From: f43703a@nucc.cc.nagoya-u.ac.jp (SUPRATIC GUPTA)
Subject: Re: RJB
Organization: Nagoya University Computation Center, Nagoya, Japan.
	<F43703A.93Jan23193419@nucc.cc.nagoya-u.ac.jp>
	<C1BK4p.n1F@uceng.uc.edu>
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 10:57:01 GMT

In article <C1BK4p.n1F@uceng.uc.edu> mghayalo@uceng.uc.edu (Manoj Ghayalod) writes:

 |Path: nucc!tutgw!hamamatsu-pc.ac.jp!yilnws!dclsic!wnoc-tyo-news!nec-tyo!nec-gw!sgiblab!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!news.cs.indiana.edu!babbage.ece.uc.edu!uceng.uc.edu!mghayalo
 |From: mghayalo@uceng.uc.edu (Manoj Ghayalod)
 |Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian
 |Date: 23 Jan 93 18:17:13 GMT
 |References: <llp0vrINNb06@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> <F43703A.93Jan23193419@nucc.cc.nagoya-u.ac.jp>
 |Organization: University of Cincinnati
 |Lines: 126
 |
 |In article <F43703A.93Jan23193419@nucc.cc.nagoya-u.ac.jp> f43703a@nucc.cc.nagoya-u.ac.jp (SUPRATIC GUPTA) writes:
 |>In article <llp0vrINNb06@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM> naga@sparcbiz2.Eng.Sun.COM (NAGA) writes:
 |>
 |> |
 |> |
 |> |    With a lot of talk on the net as to how Kashmir is going to be
 |> | "liberated" soon, let's pause for a moment and take a look at the reality:
 |> |
 |> |	  1) Anyone that have  aspirations with regard to "liberating" Kashmir,
 |> |	     might have to face full brunt of a  nuclear war in the region. Anybody,
 |> |	     that thinks India is going to let go of Kashmir after a conventional war,
 |> |	     must be living in a "fool's paradise".                                        
 |> |
 |> |	  2) The development of indigenous advanced missile technology in India, would only
 |> |	     make delivering the above weapons anywhere in south Asia much easier.
 |> |
 |> |	  3) With a BJP run GOI (it is just a matter of time before they take power),
 |> |	     swift and appropriate decisive response would be the order of the day to such aspirations,
 |> |	     as supposed to spineless and gutless indecisive reactions from the current GOI.
 |> |	     Moreover, BJP openly favors manufacturing nuclear weapons and would model the nation's
 |> |	     security similar to Israel. 
 |> |
 |> | 
 |> |  The best chance that anyone had of "liberating" Kashmir was in the sixties and seventies. We all
 |> | know how it turned out when it was tried at that time. It is the recognition of these facts that
 |> | have made US to consider labelling Pakistan as a "terrorist" state to de-escalate the crisis in
 |> | Kashmir.
 |> |
 |> | Also, continuing ethnic strife in India due to the cohort meddling from outside forces in the internal
 |> | affairs of India, might also lead to the eventual use of nuclear weapons on them.               
 |> |
 |> | Under these circumstances, the "status quo" is probably the best solution with regard to Kashmir. 
 |> | It is in the best interests of both, India and Pakistan, to maintain just that.
 |> |	      
 |>
 |>
 |>I agree to all these feeling writen by you. One more thing is very clear.
 |>Congress apeasing Muslim population for vote is not going to pay long .
 |>enough.  
 |>
 |>Maintaining status quo is a temporary solution, cannot be a lasting one.
 |>
 |>
 |>I personally feel that boths sides have done and are doing grave mistakes.
 |>On one side Muslim population is not joining the main stream and trying to
 |>develop it self. Irrespective of the religion they should join good schools
 |>for education. I remember a article that some news paper organisation had
 |>done a survey on muslim populationn and foumd that muslim population lad
 |>the highest level of school drop outs. This is not a purely economical
 |>point of view.
 |>
 |>I still remember that I had only very few muslim friends (according to
 |>my knowledge only 1 in my batch 1990 IITM) and was from a well to do
 |>family and is in US now. It does not represent the 12% population
 |>of Islam. This is not a minority problem or economic problem. This is
 |>a clear problem in mentality of muslim population in India. Atleast I
 |>can say that IIT entrance does not have any Bias. Niether can it be 
 |>true that economical situation in India between Hidus and Muslims are 330:1.
 |>
 |>
 |>Some muslims may argue that, how can we send our children to Hindu
 |>oriented schools. I can strongly say that IIT is not such a institution.
 |>There will be many arround to back me on this point. 
 |>
 |>How can muslims expect that Hindu people will leave there traditions.
 |>
 |>This is all against Muslims. 
 |>
 |>Now I want to say on mistakes of Hindu society. It still embaraces
 |>caste system. Till the reservation was implemented, all jobs were
 |>granted seeing the family names. Here I am not talking of Highly 
 |>technical jobs. Here I am talking of the general jobs. 
 |>Again speaking, If This caste system is not broken, NO BJP can stop
 |>problems between comuunities by use of Neuclear weapon. YYou can use
 |>neuclear weapon against Pakistan, the real enemy of India, but how can 
 |>you usse it against your own people? Say like Assam?  I am from Assam.
 |>I am a bengali. My family was fucked out of bangladesh. We moved into
 |>Assam, because of economic reason. And what India gave us? A second
 |>class citizenship? Why?
 |>
 |>IS IT THE MISTAKE OF ASSMESE POPULATION? No it is again the problem with 
 |>congress? They tried to appease minority vote bank. Their old divide 
 |>and rule concept? 
 |>
 |>CONGRESS/INDIA NEVER BOTHERED ABOUT THE DEVELOPEMENT OF ASSAM. Really
 |>speaking Assam has the capacity of becoming a OIL RICH/ TEA RICH country
 |>if left alone. You can ask how about technology? There is a saying that
 |>DHAN CHITALE KAKER ABHAB HAY NA. There no scarcity of crows if you spread
 |>rice.
 |>
 |>So don't say that INDIA is laways the good fellow arround.
 |>
 |>Take for example the case of Srilankan Tamils. They were in problem
 |>in their country. So They were becoming a refugee problem in India.
 |>We trained them. CAN YOU DISAGREE THAT INDIA TRAINED LTTE? You can defend
 |>Training MUKTI BAHINI saying that Pakis were buthering Bengalis. So we
 |>liberated them. But what did we gave them? First train them, then send
 |>Indian army to stop them, (INdian army did rape women there, I can bet on it.
 |>Because they did the same in ASSAM. there are proof of it. But all Indians
 |>are not to be blamed for it.)  
 |>
 |>So EK HATE TALI BAJE NA. You cannot clap with one hand.
 |>
 |>So like Pakistan and muslim society has to come to reality and accept us,
 |>and Hindu society and walk along with it, simillarly we have also to
 |>understand our mistakes and come to reality. 
 |>
 |>NORTH INDIA CANNOT RULE INDIA ANY MORE.
 |
 |Prime Minister of India : South India
 |Finance Minister of India : North India
 |Home Minister of India : South west India
 |Defence Minister of India : South west India.
 |
 |Out of the four most important positions in India only one is from
 |the North, and that too he is a Sikh, which as you know is a minority
 |group.  You have been away from India too long South India has taken
 |over.
 |
 |>
 |>--
 |>With regards
 |> 
 |>SUPRATIC GUPTA
 |
 |Manoj


I am not talking of present. I am really happy that first time in Histtory the 
PM is form non-north Indian belt, especially the most uneducated region like
UP. Supported by Bihar (highest illiteracy) MP  (one more such sate). This 
is why I am still optimistic. 


I have said this before also, and stating it again. Do you think this BM
problem would have been there if it was in Assam/ Bengal/ Kerala.


Don't you see the simple truth. Congress (not the present one, it is still
to prove it self) has always created problems in INDIA. Take any problem.

1) ASSAM   purely a INDIRA gandi created problem. With only two MP from
Assam, that too corupted by bribes recieved in top level, Congress have
always negleted Assam and its developement. BG rail lines are still not there 
beyond Guwahati. Assam had to do revolution to get a Oil refinary, a Bridge to
cross Brahmaputra, or the much wanted IIT in Assam. (GOD KNOWS WHEN IT WILL 
COME UP). Assam is continuosly flooded every year. No thought is given to
it. Brahmaputra river need a cleaning of Bed. It is a comlicated work. Why
is not there any interest?

2) Punjab Problem: Bhindrawal (am I doing a mistake? I mean the one who
was the leader during Golden temple problem) was a creation of Indira Gandhi.
She wanted to use him against the local party. Every body knew that in open
 day light  terorist were entering Golden temple with arms. One of my friend
told me that in day light people could see terorist cleaning rifles. That time
police could have stoped it. But Idira Gandhi, the biggest fool in the world,
waited till the problem become a atom bomb and then she inteligently used 
Indan Force. She could have just surrounded the Golden temple for sme time,
make it closed, till all the terorist surrender. I am sure all would have 
agreed to it. That is what they did next time. How long could they have 
survived  without food.  

Wasn't it INDIRA GANDHI FAULT. I am personally not sorry that SHE gave her
life dearly to the people who had the reputaion of being the most Indian
loving. Who can defy the contribution of PUNJAB AND BENGAL to Indian 
indipendence. Refer to garys letter where he points out how patriotic
way the punjabi army in PAK war.

3) SRI LANKA, I alraedy said enough. We trained them, and then we are
calling them terorist. What is the difference in what we did and what
Pak is doing. Only difference , India is a strong country. US has today
interest in INDIA, not in Pakistan. Today Ball is in India's court.

4) Last of MONDOL COMMISION  : foolish VP jee. wasted a great thing. It 
required national debate. I am sure all right minded people would agree
to it if presented in right form. Just to get political gains he huridly 
put in the table. And we all knnow the results.


Indian politicians are sheet. How will you Atom bomb to these internal
enemies. I don't have to prove how pliticians have been allowed to create
problems in Kashmir, Bombay etc.

Just think truth fully, and you will get the answer.

PRESENT INDIAN GOVERMENT/CONGRESS is a little different from past.
It is too early to coment on it.

BUT IT REQUIRES REAL GUTS TO ACCEPT OWN MISTAKES. IT IS VERY EASY TO 
POINT AT OTHERS. PLEASE NOTE THAT I AM BLAMING MUSLIM SOCIETY EQUALLY
STRONGLY FOR THIER CONDITION. MY FIRST LETTER SPAKS FOR IT.

--
With regards
 
SUPRATIC GUPTA