HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Subject: Re: Libertarianism vs. government
Organization: University of Tennessee Division of Continuing Education
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 20:10:27 GMT

In article <RUSSO.92Jul23163336@cucbs.chem.columbia.edu> russo@cucbs.chem.columbia.edu (Thomas Russo) writes:

>In article <archer.156@utkux1.utk.edu> archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:

>>In article <1992Jul23.150743.32350@watson.ibm.com> strom@watson.ibm.com (Rob Strom) writes:
>>
>>>For example, libertarians would allow my
>>>insurance company to put a clause in my insurance contract
>>>forbidding me under pain of losing my insurance to associate
>>>with blacks --- i.e. the insurance companies could coerce
>>>me to restrict my freedom of association.  But libertarians
>>>think that government restrictions *preventing* discrimination
>>>are an illegal abridgement of freedom of association.
>>
>>Un uh.  At that point, your insurance carrier is infringing on YOUR right to 
>>free association, at the Libertarian POV is that the government IS 
>>responsible for preventing individuals from infringing on each other's 
>>rights.
>>

>Um... um... um... may I politely say "NOT"?  The insurance company is
>only infringing on your rights IF representatives of said insurance
>company are also holding a gun to your head and forcing you to use its
>service.  If one is operating under the libertarian assumption that
>people are free to decide which insurance company to patronize, and
>that other people are free to form insurance companies with whatever
>operating policies they choose then there is NO rights infringement.

Mea culpa.  I got that one wrong.
-=-=-
T. Archer  PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu
University of Tennessee
"Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking." -- Unknown
-=-=-
From: covici@ccs.covici.com (John Covici)
Reply-To: covici@ccs.covici.com
Newsgroups: alt.activism
Subject: U.S. Should Stop The Doubletalk About Cendero Luminoso
Date: 26 Jul 92 19:2:15 GMT
Organization: Covici Computer Systems

                        SENDERO LUMINOSO

   July 24 
   Independent Presidential Candidate 
   Lyndon H. LaRouche, Jr. 

   This is independent presidential candidate Lyndon LaRouche
speaking on the subject of the genocide in Peru. 
   Two things should not be mysterious about the current
situation in Peru. First of all, it is clear from their ideology
that the so-called Sendero Luminoso are, in fact, the Pol Pots of
the Andean Spine. Secondly, it is clear that this Sendero
Luminoso has many connections to the evolution and spread of what
is called today post-modernist philosophy dating back to the
1920s and earlier, and that this Pol Pot formation called Sendero
Luminoso--this mass-murderous formation--has had a large
influence supplied in the French language by way of the
post-modernist center, the University at Ayacucho. 
   This movement is not endemic to the Andean Spine, but is
rather something which has been created in the Andean Spine by
many foreign influences, including the old Communist
International; including the French Synarchists; including the
French ethnologists who are, in some cases, the same thing as the
Synarchists; by the same circles in France which educated and
created Pol Pot, the genocidalist of Kampuchea. 
   It is also clear, that this Sendero Luminoso has support
from many strange quarters, including high-level diplomatic and
related circles inside the United States. That Sendero Luminoso
may not be joined by members of the State Department, but is
being used by certain State Department circles as an instrument
for: firstly, population control--collapse of the economy of
Peru, and mass extermination genocidally of the population of
Peru through the consequences of this kind of insurrection;
secondly, immediately, the Sendero Luminoso is a pawn of those
associated, for example, with Luigi Einaudi of the U.S. State
Department, who are determined to destroy the military
institutions of all of Central and South America. 
   In this situation, it is time to put aside all double-talk,
all diplomatic lying for sake of good relations with various
states; and to state plainly the truth, that this Andean Spine
operation, formerly associated with the Communist International,
with {America Latina}, for example, this Maoist operation, is
being employed by persons in the so-called Western industrialized
powers for the twofold purpose of genocide against the peoples of
the Andean Spine, and for the destruction of the military and
other sovereign institutions of those countries. 
   This must be said publicly in order to bring forth a crisis,
which is the only means, politically, of saving the countries of
Central and South America from this kind of worse-than-Nazi
genocide authored by Anglo-American and allied circles. 


----
         John Covici
          covici@ccs.covici.com

Newsgroups: alt.activism,soc.motss,talk.politics.misc,alt.individualism
From: archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Organization: University of Tennessee Division of Continuing Education
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 13:17:40 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.194625.18019@tss.com> burke@tss.com (Jim Burke) writes:

>by the masses.  Yet one young fellow in town has not converted.  Hell, he
>still believes in outdated concepts like civil rights.  Well, to teach him

Libertarians' primary focus is on civil liberties.  
-=-=-
T. Archer  PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu
University of Tennessee
"Vote Dempublican, it's easier than thinking." -- Unknown
-=-=-
Newsgroups: alt.activism
From: maxwell@fnala.fnal.gov
Subject: Re: Imposters in the Temple -- Part 1
Organization: What does *this* button do!?
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 21:15:06 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnala.fnal.gov
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <BrpsLr.Fq4@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, 
bfrg9732@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Brian F. Redman) writes:
> 
> Imposters in the Temple:
> American Intellectuals are Destroying our Universities
> and Cheating our Students of their Future
> 
> by Martin Anderson
> 
> Part 1  --  Two Intellectual Classes
> 

The short version:
The only good ideas in the U.S. country originate from the press/media.
If we'd teach just these media approved ideas in our universities, everything
would be fine.

Shorter version:
Shut up and obey.

anderson is a dupe.

--
 maxwell@fnalf.fnal.gov
monningh@basil.fnal.gov
Newsgroups: alt.activism,misc.headlines,talk.politics.misc,alt.desert-storm,soc.culture.turkish
From: bobh@troy.uucp (22131-hettmansperger)
Subject: Re: Media bias
Reply-To: bobh@troy.UUCP ()
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 13:46:30 GMT
Keywords: bias

In article <1992Jul28.230400.3498@anomaly.sbs.risc.net> kd1hz@anomaly.sbs.risc.net (Michael P. Deignan (KD1HZ)) writes:
>pswanson@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Paul Swanson) writes:
>
>>And just what exactly does this mean?  To me it looks like you're trying
>>to make yourself out to be something more than you are.
>
>Oh boy. A flame attempt. I'm amused.
>
>MD
>-- 
>--  Dr. Michael P. Deignan (deg.pend.)      /   "Its okay dear,
     ^^                      ^^^^^^^^

Ok, all flames aside, what *does* it mean? 

-Bob

"It's okay dear, you can show me...  I've got a degree pending!"
Xref: sparky alt.activism:13445 talk.politics.misc:35833 soc.culture.latin-america:2719
From: rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo)
Subject: Re: HISTORY LESSON: Chomsky on Cuba
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,soc.culture.latin-america
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 24 Jul 92 18:41:14 GMT

In article <9207240702.AA06415@tba.msi.cornell.edu> harelb@math.cornell.edu (Harel Barzilai) writes:

 [all the stuff deleted to save band and spare our readers ....]

 As always, the radicals get some correct information to try to justify
 the failures and crimes of totalitarian/communist regimes like Castro's.
 
 It's true that the US always had imperialistic designs on Cuba and may
 even still have it, but that's not justification to keep the present
 regime in Cuba.

 We all know that communism failed due to its own shortcommings regarding
 economics as well as social issues. The US never put an embargo on the 
 USSR, on the contrary, every year we kept them going by selling them
 tons of wheat and foodstuff.

 Most countries ignored and are still ignoring the US embargo against Cuba. 
 The lack of FREEDOM and foodstuff in Cuba are due to the failures of yet
 another communist regime, nothing more.
 
 It's time these radicals stop trying to recycle old ideas and regimes
 that DON'T WORK!

 They are even trying to convince us that Sendero Luminoso and its leader,
 the sinister assassin "Gonzalo" will be the best thing for Peru!




--
Ray I. Ravelo                 "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million
Office of Academic Computing.  Cubans who look around us in terror"
UC, Irvine.                    from the open letter to Castro by M.E. Cruz-Varela
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,alt.individualism
From: kd1hz@anomaly.sbs.risc.net (Michael P. Deignan (KD1HZ))
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Organization: The Rhode Island Internet Systems Cooperative Network
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 22:09:36 GMT

mpolen@gelato.mips.com (Michael Polen) writes:

>Because as a business person you have protection and support from the community
>Your police/fire protection, the roads, parking, etc are all paid for by
>the community, including blacks.  If you want to spend their taxes, they have
>a right to expect you to deal with them.

Uh, Mike, explain the difference between the taxes a businessman pays and the
taxes an individual pays. Then explain to me how as a businessman I am spending
"their taxes" and not my own.

MD
-- 
--  Dr. Michael P. Deignan (deg.pend.)      /   "Its okay dear,
--  Domain: kd1hz@anomaly.sbs.risc.net     /     you can show me...
--    UUCP: ..!uunet!anomaly!kd1hz        /      I'm a Doctor..."
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.conspiracy,alt.conspiracy.jfk
From: veal@utkvm1.utk.edu (David L. Veal)
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Organization: University of Tennessee Division of Continuing Education
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 22:28:03 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.123832.18186@queernet.org> rogerk@queernet.org (Roger B.A. Klorese) writes:

>In article <archer.132@utkux1.utk.edu> archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:
>>And if you are interested in bias, try being the only literate person in a 
>>public school system that reveres jock-dom and football above all else.  I'
>>ve shed my share of plasma on the field of bias.

>Yes, I agree, that's far more tragic than being denied housing,
>employment, or the right to walk down the street in peace.  Enough of
>this whining about racism, sexism, heteroexism... the real enemy is
>sports fandom...  Yeesh.

     This, I like.  "My form of discrimination is worse than your form of 
discrimination!" 
 

===========================================================================
|David Veal  PA146008@utkvm1.utk.edu  University of Tennessee             |  
|                                     Division of Continuing Education    |
| Statistics are any data which can be twisted to support your posititon  | 
===========================================================================

Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.activism.d
From: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
Subject: Re: Masturbation to Ayn Rand
Organization: Johns Hopkins University CS Dept.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 02:30:53 GMT

In article <JYM.92Jul28185230@remarque.berkeley.edu> jym@mica.berkeley.edu (Jym Dyer) writes:
>=o= Perhaps there should be a {L|l}ibertarian newsgroup (aside
>from alt.politics.marrou, that is).  I'd support anything that
>would help cut down on the incessant unending non-activist
>discussions being posted to this newsgroup.

So why can't libertarians be activists?

In fact, anyone who is actually a member of the party (or any small party with
goals) is essentially an activist by definition.
--
Hi! Ani mutacia shel virus .signature. Ha`atek oti letoch .signature shelcha!

Ken Arromdee (UUCP: ....!jhunix!arromdee; BITNET: arromdee@jhuvm;
     INTERNET: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,misc.activism.progressive
From: nelson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson)
Subject: Re: HISTORY LESSON: Chomsky on Cuba
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 19:57:55 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

In article <2A704ECA.24545@noiro.acs.uci.edu> rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:
>In article <9207240702.AA06415@tba.msi.cornell.edu> harelb@math.cornell.edu (Harel Barzilai) writes:
>
> [all the stuff deleted to save band and spare our readers ....]
>
> As always, the radicals get some correct information to try to justify
> the failures and crimes of totalitarian/communist regimes like Castro's.


  OK, but it's not just the "radicals", by whom I think Mr. Ravelo is 
  referring to leftists and their fellow travelers, who might oppose 
  the US embargo on Cuba (and Vietnam, etc).

  From a purely Republican, Chamber of Commerce, oe small business
  perspective:  On what basis should the US Government interfere in a
  businessman's right to trade with whomever he wishes?   I haven't
  been following the situation in Cuba, but in Vietnam there is a
  great deal of interest among locals in US investment and business.
  Many people there are, of course, already familiar with US customs
  and speak English, and in the south there is a great deal of old,
  US-supplied infrastructure which needs to be modernized, updated,
  and replaced.  It's a potential goldmine for US exports and investment,
  at a time when our economy is in grave need of new business.   

  The current issue of Business Week has an article on how European
  companies are investing in hotels and other facilities in Cuba.  They
  are thus establishing an economic beachhead, and when the Communist
  regime inevitably falls they will be in a better position than US
  firms which must start from scratch.   The Communist regimes in
  eastern Europe were not toppled by isolating them, but by the 
  subversive effects of exposing them to our culture.  It is unclear
  to me how the US policy of isolation benefits anybody.


---peter


    

  
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.society.revolution
From: duve@ellis.uchicago.edu (michael andrew duvernois)
Subject: Re: AF/ATS: Revolutionary Cells communique
Reply-To: duve@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:30:07 GMT

In article <f=dmlzm.nagle@netcom.com> nagle@netcom.com (John Nagle) writes:
>       I don't know whether to laugh or cry.  These guys appear to be
>leftovers from the '60s protest groups, held together by the problems
>they created for themselves by killing people.  They don't seem to have
>an agenda that makes sense in the post-Communist, post colonialist world.
>Yet here they are, still issuing communiques.  
>
I think this is a fundamental rule of organizations; once created they
cannot dissolve.  In the US we had the Weather Underground (formerly the
Weathermen) which continued to function underground years after the anti-
war movement had ceased to exist.  In fact their only bloody action
(the Brinks robbery) took place six or seven years after they lost any
meaning in their continued existence.  Or look at Washington, think of 
the money being spent on the Rural Electrification Administration long
after it is needed.  The organs of resistance are as stagnated as the
agents of the state.        

Are the other 60's revolutionary movements still active?  I'm thinking
primarily of the Red Brigades in Italy or the Japanese Red Army or related
groups in the Industrialized countries.            

Propaganda by deed may have its place, but it seems rather parodied by
working primarily to fix the mistakes of previous acts.                

Mike DuVernois
m-duvernois@uchicago.edu

Xref: sparky alt.activism:13281 soc.motss:32166 talk.politics.misc:35338 alt.individualism:4426
From: mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,soc.motss,talk.politics.misc,alt.individualism
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:56:23 GMT
Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA

In article <1992Jul22.183932.520@macc.wisc.edu>, anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
> 
> In article <15520@star.cs.vu.nl> fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:
> 
> >I've finally found what doesn't click with Libertarianism
> >and me: a belief that people are guided by rationale,
> >maximalisation of happiness, and concious thinking about the
> >cutting edges of judgements in life, with total disregard of
> >things like peer-pressure, basic mine-is-mine
> >like-me-not-like-me instincts.  People aren't rational.
> 
> Bingo!
> 
> Well said and said well.

  Which is to say that the only way people will obey is at the
muzzle of a gun. How, um, misanthropic. Pardon me as I barf.
Libs do not deny that people can be bad, but the wholesale 
condemnation of man to be some sort of animal to be herded
by the state, since we are evil by nature, is a bit too much
to take.
  For better or worse, if we are to have a society which is 
not a slave pen we must work off of the assumption that man
has the potential of being rational. Putting self interest 
as the incentive is of primary concern since a person will
not objectify that which is not perceived as good for him/her.
  Perhaps you can tell us what or other choices are. This
misanthropic pap is just too much though.
-- 

		Michael Thomas	(mike@gordian.com)
	"I don't think Bambi Eyes will get you that flame thrower..."  
		-- Hobbes to Calvin
		USnail: 20361 Irvine Ave Santa Ana Heights, Ca,	92707-5637
		PaBell: (714) 850-0205 (714) 850-0533 (fax)
Xref: sparky alt.activism:13456 alt.society.revolution:416
From: tysoj@solb1.essex.ac.uk (Tyson J R)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.society.revolution
Subject: Re: AF/ATS: Revolutionary Cells communique
Date: 24 Jul 92 20:08:53 GMT
Reply-To: tysoj@essex.ac.uk (Tyson J R)
Organization: University of Essex, Colchester, UK

In article <1992Jul20.121719.6938@iti.org> aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes:
>In article <1992Jul20.081917.26758@oneb.almanac.bc.ca> kmcvay@oneb.almanac.bc.ca (Ken Mcvay) writes:
>
>>Oh, goody. Next we'll replay the street battles between the communists and
>>the brown shirts in the twenties and thirties....
>
>As long as the last commie and the last brownshirt kill each other I don't
>see this as a problem. :-)
>
>  Allen

Well you are a fuckwit of the first order aren't you.

Even if the vast majority of the 20,000,000 soviets who died
were not communists, what about the leftists partisans all
over Europe who were butchered by nazis?  You think that
they got what was coming to them?

My own family were bundists who came west because they rejected
Stalinism.  Both  my grandmothers had 13 children.  I have only
ever seen one of my uncles, he was too young to fight in the
resistance.

Members of my family were among those who in the Netherlands
published 'de Rode Vlag' all through the war, organising
anti-nazi strikes and propaganda, hiding those conscripted for
slave labour in Germany and even trying to fraternise with
German soldiers to cause dissaffection.  de Rode Vlag also
questioned the role of Dutch capitalists under the nazis
and argued that the royal family, having fled should not be
allowed back.

The most distinguished Trotskyist fighter in Belgium during
the war was Avram Leon, who wrote the Book `The Jewish
Question', he was martyred in a concentration camp.  The
nazis didn't much care for Jews or trotskyists.

I sincerely hope that we meet someday, and then I can give
you the welcome we traditionally reserve for scum like you.

Jim Tyson
Newsgroups: alt.activism,misc.activism.progressive
Newsgroups: alt.activism
Subject: Project Vote Smart
From: dfriedman@misvax.mis.arizona.edu (D R Friedman)
Date: 27 Jul 1992 20:14 MST  
Distribution: world,local
Organization: University of Arizona MIS Department
Keywords: Smart Voters
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

Project Vote Smart is a project centered at Oregon State University that
allows voters to use an 800 number to get information about congressional
and state candidates on the issues.  The project uses computers and various
bits and pieces of information such as voting records, campaign financing,
and statements made by the candiddate to get a true portrait of what the
candidate stands for on various issues, no matter what the media ads the
candidate presents.

The service is free and is not financed by any party or pac.
Call them at 1-800-786-6885.


Denny F@misvax.mis.arizona.edu
-------------------------------------
Imagination is the beginning of creation.  You imagine what you desire, you 
will what you imagine, and at last you create what you will.
Xref: sparky alt.activism:13229 talk.politics.misc:35037 talk.abortion:28286
From: smccabe@author.ecn.purdue.edu (Sarah A McCabe)
Newsgroups: alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,talk.abortion
Subject: Re: RU486 Bill
Date: 21 Jul 92 21:19:45 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

In article <1992Jul21.175744.14589@src.umd.edu> tedwards@src.umd.edu (Thomas Grant Edwards) writes:
>I am under the impression that Pat Shroeder is introducing a Bill to 
>legalize RU486 this week.  Does anyone have the details on this?
>
>-Thomas

Well, I saw a big chunk of the press conference she held as it was 
shown on C-Span, but I have a rotten memory for names, so here goes.

The bill is written to specificaly force the FDA to turn over the dose
of RU-486 that custom officials seized from that woman who brought it 
in from France.  It is stated that the drug is to be released for her 
personal use only under the direction of her physician.  Pat Schroeder
and some other guy (a senator?) held the news conference and they 
stated that their plan was to try and attach this bill as an ammendmnt 
to some other bill that was already working its way through the congress
since there is such a time constraint on this case.  They are doing this
to try and draw attention to the fact that the FDA ban on import of RU-486
for personal use was politically rather than scintifically motivated.  
They also stressed throughout the whole conference that Bush, with one
phone call, could authorize the release of the drug and this whole mess
would be unnecessary.

Sarah McCabe
Newsgroups: alt.activism