HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [alt.censorship]  Searching for computer porn at UBC
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 13:18:51 GMT


Newsgroups: alt.censorship
From: advax@reg.triumf.ca (A.Daviel)
Subject:  Searching for computer porn at UBC
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 22:49:00 GMT

I read recently in UBC Reports that the UBC President has "asked all UBC 
units to ensure that university property is not being used to gain access to, 
create, or store (such) pornographic material on university computing 
equipment".

I am disturbed by the possibilities in this. Not so much that I think it is 
OK to store 10Gbytes of sexually explicit GIF files on univerity disks (or 
10Gb of pictures of sports cars, for that matter), but that such a thing 
(ensuring ...) may be possible, at least for ASCII files.

Computer users on a big system (VMS, Unix, etc.) are prevented from reading 
each others mail by default, and may optionally protect any other files 
against unauthorised access. But they enjoy no such protection from 
privileged users, such as system managers. We rely on the personal integrity 
of privileged users, and hope that they are far too busy to have time to 
ferret around in users files.

Users could encrypt data, but I do not believe this is common practice.
Systems such as Sun that come with DES software in the USA are prevented from
doing so outside the US. 

Given operator privileges, it would be easy to write programs that 
would scan users files and mailboxes for keywords, according to some 
particular scheme of sexual or political censorship. Admittedly machine
inspection of picture and sound files would not currently be possible, if the
files were hidden in 'innocent' directories with innocuous filenames, though 
a program could produce a list of all picture files for subsequent visual
inspection. 

Regardless of the legal and technical facts (for instance, that bitnet 
mail may be logged, that store-and-forward mail may be backed up on tape, 
etc.), users have come to believe that electronic mail has the same 
confidentiality as letter mail or telephone converstions.

I believe that the possibilities for abuse of privacy are numerous, if system 
operators are effectively directed to search their systems for 'offensive 
material'.


A.Daviel, Vancouver BC
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Any info on Indiana U Admin?
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:19:41 GMT
Organization: Department of Astronomy, University of Virginia

I hate to interrupt the flamewars, but UVa just hired Polley McClure,
who was most recently the dean of academic computing at Indiana U.
Anyone have any comments on her view on news, irc, and other such
topics? Email would be fine.
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,alt.censorship
From: ppotter@nyx.cs.du.edu (Phillip Potter)
Subject: Re: WLU (in Canada) bans alt.sex* because its "offensive"
Summary: Banned in the UK
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 19:42:26 GMT

The situation ain't too hot over in the UK either. As far as I can tell,
while alt.sex*, alt.psychoactives, alt.drugs, etc aren't actually banned
the authority that lets NetNews into the UK simply removes everything not
cross-posted to an uncensored group (this is actually one of the reasons
why I have a Nyx account]. Any folks from the UK know a) who is responsible
for this, b) why they do it and c) what if anything we could do to get them
to lighten up. Then again, the UK is one of the most heavily censored
countries in the "free world" anyway. Sigh

Phil
--
Phil Potter  ppotter@nyx.cs.du.edu | Be exactly who you want to be
-----------------------------------+ Do what you want to do
Standard disclaimers apply         | I am he and she is she
This space for hire                | But you're the only you (Crass)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 06:23:21 GMT


From: styri@hal.nta.no (Haakon Styri)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: 18 Aug 92 08:43:28 GMT

In article <viking.714081499@vincent1.iastate.edu>, Dan Sorenson writes:
>
>	Credit card fraud is also rather simple.  So is passing a bad
> check.  One can modify your license plates and go speeding through the
> photo-radar speed traps with impunity.  One can also forge a signature
> fairly easily.  So what?  The issue is that forgery can be detected,
> though finding out exactly who forged it is nearly impossible,

No, in many of these cases the culprit runs a chance of being caught red
handed. (Not that I'd deny that there *are* things that can be done for
example to harass a credit card holder with almost no chance of getting
caught.)

>                                                                and hence
> a forged post can be justifiably killed and the person who's name appears
> on it can be aquitted of wrongdoing.  I'm not after the forger so much
> as I'm after protecting the person who's name appears in the header.

Well, I hate to pick nits, but cancelling a post may not always remove all
copies of that message. And, archived copies are not deleted. And even if
an explanatory message is posted it may not reach all people concerned.
(The posters name may already be in a KILL-file, or the message is just
lost in the enormous flow of data.)

One solution to the problem would of course be to use digital signatures.
However, some countries have strict laws limiting the use of cryptography
at least for use in an international community like the news network.

---
Haakon Styri			*** std. disclaimer applies 		***
Norwegian Telecom Research	*** I speak for myself and only myself 	***
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 05:37:03 GMT


Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: harthc@ntmtv.UUCP (Howard Hart)
Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 04:02:48 GMT

In article <viking.713740471@vincent1.iastate.edu>, viking@iastate.edu (Dan Sorenson) writes:
|> In <1992Aug13.191334.19680@ntmtv> harthc@ntmtv.UUCP (Howard Hart) writes:
|> 
|> >Here's a simple if slightly fascist fix. Disable access to questionable
|> >newsgroups and permit access by user machine only. Insist on low-key,
|> >word of mouth subscription only (i.e. - they have to come to you as

|> 	Unfortunately, it doesn't work worth a damn.  Here at ISU,
|> we have a large network of Unix machines, VAXen, and one old

Works fine here, but then, everyone has a personal workstation. Agreed, 
it's a little hard to foot the bill for that a your local 
University.

|> 	There are ways around everything, and your policy is so
|> easy to circumvent it is merely a laughable attempt that only
|> inconveniences readers.

You missed the point entirely. I'm not trying to restrict access,
I'm just hiding it from those who might object to it. The purpose
is obscurity, not security.


-- 
Howard Hart		UUCP:{ames,pyramid!amdahl,hplabs}!ntmtv!harthc
System Administrator	INTERNET: ntmtv!harthc@ames.arc.nasa.gov
Northern Telecom	PHONE: (415) 940-2680
Mt. View, CA
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 05:34:52 GMT


From: bjorn@ludd.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: 14 Aug 92 09:11:15 GMT

In <5752@m1.cs.man.ac.uk> bane@vtx.ma.man.ac.uk) (M i c h a e l ;-) writes:

>Come on.... things *DO* happen if many people drive too fast down one piece of road:
>1) the police keep a watch (from secret hiding places....... THINK ABOUT IT!)
>2) there are other measures taken ("traffic calming")
>3) and it has been known (and OFTEN APPRECIATED) to actually close the roads !

Incidently, this is what I meant with my comparison to roads/traffic. Things
happen. Police are on watch for violators. The very same can be applied to
the net. Don't close the roads, but keep an eye on the violators.

   _
/Bjorn.
-- 
Bjorn Fahller     Phone:              |The opinions above are not necessarily
Trollnasvagen 3A  Intl:+46 920 226870 |those of... Hey! Wait a minute. Do you
S-951 61 Lulea    Natl:0920-22 68 70  |seriously expect Me, a student, to carry
Sweden            << space for rent >>|the official voice of the University?
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: copyright == illegal ????
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 04:49:23 GMT


From: rmz@ifi.uio.no (Bj|rn Remseth)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject:  Re: copyright == illegal ????
Date: 19 Aug 92 10:46:53 GMT


> Nope. it's not clear. If Playboy doesn't sue it's probably bacause it's
> not cost-effective. Proving who did the posting will be difficult, even
> if the message isn't anonymous. Nothing becomes legal, or ethically right,
> just because you've found a way to do it in an anonymous manner.

I  thought  the "innocent until proven   guilty" principle in  western
legal thinking was  designed  to  take care of  this. If  what you are
doing doesn't  bother anyone, then  you are innocent even if  some law
prohibits it. 

"Guilty in  the eyes of  god" and similar principles  are not what the
law is built on.


--
                                                    (Rmz)

Bj\o rn Remseth   !Institutt for Informatikk    !Net:      rmz@ifi.uio.no
Phone: +472 453466!Universitetet i Oslo, Norway !NeXTmail: rmz@neste.ifi.uio.no
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,alt.censorship
From: bear@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Bear Giles)
Subject: Re: WLU sys admins search out "nasty" filenames and passwords
Organization: National Oceanic & Atmospheric Adminstration / Boulder Labs
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 00:48:28 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.185526.9397@uoft02.utoledo.edu> sbrack@jupiter.cse.utoledo.edu (Steven S. Brack) writes:
>morgan@ms.uky.edu (Wes Morgan) writes:
>: In his reply, he apologized (he didn't realize that 
>: other users could see his command names via ps) and changed the name 
>: immediately.
>: 
>	WHat are the privacy, & collaterally, academic freedom concerns
>	regarding the ability of everyone on a system to see what you are
>	doing?

Aren't you taking this to extremes?

While I agree that activity logs shouldn't be kept on academic or open
commerical systems (e.g., Colorado SuperNet), if the system is running
sluggishly somebody (possibly I) has the rights to run a 'ps' or its
equivalent to find out what is hogging CPU cycles.  If I see a program
named 'shit' I'll probably be pretty pissed.  (As in, "this program
ain't doing 'shit.'")

Likewise, you may consider a printout with a banner like KillThePrez
a cute joke, but don't expect no response if you print it a few days
before a presidential visit and leave it in the printer hopper.

At the same time, consider the people who take filenames seriously....
I can just imagine their response to some of the files in my academic
account:  "satan," "satan1," etc.  (They contain Usenet articles
debunking claims of satanic conspiracies).


Bear Giles
bear@fsl.noaa.gov
Organization: Masters student, Mechanical Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,alt.censorship,news.admin
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 15:25:38 -0400 
From: David O Hunt <dh4j+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Limiting religious speech

> Ok, here's a question for anti-censorship people:
> 
> How many of you are dismayed at the recent Supreme Court ruling in
> Lee v. Weisman, which held prayer at graduation ceremonies
> unconstitutional?   If this isn't stifling free speech, what is? 
> 
> Let's all raise our voices and demand that this be overturned.

If you want to pray at graduation, feel free.  Nobody's stopping it.  The
decision was to prevent _organized_ prayer.  e.g.  Valedictorian says
"Let us now thank the Lord who enabled us to graduate" type of thing.

Same thing with prayer in schools - nobody is saying you can't pray.  
What they're saying is that prayer cannot be organized and sanctioned
(purposefully or by default).


David Hunt - Graduate Slave | My mind is my own.          | Towards both a
Mechanical Engineering      | So are my ideas & opinions. | Palestinian and
Carnegie Mellon University  | <<<Use Golden Rule v2.0>>>  | Jewish homeland!
============================================================================
Email:  dh4j@cmu.edu            Working towards my "Piled Higher and Deeper"

Democracy is based on the theory that the people know what they want...and
they deserve to get it - GOOD AND HARD!
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie)
Subject: [news.admin.policy]  Re: copyright == illegal ????
Originator: daemon@eff.org
Organization: EFF mail-news gateway
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 07:14:59 GMT


Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz)
Subject:  Re: copyright == illegal ????
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 16:37:29 GMT

In article <3998@svin02.info.win.tue.nl> luit1@info.win.tue.nl writes:
>jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:
>>Also true, but irrellevant.  I consider the trafficking of copyrighted
>>materials to be morally and legally "wrong" regardless of whether or not
>>someone is going to sue me.
>
>Wow, hold it, right there.
>
>Uptill now I though you were concerned about the legal implications of
>carrying (aledged) copyrighted material. And wether or not you would get
>into trouble with your superiors.
>Now you're saying you find it 'wrong', no matter what ??

Where's the contradiction?  I _am_ concerned about the legal
implications.  I also happen to think that trafficking in pirated
material, be it software or other published materials such as images,
is wrong, i.e. unethical.  There is no contradiction between my being
_against_ piracy, and _for_ USENET being treated as a common carrier.

>[...] Legally you're in the clear, as many have pointed out.

Not quite correct... legally it hasn't been established whether or not
I'm in the clear, but it seems the better judgement to act as if I were
until it is established (hopefully in favor of USENET being a common
carrier).

>Morally, you should not be the one to judge. After all, news is for the
>readers, not just for the administrator. Any censorship would mean
>restricting the free access of your users to the net. I am very much
>against any form of censorship that is based on such subjective views.

Now you're confusing two separate issues... I have every right to let
my personal oppinion about the ethics of the issue be known.  It
seemed to me that the person I was replying to was saying "piracy is
ok so long as you don't get caught," and as I am of a differing
opinion I felt it to be my responsibility to say so.  This doesn't
mean that I feel I have the right or responsibility to _enforce_ my
personal viewpoint of the ethics involved, and if you go back and
re-read my article (<Bt897t.L4n@mtholyoke.edu>), you will see that
wasn't suggesting that at all.
--
Jurgen Botz                  |   Internet: JBotz@mtholyoke.edu
Academic Systems Consultant  |     Bitnet: JBotz@mhc.bitnet
Mount Holyoke College        |      Voice: (US) 413-538-2375 (daytime)
South Hadley, MA, USA        | Snail Mail: J. Botz, 01075-0629
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk (Mark Evans)
Subject: Re: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Organization: Aston University
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 08:10:08 GMT

kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
: 
: From: brian@ucsd.edu (Brian Kantor)
: Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
: Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
: Date: 13 Aug 1992 18:38:50 GMT
: Message-ID: <16ea7qINNg7u@network.ucsd.edu>
: 
: I too am concerned about the content of some of the groups.  It is not
: the bandwidth or moral issues that are the problem, but that indeed
: there are copyright violations taking place.

As other people have pointed out this issue has nothing really to do 
with the sexual explicitness (or otherwise) of the material.

: 
: I could wish that the pictures being sent took up less of the network
: bandwidth and disk storage, but the answer to that is better data
: compression, storage, and retrieval methods, not restricting posting.
: 
: I believe that we who maintain the news software should be able to treat
: the material passing through our sites as though we were solely a
: carrier - much like the telephone system, UPS, and other common
: carriers.  In that manner, our site would not be liable for illegalities
: committed by users of the system, since we do not assume to restrict
: their posting content.

And also presumably protected from (in a similar way) to unlawful interception
and such like?

: However, I do believe that anyone posting copyrighted material to the
: net in violation of that copyright can, will, and should be liable to
: the copyright owner.  That's only fair.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Evans                                   |evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 565 1979 (Home)                     |evansmp@cs.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 359 6531 x4039 (Office)             |
From: evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk (Mark Evans)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
Subject: Re: [news.admin.policy]  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
Date: 17 Aug 92 08:30:11 GMT
Organization: Aston University

kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
: 
: Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
: From: jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz)
: Subject:  Re: Groups used to distribute illegal material
: Message-ID: <Bsz8wo.1LF@mtholyoke.edu>
: Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 14:14:47 GMT
: 
: In article <ward1.713735730@husc8> ward1@husc8.harvard.edu (Lester Ward) writes:
: >There are two main issues brought up here, censorship and legality.  I'm
: >completely ignoring the censorship issue, as that did not seem to be the
: >original posters main issue.
: >
: >As far as legality, a few comments:
: >o Copywrites: Although the poster originally brought up images, which have
: >  accepted copywrite standards, many other types of posted data is still
: >  a bit hazy on exactly what a copywrite is.  Can you copywrite algrothms
: >  for example.  I'm speaking from a vaccuum here, so someone will correct
: >  me, no doubt.
: 
: I think the hazy areas are not under discussion right now... they are a
: separate issue that I as a news administrator don't really have to worry
: about until they are settled.
: 
: >o Juristiction: A post from Germany shows up in the USA.  It is illegal in
: >the USA, but not in Germany.  Is the poster breaking the law?  There are
: >probably not too many precidents for this (its not that likely), but I hope
: >the point is clear.  Suppose the post is illegal in both countries; how is
: >the poster prosecuted? etc.
: 
: This is a good point, but doesn't apply to the major issue under discussion,
: which is copyrighted material.  Copyright laws are international.

The definition about how a piece gets to be copyright is non-standard,
most notably the 'derived work' clause in the US law, which is very
relevent here.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Evans                                   |evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 565 1979 (Home)                     |evansmp@cs.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 359 6531 x4039 (Office)             |
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk
From: evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk (Mark Evans)
Subject: Re: [news.admin]  Re: "Computers graphic when it comes to porn"
Organization: Aston University
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 16:31:30 GMT

kadie@cs.uiuc.edu (Carl M. Kadie) writes:
: 
: From: hartman@ulogic.UUCP (Richard M. Hartman)
: Newsgroups: news.admin
: Subject:  Re: "Computers graphic when it comes to porn"
: Message-ID: <225@ulogic.UUCP>
: Date: 11 Aug 92 16:03:26 GMT
: 
: That is what they (the system's owners) did.  Then people started
: all this "you can't do that" b*tching and moaning.  The U of Manitoba
: (I think it was) cut of a.s.b because it was found to be in violation
: of the Canadian laws.  The group is still in violation even if only
: one article is the actual culprit.  So they cut it off.  If everyone
: said as you did "that's their privilige" we wouldn't be here in this
: thread.

Good idea for a denial of service attack, post 'in violation' articles
to any newsgroups you don't like.
Then places like the U of Manitoba will get rid of them.

:-)
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Evans                                   |evansmp@uhura.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 565 1979 (Home)                     |evansmp@cs.aston.ac.uk
+(44) 21 359 6531 x4039 (Office)             |
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk,alt.censorship
From: morgan@ms.uky.edu (Wes Morgan)
Subject: Re: WLU sys admins search out "nasty" filenames and passwords
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:03:21 GMT
Organization: The Puzzle Palace, UKentucky

>[This article, by Jim Boyce, jboyce1@mamut.wlu.ca, appeared on July
>14th in the Wilfrid Laurier University's student newspaper, the Cord.
>It is posted with Jim Boyce's permission.]
>
>     O'Grady said that she has not seen the program running since
>that time but has concerns that it might be "masked" or kept
>dormant until she has left the university. She continues to check
>for it regularly and maintains her opposition to such actions by
>Computing Services: "it is totally ridiculous for any individual
>or small group of individuals to determine the language that
>students, or even professors, use."

That's interesting; I just received a complaint last week about a 
program named "shit".  It had been placed in the background, and 
it required several hours of runtime.  I sent the owner of the pro-
gram a note, explaining the complaints; I also mentioned that, while
I didn't plan to "take any action", any further complaints would be
directed to him.  In his reply, he apologized (he didn't realize that 
other users could see his command names via ps) and changed the name 
immediately.

I wonder what would have happened if the original admins had simply
asked the users of such language to refrain from doing so.  How do
these people stand the monolithic approach?

--Wes

-- 
MORGAN@UKCC         |       Wes Morgan       |        ...!ukma!ukecc!morgan 
morgan@ms.uky.edu   | Engineering  Computing |   morgan@wuarchive.wustl.edu
morgan@engr.uky.edu | University of Kentucky | JWMorgan@dockmaster.ncsc.mil
  Mailing list for AT&T StarServer S/E  - starserver-request@engr.uky.edu
Newsgroups: alt.comp.acad-freedom.talk