From: joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Dworkin (was Re: Liberty)
Date: 28 Dec 92 15:51:21 GMT
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <1992Dec28.091423.230@gems.vcu.edu> kkenny@gems.vcu.edu (Karen Kenny aka Mel) writes:
>In article <18223@autodesk.COM>, owen@autodesk.com (D. Owen Rowley) writes:
>> 
>> this kind of bitterness upsets me.
>> Not because it affects me personally in any way, but because the empathic 
>> part of me, the part my ascii pals don't get to know until they become
>> real world pals, feels the pungent sting of these words on the pallette.
>
>As a womyn, there are lots of instances that upset me too, D. Owen, that
>_do_ affect me personally.  I'm sure that Andrea has had her share of
>instances too.  What you may call "bitterness" might be another's reality.
>Why is it that the the actions that lead Andrea to writing what she does
>are not examined, but merely the reactions that such words evoke in a
>subset of its readers?  
> 
>> It seems to me that some clear thought about goals and how best to achieve
>> them is a lot better use of time than hanging onto the roll of hate-object
>> and squeezing bitter tears from the memory of past injustice.
>
>Like wimmin haven't been putting "clear thought" into THEIR goals
>and how best to achieve them!!  You sound like _another_ man
>trying to tell wimmin what is _best_ for them, D. Owen. <YAWN>

No, he sounds like the author of "A Critique of Feminism", printed in
the '70s. The author is, BTW, a woman. He also sounds like Germaine
Greer, and quite a few other feminist authors. "A Critique of
Feminism" starts with the Redstocking Manifesto as a case-study (of
sorts) in bad reasoning, and stillborn goal-creation within the ranks
of mainstream feminism. I happen to think that "A Critique of
Feminism" is one of the best blueprints for an agenda of sexual
liberation (and I mean /sexual/ liberation, not specialist
(transgender, pedophile, S&M, prostitution), in the sense of
liberating groups of people from the restrictions of what is permitted
or tolerated in society when it hurts nobody and certainly enhances
some people's lives) I've ever read.

The reason why Dworkin's sources are not examined to lead her to write
badly is because virtually anything can lead to unclear thinking and
bad writing. An upset stomach. Chronic multiple-rape scenarios by
father and brothers with mother watching. Teenage acne. An unpleasant
college professor. Violent lesbian rape in prison. Honestly, it
completely trivializes serious influences by the possibility of
irrelevant influences. What would be more interesting would be the
identification of what in her writing is good, and worth thinking
about, and what are the sources of /that/. 

Unfortunately what you quote from Owen leads from Dworkin to 'all
women'. I can't speak for Owen, but I don't believe that Dworkin
represents /women/ w.r.t. feminism any more than Donna Summer and "Bad
Girls". Dworkin gives good rant, startling, but rant nonetheless. I
don't agree with what Germaine Greer writes, but she writes /very
well/ and /very convincingly/.
-- 
US Jojo; damp, slighly soiled, but tasty nonetheless.