HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: marcush@leland.Stanford.EDU (Marcus Edward Hennecke)
Subject: Re: Threats and Name-calling
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 05:27:18 GMT

In article <lefty-151092152826@lefty.apple.com> lefty@apple.com (Lefty) writes:
>I am appalled that a fine institution of learning such as Stanford has
>apparently fallen to a state where I should have to advise its inmates of
>such completely straightforward facts of life as these.

PLEASE oh please don't take somebody's opinion as the opinion of the
institution s/he happens to work for or study at. Other people at the
same institution may very well have different opinions or may not be
in the state you claim them to be.

Marcus "what's this crap doing in ba.general anyway?" Hennecke
marcush@leland.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: eager@eagercon.com (Michael J. Eager)
Subject: Re: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions
Reply-To: eager@eagercon.com
Organization: Eager Consulting
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 15:56:03 GMT

In article 26078@linus.mitre.org, bs@gauss.mitre.org (Robert D. Silverman) writes:
>
>I am responsible for the misdeeds of my children. You are responsible
>for the misdeeds of yours. (if you have any). The neighbors should NOT
>be responsible for my kids misdeeds. Trespassing on their property,
>[especially by climbing over a fence] is a misdeed. The neighbors should
>not be held responsible if my kid drowns in their pool UNLESS he was invited. 

I can see it:  You are cordially invited to come to a drowning party on Sat.

Really, the point you seem not to grasp is that the tresspass of the child is
a mitigating factor.  A misdeed by one person does not excuse you of your 
responsibilities.  When such matters come to court, the judge/jury looks at
all of the parties which have responsibility.

If you have a substantial fence, which is difficult to climb, and it is securely
locked, you will likely be found to have acted with reasonable care.  If it is
a low, transparent fence, with no lock, you will likely be found to have not
acted with reasonable care.


> 
>I have no argument for requiring a fence around pools. But I would argue
>that the purpose is to prevent accidents, rather than protect against
>intentional misdeeds by others.

Children are usually seen as not being able to fully form the concepts to
have the "intention" to tresspass.  

>
>What bothers me most is that lawsuits have been filed and won after 
>a drowning in a pool that WAS properly secured. This is grossly unjust.

There have been bad decisions in numerous cases.  They are frequently overturned
on appeal.  Do you have citations for these "grossly unjust" cases, or are
is this just a stalking horse, used to ignore the "just" cases?

>
>Children are NOT responsible. That is why their parents are held responsible
>for their actions.

Yes.  And a property owner is held responsible for his property.

---
Michael J. Eager		Michael.Eager@eagercon.com
Eager Consulting		(415) 325-8077 
1960 Park Boulevard, Palo Alto, CA 94306-1141
From: lindae@netcom.com
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Springsteen Concert Postponed - I Now Have 2 TIX for Sale!!
Date: 8 Oct 92 15:42:16 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)


Well, if you hadn't already heard, the Springsteen concerts at
Shoreline Ampitheatre (Mt. View) have been postponed 'til 
October 21st and 22nd.

I have 2 tickets for the October 9 show which will now be
good for October 22nd.  These are general admission lawn seats.

I will sell to the highest offer.  Please send offers to 
lindae@netcom.com
Xref: sparky ba.general:4513 misc.kids:26198 misc.legal:18766
From: mzimmers@netcom.com (Michael Zimmers)
Newsgroups: ba.general,misc.kids,misc.legal
Subject: Re: Attractive Nuisance (was: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions)
Date: 16 Oct 92 15:30:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <24492@sybase.sybase.com> mysti@sybase.com (Mysti) writes:

>In article <1992Oct9.191528.20366@netcom.com> mzimmers@netcom.com (Michael Zimmers) writes:

>>In article <1992Oct9.172944.5291@adobe.com> pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai) writes:

>>>neighborhood. As for 10-year-olds running around unattended, it seems
>>>fairly common to me. I ran around on my family farm at that age and
>>>earlier. My nieces are doing the same thing right now. My neighbors
>>>did too.

>>A family farm, eh?  Sounds like *your* *own* *private* *property* to me.
>>
>>Very different.

>The point is that children go about the world unattended.  Given that
>fact in combination with the well-established presumption that children
>cannot reliably make judgments, then it is reasonable that those who
>have control over attractive nuisances be required to take reasonable
>steps to secure them.

Reasonable is in the eye of the beholder.  To me, it's much more
reasonable that the parent keep tighter rein on their children than
to permit them to use someone else's property as their playground.
When children are old enough to be trusted on their own, part of that
trust is that they know to respect private property (ie not to trespass).

And as far as children going about the world unattended, well, there
are many horrors and hazards out there that I'd worry about before
uncovered swimming pools.  That statement doesn't sound like one from
a responsible parent.


-- 
Michael Zimmers                                    |  Home:  408 996 1984
SoftHelp                                           |  Work:  408 996 1965
Software Solutions for Open Systems                |  Data:  408 996 1974
From: jmajor@venus.Tymnet.COM (Jodi Major)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Info on Laitron (computer dealer)
Date: 12 Oct 92 19:36:09 GMT
Organization: BT North America (Tymnet)


Does anyone out there in the net world have any opinions or 
comments on the computer dealer, Laitron, located in Milpitas?

Please repsond to this account with any info.

All responses are greatly appreciated!!

Thanks,

Jodi Major
BT North America, Inc.
Xref: sparky ba.general:4357 misc.legal:18417
From: larrabee@cse.ucsc.edu (Tracy Larrabee)
Newsgroups: ba.general,misc.legal
Subject: Re: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions
Date: 9 Oct 1992 21:16:06 GMT
Organization: University of California, Santa Cruz (CE/CIS Boards)
NNTP-Posting-Host: arapaho.ucsc.edu

In article <1992Oct9.202916.29848@leland.Stanford.EDU> eap@leland.Stanford.EDU (Eric Perozziello) writes:
&>
&>Children are not responsible. This seems to be a difficult concept for
&>many of the participants in this discussion. Maybe you could recall
&>your childhood to help you get a grip on this concept.
&>
&
&When I was a child, My parents forbid me to leave the property.
&Once I was a little older (prob 13 yrs) I could wander the neighbor-
&hood, but only areas THEY were familiar with. If I went outside 
&of this, I was punished by NOT being alowed to leave the house. 
&Seemed pretty simple to me- I learned to be responsible this 
&way too.
&

And you learned good social interaction skills too, we imagine.
 


Newsgroups: ba.general
From: jdavis@ssf-sys.DHL.COM (Jim Davis)
Subject: bartender wanted
Organization: DHL Systems, Inc.
Distribution: ba
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 15:26:15 GMT

We need someone to set up and run a "no host" bar in the East Bay on
October 24th 7pm - midnite.  There will be about 100 people and we want
to only serve wine and soft drinks and maybe beer.  We want someone to do
everything, i.e. get the wine, provide ice, glasses, bar, etc.  We are
not looking to make money, just try to cover expenses.  I suspect we'd
need a 1 night license plus some liability coverage.  Would want that 
covered also.  We have to get a decision ASAP so if you've got any ideas
please let me know today!
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: lefty@apple.com (Lefty)
Subject: Re: stupid consumers
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 21:51:04 GMT
Organization: Our Lady of Heavy Artillery

In article <1992Oct9.200036.23003@leland.Stanford.EDU>,
eap@leland.Stanford.EDU (Eric Perozziello) wrote:
> 
> Or don't they teach that in grammer school anymore?

Noted, without comment.

--
Lefty (lefty@apple.com)
C:.M:.C:., D:.O:.D:.
Xref: sparky ba.general:4303 misc.kids:25570 misc.legal:18339
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: ba.general,misc.kids,misc.legal
Subject: Re: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions
Date: 8 Oct 92 23:35:39 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

>lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell) writes:
>>>=>>>Exactly to whom is it the worth the cost of a fence to put the
>>>=>>>fence around Mr. Sohl's swimming pool?  Let that person speak up.
>>
>>    How explicit an answer would you like?
>
In article <1b00lvINNbos@smaug.West.Sun.COM> dab@ism.isc.com (Dave Butterfield) writes:
   
   [obviously having been totally out of touch with California
    liability case law......or just totally out of touch.....]

>The name of someone who considers having a fence around Mr. Sohl's
>swimming pool worthwhile enough to pay the cost would be satisfactory.

   o  The judge in the lawsuit and criminal liability case the first
      time some youngster drowns in the !@#!@#$ thing!

   o  Mr. Sohl himself, if he has any kind of morals whatever and
      any experience whatever with young children.  This of course
      assume that you and he ever WERE young children and have any
      memories whatever of your experiences.

   Obviously you are aware that the question HAS been answered and
   are deliberately playing stupid.   Hopefully you will never have
   children or a pool,,,,you would be a menace to society with
   either.

   Sadly, our society believes in protecting its children, but does
   not believe in retroactive abortion for sociopaths,.

Newsgroups: ba.general
From: marcush@leland.Stanford.EDU (Marcus Edward Hennecke)
Subject: Re: stupid consumers
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 92 20:59:38 GMT

In article <1992Oct8.191641.26535@leland.Stanford.EDU> eap@leland.Stanford.EDU (Eric Perozziello) writes:
>In article <1992Oct7.015842.9671@leland.Stanford.EDU> marcush@leland.Stanford.EDU (Marcus Edward Hennecke) writes:
>>In article <1992Oct6.235108.4996@cascade.Stanford.EDU> king@glacier.Stanford.EDU (Robin King) writes:
>>>	[...]  Besides, popularity doesn't make "right,"
>>>	does it.
>>
>>But it makes one suspicious why so few people share his opinions.
>
>Look at the area- Most liberal in the country.

There are also many conservatives who disagree with you.

>>>>>[...]  But its OK ... unpopular views and insensitive racially
>>>>>oriented remarks are not a crime here. 
>>>  ^^^^^^^  try "Asian"  :^)
>>
>>??? And what please should "insensitive racially Asian remarks mean" ???
>>Is an "Asian remark" a remark made by an Asian? How do you know that
>>Eric is Asian? Or what is your definition of an "Asian remark" (and
>>why do you write it with a capital "A")?
>
>WARNING!! INSULT COMING: Are you too stupid to get the joke???

Thanks for the insult. And where is the joke?

>>Well, all the remarks he made so far really are insensitive and are
>>racially oriented (or "racially Asian", whatever that's supposed to
>>mean). For example, he refers to Japanese as "Japs", which is
>>certainly not very polite.
>
>Come off your soap-box.  I don't beleive my remarks are insensitive,
>and they ARE NOT racially oriented. They ARE politically oriented
>towards a nation that I beleive is politically WRONG. Get it? 
>Need further explanation? 
>
>I'm sorry you don't like my abbreviations. 

Now that is really insensitive. You know exactly that your
"abbreviations" are insulting. BTW, I myself would have put the wording
a bit different, not "insensitive, racially oriented" but "racially
insensitive".

Marcus
marcush@leland.stanford.edu
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: eap@leland.Stanford.EDU (Eric Perozziello)
Subject: Re: stupid consumers
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 92 20:08:22 GMT

>>>- I think Barbara Bush is a very nice woman and it was nice of
>>>  George to have her picture put on the one dollar bill.
>>
>>	RETRO ALERT!  I thought this kind of shitty attitude toward 
>>	women went out in the seventies.  Yet here again is the same
>>	old fucked up deal:  A Woman's Value Is Based On Her Looks.
>>	
>>	Get a clue, ya lame-brain.
>>
>Now wait a minute, Robin! What makes you insult Paul? Can't you be a
>little less emotional? Don't you know how to lead a serious
>discussion? Why did you have to include the words "shitty", "fucked
>up", "lame-brain"? Do you really think that makes your argument valid?
>Do you think people take you more serious if you do that? It seems you
>want to make a weak argument stronger.

What I find interesting, marcus, is that you labeled ME a racist
for using a simple abbreviation.  Now Robin labels Paul (basically
sexist) for commenting on Barbara's looks (as if that's all that matters!)
Now YOU complain when someone points out an OBVIOUSLY discriminatory
comment?



Newsgroups: ba.general,misc.kids,misc.legal
From: pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai)
Subject: Re: Attractive Nuisance
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 18:32:16 GMT

In article <1992Oct12.211946.18447@erg.sri.com> rat@erg.sri.com (Ray Trent) writes:
>Seems this is far too serious an issue to move into civil courts where
>preponderance of evidence is the criteria for an award and lawyers get
>paid big bucks to play on the emotions of the jurors and get them to
>give a large award (coincidentally allowing lawyers to get their cut).

So you think the owners of unsecured swimming pools are being found
guilty too easily by things like a "preponderance of evidence".

-- 
My opinions are my own.
Happy owner of a new Mitsubishi Expo.
From: herb@sybase.com (Herb Lison)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: S.F. Opera House Acoustics
Date: 14 Oct 92 22:14:37 GMT
Organization: Sybase, Inc.

Can anyone tell me if the San Francisco Opera house has good acoustics
throughout, or if there are noticeable differences depending upon where
you sit.  I'd like to go to a performance there next weekend but they
only have rear balcony seats left.  Any information appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Herb Lison
From: jdoskow@ichinen.Tymnet.COM (Jonathan Doskow)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: stupid consumers
Date: 15 Oct 92 17:30:31 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: BT North America (Tymnet)

In article <1992Oct14.231950.28580@oracle.us.oracle.com> glo@dvlseq.us.oracle.com (George Lo) writes:
>
>From what I have heard since I was born, I couldn't recall any major
>accident with JAL, SIA or Cathay.  But I do remember quite a number
>of UA PanAm accidents.

When were you born?  During the '80s, there was a domestic JAL flight on
a 747 where a defective repair on the rear cabin bulkhead ruptured
shortly after takeoff from (Haneda or Narita, not sure which.)  The
resulting rush of air blew most of the tail fin off of the aircraft,
rupturing all of the redundant hydrolic systems, causing almost total
control failure.  The pilot managed to manuver the aircraft for some
time, about 30 minutes, by varying the power to the engines, while the
passangers prayed, wrote wills, and etc.  Finally, the planes crashed
into a hillside, killing all but 4 of the more than 500 passangers
and crew aboard.  I believe that this accident set some kind of record
for most fatalities in a single accident.  I also recall hearing that
the head of JAL maintenance committed suicide to accept responsibility,
and that families of the survivors suggested that officials of the
Boeing company should do likewise.
+------------------------------------------------------------------+
She can marry a taxi driver.  I don't care.

Opinions expressed are those of the author.  jdoskow@Tymnet.COM
From: rah@public.BTR.COM (Richard A Hyde  rah@btr.com)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: stupid consumers
Date: 8 Oct 92 02:59:02 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: BTR Public Access UNIX, MtnView CA. For info contact: info@BTR.COM

In article <1992Oct7.194107.1356@oracle.us.oracle.com> glo@dvlseq.us.oracle.com (George Lo) writes:
|
|If you have flown on any Asian airlines, Cathay, SIA, JAL, you
|probably would not want to fly on any American airlines anymore
|unless they are significantly cheaper.  The services are just
|completely different.

"Differernt" is the operative word here.  When I've spent some time in
Japan, I love boarding that US jet to go home.  It matches my culture.
Don't get me wrong, I love Japan and things Japanese, it's just not
home.


-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|   Richard Hyde  |  RaH@btr.com  |    This space intentionally left blank   |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: ba.general
From: skister@dvlseq.us.oracle.com (Scott Kister)
Subject: Marine forecasts
Organization: Oracle World HQ, Redwood Shores, California
Distribution: ba
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 19:28:19 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by an unauthenticated user
              at Oracle Corporation.  The opinions expressed are those
              of the user and not necessarily those of Oracle.

I have been wondering for where the areas in the SF Chronicle's Marine forecast
are. The paper gives marine data for

Point St. George to Point Arena,
Point Arena to Point Pinos,
Point Pinos to Point Concepcion, and
Monterey Bay.

I assume that they are going from North to South and I know where Monterey Bay
is, but where would Half Moon Bay, Pacifica, and SF fit in? I have never seen
these points referenced elsewhere. Thanks for the help.
Xref: sparky ba.general:4483 ba.market.vehicles:3682 ba.market.misc:7853
From: twarn@garnet.berkeley.edu (Tim Warner)
Newsgroups: ba.general,ba.market.vehicles,ba.market.misc
Subject: 1967 BMW 2002 -- fixer-upper
Date: 16 Oct 1992 00:28:32 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: ba
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

Mechanics special

1967 BMW 2002 with a 6V electrical system; $925 obo.

I bought this car about two years ago intending to fix it up. At that time I hada  place to store the car, but no time to work on it. Now, I don't have either, and would like to find a better home for it.

The car runs okay when warmed up but needs work on the cooling system, the 
electrical system, and the suspension. There is minor body damage, but nothing  too bad. The engine is a rebuilt '74 BMW 2002 with 64,000 miles on it. A Weber  two barrel is currently installed which makes it a little tough to start, but I am including the original carbeurator and manifold. The interior is aging, but  in reasonably good condition.

This car is perfect for someone who wants a project. The car can either be
restored, or converted to a 12V system. But I won't lie to you; the car is in
neglected shape and needs some work before it will be road worthy.

If interested, reply to this account, or call 510/839-6962. Ask for Tim.

(I will be out the weekend of Oct 17-18, so I will reply on Monday. Thanks!)

Newsgroups: ba.general
From: pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai)
Subject: Re: First auto insurance of my life and i am getting screwed. (help!!)
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 16:19:18 GMT

In article <24482@sybase.sybase.com> mysti@sybase.com (Mysti) writes:
>For reference, my minimum-allowed-by-law insurance coverage on an 82 Honda
>is costing me ~600 a year, from AAA.

And my almost minimum-allowed-by-law coverage on my 86 Honda Civic costs
me $150 every six months, from 20th Century.

I'm not even female...

(not minimum because I carry uninsured motorist protection)

-- 
My opinions are my own.
Happy owner of a new Mitsubishi Expo.

Newsgroups: ba.general
From: slick@netcom.com (Martin Veneroso)
Subject: Re: Air Show
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Distribution: ba
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 07:14:13 GMT

Apgar@Apple.com (Gar) writes:

>The program for the Travis Air Show (last sat) lists the Blue Angels
>schedule and says they will be in SF 10/10/92...

>Anyone know anything about this?

I'm pretty sure that would be the kick-off of Fleet Week, usually including
a show by the Blue Angels over the bay off SF.
-- 
Martin Veneroso
slick@netcom.com
Jung'f vg gb ln?
jneybeqf fhpx fjbeqf
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Re: Fry's -- Yet Another Bad Experience
Date: 16 Oct 92 23:24:59 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Distribution: ba
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <1992Oct16.215003.21934@ads.com> charleen@ADS.COM (Charleen Bunjiovianna) writes:
>
>Do Safeway and Fry's really think that we're such sheep, that they no
>longer have to make an effort after we've been hooked?

    Only as long as their stores are full of people buying things.
    As long as people put up with this crap, why should they change?
From: lstowell@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Newsgroups: ba.general
Subject: Air safety.
Date: 16 Oct 92 19:25:16 GMT
Reply-To: lstowell@pyrnova.pyramid.com (Lon Stowell)
Distribution: ba
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corp., Mountain View, CA

In article <12784@optilink.UUCP> cramer@optilink.UUCP (Clayton Cramer) writes:
>
>Remember the JAL flight that crashed near Mt. Fuji?  A 747 that
>lost most of its tail, and on the way down, the passengers had
>time to write notes before they died?  Several hundred people
>died.
>
    Remember the UAL flight  which bought the farm at
    O'Hare...and the passengers could watch the entire happening on
    the in-cabin television which was on at the time?

    How about the Eastern flight which crashed at Greensboro because
    the flight crew was arguing politics at the time?

    How about UAL 533 which crashed short of Midway?

    How about Eastern 401 which crashed in the Fla swamps.

    How about the flight at DFW (which still has pieces scattered
    around north of the airport...right near the freeway) which
    bit the dust

    How about the Eastern flight which picked a Piper out of midair
    because the Eastern pilot was looking at a warning lite at the
    time (Greensboro).  


>I take no position about the relative safety of various airlines,
>but I don't see how anyone missed such a heart-rending event.
>
   Or any of them.   

   I must say though, that the JAL response was the most
   self-blaming of any major one.  The US airlines attempt to blame
   anyone BUT themselves, JAL took the blame for what may have been
   a design fault.  

   And their in-flight service is among the best I've had.  Although
   strangely, the Japanese passengers tend to ask for "western"
   meals and the Americans tend to ask for "Japanese style" meals.
   The flight crews are among the best I've had, and you don't get
   the impression that they fly to work on brooms...unlike a few US
   airlines I could name.

   JAL is the best ride from here to Tokyo...and I've flown the
   competition as well.
Xref: sparky ba.general:4319 misc.kids:25589 misc.legal:18362