life goals, family problems, and the like.

I've stayed out of this conversation because it is very painful to me;
I'm still trying to understand why I have so few friends, and have
puzzled out only parts of it.  

I was describing the few friendships that I had had in my life to a
therapist once, and she remarked that in an odd sort of way, I was
lucky, because most people never experienced the depth of the
relationships I had described.  

I mention that not to dismiss the feelings that people have expressed
here, but just to say that the appearance of friendship is not the same
as actually having them.  It's always dangerous to compare yourself to
what others seem to have, and I get myself in the most trouble when I
begin to listen to what others think I ought to have rather than taking
the time to discern my *own* needs.

The other thing that is dangerous is to rely on others to fill your
needs, rather than taking the time and energy to get what you need for
yourself.  In fact, this has been talked about in the thread--if you
expect your friends to give you the love and attention that you did not
receive from your parents, you are off to a bad start right away.  

I did that for a long time, and of course people avoided me like the
plague;  I tried even harder to "make" friends, and they ran away even
more, and so on, and the angrier and angrier I got at them.  It was an
unhappy life....

you don't make friends, you attract them....

Andrew


-- 
|          ...we have to look for routes of power our teachers never       
|              imagined, or were encouraged to avoid.   T. Pynchon          
|                    
|Andrew Cohill        cohill@vtserf.cc.vt.edu            VPI&SU                                                  
Newsgroups: alt.support
From: Steve Salter <ssalter@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: Prince Of Tides/bad memories
Organization: OFSA
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 07:52:43 -0500

stormy@Sun.COM (Stormy Taylor - IC Region Receptionist)
>I saw Prince Of Tides Monday night.  I had no idea what the story was about, just that people were raving about it.  I liked the movie, but I found it disturbing.  Anyone else have the same reaction... bad dreams ...cant get it off my mind.
>
>Stormy

I just read the book....didn't get any bad dreams but it WAS
disturbing...lots of abuse and denial and such.

Steve
From: stormy@Sun.COM (Stormy Taylor - IC Region Receptionist)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Prince Of Tides/bad memories
Date: 9 Apr 92 17:23:41 GMT
Reply-To: stormy@Sun.COM (Stormy Taylor - IC Region Receptionist)
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: garthbrooks.west.sun.com

I saw Prince Of Tides Monday night.  I had no idea what the story was about, just that people were raving about it.  I liked the movie, but I found it disturbing.  Anyone else have the same reaction... bad dreams ...cant get it off my mind.

Stormy
From: maxwell@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Mark Story)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Goodbye, cruel world
Date: 13 Apr 92 06:20:35 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO  80523

I am leaving you tomorrow...

Bye y'all.  Entering rehab.

- Mark
Newsgroups: alt.support
From: cowpatti@netcom.com (Patricia Mae Anthony)
Subject: Re: Friends
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 92 22:44:16 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article <3759@vtserf.cc.vt.edu> cohill@vtserf.cc.vt.edu (Andrew M. Cohill) writes:
>
>The other thing that is dangerous is to rely on others to fill your
>needs, rather than taking the time and energy to get what you need for
>yourself.  In fact, this has been talked about in the thread--if you
>expect your friends to give you the love and attention that you did not
>receive from your parents, you are off to a bad start right away.  

For me, this brings up "family of choice" issues, and making agreements
with close friends to assume certain roles from time to time, including
doing so on an "emergency" basis if necessary.  When I can reach this
sort of agreement, then I don't feel like I am "at risk" as far as being
abandoned is concerned, and I also don't get burdened by fears if I want
to call on someone to share my feelings with, or when I want to ask for
a hug or a shoulder.  For me, the more I work on establishing my family
of choice, the less I find myself projecting onto other peope.

Patricia
-- 

@>-`,-->  @>-`,-->  @>-`,-->  @>-`,-->  @>-`,-->  @>-`,-->  @>-`,--> @>-`,-->
          >_,<   Cuando te acuerdes de mi, hechate una copa a mi salud. 
          (oo)   Porque donde quiera que estes, vas a cabar llorando mares.
  ,-------(._.)  Porque no vas a negar, que me llevas muy adentro.
 / |     ||      Y aunque lo quieras a no, sigo siendo tu tormento.
*  ||W--'||      Que le vas a hacer, Corazon?  Que le vas a hacer, Corazon? 
   ~~    ~~      Si te estas muriendo por mi amor?  [Cuco Sanchez]
<--`,-<@  <--`,-<@  <--`,-<@  <--`,-<@  <--`, <@  <--`,-<@  <--`,-<@  <--`,-<@

Newsgroups: alt.support
From: joe@wrs.com (Joe Aseo)
Subject: Re: What constitutes a best friend?
Keywords: friends, emotions, honesty, space
Organization: Wind River Systems, Inc.
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 00:32:05 GMT

What comes to my mind's eye as I read this post is a small boy trying to
act like an adult in an adult world -- in much the same manner as Tom Hanks
role in the movie BIG.  The world of an adult seen through the eyes of
a child is a scary place -- needs for acceptance, validation, and
nurturing can often be met with rejection, humiliation, and neglect.  It's
seems a struggle to get the love and attention denied by one or both parents
from other adults that may have needs and wants of their own.

After spending much of my life seeking others to "take care" of me in the
manner that I wished my parents had, I accepted that I was the only one
who could take care of my wounded child and his needs.  And I began
talking to my inner child in a way that that I wished my parents had.  I
grieved the pain of the abuse and neglect that my kid had suffered, and I
promised him that I would try to do better.  I asked him to forgive me
when I made a mistake that hurt him, and I asked him to be honest with me
about whatever he thought or felt.

As I learned to accept my wounded child, I learned to accept my wounded
adult self -- who, despite accomplishments and possessions, still needs
acceptance by my peers and superiors, validation for just being myself,
and nurturing from those who really care.  And I gradually saw my friends
in the same light, with their own personal wounds and needs.  Those who
became my closest friends cleared a space  to allow me to be me --
despite my wounds and neediness -- as I cleared a space for them.

To have friends is to be a friend -- you cannot share what you do not have.
So give to yourself those things on that list that you want others to give
to you. You may find that your cup will overflow. 



--
Joseph Aseo
Technical Writer
Wind River Systems
Alameda, CA 94501
From: rhw@att.com (Robert Wentworth)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: Friends
Summary: bounced mail
Date: 13 Apr 92 21:34:15 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories

To joannee@sco.COM (Joanne Eglash) who initiated this thread: after our
initial exchange of mail, my subsequent reply to you repeatedly bounced;
you didn't miss anything profound, but apologies for apparent radio silence...
From: aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (Teresa Kline)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: What constitutes a best friend?
Date: 16 Apr 92 14:38:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: lims02.16APR199209381836
Organization: Yeah, *right* !
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <P.SikNews.4@troll.cs.uow.edu.au>, sik@cs.uow.edu.au (Stein, the 24hr man) writes...
> 
>I have a few really good (close?) friends, and I have this fear that
>I have to be very careful about what I say or do, because the last
>thing I want to is to loose them because of some silly mistake.
> 

I feel that a true friend is someone who knows you, without secrets or 
barriers of any kind.  It's a scary process, especially for the people 
whose trust has been cruelly broken.  But there must be no filter with at 
least one person in your life.  They have to know *you*, not only the 
pieces that you want them to know.

>Fear 1: Do I talk to much when I'm depressed (bore them to death).
>Fear 2: Do I make sense to them at all? (Me no native English you see).
>...

I think this is a matter of communication.  I have friends with whom I 
share my joy *and* sorrow.  These are the friends.  I have acquaintances 
with whom I share only parts.  That is because either they are unwilling to 
share themselves, which puts me at a disadvantage.  Or they are not willing 
to ask my help.
There is nothing worse than the guilty feeling you get when you ask someone 
a favor who has never, and will never, ask anything of you.  

-- Teresa

		Life -- just for the FUN of it!!!!
From: rbn@ralph.rtpnc.epa.gov (Bob Boyd)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: What constitutes a best friend?
Date: 15 Apr 92 16:45:00 GMT
Organization: Here & Now

sik@cs.uow.edu.au (Stein, the 24hr man) writes:
> Current conversations in alt.support prompted me to post this,
> if you want to flame anyone, do me in, not my daughter...
> 
> I am posting the following song written by my 15 year old
> daughter, comments are welcome:
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> --------------------------- SECRETS ----------------------------
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> VERSE 1
> WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU TELL YOUR SO CALLED FRIEND A SECRET,
> WHO TELLS IT TO HER BEST FRIEND, WHO TELLS THE NEXT IN LINE.
> AND AROUND AND AROUND A CIRCLE GOES YOUR LITTLE SECRET,
> THE ONE THAT I SHARED WITH YOU, THE SECRET THAT WAS MINE.
...
other verses skipped
...
> 
> This work Copyright 1992 by May Helleren.  Comments are welcome.

I am really struck by the honesty of the song -- it tells the hurt and
the anger and the fear -- breaking a trust seems to always have those
costs.  

For me it is very important to have my feelings and give them time and
space to be.  Sometimes I need to express those feelings in different
ways.  Sometimes I find that it is very important to express them to
myself, sometimes to someone who gives me support, and sometimes there
is a piece of work to do with the people that I'm having the feeling(s)
about.  If a particular relationship is important to me, I am learning
to take the risk of making an appointment to express my painful feelings
about their behavior.  This is sometimes very scary and I'm learning that
I need a lot of support in learning and doing it.  So far I've learned a
lot of positive things from the process -- and I feel better about myself --
I'm learning to trust myself more.

For me this is all part of the idea of "Share, Check, Share" approach to
increasing intimacy in relationships.  Intimate relationships live on 
progressively risking more and more with each other.  This builds trust
and connectedness... it is also a risk -- we are imperfect and sometimes
we let things slip that were confidential(to me confidential is different
than "secret").  When these things happen there may be a time of processing
the pain and deciding if the benefits of the relationship make it worth the
effort to work through healing the hurt.  I'm certainly going through this
in various ways with 4 or 5 people I'm close to.   And I do reach out for
guidance in the process.  I am continuing to learn about how it works for
me.
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> 
>  Stein - sik@cs.uow.edu.au
> 'When thou walkest through the fire, thou shall not be burned.' -Isaiah 43:2
> 'This brain intentionally left blank.' - Gary J. Stafford

--
----

Bob Boyd
In The Here & Now
Newsgroups: alt.support
From: Steve Salter <ssalter@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: Friends
Organization: OFSA
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 12:35:18 -0500

MAUKONEN@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu asks:


>>For me, putting yourself in the right place is the easy part.  The hard
>>part is how to go about telling someone "I like you.  I would like to
>>spend some time with you and be your friend."
>> CP (?)

> This is true. Just letting it happen does not always work and somestimes
>the direct approach yelds unexpected or the opposite result. So WHAT DO
>you do ???
>Chris

Hmmm, if it was me, I would just be honest and tell the person that
you would like to be their friend but you are afraid to bring it up.
That way they know that you are uncertain. Perhaps they feel the same
way and that will give them an opening to say the same thing to you.

Steve
From: ronan@codon3 (Karen Ronan;161 GPBB;x2-0884)
Newsgroups: alt.support
Subject: Re: Friends
Date: 14 Apr 92 14:34:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.seqi1INNdr8
Organization: University of California
NNTP-Posting-Host: codon3.berkeley.edu

In article <167C89160.MAUKONEN@Yournode.Domain.Ext> MAUKONEN@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu writes:
>>
> This is true. Just letting it happen does not always work and somestimes
>the direct approach yelds unexpected or the opposite result. So WHAT DO
>you do ???

My philosophy is that making friends is a similar risk to
doing anything new, or looking for a job, or apartment, or
class, etc. Obviously it is a person, not a situation, but
risks are there and it might be too self-punishing to take
things personally.

If there's someone I don't know, I take into account that
they may have too many friends already, they may be totally
incompatible with me, or I might be incompatible with them,
etc. In some of my writing groups I've been friendly with
women, wanted to remain friends with someone and paid special
attention to them in the hope that a friendship might develop.
Once, it did and we're still friends. Another time, nothing
happened. To me, that's life--you win some, you lose some.
It isn't something that's wrong with *me* it is just that
some situations don't pan out.

Bottom line is that I pay special attention to someone I want
to get to know without horning in on them or pressuring them.
I just let her/him know what I like her/him. If it's mutual
we might start having lunch together or something.

My experience & 2 cents,
Karen

ronan@codon2.berkeley.edu

"Where the seller of stars, for a penny or two, will sell your
Heart's desire to you."