HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mark@tc.fluke.COM (Mark D. Nagel)
Subject: Re: Sonics end of year report
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:08:24 GMT

In <1992Dec31.210124.26732@microsoft.com> paulg@microsoft.com (Paul Goode) writes:

>I have to give individual notice here to Michael Cage. He has been
>rebounding well even even by his standards (35 in two games, recently)
>and has more than held his own against opposing centers (Including holding
>the Shaq to nine points). George Karl probably singles out Michael's
>contributions more than any other player.

George also mentions/praises Nate MacMillan alot. Nate was the difference in
lastnight's win over the Warriors: You can't come up with a better match-up
than the Sonics and Warriors -- what a game!

Also, I have to agree with you on Payton's play. He really should get voted
to the all star game. His defense is outright swarming and he is up ~6 points
a game on 54% shooting (up from 45% last year).
-- 
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      UUCP: microsoft!fluke!mark or sun!fluke!mark
     Snail: John Fluke Mfg. Co. / P.O. Box C9090 / Everett WA  98206
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Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: oliver@athena.mit.edu (James D. Oliver III)
Subject: Re: Points Per Possession
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 08:31:43 GMT


Okay, but what was the formula you used to calculate number of possessions?
____________________________
	Jim Oliver  
	oliver@athena.mit.edu /	joliver@hstbme.mit.edu
	oliver%mitwccf.BITNET@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: byau@jarthur.claremont.edu (Ben Yau)
Subject: Re: JJ (Was: Re: how bad is Dallas?)
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 01:56:19 GMT

In article <7802@dove.nist.gov> hira@cme.nist.gov writes:
>
>How about a trade offer from the Bullets, since he seems to like guns
>so much.

BA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

>
>How about Grant & Chapman for JJ? Grant is a well established F who 
>can score, and Chapman is young and has good potential and can score.
		^^^^^^^

>
>Sound even? Dallas gets two good established Pros, and the Bullets get 
		         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
are you sure about this?  
Harvey is an excellent player.  (he looks really really really small though).
He could probably be considered an established player. 
Chapman definitely IS improving.  but would you really call him establsihed?

I would consider even Gugs to be more established than Chapman from what
I hear.

I am not sure if Dallas wopuld take this even if it was offered to them. 
it doens't seem like enough for a fourth pick overall in the draft (well, this
year's draftt at least..  maybe it will be worth that much for whomever teh 
fourth pick is in next year's draft :)

>a player that has all-star *potential* (and likes waving guns :-))
>

*snicker*  stop it, you're killing me :)

so anyone who knows more about this situation w/ Jimmy and waving guns want
to share with us what Jimmy's future holds for him ?  i would be interested
in hearing the whole story.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Yau		    byau@jarthur.claremont.edu	          SHHHTEENKEE FOO FOO
------------------------------

"Nothing spoils fun like finding out it builds character"
						-Calvin from 
						"Calvin and Hobbes"
				----------------------------
From: dougs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Doug Steele)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:34:55 GMT
Subject: Re: Team Standings and Stats
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
From: siwasaki@unix1.tcd.ie (simon iwasaki)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Slam Dunk Contestants
Date: 11 Jan 93 16:54:47 GMT
Organization: Trinity College, Dublin


test
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: kolli@seas.gwu.edu (Chakravarthy Kolli)
Subject: Re: Jordan & Pippen: No Olympics
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 16:41:09 GMT

In article <1993Jan2.183905.22101@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> u_nique@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Jerray Wei) writes:
>In article <1992Dec30.221708.21896@ll.mit.edu> nates@ll.mit.edu ( Nate Smith) writes:
>>pretty deep to find the cause of the Chicago flatness to me.
>>
>>on another note, here's a vote for No Repeat Appearances by any NBA
>>player.  there are plenty of players to form "dream" teams from. ( i'd
>>make an exception for Sir Charles, though :-).  then mikey and scotty
>>dont have to "agonize" over whether they should go again - they wont
>>be allowed to.  somehow i dont think magic & bird would mind this rule
>>either.
>
>This is true.  Any other Dream Teamers suffering from the extra summer of
>"play?" (when you romp by 50 in every game and play 20 minutes...)  Barkley,
>Malone, Robinson, Laettner, Mullin, Stockton (who got injured) are all doing
>just fine.  Patrick Ewing is a bit off, and Drexler had knee surgery.  Huh,
>it doesn't seem like Jordan and Pippen have an excuse.
>

By the way is Jordan really playing that bad?. Watch the game closely,
and you will see how much effort he puts into the game. Much of that
effort doesn't turn up in statistics.

chak kolli
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: mittman1@athena.mit.edu (Christopher T Chiu)
Subject: Manning trade rumors(Was Re: Another Pacers trade rumor)
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:43:20 GMT

Jeff Keller writes:
>It was reported by Mark Patrick of WISH-TV8 (Indianapolis CBS affiliate) that
>there was a rumor going around about a deal involving Reggie Miller for the
>Clippers' Danny Manning.  Anyone else heard anything about this?  Personally,
>I doubt the Clippers would accept this as a straight-up deal, but maybe
>if we threw in Smits and they gave us a minor outside threat (seeing as how
>Smits is a minor threat to himself)...
>
>I don't create the rumors, I just report 'em.

I don't know if it's true, but it would be a very foolish move for
the Clippers.  Danny Manning blossomed last year under Larry Brown,
and has been a sensational performer in the paint.  Reggie Miller, on
the other hand, is a one-dimensional player; without his scoring he
is utterly useless.(Just check out his defense!)

It would be a great steal for Indiana, but if the Clippers' front
office has any brains, it would take much more for them to 
think of trading Manning.  Frankly, I don't think there is enough
talent, or at least the kind of talent that the Clippers need,
to justify a trade.

On the other hand, does anyone know if the Celtics or the 
Warriors are making moves for Manning?  Now there are two 
teams with enough talent for a trade, and who desperately
want a big man.

From a curious adventurer,
Genghis
mittman1@athena.mit.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: hymie@fff.chem.utah.edu (James Kleimeyer)
Subject: Re: Slam Dunk Contestants
Organization: University of Utah Computer Center
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 93 00:22:59 GMT

In article <siwasaki.726771427@unix1.tcd.ie> siwasaki@unix1.tcd.ie (simon  
iwasaki) writes:
> Anyone know of this years slam-dunk championship contestants?
> 
> My pick would be:Brown, L.Johnson, Ceballos, Kemp, O'Neal(!!), Augmon,
>                  Dumas(!),B.Edwards.
> 
> Any suggestions??
> 

David Benoit.

--
James Kleimeyer
FFF Research Center, Dept. of Chemistry
University of Utah    SLC, UT 84112
(801) 581-7168   hymie@fff.chem.utah.edu  (NeXT Mail)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: nates@ll.mit.edu ( Nate Smith)
Subject: need Reporters for the NBASTATS[tm] Project
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 16:46:22 GMT

We are still looking for Reporters in the 1992-1993 NBASTATS[tm]
Project.  the following 5 teams out of the 27 are currently being
picked up by the other Reporters, increased their workload:

         indiana
         milwaukee
         dallas
         sacramento

    *and* (surprise)   PHOENIX!

wouldnt it be ironic if the Suns go all the way without a Reporter!

- nate
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: dmd39855@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Daniel DuBois)
Subject: Re: Paxson sucks (was Re: Phoenix is absol
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 06:58:46 GMT

hillyard@msc.cornell.edu writes:

>From article <C0Cz23.8JG@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, by dmd39855@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Daniel DuBois):
>> hillyard@msc.cornell.edu writes:
>> 
>[...]
>> 
>>>Last time this came up I posted a comparison of Paxsons stats with the Bulls
>>>(w Jordan) and I think it was San Antonio (wo Jordan).  They are the same.
>>>Paxsons stats are not inflated because of playing next to Jordan.
>> 
>> How many games do you have to go on?  You cant really compare results of
>> two games for a player and extraploate that into an entire season w.o
>> Jordan.
>> 
>Sorry, not clear.  Paxson used to be a Spur (?).  I compared his
>last season there with his stats as a Bull.  Practically identical.

Oh, OK..  I didnt understand.  I thgouht you compared Paxson's season
stats to a game the bulls played against San Antonia w/o Jordan.
Thought that would be a pretty weak arguement.

I don't think this comparison tells much either however.  Totally
different teamates, his role is different, offensive scheme is
different.  The fact that his stats are the same is more coincidence
than proof of Jordan's non-effect on him.

-Dan
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: tamada@cheshire.oxy.edu (Michael K. Tamada)
Subject: Re: Sonics' draft picks
Keywords: Sonics Seattle
Organization: Occidental College, Los Angeles, CA 90041 USA.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 00:18:15 GMT

In article <1993Jan10.205657.5461@henson.cc.wwu.edu> n9041679@henson.cc.wwu.edu (brian h. harper) writes:

>Remember the Sonics had the 2nd pick in the 90 draft 
>(I forget now how they got the lottery pick) 

     Didn't they get that #2 pick by trading Gerald Henderson to New
York, and the pick ended up being the #2 pick (Gary Payton)?  Ironically,
the Sonics acquired Henderson by trading a first round draft choice to
the Celtics for him.  That draft choice turned out to be the #2 pick --
Len Bias.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
  |__	       o
  | W			   Mike Tamada
		  |\	   Institutional Research Office
		   \O	   Occidental College
		    |      tamada@oxy.edu
		   /|
		  | |

Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: sterbenc@ivhs.mot.com (Joe Sterbenc)
Subject: Re: Suns file protest in San Antonio loss
Organization: MOTOROLA 
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:45:46 GMT
Followup-To: rec.sport.basketball.pro

> I think there have been more as well - one in the East involving CHicago.
> ANyone know circumstances surrounding either of these?

I think you're referring to the famous Trent Tucker shot. The Knicks 
inbounded the ball with 0.1 seconds left, and Trent managed to catch,
jump, and shoot before the buzzer went off. The Bulls protested on
the grounds that no human can move that fast (on a neutral court). The
official decision was: basket (and game) counts, but the 0.4-second
rule was written as a result of the protest. Therefore, even though
some good came out of it, the protest was not upheld. If I remember
correctly, the game was tied at the time, so a correct call would have
sent the game into OT, not given it to the Bulls anyway.

Epilogue: If you can't beat 'em, join 'em...where is Trent these days?
=====
Joe Sterbenc - Intelligent Vehicle Highway Systems - Motorola
All opinions are my own, but can be rented for reasonable rates
sterbenc@ivhs.mot.com
=====
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU (Terry Wong)
Subject: Re: Billy Owens update
Keywords: Billy Owens, Warriors
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 93 23:17:32 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.020241.8352@odin.corp.sgi.com>, dickh@tribe.esd.sgi.com (Dick Harkness) writes:

|> Billy Owens says he is ready to play and wants to come back this week.  
|> At this point, the Warrior brass is not talking on the speculation 
|> that Owens will be activated.  
|> 

The first part of what you say is true; the second part is not.
Owens has been anxious to play and been saying that he has been ready
for a week.
However, the Warriors are being cautious, because this happened once 
before.  About 2 weeks after the initial injury, which occurred on Dec. 8th,
Owens said he felt good enough to come back.  The Warriors let him
return to practice, and he hurt himself again immediately.  That's when
they told him to stay away until the doctors cleared him.

Owens said that he has been able to do deep knee-bends and working out
without pain with Warrior's conditioning coach, Mark Grabow, without pain.
He pushed the Warriors to move up the date of another MRI scan, and the
Warriors complied by giving Billy a scan on Monday, Jan. 4th.  The scan
found that Billy's condition had not improved enough, and the Warriors will
keep him out for another 2 weeks.  However, the doctors feel that there
is a chance Billy could be ready by then.

The doctors are very reluctant to perform surgery on Billy's knee.
The cartiliage that is damaged is right in the middle of the knee and
an operation would need to remove a lot of cartiliage.  The injury
is of a kind that will heal eventually on its own, but the time required
is an unknown.  Certainly, if it was left alone for a year, it would
heal.  Billy's knee has never been operated on, and for the good of
his future career, it's best that both he and the Warriors stay patient.

Meanwhile, Tyrone Hill has come up with a deep thigh bruise, which will
keep him out of tonight's Sonics game.  The Sonics have the NBA's best
home record, and the Warriors, without their best 2 rebounders, Hill and
Owens, will have a difficult time tonight.  By the way, Hill was the
NBA's 7th best rebounder for the month of December.

					terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU
From: blip@tartarus.uwa.edu.au (Bryan Lip)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Slam Dunk Contestants
Date: 13 Jan 1993 02:18:11 GMT
Organization: The University of Western Australia
NNTP-Posting-Host: tartarus.uwa.edu.au
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.4.19 #1

Luc "the hammer" Longley


????????????????????????

longley is not a herman munster


from the Save Luc Club   Perth Australia
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: dewey@ccs.northeastern.edu (Dwight S Flewelling)
Subject: Re: QUESTION: 1st NBA 3pt shot?
Organization: College of CS, Northeastern U
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 18:08:09 GMT

Who hit the very first NBA 3-pointer? 

this isn't really difficult question. 

The first NBA 3 pointer was scored by Boston Celtics Head Coach Chris Ford.


Dewey
From: n9041679@henson.cc.wwu.edu (brian h. harper)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Sonics' draft picks
Keywords: Sonics Seattle
Date: 11 Jan 93 19:17:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: henson.1993Jan11.191752.19042
Organization: Western Washington University

wgr@rti.rti.org writes:

>In article <1993Jan10.180601.19497@zip.eecs.umich.edu> raghu@nairobi.eecs.umich.edu (Raghu Mani) writes:
>>There is no point in even thinking about either Webber or Montross as Sonics
>>since they are both almost certain lottery picks and given the way the Sonics
>>are playing, they will probably end up one of the last 4 or 5 picks of the 
>>first round.

>Also, Webber is just a sophomore and Montross is a junior.  I wouldn't be
>surprised if Webber came out early, but I'd be very surprised if Montross
>did.

I'd be more surprised if either of them didn't. Mostly it depends on the
type of year they're having. If they have good years, expect them to enter
the draft. There's just no reason to stay if you're going to be a lottery
pick. The only reasons to stay would be to improve your draft number or
contend for the championship. But consider what you risk. A bad season or
injury and you've lost millions of dollars. The trend in both football and
basketball is to come out when you're hot. Both these guys are hot, and we
should expect to see them in the '93 draft, along with junior Anfernee
Hardaway, who's absolutely scary. I hope a team in the East picks him up.

-Brian Harper
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: markham@brtph597.bnr.ca (Andrew Markham P205)
Subject: Re: was Re: Paxson sucks (was Re: Phoenix is absolutely scary...)
Organization: BNR Inc. RTP, NC
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 15:03:50 GMT

Dave Meeks writes:
>Andrew Markham writes:
>>
>>No, that's the end of YOUR discussion.  MAYBE minus Pippen?  He's an All-Star
>>and makes a strong case for the most versatile player in the NBA (anyone else 
>>average 20pts, 7 boards and 7 assists last year? -- and so far this year he's
>
>Well, yes...  Larry Bird was going at about 20pts, 10 boards and almost 7
>assists last year... 
>He was a much better shooter as well.  Of course, he only played half the 
>season and Pippen is a MUCH better one-on-one defender.

Notice I said he 'makes a strong case', not 'is a total lock'.  IMHO, Pippen
gets the edge over Bird if you simply take last season into account.  Any
year before and I'll take Bird, but his back was simply getting the best of
him.  

>As for Pippen, I think he is more of a very good player that is raised to
>All-Star level thanx to Jordan.  

I disagree.

>He has some strengths, but some weaknesses as well (half-court offense, 
>handling physical players, etc...) Reminds me of a Detlef Schrempf/Reggie 
>Lewis/Hornacek, etc level player.  Border-line AllStar who looks better 
>playing beside Jordan...

Well, we'll never know until Jordan retires and by then Pippen might not
be in his prime (which I think he if VERY close to).   So the point is
decidedly moot.

Pippen has improved in each of his last 5 seasons:

Year   FG%   FT%   RPG  APG  PPG
87-88 .463  .576   3.8  2.1  7.9
88-89 .476  .668   6.1  3.5 14.4
89-90 .489  .675   6.7  5.4 16.5
90-91 .520  .706   7.3  6.2 17.8
91-92 .506  .760   7.7  7.0 21.0

And he's currently on track to improve his RPG and APG again this season.

Not to mention that Jordan's rebound and assist totals have dropped 
appreciably over the last 4 (from 8.0 to 6.4 RPG, and from 8.0 to
6.1 APG).  You can attribute the loss of some rebounding to Grant,
but Pippen gets credit for all the disappearing assists.  Don't forget
he's a fairly decent defender, too.

What does all this mean?  He's better because opposing defenses don't
pay him as much attention as Jordan?  He's better because he has been
Jordan's understudy over the past 5 seasons?  He's better because he's
better?  

I don't know, and to be honest I don't care.  Pippen has taken what
was given to him and has done MUCH more than anyone ever expected from
one of Jordan's 'supporting cast'.  

If you play like an All-Star and put up All-Star numbers, aren't you
an All-Star?

-- 
Andrew W. Markham (markham@bnr.ca)
Bell Northern Research, Inc.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: sikorski@oj.miami.edu (Richard Sikorski)
Subject: mia Heat @ was Bullets- 02jan
Followup-To: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Organization: University of Miami, RSMAS
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 93 04:51:21 GMT

[I'm so tired of being behind, that I'm grabbing just a short
headline and mini-boxscore from the paper. I'll post more
detail later...]

Miami Heat (8-19) at Washington Bullets (9-20) on 02 Jan 93

(was)Grant, Ellison and Adams led the Washington Bullets to a 100-93 win
over Miami. (mia)Rice and Edwards led scoring for the Heat. The Bullets'
2nd win in 12 games was the Heat's 8th loss in 11 games.
   Washington outscored Miami 30-22 in Q3, pushing to a 9pt lead late in
the quarter with a 15-7 run. The Heat closed to 94-92 on rookie Harold
Miner's 19-footer with 7:57 left in Q4, but (was)Adams sank a 3fg and  an
fg to rebuild the lead.
(was)Stewart grabbed his career-high 16rbs. 

MIAMI HEAT
         fga-m fta-m pts
Rice      7 17  1  2  19,  4 3fgs, 6 rbs, 3 steals
Salley    1  4  1  2   3,  6rbs
Seikaly   4 11  5  6  13,  6rbs, 4 tos
Coles     7 14  0  0  14
Edwards   7 12  4  6  18,  6 assists
Long      6 11  0  0  12,  6rbs
Miner     3  7  1  2   7
Shaw      0  2  0  0   0
Burton    0  2  0  0   0
Askins    2  6  1  2   7
       fga-m fta-m rbs  a pf s to pts
Totals 37 86 13 20  44 15 27 5  9  93

WASHINGTON BULLETS
         fga-m fta-m pts
Grant     6 17  4  5  16
Gugliotta 6 12  2  3  14,  4 tos
Ellison   7 10  2  3  16, 17rbs
Adams     5 11  5  8  16,  9 assists
Chapman   6 12  2  4  14
Overton   3  5  2  2   8
Stewart   6 12  1  6  13
Jones     0  0  1  2   1
Smith     1  2  0  0   2
       fga-m fta-m rbs  a pf s to pts
Totals 40 81 19 33  67 23 19 4 13 100

Miami      33 22 22 16  -93
Washington 27 25 30 18 -100

--
Richard Sikorski     sikorski@oj.miami.edu
                   r.sikorski@rsmas.miami.edu
From: nates@ll.mit.edu ( Nate Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
Subject: Re: Protesting NBA Games
Date: 12 Jan 93 22:01:01 GMT
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory

In article <C0r8s7.K92@inews.Intel.COM> gbennett@frx730.intel.com (gbennett) writes:
>
>To completely hash out the concept of refs making bad calls, what about all of
>the no-calls certain players (e.g. Jordan, Ewing, Barkley, Malone, etc.) and
>teams are "rewarded".  During the last Kings/Lakers games, the Kings were down
>by 1 with 6 seconds left in the game.  Spud Webb drove into the lane and was
>obviously tripped by Sedale Threat.  The refs didn't call anything except a 
>jump ball between Sam Perkins and Lionel Simmons (which Perkins won).  This is
>yet another example of the refs looking at the uniforms and deciding whether
>or not to blow a whistle.  In others words, the refs threw out the rulebook
>and decided the Lakers would win the game just because they are the
> LOS ANGELES LAKERS.
>
>As you can see, one call (or non-call) can determine the course of a game.
>
>-Jerry

whoa - careful, jerry - you may awaken the Lor-Meeks battle again!!

:-)
- nate
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro
From: ortcm@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (thomas.mcguigan)
Subject: Re: Team Standings and Stats
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:43:07 GMT

In article <108000078@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> dougs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Doug Steele) writes:
>
>             Scoring     (min  16 games)
>        Player             Team    AVG 
>      scott,dennis          Orl   24.7
>
>               Three Pointers                      3 Point PCT (min 33 atts)
>        Player             Team  Threes        Player             Team   Pct
>      scott,dennis          Orl     64       scott,dennis          Orl  0.474

I think something is wrong with the way ppg is being calculated.  Through 25
games Dennis Scott's totals are:

fg:  184-414  0.444
3p:   64-135  0.474 (I guess Dennis shoulsd just stick to 3's)
ft:   58-69

ppg: 19.6 (oh, how I wish he were scoring 24.7)

Tom@Orlando
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.pro