HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brewer@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Steve Brewer)
Subject: Re: [Anglolingvo/English] easy to learn English?
Organization: W M U Centro de Scienca Edukado
Distribution: usa
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 18:09:36 GMT

In article <1992Aug11.171521.1149@efi.com> dchung@efi.com (Daniel Chung) writes:
>
>Now, perhaps Esperanto haves the regularity for note-takeing and for
>a lot of people to learn as a twoth (2th) language -- more regularitys
>than English.

Since no-one has responded to this article substantively (other than beginning
a huge flame-fest) I thought I'd give it a shot.

I tried using Esperanto to take notes as a tool for practicing and
for fun (ie having notes that other people might see and say, "Hey,
what does that say?" giving me an _entre_ into a declamation about
Esperanto :-).  I found it didn't work well at all, for me.  I've
noticed that I have a hard time switching back and forth between
English and the other languages I speak, Epseranto being no exception.
So, I'd hear something in English, translate it into Esperanto, write
it down, and then realize I'd just missed the next thing the prof said 
because I was still thinking in Esperanto.  In talking to other people
who can switch back and forth more quickly, I've decided that this is
probably just a skill that I could acquire if I worked hard enough at
it, but I'm too lazy to try.  

Being a native English speaker, I don't have any idea what a foreign
language speaker's experience in an _usona_ classroom would be.  

-- 
Steven D. Brewer  brewer@cs.wmich.edu     ****     99brewer@lab.cc.wmich.edu
                  Center for Science Education,  Western Michigan University
Vi trovos lin nur post la tajda forkuro, bakita de l' suno, frapita de ondoj
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
From: brewer@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Steve Brewer)
Subject: Du aferoj -- John Starling kaj hungaria retkonekto
Focena-Stato: Ludema
E-O-Avertoj: Anta^u^capelisto!
Organization: W M U Centro de Scienca Edukado
X-Accent-Convention: ^c ^u
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 01:36:28 GMT

John Starling petis ka mi afi^su ke li nun spertas retproblemojn
kaj ne povas ricevi mesa^gojn.  Se vi sendis ion al li ekde diman^co,
li ^sajne ne ricevis ^gin.  Balda^u li solvos la problemojn kaj
denove retumos, sed se vi havas ion gravan por li, sendu ^gin al mi,
a^u telefonu lin rekte.

Flanke, CHRIS_ROBINSON@carleton.ca en alia forumo demandas min:

]     Does anyone out there have an e-mail connection to Hungary?  A
] friend of mine, from Hungary, would like to connect with people in
] Hungary.  He would also like to know if there is an e-mail system
] set up at the "Attila Jozef" University in Szeged, or at the "Albert
] Szent-Gyoergy" Medical School.  Thank you for your time!

Se vi scias kiel lia amiko povas kontakti Hungarion, respondi al li
rekte (atentu ke li ver^sajne ne komprenas Esperanton.)

Dankon!

-- 
Steven D. Brewer  brewer@cs.wmich.edu     ****     99brewer@lab.cc.wmich.edu
                  Center for Science Education,  Western Michigan University
Vi trovos lin nur post la tajda forkuro, bakita de l' suno, frapita de ondoj
From: padeniso@eos.ncsu.edu (PAUL ANDREW DENISOWSKI)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Re: Interlingua?
Date: 19 Aug 92 13:17:25 GMT
Reply-To: padeniso@eos.ncsu.edu (PAUL ANDREW DENISOWSKI)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Originator: padeniso@c00000-118dan.eos.ncsu.edu




	I was a serious Esperanto student for a number of years, but finally
all but abandoned it and switched over to Interlingua.  I think one of
the biggest failings of Esperanto is, in fact, the entire "movado." 
There are too many Esperantists who either view themselves as members of
some exclusive club, or who are so possessed by ideas of world
peace/brotherhood/whatever, that they ignore the fact that Esperanto
simply isn't catching on.

	Interlingua, basically a standardization of romance languages (with
some English and german mixed in), aims at providing a means of
communication, for whatever purpose.  Unlike Esperanto, it is almost
immediately comprehensible to educated speakers of Romance languages and
English.  It differs from Esperanto in that it is practical and
realistic, and aimed at people who need to communicate accross language
barriers (esp in the sciences) but who do not have the time and
inclination to spent years figuring out Esperanto morphology.  Contrary
to the beliefs held by many (most) Esperantists, it is NOT a
particularly easy language to master, and (as witnessed at the last ELNA
convention) is not spoken well even by some of its biggest supporters.

	I don't want to be seen as "Esperanto-bashing", but I think some
serious changes need to be made if Esperanto is to ever catch on.  My
first suggestion would be to use Esperanto to discuss things other than
Esperanto itself or the "movado"   While it is true that there are many
other subjects discussed in Esperanto, it sometimes seems that the
entire raison d'etre for Esperanto is so that people can use Esperanto
to talk about Esperanto.
From: dfkihueg@RZ.UNI-SB.DE ("Edmund Grimley-Evans")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: [koresponda kurso] manko en koresponda kurso
Date: 21 Aug 92 10:03:38 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

> Ronald B. Harvey kaj retanoj!
>
>      En iu "La Kancerkliniko" aperas la vorto "junulic^o".

^Cu mi ^guste memoras, ke la kunteksto estis satira bildeto kun la
teksto "^Cu ^ci junuli^co i^gos granda verkisto, a^u ^cu li vanuos en
Iltisejo?"?

"Junuli^co" ne estas la sola lingva stranga^jo en la frazo. La aliaj
estas "^ci" anstata^u "tiu"/"^ci tiu"/"tiu ^ci", kaj "vanuos" anstata^u
"malaperos".

Edmund
From: dchung@efi.com (Daniel Chung)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: [koresponda kurso] manko en koresponda kurso
Date: 19 Aug 92 18:08:28 GMT


     Mia samlaborejano (mia = iu mia; la mia = la sola mia; c^u ne?)
j^us komencis lerni Esperanton per la koresponda kurso.  Tie mankas du
punktoj:

- La nomo de la literoj.  Rezulte, s^li literas vortojn Angle.

- Komencis esti vortoj "viro" kaj "knabo", sed ne menciig^as la problemo
  de seks-*malsimetrio*, kaj rajtaj solvoj ekzemple "-ic^".

					*Zhong* Qi-Iao, merkredon en Usono
From: cigno@sgi.com (Kevin Walsh)
Subject: Re: Ido-Vivo, nun amindumaj bestoj
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 16:24:44 GMT

In article <9208181907.AA03830@mdceng> kuncej@mdceng.UUCP (Jeffrey J. Kunce) writes:
...
>>>Yep, and how come the monster of Loch Ness is coming into the papers
>>>every year.
>..
>>        La frazo "is coming into" signifas (en neformala Angla) "sxpruci
>>        spermon sur/en". 
>
>Kevin, what's the point here? Are you really concerened about 
>misunderstanding, 
>or are you trying to embarass someone? If you're just trying to inject some
>humor into the thread, fine - it's cute. 

	Nu, la temo estis tre peza. 

>But in my opinion, it's in bad taste
>to poke fun at a [perceived] language slip in a multi-lingual group 
>like s.c.e.,
>especially in a manner which could be seen as humiliating.

	Mi certe ne deziras humuligi S-ro Slootmans.  Liaj posxtoj
	ofte amuzas min.  Iam, kiam mi parolas Esperante, mi pensas
	ke mi parolas inter la "familio" do mi kredas (eble erare)
	ke cxiu komprenas ke mi fundamente estimas ilin ecx se mi
	parolas petole.

>
>  --Jeff     kuncej@mocons.gov
>
>P.S. - If the above really is your first interpretation of "coming into",
>maybe you need to find a friend to help you relieve some of that tension. :-) 

	Hmmm, ... kia muziko placxas al vi?

--
------
"I've always thought of Boston traffic as Brownian motion with
evil intent."  -- Don Coolidge coolidge@speaker.sgi.com
From: dchung@efi.com (Daniel Chung)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: [gazeto] fia artikolo en gazeto
Date: 12 Aug 92 20:40:13 GMT


     [English translation is available.] -- C^i tiu paragrafo estas
sengrava al Esperanto-parolantoj.

     Iu Esperanta gazeto havis maldecan senvestan desegnaj^on de Gorbac^ev (?)
en kovrilo.  Mi jam sendis plendan leteron al la redaktisto.  Tiu gazeto
havas artikolon pri rakonto tia, kie elpensisto elpensis iun mas^inon,
kiu ekscitigas sekson al viroj ("vir'" kaj "virin'" estu apartaj radikoj).
C^u iu jam sendis plendan leteron al la redaktisto?  (Mi ne diris la
nomon de la gazeto.  Se vi abonas, vi scias.))

					*Zhong* Qi-Iao, Usono
From: KNAPPEN@VKPMZJ.KPH.UNI-MAINZ.DE (J%org Knappen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: La sufikso -ab-
Date: 16 Aug 92 18:30:58 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet
X-Unparsable-Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 20:18 GMT +0100

Kie devenas la sufikso -ab-? La deveno de -i^c- estas klare al mi, kaj 
-ang- de "jang" min ^satas. Sed -ab- mi neniam estas legita.

^Gis, J"org Knappen.
From: dfkihueg@rz.uni-sb.de ("Edmund Grimley-Evans")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: "Kio okazus, se ^ciu parolus E-on?"
Date: 17 Aug 92 17:06:47 GMT
Article-I.D.: sbusol.9208171706.AA10021
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

> 3. Cxu iu scias kiel nun fartas la jugoslavaj samideanoj ?

Legu la bonegan eseon "El la rifu^gejo" de Spomenka ^STIMEC en MONATO
1992:5!

Edmund
From: KNAPPEN@VKPMZJ.KPH.UNI-MAINZ.DE (J%org Knappen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Re: gender marking
Date: 15 Aug 92 23:12:31 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet
X-Unparsable-Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 01:02 GMT +0100

It is in fact a universal of _natlangs_ that if a gender distinction 
exists, the male gender falls in the unmarked class and the female in the 
marked class (having an additional pre- or suffix, being often disregarded in 
mixed groups, etc).

For conlangs, there are some projects which try to be more gender symmetric 
(Bruce mentions three of them) or even with the female gender as default 
(Laadan by Suzette Elgin)\footnote{Laadan was not devolopped to function as 
a mean of international communication but for use in literature, if I got 
it right}. 

However, esperanto is more than hundred years old and now more like a 
living language than like a construct which could be changed easily. This 
does not prevent esperanto speakers to find ways out of the sexism dilemma,
for example the use of -i^c- as a male suffix. Such a change cannot be 
introduced by an order of any esperanto guru but must catch on the majority 
of esperanto speakers to suceed. 

Since my native language is german, I'm 
quite aware of feminist attempts to change a living language to make it 
less sexist, and some changes reached a quite large public. But the DUDEN 
editors still refuse to recognise them. 

--JK
From: gene_ledbetter@internetqm.llnl.gov (Gene Ledbetter)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Kalipso-muziko [estis Plani
Date: 18 Aug 1992 14:39:10 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
Distribution: inet
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

         Regarding:               Kalipso-muziko [estis Planita evoluo]
              
Jon Stewart-Taylor (jstewart@maunaloa.UUCP):

> Matilda! Matilda! Matilda, sxi prenis mian monon
> kaj sxi flugxis Venezuelon!

Bonege, Jon !  Finfine oni komencas kanti kalipson esperante. 8-)
From: MATCK@MVS.UDAC.UU.SE (Christer Kiselman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Re: mia / la mia
Date: 20 Aug 92 21:30:34 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet
X-Unparsable-Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 22:53 CET

Jes, "mia samlaborejano" jam enhavas la ideon de difiniteco.
La esprimo do implicas ke ni estas nur du en la laborejo, kondi^ce ke
oni ne antaue priparolis unu el la samlaborejanoj. Se ekzistas pluraj,
mi kutime diras "samlaborejano mia". Tiu esprimo estas iom pli mallonga
ol "samlaborejano de mi", au "unu el miaj samlaborejanoj".
    Christer
From: cigno@sgi.com (Kevin Walsh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Re: English is easy to learn ?????
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:49:32 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

In article <920814070414_72627.2647_DHJ35-2@CompuServe.COM> 72627.2647@compuserve.com (Don HARLOW) writes:
 ...
>An interesting remark, Steve. Are you familiar with Claude Piron's 
>"Psikologiaj reagoj kontraux Esperanto" article? Whatever the 
>distortions to which you refer may be (I didn't receive her second 
>posting), they may not be intentional, or even conscious, at all. To 
>any Esperantist who runs into this sort of thing at all often, I 
>recommend Piron's article. 

	Kie oni povas trovi tion cxi artikolon de Claude Piron? 
	Cxu vi povus kaj rajtus meti gxin sur la reto?  

--
------
"I've always thought of Boston traffic as Brownian motion with
evil intent."  -- Don Coolidge coolidge@speaker.sgi.com
From: rbh@ISIS.AZ05.BULL.COM (Ronald Harvey)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: [koresponda kurso] manko en koresponda kurso
   Date: 19 Aug 92 18:08:28 GMT
   From: dchung@efi.com  (Daniel Chung)
Date: 20 Aug 92 02:29:39 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet


	Mia samlaborejano (mia = iu mia; la mia = la sola mia; c^u ne?)
   j^us komencis lerni Esperanton per la koresponda kurso.  Tie mankas du
   punktoj:

   - La nomo de la literoj.  Rezulte, s^li literas vortojn Angle.

Bona rimarko.  Prononcoj de literoj aperas en Leciono 4, sed la nomoj
'a bo co c^o do ktp' ne aperas.  C^u vi volas aldoni alineon por g^i?

   - Komencis esti vortoj "viro" kaj "knabo", sed ne menciig^as la problemo
     de seks-*malsimetrio*, kaj rajtaj solvoj ekzemple "-ic^".

Mi tute malkonsentas.  Komencantoj lernu fundamentan utilan
Esperanton.

Estas multe da reformaj projektoj.  La via ne estas la plej bona, la
plej bezonata, ktp.  Ec^ ne estas akordo kiel solvi "seksisman
lingvaj^on".  Se lernanto FECa havus demandon pri "seksisma lingvo",
la gvidanto povus priskribi la aferon.

Komencantoj (kaj aliaj kiuj ne regas la lingvon) ne uzu lingvaj^on
aliajn ol tiujn, kiuj estas universale akceptitaj.  Ili ne havas la
sperton decidi, kiuj reformoj estas bonaj, ac^aj, nenecesaj, ktp.

Se esperantisto multe s^atas la lingvaj^on de Karolo Pic^, tiu homo
perfidus komencantojn se tiun lingvon li instruus kiel esperanton. Mi
opinias, ke la situacio samas je io ajn reformo.

Ronaldo

Ronald B. Harvey, ICN 862-5234 or + 1 (602) 862-5234; FAX:  862-6105
Internet:  R.Harvey@AZ05.BULL.COM
From: M.Kossa@frec.bull.fr (Marc Kossa)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Request
Date: 21 Aug 92 10:40:33 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

Being new to Esperanto, I'd like to know the Esperanto translation of
these two sentences :
"Do you speak Esperanto ?" and
"Thank you"
Does anyone have any literature about the history of Esperanto in
electronic form ? Could I get it ?
Thank you.
-- 
          /| /|             |  /                        
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        /     |_(_(_/ |_(_  | \_(_)_>_>_(_(_      $B9C:4!!GO3?6n(J
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Bull SA, BP 208        | E-mail    : M.Kossa@frec.bull.fr          |
| 1 Rue de Provence      | Phone (W) : 33 76397500 ext 7421          |
| 38432 Echirolles CEDEX |       (H) : Are you kidding ?             |
| FRANCE                 | Office    : FREC B1-163                   |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
"Soyez sage les enfants"                        - Robocop in "Robocop"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
From: cigno@sgi.com (Kevin Walsh)
Subject: Re: Vir- and -in-
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
Distribution: inet
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 00:15:58 GMT

In article <199208182133.AA05732@zippy> ryon@support.avalanche.com (Ryon Brame) writes:
 ...
>Mia $0.02 worth:
>
>	I really, really like the idea of having a masculine suffix 
>(preferably 'icx').  

	Jes, ankau placxas al mi "icx".  Gxi sone similas al -cxjo.
	-njo/ino kaj -cxjo/icxo havas memoreblan simetrion:

	patrino/panjo	patricxo/pacxjo


	Yes, I also like "-icx."  It sounds similar to -cxjo. 
	-njo/ino kaj -cxjo/icxo have a symmetry I can remember. 

	patrino		patricxo	
	(pah TREE no)	(pah TREE cho)
	(mother)	(father)

	panjo		pacxjo		
	(PAN yo)	(PAH cho)	
	(mama)		(papa)
--
------
"I've always thought of Boston traffic as Brownian motion with
evil intent."  -- Don Coolidge coolidge@speaker.sgi.com
From: slootman@EVS2.UIA.AC.BE (Wim Slootmans)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: RE: Ido-Vivo
Date: 17 Aug 92 09:02:49 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

> From: Bruce Robert Gilson <EZ-as-pi@CUP.PORTAL.COM>
> 
> Pierre Jelenc says "Ido is dead/"
> Then how come I get Ido-Vivo in the
> mail three times a year?

Yep, and how come the monster of Loch Ness is coming into the papers
every year.

Almost every idea just has its people, who are pro or contra.
Esperanto, Ido, Vegeteranism, Pacifism or even Fascism and Nazism.
The difference between the ideas is the number of them.
As for now, you got to face the fact that there is a lot more activity
in Esperanto-world than in the Ido-world.  Besides three times a year
isn't that much for a magazine which probably is supposed to be the
backbone for this Ido-world.

(by the way: is Ido-vivo an Ido or an Esperanto-word???)

Wim Slootmans
slootmans@uia.ac.be
Organization: Cntr for Design of Educational Computing, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 11:14:36 -0400 
From: Bruce Sherwood <bas+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Esperanto and fluency
Distribution: inet

Barry Crown intelligently raises a vital point of intense discussion
among thinking Esperanto speakers:  what to do about the tendency to
import large numbers of European roots in order to "enrich" Esperanto.

Claude Piron and Fenando de Diego are perhaps the best exponents of two
utterly opposing ideological views on what Esperanto is and can be. 
Piron has argued strongly in favor of exploiting the inherent
possibilities of Esperanto to the hilt, with words such as "senigi" and
"malhava."  He has also argued strongly against the mania for
introducing more and more European roots when in fact Esperanto could
natively deal with the concepts, using a small but cleverly exploited
vocabulary.  His book "La Bona Lingvo" is the fullest expression of his
point of view.

Piron's view is similar to the "purist" view taken by many language
planners, but with a special internationalist twist.  His views are
heavily influenced by his knowledge of Chinese, which does quite nicely
by native coinage rather than by wholesale importation of European
roots.  He has worked with the World Health Organization in China, and
he is struck by the fact that in Chinese "heart attack" and "yellow
fever" are called "heart attack" and "yellow fever" even by doctors
(compare Esperanto "koratako" and "infarkto" or English "heart attack"
and "myocardial infarction").  He stresses the social and class
advantages of this more accessible but not necessarily "impoverished"
talk.

I utterly agree with Piron's point of view, to which I obviously can't
do full justice here (read his book!).  I believe that a majority of
thoughtful Esperantists largely share Piron's view, though I have no
proof.

As Crown says, de Diego just published an empassioned attack on Piron's
position.  While I completely disagree with de Diego's vision (or lack
thereof?) of what Esperanto is and could be, I do at least commend his
brutal honesty, for he comes right out and says that Esperanto is and is
to be the exclusive property of European culture and must not have
autonomy, and certainly must not "forsake" its European roots, roots
which Piron sees can fruitfully and joyfully be outgrown and surpassed.

For de Diego, the ONLY valid way to derive expressiveness and nuance in
Esperanto is from a large (and exclusively European) vocabulary.  I
assert that Piron has shown that there is another and better way to
derive expressiveness and nuance in Esperanto, by clever exploitation of
the unusual and non-European latent tendencies of the language.  And I
would agree with Piron that the de Diego's in the Esperanto community
have a narrow, even cramped view of what Esperanto can be, and that they
are toadying to the great god of European culture, outside of which for
them all is darkness and barbarism.  Esperanto doesn't need the
"enrichment" de Diego prescribes.  De Diego and his followers need to
have their view of Esperanto and of the world enriched beyond the
constraints of European culture.

Bruce
From: slootman@EVS2.UIA.AC.BE (Wim Slootmans)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Re: mia / la mia
Date: 21 Aug 92 08:06:16 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

> Jes, "mia samlaborejano" jam enhavas la ideon de difiniteco.
> La esprimo do implicas ke ni estas nur du en la laborejo, kondi^ce ke
> oni ne antaue priparolis unu el la samlaborejanoj. Se ekzistas pluraj,
> mi kutime diras "samlaborejano mia". Tiu esprimo estas iom pli mallonga
> ol "samlaborejano de mi", au "unu el miaj samlaborejanoj".
>     Christer

Tamen, tia uzo ne ^sajnas ^gusta al mi, ^car mi lernis ke vortvico
estas libera en esperanto.  Do oni povas samsignife uzi "la granda domo"
(kiel ekzemple en la angla) a`u "la domo granda" (kiel ekzemple en la
franca).  
Tial "mia samlaborejano" kaj "samlaborejano mia" ne povas havi malsaman
signifon!

Wim Slootmans
slootmans@uia.ac.be
From: dfkihueg@RZ.UNI-SB.DE ("Edmund Grimley-Evans")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Komputilaj katalogoj de Esperanto-literaturo
Date: 12 Aug 92 11:31:27 GMT
Distribution: inet
Organization: The Internet

Pro la helpema informo de Jens KARLSSON mi nun scias pri du tiaj:

(1) "Universitaet des Saarlandes": telnet paula.rz.uni-sb.de

(2) "University of California": telnet melvyl.ucop.edu

Amba^u estas katalogoj de universitataj bibliotekoj. La unua enhavas
^c. 700 Esperanto-librojn, la dua ^c. 450.

Se iu scias pri aliaj, bonvole skribu al mi!

Cetere, Kalifornianoj certe devus scii, ke multaj modernaj
Esperanto-libroj estas haveblaj de la tiea universitata biblioteko,
ekzemple *ses* libroj de Johan VALANO... Esploru mem!

Edmund

=======================================================================
Edmund GRIMLEY EVANS                              dfkihueg@rz.uni-sb.de
=======================================================================
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 11:29:47 -0400 
From: Bruce Sherwood <bas+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Interlingua
	<1992Aug20.114139.23391@news.columbia.edu>
Distribution: inet

Moreover, UEA provides several different flavors of membership with
differing costs, including discounts for young people.  It has
essentially no outside funding and must pay its own way.

Bruce
From: urban@sideshow.jpl.nasa.gov (Michael Urban)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.esperanto
Subject: Re: [Anglolingvo/English] easy to learn English?
Date: 14 Aug 92 15:33:09 GMT
Reply-To: urban@sideshow.jpl.nasa.gov (Michael Urban)
Distribution: inet
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA

In article <199208141048.AA01999@rand.org> LAWCROWN@NUSVM.bitnet (Barry Crown) writes:

> Jespersen was indeed a linguist, and I believe that he was quite famous in
> his time.  However, he seems to have been totally ignorant of Chinese.  The
> Chinese use exactly the same system of counting numbers as the Esperantists,
> without showing any signs of confusion.


There is a toy Unix program running around somewhere that converts
numerals to text, with assorted configuration files to govern the
conversion to a variety of languages, incluing English, Mandarin, and
Esperanto.  The length of these files can be taken as a sort of crude
metric of the complexity of a language's counting system.  Mandarin
had the shortest file, Esperanto the second shortest (I believe the
distinction between forms like `dekdu' and `dudek du' was the
additional complexity.), and English was, if I recall aright, one of
the longest.
	Mike Urban

	urban@cobra.jpl.nasa.gov