From: dasaxe@milton.u.washington.edu (Daniel Perreault)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball.college
Subject: Re: Prop 48...
Date: 25 Jul 92 08:29:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Jul25.082913.7452
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle

In article <19556@optima.cs.arizona.edu> gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell) writes:
>In article <1992Jul24.185846.14062@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu>, u_nique@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Jerray Wei) writes:
>>I don't buy any of this culturally biased stuff either.  People have advantages
>> and disadvantages wherever they come from, but the basic skills needed to
>> survive in this country don't change.
>
> Yeah - its all just hogwash right? No such thing as cultural bias right Jerray?
>Nah.... everyone is the same and all tests are the same.... But I'm sure you
>know something that the folks who study testing bias don't know.
>
>                       gln
>
>

Now let's get a grip here GaRy, I don't believe the original writer in any
way implied that there are no cultural biases, in fact I believe he said
"People have advantages and disadvantages whereever they come from..." In
otherwords, that some people have advantages(pick an ethnic majority) and
some people have disadvantages(pick an ethnic minority).

However, we are not talking about brain surgery here GaRy, I assume you took
the SAT at some point in your educational career, getting a 700 total score
is a pretty minimal task. You may try to argue that the people taking the
test, say first generation asians, have a disadvantage because they don't
read english well, but the test can be administered in several languages,
and besides like it or not statistically the people that are getting nailed
here are predominantly black, and I suspect few of them are not native
english speakers.

So lets say, these people cannot relate to the types of questions on the
exam. Ok, lets assume they don't answer shit on the verbal, that gives them
200 points, so they have to make up 500 points on the Math. Or about 50
points above the national average. This should be achievable for ANYONE
who takes the test seriously. If a person were so mathematically inept that
they lack the ability to get a 500 on the Math with concerted effort, ignoring
the verbal does not belong in college. College is not a right, that is why
there is competative entry to 4 year institutions. Even if these people simply
are not test takers, there are a variety of avenues to get to college, such
as CC's. Certainly that has not hindered many players in the NBA currently.

But lets go back to the test GaRy, lets look at the verbal section for a
minute. Even those people who contend the test is biased argue that the
questions that are so are primarily ones involving reading conprehension and
interpretation. That leaves several sections on simple vocabulary that are
not significantly biased. Certainly not enough to keep someone from getting
say an extra 150 points there, so they could split the sides evenly.

Besides GaRy, those experts who claim the tests are biased do not contend
that the injured party is at such a disadvantage that they cannot get a
700, rather that with competative entry in colleges the injured party is
at a disadvantage competing against people in the 1000+ range.

So what is the problem? Is it the myriad people who pander to these athletically
gifted youth in junior high and convince them the only place they need to work
is on the court? Or the teachers and systems that let them get as far as
high school graduation without the ability to get 700 on an SAT? Or idiots
on computers who tell them that they are being racially discriminated against
by a test so it isn't fair and thus they don't have to do shit?

Take your pick GaRy, but you tell me you honestly believe that someone with
a high school education, no learning disability and a concerted desire to
get at least 700 on an SAT who speaks english as thier native language
couldn't do so. I don't believe it, tell me why you do.



Dan Perreault
dasaxe@u.washington.edu
" Are you sure you want to put inventor here under occupation?"
" Why does unemployed sound better?"