HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: grant@bluemoon.rn.com (Grant DeLorean)
Subject: Re: 14.4k modem on Sun 4/380
Organization: Blue Moon
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 92 22:18:53 GMT

jh@cadre.com (Joe Hartley) writes:

>>How should I configure /etc/{ttytab,gettytab} for the optimal throughput?
>>I tried 'Auto-baud' and various baud rates on the Sun, but my 386PC w/ a
>>similar 14.4k modem (supports all compression protocols) always negotiate to
>>14.4k.  It doesn't matter if the speed is set to 9600-57600 on either ends.

>I have a similar situation.  I've put a new modem on my Sun 4/470, but I'm
>having troubles configuring it properly for CTS/RTS handshaking (I think).
>Has anyone done this successfully yet?  The modem is a SupraFaxModem, if it
>makes a difference.

 It doesn't make a difference. I have recently added a Supra V.32bis/FAX
modem to my corral of high speed modems, they are all about the same
for basic setup (commands used to set the modems up are different, but
the result the same). V.32bis, PEP, and HST are all nice in their own
ways...

 I haven't had any problems with out of band flow control, but then I
am using a CoALM S8P board (5 HS modems...) so sort of cheated...

-- 
\   Grant DeLorean  - IHMSA & NRA Life Member -  (grant@bluemoon.rn.com)   /

   Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish.  -- Euripides
From: olsenc@milton.u.washington.edu (Clint Olsen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Solution:  Repartitioning disk SUN0424
Date: 26 Aug 92 17:18:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Aug26.171826.4472
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

Thank you to all that responded to my cry for help.

Last night I discovered, and as one of you pointed out,
my disk was labelled differently than ANY of the entries
in format.dat!!!

I found the discrepancy, and the partitioning went well.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Olsen 
olsenc@u.washington.edu

Computers cause dain bramage...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: heiser@ferrari.nmc.ed.ray.com (Bill Heiser)
Subject: 4.1.2 "esp0" messages
Organization: Equipment Division, Raytheon Company
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 92 14:25:37 GMT

On an IPX with 32mb memory, 424mb disk, 2 1.3G disks, and a SUN
5.0GB 8mm drive, I see the following when using the 8mm drive:
Aug 29 10:10:22 tdw911 vmunix: esp0:    Target 4 now Synchronous at 4.0 mb/s max transmit rate
Aug 29 10:17:43 tdw911 last message repeated 1980 times

The system gets *very* heavily loaded when doing a cpio restore from
an 8mm tape ... maybe becuase of the overhead of generating so many of those
messages?  What causes that message?  A configuration problem?

Thanks in advance.

Bill

-- 
* Happiness is a hot boiled lobster with drawn butter, a side dish of hot     *
* fresh steamers with melted butter & a hot corn on the cob with butter & salt*
Work: heiser@sud509.ed.ray.com
Home: bill@unixland.natick.ma.us  Public Access Unix/USENET 508-655-3848
From: shah@fnsony.fnal.gov (Hemant Shah)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: dump parameters fro Exabyte 8500 tape drive.
Date: 27 Aug 92 18:19:23 GMT
Reply-To: shah@fnalb.fnal.gov
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory, Batavia, IL

I am looking for "dump" command line options to use with Exabyte 8500 8mm
tape drive, which options should I use to dump in 2.3 GByte mode, and
5.0 GByte mode.

Thanx in advance.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hemant Shah                            | All the opinions expressed are my own
Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory  | and does not necessarily reflect
Systems Integration Group              | those of Fermilab.
E-mail :shah@fnal.fnal.gov             |
 Voice : (708) 840-8071	               | I haven't lost my mind
   Fax : (708) 840-2783                | it's backed on tape somewhere.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: barmar@think.com (Barry Margolin)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Re: message from Unknown router
Date: 2 Sep 1992 19:21:11 GMT
Organization: Thinking Machines Corporation, Cambridge MA, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: telecaster.think.com

In article <1992Sep2.144249.11124@samba.oit.unc.edu> Shawn.Hayes@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Shawn Hayes) writes:
>Hi.  A freind of mine has a few Sparcstations that he is managing and 
>he is having a few proplems with a message showing up every few minutes
>from an unknown router.  His machines are hooked up to thicknet backbone
>which is tied into a corporate network.  The unknown router is not one
>of his machines.  Has anyone run into a similar problem and what changes
>are likely to fix the problem. 

That message is printed by in.routed when it receives a routing table from
a router that's not on the local subnet and not listed in /etc/gateways.

We saw this when we were running two logical subnets on one physical net,
using a cisco router's "secondary address" feature.  In order to get the
router to send RIP broadcasts that hosts on both subnets would receive, we
had to configure it to use the 255.255.255.255 broadcast address rather
than net.net.subnet.255.  This caused machines on each logical subnet to
see the broadcast from the router's address on the other subnet.

This could also happen if your routers are configured to forward
broadcasts.  This is often not correct, so you may have a router
configuration problem.

If they determine that the routers are correctly configured, then you can
silence in.routed by putting an entry for the unknown router in
/etc/gateways on each machine that complains.  The entry will be ignored
when making routing decisions, because a machine can only route through a
machine on the same subnet anyway, but it will be a "known" router and thus
not generate warnings.

-- 
Barry Margolin
System Manager, Thinking Machines Corp.

barmar@think.com          {uunet,harvard}!think!barmar
From: rodney@cssc-syd.tansu.com.au (Rodney Campbell)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Re: NEEDED: format.dat for Seagate ST42400N Elite II Drive
Date: 28 Aug 92 04:24:48 GMT
Organization: Customised Software Solutions Centres, AOTC

grinnell@eng.umd.edu (Jim Grinnell) writes:

>Could someone send me the format.dat entry for the Seagate ST42400N Elite II
>2.5 Gig drive.  It is much appreciated.

I was going to email to this person but since so many people have asked
about this and I have emailed a few people I thought I would post it once
and for all:

I do not have a format.dat entry but you can use the following parameters
for the format program to get it to work:

Cylinders      Alt Cyl	  Phys Cyl  	Heads	Sectors/Track
2623	       2	  2625		11	144

I have used this on a drive here with no apparent problems.

						  		Rodney...
-- 
     Rodney Campbell - AOTC    |Email : rodney@cssc-syd.tansu.com.au
   Advanced Network Products   |Snail : Level 1, 18-20 Orion Rd, Lane Cove West
 Customised Software Solutions |  -  PO Box A226, Sydney South 2000, Australia.
        Centre - Sydney        |Phone : +61 (0)2 911 3123   Fax: +61 2 911 3199
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: sandra@csri.toronto.edu (sandra smith)
Subject: format.dat for Fujitsu M2652SA Drive?
Organization: CSRI, University of Toronto
Date: 27 Aug 92 14:14:36 GMT

I'd very much appreciate a format.dat entry for a Fujitsu M2562SA (1.7GB).
I've searched the format.faq to no avail.  Thanks.

--sandra

-------------------
Sandra Smith
CSRI, University of Toronto
sandra@csri.toronto.edu
416 978 8715
From: glenns@nmsstage.pad.otc.com.au (Glenn Satchell - Uniq professional Services)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Re: Trackball for a Sun?
Keywords: Trackball
Date: 27 Aug 92 04:36:24 GMT
Reply-To: glenns@nmsstage.pad.otc.com.au (Glenn Satchell - Uniq professional Services)

In article <1992Aug21.231118.13005@attain.icd.teradyne.com>, jxh@certes.icd.teradyne.com (Jim Hickstein) writes:
|> In article <1992Aug14.161543.24987@newsgate.sps.mot.com> mario@wdc.sps.mot.com (Mario Nigrovic) writes:
|> 
|> Now, if someone could recommend a way to clear up "mouse grunge", my
|> life would be complete.  Maybe an eraser or something...
|>
Yep, an eraser is a good way to clean it, particularly one of the hard rubber
typewriter style erasers.

-- 

Glenn Satchell                             kalli!glenn@fourx.aus.sun.com
Uniq Professional Services Pty Ltd                 glenns@nms.otca.oz.au

"The answer is no, and we'll negotiate from there."
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: cseb@frodo.lfi.uni-hannover.de (Christian Sebeke)
Subject: SUMMARY: Pseudo Terminals
Keywords: admin terminals utmp
Reply-To: cseb@frodo.lfi.uni-hannover.de
Organization: Univ. Hannover, LFI, Abt. Design&Test
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:51:04 GMT

Thanks to all who replied:

ccoprmd@prism.gatech.edu
flash!flash.telesoft.com!mnejat@uunet.UU.NET
ajn@physics.wm.edu
bill@its.brooklyn.cuny.edu

The solution for me was manipulating the corrupted /etc/utmp - file
with the program written by DaviD W. Sanderson (dws@cs.wisc.edu).
It is available from comp.sources.unix (ask archie for the server
next to you) in Volume 25.

MAKEDEV/mknod did not help because the utmp-file seems to be
unaffected by this command.

Mehregan mentioned that there might be a patch for this behaviour.
Is there anyone who has the number on the fly? If it is a Bug, I wonder
why Sun did not fix it in 4.1.2.

The original posting was:

-----------CUT------------
Sometimes when I log into one of our SUN's and ask 'who',
I get something like

User     tty       login@  idle   JCPU   PCPU  what
cseb     ttyp2     8:40am                      w 
xbey     ttyp6    14Aug9210days                -

xbey does not have any processes running. It seems as if
the Pseudo Terminal is not released correctly. I looked
through the answerbook, manuals and FAQs - nothing found.

How can I free ttyp6 ?

Setup: several SPARCs, 4.1.2, OW3, occasionally SUNVIEW

-----------CUT------------

Christian Sebeke, Univ. Hannover/LFI, Schneiderberg 32, D-3000 Hannover 1                             Tel: +49 511 762 5035                    sebeke@frodo.lfi.uni-hannover.de

Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin,comp.sys.sun.hardware,comp.sys.sun.misc
From: lshao@netcom.com (Ling Shao)
Subject: format.dat entry for Seagate ST41600N SCSI Disk
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 18:34:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Followup-To: poster

If you have the format.dat entry for the ST41600N drive,
please e-mail me at lshao@netcom.co. Thanks.





-- 

=======================================================
Ling Shao		| e-mail:  lshao@netcom.com
MIS Dept., On Lok Inc.  |	
1441 Powell Street,	| voice:   (415) 989-2578 x231
San Francisco, CA 94133	| fax:     (415) 788-9340
=======================================================
From: pkn@cs.utexas.edu (Kay Nettle)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Help install OS on local disk
Date: 31 Aug 1992 09:26:28 -0500
Organization: CS Dept, University of Texas at Austin
NNTP-Posting-Host: deepthought.cs.utexas.edu
Keywords: sun3 SunOS4.1.1

Hi,

	I'm trying to install 4.1.1 on a local disk that's attached to
my sun3/60.  I'm not sure what type of disk it is, but when I do
format, it says 

AVAILABLE DISK SELECTIONS:
        0. sd1 at si0 slave 8
           sd1: <CST760M-SC cyl 1637 alt 3 hd 15 sec 53>

So, I was following the instructions on how to install the OS, I dd
the miniroot onto the disk.  And that worked just fine.  I booted it
from the net and answered 4.2 to root filesystem type and sd1b to root
device and I got the follow:

	bdevp:bad open
	Boot: unable to mount root

Does anyone have any idea of what's going on here.  Any suggestions as
to what I can try?  If more information is needed, please let me know.

Thanks,
Kay

pkn@tac.harc.edu

Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: blu@uunet.uu.net!mercomp (Brian Utterback)
Subject: Need Juke Box for a WORM.
Organization: Mercury Computer Systems
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 16:56:08 GMT

I have an immediate need for a WORM drive equiped with a juke box.
What is the current state of the art regarding these kinds of things?
Do you know of such a thing? Are you using on?  If so, please drop me
a line.

BTW, on systems that have juke boxes on optical drives, cdroms, etc.,
how do users access the different volumes?  Is there some standard
method?

Also, if you know of the same kind of thing for exabyte drives, I would
appreciate hearing about them too.

Brian Utterback
Mercury Computer Systems.
blu@mc.com
From: schorr@ead.dsa.com (Andrew J. Schorr)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Running out of mbufs
Keywords: SunOS mbuf
Date: 27 Aug 92 14:55:47 GMT
Organization: Daiwa Securities America, New York

I have a SparcStation 1 running SunOS 4.1.2 that hangs
every 10 days.  That is, approximately every 10 days, it
freezes, and I must hit L1-A and reboot.  Before it
hangs, it starts to print messages about running out
of mbufs, as follows:

Aug 25 04:13:06 ead2 vmunix: mbuf map full
Aug 26 02:47:51 ead2 vmunix: le0: out of mbufs - packet dropped
Aug 26 02:54:24 ead2 last message repeated 18 times
Aug 26 02:57:16 ead2 vmunix: le0: out of mbufs - packet dropped
Aug 26 02:57:25 ead2 vmunix: le0: out of mbufs - packet dropped

This machine serves as a dump host (it has an Exabyte attached
to it), and it seems always to hang while in the middle
of a remote dump (which presumably involves a lot of network
traffic).

So, is there anything I can do about this?  Is there some
kernel parameter I can change that will cause more mbufs
to be allocated?  Does anyone have any ideas?

Thanks for your help,
Andyu

P.S. Please respond by e-mail!  My news feed is NOT working!
I will summarize if there is interest.
From: hanrahan@iron.hq.aflc.af.mil (Kevin Hanrahan)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Re: Syslog LOG_LOCAL0 facility problem (thanks)
Date: 25 Aug 92 12:40:21 GMT
Organization: AFSAC


  Thanks to all who responded.  I tried to send email, but our
mailer doesnt like .com  and some international addresses.

  I got it working now.

-- 
Kevin M. Hanrahan    hanrahan@iron.hq.aflc.af.mil         (513) 427-CETA
CETA Corporation              [137.245.81.8]              (513) 257-5760
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: ehammeg@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (erik.hammega)
Subject: xdballoc: out of dblks
Keywords: systems hangs STREAMS
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 13:19:42 GMT

A few days ago I had the following problem:

On a SPARC station 2 (32MB RAM) SunOS 4.1.2
We got the following message:

	xdballoc: out of dblks

And after this the system hung. (I had to L1-A it)
After rebooting everything worked fine for about 90 minutes
then the same message appeared and the system hung again.

This repeated 5 times that day. Everytime the system would stay
up for about 90 minutes and then hang giving the by that time
hated message out of dblks.

The SS2 is equiped with Aurora S1600 cards giving a total of 48
serial lines. When the problems started about 35 lines were
being used by an application, that collected data from these
lines (generated via Barcode scanners).

Netstat -m showed me a very high number of <128 dblks in current use
(app. 30,000 by the end of a 90 minute interval).
This figure increased constantly during the uptime of the system
and I got the impression that whatever was going wrong had 
something to do with this.

I allready installed patch 100359-05 (Streams jumbo patch).

If you have ANY clue as for what is happening here, and how to stop
it from happening please E-mail me.

Regards,

Erik Hammega
AT&T Network Systems Nederland bv
Information Technology
E-mail : ehammeg@hvlpa.att.com
From: jayl@bit.UUCP (Jay Lessert)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Re: Sun 690MP performance problems
Date: 31 Aug 92 17:26:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: bit.415
Reply-To: jayl@bit.UUCP (Jay Lessert)
Organization: BIT,  Portland, OR

In article <2A9FA7FE.2305@orion.oac.uci.edu> iglesias@draco.acs.uci.edu (Mike Iglesias) writes:
>Is anyone else having problems like these with their 690MP?  Sun has made
>some attempts to look into the problem, but all we've heard is that
>"the system is performing as we said it would".  We're using ps, vmstat,
>iostat, top, etc trying to find what's going on; does anyone have any
>suggestions on what else we could use to find where the bottlenecks are?

I see no reason to doubt your Sun contacts when they say "the system is
performing as we said it would".  Sun has been pretty forthright about
the capabilities of their asymmetric MP kernel (in their written
statements, at least) and it *does* sound like you're simply I/O-kernel
bound in your current application mix.

In the real world, I guess it *is* pretty unrealistic to expect your Sun
salesman to advise you to (1) buy a Solbourne or (2) hang to your
Sequent for another year or two, but I suspect you'd be *much* happier
if you had done one or the other of those...

Unless you're willing to work something along those lines, all you can
do is hang on and wait for SunOS 5.1 (or whatever revision SunOS is up
to in Solaris 2.1).

I know it's a tough lesson to learn, but on *any* major computer purchase,
you gotta benchmark, benchmark, benchmark, then write performance standards
into the acceptance criteria in the purchase order.


-- 
Jay Lessert  {decwrl,cse.ogi.edu,sun,verdix}!bit!jayl
Bipolar Integrated Technology, Inc.
503-629-5490  (fax)503-690-1498
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: vito@eng.umd.edu (Robert McAllister)
Subject: bootp and NFS
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 92 18:58:59 GMT
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Maryland, College

Hi all,
   I am having problems with having bootpd and NFS on the same
machine. I downloaded botpd 2.22 form Carnegie Mellon, and installed
as per instructions in the README file. This consisted of editing
the /etc/serveces file and adding the following lines:
		bootps		67/udp	#bootp server
		bootpc		68/udp	#bootp client
I then edited the Makefile toinstall it into the correct directories.
When I typed "make", it compiles without complaints. 
I added a line in /etc/inetd.conf to start the daemon on reboot, and
rebooted the machine. After reboot, the 3 client machines couldn't
NFS mount vital directories. They kept giving an RPC timeout error.
	Could I be missing something? Any help would be greatly
appreciated. 
	Thanks in advance.

	Rob.

e-mail  vito@eng.umd.edu
	vito@fanny.wash.inmet.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin,comp.sys.sun.apps
From: benny@csoc.COM (Benny Clark)
Subject: backup copilot trying to access wrong tape drive
Organization: CAD Systems of Carolina
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 14:34:53 GMT

I am running backup copilot on a SS2.  I have two tape drives.

1.  rst0   1/4" QIC 150
2.  rst1   Exabyte 2.3 gig

I want to backup a few filesystems to rst1.  I have set it up to
do this and it works fine except for one small problem.  When
I come into the office in the morning, opermon is telling me that
ait can't write to rst0.  I know that it can't write to rst0.  There
is no tape in there.  I do not want to write to rst0.  The backup
did write correctly to rst1, but why does it try to write to rst0?

Any help is appreciated.  Please email.

Thanks, 

-- 
   _/             Benny Clark                  Phone : 919-859-4004
      ___/  ___/ Strategic Technologies        Fax   : 919-859-0657
  /  /     _/   4917 Water's Edge Dr. St. 280  Email : ice@csoc.COM
_/ ____/ ____/ Raleigh, NC  27606                    : ...!uunet!csoc!ice
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
From: borchert@titania.mathematik.uni-ulm.de (Andreas Borchert)
Subject: Re: NIS: multiple masters/overlapping domains
Organization: University of Ulm, SAI
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 08:54:11 GMT

In article <Btv6tM.A05@mtholyoke.edu>, jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:
> So what I would like to do is a have a simple two-level hierarchy of
> domains, where the IS machine is the master server for the top level
> (call it smith.edu), and CS's server becomes the master for a subdomain
> (call it csc.smith.edu).  Then I would like to have the server for
> csc.smith.edu be a slave for maps in smith.edu and a master for it's
> own set of maps.  This seems a much more logical approach to me.  Is
> it possible?

As far as I know, this functionality is covered by NIS+ which will be
shipped with Solaris 2.0.

-- 
_______________________________________________________________________________

Andreas Borchert, University of Ulm, SAI, D-W-7900 Ulm, Germany
Internet: borchert@mathematik.uni-ulm.de
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin,comp.sys.sun.apps
From: tony@marsh.cs.curtin.edu.au (Tony Lock)
Subject: ARM Revisited
Organization: Curtin University of Technology
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 09:31:21 GMT

Hello again, more information on Sun's Account Resource Manager.

The general response I got was 'not a particularly nice product
to have to use'. Unfortunately, it seems to offer all the right
kinds of facilities in an environment that must be reasonably
tightly controlled.

Now for some notes:

1. There is a patch on the 4.1.2 release CD that will at least
	allow it to be installed. Kind of a nice start.

2. Probably best not to use it with C2 security.

3. The ARMTOOL header message indicates that it is a beta release.
	It is not, its just a bad message.

4. The ARMTOOL in particular is not intuitive. The domain name
	mentioned is the NIS domain name. The arm domain appears
	to be unnamed, and is defined purely by the policy daemon
	that you connect to. That is, connect to another policy
	daemon, and lo, you are on a different arm domain.

5. If you wish to use the idlelockscreen facility, you MUST have
	at least two concurrent logins possible, since it appears
	to use one for the windowing, and one for the lock screen.

6. If for any reason you wish to make use of your favourite X lock
	screen facility, you must have xhost + (or similar) so that
	the windowing security is diasabled. Bit of a joke really,
	considering what the package is to be used for.

7. The timeout daemon seems to be very flimsy. If for any reason the
	auto lockscreen process cannot execute, or is terminated
	abnormally, the daemon doesn't recognise that the timeout
	should restart.

That's all for now, but I'm sure that there are other issues that will
arise. Thanks for all the replies.

Tony Lock
Curtin University
Western Australia.
From: lyndon@angelo.amd.com (Lyndon C. Lim)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: recommendations for backup hardware
Date: 4 Sep 92 17:35:37 GMT
Organization: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.


hi.  i'm looking for recommendations for backup systems.
i'm somewhat familiar with 8mm drives for the sun, but
haven't been very impressed with the reports of reliability
problems.  they seem finicky.  i was wondering what experiences
people have had with the 4mm DAT systems.  do you think the
market is going towards these systems?  i'm afraid to buy
a system which may turn out to be a dead end.

any information would be appreciated.

thanks,
lyndon c.
lyndon@brahms.amd.com
From: mills@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Gary Mills)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sun.admin
Subject: Re: how to determine if ypservices available
Date: 25 Aug 92 18:13:25 GMT
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada

In <1992Aug25.121930.11832@iplmail.orl.mmc.com> chucks@iplmail.orl.mmc.com (Chuck Strickland) writes:

> 		 this works great. the problem is that when the system
> comes back on the net, sometimes after a couple of months, the yp maps
> a extremely out of date.

What I do to avoid the problem of out-of-date NIS maps on the slaves is
to run yppush every night on the NIS master.  Sun recommends running
ypxfr on the clients, but I find yppush simpler, and it will only
initiate an ypxfr if the maps are out of date.  Here's my script:

#!/bin/sh
# yppushall: push all NIS maps to all NIS slaves

for MAP in `ypwhich -m | cut -d' ' -f1`
do
	/usr/etc/yp/yppush $MAP
done

#!/end
-- 
-Gary Mills-         -Networking Group-          -U of M Computer Services-
Xref: sparky comp.sys.sun.admin:5889 comp.unix.aix:9149