HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: potekhin@vxcrna.cern.ch (POTEKHINE,MAXI./PPE)
Subject: Re: SpaceGame routines (was Re: IBM Based Freakouts not Justified.)
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 22:11:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.101432.16647@jyu.fi>, ap@jyu.fi (Patric Aalto) writes...

>I would want the enemy ships to be aware of each other, so that they could
>work as a group instead of separate (and stupid, at that) single ships.
>But how? I have planned to let the player control the other friendly ships
>by sending them messages ('form on my wing', 'attack my target', etc. like
>in Wing Commander II from Origin). But how would I get the enemy ships
>work like that? There should be an 'enemy leader' that can send messages
>to other enemy ships, but I have felt the algorithms to make the enemy
>leader sufficiently 'intelligent' are beyond my grasp, at least at the
>moment.

Hey, you can try, say, 10 different algorithms - just for the fun of it.
I think, though, that the most fancy (and extremely inteligent) way of doing
this would be writing a simulation of a Neural Network (NNW).
Great way to educate yourself and make your 'enemy' incredibly smart !
The NNW would train pretty soon (I mean in the context of the application),
and it also would be fun to see it getting smarter ...



                     **********************************************************
Maxim Potekhin,      *     The lizards on a certain hillside have reported    *
Columbia U / CERN    *     that the stones expect God to manifest Himself     *
(212) 222 33 29 NYC  *     among them in the form of a stone                  *
      767 84 34 GVA  **********************************************************
From: checker@acf5.NYU.EDU (checker)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Splitting the Group
Date: 17 Aug 92 02:48:01 GMT
Organization: New York University

I just proposed alt.graphics.vga-programming over in alt.config. 
Everyone with an opinion should go over there and weigh in.

Chris
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: phillips@swanee.ee.uwa.oz.au (Christopher Phillips)
Subject: Re: Bitmaps
Organization: Elec Eng, Univ of Western Australia
Date: 14 Aug 92 07:17:13 GMT

galt%peruvian.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Greg Alt) writes:
>It sounds like you are claiming that it is possible to do real-time 
>sprite rotations without multiplies.

>I don't believe that is possible on a PC (even a 386), but I would love
>to be proven wrong.

processor is irrelevant for this kind of issue.  Principles apply to any
TM equivalent.

No multiplies needed at all.  What you do, is maintain position in source
image as you step through the destination pixels, by adding dx and dy to
your position in the source image.  Hence, only two fixed point
additions and one array access per pixel.

win awards!

--
Christopher Jam	__________________________________________________
'Another day, another try.  But remember, SHOOT OR DIE!' -turrican
phillips@swanee.ee.uwa.oz.au		c64 forever!!!!
------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: ap@jyu.fi (Patric Aalto)
Subject: Re: VGA, Retraces, and DMA
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 09:01:17 GMT

pcellik@axion.bt.co.uk (Peter SPHINX Cellik) writes:
>exuhag@exu.ericsson.se (James Hague) writes:
>|> Daniel Reznick writes:
>|> >
>|> >But, this is all necessary in order to write games.
>|> >In fact, this is the hardest part of writing a game.  Once all of the
>|> >low level graphics work is done, the logical parts that link it together
>|> >is almost trivial by comparison
>|> 
>|> You're kidding, right?  
>|> 
>
>Why should he be.  What is more difficult than creating the low
>level graphics routines?  Movement?  Rotation?

Well, I for one have been postponing the actual gaming routines in my game
for about two years now, as they REALLY are much harder to code than the
low-level graphics, movement, rotation etc. routines. I am talking about
the artificial intelligence routines of the enemy ships, the goal of my
game, etc. I am having big problems in coding the routines to handle these
things, whereas the polygon filling etc. routines were just solutions to
very well-defined problems, and therefore quite easy to do. I think this
is what James Hague meant, and I must say I agree with him in this.

>The disscussions here are very important to define the limits
>on which a game can be designed.  Once you have defined those
>limits, you can then apply your pretty algorithms to make the 
>game, there is no use designing a game if you do not know what
>speed constraints you have.

Well, certainly this is true also. I have nothing against discussion 
about PC-specific things like VGA vertical retrace interrupt (which I
have disabled on purpose on my VGA card, by the way, so I hope no-one
makes a program that requires it, but this is just my opinion) etc,
but I also understand that a lot of people do not have PC-compatible
hardware, and therefore threads like these should probably be carried
on in the PC-specific groups.

Please, let's not let the flame war escalate here.

Patrick Aalto
ap@tukki.jyu.fi
From: pcellik@axion.bt.co.uk (Peter SPHINX Cellik)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: inappropriate postings [was Re: VGA, Retraces, and DMA]
Date: 13 Aug 92 08:22:04 GMT
Reply-To: pcellik@axion.bt.co.uk (Peter SPHINX Cellik)
Organization: British Telecom Research Labs


In article <1992Aug12.173829.21446@dg-rtp.dg.com>, brownp@viper.rtp.dg.com (Peter Brown) writes:
|> Or do people really think we should fragment the group
|> and form rec.games.programmer.pc?
|> 

Not a bad plan.  Supporters?


====================================================
=== Kill others only if you wish to be killed.   ===
===                                       SPHINX ===   
====================================================
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Protracker Playing Source (PPS110.LZH)
From: Hamish_Hubbard@kcbbs.gen.nz (Hamish Hubbard)
Date: 20 Aug 92 20:55:14 GMT
Organization: Kappa Crucis Unix BBS, Auckland, New Zealand

I tried looking on wuarchive under /pub/MSDOS_UPLOADS (I believe that 
was the specified directory) but the Protracker Playing Source seems 
to have moved. Problem is, I dont know where to as I am using DEC ftp-by-mail
(I have no other ftp access). So, could someone either e-mail it to 
me (please confirm beforehand as I dont really need 14 copies :), or 
tell me what directory it is in now? Thanks.

Just to make the non-IBM people with their kill files happy:

VGA PC 386 486 texture mapping DMA IRQ Interrupt Mode X IBM source code

:)

--
Hamish_Hubbard@kcbbs.gen.nz                 Auckland, New Zealand

Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: VGA PC: Multiple pages in Mode 13h?
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:29:15 GMT
X-Posted-From: connection.prospect.com
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

then@vipunen.hut.fi (Tomi  H Engdahl) writes:
>
>[multiple pages in 13h]
>
>You can't do it in stadard Mode 13h. You have to go to tweaked VGA modes
>to do multiple pages. Look for Mode X (320x240 with 256 colors) from
>Dr Dobb's journal. Another possibility is Mode Y, which was explained
>in this newsgroup some time ago.
>

This is damn unfortunate.  Standard VGA has what, 256K of video RAM, but
there's no way to access beyond the first 64K in Chain4 mode?!  That
really sucks.  I found (in the Ferraro book) a way to do it with the
ET4000, and I'm sure it's possible with all the other major SVGA chipsets,
but I want to be sure my program works on *all* VGA cards.

In light of all this, I'd like to use Mode Y.  Could someone please repost
the SetMode code for Mode Y?  Thanks in advance.

>
>Tomi.Engdahl@hut.fi            "Don't force it; get a larger hammer"
>
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: cyberman@toz.buffalo.ny.us (Cyberman)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: splitting the group
Date: 21 Aug 92 16:31:24 GMT
X-Maildoor: WaflineMail 1.00r


     -=> Bjoern Stabell spoke of "Re: splitting the group" <=-
    To All at 08-20-92  18:34
 BS> Pure speculation.  I know one thing about the Amiga - there are ALOT
 BS> of programmers making games for it, so I don't think that's the reason.
 BS> Also, me thinks there is a majority of intelligent programmers on the
 BS> net, hence there is a minority of PC programmers. :)
 Me thinks you are being selfish.  You have no regard for anyone
 else's welfare but your own.  AND you are being extremely rude.
 I may have to put you in my TWIT file.

 BS> Seriously, even if there WERE a majority of PC owners (and I don't
 BS> think there is considering what machines have Internet access) in this
 BS> doomed net-world, would that give them the right to post PC related
 BS> issues on any group?  Nah, you can do better than that.
 Please explain to me in logical terms what you mean?  Do you
 expect poeple to be able to discuse comnputer controled players
 all the time?  Perhaps some poeple have no problem with
 programing the game part but have difficulting implementing the
 interface.  No one is perfect.  This group is for poeple who
 write games.  Not for your own personal use.

 BS> I can't see why you're so stubborn, you deserve your own group - now
 BS> get it!  And "it's too much work" isn't exactly a very good excuse,
 BS> especially since the newsgroup wouldn't need to be moderated (it
 BS> wouldn't be a good excuse anyhow :)
Ditto you are adament at "eleminating" PC programers.  This
behavior is no better than Hitler eliminating Jews.

 BS> Just trying to keep my KILL file empty and still get what I would
 BS> expect from my newsgroups,
What?  Gee your making it hard for me to keep my TWIT file empty.
It goes both ways.

        Stephen Cyberman@Toz.Buffalo.NY.US
        Scripted at Fri  08-21-1992  11:33:09

... A thousand mile journey begins with a single step
--- Blue Wave/QWK v2.10
    
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: dxc0904@ultb.isc.rit.edu (D.X. Chin )
Subject: PICTURES
Summary: loading them.
Originator: dxc0904@ultb
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Distribution: all
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 11:41:01 GMT

Hello all again,
	Thanks for all those who replied to my graphics mode problems,
but I still need to know one thing, Does anyone know what I need to do
if I want to encode a routine that loads any sort of picture into a
program and display it on the screen? 256 color or 16, I would definatly
like to know how to do it for a 256 color image, but 16 will do...

thanks in advance.

- Dower
- dxc0904@ultb.rit.edu

Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: pychen@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Peter Y. Chen)
Subject: Re: Computer-Controlled Players - simulated evolution
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 07:12:00 GMT

In article <BswJE8.261@ais.org> draper@ais.org (Patrick Draper) writes:
>Has anyone tried using genetic algorithms for CCP's?
		        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>

Is this like simulated evolution algorithm?  Please enlighten, I would
like to know more about this.

While we're on the subject of simulated XXX, here's a thought: how about
using simulated annealing as computer's AI?  ie, assign objects (or
objectives) with certain values, and use combinations of these values
to determine probability to move to next configuration.

-- Peter

Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: toms@pdxgp1.intel.com (Tom Shott)
Subject: Re: Splitting the Group
Organization: /fs3/l/toms/.organization
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 07:05:28 GMT


It's not that I don't want to read posts from PC people. I just don't want
to read the very specific posts on VGA programming. I enjoy the discussions
of computer oponents. Those of use on UNIX and X just don't care for the in
PC depth graphics discussions.

The UNIX/X graphics discussions tend to have their own news groups. That's
great. There doesn't seem to be a pc/vga programming news group for the low
level tech details.

The idea of making sure VGA type posts have VGA in the header works fine.
My kill fill zaps everything w/ VGA/PC/IBM in the header. It's all those
mode y posts that went by......

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom Shott  INTeL, JF1-19, 5200 Elam Young Pkwy, 		(503) 696-4520
	   Hillsboro, OR 97124  		   	 toms@ichips.intel.com
 INTeL.. We brought you segments,432,EPROM,CISC,RISC,VLIW,EISA,DRAM,FLASH
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: goss@micor.ocunix.on.ca (Timothy D. Goss)
Subject: Re: Splitting the group
Organization: M.B. Cormier INC., Orleans (Ont)
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 03:34:44 GMT

>Seriously, even if there WERE a majority of PC owners (and I don't think
>there is considering what machines have Internet access) in this doomed
>net-world, would that give them the right to post PC related issues on any
>group?  Nah, you can do better than that.

This HAS to be the STUPIDEST argument ever to be flaunted in public.  If 
the types of machines with net access was any indication of programmers
preferences then Amiga/Apple/Commodore wouldn't even be a drop in the piss
pot.  University mainframes and minis are the majority of net users and 68xxx
machines don't qualify, neither do 80x86's.  

>I can't see why you're so stubborn, you deserve your own group - now get
>it!  And "it's too much work" isn't exactly a very good excuse, especially
>since the newsgroup wouldn't need to be moderated (it wouldn't be a good
>excuse anyhow :)

We have our own group and so do you, rec.games.programmer.  Let's get on with
it.  Every year or so this discussion pops up, deal with it folks, it isn't 
going away because some don't like it.  Because some people ask hardware
specific questions doesn't mean that more sensible discussions must stop
while we watch the napalm fly.  Press K when you read an offensive post (if
this doesn't do anything then get a real news reader, it kills the current
thread and skips to the next one, no bitching, no problem).

Now.  Would anyone like to discuss some of the primitives necessary to make
a really useful genetic algorithm?  I can't see how a 'good' critter can
evolve without some powerful primitives to draw upon.  Any ideas? 
 
 +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
 |         _   /|                                                             |
 |         \'o.O'	    We the unwilling, led by the unknowning,          |
 |         =(___)=          are doing the impossible for the ungrateful.      |
 |            U             We have done so much, for so long, with so little |
 |     Timothy D. Goss      we are now qualified to do anything with nothing. |
 | goss@micor.ocunix.on.ca                                                    |
 +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
y


Just trying to keep my KILL file empty and still get what I would expect
from my newsgroups,
-- 
                                                  Bjoern Stabell
                                                  University of Tromsoe
                                                  (+47) 83 44 053 / 83 75 164
                                                  bjoerns@staff.cs.uit.no
From: n9046319@rowlf.cc.wwu.edu (Jeremy Corley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: VGA, Retraces, and DMA
Date: 15 Aug 92 20:33:37 GMT
Article-I.D.: rowlf.n9046319.713910817
Organization: Western Washington University

ron@zooid.guild.org (Secret Mud) writes:

>From: exuhag@exu.ericsson.se (James Hague)
>>
>>[I'm glad somebody agrees with me about Wolfenstein 3-D. I
>>have come to the conclusion that it's a computer junkie's game:  if
>>you aren't knowledgable enough to realize that the graphics are
>>impressive then you probably won't enjoy playing.]
>>
>>--
>>James Hague   
>>exuhag@exu.ericsson.se

>Wolfenstein 3D is one of the best examples of the fact that while some people
>have remarkable skill at writing code and doing graphics, the skill of writing
>a game is something else that they don't always have.

>A wonderful bit of programming, wrapped around a very simple game--lifted from
>the original.

> - Ron Sharp.

	I hole-heartedly agree.  I have an internship at a place that writes video
games and we review _lots_ of games to keep up to date. We coders we quite impressed
with this game.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
"Senator Kennedy, What are you going to do about the abortion bill?"
"Pay it, I guess."
				J. Corley
			n9046319@henson.cc.wwu.edu
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ron@zooid.guild.org (Secret Mud)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Re: Splitting the Group
Date: 19 Aug 92 12:41:14 GMT

From: roarf@stud.cs.uit.no (Roar Foshaug)
>In article <714144149.21073@zooid.guild.org>, ron@zooid.guild.org (Secret Mud) writes:
>|> If going to the trouble of creating a group for x86/MSDOS/VGA nitty-gritty
>|> games programmers, why not go whole-hog?  Why limit it to VGA?
>|> 
>|> How about a news group for VGA, Sound Blasters, reading joystick ports, and
>|> all the other low level things required to write a game for clones?  I find
>|> that that the constant fanning out of groups frequently dilutes the
>|> information by making it necessary to subscribe to a number of groups to catch
>|> the tidbits as they float past.
>|> 
>|>  - Ron Sharp.
>
>
>   alt.msdos.programmer ?

Then all the gaming messages with be buried in the general msdos traffic.  And
surges in the gaming traffic will probably generate requests to start another
group...
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: bradleyt@caesar.ucs.indiana.edu (T.C. Bradley)
Subject: Re: VGA PC: Multiple pages in Mode 13h?
Summary: vga modex problem on oak tech
Keywords: vga, modex, oak technologies
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:33:05 GMT

In article <THEN.92Aug18200225@vipunen.hut.fi> then@vipunen.hut.fi (Tomi  H Engdahl) writes:
>In article <1992Aug17.173418.17990@ctr.columbia.edu> jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>
>>Hello.  I'm very new to PC programming, and I'm wondering if it's possible
>>to have multiple pages in Mode 13h in a way that works on all VGA's.  I can
>>see how I can start the display at any address, but I can't see a way of
>>writing to a different page in Chain4 mode.  Since the lowest two address
>
>You can't do it in stadard Mode 13h. You have to go to tweaked VGA modes
>to do multiple pages. Look for Mode X (320x240 with 256 colors) from
>Dr Dobb's journal. Another possibility is Mode Y, which was explained
>in this newsgroup some time ago.
>

In a related query, has anyone experienced any problems with mode X on
Oak Technologies VGA card?  I have retrieved, assembled/compiled
Abrash's mode X examples, and while these examples work flawlessly on
a Trident SVGA at work, at home on an Oak Technologies card, they will
not successfully enter mode X.

I don't have access to any back issues of DDJ to check on the text of
Abrash's articles.  Is a 256K VGA card enough to tweak into mode X?  
Thanks for any info.  Email if you feel this is too basic for the
bandwidth :).


Still a novice,
T.C.

>
>--
>
>Tomi.Engdahl@hut.fi            "Don't force it; get a larger hammer"
>then@vipunen.hut.fi                        


-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
		T.C. Bradley,  Network Operations Center
	   University Computing Services, Indiana University
bradleyt@caesar.ucs.indiana.edu  => I don't need a life.  I have Star Trek. <=
From: mkudzin@csws5.ic.sunysb.edu (Matthew A Kudzin)
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
Subject: Ideas on a new newsgroup
Date: 15 Aug 92 00:17:32 GMT
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Originator: mkudzin@csws5.ic.sunysb.edu

Let me say that I support the creation of a separate newsgroup dedicated to 
graphics programming (maybe comp.sys.ibm.pc.graphics).  I have been reading 
this newsgroup for several years and have learned a LOT about graphics 
programming through it.  I am quite gratefull to everybody who has helped me.
However, over the years, IBM graphics hardware programming has been a subject
that CONSISTANTLY generates a lot of traffic.  I support the formation of a 
new newsgroup not because I want to get rid of the subject, but because it
has enough interest to DESERVE its own newsgroup.

Yes, graphics programming is an issue in computer grame programming.  However,
graphics programming is independent of game design.  If there were only a 
handfull of articles on the subject, I would not suggest a new newsgroup.  
Considering, however, how popular a topic it is, I cannot see any reason not
to give it its own newsgroup.

WE ARE NOT TRYING TO GET RID OF GRAPHICS PROGRAMMING ISSUES!  I like the
discussions on tweaking VGA performance, and would continue to read both
Rec.games.programmer AND the new newsgroup.  Some people seem to think that we
are trying to punish them by giving them a separate news group.  Not at all.
It's quite the opposite, in fact.  I divide my harddisk into subdirectories so
as to organize my files into meaningfull divisions.  Just because I keep my
WordPerfect files separate from my Quattro Pro files doesn't mean I think any
less of Quattro Pro.  Similarly, the purpose of separate newsgroups is to 
organize threads into meaningfull divisions.  Quite simply, there is enough
interest in graphics programming to justify a new newsgroup.

Sorry to waste space on Rec.games.programmer on something that has little to do
with game programming.

Matthew Kudzin
mkudzin@ic.sunysb.edu
kudzin@nuclear.physics.sunysb.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer
From: msmith%peruvian.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Matthew Smith)
Subject: Re: VGA memory address
Date: 23 Aug 92 10:21:12 MDT
Organization: University of Utah CS Dept

In article <92234.142558KSADEGH@auvm.american.edu> Kayvon Z. Sadeghi <KSADEGH@auvm.american.edu> writes:
>hi out there,
>
>I am trying to write a program that reads the screen buffer and changes
>the contants. It works with monochrome display machines as I use the
>adress 0xB000; but when it comes to VGA or any other monitor, it gives me
>some trouble. I am using the address 0xB800, I think thats the right one
>as I have checked it in many ways.
>BTW, I am using C, if that matters.
>
>Can anyone give me a hint?
>
>
>thanks alot
>k1
>---
>------------------------------------------------------------
>KAYVON Z. SADEGHI                  K.SADEGHI@IEEE.ORG
>VOICE: 202/244-0789
>
>
The question then is, what problems are you having with the color modes?  
They're pretty much just as stright forward as the monochrome modes (except for
the address, as you already know).



Matt Smith
msmith@peruvian.utah.edu
Student - University of Utah Department of Computer Science
Newsgroups: rec.games.programmer