Organization: Penn State University
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 20:07:10 EDT
From: Tim Bieling <QAA@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: Gays want to be left alone???

In article <CHRISTIA%92091508455369@ASUACAD.BITNET>, Barry Wadsworth
<BARRYW@UCSFVM.BITNET> says:
>
>Tim,
>If you want to hear ranting, look at this weeks Newsweek.
>Talk about BIASED JOURNALISM!

I scanned the article when I was at my parent's place this past
weekend - I don't recall enough of it to really comment on it tho.

>It is interesting how people who don't agree with me
>will try any tactic to shut me up or make what I said
>look rediculous.  But, just read Romans 1:26. Then
>re-read what I said.  Just because I feel that we should
>heed warnings written in the Bible, does that mean I
>should seek professional help?

What I said to you was probably just as intolerant as what you
originally wrote, for that I apologize.  However, what you wrote
smacked of some "fear" that gay people want to take over this
country, etc, etc - I find that kind of attitude very intolerant.

From all that I've read, the very few mentions of homosexuality
in the Bible refer more to prostitution, lust, etc.  I don't see
any references to save-sex loving couples.  You referred me to
Romans 1:26 - this is what my (online) Bible has:  (I included 1:27
as well)
"
ROM 1:26  For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their
 women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

ROM 1:27  And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman,
 burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is
 unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which
 was meet.
"
I don't see anything in 1:26 which would apply to me, and even 1:27 is vague.
I am a gay man, so my "natural use of the woman" doesn't include any kind
of intimate relationship with her.  I, however, am in love with my boyfriend.
I don't lust for him (as in 1:27), I am in love with him - a serious
monogamous committed relationship - I can't even fantasize about anyone
else because I'd feel guilty for doing so.

You could never understand how I feel (and how what you wrote made me
feel) - instead, you get on your soapbox and toss out all this stuff
about some agenda that all us gay people have.  I don't have any sort
of agenda - I simply ask for the same rights that everyone else enjoys
in this country - you seem bent on locking all of "us" up because we
pose some threat.

You may disagree, and continue to feel that homosexual acts (whatever
they are) are a sin - that's fine by me.  When you suggest that gov't
should legislate based on that belief, that's when you cross the line.
The government should protect my rights as well as yours - from what
you've said, you want government to protect your rights, but take away
mine (or not even give them to me in the first place).

If there's any agenda in the "gay community" it's a demand for tolerance!
Darren made a good point about "us" just wanting to be left alone - but
that includes getting government off "our" backs.

Comments?

>Anyway, thanks for your opinion.

'Welcome - but, try re-reading what you wrote and do as others have -
subsitute "christian" in every place you mention "homosexual", and think
about how that reads.  (Also, read up on how Hitler managed to gain such
power in Germany - all he did was place blame on "them" and gain popular
support because he told people what they wanted to hear...)

-Tim