HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kberry@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Kim A. Berry)
Subject: Re: Jumping the Good Ship California
Organization: Sacramento Public Access Unix, Sacramento, Ca.
Distribution: ca
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 03:28:51 GMT


o    The 1990 AFDC to citizen children of illegal aliens was
     $249,000,000.*

o    LA County Health Services spent $143.4 million in fiscal 1989-
     1990 on health care for illegal aliens.*

o    1/5 of those arrested during the LA Riots were illegal aliens.

o    80% of Californians believe something should be done to
     prevent further increases in their state's population.

* Reference: The Outlook, May 9, 1991

Much of our state's financial problems and deteriorating quality
of life are due to population increase, and 50% of the population
increase is due to immigration. Immigrants tend to earn lower
wages, thus paying less in income and property tax, but due to
family size often receive a disproportionate amount of benefit from
government programs, such as welfare and education.

Two organizations are trying to limit California's population:

     Californians for Population Stabilization (CAPS)
     926 J Street, Suite 915
     Sacramento, CA 95814
     (916) 446-1033
     Ric Oberlink, Executive Director

CAPS branched off of the national ZPG organization about 5 years
ago.

     Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR)
     Sacramento: (916) 444-FAIR
     San Diego:  (619) 233-8072

FAIR is actively lobbying for a three year moratorium on
immigration.

I am third generation Sacramentan who considered moving to the
northwest to escape the crime and congestion, but decided to stay
due to family ties. It is depressing how people are willing to
uproot their lives but won't take the time to voice their
opposition to major subdivisions at county board meetings.

I urge anyone interested in preserving the quality of life in
California to join one of the above organizations.

What can be done?

1.   Support S.1218 John Seymour, CA: make it a felony to return
     to California after being deported.

2.   Support HR 3605: Limit citizenship-by-birth to mothers who are
     legal U.S. residents.

3.   Support HR.3441: Prohibit welfare payments to illegal aliens.

The above are pending legislation. Strange as it sounds, there is
strong opposition to these bills, and they need your support!

4.   Provide tax exemptions only for the first two children.

5.   Quit subsidizing new subdivisions. 

6.   Compel California businesses to hire locally before recruiting
     out-of-state.

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------
        Kim Berry              kberry@sactoh0.SAC.CA.US

Newsgroups: ca.general
From: jeff@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Jeff Skaletsky)
Subject: Re: Stinking earthquake ins.
Organization: Quake Public Access, San Fernando Valley, CA (818)362-6092
Distribution: ca
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 07:15:20 GMT

In article <1992Aug24.212819.25828@gdwest.gd.com> stlucas@gdwest.gd.com (Joseph St. Lucas) writes:
>I'm sorry I didn't pay more attention months ago, but the earthquake 
>insurance rider that the state forced all the agencies to tack onto
>the homeowners policies, ($30-$35), didn't they drop it?  I just

Not dropped.  And you're lucky - I paid $60 +$1 for "handling cost" - 
both Allstate and State Farm quoted me on it, told me it was NOT optional.
I even had to write State Farm a separate check for it, and it was not
financible as part of the regular premium.

Guess I get to pay $60 due to my locale...

and, yes, my system is called Quake because I'm next to Veteran's
Memorial Park in Sylmar, which used to be Veteran's Hospital until 1971...

-Jeff
From: jeuck@unix.sri.com (Philip Jeuck)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: Re: Stinking earthquake ins.
Date: 26 Aug 92 18:45:24 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: SRI International

In article <BtKxHM.CpM@quake.sylmar.ca.us> jeff@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Jeff Skaletsky) writes:
>Not dropped.  And you're lucky - I paid $60 +$1 for "handling cost" - 
>both Allstate and State Farm quoted me on it, told me it was NOT optional.
>I even had to write State Farm a separate check for it, and it was not
>financible as part of the regular premium.

State Farm does not require you to pay it.  In fact my agent advised me not 
to pay it and told me it would not affect my regular insurance at all.  I 
didn't pay it and haven't been billed for it and my policy is payed up.

>-Jeff

Phil Jeuck
jeuck@unix.sri.com
Newsgroups: ca.general
From: richg@hatch.socal.com (Rich Greenberg)
Subject: Re: English as a foreign language
Organization: Hatch Usenet and E-mail.  Playa del Rey, CA
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 20:49:34 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.055033.36022@watson.ibm.com> w2dz@watson.ibm.com (Daniel Zalik) writes:
>I have some friends living in LA that have recently immigrated from Russia.
>Their english is not bad and they find that the english classes, be they in
>Jewish Community Centers or others that they have learned about, offer
>only very basic remidiation in english. They desperately desire to improve
>thier accents and grammar, but can not find an environment suitable to those
>ends. I have suggested that they try to make as many english speaking
>acquaintances as possible. However since their exposure is limited I
>wonder if anyone knows other courses of action.

Anybody want to join a partnership to offer 1-900-ENGLISH?

:-)))

-- 
                
Rich Greenberg - N6LRT - 310-649-0238 - richg@hatch.socal.com
Newsgroups: ca.general
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: California (LA is NOT all the same)
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 05:49:42 GMT
Distribution: ca

>HOGWASH! "LA" starts in San Clemente and ends west of Thousand
>Oaks in one dimension, and it goes from Santa Monica to east of
>San Bernardino the other way.  And the tentacles are spreading
>ever further.
>
>>By "LA," I, as a non-resident of same, refer to the solid mass of
>>houses, industrial parks, Burger Kings, and linear shopping malls
>>that clog the above mentioned boundaries.  You can talk all you
>>want to about different living conditions, the "spirit" of a
>>certain area, etc.  But as one who has to drive thru "LA" to get
>>anywhere (I live in San Diego), it's all a seemingly unending
>>freeway, and the best I can ever hope for is to get thru it in
>>less than 2 hours!

Let's see:
there is "The City of LA," "the County of LA," the "LA Basin,"
and clear, and extremely important generalizations of LA.  Suburbs of
LA ALL count as parts of LA.  I now count Ventura and Oxnard as part of LA.
San Diego and Orange County, SB and Riveside Counties are part of LA as
far as I am concern.  I can remember when the 101 didn't go thru Thousand Oaks
and I5 didn't exist to San Diego (San Onofre was one of the reasons I
wanted to go into nuclear engineering), and these freeways didn't exist
I WOULD say that those cities/counties weren't part of LA.

You have to ignore lines on a map for a moment like the SB-Riverside-OC
borders because the smog doesn't know these boundaries.  Trivia:
what's the evevation of the highest point in LA county?   And Palmdale also
has its own smog problem.  At the same boundaries are important in silly ways.
Technically, the house I lived in was part of the LA Strip (an insideous way
for LA to exert power on bordering cities and have a harbor (it worked there,
never happened in the Bay Area)), our mail address was a nearby "South Bay"
city (LA probably learned to do this from Athens).

And that's not all LA.  There are vast tracts of land in the Owens Valley
for that the masses could get water rights.  And of course only people
count in this world, so the 200 miles as far as Mammoth Mtn, I count as
a part of LA, that water "has" to support "LA" and if you don't
hold with that, let a few resident blow up the aquaduct.

SO as far as I am concern you both missed the mark with less than adequate
distances.  But the same thing is happening in the Bay Area.  Just watch
the open space disappear.

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Resident Cynic, Rock of Ages Home for Retired Hackers
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Second Favorite email message: Returned mail: Cannot send message for 3 days
A Ref: Mathematics and Plausible Reasoning, vol. 1, G. Polya
From: akumar@pollux.usc.edu (Anant Kumar)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: SpicMacay:L. Subramaniam(violin):LEC-DEM:Sep23:FREE
Date: 2 Sep 1992 09:23:33 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: ca
NNTP-Posting-Host: pollux.usc.edu


  Society for Promotion of Indian Classical Music And Culture Amongst Youth
                                (SPIC-MACAY)

                                 presents

                   An evening (Lecture-Demonstration) with

			      Violin Virtuoso


                             Dr. L. SUBRAMANIAM


				accompanied
			    on the MRIDANGAM by
				  GANESH

                        Wednesday Sept. 23, 1992, 7:30 pm.
			
   		     Crystal Cove Auditorium, Student Center
			   University of California
				   Irvine


		**ALSO AT:
		 US International Univ., SAN DIEGO. Sept. 24th, 7:30 pm.
			  Call (619) 291 9377 for more Info.
		**

                        ADMISSION FREE AND OPEN TO ALL.
	     (First Come First Served, limited by hall capacity)

		For CARPOOL and other info, contact:

                           UC, Irvine       (714) 856-3589 (Sanjiv)
                           USC, Los Angeles (213) 745-2917 (Kartik)
                           UC, Los Angeles  (310) 312-1644 (Munira)
			   CSU, Fullerton   (714) 992-5875 (Subha)

                or e-mail: narayan@ics.uci.edu (sanjiv)
			   anantk@usc.edu (anant)

Lecture-Demonstration: 
---------------------
The artist explains the art form and its intricacies. 
Dr. Subramaniam will present the Violin as a Carnatic music instrument
and explain the subtleties of Indian music.

Directions and Parking:
----------------------

 405 south or 5 South
 exit Jamboree go right
 left at campus
 right at bridge (2nd light)
 left at Pereira (1st light) 
 enter parking garage on the left.
 Crystal Cove is in the Student Center opp from the garage,

 PARKING: $ 2 per car.

Xref: sparky ca.general:1104 ca.politics:7150
From: ts@cup.portal.com (Tim W Smith)
Newsgroups: ca.general,ca.politics
Subject: Re: An exhortation about State Taxes
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 21:53:17 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: ca

6% of my income went to The IOU State a couple years ago.  Another couple
of hundred went to register my car.  Another 5% or so of my income went
to The IOU State via sales taxes.

Don't hold your breath waiting for guilt to whelm me.

--Tim Smith
From: ts@cup.portal.com (Tim W Smith)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: Re: Leaving California
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 92 23:54:53 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: usa
  <case.18.714844698@ucs.sdsu.edu> <111@steiny.com>
  <=2dnrq-.kilroy@netcom.com>

And don't forget, if you own a home, and borrow against the equity, you
can deduct the interest on that loan.  If you pay for expensive things
(cars, boats, planes, etc.) this way, you in effect get a nice discount
on them.

--Tim Smith
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: Re: Jumping the Good Ship California
Date: 1 Sep 92 19:58:17 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Distribution: ca
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA
Originator: daemon@sword.eng.pyramid.com

In article <1992Sep1.032851.29612@sactoh0.sac.ca.us> kberry@sactoh0.sac.ca.us (Kim A. Berry) writes:
>
>
>FAIR is actively lobbying for a three year moratorium on
>immigration.
>
>I am third generation Sacramentan who considered moving to the
   
      With postings like yours, its too bad they can't make that
      moratorium retroactive.  
>
>I urge anyone interested in preserving the quality of life in
>California to join one of the above organizations.
>
      Care to bet on what the folks here BEFORE your ancestors
      thought of them and you?

      Ya ever stop to think YOU wouldn't be here if those folks had
      the same selfish greedy attitude you do?   

      This posting was a pretty good example of the "I've got mine
      and I'm not about to share" mentality...which is what's REALLY
      wrong with California, IMNHO.
From: mludwig@bonnie.ics.uci.edu (Michael Scott Ludwig)
Subject: Re: Jumping the Good Ship California
Newsgroups: ca.general
Reply-To: mludwig@ics.uci.edu (Michael Scott Ludwig)
Organization: Univ. of Calif., Irvine, Info. & Computer Sci. Dept.
Date: 28 Aug 92 09:51:30 GMT
Distribution: ca

bjperry@base.cs.ucla.edu (Brad Perry) writes:
=In article <BtCuvC.1ss@well.sf.ca.us> casey@well.sf.ca.us (Kathleen Creighton) writes:
=>
=>Ellon, I started this thread because I wanted to hear what people had to
=>say about it.  It isn't about you, it wasn't started for you, and no one
=>forced you to participate.  If it offends you, you're welcome to put the
=>subject header in your kill file.
=
=and she simply responded with the alternative viewpoint.  Sorry
=to burst your bubble Kathleen, but there are those of us who really
=enjoy CA and will say so when given the chance (and there are those
=of us who would LOVE for all the whining babies to move to Kansas
=and un-clog our freeways).

But there's a difference between those two things.

Kathleen was asking why people might want to leave the state (sorry if I
didn't express her thoughts well enough).  It's perfectly alright to say why
you don't want to leave CA.

But it's a different thing when you start saying why you want *other* people
to leave the state.  When you do that, *you* almost sound like a whining
baby.

P.S. For Kathleen's (and other people's) edification, I'm a native.  I like
most things about the S.F. Bay Area.  I'll prob. start my career there.  But
if economic opportunity allows me to, I'll prob. move to one of the bigger
cities in Oregon or Washington a few years down the line, mainly due to CA
cities becoming too populous.


"Planet Bog - pools of toxic chemicals | Michael Ludwig
bubble under a choking atmosphere      |
of poisonous gases.  But aside from    | mludwig@bonnie.ics.uci.edu
that, it's not much like Earth."       |
        - Calvin (of Calvin & Hobbes)  | UCI and I don't agree on anything.
--
Michael S. Ludwig
Newsgroups: ca.general
From: hahn@gigantor.nas.nasa.gov (Jonathan Hahn)
Subject: Long Commutes (was Jumping the Good Ship California)
Organization: Unetix Inc. @ NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 21:31:58 GMT
Distribution: ca

In article <wallich.714172671@lupine> wallich@NCD.COM (Kenneth Wallich) writes:
>casey@well.sf.ca.us (Kathleen Creighton) writes:
>>Have you thought about leaving yourself?
>
>I think about it every day I drive into the smog from the Santa Cruz
>mountains.

>  I doubt I'll be here
>in 5 years though.  The smog and traffic have gotten too depressing to
>live with in the long run.

Did it ever occur to you that during your roughly 90+ minute daily
commute, you contribute more than your fair share of pollution and use
more than your fair share of (non-renewable) natural resources?
(Granted, you may not drive to work every day and may car pool.  If so,
congratulations;  but plenty of people commute individually from Santa
Cruz, San Francisco, etc. to the valley daily and I direct my comments
to them).

I understand that as far as present market forces go, you are simply
doing your fair share of burning gas.  However, I believe long commutes
are priced too low since they don't adequately take into account
traffic and pollution.

In your post, you complain about the smog and trafic, but you cause
much more smog and traffic than the average valley person.  It is we
(valley people) who should be complaining.

Just trying to put things in perspective.  Rather than being depressed,
you should be celebrating that the price of gas allows you live in a
beautiful area so far from where you work, enjoying a quality of life
greater than those of us who live in this smoggy valley. :-)/2.
Perhaps we should all move to Santa Cruz too?  I hear it's pretty nice
out there. :-)

-jonathan hahn
--
hahn@nas.nasa.gov					wk: (415) 604-4360
..!ames!amelia!hahn					hm: (408) 736-7014
Newsgroups: ca.general
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: Jumping the Good Ship California
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 16:25:45 GMT

In article <5023@bacon.IMSI.COM> jordan@IMSI.COM (Jordan Hayes) writes:
>Who was the idiot who decided to put a
>huge urban center at the base of a mountain range that traps the wind
>off the ocean?

First the Indians who moved there, next the Spanish (visit Alvera St.),
then the Mexicans, then the gringos, then Ed Mulhulland, ...
The Indians has a large enough culture that they knew the Basin trapped
smoke (which the Spanish saw from their boats).  CA.history.

>Ironically, the event (building of the freeways) that "made" LA also
>destroyed it.

We, the human race, "didn't know" at the time. 8^).
They seemed a good idea at the time (1940) [years before me].

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Resident Cynic, Rock of Ages Home for Retired Hackers
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Second Favorite email message: Returned mail: Cannot send message for 3 days
A Ref: Mathematics and Plausible Reasoning, vol. 1, G. Polya
From: jordan@IMSI.COM (Jordan Hayes)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: Re: Jumping the Good Ship California
Date: 31 Aug 92 02:06:17 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: Investment Management Services Inc., NYC

Robert S. Helfman <helfman@aero.org> writes:

	The problem with most people who complain about traffic is that
	they have this perverse desire/need/compulsion to live
	somewhere far from work.

You're assuming that living in one place is just the same (modulo a
commute) as living in another.  It turns out that for many people,
SillyValley is simply uninhabitable.  Heck, I'd blame it on the
companies who decided that it was a good idea to put all those jobs in
an undesirable (now at least -- I hear Sunnyvale used to be a nice
place 50 years ago) place.  Condo Hell?  No thanks, I prefer living in
*actual* neighborhoods, grown over time, with access to culture, rather
than the suburban sprawl that claims to have "cities" like Mountain
View and such ...

Oh, but I see from your return address that you "live" in LA?  That
must be why it doesn't seem to bother you much where you live, since LA
is just one big suburb.

Wait, which group is this?!? ;-)

/jordan
From: ts@cup.portal.com (Tim W Smith)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: Re: Jumping the Good Ship California
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 22:24:21 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: ca

> I know several people who have left California recently, and I'm hearing
> more talk about it.  Do you have a general sense of incoming/outgoing?
> Have you thought about leaving yourself?

I just left at the start of this month.  I didn't change jobs though.
I work for a company that had offices both in Silicon Valley and in
Port Orchard, Washington.  The Silicon Valley office closed when the
owners moved up here.  They were about to have their first child, and
wanted to buy a house and get out of city living (they've got a wonderful
location now -- on top of a hill, with a spectacular view of an inlet
on one side, and about 1/2 acre of dense forest behind the house, but I
digress).

When they moved the office, I stayed, working from my apartment.  I've
now moved to Seattle to attend the University of Washington School of
Law.  While I wait for school to start, I continue to work for the
company, at the same salary.

My paychecks are bigger, though.  Washington does not have a state income
tax.  Nyeh nyeh nyeh! :-)

The state sales tax here is higher, though.  It is 6.5%, compared to
Califiournia's 4.75%.  Gasoline tax is $.22/gallon compared to $.14.

Before anyone says "what the hell do you mean by 4.75% sales tax," let
me remind you that much of sales tax is county or city sales tax.  The
4.75% is *STATE* sales tax (as is the 6.5% for Washington).  Here in
Seattle, I seem to be paying an 8.2% sales tax, and I seem to recall
paying around 8% in Silicon Valley.

--Tim Smith
Newsgroups: ca.general
Subject: Re: Long Commutes (was Jumping the Good Ship California)
From: markp@pro-palmtree.socal.com (Mark Panitz)
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 16:34:18 GMT
Organization: The Palmtree BBS - 310/453-8726 - Santa Monica, CA

and once in San Jose you can go anyplace (ie Bart via the Santa Clara
Transit to Freemont
From: mludwig@bonnie.ics.uci.edu (Michael Scott Ludwig)
Subject: Re: Long Commutes (was Jumping the Good Ship California)
Newsgroups: ca.general
Reply-To: mludwig@ics.uci.edu (Michael Scott Ludwig)
Organization: Univ. of Calif., Irvine, Info. & Computer Sci. Dept.
Date: 28 Aug 92 10:22:23 GMT
Distribution: ca

hahn@gigantor.nas.nasa.gov (Jonathan Hahn) writes:
=In article <wallich.714172671@lupine> wallich@NCD.COM (Kenneth Wallich) writes:
=>
=>I think about [leaving] every day I drive into the smog from the Santa Cruz
=>mountains.
=
=>  I doubt I'll be here
=>in 5 years though.  The smog and traffic have gotten too depressing to
=>live with in the long run.
=
=Did it ever occur to you that during your roughly 90+ minute daily
=commute, you contribute more than your fair share of pollution and use
=more than your fair share of (non-renewable) natural resources?
=(Granted, you may not drive to work every day and may car pool.  If so,
=congratulations;  but plenty of people commute individually from Santa
=Cruz, San Francisco, etc. to the valley daily and I direct my comments
=to them).
=
=In your post, you complain about the smog and trafic, but you cause
=much more smog and traffic than the average valley person.  It is we
=(valley people) who should be complaining.

For those people who work in the valley and live on the other side of the
hill, not only are there carpools and vanpools, but since a few days after
the '89 quake, the Hwy. 17 Express bus has run between the Scotts Valley
Park & Ride Lot and San Jose, approximately every 15 minutes
peak-hours/peak-direction.  It's another reason why I have to wonder about
the people that drive alone and complain about the peak-hour traffic on that
four-lane highway.

Not that the people who live and work in the valley should feel guilt-free
driving alone - there are several mass-transit options available there.


"We have not inherited the earth    |    Michael Ludwig
from our ancestors, but are         |
borrowing it from our children."    |    mludwig@bonnie.ics.uci.edu
                                    |
 - David Brower, conservationist    |    UCI and I don't agree on anything.
--
Michael S. Ludwig
Newsgroups: ca.general