From: Diane Bailey <dbailey@cix.clink.co.uk>
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Subject: Re: "Our Daughters Must Die" - Infanticide in India
Date: 10 Sep 1992 14:52:18 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
Reply-To: dbailey@cix.clink.co.uk
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
Originator: muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu

Although grateful for any responses on this subject I have to
take issue with the first two.

Firstly, I tried to make clear in my recent posting that I was not
blaming or exonerating any religion with regard to these
problems.  I made no attack on any religion.  All such problems
seem to get discussed in religious terms in some Indian circles but
this is not a religious question.  No religion sanctifies murder
or gynocide.  While condemnations from religions would be helpful,
the solutions have to be social, legal and political.

To Sayan Bhattacharyya I have to respond more fully. Firstly
by saying that such problems are certainly Women's Issues.  In
itself that is enough.  They are economic, judicial, human rights
and other types of issue too, but that does not justify saying
they are "not just women's issues".

>It is interesting that you yourself noted that women's
>organizations have so far been totally unable to tackle the
>problem. Doesn't this point to the fact that the malaise lies at
>some other level...

No.  It indicates that the women's organisations are not yet
sufficiently powerful.  And I did not say that they had been
_totally_ unable to tackle the problem.

>It is interesting to note that the two states in India where the
>situation of women is better compared to the rest of the country
>(although still by no means perfect) are West Bengal and Kerala,
>which also have the best record in the country in land reform and
>agrarian reform. Conversely, the states where the situation is
>worst (e.g. Rajasthan) are also among the most feudal and have
>seen little or no agrarian reforms. I think that this is more
>than a coincidence, and I think that this is evidence that the
>problems you mention in your article have more deep-rooted
>economic causes than you suspect.

I completely disagree.  The elimination of female offspring
before birth is most prevalent amongst the more affluent in the
cities.  I have unfortunately not yet seen any evidence that
education eliminates the problem.  I clearly said that dowries
and inheritance are the root of the problem.  Since they are
financial and property settlements I do believe that is enough
acknowledgment of the economic roots.  Although some forms of
land reform may improve some inheritance issues in rural areas,
the problem is clearly to stop gynocide wherever it is practised.
I do not see it as appropriate to suggest that broader economic
problems be solved in order to prevent murder.  I'm sure there
are economic issues behind many murders in my own country, but no
one suggests that eliminating the economic issues is the key to
stopping murder. There are much poorer countries than India where
females are not routinely murdered without fear of investigation.

Your information regarding state variations also seems at
variance with the official figures.  Although Kerala does seem to
be somewhat free of the problem West Bengal does not:

SEX RATIO IN STATES AND UNION TERRITORIES OF INDIA
Females to 1000 Males

State/Union Territory   Total    Rural    Urban
India as whole          933      951      878
Andhra Pradesh          975      984      948
Assam                   901      917      768
Bihar                   946      963      832
Gujarat                 942      959      905
Haryana                 870      876      859
Himachal Pradesh        973      989      795
Jammu & Kashmir         892      897      875
Karnataka               963      978      926
Kerala                 1032     1034     1021
Madhya Pradesh          941      956      884
Maharashtra             937      987      850
Manipur                 971      971      969
Meghalaya               954      965      904
Nagaland                863      899      688
Orissa                  981      999      959
Punjab                  879      884      865
Rajasthan               919      930      877
Sikkim                  835      864      697
Tamil Nadu              977      987      956
Tripura                 946      945      957
Uttar Pradesh           885      893      846
West Bengal             911      947      819
Andaman & Nicobar Is    760      774      720
Arunachal Pradesh       862      881      629
Chandigarh              769      688      775
Dadra & Nagar Haveli    974      981      884
Delhi                   808      810      808
Goa, Daman & Diu        981     1013      919
Lakshwadeep             975      986      963
Mizoram                 919      928      893
Pondicherry             985      977      992
Source: Health Statistics of India, 1985, Government of India,
1986

The overall figures have got worse for most of this century:

SEX RATIO IN INDIA
Females per 1000 males
1901    972
1911    964
1921    955
1931    950
1941    945
1951    946
1961    941
1971    930
1981    933
Source: Registrar General of India, reported in Health Statistics
of India, 1985, Government of India.

>Change can only come from within, not from without.

Again I must disagree.  Apart from the USA, which has pretty much
insulated itelf from overseas pressure, I think many social
advances in most countries are largely triggered from outside. In
most countries governments establish balances that neutralise
social pressure in order to create stability.  They cannot do
that with regard to outside pressure and it is the leaders, the
official agents and a country's most important business people
that not only travel most but are also most visible.  Such
representatives often rely upon moral leverage, or respectability
in their overseas dealings.  Thus, foreign pressure can often be
far more effective, and often more constructive, and less
dangerous for all concerned, than internal pressure.  In evidence
I point to the campaigns of Amnesty International.

Now, here is a practical and positive question.  Does anyone know
anything of the laws against dowries and why they have not been
effective?

Diane
dbailey@cix.compulink.co.uk


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