HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Subject: Re: the b-word
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 17:35:19 GMT

In article <28JUL92.18364204@enh.nist.gov> aberson@enh.nist.gov writes:
>In a previous article, thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) wrote:
>>(BTW, the con is lovely! Sim looks like Jesus would
>>if he were a '90's queer,
>Or so I've been told...but when my hair loses shape and falls over my face
>I'm told I look more like Cousin It.  Many said I looked least like everyone
>expected, whatever that means.

Completely different.

I'd say Sim looks a lot like Jeff Dauber when he wears a goatee.
Plus long hair, minus the tattoos and extra holes.  (Is that too
many conditionals?)

The photos should be back any day now.

>>Nelson is *TALL*,
>Very, and quite cute, too.

Seeing as he was captured almost immediately by a tenor...

>>and I'm just *wild* about Harry!!!

The line starts behind me, John...

>There's a dearth of chicks, though...)
>Three eventually showed.  Wish there were more...

Doretta and her partner were sorely missed.

>Had a fabulous time!

Ditto.

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
Xref: sparky soc.motss:32295 alt.activism:13339 talk.politics.misc:35554 alt.individualism:4479
From: fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.activism,talk.politics.misc,alt.individualism
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Date: 23 Jul 92 15:57:14 GMT
Organization: Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam

In article 127@utkux1.utk.edu, archer@utkux1.utk.edu (T. Archer) writes:
:>In article <15520@star.cs.vu.nl> fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:
:
:>I've finally found what doesn't click with Libertarianism
:>and me: a belief that people are guided by rationale,
:>maximalisation of happiness, and concious thinking about the
:>cutting edges of judgements in life, with total disregard of
:>things like peer-pressure, basic mine-is-mine
:>like-me-not-like-me instincts.  People aren't rational.
:
:So, you anti-liberty types don't believe that individual people are capable 
:of acting in an enlightened manner, and must be forced to do so by a benign 
:statist government.

Not entirely true. I believe that people are very well capable of
acting in an enlightened manner, I see enough of it for me to have hope
for the rest of the world.

I just don't see them doing it all by themselves when confronted with
an alien entity, expecially when inside a group. Not without some
external pressure - government, attitude alteration through exposure -
to overcome our basic xenophobia and dare to give up some power.

:I am sorry, but I am not willing to accept that.

Well, I must say that I'm happy that you have a more positive outlook
on people, expecting the best might get you that. But after living an
adolesence of an intelli-nerd and glam-fag - repressed as that was - at
the same time, I think I can say that I've seen enough of human group
dynamics - they were always decent to me in one-on-ones - to not
consider myself very cynical in this area.
								FJ!!
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Subject: Re: There was this sign in the window...
Keywords: @$#!% NewsWatcher bug...
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 21:28:42 GMT

In article <84006@netnews.upenn.edu> sfsmith@pennsas.upenn.edu (Sandy F. Smith, Jr.) writes:
>A minor incident at this year's Philadelphia Gay Pride Parade and Festival has
>generated an unusual response.  Given some of the recent traffic on straight/
>gay relations, I thought I'd share it with you (along with a few thoughts of
>my own on the subject) and see how y'all in netland would respond.

>On the surface, the letter-writers are dead on.  Nobody should have to submit
>to unwanted advances, regardless of the sex or orientation of the advancer or
>advancee.  If the drivers were indeed propositioned, their response was rational
>and (you'll forgive me) straightforward, and they should not be punished for
>that.
>
>But reading the ambulance crew's remarks, a little alarm goes off in my head:
>"Something's amiss here."  My experience observing Pride Parade crowds suggests
>that the sort of out-and-out propositioning they describe is the exception,
>not the rule.  Furthermore, the sort of remarks attributed to the bystanders
>brings up that old "recuritment" bugaboo fundies throw in people's faces all
>the time.  At the risk of trivializing the issue of sexual harassment yet
>again, I can't help but wondering if their explanation wasn't just a cover for
>the discomfort they felt surrounded by all those queers, and that perhaps the
>sensitivity training is called for.
>
>Your thoughts on the subject?

You're being entirely too sensitive to the red-herring of
"sexual harassment" here, but your BS detector is right-on.
I think the notion that these morons got propositioned by
anyone at the march is as likely as Frank Rizzo being
reincarnated as a drag queen.

They got nailed in a way they didn't expect, and in that
regard they deserved it.

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rhiann@shelley.u.washington.edu (Sandy  Hereld)
Subject: AIDS and grieving on TV
Reply-To: rhiann@u.washington.edu
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Distribution: seattle
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 00:36:05 GMT

n Wednesday, August 26, Channel 9 will show "In the
Midst of Winter" at 10:00pm.  It is a show about 
AIDS and dying, how people with
AIDS, their families and caregives, deal with the grieving.  
It was made by a bunch of grad students at the U of W,
and is Highly recommended.
From: jglover@ducvax.auburn.edu (Jay Glover)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: The sexiest man on TV
Date: 21 Jul 92 04:47:42 GMT
Organization: Auburn University, AL

In article <1992Jul20.082711.18020@reed.edu>, nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
> (dammit, if they can have their motss.irrelevant pun fests, we can
> have our motss.relevant star trek geek fests :-) )

( And I'm doing both!  What fun! )
 
> In article <1992Jul19.181152.1@ducvax.auburn.edu> jglover@ducvax.auburn.edu writes:
>>someone asked [the sexiest man alive] about the possibility of a
>>Picard relationship with Crusher.  Stewart was quoted as responding
>>with "What do you mean? Beverly or Will?"
> 
> That could mean a lot of things. All sorts of things - like he was
> making a homophobic joke, or he was making a snide joke about
> Paramount's reneging on their promise to put a gay character on the
> show, or indicating his support for gay relationships, or... anything.

The Sexiest Man Alive (TSMA) hardly strikes me as the type who would
make homophobic jokes.  Which brings up a point:  If he was making a
joke and assuming he's straight, does that automatically make the
joke homophobic just because a straight person make a joke with gay
overtones (undertones)?

> But I thought Patrick Stewart has been married twice and otherwise has
> a well established heterosexual pattern? Weren't their rumours about
> him and Whoppie Goldberg having a thing?

Well they do seem very close.  Ooops, that's Guinan and Picard.
This gets confusing after a while.  :-)

>>Things that make you go hmmmmmmmm.  Will *is* awfully cute.
> 
> bleah. double bleah. As long as we're exchanging "overheard at the
> con" stories, I heard that Mr. Wheaton was censured by Paramount for
> making some anti-gay comment at a convention. I did get a kick out of
> the "Horny RA" story that was posted about him, though..

Dammit.  Now where did I put those stories?  I knew I should have 
read them.  Nelson, do you still have a copy?  

 - jay g
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rcrice@cbnewsb.cb.att.com (roger.w.crice)
Subject: Re: homo-sects
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 12:48:08 GMT

J. N. Shaumeyer (jns@wam.umd.edu) answers:
>Homosexuality *is* a Religion.
and further describes how it works, but says:
>Our bodies are indeed the place where we
>practice our worship of homosexuality.  

Oh, phooey!  I was going to suggest that we 
worship at the Church of the Inner Spring...

... and elsewhere.

>Worship today at the church of your choice.

Roger.
From: stevenso@Apple.COM (David Stevenson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Basket Weaving Engineering (was Re: Engineer bashing)
Date: 28 Jul 92 19:59:42 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

henry@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch) asks:
>akbar@cs.mcgill.ca (Alain BOUCHARD) wrote: 
>->Major advancements in modern science were often by-products of novelties,
>->pranks, jokes and gadgets industry.  We all know of Galileo's work on the
>->Pocket Spy Telescope; Marconi's Secret Pocket Pen Radio; and Newton's Rear
>->View Glasses.
>
>where can i get some of these Rear View Glasses?
>
In San Francisco, you don't need glasses to get some good rear views.
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Gay martial artists (was Re: aikido!)
Date: 30 Jul 1992 11:23:54 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Jul30.131941.1755@stiatl.salestech.com> 
rwt@stiatl.salestech.com (Roger Terrell) writes:
> [I'm cross-posting this into rec.martial-arts from soc.motss on the chance
> that there might be some readers there who have an interest, and because
> of the recent "bigotry in the dojo" thread there.]

How *sweet* of you!  

--Arne, irritated beyond belief at these goddamned cross-posts,




Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: hutch@hutch (Stephen Hutchison)
Subject: Re: There was this sign in the window...
Keywords: @$#!% NewsWatcher bug...
Organization: Intel Corp., Hillsboro, Oregon
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 18:01:55 GMT

In article <157@bbx.basis.com> scott@bbx.basis.com (Scott Amspoker) writes:
>This reminds me of the little "no lot lizards" sign some truckers have
>in their windows.  I find it interesting that someone would advertise
>that they *don't* want sex as their first communication with strangers.

This is because you aren't a trucker, right?  The reason for those little
signs is that long-haul truckers have sleeper cabs.  They park and sleep.
Their schedules usually involve driving 10-14 hours a day, then doing a
few hours of heavy loading and/or off-loading.  Sleep becomes something
to be treasured.  So how would YOU deal with being asleep in a cab in
the middle of the night and having some person who has been out practicing
really unsafe sex come and knock on your window until you wake up.
Over and over and over again.

The signs are a courtesy to the people who ply that trade.

Hutch (my brothers are both truck drivers)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,soc.bi
From: lynch@ils.nwu.edu (Richard Lynch)
Subject: Re: And now for something completely different ...
Organization: The Institute for the Learning Sciences
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 17:55:58 GMT

In article <1992Jul20.025318.11698@macc.wisc.edu> anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
>
>In article <1992Jul19.181309.13961@husc3.harvard.edu>
>twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu writes:
>
>>I'll be co-hosting a homophobia workshop at Amherst on Monday night
>>for a group of high school students attending a summer camp.  Does
>>anyone have any general suggestions for this sort of thing?  I can
>>handle conducting homophobia workshops for college students, but many
>>of these kids are fifteen or sixteen, and the territory is a little
>>less familiar.  They're unlikely to be motivated enough to participate
>>in the kind of role-playing games we usually do, for example.
>
>Really?  I dunno about trying to second-guess them that way.
>Why not explain that you've had experience in such a
>workshop with college-age people, but this is your first
>with younger people (don't call 'em kids, they hate that
>word) and you're hoping they will help out by making
>suggestions.  Explain how the role playing works and what the
>goals of it are and see what they say.  It does seem to be
>that kids middle-school age are sometimes very passive and
>unresponsive, so I hope you don't run into too much of that.
>Sometimes it's partly a matter of breaking the ice and
>getting them into it a little bit.  Good luck in any case.
>

Seconded.  Tell 'em your used to doing it with college students and you
thought about changing it and figured you were better off not until you had
experience with them.  Be prepared for a possible big surprise exactly the
opposite of what you expect.


-- 
"TANSTAAFL"     lynch@aristotle.ils.nwu.edu
From: booter@Autodesk.COM (Elaine Richards)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Hanky Code
Date: 30 Jul 92 21:01:25 GMT
Organization: Autodesk, Inc., Sausalito, CA

In article <1992Jul29.221735.27289@midway.uchicago.edu> elle@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <1308@dosbears> drp@dosbears.uucp writes:
>>Robin's Egg Blue	69-er				69-ee
>It's quite a trick, working out the difference between the two.
>(Is this like "let's do 70:  you do me and I'll owe you one"?)



That's going to be my new .sig file.

Brilliant!

ER
--
In article <1992Jul29.221735.27289@midway.uchicago.edu> elle@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>In article <1308@dosbears> drp@dosbears.uucp writes:
>>Robin's Egg Blue      69-er                           69-ee
>It's quite a trick, working out the difference between the two.
From: booter@Autodesk.COM (Elaine Richards)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: G/L Youth Suicide
Date: 28 Jul 92 01:36:37 GMT
Organization: Autodesk, Inc., Sausalito, CA

In article <1992Jul24.184238.13513@tandon.com> tdbear@tandon.com (Tom Barrett) writes:
:>Having straight women counsel lesbian girls and straight men counsel
:>gay boys in an objective, compassionate and non-judgemental matter
:>might make such accusations moot. 
:
:WRONG!  In my humble opinion, straights and gays do not mix in
:any counseling... I have yet to meet anyone who identifys
:themselves as straight who does not have some problems with
:homosexuality.  Some of the straight counselors that I've meet
:definitely give off negative/uneasy non-verbals whenever the
:subject comes up.  This is NOT a good thing for those who are
:not aware of the non-verbals.


What I suggested in the first paragraph there was a half-way solution.
See, there is this factor in the equation called "parents". Many
parents want their kids to be like themselves. Some wrong-headed folk
view themselves as a form of biological photocopy machine who believe
that their lives will be enriched by little duplicates of themselves.
It feeds the ego in a warm and fuzzy way. In order to continue the
process, the little darlings must photocopy themselves also. Many
parents think that G&Ls are "recruiting" their kids, which would thwart
this process. Worse yet, they often thing that such adults are, gasp!,
"cruising" their kids. Some parents think so well of themselves that
they believe that everyone wants to have sex with them and since their
kids are such perfect little copies, everyone wants to have sex with
their kids also.

So, given the attitudes I describe above (trust me, I have met parents
like the above description and their numbers are legion), I really
doubt that the ideal solution posed by Tom can happen in this century
outside of blessed places like SF or outside the U.S.


:It has been expressed before, and it is also my opinion, that
:open lesbian counselors should be used to cousel gay male
:youth and open gay male counselors used for lesbian youth...

This is wonderful and *should* allay phobe fears, but alas....

:When it comes to counseling gay/lesbian youth, it is VERY
:important to have a safe environment.  It is imparative for


For any youth. :-)

:the counselers involved to weed out any of their peers who
:have unresolved sexual problems/needs from their own youth to
:avoid any unprofessional situations.  You can't look the other
:way and accept just anyone.  Group counseling, while not
:personal, has its advantages of safety as well as allowing
:youth to interact and nurture each other through talk and
:discussion.


ER
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't know when it was that I scratched Fate's car door, but I should have
left a note. --Tim Mefford

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: larry@bradley.bradley.edu (Larry D. Stratton)
Subject: Levi/Bank of AM.
Organization: Bradley University
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 13:51:41 GMT


   OK, I've got the phone numbers.   Why am I calling?

   A rather confused    ld

Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.individualism,alt.activism
From: rogerl@Ingres.COM (Roger Leuthner)
Subject: Re: On Banning Private Discrimination
Reply-To: rogerl@Ingres.COM (Roger Leuthner)
Organization: Ask Computer Systems Inc., Ingres Division, Alameda CA 94501
Date: 28 Jul 92 15:57:56 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.205314.5787@auto-trol.com> katbea@auto-trol.com (Kathy Beatty) writes:
>rogerl@Ingres.COM (Roger Leuthner) writes:
>: 
>: It is the attempts to pile a thousand years of inequality upon the shoulders
>: of those white hetero males who are alive today that is a pile of dung.
>
>No, it is the denial by white hetero males who are alive today that they can
>do anything about a thousand years of inequality, that is the pile of dung.
>As long as you don't see this, you are yet another (white? hetero?) male 
>sitting on top of the pile of dung, as the rest of us are getting buried 
>under it.
>
>
>Kathy


Sorry, I've got better things to do, such as living a life as an individual
unfettered by historic insignificance.  If you must dedicate your life to
attempting to allay some guilt that's your business, not mine.

If you're under a pile of dung, you're going to have to dig your own way out;
just like I have.  Either that or whine and hope somebody does your growth
for you.
From: Minotaur@cup.portal.com (Frank - Swilling)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Wells Fargo/Bank Of America dissapointment
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 18:20:44 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world

>Bank of America had a real live operator answer the 800 number, but
>they wouldn't take my call, either.  I was told expressly that they
>would only receive comments by mail.  The address is:
>        Bank of America
>        Box 16290
>        Phoenix, AZ  85011-9974
>
>Jim Berninger

I called yesterday, too, and was urged (by a fellow I was sure was gay)
to send my comments in writing to the BofA corporate offices here in San
Francisco at the following address:

Bank of America
Corporate Communications
Number 3124
P.O. Box 37000
San Francisco, CA 94137

I did write to them, as well as to Levi Strauss and Wells Fargo, using
essentially the same laudatory body copy for their stand against the BSA's
current policies.  It took less than an hour from composition of the letters
to licking the stamps on the envelopes, and sending those letters might
actually do some good.

Frank Swilling
Minotaur@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: rjwill6@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams)
Subject: Re: Gay martial artists (was Re: aikido!)
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Francisco
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 16:19:47 GMT

> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>> nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>>> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

>>>I still think gay liberation is about knowing who Margaret Rutherford was.
>>I must not be liberated yet - who's Margaret Rutherford?
>Hint... Remember your ancient history?  The Marx Brothers?

Tsk, Steve, *Steve* -- how could anyone mistake silly old
Margaret Dumont for the sublime Margaret Rutherford?!

Remember your ancient history?  Miss Marple?
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
rod williams -=- pacific bell -=- san francisco -=- rjwill6@pacbell.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: henry@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Argggg (Job market)
Date: 28 Jul 92 18:35:16 GMT
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems; a div of Booz, Allen & Hamilton

lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard) wrote: 
->Let me get this right, a head hunter is going to get 30% or more of
->my earnings and yet I don't have the right to question there refusal
->to accept responses via e-mail?

absolutely.  you do, however, have the right to vote with your feet
and take your resume elsewhere.

i prefer to share my credentials with employers via e-mail whenever
possible, and i understand why you'd want to do this ... the fact is,
however, that some people think that hiring managers are interested in
uudecoding and assembling their resume, printing PostScript which was
conveniently shipped without required headers or macros, etc.

->Money is important but personal integrity is more important, if you
->allow money to influence you to the point where your opinion is always
->up for sale then you have lost more than a job.

indeed, but this isn't relevant.  what is relevant is what it takes to
get hired; berating someone in public because you don't like their
requirements isn't going to (a) win you any points (b) get you hired
(c) cause you to make friends and influence people positively (d) all
of the above.  

-> ... If money was the sole
->driving force in my life the triangle in my .sig file would be the
->first thing to go, I've already lost a job to homophobia.

yeah, so what?  lotsa people lose jobs to homophobia.  this has
nothing to do with your rant: employers have the right to specify
(within reason) how you should present your credentials.  

--
# henry mensch / booz, allen & hamilton, inc.  / <henry@ads.com>
Xref: sparky soc.motss:32182 soc.women:13949 soc.bi:9383 alt.politics.homosexuality:5111
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Wednesday, 22 Jul 1992 17:30:16 EDT
From: Ailsa N.T. Murphy <IO81409@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: soc.motss,men,soc.women,soc.bi,alt.politics.homosexuality
Subject: Re: TV mail list
 <1992Jul22.135519.2672@dartvax.dartmouth.edu> <l6r52hINNngs@male.EBay.Sun.COM>
 <1992Jul22.171345.14579@news.iastate.edu>

yeah, right.  anyone actually trust this?

                                    -ailsa

--
It's not what you got, it's what you give           _______________
It ain't the life you want, it's the life you live. \    DYKE    /
It's not what you got, it's what you give             \ PRIDE! /
And it ain't what it's not, but what it is.             \    /
(IO81409@maine.maine.edu or wang.com!ailanth!ailsa)       \/
Xref: sparky soc.motss:33315 alt.sex.motss:1071
From: fink2@alcor.concordia.ca (Gemini)
Newsgroups: soc.motss,alt.sex.motss
Subject: Re: Hi. I'm Dave.
Date: 31 Jul 92 14:47:20 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss

dthompso@nyx.cs.du.edu (David Thompson) writes:



>Hello, my name is David Thompson, and I think I speak for homosexuals
>worldwide when I say, golly-gee-gosh!  Sometimes I get so mad I could
>just stomp my foot!  People today are so homophobic it's terrible.  Just
>as the color of someone's skin doesn't matter, neither should who a person
>chooses to boink or be boinked by. Man, woman, both, or neither.
>Gay Rights Forever!  Wake up America!
> 
Here here!
But you have to realize that any faction that is looked down upon for any
reason (religious, economic, etc) is a perfect scapegoat for anyone who
feels cheated in life for whatever reason.  So whenever I read (or receive)
any homophic mail, I realize that this wasn't meant for me personally;  it's
only an attack on the supposed group I belong to, and not feeling particularly
tied to any one group, it doesn't bother me at all.  But the most important 
thing to realize is it's their complaint and therefore their problem.