From: peacock5293@iscsvax.uni.edu (Greywolf)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.furry
Subject: Delayed Iriesii Manifest Rebuttal (forwarded)
Date: 11 Dec 92 21:20:04 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

The following is forwarded from Chris Grant, from a letter received 12/11/92.

As a bit of explanation as to what this regards, some time ago (I forget when),
I posted a message regarding Chris Grant's planned "Iriesii Manifest" fanzine,
and also put it out on a "Tai-Pan" mailing list which had been set up for folks
interested in the Tai-Pan Project (a poorly-organized shared-universe project).

In response to this original posting/mailing, there was a very unfriendly
response on the list (it did not appear on alt.fan.furry to my knowledge), which
I passed along to Mr. Grant so that he could respond to the allegations therein.
Since this message includes some clarifications of the original message, I have
been asked to go ahead and pass this along to alt.fan.furry rather than just on
the mailing list.

Disclaimer:  I am not in any way any "official representative" of Chris Grant.
I'll pass along any posted replies that deal with Empires along with any other
letters I'll send to Mr. Grant, but if you wish to reply to him, it'd be just as
simple to write to him in person (the address is included near the end of the
transcript).  Any typos are mine.

--- begin message, received 12/10/92 from Chris Grant --

To: All
Re: EMPIRES fanzine project

     Greetings to all.
     It has come to my attention, through transcripts, of some rather
disparaging remarks made about me and my planned project, the Empires fanzine
tentatively titled Iriesii Manifest.  Having read the transcripts in question, I
have prepared a rebuttal that may serve to answer some of the questions brought
up by the gentleman perpetrating the comments.
     First -- I can't promise money because I am not in this to make money.
While it is true that the fiscal future of the 'zine is not solid, I have the
resources to put out at least four or five issues without a problem.  Most money
brought in by the 'zine goes to cover the costs of copies, binding and mailing.
I do not add postage to my cover costs.  There are precious few fanzines that do
pay -- I've been writing "Ace of Spades" for YARF for four years and not seen
one penny for it.  I do it because I enjoy it.
     "A chance to see stuff in print when it otherwise might not be" -- well,
what am I supposed to promise?  I'm not going to say you'll become rich, famous
and popular, because that is not something I control. I am promising nothing
more than I can keep and nothing more than I have ever gotten from the fanzines
and APAs I have been in for the past four years.  I have never missed a single
issue deadline with YARF -- over twenty issues!  I am proud of that record and
work hard to keep it.
     Would contributors get free copies?  Of course.  That, in my opinion, is
one of the unwritten rules on fanzines.  I should have mentioned it
specifically, I know, so that is my fault.  I have never heard of this "Tai-Pan"
project before, and I have no idea what it is about.  But if a fanzine is taking
contributions and not giving the contributors free issues ... that, to me, is
highly irregular.  In fact, it is the first time I have heard of such a
practice.
     "Central Empire holds the copyrights": Yes.  I shall explain.  I created
the Empires universe and nearly everything in it so far.  It is my creation,
with my copyright.  I, as the creator, have that right just as anyone else does
when they put something original on paper.  Now ... suppose a fan writes an
Empires story.  In it they introduce a new race of alien beings that fit
perfectly within the setting of the universe.  And, I like it so much I want to
incorporate this species into future stories of my own.  I will politely ask the
fan for the copyright for his or her creation.  If necessary, a price can be
negotiated.  I will always give credit to that fan for the creation in every
story I use it.  A footnote, like: "Special thanks to John Fan for the
Whatchamacallit species".  This protects the fan from having his ideas stolen
(reputations can be torpedoed quick in this crowd).  Plus, it protects me from
possible lawsuit if a contributing fan decides they don't like Empires anymore.
     For the curious, I have already an alien species into the Empires fold from
a fan who volunteered his creation without request for pay.  We agreed to term
(that the fan wrote unilaterally) and we both now have paperwork with original
signatures to validate the negotiation.  I don't want to be screwed, and in
return I don't want to screw others.  That's just plain good businessmanship.
     What if a fan doesn't want to give up the copyright of something he or she
wrote in the Empires universe?  No problem.  The fan's work remains solely his
own.  I will not use it in any of my creations -- I can't afford to be sued, and
besides -- I want this to be as friendly as possible, not a free-fire zone in
fandom.  I didn't go through all this trouble for nine years (I created Empires
when I was 16, I'll be 25 in February) just to fight and possibly lose
everything in court to some slick-haired lawyer in a leisure suit.
     It was stated in the transcripts I got -- "notice the reference to hundreds
of wannabe's knocking this guy's door down".  I looked all over my copy of the
letter I wrote and found no such reference.  What I extend is an invitation.
Invitations can be turned down.  I have no delusions of grandeur and have no
desire to paint myself up as a science-fiction messiah.  I intend to publish at
least a few issues with material I have on hand, regardless of whether or not
anyone else wishes to contribute.  Background notes, essays, developmental
sketches, character sketches, etc... the result of years of work.  None of it
ever before published.  I have been to more cons that I can recall where people
approached me and shown personal Empires stories, cartoons, pictures, etc. they
have done on their own.  I have received letters in the mail with similar
content.  It seems to me that the interest in this project is out there.  I
didn't make anyone do this stuff -- many are just strangers who liked my work in
fanzines.  I would like to get together this variety of material and publish it
in one 'zine so everyone who likes Empires can enjoy it.  Some of these people
may not even like me as a person, but they like the work I do.  Fine with me.
     "If something is good enough, it will get published."  How is this 'putting
down contributors'?!  It is something called "editorial policy".  Maybe I could
have put the words in more cushy terms, but that is what it boils down to.  Not
everything sent to a fanzine gets published.  Any fanzine editor will tell you
this.  Only the material the staff or editor feels upholds the established
standards or genre of the 'zine makes it in.  SOmetimes it is due to space
requirements.  If I don't use a contributor's work, I'll tell them why.  The
contribute can always try again, go elsewhere, or whatever.  Does it do anybody
any good to publish poor material?  No.  It cheats the readers, it cheats the
standards of the 'zine and its editor, and ultimately cheats the contributor
into thinking he's good enough to hack it without further preparation or
advancement.  No fair.  Admittedly, I could have phrased that better, so I'll
take that strike.
     "...how good the publisher's world is that strict rules must be adhered
to..."  Oh, come on ... it's called "fitting within the genre".  Would Arthur C.
Clarke's black alien Monolith from 2001 'fit' in George Lucas' "Star Wars"?  Of
course not!  The stories aren't structured for each other to cross over.  Would
"Conan" fans react well to their favourite Cimmerian carrying an AK-47 and a
lightsabre?  In the Empires universe, certain things don't exist.  I feel I have
the right to set the parameters for my own creation.  Bringing in powerful
aliens that could, for example, walk through walls and control time, would
seriously upset the structure of the universe as I created it.  Such beings
could take over effortlessly.  That is not teh kind of direction I want to take
with Empires.  If someone wants to write such a story, fine, but it wouldn't
really fit well within the realm of Empires.
     As for people not having the time to build their own worlds ... well, I
know what I am told at cons and in letters, and the overall concensus is that
many fans perceive they don't have the time to build their own settings.
They're great at creating plots and situations within other established
settings, when it pleases them.  That is why there are fans.  It is fans
following a storyline that make the story popular.  I myself am just a fan with
time on my hands and a desire to write the kind of story I always wanted to see
written.  I'm fortunate in that many other people like my story as well.  I'm
sorry if that is incomprehensible to the gentleman that fired off the comments
I'm replying to, but that's the way the ball bounces.  I have not once received
a single piece of Empires material from a fan that I have not enjoyed
enormously.  Every cartoon, story, comic, character, plotline, alien, or machine
has been delightful to receive.  Why would I put down my contributors, yet be so
eager to publish them for the world to see, affiliated with something I have
done, with my name connected to it?
     To conclude, the gentleman I am replying to states that I am implying I am
a "kick-ass writer", and that I promise to "make you a star".  I never said any
such thing, nor did I intend to imply such.  The facts are that I created a
story that other people like.  Some of these people reciprocated their fondness
for the story by producing original material based on that creation.  And now I
want to collect this material together and publish so that all the people who
like the story can share it.  What's so wrong with that?  Maybe this gentleman
has time to create worlds himself -- does that mean everyone can?   Nor am I
trying to imply that my use of a fan's creation is suppsoed to be some sort of
Blessing From God.  I'm just saying that it may happen, because it has happened
six times already with other characters currently in Empires.  I'm trying to
give people as much information as possible, not sound like I am delivering the
Commandments or something.
     And "why am I not being paid by some big published already, if I'm so
good"?  Well ... I never said I was so good, and if I am, everyone needs to
start from somewhere.  Ironically, while I stand accused by my attacker as being
arrogant and insulting, I personally find it insulting that he referred to
Empires fans, readers and contributors as "wanna-bes" and talked as if only he
knew the True Light of Literacy.  It is dismaying that he chose to attack rather
than simply ask me, through Jordan, what I meant in my initial letter.  It is
unfortunate that this "Tai-Pan" project, whatever it is, left such a bad taste
in his mouth that he feels he must spoil everyone else's fun .. but he might
wish to bear in mind that such reactions to people he has never met befor eis
not a wise policy if he intends to get very far with anyone as a working
partner.
     If anyone would like to write to me for a copy of this letter ... please do
so at
          1704 Malad Circle   Boise, Idaho (USA)  83705
     I'll give it an original signature as a gesture of sincerity and answer any
other questions you may have for me regarding Empires projects.
                                                  Cordially,
                                                  Chris F. Grant

--- end of message ---

Additional note from Jordan:  The use of the word "wannabe" is largely my fault,
as early on when writing to the Tai-Pan Project, I had referred to myself and a
couple of other folks on the 'net who were interested as "Tai-Pan Wannabes"
indirectly by dubbing my makeshift mailing list the "Tai-Pan Project Wannabe
Distribution List".  The term sort of stuck, since I didn't really see a
particularly negative connotation in the term -- If anything, I was trying to be
slightly humorous.  Anyway, so gathered that the use of the term "wannabe" in
this case (it's been so long since the original message was sent) was probably a
reference to that.

 
-- 
-Jordan            ..      PEACOCK5293@iscsvax.uni.edu
                  .OO.     Jordan Peacock (Jordan Greywolf)
                  O/\O     (New Address):  1610 Parker
                   --                      Cedar Falls, IA  50613