From: lib1p@jane.uh.edu (Tammy Stark Blandino)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc,alt.pagan
Subject: Re: The meaning of "pagan"
Date: 29 Dec 1992 13:24 CST
Organization: University of Houston
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: jane.uh.edu
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    

In article <1992Dec29.114516.6626@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com>, billn@hpcvaac.cv.hp.com (bill nelson) writes...
>lib1p@jane.uh.edu (Tammy Stark Blandino) writes:

..stuff deleted....

> 
>There are those that would disagree.
> 

There are always those that would disagree.  If everyone agreed there 
would be no conflict.  I am beginning to think that the human race
would decay and die if there was no conflict.  If nothing else the 
world would be a hell of a boring place.....However I think I could use 
just a little more "boredom" at the moment....


...stuff about "pagan christians" deleted...

Let me clarify myself a little more.  It is obvious to me that I didn't
do a good job before.

Having someone as your god and following a set of rules or dogma are two
different things.  For most the two are tied together.  However, because
of the nature of paganism, it is possible to see the god or goddess in any
archetype.  For this reason a person could be pagan and worship Jesus as
a god.  But the "rules" of his/her belief are pagan, not christian.  A
person who FOLLOWS the religion of CHRISTIANITY would not be able to to
accept any other than "god" (i.e. the trinity and thus Jesus) as god.

A person has every right to refer to themselves how they wish.  However to
say someone is a Pagan Christian is like saying something is an Apple Orange.


>: They are usually raised with it.  Sometimes it is hard to let go.  Because
>: most pagans can see elements of the god or goddess in all religious figures
>: it makes it easier.  
> 
>Why should people "let go" of Christianity? What is wrong with having Jesus
>as one of your gods? Is the archtype to be rejected, just because some other
>followers do not follow the teaching attributed to this deity?
> 

I am not saying that anything is wrong with it.  In fact I myself use the
bible for study and try to study what this man taught.  Jesus was a master
occultist and philosopher.  I have a great deal of respect for the man.

I am simply stating a fact that some people, because of the teachings they
have been raised with all their lives, have problems following their true
path.  Usually because of some fear inside them.  I have seen this many
times and felt it myself in my early days of being a pagan.  How they
deal with it is up to them.  It is not my place to say it is right or
wrong.  (BTW you injected that assumption.)  But they are either pagans
who use Jesus as an archetype or Christians who are pagan-positive.
Not both.

If one belief says you MUST fast on Tuesdays or else and another says
you MUST eat on Tuesdays or else....how do you follow them both?


>Now, if you said that people should "let go" of religious fundamentalism,
>of whatever stripe, then I would agree with your statement.

NEWSFLASH! Bill said he would agree with Tammy.....

All joking aside, Bill, I disagree with radicalism of any sort.  Nothing
is ever achieved by it.  


> 
>.... delided ...
> 
>: >Pagan is the term that early xians used in a derogatory sense for non-xians.
>: >You cannot be a xian pagan any more than you can be a non-xian xian!
>: > 
>: >Being a pagan does not mean that you follow x,y,and z but that you don't
>: >believe in the xian, islamic or jewish god. Period.
>: 
>: Thank you.
> 
>Why are you thanking the person. The statement is false. 

Because the person expressed for me what I intended to say.


>I know a few pagans who would disagree 

Ahhh, the spice of life....

But is that like I know a few pagan's who have had the craft passed 
down in their families for generations?

;-)


> - at least, they use Jesus as one of their deities. 

The statement doesn't say that they can't.  Using Jesus as a diety and
following Xtianity are two very different things. 

Might I point out that Jesus did not create Xtianity.  That came after him.
I might also point out that most of what is considered Xtian TODAY is not
what the man Jesus taught. Also consider the fact that, maybe, just maybe,
he taught additional stuff to his inner circle, the apostles.  Just a little
food for thought.....


> 
>.... delided ...
> 
>: Given this, can we agree that ... When on alt.pagan... we refer to pagans as
>: "all those who worship a religion not founded upon the 
>: Judeo-Christian-Moslem base"?  How you define it outside of this news group
>: is up to you.
> 
>"Not founded on, but not excluding ... " is a phrase I could agree with.

NEWSFLASH: he did it again! ---  8)

I think Bill, when all is said and done about the "Pagan Christian" thing
we are going to find that we agree...to some degree at least.  How about 
this....

"all those who worship a religion that does not follow the principles of
of the Judeo-Christian-Moslem base, but who may or may not use archetypes
contain with in it."

Gawd...now I sound like a lawyer....*shudder*.

Hey...does that mean we can create paganese (as opposed to legalese).

8)

Tammy