From: rpitts@emperor.gatech.edu (Richard Pitts)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: I'm God.
Date: 15 Oct 92 18:16:35 GMT
Organization: CERL-EE, Georgia Institue of Technology

In article <Bw4o8C.JH3@inews.Intel.COM> pharvey@mipos3.intel.com (Paul Harvey) writes:
|In article <71068@hydra.gatech.EDU> 
|rpitts@emperor.gatech.edu (Richard Pitts) writes:
|>In article <fTQ4nf9@quack.sac.ca.us> 
|pharvey@quack.sac.ca.us (Paul Harvey) writes:
|>|In article <70921@hydra.gatech.EDU> 
|>|rpitts@emperor.gatech.edu (Richard Pitts) writes:
|>|>In article <fTGg9M0@quack.sac.ca.us> 
|>|pharvey@quack.sac.ca.us (Paul Harvey) writes:
|>|>|In article <70498@hydra.gatech.EDU> 
|>|>|rpitts@emperor.gatech.edu (Richard Pitts) writes:
|>|>|>Agreed.  And we have Christianity spread thoughout the world.  It spread 
|>|>|>from Jerusalem out rather quickly.  Within a few days of Pentecost there
|>|>|>were 3,000 (Acts 2:41) and then 5,000 (Acts 4:4) believers within 
|>|>|>Jerusalem.  
|>|>|Huh? Are you confusing facts with myth? Christianity was a total dud
|>|>|amongst the Hellenistic Jews. It was in the crumbling remains of the
|>|>|Greco/Roman empire that Christianity found it's converts. Of course,
|>|>|"convert or die" is one offer that is hard to refuse.
|>|>Were the Hellenistic Jews the only Jews?  I think not.  On the day
|>|>of Pentecost, a big feast day, there were Jews from all over the region -
|>|>not just from Jerusalem.
|>|I think you are getting things confused, Pentecost is of course a
|>|Christian holiday thus unlikely that Jews would come from all over to
|>|attend. Shavuot on the other hand is something entirely different. You
|>How was it a Christian holiday in Acts 2?????????  It says the people
|>were in the house when the day of Pentecost came.  Why was Paul trying
|>to return to Jerusalem by Pentecost (Acts 20:16)?
|>Why were there God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven in
|>Jerusalem (Acts 2:5)?   
|
|You are confusing facts and myth. You don't know what myth is, do you?

Obviously myth is what you don't agree with and anything that
supports or parallels or gives support to the Biblical account.

|>If you can suppress you gloating, what is the modern day equilvalent
|>(Christian or Jewish) term for Shavuot?
|
|The Jewish term is of course Shavuot. The Christians claim this holiday just
|as they claim many European pagan holidays as their own. Christians call
|this holiday Pentecost which obviously relates to Jesus. You won't find

The Old Testament calls this holiday the Feast of Weeks, I believe.
Of course that's in the English translations.  However, I understand
your JPS version has mastered both Hebrew and English, but the others
translations have not.  :-)

|many Jews worshiping Jesus on Shavuot, for obvious reasons. The so-called
|New Testament is written in Greek and represents pagan-Greek-Hellenistic
|thought. Don't try to pawn the so-called New Testament off on Judaism. Those
|who practice Judaism see no need for any new covenant, the Hebrew scriptures
|stand nicely on their own without any pagan-Greek scripture to back them up.

Yes, they do stand nicely on their own, but the NT brings their fulfillment.

|Followers of Judaism see no problem in adhering to the rules of the Mosaic
|Law, they see no need for any new covenant to relieve them of this burden. It

You note that it is a burden - maybe, relief of it would be welcomed.
You know, that relief was promised.  God said that there was coming
a day that everyone would know (everyone would have the law written
on their hearts) and there would be no need to tell each other about
it.

   Jer 31:31   "The time is coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a
      new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.
   Jer 31:32   It will not be like the covenant I made with their forefathers
      when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they
      broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them, " declares the LORD.
   Jer 31:33   "This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
      after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my law in their minds
      and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my
      people.
   Jer 31:34   No longer will a man teach his neighbor, or a man his brother,
      saying, 'Know the LORD,' because they will all know me, from the least
      of them to the greatest," declares the LORD. "For I will forgive their
      wickedness and will remember their sins no more."

|was the early Christians who forgot how to read Hebrew and felt that the
|Mosaic Law was too great a burden, thus the need for a new covenant in
|Greek, of course. Christianity represents the combination of a Greek

Oh, I see the reading of the original languages is a problem.  
Can you read Hebrew??????

|translation of the Hebrew scriptures (Septuagint), the Persian light/dark
|duality, the Greco/Roman Lord of the Underworld and the pagan trinity, as
|well as a few others. Judaism is pure monotheism.

Maybe you don't understand the difference between monotheism (one God)
and the entities that make up the one God.  You seem to be saying that the
concept of One God requires only one manifestation.

|>|Christians are always trying to steal other cultures holidays. You're
|>|not going to fool me with your Christian propaganda, but obviously you
|>|have already fooled yourself.
|>Is the Passover a Christian or Jewish holiday?  
|
|Depends how it is observed. The early Christians were poorly schooled
|Hellenistic Jews, they no longer learned how to read Biblical Hebrew and
|complained that the Mosaic Law was to heavy a burden to carry, thus the
|need for a new covenant in Greek. The Christian impact on Hellenistic Jewry

I think if you can pull your blinders off you will see that Paul was
by no means a unschooled Jew.  He is the one that gave a lot of insight to
the law being a burden.  In fact he siad that NO ONE is justified by
observing the law - justification comes by faith.

|was almost nil. Christianity came to life in the work of Paul as the falling
|Roman Empire was replaced by the Christian Empire. Christianity had its
|greatest impact in Europe amongst European pagans. I'm quite sure that the
|marketing technique of "convert or die" had something to do with it's
|popularity.

Jesus told the disciples to go into ALL THE NATIONS.

|>|>|>Oh.  What is the volume of books we call the Bible that predicts and
|>|>|>confirms this one man Jesus the Christ as he was to come, was here,
|>|>|>and will come again?  I understand that's not enough.  
|>|>|Man? Did you say man? I thought Jesus was a God or Son of God or
|>|>|something like that. And the "New Testament" was written after the
|>|>|facts. Makes prediction rather easy, don't you think?
|>|>That's right he was a man, but he was God.  Don't get too excited
|>|>about your perception of Jesus being only a man, for he was the fullness
|>|>of God in human flesh.
|>|Oh, so Jesus was both a man and a God at the same time, and also
|>|sometimes a Son of God too, right? So, if Jesus could do it, does that
|>Correct.
|>|mean we can too? And what's all this pain and suffering and dying stuff,
|>We can be a child of God, but not God.
|
|A child of God, like Jesus?

Not in the same sense - Jesus is unique - but we can by faith become heirs of
God and so children or sons of God, but not THE Son of GOd.

|>|this means nothing to God. If Jesus is a God then what is so special
|>Jesus is God not a God.
|
|How can someone be a son of God and God at the same time?

"son" means male personage of a particular background, too.

|>|about what He did? Any God can do that kind of stuff. The Goddess Kali
|>Because he was human, too.
|
|Don't you find this reasoning to be somewhat circular?

I've lost the context on this.

|>|creates and destroys the Hawai'ian islands and is still active today on
|>|the Big island. Surely an active Goddess is better than a dead man-god?
|>Surely, a live resurrected God-man in an immortal body is better
|>than a Goddes who only creates and destroys some islands.  Jesus if
|>the creator and he sustains all things - visible and invisible.  He
|>is resposible for more than just some islands and he has conquered
|>death and has showed to us that there is life after death.
|
|Where?

He rose from the dead and never died again.  His resurrection shows
that there IS live after death - not mortal life, but immortal life.

|...
|>|>It says "YOUR MEN".  Jesus was God and man.
|>|How can that be? I thought man and god were separate and yet you tell me
|>|that they are one and the same. Are you sure it is possible for a man to
|>|also be a God? That is a very pagan belief.
|>This is the mystery of Jesus the Christ - he was and his God in human flesh.
|
|Some mystery. I thought you said Christianity was simple and had all the
|answers? Seems like Jesus is all questions and no answers.

Mystery can be see as something unique or the explanation of an old
mystery - which is now understood.

|...
|>|>We do have a couple of stories.  One was his birth - how many other
|>|>people have such a documented birth????
|>|Oh please!
|>Oh please, WHAT?
|
|Richard! Wake up! You have eyes, use them! What kind of a question is: "how
|many other people have such a documented birth????" I have seen babies born
|live and on videotape, where is the like documentation of Jesus's birth? Where
|is Jesus's birth certificate? Where is His circumcision record, Bar Mitzvah
|record, etc?

Do you have the angel hearlding these peoples birth?  Do you have a parallel
to the angel telling Mary she would be with child though a virgin?
Do you have prophecies predicting the coming of these peoples - Oh, don't
forget this happened a little before videos and sonograms.

|...
|>For Christ and His Kingdom,
|>Richard Pitts
|>rpitts@cerl.gatech.edu       |    
|>Atlanta, GA                --|-- 
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|>                         |   |   |
|
|Hey, you've reduced you idols, very good. You know those old Mosaic Laws
|aren't really all that heavy a burden, you should check them out. Discover
|your roots, so to speak.

You know, love is the fulfillment of the law.  Jesus said his 
yoke was easy and his burden light.

For Christ and His Kingdom,
Richard Pitts
-- 
rpitts@cerl.gatech.edu       |    
Atlanta, GA                --|-- 
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Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc