HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: marks@castle.ed.ac.uk (Mark Steyn)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Seven principles of computer games?
Date: 23 Nov 92 18:22:04 GMT
Distribution: alt
Organization: Edinburgh University

I once read (in a magazine long forgotten) that there were only seven
different types of computer games and that all other types were simply
amalgams of the others.

Does anybody actually have a list of these styles?  I've been pondering
over this for years, but I always get bogged down in technicalities (ie 
is Lemmings a God Game in line with Populous, or something else?).

	Mark

-- 
"A little nonsense now and then,		\ Mark Steyn :          \
 Is relished by the wisest men"			 \ marks@castle.ed.ac.uk \
          Willy Wonka				  \ mpjs@dcs.ed.ac.uk     \
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: frank@rover.uchicago.edu (Frank - Hardware Hacker - Borger)
Subject: Re: Computer Superstition
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Reply-To: frank@rover.uchicago.edu
Organization: Joint Center for Radiation Therapy
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 19:44:00 GMT

article <10292323.7317.11306@kcbbs.gen.nz>, Murray_Moffatt@kcbbs.gen.nz (Murray Moffatt) writes:
>We've all heard of common superstitions such as not walking under ladders 
> and throwing salt over your left shoulder if you spill some, but are 
> there any superstitions to do with computers?

	One time we had an early PDP11 with a switched cache that developed
	some bugs, the cache would quit and you had to turn the cash enable
	switch off and on again to restart it. It took us a month or so
	before we finally found the intermittent bug (an insoldered joint,)
	that caused it.

	Years later you would still see people go into the computer room and
	cycle the cache to "speed things up." When asked what they were doing
	the would say, "I don't know, but so-and-so told me this helps."


   Frank R. Borger - Physicist    __       Internet:  Frank@rover.uchicago.edu
Michael Reese - Univ. of Chicago |___      Phone : 312-791-8075 fax : 567-7455
  Center for Radiation Therapy   | |_) _   There is no crime in the cynical
                                   | \|_)  American calendar more humiliating
    "Birthplace of Softball"          |_)  than to be a sucker. - Max Lerner
From: keith@cco.caltech.edu (Keith Allan Schneider)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: WANTED: PDP-10 or 11
Date: 23 Nov 1992 01:24:45 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
NNTP-Posting-Host: punisher.caltech.edu

alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson) writes:

>As for the PDP-11, that is still a production machine from DEC, in certain
>models.  They are mini-tower boxes, like an old micro-VAX.

>And there was just a discussion of the value of old PDP-11 boxes on
>alt.folklore.computers, as well.  You might see if it has not expired on your
>system.

Hmm, there is still a PDP-11 in use here in one of the Physics Lab courses.
Of course, it is nearly obsolete.  The only reason that it is still used
is because the lab attendant doesn't wan't to learn some new system (or
rewrite the software) -- he might retire in a few years.  Basically, the
486's in the lab are much faster...

keith

Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: aduell@nyx.cs.du.edu (Tony Duell)
Subject: Re: Typewriter-printers (was Re: Wanted: ... and Modem)
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 92 16:36:06 GMT


Another thing that may be of interest. Some old data logging sysem was
being scapped here, and I was given any bits that I wanted (like most fo
it :-)). Anyway, one of the units I aquired was a pritner made by 'Victor
Comptometer Corporation'. It consisted of a modified mechanical adding
machine (no carry gearing for example), but the input 'shift register'
(literally, a metal slide with a matrix of pins, 10 rows and enough
columns which stored the input keypresses, one at a time) still there, and
solenoids mounted over the keyboard. The keycaps were not fitted, but the
tops of the levers that the solenoids press on were groved as if to accept
push-on keycaps. 
-tony 'PDP11 Hacker' Duell
ard@siva.bris.ac.uk
From: pete@minster.york.ac.uk
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: World's Toughest Computers
Date: 20 Nov 92 14:05:22 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of York, England

Jared Dahl (jdahl@rchland.vnet.ibm.com) wrote:
: Which computers do you consider the most rugged?  Why?
: What are some stories that you have heard about them?
: 

Although they're really basically educational CP/M boxes from the mid 
eighties, I heard about a couple of Research Machines Link 480Zs which were
stolen from a school and abandoned in a marsh for some time when it was
realised that they weren't any use for games. The machines were, some months
later, recovered and cleaned up and worked first time!

Pete
--
*Peter Fenelon -- Research Associate -- Software Safety Assessment Procedures*
Dept. of Computer Science, University of York, York, Y01 5DD (+44/0)904 433388
EMAIL: pete@minster.york.ac.uk `There's no room for enigmas in built up areas'
From: "jeff zeitlin" <jeff.zeitlin@execnet.com>
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: burroughs b20
Date: 19 Nov 92 00:48:47 EST
Reply-To: "jeff zeitlin" <jeff.zeitlin@execnet.com>
Distribution: alt
Organization: Executive Networks Information

MC::>In article <cf16naP0Bwx25HbsAe#transarc.com> Pat_Barron@transarc.com write
  ::>>So, I seem to have aquired a Burroughs B20.  Looks like it was meant
  ::>>to be used as a word processing system.  It's running an operating
  ::>>system called BTOS.
  ::>>
  ::>>What else is there to know about this system?  Can it run any sort of
  ::>>"real" operating system?  Anyone have any software for it that they no
  ::>>longer want...?

  BTOS _IS_ a "real" operating system.  It is a multi-tasking, 
  networked operating system that runs on Intel 8086-series machines.  
  If running the protected mode version of BTOS on a 286, 386, or 
  486 machine (the architecture is proprietary; not just any 
  286/386/486 will do), you get access to all of the memory that is 
  installed in the machine, which can be at least 12MB.  It is the 
  first (and so far only) non-UNIX OS to be certified POSIX.1 
  compliant.  It can emulate a PC, with performance generally as good 
  as the PC it is emulating.  Compilers for all major programming 
  languages are available.  The rest of the information posted in MC's 
  article is correct except for

  ::>I think the B20 used a Z80 or similar 8-bit microprocessor.

  No, the first CTOS machine was based on the 8086.  Burroughs 
  requested (for cost reasons) an 8088-based machine, but to the best 
  of my knowledge, the OS was identical.

  The currently sold line of BTOS machines (it's now back to being 
  called CTOS) consists of the B28 (286 processor), B38 (386), B39 
  (386 with integrated SCSI disk controller) and SuperGen (486).

  From the B26 on, the hardware was designed so that add-ons and 
  upgrades could be done without even needing a screwdriver.  This 
  applied to almost everything - memory, disk, additional RS232 ports, 
  Ethernet, video controller, early versions of PC emulation (current 
  versions of PC emulation are for 386 and later only, and 100% 
  software), and so on.

  The company I work for specializes in hardware and software support 
  and maintenance for this line of machines.  We also do consulting.  
  If you are interested in these services, contact me via PRIVATE MAIL 
  at the address in the signature, and I'll be happy to give you the 
  contact information you will need.

MC::>That's all I know, sorry.  Maybe you would get a better
  ::>response in the unisys newsgroup, which is "comp.sys.unisys"
  ::>(not surprisingly).

  Alternatively, post a message to the attention of 
  dick.zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com.  Mr. Zeitlin will be able to clarify 
  anything I said above, and give you even more information.  
  Regrettable, c.s.u is _not_ a high-traffic news group.

  J/
  jeff.zeitlin@execnet.com

 * QMPro 1.0 30-0183 * Can I yell "movie" in a crowded firehouse??
--
Executive Network Information System  (914) 667-4567
International ILink Host
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson)
Subject: Re: ASSEMBLY LANGUAGE IBM
Originator: alderson@leland.Stanford.EDU
Reply-To: alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson)
Organization: Stanford University Academic Information Resources
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 17:47:27 GMT

In article <168A69ADF.ALAN@VM1.McGill.CA>, ALAN@VM1 (Alan Greenberg) writes:
> Microcode is microcode, regardless of the technology used to store it!

OK, I still think of microcode (on the old IBM iron) as the stuff *written on
paper by engineers*, which was translated into hardware--not particularly easy
to change hardware, at that.

But you're right.  Microcode is microcode.

[Bunch of descriptive material on how it was stored on various 360s removed.  I
*said* my memory was hazy on the details...]

>I seem to recall that the 370/145 (late 1960s?) was the first IBM machine to
>use writable memory for microcode.  The code was shipped on a brand new type
>of media - an 8 inch flexible disk!  All IBM disk units of that era had
>numeric designations of 33nn (such as 3330, 3340, 3350).  The drive to read
>the flexible disk was appropriately enough called the 33FD.  In the field, it
>was quickly called a "floppy" disk instead of a "flexible" disk and the rest
>is history.

Summer, 1970.  About the end of August or start of September.  I had only just
moved into a new apartment in Austin, Texas, and my _Principles of Operation_
and the model-specific manuals had arrived that week, for all the 360s and the
two new 370s (155 and 165) when the 145 was announced.

I went to the local IBM offices, to see about getting the 145 manual.  It was
so new that they didn't have a price for it on their list yet, so they *gave*
it to me.

Some dates do stick.  ;->
-- 
Rich Alderson   'I wish life was not so short,' he thought.  'Languages take
                such a time, and so do all the things one wants to know about.'
                                                        --J. R. R. Tolkien,
alderson@leland.stanford.edu                              _The Lost Road_
From: john@gu.uwa.edu.au (John West)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Sync Three Times...
Date: 20 Nov 1992 14:19:07 GMT
Organization: The University of Western Australia
NNTP-Posting-Host: mackerel.gu.uwa.edu.au

peter@NeoSoft.com (Peter da Silva) writes:

>There's always the old bit-rot stuff. Lots of debugging techniques (just
>try recompiling it) are practically superstitious...

Or if you've got a 6502, and the program doesn't work, flip random BCx
instructions. Unless, of course, you are one of the three people in this
world who can actually remember whether its BCS or BCC for 'greater or
equal'.

John West
--
For the humour impaired: Insert a :-) after every third word
From: v462etnn@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (David L Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: World's Toughest Computers
Date: 19 Nov 92 21:25:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Nov19.190739.18948@rchland.ibm.com>, jdahl@rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Jared Dahl) writes...
>Which computers do you consider the most rugged?  Why?
>What are some stories that you have heard about them?
> 

Well, this is dredging.  Several years ago (approx. 10+), someone
ran ads in Byte (Cromemco, I think) that featured a circuit board
being smashed by a hammer.  The insinuation was obviously that
Cromemco boards were tough.

The company whose board was smashed (a manufacturer of minis, if
I recall) ran rebuttal ads in Datamation.

So I nominate Cromemcos because: they predate the AS/400, they
can hurt your foot a lot if you drop one, and they're not IBM.

David Anderson
From: jlowrey@skat.usc.edu (John 'Fritz' Lowrey)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: computers & garbage
Date: 19 Nov 1992 18:09:28 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: skat.usc.edu

	Yup!
	I have had a similar situation.  I found an entire distribution
of IBM AIX for the RT, including the dev set, FORTRAN system, X-Windows,
and a few other wiz-bang things still in the plastic wrap and thrown into
a dumpster.  Apparently the machine itself is in storage in closet in the 
Cinema department computer graphics lab.
	Sold the software on the net, never saw the machine...

							Fritz

-- 
        "...now it is my karmic burden         | J. "Fritz" Lowrey
         to stack cat food..."                 | Internet: jlowrey@usc.edu
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: pt@geovision.gvc.com (Paul Tomblin)
Subject: Re: Long gone geeking
Reply-To: pt@geovision.gvc.com
Organization: Not officially GeoVision Systems Inc., Ottawa, Ontario
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 14:05:42 GMT

mdw@theory.TC.Cornell.EDU (Matt Welsh) writes:
>In article <1992Nov17.175315.10993@geovision.gvc.com> pt@geovision.gvc.com writes:
>>[Most of the incredibly long signature mercifully deleted]
>>>[and now the rest of it deleted]
>>
>>[warlord deleted]

>Whoa, hold on there, Paul. You've got a.f.c confused with alt.fan.warlord
>again. Bad habits are hard to break, I know.

I know - but I did this one on a.f.w once already, and it had no effect, so
I tacked a warlording onto the end of something else I had to say.  Isn't
that a `George McQuary Approved Technique'?


-- 
Paul Tomblin, pt@geovision.gvc.com
(This is not an official opinion of GeoVision Systems Inc.)
"Usenet is like Tetris for people who still remember how to read"
 -- Joshua Heller (heller2@husc.harvard.edu) on rec.humor.funny
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: robm@void.ncsa.uiuc.edu (Rob McCool)
Subject: Re: ASSEMBLY LANGUAGE IBM
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 19:20:17 GMT


These are all questions from Tannenbaum's _Structured Computer Organization_,
  aren't they? It's a 200 level CS class over here...




--
Rob McCool, NCSA STG System Administrator
robm@ncsa.uiuc.edu r-mccool@uiuc.edu robm@imsa.edu
It was working ten minutes ago, I swear...
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: pt@geovision.gvc.com (Paul Tomblin)
Subject: Re: Long gone geeking
Reply-To: pt@geovision.gvc.com
Organization: Not officially GeoVision Systems Inc., Ottawa, Ontario
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 17:53:15 GMT

jeffrey@cygnus.com (Jeffrey Osier) writes:

>I started geeking when we had to play PONG with rocks.  As a
>"programmer", I was responsible for standing on the sidelines and
>yelling out instructions:

Gee - I remember when we used to play it using these wooden things with
strings, and a ball, on a large clay/concrete surface with a net in the
middle.

[Most of the incredibly long signature mercifully deleted]
>Ah, for just one time I would take	415 903 1400, 415 903 0122 (fax)
>the Northwest Passage, to find the	jeffrey@cygnus.com
>hand of Franklin reaching for the Beaufort Sea....

Much as I approve of Stan Rogers quotes in sigs, the [mercifully deleted]
Butt Ugly Ascii Font that proceeds it has _got_ to go.  So does the tab
damage.  (On my screen, it looks like "...to find the jeffrey@cygnus.com hand
of Franklin...")

-- 
Paul Tomblin, pt@geovision.gvc.com (Canadian first, Quebecer second)
"We sealed our federal pact without bloodshed and without exploitation of the
weak by the strong.  All it took was fairness, justice and some compromises
on both sides." - George-Etienne Cartier, Father of Confederation, 1867
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: Jeremy_Reimer@mindlink.bc.ca (Jeremy Reimer)
Subject: Re: Confessions of a Commodore Junkie (Was: Re: SMART DRUGS2
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 05:44:36 GMT

>
> HI !  CAN I BUY YOU"RE C128 FROM U!!!
> KIB0 WON"T LET ME BORROW HIS ! !!!!!1
>
> DO YOU HAVE SUPER PITFALL OR GALAGA 4
> IT! !! I"LL TRADE YOU FOR MRS PAC MAN
> IT SUCKS!!! WHAT WAREZ DO YOU HAVE?!
>
> BIFF
> --
>
> BBBBBBB   IIIIIII  FFFFFFF  FFFFFFFF
> B      B     I     F        F
> B      B     I     F        F
> BBBBBBB      I     FFFFFF   FFFFFFF
> B      B     I     F        F
> B      B     I     F        F
> BBBBBBB   IIIIIII  F        F


Is this the real BIFF, or just some nasty cheap BIFF substitute?


--
Jeremy_Reimer@ |"It turned out, as N-Man discovered later, that the black
mindlink.bc.ca | boat hadn't been after him at all.  It was full of riotous,
---------------| unemployed former James Bond villains enraged at the fall
aka THE JAGUAR!| of Communism in the Soviet Union."
---------------|
Stealth Sig#69 |  --From "N-Man #3: N-Man on Holiday"
From: Jay.Ashworth@f8649.n3603.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Jay Ashworth)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Jackpotting ATM's for $$$$
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 92 21:52:00 PDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3603/8649

Brent, to All on 16 Nov 92:

 B> Actually, it *debits* your account, and it's often faster than
 B> "immediately."  What I mean is, when you want $20 from your account, the
 B> machine first accesses your account, and then withdraws the $20.  Your
 B> account balance is now lower.  The machine *then* checks to see if it
 B> can actually give you the money.  If it can, then it does(of course) and
 B> if it can't, then it *credits* your account by $20.  It seems to me
 B> that the machine should see if it can give that amount to begin with,
 B> rather than tinkering with the account so much.

Interesting.  You've programmed one?

 B> All ATM's I've used have an upper limit of $200 or $300 per day.
 B> If you need $1000, it'll take you 4 days to do it.

Depends on the account type, the bank, the network, and many other variables. A friend regularly pulls $400 out at a time.

Cheers,
-- jra
Ashworth & Associates * jra%acorn@tct.com * jra@psycho.fidonet.org

--  
Internet: Jay.Ashworth@f8649.n3603.z1.FIDONET.ORG
UUCP:     ...!myrddin!tct!mechanic!8649!Jay.Ashworth
Note: Mechanic is a free gateway between USENET & FIdonet.
      For information write to chief@mechanic.fidonet.org

Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: rdippold@qualcom.qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold)
Subject: Re: CM5 pic - terribly sorry gentlemen, it's a dud
Organization: Qualcomm, Inc., San Diego, CA
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 01:40:08 GMT

matthews@oberon.umd.edu (Mike Matthews) writes:
>------
>Mike Matthews, matthews@oberon.umd.edu (NeXTmail accepted)
>------
>I will never lie to you.

Honest?
-- 
You can't carve your way to success without cutting remarks.
Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,misc.forsale.computers.workstation
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:08:18 -0500 
From: Pat_Barron@transarc.com
Subject: Re: WANTED: PDP-10 or 11
	<1992Nov21.012445.23588@leland.Stanford.EDU>

alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson) writes:
> ****
> 
> Well, there is one option I sometimes forget about.  The KS-10 model was a
> 19-inch cabinet that is usable in a house.  There are people on
> alt.folklore.computers who can tell you where to start looking for one, so I'm
> re-directing followups there.

Just as a "me too", I would dearly like to find a KS10 someplace.  I'm
convinced there were only about half a dozen of the things ever made.
I'm pretty sure Mark Crispin has two of them, and MIT had three which
now live at or around FTP Software.  I've looked through used computer
rags for the last three years or so looking for one, and I've *never*
seen one for sale.

Any clues would be appreciated (of course, I guess once Ken
Harrenstein finally releases his PDP-10 emulator, the whole point will
be moot....).

--Pat.
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
From: alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson)
Subject: Re: sync; sync; sync; was Re: Computer Superstition
Originator: alderson@leland.Stanford.EDU
Reply-To: alderson@elaine46.Stanford.EDU (Rich Alderson)
Organization: Stanford University Academic Information Resources
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 18:09:28 GMT

In article <thecure.722337922@munagin>, thecure@mullian (matthew aardvarkious) writes:
>dagbrown@napier.uwaterloo.ca (Dave Brown) writes:
>
>>In article <1992Nov19.134510.16559@uvm.edu> wollman@sadye (Garrett Wollman) writes:
>>>Or today's modern operating systems which know to sync their disks
>>>before rebooting or halting.  From reboot(1):
>>                                          ^^^ Cool!  I want an account
>>on a computer where any user can invoke reboot....
>
>>;-)
>
>Some of the early machines had a command called crash(1).

I don't know that this existed on Unix, as implied by your naming convention,
but it *certainly* existed on ITS, which ran on PDP-6 and PDP-10 hardware at
the MIT AI Lab.

>The logic was, that if you took away the challenge of crashing the machine,
>then people wouldn't bother. It worked until people started using computers
>that they knew nothing about.

It worked as long as everyone could run in and flame away at the person who did
it.  Once network access came along, it was a lot less successful, even if the
person who ran the program *did* know all about the computer.
-- 
Rich Alderson   'I wish life was not so short,' he thought.  'Languages take
                such a time, and so do all the things one wants to know about.'
                                                        --J. R. R. Tolkien,
alderson@leland.stanford.edu                              _The Lost Road_
From: rab@ariel.ucs.unimelb.EDU.AU (Richard Alan Brown)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers
Subject: Re: Unix administration horror stories.
Date: 20 Nov 1992 21:34:37 +1100
Organization: School of Physics, University of Melbourne
NNTP-Posting-Host: ariel.ucs.unimelb.edu.au

In article <1992Nov12.172551.24575@phyrql.Alt.ZA> lucio@phyrql.Alt.ZA (Lucio de Re) writes:
>pauls@css.itd.umich.edu (Paul Southworth) writes:
>

>
[stuff deleted]

>Almost true, 'cept if cash is a _real_ problem, one must keep in mind
>that Minix will run floppy-based and neither Linux nor 386BSD will fit
>comfortably in less than 80MBytes (that's an opinion, based on my
>wanting at least 200MBytes disk before I try either out).

200M???!!!!! pah, I run Linux quite happily in 65M including gcc 
and X. 200M is nice but nowhere near *necessary*.
You can also run linux off a floppy, it's a good way to see if 
you like it, and from memory the SLS installation has a base setup
filling 4 1.4M floppies.

I have used 386BSD machines, and the installation is bigger. Both are
excellent IMHO, bit for me Linux is better on small systems.


alistair scott
afs@tauon.ph.unimelb.edu.au

>
>-- 


Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers