From: perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman)
Subject: Re: What price for peace?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 23:09:16 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.183005.20101@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>In article <1992Jul16.001424.25704@colorado.edu> perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) writes:
>>In article <1992Jul15.140145.7095@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>>>In article <1992Jul13.181203.22672@colorado.edu> perlman@qso.Colorado.EDU (Eric S. Perlman) writes:
>>>>In article <1992Jul13.150134.1254@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>>>>>In article <1992Jul9.002121.16998@wpi.WPI.EDU> nyh@pitt.WPI.EDU (Nevo Y Hed) writes:
>>>>>>In article <1992Jul08.161142.10287@ncrcae.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM> nabil@ncrcol.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Nabil Idriss) writes:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I agree with you here, but you have to keep in mind that the occupier
>>>>>>>does not have the right to occupy in the first place.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>In your last paragraph you did recognize the actions that lead to the
>>>>>>occupation/annexation.  Israel had the right to annex Jerusalem under
>>>>>>the said conditions [regardless of the 67 war].  Now add to that the
>>>>>>67 war that was clearly and intentionally provoked by Egypt and
>>>>>>followed by the joining of Syria and Jordan[?] that had no deal in
>>>>>>that war.  It was a Israeli Egyptian story and I could care less about
>>>>>>agreements between them.  Why didn't we have the right to annex?  We
>>>>>>had every right to annex Jerusalem.  We also had the right to annex
>>>>>>todays OTs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>	-Nevo
>>>>>>-- 
>>>>>>Nevo Y.	 Hed              nyh@wpi.wpi.edu
>>>>>>++1-508-754-2491          CS student, Worcester Polytechnic Institute.
>>>>>>did you know that not all you know is true?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>OK Nevo, you want to go back in history? that is fine. The 1967 war was 
>>>>>a result of the 1948 war that forced Palestinians to flee their homes.
>>>>
>>>>Considering that the 1948 war was aggression by the Arab countries
>>>>bordering Israel, this clearly puts the fault on them for the 1967 war
>>>>as well.  
>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>
>>>I think you know better than saying that. In 1948? 
>>
>>Yes, in 1948.  The war was in no way aggression by the nascent Jewish
>>state.  Consider, for example, who was the prime "resistance" leader of the
>>Palestinians - Hajj Amin al-Husseini, a known Nazi collaborator during
>>WWII, and one who used similar rhetoric in his speeches often.  His
>>cadres moved starting almost the day the partition agreement was
>>announced, and months before it took effect, to prevent its taking
>>effect.  When neighboring Arab countries entered the war, it was with
>>the express purpose of "pushing the Jews into the Sea." 
>>
>>I don't blame Palestinians at large for al-Husseini - the man was a
>>dictator and a tyrant, who by the mid 1930s had eliminated most of his
>>opposition, and may not have been too popular.  But in a war, what so
>>often matters most is who has the guns.   And he most certainly did
>>that.
>>
>
>I don't care what Hajj Amin was. All I know is that the Palestinians at
>that time were opposed to establishing a Jewish state. I think Jews would
>have done the same thing if they were majority at that time.

But the fact is, they didn't.  Further, Jews were a majority in the area
allotted to the Jewish state.  Third, the approach you mention above
solves no problems.  Transfer it over now to Yugoslavia.  There are more
Serbs than any other nationality in ex-Yugoslavia, but the Croatians and
the Bosnians want to form their own country.  By your logic, above,
since Serbia doesn't want to have this happen, they have the right to
prevent it.   In other words, no matter how many have died needlessly in
that war, no matter how brutal, Serbia can only be on the side of right
since they are in the majority.  To that, I say poppycock.  Finally, you
might not care what Hajj Amin was, but to Jews then and now, with the
memory of the Holocaust only three years before 1948, it makes a *huge*
difference.  Also, given that he eliminated a lot of his enemies among
the Arab community, it made a great deal of difference to Palestinians
of the time as well, though not in the same way.


-- 
"How sad to see/A model of decorum and tranquillity/become like any other sport
A battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee." -Tim Rice,"Chess"
     Eric S. Perlman  <perlman@qso.colorado.edu> or <eric@lyra.Colorado.EDU> 
  Center for Astrophysics and Space Astronomy, University of Colorado, Boulder