HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: matt@physics16.berkeley.edu (Matt Austern)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Vinge on A Fire Upon the Deep
Date: 21 Aug 92 15:07:55 GMT
Reply-To: matt@physics.berkeley.edu
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory (Theoretical Physics Group)
NNTP-Posting-Host: physics16.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: dani@netcom.com's message of Thu, 20 Aug 92 18:48:08 GMT

In article <7z#n!sq.dani@netcom.com> dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:

> Vinge believes science
> fiction which ignores the potential of such a Singularity to be dishonest.
> The problem is that accepting it severely limits the potential for writing
> science fiction.  So he deliberately set out to create a milieu in which
> interesting stories (the current book and possibly future ones) could be
> placed. 
> 
> The galaxy, as he has constructed it, has several concentric zones.
> Closest to the core are the Unthinking Depths, in which human-level
> intelligence is impossible.  Then comes the Slow Zone.  We live near the
> outer edge of the Slow Zone.  Intelligence in this zone is limited to the
> human level:  Super-intelligent computers or beings cannot function here,
> and neither can faster-than-light travel.

Vinge explained most of this in his afterword to "The Blabber," in
_Threats and Other Promises_.

Perhaps I will change my mind after reading _A Fire Upon the Deep_,
but I felt at the time, and still feel, that he was not being
completely honest with his own premises.

In _Marooned in Realtime_, Vinge argued (convincingly, in my opinion)
that a Singularity was possible without faster than light travel, and
within the physical laws of our ordinary universe.  Sure, there was
one piece of technology in that book that is probably impossible in
our universe (the bobble, of course), but I never felt that this was
necessary for his premise of the Singularity.  As he says in the
afterword to _Marooned in Realtime_, and as a character says in that
book, you can realistically forsee a Singularity just by extrapolating
current trends.

Now, in "The Blabber," Vinge says a Singularity requires some kind of
extension of the physical laws that we know and love.  (FTL, for
example.)  I think that he has gotten around his argument for the
inevitability of a Singularity just by ignoring it.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.science
From: darknite@camelot.bradley.edu (John S. Novak III)
Subject: Re: _Tigana_ question
Organization: Bradley University
Date: 17 Aug 92 04:00:22 GMT

Sean Eric Fagan writes:

>I just finished rereading _Tigana_ (by Guy Gavriel Kay), and have one
>question:  what, exactly, did the ending mean?

SPOILERS


You mean the bit about the Riselka?  It means that of Devin,
Baerd, and Sandre, one of them will die, one is blessed, and
one's life will fork.  This from the poem that Dianora
understood.

This was one of the _few_ parts of the book that I didn't like,
because none of them, IMHO, deserved to die.
--
JSN: "Volt meters are tough.  Volt meters are much harder to destroy than
      ammeters."
SG: "Well, now, that all depends on who's using it."
          -John S. Novak III and Steve Gutschlag, 02-04-92
John S. Novak, III		darknite@camelot.bradley.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: dyck@cs.sfu.ca (Michael Dyck)
Subject: looking for Connie Willis story
Organization: CSS, Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 21:14:02 GMT

I'm looking for a Connie Willis story that appeared in
Isaac Asimov's Science Fiction Magazine, sometime in the
past 4 years, I'd guess, with mid-1990 being most likely.

It was a humorous piece involving time-travel, I think.
The main character was a housewife/mother in the present
and a college student in the past.

I'd like to know the title of the story and the issue of
IAsfm in which it appears.

Please email any info.

-Michael Dyck, dyck@cs.sfu.ca
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Unpublished Cordwainer Smith?
Date: 15 Aug 92 21:23:29 GMT
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com

In article <1992Aug13.182338.8263@vax.oxford.ac.uk>  
warda@vax.oxford.ac.uk writes:
> > By the way, let me get in a book plug here.  Sometime early
> > next year (by February I hope, though by late Spring at the
> > latest), NESFA Press will be publishing "The Complete Short
> > Science Fiction of Cordwainer Smith" in one hardcover volume
> > (cost probably $22-$30, depending upon our printing costs). The  
book
> > will include all tof  The Best of Cordwainder Smith,  The
> > Instrumentality of Mankind, Quest of Three Worlds, "Down to
> > a Sunless Sea" and one previously unpublished story (unless
> > somehow The Last Dangerous Visions beats us to press:)). 
> 
> Is the previously unpublished story "Himself In Anachron?"  This is  
mentioned 
> in the "time-line" in "Best Of CWS", but I've never seen it  
anywhere.  I have 
> a vague recollection that it was supposed to appear in "Again,  
Dangerous 
> Visions" - a book I have never seen, but would love to get a hold  
of.  Can 
> anyone confirm or deny this?
> 

Himself in Anarchron, which has never before appeared in print,
will be included in The Complete Short SF of Cordwainer Smith
that NESFA Press will publish in the spring.  It is supposed to
appear in The Last Dangerous Visions, but Harlan's exclusive
rights to it have long since run out according to the Smith
estate. 

--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
From: WSHERMAN@PENNDRLS.UPENN.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Kay's Mulitverse: Tigana & Fionavar
Date: 21 Aug 92 19:54:56 GMT


     I'm surprised that people are so timid in their analogies between
Tigana and Renaissance Italy.  Kay says in the forward of _Tigana_ that he
studied Italian history to prepare for the book.  Actually, the parallel goes
a good deal further: Kay simply turned the globe upside down and replaced the
boot of Italy by the glove of Tigana.  It was a particularly nice touch that
on the map at the front of the book, the compass has South marked off
instead of North as is customary in our world - if you replace the S by an N,
then the geography fits that of the Mediterranean pretty well: Ygrath is
Egypt, Khardun is Carthage (Tunis), Chiara is Sicily, and I have been trying
to figure out where the Barbadians come from and who the Quileians (sp?) are.
The Barbadians could be Iberian (Spanish), though that seems to be something
of a stretch.  What I'd like to know is whether there is a clear parallel
between the various city-states of Italy and the sections of Tigana.
     On another note, I think people haven't paid enough attention to why
Brandin invaded Tigana in the first place: he invaded to provide his son
with a kingdom of his own to rule.  Brandin clearly loved his (older) son
very dearly.  The fact that Brandin's revenge was so extreme was because his
love was so deep - this seems to be a tragic flaw if I ever saw one. It seems
odd to me to say that Brandin was not rational in how he dealt with his son's
death.  What parent would be? Especially one as passionate as Brandin.
Especially after Valentin defiantly told him that even though Tigana was
defeated it would be remembered for its works forever (remember, that is
just what Valentin said to Baerd's father the night before the battle, and
one can only guess that he said something similar to Brandin).
     Actually, despite the fact that _Tigana_ was very good (particularly,
as people have mentioned, the characterization of Dianora and Brandin), there
was one thing I missed: an ending.  I dislike books which end too quickly
after the killing stops.  _Tigana_ needed a 'praise them with great praise'
and return to the shire scene.  Things came to a close too suddenly for my
taste.  I'd kind of like to know what happened to Scelto, for instance.
     As for connections between Tigana and Fionavar, could it be that BRANDIN
comes back as Ailell, High king of BRENIN?  Or could Brandin and Dianora be
the local incarnation of King Arthur and Gwenivere?  There do seem to be
similar characters in the two books, but I'm not sure if there is any one to
one correspondence.  Any ideas out there?

Bill Sherman
Dept. of Physics,
University of Pennsylvania
sherman@sol1.lrsm.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: Sarek@world.std.com (Garrett Fitzgerald)
Subject: Re: David Brin - What is he up to?
Keywords: Brin, Dolphins, Sundiver, Startide Rising, Uplift War
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 16:10:09 GMT

In article <1720r5INN3b5@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> rod@cats.ucsc.edu (Rodrick Su) writes:
>	Sorry to disappoint you.  The next Brin novel will be Stratos, a
>non-uplift novel.  The next uplift novel might be Sooner.

Well, better Sooners than later... :-)

(I'm sorry, I tried not to send this, I really did... :-) )
--------------------
"Out-t-t-t!!!"

Sarek of Vulcan
a.k.a. Garrett Fitzgerald `:-)
Official Diver of the RFA, 'Chelle's TwinSib, and Donna's OneTrueLove

Sarek@world.std.com

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: duffey@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Thomas Duffey)
Subject: Re: Gene Wolfe: The Soldier series
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:07:37 GMT

dant@techbook.com (Dan Tilque) writes:

>steyn@cs.rochester.edu (Gavin Steyn) writes:
>>rvinluan@cs.cornell.edu (Rolando Vinluan) writes:
>>>	2) I don't have the first book, and the second
>>>doesn't come with a map, so can somebody help me with
>>>the modern names of the places? Rope is Sparta, Thrace
>>>is well, Thrace. But Hill, Tower Hill, Sestos, Nestos,
>>>Cowland...HELP!?!?
>>
>>The only one I remember is that Thought is Athens.  

>If I remember correctly, Tower Hill is Corinth.  If not then Hill is.

>---
>Dan Tilque    --     dant@techbook.com


	Yes, Tower Hill is Corinth.  Hill is Thebes, Sestos is Sestos, Nestos
I don't remember being in the book, Cowland is Boetia, Goodcattle Island is
Euboea (sp?), Bearland is Arcadia (another example of mistranslation, I
believe), the Hot Gates are Thermopylae, Redface Island is the Pelopennese,
Riverland is Egypt (obviously so, in Soldier of Arete) and that's all I can
remember off the top of my head.

	I too enjoyed these books a great deal, and reading them sparked an
interest in ancient history when I tried to track down the events described
within the books.

----
Tom Duffey			duffey@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu
From: branwen@cerebus.ccc.amdahl.com (Karen Williams)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Looking for 2 poems from Asimov's
Date: 20 Aug 92 19:29:12 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1992Aug20.041623.7886@menudo.uh.edu> HADCUJEK@admin.uh.edu (Julia Ellan Kosatka) writes:
>I remember a couple of poems that were published in Asimov's SF mag in the 
>early 80's and now that I've found this group, maybe I can get some help.  

These sound like "Improbable Bestiary" poems, a series of poems published in 
Asimov's and written by F. Gwynplaine McIntyre. I wish that they were
all republished in one volume somewhere; they were great.

--
                                          Karen Williams
                                          branwen@cerebus.ras.amdahl.com
"Don't whine. Warrior women speak in a husky whisper."
  -- Brat Pack #3
Xref: sparky rec.arts.sf.written:11283 rec.arts.sf.science:2598
Organization: Central Michigan University
Date: Tuesday, 18 Aug 1992 14:18:56 EDT
From: <34EP2A2@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: What are the best fantasy books involving dragons?

Definitely read
The Dragon and the George~  awesome book.

  *************************************
         Jillian/Jenever Emerye
       34EP2A2@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU
   "I'm just a girl who cain't say no"
              ~Oklahoma
  *************************************
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Orson Scott Card
From: clayton@mars.ee.usu.edu (Clayton Conrad)
Date: 17 Aug 92 15:57:52 MDT
 <willimsa.713639370@unix1.tcd.ie> <wlh04953.5@elp.aero.org> <1992Aug14.203203.25934@caeco.mentorg.com>
Distribution: world
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1992Aug14.203203.25934@caeco.mentorg.com>, phatch@storm.slc.mentorg.com  writes:
|> >Everthing deleted since nothing new was added.
|> 
|> Just checked out Maps in the Mirror from the library.  Has a lot of interesting things and 
|> some discussion of where the stories came from and how they developed.
|> 
|> He explains a lot of his background and story settings.  The net result gives a good
|> view of Card's writing methods and experience.  I am always surprised what books an
|> author likes in comparison to the kinds of books the author writes.
|> 
|> Card does list two more books in the Alvin Maker series that are yet to be written.
|> It would be good to see those and find out what Alvin moves on to.
|> 
|> For Card trivia and "rare" stories, the book is loaded.  I think he does better novels
|> than short stories or novellas.  The original Ender's Game story included in the book is
|> so much less than what the novel becomes.
|> 
|> So, has anyone else read this collection?  What were your opinions?
|> 
|> Phil

I agree with the comment that he writes better novels than short stories.  However, both
the core to Ender's Game and Xenophobe were published as short shories or novellas in
Analog.  Ender's Game the short story was brilliant.  It didn't need to be expanded, yet
Card managed to do so and very well.  On the other hand, Xenophobe was literally chopped
from the book and comprised the chapters about Qing-Jao.  When I read Xenophobe, I could
skip every other or every third chapter.  I didn't like this at all because it felt empty
when I read the Analog version.

Tanya Olsen
slg7m@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: richard@csi.on.ca (Richard Martin)
Subject: Re: _Tigana_ question
Organization: Carp Systems International, Kanata, ON
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 21:07:29 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.150858.879@galaxy.gov.bc.ca> gbrach@galaxy.gov.bc.ca writes:
>> In article <darknite.714209402@camelot>, darknite@camelot.bradley.edu (John S. Novak III) writes:
>> I _hope_ he writes more, but not another Tigana novel.  The whole
>> setting seemed to be set up (and beautifully at that) to tell
>> this one story.  Using it in any other plot would be near
>> criminal.
>> 
>
>Pshaw!  I wouldn't mind him using the same local (since I liked it very much);
>just as long as he uses different characters and a different scenario.
I think that a work set in another time (far removed from that of
_Tigana_ would be an excellent prequel to the book.  Perhaps an
account of the invasion of the peninsula.
Richard.
-- 
Richard Martin               	richard@csi.on.ca
If I had anything witty to say, I wouldn't put it here.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: qvortrup@inf.ethz.ch (Michael Qvortrup)
Subject: Re: Wolfe's Book of the New Sun
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 07:52:14 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.175703.26905@discus.technion.ac.il> davidba@carmel.technion.ac.il (David Ben_Ami) writes:
>Another question about the first book. Is Valeria the girl he meets
>in thge beginning of the book mentioned laterr?

You mean the one in the atrium with all the clocks (sunclocks?) when
he is looking for Triskele?

It was indeed my impression that they are the same person (but then 
again that assumption is not that uncommon in the books :-)

Greetings,
--Mike

-- 
#include <std-disclm.h>--"... and there is a small flaw in my character."---
Real Life: Michael Christian Heide Qvortrup      A Dane         ETH, Zuerich
e-mail   : qvortrup@inf.ethz.ch                  abroad         Switzerland
Institut fuer wissenschaftliches Rechnen  /  Inst. of Scientific Computation
From: STU_GLMCELHA@VAX1.ACS.JMU.EDU (Greg McElhatton)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: SF-LOVERS Digest   V17 #425
Date: 18 Aug 92 22:31:10 GMT

Actually, I think the best order for the Pern books are as follows:

 Dragonflight
 Dragonquest
 Dragonsong
 Dragonsinger
 Dragondrums
 The White Dragon
 Moreta
 Nerilka's Story
 Dragonsdawn
 The Renegades of Pern
 All the Weyrs of Pern

My reasoning is that while most people put The White Dragon after
Dragonquest, ALL the characters from song/singer/drums show up in
The White Dragon, and the book is MUCH more enjoyable if you read
the Harper Hall books first.

-Greg McElhatton
From: mcjunkin@hpspkla.spk.hp.com (Bart L. McJunkin)
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 18:49:04 GMT
Subject: Re: Recommended:  _Phoenix Guards_, by Stephen Brust
Organization: Hewlett Packard Company, Spokane, Wa.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written

kayser@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (Susan E. Kayser NSSDCwrites:
   
   Anyone who liked _The Three Musketeers_ will get a kick out
   of this book.  It's written in a whacky verbose style which
   is a pleasure all by itself.  The plot concerns the
   adventures of four new guards at the Phoenix court, with
   lots of intrigue, and every one fighting duels at such a
   rate you'd expect a general population decline.
   
I absolutely agree.  This books spoofs all of the long,
descriptive, travelogue trilogies that are today's norm.  A
favorite passage of mine was when the historian waxed eloquent
on the importance of brevity.  I'm sure that Brust had a great
time writing this book. 

Bart.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: baylor@force.ssd.lmsc.lockheed.com
Subject: Re: Joe Haldeman:  Worlds Enough And Time
Reply-To: baylor@force.ssd.lmsc.lockheed.com
Organization: LMSC, Sunnyvale, California
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 17:42:01 GMT

In article <!cymv-g.dani@netcom.com>, dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:
>Joe Haldeman's long-delayed "Worlds Enough and Time", the third book in
>his 'Worlds' trilogy, was worth waiting for.  If it's not the best science
>ficiton novel I've read this year, it's one of them.
>
[description deleted]
>
>One of the best science-fiction novels to appear this year, then, is a
>character study of a middle-aged woman.  (That's not the sort of thing
>you'd expect to sell.  I seem to recall someone on the net saying that the
>only way it Haldeman *was* able to sell it was as part of a trilogy which
>began with the *young* Marianne O'Hara.)  The author pulls it off remarkably
>well.

Glad to hear it. I'm waiting eagerly for the paperback. (It's not the 
money, it's the space!) I was asking Haldeman when this book would come
out at every con where I saw him for the last 3 years. His reply was,
[I need to grow some before I can write her correctly]. At least the
incredibly long wait should be worth it!


Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: mvp@hsv3.lsil.com (Mike Van Pelt)
Subject: Re: Mote in God's Eye
Organization: Video 7 + G2 = Headland Technology
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 22:02:48 GMT

In article <1992Aug9.054700.12646@oracle.us.oracle.com> mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
>In article <4501@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:
>>	IMNSHO, the mistake that one of you is making is in assuming that
>>the sequel to Mote means that the blockade DOESN'T work. I believe that
>>it deals with the time after the blockade finishes its job ...
>
>Sounds nice an logical except for one thing....
>People who claim to know have posted that it's about a Motie breakout.

According to Jerry Pournelle, about 1985, the Eye goes supernova.
Somebody lied about the length of its fuse.  (Who?  Motive?) The
supernova opens up several Alderson lines into the Motie system,
and they're out and established before anyone knows what's going
on.  (All they know at first is that they don't hear from the
blockade ships, and you can no longer jump to the Eye.)

>They may be wrong, but so far they're the best we've got.

Of course, N&P may have changed the plot sixteen times since 1985.

-- 
"It was more dangerous to drive                 Mike Van Pelt
away from Three Mile Island than                Headland Technology/Video 7
to stay there." -- Dr. Bruce Ames.              sun!indetech!hsv3!mvp
                                                mvp@hsv3.lsil.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: tomas_e@LINK.Physchem.KTH.SE (Tomas Eriksson)
Subject: K. Kurtz' Deryni series
Reply-To: tomas_e@LINK.Physchem.KTH.SE
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 16:10:55 GMT

Does anyone know if any new books in Katherine Kurtz Deryni series have 
been published in the last two years? Book 1 of the "Heirs of Saint 
Camber" trilogy ("The Harrowing of Gwynedd") was published in 1989, and 
"Deryni Magic" in 1990, but I've found no later books. Anyone know if 
there's a preliminary publication plan for book 2 & 3, and what it looks 
like? Any further books planned for those who can wait a decade or more?

Tomas

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tomas Eriksson                                          tomas_e@physchem.kth.se
            Surface Force Group, Department of Physical Chemistry,
               Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig)
Subject: Norton and Crispin:  Songsmith
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 18:45:51 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

"Songsmith" is a new Witch World novel, by Andre Norton and AC Crispin.
Fans of the Witch World novels will want to read it.  Those who are just
interested in a good read, and don't particularly care who married whom
and how many children they had will do as well do give it a miss.

The book doesn't read like one of Andre Norton's; it reads like that of a
less-skilled writer who is trying to imitate Norton's style.  And the
plotting is sloppy, consisting as does of a succession of incidents linked
by coincidence and writer's fiat.

It's not precisely bad, but it's not good either.  Well, it's better than
"Quag Keep...

-----
Dani Zweig
dani@netcom.com

   'T is with our judgements as our watches, none
   Go alike, yet each believes his own
		--Alexander Pope
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Melanie Rawn:  Next book?
From: jwwalden@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu (P'relan)
Date: 22 Aug 92 21:41:46 -0500
Organization: Dept. of Physics

In article <1992Aug20.010542.29284@newshost.unh.edu>, T_ADAMS@unhh.unh.edu (Tiffany   Adams) writes:
> In <5679@transfer.stratus.com> savoia@sw.stratus.com writes: 
>> Hold on!  Back up!  Wait a minute!!!!!  'The Dragon Token'???
>> Is that the next book after 'Stronghold'?  Did it just come out?
>> Come on!  'Fess up!   
>> 
>> Rick

I think _The Dragon Token_ came out in February 92.  I just read it this
summer.  It's still only out in hardback as far as I've seen.

> Yep...."The Dragon Token" is the second book in the "Dragon Star" series....of
> which "Stronghold" is the first.  No spoilers here, but I really enjoyed it...
> I always seem to get wrapped up in Rawn's characters...I think she does an
> excellent job of bringing them to life.  Anyway...as usual, the end leaves
> you dangling, desparately awaiting the next book....and so I wait, not so
> patiently, for the next book.......anyone care to volunteer a publication
> date?? anyone.....?? 
> 
> @>-->--- Tiffany

I think the Dragon Star series is considerably better than her first series,
but the cliffhanger endings are really beginning to annoy me.  The other
problem I found is that since the character names are derivative of the names
of their parents, older characters from previous books, you can get really
confused with all the similar sounding and mixed sounding names.  Still, it's
not as bad as a Dostoyevsky or Tolstoy novel where all your characters decide
to use a different one of their half-dozen or so names every other chapter.
Anyway, I have no idea of the publication date but it seems to take her about
a year so I wouldn't expect the next one (anyone know the title?) til sometime
in spring 93.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 P'relan (and Birith)      	   ``Time stand still -
 jwwalden@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu      I'm not looking back -
  or jwwalden@miavx1.bitnet	     But I want to look around me now.'' - RUSH
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written