HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: hrt@utne.aosg.gsf.dec.com (Henry R. Tumblin AOSG)
Subject: Re: 
Reply-To: hrt@aosg.gsf.dec.com
Organization: AOSG
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 18:43:28 GMT

jxv3790@hertz.njit.edu (Jake Vogelaar) writes:

>I redefine the title bar buttons in my .twmrc as follows:
>
>NoDefault
>LeftTitleButton "menu12" = f.menu "WindowMenu"
>RightTitleButton "______" = f.iconify
>RightTitleButton "______" = f.resize
>
>This makes the title bar kind of "Motif - like."  I could not find 
>the names for the resize and iconify buttons anywhere, though.
>Can anyone fill in the blanks?
>
>thanks
>
>Jake
The name of the iconify and resize buttons aren't really there. In your
example you specified the NoDefaults keyword, which tells the titlebar
code not to insert the default buttons for resize and iconify. Thus to
get the behavior that you need, you need to use a definition similar to
the following:

NoDefaults
LeftTitleButton "menu12" = f.menu "WindowMenu"
RightTitleButton "iconify" = f.iconify
RightTitleButton "resize" = f.resize

resize.bm and iconify.bm respectively. If you use alternative
bitmaps with these names. I've included the source for a couple
of bitmaps that I use with twm. One other thing to note is that the
size of the bitmaps for the title bar are 15x15.

/Henry

resize
------------------------Cut here-----------------------------
#define resize_width 15
#define resize_height 15
static char resize2_bits[] = {
   0xff, 0x7f, 0x01, 0x40, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f,
   0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f, 0xfd, 0x5f,
   0xfd, 0x5f, 0x01, 0x40, 0xff, 0x7f};
----------------------- Cut here-------------------------------

iconify
------------------------Cut here-------------------------------
#define iconify_width 15
#define iconify_height 15
static char iconify_bits[] = {
   0xff, 0x7f, 0x03, 0x60, 0x05, 0x50, 0x09, 0x48, 0x11, 0x44, 0x21, 0x42,
   0xc1, 0x41, 0xc1, 0x41, 0xc1, 0x41, 0x21, 0x42, 0x11, 0x44, 0x09, 0x48,
   0x05, 0x50, 0x03, 0x60, 0xff, 0x7f};
-----------------------Cut here---------------------------------
--
Henry R. Tumblin                        OSF/1 AXP
Mailstop: GSF/K13	                
Digital Equipment Corp.                 
5 Wentworth Drive                       enet: hrt@aosg.gsf.dec.com
Hudson, NH 03051                        decnet: alpha::hrt


Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: dwight@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu (Dwight D. Moore)
Subject: Re: VTX2000 or NCD-19c? Which one do you like better?
Originator: usenet@kittyhawk.ecn.uoknor.edu
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:44:40 GMT
Reply-To: dwight@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu
Organization: Geosciences Computing Network, Univ. of Oklahoma

In article <bjl.722120912@freyr>, bjl@loki.research.ptt.nl (Ben Lippolt) writes:
|>
|>Hi,
|>
|>If you had to choose between DEC's VTX2000 or a NCD-19c, which one do
|>you prefer? 
|> a. in a (non-DEC) Unix environment.
|> b. in a VMS/Ultrix environment.
|>
|>Why?
|
|>Ben Lippolt.
|>

Altough the VTX2000 show some decent performance, I prefer the NCD
since they tend to be more flexible in configuration and booting. My
experience with X Display Terminals from the big boys (DEC, IBM)
is such that they like you to have one of their machines to boot and
file serve. NCD have a nice interface for configuration (VXT's are limited
in configuration compared to NCD), and good support. I have booted
our NCD's from a VAX/VMS, IBM/RS600, and an Alliant, and font
served from each as well...try that with the VXT2000 or see
what happens when your font server disappears; how easy is
it to interactively specify a new font server? On an NCD it
is easy.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dwight D. Moore
Geosciences Computing Network
University of Oklahoma

dwight@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu (129.15.40.10)
These opinions do not necessarily represent the opinions of OU or the GCN.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jxv3790@hertz.njit.edu (Jake Vogelaar)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Need twmrc info
Date: 17 Nov 92 14:29:25 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

I redefine the title bar buttons in my .twmrc as follows:

NoDefault
LeftTitleButton "menu12" = f.menu "WindowMenu"
RightTitleButton "______" = f.iconify
RightTitleButton "______" = f.resize

This makes the title bar kind of "Motif - like."  I could not find 
the names for the resize and iconify buttons anywhere, though.
Can anyone fill in the blanks?

thanks

Jake

-- 
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Jake Vogelaar, jxv3790@hertz.njit.edu
Computer Vision R&D, Warner-Lambert Manufacturing Development Laboratory
New Jersey Institute of Technology
From: dick@ahold.nl (Dick Heijne)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Re: xterm: no available ptys
Keywords: xterm,pty
Date: 23 Nov 92 11:37:56 GMT
Organization: Ahold NV, Zaandam, Netherlands, EEC

In article <1992Nov15.211720.21888@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu>, mouse@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu (der Mouse) writes:
> In article <1e0l6qINNi05@transfer.stratus.com>, dswartz@sw.stratus.com (Dan Swartzendruber) writes:
> 
> > When I try to invoke xterm from a non-root UID, it fails with the
> > error message: "xterm: no available ptys".  Works fine from root.
> > Any ideas as to where I should be looking?
> 
> As with most things that work from root but not as mortals, it's
> probably a permissions problem.  In this case, most likely the
> permissions on the pty devices in /dev are set wrong.

Don't think so.
I lost the orginal message, so have no idea about your platform, but I
would vote for a too small kernel config parm of NPTY (or something
similar - see manual). Together with that, be sure to have enough
ttyvxxx or pttyxxx (depending on platform) devices configured in /dev.
Usually, the tool that configures NPTY re-mknod's those as well.

Dick.
-- 
+==============================Ahold NV===============================+
| Room 146 , Ankersmidplein 2, 1506 CK Zaandam,  The Netherlands, EEC |
| Dick.Heijne@ccsds.ahold.nl - Tel: +31 75 592151, Fax: +31 75 313030 |
+=====================================================================+
From: amit@point.cs.uwm.edu (Amit Srivastava)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: colors & pixels..
Date: 17 Nov 1992 18:26:46 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Milwaukee
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.2.5

	I am using DirectColor setting for colormaps.  X has the rgb plane
which has 24 bits to store the pixel.  However it uses an unsigned long
to store the pixel, does X care what u do with the remaining 8 bits.
My appl. has huge color images, and I'd like to store info. in the
pixel, say whether it is a part of a mask, to process the image. Is there
anyway to do that?
				-amit.
-- 
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x,comp.windows.x.apps,comp.windows.x.motif
From: emm@daneel.rdt.monash.edu.au (Wendigo)
Subject: How to use xrooms or alternative virtual desktops
Organization: Monash University, Melb., Australia.
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 11:17:26 GMT


I downloaded xrooms from export's contrib directory and can't seem to get
it running.

Xrooms is suppose to be a window manager independant virtual desktop like
program, however the documentation that comes with it is pitiful to say
the least.

Does anybody know exactly how to get this up and usable and how to configure
it.  I'm trying to use it with MOTIF mwm window manager but would like it to
work with OpenLook olwm as well.  A assume the set-up is similar for each.

Alternatively, is there and ftp'able software out there that will drive a
virtual desktop for motif which is similar to mwm??

Thanx in advance
-- 
Wendigo                                    | Every day in every way I'm getting
          [ Occasionally thought of as     | better and better, at least that's
            emm@daneel.rdt.monash.edu.au ] | what the little green men from
   { Sometimes answers to Evan McLean }    | mars keep telling me!
From: garyg@Warren.MENTORG.COM (Gary Gendel)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: Re: Executing GNU-C compiled Desqview/X applic
Date: 23 Nov 1992 13:18:09 GMT
Organization: Mentor Graphics, IC Group
Distribution: world
Reply-To: garyg@Warren.MENTORG.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: garyg.warren.mentorg.com

I had the same problem until I realized that I was not using the required rev level
for gcc.  Check your readme notes from qddvx101!  I am using this successfully.

Has anyone found any references to customizing the video driver?  I can get my board
into 1024 horizontal but cannot get all 758 vertical lines to display.  Only half the
screen is filled and the windows wraparound from bottom to top.

If not, anyone see any documentation on how to write a video driver for DV/X?

Thanks for any response.


Gary Gendel

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: dwex@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (david.e.wexelblat)
Subject: Re: XFree support for ATI Ultra Pro?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 16:02:38 GMT

In article <By1BMt.HI2@space.physics.uiowa.edu> ljg@space.physics.uiowa.edu (Larry Granroth) writes:
> In article <BxyysH.B66@ns1.nodak.edu> grosen@isc.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu (Johannes Grosen) writes:
> > 
> > The XFree FAQ says that the ATI Ultra (8514a) card is *not* supported
> > in XFree86 yet I am certain that I have seen references to it by
> > people who are successfully using it (Gateway machines). Can anyone
> > confirm or deny this?
> > 
> 
> Attached is the Xconfig file I use with XFree86 to run on a Gateway 2000
> with an ATI Ultra Pro.  The 1024x768 mode isn't quite right yet, but
> I find that panning around the 1024x1024 virtual screen in an 800x600
> display mode is fairly easy to deal with.
> 
> (If anyone has better clock or mode info, please let me know!)
> 
> larry-granroth@uiowa.edu
> 

Unless you are using either the Linux or 386BSD 8514 servers, you are only
using the SVGA chipset on your card.  As I stated previously, these servers
are not part of XFree86.  XFree86 does support the ATI SVGA chipset, but
buying an Ultra to use with XFree86 is sort of like putting an outboard
motor on a Porsche 928.

--
David Wexelblat <dwex@mtgzfs3.att.com>  (908) 957-5871
AT&T Bell Laboratories, 200 Laurel Ave - 4B-421, Middletown, NJ  07748

"The meaning of life?  That's simple.  Try to be happy, try not to hurt
 other people, and hope to fall in love."  -- Mallory Keaton
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: aldavi01@vulcan.spd.louisville.edu (Arlie Davis)
Subject: A teeny question: How to enable backing store on XV?
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 01:28:30 GMT
Reply-To: Arlie Davis <aldavi01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>
Organization: University of Louisville

I'm using XV version 2.21, rev 4/29/92.  Does anyone know how to enable
backing-store?  I've read the fine manual pages, which don't mention it at
all.  Is this fixed in another version?

Please reply in email, and many thanks in advance.

-- 
lrwx------   1 aldavi01 emacsstu       9 Jun  6 12:43 .signature -> /dev/null
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: dwex@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (david.e.wexelblat)
Subject: Re: XFree support for ATI Ultra Pro?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:30:44 GMT

In article <BxyysH.B66@ns1.nodak.edu> grosen@isc.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu (Johannes Grosen) writes:
> 
> The XFree FAQ says that the ATI Ultra (8514a) card is *not* supported
> in XFree86 yet I am certain that I have seen references to it by
> people who are successfully using it (Gateway machines). Can anyone
> confirm or deny this?
> 
> Thanks!
> -- 
> Johannes Grosen
> ISC System Administrator
> grosen@isc.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu

XFree86 does NOT support ATI Ultra (i.e. 8514) or S3.  There are people
working on X servers for those boards, under 386BSD and Linux.  But this
work is not part of XFree86; in fact, it's not even based on XFree86 (they
started with the stock X11R5 ports to those OSs).  Someone may wind up
porting those to XFree86, but we are not working on it ourselves.

--
David Wexelblat <dwex@mtgzfs3.att.com>  (908) 957-5871
AT&T Bell Laboratories, 200 Laurel Ave - 4B-421, Middletown, NJ  07748

"The meaning of life?  That's simple.  Try to be happy, try not to hurt
 other people, and hope to fall in love."  -- Mallory Keaton
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: gateswk@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (William K.)
Subject: Some people record there knowledge.
Summary: If you have the basics in a file I'd like to see them.
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 02:06:53 GMT




I don't know if anyone out there is like I am but when I am learning stuff
I tend to keep the basic info in a file so I can look at it and if someone
wants to know it they can look in that file.  What I'm wondering is if anyone
has something along these lines on the basic programming of windows in x.
You know how to open a window and put strings etc in it.  How to make the
colors different and the geometry and such.  I'm more concerned with
syntax than anything.  I know the c.  I need the main commands and the parameters that those commands take and the like.  I would appreciate it if someone
would share some of this info with me.  We have xwindows here at school now
but to the best of my knowledge we still don't have a course in programming
them.  Here they are use them....  We run X11R4 and 3 on two different systems
with Aix 3.1 on one and Aix 3.2 on the other. So if you could help me out
I'd appreciate it.  Thanx a lot.

Walker
gateswk@craft.camp.clarkson.edu

If you're ever lost in la la land look me up....
  I'm sure I'll be there....
    -Walker

CUL8R and I'm out....

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: qualtrak@netcom.com (Qual Trak)
Subject: Re: FLAME, FLAME ON X!!!
Organization: QualTrak Corporation
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:52:18 GMT

In article <RJC.92Nov13144522@daiches.cogsci.ed.ac.uk> rjc@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Caley) writes:
>In article <1992Nov10.173203.10719@dsd.es.com>, Paul Martz (pm) writes:
>
>pm> Yes but this doesn't sound like what the guy's describing. If this is
>pm> just free() only freeing memory back to the process, then starting the
>pm> same X client over again and walking it through the same sequence of
>pm> tasks should not cause the server process size to grow, because the
>pm> memory it freed before is still available to it.
>
>The word is `Fragmentation'. 
>
>--
>rjc@cogsci.ed.ac.uk			_O_
>					 |<

If the client asks the server to make him a window - the server
allocates the memory, not the client.  All the client gets is a window
id and the server does the heavy lifting. Only an opinion but spoken as
gospel...
------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Birchfield - QualTrak Corp (408) 730-2674 Home (408) 736-3852
jb@QualTrak.COM
------------------------------------------------------------------------


Xref: sparky comp.windows.x:19388 comp.windows.x.motif:7618
From: sdy@bcstec.boeing.com (Ugly Bag of Mostly Water)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x,comp.windows.x.motif
Subject: need help with XtArgVal on an SGI
Date: 19 Nov 92 21:24:27 GMT
Followup-To: comp.windows.x
Distribution: comp
Organization: Ringworld


We're porting an X/Motif app (X11R4/Motif 1.1.1) to an SGI (sys V 4.0.5) and
are having trouble compiling the source. This app successfully compiles and
runs on an Apollo/HP and RS6000.

One specific problem seems to be that functions prototyped with XtArgVal (which
is supposed to be size equivilent to XtPointer, char *, long, etc) generate
compile errors when invoked with non-XtArgVal types. We have lots of these
calls and don't necessarily want to go through and edit them all.

Also it seems that literal strings in the calling parameter list are not
allowed either. 

I couldn't seem to find any options on cc that would help (I tried various
forms of -ansi, -xansi, -prototypes, -cckr etc) and would appreciate any
help. Surely someone must've ported older code to the SGI successfully.

Unfortunately using gcc is not an allowable option.

thanks.

steve.


--
Steven D. Yee                 >>>  my employer does not share my opinions   <<<
sdy@bcstec.boeing.com         >>>   that's because I'm always right! =P     <<<
       I supply creativity to another's mistake as a form of self hate,
            What about your friends? Will they stand their ground?
                   Will they let you down, again? -- T.L.C.
Xref: sparky comp.windows.x:19270 comp.lang.postscript:5585
From: munoz@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (David Munoz)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x,comp.lang.postscript
Subject: Do the X11R5 Type1 font rasterizers use the AFM files for font hints?
Keywords: Bitstream,X11R5,Type1,IBM,Postscript,Fonts,AFM,font metrics,scaled fonts
Date: 17 Nov 92 19:33:19 GMT
Followup-To: poster
Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle


Hello Net-X-Perts,

Does anyone know if the Type1 font rasterizers for X11R5 (either the IBM or
Bitstream) use the Adobe Font Metrics files for font hints?

Additional, which font rasterizer is better?

Please e-mail if possible,

Thanks ahead of time,
David Munoz
munoz@bcstec.boeing.com
From: mahan@TGV.COM (Patrick L. Mahan)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: RE: X Program for VMS?
Date: 22 Nov 92 05:42:53 GMT
Organization: The Internet

#
#  I have just started looking for an Xterminal client for the vax
#system i'm on.  It's a 3520 with a Decwindows station only.
#I'm trying to get the client so i can use this term to connect to
#some hp's in some of the other rooms and across campus.
#Is Xview a good one? I have the sources for it but i can't get them
#off the CD right now as the sysmgr is off for a couple of days.
#Are there any others?  Also, has anyone had any experience in running
#Mathematica served from an HP9000/750 on an Xwindow on a vax?
#If so, how did it come out?  That's the main program i'd be running.
#

You don't need a "client" for this, just the ability to send the X protocol
between the Vax and the HP, either DECnet or TCP/IP.  For DECnet the HP will
need sometype of DECnet implementation.  For TCP/IP, the VAX will need 
a TCP/IP package.   In either case, simply log into the HP, point the
Display environment variable (DISPLAY) back at the VAX and run the X
application.  For example

	If you are using DECnet:

		$ SET HOST HP
		[after logging in]
		%#
		%# The "::" indicates to X that the connection is DECnet
		%#
		% setenv DISPLAY vax::0.0
		[run the X application]

	If you are using TCP/IP:

		$ TELNET HP
		[after logging in]
		%#
		%# The ":" indicates to X that the connection is TCP/IP
		%#
		% setenv DISPLAY vax:0.0
		[run the X application]

In both cases, you will need to make sure you Security is enabled on you
VAXstation (see the Security... in the session manager pulldown).  You might
also have problems with fonts, in which case you can obtain the public domain
fonts from export.lcs.mit.edu and compile them for the VAX using the DECwindows
font compiler.

Patrick L. Mahan

--- TGV Window Washer ------------------------------- Mahan@TGV.COM ---------

Waking a person unnecessarily should not be considered  - Lazarus Long
a capital crime.  For a first offense, that is            From the Notebooks of
							  Lazarus Long
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: cote@seismo.emr.ca (Tim Cote)
Subject: Re: xterm vt100 <-> tek4010 switching
Reply-To: cote@seismo.emr.ca
Organization: Dept. of Energy, Mines & Resources, Canada
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 16:53:08 GMT

In article FCB@acsu.buffalo.edu, PHYGONS@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu () writes:
>I am new to X. Am running it on a Sun IPX. I can switch manually from
>xterm vt100 to tex4010 windows using the mouse menus, but can't seem
>to get a graphics application program to do it. Escape sequences
>which work e.g. in kermit emulation do not do it. Sorry if this is
>a trivial question. Would appreciate information on how this can be
>done.
> 
>Thanks
> 
>Richard
>phygons@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu

There is a document called "Xterm Control Sequences" that says the escape code
to switch from vt100 mode to tek mode is <ESCAPE><CONTROL>C
To switch from tek mode to vt100 mode is <ESCAPE>[?38h
It works for me. Does your application use these escape sequences?

---
Tim Cote,  cote@seismo.emr.ca
Seismology Section, Geophysics Division, Geological Survey of Canada, EMR
1 Observatory Crescent, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada  K1A-0Y3
From: gronke@acpub.duke.edu (Paul Gronke)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: XAppeal Assistance
Date: 22 Nov 92 19:02:56 GMT
Organization: Duke University; Durham, N.C.

I am trying to see whether XAPPEAL will work on my system.
I am running a Gateway 2000 '486 with 8 meg RAM, Tseng 4000
video card, Novell Network connection.

========= network sign in section from autoexec.bat ========
lsl > nul
ne1000 -n 0x60 3 0x300 > nul
pdipx
netx > nul

========= Errors obtained from ERRORS ==============

ICMP: Network Unreachable

ICMP: Network Unreachable

ICMP: Network Unreachable

ICMP: Network Unreachable

===================================================

When I attach via TELNET first, and then issue this command
 (sleep 20; xterm -ls -d <my.ip.address>)&exit

  I get a few network unreachable commands, then this:

  3 or 4: ICMP: Port Unreachable

  and finally

  XDM: Too Many Retransmissions

Other notes: I get screen flashes, as if my PC is
trying to connect to XDM unsuccesfully.
           : I did connect succesfully when our
network was not reportng unique IP addresses (i.e. every PC
on the network would have the same IP).  Once the
network administrator assigned me a unique IP, i have been
unable to get XAppeal to run.
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
From: oj@miki.pictel.com (Oliver Jones)
Subject: Re: Help with GXxor option ?
Organization: PictureTel Corporation
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 00:34:35 GMT

In article <1egjpnINN9c0@news.aero.org> gurlitz@aero.org (Thomas R. Gurlitz) writes:

>The program (modelled on "helloworld.c") is intended to draw a line,
>wait a few seconds, then erase the line. At each mouse button press,
>a slightly different line segment should be drawn, displayed a few
>seconds, then erased. The print statements tell me when each line is drawn
>or undrawn.

The trick with XOR drawing is to use the same GC settings to draw and
undraw the line.

You need to make sure of the following:

(1) the GC function is set to GXxor before the first time you draw
    (it isn't in your example).

(2) the foreground in the XOR-drawing GC is set to 
    myforeground ^ mybackground -- the differences in
    bits between your foreground and background pixel values.
    (it wasn't).

(3) the window is initialized so it contains only background
    and foreground bits (it is, automatically, when mapped).


What you're doing when xor drawing is toggling the state of
foreground bits to background and vice versa.  That's why drawing
twice reverses the effect of drawing.  Setting the GC foreground
as shown in (2) allows the drawing operation to toggle the
bits.  

See the example on page 154 in the same book you got your example
program from.

Oliver Jones
From: mal11@po.CWRU.Edu (Matthew A. Lewis)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.x
Subject: quick question about remote clients on my server
Date: 21 Nov 1992 20:05:53 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: mal11@po.CWRU.Edu (Matthew A. Lewis)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc5.ins.cwru.edu




i am running X386 under linux on my 486 with networking, etc.
When I log onto another computer here on campus and attempt
to xsetroot -display <myaddress>:0.0
it says that it isn't authorized to connect to my machine. Where are
these authorizations????
I'd love to run Mathematica using my X for output :)

Thanks in advance.
-- 
maThiEu a. LeWis     "Don't ask me/what you know is true/don't have
cyber-mercenary       to tell you/I love your precious heart/I/I was
Thieves Like Us       standing/you were there/two worlds collided/and
mal11@Po.cwru.edu     they could never tear us apart."