HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: svh@verdix.com (Steven Hovater)
Subject: Re: Stranger in a Strange Land
Organization: Verdix Corp.
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 20:12:35 GMT

toten@bourbon.ee.tulane.edu (Derek Toten) writes:

>In article <mad-celt.715618885@cwis> mad-celt@cwis.unomaha.edu (Andrew Patrick Booth) writes:
>>minnear@ll.mit.edu (Bob Minnear) writes:
>but the most basic of visual descriptions.  And though I have no doubts
>Heinlen would have gladly tackled the assignment, I'm not convinced he 
>could have pulled it off.  Anyone know if he wrote any screenplays,
>produced or otherwise?

>				Derek
> 
Actually, yes. The flick "Destination: Moon" was from a Heinlein story - 
and in "Expanded Universe" and "Grumbles From the Grave", he discusses working
on it. In such a way does he discuss it (mostly with derogatives) that 
I rather doubt he would have taken it on.

Steve (a die-hard Heinlein fan)
-- 
Steven V. Hovater                      (703)318-5839
Verdix Corporation                     svh@verdix.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies,rec.arts.movies
From: dave@blackbox.cc.columbia.edu (David Milner)
Subject: Re: Godzilla / Nike TV Ad
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 03:13:11 GMT

The next GODZILLA VS. CHARLES BARKLEY commercial will be debuted
during the MTV Video Music Awards on Sept. 9th.

David Milner  Columbia University
inet:   dave@blackbox.cc.columbia.edu
usenet: ...rutgers!columbia!blackbox!dave
        ...rutgers!columbia!blackbox.cc.columbia.edu!dave
From: gbradley@uks197.Berkeley.EDU (Gary Bradley)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Alien^3: religious and pre-modern
Date: 15 Sep 92 17:12:30 GMT
Reply-To: gbradley@uks197.Berkeley.EDU (Gary Bradley)

mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at (Markus Stumptner) writes...

> Take a look at the other works of H.J. Giger (the Swiss artist who
> designed the Alien).  I don't know or care whether Giger is a rabid
> Freudian (could be, at that), but those sexual motifs are quite
> present, and intentional.  (I've often wondered what that guy dreams,
> but I've concluded that I prefer not to know.)

   Giger was once quoted as saying that he dreams the worlds of H.P.
Lovecraft. 

+---------------------+------------------------------------------+
| Gary Bradley        |   "You receive a love letter from me and |
| ORACLE Corp, UK     |                  you're f*cked forever!" |
| Edinburgh, SCOTLAND |        - Frank Booth ("Blue Velvet")     |
+---------------------+------------------------------------------+
| "God damn the censor man"                                      |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.movies:7071 alt.cult-movies:7908
From: kachun@astro.as.arizona.edu (Ka Chun Yu)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies,alt.cult-movies
Subject: Re: Blade Runner Director's Cut (SPOILERS)
Keywords: blade runner ridley scott director cut film
Date: 15 Sep 92 01:42:43 GMT
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ

In article <1992Sep14.223008.19139@wam.umd.edu> dododge@wam.umd.edu (David O. Dodge) writes:
>In article <1992Sep14.004216.27090@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu> kachun@astro.as.arizona.edu (Ka Chun Yu) writes:
>>That part was kind of neat:  you finally heard everything that the adverti-
>>sing blimp was spouting.
>
>Are you sure? In the DC it switches to something like "this announcement
>brought to you by" using a different voice than the normal blimp voice,
>but in the old version the blimp keeps talking in it's normal voice while
>Deckard's voiceover is going on. IMO this was the worst of the new
>sound edits. It was too noticable.
>

True there was that extra bit, but in the DC, the blimp does continue with
the advertising spiel that one can here in the original if you turn up the
sound way up and pay really close attention (by ignoring Ford's voiceover).
In the DC however, you hear the whole advertisement without any difficulty.

>Or maybe I just wasn't paying close enough attention, I don't know...
>
>                                           -Dave Dodge/dododge@wam.umd.edu


--
*Ka Chun Yu                 * "Deputy dog dog a ding dang depa depa deputy     *
*kachun@as.arizona.edu      *  dog dog a ding dang depa depa . . ."            *
*                           *                         --"Don't Let's Start"    *
From: allan@slab.unt.edu (Mark Allan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Deckard is a replicant?
Date: 14 Sep 92 23:05:42 GMT
Organization: School of Library & Info Sci, UNT

In article <6360@transfer.stratus.com> jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann) writes:
>Path: mercury.unt.edu!news.oc.com!eff!news.byu.edu!gatech!darwin.sura.net!spool.mu.edu!news.nd.edu!mentor.cc.purdue.edu!noose.ecn.purdue.edu!samsung!transfer!vineland.pubs.stratus.com
>From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
>Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
>Subject: Re: Deckard is a replicant?
>Message-ID: <6360@transfer.stratus.com>
>Date: 14 Sep 92 18:25:16 GMT
>References: <rabjab.95.0@golem.ucsd.edu>
>Sender: usenet@transfer.stratus.com
>Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
>Lines: 13
>In article <rabjab.95.0@golem.ucsd.edu> rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu (Jeff  
>Bytof) writes:
>> What evidence is there in the film and the book it's based on that  
>Deckard
>> is a replicant?  Interesting idea.
>> 
>AARGH.  Most of the old-time readers of the SF groups (old time ==
>more than a year or so) have just covered their heads and hidden
>under their desks.
>
>--
>Jim Mann            
>Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  


If so, would the old-timers please fill in us young-uns w/ a brief summation 
of facts?
From: mikep@hpmwtd.sr.hp.com (Mike Powell)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 00:24:23 GMT
Subject: Re: Godzilla / Nike TV Ad
Organization: HP Santa Rosa Site (NMD MTA MWTD)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies

	
	Some trivia about the spot.....

	It was intended as a 60 second spot (and all the required
	footage was shot) but for some reason, it was cut in half
	and unfortunately looks it.  

	-Mike-

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: kenl@origami.cc.bellcore.com (Ken Lehner)
Subject: Re: Plot holes in Alien^3 (*S
Keywords: isaac_newton
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 92 18:59:16 GMT


In article <1992Sep8.182208.28014@tandem.com>, Montague_Kevin@Tandem.com (Kevvy Kev) writes:
|> 
|> No, the clear implication (and this is supported rather than contradicted by
|> non-canonical references) is that the first one got hurt and maybe even killed
|> when the glass broke. Which brings us to two more brain-dead mistakes:
|> 1) The instinct of the f'hugger would've been to sear through the glass, not
|>    melt it.  Did these people even watch _Alien_?
|> 2) The fact that it broke through seamless, curved, Strong glass like the 
|>    cryotube implies fantastic strength.  Again: there's no way Ripley could've
|>    held one of those off with her bare hands.  Either through brute force or
|>    with acid, it would've gotten to her Very quickly.
|>  

Let's try some physics.

Broke the glass or "seared through it"?  How would you suggest that the
little beastie summoned up the FORCE to break the glass?  Force is mass
times acceleration.  Can't weigh very much, can it?  Hopping up and down
on the glass sure wouldn't break it.  Either it's strength
comes from tremendous "arm" speed (which would tend to pull itself up off
the glass:  action/reaction, unless it was adhering to the glass), or it
pushed off something (like the ceiling) with tremendous speed.  Doubtful
on both counts.

What's to stop the glass from shattering after being damaged by acid?
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: toten@bourbon.ee.tulane.edu (Derek Toten)
Subject: Re: Stranger in a Strange Land
Organization: E.E. Dept., Tulane University, New Orleans, LA
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 17:19:08 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-24504]: bourbon

In article <mad-celt.715618885@cwis> mad-celt@cwis.unomaha.edu (Andrew Patrick Booth) writes:
>minnear@ll.mit.edu (Bob Minnear) writes:
>
>
>>Does anyone one know if 'Stranger in a Strange Land' is being
>>made into a movie.  I seem to remember reading somewhere that
>>it was, and Tom Hanks would play Smith, but I can't remember
>>now where I saw that...
>
>
>I never heard anything about it.  I think that Tom Hanks would play Smith
>well.  I wonder who would direct this movie?  Not many directors could pull
>it off.  I think George Lucas could make it a great movie.  However the movie
>is only as good as the screenplay.  It's too bad that Robert Heinlen isn't 
>around to do it.  (Isaac Asimov would have been a good second choice, but alas
>he is gone as well)
>
	Sorry, but I can't resist a few comments here...
C
	George Lucas is no longer a director.  The last film he 
personally directed (as far as I can determine) was released more than 15
years ago.  In fact, he has only three directorial credits to his name:

	"THX-1138"
	"American Graffiti"
	"Star Wars"
 
	And that's it!  Perhaps Lucas can produce this film, but he won't
be the director.
	
	And while we're on the subject, Asimov did not, could not and would 
not write film scripts.  As he constantly pointed out, he did not believe 
himself to be visually oriented, something probably necessary when writing
for the screen.  Indeed, most of his works are amazingly lacking in anything
but the most basic of visual descriptions.  And though I have no doubts
Heinlen would have gladly tackled the assignment, I'm not convinced he 
could have pulled it off.  Anyone know if he wrote any screenplays,
produced or otherwise?

				Derek
 
Derek Toten
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: egl1@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Elizabeth G. Levy)
Subject: Re: Deckard is a replicant?
Reply-To: egl1@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Elizabeth G. Levy)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 13:55:12 GMT

In article <92257.025142TJS107@psuvm.psu.edu> Sime <TJS107@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>In article <rabjab.95.0@golem.ucsd.edu>, rabjab@golem.ucsd.edu (Jeff Bytof)
>says:
>
>>What evidence is there in the film and the book it's based on that Deckard
>>is a replicant?  Interesting idea.
>>
>>Jeff Bytof
>
>Oof.  I'll bet Jeff is gonna be sorry he asked that question as soon as the
>rest of us movie geeks log on in the morning...
>The rest of the net will be sorry too, if I'm not mistaken...this topic has
>been beaten to death, hasn't it?
>Sime

Aah, but the Director's Cut has been released since the last time it
was beaten to death....

Time to pull out the clubs again....


--
"It's a Drake's Coffee Cake....  I have another one, but I'm saving
it for _later_."
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: Mr_b
Subject: Re: Has the new BLADERUNNER movie come out yet??
Organization: LMSC
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 92 20:36:27 GMT


Since the directors's cut Blade Runner just started playing today,
I sure there will be a flurry of info from other posters. The review
I read said that yes, it is different, no, it is only slightly
different.  I guess, just go see it.

What I've read makes it clear that this director's cut is again different
from the director's cut movie that was seen in a few places at least six
months ago, and both of those were different from the video of several
years ago, which was touted for sceens that had been cut from the general
release movie of 10 years ago.

The review had one funny concluding comment:
'Of course, in one very important way "Blade Runner" has dated.  Can you
imagine anyone making a movie today in which the happy ending meant you
spent the rest of your life with Sean Young?'

--
From: D.J.Butcher@newcastle.ac.uk (Dave Butcher)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Judge Dredd movie!!!
Date: 7 Sep 92 08:29:16 GMT
Organization: Computing Laboratory, U of Newcastle upon Tyne, UK NE1 7RU.


<92248.101555JW83HISW@MIAMIU.BITNET>
writes
>works.  Dredd is a comic book character, a futuristic cop, that was
>created in England and imported to the U.S.  The cool thing is the
>guy who's going to play Dredd . . . Arnold Schwarzenegger!
>     This is no rumor.  A producer named Pressman is looking at scripts
>now, and Arnold has agreed to do the movie.  The budget for F/X alone
>is $50 million!  This is going to be the next BIG SF/action movie, and
>will hopefully do justice(pun intended!) to the Judge Dredd character.
>     IMO - Arnold is perfect for Dredd.  The lasting success of the
>movie will hinge on the script and the supporting cast - effects won't
>be important, as long as they aern't cheap looking.

The FX budget sounds almost adequate, this is a film that NEEDS FX,
Arnie looks the part almost absolutely, the accent might ba a slight problem
though, maybe not.  The biggest problem will be the script.
There is no way that the people who would write the script to make the best
SF/action movie ever will be given the job. (ie the creators of Dredd) and
I doubt the Artists that have been drawing him since 1978 will be consulted
of the look of the film.
It could end up a painful experience.

WAGNER / GRANT / GIBSON / EZQUERRA being the first four to spring to mind.

There are so many others that have added to the most zarjaz character ever.

Unless they are involved intimately with the film, I can see it being the most
embarrasing piece of I-don't-know-what since I-don't know when.
If they ARE deeply involved I can envisage nothing that would keep me away from
it.
Well I'll watch it either way, but I am not raising my hopes too much.

Dave

--
David Butcher n0404@ncl.ac.uk -
Splundig Vur Thrigg!
I think that says it all really ;)
From: kuchar@buast7.bu.edu (Tom Kuchar)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: STVI LD version vs. VHS
Date: 9 Sep 92 12:10:53 GMT
Organization: Astronomy Department, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA

In article <1992Sep8.164637.28800@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> ckt4x@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Curt Tsui) writes:
>Recently a friend of mine found that the package for the laser
>disc version of Star Trek VI has over three minutes of extra
>footage, versus the two minutes of the video.  I've seen the
>video, but what about the laser disc?  Does anyone know what
>the extra minute plus of footage not on the video is?

I have the LD version. From the discussion in this and other news
groups, there appears to be no difference in LD and VHS versions.  In
all fairness, I haven't seen the VHS version.  Why the discrepency?
Who knows? Perhaps two different companies did the LD and VHS version,
one rounded up the time of the added footage, the other rounded down ;-).




-- 
Tom Kuchar			  
kuchar@buast7.bu.edu		  -or-                      kuchar@plh.af.mil
Department of Astronomy		                     Phillips Laboratory/GPOB
Boston Univerity		                                  Hanscom AFB
From: rjking@acsu.buffalo.edu (Randall J. King)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Plot holes in Alien^3
Date: 15 Sep 92 23:57:12 GMT
Organization: UB

Just to throw my $.02 in,
I thought the face hugger 'crushed' Kane's helmet.  As we all know from
Chemistry, acid doesn't eat through glass (at least the ones we know:).
Oh well, we know the little suckers are strong, remeber the med lab:).
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies,rec.arts.movies
From: ahom@yingjow.tnds.bellcore.com (Allen Hom)
Subject: Re: Godzilla / Nike TV Ad
Organization: Network Data Collection Presentation and Processing Development
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 92 12:08:59 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.031311.20282@news.columbia.edu>, dave@blackbox.cc.columbia.edu (David Milner) writes:
|> The next GODZILLA VS. CHARLES BARKLEY commercial will be debuted
|> during the MTV Video Music Awards on Sept. 9th.
|> 
|> David Milner  Columbia University
|> inet:   dave@blackbox.cc.columbia.edu
|> usenet: ...rutgers!columbia!blackbox!dave
|>         ...rutgers!columbia!blackbox.cc.columbia.edu!dave

I just saw Entertainment Tonight last night, and they featured a story
about this commercial.  Looks like Lucas' Industrial Light and Magic was
involved with the special effects, so it should be pretty good...:-)
-- 
allen hom
Bellcore
ahom@tnds.bellcore.com
(908)699-5728
From: rorschak@daimi.aau.dk (Jesper Lauridsen)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: I think Alien^3 has been flogged to death.
Date: 7 Sep 92 12:37:50 GMT
Organization: Exile Government of Bramming

v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey) writes:

>        re: Alien^3
>        ENOUGH ALREADY!!!!

For those of us living on continents where Alien 3 have just been
showing for little more than a week this discussion is brand new.
-- 
No News is Bad News
From: mjb@gserv1.dl.ac.uk (M.J.T. Bell)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: DROP THE DISCUSSION OF ALIENS ALREADY!!
Date: 10 Sep 92 12:38:06 GMT
Reply-To: mjb@gserv1.dl.ac.uk
Organization: Daresbury Laboratory, UK

In article 29819@ll.mit.edu, shoham@ll.mit.edu (Daniel Shoham) writes:
> Alien threads, once hatched will attach themselves to innocent net-users.
> Shortly afterward, the next posting in the thread will POP out of the poor
> chap. The thread grow into mighty monstrosity making an entire newsgroup
> unsafe for humans. Advanced technology, kill files, etc. can kill some of
> the threads, but they are very resourcefull and find new ways to devour their
> victims.
> 
> Dan Shoham
> shoham@ll.mit.edu

Nice one DAN, just what the thread needed !
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: cooper@cos.com (Gary Cooper)
Subject: Re: The Stand (Stephen King books)
Organization: Corporation for Open Systems
Distribution: usa  
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 02:33:30 GMT

In <2756@nlsun1.oracle.nl> gbradley@uks197.Berkeley.EDU (Gary Bradley) writes:

[Pet Sematary]

>   It's a rotten book. Very very very very dull. It's really just a
>character study - no real storyline. I think the film did an excellent
>job in actually getting a watchable story out of such a plotless boring book.
>P.S. I also think S. King is pretty crap in general, but Pet Semetary
>was even lower than King's usual low standard. The only one of his books
>I have really liked is The Shining. And me a die hard horror fan!

Ditto - I was finally talked into reading a King book (Pet Sematary),
by being told "it's the scariest book I've ever read".  Hell, all
I've got to say is that person obviously never read any Lovecraft...
BTW - I also liked the Shining, and the uncut Stand was pretty good,
except, as someone else said, the ending. 

Back to the movie thread - Has anyone seen the home video version
of _Lawnmower Man_?  I read a review in the Washington Post that
said it has an extra 1/2 hour of footage and that the movie actually
makes sense now. 
-- 
gary cooper (not the dead one)     "Non Dignis Sum!" - Waynus and Gartus 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: bobc@styx.SanDiego.NCR.com (Robert Crawford)
Subject: Re: Stranger in a Strange Land
Reply-To: bobc@styx.SanDiego.NCR.COM
Organization: NCR Engineering and Manufacturing, San Diego, CA
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 16:06:55 GMT

In article <futor-100992122824@chinacat.llnl.gov>, futor@llnl.gov (randy
j futor) writes:
> 
>  toten@bourbon.ee.tulane.edu (Derek Toten) wrote:
> > 	George Lucas . . . has only three directorial credits to his name:
> > 
> > 	"THX-1138", "American Graffiti", &	"Star Wars"
> >  
> > 	And that's it!
> 
> "Twice Upon A Time" wasn't a movie??!?
> 

Yes, "Twice Upon A Time" was a movie.  Directed by John Korty and
Charles Swenson.  George Lucas was executive producer.


Bob Crawford
bobc@styx.SanDiegoCA.NCR.COM
From: sdt8s@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Steve Tilson)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: DROP THE DISCUSSION OF DROPPING THE DISCUSSION...
Date: 11 Sep 92 01:32:45 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia

PLEASE! No more "drop the aliens disucssion already" posts!
You're just wasting valuable bandwidth! I HATE wading through
all these articles about how bad every little Aliens thread is!

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!

Steve
--
You are a true believer. Blessings of the state, blessings of the masses.
Thou art a subject of the divine, created in the image of man by the masses,
for the masses. Let us be thankful we have an occupation to fill. Work 
hard...increase production...prevent accidents...and be happy. (THX-1138)
From: steveh@devildog.att.com (Steve Hendershott)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Books into Movies, Harry Harrison
Date: 15 Sep 92 13:40:50 GMT
Organization: AT&T IMS - Piscataway, NJ (USA)

I thought the original "Bill, The Galactic Hero" was a great book. One
of the best funny sf books. The followups have been bad. 

Steve Hendershott

-- 
Stephen W. Hendershott
steveh@devildog.att.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: uhschreg@cip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Ulrich Schreglmann)
Subject: Re: Natives Down the River (was re: ALIEN^3 Eggs on Sulaco)
Organization: Student Pool, CSD, University of Erlangen, Germany
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 17:02:53 GMT

wiml@milton.u.washington.edu (William Lewis) writes:

>Ulricht == uhschreg@cip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Ulrich Schreglmann)

Ulrichtet nicht, auf dass ihr nicht ulrichtet werdet!

Why really! What are you doing to my name! Ts, ts!
It's Ulrich (Ool-rik Shray-gul-munn)!


May the Coolricht Be with You!

(C)OOL mcmxcii
From: murphy@npri6.npri.com (David P. Murphy)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
Subject: Re: Stranger in a Strange Land
Date: 14 Sep 92 00:41:23 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: NPRI, Alexandria VA


>Lets see what Lunar combat on the moon looks like.
>
>bjs2@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (BENJAMIN JAY SCHRAGGER)

probably a lot different from "lunar combat" here on earth, chucklehead.

ok
dpm
-- 
murphy@npri6.npri.com 602 Cameron St. Alexandria, VA 22314 (703) 683-9090

              When every one is dead the Great Game is finished.  Not before.
                              --- Hurree Babu, "Kim"
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc Szabo)
Subject: Re: Has the new BLADERUNNER movie come out yet??
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 17:57:54 GMT
Organization: Inter/Access' Matrix BBS

In article <1992Sep9.004205.15847@intacc.uucp> zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc Szabo) writes:
>
>The new director's cut of BLADERUNNER premiers (here in Toronto) on Wed
>Sept. 9th at the amazing Elgin Theatre. This is part of the huge Festival
>Of Festivals that happens every September here.  It will only play twice (?)
>at the festival and I have no idea when it will be shown in regular first
>run theatres.  (Some things that premier at the Festival can take almost
>a whole year to come out in regular run)
>
OOPS! I made a mistake in the date.  It's actually showing Wednesday 
September 16 (NOT the 9th).

ferenc



Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies
From: espen.aarseth@hf.uib.no (Espen Aarseth)
Subject: Alien^3: religious and pre-modern
Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.movies
Organization: University of Bergen
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 92 12:01:39 GMT

Alien^3 is in many ways a much more focused and *meaningful*
film than Aliens. While "Alien 1" is certainly by far the most innovative
of the trillogy, with classical scenes of horror excellently combined 
with the science fiction elements, Aliens is very different, a postmodern
action thriller too much in love with its own techno-aesthetics (remember
those scenes with the exo-sceleton?), but apart from the "pumping iron"-
feel it did have some stunning moments of gothic romance, like when 
the andy brought down the ship with the portable on the roof.

The problem with Aliens compared to the other films is its lack of
symbolic focus, it is all brilliant surface and nowhere to go.

Fictions and movies are not mathematical systems, and the hunt for "plot-
holes" and inconsistencies in *fantasy*-artefacts is more a sign that *we*
did not like the product than what caused our dislike. (And anyway Goedel
deconstructed mathematics more than sixty years ago, so why worry about
fiction.) If I really like a movie, e.g. Gilliam's Brazil, it is easy
to ignore "logical" flaws.

Alien^3 was a very "European" film compared to Aliens, reminding me
constantly of Tarkowskij and the Danish director Lars von Trier,
instead of Rambo and Police Academy. It held a clearly religious
thematics, with the issues of loss, sacrifice and humanity (Ripley
as Jeanne d'Arc, 85 as Judas); very pre-modern compared to Aliens's
post-modernity. Within the obvious limits of Hollywoodian demands,
its almost unbelievably good.

Of course, the british actors did a lot to help. As for the plot, it
is *much* better than Blade Runner's. (With doesn't say a lot, I agree..)

espen
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.movies