HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: andy@nff.ncl.Omron.Co.Jp (Andy Krantz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Mike Godfrey
Date: 16 Oct 92 01:53:43 GMT
Reply-To: andy@nff.ncl.omron.co.jp
Organization: Omron Computer Systems R&D Labs

In article <15OCT199208574708@sscvx1.ssc.gov>, godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:
> 
> I admit the possibility that I might be Mike Godfrey in another
> incarnation with a different unix account (actually mine is a vax
> vms account).  I know nothing about the price of 4 litres of milk
> in Toronto and yet he seems to be an expert on it, so there are grounds
> for supposing that each of us has a unique existence in his particular
> dimension.  He (Mike) tells us that the bottom has fallen out of his
> housing market (in Toronto), whilst in London I live on a council housing
> estate that has all the appearances of having fallen out of someone's
> bottom, so perhaps his dimension is a mirror image of my own.
> 
> Laurence

Hark! This actually made me smile!  Wish there was more of this on the Net.

Ah subtle humour, a lost art form.

-- 
 Andy Krantz   andy@nff.ncl.omron.co.jp   \ Everyone stares at me 'cause I is
 Phone: +81-75-951-5111 x3691 FAX: 956-7403\ gaijin. I understand nobody and 
 OMRON Corp., Computer Systems R&D Labs    / nobody understand me. How could
 Shimokaiinji, Nagaokakyo Kyoto, 617 Japan/   I possibly speak for company?
From: pjh3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (PAUL JEFFERY HISEM)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: nodes abroad
Date: 7 Oct 92 12:57:24 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University


    I'm not sure whether this is the right place to post this, but I was
    wondering if anyone out there could help me.  I'm looking for either
    INTERNET or BITNET nodes in Finland, particularly in the Helsinki /
    Jyvaskyla area.  I'm trying to reach a friend, who isn't too computer
    literate.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance.

    Paul Hisem
    Lehigh University               55 Fallingbrook Dr.
    UC #29 Box 426                  Fonthill, Ontario
    Bethlehem, PA 18015             L0S 1E1
    USA
    215-867-9450                    416-892-3845
    email: pjh3@LEHIGH.EDU


    
Xref: sparky soc.culture.canada:7252 can.politics:8112
From: rossw@sco.COM (Ross Wetmore)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
Subject: Re: Appointments to the Supreme Court
Date: 6 Oct 92 13:51:50 GMT
Organization: SCO Canada, Inc.

In article <1992Oct5.145015.2653@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>The problem is that citizens of 8 provinces and 2 territories will
>have essentially no say in electing the 2 people who name 2/3rds of
>the Court...that is, in my opinion, fundamentally unacceptable.
>Gerald

  Gerald, please reread the previous postings which quote the Accord about
who is eligible for appointment and how, or read the actual text. 

  Your repeated assertion of 2 people appointing 2/3's of the bench is not
only a flat out falsehood, but it is becoming a tiresome waste of net
bandwidth. The actual documents and explanations given you leave no excuse
for such behaviour.

  Please try to avoid repetitive postings of the same opinions, or
presenting them as fact. There are many interesting points of view which 
are both novel and informative and you should allow others a reasonable
share of the bandwidth to air them in the sake of fairness.

  Thankyou.
---- 
Ross W. Wetmore - (416)922-1937 x259    | RFC822net: rossw@scocan.sco.COM
SCO Canada Inc, Toronto, Ont, Canada.   | UUCP:{uunet,utcsri}!scocan!rossw
<std.disclaimer>
----
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: sysmark@helios.physics.utoronto.ca (Mark Bartelt)
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Reply-To: mark@cita.toronto.edu
Organization: University of Toronto Physics/Astronomy/CITA
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 17:16:54 GMT

[ Laurence Godfrey ]

| You have my sympathy - Canada is an extremely boring and mediocre country, and 
| Toronto is extremely cold.  Could you not have chosen an 8 months period
| that did not encompass the whole of winter?
| 
| For sights and lifestyle, cross the border and head south or west.  It's
| much less expensive and has lots of interesting things to see.  East, west
| and North of toronto is just a wasteland.

[ me ]

| This has got to rank as one of the most ill-informed, misleading, and downright
| stupid things to have appeared in this newsgroup recently.  (And that's saying
| a lot, in view of some of the things that Kaldis spews out!)

[ Laurence Godfrey ]

| It was not ill-informed - I lived in Ottawa for 2.5 years and visited Toronto often.
| It was better than Ottawa but still awful.  I liked nothing about canada at all.

Oh, well, to each his own, and all that.  I'm glad you've found a location that you
consider a delightful place to live.  (Though I can't fathom how anyone could prefer
any part of Texas to Toronto.)  No accounting for taste, I guess.

Mark Bartelt                                                            416/978-5619
Canadian Institute for                                         mark@cita.toronto.edu
Theoretical Astrophysics                                       mark@cita.utoronto.ca

"Clothes not busy being worn are busy drying."        -        Dylan, on laundry day
                [ singing "It's all right, ma (I'm only bleaching)" ]
Xref: sparky soc.culture.canada:7537 can.politics:8499
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: robinson@mdivax1.uucp (Jim Robinson)
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Reply-To: robinson@mdd.comm.mot.com (Jim Robinson)
Organization: Motorola - Mobile Data Division; Richmond, BC
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: 14 Oct 92 19:57:14 GMT

LAURENCE GODFREY (godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov) wrote:
>
>Honestly, what do you expect!!  I told you canada was an awful place to go, an
>and they have the gall to act like they're doing you a favour when you want
>to visit!  Take my advice and go somewhere else.  Ask the Canadian embassy
>how they treated the Japanese Canadians during WW2 and when they intend to
>compensate them for the property the confiscated.

But, don't forget to ask the Brit embassy why the UK is abandoning millions
of British citizens to Chinese rule in 1997. And if we are going to
consider past misdeeds, it seems to me that the exploits of the now defunct
"British Empire" could provide some sporting food for thought.

Oh, I do so hate myself when I cannot refuse the urge to join in childish
name calling. Sigh.
-- 
Jim Robinson
robinson@mdd.comm.mot.com
{ubc-cs!van-bc,uunet}!mdivax1!robinson

Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: Anthony_Maillard@Mdd.comm.mot.com (Anthony Maillard)
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Followup-To: soc.culture.canada
Organization: Motorola
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 17:34:55 GMT

This really makes me sick.   Let's address it this way....
Why do most Americans hate Canada or Canadians?  
Is it because the educational system is better in Canada?  
Is it because you can go to anywhere in the U.S. and still meet people who
don't even know what direction is north...........? 
Is it because the educational system in America spends so much time
ensuring that students are so brain-washed with American history that they
can't see past your borders? 
Is it because the Americans look at Canada as what America could have been?
Is it because Canada has a great health care system taking take of ALL
people while the American people are still trying to figure out who's black
and who's white and whether he or she should be allow to attend school in
this or that place.
Is it because Canada never went along with the American Slavery system?
Is it becasue Canada is not agressive enough to wipe out nations of people,
then say oopppps....... in the name of democracy.

Why do people in the rest of the world hate Americans?
Is it because where-ever Americans go on vacation they have to be the most
obnoxious?
Could it be that they just have to insult the natives all the time?
Could it be that they have to be THE LOUDEST, THE GROSS-EST, THE MOST
INSULTING person in the place.
Why you ask....?   'Cause we're Amerika and we could take over you little
country if we wanted to. I'll just get some of my Marine friends and we'll
DO this town. Hell, we'll do the whole country.............HA HA HA HA HA
Ha!!!!!!  

Anthony 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
From: cthorne@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Charles E Thorne)
Subject: Re: Individual Rights in the U.S. Constitution
Organization: The Ohio State University
Distribution: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 18:58:57 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.134230.2786@bmerh85.bnr.ca> robinc@bnr.ca (Robin Collins) writes:
>It seems to me that if a Constitution states that all CITIZENS have
>(equal) rights, then it is hardly necessary to also state that all
>women and all "races" do too.
>One might argue that it is necessary to state that all men have equal
>rights just as all women do, but surely the term CITIZEN is inclusive (of
>course "under-age" residents are not citizens....).  

At the time the U.S. Constitution was written, the term citizen did not
mean all adults (whatever that means).  The U.S. Constitution was written
by delegates to a convention who were elected/appointed by the states which
had formally been British colonies.  In writing the constitution, the states
gave up certain rights, which they previously held.

Since many of the British colonies permitted slavery and did not permit
women (or non property owners or indentured servants) to vote, there was
nothing in the constitution which defined "citizen".  

Specifically, in Article I (dealing with the House of Representatives) it
states that members are chosen every two years by the "people" of the states
with the electors having the same qualifications as the electors of the most
numerous branch of the state legislature.  Until the 17th Amendment, Senators
were chosen by the legislatures.  

In determining how many representatives each state received, it was specifically to include a prohibition for slaves (each representative represented the
same number of "free" persons, including those bound to a number of years
but excluding Indians (not taxed) and 3/5 of all other "persons" (a specific
allusion to slaves).

Thus the Constitution did not define citizen when originally written.  The
14th Amendment did, however, define citizen as all persons born or naturalized
in the United States.  If a state denied voting to any "person" over 21 years
of age, they lost representation in Congress.

The 15th Amendment denied States the right to deny voting to anyone because
of race, the 19th Amendment likewise wrt the question of sex.  The 26th
Amendment lowered the age from 21 to 18 wrt voting.
From: dbowman@shade (Don A. Bowman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
Subject: Re: Internal passports
Date: 13 Oct 92 14:54:27 GMT
Organization: University of Waterloo
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) wrote:
: News reports on the legal text of the Charlottetown Accord indicate
: that there are going to be limitations on mobility rights, certainly
: as it relates at least to aboriginal governments. 

No it doesn't. It says that an Aboriginal self-government could limit who
could move into a reserve. Could is different than will be.

: 
: Further, the lack of a free market clause which allows for the free
: movement of goods, services, and people, coupled with the
: provincialization of labour market training with NO provisions for
: provinces to recognize each other standards, raise the spectre
: that provinces to will be able to restrict mobility also, and may
: be more inclined to do so, to assert powers to restrict movement
: similar to the powers given to another, the aboriginal, order of 
: government.

There is no provincialisation of labour training -- provinces MAY opt out.
This doesn't mean that provinces WILL opt out.

: 
: What other collectivities other than aboriginals are going to
: assert their collective right to limit the mobility of Canadians...
: to protect their language, culture, and religion...perhaps the KKK.

The deal ONLY says that Aboriginal governments can limit mobility rights into
and off of a reserve. Since a reserve is private property, how is this
different from you limiting me from coming into your home?

: 
: Charlottetown welcomes Canada to the world of internal passports...
: and puts Canada on the slippery slope to becoming the new South Africa.
: 

Dream on.

--
Don Bowman                (519) 744-6154     dbowman@zeus.uwaterloo.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: marky@engin.umich.edu (Mark Anthony Young)
Subject: Re: What about the Canadians?
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 00:27:56 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

cubric@cs.mcgill.ca (Marija Cubric) writes:
>The above [deleted] statement [that Canada was freely joined by its members,
 while Yugoslavia was imposed by Communists] is very often used as an argument
>to point out the difference between Canadian and (ex) Yugoslav 
>federation. But, the statement is false. The fact is: Yugoslavia was formed 
>in 1918, by free will of all its constitutive parts Slovenia, Croatia and 
>Serbia. Or at least, by the will of elected representatives of these three 
>nations. 
>
>If we want more democratic way to form a federation, then perhaps,
>a referendum can be used. But, even Canada was not formed after 
>Ontarians, Quebecers etc. decided on referendum to be in the same country,
>or I am wrong?
>
Nope, not wrong.  The British gov't created Canada at the behest of 
legislatures of the three colonies involved (the Canadas, New Brunswick 
and Nova Scotia).  The Nova Scotia gov't was promptly (that very year)
voted out of office by a _very_ unhappy electorate, which tried to get
the act revoked -- to no avail.  So, it looks pretty parallel.

...mark young
From: warkent@ltisun14.epfl.ch (Ken Warkentyne)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Date: 14 Oct 92 09:48:52 GMT
	<9OCT199219021882@sscvx1.ssc.gov> <1992Oct12.131458.27272@kub.nl>
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne---Laboratoire de
	Teleinformatique
In-reply-to: dleblanc@kub.nl's message of 12 Oct 92 13:14:58 GMT

David LeBlanc:
| Not to give the impression that I actually find Canada to be the least
| bit exciting (outside of Quebec that is) - but at least it's a country
| where one can choose a meal from more than two resturant types, 
| Indian or revolting.

Montreal is good but it's not exactly Paris.  On the other hand it's
a lot cheaper.  Some people find Vancouver exciting, but they are
usually from Terrace or Kelowna.  Still, you can now get real coffee
quite easily and watch the masses ooze along the Robson sidewalks,
gawking at the expensive boutiques, trashy tourist traps, sushi
restaurants, and the people sitting in coffee bars.  Apparently,
Toronto is not disimilar in this regard.

As for English (or British) "cuisine", any country that allows so-called
restaurants to serve "haggis and chips" should be sanctioned by the U.N.
--
Ken Warkentyne - warkent@ltisun.epfl.ch
                 Laboratoire de Teleinformatique, EPFL, Suisse.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: pavalin@bnr.ca (Paul Valin)
Subject: Re: Canada's country code?
Followup-To: soc.culture.canada
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 18:15:10 GMT

In article <Oct.6.13.22.07.1992.14481@romulus.rutgers.edu>,
kaldis@romulus.rutgers.edu (Theodore A. Kaldis) wrote:
> 
> In fact, the country code for Canada is "002".

Unless Canada has picked up and moved to Africa, I doubt that the
country code is '2'.  Where did you get this idea?

>> vechicle for its use - the telephone - was invented there. :^)
> 
> I didn't know that Massachusetts was a part of Canada.

Same old debate (yawn...)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Valin                                     Tel: + 1 613 763 7394
Bell-Northern Research Ltd.                    Email: pavalin@bnr.ca
P.O. Box 3511, Station C
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada K1Y 4H7               'only my opinions...'
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: TO ALL CANADIAN WHO LIVE IN TORONTO!!
Reply-To: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Organization: The Bates Motel
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 17:00:48 GMT

godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:
>> 
>>| You have my sympathy - Canada is an extremely boring and mediocre
>>| country, and  Toronto is extremely cold.  Could you not have chosen
>>| an 8 months period that did not encompass the whole of winter?
>
>It was not ill-informed - I lived in Ottawa for 2.5 years and visited 
>Toronto often. It was better than Ottawa but still awful.  I liked 
>nothing about canada at all.

Glad to see that you saw so much of it ... (-;

All sarcasm aside, could you tell us about where you live now?  Just 
a friendly enquiry, because maybe you were in euro-urban areas and
that's not everybody's cup of tea ... your Organization field says
you're out in the suburban Bay Area somewhere, which many Columbia
alums have described to me as "New Jersey with nice geography and
weather" (I do not happen to agree, of course; I loved it there).

It's quite possible that you might have been happier someplace like
the Vancouver lower mainland, or just as miserable in Minneapolis or
Detroit ...  to each their own.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare				
> gld@cunixB.cc.columbia.EDU		Oct 26/92: Just say "OUI!"
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			(Let's worry about the economy!)
From: kaldis@romulus.rutgers.edu (Theodore A. Kaldis)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Canada's country code?
Date: 12 Oct 92 01:33:36 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <11OCT199212301012@sscvx1.ssc.gov> godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:

>> I'm not sure exactly how country codes work in Greece, but I would
>> imagine that the first "0" is for international access and "02" is for
>> Canada.  All I know is that I dialed "002 514 XXX XXXX" and the call
>> went through correctly to Montreal (not to some mud hut in Ethiopia).
>> "001" would probably cause the call to be routed through the U.S. --
>> and probably incur extra long distance charges to the originating
>> telephone account.

> I think your memory is defective.

My memory is not defective.  It is, rather, quite good.

> 00251(4 xx etc) would get you through to a number in Asmara, Ethiopia,
> as 4 is the Asmara city code.

From where?  From the U.S., any international call (except to Canada;
and to some Carribean countries, the Bahamas, and Bermuda, which have
an "809" area code) must be prefixed with "011", the international
access code.  Overseas, the procedure is most likely different.

> This is easy to prove by dialing the international access code from
> canada (which I believe is 011) followed by 2 514 etc.

This proves nothing, because we're not dialing from Greece.

> Are you sure you can distinguish between what you call a mud-hut in
> Ethiopia and Montreal?

Frankly, no (but then I'm not very fond of Montreal).

> Incidentally, this may surprise you but people who live in mud huts do
> not, as a rule, have telephones.

I wouldn't know, nor do I presume to speak for such people.

> Perhaps there is no direct dialing to Canada from Greece, so the call
> went through an operator who thought "it's that idiot Theo trying to
> phone canada via Ethiopia again", and just switched you through.

Perhaps there is.  As a matter of fact, _CERTAINLY_ there is.  I have
never had occasion to talk to any Greek telephone operators, but I
have made a number of calls to the U.S. from there (to New Jersey and
also to California), and one to Canada.  You dial the country access
code, the area code, and the number, and your call gets connected
automatically.  For the U.S., the access code (from Greece) is "001";
for Canada, it is "002".
-- 
The views expressed herein are my   ||  Theodore A. Kaldis
my own only.  Do you seriously      ||  kaldis@remus.rutgers.edu
believe that a major university as  ||  {...}!rutgers!remus.rutgers.edu!kaldis
this would hold such views???       ||
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics
From: marky@engin.umich.edu (Mark Anthony Young)
Subject: Re: I was going to vote yes, BUT NOW ....
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 92 14:28:19 EDT
Organization: University of Michigan Engineering, Ann Arbor

beaurega@ireq.hydro.qc.ca (Denis Beauregard) writes:
>Moreover, 6 on 62 is very far from 25% rep-per-pop.  But, I am not
>advocating the Charlottetown accord anyway.  ONly thing that afraid me
>is the number of no (out of Quebec) because of that 25%.  It will
>_eventually_ bias _slightly_ HoC, but discipline of party and the
>current system (1 M.P. = 1 vote for party) are biasing any vote to
>a greater extent.  Think to that too.
>
The 18 extra Members (that come with the Cha'town accord) _immediately_
bias slightly the HoC (six seats, three times as much as any other
province).  The 25% rule will eventually bias the HoC _enormously_
(twenty seats, ten times any current province's benefit from mal-
distribution).  

The distortions of the party system are at least spread evenly across
the country (now).  This accord will only aggravate that distortion
as well, since Quebec will become even more of a prize than it has
been before.

...mark young
From: alain@elevia.uniforum.qc.ca (W.A.Simon)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Canada's country code?
Date: 12 Oct 92 18:55:55 GMT

In <11OCT199212301012@sscvx1.ssc.gov>
godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
bashes TheodorK:

> In article <Oct.11.11.45.09.1992.27217@remus.rutgers.edu>,
> kaldis@remus.rutgers.edu (Theodore A. Kal writes...

	who lashes Laurence.

> > In article <8OCT199215252779@sscvx1.ssc.gov>
> > godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:

	but let's not waste time.

> [ ... ]
> have telephones.  Perhaps there is no direct dialing to Canada from Greece,
> so the call went through an operator who thought "it's that idiot Theo
> trying to phone canada via Ethiopia again", and just switched you through.

	However much I like this image, I will have to send you
	both back to your respective corners.

	First off, '2' is a country code shared by (hang on to your hat)
		- Greenland
		- Faroe Islands
		- Africa.
	Then, there is the delicate issue of harmonization of dial out
	code accross the many countries of the world.  Indeed, not all
	countries use the international code.  They use an internal
	prefix which their own system will translate into the proper
	sequence.  Greece is one of the few countries left which have
	not harmonized their system.  For those who are interested,
	harmonization also involves emergency numbers (such as 911).

	If you had told me that I would one day side (in a way) with
	Kaldis, I would have withered you on the spot with one look.
	Life is full of surprises...


--
 Alain
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada