HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: milts@mse.cse.ogi.edu (Milt Scholl)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Running Down Hills
Date: 27 Jul 92 15:38:16 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.40568
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute, Material Science & Engineering

In article adishian@dorm.rutgers.edu (Aram Adishian) writes:

>
>	You have to realize that Milt comes from the "Banzai-Face-
>Plant-I-Like-To-Run-Into-Trees" school of running where running down a
>muddy trail is considered good fun as opposed to a great way to suffer
>a severely crippling knee, ankle, arm, spleen, or face injury.  Milt is
>one of those fanatic madmen that do their high altitude training by
>running down Mount Everest because there is bound to be nice soft snow
>at the bottom of any gorge you fall into. 

STUFF DELETED . . .
>Aram Adishian
>adishian@dorm.rutgers.edu

You seem to have missed the point - at no time did I say to descend 
banzai down the trail.  The key in running downhill is control,
control so you don't run into trees, twist ankles, pound knees.  The
best way to learn control is to run where you can exceed the limits
of control - a steep hill, a muddy trail.  You will NEVER learn
to be a good downhill runner by running down a mild incline on
pavement.  I suggest, and utilize, muddy trails (which is half the
year here in Oregon) because the limit is at relatively low velocity,
you start slipping and losing control fairly fast - so you're not
blasting down the hill in the mud.  Since you are running slower in 
the mud you have a greater oppurtunity to learn how to plant your
feet, how to avoid shock to the ankles and knees - a much easier
experience than on the pavement.  

You also seemed to have neglected the :') at the end of the article.
BTW, I have only fallen twice in the last year, and I have NEVER
run into a tree, and I have yet to injury myself, other runners,
flora, or fauna in the ten years I've been running trails.

-milt scholl
milts@mse.ogi.edu

Newsgroups: rec.running,news.answers
From: joes@lpi.liant.com (Joe Stewart)
Subject: Re: America's Finest City Half Marathon (San Diego) query
Reply-To: joes@lpi.liant.com
Organization: LIANT Software Corporation
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 12:58:45 GMT

In article <1992Jul20.194508.21471@anasazi.com>, duane@anasazi.com (Duane Morse) writes:
|> The AFC (San Diego) Half Marathon in August sounds like a very
|> scenic run: from Cabrillo National Monument, along the Bay, into
|> town, and ending in Balboa Park.  Is it really that scenic?  What
|> about hills?

YES YES YES !!!

The AFC Half Marathon and the La Jolla Half Marathon tie for first on 
my list of most scenic Half Marathons.  The only problem?  Don't count
on a PR; in fact, I use them both as training runs for flat, and thus
fast, Halfs.

Now that I think about it a bit more, the La Jolla Half probably edges 
out the AFC Half by a tiny bit.  In any case, do the AFC for the stunning,
early morning views of the Pacific Ocean, the light house, downtown from
on high, the harbor from up close, and the wonderful, glorious sight of 
the finish line when 'sprinting' across the Cabrillo Bridge into the 
heart of Balboa Park.

Just my HO...

Joe
-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------
 Joseph Stewart
 Senior Applications Engineer (FIGARO+, FIGt, FIGraph)
 Liant Software Corporation
 959 Concord Street 
 Framingham MA 01701-4613 (USA)
 508-872-8700 x340
 joes@lpi.liant.com -- {uunet,necntc,drilex}!lpi!joes
---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ccoprbm@prism.gatech.EDU (bruce mccullough)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Running Shorts For Guys With Big Thighs?
Date: 22 Jul 92 14:36:19 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

Anyone have a mail order place for running shorts for guys with big thighs?
I have those Tom Platz thighs and a some what small waist. I've searched
all round here in Atlanta but no luck(maybe I missed someplace). I run
Tri-Dual-Biathlons and really just need these to run in the park. I don't
think my Tri-shorts would work to well in the park. 
-- 
Bruce Mccullough-Tech Assistant   | "The sharpest sword cannot cut itself".
Office of Information Technology  | "Look into the book of mirrors and find 
Georgia Institute of Technology   | all the knowledge you will ever need to  
Internet: ccoprbm@prism.gatech.edu| know". -    The Teacher              
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: georgec@eng.umd.edu (George B. Clark)
Subject: Re: Left Knee Pain: Rest or Strengthen?
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 14:07:47 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland

In article <Bs0IqD.Hxs@andy.bgsu.edu> klopfens@andy.bgsu.edu (Bruce Klopfenstein) writes:
>
>We grew up in the "no pain, no gain" era, so part of me wants to
>see how much pain I can tolerate while another part of me wants
>to rest a week and go back to it.  Looking for some sage advice. 
>

The "no pain, no gain" philosophy is probably  responsible for more
serious athletic injuries than anything else. It is extremely foolish
to ignore pain and exercise, anyway.

When you feel pain, you are suppose to stop. Otherwise, an injury that
should take no more than a day or two to heal, may instead become a
lifetime problem. Knee injuries are notoriously bad, in particular,
because damaged cartilage does not heal.
From: adishian@dorm.rutgers.edu (Aram Adishian)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Running Down Hills
Date: 27 Jul 92 00:35:54 GMT
Organization: Rutgers University CCF

milts@mse.cse.ogi.edu (Milt Scholl) writes:
>>I was wondering if anyone would be so kind to give me some tips on running
>>down very steep hills.  I don't intentionally run _down_ hills, my initial
>>goal was to run UP them.  Then I realized that I have to go back down them

>try practice running down MUDDY trails - it teaches you balance, foot
>placing, and anticipation of where you step next.  Besides if you
>fall damage is minor (except for the ego) :')  you just get a bit
>muddy.

>-milt scholl

	You have to realize that Milt comes from the "Banzai-Face-
Plant-I-Like-To-Run-Into-Trees" school of running where running down a
muddy trail is considered good fun as opposed to a great way to suffer
a severely crippling knee, ankle, arm, spleen, or face injury.  Milt is
one of those fanatic madmen that do their high altitude training by
running down Mount Everest because there is bound to be nice soft snow
at the bottom of any gorge you fall into. 

	The very language used to describe mud is enough to prove
that Milt belongs to this rare breed of maniac trail runners.  For
example, most normal people would never, never remark "The mud gave me
the perfect traction to descend in a confident and secure manner."
Instead they say things like "I was walking near mud, and slipped, and
banged my head on a rock that was hidden under the mud.  The MDs are
still pulling sticks out of my butt and they say it could take weeks
for my twisted ankle to heal."

	So while Milt is busy practicing the right way to jog down a
cliff in a thunderstorm, the sensible beginner of the variety who
would ask "how do I run downhill" is ignoring his advice (although
thanking him for offering it) knowing full well that heeding it could
result in the first trip taken to a trauma center.  In short, it is
too slippery, there are untold dangers under it and you should get
more practice before you try it.

Given with the utmost respect for Milt and his abilities and with
perhaps a thousand smilies,

Aram Adishian
adishian@dorm.rutgers.edu
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: wolf@prosun.first.gmd.de (Wolfgang Koehler)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: To wear a shirt or not?
Date: 28 Jul 92 13:10:04 GMT
Organization: GMD-FIRST, D-1000 Berlin 10

In article <1992Jul27.101434.4374@verifone.com>, ken_p1@verifone.com writes:
|> To any of you hot weather running knowledge meisters:
|> 
|> Is it better (cooler temperature-wise) to wear one of the high tech fabric
|> uppers than not to wear any shirt at all while running in the hot & humid
|> summer weather?  Do these fabrics promote evaporation and cooling better than
|> plain old exposed skin?
|> 
|> I hate wearing a shirt/singlet on top when the weather gets much above 60 and
|> it's really humid outside.  A typical 6AM temp. & humidity in Dallas is
|> 77 degrees and 80% humid.  It's not even reasonably feasible to run any other
|> time, unless you just want to put in a fast mile or less...
|> 
|> Ken Papai
|> Ken_P1@verifone.com

Unless you are a woman I'd advice to run without anything on top :-).

Seriously, I prefer to run without any shirt when its hot and never had
any problems with that.

No high-tech material can evaporate better than the pure skin.
On the other hand, its quite unpleasant  to run with an wet shirt after
a while.
I`ve realized that this sometimes caused a cold of my kindneys.

wolf


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ... always look on the bright side of life ... (Monty Python)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wolfgang Koehler                                    wolf@first.gmd.de

GMD - FIRST an der TU Berlin                   German National Research Centre 
                                                    for Computer Science
Fachbereich 20

Sekretariat FR 2/1




Newsgroups: rec.running
From: page@ficus.cs.ucla.edu (Thomas Page)
Subject: Re: southern Cal fall/winter marathons
Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 15:27:29 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.135738.27137@mic.ucla.edu>, rush@eggneb.astro.ucla.edu ()
writes:
|> In particular, I would like to know about:
|> 1. Santa Monica Marathon
	August 31st (also a half marathon)  marathon is two loops of half course.
|> 2. Orange County Marathon
|> 3. San Diego Marathon
|> 4. Long Beach Marathon
	Usually 3 weeks before the LA marathon so around first or 2nd Sunday in
	February.  Last year it was Feb 9.
|> 5. Western Hemisphere Marathon
	Last year it was Nov. 24.  This is a small marathon with a pretty flat
course.  Many people say it is a boring course.
|> 6. any others in Southern California 
	The San Francisco marathon is Aug 31, same day as Santa Monica.
Tom
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: twm3@world.std.com (Thomas W Moore)
Subject: Good Boston area running stores
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Distribution: ne
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 15:40:23 GMT

Hiya,

Does anyone know any good running stores in the Boston area.  By "good,"
I mean they have a staff which actually knows something and doesn't start
throwing shoes at you to try on by their color.  I pronate (sp?) and need
to get shoes that won't make the problem worse.  I am aware of the Nike
store in Wellseley but I would prefer a store with more than one brand :-).

And if anyone has any recommendations on a particular shoe, that would
be fine.  I am running 40 miles on a good week (and 0 miles on a bad week :-).

Please e-mail to twm3@world.std.com for most of this may not be of 
particular interest to other people.  If readers want, I will post a summary.

TIA,

-Tom


-- 
============================================================================
"There is indeed such a thing as a free lunch - it just isn't the lunch you
had in mind."  -Tom Moore twm3@world.std.com in Needham Heights, MA
From: stgprao@xing.unocal.com (Richard Ottolini)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Former Olympian Ron Daws dies at 55
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:28:38 GMT
Organization: Unocal Corporation
Originator: stgprao@xing

In article <2123@bigfoot.first.gmd.de> wolf@prosun.first.gmd.de (Wolfgang Koehler) writes:
>I always thought that a good endurance ability suggests the cardio-vascular
>system is in a good shape.

Yes.  Being in shape reduces the odds of dying from heart problems,
but does not eliminate it.  Besides, even if it didn't reduce the odds,
life is more fun and vigorous when one is in shape.
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: puckett@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (Jim Puckett)
Subject: When is Oly Mens Marathon?
Summary: subject says it pretty well, I think..
Organization: NASA/MSFC
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 16:48:12 GMT



...just trying to find out when is the men's marathon?

email, please. there are bandwidth police 8-)

just one more mile,

jim p.


-- 
Jim Puckett    NTI    puckett@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov     
Huntsville,AL (205)461-4922  
This life is a test. It is only a test. If it had been a real life, you 
would have been given instructions....
Xref: sparky rec.running:1961 sci.med:14585
From: km@speedy.cs.pitt.edu (Ken Mitchum)
Newsgroups: rec.running,sci.med
Subject: Re: Di-Methyl Glycine ?
Date: 27 Jul 92 22:43:42 GMT
Reply-To: km@cs.pitt.edu (Ken Mitchum)
Followup-To: rec.running
Organization: Computer Science Dept., University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Jul27.174423.1288@igor.tamri.com> margaret@igor.tamri.com (Margaret Kritzer) writes:
>Yesterday I went to a fairly well-stocked vitamin counter,
>wanting advice about supplements for my running program,
>as well as my life in general!  I got a pretty comprehensive
>package of vitamins, minerals, amino acids and anti-oxidants.
>Then the vitamin guru recommended doing some DMG, sublingually,
>10 minutes before a hard run.  He claimed it converts lactic
>acid into oxygen.  Sort of like recycling.  Is this true?  Sounds
>too good to be true, to me.

I have no idea what DMG is. To simplify things a bit, lactic
acid is the product of anaeorbic metabolism. Its production
is certainly increased greatly through heavy exercise, but
this is normally a temporary phenomenon: when the exercise
stops, the liver rapidly converts lactate to pyruvate,
generating bicarbonate and clearing the acidosis. It's been
awhile since I studied this, but I don't think it has changed.
Unless the person has severe liver disease, sepsis, circulatory
collapse, or other major problem interfering with the delivery
of blood to the liver, the lactic acidosis produced by exercise
should be very short lived. You can view lactic acid as a 
type of "foreign currency" that the body temporarily generates
until the balance between circulation and energy use is restored,
at which time it can be "converted" back to bicarbonate. This
takes just a few minutes.

A classic example of lactic acidosis is someone with a generalized
("grand mal") seizure. I recently saw a gentleman in the midst
of a seizure, and did a blood gas and sent off a lactic level.
The pH was 6.8, and lactate level was in the 20s (about ten
times normal). I repeated these ten minutes after the seizure,
and the pH was close to normal (7.4) and the lactic level under
10. 

I would look a little critical at something that claimed to
prophylax against lactic acid, or claimed to treat it. Although
there are some experimental treatments for lactic acidosis in
(previously) terminal conditions, I don't seen any reason to
"treat" it in an otherwise healthy person.

 -Ken Mitchum MD
 km@cs.pitt.edu
From: dmf@buengf.bu.edu (David Franklin)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: To wear a shirt or not?
Date: 28 Jul 92 19:37:24 GMT
Reply-To: dmf@buengf.bu.edu (David Franklin)
Followup-To: rec.running
Organization: College of Engineering, Boston University, Boston, MA, USA


I have been told by former coaches that running with a shirt on will decrease
the rate of water evaporation from the skin.  This in turn will decrease the
rate of dehydration.  So if you want to run in hot weather without a shirt on,
you probably should be careful to hydrate yourself frequently during the run...

Happy trails,
Dave

---B-O-S-T-O-N---U-N-I-V-E-R-S-I-T-Y-----------------------------------------
-------------------------------C-O-L-L-E-G-E---O-F---E-N-G-I-N-E-E-R-I-N-G---
From: milts@mse.cse.ogi.edu (Milt Scholl)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: Running Down Hills
Date: 24 Jul 92 15:11:18 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.40498
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute, Material Science & Engineering

In article <711952153.13160.0@glycol.ucc.andrew.cmu.edu> pv0b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Pomona Anupol Valero) writes:
>Hi there,
>
>I was wondering if anyone would be so kind to give me some tips on running
>down very steep hills.  I don't intentionally run _down_ hills, my initial
>goal was to run UP them.  Then I realized that I have to go back down them
>
>Thanks,
>Pomona Valero

try practice running down MUDDY trails - it teaches you balance, foot
placing, and anticipation of where you step next.  Besides if you
fall damage is minor (except for the ego) :')  you just get a bit
muddy.

-milt scholl
milts@mse.ogi.edu

Newsgroups: rec.running
From: debi@scrp.Stanford.EDU (Debi Hooke)
Subject: Wharf to Wharf
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: ba
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 17:26:42 GMT

Just a quick note to request that if anyone who is registered 
for the Wharf to Wharf this Sunday, the 26th, and for whatever
reason can not make it, please let me know!  I have a friend
coming into town who would really like to run this race and 
would prefer to run it registered, the shirt is really great.

So if you or someone you know can`t make it please call or mail
me, (415) 723-6463 or (415) 595-5456 (home), email debi@scrp.
Stanford.EDU

Thank you and see you Sunday!! ;-)

My apologies if this gets any further than the bay area!
From: mvm@caesun6.harris-atd.com (Matt Mahoney)
Newsgroups: rec.running
Subject: Re: How fast is fast?
Keywords: 8k
Date: 27 Jul 92 17:27:55 GMT
Reply-To: mvm@epg.harris.com (Matt Mahoney)
Distribution: usa
Organization: CAE Design Center, Harris Corp., Melbourne, Fl.

In article <1992Jul21.212518.6120@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> raymond@harp.ecn.purdue.edu (Ray Kamin) writes:

>I am considering participating in an 8K run this fall and since
>I have never run in any formal events, I am curious as to the expected
>pace.

Probably 10% under 30 minutes, 50% under 37, 90% under 48.  Winning times
might be 25-26 minutes for men, 29-32 for women.

It also depends on the race.  A few years ago, I ran the New York City
New Year's 5 miler, which starts at midnight.  Most of the 4000 runners
were in costume, such as space shuttles and giant caterpillars.  They
had water and champagne at the aid station.  My time of 37 minutes was
in the top 10%, although I did see a clown in huge plastic floppy feet
going PLOP PLOP PLOP at about a 6:00/mile pace.

--------------------------------        _\/_
Matt Mahoney, mvm@epg.harris.com       |(TV)|  Drug of the Nation
#include <disclaimer.h>                |____|
Xref: sparky rec.running:2003 rec.sport.olympics:1491
Newsgroups: rec.running,rec.sport.olympics
Subject: Re: Olympic Track and Field Predictions
From: mc21@ellis.uchicago.edu (Moo-Town Snacker)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 14:45:35 GMT
Reply-To: mc21@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations

In article <1992Jul29.043112.28649@math.ucla.edu> reider@redwood.math.ucla.edu (Marc Reider) writes:
>800m: Johnny Gray, Jose Luiz Barbosa, Mark Everett  1:43.2
       ~~~~~~~~~~~
>  This pick is with the heart.  If Johnny just goes to the front and
>runs hard I think he can do it.  
 
Hooray! Hooray! Hooray! I'm with you all the way on this one, Marc.

Also, even with the track not being the greatest I am hoping for a
WR from Birir in the ST. 

Am I alone in strongly embracing that outside chance of a medal for 
Spence in the marathon? 





-- 
Martin Coleman (mc21@ellis.uchicago.edu)		           Bukkm Royale
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
My teeth are sharp. 					      I eat popularity.
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Xref: sparky rec.running:2018 rec.sport.olympics:1719
From: jpope@axion.bt.co.uk (john pope)
Newsgroups: rec.running,rec.sport.olympics
Subject: 3 Britons fail dope tests, Sprinter sent home
Keywords: Olympics, Steroids
Date: 30 Jul 92 12:25:07 GMT
Reply-To: jpope@axion.bt.co.uk (john pope)
Organization: BT Labs


Linford Christie's training partner, Jason Livingstone, age 22, has been caught taking anabolic steroids and has been sent home from Barcelona. Two British weight-lifters have been sent home too.

They all failed random dope tests taken in the UK by the British Olympic Committee on 15 July. There are some questions as to why the BOC took so long to announce the results since the results of a test are usually known within 48 hours.

Jason is known as little Ben because of likeness to Ben Johnson who is also his idol!

Jason is the reigning indoor European Champion over 60m.

Wouldn't it be ironic if the only person we could be certain of being `clean' in the 100m was Ben Johnson :-(




JP

jpope@axion.bt.co.uk 	Software Technology, Requirements, G24 SSTF
UK +44 473 646651	BT Labs,Martlesham Heath, IPSWICH IP5 7RE, UK 
		
Newsgroups: rec.running
From: trector@heineken.tuc.nrao.edu (Travis Rector)
Subject: Re: How fast is fast?
Keywords: 8k
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Tucson Az.
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:01:36 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.212518.6120@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> raymond@harp.ecn.purdue.edu (Ray Kamin) writes:
>
>I am considering participating in an 8K run this fall and since
>I have never run in any formal events, I am curious as to the expected
>pace.  That is, in a typical (?) 8K fun run, how much time will
>it take the fastest 10% of the field.  How about the top half?
>How long until 90% of the field complete the run?

An 8K is just short of five miles.  As far as the times go, it depends on the
competition of course.  I don't know what the running scene at Purdue is, but
if it's competitive, look for the top 10% in under 30 minutes.  Figure about
an hour for all the runners to come in.  If it's a fun run, with no prizes for
place, expect slower times.

"Hand of Doom"
Xref: sparky rec.running:2034 rec.sport.olympics:1975
From: kfansah@axion.bt.co.uk (Kwadwo Frimpong-Ansah)
Newsgroups: rec.running,rec.sport.olympics
Subject: Re: Olympic Track and Field Predictions
Date: 31 Jul 92 07:53:57 GMT
Reply-To: kfansah@axion.bt.co.uk (Kwadwo Frimpong-Ansah)
Organization: British Telecom Research Labs


>100m :  Leroy Burrell, Frank Fredericks, Dennis Mitchell. 
9.98
> If they ran this 5 times they could get 5 winners.  I think
the race
> will be as competitive as Tokyo, just a bit slower.

As Track and Field starts tomorrow and best of all the speed
men's and women's events (100m), its time to get serious.
I would add Linford Christie, Olapade Adeniken and Ray
Stewart to your list of possible winners.

The gold medal will be won by either Linford, Leroy or
Dennis.  Linford is in the best form of his life and stand a
good chance of winning,  He finishes a lot stronger than he
did in the past and this would help him win if he was level
with Dennis or ahead in the last 10m.

Leroy has the best chance of winning.  What he needs is to
regain his 1990 finishing strength and improve on his start.
Leroy at his best should be at least 0.05 sec ahead of the
rest.

Dennis will win if he can get a great start and build a 1
metre lead in the first 40 metres and then hang on.

If conditions are good (the track looks fast and it is hot
out there) and the wind is behind the winner will run 9.90.

The womens 100m will also be interesting.  The winner will
come out of the group of: Merlene Ottey, Irina Privalova,
Gail Devers and Gwen Torrence.  If it were not for her 'big
competition nerves', Merlene would be a run away winner. If
she is not ahead by the 50 metre point, I don't see her
winning the race.  Irina, also, has never produced the goods
in big meetings so I don't see her winning.

Gail will get the best start and if she can hold the lead she
builds in the first 30 metres, she can win the race, but I'm
not sure if she is capable of the 10.70 that will be needed
to win.

Gwen, from her past record is my choice to win.  She is a big
time competitor and has been in great form this year.  She
has even run the second fastest 400 metres of the year which
shows her finishing strength.  If she is level with any one
at 60 metres then she will win easily.

We've got some great races coming

Kwadwo