HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tehhhal@ioe.ac.uk (MR HANIF LADHA)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Muslims, Munafiqin, Kafirin
Date: 18 Nov 92 14:17:21 GMT
Organization: Institute of Education, University of London

In <jhardono.1.721968387@ucs.indiana.edu> jhardono@ucs.indiana.edu (JUMAHADI HARDONO) writes:

>My brothers and sisters,
>	Muslims are muslims who are 'mukmin'. 'Mukmin' means that people who
>are believing that "There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is Allah's 
>Messenger" without hesitating anything. Everything mentioned in Al Quran
>and explained by Rasulullah SAW is accepted and followed by Muslims
>who are mukmin. These people accept all of the messages in the Quran and
>try to follow as much as they can.	
>	Munafiqin - the dangerous group in Muslim society - are muslims
>but not mukmin. This means that they say they are muslims but they ignore
>and try to degrade intentionally teachings and words of Allah in AL Quran.

>	to be continued...


I cann't wait for next posting...  I guess the Kafirun are those who don't
believe in God, the Prophet and the Quran.

My one question is who decides who decides between a mukmin and a muslim?

Regards,

Hanif.
From: rnf@po.CWRU.Edu (Rochelle N. Fleming)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Looking for a certain Rasha....
Date: 23 Nov 1992 18:30:33 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: rnf@po.CWRU.Edu (Rochelle N. Fleming)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


Ahlan, I am posting this note in attempts to locate an old friend, who
was last known to have relatives in the Boston, Mass. area.

Her name is Rasha Hassan.  She's got a brother, Hassan [we used to call
him Sunil], and a younger sister, Samira.

She was in Kuwait until the mid 80's, as was I.  Her ancestry is Iraqi.
She would be about 24 or so in age at this time, and is moslem.
If anyone has any information, a personal mail to my email address of
rnf@po.cwru  or flemming@shasta.scl.cwru.edu would be greatly
appreciated.


Rochelle
-- 
..beauty with sentiment, whimsy without inanity...........
and best of all---- 
-intelligence - without smugness.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:5075 comp.sys.mac.wanted:10894
Organization: Central Michigan University
Date: Sunday, 22 Nov 1992 17:19:45 EST
From: Christopher Khoury <34I2NYW@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,comp.sys.mac.wanted
Subject: Wanted: Arabic Outline Font for Mac

HI, I really need an Arabic Outline  Fot, preferably Postscript,
but TrueType is ok too. If anyone has one, it would be much
appreciated if you could send it to me or point to its
whereabouts. Thanks!!

--CHris
---------------------------   ------------------   ---------------------------
    Christopher Khoury        MPHS SOCCER RULES!    "Life...You can't live
34I2NYW@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU   MPHS TENNIS RULES!       without it. --Unknown"
---------------------------   ------------------   ---------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: deniz@mandolin.ctr.columbia.edu (Deniz Akkus)
Subject: Re: ISLAMIC WORLD NEWS (10th)
Organization: Columbia University Center for Telecommunications Research
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:01:39 GMT
X-Posted-From: mandolin.ctr.columbia.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <1992Nov16.061551.23214@latcs1.lat.oz.au> keserovi@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Goran Keserovic) writes:
>
>
>   Unfortunately, this is an impossible scenario since Serbia's allies
>   Greece and Russia are rather powerful when it comes to UN doings.
>   Where-as Croatia's allies such as Germany are ignored and Bosnia's 
>   allies, the Muslim countries are unfortunately comptely ignored by
>   the UN (unless the US's oil supply is in danger).
>
>
>Regards,
>-Goran Keserovic

Russia being powerful, yes, but in a desperate, we got nuclear arms
kind of way these days.  I doubt that they still see themselves as
currently in a position to assume the protector of slavs role.  Playing
big brother takes a lot of money and resources and I think they are
rather preoccupied at home.  

Greece, being powerful, well, they have a population around 10 million,
and an economy which is among the poorest in the EC.  They do tend to be
rather vocal about their views.  

Germany... Well, I think of a few wars in the past and an economy which
is one of the strongest in Europe and the world, and a landmass right in
the middle of Europe of Unified Germany... Even with the bills of
Unification to pay, Germany is very much a force to be reckoned with.  

The Muslim allies, if they can be called that, will not do anything.
Some see the situation as an opportunity for airing the plight of
Muslims world-wide, kind of a photo-op.  Others see it as a way of
introducing some conflict in Europe and distant hopes for an Islamic
republic in Eastern Europe.  Add to that Turkey, with its twinge of both
guilt and pride, and flexing of newly found muscles, compound that with
some rootless people who have spent the last 15 years fighting in
Afghanistan and no longer remember how to do anything else other than
fight and some idealists who might have some genuine feelings about
'Islamic brotherhood' but hold rather naive thoughts about how it might
turn out in reality, you've got your Muslim allies.  

I see Croats as holding more of the aces.

regards,
Deniz Akkus deniz@ctr.columbia.edu







Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: mike@vlsivie.tuwien.ac.at (Michael Gschwind)
Subject: Re: Arab Unity
Organization: Vienna University of Technology
	<1992Nov6.222503.7885@cs.umb.edu> <1992Nov8.204827.14353@trl.oz.au>
	<1992Nov8.231340.2208@cs.umb.edu> <1992Nov10.214206.21065@trl.oz.au>
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 02:41:02 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.214206.21065@trl.oz.au> faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris) writes:
   They are still making the same mistake, read the stuff published by CLAO
   on the Lebanese newsgroup. Those of them who feel they are Pheonicians do not
   realise that the Pheonicians have come from the Arabian Peninsula near Qatar.

So the Pheonicians were Arabs? Hmm? How do you define Arab?
Culture-wise? Hardly were the Pheonicians Arabs by that definition,
would I say! Or do you define Arab-ness geographically?
Anybody from the Arab Peninsula? That would mean 
(as a Prolog clause ;) arab (X) :- jew (x). 
or (in other words) all Jews are Arabs? Hmm? (Well, if you argue that
they are from around Babylon, as their scripture says, then -by your
argument that follows - Iraqis are not Arabs: )
   Unlike, the rest of the people like Syrians, Iraqis' who are possible original
   inhabitants as new evidence is surfacing from archeological findings.



mike
--

Michael Gschwind, Dept. of VLSI-Design, Vienna University of Technology
mike@vlsivie.tuwien.ac.at	(*) BOZO is a registered 
(currently somewhere in             trademark of Bush/Quayle 92
the Bay Area, back sometime     (*) UNIX is a registered 
at the end of this year)	    trademark of AT&T
     
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:4967 soc.culture.lebanon:5090
From: im@gn.ecn.purdue.edu (Ibrahim M. M. Babelli)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.lebanon
Subject: Re: ARAB UNITY (really taxes on non-Moslems)
Date: 18 Nov 92 15:29:38 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

Follow up on jizya and zakah discussion.


Concerning the fact that non-muslims had to pay kharaj (land tax). One hint
needs to be mentioned here which is that (land tax) was charged to any man
or woman who owned a piece of land irrespective of his or her faith. The only
difference that one might find in kharaj has to do with the method of irregationbe it by rain or artificial irrigation. Other than the previous point, kharaj
was charged to EVERY land owner.

I am pretty sure of my argument cocerning the comparison of the financial 
part of zakah and jizya. Behold; I do not claim that this set standard was
never violated. Another point, I was comparing jizya and zakah (the two taxes
that are inherently existing on people of different believes automatically as
long as they live in an islamic state) and not an additional tax such as the
imported property (I am ignorant to this historical point) tax set by certain
ruler.

As to the argument about Catholic incentives, I wish not address it for lack
of knowledge on my part.

Regards

im
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:4918 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:544
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: ISLAMIC WORLD NEWS (10th)
From: keserovi@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Goran Keserovic)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 06:15:51 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia



In article <1992Nov11.144312.13782@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> prs9k@brain.med.virginia.edu (Phil Scarr) writes:
>In article <1992Nov10.231908.1@max.u.washington.edu> imnet2@max.u.washington.edu writes:
>>==========================================================================
>>I     IN THIS ISSUE:                                                     I
>>I                   * NEWS UPDATE                                        I
>>I                   * ISLAM & SCHOOLS OF ECONOMICS                       I
>>==========================================================================
>>
>>BOSNIA-HERCEGOVINA
>>An entire people are being slaughtered before our eyes, yet the
>>world watches with splendid indifference.
>
>I wouldn't exactly call it indifference.  Horror, perhaps, but not
>indifference.  What should we do?  Should we leap into a centuries old
>conflict, guns blazing?  Such a posture would cause far more harm than
>good.  I don't have any solutions, but I know that intervention on the
>part of the UN or the US is inappropriate.
>
>	-Phil
>-- 
>PHIL SCARR        \      We are Microsoft...     /          (o) 804.243.0229
> University of    /     OS/2 is irrelevant.      \          (f) 804.243.0290
> Virginia,        \     UNIX is irrelevant.      /        prs9k@Virginia.EDU
> Neurosurgery     /     Openness is futile.      \     prs9k@Virginia.BITNET
> HP-UX is my life!\ Prepare to be assimilated... /   ...uunet!virginia!prs9k
>

   Firstly, this is not "a centuries old conflict" as the media would
   like people to believe.....it is nothing more than barbaric
   aggression by the Serbian regime. No different to that of Hitler
   or Saddam, but in 1992 human blood is not as valuable as oil, so 
   the world powers just don't give a damn. Don't forget that the Serbs
   invaded Slovenia in June last year, and Serbia has NEVER had any 
   bad blood with Slovenia. Following that, the Serbs invaded Croatia.
   Now Bosnia. 

   Secondly,
   The solution is extremely simple in-fact.......Lift the arms embargo
   on Bosnia and Croatia, tighten the embargo on Serbia, and provide US
   Air Force air cover.....that is pretty simple. No US lives need to be
   lost. The Bosnian government has said that it does not want US ground
   soldiers to defend Bosnia.....there are plenty of Mulsims and Croats
   willing to defend themselves - they just don't have the weapons.

   If this was done, I think that the Serbs would start talking peace
   very quickly. 

   Unfortunately, this is an impossible scenario since Serbia's allies
   Greece and Russia are rather powerful when it comes to UN doings.
   Where-as Croatia's allies such as Germany are ignored and Bosnia's 
   allies, the Muslim countries are unfortunately comptely ignored by
   the UN (unless the US's oil supply is in danger).


Regards,
-Goran Keserovic

    P.S.  I like the bit from Star Trek-TNG in your .signature
From: ahmad@ra.cs.umb.edu (Ahmad Hashem)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: love and respect
Date: 18 Nov 92 19:55:51 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston

In article <92322.172951RHOMSIE@auvm.american.edu> RHOMSIE@auvm.american.edu (Rita Homsieh) writes:
>Dear Hani
>I do agree with you about your feeling toward the tone of these articles.
>Unfortunately, we Arab are very good in fighting each other.  Instead of, as
>Jews do, helping and supporting each other.  But, you can't blame your felllow
>brothers because we were not taught to know better.  We don't know how to love
>each other.  However, there are some educated people who have overcome their
>prejudice and are open-minded enough to accept other people.
>Also, I think that a lot of Arab have frustration that they need to express, so
>this is one way to do it. So take it easy, and love is still there you just
>have to look for it.
>Rita

Dear Rita and Hani,

I'm sorry I missed the earlier postings on this thread, and only caught this.

While I agree that the tone of some articles posted here is frustrating, I
don't agree with the kind of generalization I smell in Rita's article.  I 
think it might be true that deep relationships among Arabs are not easily
established, but from my experience once such relationships are established, 
Arabs are among the most (if not The most) loving, warm, kind, helpful, 
sincere people in the world.

As to why deep relationships among Arabs are not easily establsihed
to begin with, I think it is due to the unpredictable environment Arabs live
in.  They just learn not to easily trust anything/anybody, because of
the constant instability in their surroundings.

With warm regards,
Ahmad
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Arab  U N I T Y
Date: 16 Nov 92 01:52:28 GMT
Article-I.D.: trl.1992Nov16.015228.26554
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia

In article <1dtq0tINNlaf@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah) writes:
|> 
|> The only times there was a unity among Arabs were during Islam.  Arabs
|> before Islam came into life were fighting all the time.  Some examples are
|> the wars b/w Awis and Khazraj, the war of Dashis and Ghabra' which lasted
|> forty years and many others.  Now, in the abscence of Islam the same picture
|> is back again.
|> 
|> Some words to the wise:
|> 
|> Omer Bin Khatab had once said, "We are people that God blessed us with
|> Islam and through it we find our dignity, and if we try to
|> find our dignity with ways other than Islam, God will humilate us."
|> 
|> Isn't this what is happening dear Arab netters?
|> -- 
|>                   ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
|>                  (______   _  |   _  |_
|> _____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |

I find an irony that people in the 21st century still think that religion will
solve a human problem such as Arab unity. During Islam there was no Arabs, there
was an Islamic empire that incorporated the present Arabic states, Turkey, Iran,
and many other places. Those people were united for a breif time in history
due to the political nature of the empire that had the goal to spread the word
of God through the Qu'ran.

There is ample historical evidence to show that religions alone will not unify
people. Yet some people continue to harp on this very issue. If God has 
humiliated the Arabs or Muslims, how come he does not send some one like
Mohammad to resurect the population from its misery?.

The problem is that people fail to recognise that Islam and all other religions
have failed because they no longer serve the same purpose. Religions were
meant to be a way for explaining nature, instead, they have become a race to
reach the heavens. In the process the Arabs have lost every thing.

The most practical solution toward the Arabic problems in my opinion is not
through Islam, rather, to use the Arabic League. The Arabic League is even older
than the U.N., but not used effectively. Mixing the entire Arabic people under
religious beleifs or a centralised political entity will only lead to more
failures. Witness the down fall of the Soviet empire, I would contend that
the people on this network cannot even agree on the Capital for such a political
or religious driven union.

The best assests the Arabic people have is the language, culture, and religious
beleifs. Those can be used to build a political, economic, and military
co-oporation by strengthining the charter of the Arabic League and to give it a
braoder responsibility. This is far easier than lumping every one into a 
geographic pool that requires surrmounting many obstacle internal and external
to the Arabs. 

I am at a loss to think that going back in time will lead to salvation.

A.Faris
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: green@island.COM (Robert Greenstein)
Subject: Re: Israel Apartheid????
Organization: Strawman Incorporated
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 16:52:50 GMT

In article <MIKE.92Nov18012100@guam.vlsivie.tuwien.ac.at> mike@vlsivie.tuwien.ac.at (Michael Gschwind) writes:
>In article <1992Nov10.203328.5784@island.COM> green@island.COM (Robert Greenstein) writes:
>
>   Did you not read the entire statement, or do you just enjoy taking things
>   out of context? He said no country in the world just lets anyone come in.
>   DOes that not apply to the Arab nations? I would have a hard time even
>   visiting Saudi Arabia for example, let alone become a resident. Suppose
>Discrimiantion in Saudi Arabia - I don't think it's even worth
>discussing about - it's self-evident, and Saudi Arabia has never tried
>to 'market' itself as a Democratic society - nor does any other Gulf
>state, I think. Except of course when George Bush had to restore 
>'democracy' (to observers of Middle East politics also know by its
>Kuwaiti name 'al-Sabah' (sarcasm intended, PLEASE do NOT send me 15MB
>of mail telling me that 'al-Sabah' does not mean democracy in
>Arabic!!!! - some people on this list occasionally have a problem with
>sarcasm... ;)).

So its okay for Arab nations to play by a different set of rules?

>   I visit Israel. I might as well throw my passport away and start over,
>   because I would be prohibited from many of the countries in the Middle East.
>You can apply for a second passport from the State Dept., your
>reasoning is sufficient for them (same holds for South African visas,
>they used to put them on a removable sheet in the RSA - no longer so)

I was referring to the way Arab nations handle these passports, not
to how to wiggle around the rules with removable sheets.

>   It may not be valid to talk about how Jews were treated in Germany in the
>   context of the Middle East, but it is most certainly valid to discuss how
>   Jews are treated in Arab countries. It ain't pretty.
>Depends on the country - historically, Muslims have treated the Jews
>better than have the Christians, I have to observer though - many Jews
>from Spain fled to Fez, for example ...

Historically this is true, but can't we please talk about how things are now?
Life's just a bowl of cherries for Jews in say, Syria, for just one example?
-- 
******************************************************************************
Robert Greenstein           Orthodoxy is the death of intelligence.            
green@srilanka.island.com            - Bertrand Russell
From: astein@nysernet.org (Alan Stein)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Oct 1973: Yom Kippur War (To Husam)
Date: 17 Nov 92 13:26:36 GMT
Organization: NYSERNet, Inc.

faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris) writes:

>|> 
>|> If you call that unprovoked, then you're fucking on drugs.  If Israel
>|> wanted more land they wouldn't have given up the Sinai or territories
>|> beyond the Golan that it took in 67.  They want peace, and the sooner
>|> the Arabs recognize ISrael's right to Exist, the sooner they can have
>|> their land back.
>|> 
>They did by meeting with them about 10 times, and Israel refuses to budge.

Israel refuses to budge???  You've got to be kidding.  Israel has made
concession after concession, goodwill gesture after goodwill gesture.
Negotiations involve give and take on both sides, which means that the
Arabs have to give as well as take.  So far the Arabs haven't made a
single meaningful concession;  they still demand total withdrawal and
have indicated no willingness to consider one of the essential
ingredients of an agreement--territorial compromise.

>The Israeli negotiation policy is not to trade land for peace, rather, peace
>for peace. This means essentially a threat for Israel's neighbors, unless they
>make peace they will not have peace. This is the statement of
ambassador Shoval.

Israel has indeed clearly indicated that it recognizes the need for
territorial compromise.  At this point, the ball is in the Arabs'
court.  Unfortunately, until they stop punting, there can't be any progress.

>For your information Israel wanted the Golan heights weather provoked or not.
>The golan heights is the source for most of the Jordan river waters and Israel
>had to take it. They are stealing the waters of Lebanon, were they
also provoked 
>by the Lebanese to steal their water?.

Water sources in the Middle East cross boundaries all the time.  If
you are going to use that twisted logic, then every nation in the
Middle East is stealing everyone else's water, and they should all die
of thirst.

Under no reasonable understanding of the facts can Israel be accused
of stealing water from Lebanon.  General standards would question whether a
diversion of water by Lebanon was stealing water from Israel, but no
interpretation would view Israeli use of Jordan River water as
stealing from Lebanon.

Of course, a backwards view of reality has long been a staple of Arab
anti-Israel propaganda.
-- 
Alan H. Stein   -----  AJIN   -----  astein@israel.nysernet.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: ISLAMIC WORLD NEWS (10th)
Keywords: Islamic World News, Economics
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 02:34:53 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.221046.128@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>, abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad) writes:
|> 
|> I normally don't read the 'Islamic World News', but a headline in this
|> one caught my eye: something on Islam and Economic Systems.  Read it,
|> then follow the following pseudo-code:
|> 
|> IF (these views are not typical of the "Muslim Brotherhood") THEN
|>    Laugh;
|> ELSE
|>    Weep;
|> 
|> By the way, the article can best be described as a badly thought out
|> exercise in establishing moral superiority.  It has no economic content.
|> 
|> Tamer Abdelgawad
|> 
|> (Long live Belly-dancers!)

I did not happen to see this one, can you please post the section you are
referring to.

A.Faris
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:5009 soc.culture.pakistan:16947