HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: "Michael Smith" <p00004@psilink.com>
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcountry
Organization: Performance Systems Int'l
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 19:50:19 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink (3.2)

>DATE:   Wed, 7 Oct 92 08:19:17 GMT
>FROM:   Joanne Spetz <jojo@leland.Stanford.EDU>

>My SO and I have heard the same advice for contraband encounters...since
>I'm from CA and he's from HI, the item of concern is marijuana.

Matter of curiosity: Have you and/or SO ever actually had anything like 
a run-in with contraband growers? If so, what happened?

--Michael Smith
From: Dan Yurman <dyurman@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Date: 13 Oct 92 19:30 PDT
Subject: Re: Bears attacking people?
Nf-ID: #R:1992Oct13.195039.25383@afterlife:770071279:cdp:1449600042:000:1266
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!dyurman    Oct 13 19:30:00 1992


The incident involving a bear killing a hiker took place in
Glacier National Park, which is hundreds of miles north of 
Yellowstone.  The female bear and her two cubs were surprised
by the hiker.  They attacked the man, age mid-40s, killed him,
and reportedly ate some of his remains.  Rangers are now hunting
for the bears and are expected to kill them on site because
they now regard people as food.  These are the basic details.

A reversal of that incident took place in Grand Teton National 
Park the same week.  GTNP is south of Yellowstone.  A hunter
was attacked by a brown bear and killed it as the bear charged.
This actually took place on the border to the park and not
inside it.  The hunger is being charged by Federal and State
game officials for killing the bear illegally.  

AGAIN - NO BEARS HAVE KILLED ANYONE SO FAR THIS SEASON IN 
YELLOWSTONE.  

Wear your bear bells, travel in groups, pack your food up 
high, and don't hike in clothes your wore when you gutted
fish or cleaned game.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Yurman            | dyurman@igc.apc.org | Chance favors only
PO Box 1569           | MCI Mail: 364-1277  | the prepared mind.
Idaho Falls, ID 83403 | 43N28 112W02 -7 GMT | -- Louis Pasteur
From: egedi@ahwenasa.cis.upenn.edu (Dania M. Egedi)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcou
Date: 15 Oct 92 18:49:43 GMT

In article <Oct15.162131.72089@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>, trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna) writes:
|> In article <15004@auspex-gw.auspex.com> johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:
|> >
|> >OK, OK, I give up.  So it wasn't Sandanista's.  I don't recall exactly what
|> >this group of people were other than they were some organized guerilla group
|> >with lots of guns and didn't particularly care for a group of people in
|> >kayaks floating through their "territory".
|> 
|> The Shining Path.
|> 
|> >It's been a few years since
|> >I've read "Running the Amazon".  Yes, it was by Kane, who incidently prior
|> >to this trip, was a San Franciscan journalist and had no kayaking experience.
|> 
|> He also said in a lecture I attended, that he didn't care to ever see a kayak
|> or whitewater again.
|> -- 


He also did a hachet job on my friend Francois, who organized the trip.
Personal dynamics, I suppose, but it does serve to remind one that whoever writes
the history wins.....

 - Dania
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dania Egedi, IRCS Research Programmer		egedi@ahwenasa.cis.upenn.edu
Room 400C, 3401 Walnut St.			work:  (215) 898-0365
Philadelphia, PA 19104

"One sign of an impending nervous breakdown is the belief 
that one's work is terribly important"
From: hansont@druhi.ATT.COM (HansonTC)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Teva Like Sandals: Alps(?) More Info Plz
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:27:44 GMT
Reply-To: hansont@druhi.ATT.COM (HansonTC)
Organization: AT&T, Denver, CO

A few months ago there was a great flame war about Teva's
and another brand came up with strong loyalty--- could
someone send me some more info as to design, cost,
and manufacturer----

many thanks,
-tom hanson
ATT Denver

hansont@druhi.att.com
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: frankenp@argon.gas.uug.arizona.edu (Paul Frankenstein  )
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Backcountry in the Movies
Date: 15 Oct 92 23:09:35 GMT
Organization: x=(x^2)+C

What about K2?

paul




--
frankenp@gas.uug.arizona.edu
paulf@hacks.arizona.edu
"Bagels are great for backpacking."
	-- Mike Cottingham
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: racg8670@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Becca )
Subject: Re: Neophyte tent groundsheet question
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 15:48:13 GMT

I suggest a space blanket (if you have a 2 person tent)...

it is very light...

it is waterproof....

it is very durable...

it folds wonderfully small and fits in your backpack...

it serves as an emergency blanket too...

and you can get one just about the perfect size for a small tent for only
$5...

we used all sorts of ground cloths this summer while packing near the
seattle area and found this was the best...
From: diverson@phys.ksu.edu (David Iverson)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcou
Date: 11 Oct 1992 04:06:27 GMT
Organization: Kansas State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: bohr.phys.ksu.edu

In <14900@auspex-gw.auspex.com> johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:


>O.K. we've got marijuana growers in California and bootleggers in Kentucky
>so far.  Let me add another data point.

>17k' to the mouth at ocean.  During the trip they came across some sections
>that had never been charted that had some incredible rapids.  At one point
>their journey led them to a sandbar where their camp was broken by gunshots
>over their heads.  They were in the heart of sandanistan guerrilla territory
>and their coca fields.  They were captured but managed to negotiate their
>escape by giving up three six packs of beer.  I've never been in a kayak
>in my life but thoroughly enjoy this book.  

>-- 
>+==========================================================================+
>| John Fereira     | Auspex Systems | "Auspex does not share my opinions.  |
>| johnf@auspex.com | Santa Clara CA |  So Why am I still working here?"    |
>+==========================================================================+

SANDANISTA'S ON THE AMAZON!  This seems really, really odd.  Is this what
the book said or are you labeling misc. guerrilla's as Sandinistas.  Why
would Niceraguan Freedom Fighters be growing Coca almost 1000 miles from
their nation?  What country was this in anyway?  Please flame me if I'm
wrong, but I think the reference to Sandanistas as drug pushers is way off
base and driven by U.S. government dis-information (with sinister intent).

Excuse me, I know this isn't related to rec.backcountry, but it really
pissed me off.

-David Iverson

--
diverson@phys.ksu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU (wayne trzyna)
Subject: Re: Backcountry in the Movies
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 20:28:41 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Computer Science Department

In article <1992Oct15.153321.11591@ncar.ucar.edu> ilana@kiowa.scd.ucar.edu (Ilana Stern) writes:
>
>"At Play in the Fields of the Lord" also has spectacular scenery
>and a backcountry/cultural theme.  We rented it;  I'm not surprised
>it didn't do well in theaters as it was long, depressing, and slammed
>missionary Christianity.  (On the other hand, you get to see a lot
>of naked bodies.)

That brings to mind another one, involving missionary christianity.
I think it was called "Black Robe" or something.  Probably a more
realistic interpretation of both indian culture and early white
settlement than "Dances with Wolves".  BR does an excellent job
of portraying the harshness of nature.

-- 

-Wayne Trzyna
 trzyna@CS.ColoState.EDU
From: scott@hpcvccl.cv.hp.com (Scott Linn)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Animals (summary)
Date: 9 Oct 92 18:37:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: hpcvca.1992Oct9.183703.24907
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA

eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya) writes:
: SO far we have readers who would be (Hey!  One life at a time, please):
: 
: NA ground mammals
: 	Ring Tailed Lemur

The Ring Tailed Lemur is a resident of Madagascar, not North America.

--

Scott Linn
scott@hpcvccl.cv.hp.com
From: barb@golfcart.Corp.Sun.COM (Barbara Hunt)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: FT. Bragg, CA day hikes
Date: 13 Oct 1992 23:40:15 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: ca
Reply-To: barb@golfcart.Corp.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: golfcart.corp.sun.com

I'm going to the Ft. Bragg area the first part of November.  
Can anyone recommend any really good day hikes (max. 10-15 miles,  
1500' elev. gain).

Thanks,
Barbara
From: wegeng.henr801c@xerox.com
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Backcountry in the Movies
Date: 15 Oct 92 11:54:17 GMT
Organization: Xerox
Originator: wegeng@ogre

My favorite is Black Robe.

/Don
wegeng.henr801c@xerox.com
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: miles@ms.uky.edu (Stephen D. Grant)
Subject: Re: Encountering contraband in the backcou
    <1992Oct7.154950.1479@spectrum.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 04:09:52 GMT
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences

damouth@wrc.xerox.com (David E. Damouth) writes:

> have been killed by marijuana growers
>>in remote parts of California.  

>That same kind of story is told about the Kentucky hills, only replacing
>marijuana growers with bootlet whiskey distillers.  One friend of mine
>David E. Damouth


Get with the times Dave. Now Kentucky is rated 3rd in the nation in marijuana 
production. It used to be stills. Now its pot fields and stills. And believe
me, it is quite common to find plots booby-traped and/or guarded. I think
Ky. also had the most "successful" erradication program in the country. They
never get it all though, do they? I could'nt think of a better way to spend
our tax dollars than by flying around weekend worriors in helicopters to search
out and destroy that evil marijuana.                                 


Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: bblohm@boi.hp.com (Bill Blohm)
Subject: Re: Are gaz (butane) cartridges available in Chile?
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 17:48:45 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard / Boise, Idaho
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]

You might want to look into the Whisperlite series (MSR?).  I was given an
old beat up one and cleaned it up.  Once I got the replacement extra parts
that make up the full stove, it burns practically anything: gas, diesel, 
fuel oil, etc..

Bill Blohm     

*******************************************************************************
Standard disclaimers apply, even if nobody ever listens to me.
*******************************************************************************

bblohm@hpbs1686.boi.hp.com     \\
mage@hpbs202.boi.hp.com         =======\  You pays your money, takes your pick.
bill@hpbs202.boi.hp.com         =======/  They all reach me, or soon or late.
bill_blohm@hp4600.desk.hp.com  //
From: donehoo@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Doyle Donehoo)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Neophyte tent groundsheet question
Date: 8 Oct 92 22:06:11 GMT
Organization: Olivetti ATC; Cupertino CA, USA

In article <1992Oct7.154315.1343@spectrum.xerox.com> damouth@wrc.xerox.com writes:
>
>This reasoning for the outside cloth completely escapes me.  Instead of
>packing a tent with the outside of the floor damp, you instead pack a
>dry tent and a wet piece of plastic.  The damp plastic plus the dry
>tent has got to weigh more (and be bulkier, and take longer to pack)
>than simply packing the tent with a damp bottom.
>As we've discovered in previous exchanges, the inside vs. outside
>groundcloth issue is a religious war, with more emotion and dogma than
>data and reason in some of the postings.
>David E. Damouth


Mystery to me too. I use a Tadpole and a Footprint. In the morning I
take off the rainfly (usually THE most wet item) to dry, flip the
tent over, and let the Footprint dry, if needed. The tent bottom has
shown me it will keep out water, so the Footprint is mainly to save
the tent bottom, which can take a beating. (I have waterproofed small
pinhole punctures from rough ground.) The Footpring is extremely light,
as are the groundcloths for my other tents: weight is not an issue. With
the groundcloths for the other tents, I never worry about exact fit
or tucking under because the bottoms of all my tents are waterproof.
I want to keep them that way by using the groundcloth. Simple.
Very few times have I packed a damp tent, and if there is any
additional weight, I cannot feel it. Usually it is out within 6 hours
or so, and airing out.

My advice: do what ever works for you.

+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| "Bully! Bully!" - T. Roosevelt with John Muir at Glacier Point       |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| "The mountains are calling me, and I must go."   John Muir           |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
"Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace will flow
into you as sunshone flows into trees. The winds will blow their own
freshness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop off
like autumn leaves."    JOHN MUIR

"I only went out for a walk, but resolved to stay till sunset, for going
out, I found, was really going in."  John Muir
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: sherod@newton.Colorado.EDU (Scott Herod)
Subject: Re: Bears attacking people?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 19:32:22 GMT

If I recall correctly there have only been 5 (maybe 7) deaths 
attributed to bears in Yellowstone in the last 100 years.

The last was north of fishing bridge and east of the river in
the Summer of 1984 (Pelican Lake ?).

Scott
From: psilsbee@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Peter Silsbee)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: City Skygazing (was Re: An Insight)
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:45:54 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <25762@oasys.dt.navy.mil> oreagan@oasys.dt.navy.mil (William Oreagan) writes:
>I felt a bit suspicious looking though, standing in front of my house
>at night with my binoculars.
>Bill O

This reminds me of a time I was standing on my back porch, watching
a full, orange-red moon rising. I had to stoop a little to get my line-
of-sight under a tree branch, and I was shading my eyes from a medium-
bright light in a neighboring yard. My trance was broken by a belligerent
voice from a few yards (that's yards as in lawns with fences, not 36 inches)
away: "What the F*K are you looking at? Mind your own business!" I've always
wondered what he was doing out there that he was so paranoid about.

--Peter
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: wegeng.henr801c@xerox.com
Subject: Re: Raccoon question
Originator: wegeng@ogre
Organization: Xerox
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 18:27:23 GMT

Racoon rabies is also on the increase here in Western NY.  I can
probably provide references if there is interest.

/Don
wegeng.henr801c@xerox.com
From: psilsbee@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Peter Silsbee)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Fear and Social Conditioning
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:20:27 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

In article <1992Oct01.124526.8112@brtph560.bnr.ca> jbl@mesaadm.cre.nt.com (JB) writes:
>The question: If your significant other (female) were to trek alone or in
>an all female group, what would be your degree of concern for her safety?
> I'm talking primarily about the threat of danger from other humans.
>JB

Depends where the trek was. Most backcountry areas that I've been, my
degree of concern would be far less than if she were to take the trek
a few blocks southeast of our house, at night. It would, however, be
non-zero.

--Peter

Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: ilana@kiowa.scd.ucar.edu (Ilana Stern)
Subject: Re: Backcountry in the Movies
Organization: NCAR/UCAR
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 15:33:21 GMT

We just saw "Last of the Mohicans" which was filmed in North Carolina.
I'd really like to know where!  Beautiful cliffs, waterfalls, forests.
It even impressed my (Colorado Native) husband, who claims there's no
worthwhile backcountry east of Boulder.

"At Play in the Fields of the Lord" also has spectacular scenery
and a backcountry/cultural theme.  We rented it;  I'm not surprised
it didn't do well in theaters as it was long, depressing, and slammed
missionary Christianity.  (On the other hand, you get to see a lot
of naked bodies.)

-- 
/\     It's not denial.  I'm just very selective about the reality I accept.
  \_][ <--NCAR Ilana Stern dod#009 r.b. cliff swallow ilana@ncar.ucar.edu    
      \______________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: eric@quantum.on.ca (Eric Johnson)
Subject: Re: Bears attacking people?
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 16:25:36 GMT
Organization: Quantum Software Systems

In article <1992Oct13.195039.25383@afterlife.ncsc.mil> mssmith@afterlife.ncsc.mil (M. Scott Smith) writes:
>I read with interest the story of the bear killing a person in Yellowstone,
>and I think it's interesting that there are people who are strongly for
>killing the bear(s) and strongly against it.
<etc>

This has been discussed enough times that 'bear' has even made my kill file.
But at the risk of contributing to the problem...

I don't favour killing wildlife. I think most of us feel this way. On the other
hand, if we as a species try to preserve distinct areas as 'natural habitats'
for other forms of life, there will inevitably be problems associated with 
the boundaries between those habitats and our man-made environments, and with
the role of people visiting those habitats.

There is a tradeoff between safety of human visitors and the 'rights' of wildlife
to live freely within their habitat.

I feel that few of us could be as familiar with the give and take in this tradeoff
as are parks personel. Those people are not out there rubbing their hands with 
glee at having an excuse to shoot a bear. But as long as parks are treated as
tourist destinations and a entertainment resource available to all, there will be
hard decisions to make. At what point should be the visiting public be protected
against the odds? That is, the odds of having a negative encounter with a potentially
dangerous animal? Do those against the killing argue so because they believe there
is no risk? Because there is not enough risk? Or because they feel that humans as
interlopers in this environment have no rights?

In a natural world, every animal will fight back to give itself good odds at living.
It seems peculiar that humans should be expected to decline to protect themselves
when they are part of that world.

If we were to vastly restrict human access to wildlife habitats, the problem would
be greatly reduced. But such restriction would be followed by political backlash
from the people who use these areas. And, like it or not, that group is us!




-- 
Eric Johnson (eric@quantum.qnx.com or try eric@quantum.on.ca)
Technical Development, Quantum Software Systems Ltd (QNX OS)
From: mssmith@afterlife.ncsc.mil (M. Scott Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
Subject: Re: Bears attacking people?
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:27:22 GMT
Organization: The Great Beyond

Hmm.  Bears sound a bit too unreliable for me to feel too comfortable
wandering around in the back country.

Out of curiosity, is there any way to protect oneself against a bear
(besides taking preventive measures; let's assume you're hiking and you
come across a bear and s/he's not too terribly pleased about it)?

I certainly wouldn't ever take a gun hiking (or ever buy one, for that
matter); if I was being attacked by a bear, and I sprayed, say, insect
repellent in its eyes (from an aerosol can), would it run away?  :)

How about mace?

Or what if I started singing really loudly?

(I'm actually serious about the aerosol can..  Would something be effective
against a bear attack, blinding the bear so you could run away, or would
it just tick off the bear?)

Scott
From: price@helios.unl.edu (Chad  Price)
Subject: Re: Problems w/ NorthFace tents: NOW Pole strength
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln
Date:  9 Oct 92 17:11:43 GMT

JB <jbl@mesaadm.cre.nt.com> writes:

>Of those of you reporting problems with your North Face tent poles, how
>many had aluminum poles and how many had fiberglass poles?  From personal
>experience and word of mouth only, I have never heard of anyone breaking
>an aluminum pole, but the fiberglass ones are known to shatter.  Thanks
>for the input.         

I have an REI Geodome (aluminum poles) and a JanSport dome with fiberglass
poles. I have never had problems with the fiber glass poles, including a night
on the Isle of Skye with 40+ winds: the tent was blown horizontal over our
faces, and immediately rebounded when the wind let up. (between the gusts).
I've had the JanSport tent since 1980, and only used the REI for the last
couple of seasons. 

The aluminum poles seem to develop permanent bends after a while, and one of
them kinked irreversably (when I straightened it, it broke).

My vote is for fiber glass. Or, from my windsurfing point of view, carbon
fiber/epoxy composite poles. The latter would be extremely light, rigid and
strong. 

--
chad
price@helios.unl.edu
cprice@molecular.unmc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: mike.federchuk@rose.com (mike federchuk)
Subject: Eureaka Tents
Organization: Rose Media Inc, Toronto, Ontario.
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 18:14:18 GMT
X-Gated-By: Usenet <==> RoseMail Gateway (v1.70)


Date Entered: 10-16-92 13:10
Hi Gang!

A friend of mine (with out net access, poor sod!) is thinking about purchasing
an Eureka! "Alpine Meadows Temagammi" four person tent.  He's been told that its
the Canadian 3-season version of the "Alpine Meadows Tatshenshini" tent.  Both
tents are the same size, colour (uh, color? :) and shape.  The only difference
is that the A.M. Temagammi comes with a 4oz Oxford cloth floor, as apposed to
the A.M. Tatshenshini's 1.9oz cloth floor.  This makes the tent weigh in at
12lbs, 9 oz.  Both of these tents use the clip system and come with a vestibule
and gear loft.

Can anyone provide him with a review or experiences with either of these tents?
My impression was that the tent was well made, and seemed fairly sturdy; if not
a little on the heavy side.  Since he'll be using it for mostly canoeing trips,
Chris says that the weight is not too much of a concern.  He'd rather have the
space.

It also has a rectangular floor, a feature which both Chris and I feel is a more
"spacious" feature, when compared to a dome tent of equal size.  This may be
just an optical illusion.


Since he doesn't have an account, please send replies to mine.

Regards,
Mike

Mike Federchuk              |
Burlington, Ontario, Canada |
Mike.Federchuk@rose.com     |
---
   OLX 2.2   Press any key to continue or any other key to quit
   RoseMail 2.00 : Usenet: Rose Media - Hamilton (416) 575-5363
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: bohack@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (edward.e.harstead)
Subject: Re: Neophyte tent groundsheet question
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 16:08:48 GMT

In article <1992Oct7.154315.1343@spectrum.xerox.com> damouth@wrc.xerox.com writes:
>
>I always use a sheet of plastic inside the tent - a 2 or 3 mil cheap
>drop cloth, cut about six inches bigger than the tent floor all the way
>around, and thus lapped up the side of the tent six inches or so. 

and

>As others have pointed out, an outside ground cloth always presents the
>risk of funneling water under the tent, and won't help at all if water
>is actually flowing downhill toward the tent. 

Not necessarily so.  I use a groundsheet as you do, larger than the
base of the tent, but on the outside, with the excess tucked up
under the rain fly (no part of it can stick out from the fly).  
I therefore have a protective plastic tub as you do, but on the
outside of the tent so I have the added (and debatable) advantage
of floor protection.  

However, I find your argument for an interior tub interesting, and
will try it next time.

Ed