From: 31he@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: No dog or Chinese
Date: 23 Jul 92 11:17:32 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

Hi:

	Stop you two! It is ridiculous arguing like taht. Although I understand
why. I think we should tolerate any one to choose which ever contry to be a
citizen of as well as to choose their dignity. I am always be proud of being a
Chinese, but I don't think I have the right to blame those who do not feel so.
We are figting for the freedom, so let's give others their freedom first.


Sincerely
Xiaoxia 
In article <1992Jul20.023732.41734@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>, wavelet@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
> In article <1992Jul19.232354.18588@midway.uchicago.edu>, hh15@ellis.uchicago.edu (he  huang) writes:
>>>In article <1992Jul17.015542.15997@midway.uchicago.edu>, hh15@ellis.uchicago.edu (he  huang) writes:
>>>> In article <1992Jul15.013744.41556@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wavelet@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>>>> 
>>>> 	This Mr./Ms. Wavelet has a true name Shi-I Chu.  I guess your
>>>                                             
>>>        No. My name is Jun-Zin Won. I got an account from Prof. Chu.
>>>     Please respect him. My posts have nothing to do with him.
>>>
>>>        BTW, FBI might be interested with you.
>> 
>> 	Oh, my, somebody should have taught you that it is very irresponsible
>> 	to use other people's account to post on the net (especially if it's
>> 	bitching) without putting a disclaimer in the article.  Anyway, you
>> 	now learned it from here.
> 
>         Oh, my, somebody should have taught you that it is very irresponsible
>         to post other people's name publically without permision and 100%
>         certainty. Poor spy. It is MY account. I didn't apply it myself.
>         Somebody should have taught you that it is stupid to extrapolate
>         your personal experiance to other people.
> 
>>>
>>>> are a US citizen already, and so you think now you are happy that you
>>>
>>>          I am a ROC citizen.
>> 
>> 	Good, so you haven't done the ass-kissing thing to get a greencard
>> 	something?  Anyway, I call a self-claimed "ROC citizen" a Chinese,
>                                                                 ^^^^^^^^^
>                                                   It's up to you, sir.
>                                                   I call myself Taiwanese.
> 
>> 	which is a generic term for an ethnic group (not a RACE, as
>> 	you claimed down below.) that embraces people from mainland China,
>> 	Taiwan, and other places and communities where the majority of the 
>> 	people identify themselves with such term.  By the way, have you
>> 	read Yu2 Guang1-zhong1's poem "xiang1 chou2"?  Hope you did.
> 
>                    Never.
> 
>>>
>>>> can claim you are no longer a Chinese, and you have obtained the
>>>
>>>          I am a Taiwanese. I do not want to repeat how to distinghish
>>>      between Taiwanese and Chinese here. Sorry!
>> 
>> 	How to write 'Taiwan' or your name in Taiwanese character?  
> 
>             See, for example, regular articles on "Tai4 Wun2 Tong1 Shiun4"
>        in <Independence Daily>.
> 
>>>
>>>> previlege to ferociously blackmouthing and attacking the peole and the
>>>> land your ancestors came from, right?
>>>
>>>         Are you sure? Maybe I have a Pin-Pu ancestor.
>> 
>> 	See, even you are not sure about where your ancestors came from.
>> 	This is called "shu3 dian3 wang4 zu3".  Poor guy! 
> 
>           So what? Are you sure that your mother's grand grand 
>       father's grand grand mother is a han people? Poor guy! You
>       are sticking at purity of your blood. Will you jump into a
>       river if someday you find that your blood is not pure?
> 
>>>
>> (stuff deleted)
>>>
>>>        Read more posts from Chinese students.
>>>
>>>> 	And you are ridiculing Chinese students who think their
>>>> country is the best, who don't think his/her own country is the best,
>>>> with the exception of the few like you?  If you substitute "their
>>>> country" for "government" or technical terms like "living standards",
>>>> then I don't see any problem if any Chinese student wants to stay
>>>> outside China.  
>>>
>>>         I don't think these terms are used more frequently than
>>>     "China" by Chinese students themselves. So, why should I use
>>>     other terms?
>> 
>> 	Mmm... I have hoped that you are capable of reading posts... Let me
>> 	repeat what I meant in a simpler way so that you can understand:
>> 	All I said was that the majority of the people on earth would proclaim
>> 	their own country to be the best (can you say affection?) while some
>> 	people are willing to live their lives elsewhere for various political
>> 	and economic reasons.  This is like your love to your parents (I hope
>> 	you do) doesn't necessarily mean you'll have to live with them.
>> 
> 
>                 I am more conservative than you.
> 
>> 	By the way, I noticed that you didn't reply to most of my points. 
>> 	Maybe that means you have realized how wrong your points were in
>> 	your previous post.  After all, my post was meant to be a lesson
>> 	for you to learn.
> 
>               See my answer to lix@.... who has posted five "forwarding"s.
> 
>> 
>>>>>       
>>>>>        No! China is not a fascist nation. I can never forget the words
>>>>>    of my Chinese friend. "We just sent a small troop to punish Vietnam.
>>>>>    It took only a few days to conquer Vietnamese. We Chinese are experts
>>>>>    in wars. If we want to beat a country, no matter what it is, we can
>>>>>    always beat it to death!" he, a student from Fujen, said proudly.
>>>>>    China is NOT a fascist nation. She is guarding the JUSTICE of Asia.
>>>> 
>>>> 	Why the hell should what one student said have to do with
>>>> whether China is a fascist nation?  Your logic (or the lack of it)
>>>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>>        It's up to you. I have said it is not.
>> 
>> 	I hope you are smart enough to understand that a sarcastic tone
>> 	means the opposite when someone said something.  Or are you trying to
>> 	cover up your poor logic or the total lack of it in your posts? 
> 
>          It's up to your interpretation. I have said it is not.
> 
>> 
>>>
>>>> only serve to illustrate what kind of mentality you have.  You sure no
>>>> Americans boasting their country's invasion of tiny countries like
>>>> Panama?
>>>
>>>        I am not sure. I don't think the U.S. is a fascist nation.
>> 
>> 	Good.  See, you keep learning things.
> 
>           Yes, I learn things everyday. 
> 
>> 
>>>
>>>>>          No! China is a peace-loving country. China spends money in
>>>>>    testing nuclear bombs when she is asking for economical aids like
>>>>>    educational expenses of some provinces. She is concerned with her
>>>>>    kids. How can a mad dog care about its kids? You are wrong. Don't
>>>>>    you know, since 5000 years ago, China has been expanding her territory
>>>>>    simply because those people who lived aside China were willing to
>>>>>    give up their territories to join with this peace-loving country? 
>>>>>    You are definitely wrong! Hong Kong and Taiwan will be the next.
>>>>>    Of course, the U.S. will join with China someday.
>>>> 
>>>> 	First of all, it is very unwise to make comments on something
>>>> that only shows your ignorance.  I will not waste my time trying to
>>>> teach you any bit of chinese history, since you are such a
>>>> chinese-hater anyway.  But if we follow your definition of a
>>>> peace-loving country, then China will be surprisingly in the same club
>>>> with the UK, France, Germany, the USA, Japan, Russia, and
>>>> you-name-which countries as the best peace-loving countries in the
>>>> world.
>>>
>>>        Why?
>> 
>> 	OK, seems here you have some problem understanding logic.  This is
>> 	indeed a little complicated after all.  Lemme explain: You said
>> 	China is a peace-loving country, because it has been expanding its
>> 	territory. Although this is counterfactual, but logically, your
>> 	comments will put China together with other more (im)famous 
>> 	historically territory-expanding countries like UK, France, the USA,
>> 	Japan, Russia, etc as the more peace-loving countries. 
>> 
> 
>           But I said "because...willing to give up...". Please explain to
>        me again without cutting my sentence. It seems that you have some
>        problem in reading sentence. 
> 
>> 	If you think harder, I'm sure you'll understand this.
> 
>         If you read with your eyes, I'm sure you'll understand my sentence.
> 
>>>
>>>> 	Maybe you are to some extend supportive of the so-called TI or
>>>> whatever (which is doubtful, since you are such a China-hater).  Go to
>>>> Hong Kong and see how many support the idea of HKI, and then go to
>>>> Taiwan to see how many people in Taiwan support TI.  TI'ers always
>>>> make loudest noise, but that in no way conceals the fact that they are
>>>> only a very few.
>>>
>>>         I have never been HK. Tell me your experiance, O.K.?
>>>      My experience in Taiwan tells me it might be 1 million or more.
>>>      Anyway, my post has nothing to do with TI. 
>> 
>> 	You said it might.  which means it's a subjective statement, which
>> 	means it doesn't mean a s**t.  My statement are based on explicit
>> 	and implicit polls conducted in Taiwan, such as how many taiwan 
>> 	voters supported TI'ist nominees in various elections. 
> 
>           "sort"? "slit"? what's that? 
>           My statement was based on result of votes. DPP used TI platform
>       and got 25% (approx.) support. About 1,000,000 people voted. Some of 
>       them supported DPP simply because they don't like KMT. Suppose it is
>       about 50%. The answer is 1,000,000. This number can be larger if one
>       takes into account of KMT's tricky reduction of "voting regions"
>       before vote.
>           BTW, the sample basis of each poll, so far, is only 1,000-2,000.
>       Some of them are very poor in designing questions. And, some people
>       are afraid of speaking out their real thought through phones. I do 
>       not believe that most of them are reliable.
> 
>>>
>>>>>          Why? China is a communist country. That is your obligation
>>>>>      to share your money with them.
>>>> 
>>>> 	If you think this a joke then sadly I'd say you don't have any
>>>> sense of humor.  
>>>
>>>        I think that's you.
>> 
>> 	this sentence is "gou3 pi4 bi4 tong1".  Go back and think another
>> 	one.
> 
>          I am always not very good in English.
> 
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>       You are wrong again! They are THE MASTER RACE. They are
>>>>>   superior than you. Therefore, you must reward them much more
>>>>>   than they help you. Don't forget your racial class!
>>>>>
>>>
>>>        No. I am an all-races-equalist.
>> 
>> 	Very good.  But.... then why did you claim the Chinese are the
>> 	"MASTER RACE"?
> 
>         I didn't. Chinese did. See, for example, <Wa3 Ge3 De Hua2 Shia4
>      Di4 Guo2>, Taiwan Publishing Co. Inc., pp.100-149.
> 
>> 
>>>>>         Cultural revolution is a mistake made by a small group of
>>>>>     people. All of them have been punished. Why should Chinese people
>>>>>     rebel? Their government is always on the right track. Don't you
>>>>>     think the cultural revolution is the best population control method
>>>>>     their government has used?
>>>>>
>>>> 	Sigh, may God forgive thee, for thou do not know.  Any one who
>>>> has the least heart as a human being would not make fun out of what
>>>> other people suffered.  You think you are smart to joke about millions
>>>> of innocent lives, to joke about tens of years of suffering?  To be
>>>> polite, I say you have no soul, no heart; to be rude, I call you son
>>>> of a bitch.
>>>
>>>        Doesn't your bitch mother teach you a better word?
>> 
>> 	See, I used the words for a person who thought s/he was smart enough
>> 	to joke about millions of innocent lives and tens of years' suffering
>> 	for many more people.  (I believe if you tell you mom there is such
>> 	a person, she'll call it a son of a bitch.)  Your use of the same
>> 	words only shows your lack of class and inability to argue with logic.
> 
>         Why should I keep my class and ability to argue with logic with
>      a bitch's son?
> 
>> 
>> 
>>>> Huang He