From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: Civilization bandwagon
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 22:03:51 GMT

In article <Byspxn.H3z@newsflash.concordia.ca>, ilyess@ECE.Concordia.CA (Ilyess Bdira) writes:
|> 
|> The fact that I disagree with Tamer in some issues does not mean that
|> he agrees with you on all issues! and who are "We" It seems that you did not
|> realize that even among Islamists there is room for disagreement. SO don't
|> assume that all Islamists adopt the same views.

I did not say that he agrees with me on all issues, infact, he dis-agreed on
some. However, he strongly dis-agrees with you on most issues as many Muslims
who are not outspoken.

|> 
|> >
|> Islamic History contains a lot of contradictions, if you choose some events
|> you like and generalize about Islam, then it is like somebody who chooses
|> Germany in WWII to show that democracy does not work.

The fact of the matter is that all religious histories have contradictions
and Islam is not alone. However, you Islamists in every instance are tarnishing
the image of Islam which is a fundamentally good teaching. Islam and all other
religions are not timeless and are incapable of solving all problems. In
your attempts to claim that the Arabic world problmes are there because Islam
is not being followed, Islam is being ridiculed.

|> 
|> 
|> You and your friendly dictators are surely making sure that we will never
|> find out, even if it takes the lives of all Islamists..

My friendly dictators will not let you?. You are hiding the fact that past
political systems were no better. However, can you as a genuin Muslim claim
that those governments are worse or better than all other givernments in the
world?.

|> 
|> 
|> This shows that you never read at least one of my posts  about Islamic
|> democracy (not to mention many of my "colleages"'s) I might have the time
|> later to write about it again. Let me just say that  the above is not my
|> view about Islamic governments.

Islamic government by definition means electing a Calilfeh for life, it is
not too different from a dictatorship.

|> 
> 
|> WRONG! what is behind stagnation is conservative attitudes and cowardness
|> not to mention the fact that people use religion rather than live it..
|> This has nothing to do with the Fear of God, it is the result of just
|> the opposite.

Conservative attitudes are sourced by conservative religion and ideals. That
is exactly what you Islamists desire.

|> 
|> 
|> In Islam (at least Sunni Islam) there is no such a thing as absolute authority
|> it only was allowed with prophets. Usual human beings should not be given
|> an absolute authority.

So all the Califs did not have absolute authority?.

|> >
|> O.K I pull my own bandwagon now:
|> Do you know that Islamists include historians, Economists, Political scientists
|> and just about every kind of scientists you can imagine...
|> why don't you try to read their works, maybe it is all in the glasses you
|> are looking to the world from?

I doubt that these people are Islamists like you. Anyway give me names. There
is nothing wrong with my glasses, I think you need a brain fluid change.

A.Faris
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic