HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: saidra@prism.CS.ORST.EDU (Raoul Said)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Found problem (memory model question)
Date: 22 Jul 92 04:10:40 GMT
Organization: Oregon State University, Computer Science Dept.


	Ok, i have located the source of my problems after converting my code
from small to compact in Turbo C++.  Maybe I am missing something simple here
but how come the following code produces two identical pointers?  Am I doing
something I shouldn't be here?  All I want is two pointers to the near heap
while in the compact memory model.  When I run this code, my machine produces
two pointers that point to the same place in memory.  Any ideas??

void main()
{
char near 	*foo[2];

	foo[0] = (char near *)malloc(6);
	foo[1] = (char near *)malloc(6);
}

			Thanks
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: psteffn@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Paul Steffen)
Subject: Re: Game Library? Fact or Fiction.
Organization: /etc/organization
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 07:50:46 GMT

In article <9470@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au> warwick@cs.uq.oz.au writes:
>psteffn@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Paul Steffen) writes:
>>Inline assembly code is pure hell!!
>Obviously someone who has never used the "asm" extension in GNU C.

I am aware of the compiler option for reducing the number of used
registers.  I did say something to this effect in the message you
replied to.

>With GNU C, you specify the output values, input values, and destroyed
>registers, and it gives you registers to use in the asm function, and
>takes care of getting the values into those regs, not using them for
>optimisations across the asm inline, etc.  eg:
>
>void swap(int* first, int* second)
>/* Really fast swap :-) */
>{
>    printf("Now executing the Really Fast swap routine!!!");
>    printf("This program must be running very fast now");
>    printf("that you are using this fast routine!");
>
>    asm("   movel  %0@,d0
>            movel  %1@,%0@
>            movel  d0,%1@
>       " :             /* no outputs */
>         : (a) first,  /* %0 will be an adr. reg (a), with the value of first */
>           (a) second  /* %1 will be an address reg with the value of second */
>         : "d0"        /* d0 will be trashed by this asm code, so make sure */
>    );
>    printf("Sorry, I chatted so much, you missed the routine happening!!");
>

Sure, but if you had coded completely in assembler, couldn't you have done
an 'exg Dx,Dx' which is approximately 5 times faster?  With assembler, you
know which registers are being used by what at any given time.

>Warwick

STratoHAK/TPPi
From: sspst8+@pitt.edu (Sanjay S Patel)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Game libraries...
Date: 29 Jul 92 19:07:30 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

Well i'm sure well all go through any code he puts up and check it out thoroughly.

There are always people who respond 'that's easy!' to any question and start
hacking away..  The only way to test his legitimacy is wait and look at what he's done.

Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu (Elan Feingold)
Subject: 386 Game Library 
Reply-To: elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu (Elan Feingold)
Organization: Cornell University
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 18:24:53 GMT



>Oh yeah, well you should see my library.  It runs in 386 mode, preemptively
>multitasks sprite animations, it has a interface to Sound Blaster & Ad Lib >cards, suports all known graphics cards from 320x200x256 to 2048x2000x24 bits.
>It supports all major graphics coprocessors, had inteface for Powerglove and >SEGA 3D glasses.  Has additional support for the DEC Kannan 3D Graphics >Accelerator, which has only been released to OEMs so far.  If anyone is >interested, contact either:

Whoops, big mistake.  The only reason nkk & I posted this was because we
were getting pissed off at all the "well you should see MY library" type 
whining.  This was never meant to be believable!!!  My apologies to everyone.


Elan Feingold (elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu) & Naresh Kannan (nkk@alux2.att.com)

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|  Elan Feingold       |  Chevy Chase after being asked by a Howard Stern |
|  CS/EE Depts.        |  interviewer whether he still wore a toupee:     |
|  Cornell University  |  "Ask him [Stern] if he wants me to put his      |
|  Ithaca NY 14850     |   dentist in a higher tax bracket."              |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: kdorff@hobbes.comp (Kevin C. Dorff)
Subject: Re: TP or C ? (was: Languages to program in and ports and blah and etc...)
Organization: /home/dante3/kdorff/.organization
	<76207@ut-emx.uucp> <1992Jul20.203317.10143@esds.mdc.com>
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 14:01:54 GMT

In article <1992Jul20.203317.10143@esds.mdc.com> bonney@esds.mdc.com (Greg Bonney) writes:
>I still like Pascal. Everybody says, "it was originally intended only to teach
>people how to program".  And I say, "so what?"  C apparently wasn't "good
>enough" in it's original incarnation either.  Otherwise, why did they have to
>come up with ANSII C and C++?  And C does sacrifice readability in favor of
>flexibility.  The C "for" statement is especially weird; it's completely
>different from "for" statements I've seen in any other language.

I agree, TP is a great version of Pascal, far greater than standard pascal,
which i do this is not worth even looking at (for just about any reason),
but I also agree that C and C++ are quite worthy of their existance.
I am an avid TP, C, C++ programmer...

BUT about the "for" statement in C/C++.  Yes it is especially weird,
but anyone with programming experience knows that one of the most used
constructs is:

   initialization;
   while (expression) 
      stuff
      increment;

which C NICELY compacts to:

   for (initialization;expression;increment)
      stuff

I use this in every (not really exagerating) program that I write.  I think
it is sooo much handier than the first way to do it.

Kevin
--

            Kevin Dorff
            kdorff@nmsu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: iuzzolin@carina.unm.edu (Harold Iuzzolino)
Subject: Re: TP or C ? (was: Languages to program in and ports and blah and etc...)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 17:04:30 GMT
Organization: Ashgon Inc.

>>I still like Pascal.  Everybody says, "it was originally intended only to teach
>>people how to program".  And I say, "so what?"  C apparently wasn't "good
>>enough" in it's original incarnation either.  Otherwise, why did they have to
>>come up with ANSII C and C++?  And C does sacrifice readability in favor of
>>flexibility.  The C "for" statement is especially weird; it's completely
>>different from "for" statements I've seen in any other language.
>
[Pointer stuff deleted]
>
>Also, in C, I wanted to check a couple of bits at memory location 0400:0017.
>All I did was:
> 
>if(*((char *)0x04000017)&3) ...
>
>How would you do that in pascal? 

this is one way (there are others, as I can think of two more)

var blah:longint absolute $0400:$0017;

begin
 if blah=3 then InsertSpiffyProcedureNameHere; {Or whatever...}
end.

--Mark Iuzzolino	      | "What do you mean you found a way to store
   President, Ashgon Inc.     | memory in locations smaller than a bit?" --A 
   CEO, Fantasy Squared Inc.  | very confused teacher.
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: TP or C ?
From: stuartw@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Stuart Woolford)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 04:47:50 GMT
 <1992Jul23.213310.17575@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> <1992Jul23.182026.57480@cc.usu.edu>
Organization: University of Auckland, New Zealand.

sl8nl@cc.usu.edu writes:

>> what I want added to C:
>> add scope control with '.' ie:
>> int a;
>> blort()
>> 	{
>> 	int a;
>> 	a=1;	/* set LOCAL A=1 */
>> 	.a=1;	/* set GLOBAL A=1 */
>> 	}
>> 

>Turbo Pascal already has that feature <sneer :)>  It deals with the one and
>only reason I've found to use a program header (and it works with unit headers
>too!)

>program Global;

>var a : Integer;

>procedure blort;
>var a : Integer;
>begin
>  a := 1;    (* set LOCAL A=1 *)
>  Global.a := 1;  (* set GLOBAL A=1*)
>end;

>> B-)
>> (ever tried thinking of new and interesting names for x and y when
>> 	programming graphics B-< )
>> 

>Too many times.

cute feature B-)
(just goes to show how unreadable pascal is B-)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
stuartw@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz


			>>>>In VI Where Available<<<<
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: silver@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (silver)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: x and y (was: TP or C ?)
Date: 25 Jul 92 01:20:08 GMT
Organization: The Tally Ho

In article <1992Jul23.213310.17575@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> stuartw@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Stuart Woolford) writes:
>
>(ever tried thinking of new and interesting names for x and y when
>	programming graphics B-< )
>
row and column? as a math type, I just got too used to y going up, not
down... I realize I should (as a proper math major) just intuit the new
basis, but my intuition still finds counting rows down easier than counting
ys down... 

I guess I was hoping for too much, but I saw some interesting questions
raised about scrolling windows w/steady backgrounds and other assorted tricks
that would be fun to know about... but instead of answers to the questions, 
just ongoing discussions of pascal v. c w/ lots of "let's include the
entire message in the follow up whether we're replying to it or not."

and, yes, I'm working on an answer to the hex LOS question... I suppose,
though, most ray-trace folk would suggest checking the line between source
hex and target hex against the set of circles circumscribed around all the
blocking hexes... if you get a match, try the line against the line segments
making up the hex... circle-line intersections and line-line intersections
should be relatively easy, I think... I'll need overnight to come up with
a really good solution.

--silver--                                     | "...Sloooow the plot down,
internet: silver@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu            | we'll scuttle the story
realitynet: silver Harloe@(512)/445-6087       | and run her aground..."
In the Village: Number Eight -- Be Seeing You! |        --MST3k/Mighty Jack
From: warwick@cs.uq.oz.au (Warwick Allison)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Game libraries...
Date: 28 Jul 92 05:20:53 GMT
Reply-To: warwick@cs.uq.oz.au

In <1992Jul27.190320.57533@cc.usu.edu> sl8nl@cc.usu.edu writes:

>> A game system is a massive undertaking, even if it's for a fairly
>> limited set of game styles.  Mike Roberts has been working on TADS
>> since 1987 or so, and that's just for text adventures.  The reason that

>I dunno.  My text adventure compiler handled everything (it was similar
>to the ADVSYS library), and it took me a couple of weeks.  I could do
>everything Infocom could do and more.  The resulting executable was 18k.

Cough!  Splutter!


I think you should check out TADS, if you think that ANY 18k program stands
a chance of even coming CLOSE to equal.  Sure, I can write any of the Infocom
games with just a BASUC interpretter, but TADS would make life much easier...


--
Warwick
--
  _-_|\      warwick@cs.uq.oz.au            /Disclaimer:
 /     * <-- Computer Science Department,  /  
 \_.-._/     University of Queensland,    /      void (if removed)
      v      Brisbane, Australia.        /
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: TP or C ?
From: stuartw@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Stuart Woolford)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 00:53:55 GMT
 <76207@ut-emx.uucp> <1992Jul20.203317.10143@esds.mdc.com> 
 <1992Jul22.000454.24871@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> <cg.0afn@ami-cg.UUCP> <1992Jul24.144708.3784@inmos.co.uk>
Organization: University of Auckland, New Zealand.

bruce@cheetah.inmos.co.uk (Bruce Stenning) writes:

>In article <cg.0afn@ami-cg.UUCP> cg@ami-cg.UUCP (Chris Gray) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul22.000454.24871@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> stuartw@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz
>>writes:
>>My relevant experience: I've written an ANSI C compiler at work. I use
>>ANSI C at work almost exclusively. I've written other compilers, including
>>the one I use here at home. I've probably written over half a million lines
>>of high-level-language code over the years, so I've learned a LITTLE about
>>how to do it in a maintainable way, usually without sacrificing efficiency.

well...I never said this...perhaps you got the wrong from line????

>One question:  Do you consider C a high-level language?  I'd call a low
>level language with the typing and control of a high-level language. 
>There are a lot of things you can do in C that would be far less
>efficient in any other language.  The beauty of C is that it allows the
>programmer to write code that checks itself rather than this being done
>by the compiler.  It is very good practise to write code that is
>thoroughly checked than hope the compiler will catch it for you. 
>Writing well-documented C code with meaningful variable names will mean
>that it will be maintainable and very efficient.

>Can you imagine writing something like UNIX in Pascal?  It would be an
>absolute nightmare.

Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: vspicer@ccu.umanitoba.ca ()
Subject: formal programming education
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:59:01 GMT

hi net world
	i am interested in the current thread on formal programming education.
some associates from high school have *claimed* (note i have problems
swallowing this) that they have held major programming and marketing jobs
in the industry with just high school education.
	one fellow claimed to have worked as the product manager for a major
software publisher/distributor, the other claims to have worked for litton
systems (a canadian defence contractor) and the department of defence. both
say they were making in excess of $100k a year since they were 17. 
	this strikes me as being completely nuts, but they say there are
"back doors" into most corporations where "ability" is worth more than
formal training. 
 	my degree is in physics and i've worked the past 2 years doing software
design, electronics systems and general interfacing work for a research
lab in the physics department. these guys claim with my experience in
computer programming and hardware systems a job in the computer industry
would be no problem, but i've always thought unless you have a masters
in computer science or engineering most places aren't interested. 
	musings apppreciated....

thanks in advance
	vic spicer
         
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: messina@netcom.com (Tony Porczyk)
Subject: Re: software evaluation shareware
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 06:55:24 GMT
Organization: Messina Software
Keywords: freeware, shareware, nagware, crippleware, trashware
Distribution: usa

ggs@reef.cis.ufl.edu (Gary Sanders) writes:

>for if it wasn't criple-ware.  The money was not the problem.  The program
>was/is *very good*, but it is not available like "COMMERCIAL SOFTWARE," and in
>my book SHAREWARE != COMMERCIAL SOFTWARE.  

I absolutely agree with you in your case.  When I originally stated that
shareware = commercial software (and, no, you missed, I am not a shareware
programmer), I meant real shareware, not crippleware, which to me is crap, 
not software.  I will not even bother checking it out.

>FURTHERMORE, many shareware programs are written by people who do it as a hobby
>and the asurance of future support is not like that of commercial software.

That is a totally different story.  However, shareware which i use
every day (registered) was most certainly written by professional
programmers who did expect to be paid and did an excellent job of both
designing the program, writing it, and then supporting it (go check
out 4DOS group - Mike Bessy is there every day). 

>My philosophy:  If its crippled, I won't even evaluate it.  If it's workable
>I'll play with it, and if I use it, I'll pay for it.

Then you will do exactly as I do.

It's so nice when two people agree...

t.
From: psteffn@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Paul Steffen)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Dave 'n' Josh
Date: 31 Jul 92 04:24:58 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization


I don't know if Josh mentioned this on his explanation of real-time
perspective mapping [scaling/rotation] but the way to get speed is
to store the image to be scaled in a format where each pixel
is a byte.  An 80x80 pixel bitmap is simply a 6400 byte 2 dimensional
array.  As your scanning algorithm scans the array and stores each pixel
it is stored as another table where you then convert back to interleaved
for screen memory.  I hear that PC VGA stores each pixel as a byte,
anyway, so this might be necessary only on Atari ST or Amiga [advantages
outweigh for the latter two].

I think I posted about texture mapping about a year ago in alt.sys.amiga.demos
or comp.sys.amiga.programmer.

STratoHAK/TPPi
From: tmkk@uiuc.edu (Khan)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re:   TP or C ?
Date: 24 Jul 92 19:36:26 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana


In article <5623@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at> mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at (Markus Stumptner) writes:
>From article <BrwACJ.1sp@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, by tmkk@uiuc.edu (Khan):
>> Take it as meaning your complaints about C have merit, as opposed to the
>> complaints of those who just can't comprehend the semantics of the
>> language. 
>
>Wrong argument, since hard-to-grasp semantics are not a recommendation
>for a language, if simpler languages with the same power exist.

No, Right argument. Show me a language which is simpler than C, yet more
powerful.
From: cyberman@toz.buffalo.ny.us (Cyberman)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Game languages: not a
Date: 25 Jul 92 00:21:04 GMT
X-Maildoor: WaflineMail 1.00r


     -=> Tom Boutell spoke of "Game languages: not a fla" <=-
    To All at 07-23-92  15:10
 TB> To elaborate, games can be in radically different categories:
 TB> adventurish games, which don't require real - time movement, and
 TB> arcade games, which have to be optimized to be practical at all.
 TB> These two categories are as different as word processors and
 TB> art software, if not more so. The only languages suitable to
 TB> creating both of the above are general - purpose languages.

Well most of the things that I wish to do are not available in
C++ or Pascal.  One on which is the alaise addressing of objects.

 TB> languages like Turbo Pascal 6.0 or C++, both of which support
 TB> object - oriented programming and are still pretty well optimized,
 TB> are probably among those best - suited to games development.

Also why the "game language" is really a front end for a C++
compilor.

 TB> But just about any general - purpose language can do the trick.
 TB> What we would benefit more from is a collection of games
 TB> programming LIBRARIES - distinct libraries for distinct general
 TB> categories.

Hmmmm well I still see no problem with the idea.

 TB> Perhaps what this group could really use is a set of FAQs explaining
 TB> certain basic nifty things: 3-D rotation, the basic tricks of
 TB> dealing with retrace, where to find PD or shareware windowing 
 TB> libraries if they exist, even a list of good commercial libraries.
 TB> But a special - purpose "games programming language," I think, would
 TB> either reinvent C or some other already - existing language in
 TB> order to be general, or be limited to certain types of games.
 TB> I would encourage folks to develop reusable libraries we can
 TB> call instead.

The FAQ is a good idea.  Someone needs to set up a FAQ of basic
GRAPHIC manipulations etc.  The problem is WHO can set it up?  We
would need someone who is semi permanent.  Since most of the
poeple here are students...

        Stephen Cyberman@Toz.Buffalo.NY.US
        Scripted at Fri  07-24-1992  17:49:41

... I'm sorry. You have been temporarily disconnected!
--- Blue Wave/QWK v2.10
                                      
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: boutell@isis.cshl.org (Tom Boutell)
Subject: Game Languages: Not a Flame
Originator: boutell@athena
Organization: Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 92 15:10:33 GMT

This isn't a flame, just a collection of my own thoughts on game
languages.

As I see it, the reason why most game languages (especially those
used by commercial groups) are best suited to a particular kind
of game is that game designs can call for just about any
variety of programming. In other words, the best general - purpose
game language is a good general - purpose programming language.
Being a professional programmer who cut his teeth writing games,
I'm aware that many of the algorithms I was subsequently taught
in college had already been invented by necessity in my game
software.

To elaborate, games can be in radically different categories:
adventurish games, which don't require real - time movement, and
arcade games, which have to be optimized to be practical at all.
These two categories are as different as word processors and
art software, if not more so. The only languages suitable to
creating both of the above are general - purpose languages.

I won't get into the flamewar over what the best general - purpose
language is, but one technique that tends to be beneficial in
game programming, since if games have anything in common it's their
divisibility into objects, is object oriented programming. Thus
languages like Turbo Pascal 6.0 or C++, both of which support
object - oriented programming and are still pretty well optimized,
are probably among those best - suited to games development.

But just about any general - purpose language can do the trick.
What we would benefit more from is a collection of games
programming LIBRARIES - distinct libraries for distinct general
categories.

The need for a real - time graphics library is obvious; there are a
million people babbling about sprite libraries on this group
(me included; too bad I didn't have time to pursue that project
further - no one seems to finish it). General - purpose drawing
libraries are less needed since most general - purpose languages
include them. Less obvious is the need for things like useful
image - storage and general - purpose windowing libraries, since
most games call for numerous still images (which should be compressed
in a professional game's distribution) and most users expect
a windowing environment these days.

A 3-D library would be a nice gadget too; a few have even come down
the pike in this group.

Perhaps what this group could really use is a set of FAQs explaining
certain basic nifty things: 3-D rotation, the basic tricks of
dealing with retrace, where to find PD or shareware windowing 
libraries if they exist, even a list of good commercial libraries.
But a special - purpose "games programming language," I think, would
either reinvent C or some other already - existing language in
order to be general, or be limited to certain types of games.
I would encourage folks to develop reusable libraries we can
call instead.


-- 
My return address now works!
Believe it or not there is life after college. At least if you live
near NYC.
From: mek4@prodigal.psych.rochester.edu (Mark Kern)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: DPaint II...?
Date: 30 Jul 92 05:00:11 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York

You will find that Dpaint IIe is used for all Lucasarts games and most
other commercial games.  Although it lacks some of the newer tools found
in upscale paint programs, it's brush capabilities are unmatched. In
Dpaint, it is very easy to make a brush out of a section you cut out.
Then, you can use this brush with any of the tools (fill,spraypaint, and
all drawing commands).  Very powerful yet simple concept. As far as links
to C goes, there are none. You will have to import the stuff to your
program via either PCX or LBM files.  I've written an LBM loader, and it
isn't that tough. PCX should be even simpler.


Markus
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer