HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: albert@HPLWK.HPL.HP.COM (Joseph Albert)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Computer Go vs. computer chess
Date: 1 Sep 92 16:39:00 GMT

>From: os9ug@gkcl.ists.ca (OS-9 User Group):

>RE: computer go vs. computer chess -- difficulty in coding

>Chess programmers have another major advantage over Go programmers.
>At any given point they can do a simple board evaluation: count the
>men left on the board, weighting them appropriate (9 for queen, etc.)
>and compare the totals.

>On the other hand.. how do you evaluate a position on the Go board?
>Especially during the opening stages of the game?  If you ask a
>professional "Who has the better position here?" they will say things
>like "The territory black has created isn't nearly as valuable as this
>thick white wall."

unfortunately, today's computers do not have the horsepower to make good
use of a chess evaluation function that just added up the points of
the pieces on the board (and say checked for mate).  This would require
that searches could only stop when major material was won, or mate was
given, which is beyond the search horizon of today's hardware.

Thus, if you ask a professional chess player, "Who has the better position 
here?" for a position rich enough to be interesting, they will say things
like, "White has a lead in development", or "Black's possession of the
open file is more important than white's bishop pair", or any number
of other positional considerations that dictate the correct evaluation
of the position.

Now, we can say that we might expect go to be a more difficlut game to
program on account of the much larger search space.  Since a given
hardware configuration will be able to search less deep in go, it will
have to have a more accurate evaluation function to achieve the
same level of proficiency as a chess program running on the same hardware
(whatever it means for a go program to have the same level of proficiency
asa chess program, if indeed it isn't a meaningless comparison).

This is compelling evidence that go is harder to program, but we cannot
conclude so from this since it could be that a future analysis of go leads to
a very accurate evaluation function nonetheless. (I don't believe that this
will happen, and I believe that go is much harder to program, and more
complex game, but that is just my opinion).

Joseph Albert
albert@hplabs.hp.com
Newsgroups: newsgroup,rec.games.chess
From: schiller@tira.uchicago.edu (Eric Schiller)
Subject: Re: sneaky Nimzo-Indian?
Organization: Center for Information and Language Studies / University of
	Chicago
	<1992Aug27.061157.8914@cs.brown.edu>
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 22:44:46 GMT

It isn't a Nimzoindian at all. This is just one of the many Ragozin lines
in the QGD, and there is plenty of analysis if you just track down the
transpostions. It only becomes a Nimzo with Nf6, and not always then.

Eric Schiller
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: bwatkins@nyx.cs.du.edu (The God of all machines)
Subject: Re: Spassky-Fischer game2
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 92 02:35:52 GMT



For those of you who are interested:

At this point in 1972:

Fischer Spassky '72:  The World Chess Championship

After two games:
Spassky 2 Fischer 0

The match was to 12.5 games.

Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: wbralick@afit.af.mil (Will Bralick)
Subject: Re: Boycott
Organization: Self-similar
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 20:48:26 GMT

In article <1992Sep1.142023.7265@news.cs.indiana.edu> "Paul Hager" <hagerp@moose.cs.indiana.edu> writes:
| I thought the agreement on this match predated the U.N. embargo.
| Shouldn't there have been a grandfather clause exempting it?

If there was no grandfather clause written into the agreement then there
is no grandfather clause.  Whether there _should_ be is a question for
diplomats.

| More to the point, boycotts that involve coercing large companies
| and multinationals seems appropriate but using that coercive
| power on individuals violates basic principles of human rights.

Which _basic principles_ of human rights have been violated in this case
and where are they defined and agreed to by the nations participating
in the UN sanctions?  Mr. Fischer has no _right_ to play chess wherever
he pleases.  

Don't get me wrong -- I'd like to see him play, too -- anywhere but
Serbia.

| . ...
| Followers of Fisher's career will recall that he was forbidden from
| going to Cuba to play in the international tournament there but
| the expedient of using a telex to relay the moves was used.  From
| Fischer's standpoint, I'm sure this is just a matter of the government
| interferring with something that should be above politics -- i.e.,
| chess -- just as they did before with the Cuban tournament.

Well, Fischer's ``standpoint'' isn't what makes foreign policy.  

Chess has never been above politics during Fischer's career ... or
did he think that the big, bad Soviets (you know, the reason he doesn't
have any fillings) were all out to get him just because he was a good 
chess player and not that he was a good non-Soviet chess player.

| A final thought.  Chess is an entertainment.  What was once Yugoslavia
| was a nation of chessplayers.  My guess is that if a poll were taken,
| the combatants would want to see the games take place as a way of
| gaining a moment of diversion from all the misery surrounding them.

My guess is that if the Bosnians and Croatians were polled and under-
stood that this match might lend the slightest legitimacy to the Serbian
state then they might rather send snipers to the match than listen to it
on the radio between shellings.


Regards,

-- 
Will Bralick                          |  If we desire to defeat the enemy,
             wbralick@afit.af.mil     |  we must proportion our efforts to 
             bralick@cs.psu.edu       |  his powers of resistance.
with disclaimer;  use disclaimer;     |               - Carl von Clauswitz
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: bwatkins@nyx.cs.du.edu (The God of all machines)
Subject: Re: Fisher, Kasparov, Tal
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 92 18:20:15 GMT

mzabel@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Zabel) writes:

>In article <1992Sep3.162357.21733@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> bwatkins@nyx.cs.d
.edu (
>The God of all machines) writes:
>>
>>Korchnoi was the last player with a style.  Karpov, Kasparov have none,
>>much less Tal's!  (unless you think "dull" any "kewpie" are styles)

>     Huh?  Don't you think that Ljubojevic, Shirov, or others
>have any sort of style?  How about Basman? (sorry)

>-Mark
Sorry, world championship potential class players only.  Since Fischer:
Karpov, Kasparov, Timman, Korchnoi, Short(?).  Probably Ivanchuk next
cycle.

I had the "blunder randomly" style in this period, but I'm not
world-championship caliber.

Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: ako@jyu.fi (Antti Koponen)
Subject: Re: Alekhine a4 lines
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 19:13:00 GMT

In article <1992Aug26.205442.2026@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> mzabel@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Mark A Zabel) writes:
>     We were discussing the line:
>

>doesn't really bother me too much.  There seems to be much scope
>for other ideas here.  Maybe
>
>8.Qe2 00 9.h3 Nc6 10.00 Bf5!?  Alburt tried this setup at least once.
>or
>8.Qe2 d5!? (or ?! - I don't know)
>

I find Qe2 very dangerous. Black finds it extremerely difficult
to find any counterplay. Without Qe2 I would even consider playing
Alburts g6!?
The above mentioned lines have brought Alburt much troble and
many lost games!

>Some other Black replies after 7.a4!
>
>i) 7.-dxe5
>
>You (Antti) gave 7.-dxe5 8.Qe2!  Hmmm, could you email the Short-Timman
>game?  I'd like to see why Qe2 is so good.  In the meantime I'll take
>a closer look.  The line I've looked at starts with
>
Sorry !! 7.Qe2 was of course instead 7.a4, after 7.a4 de is 8.a5 
obligatory, if good for white.


>8.a5 Nd7 9.Nxe5 

Yes, but of course  9.Bxf7+ as I wrote.

00 10.00 Nc6!?  The Black pieces can get pretty active
>here, but usually at the cost of a pawn (at least).
>

>ii) 7.-d5

Black finds it very difficult to find a good plan after d5-move.

>
>8.a5 Nc4 9.Nbd2 b5!? - This is pretty complicated.

Alburt has desperately tried this too with poor results.

>     Well, this should keep me busy for at least one pack of
>cigarrettes.  Thanks for the reply.

Finding a move for black certainly needs another pack here!

Antti
>
>-Mark
From: dweddin@uoft02.utoledo.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: FISCHER/SPASSKY...PREDICTIONS
Date: 1 Sep 92 13:55:56 EST
Organization: University of Toledo, Computer Services



Predictions:
append your predictions underneath......


______________________________________________________

Fischer  10
Spassky   2

The match will be over in under 40 games.

This prediction is based on the fact that Bobby has done 
nothing but play chess since 1972 while Borris went skiing.

Donald Wedding
Toledo, OH

______________________________________________________

Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: martin@axis.se (Martin Gren)
Subject: Request for listing of party Fisher vs Spasskij in Montenegro
Organization: Axis Communications AB, Lund Sweden
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 14:12:55 GMT


Is there anyone who has a listing of the party where Bobby defeated
Boris now in former Yugoslavia ?

Please post it or (and ?) mail it to me ! (martin@axis.se)

Thanx

/ Martin
-- 
Martin Gren                email: martin@axis.se
Axis Communications AB     Tel: +46 46 19 18 38
S - 223 70 LUND,  SWEDEN   Fax:   +46 46 13 61 30
From: benwood@milton.u.washington.edu (Ben Henwood)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Re: Fischer CNN
Date: 3 Sep 92 16:27:14 GMT
Article-I.D.: milton.benwood.715537634
Organization: University of Washington

schiller@sapir.uchicago.edu (Eric Schiller) writes:


>CNN just ran a brief piece on the match, including a shot
>of Bobby spitting on the Treasury Dept letter and reporting
>that he had played 1.e4 (yes, they used algebraic!).
>Report was at 11:43 CST on Newsday.

>Eric Schiller

My local TV station (KING in Seattle) ran a piece last night --
what's the world coming to!!  It looked like their footage was a
zoom in on the monitor in the analysis room.  Whatever, it was
really there.

The reporter mentioned that Fischer faces a $250,000 fine from the
Treasury Department when he returns to the US for violating the
sanctions.  He noted that if Fischer wins the match and $3.5 million,
he could easily afford it.

Ben Henwood
Applied Physics Laboratory / University of Washington
benwood@u.washington.edu

"All I want to do, ever, is play chess."  -- Bobby Fischer
From: jeff@econ.Berkeley.EDU (Jeffrey C. Ely)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: re: Fischer-Spassky: The moves so far
Date: 2 Sep 92 18:44:20 GMT
Organization: Chessnews list (chessnews-request@tssi.com)


In Article 15683 castanos@wam.umd.edu (Jose Alberto Castanos) writes

>Here are the moves so far of Game 1 in the Fischer-Spassky match, as
>reported by the PRODIGY service:
>
>
>  Fischer  Spassky 
>  White     Black 
>1  e4      e5                
>2  Nf3     Nc6             
>3  Bb5     a6          
>4  Ba4     Nf6          
>5  0-0     Be7            
>6  Re1     b5          
>7  Bb3     0-0        
>8  c3      d6          
>9  h3      Nb8      
>10 d4        

Does anybody know what time (Pacific time) the games are scheduled to 
start each day?  Is this game going on right now!? (that is 11:30 AM PST)

___________________________________________________________________

Jeff Ely                              "He said the Sun's not yellow...
Department of Economics               It's Chicken!"
UC Berkeley
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: smmurthy@comet.lerc.nasa.gov (PLN Murthy)
Subject: Fischer vs Spassky
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 01:48:41 GMT

Fischer vs Spassky Game 1
Fischer won in 49 moves. 
The moves can be obtained by calling 202 334 9000 followed by
code 8400. 
-- 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
PLN Murthy			|     phone: 216-433-4000
NASA Lewis Research Center     	|    
Cleveland, Ohio  44135         	|     email: smmurthy@comet.lerc.nasa.gov 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Xref: sparky rec.games.chess:6524 rec.games.board:8300
From: janet@cs.UAlberta.CA (Janet Service)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess,rec.games.board
Subject: chinook
Keywords: update
Date: 27 Aug 92 15:14:35 GMT
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada

The results for Wednesday were 4 draws.

Tinsley is leading 16.5 points to 15.5.  Today is a rest day
there will be 4 games played on Friday and 4 on Saturday.

Janet
From: albert@HPLWK.HPL.HP.COM (Joseph Albert)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Fischer's girlfriend
Date: 3 Sep 92 22:07:37 GMT


There has been previous mention of Fischer's girlfriend, without a name
given. According to the NY Times Aritcle describing game 1, she is a
19-year-old Hungarian woman named Zita Rajcszanyi.  Her relationship
with Fischer is believed to be a very significant force in motivating
Fischer ot play again.

The article also says that a banner was displayed over the game while
in progress, and read, `World Chess Championship', further confirmation
of Fischer's contention/belief/fantasy that he is still champion, and
this is Spassky's rematch for losing the title.

Some other commentary-- 

`This was a beautiful game.  The Fischer now seems to be the Fischer of
 20 years ago.' -GM Aleksandre Nikitin

`There is the same implacable logic about Fischer's play. On the chess
 board, he is a man who never compromises.' -GM Bachar Kouatly

`In this one-sided battle, it's hard to tell whether Fischer showed some
 of his old brilliance, or whether Spassky rolled over and played dead....
 ... For Fischer to prove anything, Spassky will have to put up a
 better fight.' -IM George Koltanowski


----

joseph albert
albert@hplabs.hp.com
From: annan@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: 2-2 after 20 games
Date: 23 Aug 92 15:19:10 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

Apparently Chinook crashed in the 18th game and had to resign. But it recovered
to play the next two games.

2-2 at the half-way point, then.

Who said computers never got tired?


-- 
James Annan.
                [---------------------------------------------]
                [  I can't find a political joke to fill this ]
                [   space with - they're all away on holiday. ]
                [---------------------------------------------]
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: hyatt@cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt)
Subject: Re: Computers vs. Humans: The struggle begins
Organization: University of Alabama at Birmingham
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 00:52:41 GMT

In article <1992Aug28.160538.6326@iscsvax.uni.edu> larwick2476@iscsvax.uni.edu writes:
>Hello chess fans,
>        I thought that you should know that one of the major things that was
>discussed at the meetings during the U.S. Open this year was the topic of
>mandating that players play computers... I am happy to report that they are
>going to revise the book so that it is mandatory.  This will provide a whole
>new aspect into the great tournaments of today.  C ya at the next U.S. Open!
>
>P.S. - I won 4 out of 6 this year!
>            (Busy Person Schedule)
>


I love arguing both sides of this contest, but, exactly HOW did the USCF
decide to do this?  Did they poll ANYBODY?  (besides the commercial
vendors anyway.....)  This is back to the position we were discussing
last week.  It is ONE of the two possible outcomes, but, unless the
majority of USCF players agree, it will turn out to be a bad one.....

Bob

-- 
!Robert Hyatt                    Computer and Information Sciences   !
!hyatt@cis.uab.edu               University of Alabama at Birmingham !
From: elkies@ramanujan.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Re: Rook vs Pawns ending (Alburt-Dlugy)
Date: 4 Sep 92 15:36:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Sep4.113642.15364
Organization: Harvard Math Department

In article <Bu0wr3.6nG@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
ceblair@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Charles Blair) writes:

: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    This position (Alburt-Dlugy,
: |   | r |   |///|   |///|   |///|    New York Open) was discussed
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    by Patrick Wolff in the
: |///|   |///|   | k |   |///|   |    August Chess Life, page 43.
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    Alburt lost after 1 Ka5.
: | P | K |   |///| p |///|   |///|    Wolff says ``White had
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    to try 1 Kc5.''  Doesn't
: |///| P |///|   |///|   |///|   |    1 Kc7 draw?  (1 Kc7 Rxb5
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    2 a7 Ra5 3 Kb7 Kd6 4 a8Q Rxa8
: |   |///|   | P |   |///|   |///|    5 Kxa8 Kd5 =) 
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    
: |///|   |///|   | P |   |///|   |    
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    
: |   |///|   |///|   |///|   |///|    
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    
: |///|   |///|   |///|   |///|   |    
: +---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+    

I thought the same thing, but the diagram seems to be in error,
since the Black King had already moved to the d-file.
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: huie@netcom.com (John Huie)
Subject: Fischer/Spassky Match on Prodigy Game 1 Final
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92 21:08:49 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: Rec.games.chess


Fischer      Spassky	  	   Fischer		Spassky
 White        Black	            White	         Black


1.  e4       e5			   25. Qc1		Bf8
2.  Nf3      Nc6		   26. Qa1		Qe8
3.  Bb5      a6			   27. Nf1		Be7
4.  Ba4      Nf6		   28. N1d2		Kg7
5.  O-O      Be		   	   29. Nb1	        Ne4!?
6.  Re1      b5			   30. Be4		f5
7.  Bb3      O-O		   31. Bc2		Bd5
8.  c3       d6			   32. ab5		ab5
9.  h3       Nb8		   33. Ra7		Kf6!?
10. d4       Nbd7		   34. Nbd2		Ra7
11. Nbd2     Bb7		   35. Ra7		Ra8
12. Bc2      Re8		   36. g4!		hg4
13. Nf1      Bf8		   37. hg4		Ra7
14. Ng3      g6		  	   38.  Qa7		f4
15. Bg5      h6		  	   39. Bf4!		ef4
16. Bd2      Bg7		   40. Nh4!		Bf7
17. a4       c5			   41. Qd4		Ke6
18. d5       c4		   	   42. Nf5		Bf8
19. b4       Nh7?!		   43. Qf4		Kd7
20. Be3      h5			   44. Nd4		Qe1
21. Qd2      Rf8		   45. Kg2		Bd5
22. Ra3      Ndf6		   46. Be4		Be4
23. Rea1     Qd7		   47. Ne4		Be7
24. R1a2     Rfc8		   48. Nb5		Nf8
				   49. Nbd6		Ne6
				   50. Qe5		Resigns

Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: lucho@quack.sac.ca.us (Lou Pendley)
Subject: chess clubs in santa clara county
Summary: looking for chess clubs in santa clara county
Keywords: chess clubs
Organization: The Duck Pond public unix: +1 408 249 9630, log in as 'guest'.
Distribution: ba
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 06:34:16 GMT


i'm an intermediate chess player, and i'd like to improve my game.  do
any of you know of any chess clubs, where i can improve my game to
tournament level?  i live in mountain view, and i'd prefer mv, or palo
alto, or sunnyvale if possible.

your input is appreciated.

lucho@quack.sac.ca.us


Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
From: billmers@merlyn.enet.dec.com (Meyer Billmers)
Subject: Re: Classes and Ratings
Keywords: Chess Class Rating Norm
Reply-To: billmers@merlyn.enet.dec.com (Meyer Billmers)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 12:33:03 GMT

In <palane.714850233@pv742b.vincent.iastate.edu> Paul Lane write

> Now it get confusing.

You better believe it, Paul. A detailed answer is to complicated to give
here; I read the rule about 8 
times and still wasn't sure I understood it. If you can find a souce of
Chess Life for the past several
months, there was an issue (I think about 6 months ago) that explained
the new lifetime norm system.

But in summary, the answer is that as long as your rating is 1400+, you
are a C player. That means you
can play in the under 1600 section of tournaments and compete for C
class prizes. The norms are something
else; they are cumulative and norms accumulate forever. You get a norm
for a tornament of at least 
4 rounds in which you score at least 2 points; exactly how high above 2
your score must be depends
on the number of rounds (longer tournaments are easier) and the relative
ratings between your opponents
and THE NORM YOU ARE TRYING TO ATTAIN. So it doesn't matter if your
rating is 1620 and you are a 
B player; if you haven't yet made the c or C norms, you can compute
relative scores based on 1400
(for the c norm) or 1500 (for the C norm). Each time you make the norm
for a tournament, you get 
norm points for that class norm -- I think it's 2 and you need 10 to
make the lifetime class norm,
so you need to make the C tournament norm (or higher) 5 times in your
life to win the C lifetime
class norm. Note that you can have partial scores toward several norms
at once, e.g. you can have
4 points toward c and 2 toward C at the same time.

But except for a letter next to your name in the ratings list, lifetime
norms seem to matter little.
Most players, and all tournaments, care about your actual current rating
and corresponding class.

-Meyer
From: lumme@sara.cc.utu.fi (Mikael Lumme)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Users vs MChess
Date: 3 Sep 92 06:10:52 GMT
Organization: University of Turku, Finland

In the game Users vs MChess the move of the
MChess is 36. - Rg7

 Game #2 so far:       1  e4    e5     13  O-O-O Na6   25  Rxf8+  Kxf8
                       2  f4    ef     14  Nd4   Ng3   26  Qc2    Kg8
 8 - - - - - b k -     3  Nf3   d6     15  Bb5   Qe5   27  Qf5    g3
 7 - - p - - - r p     4  d4    g5     16  Rhe1  Nc5   28  Qd7    b5
 6 p - - p - - - -     5  h4    g4     17  Nb3   Nxb3  29  a3     b4
 5 - - - P - - - -     6  Ng1   f5     18  cb    a6    30  axb4   Qe7
 4 - P - - - - Q P     7  Bxf4  fe     19  Bd3   Bf5   31  Qg4    Qe3
 3 - P N - - - p -     8  Nc3   Nf6    20  Bb1   Rae8  32  Qd7    Re7
 2 - P K R - - P -     9  d5    Bg7    21  Bf4   e3    33  Qc8+   Bf8
 1 - - - - - q - -    10  Nge2  O-O    22  Bxe3  Bxb1  34  Kc2    Qf2+
   a b c d e f g h    11  Qd2   Nh5    23  Kxb1  Nf1   35  Rd2    Qf1
                      12  Bg5   Qe8    24  Rxf1  Qxe3  36  Qg4+   Rg7


If you want to be in on the vote for the next move,
send your suggestion (along with any comments 
that you may have) to me.  On Monday, I will 
send copies of everyone's  suggestions and comments 
to everyone on the participants list.  
It is fine with me if a person wants to be in on the 
discussion without making an initial vote.  He or she just 
has to send me a note indicating this.

If you are participating for the first time in game #2,
please include some indication of your chess playing strength.
From: connors@drutx.ATT.COM (ConnorsPA)
Newsgroups: rec.games.chess
Subject: Re: Support Bobby!
Date: 1 Sep 92 03:41:33 GMT
Organization: AT&T, Denver, CO

[Ken Ramaley]
> I mean, in the great world of Chess, what happens
> if we allow wars and such to get in the way of someone as great as Fischer?
> Ask Capablanca, who was prevented from challenging Alekhine
> to regain his title due to WW II.

Hmmm... I think that after March 1942 the great Capa had rather
more difficulty with the six feet of soil above his head than with WWII.
Such positional problems still keep him in a state of perpetual check.