HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:39:15 -0500 
From: Adrian Yiu <ay24+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: "Do you mind if she's a virgin or not?"

In article <1992Nov9.193707.6222@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, pchang@magnus.acs.
ohio-state.edu (Pei-Yuan Chang) writes:
> Interesting and exciting topic to you men, huh?  Well, just one of my male
> friends told me that he minds very much about whether his future wife is a
> virgin or not.  "How could you check it?  You are not a Gynecologist!"  I sai
>

All I can say is that your guy friends/friend are pretty pathetic. Not
that I'm dissing them but if we talk about long-lasting relationships
(Possibly marring one another) then we/I must take this issue seriously.
 Let me set up a scenario:

I have a girlfriend and I loved her a lot.(She was a virgin)  One day we
made love to each other. Then, one day we break-up and she finds the
PERFECT man for herself. But it seems that the only problem they have is
that he takes this issue seriously that he would not marry a woman who
is not a virgin. But lets also say that he really wants to make love
with her, but they are not married!! So what do you think of this "guy"
that I portrayed?? We can't ask girls/women not to have sex before
marriage, when guys want to have sex and not take the responsibility for
having sex with a virgin. Why don't you guys marry the one you had sex
with, ( a virgin ). Do you see the picture or arguement?? Its not fair
to girls...But its seems to me that we still live in a
male-dominant,male chauvanistic society. 

I'm not talking about AIDS or effective birthcontrol techniques, I'm
trying to say that men should not consider virginity as a factor in
considering marriage, if you do then you really are mentally demented or
have a Really serious "personality problem". Okay, to you conservative
males, Hey, do what ever you want, have sex after marraige, but remember
to swear to god that you will never have sex before marraige or else
don't even bother to reply because, your just too fickle and don't
believe what you believe in...

Believer,

<<ANLY>> 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: KMT campus spying activities in the U.S.
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 02:05:19 GMT

In article <9231412.15685@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby) writes:
>To the Canadian:
>
>If you're not Chinese, then, shut your mouth up!
>
>Didn't your mother teach you not to get involved in other people's
>domestic dispute?

I suggest *you* shut your mouth up.  (And no, I am not the Canadian...)
This is what the communist regime in Beijing says when other nations try to
get them to improve their human rights record; this is what the rump Yugoslav
government says when they support ethnic cleansing; this is what the Khmer
Rouge says when they massacred 1/7 of the Cambodian population.

When something has international ramifications or deals with a basic right of
the humanity, it no longer is a domestic issue.
From: sher@.umd.edu (C. Allen Sher)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Black list and etc.
Summary: The issue is citizenship, NOT action or thought
Date: 13 Nov 92 17:11:10 GMT
Organization: U of Maryland, Center for Automation Research, Coll. Pk., MD 20742


In article <17466@borg.cs.unc.edu> chu@church.cs.unc.edu (Heng Chu) writes:
>In article <BxL4vp.My4@news.iastate.edu> wwang@iastate.edu (Wen-Ping Wang) writes:

	Regarding the "blacklist" issue

>This is a result of inappropriate laws backing up the wrong doing.
>Blacklist is not necessarily bad, it just depends on what it is based
>on. I believe most people wish real terrorists on the black list, but
>not those 'preparing for sedition'...... I am really interested to
>know what people say about those still on the blacklist.


On the contrary, I do not agree with the idea that
if someone is "believed" to be a terrorist (whatever that means),
she/he should be barred from returning her/his home country.
The issue is NOT what line of thinking she/he takes
or what actions she/he might have taken,
the issue is whether that person is a CITIZEN of that nation or not!
If she/he is a citizen or national of a country,
she/he should never be barred from returning to that country.
This is in accordance with the idea of "the liberty to travel" principle
and is prescribed in ROC's constitution.

The judiciary can prosecute these people AFTER they have returned,
but they should not have the authority to forbid them from returning.
If they are really the "trouble", barring them from returning
means that you dump this "trouble" to some other country.
That is hardly a heroic or responsible attitude, is it?



---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-   C. Allen Sher                     / \         --       ---   --       -
-   sher@cfar.umd.edu                /---\     --------   ----- ---|      -
-   (301)405-1766                   /_____\      /  \      ---  __ | /    -
-   Computer Vision Laboratory     /  /|\  \    /\  /\     ---    ||/     -
-   Center for Automation Research   / | \        \/       ---   / |\     -
-   University of Maryland          /  |  \       /\       | |  /  | \    -
-   College Park, MD 20742         /   |   \     /  \      ---     |      -
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-          AN EYE FOR AN EYE MAKES THE WHOLE WORLD BLIND.                 -
-                                                --  MAHAMAT GANDHI       -
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- 

---- C. Allen Sher ----------------------------------------------
-    Center for Automation Research     |    (301)405-1766      -
-    University of Maryland             |    sher@cfar.umd.edu  -
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: ptyshih@watnow.uwaterloo.ca (Paul T.Y. Shih(Taku))
Subject: Re: "Do you mind if she's a virgin or not?"
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 23:16:42 GMT

In article <1992Nov11.173956.1600@awdprime.austin.ibm.com> tylee@leety.austin.ibm.com (Ty Lee) writes:
>
>Can't agree less with you.
>	
	Fine with me, everyone is supposed to have his own way of judging.

>This is ridiculous to say a person from Taipei remained virgin when 25 is
>"from a very conservative family, or has some personality problems"....
>
	I am not encouraging casual sex either, but the truth is that 
	young generation in Taipei are getting more westernized these
	years and sex relationships among young couples are very common
	too. I read a result of a pull held by a newspaper, 30 something
	percent of university students in Taiwan have sex experience,
	but that was 6 or 7 years ago and I personally think that the
	real number is far more than that. 

>I don't know if this gentleman had enough evidence to support his claim,
>or, if his personal taste favored non virgin sex partner to take advantage
>of the experinced one's skill in lovemaking.
>	
	I think the point is that do you have a proper concept towards
	sex. Having sex with someone you love is definitely not shameful.
	During different stages of life, one might have different criterias
	for choosing a lover too. Say you happened to love someone at your
	teenage and that someone loved you very much at that time too, then
	if sexual relationship happened between you and that someone, it
	is not shameful, in stead, it is natural. Maybe you broke up 
	afterwards, but that doesn't mean any one of you have to bear a bad
	name even you lost your virginity. The reason why I made that
	claim is that young people in Taipei get a lot more chances to fall
	into boy-girl friends relationships, so the probability of having
	sex with your boy(girl) friends is relative much higher. 

	
>Why is it to remain virgin is unhealthy to you? Should people from Taipei
>go out to have stray (casual) sex before 25 to be healthy to you?
>	
	Did I mention anything about encouraging casual sex before? The
	fact is that if one doesn't suppress his (or her) biological
	need, then having sex with his (or her) lover is nothing more  
	but a natural thing. Do you think that it is healthy to suppress
	one's biological need? I think in stead of arguing whether virginity
	is important or not, we should put more attention on teaching young
	generation how to have a safe sex because this is really the point.


	
>
>Where is your Zen master when you had an orgy?
>
	Zenism teaches you to enjoy the real life, sex is part of the real
	life too.

>>	Paul
>-- 
>/* The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of IBM's.         *\
> * Take care and have a nice day.                                            *
>\* Ty Lee                                                                    */
From: ykhsu@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (yung-kao.hsu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Reduldant and stupid obligatory military service
Date: 9 Nov 92 14:47:46 GMT
Organization: AT&T

In article <1992Nov8.235554.28812@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>Premier Hao (who still has the power of the military on his side, in the
>forms of allies as commanders) has publicly stated that the army will *not*
>protect a Republic of Taiwan should Taiwan become independent.  To me, that
>is a strong declaration that the army is loyal to the present regime, not to
>the people.

	Hao's statement certainly shows his stupidity (yes, I still
	think he should not be the Premier and Lee is a poor president).
	If Taiwan ever becomes indpendent, he would have already been
	relieved of his duty, and he would have no army to pay his
	loyality. Both Hao and some `jornalists' had attempted to promote
	the myth that he owned the army for political gains, but the fact
	is that Lee (to his credit) was/is able to cut this myth.

	To me, many high level commanders supports Hao because he
	represents their interests in the government (e.g., promotion
	and money allocation).  Their loyality ends when he can no longer
	represent their interestsi; just like a corrupted politican cannot
	win votes when he runs out of "candy".

	Still, I can understand a person who escapes the draft with this
	political objection. But to escape a draft because it wastes one's
	time is not understandable to me.

Yung-Kao Hsu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: kao@cae.wisc.edu (Chengheng Kao)
Subject: Re: Reduldant and stupid obligatory military service
Organization: College of Engineering, Univ. of Wisconsin-Madison
Date: 6 Nov 92 17:02:46 CST
Originator: kao@sun-29.cae.wisc.edu


In article <1992Nov4.170232.15076@zip.eecs.umich.edu>, cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes:
|> >I treasure my experience in my ROTC service. I made a lot of friends and I 
|> >thinks these friendship will lasts a lifetime. I had a lot of hard
|> >time in the service but this experience transformed me from a boy to a man.
|> >
|> 
|> I did make quite a few friends when I served in the army, but none of them
|> is still contacting me 10 years later. 
|> A boy can be transformed into a man in many ways. Especially, when you get
|> older you become more of a man than a boy natuarally.

You are wright boy can become man in many ways. But boy never become man
naturally. I have met too many 50 years old boys to justify my previous
sentence.
 
|> >When I just entered the service, I was viewed as a over-pampered cry baby by
|> >my superiors and even by my own soliders, I proved them wrong and  won their
|> >respects. 
|> >
|> 
|> A man can get respected from people in many ways. In fact, it is rather
|> easy to get respected in army than in real life. A man can get respected
|> from his children but not his wife, or his parents but not his friends, etc. 
|> But in the military, as long as you behave dumb enough you
|> will get all respects from every one.
|>

Your perception of " respect" is really demeaning to the word "respect".
I never respect anyone if he cannot live up to my standard no matter 
how high ranking a officer he is, how rich he is, or how important he is.
From you perception of "respect", I think you must "respect" a lot of
skum.

|> >It can be argued that two of the more creative years of a people life is
|> >wasted in the military service. May be I could have write a few more articles
|> >and got my Ph.D degree eariler if I did not have to serve in the military. 
|> >But I think the expericence in the military will serve me well for the 
|> >rest of my life and the price of two years is nothing.
|> >
|> 
|> Of cause it is very unlikely to find some thing which is totally waste from
|> every point of view, but in a modern society like today, should we do some
|> thing which will give us the best return ? I believe it is obvious when we
|> talk about business, isn't it ? 
|> 
|> So, underutilize the human resource of thousands of college graduates in the
|> military service is unacceptable to a small country like Taiwan. Taiwanese
|> can't afford to continue underutilize every precious human resource in our
|> country in order to become a developed country.
|> 
|> Yi-Chieh

As have been pointed out by many wise netters, it is not a matter of personal
consideration but a matter of person`s responsibility to the society.
I agree whole-heart with you a lot of improvement in Taiwan's ROTC
system is needed, but that is another story and have nothing to be with
our arguments here.
From: li@sicvax.enet.dec.com (Tong-Kang Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: The One China, One Taiwan Policy
Date: 10 Nov 92 17:15:20 GMT
Article-I.D.: nntpd.1992Nov10.171903.20889
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1992Nov8.223928.22808@zip.eecs.umich.edu>, cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes...
> 
>Taiwan doesn't have to do business with China, but China needs Taiwan's 
>investmnet desperately. Besides, most of the inter-strait business go 
>through Hong Kong, if China shut off Taiwan's opportunity, Hong Kong will be 
>hurt seriously which is against CCP's promise of keeping Hong Kong unchanged 
>and prosperous for another 50 years. And also according to Fortune or 
>Money magazine, most of the South Eastern Asia countries will will a bright 
>economy in the near future, so there are many invetment opportunities than 
>invetors. I doubt China can afford to lose any potential big investor for 
>whatever reason. It is investor market not being invested market.

China needs the outside investment very much including from Taiwan's but not 
that desparately. Japan, South Korea, HK are aggressively pouring money into 
China now. China needs Taiwan's investment not only for economic but also 
political purposes. Taiwan's businessmen complain about the government's ban 
of direct trade with China. This year, Taiwan's economic growth will reach ~7%, 
trade with China plays an important role. Some Taiwan's businessmen have said 
because of the same heritage and language, etc particulary in FuJian area is 
the main reason they invest in China. ALso China is potential hugh "domestic" 
market few Taiwan's corporations can ignore (China allows some Taiwan's 
companies sell some % of the products internally). I think once Taiwan 
establish the direct trade, sea and air links with China we can foresee 
Taiwan's investment rush in China. 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: KMT campus spying activities in the U.S.
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 04:23:33 GMT

In article <9231614.118@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby) writes:

>Western Christian standard.  We, easterners, are not obligated to observe
>standards that are set under Christian/Western influences; and that's why

Why not?

>UN now has an Asian Human Rights Committee, which is different from the
>standards set for other countries.

And those are?  Don't tell me it approves of the Khmer Rouge's massacre of
1/7 of the Cambodian population.
>
>Just for the record, I'm a Christian, but I don't believe Chinese people
>*need* to follow Christian moral standards.

And what do they need to follow?  Please elaborate.  I am merely talking
about human rights here, not about morality.  Or do you mean that Asian
governments should not need to give their citizens freedom of speech,
freedom of assembly, freedom of religion, etc.?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: huangp@ralphie.Colorado.EDU (PeiYu Huang)
Subject: F-16
Reply-To: huangp@ralphie.Colorado.EDU (PeiYu Huang)
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 15:59:10 GMT

[UPI, 11/12/1992] FORT WORTH, TEXAS  --  General  Dynamics  Corp.  announced
Thursday  the  United  States  and  Taiwan agreed on the sale of 150 F-16A/B
fighters, a deal made  possible  by  President  Bush.  The  new  planes  for
Taiwan's air force will be made at GD's Fort Worth plant. "When added to the
24 F-16s the U.S. Air Force plans to procure  annually,  the  F-16  sale  to
Taiwan  strengthens  the  F-16  production base in the United States for the
rest of the decade," GD's announcement said. "The sale will provide signifi-
cant  employment  at  the Fort Worth division and a large number of supplier
firms that produce various components and equipment for the Fighting  Falcon
in 47 states." (Forwarded by: A CND reader)
From: claude@trc.mew.mei.co.jp (Claude Huss)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: "Do you mind if she's a virgin or not?"
Date: 11 Nov 92 08:57:10 GMT
	<sJB=H4+@engin.umich.edu> <BxHGM5.Guv@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>
Organization: Matsushita Electric Works Ltd., Tokyo, Japan.


Paul> 	Can't agree more. Actually if a girl from Taipei remains virgin
Paul> 	after she reach 25, either she's from a very conservative family,
        -------------------
Paul> 	or she has some personality problems, or she has some personal
Paul> 	probelms. Same for men. And I think that is too unhealthy.


Should this be true? I have discussed it with many taiwanese friends
of mine here in Tokyo (male and female) and all of them were very
assertive about how  important would be to marry a "virgin
woman" in Taiwan. A friend of mine said if a woman is not virgin
would be a kind of shame to marry a taiwanese.

Could someone tell more about sexual behaviours in Taiwan? 


--
         ,,, 
        (o o)           
----oOO--( )--OOo----------------------------------------------------------
 Claude Huss, Network Researcher-Engineer  Matushita Electric Works, Tokyo.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity
-- the rest is overhead for the operating system.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: wung@eecom.gatech.edu (Peter Wung)
Subject: Re: Asian votes on the presidential election
Reply-To: wung@eecom.gatech.edu
Organization: School of EE, Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta, GA
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 00:40:34 GMT

In article 12063@zip.eecs.umich.edu, cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes:
>|I found this may interest many Asian American in the presidential
>|votes. From 11/4 USA today, it shows that Clinton lead Bush in
>|almost every group of people, except Asian and people making
>|$75,000 or more, not including party group.
>|The statistics are as follow:
>|53% Asian vote for Bush while 36% vote for Clinton.
>|47% of the people making $75,000 or more vote for Bush and 
>|39% vote for Clinton.
>|
>|My question --> is any correlation between Asian and the people who
>|making $75,000 or more ?
>|
>|Yi-Chieh 


Well, the two groups aren't mutually exclusive, but you are dealing with 
two different categories of people here, one category is ethnic and the other is 
economic.  There are definite correlations between wealthy people and asian-americans, but you can not infer from the above statistic that asians are wealthier than 
any other ethnic americans, that is comparing apples and oranges.  I am sure
there are statistics showing the asian-american representation in the wealthy strata of american society.  You just have to look it up. 8^)  
 
---
********************************************************************
*Peter Wung			Email:wung@ee.gatech.edu	   * 
*Electric Power Laboratory	Snail mail: 33787 Ga. Tech Station * 
*School of Electrical Engineering	    Atlanta, GA 30332      *
*Georgia Institute of Technology			    	   *
*Atlanta, Georgia						   *
*   	"Pass, Set, CRUSH!"...					   * 
*  	Well, 2 out of 3 ain't bad for a short, fat guy. 	   *
*								   *
********************************************************************

Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: kao@cae.wisc.edu (Chengheng Kao)
Subject: Re: Taiwan News (late)
Organization: College of Engineering, Univ. of Wisconsin-Madison
Date: 6 Nov 92 16:43:43 CST
Originator: kao@sun-29.cae.wisc.edu


In article <1992Nov4.062912.20383@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>, tchuang@cello.ecn.purdue.edu (Tim D. Chuang) writes:
|> 
|> 
|> There were 400 to 500 riot police armed with billy clubs and shields
|> against 40 to 50 peaceful demonstrators.  Two of the ten taken were
|> hospitalized.  My uncle has suffered bruises all over his body.  While
|> he has been imprisoned, the police have been forcing him to take a toxic
|> medicine which will supposedly remove the bruises from his body.  In
|> actuality this medicine will actually break down his health.  The police 
|> do not want the press to take pictures of his bruised body.  That is why
|> he is still imprisoned.  My father has seen the bruises all over his arms
|> back, legs and hips.  My uncle can not walk without a painful limp.
|> 
|> He is 62 year old man who has suffered much in his lifetime.  His eldest
|> son was killed by a drunk driver.  If your consciousness can take accusing
|> this innocent man of wrong, than I am sorry that you would be so heartless
|> and cruel.
|> 
|> You have no evidence to level your accusations.  Go back to the KMT and
|> collect your pay check if you wish, but leave my family alone.
|> 
|> --
|>  T.aiwanese I.ndependence M.ovement  --| |--     --- \   /     /  ---                                                            | |--/---    /|  | | 
|>  "Proud to be Taiwanese American"    |_| -+-     |-|-/--\-    -+- ---
|> 	T.I.M. Ding Chuang           __|  |      |-|  |+_     /|\  +
|>  e-mail:tchuang@cello.ecn.purdue.edu / | _|_     | | +++|      |  _|_  

Are you a ROC citizen? Are you uncle a ROC citizen? If they are not, I would 
want you and your uncle go F**k youself and leave my beloved country.

Do you and your uncle ever pay any tax to support Taiwanese people?
If not, I want you shut up and go scr*w youself.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: dhm3@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (David H Ma)
Subject: REQUEST!!!
Reply-To: dhm3@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (David H Ma)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 01:58:14 GMT



ftp site with gifs of Taiwan in the following areas:
1. popular stars/singers
2. TV/movies
3. scenary
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: pan@arete.ATMOS.ColoState.Edu (Victor Pan)
Subject: is the economy coming back?
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 23:13:55 GMT
Organization: Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO  80523


     this may sound funny, but it's my observation. ( not superstition! )
     i wonder if anyone noticed that the thickness of the grocery store paper bags changes?
i came to the U.S. 3 years ago while the U.S. economy just started getting worse, one-ish  
year later, those paper bags got thicker ( they can last longer..) ..., and it's just these  
days, i found the bags get thinner again. i heard this kind of correlation: when the economy  
is in recession, the paper bags will be thicker, and vice versa. i don't know if there's any  
reasoning that can explain this?? anyone?
Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:15136 soc.culture.china:29782 soc.culture.hongkong:13959