HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jones@pyrite.cs.uiowa.edu (Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879)
Subject: Re: Questions about turntables
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 14:27:49 GMT
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA

From article <45460019@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM>,
by js@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Jon Sawyer):
> 
> Or is scratchbuilding the One True Way to getting a reasonable turntable?
	I'm midway through scratchbuilding a 90 footer in HO.  Since I
	have a rule that I don't begin one module till I finish the
	last one up to a runnable level, the darned thing has stalled
	my layout for over a year.  I've learned quite a lot, though.

> Any hints or tricks on TT assembly:  bending the pit rail,
	Build yourself a rail bender.  That is a jig where the rail
	is held by three points, all bearing on the web of the rail,
	two pushing from what will be the outside of the curve and
	one pressing from what will be the inside.  You adjust the
	inside contact point to put a bit of a bend in the rail, then
	slide the jig along the rail to uniformly bend the whole
	length.  That done, you tighten the jig and do it again and
	again until your rail is bent to the right radius.

	For each contact point, I used a screw holding a stack of three
	washers, two small diameter, and one large diameter, the edge
	of which rides on the web of the rail.  The small diameter
	washer below it keeps it from binding on the foot of the rail.

> techniques for providing detentes to prevent the bridge from moving
> while boarding,
	I'll use a stepping motor drive with a "zero slop" geartrain,
	so the motor will provide the detent.

> quick and easy ways to motorize, etc.?
	One big (4") spur gear is what I'm using, directly driven by
	a small gear on a stepping motor.

> I saw a Model Masterpieces turntable kit for a 100' steel turntable
> for about $50.  Any specific comments on this kit?
	None, but for that price, considering the work I've put into my
	table, it's probably worth it.

> Also, at what angles are roundhouse stalls typically arranged?
	There's no standard.  It depends on how far back from the table
	the house is.  If it's far back, the angle is small, and the
	rails frequently end up crossing with frogs before they reach
	the edge of the pit.  If real-estate is hard to get, you push
	the house closer to the pit, and the clearance requirements
	needed to put a roof-support post between each pair of engine
	doors pushes the angle wider, and leads to more storage space
	around the head ends of the engines.

				Doug Jones
				jones@cs.uiowa.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames)
Subject: Re: Command Control: What is the current state of NMRA standard?
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 14:52:43 GMT

In article <1992Nov21.235430.23987@u.washington.edu> ryanm@stein.u.washington.edu (Ryan Mcneilly) writes:
>
>I remember reading a few messages on this a while back but could someone
>give an update of where the NMRA is at on deciding on a standard?  If they
>aren't close yet how about a comparison of the various systems out there. 
>Thanks.  --Ryan

The NMRA Electrical Committee/Command Control Working Group continues to
progress in its definition of a standard.  Hopefully a draft of the lower
layers of the standard can be released for widespread discussion in about
a month or so with the packet definition folowing a month or two later.

It will be mid 94 at the earliest before the NMRA makes any finial decision
on this topic.  I should note that even after a standard is chosen, multiple
choices will still be available.  For example, CTC based systems will continue
to be popular long after a standard is around, even though it looks like
CTC systems may not be compatable with the emerging standard.

The current draft of the standard was based upon the Lenz system but has 
several enhancements.  The dificulity at the present time is defining
a specification that is flexible enough yet precise enough for multiple
implementation philosphies.

There are several manufactures developing command stations based upon the
earlier draft with December/January release dates.  At present all receivers
use the Lenz microcode but other microcode will be available in the spring.

Committee Membership is open to anyone willing to do work.  It is also
possible to monitor our work as many of us are on line and we have formed
a distribution list.  If you are interested in either please send me a 
note.

Stan Ames
sra@mitre.org
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: smb@ulysses.att.com (Steven Bellovin)
Subject: Re: rec.models.railroad Fortnightly FAQ
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 05:17:44 GMT
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories

In article <ANDRE.92Nov17174041@king.slc.mentorg.com>, andre@king.slc.mentorg.com (Andre' Hut) writes:
>    >I'm not sure I agree with this.  For starter layouts, their snap switches
>    >might be a better idea; they match the 18" curvature of the sectional
>    >track, which makes life easier if you're not using flex track.  Also,
>    >if you get unpowered turnouts, especially Atlas, I'd recommend a ground
>    >throw or *something* to provide extra spring pressure.
> 
> #4 turnouts *are* the ones that match 18" track.  By unpowered, he
> means the ones that are manual.  It's the same Atlas switch machine
> without the solenoid.

No.  I mean the Snap-Switch, which comes in brass or nickel-silver,
manual or powered.  (These are part numbers 50, 51, 850, 851, 60, 61,
860, 861).  It has the geometry of a piece of 18" radius curved track
laid on top of the straight section.  The #4 Customline turnouts, for
which the switch machine is always an add-on, are entirely different;
they're numbers 241, 242, 281, 282, 281 BR, and 282 BR.  The curved
rail is much straighter.  According to John Armstrong's ``Track
Planning for Realistic Operation'', the Atlas #4 is really a #4.5, and
has a substition radius (in HO) of 36".  Even a real #4 is a 29"
radius.

>    >Include some Testor's liquid glue (also not great around young children;
>    >for that matter, it give me a headache sometimes) and an X-Acto knife.
> 
> Use the Testor's that comes in the cube-like bottle.  The thick stuff in the
> tube is worthless.

Yes, that's what I meant when I wrote ``liquid''.  Should be in the FAQ.
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: jsm@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (John Scott McCauley Jr.)
Subject: lightweight layout construction
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 20:17:28 GMT

How about this for the FAQ:

Q. How do I make a lightweight yet sturdy layout?
A. ???

Anyone want to answer this question? I've appended two old articles about
using foam for scenery. I'd like more info about using lightweight products
(foam core board?) for subroadbed. 

	Scott
From: wey@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (william.e.yoder)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: styrofoam scenery
Summary: another foam idea
Date: 29 Oct 91 12:27:26 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories

In article <1991Oct28.162640.29363@aio.jsc.nasa.gov>, bunce@asd2.jsc.nasa.gov (Tom Bunce) writes:
> In article <ZOO.91Oct25144348@lynx.spa.umn.edu> zoo@aps1.spa.umn.edu (david d
> [zoo] zuhn) writes:
> >[ styrofoam for scenery leaving lot of charged debris ]


I used another foam product called extruded foam. It usually comes in 
either pink or blue. It is very stong, especially when laminated in 
1 inch layers. You don't have the beading problem when cutting it. It is
a little more expensive, about $10 for a 4x8 ft, 1 inch sheet. I used
it on two 6 foot modules at our club and it makes for very light and
strong modules. Everyone wants to carry them when we haul them to shows.

Check in the yellow pages for foam distributers. It works great!!

Bill Yoder

Article 5803 of rec.railroad:
From: sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re:Model: Scenery & Is MITRE a railfan employer??? =8^)
Date: 6 Nov 91 15:12:39 GMT
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA

Actually there are a lot more than three railfans here.

On the questions on strofoam scenery Tony Steele developed a technique where
concrete patch is applied over the styrofoam.  Although this might seem
strange at first it has several advantages.  

1) it is strong and it holds up well for both permanent layouts and modules.

2) it actually looks like rock or roads.

3) it is quick to apply and it dries hard overnight. We have made drastic 
changes to the scenery on a module two days before a show without problems.

4) it stains and takes paint very well without losing its texture.

5) it is actually lighter since less concrete patch is used than would normally
be used in the plaster technique.

The concrete patch used is actually a vinyl based product that can be found at
hardware stores.

The technique calls for shaping the styrofoam to an approximate shape and then
applying a thin layer of the concrete patch over it.  For roads a puty knife
is used to give a smoth texture.  For rock cuts a knife is used to shape
the concrete.  For ground a wet sponge is used to give the concrete surface
the desired texture.  Once dry the ground is painted the desired earth color
and whatever ground material added while the paint is wet.  When the paint
is dry you are left with very realistic scenery.

Experience at module shows indicates that the plaster technique can have 
have problems over time.  The concrete module experienced one problem when 
someone fell on it and cracked one area of thin concrete.  This was repaired in 
an hour and no other than the guilty party is the wiser.

Stan Ames
From: mdb@csc.liv.ac.uk (Martin Beer)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: remote peco switches
Date: 20 Nov 92 17:21:01 GMT
Organization: Computer Science, Liverpool University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]

Wes Barris (wes@uf.msc.edu) wrote:
> In article <Bxxn2I.Gz7@math.uwaterloo.ca>, rajacobs@plg.uwaterloo.ca (Rory Jacobs) writes:
> |> Hi,
> |> 
> |> I recently purchased some N scale #6 Peco (electrofrog) switches, and
> |> the switch machines.  Eagerly I awaited there arrival in the mail, and
> |> today I received them.
> |> 
> |> So I hooked up the switch machine to the turnout, and the switch
> |> machine doesn't have enough force to over come the spring to turn
> |> the points (?)  (ie.  to switch the direction of the turnover).
> |> The switch machine does work, but just not when the pin is in the
> |> throw bar since it doesn't exert enough force.
> |> 
> |> Any Suggestions?  Should I return the switch machines?  Should
> |> I return the switches?  Any help greatly appreciated!
> |> 
> 
> I have a number of HO Peco switches and switch machines.  I have never seen
> an N scale Peco switch machine so I can only assume that it is designed in
> the same way as an HO version -- only smaller.
> 
> All of mine work fine when I power them from any of my MRC (1500, 2500, etc.)
> power packs.  However, I once tried to power them from a cheap (old) Tyco
> transformer.  When I did this, I had the same problem that you have described.
> 
> My conclusion was that you needed a "reasonable" power source in order for
> the switch machines to operate properly.

Peco make only one point motor which is compatible with all their range.

I use Peco N gauge track exclusively, together with their point motors.

I do not have any problems with them so long as they are installed
directly under the tie bar, and are checked carefully before
installation.  I originally tried to install them under the baseboard,
using the extension wire provided, but found that that was very unreliable.

The special adaptor which is supposed to allow the point moter to
be installed on the top of the baseboard works so long as it is installed
with care, and glued down well (make sure that you do not glue the actuating
bar in as well!).

The coils are quite weak, and can be easily burnt out if current is left on them.
I therefore use a capacitor discharge unit between the transformer
and the control panel.  In the UK these usually provide 24v or so for a
few seconds, and are powerful enough to switch up to four or so points.
I normally only switch two on a single contact (the top of a small bolt
fixed in a geographic control panel, touched by a wandering pen contact).
Once contact is broken the capacitor unit recharges rapidly enough
to be ready as soon as the operator wants to set the next point).

Suitable capacitor discharge units are available from a number
of sources which advertise regularly in the Railway Modeller,
and most books on electronics for model railways give suitable
circuits.

Martin
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: Steven.Schultz <Steven.Schultz@mixcom.mixcom.com>
Subject: books, magazines, video for sale UPDATE
Organization: Milwaukee Internet Xchange BBS, Milwaukee, WI U.S.A.
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 01:30:48 GMT

For sale:
 
MAGAZINES:
NOTE: I'll look for a specific topic or provide an index on request.
 
TRAINS:
7/90
 
TRAINS ILLUSTRATED:
9/89
 
PASSENGER TRAIN JOURNAL:
3/84, 7/84-3/85, 7/85, 12/85-3/86, 1/87-5/87, 7/87, 7/90
 
BOOKS:
Southeastern Wisconsin Regional Planning Commission Community
Assistance Planning Report #30: Whitewater Area Rail Service Plan
 
The Lake Superior Iron Ore Railroads by Patrick C. Dorin
 
High Green to Marceline: Santa Fe in color series Volume 1 by Joe
McMillan
 
OMilwaukee Road Narrow Gauge: The Chicago, Bellevue, Cascade, and
Western, Iowa's Slim Princess by John Tigges and Jon Jacobson
 
Contact me if interested. Make an offer on any of these items.

-- 
Steve Schultz     Steven.Schultz@mixcom.com
From: fulks@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: TYCO HO; thanks
Date: 17 Nov 92 14:11:36 MDT
Organization: Utah State University


Just wanted to say "thanks" again to all of you who have advised me
on the HO scale train situation (bought a TYCO set for my 5 year old).
Other advice on what to look for, and look out for this Christmas 
season is welcome!

	Thanks,
			Steve Fulks
			Utah State Univ.
From: SDupa@xview.csuohio.edu (Scott Hewis)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Athearn 6-axle locos - minimum radius
Date: 19 Nov 92 19:44:33 GMT
Organization: Cleveland State University - Telecomm

In article <92323.213357GRW104@psuvm.psu.edu> <GRW104@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 21:33:57 EST
>From: <GRW104@psuvm.psu.edu>
>Subject: Athearn 6-axle locos - minimum radius

>I'd appreciate any help on this question:

>What's the minimum operating track radius for Athearn's
>6-axle diesels with body-mounted couplers (e.g., FM
>Trainmaster, SD's)?  Even if they run on, say, 18 inch
>radius curves, is coupler overhang a problem?

>Thanks in advance

>G. Weaver

G. Weaver:

My son's Athearn SD-40 with KD couplers ran on 18" radius track and through
#4 turnouts with no problems whatever. This was running by itself or in
multiple-unit operation with up to three units.

Scott Hewis
--------------------------------------
* Scott Hewis; Telecom Specialist    *
* Cleveland State University         *
* email c/o scott@asgard.csuohio.edu *
--------------------------------------
From: js@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Jon Sawyer)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 18:59:38 GMT
Subject: Questions about turntables
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Loveland, CO
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad


I'd like to solicit opinions on HO scale turntable kits.  I'm looking
for a turntable of about 100', modern era, but I am also interested in
any information on other sizes and eras as well.

What are people's opinions on the various kits available?  Or is
scratchbuilding the One True Way to getting a reasonable turntable?
Any hints or tricks on TT assembly:  bending the pit rail, techniques
for providing detentes to prevent the bridge from moving while
boarding, quick and easy ways to motorize, etc.?

I saw a Model Masterpieces turntable kit for a 100' steel turntable
for about $50.  Any specific comments on this kit?

Also, at what angles are roundhouse stalls typically arranged?  As the
space I have for my roundhouse is rather limited, I'd like to minimize
the distance between the TT and the roundhouse, at the expense of
increasing the angle between stalls.  Are there kits available that
allow me to do this?  Or is there a "standard" roundhouse stall angle?
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: nolan@twg.com (Nolan Hinshaw)
Subject: Re: lightweight layout construction
Reply-To: nolan@twg.com
Organization: I'm here. Where are you?
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 01:21:15 GMT


The NMRA Bulletin has had an intermittent series of articles on construction
using extruded foam and Polyterrain scenery products. In the latest issue the
authors presented a 4'X8' layout build almost entirely with foam board,
including the framework.
--
Nolan "Man enough to do woman's work" Hinshaw
Internet: nolan@twg.com			Dingalingnet: (415)962-7197	

Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: johnh@borland.com (John Haskey)
Subject: Re: Great Model Railroads '92 seen?
Originator: johnh@genghis.borland.com
Organization: Borland International
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 21:50:50 GMT

I received my copy by mail about three weeks ago.  Anybody else agree that
the logging layout by the japanese modeler was one of the nicest for its 
size that you've seen?
								---john.

-- 
---------
johnh@genghis.borland.com
My opinions are my own but I'll gladly share them with you!
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad,rec.railroad
From: jones@pyrite.cs.uiowa.edu (Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879)
Subject: Re: Pantograph pickup width Swiss 460
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 05:30:23 GMT
Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA

From article <urf.722020840@sw2001>, by urf@icl.se (Urban F):
> I read in mbz 5/92 that Roco's HO model of the new Swiss class
> 460 engines has a pantograph with a pickup only half the width
> (+- 3mm instead of +- 6mm) of what the NEM standard says.
> 
> Presumably this corresponds with a similar decrease on the
> prototype. How has this been accomplished?

I've always been impressed with Swiss catenary, because they
seem to make more consistant use of curved catenary than any
other place I've been.  That is, when rounding a curve, the
catenary wire (or top wire, or support wire) is off to one
side, so that it pulls the running wire to the side at every
support point.  This keeps the running wire within a few
(prototype) centimeters of the centerline of the track, so
narrow pickup shoes should pose no problems.

By comparison, most catenary I've seen in the US, or France and
Italy, for that matter, has been strung with the support wire
directly above the running wire, so that both hang straignt
from one lineside support pole to the next.  This leads to
deviations of on the order of 10 to 20 cm from the centerline
of the track on a curve, and it clearly needs a wider shoe for
safe running.

				Doug Jones
				jones@cs.uiowa.edu
tjhe
From: franco@bbn.com (Frank A. Lonigro)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Computer Layout Programs
Date: 16 Nov 92 20:02:46 GMT
Organization: BBN Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: franco.bbn.com

Hi:
	It seems that all of these packages are made for IBM's and compatibles.
Has anyone heard of these companies making a version for the Apple Macintosh?
I have something I got about 4 years ago for the Mac called "MacInooga
Choo Choo".  It's cute, but not good enough for serious layout design.

Thanks,
-franco
From: hansend@physc1.byu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: dual motor DD40's
Date: 16 Nov 92 03:54:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: physc1.1992Nov16.105412.205
Distribution: world
Organization: Brigham Young University

>> the model has two motors, connected with a rod that goes past the "open"
>> section in the body. this seems to be to keep the motors (each of which
>> power one of the D trucks) sync'd, which keeps the wheels spinning at the
>> same rate. when i take this off, they seem to spin that way anyway (slipping
>> seems nonexistant). is there a good reasoin to leave this rod there, or can
>> i take it off and not expect problems? what problems will i get if they do
>> go at differnet speeds? why is this different frmo having two smaller locos
>> that are not connected?
> 
> Well, all I can say is try it. It won't hurt unless you notice them not running
> well together, you can always turn off the electricity. As I recall, mine has
> a universla joint I think, on the rod that connects the 2 motors. I've thought
> of doing that too, and closing up the inside of the hole to make it look
> more like the prototype
> good luck
> 

This is rather interesting.  I have two Athearn DD40's from the mid 80's 
when they were last produced.  Both of mine have two motors, and NO 
connection between the two motors.  I have never had any problem with 
them running out of synch or anything.  I would think that a big 
universal connecting the two motors passing through the gap between the 
engines would look rather toylike and silly.  I am surprised that the 
model was ever produced this way.

Doug Hansen  Hansend@physc1.byu.edu
From: mcghee@hpscit.sc.hp.com (Glenn McGhee)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 17:57:21 GMT
Subject: Re: Info about G Scale
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Clara, CA
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad

In rec.models.railroad, wey@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (william.e.yoder) writes:
      .
   Stuff Deleted
      .

> Brass track is one of the best conductors of electricity, but as 
> it oxidizes, the film that forms hampers the flow of electricity.

  According to the Handbook of Chemistry and Physics, aluminum is a much 
better conductor than brass.  Brass has an resistance of 7.00 microhoms
per centimeter whereas aluminum has 2.824 microhoms per centimeter.  That
shows aluminum has less that one-half the resistance of brass.  I do not
have numbers on nickel silver but here is a list other metels.

   METAL          Microhoms per centimeter

   Silver          1.59   <----------------Best conductor
   Copper          1.771                     
   Gold            2.44
   Aluminum        2.824
   Brass           7.00
   Nickel          7.80
   Tin            11.5
   Steel          11.9
   Lead           22.00
   German silver  33.00    (18% Nickel)

---
 Glenn McGhee  Hewlett-Packard Company                     _____
 Bldg. 53U/87  5301 Stevens Creek Blvd.         __  .  .    |DD|____T_
 408-553-2517  Santa Clara, CA 95052-8059      / _` |\/|C   |_ |_____|<
 HP0200/UX     glenn_mcghee@dtc.hp.com         \__| |  |-     @-@-@-oo\
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: hanss@microsoft.com (Hans Spiller)
Subject: Re: Stopping Jerky Motion in N Scale?
Date: 21 Nov 92 08:46:31 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.
Keywords: #$&?|#$! oscillating cars

In article <1992Nov19.142631.27961@tellab5.tellabs.com> jcj@tellabs.com wrote:
> I'm in the process of converting my non-MT N scale rolling stock to 
> MT trucks/truck-mounted couplers.  No big deal, but something that's 
> driving me nuts is the cars' jerky motion when starting to roll, which I 
> assume is caused by the MT coupler springs.  I tried disassembling the 
> draft boxes and putting in a dab of grease at the centering spring as
> suggested in an old "MR", but that didn't help at all.  I then tried truck
> restraining springs but they're a royal pain in the, er, caboose to put in.
> Any suggestions?  Thanks.
> -- 
> 		        jcj@tellabs.com
> 		      Carpe salsa et chips

The springs may help, but they're mainly provided to reduce problems with
iron or steel axles or car weights being pulled into magnetic uncouplers.
I think the main thing that makes MicroTrains cars run smoother is that
they weigh more than most of the other manufacturer's cars, although I
think their manufacturing tolerances are better too.  it doesn't
take much weight to make a real difference in N scale.  I've had good
luck with fishing sinkers, which I squeeze in a pair of pliers to make
a flat spot, and glue 'em down the centerline of the car (inside, of course).
It's non magnetic, and extremely cheap.  Lead is mildly poisonous, so
dont let the kids or dog at it, and wash your hands before putting your
fingers in your mouth, but I'm sure it's safer than Floquil.

			hanss@microsoft.com
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad