HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ooblick@intercon.com (Mikki Barry)
Subject: Re: God's Family Values
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 92 15:21:30 GMT
Reply-To: ooblick@intercon.com (Mikki Barry)
Organization: InterCon Systems Corporation, Herndon, VA

In article <1992Aug14.170244.23308@pony.Ingres.COM>, dan@Ingres.COM (Daniel 
J. Dick) writes:
> However, we need not expect the existance or judgements or character of God
> to turn upon our beliefs as if the tail wags the dog.  And, just as the Lord
> holds the Christian accountable, He holds the non-christian responsible, 
too.
> That is why the scripture says clearly that the fear of the Lord is the
> beginning of wisdom.

This is the exact thing I am talking about.  The statement that the xtian god 
holds others responsible can easily be taken by non xtians to say that 
xtianity is truth and no matter what else we believe, we'll have to answer to 
the xtian god.  And the only basis for this that can be given is the bible.

Understand what a slap in the face this is for anyone who doesn't believe the 
same way you do.  I will certainly not teach my daughter this sort of 
arrogant nonsense.

 


Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: carnes@ico.isc.com (Steve Carnes)
Subject: Re: Question about Encyclopedias
Organization: Interactive Systems Corp., Boulder CO
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 20:09:52 GMT

>Do any of you have suggestions on this (something that mommy and daddy could
>read through from volume to volume to a very young child)?  Our thoughts are
>that since children learn very quickly at a very early stage, we would like
>to make sure that we provide our child with the best beginning.

My suggestion would be to watch "Parenthood" with Steve Martin et al,
concentrating on the flashcards scenes.  Then wait until the kid is 4 or 5 and
taking an interest in things outside himself and his immediate surroundings,
and at that point, buy a good encyclopedia and atlas.  
-- 
Steve Carnes       carnes@ico.isc.com        uucp: {ncar,nbires}!ico!carnes
   "Rock gives reality to the otherwise abstract notion of transhuman
    time." - Edward Abbey
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: betsyp@apollo.hp.com (Betsy Perry)
Subject: Re: Waterbeds
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 13:26:23 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

In article <1992Aug18.175625.25958@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom) writes:
>
>Another possible danger, still being debated, is the danger to a young child,
>and a deleveloping fetus if you use a heater. The EMF may be dangerous. Experts
>(and the net) havent yet agreed, but I wouldnt take the chance. Same goes
>with electric blankets.

This one's easy to fix, as misc.kids pointed out to me.  You can attach
a timer to the heater so that it's only on when you're not in the
bed (in my case, between 8 A.M. and 8 P.M.)  So, whether the EMF is dangerous
or not, you're not exposed to it.  Waterbeds retain heat well enough that
you're cosy all night, even with the heater off.

I reiterate everybody's warning that infants should NOT be left unattended
on waterbeds.   (Except for "crib waterbeds", which are designed to avoid
this problem.) 
-- 
Betsy Hanes Perry   (note P in userid)     betsyp@apollo.hp.com
Hewlett-Packard Company
"It seems to us that the readers who want fiction to be like life are
considerably outnumbered by those who would like life to be like fiction."
From: bsmith@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (ROBERT SMITH)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Stupid potty training question
Date: 20 Aug 92 17:46:50 GMT
Reply-To: bsmith@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (ROBERT SMITH)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Stakeholder Relations, NCR Corp in Dayton,OH

In article <1265@ceylon.gte.com> vrs0@bunny.gte.com (V. Stern) writes:
>I know this is a stupid question, but I haven't seen it addressed in any 
>magazine articles, etc., and people I've asked don't know either... When 
>potty training a boy (we're talking urinating here) are they trained to go 
>sitting down or standing?  One friend says it's a function of how much of 
>a mess you want to clean up (hers hasn't gone through it yet, though).  
>Another friend's little boy was trained sitting down and came home from 
>preschool one day with the great revelation that the other little boys 
>peed standing up ("You know what mommy?!") :)
>
>Vanessa R. Stern
>vrs0@bunny.gte.com

Well, we're going through this now with our son (2.75 YO -- you know how boys
are).  I feel that sitting down is the better approach because:

        o You don't have to worry about his aim
        o He is easily distracted, which affects aim
        o When he says, "I have to go potty" you don't need to figure out
          which one
        o He only needs to learn one action -- sitting down
        o Sitting down on the potty for a period of time is an accomplishment
          by itself when starting training
        o It is consistent with what Mommy does, and he learns by watching

The disadvantages, I guess, are

        o He has to learn another way later, but he has seen me do it 
          standing up
        o I try to go sitting down if he's watching 

But having one child certainly does not an expert make.
-- 
E-mail => Robert.D.Smith@daytonoh.ncr.com (Bob Smith)
          NCR Investor Relations/Stakeholder Relations
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: reid@metis.tti.com (Reid Kneeland)
Subject: Re: Paper vs Cloth? 
Organization: Transaction Technology Inc.
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 15:00:13 GMT

In article <1992Aug17.185152.4341@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom) writes:

>Thats what I had always thought, but I got tired of those expensive Nikkis
>wearing out, so I tried Dappis instead. They also wear out, but with Dappis
>it is the velcro that wears out and with Nikkis the fabric justs stops 
>holding in the moisture. Right after I threw out the last batch of leaky
>Nikkis, someone, (and I am pretty sure it was you, Reid) posted about some
>stuff you can use on Nikkis to restore their abilities. If it was you can
>you repeat it, and tell us where to get it?

I've been meaning to look this up for about a year now.  Sorry (and a
special apology to Tigger, whose mail I failed to respond to.  I just
turned it up in a search through my disturbingly large mailbox.)  The
stuff is called Z-Pel, it's made by DuPont, and I'll try to find the
ordering information (we ended up ordering it by phone, but you could
try a fabric store).  You just put the stuff in the washing machine
with the Nikkys and run it.  It doesn't last as long as the original
coating, but it beats buying new ones.

We always used regular laundry detergent to wash the Nikkys; they might
have lasted longer if we'd used something milder like Ivory Snow.  Has
anyone tried that?

>Anyway, Dappis are $6 and Nikkis are more then twice that.

Thanks.  I don't think I've ever seen Dappis, but I'll look for them
(Sarah's acquiring a younger sib in about five months).

=====================================================================
Reid Kneeland
reid@ttidca.tti.com  (that's MISTER reid@ttidca.tti.com to you!)
{philabs,psivax,pyramid,quad1,rdlvax,retix,rutgers}!ttidca!reid
Transaction Technology Inc., Santa Monica, CA, USA (310) 450-9111 x2499
The opinions expressed above do not necessarily etc etc...

Never trust a man who can count to 1,023 on his fingers.
From: dan@Ingres.COM (Daniel J. Dick)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: God's Family Values
Date: 17 Aug 92 17:22:52 GMT
Organization: Ingres, an ASK Company, Alameda CA 94501
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

ooblick@intercon.com (Mikki Barry) writes:
: . . .
: This is the exact thing I am talking about.  The statement that the xtian god 
: holds others responsible can easily be taken by non xtians to say that 
: xtianity is truth and no matter what else we believe, we'll have to answer to 
: the xtian god.  And the only basis for this that can be given is the bible.
: 
: Understand what a slap in the face this is for anyone who doesn't believe the 
: same way you do.  I will certainly not teach my daughter this sort of 
: arrogant nonsense.
: 

Mikki, you have correctly represented my views in your first paragraph, and
I appreciate you for doing so.  I'm sorry that you regard these views as
arrogant nonsense.  This is a serious charge and I don't feel that you've
made yourself clear at whom this charge is directed, whether it be toward
the God of our religion, toward those who looked on and chose to believe
it, or to those who you feel devised the religion.

As for me, I'll teach my children to hold tight to this "arrogant nonsense",
submit to the Lord, love the Lord and our fellow humans, and to pray for
you and your children so that they may too find this wonderful "arrogant
nonsense."
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: elonich@cbnewse.cb.att.com (diane.e.pedersen)
Subject: Re: Mischievous Child (3 YO)
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Naperville IL
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 18:06:21 GMT
Summary: saint/sinner

Another data point on the saint/sinner situation.  In my family,
I was the "saint" (excellent student, didn't get into trouble)
and my kid brother the "sinner" (underachiever, minor run-ins with the cops)
in our father's eyes.  (Mom was more equitable).   Although I played
my role to perfection, deep down I was very disturbed by our father's
favoritism of me.  After all, I loved my brother and realized he 
often got criticized and had his achievments ignored.  (For 
example, our dad valued math and science, which I excelled in
and my brother stunk in.  But he was gifted with history and
his reading ability, which my father never valued or complimented
him on).

Now we're both grown and my brother is still somewhat warped
from the lack of paternal support and I find I don't respect
my dad as much for what he did to my brother.
-- 
Diane Pedersen
AT&T Bell Laboratories
Naperville, Illinois
att!ihlpe!elonich
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: hyler@jaana.ast.saic.com (Buffy Hyler)
Subject: Re: Youngest Going To Kindergarten
Reply-To: hyler@jaana.ast.saic.com
Organization: SAIC
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 22:54:06 GMT

My son will be starting Kindergarden on Sept. 8th.  In his case he
is staying at his current pre-school that goes through kindergarden.

One thing that I know helped him tremendously was to be able to visit
the room he was going to be in and meet the teacher ahead of time.
Their kindergarden is very different from their preschool (where there
is very little academics, deliberately so).  So they set up a day when
all the pre-K kids who were going on to this kindergarden could go and
meet the teacher and see the materials that they would be using.  David
was *very* nervous about this and did not want to go.  But with a
little help and gentle pushing he went and had a wonderful time.  Now
all he can talk about is being in the new "real school" room where he
will start to learn about reading.  At this school the kindergardeners
are given special privilages (and responsibilities).  The one my son is
happy about is that they do not have naps...they have quiet time where
they are able to do quiet things of their own choice but must be quiet
so that the pre-school kids can nap.  They also get their own special
playground time when they are the only ones out.

I'm not sure about other kids, but mine has a very high need to know
*exactly* what is going to happen to him, no surprises.  I can't
protect him against all surprises in his life, but where I can I do try
to help prepare him on what to expect.

Anyway, check with your school and see if there is a possibility to 
schedule time to visit his exact classroom and get some one on one
time with his new teacher.  This will take away a lot of the concern
a child may have and let him start to get excited.

4 weeks and counting!!!



---
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Buffy Hyler (hyler@jaana.ast.saic.com)
SAIC, Campus Point
San Diego, California
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer)
Subject: Re: Walkers/Strollers for fast walkers/joggers
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 18:22:22 GMT

On 7 Aug 92 19:09:06 GMT, greg@gregm.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Greg Moritz) said:

Greg> I am looking for a device that one can use to push a couple of 50-lb
Greg> kids around at a fast clip.

Greg> Does anybody know of such a device that is sold locally or sold thru
Greg> a mail order house.

Greg> I would envision such a device would have relatively large wheels such
Greg> as bicycle or wheelchair - type wheels rather than the 3-5" units used
Greg> on strollers for more casual walking.

Greg> ... sitting around twiddling my thumbs waiting for a response ...

They're in the Right Start catalog and also available at Costco
(so try its equivalents; Pace, Price Club, Sam's Club, etc).

But if you want to try one before you buy, go spend some time at
Hilton Head, SC.  The bicycle shops rent them (and everything else
with wheels).  When you're not out jogging, you can play in or on the
ocean.  It's amazingly humid (I live in the California High Desert)
but it seems to be a real family place.

You can probably find them in any family-oriented resort area, if
South Carolina is too far away.
--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "A MiG at your six is better than no MiG at all."  Unknown US fighter pilot
From: avs20@ccc.amdahl.com (  134  Atul V Salgaonkar)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: 17 MonthOld Refusing Everything Except Breast-Milk
Date: 19 Aug 92 21:11:00 GMT
Reply-To: avs20@juts.ccc.amdahl.com (  134  Atul V Salgaonkar)
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA


For the last 2 days, our 17 month old son has been refusing any/all solids
and also cow's milk. Even some of his favorites are not accepted.
We would like to request suggestions, for *long term effectivity* so as
to meet our son's increasing nutritional needs without overly depending on
the decrasing supply of breast milk !!
All advice, comments and constructive criticism is welcomed.
Thank you; Sincerely, Atul (email: avs20\@juts.ccc.amdahl.com)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom)
Subject: Re: Breastfeeding problems
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 16:00:38 GMT

In article <VHsNPB3w164w@seaspray.welly.gen.nz> kerry@seaspray.welly.gen.nz (Kerry Dalley) writes:
>lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom) writes:
>
>When you say you were getting a blockage every Tuesday, it puts me in mind 
>of 'the mysterious white spot'.   Many women have noticed this, a blockage 
>that can be seen or felt at the nipple, of thick stringy whitish stuff, or a 
>hard little lump.  It is not known what causes it, but in her book 
>"Breastfeeding Matters"  Maureen Minchin suggests that it may be liked to 
>saturated fats in the diet, particularly if it happens on a regular basis.  
>A friend of mine used to get blocked ducts every Saturday, after having fish 
>and chips, fried in lard, for tea on Fridays.......


In my case I had a cleaning lady come in every tuesday. Before my son was 
born I would tidy up every monday night, then I would be in work when the 
cleaning lady came. After Jeffrey I would still need to tidy up, but it seemed 
harder (I dont know why ;-)). Then I would need to find somewhere to be, so 
I wouldnt be underfoot. Usually I would be at my moms. I figured it was the 
stress of cleaning the house. 
 
>Hope this posint is interesting.....kerry :-)

Thanks!

Laura Floom

>


Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: rice@cray.com (Jonathan Rice)
Subject: Re: Second Baby Thoughts ...
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:46:01 CDT

In article <1992Aug12.202549.24557@keps.kodak.com> mbb@keps.kodak.com (Maureen Busch) writes:

>Specifically, two
>daycare slots cost twice what one slot cost, so our expenses rose drastically

A point I overlooked, to be sure.

>Maybe it is easier for people who don't have any interests that require blocks
>of time to call their own.  I don't know since I am a person whose personal
>interests do require time alone.

You're the second one to bring this up in response to what I wrote.  I'm not
sure what particular phrase of mine might have triggered it.  I'll have to
scan the article for "robot dad" or some such keyword :o)

>We all do it, and most of us manage it quite well, but it is still a mental
>and emotional job we didn't have when we had only one child's needs to 
>consider.

But it is not "more than twice as hard," at the risk of repeating myself to
the point of being a nuisance (too late?).

>This sounds like the incredibly romantic viewpoint

Thank you for the compliment.

>of a parent who has had two relatively easy to deal with children.

To the extent that we've actually had some influence, thank you for the
compliment.

>to bet your daughters are even similar in personality and temperment

Tee hee!  Cash or check, I can't take plastic. :o)

> What some of us have acknowledged is that the impact of a
>second child on our lives as we know it has been non-trivial.

As so often, it comes down to differences of experience.  I'll reply to the
more personal aspects of your article via mail.

-- 
Jonathan C. Rice    | rice@zizania.cray.com |   Anna, < 5; Ellen, < 2
Cray Research Inc.  | (612) 683 - 5370      | "I'm a man who's rich in
655F Lone Oak Drive | Eagan MN USA 55121    |  daughters." -- G. Brown
From: liz@marvin.contex.com (Elizabeth Cyr Jones)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Potty Training in 1yr old ?
Date: 17 Aug 92 18:22:02 GMT
Organization: Xyvision Design Systems


Hi All--


Being a new mom and all, I'm not sure that this
subject is relevant to a 1 yr old. (?) Anyway...
My husband and I have been wondering when the
toilet training begins, and actually I think we
were both hoping that Olivia would "initiate"
action. Well, we've noticed -just recently- that
whenever Olivia is "doing something" in her pants,
she'll squat down, and sort of freeze.

So, Bob and I were talking about this new action,
and were trying to figure out how we should respond.
1) carry her clothes and all to the toilet (closed),
so she can associate the two 2)frantically get her
clothes off and get her to the toilet?...

We'd appreciate all input - book recommendations,
particular training seats to use, etc.. Thanks in
advance.

liz jones
liz@contex.com

Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: kgatling@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Keith E Gatling)
Subject: Re: "Love" Triangle
Organization: Manlius Pebble Hill School; Dewitt, NY
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 08:36:00 EDT

We often have a similar problem with one of our relatives in town.  This
cousin has just recently started doing some work on the apartment below us
(Cheryl and I co-own a two family house with her sister Nancy and her
husband Vince) for my sister-in-law and her husband while they're away,
and often brings his two kids, 5 and 2 with him while his wife is at
work.

If we leave our back door open, as we usually do in the summer, chances
are the kids will just cruise right in saying they want to see us, and
then because we're "responsible" sorts, we end up entertaining them whle
Chris gets his work done without them in the way.

Our solution?  We have a few...the first is to keep the door closed, and
then when the kids come upstairs, they can't just run into the flat.  OF
course, they *do* knock on the door until someone answers, but when they
do, we simply tell them that we're taking our afternoon nap (which Cheryl,
who works nights, probably is).  The other thing we do is to immediately
go out...to the library, to the mall, to go grocery shopping...anywhere,
the moment we realize that Chris is here and has the kids with him.

We don't think that he's deliberately sending the kids up to us so that he
can work in peace, but he's sure not coming up to get them until he's
done.

We've also had problem like this when we bring Daniel home from Sunday
School...we'll find a note on their door saying that Chris had to go
somewhere and will be back hours later...thus changing our plans quite a
bit for the rest of the day.  We're discussing right now what to do about
that when Sunday School starts up again this fall.  Maybe after the first
time it happens this year we sit down with Chris and Laura and tell them
that if it happens again, we don't take him anymore.  I feel like we're
punishing Daniel for something his parents do, but it's not really our
responsibility to look after him like that.

So I say try taking regular trips out of the house first thing Saturday
morning, and see what happens if you're not back home until noontime.  You
might just force a new behavior pattern on them.

--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Keith E Gatling                                  kgatling@mailbox.syr.edu *
*          Opinions?  I've got plenty of them.  Just ask my wife!           *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: kgatling@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Keith E Gatling)
Subject: Re: Homeschooling?
Organization: Manlius Pebble Hill School; Dewitt, NY
Distribution: na,misc
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 15:20:26 EDT

Hey, I don't have kids yet, and I must admit to being a bit biased because
I enjoyed school and am about to become a teacher, and possibly because of
some biased things I've heard about homeschooling, but I have a few quetsions.

    1.  Do you ever worry that your kids won't have normal interactions
	with other kids...interactions that might show them that a 
	particular problem they're having isn't that unusual?  For
	example...my wife is a nurse and had a young patient with
	leukemia who along with all her siblings was homeschooled.  Her
	sisters and brothers didn't quite know how to deal with this
	and the possibility that their sister might die, because they
	had not been in the company of a wider group of children who
	might have had the same experience.

    2.  Do you worry that your kids might get a too narrow view of
	things...such as only *your* view, without learning of other
	points of view and how to deal with people who hold other
	opinions?   There are people in my family who homeschool because
	they don't believe that the public school system treats (oh boy,
	here comes that subject again) religion fairly, and I worry that
	their kids are going to grow up to be a bunch of religious drones
	who don't understand that sometimes you *have to* question.

Hey...like I said, maybe I'm totally off base here, but I do worry about
the isolation and private indoctrination issues.  But then again, I also
loved school.



--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Keith E Gatling                                  kgatling@mailbox.syr.edu *
*          Opinions?  I've got plenty of them.  Just ask my wife!           *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *