HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 15:01:45 -0500 
From: "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Splitting r.g.n

	why don't we just let Alan form his little group, and moderate it.  No
one will force anyone to send articles to it.  Just keep on sending them
to r.g.n.  It's not like having the extra group mean that you HAVE to
have your messages moderated by him.  It does, however, give him the
option of having a bboard that he maintains, moderates, and sends to
however much he wants.  
	Who cares?

ZZnew guy
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: palane@iastate.edu (Paul A. Lane)
Subject: Re: Comments during games
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:04:23 GMT

In <Bxsq20.Fzw.1@cs.cmu.edu> hde+@cs.cmu.edu (Herbert Enderton) writes:

>I still haven't found an effective way to give advice to a teammate
>without his taking it as an insult.  Anybody found a way?  

My test is what happens when I yell OGG THE BASE DAMNIT! If that doesn't
get people running, I might as well forget it and just scum. Had a great
game Saturday afternoon on rwd4 when we were actually getting together
and calling runs. Nailed Pol and Kli from a semi-clueless team on con-
secutive runs. Of cousre, we took forever to nail the last planet, but
that's life.

Suicide Solution
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: xtrek makes rec.humor.funny
From: jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 21:13:03 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

Well, it had to happen eventually.  See the article "Field Guide to
Systems Administrators", and skim down to the sections about
"SITUATION: Excessive CPU usage" and "SITUATION: Poor network
response".  Heh.  We'll make 60 Minutes next... 
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ramid@nyx.cs.du.edu (Rudy Amid)
Subject: Re: INHL Exhibition Game I: The Return of rjones
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 92 05:27:58 GMT

JGR@ECLX.PSU.EDU (Jim Reisman) writes:
[...]
>unable to participate due to time conflicts, it's like the Canadians
>say: "Quelle fromage.."
>
  Quelle Fromage means "What Cheese".   :-)

  You mean, as us Canadians would say, "C'est dommage..."


> Jim Reisman
> ID: Hockey-ikki
> Promoter for INHL
> Chairman of the Committee to Draft Bav for Commish
--
!Rudy Amid              ///
a434amid@cdf.toronto.edu//
amid@r-node.gts.org   ///
Netrek/IRC: Radix  \\X//
From: tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu (Timothy C. Worsley)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: November Classic: US vs AU
Date: 23 Nov 92 19:54:05 GMT
	<By5EJn.A1v.2@cs.cmu.edu>
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 23-Nov-92 Re: November Classic:
US vs AU Robert Hill@norman.VI.RI (516)

> Sorry about the planets...just can't resist the power of the 'z'

	the "z" key?  where is the "z" key?

ZZ"oh yeah!  I found it."new guy
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: von@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Steve Von Worley)
Subject: Re: NBR proposal: Another gimmic to help the clueless newbie
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 22:10:33 GMT

In article <of2cuPW00WB2A_ZxdZ@andrew.cmu.edu> nm0w+@andrew.cmu.edu (Nanci Ann Miller) writes:
>esj@cs.brown.edu (Eugene Santos Jr.) writes:
>>         I often get a very very late message from a newbie apologizing
>>         for doing something I suggested he not do way way after the fact
>>         because they just only saw the message.
>
>Now hang on a second here... most of us "clued" players spend most of our
>time looking at the galactic map... which means that in intense situations,
>we aren't going to be continuously waiting for so-and-so to send a message.
>Some (clued) people only look at the message boards every time they die
>(just before they come back in).  I would have to say that this kind of
>thing is a fact of life....

As far as I'm concerned, people who only read the message board after 
they die are not truly clued.  Being clued implies constant interaction
with one's team, something that cannot be done without messages (unless
everyone is in one room).  I would have to say that not reading
messages is an unfortunate side effect which grew out of local CMU
tourneys and servers, where people could talk to each other across
the room.

So, who are some of these people?

Sandia
E I E I O!   MoooOOOorgf!
-- 
Steve Von Worley
von@cory.berkeley.edu
Computer Science Gradual Student
University of California at Berzerkly 
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jsin@oahu.cs.ucla.edu (Jonghoon Sin)
Subject: Re: GB at LAR
Organization: UCLA, Computer Science Department
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 03:37:06 GMT

In article <1992Nov17.233153.22783@netcom.com> genie@netcom.com (Gene Choi) writes:
>	Do I have to explain myself again?  Lag was shit.  The pits.

No you don't have to explain again -- I'm not contending the how bad the 
lag really was.

What I'm curious about is, does the fact that you played on calvin with 
the worst possible lag makes all members of LAR deserving of shitty comments 
they got?   This is what Tom has explicitly said in his post.  I beg to
differ with him.

>	However, I'm personally satisfied that we beat LAR when
>	they played from machines in the local net, while missing
>	Amazing (he was to some dance), and a non-member subbing
>	because we didn't have enough players.

Again, that has nothing to do with the argument.  I'm glad you're 
personally satisfied.   One question, though: are you 100% positive you
would have won in overtime if LAR didn't return the two planets over to 
you?  They could just as well have said "oops, soory - didn't see you were
ghostbusted".  Even you said "thanks to LAR for being cool with the 
ghostbusts".

So, even after showing such good-will, only thing LAR can get out of Tom
is that LAR "deserved most of the acrimonius comments"?

Nice.
-- 
John Sin       <jsin@janet.ucla.edu>  ...!uunet,ucbvax)!seas.ucla.edu!jsin
UCLA EE Dept.  53-109 Engineering IV, Los Angeles, CA 90024  (213)206-7983
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: mccoy@ils.nwu.edu (Jim Mccoy)
Subject: Re: RAS hummm....
Reply-To: mccoy@ils.nwu.edu
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 05:24:20 GMT

In article <1992Nov21.235755.23662@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>, bond@barracuda.cps.msu.edu (Curtis R Bond) writes:
> 
> 	Well it seems to me that someone out there with the skill and
> presistence will eventually find a way around or through RSA. Be it by
> hacking or stealing code.  So while this may work for awhile, it could be
> possiible for borgs to be on RSA servers in two years tops.  So all this
> ends up being is a pain in the players ass to go out find the codes jump
> thorugh all the hoops just to play the game without borgs.

I believe that you have a fundemental misunderstanding of either how RSA
works or how it is being implemented for netrek client validation.  RSA is
probably the most secure validation method that we will have available to
us for a decade or more.  There is a nice paper available via anonymous FTP
from rsa.com that explains the procedure, I suggest you check it out...

I guarantee you that someone will not be able to hack RSA (at least no one
who is going to waste thier time trying to do it to make a blessed binary;
this is the same encryption scheme that banks use to transfer money, etc...
if you can crack RSA you are either working for the government, the mob, or
will soon be getting a call from either one :)  This leaves prying the key
out of the client binary.  A task that is not impossible.  If someone does
get the client key, then they will be able to make a blessed binary for
_that specific key_.  

Once the server admins determine that a client key has been broken, they
simply remove that key from a list held by the server and a new of
client with a different key is generated to replace the one whose codes
have been broken.  The difference between this and the former reserved.c
system is that under RSA you only need to compile in a new key for that
particular architecture/client , you do not need to change the reserved.c
for every other client type and do not need to change the servers keys.
Thus if someone cracks the rsa_client.sun4 key, a new rsa_client.sun4 will
be redistributed, but those using rsa_client.dec will be able to continue
using their old client.

I will leave the "why bother, let's just all use borgs" to the rest of the
group, hopefully they will be gentle :)


jim
-- 
Jim McCoy          |  PGP 2.0 Key md5 hash:
j-mccoy@nwu.edu    |  61323c49024cb089337c78a05aafe8c6
mccoy@ils.nwu.edu  |  finger mccoy@ils.nwu.edu for public key


Organization: Senior, Chemical Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 12:24:41 -0500 
From: Kevin Michael Bernatz <kb32+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NBR proposal: Another gimmic to help the clueless newbie
	<1992Nov18.221033.6252@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>
Distribution: na

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 18-Nov-92 Re: NBR proposal:
Another g.. Steve Von Worley@cory.Be (1356)

> I would have to say that not reading
> messages is an unfortunate side effect which grew out of local CMU
> tourneys and servers, where people could talk to each other across
> the room.

Greetings all,
	I just have one question... where do all these non-CMU people get the
idea that CMU people talk to each other while playing netrek in
non-tourneys (emphasising Steve's mention of CMU 'servers').  I'm sorry
to burst some bubbles, but CMU *is* a real school and does have people
doing *real* work in the computer clusters.  We do talk during tourneys
if they're scheduled at non-peak times, but playing at bronco 5:00 PM to
Midnight on weekdays is hardly a suitable time to yell "Go Ogg Sandia!
He's got 10 armies!" across the cluster :).  

-KB
 Rear Admiral "Kill the Ccon!, He's talking to a User!" Akira
From: adc@tardis.msu.edu (Alan D. Cabrera)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: The use of profanity
Date: 17 Nov 92 16:21:42 GMT
Reply-To: adc@tardis.msu.edu
Organization: Michigan State University

In article 2@cs.cmu.edu, hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill) writes:
> Alan D. Cabrera writes
> > In article 721334963@mowgli, josh@cqs.washington.edu (Josh Hayes)  
> writes:
> > 
> > >
> > > ... Tired plebian arguments for using profanity...
> > >
> > > Don't accuse me of being that shallow unless you know me. 
> > 
> > I've always been taught to judge people by their actions, not by what
> 
> > Alan Cabrera				internet:  adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu
> 
> That's odd...I was always taught not to judge people...unfortunately you  
> grow up and learn differently.

Cute, so you don't judge people.  Not even me, right?  Even now, as you
read this, I am writting to the Pope to have you cannonized.

> Speaking of actions, alan....grrr....

Yes and I understand that your anger stems from the fact that I didn't
follow the advice in the condescending personal email that you sent
me.  Hmmmm.


---
Alan Cabrera				internet:  adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu
Computer Laboratory			phone:     (517) 353-3027
Michigan State University		fax:       (517) 353-9847
514 Computer Center			bitnet:    CABRERA@MSU
East Lansing, MI 48824
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: artc@iplmail.orl.mmc.com (Art)
Subject: CAN'T GET IN  netrek.atd.ucar.edu 
Organization: MMC
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 20:06:13 GMT

Hello....

what's wrong with "netrek.atd.ucar.edu"????
it has wait queue = 9!!!
who is playing there????
I would love to check it out!!
is the netrek.atd.ucar.edu server god reading this???


AC
From: kllam@r-node.gts.org (Keith Lam)
Subject: Re: NBR Proposal: Remote Option Window.
Organization: R-node Public Access UNIX Information System (416-249-5366)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 08:14:35 GMT

In article <sf2WeCC00Vpa8VYUgE@andrew.cmu.edu> Erik Lauer <el0g+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>sherod@news.Colorado.EDU (Mad DDogg):
>
>>Proposal:  Let it be possible for someone to open an Option window
>>for any player who does not have a .xtrekrc file.
>>
	[stuff deleted]

Instead of giving someone the ability to remotely open an Option window, why
not including an imbedded "standard" .xtrekrc file in the client? This way 
a newbie playing for the first time will have the message window popped up
below the local and galatic windows. Even before s/he learns to shoot!

Keith 
"COLD"
-- 
Keith Lam					kllam@r-node.pci.on.ca
----------------------------------------------------------------------
E-mail policy restriction: must not exceed 15K in size.	NO FAQ please.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: ppregler@risc.uni-linz.ac.at (Peter Pregler)
Subject: RSA and Europe (Europeans READ THIS!)
Keywords: RSA, Europe, enl
Organization: RISC, J.K. University of Linz, Austria
Distribution: eunet
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 12:16:25 GMT

Hi European netrekkers!

RSA is a new blessing scheme that was implemented in the States during this
summer. All the popular netrek-servers in America will switch this blessing
scheme in the next few weeks. Unfortunatly, the used encrytion scheme is
copyrighted  by US-law and is falling under the export restrictions of the
US-government. So there are some open questions for people from outside of
America:

1) How can we continue to play on American servers? The clients can be ftp'd
   freely but they are cryted and the encrytion key is not available for
   non-americans.
2) Wouldn't it make sense to join the new blessing effort of the Aericans?
   Netrek seems to become more popular now. So this might be the right time to
   set up a working blessing scheme in Europe.

I looked into the details the last few days and contacted the people in charge
in the States. The outcome of this is:

ad 1) It won't be possible anymore unless one of us is willing to break the
encrytion for all the clients. If you have some time left to do it mail me.

ad2) I think it is worth to implement some scheme here. Another blessing scheme
which could be used also by the Americans, called PGP, would be even better.
Unfortunatly, I know of nobody who has time to look at this and implement it.
So here is my CALL FOR VOLUNTEERS. Does anyone feel capable to implement PGP
for blessing clients? It would only be necessary to implement the encryption.
I was told that the packet-format and the arithmetic stuff can be taken from the
RSA-implementation.

If you are interested in this either mail me or send your followups to
'netrek@cs.bham.ac.uk'. This is a list to discuss special topics related to
playing netrek in Europe. To subscribe to the list send a mail to
'netrek-request@cs.bham.ac.uk'.

Keep smiling, Peter.

-- 
Make a remark, it's ridiculous to leave all the conversation to the pudding.
-------------------------------
Peter Pregler / RISC, University of Linz, Austria
Bitnet: K315470@AEARN.BITNET  Internet: ppregler@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
From: jwh@cs.bham.ac.uk (James "Oolon Colluphid" Hawtin)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: BRONCO: Is now RSA.
Date: 17 Nov 92 20:23:07 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, The University of Birmingham, UK

In article <Bxu9z8.I6E.2@cs.cmu.edu>, jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick) writes:

[All most everything deleted]

|> 
|> ObTrek : when will we see the first player from a .su site? 
|> 

Well Spaceman I think the answer to your question is NEVER, as all you Yanks will
be running RSA servers which means that you will have it all to yourselves! This
is apart from discovery server god who seems about the only clue person around,
because he realise that RSA will lock a lot of people out and so they are
apparently not converting. Also We may see them in the UK first because everyone
will always be able to play here =:*)


				James
From: tom@soda.berkeley.edu (Tom Holub)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: GB vs LAR lag
Date: 21 Nov 1992 17:52:55 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu

In article <1ekk53INNo8b@sal-sun133.usc.edu> echeverr@scf.usc.edu (5150) writes:
)In article <1992Nov20.032959.13823@netcom.com> genie@netcom.com (Gene Choi) writes:
)>In article <1eh73nINNjme@girtab.usc.edu> rone@girtab.usc.edu (Ron Echeverri) writes:
)>>a) LAR - GB @ calvin:  Utterly cruddy lag (15% loss); 19-1, LAR
)>>b) LAR - GB @ ksu: Regular calvin lag for LAR; 11-8, GB
)>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
)>Hello?  Have you been awake?  The game was played at UCLA, with
)>most of the USC/UCLA players playing from the local net.  That
)>means the "best-possible-net-connection-in-an-INL-game".
)
)Hello?  Have you been awake?  The game was played at UCLA, but the clients
)were being run from USC and displayed on the UCLA workstations.
)
)>>Now, let the reader extracts his own conclusions.
)>Yes.  Please do.  Please get your facts straight.
)
)Physician, heal thyself.

Get a clue, dude.  The Golden Bears never played LA Riot at KSU.  You
are probably thinking of the Team With No Name game.
 -Tom
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill)
Subject: Re: what happen to netrek.atd.ucar.edu ???
Reply-To: hill@norman.vi.ri.cmu.edu
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 03:24:46 GMT

 writes
> Can anyone get into netrek.atd.ucar.edu ?????
> why is it always on queue??????
> anyone???
> 
> 
> thanks
> Art

I've been on stationary queue's for netrek.atd.ucar.edu for the past few  
weeks.  I've never gotten in there, and i've heard of anyone getting in  
there.  I don't even know why its on the metaserver....

Rob
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 03:25:48 -0500 
From: "Timothy C. Worsley" <tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: GB at LAR
	<BATHURST.92Nov18110437@felix.noaapmel.gov>

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 18-Nov-92 Re: GB at LAR Bill
Bathurst@noaapmel.g (1192)

> Reed U essentially gave up playing because 
> there link was so slow to the outside world.  This was the game were the 
> visiting team (Team Wizard) had to allocate updates.

	It was Team Darkhorse.
	Team Wizard played at home, and Reed had the lag.  It was commented
that the game would have taken LONGER of the Reed players hadn't been
there.  Their 3+ second pauses gave them just enough time to come in to
give kills away.  This was not a game of netrek, and I'm glad that those
days are gone.

ZZnew guy
From: adc@tardis.msu.edu (Alan D. Cabrera)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: RSA question (Why only US and Canada)
Date: 20 Nov 92 15:29:04 GMT
Reply-To: adc@tardis.msu.edu
Organization: Michigan State University

In article 9059@seas.smu.edu, barry@seas.smu.edu (Robert Barry) writes:
> In article <1ed02tINN853@charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu> trown@ecst.csuchico.edu (Nick Trown) writes:
> >In article <1992Nov17.205958.16009@wam.umd.edu> theodore@wam.umd.edu writes:
> >>I have a question on the RSA distribution policy.  Why is it that only  
> >>citizens of the USA and Canada can recieve the code?  (BTW I am a US  
> >>citizen, but I am wondering the logic at restricting access...)
> >>
> >
> >Well, here is the reasoning. The developers of RSA have a US patent on the
> >stuff. Therefore they are worried that countries that they don't have a 
> >patent will get it. That is why crypt is needed... Sorry all of
> >you non-US and Canadian people.. :(
> >
> 
> This is not quite right, as I understand it.  In, Communications of the ACM,
> the reason is cited as US gov't restrictions on cryptography - cryptography
> being considered "munitions" and thus a threat to national security.
> 
> However, the NSA (National Securtiy Agency for those of you overseas) has 
> done a particularly bad job of enforcing this, and I am certain that if 
> you were not concerned with the legality of it - you COULD find RSA code
> out there on internet via anonymous ftp.
> 

The actual PKE algorithm has been widely published, well known around
the world and is trivial to implement; which is why it is my opinion
that the patent is bogus.  Anyway, PGP implements the PKE algorithm and
a copy of it currently resides on ghost.sm.dsi.unimi.it (149.132.2.1).

I believe that it's perfectly fine for people outside the U.S. to ftp
it although it is illegal, because PKE is protected by patent law, for
people inside the U.S. to ftp a copy of it.  On the flip side it is
quite easy to obtain RSADI's implementation if you promise to be a good
American and not make a profit on it.

So you can't export an implementation of PKE out of the U.S because, as
mentioned above, it's reguarded as munitions.  You can't import an
implmentation because that would violate U.S. patent laws.  I think I
have this right, although the situation is comical.


---
Alan Cabrera				internet:  adc@tardis.cl.msu.edu
Computer Laboratory			phone:     (517) 353-3027
Michigan State University		fax:       (517) 353-9847
514 Computer Center			bitnet:    CABRERA@MSU
East Lansing, MI 48824
From: hadley@thoth.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley)
Subject: Re: GB at LAR
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Organization: UC Irvine Department of ICS
Date: 19 Nov 92 11:38:27 GMT

In <Bxw9yv.84z.2@cs.cmu.edu> hill@norman.VI.RI.CMU.EDU (Robert Hill) writes:

>> If what I heard was correct, GB would not show up for the game if LAR
>> played on calvin for the re-match.  So LAR took the time and effort to
>> setup a UCLA server and drove here to accommodate the GBs!  LAR could
>> have taken the forfeit from GBs but elected to give you a fair(er) shot.

>Wow...I see some serious holubism here.  I'd have told him to rot in hell
>if he put it that way..

   No, no one on GB ever explicitly said they would forfeit rather then
   play.  During the process of deciding whether we should play the last
   game at calvin or elsewhere, in light of some comments made to r.g.n
   by several members of GB (not Tom) after the infamous first game, two
   possibilities we considered was that GB might either refuse to play
   or might end up playing short-handed if the game was scheduled at calvin.
   This was speculation only.

++
   Tedd Hadley (hadley@uci.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: tz@ll.mit.edu (Taras Zommers)
Subject: Re: IC forfiets
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 21:59:41 GMT

>In article <Qf1=KTW00awXApf0ZX@andrew.cmu.edu> Michael Juster <MrYuk+@CMU.EDU> writes:
>>Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 13-Nov-92 Re: IC forfiets Taras
>>Zommers@ll.mit.edu (920)
>>
>>> All I want to know is who set up the time.  Midnight is unreasonable as far
>>> as I'm concerned.
>>
>>
>>Then you should find another game to play.
>>
>>As far as getting computers to be available, this is the ONLY time.
>>
>>-Mike
>>Admiral chi - (bronco, rwd4, discovery, doorstop, sturgeon and coming
>>soon to server near you)
>
Oh... and one more point, if TEAM A can play at any time except midnight and
TEAM B can only play at midnight, why should TEAM A have to forfeit and find
a new game to play.  Netrek may have begun at CMU and Berkeley but the players
from those schools are now a minority amongst all the current netrek players.

It does seem strange that our team has a few CMU people on it and they never
had any problems getting computers to play on at times other than "Thursday
at midnight".
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek