HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jhb@calmasd.prime.com (Jim Bishop)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: practicing roles
Date: 28 Aug 92 07:19:18 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss
Organization: -

In article <1992Aug23.180939.6571@cis.ohio-state.edu>, amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:
> you aren't going to tell me that you would have developed exactly
> the same mannerisms, behavior, voice, *vocabulary*, etc., if you'd
> grown up in rural north china, amongst the nomadic lapps, etc.?
> 

I have a friend that worked in Beijing for about 6 years.  He said he
was surprised to find that some Chinese gays had the same nellie
mannerisms and voice inflections that some American gays have.  He
couldn't figure out where they picked up the behavior and decided that
it must be more than a learned behavior.  

He said there were no gay bars or meeting places in Beijing.  There
was one gay outdoor cruising area and that was all he ever knew about.
So how'd he meet other gays?  Well, he lived in the Sheraton so he had
a shower.   Virtually everyone he worked with (except women who
weren't ever allowed into the rooms) visited him to use the shower. 
(Having a shower and some privacy was a very big deal.)  It was
considered rude if you didn't shower with your guest.


Jim
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Subject: Re: boobs
Followup-To: soc.motss
Summary: no content to summarize
Organization: earnestly practicing faggots
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 20:29:37 GMT

in article <1992Aug31.190801.19953@tc.cornell.edu> shore@tc.cornell.edu 
(the hippophile melinda shore) hopes to evoke a few titters by
responding to rod williams's

    >> Perhaps it's because he writes so much pap...

with the sucker line

 >You're really determined to milk this one, eh?

while we're on the subject, would it be possible to concoct a
reasonable Breast Tour of North America?  the Grand Tetons, of course,
and The Nipples, east of barstow, ca.  anything else?  is it too much
to hope that there's a town called Areola?  or Bosom?  would there
be just terrible long empty spaces with nothing breasty in them?

while we're on female body parts and hippophiles: how about a hymn or
two to women's hips and hip bones?  (we can save men's hips for
a later day, ok?)

and since there really *isn't* any subject here, i guess i could point
out that it was probably me and not jess anderson that john graves had
in mind when he said that jess had said he had no religion any more.
all of us over-fifties look and sound alike, y'know.

on the other hand, i'm not much interested in being told that if i
have any moral or ethical principles whatsoever - and i have a lot of
'em - then i have a religion, though possibly a religion with only one
adherent, 'cause talking this way robs the notion of "religion" of its
content and interest and also disconnects completely from the way
ordinary people use the word.  (i *know* that technical senses of
ordinary words are useful and important - but not when they apply to
everyone and everything.)

arnold (sorry to have gone all serious on you there, but pointing
  out that ann's father maintains he once knew a woman named
  ophelia bosom...also ophelia taylor self, but tail is still
  *another* topic)
From: dh0a@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (DONALD L. HARDY)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Is Pat Robertson for real??
Date: 27 Aug 92 19:52:09 GMT
Organization: Lehigh University

This was on another board:

Religious broadcaster Pat Robertson...is actively campaigning against the
Iowa's proposal to put the Equal Rights Amendment on their state
constitution. Wire reports reports (sic)(?) he said in a letter last month
that the ERA is part of a "feminist agenda" that "is not about equal rights
for women." Instead, he wrote, "it is about a socialist, anti-family
political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their
children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become lesbians."

I wouldn't believe this, though I'd believe just about ANYTHING of the
religious right, except I've heard it from two independant sources.

Anybody know anything about it?

AND, COMING SOON, TO A SOC.MOTSS NEAR YOU:

The complete text of a hate letter from the self styled "Public Advocate of
the United States."

Anybody else hear of this guy?  I'll type yhe letter out as soon as I can
bring myself to read it.  It was sent (bulk mail) to the house I now occupy,
intended for the previous resident, who was on several conservative mailing
lists (and hated it).

More news tomorrow (I hope).
-- 

******************************************************************************

Donald L. Hardy                                    Office of Physical Planning
Project Planner                                    Lehigh University
dh0a@lehigh.edu                                    (215) 758 5110
From: rcw@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM (Robert White)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Prominent Episcopal Priest Outed
Keywords: Graham Pulkingham
Date: 30 Aug 92 18:39:07 GMT
Organization: The WhiteStar Corporation

Also from Sunday (08/30/92) Denver Post.  Article by Virginia Culver.
I'll just post a few key
paragraphs.  Anyone involved in the Episcopal Church will be acquainted
with Graham Pulkingham's charismatic movement.  Phobic comments by other
clergy (most of the article) deleted.

The Rev. W. Graham Pulkingham was suspended temporarily from the priesthood
after admitting he had an affair with a man, whose wife said the relationship
destroyed their marriage. Pulkingham, 65, once headed the Community of 
Celebration in Woodland Park, [Colorado].

He couldn't be reached for comment late last week, but in an interview with
Religious News Service in New York City, he confirmed the affair and said
he had been "tormented" by homosexual inclinations since adolescence.

The affair with the unidentified man, who went to Pulkingham for counseling,
lasted from 1978-1982.  Pulkingham and his wife, Betty, have five children
and several grandchildren.

Pulkingham, described as a dynamic, forceful spiritual leader, founded
the Community of Celebration, a charismatic group, more than 15 years ago,
with branches in England, Scotland, Houston and Woodland Park.


-- 
  [   Robert Carleton White, Jr.                      rcw@scicom.alphacdc.com]
From: heath@athena.cs.uga.edu (Terrance Heath)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Parents...UGH!, Part II (Resolution)
Date: 26 Aug 92 12:52:51 GMT
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens




	I wanted to thank everyone who sent supportive messages as I
stressed about the pending weekend visit with my parents.  Its nice to
know that there is at least some emotional support out there, not to
mention lots of free advice.
	I just thought I'd post this update on the situation.  My
fears were realized in that they brought up the subject of money and
the lack of it, as well as the prospect of my returning home to live,
though my being gay was never brought up (if they weren't going to
bring it up I wasn't going to bring it up - though they already know -
until I had to).  I did not let them badger me into an on-the-spot
decision, but told them I needed time to think, and returned to Athens
on Sunday.
	Since then I've been doing some investigating on my
circumstances, and in the midsts of all this I called up my Student
Loan lender.  It turns out that I have not borrowed the full amount
availible on my loan, and that the amount still availible will cover
approximately two thirds of the total cost of finishing my degree.
When I stack that up against the benifits of cost to them (they will
only have to continue helping me with room and board, not paying all
of  it but only part of it), as well as the benifits of keeping my job
and all of the academic credits I've earned to date, it makes a
persuasive argument for my staying put right where I am.  In fact,
I'll probably offer to take up most of the burden (two thirds) of my
room and board, so it will be an offer too good for them to refuse.

*************FOLLOWING A CONVERSATION WITH MY DAD*************************

	
	Well, it all worked out, thanks to that loan. I will be
staying right where I am and finishing up my degree this year. And you
better believe I am ONE RELIEVED QUEEN!
	Thanks again to all who sent email support and advice. It
helped me more than you know. I wish I could respond personally to
each one, but I'd be typing for the next two days if I tried it, so I
thought I post the news publicly so that it would reach everyone. 
	Thanks again. I didn't realize just how supportive this
newsgroup could be.


Terrance (known to her dearest friends as "Margo Channing", and she
has no idea why!)

-- 
"Black men loving black men is THE revolutionary act!"
			-Joseph Beam_
Terrance Heath 
heath@athena.cs.uga.edu
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: brent@syacus.acus.oz.au (Brent Davies)
Subject: Re: Redefining masculinity
Organization: Australian Centre for Unisys Software, Melbourne
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 04:27:17 GMT

elf@halcyon.com (Elf Sternberg) writes:

>In article <1992Aug24.012008.20170@syacus.acus.oz.au>
>     brent@syacus.acus.oz.au (Brent Davies) writes:

>>My heroes all used to be Harrison Ford types; these days it's Julian Clary.

>   Ah, well, some of us just can't give up old habits; the older Ford
>gets, the hotter he is to me. 

My dear Elf, I *never* meant to imply I've stopped thinking he's *hot*! :-)

I'm talking about *hero-worship*, not *lustful infatuation* here.  ;)

>Then again, Patrick Stewart and James
>Burke (of "Connections" and "The Day The Universe Changed") are sex
>objects for me as well...

Well, definite thumbs-up on Mr Stewart.  Sadly, "The Day The Universe Changed"
has never aired in Australia that I'm aware of.

--Brent
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: buckmr@vccsouth21.its.rpi.edu (Ron Buckmire)
Subject: Re: Deb Price on Bush
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 17:08:24 GMT

kls4344@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Person in flux) writes:

>It's the 1964 GOP presidential nominee--not the current one--who is in touch
>with middle America on gay issues.  A recent _USA Today_-CNN-Gallup Poll found
>55 percent of voters agree with Democrat Bill Clinton's support for "equal
>rights for homosexuals."  Only 27 percent said he goes too far. 
Yes, but this figure is actually misleading. According to the latest VILLAGE
VOICE, igf one asks specific questions, like ``Should civil rights protections
similar to those for religion and disability be extended to homosexuals?'' the
numbers go down to 44% and 47% AGAINST. Other numbers [support for Gay Marriage,
Lesbian Adoption, etc are even _worse_. This poll was done by the CNN-Time
people (I believe)].

-- 
RON BUCKMIRE, 11 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735. "D.C. in '93!"
uunet!rpi.edu!buckmr||buckmr@rpitsmts.bitnet||buckmr@rpi.edu||+1 518 276 8910
"I don't think 'so called' dirty books inspire anyone to commit any crime
more serious than masturbation" -- William Burroughs, author of _Naked Lunch_
From: mara@panix.com (Mara Chibnik)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: What is virginity?
Date: 2 Sep 92 19:44:13 GMT
Organization: (getting there)



Interesting thread, this.

I remember a time when it seemed really important to keep 
track of just how far one had gone (operating from a context
in which "going all the way" was doing what might make a baby). 
It seems amazingly long ago.  In those days we knew people whom
we called "technical virgins," not because they'd never worked
in a lab, but because they'd managed to find many other ways 
besides the one that might make a baby to play sexual games.

One of the many other things I seem to have lost since those 
days is the ability to distinguish, for the purposes of 
classifying myself and others, between sexual acts that 
deflower and sexual acts that don't.  Clear as it may have
seemed to me once, it's now as messy as trying to figure out
where, along the way, I learned to read music.  There was a 
time before I could decipher it, and now I can, but no moment-- 
or even brief interval as there was with reading words-- at which
the change seems to have occurred.

As to other-than-sexual virginities, oh my goodness gracious me,
the world seems always to be full of them.

Mara [wondering between forthright-- not angry-- square brackets
     just how many undiscovered virginities she has left to lose
     and hoping to many of the losses]

-- 

  Mara Chibnik
  mara@panix.com                Life is too important to be taken seriously.
From: markm@ogicse.ogi.edu (Mark Morrissey)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: "Behind the Hate in Oregon"
Date: 4 Sep 92 00:47:53 GMT
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute (formerly OGC), Beaverton, OR

snodgras@lclark.edu (Bil Snodgrass) writes:
: 
: If the measure passes we will have a bad 3 or 4 years, but most political
: science people in the universities say that the law will not be up held
: in the Federal Courts.  But the appeals process through the courts will
: take time.  

If the current Supreme Court were to hear the arguments, I would tend to
think that the measure would be overturned.  However, if the republicans
win the election and get one more appointee on the bench, most political
analysts following this measure (and I admit I am not a political analyst :)
agree that it would be upheld just as the Georgia sodomy law was upheld.

Parts of the measure are clearly constitutional and some are grey.  If
part gets overturned, the rest will still be law.  I was amazed to find
that while the activists are confident that measure 9 will fail, the
political analysts aren't too sure.  Personally, I think it will be
a 51% - 49% vote and I'm not sure who will get the 51%.  It is best to
work hard to defeat the measures and not count on the courts.

side note: Measure 9 will not prevent homosexuals from gathering for
protest, etc.  What it will do is prevent the issuing of permits, etc.
for any purpose which can be construed as supporting homosexuals.

I haven't heard anything from Colorado for a while.  Anyone got an update?

ObMotssWish:  I caught the tail end of a news segment on NPR while driving
home which indicated that some groups (who, I don't know) have stated
that they intend to file suit to nullify the measure.  I think that the
argument is that it is unconstitutional and violate civil rights.  I'm
off to get the papers now!

--mark
--
Mark Morrissey           One Hatred to rule them all.  One Hatred to find them.
markm@cse.ogi.edu        One Hatred to bring them all and in the darkness bind
                         them.  In the land of Bigotry where the Shadows lie.
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: "do I look like a mother-fucking role model?"
Date: 28 Aug 92 07:57:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Aug28.075730.29574
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

Reed is starting up school again. One of the orientation activities
this year was a panel on "Diversity at Reed" (aka "Reed, the rich
white kids school"). There were 4 students representing diversity - a
man from Pakistan, a Thai-American woman, an African-American woman,
and me, a gay white man. About 30 Reed students came to hear what we
had to say and talk about diversity.

I've done a lot of "out" activities. I regularly walk around Portland
with big garish faggot t-shirts. I've shown up as part of Queer Nation
Portland on television. I just signed a statement against the OCA's
Measure 9 for the Oregon Voter's Pamphlet - my name as a compuqueer
all over Oregon. These things are relatively impersonal.

Sitting on this panel was *hard*. I had to give a 3 minute speech
about what it was like to be gay. It was amazingly difficult for me to
simply say "I am a gay man". It was even harder to talk about the
issues I wanted to talk about - the subtle heterosexism at Reed, the
difficulty in raising queer issues in class ("Patroklos, Achilles
'true friend'". Argh, they weren't "true friends" - they were lovers.
Get it right, Lattimore), the realization that as queer friendly as
Reed is, you really are in a small minority.

I managed to say it all, and I said it without shaking or sweating too
much. And I think I did some good - educating a few people a little
about what it is to be gay.

God, I'm glad to be out. I can't imagine how I survived being afraid
to talk about being gay. Coming out still requires courage, but I now
have that courage.
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                    The sully-van vultures are on the prowl
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Sim is OK!!
Date: 27 Aug 92 12:40:27 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison


In article <3448@ra.nrl.navy.mil> julie@hood.nrl.navy.mil
(Julie Hood) writes:

>I just spoke to Sim and he and his home are in tact.
>No electricity yet but his bunny is fine.

Good news about Sim & David.  I hope the rabbit's OK too.
:-)

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jarvis@psych.toronto.edu (Brian Jarvis)
Subject: Another Victory!
Organization: Department of Psychology, University of Toronto
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 92 17:02:00 GMT

Just a few hours ago, a tribunal of the Human Rights Commission of Ontario
ordered the provincial government to extend pension and health benefits to
same-sex couples.  The case was launched in 1988 by Michael Leshner, a
lawyer employed with the Ministry of the Attorney-General of Ontario,
when his partner of seven years was denied elegibility under the spousal
health benefits offered to employees of the provincial government.

The tribunal ruled that the restrictions were a violation of the equalities
clauses of the Charter of Human Rights of the Constitution.  Because of this
reasoning, the decision will be a valuable precedent towards arguing similar
cases across Canada.

More details will be forthcoming in the evening papers.

Brian
-- 

Brian A. Jarvis,          Rm. 4026, Sidney Smith Hall, Dept. of Psychology,
jarvis@psych.toronto.edu  University of Toronto, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
System Administrator      M5S 1A1  (416) 978-3948
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: asente@adobe.com (A Usenet Pal)
Subject: Rendell Bird
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 04:12:44 GMT

I just got off the phone with Rendell and he asked me to let everyone know
that he is fine.  There were some interesting moments when he was outside
in 90 mph winds trying to remove an awning that was threatening to destroy
the roof...

Now if we could only hear from Sim...

      -paul asente
	   asente@adobe.com   ...decwrl!adobe!asente   moo-bear@cs.stanford.edu

They were soon joined by Donald, Herbert's singularly well-favoured sheepdog,
and many were the giggles and barks that came from the shrubbery.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jkusters@zeus.calpoly.edu (Chrome Jester)
Subject: Re: What I have been doing (long)
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 16:37:48 GMT

harris@currituck.cs.unc.edu (Trey Harris) divulges:
->
->I glanced once more, back at this tragic figure sitting on the steps
->to the classics building, and promised myself that I would come back
->next Sunday, and learn more about him.  No matter what his problems,
->whatever his complaints might be, he seemed like he could use a
->friend.
->
->And that is one thing I can give to him.

And *SOME* people say that there are no positive gay role-models...

*HUGS*, Trey!!

JOhn.
-- 
/-John A Kusters, jr.--------------------------------------------------- ______
| jkusters@ares.calpoly.edu   b0- f- w g- s-- r p++                      \    /
Silence keeps us all in darkness, We can't change things overnight;       \  /
But we can shed a little light, Be Political not Polite! -Romanovsky & Phillips
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: I'm ready for my closeup, Mr. Archiver
Date: 27 Aug 92 20:41:14 GMT
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison


In article <l9qa6bINN4o6@mizar.usc.edu>
adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

>In article <1992Aug27.182800.1202@spdcc.com> 
>dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:

>> I can't wait to find out what
>> Sargon looks like--somewhere between the Terminator and Tinkerbelle,
>> I'd imagine.

>I think he's probably a dead ringer for Billie Burke.

WHOOP!!!!

Arne!  You are *too* evil!  (No, let me modernize that: Hey
Arn, like way cool, ya know?)

Please dig in your archive for the most destructo shot of
Billie Burke you can find (you *do* have a Topper press kit,
don't you, luv?) and send it to Steve to put in the archive
as sargon_at_home.gif.

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jhansen@convex.com (James Hansen)
Subject: Re: McNeil-Lehrer on the Pentagon Ban
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 16:17:11 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

Rod Williams writes:

>The report showed the parallel between the claim that
>straight military folk would be uncomfortable living in close
>proximity to gays and lesbians, and the exact same claim made
>in the 40s about white military being uncomfortable living
>next to blacks.

The report also pointed out that the fears imagined by those opposed
to the racial integration of the military never materialized once the
ban was lifted.

I found it quite ironic that Colin Powell supports the ban of homosexuals
for quite the same (unfounded) reasons that blacks were kept out of
the service before the '40s.

--
James B. Hansen                                  {sun,uunet}!convex!jhansen
CONVEX Computer Corporation                              jhansen@convex.com
3000 Waterview Parkway, P. O. Box 833851
Richardson, TX 75083-3851                              Phone: (214)497-4802
Xref: sparky soc.motss:37254 soc.culture.asian.american:8608
From: kenj@kambo.wpd.sgi.com (Ken ``Blackfur'' Jones)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,soc.culture.asian.american
Subject: Re: AM/CM - Gay Colonialism?
Date: 28 Aug 92 01:03:21 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA

johnf@uhheph.phys.hawaii.edu (John Flanagan) writes:

>The student GLB group (the Ohana) is a social group which meets
>twice a month.  I haven't been to a meeting yet this semester, but
>last semester typically 10-20 people would show up.  Of these, almost
>all would be Asian or Pacific Islander -- I was frequently the only
>Caucasian there.  Since whites comprise about 16% of the student
>population, almost all others being Asians or Pacific Islanders, then
>non-whites are slightly over-represented in the Ohana.  Of course,
>with a sample size this small such statistics are meaningless.
                                    ^^^^^^^^^^
Uh oh, John.  You just said the magic Hu word! :-)

- Ken
Newsgroups: soc.motss