HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lawbkwn@buacca.BITNET (Yaakov HaMizrachi)
Subject: Historical Trivia (was ownership of England)
Organization: The Internet
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 12:01:14 GMT


Oopps, tried to send this once and flubbed it.
Lets try again.

Received: by BUACCA (Mailer R2.08 PTF009) id 2356;
          Wed, 08 Apr 92 19:51:57 EDT
Date:    Wed, 08 Apr 92  19:40:03 EDT
From:    "Yaakov HaMizrachi" <lawbkwn@buacca>
Subject: Ownership of England
To:      sca@mc.lcs.mie.edu

My thanks to the most knowledgable
and worthy Hosseun Ali Qomi, for
sharing this most enlightening argument
with us.  As always, I find the study of
history intriguing.  I share M'lord
Hossein's view that such discussions should
take place here more often.
My lord, you mention two books on
William Rufus, might I inquire to
the authors and titles?  I should
love to read them over the summer.

I believe that 'proto-France' refers to
the notion that there was no French
political state as we today reckon such things.
At times, the King of France controlled little
more than Paris and its outskirts.

I had wondered whatever happened to
Robert Curthose.  He seems to have
just gone off and ruled Normandy and
we never hear from him again.  Reminds
me of 'Whats-his-name' the third member
of the Second Triumverate of Rome.
Marc Anthony got killed, Octavian got
the Empire, and this guy went off to
Africa to live happily and decidently
ever after.

If memory serves (always a perilous thing
to rely on), William was a cousin of Edward
the Confessor, while Harold was a nephew
(Edward having been too pious to ever have
sex and produce an heir).  Harold supposedly
gave William his claim to the throne when
William rescued him from drowning.
(How convenient the William just happened by.:)

Another bit of interesting historical trivia:
William did not object to the Sobriquet
'Bastard', but got rather touchy when
people mentioned his grandfather had been a
lowly tanner (or undertaker, I'm not sure).
Apparently, some folks taunted him about
it and he had them executed.

Hmm...here's an idea for a new game.
Everyone contribute you favorite piece
of historical trivia.  My own personal
favorite:
In England, the common law became so
formulisitic and incomprehensible to
the people that their developed a seperate
court for justice, as opposed to law.

In service to historical trivia,
Yaakov
.
QUIT
From: dgreen@thor (David Greenebaum)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Wm the Conqueror - Member?
Date: 14 Apr 1992 16:40:14 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.berkeley.edu

Greetings to the Rialto from Bjalfi Thordharson!

Hossein writes:
>Lord Charles writes:
>>I have here seen a number of notices beneath the title, "William the
>>Conqueror, Member."  I knew not that William was a member of our Society.
>>Or was the reference to some other fellowship that he was a member of?
>I have puzzled on that title myself (and I was one of the contributors),
>albeit with my somewhat degenerate cast of mind I thought of obscure
>journal articles on the late William's member.  Not that I'd touch it with
>a ten-foot Anglo-Saxon. :-)

*Wet blanket mode ON*
I would guess that the title was formed by a truncation algorithm, from
something like "Wm the Conqueror, Membership requirements, and related 
blither and blather".
*Wet blanker mode OFF*

---------------------  Bjalfi Thordharson/College of St. Katherine/Province of
 |\  | |\  |\  |// |       the Mists/Principality of the Mists/West Kingdom
 | > | |\\ | \ |/  |   David Greenebaum/University of California/Berkeley, CA
 |<  | | \ |   |   |   dgreen@athena.berkeley.edu, dgreen@garnet.berkeley.edu
 | > | |   |   |   |
 |/  | |   |   |   |   "I make mistakes, but I am on the side of good -- by
---------------------  accident and happenchance." -- the Golux
From: parr@acs.ucalgary.ca (Charles Parr)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: cutting through a shield
Date: 16 Apr 92 15:46:31 GMT
Organization: The University of Calgary, Alberta

In article <1992Apr16.125042.14593@bmerh2.bnr.ca> cav@bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin) writes:
>In article <9204151953.AA23533@math.bu.edu>, jeffs@math.bu.EDU (Jeff Suzuki) writes:
>|> 
>|> Here's a question that the various posters on the argument of "A
>|> period polearm can/cannot cut through a period shield" haven't brought
>|> up yet:
>|> 
>|> Does the fact that SCA shields are made of plywood make a difference?
>
>The general consensus is that period shields were also made out of what
>amounts to plywood.  Period plywood would in all probability have been
>of BETTER quality than that commonly used for SCA shields.
>
>|> I'm sure there's an engineering problem here that is just _looking_
>|> for an engineering grad student to analyze and write a TI article
>|> on...
>|> 
>|> Fujimoto


I've been slowly working on an analysis of the forces which act
on a shield in combat, and ways to make them last longer. I have
something of a reputation for building very attractive and 
durable shields already, and since I enjoy it, I figured, why
not go all the way? 

There are several important forces acting on the shield when it 
is struck, the most important one is the compressive force
against the edge of the shield. This makes the shield flex,
almost like a playing card being squeezed between the fingers.

This force slowly causes the plywood to delaminate, as soon as
the plys are no longer solid, the wood crumbles very quickly.

The solution seems to be to use a more flexible "rubbery"
glue, and make your own plywood...

Carolus Mediocris, Montengarde An Tir





-- 
Within the span of the last few weeks I have heard elements of
separate threads which, in that they have been conjoined in time,
struck together to form a new chord within my hollow and echoing
gourd. --Unknown net.person
From: christer@sue.komunity.se (Christer Romson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Bertram's Membership Letter
Date: 6 Apr 92 10:34:37 GMT
Organization: The Internet
X-Unparsable-Date: Mon, 6 Apr 92 12: 25 MET DST

Moreach:

> Are *any* of the BoD required to represent these [non-american] folk,
> much less be from the general localities in question?

> rules that fit US laws and customs may not be completely workable for our
> native-born citzens of Drachenwald and Lochac
From: lawbkwn@buacca.BITNET (Yaakov HaMizrachi)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Vivat Arval!
Date: 8 Apr 92 18:27:46 GMT
Organization: The Internet


Heart Vivats to Arval on his Pelicaning.
I'm sorry I wasn't there to see it.

Yaakov
From: trifid@agora.uucp (Roadster Racewerks)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Re: you people are pathetic/flamers
Date: 12 Apr 92 15:32:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: agora.1992Apr12.153227.9736
Organization: Open Communications Forum




Actually, it was just a silly flame from some anonymous twit who found a 
terminal open someplce, so far as we could tell.

Quite frankly, since it went unanswered for a couple of days, I was hoping we
would all maintain our cool and ignore it. (It's nice to defend your friends,
but not necessary to defend them from children and the village idiot.. :-)
Responding to people like this fellow (whoever he was) only serves to inflate
their ego further, since all they want to do is make a fuss anyway.

Moreach
From: n9040513@henson.cc.wwu.edu (aldridge andrea)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Use of the term "Mundania"
Date: 10 Apr 92 20:17:10 GMT
Article-I.D.: henson.1992Apr10.201710.16124
Organization: Western Washington University

>Except that, as I understand, "Mundania" is a place-name in the endlessly
>self-referential novels of Piers Anthony (whom I cannot abide, but my
>husband and son read everything the varlet writes).  Seems to mention
>such would be a worse "culture shock" than simply to refer to the
>20th century.
>
>Maybe there is a phrase we could use instead? that would indicate "the
>mundane world" unobtrusively and without referencing a clutch of books
>that by comparison make late 20th-century America look like The Enchanted
>Ground?  I invite suggestions.

But...didn't Piers Anthony borrow the term from the SCA?



-- 
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
<>  Andrea Aldridge   IRC:  Folkie   E-Mail: n9040513@henson.cc.wwu.edu   <>
<>  WWU--452 Edens Hall North/Bellingham, WA 98225 USA     206-734-0270   <>
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
From: BLISSA@UNC.BITNET
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Period guitar music
Date: 15 Apr 92 04:54:00 GMT
Organization: The Internet

A friend has asked me to ask for him, if anyone
out there has any period (esp. Flaminco--sp.?) guitar
music or documentation?  Pretty please?  I told
him I thought someone on the Rialto would....
Julitta
From: Stuart.Tingle@f43.n140.z1.fidonet.org (Stuart Tingle)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Magick
Date: 13 Apr 92 10:13:00 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:140/43 - U of S Computing Se, Saskatoon Sask

To: Gerald_Del_Campo@sorinc.UUCP (Gerald Del Campo) 
 
 On 04-12-92 Gerald Del Campo wrote... 
 
 GD> It seems that much magick is mixed in with the Midieval period.  Has 
  anyone 
 GD> ever adopted the persona of a magician in the SCA? 
 GD>  
The day was years ago we had a magician persona who lived in our fair wood. 
His name was magus vector. (don't blame me I just call em as I see um) 
He did a few period illusions and added greatly to our amusement,  
especially at camping events where he would creep about at night in his 
black long underwear and get beat up for sneaking up and pretending,  
though the pretend was often unknown to the victum, to attack someone. 
We called him Bill the magic ninja.  
Er.. Maybe this was not such a good example. 
 
Omar ibn Rashid 
Myrgan Wood 
Avacal 
Antir 
 
  
 
... OFFLINE 1.32 * Don't talk to me about life... 

--  
Stuart Tingle - via FidoNet node 1:140/22
UUCP: ...!access.usask.ca!weyr!43!Stuart.Tingle
Domain: Stuart.Tingle@f43.n140.z1.fidonet.org
Standard Disclaimers Apply...
From: Syr.Jonathon.MacNaughton@f104.n170.z1.fidonet.org (Syr Jonathon MacNaughton)
Sender: Uucp@blkcat.UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Killing from Behind in Calontir
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 1992 22:41:11 -0500

 CN>Unto the Gentles of the Rialto, and especially Syr John, does 
 CN>Duncan Bruce of Logan send forth greetings!

 CN>My lord, where did you get the impression that killing from behind is
 CN>allowed in Calontir?  While we do _practice_ with killing from behind
 CN>before venturing westward to Estrella, it is definitely NOT allowed
 CN>within the Calon conventions of combat.  We also use the Middle-derived
 CN>custom of fouling the weapon (without grappling or wrestling) and 
 CN>offering our opponent the chance to yield.  Otherwise you must get the
 CN>fighter's attention AND EYE CONTACT before engaging them.

Um, from some Calontir transplants?  :-)  I've just finished a
conversation (moments ago) with several friends in Forgotten Sea who
apprised me that it it _*NOT*_ listed in the marshallate as legal.
Special circumstances for scenarios (such as killing animals from
behind) may be negotiated with the Earl Marshall, but in no case is
_striking_ from behind allowed.

 CN>In addition, a general comment about killing from behind.  I know of no
 CN>kingdom where _striking_ from behind is allowed.  It may happen upon
 CN>occasion, but that is true even when killing from behind is not.  I am
 CN>personally in favor of the Western-derived killing from behind (sword
 CN>over the eyeslots) as there is too much abuse of the "invulnerable rear"
 CN>in many melees.  While there are some lobbying to get Calontir to change,
 CN>it hasn't happened yet.

As far as I know (and as always I stand open to correction), no kingdom
allows striking from behind.  Besides being, IMHO, unchivalric, the risk
of injury increases dramatically.  My studies of the human body tell me
that we bend forward quite well, but bending backwards generally causes
a great deal of suffering and anguish.  I agree that the 'invulnerable
rear' is abused at times.  However, the individuals that abuse that
practice will tend towards abusing others and are easily spotted.  My
two cents on this dead equine.  <grin>

 CN>Finally, to respond to an earlier post (not one of yours, Syr John), it
 CN>somewhat misrepresents the case to say that Calontir _refuses_ to fight
 CN>with Ansteorra.  Actually, until this past Pennsic there was a long
 CN>standing treaty between Calontir and Ansteorra that we would not raise
 CN>arms against one another.  The treaty was signed by William of V'Tavia
 CN>for Calontir and Inman for Ansteorra, and I belive it was the first time
 CN>that William sat the Falcon throne (i.e. a long time ago).  This is also
 CN>why Calontir and Ansteorra traditionally hold an Interkingdom Peace every
 CN>year (at which there is plenty of fighting, BTW).  Now that the treaty is
 CN>no longer in effect (Inman wanted to fight with the East this year), who
 CN>knows what will happen.  SFSF

Hopefully we'll all meet and make honorable war where we can all go home
as friends.

Syr Jon
From: markbr@radian.UUCP (markbr)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Disenchantment
Summary: but...
Date: 15 Apr 92 18:15:35 GMT
Organization: Radian Corp. Austin, TX

In article <sceetINN4hq@agate.berkeley.edu>, cozzlab@garnet.berkeley.edu writes:
> In article <702965029.F00006@blkcat.UUCP> Dave.Aronson@f120.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Aronson) writes:
> 
> [Instead of "Mundania"....}
> 
> >Perhaps rather than indicate the setting where it DOES exist, react to the idea
> >with something like "I've never heard of such a thing!  It sounds rather
> >implausible.  I don't think that will ever { happen | be invented | whatever }
> >in OUR lifetimes!"
> 
> Oh, I like that one very much.  Depending on the out-of-period reference in
> question, one could sometimes add "At least, I hope not!" and/or "God forbid!"
> 
> 
> Dorothea of Caer-Myrddin                               Dorothy J. Heydt

But... *I* always heard that really happens in Hi-Breasil!

/*___________________________________________________________________________*
 *  1.     How *DARE* you attribute these opinions to anyone else!           *
 *  2.     Would *you* claim opinions like these if they *weren't your own?  *
 *					                                     *
 *		         Mark Silverdragon                                   *
 *					                                     *
 *          	       	markbr@radian                                        *
 *___________________________________________________________________________*/
Etymology, n.:
	Some early etymological scholars come up with derivations that
were hard for the public to believe.  The term "etymology" was formed
from the Latin "etus" ("eaten"), the root "mal" ("bad"), and "logy"
("study of").  It meant "the study of things that are hard to swallow."
		-- Mike Kellen
From: BRDD9354@acs.wooster.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Majick
Date: 17 Apr 92 01:33:00 GMT
Organization: The Internet

Greetings to the Rialto and all the denzians (yes, Sappy, you,too) thereof!

I do believe that the individual of whom the gentle who originally started
this thread was speaking was the mathematician and astrologer and claimed
wizard Dr. John Dee, advisor to both Queen Mary I and Queen Elizabeth.

Vladyslav Joppam
BRDD9354.WOOSTER.BITNET@mitvma.mit.edu
From: dlc@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Dennis Clark)
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 15:25:12 GMT
Subject: Re: Light Blows, and What Next
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
From: Alex_Hart@mindlink.bc.ca (Alex Hart)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Help in Gaelic
Date: 13 Apr 92 02:02:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: mindlink.11392
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada

And how about a dictionary or 2 in Gahlig as opposed to Eirse ? After all the
gentle does ask for help in GAELIC not IRISH ! :-)
Alastair The Eastern Traveller
Lions Gate,An Tir
From: trifid@agora.uucp (Roadster Racewerks)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: RE:  MSGID: 1:124/2206.0 dcfa8efa
Date: 16 Apr 92 16:22:00 GMT
Organization: Open Communications Forum



The folk in Brittany speak Breton. Note I said *speak*, as they have held
demonstrations against the French government for its attempts to "homogenize"
the language out of existance, and have gotten the language recognized by the
EC. The people of Cornwall are reviving their version as well, despite it 
having gotten so rare that it first had to be reconstructed by scholars before
it could be taught, as the two or three native-speakers were both very old, and
had been influenced all their lives by English usages. It is my understanding,
from reading soc.culture.celtic (when it isn't fighting the battles of Northern
Ireland!) that a Breton can understand a Welshman in writing, but not spoken,
and that an Ulsterman can understand a Scot, but a southern Irishman will have
more trouble...in this case in the written form especially (because Eire 
modernized the spellings and some of the grammar during the Celtic Revival).
There is a great deal of work being done to keep all of these languages from
further extinction. The EC has a whole list of minor languages that are to be
protected...many of them either Q-Celtic (Irish type) or P-Celtic (Welsh type).

Moreach
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: nnpeters@watcgl.waterloo.edu (Neil N. Peterson)
Subject: pottery
Keywords: need some information
Organization: Computer Graphics Laboratory, University of Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 22:30:20 GMT

Greetings all Gentles of the Knowne World,

I am presently looking for documentation for period pottery tecniques 
glazes, firings and styles.  I currently have only been able to find 
some good references to particular objects (ie color photographs)
I am a fairly accomplished potter, and have been experimenting with
some interesting designs, like enclosed candle holders which have 
celtic knotwork designs in latticework, which ends up looking more
Renaissance than anything else.  Basicically I need some direction
Please forward information, preferably primary sources to this account.

				Yours in service to the dream
					Erinhilt
(Posting from Arnora's account)
From: Richard.Boyko@f43.n140.z1.fidonet.org (Richard Boyko)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: withholding knowledge
Date: 12 Apr 92 10:12:00 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:140/43 - U of S Computing Se, Saskatoon Sask

Greetings unto the Rialto from Layamon le Vavasour of Cambridge! 
Ilaine writeth: 
 
 LS>         I can hardly believe a teacher is expected to teach evertyhing she 
 LS> knows about everything in an hour or two. If I teach a class, I intend to 
 LS> stick to my lesson plan, and 'persona games' have nothing to do with it. 
 
I agree. The subject matter that I am able to teach is not compatible to a 
strict limit to my persona: Arthurian Literature. _YOU_ try to sketch the 
developement of Arthurian literature from Gildas to Malory by limiting 
yourself to what a twelfth century cantabrigian would know! Some degree of 
suspension of disbelief is necessary in order for me to properly give the 
class. There is no way, for example, my persona would know that Excalibur 
first gets called Excalibur in Wace, that the Sword in the Stone is actually 
called Clarent [alliterative Morte Darthur], and that the Round Table was 
first said to be able to seat 1600+ [Layamon's _Brut_] and be portable. 
 
 LS>         I will not tie myself in a straitjacket and refuse to mention 
 LS> anything I am not going to discuss at length. Nothing exists in a vacuum. 
 
Indeed it doesn't, and indeed you shouldn't. The one and only time I taught 
my class saw me cover a lot of information, but skim over an awful lot more. 
-Layamon le Vavasour of Cambridge, Myrgan Wood Pursuivant. 
 
 
... OFFLINE 1.32 * Or, two bars dancetty and in chief a greyhound courant contourny sable. 

--  
Richard Boyko - via FidoNet node 1:140/22
UUCP: ...!access.usask.ca!weyr!43!Richard.Boyko
Domain: Richard.Boyko@f43.n140.z1.fidonet.org
Standard Disclaimers Apply...
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: cav@bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Subject: Re: Determinate Marshalling
Reply-To: cav@bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Thu, 09 Apr 92 21:30:48 GMT

In article <b6n102QX0fxg01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com>, branwen@cerebus.ccc.amdahl.com (Karen Williams) writes:
|> In article <1992Apr8.234158.2163@news.cs.indiana.edu> mikes@iuvax.cs.indiana.edu (Michael Squires) writes:
|> 
|> >Third, if the marshall is certain (and that's a difficult judgement call)
|> >that an apparently full-speed blow was not blocked, AND the pattern is
|> >repeated more than once, then the marshall should try to discuss the
|> >possible problem with the fighters.  
|> 
|> >Fourth, if a marshall sees such a pattern, and sees that the fighter who
|> >is throwing the blows seems to believe that they were good (most fighters
|> >clearly telegraph that with their body language), then the marshall needs
|> >to get the fighters discussing the problem, if any, before tempers flare.
|> 
|> I authorized in the Midrealm, then moved immediately to the West, and I
|> have since fought in a tourney in the Midrealm.  A major difference that
|> I noticed is that in the Midrealm, after a bout the marshalls come up to
|> the fighters and ask if they have any problems with the fight, but the 
|> fighters don't talk to each other. In the West, after a bout the fighters

Hold !!!  Last time I checked, Midrealm fighters talked before, during, and
after bouts.  Marshals might ask just to be on the safe side, or if they
felt one fighter might have been intimidated and was reluctant to voice
feelings about the fighting, but we DO speak to each other.  Heck, sometimes
we even have a beer together.  Opponents have even been known to sleep
together after fighting (don't tell anyone though).

|> will walk off the field together talking about the fight, asking about
|> problems, or talking strategy. (I was at Bunstable's two years ago, which
|> had over sixty fighters, and none of the fighters talked to each other
|> after the fight.) In fact, when I went up to an opponent after a bout in
|> the Midrealm to do post-fight chatting, both the fighter and the marshalls
|> were surprised.
|> 
|> Having been a fighter in both places, I think I like the way the Westerners
|> do it better, since communication between fighters seems to keep the problems
|> down. Having the marshalls talk to the fighters adds a level of complexity
|> and seems to encourage fighters *not* to talk to each other.

This may be a localized thing.  It has not been my experience.  I hope you
find your welcome when next you visit our kingdom more amiable.	

|> 
|> Branwen ferch Emrys
|> The Mists, the West
|> --
|>                                           Karen Williams
|>                                           branwen@cerebus.ras.amdahl.com
|> "Don't whine. Warrior women speak in a husky whisper."
|>   -- Brat Pack #3


Cheers,
Balderik
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: kenm@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca (...Jose)
Subject: Re: Ealdormere Coronet Tourney
Organization: Department of Computer Science, McMaster University
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 20:16:45 GMT

In article <PiZqiB1w162w@micor.ocunix.on.ca> gwilym@micor.ocunix.on.ca (Bill Sanderson) writes:
>Greetings from Gwilym
>
>The new Prince of Ealdormere is Kildare Silverlock Thorkilson who won 
>by the inspiration of his lady Catherine. The other finalist was
>Baron Septentria, Cordigan d'Arnot who fought for his lady Diane.

	Actually, Their Highnesses are Kildare *Silverwolf* Thorkilson
and Catherine du Pre's.  This is the second Rozaki Prince of Ealdormere
in a row (and, once again, from Ben Dunfirth in Rising Waters).... what's
the land coming to?  :)

	(see .sig for more on this)

			....Cinaed           




Lord Cinaed de Moray
Chamberlain to Their Highnesses of Ealdormere   (is this a good thing?)
In residence in the lands
of Byron, Baron Rising Waters,
in the Midrealm.

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
".sig quotes are silly"|Kenneth C. Moyle          kenm@maccs.dcss.mcmaster.ca 
 - Kenneth C. Moyle    |Department of Biochemistry     MOYLEK@MCMASTER.BITNET 
                       |McMaster University       ...!uunet!mnetor!maccs!kenm 
From: Tim@f4229.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Tim)
Sender: FredGate@ocitor.fidonet