HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: wcsjc@alfred.carleton.ca (John Coughlin)
Subject: Re: Whence comest "keyboard"
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 03:53:44 GMT

In <1992Sep14.224032.3841@ee.ryerson.ca> elf@ee.ryerson.ca (luis fernandes) writes:

>So, does anyone know when and with which computer, the term keyboard
>was first used to?  (I can only assume that the syllable "key" is
>originally from the keys on the typewriter; but why were the
>*things* on typewriters also called keys, i.e. most people know keys
>as being devices used to open locks. ) Where's the connection ?

Think of clavichords and pianofortes.  Hitting a key causes a lever to
strike a hammer on a wire.  Pressing a mechanical typewriter key
causes a lever to strike a hammer on the ribbon and paper.  The
progression via electric typewriter or teletypewriter to computer
keyboard carries the functional meaning, although the mechanical means
of transmission has disolved.
-- 
Flesh: John Coughlin                            Elvis ate my Cadillac
Net: wcsjc@ccs.carleton.ca     Vox: +1 613 957-2851     Fax: 990-7370
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: mdw@theory.TC.Cornell.EDU (Matt Welsh)
Subject: Re: You know when you're hacking too long when...
Organization: Cornell Theory Center
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 22:12:47 GMT

In article <aldavi01.716419635@starbase.spd.louisville.edu> aldavi01@vulcan.spd.louisville.edu (Arlie Davis) writes:
>In <1992Sep13.170603.24419@tc.cornell.edu> mdw@theory.TC.Cornell.EDU (me) writes:
>
>> I've done something similar. I find that whenever I'm looking for something
>> at home or in my office, and simply can't find it, my first impulse is
>> to
>
>> % grep office shoes
>
>Wow!!  You must have HUGE SHOES!!!
>
Yow! Maybe this is why I could never find my shoes! 

>Grin, indeed.  :)

mdw

-- 
Matt Welsh    mdw@tc.cornell.edu        +1 607 253 2737
Random Hacker, Cornell Engineering and Theory Center 
  "I'll eat anything that's BRIGHT BLUE!!"
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: sunthej@alleg.edu (Jake Blues)
Subject: Who invented the digital computer
Reply-To: sunthej@alleg.edu
Organization: Allegheny College
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 23:53:31 GMT


	Hello all.  I remember reading that there was some dispute as to  
who invented the digital computer, and that a court case was ongoing that  
could have wide-reaching consequences to the industry.  Does anyone have  
any more info on that?  Has the court case been resolved?  Who won?

							Jake
From: mjb@doc.ic.ac.uk (Matthew J Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Is there a PDP-11 (or 8, or...) Emulator?
Date: 3 Sep 92 19:15:25 GMT
Organization: Department Of Computing, Imperial College, London.
NNTP-Posting-Host: oak1.doc.ic.ac.uk
In-reply-to: bmb1021@ultb.isc.rit.edu's message of 2 Sep 92 04:34:15 GMT

In article <1992Sep2.043415.12160@ultb.isc.rit.edu> bmb1021@ultb.isc.rit.edu (B.M. Buck ) writes:
>Is there a PDP-11 (or PDP-8, 10, 1, 6, etc) emulator available
>(perferrably for MS-DOS or similar varients)?  While recently reading a
>book on PDP-11 Assembly language, I wondered if it would be possible to
>try writing some code for the beasties.  Not having a PDP-11, or even
>knowing where to get one, I thought of emulation...
>
>Also suitable would be pointers on how to acquire one cheaply.
>
>  Thank you for your support.
>    BP (bmb1021@ultb.isc.rit.edu)
>

Well, there is such a thing here at Imperial College - the Unix PDP-11
written by Diomidis Spinellis, Jan Simon Pendry and Duncan White. To
quote from the man page:

:DESCRIPTION
:     em11 is an interactive source  level  PDP-11  emulator  with
:     built-in  debugging facilities.  It is invoked with a single
:     .e11 file [produced by  the  PDP-11  assembler,  as11(L)  ].
:     This  file  is used to extract the absolute PDP-11 code, the
:     source lines and a list of symbols.

Unfortunately this is a local product, still in beta, runs only under
UNIX as far as I know, and I have no idea as to how or when it will
ever be distributed. It's used in the 1st year undergraduate
architecture course, so that the students can have a 'machine' each
that is OK to crash or otherwise mangle ...

-Matt

--
| Matthew J. Brown  | Dept. of Computing | If God intended for us to go to   |
| mjb@doc.ic.ac.uk  | Imperial College,  | lectures He wouldn't have created |
| mjb02@cc.ic.ac.uk | 180 Queen's Gate   | double-sided photocopiers.        |
| Morven on Lambda  | LONDON SW7 2AZ     |          -IC RagMag 1991/92       |
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva)
Subject: Re: Is there a PDP-11 (or 8, or...) Emulator?
Organization: Taronga Park BBS
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 11:09:19 GMT

In article <1992Sep09.113100.23379@tpki.toppoint.de> kris@tpki.toppoint.de (Kristian Koehntopp) writes:
>	psw = (func[codeword])();

Unless the compiler can do function prologue elimination this is much
slower.
-- 
                                                                `-_-'
                         Har du kramat din varg idag?            'U`

Peter da Silva, Taronga Park BBS, Houston, TX  +1 713 568 0480/1032
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
From: peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 18:21:32 GMT

In article <1992Sep1.224833.27021@news.columbia.edu> lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner) writes:
> This is a crock.  Industry acceptance of MS-DOS since the inception of
> V 2.00 means that there is no such problem.

Except for the problem caused by the inability to make any substantial
improvements to DOS because it'd break all the critical applications. Microsoft
eventually had to invent not one but *three* new operating systems, and they
*still* have to retain very low level DOS emulation to get any market share.

> I don't use MS-DOS, I use
> DR-DOS, which is a compatible superset.  Frill features of the hardware
> are seamlessly added, not required.  My code just runs slightly faster; 
> the alleged improvements are overblown when it comes to actual performance
> improvement.

If your programs were written in high level code, and you'd recompiled them
with a 32-bit compiler, you'd have seen substantial performance improvements.
Native 386 code is so much faster then 8086 or 80286 code that insisting you're
sticking with 8086 because assembler is more *efficient* is insane!

> In summary, the answer is yes, the same exact environment, surrounded
> by a lot of optional shit that can be 100% ignored.

And you think this is a good thing? The DOS environment is a concrete prison
on the edge of a blasted war zone, pockmarked with bullet holes, held together
by phenomenal programmers using knotted rebars and their own muscles. The tools
are mostly toy versions of the real thing, with lots of pretty colors and
exciting plastic mouldings  stuck on the side... but they won't do basic
things like cut standard sized planks. The exceptions are a few old leftovers
from before the war that don't have any safety guards and have a habit of
blowing out the whole prison's electrical system if you make a mistake.

I'm sorry, I'm not interested in doing without that optional shit like clean
air and properly grounded and insulated tools any more.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                               `-_-'
$ EDIT/TECO LOVE                                              'U` 
%TECO-W-OLDJOKE Not war?                        Have you hugged your wolf today?
Ferranti Intl. Ctls. Corp.      Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012       +1 713 274 5180
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: dpbsmith@world.std.com (Daniel P. B. Smith)
Subject: Re: Why is kermit called kermit?
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 01:10:44 GMT

"...We invented a new protocol and called it Kermit, after Kermit the
Frog, star of 'The Muppet Show'.  Why? Mostly because there was a Muppets
calendar on the wall when we were tyring to think of a name, and Kermit is
a pleasant, unassuming sort of chracter.  But since we weren't sure
whether it was OK to name our protocol after this popular television and
movie start, we pretended that KERMIT was an acronym; unfortunately,
we could never find a good set of words to go with the letters, as 
readers of some of our early source code can attest.  Later, while looking
through a name book for his forthcoming baby, Bill Catchings noticed that
Kermit was a Celtic word for "free," which is waht all Kermit programs
should be, and words to this effect replaced the strained acronyms in our
source code.... When BYTE magazine was preparing our 1984 Kermit
article for publication, they suggested we contact Henson Associates Inc.
for permission to say that we did indeed name the protocoal after Kermit 
the Frog.  Permission was kindly granted, and now the real story can
be told."

p. 3 of "Kermit: A File Transfer Protocol," by Frank da Cruz. Digital
Press, 1967. Order number EY-6705E-DP.  ISBN 0-932376-88-6.  
The copyright page, after the copyright notice, also notes that
"The KERMIT File Transfer Protocol was named after the star of 
THE MUPPET SHOW television series.  The name is used by permission of Henson
Associates, Inc."

By the way, this happens to be a TERRIFIC book, which, in addition to
information on Kermit itself, is FULL of hard information and lore on
cross-platform issues with respect to asynchronous communication.

-- 
Daniel P. B. Smith
dpbsmith@world.std.com
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
From: bruno@broue.rot.qc.ca (Bruno Majewski)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: AFC archives???
Date: 9 Sep 92 12:38:02 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Groupe de Recherche Operationnelle en Telecommunication (ROT)
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

Hello out there

This might be a battered-to-death FAQ, but is there an archive of
net.traffic for this conve... conference?

I've got the impression our site is not getting all that is said here...

enquiring minds want to know...

----------------------+-----------------------------------------------------+
Bruno Majewski        | Groupe de Recherche Operationnelle en               |
                      |   Telecommunication (R.O.T.)                        |
bruno@broue.rot.qc.ca +-----------------------------------------------------+
                      | also @: Synerlogic Inc, div. of Andersen Consulting |
There is good beer,   |         Voice: (514) 685-7575                       |
& there is bad beer;  |         FAX  : (514) 685-7692                       |
don't confuse them!   |                                                     |
----------------------+-----------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: You know when you're hacking too long when...
From: ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Thomas Koenig)
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 02:15:34 GMT
Organization: University of Auckland, New Zealand.

ericj@eskimo.celestial.com (Eric Jorgensen) writes:

>sgcclmj@citec.oz.au (Liz Jones) writes:
>>    even worse:
>>       in hand-written stuff, showing mud-emotions...
>>    like *grin*
>>    *smile*
>>     etc...

>How about writing (hand-written) ':)' at the end of sarcastic items (yes,
>sideways)?

I sometimes do that, but only if I know the person I'm writing to is
another emailer and/or IRCer. And yes, I usually don't write email
from my holidays, postcards are nicer :-)
-- 
Thomas Koenig, ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz, ib09@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de
The joy of engineering is to find a straight line on a double logarithmic
diagram.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Who invented the digital computer
From: ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Thomas Koenig)
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 02:57:54 GMT
Organization: University of Auckland, New Zealand.

sunthej@alleg.edu (Jake Blues) writes:

>	Hello all.  I remember reading that there was some dispute as to  
>who invented the digital computer, and that a court case was ongoing that  
>could have wide-reaching consequences to the industry.  Does anyone have  
>any more info on that?  Has the court case been resolved?  Who won?

Konrad Zuse invented the first freely programmable digital computer.
I'm unaware of a court case; maybe you think of the integrated
circuit?  I dimly remember something there...
-- 
Thomas Koenig, ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz, ib09@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de
The joy of engineering is to find a straight line on a double logarithmic
diagram.
From: dhembrow@eoe.co.uk (David Hembrow)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: automatic CP/M to MS-DOS migration?
Date: 9 Sep 92 11:30:50 GMT
Organization: EO Europe Limited, Cambridge, UK
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

ivie@cc.usu.edu (CP/M lives!) writes:
: In article <1992Sep8.085605.14973@news.columbia.edu>, lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner) writes:
: > In article <1992Sep6.021133.17107@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Thomas Koenig) writes:
: >>If I remember correctly, one of the points in favour of MS-DOS 1.0 when
: >>it was introduced was the easy porting of CP/M software (^Z as end of
: >>file marker, COM - files, file control blocks).
: >>
: >>Just how far was this automated? Are 8080 and 8086 related closely enough
: >>that you could write an assembler which translated 8080 assembly into
: >>8086 code? Was this how, for example, WordStar was ported?
: > 
: > They aren't related at all, but the "order" of the file system calls are
: > the same, so that less mental processes are needed to translate from
: > one to another.
: 
: About the time that MS-DOS first came out, I remember rumors of software
: that developers could get from either Intel or Microsoft (don't remember
: which) that would take 8080 assembly source and make 8086 assembly source
: from it, with warnings on things that wouldn't translate. The direct
: correspondence between CP/M and DOS system calls made it easy to translate
: CP/M software to DOS.
: 
: Roger Ivie
: ivie@cc.usu.edu

I've got two different programs like this at home. Never actually used
them, but they do work as described above.

The problem with translating Z80 is that it has extra registers, IX, IY
and alternate set which don't correlate with anything on the 8086.
The converter program which I've got generates a load of macros to handle
these with multiple instructions.

I get the impression that it would do quite well on simple code using
8080 instructions but anyone who did anything more complex would be bitten
by the extra code generated.

The macros for LDIR etc. are comparitively straightforward, using REP MOVSB
as you might expect.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: xexeo@dxcern.cern.ch (Geraldo Xexeo)
Subject: Re: Recent IBM Performance Problems
Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers
Keywords:  IBM VM PERFORMANCE PROBLEM CRASH CMS
Organization: CERN European Lab for Particle Physics
Distribution: cern
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 11:17:11 GMT

This is part of a very informative news posted inside CERN today. Please
believe me that CERN computer center provides very good services to the
user, and sometimes, they are fun...

>   During the summer months we have made few changes to the IBM operating
>system and have had good stability averaging one unscheduled service
>interruption (i.e. a crash !) per two weeks. 

The question:  is "unscheduled service interruption" jargon? 

          Thanks,

                     Jerry

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Geraldo Xexeo      |internet: xexeo@dxcern.cern.ch | "Cristo Redentor,    
CERN - PPE Division|bitnet:   gxexeo@cernvm.bitnet |  Bracos abertos sobre a
1211 Geneve 23     |decnet:   vxcern::xexeo        |  Guanabara...
Switzerland        |FAX:      (41) (22) 785 - 0207 |  Rio, eu gosto de voce!"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:13907 rec.humor:28502
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,rec.humor
Subject: Re: Thoughts - Aussies have it better both ways!
From: 9051467f@levels.unisa.edu.au (Wild Child)
Date: 13 Sep 92 22:23:32 +0930
Organization: University of South Australia

In article <1992Sep13.051133.5035@cs.uow.edu.au>, david@cs.uow.edu.au (David E A Wilson) writes:
> u734120@bruny.cc.utas.edu.au (John Lamp) writes:
>>>peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) writes:
>>>> Hibberts Law #14:
>>>> 	When two technologies are competing for the marketplace,
>>>> 	the inferior one always succeeds.
>>And VHS winning over Beta ;->
> 
> But VHS had the superior running time (2 hrs vs 1 hr) when first introduced
> and movies usually run for more than 1 hr... Here is Australia we can now get
> E-300 (5 hour) tapes that will run for 10 hours at LP speed. What can US
> VHS & Beta machines reach?
> -- 
> David Wilson				(042) 21 3802 voice, (042) 21 3262 fax
> Dept Comp Sci, Uni of Wollongong	david@cs.uow.edu.au

We Australians also get 625 line PAL instead of the crappy 500 odd lines dummy
Americans get with NTSC.

-- 
John McVey, Whyalla campus, Uni S.Australia
Electronic Engineering Student & Terror Tekkie G1 (at 19!)
9051467f@levels.unisa.edu.au, or try
9051467f@wh.whyalla.unisa.edu.au
'An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it.'  Don Marquis
'Those who believe in an afterlife won't be disappointed'  Me
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Obligatory disclaimer : UniSA hates my opinions...			     |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
From: peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 16:20:50 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.094005.15877@news.columbia.edu> lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner) writes:
> You really don't know what you're talking about here :-).

I do. Been There. Done that. No smiley.

> The registers
> aren't juggled hardly at all,

All them "MOV ES,whatever" instructions and segment prefixes are all in my mind.

> Who cares if code written for one O/S does/does not run on another one.

I do.

> When
> more than a few egocentric usenet types are using your code, then you can
> criticize what goes on.

They are.

> In the mean time, most of these machines are *not*
> being used for what you imaginge they are used for.

Oh, I think I have a good idea of what they're used for. Running a single
critical application that boots under DOS and then boots DOS out until it
needs to do soem file I/O.

> >And I suspect that it will be a lot easier to get Ckermit running under
> >OS/2 instead of in the DOS compatibility box than to get your assembly
> >language version that includes (and probably interacts intimitely with)
> >its own device driver.

> In a word, yes.  Working well? NO!  If you know what you're doing, you
> can talk to the OS/2 driver in ways that C generally is ignorant of.

Yes, OS/2 is a bit of a mess internally. Typical IBM design.

> However, under IBM's OS/2 v2.0, Kermit seems to run fine, although it sucks
> under windows.  (In fact *everything* sucks under windows :-(.)

Yes, Windows is a bit of a dancing bear. But I'm still amazed it dances at all.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                               `-_-'
Ferranti Intl. Ctls. Corp.                                    'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012
+1 713 274 5180                                   Har du kramat din varg idag?
From: 9125113g@lux.latrobe.edu.au (Mitch Davis)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: GOTOs
Date: 7 Sep 92 07:06:31 GMT
Organization: La Trobe University

In article <1992Sep4.113830.15889@odin.diku.dk> klaus@diku.dk (Klaus Ole Kristiansen) writes:
>9125113g@lux.latrobe.edu.au (Mitch Davis) writes:
>
>>procedure try;
>
>>{Build a finite state machine that repeats all actions in turn until }
>>{it gets to the end without failure.  If any step fails, it starts   }
>>{afresh with the initial state.                                      }
>
>>var state:integer;
>>    leave:boolean;
>
>>begin
>>  state := 0;
>>  repeat
>>    case state of
>>      0:leave := init_rs232;
>>      1:leave := init_modem;
>>      2:leave := dial_modem;
>>      3:leave := log_on;
>>      4:leave := do_the_business;
>>    end;
>>    case leave of

Oops!  Delete the following:

>>      true :leave := false;

and insert the following:

        true :begin leave := false; state := 0 end;

>>      false:state := state + 1;
>>    end;
>>  until (state=5);
>>end;
>
>Not very readable. (And does not start over, but that is beside the point).

And how would you make it readable without GOTO's?  (BTW, restart bug
fixed, see above).

Mitch.
From: twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: You know when you're hacking too long when...
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 05:14:34 GMT

In article <1992Sep11.173248.58@iris-dcp.es> mcastro@iris-dcp.es writes:

>you know [...] too long when you go to bed, start to sleep, 
>and suddenly the little voices inside your head said:
>
>you have running jobs
>$

I've been lobbying for a "reboot" button for humans for awhile now.
Really.  Look, a small DECstation takes about five minutes to boot up,
a Sun ten, a VAX half an hour, but it takes the human beast eight
hours to do a full reset.  I need _instant_ gratification.  Some days,
after I've been working so hard on something that I *just* *can't*
*stop* thinking about it, I want someone to be able to push a button
in the side of my head and let me just completely demagnetize in one
fell swoop.

That's what I want.

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "I don't know how much support NAMBLA
\  / twpierce@unix.amherst.edu /  has in the gay community."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Clayton Cramer, August 1992
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:13686 comp.lang.c:13279
From: rh@smds.com (Richard Harter)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: bogosort revisited (with source)
Date: 6 Sep 92 23:50:07 GMT
Reply-To: rh@ishmael.UUCP (Richard Harter)
Organization: Software Maintenance & Development Systems, Inc.

In article <1992Sep6.111107.16924@grebyn.com> richk@grebyn.com (Richard Krehbiel) writes:

|>It seems to me that introducing random chance is cheating; one can make
|>the time to sort as long as you please.  For example, given N elements
|>divide the sky up into N*(N-1)/2 sectors.  Do an exchange on the pair
|>corresponding to the first sector in which a supernova is observed.

|If you would send me the equipment necessary to detect these
|phenomena, I'll be glad to give it a try!

I forgot to mention that the time to build the equipment is part of
the cost of the sort....
-- 
Richard Harter: SMDS Inc.  Net address: rh@smds.com Phone: 508-369-7398 
US Mail: SMDS Inc., PO Box 555, Concord MA 01742.    Fax: 508-369-8272
In the fields of Hell where the grass grows high
Are the graves of dreams allowed to die.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.os.ms-windows.apps,comp.os.ms-windows.misc