From: cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher Morton)
Subject: Re: Sanity arrives to this group! Welcome back Susan!
Reply-To: cmort@ncoast.org (Christopher Morton)
Organization: North Coast Public Access *NIX, Cleveland, OH
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 14:16:08 GMT
Followup-To: talk.politics.guns

As quoted from <susan.703387047@coombs> by susan@coombs.anu.edu.au (Susan McDonald):

> 	Perhaps it was a poor choice of words, however, when taken in
> the context of what that post was about ("Someone picking a fight") those
> words make a little more sense.  When I wrote them, I meant, and what
> obviously Chris decided to ignore, either intentionally or unintentionally,
> was that I mean that when someone provokes a fight if you return in kind,
> all you are doing is playing directly into their hands.  They WANTED that
> fight and here you are providing them with the opportunity to beat you
> up.

"Poor choice of words"?  It was exactly what you meant to say.  If you don't
have the integrity to own up to your own statements, that's not anybody ELSE'S
fault.  The context was CRYSTAL clear, since I explicitly framed it in MY
comments to which YOU responded.  Are you saying that you responded to my
comments without READING them?

But the above is moot anyway, since you've just restated what was said before.
Silly me for providing somebody with an "opportunity to beat me up" by being
Black.  Silly Harvey Fierstein for doing the same thing by being gay.  The
Germans sure knew how to deal with troublemakers like US, huh?  Apparently
some Australians have the same idea.

> 	When I said "such bigots should be pitied and ignored, not
> physically fought against" I mean that people when faced with a provocation
> of that type (ie, "Hey, you, you poofta/lesbian/queer/nigger!") should
> not out of some mistaken (IMO) sence of honour get into a fight with them.

That's NOT what you SAID, and it's painfully obvious that you don't MEAN it
NOW.  You're SAYING it because you got caught.  Your actual sentiments don't
seem to have changed one IOTA.  You're STILL blaming the VICTIM.

> Instead they should ignore the provocation and actually pity the person who
> has made it because of some misguided bigotry.

But of course you offer no DIFFERENT advice for somebody who's the victim of a
violent assault.  Why SHOULD you.  You haven't changed your position at all,
merely tried to obscure it.  You STILL impose upon gays and minorities a DUTY
TO DIE.  SOME of them don't accept that "duty".  I hear that some Jewish
troublemakers were similarly recalcitrant at Treblinka and in the Warsaw
Ghetto.  Must have been typical men, huh?

> 	To Christopher and others, it seems that such a suggestion as actually
> avoiding a fight, rather than allowing others to provoke it and fulfill their
> wishes for a fight, is anethema.  To me, at least, that is more the thinking
> of small boys who have to prove their "toughness" than mature adults who
> don't go looking for fights if they can avoid them.

It doesn't SEEM, but is there in black and white for all to see, that Susan
expects gays and minorities to be savagely beaten and possibly killed,         
"pitying" rather than "resisting" their murderers.  That is neither the 
attitude of mature adults nor of small boys.  It's the attitude of gay bashers
and White supremacists.  I didn't realize that the National Front was so
active in OZ....



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