From: noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring)
Subject: Evil, Free Choice, Heaven/Hell, etc. (was Re: Existence of Concepts)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 92 20:20:27 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article kilroy@gboro.glassboro.edu (Dr Nancy's Sweetie) writes:

>My conclusion is that the `power' of a temptation lies in its attractiveness
>to the person tempted.  This is similar to the way the `power' of a poem/
>symphony/painting/sculpture lies in how the artist's work "strikes a chord"
>with the audience.  There is no magical power in a set of sounds, but there
>_is_ a kind of magic in the way Beethoven's Ninth Symphony stirs my soul.
>
>Also, note that I did not say evil exists only in the actions of people, or
>that it is dependent upon human nature -- I said it was dependent upon the
>existence of sentient beings.  Devils, for example, are self-aware beings
>capable of some kinds of action; but they are not people.  If the only
>creature ever made was Satan, he'd still be capable of Evil.
>
>Please note that none of this says evil is not `real'.  Merely that it need
>not be any kind of thing, material or spiritual.  If I beat someone up with a
>bat, that would be evil, and it would be very real.  But I can beat someone
>up even if `evil' is used only as an adjective.  The reality of emotions and
>intentions does not dependent on their existing outside of the creatures who
>experience and act.

I tend to agree with this.  In a prior post I mentioned Dr. Norm Geisler's
approach to evil.  There is no such thing as 'evil', at least separate from
God's creation, since God created *everything* in the Universe and declared it
to be "good" (including Satan).  What we call evil is choosing the lesser good,
rather than the greater good of God (i.e., His will).  For example, it would
be *good* if I rob a bank, since then I could provide for my family.  However,
God said that stealing is not in His Will.  Thus, the greater Good is not to
steal.  Another example:  I may say, "it is *good* that I kill that person,
since everyday that person says something bad about me - I don't feel right
when they do, and I consider it good to feel right."  However, God's Will
says that you must not murder.  Sin is, in summary, doing the lesser good,
rather than the greater Good of God.  And we have to remember that God's Will
is based on perfect knowledge, and that because of His infinite love for each
of us, his motives are that He obviously wants the best for us.

On a related note, we have been blessed by God to have a free-will.  We are
created in His Image, and one of the traits of God is choice.  If we could
not choose among several alternatives, then we would not have been completely
created in His Image.  It's interesting to note that God foreknew before
Creation that man would choose the lesser good rather than the greater Good
resulting in the great Fall of man, yet God went ahead and created man anyway
(despite this foreknowledge) in His Image rather than creating beings that
would automatically (robotically) choose Him.  Of course, the rest is
obvious, that God then chose the sacrifice of His Son to be the means by
which man could be reconciled to God, and when you look at it, this does not
infringe on the free-will choice of mankind.  We choose to accept or not to
accept Christ (obviously, I'm not a Calvinist).  [Of course, God foreknows who
will accept Him, and who will reject Him, but *we do not* (this is explainable
in that we are restricted to time, while God, who created time, is outside of
time, i.e., timeless, the Alpha and the Omega).  And of course, God will work
hard to lead a person to come to the conclusion that he/she should accept His
gift of salvation, but I don't believe that God will ever "force" anybody to
accept Him, even though God has the power to do so.]

Even Heaven/Hell is both an aspect of man's choice and of God's Love, at least
according to my interpretation of C.S. Lewis.  For those people who say, "My
will be done", and reject God, then God, in His Love for them, will honor
their choice and find them a place where His presence will be withdrawn, as
that person *requested*.  Of course, we call this place Hell, since it is
obvious, just looking at the world around us, that where God's Will has been
effectively replaced by man's will, that 'Hell' will be the end result (thus,
Hell is a place that man will create, all God needs to do is to withdraw the
presence of His Spirit, and a place of suffering will automatically result -
God will not need to institute any other unpleasantries - man will be
sufficiently talented to provide the misery prominently mentioned in
Scripture).

However, for those people who say "Thy will be done", and accept God through
Christ, then God, in His love, will honor that person's choice and bring that
person into His presence.  We call that place Heaven.  No more need be said
here.

Anyway, my views on the above subjects are obviously different than what is
normally taught, and to some Christians may even be controversial or
unpalatable, but that is what I believe at the present.  I am open to change
one or more of my viewpoints when somebody is able to show, from a logical
integrated analysis of God's entire Word, that they are not correct, or, at
the minimum, can't be supported.

Jon Noring

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