HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu (Roy S. Rapoport)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Het males & bi-femmes
Date: 30 Dec 1992 21:25:35 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Dec27.204132.15473@netcom.com> boserj@netcom.com (Jeffrey Boser) writes:
->actually, this is a pretty bad example, and wrong to boot.  In SIASL,

*grin* go get 'em, Jeff :)

->making it with two women.'  I dont really..  but give me someone
->I care about and something sweet and ill spin fanta..  nah..  Ill
->just jump into things and have fun.  <grin>

I think that may be arranged ... I may even throw in some warm socks :)

->I sometimes think it has to do with the power games in our culture,
->how man is supposed to dominate the woman, and the more women the
->better..  kinda like how a man is seen as virile if he has many
->women lovers, and how its not true of women.

Hmm ... maybe that's why I've found the concept of me and two women so ...
hmm, not repugnant.  Just unpleasant, I suppose ... Then again, I try very
hard not to dominate women (Kerry excepted, of course :) ), so I would
probably have been lost if I had to dominate _two_ people at the same time
(dreams of co-bottoming with Kerry fade from the minds of some people, I'm
sure :) ).

->oh well, then again if I could figure these things out I wouldnt
->be so confused.  <chuckle>

*grin* Good friend of mine says "the end of confusion is the beginning of
death" :).

-roy, terminally confused


-- 
Roy S. Rapoport     internet: rsr@soda.berkeley.edu      bitnet: rsrsoda@ucbocf
anonymous mail: wi.5836@n7kbt.rain.com        androphile, gynophile, kerryphile
"What I used to think is me / is just a faded memory." -NIN
DISCLAIMER:  I speak for the University of California at Berkeley.  Rrrright.
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk (Clive Grace)
Subject: Re: a *bench* of bisexuals?
Reply-To: cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 11:49:00 +0000


> Is that De Hems in Macclesfield St by any chance?  Where they have a Dutch
> night once a week in the room upstairs?

Yup... the very same. Nice pub, decent atmosphere and the beer was 
okay -- the company (apart from our good selves) could have been 
better tho... especially the Glaswegans with the hormonal overdrive 
unit (TM)... I hate to admit it, but I enjoyed exuding signals of 
"fuck off" to them... reminded me of those pictures of rutting rams 
on the BBC Wildlife magazine.

Pardon me, I need a cold shower....
--
+-------------------------------------------+--------------------------+
| When I grow up, I want to give up being   |cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk|
| a Journalist and learn how to write...    |                          |
+-------------------------------------------+--------------------------+
|       Bisexual knitter of quality and distinction since 1992.        |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+

Xref: sparky soc.bi:17331 alt.polyamory:2228
Newsgroups: soc.bi,alt.polyamory
Subject: Leaving soon
From: woodhous@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Joe P Woodhouse)
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 13:45:04 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia

   Hi folks.

   In something a little over 13 hours from now, Karina & I get on our
plane. We'll be meeting quite a few people while we're in the US, and if
even *half* of what might reasonably be expected to occur occurs, we'll
be limping for months... 8-P

   I retain net access throughout the entire trip, and will regularly be
telnetting home to read email (at least every few days), so email will
always reach me. I won't have so much time for news, though - I'd really
really be grateful if anyone who posts a followup to anything I've said
could also email me a copy? Thank you...

   So yeah, to those of you lucky enough to be meeting us (8-P!) - we'll
see you soon!

Joe.

  / Joe Woodhouse        / I'm just a sweet bisexual...   / Hello, there.
 / Latrobe University   /    (think - Rocky Horror)      / Threesomes are fun.
/ Melbourne, Australia / Music. Magic. Mathematics. Me. / I like cats! (miaow!)
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 22:41:21 EST
From: Graydon <SAUNDRSG@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Het males & bi-femmes
 <C0549I.Fsw.1@cs.cmu.edu> <1993Jan2.212358.23156@vpnet.chi.il.us>

I've always thought of these things (since I'm not much mathematical)
as geometry - three people is a triangle, where each edge and the
whole surface is a particular relationship.  You can add a line through
the centroid to the other edge that describes the specific 'this person
with that couple' relationship if you want.

Even more fun is to consider a quad as a tetrahedron, and watch your
brain melt.

Then there's the argument about how much it helps if the triangle is
equilateral, or if isoceles triangles are inherently unstable,
wether 'very married' couples should be represented (in larger
complexes of relationships) as points, and how to colour code things
to describe the nature of the relationships.  (varying from languished
lute playing to utter carnality, I suppose.)

Graydon

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
saundrsg@                "Praise then Darkness and Creation unfinished"
   qucdn.queensu.ca                   - U. K. LeGuin
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Introduction, or De-Muffining
From: woodhous@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Joe P Woodhouse)
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 16:10:55 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia

eleanor@cbnews.cb.att.com (eleanor.j.evans) writes:
>idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid) writes:
>>eleanor@cbnews.cb.att.com (Piglet) writes:
>
>Hey, look, I'm in the middle!!  *big grin*

   Not from where I am, hon... looks like you've got Kay surrounded! 8-P


>>What is Aussie Moist (apart from Joe, that is :))?

   Evil man! Here I am, 3am, way sleep deprived, desperately trying to
catch up with both email and news before we head off in a few days, but
I can't let this go by!! [laugh]


>With luck, I'll be able to verify the Joe part in person.....:-).

   Well, hey, I thought we'd sorted out something, yes? Hmmmm. 
[email winging it's way Piglet-ward]


>>>Piglet, fluffing her brown tresses....
>>
>>		Kay (considering nuzzling Piglet's tresses)
>
>Piglet, leaning in towards the keyboard to get her hair closer

Joe, wishing he could be nuzzling both of you... [grin]

  / Joe Woodhouse        / I'm just a sweet bisexual...   / Hello, there.
 / Latrobe University   /    (think - Rocky Horror)      / Threesomes are fun.
/ Melbourne, Australia / Music. Magic. Mathematics. Me. / I like cats! (miaow!)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: jenk@microsoft.com (Jen Kilmer)
Subject: Re: treating men as sex toys
Date: 30 Dec 92 06:34:33 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation

In article <1992Dec26.052957.4713@news.acns.nwu.edu> Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde) writes:
>In article <MUFFY.92Dec24114049@remarque.berkeley.edu> 
> muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu (Muffy Barkocy) writes:
>>[some men seem to like sex w/ men for "just sex", but if emotions
>>are in play, they want a woman]
>>
>>For me, this is not true at all; the emotional interactions seem to be
>>pretty identical....I wouldn't feel bisexual if I was just
>>using men for sex...they'd just be a rather elaborate sort of dildo, and
>>I don't think I would be bisexual if I was only having relationships (of
>>any sort) with women and just had a large collection of dildos...*grin*.
>[...]
>
>Well, it sounds like your experience is not inconsistent with the idea
>that women are socialized to place more importance on emotions and
>relationships. It sounds like you would not pursue relationships
>without a relational component, so *for you* the experences of both
>sexes tend to have more in common.
>
>A man, say, who was not adverse to cheap meaningless sex ;) might find
>that men and women responded differently to the idea.

I find this rather interesting in light of recent discussions with 
a [male fundamentalist christian] friend about the role of sex in
human relationships. His view is that sex is only part of a whole 
marriage, that marriage makes one being out of two people, and that
sex can't be successfully separated from the rest of the whole 
relationship.  For him, separating sex from the love & commitment
of marriage is not what God planned and he personally finds it
... um ... revolting.

I, on the other hand, have maintained that sex can be just a physical
act, and that it's not necessarily better or worse than sex as part
of another relationship - and of course relationships vary as well -
what I've maintained is that it's different, and each kind of 
relationship/encounter is likely better or worse  for a particular
individual based on what the particular individual needs/wants.

Anyway....

-jen
From: mlloyd@ocf.berkeley.edu (M. Lloyd)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: a *bench* of bisexuals?
Date: 24 Dec 1992 06:27:01 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: earthquake.berkeley.edu

moh2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>I have to say that the English have an amazing ability to politely
>ignore anything they find disturbing....

...  like America.

hugs
Mike
-- 
Mike Lloyd, B0/1 h- f- t w- g+ k+ s m- e? |    "Bloody nose and burning eyes
      Retro-hippy, music nut, bi and      |  Raised in laughter to the skies"
          backrubber of devotion          |                 - Bruce Cockburn
               --The end of confusion is the beginning of death--
From: winsor@geek.teng.ppd.ti.com (js)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: SOMEBODY HELP ME!!!
Date: 22 Dec 1992 21:06:48 GMT
Organization: Texas Instruments Incorporated, Austin
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: geek.teng.ppd.ti.com

I have *just* received mail from Seth.  But his mail account
has been killed, so the Postmaster says.

does anyone have a means for me to get in touch with him?
I need to urgently.

Any help deeply appreciated!

ADVthanksANCE
js
Newsgroups: soc.bi,soc.motss
From: solovay@netcom.com (Andrew Solovay)
Subject: Re: Liberty (was something relevant about CO-2 long ago...)
Organization: People's Front of Judea
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 21:40:05 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.193904.24017@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> ry@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (ryerson.schwark) writes:
>Quoting Ms. Manners:

I've heard a lot about how we should respect people's tastes and
preferences. Well, Miss Manners has made it abundantly clear that
she prefers to be addressed, and referred to, as "Miss Manners",
not "Ms. Manners" (in contradistinction to her writer, who (I
believe) goes by "Ms. Judith Martin").

Why is it any less rude to ignore her wishes by calling her "Ms.
Manners", than it would be to (for instance) refer to Melinda
Shore as "Miss Shore"?

Or do we respect only those preferences with which we happen to
agree? 
-- 
Andrew Solovay    
                "I know that, in America and under capitalism,
                 I am the freest woman in history."
                                --- Camille Paglia
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: j_babylo@oz.plymouth.edu (Jessica L. Babylon)
Subject: Re: Introduction, or De-Muffining
Summary: Snicker
Keywords: grovel, grovel
Organization: Plymouth State College - Plymouth, NH.
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 92 15:28:11 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.161417.16770@cbnews.cb.att.com> eleanor@cbnews.cb.att.com (Piglet) writes:
>In article <BzH5Gp.Ant@cck.coventry.ac.uk> idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid) writes:
>>Awww, ok, you're forgiven and snuggled, you no-doubt excellently-haired
>>Piglet, you!  *smooch*  Anyone who has to live at 1200 deserves every
>>bit of sympathy she can get.
>
>Ooo, smooch, snuggle, sympathy, sympathy, love, love....  I'll take every
>bit of sympathy I can get.  Especially when it's as nice as that....
>
I'm at 9600, it's not *that* much better, snuggles et al pweese?I'm
just a glutton for attention, yah i know.shrug.

>>Would I swap my yummy workstation and 19200 baud connexion for Mike's
>>beautiful hair?  Errrr..  um.  Yes, actually I would :(
>
>19200 baud!!!  Augh!!  I'm _so_ jealous....
>
They *make* 19200 baud?!?!?! Sheesh i want some

>>*snicker* I BET YOU'RE USING VI, TOO!  HAH!
>
>Bite your tongue!!  Not a chance.  I'm a dedicated emacs-er.  And, let me
>tell you, that's some dedication.  This is not what you could call an
>emacs-friendly environment.  So much so that I don't have what you could
>call a friendly emacs.  Keeps doing weird things with over 80 character
>lines...
>
Bite who's tongue?Hrm.Oh i'm so naughty.Grin.emacs blech.

>
>
>Piglet
>
>>6'2", dark short hair, blue eyes, bisexual and horny as ....
>
>of indeterminate height (someone wanna come help measure me?--the doctor's
>scale said 5'4", but I've always been 5'2", and I don't think she was
>doing it right, because it definitely wasn't on my head...)
Don't ya love over friendly nurses though?when i hurt my ankle i got
one of those.Yum!Giggle

>med. brown short? hair
>hazel eyes (blue or green, depending)
Oh my, c'mon baby lite my fire!Green eyes and brown hair, you've just
gotta come to my hometown and getcher own piglet stamp honey.

>DEFINITELY bisexual

>and not very horny at the moment (someone wanna come help...never mind)
Nod emphatically. What did you have in mind?Giggle.Pshaw, i think i
will entice you here to get the stamp and then seduce you so you never
want to go home.Hah!

- Scandalous "I feel released, bad times deceased my confidence has
increased " the Goddess
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 00:37:59 EST
From: Graydon <SAUNDRSG@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Understanding
 <1992Dec20.192301.1250@infodev.cam.ac.uk> <1992Dec21.152115.510@dsg.cs.tcd.ie>
 <1992Dec22.141030.16600@thelema.uucp> <92357.110706SAUNDRSG@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
 <MUFFY.92Dec22111050@remarque.berkeley.edu>

Oh dear.  Between this and some very civil email from a Diana, I've
got grounds to consider I mispoke.

'tactics' - 'methods of achieving objectives' - that is, I made that
post as a comment on what I've seen work better as a communication approach,
*NOT* as a comment about self identification, the appropriateness of going
'ack' around feminism-as-a-topic, nor as someone who thinks the clueless
ought to be coddled.  (the clueless from anyone's perspective.)

And, Muffy, why *do* you regard yourself as bi, rather than say, as
a person with catholic tastes in sex partners?  (honestly curious).

Graydon
Xref: sparky soc.bi:17015 soc.motss:53226
From: mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik)
Newsgroups: soc.bi,soc.motss
Subject: Re: Liberty (was something relevant about CO-2 long ago...)
Date: 21 Dec 92 11:48:48 GMT
Organization: (getting there)

dbshapco@napier.uwaterloo.ca (Brad Shapcott) writes:
[ much deleted ]

 >I can't *see* the point of feminism if it isn't to clue in the type
 >of person I used to be, and then to continue educating the type of
 >person I've become.

And this is a lot of the problem.  

Feminism is not (especially) designed as a re-education program for
men, but as an empowerment program for women.  It is not my job, as
a feminist, to use my time and energy in the education of clueless
men, although I have been known to spend considerable time doing
just that when I encounter a man who shows some signs of being
responsive. 

I'm not trying to say that "feminism" shouldn't educate men (as well
as women).  I'm also not saying that "feminists" shouldn't educate
men (as well as women).  I'm saying that the problem with what Brad
has written is that he's gone so far as to say that he cannot see
any other important purpose to feminism.  That's not all that far
from dismissing women's reactions about the so-called "inclusive
masculine" pronouns.

I've already written one rather angry letter to Brad.  I'll try not
to write any more to or in answer to him.  But I am really  very
angry, and the main reason I deleted the rest of his article is that
he goes on to say some stuff that offended me as deeply as anything
I've ever seen in soc.motss.
-- 

  Mara Chibnik
  mara@panix.com                Life is too important to be taken seriously.
From: h431@quads.uchicago.edu (heather e blair)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Sexual consent (Was: Roy's "consenting" slave)
Date: 3 Jan 93 18:08:13 GMT
Reply-To: h431@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago

In article <1h3qciINNb4c@agate.berkeley.edu> mlloyd@ocf.berkeley.edu (M. Lloyd) asks about how to expand the "right to say no" territory:
>
>Sure is.  Found any good routes, other than the self-defence course?  I
>don't want to learn agression (that's not what self-defence is about, I
>know), so I will have nothing to do with the Fierceness brigade, and
>their Warrior archetype.  The very concept makes me sick.  Still, a
>little ability to hold fast when a confrontation, a "no", is required
>would be rather useful.
>

Family (or couples) therapy was the other one.  Self-defense is useful for
learning physical techniques against physical aggression, so when Senator
Packwood stands on your feet, grabs you by the hair and kisses you, you'll
know how to get out of that hold and fight him. (for example).  But a lot
of the nay-saying territory I've been trying to expand is the ability to
tell people things that I'm afraid they aren't going to like very much
possibly to the point of yelling and screaming and vicious name-calling.
(Or being cast out of their lives forever).  This has taken lots and lots
of practice, and I've been a much quicker student in the business realm
than in the personal.

Business example:  I asked a professor to redirect his phone
calls when I was talking to him.  I was afraid he'd get pissed, but I
asked it, and he did it - rather amiably.

Personal example:  I'm working up to telling my ex-girlfriend not to say
certain nasty things about my love-life, past or present.  I haven't done
this yet, and I'm real scared, but I think I will when I form the request
in an appropriate way.
 
>[Bi-relevance is clearly nil, directly.  I happen to think that several
>people I know on this group want to know about this, though, so I'm
>unsure what to do.  We can go to email, or land in another group, but I
>see disadvantages either way.  At least I'm asking Heather, who must
>hold the record for Best-Posts-In-Least-Words, and has held it for some
>time.]

Aww, shucks.
>
>Mike, who finds there is no contest whatsoever between Wimp and Warrior,
>but would like to take a few excess out of the wimpishness

But, Mike, think of this as assertiveness.  It actually cuts way, way, down
on one's desire to do violence to somebody.  If you can stand up to people,
tell them what you fear they won't want to hear, make them see that you are
deadly serious, while being rational and polite, you'll find that your desire
to flatten their noses has diminished.



-- 

- Heather Blair       h431@midway.uchicago.edu
Newsgroups: soc.bi,soc.motss
From: mudge@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (MUDGE BRIAN WAYNE)
Subject: Re: Imitating Turing (was: Liberty (was: (never mind)))
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 17:17:58 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.160317.2518@dcs.qmw.ac.uk> arodgers@dcs.qmw.ac.uk (Angus H Rodgers) writes:
>In <Bznvz6.Grt@cck.coventry.ac.uk>
>idx009@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid) writes:
>
>>In article <1992Dec21.220208.19407@dcs.qmw.ac.uk> 
>>arodgers@dcs.qmw.ac.uk (Angus H Rodgers) writes:
>
>>If Alan Turing's supposed to be a role-model, I'll turn straight.
>>And give up computers.  And have a sex change.
>
>>Gus, why on earth would anyone want to be a sociopathic chess-player
>>who worked for the Government?

  Sociopathic?  Ok, he was arrested/convicted on six counts of "gross
indecency", but having sex with a 19 year old is hardly sociopathic
by today's standards.

                           Bri...
From: mlloyd@ocf.berkeley.edu (M. Lloyd)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: YES!  It works!!!
Date: 24 Dec 1992 16:48:28 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: earthquake.berkeley.edu

C.G.C.vanDijk@IO.TUDelft.NL writes:
>Hi everybody,

Heelllooo dere!  A muffin, a muffin!  There ain't nuffin like a muffin!

>For any welcoming hug (shy smile, quickly evolving into shameless begging)
>please hug Kay too, who found this way of posting for me.  

Ooh, I get to hug you *and* Kay?  Bliss!  Three-way!  <<<HUG>>>
Now if you sit <here>, and Kay sits <there>, I can just about give you
simultaneous backrubs ...

>Casper G.C. van Dijk               "Broken words,
>Delft University of Technology      never meant to be spoken"
>the Netherlands                                    Bob Dylan

Mm.  Good taste in Dylan.  I keep hearing that song on the radio - not
sure why.  Still, I won't complain.

>PS: With regard to recent postings on net.personality: I'm mid twenties,
>bitter funloving cynic idealist, 6'2", blue eyes, and at the moment,
>I wear my hair like Jesus wore it (Halleluja I adore it).

*clank* <the sound of Mike's jaw hitting the floor>  He quotes Dylan, he
lets it all hang out (of his follicles), he makes silly rhymes.  I'll
avoid the joke I was going to make on the Messianic reference, of taking
up a missionary position ...

I think we'll let him stay :-)
hugs
Mike


-- 
Mike Lloyd, B0/1 h- f- t w- g+ k+ s m- e? |    "Bloody nose and burning eyes
      Retro-hippy, music nut, bi and      |  Raised in laughter to the skies"
          backrubber of devotion          |                 - Bruce Cockburn
               --The end of confusion is the beginning of death--
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde)
Subject: Re: a *bench* of bisexuals?
Followup-To: soc.bi
Originator: lunde@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
Reply-To: Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu (Albert Lunde)
Organization: Ministry of Silly Walks
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 19:47:24 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.232156.25617@midway.uchicago.edu> 
 moh2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>Oof.  Was much fun.  Anyone want details....

Pretty please....Tell us more...

(I could use some light gossip for a change; and this sounds promising...;)

-- 
 Albert Lunde         | Interfaith  |     *Y*Y*      "A branch on the
 Albert-Lunde@nwu.edu |  Bisexual   |      *Y*        tree of life"
                      |  Feminist   |.......|.........................
From: pooh+@cs.cmu.edu (Will Timmins)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: Re: Okay...okay...here is an official demuffin...
Date: 31 Dec 92 20:20:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C054Hq.Fy5.1
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Congradulations!!!

Hugs by the truck load... (I suppose this, too, would be my official demuffin..
have been lurking for a while, just started posting, and haven't really 
indicated I was bi. I am. There)

Hope you have fun on the net, fun in your life...

Peace, light, love, and happiness to thee and thine.


-- 
[Pooh Bear incarnate.                                             ]
[H1 C+ F+ W G+ K+ S+ R- E+ P                                      ]
[                                                                 ]
[To email, please make sure to mail to pooh@seismo.soar.cs.cmu.edu]
Newsgroups: soc.bi
From: miket@hermes.tcs.com (Michael Turner nmscore Assoc.)
Subject: Re: Understanding
Organization: Teknekron Communications Inc.
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 06:17:29 GMT

In article <92359.165646SAUNDRSG@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> Graydon <SAUNDRSG@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
>I'm probably not someone you'd regard as bi; I can imagine sex with
>men, there are a couple of very good male friends it has occured to
>me to wonder what sex would be like with, but other than that I'm
>sexually attracted to women.  (Ideally, tall, slender, pale women
>who delight in life, are suffused with fierceness, and have souls
>like swordblades.)   *Emotional* attraction seems gender neutral.

Check back with me when you've given up your obviously-doomed quest.
I know this woman who is short, well-muscled, pale, delights in life,
is suffused with practicality, and has a soul like a Swiss Army knife.

That's two out of....lemme count, here....seven, which is about as good
as I ever manage.

The Swiss-Army-knife part might sound unromantic, but the problem with the
swordblade-souls is they only cut two ways, and can't fix anything at all.
Believe me, I've been through it.
---
Michael Turner
miket@tcs.com