From: philip@utstat.uucp (Philip McDunnough)
Subject: Re: Neuron (really networking NeXT vs. Mac)
Organization: University of Toronto, Dept. of Statistics
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 12:57:59 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.175153.25639@cs.yale.edu> nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu writes:

[ More on Mac vs. NeXT for connectivity...]

I wasn't going to respond to this but I just tried my Mac again after a year
of it gathering dust and I had a couple of surprises.
>
>A/UX is an extra-cost item for the Mac.  X-Windows is an
>extra cost item for the NeXT.

Not much more for A/UX and it runs a lot of software. In particular it runs
Textures which in its new version very impressive. It is essentially a
WYSIWYG TeX! That is in one window you type your TeX code and in the other
the output appears virtually immediately. No need to wait for a page to be
done,etc...It is extremely nice. TeX on the NeXT is also very nice but it
does not have this feature and it harder to set up with Postscript fonts,
and in general,...
>
>Networking PC's requires extra-cost hardware and
>software, and I've heard plenty of horror stories about
>various PC network "solutions".

The hardware costs with software work out to under $400. No horror stories.
It "just works" to quote someone. 

>
>Networking the Next requires a different investment of
>time and knowledge depending upon your needs.  It can be as
>easy as attaching cables, powering up, and letting the
>bundled tools autoconfig the new host.  Or, it can involve
>some knowledge of unix networking. 

At the moment it seems to require some Unix administration knowledge.
The NeXt, in general, seems far harder to use than the Mac when something
goes wrong.
>
>> I have to say this. As part of the connectivity issue the
>> Mac has good communications' programs and
>> faxmodems/sw. We have Neuron. I rest my case. 
>
>I have to say this: apples to oranges.  The Mac in generally
>a single-user, single-process machine, and the NeXT is a
>multi- user, multi-tasking machine.  The very nature of
>the benefits of such mach/unix multi-tasking also makes
>it difficult to use the same serial port for data and fax. 
>I'm not about to give up the advantages of mach/next for
>that one reason! 

Well A/UX 3.0 is multi-user, multitasking. Apple has reasonable prices
for those who want colour. This is no longer the 50's. Why should we be
paying over $5000 for colour on a Cube? Mach is not really used a great
deal on the NeXT. If it were my 3 slots on the Cube would be doing something.

Now you explain to me why a single user single tasking machine can have
a WYSIWYG TeX program while we have to tex our files and wait around to
see what's up?

I'd agree that comparing NeXt's and Mac's is difficult. I still prefer the
NeXT, its users,etc...But as I see it what was needed was a multimedia
environment which got along with people. The NeXT has given up on this
and gone for the workstation market. What one does not need is another
workstation. The NeXt simply is not a personal computer. It's much harder
to maintain than a Mac, the cost of colour is too high, the OD and ND( the
reasons for NeXT to exist in a sense) have been dealt with in an odd way,etc...

I don't like saying this but the NeXT does not have the software of the
Mac, is too expensive at the entry point, is too expensive to get colour,
etc...I'm looking at the software I have on the NeXT. FrameMaker. Works
just as well or better on the Mac. TeX. Textures is better. Mathematica.
Well it's on the Mac as is Maple. Write Now. Word is better. Improv. What
does that give me? TopDraw. I'm not an artist. New S. Better on the NeXt
but also not widely available. It's better because it doesn't exist on the
Mac. In general stats' programs are better on the Mac. Mail is wonderful on
the NeXT. The people are better and more interesting as well. Things will
happen and eventually the NeXT will be nicer in virtually all ways. But
right now I have Neuron. I'd like to be able to fax properly and I'd like
colour and I'd like a WYSIWYG TeX. As a NeXT sales rep once told me. "You
aren't ready for a NeXT" or something like that. In retrospect he was both
honest and right. I basically have no interest in Unix. I'm not interested
in OS's and programming( too old, not patient enough). I just want to point
and click and multitask. My HP Integral gave me that 7 years ago.

To be fair, the NeXT is wonderful and I'd recommend it( and have to many who
have bought it) to most people. The continuously previewed TeX is close, so
that's not major. I probably have never recovered from the ND and OD issues.
I'm a Mac type. Sorry...[Still love the Cube though...]. It's very complicated.
I certainly would rather have a NeXT than a Sun, HP,etc...Multimedia and
interpersonal computing. Where have they gone?

Philip
philip@utstat.toronto.edu