From: rdubbs@cs.tamu.edu (Roger B. Dubbs III)
Subject: Re: Europs and WWII strategic level games
Organization: Computer Science Department, Texas A&M University
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 08:05:14 GMT

In article <1992Aug29.145612.1@cubldr.colorado.edu> gregory_b@cubldr.colorado.edu (Brian Gregory) writes:
>Strategic warfare is only midly abstrated;  bomber raids take place over the 
>hexes your units defend and convoy attacks in the sea areas you'd use for 
>invasions.  Both involve fighters and ships you'd rather use for your home
>country's defense, and they can the next turn- if they destroy the raiders.

I have to say that the Strategic warfare rules are a real gem, and I'm
glad to hear that A3R has used some similar rules (especially the
surface raiders)  The SW rules play fast, but have the right feel.

>The cost of this wonderful detail is increased playing time (which none who've 
>played it complain about!) and, IMHO, some sacrifice on diplomatic rules
>and strategic variances (Advanced Third Reich apparently has this area
>well-covered, stepping closer to enabling Axis & Allies-type "what if" 
>situations), as well as loosely-fixed naval reinforcement schedules --
>so you can't choose when the Tirpitz comes in or to build another, but can
>build a German aircraft carrier or some extra British and Italian BBs.

Well, I have to admit that for our group, the playing time is a bit too
long.  However, we are as yet still inexperienced, and we have already
seen massive speedups.  At a good clip, we can get done a season in 4-5
hours.  The biggest bottleneck seems to be in the Naval and Air phase.
It isn't that the combat requires a whole lot of time, it is deciding
where to go, and whether to intercept that costs.  I'm sure both these
pick up with experience.

The diplomatic options are quite limited in ETO.  I would suggest that
one player/partnership be used, since the victory conditions are per
partnership.  There is a small gleam of hope, however, if you play the
combined game (Both ETO and PTO linked into the whole war).  In the 
combined game scenarios, each country has a specific major and minor 
victory condition.  

>> I see Europa as trying to be a game _system_ with varying theatres of 
>> operation such that I don't have to fill up a garage with maps to play one 
>> game but can link theatre scenarios together in a "campaign game" of sorts.
>
>WWII has something like 20 scenarios covering the '39-'45 european theater,
>as simple as the 2-turn Battle of Britain, the more complex 10-turn N.African 
>scenario, Barbarossa or the whole theater in one and two year segments, as
>well as the obligatory whole kit-n-kaboodle...

Do you have a different edition than I do?  I only recall 14 or so
scenarios.  Lets see if I can remember them:

*1. Sink the Bismark
*2. Battle of Britain
*3. Battle of the Bulge
*4. Case White
*5. (Invasion of Norway, can't recall name)
*6. Barbarossa
7. Russian campaign (extends Barbarossa to 1945)
*8. France-Norway-Britain assault on the west scenario.
*9. African campaign, from italian assault to fall of africa
(10 seasons, not ten turns, I believe)
10. Italian campaign
11. Normandy campaign
*12. Campaign game, 1939-1945 (in progress 8)
13. Campaign game, 1940-1945
14. Campaign game, 1942-1945

I think that's it, with the names all messed up. 8)  I've played the *'ed
ones, and I found that the best scenarios are 5, 6 and 9, but a new player
should certainly play the first four scenarios as well.  I think 10 and
11 look interesting, but I have not played them yet.

/Roger


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