From: stingray@unlisys.in-berlin.de (Christian Lampl)
Subject: Re: Jews For Germans
Organization: Unlimited Surprise Systems, Berlin
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:18:08 GMT

aliki@nova1.stanford.edu (Alexandra Schmidt) writes:

>Dear Christian--

>The fact that anti-Semitism was not a German idea is irrelevant.  (It may
>also be untrue; consider the virulent anti-Semitism of Martin Luther, who
>established the religion many Germans follow today.  But that's another
>issue and not one I want to take up now.)  As has been earlier pointed out, 
>cruelty is not a German trait per se; it's a human one.  That does not make 
>it any less excusable in action.  The same is true for anti-Semitism: a person
>is responsible for his anti-Semitic actions, period.  Where the idea came 
>from--particularly in the case of something that's been around as long as 
>anti-Semitism--just doesn't make a difference at this point, particularly
>not to the six million and those who survived.
Yes, you are right. A person is responsible for him- or herself.
But some people, like Michael or Lawrence, seem not to understand,
that this is no matter of belonging to a special race or country.
Btw: In their opinion to be German means to belong to a special
     race which is more violent and more rasistic than others.
     Looking at Germans as members of a special race is just
     the same bullshit the Nazis did. But this fact they don't
     want to hear.
Antisemitism goes back at least to the 11th century, the time
of the crusades. And it was spread over whole Europe.


>As to being silent out of fear: that may be so, but it's not something to
>be proud of either.  It's not the same thing as murder, but it makes the
>task of the murderers much easier.
I'm not proud of the things my ancestors have done. I just
don't believe that people in other countries would have behaved
in a different way. Look at the countries Germany had occupied.
Many people there were afraid. Do you think that Germans who
fought against the system were treated different than other 
enemies ?

>This is true.  Being objective means that we accept the fact that a 
>German teenager today is not responsible for the sins of his grandfather
>(speaking generally, I'm not making any personal accusations).  It also
>means that discussions of the recent past not be dismissed as 'dirt-digging'
>or 'trying to stir up trouble'.   (Again, I don't accuse you of this, but
>it is behavior I have seen personally and read about.)
Well, I see it the same way. It was cruel what happend in Germany.
But I don't have such a historical minority complex that 
I can't say that the things, for example, Lawrence said
were bullshit and that everybody who has such rasistic point of
views is an asshole. Doesn't matter if he is a jew or not.
BTW: What are the sins of my grandfather ?
     Was it a sin that he became a soldier ?
     Well, the youth was told that they had to fight for their
     country. It is rubbish but still taught in many countries
     to the young pupils even today.
     At least in this point of view many germans have learned
     something.

Bye,
  Christian

-- 
"There're so many different worlds, so many different suns,
 but we have just one world, though we live in different ones"
- Dire Straits "Brothers in arms"
Christian Lampl - stingray@unlisys.in-berlin.de - aka Ray at the IRC