HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: aq0@engr08.uark.edu (Amer Qureshi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: A JOKE
Date: 17 Apr 92 20:25:26 GMT
Article-I.D.: engr08.1992Apr17.202526.1018
Organization: University of Arkansas

askhan@csws2.ic.sunysb.edu (Ashfaq Khan) writes:

>	Aik aadmee aik kooain kay pass baeetha keh raha tha "Saat,saat,
>saat....." Aik aur aadmee wahan say guzra to poochnay laga, "Kayaa saat,
>saat laga rakhee hay?" Is per pehla aadmee kehta hay, "Tum bhee dekh low."
>Jaeesay he yeh aadmee kooain main dekhta hay to pehla aadmee usay dhakka
>day dayta hay. Ab wo keh raha tha,"Aath,aath...."
>
>
>TRANSLATION:
>
>	A guy was sitting on the edge of a deep well and was yelling,
>"Seven,seven,....." Someone else passed by and asked, "What the hell are you
>crying for?" First guy replies, "Come and see." The minute he looks into the
>well, first guy pushes him into it. Now he was saying, "Eight, eight,...."
>
>
>P.S.
>	Makes any sense? 
>	Perhaps stinks?
>
	Comments and other jokes are welcome.

all right, we are getting some where now, post more jokes every one...

Amer [invisible touch of a smile] Qureshi...
From: ahussain@prism.poly.edu (Arshad Hussain)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Mr. Maudoodi and Minority relation
Date: 10 Apr 92 00:38:23 GMT
Organization: Polytechnic University, New York

>From: hyder@cs.utexas.edu (Syed Irfan Hyder)
>Subject: Re: Mr. Maudoodi and Minority relations: Another case of Dishonesty?

>In article <1992Apr9.183625.1418@prism.poly.edu> 
>      ahussain@prism.poly.edu (Arshad Hussain) writes:
>> In his testimony before Munir Commission 1953,
>>Mr. Maudoodi states that he has no objection if
>>Government of India starts treating MUSLIM minority as
>>ASHOOTS & MALEESHS.

>A classic case of quoting out of context and making
>the readers believe of some thing which is not intended at
>all. 
>So, you have in front of you yet another piece of
>scholastic dis-honesty.

>[I have not read Munir report. However, I have read the above 
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>objection being referred to in "Russail-o-Massail-III" and
                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Maudoodi's answer to it. 
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Who is talking out of context?
I Have READ the report.
I am talking about Mr. Moudoodi's TESTIMONY before commission. 
Mr. Hyder is QUOTING  Mr. Maududi's ANSWER to READER's OBJECTION.

I have great respect for Mr. Maudoodi. He was a scholar. These are 
the areas I disagree with him.
From: hyder@cs.utexas.edu (Syed Irfan Hyder)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: The Mongols and the Indian sub-continent: No Mystery
Date: 15 Apr 1992 12:49:54 -0500
Organization: U Texas Dept of Computer Sciences, Austin TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: pageboy.cs.utexas.edu

In article <9204132026.AA13579@hadar.fai.com> balajiv@hadar.fai.com (Robi Bisesarji) writes:
>
>Reading through the history of the mongols, one often comes across the name
>'Khan' being used more as a title than as a surname/tribal name. Chingiz Khan
>(the Grand Khan) was the title that Temuchen took when he was elected leader
>of the mongol tribes in a 'kuraltai'. I wonder if the word Khan had any special
>meaning in the mongolian language of those days. This word seems to be
>inherently mongolian in its origin because at the time of the mongol expansion,
  [stuff deleted]

>mongol features and more of Turkish features. There is a vast distinction
>between his features and that of Chingiz, Kublai Khan, Ogodai, Chagatai, etc.,
>of the original mongol royalty. Maybe he was a Turkish native from the region
>that today includes Uzbekistan, Turkistan, etc. Any opinions/concrete evidence?
>

I don't think that there is much mystery about the
above. Although initially Muslims and Islam entered subcontinent
through Sind, but later on (Ghaznavis, Ghauris, Moguls...) Islam
came through Central Asia and Afghanistan. Read for example
Syed Sajjad Hyder Yeldrum's daughter QuratulAin Hyder's 
"Kaar-e-Jahaan Daraaz hai" for one lineage of this history.



Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: anajam@athena.mit.edu (ADIL NAJAM)
Subject: Pathanay Khan.....piyar aur iishq......
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 18:08:05 GMT

In article <1992Apr10.042833.9832@acsu.buffalo.edu>, memon@acsu.buffalo.edu 
Naveed Siraj Memon writes:

|> Naveed[jis dil vich pyar dee dayray hin
|>        bas us dil kooN irfaan samajh
|>        jay kooN pyar dee jaaN sunJan naheeN
|>        os banday kooN nadaan sumjh  
|>        aye pyar ay dars waliyaaN da
|>        aye maslak paak nabeeyan da
|>        inmool pyar dee doolat aye] Memon


	Just reading it makes the memories of Pathanay Khan crooning these
	immortal lines echo in my head........an analysis of your recent
	postings suggest that you are listening to the EMI [blue coloured :-)]
	collection of Pathanay Khan which I played and re-played to extinction...
	......how I envy you for having the pleasure of basking in the
	histrionic splendour of Pathanay Khan while I have to sit through
	drab discourses of Prof. Solow........he may have won the Nobel
	Prize but what does he know of iishq.......it is where the Solow model
	fails that the models of iishq begin.........

	Do please post the rest of this great Kafi.

	The Universality of this message is eternal.......untill there are
	people who can appreciate this message, there is hope.

	But why then does Amir Khusro (and I am assuming this is by Khusro)
	say:

	jo saajan meiN jaanti kay preet keeaye dukh hoay
	nagar dhandora peeT-tee kay preet na kareeoo koay

	?


	ADIL [.....ghoom chaRkhaRa goom
	      	   tairee kattan waali jeevay......] NAJAM
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: anajam@athena.mit.edu (ADIL NAJAM)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: SCARY THOUGHT
Date: 13 Apr 92 20:37:14 GMT
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology

LAHORI POOND writes:
|> 
|>      As for the room well it is a big enough to accomadate all the die hard 
|> scp correspondents.It does have a ceiling but no windows so that no one can 
|> call for help from within a room.


	I am glad there aren't any windows........with all you guys in the room
	it would not be people INSIDE the room who would call out from help
	.....it would be PEOPLE outside the room who would be shouting.....
	...."Dohai hai, dohai hai......give us a break....."
From: khant@topaz.ucq.edu.au
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: A request to all the Muslims
Date: 17 Apr 92 16:32:37 AET
Organization: University of Central Queensland, Australia


I am again requesting all the muslims please leave Qadianis alone. If we

keep on arguing with these people that will benificial for them.  If you 

want to convence a Hindo that his religion is wrong i am sure he would not

beleive you, so how come we can convence to Iblis (Shahtan-e-murdood) family.

I think we should not worry about them and should not argue with these peoiple

These people have a Lanat from Allah like others non muslims.  We muslims are 

lucky

enough that we got the hiddayat from Allah, Allah does not send hiddayat to

to all human being, had he sent to all then every one in this world would 

have been mulim.  So all muslim should send thanks to Allah every time for

being sent in a muslim family and should pray for the Qadianis (May Allah 

give these people Hiddayat) that is only thing we can do.


I would request again and again to all the muslims please ignore Qadianis

and do not reply thier messages.  As we are very weak and can get the Attack

of Qadianis, as we get it from Iblis (Shahtan-e-murdood) and can not save

ourself from Iblis(Shahtan-e-mudood). I believe there is no difference 

between Qadianis and Iblis (Shahtan-e-murdood). They can only be handeled 

by our Muftis, and Ullmas, so we should not worried about these Iblis family.

If you are good muslim then you should only try to save yourself from attack

of Iblis.  Iblis(Qadianis) have been succeeded to get you(Muslims) involved

in rubbish and foolish arguments and vaste your time for last two months.

The only duty which we have completed successfully was, to let them know the

correct and perfect way of living in this world. Know it is all up to Allah

Subhana Tallah, if they are lucky enough they will get Hiddayat from Allah

Subhana Tallah otherwise Hell(Jahanum) would be thier future fore ever.
From: az1@ukc.ac.uk (A.Zafar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: British open Squash
Date: 14 Apr 92 00:23:20 GMT
Organization: Computing Lab, University of Kent at Canterbury, UK.


	Jansher Khan has won the British open beating Chris Robertson 9-7,
10-9 and 9-5. Jahangir who has won the competition 10 times but was out due to
injury.

--
			 - Aman Zafar 			_   /|
			 - University of Kent 		\'o.O'
			 - England. 			=(___)=	
							   U
From: ahussain@prism.poly.edu (Arshad Hussain)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Mr. Maudoodi and Minority relations
Date: 9 Apr 92 18:36:25 GMT
Organization: Polytechnic University, New York


 In his testimony before Munir Commission 1953,

Mr. Maudoodi states that he has no objection if

Government of India starts treating MUSLIM minority as

ASHOOTS & MALEESHS.

The report is published by Govt. of Pakistan.
From: 3040_3744@uwovax.uwo.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Ahmadis vs Non-Ahmadis
Date: 9 Apr 92 22:17:40 EST

In article <92100.103246BUTTS@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>, Sabaa Butt<BUTTS@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> writes:
> Though this marathon-no-holds-barred debating session of Ahmadis vs Non-Ahmadis
> has yet to come to an *unprecedented* outcome, its really not that difficult to
> resolve this issue. All it needs is a little bit of tolerance and the capacity
> to get rid of ethnocentrism, of the belief that only our own ideas and convicti
> ons are true and correct. I know there is always the temptation to impose one's
> own ideas on others, to spread one's own *truth*. Its a common human weekness
> to persecute people who are *different*. But one has to remind oneself that all
> individuals or groups have a fundamental right to live their lives according to
> their own choice. Suppression of someone's ideas and beliefs leads to general
> human impoverishment. Freedom and tolerance are necessary for general improve-
> ment of culture and civilization. Thus we should regard and respect the beliefs
> ideas and convictions of other people.
> 
> Truth, Goodness and Beauty are not the monopoly of any one individual or group.
> 
> Sabaa.


THANKS THAT THERE ARE STILL PEOPLE IN THIS SOCIETY WHO ARE MORE SENSIBLE AND
MORE RATIONAL. I AM DELIGHTED THAT YOU HAVE POSITIVE THINKING AND OPEN MIND
TOWARDS OTHER PEOPLE. I AM AGREED THAT WE SHOULD RESPECT TO EACH OTHER AND
DISCUSS POLITELY THESE MATTERS. 
THANKS SABAA FOR YOUR POSTING.
MUNAWAR
From: hyder@cs.utexas.edu (Syed Irfan Hyder)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Mr. Mirza plays and misses (burqa and women)
Date: 8 Apr 1992 11:39:24 -0500
Organization: U Texas Dept of Computer Sciences, Austin TX
NNTP-Posting-Host: pageboy.cs.utexas.edu


Dear Murad Mirza:

	I just don't know how to comment on your recent form
where "burqa and women" are concerned. 

I think you are being consistently
beaten outside the off-stick. You are playing again and again
and missing. You are fortunate that some of your thick inside
edges barely missed the stumps by hair-line. You may consider
yourself lucky to be still out there.
I know that outfield has moisture on it , adding extra
pace to the ball. Also, there is wind moving in from the covers,
and angling in to the batsman, further 
aiding the occasional in-cutters. Further complicating the
situation, is the over-cast sky.

The reason why you have been unable to judge the pace and
swing of the ball is that you are not concentrating. Furthermore
your bat is often away from the body. You must try to come in
 line before you attempt a stroke. If you are having
difficulty in judging the pace of the ball, try to come
on the front foot meeting at  the pitch of the ball instead of going
on the back foot.

Furthermore, the bowler is intelligently exploiting
the rough on the pitch. Bowler is also varying  the pace. 
I would recommend that
you do some gardening and try to pave the rough made
by the other bowler who is stepping on to the wicket from the
other side. If you are really having difficulty, why
don't you seek  help from the umpire:

regards

Irfan Hyder
From: fmbutt@mrbt.sw.stratus.com (Farooq Butt)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Did this happen to you, too ?
Date: 9 Apr 92 14:53:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: transfer.2051
Distribution: na
Organization: Stratus Computer, Software Engineering

In article <2291@news.duke.edu> shafqat@neuro.duke.edu (Saad Shafqat) writes:
>
>On a flight from Istanbul to New York, I had my (Pakistani) passport 
>confiscated by the (Turkish) airline, apparently under advice from
>US Immigration.  This also happened to the other four Pakistani passports
>on that flight.  Our passports were not recovered until just before
>the immigration counter at JFK.  Nobody explained why this happened, so
>it did cause some anxiety.  I was just wondering if this has also happened
>to other Pakistanis and also why it happens at all.
>
>


Saad-

you have my sympathies.  This is a very humiliating experience to go
through.  The prcedure has been "requested" by INS since great numbers
of Pakistanis used to rip up their passports and travel documents on
board the airplane and flush them down the toilet.  Upon arriving in
the USA, they would claim politcal asylum and claim to be "Mustansar
Hussain TharuR" who is being pursued by the government.  Since they
had no ID, no ticket, no visa, INS would have to feed and clothe them
until it could be proven that they were NOT bona-fide political
refugees.  Once in the US, these folks were not incarcerated but
rather told politely to report to an INS officer every week or two.
Of course, you know what happened: they set up a chum-chum stand in
Jackson Heights, NY under a brand new name and identity (with a jaalee
SSN etc.) and now honest folks like you have to pay the price of their
"chaalaakee."  The only airline where this does NOT occur is PIA and 
they make sure they have photocopies of _all_ your travel docs. 
before you board (thus covering their rears).  Remember, for every 
asylum seeker, the airline has to pay the US govt. several thousand 
dollars in fines. PIA's technique of photocopying travel docs. is 
is miles ahead of any other airline in the world.  

This scan may not survive for much longer though.  The USA is
seriously considering removing Pakistan from the list of countries
that have "repressive" governments, thereby effectively closing the
door on Mr.  Mustansar Hussain TharuR and Co.  BTW: didya know that
you can no longer use an MCI calling card to call Pakistan from Long
Island, NY because of Mr. TharuR's pals who have been racking up
"free" calls for the past few years.

fmb
-- 
Standard High-Tech Disclaimer: NOTHING  in the above article has the slightest 
relationship to reality. If any reality correspondences are found, please 
notify me IMMEDIATELY. Any threats, abuse or stupidity of any kind is purely 
UNintentional. These are MY Opinions NOT my employer's.
Organization: Central Michigan University
Date: Friday, 17 Apr 1992 05:31:08 EDT
From: Mahfooz Ahmed Jafry <32JMVQG@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Women and Burqa: Analyzing the recent discussion

Salam Alaikum :

       Concerning the dress 'tight jeans' are not Islamic way for men and women
  In one of the hadiths Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) says, for men, to cover the pa
rt of the lower body with shirts (daman), Pakistan shalwar Khamiz is ideal to r
epresent this adiths.  Dress code for men is similar to women, transparents and
 revealing dress are also not recommended for men also.  It depends on the area
 and on the season but to cover the body and a dress which shows 'khassiatallah
' which is required for men.  I am sorry I saw this article today this is why
I am late in contributing what I know.

        I would like to emphasis that normally people see different compiled b
ooks of hadiths in English, they do not find or see books of hadiths in Islamic

Center etc the real and the original book translated from hadiths and say that
I did not find this in Abu Dawood or Sahih Bukhari or Ibne Maja or Tirmizi etc.
This is not correct and write this hadiths are not found in book so it is wrong
  This is unfair.  This is why I brought with me 3 volume of complete set of S
ahih Bukhars in urdu and Arabic language (both), a complete set of about 3000 p
find this hadiths in Bukhari.  When I do not find any particular hadiths in tht
complete set then I say I do not find that hadiths in Bukhari, without looking
a complete set it is not fair to say that this hadiths is wrong.

     Concerning Burqa or bari chadar to cover the head, body and face is demons
trated by Ibne Abbas that 'what pardah is' and I read this in books of hadiths
and and Tafhimul Quran and Maulan Maudoodi cited this hadiths in paradah.  I do
 not have my book of pardah, I gave it to one bapardah khatoon in Detroit and s
he lot it otherwise I can quote the exact hadiths.  The real pardah is very har
d to understand, all alone, one girl cannot do it, and in USA this is more diff
icult. It needs environment, encouragement and confidence which comes after a t
horough study and practice.  A muslim women (unanimous) is allowed to leave her
pawn and feet open, it is not mandatory to cover. One girl asked me about parda
h in USA, I told her do whatever is possible or u can do, what I can say more.
There is a young girl in our university 'Umme Salim' she is a graduate student
in religion department, by having a comparative study, she not adopted religion
Islam, she adopted complete pardah, she comes to class in complete pardah and o
nly her eyes remain open :  If any sister wants to talk to her to disucss the
the issue I can ask her muslim husband and pass the telephone number.

       'hawa hai garcha tund-o-taiz laikin chiragh apna jala raha hai
        woh marde darwesh ki jisko haq ne diyenh andaze aarifaana'   iqbal
        woh marde darwesh ke jisko haq ne diye hain andaze aarifana'    iqbal
From: aaj5096@hertz.njit.edu (Ali A. Jafry)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: PINKY FLOYD - Once again! Your serve!
Date: 15 Apr 92 23:03:33 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <13APR199217191823@juliet.caltech.edu> mughal@juliet.caltech.edu (ASIM M MUGHAL) writes:

>>I must go down to the seas again, 
>>to the lonely sea and the sky, 
>>And all I ask is a tall ship and a,
>>Star to steer her by.
>
>	Ali Sahib, you forgot to mention the above in quotes and would 
                       ^^^^^^

Oops!! I guess I did.

>	you know who poem is it from ? ;)
>

I think that the poem is by .. John Masefield.


Ali

-- 
"I must go down to the seas again, to the lonely sea and the sky, 
 And all I ask is a tall ship and a, star to steer her by."

                                              --- John Masefield
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Women strive to lift veil of repression
From: vkuttikattu@vax1.umkc.edu
Date: 7 Apr 92 21:54:58 CST
Reply-To: azhar@duke.cs.duke.edu
Organization: University of Missouri-Kansas City

In article <702133493@volga.cs.duke.edu>, azhar@duke.cs.duke.edu (D. Salman [Quintessential] Azhar) writes:
> 
> 	   When Lady Sabaa posted this article hinting that "veil" is
> responsible for mitigating the progress of muslim women, she probably
> overlooked the successful ascent of the "veiled" Benazir Bhutto. :-)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Its probably not the literal veil that she's talking about, its probably the
veil of subjugation that muslim women suffer from.It is a psychological
barrier.Women like Benazir probably never suffered from it because of her
western upbringing.The veil Benazir Bhutto wears today is just a piece
of clothe to satisfy the "traditionalist"(more correctly fundamentalists). 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> In article <92087.093610BUTTS@QUCDN.QueensU.CA> BUTTS@QUCDN.QueensU.CA writes:
>>Stringent set of Islamic laws hinders progress in Pakistan:
>>==========================================================
>>The Globe And Mail
>>(By John Stackhouse, Development Issues Reporter, Lahore, Pakistan)
> 
> 	   Like all orientalists, Stackhouse perceives the east
> (especially Islam which does not claim to be an eastern religion) as
> something much like pyramids of Egypt... Awesome, exciting,
> spectacular, yet obsolete, and ultimately inferior to the World Trade
> Center. 
> 
> 	   But seriously, let us look at what Stackhouse has to say.
> Thanks to orientalists like him, muslims have been barking up the
> wrong tree in their pursuit for improving the quality of muslim
> women's life. The answer lies in education and respect, not a
> surrender to the western system, for each civilization and culture has
> its own stable set of values, which cannot be transported as easily as
> we suppose.
> 
>>articulate high school student wants a graduate degree, a career in the public
>>service and perhaps later, a family. But at 19, Ms. Nisar already finds that
>>life's grade becomes steeper with each step. Her parents would rather she marry
>>and have children than pursue a career. 
> 
> 	   Maybe, just maybe, it is best in Pakistani society for men and
> women to marry early, especially women, whose emotional needs are not
> recognized in general. In fact, a person (man and woman) has a more
> accommodating personality at younger age, and that is an asset to a
> marriage. There are plenty of Pakistani husbands who encourage their
> wives to pursue a career, as there are Pakistani wives who encourage
> their husbands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
so now you agree that womens' emotional needs are not being met in
Pakisthani society.
As for women & men having a more accomodating personality at a younger age

THATS REALLY STUPID!!!                                  
-------------------------------------------------------------------------