HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: aduncan@titan.trl.OZ.AU (Allan Duncan)
Subject: Re: ! Pournelle [sic] says that there is a new amiga !
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne, Australia
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 02:34:53 GMT

From article <1992Jul27.052645.9548@zip.eecs.umich.edu>, by gilgalad@sparky.eecs.umich.edu (Ralph Seguin):

> I suggest we send a machine to Niven instead :)  Remember Byte is a
> VERY poor magazine when it comes to being fair.  A lot of them
> seem to live in an Intel only world of their own :)

This has been a continuing drift to Intel worship.  But remember - a lot
of the early Amigas were sold on the basis of the Byte reviews.
Allan Duncan	ACSnet	 a.duncan@trl.oz
(+613) 253 6708	Internet a.duncan@trl.oz.au
		UUCP	 {uunet,hplabs,ukc}!munnari!trl.oz.au!a.duncan
Telecom Research Labs, PO Box 249, Clayton, Victoria, 3168, Australia.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie)
Subject: Re: Amigas are cool
Originator: torrie@Xenon.Stanford.EDU
Organization: CS Department, Stanford University, California, USA
Date: 30 Jul 92 05:24:55 GMT

mlelstv@specklec.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst) writes:

>Look at the hundreds of UNIX programs that will generate segfaults on
>bad input data. This symptom exists because such an error doesn't bring
>the machine down and is tolerated by people.

  Actually, I tend to think it's because most Unix programs are not
designed for general populace use.  Certainly I wouldn't buy a
Unix program which fell over when you gave it incorrect input
data.

>It however won't help
>you with your critical presentation where a segfault is as bad as a
>system crash (at least on the Amiga where a reboot last a couple of
>seconds).

  My point is that the segmentation faults allow you to detect errors
before you ship the product.  They also tell the user (if they do
happen in a running program) that something wrong HAS happened.
Without memory protection, you don't even know whether some
bit in some other program has been arbitrarily flipped.  (Which
reminds me of an interesting fact I read yesterday: apparently
the entire justification for "spinach contains lots of iron"
is based on a faulty report where the decimal point was shifted
to the right by one place in some lab report.  Spinach actually
contains 10 times LESS iron than the popular press used to 
spout about).

>And still you can find such errors without hardware memory protection.
>Look at such utilities like Mungwall or Enforcer which will track down
>more errors than generic MP will exploit.

  Don't these USE hardware memory protection?  I know that on the Mac, 
Jasik's Debugger allows you to use the 680(2|3|4)0's memory protection
to trap writes into other app memory spaces.

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Evan Torrie.  Stanford University, Class of 199?       torrie@cs.stanford.edu 
Embrace rationalism, reject superstition.           Break away from the past.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: I am giving up on the Amiga
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 14:30:58 GMT
X-Posted-From: connection.prospect.com
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block) writes:
>
>: Exactly my point, John.  OS/2 2.0 and AmigaDOS 2.04 do *not* have roughly
>: equivalent usefulness and functionality.  So why should they be expected
>: to run on the same hardware and occupy the same amount of RAM and HD space?
>
>Another well known OS used by a well-known CD-I system runs an OS,
>which, with an extra 350k of source code (actually, it was a bit
>less), runs with VM, MP, and resource tracking.  That leaves oh, 32
>megabytes +?
>

Greg, these two sentences just don't parse for me.  350K of *source* code?
32 megabytes of what?

>
>What makes you think that it will take more than that to
>add it to AmigaDos/AmigaOS?
>

I didn't want to get into this, but what makes you think that VM, MP, and
resource tracking are the only things OS/2 2.0 has over AmigaDOS?

>
>Greg
>
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: brett@visix.com (Brett Bourbin)
Subject: Re: I am not giving up on the Amiga
Reply-To: brett@visix.com
Organization: Visix Software Inc., Reston, VA
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 16:17:01 GMT

In article <mykes.0ahv@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG> mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike  
Schwartz) writes:
> OK all you Unix/X guys out there.  Let's start a list.  I'll start it  
off,
> you can add to the end :)
> 
> 1.	FrameMaker
> 2.	XGuide
> 3.	XRn

  Looking Glass Version 3.	8^)
--                                    __
Brett Bourbin                  \  / /(_  /\/  11440 Commerce Park Drive
  Manager of Technical Services \/ / __)/ /\  Reston, Virginia 22091
  brett@visix.com               Software Inc  703.758.8230
From: rickan@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (Mark Rickan)
Subject: Re: Commodore's Reply
Organization: Department of Computer Science, McMaster University
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 00:24:21 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.065327.5742@uwm.edu> gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
(Gregory R Block) writes:

>mac1@Ra.MsState.Edu (Mubashir Cheema) writes:
>:   Now honestly how many people disagree and really find it
>:   MOST EXCITING time for an Amigan ?
>
>A lot of users, and a WHOLE LOT of developers.

Agreed. People don't seem to understand that the early innovations were
embraced by few and once evoked yawns from users of other platforms. If
you want nostalgia, boot up Textcraft under 1.0. That wasn't depressing,
it was distressing :).

Mark

-- 
 -------------------------------------------------------------------------
 = Mark Rickan                         ...!uunet!utai!utgpu!maccs!rickan = 
 = DCSS, McMaster University               rickan@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca = 
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jrm3a@cyclops.micr.Virginia.EDU (Jonathan Moll)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Marc and Memory and Clyde.
Date: 27 Jul 92 23:39:57 GMT
Organization: University of Virginia
Originator: jrm3a@cyclops.micr.Virginia.EDU

Marc Barrett sez:

>   People have been predicting the demise of main memeory as we know it
>ever since the first rumors of bubble memories reached the computer

No No No -SB- (silly boy)  Bubble Memory was to replace secondary
storage, as it was non-volatile.  (Just like CORE w/o the EM bleed :))
It disappeared faster than my paycheck as far as personal computing goes.
I think SHARP or Hitachi might still manufacture the 128K gizmos for
data logging (mil spec zero power survival).  EEPROMS have replaced
bubble memory in low read/write cycle designs.

>industry.  If I said that hard drive's will ALWAYS be cheaper than RAM,
>this might have been an exageration, because such developments as 
>holographic optical memories have a chance of turning the system on its
>side.  But I do think that it will be a LONG time before anything like
>holographic memories will become available.  At least several of the

I bet supercomputing peripherals using optical 3D crystals will be 
available in the next five years.  After all Cray Unicos doesn't do VM.

>world's largest computer memory manufacturers seem to agree with me, as

Do they consult you, or do you consult them?  Hmm Hmm Hmm?  Hee Hee Hee! 

>the 256Mbit memories that IBM, Sharp and a German firm (I forget the name)
>are collaborating on use standard memory techniques, pushed to their
>limits.

Gee -SB- what limits are we talking about?  (My GOD, it's FULL of ELECTRONS)
(NO you FOOL! Put down that arc welder! Argghhh refractory metals.... I'm
 melting.....)

>
>>P.S. Dear TKKC, "VM is obsolete OS technology, Nahh Nahh Phpptt!"
>>P.P.S.  I do like memory protection (pie in face, panic, machine halts
>>        with a "memory protection" error) Hee Hee Hee. :)  (Yes kiddies
>>        I DO KNOW that it doesn't have to halt, just give me an exception
>>        and call systems in the morning)
>
>   Besides, if VM is obsolte, then why are so many Amigaoids making such 
>a bit deal about it possibly finally becoming available through an 
>unsupported third-party hack?

Good point, I guess you have some of em whipped into a frenzy eh?  Personally
I think the HUMAN BEING makes the computer functional, not the other way
'round...

Taa Daa th,th,th,thats all folks!
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: ataylor@agsm.ucla.edu (Al Taylor)
Subject: Re: LOADED LOADED LOADED Amiga system for sale!!!
Keywords: LOADED
Date: 22 Jul 92 13:59:02 PDT

barrett@snoopy.cs.umass.edu (Daniel BLAZEMONGER) writes:


>Check it OUT!!  This system is LOADED!!!!

>	o	Amiga 1000
>	o	256K RAM
>	o	1 floppy drive (needs repair)
>	o	1 bottle of "Johnny Walker Black"


Will you sell the Johnney Walker seperately? 

Sorry couldn't resist.

al		ataylor@agsm.ucla.edu
From: mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: I DID giev up on the Amiga!
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: GRn 1.16e (7/4/92) by Mike Schwartz & Michael B. Smith
Date: 28 Jul 92 10:57:58 PST
Organization: Amiga makes it possible

In article <1992Jul28.084535.28895@mpifr-bonn.mpg.de> mlelstv@specklec.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst) writes:
> In <haley.712303311@unixg.ubc.ca> haley@unixg.ubc.ca (Ross MacGregor) writes:
>
> >In <1992Jul22.212801.6596@mpifr-bonn.mpg.de> mlelstv@speckled.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst) writes:
>
> >>That sounds like a good idea.. an 040/33 with 256k cache, AA and 8MB chip
> >>memory. If not priced unreasonably that would be an item I would buy
> >>at once.
>
> >Wow, me too! Do you think it's too late for cbm.suggestions?
>
> Yes, it's too late..

Understatement.

>
> Regards,
> --
> Michael van Elst
> UUCP:     universe!local-cluster!milky-way!sol!earth!uunet!unido!mpirbn!p554mve
> Internet: p554mve@mpirbn.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de
>                                 "A potential Snark may lurk in every tree."

--
Amiga programmer of: GRn, MailMinder, Budokan, Beyond Dark Castle, Dark Castle
Sega Genesis programmer of: Dick Tracy and Marble Madness.
Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
1124 Fremont Ave.
Los Altos, CA 94024

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie)
Subject: Re: I DID giev up on the Amiga!
Originator: torrie@Xenon.Stanford.EDU
Organization: CS Department, Stanford University, California, USA
Date: 27 Jul 92 06:50:53 GMT

mlelstv@speckled.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst) writes:

>In <1992Jul24.161543.29658@ra.msstate.edu> skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
>>The original Mac II video boards could be made to work with NTSC using a
>>special cable and some software from Apple.  I saw an early Mac II display
>>a B&W interlaced image on a //GS color monitor (analog CGA-res like the
>>A108x).  It was about as usable as an Amiga in interlace mode.

>Thanks for that information.. never heard of it. But the fact that it was
>B&W seems to indicate that they just programmed the video controller for
>NTSC frequencies and interlace mode but didn't have a PAL or NTSC encoder
>for adding the color burst and carrier (i.e. something like the small A520
>box).

  This is true.  The Mac PAL/NTSC output is only black and white.  
If you want colour, you need a nice board like the Radius VideoVision
(which incidentally is an Apple-developed technology).

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Evan Torrie.  Stanford University, Class of 199?       torrie@cs.stanford.edu 
Embrace rationalism, reject superstition.           Break away from the past.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cpca@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Colin Adams)
Subject: Re:  I DID give up on the Amiga!
Organization: James Cook University
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 10:13:52 GMT

In article <gromyko.03tg@sputnik.rhein-main.de> gromyko@sputnik.rhein-main.de (Michael Grom) writes:
>In article <1992Jul26.191956.2642@news.iastate.edu> barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N Barrett) writes:
>>Again, it is far better for most people to have a slow non-DMA SCSI included
>>than to have no HD capability included at all.
>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Oh Marc, what a silly answer! What about all those little high-priced
>Macintoshes Apple sold in the past, without internal harddisks?
>A computer without a hardddisk/controller gives you the opportunity
>to choose from what suit your needs best.
>
>Leave the silly A600 aside!

I disagree (how unusual everybody says :-) ).

In Australia the A600 is about $650.  It is only around $200
extra for a 20 MB harddrive.  This will mean a lot more Amiga owners
will have harddrives, which can only be good for the Amiga.  I doubt 
a 40 MB harddrive would be much more.

The A600 with harddrive is selling for the same price the 500 without
a harddrive was around a year ago, and the 500 was a huge success in this
country.  C= is trying to bring harddrives to the low-end, which can
only be good.

>Regards,
>	Michael

-- 
Colin Adams       Honours Student - James Cook University of North Queensland
              "Friends come and go, but enemies accumulate."
From: t9114145@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Upgrade Amiga OR buy 486??
Date: 27 Jul 92 17:54:07 GMT
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

In article <1992Jul25.140756.3748@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au>, davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn) writes:

(stuff deleted)

> The Amiga's survived OK without marketing - what we need are machines which are
> sellable.  The A600HD will sell fairly well in Australia at its current price,

The A600 is selling in "Maxwell's" at $699! Amazing ripoff. What prices
have you heard?

> based on word of mouth alone - they won't need to market it.  That doesn't
> help me, though - I want an A4000, and they have five months to sell me one.

Do you think that even if C= announce the A4000 tomorrow that we would see
one here in the next YEAR? C= Australia are more pathetic than head office, 
if that's possible. I once arranged for a C= rep. to come out and see our
network expert, and hopefully sell the college lots of A3000's. He didn't
arrive. This is the sort of effort they are making all over the world. They
give A600's to one outlet, and let them seel at an inflated price. 3 months
ago they told me A500+'s wouldn't be seen in Oz at all. Guess what's in the
shops now? 
 
Stupidity, incompetence, sloth? You tell me.

> 
>>So, what do you net.amiga.experts recommend?  (I don't even want to ask the 
>>MS-DOS gang). Please be honest.
> 
> I'm no expert, but you could do what I'm doing.  There have been some very
> promising noises about new machines.  I'm giving them time to see what
> actually comes out, but I'm not waiting forever.
> 

Well, my waiting is up. A lack of honest, trustworthy retailers is contributing
as well, but Commodore themselves are the main problem. I have owned a 1000,
a 2000 and a 2500 system and liked them all, but now it's time for a 486
with Coherent or OS/2. It wouldn't have taken much effort on C='s part to 
keep me and other customers, but it's too late now. Maybe if the 4000 and
the AA chips happen I'll convert again, but they will have to be good.

> 
> -- 
> 
> David Meiklejohn                  | Internet : davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au
> Computer Systems Officer, QDPI    | Fax      : +61 70 92 3593
> Mareeba, Australia                | Voice    : +61 70 92 1555
-- 


Adam Eberbach      t9114145@phillip.edu.au          fnord
Computer Science student, Phillip Institute of Technology.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: laire@uni-paderborn.de (Ralph Schmidt)
Subject: Re: Commodore's Reply
Organization: Uni-GH Paderborn
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 19:58:27 GMT

gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block) writes:

>mac1@Ra.MsState.Edu (Mubashir Cheema) writes:
>:   Now honestly how many people disagree and really find it
>:   MOST EXCITING time for an Amigan ?

>A lot of users, and a WHOLE LOT of developers.

You're really excited ??? I'm only disappointed....

IMHO...this year will decide the future of Commo and i'm not
optimistic about it. You must only look at the key-market of
the amiga....the major US game-companies want to stop Amiga
support....i think you can imagine what will happen if this
doesn't change. And i guess it's not necessary to comment
the not existing perspectives for developers, because
this won't be read by a responsible person.

P.S. I'm really be anxious how Commo will react if they loose
     their cash-cow market, germany, perhaps they realize then
     that it's wrong to produce what they think the public needs
     and NOT what the public wants.
     And if you want to open new markets you need a fascinating
     toy to confince the audience. I can't see such thing on
     the horizon, i only see the sun go down.....



Regards...

>Greg

>--
>(: (: (: (: Have you overdosed on smileys today?  Why NOT!?! :) :) :) :) :)
>(:"The person who said size doesn't matter was probably a very small man":)
>(:	gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu			Gregory R. Block         :)
>(: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (: (:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
-- 
Ralph Schmidt                                            laire@uni-paderborn.de
University of Paderborn (Germany)
From: foax@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: I am giving up on the Amiga
Date: 31 Jul 92 02:27:32 EDT
Distribution: world,comp
Organization: Cornell University

In article <mykes.0ala@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG>,
mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes: 
> In article <1992Jul28.173645.6201@msi.com> bill@snoopy (Bill Poitras) writes:
>> mykes@amiga0.SF-Bay.ORG (Mike Schwartz) writes:
>> : I have also heard that development of DOS software using OS/2 is
>> : not a good thing to do (hard to test for true compatibility).  Same
>> : is true if you develop Windows apps.  As well, when Windows 3.2 (or
>> : whatever) comes out, you are going to have to wait for IBM to scurry
>> : to be compliant/compatible again.  And MicroSoft is likely to do many
>> : many things to sabotage OS/2 compatibility as time goes on.  And finally,
>> : the DOS emulation requires config.sys and autoexec.bat garbage for
>> : each command.com run...
>>
>> 3) Windows 3.2?  What's that?  I'm still waiting for Windows NT.  Anyway,
>> by the time Windows 3.2 comes out, there won't be any reason for an OS/2
>> user to use those apps.  They either will be happy with Windows 3.1 apps,
>> or OS/2 2.0 apps.  No Steekin' Windows 3.2 need apply.
>>
> 
> Windows 3.2 is just a name for the next version of windows that will be
> popular (and much more popular than OS/2).  Judging from the great
> improvement in windows from version 3.0 to 3.1, the next version is
> likely to be a "must have" upgrade, whether it be Windows NT or something
> suited for a cheap 20MHz 386SX box with only 4 Megs of RAM.

The following is one step short of hearsay, but here goes.

In (I believe) the June issue of Computer Shopper, there's a brief note on
Microsoft announcing Windows 4.0.  I don't think it will be out anytime soon;
I'm not even sure the release date was mentioned.  It will have a nicer, more
consistent user interface, with style guidelines like those for the Mac
(and, I might add, AmigaOS 2.04).  Most remnants of DOS will be practically
eliminated.  (Don't ask me what that means, there was no detail and my memory
is fuzzy on this anyway.)

Sounds like a must-have upgrade to me, and one suited for a 20 MHz 386SX with
4 Mb RAM.  Perhaps Microsoft intends to push Windows NT for the high end while
supporting the low end with Windows 4.0.  Could it be that they could cut DOS
out entirely from Windows at the low-end (i.e. make a new low-end OS)?

>> | Bill Poitras    | Molecular Simulations Inc.    | Tel (408)522-9229       |
> Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
-- 

--Colin Howell			email to howell@astrosun.tn.cornell.edu
--Cornell Astronomy Dept.	(hopefully switching to computer science)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt)
Subject: Re: Games on consoles
Organization: Occidental College, Los Angeles, CA 90041 USA.
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 18:38:25 GMT

Further items of debate... one of the largest purchases in any system is
the monitor.  Which will be necessary to run game consoles in decent
resolutions, with decent color consistency and lack of blurryness...
and monitor prices are going down.  The price of a 386sx CPU with
case, power supply, and all necessities except hard drive is less than
$400.  Still 4x the cost of a console, but the  proportionate values
drop to 2x the cost when you factor in a $300 monitor.

$800 for the machine now... and $400 for the game console.  The machine
could be marketed with a CD-ROM, so could the console.  Add $300.

$1100 for the machine (we've seen them at that price, haven't we) and
$700 for the console.  

Add sales tax, and misc. and you're looking at $1200 for the computer,
and $775 for the console.  Before media.

This is the basic problem of consoles... sure they can produce a cheap
CPU that can do all sorts of neat tricks... but, if they want serious
power, they have to add costly peripherials.

Thom

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: mlelstv@speckled.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de (Michael van Elst)
Subject: Re: I DID giev up on the Amiga!
Organization: Max-Planck-Institut f"ur Radioastronomie
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 22:47:28 GMT

In <torrie.711914603@Xenon.Stanford.EDU> torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie) writes:
>  Define run-of-the-mill.  The NeXT (even the original) is hardly
>a run of the mill architecture.

Sure it is. There's really nothing amazing about the NeXTs hardware.
The software is different point.

Regards,
-- 
Michael van Elst
UUCP:     universe!local-cluster!milky-way!sol!earth!uunet!unido!mpirbn!p554mve
Internet: p554mve@mpirbn.mpifr-bonn.mpg.de
                                "A potential Snark may lurk in every tree."
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: ata@hfsi.uucp (John Ata FSO)
Subject: Re: I am giving up on the Amiga
Reply-To: ata@hfsi.UUCP (John Ata FSO)
Organization: HFSI, McLean VA.
Distribution: comp
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 04:29:16 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.220958.14001@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> foax@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
>Actually the 286 and the 68000 aren't all that similar either.  While
>the 68000 was concentrating on implementing a 32-bit programmer's
>model on chip to hide the internal 16-bit arithmetic logic unit and
>data paths (ask Jarkko Lindblad about this if you doubt me, I got it
I've asked this question before, and I;ll ask it again:  If the 68000
as a 16 bit ALU, then why is it that I notice no difference in instruction
timing between:

	add.w		#1,d5

		and

	add.l		#1,d5

I have these instructions in a loop and time them over a given period.
Has anyone else verified this?

>--Colin Howell			email to howell@astrosun.tn.cornell.edu
>--Cornell Astronomy Dept.	(hopefully switching to computer science)


-- 
John G. Ata - Technical Consultant | Internet:     hfsi!ata@UUNET.UU.NET
HFS, Inc.		  VA20     |     UUCP:     uunet.uu.net!hfsi!ata
7900 Westpark Drive	 MS:601	   |    Voice:	(703) 827-6810
McLean, VA  22102	           |      FAX:	(703) 827-3729
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy