From: cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk (Clive Grace)
Newsgroups: soc.bi
Subject: objectification (developed from hot Bi Studs/Babes)
Date: 23 Aug 92 13:25:00 GMT
Reply-To: cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk



I was scanning through the root messages to get the whole picture on what Jean-
ette Bradley wrote and came across this snippet by Ellen that didn't
sink in initially, but it has now. 

[Ellen wrote:]

>What's sad is that bi women being objectified by het men has made
>me perpetually suspicious of het male attraction.

Big problem this: I tend to agree with you, but in reverse, I feel that
some women are turned on by Bi men because they are seen as some sort of
sex machine. These women, in my (rather limited) experience seem to enjoy
the macho posturings of certain male media symbols and look to Bisexual
men as "something different", almost as if we were a side dish at a 
restaurant.
 
After the "hot-bi-studs" postings I made (recounting the advances of a
woman at work who was interested in me primarily because I was bisexual 
-- and my inability to deal with it because I couldn't understand how to 
empower myself) I can think more clearly about what was going on at work,
it's left me with some scars though... for example, I'm now very suspicious
of any attractions I now have for straight women that show an interest in me, -
either sexually or emotionally because, like Ellen, I don't want to be objecti-
fied, but I'm also terrified of contributing to the myth that
invariably leads to objectification...

This can lead to problems when being interested in Bi women, because even
though I feel that the chances are greater that I can get on better and
more emotionally with a bisexual woman, I have to make sure that I am
neither objectifying, nor am I contributing to the myth that Bisexuals
are sex-crazy.

I feel that bisexual women are more likely to be more accepting and more 
open to listen to a bisexual man because they have gone through the same
(or similar) agonizing descisions, that the chances are greater that we
share a similar vocabulary, and that we know about objectification, sexism, ho-
mphobia, and a whole host of Bi issues that appear on the net every day.
 
I find it's easier to trust some Bi women here with my innermost feelings
about my being abused, it's easier to gauge whether thay can handle the disclo-
sure than straight people -- probably because my coming out as abused
has a direct parallel to coming out as Gay or Bisexual, which I've also done
-- I can't come out as abused with a majority of straight women or men yet.

Now, I'm not saying that all straights are going to be uncommunicative and unt-
hinking, but when I meet a bisexual person, I feel that a great many of
the social conventions are breaking down. In my experience so many people
that profess to being straight are potentially dangerous, and keep normal
social conventions very much alive and kicking, so  I keep an eye out for
them and don't get too involved with them.

I am more likely to let a bisexual person touch me intimately than a 
straight person. I know this may be a problem, but until I can resolve
my distrust of straight people, my dichotomy between straights and
Bi's will still exist.

Gay men and Lesbians are a different issue, I feel safer amongst the
Lesbians I've met than the straights I've met because a large proportion
of the bisexual "language" still gets communicated with Lesbians (I'm not
as sure about Lesbian separatists though - the only one I've talked to
for a decent period of time, and over a reasonable spread seemed genuinely int-
erested in my then budding bisexuality primarily because she knew I was sexual-
ly abused as a child, which isn't exactly a good basis for a deep discussion-b-
ased relationship, but at that point in my life, 
I was too screwed up to have sex of any kind and she wasn't interested
in men for sex, so perhaps it was a good relationship and I was just being
overly wary, perhaps she was intrigued by a non-sexual wannabe androgyne...
food for thought).

However, I don't feel as safe amongst some Gay men as lesbians because of
the pressures I was put under when I started coming out and identifying
(first) with my Homosexual feelings, and how some of them were just totally
unable to accept my (then later) bisexual feelings, trying to steer me 
away from that path...

>sigh< this is difficult, I'm going to have to study this some more,
for example, why are nearly all the Lebians I've met far more understanding
of my bisexual feelings than Gay men? Why do Gay men seem to need
convincing that I'm bisexual? (leaving the straights out of this for
the time being) Why do both straight and gay men say "it's just a phase,
you're young" which seems to always be followed by a knowing wink!

The bastards

+----------------------------------------------+--------------------------+
| The more straight people I meet, the more I  |cliveg@cix.compulink.co.uk|
| love horses....                              |cliveg@cix.compulink.uucp |
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