HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jbh55289@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Josh Hopkins)
Subject: Re: What is SSTO? Thoughts on Space.
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 05:41:55 GMT

nsmca@acad3.alaska.edu writes:

>If there is no [m]arket for SSTO, then why is there three contractors??

Right now there is a large surplus of launchers and a shortage of payloads. 
That hasn't stopped people from proposing new vehicles.  If you include paper
studies with little serious potential for succes (which I'm assuming the other
SSTO proposals are) then there are probably several dozen new vehicles being
proposed for a market that doesn't need them.

>If the US Defense can let go some its budget we might be able to get the DC-X
>up, I think the Japanese are working on alot of things, after all the have the
>money.. A combo Gov/Private Corp effort..

The DoD _is_ letting go of a large portion of its budget.  It has however 
already paid for DC-X (which should not be confused with an orbital follow on).

-- 
Josh Hopkins                                          jbh55289@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu

Q:  How do you tell a novice from an expert.
A:  A novice hesitates before doing something stupid.
From: hwt@bcarh11c.BNR.CA (Henry Troup)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Re: Subjective Safety Measure(Re: man-rating)
Date: 22 Jan 93 15:06:47 GMT
Reply-To: Henry.Troup@BNR.CA
Distribution: world
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada

In article <33257@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM>, wats@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM (Bruce
Watson) writes:
|>Contrary to all the movies we've seen, there has never been an elevator
|>fatality since Otis designed the safety features of the modern elevator
|>in the late 19th century.

There have been two in Ottawa, Canada in the last three years.  Neither
involved a falling elevator, however.  Both involved door problems,
people caught in the door and crushed aginst the door frames outside the
elevator.

I see your "never" and raise you two anecdotes.  If you call my bluff,
I'll have to research and give names and dates.  One was in the Lord
Elgin Hotel, the other an apartment building.
                 
Henry Troup - H.Troup@BNR.CA (Canada) - BNR owns but does not share my opinions
			     "I am Salman Rushdie"
From: roberts@cmr.ncsl.nist.gov (John Roberts)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Re: solar sails
Date: 24 Jan 93 01:15:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: cs.C1C3xs.33E.1
Distribution: sci
Organization: National Institute of Standards and Technology formerly National Bureau of Standards
X-Added: Forwarded by Space Digest
Original-Sender: isu@VACATION.VENARI.CS.CMU.EDU


-From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
-Subject: Re: Solar sails
-Date: 23 Jan 93 08:39:41 GMT
-Organization: Abo Akademi University, Finland

-There was another proposal as well. A small space probe suspended behind a
-giant solar sail (2km across, total mass of one hundred kg(?)) would reach
-Alpha Centauri in 250 years if we make a close flyby of the Sun - one solar
-radius from the surface (0.7 million km). Is there a way to manufacture an
-ultra-light sail able to withstand the temperature (4000-5000K at least)?

Do you have access to the math behind that proposal? It should be impressive -
for instance, the sail has to withstand something around 50 MW/m^2.
(The inverse-square law wouldn't exactly apply as far as photon thrust is
concerned at that distance, but it should be less than a factor of two off.)

John Roberts
roberts@cmr.ncsl.nist.gov
From: ewright@convex.com (Edward V. Wright)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Re: Using off-the-shelf-components
Keywords: space science, electronics, computers
Date: 28 Jan 93 00:11:39 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In <1993Jan27.190735.17499@cc.ic.ac.uk> atae@crab.ph.ic (Ata Etemadi) writes:

> Are there any companies out there whose off-the-shelf products are
>space-qualified ? 

That depends on what you mean by space-qualified.  The Russians
consider canned borsht from the local supermartski to be space-
qualified.  NASA doesn't.

Space-qualifed today means 

1) lightweight (because transportation is so expensive), 
2) reliable (because there's no one to fix it it breaks down), and
3) able to operate in conditions of extreme heat, cold, vaccuum, etc.

Given a reliable, low-cost space transportation system, 1 and 2
become much less important.  And if you have a rotating space
station, with artificial gravity and earth-normal or near-normal
atmosphere, 3 ceases to be important as well, and you can buy
just about everything off the shelf.
Newsgroups: sci.space
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: solar sails
Organization: Abo Akademi University, Finland
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 19:03:06 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

In <1k06a8INNsag@gap.caltech.edu> earl@cco.caltech.edu writes:

> roberts@cmr.ncsl.nist.gov (John Roberts) writes:
> 
> 
> >-From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
> >-Subject: Re: Solar sails
> >-Date: 23 Jan 93 08:39:41 GMT
> >-Organization: Abo Akademi University, Finland
> 
> >-There was another proposal as well. A small space probe suspended behind a
> >-giant solar sail (2km across, total mass of one hundred kg(?)) would reach
> >-Alpha Centauri in 250 years if we make a close flyby of the Sun - one solar
> >-radius from the surface (0.7 million km). Is there a way to manufacture an
> >-ultra-light sail able to withstand the temperature (4000-5000K at least)?
> 
> >Do you have access to the math behind that proposal? It should be impressive -
> >for instance, the sail has to withstand something around 50 MW/m^2.
> >(The inverse-square law wouldn't exactly apply as far as photon thrust is
> >concerned at that distance, but it should be less than a factor of two off.)
> 
> Look in _The Starship Handbook_ by Mallove & (forgotten name).  It is fairly
> low on math itself, but has references listed in the back.  You might also
> check in _The Journal of Spacecraft and Rockets_ or _The Journal of Propulsion
> and Power_ under solar sails.  
> 
> As I recall, the sail survives because the approach to the sun uses
> some shielding body until perihelion, then the sail is deployed, and
> heats up from there.  The optimal sail design has a highly reflective
> solar surface (minimizing heat transfer to the sail), and an efficient
> radiator for the outer surface.  Since the spaceward side of the sail 
> is pointed at the background heat sink, and the inner surface is 
> reflective, the actual temperature of the sail is kept to below failure 
> levels (varying with assumed materials and failure modes).  

...the size of the sail would be two kilometers across. The total mass is just
60kg, presumably including a small interstellar probe.
 
> >John Roberts
> >roberts@cmr.ncsl.nist.gov
> -- 

MARCU$

> "Have you never wanted to look beyond the clouds and *earl@alumni.caltech.edu
> the stars?  Or to know what causes the trees to bud, *Earl Hubbell
> or what changes a darkness into light?  But if you   *Opinions solely mine.
> talk like that, people call you crazy." --Frankenstein
From: MUNIZB%RWTMS2.decnet@beach.rockwell.com ("RWTMS2::MUNIZB")
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: AmRoC
Date: 23 Jan 93 02:05:54 GMT
Distribution: sci
Organization: [via International Space University]
X-Added: Forwarded by Space Digest
Original-Sender: isu@VACATION.VENARI.CS.CMU.EDU

On 13 Dec 92 13:48:16 GMT, Dean Adams <dnadams@nyx.cs.du.edu> writes

>gh6677@ehibm3.cen.uiuc.edu (George C Harting) writes:
>>I was wondering if anybody had any recent info about Amroc's Hybrid
>>rocket?  

>FYI... they have a test firing for one of their latest motors
>scheduled on the 15th of this month out at Edwards AFB...

A local L.A. paper had an article on AmRoC just before the scheduled 
test of their 250 klb thrust motor (derived from their successfully test 
fired 70 klb thrust motor), but I haven't seen any follow up stories.  
Does anyone know if the test was held?

Disclaimer: Opinions stated are solely my own (unless I change my mind).
Ben Muniz     munizb%rwtms2.decnet@consrt.rockwell.com    w(818)586-3578
Space Station Freedom:Rocketdyne/Rockwell:Structural Loads and Dynamics
   "Man will not fly for fifty years": Wilbur to Orville Wright, 1901
From: higgins@fnalf.fnal.gov (Bill Higgins-- Beam Jockey)
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Andres's Tirade (was Re: 2001/2010 Rocket Engines - What are they?)
Date: 26 Jan 93 17:18:21 GMT
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory
NNTP-Posting-Host: fnalf.fnal.gov

In article <1993Jan22.214823.14838@galileo.cc.rochester.edu>, agae@palm.lle.rochester.edu (Andres C. Gaeris) writes:
> Well, considering the current public and governmental attitude to expensive
> new space programs plus what is going worldwide with the space agencies,
> the _Forbidden Planet_ writers were not really off of the mark.
> I do not believe that Bill or I will reach the Moon in the next century

 Well, we're sure not gonna do it in this one...

> (except for some really good breakthroughs in longevity and geriatrics) and
> sure that Bill and I carry a good quantity of Mankind around 8-)!

Andres, we need to reduce launch cost-per-pound!

> I fell like Mankind will not reach the Moon and the planets in a really
> effective way till the end of the next century. The beginning of the next
> century will be for PC technologies, 'ecologic'-cleansing, and New-Age
> illiterates trying to subvert science and technology to their own pervert
> agenda.

Ooh, flame fodder if I ever saw any!  I sure hope you're not right...
but you might be.

> Sorry about this tirade. It is the result of reading three times 'Fallen
> Angels' and seeing around what is going on with S&T policy.

This novel has been proven by doctors to be bad for your mental
health.

> (Next tirade: _How the U.N./Green technological police forced me to leave
> Physics and go back to administer my family's convinience store_)

Is this real, or are you dreaming about *Fallen Angels* again?  It
would  be a great loss to North American science if you did.

Bill Higgins, Beam Jockey              | "Enough marshmallows
Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory  | will kill you 
Bitnet:           HIGGINS@FNAL.BITNET  | if properly placed."
Internet:       HIGGINS@FNAL.FNAL.GOV  | --John Alexander, leader of
SPAN/Hepnet:           43011::HIGGINS  | "disabling technologies"
 [*Aviation Week*, 7 Dec 1992, p. 50]  | research, Los Alamos
Newsgroups: sci.space
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Mir mission to Mars?
Organization: Abo Akademi University, Finland
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 18:19:18 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.24

In <C1GtzB.EL7.1@cs.cmu.edu> flb@flb.optiplan.fi writes:

> >    A flyby mission would require a total delta-V of the same magnitude as the
> > mission outlined above, or about 5km/s for the Proton stage.
> 
> Sorry to be dense, but in this context does "flyby" mean not 
> even properly *orbiting* Mars, perhaps to take a pick-axe to 
> Phobos and Deimos, but rather merely sailing on by ?

Exactly. An orbital mission would require an additional 220 ton rocket stage
(=one more launch by Mir) and would prolong the mission by up to two years.
 
> > > However, if the Finn government were to provide sufficient funding, I'm sure a 
> > > human flight to Mars could be arranged.
> 
> This will happen only is it can be repackaged as a support plan 
> for the farmers.  Perhaps with enough hydroponics on board ..
> 
Yup. Our farmers get 71% of their income from the state - not from selling farm
products.

MARCU$

> -- 
> * Fred Baube         ..when you think your Toys  you hear Laughter
> * Optiplan O.Y.           * have gone Berserk    cracking through the Walls
> * baube@optiplan.fi       * it's an illUsion     you're sent Spinning
> * GU/MSFS                 * you Cannot Shirk     you Have No Choice
> * #include <disclaimer.h> *                 -- Sioux proverb
> * Where is the follow-on  * Everybody has a right to be stupid, but some 
> *       to P.G.P. ??      *    people abuse the privilege -- Josef Stalin
From: szaidi@blackstone.eece.unm.edu (Shoaib Hasan Zaidi)
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: Re: Objective lenses that work in UV
Keywords: uv,lithography
Date: 25 Jan 93 22:53:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: lynx.1k1r17INNgp6
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
NNTP-Posting-Host: blackstone.eece.unm.edu

Isn't uv light used for lithography of microchips etc. These might be
expensive but would give tight focus.

-Shoaib Zaidi
From: siegman@EE.Stanford.EDU (Anthony E. Siegman)
Subject: Re: Spinning a Mirror
Organization: Stanford University
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 93 02:05:44 GMT

In article <1993Jan26.154851.22107@actcnews.res.utc.com> Bob.Clarke%bbs@actcnews.res.utc.com (Bob Clarke) writes:
>I saw an article where a astronomer was spinning a liquid in a round tray,
>which created a parabolic depression in the liquid.  Once a steady state was
>reached, he poured a reflective liquid into the spinning liquid which would
>float on top.  Thus, very cheaply he created a very good and very cheap
>primary lens.  Unfortunately it only work straight up, if tilted the liquid
>would pour out of the tray.
>
>My question, has anybody tried "spinning" a 8 or 10 inch mirror with a UV or
>heat curable material?  Would a slow or fast cure work best.  I wonder if
>the differential curing which is unavoidable would ruin the optical quality.

   Prof. Angel (sp?) at the University of Arizona is making deeply
curved glass mirrors for astronomical telescopes up to 3 m (10 m?) in
diameter by spinning a kind of circular "swimming pool" full of molten
glass for many days or weeks, while the glass cools and freezes the
parabolic depression into the mirror.  His setup, which is under the
stands of the Arizona football stadium, is really amazing: the
spinning tub or cylinder that I saw was 10 to 12 feet across and about
a meter deep, motor-driven on a pedestal 8 or 10 feet up in the air,
with huge slip rings to carry several megawatts of electricity into
the heaters which melt the glass; when filled it contains several
_tons_ of molten glass.  The parabolic depression in the center is a
foot or two deep.  Much of the "solid" portion of the glass slug below
the mirror surface is actually filled with cast sand cylinders which
make up much of the mirror volume.  After the mirror cools these sand
castings are blasted out with high-pressure water jets, so that the
mirror is actually a honeycomb structure, much lighter than it would
be if it were solid glass.  An amazing project; I think they have
plans to go for 10 m diameter mirrors eventually.


Newsgroups: sci.optics,sci.engr
From: jsalinas@lonestar.utsa.edu (Jaime I. Salinas)
Subject: Reflection !!!!!
Organization: University of Texas at San Antonio
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 22:32:36 GMT


I would like to find out what frequency of light reflects best off of white
office paper to be transmited through optical fiber. I am going to use this
info to build a page scanner. We would  like to keep the cost of this as low
as possible.

I would appreciate any information or comment.
Please send it to: jsalinas@lonestar.utsa.edu

THANKS !!!!!
From: mancini@fysik.uu.se (Derrick C. Mancini)
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: Re: Looking for REFLECTIVE liquid..(like mercury,but..)
Followup-To: sci.optics
Date: 25 Jan 1993 10:24:57 GMT
Organization: Fysikum, Uppsala Universitet
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: usx221.fysik.uu.se

In article <1993Jan23.213030.17788@Princeton.EDU>,
ajackson@ernie.Princeton.EDU (Andrew William Jackson) wrote:
> 
> In article <1993Jan22.164917.25317@netcom.com> ccat@netcom.com (Chris Beaumont) writes:
> >I'm looking for a reflective liquid,like mercury,but hopefully nontoxic.

Gallium or Indium or Tin are possible, since their melting points
are relatively low.  You would have to keep your mirror hot, though!
Tin would be pretty much non-toxic I think.  But the vapor of any
metal would be bad to inhale.

You might get an enhanced reflectivity for a particular wavelength if
you have a thin oil film spread on water, essentially acting as a
reflectivity coating.  But any disturbance would undo the effect.

Derrick C. Mancini
Fysiska Institutionen  -  Uppsala Universitet
Box 530  S751 21  Uppsala  Sverige
mancini@fysik.uu.se
---------------------------------------------
"Are we having fun yet?"  -  Zippy
From: dah@cveng121.veheng.det (Dewane A. Hall)
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: Susceptibility of Si
Date: 26 Jan 93 16:09:53 GMT
Reply-To: dah@cveng121.veheng.det
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.


What is the susceptibility of Silicon at
1.06 micrometers or what is the index of
refraction and absorbtion coefficient of
silicon at this same wavelength???????


---------------------------------------
I have eyes but cannot see another
I have ears but cannot hear another
I have a nose but cannot smell another
I have a tongue but cannot taste another
I have hands but cannot feel another
Being in Love doesn't have to make sense.
 by DAHCASS
Newsgroups: sci.optics
From: Bob.Clarke%bbs@actcnews.res.utc.com (Bob Clarke)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 15:48:51 EDT
Organization: United Technologies Research Center
Subject: Spinning a Mirror
Distribution: world
Reply-To: Bob.Clarke%bbs@actcnews.res.utc.com (Bob Clarke)
X-Posting-Software: UniBoard 1.10a S/N 190921

I saw an article where a astronomer was spinning a liquid in a round tray,
which created a parabolic depression in the liquid.  Once a steady state was
reached, he poured a reflective liquid into the spinning liquid which would
float on top.  Thus, very cheaply he created a very good and very cheap
primary lens.  Unfortunately it only work straight up, if tilted the liquid
would pour out of the tray.

My question, has anybody tried "spinning" a 8 or 10 inch mirror with a UV or
heat curable material?  Would a slow or fast cure work best.  I wonder if
the differential curing which is unavoidable would ruin the optical quality.
????
Bob Clarke

--
Bob Clarke, user of the UniBoard System @ actcnews.res.utc.com
E-Mail: Bob.Clarke%bbs@actcnews.res.utc.com
========================================================================
   United Technologies Corporation
   Opinions expressed do not necessarily represent UTC.
From: dah@cveng121.veheng.det (Dewane A. Hall)
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: Susceptibility of Silicon
Date: 28 Jan 93 18:00:08 GMT
Reply-To: dah@cveng121.veheng.det
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.

Needed Values for Silicon @ 1.06 micrometers

	Susceptibility
	Refractive Index
	Absorption Coefficient

Thanks.

----------------
If you don't know, you better ask someone.
From: wellison@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: More HeNe tubes for sell....
Date: 22 Jan 93 09:52:35 CST
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services


I just recieved several more HeNe tubes. These are the bare tubes and are rated
at 1mW to 2mW maximum output. They require a 75K ohm/3 watt ballast resistor
and a power supply which produces +1800vdc at 3.5 to 5mA and a 8kvdc trigger.
They measure about 9"L x 1"D. I am selling them for $20 each plus $5 shipping.
I also have a 5mW HeNe tube for sale. It requires a 75K ohm/3 watt ballast and
a power of +2400vdc at 6mA and a 10kv trigger. It measures 13"L x 1.5"D. I am
selling it for $50 plus $5 shipping.

-=-= Wes =-=- 
Xref: sparky sci.optics:1428 rec.boats:9354
From: francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir)
Newsgroups: sci.optics,rec.boats
Subject: Re: Do I want flat-field binoculars?
Date: 23 Jan 1993 17:19:18 GMT
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: oas.stanford.edu

victor porguen writes:

	Superb advice for buying binoculars from Daniel P. B. Smith 
	in the previous article.  I wish I'd written that. Couldn't 
	have put it better.

On a related matter, bird watchers emphasize the importance of color
correction, and this may be important to boaters, too. color problems
are inportant in twilight when the perception of color is at its lowest.

I have one quite poor eye ("the Nelson touch") and I've been looking
around for telescopes. Surprisingly hard to find. At the moment I'm
thinking of getting an instrument maker to cut my binocs into two.
Twice the number, half the weight. Any thoughts? Oh yes, I am also using
a Celestion C65, a 6.5cm telescope. lightweight plastic thing.

						Cap'n Fido on
						F E L I X

Newsgroups: sci.optics,rec.boats
From: rsilvers@cirrus.nynexst.com (Robert Silvers)
Subject: Do I want flat-field binoculars?
Originator: rsilvers@cirrus
Organization: Nynex Science and Technology
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 20:58:39 GMT


	I need to decide between two Fujinon binoculars.  They
are identical in quality, but one has more eye relief and is
of flat-field design.  The flat-field ones cost more, $500 instead
of $400.  I understand what this means, but aren't most camera
lenses curved field?  (except for copy-stand cameras?)  Is this
something I should care about?  

	I do not wear glasses, so I do not want to pay for the
extra eye relief.

				Thanks,
					--Rob.
Xref: sparky sci.optics:1427 rec.boats:9350
From: vporguen@unl.edu (victor porguen)
Newsgroups: sci.optics,rec.boats
Subject: Re: Do I want flat-field binoculars?
Date: 23 Jan 1993 15:55:22 GMT
Organization: University of Nebraska--Lincoln	
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: unlinfo.unl.edu

Superb advice for buying binoculars from Daniel P. B. Smith in the
previous article.  I wish I'd written that. Couldn't have put it 
better.

VP

Newsgroups: sci.optics
From: lana@news.mit.edu (Svetlana Panasyuk)
Subject: Wanted information about ZEMAX
Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 19:10:57 GMT


Hello!

I would really appreciate some information about program called ZEMAX,
namely - is it commercial, shareware or freeware product and where can
I get it (e.g thru anonymous FTP :-).

Please answer by e-mail: lana@meinesz.mit.edu

Thanks in advance

Svetlana
From: hnr@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Harvey Rutt)
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: Re: Objective lenses that work in UV
Date: 22 Jan 93 12:18:34 GMT

I seem to recall UV transmitting microscope objectives are used in
biology where they excite fluorescence with UV. Also there are
certainly some so called 'fluorite' objectives (?CaF2), although I
*think* this was used for superior chromatic aberration compensation
in the visible, not for its good UV transmission.
As another contributor pointed out, true diffraction limited
performance in the UV with high NA is probably not on commercially.

The other area of work which does use very high resolution UV
transmiting lenses is microelectronics, with Hg line excitation. Their
lenses can cost hundreds of thousands!

Harvey Rutt
Southampton UK
From: wellison@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Newsgroups: sci.optics
Subject: Mother of all HeNe's for sell
Date: 28 Jan 93 18:26:07 GMT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services


I just got a lead on the mother of all HeNe's. This guy is a Jodon
HN-50 producing +50mW ! ! The tube was replaced in 1989 and it has
very low hours on it. The laser comes with a Jodon digital power meter
and the power supply as well. The cavity has an etalon prism for tuning
in the 1192Nm and 3390Nm (IR) range. It is also open cavity design.
The overall unit is in excellent condition. The guy wants $4,000 or
best offer for it. The ultimate light show or holography laser !

-=-= Wes =-=-
Newsgroups: sci.optics,rec.boats