HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 10:57:56 -0500
From:         Miriam Clifford <DMIMI@ECSVAX.BITNET>
Subject:      Re:60 Minutes

I probably should stay out of this, but ---

I resent the implication of a couple of our deaf-l people, that anyone who
disagrees with their opinion about something, whatever it might be, does so
because he/she does not have the best interests of the person they are working
with at heart and are making recommendations in favor of their own job
security and money.  Of course, there are some like that, but the majority
of professionals make recommendations in terms of the person they are working
with and with as objective a decision as possible.  Please, folks, let's try
to be a little more objective and fair.

dmimi@ecsvax.uncecs.edu  dmimi@ecsvax.bitnet
Miriam (Mimi) Clifford; 2535 Sevier St, Durham, NC 27705; 919-489-4821
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Thu, 5 Nov 1992 14:32:00 +1300
From:         IS30124@OTAGO.AC.NZ
Subject:      Re: Missing or incomplete e-mail addresses

Bruce Carey writes:-
BC>I am curious as to why so many hearing people who want to associate
BC>with deaf people seem to feel a need to apologize for hearing, or
BC>seem to expect rejection because of their ability to hear.

BC>Donya, why do you feel that some people here will reject your
BC>participation on Deaf-list? Have you had experiences in which
BC>deaf people you have met have rejected you because you were able
BC>to hear? Please do not feel I am grilling you, I am genuinely
BC>curious.

Donya, there's no need to feel like you will be rejected by deaf people. You
are very welcome to use DEAF-L. The more people there are on it, the merrier it
is! I am deaf myself. I can see that you are quite anxious to avoid offending
deaf people.

Anyway, have a good day in the USA. It is a very good day here in New Zealand.
Cheers,
Barry.
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Subject: (no subject given)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 15:46:59 EDT
From:         Donya Head <6751H350@KENTVM.BITNET>

Hello everyone,
I have been a silent reader for about a month now; mainly because I have not
had time.(I know it's a poor excuse.) Anyway, let me introduce my self my
name is Donya Head, and I am a student at Kent State University.  I am studying
Speech Pathology.  I subscribed to this list for a class I'm taking, but I also
am interested in what the deaf community is interested in.  Some of my closest
friends are deaf, and they are the reason I chose Speech Pathology as my major.
I am a hearing person, but please don't hold that against me!!!!!

                                     donya(6751h350@kentvm)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 19:22:33 -0500
From:         Cynthia Clark <cclark@CNRI.RESTON.VA.US>
Subject:      Re: Telnet address at Gallaudet

Hi Scott again,

Yes, I am interested to get on the "Notes" which is an e-mail
discussion in Gallaudet.   How can I get on the "Notes" ?

Cynthia


------- Forwarded Message  --------------------------------------------

	Cynthia>	How can I get an account to get an access to
	Cynthia>	the Gallaudet network ?


Scott>	You can't. There are specific guidelines for obtaining a Vax account
Scott>	here at Gallaudet. In a nutshell, you must be a student, faculty, staff
Scott>	or be doing research in and for the university to get on line here. Is
Scott>	there something specific you're looking for? Maybe I can help you out if
Scott>	you're interested..... Drop me a line and let me know.


------- End of Forwarded Message  --------------------------------------
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:31:37 -0600
From:         FATRW@USU.BITNET
Subject:      position announcement

As promised, here is a position announcement for SKI*HI Institute, a part
of Utah State University.
Position:  Project Coordinator for two outreach projects funded by the
           National Diffusion Network.

Duties:  Coordinate INSITE basic training for four sites and SKI*HI
         basic training for four sites.  Coordinate product development
         including videos, editing of a monograph.  Work to develop new
         training sites.  Assist Outreach Coordinator on regional
         conferences, work with disseminator on materials, and write
         continuation proposals.

Qualifications:  Ability to establish professional inter-personal
         relationships with other members of the SKI*HI Institute and
         the University Community.

         Demonstrated ability to communicate effectively both verbally
         and in writing

         Masters Degree or all but project or thesei



is completion in
         visually impaired or deaf education, communication disorders,
         or related field.

Other Qualifications prefered:  Working with sensory impai



 impaired children
         and their families

         Deaf and Hard of Hearing persons are encouraged to apply.

Salary:  $24,000+

Send resumes to SKI*HI Institute
                UMC 1900
                Utah State University
                Logan, Utah  84322

                ATTN: Beth Walden

I apologize for my typing (I'm not qualified).  A personnal note:
This is the best place I have ever worked.  The sense of community
among the staff is phenominal!
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X-Envelope-to: deaf-l@siucvmb.bitnet
Full-Name: Tilak Ratnanather
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:12:08 EST
From:         "(Tilak Ratnanather)" <tratnana@EUREKA-GOLD.WBME.JHU.EDU>
Subject:      60 minutes transcripts

For those of you who would like to obtain the transcripts of
the 60 Minutes program on cochlear implants, the address is:

        60 Minutes
        PO Box 7
        Livingston
        NJ 07039

        $5 charge; send self stamped envelope;

        MENTION THE DATE OF THE PROGRAM...which is Nov 8,1992.

Tilak
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:35:25 -0500
From:         Cynthia Clark <cclark@CNRI.RESTON.VA.US>
Subject:      Re: 60 Minutes, Angels and Outcasts, etc
              10 Nov 92 09:53:22 EST." <9211101033.aa08524@CNRI.Reston.VA.US>

Everyone has the right to express his own opinion regarding
the cochlear implants.  Parents have their RIGHT to
make decisions whatever is best for their child.

What are the cons and pros for Cochlear Implants?
What are the cons and pros for being deaf at birth ?

Let's be fair - Cochlear Implants are NOT
for everyone !!   It depends on the parents,
child and circumstances.  For example,  it might
work for these hearing child who lost their hearing.
However, it might NOT work for a born-deaf child.
Here is an analogy:  forcing a left-handed child to
learn how to write using her right hand.  That's
exactly how I felt when I was being forced to
use hearing aid and being forced to listen these sounds
since I was three years old - I hated every minute
of it.  I eventually learned how to throw
my hearing aid away into the toliet when
I was about fourteen years old.  :*)  Thank God, I was
NOT being forced to learn how to speak - perhaps
that's why I could speak fluently !!

In my own personal opinion, I am VERY disappointed with
the 60 Minutes program because it appears that it does
NOT make National Association of the Deaf (NAD) look good.
It does make the cohlear implants look good and even better
than the deaf culture.  I'm sure there is always a room
for improvement for NAD to grow somehow - I mean it as
a constructive critcism.

Comments are welcome.

Cynthia Clark
A born-deaf Reader
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From: riolo@COR4.PICA.ARMY.MIL (Joseph P. Riolo)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Subject: Re: Re:60 Minutes
Date: 10 Nov 92 22:47:34 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

Chris,

>About the decision of the cochlear implantation, don't you think it's
>by far the best solution to leave *that* decision with the parents?  It is
>your and my responsibility to inform these parents of all the pros and
>cons of everything, and I'm sure that these parents reached their decision
>with difficult soulsearching and discussions with a lot of other people.
>I would be opposed to anyone's interfering with their decision and preventing
>them from deciding.

      I agree with you on this.  However, it is not that all clear cut.
Parents may be misinformed.  Parents may be under undue pressures.  Parents
may be coerced.  Parents may not do hard thinking.  Parents may not listen
to deaf child.  So on...  Also, at what age of child her interests have to
be considered in place of her parents' intersets?  But, again, I agree with
you that ultimately, it is best to leave decision to parents.  Thanks
for writing.

                                        Joseph P. Riolo
                                        <riolo@pica.army.mil>
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Sun, 8 Nov 1992 23:00:25 EDT
From:         EGALE@KENTVM.BITNET
Subject:      RE: ASL in Middle East?
              29 Oct 1992 22:22:24 -0600 from
              </PN=BRENDA.L.MONENE/O=DEAFTEK/ADMD=TELEMAIL/C=US/@SPRINT.COM>

Brenda-

You once told me that if I gave you my snail mail address, you would send me
a Deaftek package.  Could you E-mail me at EGALE@KENTVM.KENT.EDU, then I
will reply.  Your email id is soooo long and it would be easier to reply to
you personally after you send me any kind of message.

Thanks...

Lazy Gale
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 17:55:44 -0500
From:         Cynthia Clark <cclark@CNRI.RESTON.VA.US>
Subject:      Re: Deafness CURE!
              02 Nov 92 03:56:16 GMT." <9211022324.aa13552@CNRI.Reston.VA.US>

	>Wouldn't it be great if we could hit our ears, the same way
	>you hit your car's steering wheel when it doesn't start, then
	>starts after you hit it, then our hearing comes back?
	>			
	>		-A happy thought

This is an interesting thought, but of course everyone has
their own thoughts/dreams.  I NEVER dream of becoming "a hearing
person", perhaps it's because I am so happy for NOT being
able to hear anything.  Esther's interesting story makes
me so glad for being able to sleep upstairs without any
kind of sounds.   If anything happens, then that's life.

Sleep peacefully,

Cynthia  :*)

A born-deaf reader


=====================================
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 23:33:13 -0500
From:         "(Seth Gordon)" <sethg@SILVER.LCS.MIT.EDU>
Subject: I can read your mind. You think I'm full of bull.
              3 Nov 1992 22:28:11 +0200 <9211032103.AA12237@silver.lcs.mit.edu>

    Note about physical realization of telepathy: for monkeys, the human
    ability to speak and hear would look like telepathy.

A former student of mine believed that one of his counselors was
virtually telepathic.  The counselor could read his body language
and tell when he was lying.
--
seth gordon ... <sethg@silver.lcs.mit.edu>   ... .sig under construction;
mit bs '91  ... learning ctr 4 deaf children ... pardon the inconvenience
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 16:10:02 GMT
From:         Bosco Keown <keown@VNET.IBM.COM>
Subject:      60 Minutes, Angels and Outcasts, etc

Ref:  Esther's posting of Tue, 10 Nov 1992 09:53:22 EST

>                                                                They did
> NOT say that meningitis patients have a low success rate with CI.

What's the issue here? Are meningitis patients 'supposed' to be
unsuccessful with cochlear implants? I don't believe that that
is true in the general sense, so they had no reason to explicitly
say that meningitis patients have a low success rate.

People have to be realistic - selecting patients for cochlear
implants is NOT an exact science, and inevitably there will be
mistakes because the process (as yet) does not always weed out the
unsuitables. But there are FAR MORE implant success stories than
there are failures, so bear that in mind when you feel the urge
to dismiss cochlear implantation as being wrong. Why do some people
always seem to focus on the failures rather than the successes?
If we must focus on the failures, let's do it in a more positive
way: find out WHY the failure was caused, and then make sure it
doesn't happen again. But don't call for an end to cochlear implantation
just because of  a relatively small proportion of failures.

The real issue which raises the most feeling/discussion is the implantation
of *children* who are unable to make decisions of their own. In these
cases, I say (endorsing Chris's words once again) give the parents
the facts and let them make the decision. Then accept it and shut up.
I say "shut up" at this point because we should support the decision
made by the parents and not make them feel guilty about it.

Bosco.

Bosco Keown,
CICS/6000 Development,         | VNET     : KEOWN at WINVMC
IBM UK Laboratories, Ltd.,     | IBMIPNET : keown@harpo.hursley.ibm.com
Hursley Park,                  | Internet : keown@vnet.ibm.com
Winchester, England.           | BITNET   : KEOWN at VNET
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 15:38:55 EST
From:         "Joseph P. Riolo" <riolo@COR4.PICA.ARMY.MIL>
Subject: Re: deaf in the mainstream

Lew,

     You say in an interesting post about deaf people being blended
in hearing society:

>     For 40 years, I didn't know another deaf person.

     I assume you are talking about alive deaf person that you never
meet in the flesh.  My question is: How come?  I find that long span
of time hard to believe.  But, it is not impossible.

     On second thought, you may not mean that way.  You might have
seen deaf people out there in mall but you did not walk to them to
introduce yourself so to know them more.

     In either way, I will appreciate a little more elaboration of your
terse statement so to form appropriate context of your post.

                                        Joseph P. Riolo
                                        <riolo@pica.army.mil>
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:58:00 CDT
From:         CONLEY%MSUVX2@MEMSTVX1.BITNET
Subject:      Re: 60 Minutes, Angels and Outcasts, etc

        Hi gang,


>From:         Cynthia Clark <cclark@CNRI.RESTON.VA.US>
>Subject:      Re: 60 Minutes, Angels and Outcasts, etc

>What are the cons and pros for Cochlear Implants?
>What are the cons and pros for being deaf at birth ?

        GOOD point!  Two Totally different situations.

>Let's be fair - Cochlear Implants are NOT
>for everyone !!   It depends on the parents,
>child and circumstances.  For example,  it might
>work for these hearing child who lost their hearing.
>However, it might NOT work for a born-deaf child.
>Here is an analogy:  forcing a left-handed child to
>learn how to write using her right hand.  That's
>exactly how I felt when I was being forced to
>use hearing aid and being forced to listen these sounds
>since I was three years old - I hated every minute
>of it.  I eventually learned how to throw
>my hearing aid away into the toliet when
>I was about fourteen years old.  :*)

         A HEARING TOILET!  HA-HA-HA-HA!!!  (Rolling on floor laughing!!!)
         (Sorry, I couldn't help myself,......I do understand your point.)

>In my own personal opinion, I am VERY disappointed with
>the 60 Minutes program because it appears that it does
>NOT make National Association of the Deaf (NAD) look good.
>It does make the cohlear implants look good and even better
>than the deaf culture.  I'm sure there is always a room
>for improvement for NAD to grow somehow - I mean it as
>a constructive critcism.

        Sorry to say, you're right.  '60 Minutes' should have done
        more research pertaining to the two different issues here:
                Deaf at birth  -  post-lingually deaf
        which, IMHO, did make NAD look rather low.

>Comments are welcome.

>Cynthia Clark
>A born-deaf Reader

        Thanks Cynthia....good post!

                                        Steven Conlee
                                        CONLEY@MEMSTVX1.MEMST.EDU
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:20:19 GMT
From:         Bosco Keown <keown@VNET.IBM.COM>
Subject:      cochlear implants

Ref:  Henry's posting of Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:59:01 -0500

>         (and I was also disturbed by Harlan Lane, too when he said that
>the doctors were trying to make money from the deaf).

Did he, really? I wonder if Lane stopped to think how much money he
himself made from his books about the Deaf?

Bosco.

Bosco Keown,
CICS/6000 Development,         | VNET     : KEOWN at WINVMC
IBM UK Laboratories, Ltd.,     | IBMIPNET : keown@harpo.hursley.ibm.com
Hursley Park,                  | Internet : keown@vnet.ibm.com
Winchester, England.           | BITNET   : KEOWN at VNET
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Thu, 5 Nov 1992 09:29:39 EST
From:         "(Mark Hunt)" <markhunt@ZEN.CAC.STRATUS.COM>
Subject:      Desired deafness in offspring

Hello all,

I have also been a lurker on this list for a short time.  Mostly due to my
current work load and a little due to not having anything I considered
important enough to say.

Last night, at my ASL class, my teacher told us of the birth of her first
child.  Shortly after the child was born, the nurse entered my teachers room
very apprehensively and began to tell her that her baby was deaf.  My teacher
was very happy to hear this and her joy confused the nurse whom expected her to
be sad.  My teacher went on to explain that the same situation occurred with
the birth of her second child.  The story caused a little confusion among the
class students.  This brings us to my question and perhaps the cause of the
class confusion.  I would understand happiness in giving birth to a healthy
child, be it hearing or deaf.  I am confussed as why you would wish for a
child to be deaf though.  I do not wish to offend or imply that deafness is
bad, but I am confussed as to why someone would wish for it in thier child.
I am happy for her children to be able to grow up in an environment where
they can observe communication at a very young age.  Where they can develop the
ability to communicate and ask the millions of questions that help them learn
about the world they see around them.  I am however, still confused as to the
desire.

Thanks,

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
markhunt@zen.cac.stratus.com   | <-- Prefered E-Mail address
Mark_Hunt@vos.stratus.com      | <-- This works but takes forever for mail to
                               |     get to me.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 23:26:37 -0500
From:         CSRI Distribution Manager <distrib@TURING.TORONTO.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Missing or incomplete e-mail addresses

As yet another hearing non-poster (lurker, muffin :) )  I was very
interested to see the gentle responses to Donya's concern about
being rejected.  One of the reasons I've hesitated to post is that
I'm very aware that I am a vistor in a deaf space and should consider it
a priviledge and behave accordingly.  Too often, I think hearing folks
talk too much, listen too rarely and understand too little about
deaf reality and deaf culture. I'm very interested (for both personal
and professional reasons) and I have a lot to learn, so I'm really
glad to be here.  But I do understand exactly how Donya feels.

Chris Stephenson
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.deaf-l
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:39:11 -0500
From:         Cynthia Clark <cclark@CNRI.RESTON.VA.US>
Subject: Re: My Bio & other stuff (from Richard Snelling)
              05 Nov 92 17:14:00 CST." <9211052057.aa25363@CNRI.Reston.VA.US>

Richard's question> What does  :*) and  :)  and *-) , etc. mean?????



 			:-)

      This odd symbol is one of the ways a person can portray "mood" in
      the very flat medium of computers--by using "smiles".  This is
      `metacommunication', and there are literally hundreds of them,
      from the obvious to the obscure.  This particular example
      expresses "happiness".  Don't see it?  Tilt your head to the left
      90 degrees.  Smiles are also used to denote sarcasm.
                                      - Brendan P. Kehoe


Have a good day,

Cynthia   ;*)

P.S.  does this look like a wink, isn't it ?
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Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:51:19 -0500
Comments:     Warning -- RSCS tag indicates an origin of 11CWATT@GALLUA1
From:         "Keith Watt - Gallaudet Dept. of Education"
              <11CWATT@GALLUA.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: deaf wish

Omer -

>If you and your spouse are Deaf, what would you rather adopt?  A normally
>hearing child or a deaf child?
>
>I had, on the other day, a chat with a friend who is in this situation.
>He told me that he and his wife considered adopting a deaf baby.  However
>nowadays most of the deaf babies have also other defects and the couple
>didn't cherish the idea of adopting a mentally retarded child.
>
>Anyone with stories about adopting deaf babies?


Interesting question, I'd like to see any responses as well, since I'm
hoping to adopt a deaf child (a baby if possible) within the next 5 years
or so.

Keith

===============================================================================
Keith Watt                              |
Gallaudet University                    | "Exit, pursued by a bear."
Department of Education                 |     Stage direction in Shakespeare's
                                        |     _The Winter's Tale_ (1611)
BITNET:                                 |
11CWATT@GALLUA.BITNET                   |
===============================================================================