HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: molenda@i1.msi.umn.edu (Jason Molenda)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Re: (repost) Serdar Argic FAQ - everything you didn't want to know, but he replied anyway
Date: 3 Jan 93 01:03:38 GMT
Organization: University of Minnesota

kbibb@maui.qualcomm.com (Ken Bibb) writes:


>The person I had in mind had an address that ended with mn.org, not
>umn.edu.  I appreciate what you've been doing for mn.org, but I did
>not think that you *were* mn.org.  

I'm not affiliated with mn.org, either, of course, but it was this line
that concerned me:

>                                     The sysadmin of umn is also working
>on this problem.

There is no sysadmin of umn (umn == University of Minnesota).
-- 
Jason Molenda, University of Minnesota, Supercomputer Inst., Technical Support
SGI Iris Admin        molenda@jason.msi.umn.edu       DoD #1867     '77 CB750F
From: Karl_Kleinpaste@cs.cmu.edu
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Serdar Argic -vs- the Universe, er, Usenet
Date: 25 Dec 92 21:11:40 GMT
Organization: Carnegie-Mellon Univ, Nectar Project

It's really quite fascinating to me to watch all this.  I have been
unsubscribed from news.admin.* since their inception to replace
news.admin since I am not a newsadmin at this time.  But I recently
resubscribed for a couple of good reasons, just in time (apparently)
to see this entirely-too-amusing flame war start going down.

Anything said in response to SA (hm, interesting initials... :-) gets
a "you humiliate yourself" sort of response back from him.  He flames
at _great_ length, is evidently taking over large fractions of the
talk.* and soc.* hierarchies, and somehow feels duty-bound to include
news.admin.policy in every single posting he makes.

OK, so if he wants n.a.p involvement, here's an n.a.p question:

When is some enterprising newsadmin going to arm the Usenet Death
Penalty against Monsieur Ardic?

C'mon, folks: Is there some reason to say that the time has not come?
I'd do it myself, but I'm not a newsadmin at this point; while the
technical capability to implement the Penalty exists within me, lack
of access to a sys file would force me to occupy some horrendous
quantities of network bandwidth, to say nothing of beating further on
my NNTP server, which is already badly overloaded.  I'd rather not.

I don't care _what_ opinions Monsieur Ardic is trying to hand to the
rest of the planet; I'm having enough trouble trying to identify
exactly what his complaints are, much less why he's including n.a.p in
such postings, least of all why we're supposed to care.  The fact that
he is flaming _so_much_ in _so_many_ newsgroups is IMHO quite
sufficient justification.

A couple of amusing (to me) postscripts...
1. I don't even know what the initials "SPDA" stand for, but I suspect
that Monsieur Ardic would like to include me in their number for
suggesting this.
2. I will find it entertaining in the extreme to see Monsieur Ardic's
response to this suggestion, which will no doubt include some subset
of [a] a demand for my net acess to be removed (yeah, right, and the
Easter Bunny will be early this year); [b] a personal attack on me for
the suggestion of the levy of any type of penalty against him, let
alone the Usenet Death Penalty; [c] confused questions from Monsieur
Ardic as to the exact nature of the Usenet Death Penalty.
3. It's clear to me that Monsieur Ardic has confused the Usenet with
Real Life(tm).

The last is by far the most amusing; Monsieur Ardic manifestly doesn't
know what he's up against, as evidenced by his apparent belief that
further (continuous, ever more irritating) flaming will reinforce his
position, rather than weakening it.

For anyone else who doesn't know what the Usenet Death Penalty is...
well, just hang on a little while, someone will surely pipe up to
explain it properly.

--karl,
armed but not too dangerous
(not yet, anyway)
From: eluyten@rc1.vub.ac.be (Eric Luyten)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Re: Question about our friend
Date: 31 Dec 92 10:30:34 GMT
Organization: Brussels Free Universities (VUB/ULB), Belgium

In article <1992Dec30.154455.13365@kodak.kodak.com>,
|> dennett@acadia.Kodak.COM (Charles R. Dennett) writes:
|> I've been watching the posts fly back and forth between our
|> friend and the others.  I noticed that nothing from our friend came
|> through last night.  Did he finally get shut off? 

Everyone deserves a short break now and then... Maybe the PC was accidentally
turned off by the maid ? Disk crash ? Power failure ? Funding suspended ?

|> Also, I notice that others refer to him by different names.  Just
|> curious if someone would email me a brief history of his activities

Before I attempt to do it, has someone already done some analysis on the
stuff it produces ? i.e. Gather ALL articles originating from the site for
a certain period of time and check posting dates/times, length, consistency,
typing errors, repeats, ... ?

As a sidenote, I have to admire the thing : from a follow-up posting by me
only containing two words (posted to soc.culture.turkish) it deduced that
I was myopic (TRUE !!, but not severely, and I do wear specs), cross-posted to
a dozen newsgroups and directed followups back to soc.culture.turkish
Clearly a case of "I can shout louder than you can."

Eric.
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: kbibb@maui.qualcomm.com (Ken Bibb)
Subject: Re: (Auto?)Canceller, stop it! (Re: Cancels)
Organization: Qualcomm, Inc., San Diego, CA
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 22:49:03 GMT

In <Bzxrz8.C3F@unix.amherst.edu> twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce) writes:

>In article <root.725486928@maui> kbibb@maui.qualcomm.com (Ken Bibb) writes:

>>>Damn it, canceller, whoever you are, stop it.
>>
>>I think you have me to thank for that :-/  I complained to
>>postmaster@anatolia.mn.org that the posts were inappropriate for
>>news.admin.policy and he said that he would remove them.

>Then why were they cancelled by exile@mediaone.freeside.com?

Because exile must have gotten sick of them.  I figured it was just
anatolia (which surprised me because I didn't think that anatolia
would make any attempt to cancel the articles that were inappropriately
posted).

-- 
Ken Bibb                "he heard the snow falling faintly through the
kbibb@qualcomm.com	 universe and faintly falling, like the descent of
jester@crash.cts.com     their last end, upon all the living and the dead."
				--"The Dead", James Joyce

Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz)
Subject: Re: A R G I C allows itself far too much
Organization: Mount Holyoke College
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 18:07:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.134900.22459@refrig.dixie.com> todd@refrig.dixie.com (Todd H.) writes:
>jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:
>>Uunet /can't/ refuse service based on content...
>
>I disagree.  Uunet is a business, and can do anything it wants to.  The
>communication links they carry aren't regulated by the government, so far as
>I know, and they aren't a public utility, so they're free to cut off anyone
>that they want.

My fault for being vague... by "can't" I didn't mean "isn't allowed" to, I
meant "can't afford to".  They'd be opening themselves wide up to all sorts
of nastiness by setting a precedent for refusing service based on content.
Not the least of which would be that they'd have to start monitoring all
traffic, which is essentially impossible, and would endager their chances
of arguing "common carrier" status in a future legal action against them.

In short, they aren't going to do it.

>Y'all are just afraid to take on the task of pressuring an organization as
>large as uunet, perhaps for fear of retribution??  Seems pretty silly, really.

Oh, give me a break.  "Afraid to take on the task" my fanny... I
/support/ Uunet's policy of non-censorship 100%.  But even if I
didn't, just how do you propose to "pressure" Uunet?  What, like: "If
you don't cut off Serdar Argic we we'll boycott you."..?  Good luck
trying to organize a boycott against an organization that provides
many sorely needed services on the Net for free, never mind their
commercial importance.

Silly, indeed.
--
Jurgen Botz, jbotz@mtholyoke.edu
From: news@hrd769.brooks.af.mil (InterNet News)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Re: Is it live, or is it Memorex?
Date: 23 Dec 1992 10:07:19 -0600
Organization: Armstrong Lab MIS, Brooks AFB TX
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: hrd769.brooks.af.mil

In article <1h8l38INN7f0@agate.berkeley.edu> dev.null (Serdar Argic is a fool) writes:
>I am curious what "Serdar Argic", the AI daemon dedicated to defending
>the honor of the Turks against those evil Armenians, will do with this
>article.
>
>
>--
>Joe Buck	jbuck@ohm.berkeley.edu

  I am still trying to figure out what genocide has to do with news 
administration policies.  I did notice that the quotes have been
reasonably accurate, but no permission to copy has been given to
quote these major passages.  At least one of the documents being quoted
includes the statement "No part of this work may be reproduced in any way
without permission of ...".  Does this mean that he is violating copyright
laws and the Berne Convention, and therefore using the net for illegal 
acts?

  In his defense, he has a right (in the U.S.) to say the things he is saying.
I just wish that he understood that his methods have alienated a great many
people who still feel that what is going on in Eastern Europe is horrific. 
People that feel very deeply that what is going on is wrong and should be
stopped, and are trying through the PROPER CHANNELS.  I don't really think
that news.admin.policy is the correct place.

  Sergar, please talk to the U.N.  They are waffleing on whether to do 
anything about the internal affairs of your country.  Make them see your 
point, and make them do something about it.  I don't want to add you to my
kill file, but I may have to if you don't stick the the charter of this group.

Dave Burgess
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: kbibb@maui.qualcomm.com (Ken Bibb)
Subject: Re: Is it live, or is it Memorex?
Organization: Qualcomm, Inc., San Diego, CA
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 01:04:15 GMT

In <1992Dec23.164853.27785@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com> c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos) writes:

>In article <1ha2rnINNbd6@hrd769.brooks.af.mil> news@hrd769.brooks.af.mil (InterNet News) writes:

>But he pays a few dollars a month to UUNET for a one direction only news
>feed. Not that UUNET would ever release connection times with 
>anatolia.mn.org (Hi, Ahmet!) but I'd bet it's POST-ONLY. So, for a few
>dollars a week out of pocket cost to him he gets 2 1/2 million readers.
>Pretty bloody economical, wouldn'nt you say? 

>Mutlu's actual cost to the net is not much; compare his volume to one
>post in comp.binaries and he's minor league. But the precedent he
>sets, namely, that USENET is too slow or too unwilling to respond to
>even MAJOR abusers is extremely scary.

I suggest that those of you who have problems with Ahmet/Argic/Mutlu
send email to THEIR feed (uunet) to see if they plan on doing anything
about this problem.

-- 
Ken Bibb                "he heard the snow falling faintly through the
kbibb@qualcomm.com	 universe and faintly falling, like the descent of
jester@crash.cts.com     their last end, upon all the living and the dead."
				--"The Dead", James Joyce

Newsgroups: news.admin.policy,alt.fan.hasan-mutlu,alt.fan.serdar-argic,soc.culture.turkish,trial.test,alt.destroy.the.earth,alt.devilbunnies,alt.religion.kibology,alt.flame,alt.cascade
From: jfurr@nyx.cs.du.edu (Joel Furr)
Subject: "Serdar Argic" vs. Kibo with DEVILBUNNIES
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Keywords: turkey genocide armenia
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 92 12:12:33 GMT

In article <9212271658@zuma.UUCP> sera@zuma.UUCP (Serdar Argic) writes:
>In article <BzuL9s.CCy@polaris.async.vt.edu> jfurr@polaris.async.vt.edu (J. Furr) writes:
>>Or perhaps someone here can help me.  Assuming I'm in my killfile and know
>>how to type, how do I set things up to kill all posts authored by "Serdar
>>Argic"?
>
>Thanks so much. By the way, you make me laugh.

"Serdar Argic", you think you're hot stuff, right?  You think you've got
the entire net on the run from your AI-produced idiocy?  Buddy, you
haven't BEGUN to touch on the track record of grep-produced followups the
ALL-TIME CHAMPION holds.  

I'll be impressed when "Serdar Argic" takes on KIBO and comes out
standing.  Not that it'll ever happen, of course.  "Serdar Argic" is too
GUTLESS to fight.
From: c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com (Spiros Triantafyllopoulos)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Re: A R G I C allows itself far too much
Date: 2 Jan 93 01:55:08 GMT
Organization: Delco Electronics Corp.

In article <C04ID2.Mv9@polaris.async.vt.edu> jfurr@polaris.async.vt.edu (J. Furr) writes:
>>Serdar Argic is none other than Hasan B Mutlu of Chicago, IL. (He's
>>in the phone book also). Argic's differences with Mutlu include the
>>fact that Mutlu used single quotes when molesting peoples' names
>>while Argic uses doubles, a different signature, and different email
>>address. 
>
>How do you know that Argic=Mutlu if they both have phone numbers?

To paraphrase a proverb, if it posts like a Mutlu, it insults like
a Mutlu, and behaves like a Mutlu, it is a Mutlu.

Serdar Argic is nothing more than a pen name. Since our friend is an
accomplished researcher in the field of data communications and
networking, I'd guess having his real name dragged all over USENET 
(in a rather exciting way I should add) is more of a liability.

My characterization of this is Chickensuit, inspired after the man
in a chickensuit appearing at Pres. Bush's rallies planted by Clinton
supporters (for the debate issue). 

Hence my many references to him as Mr. Chickensuit, and my now-famous
poultry articles and poultry .signature. From a News.admin.policy
standpoint though, is there an ethical problem to post under an
alias and a non-responding (or fake, depending on circumstances) 
user ID to avoid professional embarassment?

Spiros
-- 
Spiros Triantafyllopoulos                    c23st@kocrsv01.delcoelect.com
Software Technology, Delco Electronics       (317) 451-0815
GM Hughes Electronics, Kokomo, IN 46904      [A Different Kind of Disclaimer]
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: elle@kimbark.uchicago.edu (Ellen Keyne Seebacher)
Subject: Re: Canceling other people's postings
Reply-To: elle@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:45:22 GMT

In article <ByuG25.A5v@mtholyoke.edu> jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:
>... I stated that the only time that it's appropriate for
>a third party to cancel a post is in the case of a moderator canceling
>unapproved articles to his/her group.

Or, perhaps, someone helping the moderator do that.  I've canceled a
clearly inappropriate article forged to news.announce.important, and
no one except the perpetrator seemed to object.

--
Ellen Keyne Seebacher              news@uchinews.uchicago.edu
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: molenda@i1.msi.umn.edu (Jason Molenda)
Subject: Re: Yeah! Argic has called!
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 15:44:57 GMT

exile@mediaone.freeside.com (Exile in Paradise) writes:

>intentionally bait him some more. A few questions: why hasn't anyone at 
>anatolia or uunet done anything about him? Is there really anything that 
>*can* be done without setting bad precendent (as I did) or infringing on 
>netiquette? If there is something that can be done, is anyone 
>coordinating it? What would the ramifications be? I will be mailing for 

I'm attempting (rather unsuccessfully :-() a dialogue with the system
administrator of anatolia.mn.org based on the assumption that he isn't
aware of what is going on.  He's an awesome manipulator of words and
I'm not exactly the best communicator on the face of the earth, so it
isn't going well.

Although I am not involved with the mn.org people (short of living in
the same state), I think they are in the same position as uunet.  They
accepted moolah for services and those services cannot be revoked
arbitrarily.  Even if they were, it would simply mean you couldn't send
mail through anatolia.mn.org; the sysadmin could still dump the news
through uunet (as he's been doing).  Unfortunately, this is (a)
providing a lot of bad press for the hard-working mn.org people, and
(b) causing problems with their news gateway machines as people
mail-bomb anatolia.mn.org.

My opinions and statements are in no way the opinions of the University
of Minnesota, the Minnesota Supercomputer Institute, or the Unix Users
of Minnesota.  I'm just some bum with a keyboard. :)
-- 
Jason Molenda, University of Minnesota, Supercomputer Inst., Technical Support
SGI Iris Admin        molenda@jason.msi.umn.edu       DoD #1867     '77 CB750F
From: Christophe.Wolfhugel@grasp.insa-lyon.fr (Christophe Wolfhugel)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Encoding Mime articles before transmission ?
Date: 1 Jan 1993 19:34:48 +0100
Organization: INSA Informatique (Grasp), Lyon, France
NNTP-Posting-Host: grasp1.univ-lyon1.fr
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

What policy should a site adopt when forwarding Mime articles ?
There are currently sites posting and sending articles in 8bit
(Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit), which is fine on the 8-bit
news systems.  But I doubt that currently the sender would
encode it in "quoted-printable" before transmitting to a 7-bit
site.

Is it reasonnable if a site performs such conversion before
forwarding the article to its 7-bit neighbors (and possibly to
many other sites behind).

I offten see articles coded in "8bit" arriving here, for example
in comp.sys.next groups.  I can forward them as is to the other
sites, regardless if they support 7 or 8 bit, or encode them in
"quoted-printable", and at this point articles would get converted
back only if the newsreader has the adequate software.

This is not a technical question... software already exists
(in beta :)) for converting articles within the news system.

-- 
Christophe Wolfhugel    |    Email: Christophe.Wolfhugel@grasp.insa-lyon.fr
  "Dernier reve de 92: demain l'Europe ..."
From: rick@ricksys.lonestar.org (RIchard McCombs)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Re: (Auto?)Canceller, stop it! (Re: Cancels)
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 03:18:27 CST
Organization: The Red Headed League; Lawton, Ok
X-Newsreader: rusnews v0.96

jbotz@mtholyoke.edu (Jurgen Botz) writes:

> In article <1992Dec27.165426.27597@ennews.eas.asu.edu> sridhar@asuvax.eas.asu.edu (Sridhar Venkataraman ) writes:
>>Works for rn. I was waiting to test the following line in the killfile
>>when I noticed that nothing got killed because someone else seems
>>to be doing a cancel for everyone of us!
> 
> Uh huh... something I don't appreciate in the least, because I was looking
> forward to Argyc's (sic) response to Josh Smith's jibberish article.
> 
> Damn it, canceller, whoever you are, stop it.  Robot or no robot,

It was not a robot it was a standard Waffle cancel; Waffle just happens
to let either the person that sent the message cancel it, or anyone with
sysop level access.

-- 
Internet: rick@ricksys.lonestar.org,      bo836@cleveland.freenet.edu
UUCP: ...!rwsys!ricksys!rick,   {backbones}!ricksys.lonestar.org!rick
BITNET: bo836%cleveland.freenet.edu@cunyvm  Fidonet: Richard McCombs @ 1:385/6
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: molenda@i1.msi.umn.edu (Jason Molenda)
Subject: Re: Serdar is furry? (was Re: Quicksilver virus on furry Muck -- solved!)
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 23:55:51 GMT

kbibb@maui.qualcomm.com (Ken Bibb) writes:

>In <C0Au7L.82H@polaris.async.vt.edu> jfurr@polaris.async.vt.edu (J. Furr) writes:

>>being Targhan but has admitted being Targhan to several people.  Targhan
>>and Korthedon also have the same email address, mtymp06@staff.tc.umn.edu.

>Isn't this coincidental? ;)  Maybe it's Mutlu again, he slurs, etc...

jeez, we just can't get a break around here! :-)

chances are it's a different person.  i don't have any access to
staff.tc (not even an account), but the possibility of there being two
shmucks at the U of MN is pretty high.  I think we have something like
35,000 or more full-time students, all with accounts now.

I don't know anything about Muck or Furry or any of these other words I
see being used, so I'm staying out of this one.
-- 
Jason Molenda, University of Minnesota, Supercomputer Inst., Technical Support
SGI Iris Admin        molenda@jason.msi.umn.edu       DoD #1867     '77 CB750F
From: exile@mediaone.freeside.com (Exile in Paradise)
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
Subject: Cancels
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 92 13:59:22 CST
Organization: Media One Studios

Hellay there everyone! It is I, Exile, posting to apologize to everyone 
who was annoyed at my cancels... I was just fed up with 30 posts by this 
guy a day hitting my site. It really was an experiment to see how the 
Internet handles cancels, and now I know... I have only been online here 
for 2 weeks steadily and finally said "What the Hell, try it" and I did. 
Really, I wish the Argic material was a AI-like program or some such, 
because I would like to see the coding! Alas it is not to be... instead 
we (everyone NOT argic) are forced to stand idly by while the InterNet 
terrorist Argic continues unabated attack on everything not even related 
to what He is babbling about. Well, you all have set the policy and *I* 
will abide by from now on, yet I won't hesitate to help anyone who finds 
a way to silence the endless babble from zuma. The mental picture here is 
frightening to say the least. Anyway, thanks for your posts about proper 
policy and again, apologies to all who were annoyed, but I felt I should 
at least try it once and *see* for myself.
L8r

--[Exile in Paradise: exile@mediaone.freeside.com ]------------------------
: All sentient beings are created unequal, The best society provides each :
: with equal opportunity to float at his own level - The Gowachin Primary :
--[ Media One Studios: +1-(713)-944-4176 ]---------------------------------
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: Killfiles
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 23:58:19 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <BzuL9s.CCy@polaris.async.vt.edu> jfurr@polaris.async.vt.edu (J. Furr) writes:
>Or perhaps someone here can help me.  Assuming I'm in my killfile and know
>how to type, how do I set things up to kill all posts authored by "Serdar
>Argic"?

The relevant line in mine reads:

/Serdar Argic/h:j

which kills all articles with his name anywhere in the header.  If you
are really feeling unfriendly, change the "h" to "a" to kill all articles
which even mention him (although this will take a bit longer at startup).
-- 
"God willing... we shall return."       | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
       -Gene Cernan, the Moon, Dec 1972 |  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy
From: Volkmar.Grote@Stollmann.DE (Volkmar Grote)
Subject: Re: The Serdar Argic thing.
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 92 01:00:53 GMT
Organization: Stollmann GmbH, D-2000 Hamburg 50, Germany
Originator: vg@sai1

dgilbert@gamiga.uucp (dgilbert) writes:

| 	I've only been following this discussion for a couple of days, but
| today's posts seemed only to confim (not deny as they were intended
| to) the position of the net in general vs. Serdar Argic.  In
| particular, he quoted a short amount of my previous post, then
| proceeded in a completely off topic post of some other information
| that has absolutely no relavance to news.admin.policy whatsoever.
[rest deleted]

It has been suspected before, that "mutlu/argic" is not a person,
but some kind of "eliza" program. Obviously there is a bug, which made
it start in "news.admin.policy" while scanning for "politics".
The volume and pitch is annoying, but it is nice to watch it working.

Volkmar
Newsgroups: news.admin.policy