Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Affirmative Action should be Dead
From: <KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu>
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 07:37:28 EST
Distribution: usa
Organization: Penn State University

In article <1992Dec31.214827.21442@samba.oit.unc.edu>,
Terry.Parks@launchpad.unc.edu (Terry Parks) says:
>
>> AA is needed because whites still hire whites at the
>> expense of more qualified Blacks.
>
>And I suppose AB is needed because whites hire blacks at the expense
>of more qualified whites and AC is needed because blacks hire whites at
>the expense of more qualified blacks and AD is needed because blacks hire
>blacks at the expense of more qualified whites. Mandating the hiring of
>people because of their race as AA does is an illogical solution to
>a belief that some people were hired because of their race.

   Affirmative Action does not, repeat, DOES NOT mandate hiring of people on
the basis of race.  Terry, please go and read the language in the statutes.
Only Compnies that have a history of discriminatory hiring are covered under
AA and it does not mandate that they hire a person of a specific race, but that
they have a representative sample of people in the pool of people that they are
to hire.  Companies and idiots like yourself have taken that to mean that
quotas are necessary.  When I look through the Employment pages I see companies
list themselves as EOE (Equal Opportunity Employers) not AAE (Affirmative
Action Employers).  Cite me where the AA statute and law specifically state a
person  of a specific race MUST be hired over a white person?

>
>> The doors of opportunity are still closed
>> for Blacks in many areas and many professions.
>
>Could you name any of these mythical areas and professions? There are
>(unfortunately) many race based opportunities but all of them are
>denied Caucasians and not Blaks.
>

    Until a few weeks ago, there were zero black head football coaches in
college football, even though there are a myriad of qualified blacks that
could be hired.  As one Athletic Director said, "I can't see a Black coach
relating to our Alumni".  That sounds like a pretty closed door.  How many
Black federal judges were appointed during the Reagan/bush era?  I watch the
Nightly news on the networks, I see a lot of Black faces!  How many Black
women are stars in Hollywood?  And the entertainment field is the one field in
which Blacks have been allowed to flourish.  What about in the corporate field,
how many white owned Fortune 500 companies have Black CEO's?  Are you saying
that there are no qualified Blacks to head a Fortune 500 company?
   I have named several profession in which the door of opportunity are closed
for Blacks, can you name me any that are closed for whites?

>> Hopefully whites will see the
>> problem with some of their hiring practices before too long.
>
>I guess you couldn't kept your racist insights to yourself.

     No racist insight here, just plain facts, with numbers to back them up
(look at the unemployment rates for blacks vs. whites over economic strata,
education attainment, etc).

>
>> AA is a good idea and if done correctly, does a lot of good.
>
>Such as? Deny hard-working, deserving people employment? AA benefits
>racists and unqualified "minorities" and women, at the expense of
>everyone else, especially non-racists and hard-working people.

  See there you are playing the stereoype game.  AA does not mandate that
anyone who is unqualified be hired for any positions.  Companies misread the
statute and feel that they have to do so.  I guess you consider yourself non-
racist?

>
>> Quotas are not part of the AA  statutes, but some people use
>> quotas because they don't know the statute.
>
>Could you name one AA program which doesn't employ quotas?

   Can you name me one that does employ quotas?  If you can name one, was that
company forced to implement quotas by statute or by their own doing?  Remember
that the Supreme Court ruled that quotas are illegal in the Bakke Case in 1978.
All AA programs that are instituted by court orders or any other orders do not
implement quotas BY LAW!  So you are going to have to tell us specifically
which ones implement quotas.

>
>> AA will never be used to protect white people because white people, at least
>> in the foreseeable future, will control the businesses and the government,
>so
>> there will be no need for AA for whites.
>
>Today, "white people" in fact, do not control businesses and the
>government. Millions of these "white people" live in poverty. The truth
>is that not one is eligible for AA race preferences which are instead
>provided to millionare "minorities".
>
>--
   Oh really, what planet do you live on?  White people control the companies,
the government (I guess the President, the Speaker of the House, the VP, etc)
are not white?)  Yes, millions of white people live in poverty, as do millions
of Black and Hispanic people.  I guess you don't know your census figures that
tell us that over 20% of Black people live in poverty and yet only 7% of white
people do.  Yes, we are all millionaires as you say!  Get real Terry you are
so full of shit that it smells all the way up here in DC!
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,soc.culture.african.american,misc.education