HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tsellers@umiami.ir.miami.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Comments on DS9 "Emissary" **SPOILERS**
Date: 7 Jan 93 14:56:40 EST
Organization: Univ of Miami IR

In article <1993Jan7.000850.15666@fnbc.com>, frank@fnbc.com (Frank Mitchell) writes:
> In article <1ifik5INN28u@menudo.uh.edu> HADCRJAM@admin.uh.edu (MILLER, JIMMY  
> A.) writes:
>> The Trill are a symbiote race.  The human-looking bipeds form the "body"  
>> and the slugs are the "brains".  The freaky part is that it appears the 
>> host had an intelligent, free-will being in it to start with.
[Stuff deleted]
> Well, the original mind of the humanoid might meld with the Trill 
> and form a single mind; [Stuff deleted]
> But, now that you mention it, the replacement Trill host of "The Host" 
> seemed not too happy to be there [or ... ]
> the humanoids might consider it an honor to carry the slugs[....]
> we're entitled to an explanation[....]

I've had problems with the Trill since first seeing "The Host."
I didn't notice any reluctance by the replacement host in that 
episode, but I was disturbed by the immediate and complete acceptance 
of the slug by the crew and the consequent skirting of the ethical 
and biological questions involved.  If no benefit is realized by the 
humaniod hosts, then the slugs are not sybiots, but rather parasites 
and a transporter biofilter would do the right thing by 'curing' a host.
Besides which, how could the symbiosis have begun naturally?  We've only 
seen artificial linkings so far.  If there is no natural symbiosis, how 
was the artificial one discovered and implemented, and by whom?  The 
slugs seem not to have the necessary appendages to implant themselves, 
and what host would think it possible, let alone chose to do so?  I 
can't ignore them now, as I preferred to do previously.  So...

Ideas:
1. Discovering a mentally advanced slug, humanoid race with median IQ of 
	about 90 on human scale communicate with it and cook up symbiosis 
	scheme.  Hosting is voluntary for individuals who receive societal 
	(science, government, etc.) and personal (financial?, intellect 
	upgrade (slight but permanent), relief from boredom, enhanced 
	lifespan) benefit from temporary (10-20 years avg) service?
2. Humanoids are genetically engineered non-sentient improvements upon 
	natural hosts.  Not likely.

That's off the top of my head; I don't like either one particularly, but 
I'm not going to spend any more time on someone else's problem.  I 
would like for them to spend a little more time, though, to produce a 
plausible explanation and avoid the absolute minefeild of possible 
inconsistencies ahead for DS9 if they don't.

Also...wasn't the ensign framed for the murders of the Klingon emissaries 
in ST:VI named Dax?  If so, I'd like a future episode to either confirm 
or contraindicate whether it was the same Dax.  This could be interesting.

Tony
tsellers@umiami.ir.miami.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: gslars@staff.tc.umn.edu (Greg Larson)
Subject: Re: Replacement for Picard
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:31:53 GMT

In article <1idcmuINNiqp@phoenix.apana.org.au> hunter@phoenix.apana.org.au (James Gardiner) writes:
>
>I think Riker should become captain because it can bring more
>character to the Characters.
>Captain Kirk was a Womanizing, power hungry man.  Ie had some real
>life qualities.  ST:TNG characters are just too nice.  Because of this
>the characters are very uninteresting.
>We need some bad qualities in the crew to make them more interesting.
>
>Riker would be a good start.  a young Captain, usually more foolish, could
>make for some interesting plots.

You make some good points.  I think the crew members also seem
overly-competent,  i.e., they all wind up being super-geniuses at one
time or another.  Their talents should be more mundane, with maybe one
or two indispensible super-geniuses thrown in.  This would enable them
to have more antagonistic behaviors without being thrown off the ship.
And I don't mean just nitpicky personality differences, but perhaps
hidden, self-serving, devious reasons for being there.  



Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: mariani@gmd.de (John A. Mariani, I3.CSCW 2699)
Subject: captaincy of the Enterprise
Reply-To: mariani@gmd.de
Organization: GMD, Sankt Augustin, Germany.
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 13:49:29 GMT

There are actually two things to consider about Riker being given captaincy. One is about
the actors.

Would Frakes be given more money as the nominal star (I've heard that Stewart, Spiner and 
Burton get the most cash)? If so, then Frakes has something to push for. If not, then I'm sure he won't
mind if someone else gets the job.

It is interesting that Takei pushed for Sulu to be made Captain, something which I was just as
pleased as anyone to see finally happen (even if it just increases the realism of the series), but
did it make any *personal* difference to Takei? Did he get more dosh? Did he get more to do as
an actor? Judging by ST VI, no, I don't think he had that much more to do.

The other is about the character. I wouldn't mind seeing Riker as Captain (I guess I just
like him more than a lot of you seem to); I think he'd make a good job of it. But the writers
could have much more fun (sounds like they tried it with CoC; it'll be years before I get to
see it, I'm only going off your comments) by having a Captain with a radically different style
to Picard (and Riker, for that matter) and playing them off each other. Riker could feel
"miffed" that he'd been passed over (it's obvious to me that he stays on the Enterprise with
the (vain?) hope that he will be next in line for the job).

I would like to see this state of affairs continue as an arc for quite a few episodes; plenty of
acting challange for Frakes to get his teeth into. But I'd also like a happy ending, where finally
Riker proves that -- for the Enterprise at least -- his command style works better, and he
does get the Captaincy. It would also call for some subtle writing and playing all round -- I'd hate
to see a "Caine Mutiny" type story, because that would just be the easy way out for all
concerned.
From: cegtitd@prism.gatech.EDU (Tim Dodd)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: DSN: Meaning of "Celestial Temple" -- Spoilers
Date: 12 Jan 93 14:58:45 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

Spoilers for DS9:  "The Emissary":



In article <1993Jan12.070131.22493@admiral.uucp> dave@admiral.uucp (Dave Litchman) writes:
>A lot of people have posted saying that they don't get the thing about the
>Celestial Temple that the Bajoran Priestess told Sisko about. Well, to me
>it's obvious that their Celestial Temple is the wormhole itself, and Sisko
>does indeed fulfill his "destiny" to discover it...

This was obvious to me, too, except that the Temple is the source of the orbs,
which would be the alien world within the wormhole, not the wormhole itself.

What bothered me about this is that the orbs had apparently been appearing
for 10,000 Bajoran years, which means that the Bajorans had been looking
for the temple for that long, or almost that long.  Also, the Cardassians
had been looking for the temple for at least 16 years.  Then along comes
Lt. Dax, who, working with information available to both the Bajorans and
the Cardassians, finds the wormhole in only two hours or so.

I thought this was stretching it a bit.  My willing suspension of disbelief
can only accomodate plot holes of diameter 1 AU or less....

Tim
-- 
Tim Dodd, Research Scientist, Georgia Tech:  cegtitd@prism.gatech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: rjg@umnstat.stat.umn.edu (Robert J. Granvin)
Subject: Re: Sisko's kid
Organization: School of Statistics, University of Minnesota
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 19:25:59 GMT

In article <880840m.27.726339818@axe.acadiau.ca>, 880840m@axe.acadiau.ca (MICHAEL ALEXANDER MCKAY) writes:
|> I just saw a teaser ad for DS9, and learned that Picard is implicated 
|> in the death of Sisko's spouse; Sisko has a kid; the kid wears a uniform;
|> the kid whines.
|> 
|> Is the kid doomed to be the new Wesley?

No.

-- 
\\ Robert J. Granvin                                 User Services Specialist
// School of Statistics - University of Minnesota            rjg@stat.umn.edu
From: scott.hollifield@the-matrix.com (Scott Hollifield) 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Vulcan Captain???
Date: 7 Jan 93 23:34:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The MATRIX BBS - Birmingham, AL - 205-323-2016
Reply-To: scott.hollifield@the-matrix.com (Scott Hollifield) 

On Thu, 7 Jan 1993 06:01:31 GMT, abick@sebastian.carleton.ca (Alan Bick)
wrote:

AB>The moment I saw the Vulcan captain on the Saratoga (sp?) my mind went
AB>crazy! I knew I had seen him somewhere, and I couldn't figure it out until
AB>practically the end of the show. Everytime he showed up, I got a little
AB>closer to figuring it out until it finally clicked... he was the guy
AB>seating next to the Admiral when Wesley was explain the "accident" at Star
AB>Fleet Academy!

Er, no he wasn't.  Captain Setelk from "The First Duty", who sat on the
board of inquiry into the Academy accident, was played by Richard Fancy.
The Vulcan captain of the Saratoga in DS9 was played by John Noah
Hertzler (who, in his very brief scene, made a better Vulcan than the
other guy, IMHO).

              /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
              \  "Let us think the unthinkable, let us   /   scott.hollifield
              /   do the undoable.  Let us prepare to    \   @the-matrix.com
              \  grapple with the ineffable itself, and  /
              /    see if we may not eff it after all."  \
              \_              --- Dirk Gently           _/
                \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

---
 . OLX 2.1 TD . I have decided to display my feminine self today. . Worf
                                                                                                         
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: jogle@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim))
Subject: Re: Past Prologue: DS9 guest star spoilers
Organization: National Radio Astronomy Observatory, Socorro NM
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 93 17:29:39 GMT

In article <mumble> mlj44080@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Michael Lee Jacobs) writes:

>O.K. this is from a T.V. guide so its reliability is well...
>	Anyway in the listing for next weeks episode they list two guest
>stars. One of which is....

>hope that worked btw.
>Lursa: Barbara March.
>	Is this the same woman who played Lursa of Lursa and Be'Tor?
>Does this mean she is hanging around DS9 now that she is dispatriated?
>Or do we just have another Lursa walking around the universe. I would
>check my tape but I was robbed yesterday and although my Tape Library is
>intact they took the VCR and TV to play it on  *$@#@#$&@#!

It is supposed to be the same character so I would assume it is the
same actress.  His sister supposedly shows up as well.

-- 
Kansas Jim (Jim Ogle, TORG guru)                               /|
jogle@aoc.nrao.edu (NRAO-VLBA, Socorro New Mexico)           o| |-
"I'd be apathetic if I cared."                              /| \|
From: tjones@access.digex.com (Tom Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Symbiotic Life forms:DS9 (Possible Spoilers)
Date: 11 Jan 1993 09:54:51 GMT
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

In article <sfICPg200iV103B3Y8@andrew.cmu.edu> msb0+@andrew.cmu.edu (Maulik Harish Shah) writes:
>I dont know if anybody has mentioned it before? But how could Symbiotic
>Life forms come about? Any method of procreation/survival that would
>require surgery (as Dax' flashback would indicate) wouldn't make sense.
>Perhaps there is another lifeform that performs the surgery? Or that
>transferring slugs from host-host could happen naturally (by the slug
>crawling along the ground or something) and that surgery just increases
>the chances of successful transferrence. Also, why is Symbiosis
>necessary for the host? Obviously, the host has its own reproductive
>life cycle (because Dax, as a host has her own memories...)

Surgery may not strictly be required, but might be useful to prevent
complications; compare to the birth process in developed countries.
Nearly all births are attended medically, although obviously the process
has a reasonable success rate without such help.

My dumb theory is that perhaps the slug's intelligence provides the
host more intelligence, and thus a greater chance of survival.

I'm sure we'll see an entire episode devoted to this subject before the
season is out; hopefully it will make sense.

-tom jones
 greenbelt, maryland
From: ac999239@umbc8.umbc.edu (ac999239)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Fox and DS9?
Date: 4 Jan 1993 21:36:57 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland, Baltimore County Campus
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: umbc8.umbc.edu

As far as I can tell, as of now no fox stations in my area are carrying DS9
here in Baltimore...Only an Independant station and a Washington channel are
carrying it. Not that I'm complaining, but since the fox stations are carrying
the normal ST:TNG why not the DS9 as well?
From: 00rdharringt@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu (Rob Harrington)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: O'Brien rank
Date: 12 Jan 93 02:14:06 GMT
Organization: Ball State University

In article <1993Jan11.210314.13487@bsu-ucs>, 00ajpayne@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu writes:
> In article <1993Jan11.133748.1991@nynexst.com>, elissa@nynexst.com (Elissa Gilbert) writes:
>> Just to throw some more fuel on the debate over O'Brien's rank: in the novelization of
>> Deep Space Nine, he is referred to as an *Ensign*.  It is explicitly stated that this
>> is a promotion for him, and that's one of the reasons he accepted the transfer.
> 
> Could it be possible that O'Brien's title as Transporter Chief could be
> more of an "enlisted" rank,
> and he was promoted to Ensign.
> Making him promoted to officer status.
> 
But his first assignment on the Big E was Conn on the Battle Bridge...
and before that he was Tactical Officer on the USS Rutledge...

-- 
/---------------------------------------v-------------------------------------\
|  Rob Harrington                       |              Ball State University  |
|  Department of History                |               Muncie, Indiana, USA  |
|  Vax--00RDHARRINGT@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu  |       Unix--herring@bsu-cs.bsu.edu  |
>---------------------------------------^-------------------------------------<
|                  Ball State University - University Democrats               |
|                Not a spokesperson - REPEAT - Not a spokesperson             |
\-----------------------------------------------------------------------------/
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: roy@watson.ibm.com
Subject: Re: Dax in previous lives?
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1993 13:56:09 GMT
News-Software: IBM OS/2 PM RN (NR/2) v0.16 by O. Vishnepolsky and R. Rogers
Reply-To: roy@trigger.watson.ibm.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

In <C0Hq82.9FD@cmptrc.lonestar.org> brad@cmptrc.lonestar.org (Brad Barton) writes:
>In article <1993Jan6.174144@usho72.hou281.chevron.com> hhtra@usho72.hou281.chevron.com (T.M.Haddock) writes:
>>In article <1ifjclINNg02@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu>, msiegall@OAVAX.CSUCHICO.EDU (MARC SIEGALL) writes:
>>|> Where else have we seen the actress who plays Dax?  She looks very
>>|> familiar to me and my friends, but we can't place her.  Thanks!
>>
>> If you're talking about Terry Farrell, she was in
>>
>>       Back to School
>>       Beverly Hills Madam  (TV)
>>       The Deliberate Stranger (TV)
>>       Hellrasier III: Hell on Earth
>>       "Paper Dolls"
>
>She also won a nation-wide Brooke Shields look-a-like contest about 7 or 8
>years ago and then went on to be a model.
>
>-- 
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>|  Brad Barton - brad@cmptrc.lonestar.org  |  "Light the lamp, not the rat!"  |
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And: "If she was a president she'd be named Babe-raham Lincoln."

     "She makes me feel funny, like when we climb the rope in gym class."

She is most excellent.

Signed, 
Garth (not to be confused with Garth Brooks who is banned from this group)

----------------------------------------------------------------------
| Disclaimer:  The comments in this post  | - What is your name?     |
|              are not necessarily shared | - What is your quest?    |
|              with my employer           | - What is...             |
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: HR-5@ia.ph.bham.ac.uk (Connor MacLeod (of the Clan MacLeod))
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Problems with 'Phased' ?
Date: 12 Jan 93 11:32:46 GMT
Organization: Physics Department, Birmingham University, England
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X-Disclaimer: Birmingham University has no views on the subject of this article
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 In message <1993Jan11.194031.25874@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA> dboese@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA (Darcy Boese) writes...

>> In 'Phased' (TNG) why don't La Forge and Ro fall through the floor
>> of the Enterprise when they can walk through walls ?
>
>Perhaps the artificial gravity generation is not limited to 'normal'
>phase.  Gravity is gravity.
>
 I disagree, the gravity is created by four graviton machines, gravitons are normal particles , thus would need phasing,
 and anyway if gravity were acting that would make them more likely to fall through floor, they would not fall
through if no gravity but then they would be unable to walk etc. Also how come Laforge and Ro can see other people yet
other people can't see them. Are photons phased or not ?
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: jsbell@acs.ucalgary.ca (Joshua Bell)
Subject: Re: 28 Re: Cardassia = Iraq
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 07:55:41 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

In article <JASON.93Jan11154603@ab20.larc.nasa.gov> Jason C. Austin <j.c.austin@larc.nasa.gov> writes:
>In article <1993Jan8.155417.14814@umr.edu> S104374@UMRVMA.umr.edu writes:
>-> >  I always  saw Cardassia equal to Israel and the Bjorans(sp?) equal to
>-> >the Palistinians.  

>-> That's interesting; I always saw the Bajorans as Jews and the Cardassians
>-> as Syrians/Iraqis.

>	If anything, it was originally the Bajorans = Palestinians and
>Cardassians = Israelies.  

Hee hee. The fact that everyone can associate the Bajorans and
Cardassians with various groups on Earth, often more than one
group, shows just how well Piller and Berman's scenario is
designed. The situation is appealing, *because* people can
identify it with a real-world situation. And it's vague enough
that people will associate it with a real-world situation that
they acknowledge as a problem - perhaps giving them insight into
situations they previously _didn't_ acknowledge.

TNG Companion, page 178:

 The Bajorans, Berman added, were not modeled on any one
real-life ethnic group: "The Kuds, the Palestinians, the Jews in
the 1940s, the boat people from Haiti -- unfortunately, the
homeless and terrorism are problems [in every age]."

Joshua
--
     _|_
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  /   |   \               ___====___  `-._()_.-'  ___====___
 |   _|_   |              ~~~'  `~~~`==\ `--' /=='~~~'  `~~~
 | ,',|,`, |                             `--'
 |//_|||_\\| Star Trek: Deep Space Nine  `--'  jsbell@acs.ucalgary.ca
 ||',-"-,`||                             `--'
 ||/     \|| Acadamic Computing Services  `'  University of Calgary, Canada
  \|     |/
   `,___,'
From: HR-5@ia.ph.bham.ac.uk (Connor MacLeod (of the Clan MacLeod))
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Q's rank ??
Date: Monday, 11 Jan 93 18:19:19 GMT
Organization: Physics Department, Birmingham University, England
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On an episode I saw recently (TNG) in which Q featured,
(I don't remember the name though it starred a young lady also from the
continuum) Q appeared on the enterprise in a starfleet uniform
carrying five pips, what is this and how come he was so quickly
demoted in a later scene where he has only four ??
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: jeffb@audiolab.UWaterloo.ca (jeff bamford)
Subject: Re: The Hispanic or English Counselor Troi
Organization: Audio Research Group, University of Waterloo
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 21:08:51 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.222300.22235@cbfsb.cb.att.com> rrp@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (rakesh.r.patel) writes:
>
>Last night, there was a brief snippet on TV about the new women of
>TNG, comparing them with the women of the orginal StarTrek. The 
>actress (I forget her name) that play Counselor Troi was being
>interviewed. She sounds as if she has an English accent! On the
>TV show, maybe it is me, but she sounds Hispanic!
	
Marina Sirtis has a very thick London accent.  If memory serves me 
correct one her parents was Greek the other was English.  Her accent
on the show is completely made up.

-- 
****************************************************************************
*   Jeff Bamford      jeffb@audiolab.uwaterloo.ca                          *
*  UW 519-885-1211 ext. 3814  Office: PHYS 206  Local: 519-664-1463        * 
****************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
From: cmatting@nyx.cs.du.edu (Chris Mattingly)
Subject: More ramblings about DS9
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 93 07:05:28 GMT

As one of my friend's pointed out, it is an interesting fact that
the lead character is only a Commander.  Doesn't this mean that any and all
ships that come by will have Captains that will outrank him?


--
Chris Mattingly -- Residing in a wonderful dorm at NCSU 
Send all flames to: /dev/null
Send all other stuff to: cmatting@nyx.cs.du.edu
From: gwangung@carson.u.washington.edu (just another theatre geek)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current
Subject: Re: Deep Review 9: "The Emissary" (SPOILERS)
Date: 7 Jan 1993 18:15:02 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: world,local
NNTP-Posting-Host: carson.u.washington.edu

In article <79387@hydra.gatech.EDU> ccoprdj@prism.gatech.EDU (Jorge Diaz) writes:
>In article <1ihmedINNkvp@shelley.u.washington.edu> gwangung@carson.u.washington.edu (Roger Tang) writes:
>>	Besides, if it was selfish, it's a character flaw....which makes
>>her an IMPERFECT character. Thought we wanted that....
>I don't mind greedy, like Quark.
>I don't mind immature, like then new doctor.
>I don't mind selfish, even, if it's not going to put the entire space station
>   at risk.
>But this?  Keep that up, Kira dear, and the show won't last to the end of
>January.  She'll get them all killed.
>Even Kirk had a back door.  What would have happened if the wormhole hadn't
>opened up at that moment?  The station and everyone in it would have been
>destroyed.  And for what?  Nothing except the need for revenge of one woman.

	I see that as a PRINCIPLED woman. As in, give me freedom or give me
death. As in, if you don't make the threat, you get trashed anyway with the
real possibility of the Cardassians going on to the planet and reinvading.
-- 
Roger Tang, gwangung@u.washington.edu
Producer Emeritus, Asian Theatre at the UW, Uncle Bonsai Memorial Fan Club
	"The definition of balls is for a non-singer to go karaoke singing
with the cast of a musical revue."
Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek.current