HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ALKIRE@acuvax.acu.edu (AL KIRE)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: A calibre question
Date: 16 Apr 92 13:12:35 GMT
Organization: Lost in NETland

In <53122@mimsy.umd.edu> ahahma@utu.fi writes:

# In article <53075@mimsy.umd.edu> davidg@interop.com (David Gimpelevich) writes:
# 
# #Also, the same video does show how a fuel truck explodes when hit by
# #a bullet - a .50 BMG!
# 
# That reminded me to ask, what that caliber actually is. .50 BMG is a
# .50, of course, but what is the cartdridge (casing) like? Also, what
# do the letters stand for? Is the round some sort of a special one
# made by Barrett only, or is it a more common round? BMG == Browning
# Machine Gun?? (at least they have made some quite widely spread
# MGs in that calibre)
# 
# ArNO
# 
# [MODERATOR:   BMG == "big momma gun" I think....]
# 

The .50 BMG stands for Browning Machine Gun.  It is the cartridge for the big
machine guns usually used on airplanes, tanks, etc. since WWII.  They had 11 of
those suckers on the B-17s.  

It has become quite popular for 1000 yard target shooting.  The army uses a
McMillian built .50 BMG for sniping out to 2000 meters especially if the target
is microwave dishes, fuel dumps, etc.  According to the Special Forces weapons
specialist who briefed me, they have to be sure of their shot, because the
barrel heats up enough with one shot to change the point of impact 2 feet at
2000 meters.

If you are used to conventional sporting rounds (even the 8mm Rem. Mag.) the
only way to describe the case is HUGE!.  I don't have the exact specs, but the
projectile has got to be 2 to 3 inches long (and 1/2 inch in diameter).  The
case itself is 6 or 7 inches long and thicker than a broomhandle.  There is a
slight shoulder on it.  I bet the case head is at least an inch in diameter. 
I've never fired one, but the McMillan rifle I saw had a large muzzle brake on
it that worked like a jet thruster to pull the rifle away from the shoulder. 
This was to help counteract _some_ of the recoil.

_Guns & Ammo_ did an article on .50 BMG shooting not too long ago.  It was a
cover story if I remember.  One of the guys at work showed it too me.  They
even had reloading data (MASSIVE powder drops).  We figured out the number of
reloads per pound and it wasn't many.
From: bbx!bbx.basis.com!russ@unmvax.cs.unm.edu (Russ Kepler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: LUBES (PRELUBE?)
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:27:44 GMT
Organization: BASIS International, Albuquerque NM


In article <52664@mimsy.umd.edu> sybok@athena.mit.edu (The Terminator) writes:
#What lubricants should I use on my parkarized 1911 for
# 
#  (a) A general lubricant of outer surfaces and lockwork

I tend toward using Break-Free for the general cleaning and lubing of
pistols and rifles.  I first clean using Hoppes #9 then do a final
wipedown and cleaning using Break Free on a patch.  I spot lube
rotating surfaces (pins and the like) using Break Free and use a
synthetic grease on the larger flat surfaces (a light coating on a
bolt as an example).

#  (b) A bore lubricant which has teflon-like additives

After cleaning the bore I do a final pass with a clean patch wetted
with the Break Free mentioned above (as a matter of fact, the same
patch later used for the final wipedown).

#I'd prefer dry lubricants over oils, I think.

I use a anhydrous graphite (GunSlick?) on rails and on some bolts.

#Lastly, for a brand-new gun, that's never been fired, should it
#be taken down (field-stripped) and coated with lubricant before
#it's first fired, or does the factory make sure that it's adequately
#primed for the first shooting session?

Strip and detail clean it.  You never know what the factory has left
inside: could be completely dry and firing could gall unlubed surfaces.

-- 
Russ Kepler, Basis International Ltd. russ@bbx.basis.com  phone: 505-345-5232
From: erico@narrator.pen.tek.com (Eric Oosterhof;627-4329;47-720;tekig1.pen;)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: bullet & gasoline truck
Date: 14 Apr 92 20:17:29 GMT
Organization: tektronix


In article <53100@mimsy.umd.edu>, rrw@philabs.philips.com (Roger White) writes:
|> In article <53044@mimsy.umd.edu> rtaraz@ascoli.WPI.EDU (Ramin Taraz) writes:
|> ##>>>> On 10 Apr 92 23:21:05 GMT, rrw@philabs.philips.com (Roger White) said:

|> #Now, lets see here, how can somebody get hit with a bullet from a
|> #rifle and not loose his balance?  I dont care how good the armour is,
|> #you do loose your balance! (or maybe I am mistaking, I never stopped a
|> #bullet with my body)  
|> #
|> #One more thing, how can a _soft_ body armour protect you from a .44 magnum?
|> #
|> 

Think about it.  Remember in physics all the rumors about Newton's Law
and all that.  You know, equal and opposite actions.  Well, if the slug
from a gun has enough punch to knock over the shootEE, the shootER is
also on his butt.  That's physics, pure and simple.  Watch some war 
footage.  See GI Joe get shot and fall STRAIGHT down, none of this flying
back 10 feet crap.  That's application, pure and simple.  Watch a good
entertaining shoot `em up movie from Hollywood.  See John Rambo shoot
a Bad Dude and the Dude flies backwards, through a wall, and over a fence.
That's Hollywood bullshit, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT.

-- 
Eric Oosterhof                "Gentlemen, I have the utmost confidence 
erico@tekig1.PEN.TEK.COM       in your ability to perform...
(503) 627-4329                 the impossible!"  Capt. Jean-Luc Picard
"Choosy mothers choose .gif"  Anthony C. Zable
From: mac@cis.ksu.edu (Myron A. Calhoun)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Care of valuable guns
Date: 17 Apr 92 01:50:50 GMT
Organization: Kansas State University

stumpf@cs.washington.edu (Todd Stumpf) writes:
#   What should and shouldn't be done with a collector's gun?
# 
#   A few months ago, I found out my grandfather's luger was worth something....
# 
#   I took it to the local gunrange where they examined and apraised it.
#   It is not in the best condition, the grip is worn and the finished slightly
#   damaged.  There suggestion was that it "would make a great shooter."
    [.....]

My father-in-law left me a Browning "Light 12" with a Belgium barrel.
When I ran it by my gunsmith for a quick check, he said it had more
collector value than it had shotgun value.  But then he added that
since it appeared to be well used, I might as well continue to enjoy
using it; that it wasn't worth enough to put it up on a wall hook
just to look at.

Does anyone know which of the several "numbers" I can find on the gun
would be THE serial number?  I find digit-letter-digit-digit-digit
where shells are inserted and letter-digit-digit-digit-digit-digit
on the barrell itself.  It also has lots of funny little glyphs on it,
but I've heard those are called "smithmarks" or something like that?
--Myron.
-- 
# We preserve our freedoms using four boxes:  soap, ballot, jury, and cartridge.
# Myron A. Calhoun, PhD EE; Associate Professor  (913) 539-4448 home
# INTERNET:  mac@cis.ksu.edu (129.130.10.5)      532-6350 work, 532-7353 fax
#      UUCP:  ...rutgers!depot!mac               W0PBV @ K0VAY.KS.USA.NA
From: sybok@m4-035-12.MIT.EDU (The Terminator)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .357 Home Protection Gun Recommendations Sought
Date: 6 Apr 92 12:57:39 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

In article <52601@mimsy.umd.edu> bp816@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Stuart Krivis) writes:
#
#One thing no one has mentioned...  Don't use handloads for self-
#defense. They will make you out to be a monster in court if you
#ever actually have to shoot someone.
#
#Point 2: Why use a handgun for home protection? Shotguns are more
#effective and safer. Shotguns scare the hell out of burglars!
#You are much less likely to shoot thru 3 houses and kill Uncle
#Fred's goldfish. Kids are less likely to get in trouble with a
#shotgun in the house. AND it takes less skill to use a scatter-
#gun. Get a 410ga or go whole hog and get a 20. Remember, all
#those farmers can't be wrong! 

    A handgun is much better in close quarters--long guns can be more easily
    wrestled away from you, and you are more vulnerable when you swing them
    through large angles as you tiptoe through the house looking for the perp.
    Also, if you only have enough money for ONE gun, and you buy a shotgun,
    forget about ever carrying it for self-defense when something comes up.
    A handgun can serve both home-defense and self-defense niches.  Finally,
    you can still operate the handgun if the badguy gets the first shot and
    takes out one of your arms.  Unless you're Big Arnold, forget about
    operating your shotgun with one arm.


Oh, and if you're steadfast on a shotgun, don't use any kiddy calibers like
0.410 or 20-gauge--use a 12-gauge semi-auto with 00 Buck alternated with slugs
in the magazine. :-)
From: sybok@m4-035-17.MIT.EDU (The Terminator)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .357 145 gr. Sivertip
Date: 7 Apr 92 13:06:13 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

#I don't know wether our govt. usually open our mail, but customs may be
#curious about incoming boxes, just to be sure that all taxes are paid,
#to fight against drug traffic and so on. Being unable to see the inside
#of a package can make them very curious. In addition, it is strictly
#illegal to import ammo this way. Please, do not do this. It can cause
#me a *LOT* of problems and it can be very harmful to shooters here.
#
As you wish.  Well, if you ever change your mind, you know where I stand.
Are all hollowpoints banned there?
From: voodoo!tomm@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Tom Mackey)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Winchester shotgun reblueing tip
Date: 14 Apr 92 14:30:32 GMT
Organization: Boeing Graphics project, Bellevue WA



After the last two posts requesting info, I thought I'd justify my
existence here and offer the following little tidbit.  You may
remember I posted some months ago about inheriting all my dad's guns,
including a Winchester Model 42 .410 pump that had rusted.  I've been
asking around and by following several pointers, arrived at Simmons
Gun Repair.  They did all of Winchester's custom ventilated rib
installations, a process which requires re-blueing the gun.  Hence any
ventilated rib Winchester shotgun (at least from the period that
produced the Model 42) was "factory blued" by Simmons.  I checked the
value of the 42 and was shocked to see that one in excellent
condition will fetch $600 - $650.  As a matter of fact I know of one
that sold here in the Seattle area for $1000, but it was a triple
rarity:  it was modified choke, was one of the last to be made (S/N
was 2 or 3 before the end of the run), and it had a ventilated rib.
I talked to one Mr. Hopkins at Simmons who was willing to do what he
could towards restoring my 42 to as good a condition as possible,
considering that some of the rust has produced pits on the receiver.
They charge $180 for a typical ventilated rib installation.  The
extra hand work that my situation will require could run an
additional $100.  Not bad, to "factory" restore a fine firearm and
maybe add a custom rib at the same time.  Without further ado:

	Simmons Gun Repair
	Attn. Mr. Hopkins
	700 South Rogers Rd.
	Olathe KA  66062
	1-800-444-0220

When I do the deed, I'll let you all know how it turned out -- July or so.

-- 
Tom Mackey       (206) 865-6575        tomm@voodoo.boeing.com
Boeing Computer Services         ....uunet!bcstec!voodoo!tomm
M/S 7K-20,     P.O. Box 24346,     Seattle, WA     98124-0346
                    -Save Teddy Bear Cove-                   

[MODERATOR:  Keep us posted, Tom, a couple of us are pretty interested
in following your reconditioning of this.]
From: sybok@m4-035-19.MIT.EDU (The Terminator)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: alternating 00 buck and slugs t
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:20:45 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

In article <52983@mimsy.umd.edu> paulh@tekcae.cax.tek.com (Paul Hammer) writes:
#
##Oh, and if you're steadfast on a shotgun, don't use any kiddy calibers like
##0.410 or 20-gauge--use a 12-gauge semi-auto with 00 Buck alternated with slugs
##in the magazine. :-)
#
#Should a slug be first, or a 00 buck?

00 buck.
From: glock@glock.chip.cba.ufl.edu (Joe Granto (BACL))
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: polar bear
Date: 9 Apr 92 14:04:22 GMT
Organization: College of Business, University of Florida

Since someone said that a polar bear can be taken down with a .357 magnum, I 
put in another vote for the Glock 10mm.  The Glock can take ANYTHING you can 
buy or handload.  And I mean ANYTHING.  I talked to a police officer who 
handloaded a round so hot that flame shot through the trigger slot, and the 
gun cycled it fine.  The variety in loads is good; the heaviest hollowpoint 
is 200gr moving at 1100fps, while the real penetrator is a 155gr 1400+ round 
made by Hornady (come to think of it, the 200gr is also by Hornady).  I own 
one of these Glocks, and it is too sweet.  The gun can reliably take down 
deer, boar, and black bear.  It holds 15+1 rounds, and I do not doubt that 
someone (if not Glock) will come out with a +2 magazine butt.  My personal 
recommendation would be to buy a box or two of HydraShoks, Silvertips, or 
Starfires, pull the bullets, and load them to about 1400fps (all of these 
rounds have been emasculated to meet the FBI criteria; fine for use against 
people, not fine against bears).  Bullet pulling is easy, and the Glock can 
handle the hot rounds.  I'd be interested in knowing how bad the kick is...

[MODERATOR:  Don't try this at home without an adult, kids ....]
From: gmk@falstaff.MAE.CWRU.EDU (Geoff Kotzar)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: NEI Bullet Moulds
Date: 16 Apr 92 17:55:27 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University

The latest American Rifleman reported that NEI/Tooldyne, also known as NorthEast
Industrial, has stopped manufacturing the line of bullet moulds they offered.
The reasons cited were manufacturing problems and health problems of the owner.
This is supposed to be temporary but the company returned all unfilled orders
and refunded any deposits,  so who knows how long the suspension will be.

The point of all this is that NEI made the J.D. Jones/SSK bullet moulds and
those that are still in stock at SSK and Cor-Bon may be all that there will
be for some time. Anyone out there shooting and especially hunting with the
.41, .44 and .454 and using cast bullets may want to pick up these moulds now.
I know that there are several companies offering cast bullets dropped from the
SSK designed moulds -Cor-Bon, Patriot, and Penn for example- that will probably
be scarfing these moulds up. How long the supply will last is anyone's guess.

I don't have the addresses for these two companies but they advertise in almost
all of the gun magazines. For the record, I am not affiliated with any of the
above companies. I have used the NEI moulds for years with great satisfaction
and would not like to be without the SSK designs that I have at present.

geoff kotzar          gmk@falstaff.mae.cwru.edu
From: tnev2@isuvax.iastate.edu
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Shotguns vs Handguns (was: Gun Recommendations Sought)
Date: 7 Apr 92 22:31:16 GMT
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa

In article <52674@mimsy.umd.edu>, mbrown@convex.com (Mark Brown) writes:
#
##|Kids are less likely to get in trouble with a shotgun in the house.
#
#_ANY_ kind of gun that is kept in a house with kids should have a 
#trigger lock on it when the adults aren't around.
#

	In Iowa, it's a legal requirement.  (one of the few gun laws that the
NRA supported)

		-CJ
From: baechler@lia.di.epfl.ch (Emmanuel Baechler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: rec.guns #14820 - Re: Finnish rifle rewiew
Date: 10 Apr 92 18:20:02 GMT

|> STUPID QUESTION TIME : What's a "diopter sight?"


A diopter sight is basically a diaphragm whose internal diameter
can be adjusted. They are adjustable in windage and elevation. Most
of them have an "eye protection" so that they can be used without
fearing the sun.

-- 
Emmanuel Baechler.
Laboratoire d'Intelligence Artificielle
Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne
MA-Ecublens
CH-1015 Lausanne	Switzerland
Tel.: ++41-21-693-2732
e-mail: baechler@liasun6.epfl.ch
Standard Disclaimer

Ban the bomb. Save the world for conventional warfare.
From: n8441213@henson.cc.wwu.edu (Gary Rutledge)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: 264 Winchester Mag.
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:27:48 GMT
Organization: Western Washington University


     Hey Guys,
     
     Someone is wanting to buy my dads' 264 Winchester Magnum.  How much
     should I ask for it?  (Depending on the price, it may or may not be
     for sale.)
     
     Also, as I hunt the early-bow season these days,  I've lost touch with
     caliber-Vs-Task knowledge.  Would someone please refresh me about
     what the 264 Mag. is good for?  Deer, Elk, Bear(big/small), Longrange
     target, etc?
     
     Thanks,
     
     Gary
     Physics Department
     Western Washington University
From: C08926RC@WUVMD.Wustl.Edu (Rob)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: New England Firearms
Date: 14 Apr 92 14:31:33 GMT


I was ready to order a rifle when I came across an ad for New England
Firearms' 9 shot .22 Revolver and 5 shot .32 H&R Magnum.  Is NEF the
new owners of the old H&R line?  Has anyone seen their revolvers?

I thought the quality of the late model H&R revolvers was good; if
these are the same, then I may spend the $71.50 on one.

And that leads me to my final questions:  What's the future hold for
the .32 H&R Magnum?  Will I be able to find brass and bullets for
reloads?  How about factory loads?

Thanks in advance!

Rob
C08926RC@WUVMD
From: jeffs@austlcm.sps.mot.com (jeff stump)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Hearing Protectors - HELP
Date: 9 Apr 92 23:30:49 GMT


   I wonder if anyone out there has found any smaller or more comfortable
hearing protectors. The headset types are comfortable except on hot/humid
days when they are terrible to wear here ( Texas from Mar-Nov ). 
Also, some rifle shooting is very uncomfortable with headsets on.
  I have tried *many* of the smaller ear 'plugs ' but, either they do not
seal good or offer too little protection (db's). Has anyone else had a 
similar problem ? Any reccomendations ? I have heard that at some gun shows
there are people who will pour into your ear a set of plugs but, I have 
yet to see them ? 
  What is the minimum (in dB) rating one should have for say pistol shooting
with .22,.357,.45 under an iron roof outdoors ?  Comments ?
***********************************************************
**  Jeff Stump                                           **
**  Motorola Inc, Austin, Texas                          **
**  E-mail:  jeffs@austlcm.sps.mot.com                   **
***********************************************************

[MODERATOR:  For the best protection, the headset style should
be kept, plus use plugs underneath.  Or so our club know-it-alls
assure us, one of whom I think works for OSHA doing sound "stuff".
Seems the bone (skull) directly behind your ear should be protected
too, as it will conduct more energy than is good directly to the
ear.  Several of the locals on this net should be able to tell 
you about the custom plugs you describe.]
From: hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Hearing Protectors - HELP
Date: 11 Apr 92 23:43:49 GMT
Organization: Computing Center, North Carolina State University

In article <52908@mimsy.umd.edu> jeffs@austlcm.sps.mot.com (jeff stump) writes:
# ...  I have heard that at some gun shows
#there are people who will pour into your ear a set of plugs but, I have 
#yet to see them ? 

  I got a set made up at a gun-show.  The material is silicone rubber
(normally used for prostheses) and it is kneaded with a catalyst and
packed into your ear.  These are reasonably comfortable to wear, but
don't give wonderful protection for me because it seems that with
my moving my jaw (mostly talking :-) that very small gaps appear
between my ear and the plug and reports get through.  Also the lack
of skull coverage probably also makes a difference.  When I wear
them under the muffs it really is *excellent*.

# ...
#[MODERATOR:  For the best protection, the headset style should
#be kept, plus use plugs underneath.  Or so our club know-it-alls
#assure us, one of whom I think works for OSHA doing sound "stuff".
#Seems the bone (skull) directly behind your ear should be protected
#too, as it will conduct more energy than is good directly to the
#ear.   ...

  That's what I've heard, too.

--henry schaffer  n c state univ
From: sybok@m4-035-1.MIT.EDU (The Terminator)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: PEN GUN
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:20:55 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

Where could I get a pen gun?
From: jalden@coos.dartmouth.edu (Joshua M. Alden)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: General Shotgun questions
Date: 7 Apr 92 13:04:23 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

Hello.

    Just got a Remington 870 (somewhat worn, but very serviceable).
It's been a long time since I used a shotgun, and then it was only to
shoot trap.  This one is going to be used for home defense, trap & skeet
and perhaps hunting, in that order.

    I have some questions.  First, how do I measure the barrel length
for legal purposes?  Measuring from where the barrel starts just in
front of the breech I get 25 inches.  (I got a good deal, so I was
willing to accept a long barrel).

    I'd like to get it cut down to somewhere near the legal length in
the not-too-distant future.  I know that this decreases its utility as a
hunting weapon, but are there still types of hunting where this doesn't
matter as much?  Can I compensate with a choke (right now it's wide
open)?  (I've got a friend who's going to teach me to hunt this fall
and I've taken a hunter safety course, so all you hunters can stop
wincing now.  :)  Obviously, for close-quarters movement a shorter
barrel (and open choke) is much better.  How does shortening the barrel
effect trap and skeet?

    Any idea how much getting it cut down will cost?  It's got an
attractive sight-bar running the length of the barrel and that will have
to be cut back a little shorter than the barrel and ground off, polished
and blued.  And the sight bead will need to be moved or replaced, of
course.

    Presently it holds four shells in the magazine.  How much does an
extended magazine cost, and are there any to avoid or particularly look
for?

    Are there any good books out there which will tell me how to do more
than field-strip it (really give it a good cleaning)?  It's clean now,
but I'll be shooting it a lot in the near future if my schedule
permits...  and certainly I want to become proficient with it before it
gets put in a gunlock behind the bed.

-Josh.

--
Josh Alden:  Joshua.Alden@dartmouth.edu
EMT Instructor, DMS Health Education And Rescue Training
Ownership of a weapon is a victimless crime.
From: baechler@lia.di.epfl.ch (Emmanuel Baechler)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: (null)
Date: 7 Apr 92 18:12:59 GMT


# Well, maybe the .454 would work if you stuck it in his ear.  Otherwise
# I wouldn't feel safe with ANY handgun cartridge.  Well, maybe just the
# .50 BMG.  {:^)

I have read at several times that people who in the arctic have both a
rifle (in 375 H&H for example) and a revolver in .44 magnum or .454 as
a backup. The backup is really important, especially when the rifle is
deeply buried in the luggage and the bear comes too close.

##   (b) Are semi auto rifles appropriate, or does the cold weather 
##       interfere with reliability?

Be extremely careful before buying a semiauto. Most of them have serious
problems when they are used in extremely cold times.

# The polar bear is about the most dangerous predator you can come up
# against, and they don't go down easily.

At least, you seem them arriving, while you only see a tiger when he
already eating you. In addition it is much more agile. IMHO a Bengal's
tiger is more dangerous.

Emmanuel Baechler.
Laboratoire d'Intelligence Artificielle
Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne
MA-Ecublens
CH-1015 Lausanne	Switzerland
Tel.: ++41-21-693-2732
e-mail: baechler@liasun6.epfl.ch
Standard Disclaimer

Ban the bomb. Save the world for conventional warfare.