From: davidm@meaddata.com (David Miller)
Subject: Re: dive flags & boaters
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 20:13:59 GMT
Distribution: usa

In article <1992Apr14.133646.6252@cattnts>, craig@cattnts (Craig Campbell) writes:
|> In article <1992Apr3.112914.23343@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> mayne@cs.fsu.edu writes:
|> >In article <2APR199213090362@zeus.tamu.edu> bdd0066@zeus.tamu.edu (Bryan, kick the tire and light the fire, Duke) writes:
|> 
|> Story of powerboat cruising by dive flag omitted...
|> 
|> >>  For me, that was just a little
|> >>too close for comfort, but he should have never been there.  my flag
|> >>was very plain to see.  so why didn't he stay away??
|> 
|> >Most likely he didn't have any idea what a dive flag meant. Quite a few
|> >boaters don't. That doesn't make them idiots.
|> 
|> Not idiots, no....but if a automobile driver ran over a pedestrian at a
|> cross walk, how much strength would you give the argument that the driver
|> probably didn't know what the X meant.  Think about it.

The dive flag is not a standard nautical flag.  Rules vary by state.  The
most important issue is to make boaters aware of flag.....

|> 
|> >I can understand being frightened and angry after an experience like
|> >that, but I must disagree with the "all boaters are idiots" attitude
|> >shown in some articles in rec.scuba. The most flagrant was someone
|> >else's, not yours. Since I don't want to attack any individual perhaps
|> >it is best that I put my comments in a response without a specific
|> >reference.
|> 
|> All boaters are not idiots.  (I am a boater and a scuba diver, so I can see
|> both sides.)  However, operating a boat does require a certain specialized
|> skill set, including how to read common (not all) nautical markers.  I would
|> define a dive flag as a common nautical marker.  Is ignorance a valid excuse?
|> 
|> >Most boaters don't know about diving and divers, and this can produce
|> >dangerous situations. As divers there really isn't much we can do to
|> >change boaters. We have to learn to protect ourselves. It shouldn't
|> >be that way, but it is.
|> 
|> How about some sort of information campagne (around cottage country) to
|> inform boaters (at least the ones who can read) of the meaning of a dive
|> flag?  (I know, who would pay for it.... :-( )

Good idea!  Divers have to pay for it (IMHO) - I'm a diver and a boater.

|> 
|> >Attacking boaters is not the solution. It isn't courteous, it isn't
|> >reasonable, and it won't help.
|> 
|> A public prosecution of a boater who ignored a dive flag and hit a diver
|> probably would help (everyone except the hit diver...).  The publicity
|> of a trial might do the trick.

Hitting a swimmer is an issue.  A diver surfacing under a boat or in the
path of a boat may be the diver's fault and not the boater's fault.  The
dive flag is a flag of the diving industry and is not universally accepted.

|> 
|> >Boaters are much more numerous than divers and the boating industry has
|> >much more clout. If it comes to confrontation we'll lose. If we try to
|> >push for really tough regulation of boats by yelling too loudly about
|> >hazards to divers the result is more likely to be tough regulations on
|> >diving.
|> 
|> The boating industry (comercial) know all about divers and dive flags 
|> (along with a zillion other flag combinations).  The recreational industry
|> does not have the same clout.  Regulations don't mean anything.  The problem
|> as I see it is ignorance, not malice.  Nobody, boater or otherwise WANTS
|> to hit a diver!!

The commercial flag for diving in coastal waters is the ALPHA flag and not the
red divers flag (at least this is true for CA).

|> 
|> Net question:  "How can we (diving industry) inform the recreational boating
|> 		industry about diving in a friendly and useful manner?"
|> 		(How do we pay for it?)

Signs at boat ramps.  Lobby states for laws or at least a mention in the safe
boating books.  Give one page leaflets to boat dealers to include with new
boats.  Mayber a nice little sticker for the dash that shows common 
navigational markers along with the dive flag......

Seems like PADI/NAUI/DAN and other diving organizations could sponser an
effort to do this (and solicit funds from the diving community - and possibly
even from boating manufacturers).

|> 
|> >Bill Mayne
|> 
|> 
|> -- 
|> Craig Campbell		|	These opinions are entirely the result of a 
|> Systems Engineer	|	small butterfly crashing into the far side
|> NCR Canada,		|	of the planet.  Chaos Rules.
|> an AT&T Company		|	I speak for no one, except, possibly, myself.

-- 
David James Miller                             Architecture&Systems Evolution
Mead Data Central, B6F3                        (513) 865-7441
PO Box 933                                     davidm@meaddata.com
Dayton Ohio 45401
Newsgroups: rec.scuba