From: dlin@weber.ucsd.edu (Diane Lin)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re:  20/20 and spanking
Summary: on parental authority, etc.
Date: 5 Nov 92 02:25:47 GMT
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

In article <7484@tekig7.PEN.TEK.COM> dank@tekig6.pen.tek.com writes:
>In article <1d6s18INN9uh@network.ucsd.edu> dlin@weber.ucsd.edu (Diane Lin) writes:
>>Advocates of spanking seem to see parental authority as a given, and
>>rebellion is not tolerated in any form.  In fact, they often go so
>>far as to accuse non-spankers of spoiling their kids or raising
>>brats, as if discipline is an either/or situation.
>> . . . .
>>Many parents see rebellion as a threat to their
>>authority, rather than as a normal phase in child development.  I
>>sometimes think that if people actually understood more about child
>>development, and the incredibly healthy aspect of rebellion, they
>>would be less inclined to take such behavior personally.  
>
>I don't know if I qualifiy as an advocate of spanking, in that I'm not out
>to convince non-spankers to spank, but I do consider *some* parental
>authority as a given.  Don't we all?  Rules like not playing in the street,
>taking medicine when prescribed by the Dr., using seatbelts in the car, not
>intentionally harming someone, etc.  are not open to negotiation in our family,
>and I would imagine not in most.  
>
Absolutely!  However, I don't view such rules, i.e. rules governing
safety or acceptable social conduct (can't intentionally harm
someone) as examples of parental authority.  Yes, for now, until our
son is old enough to understand exactly *why* we have such rules, he
is still expected to follow such rules.  When he is old enough to
understand why the rules were created, it is our hope that he will
agree that they are good rules.  If, however, we had a rule that was
not so rational as keeping seat belts on, we would be willing to
entertain suggestions to amend or dispose of the rule.  One rule
that the Stiles' (the parents of 4 girls featured on 20/20) had was
clearly ridiculous:  the two year old was punished for having a BM
in her training pants.  

We plan to have regular family meetings to discuss the rules of the
house, and we hope that the rules will be agreeable to everyone.  I
sometimes rely on my son or husband for reality checks :-).  If a
rule that I create is merely capricious, I certainly want to reflect on
that and revoke it if it's a bad rule.  Rebellion in the sense of
challenging parental authority (in socially acceptable ways) is a
sign of a healthy family relationship, I would think.
[...]

>...at least some anti-spanking advocates
>seem to set up straw men in their beliefs that if you do spank, you're left
>with resentful, un-self-disciplined brutes, or worse.

You're absolutely right, and I apologize to anyone who thought I was
setting up a straw man for my anti-spanking beliefs.  I was spanked
as a child, and I was quite well behaved and not resentful of my
mother's methods.  However, as an adult, I have the benefit of 20/20
hindsight, and I choose to use different methods with my child(ren),
since I believe that one can produce well-adjusted, happy and
respectful persons without resorting to spanking.

>I would never consider spanking my wife either, but then I would also never
>expect her to obey me.  She is capable of making her own decisions regarding
>playing in the street, taking medication, wearing seatbelts, etc. :-)

Right, and as I wrote above, when children become mature enough to
realize the reasons behind such rules of behavior, one hopes that
even they will agree that the rules are good ones.  Until that time,
it is my responsibility to teach my child, and to be the external
judge of what constitutes proper behavior.  

[...]
>It seems to me there are
>much more important issues at the heart of successful parenting, but
>spanking gets blown out of proportion because it is a tangeble, visible
>action.  Whether or not a parent truly loves and respects and accepts a
>child is more to the point, but much harder to see or discuss.

Absolutely, Dan.  But, since spanking is such an accepted form of
punishment in this society, I think that discussions about the pros
and cons of spanking are quite worthwhile.  I think that in part,
there is also a disagreement between the set of parents who believe
that the family is an insular community which is self-contained and
thus should be self-governing, and the set of parents who believe
that the family is part of the greater society, in which case the
society as a whole has some investment in the way the members of
the smaller unit (the family) are treated.  (Of course, there
are people who fall between these two articulated sets of parental
views.)  And in fact, a few folks in this thread have espoused the
view that if they choose to spank their kids, it's none of our
business, since it's a personal decision.  I guess that sort
of view makes me uneasy, in part because since becoming a
parent, I have felt more connected, somehow, to society, and
to the community of people throughout the world.  Then
again, maybe I'm just a buttinski :-).
-- 
Diane C. Lin			"Live now; make *now* always the
dlin@weber.ucsd.edu	         most precious time.  Now will 
(Dylan's mom, 23 months)	 never come again." (ST:TNG)
Newsgroups: misc.kids