HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 10:18:16 EST
From: <NAYLORD@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: Re: learning left and right
Distribution: rec

Terry Jones writes:
>the practice of learning with the right and then trying to learn with
>the left is satisfying if nothing else. until recently i would always
>feel a bit guilty about doing this, but now i feel there is often
>justification for it.

>some tricks have a very distinctive feel or rhythm or pattern. or they
>take a lot of experimenting before you try the right combination of
>actions, frame of mind, posture etc and they begin to click. it takes
>time to do this - especially if you are working on something difficult
>alone. i think there is a reasonable argument to be made in favour of
>learning some tricks with one hand and then working on the other. once
  { some very good examples deleted }

 Terry, you have discovered a well accepted principle of
 motor learning. It's called Transfer of Learning. Simply put
 it means that a motor skill is transferred from limb to limb
 even though only one limb has been actively involved in practise.
 Academics have found that there is even some transfer from to
 different limbs eg. you can write with your foot better because
 you already have the skill with one hand. There are tons of
 experiments in this area, and Transfer of Learning is a well
 established and accepted principle of motor learning. I
 discussed it briefly in a JW article a while back, but your
 examples are much better than mine.

>of course nothing can ever be proved about which method is better,
>(faster, results in better technique) or for what tricks or for who.

On the contrary, there is lots of evidence. I can point you
to some scientific reports on Transfer of Learning if
you are interested or sceptical.

  David Naylor
  naylord@qucdn.queensu.ca
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: perry@sys6626.bison.mb.ca (perry)
Subject: Las Vegas, Benny Rheel Workshop
Organization: System 6626 BBS, Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 92 08:44:06 CST
Comments: CHAIRMAN IJA

I am informed from the Las Vegas mini Festival, Jan. 1993 that there are 
only 3 people registered for the Benny Rheel Workshop.  Minimum number 
required to hold this workshop is 10 participants.  If you are interested 
in attending it, please read about it in JW and call immediatedly Benny 
Reehl at 207 582-3730 to register.
Perry Rubenfeld
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: jleonard@jarthur.claremont.edu (Jon H. Leonard)
Subject: Re: Challenge to Everyone (physics)
Organization: Harvey Mudd College, Claremont, CA 91711
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 00:04:28 GMT

In article <1egrctINNlh2@agate.berkeley.edu> jboyce@physics.berkeley.edu writes:
[deleted]
[on the topic of making juggling easier]
>I thought about it for a while and came up with the following
>possibilities (I haven't really considered practicality yet):
>
>   1.  Juggling underwater (constant bouyancy force).  Adjust the
>       ball density to achieve different effective gravities.  The
>       problem here is comfort, as well as drag due to viscosity
>       (which needs to be substantially less than the force of gravity)
[deleted]
>Jack
>jboyce@physics.berkeley.edu
>

I tried this for the first time last Friday.  I had some of the crystal balls
from the Klutz catalog, and I wondered what it would be like to juggle them
underwater.  It's a really neat way to juggle, both because the balls have more
interesting optical properties underwater, and because the pattern is slowed
down significantly.  I highly recommend trying it.

However, it doesn't correspond very well to a uniformly slowed down juggling
pattern, for a few reasons.  Probably the biggest change is that the viscosity
of the water is very significant, so that the throws need to be changed
substantially.  Also, motion of the water, either set up by the juggler's arms
or independent, can have suprising effects on the juggled objects.  The other
thing that I noticed was that the balls getting close to the surface disrupted
visibility and warped the paths as well.  (I was looking down into the water.
I tried juggling them while I was completely underwater, but without goggles
it was a hopeless endeavor.)

I'm not sure whether to recommend underwater juggling as a learning exercise or
not.  On the one hand, I wasn't able to juggle three above water after trying
this for several practice attempts (I can normally juggle five without trouble)
because my refexes were all wrong.  However, some other people who aren't very
good jugglers who tried it were able to juggle for a fairly long time this way.

A warning:  The crystal balls scratch easily:  don't do this unless you are
willing to have them significantly more scratched than they were before.
Also be prepared to retrieve nearly invisible objects from the bottom of the
pool (or wherever).

Jon
-- 
Jon Leonard		jleonard@jarthur.claremont.edu

I'm not an actor, I just play one on TV.
Pay no attention to the microprocessor behind the curtain.
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: garys@iscp.bellcore.com (Gary Seubert)
Subject: Re: Dynamics of Juggling
Organization: Bellcore
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 15:54:57 GMT

In article <1992Nov18.005450.4150@serval.net.wsu.edu>, efrie@luke.eecs.wsu.edu writes:
|>  ... stuff deleted ...
|> 
|> 	I guess if ceilings weren't so low there would be
|> 	more numbers jugglers out there :^}. 
|> 
|> -Eddie Frie WSU Juggling Club

That's exactly why I practice numbers in my garage!

yraG
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: goater@fraser.sfu.ca (Rosemary Lyn Goater)
Subject: Unicycling in Canada, eh?
Keywords: unicycles canada beer eskimos
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 20:55:08 GMT

Hi.  I'd like to learn to ride a unicycle, but I'm having one helluva
time finding a distributor for them here in Canada.  I live in
Vancouver, and the only one available is a real cheap-quality Norco.

I think I may be able to get a Miyata via mail-order from California
for around US$135 (plus an arm and a leg for UPS to Canada).  I think
it's a 24" wheel.  Does anyone have anything good to say about a
Miyata unicycle?  Or, better yet, can any suggest a better source for
me?

Much appreciated.

- Darren

Oh, as an aside, (without opening up a can of worms) is it typical for
people to learn on a 20" or 24" unicycle?  I just wanna sort of goof
around on the thing.  I'm 5'11", 175lbs, and my BIcycle skills are
good (I race).  Thanx.

Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: ecarsten@next1.cs.umr.edu (Edward Carstens)
Subject: Re: The Juggling Capital (according to Juggler's World)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 18:43:40 GMT
Organization: University of Missouri-Rolla, Missouri's Technological University


You know, Bill Giduz asked if anyone knew for sure if Juggling Capitol was the  
only juggling store in the U.S. and nobody answered him (at least publicly)!   
You guys should have brought this up BEFORE he wrote the article.. not AFTER.

-Ed Carstens
Creator of JugglePro
From: yking@cs.ubc.ca (Yossarian Yggy King)
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: Re: Music
Date: 19 Nov 1992 13:35:09 -0800
Organization: Computer Science, University of B.C., Vancouver, B.C., Canada
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacific.cs.ubc.ca


Call me perverse, but I've always enjoyed juggling to Alice Cooper's
"Welcome to My Nightmare." It's got several different moods and tempos
to it (and for demented personal reasons, I just like the song).  I've
never used it in a show, but I've thought it would be a neat piece in
the dark with glow-in-the-dark balls and a glowing skeleton outfit.
	And maybe the song describes juggling? ...

		We sweat and laugh and scream here
		'Cause life is just a dream here
		You know inside you feel
			right at home

		You're welcome to my nightmare
-- 
Yggy King       | Thinking the world should entertain you leads to boredom
UBC Comp Sci    | and sloth. Thinking you should entertain the world leads
B.C., Vancouver | to bright clothes, odd graffiti and amazing grace in
Canada          | running for the bus.    -- Ann Herbert
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: marko@IMD.Sterling.COM (Mark Olson)
Subject: Re: Music
Organization: Sterling Software, IMD
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 20:29:00 GMT
X-Md4-Signature: f6ba8081a7475c6794011678e90bfb4a

In article <19NOV199213593622@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov> femanrs@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (BRUCE MANNERS) writes:
>With all of the discussion about M. Menes and the Gizmo Guys use of the 
>Root Beer Rag by Billy Joel going on, What other songs do you folks 
>recommend using to juggle to in a show?
>
>If you identify a song that you feel may be more appropriate to a specific 
>prop then please identify it.  Also try to name the artist.
>
>Well folks, what songs do you think are good for juggling?

Show tunes, you know, from Broadway, provide some excellent juggling music.
Especially tunes from musicals that have a lot of dancing in them, also some
music from Hollywood's golden age is good. Music from the Wizard of Oz, 'If I
only had a brain' provides lots of interesting rythyms and segues. 
'Tea for Two' also provides some great moments for using bounce juggling to 
fill-in the rythym.
-- 
Mark Olson  || marko@IMD.Sterling.COM -or- uunet!sparky!marko
From: tka2@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (TOMER AMIT)
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: I need help with juggling 4 or more
Date: 18 Nov 92 16:39:12 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

Hi, how is everybody doing?  I have a problem.  I recently (three weeks ago)
learned to juggle.  My teacher was a guy in my hall who is a decent juggler.
When I first came here (Lehigh U.) I couldn't juggle one ball.  Now, I have
mastered three and I can do a few tricks (like juggling against the wall,
behind my back, from the floor, on my foot, from the knee; nothing
complicated).  I have made a vow to the guy that taught me how to juggle to
surpass him by the end of the semester.  He laughed, he laughed hard and for a
long time.  Since he can't juggle more then three I thought it would be a
great idea for me to learn how, and then show him and the rest of my hall who
laughed at me while I practiced every weekday at midnight.  Unfortunately, I
don't know how.  I hold two balls in my right hand, two in my left, and just
sit there and stare at them, not having any idea what to do.  I would really
appreciate if one of you could e-mail to me directions on how to juggle four
and maybe give some knew ideas for tricks wiht three.  I promise I will keep you informed
informed of my progress (If you care).

-Tom

p.s. sorry about the grammar
From: fenthe@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: music?
Date: 18 Nov 92 23:43:08 GMT
Organization: Carnegie Mellon Computer Club


 Does anyone know what the music that's used on the routines by Michael Menes
on the '89 video (the ball section of his routine, that is, rather than the
rings bit), and the Gizmo Guys on the '88 video, is? It's some short
piece for the piano, and it seems /ideal/ for juggling to.. <grin>

 Thanks.
-- 
Daniel Mitchell = Fenthe Marten = fenthe@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu =
m91djm@ecs.ox.ac.uk = dmitchell@cix.compulink.co.uk = bi furry juggler
Snailmail: 18, High St // Earls Colne // Essex CO6 2PA // ENGLAND
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: miguel@aclcb.purdue.edu (PHILLIP_SANMIGUEL)
Subject: Re: The Juggling Capital (according to Juggler's World)
Reply-To: miguel@aclcb.purdue.edu
Organization: Purdue University AIDS Center
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 15:15:44 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.005105.1425@wam.umd.edu>, mmeltzer@wam.umd.edu writes:
>
>Even "Juggler's World" calls it the only juggling store in the nation.
>Are the others that you folks mentioned strictly juggling stores?
>

  Two Ply Press mentions the Juggling Capitol as opening in New York.  Is 
this a new store?  I know Neil's store is in D.C. because I've been there.
If Two Ply Press can be wrong then so can Juggler's World.


                                    _            _
__________________________  _      (_)  ________(_)________________________
Phillip SanMiguel        _/  \     /  \  Purdue University Juggling Club
miguel@aclcb.purdue.edu (_)   \   /    |   *Juggling*Unicycling*COMBAT*
         _               |      x    _ | 1001 Stewart Center, Box 665
________(_)______________ \_ _ / \ _(_) _West_Lafayette,_Indiana__47907-1001   
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: gavind@cortex.physiol.su.oz.au (Gavin Dixon)
Subject: Re: Juggling store misconception
Organization: Department of Physiology, University of Sydney, NSW, Australia
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 22:40:14 GMT

In <9211131914.AA05783@mace.Princeton.EDU> "Allen Knutson" <aknaton@math.Princeton.EDU> writes:
>Brian Dube's in New York City. Also a pleasant place to visit, though the
>help there aren't always that knowledgeable about the products.

I too recommend a visit to Brian Dube's studio. The address is 3rd Floor,
520 Broadway (in SoHo, about two blocks down from Housten). Needless to say,
he has his complete range of clubs on display plus stage balls and silicone
balls (in safe :-)). Brian is usually there himself. I have tried talking
him into getting an email address but he is still not totally convinced of
its benefits. Just mention that Todd has an account :-} BTW, the new Dube
catalogue is now out. 

Gavin


Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: gcohen@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Gregory Cohen)
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: IJA Questions
Date: 21 Nov 92 22:08:34 GMT
Distribution: World
Organization: Florida State University

Dear Perry,
	I'm glad that a member of the IJA BOD is on internet.  Perhaps you can give us some stat's that were left hanging at nationals. (i.e.. questions of mine that no-one could answer)
 
1. Has the life member fund been repaid?  if not what plans are there to do so?
 
2. Has a separate life member fund been established?
 
3. Are we still losing $6 per IJA member (is this figure correct? its been a while) .  When I was told how the IJA intended to recoup this loss, it was by getting more members?  Is the loss liner per member or if we get more will the loss be reversed?  How many new members do we need to attain a profit margin again?
 
4. How much was made by Nationals in Montreal? (both gross and net)
 
5. What are the bottom line assets of the IJA currently?
 
6. Has the constitution been amended to reflect the reduction of the board members? and was it amended before the elections this summer?  if not does the smaller member board legally have the power to a) exist? or b) amend the constitution?
 
 
-GReg Cohen
gcohen@mailer.acns.fsu.edu
 
 
 
P.S. Can you upload to me the minutes of the last few BOD meetings?
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: tayer@Athena.MIT.EDU
Subject: (none)
Organization: Computer Science, Indiana University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 12:10:44 EST

I echo the statement that site-swap doesn't say everything about
juggling.  I don't think it's necessary at all to throw showered
throws a specific height, or any throws for that matter, unless
there's a good reason.  I can do a very comfortable four-ball shower
at head level, and my five-ball shower can have different heights,
depending on the day or my preference.  It should never be confining.

Also, to the person who asked last week if anyone could do the
seven-ball version of the five-ball throw-one-high-catch-the-
others-and-start-up-again trick, the answer is yes.  I did it this
morning.  And thank you--it was worth it.

Toby

           *
         *          "I'll not be juggled with."
            *                    -Hamlet, 4:5
         * O  *
        *_/|\_*     "O me!  You juggler!  You canker-blossom!"
           |                     -Midsummer-Night's Dream, 3:2
          / \
                    "...and be these juggling fiends no more believed..."
                                 -MacBeth, 5:8
From: weissman@pianoforte.esd.sgi.com (Terry Weissman)
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: Re: music?
Date: 19 Nov 92 01:52:01 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA


In article <1992Nov18.184309.2601@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu>, fenthe@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:
> 
>  Does anyone know what the music that's used on the routines by Michael Menes
> on the '89 video (the ball section of his routine, that is, rather than the
> rings bit), and the Gizmo Guys on the '88 video, is? It's some short
> piece for the piano, and it seems /ideal/ for juggling to.. <grin>

It's Root Beer Rag, by Billy Joel.

- Terry 		weissman@sgi.com
From: bunson@corona.uoregon.edu (Paul E. Bunson)
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: Re: Challenge to Everyone (physics)
Followup-To: rec.juggling
Date: 20 Nov 1992 00:59:21 GMT
Organization: MSI- University of Oregon
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: teatime.uoregon.edu

In article <1egrctINNlh2@agate.berkeley.edu>, jboyce@physics.berkeley.edu
wrote:

> 
> Ideally, one would want some kind of a situation where you could juggle
> as you do normally, but with a controllable "gravity".  You could start
> with a very small gravity (say moon-equivalent) where presumably things
> would be easy to do, and then slowly increase g until you're on your own.
> I don't have any hard evidence, but it seems intuitively that this would
> make the learning process easier, faster, and less error-prone.
> 
> My challenge to all you physics/engineering-minded jugglers out there is
> to conceive of some method of doing this.  Essentially you want to
> exert an (approximately) constant upward force on all the objects (call
> them balls for now) throughout their paths.  A constant force effectively
> decreases g.  This should of course be done in such a manner that
> doesn't interfere with the juggling.

> Jack
> jboyce@physics.berkeley.edu

Someone once suggested to me that virtual reality is the way to go.  I
don't really know much about virtual reality but I understand that it would
not be much different than a video game, except that you would actually
move your hands as if you were juggling.  It would be a lot like a flight
simulator except that it would be a juggling simulator.  You could even
have gravity go up or to the side or whatever.  It was actually a juggler
from Berkeley that suggested this to me, but I don't remember his name.

Paul
bunson@corona.uoregon.edu
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: perry@sys6626.bison.mb.ca (perry)
Subject: New IJA Secretary/Treasurer
Organization: System 6626 BBS, Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 92 22:34:37 CST
Comments: useless sack of protoplasm

This is a first try at posting something on the network.  Although I get 
lots of mail directly, and read the daily articles (responding to some 
that I feel qualified to answer), I have never posted.  Hope it works.

Be advised that the new Secretary/Treasurer of the IJA is Richard Dingman 
effective IMMEDIATELY!!

Box 3707 Akron NO LONGER EXISTS.  An

Any inquiries should be sent to Richard Dingman at P.O Box 218 Montague 
Massachusetts  01351.  Phone (413) 367-9398 during regular business 
hours.

I guess if this message gets through, I'll read it tomorrow.  If 
not..............

If anyone wants to write to me direct, my E-Mail address is:
perry@sys6626.bison.mb.ca.

My snail address is 474 Enniskillen Ave. Winnipeg, Manitoba, R2V 0J4 
CANADA   ph. (204) 586-5785 CST.  (call after 6:00)
Fax (204) 586-0490

I welcome comments, suggestions from all on the IJA goings on, but 
beware, every complaint should come with a solution that you are prepared 
to help impliment.

On a personnal note, I want to thank the numerous people who have 
offerred to help me post things and give me help as I delve into the 
world of E-Mail.  "To meekly go where no Chairman of the Board" has gone 
before"!

Perry Rubenfeld
Chairman of the Board of Directors of the IJA
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 13:41:16 EST
From: <NAYLORD@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: Re: Challenge to Everyone (physics)
Distribution: world

jboyce@physics.berkeley.edu writes:

>  1.  Juggling underwater (constant bouyancy force).  Adjust the
>      ball density to achieve different effective gravities.  The
>      problem here is comfort, as well as drag due to viscosity
>      (which needs to be substantially less than the force of gravity)
>
>  2.  Juggling lighter-than-air balls.  Viscous drag kills this.

Some interesting ideas Jack. I have one minor correction to
the above comments. I know I'm being picky here but what the
heck, if we're going to talk physics...  The reason the above
ideas fail is not because of viscous drag. Viscosity plays a
very minor role in drag over non-slender (bluff)
 bodies, except at extremely
low fluid velocities (so-called Stoke's flow). PRESSURE drag
resulting from the separated flow and turbulent wake is the
source of the problem - and pressure drag is proportional to the
DENSITY of the fluid. If only juggling props were more aerodymanic!

I wish I had something to add rather than just pick at
someone else's posting, but I don't.

  David Naylor,  Queen's Juggler
  Kingston, Ontario, Canada
  naylord@qucdn.queensu.ca
Organization: Queen's University at Kingston
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 11:21:25 EST
From: <NAYLORD@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: Re: New IJA Secretary/Treasurer

Welcome to rec.juggling Perry!

A short question: When is the next IJA roster coming
out? For me this is one of the most important benefits
of being an IJA member - access to the juggling community.
Plus the last one came out the week BEFORE I moved, so nobody
can find me from the old roster.

  David Naylor,  Queen's Juggler
  Kingston, Ontario, Canada
  naylord@qucdn.queensu.ca
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: ben@crash.cts.com (Ben Decker)
Subject: Re: busking
Organization: CTS Network Services (crash, ctsnet), El Cajon, CA
Date: 16 Nov 92 16:51:03 GMT

I forgot to answer one more thing... Can you make a good living?

Yes, but it depends on the location you choose, the demographics of your 
audience and, MOST IMPORTANTLY, how entertaining your show is. I haven't 
worked the streets in about 2 years (strictly stage now) but I'm living
in our house that we affectionately refer to as "the house that street
performing built."  :)

One more thing... If you can do it, it is better to open up a new place than
to try and go where there are already too many performers. It's a simple
"supply and demand" thing. It's better to be tops in a new place than
to be constantly compared to the better acts when you are starting out. Also
, audiences only have so much fun money to drop in a hat. Less competition means
it is easier for you to pay your bills. :)

				-Ben

Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: miguel@aclcb.purdue.edu (PHILLIP_SANMIGUEL)
Subject: Re: Xjuggle ftp?
Reply-To: miguel@aclcb.purdue.edu
Organization: Purdue University AIDS Center
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 17:33:46 GMT

Hey everybody,

  The juggling list archives are at

	moocow.cogsci.indiana.edu


                                    _            _
__________________________  _      (_)  ________(_)________________________
Phillip SanMiguel        _/  \     /  \  Purdue University Juggling Club
miguel@aclcb.purdue.edu (_)   \   /    |   *Juggling*Unicycling*COMBAT*
         _               |      x    _ | 1001 Stewart Center, Box 665
________(_)______________ \_ _ / \ _(_) _West_Lafayette,_Indiana__47907-1001   
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
From: greg@athena.cs.uga.edu (Greg Whitlock)
Subject: juggling record
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 22:32:37 GMT

A friend of mine heard rumor that someone juggled 10 balls a few
months back.  Since I've only recently started reading this group
I don't know if that is true.  Can anyone confirm? 

Thanks.

--greg
From: el24+@andrew.cmu.edu (Edward Liu)
Newsgroups: rec.juggling
Subject: test test test
Date: 23 Nov 92 16:19:08 GMT
Organization: Masters student, Information Networking Institute, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

This is a test

\014
Like I said, this is a test!

-- Ed
Edward C. Liu		|   " 'Ed, are you hallucinating?'
el24+@andrew.cmu.edu	|     'Huh?  Oh.  Yeah, but not right now."
(E-L, not E-One)	|	-- _Northern Exposure_, Nov 9 1992