HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: woodruff@s34.es.llnl.gov (John Woodruff 422-4661)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Car topping small boats?
Date: 28 Jul 92 19:19:41 GMT
Organization: Lawrence Livermore National Lab
In-reply-to: EPLUS17@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu's message of 27 Jul 92 19:58:05 GMT

>>>>> On 27 Jul 92 19:58:05 GMT, EPLUS17@vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (Richard Engelbrecht-Wiggans) said:

 Richard> I would like something small enough to car top on a mini-van. 
 Richard> I think that with the help of a
 Richard> simple ramp, I can handle anything that the roof can....

A few years (well, 20) ago, some folks in the local FJ fleet car topped
using a tactic that I think is worth passing on:

Lash the boat to an aluminum ladder that has dolly wheels at one end.
Build a fitting at the aft end of the cartop which will clamp to one end of
the ladder, and will pivot about a vertical axis.

Now to load, just lift one end of the ladder (with boat) up to the clamp
while the other (probably the bow) rolls on the ground.  With the ladder
clamped into the fitting, walk the other end in an arc to the front of
the car, and secure the whole thing.

You never have to lift more than half the boat weight, and the load is
always in control. Looked like a piece of cake to me when my friends did
it!

Enjoy
--
John Woodruff   (woodruff1@llnl.gov)   510-422-4661
Employed by, but not representing the policys of
Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: walter@watson.ibm.com (Walter Wilson)
Subject: 30' O'Day 1978 info wanted
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:36:02 GMT
Distribution: usa
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

 am looking for a sailboat around 30' in the NY area.
(any leads appreciated!). Money is an object (ie closer
to $10,000 than $20,000)

We want it for weekend sailing and short cruises with
a family of 2 adults and 2 kids (10 & 15) and maybe
an occasional college student back home.

One candidate I've found is a 30' O'Day 1978 (15 years old)
with excellent maintenance; the current owner wants to move
up in size (don't we all? :-) )
It has a keel-centerboard, the original Yanmar diesel 
(1 cylinder?).
The rigging is original layout, so I would probably re-rig
(someday) to reef jib and main and adjust jib car from the cockpit...

This one gave us that "feels right"  feeling, so I'm trying
hard to be objective. I would buy on the spot for $10,000, but
the owner is asking $22,500... What can anyone tell me about
the boat, the keel-centerboard, or the price? 

-- 

  Walter G. Wilson  (walter@watson.ibm.com)
  The opinions expressed here are my own.

  "My plans for the year all laid out...
   Ah... A dream in Springtime "
     -- Shodo (Go Seigen)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Saturday, 25 Jul 1992 12:16:34 CDT
From: Dennis Bartley <U13792@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Crew
Distribution: na

In article <1992Jul25.044816.26362@muddcs.claremont.edu>,
mhaines@jarthur.claremont.edu (Matthew Haines) says:
>
>In general, are people willing to crew on boats in races
>in conditions that would require a lot of time
>(either weekend after weekend, or long distance races)
>in short supply or a surplus item?
>
>I ask because I go to schoool in the LA area and am
>interested in crewing, but don't know how to go about getting in to it.
>
>I seem to have the usual"can't get any experience
>because I don't have any experience" problem.
>
>--Matthew
>

I tend to find that reliable crew that are able to commit to
every race are hard to find. Experience isn't quite as important...
the most experienced foredeck who doesn't show up for a race isn't
much use to me.

I don't know what the season is like out in LA. In the midwest,
we start training in mid April or so. By the middle of the summer,
our crew is pretty set. We do race on Wednesday evenings, and that
would be a good place for new crew to get experience.

Our fleet happens to have a crew pool. Call up and leave name and phone
number, and skippers looking for crew can find you. Another technique
is to go down to a yacht club for a 'beer can' race and try to hitch
a ride. Somebody will be short.

Good luck.
From: U13792@uicvm.uic.edu (Dennis Bartley)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: problems with steering (sailboat)
Date: 27 Jul 92 23:34:19 GMT
Article-I.D.: uicvm.92209.183419U13792
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago

In article <1992Jul27.174614.27885@eskimo.celestial.com>,
plank@eskimo.celestial.com (David Walker) says:
>
> I have a problem steering my sailboat while sailing at 45 degrees to
>the wind. The boat always trys to point away from the wind. Most of the
>time I have to push the tiller about 3/4 of the way over just to
>maintain a straight course.
> I might mention the boat is 15'long 4' beam. I built it strictly to the
>plans. It is rigged with a 59sq.ft. sprite sail.
> Any sugestions on how to correct this problem are welcome.

The problem is that the center of effort of the sailplan is in front of
the "center of lateral resistance" (the point around which the boat turns).
This is a feature most people would prefer not to have... if you let go of the
tiller, you'de want the boat to head up into the wind and stop, rather than
away from the wind onto a run.

I don't know what a "sprite" sail is. Some of the usual causes on reasonably
designed boats are the main isn't trimmed well, the centerboard may not
be in it's proper place? or perhaps the mast is raked too far forward.

If the design is at fault, you may be stuck having to put up with this
behavior, or try some modifications. Moving the sailplan aft moves the CE
aft. Moving the centerboard or keel forward moves CLR forward.
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: plank@eskimo.celestial.com (David Walker)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: problems with steering (sailboat)
Keywords: steering
Date: 27 Jul 92 17:46:14 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: -> ESKIMO NORTH (206) For-Ever <-


 I have a problem steering my sailboat while sailing at 45 degrees to
the wind. The boat always trys to point away from the wind. Most of the
time I have to push the tiller about 3/4 of the way over just to
maintain a straight course.
 I might mention the boat is 15'long 4' beam. I built it strictly to the
plans. It is rigged with a 59sq.ft. sprite sail.
 Any sugestions on how to correct this problem are welcome.
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: spencer@panix.com (David Spencer)
Subject: Re: Looking for (not expensive) Wrist-Watch for Sailing
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 20:11:45 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

In <2670105@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM> bsmith@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Brian Smith) writes:

>In rec.boats, kvk@questor.sw.stratus.com (Ken Koellner) writes:

>    Since I end up breaking the band of my Seiko every few months, I
>    thought it would be a good idea to buy a cheap watch so I don't loose
>    my better watch sailing.

>I won't try to advise you on what watch to buy because I'm too much
>out of touch now.  However, I suggest that when you do buy one, if it
>has a two-part band, replace the band with a single one.

>After losing a relatively expensive watch that caught on the rigging,
>I went to K-Mart and bought a <$20 Casio.  I also bought a single band
>and had the assistant swop the bands for me.  Next I tried to buy some

Then take some electrical tape and do a figure 8: across the bottom of
the face, cross over on the back, across the top, cross over the back.
I broke the pin seating on my $9 Casio (where _do_ you boys buy
watches that you get clipped like this?) at the Newport regatta (third
strap in 5 years) and taped the watch onto the band. Tastes great,
less filling, and the black tape is such a nice fashion statement. I
know, duct tape is more appropriate, but black looked so much nicer.

It's a minor parlor game at Sonar regattas to figure out who paid the
least for his Casio. I's great to have 50 boats come up on the line
and 200 watches simultaneously going beebeebeebeep beebeebeebeep ....

dhs    spencer@panix.com
Sonar 404
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: ecf_stbo@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu (Maurice: The Pompatis of love)
Subject: Re: Anybody know anything about Evelyn boats???
Followup-To: rec.boats
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: The Johns Hopkins University - HCF
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 14:51:00 GMT

In article <msolomon-210792074204@mac61177.mitre.org.>, msolomon@mitre.org (Moise Solomon) writes...
>I would think that 159 is
>somewhat slow for an Evelyn 32.  My feeling is that the lower 150 range
>would be a more realistic rating, but I don't know.  The boat may not be
>well sailed.

Are we really talking about an Evelyn 32 here? The Evelyn 32 that races
in my club is an ultralight, I think. It rates in the 90's, or at most
102. It's in the A fleet (A = < 118 in CBYRA this year).

Tom O'Toole - ecf_stbo@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu - JHUVMS system programmer 
Homewood Computing Facilities, Johns Hopkins University, Balto. Md. 21218 
> * OLX 2.1 * ease!Trim!eeeaaaassse!trimtrimTRIMeeeeeeeaaaaaasse!trimea
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: jfh@cs.brown.edu (John F. Hughes)
Subject: Re: Varnish/Stain Suggestions For Aged Wood Deck
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 10:28:43 GMT

In article <l6mkl7INN9g3@cronkite> billc@sextant.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>In article l6k4b1INN2pb@spim.mips.com, toddster@mips.com (Todd Rodericks) writes:
>>I am looking for suggestions/inputs on durable stain and varnish 
>>products. ...
>
>Here is a controversial topic.  I would first say that
>assuming you can rescue the damaged areas, that the most
>durable finish for bright wood is the same one used for
>sails:  Yachtcrylic.  The enemy is the sun, and blocking it
>with fabric does more good than anything else.
>
>finish to not only stay on, but to also come off.  (You're
>about to find out about removing finishes.)  Varnish comes
>off pretty easily with heat and a scraper. [...]
>Among varnishes, I have tried and been disappointed with
>Interlux Schooner (recommended in the strange and popular
>"Brightwork" book by Rebecca Wittman).  Seems to last just
>three or four months in California sunshine, doesn't seem to 
>hold up well under feet and moving lines.  

I agree that a fabric cover is the way to go if you want to
protect your brightwork. For a runabout, I'd spend my first
$$$ getting a cover made, at least for the top of the boat. The sides
are likely to suffer less, not being in direct sunlight as much.

I've used schooner too. I like it, because of ease of application,
but Bill is right---it comes off easy. My taffrail, (one of many items 
that went home with me this winter and got 5 or 6 good coats
of Schooner is already showing through (sigh). And one or two parts
of the cockpit coaming, where lines like the jib furling line tend to hang
over, are showing wear too. I'm not talking about pulling the line
while it's draped over the edge,m either--it just rests there!

Anyhow, I'll probably shift varnishes for next year. Two bits of advice:
(1) Get Rebecca Wittman's book Brightwork--it reall y is worth reading.
(2) For now, at least, avoid water-based polyurethane, until you have
tried the following experiment: paint a scrap with several coats. Set it
outside for 2 months. Now try to remove the stuff and refinish. Compare
to a piece of varnished wood treated similarly. The 2 month delay I'm
suggesting shouldn't be a problem: it'll take you that long to prepare
the wood on your boat anyhow, and the prep is the same for either 
varnish or poly.  Sigh.

-John



s

















Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: zpope@osf.org (William Pope)
Subject: Re: Why multis aren't real or can I find a real Cat
Reply-To: zpope@osf.org
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: 24 Jul 92 14:01:18

In article <1682E8D2C.STU@mwvm.mitre.org> STU@mwvm.mitre.org writes:


>From: STU@mwvm.mitre.org
>Subject: Re: Why multis aren't real or can I find a real Cat
>Message-ID: <1682E8D2C.STU@mwvm.mitre.org>
>Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 14:02:11 GMT
>
>I've sailed a 36' Pearson for several years - and other similar boats before
>her - and have owned (or been owned by) a 16' Hobie for about as long.
> 
>For relaxing, long weekends or trips, I like the Pearson (maybe love her).
> 
>But, for the real joy of sailing, you can't beat a multi.  The cat outpoints,
>out reaches and out goes the bigger boat in all but the very lightest down
>winds.
> 
>Now, the question:  Can I get this kind of performance on a live aboard cat?
> 
>I've chartered a Prout for 2 weeks after reading a bit - and she was a pig.
>Ran very well, but just wouldn't point at all - not even 179 degree tacks!
> 
>I'm about to charter a Privilege 39 - and folks tell me she is better - but
>is she as good as a Hobie?
> 
>Is there some fundimental rule that prohibits making a big cat perform like
>a small cat?

Length to displacement, sail area to displacement, and too much
displacement.  Take a look at the Edel Cat 35 and Iroquois Mk II for counter
examples.  The Privileges look a little bit too beefy IMO.  What I really
would like to see is a Lagoon 42 with high lift dagger boards.  Of course
the boards would have to be some kind of unobtainium to keep a reasonable
chord for the loads.

Currently sailing a J-30 and a Stiletto 23, fast is a relative thing.

=bill
--
============================================================================
William Z. Pope                                     Phone: +1 (617) 621-8889 
Open Software Foundation                              Fax: +1 (617) 621-0584
11 Cambridge Center                                     Email: zpope@osf.org
Cambridge, MA  02142                             OSF DME Integration Project



Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: roy@alanine.phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith)
Subject: O'Day-30's
Organization: Public Health Research Institute (New York)
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 01:34:00 GMT

larry@pdn.paradyne.com (Larry Swift) writes:
> I'm sure to offend some O'Day owners for which I apologize ahead of time,
> but you asked....  Years ago I looked at an O'Day at the boat show and
> decided I wouldn't sail one across the bay, let alone coastal cruising or
> blue water.

	Having just finished the ALIR (Around Long Island Race) in an
O'Day-30, I guess I should toss my experiences in here.  Over the course of
the first 24 hours, during which we were beating into 15-20 kt winds and 6
foot seas, we managed to do a pretty good job trashing the interior of the
boat.  Somebody (the owner, I think) fell against the door to the head and
tore it off its hinges.  Somebody else, wedging themselves against the main
salon table managed to tear the table top off its mountings.  Yeah, the
weather was rough, but it wasn't extreme; I consider somebody tearing the
table top off by using it to support themselves in a heeling boat to be an
indication that the table top was inadequately secured.  Ditto for the head
door coming off its hinges just because somebody slammed into it.

	The head also consistantly overflowed whenever we were on starboard
tack requiring us to close the sea cock whenever the head wasn't in use.
This doesn't sound so bad until you realize the outflush seacock is burried
under a berth cushion in the main salon.  Not only is it a royal pain to
get to (especially if somebody is sleeping on the berth), but I don't even
want to think about how much plumbing is involved to get from the bottom of
the bowl on the starboard side of the boat to the seacock under the port
berth in the main salon.

	We managed to finish something like 11th out of 12 boats in our
division, which isn't anything to shout about but at least we finished.
Out of something like 105 boats, about 20 didn't start and 20 dropped out.
One boat (C-Jakk, a Newport-41 from our club) was dismasted in what really
sounds like a freak accident; the leeward upper shroud slid off the end of
the upper spreader tip and when they tacked, the mast broke at the top
spreader.  Most of what I know about the indicent comes from talking with
the owner, and 2nd hand reports from other people on the boat.  They
managed to sail downwind 7 hours with the broken rig to get to a safe
harbor.  At the time of the incident, they were several tens of miles
offshore, and were limited by draft as to which inlets they could get into.
It also happend in the middle of the night and they didn't want to start
the motor until they could do a visual inspection to make sure nothing was
fouling the prop.
-- 
roy@wombat.phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith)
Public Health Research Institute
455 First Avenue, New York, NY 10016, USA
"This never happened to Bart Simpson."
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: whoward@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu (Will Howard)
Subject: Re: rules question
Organization: Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 14:00:06 GMT

In article <712114816.F00001@ship.wimsey.bc>
Laughlin.Hughes@f764.n153.z1.fido.zeta.org.au (Laughlin Hughes) writes:
>This message was from JOHN BALL to ALL,
>originally in conference Sail__Fido
>and was forwarded to you by LAUGHLIN HUGHES.
>                    -------------------------
>I sat on a protest hearing last night. Here is a description of the
>incident.
>The first leg was a beat, with buoys to port. The start line was between
>a mark and the mast of the committee boat. No distance mark was set off
>the committee boat. There were three starts in sequence for three
>separate divisions. The incident involved the first start. The line was
>quite conventional, with the committee boat on the correct side of the
>mark. The wind was very light. There was a small adverse current.
>
>A boat in the first division crept over the start line on stbd tack,
>starting correctly, and completely cleared the start line. The boat then
>tacked onto port. The boat then was pushed by the current back over the
>start line. The boat bore off a bit to accelerate, and sailed behind
>the committee boat and went off to the right side of the course, where
>they had seen some puffs of wind. They then continued on around the
>course.
>
>The Race Committee protested the boat for failing to sail the
>course, under rule 51.2 (the 'string' rule).
>
>What is your reading of the situation, the applicable rules, and the
>your grounds for decision?
>
Was there really that little wind, or was the first div. boat so unable to sail
to weather that it couldn't clear the line? There are rules about clearing the
start but I forget the numbers. Some other rulesnik will undoubtedly answer the
details.
But what I want to know is: why didn't the committee postpone/abandon the race
if there was so little wind that boats were unable to clear the starting area?
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: spencer@panix.com (David Spencer)
Subject: Re: Spinnaker Douse - Question
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 13:12:44 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

htweedie@madhat.actrix.gen.nz (Hamish Tweedie) writes:

>fog@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Larry Fogelquist) writes:
>> Does anyone know what a windward floter spinnaker douse is?
>> How is a windward floater different from leeward floater?

>	Note that this technique is only recommended in the VERY light

Nah. If you square off so that the chute is a dam instead of a foil
(you need to be almost by the lee), take off the pole and let fly the
sheet, you're not going to blow into the rigging. We do it all the
time, whether it's light or heavy. It just takes a practiced hand on
the tiller (to keep you far downwind without gybing or collapsing the
chute) and good coordination among the gatherer, the gorilla and the
chutehandler (so the chute stays full as it comes around the
headstay).

This is on a 22 foot boat; on a 50 footer your mileage may vary....

>if it goes wrong.... it really goes wrong!

Yep. A 15 degree shift will either convert your chute to confetti or
decapitate your gorilla with the boom. A little sea can make it real
interesting. And a slow gatherer will make your chute into a nice sea
anchor (We lost 8 places at the Sonar NA's last year with a bad
douse; the gatherer no longer sails with us....)

Still, it's worth doing - and therfore worth practicing. It gives you
a lot of tactical flexibility at no cost.

dhs   spencer@panix.com
Sonar 404
From: htweedie@madhat.actrix.gen.nz (Hamish Tweedie)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Olympics?
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16e (7/4/92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith
Date: 30 Jul 92 11:13:10 PST
Organization: The mad HATter's madhouse

In article <1992Jul29.135852.13748@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu> whoward@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu (Will Howard) writes:
> In article <22892@oasys.dt.navy.mil> michaels@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Robert
> Michaelson) writes:
> >Anyone hear how the Olympic sailing is going?  Sure can't depend on
> >the TV coverage for news here.
> >
> >rob
> NY Times said today (Wednesday 7/29) that J.J. Isler was disqualified for a
> premature start (or, DSQ'ed for a PMS,  for you acronym fans) in the first
> women's 470 race .That's the only news I've heard. 

	Yip, she looked like the a boat that was way over the start when
the individual recall went up! She sailed on to complete the race (in
breach of the instructions :-). There were about 8 boats (out of a fleet of
18) that PMS's in that 1st race.

-- 

|           ///    htweedie@madhat.actrix.gen.nz  Bombora/Ross 780 sailor|
| Taste    ///       OR tweedie_h@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz        | RZ350, R65,|
|= Amiga  ///        OR tweedie@ivory.isor.vuw.ac.nz        | K75S rider.|
|    \\\ /// "Computer programmers were put on Earth to make accountants |
|     \XX//  look interesting!"   "Stretch yourself.........get morphed!"|
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: greg@netcom.com (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Man Overboard, again
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 05:56:25 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Jul17.161618.13040@webo.dg.com> psmith@dg-webo.rtp.dg.com (Peter Smith) writes:
>
>You should come here during the "frostbiting" season.  A San Franciscan
>would feel right at home, but the reduced visibility would be due to
>snow, not fog.
 
As look would have it, it appears that I may be about to do just that!
 
So, pardon the ignorance of an soon-to-be ex-pat Californian, but what
do you use to scrape your frozen butt off the bottom of the Dyer Dhow?
A spatula? A blowtorch applied to the exterior of the hull?
 
Greg
From: CHRIS@csclan.cs.com (Chris Rousseau)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: What is your marina like?
Date: 24 Jul 92 21:32:17 GMT
Organization: Computer Support Corporation,  Dallas,Texas.
News-Software: CNEWS Novell/MSDOS inews ver 11Sep91

Reply-To: CHRIS@csclan.cs.com (Chris Rousseau)
Followup-To: 
Distribution: usa
Organization: Computer Support Corporation, Dallas, Texas.
Keywords: marinas monopolies

I would like to start a discussion about marinas and the service/quality
per dollar.  We seem to have a marina system nearing a monopolistic state
on at least one of the area lakes and are wondering just how bad we are
being screwed.  Things I wonder about are: 

1)price/foot/year
2)quality of management
3)quality/quantity of facilities
4) other...

please post...

Thanks

Chris
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: walter@watson.ibm.com (Walter Wilson)
Subject: Cruising Pamlico Sound: info wanted
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:40:27 GMT
Distribution: usa
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

Can any netter comment on cruising conditions on Pamlico Sound 
in August?

Any referals to boat charterers in the area?

-- 

  Walter G. Wilson  (walter@watson.ibm.com)
  The opinions expressed here are my own.

  "My plans for the year all laid out...
   Ah... A dream in Springtime "
     -- Shodo (Go Seigen)
Newsgroups: rec.boats