HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Sat, 25 Jul 1992 20:06:00 EST
From:         the anti-elvis <199561011@VUVAXCOM.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: libertarians

mj:

yes, a less intrusive government would certainly be a good thing,
and this lack of intrusion would, i think, also go far toward
reducing expenditures  (as vms already pointed out).  the policy
of a neutral government is, i think, highly desirable.

one thing that concerned me was that you basically said that the
government should turn social concerns over to the individuals and
the states, and not involve itself.  i am concerned that the states
often will become overly intrusive in social concerns, which, imho,
is generally something that the states should remain as neutral
as possible on as well, leaving open the widest possible range of
personal freedoms.  this means that the fed. govt. needs to keep
the state govts. from becoming intrusive, a position that travis is
bound to scream bloody murder about, but then, i'm not a state's rights
person, and he is.  so its not completely clearcut.

brni
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Date:         Mon, 20 Jul 1992 20:03:02 EST
From:         MacPhil <IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Language Of Violence
Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu>
              20 Jul 1992 19:55:43 EST from <92price@GW.WMICH.ED U>

On Mon, 20 Jul 1992 19:55:43 EST <92price@GW.WMICH.EDU> said:

Didn't we already receive this reply (and the unnecessarily long
.sig) at least once before?


>Robert writes
>>  additions to PC vocabulary:
>>   AIDS - 'Anal Injected Death Serum'
>>   GAY  - 'Got AIDS Yet?'
>
>I believe this sort of sick humor may not only be dangerously close to
>suggesting some sort of confusion or apprehension about one's claimed sexual
>orientation, but may also be inappropriate for this list.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>...Dehumanizing the victim makes things simpler -- | ---- Kai Alexis Price ----
>it's like breathing through a respirator --------- |---------------------------
>it eases the conscience of even the most conscious/ ---------------------------
>and calculating violator ----------------------- / But death is the silence ---
>words can reduce a person to an object --------- | in this language of violence
>something more easy to hate -------------------- | Death is the silence. ------
>an inanimate entity ---- (By The Disposable) --- | But death is the silence ---
>completely disposable ------ (Heroes Of) ------- | in this cycle of violence --
>no problem to obliterate -- (Hiphoprisy) ------- | death is the is the silence
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------------------------
When ambidextrous people can't do it right, we do it left.

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
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Date:         Thu, 30 Jul 1992 14:45:03 CDT
From:         fred <CCHILDER@UNMCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      congressional criminals

The people who are in trouble for misuse of the postal facilities must
be democrats. If they were republicans they would have shredded all memos
dealing with the issue and refused to testify claiming national security
considerations.

If we locked up everyone in congress who is a crook the chambers would be
pretty empty. People only howl when the "other crooks" (read members of
the other party) skip punishment. Ollie North was convicted and served
no time, lost no benefits. I think that the democrats in question should
receive equal punishment.

fred
"You can only depend on one thing
you need a bus load of faith to get by" - Lou Reed

PS - Is the Central Scrutinizer under house arrest via the shadow gov't?
He seems to have disappeared.

PSS - Although I am in favor of american beer I would not want to deny
anyone their ethnic heritage so we must support all beers.
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Date:         Fri, 31 Jul 1992 15:48:15 BST
From:         Dunstan_Vavasour <dunstan@GEC-EPL.CO.UK>
Subject:      Re: congressional criminals
Comments: To: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU

LiNda
>>PSS - Although I am in favor of american beer I would not want to deny
>>anyone their ethnic heritage so we must support all beers.
>
>frEd,
>
>would you consider being our Minister of Beverage?
>
>-linda suE saboE  - VotE E in NovEmbEr.
>                    your brEw is safE with us.

you meaN ale czar ?

DuNstaN
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Original_To:  BITNET%"POLITICS@OHSTVMA.BITNET"
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:01:00 EST
From:         linda <SABOE@VUVAXCOM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: dumping Dan: myth or reality?

kerry, missy j,
i agree that it would only work if danny resigned.
i don't think it'll happen tho' unless quayle does something really dopey.
and well, hey, what're the chances of that happening :)
-linda
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Date:         Fri, 31 Jul 1992 15:46:45 BST
From:         Dunstan_Vavasour <dunstan@GEC-EPL.CO.UK>
Subject:      Re: Mr. Johnson meets the press.
Comments: To: POLITICS@OHSTVMA.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU

[stuff deleted]
>for the facts is a low moment in the political process.  I will
>reaffirm that we, on the JohnsoN/OlsoN ticket not only have
>consistently gone on record as having supported the right of
>every American to good beer ("A six-pack in every fridge") but
>that we fully support and promote the grass-roots American
>microbrewery efforts.  In fact, as has been noted, we participate
>directly in the process.  We stand on our record as brewers,
>and challenge the Kerry campaign to offer similar tangible proof
>of their commitment."
>
>  "A follow up question, if I may:  What motivation do you think
>the Kerry campaign could have for asserting that you are 'anti-
>American' in your beer policies, when in fact it is well known
>that you brew your own beer, here, in America, with 100% American
>malt and hops?"

While Not wishiNg to be seeN to eNdorse the JohNsoN/OlsoN campaiNg, I
must agree with their seNtimeNts here. I speNt, iN total, several
moNths iN ClevelaNd iN 1990/91, aNd speNt a great maNy happy hours iN
the Great Lakes BrewiNg CompaNy (oNe of ClevelaNd's two
microbreweries). It was almost like beiNg at home :-)

Seriously, the mass produced AmericaN beer is like piss, aNd aNyoNe
who defeNds it is automatically disqualified from high office oN the
grouNds of iNsaNity. The JohNsoN/OlsoN campaigN's attempts to redress
this balaNce is NothiNg but commeNdable.

DuNstaN
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Date:         Tue, 28 Jul 1992 10:38:43 -0500
From:         Jason Briggs Cormier <CORJB@RHODES.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Questions, questions

>I, too, am tired of the old Double Standard regarding men, women, and
>sex.  And I say it is time that men should be forced to help support the
>children they father.  After all, it doesn't take one person to conceive
>a child, it takes two.  So why should it be placed all on the woman's
>shoulders?
>

I've already said this, but I completely agree.  The man bears
as much responsiblity for the child as the woman does.  This
however requires according to my mind, that the father be as
integral in the decision-making process as to whether abort,
keep or put up for adoption.  I hear the argument that the
woman has the main interest since it is her body, but if that
is going to be the case then the father shouldn't have to
support a decision with which he doesn't agree.

-j.b.
>Evelyn Duncan
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Date:         Thu, 23 Jul 1992 16:49:00 EDT
From:         Travis Kidd <TKIDD@CLEMSON.BITNET>
Subject: RE: The Romantic Tragedy of the Electorate

On Thu, 23 Jul 1992 11:00:00 EST linda <SABOE@VUVAXCOM.BITNET> said:
> -travis
> >Believe me--if Perot doesn't want Bush re-elected, all he needs to do
> >is say the words and Bush will be outta the White House.
>
> wow, travis, didn't know george was so obedient.
But Perot supporters are.

> -linda
-Travis
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
From: holzman@fnalno.fnal.gov (Daniel B. Holzman)
Subject: Re: Jails and GE
Organization: FERMILAB
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 22:28:50 GMT
X-Posted-From: fnalno.fnal.gov
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

In article <POLITICS%92072810190169@OHSTVMA.IRCC.OHIO-STATE.EDU>, KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET (Kerry Stephenson) writes:
> Julie:
> 
> You mention some of the more ridiculous laws that are on the books, in
> an effort to support the idea that anti-sodomy laws are of a similar
> nature.  However, you fail to point out that those laws have not been
> enforced for a very long time, while the Supreme Court has upheld
> the constitutionality of anti-sodomy laws as recently as 1986.
> 
>                                        --Missy Justice

Of courst, what MisJustice misses several things here:

First, that a law which has not been enforced for a very long time was once a
law that was upheld as legal only 6 years prior.

Second that unenforced does not imply unconstitutional.
-- 
Daniel B. Holzman                    | Eight Words the Witch's Rede Fufill:
HOLZMAN@FNAL.BITNET                  | An It Harm None, Do What You Will
HOLZMAN@FNALC.FNAL.GOV.INTERNET      |
                                     | All Acts of Love and Pleasure are
Love doesn't subtract,               | Her Rituals
   it multiplies    - Heinlein       |
TEAM STAR Charter Member             | Speak the Word.
Disclaimer:  Fermilab's far too large to have an opinion, let alone mine.
From: 92price@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Divorce
Date: 27 Jul 92 18:52:31 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

The ancient Celts had a preventative measure against divorce--short-term
marriages.  That is people could choose to get married for one year or five
years or ten years or for their lifetimes.  You make your vows reasonable, and
if after so many years it doesn't work out, well, you choose not to renew your
vows, no guilt, no hurt.  I think this would help people to cherish their
marriages because they wouldn't feel trapped.  And it would reduce divorce.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We've got baskets, baskets of love!!" <-- The Fugs  |  Kai Alexis Price
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date:         Tue, 21 Jul 1992 09:15:59 -0400
From:         KILBURN@WVSVAX.WVNET.EDU
Subject:      Re: more on SS#'s, Missy/MacPhil

Robert:
> EXCELLENT!  When I approached our registration office and asked what they
> would do if I refused to reveal my SS# for enrollment, they acted as if
> it had never happened.  They evidently are/were unaware of any law that
> would require them to change their system.
>
> Was the university required to issue *all* students new ID or just those
> that requested it?  If you can cite the statute used in this case, I would
> love to force the issue here.

I don't know from statutes, but if you're willing to push, you can probably
get the requisite concessions.  At all the schools I've been associated
with (except U.C. Berkeley, which didn't use SSN's), a student could/can
request an alternate ID number and be given it.  Similarly, in New Mexico,
I managed to get my SSN removed from my driver's license.  Mind you, I had
to talk to 6 different supervisors (including the guy who takes the
pictures -- go figure!), but I got it done.

The only place I haven't had any luck when push came right down to shove is
the local supermarket -- they require SSN's on checks and simply refuse to
take the check if you won't include the SSN.

> As far as posting grades, the instructors have taken to using the last 4
> digits of the SS#.  Within a given class, this is sufficient to ensure
> unique ID.

Yep - it works well.  And I was told quite explicitly (as a grad student
and as a faculty member) *not* to use full SSNs or full names on grade
postings.

> From me
> Many parents have simply quit claiming their children in order to avoid
> tagging them with federal identification.  (SS#)

> Me thinks MacPhil that you underestimate the number of parents that find
> the SS# requirement unacceptable.  The *net* gain in refund is only a few
> hundred dollars.  I'll willingly sacrifice the refund in exchange for not
> selling my child to the government.

I'm curious:  how many folks don't claim their kids, and how do you figure
on the net refund bit?

> additions to PC vocabulary:
>  AIDS - 'Anal Injected Death Serum'
>  GAY  - 'Got AIDS Yet?'

This is *truly* offensive.  I'm tempted to ask about how you reconcile
statements like this with your religious values, but I won't.

Kerry
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Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 1992 16:10:48 EDT
From:         Tim Johnson <ST402711@BROWNVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Entrepreneurship Chinese Style

>It does have sounds of Coma, but there was a sci-fi book
>that I either read or read about, where all people convicted
>of crime were sentenced to death in order to use their
>body parts for non-criminals.

Larry Niven, I think.  I once talked to someone who had
a friend who read a review of it.

                                 -Tim
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Date:         Thu, 30 Jul 1992 16:35:00 EST
From:         "Peter J. Schledorn" <UNCPJS@UNC.BITNET>
Subject: Re: How Iraq was armed

> BTW - Does the "it's time for a change" argument apply to congress?
> If 12 years of repub administrations is too long, then congress or
> even safe seats are overdue for a similar change.  (Changing all safe
> seats would give congress to the repubs.)  Or, is it "change" is
> "repubs are to be exchanged for demos"?

How safe is safe?  If all of the seats that had been held by the
Republicans during the last 12 years were still held by them, they
would have a majority today (that according to Barney Frank's book).

When you look at the numbers (this from the Congressional Quarterly
Almanac) you find that in the Senate there are 29 Democrats and 22
Republicans that have been there since before Jan 1, 1981.  In the
House, there are 107 Democrats and 54 Republicans who have stayed in
all that time.  So that's 51 senators and 161 representatives--a bare
majority in the Senate and a bit over one-third of the House.  And in
both houses, Republicans are quite well represented among the long-
term members.

If we double the time allowed to 24 years, we find six Democratic and
three Republican senators, and 24 Democratic and 11 Republican reps
who have been there since before January 1, 1969.  In both houses, less
then 10 percent have been in office for that length of time, and the
Republicans are still well represented.

You want more change than that, take it up with the voters.

Best,
Peter

> -andy
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Date:         Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:32:00 -0400
From:         Song Weaver <JULIE%DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU@CARNEGIE.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Obfuscation Elimination

>>When I am Logic Czar, I will produce a sound proof of the non-existence
>>of god...
>
>...when C.S. Lewis attempted
>to prove the non-existence of God, he actually proved his
>existence...
>-j.b.


When?  How?  Where?

In what manner was the existence of God proven?  To whom?  Using what
reasoning?  With what criteria of proof and validation was this proof
performed?

--Julie "Bet I become logic Czar before Jamie" W.
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Date:         Sat, 25 Jul 1992 01:47:00 EST
From:         the anti-elvis <199561011@VUVAXCOM.BITNET>
Subject:      v-election polls

please send your virtual election polls to
199561011@vuvaxcom.bitnet

i will try to do this weekly until the election.
if you can have your vote in by monday around 7pm,
i will try to have the results out by midnight.

*******************************

the official choices are:

kilburN/stevensoN
johnsoN/olsoN
schledorN/loriN (although lorin is MIA)


the following have been nominated but have not yet declared their candidacy:

duncaN/hoffmaN
feinsteiN/zimmermaN
freemaN/alleN
lorsoN/sultaN


and the declared but unnominated eighth party candidate:

jimbo/jimbo
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Date:         Wed, 29 Jul 1992 10:05:55 -0400
From:         KILBURN@WVSVAX.WVNET.EDU
Subject:      Re: the upcoming war

Gary:
>Looks like you're right.  So much for bucking the conventional political
>wisdom.  Has this been having any effect on the poll numbers for Bush and
>Clinton?

I haven't seen any recent polls on this.  It does look like the possible
military intervention scenario has strong bipartisan support; Clinton has
made several comments (that have been reported) to that effect.  My guess
is that a "short" military event (?) would help Bush more than anyone else
-- partly because of the knee-jerk flag-waving kind of response, and partly
because it would count as another "foreign policy victory".

Sigh.

Kerry
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Date:         Tue, 28 Jul 1992 11:48:00 CST
From:         Ghost of Abbie <AHOFFMAN@UMKCVAX1.BITNET>
Subject:      personal liberties and high resolution broadcasting

I want to see how high resolution technology comes out in terms of cost
accessibility to you and me before opposing or favoring it. Personal l
liberties should be as we discussed thirty years ago - do to others what
you want for yourself. Hurt is the absolute taboo. Beyond that, the goal
is to raise the quality of evryone's life without imposing a dictatorship
or police state to accomplish such a goal. "Free"
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Date:         Mon, 27 Jul 1992 11:08:04 EST
From:         Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Is Quayle pro-choice?
              27 Jul 1992 11:40:27 EDT from <MEC038@UKCC.UKY.EDU>

KAT:

RU486 is taken after conception (and after a positive pregnancy test.)
In addition, it is a lengthy procedure, requiring at least 4 visits to
a doctor, over a period of at least 3 week.

In addition, though I don't know Quayle's position on RU486, he might
well be against it for medical reasons, since the French tests have
noted a stong stimulating effect on the growth of breast cancer and
"notably severe inhibitory properties on the immunitory system"
(A direct quote from the International Inquiry Commission on RU486,
1990).
                             --MJ
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Date:         Thu, 30 Jul 1992 12:15:35 EDT
From:         Evelyn Duncan <R3EJD@AKRONVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: this just in!

What's wrong with Nuts and tuNa?  Besides, we have lasagNe, baNaNa splits,
aNtipasto, suNdaes, pumpkiNs, SuNdays, suN, mooN, SaturN, lightNiNg,
kitteNs, CaliforNia, aNd VirgiNia!

EvelyN DuNcaN
From: IQTI400@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU (MacPhil)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.politics
Subject: Re: Dan Quayle & Masturbation
Date: 26 Jul 92 20:04:14 GMT
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Comments: To: Forum for the Discussion of Politics <POLITICS@ucf1vm.cc.ucf.edu>
              26 Jul 1992 14:13:00 EST from <199561011@VUVAXCOM>

On Sun, 26 Jul 1992 14:13:00 EST the anti-elvis said:
>        i dunno.... the dangers of masturbation are legion.  hair on
>        yer palms, goin' blind as a bat, gettin' hit by trucks, and
>        goin' to hell (do not pass go, do not collect $200).  sounds
>        dangerous to me.

so you chose the route of the inflatable doll, right? :)

------------------------------------------------------------------------
When ambidextrous people can't do it right, we do it left.

MacPhil / iqti400@indycms.bitnet / iqti400@indycms.iupui.edu
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Date:         Thu, 30 Jul 1992 08:56:40 BST
From:         Dunstan_Vavasour <dunstan@GEC-EPL.CO.UK>
Subject:      Re: Erratum
Comments: To: POLITICS <POLITICS@OHSTVMA.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>

>For "pretensious" read "pretentious."
>That'll learn me.
         ^^^^^
>Jamie
>will try to avoid pretension futurewise


Will you borrow me some English lessons ?

Dunstan
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Date:         Tue, 28 Jul 1992 09:41:19 -0400
From:         KILBURN@WVSVAX.WVNET.EDU
Subject:      Re: Is Quayle pro-choice?

Mike writes:
>That's not true. Fertilization itself takes place rather quickly, if the
>woman has ovulated at the right time. Sperm are capable of staying alive
>in the female body for a few days, though, so intercourse slightly before
>ovulation can still lead to fertilization.
(other stuff deleted)
And just to keep us all honest, I checked in a couple of texts.  According
to those sources (available upon request, of course), sperm take from 30 to
60 minutes to reach the fallopian tubes, where fertilization takes place.
Given that sperm retain their viabilitly for a day or two (as Mike said),
the "window" for fertilization should be between 30 minutes and, say, 48
hours.

Kerry
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