HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: awozniak@zeus.calpoly.edu (Adam "Hey Sister, can you spare a hug?" Wozniak)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,news.admin.policy,alt.fan.furry
Subject: Religion (Was Re: Quicksilver virus on furry Muck -- solved!)
Date: 9 Jan 93 02:56:22 GMT
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo

I'm so tempted to go newgroup alt.religion.mud it's not even funny...

michael.armstrong@homebase.com (Michael Armstrong)  writes:
[ to the person responsible for the FurryVirus ]
>I implore you in the name of Christ to make amends for your deeds.
>
>       "Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes
>        an enemy of God." -- James 4:4b NIV
>
>I feel J. Furr is in someway responsible.  What other motive does J.Furr
>have except to incite anger by adding gasoline to a burning house.  You
>felt that FurryMUCK was sinful.  So is the whole planet,  Fumigating the
>problem is not the answer.  I've run into worse than FurryMUCK in my
>modeming days. I just don't participate in it.  I voice my indignation
>at sin, (even my own) but I don't try to get rid of it.  That's God's
>job, not mine.  Jesus cleanses sin and guilt to get rid of it.  We can't
>wish sin away because then sacrifice on the cross is meaningless.
>What's the point?  If humanity can get rid of it's sin (conscience
>choice to do wrong), there is no need for someone else, let alone God
>to bother trying.  IF sin was never meant to be an option to us, why the
>tree?  Why the choice?  Humanity is a creature (creation) of choice.
>
>I would recommend John Fischer's _Real Christians [don't] Dance_ and
>_True Believers [Don't] Ask Why_ for some real answers. (Bethany House
>Publishers.)  We're in the world, not of it but alot of times, we
>(christians) are of the world in our own little way.
>

Michael, you should read your bible more often.  In fact, look about half a
page down from the passage you just quoted.

	"Who are you to judge another?"
		James 4:12b

-- 
Accept these axiomatically, and the universe will fall into perfect order:
               A & !A == TRUE            A | !A == FALSE
Should we really be playing words with games?
awozniak@morpheus.calpoly.edu
Xref: sparky rec.games.mud.admin:1117 rec.games.mud.tiny:1337
From: rparker@eagle.csc.calpoly.edu (Earendil)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,rec.games.mud.tiny
Subject: Re: What rights do people want?
Date: 13 Jan 93 02:46:01 GMT
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo


   I would like to follow up on one of Steves rights listed.  The right 
to have a player restored after a crash is a hard one sometimes to comply 
to.  Sometimes a system might not have a log of such items that the wizard
can look to to see the validity of the item.  A case in this was a player
on a mud that would continually lose an item in a fight who would then disco..
Later he would log back on and complain that he had to disconnect due to a
problem with the system and wants his stuff back... There was at that time
no log of what goes on, and the wizards were in an ethical issue of who was
right or wrong.
  I think that given the system and the wizrads available, you have the right
to be heard in cases of loss of items, and given the situation it should be
weighed fairly as to whether the item should be restored.  There should also
be an avenue if the player feels this is not handled fairly.  
  To cap this off, I have liked the way some muds have done final arbitration.
In one case, the wizards of the mud sat in the background and let the global
community decide what the fate of the situation would be.  They were available
for council, but made no decisions for how the problem would be solved.  This
might be a good scheme to consider when pressed with the "The ARCH always
has the final say" problems.



-- 
rparker@blackbird.calpoly.edu                 ||    
Earendil @ Flesh & Blood                      ||   
Earendil @ TMI
Xref: sparky rec.games.mud.admin:1046 news.admin.policy:1076
From: jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,news.admin.policy
Subject: Re: Quicksilver virus on furry Muck -- solved!
Date: 7 Jan 1993 03:53:59 GMT
Followup-To: rec.games.mud.admin
Organization: UT Health Science Center Houston


Would someone besides Joel Furr please explain to me just what this subject
has to do with administering Usenet news systems? If the answer is "nothing",
would yall please get it out of news.admin.policy?
-- 
Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC, PP-ASEL | Never ascribe to malice that which can
jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu      | adequately be explained by stupidity.
      "Science is all in the public domain, and allows few secrets."
              -- Tom Clancy, _The Sum of All Fears_
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
From: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
Subject: Re: Transcript of the "God Conference on Players' Rights"
Organization: Johns Hopkins University CS Dept.
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 22:33:48 GMT

In article <C0pKCx.BH0@math.okstate.edu> russ@math.okstate.edu (R. Nomad) writes:
>i have no joke here, i just like saying "You still see Random posting merely
>so as to get 1 line sarcastic comments in."

Both statements true.
--
"The writer wrestling with an uneasy soul.  Turbulent in its uncovering,
cathartic in its expression.  Huang is a sensitive this age of the world has
not seen."
	-- auzzie about dirque

Ken Arromdee (arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu, arromdee@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu)
From: GREESE@MAINE.MAINE.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
Subject: Re: Transcript of the "God Conference on Players' Rights"
Date: 13 Jan 93 00:16:01 GMT
 <1ish71INNr0k@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> <1993Jan11.194804.7818@leland.Stanford.EDU>
 <1993Jan11.234052.17342@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Organization: University of Maine System

Guess you might be a Tipper Gore fan?
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
From: jwtlai@jeeves.uwaterloo.ca (Jim W "GrimJim" Lai)
Subject: Re: A proposed "brief statement of players' rights"
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:20:27 GMT

In article <C0oJpJ.DE0@polaris.async.vt.edu> jfurr@polaris.async.vt.edu (J. Furr) writes:
>
>I'll post excerpts of various people's points of view from the "Conference
>on Players' Rights" tomorrow, since the whole transcript as it stands is
>going to be hard to discuss.  Until then, here's MY proposed statement of
>your rights on a mud.  Make of it what you will.
>
>"This MUD does not guarantee your privacy, inasmuch as it is impossible to
>do so.  Snooping on other players is frowned upon and may be dealt harshly
>with given the situation.  Snooping by wizards for db protection purposes
>or for the purpose of investigating suspicious activity by players may
>take place at any time.  People being wiz-snooped may not be told until
>the investigation concludes."

It's pretty weak in some ways.  The first sentence could be stated with more
clarity: "As it is technically impossible to guarantee privacy, this MUD
does not make such a guarantee."  After all, a casual reader may object to
the sentence, asking just why it is impossible to make such a guarantee.  In
fact, the policy from Space Madness has the stronger statement:
   "While all reasonable efforts are made to provide for privacy needs, the
    admins of this MUD can't guarantee privacy of any text transmitted here."
This implies that the admins do take actions to ensure reasonable privacy, as
limited by the server and system.

The second sentence allows for a case-by-case basis evaluation of incidents,
leaving the field of enforcement open to individual wiz judgement (which is
not a bad thing).

The term "suspicious activity" is ambiguous, as "suspicious" requires a value
judgement.  (E.g. what if a wiz claims that tinysex is a suspicious activity?)
This section needs to be clarified.

I would prefer the last sentence to read: "People being legitimately
wiz-snooped need not be informed until after the investigation has concluded."

I would also add a proviso that highly disruptive players may be stripped of
server privileges and/or access at the discretion of the admin.  While such
action is extreme, players should be made aware of this.  (The Space Madness
policy statement hints that such action is possible, but does not state it
explicitly.  Said proviso need not be explicitly stated.)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
From: langd@rs6308.ecs.rpi.edu (Derek Jonathan Lang)
Subject: Looking for a site
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 17:02:23 GMT

A friend and I are looking for a site to run a Diku.  We have strong
code and need about 12 meg of disk space.  To this point, our efforts
to find a site have not been successful.  If you have a site, know of
a site, our just have some friendly advice to offer on the topic of
obtaining a site, please contact me via E-mail.

Thanks for any and all help,

Derek J Lang
langd@rpi.edu







Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
From: durrell@pinball.arcade.uiowa.edu (Bryant Durrell)
Subject: Re: Transcript of the "God Conference on Players' Rights"
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 05:02:05 GMT
Organization: University of Iowa

In article <1993Jan12.014500.21921@leland.Stanford.EDU> whale@leland.Stanford.EDU (Stephen Schmidt) writes:
>The problem that I have with the idea of a "generally accepted" set of MUD
>ethical guidelines is that it causes no end of problems for any MUD admin
>who for some legitimate reason wants to have different standards on his MUD.

Indeed.  Although I think it's a good idea to come up with some 
kind of guidelines, any such thing that doesn't acknowledge the
possibility that a MUD may need different standards is pretty
useless.  But there's no reason why such guidelines shouldn't 
do this, neh?

I mean, hey.  If you see flaws in the concept, address them.
Why dismiss the whole thing out of hand cause of flaws in the
prototype?

-- 
Bryant Durrell					   durrell@chop.isca.uiowa.edu
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                 I feed on the flesh of the living, and I vote.
From: gregb@wombat.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Snooze)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
Subject: Re: Transcript of the "God Conference on Players' Rights"
Date: 11 Jan 93 14:34:00 GMT
Followup-To: rec.games.mud.admin
Organization: /home/fsg/gregb/.organization


Okie... I skiimed through this conference and as far as I can tell, not
much was really accomplished.  Each person should handle things your own
way.  For instance, I'm currently working on a mud that will be a fairly
serious role playing world.  And there will probably be a lot of times when
wizards/GMs will be wandering around hidden/dark.  Mostly because they
might be running small mini-adventure type things and the idea is to make
it so that the players don't always know when what they are doing is being
moderated.  It will be much more of a game in that sense.  Now in this case
I don't think I'd be violating players' rights.

Looking back at the conference, it doesn't really apply that much to
something like what I'm working on.  I think Xibo said it best actually
when he was discussing how each mud was different and that no policy could
probaby fid all muds, and that there are many wizards of older muds, or
people who have ran muds for 2-3 years at this point (look at random or
jopsy) that have had problems maybe now and then and have dealt with them
all.  And each has come up with their own solutions <that work>.

<glad he didn't waste his time going to the conference...>
snooze
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,rec.games.mud.tiny,rec.games.mud.lp
From: arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu (Ken Arromdee)
Subject: Re: What rights do people want?
Organization: Johns Hopkins University CS Dept.
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 05:40:13 GMT

In article <1j07lnINNb2l@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> pariah@tartarus.uwa.edu.au (Michael Malone) writes:
>>1. Right not to be snooped or logged without their knowledge and consent.
>Dick is cheating, so Dora the God has to inform him that he is being
>checked up upon ?

What if Dick is suspected of cheating, and is monitored for six months but
nobody finds any evidence, and furthermore the gods failed to listen when Dick
pointed out that the person that accused him of cheating to begin with had an
ulterior motive?

One would think at least an admission of spying and an apology are deserved
(of course, nobody can force one out of a god, but we are discussing _ethics_).

>>2. Right not to be harassed by other players.
>My heart bleeds. If a big boy picks on you in that other real world,
>do you ask the admin to fix it for you ? Fight you own battles, or
>if you have some friends (hmm ?) then do something about it.

What about sexual harassment?  Or other harassment (race, sexual preference,
etc.)?  People _do_ go to the admin-equivalent in RL to stop these.

What about cases where you _can't_ fight your own battles because if you do,
the wizard blames you for doing the fighting?  (This can be surprisingly
frequent.  Player bends the rules to harass you.  In order to retaliate, you
must bend the rules too, but then both of you broke the rules and you may both
be punished.  The other player doesn't care because the punishment consists of
keeping people farther away from other goals, and the other player only wants
to harass and _has_ no other goals.)
--
"On the first day after Christmas my truelove served to me...  Leftover Turkey!
On the second day after Christmas my truelove served to me...  Turkey Casserole
    that she made from Leftover Turkey.
[days 3-4 deleted] ...  Flaming Turkey Wings! ...
   -- Pizza Hut commercial (and M*tlu/A*gic bait)

Ken Arromdee (arromdee@jyusenkyou.cs.jhu.edu, arromdee@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
From: whale@leland.Stanford.EDU (Stephen Schmidt)
Subject: Re: Players - Self Regulation.
Keywords: nomic, law, rights
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 05:46:12 GMT

***
Law 303. [common] Theft

The shall be no unlawful theft from living creatures with The City.

***

Isn't that a little circular?
-- 
Steve Schmidt			<><		   whale@leland.stanford.edu
I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration, Communist
indoctrination, Communist subversion, and the international Communist
conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids!
Xref: sparky rec.games.mud.admin:1045 news.admin.policy:1075 alt.fan.furry:2602
From: michael.armstrong@homebase.com (Michael Armstrong) 
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,news.admin.policy,alt.fan.furry
Subject: Re: Quicksilver virus on furry Muck -- solved!
Date: 6 Jan 93 18:46:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Home Base BBS - St. Thomas, Ontario - 519-633-7253
Reply-To: michael.armstrong@homebase.com (Michael Armstrong) 

From: michael.armstrong@homebase.com (Michael Armstrong)

MA>This does me alot diservice since I am a Christian.  You have
  >tarnished my testimony and value of my faith as well as yours.

AX>        Geez, just what we need, a 'fundie'.  And just how does the
  >so-called Christian Faith have anything to do with a virus on a mud?

The guy who planted the virus admited to being a Christian in his post.
He did post that on the above newsgroups so I replied to get him to go
further than just apologize for doing it.  I hope that security can be
tighten so events like this can be less possible because of him
supplying information to sysadmin.

BTW, I'm not a 'fundie' or fundalmentalist.  Luckly, being a Canadian,
we don't have alot of the flap-trap that you guys in the states have.
---
 . SLMR 2.1a . This tagline will self destruct in 10.. 9.. 8.. 7..
                                            
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,rec.games.mud.tiny
From: coram@ed.ecn.purdue.edu (Chaosmage)
Subject: What rights do people want?
Organization: Shadow Walker's Anonymous
Reply|to: coram@ecn.purdue.edu (Chaosmage)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 18:57:21 GMT

I've heard a lot in the last few days about this God's Conference, and people
wanting rights/priviledges.  But no one has really said WHAT rights the
players want.  The only thing I get out of it is some kind of right to
privacy is lacking but desired.

So, what gives?  What right are being denied that have you all up in arms?
I must say, it is a really sad turn of events that we find ourselves NEEDING
a written set of rights.  Aren't we all supposed to be adults?  Or close?
Why do people have problems with being nice to each other?  If everyone
were nice to everyone else, there'd be no problem, ne?

Maybe it's because I've never been screwed over by another player nor a 
wizard, but I really don't see the problem.  Everywhere I've been there's
been some sort of policy.  Common sense has served ME all the time.  And
all the wizards I've talked with were nice enough to put up with my foolish
questions.

--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Kevin C. Coram | INTERNET: coram@ecn.purdue.edu | CompuServe: 72567,2201 |
| "Don't tell me I'm nuts.  I know.  It keeps me sane."                    |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin,alt.fan.furry
From: kmeyers@nyx.cs.du.edu (Karl Meyers)
Subject: Re: Quicksilver virus on furry Muck -- solved!
Summary: Sheesh! 
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 93 17:46:44 GMT

In article <1993Jan8.095925.15653@netcom.com> foxen@netcom.com (Foxen) writes:
>
>Look people, it's like this:
>The guy wrote the virus.
>The guy also happens to be a Christian.
>
>THESE TWO DATUMS HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER!
>
>So it's really really silly to start a flame war over it.

Y'know, I think Foxen's got a point there.  THis is starting to get entirely
too silly.

The situation's been rectified, the culprit (or at least one of them) has been
caught, and FurryMUCK's running about as well as it usually does, so why is
everyone still wasting bandwidth on it?

We now return you to your regularly scheduled flamewars.  :)

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Karl F. Meyers              /               Disclaimer :            / 
kmeyer@unf6.cis.unf.edu     /    Ridicule is the burden of genius.  / 
kmeyers@nyx.cs.du.edu       /////////////////////////////////////////
GEnie : K.MEYERS2           / Babs : Well, isn't that conveeenient? /
University of North Florida /       --> Stay Tiny Tooned! <--       /
---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: GREESE@MAINE.MAINE.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
Subject: Re: Transcript of the "God Conference on Players' Rights"
Date: 13 Jan 93 00:05:11 GMT
 <1993Jan11.093859.24683@leland.Stanford.EDU> <1ish71INNr0k@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu>
Organization: University of Maine System

You say that wizards should be happy and patiently answer any question you
might throw at them.  While it seems painfully true in your case that you
were confronted with jerk immortals at every turn in your particular
experience, in general, players do not read the help files, and immortals
are often assaulted with the same question over and over and over again,
one which is in fact posted in the help/faq files.  Nightmare has
a command (faq) which answers all frequently asked questions.  A new
player at login is told several times that their first act should be to
type <faq>.  Nevertheless, over and over again questions matching those
in the faq are asked by newbie players.
My point? Though I think in your case the immortals were wrong to be so
short with you (since their mud clearly did not have the documentation),
in general players are not overly anxious to read the answers to their
questions, they want someone to lead them through the beginning stages
on a leash.  So I sympathise with SOME immortals who get annoyed.  I
do believe that an immortal should, however, happily address any questions
which are not supported by documentation.  After all, immortals are their
to make the game enjoyable for players, and players cannot enjoy it if the
help is nowhere to be found.
    Descartes of Borg
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
From: mickey@pecan.cns.udel.edu (Mickey)
Subject: Congress and Internet 
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 00:06:59 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.194626.2184@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> jfurr@nyx.cs.du.edu (Joel Furr) writes:
>
>What makes you think that Congress is going to set
>up a MUD Security Act?  Congress barely knows what the internet is.  If
>laws are passed that affect MUDs, they'll affect MUDs only because they
>affect ALL internet-related activity and not MUDs in particular.

Actually, some of Congress does know what Internet is.  The Congressional
Member Information Network (for the House of Representatives) runs its
own system that can very easily connect to Internet for access to its
services.  There has been some discussion between some of the computer
network administrators over there about hooking into Internet or some
other net due to some of the inefficiences of their own newsfeeds, etc.
(but I doubt they are very serious discussions...)

Mick

 
-- 
Mickey McCarter, amateur actor & reporter |mickey@chopin.udel.edu     __
"Law?  This is the only law.  The law     |mickey@pecan.cns.udel.edu / |	
 of averages." - Harvey Dent, Batman: TAS  |Weep not for Camelot...  /__|_ 
Existential Disclaimer: Believe what you like, nothing matters         |
From: cooljohn@leland.Stanford.EDU (John A. Magdaleno)
Subject: mudlib, lpmud/mudos ftp sites?
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 93 02:28:33 GMT

Could some one post the various ftp sites that have lpmud/mudos & mudlib
archives?

Thanks in advance.

cooljohn@leland.stanford.edu
From: bx096@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Peter Andrew Stark)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
Subject: Help! I need help on starting a MUD!
Date: 9 Jan 1993 06:39:32 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Hi,

I am thinking of starting a MUD and was wondering is anyone out 
here knows what I would have to do to do this. I understand I have 
to get a SITE and the actual program for the game. The MUD I'd 
like is really a MUSE that uses @Va-VZ, @WA=@WZ, and @XA-@XZ. I 
really also don't know the different between this MUSE and all the 
other kinds. 

So my main questions are at this time is:

 1> What kind of programs do I need? Where to I get them? Are 
    there instructions with them?
 2> How do I get a site? How does one get one and how much money 
    do I need to get one? Is there any money involved?
 3> What is an adminstrator in charge of? How much work in 
    involved to keep it up and running?

Thanks for all the help and if any of you have any suggestions or 
things that you think that I should know before doing this, please 
feel free to do so. Thank you.

Pete Stark
##
-- 
Peter Andrew Stark
Peter.stark@f721.n278.z1.fidonet.org
Email: bx096@cleveland.freenet.edu
Unix+Email: stark@wiretap.spies.com
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin