HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jrbell@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (Jason Bell)
Subject: Re: A Fire Upon the Deep
Organization: Monash University
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 23:26:52 GMT

Jonathan M Lennox (jml12@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu) wrote:
:   Can anyone tell me what the current publication status of Vernor
: Vinge's _A Fire Upon the Deep_ is?  I've been looking for it in
: various sf bookstores, but I haven't seen it anyplace.  Is it out in
: paperback?
: 
: --
: Jonathan Lennox
: jml12@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
: 

By sheer fluke I just happened to see it in the Uni. bookstore
yesterday, in hardback. It looks quite interesting!

-Jason
From: esr@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: "The Chieftan", or John Norman Returns
Date: 10 Nov 92 17:52:02 GMT

In <1992Nov9.001623.7583@netcom.com> Dani Zweig wrote:
> trebor@foretune.co.jp (Robert J Woodhead):
> >I recall that the first half-dozen Gor books were actually quite decent -- 
> >sort of "R-Rated John Carter on Counter-Earth, the Sequel" if you will.  
> >They went into decline...
> 
> I was told that starting with the fourth book, Norman managed to
> negotiated a no-editing clause.  But it was certainly after the
> sixth issue that the writing took its precipitous decline.

Quite.  A shame, too.  There was actually some interesting world-building in
the early books, before they degenerated into mechanical SM porn.
-- 
					Eric S. Raymond <esr@snark.thyrsus.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: st1rk@rosie.uh.edu (Maxwell, Darin)
Subject: Walter Jon Williams
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 03:52:00 GMT

I've seen people mention the works of Williams, but noone ever mentions
the one book of his that I have read. I intend to read others, but I
really enjoyed _Aristoi_ and wonder if anyone else did.

Also, I am unfamiliar with the concept of cyberpunk, but does this book
come at all close to it? If it isn't cyberpunk without the dregs of society
outlook which seems to be the 'punk' in 'cyberpunk', what type of book is
it? Is there more like it around?

Thank all of you for discussing cyberpunk. I shall, as soon as I get the
time, try several of your suggestions myself. As far as I am concerned
that is at *least* one good reason for this newsgroup to exist. The other
reasons are just as important but shall remain nameless for now.

White chocolate fans unite,
Darin

--
Darin Maxwell             I'm sure you know all about the hedgehog
st1rk@jetson.uh.edu       and his sexual problems.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Science Fiction -- Which books are good/original?
From: S954818@UMSLVMA.UMSL.EDU (Mark Pedigo)
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:03:12 GMT
Organization: UM ST. LOUIS

In article <H.OCgXSwHrZC6@elfhaven.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca>
mforget@elfhaven.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Michel Forget) writes:
 
>
>Hi!
>
>Most of my reading has been Fantasy, but I would like to read more Science
>Fiction.  I like the books by David Brin, and The Gap series by Stephen R.
>Donaldson is good.  Which others are good?
>
>Any suggestions would be welcome!
>
Personal fav's of Sf/fantasy/horror:
1.  White Plague - Frank Herbert.  (Sf, loosely. Actually more of a
    conventional novel with some science added for flavor).
2.  On a Pale Horse - Piers Anthony. (Fantasy.  Although the word "science"
    might be mentioned a time or two, this is NOT sf.  However, I would
    reccomend this to any fantasy fan.)  The original novel in the
    "Incarnations of Immortality" series.  Skip the sequels.
3.  Chronicles of Amber - Roger Zelazny.  Again, strictly fantasy, but worth
    reading.  Deals with alternate/parralel universes, realities. Fascinating.
4.  This one has been mentioned already in this thread, but bears repeating.
    The Foundation Trilogy - Asimov.  Personally, I've never read anything by
    Asimov that I felt was not worth my time - Excellent writer and a very
    lucid thinker.
5.  Again, fantasy.  To Your Scattered Bodies Go - Philip Jose Farmer.
    (original novel of the Riverworld series). Again, skip the sequels. One
    of the most original novels yet.
6.  Somewhat (actually, vaguely) related are horror novels.  Personal fav's
    in this category include anything by Joyce Carol Oats (sp), a truly
    demented, very intense author.  Usually not billed as horror, per se,
    but too realistic to not make an impression.
 
As far as "hard core" science fiction is concerned, anything by Asimov, Clarke,
Niven (if you can stand the overly simplistic style) can be reccomended.
 
-mp
From: ca572@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Mark L. Stackpole)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: James Schmitz
Date: 11 Nov 1992 20:46:14 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


	Also the Washington Science Fiction Association published
a collection early this year : _The Best of James H. Schmitz_. As
an appendix, there is a bibliography of his short fiction - though
not complete. (A 2-part serial from _Galaxy_ (1956) is missing, for 
instance).
	You do know that Mr. Schmitz died several years ago - and 
that somebody at CSU Sacramento has razored out all the Schmitz
stories from their collection on Astoundings/Analogs? Grrrrr...[D[heir collection of Astoundings/Analogs?  Grrrr...

Mark Stackpole@oclc.org
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: evanh@sco.COM (Evan Hunt)
Subject: Re: help with bibliographies needed - Zelazny, Card, etc.
Organization: The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1992 08:39:06 GMT


My thanks to everyone who responded - we have gotten all the needed
information. The SF-loving young adults of Santa Cruz thank you.

-- 
Some of the new words in the American Heritage Dictionary:  Novelize, El Nino,
moonquake, ombudsperson, shock-jock, metafiction, hypertext, wellness, slam-
dunk, nerd, media event, colorize, preowned, CD/ROM, stress test, four-by-four,
prequel, waitron, infotainment, junk bond, supersaver, sound bite, HIV, wide-
bodied, stun gun, talking head, laptop, leveraged buyout, women's studies.
From: aa396@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bill Henley)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Heinlein, Asimov, and Clarke
Date: 6 Nov 1992 00:17:16 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


Regarding what Arthur C. Clarke did during World War II; I 
believe he worked on a British scientific project developing
the wartime uses of radar.  His novel GLIDE PATH, if I'm not
mistaken, was a fiction based in large part on his experiences
at this time.

-- 
Bill Henley, Assistant Sysop, Science Fiction & Fantasy SIG
ID  aa396
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: qvortrup@inf.ethz.ch (Michael Qvortrup)
Subject: Re: Blaylock and Powers (Re: Tim Powers)
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 07:33:40 GMT

In article <BxB1LA.GIp@da_vinci.it.uswc.uswest.com> bjones@lookout.it.uswc.uswest.com (Brent Jones) writes:
>In article <1992Nov6.114617.6220@neptune.inf.ethz.ch> qvortrup@inf.ethz.ch (Michael Qvortrup) writes:
>>[question about comparison between Ps _The Stress of Her Regard_ and
>>Bs _The Last Coin deleted]
>
>Oh man, I read your post and thought my heart was going to stop.
>thud! Thud!! THUD!!! **Burst** as my heart pounds its way out of my
>ribcage in a welter of gore and anguished disbelief . IMHO
>Blaylock is one of the most subtle, brilliant writers working today, and
>_Last Coin_ is one of his best books. If you found Andrew Vanbergen a
>pathetic null, then you probably shouldn't read it again or bother
>with any of his other works, as one of Blaylock's hallmarks is creating
>idiosyncratic characters who muddle through somehow, mostly by accident
>and through the strength of their curious convictions.

I guess I should clarify a bit. I found _The Last Coin_ to be very
wellwritten from the craftmanship point of view (and let us please
not start that discussion again), but that just doesn't cut it for
me in this case. Andrew Vanbergen *is* pathetic, and I just can't 
identify with a character like that, never mind how well written the
book is. From a clinical point of view I guess that Andrew Vanbergen
is a very interesting person, but a book in my opinion needs more
than that. I for one believe, that a story needs more than people;
it also needs story. And I found _The Last Coin_ sorely lacking in 
that regard.

>Still give Powers a go, however, especially _Last Call_ or _Annubis
>Gates_. His works are different from Blaylock's, even though they do
>share the same kind of skewed, manic world view. His characters are
>more focused and competent in the way in which they interact with the
>"real world."

I actually like the "skewed, manic world view", but a story needs 
a bit more than that.

>Wow. Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

Very true, but we have to set that aside once in a while, or we 
wouldn't get any interesting discussions going or learn anything
new.

>BTW, your post implied that _Stress of Her Regard_ was written by Blaylock,
>which is not the case. It was written by Powers.

Yes, I noticed afterwards that taken out of context it might be seen
that way. It wasn't intended.

Greetings,
--Mike

-- 
#include <std-disclm.h>--"... and there is a small flaw in my character."---
Real Life: Michael Christian Heide Qvortrup      A Dane         ETH, Zuerich
e-mail   : qvortrup@inf.ethz.ch                  abroad         Switzerland
Institut fuer wissenschaftliches Rechnen  /  Inst. of Scientific Computation
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: st1rk@rosie.uh.edu (Maxwell, Darin)
Subject: Re: Walter Jon Williams
Summary: read from library 
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Keywords:  library
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1992 19:50:00 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.071013.17822@u.washington.edu>, mimir@stein.u.washington.edu (Al Billings) writes...
> 
> I like his books a lot but the book you mention is Hardcover. As I am a
>student (like many others here), I can't spend $23 on a single book that
>isn't for a class and that is only a novel. IT is a crime but I don't make

I'm sorry. I got the book from my library and actually assumed it to have been
around for a while at least. I didn't check the date.

While unfamiliar with Williams' other stuff, I found this one of those books
that I simply could not put down. It is a life-changer for me, or at least an
attitude-changer. I took the ideas in the book and said, "YES". It was exactly
what I wanted to read at the time and due for a rereading already, only 3 weeks
or so after I read it. If you have any method of reading this book, drop all
your other worries and enjoy.

On Cloud 8, fast approaching Cloud 9,
Darin

--
Darin Maxwell             I'm sure you know all about the hedgehog
st1rk@jetson.uh.edu       and his sexual problems.                     
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: griffin@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Zack Thompson)
Subject: Re: Human Computers in SF--Help!
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:01:54 GMT

In article <3741@creatures.cs.vt.edu> sahle@csgrad.cs.vt.edu (Eskinder Sahle) writes:
>
>Hello all:
>
>I need some help....  I'm looking for examples in fiction literature
>of super sophisticated communicative computers a la HAL. That is,
>computers that talk and communicate like humans.  I'm not so much 
>interested in those instances where it's a robot that cannot be
>distinguished from a human being as in computers sounding human without
>being almost totally human-like....  So far I got these suggestions.
>If you can add to the list or comment on the works in it I would very
>much appreciate it....
>
>Thanks,
>Ahmed
>

Howdy-

ZT here.

Look in Larry Niven's _The Smoke Ring_

Just for the Record.

                       The Crystal Griffin
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: volker@sfb256.iam.uni-bonn.de ( Volker A. Brandt )
Subject: Re: MUAD'DIB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Organization: Applied Math, University of Bonn, Germany
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 22:22:53 GMT

In article <1992Nov3.172648.1@woods.ulowell.edu> howsonj@woods.ulowell.edu writes:
>My favorite book of all time is Dune by Frank Herbert. If there is anyone else
>out there who loves this book as much as I do, than please reply or email me
>back. Maybe we can create our own fan club newsgroup. Thanx.

Hello!  I also enjoyed this book very much, and most of the sequels as well.
But what should we talk about in your proposed "fan club newsgroup"?  Herbert
is dead, the mythical 7th volume was never finished, all the other books have
been available for years.

Still, I liked the books, and I reread them occasionally.

-- Volker

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bitnet:   UNM409@DBNRHRZ1                              Volker A. Brandt
UUCP:     ...!unido!DBNRHRZ1.bitnet!unm409             Angewandte Mathematik
Internet: volker@sfb256.iam.uni-bonn.de                (Bonn, Germany)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: tovah@panix.com (Tovah Hollander)
Subject: Re: Looking for author/title of short story
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 21:32:20 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC

mgrossman@hamp.hampshire.edu writes:

>  Sounds like Arthur C. Clarke's "The Nine Billion Names of God".  A neat
>story, you could probably find it in one of his anthologies.

Or anybody else's.  This has to be one of the most-anthologized SF stories
of all time (not undeservedly, let me hasten to add).

-- 
Tovah Hollander
tovah@panix.com -or- tovah@onion.salad.mssm.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: YANJUNA@YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu
Subject: Re: Rama Revealed
Organization: Yale University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 92 22:32:34 EST

In article <1e13i2INNsm2@transfer.stratus.com>
tarl@sw.stratus.com (Tarl Neustaedter) writes:
 
>
>In article <1992Nov13.182402.5604@eos.arc.nasa.gov>, kyrsten@eos.arc.nasa.gov (Kyrsten Swazey) writes:
>> Umm... this is probably a pretty foolish question, but has the third
>> Rama book been published already?
>
>Yes. Save your money. It's far more Gentry Lee than Arthur Clarke (if any),
>and doesn't have any of the magic of the original.
>--
 
      The "third" book in the Rama series _The Gardens of Rama_ (which is
the -second- collaborated Rama book with Clarke and Lee) has been out in
paperback for a couple of months.  However, _Rama Revealed_ which is the
"fourth" book in the series (and the -third- collaboration) is scheduled
for early next year.
       Hope this clears up the confusion.
 
 
************************************************************************
   "INSANITY IS A VIRTUALLY IMPREGNABLE GAMBIT...
BUT YOU HAVE TO LAY THE GROUNDWORK EARLY IN THE GAME..."
 
    JUNSOK YANG (YANJUNA@YALEVM.YCC.EDU)
 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: bjones@lookout.it.uswc.uswest.com (Brent Jones)
Subject: Re: Tim Powers
Organization: U S WEST Information Technologies
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 14:40:52 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.140437.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu> rwilley@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Hrothgar) writes:
>From memory i can recall the following books by Powers
>
>	The Drawing of the Dark
>	The Anubis Gates
>	Dinner at Deviant's Place
>	The Stress of Her Regard
>	The Last Call
>
>i would recommend all of these books very highly.  The Last Call is
>probably the strongest of his works.  I think Dinner at Deviants is
>most likely the weakest, but still worth reading.  Powers is one of those few
>authors wo I actually feel is worth purchasing in hardback.  For those of you
>who really like his work, i would also recommend the follwong authors
>Michael Shea - "Nifft the Lean"
>Robert Holdstock - "Mythago Woods"
>James Blaylock - "The Last Coin"
>	(Power's college roomie, btw)
>
>				richard
>	rwilley@eagle.wesleyan.edu

Although they were great friends in college, they never roomed together.
They did, however, seem to be pretty much inseperable and spent a great
deal of time together.

While friends in college, they were both working on their first real
manuscripts. Blaylock's concerned the Wild Man of Borneo and sinister
Plaster of Paris factories producing poisoned milk in Victorian England.
Powers' concerned some fairly strange ideas about the brewing of beer.
Not really sure what happened to Blaylock's first, but Powers' became
_The Drawing of the Dark_. 

I agree that if you like Powers, you will like Blaylock, and vice
versa.
-- 
Brent Jones, Lead Technical Editor, U S WEST Information Technologies
U S WEST sez "Nuh uh, his opinion, not ours." bjones@denitqm.uswest.com
"In the Kingdom of Boredom, I wear the Royal Sweatpants." --M. Leyner
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: eliz@ai.mit.edu (Elizabeth Willey)
Subject: Re: _Swordspoint_ by Ellen Kushner
Organization: MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 23:19:36 GMT

Arun Meda Sannuti writes about _Swordspoint_ by Ellen Kushner:

	   I don't want to talk about it, since saying anything would be
   giving something away, but the writing is very good.  (It should be,
   since she is a literature prof. at Northeastern University.)  The
   characters are not flat, in fact, they are incredibly complex, yet you
   grow to understand and appreciate them, though they aren't all that
   wonderful as people.  Though it does seem weird that it is classified
   as a fantasy, since I detected no magical elements in it.  Historical
   fiction in a pseudo-medieval world would be more accurate.

_Swordspoint_ is one of a newish type of fantasy called an
ahistorical.  What that means is that it is not tied to a specific
locus in our historical past, but rather that it takes place in a
place without connection to, but containing elements of, various
recognizable epochs from our history.  This lack of locus means that
it's not really a history, and thus it is fantasy.

_Thomas the Rhymer_, the other Kushner novel, is also claimed to be an
ahistorical, but I feel that it cannot truly be so because the plot is
firmly based on ballad associated with a place and time in our
history---that is to say, the story has a historical context, and the
novel does not successfully dissociate itself from the history.  It
does, however, have other requisites for a true fantasy, including
Elfland and a reference to the Wild Hunt.

There are various Kushner short stories scattered through various
anthologies, some of which are also ahistoricals in the same way that
_Swordspoint_ is but with stronger fantasy elements.  Look for them;
you'll enjoy them if you enjoyed _Swordspoint_.  "The Swordsman Whose
Name Was Not Death" is another Richard-and-Alec story, to be found in
the most recent Year's Best Fantasy Windling-and-Datlow collection
(Number Five); "Red Cloak" was (I think) in _The Magazine of Fantasy
and Science Fiction_ and I don't know if it has been anthologized.
Enjoy.  There are no further Richard-and-Alec stories that I've seen.

Ellen Kushner is not a professor of literature at Northeastern now,
and she could write well before she was, and many professors of
literature can't write at all.  Always take the back matter of books
with a pound of salt.


Elizabeth Willey
From: ECZ5TAN@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: New HB Releases
Date: 10 Nov 92 21:51:00 GMT

Here's a few titles of some releases in hard cover:

Anthony, Piers. Killobyte (Ace/Putnam, $19.95, Jan)
Feist, Raymond E. The King's Buccaneer (Doubleday, $20.00, Nov) Riftwar series.
Geston, Mark. Mirror in the Sky (Morrow/AvoNova, $20.00, Dec) Geston returns
   after 20 years.
Jones, Courtway. Witch of the North: Second Book in the Story of Dragon's Heirs
  (Pocket, $21.00, Dec)
Kurtz, Katherine. King Javan's Year: Vol. 2 of The Heirs of Saint Chamber
   (Ballentine/Del Rey, $20.00, Dec)
Williams, A. Susan, ed. The Lifted Veil: The Book of Fantasy Literature by
   Women (Carroll & Graf, $28.00, Nov) From the 19th century on. Limited to
   short stories in English. This is quite a collection.



Morgan
ecz5tan@uclamvs.bitnet
ecz5tan@mvs.oac.ucla.edu
From: dik@comp.lancs.ac.uk (Richard Bentley)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Glen Cook
Date: 9 Nov 92 10:25:23 GMT
Organization: Department of Computing at Lancaster University, UK.

I have just returned from a visit to the USA - needless to say with
a backpack full of American paperbacks. One author I particularly
wanted to buy was Glen Cook, particularly the Dread Empire / Black
Company series. I did not realise just how many books Glen has written
(we only have the first 3 Black Compny books published here (I think)
and those only recently). I managed to pick up 15 in the end and 
know there are others I haen't got. Could somebody please mail or post
a complete list of his books with publication order (my copies do not
have series numbers on them !).

Many thanks,

Richard

+------------------------------------+----------------------------+
| uucp :  ...!mcsun!ukc!dcl-cs!dik   |   Department of Computing  |
| arpa :  dik%lancs.comp@ucl.cs      |   University of Lancaster  |
| janet:  dik@uk.ac.lancs.comp       |   Bailrigg, Lancaster      |
| tel  :  (44) 524 65201 x3119       |   LA1 4YR,   UK.           |
+------------------------------------+----------------------------+
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: jgreely@morganucodon.cis.ohio-state.edu (J Greely)
Subject: Re: John Norman movie(was Re: Sharon Green)
Originator: jgreely@morganucodon.cis.ohio-state.edu
Organization: Ohio State University Computer and Information Science
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 03:48:00 GMT

In article <2B029C55@ssd0.laafb.af.mil> KitchenRN@SSD0.LAAFB.AF.MIL writes:
>WHAT Norman movie?  SURELY there was NEVER a Gor Movie?!?!?!

Heh, heh.  There are *two* of these turkeys.  Take a spaghetti
western, replace the costumes with leftovers from "Conan" (or,
alternately, "The Warrior and the Sorceress" :-)), stir in random
pages from the first Gor novel, and you've got a movie!  Of course,
the hero's girlfriend (a Playboy centerfold, Rebecca Ferrati(sp?), I
think) was *not* the slavish type, and had to be talked into putting
her weapons down and wearing the chains when they snuck into the
villain's territory.

  We never had the stomach to rent the second one...
-- 
J Greely (jgreely@cis.ohio-state.edu; osu-cis!jgreely)