From: shulick@yankton.ucs.indiana.edu (Sam Hulick)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Weak-mindedness & piracy & drugs (oh boy) (LONG)
Date: 17 Nov 92 15:35:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: usenet.Bxv9z6.I5D
Organization: Vallen Software

In article <BxuDML.CA0@starnine.com>, mikeh@starnine.com (Mike Haas) says most sayishly:
>In article <Bx9n9K.943@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> shulick@yankton.ucs.indiana.edu (Sam Hulick) writes:
>>Oh, come on, now.  What a weak argument, Ken, really.  Either I'm stupid
>>or a jerk?
>
>Sounds like it.
>
>>No, try I'm realistic.  And "piracy is wrong" is about as
>>weak and diluted as "say no to drugs."
>
>Both good ideas.  Or do you do drugs too?

No, they're not good ideas, you bloody conformist.  They're society's
ideas and what they want you to do/believe.  Sheesh, get a mind of your
own.  Why is "say no to drugs" a good idea?  Sure, I agree piracy is
wrong, but when it comes to drugs, the govt. has no right to tell us
what we put in our bodies.  So you must be one of those fools who thinks
drugs are absolutely horrible, but you've never tried them, right?  Did
you know caffeine does significantly more damage to the body than LSD?
Learn to follow your OWN ideas and thoughts rather than the government's
stupid slogans.  Remember, they're the assholes that take 1/3 to 1/4 out
of your paycheck for "taxes," which they pocket.  (By the way, believe
it or not, I don't do drugs, merely because I have no need to.  But if I
wanted to, I wouldn't hesitate.)

>>And no, I'm not a good guy, and
>>no, I'm not a bad guy.  I try to be un-biased.
>
>If you condone software piracy... ypu're a bad guy!

Actually, I condone the type of piracy where you copy something, try it
out, and if you like it, you buy it.  If you don't like it, you trash
it.  MANY others still do that.  What kind of damned
idiot is going to pay $400 for some software package and finds that it
doesn't meet certain requirements?!  Oh sure, with a high-paying job, it
wouldn't make much difference.  But paying $400 on some package that
*SAYS* it can do <x> amount of neato features, is foolish.  AND, the
company is very unlikely to take it back for a refund.

>>Let's talk about realism.
>
>OK,  Theft is immoral.  Copying commercial software is
>theft.  Therefore, Copying commercial software is immoral.

Nothing is immoral, nothing is moral.  "Moral" is individualistic.  For
one man, murdering may be moral.  For another, it may be the ultimate sin.

>>You could turn one in, but
>>maybe somewhere in the world, someone will say "I want a copy of that
>>game" and become a pirate.  -1, +1.  They sorta cancel out.  
>
>Not likely.  More likely it will set an example and dissuade
 ^^^^^^^^^^
If you've never been in the pirate world, shut up.  I'm speaking from
experience.  You DO NOT realize how easily people cross the line to
piracy.  If they want/need it, they'll ask for it.  Why did I quit
pirating, you're wondering?  All I did was pirate games, and I hardly
play games.  Nowadays, I spend my time w/ telecomm, and developing
software for PD/ShareWare.  PD stuff is great.  It's free, and it's
almost as good as commercial stuff.  In fact, I've run into PD software
that's actually better than commercial stuff.  PD developers are very
generous & we unemployed folk are grateful. :)

>You see, your "maybe" is simply a rationalization... the kid
>of thing children do.  Grow up.

Oh, I see.  So everyone who uses the word "maybe" is immature.  Get a life!

>>heavy copy protection.  I don't have the answers.  I just know that
>>turning in these people isn't going to solve anything.
>
>It sure will.  Put these scum behind bars.  Do it enough, and
>folks will actually start to believe they'll be punished, then the
>practice will begin to whither.

No, it won't work.  I could go into profound criminal justice theories,
but I won't.  Basically, if the risk is in a lesser degree than the
benefit(s), the person will commit the crime.  Look at murder.  They can
put people in jail for LIFE for murder.  Do murders cease to exist?  No.
I don't necessarily advocate crime, but go do some research, and you'll
find that crime (any type at all) is natural in every society, and it is
absolutely indestructable.  I was rather shocked when I learned this.

>Now, NOT turning them in... THAT won't solve anything (exacerbates
>the problem, actually).

Probably.

>>Thus my earlier
>>statement: It will only hurt the pirate, and it won't help anyone.
>
>Good.  See, even YOU agree... it WILL solve something!
>
>After all... who gives a rats ass about scum software crooks?

How apathetic.

>By the way, Sam, on a personal note, I don't think you have the smarts
>OR the morals that God gave a rock.

And I think you're pretty close-minded.  "DRUGS ARE BAD.  PIRACY IS 100%
WRONG."  Lighten up a little and THINK about all facets of the issues
before you go shooting your mouth off about what government deems right
and wrong.

>I have commercial software on the
>market... have had Amiga products released since 1986... and I will
>FULLY prosecute anyone who steals it.

So this is why you're so anti-pirate.  Sure, I suppose anyone would be
anti-pirate if they had programs on the market.  Hey.. if I developd a
prog and put it on the market for $200, you BET I'd be watchful as far
as who bought the prog and who didn't.  It's a natural thing, to change
like that.  Man, if you were unemployed and living off shit money, you
would pirate the stuff you need, and don't tell me you wouldn't.  Just
like when I was in high school, I was always hacking into the
university's machines, and now I'm anti-hacker.  And to prove this whole
point: EVERY WEALTHY PERSON I KNOW is NOT a pirate because they can
afford the stuff.  EVERY middle- to low-class person I know pirates
because they need things and can't afford them.  This is fact.  And MOST
thankfully, I'll have a good job soon so I can start buying all these
nice packages on the market.  For example, I wouldn't DARE pirate
something as excellent as MorphPlus.  I love ASDG, they've put out some
FANTASTIC software, and I'd hate to see them go down because of sinking
funds.  Actually, if you want an example of a company killed by piracy,
take a look at Discovery Software.  Great company, down the drain.

>I would recommend that you re-evaluate your position on these matters
>before you make a total fool of you... well, before you do it AGAIN
>anyway.

Same goes for you.  And stop being so close-minded.  It's very
repulsive.

You probably missed my whole point, anyway.  I'm not saying "GO PIRATES,
GO."  I think people should have a better chance to test things out
before they go buy them.  I saw a PageStream demo on the net that could
actually let you compose things, but not print.  Now that's a good idea.
My other point is that you have to learn not to be so biased against
pirates.  Put yourself in their shoes and you'd know why they do it.
Same with drug-users.  Don't be an asshole and degrade them and put them
down.  I just think, "If they want to do drugs, let them, it's their
right.  If they get caught, oh well."  Of course, you can't really apply
this to piracy.  "If they want to pirate, let them, it's their right."
Well, no.. it's not their right. :)  But I sure as hell am not going to
turn in a pirate.  I've been there, and I know what it's like.  If you
(anyone) turn in a pirate and later find out that he was fined so
heavily that he's homeless - and you didn't feel an ounce of remorse,
you need some help.

-- 
Sam Hulick          | "You can't discover new oceans unless you have the
shulick@indiana.edu | courage to lose sight of the shore."  --Anon.
(NeXTmail welcome)  |