HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: spencer@panix.com (David Spencer)
Subject: Re: protest question (rule 32
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 12:45:04 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

ben@hpcvra.cv.hp.com (Benjamin Ellsworth) writes:

>> (Going full speed forward without course alteration can be a perfectly
>> reasonable action to avoid a collision). 

>In fact it is REQUIRED.  The privileged vessel is primarily responsible
>to maintain course and speed so that the burdened vessel can avoid
>her.

The most famous ship collision of recent times is generally felt (the
case was settled without final determination) to have been caused by
evasive maneuvers.

_Stockholm_ was (probably) yawing slightly off course on the edge of a
fogbank, outside of the normal shipping lane. _Andrea Doria_
(apparantly misjudging _Stockholm's_ course, and apparantly ordering
port instead of starboard in the heat of the momoment) turned hard
over in an attempt to pass rail to rail. T-bone. If she'd held her
course, she probably wouldn't have been hurt.

On the other hand, let me repeat myself: It's just _dumb_ ever to hit
another boat. Period. It's like the old car-safety ad: "He was right.
Dead right." Even if nothing else happens, you're giving away all that
momentum you've worked so hard to build up.

[I was reading about the _Andrea Doria_ just this weekend; a friend of
mine (an experienced professional diver) was killed diving the wreck
last month.]

dhs    spencer@panix.com
"Upon reading Goethe, I am always struck by the paralyzing
 suspicion that he is trying to be funny" - Waugh
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: ecf_stbo@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu (Desert Stork: Delivers election in swaddling clothes...)
Subject: Re: net gathering?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords: party, raft, chesapeake
Organization: The Johns Hopkins University - HCF
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 15:31:00 GMT

In article <120@cherise.UUCP>, bobp@sandr.com (Robert Parkinson) writes...
>What do you think? Are enough of us from the Chesapeake to
>make this worthwhile? I'll show up.

I might be able to make it some saturday or sunday. Where? General middle river
area is best for me...

Tom O'Toole - ecf_stbo@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu - JHUVMS system programmer 
Homewood Computing Facilities, Johns Hopkins University, Balto. Md. 21218 
> * OLX 2.1 * ease!Trim!eeeaaaassse!trimtrimTRIMeeeeeeeaaaaaasse!trimea
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: bdaniels@psychnet.psychol.utas.edu.au (Brett Daniels)
Subject: Hobie 14 Turbo
Keywords: Hobie
Organization: Psychology Department, University of Tasmania
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 06:18:55 GMT

I am interested in buying a small off the beach cat (no centreboards), 
preferably with a jib and trapeze setup while also being relatively easy to 
sail single-handed.  Today I had a look at a Hobie 14 turbo, apparently 
about 8 years old.  I would welcome anyone's opinion on this boat.  Are they 
good performers for their length, n.b. I am writing from Australia and 
logical alternatves to this boat seem to perhaps be a Maricat 4.3 or a 
Windrush.  Are their any particular problems I should pay particular 
attention to in this model and age of boat.
	If anyone has an idea what one of these would be worth in Australia 
I would be most appreciative.  The particular example I saw was in very good 
condition, although the sails looked a bit tired and apparently the hulls 
were completely watertight.

Any relevant Information much appreciated,

Brett Daniels.
___________________________________________________________________________________
Brett Daniels                  |     "The blackberry jam tastes like fish"
Department of Psychology       |
University of Tasmania         |                  possibly a Marx brother
_______________________________|__________________________________________________
From: John Werner <werner@soe.berkeley.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: protest question (rule 32)
Date: 17 Aug 1992 18:42:35 GMT
Organization: UC Berkeley School of Education
Distribution: world
     <1992Aug17.153947.6825@phri.nyu.edu> <26100022@hpcvra.cv.hp.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tol7mac19.soe.berkeley.edu
X-UserAgent: Nuntius v1.1



In article <26100022@hpcvra.cv.hp.com> Benjamin Ellsworth,
ben@hpcvra.cv.hp.com writes:
>> (Going full speed forward without course alteration can be a
perfectly
>> reasonable action to avoid a collision). 
>
>In fact it is REQUIRED.  The privileged vessel is primarily
responsible
>to maintain course and speed so that the burdened vessel can avoid
>her.  In crossing and overtaking situations, any other actions are
>bound to cause problems....

I don't think this is always true.  If it is obvious that a
collision is imminent, the privileged vessel sometimes can and
should maneuver to avoid it.

An example: Last summer, I was crewing on Planxty (hi Dennis) in the
Lake Michigan PHRF championships.  We were on starboard, and a boat
on port was trying to cross us.  It was pretty obvious (to us
anyway) that they weren't going to make it.  Our jib trimmer, who
was down to leeward, kept yelling "starboard", and the other skipper
kept yelling "hold your course."  Finally the port boat's bow
crossed ours, but there half a boatlength or less separating us. 
Our skipper dumped the main and yanked on the tiller, and we just
missed the other boat's stern.  If we'd kept going, we would have
t-boned him.  Instead, we protested and got him DSQed.

In a situation like this, I think the starboard boat is required to
try to avoid the collision.  And even if it weren't required by the
rules, I think it's crazy to hit another boat just to prove a point.

--
John Werner                         werner@soe.berkeley.edu
UC Berkeley School of Education     510-642-9651
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: petere@tesla.mitre.org (Peter D. Engels)
Subject: Re: marine heads - advice/recommendations wanted
Followup-To: rec.boats
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 16:17:35 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.204025.15182@cs.brown.edu>, jfh@cs.brown.edu (John F.
Hughes) wrote:
> 
> In article <zz!nh=n.greg@netcom.com> greg@netcom.com (Greg Bullough) writes:
> >In article <914@seahcx.UUCP> kenh@seahcx.UUCP (Ken Hughes) writes:
> >
> >Yes. Rip the bugger out and replace it with a Raritan PHII (manual)
> >head. No, don't you go near those attractive little compact models,
> >unless you have a space crunch. And the W-C head with the plunger
> >will pee water all over your fingers after about a year (yuck).
> 
> What Greg says about the Wilcox-Crittenden head is partly true---there's a
> packing gland at the top of the pump (through which the pump shaft rides), and
> the packing nut needs to be tightened periodically, and then (eventually) the
> packing needs to be replaced. It costs about $3, I think. My new one's been in
> there 18 months with no sign of leaks, and I haven't even had to tighten it
> yet. Perhaps this is in part because I make a policy of pumping some "sea lube"
> through the head after each weekend of use. SeaLube is a commercial product
> that claims to be good to all the rubber parts of the head. So far, I've been
> utterly happy---the pump works smoothly and effectively. 
> 
> By the way---installing a new packing is simple and clean---it happens entirely
> on the "clean water" side of the head, in case you're squeamish. So don't be
> *quite* so afraid of the W/C models, particularly if you can get a used one
> cheap. 
> 
> -John

I second John's comments.  Have owned a sailboat that's had the same W-C
head (the model is called "Skipper") in it for 18 years, and it was in the
boat when I bought it.  It will swallow anything that dissolves in salt
water.  Only maintenance is the pump handle packing, and occasional
replacement of the leather washers at the bottom of the pump - this is
needed about every five or six years, and is simple to do.  Otherwise, it
still has all the same parts it had 18 years ago, and has never failed me
once.
-Pete
From: dick@hpscit.sc.hp.com (Dick Lucas)
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 16:20:41 GMT
Subject: Re: Inboard VS. Outboard
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara, CA
Newsgroups: rec.boats

One other comment in addition to Bill Walker's excellent response...
I have owned both an I/O and an Outboard, and moor this boat on a buoy.
The I/O was always submerged when moored, but the outboard tilts completely
out of the water.  No corrosion, no green stuff growing on it.

Dick Lucas
From: jamesm@lunch.austin.ibm.com (James Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Help buying daysailer.
Date: 12 Aug 92 22:57:30 GMT
Reply-To: jamesm@voyager.austin.ibm.com
Followup-To: rec.boats
Distribution: rec
Organization: IBM AWD; Austin, Texas


A friend and I are considering buying an "America 17."  This is an open
cockpit, fiberglass, sealed hull (i.e., "full floatation?") *winged* fixed
keel daysailer with a 23' mast.  The 400 lb. keel drops 3' to 3 1/2' below the
hull, and has swept back wings projecting about 6" to the sides several inches
above the bottom of the keel.  The rudder drops nearly as far as the keel.
The current owner, the only person I've been able to find who has heard of
this make of boat, says its hull and keel are based on a patented design used
by the Australians in their America Cup victory several years back (hence the
name "America 17").  It is a fast *looking* boat, but a local sailmaker and
racing guru avers that the winged keel will do little more than provide drag
when the boat heels more than 8 degrees, and that it would probably be classed
with longer (and thus faster) 20' fin-keeled boats.

We're thinking of buying the boat primarily for the beer circuit (i.e.,
noncompetitive toodling around the local lakes), but might like to try racing
it in the future.  It's about seven years old (3 years as a salesman's demo
model + 4 years of extremely light use), a bit grungy on the top, but very
clean on the bottom (very, very few dings, scratches, etc.) and the nylon
sails look at worst a bit wrinkly.  The galvanized trailer looks pretty good,
too.

So here are the questions: 

    1) Has anyone ever heard of this kind of boat?

    2) Is our sailmaker correct -- it'll never be a racer?

    3) Does $3000 sound fair for this boat and trailer?

Please respond via e-mail (jamesm@voyager.austin.ibm.com) if you're shy about
publicly airing your opinions on this boat.
--

_________________________________________________________________

  James Miller -- developing Unix software at (!) IBM -- Austin
_________________________________________________________________

  Internet:  jamesm@voyager.austin.ibm.com
  ibm?net:   jamesm@lunch.austin.ibm.com
  VNET:      JAMESM at AUSVMQ
  yaknet:    512 838-1608
  UPSnet:    11400 Burnet Rd., IMAD 9541; Austin, Texas 78758
_________________________________________________________________
From: michiel@mfie.atr.bso.nl (Michiel Fierst van Wijnandsbergen)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Mayday's and Channel 16 use (was Re: snow goose)
Date: 23 Aug 92 10:30:00 GMT
Organization: Me? Organized?
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

lls@kings.demon.co.uk (Lady Lodge Systems) writes:
: In article <1992Aug14.163151.19206@tcom.stc.co.uk> bruce@tcom.stc.co.uk (Bruce Munro) writes:
: >
: >Does the US not have a PANPAN call for emergencies that are not immediately
: >life threatening. My understanding is that MAYDAY should only be used
: >in cases of injury or where the boat is in immediate danger.
: 
: #ifdef LITTLE_NIT_PICK
: In case of injury (that is not immediately life threatening) shouldn't one
: send a PANPAN MEDICO?? 
: #endif
: 
: I was taught that MAYDAY, PANPAN and all the other terms were covered by
: 'international' agreement.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Correct. Here it is:
	DISTRESS means the vessel is in grave and imminent danger.
	Only the master or person in charge can authorise a distress
	call. The call is "Mayday Mayday Mayday".

	URGENCY situations where the vessel is not in imminent danger
	but urgent help needed, such as man overboard or engine failure
	near a hazard. For urgent medical advice add "medico" or
	"radiomedical". The call is "PanPan PanPan PanPan".

	SAFETY. These messages relate to navigational safety and may
	be transmitted by the C.R.S., or any vessel possibly on a
	frequency other than safety and calling. The call is
	"Securitay Securitay Securitay", followed by the address
	and calling station three times.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michiel Fierst van Wijnandsbergen          email:         mifi@atr.bso.nl
email: michiel@mfie.hobby.nl               email: michiel@mfie.atr.bso.nl
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: ennisj@tt.com (Jay Ennis)
Subject: Re: Flares (was: Re: snow goose)
Organization: Telecommunications Techniques Corporation, Germantown MD
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 14:19:42 GMT

In article <26100020@hpcvra.cv.hp.com> ben@hpcvra.cv.hp.com (Benjamin Ellsworth) writes:
>
>>	What does one do with old, outdated, flares?  Is there a safe way
>> to dispose of them?
>
>One waits until the 4th of July and considers them expensive fireworks
>:-).  Not the safest, but the most common answer in my experience.
>

I don't advise celebrating your 4th of July this way on the water when the
Coast Guard is around.  I was in an anchorage near Annapolis for the
celebration last year when five or ten boats got into this.  Not only did
the falling meteors (still burning) come frightfully close to boats, but
the CG boats arrived soon afterwards searching for culprits.
-- 
Jay Ennis 
ennisj@fb.tt.com                 "The sea is your wife, your ship your mistress,
                                  and the land a treacherous whore"
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: jfh@cs.brown.edu (John F. Hughes)
Subject: Re: protests or using the rules
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 16:18:59 GMT

In article <STEPH.92Aug21110148@candide.uchicago.edu> steph@cs.uchicago.edu (Stephen Wilson Bailey) writes:
>   >You have got to be kidding.  This would turn sailboat racing into drag
>   >racing.  You might as well take up powerboat racing.  The fact that
>   >sailboat racing is a _tactical_ sport is one of the main attractions for
>   >me.
>
>Many people who have never raced handicapped think this.
>
>Sailing is also a strategic sport.  There are current and winds and
>seas to consider.  I race handicap, sometimes with huge gulfs between
>us and the next slowest boat, and I enjoy it greatly.

Ok, having jumped in on one sid eof the fray, let me get into the other. 
There's a problem with racing handicapped, too, of course, and it has to do
with the rules. Not the *racing* rules, but the *rating* rules. The people
who want to race the rules in Handicap Racing have to do it by buying a new
rule-beater boat. Those who want to do it in one-design racing may have to
buy themselves or someone else a new boat after a collision. Whatever
rule you race under, there'll always be a rule-stretcher somewhere who
considers winning more important than fair play. And Handicap racing has, over
the years, led to some of the most hideously ugly boats ever built. I won't
even get into seaworthiness...

  Still---I think that I've seen Airwaves (isn't that the boat you're on,
Stepen?) and she's quite snazzy. So I am not implying that *all* boats
bult for handicap racing are ugly. I wouldn't make a statement like that
without an asbestos suit. 

-John
From: paulh@tekcae.cax.tek.com (Paul Hammer)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: protest question (rule 32
Date: 17 Aug 92 21:29:52 GMT
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

>- why was the port tack boat not required to keep an appropriate lookout also?

It is.  But it was already clear that the port tack boat had faulted.
The point of the startboard tack boat failing to keep a lookout
was to show that starboard tack boat was not completely free of fault.

-rcf
From: legacy@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (wayne.m.simpson)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Lady Anna
Summary: Here's an idea
Keywords: gone
Date: 17 Aug 92 20:02:22 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

In article <1992Aug17.153757.5684@cbfsb.cb.att.com> heon@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (garry.j.heon) writes:
>Does anyone have any details of the sinking of Lady Anna this
>past Thursday, 3:00 am off Cape May.  All I heard is that the captain
>woke the owner and guests telling them the boat was taking on water.
>Five minutes later the boat was gone.  For those who do not know 
>Lady Anna, she's a 120' aluminum sport fisherman.  Supposedly the 
>largest in the world.  
>The boat was kept a few blocks from my house and I've seen her many
>times.  Reports claim she was taking waves over the stern before
>she went down.  From the looks of her the only way water could
>enter the boat would be through the door to the engine room, if
>it were left open.  Anyone have any ideas how she went down?

   From what I've heard from others and read in an article in the Asbury
Park Press, Mr Hovnanian (the owner, and the person who owns what portion
of New Jersey Donald Trump doesn't) took Lady Anna from the yard of her
Florida builder in the middle of the night while still owing about .5 meg
of her 5 meg building cost. That was just a few months ago. The rest of the
fitting out was done elsewhere.
   Could sabotage be a possibility? You be the judge.

Wayne Simpson    (no fancy .sig this time)
From: dsmith@hplabsz.hpl.hp.com (David R. Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Flares (was: Re: snow goose)
Date: 12 Aug 92 20:36:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: hplabsz.1992Aug12.203646.18931
Distribution: usa
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Laboratories Palo Alto,CA

In article <1992Aug12.185155.26535@progress.com> gerard@progress.COM (Gerard Bras) writes:
>>	What does one do with old, outdated, flares?  Is there a safe way
>>to dispose of them?
>
>I've got a bunch of flares, some of which could have been Noah's.
> On a hunch I called my town's fire department.  They referred me
> to the state fire marshals office.  They said  something to the
> effect of "Huh?  I dunno.  Maybe call back in the morning and ask
> for the explosives man.".  I've got a feeling this will go nowhere.
> Maybe the best thing is to dispose of them all next July 4th.  Sure
> beats having them in the attic or basement.
>
>Any better ideas out there?

The instructions that came with my flares said to soak them in a bucket of
water.  The Coast Guard Auxiliary course suggests keeping old ones around
to supplement the new ones.

-- 
David R. Smith, HP Labs | Quality is like buying oats.  If you want only top
dsmith@hpl.hp.com       | quality oats, you must pay a fair price.  However, if
(415) 857-7898          | you can be satisfied with oats that have already been
                        | through the horse once, that comes more cheaply.
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: kevin@turbo.Columbia.NCR.COM (Kevin Ormerod)
Subject: Re: Flares (was: Re: snow goose)
Organization: NCR Corp, E&M-Columbia, Columbia, SC
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 18:15:31 GMT

>So, my questions are:
>
>  1) Is a 5-year out-of-date flare likely to be unstable?

	No.

>  2) Would one expect a flare gun to go off simply by closing it quickly?

	Yes.

I was in the USCGAUX, taught safe boating classes, and participated
in flare drills while in training.  We always recommended that boaters
save their old flares if they were of the 12 ga. or 25 mm variety.
If you ever REALLY need flares, you'll wish you had a whole case
of them and not just the legal minimum.

The only flares that we ever had problems with (ignition problems)
were the Skyblazer brand -- the self contained type that are ignited
by pulling a chain.  I have been told that they solved their
problems but ...

As far as the plastic gun is concerned (and it is classified as a
handgun in some states) they are very inexpensive -- note, out of
kindness to the mfgrs. I didn't say cheap.  Close the gun slowly with
it pointed away from you, cock it, hold it above your head and fire
while looking down (we don't want plastic in our eyes if the barrel
shatters)

It is not legal for civilians to test fire using red flares -- thats
what the white ones are for.  I didn't say this, but if you must
test using a red flare, fire it down into the water -- remember, I
didn't say this.


Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: ss@tamarack16.cray.com (Sandra Swanson)
Subject: Re: radio licenses (was Re: snow goose)
Originator: ss@tamarack16
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 21 Aug 92 13:18:09 CDT


In article <1992Aug21.185538.3750@news.clarkson.edu>, billp@voyager.chm.clarkson.edu (Bill Plunkett) writes:
> From article <1992Aug20.153251.27144@mksol.dseg.ti.com>, by pyron@skndiv.dseg.ti.com (Dillon Pyron):
> > 
> > In article <1992Aug19.165745.10475@ichips.intel.com>, jreece@sousa.intel.com (John Reece) writes:
> >>
> >>In the US the VHF operator doesn't need a license, but the boat
> >>needs a station license.  It's around $35.
> > 
> > You are required to have a "Limited Radiotelephone Operator's Permit".  Fill
> 
> Guess it's my day to be a compulsive nit-picker.  It's called a
> "Restricted Radiotelephone Operators license" and is issued for free
> and with no examination for just this purpose - incidental operation
> of a licensed station (such as aircraft or boat).  It is not required
> of anyone having higher privileges (1st, 2nd or 3rd class
> radiotelephone license).  It never expires, BTW (whereas the higher
> certificates do).  And, as Mr. Reece says, you also need a station
> license for your vessel.
> 



According to the current (1992) issue of Chapman's, a "Restricted 
Radiotelephone Operators license" is not required for operating a
VHF on a VOLUNTARILY EQUIPPED pleasure vessel operating within the
territorial waters of the U.S.

If the vessel is used commercially, then a 3rd class FCC license is
required.

At least that's what Chapman sez!



<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Sandra Swanson   -   Software Publications
Cray Research, Inc. - ss@tamarack.cray.com
655F Lone Oak Drive
Eagan, MN     55121     -     612/683-5815
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Frapped again
From: smittie@beach.csulb.edu (Smittie)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 21:18:28 GMT
Organization: Cal State Long Beach

When I was a Seaman in the Navy I was assigned to Deck division. Anytime we
tied to the pier we had to frap the mooring lines. This entailed a man crawling
over the side of the ship and sliding down the mooring line wrapping them with
small stuff as he went. Needless to say it was a very unpopular job.

smittie

-- 
___________________________________________________________________________
GEnie, MCI, AOL:Smittie | If all of us were as smart as we think we are the
smittie@beach.csulb.edu |  current world problems would be yesterday's news.
________________________|___________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: psmith@dg-webo.rtp.dg.com (Peter Smith)
Subject: Re: Flares (was: Re: snow goose)
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 16:26:48 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Data General Corp., Westboro, MA

In article <1992Aug12.162125.12849@phri.nyu.edu> roy@alanine.phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith) writes:
>dudley@treefort.Corp.Sun.COM (Dudley Gaman) writes:
>...
>	What does one do with old, outdated, flares?  Is there a safe way
>to dispose of them?

Often people mix them in with fireworks on July 4.  Several times I've
seen boats anchored off shore on the 4th setting off a mix of rockets,
roman candles, and meteor & parachute flares.
---
Peter Smith -- Data General Corp., Westboro, MA
Peter_Smith@dgc.ceo.dg.com or psmith@dg-webo.webo.dg.com
#include <std_disclaimer.h>
From: John.Ball@f764.n153.z1.fido.zeta.org.au (John Ball)
Sender: UUCP@ship.wimsey.bc