HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: NARAM SUMMARY????
Date: 7 Oct 92 20:09:02 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <19921005162142.Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu>, Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu writes:

> I fear that holding MR events at a NARAM (especially an east coast NARAM) is
> asking for problems.  These are the problems that need to be planned for:

> [four problems]

> If they think they can pull this off, more power to them.  I just think there
> are too many things that can go wrong and there are likely to be a lot of
> angry people yelling at the CD.

I'm going to save your posting and drag it out everytime somebody asks
why American rocketeers don't just fly standard FAI events.

> > > > 1/2A Cluster Altitude (provisional event)
> > > I assume that this will be changed if Apogee's 1/4A's are unavailable.

By the way, this assumption is wrong.  It is clusters of 1/2A's, not
clusters of 1/4A's.
-- 

cdt@pdp.sw.stratus.com      --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
From: jack@rml.UUCP (jack hagerty)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: Changes to FAQ
Date: 14 Oct 92 04:49:26 GMT
Reply-To: jack@rml.UUCP (jack hagerty)
Organization: Robotic Midwives, Ltd.

In article <1992Oct13.173156.23102@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com> billn@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com (bill nelson) writes:
>jack@rml.UUCP (jack hagerty) writes:
>: 
>: 1.1 Camroc - The first purpose-designed rocket camera. Designed by Estes and 
>:    extremely valuable on the collector market.
>
>How valuable?  I might be willing to sell mine - with a couple of spare
>film magazines.

Talk to Bob Sanford ("Collectors' Closet" in the current AmSpam). He can
be reached at 72020.371@compuserve.com or phone him at Aerotech.

- Jack

=============================================================================
||Jack Hagerty, Robotic Midwives, Ltd.                 jack@rml.com        ||
||Livermore, CA		           NOTE! New, improved address! ^^^        ||
||(510) 455-1143	            (old ones will still work)             ||
||-------------------------------------------------------------------------||
|| October '92 - Congress overrides President Bush's veto of               ||
||                     the cable industry regulation bill                  ||
|| November '92 - Viacom raises rates (5th time in 5 years)                ||
=============================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: soc1070                         
Subject: Guidance Alternatives
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Minnesota CIS
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 16:02:00 GMT

Does anyone have any experiences with alternative guidance methods - I
mean alternatives to fins, not like launch rods, rails, towers, etc.

Someone told me there was a company that sold micro gyros suitable
for HPR models, but he couldn't remember the company's name.

Or how 'bout exhaust vectoring, like the A4/V2?

Or maybe various combinations of things.

Weeeellllll?

------ 
Tim Harincar				Kill Your Television.			
Central Minnesota 		
Association of Rocketry		
soc1070@vx.acs.umn.edu		
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: soc1070                         
Subject: Re: Changes to FAQ
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Minnesota CIS
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 13:40:00 GMT

I would like to see some information on electronic transmitters as
payloads. I have one that I haven't constructed a model for yet, 
nor have I made any sensors for it other than the homing beacon.

It was made by a guy who converted an FM wireless microphone, Robert
Doumopolous, I believe. He sold a bunch through AmSpac a few years
ago. I dig up his name & address from the information that came
with the unit.

Anyone else used this system? Success/failure?

Also, how about GI Joe type figures? They seem to be pretty popular
right now. I think a great competition would be spot landing with
a passenger figurine![ Maybe NARAM? ;) ] 

-------------
Tim Harincar				Kill Your Television.			
Central Minnesota 		
Association of Rocketry		
soc1070@vx.acs.umn.edu		
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: Changes to FAQ
Keywords: FAQ
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:16:12 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <585@rml.UUCP>, jack@rml.UUCP (jack hagerty) writes:

> 2.1 Still Cameras 
> 
> 2.1.1 Historic - The intensity of interest in camera payloads can be seen by 
>    how early they were flown. According to Stine (Handbook, 2nd Edition) 
>    the first documented camera payload was flown by Lewis Dewart in 1961. 

Sorry.  The first documented camera payload was flown decades previous to
this.  A school group in Scotland formed what it possibly the first model
rocketry club long before G. Harry Stine "invented" the hobby.  Of course,
there were no commercial MR motors available, but they used pennywhistle
fireworks motors (prepackaged and about as reliable as the Estes C5) to
power their creations.  The group's advisor designed and flew a camera-
bearing rocket with which he took several photos of a nearby loch.  This
group was written up in the Model Rocketeer around 1982 or so (I believe
the name of the article was "King George VI's Rocketeers") and included
photos of the group and of the camera rocket.


> 2.2.2 Due to the greater difficulty of adapting a movie camera, and relatively
>    easy access of Cinerocs,

Huh??  Do you mean "easy" 20 years ago?
-- 

cdt@pdp.sw.stratus.com      --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: NARAM SUMMARY????
Date: 7 Oct 92 23:02:29 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <19921007180239.Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu>, Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu writes:
> The difference between FAI (atleast in the internats) and NAR is that in the 
> internats, there is a timing team per contestant or launch pad in NAR contests,
> there are usually fewer timers. 

Yeah, like four or six shared for EVERYBODY.  I don't know how they do
it in local European meets.  I bet they don't have funny weighting factors
that force them to fly six events per meet.

> > By the way, this assumption is wrong.  It is clusters of 1/2A's, not
> > clusters of 1/4A's.
> I'll have to read it again.  I thought it was total impulse of 1/2A.  How 
> 1/2A's do you get?

Two 1/4A's, three 1/2A's, four A's, five B's, etc., etc., and a partridge
in a pear tree.
-- 

cdt@pdp.sw.stratus.com      --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
From: barrett@add.itg.ti.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: 29mm Nosecone?
Date: 16 Oct 92 17:58:35 GMT
Organization: Texas Instruments, Austin, Tx.


  I'm planning to add three outboard 29mm engines to my THOY Falcon.

  I'll epoxy the 29mm motor mount tubes to the side of the main body
tube.

  Does anyone know the source of nosecones that I could use for these
29mm motor mount tubes?  Nothing fancy, balsa would be fine.  I don't
need a very long one either (2-3" would be just fine).  I'll just epoxy
them onto the motor mount tube anyway.

  I've checked LOC, Aerotech, THOY catalogs and have come up empty.  I
really don't want to turn my own!

  I'll be out of pocket till next Monday, so any "answers" to my
questions should also be sent to me via e-mail since the sys-add for my
news-server may delete anything over a few days old, and I'd miss a
posted answer.

Thanks,

Stu Barrett  barrett@add.itg.ti.com
TRA#1277  NAR#4341
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: pfeiffer@nmsu.edu (Joe Pfeiffer)
Subject: Bail-Out
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
Distribution: rec
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 03:06:32 GMT

Well, we finally went out to launch my son's Bail-Out for the first
and last time...  good news was it was my daughter Becca's first
launch; she had as much fun as Joel (no, I'm not a sexist, I'm agist:
Joel is eight, and has been launching since he was five.  Becca turns
five next month).

Got two launches out of the Bail-Out.  First launch... whoever decided
an A8-3 was a good minimum for this rocket was crazy.  The motor is
through right about when the rocket clears the launch rod.  It did
eject properly before it hit the ground, but it was close.  This
rocket takes more wadding than I'm used to, probably because old GI
Joe is heavy and takes quite a push to get out of the tube.

Second lanuch...  a C6-3 is about right.  Stayed well within sight,
ejection at apogee.  Unfortunatly, GI Joe's parachute hung up on the
shock cord mount, and neither he nor the rocket 'chute ejected (the
nose, which comes down on a streamer, did eject properly).  Guess what
-- when GI Joe slides up to the front of the rocket it's stable without a
nose cone.  And heavy.  Came down on asphalt; hit so hard the airframe
crumpled both up at the front and at the back by the fins.  It hit so
hard the funky locking fin/motor mount assembly came apart!  GI Joe,
being somewhat stronger than his rocket, survived with only the singes
from his first launch...

I guess my earlier concern about the longevity of that plastic motor
mount is not a problem :(

Time to buy some parts and build my own version...

-Joe.
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: soc1070                         
Subject: Re: July BPP for ftp
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Minnesota CIS
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1992 16:25:00 GMT

In article <pthomson.718666342@pv1424.vincent.iastate.edu>, pthomson@iastate.edu (I Forgot) writes...
>In <9OCT199215355783@vx.cis.umn.edu> soc1070                          writes:
> 
>>Since the new issue of the Black Powder Picayune is about to be published,
>>I have decided to put the last issue on the archive for everyone who
>>doesn't subscribe. The files are julybpp.sit for the Mac folks and 
>>julbpp.zip for the Unwashed Heathen of DOS. All of the articles are ascii
>>files for easy reading. 
> 
>At what site is the archive??
>

The archive is at sunsite.unc.edu. The files are located in 
pub/archives/rec.models.rockets. 

I have just received a note from Robert Sisk who is sort of the 
'archive manager' telling me the files are temporarily missing.
When they are available, I'll let everyone know.

Bob said he is still working a few bugs out of the archive, it has
sort of been sporadic up 'till now.

----------
Tim Harincar				Kill Your Television.			
Central Minnesota 		
Association of Rocketry		
soc1070@vx.acs.umn.edu
From: iqv@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: events?
Date: 15 Oct 92 09:47:29 EDT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Cornell University

Sorry, i forgot one more question.  Are there any groups that are having an
event in the new york (state) area?
					David
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: please help
Date: 15 Oct 92 19:12:40 GMT
Followup-To: rec.pyrotechnics
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <1992Oct15.175517.5610@news.unomaha.edu>, dulcinea@cwis.unomaha.edu (Shaene Steinauer) writes:
> Hi! 
> 
> I amm trying to figure out a way to electronically ignite flash cotton for
> a costume effect.  I found a good idea in a pyrotechnic newsgroup:  use
> model rocket igniters.  They work well.  However, I'd like to achieve
> the effect without having to replace the igniter every time. 
> 
> Any suggestions?

Yes -- take it to rec.pyrotechnics.  There are no re-usable model
rocket igniters.
-- 

cdt@pdp.sw.stratus.com      --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
From: hrbob@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (robert.e.wiersbe)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: NARAM SUMMARY????
Date: 16 Oct 92 23:05:35 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T


>>I'm getting the impression that this year was ho-hum, even the guys who went
>>from our club didn't have much to say. The only things I heard about were the
>>Great Estes Prang and some insanity about scaring turtles to death. Oh yeah,
>>they also said it was hot.
>
>OK.. tell us all about it... Great Estes prang? Scaring turtles to 
>death! Hmmmm...

>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
>Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
>Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !

I'll tell you what I heard, I don't know more 'cause I wasn't there. Estes
had (that's had) a very nice, large, scale Saturn 1B that they launched with
one of their "available sometime in the future" G composite motors. The 
ejection charge apparantly failed and it pranged behind some cars. I dubbed it 
the "Great Estes Prang" because someone from Estes (Mike Hellmund??) was making
jokes whenever another manufacturer's composite motor chuffed. 

The launch site was on Federal land or something like that and there was a
species of turtle living there that is in danger of extinction. The problem
with these turtles is that they scare easy, and they tend to lose control of
their bladders when they get scared. Seeing as how they live in a desert, this
can be life threatening (they lose moisture). I'm not sure if anyone actually 
saw any of them, or if any rockets landed near them, so it probably wasn't a 
big deal. But I guess whoever owns the land made sure everyone knew about it.

This is all second hand, of course. You might try subscribing to some club
newsletters or American Spacemodeling and possibly read about it there. 

Bob Wiersbe	
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: lesnyd@monsanto.com (Larry E. Snyder)
Subject: Re: Guidance
Organization: DSC
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 21:28:07 GMT

In article <10490022@hpfcmgw.FC.HP.COM>,... writes:
> 
> They typically stay around their end of the road, and us around ours. ONE of
> those guys, however, insists on flying directly overhead of our launchers
> over and over again (4-5 times last Sunday). Now this wheat field's about
> 1 mile on a side, and we're 1/4 to 1/2 mile away from this dude, but he 
> just won't "buzz off"! 
> 

Have you talked to this guy? I fly with some folks who simply don't have a
clue where their planes are. I've seen guys wander half a mile away and not
realize it. You should check to see if he knows he's doing it...

But don't be obnoxious! I had a guy come over and tell me I was disturbing
his tennis game and he was a real horse's hind end. I can guarantee you if
I see him while I'm flying he's going to be hearing a lot of buzzing very
nearby...

But all within AMA safety rules, of course.

Larry

Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: parachute 101
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 18:04:40 GMT

In article <19921001153705.Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu> <Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu>  (Roger Wilfong) writes:


>One comment on snaps.  The C/L folks have bee using snaps to attach control
>lines for years.  They do not use the standard, brass, fishing snap swivels 
>you find at most sporting goods stores.  Instead, they use a much heavier 
>snap (sans swivel).  Speed and some other events require pull tests of 
>several hundred pounds to ensure that the planes, lines and attachments are
>strong enough.  If you insist on using snaps for parachute attachment, you 
>might look into these snaps - I think Sig sells some and I know that fishing 
>speciality shops carry them.



Heheheh.. Don't know about hundreds of pounds (the speed guys use 
soldered loops over buttons) but we do use a variety of snaps. There
are two kinds - the dumbell shaped ones, and the ones that work like
a split ring but are in the shape of a fish. The former are weaker 
but much easier to find.

In any case I have found a source for both: Netcraft Inc. in Toledo, 
Ohio. Call them at 1-800-638-2723 for a catalog. The dumbell shaped 
clips are available in 7 sized ranging from tiny to mondo. Prices 
are 95 cents to $2.70 a dozen, or $4.30-$12.50 a gross. The split 
ring-type ones are more expensive: approx $2.50 per half dozen. They
come in 4 sizes. They are rated at 18-80 pounds, but once you remove 
the swivel part they'd be far stronger. 

They also have clips I would not consider using for C/L (especially
Combat) not because they are weak but because they have protrusions 
that might snag the lines (your opponent's?) or the other clip at 
embarassing times. (Come to think of it the same might be true for 
rockets and shroud lines but you can slip latex tubing, or wrap tape
over the clip) The most promising appear to be the Romer Interlock 
and the Duolock Snaps. I have some of the latter.. incredibly strong 
_and_ light.








-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: <Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu>  (Roger Wilfong)
Subject: Re: 29mm Nosecone?
Organization: UofM Hospitals
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 19:39:00 GMT

In Article <1992Oct8.135401.27433@axis.dsg.ti.com> "barrett@add.itg.ti.com" says:
> 
>   Does anyone know the source of nosecones that I could use for these
> 29mm motor mount tubes?  Nothing fancy, balsa would be fine.  I don't
> need a very long one either (2-3" would be just fine).  I'll just epoxy
> them onto the motor mount tube anyway.
> 
>   I've checked LOC, Aerotech, THOY catalogs and have come up empty.  I
> really don't want to turn my own!
> 
  
NCR used to have an aerofoam cone that fit a 29mm tube but they have dropped
all of the aerofoam cones from their catalog.  You might see if they have 
any kicking around that they want to close out (while you're at it, see if
they have any BT-23, I need a 34" piece to rebuild a rocket that I pranged
this summer).
You also might try AAA they sometimes have a odd selection of cones.  The last
place I can think of is FSI - I don't have a copy of their catalog handy 
but I think a couple of their kits are 29mm (the OSO comes to mind but that 
may be 27mm).
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: Not a NARAM Summary...
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:22:51 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <1992Oct8.171352.16982@infonode.ingr.com>, jim@doink.b23b.ingr.com (James B. Reed) writes:
> It was advertised as a high power demonstration launch...
> the star of the show was to be a 21 pound, 7 1/2 foot tall V-2...

I assume from your description that this was a publicly advertised
demonstration launch.

> 3 FX
> engines for a Realistic (tm) smoke effect...
> They fired the
> FX engines one at a time, boy was I underwhelmed.  They don't
> really do much for 7.5 foot rocket...

Should I ask if this bird had ever been test-flown...?

> It had a fiberglass body...
> a single J engine...
> straight into the cotton field, ... 
> pretty well shattered...

Sigh.
-- 

cdt@pdp.sw.stratus.com      --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: jim@doink.b23b.ingr.com (James B. Reed)
Subject: Re: Not a NARAM Summary...
Reply-To: jimreed@b23b.b23b.ingr.com
Organization: Intergraph Corporation, Huntsville, AL.
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 21:05:42 GMT

In article <7182@transfer.stratus.com>, cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares) writes:
|> In article <1992Oct8.171352.16982@infonode.ingr.com>, jim@doink.b23b.ingr.com (James B. Reed) writes:
|> > the star of the show was to be a 21 pound, 7 1/2 foot tall V-2...
|> 
|> Should I ask if this bird had ever been test-flown...?

Since the publicly advertised purpose of the launch was to
commemorate the V-2's 50th anniversary, I doubt they wanted
to risk losing the rocket with a test flight.

|> > It had a fiberglass body...
|> > a single J engine...
|> > straight into the cotton field, ... 
|> > pretty well shattered...
|> 
|> Sigh.

After thinking a little more about it, I wonder if the
large diameter of the V-2 was the reason for the ejection
failure.  Maybe the ejection charge just wasn't up to the
task.

-- 
James B. Reed                | If at first you don't succeed,
Intergraph Corporation       | Find out why,
jimreed@b23b.b23b.ingr.com   | **THEN** try again.
(205) 730-8874               |
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: cgaeth@nyx.cs.du.edu (Christopher Gaeth)
Subject: Has anyone built the Knight Star IV?
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix @ U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 92 12:37:08 GMT


Has anyone built the Knight Star IV that was rumored to be on
Calvin.nmsu.edu?  Since Calvin is done for the count I haven't been able
to get the plans.  Does anyone have any suggestions for first RC
boost-glider?  Please respond to my e-mail address listed below.  I don't
always have this newsgroup available.  Thanks in advance.

cgaeth@amsaa-cleo.brl.mil
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: NARAM SUMMARY????
Date: 15 Oct 92 21:55:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: usenet.Bw6nJt.9E9
Organization: Indiana University

In article <19921007182919.Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu> <Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu>  (Roger Wilfong) writes:

>BTW, I tried to get my brother inlaw to switch to 'Rocket Golf' (tm) but he 
>just looked at me incredulously.

There is "archery golf" - would this involve bazookas?  9-)




-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: iqv@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
Subject: belleville hobby?
Date: 15 Oct 92 09:45:23 EDT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Cornell University

What's the scoop with belleville hobby?  the number that's been posted a couple
of times seems to be wrong, and it wasn't listed in Ill. information.  Does
anyone know what the phone number is?  I just got my first order of parts from
estes, and it seems pretty expensive.  ( I forgot to order the nose cone :-(  )
or does anyone know of discount mail order places?

                                      	Thanks
                                           David Sebba


Newsgroups: rec.models.rockets
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: NARAM SUMMARY????
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 20:00:45 GMT

In article <19921002165451.Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu> <Roger.Wilfong@umich.edu>  (Roger Wilfong) writes:

>> D Dual Egg Lofting Duration (provisional event)
>The only problem with ELD is that you use a big chute for a long duration.
>If you come down fast enough that you break the egg(s), you're probably not
>competitive any way.  ELA is a better event.

Hmmm.. Wouldn't you want to use the biggest chute you could get
away with, or am I missing something here? Is there a serious weight 
penalty? I assume long duration = good? Do people tweak parachute 
size like indoor rubber fliers tweak rubber cross section and props?
I assume everyone weighs their eggs..











-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !