From: dan@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Dan Parmenter)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.misc
Subject: Evan Dorkin and...El Santo (was Re: Bill & Ted's Excellent Comic)
Date: 8 Jan 93 19:57:21 GMT
	<1993Jan6.005829.13493@news2.cis.umn.edu>
	<DAN.93Jan7124300@spiff.gnu.ai.mit.edu> <4qzrx!j@lynx.unm.edu>
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Organization: /home/fsg/dan/.organization

Okay, I spelled El Santo's name wrong.  But I don't think that
invalidates my assertions.  In fact, I freely admit, I've never seen a
Santo movie.  I'm dying to, but I haven't been able to find them;
however, based on comments made elsewhere, I know that Kanterovich and
Brevoort (or one of them) who wrote the fill-in of Bill and Ted *are*
Santo fans, and their issue makes specific references to at least one
Santo movie, whereas if you study Dorkin's drawing of the Santo
t-shirt (did I mention that the El Santo reference was on a t-shirt?)
you'll notice that he doesn't even draw the mask right.  My point is
that if you're going to make a reference, get it right.  My failure to
do so with regard to Santo's name is a beautiful illustration of this
point :-) Yeah right.

Dorkin's musical tastes: I agree with whoever it was who said that
Dorkin obviously has no affinity for a pair of metalhead characters
like Bill and Ted, which is why he transformed them into alternative
wannabes.  As a matter of fact, that *is* more or less my "scene", or
one of them; however, I don't think that's Bill and Ted's world at
all, and taking them out of their familiar setting and recasting them
as alt-geeks makes no sense within the context of those characters and
their world.  I *loved* the first Bill and Ted movie.  Despite being
about people that I probably wouldn't hang out with in real life, the
film forced me to see the world through their eyes and buy into their
shallow worldview.  Through the course of the movie, the characters
actually, well, evolve and change.  The film also had all sorts of
clever bits that even made for good science fiction (their time travel
hijinks are easily among the best-done I've ever seen in a movie, with
some wonderful twists), yet you never forgot that the story is
essentially about a couple of goofy teenagers with lousy musical
taste.  I guess an author writes about what they know, and evidently
Dorkin doesn't know much more than the world of comic books and
"alternative" music scenes.  I have a general dislike lately for
cartoonists that seek to demonstrate their hipness by *constantly*
throwing in hip references to bands or whatever.  I couldn't care less
that Evan Dorkin put The Residents in Bill and Ted, and I *love* the
Residents.  I have many of their albums and have seen them perform
what was one of the best shows I've ever attended (guess I'm hip, I
made a reference to The Residents).  This kind of attitude reduces
complex cultural phenomena to the level of a hip reference point.
Indeed, this is a symptom of much of modern life - no one ever says or
does anything original, they quote another "hip 'n' clever" person
instead.  How many times have you said something witty and original,
only to have someone laugh and say "Where's that from?", as if all
humor was necessarily derived from "The Simpsons", Monty Python
routines and Dave Barry.  Nowadays one can ftp the complete indexed
quote list from "Mystery Science Theater 3,000", oh, pardon me, I mean
"MST3K", and that strikes me as rather sad - someone typing pages and
pages of someone else's jokes instead of their own.  Cartoonists like
Dorkin seem to primarily function not by writing stories, but by
stringing together hip references and a lot of "attitude" humor that
seems more based on insulting and jockeying for superiority than on
real wit.  Consider this quotation from "Milk and Cheese": "You ass
backwards MTV watching top 40 singing backwoods jerkwater LOSER!"
That's pretty typical of Dorkin's "humor".  

His strip in Reflex with Kyle Baker reflects their limited
sensibilities, and their characterization of the "types" that inhabit
that world show no real insight or humor.  I've seen at least two or
more Dorkin-related music strips where he rants on about these "bitchy"
girls that don't want anything to do with him.  Oh Ev, you're so
*vicious*!  "I'll show that bitch...I'll..DO A COMIC STRIP ABOUT HER!"
I've heard random music scenemakers (including people on the net,
such as Lazlo Nibble) make more interesting and witty comments on that
world than anything I've seen out of  Dorkin and Baker.

Actually, Dorkin comes across a bit better in interviews.  I've even
used some of his comments about Ren and Stimpy in my own vicious
screeds on that overrated "hip" reference point (which Dorkin claims
to dislike as much as I do).  He also surprised me with some
unexpected "references" to things like Jack Kirby (my soft spot) that
while no funnier than his other references seemed to represent at
least a slightly broader perspective.  But even if he did nothing but
Kirby, Ditko and "Music Man" references, if he wasn't bringing
anything original to it, I wouldn't care.

As cartoonists go, Dorkin is still fairly young, and if he's really as
good as people think, he'll eventually start doing things with a bit
more originality and less obvious "attitude".  After re-examining some
of his art in light of this discussion, I've concluded that he's
definitely got some drawing ability, and I will continue to observe
his career with interest.  But if Bill and Ted, Milk and Cheese and
what I've seen of his other stuff is any indication, than it may be a
bit of a wait.

- Dan

--
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| Dan Parmenter       |"I'm waiting for a time, when I can do without these  |
| dan@gnu.ai.mit.edu  | things that make me feel this way all of the time"   |
|                     |                            - Spiritualized           |
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