From: kieran@cmatter.physics.indiana.edu (kieran)
Subject: Re: SANDMAN: Lucifer's name and the end of Season of Mists
Organization: Indiana University
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 92 19:00:44 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.203827.14703@eskimo.celestial.com> alpinist@eskimo.celestial.com (David Butler) writes:
>>>In article <REUS.92Mar23165135@klein.euromath.dk>, reus@klein.euromath.dk (Jens Peter Reus Christensen) writes:
>>>
>>>|>Last night I was reading issue 22 of _The Sandman_, and I came across a part
>>>|>where Morpheus said that Lucifer was also called Samael when he was still an
>>>|>angel.  I have never heard the name Samael before and was wondering if this
>>>|>referance can be found in the bible.  Anyone who knows, either post the 
>>>|>answer
>
>     The term Samael means "Blind God" and can be found in the Gnostic
>versions of Genesis (which are most likely to be the origional version)
>I would recommend reading the "Nag Hammadi Library" for references. 
>Anyway, the story goes that the ranting jealous angry being lording over
>the garden of Eden was not the true origional creator and spirit of love
>but a defective created being.  When he made the statement "I am a
>jealous God, there are no other Gods beside me" a voice came from above,
>"you are mistaken, Samael".

    Ummm... I think that you are a bit off here.  Gnosticism as a strong
syncretic tradition postdates the birth of Christ (or is contemporaneous
with it). 

    Moreover, I believe that "Samael" means "The poison one"  in Hebrew,
or sometimes "the angel of death".  I can't cite you the source yet - I'll
get my hands on it this weekend.  It is almost certainly Hebrew.

    The whole role of Satan/Shaitan is quite interesting - the original
translation (I believe) was "the accuser" who brings up the charges to
the council of God.  It makes me think of secret police, but that is a
*definite* anachronism.  The Haggadah tells the story that Satan refused
to prostrate himself at the feet of Adam and Eve, because of his own pride.
He led a rebellion because he felt that the angels were superior to mere
humans.  But the earliest reference I have to that is around 300 CE (this
is *not* a definitive reference).

     Again a call:  does anyone have a *hard* reference that states the 
date of origin of the rebellion of the angels story?  I've heard vague
references to Sumerian myths;  when did it become a part of Biblical 
tradition?

>      It is mostly likely the contradictions between the origional
>version of Genesis and the one that is accepted today is why Israel has
>not released the Dead Sea Scrolls for translation.

      Whoa!  This is pretty shaky ground.  Even if they differed, the
Dead Sea scrolls are from a particular sect and need not be canonical.

      To return to comics:  what do you think of the ending of Seasons
of Mists?  I find it very ambiguous, in an unsatisfactory way.  I'm not
sure what Gaiman is really trying to say.  Is God really unjust in his
view?  Or did Remiel effectively rebel?  If so, is this how we can under-
stand the cruelty of his torturing out of love?  (In effect Gaimain is
saying:  the new hell is paved with good intentions, but they are no
better than the old?)

                   Kieran Mullen
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc