HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 20:28:41 -0400 
From: Anthony Russell Rosania <ar2j+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Overhead setting...
 <JPY.92Apr13093946@mendelssohn.cs.columbia.edu>
	<92104.083224YOUNG@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>
Distribution: na

Excerpts from netnews.rec.sport.volleyball: 13-Apr-92 Re: Overhead
setting... Charles Young@SLACVM.SLA (646)


> The ball cannot come to rest!!??
> How does the ball change direction completely, going down to going up,
> without coming to rest? Yes, rule books do say stupid things like
> that, which really means the ref will decide. As always.


YES!!! RIGHT ON!! CHARLES Gets the commonsense award!!! Great setters
often hold the ball for a ridiculous amounts of time, they get away with
it because they are good. As long as a set is great( i.e. a measure of
this can be the amount of spin and still is the rule some places) you
can get away with more.

						Ant
From: skb@ute-cmi.ctcpc.cypress.com (Scott Butler, MN, x5036, (612) 894-6562)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Outdoor nets
Date: 15 Apr 92 19:50:24 GMT
Reply-To: skb@ute-cmi.ctcpc.cypress.com
Organization: Cypress Semiconductor Inc.

I have read enough promotional material!  What is your experience
with outdoor net systems?  

My use will be grass, not sand.  I would like comments about:
   durrability,
   ease of:
      setup
      take down
      carrying and storage
   net play
   misc. info/experience.

Also I want out-of-bounds marking lines, so if they don't come with
the system....

Any info is apreciated.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Scott Butler			 	Telephone : (612) 851-5036   
Cypress Semiconductor Inc.	 	Fax       : (612) 851-5199
2401 E. 86th Street		 	E-Mail    : skb@cypress.com   
Bloomington,MN 55425, USA
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: mkrogers@amherst.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Clarification on double touch
Date: 7 Apr 92 15:15:41 GMT
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst, MA.

In article <594@grivel.une.oz.au>, plaplagn@metz.une.oz.au (Patrick Laplagne) writes:
> [While setting] you finger the ball the wrong way and it spins backwards
> instead. Some people argue that this sort of thing automatically
> qualifies as a double touch, others that it is up to the umpire's
> assessment. Who is correct? For my money, I think that some botched
> sets look legal all the same and that it is stupid to call them a foul.

This shouldn't *automatically* be a fault.  A double contact should be
called if the ref sees the setter contact the ball twice.  Another
possible call is a lift.  If contact with the ball is not brief or the
setter flings, throws (etc.) the ball with his fingers, it is a fault.
For instance, a ref usually does not allow the ball to roll along the
fingers.  A lot of spin does not necessarily mean the set was illegal.
On the other hand, it almost always does.

	-mike rogers
	mkr@cs.amherst.edu
From: hyu@eng.umd.edu (Henry K. Yu)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Power Volleyball - the ultimate serves
Date: 8 Apr 92 03:46:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: eng.1992Apr08.034652.19189
Organization: College of Engineering, Maryversity von Uniland, College Park
Originator: hyu@frob.eng.umd.edu


In article <1992Apr8.002342.25625@spd.analog.com>, gordon.cheung@spd.analog.com (gordon.cheung@analog.com) writes:
>    I've been reading my 'Power Volleyball' book lately, lot's of
>stats and pictures and words. I love the book. In the chapter of
>serving, the author suggested that the ultimate serves are:
>
>1. Side-spin serve ( one that curves)
>2. Jumping Floater
>    
>    I can't quite picture how a jumping floater works. I've done it
>accidentally here and there, and for me, jumping floater is 
>equivelent to 'OUT'. Did anybody actually try this and has some success.
>
>    Then the author pointed out that the rule book does not specify that the
>server has to toss his/her own ball. What if a teammate can toss for the 
>server? 

Can someone verify this?  More specifically, who can toss the ball when it is
being served?  Can your teammate, audience, coach, etc. do it?
Or, of course, only the server can do it.

>        Think of the implications, the jump server can get consistant tosses
>from the setter, extra momentum can be gain off the rebound of an incoming toss, 
>or ...Hmm ... let me go home and check my rulebook.
>-- 
>****************************************************************************
> Gordon Cheung  INTERNET: gordon.cheung@analog.com
>      7E         UUNET   : uunet!analog.com!gordon.cheung
>      7X          MAIL    : 3 Technology Way,Analog Devices.Norwood,MA 02062
>****************************************************************************
From: rmp@crashnburn.Eng.Sun.COM (Richard Pottorff)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Volleyball Doubles Clinic - San Jose, CA
Date: 16 Apr 92 20:34:13 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: crashnburn

In article <SWFC.92Apr16122220@mendelssohn.cs.columbia.edu> swfc@cs.columbia.edu writes:

There have been recent postings on v-ball clinics and camps.  What do
they teach at these events and how much better is it than playing with
good v-ball players?

Shu-Wie F Chen	             Columbia University Department of Computer Science
swfc@cs.columbia.edu	     500 W120th Street, New York, NY 10027


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


What good are camps and clinics, you ask.  What good is school K-12; and 
college, undergrad thru post-doc? I ask rhetorically.

Well, one benefit is they all accomplish a transfer of funds, usually from
the student to the teacher, :-) but there are other benefits.

A lot of low-level players think they are hot stuff, and resist any and all
attempts of teaching by higher level players.  Even if a good player comes
to play at a low level event, and tries to help people improve their game,
(s)he'll quickly discover massive amounts of resentment and give up.

Plus, good players tend not to like to play with much lower level people.
Its no challenge, and out of control players could easily hurt them. Also,
it can be very frustrating.

Camps and clinics tend to attract the people who are willing to learn, and
are open to criticsm, at least from a recognized authority.   And the
instructors at these camps usually have the highest credentials.

Probably the most important thing is that you can accomplish the same amount
of improvement in half an hour of drills that you might see in 2 hours of
games.  I say might, because you might get to touch the ball no times in
those two hours.  Plus, the instructors are there to give you instant
feedback, etc.

I took an Adult Sports Foundation volleyball camp several years ago to learn
the 3-step hitting approach.  The coach of the team I was on told me I was
doing when I was done what he had been trying to show me all along, but I'm
still not convinced.  Also, I learned how to set, the technique that
is used by high level players and lower level players tend to call catch 
and throws; but when I do it right, the ball comes out cleanly with no
spin, and goes where I want it to.

When I get some spare cash, I plan to take another camp, I figure I'll
probably learn at least as much this time as I did last, and I've moved
from a beginninng player to at least advanced intermediate in the meantime.

I've been taking an advanced class at Foothill for at least a year, and
thanks to Liz my passing is drastically improved, I'm starting to mash the
ball on my hits, and now she's picking on my serve.  If I ever get an A
in her class I think I'll be ready for A level play :-).

Ramblin'
From: todmh@mars.lerc.nasa.gov (Darcie Hammer)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Yelling free
Date: 16 Apr 92 19:12:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: mars.16APR199215125566
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <29E934B3.426A@deneva.sdd.trw.com>, tlennan@peterpan.sdd.trw.com writes...
>In article <1992Apr12.195427.6179@bsu-ucs.uucp>, 01dmcrumb@bsu-ucs.uucp writes:
>> In article <1992Apr7.193839.11702@kodak.kodak.com>, grobbins@Kodak.COM (Gretchen Mittelstaedt) writes:
>> > 
>> > Just a short, simple question:  When is it appropriate to yell "free",
>> > and is there a specific person that should be yelling it??
>> 
 [...]
> 
>Hmmmm...  I was taught that a "free ball" is any ball which is is coming over
>the net after a fore-arm pass, but in common usage it is any ball which isn't
>spiked.
> 
 [...]
> 
>I believe that only one person, the setter, should yell "free" since he/she
>must decide whether or not to "release" to the net - everybody always does
>what the setter says, right?  At least they do if they want to get set ;)
> 
IMHO a free ball is any ball that you're better off covering alot of court
than alot of net.  It's tough to block a hitter that's 15 feet off the net
since a small change in where they're facing results in a big change
in where the ball crosses the net.  Not that it can't be done, it's just
that all 5'6" of me doesn't "windshield wiper" very well.

We usually have the setter yelling "free" first, kind of an "I'm releasing
and going to the net, so get your slow hitter butts back and pass something",
but as soon as we hear "free" we all say it.  But we're just vocal that way.

darcie

p.s. did I ever tell you about my yellow card for yelling "free" and "angle"
during a game?? Apparantly it's unsportsmanlike to say (and I quote) that
"all of her hit's are freebies, and she has no angle".

Hmmmmm.  Damn rude of me.
From: 01dmcrumb@bsu-ucs.uucp
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Yelling free
Date: 13 Apr 92 00:54:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: bsu-ucs.1992Apr12.195427.6179

In article <1992Apr7.193839.11702@kodak.kodak.com>, grobbins@Kodak.COM (Gretchen Mittelstaedt) writes:
> 
> Just a short, simple question:  When is it appropriate to yell "free",
> and is there a specific person that should be yelling it??
> 
> 
> Gretchen Mittelstaedt
> Eastman Kodak Co.
> grobbins@kodak.com

I think that not just one person should yell "free". For example here at Ball
St. Univ (muncie In.) sometimes when just one person yells free, the middle
blocker will sometimes go up for the block... that usually will lead to the 
opposing to "tool" right of his/her hands...
Now if everyone is yelling "free" then everybody can move back and run an
effective transition...
Don't you think?
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: u2417@sunc2.cs.uiuc.edu (Mike Schneider)
Subject: DID YOU OR THE NET TOUCH WHILE BLOCKING?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 17:33:13 GMT

I'm sure this has happened to anyone who blocks often.  
You are blocking, and your opponent spikes the ball hard,
and it hits the top of the net and bounces back at him.
However, it also happens to have hit *you*, which your
opponent doesn't realize, and his team has 3 more hits!

I've thought about this recently and decided that when I
touched the ball in this way, I would not say so until
after the ball was played (since we have no ref).  Why should
I give this info to the other team during a play?

Then this happened during practice.  The ball bounced off the net
back to the other team, and I had touched it (just a bit).  One player
passed it, but someone else was saying "did you touch it" and of course
I didn't say anything.  The next person just caught the ball
and said "He didn't touch it."  Then *I* said "Aha!  I did touch
it, and you should never let a ball go until you are absolutely
sure it is dead." (or something like this).  Of course, this person
that caught the ball is a friend of mine with an attitude and
he got really pissed at me when this happens, which is typical
of him since he hates to be wrong.

I'm just wondering...how does anyone else feel about this?


-- 
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!! Mike Schneider schneid@jerry.stat.uiuc.edu !!
!! University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign !!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: ericding@athena.mit.edu (Eric J. Ding)
Subject: Re: DID YOU OR THE NET TOUCH WHILE BLOCKING?
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 20:21:10 GMT

In article <1992Apr9.173313.11501@sunb10.cs.uiuc.edu>, u2417@sunc2.cs.uiuc.edu 
(Mike Schneider) writes:
[stuff on accidental touch during a block deleted]

|> Then this happened during practice.  The ball bounced off the net
|> back to the other team, and I had touched it (just a bit).  One player
|> passed it, but someone else was saying "did you touch it" and of course
|> I didn't say anything.  The next person just caught the ball
|> and said "He didn't touch it."  Then *I* said "Aha!  I did touch
|> it, and you should never let a ball go until you are absolutely
|> sure it is dead." (or something like this).  Of course, this person
|> that caught the ball is a friend of mine with an attitude and
|> he got really pissed at me when this happens, which is typical
|> of him since he hates to be wrong.
|> 
|> I'm just wondering...how does anyone else feel about this?
|> 

Well, Mike, I'm just a wanna-be setter with a so-so vertical, so you don't see
me going up to block like a monster very often.  But nevertheless, I'd say I do
have an opinion - be honest.  During the game, I've often heard, the ref/ump is
without a doubt authority, so if nobody calls it, it's not a penalty - that's 
how it is with even the most flagrant penalty...

But if you're practicing, or playing a self-refereed game, BE HONEST.  If it 
bounces off the net and goes out (or rather off of you), tell them.  Don't go
shouting at the top of your lungs, "I TOUCHED IT, GO AHEAD AND PLAY IT!!!", but
don't hide it to save yourself a point...

Just my own opinion, flame someone else if you disagree.. :-)

Eric Ding

--
"I wish I could really set..."
-- 
450 Memorial Drive H424                                           (617) 225-9424
Cambridge, MA 02139                                      ericding@athena.mit.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: jpy@mendelssohn.cs.columbia.edu (John P Yu)
Subject: Re: DID YOU OR THE NET TOUCH WHILE BLOCKING?
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 15:30:25 GMT

In article <1992Apr9.173313.11501@sunb10.cs.uiuc.edu> u2417@sunc2.cs.uiuc.edu (Mike Schneider) writes:

>  I'm sure this has happened to anyone who blocks often.  
>  You are blocking, and your opponent spikes the ball hard,
>  and it hits the top of the net and bounces back at him.
>  However, it also happens to have hit *you*, which your
>  opponent doesn't realize, and his team has 3 more hits!

>  I've thought about this recently and decided that when I
>  touched the ball in this way, I would not say so until
>  after the ball was played (since we have no ref).  Why should
>  I give this info to the other team during a play?

>  Then this happened during practice.  The ball bounced off the net
>  back to the other team, and I had touched it (just a bit).  One player
>  passed it, but someone else was saying "did you touch it" and of course
>  I didn't say anything.  The next person just caught the ball
>  and said "He didn't touch it."  Then *I* said "Aha!  I did touch
>  it, and you should never let a ball go until you are absolutely
>  sure it is dead." (or something like this).  Of course, this person
>  that caught the ball is a friend of mine with an attitude and
>  he got really pissed at me when this happens, which is typical
>  of him since he hates to be wrong.

>  I'm just wondering...how does anyone else feel about this?

   It's sort of CHEAP to win points this way.  Personally, I
   find that to be bad sportsmanship - in un-refed games, it's
   especially distasteful.  I'm sure you've played in games
   with one or two guys that always rake the net when they
   block and swear they never touched it, or the guy who's
   always calling other people for "hands" and never calls it
   on himself.  You probably seen games where every shot on
   the line is disputed - sometimes every defender calls it
   out, except the person who got beat.

   Usually, I find that the people who do this are rec-level
   hackers or basically mediocre players who are A-player
   wanna-be's.

   Even if your opponents stoop this low, it doesn't mean
   you should.  Since this occurred in practice, it could
   get pretty dismal if you never got an honest call.
   Win because you played better, NOT because you suckered
   someone.  Rubbing it in be going "Aha" is kinda in bad
   taste too.

   Flaming off,
   /jpy



--
===============================================================================
The rogue warrior |.,..@....V.O*L/L)!?...EY.]+#####+B.A.....LL.....U..S.A*....|
===============================================================================
From: harbour@vf.jsc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Spin (or lack of...)
Date: 15 Apr 92 03:45:02 GMT
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Flight Center

In article <2151@cypress.UUCP>, skb@ute-cmi.ctcpc.cypress.com (Scott Butler) writes:
> I hope spelling is not a prerequisite to being part of this group!  I am
> hopeless without my spelling checker.
> 
>> > In the case of a volleyball, a float serve has an added
>> > effect.  The ball surface on impact is pushed out of round.  As the ball
>> > is moving the surface ripples and undulates while returning to it's prefered
>> > shape.
>>
>> As was pointed out by another poster, this undulation effect has virtually
>> no effect on the path of the ball, since it is damped almost immediately.
> 
> Perhaps I am incorect, but I was informed that to the human eye the appearence
> of the ball resumes it's round shape quickly, but that even small undulations
> will cause a mesurable effect in a hard hit serve.  And the faster the ball
> crosses the net, the more undulations left undamped?
> 
> Scott

As a matter of fact, everything counts to a certain degree, even local
gravitational variations :-).  Seriously thougth, the fact that a non-
rotating sphere is aerodynamically unstable is the primary cause of the
strange things that a float serve does.  A while back in school (EGADS!
I might have actually learnt something in school!?) we did an experiment
with a cylinder in a wind tunnel.  It was pretty amazing how just a little
spin evened out the airflow.  The experiment graphically displayed why
floaters move randomly and why spinners curve in a predictable manner.
-- 
Jeff Harbour -- harbour@vf.jsc.nasa.gov -- (713) 483-5808
Lockheed Engineering and Sciences Company -- NASA Johnson Space Center
All comments reflect my personnal opinion (.sig void where prohibited by law)
From: grobbins@Kodak.COM (Gretchen Mittelstaedt)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Yelling free
Keywords: free
Date: 7 Apr 92 19:38:39 GMT
Reply-To: grobbins@Kodak.COM (Gretchen Mittelstaedt)
Organization: Eastman Kodak Co., Rochester NY


Just a short, simple question:  When is it appropriate to yell "free",
and is there a specific person that should be yelling it??


Gretchen Mittelstaedt
Eastman Kodak Co.
grobbins@kodak.com
From: douglis@MITL.COM (Fred Douglis)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: DID YOU OR THE NET TOUCH WHILE BLOCKING?
Date: 9 Apr 92 22:13:39 GMT
Organization: Matsushita Information Technology Laboratory

u2417@sunc2.cs.uiuc.edu (Mike Schneider) writes:

>I've thought about this recently and decided that when I
>touched the ball in this way, I would not say so until
>after the ball was played (since we have no ref).  Why should
>I give this info to the other team during a play?

Because in a game without a ref, you're relied upon to fill the role
of the ref.  Even in a competive game, you should play the best volleyball
you can and not rely on misleading the competition.

>Then this happened during practice.  The ball bounced off the net
>back to the other team, and I had touched it (just a bit).  One player
>passed it, but someone else was saying "did you touch it" and of course
>I didn't say anything.  The next person just caught the ball
>and said "He didn't touch it."  Then *I* said "Aha!  I did touch
>it, and you should never let a ball go until you are absolutely
>sure it is dead." (or something like this).  Of course, this person
>that caught the ball is a friend of mine with an attitude and
>he got really pissed at me when this happens, which is typical
>of him since he hates to be wrong.


>I'm just wondering...how does anyone else feel about this?

I think *you* are the one with the attitude!!  

Since you posted this query, I gather you are open to advice.  My
advice is to try and make volleyball fun, and that means you shouldn't
be intentionally spiteful.
-- 
Fred Douglis
Matsushita Information Technology Laboratory  | Email: douglis@mitl.com
182 Nassau Street,			      | Phone: +1 609 497-4600
Princeton, NJ 08542 USA 		      | Fax:   +1 609 497-4013
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: bruno@convex.csd.uwm.edu (Bruno Wolff III)
Subject: Honor calls
Originator: bruno@convex.csd.uwm.edu
Organization: University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Computing Services Division
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 22:04:56 GMT

My opinion on honor calls is that if you are playing without refs each player
should make calls regarding their own faults. I don't that you need to tell
the other team about touches (on a possible block) immediately. They are
responsible for continuing play until told by you to stop.
When playing without "real" officals (e.g. player ref'd tournaments and many
leagues) some calls should be made to help the officals. Basicly to include
things they didn't see. I prefer to let them decide what is a ball handling
error though.
When playing for real with real officals you should play to help your team
win. This means that you should call "NO" even if you do touch a ball if you
think trying to deceive the ref is worth fooling your own team (because no one
will have a play on the ball anyway). "Real" officals should make calls based
on what they see not what the players tell them happened.