HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener)
Subject: Re: Plastic recorder recommendations
Keywords: Plastic recorder recommendations
Reply-To: gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Gabe M Wiener)
Organization: Columbia University
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 22:04:11 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.182557.15228@news.eng.convex.com> richardh@convex.com (Richard Hargrove) writes:
>I've been playing soprano and alto recorders for almost a year and am 
>considering acquiring a tenor and a sopranino to extend my range. 

>I specify plastic because it's my understanding that a good plastic 
>recorder is better than a cheap wooden one, and I can't justify the
>cost of a good wooden one.

>It's also my understanding that the best plastic tenor is the Yamaha
>Rothenburg.  I have been trying out an Aulos tenor, model 311, but 
>don't like the sound in the upper register - the higher frequency
>overtones are much too loud.  Any comments on this before I spring for 
>the Yamaha?  Any suggestions for maker and model for the sopranino, 
>possibly including don't bother?  Any comments at all?

I've never in my life played a plastic sopranino (never seen one, actually,
though I do own a plastic garkleine <sp?>).  Anyway, the Yamaha plastic
Rottenburghs are by far the best plastic instruments around, though I'd
still recommend a nice wooden Moeck if you can afford it.


>On a related topic, some of the local recorder players here in Dallas
>have said that unless you can get an exceptional instrument, wooden
>recorders are generally no longer worth what you pay for them.  Comments?

I've never found this to be the case...depends on the maker, etc.

>Finally, I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on how to handle
>condensation in a plastic recorder?  I find that condensation builds up
>and constricts air flow after only a few dozen bars of play.  When I
>try to draw it out at a convenient time during play (usually during a rest), 
>I produce a sound that is not aesthetically appealing.  I also find that
>there are times when it is difficult to breathe, draw, and play in the
>time allotted.

What I do in these cases is to draw the moisture in more frequently than
I otherwise would, thus preventing the need to unclog the thing in one 
noisy shot.


--
Gabe Wiener - Columbia Univ.     "This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings 
gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu       to be seriously considered as a means of 
N2GPZ in ham radio circles        communication. The device is inherently of
72355,1226 on CI$                 no value to us." -Western Union memo, 1877
Xref: sparky rec.music.classical:19230 rec.music.early:1817
From: rags@triples.math.mcgill.ca (Robert A. G. Seely)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,rec.music.early
Subject: Re: in praise of Monteverdi (was Re: in praise of Harnoncourt
Date: 22 Dec 92 22:00:06 GMT
Organization: /etc/organization

In article <1992Dec22.171215.25134@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> velde2@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Francois Velde) writes:
>  ...        It is stunning, to me, to see the two lovers unabashedly 
>engaging in near-foreplay, in front of the whole court. Not only is the
>ending of the opera immoral (the wicked triumph over the innocent), but 
>said wicked have to belabor the point with this incredible duet. The text
>follows, from memory (pardon the inaccuracies and errors in translation):
>
>Pur ti miro, pur ti godo,	I behold you, I rejoice in you,
>pur ti stringo, pur t'annodo,	I embrace you, I chain you,
>piu non peno, non moro,		I suffer no more, I die no more,
>o mia vita, o mio tesoro.	O my life, o my treasure.
>Io son tua, tuo son io,		I am yours, yours I am,
>speme mia, dillo di,		O my hope, say it, say
>pur ti sei l'idol mio, 		Truly you are my idol,
>o mio ben, o mio caro,		O my sweet, o my dear,
>o mia vita, si, si, si, si.	O my life, yes, yes, yes.
>
>This is not a pompous love declaration: those are the murmured words of two
>lovers, exaggerated, repetitive, obsessive.  Both voices, in the Harnoncourt 
>recording, are sopranos (Nero was a castrato role).  As a result, they are
>perfectly symmetric, as the text is between the two characters, and very
>disturbingly erotic: the two voices mirror each other, dance around each
>other, grope for each other, like two hands searching each other in the dark.  
>  ...
>	Francois Velde
>


This is one of opera's sublime moments - but a warning - be sure to get the
early Harnoncourt recording - the later "soundtrack" of the JPPonelle
production isn't up to par with this one.  

I also like the performance of this duette by Arleen Auger and Della Jones
(in the R Hickox production on Virgin - how apt! - which is a beautiful, if
stark, production of this opera.)  The voices shimmer in a way that sends
shivers down your spine (has to do with the "beats" set up by two close-but-
not-quite-identical notes) - this is an effect that is almost surely not
going to be present when Nerone is sung by a male singer - even less if the
male is a tenor.  If you like your decadence "stripped down" then try out
the Hickox "Poppea".

-rags
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dritz@papasun.mcs.anl.gov (Ken Dritz)
Subject: Re: Beginning a classical collection
Organization: Argonne National Laboratory, Chicago, Illinois
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 19:24:48 GMT

Check whether a public library in your area has a musical materials section,
with CDs available for checkout.

Ken
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: ssc@nwu.edu (Steven Chung)
Subject: Schubert recommendations
Originator: schung@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston Illinois.
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 21:59:32 GMT


Any recommendations on recordings of Schubert's two piano trios and his
Fantasia D934?  I've only seen Kremer's recording of the Fantasia, and I'm
not particularly a fan of his.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: NEW New Grove?
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 04:26:09 GMT

In article <1h64b6INNo3j@cat.cis.Brown.EDU> ST801578@brownvm.brown.edu (Calvin Lee) writes:
>How much does the new New Grove cost?

About $1,500 for the 20-vol. set.

Roger
From: tegammk@prism.gatech.EDU (Mike Kazmierczak)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Shostakovich symphony recommendations
Date: 23 Dec 92 21:42:23 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology

In article <1992Dec23.154022.18623@nosc.mil> sampson@nosc.mil (Charles H. Sampson) writes:
>     Although you asked for recommendations, I'll give you a warning.
>Until you become a Shostakovich fanatic, avoid [Symphonies] #2 and #3.  
>

Dismal? Pedantic? How about inventive and new? Shostakovich was young and
under pressure to conform, but that does not make these two symphonies for
fanatics only...

-- 
Mike Kazmierczak
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta, Georgia, 30332
uucp:	  ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!tegammk
Internet: tegammk@prism.gatech.edu
From: freed@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (a la vida vidita bona)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: test
Summary: _attempted_ posting...
Date: 2 Jan 93 20:29:21 GMT

Expires: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: rec.music.classical
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX
Keywords: 

Hello...sorry to waste space but I'm attempting (fairly unsuccessfully)
to figure out how to post here.  Here goes attempt #4.

Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: marca@ncsa.uiuc.edu (Marc Andreessen)
Subject: Re: Beginning a classical collection
Organization: Nat'l Center for Supercomputing Applications
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 08:56:42 GMT

In article <BzzAMr.AKD@nic.umass.edu> yang@titan.ucc.umass.edu (HUAYONG YANG) writes:

   >4) Should one look for particular condutors/orchestras performing that
   >piece?  This really complicates CD selection!

   Yes. Karajan and Bernstein are top choices.

Suggestions from another ignoramus: rather than Karajan, there are
quite a few non-Nazi conductors of greater interest.  E.g., off the
top of my head, Giulini, Dutoit, Jarvi, Harnoncourt (esp for
Beethoven), Tennstedt, Chailly, Abbado; younger conductors, Rattle and
Andrew Litton; and in authentic instrument land, Norrington, Pinnock,
Gardiner.

Marc

--
Marc Andreessen
Software Development Group
National Center for Supercomputing Applications
marca@ncsa.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Monday, 21 Dec 1992 14:52:57 CST
From: <U58402@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Urban legends
 <1992Dec21.094237.20283@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>

A story about some old composer who I don't remmeber, but I think it
Brahms:

Brahms was at a party when an amateur musician came running up to him
and corraled him into listening to a performance of one of his string
quartets. The musician and his friends had been practicing for weeks for
this occasion, so Brahms felt it too impolite to say no. As it was, he sat
through one of the most godawful performances of one of his string
quartets he had ever heard. After it was finally over, the musician came
up to Brahms excitedly and said "So how was it?" Brahms managed a weak
smile and said, "Well, I was impressed by the choice of tempi. I think I
liked yours the best."


Wilbur Pan                                  u58402@uicvm.uic.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------
This article does not represent the opinions of the Deans of the
College of Medicine of the University of Illinois at Chicago.
They're not that clever.
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: cb@tamarack13.timbuk (Chris Brewster)
Subject: Re: Prokofiev's 5th Symphony
In-reply-to: zorro@picasso.ocis.temple.edu's message of 19 Dec 92 23:50:52 GMT
Organization: pubs
	<1992Dec19.235052.4595@cronkite.ocis.temple.edu>
Date: 23 Dec 92 12:20:04 CST


[Actually, this is about the 4th symphony.]

Concerning the MHS edition of Prokofiev symphonies (Martinon), it uses
the original version of the 4th.  I find this version way inferior to
the later version.  The 4th is one of my favorites, so the difference
isn't trivial for me.  Although I'm not much of an Ormandy fan, his
recording of the 4th is nice, if you see it around.  In any case, make
sure you know which version of the symphony you're buying, and at least
try out the later one.

Chris Brewster
cb@cray.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical,rec.music.misc
From: lazlo@triton.unm.edu (Lazlo Nibble)
Subject: Re: FYI: Lovely Music....
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 92 05:23:11 GMT
Organization: Usenet Power Elite: Crush-The-Innocent-Newbies Strike Team
Distribution: usa

gtaylor@vme.heurikon.com (Gregory Taylor) writes:

> This follows right on the heels of a re-release of Alvin Lucier's "Music
> on a Long, Thin Wire"  

Was this album spawned from the installation at Winrock Center in Albuquerque?

--
Lazlo (lazlo@triton.unm.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: "bob warren" <bob.warren@canrem.com>
Subject: cd prices
Reply-To: "bob warren" <bob.warren@canrem.com>
Organization: Canada Remote Systems
Distribution: rec
Date: 2 Jan 93 17:21:42 EST

To: alexander.inglis@canrem.com

No, not a club. They've been around for quite a while. I haven't made
use of the service ... I really like in-person shopping. As I live in

    So do I, but I live in Brampton and work in North York. I don't
get downtown that often, so other than over to Square One I'm not
able to frequent a large number of music stores. There _is_ an HMV
outlet at the Bramalea Shopping Centre, but fairly expensive.

downtown Toronto, this is an easy "everyday sort of thing to do. The
catalogue prices are actually not bad at all, especially for anyone
subjected to non-Yonge & Dundas prices! Seems to me DGGs, to take a
common example, were well under $20 ($17.99? $18.99?). Provided one buys

    As I recall, there's a music shoppe in the Eaton Centre which
 is Classical only, but only saw it once.


Tell me a litte more about your music interests. You might be better to
use private mail. You can upload to U-Classic but mark the entry private
and enter the FIRST line of your message as:

To: alexander.inglis@canrem.com

     Thanks for the tip: the only other UseNet Conference that I have
posted on is rec.games.chess, and there virtually all msg traffic is
directed to ALL.

     Music interests:

             Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Brahms

             _some_  symphonic/orchestral works
             _some_  barocque (Bach, Vivaldi, Handel, Purcell, Albinoni)
             piano/violin/cello concerti

        Happened to hear a Fialkowska recital on Arts National a few
      months ago, live in Calgary. Fantastic! Such strength!


     That is today - I don't have a feel for opera yet, but I don't
    close the door on it, I just haven't a sufficient interest yet.


PS Thanks for the mention over on L-Mozart BTW ...!

     You're welcome. Some closed minds over there (esp. Jim Lee) but
  I enjoy Paul Moor's insights and retrospectives. I noticed in a
  recent issue of Audio magazine several record reviews by Paul Moor.
  Is he syndicated, I wonder ?



  Bob Warren from Brampton, Ontario on Fri  01-01-1993  at  19:03:29
---
  SLMR 2.1a #1696      $x  $  r  $g....
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Saxophone, use of -
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 21:30:31 GMT

jwenger@ulci06.unil.ch () writes:
: 
: Dear net.folks,
: 
: Friends and I were chating about music in general, and saxophones in
: particular. No one could mention a piece of classical music, orchestral,
: chamber or other, where one or more sax were used. Can you?
: I'll post the consolidated list of your answers, as soon as I get something
: publishable.

Looking briefly in my Oxford companion I find: Bizet's L'Arlesienne
(how could I forget that?), Kodaly's Hary janos, Vaughan Williams's
Job - all alto sax.

VW's 4th symphony (should have remembered this too) and Prokofiev's
Romeo and Juliet - tenor sax.

All the above use only one sax; d'Indy scored for more than one sax in
various orchestral and choral pieces, and Stockhausen wrote for alto
tenor and baritone in Carre. (Actually - I wonder if he did or whether
Cornelius Cardew, who actually wrote the piece from Stickhausen's
sketches did?)

I was right - Debyussy's Rhapsodie (1919) ius for alto sax, there are
also concertos by Glazunov and Ibert (Concertino da camera), and the
Scherzo humoresque by Jean Francaix, written for Marcel Mule's Quatuor
de Saxophones de Paris.

I trust you and your friends all feel suitably sheepish?

--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker)
Subject: Re: Bela Siki
Organization: Camosun College, Victoria B.C, Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 01:55:33 GMT

Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley) writes:
: Does anyone know if this pianist is still alive? He used to teach at one of
: the universities in Seattle. He played the Bartok Piano Concerto #2 about 20
: years ago with the Vancouver Symphony under Lukas Foss, and I think made a
: recording (of the Dohnanyi Nursery Rhyme thing?) with the Seattle symphony
: under Milton Katims.

He was still alive when I met him at this year's Victyoria
International Festival. He played the Chopin etudes and the Mozart
K491 concerto with the (thinly disguised) Victoria SO conducted by -
Milton Katims! Two searching and profound performances which it was a
privilege to review.

Siki seemed in good health - although he had already lit up in the
dressing room within a few minutes of playing. He is far more proud of
his daughter's accomplishments (she is not a musician) than of his
own. A very modest man, with very European manners: he gravely shook
my hand, insisted on introducing me to his wife, and called me 'Mr.
Barker' throughout our conversation. He teaches at the related summer
school here most years apparently.

Come over next year if he's playing Mike....

--
Real:  Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept., Camosun College, Victoria B.C.
Email: (dbarker@spang.camosun.bc.ca)
Phone: +1 604 370 4452
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: roger@crux.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig)
Subject: Re: CD inserts.
Originator: news@nimaster
Reply-To: roger@astro.princeton.edu (Roger Lustig)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 06:11:25 GMT

In article <Bzo6A3.JnC@cda.mrs.umn.edu> naras@cda.mrs.umn.edu (B. Narasimhan) writes:
>Just a thought.

>Certain labels like Archiv, DG, to name two, include excellent
>historical material in their CD inserts on the composers. Others
>don't, although RCA and CBS seem to be improving.  

Thank you!  (I write for RCA -- any critiques gladly accepted.)

>However, I am 
>always frustrated by the fact that not much info is included about
>the performers or the orchestra.  I have the whole set of 9 Beethoven
>symphonies by Roger Norrington and it has some info on him and his
>orchestra repeated in all of the CD's.  

>Which labels include biographical info on the performers
>on a routine basis? Wouldn't it be nice if the material was
>pertinent to the performance itself? I have seen CD
>inserts regurgitating the same reviews for many different
>recordings.

Very often, the performers or their managers have control over 
what gets published there.  The label may have little choice in
this matter.

Roger

>
>-- 
>B. Narasimhan                             naras@cda.mrs.umn.edu
>Division of Science and Math.
>The University of Minnesota at Morris
>Morris, MN 56267
From: kahn@troi.cc.rochester.edu (James Kahn)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: The BEST finale!
Date: 31 Dec 92 17:12:24 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

>What is YOUR favorite ending or finale to a classical piece?

I unfortunately missed much of this thread, so at the risk of repetition
I'm throwing my hat into the ring.  In addition to Brahms Symphony #1, I'd
also add (all refer to final movement or act unless indicated otherwise):

Brahms (who really knew how to finish off a piece):
 Symph. #4 (1st mvmt.)
 Piano Concerto #1
 Concerto for Violin and Cello

Mozart (who sometimes knew how to finish off a piece):
 Fantasy and Piano Sonata in C minor (K. 475/457)
 Rondo in A minor (K. 511)
 String Quartet in D minor (K. 421?)
 The Magic Flute
 Marriage of Figaro (act 2)

Bach:
 Goldberg Variations (not the repetition of the theme, but the last 2 
   variations)^*

Beethoven (who rarely knew how to finish off a piece):
 Sonata op. 57
 Piano Concerto #4

Jim Kahn
University of Rochester

^* By the way does someone know the story of the last variation?  I recall
reading that it was a joke, based on weaving together two well-known drinking
songs.  It's still magnificent music.
From: Bill_P_Pearce@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Libretto for Rameau opera
Date: Fri,  1 Jan 93 22:26:23 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)




I wonder if anyone could recommend to me a source (i.e. a music store
somewhere that does mail order business) where I could obtain a libretto
for Rameau's opera "Hippolyte et Aricie".  I have had a recording for
several years but it contains no libretto (or even any kind of pamphlet
telling who is singing what).  Presumably there was supposed to be one,
and I haven't tried writing to the record company, which is CBS (because
I think my chances of the letter ever getting to the right person or
department and of their actually having one to send me are vanishingly
small).

    Bill Pearce
From: brad@buck.viewlogic.com (Bradford Kellogg)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
Subject: Re: Saxophone, use of -
Date: 22 Dec 92 17:45:05 GMT
Organization: Viewlogic Systems, Inc.
Originator: brad@buck


So far, I haven't seen anyone mention Prokofiev, who used a saxophone in
Romeo and Juliet (a brilliant piece, by the way), and incredibly enough,
he even used a saxophone in his concerto for saxophone and orchestra. :-)

There is a substantial body of music for saxophone(s) written by a number
of French composers. It is mostly not well known, but if you hang out at
a music school, and if you have a college roommate who is a saxophone major,
(okay, such as myself) you get to hear quite a bit of it.

- Bradford Kellogg
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: sowhat@gphs.vuw.ac.nz (Christian Zick)
Subject: Re: RFV: Bruckner Re: The BEST finale!
Organization: Institute of Geophysics, Victoria University of Wellington, NZ
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 21:33:10 GMT

In article <JWA.92Dec22230634@vipunen.hut.fi>, jwa@vipunen.hut.fi (Jyrki J Wahlstedt) writes:
> In article <1992Dec22.154744.3519@walter.bellcore.com> broken@venison.bae.bellcore.com (Tony Brokenborough) writes:
> 
> >Oh please shut up !!!!!!
>   No, why should I do what you won't do.
> 
> >99% of the people on the net HATE's Bruckner's music. Even his contempories
> >and the critics of his day hated his music. Whenever his music was critisized,
> >he changed it !!!  That's why there are numerous 'originals' to many of his
> >works. (The 'Bruckner problem' !!!!! )
>   Ok! Let's call for a vote. I give one vote for Bruckner and I am quite
>   sure that the 99 % isn't showing up. ........

here is my vote against Bruckner. OK, I don't HATE the music, but I was
fed up and finished with it. I even sold my Bruno-Walter-Bruckner-LPs for one dollar each.

I still remember VERY positively a Karajan performance of Bruckner's 7th (or
8th ?) with the Berlin Philharmonic, which I think was one of my very
first classical concert visits. But now the essence of this remembrance is
the fully controlled, introverted (closed eyes throughout) and quiet
conducting by Karajan (I saw it from behind the orchestra).

My taste, and consequently appetite, moved towards piano and chamber music
during the years, which is obviously is a place quite far away from Bruckner's.
I also had a record with organ music from Bruckner, which I sold later on. 
Although I am almost addicted to organ music, I did not find anything
beyond sweet-humming noise in his organ compositions.

I must admit that I had the feeling of having cleaned up my record collection
when it contained no more Bruckner.

Christian Zick
sowhat@gphs.vuw.ac.nz
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical
From: chrisi@lloyd.Camex.COM (Chris Ischay)
Subject: Re: Hildegard Behrens vocal collapse?
Organization: Camex Inc., Boston MA
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 18:58:13 EST

In article <1992Dec21.172249.13631@visual.com> rwh@visual.com (Rob Holzel) writes:
>A friend told me the following.  I wonder if it's true?
>
>1. Hildegard Behrens has recently suffered a vocal collapse,
>   which to the horror of the MET management will prevent her from
>   singing Brunnhilde in upcoming "Ring" performances.

I heard her sing Salome last year for the BSO, and she sounded pretty good.
Two months later I heard her sing Tosca at Covent Garden and she was in
rough shape.  The passages in which she could push out a big sound were
reliable, but Vissi d'arte was simply not within her powers.  She sounded
as if she were singing through a terrible respiratory problem.

>2. Eva Marton will not sub for Behrens, since she swore never to
>   sing at the MET again when she was passed over for Brunnhilde (in
>   favor of Behrens) the first time around.

Small loss.  I'd rather hear Levine sing it himself.

>3. As a singer of last resort, the MET have enrolled Dame Gwenyth
>   Jones to sing the role.  This much disconcerted my friend, who
>   said Jones is so past her prime that by now he'd thought she
>   was dead. 

Jones is singing Brunnhilde tonight at the Met, but that's the way it was
scheduled way back when.

Chris Ischay
chrisi@camex.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical