Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish
Subject: Re: Seyreyleyin gumburtuyu  
From: Hakki_Kocabas@kcbbs.gen.nz (Hakki Kocabas)
Date: 27 Jan 93 03:10:39 GMT
Organization: Kappa Crucis Unix BBS, Auckland, New Zealand

> In article <1029324.58467.7457@kcbbs.gen.nz> Hakki_Kocabas@kcbbs.gen.nz (Hak
> >Emre Erkut'un 'din'i mi ?    
> >Allah'in 'din'i mi?    
>   
> Bir insan dusunun, din gozunu o kadar karartmis ki, cumhuriyetin yasalarini 
> bile din saniyor.  
  
Bir insan dusunun, kendi dini gozunu o kadar karartmis ki Allah'in  
dinini goremez hale gelmis. Kendi yasalariyla kurup korudugu dinine de  
'cumhuriyetin yasalari'..'Ataturk ilkeleri uzerine oturtulmus cumhuriyetin  
yasalari' adini takarak onlari kutsallastirmis. Ve de bana  
boyle cibillastirilmis diniyle fiyaka yapiyor. Cav, cav etme Emre !  
Ataturk'un 'din'ini getir !.  
  
> >in the maze of metaphysicians' "DIN" like Emre Erkut's ?!    
>   
> Ben ya da Ataturk mu metafizikci yani? Siz metafizik hakkinda da  
> yanilgilar icindesiniz. Ne ben, ne de Ataturk, fizikle aciklanamayani  
> baska seylerle aciklamaya calismisizdir. Bu baglamda bir   
> metafizikci varsa o da peygamberdir.   
  
Hey Emre Erkut !  
  
Iste sana benden bir hediye. Metafizikci dedinde aklima geldi.  
Birinin onerilerinin hangi oneriler kategorisine girdigini ogerenmek  
istersen asgida siraladigim sorulardan uygun olanlari ona  
uygula ve oneriyi yapanin yanitini kaydet.  
Ornegin su buyuk (!?) soze bu sorulari uygulayabilirsin:  
"Hakimiyet bila-kaydu-sart milletindir."  
Bak bakalim hangi ketegoriye girecek.  
Amman bana tesekkur falan etme Ataturk carpar...:-)  
  
"The philosophy exists only as questions, not as answers"  
  
Wahle, R., Die Tragikomoedie der Weisheit. Die Ergebniss und die  
Geschichte des Philosophierens (Wien/Leipzig, 1915), p.41.  
  
"The best is silence."  
  
Whale, R. (1915), p.41.  
  
"The Investigations contain 784 questions. Only 110 of these are  
answered; and seventy of the answers are meant to be wrong."  
  
Anthony Kenny, in "Aquinas and Wittgenstein", Downside Review 77  
(1959), p.235.  
  
""In philosophy", he wrote in RFM, "it is always good to put a  
question instead of an answer to a question" (p.147). (He went on,  
however, to question this statement!)"  
  
Oswald Hanfling, Questions and Answers in Wittgenstein's  
Philosophy, WITTGENSTEIN EINE NEUBEWERTUNG II, (Wien, 1990), p.123.  
  
                             *  
                           *   *    
  
AI PHILOSOPHICAL INVESTIGATOR's QUESTIONAIRE DATABASE  
  
Did you invent that ...... as a fiction ?  
In your use, can you say that a reality corresponds to ...... if it  
is true and we can assert it ?  
If yes, so you have a use for ......  
  
Do you use ...... as an explanation of the use of the words ?  
  
How did you learn the expression ...... ?  
Has anyone explained it to you by refering to sensations, images or  
thoughts that accompany hearing ...... ?  
  
Can you construct an application of this-symbol/these-symbols ?  
Is this a definition about a symbol ?  
  
In your use of it, is time enter into ...... ?  
Do you use ...... to make forecasts/predictions ?  
  
If you use it as a mathematical proposition, can you prove it in  
mathematics according to certain rules ?  
  
In your use of ......, can you say nothing which happens will ever  
make me/us call it false or give up ?  
  
Would you use ...... if in its application things were different ?  
  
Is ...... useful in experience ?  
  
If ...... is a rule, do you know how is it used ?  
  
Do you want to join different techniques with the use of ...... ?  
  
Do you want to use ...... as a projection ?  
  
Do you want to make ...... independent of experience ? So you want  
to lay down ...... as a foundation which provides a form of  
representation ? a method of description ?  
  
If you don't marvel at the fact that the propositions of arithmetic  
(e.g. the multiplication tables) are "absolutely certain", then why  
should one be astonishted that the proposition ...... is so   
equally ?  
  
Can you say "I don't have to change my opinion that ...... " ?  
  
I don't know what you mean, tell me exactly what you mean, or else  
I may be cheated.  
I need to know how it is used, do you know how to use it ?  
  
An expression has any amount of use, then how if I tell you a word  
......, can you have the use in your mind in an instant ?  
  
Is this similar to nonsense or to something that is surprising ?  
Are you inclined to call this nonsense ?  
  
Is this nearer to the ordinary case or is it nearer to the absurt  
case ?  
  
Is that ...... a rule about the use of a symbol or symbols ?  
  
Was ...... first introduced because of experience and now you have  
made it independent of experience; a rule of expression for talking  
about your experiences ?  
  
Is it true that you have arranged your notation in such a way that  
...... is meaningless ? and has been excluded ? Is it excluded for  
experiencial reasons, however the statement that it is impossible  
is not an experiencial statement ?  
  
When you use ...... can you say it is impossible ? If so, is this  
a rule of expression ?  
Is this ...... a paradigm/an-object-of-comaprison and you want to  
use it as a model ?  
If yes, is it useful ?  
        is it useless ?  
  
Do you use ...... as a picture of an experiment ?  
  
Do you use ...... as a stadard for the experiment, so it is non-  
temporal ?  
  
Do you use it as a historic description of an event, so it is  
temporal ?  
  
Do you use ...... to construct concepts ?  
  
Do you use ...... to describe objects ?  
  
Do you want to fix and teach ...... as a technique ?  
  
Do you want ...... to serve as a paradigm which is timeless ?  
  
Do you use ...... as a standard of comparison as a paradigm for the  
technique ?  
  
Do you want to make up your mind what you want to do with ...... ?  
  
Before you answer the following questions don't gaze at a form of  
words forgetting my asking you what is done with it. Don't gaze to  
your own soul to see if two expressions have the same meaning but  
gaze how you use it.  
  
In your use of ...... is it meaningful to affix to ...... by  
definition ?  
  
Does ...... have its sense in a system of proofs ?  
  
Do you want this sentence ...... to work ?  
  
Would it is true that ...... make any difference how you use it  
later ?  
  
Leave alone it's meaning does ...... have a use ? If not why don't  
you eliminate it ? If you do that wouldn't it be a modification  
other than closing certain doors ? Would it ?  
  
This shows what you do with ...... : Have you chosen ...... to get  
to a certain point ?  
You don't know what ...... means ? Want to try again ?  
  
Do you have grounds for doubting that ...... ?  
  
Has experience shown it to be unnecessary that ...... ?  
Can you say that experience always proves you right that ......?  
  
Does ...... state part of the picture you form to help you in the  
judgement of various situations ?  
  
Do you need to satisfy yourself by saying that ...... to be able to  
act ?  
  
If I pronounce the opposite of that ...... . would you regard me as  
demented ?  
  
Can you say: I cannot give you any grounds that ......, but if you  
learn more you too will think the same ?  
  
Does it make sense to doubt that ...... ?  
Can you doubt that ...... ?  
  
What is it like to make such a mistake as that ...... ?  
  
What is it like to discover that ...... was a mistake ?  
What could a mistake here be like that ...... ?  
  
Is this ...... supposed to be an empirical proposition ?  
  
Is the hypothesis ...... possible ?  
  
Can you say if I am wrong about this ......, I have no guarantee  
that anything I say is true ?  
  
Can you say if you are wrong about this ......, you have no  
guarantee that anything you say is true ?  
  
What would the practical effects of this belief ...... be ?  
Is it difficult to imagine why anyone should believe the contrary  
?  
What could induce you to believe the opposite ?  
Can you imagine the opposite of ...... ?  
  
Is this proposition ...... must be solid for you ?  
  
Is this ...... a fact that you are certain of to be certain of the  
meaning of your words ?  
  
Can you say that it stands fast for me and many others that ...... ?  
Is it possible for you to doubt that ...... ? Why ?  
Could you try to doubt that ...... ?  
Can you say everything speaks for ...... ?  
Can you say nothing against ...... ?  
If you doubt that ...... how would your doubt come out in practice ?  
If it makes no difference at all enjoy your doubt !!!  
  
What are you doing in believing that ...... ?  
What are you believing if you believe ...... ?  
Can you say that one can only believe that ......, and even that  
one can't believe ?  
Why do you believe that ...... ?  
    Have you reasons ?  
    Do you need reasons ?  
On what ground do you believe that ...... ?  
  
Is this ...... revealed by God ?  
    via which messenger ?  
    in which scripture ?  
  
What does this belief ...... consist in ?  
  
Why should it be possible to have grounds for believing that ......  
if it isn't possible to be certain ?  
  
Can you say: nothing in the world will convince me of the opposite  
that ...... ?  
Can you say: for me this fact ...... is at the bottom of all  
knowledge ?  
Can you say: I shall give upother things but not this ...... ?  
Can you say: I can't be wrong about it that ...... ?  
Can you say: I cannot depart from this judgement without toppling  
all other judgements with it that ...... ?  
  
Can you say: I cannot be making mistake about it that ...... ?  
If your use of that ...... is not to be a merely an observation  
about grammar, can you give the circumstances in which this  
expression ...... functions ?  
  
If you doubt that ......, would you have to doubt all sorts of  
things that stands fast for you ?  
  
Can you say that ...... is a hypothesis, which as you believe, is  
again and again completely confirmed ?  
Are you not ready to let anything count as a disproof of this  
proposition ...... ?  
  
Here you have arrived at a foundation of all your beliefs, what  
would it be like to doubt ...... ?  
What would you believe if you didn't believe that ...... ?  
So far you have no system at all within which this doubt might  
exist ? You have arrived at the rock bottom of your convictions ?  
and one might almost say that these foundation walls are carried by  
the whole house ?  
  
Suppose it wasn't true that ...... ?  
How should you imagine the mistake being discovered ?  
  
If you know that ......, do you also know, or do you only believe,  
that no future experience will seem to contradict your knowledge ?  
If yes that is after all a decision. It is possible that you will  
act against it.  
  
-------------------------------------------------------------------  
Amman "Hakimiyet bila-kaydu-sart milletindir." hangi kategoriye  
dusuyor kimseye soyleme, Ataturk carpar...Ataturk carpamasa bile Kaya  
carpar....o da carpamazsa Cumhuriyetin Yasalari carpar. O ovundugun  
yasalar ki 'millet'i carpita, carpita 'millet' olmaktan cikarmis 'ulus'la   
'millet' arasi bir hilkat-garibesi haline donusturmustur.   
  
> >> Degerli kardesler, alayci tavirlar takinmayin. Takinirsaniz, ayni    
> >> tavirlari davet edersiniz. Su an sizinle alay edilmemesinin nedeni    
> >> haketmemeniz degil, yazan kisinin duygularina esir olmamayi    
> >> basarmasindandir.    
> >>     
> >> Yoksa Turk ulusunun uslu cocuklari yaramaz olmayi da bilir!    
  
Yaramazliktan insanliga ne hayir gelir ?  
Akli kullan Ey Emre Erkut !  
Akli kullan !  
Akli !  
  
> --   
> Emre Erkut                                      Your wisdom is limited   
> Krannert, Purdue                                by the comprehension  
> Turkish Education Foundation 1992 Scholar       of your adressee.  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.turkish