From: vcs_teo@csd.brispoly.ac.uk (VCS Teo)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Assimilation by the Chinese in Malaysia....
Date: 13 Apr 92 14:55:32 GMT
Organization: Bristol Polytechnic, England

In article <5478@beta.COM> your mama writes:
>>In article <1992Apr1.175505.3511@athena.mit.edu>, zam@athena.mit.edu (Nor Aazizam Mohd Aasif) writes:
>>> 
>>> Excerpt from "CHINA AND THE ASEAN STATES: the ethnic Chinese
>>> dimension", by Leo Suryadinata. pp 17 - 18.
>>> 
>>> As was mentioned, some Chinese in the ASEAN communities have been more
>>> acculturated into local society than others.  Their degree of
>>> acculturation depends largely on the size of the Chinese community (in
>>> proportion to the non-Chinese population); the degree of religious
>>> similarities between the Chinese and the indigenous population; the
>>> readiness of the local government to accomodate the Chinese;
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
	rightly said.

>>> readiness of the local Chinese to acculturate.  The Chinese in
>>> Thailand appears to be the most acculturated.  They are followed by
>>> the Chinese in the Philippines and Indonesia; THE LEAST ACCULTURATED
>>> ARE THOSE IN MALAYSIA.
>
>>>	I am as open minded as a person next door, but when I see a
>>>clear-cut example of a group of people refusing to assimilate into a
>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>>society just for the heck of it, it ticks me off...
>
>>>NorAazizam MohdAAsif	 
>>>The white man made many promises to us but they never kept but one; they
>>>promised to take our land and they took it.
>                                                        Red Cloud
>
>OK, this is to let off steam. Excuse me Mr. Know it All. I cannot believe
>you can say that the Chinese have totally refused to assimilate. What do
>you call the BABAS ?
	you mean the Peranakans

> Are they not an example of Chinese assimilation with
>the Malay culture ? You know my grandmother even dresses like a Malay.

	mine too. I still remenber clearly once she visited us in Sabak
	Bernam and went to a chinese temple to pray...and the stares of
	disbelieve she got from the people around.

>There is more to Malaysian history than your small ethnocentric window.
>
>Baba culture is the result of Malay/Chinese inter-marriages. It seems to me
>that they were allowed freedom-of-religion. Malay marries CHinese or vice
>versa but the couple were allowed to choose their religion (correct me if
>I am wrong). That does not seem to be the case today.
 
	Gone are the good old days eh? :-(

>
>Today Malay/Chinese inter-marriages result in the Chinese person having to 
>convert to the Muslim faith. I have nothing against Islam. But the question I 
>present is why has the "Baba process" almost come to a halt ? Who benefits 
>from this "Us and Them" division ? Is this "have-to-convert-to-Muslim" rule NOT a tool to preserve a Muslim majority for obvious political reasons ? Or is it
>just another attempt to tamper with the creative forces of the universe just
>for the heck of it. I assure you if you look into other Muslim countries or 
>even the "Cape Malays" of South Africa, such stringent rules regarding 
>mix-marriages do not exist.

	One question here. If a non-muslim converts to being a muslim for the
	reason of marriage then if the marriage fails can he/she revert back
	to be a non-muslim?

>The reasons that Malaysia is such a mess right now are more complex than 
>you think. But think you must.
>
>Honestly, someone as thoughtfull as you should not be wasted on a technical
>degree. I suggest you take up history/philosophy/political science/anthropology.
>It might do some good.
>
>A belated "Selamat Hari Raya Aidil Fitri" to you.


===victor===...another Peranakan (half Peranakan actually)
vcs_teo@csd.brispoly.ac.uk

ps. Drop me an email if you're free...its not very often that you get to meet 
with a peranakan.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean