HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rcsjp@cgl.rmit.oz.au (Jason Pouflis)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.theory,soc.culture.greek
Subject: How can I tell if I'm Greek or Macedonian?
Date: 11 Sep 92 01:25:32 GMT
Organization: Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology

So,
How can I tell if I'm Greek or Macedonian?
Heritage wise I mean?
I was born in Australia, but my Father and Ancestors came from around Edessa.

In this region Greek is the official language, but it is commonplace to 
speak a combination (possibly a Creole) of Macedonian and Greek.

So what is it that would make me Greek or Macedonian?
The culture, language, the gene lines (parentage), place of residence, religion?
what?
What is the difference?
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: jason@ab20.larc.nasa.gov (Jason Austin)
Subject: Re: Bush is pro-child molestors?
Reply-To: Jason C. Austin <j.c.austin@larc.nasa.gov>
Organization: NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton, VA
	<JASON.92Sep10113741@ab20.larc.nasa.gov>
	<farenebt.716140581@craft.camp.clarkson.edu>
	<JASON.92Sep10153211@ab20.larc.nasa.gov>
	<farenebt.716171756@craft.camp.clarkson.edu>
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 19:05:23 GMT

In article <farenebt.716171756@craft.camp.clarkson.edu> farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Bri Farenell) writes:
-> jason@ab20.larc.nasa.gov (Jason Austin) writes:
-> 
-> I disagree. Then again, it would have to pay the temporary much less
-> than it would have had to pay the regular worker. I contest that the person
-> being paid makes a big difference. I would prefer PAID leave but I can
-> understand why some would think it's an unfair burden. I think UNPAID
-> leave is much more fair and palatable to most. 

	That's assuming you can get a temporary to do the same
quality and quantity of work as the permanent employee.  Working as a
temporary myself while I was going to college and working with
temporaries at previous jobs, I know this is almost impossible except
for fairly simple jobs.  One slow person tends to slow the entire
business down.  Good management can handle people being gone but not
without control.

-> 
-> >	Rush Limbaugh made a good point about this bill today.  Bush
-> >has vetoed this bill in the past and the Democrats know he will veto
-> >it now.  They want him to veto it, because when he does veto it, they
-> >will scream, "SEE! He doesn't care about family values!"  The
-> >Democrats know there's a sucker born every minute.
->  	
-> So what? 
-> 
-> I admit that the timing is political. But then again, so is
-> Bush's veto (he wants to be pro-business). That is a cop-out response.
-> At least, I'll admit the real motivations behind the Dems move. Their
-> motivation doesn't change the fact that I think the family leave bill
-> is a good idea nor should it change your mind that it's not. The timing
-> shouldn't change the worthiness of the bill in anyone's mind.
-> 
-> Besides, what if the Dems think they have enough votes to override?

	
	I threw the election politics in, because I thought it was a
good point.  Timing does affect the way I view the sincerity of those
that submitted the bill.  It makes me wonder if they think it's a good
idea, or if they're doing it for political gain.  It's the same as the
Iran Contra affair which suddenly appeared again.
--
Jason C. Austin
j.c.austin@larc.nasa.gov

Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: fehr@ms.uky.edu (Jeff Davis)
Subject: Re: The draft and Vietnam
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 20:35:46 GMT
Organization: The Gizmonic Institute

In article <1992Sep11.170722.14124@anasazi.com> john@anasazi.com writes:
>
>]"Beating up on Bill Clinton over whether he evaded the
>]draft during the Vietnam War is like taking the strap
>
>Bill Clinton is being beaten up for being dishonest about how he got
>out of it.

Opponents are attempting to beat up on Clinton because nothing else
seems to be working. The draft is a non-issue to most folks.
Although it might be nice to find a use for all of the froth
that is being produced.
-- 
Coach Jeff Davis <davis@keats.ca.uky.edu> Season: 0-1 Lifetime: 0-3 
I'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you all to repent from your sins.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Top 10: Why Bush should be baseball commissioner
From: adams@spss.com (Steve Adams)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 18:57:47 GMT
Organization: SPSS Inc.

rja@redwood26.cray.com (Russ Anderson) writes:


>Top 10 Reasons Bush should be the new baseball commissioner
>-----------------------------------------------------------

>10. No Congress to deal with.
Yes, but the owners are probably the ONLY group more childish than the
Congress.  And more out of control.

>9.  He won't be asked to make any decisions.
Right.  He just needs to say 'Ja wohl, meine Herren' and march in lockstep
with the owners.

>8.  He can bail out his other son for a change.
Hey, the Rangers just got Jose Canseco...

>7.  Someone has to bounce out the first ball of the season.
Clinton can handle it...

>6.  He won't let Willie Horton play in the majors.
What about Al Gore?  He started it...

 -Steve
--
 The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
                        -------------------
     adams@spss.com                           Phone: (312) 329-3522
     Steve Adams                              Fax:   (312) 329-3558
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:43911 alt.politics.elections:12484 alt.politics.clinton:4146 alt.politics.marrou:1054 alt.politics.bush:4170
From: lazarus@ocf.berkeley.edu (Andrew J. Lazarus)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.marrou,alt.politics.bush
Subject: Re: Why I cannot vote Democratic
Date: 5 Sep 92 17:11:05 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: avalanche.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Sep3.161101.4530@esd.dl.nec.com> mlee@esd.dl.nec.com (Michael Lee) writes:

It's generally a waste of time to reply to aspirants to the Libertarian
version of Heaven, which I find most unappealing, but

>If the personal income tax were completely eliminated, the total taxes
>would be about 33% of total income.  This is what the serfs paid in the
>Middle Ages in Europe.

I'd like some documentation about the rates paid by serfs. Your
statistic buried in here misses two major points:

1. As wealth increases, people can afford more in taxes (progressivity).
Hence 33% of the earnings of serfs impinged badly on their ability to
live. 33% on a computer scientists' income doesn't.

2. I imagine the number is bogus, anyway. Does it include the many taxes
on goods paid by serfs? Rates on necessities like salt were enormous?
Does it include conscripted unpaid labor?

Are you a medieval studies major or is this some factoid from the
Libertarian party platform.

andy
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:44437 alt.politics.usa.misc:5 alt.politics.usa.constitution:17 alt.politics.reform:2 alt.politics.libertarian:3 alt.politics.org.misc:3
From: jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.org.misc
Subject: Five new alt.politics groups have been created
Date: 9 Sep 92 22:10:08 GMT
Reply-To: jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland

alt.politics.usa.misc		Misc. USA politics.

A group for discussions on politics specific to USA - federal domestic
issues, foreign politics, politics in areas / states, general
development and political atmosphere.

alt.politics.usa.constitution	U.S. Constitutional politics

Discussion on the role of the U.S. Constitution as a major document
shaping the happenings in the country.  Theoretical discussions on
that role as well as practical reports on the role and interpretations
belong into the group, as well as methods of supporting USA as a
country based on the principles of the constitution.

alt.politics.reform		Political reform

Discussions on how to achieve political reforms, what tools to use,
when reforms are desirable as well as political reforms currently
going on around the world (like in the x-USSR).

alt.politics.libertarian	The libertarian ideology

The libertarian ideology aims for limited government and individual
and economic freedom.  	With more than 80 libertarian organizations
there is a growing interest in the ideology around the world.

alt.politics.org.misc		Political organizations

Generic group for discussions on political organizations of economic,
military or other kind - examples include NATO, GATT, European
Council, OECD etc.

//Jyrki
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:44664 alt.politics.elections:12800 alt.politics.clinton:4821 alt.politics.marrou:1103 alt.politics.bush:4656
From: lazarus@ocf.berkeley.edu (Andrew J. Lazarus)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.marrou,alt.politics.bush
Subject: Re: Wage slaves vs. serfs (Was: Why I cannot vote Democratic)
Date: 10 Sep 1992 23:33:54 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
NNTP-Posting-Host: avalanche.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Sep9.212634.26971@esd.dl.nec.com> mlee@esd.dl.nec.com (Michael Lee) writes:
>From article <18apn9INNgrs@agate.berkeley.edu>, by lazarus@ocf.berkeley.edu (Andrew J. Lazarus):
>> In article <1992Sep3.161101.4530@esd.dl.nec.com> mlee@esd.dl.nec.com (Michael Lee) writes:
 
>>>If the personal income tax were completely eliminated, the total taxes
                                                              ^^^^^
>>>would be about 33% of total income.  This is what the serfs paid in the
>>>Middle Ages in Europe.
 
>That means it is supposed to be big enough to do *only* what is absolutely
>necessary to serve the people.

As I said, I don't wish to discuss Librtarian heaven, I just hope never
to live there.

>Check the library.  Look under feudalism, manorial taxes, etc.

>Serfs worked six (6) days per week.
>The output of two (2) days was delivered to the lord of the manor.

As I thought, you are comparing apples to oranges. You have left out the
taxes the serf paid other than unpaid labor. For example, in France
there were riots just over the tax on salt. It isn't fair to compare one
type of medieval tax to all types of modern tax.

Say, what is the libtarian explanaton for the droit de seigneur and how
much is it figured into the tax calculations?

andy
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: g92b8843@giraffe.ru.ac.za (MR PA BAISE)
Subject: Hong Kong 
Keywords: Independence; invade
Organization: Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 23:48:38 GMT

Hi

I was just wondering what would happen if Hong Kong declared independence 
from the U.K. before 1997, just as Rhodesia (now Zimbabwe) did. Would 
China invade militarily? What would the U.K. govt. do?  Please post opinions.

- Paul

Paul Baise                          E-Mail : G92b8843@giraffe.ru.ac.za
Department Of Computer Science      Tel : +27-461-22023 (ext 292)
Rhodes University                   Fax : +27-461-25049
P.O. Box 94
Grahamstown, 6140
South Africa
From: drm@esl.com (Don McGregor )
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Was Clinton a Moral Draft Dodger?
Date: 8 Sep 92 16:31:47 GMT
Reply-To: drm@esl.com

In article <1992Sep7.195739.14804@cbnews.cb.att.com> jmk@cbnews.cb.att.com  
(joseph.m.knapp) writes:
> drm@esl.com writes:
> >Joe Sixpack in Duluth:  "I'd like to vote for Clinton, but he has a  
> >history of being a slippery guy who's out for himself.If he manipulated  
> >the system to avoid all military duty, why should I believe he has the  
> >moral courage tomake hard decisions as president?Bad decisions at18 are  
>>one thing,but it looks to me like he's lying through his teeth about the  
> >specifics of the draft issue and his motivations for avoiding it even  
> >now." 
> 
>Sure,that's the Bush campaign's Current Fantasy. Is it really playing out
> that way though? The only one calling Clinton out on the carpet is hired
>gun Charles Black.Oh, also Bush partisans who will delight in any kind of
> sniping, the sillier the better. 
> 
Clinton is taking some hits on the recent LA Times story, in which alleged  
that his uncle was pulling strings to get his draft physical delayed and  
to get him into a naval reserve position.  The press has been hounding him  
on that for the last week or two.

When debate time rolls around, one of the reporters will lob that question  
at him and he'll have to answer it on national TV.  

Voters care a lot about "character."  It doesn't look like Clinton  
displayed much in his attempts to avoid the draft, and even less in his  
current version of the events.  His uncle is pulling strings like crazy,  
gets his draft physical delayed by about a year--Clinton's was delayed by  
more than any other person's in that district--lines up a naval reserve  
slot for him, and he didn't know anything about it?  His ROTC vs. Draft  
lottery account looks specious too. (As I recall he said he opted for the  
lottery before he found out what his number was, but his infamous letter  
resigning from ROTC was postmarked a day or two after the lottery.)

Combine that with his tendency to be oh-so-clever by shading the truth,  
and I think voters have reason to worry.  Eg, his accounts of drug use.  I  
don't give a damn about whether he took a few tokes in college.  Gore  
admitted in '88 that he had smoked MJ too, and that's not an issue.  But  
Clinton tried to dodge the issue when he was asked if he had ever used  
illegal drugs by responding that "he had never broken the laws of the US."   
He smoked (but didn't inhale!) in the UK.

--
Don McGregor
drm@esl.com  
Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:45312 alt.rush-limbaugh:4760 alt.politics.elections:13061 alt.politics.clinton:5304 alt.politics.bush:5030
From: mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM (Mark Wilson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush
Subject: Re: SC rally: "We don't want a draft dodger for president!"
Date: 14 Sep 92 16:53:20 GMT
Organization: NCR Engineering and Manufacturing Atlanta -- Atlanta, GA

In <farenebt.716390287@craft.camp.clarkson.edu> farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Bri Farenell) writes:

>I hope so. However, you are neglecting to mention one of the biggest
>costs in medical care, drugs
>In the 1980's, drug costs went up something like
>20 times the rate of inflation.

A huge percentage of this increase can be attributed to insurance.  Which
goes back to point one from the previous post.  There was the case of a
common innoculation (DPT, I believe), 1 person in a million was having a
bad reaction to the shot.  No one ever proved that there was something
defective in the shot or in how the dose was manufactured (I don't believe
they even tried).  All the lawyers had to do was to show that the reaction
was caused by the innoculation.  All three companies that were making the
stuff stopped doing so on the advice of their lawyers.  After a panic 
ensued in the pediatric community, the government passed some form of
legal immunity and now one company has started to make the stuff again.


-- 
--Mark
My opinions are mine, all mine.  Unless someone else claims them first.

Xref: sparky talk.politics.misc:45075 ca.politics:7696 ba.politics:5240
From: mikea@zorba.gvg.tek.com (Michael P. Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,ca.politics,ba.politics
Subject: Why do we need the Fed. Gov't? (Was: Run conservatives, run away!)
Date: 12 Sep 92 22:36:03 GMT
Followup-To: talk.politics.misc
Distribution: na
Organization: Grass Valley Group, Grass Valley, CA

In article <1992Sep11.201112.21467@PA.dec.com> gnn@wsl.dec.com (George Neville-Neil) writes:

>Take it back from the fed and let the local gov'ts deal with it.

Just got back from a Civil War re-enactment up here in Nevada City for the
Constitution Day celebration, and it got me to wondering what things would
be like if the boys in grey had won. Maybe California would be its own
country as well. 

At the very least, we wouldn't be listening to the lies from presidential
hopefuls as they shake hands in the Dipwad, Iowa Dairy Queen. Though I
guess then we'd just have our own local infestation of liars, albeit easier
to spot and eradicate.
								MPA
 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.bush
From: rcollins@encore.com (Roger Collins)
Subject: Re: SC rally: "We don't want a draft dodger for president!"
Reply-To: rcollins@1.com
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 20:04:48 GMT

farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Bri Farenell) writes:
|> Clinton's plan
|> helps those who can't afford insurance but doesn't affect those who can.

Thank God!  There really is such a thing as a free lunch!

I guess making me *pay* for it doesn't really affect me.

I want a law passed taking money from people with last names that start
with F and giving it to people with last names starting with C.
This will only give the latter group more money and will not affect
the former group.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,ca.politics,ba.politics,soc.motss
From: twpierce@unix.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: The Harrassing Phone Calls Can Stop NOW!
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 16:34:33 GMT

In article <1992Sep6.221015.6614@tc.cornell.edu> shore@theory.TC.Cornell.EDU (Melinda Shore) writes:

>so there was certainly no
>question of my 'flaunting it' at the office (still wearing
>your wedding ring, Phool?).

The real question is, what does his boyfriend think about it?

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "I don't know how much support NAMBLA
\  / twpierce@unix.amherst.edu /  has in the gay community."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Clayton Cramer, August 1992
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,ca.politics,ba.politics,soc.motss
From: michael@resonex.com (Michael Bryan)
Subject: Re: The Harrassing Phone Calls Can Stop NOW!
Organization: Resonex Inc., Sunnyvale CA
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 10:36:22 GMT

In article <_svn4fn.phil@netcom.com> phil@netcom.com (Phil Ronzone) writes:
>First, it wasn't the "negro fascist lobby", but rather what we might call the
>rich, white, guilt-laden knee-jerk liberal lobby that got those laws passed.

Oh, so sorry.  I forgot that the only the white people were concerned
about what happened to the black people.  The black people obviously
resented any attempt to have their rights protected, and were not the
ones pusing for legislation to protect them from discrimination.

Sounds like you're the one living in a fantasy world.

>druggies, but you know, it is a bad law. And so are the "anti-discrimination"
>laws, which of course, merely codify racial presence into law.

I agree that there are problems with anti-discrimination laws.  It's a
damn shame that we have to have laws just so various groups of people
have some recourse against unfair discrimination.  But as long as
bigotry and hatred exist, and result in various classes of people
being denied equal rights, the laws *are* needed.  Only when we see
an end to this foolish bigotry and close-mindedness will I believe
otherwise.

Personally, I'd much rather see laws which said something to the effect
of "Job hiring/firing/promoting/etc decisions can only be made based
on factors directly related to the ability of the person to do said
job.  Renting decisions can only be based on factors directly
related to the tenants ability to pay the rent and properly maintain
the property."  The problem with such laws is that they are virtually
impossible to enforce, due to the way people could twist the meaning
of what was relevant to the job.  Hence the need for laws which name
specific things which are considiered illegal discrimination.  Is it
perfect?  No.  But I don't think there are any reasonable alternatives.

-- 
Michael Bryan  michael@resonex.com  "Milk and Cheese in '92!"  |     ,_,
"Lovers are like... dentures.  You don't want them in your     |    /oo \
mouth all night, but you sure as hell want them within arm's   |    <>__|
reach in the morning!"  --- Miss Elmira Gulch                  |    |  U|
From: mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM (Mark Wilson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Was Clinton a Moral Draft Dodger? (was Re: Better Off Than Four Years Ago NOT)
Date: 14 Sep 92 19:16:25 GMT
Organization: NCR Engineering and Manufacturing Atlanta -- Atlanta, GA

In <lavnctINN96t@spim.mips.com> mpolen@suntory.mti.sgi.com (Michael Polen) writes:

>(2) Clinton did not fail to live up to his obligations to ROTC.  It was
>a voluntary program and had no obligations.  ROTC was a college class for
>units.  There were no requirements to go into the military, no requirements
>to stay in ROTC, no ...

What school did you go to.  It is true that some high schools have a form
of ROTC that has no obligation.  In every college, university or
institute that I have ever heard of, joining the ROTC does entail a
military commitment upon graduation.  Under some conditions the ROTC will
also pay, or help to pay for your tuition.  ROTC is a voluntary organization
in that no one is forced to join, but once you have joined (ie signed on
the dotted line), you do have obligations.  Just because (to my knowledge)
the government has never prosecuted someone for not living up to their
obligations does not mean that the government does not have that right.

-- 
--Mark
My opinions are mine, all mine.  Unless someone else claims them first.
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc
From: nelson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson)
Subject: Re: CNN Anchor Admits Pro-Clinton Bias
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:03:32 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Corporation, Chelmsford, MA

In article <1992Sep11.052247.5310@brownfield.glv.com> <jbrow@glv.com> writes:
>
>Many people in this country are fairly libertarian in their beliefs.

   "Many" is a nice safe word.  In a nation of 240 million 1% would 
   represent "many".  


---peter

Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.theory
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Canadian vs US health care
Reply-To: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Organization: Curious Goods (formerly Louis Vendredi Antiques)
Distribution: usa
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 18:53:44 GMT

elson_p@apollo.hp.com (Peter Nelson) writes:
>
>  But most national health care is like a giant HMO, and HMO's do not
>  tolerate this much patient control.  My approach requires flexible
>  access to doctors (especially since part of the task is finding a
>  doctor who will tolerate a patient like me!) and labs.  This is
>  easier to achieve in the US system than the Canadian one.

Actually, Peter, your responsibility as a medical consumer is
admirable and I take my hat off to you ... however, the point that you
raise is not realistic, as you can open up any local Canadian city's
telephone book (yellow pages) and find specialists listed ... I have
stole^H^H^H^H^Hgotten a couple of telephone books during trips back up
north, and the Montreal Bell Canada yellow pages are full of doctors
who list their specialty.  Here's a multiple line ad:

	DUMAS, GASTON DR
	Dermatologist
	Laser Cutaneous Surgery
	Lipo Suction

	12245 Grenet		332-4545

You can probably get the provincial College of Physicians and Surgeons
directory from a library if you want more detail.  But if the doctor
sends you back to a GP first, that's their business and you can't
blame it on the government since they have no say on how doctors
practice; since their egoes are as big as American doctors, they'd
be going ballistic otherwise.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare				
> gld@cunixB.cc.columbia.EDU		Oct 26/92: Just say "OUI!"
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			(Let's worry about the economy!)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc