HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 12:39:33 GMT

In article <23448@alice.att.com> jj@alice.UUCP (jj, clueless old white boy) writes:
>In article <SHAW.92Aug13001642@whopper.lcs.mit.edu> shaw@whopper.lcs.mit.edu (Andy Shaw) writes:
>>Absolutely correct.  But as you know and stated, almost _all_ of the ruling
>>elite is white, and entering that elite is practically impossible for a
>>member of a minority group.
>It's about as impossible for me as you, despite any racial issues.
>Now, yes, before you faint with rage, your race makes it harder,
>I do agree with that, BUT it's no more possible for me than you.
>I'm not born into it, and I'll never be part of it. Not now,
>not ever.  In a very real sense, I'm no more white than you are.

  But JJ, you have a greater chance of marrying into it, than any
  of us.  You're still white (remember or ozone-layer-challenged
  conversation?)  And if you marry into the elite, your kids will
  be elite.  You can still dress up in a Brooks Brother tweed
  suit, impersonate a London accent and get accepted to the smoking
  clubs there, if you want.  As for us, they'd spot us a mile
  away and ask us for our passports or green cards.
>
  But I heard that Marcus Allen (running back for the L.A.
  Raiders) gets stopped by cops in his fancy sports car because
  they think he's a drug dealer.  No matter how rich, famous,
  and accomplished he is, all the cops see is a black man in
  a Porsche, must be a drug dealer.  I bet they won't stop
  you if you were to tool around town in a Bimmer.  So admit
  it JJ, it is slightly easier for you to get into the elite
  because you can "pass".  It's harder for us to "pass".
  When Aussie and Irish holders of student visas can cross
  the Canadian-U.S. border easier than native-born Asian
  Americans (who must carry passport or birth certificate,
  whereas the Aussie carries a Cornell I.D. because she
  "forgot" her passport, but hey, no problem, we love your
  accent anyway), then JJ, it is still easier for you to "pass".
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: Michael F. Kamprath <kamprath@caen.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: caucasians
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 17:38:17 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan, Aerospace Engineering
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d5
X-Xxdate: Thu, 13 Aug 92 17:38:19 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.142226.10394@ee.gatech.edu> Peter Wung, wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu
writes:
>In article @engin.umich.edu, kamprath@caen.engin.umich.edu (Michael F. Kamprath) writes:
>>In article <sJ0cPB2w165w@midiline.la.ca.us> Patti Hayes, 
>pattisan@midiline.la.ca.us writes:
>>Ahhh, but you miss the point that these "TYPICALLY WHITE AMERICAN"s are
>>indirectly making (though they may not realize it): you will achieve nothing
>>in getting other people to change their actions/behavior by "whining."
>>Ever hear of those mental defense mechanisms in psych class?  They'll
>>usually just whine (or as you say, criticize) right back.  This is true
>>between any two human beings regarless of the subject.  If you feel they won't
>>understand, educate.  If feel its something that's got to be experienced,
>>try to relay it.  I agree that there are some things that just must
>>be experienced, but certainly you can try to describe its effect.   
>>
>>Michael F. Kamprath
>>kamprath@caen.engin.umich.edu
>
>
>Michael, you have me confused, if they don't understand, How am I supposed 
>to educate?  It usually takes the understanding that there is a problem 
>to seek a solution.  If white america is not willing to admit there is a 
>problem, there is no way I can educate them because they won't accept my
>education.  I have no foundation to base my arguement on.  Not all
>anglos ;-) have open minds, it's a majority thing, I don't understand.
>
>

I must admit that this discussion is making me more aware of the reason colleges
are making "cultural sensativity" classes mandatory.  Not that I agree with the
typical content of "look what your ancestors did to our ancestors and thus you
should be sorry and do all this for us."  Rather, IMHO, it should be "look at the
state of of _OUR_ soceity, here is what _WE_ can do to fix it."

Michael F. Kamprath
kamprath@caen.engin.umich.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: exudms@exu.ericsson.se (New Dave)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: AMERI-ASIAN
Date: 12 Aug 92 21:07:58 GMT
Reply-To: exudms@exu.ericsson.se
Organization: Ericsson Network Systems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Followup-To: soc.culture.asian.american
From: exudms@exu.ericsson.se (New Dave)
Reply-To: soc.culture.asian.american
Organization: Ericsson Network Systems, Inc.
Subject:AMERI-ASIAN 
Keywords:The Children of	
 
 The talks in this group seems to generate ill-feelings towards this country, or mostly the different societies as were see it, and the great inter-relations, inter-cultural, inter-racial marriage, interacial-sex, etc., with the anglo society. 
Northeast asians have long been established in this country (and other countries for that matter) and many families of anglo and asian  parentage have evolved. These children grow up in an american society along with other ABA (ABC) and anglo children. 
Do hispanic, american indian, and black children/adults view the aspring as ASIAN (Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Veitnamese, etc.) or AMERICAN, or AMERI-ASIAN.
A minor observation I've made is that the different societies accept these children/adults as part of thier heritage. But some may be totally american.
What is the future for these children of the american-asian families?
A growing minotity; a minorities minority (and a beautiful race of man).
I think "Culture" plays an important role in this situation don't you?

Comments? 

/New Dave



/-------------------------------------------------------\  																 	  		  				   																															    |  exudms@exu.ericsson.se (New Dave)				|	
|  EXU/S/D		~<>~	"Patience, the essential|			      										 			  												 		 		 				F1066 RCHN  EXUDMS		 quality of man"        |			| 				|															\-------------------------------------------------------/
From: gwangung@milton.u.washington.edu (Just another theatre geek.....)
Subject: Re: College Dating Question and more...
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 21:34:31 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.204758.4856@u.washington.edu> maxim@milton.u.washington.edu (John Martin) writes:
>Okay I am back for some more punishment...

	Good.  I can use some practice whuppin' on some white boy ass.

>Preamble:
>In my previous post (White Guys...) I said I read this group
>to get a laugh.  I apologize for that remark.  It came across
>pretty flippant.  But sometimes the who's dating who threads are
>pretty humorous.  Especially when those two guys shchen & yazhao
>start getting so foul mouthed towards women who date white guys.
>I mean what's up with these two guys? 

	Nothing's up. That's the problem.

>And another thing.  Should I attach a complete resume' and
>love-life and dating history each time I post to avoid or 
>at least cut down on the 'geeky' white boy stuff in the re:'s?

	Yup. Credentials, y'know.

>p. s.  Jim- I do have an obnoxious superior attitude that was impressed
>        on me during my youth, but I am not racist or sexist, just
>        generally superior.

	And you're at the UW? Don't think so......(Now if you were a Cal
weenie, I'd understand.....)

-- 
Roger Tang gwangung@milton.u.washington.edu
Executive Producer Emeritus, Asian Theatre at the UW;
	The definition of having balls is a non-singer who goes karaoke singing 
with the cast of a musical revue.
From: ng@MOE.OPTICS.ROCHESTER.EDU (Baldwin Ng)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: REPOST[***** NEED HELP: Events for C.S.A. ******]
Date: 17 Aug 92 19:37:00 GMT

Hello Everyone,

I was the President of the Chinese Students' Association last semester
at the University of Rochester.  This coming semester, I will help
the new President to organise some NEW and EXCITING events.  We really
want to see what kind of interesting activities other CSA's (both US & Canada)
have.

Thanks for your input (in advance),
Baldwin Ng
(ng@moe.optics.rochester.edu)
From: timlee@btr.com (Timothy J. Lee  timlee@btr.com)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Hoyt Sze's "Parting Shot"
Date: 21 Aug 92 04:04:28 GMT

judyy@ocf.berkeley.edu (Judy Y. Tseng) writes:
|[presumably quoting Hoyt Sze]
|
|	Understand that moderation and accomodation is unacceptable; you're
|either with me or against me. In this fight against white rule, compromise is
|collaboration. In this struggle, middle ground does not exist.

What about respect for diversity?  Not everyone will agree on the
methods that lead to racial equality; insisting that anyone who
doesn't agree with your method is an enemy is likely to get nowhere.
 
|	Alliance requires sacrifice and commitment. If you marry white, you're
|on the wrong side.

Let's see, interracial marriage "pollutes" the idea of racial purity
and damages the basis of racial discrimination.  Or is the agenda
really a separatist one?

|	Even if all the rest of the Asian American community bows to white
|rule, we must steel ourselves to rooting out the self-haters and the racists.
|Sometimes the prospects may seem dark, but I promise you that truth and
|ideological purity are rewards which stand by themselves.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Hmmm...

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee                 timlee@btr.com  ...!decwrl!btr!timlee
This message comes with no warranty, not even an implied warranty of
fitness for any particular purpose.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 13:01:54 GMT

In article <23475@alice.att.com> jj@alice.UUCP (jj, curmudgeon and clueless old white boy) writes:
>In article <1992Aug17.170214.24593@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
[stuck-up snobs stories]

  Wow, you've talked about a world I've barely glimpsed.
  You're right, they wouldn't walk down any city street.
  I truly have no experience with these snobs.  I did
  read a book about "Bohemian Grove" back when I was
  in college trying to get a liberal-arts education.
>
>>  I beg to defer.  I don't see how I'd care to wrap
>>  baby strollers around any such hapless males within
>>  5 minutes.  9 months of pregnancy isn't something I
>>  go through just for the fun of it, and I won't do
>>  it for just anybody. 
>I wasn't thinking you'd have any of their kids, I was thinking
>you'd wrap the baby stroller they *tried* to hand you right
>around their neck.   BEFORE there was any issue of even
>considering offspring.  Sexism, in case it isn't clear,
>is also de-regeur in these circles, and I think you'd simply
>gag on it.  I do, and I'm not even the "affected" class.
>
>>  It's much easier for you as a
>>  male to wrap baby strollers around available females 
>>  in 5 minutes flat.
>Huh? What does that mean?

  Oh, okay.  I meant that a man could get someone pregnant
  in 5 minutes flat and move onto the next one, and do it
  again in 5 minutes, and then move onto the next one, etc.
  I meant that a woman has to take at least 9-10 months to
  produce an infant.  But I now see that your meaning of
  "wrapping baby strollers around someone" was differnt
  than what I thought you meant.  I guess Arnold could
  wrap one around someone's neck in 2 seconds!
>
>
>Well, I wouldn't say "black" or "white".
>
>And, I don't consider the people we're talking about here
>white, either, I consider them the arrogant, prejudiced
>elite.  Yes, most of them are "white", but most whites
>aren't them, and I really don't want the name of my race
>used as a label for "old white people in power". 

  Oh good we agree then.  (White != "ruling elite")  That
  was the whole point I was trying to make.  So one can
  be white, but not in the ruling elite.  Seems quite
  evident to me.

>The
>"ruling elite" is a pretty good name, actually.  They 
>are no more representitive of whites than Saddam Hussein is
>of the average Kurd.
  Saddam Hussein is not of Kurdish background, I think.

  Well I don't think "elite" is such a good name.  More
  like the "ruling sh*theads".

Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: chu@nero.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Surviving in a White Man's world
Reply-To: chu@nero.mit.edu
Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 02:46:38 GMT

In article <l90103INNerg@news.bbn.com> ahsiung@bbn.com (Anita Hsiung) writes:

> Robert Quan writes:
> >
> >    Point 1:  Why is it that the media always associate an asian as a
> >              foreigner and not an American.  


To which Anita responds,

> I've never gotten this question from a "non oriental".  
             
              [...]

And later writes,

> If you insist that the U.S. take steps to combat these
> stereotypes (and that is a noble goal), you must also combat the
> stereotypes that your own country holds.

Why do you assume "his own country" is not the USofA?  If I'm an 
American, why should I do any more to combat racial stereotypes
in Taiwan than any other American not of Asian descent?  I think
the original discussion was about racial stereotyping in *American*
society.  Whether or not things are equally bad in Taiwan is an
interesting topic, but not especially germane to this discussion.

                                    -- Bill

--
chu@nero.mit.edu (NeXT mail)           Bill Chu
chu@mtl.mit.edu                        MIT Submicron Structures Lab
From: jj@alice.att.com (jj the curmudgeon)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: One does not a people make (was: Re: Keeping in mind ....)
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:09:35 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.23433
Reply-To: jj@alice.UUCP (jj the curmudgeon)
Distribution: na
Organization: NJ State Home for Bewildered Terminals

In article <1992Aug11.144513.19635@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>  And in a way, it is, "It's about time you'all feel a little of the shit
>  you'all have piled on us since the day you're born."  It's human nature
>  to want to inflict pain on someone else because of the pain you've felt.
>  It's not right, it's not justified, but as Sista Souljah said, "It sure
>  feels good."  It is why abused children will mostly likely turn around and
>  abuse their children.  It is why evil perpetuates itself exponentially.
Hear, hear.

Andy, are you listening?

>  Why don't you say *some* people are racist and
>  it doesn't matter what color their skin, sexual preference, whatever.
>  Just that *some* people are racist, period.
Why not?  I don't say that any more because when I did, at least three
very vituperitive people leaped to the forefront to claim
"minorities can never be racist" and "only people in a position
of power can be racist" and other such excuse for their own racism.

I've tried to be equitable, but frankly, some individuals have made
it clear that they do not want to be equitable, they want to be
immune from their own actions while blaming me for some other
white man's actions.  (Some people show a very peculiar attitude
toward me, it seems, when they claim I'm in power.  Now THAT
is an outright laugh! According to George Bush's quotes on athiests,
I can't even be a "good american". Now doesn't that sound familiar
to you?)

As to the truth of what you say, "... *some* people are racist.."
without specifying race, I think you've hit it on the head.
Unfortunately, the seeming concensus in this newsgroup a week ago was
that that position was not acceptable.
-- 
 Bush    *Copyright alice!jj 1992, all rights reserved, except transmission
   vs       *by USENET and like facilities granted.      Said permission is
 Clinton  --    *granted only for complete copies that include this notice.
 Just Say !NO!       *Use on pay-for-read services specifically disallowed.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: buchino@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Bert N Uchino)
Subject: Re: ORIENTALS???????
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 08:08:28 GMT

In article <25446@dog.ee.lbl.gov> jscott@Aztecridge.LosGatos (John Scott) write
s:
>Whenever I call an oriental "oriental", I always get told to say Asian
>instead.  I just don't understand what the big deal is with you
>orientals!!!  I always ask for a legitimate reason but never get one.  I
>hope someone on this newsgroup could give me a reasonable explanation.
>Otherwise, I see nothing wrong with calling Korean, Chinese, and Japanese
>people "oriental."
>
>John Scott

John,
     A better approach might be to ask people their ethnicity before 
categorizing them as "Oriental" or "Asian".  The groups that you mentioned (and
one's not mentioned) are culturally very different from one another.  Any 
simple category ignores the unique histories and traditions of each group.  
Hope this is reasonable to you.    Bert U.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: fellow@natinst.com (Osbert Tan)
Subject: Re: Racial Beating
Organization: National Instruments, Austin, TX
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 13:44:59 GMT



My question to the net is, how do you deal with this type of situation
(i.e. racial slur), at the same time coming out of it with honor/dinity
(you fill in the appropriate word(s)) intact and ALIVE ?

-Osbert
-- 
                                     _ _
---------------------------------ooo--U--ooo------------------------------------
fellow@cs.utexas.edu  Standard disclaimer applies. My opinions are, simply mine.
fellow@natinst.com            Down with racism. Down with imperialism.  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)
Subject: Re: Racism against WHITE in China??? (was Re: Caucasians don't understand
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 01:30:59 GMT

In article <1992Aug17.221424.24709@u.washington.edu> chuan@milton.u.washington.edu (Chuan "infamous" Lee) writes:
>
>1) I was asked to pay double for an entrance ticket because I 'dressed'
>   like a foreigner, by an 60-year old women.  I paid the normal fare
>   after I lied that I was from Canton, with my Cantonese-accent Mandarin.
>2) I tried to help 2 American students to get cheaper seats on a train
>   from Shanghai to Xian.  The train captain insisted that all foreign
>   'guests' must buy tickets for the luxury cabin, because "Aren't all
>   American rich?"  After explaining the students' budget problem, for
>   a long time and some back-padding (friendly gesture), I got the
>   '2nd class' seats for the students.
>3) I was with a tour group visiting the Tomb of Ch'in.  And all of us
>   (1/3 from South Africa, 2/3 from Hongkong, me from US) paid 30 yuen
>   for the entry tickets, while the locals pay only 5 yuen!  I ticket
>   was already included in the tour package.  We are all overseas Chinese.
>   We were taken advantage of; but discriminated, depends on how you
>   look at it.
>4) Same place at Tomb of Ch'in.  I bought 2 tickets for the 2 American
>   friends whom I met earlier in Shanghai on the train, guest what, for
>   5 yuen each!  They didn't get by this time though.  The doorman said,
>   "You LOOK completely a foreigner.  How did you get these tickets?
>   You have to buy the foreigner's tickets."  My friends didn't get in
>   since they couldn't afford it.  Worse, the tickets were not refundable.
>5) I wanted to buy an antique spoon for sourvenir at the Najing Museum.
>   The sourvenir door had a sign said, "Foreign Guests only".  Besides,
>   all sale items were priced in FEC (Foreign Exchange Currencies).  The
>   Renmingbi (people's currencies) was not used here.
Most public services in China are subsidized heavily by Chiness in the form of 
low salary! foreigners did not contribute to this kind of subsides. For the 
sake of fairness, foreigners should pay not only the price over the counter, 
but also the share of subsides! That is the rational for dual pricing.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Asian American speakers at the Repub Convention
From: yuan1@husc9.harvard.edu (Nina Yuan)
Date: 21 Aug 92 12:43:19 GMT
Distribution: na

yeonwook@hardy.u.washington.edu (Mark Choi) writes:

>In article <1992Aug19.071903.28926@oakhill.sps.mot.com> jpak@manute.sps.mot.com (I'm a C-SPAN junkie :-) ) writes:
>>On C-SPAN's coverage of the Republican convention last night (Tues), I saw
>>two Asian American Republicans give short speeches.
>>
>>
>>I believe their presence was at least in part due to the Republican's willing-
>>ness to show the "colors of the rainbow" at the convention.  There were also
>>two Hispanic speakers, an African American speaker, and of course some women.
>>(I didn't watch the whole thing, so there may have been more.)  However, as
>>has been mentioned here before, Asian Americans are as likely to be Republican
>>as Democrat.

>>p.s. Ob. media bias comment:  According to ABC last night, on the eve of the
>>     convention, Governor Clinton was leading Pres. Bush 57% to 37%.  If I
>>     catch the figures after Thursday night, I'll post them.

There was a blurb in the New York Times about the racial breakdown of the
Republican delegates; I think it was about 88% white, 2% Asian, and the
other 10% split between blacks and Hispanics, I think.

By the way, the ABC/Washington Post poll today reports Clinton at 50% and
Bush at 41%.

-nhy

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nina H. Yuan                               "It's a miracle that curiosity
nina@panix.com                              survives formal education."
yuan1@husc.harvard.edu                                  - Albert Einstein