HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: FAQ
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 93 21:29:45 GMT

In article <1993Jan9.030712.856@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>
ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu) writes:
>Why do people keep insisting this?  As long as everyone insists that:
>	South Asian Americans aren't Asian Americans
>	Asian Americans are really Orientals
>	Orientals are those people who look like Japs and Chinks and Gooks
>we're not going to make any progress. ...

Regardless of the denotation of "oriental", it now connotes the peoples of
E. Asia.  Clearly, when "oriental" is used, we know what facial features that
suggest.  The word "Asian" does not have the same implication.  In fact, its
denotation suggests the same:  (from Webster's dictionary)

     Asian \'<a^->-zh<e>n, -sh<e>n\ adj (1599)
         :of, relating to, or characteristic of the continent of Asia or its 
         people-- Asian n

Asian people means those in the entire area to the right of Europe, including
Russia.

Despite this fact and despite Mr. Hu's pretentions to use the term "Asian"
to refer to South Asian Americans, Mr. Hu does not refer to S. Asian Americans
when he complains:

(AAF = asian-american female, WM = white male, AAM = asian-american male,
 WF = white female)

     ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu) writes:
     >The simple fact, though, is that AAF/WM relationships outnumber
     >AAM/WF relationships by a huge margin.  (From marriage records,
     >4:1 in San Francisco, 8:1 in Sacramento)  It doesn't take a statistical
     >genius to surmise that something very strange is going on.

When he becomes angry that White men are marrying Asian-American women, he
is not referring to South Asian-American women.  He is referring to Oriental-
American women.

Mr. Hu does not, himself, use the term Asian to refer to South Asians.
Why is he complaining when other people use it to refer to groups other
than South Asians?

------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
Jinsei no imi wa nan desu ka.                Sister, can you      |   \|  |`
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.           spare a coin?        |    | -+-
                                                                  |   /| / \
Copyright 1992, 1993    Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3                    |
------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
From: atom@soda.berkeley.edu (Allen Tom)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Asian american males with African american females
Date: 12 Jan 93 05:43:32 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1iss80INN2eb@uwm.edu> nina@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Shenina Louise Jones) writes:
>
>         I'm a new poster on this net and I was wondering:  Do any 
>Asian-american men find African-american women attractive?  I've never 
>really read or seen this combination anywhere in the U.S.  I read the 
>many postings, but haven't read anything about this... Any thoughts?
>

Just like all other ethnic groups, there are some indivduals that I 
think are really attractive, and others that are repulsive, a lot 
of people in the middle. 

Unfortunately, with the way society is now, it'd be difficult to have
a relationship with an African-american woman.

Based solely on physical looks (which is a horrible way to judge a woman),
the actress who played the wife on ST:Deep Space 9 is a babe!


-- 
+-------=Allen Tom=-------+    They think that I'm CRAZY,
| atom@soda.berkeley.edu  |       But I KNOW they are wrong! -- Ren
| atom@ocf.berkeley.edu   |          
+-------------------------+ wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba!!!!!
From: underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe)
Subject: Re: WANTED: Independent, Fun-loving, Open-minded Asian Woman
Organization: Miners for a Heart of Gold
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 93 19:07:56 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.083105.22333@beaver.cs.washington.edu>
paulko@wolf.cs.washington.edu (Paul Ko) writes:
>an960@anon.penet.fi wrote:
>: The subject says it all.  I am looking for a young Asian Woman who is
>blah, blah, ... oh, I see, and she has to be Asian. Makes sense to me(?).
>: Why the request that you be open minded?  
>Maybe because you aren't?
>: you did.  Have a great day!
>Look, this isn't a flame, but why the hell do people talk about being
>"open minded", and then go on to say that they are only interested in
>dating with a specific race? Whether it's the same race or not isn't the
>issue. I'm sorry, but if you'll only date people of a certain race,
>that's not open minded.

Here are two sets of situation:

(1)(a) Chinese-ge men who date only Chinese-ge women
(2)(a) Caucasian-ge/African-ge men who date who only Chinese-ge women

(1)(b) Chinese-ge men who go to Asia to marry a Chinese-ge wife
(2)(b) Caucasian-ge/African-ge men who to Asia to marry a Chinese-ge wife

Chinese-cu routinely condemn #2 as being abnormal.  They say that
#2a is a fetish thing and that #2b is a mail-order bride thing.

However, Chinese-cu routinely accept, even praise, #1 as being normal.
They say that #1a is just natural and that #1b is okay.  They
might even recommend some friends back there to help their mate-looking
buddies out.

What we have is is unadulterated Chinese-cu bigotry.  But then, we
already knew that, didn't we?

------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
Jinsei no imi wa nan desu ka.                Sister, can you      |   \|  |`
Shitte itara oshiete kuremasen ka.           spare a coin?        |    | -+-
                                                                  |   /| / \
Copyright 1992, 1993    Disclaimer:  1 + 1 = 3                    |
------------------------------------------------------------------+------------
From: wenz@ucs.orst.edu (Wen Zongyao)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Why are we different?
Date: 5 Jan 1993 17:40:28 GMT
Organization: University Computing Services - OSU
NNTP-Posting-Host: ucs.orst.edu

In article <Jan.5.02.56.37.1993.23527@gandalf.rutgers.edu> jin@gandalf.rutgers.edu (GJ) writes:
>What is real Chinese culture? The language? The current official Chinese
> language was not considered Chinese 100 years ago. Mandarin is the language
> of Manchurian. Manchurian, Mongolian, and many other invaders had destroyed

Be aware that Manchurian and Mongolian have their own language.  They might
have influence on speaking Chinese, but they are not Chinese.  In fact, what
happened was that Manchurian lost their own language during the past 100
years.  There are very few Manchurian in China know Manchurian language. 

> much of the old culture. I would say you may find more old Chinese culture in
> Korean and Japanese than in "Chinese". Cantonese and Taiwanese are much
> closer to the old language than Mandarin. I know many Taiwanese and
> Cantonese refuse to learn Mandarin.  They may have ancestors killed or

The origin of Han people is somewhere around Gansu, a central province in
China.  This is why China is translated as 'the central country' in 
Chinese.  The current Chinese is evolved from the language of Han.  Therefore
I think the language spoken by Gansu people is much more like the orgin
Chiese.

>The mind of people? Chinese 2000 yrs ago was more open-minded. You can find it
> in the literature. Many creative thoughts! The real decline in culture  came
> after emperors adopted Confucian as the only moral and knowledge
> intellectuals need to know. Everything else was belittled. The emperors were
> quite successful in limiting people's mind and prolonging their empires.
> The culture has been therefore degraded consistently.

100% agree.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Why are we different?
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 93 14:50:45 GMT

In article <Jan.5.02.56.37.1993.23527@gandalf.rutgers.edu> jin@gandalf.rutgers.edu (GJ) writes:
>
>Personally, I consider the current Chinese culture the main reason that China
> has freefallen in her international status in the past 200 yrs, and many CA
> are victims of that indirectly. However, the Chinese-cu that we hates most may
> not be real Chinese-cu.
>
>What is real Chinese culture? The language? The current official Chinese
> language was not considered Chinese 100 years ago. Mandarin is the language
> of Manchurian. Manchurian, Mongolian, and many other invaders had destroyed
> much of the old culture. I would say you may find more old Chinese culture in
> Korean and Japanese than in "Chinese". Cantonese and Taiwanese are much
> closer to the old language than Mandarin. I know many Taiwanese and
> Cantonese refuse to learn Mandarin.  They may have ancestors killed or
> tortured by Manchurian. The invaders had created a lot of hatred in the
> culture.
>
>The mind of people? Chinese 2000 yrs ago was more open-minded. You can find it
> in the literature. Many creative thoughts! The real decline in culture  came
> after emperors adopted Confucian as the only moral and knowledge
> intellectuals need to know. Everything else was belittled. The emperors were
> quite successful in limiting people's mind and prolonging their empires.
> The culture has been therefore degraded consistently.

  Wasn't just the Manchurians though.  The Ming Dynasty was pretty
  bad.  They stifled thought, had secret police everywhere.  Then again
  if you go further back, the Emperor Chin(?) that built the Great
  Wall was also a despot who enslaved thousands to build the wall
  and also burnt books and killed scholars.  Even further back,
  there were despots (near the Bronze age) that had snake pits that
  they threw people into, and cut off people's arms and legs and
  let them roll around in the snake pits.  

  There were also times that civilization flowered, like the Han
  and Tang Dynasty, which is what I think you're referring to.
From: mcovingt@sdcc13.ucsd.edu (Maiko Covington)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Why are we different?
Date: 4 Jan 93 16:29:54 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego

>  Sure does.  I suppose you didn't have any sports events, dances,
>  clubs, and ski trips at your school.  Then you wonder why people
>  raised in Asian School systems can't get dates!

Hey, wait a minute.. at my school (Japanese schools) we had LOTS of
sporting events. We had a ski trip. We have a week long "school
trip" for graduating class. We have a yearly "sports day".. we havea
yearly "culture festival" where each class in the school turns their
classroom into a store, a restaurant, or puts on a show... then the
school is open to the public, we sell  tickets, and generally goof
around and have LOTS of fun. We have sports teams. We go on field
trips to the movies and the theater. Yes, school is hard work, but
we also DO have extracurricular activities and fun.
	And... I CAN get dates. ^_^
		Maiko Covington
From: shin@duck.ee.udel.edu (Jeong-Gyun Shin)
Subject: Re: Dwight-cu Notation (was Re: Negative connotations)
Organization: University of Delaware
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:29:09 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.071549.18762@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> ajh@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Alan Hu) writes:
>Italian culture, I can save a lot of keystrokes by using "Italian-cu"
>instead, as both a noun and an adjective.

May save keystrokes as long as a reader knows "italian-cu" means exactly
what a writer meant to say with "italian-cu".  Now, that's already quite a 
generalization.  Soooo, stick to it if one aspires to be a single minded
netter.
From: rw@hplb.hpl.hp.com (Russil Wvong)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Media Stereotypes: The Solution
Date: 10 Jan 1993 08:29:52 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

In article <cfHzooO00UhW40xJt_@andrew.cmu.edu> you write:
>My friend, Mr.Russil Wvong writes,

Thanks. :-)

>Not only was the the Great Master Bruce Lee and his film the greatest
>commercially successfully films ever made. But they put a real hero in
>every(especailly oppressed peoples) young boy's heart. Bruce Lee was the
>greatest role model that ever lived.

Well, I think that may be a little exaggerated. :-)  Bruce Lee's films
weren't the "greatest" commercial successes (I think the Star Wars and
Indiana Jones movies are at the top of the list), and although he may
have been a good role model, I think "greatest" is too much.

>elvis was shit!

?? He had a big impact on American music, obviously, and he had millions
of fans.  So I don't think a postage stamp was inappropriate.

--Russil
From: jin@gandalf.rutgers.edu (GJ)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Why are we different?
Date: 6 Jan 93 06:55:52 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.



yeonwook@hardy.u.washington.edu (Mark Choi) writes:

>But it is the same culture that inspired China to become great.

Nope, it's no longer the same culture.


>Yes. I agree that what could be considered "Chinese thought, religion, and
>philosophy" (aka culture) are best carried on in Korea and Japan, and that
>years of domination by this or that has resulted in a much different China
>than that of the T'ang times, or even as recent as the Ming times.

>Hmm...although I agree that Chinese culture was more open-minded 2000 years
>ago, you must remember that 2000 years ago, China was still divided into many
>different states, and that each of these states were culturally different.
>Buddhism as the inspiring force to be dealt with, but I cannot remember any
>Han Chinese dynasties actually adopting Confucianism as the _only_ moral
>philosophy as in the case with Yi Korea. However, I do not doubt Confucianism's
>influence in Han courts. But this influence came just as important as Buddhist
>and Taoist influence. 

>Also, I do not agree totally that Confucianism degraded the advanced state
>of Chinese dynasties. Although it is known that if applied incorrectly,
>Confucianism can do all the bad things that weren't supposed to happen
>(political factions, massive government intervention, dragging, lack of
>artistic inspiration). However, in cases where the state is totally following
>either Confucianism or Neo-Confucianism, and the people also follow it 
>(as in Korea during the early half of the Yi), it can be quite a productive
>inspirational force that can adequately replace Buddhism in numbers.

Maybe the problem in China was Confucianism had become rote
 material of exams and few (at least not the powerful) followed it.
 Emperors and their courts just used Confucianism to fool people. They enjoyed
falling into the crack of the system they maintained for their best
interest.






















Gavin
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: stgprao@st.unocal.COM (Richard Ottolini)
Subject: Re: What's it like outside California?
Organization: Unocal Corporation
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 00:55:29 GMT

There was only one Asian American student in my high school in the Detroit suburb where I grew up
(near when and where Madonna grew up) in the 1970s.  Few Chinese resturants serve anything
closely resembling what I ate when I lived in China.
From: david@xlnt.com (David Johnson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Media Stereotypes: The Solution
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:28:12 GMT

rw@hplb.hpl.hp.com (Russil Wvong) writes:
>George Wu writes:
>>     Sony now owns Columbia Pictures and Matsushita owns Paramount (I think).
>>Both claim they will not interfere with the creative control of the studios,
>>in response to American fears of "the Japanese takeover."
>>
>>     I think it'll be a cold day in Hell before you see an AA star in the lead
>>role of a mainstream American movie.
>So the question is:  Would an action movie starring an Asian-American --
>something like Die Hard, say -- be able to make lots of money?

>I think the answer is yes.  Bruce Lee's films were commercially successful.
>Hong Kong action movies, developed by directors such as John Woo into
>something like an ultra-violent art form, already have quite a few non-Asian
>fans, despite the fact that all the actors and actresses are Chinese.

Did you ever notice that Lee only had a few lines in the American
production in which he was supposedly THE star (Enter the Dragon)?

Brandon Lee and Don Wilson, both Asian, are coming up in action
movie stardom.  I think they are both American.

...

>Of course, you're probably not going to see an Asian-American star in a
>serious drama like Out of Africa anytime soon.  But nobody watches those
>movies anyway. :-)

"The Last Emperor" was a serious drama and had Asian (I do not
know if John Lone or Joan Chen are American) stars.  I think Lone
was nominated for an Oscar.

As far as propagating negative Asian males images, most of the
male characters in "The Last Emperor" are eunuchs and the emperor
Puyi is said to have been impotent most if not all his life.

For the record, I do not believe the movie makers had this in
mind.  I was just making a very small joke.

I do not think it was an American production.  The
director is Italian.
-- 
David Johnson
XLNT Designs, Inc. (XDI)
david@xlnt.com
From: gwangung@carson.u.washington.edu (just another theatre geek)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Asian american males with African american females
Date: 13 Jan 1993 00:37:54 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
NNTP-Posting-Host: carson.u.washington.edu

In article <1993Jan12.155105.16776@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> q2tj@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
>> Part of the problem is simply lack of opportunity:  I just haven't
>> gotten a chance to know that many African-Americans.  Part of it,
>> though, is undoubtably fear that I have yet to overcome.  In the
>> circles I run in, both Asian- and African-Americans are under enormous
>> social pressure either to blend into upper-middle class white suburbia
>> or to develop separatist ethnic solidarity and pride. 
>Alan points out a really interesting dilemma here.
>Assimilate or Separate!  (You can really see this
>going on at college campuses too).  Could this
>be a *false* dilemma, that people are pushed into?

	Yes.

	Sorta like being FORCED to choose between hanging out with friends
from work or with friends at my theatre. Now they're trying to make social
relationships into a zero-sum game (Now, see here....you're only supposed
to have 3 close friends, 25 casual friends and 34 acquaintences....)


-- 
Roger Tang, gwangung@u.washington.edu
Producer Emeritus, Asian Theatre at the UW, Uncle Bonsai Memorial Fan Club
	"The definition of balls is for a non-singer to go karaoke singing
with the cast of a musical revue."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: paulko@wolf.cs.washington.edu (Paul Ko)
Subject: Re: WANTED: Independent, Fun-loving, Open-minded Asian Woman
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering Dept., Univ. of Washington, Seattle
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 93 08:31:05 GMT

an960@anon.penet.fi wrote:
: The subject says it all.  I am looking for a young Asian Woman who is

blah, blah, ... oh, I see, and she has to be Asian. Makes sense to me(?).


: Why the request that you be open minded?  

Maybe because you aren't?

: you did.  Have a great day!

Look, this isn't a flame, but why the hell do people talk about being
"open minded", and then go on to say that they are only interested in
dating with a specific race? Whether it's the same race or not isn't the
issue. I'm sorry, but if you'll only date people of a certain race,
that's not open minded.

Paul Ko.
From: lin@Apple.COM (Judy Lin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: What's it like outside California?
Date: 4 Jan 93 21:30:38 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

Since moving to America as a child, I've always lived in the San Francisco
Bay Area. Except for short vacations, I really haven't been out of California.
I am curious about the Asian American experience in other parts of the country.

In California (at least in my experience),
one encounters very little overt prejudice or discrimination. 
People in general are very culturally and politically aware, and it's
easy to make friends and interacting socially with people of all ethinicity
(admittedly, my experience has been with college-educated professionals).
There are also many businesses that cater to Asian Americans needs, ie.,
restaurants, book stores, groceries, theaters, etc.

Are other areas in the country as amenable to Asian Americans? How about
attitudes toward inter-racial couples and mix-blood children? What has your
experience been like? If one were to contemplate relocation, where would
one choose, and where to avoid?

Thanks in advance for your reply!

Judy
lin@apple.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: an3879@anon.penet.fi
Subject: bimbos
Organization: Anonymous contact service
X-Anonymously-To: soc.culture.asian.american
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:12:13 GMT

I know several Chinese girls.  It seems that all the Chinese girls
that I know who grew up or were born here in America are bimbos.
They wear tons of makeup, use disgusting perfume, smile too much
(I'm talking about fake and insincere smiles), wear clothes that
are too tight and skirts that are too high, and just all around
too gung ho American.

I hate them, every time I see one of them I just want to throw up.

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Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: dtwei@acsu.buffalo.edu (Danielle T Wei)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: AA & sports Re: Media Stereotypes: The Solution
Date: 9 Jan 93 02:40:25 GMT
Organization: UB

In article <1993Jan8.135116.20389@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com> lam@popeye.comm.mot.com (Dan Lam) writes:
>I noticed that a lot of AA parents dont encourage their kids to
>excellll in sprot as much as they do encourage them to do well in music.

That is true. Because most AA parents want their children to enter the
upper classes, and thus should be given a more "classical" education

>Michael Chang is great.  There is also "the Satos" in the national
>volleyball teams (Eric and Leanne Sato) and another JA in the women
>team.  She played in the last Olympics but I forgot her name (Hey Peter
>you can help me out).  These AAs could be good role models for those kids
>who
>like volleyball. 

Ahhh! Of course! BTW, I've always wondered why the Japanese are out-performing
the Chinese in sports in America today. If you look around, you see Yamaguchi,
the Satos, etc, and then you see Michael Chang :)
As for that Japanese girl, I believe she was once on the Japanese national
team, but then deserted. She married an American (I assume) and adopted his
name. Her name now is pretty long, starts with Z..
It's not Zimmerman but it's pretty close.. Zimmer-something I think..

[15 lines of volleyball-praising deleted]

>So what sports/activities do you AAs out htere play/participate?

Well, I play tennis, touch football, ping-pong (of course)..
I used to play squashball, swim. I like playing pool, skate.
And finally I like watching football on TV :)

(GOOOOOOO BILLS!!)
(well, I like the Rams too, but they're losing, and the Bills is the
hometown team here) :)

>Dan
>
>ps:  thanks for reading.  finally get to talk about my favorite subject

Ooops, sorry I deleted it

Ning Wang
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american