HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ccadeff@sadeff.vislab.olemiss.edu (Sergio Adeff)
Subject: Re: Los nin~os que hablan esperanto
Organization: Mississippi State University
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 23:08:34 GMT


Se afirmo en el curso de la discusion de este tema, que el esperanto nunca
puede ser un idioma natural porque es un hibrido o mezcla de otros idiomas.
Nunca se ha hecho el experimento, supongo, pero si una pareja que habla
esperanto estuviera dispuesta a criar un hijo o hija hablando delante de
el o ella solamente en esperanto al menos hasta cierta edad, para este
ni~o o ni~a el esperanto seria el lenguage "natural" con la misma intensidad
que los demas podemos definir nuestro idioma "natural".


-- 
-- Sergio E. Adeff, Ph.D., Professor of Engineering & Supercomputer Consultant  
-- The University of Mississippi      Phone: 601-232-7206    FAX: 601-232-7180
-- 107 Powers Hall                    Internet: ccAdeff@Crayx.MCSR.OleMiss.Edu 
-- University, MS 38677, U.S.A.       ________________________________________
From: rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo)
Subject: Re: Homophobia: US vs. CUBA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Date: 11 Jan 93 17:41:23 GMT

In article <C0JL98.BEC@fig.citib.com> glp@fig.citib.com (Greg Parkinson) writes:
>
>In article <2B4C706C.23805@news.service.uci.edu>, rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:
	
>
>So then gay children should be placed with gay people?
>

 Maybe, but who and how to determine if a child is gay could be tricky I guess.
--
Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million
Office of Academic Computing. Cubans who look around us in terror"
UC, Irvine.                 from the open letter to Castro by M.E. Cruz-Varela

Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Internet in Argentina??
Distribution: world
Organization: Learned Information (Europe) Ltd.
Reply-To: ashley@chaz.demon.co.uk
X-Mailer: Simple NEWS 1.90 (ka9q DIS 1.19)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 09:41:40 +0000


-- 
*****************************************************************************
*                          - Charles Ashley -                               *
*    Internet:   ashley@chaz.demon.co.uk        Learned Information Ltd.    *
*    CompuServe: 71333,624                      tel: +44 (0)71-278-3414     *
*****************************************************************************
From: guay@fraser.sfu.ca (Tim Guay)
Subject: mail lists
Summary: mail lists
Keywords: mail lists
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:42:34 GMT

Hi, I'm looking for any mail lists on Latin America that I can subscribe to.

Thanks
	Tim
	guay@sfu.ca
From: aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas)
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Organization: University of Maryland, College Park
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 04:06:57 GMT

In article <2B48D594.1427@news.service.uci.edu> rravelo@asturias.acs.uci.edu (Ray Ravelo) writes:

> que no. Lo que sea. Lo que creo es que decir que la mayoria de los judios
> son socialistas o marxistas es un poco como darle la razon a los anti-semitas
> de Hitler y los "pemiat"(?) rusos de ahora que acusan a los judios del desastre
> ocurrido en la antigua Union Sovietica en los ultimos 70 an~os!

No creo que nadie haya dicho que la mayoria de judios son marxistas o
socialistas. Hasta ahora, lo unico que se dijo es que existen judios 
seculares.

> 
> Yo creo que los judios son como todos los demas grupos etnicos, unos son
> socialistas, otros marxistas y otros, -como muchos judios cubanos que conozco
> son conservadores y anti-comunistas como yo! 

Totalmente de acuerdo. 
"Hay de todo en la vi~a del se~or". 



>
>--
>Ray I. Ravelo                "We're your opposition, Mr. Castro, we 10 million




         ______                ______            _________
        /_____/\              /_____/\          /________/\
       /      \ \            /      \ \        |   ____  \ \
      /   /\   \ \          /   /\   \ \       |  | |__\  \/
     /   /__\   \ \        /   /__\   \ \      |  |/___/  /
    /     __     \ \      /     __     \ \     |    _____/
   /_____/  \_____\/     /_____/  \_____\/     |___|/
   
       aap@wam.umd.edu
From: ib19@vaxb.acs.unt.edu
Subject:     Pregunta de Julio sobre Fujimori
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 04:53:44 GMT



	Con respecto a la pregunta de Julio sobre la popularidad de 
Fujimori. Es verdad que su popularidad ERA MUY ELEVADA. En la
actualidad, despues de varios meses de su 'auto-golpe', a juzgar
por los resultados de las ultimas elecciones, esa popularidad ha
ido menguando.

	Aun asi consiguio mayoria absoluta en las elecciones pasadas.
Claro que los mayores partidos la boicotearon, pero parece que el
porcentaje de votos nulos y la cantidad de ausencia, aunque grande (me
parece recordar 20%) no indica mucho - en mi opinion.

	El fenomeno de Fujimori en el Peru no es tanto de apoyo a el, 
sino (tal como Perot en EE.UU.) que el pueblo peruano, cansado de los
politicos tradicionales, se congrego alrededor de su persona con la
esperanza de algo nuevo.  Todos los partidos que se presentaron a las
elecciones en que Fujimori gano, no representaban cambio alguno.

	Con esa popularidad Fujimori realizo el 'auto-golpe' de hace
unos meses. Y el pueblo lo apoyo, porque eran ellos quienes mejor veian la
corrupcion existente y la tremenda distancia entre gobernantes y 
gobernados. Durante estos meses de espera, el pueblo - con memoria
siempre muy corta - sigue esperando y asi gastando sus esperanzas.
Entonces no es de sorprenderse que la popularidad de Fujimori haya bajado.

	Guillermo
From: ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: CIA Agent on Che's Assassination
Date: 5 Jan 93 17:30:21 GMT
Organization: Computing Services, UC Davis

BOOMERANG

The NY Transfer News Collective writes:

>excerpted from...

>         Nicaragua Solidarity Network of Greater New York
[...]

>CIA AGENT DESCRIBES GUEVARA EXECUTION

>the Bolivian military
>caught the Argentine-born Cuban revolutionary and ordered
>Rodriguez to execute the prisoner. According to Rodriguez,
>Guevara was a broken man, wounded and looking "like a beggar,"
>but retaining "firmness and dignity." Rodriguez says he told
>Guevara: "Comandante, I'm sorry. I've tried to save your life,
>but the orders of the Bolivian high command are that we execute
>you." Guevara turned pale, Rodriguez goes on, but then became
>very calm and said: "It's better that way. I never ought to have
>been taken alive."

This is exactly what "Che" was doing with Cuban peseants in the Sierra 
Maestra, simply for suspecting they were collaborating with the army.  In one 
occasion "Che" shot a member of his own platoon for being caugth smoking during 
a blackout.  "Che" himself shot him point blank (without a trial or anything of 
the sort) alleging that it was necessary to maintain discipline in the ranks.
Ironically history dealt the assasin the same deck of cards.

Edelmiro
From: wombat@physics.Berkeley.EDU (Gene P. Ledbetter)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: re: derechos humanos en EEUU
Date: 12 Jan 1993 12:20:57 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

Dice Enrique Cortes-Rello:

>> Si vivieras mas cerca de Arizona, te invitaria a tomar
>> unas buenas cervecitas Mexicanas para platicar y
>> convencerte de que todos los Latinoamericanos somos
>> hermanos (incluyendo los Puertorriquen~os).

Dice Edelmiro:

> Dos X o Tecate estarian bien, junto con unas buenas
> chimichangas de puerco. Alli te podria convencer de que
> todos los latinoamericanos somos hermanastros que solo
> tenemos la lengua y el pinchi catolicismo en comun.   Y
> claro, como somos buenos hijos de la chingada madrastra
> patria, los boricuas nos fuimos al norte y nos casamos con
> una gringota.  Ya tenemos casi 100 an~os de matrimonio y
> nos va muy bien.

Digo yo:

No necesito nada mas que un _Bohemia_, gracias, y no quiero 
convencerles de nada en el mundo, excepto de que es esta la 
mejor cerveza de todas.

Gene
From: julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human rights in the USA.
Keywords: USA
Date: 8 Jan 93 22:13:31 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <43169@sdcc12.ucsd.edu>, robarr@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Robert O'Barr) writes:

> 
> Julio, let me see if I understand your explanation. You think Haitians
> risk their very lives coming to the US because they seek wealth?
> This is the official position of the Bush administration; that since
> they are economic immigrants, they have no right to any special
> considerations (i.e. they must apply and be placed on a waiting list
> just like the mexicans, chileans, argentines, etc.)
> 

	I haven't seen any good report on the situation in Haiti. I
	know it's bad. It's clear they are trying to get out of there.
	There is something bad in Haiti. I don't think people risks
	their lives just to be "free" in an esoterical way, though.
	I think they must be escaping their hopelessness. I don't agree
	with Bush who is being hypocritical and coy. I don't think
	all of them are persecuted for political reasons but I believe
	all of them have the right to a refugee status while the legitimate
	goverment of Aristide is put back in full control of Haiti.

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Julio , U of Penn, Philadelphia 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: rb9a@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (Raul Baragiola)
Subject: Re: Homophobia: US vs. CUBA
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 23:52:02 GMT

In article <C0pBCD.Hqv@fig.citib.com> glp@fig.citib.com (Greg Parkinson) writes:
>
>In article <1993Jan10.041730.25272@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>, rb9a@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (Raul  Baragiola) writes:
>
>|> I would expect major problems when the child reached adolescence, not
>|> only to the absence of the parent of one sex, but also due to the reaction
>|> of other kids. 
>
>My friend Raul was teased for not speaking English
>when his parents came to the States.  Using your logic,
>they shouldn't have come here.

Thanks, but that is not my logic. Yours, maybe? When getting my quote
out of contest you lost that it was answering your:

>Studies show that children being raised by homosexual parents don't
>suffer from anything that other children don't suffer from.

I also asked you about those studies. I am interesting in learning
especifaclly about how many samples there were, for how long were the
children followed, etc.  I am very skeptic.     

>|> A third problem I suspect: isn't the lifetime of homosexual
>|> relations very short -a few years? 

>Another stereotype.  Heterosexual unions and gay male
>unions tend to last about the same amount of time on
>average, with lesbian relationships a bit shorter.
>
>|> If so, what would be the effect on the
>|> children?
>
>If this is a worry for you, you should look first
>at the vast numbers of divorced heterosexuals with
>children, or the huge numbers of girls who pop out
>unwanted babies.  

A non sequitur. We have all looked first at the problem of the
effect of divorced parents on children. That nothing is done to
solve or mitigate this problem does not mean we should accept this
without questioning. 

>It's clear that children who are
>raised by parents who want them and can care for them
>are better off - no matter what the genders of their
>parents.  

I agree up to the dash.  The "no matter what the gender" is not
clear in the least.  It is easy to argue the other way. Take two
couples, one heterosexual and one homosexual. Assume their intrinsic
qualities are the same, same sorts of defects and virtues. The child
growing in the homosexual family will not be exposed to an incomplete
education, since it is (this time clearly) known that fathers and mothers
each contribute to different aspects of their education, determined by
the differences between sexes. 

Raul
From: julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Date: 5 Jan 93 23:13:44 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

> 
> In my face?  We just happened to pass civil rights legislation to protect 
> homosexuals (which by the way are the most affluent minority in the nation) 
> from discrimination in California, 
>
> Edelmiro


	You mean in Colorado ?  In case the reader doesn't know it,
	Colorado passed legislation that impedes Gay-Lesbians legal 
	protection. By the way, your statement about their affluency
	should be backed by a reference, otherwise it sounds like
	anti-semitic Nazi propaganda, watch out for slips of tongue !


-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Julio , U of Penn, Philadelphia 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: rb9a@kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU (Raul  Baragiola)
Subject: Re: Equal protection under the law (was Homophobia: US vs. CUBA)
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 04:29:37 GMT

In article <21124@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu writes:
>Raul Baragiola writes:
>
>>In article <21047@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> ez000281@hamlet.ucdavis.edu writes:
>[...]
>
>>>the Colorado propostion, for in our county, unlike Argentina perhaps,we have
>>>a amendment in our Bill or rights which GUARANTEES "equal protection under
>>>the law", I believe its the 14th amendment.
>
>>That is a fantasy, nobody GUARANTEES that. At most, it is a statement of
>>goals. One can see daily that the protection under the law depends on
>>how much lawyer your money can buy (among other things).
>
>Of course nobody guarantees anything to anybody in our system.  You have an 
>obligation to stand for your rights.  We don't have paternal dictators patting 
>our backs every minute to to this or that.  It all depends whether you know the 
>rights you have been endowed with and whether you are willing to stand up for 
>them when someone tramples over them.  Fortunately we have that piece of paper 
>which James Madison attached onto our Constitution, further amended after the 
>Civil War, which states that we are all equal under the law.  In Cuba you don't 
>even have this clause, and what's worse, you don't even have access to an 
>attorney in one day trials where executions are carried out a the next morning. 
>I don't know what you mean by the buying a lawyer that guarantees your rights, 
>since we have more attorneys than any other nation on earth, which every day 
>guarantee equal access to thousands of people.  Perhaps I happen to be an 
>attorney's son who has always been taught to stand for individual rights and 
>personal liberties, while others simply hail the cinics who think there is no 
>justice in our country since it is simply justice for the rich.  When people 
>start telling us that we shouldn't have attorneys in society, and we shouldn't 
>pay them, we should begin to be worried y.  For 
>without attorneys the state can do what it wishes, and this obviously leads to 
>a dictorship, where the only attorneys are those in the state's payroll.  .
>
>Saludos,
>
>Edelmiro

Slow down, you got carried away! Did I say that Cuba is better? Did I say that
we shouldn't have attorneys? I just said that the statement that rights are
guaranteed is a fantasy. A nice fantasy, but a fantasy. An even though we
may be more protected in iour rights that in most other places on earth,
you cannot deny that you have better chances to defend your rights the
better the lawyer -other things being equal. An the best lawyers are the
most expensive, and thus only accessible by the richer people - with some
minor exceptions.

Saludos,

Raul
From: robarr@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Robert O'Barr)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human rights in the USA.
Keywords: USA
Date: 12 Jan 93 03:46:26 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of California, San Diego

In article <104097@netnews.upenn.edu> julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez) writes:
 >	they choose the USA over Mexico". The question of why do they leave
 >	Haiti I think is "because they are hopeless. After all the struggle
 >	to reach democracy, a bunch of gorillas takes control and the 
 >	international community does little."  
 >
 >	Now my question. What are the requisites to be granted entry
 >	as an "economy refugee" ?

Julio,

I think currently, the requirement is wait in line.  We do let quite
a number into the country legally each year but the US is certainly
under no obligation legally or morally to let in everyone looking to
get rich quick.

Robert
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
From: ib19@vaxb.acs.unt.edu
Subject: No me defiendas compadre...
Organization: University of North Texas
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 04:51:00 GMT

Edelmiro,
	Por lo mucho que mencionas a Cuba en tus notas me imagino que debes
tenerla muy dentro de ti. Eres tal vez descendiente de cubano(a)s, o naciste
en la isla?  Te conozco de lo que escribes y desde no hace mucho, pero me he
dado un poco de idea de cuales son las tuyas. Por lo menos con respecto de
Cuba, Castro, los comunistas...

	Respeto tus ideas, aunque muchas veces no las comparto. Pero otras
veces si. Esta es la descripcion perfecta de mi reaccion a tus comentarios
acerca del Peru. Un consejo:  Ten cuidado porque estas pisando brasas. Las
brasas son tus palabras. Que aquellos que como yo, que hemos nacido y 
vivido en el Peru, y tenemos contacto mas cercano que el que tu pudieras 
tener, comprendemos un poco mejor las cosas que estan ocurriendo por alla.

	Esta bien que tengas amigos que te digan cosas y que leas articulos
y libros al respecto. Dinos que has estado alla, y los peruanos te creeremos
mas. Claro que vas a tener que explicar que hacias cuando estabas por esas
tierras y te preguntaremos con detalles. Pero en tanto que tus comentarios
solo esten basados en terceras personas o en oidas, pero no en experiencias,
es como decimos por alla.  Y tambien lo decimos por aca:

	POR FAVOR, COMPRADRE, NO ME DEFIENDAS!

	Guillermo, y tengo el orgullo de ser peruano...
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Cuba/Drug Trade
From: lcornel@eis.calstate.edu (Louis Cornelio)
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 01:52:20 GMT
Organization: Calif State Univ/Electronic Information Services

of course, we can just continue waiting for Fidel to die of
old age, like Franco..........
From: nicanet@nyxfer.UUCP
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Puerto Rico News Update 1/3/93
Date: 4 Jan 93 22:27:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:aiBVwB24w165w@nyxfer.uucp:-1132118974:000:2573
Nf-From: nyxfer.uucp!nicanet    Jan  4 14:27:00 1993


Subject: Puerto Rico News Update 1/3/93
From: nyxfer!nicanet (NicaNet NY)


Via NY Transfer News Collective * All the News that Doesn't Fit

excerpted from...

         Nicaragua Solidarity Network of Greater New York
       339 Lafayette St., New York, NY 10012 (212) 674-9499

             Weekly News Update #153, January 3, 1993


PUERTO RICO NEWS

Puerto Rican Senate president Miguel Hernandez Agosto--left
without a quorum for several consecutive sessions--issued an
arrest order against absent legislators to oblige them to
participate in the parliamentary sessions. New Progressive Party
(PNP) legislators countered with a court interdiction paralyzing
the arrest orders, alleging that the Senate president does not
have the authority to issue such orders. [ED-LP 12/15/92] The PNP
legislators are boycotting the sessions, saying that the PPD,
which was defeated by the PNP in Puerto Rico's Nov. 3 elections,
is trying to use the Senate to make last-minute nominations. [ED-
LP 12/18/92].

Following a federal investigation, Puerto Rico's Electrical Energy
Authority (AEE) has received a $30 million fine from the US
Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) for serious violations of
environmental law. Anonymous sources cited by reporters indicate
that the AEE and the US Department of Justice are negotiating the
pollution situation and the payment of the fine. [ED-LP 12/21/92].

New Puerto Rico governor Pedro Rossello is continuing to fill
positions for his new administration; he has named Hector M.
Pesquera as the first Puerto Rican ever to head the FBI in Puerto
Rico, and is said to be considering naming FBI agent Pedro Toledo
to head the national police. Toledo would be the first federal
agent to head Puerto Rico's police. [ED-LP 12/21/92] 


                               -30-

These updates are published weekly. A one-year subscription is
$25. Back issues and source materials are available on request.
(Many of our source materials are accessed through NY Transfer;
back issues are also available on NY Transfer's OnLine Library.)
Feel free to reproduce these updates or reprint any information
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From: dgt@phy.duke.edu (Dinko Eduardo Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Gay and Lesbian Affirmative Action
Date: 8 Jan 93 19:33:47 GMT
Organization: Duke University Physics Dept.; Durham, N.C.

Hey, you people!  Wake up!  This is not the place to discuss the rights
of homosexuals in the USA.  This is soc.culture.latin-america!  Please
take this little verbal war somewhere else.            
-- 
Dinko Gonzalez Trotter
dgt@phy.duke.edu
From: julio@upenn5.hep.upenn.edu (Julio Gonzalez)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.latin-america
Subject: Re: Human Rights in Cuba
Date: 6 Jan 93 00:18:44 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

> >Mi comentario sobre los cubanos que estan aca no tiene nada que ver con
> >que yo sea o no comminista/simpatizante de Castro.
> >Pareciera que el mundo se divide entre aquellos que estan de tu lado, y 
> >los que no estan de tu lado, que por definicion son comunistas/simpatizantes
> >de Castro.

	Una division mas detallada es:

	1) Pro-Castrista: cualquiera que no piensa Cuba es el
	peor pais en el mundo. A estos se les aplica la pena
	de muerte previa tortura.

	2) Traidor: Anti-Castrista por el dialogo, a estos se les ataca
	con bombas. Solo se matan algunos para asustarlos un 
	poco. ( Esto fue publicado en el Inquirer, un periodico
	"main stream" ).

	3) Freedom fighter: proponen la invasion de la Isla por
	los "USA marines". Ellos recibiran todos los favores economicos
	despues de que Castro sea asesinado. No importa quien lo
	asesine, la mafia o la CIA.

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Julio , U of Penn, Philadelphia 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------