From: allanc@cs.su.oz.au (Restless Wanderer)
Subject: Re: South Africa, Australia, New Zealand.
Reply-To: allanc@cluster.cs.su.oz (Restless Wanderer)
Organization: Basser Dept of Computer Science, University of Sydney, Australia
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 22:39:40 GMT

In article <BxwAEH.75D@cantua.canterbury.ac.nz> wft@math.canterbury.ac.nz (Bill Taylor) writes:
>South Africa
>~~~~~~~~~~~~
>long injury-time, allowed the boks to squeak home with a respectable-looking
>loss. Subsequent events have proved how woefully inadequate this assessment was.
>
>It is clear, I think, that S.A. are nowhere near the 3rd best (i.e. England).
>Indeed, I think they would lose to Scotland right now; and might have a tough


	Time to disagree.I believe that if SA played any southern
	hemisphere team such as Fiji or West Somoa,the boks would
	get their buts kicked.
	Somoa would more than hold them in the forwards and the Somoan
	backline is quiet fleet of foot.Not afraid to tackle,and would not
	allow (all I can do is kick) Botha to do anything.

	Likewise with Fiji.Although the forwards may be smaller in stature
	what they lack in size they have in lineout ability.Ceratinly the
	Fiji style of play would frustrate the hell out of a big pack.
	Sa were not impressive in any tour match I watched.Shit they even 
	made England look good.

>time with Ireland or Wales, even, (though they would win these). So it
>seems their placing is FIFTH EQUAL; alongside France, (after Scotland).


	I place them at about 7th-9th in the world,just in front of Italy.

>Why have they declined so ? It is not due to lack of commitment or talent,
>obviously. The depth of their talent is still unrivalled, except perhaps by
>New Zealand.  It is obviously their techniques and tactics that are deficient;

	Where is the depth ? If Naas Botha can still make the number one
	5/8th,I'd be shocked to think that no-one else can fill his shoes.
	If that being the case,why didn't they replace him.
	It's too late after the horse has bolted.

	[ stuff about the SA abysmall lineouts deleted ]

>Australia & New Zealand
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>So at last we come to the matter of the top two teams in the world. Another
>flame war is bursting out over whether Oz is really number one, and if so by

	Excuse me but who won the latest world cup. ?
	I've had enough of those knockers that keep saying Australia
	has to keep winning to defend their title.Look we won it convincingly.
	What happens now has sweet FA to do about the WC.

>how much. Can we say one thing outright - as far as I'm aware no-one, not
>even the most one-eyed Kiwi supporter has ever suggested, from the world cup
>till now, that they are not the best. The only question is by how much.


	See above.Clive I konw you're not stupid,but we are as good as
	WC's.Sure at the present we are travelling hard due to injuries.
	Remember,we have been playing for over 20 months of International
	rugby.HAs anyone else done the same ? Not that my history books
	tell me.How much more do you guys want us to be before you accept
	that we do indeed have the depth.We loose FArr Jones,we win with 
	Slattery.WE loose Lynagh,we win with kelleher in the centres.
	We win with Daly,we win with his replacement.......come on give
	it a break.
	I'm not saying you are one eyed/biased but those wallabies and entourage	deserve some recognition of the great achievements they have  reached.

	I haven't seen a better side in my life than the WC squad of
	Australia.Closest was the French side of '78 era with John Pierre
	Rives as captain.

>The fact that the Aussies didn't crow shows clearly that they had precious
>little to crow about !

	In Aussie rugby we are taught to be humble,whether we win
	or lose.Winners are grinners and the rest can please themselves.

>>I would venture to suggest that Australia does not
>>posess anywhere near the strength in depth of, say, New Zealand.
>
>...and this is indeed the heart of the matter. This crop of injuries has been

	Bullshit to the above statement.What do you guys want.? Australia
	to fielda club side like Randwick as a stand in.? There'd still
	be no contest.Depth indeed ....Bwhahahahahahahahahah


>           \\         |
>            \\        | New Zealand has suffered injury problems just as
>             )`--')   | great on recent tours, but they have never left the
>            <  o /    | seeming disarray that we've got here. No satisfactory
>             `\  /    | rearrangements on the spot; and no suitable replacements
>              / /     | in sight.

	Listen Bill,when the thugs like Whetton,Buck and Loe all got suspended
	and were dropped from Internationals.I seem to remember cries of
	how NZ couldn't win without them.So wher's the depth if it takes three
	players to be the nucleus of the team.You guys were the one's whingeing.



>         /_,, ~~      |         BEWARE OZ; 1993 Bledisloe will be your Waterloo !

	If that happens,and I doubt it.I'd lay blame to the far to rigorous
	tour since the WC series,just to prove that we are the best.How many 
	years will we be required to keep up this tempo.



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