Newsgroups: bit.listserv.psycgrad
Date:         Fri, 11 Dec 1992 11:37:09 EST
              <PSYCGRAD@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
From:         Matthew Simpson <054340@UOTTAWA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Common-Sense Knowledge In Psychology
              10 Dec 1992 23:17:12 EST from <zorrilla@CATTELL.PSYCH.UPENN.EDU>

On Thu, 10 Dec 1992 23:17:12 EST Eric Zorrilla said:
>> I'm sorry.  I assume that science transcends racism and myth.  You were
>> the one who wanted to attract these scientifically-minded people so daunted
>> with socializing myths and racism.  I assert that no such creature exists.
>
>You are saying that the child who steals from the everpresent cookie jar
>because he has been taught that stealing from that everpresent cookie
>jar is rotten to the core...

I never said that.  Eric, you must be thinking that I am saying something
completely different from what I have written.  Maybe two interpretations
can be applied to the same words.

>...There IS such a thing as naive ignorance.  To state otherwise,
>IMHO, is simpy being holier-than-thou.

Once again, I did not say that there is no such thing as naive ignorance.
If you read my words carefully, you will se that I am asserting that
when a person is operating on the basis of racism or popular myth, the
person is not thinking scientifically.  Therefore, the concept of a
scientifically-minded racist is oximoronic.  One can think scientifically.
And one can think on the basis of popular myth or racism.  However,
one cannot do them both at the same time.  If I am wrong, you should be
able to provide me with an example of someone who is simultaneously
being scientifically-minded and racist, or who is thinking scientifically
while simultaniously operating on the basis of popular myth.  That's is
the challenge.

>        Saying that "science transcends myth" is asserting, in this case,
>that the tabula rasa child comes to the world with ideas about what is
>scientific investigation and what is not.

The concept of transcendence is not dependent on knowlege before birth,
as you assert here.

>> and recruitment
>Yes, and this is not important?

Yes, it is important.  However, what we are currently doing is sufficient
to provide over a 100:1 grad.-school-applicant to acceptance-to-grad-school
ratio.

>> And the last is self-confidence.
>
>You don't differentiate between "self-confidence" and the
>meaningfulness of one's life?  Perhaps you and Sartre should chat.

Neither do you differentiate between meaningfulness of life and
some other off-the-cuff psycho-babble concept.  What is your point?

>
>> This small group of students will not be on the review boards [referring to
>> those that perceive psychology as a pseudoscience].
>
>Perhaps not YOUR review boards.  But I ALREADY have had most of my review
>boards consist of M.D.'s, and Ph.D.'s in Neuroscience, Endocrinology,
>Microbiology and Immunology.  The study section that looked at my last grant
>had one Ph.D. in psychology.

But they did not have a small group of students from engineering who
thought that all psychologists were psychoannalysts.

>> The solution is in providing psychological tools that fit current social
>> trends
>
>The point of all this (I think) is that we HAVE many of these tools, but no
>one is recognizing them.

We have not yet come up with tools that are THAT worthy of recognition.
If we did, they would be beating down our doors instead of vice versa.
Could you imagine what would have happened if Louis Pasture would not
release his information on the cure of rabbies, yet he was the only one
doing all the curing?

Sorry, no time to do spellchecking right now.  Please don't jump on my case.

have fun!

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