From: silver@macbeth.umd.edu (Adam Silver)
Newsgroups: misc.fitness
Subject: Re: SUPPLEMENTS! (was Re: Really Strong Stuff)
Date: 15 Dec 92 02:13:37 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Maryland

In article <75582@apple.apple.COM> chuq@Apple.COM (Eeyore's Evil Twin) writes:
>silver@macbeth.umd.edu (Adam Silver) writes:
>
>>DON'T PISS ME OFF!  Whew!  I hate when people get into this bullshit with me.
>>WAKE UP!  I know what I am talking about if you listen to what I'm saying.
>>Read between the lines.
>
>How do we know you know what you're talking about? there are half a dozen
>other people who post the same kind of article and clearly have no clue.
>That's why references and data backing up statements are necessary.

Alright.  You have me there.  I guess I take for granted that many people
out there have been reading my articles for a couple of years now.  They
will tell you that my information is generally accurate and to the point.  I
usually don't have to break out all of the references.  I'm lazy when it
comes to that.  I read a lot and absorb a lot.

I generally don't just blurt out information unless I'm sure I know what I'm
talking about.

>If you have an informed opinion, Adam, adn I'm not claiming you don't, then
>give us the data we need to evaluate whether or not to believe you. Bullshit
>is a really powerful word, but doesn't tell us much about the discussion
>other than what you think. Give us the data we need to decide to agree with
>you.

BULLSHIT!  Just joking.  :-)

>True. But BULLSHIT is just as content free as GREATEST SUPPLEMENT EVER
>INVENTED. From the data given, either could be true.

Understood.  It's just my way.

>>Reasearch or not, I wouldn't trust any company that copies off of another
>>company as quickly as they find out that another company (makers of Hot Stuff)
>>have come up with a product that really sells.  That's what the makers of
>>Really Strong Stuff did.
>
>True. In fact, I looked at the labels over the weekend. I'm not impressed. I
>didn't bring it home to do a detailed study based on the literature because
>I didn't want to waste the money (and they didn't have a tiny jar) on
>something that I knew I wouldn't want to eat.

I guess I'm not totally crazy.

>This is why it's key to start dispelling some of the old wive's tale stuff
>that goes on in the fitness world, and encourage people to start educating
>themselves. You need to be able to read labels (and, assuming the labels are
>accurate) and figure out whether you want to suck down what the hype is
>pushing on you.  You might also find that you can save a chunk of money by
>figuring out what compounds in a given mix are actually doing the real work
>and which are questionable and rolling your own. 

This is what I try to help people with.  Although I don't have the references
in front of me, I try to give accurate info, not just opinions (although I
do have them).

>Or simply decide you don't need it at all. But you educate folks with facts,
>not with screams of BULLSHIT. You don't beat the hype artists by out
>screaming them. That's my point.
>
>
>>BULLSHIT!!!!  Did you hear that?  Why did I say this?  The guy (I forget his
>>name) never screened even one of the football players for steroids.  Duh.
>>Great research.  It was because of this research that many supplement
>>companies decided to sell chromium picolinate as a supplement.
>
>On the other hand, the pigs at Tulane weren't on steroids, and that seems to
>be a well-controlled study. 

Somehow, pigs and humans seem different to me.  Although monkeys are closer,
they aren't humans either.

>>What does your research say?
>
>I've covered a lot of this before, but to summarize: Chromium seems to be a
>key element in blood sugar control and deficiencies can make diabetics much
>worse (and supplementing diabetics can improve control and reduce the need
>for injected insulin). It seems to help catabolize fats -- there have been a
>couple of studies on that recently, one with pigs at Tulane where
>chromium-supplemented pigs were something like 12% leaner than control pigs,
>and another in humans where two groups were put on reduced calorie diets and
>one supplemented with Chromium Picolinate and L-Carnatine. The control group
>lost zero pounds and gained body fat (ate muscle tissue), while the CP/Car
>group lost weight and reduced % body fat.

That's an important factor there.  L-Carnatine, as you say below, helps
transport fatty acids to the blood stream to be used as a primary source of
energy.

[lots deleted]

>Funny, I've heard that before. CP might help the weight loss, but there are
>no magic cookies. Honest.

Well, supposedly it should help in reducing fat and increasing muscle mass
by allowing more aminos and carbs into the muscle cells, so one might
experience a weight GAIN (but be leaner).

							-Adam

-- 
     **********************************************************************
     *               Adam Silver    Powerlifter/Armwrestler               *
     *           silver@umd5.umd.edu    University of Maryland            *
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Newsgroups: misc.fitness