From: stead@skadi.CSS.GOV (Richard Stead)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: Paying a Reasonable Price for Gas
Date: 6 Nov 92 20:24:44 GMT

In article <92311.081953SROWELL@ESOC.BITNET>, SROWELL@ESOC.BITNET writes:
> In article <1992Nov4.214147.3848@dg-rtp.dg.com>, goudreau@batman.rtp.dg.com (Bob
> Goudreau) says:
> >> In Germany a pride is taken in protecting the environment and the
> >> US should do the same.
> >
> >Given all this German pride, why was the US the world leader in
> >phasing out the use of leaded fuels?  And why does Germany still
> >*subsidize* the production and use of coal?
> 
> a) Phasing Out Leaded Fuels
> 
>    Just because the US did it first (because your cities became all
>    smogged up one day and somebody noticed!) does not make you a

Lead does not contribute to smog.  It is an additive to improve combustion,
but settles as dust and was suspected as one of several lead sources
contributing to lead poisoning in inner city children.  It was the easiest
to eliminate since MTBE was readily available.  So, yes, the US is world
leader here.

>    world leader I'm afraid. You just had to do it first because you
>    had a problem. I'm sure if I said that the Germans were the world
>    leader in car design because the car was invented here (which they
>    were) I'd get some argument.

This has nothing to do with the above argument.  If we are first to eliminate
lead, and we have essentially eliminated it, then we lead.  This can be
taken as a point of pride in cleaning up our environment.  No matter where a car
was first invented (and I would argue against your claim that Germany was the
first in that, for various reasons), car design is an ever-changing area
of development.  Thus an analogous situation with leaded gas would be
if Germany came up with a better-designed unleaded gas.  Then they could
claim a lead in design.  Still, the US would lead in the elimination of lead.

>    In Germany a potential problem was AVERTED by the use of catalytic
>    converters.

Lead in gas poisons catalytic convertors.  Thus this has nothing to do
with leaded gas.  And you don't need to SHOUT.  And don't claim Germany was
first on catalytic convertors - it wasn't, and it doesn't have the most.

> b) Subsidisies on Coal
> 
>    I'm surprised you picked coal (I thought it was rape oil seed these
>    days). Subsidising an industry is an attempt to preserve the indutry
>    and to preserve the thousands of jobs that are associated with it. It
>    is not an attempt to screw up the US. In the UK, you may remember, the
>    government attempted to shut 60% of all coal pits, killing off 30,000
>    jobs. It brings it all into perspective doesn't it?

What perspective?  That Europeans care about the environment only when it
is expedient?  Big deal.  And nobody is claiming a threat to the US here -
it was merely pointed out that Europe does not care about the environment,
but rather subsidizes the most polluting of all fuels - coal.  The subsidies
are making European coal unfairly competitive with other European energy,
it doesn't imapct the US at all.
 
>    The US seems paranoid (this'll get me some flack!). If it's not the
>    Japanese out to get you, it's the Europeans! The US is quite happy when
>    everybody is being nice to them and playing the game their way, but
>    as soon as anybody else decides not to, there's all this furore about
>    unfair trading and placing huge levies on French imports (I'm sure the
>    wine connoisseurs in the US are going to be annoyed!).

The duty on French white wine is a device to get stalled talks on European
agricultural subsidies moving.  A "warning shot across the bow" is the term
we use for such an action.  It is not punitive at this point, since it affects
only a very narrow market.  It merely is intended to indicate that we will not
wait forever for negotiations to complete.


This is getting pretty far from the topic of driving.

--Richard
--
Richard Stead
Center for Seismic Studies
Arlington, VA
stead@seismo.css.gov
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving