From: rwr@uiscpt.aztec.co.za (Richard Ramsden)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african,sanet.talk.politics,apc.reg.safrica
Subject: Re: The ANC and the SACP
Date: 31 Aug 92 10:44:38 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.african
Organization: Unix Information Systems (Pty) Ltd (UIS)
Disclaimer: #include <disclaimer.h>


gavan@elc.mth.uct.ac.za (Gavan Tredoux) in
<1992Aug18.112312.28056@ucthpx.uct.ac.za> writes:


>lkk@panix.com (Larry Kolodney) writes:
>[ANC and its ethnic basis]
>


... [ stuff deleted ] ...


>
>: And you readily admit that the ANC does not have a racialist or
>: tribalist agenda (in fact that was the entire basis of their split
>: with the PAC).  So what's your point?
>
>You misunderstand me. They don't mobilize explicitly on the basis
>of Xhosa ethnicity, and they try to make out some sort of non-racial
>appeal. But they're Xhosa dominated, at the highest levels, and that's


Gavan: What is the source of your assertion "...[The ANC is] Xhosa dominated,
         at the highest levels ..."?
       Can you prove this?
       How would you rate the local support in rural areas country-wide?


>one of the reasons why in the context of the violence on the Reef,
>they find themselves on the side of Xhosa vs. Zulu, and do so because
>that is the perception on the ground. That's extremely important,


Recent research has shown that the vast majority of Black people view
the conflict as ANC vs Inkata and _not_ Xhosa vs Zulu.


Again what is the source of your assertion?


>and will probably become critical in the future. As for their
>non-racialism, that's pure fantasy. When Mandela refers to *our*
>people, we all know how to resolve the reference. The ANC is and
>always has been a black party, and that is reflected in its support,


It has a few white MPs, and some "white" intellectual support.  What role
do you think these people will play?


>which is a rather better guide to its ethnic/racial role than its
>policy documents - documents which nobody has read anyway. The split
>with the PAC doesn't affect this one iota.
>
>: Gavan, maybe they're really a class based party.  After all, they have
>: virtually no support among the economic elites of SA either.  Or could
>: it be that there's just a slight correlation between skin color and
>: economic interests?
>
>That's quite wrong. There is no class profile in their support,
>and they have never, nor will they conceivably, attract white class
>based support. That's why our politics is ethnically based. 
>Examining black elites one finds what is really the core of the
>ANC's leadership, and the principal movers in its history. Correlation
>between phenotype and economic interest misses the wood for the trees,
>not to mention the lack of any viable cross-ethnic coalition of class
>interest. Think of it this way: they're an ethnic organization 
>pursuing, among other things, the economic and material interests
>of their supporters. They also pursue
>rather more important interests, like *status*, especially ethnic
>and racial status.
>
>Why is this important? Because it could lead to the capture of the state
>by partisan ethnic interests, leading to an irreparable tear in


But I really can't see that kind of ethinicity playing *such* a dominant
role here *if* a Codesa reaches a settlement, and elections are a success.


Capture of the State?  Sounds too paranoid.


>the social fabric of the kind now witnessed in Yugoslavia and Northern
>Ireland. Nothing is more important here politically.
>


What about the other economic issues?  What scenarios do you foresee?


>Gavan Tredoux
>UCT
>
>


Richard Ramsden


Newsgroups: soc.culture.african