HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.international
Reply-To: jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 18:07:04 GMT

>Actually, I fail to see the need of this group when we have
>comp.std.internat. So, OK, the perspective intended here is
>broader than just standards, but comp.std.internat is seldom
>an over-crowded place.

That comp.std.internat has little traffic is not the point.  That
group is for international standards, and thus it probably is
considered inappropriate by many to discuss other internationalization
issues in that group and doing that could well cause many flames.

People intertested in international standards are a different group
from people interested in internationalization.  There may be some
overlap, but I don't think there's enough to discussion
internationalization in a group for standards.

//Jyrki
From: mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at (Markus Stumptner)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: rec.games.strategic - how about perfect-info
Date: 26 Aug 92 19:39:14 GMT
Organization: DB and ES Subdivision, TU Vienna

From article <a_rubin.714854536@dn66>, by a_rubin@dsg4.dse.beckman.com (Arthur Rubin):
> In <1992Aug25.182038.27357@news2.cis.umn.edu> thornley@nano.cs.umn.edu (David H. Thornley) writes:
>>By that definition, a lot of wargames are "games of perfect information"

> Isn't the initial setup in some wargames face down?

As he wrote, in "a lot" of them, it is not.  Sometimes, it's an
optional rule, i.e., you can play it both ways.  (Nothing to do with
the group split discussion, just for information.)

-- 
Markus Stumptner                                mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at
University of Technology Vienna                 vexpert!mst@relay.eu.net
Paniglg. 16, A-1040 Vienna, Austria             ...mcsun!vexpert!mst
From: 33plato@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Larry Plato)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: rec.bicycle.mtb
Summary: request for discussion on misc.pub-speaking
Date: 2 Sep 92 18:18:46 GMT
Organization: Western Michigan Univ. Comp. Sci. Dept.


Sorry about the header , Im new at posting, someone posted about a public speaking
group and one suggestion was misc.pub-speaking.  The group would be unmoderated
discussions on the art and science of speaking in public.
Any constructive comments or suggestions welcome.  Any toastmasters out there?

Larry Plato
Western Michigan University
My opinions are my own, I stole `em fair and square.
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva)
Subject: Re: 2nd RFD: comp.unix.* reorganization
Keywords: worthless
Organization: Taronga Park BBS
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 10:48:49 GMT

In article <1992Aug30.215608.10019@devon.lns.pa.us> paul@devon.lns.pa.us (Paul Sutcliffe Jr.) writes:
>>No, because even if DOS drivers are available the criteria which a DOS
>>user would use would most likely be meaningless to a UNIX user [...]

>The OS has nothing to do with it.

The OS has *everything* to do with it. The most critical factor in choosing
a peripheral is software support, and it's unlikely that anyone using another
operating system will have the faintest idea what to do about "my Digiboard
is generating spurious interrupt messages when I make a connection" or help
with "I'm looking for a dumb serial card to use with FAS" let alone "which is
better for SCO, the BUSTEK or Adaptec SCSI card?".

>The .hardware groups are for hardware issues.

The hardware groups are for DOS related hardware issues, de facto if not
de jure.

All of which is moot. The CFV has been out for some time.
-- 
                                                                `-_-'
                         Have you hugged your wolf today?        'U`

Peter da Silva, Taronga Park BBS, Houston, TX  +1 713 568 0480/1032
From: gritton@alaska.et.byu.edu (Jamie Gritton)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: Removal of Unused Newsgroups
Date: 3 Sep 92 15:05:31 GMT
Reply-To: gritton@byu.edu
Organization: Brigham Young University, Provo UT USA

aryeh@cash.ucsc.edu (Aryeh Friedman) writes:

>         It should be stated that there are two kinds of CFR's.  They are:

> 		1) Unconditional CFR -- Which takes effect no matter what upon
> 		verifaction of the CFR vote.

> 		2) Conditional CFR -- Basically voting on whether or not the
> 		newsgroup should be removed if certain traffic requirements are
> 		not met after a specfied time period.

   Why is this? The unconditional one seems good enough to me. If you
want, you can have an unofficial poll on whether a CFR will be issued
based on traffic.
--
James Gritton - gritton@byu.edu - I disclaim
From: moser@sw.stratus.com (Tom Moser)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: comp.sys.stratus
Keywords: Stratus, VOS, FTX, fault tolerant, news, mailing list
Date: 25 Aug 92 16:54:37 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

I would favor something like comp.sys.ft-avail to discuss all
fault tolerant and high-availability platforms. Limiting the group to
Stratus invites creating several other groups to discuss the same topics
as they relate to other vendors. Having one central group for all ft and
high availability topics is probably a better idea.

-Tom
Xref: sparky news.groups:17389 misc.legal:16778
From: bobk@dogear.spk.wa.us (Bob Kirkpatrick)
Newsgroups: news.groups,misc.legal
Subject: Re: RFD: misc.legal.family moderated
Date: 1 Sep 92 07:10:32 GMT
Organization: Dog Ear'd Systems of Spokane, WA

thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank) writes:

> On the other hand, the problem disappeared as soon as misc.legal regulars
> addressed the argument.  I haven't seen a post on the "child support is
> completely outside the realm of standard legal theory" topic since I posted
> a short section from my Farnsworth on point.  In fact, I even checked in some
> of the other cross-posted groups, and the legal arguments dropped out
> completely.  The main problem was one poster continuously posting non
> sequiturs with Funny Capitalization, and Mark and I kept e-mailing him
> until he stopped.

That was well and good for misc.legal, but the same approach has had no
effect in two of the alt groups you mentioned. (The other was alt.abort-
ion.inequity, which was created for exactly that kind of thread).

What we hope to accomplish is to avoid the theories/ideals/opinions that
usually have a bias of one sort or another attached, and be able to get
down to reasonable transfers of knowledge on specific issues. While a
debate can be fun, and even informative, their usual altnet suit isn't
particularly compatible with a need for harder information.

Because of the personal nature of family law, I've noted that even
though a significant amount of information is available through misc.
legal proper, the vast majority of 'seekers' have gravitated to the
newsgroups whose name and orientation is aimed at family law in part-
icular. It's unfortunate that many get chased away from the altnet by
the ubiquitous opinionated flame-posts. :-(


--- 
Bob Kirkpatrick <bobk@dogear.spk.wa.us>
Dog Ear'd Systems of Spokane, WA
From: jlewis@ogicse.ogi.edu (Jeff Lewis)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.music.makers.* groups
Date: 1 Sep 92 22:29:03 GMT
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute

a short while back, Lazlo sed:
>As an aside to this RFD, I'd like to suggest that it might be time to move
>rec.music.makers.* up to rec.musicians.*, with appropriate name changes for
>any existing or proposed subgroups.

To make this idea a little more concrete, and get some feedback, here's what
I'd propose that a `rec.musicians' hierarchy look like:

    rec.musicians.misc
    rec.musicians.guitar
    rec.musicians.guitar.bass -or- rec.musicians.bass-guitar
    rec.musicians.guitar.tablature
    rec.musicians.percussion
    rec.musicians.keyboards
    rec.musicians.synth
    rec.musicians.marketplace

`Rec.musicians.misc' would replace `rec.music.makers'.  From discussion,
`Synth' and `keyboards' seem to relatively dissociated anymore.  What to do
with bass guitar is still problematic, I guess - a related question worth
asking is "where should tablature for bass guitar go?"  `Rec.musicians.
marketplace' would be the obvious analogue to `rec.music.marketplace' for
sales/trading of equipment.

Some interesting further possibilities might be the creation of genre
specific groups, such as:

    rec.musicians.rock
    rec.musicians.jazz
    rec.musicians.classical
    etc...

although I have no idea if they'd be useful.  It seems that current discussion
in rec.music.makers is largely rock/popular music oriented, although I have
a feeling that this is simply because jazz and classical (etc) musician
discussions are carried on in the bluenote and classical groups, respectively.

--Jeff
From: jym@mica.berkeley.edu (Jym Dyer)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: misc.boycotts.announce moderated, misc.boycotts.misc
Date: 1 Sep 92 17:06:12
Organization: The Naughty Peahen Party Line
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: Jyrki Kuoppala's message of Tue, 1 Sep 1992 00:54:56 GMT

=o= How about misc.activism.boycotts?  Discussion of boycotts
probably doesn't belong in the misc hierarchy, though.
    <_Jym_>
From: nick@sunburn.uwaterloo.ca (Nick Fitzpatrick)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.games.diplomacy
Date: 1 Sep 92 13:46:25 GMT
Organization: University of Waterloo

In article <1992Sep1.072353.11872@ists.ists.ca> sizone!justin@ee.ryerson.ca (Justin Wells) writes:
>In article <BtvJw8.JLz@uunet.uu.net> nick@sunburn.uwaterloo.ca (Nick Fitzpatrick) writes:
>>This is a Request For Discussion on the creation of a newsgroup for
>>the Game of Diplomacy.
>
>
>This sounds like a good idea to me.  Perhaps you could include in
>the mandate for the group some of the following things:
>
>(1) Keeping a public list of addresses of diplomacy players
>(2) (the obvious) maintaining a FAQ for diplomacy
>
There is a list of over 800 addresses maintained by the Diplomacy
Adjudicator in Washington (send the message get whois to 
judge@u.washington.edu).

There is also a monthly Internet Guide to Diplomacy which is already
posted to rec.games.pbm, rec.games.board and bit.listserv.dipl-l, while
not exactly a FAQ, it fulfills the same purpose.

Nicholas Fitzpatrick
From: andy@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Andrew Hackard)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.arts.sf.babylon5
Date: 31 Aug 92 07:05:55 GMT
     <Btp8HH.L6r@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>
Organization: Attack of the Quayle Potatoes

nick@sunburn.waterloo.edu (Nick Fitzpatrick) writes:
>techy@iastate.edu (Troy A Rutter) writes:
>>This is a request for discussion on the creation of a new newgroup,
>>rec.arts.sf.babylon5.

[...]

>Good lord, there are enough posts right now in rec.arts.startrek.current on
>B5 for it to justify it's own newsgroup right now!

Nope.  There are enough B5 posts on r.a.st.current to be awfully annoying,
yes, but nowhere near the number I'd have to see to create a newsgroup for
it.  This smacks of the QL ghettoization (what an atrocious word) attempts
-- "I don't like this stuff in MY group, so get your own and go there."

We're lucky the rec.arts.sf crowd is more tolerant, or Star Trek would
have its...own...

umm...

Let me get back to you.  ;-)

>>Rec.arts.sf.babylon5 shall be unmoderated, but as I said i will be making 
>>the monthly FAQ on what B5 is.

>But, why not rec.arts.babylon5, as this would match the heirarchy 
>presently used by two other SF shows (rec.arts.drwho, and rec.arts.startrek.*)

Both shows were around LONG before rec.arts.sf.*, and both shows have grown
beyond the point where they are "only" TV shows.  I could make a far better 
case for moving Dr. Who under the rec.arts.sf hierarchy (though I shan't be
issuing the RFD) (and as long as the RFD was properly cross-posted :-) ) than
for Star Trek, since Trek isn't just a TV series -- it has several (5 or 6,
depending on whom you ask) movies out, a slew of novels, and an entire
generation or two of fen.  However, a B5 group, since it's new, should go 
under rec.arts.sf.tv, if it's going mainstream at all.

(For the record, I think both B5 and B7 should start out with alt groups,
following the precedent of alt.tv.simpsons, et al.  But that's just me.)

-- 
"Me and you, a two man crew, 
 side by side we are united,
 we will never be divided...."

                                                  Au revoir, mon cherie.
From: boubaker@cenatls.cena.dgac.fr (Heddy Boubaker)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.music.makers.* groups
Date: 4 Sep 92 12:11:58 GMT
Organization: Centre d'Etudes de la Navigation Aerienne
Originator: boubaker@bendy


In article <42319@ogicse.ogi.edu>, jlewis@ogicse.ogi.edu (Jeff Lewis) writes:
|> 
|> [ A & B deleted ]
|> 
|> Variations on a theme:
|> C:  rec.music.makers
|>     rec.music.makers.{rock,jazz,classical}
|>     rec.music.instruments.{guitar,percussion,keyboards,etc}
|>     rec.music.instruments.misc
|>     rec.music.instruments.marketplace
|> 
   That's my favourite variation :
   1/ IMHO rec.music.* seems to be a better organisation than rec.musicians.* 
      ( A & B ) because it's not 'close' to non musicians:
      - rec.musicians.instruments.* look like places for discussions of 
        musicians about their instruments.
      - rec.music.instruments.* look like places for discussions for 
        everybody loving music about some specific instruments.
   2/ rec.music.* hierarchy already exists and it is perhaps unnecessary
      to create a parallel hierarchy only for musicians:
      It could be a (little) humility lesson for musicians to share
      something about music with non-musicians ;-J 

   My only remark will be about rec.music.instruments.marketplace :
   what about selling things like sound-effects, trackers, ... a better
   hierarchy could be:
   rec.music.marketplace.material (from jack to full recording studio)&
   rec.music.marketplace.misc (for collectors, books , concert ...)

|> 
|> [ D deleted ]
|> 
|> Feedback?
|> 
|> --Jeff

 heddy
From: neilp@cs.hw.ac.uk (Neil Postlethwaite)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.arts.sf.tv.blakes7
Date: 29 Aug 92 19:07:55 GMT
Organization: Dept of Computer Science, Heriot-Watt University, Scotland

In article <BtpH33.2KD@uunet.uu.net> ramsey@cua.edu (Betsy Ramsey) writes:
>This is a Request For Discussion about a proposed new group
>rec.arts.sf.tv.blakes7, the purpose of which would be to discuss the
>British science-fiction television show _BLAKES 7_.  Some preliminary
>discussion has already taken place in rec.arts.tv.uk and alt.config.
>

A bit of a mouthfull ain't it ???

why not just plain rec.arts.blakes7 like Star Trek is rec.arts.startrek

Or alt.tv.blakes7 similar to alt.tv.red-dwarf or alt.tv.twin-peaks

Neil
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: obrien@netcom.com (Robert O'Brien)
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.arts.sf.tv.blakes7
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 06:27:51 GMT
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Summary: Oh, No!  Not *another* must-read ;-}

Given that I already have difficulty finding time to read all the groups
I already "can't do without" I'm making this a hesitant, 

but *definite*    yes.

One thing I particularly like about B7 is that there is so little
need to discuss/fantasize about what happens 'after...'

One good friend of mine had the unfortunate experience of being first
exposed to B7 with the last episode:-}

Newsgroups: news.groups
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: soc.culture.indian.american
From: a_rubin@dsg4.dse.beckman.com (Arthur Rubin)
Date: 1 Sep 92 14:39:08 GMT

In <9209010727.AA22117@cs.utexas.edu> FURRJK@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU writes:

>Did someone forget to mention that the reason an awful lot of people cited
>as the reason for voting against soc.culture.indian.american was the fact
>that its name was a crawling horror from the sewers of hell, or whatever
>that phrase is the DaSilvas like?  As I said at the time, everyone I asked
>(a couple dozen people, if I recall correctly) assumed that soc.culture.
>indian.american was about American Indians.  Native Americans.  Amerinds.
>EVERYONE assumed that.  When I told them that it was intended to be about
>ASIAN Indians living in the USA, they all went "Huh?"

Perhaps the people you talked to thought it was ambiguous; I thought it
quite clear that it was about americans of indian descent.  Consider
soc.culture.african.american and soc.culture.asian.american.  If you care
so much about having appropriate names for groups, propose a change of name
for those groups.

I would (and said I would) vote against (almost) all of the other names
proposed in the last re-org.

We now return you to your regularlly scheduled Alok flame war.
--
Arthur L. Rubin: a_rubin@dsg4.dse.beckman.com (work) Beckman Instruments/Brea
216-5888@mcimail.com 70707.453@compuserve.com arthur@pnet01.cts.com (personal)
My opinions are my own, and do not represent those of my employer.
My interaction with our news system is unstable; if you want to be sure I see a post, mail it.
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: bethmo@microsoft.com (Beth Moursund)
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.games.abstract
Date: 01 Sep 92 05:32:12 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation
Distribution: na
Keywords: perfect-information deterministic strategic no-dice

>The games we're interested in are (again, almost always) games of perfect
>information, so why not rec.games.perfect-information?  Well first off,

I'm surprised that no one has pointed out yet that 1830 and Civilization
are both diceless games of perfect information.  :-)

Newsgroups: news.groups
From: pjb4288@ultb.isc.rit.edu (Pete - Toonatic - Boulay)
Subject: Misc.for.sale.computers.reorg
Originator: pjb4288@ultb
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 02:26:37 GMT

To the person who posted the CFV, I sent my vote in and it was bounced.

Undeliverable...

I vote NO for the reorganization of misc.forsale.computers
-- 
Peter J. Boulay --17 Split Rock Road-Pittsford, NY 14534-The ToonAddict!
Email should be sent only to PJB4288@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
Disclaimer: You don't like what I'm writing? Oh well.
"Well shut my mouth wide open!"- Tiny Toons HISMV
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: jhildeb1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Jeff Hildebrand)
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.arts.sf.tv.blakes7
Reply-To: hildebra@math.wisc.edu (Jeff Hildebrand)
Organization: Don's Merry Horde of Topologists
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 17:13:08 GMT

shimkus@athena.cs.uga.edu (Peter Gambit) writes:
> Well, maybe one of the reasons that it has light traffic in your opinion is
> no one can find the discussion in the first place.

	Which suggests to me something that should maybe be tried first.
Namely getting a consensus on one existing group where discussion of B7
should take place (the obvious candidate to me would seem to be rec.arts.
sf.tv but other arguments could be made). Then make a regular post to
all the various groups where B7 discussion has occured pointing interested
people in the direction of that one group. Then if having the pointers
to the one group does cause a massive increase in traffic, then it's time
to start thinking about a seperate newsgroup.

	The advantage I see to this is that it doesn't isolate B7 in it's
own newsgroup, so people who might be interested in the show but have
never heard of it before (because at least in the US, except for the boom
period in B7 fandom from around 1985-1989 it's been almost solely a show
with a cult type following) may be intrigued enough to check the show out.
Getting more people interested in the show always sounds like a good plan
to me.

	This is actually an idea that I was thinking about before the RFD
came up. And I guess I'm volunteering to be the one who makes the posting
if people decide to go through with it.

	Comments on the idea?

-Jeff
-- 
Jeff Hildebrand, The Shaggy TA			hildebra@math.wisc.edu
"Join that political superman, secret agent double 0 zero, George Bosh
in his new film, 'Never Just Say No Again.'"      Off The Cuff, R.I.P.
"Did everyone buy that? Good, 'cause I didn't"   The Proof By Snow Job
From: rhiann@milton.u.washington.edu (Sandra Hereld)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.arts.sf.tv.blakes7
Date: 4 Sep 92 18:41:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Sep4.184121.23768
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <BtpH33.2KD@uunet.uu.net> ramsey@cua.edu (Betsy Ramsey) writes:
>This is a Request For Discussion about a proposed new group

I've never wanted to vote before, so I've never looked up the procedure,
but I am thrilled to hear about this.  I was just about to post a
request to rec.arts.sf.tv to see if there was a better place to
find b7 fans.


>joeisham@sdf.lonestar.org (Joe Isham)
>kat@bacchus.esa.oz.au (Kathryn Andersen)
>ramsey@cua.edu (Betsy Ramsey)
>sll28@cc.usu.edu (Lorna Payne)
From: avery@netcom.com (Avery Ray Colter)
Newsgroups: news.groups
Subject: Re: RFD: misc.boycotts.announce moderated, misc.boycotts.misc
Date: 1 Sep 92 20:18:49 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

If bias on the moderator's part is a problem, then one could indeed have
some kind of m.b.a.left and m.b.a.right or something.

Maybe the moderator should be a card carrying member of the ACLU.
After all, they don't agree with the Nazi party, but affrimed their
right to hold demonstrations.

-- 
Avery Ray Colter ("Elfcat") - 	avery@netcom.netcom.com (IP 192.100.81.100)
(510) 656-1902          	{elfcat|arcolter}@aol.com
"Heaviness is the root of lightness; calmness is the controller of haste"
Newsgroups: news.groups
From: morrow@fnalo.fnal.gov (Super-Turtle Jimmy Elmo)
Subject: Re: RFD: rec.arts.sf.babylon5
Organization: The Daily Planet
Followup-To: news.groups
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 22:47:52 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnalo.fnal.gov
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <1992Aug28.140420.10166@news.iastate.edu>, techy@iastate.edu (Troy A Rutter) writes:
> This is a request for discussion on the creation of a new newgroup,
> rec.arts.sf.babylon5.
> 
	First, it should be rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.
	Second, there hasn't even been one episode shown.  Wait until the
show's been around twenty years or so and has an enormous cultural following.
In the meantime, create an alt.tv.babylon5.
	Babylon 5 could be a ratings bust and vanish within a year, you know,
and then we'd be stuck with yet another dead newsgroup in the mainstream
hierarchy.
-- 
"There's trouble, and there's trouble. Eating ice cream before dinner is one   
thing, but never had I been in the kind of trouble where they'd throw my Dad   
in jail."                                                                      
--Marshall, "Eerie, Indiana"                                                   
  
elmo (morrow@physics.rice.edu,morrow@fnal.fnal.gov)
Newsgroups: news.groups