From: dixon@spot.Colorado.EDU (Life is real?)
Subject: Re: Culture Problems
Keywords: culture,raise,yeast
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 20:48:09 GMT

In article <1992Aug24.192022.18660@acd4.acd.com> cat@iedv7.acd.com ( Chris Teegarden (ICCT)) writes:
>
> [stuff deleted]
>
>First of all, some background.  The culture was started about two weeks ago
>using just a mix of all-purpose flour and water.  I left it out until it
>started working as evidenced by some bubbles at the surface and a distinctly
>sour odor.  I went through three cycles of taking a teaspoonful out and using
>it to seed a new culture and throwing away the rest on about a 24 hour
>interval.  Each time, I ended up with a sour smelling culture with some bubbles
>at the surface.

A TEAspoon not a TABLEspoon?  Could be 2 problems here: 1) If you really did
use just a teaspoon, then you are proofing the 24-hour starter with only
1/3rd of the amount of starter you should be using, so it may be weak as
a result, 2) your starter may be having trouble letting the yeast in the local
area get established.  First try the 24-hour method using a TABLEspoon
of starter and compare the results to what you've been getting.  Assuming
everything was done right, i.e. temperature of the proof and all measurements,
then you may want to try the 12-hour method to see if that helps.  Use 1 c.
of starter, 1 c. water, 1 1/2 (aprox.) c. white flour, and proof for 12 hrs
at 85 degrees.  It just sounds to me like the yeast isn't quite up to par
yet, i.e. lots of lacto bacilli and not much yeast is growing in the starter.
Keep trying...sometimes it takes a bit, but then it'll all of a sudden take
off and be great!
>
>After that, I put the culture in the fridge and left it there for about a week
>until last Thursday morning.  I then took it out and followed Dr. Wood's
>instructions for reviving a culture.  I fed it 1/2 cup water + 1/2 cup flour
>and proofed it for 12 hours.  Again, the mixture was sour smelling with a
>moderate number of bubbles.

I disagree a bit with Dr. Woods proof in this case.  It's probably ok for
a healthy starter, but not otherwise (IMHO).  Proofing your starter with
only 1/2 each of water and flour means the ratio of starter/water/flour
is not the best for a 12 hour proof.  For example, the starter portion will
be at least a cup, and that means the starter is probably actually over-
proofed by the end of the 12 hour proof.  The starter portion shouldn't really
be more than 50% or so of the batter when you are proofing for 12 hours.
>
>
> [stuff deleted]
>
>To make a long story short (too late), the dough only rose a small amount so
>I got two very sour bricks for my trouble.  Is this a common experience for
>home started cultures?  If not, what are the common causes for failure?  I
>am beginning to understand why so many cookbooks want you to use commercial
>yeast in making a starter.
>

Common for starters that don't have a high enough concentration of yeast
in them yet.  This verifies the idea that your starter is a bit weak in
yeast, but possibly strong in lacto bacilli (sour smell/taste).

>To console myself, I started the Russian culture from the wet sample that
>David Adams gave me (thanks again Dave) and was able to make two very nice
>loaves by Sunday.  This culture has had the opposite difficulty.  The yeast
>has been very agressive in producing CO2 and ethanol but the bread has only
>a very faint sour taste.

If this starter was revived from dry starter, then it may have lost it's
lacto bacilli content, thereby resulting in the lack of 'sour'.  I believe
the Russian is usually quite sour, so who knows?  Dave?

Brian D.

Newsgroups: rec.food.sourdough