HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tighe@convex.COM (Mike Tighe)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Unusual GLOCK ejection method
Date: 29 Jul 92 11:52:22 GMT
Organization: Convex Computer Corporation, Richardson, Texas

#I asked him about it, and he said that the GLOCKs are the only
#gun he knows of, which will eject through the magazine well.

#Any comments?

Sounds like a candidate for Stupid Gun Tricks On Letterman -:)
-- 
Mike Tighe, (214) 497-4206
tighe@convex.com
From: pacdata!jimh@uunet.UU.NET (Jim Harkins)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Ricochets
Date: 25 Jul 92 13:11:42 GMT
Organization: Pacific Data Products

In article <1992Jul22.235146.3324@athena.mit.edu> sybok@athena.mit.edu (The Rifleman) writes:
#
#When Reagan visited my high school, David H. Hickman in Columbia, MO, in
#1986, I walked through the detector with a full ring of keys, and it
#didn't go off.  I guess the detectors used in airports are set to lower
#threshold?  (I've never been on a plane.)

They vary wildly.  Here in San Diego I suspect I could walk through
with a steel trash can on my back, in Phoenix I have to remove my keys from
my pocket.  At Salt Lake city I had to remove all coins as well as my keys.
In some forgotten city I had to empty my pockets and remove my watch.
I just went through San Diego and Phoenix last week, Salt Lake city and the
forgotten city (Orlando?) was around 1985.

ObGunContent:  You shouldn't try to smuggle a gun onto a plane :-)

jim

-- 
Lawyers Creed:  What's mine is mine, what's yours is negotiable.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Harkins                         [ucsd|uunet]!pacdata!jim
Pacific Data Products               jim@pacdata.com
--------------------------------------------------------------
From: fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (steve hix)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: .308 for 1000 yd. Matches
Date: 23 Jul 92 21:03:06 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.

In article <1992Jul22.212546.27830@informix.com> infmx!gregm@uunet.UU.NET (Greg Mitchell) writes:
#I'd like to propose some conjecture ...
#
#I really should know the answer to this, being a pilot ( haven't been
#flying in a few years though ).  As the air density decreases the speed
#of sound increases.  Isn't this relation linerally proportional ? 
#If I had my flight computer handy I'd know for sure.

Oops...  I think it's the other way around (remembering my time working
as a ground instructor).  Seal level (standard conditions) speed of
sound is around 750mph.  At 30,000 feet, it's about 650.

#The bullet will decelerate slower in the thinner air, but shouldn't
#it cross through the trans-sonic at a higher speed ?  

No.  (But the speed of sound below 10,000', where most of us live and
breathe, is closer to the sea-level value than the 30,000' one.)  It
might be a little better in Denver than in San Diego, assuming the
same air temperature.


--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of making many books there is no end...  |  What's wrong with chasing 
                       -- Eccl. 12:12    |  nebulae till 3 am?  |-(
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: dbetz@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Drew Betz)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: "Puff the Magic Dragon"
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:53:39 GMT
Organization: SigSauer Fan Club

In article <1992Jul25.022242.23797@hpcvusn.cv.hp.com> markc@hpcvxjme.cv.hp.com (Mark Cook) writes:
#developed as a replacement for the AC-47D Dragon Ship (The *real*
#"Puff the Magic Dragon").  The original Puff had this problem: it

[some descriptions deleted]

#All this information is taken directly from "Arsenal of Democracy-III,
#American's War Machine (The Pursuit of Global Dominance)" by Tom
#Gervasi (Grove Press, Inc., 1977).

There is also a discussion about these two aircraft in John Stockton's
_In Search of Enemies: A CIA Story_.  A good "kiss and tell" book for
those wishing to learn about the DDO circa 1975 and a little about
Angolan history, UNITA, and J. Savimbi.

Drew 
--
drew betz : wj8k : dbetz@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   
"Our campaign is the opposite of 'competence.'"
- Clinton aide Eli Segal, quoted in the 7/22/92 _Wall Street Journal_
From: msn@reef.cis.ufl.edu (Mike 'HK G3ZF Full-Auto' Newsome)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: (null)
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:55:38 GMT

# syoung@pecanpi.UUCP (Stan Young)
#
#> TTC103@psuvm.psu.edu wrote:
#> If only one gun:  One of those 16 inchers off USS Iowa
#
#	[MODERATOR:  Doesn't it have to be over 18inches for ATF to
#	 consider it a real rifle ... ?  Errr ... could be interesting
#	 trying to convince a jury of the difference... :-) ]
#
# Pat, if that's all they'd be worried about, it would be
# worth while to pay the $5 short barrel tax.  Actually, a
# 5 incher would suit my needs....:-)
# 

	Ahhh.  There seems to be some confusion here.  ;-)
	The tax would be $200.00 since the 16 inch rifles
	are NOT smooth bores.  Moreover, as this is a DD
	you would have to purchase it from a Type 10 FFL
	with a Class 2.  All joking aside, I wonder if it
	is possible to salvage a WWII battleship rifle
	build a receiver ( Types 10 & 7 FFL's + Class 2 )
	and manufacture a Post May-86 DS DD.  Yeah! Thats
	the ticket!  Then I'll cut the barrel down to 6 ft.
	WOW!  What a show stopper!  I'd take it with me to
	the Knob Creek Machinegun Shoot this Oct.  They'd
	love it!    The only problem that I can see is that
	it would be a bit pricy to shoot.  Lets see...
	660lbs black powder at $... Bulk... plus shipping..
	hmmm  substitute VW engine block for projectile...
	....   Naaaaa!!

	[MODERATOR:  Seems like you'd use up what would otherwise be a 
	 lifetime supply of Bullseye in a single shot in order to reach
	 major, hmmm?  Rapid reloads would be a problem too for those
	 into PPC.  Of course, it might be hard to qualify in "any-any"
	 style matches like at my club (the only rule is "if you can tote
	 it, then you can shoot it.")]



			Dooka yoroshiku onegaishimasu,
        ________                                    __  __  ______
       /  ____//__      msn@reef.cis.ufl.edu       / / / / / ____/
         /  //  //      Michael S. Newsome        / / / / / /__
          GUNDAM        3632 NW 46th Pl.         / / / / / ___/
        //  //          Gainesville, Fl.        / /_/ / / /
      //__//___/        32605-1046.            /_____/ /_/
        //______/       U.S.A.            The University of Florida
                                                  Alumnus

          Watashino hatano motoni watashiwa jiyuuni ikiru
From: erudnick@pica.army.mil (FSAC-SID)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: "Puff the Magic Dragon"
Date: 28 Jul 92 21:41:47 GMT



"Puff the Magic Dragon", also known as "Spooky", was the name for the
AC-47 gunship, which was equipped with three 7.62mm Miniguns firing
out the port side.

The AC-130 "Spectre", the only type left in service, comes in 3 flavors:

AC-130A - two 7.62mm Minigun, two 20mm M61A1 Vulcan, two 40mmL60 Bofors;
          
AC-130H - two 20mm M61A1 Vulcan, one 40mmL60 Bofors, one 105mm M102 (M137)

AC-130U - one 25mm GAU-13 (?), one 40mmL60 Bofors, one 105mm M102 (M137)

As the "U" models enter the fleet, the "H" models currently in active
service will be transferred to the Reserves, and the "A"s will be
retired. 10 "A" were built (one of these is the first production C-130
built). 10 "H"; one lost in Desert Storm and will be replaced. 12 "U".



Ed Rudnicki     erudnick@pica.army.mil     All disclaimers apply
Protect the Second Amendment - boycott Ruger products
From: jca@crash.cts.com (John C. Archambeau)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: AVOIDING GETTING MISTAKENLY SHOT
Date: 28 Jul 92 12:37:08 GMT
Organization: CTS Network Services (crash, ctsnet), El Cajon, CA

In article <9207221854.AA22524@gtephx.com> forda@gtephx.UUCP (Andrew Ford @ AGCS, Phoenix, Arizona) writes:
#In article <8ybmb#=.damiel@netcom.com>, damiel@netcom.com (Paul Theodoropoulos) writes:
## secondly, in any and all self-defense shootings, you can absolutely count
## on being sued in civil court by the perp and/or his family. at the least,
#
#What the hell kind of pinko-commie place do you live in?  Arizona law 
#pre-empts the success of any such civil suit if the shooting was deemed
#justified by the police, the DA, the jury, or the judge.

In the People's Republic of Kalifornia, it can and does happen all the
time.  This is the lawyer state.  Even if the shooting is justified;
you can possibly look at your exposed carry or CCW permit being
suspended or revoked pending an investigation.  Firearm being 
confiscated and mysteriously disappear from the local PD's property room
or some bureaucratic red tape to keep you from your legally owned firearm.
I personally would be royally P'd if it was a SIG-Sauer with some minor
custom gunsmithing or a tactical pistol from the S&W Performance
Center that turned up missing after the shooting was deemed justifiable.

I just bought my first 9mm pistol and the sales person who is very
knowledgeable and helpful to patrons of the store he works in prefers
to have Black Talon in his SIG-Sauer (I don't know if he has a P226 or
P228).  He says the the recoil is low and the expansion of the Black
Talon bullet is good.  Good defensive round, ideal for pistols that
can't take a steady diet of +P ammunition.  However, I hope he doesn't
ever get into a shooting with one because in CA he may get crucified
alive on the stand for using this evil assault round.  Fortunately, I'm
leaving Kalifornia the end of August, probably permanently.  I just hope
that none of my friends, acquaintances and people I work with ever get 
involved in any shootings because regardless of whether or not the
shooting is justified or not, it is Napoleonic justice with respect to 
your second amendment rights.
--

     // JCA

 /*
 ** ARPA    : jadpc!thewall!jca@nosc.mil | 13 + 1 = 228... 
 ** INTERNET: jca@thewall.cts.com        |
 **           jca@thewall.uucp           |           SIG-Sauer P228...
 ** UUCP    : nosc!jadpc!thewall!jca     |
 */
From: raymond@jupiter.ame.arizona.edu (Raymond Man)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: M1 Garand -> M14 -> M16
Date: 22 Jul 92 02:58:19 GMT


::The US Army were already buying M16 in the hundreds of thousands in 
::1958 - 1961, so I guess very few VC had the good fortune to run into
::an M1.

#Speaking of rehashing of VN legends...Colt began mass production of the M16
#in March of 1964.  (just when all the design and ammo problems were first
#*discovered*)  Lots of time for the VC to get used to this t-ting sound...

Orders were places for the AR-15 from 1958 onwards mainly because of
the production problem of the M14, which has mostly replaced the M1 rifle. 
Colt got the license for AR-15 in 1959. By 1964 AR-15 has been in
trial for sometime in Vietnam and Colt was already
delivering against the big orders. The AR-15 was deemed so well suited
for that area that all deliveries went there. Prior to that, US advisors
used more sub-machine guns and M1 carbines than rfiles, which would more
likely be M14 than M1. US involvement did not really grew until Johnson
was well in power and the build-up peak came in 1966/67.

So M1 mainly saw action in Vietnam at the time of D.B. when the French
airborne operation turned into a siege and the M14 supply had yet to
catch up.

Raymond Man
From: forda@gtephx.UUCP (Andrew Ford @ AGCS, Phoenix, Arizona)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Best defense: Machine gun or shotgun?
Date: 27 Jul 92 13:53:08 GMT
Organization: gte

In article <1992Jul24.163830.22825@CERIS.Purdue.EDU>, jheath@fieldofdreams.npirs.purdue.edu (Jim Heath) writes:
# # In my home, I'd want at least 4 or 5 weapons including short shotgun, 
# # a good medium to large game rifle, a high capacity .22 rifle, several
# # handguns, and, if possible, a sub-machine gun.  
# # 
# # If I had to leave, I'd want to have two handguns on me (preferably a
# # high capacity auto and a revolver) and a shotgun.  (Short range
# # defense only -- if I'm out and about I'll run first / fight as
# # a last resort: if I'm home, I'll fight ASAP [I'm talking riots and/or
# # general anarchy here]).
# 
# Why not 2 high capacity autos (or 3 if you can hide 'em) or 2
# revolvers that use the same ammo?  (Oh those would be
# self-loaders that use the same magazines)  

The high-capacity auto would obviously be the weapon of choice.
However, in being out and about during a riot one may encounter
situations where weapons would be abused (ie: dropped, fallen
upon, dunked in mud/water/dirt, etc): it seems to me that a 
revolver will continue to be operational for longer than a 
auto pistol given the same level of abuse and assuming that
the barrel does not get blocked.  (Revolvers have fewer moving
parts to get gummed up.)  

# I have the impression that it wasn't a good idea to wander about
# LA with a shotgun during the riots. 

I had the impression that it wasn't a good idea to be outside at all
in LA during the riots: however, children need food and water and one
should be prepared to venture out to obtain necessities (and then 
get your *ss back home ASAP!).

I would limit it to two handguns because of weight considerations
(but you make a good point about similar ammo -- maybe a DE would
be a good idea -- carry two guns and one type of ammo): obviously,
I'd be going out to get something and I would like to be able to 
return home ASAP.

-- 
"25 States allow anyone to buy a gun, strap it on, and walk down the street with
no permit of any kind: some say it's crazy.  However, 4 out of 5 US murders are 
committed in the other half of the country: so who is crazy?"   -  Andrew Ford
gtephx!forda@enuucp.eas.asu.edu  OR  !uunet!samsung!romed!enuucp!gtephx!forda
From: ghm@ccadfa.cc.adfa.oz.au (Geoff Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Webley .45
Date: 24 Jul 92 03:19:00 GMT
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy, Canberra, Australia

jheath@fieldofdreams.npirs.purdue.edu (Jim Heath) writes:

##From article <9207221412.AA12251@mimsy.cs.UMD.EDU>, by rats@ihlpm.att.com:
## 
## The M1912 Webley autoloader had an interesting feature in which you could
## drop the magazine by a small amount, and be able to handload single
## rounds through the top of the weapon; I don't recall if the weapon locked
## back the slide after each round in this mode. Anyway, the rationale was
## that in fighting hordes of indiginous insurgent forces, you could shoot
## single rounds to your hearts content, but have a full magazine ready
## when multiple attackers got too close for comfort...

Many of the service rifles of this era had a magazine cut-off for the
same reason.

#Didn't they make the revolvers until at least WWII?  I'm sure I
#have seen references to them in books/stories from/about that
#period.

Yes, but the .455 was pretty much phased out after WW1 in favour of the
.38-200 (basically the .38S&W with a 200-grain bullet).

#I didn't realize they made an automatic.

They produced their locked-breech auto in .455 and in a .38 calibre,
although I'm not sure exactly which cartridge it was chambered for.
They also produced pocket autos of a similar profile (but with simpler
internals) and this design was also made in the USA under licence by
Harrington and Richardson.  The interesting feature of the Webley
autos was that the slide return spring was a U-shaped spring in the
butt of the gun, not a coil spring.

Geoff Miller (g-miller@adfa.oz.au)  |   Don't steal.  The government
Computer Centre                     |   hates competition.
Australian Defence Force Academy    |   (via Jeff Cooper)
From: jd@latcs1.lat.oz.au (John Dimogotsis)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: ammo calibers ?!
Date: 21 Jul 92 12:26:51 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia


	Hi there, I know very little about guns and there is one aspect
		of postings to this newsgroup I do not understand,
	ammunition is classified either in terms of milimeters 
	(i.e. 9mm, 7.62mm, 5.56mm etc) or as fractions of inches
	(i.e. .22 .38 .44 .357magnum etc), are these just two different
	conventions discribing the same ammo (I have grown up with the
	metric system, so feet and inches are a bit foreign to me)
	or is there a significant difference between ammo when different
	conventions are used? For example 7.62mm translates to .30inch
	is there a difference when different conventions are used or
	does this reflect the preference of the writer of the posting?
			Thanks in advance to anyone who will reply.
								John.
From: exuslh@exu.ericsson.se (Sherry HArris,xtr,0334)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Arguments FOR bearing arms
Date: 31 Jul 92 15:57:50 GMT
Organization: Ericsson Network Systems, Inc.

Hi Randy,

I don't have the statistics you asked for but I thought I could may be help
with a women's perspective on having a firearm.

I don't know if you have any children.  If you do I know that the statistics show
a higher rate of successful suicides in homes where the parents have a firearm.
This is obvious since an attempted suicide with a firearm is more successful than
pills.  You also have the dilemma of introducing the gun to the child which is 
what I believe is the best.  I don't mean just showing it to them.  Children are
curious about things just like when you say its hot and they still touch it.  
These are just my thoughts.  I have not had to deal with this problem, but know
people who have.

I know there are some movies that show how vulnerable people are without a firearm.
The only one that comes to mind right off is "Cape Fear" in the movie the police 
could not do anything to the man unless he broke the law well obviously when he 
broke the law it was to late for the police to help.  There was another movie on 
TV about an X-husband who was obsessed with getting his X back.  The police 
couldn't do anything except issue a restraining order but alot of good that did
he beat her almost to death.  she now can feel on one side of her body but can't control it and numb on her other side but can control it.  It`s unbelievable the 
number of people who put their lives in the hands of the police.  The police have
good intentions but will not and can not do anything if someone just threatens you.

Enough of that stuff.

Has your wife ever fired a firearm?  I shot rifles when I was younger so I wasn't
intimidated by the revolvers but the semi-auto intimidated me.  If she hasn't been
around guns introduce her to them.  She probably would be willing to try one.
If she is , don't give her a 357 or 44 to shot.  I know several women who's 
boyfriends (maucho image) shot his 44 then encouraged them to.  Know most will not
fire another one they are afraid.

I think a good choice would be a 38 special.  This depends on your wife`s personality
also.  If she's really intimidated I might even start with a 22 revolver.  I know
alot of ranges rent guns for you to try.  I'm not sure they rent 22's though.

Hope this was helpful and not a waste of your time.

/Sherry
From: burge@qdeck.com (Bill Burge)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Reloading Presses and some other stuff
Date: 31 Jul 92 12:57:56 GMT
Organization: Quarterdeck Office Systems, Santa Monica CA

In article <1992Jul27.172356.20301@wam.umd.edu> gisie@wam.umd.edu (Dr. Death) writes:
#I have been reloading .223 ammo for about a year now (on
#a single stage press) and now that I have purchased a pistol,
#I plan on doing more shooting and more reloading.  Unfortunatley,
#the single stager is way too slow for my tastes.  Im ready to
#purchase a progressive... any recommendations? and prices?
#

One word - Dillon.  Don't mess with the square deal get the 550 or high
er up.  You're looking about $300 for press and goodies.

#Also, does shooting in indoor ranges adversly affect you health?
#I spend about 3 hours/week at the indoor range and can tell when I
#leave that I have a "gunpowder" taste in my lungs for the next 12 hours
#or so.
#

Yes, if the air circulation is poor you are affected not only by lead,
but also by vaporizing bullet lube.  Alox can be hazardous.

#Last, what type of solvent and lube do you recommend for cleaning a
#Glock...Break Free? I have a chance to get a free Break Free cleaning
#kit.
#

I like something about the consistancy of 30 weight.  Glocks need little lub
and my has functioned flwlessly with little care.  Some guns are thorough-
breds some are workhorses.  Mine is a workhorse.  Avoid slight lubes like
BreakFree or WD40 - they disapait and penatrate primers too well.

#
#Once again, Thanks,
#Doc
#

Love your Glock and it will defend you - always.

Bill	burge@qdeck.com
From: chuckh@apex.com (Chuck Huffington)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Chlorate primers?
Date: 28 Jul 92 20:38:50 GMT
Organization: Apex Computer Company

In article <9207280055.AA27018@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> fiddler@concertina.Eng.Sun.COM (steve hix) writes:
#I've been looking through Shotgun News, and have seen attractive
#prices on some "chlorate-primed" 9mm (said to be useful for its
#long storage life).  No mention as to corrosiveness, it is
#Berdan primed.  (I'll be reloading, but not that particular
#batch of ammo, assuming I get any.)
#
#Is it corrosive? Reliable?

Yes it is corrosive.  Chlorate primers produce salt when fired.

Reliable,  who knows.  Chlorate primers can be stable if correctly made
but if not they are very unreliable.  The main virtue is cheapness.
From: schow@sol.UVic.CA (Stirling Chow)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: 1903 Colt Model M 32
Date: 31 Jul 92 00:24:43 GMT
Organization: University of Victoria, Victoria, B.C. CANADA


   A while back I posted a request for information on the pricing of
   a 1903 Colt Model M .32.  I found some more information on the gun so here
   it goes.  It was built in 1913 (found by referencing the serial #) and has
   had few rounds put through it.  The current owner, who has had it for a
   couple of decades has not fired it.  I talked to him last night to find out
   its condition and he mentioned that structurally it has no flaws or rust,
   but that the blued finish is almost completely gone.

   The gun came down from Alaska and ended up in Ontario where the police there
   confiscated it for a crime investigation.  It still bears the police file ID
   numbers which he said were put on with a white powder.  After being cleared
   by the police, the current owner purchased it directly through them.

   I realize that a Colt 1903 has a bit of collector value to it; ~700,000 were
   produced between 1903 and 1945.  The owner is asking $275 Cdn. for this gun.
   The history of it sounds interesting, but i'm also looking for a firearm that
   I can use for plinking and becoming more adept with shooting.  Is the .32
   reasonable for this use, and will this gun be able to handle being fired with   today's brands of ammunition?  How does the price sound (if interested i'll
   try to bargain it down a bit)?  Thanks for the help.
From: etjue@lbl.gov (Eric T. Jue)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Beretta 92F vs. Sig P228
Date: 29 Jul 92 15:01:27 GMT
Organization: LBL

I am considering purchasing either the Beretta 92F or the Sig P228.  I
prefer the Sig but can't decide because of price differences.  The best
prices I could find is $489 for the 92F and $549 for the P228.  Are these
prices really good?  What are your opinions concerning these guns?  I
appreciate any responses my posting.  Thank you very much.
From: dbetz@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Drew Betz)
Newsgroups: rec.guns
Subject: Re: Long Range Handgun Ballistics
Date: 25 Jul 92 13:12:06 GMT
Organization: SigSauer Fan Club

In article <9207241908.aa06399@claudius.pica.army.mil> erudnick@pica.army.mil (FSAC-SID) writes:
#Instead, in all cases for both cartridges a superelevation of only 5
#degrees (approx) is required to reach 900 yards. This seemed "intuitively"
#wrong so I took out my Artillery Luger and sure enough at the 800 m max
#setting the angle between the sights and the bore was about 5 degrees.

What's an "Artillery Luger," anyway?  Nobody would seriously
use a 9mm handgun for targets 800m away (would they?).

Drew 
--
drew betz : wj8k : dbetz@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   
"Our campaign is the opposite of 'competence.'"
- Clinton aide Eli Segal, quoted in the 7/22/92 _Wall Street Journal_