HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Philosophy of Nationhood
Date: 8 Jan 1993 18:26:50 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu



a.Faris@trl.oz.au  writes:

>According to the Torah, God gave the land of Palestine which was occupied
>by the Canaanites to the decendants of Abraham and more specifically that
>of Isaac. Circumcision of males was the sign between God and Abraham as to
>honor that promise. Converts into Judaism are not decendants of Isaac and
>it is beleived that many Eastern European Jews are converts and are Khazars.
>Hence:

>1. Do these people have the right to kick the indiginious Palestinians out
>of their place of birth and be part of the Jewish Nation?.

>2. Since they are not decendants of Isaac, should they be included in the
>Jewish Nation?.

>According to the Qur'an, the Arabs of Arabia are decendants of Abraham also
>and more specifically that of Ismail. The decendants of Ismail are Muslims
>and a certain percentage of Palestinians are decendants of Ismail.
>However, the decendants of Ismail have been also promised their share of
>Palestine, and if they choose to be part of an Islamic nation; then:

>1. Do the converts into Islam have the right to kick a Jew out of Palestine
>and be part of a Palestinian Nation which is Islamic?.

>2. Since those converts may not be decendants of Ismail or Sam, should they
>be included in the Palestinian Nation which is Islamic?.

>Hence:

>Can or should Nationhood be based or religious affiliation?.

If you don't get it, it should be based on  s e c u l a r i s m ...

btw, don't christians have a share of the pie?

>A.Faris 
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: guay@fraser.sfu.ca (Tim Guay)
Subject: Mail lists
Summary: Mail lists
Keywords: Mail lists
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 17:40:00 GMT

Hi, I'm looking for mail lists on the mideast that I can subscribe to.

Thanks
	Tim
	guay@sfu.ca

Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6328 talk.politics.mideast:24925
From: aaldoubo@copper.denver.colorado.edu (Shaqeeqa)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: WHERE DO THE "Palestinians" COME FROM?
Date: 7 Jan 93 08:45:50 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.arabic
Organization: University of Colorado at Denver

In article <240@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP> ohayon@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP (Tsiel Ohayon) writes:
>
>Uh oh, another intellectual Arab woman on the net. After Anisa, we have Rita.
>Any relationship to the famous Israeli singer :-)?

Well, I'm not gone yet (at least until one of your Mossad agents comes to
take me away) ... Rita was responding the same way that the posters on
s.c.j. do.  Why do you have to react so sarcastically all the time?
 
>I didn't know that any Arabs liked Israel. This is new to me, please explain.

What about your Druze colleagues?

>As for never seeing people like us, are you talking about Jews? Israelis?
>I suggest you get out more often, or uncover your eyes from under your 
>tchador :-). Just go the Lebanon, violence their was/is common place.

Maybe she doesn't wear the chador!  She could be a Xian, Tsiel.  Stereotypical
are we?

>I suggest you do the same. Apparently you've been asleep all your life, just
>woke up and have not had time to wash your eyes! To paraphrase Shamir:
>"Arabs suck Jewish hatred from their mothers' breasts". He said something 
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>They are just pawns. Saddam (ima'h shemo) proved it. Or was that too long ago
>already?

I'd like to erase Saddam's name also, Tsiel.

>My guess is that the stories will be quite different. The Arab history books
>are probably closer to Sinbad the Sailor and the the Counts of 1001 nights.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You really are biggotted, aren't you, Tsiel?

Anisa

Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: malik@wilbur.psu.edu (Sohail Malik)
Subject: Hieroglyphics
Organization: Penn State University, Center for Academic Computing
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 93 01:50:01 GMT

A friend came back from Egypt with a necklace that claims to spell
an English name in what looks like hieroglphyic characters.

This sounds like a fabricated hieroglyphic to English letter mapping
for the benefit of purveyors of tourist items because each of those
characters is the equivalent of a meaningful word, isn't it?

Can anyone confirm whether this is indeed the case?

Thanks.

-Sohail
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6502 misc.jobs.misc:8635 rec.travel:17633
From: richardg@idca.tds.philips.nl (Richard Grear)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,misc.jobs.misc,rec.travel
Subject: Re: Work in Kuwait - info' wanted
Date: 12 Jan 93 11:20:31 GMT
Reply-To: richardg@nofssrv.syssup.tds.philips.nl (Richard Grear)
Disclaimer: This is not necessarily the opinion of anyone else

In <frank2.42@odie.ee.wits.ac.za> frank2@odie.ee.wits.ac.za writes:

>I have heard stories of short term contract jobs being offered in Kuwait. 
>The work is apparently menial and very tough. The good part is the reported 
>huge sums of money that are being paid.

>Anyone know anything about this?

>Please e-mail me.

I would not bank on it. The tendency in that region is to import hundreds of
Phillipinos, Indians, Pakistanis etc. who are prepared to do this work for
very little (comparatively)

I also have a feeling that some of the Arab states blacklist visitors to Israel
*and* SA.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In antici........                                                  ......pation
                         richardg@nofssrv.syssup.tds.philips.nl                
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In antici........                                                  ......pation
                         richardg@nofssrv.syssup.tds.philips.nl                
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: eggertj@moses.atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert x6127 g41)
Subject: Re: WHERE DO THE "Palestinians" COME FROM?
Followup-To: soc.culture.arabic
Reply-To: eggertj@atc.ll.mit.edu
Organization: MIT Lincoln Lab - Group 41
	<EGGERTJ.93Jan4111603@moses.atc.ll.mit.edu> <4624@bimacs.BITNET>
	<93005.161146RHOMSIE@auvm.american.edu> <240@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP>
	<EGGERTJ.93Jan6170921@moses.atc.ll.mit.edu> <244@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP>
Date: 7 Jan 93 00:10:02

In article <244@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP> ohayon@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP (Tsiel Ohayon) writes:
>   Israeli Arabs do not serve in the Army, unless they make a formal request.
>   Druzes and Bedouins do on the other hand. Druzes are not Arabs! They are
>   a sect of their own. Bedouins, I don't really know.

You are confusing the Arab nationality with the Moslem religion.
Druses certainly are Arabs.  They speak Arabic.  The Druse religion is
a breakaway sect of Islam.  Arabs are typically Moslem, but many are
Christians and some are Druses.  The Druses of Israel serve in the
Israeli armed forces, I think since 1956, at the demand of the Druse
leadership.  Most of the Druses serve in a special minority unit
(shades of the American black units of WWII!).

>   What the Rita  was saying in her article is that the Arabs didn't like the
>   government of Israel not the land, so let's not change the context.
>   I guess you should learn to read better.

Even that explanation is wrong.  I don't know how you can pretend to
speak for Israeli Arabs.  There are many who love their country, and
many who have already died for it.  Some even support the Zionist
nature of the government of Israel.  (Indeed, you can't be an Israeli
Arab politician and say otherwise!)

--
=Jim  eggertj@atc.ll.mit.edu (Jim Eggert)
From: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: Al-Baqarah #143
Date: 8 Jan 1993 18:24:25 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris) writes:

In article <1ifikpINNe8i@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Hamaza H. Salah) writes:
|> Al Baqarah #143
|> 
|> Found this interesting fact about this verse in Sorat Al-Baqarah:
|> 
|> 143. And thus We have made you a medium (just) nation that you
|> may be the bearers of witness to the people and (that) the
|> Apostle may be a bearer of witness to you; and We did not make
|> that which you would have to be the qiblah but that We might
|> distinguish him who follows the Apostle from him who turns back
|> upon his heels, and this was surely hard except for those whom
|> Allah has guided aright; and Allah was not going to make your
|> faith to be fruitless; most surely Allah is Affectionate,
|> Merciful to the people.
|>      
|> Note that the total number of verses in this Sorat is 286.
|> Half of it is 143, which is the number of this verse.  This
|> verse also says "And thus we have made you a  m e d i u m  
|> nation."  
|> 
|> "Can't they study the Quran?  And if it were not the words of 
|> God, they would have found so many differences and disputes."
|> -- 

)Some one has posted a similar analysis on the Jewish and Christian books
)and found that all verses are a multiple of seven. If this is used as proof
)that it is the word of God, then Islam cannot continiously claim that the
)Jewish and Christian books have been modified.

Who said, "i am posting this to prove that it is the word of God....?"
i just found it interesting to tell arab muslims it is "interesting."

)Hence, We can conclude that Muhammad is not the awaited Messiah, as it has been
)claimed by Dr. Siddiqui a number of times on SRI.

conclude what ???  what a logic from a highly educated social behavior
knowlegeble intellectual?

you're jumping from one subject to another...

)A.Faris
-- 
                  ___________________ cl056@cleveland.Freenet.Edu _____________
                 (______   _  |   _  |_
_____ H A M Z A ________) |-| |_ |-| | |
From: zzaaskk@v2.cgu.mcc.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: salAmu `alaykum
Date: 12 Jan 93 17:44:44 GMT
Organization: Manchester Computing Centre CGU

In article <1is8uuEINNg5u@uni-erlangen.de>, rtrisack@cip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Robert Risack) writes:
> al-ssalAmu `alaykum
> Wa-alaikum   Al-Salam

> I just want to ask, if there are some arabs coming to InterNet from
> arabic countries. All arabs I read postings from are working in Amerika,
> Australia, France, or Ireland. Is there no arabic Institute with InterNet
> connection?

I have seen postingings from Saudia Arabia, King Fahad University in Dahran
on GIS-L at LISTSERV in Buffallo. 
And from Cairo University, Dept of Architecture, on MSA. USENET is not 
available in many British Universities so I think the probability 
of Arab Countries getting it will be that much less.


> bye
> ---
>     |/.         ..                |Robert Risack
>  \ s|  __| |   \__/ __| o |       |-------------------------------------
>   --' / .. /       /  . / /       |rtrisack@cip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de


Kamie Kitmitto
From: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: What is  H a m a s  ??
Date: 7 Jan 93 20:53:41 GMT
Organization: AT&T

Aziz Faris writes:
>Hamaza H Salah writes:
>> Jews beleive that Ozir was the son of God, and christians beleive in the
>>trinity and some others beleive in God to be the jesus,

  To be precise, some Jews consider Ezra to be God, and almost all Christians
associate Jesus (PBUH) in worship. There are a few exceptions.

>If you call Jews and Christians Mushrikeen, how is it that the Qur'an also
>calls them the "People of the book". Isn't there a contradiction here?

  Where is the contradiction? The same Qur'an also says:

  "They have rejected (qad kafara), those who say that Allah is the Messiah,
   the son of Maryam."

  "They have rejected, those who say that Allah is one of three."

  Who said the beliefs of the people of the book were true? If they were they
would be called Muslims instead.

> Also as I understand, in the opening prayer of the Qur'an, Muhammad himself
>is praying to God to be kind on him as he is kind to them. How could you call
>Jews and Christians as such?.

  Where did you read this? This is not true. In any case, the followers of
Jesus, Moses and all other Messengers of God (PBUT) before Muhammad (PBUH)
were good, and they are considered as much our brothers as any Muslim. They
were Muslim and they worshipped non but God. However, we believe that modern
Judaism has strayed from the message of Judaism and has fallen victim to
numerous distortions; we also believe that modern Christianity has by and
large forgotten its monotheistic roots and its laws and has falled victim
to concepts of paganism it was initially charged with eradicating.

  Jesus (PBUH) is my brother in Islam, he is innocent of the slander made
in his name: that he claimed divinity.

>Mushrikeen as you point out are those who attempt to divide God into a number
>of pieces and are Polytheists. How is an Atheist or an Agnostic treated, it
>seems they do not fit that catagory.

  They are not mushrikeen (associators) at all, but they are rejectors
(kuffar) nontheless.

>Also, is a "Good being" only a "Religious being" or a "Muslim being" or a
>good being can be any person?.

  A good being is a person who seeks the best action for the sake of God
and performs it for the sake of God. A person who performs a good action
for the sake of material gain, or because of fear of reprisal is not doing
a genuinely good deed. A person who seeks to do things for the sake of God
seeks to know what God's commandments are, and follows them when he finds
them. I personally feel that any person who truly seeks guidance is good,
even if he makes an honest mistake and ends up unintentionally doing
something bad instead. Good people don't have to be Muslim, but a good
Muslim will be a Mu'min and a good nonMuslim will seek guidance, and if he
encounters Islam, he will accept it and become a good Mu'min. You can't be
correctly informed about Islam, reject it and be good.


Mazen Mokhtar
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: ehrlich@bimacs.BITNET (Gideon Ehrlich)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
Subject: Re: WHERE DO THE "Palestinians" COME FROM?
Date: 11 Jan 93 09:46:35 GMT
Organization: Math department, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, ISRAEL

In article <244@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP> ohayon@jcpltyo.JCPL.CO.JP (Tsiel
Ohayon) writes:

>
>Israeli Arabs do not serve in the Army, unless they make a formal
> request.

Tsiel is right. Arabs do have the privilage to serve in the Israeli
army , as well as in the Israeli police , Israeli education system and
Israeli health system according to their free willo only.

>Druzes and Bedouins do on the other hand.
>  Druzes are not Arabs! They are a sect of their own.

Right!

And so are Cherkesses , Alawins, Gypsies, .... and you should have no
"Arabs".


> Bedouins, I don't really know.

Bedouins are the only real "Arabs" they arrived to our land during the
last centuries from Yemman and Saudi Arabiamainly through Sini desert.
Till the begining of this century they were the only ones fere called
"Arabs" Look for that at Encyclopedia Britanica 1910 , plopulation.

>Tsiel

Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6474 talk.politics.mideast:25147
From: proberts@informix.com (Paul Roberts)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: WHERE DO THE "palestinians" COME FROM?
Date: 8 Jan 93 00:34:57 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.

In article <1993Jan7.194335.20578@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> carasso@Turing.ORG (Roger Carasso) writes:
>
>ISRAEL SURVIVES FOR TWO REASONS:
>
>	1. IT'S TROOPS ARE BETTER TRAINED AND SMARTER.
>	2. DEFENSIVE WARS ARE EASIER TO FIGHT.*
>
>

Having a couple of hundred nuclear weapons may help (Arab nations have
none).
Xref: sparky soc.culture.arabic:6235 talk.politics.mideast:24706
From: abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast
Subject: Re: Name of Palestinian Deportees (part i)
Date: 5 Jan 93 07:17:47 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester (Rochester, NY)

In article <1993Jan5.025223.1840@ennews.eas.asu.edu> makowsky@enuxhb.eas.asu.edu (David Makowsky) writes:
>In article <1993Jan5.022707.27334@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> abde@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Tamer A. Abdelgawad) writes:
>
># In article <1993Jan4.194657.13384@bony1.bony.com> jake@bony1.bony.com (Jake Livni) writes:
> 
># >They should be welcome in their own homeland on the Jordanian-Occupied
># >East Bank of Palestine.  Working to overthrow the local government is
># >enough to make someone person-non-grata in most any country.
>
># Would you find it acceptable if Mario Cuomo deported you from New York to
># say, Alabama?
>
>	Of course no one would find it acceptable if they themselves were
>deported.  That is not a reason to oppose deportations.  I doubt
>everyone who gets imprisoned finds that acceptbale either.  Should we
>let all criminals go free?
>

Please reread the statement and my response.  The argument was that the
deportees should not complain since their homeland is really Jordan.  My
response is intended to demonstrate that this is bad reasoning.  That's all.

># Isn't it your 'homeland' after all?
>
>	I did not realize Hymietown remarks were still in vogue.
>

You are WAY off base here.  Please be careful before accusing people of
antisemitism based on your *own* (completely wrong, BTW) interpretation
of their comments.

># And the 400+ deportees
># were *not* 'convicted' of "Working to overthrow the local government".
>
>	They only wanted to kill the Jews.

They were *convicted* of no such thing.

Tamer Abdelgawad
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast
From: faris@sarcasm.trl.OZ.AU (Aziz Faris)
Subject: Re: He's finally arrived
Reply-To: a.Faris@trl.oz.au 
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne,Australia
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1993 21:25:16 GMT

In article <C0JnvE.D2y@imag.fr>, oueichek@gram (Ibaa Oueichek) writes:
|>   As a side question (this one can be a subject for a debate), does anyone
|> among our fellows s.c.a readers have an experience with teaching their kids
|> how to speak our natif language (Arabic, of course) at the same time with
|> the environment language (in my case French). I know that kids are very
|> good in learning languages but should i start to speak French with him once
|> he starts to pronounce words or should i wait ?. I'm really interested because
|> my son has started to pronounce some words and i have no experience in this
|> field (well, this is our first son, maybe once i have the 10th i'll be enough
|> experienced :-)).

I could tell you how we have done it. We started teaching our two year old
boy easy words in both Arabic and english just to develop his skill of
pronounciation. Then gradually teach him how to say the same thing in both
Arabic and english.

A.Faris
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: mmdh@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (Mazen Mokhtar)
Subject: Re: Al-Baqarah #143
Organization: AT&T
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:08:42 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.224141.16607@trl.oz.au> a.Faris@trl.oz.au  writes:

>Hence, We can conclude that Muhammad is not the awaited Messiah, as it has been
>claimed by Dr. Siddiqui a number of times on SRI.

  Muhammad was never the awaited Messiah. The Messiah was Jesus (PBUH). A
quick glance at a Qur`an should prove my point.

  Muhammad (PBUH) is the final Messenger of God, sent to all of humanity
with the message of guidance and truth. His message confirms and completes
the messages sent before him at the hands of Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus
and other Messengers, may God's blessing and peace be upon them all. He and
all other Messengers of God taught that there is God is one, so worship Him,
obey Him and join no object, animal or human in worship.

  He taught that God, Glorified and Most High, is Merciful and Just. No one
inherits the sin of another; no one inherits the punishment of another. It
is far below the Glory of the Creator of all creation to have a partner or
son. He taught that the essence of Islam is in submission to the Creator and
Sustainer or the worlds, a submission of love; and that nothing may be
obeyed in the disobediance of God.

  A Muslim is not a servant of the world, the world is the servant of the
Muslim. "O world, serve he who serves Me and use he who serves you!"


Mazen Mokhtar

Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: swslr@well.sf.ca.us (Larry Krone)
Subject: Computer Fonts / Translators
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 23:16:09 GMT


I am hosting several Arab students at my house...I have been trying
to find some sort of language translation tool for English to Arabic
or vice-versa...or perhaps Arabic Fonts...Any ideas???

Thanx,

Larry

swslr@well.sf.ca.us
Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic
From: othman@ntrc25.ntrc.ntu.ac.sg (othman (EEE/Div 4))
Subject: Re: He's finally arrived
Organization: Nanyang Technological University - Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 04:13:08 GMT

Ahmed El-Habbash (ahmed@dsg.cs.tcd.ie) wrote:
: First, congratulation, and I hope he (the boy) will be on the right path in
: his life.
Me too.
: 
: Second, we also had a baby girl on the morning of the 30th of December, 1992.

I also had  a boy born on the 2nd Dec weighing 2.5 kg, somewhat prematurely,
but is close to 50cm in length, in fact the longest in the ward.
	I name him Adib which I hope is Islamic and not too Arabic. I believe
it means intelligent in arabic. He somehow is more quiet than his older 
brother and sister, or maybe he is more philosohical, or maybe he is just 
too weak by being born prematurely.
	I'm looking forward to hearing his words, which should be like I and
 his olders who are more talkative.

If I get another girl,hopefully and inshaallah, I'll name her affikah.

anisa recommended anisa but I already had a daughter by the name of anisah so
cannot use that name.
: She was 3.84 Kg and it was a normal delivery, Alhamdulillah. We named
: her Sarah, and I hope Inshallah, she will be on the right path in her 

Is Sarah an arabic /islamic name?


--
Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,
Nanyang Technological University, Singapore 2263.
Internet Email: eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg
Bitnet Email: eoahmad@ntuvax.bitnet

Newsgroups: soc.culture.arabic,talk.politics.mideast