HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: les@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (Les Earnest)
Subject: Re: pros in olympics
Organization: Computer Science Department,  Stanford University.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 06:32:01 GMT

stigmata@athena.mit.edu (???) writes:
>this is my personal opinion, but i don't really think pros
>should be allowed to ride in the olympics.

Unfortunately, you are about 100 years late with this idea -- pros
have been participating in nearly all olympic sports from the
beginning.  Never mind that we call them "amateur" -- they make their
living from participation in the sport.  In addition to these
professional amateurs, there are also amateur amateurs (who generally
don't make it to the Olympics), amateur professionals (i.e. athletes
who hold professional licenses but can't make a living from their
sport; they too will not make it to the Olympics) and professional
professionals, who are now beginning to appear in the Olympics.

The only thing that is changing is a reduction in hypocracy.
--
Les Earnest                                  Phone:  415 941-3984
Internet: Les@cs.Stanford.edu              USMail: 12769 Dianne Drive
UUCP: . . . decwrl!cs.Stanford.edu!Les         Los Altos Hills, CA 94022
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: hammonds@riacs.edu (Steve Hammond)
Subject: RESULTS: Stage 6 - Womens's Tour
Organization: RIACS, NASA Ames Research Center
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 09:14:40 GMT


On Thursday August 20th, Van Moorsel (Netherlands) took over the lead 
in the "Tour Cycliste Feminin".  This 6th stage was 107Km and the final
sprint was won by Alison Sydor (Canada).  Even here in Toulouse, the
news is pretty brief.  Today's stage is 131Km.


Results of the sixth stage:

1. Alison Sydor (Can)               2h47' 21''  38.47k/h  15 sec bonus
2. Leontien Van Moorsel (Nethlds)   s.t.                  10 sec bonus
3. Aiga Zagorska (Lith.)            s.t.                   5 sec bonus
4. Luzia Zberg (Sui)
5. Kathy Lynch (NZ)
6. Heidi Van de Vijver (Bel)
7. Alexandra Kaliaseva (Rus)      all at the same time
8. Catherine Marsal (Fr)
9. Louisa Jenkins (USA)
...
12 Jeannie Longo (FR)            


General Classification: (after six stages)

1. Leontien Van Moorsel (Nethlds)   14h09'15''
2. Jeannie Longo (FR)                 @    7''
3. Heidi Van de Vijver (Bel)          @ 1'34''
4. Kathy Lynch (NZ)                   @ 2'01''
5. Alison Sydor (Can)                 @ 2'13''
6. Catherine Marsal (Fr)              @ 2'58''
7. Luzia Zberg (Sui)                  @ 3'08''
8. Maria-Paola Turcutto (Ita)         @ 4'16''
9. Louisa Jenkins (USA)               @ 4'30''
10 Alexandra Kaliaseva (Rus)          @ 4'40''



     Steve Hammond
           hammond@orion.cerfacs.fr


-- 

 Steve Hammond   *   RIACS   *   NASA Ames Research Center
    phone: (415)604-3962    e-mail:hammonds@riacs.edu
From: RADDAMSW@LIVERPOOL.AC.UK
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Cyclocross tires, anyone?
Date: 18 Aug 92 09:00:57 GMT
Organization: University of Liverpool

>  I'm hoping that the 'cyclers of the net will have some recommendations
>on tires for a couple of not-quite-cyclocross bikes. I'm thinking of
>putting Avocet's Cross tire on my Bridgestone RB-T, probably in
>its 35C width.
>
>  Also, one of my housemates is searching for a narrow 700 knobby tire
>which can be inflated to 100 PSI+.

A friend of mine has Tioga Greyhounds on his 'cross bike, and they're the most
aggressive 'cross tyres I've seen. The tread is basically a reduced MtB tread.
A series of split-arrow-heads (the only way I can describe them!) forms the
central tread, and there are large side-blocks to give stability when cornering
in mud. He loves them, but they aren't that easy to get hold of in the UK. Your
mileage may vary. These are around 32mm wide if I remember rightly and he's had
them up to 100 psi for riding on the road. He has 'em at around 60-70 off road.

Steve JW. (MadBritishMountainBikerAndMaterialsScientist)
From: pablo@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Pablo A Iglesias)
Subject: Panniers
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 16:06:40 GMT

My girlfriend and I are planning a ten day touring trip and are
looking at some Panniers.  Could anyone out there comment on the
Panniers offered in the Nashbar catalogue?  These are the Nashbar
Deluxe Rear panniers.  Any other suggestions would also be
appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Pablo
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Pablo Iglesias                          Phone : (410) 516-6026
Department of Electrical Engineering    Fax   : (410) 516-5566
The Johns Hopkins Universityity         email : pi@ruth.ece.jhu.edu
Baltimore, MD 21218

-- 
Pablo
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: bgeer@javelin.sim.es.com (Bob Geer)
Subject: Re: Trispokes
Reply-To: bgeer@javelin.sim.es.com
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corporation
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:57:22 GMT

amiller@ALMADEN.IBM.COM (Alex Miller) writes:
>Want to buy a rear air spoiler for a Porsche 911 Turbo that costs
>more than a complete Yugo?  I've heard it makes the car look good.

I'll bet the spoiler lasts longer, tho.

Oooops...wrong newsgroup...Sooooorrrrrry!

-- 
<> Bob `Bear' Geer <>   bgeer@beorn.sim.es.com     (this *should* work)   <>
<>     cola-zombie <>   speaking only for myself, one of my many tricks   <>
<> Salt Lake City, <>    "We must strive to be more than we are, Lal."    <>
<>          Ootah  <>           -- Cmdr. Data, learning schmaltz          <>
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Gas subsidies and taxes (was Re: Bicycle Paths
Date: 19 Aug 92 04:54:57 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1992Aug19.012047.18175@adobe.com> byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer) writes:
>
>I am probably the most capitalistic person you could ever
>meet.  And *that* is the reason I support gas taxes.
>Not to kill the automobile, but to end the subsidy.  Not
>to punish.  Not to put anyone into a labor camp.  Not to
>kill the automobile.
>
>I don't want the automobile killed.  I love driving my
>sports car.  But I don't think othe people should pay
>for my milage - I should.  Stealing money from those who
>use public transportation or ride bicycles to pay for
>the roads I use is not an appropriate solution to road
>construction and maintenance.

Scott, are you sure that you know what you're talking about?
Who are these people that are paying for your driving? The
13% of the American public that don't own and operate automobiles?

Maybe you don't realize that 100% of the American population uses
the roads. If it isn't for their personal transportation it certainly
is for the transportation of the goods and services that are
necessary in a population density like the world is developing.

Apples are here overnight from Washington state via those roads.
Not railroads. Vegetables from the Imperial valley are in stores
within 24 hours of being picked and packed. Even slaughterhouses
bring your steaks to you on those roads that you want to pay more
for. Emergency vehicles, war material, and yes bicycles use those
roads. 

You claim that private vehicle drivers don't pay their fair share.
So tell us how you arrive at that. There isn't a single citizen
of this country that doesn't rely completely on this highway system.
Without this highway system this technological society couldn't
exist. Even TV reporters rely on traveling these roads. In case
you didn't know it, after the earthquake, with the road system
pretty much unuseable TV coverage was very poor until roads got
opened.

Increased taxation means only one thing, increased spending. Your
idea that government can somehow resist spending $2 for every $1
they have coming in certainly isn't backed up with any historical
evidence. So you are a dreamer of the first magnitude if you
think that they are going to change any time before the
economy collapses.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: akkana@netcom.com (Akkana Peck)
Subject: Re: Chain Cleaners
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 04:18:14 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1683B803.RONEAL@lexmark.com> RONEAL@lexmark.com writes:
>to purchase one of the currently available chain cleaners, which one is the
>better of the two - Park's chain cleaner or the Vetta Chain Cleaner?  Or,

I bought the Park cleaner because it costs slightly less and I was in a
cheap mood that night.  The second or third time I used it, the tabs
which hold the wire that's supposed to hold the two pieces together broke
off.  I can still use the chain cleaner, but I have to hold it together
with one hand, turn the cranks with the other hand and press the
solvent-release button with the other hand -- oh, wait, that's three
hands.  Awkward.  I should have paid the extra couple bucks for the
Vetta, which looks like it also cleans the derailleur rollers and is
probably of better overall quality.
From: clifford@marob.escc.com (Robert Clifford)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Chain Cleaners
Date: 19 Aug 92 02:02:45 GMT
	<1992Aug17.220122.10429@athena.mit.edu>
Organization: ESCC, New York City

On 17 Aug 92 22:01:22 GMT, aviator@athena.mit.edu (Joakim Karlsson) said:
  > Nntp-Posting-Host: e40-008-7.mit.edu

  > In article <4bCV02iu1e9n01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> msw10@nepenthe.as writes:
  > Citra-Solv is *much* more potent and effective...

  > Where, in general, do you find this product?  Hardware store?  Bike store?
  > Paint store?  Citra-Solv-'R-Us?  ...Joakim

In New York City, it is often found in health food stores along with
the "environmentally safe" biodegradable cleaners.

BTW I find Citra-Solv an excellent chain cleaner.

-- -- 
Robert Clifford, ESCC New York City
clifford@escc.com
From: msw10@nepenthe.as (Michael S. Wong)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Dual pivot calipers (?)
Date: 21 Aug 92 22:59:07 GMT
Reply-To: msw10@nepenthe.as
Organization: Sun Microsystems


In article 27617@hpcvusn.cv.hp.com, harry@cv.hp.com (Harry Phinney) writes:
>Michael S. Wong writes:
>: In article 714180993@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca, rlewis@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca (Robert Lewis) writes:
>: >Now as I have read it (Cycling Plus, August 1992) at least the Shimano 
>: >105 dual pivot brakes include something in the brake lever (a cam I am
>: >assuming)
>: I've never read this nor have I taken apart my 105 levers. However, this
>: is a very definite possibility, as Shimano's "Servo-Wave" mountain levers
>: do indeed operate in this manner.
>
>I have not seen any 105 levers with any sort of "Servo-Wave" mechanism,
>and I have seen many which were completely ordinary.
>
>: The Dura-Ace STI levers are matched with 
>: DA dual-pivot calipers, so I'd assume the dual-control levers have some
>: "Servo-Wave" mechanism also.
>
>Neither the Dura-Ace nor the Ultegra STI levers have any "Servo-Wave"
>mechanism.  They have a fairly ordinary front-pull aero cable routing
>with no cams involved.  The full travel of my Ultegra STI levers pulls
>0.5" of cable.  My old (~1973) Campagnolo Record brake levers pull
>0.6" of cable, but the lever travels further.  
>There is very little
>difference in mechanical advantage between these two levers.  I am
>currently using the STI levers with Campagnolo Record brake calipers.
>They work fine together.
>
>: Given the choice however, I'd use the two together.
>
>Shimano tries to give you no choice.  Try ordering the STI levers
>separately.

Shimano are ***holes. However, I have seen DuraAce levers for sale separately 
from Excell. Also, you can get dual-pivot brakes with regular, "single-control"
levers about anywhere.

>
>Harry Phinney   harry@hp-pcd.cv.hp.com

Michael Wong.
msw10@amdahl.com
From: garyw@hplsla.hp.com (Gary Wong)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Avocet 50 altitude errors (was Re: RAMROD altitude gain)
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:01:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: hplsla.6000028
Organization: HP Lake Stevens, WA


I'm convince, on average, the AV50 give compressed altitude readings between
sea-level and roughly 5000 ft.  Almost all of my riding is done between
sea-level and 2000 ft.  If I stay within this altitude range is there
a correction factor I can apply to the amount of climbing displayed by the
AV50?  For instance, if during my ride the AV50 shows I have climbed 1000 ft,
can I add 5% to get a more accurate reading (1000 + 50 = 1050 ft)?

Gary Wong
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer)
Subject: Re: Gas Taxes R Us 
Reply-To: byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer)
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Distribution: rec.bicycles
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 22:03:23 GMT

Thomas H. Kunich writes

> Now, I _do_ believe that bicycles are a good commuting
> alternative but I don't believe that forcing people to
> use them is the answer.

How about balancing the costs versus the benefits so that
there are no hidden costs and the user can properly
determine which benefits them most?  That's not using
force.  It's simply fair.

If the costs of driving were directly exposed instead of
hidden in property and sales taxes, then the (mortgage
+ driving costs) == X% of income equation would slowly
change how people live, minimizing capital wastage and
making the economy far more efficient.

> This discussion was started because of social reformers
> wanting to tax automobile users for the auto's percieved
> 'extra' cost to society. Of course they simply skip over
> or don't mention the auto's hidden benefits.

Well, the benifits are great and widespread.  They aren't
that hidden - it's fairly easy to name them, and you have
done so.  The costs *are* hidden.  Can you name the
percentages of where the costs of driving an automobile
(highway construction and maintenance, etc.) without
spending a good chunk of a day and a lot of phone calls?
Even if that information were widely available, can
someone easily recude their contribution to that system
if they reduce the benefits they recieve from it?

Example: If I sold my car, took only my bike, grew my
own food or bought locally grown or made stuff, didn't
watch TV (for those *wonderful* TV news broadcasts :-),
and otherwise reduced the benefits I recieved from the
highway system as much as possible, would it affect the
amount I was *forced* to contribute to that system?  Not
much, if at all.

If the costs of the system were recovered through a direct
usage tax (either toll roads or a gas tax) they would
cost most to those that recieved the most benefit.  Then
I could change my lifestyle to reduce that benefit and
thus reduce my cost.

What we are really after is a way of short-circuting the
game that the politicians pay with general funds, and
the natural pork-barrelling that results.  Directed taxes
are hands-off for the politicians - and the less we let
them get their hands on, the better.

Scott Byer                                   NeXTMail: byer@adobe.com
Adobe Systems Incorporated               These are *my* opinions, and  
1585 Charleston Road, P.O. Box 7900        do not necessarily reflect
Mountain View, CA 94039-7900             the opinions of my employer.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rcedv@netmbx.netmbx.de (R. Cirksena)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Carbon-bike
Date: 21 Aug 92 13:44:02 GMT
Organization: netmbx, Berlin, Germany


Newsgroups: de.rec.fahrrad
From: rcedv@netmbx.netmbx.de (R. Cirksena)
Subject: Rennrad aus Karbon
Organization: netmbx, Berlin, Germany
Distribution: de
Date: Tue, 11 Aug 1992 14:02:38 GMT


Hi.

I plan to buy a racing bike (correct english?). I know already how to ride
a bicycle :-)).
But before I do it, I have a few questions:
1. Has someone out there any experiences with a trek 2100 bike?
2. What do you think about a carbon-frame (muffed) in general?

3. I think I have to spend about 1100 ... 1700 $ for a bike. Is this a 
   realistic price? 

bye,

+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Ralf Cirksena        |_______________Email: rcedv@netmbx.UUCP___________|
|                      |        If I knew everything I don't know yet,    |
| 1000 Berlin 36       |      I whould like to forget everything I know.  |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,sun.bike
From: ward@m.cs.uiuc.edu (Christ Ward)
Subject: Re: Truck bed racks
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 20:08:48 GMT

cbrunson@vermont.East.Sun.COM (Chuck Brunson - Sun BOS Corporate Software Engineering) writes:

>I need to put a rack in the bed of my truck (Mazda B2200 pickup) and I'm
>looking for opinions as to which ones work well. The 2 I've looked at are
>the Road Gear which is just a fork mount with quick-releases that clamps
>onto the lip of the truck bed (about $35) and one from Cannondale which
>is a bar that pressure mounts across the bed and has fork mounts along
>it (about $85 but comes with 2 fork mounts).

>The Cannondale looks nice but has no security features at all (it can be
>taken out in about 15 secs!). The Road Gear ones can be screwed down so
>they'd be a bit harder to remove. In either case I'll still have to get
>a chain to secure the bikes.

>Has anyone installed either of these on a truck with a bed-liner and if
>so did you have to cut the bed-liner. Someone suggested that I use the Road
>Gear one and just screw it to the bed-liner and that it would be stable enough.
>Anyone tried that? I was told to put a strip of metal underneath to make
>it stronger. I'd also appreciate ideas on how to secure the bikes, chains etc

Well, AFOM cut a piece of plywood to fit snugly around the wheel wells and
then bolted small blocks of 2by4's which he had run old axle through.  
Total cost was nil, because it was from scrap and a bike store owner donated
the axles.  However, I'm sure this could be done for under $20.  His "rack"
hold's three bikes right now, but, I'm sure you could make it work for more
(we just needed 3 so that's what he did).  In fact when sombody at the bike
shop asked about a rack for pickups the owner brought the over to my friends
to show him what he had made.  The guy was so impressed that he ask my friend
to make him one for $50 or more, to which my friend replyed "make it yourself",
as he wasn't interested.  You'd still need some kind of lock, but, it'd be 
cheaper (total) then somthing pre-made.

ward


>---
>UPA Masters Team: Red Menace		Chuckie B.
>BACUL Team: 	  RADial ACTive 	Sun Microsystems/SunSoft Inc. BDS
>Boston Area Corporate Ultimate League 	chuck.brunson@East.Sun.COM
> You're NEVER too old to play! 		Work Phn. (508)671-0527
From: budn@hpmwtd.sr.hp.com (Bud Noren)
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 16:02:41 GMT
Subject: Re: Maximum heart rate (was Re: Heart Rate Survey: Results)
Organization: HP Santa Rosa Site (NMD MTA MWTD)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles

morris@samson.bnr.ca (Morris Bernstein) writes:

>Just out of curiosity, how do people measure their maximum heart rate.

Here's the method I've seen recommended for bicyclists:  Go out and warm up
for a while, maybe ten miles or whatever it takes.  Gradually increase
your pace until you are at the point where you can just barely sustain the
effort for a long time (anaerobic threshold).  Stay there for several
minutes.  Finally, sprint with everything you have; being in a competitive
situation will help with the motivation to give every last bit.  Obviously,
you are looking for the highest number you see on your HRM.  It helps to
be rested when you do this - if you are still trashed from a killer ride
the day before, you might not be able to get your HR up to its real max.

>Do they go over it and drop dead from heart attacks?

If it were possible to kill yourself just by pushing to the ultimate
performance limit, hoards of athletes would be dropping dead every 
day.  I think only people who have some abnormality, like a heart
condition, are in danger (barring the use of drugs) while doing this.

>I'm particularly curious about this because I recently had my VO2 max
>calculated based on 85% of my max heart rate, where max heart rate is
>220 - (my age).  This worked out to about 162.  I didn't believe the
>results, so I went and sustaind a heart rate of over 180.  What does
>this tell me?

That you, like lots of other people, don't fall into the center of the
statistical distribution.

-Bud
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles,ont.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,ott.general
From: cathyf@is.rice.edu (Catherine Anne Foulston)
Subject: Re: Car inspections..
Organization: Rice University
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 02:09:51 GMT

In article <1992Aug10.184101.946@csi.on.ca> richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin) writes:
>on this continent.  In Britain, EVERY motor vehicule has to have an
>annual inspection to be insured,

In Texas this is the other way round, to coerce people into
getting insurance.  You also need insurance to renew your
vehicle registration.

>and you can't have your driver's
>licence renewed without insurance.

This in Texas also.  What I want to know is, what are all you
non-car-owning bicyclists who want to keep your license current
supposed to do?  How can you show proof of insurance when you
don't have a car to insure?  You could get non-car-owning driver
insurance, I suppose, but why?  Borrowed cars are covered by the
owner's insurance.  I'm not sure about rental car coverage, but
if you only rent once in a while I'd think you could buy their
coverage for a lot less than maintaining your own policy.  (Even
though their coverage is a ripoff if you do already have insurance.)

This is relevant, I guess, since I have considered letting my car
die a quiet death of old age and then not replacing it, and just
bicycling everywhere, but I'd want to keep my license current so
I could rent a car if I really needed to.

In practice it may not matter.  I understand that almost any
vaguely official-looking paper will usually get you by at the
inspection places (it's done by private companies but under rules
that control price and such).  They may not even check that it
really is proof of insurance, much less that it matches the car
in question.so perhaps they don't check carefully at the driver's
license office either.  This part is all net.rumor though so take
it for what it's worth (about $.0001 probably :-).

	Cathy
-- 
Cathy Foulston + Rice University + Network & Systems Support + cathyf@rice.edu
Actually I'm not clueless.  I'm conceptually challenged.
Important rule for out-and-back rides:  what goes down must come up.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: brister@decwrl.dec.com (James Brister)
Subject: Re: My Bicycle Helmet Experience
Organization: DEC Western Software Lab
	<q54m9s=.tomk@netcom.com> <1992Aug13.003828.20258@lrmsc.loral.com>
Date: 12 Aug 92 18:57:16

On Thu, 13 Aug 1992 00:38:28 GMT, robishaw@orion.lrmsc.loral.com (Gary Robishaw x5960) said:

> In article <q54m9s=.tomk@netcom.com> tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich) writes:
>>
>>  A lot of Tom's nonsense deleted...
>>
> Loosen your sphincter Tom.

It is. That's the problem....

James
--
James Brister                                           brister@wsl.pa.dec.com
DEC Western Software Lab., Palo Alto, CA                        decwrl!brister
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: jac@noaacrd.colorado.edu (Julia Collins)
Subject: Re: Women's Tour de France updates anyone?
Organization: NOAA Climate Research Division
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 17:03:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.003038.6295@usage.csd.unsw.OZ.AU> csh@newt.phys.unsw.edu.au (Chris Heath) writes:
>
>Who cares about the women's Tour ?! (provoke provoke).
>
>SMEE
>
I can feel the blood pressure rising :-).  
Seriously, any news would be appreciated. 

Julia
.................................................................
: e-mail:       jac@noaacrd.colorado.edu			:
:...............................................................:
: Given that true intellectual and emotional compatibility are  :
: at the very least difficult, if not impossible, to come by,   :
: we could always opt for the more temporal gratification of    :
: sheer physical attraction.  That wouldn't make you a shallow 	:
: person...would it? 	 		- Lyle Lovett		:
:...............................................................:
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles