HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: ROC vs PRC
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:29:09 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: stevelin

In article <1992Oct10.131947.1@cua.edu> 54yang@cua.edu writes:
>In article <1992Oct9.184054.6074@odin.corp.sgi.com>, yu@chang.asd.sgi.com (Yu Chang) writes:
>> 
>> It is interesting to see people from china always being so defensive of the
>> faults they had in the past or they have now. What causes that?
>
>	Blind pride may be a reason, not confident may be another.
>
They might have been part of Red Guards, so they reacted.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: slqmt@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Looking for friend
Date: 11 Oct 92 23:12:53 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

Hi,
My friend want to look for Mr. Li Ming Xiang, studying in
California Institute of Technology majoring on Biochemistry.
He was graduated from Wuhan University. He disappeared
around Aug 31, 1992.
Thanks
SLQMT@cc.usu.edu
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:27645 soc.culture.taiwan:14301 soc.culture.hongkong:12378
From: laub@Software.Mitel.COM (Boniface Lau)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: Traditional vs Simplified Characters
Date: 13 Oct 92 02:26:08 GMT
	<1992Oct12.103214.59624@cc.usu.edu>
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.
In-reply-to: ma@cc.usu.edu's message of 12 Oct 92 16:32:14 GMT

>>>>> On 12 Oct 92 16:32:14 GMT, ma@cc.usu.edu said:
[...]

ma> This argument doesn't make any sense. Everyone now knows that
ma> "love" and any emotion is the result of BRAIN function. Relating
ma> "heart" to "love" is a misconception by our old folks. By taking
ma> "heart" out of the "love" only destroys the WRONG meaning of the
ma> word. 

Instead of saying "hsin hsin hsiang yin", should I expect you to say
"nao nao hsiang yin" :-) ?

When you take a solemn oath, instead of placing your hand over your
heart, should I expect you to place your hand over your head :-) ?


---
Boniface Lau    (613) 592-2122 ext. 3042    Boniface_Lau@Mitel.COM
Mitel Corp., 350 Legget Drive, Kanata, Ontario, Canada K2K 1X3

For my ballets
  you have to hear the music as *music*
    and not make a personal interpretation of it.
      Then your mind will be free to *see* the dancing.      -- Balanchine
From: leung@DSG.Tandem.COM (Steven Leung)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Traditional vs Simplified Characters
Date: 12 Oct 92 15:45:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: dsg.1992Oct12.154534.4580
Organization: Tandem Computers

yding+@pitt.edu (Yijun Ding) writes:
> As I understood, many simplified characters are taken from "hand
> writing".  Most of simplified characters were already widely used in
> people's hand writing before officially adopted.

Actually, quite a lot of the simplications are already in the Cao3 Shu1.
For example, the char [x that Dave particularly cited as an example is
in use in Cao Shu long before the formal simplification occurs. (I think
I have seen the simplified char love in CaoShu too.) I always have a 
liberal view on this issue:

*  (written) language is always in an evolution process: many ancient
   char stops being used (i.e., dead) while new ones are being created
   because of new needs. These things happen even without the simplification.
   The simplification is just a formalization process, which at least
   serves the function of standardization.

*  One can learn the written chinese either from the original form or the
   simplified form, and it's not much a burden to learn the other form
   once you master either one. So, I never understand why some people are
   so fuss about it.

Steven
------
328. Seek opportunity, not security. ...
        - Life's Little Instruction Book by H. J. Brown, Jr.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china
From: library@sunspot.noao.edu (John Cornett)
Subject: Re: 70,000 People Should Sue Shanoon Yeh, Seriously
Organization: National Solar Observatory/SP, Sunspot NM, USA
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 19:48:06 GMT

In article <Bw52AA.35I@ulowell.ulowell.edu> cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi) writes:

>No body dare to sue Mr. Yeh. Think about it: "Shannon T. Yeh Got sued for
>smearing Democrate Fighter of Fraudulent deeds against China!"
>, the big title, on major U.S. newspapers. Guess who is going to be the loser.
---------------

There are many U.S. newspapers, or newsletters, and it is difficult to predict
what many of them would say. But on major newspapers in the U.S., if the story
was covered, I believe they would say something like "Anti-Democracy Activist
Tries to Prevent Jobs to Chinese Students: Lawsuit Pending".

I have a feeling that some netters do not understand how U.S. people think.
I have no way to know what works elsewhere, if insulting the students works in 
other places, I nevertheless believe the same tactic here may backfire badly. 
In fact, I believe it alarms us, and makes us think the Party must be cruel.

The effect of all this is to drive a wedge between us, the Party on one side,
and the majority of U.S. people on the other. I realize some believe this is
good for China, that we should not associate with each other. I personally
disagree with that view, and believe there is a way for us to work together.

I also believe it may also be unfair to the Party, because I am unsure that
the majority of Party leaders really hate or despise students, or share the
eagerness to insult Chinese students in the U.S. Surely, these students will
do great good for China, for Chinese people, and for our good relations,
if only people can accept each other and learn to work together.

John Cornett
From: poppy@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Bush's "speech" in St. Louis
Date: 12 Oct 92 10:29:21 -0300
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

I think President Bush was refering Gov. Clinton was against his own country
in a foreign land when U. S. was at war (though the war is not justified).
I don't think these Chinese students here in U. S. would likely be against
their homeland when China were at war with a foreign country.

BTW, I believe most politicians are of dirty-mind.  It is too naive to ask
a politician for a moral issue.
From: ftsui@uncc.edu (Fong Tsui)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: First try
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:08:08 GMT
Reply-To: ftsui@uncc.edu
Organization: University of NC at Charlotte

First try.
Keywords: world
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
From: kxd5425@usl.edu (Du Kaisheng)
Subject: Re: Oct. 1 or Oct. 10, which is the more important day for China?
Organization: University of Southwestern Louisiana
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 01:20:47 GMT

>there are quite a few die hard Chiang followers on this net.  Let me
>furthermore qualify myself by saying that Chiang Chin Kuo, though has 
>extreme amount of power, he is a very good president.  And Taiwan's 
>economic success today does have alot to do with his contribution.
>
>	But I think the old Chiang is still to be blamed for the bad
>name KMT has today.  KMT was a good party with good intension and 
>has a strong intellectual following.  That is before Dr. Sun Yat Sen
>passed away.  After that.  Well... it's history. 
>
>- C. H. Yang
It doesn't matter how contraversial the issue and how many bad things
CCP has done to this country and how many good things Mr.Chiang could
had done, it was the choice of the majority (if not all) of chinese
people at that time.  At least at that time CCP looked much better than
KMT.  It seems to me that people tend to be tired of the present goverment
and try to have a change.  But what progress can we really make by doing
that?  If you are not in power you may say something but whenever you 
have you probabely will do the same thing.  Chiang did much better in
Taiwan simply because he had to concentrated on the "survival" problem.


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: tian@ece.scarolina.edu (Ming Tian)
Subject: Re: Favorate Xiao3ren2shu1
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date: 14 Oct 92 04:07:30 GMT

Tuya@ccmail.uoregon.edu writes:

>          One thing I miss in the U.S. is xiao ren shu (XRS).
>          Here are my favorate ones:

>          1.  3 guo2 yan3 yi4;  I especially enjoy the five tiger
>          generals, and I spent long time trying to figure out how
>          they ranked in terms of wu3 yi4.  The result is like this:

>              Luu3 bu4
>              Ma3 chao1
>              Guan1 yu3
>              Zhao4 yun2
>              Zhang1 fei1
>              Huang2 zhong1
Another ranking I heard of in my childhood is as follows:

               1. Luu3 bu4
               2. Zhao4 yun2
               3. Zhang1 Fei1
               4. Guan1 Yu3
               5. Ma3 Chao1
               6. Dian3 Wei2
               7. Huang2 Zhong1

   I prefer this one to yours.
   I also enjoy Jin1 Yong1's stories greatly. I hope he could write more
.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: mingwei@idt.unit.no (Mingwei Yang)
Subject: A comment on action 9201
Originator: mingwei@geitved
Organization: Div. of CS & Telematics, Norwegian Institute of Technology
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 10:25:57 GMT

Hi, I am a student in Norway and I am going to return to China after I
finish my degree studey next year. So, personally, I have nothing to
do with the S1212(?) bill. 

Occasionally, I read from the new group SCC and noticed there are some
disputes among Chinese students about the issue. Frankly, I am a bit
puzzled by Mr. Yeh's anger toward the lobby activities. 

We all heard  during early 1950s, the American government
attempted to prevent some famous Chinese scientists, e.g., Qin
Xuesing, going back to China. If the S1212 bill were trying to do a
similar thing, I would like to say, the motivation of Mr. Yeh's action
9201 is correct, or at least, is understanable.

However, things seem different... The bill, or now the law, does not
force anybody to stay in the US. It only gives a chance to those who
want to stay there. So everybody can make his/her own decision freely.
What is really wrong?

Mr. Yeh called the green card many Chinese will get "blood card". In
some sense, he is right. Without the blood flowed over Beijing's soil,
there won't be evidence to sopport the bill. However, who should be
responsible for the blood from the bodies of the innocent Chinese
people? Who should be condemned? 

Another question is if the returned people are really safe. Like Yeh,
I believe it is relatively safe now if you won't be involeved in any
political activites against CCP. It is the reason that I decided to go
back and work in our homeland. However, remeber the terrible
history of the modern China, millions people suffered so much even
though they never do anything against CCP! China is such a country:
today you may be safe, but tomorow you might not. Therefore, when you
have moved to a safe place like the US, if to return to the old place
is really a serious problem to each person. After 6.4, when anybody
says  he is not safe, he may be a lier, or he may not be a lier.
Nobody can determine it clearly. It is quite different from in another
country like the US: if a guy claims that he has not freedom of
speech, then we can determine immediately that he is a lier!

Therefore, let's make our own decision for our future and do not blame
and interpose other prople's decision.

The commens are written in poor English. Thanks to everybody for
reading it.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: zou@ccs.northeastern.edu (Chendong Zou)
Subject: Luo, Jiang
Organization: College of CS, Northeastern U
          Luo, Jiang
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 23:32:01 GMT

I would appreciate if anyone can help me find Mr. Luo1, Jiang1's address.
Mr. Luo is my friend in Beijing University(formerly Institute) of Aeronautics
and Astronautics. He came to the state last year and studied Aerospace engine
in Pen. State Univ. 

If anyone know his address, please email me or call me at 617-776-7825.

Thanks a lot!

Zou Chendong


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: u926009@postoffice.utas.edu.au (HAJIME YOJI)
Subject: Re: Where are the Japanese?
Organization: University of Tasmania
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 08:35:16 GMT

In article <wep8wzK00VpaECLF0q@andrew.cmu.edu>, ws22+@andrew.cmu.edu (Wenjun Sun) writes:
> 
> This is 'netnews.soc.culture.china', why should the Japanese stir the
> mess in this net? They have their own 'netnews.soc.culture.japan'

The person who raised the topics 'Where are the Japanese' would knew that
there is 'netnews.soc.culture.japan'.  I think the point he wanted to make 
was that there are so many things between China and Japan which should be 
discussed or communicated. China and Japan are, after all, part of Orient 
and we have so many things in common.
It might be very interesting to have inter-channels dicussion.
The topics like "Emperor's visit to China' might be a good start. 

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: ftsui@uncc.edu (Fong Tsui)
Subject: Have a nice day
Reply-To: ftsui@uncc.edu
Organization: University of NC at Charlotte
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 20:29:20 GMT

It is a good day to go out to relax. Most Chinese need that.


Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: engp2030@nusunix1.nus.sg (WU HU)
Subject: re: cooking mantou
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 05:47:14 GMT

Could you try other kinds of flour.
From: lix@nubian.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Silk valley has a "Kuai" tree?
Date: 9 Oct 92 20:37:50 GMT
Organization: Boston University

In article <BvvBEs.LxJ@cs.psu.edu> jyw@phys.psu.edu (Jin-Yuan Wu) writes:
>In article <ldbeulINN9jb@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin) writes:
>(deleted)
>The Xinhua Dictionary is on top of my desk. Anything you want find out?

Well, Steve Lin has not inform me how much he donated yet. Before he
does so, please stop checking dictionary for him. He is trying to
get free lectures. A person with 10,000 GNP should not behalve like
that. I am really disappointed.


-- 
The SOS China Education Fund is a non-political, non-profit and independent
organization to raise money promoting the education in rural China. All donations
are tax-deductable. Make checks or money orders payable to: "SOS China Education
Fund"; c/o Jie KANG, 2610 E. 5th Pl, Apt. 1, Tulsa, OK74104, USA.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
From: cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang)
Subject: Re: Oct. 1 or Oct. 10, which is the more important day for China?
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 15:46:28 GMT

>> It is true that without Old Chiang, Taiwan  won't be the same as she is
>> now. But, the real question is will Taiwan be better off or worse ?
>> Two possibities, if Taiwan was ruled by Japanese after WWII, Taiwan will be
>> close to what Japan is now, or if Taiwan was governed by U.S., Taiwan will
>> close to what U.S. is now. Both possibilities are much better off than
>> what Taiwan is now.  So, what is the point to thank old Chiang ?
>
>	** First, you are wrong in the two possibilities you mentioned.
>	   To be a poor Chink is better than to be a rich Japs or
>	   a rich Yankie.
>

I believe most of the people will agree that Japan and German have received
countless help and aids from U.S. after the WWII. And that is the main reason
they can be what they are today. Then, please tell me is Japanese now
more Japanese or more Yankie ? Or, is Germany now more Germany or more
Yankie ? So, if Taiwan would be in the similar situation as Japan after
WWII, will Taiwanese be more Taiwanese or more Yankie ?

Yi-Chieh
From: news@news.clarkson.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: TEST TRY!
Date: 15 Oct 92 02:50:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: craft.zhangey.719117453
Organization: Clarkson University

This article was probably generated by a buggy news reader.
From: ftsui@uncc.edu (Fong Tsui)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Just for fun
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:15:18 GMT
Reply-To: ftsui@uncc.edu
Organization: University of NC at Charlotte

Who can tell me how to use the newsgroups? 

Keywords: 
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:27530 soc.culture.taiwan:14267 soc.culture.hongkong:12313
From: ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: Oct 10, Our National Day
Date: 12 Oct 92 09:59:55 -0600
Organization: Muskingum College

In article <1992Oct11.201006.23597@zip.eecs.umich.edu>, cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes:
> 
> Thought Oct. 10 national day is only observed in Taiwan, no ?
> 
> Yi-Chieh

	** You "frog in well", open your eye to the world.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:27669 talk.politics.china:1863
From: lix@yangtze.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china
Subject: Re: >> CSS in USA maybe become SCRAP HEAP in the future China
Date: 13 Oct 92 14:20:54 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.china
Organization: Boston University

In article <1992Oct13.041520.1008@news.Hawaii.Edu> wendong@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Wen-Dong Tang) writes:
>(deleted)
>>***********to help those poor kids in China to get basic education;
>>*********** .......
>
>As I know, some CSS donate money to the so-called Eduction Fund.

It is SOS China Education Fund, run by CSS ourselves.

>I don't, just because I believe the money I donate would not really go to those poor kids.

It is wise to be prudent, we earned our money not easily. SOS will try her
best to inform the every donator the name/address of the student who receives
his donation, and will ask the poor kid reports his/her scores (if the donation
is much higher than the needed postage). Well, we will try our best to make
sure donation to reach the hands of those poor kids. Even though, we still
can't guarantee the government won't grab that money from kids' hands, nor his/her
father will not use it to gamble. That is beyond our capability. Though, after we
tried, we will be qualified to make ourselves feel in peace, feel less guilty,
you know, only a few dollars, that is already a good bargain.

>Donation fo the flood was an example, you can read the reports by the Taiwanese journalists, if you do not know.

Sorry to learn that. Where did you donate? I think the CSS in Purdue,
SUNY Baffalo, St. Louis area, etc., did vary reliable work. That is why I
trust those CSS like Shi WenYuan, Luan ShuSheng, etc. this time. A few
SCC netters, Steve Lin, James Ou (without my lecture, thanks) have donated,
another netter has promised to donate the difference of lawyer fees for
GreenCard between a Group A and a Group B CSS. I'll take personally
responsibility to make sure their money is not abused. If they need my
personal data for later possible legal case, please email me. You are welcome
to do so also.

-- 
The SOS China Education Fund is a non-political, non-profit and independent
organization to raise money promoting the education in rural China. All donations
are tax-deductable. Make checks or money orders payable to: "SOS China Education
Fund"; c/o Jie KANG, 2610 E. 5th Pl, Apt. 1, Tulsa, OK74104, USA.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: echeng@phys.psu.edu (Eddie Cheng)
Subject: Re: Once again, please join me
Organization: Penn State, Department of Physics
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 01:23:23 GMT

In article <98227@bu.edu> lix@doc.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li) writes:
>of people. Well, Eddie's question about morality makes much more sense.

	Thanks.  :-)

>Though I don't agree with him completely. 

	Of course.  Nobody would agree with anybody else completely.  :-)
For me it would be much worse.  :-(

>whether they are moral, they are polititians. 
>The problem, as Eddie asked, is whether
>it is moral for me to take the this advantage.

	Well, actually I raised *two* moral questions and you picked the 
(relatively) minor one.  :-)  The major question I have been challenging
is if it is moral to tell lies or half-truths and mislead US public
for this bill.

>On one hand, as I argued to Scott, I think it is OK, so far I did 
>nothing to deepen "Guo Nan", I did not kill, and I neither lied. 

	OK, so you were not involved in the major question, fine.  :-)
 
>GuoNanCai cames naturally and why I should refuse to accept?
>On the other hand, well, if I accepted such GuoNanCai, having kept silence 
>when killing and lying happened, there might be something regretable also. 
>I don't know.  

	Well, *I* will.  But I agree that this is more of a personal thing,
i.e. personal feeling and judgement.  It is up to everybody.

>Maybe Shannon and Eddie can help. Let me put it in this way, assuming you both
>haven't got greencard yet. And you don't need this bill to get greencard. But,
>assuming now the layer fee is only houndreds instead of thousands. My question,
>whether you two think this is also a kind of FGNC?

	Sorry I don't quite understand your question.  Why does it make a 
difference on how much lawyer fee is?

>I'm not arguing with you two, but really QinJiao. I came before 4-11, but my
>family came after that. So I really hesitate whether I should accept this GNC.
>If I refuse, I'll take away my family members' chance, it is somewhat unfair
>to them, I am affraid.

	If I understand you correctly, you are saying the dilemma is if you
refuse the bill and take the normal channel to get a green card, you end
up consuming the quota of normal channel which you could have saved for
later comers?

	Well, as I see it, the two "evils" have significant levels of 
"evil-ity", so to speak.

	I think that a mutual friend of us had once asked a good question:
"What would you be doing if there had not been 6.4?"



	 Eddie
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: usenet@news.acns.nwu.edu (Usenet on news.acns)
Subject: Re: Be a honest beggar!
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois, USA
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 15:44:00 GMT

In article <Bw6nD9.4uG@nic.umass.edu> usys@titan.ucc.umass.edu (CLARENCE J  
MAZIARZ JR) writes:
> 
> >Why do you call them blood-carders? Does this mean that CCP has the right
> >to kill 
> 
>     CCP has no right to kill innocent people. They did, they committed
>     atrocities.
> 
> >and CSS have no right to protect themseves? 
> 
>     Of course you have, who says you can not have?
>     But do not "protect" youself by cheating.
>     You decide where you want to stay. Actually, who cares. It seems you
>     think China can not do without you. Still dreaming? Have not you
>     realize what you are now? You know it, I don't bother telling you.
> 
>     It seems there are so many Pan Jinlian's on net recently. They beg Xi 
>     MenQing for ..., saying their Wu DaLang would kill them if they go back 
>     home. After their Xi MenQing's offer them shelter, they even say 
>     congrtulations to each other.
> 

Ok, Mr. Please tell me is CG as kind, vulnerable and honest as Wu Dalang? Had  
Wu Dalong ever wanted to kill Pan Jinlian? The fact is CG has already killed  
its people. If you want to use analogy, use some better one.

Carl