HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lilleyc@cs.man.ac.uk (Chris Lilley)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan,alt.privacy
Subject: privacy act
Date: 18 Aug 92 16:58:20 GMT
Followup-To: alt.pagan
Organization: Dept Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K.

In article <l8q892INNetf@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM>
williamt@athena.Eng.sun.com (Dances with Drums) writes: 

 >In article <1992Aug14.072100.28509@access.digex.com>
 bote@access.digex.com (John Boteler) writes: 

 >>By the way, in looking at the flow of these various
 >>arguments I haven't once come down on one side
 >>or the other; I'm playing the technician here,
 >>trying to get the damned job done. I repeat:
 >>do you folks want to help or hinder?  (Hint:
 >>we don't need anymore negative slippage.)

>	Well, Alaska apparently has had some good legislation in this
>area, as well as California.  As an example is a constitution amendment
>that would guarantee a right to privacy.  Under this, things
>like abortion become a right, things like growing pot in your home 
>become a right.  Living a nudist lifestyle in your home become a right.
>If I have sex with my girlfriend in my own home, and some neighbor
>films the act through the slats of the window, he is trespassing and
>violating my rights -- I am not the guilty party.  That type of
>amendment is a *first* step.  Once me move consciousness to that
>level, nation-wide, we can then take steps that now would seem
>unthinkable.  Like maybe anti-discrimination based on appearance --
>would that apply to nudity?  The way you attack things is to get well
>thought out laws enacted that as a side effect can be used to permit
>a host of activities.  Many people who might not agree with abortion
>or growing pot in your own home might agree with a law guaranteeing
>privacy.  Privacy is something that seems like the 'American way'.

This posting puzzled me.

Growing grass in your own house is illegal; are you saying that
illegal acts become decriminalised if carried out in the privacy of
your own home?

I can see some problems with that.

"Oh sorry sir, I didn't mean to interrupt you beating your wife,
excuse me for trespassing"

Of course, that is just a formalisation of existing policy ;(

"It is not our policy to interfere with domestic violence"

Perhaps you could post some more details about how privacy legislation
can affect abortion rights or growing cannabis. This wasn't exactly
clear in the original post. 

I quoted the whole chunk here for people to refer back to; dont want
to risk misquoting.





--
Chris Lilley
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Technical Author, ITTI Computer Graphics and Visualisation Training Project
Computer Graphics Unit, Manchester Computing Centre, Manchester, UK
Internet:   lilley@cgu.mcc.ac.uk        Janet:   lilley@uk.ac.mcc.cgu
Voice:      +44 (0)61 275 6095          Fax:     +44 (0)61 275 6040
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: txdv1@isuvax.iastate.edu (Angela KAY Rolling)
Subject: a gods resoning?
Reply-To: txdv1@isuvax.iastate.edu
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 14:06:06 GMT

if i were a god i might ask/have another ask a question about ones worth
as a test. it seems to me that mytology's tend to refer to gods testing
people. Does a god have to be omnepotint/all knowing/in total controle?
cant a god simply be an extremly powerful non-physical entity?

ELF-KIN	What would a cave dweller think of us now?
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: ciaran@county.lmt.mn.org (Ciaran Benson)
Subject: Re: jet, ruby
Reply-To: ciaran@county.lmt.mn.org (Ciaran Benson)
Organization: LaserMaster Technologies, Minneapolis, MN
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 15:06:01 GMT

elizabeth a fannin put these thoughts to pen;

>"...and hey, i should know:  i'm often putting strands of glass
>beads against my skin, including (woowoowoothat's cold!!!) my
>midsection."

  Oooh ... you tease !! :)

  Blessed be, Ciaran.

  Yes, I do take some small satisfaction in knowing that this
is going to be PUBLISHED AROUND THE WORLD at something roughly
approximating the speed of light when passed through a federal
government.
From: cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Subject: Re: That Virgin Mary really gets around
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 18 Aug 92 18:53:51 GMT

I just wanted to mention one thing about the BVM and all that jazz --
about the goddess, too.

Mary is a sad version of the goddess only -- bereft of her divinity (in
most instances) and made to kneel before her own son.  Is this really
a good example of the goddess?  People DO tend to want the mother more,
but the version christianity gave them was watered-down and had most of
her divine powers removed -- and again, let me emphasize that Mary is
the only version of the goddess that I know who is in subjection to her
son.

I'm not trying to make trouble, but I still think Mary is more a sad
example of what happened to the goddess after she was forcibly
suppressed than how christians need her, too.  

Blessings,
Janis 
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz)
Subject: Re: the netherlands...a late commentary
Organization: International Computer Science Institute, Berkeley, CA, U.S.A.
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 21:35:35 GMT

std_beaulieu@hg.uleth.ca writes:
>   The bulk of the Netherlands was once North Sea, and exists by
>        virtue of the dykes which guard it.

ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
> yay!  dyke power!  i have this mental picture of bronze-clad amazons bearing
> labryses standing at the broders looking fierce...  B)

This (what ailsa wrote) gives *me* a picture of a bunch of ocean
waves sitting offshore with terrible, frightened faces, nudging each
other and saying "Dare ya!"

Blessings!

		-- radzy

------------------------------------------------------------
					|  An it harm none,
	T. O. Radzykewycz	     	|  do as ye will.
	The Incredible Radical Cabbage	|
					|  "Just pray for a
	radzy@cogsci.berkeley.edu       |  tough hide and a
	        			|  tender heart."
	        			|    -- Ruth Graham
------------------------------------------------------------
> Hi! I am a .signature virus. Copy me into your .signature to join in!
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: New group details and comments.
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 13:06:51 EST
Organization: Ailanthus Project

radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (Tim Radzykewycz) writes:

> krikket@meltdown.chi.il.us (D. 'krikket' Krick) writes:
> > So we end up waving a red flag and a few assholes come forth.  IMHO, as a
> > community, we won't get anywhere until we are willing to stand up against
> > this kind of activity, and not wither into the background when someone
> > yells "BOO!"
>
> Well, there's a difference between standing up & fighting and provoking
> a fight.  Creating something which we *know* will annoy a lot of the
> fundies into posting burn-in-hell type stuff is simply asking for a
> fight.  When it happens, *we* are the ones who would be responsible
> for it.
>
> We'll get some fires-of-hell postings regardless of what we call our
> groups, but no sense in fanning the flames, is there?  Let's stand up
> for ourselves when we need to, but let's not go looking for problems
> either.
>

exacactly.  most activists say that you shoudl choose your battles.  since i am
an activist myself (on the gay rights front), i heartily agree.  the first
question is: is this worth doing?  is the adrenaline spilled over it worth the
prospective benefits?  what ARE the prospective benifits?  and then, if it
isn't worth it, don't bother, or leave it to those people who are in love with
the idea - and never say "i told you so."  especially since it could be you
were wrong.

i could be wrong, but it seems to me that there are NO benefits to creation of
this new group, and definitely costs.

                                           -ailsa

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
     ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com                   ________
        I don't need a hero                Silence \      / Action
        I don't need a soldier                =     \    /    =
        I did when i was younger            Death    \  /    Life
        But now i'm so much older.                    \/
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz)
Subject: Re: words
Organization: International Computer Science Institute, Berkeley, CA, U.S.A.
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1992 21:32:59 GMT

liam@brewich.hou.tx.us (Liam) writes:
> ... yet we still fail to see that the only way to change the
> world is to change ourselves from within.( I must include myself
> in this collective "we")  So I sugest that we, all of us, change
> ourselves for the better and exhibit the qualities that we
> admire the most...in the face of intolerance be tolerant and
> when bashed don't return fire, because if we do, we also condemn
> ourselves. So as we sit behind these battlements forged of our
> own indignation, remember that to see our own worst enemy all we
> have to do is look in a mirror.

Great posting, Liam!
I agree wholeheartedly!

One further thing we each (myself included) need to do is
to look at ourselves when others accuse us of something.  The
first step toward ridding ourselves of any traits we don't
want to have is to recognize that they exist.  So many people
(myself included FAR too often), when someone says they have a
problem, simply go into auto-defense mode and stop listening.


Bear Blessings!

		-- radzy

------------------------------------------------------------
					|  An it harm none,
	T. O. Radzykewycz	     	|  do as ye will.
	The Incredible Radical Cabbage	|
					|  "Just pray for a
	radzy@cogsci.berkeley.edu       |  tough hide and a
	        			|  tender heart."
	        			|    -- Ruth Graham
------------------------------------------------------------
> Hi! I am a .signature virus. Copy me into your .signature to join in!
From: evc@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Edward Van Cura)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: the netherlands...a late commentary
Date: 18 Aug 92 06:12:46 GMT

>yay!  dyke power!  i have this mental picture of bronze-clad amazons bearing
>labryses standing at the broders looking fierce...  B)
>
>                                       -ailsa

There is an obscure mention of "amazons" in a book entitled,
*Fontes Historiae Religionis Germanicae* put together by Carolus Clemen
in 1928. The book contains many old Latin and Greek sources of Germanic
Heathenism. The following is an excerpt translated by James Chisholm
and can be found in the latest *Idunna*.

Paulus Diaconus
[Paul the Deacon]

(Written at the end of the 8th century C.E.)

...

ib.15(l.l.55): It is said that when the Lombards were journeying with 
their king and they came to a certain river and the Amazons prevented 
them from crossing it, he (Lamissio) swam across the river to fight 
with the mightiest of them and he killed her. With this act, he
obtained high praise from the Lombards as well as passage across the 
river. Both sides had made an agreement with one another before hand,
that if the Amazon beat Lamissio, the Lombards would turn away from 
the river, but if, as happened, the Amazon was defeated then the 
Lombards would be allowed to cross the river.

...

Wassail!
Thorfinn
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Bread, "it's pure pollution."   Greenpeace spokesperson
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=



Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: kumagic@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Stephen R. Figgins)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Re: Amber...Jet.
Date: 13 Aug 92 10:33:30 CDT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

In article <Bswp0D.L37@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, ba@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (B.A. Davis-Howe) writes:
> ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
> 
>>some jet too, and the heck with the gardnerian priestesses!  i want an amber
>>and jet beaded necklace too!!!
> 
> If I could, I'd buy you one! :)

My lover makes Amber and Jet necklaces, and sells them exclusively to
pagans.   In fact much of the amber and jet she uses to make the
necklaces she buys from pagans.  She has plans to tour the pagan
festivals and sell her goods someday, maybe in a few years.  

E-mail me for more information.  I don't really want to be advertising
here, but she does do mail-order on jewelry and other things. 

-- 
___________________________________________________________________________

Stephen R. Figgins           |  There was an old woman
kumagic@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu   |  Who lived under the hill 
PO Box 1244                  |  And if she's not gone 
Lawrence, KS 66044	     |  She lives there still
___________________________________________________________________________
 
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: AS.AAM@forsythe.stanford.edu (Astrid Mustard)
Subject: Re: words
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 15:31:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug16.213259.471@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>,
radzy@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (T. O. Radzykewycz) writes:
>liam@brewich.hou.tx.us (Liam) writes:
>> ... yet we still fail to see that the only way to change the
>> world is to change ourselves from within.( I must include myself
>> in this collective "we")  So I sugest that we, all of us, change
>> ourselves for the better and exhibit the qualities that we
>> admire the most...in the face of intolerance be tolerant and
>> when bashed don't return fire, because if we do, we also condemn
>> ourselves. So as we sit behind these battlements forged of our
>> own indignation, remember that to see our own worst enemy all we
>> have to do is look in a mirror.
>
>Great posting, Liam!
>I agree wholeheartedly!
>
>One further thing we each (myself included) need to do is
>to look at ourselves when others accuse us of something.  The
>first step toward ridding ourselves of any traits we don't
>want to have is to recognize that they exist.  So many people
>(myself included FAR too often), when someone says they have a
>problem, simply go into auto-defense mode and stop listening.
>
>
>Bear Blessings!
>
>                -- radzy



I agree with equal enthusiasm.  I thought I'd also add (to radzy's
post) that we might also want to look at our reactions and
perceptions to others and see how those may be reflections of
ourselves and use them as guides for "self-improvement" (a totally
subjective word, eh?).

Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: rickheit@dragon (Erich Rickheit KSC)
Subject: Re: New Thread: Pagan Fiction
Frankie: Nothing...why, do you think I should?
Organization: University of Lowell Computer Science, Lowell MA
Brad: What have you done with Janet
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 14:55:19 GMT

In article <2A89DE70.24607@noiro.acs.uci.edu> cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:

>Well, of COURSE _The Mists of Avalon_ is great, and so is just about
>anything by Ursula LeGuin.  James Tiptree (Alice Sheldon) is also very
>good, though she leans to science fiction (she's won a Hugo).  I don't
>know if she'd be considered P/pagan, though . . .

On the whole, I found _MoA_ annonying. The Xian bashing grew thin real fast
(every Christian character, bar none, is bigoted, stupid, intolerant and
rude. Most are frigid, too) There were some nice ideas; the queer Lancelot
was a nice touch, as was the relation between Excalibur and the Sangreal.
(but why is the Sight only good for planning dinner?) An interesting note:
after her stroke, MZB officially never had been pagan. Retconning is such fun.

From LeGuin, let me especially recommend _Always_Coming_Home_. Not really a
novel, but a fictionl work of anthropology about a cuture that will come
into being in northern California long in the future. It includes a great
deal of these people's writings and poetry, and the origianl edition
included a cassette with recordings of some poems and songs; nice, except
for too-loud and obviously faked night noises in the background.

And, alas, James Tiptree, Jr. is in the past tense. A good science fiction
and feminist writer, but not especially of pagan interest. Go read her
anyway.

-- 
			Erich the hahaha Mad
rickheit@dragon.cpe.ulowell.edu AT&T: 508 453 1753 : USnail : Erich Rickheit KSC
         "Here, my ice lolly's melted --           :          85 Gershom Ave, #2
          You really _are_ the devil!"             :          Lowell, MA 01854
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: swells@triton.unm.edu (Earth-daughter)
Subject: Re: "gangway, folx" was:  Re:  Need help/advice on designing my Taro
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 22:24:38 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Keywords: Tarot, art, design, chocolate


hey, i've already started!  look under "A Politically Incorrect Question"
which is best translated as "conservative asshole making idiot general-
izations."  see ya there!

shannon the mouthy pushy ranting broad "gee, which aspect of the goddess
        are we representing now?"






Newsgroups: alt.pagan,alt.divination
From: n9140397@henson.cc.wwu.edu (Michael J. Hamilton)
Subject: Re: Tarot: What's the blank card for?
Organization: Western Washington University
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 20:02:12 GMT

In article <1992Aug11.204914.17176@porthos.cc.bellcore.com> netnews@porthos.cc.bellcore.com (USENET System Software) writes:
>
>Has anyone read and practiced Tarot Spells.  I forgot the
>author.
>

Seems like there was a book on Tarot Spells by Melita Demming
and Osbourne Phillips, published by Llewwylin (sp?).

Dymen.
From: darsie@eecs.ucdavis.edu (Richard Darsie)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan
Subject: Chocolate (was Re: "gangway, folx")
Date: 12 Aug 92 23:35:25 GMT
Organization: University of California, Davis

In article <VLkePB3w164w@ailanth.UUCP>, ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
> 
> cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
> 
> > In article <BoNcPB6w164w@ailanth.UUCP> ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T
> > >swells@triton.unm.edu (Earth-daughter) writes:
> > >
> > >> In article <2A8309B5.11290@noiro.acs.uci.edu> cortese@skid.ps.uci.edu (Jan
> > >> >In article <k3ym=6-@lynx.unm.edu> swells@triton.unm.edu (Earth-daughter)

> and if Amanda gets her newsreader fixed, we can be a tetrality?  but she has to
> say what sort of chocolate she likes (shannon that is) before we induct her.
> milk is about the only sort left...

>                                               -ailsa
>                                                She Who Must Be Fed Chocolate
> 

I'm in a terrible quandary. The Goddess of Dark Chocolate has put the
"come-hither" on me and I find it increasingly hard to refuse Her
summons. Please, can one of you net.goddesses send me a ritual of
placation so I can avoid having to buy a new wardrobe???  

:-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

Richard
(Tuneweaver)

P.S. Here's an inducement:

DEATH BY CHOCOLATE

2 c. flour
1 tbsp. double-acting baking powder
1/2 tsp. baking soda
2 c. sugar
2 large eggs
1 stick unsalted butter at room temperature, quartered
1 c. sour cream
1/2 c. water
2 tsp. vanilla extract
1/2 c. plus 2 tbsp. cocoa
1 12-oz package semisweet chocolate chips
  powdered sugar

Sift flour, baking powder, and baking soda twice. Place in a small
bowl. Beat the sugar and eggs in a large mixing bowl until sugar
is dissolved. Add butter and mix into egg mixture thoroughly. Add
sour cream, water, vanilla extract, and beat. Add flour mixture
and cocoa and beat slowly just until flour is absorbed. Do not
overbeat.

Fold in chocolate chips and pour into buttered Bundt pan. Bake at
350 degrees F for 1 hour.

When cool, sift powdered sugar on top.
From: briansp@css.itd.umich.edu (Brian Spolarich)
Subject: Re: Tarot: What's the blank card for?
Organization: University of Michigan ITD Consulting and Support Services
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 16:12:16 GMT

     Well, it looks like rn trashed my previous response for some reason...
something about my .signature file...as with all computers, it works until
it doesn't.  Oh well, blessed be...
     Anyways, with all of this discussion about the so-called "ghost"
Tarot card, I thought I would put in my two cents.  I have been using an
interpretation that I haven't seen put forth here, so I thought I would 
share it with you.
     In the past few years, mathematicians have begun to discover a basic
principle of the Universe:  that of uncertainty.  The belief structures 
that comprise the Scientific Method break down into absurdity on the macro-
and micro-cosmic level, leaving particle physicists scratching their
prematurely balding heads, and turning young mathematicans into old ones
before their times.  The end result has been the formulation of Chaos theory,
or the Principle of Uncertainty.  Cause and effect relationships become
disentangled, leaving causes without effects, and events without causes.
     We, of course, have known this all along, and modern Science will 
blodly trudge along behind the cart, while we sit in the front seat reading
Descartes.  So be it.
     I have found the blank card, therefore, to be very useful in representing
this principle, the blind, unreasoning aspect of chance, in my Tarot 
studies.  It represents to me the unseen face of the Goddess, that which
is not merely Unknown, but Unknowable.  That which cannot be predicted.
Chaos.
     I have, as I said previously, found this interpretation extremely
useful, especially since I find nothing in my decks to represent this
principle.  I thought I would share it with you.
     Blessed be, all!
      -brian

________________________________________________________________________
Brian W. Spolarich                   "Until I die there will be sounds.
P.O. 4296 	                      And they will continue following
Ann Arbor, MI  48106                  my death.  One need not fear for
(313) 747-8473                        the future of music."
Internet:                                     -John Cage
briansp@umich.edu
Bitnet:  USERW292@UMICHUM
________________________________________________________________________






Newsgroups: alt.pagan
From: pharvey@quack.sac.ca.us (Paul Harvey)
Subject: Re: That Virgin Mary really gets around
Organization: The Duck Pond public unix: +1 408 249 9630, log in as 'guest'.
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1992 22:25:53 GMT

In article <1518@lysator.liu.se> ceci@lysator.liu.se (Ceci Henningsson) writes:
>What I wonder about is why she is called the VIRGIN Mary. Does it
>really say in the Bible that she did never have sexual intercourse
>with any person? 

Traditional Christians had a lot of trouble interpreting the symbology
of virgin birth, as they had a lot a trouble with women and the goddess
in general. Virgin birth is a universal idea that appears in almost
every mythology around the world. If a mother gives birth to a child and
yet she never had sex with a man, then that tells you that a deity must
be involved, so the child is a demi-god. A deity becomes personified by
transformation through the body of a human woman. That's all, it has
absolutely nothing to do with the filthyness of sex or women, neither of
which are constructive concepts.

Xref: sparky alt.pagan:7897 alt.divination:286
From: netnews@porthos.cc.bellcore.com (USENET System Software)
Newsgroups: alt.pagan,alt.divination
Subject: Re: Tarot: What's the blank card for?
Date: 11 Aug 92 20:49:14 GMT
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ

I use the blank cards for possiblities:  It's in 
the clients hands, the matter hasn't been decided,
you are not to know.
From: sad@dasher.uucp (22430s-downie)
Has anyone read and practiced Tarot Spells.  I forgot the
author.

sad
Newsgroups: alt.pagan