HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jac@cis.ohio-state.edu (Jim Clausing)
Subject: Re: Bargaining for vacation time?
Originator: jac@kazoo.cis.ohio-state.edu
Organization: Ohio State Computer Science
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 18:41:10 GMT

>>>>> On 8 Oct 1992 07:18 EST  , olson@dstl86.gsfc.nasa.gov (Paul Olson) said:
Paul> News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

Paul> In article <1992Oct7.013821.23224@mcs.kent.edu>, pstephan@mcs.kent.edu (Paul H. Stephan) writes...
>Does anyone have any experience on whether or not it is possible to
>bargain for how long until additional vacation time is earned.  Most
>company's that I'm familiar with start with 2 weeks then add 1 week
>after 5 years.  When changing jobs this can be rather discouraging
>if you are close to or beyond the 5 years.
> 
>Any thoughts?
> 
>Thanks,
>Paul H. Stephan (pstephan@mcs.kent.edu)

[...stuff deleted...]
Paul> The bottom line is EVERYTHING is negotiable.  Most people either don't know to
Paul> try or are too afraid to state their requirements.

Paul> |      __| Paul J. Olson - VAX Systems Manager & Resident Amiga Addict |

I must agree with Paul (Olson) here.  EVERYTHING is negotiable.  If
you are getting more than 2 weeks at your current place of employment
and don't want to give that up, make that part of the deal.  I once
gave up vacation (that is, moved to a new job that gave less vacation)
and I wouldn't ever do it again.  If you have the experience and you
aren't also making unreasonable (whatever that means) salary demands,
by all means negotiate any of the rest of the package that is
important to you.  As has been stated elsewhere though, try to get it
in writing as that eliminates problems down the road.
--
Jim Clausing					jac@cis.ohio-state.edu
CIS Dept.					(614)292-4029
Ohio State University			fax:	(614)764-0271
From: slahiri@jade.tufts.edu (Sandip Lahiri)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: How good is M.S. in M.E.
Date: 8 Oct 92 01:44:22 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA
Originator: slahiri@jade.tufts.edu

Hi,
I am posting this for a friend who does not have net access. She is
doing M.S. in Mechanical Engineering. She wants to know how good (or 
bad) is the job situation in m.e. in massachusetts (understatement
huh?). Well, then where's the prospect looks brighter? (usa please).

Replies to this account please. I will forward the replies to her.
Thanx a tonne in advance.

-Sandip
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: ghost@openage.openage.com (Glenn Host)
Subject: Re: How to answer these contract head hunters
Organization: Open Age, Inc.
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 19:18:26 GMT

lily@gagme.chi.il.us (Lily Moy) writes:

>I've been approached to be a contract-for-hire.

>Basically, I'll be an employee of Company X, working at Company Z
>for a 2 month trial period. Company Z has the option to hire me
>full-time after that trial period.

>Has anyone experienced this? 

>I am looking for a full-time position and this opportunity is in the area 
>I want, and provides a foot into the door of Company Z (my first choice).

>What are the pros and cons? DO alot of companies NOT hire you after
>the trial period?  Thanks.

>--Lily

I have been hired once (although not as a contracter but as a temporary)
and not hired once (currently) so my results have been balanced.

It depends on the company - you should be making more than if you were
a fulltime employee otherwise they have no incentive to hire you as
a permanent.  The longer the expected contract (whatch out for people
who say they need you for a year and let go people in a month or two -
sometimes they delibertely lie about how long they need you to reduce the
rate) the less difference between the permanent rate and contract rate.

Some companies for contracters (my current company included) so that it
does not work out they can quickly dismiss you.

I would look at the employment history of Company Z and insure they
do not have sine-wave employment.  Make sure they tell you by a
certain day if they are going to hire you fulltime and if not look for
a new position - don't depend upon X or Z to tell you or you may go
for a period unemployed.

Recently I have discovered though that many 'permanent' jobs don't last
much longer than some 'temporary' or 'contract' jobs - companies tend
to hire for a project and layoff at the end.

-- 

                      Glenn E. Host - Reston, VA
Very grateful guest of Openage - the best SCO service shop in the area
************* my views represent no one - not even myself. ****************
From: fsquared@eff.org (Fawn Fitter)
Subject: thanks for help with article!
Originator: fsquared@eff.org
Organization: The Electronic Frontier Foundation
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 14:22:14 GMT

Just a quick note to express my appreciation to those of you who responded 
to my post last month looking for recent college grads who got jobs through
networking.  You know who you are!

FYI, the article has been accepted and will run in the January/February issue
of Circle K Magazine, a publication that goes to college-age members of the
Kiwanis Club's youth service organization.  The editor made a point of 
complimenting me on the wide range of interviews and the useful tips my
interviewees offered.  Kudos to you for your help.

I will let each of you know individually by email when the article comes out,
and ask you for your snailmail address so I can send you a photocopy.

Thanks again!
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: ortega@cactus.org (Paul Ortega)
Subject: QUERY: Thomas, Mack, & Collier
Organization: Capital Area Central Texas UNIX Society, Austin, Tx
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 03:15:07 GMT

Has anyone had any dealings with the recruiting firm,
Thomas, Mack & Collier?

-- 
Paul Ortega			|  "Would you believe two cops
2015 Cedar Bend Dr., #1105      |   in a rowboat?" - Maxwell Smart 
Austin, TX 78758		|_________________________________
(512) 832-9197			ortega@cactus.org
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: tfj@apusapus.demon.co.uk (Trevor Jenkins)
Subject: Strange Interviewing question 
Distribution: world
Organization: Job hunters use Parachute
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 20:23:36 +0000


In article <int559r.718495844@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au> int559r@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au writes:

> Hi all.
>         My girlfriend went to an interview recently for a receptionist
> position in a (small) printing/publishing firm, and the interviewer
> asked her:
> 
>    "If I offered you any job in the world, provided that it would not be
> a receptionist or secretary, what job would you prefer?"
> 
>         The question excluded the job offered, so what was she really
> trying to ask?

Those of us who interview prospective candidates have very odd reasons for
asking questions. I'm a software engineer but my boss is a (ture-blue)
manager during interviews she hates it when I ask the candidate "How do YOU
debug a program?" As my boss cannot program she thinks that there is a
corret answer to the question and no matter how many times I've tried to
explain my reasons behind asking the question she still hates it when I do.

What I have found odd is that in the five or six years that I've been
involved in interviews and the 100s of interviews that I've given I've
never gotten a student with a computer science or computing degree to give
me a sensible answer; the only person who did give me a good answer was a
physicist and she got the job.

My rationale for asking the question is wide spread. It checks out the
applicatants ability to figure out what the real question is; for me to
appraise how they react when asked odd questions; I'd also like to know HOW
they work; I'm also fishing for how good their practical skills are (or is
the first class honours degree merely a reflection upon the quality of
their teachers) and lastly it gives me a chance to wind-up my boss. :-)

Your girlfriend may have meet someone with as strange an interviewing style
as me; it is also possible that she just meet an incompetent interviewer.

By the way, "how do you debug a program" is the ONLY question that I'll ask
in an interview that I base my hiring recommedation upon. You can guage how
well I think you are doing by the timing of the question: if it is near the
beginning then you've lost already; in the middle I sense something and am
probing for more; if it is toward the end then you've onto scoring a home
run and this is the last pitch of the game.

All this reminds me of an SF story concerning the election of the next US
president it all came down to the answer to a single question. Who got in
was decided by what was said. 

-------------------------------------------------------------
Trevor Jenkins                                   Radio: G6AJG
134 Frankland Rd, Croxley Green, Rickmansworth, WD3 3AU
email: tfj@apusapus.demon.co.uk
phone: +44 (0)923 776436
From: kulla@casee.enet.dec.com (Marc Kulla)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: International Software Jobs
Date: 15 Oct 92 09:50:16 GMT
Reply-To: kulla@casee.enet.dec.com (Marc Kulla)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


In article <1992Oct14.102321.22396@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu>, arichmon@nyx.cs.du.edu (Snr SW Engineer) writes:
|>
|>A couple of weeks or so ago, somebody asked if any netters who had joined
|>ICPA could say how useful they found it. I didn't notice any responses.
|>Were there any? I currently subscribe to their newsletter, which costs
|>much less than full membership, but I'm wondering if I should go ahead
|>and join. I'd be grateful for any info..
|>

I did post an article asking for information on this organization a few
weeks ago.  I did not get any information from people who joined.  The
only information I have is from ICPA.  

If you could post a note about your feelings of the newsletter, I think
a lot of netters would appreciate it.  If you'd rather not post it, then
feel free to send it to me.  I'd surely appreciate it.

Marc 

Consulting to: 
Digital Equipment Corporation
Sophia Antipolis, France
e-mail: kulla@casee.enet.dec.com
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net (Orville R. Weyrich)
Subject: Re: Family Leave Act
Reply-To: uunet.uu.net!weyrich!orville
Organization: Weyrich Computer Consulting
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 02:16:11 GMT

There have been numerous postings on this thread describing how workers in
other countries besides the U.S.A. enjoy more vacation and paternity leave
benefits.

I wonder which [if any] of the countries that have greater benefits also
have balanced governemnt budgets and do not have trade deficits.

Certainly any such countries must be doing something right!  Or else they
have given up something else.

So how about it, world! If you have a balanced government budget and no
trade deficit, please tell us in the U.S.A. how you managed to do it.

Or if you do have budget and/or trade deficits, share with me why that
doesn't concern you to be borrowing against the future?

I realize that for a developing nation, trade deficits may be useful if the
money is spent in improving the infrastructure of the country. But the
European nations that were previously listed don't seem to be in that
category. And certainly, the U.S.A. isn't in that category -- our trade
deficits are due to consumption [of TV's, VCR's, etc.] rather than due
to investment [in railroads, harbors, highways, capital machinery, etc.]

orville

--------------------------------------   **************************************
Orville R. Weyrich, Jr.                        Weyrich Computer Consulting
Certified Data Processor                     POB 5782, Scottsdale, AZ 85261
Certified Systems Professional                   Voice: (602) 391-0821
Certified Computer Programmer            Internet: orville%weyrich@uunet.uu.net
--------------------------------------   **************************************
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: paul@monsoon.aim.com (Paul V. Farr)
Subject: Sales/Marketing Position ****DESIRED****
Originator: paul@monsoon
Organization: AIM Technology
Distribution: ba
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 23:14:34 GMT

Posted by Paul V. Farr at AIM Technology (paul@aim.com) for:

            William M. Turner ("Bill") at 415-927-2266.

Please call him directly.  I will gladly forward e-mail responses
to him for you.

Professional Objective:

A senior executive position in Sales and Marketing, leveraging 20 years
experience in mainframes, mini-computers and micro-computers.

Skills Summary:

Award-winning sales professional with a record of consistantly
strong success in opening new markets and launching new products.
Strategic leadership skills include planning, development, and
implementation.  Has held full charge responsibilitiy in execution
of financial, management, and marketing objectives.  History of
success in staff selection, training, and motivation.  Strong
skills in pricing and negotiations; persuasive presentation ability.
Experience in market research and analysis, positioning, product
packaging, and has designed customer service and support.

Background & Personal Recommendation:

I first worked with Bill in 1982 at a startup company called
Fusion Products, which marketed data manipulation tools in the
IBM System 34/36/38 minicomputer marketplace.  They had a
on-line retrieval tool, a data entry package, and a spreadsheet
package which sold well.  He was one of the founders of this
extremely successful company and headed their sales effort
building a full sales organization from the ground up WITHOUT
any outside funding.  This company was later acquired by Pansophic,
a IBM mainframe software vendor.  Since then Bill has held a
variety of senior positions including: CEO at an Autocad add-on
company (IBM PC market), and VP, Marketing & Sales at a IBM Mainframe
software company.

I've found him to be an extremely capable and trustworthy
individual whom I would have NO reservations about hiring. 
If we had a senior position available, he would be the first
person I would consider.

Summary:

Bill is looking to make the transition from proprietary IBM
based systems to the Open Systems world.  I believe that he
is an excellent candidate because he is aggressive and
smart and would quickly learn both the product and the market.
-- 
  Paul V. Farr                    Voice:  (408) 748-8649 ext 204
  AIM Technology                  FAX:    (408) 748-0161
  4699 Old Ironsides, Suite 150   E-mail: paul@aim.com OR uunet!aimt!paul
  Santa Clara, CA   95054         My opinions; not neccessarily AIM's.
From: jmaddox@mistxt.oc.com (John Maddox)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Info sought on Contact Software (sells ACE software)
Date: 15 Oct 92 17:09:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: ra.1992Oct15.170908.7995
Organization: OpenConnect Systems, Dallas, TX


I am posting this for a friend who does not have net access...

This person is considering a position at Contact Software in
Carrollton, Texas and wonders what current and ex-employees
of this company can tell him regarding their employment
at Contact Software...

This company sells and supports a product known as ACE (?)

Thanks... email please, if possible...
Don't get a lot of time to review new postings.

John

-- 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
John Maddox                jmaddox@mistxt.oc.com                   214-888-0476
                            OpenConnect Systems
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: philco@microsoft.com (Phillip Cooper)
Subject: Re: Bargaining for vacation time?
Date: 16 Oct 92 16:13:59 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corporation
Distribution: usa

In article <6215@dove.nist.gov> west@mgmt3.ncsl.nist.gov (Jim West) writes:
>In article <1992Oct14.172454.23231@microsoft.com> philco@microsoft.com (Phillip Cooper) writes:
>>
>>In the fiscal year just ended, the federal deficit was 290 billion.  
>>This, in a budget of about 1.5 trillion dollars.  Your statement above
>>that we are spending "almost 50% more than we take in" is not even
>>close to being accurate.  The correct answer is about 20%.
>>
>>Phil Cooper
>
>
>Where are you getting your numbers?  290 billion is probably the number quoted
>by the feds.  When I calculated the "real" deficit for 1991, I came up with
>430 billion.  I found a copy of the "Economic Report of the President" for 1991.
>In the back there are several tables.  One list the amount of public dept outstanding
>(or something like that).  I looked at the levels for 1991 and 1990.  The growth
>in the public dept between these two years was about 430 billion dollars. 
>
>Why the difference?  The Savings and Loan bailout is "off budget" and the gov't
>does not count the dept held by the Social Security Administration.  This would
>be all well and good if we didn't have to pay off that "off budget" dept, but
>that would mean we'd have to stop making Social Security payments when the
>baby boomers start to retire.
>
>I think that the "real" data bears out Craig's statement about spending almost
>50% more than we take in.
>
>I'm planning to make the same calculation for 1992.  I'm guessing that the "real"
>deficit will be well over 500 billion.
>
>Jim
>-- 

Jim,

My numbers come from the Oct. 14 edition of the Seattle Times (Business
Section).  You may be thinking of projections made earlier this year when
congress was planning on fully funding the S&L bailout.  It didn't happen,
so the deficit came in at about 60 Billion less than projections had been
indicating.

Of course, the S&L problem is still there, and it will have to be dealt
with, but the simple fact is that the money was NOT spent in the last
fiscal year, hence a deficit of around 290 Billion.

Phil Cooper
From: hameed@hal.COM (Hameed Mohammed)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Help...Trying to contact a company INTERQUEST.
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:17:02 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: HaL Computer Systems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: hal-backbone.hal.com


Posting for a friend of mine. He found a message from someone at Interquest,

trying to interview him. The message wasn't recorded when he was giving his
 
number.

He Wants to know the phone number and/ or the address, or atleast the city

in which it is located.


Thanks in advance.


Hameed.

hameed@hal.com
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
From: mattm@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Matt Mosley)
Subject: Young computer programmer/operator needing work
Followup-To: mattm@ai.mit.edu
Organization: Free Software Foundation 
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 00:54:57 GMT

I hope I'm posting this in the right newsgroup.

I'm a 16 year old computer programmer/operator living in the Baltimore, MD
area.  I've been looking for some sort of work, maybe an apprentice-type
job, in the field I intend to go into.  I plan to work on at least a BS
in Computer Science, and have a good high school record.

I am in desperate need of some sort of part-time work, will take whatever
you're willing to give me (reasonable).  Preferably local, but it's possible
for me to work in the mail (I used to type for someone who lived quite a ways
away, send papers back and forth.)

I can type around 80 wpm on a computer, not quite so good on a typewriter,
and can program in C, Basic, and a little Pascal.

That's about it in a nutshell.

If someone could at least point me in a direction, I'd appreciate it.

Mail replies to mattm@ai.mit.edu - please don't reply to this group.

-- 
><  Think for yourself, and feel the walls ... become sand beneath your feet.
><  Matt Mosley / Internet: mattm@ai.mit.edu                - Queensryche
From: plutchak@pilsner.geo.brown.edu (Joel Plutchak)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: Family Leave Act
Date: 9 Oct 1992 16:12:08 GMT
Organization: Brown University Planetary Geology
NNTP-Posting-Host: pilsner.geo.brown.edu

In article <140@cnmhnet.UUCP> keithg@cnmhnet.UUCP (keith garrard) writes:
>And can anyone explain to me why a woman has to take two months off to
>have a baby?  
>Women want equality in the workforce, and they say they want to have 
>jobs and careers.  But then, they take time off to have babies.  They
>leave work early if their kids get sick at school, and have to be
>picked up.   They don't show up at all if it snows, and school is
>cancelled, or they have to leave early if it starts snowing and it's
>announced that schools will close early.  If a woman wants to have a 
>youngun, then have it.  Take up to a week off [if you had a cesarian]
>and get back to work.  Let's face it; if you want a career, then 
>support it.  A company hires a person to work for them because they
>need the help.  If you want the job, then you ought to work the hours
>you are expected to work.  If you want to be a mother to your children,
>then stay home, and let someone work who will be at work everyday.

   Wow.  I'm speechless.  If you're married, I feel sorry for your
wife.  If you're not, here's some advice: thoroughly discuss your
opinions on marriage (as outlined above) with anybody you're
considering marrying.  If you both still want to go ahead with it,
you deserve each other.  And I hope for the best for all the
"fatherless" children you have.
--
Joel Plutchak, Research Programmer/Analyst
From: cc445@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Ronald J Albuquerque)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Working in Mississippi.
Date: 10 Oct 1992 17:58:04 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Hey people,

Just curious...can anyone shed any light at all on
working/living conditions in Mississippi ? Any info
at all would be welcomed.

Cheers!
Ronnie.
-- 
Ronnie Albuquerque
89500831@dcu.ie, cc445@cleveland.Freenet.edu

"Always look on the bright side of life..." - Monty Python
From: keithg@cnmhnet.UUCP (keith garrard)
Newsgroups: misc.jobs.misc
Subject: Re: IBM layoff
Date: 7 Oct 92 23:16:50 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: California-Nevada Methodist Homes

In article <1992Oct6.164717.3006@tc.fluke.COM> mehr@fluke.tc.fluke.com (Manooch Mehr) writes:
>    I heard that IBM is planning to reduce its work force by 20000. I would like to know 
>    if this rumor is true or not. I would also like to know what percentage of this wrok force are

Well, yes & no.  It is true that they are reducing their workforce.
However, they are reducing it by 40,000, not 20,000.  They are 
reducing it by offering early buyouts.  They were surprised because
they were expecting 20000 to take them up on it, but 40000 took
them up on it instead.  So it is not a reduction by firing or
lay off, it is strictly a voluntary thing, and it was quite
successfull, too successful for IBM, as it is going to cost them
more for the buyouts than they had budgeted for.  
--Keith