HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: biddy@ping.actrix.gen.nz (Bridget Ingham)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers
Distribution: world
Reply-To: ping@ping.actrix.gen.nz
Organization: 
Keywords: 
Summary: 
Date: 9 Sep 92 22:04:55 GMT
Organization: Private UUCP Site

In article <1992Sep8.075544.25771@news.columbia.edu> lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner) writes:
> obFACT: most PC's are *not* on internet.

Most PC's are not on anything ....

> cjl

Cheers

    Peter S. Ingham              ping@ping.actrix.gen.nz
    Lower Hutt,  New Zealand     3:771/220.5
From: dvdjns@hale.cts.com (David Lloyd Jones)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Evolution of Computers
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 92 15:26:41 PDT
Organization: Hale Telecommunications San Diego CA

The Computer Museum of America will have a display at the
San Diego Computer Fair Sept. 18-20. The display will be
pieces of hardware that illustrate the evolution of the
computer. I've been asked to write a short description of
each item, and I'm supposed to give a little history on them
and where appropriate, explain why the item represents a
breakthrough or step up on the evolutionary ladder. Frankly,
I've been unable to find much on any of the items, short of
writing the manufacturer, and there is no time for that. So,
anybody, can you help me? Anything you know about any of the
following items would be greatly appreciated.

1) Burroughs comptometer and stand
2) Centronix 939 printer
3) Centronix 588 printer
4) Clary Comptometer
5) Defense Department Keyboard
6) Diablo Hytype printer
7) Emulog MPD Log-53 CRT terminal
8) Ferrite Core Memory Block
9) Hewlett Packard Keyboard
10) IBM electric typewriter M.IIC
11) IBM Card Verifier
12) IBM 3277 Model 1 terminal
13) IBM 082 Card Sorter 22216
14) Monroe Adding Calculator
15) Stenotype with case
16) Teletype Model 43 teleprinter
17) Teletype Model 33TU
18) Thales Comptometer


HALE TELECOMMUNICATIONS - Public Access Node, San Diego CA 619/660-6734 HST
dvdjns@hale.cts.com (David Lloyd Jones)   11-Sep-92 at 3:29p
From: rh@smds.com (Richard Harter)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: GOTOs
Date: 6 Sep 92 02:29:36 GMT
Reply-To: rh@ishmael.UUCP (Richard Harter)
Organization: Software Maintenance & Development Systems, Inc.

Re the problem of communciating with a remote site via modem: the natural
way to handle this sort of thing is with a jump table, e.g. in C

int (*command[])() =
{
	init_rs232,
	init_modem,
	dial_modem,
	log_on,
	do_the_business,
	0
};
	
int state = 0;

while (command[state]) state = (command[state])() ? state+1 : 0;

[Disclaimer: code not checked.]  Given that we are executing functions
(procedures) rather than blocks of in line code, jump tables are better.
Note that no explicit dimensions appear in the code, that the functions
appear in an easily modified table, that no goto's or case statements
are required, and that the execution body is a one liner.  I call it
a win; your mileage may vary.
-- 
Richard Harter: SMDS Inc.  Net address: rh@smds.com Phone: 508-369-7398 
US Mail: SMDS Inc., PO Box 555, Concord MA 01742.    Fax: 508-369-8272
In the fields of Hell where the grass grows high
Are the graves of dreams allowed to die.
From: joslin_paul@ae.ge.com
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: BUNCH - the answer
Date: 14 Sep 92 12:35:31 GMT
Reply-To: joslin_paul@ae.ge.com
Distribution: na
Organization: GE Aircraft Engines
Originator: news@c0228.ae.ge.com

schnoebe@convex.com (Eric Schnoebelen) was one of many who knew that
BUNCH was:

>	B - Buroughs	- Unisys
>	U - Univac	- Unisys (via Sperry)
>	N - NCR		- AT&T
>	C - CDC		- CDC/Seagate (what other spin offs?)
>	H - Honeywell	- Groupe Bull

Obligatory Footnote:  GE once made computers.  1/2 :-)
-- 
-- 
     Paul R. Joslin     |Dan Quayle's Top 10 TV complaints:
joslin@c0223.ae.ge.com  | 2. They always have reruns on "Nick at Nite".
   +1 513 583 3537      |
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva)
Subject: Re:  The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
Organization: Taronga Park BBS
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 13:10:39 GMT

In article <Bu6svH.31J@hatch.socal.com> richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich Greenberg) writes:
>In article <liam.06m7@durie.amigans.gen.nz> liam@durie.amigans.gen.nz (Liam Greenwood) writes:
>OK, here is some assembler code that will run on every member (except
>the 360/20) of IBM's 360, 370, 303x, 43xx, 308x, 3090, 9370, and 390 series 
>of mainframes, plus the compatables from Amdahl, Hitachi et al that are 
>running any flavor of OS (PCP, *MFT*, MVT, VS1, SVS, and MVS/*),  
>or are running in CMS under the control of VM (any flavor):

All the same instruction set, all the same operating system, and to provide
that ability IBM and other companies have had to make heroic efforts that have
still proven inadequate to keep up with the industry.

Precisely similar to the 8086/DOS situation...
-- 
                                                                `-_-'
                         Have you hugged your wolf today?        'U`

Peter da Silva, Taronga Park BBS, Houston, TX  +1 713 568 0480/1032
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: kolstad@cae.wisc.edu (Joel Kolstad)
Subject: Re: Sneakers
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering
Date: 13 Sep 92 22:29:22 CDT

In article <1992Sep14.025648.8533@udel.edu> elkins@daffy.cis.udel.edu (Robert Elkins) writes:
>I just saw the movie this afternoon.  Could be a vt52; at least they used 
>an acoustic modem; usually Hollywood messes up pretty bad when it comes to
>computer technical stuff.

Yeah, but later in the movie they set a newer phone (with square transmitter
and receiver) ON TOP OF an acoustic coupler (since it wouldn't fit in it
due to it's shape), and then proceed to have a VOICE SESSION with the
NSA.  The call is being traced, and hanging it up before the trace is
completed consists of KNOCKING THE PHONE OFF THE COUPLER.

Shessh...  oh well!  I thought is was a good movie anyway.  There is a LOT
of technical baloney in the movie, though.  (For instance, when their little
decryption box takes ANY input data, and decrypts it and displays it with
NO IDEA what format the data ought to be -- they call up the National Reserve,
get some text, and it mutates into more text; they call up the air traffic
control computer, get some text, and it mutates into GRAPHICS.  Damn smart
box... not only can it decrypt any of the U.S.'s cyphers, it's artificially
intelligent as well!

					---Joel Kolstad




Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner)
Subject: Re: automatic CP/M to MS-DOS migration?
Keywords: assembler, 8080, 8088, 8086
Reply-To: lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 08:56:05 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.021133.17107@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz> ecmtwhk@ccu1.aukuni.ac.nz (Thomas Koenig) writes:
>If I remember correctly, one of the points in favour of MS-DOS 1.0 when
>it was introduced was the easy porting of CP/M software (^Z as end of
>file marker, COM - files, file control blocks).
>
>Just how far was this automated? Are 8080 and 8086 related closely enough
>that you could write an assembler which translated 8080 assembly into
>8086 code? Was this how, for example, WordStar was ported?

They aren't related at all, but the "order" of the file system calls are
the same, so that less mental processes are needed to translate from
one to another.

BTW, DR-DOS has additional levels of compatibility on this front, that
Microsoft thought unimportant to provide.  Even available in the latest
version (6.0).

There are direct emulators for both CP/M-80 and the CPU.  If you should
have a machine with a V20 or V30, you can run it as an 8080 or 8085.  The
software emulator, while generally slower, is needed only if you lack that
CPU chip or need full Z80 capability.

Actually, I left out CP/M-86, which is where most of the translation 
actually occured.  Much of the CP/M-86 calls derive from CP/M as I explained.
Then the MS-DOS calls are a ripoff of the CP/M-86 stuff (as a subset; DR-DOS
does more of them) with other things added, some redundant.  Microsoft
attempted to proclaim that some would eventually be obsolete; all of them
still work fine.

BTW, your "large" 2 Meg file can be handled easily on MS-DOS with SEDT;  I
would recommend a RAM disk be available to at least SEDT itself, if not
the file space for the file itself to speed up the edit.

cjl
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.dcom.modems
From: parry@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (Tom J Parry)
Subject: Re: Disconnect Phantom
Originator: parry@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au
Organization: Monash University, Melb., Australia.
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 23:40:39 GMT

Brett G Person (person@plains.NoDak.edu) wrote:
> 
> +++ ATH ATDT 1 900 ....
> There!  This used to bite ( byte?) one of our local sysops a lot.
> Seems you used to be able to grab control of HIS modem by doing stuff
> like this.   Any software that is STUPID ENOUGH to read the TEXT that
> the modem sends back deserves to be fed text like this. 

The modems here are set up that they will go to command mode if they
receive '+++' with the correct delays coming from the host end (as they
should with a default setup). What would be better would be to change the
guard characters away fro +. On quite a few occasions I have entered +++ to
drop MY modem to command mode and the echo coming back has killed the
remote modem. It's quite stupid considering it took them months to set
these things up and test them!

-- 
Tom J Parry.
Your reality is a figment of my imagination.
From: rorschak@daimi.aau.dk (Jesper Lauridsen)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: You know when you're hacking too long when...
Date: 6 Sep 92 20:42:20 GMT
Organization: Danish Trainspotter Society


  ... when you worry if someone will notice the extra spaces after some
of your lines in a text that you are going to print out.

-- 
I have things to do and News to read
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:14011 comp.unix.misc:3685
From: jimf@centerline.com (Jim Frost)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
Date: 15 Sep 92 15:24:13 GMT
Organization: CenterLine Software, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: 140.239.3.202

lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles Lasner) writes:
>In article <id.E_2T.V5B@ferranti.com> peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva) writes:
>>	4. Oh yeh, a single register can address the whole screen.

>Can you address a 1280x1024x256 color screen with one register?

Yes.  That's not even a meg and a half, easily fitting in 21 bits of a
32-bit register even if the hardware only supports 24 bits of real
addressing.

[BTW, most graphics people call that a 1280x1024x8 screen to keep the
dimensions in a single unit; a 1280x1024x256 screen is what you'll
find on the highest-end SGI's.  Still, that's only ten meg and
still addressible within 24 bits.]

>>> If I need to go to OS/2, I'll
>>> opt to avoid the overhead of '386 mode, and stick to the "prison" you
>>> describe of program space of 16 Megabytes.
>>
>>64K.

>No, 16 Megs in '286 protect mode.  386 mode sucks, even on 486's.

He was right, it's 64K.  There isn't a 24-bit addressing mode in the
286 so you get to shuffle segment registers to get your whole 16Mb.

>You like to "mix and match" arguments from the land of unix-386 code and
>then switch to Amiga-love.  Please stay in one box at a time.

Perhaps this is the crux of the problem.  There really is more than
one box in the market, Charles.

jim frost
jimf@centerline.com
From: dhembrow@eoe.co.uk (David Hembrow)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Renumbering BASIC programs (was Re: Branching in HLL vs. Assembler)
Date: 9 Sep 92 11:26:44 GMT
Organization: EO Europe Limited, Cambridge, UK
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

stefang@isy.liu.se (Stefan Gustavson) writes:
: don@zl2tnm.gen.nz (Don Stokes) writes:
: 
: >jeremy@sw.oz.au (Jeremy Fitzhardinge) writes:
: >> Ob brain twitch:  how can
: >> 1000 LET N=1000+A*1000
: >> be made to use less memory on a ZX Spectrum?
: 
: >1000 LET N=VAL("1000*A*1000")
: 
: >(Numeric constants were stored in _both_ binary and text formats in memory,
: >so putting it in a string saves five or six bytes per constant, at the
: >expense of execution time...)
: 
: >Do I win?
: 
: No, you don't:
: 
: 1000 LET N=VAL("(A+1)*1000")
: is one byte shorter. :-)
: 
: How come that old BASIC interpreters made so bad use of memory
: when 16K was still expensive? I don't get it.
: 
:    /Stefan (stefang@isy.liu.se)

Try:

1000 LET N=VAL("(A+1)*1e3")
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: GR.JLB@isumvs.iastate.edu (Jeff Balvanz)
Subject: Help with ancient Diablo 630ECS?
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 03:38:28 GMT

I first posted this to comp.periphs.printers, but on reflection
decided that alt.folklore.computers might be a better place to ask
the question since us oldsters (I'm 36) tend to know more of these
answers on working with stone knives and bearskins. . .

My co-worker and I have recently acquired (through the University's
Asset Recovery program -- read "Surplus Store") a trio of Diablo 630ECS
printers for the grand total of $15 plus tax.  I know all about their
text modes and am using them with WordPerfect, etc. on a TI
Professional Computer from 1983 (yeah, I like playing with vintage
iron, especially if it's cheap).

Anyway, my questions for the group:

1.  Does anyone know how to use the graphics mode that is enabled with
<Esc>3 and disabled with either <Esc>4 or <Return>?  My guess is that
it's some kind of special spacing to print bitmapped graphics with the
period key, but I don't know what characters to send and don't really
have time to send all the ASCII set and see what happens. . .

2.  Does anyone know what HyPLOT mode, enabled with <Esc>G, is?  Sounds
like some kind of plotter emulation, but how does it work?

3.  Does anybody know of a company that still sells daisy wheels?  I've
got a sans serif font, but I'd like a serifed font for more formal
occasions, and an ECS wheel (the extended character set) would be
really nice since I have an ECS printer.

Thank you in advance for your assistance.


--
Jeff Balvanz                    BITNET: gr.jlb@isumvs.BITNET
Senior Technical Consultant     INTERNET:  gr.jlb@isuvms.iastate.edu
Microcomputer Services          PHONE:  (515) 294-8683
ISU Computation Center          USMail:  191 DURHAM CENTER, ISU, AMES, IA 50011
--
Jeff Balvanz                    BITNET: gr.jlb@isumvs.BITNET
Senior Technical Consultant     INTERNET:  gr.jlb@isuvms.iastate.edu
Microcomputer Services          PHONE:  (515) 294-8683
ISU Computation Center          USMail:  191 DURHAM CENTER, ISU, AMES, IA 50011
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: morris@grian.cps.altadena.ca.us (Mike Morris)
Subject: Re: Coke machine at CMU
Organization: College Park Software, Altadena, CA
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 16:52:34 GMT

ap096@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Kevin P. Dahlhausen) writes:
>In a previous article, jarnot@kin.lap.upenn.edu (Kevin J. Jarnot) says:
>>I have recently heard of a Coke machine at CMU that is connected to the 
>>Internet.  Anyone have the whole story???

>Sure, here is an article from some time ago.....     [[edited]]
>From my personal archives of alt.folklore.computers.
>From: tgl@zog.cs.cmu.edu (Tom Lane)
>>Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
>Subject: The only Coke machine on the Internet
>Date: 11 Dec 89 15:45:34 GMT
>
> <large chunk deleted>
>
>The Coke machine programs were used for over a decade, and were even
>rewritten for Unix Vaxen when CMUA was retired in the early eighties.
>The end came just a couple years ago, when the local Coke bottler
>discontinued the returnable, coke-bottle-shaped bottles.  The old machine
>couldn't handle the nonreturnable, totally-uninspired-shape bottles, so it
>was replaced by a new vending machine.  This was not long after the New
>Coke fiasco (undoubtedly the century's greatest example of fixing what
>wasn't broken).  The combination of these events left CMU Coke lovers
>sufficiently disgruntled that no one has bothered to wire up the new
>machine.

I don't know about the CMU area, but here in LA the old bottles are
still available.  About 10 years ago they got real hard to find for
about 9 months, but were never _totally_ discontinued. If the local
situation htere has changed, and the old style bottles are now 
available, and if the old machine was put into storage and could 
be resurrected gold old CMU could boast....  again?

-- 
Mike Morris   WA6ILQ   | This space intentionally left blank.
PO Box 1130            | 
Arcadia, CA. 91077     | All opinions must be my own since nobody pays
818-447-7052 evenings  | me enough to be their mouthpiece...
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: pratta@rpi.edu (Anthony Edward Prattico)
Subject: Re: Coke machine at CMU
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 23:15:14 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.211448.18967@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> hunt@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Hunt) writes:
   In article <87501@netnews.upenn.edu> jarnot@kin.lap.upenn.edu (Kevin J. Jarnot) writes:
>   (Upgrading to X-Windows workstations on ethernet in every dorm room at CSH
>   - I believe we will be the first student organization in the country/world
>   to do so)

Well, in part. RPI already has ethernet in some of the dorms. However, to get
full X-Window support, you need something like an RS/6000 or a SPARC. At
present, only faculty have this kind of support. 

However, SPARCs are available to students, though I don't know if anybody has
actually bought one. I personally have no need for windowing except for games,
and use emacs for all other work, mail, Usenet news, etc. Usually, access
using MS-Kermit on a PS/2 30-286 over a 19200 baud digital data line is faster
than the network servers. I do miss mouse support however.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anthony Prattico        pratta@rpi.edu           Anthony_Prattico@mts.rpi.edu
Xref: sparky alt.folklore.computers:14020 comp.unix.misc:3689
From: aldavi01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Arlie Davis)
Subject: Re: The third variable.
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 18:56:00 GMT
Organization: University of Louisville

In <rw.716255281@donner> rw@donner.Rational.COM (Bob Weissman) writes:
[... foo ... bar ...]
> It's "bletch".

> I've always heard "foo, bar, bletch, and mumble".

> So what's the FIFTH variable?

Wrong.  The spectrum goes foo, bar, bang, eek (or "eek!" if your language
will allow the ! (most won't (sniff))), and THEN mumble.

The sixth variable could be "six".

-- 
lrwx------   1 aldavi01 emacsstu       9 Jun  6 12:43 .signature -> /dev/null
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.unix.misc
From: hallam@zeus02.desy.de (Phill Hallam-Baker)
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)
Reply-To: Hallam@zeus02.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 19:42:10 GMT

In article <ALANB.92Sep9124227@swordfish.sdl.mdcbbs.com>, alanb@sdl.mdcbbs.com
(Alan Braggins) writes:
|>>>>>> On Tue, 8 Sep 1992 09:50:00 GMT, lasner@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Charles
|>Lasner) said:

|>>>Translation:
|>>>
|>>>	People who write applications in assembly code are people who
|>>>	are willing to trade off a factor of 10 or more in a few years
|>>>	for a factor of two in a portion of the code today.
|>
|>> No, not a translation at all, just some self-serving words you dredged up
|>> to twist my statement.
|>> The truth is that for any "family" of machines, the "meat and potatoes" of
|>> the code is the same for all models. 
|>
|>Yes, but my code runs on architectures that didn't exist 3 years ago, and has
|>to to be competitive.

Mine has to work on an architecture (DEC-alpha) which we won't have delivered
for a month and has to run before the end of the year.

After that there are some schemes we have for the new CRAY machine where we
haven't a clue what the architecture is but are simply working on the basis of
anticipating commercial imperatives.

--

Phill Hallam-Baker
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 02:12:49 -0400 
From: "Joseph M. Newcomer" <jn11+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: The need for an assembler (was: Favorite CPU)

Ah, timing loops...

The last timing loop I encountered cost me, personally, $2500.  This
was because the AppleTalk card on my PC uses a timing loop to time out
the communications between the processor and the card when it is 
initializing.  When I went to a 33MHz 386, it meant that the driver
couldn't locate the card because it timed out.  I had to buy a new
laser printer with a parallel port.

*ANYONE* who uses timing loops without calibrating them should be shot.

Some years ago I was talking about optimizing compiler technology and
when I described the optimization that converted:
    for(i=0;i<10000;i++) ;
to
    ;
I was interrupted by an outraged audience member "How can you write
timing loops with a compiler like that?" he demanded.  I was dumbfounded.
I said "If you care about timing, you don't write timing loops.  That
is the lazy programmer's technique.  Call an abstract operation such as
"wait(500)".  If you have to, make it a compiler intrinsic.  Otherwise
you are writing something that depends upon the implementation of the
compiler, and may not even be portable across two versions of the compiler,
and it certainly isn't portable across different models of hardware".
Unfortunately, he didn't understand the difference between abstraction
and implementation, and somehow thought that whatever he saw as generated
code represented a contract between the compiler writer and him, and
the compiler writer was required to always generate the identical code.
I hope he has done well in whatever career he has chosen, such as
selling insurance.
                                joe
From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Branching in HLL vs. Assembler (was Re: The need for an assemble
Date: 10 Sep 92 18:15:03 GMT
Organization: Trivializers R Us

In <1992Sep10.145729.4839@cs.yale.edu> rescorla@rtnmr.chem.yale.edu (Eric Rescorla) writes:
>As I remember, the way things worked was that a failed if descended
>to the next line for execution(barring elses) while a successful if
>just stayed on the current line, so writing:
>10 IF FOO THEN BAR
>20 ...

>saved you writing
>10 IF !FOO(or whatever the syntax was in old basic) then 20
>15 (good example of numbering, eh?) BAR
>20 ....

This reminds me all too much of the old non-renumbering-Basic days
on a pdp-8 (with some relatively small limit on the highest legal
line number) in which the nonforesightful programmer ended up with
sections of code (the ones with the most unused line numbers to
start) looking something like

10 IF FOO THEN 20
11 GOTO 15
12 BAR
13 BAZ
14 GOTO 17
15 !FOO ETC
16 GOTO 30
17 QUUX
18 GOTO 595
20 FOO STUFF
etc

Those were the good old days, when a mature program had an
execution path like a peano curve.

paul
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: mdw@theory.TC.Cornell.EDU (Matt Welsh)
Subject: Re: You know when you're hacking too long when...
Organization: Cornell Theory Center
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 17:06:03 GMT

In article <1992Sep13.022934.15004@picarefy.picarefy.com> jwbirdsa@picarefy.picarefy.com (James W. Birdsall) writes:
>
>   I was getting ready to go out this afternoon and I wanted to know where
>my cats were (they like to charge out the door when I open it, so it pays
>to know if they're in range so I can block them, since they're not allowed
>out).
>
>   I tried to call Cat::GetLocation() on them.

I've done something similar. I find that whenever I'm looking for something
at home or in my office, and simply can't find it, my first impulse is
to

% grep office shoes

Too much report with UNIX. -grin

mdw

-- 
Matt Welsh    mdw@tc.cornell.edu        +1 607 253 2737
Random Hacker, Cornell Engineering and Theory Center 
  "I'll eat anything that's BRIGHT BLUE!!"
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers