HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: STS-1 DISASTER/COVERUPy
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:22:52 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <1993Jan5.234659.7819@ee.ubc.ca> davem@ee.ubc.ca (Dave Michelson) writes:
>>Plus the 747 airframe, crew, and modifications.  One could not expect
>>the carrier aircraft to survive a launch of orbiter from its back.
>
>Even the X-15 didn't light its engine until *after* separation from the
>carrier aircraft.      

There are missiles which fly off their launch rails under power, rather
than delaying ignition until after separation.  Admittedly, a delay is
usually considered safer.
-- 
"God willing... we shall return."       | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
       -Gene Cernan, the Moon, Dec 1972 |  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
From: Chris.Moss@f161.n207.z1.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Re: "moonraker" -- fact o
X-Sender: newtout 0.06 Jan  3 1993
Date: 03 Jan 93  14:46:00

Well, According to the beliefs of "MANY" People, we are in a space wars
attitude, the who is better then who and Quailty vs. Quanity, Well from what I 
can see, You "WILL NEVER" know the hammer is dropped and or when you will be
"Microwaved"!.. Just do as you have been and make your like a productive one, 
remember the average man's life sapn is only to (70) years!


                                          Chris

--- DB 1.39/004571
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle,alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc
From: dmelen@esther.la.asu.edu (Dave Melendrez)
Subject: Re: STS-1 Disaster -- follow-up #2
Organization: Mars Observer TES Project, ASU, Tempe AZ
	<72669@cup.portal.com> <1icf2iINN2kv@nic.umass.edu>
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:19:47 GMT

In article <1icf2iINN2kv@nic.umass.edu> padgett@inyo.caltech.edu (Deborah Padgett) writes:

>   Question - where did the Moonraker shuttle get the fuel to fire its
>  main engines while on board the 747? This has bothered me for years...
>  :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) ;-)

Extra tank in the cargo bay??
Maybe we should ask Derek Meddings et al. (SFX group).

______________________________ 
                              _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/_/_/_/_/  _/_/_/  _/_/_/   _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ Arizona State University
   _/      _/      _/       _/_/_/_/_/   Mars Observer Spaceflight Facility
  _/      _/_/_/  _/_/_/   _/ Thermal Emission Spectrometer Project Office
 _/      _/          _/   _/_/_/_/_/               dmelen@evie.la.asu.edu
_/      _/_/_/  _/_/_/   _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/         >Dave Melendrez< 
_______________________ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
From: cpatters@ub.d.umn.edu (Granma)
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Re: Launch views, Tiles & New book on STS
Date: 8 Jan 1993 13:11:30 -0600
Organization: University of Minnesota, Duluth
NNTP-Posting-Host: ub.d.umn.edu

In article <1993Jan6.122446.4754@titan.ksc.nasa.gov> hollis@titan.ksc.nasa.gov writes:

>I bought the book for myself as a Christmas present and am really
>thrilled by it, finally a book on the shuttle system not written by
>NASA or Rockwell which realistically details it's history,
>capabilities, shortcomings, and design.  As an engineer at the cape
>working on the shuttle it is a very welcome find.  I was so tired
>of those glossy, canned treatments I seen before in many colorful
>but vague coffee-table type books.
>
Question:  Some years ago, a popular car magazine (Car & Driver?)
did a "road test" on the RSS.  (ok, it might not have been the
RSS, but from reading this, my civilian mind figured the RSS might
just be the "thaang" in question! :-)  The article was really very
funny.  If anyone out there in net land knows the name of the 
magazine and the date, please email me.

Thanks!

Granma
*-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-*
|          "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"	      |
*-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-*
From: Sean.Hayden@f6.n3651.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Sean Hayden)
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Sci.Space.Slaw.Shuttle
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 93 09:45:12 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3651/6

Just to add a little comment to the already incomprehensible traffic in this echo, Fly By Night (Nifty name huh?) in Florence, Sc now carries this echo.
And the totally clever, yet modest sysop who is writing this plans to take a part, albeit a modest one in this echo..
... Allright! Enough BS where's the moderator! :)


--  
Internet: Sean.Hayden@f6.n3651.z1.FIDONET.ORG
UUCP:     ...!myrddin!tct!mechanic!3651!6!Sean.Hayden
Note: Mechanic is a free gateway between USENET & FIdonet.
      For information write to chief@mechanic.fidonet.org

Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: davem@ee.ubc.ca (Dave Michelson)
Subject: Re: STS-1 DISASTER/COVERUPy
Organization: University of BC, Electrical Engineering
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 23:46:59 GMT

In article <18330@bcars664.bnr.ca> Henry.Troup@BNR.CA writes:
>
>Plus the 747 airframe, crew, and modifications.  One could not expect
>the carrier aircraft to survive a launch of orbiter from its back.
>                       

  !!
 
Even the X-15 didn't light its engine until *after* separation from the
carrier aircraft.      

--
Dave Michelson
davem@ee.ubc.ca
Xref: sparky sci.space.shuttle:3083 alt.conspiracy:13730 talk.politics.misc:66277
From: padgett@inyo.caltech.edu (Deborah Padgett)
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle,alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: STS-1 Disaster -- follow-up #2
Date: 5 Jan 1993 17:04:18 GMT
Organization: Astronomy Department, University of Massachusetts at Amherst
NNTP-Posting-Host: inyo.phast.umass.edu


Question - where did the Moonraker shuttle get the fuel to fire its
main engines while on board the 747? This has bothered me for years...
:-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) ;-)
From: Chris.Moss@f161.n207.z1.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Lemurs in space (was: re:
X-Sender: newtout 0.06 Jan  3 1993
Date: 03 Jan 93  14:40:00

GEE!

--- DB 1.39/004571
From: anderson@Williams.EDU ()
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: What "supports" the stack on the pad
Date: 6 Jan 1993 18:18:55 GMT
Organization: Williams College
Distribution: world
Reply-To: anderson@Williams.EDU ()
NNTP-Posting-Host: spinnaker.cc.williams.edu



Here's a question my inquiring mind wants to know.  How is the orbiter stack
supported on the moblie launch platform?  Is it "standing" on SRB's?  For that
matter how are any of these launch vehicles supported prior to launch?  I can't
see the engine nozzles supporting all that weight.  Also, as a sidebar, what is
the function of the two rectangular shaped items in front of the wings of the
orbiter while on the pad?  I seem to recall some reference to and umbilical
housing of some sort.

Thanks - Jim

--
********************************************************************************
Jim Anderson						Williams College
Systems Manager						Center for Computing
janderson@williams.edu (Internet)			Jesup Hall
janderson@williams.bitnet				Williamstown, MA 01267
							413-597-2082
********************************************************************************
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: fpaterek@uceng.uc.edu (Franz Paterek)
Subject: Re: Request: Shuttle Mission Summaries
Organization: University of Cincinnati
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 02:10:01 GMT

|I am new to this newsgroup and I am wondering if there is a
|data file(s) or book that has a detail overview of all shuttle
|missions.  Main topics would be launch and landing dates, crew,
|payload, and mission report(s).  I was unable to find this out 
|from the faq (unless I missed it).
|
|Thanks in advance,
|
|Neil 

Neil,

use telnet to connct to nasa's Spacelink.  It is a public BBS that is mainly
aimed at teachers but it has very detailed information on shuttle missions.

type at the command line:  telnet spacelink.msfc.nasa.gov
or telnet 192.149.89.61

Hope this works for you.

Harald Paterek
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: Viewing Shuttle landing at Kennedy???
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:10:17 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <brant.726827574@menaik> brant@cs.UAlberta.CA (Brant Coghlan) writes:
>Where is the best place to view a Shuttle landing at the Kennedy Shuttle
>Landing Facility?  How do you get there?  Should you go really early?
>I appologize if this is a FAQ, but they seem to only deal with liftoffs.

That's because the answer is basically "you can't".  There just isn't
anything much to see unless you're pretty close, and there is no way to
get close without serious VIP status.

Note also that trying to view a shuttle landing is a gamble at either
major site, because they'll move an Edwards landing to KSC, or vice versa,
on a moment's notice.  KSC weather, in particular, is very hard to predict
very far in advance.
-- 
"God willing... we shall return."       | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
       -Gene Cernan, the Moon, Dec 1972 |  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Re: STS-1 DISASTER/COVERUPy
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
	<1992Dec19.090259.2203@ccsvax.sfasu.edu> <18330@bcars664.bnr.ca>
	<1993Jan5.234659.7819@ee.ubc.ca> <C0G325.FoD@zoo.toronto.edu>
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 19:05:06 GMT

On Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:22:52 GMT, henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) said:

HS> In article <1993Jan5.234659.7819@ee.ubc.ca> davem@ee.ubc.ca (Dave Michelson) writes:
>>Plus the 747 airframe, crew, and modifications.  One could not expect
>>the carrier aircraft to survive a launch of orbiter from its back.
>
>Even the X-15 didn't light its engine until *after* separation from the
>carrier aircraft.      

HS> There are missiles which fly off their launch rails under power, rather
HS> than delaying ignition until after separation.  Admittedly, a delay is
HS> usually considered safer.

For an example on the NB-52B, the HiMAT (a supersonic RPRV) took
off with its J79 engine running.  The fuel tank was kept topped
up from a tank in the pylon until shortly before launch.

As I recall, they used JP-5 instead of JP-4 for this because of 
the "hot refueling" on the wing of the NB-52B.  JP-5 is markedly
less volatile than JP-4.

The NB-52B pilots did not notice the thrust of the ninth engine.
--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "A MiG at your six is better than no MiG at all."  Unknown US fighter pilot
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: What "supports" the stack on the pad
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:05:26 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <1if7qfINNdne@savoy.cc.williams.edu> anderson@Williams.EDU () writes:
>... How is the orbiter stack
>supported on the moblie launch platform?  Is it "standing" on SRB's?

The orbiter hangs on the external tank, which hangs on the SRBs.  The SRBs
are bolted to the pad at their aft skirts (just above the nozzles proper).
Explosive nuts fire, simultaneously with SRB ignition, to release them.

>For that matter
>how are any of these launch vehicles supported prior to launch?  I can't
>see the engine nozzles supporting all that weight.

They don't.  Pad support fixtures are part of the vehicle, usually in the
vicinity of the engines because that's where the heavy structure is already.

>Also, as a sidebar, what is
>the function of the two rectangular shaped items in front of the wings of the
>orbiter while on the pad?  I seem to recall some reference to and umbilical
>housing of some sort.

That's what they are; they carry fuel plumbing and suchlike to the orbiter.
-- 
"God willing... we shall return."       | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
       -Gene Cernan, the Moon, Dec 1972 |  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
From: hwt@bcarh11a.BNR.CA (Henry Troup)
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Re: STS-1 DISASTER/COVERUPy
Date: 4 Jan 93 13:19:38 GMT
Reply-To: Henry.Troup@BNR.CA
Distribution: world
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada

In article <1992Dec19.090259.2203@ccsvax.sfasu.edu>,
a_willisgt@ccsvax.sfasu.edu writes
|>much more cost effective than the $35 million-or-so-per-flight that this 
|>sub-orbital shuttle of yours would cost.

Plus the 747 airframe, crew, and modifications.  One could not expect
the carrier aircraft to survive a launch of orbiter from its back.
                       
Henry Troup - H.Troup@BNR.CA (Canada) - BNR owns but does not share my opinions
	       Legislated morality is the enemy of true morality
From: gbt@cray.com (Greg Titus)
Subject: Re: Launch views, Tiles & New book on STS
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 8 Jan 93 17:50:09 CST

In article <1ikjl2INNl6o@ub.d.umn.edu> cpatters@ub.d.umn.edu (Granma) writes:
>Question:  Some years ago, a popular car magazine (Car & Driver?)
>did a "road test" on the RSS.  (ok, it might not have been the
>RSS, but from reading this, my civilian mind figured the RSS might
>just be the "thaang" in question! :-)  The article was really very
>funny.  If anyone out there in net land knows the name of the 
>magazine and the date, please email me.

Can't tell you the year, but it was almost certainly Road & Track.
The April 1st issue frequently contains a road test of some weird
thing or other.  Sometime in the late 70's they tested a Rose Bowl
float.  It had all the standard stuff: acceleration curves, top
speed, turning radius, etc.

greg
-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------
Greg Titus (gbt@zia.cray.com)                   Compiler Group
Cray Research, Inc.                               Santa Fe, NM
Opinions expressed herein (such as they are) are purely my own.
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: brant@cs.UAlberta.CA (Brant Coghlan)
Subject: Viewing Shuttle landing at Kennedy???
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 08:32:54 GMT

Where is the best place to view a Shuttle landing at the Kennedy Shuttle
Landing Facility?  How do you get there?  Should you go really early?
Any pointers gratefully accepted.

I appologize if this is a FAQ, but they seem to only deal with liftoffs.

Brant Coghlan  UofA Comp Sci Grad Student, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
brant@cs.ualberta.ca
From: Sean.Hayden@f6.n3651.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Sean Hayden)
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Sci.Space.Slaw.Shuttle
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 93 09:45:12 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3651/6

Just to add a little comment to the already incomprehensible traffic in this echo, Fly By Night (Nifty name huh?) in Florence, Sc now carries this echo.
And the totally clever, yet modest sysop who is writing this plans to take a part, albeit a modest one in this echo..
... Allright! Enough BS where's the moderator! :)


--  
Internet: Sean.Hayden@f6.n3651.z1.FIDONET.ORG
UUCP:     ...!myrddin!tct!mechanic!3651!6!Sean.Hayden
Note: Mechanic is a free gateway between USENET & FIdonet.
      For information write to chief@mechanic.fidonet.org
From: BrianT@cup.portal.com (Brian Stuart Thorn)
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Re: Launch views, Tiles & New book on STS
Date: Thu,  7 Jan 93 17:18:03 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)


>From: BrianT@cup.portal.com (Brian Stuart Thorn)
>>Oh, and despite what has been posted here from time to time, the
>>SPACEPORT USA tourist attraction DOES NOT provide bus rides to see
>>a Shuttle launch. The facility DOES NOT open until something like
>>two hours after a launch on the day in question.
>
>The following is still true, and if you want tickets, order now.  They are
>going fast:
>
>The KSC visitor center offers bus rides from the visitor's center to a site
>about 6  miles from the launch pad. The cost is $6 for adults, $3 for children
.
>For information and reservations you will need to call 407-452-2121  Ext.
>260...(This is the BEST and closest view.)

       I still have questions about this. First, please make it clear
       that you must get the "tickets" at least one day before the
       launch, as there is no public access to the KSC Visitor's Center
       on the day of the launch until after liftoff.
       Second, why would anyone pay $6.00 to see a Shuttle launch when
       you can write NASA or your Congresscritter and get a car pass to
       the same site for free (or, 29 cent postage.) If you will be
       in the Cape Canaveral area unexpectedly, then you're probably
       too late for the $6.00 tickets too.
       
       -Brian

>From: Darrell Holloway
>Subj: Space Shuttle Book
>
>Just thought I'd tell you all about the best book I have ever seen
>regarding the Space Shuttle.  It has just come out in print.
>
>title:      SPACE SHUTTLE

   Another good but outdated book is "Space Shuttle Log: The First
   Twenty-five Flights" from TAB Books. It was published in 1987 and
   I'm hoping it's updated to "The First Fifty Flights" soon.
   A good mix of B&W pictures, detail, and easy to understand.
   
   -Brian

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brian S. Thorn                                    "If ignorance is bliss,
BrianT@cup.portal.com                               this must be heaven."
                                                -Diane Chambers, "Cheers"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: davem@ee.ubc.ca (Dave Michelson)
Subject: Re: date of challenger crash
Organization: University of BC, Electrical Engineering
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 05:46:32 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.040907.19858@trl.oz.au> briganti@rhea.trl.OZ.AU (Joe Briganti) writes:
>header says it all. Anybody able to tell me month and year?

January 28, 1986.  I would tend to call it a break-up rather than a crash.
 
--
Dave Michelson
davem@ee.ubc.ca

Newsgroups: sci.space.shuttle
From: buesinnj@cda.mrs.umn.edu (Neil Buesing)
Subject: Request: Shuttle Mission Summaries
Organization: University of Minnesota - Morris
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 02:24:55 GMT

I am new to this newsgroup and I am wondering if there is a
data file(s) or book that has a detail overview of all shuttle
missions.  Main topics would be launch and landing dates, crew,
payload, and mission report(s).  I was unable to find this out 
from the faq (unless I missed it).

Thanks in advance,

Neil

 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Neil Buesing              |
 UMM P.O. 597              |  "Of my friend I can only say this.  Of all  
 Morris, MN 56267          |   the souls I have encountered in my travels, 
 (612) 589-1963            |   his was the most, -- human."    
                           | 
 buesinnj@cda.mrs.umn.edu  |
         @UMNMOR.BITNET    |		[ Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan ]
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: sci.space
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: Aluminum as Rocket Fuel?
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 20:50:01 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <1993Jan11.200942.28571@pixar.com> loren@pixar.com (Loren Carpenter) writes:
>... It seems that an easy way to raise the ISP of a fuel is
>to preheat it.  An exothermic reaction consumes some of its output in 
>heating the unreacted material up to reaction temperature.  So, liquid Al
>at 1000C ought to burn a bit hotter than solid Al at room temperature...

True only up to a point.  For any fuel combination there's a limiting
temperature, where the reaction products start to decompose, and high-
performance rocket engines started reaching it long ago.  One reason
(not the only one) why the SSMEs run quite hydrogen-rich, for example,
is that the flame wouldn't get much hotter with a leaner mix.

Given that an aluminum-oxygen rocket is going to have to run very
oxygen-rich for useful performance, though, it might help some.
-- 
"God willing... we shall return."       | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
       -Gene Cernan, the Moon, Dec 1972 |  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.astro,alt.sci.planetary
From: hinz@picard.med.ge.com (David Hinz (hinz@picard.med.ge.com))
Subject: Re: Cheap Mars Rocks (was Re: Moon Dust For Sale)
Organization: GE Medical Systems, Magnetic Resonance
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 93 07:07:45 GMT

Henry Spencer (henry@zoo.toronto.edu) wrote:
: In article <1993Jan9.041013.27969@siemens.com> aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri) writes:
: >I must admit some skepticism wrt meteorites that are claimed to have been
: >ejected from Luna and Mars.
: 
: The evidence for the lunar meteorites is pretty convincing.  The Mars ones
: aren't as solidly established, but they're getting there.

OK, someone has to ask...

By what mechanism do these rocks get here?  Volcanic action & random launching?
How do they acheive escape velocity?  Why do they end up so often in 
Antarctica?  Or are they just more  visible there?  Do they come in swarms,
or randomly?  What is the meaning of life?  ((oops, sorry, got into question
mode, and, well, you know....))


--

Dave Hinz  -  Opinions expressed are mine, not my employer's.  Obviously.
Ask me if I have an opinion on this! \ Don't blame me; I voted for Perot!
SAAB - Because you get what you pay for.     \       Pherrets are Phun!!!
Xref: sparky sci.space:19227 sci.engr:2491 sci.engr.biomed:686 soc.college.grad:2295
From: mchenry@engr.latech.edu (Michael Q. McHenry)
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.engr,sci.engr.biomed,soc.college.grad
Subject: NASA Graduate Student Researchers Program - help
Followup-To: sci.engr.biomed
Date: 12 Jan 1993 21:27:38 GMT
Organization: Louisiana Tech University
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: mchenry@engr.latech.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: altair.engr.latech.edu

Greetings.  I have just today found the 1991/1992 GSRP informational and 
application packet, but I have been unable to reach anyone about getting 
the 1993/1994 packet.  The obvious phone numbers in this document are no
longer in service, and the deadline for proposal submission is 01 February.

If anyone has any information about this program, contacts, phone numbers
or email addresses, I would greatly appreciate the e-mail.

---
Quinn McHenry                 "If you would be a real seeker after truth, it
mchenry@engr.latech.edu        is necessary that at least once in your life
Biomedical Engineering         you doubt, as far as possible, all things."
Louisiana Tech University                   - Rene Descartes

Newsgroups: sci.space
From: tjs@earth.wustl.edu (tom sullivan)
Subject: NOAA/TIROS Satellites??
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis MO
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:24:31 GMT


We're interested in finding out some more about the NOAA TIROS weather
satellites. Specifically, what is the transmitter power of these polar
orbit satellites. Also, are there any good references concerning the
modulation format used for data transmission?

thanks

tom sullivan
Washington University in St. Louis

tjs@earth.wustl.edu

Newsgroups: sci.space