HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: regard@hpsdde.sdd.hp.com (Adrienne Regard)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: why don't kids wear helmets riding
Date: 16 Oct 1992 10:50:10 -0700
Organization: Hewlett Packard, San Diego Division
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpsdde.sdd.hp.com

In article <1992Oct16.161726.22927@morrow.stanford.edu> GC.SUL@forsythe.stanford.edu (Sullivan) writes:
>Can anyone tell me if the Pony Club has requirements for helmets on
>kids. and up to what age? 

Yes, they do.  Pony Club participated in the testing for the latest
helmet standard, and pony clubbers are 'required' to wear helmets in 
pony club activities.  However, the definition of 'pony club activities'
and 'required' varies area to area.

>Our local junior horseman group was practiceing Team Penning last
>Sunday.  

Man, that saddens me.  We just lost one of our most promising 14 year olds
last summer to a team penning fall.  Lost.  She died.  Massive brain
trauma.  She wore her helmet jumping, and riding dressage, and eventing,
but not team penning.

>The Lake Co. Fair always has a Gymkhana on Labor Day. All kinds of
>kids trying to run barrels-5 year olds on ponies-with no helmet
>requirement.

The gymkana governing bodies do not mandate helmets.  AHSA does for
junior riders, 18 and under.

>ready to be riding on her own.  She is simply not strong enough to
>control our pony if she was in a situation where SHE NEEDED TO.

Nobody is *ever* 'strong enough' not to need a helmet.

>Am I just paranoid and overly concerned or is there still a lot of
>ignorance regarding safety in the horse industry?
Yes.

>(By the way-I have to admit that I don't wear a helmet trailriding,
>though I do have safety stirrups with toe guards.  However, I still
>feel I can dismount and land on my feet quickly-I know it doesn't
>matter)

I can't think of an accident at our 100-family riding facility last year
where head injury occurred over fences.  Each and every single incident
I know of last year occurred with riders who came off ON THE FLAT.  Most
came off of well-trained horses who just put their feet wrong.

You want kids to wear a helmet, but you *don't*?  What is that?

>Any opinions appreciated.


OK, here's mine.  I don't allow anybody on my horses without a helmet and
without boots.  Period.  Ever.  Even to sit in the paddock while the horses
are eating.  Ever.  Period.  If you have both feet off the ground, you have
a helmet on.  Regardless of your 'strength'.  Regardless of your age.

Adrienne Regard
From: ckw0@aber.ac.uk (Carl Keri Williams)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Help for a friend's project.
Summary: Information on rear-facing horse transport.
Date: 12 Oct 92 16:44:22 GMT
Organization: University of Wales, Aberystwyth

As some of you know, I've had to defer my college course for a while :-(
but a friend of mine who is still on the course would like to get as much
information as possible for her project, which is about rear-facing horse
transport.  Would anyone with ANY information on this, either personal 
experiences, information on any articles/papers, contacts with people who 
have studied this, names and adresses of manufacturers who make/made 
rear-facing trailers, etc, etc, could you possibly get in touch with me?
If this has been discussed on the net and anyone has kept a file of postings,
could they forward this to me, too?  

Inormation from anywhere and everywhere in the world would be appreciated!

Thanks in advance,

Esther, Rickie, Mari and baby Non.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "If God had meant for us to work, then I'm sure he  | ckw0@uk.ac.aberystwyth|
|  would have given us jobs..."  ...                  | ckw0@uk.ac.aber.cs    |
| "Sign on you crazy diamond" - Half man half biscuit |      tardis ?         |
From: karlm@sequent.com (Karl Maerz)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: STOP IT!!!  (& When it Rains it Pours)
Date: 15 Oct 92 00:17:48 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Oct15.001748.2964
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.

king@glacier.Stanford.EDU (Robin King) writes:
 |clarefg@bestbet.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
 | | I agree with Sue. This thread has gone on too long!
 |
 |	I'm interested in all topics equestrian: slaughterhouse
 |	info, animal rights groups as they affect horse ownership,
 |	horse morphology/anthropology, etc.  These are all pertinent 
 |	to knowing about horses.  Leg aids and Avon Skin-So-Soft 
 |	are also pertinent.  
 |
 |	Let's not limit our topics unnecessarily by being unable
 |	to deal with controversial subjects.  Flames and uppity 
 |	attitudes are detrimental to the sharing of knowledge.
 |

The conversation in question long ago degenerated into the typical 
usenet scenario of "I'm right!" "No, *I'm* right!" "No you're not!" 
"Yes I am!" complete with long quotations and refutation and supporting
arguments -- virtually all of which are irrelevant to rec.equestrian
and mostly relevant to getting the last word in and showing all of us 
how "right" the current author is and what a bozo the other dweeb is.

Kids...  Cut it out!  Your debating skills may be great and all that,
but none of us really care since the noise to signal ratio has gone
asymptotic.

Givens:		There are many fine animal welfare organizations.

		There are a few radical "animal rights" organizations
		whose agendas are a bit, er, extreme for the average
		rec.equestrian lurker.

		Nobody here (so far) has admitted to subscribing to
		the views of the second kind of group.

		Humans have really boring teeth.

		The petty bickering over morphological vs. anthropological
		has become sophmoricological.

		My horse is hands-down, *way* more better than
		your horse could ever hope to be.

		(Hah!  Gotcha, didn't I?)


Now, let's talk about some really fun stuff.  For instance, after
several years of injury-free (for me) horse ownership, I was kicked
in the shin by my riding buddy's horse while we were riding.  It hurt 
like hell!  I'm lucky my leg didn't break, though I'll have a pretty
good scar.  One week later I was lovin' up my mare when she spooked
and jumped forward right square onto my big toe (we're talking full
weight with shoes on, here, ~1200lb mare).  To make matters worse, she 
pushed off hard with her front legs to get off my foot in a hurry.  I was 
wearing boots, but the toe is broke big time, its a really awesome sort
of plum/twilight color, and I'll be able to use the nail for a guitar pick 
when it falls off in a few days.

Two sorta bad ones in one week.  hmmmmm...  I didn't think I had
become too complacent (I'm generally very safety conscious) but
the evidence would seem to suggest otherwise.  If these things run
in three's I'm not looking forward to the next one...  Anyone else
have any runs of fortune like this?

Karl Maerz
karlm@sequent.com
From: deniseo@hpmwtd.sr.hp.com (Denise O'Connor)
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 19:30:37 GMT
Subject: HELP: ARAB BLOODLINES
Organization: HP Santa Rosa Site (SRSD MWTD)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian

 Can anyone comment on the Spanish Arab bloodlines given below.  I am
 interested in any good/bad points, or any knowledge about any of it.
 So far I haven't found any one who can comment about the lines, so if
 anybody has any comment, please, please, please, send it on to me.

 Thanks - Denise


							BARQUILLO
 					ORIVE
							GALATIFE
 			GARBO
							MAQUILLO
 					BALDOSA
							HABLDURIA
 	UVAL
							GANDHY
 					MALVITO
 							EGINA
 			CANTINERA II
							MAQUILLO
 					URAL
							CIBELES


							ILUSTRE
 					CONGO
							TRIANA
 			ZANCUDO
							CAMELO I
 					YAIMA
							MANICURA
 	OCALINA II
							SIRIO III
 					SIRIO IV
							ARMIDA
			OCALINA
							KASHMIR
					FARINA
							LAMPARA

 She was a yearling when she was imported from Spain, she is eight now.
 There were imports into spain further back in her lines, such as 
 URSUS, SEANDERICH, RAZADA, REYNA, where did they come from?
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: gordo@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Gordon C. Smith)
Subject: First time SELLER - advice wanted.
Organization: University of Hawaii
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 20:25:01 GMT

I'm on the verge of showing my horse to someone who seems to have a 
fair amount of experience buying horses. Can you all provide me with 
some pointers to give a good impression?

I just want to make it as smooth as possible for me to present my 
horse to a potential buyer without being treated like  a kook by a 
smooth talking horse trader! 


Here's the particulars:

I play polo  and I need horses that can go two chukkers. I bought a 
pretty roan 8 y/o QH mare last March that is very well broke and plays 
well. The problem is that she has, according to the vet, "minor 
ringbone" and she goes a slightly lame if I ride her hard (like going two 
chukkers three days a week). Word got around that I might sell her and 
this morning an instructor called and said she needed a lesson horse 
for beginner English lessons. She'd be kept in a stall at a reputable barn 
and go out for "a couple of lessons a day". This may be a good deal
for everyone involved, including the mare. I'll have to inquire
about the instuctors reputation.

I haven't gone through this process before -  so any ideas on what I 
should do in showing off the horse and how we can both come to a 
reasonable agreement would be appreciated.

THANKS!

Gordon Smith

Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: GC.GGG@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gwyn Gordon)
Subject: Re: First time SELLER - advice wanted.
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 23:38:59 GMT

In article <1992Oct15.202501.805@news.Hawaii.Edu>,
gordo@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu (Gordon C. Smith) writes:
>I'm on the verge of showing my horse to someone who seems to have a
>fair amount of experience buying horses. Can you all provide me with
>some pointers to give a good impression?

I used to work with a person who boarded and sold horses for a
living, and believe me showing a horse can be raised to an art form
if you want to go to that extreme! You can do as much or as little
of these things as you have the time/inclination for, but this is
what we did:

The day before:

1) clipped furries from pasterns, fetlocks and behind ankles,
trimmed the bridle-path, whiskers and outsides of ears

2) pulled mane to neat, even length

3) gave thorough general grooming

The morning of:

1) rode easily for a short time (or lounged) just to get any stray
willies or kinks out

2) gave INTENSE bath (eg: every square inch plus mane and tail

3) braided mane and tail

4) when dry, gave complete grooming, including using hoof-oil on
feet and baby oil on nose and eyes (don't forget fly spray to keep
her comfortable while she'd being led, examined, poked, prodded, and
generally stared at)

When they drove up the driveway:

1) put another coat of hoof oil on feet

2) wipe stray dust off coat

3) put on best bridle and saddle, with CLEAN saddle pad and polo
wraps


In general, the idea is that the horse should look like it's ready
to go in a show (which is what these horses were for). It's good to
have someone ride the horse for the prospective buyers, so they can
see what the horse looks like from the ground. This rider should be
quiet, comfortable on the horse, and make everything look easy. Then
the people ride the horse and you can give them helpful hints or
not according to your own style.

They main thing is that the horse be quiet, comfortable and
beautifully presented from the moment they arrive. Clean tack, clean
horse, and newly-oiled hooves can really make a horse look special!

Good luck!

=gwyn
From: hjuenema@orion.cel.scg.hac.com (Heather Juenema)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: why don't kids wear helmets riding
Date: 16 Oct 92 21:29:44 GMT
Article-I.D.: hacgate.23672
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Colorado Engineering Labs


 I, though an adult always always ALWAYS wear a helmet anytime I'm on
horseback and never ride in a heelless shoe!! I require the same out
of any student young or old and regardless of riding level.

Pony club here in Colorado has extremely strict helmet rules which most
4H events adhere to as far as english riders. Unfortunantly most western
riders have never worn a helmet in their lives.

I believe most serious horse related injuries are back or head related and
most of the head injuries could have been prevented. Even the most advanced
riders go off a horse occasionally, especially with the bigger more powerfull
horses that are being produced these days.

I only have one set of brains and do not care to risk them whether it be
jumping or dressage work. I even wear a helmet when I go trail riding in 
a western saddle. Trails can be especially dangerous since you never know what 
you'll encounter. Even the calmest horse can become unglued if you come face
to face with a semi on a small seldom traveled dirt road in the boonies!
(trust me, I know this one from experience!)

Heather and Gizmo
From: hjuenema@orion.cel.scg.hac.com (Heather Juenema)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Washing leather breeches (Was: Re: Custom Pants)
Date: 14 Oct 92 20:55:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: hacgate.23644
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Colorado Engineering Labs


 I'm new to this computer stuff in general so I hope this comes out ok.

Call me really weird or something, but I have always washed my leather
seated breeches on  a permanent press cycle with normal detergent 
( I happen to use YES detergent ). I have never dried my breeches other
than hang drying and I don't wash them after every ride unless they're
my white show breeches. My schooling breeches only get washed every week
or every other week depending on how dirty they get. I haven't had the
leather wear out or crack on a pair yet (My schooling breeches are three 
to four years old).

Heather and Gizmo (my ingenious 5 yr old TB escape artist!)
From: tracy@scoraz.resp-sci.arizona.edu (Tracy Scheinkman)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: re: Animal Rights bashing
Date: 10 Oct 92 04:59:19 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ

In Article 9185 (1 more) in rec.equestrian pallas@cephalo.neusc.bcm.tmc.edu 
(Sarah Pallas) writes:

>I am quite sure that PETA, CEASE, ARM, Friends of Animals, In Defense
>of Animals, the ALF and others have no interest in being "informed" by
>anyone.  Their positions are relatively well-thought out, and they
>have no interest in softening them.  They would consider your interest
>in breeding and riding and showing horses to be highly arrogant and cruel.

	Well I have some friends who are members of PETA and Friends of
Animals, and they don't seem to mind, as a matter of fact one of them,
the local ferret expert and rescuer, member of Ferret Friends, has 
horses herself!

>From Michael W. Fox, environmental studies director of the Humane
>Society of the United States:  "Humane care is simply sentimental,
>sympathetic patronage.  Human beings aren't superior to the other animals,
>we're just different."  Humane society literature states that "there
>is no rational basis for maintaining a moral distinction between the
>treatment of humans and other animals."

	That does it, now you're saying that the HUMANE SOCIETY is
in on it too?!  This is only the finest animal humane organization
in the entire country.  Without them low cost spay/neuter clinics
would not be available to pet owners across the country.  You have
finally dropped off the deep end.  I have been very patient and
reasonable when posting to you, yet each time you have inferred that
I am some horrible anti-life anti-human, I will not put up with these
awful insults any longer.  This is totally unreasonable behavior
and does not belong on the net.  From now on if you want to insult
me do it by e-mail and stop subjecting the rest of the net to your
ravings.

					Tracy and everybody
From: jlevy@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (janet.s.levy)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: When will the bad luck end (was Stop IT!!)
Keywords: accident streaks
Date: 16 Oct 92 20:41:15 GMT
Organization: AT&T

Here's some bad luck which came in threes.  Several years ago, my
friend took her big Appaloosa to a nearby barn for an open show.
I went along as her assistant/moral-support.  Her first class was
a halter class, and as we were waiting with other horses and handlers
in an open area in front of the arena, someone's horse kicked out
and hit my friend squarely in the elbow.  She was in a lot of pain,
so the barn gave her a stall and I drove her to the emergency room.
X-rays showed that it was only a severe bruise, fortunately, so we
returned to the barn (her arm in a sling).  We trailered back to
our barn, but when we unloaded her horse, he slipped for some reason
and scraped his hock on the ground.  We called the vet and he
advised holding ice to the area.  Since she was out of commission,
I sat on a stool and held the ice bag on his leg for about a half
an hour.  He was calm the whole time, and then suddenly, something
must have hurt him and he kicked, getting me in the knee.  I ended
up with a not-so-bad but painful bruise.  

So there we were, all three of us with joint injuries.  Horse shows
are so much fun!  Are we having fun yet?

Janet Levy
jsl@ihlpm.ATT.COM
From: king@glacier.Stanford.EDU (Robin King)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: Animal Rights bashing
Date: 8 Oct 92 20:13:17 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Center for Integrated Systems, Stanford University, California

(Sarah Pallas) writes:
>
>When you say you support animal RIGHTS, that means you support at
>least the platform, and I might assume it means you support the
>violent means of obtaining the goals of the platform.  In that case, I
>have no respect for your opinion, as it means disrespect for human
>life. 

	Whoa!  The word "rights" has different meanings to
	different people.  Instead of assuming you (everyone)
	know what people "mean" by a particular buzzword, 
	try to listen to what they're saying.  

	My too sense,   :^)
	Robin
From: tracy@scoraz.resp-sci.arizona.edu (Tracy Scheinkman)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: recommendation of Grooma products
Date: 9 Oct 92 06:31:08 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ


	I agree completely my filly and mare literally fall asleep
when I use my soft Grooma on their faces.  If they were cats they
would purr.  Also Groomas make wonderful bath scrubbers, they
get all the deep down dirt while the horse is wet and soapy and
clean up incredibly easily.

				Tracy and everybody
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: prescott@rtsg.mot.com (Audrey Prescott)
Subject: chewing on fence
Summary: chewing on fence
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 16:23:12 GMT

Any recomendations on the best way to keep a horse from chewing on a 
fence?  My horse has moved to a new home where she is now outside whenever
she wants to be.  There is only one other horse there and he has lived
there for 6 years. (other horses there with him most of the time)  
Now my horse is there and someone is chewing on the fence.  
(not cribbing, but random little chews that look like boredom.)  
I doubt it is the horse that has lived there for 6 years, and so
I need to do something about the slow destruction of the fence.  

Any stories on what works the best?  I got some 'stop chew' spray on 
stuff that was clear.  But then I couldn't tell if she had stopped chewing 
or not.  So I got some brown 'stop chew' and sprayed it on, figuring since
it is brown I will be able to tell if she is still chewing on the fence.

Please - any ideas are appreciated!

Audrey Carroll 

prescott@blue.rtsg.mot.com

Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: templin@rintintin.Colorado.EDU (TEMPLIN GERI ELLEN)
Subject: Grooma and horse vaccuums
Summary: Looking for some info
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 00:27:46 GMT


Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Keywords: Horse Vaccuums and Grooma 

   Hello, first time poster here. I was wondering if someone out there
   could mail me some information on the following subjects:

   1) Grooma - is this some kind of rubber currycomb? Where do I
      buy one?

   2) My friend and I are interested in splitting the cost of a
      horse vacuum (two black horses, two black STATIC-Y horses) 
      and I had some questions for those of you versed in such
      extravagant machines:

      Can any vacuum work? Like a shop vac from the local hardware store?
      How loud is a real horse vac? Are vac's designed for other uses
        too loud to use on a horse? (thoroughbred mare) :^) 
      Is a canister better than a hand-held?
      What kind of attachments are the best?
      Do they make Grooma's that hook up? :^)

   Hopefully this makes it out there - I read all the instructions HONEST!

   I'll be awaiting any responses with fingers crossed:

      templin@cs.colorado.edu

   thanks! geri
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
From: broberts@bigwpi.WPI.EDU (broberts)
Newsgroups: rec.equestrian
Subject: Re: why don't kids wear helmets riding
Date: 16 Oct 92 16:42:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: bigboote.1bmrd7INNl1c
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: bigwpi.wpi.edu

The Pony club in my area, central Massachusetts, required helmets to
be worn. No you are not being paranoid. You can't always tell when a
horse is going to spook no matter how long someone has been riding. 

I think people think of riding helmets like seat belts. Some people
think its better to be a little uncomfortable and take the precaution
of wearing a seatbelt but like with seat belts there are people who
wont wear a helmet unless someone makes them or the seriously hurt
themselves. A lot of people just dont look at the risks.

I have been riding since I was about 5 and I usually wear a helmet. I
also teach kids how to ride now and I NEVER let them ride without a
helmet. Its  a good habit to get into.

-Jen Roberts