HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Protectionism and Japan
Date: 15 Nov 92 22:58:30 GMT
Distribution: usa,tx
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc

In <BxLzws.8yo@NeoSoft.com> hari@NeoSoft.com (Doug Andersen) writes:

> 
>That's a pretty strange view of trade ("defending our shores from
>invaders").  Again, who wins and who loses when the government blocks
>imports.  The domestic industry wins, the consumers (whether they are
>other companies or individual people) in the U.S. lose.

Well, assuming, of course, that those consumers in the U.S. have jobs
after the places they work are put out of business by foreign
competitors who are subsidized to export by their governments.

> 
>Dumping is simply a way for US companies to get the government to do their
>work for them.

Of course, if OTHER governments didn't provide an edge for their
companies, 'dumping' wouldn't be a problem, would it?  Oh, and let's
keep in mind the difference between 'hard' and 'soft' currencies, too
(which doesn't necessarily apply in this case, but certainly can help
explain part of why some other companies in foreign countries would
rather sell here at a 'loss', insofar as 'official exchange rates'
go.) 

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
From: jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Bush Vetoes Stupid Education Reform Bill
Date: 19 Nov 92 14:07:08 GMT
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Distribution: tx
Organization: Los Tejanos SCUBA Club and Beer Joint, Austin, Tejas

In article <1992Nov19.002507.41777@watson.ibm.com> johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti) writes:
>John F. Haugh II (jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org) wrote:
>: It doesn't matter if it was his own time.  If the teacher could spend the
>: time reading any other material that can be legally owned, he should be
>: able to spend it reading the bible.
>
>Yes it does matter.  His employer can dictate what he can and cannot do as
>a condition of employment.

So let me get this straight.  The Texas Government is free to discriminate
against any employee it feels like.  The Texas Government can tell you, as
an employee, that you MUST read the Bible, or that you MUST NOT read the
Bible.  Whichever it decides, as a condition of employment.  It could even
dictate to women (or men - we have a woman governor ...) that they may not
wear clothes and that they must submit to any sexual advances.  After all,
there is no constitutional prohibition against sexual harassment ...

I'd like to think that the 14th Amendment has something to say about states
restricting the 1st Amendment rights of its citizens.

	Amendment XIV

	All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and
	subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the
	United States and of the State wherein they reside.  No
	State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge
	the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United
	States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life,
	liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor to
	deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
	protection of the laws.

Since religious freedom is a right of citizens of the United States, I'd
say that Texas cannot make or enforce any law abridging that right.
-- 
John F. Haugh II                  [  TSAKC  ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151           [ DoF #17 ]        @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: hari@NeoSoft.com (Doug Andersen)
Subject: Re: TEXAS SCHOOL FINANCE: GRAPPLING WITH FAIR SHARE PLAN
Organization: NeoSoft Communications Services -- (713) 684-5900
Distribution: tx
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:55:09 GMT

In article <1992Nov15.223104.28073@mksol.dseg.ti.com>, mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
     Doug Andersen says:
> >The problem is that people look at
> >wealthy school districts and note how good the schools are.  The problem
> >with that analysis is that it ignores the fact that wealthy school 
> >districts are also filled with kids whose parents are educated and who
> >make sure that kids attend school and do their homework.  There is also
> >some peer pressure at work as the expectation (from both parents and the
> >other students) is that most kids will go to college.  That's a byproduct
> >of the wealth, but it can't be transfered simply by giving more money to
> >the school district.
> 
> It's also not true.  So it's your position that we should give up on
> trying to help anyone, since it will be a futile effort?  Sorry, but
> some of those kids want to learn MORE than those nice, white bread,
> suburban dweebs who have had everything handed to them all their
> lives. 
 
It is true.  The sociology of the school and the surrounding community has
a hell of a lot to do with the results.  Once you get past a certain point
in school funding you start getting frills that might make life nicer, but
have very little to do with the results.  Things like football stadiums,
new band rooms, overhead machines, movie projectors. 
 
> 'Fat' and 'frills' are irrelevant to the question.  Why, Doug, should
> someone have drastically reduced chances to get a decent education
> just because they didn't happen to be born to a nice suburban family? 
 
First of all, no one has shown that we can't achieve a decent public
education with the money we have right now.  There are more than a few
studies that show that once you get past a certain threshold of funding
you get very little bang for your buck (marginal education so to speak).
Isn't it possible that there are other problems, like the structure of
our public schools, that could actually make a difference.
 
You can achieve total equality of school funding if you really want, but
you will give up almost all semblance of local control, and you'll just
increase the flight out of the public schools.  
-- 
Doug Andersen
hari@Sugar.NeoSoft.com
From: jdp@caleb.UUCP (Jim Pritchett)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: What, Me Vote?
Date: 15 Nov 92 20:20:18 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: is sometimes desirable

In article <1992Nov03.164255.2557@NeoSoft.com>, Doug Andersen writes:

> In article <HdoVr*ye1@caleb.UUCP>, jdp@caleb.UUCP (Jim Pritchett) writes:
> > AIDS - you can't stop AIDS until you substantially reduce the behavior that
> >        spreads it.  AIDS is one of the most difficult virii around.  We can't
> >        cure the easier ones, it is very unlikely we will cure this one.  Slick
> >        Willie is NOT going to offend the Gay lobby, so she should vote
> >        Republican here too.
>  
> And how to you reduce the behavior?  You educate people.  Yet, the
> Republicans have fought sex education (even for adults!) every step of the
> way.

The "education" that you are advocating will simply be something like "here's
a condom, go fornicate, you are safe now."  Condoms do NOT provide safety.  The
failure rate is quite unacceptable when the consequence of failure might be
AIDS.

>  
> > hate crimes - you mean like the rioting, looting, and killing in LA?  Liberal
> >               Democrats think that those crimes are "excusable."  So, if you
> >               are against hate crimes, you should vote Republican here too.
>  
> Are you that out of touch?  The number of "hate crimes" (crimes based
> on a person's race, religion, sexual orientation, etc) has skyrocketed in
> recent years.  I don't think the President can do much, but the President
> CAN set a tone of intolerance, something Bush has never strived to do.

YOU are out of touch!  When has the President EVER said anything condoning ANY
hate crime?  The Democrats were falling all over themselves trying to excuse
the LA riots.

> > censorship - huh?  What censorship?  You mean the people who think that tax
> >              dollars shouldn't be used to fund sick, perverted "art"?  Well,
> >              I guess that the Democrats have this one if you like that kind
> >              of "art."
>  
> There is plenty of censorship going on.  I'm not talking about reduced
> funding for art, I'm talking about direct government action to shut down
> someone's free speech.  Check out one of the several groups that monitor
> censorship.

I don't get them.  If you want to make the point here, post some examples
yourself.


                                                Jim Pritchett


UUCP:  rwsys.lonestar.org!caleb!jdp
 or    utacfd.uta.edu!rwsys!caleb!jdp
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti/100000)
Subject: Re: CHOICE: DEBATE BASED ON COMPETING PHILOSOPHIES
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 23:44:18 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: IBM Advanced Workstations and Systems, Austin, TX
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Gerry Palo (gpalo@digi.lonestar.org) wrote:
: A choice system would go far to free the public schools of all those Federal
: and State rules that cost them so much, also of the top-heavy administrative
: structure that is required to enforce them and which tends to perpetuate 
: and grow its own existence over time.

I think just the opposite would happen.  You may have noticed that the
government doesn't give us our money back without a LOT of strings attached.
This voucher money would be contigent on the schools following a bunch of
federal regulations which would make them a lot like the public schools are
today.  Anytime you start to commit public money, you're going to have
bureaucracy.  On the other hand, we're starting to see a lot of really fine
school-choice systems being set up in the private sector, which I think will
be very successful.

--
John Iacoletti       IBM AWS Austin       Internet: johniac@austin.ibm.com
        My opinions do not reflect the views of the IBM Corporation
    "Egad, a base tone denotes a bad age" -- TMBG   "I Palindrome I"
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Subject: Re: Clinton has won...watch your pocket!
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 16:31:34 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: IBM Advanced Workstations and Systems, Austin, TX
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Tom Kimball (tom@europa.lonestar.org) wrote:
: I'll grant you that I was exaggerating on this.  But I have a serious fear
: that a Libertarian President would not safeguard the national security, in a 
: way that goes far beyond my concerns that a Republican or Democrat could weaken 
: the national security.  This one thing is enough to ensure that a Libertarian
: candidate will never get my vote for President or Congress unless they make 
: important changes in their platform.

Have you ever even READ the Libertarian platform?  Allow me to quote from the
1992 platform:

"Any U.S. military  policy  should  have  the  objective  of  providing
security for the lives, liberty and property of the American people in
the U.S. against  the  risk  of  attack  by  a  foreign  power."

Now tell me again why you think a Libertarian president would not safeguard
national security.

--
John Iacoletti       IBM AWS Austin       Internet: johniac@austin.ibm.com
        My opinions do not reflect the views of the IBM Corporation
"Look, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system
 of government"
From: johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Subject: Re: Football Failures at Bowie Force end of Season
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 92 01:09:56 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: IBM Advanced Workstations and Systems, Austin, TX
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

David L. Cathey (davidc@montagar.com) wrote:
: 	Nah, not at all.  You just don't like the method.  I hope to drive
: all this football crap out of school, and let the Pro's start there own
: football camps like more of the other sports...

Good idea.  And then we can drive out the math crap and the history crap and
the English crap, and make ALL employers educate their future employees.

: > I think most of them DO want to learn them (for different reasons).
: 
: 	No you don't.  You've already stated that you think that people
: will take the easy way out.

.. IF they are there as a punishment and not because they want to learn the
subject.

: If they didn't have to, they be at the beach.

Speak for yourself.  Lots of people LIKE to learn the subjects.  I'm sorry
school was such a chore for you.

: 	Who's dictating life?  If they don't like school, leave.  They have 
: that choice.  If they want to play football for a living, they can talk to
: Jimmy.  I have done *nothing* to prevent that.

How would you like it if we dropped everything EXCEPT football.  You don't like
it?  LEAVE!  I'm a taxpayer, and I don't like the curriculum.  Allowing 
somebody to pursue a football education doesn't prevent YOU from getting your
science education or whatever.

--
John Iacoletti       IBM AWS Austin       Internet: johniac@austin.ibm.com
        My opinions do not reflect the views of the IBM Corporation
    "Egad, a base tone denotes a bad age" -- TMBG   "I Palindrome I"
Newsgroups: tx.politics
From: tk@pssparc2.mitek.com (Tom Kimball)
Subject: Re: Clinton has won...watch your pocket!
Organization: OpenConnect Systems, Dallas, TX
Distribution: tx
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:32:13 GMT

In article <1992Nov14.000811.14420@cpqhou.compaq.com> thomasr@cpqhou.UUCP (Thomas Rush) writes:
>Of course they don't.  But you can either look back at this post in
>four years and laugh at me, or you can think that maybe the 1996
>election is where you ought to start voting Libertarian.

I don't want Texas to become the 13th province of Cuba in 1997.
-- 
Tom Kimball 	OpenConnect Systems	
          	2711 LBJ Freeway, Suite 800
tk@oc.com      	Dallas, TX  75006
From: jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Bush Vetoes Stupid Education Reform Bill
Date: 15 Nov 92 16:02:17 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: UT Health Science Center Houston

In article <Bxo977.3C3@NeoSoft.com> rocky@NeoSoft.com (Joe Mullally) writes:
>	Are you saying that one could _not_ believe in the existence
>of the Christian God, for example, without denying He exists?

That is exactly my position: I do not believe that there is a God, in any of
the molds that the various religions espouse. I recognize, however, that the
possibility exists. I simply do not have enough evidence to form an opinion
one way or the other.
-- 
Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC, PP-ASEL | Never ascribe to malice that which can
jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu      | adequately be explained by stupidity.
           "Cat: Four legs and an attitude." -- Jim Reese
From: reed@rd08.wg2.waii.com (Michael Reed)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: CHOICE: DEBATE BASED ON COMPETING PHILOSOPHIES
Date: 18 Nov 92 15:49:01 GMT
Reply-To: reed@rd08.wg2.waii.com
Distribution: tx
Organization: Western Geophysical Research & Development

In article <1992Nov13.140629.5961@mksol.dseg.ti.com>, mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
|> In <1992Nov12.190305.23973@cpqhou.compaq.com> thomasr@cpqhou.compaq.com (Thomas Rush) writes:
|> 
|> >In article <1992Nov10.144456.24487@mksol.dseg.ti.com> mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
|> >>
|> >>Well, private schools average about half the cost of public schools in
|> >>this country because over half the private schools are parochial in
|> >>nature and hence have a cost advantage (due to tax exemptions on
|> >>church property, the ability to have 'religious' payment to teachers
|> >>as part of their compensation (have a priest teach the math class,
|> >>since he costs a lot less than a 'private enterprise' teacher), etc.).
|> 
|> >I have yet to see a public school pay property taxes.  In fact, when I
|> >was growing up, the Federal Government paid my (public) school district
|> >for the value of the property tax that would have been collected if
|> >the various federally-owned land had been in private hands.
|> 
|> Yes, and now lets talk about all the State and Federal rules that that
|> public school has to comply with that that private school doesn't.
|> EVEN SO, the NON-PAROCHIAL private school is not significantly less
|> expensive (if at all) than the public school.  It is the preponderance
|> of parochial schools (with the cheap teachers, administration, etc.)
|> that lower that aggragate cost for private schools.  Talking about
|> 'private schools' as a single group just doesn't make much sense,
|> since it subdivides into two groups with quite different
|> characteristics (and costs).
|> 

How many private schools have to offer programs for the handicapped,
the retarded, the learning disabled, the emotionally disturbed?  My
guess is that if those expensive programs were eliminated from the
public school budgets you would find the cost per student in the
public schools much closer to that of the average private school.

-- 
The above are my own opinions and mine alone.

*****************************************************************************
Dr. Michael Reed,
Western Geophysical, Research and Development Group
reed@rd08.wg2.waii.com
(713) 964-6322                     FAX: (713) 964-6372
*****************************************************************************
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Burning questions of costs (was Re: Football Failures at Bowie Force end of Season)
Date: 15 Nov 92 17:17:16 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc

In <21870@rpp386.lonestar.org> jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II) writes:


>In John Haugh's particular case, John Haugh's house will soon have a
>fire alarm that is connected to a central station that reports straight
>to the Fire Department.  John Haugh will pay for this improvement to
>his house with his own money.  This improvement will save money for the
>Fire Department because they won't get called out when his house is
>fully involved in a fire.  This will also save fire fighters lives
>since fewer of them will be involved in putting out the fire, in case
>John isn't able to put it out himself (and John does have a nice sized
>fire extinguisher in the house that he knows how to use.)

>John Haugh should pay less in taxes because he is so thoughtful.  You
>should get to take this same approach to providing for your own
>personal security and get a tax cut as well.

Or perhaps John Haugh should pay more, since all these improvements
make his house worth more and he has more to protect and more to lose?
Therefore, the free market price of protection should be worth more to
John (because of the greater loss potential).

FLAME BAIT ALERT:

>[ And he =really= should pay less because he is using fewer of those
>  "externalities" Fred bleats on about. ]

MOOOOooooooooo!

Now then, since I have your attention, why is it that you can't write
a note without putting in flame bait when you are responding to
something you disagree with, John?

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
From: mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Football Failures at Bowie Force end of Season
Date: 18 Nov 92 15:04:52 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: Texas Instruments Inc

In <21891@rpp386.lonestar.org> jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II) writes:

>In article <1992Nov16.185858.14918@watson.ibm.com> johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti/100000) writes:

>>You mean I'm missing Fred's point of having schools.  And we all know that 
>>Fred's opinion is the only one that matters.

>Of course Fred's right.  If he wasn't right, he wouldn't post so damned
>much.  It's like Hyundai and the $700 per car they spend on advertising.

You know, the idea of two of the largest posters in this newsgroup
complaining about MY volume just strikes me as rather funny.  Not to
mention the idea of two of the people who have the most closed minds
I've ever seen complaining about MY believing that 'only my opinion
matters' is simply hilarious.

And of course, then there's all the flaime-bait -- get a life, guys.

-- 
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fred.McCall@dseg.ti.com - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.
From: curt@ekhadafi.austin.ibm.com (Curt Finch 903 2F021 curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com 512-838-2806)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Bill to legalize carrying handguns
Date: 17 Nov 92 19:12:17 GMT
Distribution: tx
Organization: IBM AWD, Austin

dewey@vpdbox.austin.ibm.com writes:

>Rep. Bill Carter, R-Richland Hills, said Monday he plans to file legislation
>to allow "propoerly trained, law-abiding citizens" to carry concealed
>weapons to protect themselves and prevent crime.

Are these the kind of people typically involved in handgun related
deaths or not?

-- 
--
curt@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com (Curt L. Finch) | AIX NFS/NIS Field Quality 
My views are unrelated to those of IBM     |        Austin, TX
- FICA isn't a retirement plan. Money's spent. It'll be gone when you need it.-
From: jfh@rpp386.lonestar.org (John F. Haugh II)
Newsgroups: tx.politics
Subject: Re: Football Failures at Bowie Force end of Season
Date: 21 Nov 92 23:03:53 GMT
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Distribution: tx
Organization: Los Tejanos SCUBA Club and Beer Joint, Austin, Tejas

In article <1992Nov20.010030.19360@watson.ibm.com> johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti) writes:
>I'm not complaining about your volume.  I just find it hilarious that you
>supposedly don't have the time to support your arguments, when you obviously
>have the time to post scads of other stuff.

This morning's news expiration was for 4 days (I adjust it based on the
amount of free space, so it isn't ``fixed'').

Of the 199 articles in /usr/spool/news/tx/politics, this is the breakdown
by number of articles and total size.  I only list the posters who have
posted more articles in the last four days than me since I don't want
someone to claim that I picked the Top 5 because I'm number 6 ...

Poster		Articles	Total Blocks
Fred McCall	43		328
John Iacoletti	24		120
Doug Andersen	20		102
Curt Finch	19		108
Jim Pritchett	15		70
John Haugh	14		76

This accounts for 135 of 199 (68%) of total articles.  The disk usage
accounts for 804 of 1190 blocks (68%) of total disk space.  Based on that,
Fred is fully 21.6% of the traffic in this group.  No wonder he doesn't
have time to back up any of what he writes - he has quite a quota to fill.

Speaking of which, these are the stats for how much he DOES write and how
long it takes him.  He seems to post between 8AM and 9AM Central time.
Which means that either he doesn't get to work til 9:30AM or so, or he is
lying about posting on his own time.  His last article on 11/20 was posted
at 9:24 CST, so you be the judge.  Using the time between articles as the
length of time to write the second article (which assumes he doesn't read
the article he is responding to ...), he averages roughly 6.5 minutes
per article.  The median is about 5 minutes.  There were 17 articles
taking less than 5 minutes, 4 taking about 5 minutes, and 18 taking more
than 5 minutes.  Four articles were discarded because of the technique
used to calculate the time.  This gives a total of 43 articles posted to
tx.politics in 4 days time.  The standard deviation for writing each
article about 4.84 minutes.  The average number of articles is 10.75 per
day, median is 8, standard deviation is 4.99.  Friday was a "big" day for
him ...

Of course, this doesn't include the other groups that he posts to, so all
of these numbers are one the low side.
-- 
John F. Haugh II                  [  TSAKC  ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151           [ DoF #17 ]        @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
[ITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOYITSABOY]