From: carroll@gloin.cis.udel.edu (Mark C. Carroll)
Newsgroups: alt.messianic
Subject: Re: Messianic Judaism (inter-marriage)
Date: 8 Jan 93 16:22:42 GMT
Organization: University of Delaware, Newark

In article <141598.2B3A1FDA@paranet.FIDONET.ORG> Harvey.Smith@p0.f1.n7002.z8.FIDONET.ORG (Harvey Smith) writes:
]
]To: Mark Carroll
]
] In a msg on <Dec 23 12:42], Mark C. Carroll of 8:7002/6 writes:
]
] MCC] ] We target sinners, first those who are Jewish and then the 
] MCC] Gentiles.
]
] MCC] That's part of the proof that you're not Jewish. We don't look at 
] MCC] the people around us as "sinners" who need to be "saved". 
] MCC] That's Christian, not Jewish.
]
]True but its also Messianic Jewish, according to the Tanakh "To turn ungodliness away from Jacob"..  You will find this statement over and over in the Tanakh...
]



] MCC] Ah. And real Jews have no compassion. Yea, right...
]
]Not true.  Rabbinic Jews have compassion as well as pagans etc.  Compassion 
]depends on ones family upbringing.. Either to be a giver or a taker.
]
] MCC] I've never known a Jewish synagogue to turn anyone away. I've 
] MCC] never met a Rabbi who won't help a person in need. 
]
]Interesting... Except on the High Holy Days huh...  When if you don't have a
]ticket too bad...
]

My synagogue has *never* turned anyone away, on the high holidays or
any other time of year. The only time that *any* synagogue I've been
involved in has turned away non-ticket holders is when the building is
overfull. You can only pack so many people into a finite amount of
space... and then you can't pack any more in. And then the question
becomes, who takes priority in getting in: those who regularly support
the synagogue, or others who came at the last minute. It's not right
to turn *anyone* away, but sometimes it can't be helped, and then it's
just a matter of: the community that supports the synagogue, that is
the membership of the congregation, should have priority.

]In fact a Conservative Shul went on record as saying that they were glad we 
]were in existance as we took in the poor who could not afford a ticket to 
]High Holy days at the local Synagogue, and we always advertise Free Seats...
]

I find it rather interesting that when you were called on this point,
it turned out that said (unidentifier) Shul did *not* go on record,
but their president (who you also refuse to identify) said, off the
record, in private conversation what you claim. 

Perhaps you have free seats on the holidays because the Real Jews go
to Real synaogogues, not to your churches.

] MCC] judged solely on the basis of their actions during their 
] MCC] lifetime, and that everyone, regardless of whether they are 
]
]True according to Hellenistic Philosophy, but not according to the Torah.

True according to JEWISH philosophy. Judaism does *not* equate
non-Jewishness with "wickedness". 


]Have you never read Ezekiel, where it plainly states "if you fail to warn 
]the wicked then their blood is required upon you".  Do you remember the 
]story of Jonah, who was sent by God to Ninevah to warn them of impending 
]judgment and told them to repent?????

Wickedness != Non-Jewishness.

I challenge you to provide support from Jewish texts that in either of
the above cases this means that wickedness == non-Jewishness or that
warning == proselytizing.

	<MC>
-- 
|| Mark Craig Carroll: <MC>     ||"In all seriousness of truth, hear this:
|| Univ of Delaware, Dept of CIS|| without the It, one cannot live. But
|| Grad Student/Labstaff Hacker || whoever lives with It alone is not
|| carroll@udel.edu             || human" - _I_and_Thou_, by Martin Buber
Newsgroups: alt.messianic