HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: nevin@titan.trl.OZ.AU (Joseph Nevin)
Subject: Re: Step/Unstep mast?
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne, Australia
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 02:30:44 GMT


We regularly have to lower the mast in order to get under some 
traffic and rail bridges.  The bridges are at the end of the 
Swan river (Perth, Western Australia), while the boat pens and 
Yacht clubs are further back up the river.  Our boat is an S&S 
34 (ie 34ft), but I know of boats up to 50ft (including a 
ketch) that have to regularly negotiate the bridges.

If the boat is set up for it the procedure is quite simple.  
The mast will need to be stepped at the deck.  What we do is to 
construct an 'A' frame from the spinnaker poles to support the 
mast.  The bottom of the A frame needs to be attached to the 
deck in line with the base of the mast.  Attach two of the Jib 
halyards to the apex of the frame at the bow.  Lead another 
line from the apex, through a block on the deck, back onto a 
connivent winch.  Release the forestay (and baby stay) and the 
rig should lay back.  Control the speed of the mast with the 
line on the winch.  To get the mast back up is the reverse, 
except that you now have to work the winch instead of feeding 
the line through.

There is more detail that I have described, but once set up, is 
quite simple.  Depending on the size of the mast it will be 
heavy, and unless you are sure what you are doing, a bent mast 
and a damaged boat is expensive to repair.  

   Joe.

nevin@titan.trl.oz.au
From: karina@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Karina Haavik)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Wind - the movie
Date: 2 Oct 92 07:26:41 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

I don't know Puccinni from a hole in the wall, but I believe it was the
death scene from Madame Butterfly.  I was more intrigued by the review
a few weeks back that said there was a gratuitous bare breast, but I think
it was a pair of them.  Quite gratutious.  Wearing a lei and junmping up and 
down, no less.  My boat looks like that all the time...   :-)

Karina
From: tarkkone@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Lauri Tarkkonen)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Cruising Boats (was Re: Book "Maiden Voyage")
Keywords: Baba 30, Folkboat
Date: 26 Sep 92 11:24:11 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In <1992Sep25.045919.24678@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu> dbyrne@ldgo.columbia.edu (deidre byrne) writes:
>rig, and the mast is stepped into the cabin top.  Folkboats 
>were designed by Marieholms of Sweden, and this one
>is hull #16 from a yard in Denmark (built 1962). 

This statement is at least inaacurate. The original Folkboat (means,
Peoples boat) was a result of a design competition of the Skandinavian 
Sailing Association in year 1941. Actualle the winning design was then 
modified by Tor Sunden, and then there was a dispute avout the copyright.
It was solved in a compromize, in Sweden the copyright is Sunden's elsewhere
it belongs to the association.  Tor Sunded designed later on a similar boat
for Marieholm to be produced in fibreglass. It was called the International
Fokkboat, or shortly IF. Then there are several similar designs made in UK 
and elsewhere. The main difference is that the original Folkboat is a clinker
built and the rest are carvel. The class rules permit today fibreglass, but
it must be 'clinker'.

This is the 50th anniversary year of the original Scandinavian Folkboat.

- Lauri Tarkkonen
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: dbyrne@ldgo.columbia.edu (deidre byrne)
Subject: Re: winterizing: hull and bilge cleanup
Keywords: deposits on hull
Organization: Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 18:11:47 GMT

>What do I use to get mineral deposits off of a glass hull?

I have heard that blue toilet-bowl cleaner works well.
Never tried it myself.

                        -- Deirdre

------------------------------------------------------------------
"There are more things in    dbyrne@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu  
Heaven and Earth, Horatio,   Deirdre Byrne
than are dreamt of           202-A Oceanography  
in your philosophy."         Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory
                             Palisades, NY 10964
Hamlet I, v, 166             (914) 359-2900 x545
From: KXN2@psuvm.psu.edu (Karl Nordstrom)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Messing About the Chesapeake
Date: 30 Sep 92 15:29:33 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Penn State University

iseman@ravel.udel.edu (Stephen Early) says:
>In article <lcgdv2INNf2g@cronkite> billc@sextant.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>>
>>I'm finally going to attend the Annapolis Boat Show next week.
>
>Does anyone have the particulars on the Boat Show like dates, times, and if
>there is an admission charge??

The (sail)boat show is on Oct 8-12th.  The (Motor)boat show is on Oct 16.
From: bennett@erich.triumf.ca (P.Bennett)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Loud Boats (Was: Re: Novice boaters)
Keywords: Sails, mufflers, wetsuits, whipped cream, fire trucks...
Date: 28 Sep 92 15:55:00 GMT
Organization: TRIUMF: Tri-University Meson Facility
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <lce7i5INN14q@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM>, dudley@treefort.Corp.Sun.COM (Dudley Gaman) writes...
>In article <25SEP199216211976@reg.triumf.ca> bennett@reg.triumf.ca (P.Bennett) writes:
>>I moor (park?) in a marina, and I consider it foolhardy to try to sail into my
>>berth - if I misjudge, I will hit another boat, or hard floats.
> 
>And what if you misjudge while under power?  The only time I've been hit while
>in my berth was by a power boat who misjudged where the stern of his boat would
>be when he was applied too much power.  The result was $600 damage to my boat.  
> 
>Dudley
>..
Yes, I can make mistakes under power too, but at least I have some "brakes"
(full power astern), and don't have to tack in very narrow channels.

When the original poster in this thread spoke of sailing into his mooring, I
assumed (because we only have marinas here) that he meant sailing into a marina
berth, which I consider to be improper if power is available (at least on my
boat - 30').  He later said he sailed to a mooring bouy - a totally different
matter, and probably quite a reasonable operation, depending on the proximity
of other moored boats.

Peter Bennett VE7CEI                | Vessels shall be deemed to be in sight
Internet: bennett@erich.triumf.ca   | of one another only when one can be
Bitnet:   bennett@triumfer          | observed visually from the other
TRIUMF, Vancouver, B.C., Canada     |                          ColRegs 3(k)
From: pavlov@niktow.canisius.edu (Greg Pavlov)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Loud Boats (Was: Re: Novice boaters)
Date: 29 Sep 92 16:41:40 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208

In article <1992Sep29.020320.7142@morrow.stanford.edu>, francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir) writes:

> 	A powerboat is much more invasive of its environment; 
> 	it generates noise and wake which are heard/felt a considerable 
> 	distance from the source, dumps smoke into the air, and sometimes 
> 	oil into the water.  A sailboat's impact on its environment is 
> 	largely the space it occupies.
> 
  Thatdepends.  Around here, anyway (eastern Lake Erie, western Lake Ontario)
  the majority of the sailboats under way at any given point in time are moving
  under engine, not sail power.  Of those, the majority are using either out-
  boards or (cough, cough) i/b diesels.  

  But all in all, I find it much easier and much more pleasant to coexist with
  sailboats.  They are mostly quieter.  Also much easier to avoid.  Super fast
  super loud powerboats in the hands of a reckless or un/semi-skilled driver
  pose a much greater threat to me and my family than a sailboat in anyone's
  hands (including abandoned and unattended).  Strictly opinion, of course...

> I have to wonder how much boating you have done. Almost all sailboats 
> are displacement boats, whereas a lot of power boats are planing boats.
> Displacement boats generate wake, planing boats do not (to speak of).
> It follows that sailboats make a lot of wake

  Yougottabekidding.  Ok, ok, a true planing hull will cause a minimal wake.
  But there aren't too many of those around on anything above a "rowboat".
  The vast majority of powerboats have either deep vee or modified deep vee
  hulls.  The may "plane", but they sure as hell generate a substantial wake.
  
  greg pavlov
  pavlov@fstrf.org
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni)
Subject: Re: Loud Boats (Was: Re: Novice boaters)
Keywords: Sails, mufflers, wetsuits, whipped cream, fire trucks...
Organization: The Department of Redundancy Department
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 18:49:32 GMT

In article <1992Sep24.160646.15969@cbfsb.cb.att.com> heon@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (garry.j.heon) writes:

>Considering that I spent $60,000 for a pair of custom
>built engines that added a mere 10mph to my top speed I would consider
>it foolish to throw away $18,000 of that investment because some people
>don't like hearing that hum off in a distance.

There are people who put more horsepower into their car stereo systems
than there is in their engines.  This doesn't automatically entitle
them to blast around wherever they want to, simply because they
already have it installed.

-- 
Jake Livni  jake@bony1.bony.com               Pat Paulsen for President
American-Occupied New York                    This year he has a real chance!
My opinions only - employer has no opinions.
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: petere@tesla.mitre.org (Peter D. Engels)
Subject: Re: deciphering time codes
Followup-To: rec.boats
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 18:01:59 GMT

In article <BvE9HI.9L6@news.orst.edu>, kaufmanj@ucs.orst.edu (John Kaufman)
wrote:
> 
>  Next month I will be doing some cruising in the Sea of Cortez. I am a novice
> at celestial navigation, and plan to practice, practice, practice during my
> time there. Obviously I need to synchronize my watch to precise GMT. Months
> ago someone on the net posted a telephone number for time, as kept by the
> Naval Observatory. I have called this number, and have gotten a series of
> tonal beeps which I cannot decipher to set my watch. Can someone explain to
> me how to decrypt these tones?
> 
> Is there another source available to obtain accurate time? Is the local time
> supplied over the telephone accurate enough for this purpose? The Naval
> sciences department on campus here can't seem to answer my questions.
> 
> Thanks!

Time from the telephone is good to about one second, which is plenty
accurate for celestial navigation.  Be sure to check your watch over a
time, so as to know its rate of drift.  All you need for a watch is a $25
Casio or Timex.  You can also get time from radio broadcasts.  The US
broadcast is station WWV, broadcast from Boulder Colorado on 5 MHz, 10 MHz,
15 MHz, 20 MHz and 25 MHz (some of these frequencies will come in better
than others, depending on time of day and location).  Also there's
CHU-Canada on 7.335 MHzmuch stronger than WWV on the East Coast.

-Pete
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: greg@netcom.com (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Sailing into a slip
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 03:48:22 GMT

In article <1992Oct6.002003.21395@hpcvca.cv.hp.com> donr@hpcvcdo.cv.hp.com (Don Reid) writes:
>enough time to become intimately familiar with them.  Also I am usually
>docking at new harbors.  I dock them a VERY slow speeds generally under
>power (at the speeds I dock they won't coast more than a boat length). 

YES! Listen to this man! The fellow who got me oriented towards big
boats said "the best idea is to come in about half as fast as you
think you should." 
 
"But what about losing steerageway, you say?" It's pretty easy to 
get a little back, as long as you don't get exuberant and shove
the throttle home, thus skewing the stern around where you don't
want it.
 
"But isn't compensating for windage harder if you're going slower?"
Well, no, not really. Too many skippers try and rush into the slip
before the wind gets ahold of them. Others try and sort of gently
arc their way into place, never committing to a direction. Nope,
doesn't work. You still have to make square turns square, just make
them earlier or later, as suits the cross-wind.
 
By the way, the half-fast advice applies to all boats, as your sense
of speed will sort of scale up and down with the boat.
 
It hasn't failed me so far.
 
Greg
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: zintel@mdd.comm.mot.com (Mike Zintel)
Subject: How common is overheating from no cooling water?
Organization: Motorola, Mobile Data Division - Seattle, WA
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 05:09:21 GMT

Last weekend my wife said "the engine's on fire". The good news is, it 
wasn't actually ON FIRE, just sort of melting down, with smoke. Apparently
I lost my cooling water feeding a 350 CID Merc after running well for about 
an hour. How common is this? Does fresh-water cooling help? How about an 
alarm? How much damage is usual?

Sad similar stories might cheer me up in a sad way. :-)




-- 
---
Mike Zintel             zintel@mdd.comm.mot.com not zintel@mdi.com anymore
Motorola Mobile Data
Bothell, WA
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: greg@netcom.com (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Catalina 30 (WAS: Request for advice ... Cruising sailboats)
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 03:12:46 GMT

In article <ld0mjgINNrqn@cronkite> billc@sextant.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>In article 4839@netcom.com, greg@netcom.com (Greg Bullough) writes:
>>The 30 trades off seaworthiness in its hull form for space below.
>>In order to achieve that cavernous main saloon, with its dinette
>>that makes into an orgy-bed, the boat has been given a terminal
>>case of nautical thunder-thighs.
>> 
>>It sails well, if kept flat, in spite of this. To the credit of
>>the designers.
>
>Will you amplify your statement on seaworthiness?  Do you
>mean that the C30 is too beamy to be seaworthy?  By this do
>you mean that if capsized it will remain inverted longer
>than an otherwise similar but narrower boat?

I didn't have this in mind at all. However, it's probably the 
case (I wouldn't want to experience a knock-down in a Catalina
30, not because of not getting back up, but because I'd be 
afraid of breaking something, like a port, a chainplate, or
the hull-deck joint. A knock-down can be a very violent 
affair.)

The Catalina 30 is a lot more likely to get tripped up and
knocked down, or to fall off a wave, than a skinnier boat.
And a broach is apt to end nastily, as well. It's also
more likely to have its underwater surfaces fail to "bite"
with a resulting loss of control. Those bulbuous hips will
drag in the water, at a high angle of heel, and the boat
will pivot around them. Depending on the conditions, this
can lead to a number of things, all of them bad. Also,
the keel will pop out of the water, much more readily
than a skinny boat, or one with wineglass sections, or
both, and those "hips" will be the fulcrum of the pivot.
 
Greg
From: paulh@tekcae.cax.tek.com (Paul Hammer)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: wooden boat finishes (a big can of worms)
Date: 2 Oct 92 17:01:59 GMT
Article-I.D.: tekcae.1136
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

>> I have a 16' foot cedar boat which was fibreglassed by the previous owner.

>> What is the best hull treatment?  In terms of bottom paint, I'm looking at the

>Fibreglass that has been applied with epoxy resin is Extremely hard to
>remove.  Heat is about the only thing that works, but you have to be very

Given the vintage it is far more likely to be polyester resin.  This
does not stick nearly as well as epoxy.  Removal is still the same, though.

>careful.  A hot-air heat gun is best; heat from the fibreglass side, while
>pulling gently on the glass.  It won't be easy; possibly, you could remove
>all the 'glass that's loose, smooth off the rest, and paint the whole
...
>As to paint, use any good-quality oil-based paint.  Don't bother with
>epoxy; you'll just have to paint over it anyway, as epoxy deteriorates in
>sunlight, if not covered by paint.
>Paint, by itself, won't protect against rot.  Just keep the hull dry and
>covered, but well ventilated, when its not in use; it'll outlast you by
>many years.
>
The reason that epoxy was suggested was most likely protection against
rot.  While paint does not protect well against rot, as already mentioned
above, epoxy does protect well.  But the coating has to be thorough.
Cracks and holes will allow moisture to sneak in and stay.  This can be worse
than not having the coating at all.  One of the reasons 'glass is used
when covering a hull with epoxy is to strenghten the epoxy layer to
avoid cracks.

The paint will stick better to the epoxy than it will to the wood, no matter
what else you might do to the wood.

My own ideosyncratic choice?  I agree to forget about the epoxy.  Its too
expensive, and to do it "well" requires putting back a layer of fibreglass.

Once the hull is stripped, oil it.  Oil it again and again.  (E.g. Deks Olje
is the only brand name that comes to mind.  Most any Teak Oil ought to work.)
The oiling will go along way to avoid rot.  If the wood is in good enough
condition cosmetically I might choose no other finish.  If not good enough,
then paint over the oil.  It will stick just fine.  Note that this applies
only to a trailer-kept boat.  If unpainted, the oil will wash out
too fast in a wet-kept boat.

>-Pete

-rickf
From: donr@hpcvcdo.cv.hp.com (Don Reid)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Sailing into a slip
Date: 6 Oct 92 00:20:03 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Company, Corvallis, Oregon USA

: At least this is my experience.  I'd be interested in hearing about
: how *you* handle docking.

I have a Day Sailer (17' 600LB) which I sail into a dock all the time.

I only sail bigger boats as charters every few years, so I don't have
enough time to become intimately familiar with them.  Also I am usually
docking at new harbors.  I dock them a VERY slow speeds generally under
power (at the speeds I dock they won't coast more than a boat length).  I
do anchor and pick up buoys under sail though.
From: roy@mchip00.med.nyu.edu (Roy Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Lights for Kayaks
Date: 27 Sep 92 02:23:01 GMT
Organization: New York University, School of Medicine


	Recently, I had an email conversation with somebody about the proper
lights for a rowboat/kayak/canoe/etc to show.  I promised I would look it up
in COLREGS when I got a chance, but now I can't find the address to mail the
answer back to, so on the assumption that it's of moderately general
interest:

	COLREGS 25(d)(ii) says: A vessel under oars may exhibit the lights
prescribed in this Rule for sailing vessels [i.e. red and green in front,
white behind], but if she does not, she shall have ready at hand an electric
torch or lighted lantern showing a white light which shall be exhibited in
sufficient time to prevent collision.
From: bsmith@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Brian Smith)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 19:23:14 GMT
Subject: Re: Loud Boats (Was: Re: Novice boaters)
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Loveland, CO
Newsgroups: rec.boats

In rec.boats, mike@gilligan.East.Sun.COM (Mike Roncadori) writes:


    spirit of sharing the waters). I kind of wonder if kayakers,
    and swimmers ever complain about sailboaters.

Don't know about swimmers and kayakers, but I know that fishermen do.
Out here in Colorado they almost all troll and have a line
extending many yards behind them.  The lines often get caught up on
keels, centerboards and rudders.  Some years back, as an official of
SAIL (Sailing Association of Intermountain Lakes) I had a lot of
dealings with the Colorado State authorities to try to solve that one.
Mostly it was a matter of educating people and asking them to be more
considerate.

A couple of weeks ago, while I was anchored overnight at Glendo in
Wyoming, a fisherman caught his hook in my anchor line and lost his
gear.  It was early in the morning, daylight and dead calm.
Apparently, it was my fault.

B.S! 
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: jfh@cs.brown.edu (John F. Hughes)
Subject: Re: Step/Unstep mast?
Organization: Brown University Department of Computer Science
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 14:36:54 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.160108.29437@eua.ericsson.se> mike@erix.ericsson.se (Mike Williams) writes:
>In article <1992Oct2.151520.9949@spss.com>, bartley@spss.com (Dennis Bartley) writes:
>|> Ready? Secure the main halyard, and tigten up the line going to the
>|> winch. Unpin the shrouds and backstay. Begin lowering the mast by
>|> easing the line on the winch. Initially the guys up forward won't have
>|> much to support, but as the mast gets past 45 degrees, the halyard
>|> will become less effective, and the people forward will be supporting
>|> it completely. 
>
>NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!
>
>Unless you have a very light/short mast don't try this sort of thing
>if you value your head, legs, arms......
>
>I have seen a person break his shoulder bones in an accident when a
>proper crane was used. With a 30ft mast you are begging for trouble
>and possible severe injury if things go wrong. 

I don't agree. I've stepped and unstepped my Tornado mast (about 26 feet?)
alone a number of times. It's a fairly light mast, but not ultralight. 
It is, however, designed with a pivot at the base. Figure out a good, secure,
solid method to pivot at the base before you try this stunt. I once dropped the
Tornado mast without remembering to put in the pin for the pivot, and the
results were unpleasantly surprising (but fortunately not expensive).
   The V-brace method that was suggested by someone earlier has worked
extremely well for a great many people. The wider the base of the V (once
again, the bottom points of the V should be *well* secured) the more stable
things are. But there are plently of folks who have used a long ladder instead
of a pair of poles, so clearly width of base is not essential.
   Here's why just using the halyard is a bad idea: the angle between the
halyard and the mast gets small as the mast is lowered, and its cosecant,
by which the force of gravity is multiplied to compute the tension in the wire,
gets *very* large. Putting in the hoisting frame essentially guarantees that 
no angle ever gets too small, so you have plenty of purchase. 
   Hints: watch out for crosswinds, or have very reliable people on a pair of
guy lines that run out to the sides, keeping everything centered. Otherwise the
mast may try to slip to one side or the other, and will overpower you, possible
ripping out the deck fitting as it does so...

   Overall hint: draw lots of pictures before you try it, and think about the
forces involved and the directions in which they will act.

-John
Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: billp@voyager.chm.clarkson.edu (Bill Plunkett)
Subject: Re: It's Fall. You know what that means...
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 20:32:52 GMT

Fall?  I must've missed it.  It was actually snowing here today :(
And I was looking forward to some nice autumn sailing.  It's supposed
to be a good year for fall colors here in the Adirondacks.  Let's hope
for a decent indian summmer.

-billp

Newsgroups: rec.boats
From: harsant@headplant.trl.OZ.AU (Dave Harsant)
Subject: Re: Sailing into a slip
Organization: Telecom Research Labs,Melbourne, Australia
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 01:48:36 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.194115.25861@klaava.Helsinki.FI> tarkkone@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Lauri Tarkkonen) writes:
>When I still had a boat without engine, I felt that the find coming from the
>side is the most difficult. If you have to dock without the engine and the

Yes, a strong sidewind can push you sideways while trying to manoevre.
Winds can also get quite tricky where the breeze comes over a breakwater.

>wind is corming more or less straight from your back, you can slow your boat 
>by making a tight 360 degrees turn just before you enter your place. The

Yes, we usually do this if the wind is behind.

--
Dave Harsant,
Telecom Australia Research Laboratories  |  d.harsant@trl.oz.au
Newsgroups: rec.boats