HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rogue@ucrengr.ucr.edu (ed zeamba)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Rules Q's
Date: 9 Jan 93 09:42:31 GMT
Organization: University of California, Riverside

the FAQ said it is leagal to "attack" a served ball from the 
back players.  What does this mean?  block? Spike?

what is a"2-hand over-head set"  is that where your hands are
open and apart (set?) or togeather?
Now this hit is leagal indoors and illegal outdoors?
What about front row players if its "legal" on a serve?

Ok, if its legal (accordinf to the FAQ) to hit the ball with 2 separated
fists on the First attempt, then is it legal on 2nd 3rd hits?
question #47 would seem to make no differentiation between hits
(about pass/hit) with both hands simultaneuosly on any attempt?
I'm confused...

Can you reach over net to block an oncomming ball in anticipation
of its flight over the net if there is no set/hitter under it, on
the other team's 1st, 2nd or 3rd hit?


more to come later  I'm sure.

             "I'd rather be an obscure thief than a famous fool..."
     /                                                                \
@###I===============> "Know me as GORD of GREYHAWK..." <===============I###@ 
     \		                                                      /
		With the slightest bow and tip of his hat,
	  	   the Rogue steps back into the night... 

rogue@ucrengr.ucr.edu		UC Riverside -- home of the Guildsman
-- 
     /                                                                \
@###I===============> "Know me as GORD of GREYHAWK..." <===============I###@ 
     \		                                                      /
rogue@ucrengr.ucr.edu		UC Riverside -- home of the Guildsman
From: kiviat@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Brian Kiviat)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Date: 7 Jan 93 21:26:18 GMT
Reply-To: kiviat@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Brian Kiviat)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In rec.sport.volleyball, jcp29389@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (I Spike - Therefore I Am) writes:
>>How little spin is required for an effective float serve?
>>One revolution of the ball from server to receiver?

>0 revolutions.

To use the baseball knuckler as an analogy, some spin is needed for
the ball to travel in an erratic path. The cause of this path is the
changing aerodynamic forces on the ball as it tavels across the court.
If there is no spin at all, the forces will be constant and the ball
will not change direction. If a slight 0-1/2 rotation is present, the
aero forces will change as the different facets of the ball deflect
the air differently.  A baseball has a more variable surface than a
volleyball and will have more movement, but we all have seen balls move
left-right-down as they float towards us.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball,news.answers
From: seal@leonardo.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (David Seal)
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 01:02:14 GMT

kiviat@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Brian Kiviat) writes:


>To use the baseball knuckler as an analogy, some spin is needed for
>the ball to travel in an erratic path. The cause of this path is the
>changing aerodynamic forces on the ball as it tavels across the court.

spin stabilizes the ball, and changing aerodynamic forces will have
less effect.  no spin is best.

ds
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Seal                 |  Jet Propulsion Laboratory  |     sunset: 7:54pm
seal@leonardo.Jpl.Nasa.Gov |       Mission Design        |   temp: 82 degrees
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: robp@landru.network.com (Rob Peglar)
Subject: Re: Rules Q's
Reply-To: robp@landru.network.com
Organization: Network Systems Corporation 
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 93 20:46:31 GMT


Just clearing up some difficulty with 'attacking the serve'

The pertinent rule is 8.10 (Rule 8, Article 10).  There is also some helpful commentary
(8.6) that defines what a 'spiked ball' is, which is relevant but not essential to the
discussion of 'attacking the serve'.

To make it simple, take a look at 8.9.  This defines an attack hit.  Notice that this
definition is more general than in commentary 8.6.  Attack hits include spiked balls,
and also include other actions (but not blocking).  In addition, by the definition of
a spiked ball (comm 8.6), you can never spike a serve legally.  Think about this in
relation to 8.10.

So, now 8.10.  One cannot attack a served ball until it drops completely below the
plane (of the net). 

Notice, row (position of players) doesn't have anything to do with it.  This rule used to
be interpreted as the FAQ says (back row OK) but not anymore.  It doesn't matter if
it's front or back row;  the ball below the net obviates this  (back row players can
attack it even in front of the 3m line, because the ball's below the net).  The position
of the ball has everything to do with it.

Now, practically speaking, it's almost impossible to take a swing at a ball below the
net and get it to go over.  But, since 8.9 defines what an attack hit is, in theory (never
actually seen it done due to the risk) one could set (overhand) the serve back over
the net (i.e. on 1) and still be legal.  I suppose if you were 4"11, you could take a swing
at it  :-)

In conclusion, this is one of those rules that I say don't worry about, don't spend (much)
time with it.  It hardly ever happens.  Brush up on those ball-handling-calling skills
instead, and don't worry about weird cases like this.

Rob
USA National Referee




In article 1704@sputnik.huxley.bitstream.com, glennc@bitstream.com (Glenn Corwin) writes:
>In article <24813@galaxy.ucr.edu>, rogue@ucrengr.ucr.edu (ed zeamba) writes:
>: the FAQ said it is leagal to "attack" a served ball from the 
>: back players.  What does this mean?  block? Spike?
>
>Since you are from California, I'll assume you are asking about USVBA rules (a
>few organizations have some rules differences, which the FAQ does not detail
>but tells you where to get the info).
>
>It is illegal to attack (spike) or block a served ball. I disageree with FAQ
>#20. It seems to indicate that it is legal for back-row players to spike a
>serve. IMHO this is incorrect. It is ALWAYS illegal to spike a serve. Maybe
>what the FAQ should have said was that the ball may be hit back over the net
>once it has dropped below the top of the net (not completely above it). That's
>legal for any player (front or back).
>

---
-legal mumbo jumbo follows-
This mail/post only reflects the opinions of the poster (author), 
and in no manner reflects any corporate policy, statement, opinion,
or other expression by Network Systems Corporation.
From: cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: VB Magazine Ball Review
Date: 5 Jan 1993 17:36:03 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: rocket.sw.stratus.com

In article <1867.2b486e54@atlas.nafb.trw.com>, alee@atlas.nafb.trw.com writes:
>               Volleyball Magazine has their first ever ball review in the 
> March issue. A summary follows:

	...

> Spalding Top Flite 18   78.00        Editors Choice < $50. Top grain leather
> Brine Beach Elite       56.00        Best Value     < $50. Top grain leather	
> Mikasa Beach Pro        50.00        Best Value     > $50. Top grain leather
                          ^^^^^                       ^^^^^

> It should be noted that list price is not a good guide for choosing a ball.

Or for rating it, apparently...!  :-)
-- 

cdt@rocket.sw.stratus.com   --If you believe that I speak for my company,
OR cdt@vos.stratus.com        write today for my special Investors' Packet...
From: rwolken@rtormw.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Increasing Jump, (Followup to section in FAQ):
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:21:06 GMT
Reply-To: rwolken@rtormw.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: DisOrganisation is more Appropriate.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball

I just read what was in the FAQ relating to increasing your jump,
and I would like to bring the discussion up again since I'm keen
on getting my jump back up to scratch again.

The suggestion is to do these exercises on the edge of a step
and do calf raises, which seems to me to improve the strength
in your calves.

I remember vaguely from 6-7 years back reading a study done by
Doug Beal(sp?,name?) on this very issue, but the way he had broken
it down was as follows: (If I remember correctly)
Thighs contribute 60% to your jump,
Hamstrings        35%
Calves 		   5%.  
Therefore strengthening you calves, although necessary, may not
produce a great improvement.

Any thoughts/further suggestions on this?

Richard.W.
From: rwolken@rtormw.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Date: 11 Jan 93 11:37:11 GMT
Reply-To: rwolken@rtormw.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: DisOrganisation is more Appropriate.


[
[   What you people seem to be overlooking is "force" -- the force of
[friction, net force on the ball in its component axes, etc.
[   If the ball is sailing through the air with no spin and a (relatively)
[straight path, the net force applied to the ball (besides gravity) is via
[friction of the air; however, this air friction only affects the force
[vector along the axis of the ball's path.  Since the ball is a free-floating
[object, there are NO forces acting on its other axes.
[   Now, any gym will have lots of little air currents caused by the opening
[of doors, the movement of players, etc.  Even though these currents may be
[small, they still have a net effect on those "unforced" axes of the ball
[which I mentioned earlier.  That's why a float serve is always so
[unpredictable -- nobody can see those little air currents, so there's no way
[to tell if they'll make the ball drop suddenly, curve a foot to the left, or
[sail way out.
[
[     - Mark Rosteck -

I've never known, exactly, the physical laws involved, but when I use
the float serve it does have a certain amount of predictability, 
(of course nowhere near 100%). 

When I manage to get the ball to travel with the valve at the top,
it drops. The further back I stand, (and therefore the harder my impact
is on the ball), the more dramatically it will drop. 

The reverse is the case when the valve is at the bottom, the ball will rise.
The perfect ball will generally hit the reciever in the chest. This one is
pretty dangerous to serve from deep, as it will float out if done correctly.

All other variations have an equal reaction, ie. to float in the opposite
direction to the position of the valve.

I can't give any explanation for this, but my coaches theory was
that the hand contact on the ball causes an internal reverberation 
effect which temporarily distorts its shape, and because of the
stiffness around the valve this area remains smooth (thereby allowing
the air to pass faster over that point). This is why the
harded/sharper the contact, the better the effect. 

The only unfortunate thing is that I can only ever get it right
at trainings, after about 20 consecutive serves, because it seems to 
be a rythym thing. 


PS. Actually, after reading the previous article, I'm tending to doubt
my own theory now. But it is, nevertheless, an alternative, take it or leave
it. 
In my last training I served to the same spot (pos 5, deep) about 15 times,
and no matter what I did with the valve, it floated about a meter to the
right (very late too), and usually went out. 
Tonight I'll check if theres something there like an air vent or something. 


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

	Richard Wolken, Munich, Germany. (089)9591-1028

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: ematias@csri.toronto.edu (Ummm... me!)
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Organization: CSRI, University of Toronto
Distribution: usa
Date: 9 Jan 93 03:55:48 GMT

In article <1ik96u$mla@agate.berkeley.edu> sag@hera.Berkeley.EDU (Steve Goldfield) writes:

[Stuff deleted...]

>But a volleyball is roughly spherical, so the fluid path of
>a ball that isn't spinning is the same on top as below. So,
>what is the aerodynamic force on a nonspinning ball? If the
>ball is spinning, there should be small drag effects that
>slow the air in one direction and speed it up in the other.
>
>Is there something wrong with the above reasoning, or is
>there another aerodynamic principle involved?

   What you people seem to be overlooking is "force" -- the force of
friction, net force on the ball in its component axes, etc.
   If the ball is sailing through the air with no spin and a (relatively)
straight path, the net force applied to the ball (besides gravity) is via
friction of the air; however, this air friction only affects the force
vector along the axis of the ball's path.  Since the ball is a free-floating
object, there are NO forces acting on its other axes.
   Now, any gym will have lots of little air currents caused by the opening
of doors, the movement of players, etc.  Even though these currents may be
small, they still have a net effect on those "unforced" axes of the ball
which I mentioned earlier.  That's why a float serve is always so
unpredictable -- nobody can see those little air currents, so there's no way
to tell if they'll make the ball drop suddenly, curve a foot to the left, or
sail way out.

     - Mark Rosteck -
(ematias@csri.toronto.edu)
(g1marker@cdf.toronto.edu)
From: robp@landru.network.com (Rob Peglar)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: Contact Above the Knee
Date: 5 Jan 93 19:30:50 GMT
Reply-To: robp@landru.network.com
Organization: Network Systems Corporation

Scott Marks said,

  I've heard that the USVBA is going to adopt the FIVB's new rules *next*
  season...
  

Well, that's the plan.  The USA will evaluate the changes this year.  If
the changes pass the evaluation, they will be in the '94 USA book.  No
guarantees.

For instance, in the USA-Japan men's match I reffed here in Mpls. in October, we
played FIVB rules.  I asked Fred (Sturm, USA head coach) whether he had seen
any occurrances of the new FIVB 'non-call' pertaining to allowing blockers
to be in the net when the action of playing the ball is no longer in the
front court.  Fred said "not once".  The conclusion for this particular rule
is that the jury is still out.

On the other hand, I am (personally) convinced that the USA will adopt the
knees-and-above rule in '94.  

Stay tuned.


Rob
USA National Referee


---
-legal mumbo jumbo follows-
This mail/post only reflects the opinions of the poster (author), 
and in no manner reflects any corporate policy, statement, opinion,
or other expression by Network Systems Corporation.
From: sag@hera.Berkeley.EDU (Steve Goldfield)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Contact Above the Knee
Date: 4 Jan 1993 16:50:32 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: hera.berkeley.edu

Someone recently stated that after the Olympics, international
volleyball rules were changed to permit contact above the knee.

I recently obtained a copy of the 1993 "Official United States
Volleyball Rules" (inside it says 1992-93 and copyright 1991)
which states unequivocally: "The ball may contact any part of
the body on or above the waist."

Have the US rules been changed to be the same as the international
rules? Are they reprinting the US rules?

Steve Goldfield        :<{  {>:           sag@hera.berkeley.edu
University of California at Berkeley     Richmond Field Station
From: vaf@Valinor.Stanford.EDU (Vince Fuller)
Subject: Re: Stanford men's VB schedule?
Organization: CS Department, Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: ba
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 19:59:03 GMT

Does anyone have the start of the season top-20 rankings handy?

	--Vince
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: dwilson@Ingres.COM (It's up to me.)
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Summary: 
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Keywords: 
Organization: ASK Computer Systems, Ingres Product Division
Distribution: usa
Date: 4 Jan 93 22:05:21 GMT

In article <1993Jan4.141459.25754@wuecl.wustl.edu>, fred@wuee1.wustl.edu (Fred U. writes...
> 
> 
> 
>How little spin is required for an effective float serve?
>One revolution of the ball from server to receiver?
>One/half revolution?
>Less?
> 
>Thanks,
> 
>Fred

I'd imagine that a good float serve, like a good knuckleball, would have
zero spin.  

Dave Wilson                         Please note that this was written by
Ingres Tech Support                 Dave Wilson the person, not Dave
                                    Wilson the Ingres representative.

Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: oski@leland.Stanford.EDU (L. Ravi Narasimhan)
Subject: Re: Stanford men's VB schedule?
Organization: Department of Chemistry, Stanford University (Not)
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 93 04:36:24 GMT

In article <1904@esl.ESL.COM> Samuel Hahn <sam@esl.com> writes:
>Does anyone out there have a postable Stanford men's VB schedule?  Don't they  
>start their season about now?  Haven't seen any announcements in SJM (SOP,  
>unfortunately).  
>
>Thanks -- Samuel Hahn
>          <sam@esl.com>


Did someone say Stanford Volleyball?

>engage booster mode<

		Spamfjord Men's Volleyball Schedule

1/15-1/16	UCSB Invitational	UCSB
1/22		Berkeley		Stanford
1/23		Alumni day		Stanford
1/29		UOP			UOP
1/30		UC Santa Cruz		UC Davis
		UC Davis
2/6		Berkeley		Berkeley
2/13		USC			Stanford
2/14		Long Beach		Stanford
2/19		Northridge		Stanford
2/21		San Diego State		San Diego
2/22		UC San Diego		San Diego
2/27		BYU			BYU
3/3		UOP			Stanford
3/6		UC Santa Barbara	Stanford
3/12		UCLA			UCLA
3/13		UC Irvine		Irvine
3/22		Ohio State		Stanford
3/24		Hawaii			Stanford
3/25		Hawaii			Stanford
4/2		Loyola Marymount	Loyola
4/3		Pepperdine		Pepperdine
4/9		Long Beach		Stanford
4/10		USC			USC
4/17		San Diego State		Stanford
4/24		UC San Diego		Stanford

4/28-5/1	Mountain Pacific Sports Federation (whatever the hell
that is) tournament at UC Irvine

5/7-5/8		NCAA Championships	UCLA

Information from the Stanford Booster Newsletter for December, 1992.
They have already played and defeated USC in 2 preseason matches.  They
were in Japan for a tour in late December.

Ghod, I miss taking stats for those guys....

				--- Ravi Narasimhan
				    oski@clockwise.att.com
		
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: wung@eecom.gatech.edu (Peter Wung)
Subject: Re: Back-row blocking FAQ
Reply-To: wung@eecom.gatech.edu
Organization: School of EE, Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta, GA
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 22:20:06 GMT

In article Fqn@srgenprp.sr.hp.com, tomp@sr.hp.com (Tom Parker) writes:
>|I've been religiously following all the discussion on what's a block and
>|what isn't and who can block and who can't and I thought I understood
>|it, but now I'm confused.
>|
>|I was in a match last night and a back-row player came up and
>|participated in a (quite effective) double block.  I complained that the
>|back-row player's block was illegal.  I was then informed that USVBA
>|rules allow one back-row player to block if there is only one man (or,
>|presumably, no men) in the front row.
>|
>|Is this true?  If so, what is the exact rule?
>|

Question:  Were you playing coed?  And were you playing sixes?  In coed play,
sometimes they let guys come up to help block.  This is not an official rule.
Also, the lines between front row and back row are often blurred when you are playing 
with less than 5.


>|Thanks,
>|tom parker
>|
>|P.S.  From the FAQ:
>|
>|>30. Can a backrow player block?
>|>    No [8-14-d].



---
********************************************************************
*Peter Wung			Email:wung@ee.gatech.edu	   * 
*Electric Power Laboratory	Snail mail: 33787 Ga. Tech Station * 
*School of Electrical Engineering	    Atlanta, GA 30332      *
*Georgia Institute of Technology			    	   *
*Atlanta, Georgia						   *
*   	"Pass, Set, CRUSH!"...					   * 
*  	Well, 2 out of 3 ain't bad for a short, fat guy. 	   *
*								   *
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Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: tomoo@hpmctt.mcm.hp.com (Tomoo Taguchi)
Subject: BYU Men's Schedule
Organization: HP Cardiology Business Unit - McMinnville, OR
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 21:22:58 GMT

Could someone post the BYU Men's team schedule?  Thanks.

Tomoo
From: sag@hera.Berkeley.EDU (Steve Goldfield)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Date: 8 Jan 1993 16:13:18 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: hera.berkeley.edu

In article <seal.726454934@leonardo> seal@leonardo.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (David Seal) writes:
#>kiviat@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Brian Kiviat) writes:
#>
#>
#>>To use the baseball knuckler as an analogy, some spin is needed for
#>>the ball to travel in an erratic path. The cause of this path is the
#>>changing aerodynamic forces on the ball as it tavels across the court.
#>
#>spin stabilizes the ball, and changing aerodynamic forces will have
#>less effect.  no spin is best.

The above appears to contradict my limited knowledge of physics.
The aerodynamic forces in question should be Bernoulli's principle
that pressure has an inverse relation to velocity of fluids: in
other words, the airfoil effect that allows airplanes to fly.
It works because the path of the fluid above a wing is longer
than the path below. So the fluid has to move faster, which
creates lower pressure on top, which lifts the wing.

But a volleyball is roughly spherical, so the fluid path of
a ball that isn't spinning is the same on top as below. So,
what is the aerodynamic force on a nonspinning ball? If the
ball is spinning, there should be small drag effects that
slow the air in one direction and speed it up in the other.

Is there something wrong with the above reasoning, or is
there another aerodynamic principle involved?

Steve Goldfield        :<{  {>:           sag@hera.berkeley.edu
University of California at Berkeley     Richmond Field Station
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
From: mkrogers@unix.amherst.edu (Michael Rogers)
Subject: Re: How small rotation required for effective float serve?
Organization: Amherst College
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:50:44 GMT

Kevin Miller (kjmiller@mitre.org) wrote:
: ...  The airflow around a non-spinning, spherical
: object is inherently unstable.
: ...
: I would argue air currents play a minor role in the erratic flight of a
: float serve (see above).  I strongly suspect that a float serve in
: perfectly still air would move just as erratically as one in a gym with
: "normal" air currents.

To me "unstable" means that the system exhibits major responses to
relatively minor changes in the conditions.  Might not the air
currents cause significant changes in the airflow?

	-mike

"Mathematicians are like Frenchmen:  Whatever you say they translate
into their own language, and forthwith it means something else."
	-Goethe (or words to that effect)
From: dft00@QUTS.ccc.amdahl.com (Doug Tiedt)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball
Subject: Any volleyball gifs out there?
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:50:36 GMT
Reply-To: dft00@QUTS.ccc.amdahl.com (Doug Tiedt)
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA


Does anyone have any gifs (or other image formats) of volleyball
action suitable for backgrounds on a workstation?  Or do you know
of any ftp sites that have these?  Not just generic ftp sites, I
know of them.

Thanks,
Doug
--
=/=/=/=/=/=/=/ Doug a.k.a. dft00@quts.ccc.amdahl.com \=\=\=\=\=\=\=

What we have here... is a case of the blind leading the stupid.
                                                               -me
Newsgroups: rec.sport.volleyball