HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: knudsen@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (michael.j.knudsen)
Subject: Re: Unsubscribing???Why??
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 01:13:37 GMT

In article <1993Jan15.214353.22443@gibdo.engr.washington.edu>, tvp@gibdo.engr.washington.edu (Tad Perry) writes:

> So, what's the case of "boku", eh? You know that's a difficult
> question. Supposed universal grammar says *every* noun must have case.
> I'd vote nominative case with "nihongo ga ii" as a predicate. Weird,
> huh? But that's the way I see it. Or we posit some kind of "topical"
> case and start reworking the grammar. There are reasons why doing
> the latter may be preferrable.

I'd have to go along with the latter for Nihongo.
The example sentence maybe didn't use "wa", but clearly the standard
set of cases for Western languages requires some sort of "topical" case
addition to handle nouns/pronouns preceding "wa."
There are plenty of beginner's sentences with both "wa" and "ga"
noun phrases; trying to stick both of them in the nominative case
can't be right.

Trying to force Japanese syntax into Western grammatical molds is unfair
both to the Japanese culture and to us poor slobs trying to learn it.

BTW, my favorite translation of "wa" is "-wise", as in
"boku-wa sushi ga ski desu" ==> "Me-wise, sushi is good."
I guess it was back in the 60s that ad-agency jargon ran "-wise"
into the ground so much that the English pundits condemned it.

--Mike Knudsen ( a lousy name for katakana)
-- 
	"I don't think so, Al"
	knudsen@iexist.att.com
From: jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: Re: Sorting Japanesey
Date: 24 Jan 93 02:32:56 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

In article <1993Jan23.204214.29441@netcom.com>, kschwarz@netcom.com (Kenneth L. Schwarz) writes:
> Does anyone know how sorts are implemented on lists of Japanese words?
> For example, let's say we have a database with 10 fields per record, and
> these records contain Roman characters, kanji, or kana, or any combination
> thereof.  If we want to be able to sort this database with any of
> the fields as 
> the sort key, what do we do?

Ken, and anyone else interested should pop over to comp.std.internat
where just this discussion (seems to be getting more heated everytime
I read it so maybe argument... :).
--
jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
James Miller
From: xepo@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Scott R Violet)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: FAQ?  Or where to find Nemacs
Date: 24 Jan 93 20:08:29 GMT
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4
Originator: xepo@csd4.csd.uwm.edu


HI,
	Just wondering if there is a FAQ for this group?  And if not,
could some one point to a server that has Nemacs.
Doomo,
-- 

		-Scott Violet (xepo@csd4.csd.uwm.edu)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: pcm@scammell.ecos.tne.oz.au (Peter Murray)
Subject: TrueType Fonts?
Organization: Telecom
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 02:39:42 GMT


I hope this question hasn't been asked too many times
before in this group.  Are there any Japanese TrueType 
fonts available via ftp?  Thanks.

+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Peter C. Murray		    | pcm@scammell.ecos.tne.oz.au	|	
| Telecom Mobiles 		    |					|
| Information Technology Development|  					|
| Information Technology Group	    | 					|
| Telecom Australia		    |					|
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: akiy@siva.cs.titech.ac.jp (Akiyama Jun)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: Re: On Tienanmen Square (was <none>)
Date: 28 Jan 93 08:34:53 GMT
Reply-To: akiy@cs.titech.ac.jp
Organization: Tokyo Institute of Tech., Dept. of Computer Science, Japan

(James Massey) asks:
> If I want to say "don't forget Tienanmen Square", is it "Tenanmon wa
> oboenachatta ikemasen" or "oboenakucha"?

I'd probably say:

	Tienanmen wo wasuretewa ikemasen.

This phrase would also connotate a warning (kind of like "Remember the
Alamo") to the listener/reader.

As for your phrases,

      *	(1) T. wo oboenachatta ikemasen.
	       ^^
	(2) T. wo oboenakucha ikemasen.
               ^^
I would mark (1) as being ungrammatical, while (2) seems quite
awkward.  Note that the 'wa' subject marker is supposed to be the 'wo'
object marker.  

It seems you're using sentence (1) in the same manner as:

	(3) Gohan wo tabechattara ikemasen.
			       ^^
   which would translate loosely to:

	(3t) Don't eat the meal/dinner/rice.

   and more specifically to:

	(3t.2) It would not be correct, if you/he/she/etc were to eat
	       the meal/dinner/rice/etc.

On the other hand, (2) translates loosely to:
	
	(2t) I must memorize T.

which would seem strange, as the sentence sort of means that you have
to go and memorize by rote (as in a multiplication table or a
vocabulary list) the events at Tienamen.  It would be analogous to (2)
to say something like:

	(4) Minna no namae wo oboenakucha ikemasen.

which would be loosely translated to:
	
	(4t) I must go and memorize everyone's name.


Hope that helps.  I apologize for all this babble just for a simple
question like the above, but working on Prolog for several hours can
certainly make a person babble.

Note: please don't hesitate to correct me on any of the above points.
      I'm open to criticisms.

 	Jun



--
           akiy@cs.titech.ac.jp|Amiga/Mac/IBM/NeXT/NEC (ugh)/Unix-box User   
UCLA undergrad, studying abroad|"False ideas may be refuted indeed by argument,
  Tokyo Institute of Technology| but by true ideas alone are they expelled."
    Natural Language Processing| ---John Henry Newman, _Apologia Pro Vita Sua_
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: asano@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (Yoshiteru ASANO)
Subject: is this group about Japanese language or what?
Summary: complaining about so many questions not related to Japanese per se
Keywords: claims on thie newgroup
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 16:27:59 GMT

I noticed that there are so many articles on computer-related matters in this
newsgroup.  Is this the original purpose of the group?  I thought this group
is to talk about "Japanese language", about its grammar and other 'linguistic'
aspects of Japanese.  Am I wrong?  Is there any other newsgroup appropriate
for talking about Japanese-related computer affairs?
     y.a.

Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: cmr@world.std.com (Charles M Richmond)
Subject: Re: FAQ: word lists available ?
Organization: Integrated International Systems Corp. One Longfellow Place, Suite 3309, Boston, Ma.
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 18:58:42 GMT

I have used the following at one time or another. Note the entries where the
romanji is the same although the kanji is not.  Corrections welcomed!

Charlie

ue		up
shita		below
		tongue
jikan		time
te		hand
yubi		finger
ie		house
ki		tree
umi		ocean
taiyo		sun
hikouki		airplane
daidokoro	kitchen
ofuro		bath
kawa		river
		leather/skin
hashi		edge
		bridge
		chopsticks
tsukue		desk
haru		Spring
natsu		Summer
aki		Fall
fuyu		Winter
onsen		hot spring
e		picture/painting
yu		hot water
shachou		president/boss
kaisha		company
kaishajin	office worker
shougakkou	elementary school
chuugakkou	secondary school
daigaku		University
koppu		grass
eki		station
honbako		bookcase
yuka		floor
yuki		snow
kaze		wind
kumo		cloud
		spider
inu		dog
niwa		garden
kaminoke (ke)   hair on head
ame		rain
		candy
mori		forest
samui		cold
atsui		hot
satou		sugar
shio		salt
byouin		hospital
jinja		shrine
tera		temple
udedokei	wrist watch
kakedokei	wall clock
me		eye
mimi		ear
kuchi		mouth
ha		teeth
hige		mustache
agohige		beard
mayuge		eyebrow
matsuge		eyelash
kuchibiru	lip
kuchi		mouth
hana		nose
		flower
-- 
*****************************************************************************
*  Charles Richmond 	Integrated International Systems Corporation        *
*  cmr@world.std.com	(Temporary) cmr@koneko.shr.dec.com		    *
*  Specializing in UNIX, X, Image Processing, and Communications.           *
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: prener@watson.ibm.com (Dan Prener)
Subject: Re: Sorting Japanese
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1993 06:56:43 GMT
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center, Hawthorne, New York

In article <1993Jan23.204214.29441@netcom.com> kschwarz@netcom.com (Kenneth L. Schwarz) writes:

> Does anyone know how sorts are implemented on lists of Japanese words?
> For example, let's say we have a database with 10 fields per record, and
> these records contain Roman characters, kanji, or kana, or any combination
> thereof.  If we want to be able to sort this database with any of the fields as
> the sort key, what do we do?

> I know that in Japan telephone books are sorted by aiueo jun (that is, by the
> phonetic order of a kana matrix.)  And CDs are sorted in a similar way
> in record stores.  So it seems likely that a phonetic sort is the most 
> useful organization for human's to deal with.

> But that would not be so for computers.  Sorting kanji by stroke count is
> easy:  there is one and only one stroke count for any particular glyph.
> But to do a phonetic sort would require that the algorithm recognize the
> particular reading of the character in context.  This is a bear of a
> problem.

> Still, there must be ways that Japanese databases handle such problems.
> Anybody know how it's done?

If there are no external requirements imposed upon the definition of your
sort, why not sort by the underlying binary representation of the kanji.

(Then all you have to worry about is big-endian vs. little-endian
representation of integers.)
--
                                   Dan Prener (prener@watson.ibm.com)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: sekii@mail.ast.cam.ac.uk (Takashi Sekii)
Subject: Re: What word is this??
Organization: Institute of Astronomy, Cambridge
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 18:21:09 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.220407.25507@Csli.Stanford.EDU>, hiraga@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Yuzuru Hiraga) writes:
|> In article <1993Jan26.202040.25821@wam.umd.edu> rsrodger@wam.umd.edu (Yamanari) writes:
|> >	In Kawabata's Sho no syousetu (palm of hand stories)
|> >	in the story "Natu to Huyu" on page 3 there is a word,
|> >	"haehairazu" (with the characters for hae "fly" (the insect)
|> >	and "hairu" (enters)).  Is this a screen door?
|> 
|> Not knowing the original, the best I can guess is that it should
|> be read as "hae-irazu"; and identical to what is more commonly
|> known as "hae-tori-gami".
|> Haetorigami is a roll of paper hung from the ceiling, with
|> sticky substance (and possibly some attractor substance) on both
|> sides so that a fly that touches it gest caught.
|> After a few days with a number of flies on it, it's quite an ugly sight.
|> I don't think you can find them much nowadays.
|> 
|> By the way, "neko-irazu" is the name of anti-rat pesticide tablets.
|> Literally, this means "cats not needed".
|> If my above supposition is correct, note the asymmetry in the naming --
|> here, it is flies that need get rid of.

Well, no asymmetry, I'm afraid. As you say, "irazu" of "neko-irazu"
is derived from verb "iru"(need), while "irazu" of "hae-irazu"
is derived from another verb "iru"(enter) as original poster indicates.

-- 

Takashi
------------------------------------------------------------------
Takashi Sekii                Institute of Astronomy
sekii@mail.ast.cam.ac.uk     Madingley Road, Cambridge CB3 0HA, UK
------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: <None>
Date: 25 Jan 93 12:54:42 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services
Summary: Sorting issues and Kanji phonetic reading recognition

I'm still formulating structures for a JIS compatable word processor
and am curious how others have handled recognition of compounds
phonetically in the sorting context.  (huh?)  What I mean is when
given a jukugo compound what strategies have proved most effective for
recognizing the compound phonetically?  I'm stumped.  I've considered
using a resource file containing individual characters with possible
phonetic readings then hashing the possible kun-yomi's using another
resource file, but this and other combinations don't seem to be very
fast or efficient storage wise.

Don't you wish there was some magic hash table; kind of reminds me of
the movie "Sneakers" and their 'magic box' decoder. :)
-- 
jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
James Miller

_chicchai .sig no ho ga ichiban iin janai ka..._
             Enlightenment Happens?
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: p1828@npratk.nire.go.jp (tanaka.atsuko)
Subject: Re: What word is this??
Keywords: hae hairaza
Organization: National Institute for Resources and Environment, AIST, Tsukuba, Japan
Distribution: us
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 00:56:40 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.202040.25821@wam.umd.edu> rsrodger@wam.umd.edu (Yamanari) writes:
>
>	In Kawabata's Sho no syousetu (palm of hand stories)
>	in the story "Natu to Huyu" on page 3 there is a word,
>	"haehairazu" (with the characters for hae "fly" (the insect)
>	and "hairu" (enters)).  Is this a screen door?
>
>	I've checked Nelsons, and others--but no luck.  Anyone?
>
>
>-- 
>Attempts to lessen the burden of proof in rape | Why not put me in your kill
>trials are violent assaults on civil rights.   | file?  add: "/: rsrodger/h :j"
>  =====boycott=is=coercion=is=censorship=is=closed minded=is=cowardice=====
>Pyramid schemes are illegal unless you're the US government.| Evolution works.


I haven't met the word "haehairazu".
I consulted my Japanese dictionary, KO^DAN-SHA's NIHONGO-DAI-JITEN,
but there is no discription of "hae hairazu".  
I wonder, whether the reading of "har hairazu" is correct?  

I think "hae hairazu" should be a local term.  From the word 
'hae hairazu', I imazined a fly-net cupboard or fly-net.

If there are no Kanji, I can read in two way...
"hae ha irazu" = I don't need a fly.
"hae hairazu" = A fly will not enter.

cf. screen door = AMI-DO, AMI means 'mesh' and DO(=TO) means 'door'.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Ms. Tanaka,Atsuko                           tanaka@npratk.nire.go.jp
    Safety Engineering Dept.
    NIRE   --National Institute for Resources and Environment--
    16-3 Onogawa, Tsukuba, 305                 Phone +81,298-58-8574
    JAPAN                                      Fax   +81,298-58-8558 
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: johnf@HQ.Ileaf.COM (John Finlayson)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: Re: Japanese wordprocessor for DOS
Date: 26 Jan 93 19:05:11 GMT
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.

I think the following sites carry these, plus JWP, an impressive effort 
by Stephen Chung (I believe) for MS Windows 3.x:

Site				Directory
----				---------
kilroy.jpl.nasa.gov		pub/misc
ftp.uwtc.washington.edu		pub/Japanese
OAK.Oakland.Edu			editor	
monu6.cc.monash.edu.au		pub/Nihongo
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: mekong%ntuvax.dnet@NTU.BITNET
Subject: Re: OTAKU
Reply-To: NIHONGO@mitvma.mit.edu
Organization: The Internet
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 05:00:19 GMT

>I cannot quite figure out from the posting above what the original
>debate was about, but it is NOT correct to say that there is femininity
>built into the word "OTAKU", whatever 'definition' (currently in use
>as of today) you decide to use.
>
>Perhaps this "someone" you're referring to above heard the word
>incorrectly, as there is a word "OTAFUKU" which refers to a mask
>of woman, whose face is extremely round and nose small. The word also
>refers to women whose faces are noticeably round, just like the
>OTAFUKU mask.
>
>Hope this was of some use to you.
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: truett@netcom.com (Truett Smith)
Subject: Re: What word is this??
Summary: In the tropics, it's called ...
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 08:37:33 GMT

Am I the only one who's been near enough to the tropics to know what a 
"mosquito net" is?  I interpret the phrase "haehairazu wo aketari sita ue ni"
to mean "rearranging the mosquito netting".

Truett Smith

Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: craig@ariel.earth.nwu.edu (Craig R. Bina)
Subject: tsururi kanji query
Originator: craig@ariel.earth.nwu.edu
Organization: Geological Sciences Department, Northwestern University
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 21:23:07 GMT


I have only seen the word "tsururi" (in the sense of "slipping" or
"sliding") written in hiragana.  Are there kanji for this?
       Craig.....
-- 
Craig R. Bina, Asst. Prof.
Dept. of Geological Sci., Northwestern Univ.
Evanston, Illinois, craig@earth.nwu.edu
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: nozomi@YUCCA.CC.TSUKUBA.AC.JP (Ytow)
Subject: (none)
Reply-To: NIHONGO@mitvma.mit.edu
Organization: The Internet
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 08:00:49 GMT

   If I want to say "don't forget Tienanmen Square", is it "Tenanmon wa
   oboenachatta ikemasen" or "oboenakucha"?

It depends on the context.
Most suitable answer is
"Tenanmon wo wasureru na," = Remember Tienanmon.

Nozomi
Xref: sparky sci.lang.japan:5191 fj.kanji:783
From: takikawm@jade.CS.ORST.EDU (TAKIKAWA MASAMI)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan,fj.kanji
Subject: Re: kanji kun-yomi recognition and sorting issues
Date: 25 Jan 93 22:33:18 GMT
Article-I.D.: flop.1k1preINNdiu
Organization: Computer Science Department, Oregon State University
NNTP-Posting-Host: jade.cs.orst.edu

In article <1993Jan25.125721.46740@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>
 jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
> I'm still formulating structures for a JIS compatable word processor
> and am curious how others have handled recognition of compounds
> phonetically in the sorting context.
...
> Don't you wish there was some magic hash table; kind of reminds me of
> the movie "Sneakers" and their 'magic box' decoder. :)

There is a program (filter) called "kakasi" which converts Kanji texts
into Roma-ji or Kana. The source files appeared in fj.sources last year.
The following Kanji text:
  kakasi $@$O$H$F$bJXMx$G$9$M!#$3$&$$$&4A;z2>L>:.$8$jJ8$b$A$c$s$H(J
$@!!JQ49$7$F$/$l$^$9!#(J
can be converted into Roma-ji:
  kakasi hatotemo benri desune . kouiu kanji kana maji ri bun mochanto
 henkan shitekuremasu .

Hope this helps.

Masami
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: kevino@ICHIGO.OS.NASU.TOSHIBA.CO.JP (KevinoNS)
Subject: Re:  inauguration
Reply-To: NIHONGO@mitvma.mit.edu
Organization: The Internet
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1993 01:59:41 GMT

> Well, a friend of mine saw a videotape of the inauguration and she found
> Rie in the crowd.  This friend of mine studies Japanese and she's seen a lot
 of
> recent Japanese magazines so this information is pretty trustworthy.

> 	I just wonder what Rie thought she was doing there.  Since her mother

Yep, she was there.  One of the TV stations in Japan sent her over as
one of their commentators.  Considering the extravaganza that the
inauguration has become, sending an entertainer to cover it is perhaps
not as incongruous as you might think :-)  Although it also says
something about the way TV news is done in Japan as well.

Til Later,
  Kevin

 -------------------------------------------------------------------
| Kevin O'Donnell           |                                       |
| Nuclear Medicine          | ' You cannot achieve the impossible   |
| Nasu Works                |   without attempting the absurd. '    |
| Toshiba Corp. Japan       |                                       |
| kevino@nasu.toshiba.co.jp |                                       |
 -------------------------------------------------------------------
 Disclaimer: Any opinions expressed are mine, not Toshiba's.
Xref: sparky sci.lang.japan:5190 fj.kanji:780
From: jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan,fj.kanji
Subject: kanji kun-yomi recognition and sorting issues
Date: 25 Jan 93 12:57:21 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

 I'm still formulating structures for a JIS compatable word processor
 and am curious how others have handled recognition of compounds
 phonetically in the sorting context.  (huh?)  What I mean is when
 given a jukugo compound what strategies have proved most effective for
 recognizing the compound phonetically?  I'm stumped.  I've considered
 using a resource file containing individual characters with possible
 phonetic readings then hashing the possible kun-yomi's using another
 resource file, but this and other combinations don't seem to be very
 fast or efficient storage wise.
 
 Don't you wish there was some magic hash table; kind of reminds me of
 the movie "Sneakers" and their 'magic box' decoder. :)
-- 
jamiller@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
James Miller

_chicchai .sig no ho ga ichiban iin janai ka..._
             Enlightenment Happens?
Lines: 36
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 93 11:27:20 MST
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: Re: Converting resume to nihongo
Organization: Brigham Young University, Provo UT USA
Keywords: resume japanese argh
From: luke@newt.ee.byu.edu (David Luke)

In article <1993Jan27.060512.9221@netcom.com> odin@netcom.com (Jon Granrose) writes:

>I'm going to a Japanese career fair in San Francisco in a few weeks.  I'm
>not too excited since I've only been studying for about 3 years and while I
>survived 6 weeks in Japan I'm definitely not fluent.  Apparently, a
>significant percentage of the interviews are being given by people who do
>not speak English.  So I must convert my resume to Japanese and am going to
>get some interview practice with my sensei.

>Anyway, I am looking for samples of english resumes that have been
>converted into Japanese as well.  I am most concerned with the format of
>the resume over the content (assuming it is similar to english resumes).
>Also, if there are any do's or don'ts for resumes in Japan, I'd appreciate
>the information (as might others in this group).

The first thing to remember is that the format is totally different.  
Japanese resumes are done by filling in the blanks on a special resume
form (rireki-sho youshi, or something like that).  They should be filled
in, in Japanese, by hand.  Ideally, you should do an original for each
company, but that's a bit much to ask for a career forum -- copies are
fine for that.

The company sponsoring the forum should have provided a form and instructions
in the materials they sent you.  (Is this Disco?  Ciema?  Selnate?)  If
not, ask the Japanese professors at a local university for a copy.  Are
you in CA?  If so, you might be able to get your hands on forms at a
Kinokuniya-type store.  If you're _really_ desperate, I could mail you
one, I imagine.

Anyway, start by getting the form.  If you have questions after that,
ask.
-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  David Luke                      "There's nothing worse than a brilliant     |
|  luke@wombat.ee.byu.edu           image of a fuzzy concept."                 |
|                                                               -- Ansel Adams |
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
From: IP25208@PORTLAND.BITNET
Subject: Re: forgetting Tianamen Square
Reply-To: NIHONGO@mitvma.mit.edu
Organization: The Internet
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 20:22:56 GMT

     perhaps you should wait until the edginess subsides before you
     a fit over the list - people are only trying to be helpful and it
     help if you showed a little patience

                                       relax and take deep breaths
From: BFLV@MUSICT.MCGILL.CA (BFLV)
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan
Subject: Looking for a Japanese Word Processor !!
Date: 22 Jan 93 01:40:46 GMT
Organization: McGill University

Could anyone out there tell me the ftp addresses from which I can
get a good Japanese word processor ?   ThanX!


                                                M.Y.
Newsgroups: sci.lang.japan