Newsgroups: talk.abortion
Subject: Re: Sci. POV 1: Life begins at birth
From: mgaylord@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Gaylord)
Date: 14 Apr 92 18:13:17 GMT
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY

(stuff deleated to save space)

>
>It would appear that the error in understanding is yours.  His statement
>that "The baby ends up with the belly button" says nothing about the
>condition of the woman's womb after childbirth, and thus is pointless.
>
>>Its reasonable acurate statements like this founded in science that make
>>his "one liners" worthwhile.  
>
>His one-liner niether said nor proved anything.  It was worthless except
>for the "cutesy" factor.
>
>>Also if he can express his self in one line
>>and does instead of caring on and on, more power to him.  Do you like endless
>>BS?  
>
>Yes, I like pointing out BS.  This can be trivially proven by the fact 
>that I am replying to your post.

>
inting or generating?


>
>>>If all the things required for the fetus to grow and flourish are
>>>"part of the fetus", as you claim, then why is a host necessary
>>>at all?
>
>>He never said everything.  
>
>It was clearly implied.

The problem with implied is it allows you to read what you want and not what 
said.  
>
>>A host is needed to suply nurishment and
>>a suitable environment for survival, sort of like you and the ecoli
>>in your gut (if the preseeding statement doesn't make sence to you
>>go ask a biologist for help, you need it).
>
>It would only have made sense if you had used the proper name for
>a particular intestinal organism, which would be "E. coli".  Just
>as a hint, it's two words and the period is there because E. is an
>abbreviation.

OK, E. coli, now that it makes sense, the relationship is understood.
>
>>>If all these things were "part of the fetus", then what causes 
>>>the 2-3 weeks of bleeding that a mother experiences post-partum?
>>>(And why do I suspect that you had no idea that maternal blood
>>>loss is severe during and for an extended time after delivery?)
>
>>Because these implant into the Utrian wall, and the transfer is across the
>>permeable wall,  this is why they have separate blood suplies (often 
>>different types) and yet can get the nutrients needed.
>
>Perhaps you meant "uterine wall".  Did it perhaps occur to you that
>the tearing of the uterine wall is equivalent to the baby's "belly
>button"?

Does it occur to you that regardless of the bleeding the blood suplies are
still separate, which is the point here, besides the umbilical cord doesn't
atach directly to the uterous but to the placenta.    

>
>>>Where does the fetus obtain the raw materials to make all these
>>>organs "itself"?
>
>>See Above.
>
>Everything that makes up any part of the fetus comes from the mother's
>body, and yet you maintain that they are "separate".  Is this accurate?

including the y chromosome?  (yes it is accurate, in a strict sense)

>
>>>If the fetus carries "its own" blood supply, as is often asserted,
>>>then why does a woman carry nearly an extra quart of blood ("her
>>>own" blood) during pregnancy?
>
>>Just a guess, 
>
>So indeed, while you were flaming me for MY ignorance, you don't know
>the answer yourself.

There is a difference stating when your guessing vs stating ignorance as fact,
If you said I don't know x, please enlighten me you wouldn't have been flamed.
Much of what you posted was wrong, I am sorry that my reply was in such a
harsh tone, for that I apologize.

>
>>>Really, Mahony, please attempt to say something worth listening
>>>to next time.
>
>>Do you mean something you can understand without having to learn anything
>
>On the contrary, I understood the pointlessness of his statement the
>moment I heard it.  This does not appear to be true for you.

because I see his point.
>
>>or say something that you want to hear, that may prove contrary to your
>>misguided beliefs?  
>
>Please enumerate what my "misguided beliefs" are.
>
>>What he said was worthwhile unlike your uninfomed drivel.
>
>From the person who just said he was guessing, we have yet another
>allegation that I am uninformed.

Yes i was guessing on one point in an atempt to answere a question, but since
I stated I was guesing it didn't come off as a fact.  The way you word this
anyone who guesses is always to be concidered wrong, even on other topics.
I wish I knew the difinitive answeres for all questions, I don't, but I don't
try to apear all knowing.

>
>So tell me Gaylord, have you ever had a child?

yes, I have fathered a child.

>
>>>>Brendan Mahony
>>>
>>>                -rocker
>
>                           -rocker

     -Mark
Newsgroups: talk.abortion