HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu (Lauren L. Crawford)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Bob Dylan
Date: 9 Oct 92 15:07:29 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Oct9.134043.4452@cbnews.cb.att.com> ajw@cbnews.cb.att.com (andrew.j.whitman) writes:

>inane.  When he's good he's very good - on almost all of the "Slow
>Train Coming" album, on "Every Grain of Sand" 

You just hit on one of my all-time favorite songs.  Incredible.  I've
forgotten, however, what album it's on (I used to own it, before I trashed
all my LPs for CDs); anyone care to enlighten me?

>I think he's the finest songwriter rock music has ever produced, and 
>the *only* songwriter in rock music whose lyrics can legitimately stand
>on their own as great poetry.  

Now if only he could _sing_.  8-)  I have to admit, I enjoy Dylan most
when: a) I've got a lyric sheet to look at rather than strain to make sense
of "whuzzaNYYYYYYYYzgulllikeYYEEEEWWWWW dewinnaplayzlykTHIIIIIIIIZ..."
or b) somebody else covers him.

>But I'm also disappointed in him because
>he's prodigiously talented, and because Christianity, of all subjects,
>should inspire great lyrics, and because Dylan doesn't even try most 
>of the time.  The bane of Christian music is triviality:  tired cliches, 
reciting Bible verses instead of interpreting how those verses apply in 
>people's lives, an insistence on the upbeat and on warm, fuzzy
>feelings instead of on the cross where Jesus died and the cross
>that we are to take up daily in following him.  

Amen and amen.  Although, to be honest, I do see better and better stuff
coming out these days:  Bob Bennet, Bruce Cockburn, Michael Card ...

I would also add that Dylan, for all his poetic genius, isn't much of a
tunesmith.  He's an example of that typical dichotomy I see in music: 
great words, OK tune; great tune, OK words.  It's really hard to find
somebody who can put it all together.

>But I'd like to see him do better.  He *can* do better.  I'll commit
>the ultimate Christian Dylan Fan sacrilege of asserting that Dylan's
>non-Christian music from the sixties is far superior to anything
>he's released as a Christian.  

Except "Every Grain of Sand."  We have to disgree on that one.



-- 
The trick of reason is to get the imagination to seize the actual world --
if only from time to time.     -- Annie Dillard, "An American Childhood"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lauren Crawford  //  crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt - K31)
Subject: Re: Larry Howard
Reply-To: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil
Organization: Naval Surface Warfare Center	
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 11:44:48 GMT

In article <BvtGrI.n5A@casper.cs.uct.ac.za>, hkabutz@casper.cs.uct.ac.za (H M Kabutz) writes:
|> Hello everybody!
|> 
|> I just bought myself the tape 'Redeemed' by Larry Howard.  It is
|> excellent music, together with very good lyricks.

Wow!  Is the the album with 1159?  Anyway, I want whatever CD it is that
has that song, if there is an address or publisher info or whatever
would you email or post that.

Stephen
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: umrobe57@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Ken A. Roberge)
Subject: Man do I need help?
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Distribution: World 
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 20:34:31 GMT

	I need someone to send me a list of about 20 Christian bands to
try out..and maybe a little description with each because am basically
walking blind into this market..and only have 1 or 2 tapes..MWS and
Charlie Peacock, and two Petra tapes..the newest and Beyond Belief..these
choices were strictly on the advice of friends..however what I think I
could use is sort of an outline of the different music sections (ie..pop,
jazz, rock, heavy metal..easy listening) with a few bands to check out in
each section..put say the best known in each section..It's hard to go
somewhere and buy a tape when you don't know anyone on the shelves..
 
 Please respond via e-mail
Thanks

-- 
*--------------------------------------------------------------*
If you want me I'll be hiding somewhere on Wizards Island
In the middle of Crater Lake..
*--------------------------------------------------------------*
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: Danny W. McCampbell <danny@utkux1.utk.edu>
Subject: Re: Music about heaven
X-Xxmessage-Id: <A6F84DBC7001CC3E@revelation.utcc.utk.edu>
X-Xxdate: Wed, 7 Oct 92 08: 18:04 GMT
Organization: The University of Tennessee
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d12
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 12:18:09 GMT

euahbg@eua.ericsson.se (Hans Bengtsson)

I would suggest the song on Carman's new tape Addicted
to Jesus about Carman going to heaven and seeing the 
Angels and Jesus.  I cannot remember the name of the
song.  Sorry.

Danny

PS  Last song on side 1.
From: drice@ponder.csci.unt.edu (Keith Rice)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Is Huff Related to Huff?
Date: 16 Oct 92 23:12:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: ponder.drice.719277137
Organization: University of North Texas

In <Bw17C0.K3o@news.cso.uiuc.edu> cwf50862@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Chippen ) writes:

>If i recall correctly Ronn Huff string man for Mws and many other ccm artists
>is the brother of David and Dann huff of Giant and formerly of WhiteHeart

>(Dann Huff has also played for nearly every musical artist in the world)

No.  Ronn is the father of Dann and David.

--
_____________________________
__-----____--___--__-----____	D. Keith Rice
__--__--___--__--___--__--___	University of North Texas
__--___--__--_--____--___--__	Department of Computer Science
__--___--__----_____--__--___	Denton, Texas, USA
__--___--__--_--____--_--____
__--__--___--__--___--__--___	drice@ponder.csci.unt.edu
__-----____--___--__--___--__
_____________________________
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian,alt.rock-n-roll.metal,alt.thrash,alt.rock-n-roll.metal.heavy
From: Phil.Powell@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Phil Powell)
Subject: Intermosh No. 10 Update
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 02:19:59 GMT

My friend Shade (rljhr@cs.flinders.edu.au) just informed me that
Discarnated is interested in selling their pre-release of their upcoming
demo to the US ONLY IF 20 orders or more are placed...

It is $5 per tape plus $3 postage and handling.... let me recommend it to
you, Discarnated is CRUSHING FREAKIN' DECENT death/thrash, leaning more
towards death metal...it has 4 songs on it, varied and produced fairly
well... worth the money!

Send all requests to: rljhr@cs.flinders.edu.au (Shade)

Tanx!

Also, Final Judgement will be in concert this Saturday (Oct. 17) at the X
in Smyrna GA with Antix and The Released.. try to go, it'll CRUSH.. (thanx
Sam for the update)... also I goofeth yea verily... Final Judgement's
upcoming album on Mootown Records is called "Desolating Sacrilege", not
"Desolate Sacreligious" or whatever I had before...

FINAL UPDATE: Final Prophecy (oo what a pun!) will be in concert in Tampa
Florida, word has it Morbid Angel and Obituary will headline...

Phil

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: cee1@ra.msstate.edu (Charles Evans)
Subject: Amy Grant's new .... daughter
Organization: Mississippi State University
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 02:27:06 GMT

I just heard on the local secular station that _loves_ playing Amy said
that she had her baby Sunday. Named: Sarah Cannon (Chapman?).

But who knows who Sarah Cannon is b.k.a.?  Easy one, but they named her for
Sarah Cannon.

-- 
+--------------------+-----------------------+------------------------+
|  Charles E. Evans  |  cee1@ra.msstate.edu  |        Fear God        |
|    iDLE CHATTEr    |  cee1@MSSTATE.BITNET  |  Love the brotherhood  |
|    Idle chatteR    |cevans@abe.msstate.edu |  Pray without ceasing  |
From: urmvance@memstvx1.memst.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: DA:Doppleganger on CD?
Date: 15 Oct 92 17:13:07 -0600
Organization: Memphis State University

In article <1992Oct15.132434.19451@eng.umd.edu>, yag@eng.umd.edu (Eric Funk) writes:
> 
> Is the DA (or Daniel Amos) album "Doppleganger" available on CD? My
> friend is interested in getting it.

According to True Tunes magazine, Yes. Say they, it is being reissued on disc.
Call them up: 1-800 669-TRUE.
-- 
 | --+-- |    |  | |       /-+-  ||  ---\ --+-- |    --+-- |The Way   |Ask me|
 | --+-- \--\ |  | \--\    |    -++-  |-/   |   \--\   |   |The Truth |how I |
\| --+--    | \--+    |    \---  ||  -+-  --+--    |   |   |The Life  |know! |
Richard Vance: URMVANCE@memstvx1.memst.edu  Memphis St University, Memphis, TN
From: acb@moscom.com (Amy Bourquin)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Michael Card's guitar playing
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:54:40 GMT
Organization: Moscom Corp., Pittsford NY

>
>Agreed...I'd need to surgically alter myself to sing "Simeon's Song"...;-)
>
>Bob (OK, OK, call me "picky";-) Miller

Simeon's Song isn't too bad for me in the key of G
Boy is it a great song!

Now that I've held HIm in my arms
My life can come to an end
Let your servant now depart in peace 
I have seen Your salvation
He's the light of the Gentiles
and the glory of His people Isreal.

Amy B.
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: 2 Bride shows in Ohio
From: bgbaker@miavx3.mid.muohio.edu
Date: 14 Oct 92 22:55:15 EST

Bride is coming to the KIng's Place in Columbus Ohio on November 7th.
Admission is free... a don't miss Heavy Metal show...
(For directions, contact me)

Bride is also doing an Accoustic Set North of Cincinnati on October 31
(in case you didn't read my other post)
Admission is free...
(For directions, contact me)

				Gary

Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: cwf50862@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Chippen )
Subject: Re: Huff family
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 23:31:19 GMT

dann huff has also played with Janet jackson and others, it seems he loves to
play and loves to be heard.

Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: jpeg8496@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jeffrey P. Elbel)
Subject: Re: >>>>>> 77's <<<<<<
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 18:34:11 GMT

jpeg8496@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jeffrey P. Elbel) writes:

	PLEASE EXCUSE THIS WRETCHED TYPO.  I AM NOT ILLITERATE:

>I dunno, maybe he really meant "Take off all your ** close ** and
>get down on your knees."

It's CLOTHES.  I know.  It was a simple mistake.  Thank you for
correcting me.

JEFF
FTJ
From: phiggins@crux.acs.uci.edu (Paul Higgins)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Amy Grant's new .... daughter
Date: 16 Oct 92 17:40:29 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.2ADEFE8D.3920
Organization: University of California, Irvine


According to the Los Angeles Times' "Morning Report" for Wednesday, Oct. 4:

     Country music legend Minnie Pearl has a new namesake.
     Grammy-winning singer Amy Grant has named her new daughter Sarah
     Cannon Chapman in honor of Pearl, her longtime friend and fellow
     Tennessean whose real name is Sarah Cannon.  The baby was born
     Sunday in Nashville. ...
From: md@sound.esm.rochester.edu (Mike DeMurga)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Fearful Symmetry (DA) on disc?
Date: 12 Oct 92 21:03:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: galileo.1992Oct12.210355.8825
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Rochester, Rochester NY

In article <1bb1lcINNp8c@gambier.rick.cs.ubc.ca> n3x092@rick.cs.ubc.ca (Geoff Lloyd Burian) writes:
>Has the great DA album "Fearful Symmetry" made it to CD yet?
>
I'm pretty sure this has been out...might check with Spring Arbor.

>Oh, yes, and I saw something somewhere which talks about a DA live
>"bootleg" album which was put out a while back.  Anyone have it?
WHAT???????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I must live in a cave or something.  Is this for real?  
>
>Geoff B.
--Mike
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: noel@crs.cl.msu.edu (Noel Estabrook)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Jonathan David Brown convicted
Date: 11 Oct 92 21:27:48 GMT
Reply-To: noel@crs.cl.msu.edu.UUCP (Noel Estabrook)
Distribution: na
Organization: Michigan State University

In article <1992Oct9.184649.9377@cbfsb.cb.att.com> Mark Wuest <mdw@trumpet.att.com> writes:
>>  Ain't that the truth! I've submitted two posts there -- both of which
>>  I thought were legitimate -- and both were rejected. The embedded
>>  comments are also a nuisance.
>
>I differ with both of you.  Man!  The guy gives up considerable time
>trying to moderate a group that (left to its own devices) swings wildly
>from extreme to extreme and instead of appreciation, gets chided
>publicly.  If he doesn't read this newsgroup, would you call it
>gossip?
>
>FWIW, I've posted to that group and had the post "rejected", too.  But,

Well, maybe I'm even different yet.  I tried posting to s.r.c. myself
and only succeeded in getting only 2 out of 10 posts submitted.  Not
only were 8 not submitted, but I never even got a reason or E-mail as
to why.  After finally deciding that it was because I am very conservative,
I wrote clh (moderator) a note asking for some sort of explanation as to
why I wasn't getting posted.  Well, 2 months later, and still no reply...


Noel Estabrook          |       If somebody publishes an article in a really
noel@crs.cl.msu.edu   __|__	obscure research journal and nobody reads it,
Educational Technology  |	does it really exist?  - IgNobel Prizes
Michigan State Univ.    |				Romans 12:2
--
Noel Estabrook          |       If somebody publishes an article in a really
noel@crs.cl.msu.edu   __|__	obscure research journal and nobody reads it,
Educational Technology  |	does it really exist?  - IgNobel Prizes
Michigan State Univ.    |				Romans 12:2
From: st0o+@andrew.cmu.edu (Steven Timm)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Album Review:  AMY GRANT:  "Home For Christmas"
Date: 15 Oct 92 16:55:18 GMT
Organization: Doctoral student, Physics, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

In her introduction to this album, Amy says "It's my hope that from year
to year, as the Christmas season rolls around, my own children will blow
the dust off of this recording and let the songs that were dear to me as
a child find a sweet, familiar place in their hearts."

In this goal she has succeeded admirably.  This is the first Amy Grant
album in quite some time that you could give to your grandma as a
Christmas present.  Several old standards are rearranged, such as "Have
yourself a Merry Little Christmas",     "It's the most wonderful time of
the year"
"Rocking Around The Christmas Tree", "Winter Wonderland", "I'll Be Home
For Christmas."  All these are tastefully done, yet refreshingly and
newly 
arranged.  

There are a couple religious Christmas carols, done up in quite classic style,
"For unto us a Child is born" (which features a boys choir) and 
"O Come All Ye Faithful."

Rounding out the balance are four new songs.  "Breath of Heaven" (Mary's
Song) written by Amy Grant and Chris Eaton.  "Grown-up Christmas List"
(David Foster/Linda Thompson Jenner) "The Night Before Christmas" (Carly
Simon)  "Emmanuel, God with us"  (Amy Grant, Chris Eaton, Robert
Marshall).

Grown-up Christmas list is probably the best of the four.   The album is 
produced by Brown Bannister, lots of arrangements by Ronn Huff and Shane
Keister.   The album ends with an instrumental improvisation on Jesu,
Joy of Man's Desiring led by Carl Marsh, Tom Hemby, and Mark O'Connor.
The vocal work throughout includes some vocals we didn't think Amy was 
capable of anymore, challenging and well sung.  This is not a trail-blazing
album by any stretch, but it is a worthwhile addition to her works.

Steve's rating:  Three thistles on a scale of -5 to 5
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
From: ss1@kepler.unh.edu (The Rink)
Subject: Re: AMY GRANT LYRICS AVAILABLE!
Organization: Turkey Hall
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1992 01:34:57 GMT

>I thought lyrics were copyrighted? Doesn't one have to obtain the publisher's
>permission before reproducing them?

See the text files on copyright laws at cs.uwp.edu ... it is in
/pub/music/lyrics  ...  right before you enter into the files directory.
This explains copyright laws and why it is not really a violation just to
reproduce them and make them available.  The way that you use the files,
however, can be a copyright violation, so you should read these files before
downloading anything.  Sorry for forgetting to mention this in the post.
-- 
/\     The          "...and it was about this time that Saddam Hussein was
 .\     Rink         getting really angry at Israel, so he invaded Kuwait...."
  .\/\        /\                              --Me, misquoting myself.
 .  \.\/\    / .\
 /\. \/. \  /.  .\  /\    "You do not test the strength of a fly by hitting
/. \ /.  .\/  .   \/. \    it with a sledgehammer."  --Professor Simpson
  . / . .  \   .  /  ..\/\
/\ /      . \.   / .    \.\      ss1@kepler.unh.edu   s_stoddard@unhh.unh.edu
From: rhm@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Bob Miller)
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 20:13:02 GMT
Subject: Re: Michael Card's guitar playing
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian

In rec.music.christian, chaplin@keinstr.uucp (Roger Chaplin) writes:

> Bob Miller (rhm@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM) wrote:
> : In rec.music.christian, jmrg9881@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Reid) writes:
> : 
> : "Scandalon" has three Am songs in a row! ("gimme another key, Mike, please...,
> : please....AAAAARGHHHHHHHHH!")
> 
> Could it be that those three songs *need* to be in a minor key, and Am
> happens to be just the right 'height' for Michael to sing (in those
> days, anyway :-\ and *too* high for most normal people (myself
> included) to sing?  That's what causes me to say AAAAARGHHHHHHHHH!

Agreed...I'd need to surgically alter myself to sing "Simeon's Song"...;-)

Perhaps its because I check the keys of the Praise-and-Worship sets I 
compose for Sun AM to make sure they make sense...and avoid more than two
in a row in the same key (I'll even *transpose* one to avoid it)...

Bob (OK, OK, call me "picky";-) Miller
From: CASTILLO@nauvax.ucc.nau.edu (Ulysses Castillo)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: REVIEW: Steven Curtis Chapman's...(Question!!)
Date: 13 Oct 92 21:00:23 GMT
Distribution: world,local
Organization: The Camelot System /~

In <1992Oct13.145349.12419@viewlogic.com> tim@kudzu.viewlogic.com writes:

> 
> I had the pleasure of catching this tour in Worcester Mass. on Oct.

Did he sing Go There With You ?  I would be VERY disappointed if he hadn't;
that's my new all-time favorite from him.

Ulysses.
_____
Ulysses Castillo (aka Belgarion)   Trr, lbh zhfg or n irel phevbhf crefba!
Castillo@nauvax.ucc.nau.edu
"And be assured, I am with you always, to the end of Time.", Matt. 28:20
From: harling@miki.pictel.com (Dan Harling)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Legality of copying individual songs
Date: 8 Oct 92 17:44:16 GMT
Organization: PictureTel Corporation

In article <1992Sep29.233528.11240@wdl.loral.com> trw@spl1.spl.loral.com (Tim R Witort) writes:
>   If the copy is in your possession, it is legal. It's the 
>distribution of copies that is illegal. Many people make copies
>of their music to play in the car or on their Walkmen which is
>legal since YOU are still the owner of the legally purchased
>recording. Some people even think that making ANY copies at all
>is illegal. I don't think that is the spirit of the law though.
>The law is designed to stop people from making copies of music
>and giving/selling it to others thereby depriving the artist or
>music company of the money that they WOULD HAVE gotten had the 
>person purchased a copy legally.

The point of copyright law is not to enforce sales and income; it is to
protect the author's ownership of his work.  When you buy an album, you
pay for the right to listen to it at any time, which includes making a
tape for your car.  You may even lend the album or copy to a friend,
provided *nobody* will be making use of any of your other copies at the
same time.  In other words, when you buy one copy, you may only make
use of one copy.
____________________________________________________________________________
Daniel A. Harling                        (harling@pictel.com)
PictureTel Corp.             Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of
Peabody, MA  01960                 PictureTel, but they ought to be!
From: clopton5107@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Jonathan David Brown convicted
Date: 11 Oct 92 21:48:26 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

In article <1992Oct8.154956.12253@galileo.physics.arizona.edu>, krueger@galileo.physics.arizona.edu (Ted Krueger) writes:
> In article <7OCT199220311062@elroy.uh.edu> st1t0@elroy.uh.edu (CARL SEILER) writes:
>>In article <Bvs1xr.Lx0@mentor.cc.purdue.edu>, ismith@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Chris Smith) writes...
>>>>Evidence confiscated from Brown's home included signed membership
>>>>cards for the Ku Klux Klan and Aryan Nations, and a picture of Brown
>>>>saluting a Nazi flag. 
>>> 
>>>As an African American who likes many of the artist he has produced,
>>>Double WOW!!
EDITED
>>been said that Sunday is the most segregated day in America, and I
>>wondered if you would care to share your feelings on the subject.
>>
> I don't know who said this, but I have been a white-male-of-european 
> heritage for most of my life ;) and the last church that I was a member 
> of was about 80% hispanic.  I have also been a member of a church that 
> was 40% black 30% hispanic.
> 
> Perhaps the statement you repeated is an urban myth?

But look at that you said---80% Hispanic! I admit that 40%black and 30%hispanic
is impressive, but I also bet it is the big exception.

I live in an area that has a large, fairly poor black community surrounded by a
white community.  Here churches are pretty white, or pretty black.  Here it is
true.  My church is mostly white.  So white that no matter what are personal
attitudes are, nonwhites are going to be very aware of our whitness. 
        
        The fact of the matter is that people are more at home cultural
surroundings they are familiar with.  Compounded by centuries of racism and
economic separation--which leads to even less mutual understanding, and you
shouldn't expect anthing but two (or more) separate cultures,a dn two separate
churches.  Each with their own traditions and their own music.

        I knew I could do it!  I brought this thread back to music!

        Check out the difference between "Southern Gospel" (white Cracker
music) and "Black Gospel" (being white myself, I'll leave this alone).  They
are as different as night and day (no pun intended).  Their difference is a
testament to the separatin of the white church and the black church.

        We can all get along.  But I'm not so sure that we will.






 
> "How dare you call us [people] `you people'!"
> 	-Benjamin Hooks
> 
> krueger@galileo.physics.arizona.edu
From: jmrg9881@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Jon Reid)
Newsgroups: rec.music.christian
Subject: Re: Music about heaven
Date: 8 Oct 92 15:42:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.Bvt7M5.F69
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

>I'm having a radio program in a couple of weeks and this
>program will be about HEAVEN...

If you want something that's... uh... different, there's Carman's "Third
Heaven", the last track off of "Addicted to Jesus".

Might not work on radio, though.
-- 
Jon Reid    j-reid@uiuc.edu    GEnie: THE.REIDS
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose."