HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rhaller@oregon.uoregon.edu (Rich Haller)
Subject: Re: Comments from 2nd viewing
Followup-To: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Organization: University of Oregon
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 17:31:26 GMT

In article <BARB.92Sep13223047@chamarti.ai.mit.edu>, barb@zurich.ai.mit.edu
(Barb Miller) wrote:
[spoilers ahead] 


[spoilers ahead] 



[spoilers ahead] 




> 
> In article <rhaller-130992102212@rhaller.cc.uoregon.edu> rhaller@oregon.uoregon.edu (Rich Haller) writes:
> *   Another explanation is that the ring was good and it was the 'bad' Cooper
> *  in her dream telling her not to take it.  It might be argued that it has to
> *   be the good Coop because that is the one in the lodge, but don't forget
> *   that Leland/BOB enter the lodge at the end of FWWM, so Coop/BOB could also.
> *    That said, I'm not as happy with this theory as I would like to be.
> 
> Well, one possibility is that it is not time for her to accept the
> ring yet.  I don't remember the chronology well enough to know just
> exactly what all happens to her after that warning not to take the
> ring, but possibly she has to fall "faster and faster" than she's
> doing now in order to acquire enough knowledge, or precipitate enough
> events, or come into contact with enough people, so that everything
> that needs to happen does happen before she is killed.
[deletions]

I like this a whole lot better than my bad Coop explanation:
Coop warns her because the time isn't right for her to take the ring.

Maybe the ring really was there, not just dreamed, but disappears because,
being warned, she fails to put it on within some critical time limit, or it
is withdrawn because of the warning.
Interestingly, the ring arrives after Annie leaves:
#       Annie:  My name is Annie:  I've been with Laura and Dale.  The good
#         Dale is in the lodge and he can't leave.  Write it in your diary.
#       {Sarah calls Laura, distant, mournful.  Laura looks at the door,
#         then at her bed.  Annie's gone.  In her hand is Teresa's ring.

This is echoed later in a scene in the shooting script where a nurse takes
the ring off Annie's finger:

#   -- Nurse attends to Annie.
#       Annie:  My name is Annie.  I've been with Laura and Dale.  The good
#         Dale is in the lodge and he can't leave.  Write it in your diary.
#      The nurse slides the ring off of Annie's finger.  She goes to
another
#      room and puts it on.

> Both ring and necklace are left behind after their owners are killed,

I don't think the necklace is magical, just symbolic. Also, I don't think
the ring is left behind.  It goes to the lodge from whence it is sent out
again.

-Rich Haller
From: jsnyder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (J Snyder)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Re: Questions (spoilers)
Date: 5 Sep 92 14:34:13 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <6081@transfer.stratus.com> cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares) writes:
|In article <1992Sep1.000831.7920@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>, jjc4@po.CWRU.Edu (James J. Campanella) writes:
|
|> Okay, I got the distinct impression that the inhabitants of the Black 
|> Lodge "eat" pain and suffering (Garbonsiviaum, not even close, sorry).
|> Further, I got the impression that Bob is almost a butcher for the group.
|> That he must kill whoever wears that dreaded green ring. Near the end
|> of the movie, the dwarf and one-armed man asked for their share of the pain and 
|> suffering...
|> 2.) Do they *need* to cosume the pain and suffering
|> or do they do it for some other reason?
|> 3.) When the one-armed man saw the light and became
|> "good", he must have stopped consuming pain...
|
|What was the line MIKE spouted about -- "Appetite... fulfillment... a
|golden ring of (something).."?

Oooooo...you're good!

"Appetite...  Satisfaction...  A golden circle."
"A golden circle?  My ring!  My ring!"
...
"You have all the answers you need."

Good connection - this had not ocurred to me, and it ties in well to the
addiction theory.



-- 
---------------------------+- If we took the bones out, it wouldn't --
jsnyder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu |  be crunchy, would it?  -  MPFC
---------------------------+  That is your reciept for your husband,
and this is my reciept for your reciept. - Brazil
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Monday, 14 Sep 1992 10:07:29 EDT
From: <SAUDA@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Wanted: Name of music not on FWWM Sndtrk

At the end of FWWM, there is a very beautiful Requiem meshed
with the very iconic events on the screen.  Could someone planning
on seeeing the film again get the name of the piece off the credits
(I am pretty sure it said Requiem in ___ by _______) and more importantly
the name of the composer.

Since I am unable to read this wonderful (and thought provoking) news
group, please send information to me at sauda@maine.maine.edu.  Thanks.

OB TP Content:  Loved the movie.  Unfortunately it probably won't
convert the uninitiated into TP fans.  It does however increase
the old TP fans thirst for more movies/or shows!  I have started
watching tapes of the old TV series after seeing the movie and notice
many different nuances.  Lynch studied prior to making the movie.

Michael Sauda
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
From: jsetzer@rucs2.sunlab.cs.runet.edu (Jim Setzer)
Subject: Re: Fat Trout/Big Tuna
Organization: Radford University
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 92 00:17:56 GMT


	Could someone repost the Twin Peaks Allusions from about 9 months ago.
I've dusted off the tape of the first two seasons, and would like to have this
handy as I watch them.

					Thanx

-- 



				Jim Setzer
From: jsnyder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (J Snyder)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Re: grey hair
Date: 5 Sep 92 14:28:59 GMT
Distribution: alt
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <15237@umd5.umd.edu> jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog here...) writes:
|In article <KANDALL.92Sep1170900@globalize.nsg.sgi.com> kandall@nsg.sgi.com (Michael Kandall) writes:
|
|>Why did Leland's hair turn white in the TV series?  I thought it was
|>because BOB had taken over his mind/body/soul.  Coop said he should
|>have realized earlier that BOB's grey, greasy hair, and the sudden
|>change in Leland's hair was related.
|
|>In the movie, it seems that BOB had controled Leland from long ago.
|
|I think the change came about because Leland's actions AS LELAND were
|getting more Bob-like.  Apparently his killing of Jacques was his own
|act, not that of BOB.  Also, while his attack on Jacoby has been
|labeled an act of BOB by the producers, his sneaking out to follow Maddy
|earlier in that episode seems to have been Leland acting on his own.
|
|Before BOB could assert control over Leland only for moments.  Now Leland
|himself is becoming more BOB-like -- one of Robert's children.  Now that
|he has become a creature of BOB, able to commit violent acts free from guilt
|or shame (like killing Jacques), he is marked by the appearance of BOB.
|
|Sound good?

Not really ;)... I think the net.consensus from the series was a determination
that grey hair represents that the character has killed someone, probably
with malice.  I seem to remember a thread on this subject from the beginning
of the second season...

I do like the idea that here in that it ties everyone into the lodges.

Is the entire town posessed?  Is this all just a giant Twilight Zone?

-- 
---------------------------+- If we took the bones out, it wouldn't --
jsnyder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu |  be crunchy, would it?  -  MPFC
---------------------------+  That is your reciept for your husband,
and this is my reciept for your reciept. - Brazil
From: sally@anableps.berkeley.edu (S. A. Wilson)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Ring, OAM
Date: 16 Sep 1992 00:25:59 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: anableps.berkeley.edu






could it be that it is "who" offers the ring that defines its 
properties?  so maybe that is why coop told laura not to
accept the ring the first time since it was being offered by
a representative of the dark lodge. in the end, as others have
posted, MIKE's purpose was not to save laura from death but to
offer her the ring so as to help transport her to the lodges
and eventually to the white lodge. 

also, think that the hypothesis that earlier it was not yet
the right time for her to except the ring since, since it was offered by the 
dark forces, and also because she was not spiritually ready, she had
not yet achieved the spiritual power to confront, and overcome her
"shadow self."

as for MIKE not stating right out that BOB was in leland was
because now that he is associated with the white lodge he
cannot interfere beyond certain limits when dealing with
the physical world of TP. like the Giant he could not help
coop right out, but could give him only vague clues, and it
was then up to coop to come up with the solutions. 

still the part with him and the LMFAP, does not fit into his
"conversion." but maybe as others have posted that the ARM
represents his connection to the darker forces. removing it
is the break, yet in the final scenes of FWWM, being in
the presence of the arm--and the way the LWFAP was situated 
near him like an appendage--that he reverted back to his old
self....but again why?


it seems to me, that while in the physical plain of TP that the
"good" lodge residents are somewhat powerless.

sally--





i tend to believe MIKE. it would be rather interesting to



-- 
Video meliora proboque, deteriora sequor! ###	Sally   A.  Wilson
[Ovid's _Metaphorposes_]		  ###   sally@mica.berkeley.edu
Vita non est vivere sed valere vita est.  ###   
[Martial]				  ###	P.  Spud  Peel
From: enomura@sdcc13.ucsd.edu (Eddie the 'ead)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Indian Whooping Sound - 6 Times (spoilers)
Date: 10 Sep 92 08:22:14 GMT

We hear the Indian whooping sound at least six times.

1)  When the lady with the ice-pack walks up to the trailer, there is
    a shot of the telephone pole there.  The sound accompanies the telephone
    pole.

2)  Again, the sound accompanies the telephone pole, this time when Desmond
    is looking at it.

3)  The LMFAP demonstrates it to Cooper.

4)  Still in Laura's dream, when she gets up to open the door of her room,
    we very faintly hear it.

5)  In Leland's flashback of the TV set being axed, we hear it from what
    sounds like inside the TV just before it is hit.  The sound does not
    accompany the TV shot at the beginning of the film.

6)  When the OAM is chasing Laura and Leland on their way to meet Sarah
    for breakfast, we hear it when we first see the OAM's vehicle.



ed

-- 
   /\__Edwin Nomura -- enomura@ucsd.edu__________.:___________.____________/\
  / \\        .:.         .                      : .         :            / \\
 /  \\\   :  .::     :     :  Fire walk with me  :..        : .     :    /  \\\
/   \\\\..::..:::.:::::.:.:.....:::::...::..:...:::::.:.:::::.:....::.../   \\\\
From: jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog here...)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Questions and answers & a theory about the ring
Date: 13 Sep 92 21:39:04 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park

In article <BuFnGw.8w5@acsu.buffalo.edu> v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey) writes:

>>>1) Just where does the special European ending start on the movie
>>>   and what is different?

>>It starts at the scene where Sarah Palmer, half-asleep, has a vision of
>>BOB in her daughter's room.  Everything after that is new/different,

>     Actually, Sarah DOES have the same vision of Bob in Laura's
>     room in the ABC pilot -- we just didn't see it.  A later
>     episode (1004, I think) has Andy sketching Bob from Sarah's
>     descriptions of a man she saw in Laura's room in her vision
>     from the pilot.  

No, that sketch came from Sarah's vision in the first one-hour episode,
when she saw Donna with Laura's face and BOB crouching at the foot of
Laura's bed.

>>>5) Everyone seems to say that the ring symbolizes "You're next"  Then
>>>   howcome when the OAM drives up screaming, he holds up his hand with
>>>   the ring on it?

>>Because he's from the Lodge, and they control the ring.  It's theirs.
>>Why shouldn't he wear it?

>     Teresa Banks is shown with the ring as well... somehow, she came
>     into possession of the ring, and Bob/Leland couldn't possess
>     her either (if that was ever his intent... to stop her blackmailing
>     him...?) - so she's dead.  

Here's an idea.  Maybe wearing the ring symbolizes giving your soul over,
not to BOB, but to MIKE / God.  Teresa wore the ring -- she couldn't
be taken over.  In fact, she even had one dead arm, like MIKE does.  Then
Laura wore the ring -- and was saved.  On the street, Philip Gerard wore the
ring, and he was the vessel for MIKE, warning Laura.

One question -- was he wearing the ring in the "garmonbozia" scene at
the end?  If not, then that would explain his strange actions after he
gave the ring to Laura -- he was re-united with his "dark side" (the
Arm), and hence ignored Ronnette (at least on camera) and ate with BOB.
Maybe without the ring, he couldn't remember that Leland was BOB, and that
explains why he didn't track him down in the series.

Just thoughts...
From: ckt4x@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU (Curt Tsui)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Re: Who's got an episode guide?
Date: 6 Sep 92 20:28:07 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia

SHILL@HARPERVM.BITNET  writes:
> I am in dire need of an episode guide to Twin Peaks.  Somebody out there
> has got one, please email or post, and a great big thanks.
> -Steve


The most current issue of Film Threat with the FWWM cover has
an episode guide/summary though you have to put up with the
usual snide Film Threat remarks on all episodes.  
--
                               - Curt Tsui -
      			     curt@Virginia.EDU
   "Happiness might very well be a glandular condition." - David Cronenberg 
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
From: georgen@pooky.cs.mun.ca (George Noel)
Subject: Re: I saw FWWM ** SPOILERS !! **
Summary: Masked dancing man
Keywords: connections
Organization: CS Dept., Memorial University of Newfoundland
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 21:44:30 GMT

>
>	As for the dancing man in the room above the convenience store, did I
>just imagine it or was he dressed exactly the same as the MFAP?
>
>	The dancing man had black, flat-topped (Eraserhead?) hair, a long
>nose, and a face painted white -- but he wasn't wearing the mask.  It is
>"Pierre Tremond" (aka the Boy Magician) who is most frequently seen with the
>mask.  One aspect of the white mask which I'm surprised to see hasn't been
>discussed, to my knowledge, is that it doesn't have any eyeholes; thus, one
>is unable to see when wearing the mask.  If the grandson is the Magician, is
>this what is meant by "In the darkness of future past/The Magician longs to
>see"?
>
>	Come to think of it, could there be a connection between this white
>mask and the white mask (which I presume was Caroline's death mask) that
>Windom Earle sent to Cooper?

 But wasn't Pierre Tremond in the scene above the convenience store also
 along with the dancing "masked" man? You are right though, the dancing
 masked man WAS dressed like the LMFAP, he danced - the LMFAP also dances
 and Pierre Tremond also wore a mask like the dancing man's face. Someone
 mentioned before how they though Pierre and Bob were connected, another
 indication of this was in one of the rooms when Laura goes through the
 door in the red room above the convenience store, Pierre appears there,
 snaps his fingers (from the series - "sometimes things happen just like
 that! <snap>") and a white light appears on the wall like the same white
 light that is shown when Bob appears (ie: when he says Where's Josie?").
 Could all of the seperate "entities" in the red room be "one and the same?"
  
   Also, from the TV series, what does Pierre say to Donna in french when
   she first meets him?
    
    -=*George*=- ^^^ what does he say in french and what does it mean in
		     English?
From: clements@bbn.com (Bob Clements)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: "You shot Mike"
Date: 9 Sep 1992 14:24:03 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: classic.bbn.com

SPOILER


As far as I've seen, nobody has yet figured out why Laura says
"You shot MIKE" after Bobby shoots the deputy.

When I heard that line, I thought she was saying "You shot Mike",
not "You shot MIKE".  I.e., she thought Bobby had killed their
high school classmate Mike, the future close friend of Nadine,
and not the metaphysical enemy of BOB.

At that point in the timeline did Laura know anything about MIKE?

Not that it makes much more sense referring to Mike...

Bob Clements, K1BC, clements@bbn.com
From: jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog here...)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Re: Thoughts UPdate (FAQ?)
Date: 15 Sep 92 21:25:28 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park

In article <H6D6qB2w165w@zitt> zitt!joe@dogface.austin.tx.us (Joe Zitt) writes:
>melunney@jeeves.uwaterloo.ca (Mike Lunney) writes:

>> The order was T under Teresa's
>>               R under Laura's
>>               B under Ronette's (second episode of the second season?)
>>               O under Maddy's (seventh or eighth episode?)

>Hmm... Perhaps he's spelling it backwards, and there was an attack we didn't
>know about >between< Laura's death and Ronette's letter-placement, using
>the letter "E".

Hmm.  I like that.  More backwards-time.

Then again, remember that he "marked" Maddy for death in the second episode
of the second season by attacking her, putting her before Ronnette (who
he didn't try to kill until the third episode).  That might be it.
Organization: William Rainey Harper College; Palatine, IL  60067
Date: Saturday, 5 Sep 1992 11:38:10 CST
From: Steve W Hill <SHILL@HARPERVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Who's got an episode guide?

I am in dire need of an episode guide to Twin Peaks.  Somebody out there
has got one, please email or post, and a great big thanks.
-Steve
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
From: zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc Szabo)
Subject: Re: FWWM - spoilers...
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 17:24:01 GMT
Organization: Inter/Access' Matrix BBS

In article <9208300306.AA09030@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> C491153@MIZZOU1.missouri.edu (John Schultz) writes:
>Arr, matey!  Thar be spoilers here!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Jeremy Matthew Toeman <jt3h+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>>3] Did they forget to put in a scene of a letter being shoved under the
>>girls' fingernails?? I *KNOW* they both had them. (Either that, or my
>>memory is way-screwed)
>
>I don't remember seeing this scene in the movie.  Wouldn't BOB/Leland
>had to have put the letters under Ronette and Laura's fingers *before*
>Mike gets there?  As Ronette tries to open the door, BOB beats her,
>then throws her outside and leaves her there.  Did he come back for the
>finger perhaps?

Ronette didn't have a letter under her fingernail when Cooper examined her
in the tv pilot.  The only 3 letters I am aware of were from Theresa Banks,
Laura and Maddie (R B T).  Leland/BOB would have had plenty of time to
put the letter under Laura's fingernail between the time of Mike's 
departure and putting Laura in the water.

There were a few details explained in the tv series that never made it]
to the movie.  Not to say they couldn't have still logically happened.
 -Waldo biting Laura
 -Jacques saying: "Bite the bullet, baby"
 -Bobby crying after making love to Laura (as told to Jacoby) 

However, there were indeed a lot of tiny details in the movie that were
directly known from the tv series that made it all the more spooky.  As
soon as Laura said "Goodnight, mom" and Sarah said "Goodnight, sweetheart"
(paraphrased??) I got a chill up my spine because I knew IT had started.


ferenc



Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
From: mfrazer@scott.skidmore.edu (Matthew Frazer)
Subject: Re: The Monkey man and garmonbozia
Organization: Skidmore College, Saratoga Springs NY
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 17:17:04 GMT

salmieri@whitebase.ukp.com (Gregory Salmieri) writes:

> I agree wit all the above ideas except the first one, that was creamed corn. 
> As far as the second idea: The ring transports you to the black lodge, thus 
> the qwl cave symbols. The symbols were a map to the lodg, Andy figured that 
> out.                                                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
                                                  I believe Windom Earle       
						     First Knew This
There was a scene in one oof the episodes with Windom on the laptop
yelling that the cave painting was not onlty an invitation it was also
a map, a map to the black lodge, nasty rasping laughter, leo screaming
and twitching etc.....

--
===============================================================================
"Diane..as we know from experiments  | I do not have insomnia! I just forget 
conducted on GI's during the Korean  |             to sleep.
War, sleep deprivation is a one way  | Matt Frazer, mfrazer@skidmore.edu
ticket to temporary psychosis, and   | 5 Stevens Way Durham NH 03824
I'm working on a three day jag."     | Skidmore College Saratoga Springs 
-FBI Special Agent Dale Cooper       |          New York 12866
===============================================================================
                              Be Seeing You!
===============================================================================
From: miuvdd@lure.latrobe.edu.au
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Need Help with Aussie Release date!!!
Date: 8 Sep 92 06:04:03 GMT
Organization: VAX Cluster, Computer Centre, La Trobe University





Does anyone know when FWM is due to be released in Australia?
Could someone tell me who is handling the distribution in the
States?  That would certainly help me track down who is handling
it over here.

Thanks,

Morgana
miuvdd@lure.latrobe.edu.au
From: sally@anableps.berkeley.edu (S. A. Wilson)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: "Black Dog Runs at Night"
Date: 11 Sep 1992 22:57:05 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: anableps.berkeley.edu



Okay, re-listening to the TP:FWWM soundtrack last night I paid
more attention to the songs. And while listening to "Black Dog
Runs at Night," I could swear that I heard a "squeaking," or
"squealling" nose which cropped up occasionally; to me it sounded
as if it were from an animal, a pig, which I doubt, or could it
be from some type of primate? Wasn't it mentioned in this group
that the first time we see a flash of the primate that it was
when this song was played in the background, when the Cream
Corn Kid was doing his dance?

Sally--


-- 
That the play is the tragedy, "Man,"  \\\\\	Sally A. Wilson
  And its hero, the Conqueror Worm.    \\\\\	sally@mica.berkeley.edu
("The Conqueror Worm"			\\\\\
from Egar Allan Poe's _Ligeia_)		 \\\\\	Spud 	Peel
From: zitt!joe@dogface.austin.tx.us (Joe Zitt)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Re: Thoughts UPdate (FAQ?)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 92 09:59:16 CDT
Organization: Metatron Press / Human Systems Performance Group, Austin, TX

melunney@jeeves.uwaterloo.ca (Mike Lunney) writes:

> The order was T under Teresa's
>               R under Laura's
>               B under Ronette's (second episode of the second season?)
>               O under Maddy's (seventh or eighth episode?)

Hmm... Perhaps he's spelling it backwards, and there was an attack we didn't
know about >between< Laura's death and Ronette's letter-placement, using
the letter "E".


--
"Go to an extreme and then retreat to a more useful position"  --  Brian Eno
Joe Zitt 	       ...cs.utexas.edu!kvue!zitt!joe  	       (512)450-1916
From: jsnyder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (J Snyder)
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: Re: Fat Trout/Big Tuna
Date: 6 Sep 92 17:30:47 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <1992Sep2.184752.14566@uwm.edu> drbenway@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (The Overload) writes:
|
|     
|
|
|     Lynch sure has a penchant for large fish...


So does John Clese...
-- 
---------------------------+- If we took the bones out, it wouldn't --
jsnyder@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu |  be crunchy, would it?  -  MPFC
---------------------------+  That is your reciept for your husband,
and this is my reciept for your reciept. - Brazil
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks