Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: God speaks
From: <MVS104@psuvm.psu.edu>
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 11:33:09 EST
 e.com><1992Nov11.040917.27760@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu>
Organization: Penn State University

In article <1992Nov11.040917.27760@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu>,
brian@lpl.arizona.edu (Brian Ceccarelli 602/621-9615) says:
>
>   Jesus really doesn't give a hoot about intellect.  It doesn't impress
>him.  Why should it?  He himself created the universe . . . Einstein,
>Hawkins, Marilyn Vos Savant and the likes are less than kindergardners
>compared
>to the intellect of Jesus.  To Jesus, we all have insignficant I.Q.s.
>He has infinite I.Q.  The sum total of ours approaches zero in comparison.

So what you're saying is why bother thinking about anything, it doesn't
matter because we're all just stupid in comparison. Excuse me if I
don't think that a guy who riled people until he was hanged on a cross
is a genius...

>   Things that may seem important to you and I are not important in His
>eyes.  Do you know what impresses Jesus?  It is not intellect.
>Read the Bible carefully.  You will find only one thing.  Faith.
>Faith impresses Jesus.  Jesus is amazed and pleased when people show
>faith.  That is what Jesus looks for.   And for the definition of
>faith, (don't give me that blind faith crap), take faith in context.
>Read Hebrews 11 for the contextual definition.

So he's impressed by faith. Well, you'd think with his intellect, he'd
think, "well, they're really trying to comprehend this mess, and I give
them credit for trying." You say, no, he frowns on our using our brains.
As for blind faith, I'll just give it to you anyway. Why don't you
post this meaning of faith which you think isn't blind? Or are you just
assuming it isn't blind so you look better? What isn't blind about faith?

>   From Jesus's perspective, more times than not, the intellect
>only serves as an inhibitor from entering God's Kingdom.  Not
>because intellect is bad in itself, but it usually breeds
>pride and ego.  Pride and ego yield the I-can-do-it-myself
>attitude.  From there, the next step is the I-don't-need-God
>attitude.  That is the lie.  If you don't think so now,
>then wait until later.

Falling back on the old terrorist tactics again? Excuse me if I don't
cower and beg for forgiveness. After all, it's not as if god has
revealed himself to me. And no, the bible isn't good enough. If it was,
we wouldn't be arguing. As for pride and ego, well, I like them
because they help me survive. Who else should I feel good about?
You want so badly to prove we can't do it ourselves. So explain why
we are. Is it because of god? Doesn't appear that way.

>    There's a big picture here.  Learning computers until you are
>blue in the face, rummaging through tech manuals, collecting facts,
>getting good at trivia pursuit, doesn't do you any good in the
>end.  You die in the end.   All those intellectual facts we
>collect until we die do us no good in heaven nor in hell.  As

Assuming there is a heaven and hell. And I don't. So prove to me that
they exist, and maybe I'll start to do what you suggest. And don't
just blindly quote bible passages; really prove them! I want to know,
not to blindly believe.

>    Remember when you were a child?  I had a happy childhood.  I
>trusted my parents in matters that I didn't know nor even cared
>about even if I knew.   There are a thousand things like that in our
>adult lives too.  I trust God the Father to take care of them
>and he seems fit.  He can do things I simply can't.  That is
>the childlike attitude that Jesus is talking about.

So the trick is to deny you can actually do anything, and beg god to do
it for you? Sounds pretty lame to me, but hey, if he's willing...
Anyway, prove your god exists before you ramble on so much. I'm sure
that's what I'd rather see first. And if you can't prove him, then ask
him to pay me a visit. He's not answering me. Wonder why?

Martin Schulte
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc,talk.origins,alt.atheism