HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Forcing locks (was Re: Mushroom pins)
Date: 15 Apr 92 22:11:39 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In article <1992Apr14.212537.25749@cco.caltech.edu> carl@SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU writes:
>In article <1992Apr14.165823.29478@cs.yale.edu>, yarvin-norman@CS.YALE.EDU (Norman Yarvin) writes:
>>I wondered one time if it was possible to, by applying enough force, just
>>shear the pins of a pin tumbler lock apart.  The pins, I reasoned, are made

>It would work.  The campus locksmith shop has what those of us who have seen it
>in action refer to as the "B&G master."  It's a two-foot piece of metal with a
>piece of steel thin enough to fit into a keyway, but still pretty damned strong
>welded onto the end of it.  Insert it into the keyway and twist, and the lock's
>open.

In a couple of movies I've seen car trunks opened with a yard-long rod that
gets jammed into the trunk lock and yanked.  The result is that the entire
lock gets pulled out.

Does this kind of thing exist in the Real World?  Would it work on cheap
door locks?  Seems a pretty fast (but destructive) way to get something
opened.

-- 
fadden@uts.amdahl.com (Andy McFadden)
[ Above opinions are mine, Amdahl has nothing to do with them, etc, etc. ]
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: Novice questions.
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 04:35:50 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.IBM.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In  <MCCASLAN.92Apr13220507@duncan.cs.utk.edu>  mccaslan@duncan.cs.utk.edu (a dancing marSUPial) writes:
>
> WD40, although a lubricant,

WD40 is *not* a lubricant.  As the name implies (Water Displacement formula
# 40) it is designed for displacing moisture.

> and quickly on the subject of Best locks, i was under the impression that
> all Best locks (at least those here) had a warded bit at the end of the lock
> that kept even all the other pins from being picked...

What gives you this impression?  I've never seen a Best cylinder designed
this way.  (Which doesn't mean that they don't exist, but I'd love to see
one if they did...)  Are you confused by the shoulder on the bottom of the
key at the tip?  This is a stop so that the pins can be counted from the
tip instead of from the bow; most other keys have a shoulder near the bow of
the key which butts up against the face of the cylinder core.  The fact
that Best has the shoulder at the tip means that you can use a 7-pin
blank in a 5, 6, or 7 pin lock without having the excess sticking out the
back of the core into the lock cylinder.

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing,sci.electronics,rec.pyrotechnics
From: hologram@wam.umd.edu (C. Carlson)
Subject: Re: Proximity detectors, flash pots, smoke pots, radio control
Organization: University of Maryland at College Park
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 05:29:10 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.042111.4346@cco.caltech.edu> heathh@cco.caltech.edu (Heath Ian Hunnicutt) writes:
>Hello,
>	Does anybody in net-land have any info on building a motion/
>proximity detector?  What I am hoping to construct is a small device
>that can be placed near strategic entryways that would radio an alert
>to some control box if there was motion in the sensors field of vision.
>
>	It would be very much to my liking also, if the control
>box could issue radio commands to electronic flash pots and 
>smoke pots.  (The kind used in stage productions to produce thos
>exciting pyrotechnic bursts of light and smoke.)
>
>	So, anyone who has any inbfo/suggestions, please mail me.
>
>See ya,
>Heath
>

	My dad just bought a light for our carport that has a motion
detector built into it.  So, when I drive home at night the light
comes on!  I think he bought it at Hechinger's and was reasonably
priced.  And it probably uses the same technology that home burgler
alarms use...  Just a thought...

--chris carlson
hologram@wam.umd.edu
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: asa3@ellis.uchicago.edu (Snugglebear)
Subject: five keys
Reply-To: asa3@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Distribution: NA
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 00:51:55 GMT



There's also another problem with the coded key(?) lock that you're talking 
about.  Most of the time, you can get the keys involved by seeing which keys
have already been pressed.  I just managed to open a lock in the dorm,
but it was only a three key combination, so the permutations were easy!@



Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: interest.. combination locks.
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1992 22:35:44 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.ibm.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In  <ku201tINN2ds@utkcs2.cs.utk.edu>  mccaugha@hydra3f.cs.utk.edu (William Douglas ( Doug ) - The Juggler ( me ) writes:
> I do not see how in the world a stethoscope and good hearing would help get
> something like this moster open.

Safes are fun.  Manipulation involves more feeling than hearing.

> How does a locksmith go about opening a safe built into a walk for which the
> combination is unknown?

Depending on the safe, either manipulation, or drilling.  (After a safe is
drilled, you can weld in hardened steel rods to fill the hole, and repaint it.)

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: charles@sdd.hp.com (Charles Keith)
Subject: Source for Medeco Cylinders
Organization: EEPG HP San Diego Div.
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 21:34:46 GMT


If anybody wants some Medeco cylinders to fool around with, there is a
surplus company called Marlin P. Jones & Assoc that is selling them real
cheap.

Based mostly on curiosity inspired by this group, I ordered a couple.
What you get is a cylinder with a slot in the back, (looks hard to apply
unless you have matching equipment or do machine work) two nuts to hold
the cylinder in, 3 keys, and a key card.  The catalog only promises 2
keys.

These locks may be quite old (I have bought WWII surplus from MPJ&A) but
they are definitely Medecos, and they look hard to pick (but I am a poor
judge of that).  They have "Medeco" and a UL symbol on the front of the
cylinder.  The cylinder can be slid out of the housing by removing a
snap ring, but the cylinder itself looks hard to disassemble (probably a
destructive process).  They are worth what I paid just to satisfy my
curiosity.

Marlin P. Jones & Assoc. P.O. Box 12685, Lake park, FL 33403-0685
Stock number: HD2003      Price: $5.00
Call: 407-848-8236 8:30AM-4:30PM Eastern time Visa/MC/Amex
$3.50 service charge for orders under $15.

I have no relationship with Marlin P. Jones & Assoc. except as an
occasional (and generally satisfied) customer.

->Charles Keith
-- 
Charles Keith M/S 61U65     Telnet: 592-4472
Hewlett-Packard Co.         Internet: charles@sdd.hp.com
16399 W. Bernardo Dr.       Disclaimer: I am not a qualified spokesperson.
San Diego, CA 92127-1899
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: mycroft@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Charles Hannum)
Subject: Re: Bathroom door locks
Organization: /etc/organization
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 16:20:37 GMT


In article <92099.133700U56932@uicvm.uic.edu> <U56932@uicvm.uic.edu>
writes:
>
> I was downtown leaving a client's office when I decided to stop by
> the restroom on the floor. When I got there, there was this teardrop-
> shaped Simplex lock on the door!

Jesus!  What'll they do next, put a lock on the exit so you have to
hack your way out of the building?  This is ridiculous.

Newsgroups:   alt.locksmithing
From: Larry Margolis <margoli@watson.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: Novice questions.
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 04:24:44 GMT
Reply-To: margoli@watson.IBM.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: The Village Waterbed

In    <92104.163726C09615SJ@wuvmd.wustl.edu>          Aack! <C09615SJ@WUVMD.WUSTL.EDU> writes:
>
>    I don't completely understand your question.  I have two bent pieces
> of metal in my set.  I thought they were called torque wrenches.  They are
> made of springy steel but they don't bend in the direction that I apply
> force to.   I've got one of those simple Pro-Lock sets.

All torque wrenches have at least one bend.  Some have a second twist on
the handle side, so that they *do* bend as you apply pressure.  (Some have
an additional twist on the end that goes into the lock, for when the 90
degree bend would have you hitting the handle into the door jamb.)

Larry Margolis, MARGOLI@YKTVMV (Bitnet), margoli@watson.IBM.com (Internet)
Xref: sparky alt.locksmithing:706 sci.electronics:8649 rec.pyrotechnics:1859
From: mccaugha@hydra2a.cs.utk.edu (William Douglas ( Doug ) - The Juggler ( me ) McCaughan)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing,sci.electronics,rec.pyrotechnics
Subject: Re: Proximity detectors, flash pots, smoke pots, radio control
Date: 17 Apr 92 02:50:27 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, University of Tennesee, Knoxville
Distribution: world
Reply-To: mccaugha@hydra2a.cs.utk.edu (William Douglas ( Doug ) - The Juggler ( me ) McCaughan)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hydra2a.cs.utk.edu

In article <66qaJB1w164w@obmarket>, michaelc@obmarket (Michael Campbell) writes:
[stuff deleted..]
|> On a related note, I've heard that modern fire alarms in buildings, (the
|> kind you set off, not the automatic kind) have the paint spraying
|> mechanisms similar to the ones in bank bags.  (Explode on you, literally
|> painting you red.  Sometimes blue.  Impossible to wash off).  True, not
|> true?

There is a dye on the market that cannot be washed off (unless you get to it
within the first 20 minutes of having it sprayed on you). It takes about a week
to wear off. I have seen it used in a product intended for selfdefense (an 
alternative to mace). The product creates a 3 inch thick foam on the face of the
attacker and also colors his skin green (for a week). It cannot harm the eyes
and will not cause reactions even in the most allegetic person. Also, if it is
turned on you for some reason, you really cannot be hurt. The product is good 
but is presently be marketed through somewhat of a pyramid scheme.

Generally, the fire alarm pulls (the little white handles in the read box that
says 'break glass incase of fire') spray UV dye on you as you pull it. Until you
experience having just a little of this on your hands then looking at yourself
under a black light, you would not believe how much people touch themselves (it
spreads like mad!).

-- 
...doug <mccaugha@cs.utk.edu> USA    | The past 22 years have been a |
                                     | helluva trip, but honestly, I |
                                     | am ready to come down now...  |
From: gxs@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Greg Sorkin)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Sesame Padlocks
Date: 15 Apr 92 12:08:51 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh

A handy way to get small quantities of various thicknesses of shim stock is to
buy a set of spark plug gauges from your local auto parts shop.
From: mccaslan@hydra2a.cs.utk.edu (a dancing marSUPial)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Novice questions.
Date: 15 Apr 92 09:41:44
Organization: /blue/homes/mccaslan/.organization
NNTP-Posting-Host: hydra2a.cs.utk.edu
In-reply-to: Larry Margolis's message of Tue, 14 Apr 1992 04:35:50 GMT


oh.  and double oh.
actually, i had it told to me that there was such a thing at the
end of a Best.  and here i was all in a hurry to go out and buy
a set of best blanks (all the a-h series) in order to make tension
wrenches...looks like i don't have to do that now.

question: ever get tired of goofy questions? :)
thanks,
don
From: brown@cs.utk.edu (Lance A. Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: Dye marker fire alarms?
Followup-To: alt.locksmithing
Date: 16 Apr 92 15:33:41
Organization: Univ of TN, Knoxville - CS Department
	<ranck.59@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: galoob.cs.utk.edu
In-reply-to: ranck@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu's message of 16 Apr 92 17:28:52 GMT

> ranck@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu (Wm. L. Ranck) wrote:Article-I.D.: vtvm1.ranck.59

> In article <66qaJB1w164w@obmarket> michaelc@obmarket (Michael Campbell)
> writes:

>>On a related note, I've heard that modern fire alarms in buildings, (the
>>kind you set off, not the automatic kind) have the paint spraying
>>mechanisms similar to the ones in bank bags.  (Explode on you, literally
>>painting you red.  Sometimes blue.  Impossible to wash off).  True, not
>>true?

>    Well, I don't know if it's true or not, but it sounds way too easy to
> get around this type of detterent.  Take a coat hanger and pull the lever
> from a few feet back.  But, there are lots of ineffective products on the
> market so I wouldn't say that nobody has marketed these.
>    This sort of thing only works once or twice.  Then the troublemakers 
> find out about it and the workarounds are simple.

Aye, but if everyone on campus KNOWS that somebody has tripped a trapped
alarm, it is difficult to hide yourself with a purple hand.  Once or twice
should be all it takes to catch the perpetrator.

Lance
--
Lance A. Brown  <brown@cs.utk.edu>
  The Crystal Wind is the Storm, and the Storm is Data,
     and the Data is Life -- The Player's Litany
                                 from _The Long Run_ by D.K. Moran
From: hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: Re: pop cans
Date: 9 Apr 92 20:46:31 GMT
Organization: Computing Center, North Carolina State University

In article <1992Apr8.041005.17967@athena.cs.uga.edu> miles@athena.cs.uga.edu (Miles Meekhof) writes:
> ...
>A guy once told me if you dissolve salt in some water, heat it up, add some
>more and so on  (Super-saturating) and then put it in a squeegee bottle and
>then
>squeeze it into the coin slot, you are supposed to get a lot of cokes or pop.
>
>I actually tried this once, but it didn't seem to work.  I heard that when you
>put a quarter into the slot, it makes a connection from one side to the other.
> ...

  In the *old* days, coin machines had tests built in to make sure
that the coins used were valid coins - but the tests were 
mechanical.  A coin had to be the right size, roughly the right
weight, bounce about right, be non-magnetic, ... to be accepted.
While it is possible that some of the new integrated circuit types
forgot some of this practical wisdom, I would assume that there would
be sufficient economic pressure to rapidly rediscover it.  Therefore
I would be astonished if there were coin-op machines which merely
checked for electrical continuity and were satisfied with this.
My own guess is that some coin-op machine was made with some
electronic module not well protected from a conducting liquid which 
was squirted in the slot and that the salt water caused a short
which made the machine think it had received some money.  No doubt 
the manufacturers/operators quickly learned to put in a piece of 
plastic or whatever to keep that from happening any more.

--henry schaffer  n c state univ
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis
Date:         Mon, 13 Apr 92 16:37:34 CST
From:         Aack! <C09615SJ@WUVMD.WUSTL.EDU>
To:           NETNEWS@WUVMD
Subject:      Re: Novice questions.
Newsgroups:   alt.locksmithing

>
>In article <1992Apr13.151213.10720@ncsu.edu>, hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E.
>Schaffer) says:
>
>In article <92104.085725C09615SJ@wuvmd.wustl.edu> C09615SJ@WUVMD.WUSTL.EDU
>(Aack!) writes:
>> ...  What makes one lock easier to pick than another?   ...
>>       [even though they] use the same type of blank.
>
>...........................................  Dirty, grungy locks are
>often harder to pick.
>

   Makes sense.  Does this mean that a can of WD-40 should be among
a locksmith's tools of the trade?

>>       .............................  Am I applying too much pressure?
>
>...........................................................  Is
>the handle of your wrench made from springy steel?  I prefer this type
>because the amount of torque is easily seen/controlled by how far
>the handle is curved by pressure on its tip.
>>

   I don't completely understand your question.  I have two bent pieces
of metal in my set.  I thought they were called torque wrenches.  They are
made of springy steel but they don't bend in the direction that I apply
force to.   I've got one of those simple Pro-Lock sets.

                                             Jon
From: hes@unity.ncsu.edu (Henry E. Schaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: The second step (Was: Re: The National Locksmith - Magazine)
Date: 13 Apr 92 01:59:46 GMT
Organization: Computing Center, North Carolina State University

In article <kuhjv3INNgr1@utkcs2.cs.utk.edu> mccaugha@duncan.cs.utk.edu (William Douglas ( Doug ) - The Juggler ( me ) McCaughan) writes:
> ...
>What do you do after you have bought the lock, taken the thing apart, 
>comprended the internal workings, played with it, filed through the casing for
>other locks (such as combination and key padlocks) to get at their internal
>workings, read books at several libraries, then realise that there is still 
>more to learn but find that you have run out of sources?

  OK - that's fair.  There are several things you can do.  One, of course, 
is to subscribe to a locksmithing magazine.  But a magazine won't help all 
that much, so you have to continue buying various types of locks, taking 
them apart, figuring out everything about them, and installing, removing,
modifying them.  Buy some key blanks, make up a master key scheme,
and file the keys to fit (assuming you don't have a key machine) -
filing may take a few minutes, but it does work.  Maybe buy a
rekeying kit (kit of different size pins, with a follower) and do
some rekeying for your family or friends (the same size pins fit,
I think, the familiar Kwikset and Schlage pin tumbler locks) so that
their deadbolts can be opened with their normal front door key.  Or
buy a deadbolt installation kit (hole saw plus template - I think that
Black and Decker makes a good one, available at better building
supply places) and put in a few deadbolts for your family and friends -
charging them only for the material plus a couple of bucks towards the
installation kit - and rekey the deadbolt for them, too.  Buy or
make a pick set, and use your practice locks to practice picking.
Help people at work who have been locked out of their
desks or filing cabinets.  Desks usually have wafer tumbler locks
which are *much* easier to pick than pin tumbler locks.  Filing cabinets
are not as easy to pick, but are pickable and also can be opened by
pushing a flexible plastic ruler past the sliding drawer - carefully
inspect some working cabinets to see what I'm talking about.

  When you've done all that, ask again.  :-)

--henry
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: bberbeni@isis.cs.du.edu (Bill Berbenich)
Subject: Re: pop cans
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 92 04:00:50 GMT

allyn@netcom.com (Mark Allyn) writes:

>All this about stealing pop from a machine - - why bother stealing that
>stuff? That stuff is bad for you. It's nothing but sugar and other goodies
>that disolve teeth and pennies. Wasn't there something a while ago about
>a can of coke being able to disolve a penny??

Saliva and stomach acids will dissolve a penny, too.
--
"Wow!  That was intense!"
"A repo man's always intense." - after car chase with (hispanic) brothers
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: amb@silver.lcs.mit.edu (Andrew M. Boardman)
Subject: Re: Need information on entry system
Organization: Quiche Eaters Anonymous
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 14:29:05 GMT

In article <1992Apr14.235054.54484@cc.usu.edu> slrf5@cc.usu.edu writes:
>1:	There are many Key type systems that have secured keys.  ASSA is one
>brand that is that way.  Keys can not be copied without an identification card
>give at the time of purchase.  Locksmiths who sell these types of systems are
>under contract not to copy keys without proper verification.  Our university
>has gone to this system in many buildings and it gives 'Total Key Control'. 
>there are no unauthorized keys and this system is unpickable.

Might I suggest a milling machine and a hunk of steel, or the ever-
popular piece of brickstrap?  (Now as for those (you know hwo you are)
who make Medeco biaxial keys from brickstrap...)

andrew
From: mccaugha@duncan.cs.utk.edu (William Douglas ( Doug ) - The Juggler ( me ) McCaughan)
Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
Subject: How 'bout them laws..
Date: 5 Apr 92 17:20:06 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, University of Tennesee, Knoxville
Distribution: world
Reply-To: mccaugha@duncan.cs.utk.edu (William Douglas ( Doug ) - The Juggler ( me ) McCaughan)
NNTP-Posting-Host: duncan.cs.utk.edu
Keywords: busted, oops, "but officer, I have never seen them before.."

So.. Are the laws about possession of "burglery tools" uniform around the
USA now? (if this newsgroup is reaching Europe and other places, what kind
of laws are you looking at?)

And what can those of us who have a genuine interest in learning about
locksmithing do? (but do not want to necessarily become a locksmith or
spend 3 years as an apprentice and $100/year for the license)

-- 
...doug <mccaugha@cs.utk.edu> USA    | The past 22 years have been a |
                                     | helluva trip, but honestly, I |
                                     | am ready to come down now...  |



Newsgroups: alt.locksmithing
From: dd908821@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (Douglas Deden)
Subject: Re: Sesame Padlocks
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 23:38:32 GMT
Reply-To: dd908821@longs.LANCE.ColoState.EDU (Douglas Deden)
Organization: Engineering College, Colorado State University

In article <1992Apr13.235238.11062@husc3.harvard.edu>,
bthomps@husc9.Harvard.EDU (Ben Thompson) writes:
> 
> 	I am the proud owner of a Sesame padlock (four dials,
> 0-9, set in the bottom of the lock body), the combination of
> which was forgotten years ago. I understand that the theory of
> opening one of these is to insert a piece of very thin sheet metal
> (pardon the kindergarten terminology) into the gap between a dial
> and its rectangular slot to feel for the flat spot on the inner
> wheel, which should tell me the number for that dial.
> 
> 	1) does anyone know of any other non-destructive methods?
> 
> 	2) where can I get good shim stock (if that's the right phrase).
> 
> ----
> 
> Ben Thompson




Well, my uncle handed me one that he had forgotten the combination to,
and I didn't have any tools or picks handy, so I just started with 0000
and worked forward.  The combination ended up being something around
4500, and it only took a few hours while watching television.  I'll be
the first to admit that it isn't a skillful (or efficient) method of
opening this type of padlock, but it works (and it's very non-destructive). 


---- Doug Deden ------ dd908821@longs.lance.ColoState.Edu ---------