HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tony@nexus.yorku.ca (Anthony Wallis)
Subject: Honey is just dirty sugar (was: Is honey healthy ? ..)
Organization: York University
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 14:42:05 GMT

Abhay Bulsari (abulsari@abo.fi) relays:
> I received this from: Michael Traub <traub@btcs.bt.co.uk>
> Reproduced from "The Vegan", Autumn 1992
> .. Honey  is  produced  when nectar is mixed with the digestive
> secretions  of  the  bee, and the resulting mixture is disgorged (to
> be  fed  half-digested  to  other  bees).  Its  sole purpose is not to
> satisfy  humans'  sweet  tooth  but  to  provide  the  energy
> necessary to sustain  a  bee  in  flight ..

(I am a chemically-educated beekeeper who has published a little on the
 energy-economics of the honeybee colonies.)

The above statment from The Vegan is about 3/4 but essentially correct.
Honey is the above, but concentrated to supersaturation for storage and
to prevent fermentation.  The bees also add some preservatives, including
peroxides.

I sell honey but I also tell people that I consider honey to be
basically "dirty" sugar (actually a "dirty" supersaturated solution of
sugars to be more chemically correct.)  Its value to the bees is purely
carbohydrate energy.  The colour and flavour of honey is accidental.
Bees will accept solutions of sucrose, frutose, etc. as a substitute
and there is some evidence that they "prefer" it in a beekeeping
context.

> honey  can  be  contaminated .. [ infant botulism scare ]

* Never feed honey to infants *, anyway.  They can't handle the
relatively benign microbiotics in it, such as yeasts.

> .. royal jelly .. [no] evidence that it has any medicinal benefits.

Yup.

There are _six_ products from beekeeping.

[1] Beeswax. 
	  Once the main economic hive product.  Before petroleum-based
    wax products the major source of wax.  Still required for some
    church candles. (Allegedly because it is produced by "virgin"
    (sterile female worker) bees !)  It is "nicer" to work with than
    parafin wax.

[2] Honey.
	  Before sugar, _the_ sweetener.  Magical thinking about
    benefits of its non-sugar contents is widespread.  Has been used as
    an emergency wound dressing because of its desiccant action.
    Supersaturated sucrose solution would do the same if you had it at
    hand.

[3] Bee sting venom.
          Magical thinking about its effect on arthritis, etc.
    Will do something to the immune system for sure .. and
    thumping a TV will sometimes "fix" it for a while.
    
[4] Propolis.
          A fairly decent varnish.  Used by Stradivarius.
      
[5] Royal Jelly.
          Magical thinking ..

[6] Bee larvae.
          Excellent non-vegetarian food.  Absolutely loaded with
    all sorts of animal-source goodies.  Excellent fish bait.
    (I'm serious, even if it's not appropriate for this group.)

--
tony@nexus.yorku.ca = Tony Wallis, York University, Toronto, Canada
From: loc@yrloc.ipsa.reuter.COM (Leigh Clayton)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Vitamin supplements
Date: 2 Oct 92 12:13:15 GMT
Organization: Reuters APL Software Division
X-Telephone:  +1 (416) 364-5361 Fax +1 (416) 364-2910 Telex 0622259
X-Mail:       1900/2 First Canadian Place, Toronto, Canada, M5X 1E3


 In response to <1992Sep30.151453.9454@informix.com> (Paul Roberts):

 FYI there are reported ill effects for even the vitamins you mention. Too much
(unbuffered) vitamin C can predispose to gastric ulcers (a problem I've had
myself, although I can't definitely blame the rather high doses of C I was
taking at the time, since I was doing some other unhealthy things at the same
time). Vitamin E in very large doses is reported to lead to general feelings of
unwellness, bad enough even if nothing more serious turns up (remember that use
of these substances in large doses by humans has not been common for more than
a very few years).

 Personally, I take carefully considered vitamin supplements (about 1G of C,
400 iu E, plus Beta Carotene and a B spectrum), but I'm no longer a vocal
advocate of doing this, simply because the issues are rather more complex than
I used to realise and I think a person should balance the risks against the
gains, and make a personal, informed decision.

 You mention 'at least one Nobel Prize winner'; this is just appeal to
authority, a suspect argument at best. I personally respect Pauling's reasoning
wrt the 'proper' vitamin C dosage, but it is fundamentally based on the same
logical principle that recommends mandrake root for sexual problems:
suggestiveness. Pauling's arguments are quantified, and backed by lots of
'scientific' data, but the bottom line is that he's arguing from rats and dogs
to people, and that's a leap rather than a proof any way you look at it. He
*could* be wrong.

                        -    -    -    -    -

 By the way, I agree with someone's (your?) point that Abhay is not really
doing a service by reposting all this stuff. I have frequently found myself
disagreeing with the people he idolises (esp M. Traub), but will defend their
right to waste bandwidth like everyone else. I find it a little harder to
defend the waste involved in all these re-posts; that is *not* communication by
my lights (since the author is conducting a monologue that we are simply forced
to witness). Let Mr Traub (and whoever else originates all these posts) speak
for himself if he chooses, or respect his choice to be silent.

../Leigh

--------------------------------------------------------
It's only work if somebody makes you do it    .../Calvin
--------------------------------------------------------
Leigh Clayton                  loc@yrloc.ipsa.reuter.COM
    -or-                     loc@ipsaint.ipsa.reuter.COM
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: tara@socrates.umd.edu (Tara McDermott)
Subject: Re: Vitamin B12 and vegetarians
Organization: University of Maryland University College
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 15:13:13 GMT

levesque@IRO.UMontreal.CA (Lucie Levesque) writes:


>Why on the labels of Spirulina and other algae like
>super blue green they claim it contains B12 and
>I learn that there is none ?  Please someone give
>me an answer to that one.

Because it does have B12.  The problem is that is a B12 analog (which
might not be the right word, oh well).  It is not the active form of
B12 that your body can use.  That's the answer as best I can explain.
Unpasturized miso (which when used is not boiled) has B12, as does
nutritional yeast, and bean dosas (the bean puree is allowed to
ferment for several hours before cooking, and this creates B12, as an
Indian cook I know says - don't know if I should believe her or not).

Tara
-- 
Tara McDermott                     You've got a friend in Pennsylvania,
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us (Valerie Mates)
Subject: Results: Vegetarian Restaurants in Philadelphia
Organization: GREX Public Access Unix +1 313 761 3000
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1992 02:46:22 GMT

A few weeks ago, i asked about vegetarian restaurants in the Philadelphia
area, with emphasis on restaurants where a customer could find meat and I
could find good vegetarian food.  Here's a summary of the results:

-----------
From: alux2.att.com!yp
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 10:58 EDT
To: popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us

Hi,

In Philly, try the Indian restaurant called New Delhi (I think
that it is located  at Walnut & 42nd (!!)). They have buffet
lunchs and Dinners which comprise of a good number of
vegetarian and Non-vegetarian dishes. The food is very good.
There are couple more indian restaurants and a Thai restaurant
around the corner.

Good luck,

Yash Punati

PS: 1. Call New Delhi and confirm the location.
    2. If you don't like spicey  food, then stay away from these places.

----------
From: Elizabeth Bratt <Csli.Stanford.EDU!owen>
To: popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us
Subject: rec.food.veg

  When I was in Philadelphia last year, I had
dinner and lunch at a really great Korean restaurant.  It has
plenty of beef and shrimp and chicken and octopus and cuttle
fish and eel, but it also has vegetarian foods, namely:

Bak Ban:  Over six kinds of vegetable with rice and soup $6.50
Yahng Nyum Tofu:  Bean curd with house special sauce      5.95
Kim Chi Yayng Nyum Tofu:  Bean curd and kimchee with
			  house special sauce		  6.95
Ya-Chae Twikim:  Vegetables deep fried in corn oil:	  5.95

Those are what's listed under "Vegetarian Special", so I assume
the sauces will be fine, too.

I really liked the food there (I had beef among other side dishes)
and there were little Korean kids who were playing and talking
with the staff, so it's definitely authentic.

The name of the restaurant is Korea House, and it's on
117 S. 18th Street, between Sansom St. and Chestnut St.
It's open Mon-Sat 10am-10pm, and Sun 4pm-10pm.  There
are no vegetarian "Luncheon Specialties", though.

They gave tons of food for small amounts of money, and I liked
it a lot.

Liz
----------

So, this past week I finally went to Philly.  Naturally, my difficult
customer being the kind of person she is, we didn't go to any of the
restaurants on the list.  However we did discover a nice falafel place
near South Street.  The Customer From Hell even enjoyed the food there.
I was surprised!
-valerie
-- 
----------
Valerie Mates
popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us
From: chandy@marais.inria.fr (Chandra SHEKHAR)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Why does everyone talk only about weight loss?
Date: 28 Sep 92 14:32:30 GMT
Organization: INRIA, Sophia-Antipolis (Fr)

Aren't there any vegans out there who are trying 
desperately to *gain* weight ... or am I the only
weirdo around? It pisses me off that 99.99% of all
veg. discussions deal with the issue of losing weight!
You open any book on vegetarianism, and the first
thing they talk about is how veg(itari)anism helps
to reduce weight.

I want to remain a vegan, but I also want to be
well-built and muscular like my meat-eating friends.
Any simple suggestions? (Avoid standard responses
like "eat more protein", "do weights", etc. I have
tried them all.)

Chandy
From: kbroman@tinman.Berkeley.EDU (Karl W. Broman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Unhydrogenated vegan margarine?
Date: 30 Sep 92 05:16:08 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, U. C. Berkeley

In article <346@mindlink.bc.ca> Greg_Dawson@mindlink.bc.ca (Greg Dawson) writes:
>Can anyone recommend a good *unhydrogenated* vegan margarine, available in
>either Canada or the U.S.?
>
>My final non-vegan foodstuff is now the margarine I use (Becel), which is
>unhydrogenated but unfortunately not vegan.
>
>Thanks!
>
>Shari Dawson

Margarine is hydrogenated so that the molecules stick together better,
thus making the substance a solid at room temperature.  It is my
understanding that vegetable fats are generally made of molecules
full of double and triple bonds, making the molecules twisted clumpy 
things which don't like to connect with each other.  Hence vegetable
fats are (usually/always?) OILS -- liquid at room temperature.  

I think hydrogenation is NECESSARY is order to duplicate a butter-like
substance from solely vegetable fat.

I am just a humble, first-year statistics grad student, and so I'm 
probably wrong.  

karl broman
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: georgec@eng.umd.edu (George B. Clark)
Subject: Re: Detoxification
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 16:35:55 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland

In article <1992Sep29.063829.13844@abo.fi> abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT) writes:
>
>Every  other  popular  health  book  these  days  seems to contain the word
>"detoxification".  We  are  urged  to  change  our  diet, fast or purge our
>systems to facilitate internal "cleansing".

"Detoxification" is a pseudo-scientific buzzword that really says nothing
until you identify a specific toxin. 

>In  fact,  recent  scientific  research  suggests that many old ideas about
>the  relationship  between nutrition, the digestive system and disease, may
>be at least partly true.
>
>The  research  centres  on  the  role  of the bowel flora - the "bugs" that
>live  in  the  large  bowel  or  colon  in  all  of us. In a healthy bowel,

This isn't recent research. The theory had its roots in France at the
turn of the century, and there has never been any data to verify it.
In hindsight, the theory was founded on a misunderstanding of how the
colon works. This was forgivable 100 years ago, but in 1992.

>At   Cambridge,   a   relationship   has   been  established  between  food
>intolerance  and  the bowel flora - particularly in patients with irritable
>bowel syndrome.

Too little dietary fiber, not food intolerance, to be more accurate.

>Practitioners  of  natural  medicine, including some today who use "fringe"
>methods  such  as  colonic  irrigation  and enemas to wash out the bowel as
>part  of  the  treatment  of  any  chronic illness, believe that imbalances
>occur  because  the bowel quite simply becomes "clogged up" with mucous and
>old  faecal  debris  and  is  unable to elminate efficiently. As one famous
>naturopath put it: "death begins in the colon".

Their procedures are dangerous, sometimes fatal, and in many states the 
procedures are even illegal.
From: babineau@bnr.ca (Michael Babineau)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Veg Restaurants in Melbourne Australia ?
Date: 2 Oct 92 18:57:22 GMT
Reply-To: babineau@bmerh812.BNR.CA
Organization: BNR Ottawa, DMS Software Design

Can anyone give me recommendations on restaurants in Melbourne, Australia?

-- 
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|Michael Babineau           | BITNET: babineau@BNR.CA                    |
|Bell Northern Research Ltd.| UUCP  : ..!uunet!bnrgate!bmerh812!babineau |
|Ottawa, ON. CANADA         |         ..!psuvax!BNR.CA.bitnet!babineau   |
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 22:24:26 -0400 
From: Jyothi Rengarajan <jr55+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: RECIPE: Indian Green pulao


This is an easy way to make rice more exciting. Typically, Basmati rice
would be the best, the aroma is unbeatable, but use whatever white rice
is available.

I cup Basmati rice
1 medium onion, chopped
12oz package frozen peas
4 cloves
1 small stick cinnamon
1 clove garlic(minced): optional
2 to 3 bay leaves
2 tbsp oil (more if you like)



Heat oil in a deep pan and fry onions till slightly brown. Add cloves,
cinnamon, bay leaves and garlic and stir. Add rice and stir for 2 to 3
mins. The rice should be coated with the oil. Add 2 cups water and allow
thw pot to come to a boil. Add peas.Stir, lower heat and simmer covered
until the rice is cooked. Let it stand uncovered until extra water
evaporates.
From: gbelli@opal.tufts.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Kosher gelatin
Date: 6 Oct 92 14:02:22 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA

In article <1992Oct3.004700.5293@eskimo.celestial.com>, chips@eskimo.celestial.com (cav) writes:
> In article <1992Sep30.220046.15034@ucselx.sdsu.edu> maxc0452@ucselx.sdsu.edu (Legene) writes:
> }
> }  Hi!  I'm a lacto-ovo vegearian.  I was eating some yogurt (that's my
> }effort toward political correcness for the year) and noticed that it
> }had "kosher gelatin" as one f the ingredients.  Did a horse die just so I could
> }eat yogurt?  I really don't like it *that* much!
> }
> }
> 
> Horses are not kosher so it didn't come from one. "Kosher gelatin" that is
> used in yogurt is almost most certainly from NON-animal source. While some
> rabbi's do allow the use of animal bones for gelatin, very few if any would 
> allow such gelatin in yougurt.
Hello?  Non-animal gelatin?  Explain please.
GB
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: "Murphy Brown" is a vegetarian
Date: 28 Sep 92 17:54:24 GMT
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)

gedge@cm.cf.ac.uk (Geraint A Edwards) writes:
>
>Gedge "is anyone compiling that list?"

     If you mean a list of famous vegetarians, I'm working one it. HOWEVER,
because of the number of inaccurate lists floating around, I'm looking
for evidence of vegetarianism. At the very least, a quote that says 
"I don't eat meat," or something to that effect. 

     I'll have a short preliminary version up in a few days.

===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@cs.umd.edu  |  "Born to die"   |   Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
          This is a .signature antibody. Vaccinate your .sig!
     "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
      persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.  Therefore all
      progress depends on the unreasonable man."
      -- George Bernard Shaw
From: RCJ@ula.cam.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Vegetarian issues come up in the oddest places...
Date: 6 Oct 92 08:33:00 GMT

Article #2859 (2867 is last):
Newsgroups: alt.sex.wizards,alt.sex
From: birmingh@fnalo.fnal.gov (Phillip J. Birmingham)
Subject: Re: Semen!
Date: Thu Oct  1 00:28:45 1992

In article <009615CE.042E7C40@Msu.oscs.montana.edu>,
 gwh0621@Msu.oscs.montana.edu writes:
> In article <carrier.717820766@iros1>, carrier@IRO.UMontreal.CA (SilverCloak)
 writes:
>>This is probably a FAQ.. but there wasn't much info in the FAQ's..
>>butmy SO has been complaining recently about the flavour of my semen...
>>It is  supposed to  be very bitter and unpleasant.. Is there anything I can do
 to affect
this?? I would very much like to make it a more pleasant experience..
>>Thanx for any help!
>>E-mail is fine.. i will post results :)
>>SilverCloak: k
> ::Tried E-Mail, sorry, server here is on the blink.....
>    Abstain from meat of any kind for 7 days,  go light on dairy products,
> and eat lots of leafy grean veggies....forbidden are spices and
> onions/garlic...also, abstain from liquor

         Jeez, I think I'd rather abstain from blowjobs!

    ...drink plenty of water and fruit
> juices...AND exercise regularly each day.

         Good advice for any reason.

--
 Phillip J. Birmingham   birmingh@fnal.fnal.gov
 I don't speak for Fermilab, although my mouth is probably big enough...


CBS%EARN-RELAY::edu.berkeley.ucbvax::rec-food-veg
From: Center for Conservation Biology <conbio@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Date: 25 Sep 92 09:55 PDT
Subject: Re: "Murphy Brown" is a vegetarian
Nf-ID: #R:1992Sep23.135555.10105@uoft02.ut:-2039225982:cdp:1451200009:000:450
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!conbio    Sep 25 09:55:00 1992



Another to add to the list...the SF Chonicle had a short article
this morning abo punk (?) rocker Ozzy Osbourne, infamous for
--during a concert--biting the head off of a *bat* thrown on
stage by a fan.  (Ozzy claims he thought it was rubber, not real)
--along with his new fatherhood, Ozzy is now vegetarian.

Goes to show ANYone can change his lifestyle with a bit of effort!

---Kathy Switky      conbio@igc.org  *or* krswit@leland.stanford.edu
From: debra@creatures.cs.vt.edu (Debra Potts)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: A free opportunity to spout opinions!!
Date: 30 Sep 92 16:12:05 GMT
Followup-To: "How-to" questions from an aspiring veggie

Here are a few hints that you might find helpful:

1.  Get a RICE COOKER!  This is a wonderful and (in my kitchen) com-
    pletely indispensible gadget.  You can get them at any dept. store
    that sells cookware or--even cheaper--at those catalog showroom
    type stores like Best, Brendles, Service Merchandise, etc.  The
    great thing about a rice cooker is that it's always perfect and it
    is out of the way; you just measure the rice, put it in, turn it
    on, and cook away at the rest of your meal.  When you hear the little
    button go "pop" your rice is done, and (in the case of my cooker)
    will stay hot, fresh, and fluffy for up to five hours.

2.  If you haven't already gone veggie, and you don't absolutely despise
    the taste of flesh so much that you are ready to give it up immediately
    and forever, I'd recommend that you take it slow.  Old eating habits
    are hard to change.  Yes, you can be a "junk food veggie" if you don't
    care about your health, but if you want to eat healthy and meat-free,
    you may as well get adjusted to the fact that most of the time you
    will be spending a little more time in the kitchen than you used to
    (unless you were already "into" cooking).  This to me is a BIG plus,
    as the emotional high I get from creating beautiful and tasty and
    life-prolonging meals is enormously rewarding!  In fact, I can hardly
    be in my kitchen cooking with someone else in the room without every-
    body wanting to get in on the act!

    But for some folks this is a little frustrating at first.  I mean,
    what happens when you forget to soak the beans overnight for your big
    meal and you had to work late?  Of course, there are plenty of whole
    foods short order items, but getting into a groove takes time.  There
    are several step-by-step veggie cookbooks out there, and there is
    a good--if somewhat inappropriately titled--paperback cookbook by
    Jean Hewitt called "Jean Hewitt's International Meatless Cookbook"
    which contains lots of veggie dishes, but also recipes for poultry and
    fish.  This book is tattered and dog-eared now, but it was very useful
    to my in my "just want to cut down on red meat" phase, and my "just want
    to avoid red meat and poultry days," and finally to my "well, there are
    also plenty of good vegetable recipes and i can ignore the fish and chicken
    ones" days.

    There are lots of other good hints, but I'm sure many concerned and 
    helpful folks will be posting here in the next few weeks to get you 
    started on the right track, so I'll just leave it there.            

    Good luck and bon apetit!

           Debbie
From: kuan@taquito.engr.ucdavis.edu (Frank Kuan)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: cheap veggie eatin'
Date: 2 Oct 92 03:27:33 GMT
Organization: College of Engineering - University of California - Davis


Distribution: 
Organization: College of Engineering - University of California - Davis
Keywords: 

In article <1992Sep30.172232.29245@eng.umd.edu> georgec@eng.umd.edu (George B. Clark) writes:
>In article <92272.174441JRUNNE@auvm.american.edu> <JRUNNE@auvm.american.edu> writes:
>>
>>1) Anyone else out there who's set up a vegetarian lifestyle in a conservative
>>(ie read:  hard to find basics) town?
>

For starving students, I have a tip. I was shopping at the PRice
Club today, and I stumbled onto a gold mine. In the frozen food section,
they have Amy's Organic Kitchen stuff like veggie pot pies, bean/rice/
cheese burritos, veggie lasagna, all made with organic ingredients.
The frozen burritos come in 8 packs, and they sell for about 8 dollars.
That is a DEAL. I think a two pack of veggie pot pie is like 3.45$. 
The bean/rice burritos are vegan, and are delicious. 1 dollar per burrito
of this quality is awesome, considering it only takes 2 minutes to 
microwave it. Instant protein, and yummy too.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg