HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brodie@mis.mcw.edu
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: NNTP SERVER works, but MAC user cannot POST (help?)
Date: 22 Jul 92 12:13:20 CDT
Organization: Medical College of Wisconsin

Hi.  We have a MAC user who uses TCP/CONNECT to connect to our ANU-NEWS
system, which also supports NNTP.

The access is set up (via NNTP_ACCESS.NEWS), and he can *READ* all of
the newsgroups just fine.  However, when he POSTS an article,
the article makes it over to our site, but simply ends up
in a file name such as "[NEWS_MGR]NNTP_2200FEC3_1.TMP;1".

The aforementioned article file that gets sent over looks like:

--------------------------------------------------
From: jmoulder@mis.mcw.edu (John Moulder)
Newsgroups: vmsnet.test
Subject: TCPConnect Test #2
Reply-To: jmoulder@mis.mcw.edu (John Moulder)
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: Medical College of Wisconsin
Keywords: test
Test from TCP Connect
22 July, 11:40 am CDT

jmoulder@mis.mcw.edu  (John Moulder)      414-266-4672
Radiation Biology                   Medical College of Wisconsin
Milwaukee, Wisc   
------------------------------------------------------

One of the problems that I see is that it looks like there's no
article ID (I have a gut feeling that's what is causing the
article to never be posted..?).

Has anyone else used a similar setup?  (pc or mac-based NNTP reader
with anu-news server, and get POSTINGS to work.)

what am i missing...?


-----
Kent C. Brodie					Internet:  brodie@mis.mcw.edu
Sr. Systems Manager; MIS Department		UUCPnet:   mcwmis!brodie
Medical College of Wisconsin, MIS Dept.		MaBellnet: +1 (414) 257-8769

"Simon says.... DRY UP!"	--Simon-Bar-Sinister; "Underdog"
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Understanding News and ANU-News manager tasks?
From: Gelson Dias Santos <GELSON@VORTEX.UFRGS.BR>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:20:00 -0300
Reply-To: Gelson Dias Santos <GELSON@VORTEX.UFRGS.BR>
X-VMS-To: IN%"anu-news@ndsuvm1"
X-VMS-Cc: GELSON

  Ok, I *think* I finally have ANU-NEWS 6.03 working right . Now I would
like to know where can I find generall information about "How usenet works",
"Managing a news site" and the like. So far, I have read only the Anu_News
manual and the RFC's included in the distribution. I have created some local
newsgroups, posted some articles in it etc, but now I want to get a real news
feed from a neighbourhood NNTP server and need to know how to manage my site.
  I suspect there is something like this in the news.* newsgroups, but I want
this info *before* getting a feed...
  Can someone suggest a good introduction doc/book/anything about this subject?
  Thanks in advance,
 
 
/-------------------------------------------------------------------\
|        Gelson Dias Santos  --->  Internet: gelson@vortex.ufrgs.br |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Universidade Federal do Rio Grande do Sul || Sorry, english isn't |
|       Porto Alegre - RS  Brazil           ||  my native language. |
\-------------------------------------------------------------------/
From: breaux@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Charles Breaux)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Configuration Questions
Followup-To: system@jsrvx1.ucsf.edu
Date: 27 Jul 1992 01:40:43 GMT
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: cory.berkeley.edu
Keywords: Can connect to server, but no articles are downloaded.


Can someone tell me what I've forgotten? When I run ANU news V6.0.3 (3/14/91)
on my VMS machine using the command "news/netserver=host/netproto=tcp", the 
news program connects to the server, says "Retrieving Newsgroups:........"
and then Shows the groups and the number of articles in each, but when I
select any group that has articles, I'm told there aren't any.

My news.sys file contains only the line 

me:

Thanks in advance.

Vince Reed
UCSF Cardiothoracic Surgery
(415)476-3437
From: brodie@mis.mcw.edu
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: cannot create groups with a CHECKGROUPS msg. help?
Date: 24 Jul 92 14:21:46 GMT
Organization: Medical College of Wisconsin

I wish to add more newsgroups (I want *all* the "news.xxxx" groups).
simple?  should be.   I'm trying to post the following "checkgroups"
message to my local news node:

Newsgroups: news.admin.ctl,junk.ctl
Distribution: local
From: brodie@mis.mcw.edu
Subject: cmsg checkgroups
Control: checkgroups

news.admin		Comments directed to news administrators.
news.announce.conferences	Calls for papers and conference announcements. (Moderated)
news.announce.important	General announcements of interest to all. (Moderated)
news.announce.newgroups	Calls for newgroups & announcements of same. (Moderated)
news.announce.newusers	Explanatory postings for new users. (Moderated)
news.answers		Repository for periodic USENET articles. (Moderated)

etc....

The problem is that the article ends up getting posted to "control".
No newsgroups are created (even with  $news add file/exec ...), and
no mail is sent to "usenet".

what am I missing?

-----
Kent C. Brodie					Internet:  brodie@mis.mcw.edu
Sr. Systems Manager; MIS Department		UUCPnet:   mcwmis!brodie
Medical College of Wisconsin, MIS Dept.		MaBellnet: +1 (414) 257-8769

"Simon says.... DRY UP!"	--Simon-Bar-Sinister; "Underdog"
From: G.Huston@AARNET.EDU.AU (Geoff Huston)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: RE: Where is 6.1a4???
Date: 26 Jul 92 22:48:48 GMT
Reply-To: Geoff Huston <G.Huston@AARNET.EDU.AU>


    Where can I get my hands onf ANU NES 6.1a4.
 
 
anon ftp from sao.aarnet.edu.au
 
 
Geoff Huston
From: ake@dayton.saic.com (Earle Ake)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: cannot create groups with a CHECKGROUPS msg. help?
Date: 24 Jul 92 21:46:50 EDT
Organization: Science Applications Intl. Corp., Dayton, Ohio

In article <1992Jul24.092146.242@mis.mcw.edu>, brodie@mis.mcw.edu writes:
> I wish to add more newsgroups (I want *all* the "news.xxxx" groups).
> simple?  should be.   I'm trying to post the following "checkgroups"
> message to my local news node:
> 
> Newsgroups: news.admin.ctl,junk.ctl
> Distribution: local
> From: brodie@mis.mcw.edu
> Subject: cmsg checkgroups
> Control: checkgroups

Add in the 


header and it should work.


-Earle
_____________________________________________________________________________
             ____ ____    ___
Earle Ake   /___ /___/ / /     Science Applications International Corporation
           ____//   / / /__                 Dayton, Ohio
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internet: ake@dayton.saic.com  uucp: dayvb!ake  NSI-DECnet (SPAN): 28284::ake
From: saul_sy@sage.hnrc.tufts.edu (Saul Tannenbaum)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: NNTP SERVER works, but MAC user cannot POST (help?)
Date: 23 Jul 92 02:40:02 GMT
Organization: USDA HNRC at Tufts University

In article <1992Jul22.121320.232@mis.mcw.edu>, brodie@mis.mcw.edu writes:
> Hi.  We have a MAC user who uses TCP/CONNECT to connect to our ANU-NEWS
> system, which also supports NNTP.
> 

I don't know *anything* about TCP/CONNECT, but I tracked a problem
with a different Mac newsreader (NewsWatcher) to:

> Path: news

ANU NEWS is expecting a host!user path, and will reject the article
because of that. (FWIW, the RFCs say that just "host" is good enough,
but "host!user" is the polite thing to include for backwards compatibility.)

> One of the problems that I see is that it looks like there's no
> article ID (I have a gut feeling that's what is causing the
> article to never be posted..?).
> 

That will certainly cause problems, too.

> Has anyone else used a similar setup?  (pc or mac-based NNTP reader
> with anu-news server, and get POSTINGS to work.)
> 
Posting, from the newest version of NewsWatcher (and only the newest
version), works for me without problems to an ANU-NEWS server.

********************************************************************************
Saul Tannenbaum                         |
Manager, Scientific Computing           |Internet: STANNENB@HNRC.TUFTS.EDU
USDA Human Nutrition Research Center on |
    Aging at Tufts University           |
*********************** Standard Disclaimers Apply *****************************
From: oberman@ptavv.llnl.gov
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: Compatibility with VMS 5.5
Date: 21 Jul 92 17:03:52 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.092916@ulci20.unil.ch>, dhenchoz@ulci20.unil.ch (Daniel HENCHOZ) writes:
> Does someone know any compatibility problem between ANU-NEWS 6.0-3 and VMS
> 5.5?

I have been running V6.03 as a client under V5.5 and now V5.5-1 for several
months with no problems.

DEC failed to keep their promise to fix the SMG bug in V5.5-1, though. It's
still there!

R. Kevin Oberman			Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
Internet: oberman1@llnl.gov		(510) 422-6955

Disclaimer: Don't take this too seriously. I just like to improve my typing
and probably don't really know anything useful about anything.
From: fenner@cmf.nrl.navy.mil (William C Fenner)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Log-file format patch for ANU 6.1a4
Date: 22 Jul 92 00:01:53 GMT
Organization: NRL Connection Machine Facility, Washington, DC

Here is a quickie diff that puts the machine we received the article from
(the first entry in the Path: header) into the log file along with the
Message-ID and other information.  It's sometimes _very_ handy to know
what machine an article came from.

  Bill

************
File DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;212
  442     char recvfrom[50],*p;
  443   
******
File DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;211
  442   
************
************
File DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;212
  459     strncpy(recvfrom,itm[PATH],49);
  460     recvfrom[49]='\0';
  461     if (p=strchr(recvfrom,'!')) *p='\0';
  462   
  463     strcpy(newsgroup,ng);
******
File DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;211
  458     strcpy(newsgroup,ng);
************
************
File DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;212
  486     printf("Add %s %s %s",recvfrom,itm[MESSAGE_ID],newsgroup);
  487     if (!strcmp(newsgroup,"junk") && !junk_it) {
******
File DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;211
  481     printf("Add %s %s",itm[MESSAGE_ID],newsgroup);
  482     if (!strcmp(newsgroup,"junk") && !junk_it) {
************

Number of difference sections found: 3
Number of difference records found: 6

DIFFERENCES /IGNORE=()/MERGED=1/OUTPUT=DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]RECVFROM.DIFF;1-
    DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;212-
    DSKM:[NEWS.V61A4.NEWS_SRC]NEWSADD.C;211
-- 
Bill Fenner                  fenner@cmf.nrl.navy.mil
From: jeh@cmkrnl.com
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Bug: 6.1A4 sometimes loops after auto-newregister confirm prompt
Date: 22 Jul 92 01:02:25 GMT
Organization: Kernel Mode Consulting, San Diego, CA

Found a problem today with the "automatic register of new groups with confirm"
option (and maybe other variants, dunno).  Seems to work fine under routine
cases.  However, today I had a new group which was both empty and the first
group in the system.  (Don't know which of these conditions was the trigger for
the problem -- maybe both together.)  After accepting my answer to "New group
... register? [Y]", it looped interminably.  

News 6.1-A4.

	--- Jamie Hanrahan, Kernel Mode Consulting, San Diego CA
uucp 'g' protocol guru, VMSnet (DECUS uucp) Working Group, and
Chair, VMS Programming and Internals Working Group, U.S. DECUS VAX Systems SIG 
Internet:  jeh@cmkrnl.com, hanrahan@eisner.decus.org, or jeh@crash.cts.com
Uucp:  ...{crash,eisner,uunet}!cmkrnl!jeh
From: sloane@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Bob Sloane)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: Configuration Questions
Date: 27 Jul 92 11:21:17 CDT
Followup-To: system@jsrvx1.ucsf.edu
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

In article <14vk6rINNd93@agate.berkeley.edu>,
 breaux@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Charles Breaux) writes:
> Can someone tell me what I've forgotten? When I run ANU news V6.0.3 (3/14/91)
> on my VMS machine using the command "news/netserver=host/netproto=tcp", the 
> news program connects to the server, says "Retrieving Newsgroups:........"
> and then Shows the groups and the number of articles in each, but when I
> select any group that has articles, I'm told there aren't any.

It sounds like you don't have permission to read articles from the
nntp server.  Have the remote site check the nntp_access file to make
sure your system is included and has read and post permission.

> My news.sys file contains only the line 

You shouldn't need a NEWS.SYS file in a client only configuration.
-- 
USmail: Bob Sloane, University of Kansas Computer Center, Lawrence, KS, 66045
E-mail: sloane@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu, sloane@ukanvax.bitnet, AT&T: (913)864-0444
From: astlc@acad2.alaska.edu (Tom Claydon)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Text version of docs wanted!
Date: 28 Jul 92 02:36:39 GMT
Article-I.D.: acad2.1992Jul27.223639.1
Organization: Anarchy Incorporated


 Greetings! I'm looking for the text version of the 6.0-3 documentation
(NEWS.TXT). I can't decompress the compressed docs, so if someone could
provide me with a copy or point me to a FTP site where I could grab a copy,
I would greatly appreciate it! Thanks!
-- 
Tom Claydon, Electronics Tech.
University of Alaska Anchorage
BITNET: astlc@alaska.bitnet
INTERNET: astlc@acad2.alaska.edu
From: ewilts@galaxy.gov.bc.ca (Ed Wilts)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: Compatibility with VMS 5.5
Date: 21 Jul 92 08:10:04 -0700
Organization: BC Systems Corporation

In article <1992Jul21.092916@ulci20.unil.ch>, dhenchoz@ulci20.unil.ch (Daniel HENCHOZ) writes:
> Does someone know any compatibility problem between ANU-NEWS 6.0-3 and VMS
> 5.5?

Works fine here.  We've got multiple patches in place to 5.5 on our 200+ VUP
cluster.  The only thing we're not yet running is the new queueing system.

-- 

Ed Wilts, BC Systems Corp., 4000 Seymour Place, Victoria, B.C., Canada, V8X 4S8
EWilts@Galaxy.Gov.BC.CA   |   Ed.Wilts@BCSystems.Gov.BC.CA   |   (604) 389-3430
From: sloane@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Bob Sloane)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: NNTP SERVER works, but MAC user cannot POST (help?)
Date: 23 Jul 92 09:28:21 CDT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Services

In article <1992Jul22.121320.232@mis.mcw.edu>, brodie@mis.mcw.edu writes:
> The aforementioned article file that gets sent over looks like:
> 
> --------------------------------------------------
> Path: news

This should be Path: system!user

> References: 
> Followup-To: 
> Distribution: 

The empty headers shouldn't be there. Although this shouldn't cause a
problem for ANU News, it can for other transports.

> Keywords: test
> Test from TCP Connect
> 22 July, 11:40 am CDT

There should ba a null line after the headers.

> One of the problems that I see is that it looks like there's no
> article ID (I have a gut feeling that's what is causing the
> article to never be posted..?).

That could be a problem.  I would telnet to the nntp port and type in
the above article by hand and see what happens.  Probably fixing the
-- 
USmail: Bob Sloane, University of Kansas Computer Center, Lawrence, KS, 66045
E-mail: sloane@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu, sloane@ukanvax.bitnet, AT&T: (913)864-0444
From: mores@rapnet.sanders.lockheed.com
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: TCP/IP flavor confusion
Date: 23 Jul 92 20:22:42 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Sanders, Inc.

I am lucky enough to have more than on flavor of TCP/IP on one of my company's
VAXclusters.  I have no problem with building the two flavors of ANU_NEWS.EXE
and setting up to use the correct one for the specific node on the cluster.

Both versions of NEWS_tcpflavor.EXE file work just fine when there is no
NEWSRC file to start with.

The problem is that you cannot use ANU_NEWS on a node of the cluster where the
TCP/IP flavor is different from what was in effect when the NEWSRC file was
created.  The NEWSRC file on the first line remembers the TCP/IP flavor and
seems to ignore any override using NETPROTOCOL qualifier.

What are the rules here?  This is does not seem to be discussed in the
documentation.  It this a bug or a feature?

I would seem to me that just going with the default TCP flavor (/NETPROTO=TCP)
would be the the thing to do, since it is less likely that there would be more
than one flavor of TCP/IP running on a node.  All of the effort that when into
coding various TPC/IP command line/verb qualifier types is a mystery to me. 
You can only link in one flavor; so it should be just a compile time option. 
Have I missed something here?

If you want to remember netprotocol, make it just TCP (node default) or DECnet.
Does this make sense?
From: littlec1@jaguar.uofs.edu (Chris Little)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: How does one post anonymously??
Date: 28 Jul 92 16:09:56 GMT
Organization: University of Scranton


How does one post anonymously in NEWS?

--
Chris Little, Programmer/DBA
                                                University Computing Systems
                                                University of Scranton
  LITTLEC1@JAGUAR.UOFS.EDU                      Scranton, PA 18510
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Re: NNTP SERVER works, but MAC user cannot POST (help?)
From: fenner@jazz.psu.edu (Bill Fenner)
Date: 23 Jul 92 13:13:13 EDT
Organization: NRL Connection Machine Facility, Washington, DC

In article <1992Jul22.121320.232@mis.mcw.edu> brodie@mis.mcw.edu writes:
>However, when he POSTS an article,
>the article makes it over to our site, but simply ends up
>in a file name such as "[NEWS_MGR]NNTP_2200FEC3_1.TMP;1".
>
>The aforementioned article file that gets sent over looks like:
>
>--------------------------------------------------
>Path: news

This is the problem -- ANU News either wants no Path: header, or a header with
a bang in it (i.e. mac!news).  I'd suggest seeing if the NNTP client has
an option to not put Path: headers on posts, or, if not, asking the author
if that option could be added.  It makes no sense for a NNTP client to supply
a Path: header when posting.

>One of the problems that I see is that it looks like there's no
>article ID (I have a gut feeling that's what is causing the
>article to never be posted..?).

Nope, the NNTP server will generate the Message-ID.

  Bill
--
Bill Fenner	fenner@jazz.psu.edu	..psuvax1!hogbbs!wcfpc!wcf
		wcf@hogbbs.scol.pa.us   (+1 814 238-9633 v.32bis)
From: zmw@altair.selu.edu (Mike Whisenhunt zmw@selu.edu)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Local news groups getting notes deleted too early
Date: 21 Jul 92 13:15:54 -0600
Organization: Southeastern Louisiana University

Hi.  We're running ANU-NEWS v6.1 alpha 4.  I've received complaints from
people who administer local news groups, that notes which are newer than
the note-retention cut-off are being deleted.  In other words, the note
retention period might be 60 days, but notes posted 7 days ago got wiped out.
History is turned on. Newssite.h EXP_TIME is 14;  newsgroup default item
retention is 3 days.
The following is a show newsgroup of one of our local groups with this
problem.
Any thoughts or additional info needed?  Thanks.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
Mike Whisenhunt                |Internet: zmw@selu.edu   |How to tell if your
VMS System Manager/Postmaster  |Phone   : (504) 549-3643 |boss has used your 
Southeastern La. Univ, Box 430 |Fax     : (504) 549-5092 |Word Processor? Look
Hammond, La 70402  USA         |"Wise men still seek Him"|for whiteout on CRT.



Show Entry: Newsgroup slu.grants

Newsgroup: slu.grants
Title: SLU Grants Information
Prot:RX

Created:   21-Apr-92
Retention: Permanent
Note-Retention: 60 days
Count:     0
Status:    Locally defined Newsgroup
Post-Access: No POST Access to Newsgroup
Access-File: Membership list follows
Member: xxxxxxxx WRITE
Member: xxxxxxxx WRITE
Newsgroup is entered in the following Classes:
  $local
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
From: dhenchoz@ulci20.unil.ch (Daniel HENCHOZ)
Subject: Compatibility with VMS 5.5
Organization: University of Lausanne CH (Switzerland)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 07:29:16 GMT

Does someone know any compatibility problem between ANU-NEWS 6.0-3 and VMS
5.5?

Thanks for answer.

						Daniel
From: a_millsbs@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Where is 6.1a4???
Date: 26 Jul 92 14:24:26 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

Where can I get my hands onf ANU NES 6.1a4.

Thanks in advance,

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
B. Scott Mills                            (409) 568-1134
Computer Center -- Technical Support,     Stephen F. Austin State University
a_millsbs@ccsvax.sfasu.edu                P.O. Box 13012 SFA Station
root@calvin.sfasu.edu                     Nacogdoches, TX  75962
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ake@dayton.saic.com (Earle Ake)
Newsgroups: news.software.anu-news
Subject: Getting syntax wrong on forward causes News to exit to DCL
Date: 24 Jul 92 21:43:17 EDT
Organization: Science Applications Intl. Corp., Dayton, Ohio

	I tried to forward a message to more than one person and instead
of using forward/to=(user,user) as the help says, I used a double quote
to enclose the addresses.  Here is what happened.


NEWS> forw/noedit/to="ake@dayvc,system@dayvc"
Subject: E-Mail Connectivity Conference 7/27/92
        Invoking mailer...
%LIB-F-SYNTAXERR, string syntax error detected by LIB$TPARSE
$

Yes, that's right.  Dropped right to DCL!  Is there any way to detect the
error and then report it rather than exit entirely?  BTW, this is 6.1a4.


Earle
_____________________________________________________________________________
             ____ ____    ___
Earle Ake   /___ /___/ / /     Science Applications International Corporation
           ____//   / / /__                 Dayton, Ohio
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internet: ake@dayton.saic.com  uucp: dayvb!ake  NSI-DECnet (SPAN): 28284::ake
From: brendan@cs.widener.edu (Brendan Kehoe)
Newsgroups: news.software.readers
Subject: Re: Internet Books/Readers/Novice Users
Date: 21 Jul 1992 13:39:58 -0400
Organization: Widener University Computer Science Dept, Chester PA
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: betty.cs.widener.edu
Keywords: newsreaders novice books

silvert@biome.bio.ns.ca wrote:
>I think the original posting by krol@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Ed Krol) about
>writing an Internet book for ORA is important, since many of us rely on
>these books for ourselves and for users.  I find his idea of stressing
>one news reader (even though he has chosen NN, which I use) distressing,
>because it will have the effect of pushing users in a fixed direction.

When it came time to address doing a total and complete rehaul of the
Usenet chapter in my own ``Zen and the Art of the Internet'', I got a
lot of pressure from people to put something concrete in about rn,
trn, or whatever.  When I sent the second edition final copy in April,
it went without that stuff.  Boy, talk about a hard decision.  While
rn is probably the most likely candidate, I couldn't even assume that
people would be using Unix---so should I try out VMS News, and some PC
readers, and Mac ones too?  Who knows.  I figure there are plenty of
sysadmins out there who (like myself) have the responsibility of
informing their users how to use what's on their system.  The idea
behind everything that's available is what I wrote about in Zen---not
the mechanics.  That's their job, not mine (outside of Widener); it
may come back to haunt me, but I think it was a sound decision.  From
what I've heard, there will probably be a fair number of similar works
*with* the mechanics for the various platforms out before our new
President's gotten past his first 100 days, as it is.  We'll see.

(Ok, I can't resist...ISBN is 0-13-010778-6, $22.  Shipping now. <duck>)

-- 
Brendan Kehoe, Sun Network Manager                      brendan@cs.widener.edu
Widener University                                                 Chester, PA
                                              At Bennigan's, EVERYONE gets it!
Newsgroups: news.software.readers