HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pebi@aem.umn.edu (Peter A. Bidian)
Subject: Re: Worst Car Award
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 20:04:02 GMT

qazi@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Aamir Hafeez Qazi) writes:

>In article <C1FJxL.2rz@ssesco.com> nau@ssesco.com (William Nau) writes:
>>Ken Rothman <krothman.727987654@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu> writes:
>>> With all the advances in aerodynamics and ergonomics in design in the past ten
>>> years (mostly on the part of European and Japanese makers), this beast is an
>>         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>
>>Apparently the Ford Taurus had little influence on the shape of cars today.
>>In my opinion there is no car that has had a greater influence on the vast
>>improvements of aerodynamics than the Taurus.

>--Why doesn't anyone give credit to the '84 Audi 5000 S???  I thought this
>  was the car that started the wave of aerosedans!!!  The Taurus merely
>  copied the Audi's aerodynamic styling!

>--Aamir Qazi

Yes, and that Audi (the 100 series) was introduced 1982 in Germany!
I don't think the Taurus is that old. Anyways, maybe that was the
break through for the US market!

Peter
From: parkerg@osshe.edu (Greg Parker)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Maxima
Date: 27 Jan 1993 16:50:23 GMT
Organization: Oregon State System of Higher Education
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: osshe.edu



Xref: sparky rec.autos:32429 misc.forsale:36017
From: robert@sherlock.oas.uci.edu (Robert Morey)
Subject: Someone take this AUDI off my hands!  (San Francisco)
Newsgroups: rec.autos,misc.forsale
Date: 22 Jan 93 01:38:42 GMT
Distribution: ca

     I have an 84 Audi 5000S to get rid of--I don't need/want a
   car anymore and am willing to sell pretty darn cheap!  Email
   for details.  I'm in San Francisco.

     RJM
From: hacker@cco.caltech.edu (Jonathan Bruce Hacker)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Catalytic converters & California
Date: 28 Jan 93 08:19:36 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: punisher.caltech.edu

mjkobb@media.mit.edu (Michael J Kobb) writes:

>  Now, I'm planning to move to the west coast (i.e. California)
>sometime in the next year, and the car is going along.  The question
>is this:  how much nastier are CA's emissions requirements, and is a
>car that passed in TX likely to pass inspection in CA?  What's the
>law concerning cars purchased out of state anyway?  If it doesn't
>pass, how much is it going to cost me to have the catalyitic
>converter replaced or upgraded?

Did your emissions 'upgrade' include an EPA 49 state emissions decal
under the hood?  If it did, you will only have to pay a one-time $300
smog impact fee when you register.

If the car doesn't have a decal then I suspect things might get
complicated.  They (DMV) definitely wanted to see that decal when I
registered my out-of-state car here.  Perhaps someone has done this 
and can shed some more light on the matter.
-- 
Jon Hacker
Caltech, Pasadena CA
hacker@tumbler-ridge.caltech.edu
From: chmilar@Apple.COM (Michael Chmilar)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Worst Car Award
Date: 26 Jan 93 23:15:59 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

nau@ssesco.com (William Nau) writes:
>Ken Rothman <krothman.727987654@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu> writes:
>>With all the advances in aerodynamics and ergonomics in design in the past ten
>>years (mostly on the part of European and Japanese makers), this beast is an
>         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>In my opinion there is no car that has had a greater influence on the vast
>improvements of aerodynamics than the Taurus.

Gee, I always thought that the Taurus was a major rip-off of the Audi 5000 -
the first "round" one.  When the 5000 came out with the new style, it was
pretty radical.  It looks very conservative now, but I would say that it
started the trend which others, including Ford, merely elaborated on.
--
Michael Chmilar
chmilar@apple.com
From: chu@freebie.jpl.nasa.gov (Eugene Chu)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: New Mustang
Date: 28 Jan 1993 09:49:12 GMT
Organization: SAR Systems Development & Processing, JPL
NNTP-Posting-Host: freebie.jpl.nasa.gov

In article <C14r4A.9t1@csulb.edu> mikefitz@csulb.edu (Michael Fitzpatrick) writes:
>I am going to hopefully be buying a new car in the next 4-6 months and
>was wondering if anyone knew when the new model mustang is due out.  I
>am looking at the old mustang, the new probe gt, and the thunderbird.
>If the wait isn't too long I would like to hold off and get a look at
>the new mustang.
>
>Mike
>

The only "new" Mustang that you will see this year is the Cobra Mustang.
This car has some engine and suspension enhancements over the regular
Mustang GTs, and is in general a better performing car.  However, it
has also been wrung out by the car rag journalists, whose aggregate
contention is that it is not quite as good as the new offerings from
GM: the new Camaro and Firebirds.  Shockingly, the Mustang Cobra cost
as much as, or more than the GM cars.

The real new Mustang will debut in October of this year.  It will be
completely redesigned with new suspensions, brakes, body styling, and
possibly new engines.  The one to wait for would be the GT version with
an all-aluminum DOHC V8 engine.  There's even a rumored super high
performance car with a supercharged engine that puts out close to 500 hp.
Unfortunately, it will also retain some features that will prevent it
from being an ultimate performer, such as its hokey "modified MacPherson
strut" front suspension.  But I digress.

eyc
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: jdrout@scott.skidmore.edu (JTD is lost)
Subject: Re: Corvetts
Organization: Skidmore College, Saratoga Springs NY
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 19:43:11 GMT

It all depends on the performace you want (raw power, handling, top
speed, combinations?), what you want to do with the car, how much you
can do yourself, your budget, your taste in the cars looks, ragtop or
t-rrof or targa or fixed, etc.

Jonathan
jdrout@scott.skidmore.edu
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.tech,hotrod@dixie.com
From: nau@ssesco.com (William Nau)
Subject: Re: elderly drivers
Organization: SSESCO
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 14:10:31 GMT

>>For the reverse side of this story:  I had a short ride a couple weeks
>>ago with an uncle who is in his mid-80s.  He knows where the right side
>>of his Lincoln Town Car (a monstrosity if there ever was one) with
>>enough accuracy to keep a series of concrete light poles a very steady
>>15 to 18 inches from the car at 35 mph.  That is approaching the
>>accuracy of a race driver.  Very few drivers under 70 years of age have
>>a snowball's chance in hell of that degree of accuracy behind the wheel.
>>
>>Chris Prael

Good for him.  However, I don't really think age or the size of the car
has much to do with it.  Once you're used to a big car, you know where
it is as well as you would in a small car.  Also, I'm sure that many
of the better drivers could perform such a feat at any age.  50+ years
of driving is not necessary (not to say that extra experience doesn't 
help.  It certainly does).  You uncle may be above average and you
should be proud of that.  There's no reason you and I can't do the same.
-- 
William R. Nau
Supercomputer Systems Engineering and Services Company (SSESCO)
511 11th Avenue South, Suite 216
Minneapolis, Minnesota 55415-1536
(612) 342-0003

nau@SSESCO.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: issa@cwis.unomaha.edu (Issa El-Hazin)
Subject: Re: Before Buying Japanese.
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 09:58:33 GMT

jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (John F Nielsen) writes:

>In article <C17n3D.DLr@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cka52397@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Slartibartfast) writes:

>>
>>	Yes, Greg, but you forget, the Sterling was made in England, where
>>reliable cars are only made by GM (Vauxhall) and Rolls Royce.  The Legend was
>>made in Japan.  The Probe and MX-6, and 626 for that matter, are all made in
>>the same plant in Flat Rock, MI.  Obviously the same car made in different
>>factories by different companies could, and probably would, have dissimilar
>>repair records, but cars made in the same plant by the same workers won't...

>Checking the 1993 Buying Guide I find . . .

>The Mazda MX-6 and Ford Probe were essentially idenitcal except for
>the 91 model. 

>I don't know where they diverge on the assembly line. But that
>one year may have been a fluke. Certainly not enough to hurt the
>credability of the ratings, when you find some many other patterns
>(even the other years for the Prob and Mx-6) with cars.

>(like Toyota exhaust being black for most models and the Chevy Nova
>a toyota clone also black)

>Anyways, HOW about how they rated those cars. Did what they determine
>sound like what you would expect from a toaster rating company?

>john
>-- 
>John Nielsen   MAGNUS Consultant            ______   ______   __  __	
>jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu         /\  __ \ /\  ___\ /\ \/\ \
>                                           \ \ \/\ \\ \___  \\ \ \_\ \
>  Back off man, I'm a Scientist!            \ \_____\\/\_____\\ \_____\


From what I recall (I read this article last week), C/R claimed that the 
Probe got ranked worse than average on reliablity mostly due to its' less than
perfect body parts (which are [mostly] unique to the Probe). I'll check my
mag. when I get home and if they differ from what I stated here I'll repost
if somebody else don't beat me to it.
As of now, I'm about 100% sure this was the reason given. As a matter of
fact, when I read that the Probe got ranked worse than the MX-6 I knew
right away that this was going to be the next issue discussed on here (C/R being
fair or not..).

issa

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: thomas@datamark.co.nz (Thomas Beagle)
Subject: Re: Politics of car buying(Buying a Japane
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 20:14:13 GMT
Organization: Datamark International Ltd.

In article <1993Jan20.223306.24809@spectrum.xerox.com> mdennie@beryllium.mc.xerox.com writes:
>
>In the LONG run, though, with even trade practices (and preferably no trade
>barriers) we _would_ seek to play the Japanese market game - ie. to build
>automobiles for the Japanese market, with Japanese consumers in mind, and
>steering wheels on the right.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

What a concession!

Can you imagine the reaction if the Japanese tried to sell right-hand
drive cars in the United States?



-- 
    Thomas Beagle | thomas@datamark.co.nz           Work: 64 4 233 8186
 Technical Writer | thomas@cavebbs.welly.gen.nz     Home: 64 4 499 3832
   Wellington, NZ | Yes, I do have long ears, a black nose, and a tail.
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mark@wdcwdc.sps.mot.com (Mark Shaw)
Subject: Re: Politics of car buying
Organization: Motorola Western MCU Design Center, Chandler Arizona
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 00:25:53 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.152619.29534@zia.aoc.nrao.edu>, gvanmoor@nrao.edu (Gustaaf Van Moorsel,,,) writes:
|> In article 2074@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com, c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos) writes:
|> 
|> >>In Germany, where there are even fewer restrictions on importing cars than in the US
|> >>(no quota, no extra taxes on light trucks), Japanese cars are almost as successful as
|> >>they are in the US. 
|> >
|> >I don't think so; I have the figures in the library, but I seem to remember
|> >that Japanese car market share in Germany is at best in the low teens %,
|> >while in the US is in the upper twenties or low thirties...
|> >
|> >Spiros
|> 
|> Well, I lived in Germany for seven years and I assure you, it is certainly much more
|> than the low teens; the lates figure I have is around 20-25%. But this is beside
|> the point anyway, my point was that in a market like Germany the Japanese outsell
|> the American made cars by at least a factor 10 (I deliberately give a low estimate), 
|> where none of the two receives any preferential treatment.

You are still coming to the same wrong conclusions that everyone else makes.  Namely
That American cars are suited to German tastes.
That lack of American cars in Germany is a lack of American business presence there.

If you do have the data, please share the numbers with us and for
which years they are valid. I would really like to see how the Japanese
stack up against VW, Opel, or Ford in the German market.

Mark


Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: cshafai@eeserv.ee.umanitoba.ca (Cyrus Shafai)
Subject: How to clean you engine? 
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 16:53:49 GMT

How do you clean your engine?  Can you use water and mild soap like you
use for the body of the car?  Is there a danger of shorting some of the
electrical systems?

Or should you just rub it/the hoses, etc. with a damp cloth?
I am current just rubbing dirty areas with a damp cloth.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------
Cyrus Shafai                        <cshafai@ee.umanitoba.ca>
The Scanning Tunneling Microscopy Laboratory  -  STM/AFM Lab
University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada   ph. (204) 474-6007
From: km1i+@andrew.cmu.edu (Kevin Maljak)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Lotus Elan in 'Basic Instinct'
Date: 21 Jan 93 18:33:04 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.UfLrY0y00WBMM8zG1Z
	<1jjl26INN5jh@phantom.gatech.edu>
	<SS.93Jan20101639@wpi.WPI.EDU>
Organization: University Libraries - Public Services, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

The Lotus that turned into a sub was in "The Spy Who Loved Me"
and I thought it was later blown up in "For Your Eyes Only".  
It was the movie where the girl killed the one guy with the bow
and arrow and then there was the great chase scene with the 
2CV (Renault or Citroen, can't remember who made them) down the 
hill and the bad guys were in Peugeot 504s I believe because
one landed in the olive tree.  

"From Russia with Love" was on the train and I remember the 
chase scene with the powerboats, I don't remember him having
a special car in that one but I might be mistaken.

Kevin
From: tut@cairo.Eng.Sun.COM (Bill "Bill" Tuthill)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: Pros/Cons of 4WD?
Date: 26 Jan 93 22:39:21 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc., Mountain View, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: cairo

abrandt@clam.rutgers.edu (Harriet H. Frau) writes:
> 
> What does the lack of 4WD do to a SUV when it comes time to resell?

Lowers resale value, probably in proportion to the money you've saved
initially and over time in lower maintenance costs.  As a fellow rafter
said to me after selling his 4WD pickup truck, "I use 4WD for a few
yards every year, but pay for it the other 12,000 miles."

> I will use the truck farther north in the snow, and back
> road driving in the summer.  Are there other driving situations where
> drivers have found 4wd to be a bonus?  

In California 4WD is a big bonus because the Highway Patrol will let you
by without chains.  Californians are in general very bad snow drivers,
anyway.  I've seen more 4WD than 2WD vehicles smashed into snowbanks,
mostly because of bozo drivers.  The fact of the matter is that 4WD has
only marginal traction advantages over FWD or RWD with limited slip.   
All are limited mostly by snow depth-- when the snow is deeper than your
clearance, you ain't goin' nowhere.  The most useful feature of 4WD is
low range, because it lets you creep slowly (uphill or thru snow) and it
gives you a wide choice of gears, like a 10-speed bicycle.  Remember,
all cars and SUVs use the same number of tires when braking!  And when
you're out of control, braking is often required!!

> I look for any illuminaton on 4WD vs 2WD in general, and anyone who
> has had experience with the Isuzu Rodeo 4WD system.

The Isuzu systems are not terribly sophisticated, but they do have low
range, and that is the most important part.  Does the Rodeo 2WD have
limited slip differential as an option?  Jeep's 4WD systems are usually
considered the most sophisticated.
From: kimd@gizmo.usc.edu (Kim Daugherty)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Buying a Saturn
Date: 23 Jan 1993 11:36:14 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: gizmo.usc.edu


Is the rumor true that Saturn dealers will not bargain off the sticker price?
If anyone has got one below MSRP, could you please share your story?  I'd 
like to buy an SL as a cheap reliable car.  Thanks.


-- 
+---------------------------------+-----------------------------------+
| Kim Daugherty                   | PhD program in Computer Science   |
| kimd@gizmo.usc.edu              | University of Southern California |
+---------------------------------+-----------------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: johnh@sun411g.SanDiego.NCR.COM (John Holmes 2540)
Subject: Tail light LENSES: 3rd Party Source?
Summary: Looking for cheap source of new lenses 
Keywords: autos lenses price lens 
Reply-To: john.holmes@SanDiegoCA.NCR.COM (John Holmes)
Organization: NCR Corp. E & M San Diego
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 23:02:03 GMT

Does anybody have a source for tail/parking light lenses other than
the new car dealers?  Our 1980 Mercury needs new lenses but I was 
astounded to find the rear lenses (fancy) are $85.00 each and the 
front lenses (simple) are $45.00 each!

BTW, is there a FAQ for this group at an ftp site?

Thanks in advance.

-  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -
John Holmes, NCR Corp.
Internet: john.holmes@SanDiegoCA.NCR.COM
Phone: (619) 485-2540
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: chuck@netcom.com (Cheuk Cheng)
Subject: Need Advice on purchasing an Eclipse GS
Summary: Need advice on purchasing an Eclipse GS
Keywords: Eclipse
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 15:37:47 GMT

        My friend is considering buying a 93 Eclipse GS.  He got a quote of
$10,000 for the fully loaded 5-speed version.  But he wants to know how much
it costs for the automatic version.  According to the saleman, he said it will
cost another $4000 (this much !!) because he said only the 5-speed version is 
on sale.  So if any of you have any comments or suggestions, please email me.

P.S. Does anyone know the invoice price for this car?  Thanks in advanced.

Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: phr@telebit.com (Paul Rubin)
Subject: Re: For Sale: 92 Nissan Sentra E
Organization: Telebit Corporation; Sunnyvale, CA, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1993 01:17:46 GMT

In article <1993Jan27.032754.29080@newstand.syr.edu> brkirby@mothra.syr.EDU (Bruce Kirby) writes:

   The car works great, but I am approaching the end of a PhD in Syracuse
   and planning to move back to Canada. The Canadian government doesn't
   like the automatic seatbelts and won't let me import it. More dumb
   government rules.

Wow!!!! Does this mean I can buy a car in Canada and get normal
seatbelts instead of attack belts????   Can I bring it back to 
the US?  Where do I sign?
tnx
From: jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (John F Nielsen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: yet another consumer reports article (Re: Before Buying Japanese.)
Date: 25 Jan 93 17:42:21 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: The Ohio State University

In article <1993Jan22.181330.2179@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com> c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos) writes:
>In article <1993Jan22.142044.20423@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (John F Nielsen) writes:
>>>Unless CR can prove that they have used a sample population
>>>representative of the actual population of course...
>>
>>Why is that necessary for what they are trying to show. Unless the
>>people answering the questionaires are morons or like to lie, the
>>data is useful, it is not that hard to know when you got a repair.
>
>Because, very simply, it is not correct. In order for the statistics
>to be correct they would have to make sure that several things happen:

Their pur[po
>
>a. questionnaires are mailed to people in proportion to car ownership
>   (or market share)
>b. response rates are similar to mailing rates
>c. response rates are accurate as far as problem reporting goes
>d. statistical methods are followed properly


What I am contending is that for what they are trying to show, 
all of this is not necessary.

IF you have 10,000 people responding about problems with their Ford
Ranger  and 50,000 about problems with their Ford Taurus, patterns
will show up. And, both with have groups of people who respond
because they love or hate their machine.

>In my case, a couple of things. One was that the lawnmower in question
>was WAY too HEAVY after grass clippings were collected; its engine

Which mower was this?

john
-- 
John Nielsen   MAGNUS Consultant            ______   ______   __  __	
jnielsen@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu         /\  __ \ /\  ___\ /\ \/\ \
                                           \ \ \/\ \\ \___  \\ \ \_\ \
  Back off man, I'm a Scientist!            \ \_____\\/\_____\\ \_____\
From: jr4q+@andrew.cmu.edu (Jason M. Roth)
Newsgroups: rec.autos
Subject: Re: List of clone automobiles
Date: 25 Jan 93 06:56:01 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.wfN1iVa00WBM43P75N
Organization: Junior, Architecture, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

>Toyota Camry / Lexus ES300  Im not sure on that

Yes, these are the same (bringing up the ? of why spend $6k more for an
L and even worse styling. (There really is very little mechanical, etc.
diff. w/ the 6 cyl. Camry and the Lexus; you get almost nothing more for
the ES300).

>Chevrolet Lumina / Pontiac Grand-AM / Olds Achieva / Buick Century  ???

You've confused 3 different body types:

Chevrolet Lumina/Pontiac Grand Prix/Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme/Buick
Regal (although I swear that the Buick and Pontiac are closer to each
other than the other 2; a slightly stretched platform, perhaps?)

Pontiac Grand Am/Oldsmobile Achieva/Buick Skylark (all distantly derived
from the Chevy Corsica)

Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera/Buick Century (a 1/2 size above the previous
group, into midsize)

Just trying to be helpful; good job on the list, tho' (more time than
I'd spend).

PS Sorry for the last post on the US in Germany; I wrote it 2 days ago,
and since then the real #s came up, and I was wrong. I still hold to the
point, tho', that the US doesn't export much 'cos there's no need, w/
Opel and Ford already there.
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: kokerj@vccnw07.its.rpi.edu (James Matthew Kokernak)
Subject: Re: civic above specs...
Reply-To: kokerj@rpi.edu
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY.
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 13:08:54 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.4168.242@dosgate>, "mike pot" <mike.pot@canrem.com> writes:
|> Hello All,
|> 
|> I have a '91 Civic Si hatchback and am curious if any others have
|> experiecnes the same as me. Me someone can help me clear up some of the
|> following:
|> It seems to so 0-100km/h (that is 0-60mph) in just over 7 seconds!

I think you're watch is slow.

|> This is far above factory specs. It's supposed to have 108 hp. The '92
|> and '93 models (more expensive too) have 125 hp because of it's variable
|> valve timing, although I do not think it actually accelerates faster.
|> I'm really hot about acceleration, not top speed, although it does do
|> 200km/h (125mph).
|> In the city I've dragraced all kinds of cars including Mustangs 5.0's,
|> surprised, but I keep up! I know not all mustangs are the same. On the
|> highway going 200km the mustang does pass me. Also if I have two people
|> in the car with me it's not so visious anymore, I have to be alone in
|> the car.

Just like the fish that got away.

|> Maybe this is not above specs, maybe it is. I always drive the crap out
|> of it revving the engine up to 7500 rpm, also the >7 secs is
|> accomplished with a kind of speed shifting, what I do is I leave the
|> accelerator padal to the floor all the way, and when it's time to shift,
|> I press the kludge. while the kludge is just slightly down the engine
|> revs up from >6500 to 7500 rpm, this while I shift to the next gear and
|> I let go of kludge all at once. This gives a super boost.

Hey folks, we're all gonna get a chance to see someone have problems with
their Honda! First hand!


|> Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
|> World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
-Jim
"If it's not German, it's not worth driving"