HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Sherri's Spewing (WAS: Re: Another Lindros)
Date: 13 Apr 92 16:41:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: optima.15243
Distribution: na
Organization: U of Arizona CS Dept, Tucson

In article <MduE1zq00VAyJ6Bktg@andrew.cmu.edu>, rs7f+@andrew.cmu.edu (Richard K. Shehady) writes:
> American elementary and high schools stink. Period.  You don't see very 
> many foreigners coming here to learn until college level.  It is

How many kids travel out of the country to go to *public* schools in a foreign
nation anywhere in the world??? There are private prep schools in this country
that are amongst the best in the world - if you have the $ and the connections
to get your kids into them - something I certainly did/do not have...

> I don't mean to turn this into n.rec.education, but it is a fact.  Another
> thing is you see a lot of American students who have loads of trouble 
> their first few semesters of college because they were so pitifully
> unprepared by their high schools.

 Unlike other countries whose children all get straight A's from the day they
enter college right? The fact that our universities accept a wider range of
students than do most foreign universities is more likely the reason that this
occurs in the US than in other nations. We simply have more students going onto
higher education now. We could, of course, cut way back on access and more or
less make it impossible for a kid from an inner-city school to get a college
education or say some kid from who grows up in the sticks where very few
ever even consider college as an option, and instead simply take kids from the
top prep schools or top high schools in the nation - my guess is that you'd
see a marked improvement in the abilities of an incoming freshman class very
quickly - of course you'd see half the colleges and universities in the
country close and you'd be denying bright, capable human beings from
advancing their education and life....

			gln
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Players to sue league?
Date: Wed, 08 Apr 92 15:53:04 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Keywords: Antitrust ruling opens door


I found this in this morning's Pgh. Post Gazette:

Lost in all the talk about the owners" "final ultimatium" amd the players
rejection of it, was the news that the NHL lost an antitrust suit that was
being tried in federal court in Minneapolis.  The ruling came down yesterday
afternoon.  (Unfortunately, the morning paper didn't print the details of
the case.)

Jim Quinn, a lawyer for the players, says the decision opens the door for
players to challenge any league bylaw that would have been previously been
excluded by an antitrust exemption that the league held.  Quinn said players
could now sue the league over the draft and free agent system.

"I would not have a good night's sleep if I were them(the owners)." Quinn said.

Bill Wilkerson, spokesperson for the NHL, said there was no coincedence the
players' rejection came soon after the ruling.

Said Wilkerson, "The litigation agenda has taken over the bargaining agenda."

Lori
From: adams@pyramid.unr.edu (Brian Adams)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Penguins retain cup ?
Date: 10 Apr 92 22:35:53 GMT
Reply-To: adams@pyramid.unr.edu (Brian Adams)
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Nevada, Reno  Department of Computer Science

It seems to me that until somebody wins the cup again that the Pens retain it,
since they are still the reigning champions.

Whether or not they physically keep the cup for display at home is not that
important, if you think about it. They're still the champs!

Having said that, I'm sure the League, in their infinite wisdom, will dream
up some hair-brained way of handling it. They'll probably say that the Pens'
reign has expired or something.

Really, at this point, who gives a rat's ass! Let's go to a baseball game.

Brian



Organization: H&SS Dean's Office, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 09:11:02 -0400 
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Pens-4 Caps-1


>From Warren Arbogast
>In article <1992Apr16.152820.123991@cs.cmu.edu> lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori
Iannamico
>) writes:
> 
>>received a minor for roughing.  As Dino made his way to the penalty box, he
>>was taunted with chants of "Rapist" and "Pervert".
> 
>I'm curious (seriously) as to whether Scott Stevens, Geoff Courtnall, and 
>Neil Sheehy, ever got or still get a hard time around NHL cities over the 
>infamous limo incident?

Dino's reputation includes his on-ice behavior as well.  Many people I
know occasionally say something like, "Oh yeah, remember that limo
incident with those other three players."  They don't even know who those
other three players are; I didn't remember myself until you refreshed
my memory.  It seems that "indecent exposure" type of things are more
cause for jokes.  I don't know many people who joke about rape or
alleged rape.  Case in point: not many people talked about the Doc Gooden
(and those "other two players") rape charges in Florida.  However, many
folks seem to find the David Cone indecent exposure charge to be quite
amusing.  (No mention, though, of the women who expose themselves during
games.  I was sitting near one myself at a Pirate game and most of the
people -- women included -- thought it was funny.)  I have no comment
on these things -- just stating what I perceive.
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: What the world needs now is an AMERICAN TV CONTRACT.
Date: 8 Apr 92 15:35:15 GMT
Organization: Ericsson Telecom, Stockholm, Sweden

In article <1992Apr4.212836.1075@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>In article <allan.702362807@so-heart-rv> allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:
>>
>>And do you really think banning fighting will do anything? Look at Detroit,
>>Chicago, etc. The fighters are often the most popular people.
>>
>>If you ban fighting, you will get a lot more stick swinging, kicking, etc.
>>(After all, what can the person do to retaliate?) And it won't do a thing

Some people like to use this argument (myth) to justify fighting.
If you really believe that banning fighting would increase retaliation
of another form, then you have no confidence in the players. You
think that the players are childish cry-babies that would do anything
to prove their manliness. I don't think it has to be that way.
My reference for this claim is the Swedish hockey league, where we have
both less stickwork and less fighting. OK, the larger ice surface makes
it a less contact sport here but it shouldn't be impossible for NHL to
change anyway.

>>to help get a TV contract, because Americans have Football, basketball, 
>>baseball and I doubt the head of the national networks even know what Hockey
>>is. And people will STILL think hockey is a barbaric game because of the
>>hitting and the nasty stickwork that a ban on fighting will bring.
>>
>
>The NBA could hardly get on American TV fifteen years ago...
>
>Hockey violence is already much reduced...and can be mostly eliminated
>with rules changes...both fighting and stickwork...it just takes a 
>little owner-GM-coach-player cooperation.
>
Couldn't agree more.

>>Besides, do you really think the average US blue collar sports fan, the
>>type that loves the NHL, will really be upset over a little fighting?
>>Actually, if anything, I think he'd LIKE the odd scrap.
>>
>
>Hockey in the US actually has the most upscale profile for an audience
>of all the major sports....believe it or not...but it's because it is
>unquestionably the most entertaining sport and it hasn't been mass
>marketed in the US...and perhaps because of it prominence in the
>Northeast US, and all those exclusive private universities.
>
>Gerald

Staffan
--
 /\         /|                              Go MALMO!! 
 \         /-|                      Go Leksand!! Hata Vita Hasten!      
\_)taffan /  |xelsson        Congratulations, Rogle! New Elitserie team 92-93
#etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se#   r.s.h net contact for the Swedish Hockey League
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Coach's Corner Update - April 12, 1992
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 05:40:14 GMT



Here's a summary of Don Cherry's coach's corner, April 12, 1992.


Topic: The Strike

Details:

Don begins saying how HE was the one that was predicting that the
players were going to go on strike, that they would be out for
a week, then they would come back and play the playoffs. (To prove
his point, Don showed clips from previous episodes when he
was making his predictions.)

Ron Maclean started calling Don 'Kreskin', because of his ESP powers.
Don replied "Who does he play for?" (I believe he was trying to be funny.)
Ron also made the quip that predicting that the playoffs would go ahead
was the first Playoff prediction Don ever got right.

As for who won the strike, Don said it was a draw; the owners gave
up more than they wanted, but the players didn't get everything either.
The players got the most important thing they wanted - respect.

Don gave some credit for solving the strike to Wayne Gretzky for
solving the strike. Although Ken Baumgartner and Mike Liut are
nice guys, it took Gretzky to make an impact. Wayne is probably
the most powerful man in hockey right now. (Don claimed that
talks Gretzky gave during the strike made it seem like Wayne
had 'returned' to his small-town Ontario roots. He then made
a plea for Wayne to remember his roots, instead of getting
his 'brain fried' down there with every one else in La La land.)

The players needed better public relations. Bob Goodinow did
OK. The owners and John Ziegler came up smelling like roses.
[Side note: If the NHL owners are so good at marketing their
point of view in the strike, how come they can't market NHL
teams like that?]

As for Ziegler's speaches during the strike, Don was quite
sarcastic. "If you love hockey so much, try to make it out
to a few more games".

Ron Maclean's closing comments referred to the differences
Don and Wayne have on fighting in the NHL: "Don feels that
fighting would be McSorely missed".

Anyways, a so-so episode. (At least it emphasizes Don's stand
on NHL management and John Ziegler.) I'd give it a 5 out of 10.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   \  \                   |Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.ualberta.ca)
    \  \                  |Department of Computing Science,
     \  \_______          |University of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
      \    ###  \     _   |---------------------------------------------------
       \___###___\   (_)  |My opinions are mine and mine alone.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is amazing how much can be accomplished if no one cares who gets the
 credit..."          - U. of A. Golden Bears Hockey Motto (C. Drake)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: ARBOGASTW@vaxb.gbus.virginia.edu (Warren Arbogast)
Subject: Re: What the world needs now is an AMERICAN TV CONTRACT.
Organization: Darden Center, University of Virginia
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 13:23:30 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.153222.20401@athena.mit.edu> mczody@athena.mit.edu (Michael C. Zody) writes:

>   It has been suggested that expanding to more U.S. markets and banning fighting
>is the route to go.  As I've already said, most U.S. markets can't understand
>anything but the fighting, 

I feel sorry for you.

>   As far as building more support in the U.S. in concerned, the way to do it
>is the way soccer has done it

Unless I missed something, soccer hasn't done anything substantial as far as 
pro sports goes.  When I was a kid, I remember hearing "soccer is the 
fastest growing sport."  I have two kids now, one is little league age 
and the other day somebody told me "soccer is the fastest growing sport."

blah, blah, blah.
From: bsk@acsu.buffalo.edu (Brian S. Kazmierczak)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Where is the cup? (was: Re: Penguins retain cup ?)
Date: 9 Apr 92 13:20:44 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: UB

In article <1992Apr8.221443.21724@helios.physics.utoronto.ca> obaidr@bullet.ecf (OBAID ARIF) writes:
>Now that the playoff's have been cancelled, does this mean that the Pens
>keep the Cup ?
>Or is it that the Cup will be placed in a neutral place since no one is the
>Champ this year ?
>Boy, is this confusing......
>Arif [ scratching my head.... ]  Obaid

Ok, I may sound niave, but do the teams actually keep the cup? What's that
thing they have in the Hall of Fame in Toronto? Is it just a copy of the
cup? 


Hey! Buffalo's never won it, how am I supposed to know? :)

----

Brian
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: So long, Stanley Cup playoffs
Date: 13 Apr 92 14:43:04 GMT
Organization: HMS

In article <wdts8se00WBNM3blxt@andrew.cmu.edu> am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>
>You are in no position to judge whether or not I'm a compassionate
>human being and I resent your reference that I am not.  I have been

Listen,you're not compassionate. End of story. I supported the players
from the very start  and I knew down deep inside that they'd get what
they wanted sooner or later. You bashed the players' motives for
striking when they struck. You only see one side of things - the fan's
side. Guess what, even if they had to play the finals in the August
I would have watched them play.
You jumped into the owners' corner because you felt that you put alot
of money into the game over the years and were getting screwed by
'greedy players' at the worst possible time - to see your Penguins
lose to the Rangers or whoever is gonna beat the crap out of them this
spring. Fine. I can dig that. But you have no right to come out and
tell me that the players owe you something over the years you've
supported them. Most of the money you saved from babysitting went to the owners
and you don't have to be a genius to see that. Alot of the former greats
you watched play got screwed by this league! What they did they do to
deserve that? They simply played a great of hockey and nobody gave a
shit until a guy named Bob Goodenow stepped in and got some respect
from the owners.

LONG LIVE NHLPA! GO BRUINS!
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
From: 91287041@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (gut feelings...)
Subject: Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University, Sudbury, ON
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 03:36:01 GMT

In <1992Apr14.003842.29542@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> ash@sumex-aim.stanford.edu (David Ash) writes:

>should at least be competitive on a regular basis.  There's something wrong
>when the province which has given the NHL many great players including the
>Great One himself can't even make the playoffs year after year.  I'm too young
>to even remember the Leafs Cup victory in 1967, but I do know that the
>standard I've come to expect as minimal Leafs performance has declined over
>the years from "usually they'll get to the 2nd round of the playoffs" to "well
>at least they'll do better than the Sharks (but I wouldn't bet the store on
>it)"!

well i am old enough to remember the Imlach era and what encourages me about
the present group is that for the first time since Imlach got fired, the man
who runs the show (fletcher) is not the owner.  I think Grant Fuhr started
celebrating the end of the season a little early though...

>GO BLUE JAYS!!!
>-- 
>David W. Ash               | "What profits a man if he keeps his eternal soul
>ash@sumex-aim.stanford.edu |  when he could have lived life to the full and
>HOME: (415) 497-1629       |  been forgiven at the end of it all anyway?"
>WORK: (415) 725-3859       |         --David Merritt, a.k.a. THE RED SHARK


-- 
roger l. maynard                              
91287041@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca             
Sudbury Ont.                                
Canada                                     
From: cadams@hpspdla.spd.HP.COM (Chris Adams)
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 21:25:52 GMT
Subject: Re: Calder (not Bure, not Lidstrom, not Amonte!)
Organization: HP Stanford Park - Palo Alto, CA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey

Dionne sounds like an interesting story.  How many games has he played
and why did he start the season late?  Even Bure fans are interested!


 _______________
/ |   | | |   | \  Chris Adams
| | O |.|.| O | |  (415)857-7864
|[|   | | |   |]|  cadams%hpspd%hplabs@hp.com
| | O |.|.| O | |
\_|___|_|_|___|_/  GO CANUCKS!!!
From: tiok_jk@tac.fi (Juha Koivisto)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Women's World Championships schedule
Date: 13 Apr 92 06:46:16 GMT
Organization: City of Tampere


The Women's Ice Hockey World Championships will be played here in
Finland starting on Monday the 20th of April.
The games will be played in two icehalls of Tampere.

Tampere is very famous ice-hockey city in Finland.
Men's Ice Hockey World Championships has been played
four times in Finland and three times (1965, 1982 and 1991)
Tampere has been one of cities were the games has been played.


Here is the schedule for the games:

1992 Women's Ice Hockey World Championships in Tampere, Finland

Group A:  Canada, Sweden, Denmark, China
Group B:  USA, Finland, Norway, Switzerland

Apr 20,  12.00   Canada  - China
         15.00   Sweden  - Denmark
         17.00   USA     - Switzerland
         18.30   Finland - Norway

Apr 21,  13.30   China   - Sweden
         15.00   Norway  - USA
         17.00   Denmark - Canada
         18.30   Switzerland - Finland

Apr 22,  No games

Apr 23,  13.30   Denmark - China
         15.00   Canada  - Sweden
         17.00   Norway  - Switzerland
         18.30   Finland - USA

Apr 24,  15.00   A3 - B4
         18.30   B3 - A4

Apr 25,  13.00   A1 - B2
         16.00   B1 - A2

Apr 26,  13.00    7 - 8
         13.30    3 - 4   Bronze Medal Game
         16.00    5 - 6
         17.00    1 - 2   Gold Medal Game

Times are in local timezone EET-DST (GMT + 3 hours).

-- 
Juha Koivisto   *  Department of Information Technology
tiok_jk@tac.fi  *  City of Tampere, Finland
From: lyddy@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: NHL Season is over.
Date: 9 Apr 92 10:33:53 GMT
Distribution: na

>  I have always wondered about who you are Sheri and Gerald and your past
> playing expirence in the game of hockey. Mabey you could tell us how you
> scored the winning goal(s) in any games that you have played, and if you
> are still playing.

This line of questioning always cracks me up.  I guess your point is that 
if a person hasn't separated his/her shoulder playing hockey, he/she has no
right to an opinion on the subject.  I guess you feel that only ex-soldiers
and Marines have a right to comment on military policy, or that only law
school graduates should have the right to vote...

There is an old saying: "Concentrate on WHAT is right, not on WHO is right."
Perhaps your opinions about the NHLPA are well-founded in logic.  But attack-
ing Sherri or Gerald's positions just because they didn't lead the pickup
league in scoring won't convince me that YOUR opinions are more appropriate.
Let's stick to the argument and forget about the perceived "expertise" of the
participants.  (Begin Sarcasm) Besides, you admitted that you never played 
hockey for a living, so what could YOU possibly know about the players' coll-
ective position? (End Sarcasm) 

-Dan Lyddy
-UMass at Amherst
Organization: Astm Center, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey,talk.politics.misc
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 13:01:23 -0400 
From: "Carl D. Lovejoy" <cl3d+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Greedy Athletes
	<1992Apr10.001526.21837@adobe.com>
Distribution: na

In article <Edt=9m_00Uh7Q6ur0v@andrew.cmu.edu> "Carl D. Lovejoy"
><cl3d+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>>thinking know.  They Like the rest of the South could give a rats ass
>>about Hockey.

>This simply isn't true.  Or perhaps the fact that the University of
>Alabama-Huntsville has a hockey team is demonstrating "giving a rats >ass"
>about hockey.  

>It is true, however, that if you can't see hockey, you won't ever pick up
>interest in hockey.  The NHL shot itself in the foot in a big way when it
>took the SC contract, and became invisible to vast parts of the country.

>Sherri Nichols

	My mother always warned me there would be people who can't distinquish
between a general statement and a specific one.

	IN GENERAL (there is that clear enough), and it does not take a genius
to find an exception to just about anything,  the South does NOT give a
rats ASS about Hockey.  Period.   I am sure that there is one or two
Cowboys that carry an Aluminum Cooper as aposed to a shot gun on there
horse, but I truely doubt tthat he finds enough buddies to pick up a
game.

	Please explain why there have been so very little season tickets sold
for the Lightning;  last I heard it was around 2000.  With as much noise
as they mnade down there about wanting this team, that is before they
actually had to pay the bills, you would have thought they could have
made more.  And I am sure that you ahve not forgotten about the  Atlanta
Flames no have you?  

Carl
From: IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (the DM)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Playoff Format
Date: 16 Apr 92 02:00:31 GMT
Organization: University of Maine System

I do believe that that has actually been proposed before but of course
Ziegler is still running the show so nothing that makes sense will ever
happen till he's gone.   Hhhmm.  Bruins would STILL play montreal in
round two......         GO B'S
                                         Patrick Ellis
Organization: Bar-Ilan University Computing Center, Israel
Date: Sunday, 5 Apr 1992 13:58:58 IST
From: <X41671@BARILVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Calder (not Bure, not Lidstrom, not Amonte!)

Has anyone taken a peek over at Marcel Dionne's kid brother Gilbert?
I'll bet that his stats based on a full season would equal or even surpass
some of these big names, and taking into account that he plays for defensive
minded Montreal, where Denis Savard can't even hit 80 pts., he must have
some great talent, unfortunately unnoticed.
HUDSTER
From: david@eng.umd.edu (David Chi-Chung Lu)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: Minimum Salaries
Date: 11 Apr 92 20:19:00 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Maryland, College Park

In article <1992Apr10.020451.20465@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
>
>  Can anyone provide me with the following information on salaries ?
>
>*  Minimum and Average salaries in the NHL
>*  Minimum and Average salaries in the NBA
>*  Minimum and Average salaries in Baseball.

As close as I can recall, from last week's Washington Post:

Average salaries:   NBA   $1.1 million
                    MLB   $900,000
                    NFL   $475,000
                    NHL   $380,000 
Assumed to be in US$.

An important note when comparing these is the number of players in
each league.  There are 564 NHL players, almost 1300 NFL players, and
over 700 major league baseball players.  There are only about 350
players in the NBA.  (Fewer cheap benchwarmers around to offset
the huge superstar salaries.)  Even Gretzky's $3 million is measly
compared to Larry Bird's $7 million, not including those sticky player
licensing profits.  The b-ball players are the really rich ones.

But who cares.  I got good seats for the first Caps playoff game!

Dave Lu