HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc,rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: Insuring your events
Date: 15 Sep 92 17:05:05 GMT
Followup-To: rec.models.rc
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

In article <BuFvK4.8s4@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib) writes:

> Just wondering though. Unless you need or want _$2 million_ coverage
> whats the point of belonging to _both_ organizations?

That's the flip side of the question most modelers are asking, which is:
if you're not active in competition, why pay $40 for the $15 or $25 worth 
of insurance you need to get access to your local flying field?

> Similarly, of 
> what utility would this program have been to the AMA 2 years ago? Would
> the AMA be able to cut its membership fee down to $15 if SFA had taken 
> over the insurance part of it? I really doubt it.  The insurance part 
> of AMA dues is, from what I have heard, far smaller than $25. The dif-
> ference is used to finance the many other programs AMA runs, including 
> several national events and competitions. The result would have been 
> an _increase_ in total dues (since AMA has to now fork over $25 per 
> member to the SFA for insurance) or a gutting of the many AMA programs.

This is all based on an invalid business assumption.  You're assuming 
that SFA would still have needed to charge $25 per member if the AMA
board had agreed to transfer the entire membership of AMA to their program
as a lump enrollment.  But they didn't, and so SFA must, at least for the 
moment, charge what it charges.  Look for the price to drop as enrollment
grows.

If you feel good that your dues moneys finance national events and 
competitions you never go to (assuming you never do, and most AMA
members DON'T) then by all means, do what you like with your money.

The NAR, in contrast, doesn't subsidize events with dues -- we make
sure events are self-funding.  In fact, practically all of them make a 
profit, which is split between the host club and the Association's 
general fund, out of which money is allocated to improve member services.  
In effect, our events subsidize our members, and not the other way around.  
We feel this is the fairest way to serve our membership.

But you're right about AMA using members' dues to finance a whole host 
of activities that only a small percantage of the membership ever gets 
to participate in -- they've told us this in black and white, and
DEMANDED that we run our 1992 World Spacemodeling Championships the same
way.

By the way, after 1992 the AMA will be holding the rocketry world 
championships instead of the NAR.  In accordance with their philosophy, 
expect them to be allocating yet another chunk of your money to subsidize 
these events as well.
-- 

cdt@pdp.sw.stratus.com      --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: duncan@nevada.edu (DUNCAN MCCOY)
Subject: Re: CGM Eagle 2
Keywords: trainer, power
Organization: University of Nevada System Computing Services
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 23:56:09 GMT

In article <Bun2y1.6Dw@csn.org> eeak@teal.csn.org (Ed Krejcik) writes:
>Hi,
>
>I've been reading this Newsgroup for a while now and I figure I can
>get some good advice from you all.  Here's my scenario...
>
>I've built a CGM Gentle Lady (my first plane ever) and been flying it
>with much success.  I've had a few rough landing, but no crashes, and
>never damaged it in the process.  Now I want POWER!  I'm thinking about
>a CGM Eagle 2.  What I'm looking for is this:
>
> 1) Is this a good power trainer?
>
> 2) Is there anything I should know about building it?
>    Things like, "I would do this, instead of what the instructions say."
>             or, "You might want to reinforce this or that."
>
>Thanks in advance...
>
>Ed Krejcik
>mail to: eeak@pvi.com
>                                            I wish I had a cool .sig

Ed -

The CG Eagle II is one of the best trainers you can get. It's easy to
build, flies well and is fairly sturdy. I'd rate the plans and
instructions as some of the best in the business. If you follow the
directions precisely, you'll build a good airplane.

The kit gives you the option of 3-channel with rudder, elevator and
throttle or 4-channel with aileron, rudder, elevator and throttle.
Go with the 4-channel aileron version.

For power, you'll want a .40 - .45 engine. A good choice would be
the OS .40 FP. Doesn't cost a lot and is very reliable and not
the least fussy. Get an FM 4-channel radio with a jack for a buddy
cord (Futaba 4NBF or equivalent). The buddy cord will allow you to
slave your transmitter to an instructor's. That way you can learn to
fly your plane without having to pass the transmitter back and
forth "in extremis."

The Eagle II can be set up for gentle training and later, control
throws can be increased for a little sportier approach to flying.

It's a good airplane and you can't go wrong with it. Other good
trainers are the Great Planes PT-40, the Midwest Aerostar and,
if you want an ARF, the Royal 40T.

Good luck.

Duncan



Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: FAQ? (questions about engines)
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 23:39:31 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.080417.2292@inland.com> bloom@inland.com writes:

>Actually nitromethane has less energy per volume than either methanol or 
>gasoline, but the stoichiometric ratio of nitromethane to oxygen is 
>larger than the ratio for the other fuels.  This means that you burn a 
>much greater volume of nitromethane per each stroke of your piston, and 
>subsequently produce more heat and more power.  In addition, nitromethane 
>by itself is a slower burning fuel than methanol and requires more 
>ignition advance to utilize its chemical energy efficiently.  Since 
>model engines do not have an easy way to change the ignition point using 
>a glow plug, high nitro fuels use a lot more propylene oxide to speed 
>up the burn rate of the fuel.  As an example, an extremely potent racing 
>fuel might contain 70% nitro, 10% propylene oxide and 20% oil and no 
>methanol.

Actually nitro is faster burning, since one must raise the head clearance
when running more nitro, or one runs into pre-ignition and overheating.In
model glows (which are in reality a form of glow-assisted diesel) the com-
pression ratio controls ignition timing. (It might be, though, that what 
nitro does is increase the _effective_ compression ratio, since after all 
there is more of a charge in the cylinder, so maybe the pre-ignition is 
caused by this and not because its "faster burning"..)

The propylene oxide might be needed to keep plugs lit after the head is 
raised, though. I've never heard of people putting this much propylene 
oxide in a fuel, though, except for that special 1/2-A blend I posted 
about.





-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Heli-engines and Airplane-engines
Date: 14 Sep 92 15:41:13 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

In article <1992Sep11.090414.7634@sm.sony.co.jp> kasuga@sm.sony.co.jp (Tomoaki Kasuga) writes:

>I have been enjoying flying helis few years.
>And recently started airplanes, too.

>My question is about difference between Heli-engines and Airplane-engines.
>I know usual Heli-engines have piston ring, and Airplane-engines have not.
>Why?

This is sometimes true, sometimes not. My guess is that they figure 
that a heli engine will ingest a lot of dirt, so they use a ringed
piston in an iron liner instead of the regular ABC/AAC setup.

I've taken Brat .28s apart and I've noticed that the heli versions 
also have a deeper boost port on the liner. 

Is there any difference in port timing, either for the liner ports 
and for the crank?





>I want to use my Heli-engines for my airplane.
>Will it be any trouble?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>	------------------------------------------------------------
>	Tomoaki Kasuga <kasuga@sm.sony.co.jp>    Workstation div. Sony Corp. 
>-- 
>	------------------------------------------------------------
>	Tomoaki Kasuga <kasuga@sm.sony.co.jp>    Workstation div. Sony Corp. 


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: pfoss@cmsa.gmr.com (Pete Foss PO/46)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Small 4-cycle recommendations?
Date: 9 Sep 92 15:50:36 GMT
Reply-To: pfoss@cmsa.gmr.com
Organization: Skymasters RC of Michigan

I flew a Goldberg Freedom 20 with the small OS four stroke (26?) on it.  It was a tad
under powered on takoff.  You really had to climb out very slowly.  I did not
adjust the neddle myself so I do not know if it was peaked out where it should be.
It may have been just too rich.
From: earl@trsvax.tandy.com
Date: 09 Sep 92 17:54 CDT
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: Small 4-cycle recommendations?
Message-ID: <1195667305@trsvax>
Nf-ID: #R:barsoom:715978504:trsvax:1195667305:000:1938
Nf-From: trsvax.tandy.com!earl    Sep  9 17:54:00 1992



/* ---------- "Small 4-cycle recommendations?" ---------- */
I'd like to move from R/C gliders to powered planes, as this will make
it much more convenient for me to fly -- there's plenty of sites around
here where I can fly powered, while it's nearly impossible to find a
good slope most of the time...  I want a 4-cycle because it's quieter,
and I want a small one (just about as small as possible, actually),
because I'd like to start out using it to power a light trainer, and
then progress to more "lively" small models later.  Probably, something
that'll be able to replace a glow motor of around .15 to .25 would be
great -- then I'd start out by slightly overpowering a light trainer
to allow for the greater weight of the engine.  (Seeing as I'll be
scratch-building these models, mostly from M.A.N. plans, I'd think
this would be simple.)
Any recommendations of what to get -- or what to avoid?  Or, for that
matter, comments on the feasibility of my strategy?  :-)
-tih
Tom Ivar Helbekkmo, NHH, Bergen, Norway.  Telephone: +47-5-959205
Postmaster for domain nhh.no.   Internet mail: tih@barsoom.nhh.no
************************************************

IMHO, I would recommend the ACE 4-20 model aircraft with a 
    OS 26 SURPASS or a HP (RJL) 21 four cycle engine.
      A 20 size ugly stick type model would also work OK.
    Unfortunately, for 20 size 4 cycle engines, I only know of these
    two engines.


***********************************************************************


<This information is provided by an individual and is not nor should be
 construed  as  being  provided  by  Radio  Shack or Tandy Corp.  Radio
 Shack/Tandy Corp has no obligation to support the information provided
 in  any way. > 
						
						Earl W. Bollinger
						@ <trsvax!earl>


"You were in the Clone Wars!", said Luke excitedly.
"Yes", replied Obi Wan, "I was a DOS programmer. But that was before the dark
 times, before OS2."


Xref: sparky rec.models.rc:3745 rec.models.rockets:2469
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc,rec.models.rockets
Subject: Re: Insuring your events
Date: 12 Sep 92 00:19:16 GMT
Organization: Indiana University

In article <6320@transfer.stratus.com> cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares) writes:

>Clearly, if you fly Control Line, you need to be an AMA member. If you
>like Model Aviation, you need to be an AMA member. That's fine with us..
>we have nothing against AMA. The people who founded Sport Flyers took
>the whole program to AMA two years before going public with it...and we
>would STILL like to work with AMA.

Just wondering though. Unless you need or want _$2 million_ coverage
whats the point of belonging to _both_ organizations? Similarly, of 
what utility would this program have been to the AMA 2 years ago? Would
the AMA be able to cut its membership fee down to $15 if SFA had taken 
over the insurance part of it? I really doubt it. The insurance part 
of AMA dues is, from what I have heard, far smaller than $25. The dif-
ference is used to finance the many other programs AMA runs, including 
several national events and competitions. The result would have been 
an _increase_ in total dues (since AMA has to now fork over $25 per 
member to the SFA for insurance) or a gutting of the many AMA programs.

(I restored the rocketry newsgroup to the Newsgroups: line since cdt 
(sorry-forgot your name) suggested that the rocketry people would be 
interested).

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
Xref: sparky rec.models.rc:3626 misc.forsale:25405 ba.market.misc:6856
From: miket@voder.nsc.com (Mike Tuason)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc,misc.forsale,ba.market.misc
Subject: RC HELICOPTER FORSALE
Keywords: $240: COMPLETE W/ENGINE AND RADIO FOR
Date: 5 Sep 92 01:02:23 GMT
Followup-To: poster
Distribution: ba
Organization: National Semiconductor, Santa Clara

FOR SALE:

	*GMP CRICKET RC HELICOPTER
 		- "easy to fly" small beginner's heli 
		- rugged all aluminum construction
		- simple rotor head design for inexpensive repairs
		- uses standard 4channel radio
		- CONTROLS:
			Engine throttle
			Cyclic pitch right/left
			Cyclic pitch fore/aft
			Tail rotor pitch
	
	*O.S. 28H HIGH PERFORMANCE HELICOPTER ENGINE
	 	
	*CIRCA 1989 FUTABA TRANSMITTER AND RECEIVER WITH 4 SERVOS.

	*MANUAL AND LOTS OF RC HELICOPTER FLYING NOTES.


	PARTS ARE READILY AVAILABLE FOR ALL OF THE ABOVE.


	PRICE:  $240.00 FOR EVERYTHING

		PLEASE CALL Michael at: (415)922-0753 
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: fisher@kay.enet.dec.com (kay::fisher)
Subject: re:AM vs FM AGAIN? - Have Mercy
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 05:17:23 GMT
X-Posted-Via: NEWS-NOTES gateway (a hack!)

>   Dual conversion on an AM?   I thought that dual conversion was impossible/
>   useless on an AM receiver because of the method of detecting an AM signal.
>   Besides,   I've yet to see an AM receiver that had 'Dual Conversion' on it.
>
>-- 
>          _____________________________________________________________
>          -                *                      _______   _~;       -
>          -            Paul Moreau               |       =_= /        -
>          -    Sr. Diagnostics Software Eng.     \   USA    /         -
>          -         Irvine, California      --->  *-_  ___ /          -
>          -     UUCP: ..!uunet!storcon!paulm         \/   \\          -
>          _____________________________________________________________

Well - I didn't want to answer till I was sure.
Check out Model Aviation October 1992 issue page 160.
The add for Kraft Midwest Inc. shows a dual conversion AM receiver.

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
################################################################################

Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: careyb@sweetpea.jsc.nasa.gov (Brian Carey 283-4181)
Subject: Air Brush
Keywords: air brush paint 
Organization: McDonnell Douglas Space Systems Company
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 13:03:43 GMT

I have a question for he air brush experts out on the net.
	First can one air brush on monokote?
	If you can air brush on monokote what kind of paint is used to prevent 
	glow fuel from dissolve or lift off the paint?
	Also can you give me some information on the thickness the paint 
	should be and what kind of preparation should be applied to 
	the monokote.

	Thank You in advance for any help in these matters.


	Brian C. Carey
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: fogarty@erenj.com (Ben Fogarty)
Subject: WANTED - Winch
Followup-To: rec.models.rc
Organization: Exxon Research & Engineering
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 14:59:13 GMT

My son has progressed in flying to the point he could use a winch to launch
his FUN and MERLIN. I think it would be good for him to practice launches
on a winch since they are used in contest flying. I am looking for a
reasonably priced winch (used is ok) with which we can practice and play. I
am willing to repair minor problems to save some money. Even suggestions
for a new unit would be appreciated

Ben Fogarty - Analyst
ER&E
Computing and Telecom Support Division
fogarty@erenj.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: bobwo@ecs.comm.mot.com (Bob Woodhouse)
Subject: Re: Airtronics / Futaba
Organization: secure_comm
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 21:56:17 GMT

In article <9209081551.AA08763@bottom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> Matthew D Marks <mmarks@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> writes:
>Hello Net...
>
>
>Quesion #2:
>He also has a spare Futaba s148 servo that he would like to use with his 
>Airtronics radio.  All he needs to do is solder on a servo connector, but the 
>Airtronics servo connector has the following scheme:
>
>Airtronics:                                         Futaba:
>             ---------black              black-------------
>to connector ---------black              red--------------- to servo
>             ---------black w/ red       white-------------
>
>How do these connect?
>
>Thanks
>Matt
>--
>======================================================================
>Matthew D. Marks                   ||   " In the race for quality,
>Mechanical Engineering Department  ||     there is no finish line. "
>The Ohio State University          ||
>e-mail: marks.23@osu.edu           ||              - David T. Kearns
>======================================================================


This question has come up recently.  I have e-mailed the answer to someone before,
but a follow-up posting contradicted my answer.  Perhaps someone will disagree with
my answer, but I have recently and succesfully followed verbal instructions from
Airtronics and written instructions on a spare Futaba connector I bought, so there.

Airtronics red or black/red    =  Futaba red 
Airtronics outer black         =  Futaba white 
Airtronics middle wire (black) =  Futaba black

The wires will cross in a twisted way, so don't worry about that.

Have a good day,
Bob Woodhouse
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Tangents (was: Re: FAQ? (questions about engines))
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 04:11:16 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.025001.18866@c3177208.ssr.hp.com> bill@c3177208.ssr.hp.com (Bill Chidester) writes:
>   Other fights I like to start are with statements like:  "Dry air cools
>   better than humid air" (not an easy one to put over on pilots, but 

True, if you are using evaporation of a liquid as your cooling method. Might
also be true otherwise, I'll have to think about it. A nice one is "dry air 
has a higher density than humid air" (easy when you remember N2 = 28 g/mol
and H2O = 18 g/mol).

>   almost anyone else will bite at it) and "An electric arc is a great heat
>   conductor".

Heh.. this one is over my head  8-)




-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: bloom@inland.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Re: FAQ? (questions about engines)
Date: 10 Sep 92 08:04:17 CST
Organization: Inland Steel Company; East Chicago, IN

In article <1992Sep9.142737.9933@ryn.mro4.dec.com>, barber@ad.enet.dec.com (ANDREW BARBER) writes:
> 
> Yes, I know an ideal engine is impossible (i didn't say it was)...I just cited
> it as an extreme case to demonstrate my point about waste heat. I think nitro
> has more energy per volume than the rest of the fuel.  In this manner, you are
> going to get more energy out of every stroke.  This energy will be split 
> bewteen excess heat (waste) and mechanical energy.  The ratio depends on how
> the nitro burns.  I think nitro also burns faster (higher power per volume).
> 
> 
> andy


Actually nitromethane has less energy per volume than either methanol or 
gasoline, but the stoichiometric ratio of nitromethane to oxygen is 
larger than the ratio for the other fuels.  This means that you burn a 
much greater volume of nitromethane per each stroke of your piston, and 
subsequently produce more heat and more power.  In addition, nitromethane 
by itself is a slower burning fuel than methanol and requires more 
ignition advance to utilize its chemical energy efficiently.  Since 
model engines do not have an easy way to change the ignition point using 
a glow plug, high nitro fuels use a lot more propylene oxide to speed 
up the burn rate of the fuel.  As an example, an extremely potent racing 
fuel might contain 70% nitro, 10% propylene oxide and 20% oil and no 
methanol.
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib)
Subject: Re: FAQ? (questions about engines)
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 04:42:57 GMT

Actually the only plugs I've looked at with heat ranges
were some OS's back in the mid-70s. I did remember that the 
hottest one of the range has a really thick element, and 
needed 3 volts to light. 

I'll have to get a hot and medium Fireball to compare to 
the 3 colds I have in my possesion and see. I haven't used
these yet since they have a propensity to blow seals. 

Rare glowplugs? I have a pair of Aldrich Magnums from who 
knows when...


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                          | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@SILVER.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS                 !
From: zap@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (ZaP!)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Sailplanes in the U.K.
Date: 10 Sep 1992 17:50:43 GMT
Organization: The UCSC Irregular Rocketeers
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: ucscb.ucsc.edu


I am going to be traveling to the U.K. this October and would like
to drag one of my slope gliders along and heave it off a hill.
Are there any good sites near London or Norwich that anyone can
recommend?  I keep saying I'll fly it off the cliffs of Dover, but
I am dubious of the practicality.

Please email any responses; I'm very far behind in the group.
(However, that doesnt mean _not_ posting something of intrest. =) )


-Ford					Internet: zap@ucscb.ucsc.edu
					UUCP    : zap@armory.com

[Insert tautology here.]
From: mrb@arrc.salf.ac.uk (Mark Burgin)
Newsgroups: rec.models.rc
Subject: Where can I get a Skylark RC Heli Simulator?
Date: 8 Sep 92 08:10:46 GMT
Reply-To: mrb@arrc.salf.ac.uk (Mark Burgin)
Organization: Advanced Robotics Research Centre, Salford, UK.

Does anyone know of a supplier of the Digital Wonder "Skylark" RC 
Helicopter Simulator for a PC.  I have just read a review of this system
in a magazine published here in the UK but the system does not seem to be
available over here yet.  I would be grateful if anyone could let me
know of the name, address and phone number of any supplier in the US 
that stocks this system and is set up to handle export orders.  It would be
helpful if you could also give me an indication of the price if you have
that info to hand.


Please reply by e-mail to mrb@arrc.salf.ac.uk as I cannot usually read the
rec.* newsgroups from this system.


Thanks

Mark Burgin (mrb@arrc.salf.ac.uk)