HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: RPT378@MAINE.MAINE.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Re: John Daly
Date: 30 Jul 92 13:36:45 GMT
Organization: University of Maine System

In reference to the Daly exibition...I guess I've felt for a while that John
was really a pretty good kid; I suspect that he will become a very good golfer
if he learns to handle celebrity.  He seems to be a very talented guy who may
learn to handle golf courses better.  But if he can't learn to handle fame, he
will probably fizzle.  LZ
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: john@sequent.com (John Vander Borght)
Subject: Re: Cook blows British Open
Keywords: n
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: sqnt
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 17:15:08 GMT

gattuso@ssd.comm.mot.com (Christopher Gattuso) writes:

>>I found another thing disappointing. In previous Opens we've 
>>been treated to the BBC's coverage. This year it was the network
>>coverage and it was quite sad by comparison. You get to see the
>>top 4 or 5 competitors most of the time. A lot of closeups
>>(who cares) of their faces and lengthy delays while we wait for 
>>putts. Occasionally you tapes of hole in ones and shots of 
>>Greg Norman once in a while.
>>
>>It was done the way it's done each week on the PGA coverage.
>>
>>Too much putting and too few competitors shown.

>This is not true.  ABC used the BBC Coverage but with different announcers.
>This was mentioned at the beginning of the telecast, because they were 
>amazed at the 200 ft. crane tower they used to follow tee shots.

They did say that they had a few of their own cameras also to provide
coverage of Americans that the Beeb didn't cover, but for the most part it
was the BBC broadcast with the American announcers and graphics, both of
which are significantly worse than the British ones.  I really like the
BBCs way of showing a players 18 individual hole scores.

John Vander Borght
john@sequent.com
-- 
"Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty!"
John Vander Borght
john@sequent.com
From: martin@chiton.ucsd.edu (Martin Olivera)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Re: Ruling Question
Date: 24 Jul 92 18:38:52 GMT
Organization: UCSD - Scripps Inst. of Oceanogr. - MPL

In article <1992Jul24.134530.14035@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com> gattuso@ssd.comm.mot.com (Christopher Gattuso) writes:
>I know this isn't a great question, but maybe someone could help me:
>
>I am a lefty golfer (about 12 handicap).  I am not great but better than
>average.  I was playing for money with my friends yesterday and had a crap
>lie, that was impossible for a lefty to hit it, but easy for a righty.  So, 
>I asked one of my friends to borrow a wedge (he is righty). Everybody was
>laughing and such.  I am kind of ambidextorous and have experience swinging
>a club righty.  Anyway, I was about 100 yards away and put the ball about 10
>feet from the stick.  The laughing immediately stopped and they called foul
>saying I was in the wrong using someone elses club.
>
>Is that illegal???  My opponent gave me the club to use with consent.
>
>Outcome:  I told them to shove it, that it was too impressive (I couldn't 
>do it again if I tried) to call illegal.  Sank the putt to double the 
>stakes, and walked off with my team winning $12.

First, you should get, read and keep in your bag a "Rules of Golf" book (it 
costs about US$1.50, and it's worth all 150 pennies and more). You'll like 
Rule 4-4 which deals EXACTLY with the situation you just posted.

Now, that being said, this would be a rough summary:

You may add clubs to your bag as you play a round, so long as the total amount
in the bag does not exceed 14 clubs. Adding means you can buy them at the shop,
or someone can bring them to you, or you can borrow them from another 
competitor. HOWEVER, if you borrow a club from another player, the other player 
MAY NOT have the club back until the stipulated round is completed. Another 
thing you MAY do is to replace a broken club with another one, but this
applies only if the club was broken in a manner other than caused by normal
play (i.e., you MAY replace a 5-iron that broke as you were taking a stroke,
but you MAY NOT replace a club that broke when you smashed it into a tree out
of anger). Partners may share clubs only if the total number of clubs shared is 
no more than 14.

So actually in your case if by borrowing the club you did not go over the
14-club limit then you're OK. If your opponent took the club back then he
should've been penalized (see the Rules as match and stroke play have
different penalties).

Martin
--
From: clyde_r@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (CLYDE REA)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Re:  Ruling Question
Date: 25 Jul 92 10:54:06 GMT
Organization: Computing Center, Florida State University

Martin Olivera:

You are quoting from an outdated "Rules of Golf".  You need to get the
1992 edition.

Rule 4-4 was amended in 1992 to prohibit the borrowing of a club from "any
other person playing on the course".  

In the question as posted, borrowing a competitor's or partner's club, 
whether or not it is returned to that person for further use, is in 
violation of rule 4-4.


Clyde-
"Inquiring minds?"
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: nelson@mdd.comm.mot.com (Mike Nelson)
Subject: Re: Ruling Question
Organization: Motorola - Mobile Data Division; Richmond, BC
Distribution: sqnt
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:34:25 GMT

In article <1992Jul24.173751.5065@sequent.com> john@sequent.com (John Vander Borght) writes:
>gattuso@ssd.comm.mot.com (Christopher Gattuso) writes:
>
>>I know this isn't a great question, but maybe someone could help me:
>
>>I am a lefty golfer (about 12 handicap).  I am not great but better than
>>average.  I was playing for money with my friends yesterday and had a crap
>>lie, that was impossible for a lefty to hit it, but easy for a righty.  So, 
>>I asked one of my friends to borrow a wedge (he is righty). Everybody was
>
>>Is that illegal???  My opponent gave me the club to use with consent.
>
>
>If you were playing Stroke play, there is a two stroke penalty for each of
>the first two violations.  If you are playing Match play, you lost the hole,
>again for each of the first two violations.
>
>See Rule 4-4a
>
>>Outcome:  I told them to shove it, that it was too impressive (I couldn't 
>>do it again if I tried) to call illegal.  Sank the putt to double the 
>>stakes, and walked off with my team winning $12.
>
>John Vander Borght
>john@sequent.com
>-- 
>"Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty!"
>John Vander Borght
>john@sequent.com

Is there not a rule about conspiring to break the rules?
So if someone helps you break the rules then they have 
also broken a rule? In this case the players giving the
club would be guilty of a rule breach.

Mike N.
From: kemery@nmsu.edu (Kendal Emery)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Slope and question
Date: 24 Jul 92 15:43:33 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: NMSU Computer Science


Hello all you fabulous golfers, and all you honest duffers out there.

There was a question about slope and handicaps and such a while back.
The course I play, Desert Lakes Golf Course in Alamogordo, NM, is 
rated as follows, I think.

TEE          SLOPE         PAR

Men's Blue   114           72
Men's White  110           72
Ladies Red   115           72

Now for my question......

On the score card, and at the hole for that matter,  is listed 
a handicap for the hole.  According to our golf league,  my 
handicap is 28.  How does hole handicap come into play, and where
is it used?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Kendal
--
*******************************************************************
*******************************************************************
** kemery@dante.nmsu.edu  (Kendal Emery)                         **
**                                                               **
**      "If Jesus came back today...                             **
**         We'd try to book Him on the Oprah Winfry Show"        **
**                      Randy Stonehill..Great Big Stupid World. **
**                                                               **
*******************************************************************
*******************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: martin@chiton.ucsd.edu (Martin Olivera)
Subject: Re: Favorite shots to WATCH?
Organization: UCSD - Scripps Inst. of Oceanogr. - MPL
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:39:48 GMT

In article <92209.132525RPT378@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> <RPT378@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:
>In reading the give-and-take about TV coverage of the British Open, I seem to
>get the impression that most of us would rather watch drives, approach, and
>perhaps trouble shots by anyone on the course than just watch the leaders putt,
>putt, putt.  I think I would rather see those beginning shots than endless putt
>ing.  What do you think?  Is disinterest widespread amongst us duffers?  Larry
>:)

My favorite shots to watch are the ones to get out of trouble (from woods,
sand traps, etc) and anything within 50 yds from the green. I also enjoy
watching smooth swings.

Martin
-- 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: john@sequent.com (John Vander Borght)
Subject: Re: Ruling Question
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: sqnt
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 17:37:51 GMT

gattuso@ssd.comm.mot.com (Christopher Gattuso) writes:

>I know this isn't a great question, but maybe someone could help me:

>I am a lefty golfer (about 12 handicap).  I am not great but better than
>average.  I was playing for money with my friends yesterday and had a crap
>lie, that was impossible for a lefty to hit it, but easy for a righty.  So, 
>I asked one of my friends to borrow a wedge (he is righty). Everybody was
>laughing and such.  I am kind of ambidextorous and have experience swinging
>a club righty.  Anyway, I was about 100 yards away and put the ball about 10
>feet from the stick.  The laughing immediately stopped and they called foul
>saying I was in the wrong using someone elses club.

>Is that illegal???  My opponent gave me the club to use with consent.

You can only add clubs if you started with less than 14 or you are
replacing a club damaged during the normal course of play, EVEN THEN, you
can't borrow one from someone else playing on the course.  The only
exception, is if it was your partner and the total count of your clubs and his
was less than 14.

If you were playing Stroke play, there is a two stroke penalty for each of
the first two violations.  If you are playing Match play, you lost the hole,
again for each of the first two violations.

See Rule 4-4a

>Outcome:  I told them to shove it, that it was too impressive (I couldn't 
>do it again if I tried) to call illegal.  Sank the putt to double the 
>stakes, and walked off with my team winning $12.

John Vander Borght
john@sequent.com
-- 
"Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty!"
John Vander Borght
john@sequent.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: mikem@col.hp.com (Mike McTigue)
Subject: Re: Golf Shafts
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 17:29:07 GMT
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division

stephen@cs.utexas.edu (Stephen Craig Mautner) writes:
> 
>      Could one of the golf guru's out there please explain to me what the 
> shaft Flex Point is.  I have been looking at the True Temper shafts in the 
> Golfsmith catalog, and I have noticed that the regular dynamic shafts 
> have a mid flex point, while the dynamic lites are listed as a high
> flex point.( I am doing this from memory but I think this is correct)
> I was not sure what type of player the different flex points were designed
> for, and what might be correct for me.  (FYI, I am 6' tall I shoot in 
> the 90's and hit a 5 iron about 160 yards)
>      The reason for this is that currently, I am looking into getting
> a new set of irons (3-9, pw)  with the Texas Classic heads from GolfSmith
> but I was not sure what shafts I should use.  I would also be interested
> in hearing people's opinions of the Texas Classic heads.  I live about 
> 2 miles from Golfsmith's Headquarters here in austin, so I had a chance
> to swing them around and I thought they felt pretty good.  I have found
> a place here in town which will build them for me for ~ $200 (which was
> $100 less than Golfsmith was selling their pre-made set for).
> 
> All advice in these matters is appreciated. 
> Thanks.
> 
> stephen
> 
> 


Generally:

  o Flex point nearer the tip: For more beginner players. Helps get the
    the ball higher sooner.

  o Mid flex: Better players who don't want such a high trajectory,
    want a more boring shot, and don't have much problem getting 
    hieght on a shot.

  o Flex point nearer to the grip: Very strong players who want a lower
    shot, or good player who wants to hit the ball lower. 

Now the question is: what is a high flex point? Nearer the tip or grip?
I think it means nearer the grip, but I'm not positive. Anyone else??

Good luck.

 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: ilh@lcs.mit.edu (Lee Hetherington)
Subject: Re: TV coverage (Was: Cook blows British Open)
Reply-To: ilh@lcs.mit.edu
Organization: MIT/LCS Spoken Language Systems
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 18:43:47 GMT

In article <1508@idacrd.UUCP> n4hy@idacrd.UUCP (Bob McGwier) writes:
   Both of you did not listen to the commentary (I don't blame you).  ABC
   primarily used  BBC CAMERA'S AND ONLY USED THEIR CAMERAS ON THE FIRST
   FOUR HOLES!

Does anybody know if ABC just rebroadcast the BBC's video broadcast or
actually got raw camera feed from all the BBC's cameras.  If the
latter is true then ABC is responsible for choosing which camera
shots to give us.  I suspect that ABC *chose* to show us the first and
second place (and a few other American) players.  Didn't someone
already say that the BBC showed a great variety of players?
--

--Lee Hetherington
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: panu@sol.acs.unt.edu (Sittiwong Panu)
Subject: Re: Scoring Question
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 21:39:10 GMT

steve@oceania.com (Steve Dakin) writes:


>I was wondering how to compute a 18-hole score based on less than 18 holes of  
>play.  For example, let's say I play a twilight round and can only squeeze in  
>14 holes before it gets too dark to play.  Is there a widely acknowledged way  
>to compute my score for all 18 holes?

>Comments, ideas and references welcome (e-mail or post).

>Thanks,

According to Uncle Snoopy (an USGA official book on handicap) you can post
the score for handicap purpose if you play at least 13 holes.  You will
record the par plus number of strokes you would received for the holes
you didn't play.  For example, an 18 handicaper will have to add one stroke
to the par for the holes he didn't play as his score.

Hope this help.

Panu
>Steve
>-- 
>    Steve Dakin                      Oceania Health Care Systems 
> steve@oceania.com (NeXT mail)       Palo Alto, CA (415) 322-0127
> jester@oceania.com                  "That one deserves a ... WOW!"
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 14:15:37 EDT
From: <JPM121@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
Subject: Re: one more rules question
 <1992Jul28.203650.9374@convex.com>

In article <1992Jul28.203650.9374@convex.com>, sercely@convex.com (Ron Sercely)
says:
>
>In article <1992Jul28.193432.23220@cs.UAlberta.CA> lake@cs.UAlberta.CA (Robert
>Lake) writes:
>>
>>We were putting on the green just as a small storm cloud began to pass over-
>>head.  The green itself had a small downward slope in the direction of the
>>wind.  Player A putts his ball (he is only about 3 feet from the hole) and
>>the ball misses the hole. It comes to rest about 2 inches from the cup and
>>the wind then blows it off the green (it was a *very* strong wind).  Should
>>he play the next putt from off the green (30+ feet away from the hole) or
>>from 2 inches from the hole?
>>
>>Player B has marked his ball.  He then places the ball on the green and gets
>>ready to putt.  Before stroking the ball, the wind, as with player A, blows
>>his ball off the green.
>>
>>In each case, the ball was literally blown off the green by the wind (the
>>downward slope of the green had very little to do with the distance the ball
>>rolled).
>>
>The rules are rather long, so I will summarize
>for Player A.
>rule 18 applies to a ball at rest moved by an outside agency.  It states that
>you replace without penalty.  HOWEVER, it also states that wind is NOT an
>outside agency.  Since there is no rule that states you may replace the ball
>if
>moved by the wind, he is 30+ feet from the hole!
>
>Player B is more complex because of the statement "gets ready to put".
>If he had "addressed the ball", (which means he has "taken his stance" and
>grounded his club), HE IS DEEMED TO HAVE MOVED THE BALL.  Penalty 1 stroke,
>and
>REPLACE THE BALL.  (this is exactly the rule that started this thread).  If he
>had NOT addressed the ball, same as for player A, play from off the green, no
>penalty.  Probably one of the few times the player WANTS the penalty!
>

This explanation fails to address the fact that the ball was marked.
He should be allowed to replace the ball WITHOUT penalty, if he did not
"address" the ball.  (this is seen in PGA tourneys; when ther is a stiff wind
blowing, players often run up to the green after their approach shot to
mark to ball as soon as it stops.

John Meredith
Pennsylvania State University
JPM121@psuvm.psu.edu
  Disclaimer: "Penn State doesn't even know I have an e-mail account,
              let alone what my opinions might be."
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: hannegan@hyperion.gsfc.nasa.gov (Bryan Hannegan)
Subject: Re: Average hitting distances continued
Organization: NASA Goddard Space Flight Center, Greenbelt, MD
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 15:20:54 GMT

In article <711902078@volga.cs.duke.edu> rws@duke.cs.duke.edu (Ronnie W. Smith) writes:
>2. "Average hitting distance" tends to be a function of your handicap, up
>   to a point.  There was some study in one of the Golf pubs. a few years
>   ago that had some formula for what was your lowest expected handicap as
>   a function of how far you drive the ball.  I drive about 215-225 through
>   the air on average, and my limit was somewhere in the 5 range.  I'm
>   currently a 10.1.  Obviously, if you develop an incredible short game, you
>   can overcome this, but all things being equal, lower handicap folks tend
>   to hit the ball farther.  Notice the word "tend", no flames please.
Hmmmm.... I hit the ball extremely well, yet can't seem to shake my handicap
below a fifteen or so. Played very competitively in high school, but went 
downhill from there. Can any one help with a few hints?

Here are the particulars:

      "Woods" Taylor Made 11 deg loft Driver, Gold Graphite shaft

      "Irons" Palm Springs Company Forged "blades" 2-pw
              Sand Wedge Spalding 60 deg.

Distances:          Driver 245-270
                    2-iron 210-225
                    3-iron 195-210
                    4      180
                    5      170
                    6      160
                    7      150
                    8      135-140
                    9      125-135
                    pw     120
                    sw     85

Average about 3-4 greens per nine, about 34-36 putts for 18.
Low round: 76 Hardly ever over 100 (once or twice in my life)

Bryan


hannegan@hyperion.gsfc.nasa.gov



From: jaym@hplsla.hp.com (Jay Miazga)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 16:51:53 GMT
Subject: Re: greenhorn (not) learning to swing
Organization: HP Lake Stevens, WA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I'm sure Arnold Palmer wouldn't have any
trouble hitting whiffle balls with my humble #3 wood, old and disheveled 
as it is.  Any words of wisdom?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


Being on the steep part of the learning curve myself,
I'll say that you're not doing yourself any favors by:

1) Starting out swinging a wood.  Try a mid iron.     

2) Hitting whiffle balls.  Yuch.  Go try real balls at a range.

3) Teaching yourself from a book/video/etc.  Group lessons are
   a great way to start and not too expensive.


You're probably bringing the club way, way too far back
in the backswing, by the way.

Oh, that reminds me of something else;

4) Taking advice from other shitty golfers.  Go see a pro.


Have fun,

jaym
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: ilh@lcs.mit.edu (Lee Hetherington)
Subject: Re: YAGR (yet another golf ruling)
Reply-To: ilh@lcs.mit.edu
Organization: MIT/LCS Spoken Language Systems
	<d#pmby+.mzimmers@netcom.com>
	<ILH.92Jul30095125@winnie-the-pooh.lcs.mit.edu>
	<1992Jul30.150114.9654@convex.com>
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 16:45:00 GMT

Ron Sercely writes:

    The closest decision I can find is 19-1/6.
    
    Q. A ball played from off the green was about a foot from the hole
    and still in motion when it was moved by a dog to a spot about ten
    feet from the hole.  The ball was either deflected by the dog or
    the dog picked it up, ran with it and dropped it.  What is the
    ruling?
    
    A. If the ball was deflected, it would be played as it lay,
    without penalty, from the spot to which it was moved by the dog --
    Rule 19-1.
    
    If the dog picked up the ball, the player should have placed the
    ball, without penalty, as near as possible to the spot where the
    original ball was when the dog picked it up -- Rule 19-1a.

Sounds like there is a difference between being deflected and being
picked up.  Apparently being picked up is covered under Rule 19-1a as
`coming to rest in or on a moving or animate outside agency'.

Back to the case of the gull (picking up and carrying a moving ball
into the water):  you get to replace the ball without penalty as close
as possible to the point where the ball was picked up.

[I didn't think it was reasonable that you were at the mercy of devious
 little creatures snatching up your ball at will and depositing you in
 nasty places like out-of-bounds or in a water hazard.]
--

--Lee Hetherington
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: robg@bnr.ca (Rob Gaudet)
Subject: Re: WOMEN'S U.S. OPEN
Reply-To: robg@bnr.ca (Rob Gaudet)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 17:21:39 GMT

It was Patty Sheean (sp?) who beat Juli Inkster by 2 strokes
in the 18 hole playoff.

regards,
   Rob

p.s. Juli Inkster is American not Canadian.


Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf
From: scramer@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Steve K Cramer)
Subject: Re: Hitting straight
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:02:44 GMT

In article <Brq8vJ.G6u@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> mkohlhaa@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
(mike) writes:
>I've been playing golf for about 5 years now, but only recently have I started
>taking it very seriously.  I'm decent with club distance, chipping, putting,
>etc, but my BIG problem is hitting the ball without slice, especially off
>the tee.
>
>From what I gather, correcting a slice is something that a great many golfers
>have to do at some point.  I hope that instead of having to enlist the
>aid of a pro, I might be able to get pointer or two from any of you to
>help me eliminate my slice.
>
>Any suggestions???
>
>Mike
>
>e-mail: mkohlhaa@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
>physical location: In the trees on the right side of the fairway. 8-).
>
>--
>
>                        -- Mike
>

Aim left! Trevino won numerous tournaments that way. He hits a low draw now, 
but he's a pro.

*******************************************************************************
Steve Cramer               scramer@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
"just hit it"              614-292-8481
*******************************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf