HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tse@loonybin.apple.com (Gary Tse)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Date: 1 Sep 92 06:09:27 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: Raoul Duke School of Pharmacology and Journalism

In article <1992Aug31.133623.3835@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>>There's a good chance of that happening in the United States in a few
>>decades, as Asian-Americans start controlling a disproportionately
>>large share of the economy and as the United States starts going on
>>the economic skids.  What I'm saying is that the way of keeping the
>
>  Fear not.  I doubt that Asian-Americans will control a large share
>  of the economy of this country.  Besides if they do, and if JJ's
>  experiences can be generalized, then the petty elite will be playing
>  golf in country clubs with the AAs and asking for campaign contributions.

In fact, this happened in San Francisco.  A number of wealthy Hong Kong
expatriots, through investments and campaign contributions, wielded 
significant political power during the term of the former mayor Art Agnos.
An "uncle" of mine, in better times, was a major real estate developer
in a local city (Fremont, for the benefit of the BA readers) and used to 
have weekly private lunches with the mayor of that city.

In these cases, money is what counts.  The color of one's skin and the
shape of one's eyes probably mean nothing. 

-- 
Gary Tse, tse@Apple.COM		"The fascination of what's difficult",
(408) 862-5452			    The wish to do what one's not done before,
				Is the proper card to show at Heaven's door.
From: kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go)
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, Rice University
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 19:04:54 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.220816.9234@island.COM> fester@island.COM (Mike Fester) writes:
>Uh, I am white. I've had black, Asian, and female bosses in both academic and
>technical areas. None of them carried whips (neither did any of my white
>bosses)

How do you know they don't carry whips?  Do you go into their bedrooms?  :-)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu)
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Distribution: soc
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 14:22:28 GMT

In article <78685@ut-emx.uucp> joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang) writes:
>In article <1992Aug29.011749.28005@news.acns.nwu.edu> dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson) writes:
>>To assimilate is WRONG. To assimilate means that you will TRY to become 
>>one of them but this is something you will NEVER achieve. 
>
>But I'm not advocating assimilation.  What I've basically done is to
>hand people that I know an ultimatum saying "I'm Chinese, if that
>bothers that's your problem."

  When are you going to become Asian American?  As long as you're
  Chinese, they'll tell you to go back to China.  If you don't
  like it here, go back to China.  
>
>>To want to become "white" isn't the way to go.
>
>I think that the whole point of my posting is to point out that
>"become white" isn't a precondition from "joining them."  Most people
>I know in the establishment, frankly don't care what color you are.
>(It may be because I stay in academic circles a lot.  After all,
>"white Americans" are a minority among graduate students in the
>department here.)

  You do stay in one small circle too much.  I said you were
  clueless because you're drawing your conclusions from your limited
  experiences only.  

  Besides, we're not just fighting for Asian Americans who are professional.
  We're talking about all Asian Americans and/or all Americans whatever
  their class.  I'm glad that JJ brought up the class issue, because too
  many of you think that as long as Asian professionals are accepted
  everything is peachy-keen.  Sell-out philosophy:  I've got mine,
  who cares if you get yours.
>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,soc.motss
Subject: Re: Foreign-born Gay Asians
Date: 25 Aug 1992 13:48:54 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <MDAY.92Aug25000407@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu> 
mday@jukebox.lcs.mit.edu (Mark Day) writes:
>
> > adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
> > [About Arthur Hu's continued fascination with gay Asians]
>
> >It seems like you've asked for information on this (very tired) subject
> >every two weeks for the last year.  Why don't you just give it a rest, Hu?
>
> Now, be nice.  It's become increasingly clear to me that Arthur's
> slowly coming out to himself. 

You think so, too?

> It's tough for him, because a lot of his identity is probably built up
> to avoid this part of himself.  Worse, he's got a hyper-quantitative
> MIT education that doesn't give him many tools for a situation like
> this.  His concept of himself is coming unglued and all he can do is
> keep finding data that he hopes will help him understand what's
> happening.

Oh, I'm sure that has a lot to do with it, but there's an even
simpler reason why Hu would remain in the closet.  It's all those
drag queens forcing him to listen to listen to Ethel Merman
records.  It's all those butch hairy people in totally revealing
leather trying to force him into a harness.

Hey, Hu!  Are you free this weekend for a poker game over
at Sargon's bachelor pad?

Arne

Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak)
Subject: Somebody, please create soc.culture.white.american.  Quick!!
Reply-To: jpak@manute.sps.mot.com (Kinder and Gentler Jim)
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 21:38:46 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.165049.7810@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>  No one is asking you to deny yourself.  Just walking
>  a mile in someone else's shoes, before denying what
>  they experienced as a child.  We all know what happened
>  to you as a child and we know that white people can be
>  just as oppressive to each other as they are to minorities.
>  We accept that and thank you for providing such illuminating
>  experiences.  Unfortunately this group is soc.culture.asian.america
>  and most of us want to get back to discussing issues that
>  we faced growing up without having to provide tit-for-tat
>  an identical incident that happened to some poor white
>  kid from the wrong side of the track.

There's only one solution to this.  Somebody has got to create soc.culture.
white.american, or soc.culture.european.american, or soc.culture.white.people,
or soc.culture.melanin.challenged, and QUICK!!

I've heard the arguments in the past in other newsgroups for and against it.
Why doesn't somebody start a formal RFD on it?

If created, it would benefit everybody by:

1. Giving white people a genuine forum for talking about the discrimination
   they've suffered, either in America or overseas.
2. Giving them a forum for talking about life as a white person, the way we
   talk about life as an AA here.
3. Taking the focus off them here and in other soc.culture groups and into
   a group where *they* deserve to be the focus.
4. Leaving scaa as a forum to talk about the *ASIAN AMERICAN* experience, not
   the White American "I got it as bad as you do" experience.  Let them talk
   about it THERE.

So, how about it people?  What's wrong with this picture?  Nothing I can see.

And don't tell me whites don't deserve their own newsgroup, 'cause they do.
Right now, whites on USENET are like Palestinians in the Middle East.

And don't tell me scwa will turn into a forum for white supremicists.  You
don't know that will happen, and besides, those kind of people show up all
over the place, anyway.  Even here.

And if that newsgroup gets created, I swear on a stack of Bibles I won't
ever walk in there and pretend to be an "expert" on the White experience,
the way certain posters here claim to be experts on the AA experience.  I'll
probably mostly listen.  I'll give that newsgroup the respect and deference
I give to all the other soc.culture groups.  Heck, I probably won't even
read it after the first month or so.  :-)

How about it, people?  You like the idea?  I absolutely love it.

Please, tell me why White Americans don't deserve their own newsgroup in
USENET.

Jim
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american,soc.culture.korean,soc.culture.asean
From: jj@alice.att.com (jj, clueless old white boy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Degrees of racism (was Re: Caucasians don't understand)
Date: 1 Sep 92 18:13:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.23605
Reply-To: jj@alice.UUCP (jj, clueless old white boy)
Distribution: na
Organization: NJ State Home for Bewildered Terminals

In article <1992Sep1.123534.19658@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:


>  Notice nothing said by Mr. Jackson about "race war".  Mr. Jackson
>  is demanding equal treatment, plain and simple.  Unless the Whites
>  can't give and receive equal treatment without a race war.  Hmmm...
Mr. Jackson has repeatedly suggested that blacks and other "races"
should band together for the express purpose of *taking* power from
whites.  Sharing has NOT been suggested.  Mr. Jackson has repeatedly
said that he does not endorse any dealings whatsoever with whites,
and that such dealings are "selling out".  Mr. Jackson has made it clear
that he expouses that whites should be shut out of any dealings with
anyone other than whites, in every way, shape, and form.

That, in and of itself, is a call for rebellion and war, on a strictly
racial basis.  WHy do you claim otherwise?
-- 
 Bush    *Copyright alice!jj 1992, all rights reserved, except transmission
   vs       *by USENET and like facilities granted.      Said permission is
 Clinton  --    *granted only for complete copies that include this notice.
 Just Say !NO!       *Use on pay-for-read services specifically disallowed.
From: kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Date: 29 Aug 1992 18:01:00 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, Rice University

In article <1992Aug26.050450.18705@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>Frankly, I don't know why the hell my name even appears in this.  I've
>never met Mr. Hu, Ms. Tseng, Mr. Sieh, nor Mr. Shaw.  I have no idea
>what their skin color is, and they have no idea what my skin color is
>either.
>
>But when I do look in the mirror, I suppose that I do see my skin color.
>I say, "Gee.  I'm an American."

Well, we may now know his race, but we *do* know he can see.  Uh-oh...
something personal has leaked out!
From: jpak@oakhill.sps.mot.com (Jim Pak)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Date: 25 Aug 92 22:19:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: oakhill.1992Aug25.221926.9927
Reply-To: jpak@manute.sps.mot.com (Kinder and Gentler Jim)
Distribution: na
Organization: Motorola Inc.  Austin, Tx.

In article <1992Aug25.142037.24448@panix.com> sieh@panix.com (Twinkie Chinkie) writes:
>And we, meaning the collective Asian American posters on s.c.as.am are no
>different.  I noted your reply to my article about the Judy Tseng tirade
>against me.                                                       ^^^^^^
>^^^^^^^^^^
>[...]
>in this case, another Asian American bashing another because one thought[...]
               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Lui, are you ever going to stop with this?  Granted what Judy wrote to you
was mean, but it's not like she hasn't gotten some back from you and others,
and besides, it's been *THREE WEEKS* now.  And you keep mentioning it again
and again in post after post after post.  Enough already!!  What do you want,
an engraved apology from her?

You know, in a previous article, you wrote:

     For myself, I have a serious difficulty with the idea of portraying
     myself as a victim.  [<1992Aug22.190240.25334@panix.com>]
           
Really?  Is that so?  Could have fooled me.

Jim
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: kerryg@stat.rice.edu (Kerry Go)
Subject: Re: Olympic Games
Organization: Dept. of Statistics, Rice University
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 00:44:53 GMT

In article <1992Aug5.184906.16941@nynexst.com> clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu) writes:
>>underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
>>
>>>In article <1992Aug5.041623.10986@news.columbia.edu>
>>>cwt2@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Charles W Tang) writes:
>>>>Just a quick question: When you're watching the Olympic Games, which
>>>>country or countries do you cheer for?
>>>>
>>>>Let's say, if you're ethnically Chinese, and you see the Chinese and
>>>>the US teams competing against each other -- which country do you
>>>>cheer for?
>>
>>>There's no doubt that American citizens who call themselves
>>>American-Chinese (!) are rooting for China.

I don't see this as necessarily true.  But then, since Dwight said the above,
we all know it's not necessarily true.

>  I don't automatically root for anyone.  During the U.S.
>  vs. Italy men's volleyball game, I rooted for the Italians--
>  they're so handsome compared to the skinhead American look.
>  So I basically root for whoever I think's the cutest, so there.

I like that attitude.  But since I've been following the U.S. v-ball team
for years, I did want the U.S. to win.

There are other sports, however, that I really didn't care what country
the athlete is from--I just rooted for the cute ones.  So I didn't watch
any men's sports besides v-ball.  :-)

Most of all, I like seeing a good game.  It disturbs me that people root
for one side to the detriment of the other.  Many people are to the point
where they are happy to see the other team mess up or get hurt.  At that
point, I think rooting for a side has gone too far.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi)
Subject: "Banana"'s sexuality and social status
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Lowell Computer Science
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 01:12:05 GMT

Male "banana"'s ass is valued high by white gay men. The reason for that are 
two folds. One is that male "banana"s normal receives arrogant, if not hostile
, attitude from Whites. When a White man makes an sexual advance, in a
pledging mode. The male "banana" will be so moved by the sudden "friendliness"
from White man. Even though the male "banana" does not have any interests of
being stuffed in ass, he is more than willing to submit himself, for the
pleasure of being wanted by a whiteman. second is that, even thogh the
hostility toward "banana" on surface, deep in whitemen heart, there is "fear",
mythical feeling, "respect" toward "banana", because the "banana" from a
culture that dwarfs all others, the need to share a piece of that culture
through body contact compell them to move. The above two apply to Female 
"banana" in the relationship with white men too. To back up my claim, I like 
to give two examples:
San Francisco is a "banana" most concetrated place in U.S., by no accident
 the city is gayman capital in U.S. too. People bacome "banana" for the sake of 
 gold, that is why San Francisco is called Old Gold Mountain(Jiu2 Jin1 San1)
 in the "banana"'s known language, but lost their asses, that is why I call
 San Francisco Old Ass Mountain(Jiu2 Gan1 San1). 
Another story is that about Nixion visit "banana"'s fatherland. Just before
 he took on journey, his staff member arranged him with a "banana" young femal.
 The rational behind the act is that Mao's people kicked Nixon's people's asses
 in Korea, Vietname, to get even with so many "bananas" asses lost in U.S.. 
 In order to say to himself that I got one of you too when met Mao, and have
 enough confidence to stand straight without too much leg-shakng, He closely, 
 carefully "examed" the femal "banana", in and out. Made her giggle, cry,
 be exhsausted, be satistified, etc on the White Hours bed the night.

Just a piece of reality for "bananas" or "bananas_about_to_be", joy? sad? 
what ever.
From: shaw@whopper.lcs.mit.edu (Andy Shaw)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Perceptions, Realities, Perceptions
Date: 26 Aug 92 09:02:24 GMT
	<1992Aug25.142037.24448@panix.com>
	<SHAW.92Aug26002432@whopper.lcs.mit.edu>
	<1992Aug26.050450.18705@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Organization: MIT Lab for Computer Science, Cambridge, Mass.

In article <1992Aug26.050450.18705@leland.Stanford.EDU> underdog@leland.Stanford.EDU (Dwight Joe) writes:
   But when I do look in the mirror, I suppose that I do see my skin color.
   I say, "Gee.  I'm an American."

Jeez Dwight, what a coincidence ... so do I.  Although that is a funny
comment from someone whose .plan says:

  Kesa okite kara
  kagami ni utsutte iru jibun o mita
  Nani mo minakatta

  <This morning, I woke up and>
  <I looked at the myself being reflected by the mirror>
  <I didn't see anything>

In any case, it's 100% clear to me that I'm an American, even when I see my
skin color.  However, it's not clear to everyone else, and that's part of
the problem.  Somehow, if I were a second generation Lithuanian instead of
a second generation Taiwanese, I suspect I wouldn't have this sort of
problem.

-Andy
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: masahiro@tgevax.life.uiuc.edu (Masahiro Kono)
Subject: Re: What is tacky today
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 00:36:53 GMT

david@xlnt.com (David Johnson) writes:

>In article <4920070@hpcc01.corp.hp.com> joanne@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Joanne Petersen) writes:
>>I'd like to know what it's like to be an Asian person living in the deep
>>south and Texas!  

>I corresponded with
>a regular in scaa during the school year, and he
>had very
>positive things to say about race relations in San Antonio where he
>grew up.  He says Texans are unfairly accused of being a bunch of
>bigots.  

>He cannot say the same for some people in Atlanta.  He said he experienced
>more bigotry in 3 years in Atlanta than in 10+ years in Texas.

I don't want to get into a semantics flame, but could you be a wee
bit more specific about the "bigotry in 3 years in Atlanta"? Were they
verbal abuse? physical abuse? stereotyping? Bigotry to me covers a broad
area.  Also, the social status and/or environment of the bigot and victim
has something to do with certain types of racist behavior.  It seems more
likely and easier for a bunch of (sorry for the bit-o-stereotyping to
follow, but it's to make a minor point) rednecks in a Chevy/Ford pickup
coming out of a 7-11 with a 12-pack-o-Busch to make ching/chang/chong
noises with slanty eyed gestures in passing than a neighbor in a white collar
neighborhood who has known you for several years.

There are nice people everywhere. Conversely, there are jerks everywhere.

-mas (masahiro@tgevax.life.uiuc.edu)
From: mwong@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Marilyn J Wong)
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 22:51:02 GMT
Subject: Re: Hi, Test
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american

OK, you're posted. . . 


So, you're an engineering student?  How do you like it and
what discipline are you taking?

I'm getting my MSEE with a specialty in ICs.  I also work at HP.
I also love wu-shu.  write back!
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: mitchell@Software.Mitel.COM (Robert Mitchell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: name this tune
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:47:27 GMT
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.



Hello,

  The Steven Spielberg movie "Empire of the Sun" opens with a song
called "Suo Gan". Can anyone tell me what the song title means, and what
the song is about ?

Thanks.

/Rob
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
From: mhmann@nyx.cs.du.edu (Me Mann)
Subject: Re: Krawalle in Rostock Deutschland
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 01:40:50 GMT

In article <l9l081INNa9l@male.EBay.Sun.COM> tooka@train.EBay.Sun.COM writes:
>Hi,
>
>Unfortunately I just read on the German culture net that 
>there was just an incident in Rostock (N. Germany) involving
>about 100 Vietnamese refugees.

Yes unfortunate indeed.  I saw a glimpse of what was happening
in the ABC world News this evening.  I wasn't paying too 
much attention at that time as I was about to go out.

>How things have changed in Germany since I last visited Cologne
>and Rheinland-Pfalz where I had such a good time and
>made many friends...

This is not new really. Infact awhile ago,  either on CBS or
ABC .. more likely CBS, 60 minutes perhaps, there was
a report of a  neo-nazi movement in Germany. The leader
was interview and you should have heard what he says. 
Basically his thought is no different from those of
Aldorf Hitler's. His contempt and hatred of immigrants
is made very public.  I also understand then  that he was 
at odd with the authority... so perhaps the better
part of Germany do not or at least not openly condone
his actions.  Ya,  the report also shows a training camp.
Kind of scary.
From: jj@alice.att.com (jj, clueless old white boy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: Please educate this man
Date: 3 Sep 92 17:14:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.23624
Reply-To: jj@alice.UUCP (jj, clueless old white boy)
Organization: NJ State Home for Bewildered Terminals

In article <24540@oasys.dt.navy.mil> mulvihil@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Lawrence Mulvihill) writes:
:If Judy Mann had called me, I would have suggested that
:multiculturalism is explicitly wrong, because it denies
:the superiority of Western values as a way of life for
:humans (in effect, setting up situational
:ethics relativism for cultures).
:
:-- Newt Gingrich
:   Republican Whip
:   U.S. Representative (R-Ga.)
:
:   From a letter to the Washington Post Sept 2, 1992

Why don't we just try to get him voted right out?
That is probably the only kind of education he's capable
of understanding, given some of the other gems attributed
to him.
-- 
Extremism *Copyright alice!jj 1992, all rights reserved, except transmission
   in the    *by USENET and like facilities granted.      Said permission is
  defense of     *granted only for complete copies that include this notice.
 liberty is no vice.  *Use on pay-for-read services specifically disallowed.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asian.american