From: mike@isgtec.com (Mike Sellers)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: places to live in the USA
Date: 7 Oct 92 13:10:35 GMT
Organization: ISG Technologies Inc., Mississauga Ontario

There was just recently a discussion of this in misc.jobs.misc.
I'll give you a capsule here of what I said there.  

We recently moved from Portland, Oregon, to Toronto, Ontario as the
result of accepting my current position.  I'm glad we did it overall,
but it was a heart-wrenching decision; if quality & cost of living were
the only issue, we would _never_ have moved.  I should note too that
my wife and I have lived all over the US and overseas, so we've seen
more than a few areas firsthand.

My top choice for livability, cost, etc., especially considering factors 
like gardening, traffic, crime, climate, schools, and other family needs,
is still the Portland area, specifically Tualatin/Sherwood, without question.
The entire Pacific NorthWest ("upper left coast" :-) ) is quite good, but 
the cost of living and traffic in the Seattle area are killers.  Some other 
areas like Corvallis, Oregon, being a college town, might be somewhere where
you and your husband can find work.  Portland does have a small-feeling 
hi-tech market; no telling what you could find these days.  One aspect of
Oregon (out of many) that I might mention is the gardening:  people in 
western Oregon grow more fruits and vegetables in private gardens than
I've seen anywhere else in the US... and *anything* will grow there.
Also, Portland is known as the "Rose City" -- there are rose gardens 
all over -- and, curiously enough, the elephant-breeding capital of the
world.  It's also home to Tektronix, Intel, Mentor Graphics, Sequent,
HP (Corvallis), and many other high-tech firms.  Oh, and you mentioned
trout fishing.  This, along with ocean (salmon) fishing, the mountains,
desert, skiing, and forests (including the only state park inside city
limits) are available within a 2 hour drive of Portland.

Just to give you an idea: We sold our house (sniff) for $125000 last
April.  It was 2500sf, 4br, 3.5ba, .25 acre fenced lot with fruit trees,
garden, grapes, raspberries, blueberries, 3 decks, view of forests and 
mountains, on a court, great neighborhood, great schools.  I don't know 
that I'll ever see housing value/cost like that again.

Other areas you might want to consider (this information was amassed 
during my job search):  

The Salt Lake City area -- low cost of living, (one of the only areas
lower than the Portland area) generally good family living; but -- hot 
summers and cold winters and parochial attitudes abound.

Denver/Boulder Colorado -- higher in cost than Oregon or Utah, but
still reasonable.  Down-to-earth people, with a decidedly western
(but cosmopolitan) culture.  Seems to have a good job market.

Dallas/Ft Worth Texas -- same as Colorado, except last I checked the
housing market was very inexpensive.  Also the summers are imported
from Hell, as are the fire ants.  

Atlanta, Georgia, the RTP area of North Carolina, Madison, Wisconson
and in some ways Vancourver BC also rated highly on my list, which 
looked a lot like yours.

Toronto is by many measures a great place to live too.  It is safe, 
generally clean, the schools are generally good (but not great), and
people overall are friendly.  However, the cost of living is ridiculous--
Toronto is the most expensive city in N. America, I heard a few months
ago.  The sales tax is 15% (Oregon has _none_ ... talk about a shock!),
in addition to a hefty income tax, property tax, no mortgage deduction,
vehicular taxes, and just about every other form of tax you can think of.
But, I love my job, and it seems to be working out for us.

Good luck to you!

--
              Mike Sellers      User Interface Team Leader
           mike@isgtec.com      ISG Technologies, Toronto, Canada
              "Actum ne agas" -- Do not do what has been done.
                         Furare tantum ab Optimis