From: klg@statsci.com (Kevin L. Gross)
Subject: Re: CFD for misc.jobs.offered.entry
Reply-To: klg@statsci.com (Kevin L. Gross)
Organization: Statistical Sciences, Inc
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 23:04:24 GMT

root@dogear.spk.wa.us (Bob Kirkpatrick) writes:

   2) It gets bandied about so that it can be determined if enough people like
      the idea.
   3) It's then discussed if the impact on the net (not from a personal view,
      but for all) is a good one. 
   4) A Call For Discussion is issued to collect comments enlist dialog with
      others to make sure that there is a) interest, b) reason to continue, and
      c) cover all the bases so this doesn't have to be redone in the near
      future. This happens in the news.groups area, not here. (although the
      dialog is often crossposted).


I think having yet another split of misc.jobs.offered is a bad idea.
Perhaps there are a lot of entry-level types out there. So what? There are
a lot of people out there in various categories:

   1. No experience, No education.
   2. No experience, lots of education.
   3. Lots of experience, no education.
   4. 2 years experience, no education.
   5. No experience, Phd.
   6. 5 years experience, no education.

So where does it end, and where do you draw the line? A lot of people have
backgrounds that don't fit "10 years experience and BSCS required". A
majority of people reading the net are either already working or going to
school.  Splitting the group up will make it harder for everyone to read
ALL the jobs possible and even worse, make it difficult for prospective
employers to post, possibly eliminating job postings. THIS I DO NOT WANT.

Starting another group isn't going to magically fill it with job offers.
Any job offers for entry-level positions are still going to go to the
misc.jobs.offered list.

I just wonder how many employers are going to post to an entry-level
group. No offense, but how many employers are *specifically* looking for
entry-level people that *aren't* already cruising campuses? How many
actual postings have there been for ELP's? I haven't seen many in the 3
years I've been reading this group. Course, I haven't noticed a big
differentiation until recently when the flap over "New grads need not
apply" started.

Not everyone is willing to lose a prospective GREAT employee for their
prejudices and why would you want to work for someone that does?

A lot of employers say they require a degree. I don't have one, a lot of
people don't. You don't hear us calling for a new group for non-grads only,
for the same reasons I've mentioned here.

Another idea would be to encourage the use of simple codes in the Subject
lines. Not to say you have to use them, but them that does, wins.

I refer to personal ads in the underground rags, SWM seeks SOF and like
that. At first it might be difficult to catch on, but after a while, it
would be easier:

   ELP - Entry Level Position
   MLP - Middle Level Position
   HLP - High Level Position
   SCR - Secret Clearance Required
   TCR - Top-Secret Clearance Required
   2YE - 2 Years Experience.
   5YE - 5 Years Experience.
   9Y+ - 9 or more Years Experience.

Its not like its that important to know in the subject line, but using a
news reader like nn to cruise through groups and look for ELP's would be
useful to those who require those positions.

My two cents, spend them or set them on the railroad tracks...