Newsgroups: bit.listserv.gaynet
Date:         Sat, 25 Jul 1992 06:17:03 -0400
From:         gaynet@ATHENA.MIT.EDU
Subject:      GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 576

In this issue:
                   Doormats, prostitutes, & feminists
                        2 steps forward, 1 back
                          security clearances
                    GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 574
                            Lt. Tracy Thorne
                                Leaving
                          An Unfortunate End.

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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 92 18:15:14 EDT
From: Sarah Richardson <SRICH@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU>
Subject:      Doormats, prostitutes, & feminists

"Kevin S. Lowery Catonsville"  reacts to LOCKE's sig.:

>> "I myself have never been able to find out precisely what feminism is.  I
>> only know that people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that
>> differentiate me from a doormat, or a prostitute."   -Rebecca West, 1913

>Woah, chill out baby!  Nobody is callin' you a doormat or a prostitute!
>I am not saying that discrimination isn't out there, but this sig file
>has a hard edge that is rather uncomfortable.  Can we be a little more
>positive?

This sounds like you wish that feminists would be softer,
more comfy, more, um, ...cheery?  I almost expected
to see, "You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."

Here's a suggestion - next time you go to a movie
(read a book, watch a TV show, etc.),
REALLY try to identify with any of the women in it
and see how often you feel comfortable.  You might
begin to understand why feminists (who can also be
men) feel that a hard edge is often appropriate.

Sarah (who rewrote this to douse some flames.)

srich@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu

------------------------------

Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 92 17:35:04 EST
From: Graham Wolff Christian <GRAHAM%HARVARDA.BITNET@mitvma.mit.edu>
Subject:      2 steps forward, 1 back

Here follows a perhaps excessively lengthy contribution, excerpted without
permission from the Letters section of the Washington Post's Book World from
July 19,1992. The Post printed five letters, of which I will reproduce 3 entire
, most of the fourth, and a precis of the fifth.
1st)"I would like to commend The Washington Post Book World for its excellent
coverage of gay literature in its June 21 issue. The issue appeared on the same
day as Washington's Gay and Lesbian Pride Festival, and thus I was especially
pleased to see [writer lists three recent titles and praises their critical
treatment]."
                                                   JIM GRAHAM
                                                   Washington
An editor's note in italics says here: "Jim Graham is administrator of the
Whitman-Walker Clinic Inc."
2nd) "I cannot understand how you could run three favorable reviews of books
about homosexuals in featured positions in your Father's Day issue. Adding in
the other uncritical reviews of books by or about homosexuals that also ap-
peared in that issue, I can only assume you are not interested in serving the
interests of the 98 percent of us who are not homosexual. You should be ashamed
to promote homosexual behavior when it inevitably leads to AIDS, hepatitis, and
other diseases. Please cancel the book section delivery or I will cancel The
Post entirely."                                    ROLAND P. HIRSCH
                                                   Germantown
3rd)"I may not be able to define it, but surely now I have seen it, the quin-
tessence of cultural elitism: The first three reviews (_both_ cover pieces
_and_ the page two feature) devoted to works of "gay letters"--on Father's Day.
                                                   MICHAEL T. COLLINS
                                                   McLean
4th)"In reading the June 21 issue of Book World, it appears that you have gone
overboard to focus on homosexual authors, mixed-up women authors(Carol Matthau)
and a variety of individuals with personal problems. Certainly there are more
authors currently writing books with more appropriate themes than your focus
on homosexuality. It is almost as if your intent is to foster this disgusting
life-style. As you are basically in the "entertainment" field and so many of
the individuals there seem to be homosexuals, I can only attribute your choices
for inclusion in the Book World as personal.
    "If you consider the books presented in your most recent issue as the best
of American authorship, and the most presentable authors, then your whole view-
point on American writing must be totally skewed."
                                                   JOHN R. NIEMELA
                                                   Reston
5th)"In his review of Eric Marcus' *Making History*, James D. Woods writes
that "lesbians and gays are perhaps the only minority not raised by their own
people, whose parents do not share their minority status." I would suggest that
this obtains among members of the American deaf community as well..."
                                                   CEIL LUCAS
                                                   Arlington
After all my years in the trenches, I was dumbfounded by the implications of
this discourse. It occurred to me that the Post might have undone all the good
done by M.Nussbaum in her brilliant contribution to *The New Republic*; then
again, they may have printed the most nearly printable letters. One queer (we
presume--why did The Post volunteer his professional affiliation except to
"out" him?)speaking in self-defense;three men bursting with hatred;one (perhaps
) deaf woman saying, in effect, "Don't tell me about your oppression. I've got
my own oppression."
I have become accustomed, by now, to queer-bashing from Christians. I am at a
loss to understand why nos. 2,3,&4, who display no particular interest in
Biblically tinged homophobia, should care in the least about queers. I am
astonished that these gentlemen, who seem to read Book World with some atten-
tion, should not be able to understand that their contributions so closely
match (shocking) denunciations made, over the past two or three hundred years,
against women, people of color, immigrants, Jews, and the left-handed. Try,
just for a moment, dear friends, to substitute words like "Jew" or "Chinese"
or any more colorful substitute for "homosexual" in the pieces above--and
suddenly they seem sickeningly familiar. #4 explicitly (though unconsciously,
I would guess) brackets homosexuals and women. These writers seem wilfully ig-
norant (98%;"Father's Day," as thought there were no gay fathers, or dutiful
gay children, for that matter;I won't begin to address the grammatical sole-
cisms)--and yet they vote. Ms. Lucas's letter gives me no comfort either--it
promotes the image Republican Party spin doctors most love--the "left" as a
consortium of "special interests," fingers in ears, screaming, "NOT you! ME!"--
Bush saying, "There isn't enough for you all (and the military). We must choose
one or two and throw the rest on the fire."
Am I wrong?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 16:35:10 -0700
From: Jessea N. R. Greenman <jnrg@ocf.Berkeley.EDU>
Subject: security clearances

I suggest you contact Lambda Legal Defense and Education Fund in
New York City.  There is a case happening in Silicon Valley
(i.e. near San Jose,CA), with a lesbian challenging her denial
of a security clearance.  Last I recall hearing, and 'twas
a while back, the court said they would hear the case,which
was a victory of sorts since the company was fighting it.
I believe the case is being handled by a private attorney but
LLDEF should at least be tracking it.  LLDEF phone=212-995-8585.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 20:17:49 EDT
From: Tim Pierce <twpierce@cs.amherst.edu>
Subject: Re:  GayNet Digest Volume 5 Issue 574

"AAKL000@CATCC.bitnet  Kevin S. Lowery Catonsville"
<AAKL%CATCC.BITNET@mitvma.mit.edu> writes:

> > From: An Anonymous Sender
> >
> >                                             LOCKE
> >
> > "I myself have never been able to find out precisely what feminism is.  I
> > only know that people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that
> > differentiate me from a doormat, or a prostitute."   -Rebecca West, 1913
>
> Woah, chill out baby!  Nobody is callin' you a doormat or a prostitute!
> I am not saying that discrimination isn't out there, but this sig file
> has a hard edge that is rather uncomfortable.  Can we be a little more
> positive?

Hey, don't let it bother you, Kevin.  I mean, she's just a fish,
right?

-

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 20:48:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Nicholas Heer <heer@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Lt. Tracy Thorne
Mime-Version: 1.0

From: clarinews@clarinet.com (UPI)
Newsgroups:
 clari.news.military,clari.news.issues.civil_rights,clari.news.group.gays
Subject: Navy panel recommends honorable discharge for gay aviator
Keywords: navy, military, civil rights, social issues, gays,
	special interest
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 17:44:31 PDT
ACategory: usa
Slugword: navy-thorne
Priority: regular
Format: regular
ANPA: Wc: 386; Id: z6529; Sel: xxnmn; Adate: 7-24-845ped; Ver: 2/0
Codes: ynmnrxx., ynxhrxx., ynjgrxx., xxxxxxxx

	VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. (UPI) -- A three-member Navy board of inquiry
Friday recommended an honorable discharge for Lt. j.g. Tracy Thorne, who
told a national television audience three months ago he is a homosexual.
	The panel at Oceana Naval Air Station, which convened for two days,
reached a unanimous decision after deliberating two hours.
	Thorne, 25, a Norfolk-based bombardier-navigator, made an emotional
appeal to the board earlier, fighting tears as he asked the officers to
allow him to remain in the Navy.
	Instead, the board of inquiry determined he was violating the
Pentagon's policy against homosexuals in the military.
	Thorne said he was disappointed over the decision but believes he has
helped break down some stereotypes.
	``This policy just doesn't affect a handful of people,'' he said.
``It affects an enormous amount of people. Hopefully they'll realize
that gays and lesbians aren't these stereotypical monsters that they've
been made out to be through history.''
	The Pentagon policy has been in effect for 48 years, but Thorne was
hopeful the Navy brass will intervene before he is ousted.
	The board's recommendation will go up the chain of command to the
Bureau of Naval Personnel, and the Navy secretary could take a personal
look at the matter if he desires.
	``The secretary of the Navy has to let this cross his desk,'' Thorne
said. ``He has the power to retain me if he so chooses. And we hope that
he does.''
	If the panel's recommendation is upheld, Thorne plans to plead his
cause in the federal courts.
	His father, Roscoe Thorne, a Florida surgeon, also spoke to the
panel. He gave a sometimes rambling but highly emotional speech,
comparing the bias against against homosexuals to the racial prejudice
he witnessed while he was growing up in Mississippi.
	Thorne went public with his sexual orientation on ABC's ``Nightline''
and two other television network shows, and the Navy's case hinged on
videotapes of Thorne's television appearences.
	The Navy grounded Thorne following the broadcasts and began steps to
discharge him.
	His lawyers are trying to utilize a little-known clause that allows
the secretary of the Navy to retain a gay service member in certain
circumstances.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 14:08:09 EDT
From: dwoolwin@cc.gettysburg.edu
Subject: Leaving

One Saturday I will send in the official message to be unsubscribed until
I am able to resume subscription.
I have enjoyed, sometimes more than others, reading gaynet - I feel that I
have gotten to actually know the people on the - one gets some sense of
personality from what people write. It seems to be a diverse group, more
diverse in terms of age, for instance, than, at least, most gay male groups
with which I have been acqquainted. In some sense gaynet served as a g/l//b
community for me while I was here at Gettysburg (that is not to say that
there haven't been g/l/p people actually present at G-burg which have also
served as a community - although given the size and location of this place,
the actually g/l/b community on the ground has been small.
I hope to resume membership - I will, once settled, which may take some
weeks, try to resume through a modem in my apt. I have gotten some info and
costs on that. But I may not be able to....so...
Goodbye
David E. Woolwine                         717-337-6187
Sociology and Anthropology Department     dwoolwin@cc.gettysburg.edu
Gettysburg College
Gettysburg, PA 17325

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 25 Jul 92 00:00:36 EST
From: Mike.W.Miller.40@nd.edu
Subject: An Unfortunate End.

To all who are following the Great American Road Trip, Mark Hertzog has met
with an untimely demise in the form of me, his first axe murderer.  If you
were expecting him in the near future, you probably needn't leave the light
on as you wait.  However, I will be mailing small tokens of Mr. Hertzog to
all whose addresses he has in his little black book.

G'night all,
Mike!

------------------------------

End of GayNet Digest
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