From: Bill.Carlson@p0.f18.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Bill Carlson)
Newsgroups: alt.messianic
Subject: ALMAH - BETULAH
Date: 8 Jan 93 15:33:04 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/18.0 - Midrash, Denver CO

---------SINCE THIS DISCUSSION APPLIES TO THIS NEWS GROUP AS WELL------
ON ISAIAH 7:14 {pg. 35}  "THE YOUNG WOMAN.  Hebrew HA'ALMAH means an
adolescent woman, one of marriageable age. [...] The Hebrew for
'virgin' is BETHULAH, though ALMAH too sometimes bears this meaning.
(ISAIAH Soncino Books Of The Bible Editor: Rev. Dr. A. Cohen M.A.
Ph.D., D.H.L. by The Rev. Dr. I. W. Slotki, M.A., Litt.D.  Revised by
Rabbi A. J. Rosenberg  The Soncino Press London - New York @ 1983 ISBN
0-900689-28-5)

As can plainly be seen, the Soncino Is. says EXACTLY what we've been
saying all along: that almah can bear the meaning of virgin, (contrary
to what one will hear on this net)!

And the quotations of Rashi on Is. 8:3, really have little bearing on
Rashi's quotations on Is. 7:4 in Midrash MIKRA'OT G'DOLOT.  [Which
verbatim quotations, ad loc, we still have not seen from certain
parties, contrary to what you've all been led to believe.)  Also
interesting to note: besides the fact that the Sincino Is. (pg.35)
states that "It is difficult to say with certainty who was the young
woman referred to."  The woman in Is. 8:3, (Isaiah's wife), conceives
after the prophecy in 7:14, (which has just been stated by the anti-
missionaries on here that the woman in 7:14 was ALREADY pregnant), and
the name of the child (8:3) is given as Maher-shalal-hash-baz, and
identified as Isaiah's son, where as in 7:14 such ideas as: "a wife of
King Ahaz (Kimchi), or a woman of the Royal Family (Abarbanel) may have
been the young woman of the text." -[Son.Is.pg.35].  Now... one may ask
themselves, if it is obvious that the two women in 7:14 and 8:3 are the
same, why do the Sages agree that in 8:3 it is Isaiah's wife, but in
7:14 they are unsure just who it is!  Come on folks, let's use a little
common sense here.  [Of course it would probally just be easier for
some to state that the Rabbi's were ignorant in stating that 7:14 and
8:3 were not the same person, but I'd find that argument hard to
believe!]

As to certain people who claim to be Orthodox needing a reff. to look
up the Midrash on Beresheet 1, on the Ruach of El*him being King'
Messiah - I'd be a little wary of that.  It is a quite famous portion
in the Midrash, and if they're maintaining that they need more info,
either they're NOT Orthodox, didn't attend Yeshiva very long and are
ignorant of the writings of the Sages, -OR- they have a hidden agenda!

Many/most of us on here have probally seen the painting of a famous
Rabbinic Judaic painter on the creation -(his name escapes me at the
moment) which when he comes to that portion in Beresheet paints a man
with a beard and a crown on His head, and the bottom portion of His
body looking like a 'spirit', floating over the water. - But while
this doesn't really have much of anything to do with anything; the
case of the Midrash not having HA/THE before Mashiach has really no
bearing on much of anything, since the construction is most specific
as to who it is talking about:

...and who is the Ruach/Spirit of El*him that is hovering over the
face of the water - NONE OTHER THAN KING MESSIAH!

(I think it is equally as clear, that the nation "Israel" isn't
floating over the face of the water :-)  But be that as it may, it
becomes painfully obvious that dealing with anti-missionaries is
havel-havelim, as there is more smoke with their strange-fire than
substance!

... 012 they heard the Voice of HaShem El*him walking in the garden...210
--  
Bill Carlson - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
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