HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jsm@cs.nott.ac.uk (John Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: New Adventures
Date: 9 Apr 92 19:14:03 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Nottingham University

In article <WHITEHEC.92Apr8113215@panda.cs.man.ac.uk> whitehec@cs.man.ac.uk (C.J.Whitehead) writes:
>
>Is it just me, or are the New Adventures books getting
>too far away from the traditional idea of Doctor Who?
>
>Timewyrm: Revelation and Cats Cradle:Time's Crucible were
>surreal to say the least.  What's happened to the old type
>of plot: "Doctor lands somewhere, gets involved in events,
>sorts out events, Doctor leaves"
>
>Ok, in books you can do things not possible on TV, but does
>this mean we should suddenly allow the Tardis to die and
>have a ghost, and other stupid things like that.  If the
>current trend continues, there is a danger of totally destroying
>27 years of continuity.
>
>What do others think about this?  Should we forgive these
>authors for completely altering our idea of the Doctor?

While your points are fair enough, I have to disagree. Surely it is better
to try and push the boundaries of Who? I mean, one of the main problems of
the Saward/JNT years was its stagnation. Apart from Season 19 (which
shows a lot of experimentation, probably due to the new Doctor and new-ish
production team), the mid 80's saw one bland and uninspired story after
another, most prevalent in junk like "Warriors on the Cheap" (sic), in
which viewers were expected to ignore the shoddy script and production values
just because the story had some old monsters in it (the fact that most
viewers were too young to remember, or had forgotten the Silurians and Sea
Devils was completely ignored).

Conversely, the Cartmel/McCoy years have probably gone too far in terms of
experimentation, alienating some fans - the last three years of the programme
were a period of revolution, when it should have been evolution. A lot
of the blame for this can be laid at the shortness of the seasons - 26
episodes a year would have allowed a greater mix of traditional and
experimental stories. However given a choice, I'd go for Cartmel's
experimentation rather than Saward's over-reliance on the past.

Regarding the _New_ Adventures, Virgin intended to make them different to
the standard stories. The average TV Who story wouldn't fill the approx.
250 pages in these books - just look at the average Terrance Dicks 128 pages
of large print churn-em-out. 

And as for 27 (shouldn't that be 26?) years of continuity - what continuity?
Most of the main concepts of the series (e.g. Gallifrey) weren't around
at the start of the series, and most of these have been altered over the
years (compare the Time Lords in The War Games to those in The Deadly
Assassin, for instance).

Anyway, Genesys, Exodus & Apocalypse are hardly the most original Who stories
ever written, and the forthcoming "Future History Cycle" seems to be set
around previously defined continuity. Perhaps these will be more to your
liking.

-- 
John Smith | Dept of Computer Science, University of Nottingham, UK.
           | Email  jsm@cs.nott.ac.uk  or  psyfjsm@unicorn.nott.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: wilson@cs.ucf.edu (tom wilson)
Subject: Re: The Master's Past
Keywords: Master history regeneration delgado ainley
Organization: University of Central Florida, Orlando
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 02:05:39 GMT

In article <bperles.703175180@du139-212.cc.iastate.edu> bperles@iastate.edu (Brian P Perles) writes:
>	As for his past, The Doc.has said that they went to school together,
>or at least knew each other on Gal.  That doesnt realy make sence since the
>master is on his 13th Regeneration and must be much oldder than the Doc.

There's not direct correlation between number of incarnations and apparent
age. A Timelord could go a few centuries (as Hartnell must have), or just a few
years, before something brings about the regeneration. Since we never see the
Master actually regenerate (other than the before-Deadly-Assassin-look and the
during-Deadly-Assassin-look), he must have regerenated many times before his
appearance in season 8, or many times right before Deadly Assassin (or both).
The only other alternative is that he has regenerated several times but has
been able to control his appearance so that he always looks the same.

Someone who is as troublesome as the Master is bound to use the regenerations
faster than someone careful like the Doctor.

Tom
From: dbarker@camins.camosun.bc.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: Brian Blessed
Date: 12 Apr 92 20:00:17 GMT
Organization: Camosun College

In article <1992Apr11.170536.13590@crash.cts.com>, jhitch@crash.cts.com (Jeffrey Hitchin) writes:
> In <1992Apr10.222034.375@cco.caltech.edu> tlynch@cco.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) writes:
> 
>>For those who want to go a bit further afield than SF (which so far is
>>all I've seen so far as references to BB are concerned), Brian Blessed
>>does a magnificent turn as Caesar Augustus in the first five episodes
>>of "I, Claudius".
> 
>>Tim Lynch
> 
> 	And on more non-SF stuff, he was in a two-hour episode of
> "Lovejoy" as an unscrupulous art dealer.  I can't remember the name
> of the episode, but it had Linda Grey in it.

Excellent, he was indeed. He also played the eccentric Greek in "My
Family and Other Animals", the dramatisation of Gerald Durrell's
autobiographical novel.

-- 
Deryk Barker
Computer Science Dept.
Camosun College,
Victoria, BC
Canada
From: zkessin@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Zachary 'Lego' Kessin)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: The Master's Past
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:40:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: chaos.zkessin.703186821
Organization: Brandeis University

aa634@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bill White) writes:


>In a previous article, bperles@iastate.edu (Brian P Perles) says:

[...]

>Now a question concerning the Master. Does anybody have any theories
>of what happend to the Master between "Frontier In Space" and "The
>Deadly Assassin" that put his body into such a decayed state? It's
>never mentioned in any of the televised stories, but it's something
>I've wondered for a long time.

I thought that it was age, the end of his life cycle, but he decided
to go on living anyway. You could say that he was exposed to something
that caused his body to decay, but I don't think so.


>Bill White, aa634@Cleveland.freenet.edu OR aa037@Medina.Freenet.edu

--Zach
   Zachary Kessin               
 ZKessin@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu  / real.world: I don't think the    |
 (617)736-5878                 /   news server gets that group!    |
From: stabosz@brahms.udel.edu (Rae Stabosz)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: New Doctor
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:33:36 GMT
Organization: University of Delaware


	I don't usually participate in discussions of who the New Doctor
might be, but a recent posting suggesting a return to Tom Baker got me
to thinking.  I am one of those who first began watching Dr. Who when
Tom Baker was the doctor, and so he WAS the Doctor, for me, and he
remains my favorite.

	I could see him returning, if they did it in the following way:
brought him back in a sort of older, grayer, sadder Doctor.  As if he
recognized himself again, from a former regeneration, and had a kind of
haunting existential melancholy for awhile... first season... as he
worked on assimilating who he is now (a different type of regeneration,
a return to a former identity, but with changes) with who he was, and
who he will be again.  Using the natural aging of Tom Baker as a
starting point for contemplation of identity for the Doctor.  I could
see this very well.  I'd like to see it.  I always thought Tom Baker had
a wide range of interpretation for the Doctor, and would love to see him
as a new/old Doctor, something which has not been done before.

	Rae

From: uhclem@nemesis.UUCP
Date: 06 Apr 92 19:56 CDT
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: Sci-Fi channel
Message-ID: <-403800@nemesis>
Nf-ID: #R:dartvax.dartmouth.edu:14184:nemesis:-403800:000:2283
Nf-From: nemesis.UUCP!uhclem    Apr  6 19:56:00 1992


[0]Rattletrap Exlaxia (Battlestar Galactica).  Finally they have rights
[0]to Dr. Who, but which ones is not specified.

According to the last info Lionheart gave my local PBS station,
SFC only has rights to production codes A-ZZ, EXCLUDING MM.  On this
they allegedly have a nation-wide exclusive, and have had it since
1990.  

Does anyone know of a US station that IS showing the Hartnells and
Troughtons now?  This might indicate that the exclusiveness has timed-out,
or may only indicate that the given station had secured the rights
long ago and haven't renegotiated in at least two years.  The local PBS
station did not know how long the exclusive-rights were for on these, but
subsequently they have been unable to reshow the early stories and had
planned to do so when they reached the end of McCoy recently.

Lionheart did a similar thing with Monty Python.  They gave a five-year
nation-wide exclusive contract to MTV.  MTV showed them every twenty
minutes for six months (edited, introduced, and with commercials)
and finally stopped showing them.  But the five years have not expired
yet, so no one else in the US can get the rights.  PBS is having the
same trouble with one or two shows that they showed and then A&E got
a contract and now PBS stations can't get them back.

I for one am very depressed that SFC is now in the hands of USA network.
After watching the film 'The Blues Brothers' on USA that had been totally
butchered (Ray Charles only appears in the credits, the entire music store
and street dance was omitted, along with everything that happened in the
jail at the start of the film that didn't have credits on top of it, plus
other stuff), they keep the USA logo on the screen for a minute or so,
and show it every five to ten minutes, and they insert lots of commercials.
With :20 of commercials per hour, those :25 and :28 Dr. Who Episodes are in
for significant hacking, IF USA treats SFC the same way.   But this time,
I do believe that SFC will actually go on the air.


Frank Durda IV <uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org>|"This won't do at all.  We 
...utacfd!nemesis!uhclem (nearest internet) | can't have two of us walking
...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem	            | around!"
...decvax!microsoft!trsvax!nemesis!uhclem   |Who said it and What story?
From: trent@termnet.chi.il.us (Brian Issleb)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: Douglas Adams
Date: 10 Apr 92 00:02:18 GMT
Organization: Temple of Pong BBS

In article <1992Apr07.054900.8954@deeptht.santa-cruz.ca.us>,
keeper@deeptht.santa-cruz.ca.us (Ron O'Dell) writes:
>In article <1992Apr1.025026.20002@nic.unh.edu> B_LUND1@unhh.unh.edu (Marcus Win
>dwalker) writes:
>>In <0NkiiB8w164w@bsbbs.columbus.oh.us> doctor@bsbbs.columbus.oh.us writes:
>>| Hey,did anyone ever find out about Douglas Adams dying or not?
>>	Then, why don't you know if he died? :-) Sorry, couldn't resist
>
>
>What's funny?  That is precisely what he's asking.
>
>We don't know if he died, because some fool a few months ago posted
>"Douglas Adams has terminal cancer," without giving any attribution.
>
>I would imagine that it was false, because since that time, there was a
>television special (interview) with him ... if it had had any mention of
>him dying, I'm sure people here or rec.arts.tv.uk would have said something.


Or on alt.fan.douglas-adams

 
 
           "...my left arm's come off too.  Hell, how am I going to
             operate my digital watch now?"

                                         -Arthur Dent
From: schouten@sp17.csrd.uiuc.edu (Dale Schouten)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: The *The* prefix in front of Time Lord's names
Date: 14 Apr 92 20:19:11 GMT
Organization: Center for Supercomputing R & D

In article <walshm.703277463@craft.camp.clarkson.edu> walshm@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Matt 'MTM' Walsh) writes:
> Ever notice that some timelords have 'The' names, like
> THE doctor
> THE master
> THE Rani
> The president

Yes.

The Dale
schouten@uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho,rec.arts.tv.uk,rec.arts.startrek.current,rec.arts.sf.science
From: kasprj@operators.its.rpi.edu (Jim Kasprzak)
Subject: Re: Parallel Universes
Reply-To: kasprj@rpi.edu
Organization: The Big Wedge
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 23:55:03 GMT

In article <ZPZ8iB4w164w@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca>, yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Dave Shariff Yadallee) writes:
|> Trying something new.  The subject alternative universes.
 
 Well, perhaps new on this discussion this week. 
 
 Required reading for any discussion of alternate realities should include
Larry Niven's essay "The Theory and Practice of Time Travel". And for a look
from the fiction angle, try Niven's "All the Myriad Ways".
------------------------------------------------------------------
     __  Live from Capitaland, heart of the Empire State...
 ___/  | Jim Kasprzak, computer operator @ RPI, Troy, NY, USA
/____ *| Why can't people stop taking things so seriously? 
     \_| "All I want is to have my peace of mind" - Boston   
      ====  e-mail: kasprj@rpi.edu or kasprzak@mts.rpi.edu 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: kemnitz@netcom.com (Greg Kemnitz)
Subject: Re: Question on the Master
Date: Wed, 08 Apr 92 20:05:11 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article <domalley.702756482@unix1.tcd.ie> domalley@unix1.tcd.ie (Slartibartfast            (alias Daniel O'Malley)) writes:
>In <WGARMIL.92Apr7162521@cs.ulowell.edu> wgarmil@cs.ulowell.edu (WildCard) writes:

>>I think everyone is forgetting the real reason for the BBC doing this.
>
>>The actor who played hte orginal Master died right before that episode
>>was filmed.  Rather than kill the character off, the BBC had someone
>>play that decrepid version. 
>
>*BING!!*
>Wrong!!
>Roger Delgado died in 1973. 'Assassin' dates from 1976.
>Surely they had time to seek a replacement actor in 3 years?
>But who cares anyway? Assassin was a classic story, and the
>Master's appearance makes it even more convincing (and he looks kinda cool,
>in a gruesome sort of way...)
>Daniel.


Yeah, Daniel is right on this.  Bob Holmes, who wrote the Deadly Assassin,
and the script editor at the time (or was this already Holmes?) decided
to bring back the Master in this story to set up his use in other stories
later if a future production team wished to do so at a later date.

Which they did.


	Jon Rhein
	jon@postgres.berkeley.edu
	postin from a friend's account
From: ss@rugsucker.WPI.EDU (Scott N Streeter)
Subject: Re: The Master's Past
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, MA 01609-2280
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 23:12:55 GMT

>>>>> On 11 Apr 92 19:39:40 GMT, malinon@iastate.edu (Ramon C Redondo) said:


malinon> Sice we have talked about the Master's most recent
malinon> incarnations...  I have a question.  Does anyone have any
malinon> knowledge of the Master's life BEFORE Roger Delgado played
malinon> him?  This would MOSTLY be outside of the actual show, but I
malinon> have heard a rummor (I don't know how much faith, if any to
malinon> put into it) the the Master was the Monk in the Time Meddler
malinon> (try saying THAT one three times fast!).

I had heard a rumor at one point that the Master is really a future
regeneration of The Doctor. Anyone else hear this.
--
                        Scott Streeter
                        ss@wpi.wpi.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: J_DELANO1@unhh.unh.edu (Jeff   Delano)
Subject: Dr. Who Encyclopedia?
Organization: University of New Hampshire
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 23:36:21 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.12

	Our erudite author lister, John Wenn, has listed in his
Dr. Who Books list the Doctor Who Encyclopedia.  He has two volumes
listed, which cover half the alphabet.  I have never heard of these
books anywhere else.  Can anyone tell me if they are genuine?
	Senex

 ______   _____  _       _____ _     _
|______  |____  |  \  | |____   \___/   J_Delano@unh.unh.edu
_______| |_____ |   \_| |_____ _/   \_
       
"If you could see birds wheeling in another sky, would that convince you?"
____________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: aa634@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bill White)
Subject: Re: The Master's Past
Reply-To: aa634@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bill White)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 92 15:06:20 GMT


In a previous article, bperles@iastate.edu (Brian P Perles) says:

>
>	I have the book form of Time Meddler, and I honsty thought the Monk was
>the Master,(till some one told me otherwise).  I think he was killed in "Dalek
>Master plan", but that has never stoped anyone before.  The Master has died many 
>a time!
>	As for his past, The Doc.has said that they went to school together,
>or at least knew each other on Gal.  That doesnt realy make sence since the
>master is on his 13th Regeneration and must be much oldder than the Doc.
>  But hey, maybe the Master was alittle slow?
>

not necessarily. Just because the Master ran out of regenerations 
and stole a body doesn't mean that he's older than the Doctor. What it
does mean is that he's more wasteful and takes more chances than the
Doctor. 

Now a question concerning the Master. Does anybody have any theories
of what happend to the Master between "Frontier In Space" and "The
Deadly Assassin" that put his body into such a decayed state? It's
never mentioned in any of the televised stories, but it's something
I've wondered for a long time.


"It looks like we're gonna need a new Timmy!"
               --Mr. Lizard
                 Dinosaurs
-- 
Bill White, aa634@Cleveland.freenet.edu OR aa037@Medina.Freenet.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------
       Assistant Sysop, Cleveland & Medina County Free-net's
                  Science Fiction and Fantasy Sig
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho,rec.arts.startrek.current,rec.arts.sf.science
From: ghogenso@jarthur.claremont.edu (Gordon Hogenson)
Subject: Re: Parallel Universes
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 01:01:26 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.200456.22415@news.cso.uiuc.edu> ose@symcom.math.uiuc.edu (David T. Ose) writes:
>  Mathematics is used
>in most disciplines, and especially in physics, as a model that describes
>certain aspects of observed phenomena.  The problem enters when we say 
>"THIS MODEL IS REALITY."  It is not reality.   In particular, QM is not 
>reality; it is a theory that describes parts of what we experience 
>(or at least of what modern physicists experience).  

The question of the nature of reality is very complex and subtle.  
Very often mathematicians come up with mathematics without thought
to its potential applications, only to discover that these mathematical
ideas are very useful in describing the physical world.  This is what
happened with group theory, with fractals and chaos, and with orthogonal
polynomials (in QM basis sets).  This suggests to me that "reality" is
indeed mathematical in nature--otherwise why should so many mathematical
ideas find a place in reality? 

Einstein was able to make several *predictions* about the universe based
on mathematical arguments.  If mathematics/physics were simply a model
used to *describe* what we already observe, then how could it possibly
predict things that we have never thought to observe?

Mathematics seems to *predict* not just describe observed events.  You
underestimate its power by stating that mathematics is "simply" a model.

Note that in some cases my arguments do not apply--sometimes mathematics
is used as "simply" a model.  For example, in biological population
dynamics, differential equations are made which contain parameters that
are meant to simplify and approximate underivable quantities such as
"death rate" or "reproductive rate."

>---David Ose                  Mathematics Dept.,  U of Illinois
-- 
Gordon Hogenson
From: Allan.Finkas@f1701.n140.z1.fidonet.org (Allan Finkas)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Brian Blessed (was Re: Pertwee, etc.)
Date: 12 Apr 92 13:42:00 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:140/1701 - USS Galifrey, Regina Sask


In a msg of <11 Apr 92>, Erin McCanna, ema writes to All:

 EMe> Does anyone remember that
 EMe> really bad SF "B" movie he was in that I think was a version of Flash
 EMe> Gordon, where Flash is a football star? Very bad. He was king of the
 EMe> monkey people (yes, like in Oz).

It was the Di Laurentis version of "Flash Gordon" starring Sam Jones as
Flash, Max Von Sydow as Emperor Ming, Melody Anderson and Topol.  Queen
did the soundtrack.

Blessed's role as king of the Hawkmen was one of the more memorable bits in
the movie.  I had not seen Blessed in any other roles prior to this and
thought he seemed rather eccentric and rather humourous at the time.  All
other roles I've seen him in since then have seemed rather similar.

-Al

"Greed is good!  Greed is right!  Greed works!" --- Fajo

--  
Allan Finkas - via FidoNet node 1:140/22
UUCP: ...!access.usask.ca!weyr!1701!Allan.Finkas
Domain: Allan.Finkas@f1701.n140.z1.fidonet.org
Standard Disclaimers Apply...
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: robinson@next532-2.gsfc.nasa.gov (Scott Robinson)
Subject: Re: Sci-Fi channel
Organization: Goddard Space Flight Center
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 13:55:37 GMT

In article <-403800@nemesis> uhclem@nemesis.UUCP writes:
> 
> Does anyone know of a US station that IS showing the Hartnells and
> Troughtons now?  

Maryland Public TV is currently showing the Hartnells.  Last week was  
"The Romans"...

--
J. Scott Robinson              Computer Sciences Corp.
      EMail: robinson@next532-2.gsfc.nasa.gov
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana...
From: keeper@deeptht.santa-cruz.ca.us (Ron O'Dell)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
Subject: Re: Pertwee, etc.
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 92 22:34:27 GMT
Organization: The Armory

In article <1992Apr10.155037.1@kean.ucs.mun.ca> pjam@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
>I'd like to see more of him. Other Brian Blessed works, anyone?

He's been in many things ... television, besides Doctor Who:

Blake's 7  ("Cygnus Alpha")
Space: 1999  (I don't remember the episode title)
The Black Adder  (the King)

movies?  Henry V; Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves (I heard -- never saw the
film); a 1981 Flash Gordon film

Plenty more, I'm sure.  Theatre too, I imagine.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho
From: aa634@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bill White)
Subject: Re: K-9 and Company (opinions)
Reply-To: aa634@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bill White)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 92 13:20:44 GMT


In a previous article, dbarker@camins.camosun.bc.ca () says:

>In article <92100.091754JMH131@psuvm.psu.edu>, <JMH131@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>      I just thought I'd put in a few words about _K-9 and Company_.  I take it
>>  that the BBC originally cancelled the show because it didn't receive high
>>  enough ratings.  Am I right about this?
>
>Not exactly. I don't think it was ever a series, but a one-off special. They
>might have considered it a possible pilot, to be followed by a series if it
>was successful enough, but it was never touted in England as a series. The BBC
>never, in my experience  cancels a series after a single show. Anyway, the show
>was an hour long (well 50 minutes) whereas one would have expected it to be
>half that for a series.
>

It might have been produced as a Christmas special since that holiday
is mentioned throughout the story.


"It looks like we're gonna need a new Timmy!"
               --Mr. Lizard
                 Dinosaurs
-- 
Bill White, aa634@Cleveland.freenet.edu OR aa037@Medina.Freenet.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------
       Assistant Sysop, Cleveland & Medina County Free-net's
                  Science Fiction and Fantasy Sig
Newsgroups: rec.arts.drwho