From: kimmyd@bnr.ca (Kimmy Posey P920)
Subject: Clarifications on Rape in any form ...
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, BNR-RTP 
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 16:18:15 GMT

Ok, I admit I got a little emotional on this one and let my reason be clouded.
I don't however think I am way off base here.  I am by no means an expert in
the area of human behavior.  I can only draw on my own life experiences and
those of others which I have read or heard about.  I will try to redress some
of the things that I posted previously and rebute what I can remember from
the responses.

I concede that most people have rape fantasies.  I have had them, although it
makes me ashamed of myself to admit it.  This shame however doesn't make me
feel that I am a bad person nor does it make me more likely to commit a rape.
On the contrary it makes me less likely to do so as it is the realization of  
the horrible nature of rape that invoke this shame.  On the other hand if I
enjoyed the fantasy, drawing pleasure from it, feeling no shame then I would
react like all animals, i.e. I would seek to re-experience that thing which
gave me pleasure.  Eventually I would reach the conclusion that the real thing
would be even more satisfying and seek to turn fantasy into reality.

People who have occasional rape fantasies need not rush out to the nearest
psychiatric facility and sign-up.  It is the person who repeatedly indulges in
such things, who finds it pleasurable and exciting and fulfilling that should
seek help.

Visualization and fantasization are indeed related to physical acts.  Every
great athlete, business man, scientist, or whatever has imagined himself doing
whatever activity for which he is noted long before actually doing it.
For many years before I was hired to design embedded systems for my current
employer I dreamed of being an engineer.  In junior high my science
teacher Mr. Wooldridge turned me on to computers and I have dreamed about them
every day since.  These dreams lead me directly to the job that I do today.
Those dreams drove me beyond every obstacle to get what I wanted.  I wasn't
well prepared for college so I really had to study hard.  My parents wanted
me to be a doctor and cut me off when I refused to become one.  The Dean told
me I didn't have what it took to become an engineer etc.  But that dream alone
was enough to sustain me.  It drove me almost supernaturally.  I saw myself
as an engineer therefore I became one.  Ok yeah, I also saw myself as an
astronaut, a general, a postman, and a professional football player but I
never really dwelt on those things.  All I'm saying is that I personally feel
that there is a link between what you dwell on and how you behave.  I could
be wrong but I don't think so.

Yes DC I am certainly willing to listen to opposing views.  However I am a
confontational person by nature.  If I perceive that someone is in an
agressive posture when addressing me I have a tendency to go into "scorched
earth mode".  I apologize if you were offended or intimidated.

As for innocent people being wrongly punished for rape (or murder or robbery
or anything else) I must quote the immortal words of Mr. Spock:

        "The needs of the many outweight those of the few or the one"

I think he might have been quoting someone else like maybe Marx.  Anyway the
point is that no system is perfect.  But if it works most of the time then
generally speaking it's a good system.  And also my on feeling is that most
rapist don't have the balls to murder someone.  It takes a whole different
set of motivations to do that.  At least it would for me.  Again I could be
wrong.  It certainly wouldn't be the first time.  But as someone who has
certainly considered murder, the prime reason that I have refrained from that
activity it the certainty of spending most of my life in prison followed by
a trip to the electric chair.  

Differing degrees of rape ???  What a thoroughly obsurd idea !!!  No means
no.  THAT'S IT !  PERIOD !  There is no aggrievating circumstance that lessens
the wrongness of rape.  I don't care what some sap-liberal-lawmaker says !

On academic reasearch and medical expertise on the human psyche.  Please!  I
sir (or madame) am a consumate expert on finite state machines.  I know
exactly what they are, how they work, what influences their behavior, how to
diagnose their problems, and how to fix them.  If I tell you something about
FSM's you can take it to the bank sister!  But if you come to me and say:
"I'm an expert on the human mind and it works thusly ..." then I will say:
"Get out of my face sap !" because I know you aren't an expert at least by my
definition.  Yes I know, websters defines it differently but my definition is:

 Expert:  One who possesses the vast majority of all knowledge on a subject. 

There is no such person with regard to the human mind this side of God.

Geez I'm sick of this.  I didn't mean to spark the biggest debate since
ROE vs. WADE, so unless anyone violently objects I hereby surrender to over-
welmingly superior forces.  I just think that this group should be a place
for victims to be comforted and supported by people who can empathize with
what they feel.  People who are outraged by the way our society treats the
entire subject of rape and want to do everything in their power to change it.
Again, if I have offended anyone I deeply apologize.  Especially if I have
offended someone on whom this terrible tragedy has fallen.

KimmyD