HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pw15@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Philip  Wang)
Subject: Re: Metal and classical
Reply-To: pw15@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Philip  Wang)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 17:24:05 GMT

In article <1992Aug14.164909.5215@news2.cis.umn.edu> kimmel@epx.cis.umn.edu (Eric Kimmel) writes:
>>I find that many people who are into very heavy metal, and also into
>>(some degree) classical music (such as Mozart), and wanted to get
>>your opinion, and also offer a possible explaination, at least for
>>my part...
>[etc..]
>>So is there any sense to what I am saying?
>There's not much to hate about classical music.  There is obvious talent, it's
>musically pleasing, and the people making it aren't a bunch of no-talents
>yelling "What up Kris?!?!?" for a million bucks. 

Also, if you are a lousy classical musician, it's painfully obvious. In rock
music it's easy to fake it (looks at Nirvana).
>
>It could also be one of those anti-social things.  Classical music and heavy
>metal are not generally socially acceptable.  Heavy metal to shock the
>parents and classical to shock peers.

>I find that most people that listen to heavy metal will chose classical or
>heavy rap (Ice-T, Public Enemy, etc..) as second choice.  Those that listen
>to Motley Crue, Def Leppard, and Bon Jovi are more likely to listen to Top
>40 stations.  There is only 1 person I know that likes both heavy metal
>and country (my fiance).
>
Just for the record, although I know no one on this net gives a shit, Def 
Leppard is classically influenced. Their main composer (Steve Clark, the one
that died) studied classical guitar for years prior to joining the band.
Of coursehis alcoholism in recent years may explain the crap they've put
out this past year or so.

If someone has any info on new tours in the fall from death / grind bands,
please e-mail me as I won't be around these two weeks to read posts. I'm
most interested particularly in Sepultura, Bolt Thrower, Carcass (I missed
their Napalm Death tour), but any will do. Obituary wouldn't be too bad
but they already came and I doubt they'll come back until next album. I'm
also going to have to miss Testament and Pantera, unfortunately, since I'll
have just returned on the night of their show. But please let me know of
anything interesting. Especially Morbid Angel (my faovrite of the bunch).

philip
"Washington Boulevard, east-bound. Thirty-three...Can I get a transfer, man?
Ninety-five cents?! FUCK YOU I'LL SKATE TO THE BEACH, AND I'LL LOOK BETTER
GETTING THERE!!!" - Faith No More, "Death March"
e-mail Philip Wang at pw15@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
From: Phil.Powell@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Phil Powell)
Newsgroups: alt.thrash
Subject: Re: Metal and classical
Date: 15 Aug 92 00:18:22 GMT
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service

In article <BsxDpG.Fnn@world.std.com> azog@world.std.com (Azog Thoth) writes:
>Ive been wondering about this for some time now, and figured that I
>may as well ask the net...
>
>I find that many people who are into very heavy metal, and also into
>(some degree) classical music (such as Mozart), and wanted to get
>your opinion, and also offer a possible explaination, at least for
>my part...
>
>But I must state that the above observation usually seems to work for
>people into real metal, such as Sepultura (sp?), Nuclear Assault, etc.
>Not industrial or pop metal (which for me, into falls Soundgarden, which
>I do like, Ministry, Motley Crue, etc).
>
>For me, the enjoyment of being able to switch from classical to thrash
>is in the tecnique of both types of music, and the imagination, and 
>lastly, the delivery. In my eyes, one cant deny that the energy needed
>to create stuff like Kreators sound is quite impressive, and if you
>think a lot of it is noise, listen to the guitar work. Theres a lot of
>technical stuff in there, or at least there is IMHO. 
>
>So is there any sense to what I am saying?
>
>
>-- 
>Billy D'augustine
>azog@world.std.com
>
>"Obliteration of mankind. Under a pale grey sky. We shall arise!"

Oh absolutely! I am totally into the bands that have influenced todays
more techno-thrash and some death bands: the early masters like Beethoven,
Bach, Haydn, Smetana and Debussy... in fact, they say that Beethoven's
Ninth Symphony, rhythmically transposed, has actually matched a popular
tune by Slayer (I don't know which one, though)..

Phil

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: alt.thrash
From: pw15@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Philip  Wang)
Subject: Re: WHEN DOES THE *REAL* METAL DISCUSSION BEGIN?
Reply-To: pw15@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Philip  Wang)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 05:37:30 GMT

>Yeah..Also, do any of you guys call Flotsam and Jetson THRASH?! I got
>ripped BIG TIME. I bought F&J's _No Place For Disgrace_ the other day...
>I thought it would be a cool cd to dive to, boy was *I* wrong. Sounds like
>that fag Queensryche singer meets Metallica... IMHO, THRASH should
>be Sepultura meets Deicide...Any other opinions?
>
I don't think of Sepultura, Deicide, etc. as thrash. To me, bands like Satan,
Coroner, Blitzkrieg, Venom, Raven, VoiVod, Annihilator, that is thrash. The
American giants like Megadeth, Slayer, Metallica, Testament, etc., I find 
them sort of in between metal and thrash and not really heavy enough to
suit me when I want something that makes me feel like killing someone. I think
that's also sort of where Flotsam & Jetsam fit in, but I never was into that
band, although I don't think of them as a Queensryche/Metallica clone. I
think they listened too much to their Helloween and Iron Maiden albums and
gorgot which ones they wrote and which ones Kai Hansen and Steve Harris
wrote, but that's my opinion. I think grind and death are much too different
from thrash to be considered thrash. But I'm all for a death metal newsgroup.
That would be cool. They seemed to have created alt.r-n-r.metal.progressive
really quickly, so I don't see why it would be difficult to make
alt.metal.death at all.

philip
"Washington Boulevard, east-bound. Thirty-three...Can I get a transfer, man?
Ninety-five cents?! FUCK YOU I'LL SKATE TO THE BEACH, AND I'LL LOOK BETTER
GETTING THERE!!!" - Faith No More, "Death March"
e-mail Philip Wang at pw15@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
Newsgroups: alt.thrash,alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: cblanc@pomona.claremont.edu
Subject: Axl Rose Killed IN Vasectomy Mix-up...cblanc posting incoherently...
Organization: Pomona College
Date: 12 Aug 92 20:29:35 PDT

In article <1992Aug13.005528.16795@gmuvax2.gmu.edu>, rshvern@gmuvax2.gmu.edu (Rob Shvern) writes:
> I am awaiting the day school starts up again in the fall so this 
> discussion can once again turn to heavy metal,  not hard rock and
	I dunno if school starting up is gonna help us out here - it's a
problem with the fans.  Of any genre, I think metal is blessed with the
dumbest, most ignorant and attitude-based fans...a lot of these cross over into
the hard rock you're talking about.  We do have the hard rock sub and the heavy
metal sub, which should take care of the hard rockers and those who insist what
is not metal is - I say we make alt.thrash the genre-metal, underground-metal
sub.  Sure, it's not all thrash (I agreeing with the guy who took the
historical argument for thrash - it's fast metallic punk, like DRI or COC or
MDC or even Bad Brains) but it'll keep us away from most of the attitude and
self-aggrandizing image-monger traffic until they start thinking "thrash" is
way cooler than "heavy metal."

> more of this Def Leotard and other weak music.  
	I kinda like early Def Leppard, but I agree, it shouldn't be on this
sub.  Some of it isn't weak at all, like Van Halen, and some of it doubtless is
(Poison?) but I realy don't care as the sound isn't my thing.  Maybe we should
try gently redirecting these d00ds by not replying to their posts and sort of
easing them into the hard rock subs by replying there with real info? 
Remembering that these guys are attitude-and-pose cases, this might be the best
way to defuse them...


> 
> Better yet,  see if someone with power can get an alt.metal.death
> conference created so we can abandon this one and let the spandex
> lovers talk about Axl rose's screachy voice some more.  
	Naahhh, metal and derivatives are already using up more than their
share of bandwidth - let's just grab coffee, donuts, and cadavers and stick
around here and blow off the alt.*.metal.* subs.


> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> God is Love         |  "Mourn not the dead,  the living suffer"
> Love is Blind       |  "There is no other God,  Satan killed him"
> Ray Charles is God  |  "Feel the blood spill from your bowels"
> -----------------------------------------------------------------  
> rob

Just some fairly useless thoughts...y'know?
Newsgroups: chile.test,alt.pulp
From: rvillalb@dcc.uchile.cl (Rodrigo Villalba)
Subject: Otro test!!!
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 20:34:16 GMT
Organization: Universidad de Chile, Depto. de Ciencias de la Computacion

           #                            ##
           #                            ##
           ###############################
           ###############################
           ###############################
           #             ####           ##
                       ######           ##
                    #########           ##
                 #########  #           ##
           #  ##########    ##          ##
           ##########       ###        ## 
           #######          #####    ####
           ####              ###########
           #                   ####### 
           #
                            #
                           ##
                       ######
                   ##########
               ###########  #
           ############
             ######
                 ####
                     ####   #
                         ####
                            #
                             
           #                #
           ##################     ### 
           ##################    #####
           ##################     ### 
           #
           #                            ##
           ###############################
           ###############################
           ###############################
           #
           #                            ##
           ###############################
           ###############################
           ###############################
           #
               ###
             #######
           ##########   ####
           ##      ###  #####
           ##       ##      #
           ##       #      ##
            ##    ##      ###
           #################
           ################
           ##
            
           #                            ##
           ###############################
           ###############################
           ###############################
           #
           #                            ##
           ###############################
           ###############################
           ###############################
            ##            # 
           ##              ##
           #               ##
           ##              ##
           ######      ##### 
            ############### 
               ##########


                :-)

--

##include <rvillalb.h> 


Newsgroups: alt.pulp
From: rvillalb@dcc.uchile.cl (Rodrigo Villalba)
Subject: El diaulo!!!
Originator: rvillalb@dcc.uchile.cl
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 14:49:46 GMT
Organization: Universidad de Chile, Depto. de Ciencias de la Computacion


                          ___====-_  _-====___
                   _--^^^#####//      \\#####^^^--_
                 _-^##########// (    ) \\##########^-_
                -############//  |\^^/|  \\############-
              _/############//   ( oo )   \\############\_
             /#############((     \\//     ))#############\
            -###############\\    (oo)    //###############-
           -#################\\  / vv \  //#################-
          -###################\\/      \//###################-
         _#/|##########/\######(   /\   )######/\##########|\#_
         |/ |#/\#/\#/\/  \#/\##\  |  |  /##/\#/  \/\#/\#/\#| \|
         '  |/  V  V  '   V  \#\| |  | |/#/  V   '  V  V  \|  '
            '   '  '      '   / | |  | | \   '      '  '   '
                             (  | |  | |  )
                            __\ | |  | | /__
                           (vvv(VVV)(VVV)vvv) 

--

#include <rvillalb.h>
From: Hal Muskat <hmuskat@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: alt.rap-gdead
Date: 14 Aug 92 13:42 PDT
Subject: Re: is there anyone there?
Nf-ID: #R:wissel.gba.nyu.edu:28355:cdp:1309800001:000:6
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!hmuskat    Aug 14 13:42:00 1992


what?
From: Frederick.A.Ringwald@dartmouth.edu (Frederick A. Ringwald)
Newsgroups: alt.rap-gdead
Subject: Re: is there anyone there?
Date: 18 Aug 92 04:08:35 GMT
Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH

Yo, yip yip yo, yip yip yo!
Newsgroups: alt.rap-gdead
From: akerson@deimos.srg.af.mil (Pete Akerson - akerson%srg@uunet.uucp)
Subject: Re: Saint of ...
Organization: ARINC Research, Corp.
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 15:21:50 GMT




quaglia@seas.smu.edu (Bruce Quaglia) writes 

>> Hey that's great! Let's hear the rest. BTW, is anybody even on this group?

no.
--
Usually Reply-to: akerson%srg@uunet.uucp
Internet: akerson@srg.af.mil@uunet.uucp
Uunet: uunet!srg!akerson
Milnet: akerson@srg.srg.af.mil     maybe ...
From: banghartr@clvax1.cl.msu.edu (Rick Banghart, IPTV)
Newsgroups: alt.divination
Subject: Re: I Ching
Date: 12 Aug 92 12:01:14 GMT
Reply-To: banghartr@clvax1.cl.msu.edu
Organization: NASA Goddard Space Flight Center - Greenbelt, MD, USA
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4

In article <1992Aug11.195325.15607@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca>, aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey) writes...
>banghartr@clvax1.cl.msu.edu (Rick Banghart, IPTV) writes:
>: I think I can.  In casting the hexagram, each line is 
>: determined by throwing three coins.  The yin or yang
>: (broken or solid) is determined by the predominance of
>: heads or tails.  If three heads or three tails are thrown,
>: then the line is "moving" or "changing."
>: 
>: This yields a second hexagram (formed by swapping broken
>: for solid and solid for broken lines).  The
>: second hexagram is said to give information about the future
>: of the situation.
>: 
>: I understand that the yarrow stalks have a similar method of
>: determining changing lines.
>: 
>: The Whilhelm-Baines (sp?) translation I use, gives interpretation
>: for changing lines in each of the positions.
>: 
>: Hope that helps.
> 
>One more question, about the "heads"/"tails" implementation, to see if I have
>it straight.  Throwing two heads and one tail gives you yin, or a broken line.
>Throwing one head and two tails gives you yang, or a solid line.  Throwing
>three heads gives you a "moving" yin, that becomes a solid line; and throwing
>three tails gives you a "moving" yang, that becomes a broken line.
> 
>Is this close, or am I so far off base as to give up on me in disgust?
No disgust here!  I think I'll blame retrograde Mercury :).

Throwing three heads will give you a moving yin, as you say.
It becomes a yang line in the "moving" hexagram that is created
when each moving line (or changing line) is swapped with its 
opposite.
> 
>Also, anyone who knows how this works with yarrow sticks, feel free to chip
>in...
> 
I'd like to here about the yarrow stalks, too!

Rick
Newsgroups: alt.divination
From: robg@citr.uq.oz.au (Rob Geraghty)
Subject: Re: new Tarot person
Organization: Prentice Centre, University of Queensland
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 02:28:11 GMT

ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:

>prs@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Phil Stephens) writes:

>> Just occurred to me, the concept of light trance for doing a *card* reading
>> may be unfamiliar to some here, as many think of the cards themselves doing
>> all the work, or as them being an oracle for an outside intelligence.  Not
>> to knock those approaches, but that's not how I work.  I think of it as being
>> very similar to doing a psychic reading w/o cards, only the cards give me
>> something additional to focus on and an additional aid in getting started.
>> (stuff deleted)

>i'll agree with this.  i do my best readings while tranced, although i did a
>(stuff deleted)

Glad to read about this!  After watching many people giving readings using
cards, I came to the conclusion that *real* soothsaying was really a
psychic ability.  Before you laugh - what I mean is that the cards or
runes (whatever) were merely a physical focus for a psychic ability.
Come to think of it - maybe the cards are just to keep the left brain
occupied while the right brain gets on with the job :-)

Most of the card readers I have seen talked a lot without really referring
directly to the cards.  They would use particular cards to back up their
assertions.

Actually I get the impression some readers use the cards so that the
customers have the idea that there is some technical, physical
explaination behind the reading.  People probably feel a lot more
relaxed when someone reads things from cards rather than looking
at the customer and telling them...

Rob
From: dic5340@hertz.njit.edu (David Charlap)
Newsgroups: alt.divination
Subject: Re: new Tarot person
Date: 13 Aug 92 20:26:38 GMT
Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, N.J.

In article <55678@olivea.atc.olivetti.com> prs@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Phil Stephens) writes:
>
>Just occurred to me, the concept of light trance for doing a *card* reading
>may be unfamiliar to some here, as many think of the cards themselves doing
>all the work, or as them being an oracle for an outside intelligence.  Not
>to knock those approaches, but that's not how I work.  I think of it as being
>very similar to doing a psychic reading w/o cards, only the cards give me
>something additional to focus on and an additional aid in getting started.

I work similar to this.  Being a bit religious in nature, I always
call upon God to help arrange the cards while shuffling.  Oddly
enough, when I don't do this, the readings come out much less
accurate. 
-- 
   |)  David Charlap           "I don't even represent myself
  /|_  dic5340@hertz.njit.edu   sometimes so NJIT is right out!.
 ((|,)
  ~|~  Hi! I am a .signature virus, copy me into your .signature file.
From: ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Ailsa N.T. Murphy)
Newsgroups: alt.divination
Subject: Re: new Tarot person
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 18:51:49 EST
Organization: Ailanthus Project

prs@strobe.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Phil Stephens) writes:

> Just occurred to me, the concept of light trance for doing a *card* reading
> may be unfamiliar to some here, as many think of the cards themselves doing
> all the work, or as them being an oracle for an outside intelligence.  Not
> to knock those approaches, but that's not how I work.  I think of it as being
> very similar to doing a psychic reading w/o cards, only the cards give me
> something additional to focus on and an additional aid in getting started.
>
> (As for the cards themselves being nonrandom by virtue of synchronicity, well
> that's my "working assumption" while I'm reading the cards, but they could
> just as well be random and functioning as so-to-speak Rorschack inkblots:
> that is plausible as well; whatever works for you).
>

i'll agree with this.  i do my best readings while tranced, although i did a
whole mess of readings whihc i was told were quite accurate, while at a dance
(it was slow to start, one of the guys remembered i had a tarot deck, and the
rest was history...).  i've never put much stock in the idea of the cards
themselves being intelligent or magical or anything like that (or ouija boards
either *grin*).  i treat my cards carefully and reverently as i do any of my
magical tools, but that is because of the effect it has on ME...

i think the reason i get completely different sorts of redings with different
decks is a similiar thing - the imagery of different decks works on my
subconscious differently.  although my brother insists that my daughters of the
moon deck just doesn't like him B)...

                                            -ailsa

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
     ailsa%ailanth.uucp@wang.com                   ________
        I don't need a hero                Silence \      / Action
        I don't need a soldier                =     \    /    =
        I did when i was younger            Death    \  /    Life
        But now i'm so much older.                    \/
Newsgroups: alt.divination
From: aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey)
Subject: Re: I Ching
Reply-To: aaron@space.ualberta.ca
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 18:35:42 GMT

jamie@cs.sfu.ca (Jamie Andrews) writes:
:      I would say that the transition from the first to the
: second hexagram is giving an indication of how the situation
: is changing.  First=>second could mean past=>present, present
: =>future, or past=>future.

I'd got this impression too.

:      Not quite...
: 
: Tails = 2, Heads = 3.
: 
: 3 tails + 0 heads = 6 = yin (broken), moving to yang
: 2 tails + 1 head  = 7 = yang (solid), unmoving
: 1 tail  + 2 heads = 8 = yin (broken), unmoving
: 0 tails + 3 heads = 9 = yang (solid), moving to yin
: 
:      You just had the moving yin and yang numbers mixed up.

Aha.  I do remember references to 6's and 9's being moving lines...now I know.
It's all so clear now.

: >Also, anyone who knows how this works with yarrow sticks, feel free to chip
: >in...
: 
:      Sorry, can't remember... it's all in the Wilhelm/Baynes
: translation, at the back.  It's fairly complicated.  I just use
: the coins, preferably pennies that I've found in the street.
: (More magical. :-))

That's a good idea.  As an incorrigible penny-retriever, I probably have lots
of them lying around somewhere...

Now all I need is the book, so I can find out what the hexagrams mean.  (Or I
can stick to /usr/games/ching.)

--
---Alfvaen(a.k.a. Aaron V. Humphrey)
"There's too many clues in this room."  Gordon Lightfoot
Current Album--Bill Cosby:For Adults Only
Current Read--Henry David Thoreau:Walden and Other Writings
From: agray@axion.bt.co.uk (Andy Gray)
Newsgroups: alt.divination
Subject: Re: I Ching
Date: 12 Aug 92 12:24:59 GMT
Organization: BT Laboratories

In article <92224.172641TONY@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, TONY@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Tony Roder) writes:
|> In article <1992Aug11.195325.15607@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca>,
|> aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey) says:
|> ........
|> >(Not that I >need< to know this--the UNIX ching utility does it all for me,
|> ........
|>
|> the coins.  I have also used several computer programs (one of which I
|> actually wrote as an exercise), but I don't consider electronic casting as
|> a genuine consultation of the I Ching:  it leaves no room for the
|> introspection, for the focused attention so essential to properly formulate a
|> question and to create a foundation for an interpretation of the readings.

The UNIX 'ching' program admits to '[hashing] the individual characters in
combination with the time of day, process ID and other magic numbers which happen
to be lying around the system'.

Whilst this is far from satisfactory it does also allow you to cast the change
yourself and then use the result of that to access the interpretation. In this
way it is only giving you the same result as you would get if you use a cookbook
of interpretations.

	/usr/games/ching [hexagram]		where 64 >= hexagram >= 1

This does assume that /usr/games is available on your system!