HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: altizer@figaro (Robert Altizer)
Subject: NEED HELP: Converting catches to 2 voices
Reply-To: altizer@chdasic.sps.mot.com
Organization: Motorola SPS
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 17:00:28 GMT

My madrigal quartet has gotten several jobs at which we plan to do some of
the bawdy (and otherwise) catches from "The Catch Book" (Oxford U Press).
Now we find that two of the singers can't make some of the dates and we're
left with two voices, soprano and bass, to cover the gigs!

Can anyone offer advice on converting catches written for three or four
voices to two, or suggest alternate sources of material?  We'll learn new
pieces if needs be to fill our 20-30 minute sets, and have until mid-February
before the first performance date.

Thanks in advance, and happy holidays!
Bob

---
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------#
# Robert Altizer - Motorola ASIC SQA          altizer@chdasic.sps.mot.com #
# 1300 North Alma School Road, M/S CH240                     R10908@email #
# Chandler AZ 85224-8517 USA                (602) 821-4249(v)/821-4167(f) #
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Newsgroups: rec.music.early
From: ketil@edb.tih.no (Ketil Albertsen,TIH)
Subject: Copyright (Was: standard representation of music)
Reply-To: ketil@edb.tih.no
Organization: T I H / T I S I P 
Posting-Front-End: Winix Conference v 92.05.15  1.20 (running under MS-Windows)
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 09:28:36 GMT

In article <de19-161292195121@mac19-pg2.umd.edu>, de19@umail.umd.edu (Dana S Emery) writes:

>[...] The music itself is old enough to be out of
>copyright, but the printed score as published by, say, Dover, is definatly
>under copyright protection. 

Do you have any idea of what that copyright covers? That is, can they
copyright the "logical" contents - the parts, dynamic variations etc. -
or only the typographical layout of this?
 
If I buy a single printed copy of a published score and manually type 
it into my music editor, then print it out on my printer - may I 
distribute this printout freely? It will have a different layout, 
different line lengths and weights, different text fonts for the 
lyrics, maybe some interpretation hints are added and others removed, 
but it will all be *based* on the copyrighted score.

(Why I would care to do the work of entering it? (1) To print it in
mammoth size, high quality, (2) to remove those parts that are just
disturbing and space consuming when you need a mammoth size, (3) to
have parts of it played automatically on my keyboard, for learning
the music by ear or as a surrogate orchestra)
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Berlin Musikinstrumenten Addresse
From: 00hcpence@BSUVAX1.BITNET
Date: 14 Dec 1992 23:59:00 -0500 (EST)
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

        Thanks to all who wrote. New address is:
 
                Musikinstrumenten Museum (bei Philharmonie)
                D-1000 Berlin
                Tiergartenstrasse 1
                Deutschland
 
        My work is on a computer database for extant precursors of the
bassoon and also early jointed bassoons to c. 1750. In addition to European
resources, I've been trying to contact people in Latin & South America. From
iconographic evidence, plus a few personal contacts, it seems highly probable
that the Spanish Envoys brought dulzians to the New World.But, so far, I've
not had much luck in getting responses from the Southern Hemisphere!. I
would certainly appreciate hearing from any of you who know of these early
instruments. The list includes: Dulzians (aka curtals, chorist-fagotts),
racketts, etc. Regards to you all!
 
Homer Pence, Professor in Musicology
Ball State University
School of Music-Box 32'
Muncie, IN 47306 - USA'
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
From: allyn@milton.u.washington.edu (Allyn Weaks)
Subject: Re: sheet music storage
Summary: MIDI isn't a decent score representation
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 21:17:18 GMT

From: mike@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Mike W. Burger) writes:
>        There is a somewhat standard representation for sheet
>music.  There are several standard MIDI file formats that can
>be loaded into various scoring packages and multi-purpose
>MIDI (Musical Instrument Digital Interface) packages.

MIDI has bad problems for representing scores - they are extrememly
ambiguous.

1) MIDI stores "note number" on a keyboard, not the name of the note
played, so there is no information about enharmonic equivalents.  

2) MIDI stores the duration of a note as a time, rather than as a note
value, forcing you to use a simple time signature (often inappropriate for
early music, and MIDI doesn't allow all possible signatures, anyway) to be
able to calculate the note value.  And that timing has to be very precise
if you want to differentiate between a real eighth note that wasn't held
quite long enough, and triplet sixteenths where the note is held for 2/3 of
the triplet, and the third part is a rest. 

3) There's no way to represent markings such as slurs, ligature marks,
text, repeats, beaming, etc.

I use Concertware+MIDI on the Mac for bulk note entry because I like the
interface, then  transfer the data via MIDI files to Finale to generate a
score for printing.  I always have to do LOTS of cleanup of accidentals,
durations, odd beaming, etc.  It's worth the file transfer because I'd have
to do the exact same cleanup if I entered things directly into Finale via
the MIDI keyboard. (And the Finale step time entry and error correction
sucks..)

I think the real answer is to either do things graphically or ascii based
for now, and patiently wait for SMDL (Standard Music Definition Language?)
in the long run.  I'd much rather wait a couple of more years for a good
standard (that will actually be standard) than rush into one that's badly
designed and will likely fall by the wayside after a short time.

Allyn Weaks
allyn@milton.u.washington.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: Computers/Chant Notation
From: 00hcpence@BSUVAX1.BITNET
Date: 11 Dec 1992 16:44:00 -0500 (EST)
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

For Gordon Nixon, University of Toronto:
 
        Try Eleanor Selfridge-Field at XB.L36@Stanford.Bitnet. That's where
"Computing in Musicology" is published as part of the Center for Computer
Assisted Research in the Humanities. Good Luck. Let us know if you find
such a program for DOS.
 
Homer Pence, Professor of Musicology
Ball State University
School of Music, Box 32
Muncie, IN 47306
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
Subject: RE: gut strings
From: Cindi Roden <RODEN@GUVM.BITNET>
Date: 14 Dec 1992 08:03:45 -0500 (EST)
In-reply-to: Message of Sat,12 Dec 1992 02:12:39 GMT from <knotts@HPL-OPUS.HPL.HP.COM>
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Tom Knotts,
I believe it is lamb but am not 100% positive.  It is definitely NOT
cat gut, regardless of the fact that people call it that.
Newsgroups: rec.music.early
From: ketil@edb.tih.no (Ketil Albertsen,TIH)
Subject: Re: standard representation of music 
Reply-To: ketil@edb.tih.no
Organization: T I H / T I S I P 
Posting-Front-End: Winix Conference v 92.05.15  1.20 (running under MS-Windows)
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 10:27:08 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.001623.26403@news.cs.brandeis.edu>, jacob@max.cc.brandeis.edu ( ) writes:

>> I don't know if there is a standard way of representing
>>music, so I have my doubts that there is much to find.
>
>curiously i've asked about standard music representations only a few
>weeks ago on comp.music and a few standards groups...
>
>from what i got there's only one, it's an ansi standard in the making
>(as been for quite some time) is called smdl and is far from ready...

I've been playing around (oops..unintentional pun) with my own extension
to the ODA document standard: A new content architecture for sheet music,
for about a year now. (You guessed it - it IS a hobby project)
Before starting out around, I searched for standards and found none
(I didn't hear about smdl then, and haven't heard of it other places
either, so if jacob@... could provide a reference, I would be happy!)

During my Christmas vacation, I will be starting out the implementation 
of this "private standard", and I suppose experience will provoke a 
lot of adjustments to the grammar.

Now: Are there anyone out there that can read ASN.1 definitions, and
preferably know the ODA standard (T.400/IS8613), who would like to
get into a discussion on this topic? I suspect that the technical
details will bore other readers of r.m.e, so we probably should
restrict the discussion to mail messages. 

Please report interrest in this subject to ketil@edb.tih.no.

Ketil Albertsen
Organization: Johannes Kepler University Linz - Computing Center
Date: Friday, 18 Dec 1992 16:13:07 CET
From: <K317370@ALIJKU11.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Re: Toothpaste?!

re the toothpaste thing

you have to use gel toothpaste, i used the blue stuff to
get rid of a huge scratch in a cd, and it worked well

of course you cant use normal toothpaste, it will scratch
the cd more (duhhh|)

tim
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: rodean@fc.hp.com (Bruce Rodean)
Subject: Re: Noteworthy, again!
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 05:27:45 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Fort Collins, CO
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.8 PL6]

Evan Cheng (evan@top.cis.syr.edu) wrote:
> Just two more questions about Noteworthy!
> 
> 	1. Do they carry CDs from small classical distributers like
> 	   Delos, Dorian, Harmonia Mundi, Reference Recording,
> 	   BIS, Sheffield Lab, Chesky, and etc? What are their prices
> 	   like?

No.  They carry the Polygram family (DG, Archiv, Phillips, London,
etc.), EMI/Angel, CBS/Sony and Telarc.  They do not carry *everything*
in each catalog also; in fact it's somewhat limited.  If they do have
it, it is a good price.

> 	2. How does Noteworthy's price stacks up against CD Connection?
> 	   Would someone gives me an example or two (oh, please)?

Can't help you here since I've never ordered from CD Connection.

--
Bruce Rodean                          Hewlett-Packard Company
rodean@fc.hp.com
From: gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor)
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Re: Box Set Mania
Date: 15 Dec 92 04:00:40 GMT
Reply-To: gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor)
Organization: Heurikon Corporation, Madison, WI

as232@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Michael Lerner) writes:
>It seems like an endless spiral.  I was looking at 3 of the latest installments
>of "let's make some money by repackaging old material", namely Fleetwood Mac,
>Journey, and Queen. 

You poor man. Sure, someone screwed up bigtime by not digging through
the vaults for some PRE-b'nicks Mac because they figured that none of
America's youth were interested in the old blues band or even that
conflagration with Bobby Welch. But cheer up. Box Mania gave us the
new Aretha *and* the G*dlike B.B. King set. I consider the Journey,
FM and Queen retreads more than a worthy price to bear to hear Lady
Soul and Lucille sing on CD. And hey - the second Bobby Dylan set is
coming, to say nothing of some jazz that'll knock your socks off.
Although it may humour some long-time net readers to hear me sound like
the usual Usenet exclusivist nerd, just buy the darned B.B. King set
and draw yourself a hot bath and crack out that bottle of Johnny
Walker red and pour yourself 5 fingers and put it on and turn it up
and learn what *real* music is [note. Heavy dose of irony and comedy
here, but the King stuff *rules*. Seriously.]

Oh yeah. The Olivier Messaien set on Erato shreds, too.

Have a nice day, consumers. The thrill isn't gone, after all.
--
The law moves quickly in the rain/and chokes the world with memorials./The
courts accept the lowest superstition/into evidence. And we embrace quickly in
the rain,/conceiving a hale infant with hands to wrinkle/the bedsheets toward
it, wave by trough by wave./Gregory Taylor/Heurikon /Madison, WI/608-828-3385
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: reich@winx06.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de (Stefan Reich)
Subject: wanted: Defunkt CD
Organization: University of Wuerzburg, Germany
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 10:53:10 GMT


Hi!

I am a fan of DEFUNKT from New York City! I'am lookin for a CD called
"Thermonuclear Sweat" for about two years now. The record company Hannibal
Records doesn't sell it anymore.

WHO WANTS TO SELL HIS COPY? PLEASE!

Stefan reich@winx06.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de

Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: LCLAYHILLS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Leif Clayhills Mate)
Subject: Re: NEVERMIND's 13th track??
Organization: Abo Akademi University, Finland
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 09:47:42 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

In <1992Dec16.170039.14278@cs.nott.ac.uk> pcxkrm@unicorn.nott.ac.uk writes:

> In article <1gh9r7INNqoc@mozz.unh.edu> jsl@kepler.unh.edu (Chau) writes:
> >
> >TThe Nirvana CD's with the 13th track are the ones that are rare.  It was  
> >something like one in very seven had the extra track of 'garbage'.  They
> >CD's that have been recently in the stores do not have the extra track.  It
> >was only released a the first hundred thousand or so albums that were first
> >released.  From what i here.. the extra tracked albums should be worth more
> >in the long run.  When buying the album there is NO way to tell which one
> >has the extra track.  I guess it is a stroke of luck.
> >
> >
>  {sig deleted}
> 
> I bought my CD a couple of months (or maybe more) after it came out -
> (in the UK that is), but everyone I know with a copy has the extra
> track, so I don't think they can be that rare. Maybe it's just some US
> versions that don't have it? There was actually an article in Q a few
> months back that mentioned it and it's name, but I don't have that to
> hand right now. I'm fairly sure they implied that it was a standard
> track.
> 
  {another sig deleted}

well...when i bought it couple of months ago - I had to run in 3 different
record shops (checking every CD they got) before I found 1 with the extra 
track. 2 easiest ways to recognize it : a) display total playtime of the cd
4*.** mins and it's w/o, 5*.** mins and it has it. b) look at the play-side
of CD - You can easily see the 10 min silence period on it. ... And Yes it's
called : Endless Nameless ... well that's all for today :)

  Leif.
Organization: University of Central Florida--Computer Services
Date: Friday, 11 Dec 1992 13:53:51 EST
From: <ACCOUNTS@UCF1VM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Re: YES discography

There is a pretty nice one already.  You can ftp it from cs.uwp.edu.

Jim Ennis
From: as232@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Michael Lerner)
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Re: Noteworthy
Date: 14 Dec 1992 21:16:50 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


I'm not sure why people want to use Noteworthy on Compuserve or GENie or
whatever.  The whole idea of NW is to lower prices, but if you spend money
on the connection rates of CIS you are actually raising the total cost of the
CD to you.  Why bother, when you can call NW's 800 number to order for free?
I have the same reservations about NW's new online modem service.  There is
some kind of 1 time charge for the software, but, IMHO this fee must be
figured in along with S&H to raise the total cost of CD's through the roof.

Mike
--
From: as232@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Michael Lerner)
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Box Set Mania
Date: 14 Dec 1992 21:26:10 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


It seems like an endless spiral.  I was looking at 3 of the latest installments
of "let's make some money by repackaging old material", namely Fleetwood Mac,
Journey, and Queen.  In regards to Mac, I feel like I have all their best songs
from the Greatest Hits (With the exception of 1 or 2 tracks off Rumours).
Journey, I'm missing about 3 great songs from their albums, on their old
Greatest Hits, but I feel like I have more than enough.  The Queen latest
release is perhaps the biggest rip-off in the history of box-sets.  What
it appears to be (Correct me if I'm wrong) is 3 discs, 2 of which are
previously released *GREATEST HITS* CD's.  Fans who have those 2 Grt. Hits 
CD's should be very wary of this set, it looked like the exact same sets to
me.  The third disc being an interview with the band (I can get that on VH1's
documentary which airs about twice a month).

I haven't seen the Floyd set yet (Maybe it was sold out?), so I won't go into
that one...

Buyer Beware!
Mike
-- 
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: rojohnso@libws3.ic.sunysb.edu (Ronald Johnson)
Subject: Re: Toothpaste?!
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:46:21 GMT

In article <92353.161307K317370@ALIJKU11.BITNET> <K317370@ALIJKU11.BITNET> writes:
>re the toothpaste thing
>
>you have to use gel toothpaste,
>
>of course you cant use normal toothpaste, it will scratch
>the cd more

Isnt it a bit presumptuous to just assume that we would know they meant gel
toothpaste? Maybe the original post should have been more detailed.

>(duhhh|)
>
>tim

Was that necessary?? Were all here learning from eachother...Grow up

                                                                   RJ
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: 2038am@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (That Guy)
Subject: Re: BMG & Columbia Alternatives
Organization: George Mason University, Fairfax, Va.
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 20:21:58 GMT



could somebody please E-mail me the contact info for Noteworthy?

thanx in advance.

-Andy

Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: dap@portal.vpharm.com (David A. Pearlman)
Subject: Re: Tarzan Boy by Baltimora - Where?
Organization: Vertex Pharmaceuticals, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:07:26 GMT

In article <1992Dec8.052726.19278@urbana.mcd.mot.com> mbraun@urbana.mcd.mot.com (Matthew Braun) writes:
>ac@apple.com (Allen Cecil) writes: 	
>>Anyone know what year and on what label the song "Tarzan Boy" by the
>>group Baltimora (sp?) was released.
> It was originally released on the 1985 album/EP, "Living in the Background"
>on Manhattan Records (a division of Capitol Records, a.k.a EMI outside of
>the US.)  The catalog number is SQ-53020.  The record's cover says "Also
>Available On Cassette".  I don't recall of ever hearing of this critter
>appearing on CD or in any collections.

This material was later reissued, with one track remixed, the single
version of "Tarzan Boy" and two additional tracks (making a full album):

Living In the Background
Manhatten ST-53026 (c) 1986

Side 1:
1) Tarzan Boy (single version)
2) Living in the Background (remix)
3) The Jukeboy Boy
4) Pull the Wires

5) Woody Boogie
6) Chinese Restaurant
7) Running for your Love
8) Up With Baltimora

Versions of side 1 tracks 1,2,4, and side 2 tracks 1-3 appeared on the
EP mentioned above. I doubt it was released on CD in the US.


dap
-- 
=============================================================================
    David A. Pearlman

Vertex Pharmaceuticals Inc.                     email: dap@vpharm.com
From: hhtra@usho72.hou281.chevron.com (T.M.Haddock)
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Re: NEVERMIND's 13th track??
Date: 17 Dec 92 16:44:26 GMT
Organization: Chevron


 Many wrote:
|>>> The Nirvana CD's with the 13th track are the ones that are rare.

 Others wrote:
|>> I heard it was the one's without the 13th track that are rare.

 Leif writes:
|> well...when i bought it couple of months ago - I had to run in 3 different
|> record shops (checking every CD they got) before I found 1 with the extra 
|> track. 2 easiest ways to recognize it : a) display total playtime of the cd
|> 4*.** mins and it's w/o, 5*.** mins and it has it. b) look at the play-side
|> of CD - You can easily see the 10 min silence period on it. ... And Yes it's
|> called : Endless Nameless 

 Well, the best bet is to go back and buy BOTH and put them away.
 That way you've covered all the bases.   :)

 TRAVIS

 PS - Mine has the 13th track.
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: fleckens@plains.NoDak.edu (Clint Fleckenstein)
Subject: Re: FYI: The Compact Disc Connection service
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1992 06:24:20 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: North Dakota Higher Ed Computing Network

In article <1992Dec18.184643.13220@cbfsb.cb.att.com> corwin@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (carl.w.smedberg) writes:
>
>
>Just a friendly warning if you place an order from CDC. I placed
>an order 13 days ago and haven't see anything yet.

I've ordered with these guys a lot.  It takes a while to get them
here because they don't stock the stuff and get it from distributors.

I must say I've been more than happy with my orders.  I have never
had an order turned down for availability reasons, and I usually get
my stuff in two weeks on the dot.

>Are you happy with this kind of service? 

I'm sure happy with the prices!

>If enough people are unhappy I'll let CDC know about it!

Count me out...I like 'em.  Give them a chance before you put them
down on the net.  Retailers in ND don't stock much, and charge a
pretty high price for what they do stock; CDC is just what I need,
in most cases.

Clint Fleckenstein, satisfied customer
 __________________________________________________________________________
 Clint Fleckenstein   <fleckens@plains.nodak.edu> <fleckens@NDSUVM1.BITNET>
 Master Control/Operations, KFYR TV 5/KQCD TV 7/KUMV TV 8      .5k EX Pilot  
 My login and conduct don't belong to Meyer Broadcasting.         DoD #5150  
 If Hell freezes over I'll snowboard there too!   "Tighten your sphincter!"
Organization: Universit de Sherbrooke
Date: Friday, 11 Dec 1992 15:13:08 EST
From: <LDAA@UDESVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
Subject: Bizarre cd's

(1) Some of my italian RCA cd's (for example, Pierrot Lunaire) have
become discolored, their gold tint becoming brownish and I can read
the label through the other side. They play well though. Are they in
the process of disintegrating?

(2) I received a few weeks ago a cd from the group Laser which is
transparent: I could read what is typed on my computer screen
through it. Normal?

-Pierre Blackburn
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: brody@eos.arc.nasa.gov (Adam R. Brody )
Subject: Good service from BMG!
Summary: Good Service from BMG!
Keywords: BMG, service
Organization: NASA Ames Research Center
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 16:59:17 GMT

In BMG's last buy 1 get 2 free sale I entered 3 boxed sets on the
order form.  I knew this would be questionable but I got an OK
over the phone before I ordered.  The sets came and sure enough, they
wanted money for each of them.  I called them this morning and they
said that the savings were already built in to the prices so that
I couldn't do a buy 1 get2.  However, since I was given the OK over the
phone, they would oblige me and send me a new bill.  I won't open any
of them until I get the bill just in case!
Newsgroups: rec.music.cd
From: corwin@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (carl.w.smedberg)
Subject: Re: FYI: The Compact Disc Connection service
Summary: Compact Disc Connection
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:46:43 GMT



Just a friendly warning if you place an order from CDC. I placed
an order 13 days ago and haven't see anything yet. I'd have
to say that I'm dissapointed. It shouldn't take more than a
week to ship a package via UPS ground from the west coast to 
the Illinois, let alone 5 more days to pick 5 CDs off the shelf
and package them! Maybe I've been spoiled by the overnight delivery
provided by MACconnection. Even if I wanted 2nd day air, they
still indicated it could take a week to pack the order!

Are you happy with this kind of service? 

If enough people are unhappy I'll let CDC know about it!

Carl Smedberg
att!ihlpm!corwin