From: pack@acd.ucar.edu (Daniel Packman)
Subject: Re: Laws of man and God
Keywords: Amendment 2, hate
Organization: Ntl Center for Atmospheric Research - Atmospheric Chemistry Div
Distribution: co
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 00:02:02 GMT

In article <1992Dec11.200157.14029@stortek.com> v042517@stortek.com (Vince Dugar) writes:
>
>Understood.  But in my case, life got a lot simpler the "day" I realized
>I'd never figure it all out on my own (or with the help of other men).
>I suppose this is where non-Christians have a lot of trouble, possibly
>calling simple faith a crutch, etc.  But my response to that is those
>who don't have a (traditional) religious faith, must have *some* form
>of faith, unless they honestly believe they "know it all."

The true joy for some comes from reveling in the fact that one does
not know.  Answering questions that cannot be answered takes all
the fun out of life.  Particularly if much of the fun comes in pondering
these questions.

>
>>
>>In Judaism, the Law is divided quite clearly between the Law of God and
>>the Law of Man.  The former is a private matter between you and God.  The
>>latter is clearly written down.  
>
>Isn't the former also clearly written down in the Old Testatment?  There
>also, the Jewish law is written.  The problem with the laws of man were
>that no one could possibly ever keep them!  So Christ came to rewrite the
>law -- He put it in terms of faith.  Acceptance of Christ makes the
>individual justified to God the Father -- the hope of perfection through
>man's laws is a dead issue.

The Torah is indeed written down as are reams of commentary on it.  This
work and its commentary can be viewed as both a practical guide to living
as well as an approach to faith.  But in a society such as ours, this does
not constitute the "Law of Man" I was talking about.  That is the set of
laws of the federal, state, and local governments and that applies to all
people of all faiths.  There is a great  leap between keeping man's laws
and striving for perfection.  A great majority of the people in our society
manage to live legal, if imperfect, lives.

>
>>So, if you commit a wrong, you must
>>satisfy the requirements of the Law of Man independently of any private
>>action you do with God.  This fits in well with the concept of separation
>>of Church and State.
>
>Huh?  Regarding the first sentence here, see my previous comment.  Re
>the 2nd, well that's a whole other discussion.
>

Let me rephrase it:  What you do religiously is your business.  What you
do in society is everybody's business and comes under straightforward laws
that are written down.  If you steal from somebody, then the laws we live
under require that you provide restitution.  If your personal religious
belief involves some internal process such as prayer, fine, go ahead and
do this but remember that you still have another set of laws that must
be followed.  It truly galls me to have often seen religion used as a
way for people to feel better about themselves while treating others poorly.

-- 
Dan Packman     NCAR                             INTERNET: pack@ncar.UCAR.EDU
(303) 497-1427  P.O. Box 3000
                Boulder, CO  80307-3000        NSI/DECNET: 9583::PACK
Newsgroups: co.politics