From: a-amberf@microsoft.com (Amber Foruria)
Subject: Re: Response to "Bible and Abortion"
Date: 08 Apr 92 19:31:39 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.

In article <d1wtsnq@rpi.edu>, cookc@aix.rpi.edu (rocker) writes:
> a-amberf@microsoft.com (Amber Foruria) writes:
> 
> >abortions as a form of birth control.  Well, I have two friends that 
> >have done just that.  They either don't want to use birth control or 
> >else their boyfriend refuses to use anything.  They have both had two
> 
> Then your friends are, to put it quite simply, stupid. Considering
> the expense involved in abortion is much larger than that of using
> birth control, and that abortion is minor surgery, it doesn't make
> sense.

I agree with you completely!!!  They were absolutely stupid!  That
is probably why they didn't tell me until after.  I asked them why
they didn't just use the FREE birth control they could get and they
said they didn't want to bother going in for the exam etc and doing
the things it takes to get the birth control!!  I still can't figure
out what the hell was going on in their head! Also, as far as their
"boyfrinds" go......I have now use for jerks like that.


> 
> Now, to look at this from a different angle.  Do you really want
> such stupid and irresponsible people to become _parents_?  You
> once the girls become pregnant?

I never said they had to KEEP the child!  they could always
give it up for adoption and there was (and is) support available
to them, for that.


> 
> >	NOW! What is the POINT in calling names?!  It really isn't necessary
> 
> It's an emotional issue.  When someone tells me that he would happily

I understand that, and I agree....



> 
> 
> >	It was said,"...So you know how many correctly don, first  
> >trimester abortions, done in a clinic, it would take to reach...."
> >the point at which a woman would be too damaged to have children.
> >Well, after quite a few there will be damage, and if a woman is
> >dumb enough to have a lot, she could end up permanantly damaged.
> >Then, what about the ones that are done wrong?  Especially, if
> >abortion is made illegal.  Then the women will not only be
> >damaged, they could also die.  
> 
> A good argument for abortion remaining legal.

I think abortion should remain legal to women...except those like
my "friends".  I don't think a woman or girl should be able to just
walk into a clinic and say "I want an abortion...I don't want to carry
the child to term...."  I think clinics are doing a good job telling
the mothers what there options are....I feel there should be limitations.



> >ABORTIONS!!!!!!  IF SHE IS STUPID ENOUGH TO GET ONE EVERYTIME
> >SHE FEELS IT IS INCONVENIENT TO HAVE A CHILD, THEN SHE WILL HAVE
> >TO PAY THE CONSEQUENCES!!!!!
> 
> What consequences would those be, other than the obvious expense?

Just the expense, any damage (if there is any), etc. Also, any guilt
or pain (I know, pregnancy causes pain....so, don't get pregnant!)


> 
> >	I mentioned that, thanks to the fact, that abortions were
> >illegal when my natural mother was pregnant ( I am adopted ) she
> >didn't have an abortion.  It was then said "....Do you realize that you
> >are advocating
> >             ng that your own mother be enslaved to her reproductive organs
> >for 9 months?...."  If my mother was "enslaved" she did it to herself.  I
> >love my natural mother, but that doesn't mean that I agree with what she
> >did.  Even if the result was me!  She would have been much happier if she
> >had not had a baby.  Like I said, she came from a very strict Catholic family.  I think my
> >grandmother went back to Italy for awhile because seh
> >was ashamed of my mother.  Now, that doens't mean I feel abortion should
> >be 100% legalized so that my mom might not have been as miserable.  she 
> >would've had me even if abortion was legal!  Of course she would   have
> >thought about it, but she probably wouldn't have  been any happier....
> 
> Another good argument for legal abortion.  Just what are you attacking
> here?

I am not really attacking anyone.  Must I ?


> 
> >	It is never "merciful" to have an abortion whether the aborted
> >child goes to heaven or not!!!!  Just because an aborted child would
> >go to heaven doesn't mean I approve of abortions!  Animals that are
> >killed go to heaven also, does that mean we should go around killing
> >them?!
> 
> Interesting theology here.

Thank you!  :-)


> 
> >if she must carry a child.....and, if she IS suffering, don't you think
> >she should have thought about that BEFORE she decided to have sex and 
> >not use birthcontrol? or, for those who will argue that birthcontrol
> 
> "you don't feel..." that a woman is suffering when she carries a
> child.  Have you ever carried a child?  Do you have any idea what
> other women feel about carrying children?

I realize that carrying a child is a sort of suffering.  What I meant
was, if she doesn't WANT to endure the suffering, if having a child
isn't worth the suffering she must go through while being pregnant,
WHY GET PREGNANT IN THE FIRST PLACE??!!


> Do you realize that "not having sex" is NOT a reasonable option
> for many women?  What about women in abusive relationships, who
> may be beaten up for refusing sex?  What about women who simply
> love their husbands and wish to make them happy through sex?  What
> about women who enjoy sex?  Would you make all these women unhappy
> simply because you feel their abortions are irresponsible?

First of all:  for those who can't help themselves; why not use
birthcontrol?  Abusive relationships; I agree with you...women in
those kinds of situations SHOULD be able to get an abortion.  
Women who love their husbands....BIRTHCONTROL! WHAT IN THE WORLD
IS WRONG WITH BEING A LITTLE MORE RESPONSIBLE WHEN HAVING SEX??!!

> >state shouldn't enslave a woman, but the father should.  There
> >are no should or should nots.....And I don't feel that the father
> >should (or has a right to) FORCE a woman (his wife, lover, mother
> >of his child) to have a child. BUT, if men want to have an opinion
> >on the subject of illegal abortions, I don't feel ANY MAN except the
> >father has a right to say anything!!!  Unless it envolves a 
> I don't object to men having an opinion on the abortion issue.  I
> only object when men are willing to mandate for me what they
> themselves would never have to face.

I agree with you....I was being a bit harsh.

> 
> >I feel women should be able to have an abortion under any 
> >circumstance OTHER THAN AS A CONVENIENCE!!!!  IF SHE IS RAPED, THE
> >BABY OR SHE WILL DIE AS A RESULT OF PREGNANCY, THERE ARE SEVERE
> >BIRTH DEFECTS IN THE BABY AND EVEN (if there could be some sort of
> >guide lines....though that seems impossible) IN CERTAIN CASES OF
> >SEVERE POVERTY OF THE PARENTS (but that is controversial because
> >birthcontrol is given out free). So, I am pro-life, and pro-choice.
 I accidently edited this last statemen...

	My definition of convenience, I feel, has been explained!