From: esz001@cck.coventry.ac.uk (Will Overington)
Subject: Re: U` => Declension cases in Esperanto
Organization: Coventry University
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:20:11 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.102313.15918@ccsun.strath.ac.uk> duncan@spd.eee.strathclyde.ac.uk (Duncan C Thomson) writes:
>En alt.uu.lang.esperanto.misc esz001@cck.coventry.ac.uk (Will Overington) diras:
>>I did some Latin, and just a little German years ago, so think
>>of there being six cases, as in Latin, or four as in German.
>
>Aha - perhaps *this* is the reason your Esperanto learning isn't so fast.
>
>Aha - *jen* kial vi ne lernas Esperanton rapide.

Why do you reach that strange conclusion?

It is a matter of schedule, and, until being on the net and finding
soc.culture.esperanto and now alt.uu.lang.esperanto.misc, a matter of
finding the incentive of being able to use it, even if it is only
a little.


>
>> [ a screenful of text explaining that Esperanto has in fact got four
>>   (or is it six) cases and that *this* is how it should be taught    ]
>>
>>If people agree with me on this approach, maybe we can draw up a
>>piece of learning material.
>
>I very much disagree.  Here we have a beautifully easy language with two
>completely regular cases, and you want to complicate things by saying it
>has six cases, only one of which uses an ending, and four of which use
>prepositions.  I'm sure the average person learning Esperanto has no
>interest in spending days learning Latin case structure before learning
>their first Esperanto word.

I quite agree that surely the average person learning Esperanto has no
interest in spending days learning Latin case structure before learning
their first Esperanto word.

However, one could start with Nominative and Accusative and then,
when sentences of the complexity of having an Indirect Object arise,
state that it is Dative case and say that the ending is the same as
for the nominative but that one uses a preposition in order to make
it clear that it is not the nominative noun or pronoun.

I feel that this could, done carefully, lead to a much clearer
understanding of the grammar and avoid some sort of mumbo-jumbo
confusion where people think that there are several subjects but
that some subjects have prepositions!

But it isn't Latin case structure as such. We have Indirect Object
(that is, Dative) and Genitive in English.

One can say that Esperanto does not have the Anglo-Saxon Genitive form.

For example,

In English

The man's book.  (deriving from "The man his book" I think)

or

The book of the man.

In Esperanto

La libro de la viro.

>I very much disagree.  Here we have a beautifully easy language with two
>completely regular cases, ....

Are you claiming that Esperanto has two and only two cases?

Are these then Nominative and Accusative?

Does that mean that Esperanto thus has no Genitive case?  :-)

Does that mean that Esperanto thus has no Dative case?    :-)    :-)

Hmm!


>
>Amike (kaj ne-flame),
>
>	-Duncan

Yes, friendly disagreement, in the spirit of a learning discussion
at our mutual university (Usenet University).

>Duncan C THOMSON                            |  .__ _.._ .__._  _ , .___ _
>         <duncan@spd.eee.strathclyde.ac.uk> |  |_ |_ |_||_ |_|/_\|\| | / \
>SPD, Dept of EEE, University of Strathclyde |  |__._||  |__| \| || | | \_/
>204 George Street, Glasgow G1 1XW, UK       | esperanto - lingvo internacia

Will

Newsgroups: alt.uu.lang.esperanto.misc