From: btiffany@pbs.org
Newsgroups: alt.messianic
Subject: Re: Clean And Unclean
Date: 6 Sep 92 17:24:55 EDT
Organization: PBS:Public Broadcasting Service, Alexandria, VA

Robert A. Levene writes:

> Laura Manninen wrote:
> 
>>> The accusation on the table is that Judaism is characterized by or
>>> based upon rejection of Jesus as messiah.
>>
>> But what do you say about the fact that the modern day Judaism (Rabbinic)
>> ignores the parts which talk about the Messiah as being Son of God and
>> his death as atonement for sins ?
> 
> It doesn't ignore those parts, it understands them differently
> than you do.  
> 
>>  Tanach also says that all men are sinners
>> (unlike RJ which says we've got a "Divine spark" inside) and that there
> 
> Non-sequitur.
> 
>> is no atonement of sins without a blood sacrifice (Lev. 16,17).
> 
> Some atonement offerings were bloodless, and some atonement
> didn't even involve sacrifices.

I see it's once again time to post Mike Brown's comments on atonement!


     Until the Temple was destroyed in A.D.  70, Jewish teaching emphasized
     the  necessity of blood atonement.  According to the Talmud, "There is
     not atonement (kapparah) without the  blood"  (Yoma  51;  Zebahim  6a;
     Menahot 93b).  It is recognized by Jewish and Christian scholars alike
     that the New Covenant emphasis on blood atonement is based  on  JEWISH
     beliefs  of  the  day.  And, although many Jews today think that it is
     the New Covenant writers who cited Leviticus 17:11 to prove  that  God
     required  blood atonement, it is actually the RABBIS of the Talmud who
     quoted this verse in this way!  They recognized that because "the life
     of  a  creature  is  in  the blood" God gave it upon the altar to make
     atonement for His people ("It is the blood that  makes  atonement  for
     one's life" Lev.  17:11).

     Blood sacrifices formed the main part of the ancient Israelite  Temple
     service,  and, according to Leviticus 16, on the Day of Atonement (Yom
     Kippur) THE HOLY PLACE ITSELF, as well as the High Priest and all  the
     people  of  Israel,  were to be cleansed by the BLOOD of a sacrificial
     goat.  On the eve of Israel's exodus from Egypt, it was the  BLOOD  of
     the  Passover (Pesach) lamb, put upon the two doorposts and the lintel
     of the house, that would be a sign to the destroying  angel,  and  the
     LORD  said,  "And  when  I  see  the BLOOD, I will pass over you" (Ex.
     12:13).  Even the giving of the Torah at Mount Sanai was ratified with
     the  shedding  of  BLOOD  ("This is THE BLOOD OF THE COVENANT that the
     LORD has made with you in accordance with  all  these  words"  --  Ex.
     24:8, and the Aramaic Targum to this verse reads:  "And Moses took the
     blood and poured it on the altar AS ATONEMENT FOR THE PEOPLE ...").

     It is with good reason that the letter to the Hebrews says  that  "the
     law  requires  that  nearly  everything  be  cleansed  with blood, AND
     WITHOUT THE SHEDDING OF BLOOD THERE IS NO FORGIVENESS"  (Heb.   9:22),
     since  the  central  importance  of the blood, and, in particular, the
     blood of atonement, is clearly seen in the Tanakh.  Any  other  system
     of atonement which does not include the blood is not biblical, and any
     other  system  of  atonement  which  fails  to  offer  SUBSTITUTIONARY
     atonement,  i.e.,  an innocent sacrificial victim dying on behalf of a
     guilty sinner, is not able to provide real forgiveness of sins.

     How  then  do  we  account  for  references  to  flour  offerings  and
     "atonement  money"  in  the  Torah?   The  answers  again  are simple.
     According to Leviticus 5:11-13, a poor Israelite  who  was  unable  to
     bring  the  required trespass offering of a lamb, goat, turtledoves or
     pigeons could bring instead an offering of fine flour.   According  to
     verse 12, the priest will "take a handful of it [i.e., the flour] as a
     memorial portion, AND BURN IT ON THE ALTAR ON  TOP  OF  THE  OFFERINGS
     MADE  TO  THE  LORD  BY  FIRE."  Then (verse 13) "the priest will make
     atonement for him." In other words, the priest,  in  his  capacity  as
     mediator  for  the people, AND HAVING MINGLED THE FLOUR WITH THE BLOOD
     WHICH WAS ALREADY UPON THE ALTAR, would make atonement for his  fellow
     Israelite.    Nowhere   is  it  written  that  "the  flour  will  make
     atonement," or that "the life of a creature is in the flour."  Rather,
     the  whole basis for atonement remained in the sacrificial blood which
     was upon the altar.

     The references to "atonement money" actually have nothing to  do  with
     atonement  for  sins.   One example is found in Exodus 30:11-16, where
     every male Israelite who was to be counted in the census was to pay  a
     kopher  ("a  ransom";  see Ex.  21:30 -- the owner of a goring ox that
     killed a man would have to pay a  kopher,  i.e.,  a  fixed  amount  of
     ransom  money).   Since  the taking of a census was considered to be a
     dangerous enterprise (according to 2 Sam.   24,  when  David  numbered
     Israel,  a plague broke out among the people), God told the Israelites
     to contribute an offering to the Tabernacle, SO THAT NO  PLAGUE  WOULD
     BREAK OUT AMONG THEM.

     Thus, the kopher here had to do with PROTECTION FROM A PLAGUE, and not
     the   forgiveness  of  sins  or  personal  atonement.   In  fact,  the
     expression in verse 15 "to atone for  your  lives"  should  really  be
     translated  as "to pay a kopher (ransom) for your souls." This is also
     the best way to translate Numbers 31:50, since the  reference  to  the
     children of Israel offering gold jewelry to the LORD again has nothing
     to do with atonement.  Having just counted the soldiers who  had  gone
     into  battle  with  Midian  (again,  they  had  taken  a CENSUS!), the
     officers decided to offer some of the spoil to God and thus to  pay  a
     kopher for their souls.  What connection is there between any of these
     narratives and the concept of personal  atonement  or  forgiveness  of
     sins?

     As to the belief that "the prophets indicate clearly that God  doesn't
     want  blood  sacrifices,"  it  is clear from reading the prophets' own
     words that what they really opposed were  empty  sacrifices  and  VAIN
     offerings.   If  one wishes to say that the prophets wanted to ABOLISH
     the sacrificial system, then one would  also  have  to  say  that  the
     prophets  wanted  to abolish Sabbath!  (See Is.  1:13:  "Stop bringing
     MEANINGLESS OFFERINGS!  ...  New Moons, Sabbaths, and convocations  --
     I cannot bear your evil assemblies.")

     The prophets taught that sacrifices without  mercy  and  justice  were
     vain,  and  that bringing an offering without a repentant and contrite
     heart  was  unacceptable.   Both  of  these  themes   are   constantly
     reiterated in the New Covenant, and one of Yeshua's favorite texts was
     Hosea 6:6:  "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgement of
     God  rather  than burnt offerings" (see, e.g., Matt.  12:7).  In fact,
     when Yeshua gave the Great Commission, he said  that  "REPENTANCE  AND
     FORGIVENESS  OF  SINS will be preached in his name to all nations ..."
     (Luke 24:47).  Without repentance, the sacrifice of Yeshua will do the
     sinner no good.

     When the Temple was destroyed in A.D.  70, the rabbis instituted  what
     they  thought  were  other  forms  of  atonement, such as prayer, good
     deeds, and charity.  They found support for this  in  verses  such  as
     Hosea  14:2 (verse 3 in some versions), which states poetically, "That
     we may offer the fruit of our lips." Yet, while  the  Bible  sometimes
     describes  prayer, repentance and worship with "sacrifice imagery", it
     never implies that  these  things  were  to  take  the  place  of  the
     sacrifices themselves.

     Thus, in Psalm 51, after stating that "the sacrifices  of  God  are  a
     broken  spirit"  (v.   17), David says:  "Then there will be righteous
     sacrifices, whole burnt offerings to delight you; then bulls  will  be
     offered  on  your altar" (v.  19).  Another good example is Psalm 141,
     where David asks that HIS PRAYER be set before  God  as  INCENSE,  and
     that  the LIFTING UP OF HIS HANDS be as the EVENING SACRIFICE.  Yet no
     one would suggest that King David, who  brought  the  ark  of  God  to
     Jerusalem,  and who desired to build a permanent "house" for the LORD,
     wanted to abolish incense or the evening sacrifice!

     The rabbis have taught us much that  is  beautiful  regarding  prayer,
     repentance  and good deeds.  Yet, as beautiful as this teaching is, it
     provides us with no suitable replacement for the blood  of  atonement.
     To this very day, there are still Orthodox Jews who, recognizing their
     need for an atonement sacrifice, kill a chicken on Yom Kippur, wave it
     around  their  heads  and  say:   "This  is my substitute!  This is my
     atonement!" What  a  sad  testimony  to  our  people's  lack  of  true
     forgiveness  outside  of  God's  way  through Messiah!  And what clear
     evidence of the fact that,  with  the  Temple  destroyed,  traditional
     Judaism offers no new covenant, RATIFIED WITH BLOOD, and acceptable in
     the sight of God.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
		Surely our griefs He Himself bore, and our sorrows He carried;
     /\		... He was pierced through for our transgressions, He was
____/__\____	crushed for our iniquities; the chastening for our well-being
\  / || \  /	fell upon Him, and by His scourging we are healed.  All of us
 \/--++--\/	like sheep have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own
 /\  ||  /\	way; but the Lord has caused the iniquity of us all to fall on
/  \ || /  \	Him. ... By His knowledge the Righteous One, My Servant, will
----\--/----	justify the many, as He will bear their iniquities.
     \/							-- Isaiah 53
		Bruce Tiffany