HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 08:12:29 EST
From: Sonja Kueppers <SEK@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Pumpkin Muffins

I just wanted to let you know that I tried Linda Koch's Pumpkin
muffin recipe this past weekend.

I baked 2 dozen, one for my home and one for my church "muffin swap".
They went over really well both at home and at church.  I found that
they were actually *better* 2 or 3 days after baking than they
had been the day they were baked.

I also calculated that they had 80 calories each.  Seemed like a bargain
to me!

For those of you who may have missed it, here's the recipe (with my notes):

PUMPKIN MUFFINS

2/3 c. nonfat dry milk (powder.  Do not add water.)
6   T  flour
2   tsp. pumpkin pie spice
1   tsp. cinnamon
1   tsp. baking soda
1/3 c. brown sugar (orig. recipe suggested brown sugar substitute)
1   tsp. vanilla
2   eggs
1   c. pumpkin
1/2 c. grated carrots
1/4 c. raisins (or 1 c. applesauce; I didn't try this)

Mix together.  Divide equally into a 12-muffin muffin tin.  (I used
foil muffin papers to keep the muffins from sticking to the pan.  The
original recipe suggested using PAM instead.)
Bake in 350 degree oven for 20-25 minutes (The original recipe suggested
18-20 minutes; I got better results baking for 25.)

-Sonja
From: GC.AVW@forsythe.stanford.edu (RAGIN CAJUN)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Nonfat Eating
Date: 19 Nov 1992 03:08:40 -0800
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: morrow.stanford.edu

In article <1992Nov13.161054.15676@unislc.uucp>,
pjd@unislc.uucp (Priscilla Davidson) writes:
>From article <BxL1A7.MDI@wrs.com>, by jessica@wrs.com (Jessica Hart):
>>
>> Is anyone else out there pursuing a totally nonfat diet?
>       [parts deleted]
>>
>> I guess I'm interested in anyone's thoughts on this sort of diet. I'm
>> doing it partly to lose weight, but I try to think of it as just a much
>> healthier way to eat anyhow. I don't plan to go back to high-fat foods
>> after I lose the weight.
>>
>   Jessica -- I've always heard (from Weight Watchers, Jenny Craig, and
>   a registered dietitian) that a totally non-fat diet (well, as totally
>   nonfat as we can get it) is not healthy.  The body needs fat, especially
>   for vitamin A, which is not water soluble.  I was told that all sorts
>   of dire things would happen to me if I cut out fat completely:  my hair
>   would fall out, etc.  Anyone else in this group care to comment?
>

Not sure how true all that is cause I have been reducing my fat
intake for quite sometime.  I know a totally fat free diet is
impossible but my doctor gave me to go ahead to not add fat to
anything I eat but use the natural fat that is in food.  I, also,
heard that you have to have fat to have a sex drive-so far no lost
hair and my new SO is 19 years younger than I am-so no problems in
that department either.

Alma
From: jfrawley@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Judy Frawley)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Nonfat Eating; Lunch
Date: 16 Nov 92 17:01:14 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY

In article <BxMn84.5A@wrs.com> jessica@wrs.com (Jessica Hart) writes:
>
         STUFF DELETED
> The one thing I do miss is sandwiches, I haven't figured out
>how to make an interesting nonfat sandwich. Keep in mind it also has
>to be vegan! What could I put on there, pickles and mustard is about
>all I canthink of. I'm not that crazy about salad stuff (lettuce,
>tomatoes etc) as a main course. Sounds like the field is open for more
>NONFAT LUNCH SUGGESTIONS from others!
>
Jessica,

I have used some recipes in the "New Laurel's Kitchen" cookbook.
One that I especially liked was Garbanzo Spread; it was absolutely
fantastic.  I will send it along tomorrow when I get back to my
cookbooks.  It's basically garbanzos, onions (sauteed - I used 
wine instead of oil :-), sesame seeds (sorry, I don't know if
these are real fatty or not, but you can certainly leave them 
out), and spices, cooked and mashed and then cooled in the refrigerator.
It made enough for two really big sandwiches and then I froze 
half the leftovers to use later and used half later in the week.

I hate salad - blech.  I like spinach salad, though, so I have
been known to make some and use it in a pita with some tamari
or something to moisten it.  I make spinach salad with 
spinach, onions, mushrooms, and mandarin oranges and sometimes
walnuts (although not usually).  You can also add chopped
apples to this for an interesting taste.  

How about a burrito sandwich?  I use any kind of bread I have
laying around (usually whole wheat or pita) and spread a layer
of refried beans (I'm a vegetarian, so I look for lard-free or
make my own), salsa, jalapeno peppers (optional, shredded red-leaf 
lettuce and tomatoes and black olives).

Ratatouille sandwiches are wonderful!  I usually make up a 
huge batch of ratatouille and break down into three separate
batches and use 1/3 for side dish and sandwiches, 1/3 for
spaghetti sauce (I add extra tomato sauce and spices), and
1/3 for a casserole whose name I can't remember right now
(w/potatoes and mushrooms and then baked in the oven).  
I have a recipe for ratatouille if you want it.  I cool
it and serve in a pita.

I hope these help.  I'm in a similar boat; I am not vegan, but
vegetarian watching the fat in my diet.

Judy Frawley
From: wvenable@attunga.stats.adelaide.edu.au (Bill Venables)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Swimming (was: One whole week)
Date: 23 Nov 92 22:29:43
Organization: Department of Statistics, University of Adelaide
	<1992Nov13.182345.14404@inmet.camb.inmet.com>
	<Nov.17.11.42.02.1992.9354@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
	<98010@netnews.upenn.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: attunga.stats.adelaide.edu.au
In-reply-to: crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu's message of 17 Nov 92 17:13:53 GMT

>>>>> "Lauren" == Lauren L. Crawford <crawford@ben.dev.upenn.edu> writes:

Lauren> In article <Nov.17.11.42.02.1992.9354@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
Lauren> shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan) writes:

>I read that book.  Thats where I read that swimming doesn't burn fat.  Has
>he changed his mind on that?  The book I read was a 1978 edition.

Lauren> I haven't read that, but it sure sounds like hooey.

That's because it is hooey, Lauren.  When I hear things like this I feel
like "releasing the safety catch on my Browning"(**), too.  Even this loose
"burn off the fat" kind of language should be enough to alert one to the
possibility of nonsense ahead.

I must say this is a big pity, though.  There is a need for a simple book
that explains the physiology of fat catabolisis and the signs to look for
while it's happening, and the Baily books were, according to some of my
email correspondents, the only ones to try to do this.  I can't get them
here in Australia, but after hearing this I don't intend to try too hard.

(My daughter, the medico no less, seems to know nothing much about it.
She's a great help, I must say.  Her advice is "just take some catabolic
steroids dad!"  If only there were such things... :-)
----------------------------

(**) Trivia question for the day:  Who said this: "Whenever I hear the word
     `culture' I release the safety catch on my Browning".

     Hint:  No, it wasn't Goering, but everyone thinks it was...


--
___________________________________________________________________________
Bill Venables, Dept. of Statistics, | Email: venables@stats.adelaide.edu.au
Univ. of Adelaide, South Australia. | Tel: +61 8 228 5412  Fax: ...232 5670
From: GC.AVW@forsythe.stanford.edu (RAGIN CAJUN)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: body image
Date: 19 Nov 1992 03:35:58 -0800
Organization: Stanford University
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: morrow.stanford.edu

In article <BxtKAL.6C6@dale.cts.com>,
npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan) writes:
>I've noticed that people's body images seldom reflect how I perceive
>their bodies.  I once had a roommate that was quite rotund (sounds like
>the beginning of a limmerk), and she didn't usually see herself that
>way at all.  She once compared herself to Marilyn Monroe, which is
>apparently how she saw herself.  But when she saw a photograph of
>herself she got very depressed about her weight.  For some odd
>reason we can seem to edit our image in mirrors.
>
>I also didn't see myself as really fat when I was, and it was a
>photograph of me with my little 4 year old neice that convinced
>me how huge I was.
>
>It seems like I get a clearer idea of my body when I see it in a
>picture.  Maybe that's because I can see the whole thing at once,
>rather than just focusing on a piece at a time.
>--

This is true.  I started this diet after seeing a picture of myself
that my uncle took on our vacation-my first thought was who is that
fat woman-then I realized and decided to do something about it.  I
think I will start taking pictures of myself just to keep up the
progress and it may help with my body image.

Alma
From: mprisco@lynx.cat.syr.edu
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Double chin
Date: 16 Nov 92 18:27:57 GMT
Organization: Syracuse University

In article <1992Nov11.161716.18271@prime.mdata.fi> kauhunen@mits.mdata.fi (Kari Nenonen) writes:
>In article <Bx9Hz0.180@world.std.com> glamkin@world.std.com (Gerald Lamkin) writes:
>>I'm inthe midst of a successful weight watchers diet. I've lost 20 lbs
>>with another 30 to go. The posblem is the double chin. It seems not to be
>>affected by the diet. any suggestions??
>>
>It might be that you don't get rid of your double chin by dieting. (Also thin
>persons can have a double chin). It depends on your age - if you are past 40
>then you propably need a little operation to get rid of the double chin.
>
>
>--
>* kauhunen@mits.mdata.fi * * Kari Juhani Nenonen *
>                  * Helsinki - SF *
>
Well, I'm finding that that's some of the last fat to come off.  Mine
is much better than it was 70+ lbs ago but it still shows a little
in photos, so I'm hoping the last 10+ will help that.   Its probably
somewhere in your last 30 lbs!

Margot


Margot
 


--
"I think we're passing through here kind of fast,
  Did you think these tracks in the dust would last? "
                                         - David Crosby
From: jsl+@pitt.edu (John S Lundberg)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: Too heavy for scales (was: Re: Fatman returns (hee-hee-hee)
Date: 19 Nov 92 18:40:09 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <17525@pitt.UUCP> geb@cs.pitt.edu (Gordon Banks) writes:
>I found a freight scale that showed I was 335lbs.  
>Most shipping departments have them.

The "Health-o-meter" scale I have at home was purchased from Sears
and has a capacity of 350 lbs.  With some trivial effort such balance
beam scales can be used to measure weights > their stated capacity.
-- 
John Lundberg
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: amygk@watson.ibm.com (Amy)
Subject: Re: Limiting exercise
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 14:41:23 GMT
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

Judy,

To me, determining fat gram content of homemade products is easier than
guessing at some store bought products (like Tahini - see my previous post).

Get a fat gram counter (like the T-Factor Fat Gram Counter, a small booklet,
$2.95) or equivalent book. You listed the following recipe:

3/4 cup walnuts               23.1 g
1 egg                          5.6 g
1/3 cup milk  (skim?)          0.5g skim, 6.6g whole
3 Tbsp oil                    42.0 g

total for part of recipe      71.2 g skim, 77.3g whole
This doesn't include the flour (1.2g per cup) and bananas (0.6g per medium
banana).

Unfortunately, your yummy recipe is too yummy! Even if you get 12 slices
of banana bread out of it, it's over 6g fat per slice.

If you use the applesauce instead of the oil, cut the walnuts down (or out)
and use skim milk, you get:

1/4 cup walnuts                    7.7g   (chop them, they'll go further)
1 egg                              5.6g
1/3 cup skim milk                  0.5g
3 Tbsp unsweetened apple sauce   < 0.1g

total for part of recipe          13.9g

A big difference. I bet it tastes just as good, too. I've been doing a lot
of low fat cooking for the past year, making substitutions like these.
Some day I'll post my 3g/muffin blueberry muffin recipe, and our lower
fat veggie pizza recipe. I can't imagine ordering a greasy pizza anymore.

Well, good luck and let us know if you try the modified version.
-- 
Amy (amygk@watson.ibm.com)
My opinions, IBM's hardware
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: mprisco@lynx.cat.syr.edu ()
Subject: Re: When Food Is Love
Organization: Syracuse University
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 09:19:09 EST

In article <By10HF.Ltq@dale.cts.com> npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan) writes:
>I think I half-way agree with Gordon and Steve on the Roth premise.  But
>it does seem to me that there are at least two kinds of overweight problems.
>There's my kind of problem where I really don't abuse food. I almost
>never binge.  Occassionally I eat inappropriately and eat to excess, but
>a naturally thin person wouldn't get fat on what I eat.  I really believe 
>that.  My real problem is a combination of having an efficient metabolism
>and of living a sedentary life.

Yes!  This is absolutely true.  I think you'll also find these
differences between people who are overweight due to genetics and those
who eat due to emotional reasons.  There are quite different solutions
to these.  I've communicated to emotional eaters who tell me that 
something like WW just won't address the issue for them.  Whereas for
me, portion control makes all of the difference in the world.  That
is not to say that I don't sometimes eat for emotional reasons (but
I think everybody does.  Even my normal weight husband will gorge
when really stressed out).

>
>Then I suspect that there are people who abuse food.  Just like anything
>can become an addiction, I'm sure food often does.  Sometimes I'm amazed
>by the incredible feats of bingeing posted here.  I feel really lucky
>that I don't have to deal with that in addition to my propensity to being
>fat.

Yes, me too, because you could certainly face both problems...  
>--
>Nancy P. Milligan 				npm@dale.cts.com

Margot


--
"I think we're passing through here kind of fast,
  Did you think these tracks in the dust would last? "
                                         - David Crosby
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: lady@vesta.unm.edu (Just some lady..)
Subject: Re: holiday dieting
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 14:48:05 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Keywords: diet holidays socials

hi.. I've been lurking here for a while and thought I should finally 
put in some input since I've been reading all of yours. :) I've
been changin  my lifestyle for about 6 weeks and have lost 18 lbs.
I have about 50 more to go to make my goal.. I say 'changing my 
lifestyle' because i've been changing what I eat, how I eat, how
I think about food and I've been more active. Its interesting how
after 6 weeks I can only go 1 day without my walk without feeling
icky :) 

In article <grenus.722024304@pasture.ecn.purdue.edu> grenus@pasture.ecn.purdue.edu (Karen M Grenus) writes:
(about holiday eating)


>	Should I just eat very little the day of the party and work out like mad that week? I don't want to offend the people that invited me to dinner by not
>eating or by whipping out my own freeze dried entree.

I look at it this way.. you are loseing the weight for _you_. By giving 
into people to make them feel good, you are losing track of doing things
for yourself. Its interesting how our society has taught us its bad to be
selfish.. well in some cases its good.  I'm not saying you have a right
be be rude.. nono, but you do have a right to eat only what you want
from the buffet table.  First, I wouldn't starve myself that morning.
When I do that all that ends up hapening is I end up pigging out at 
the potluck/dinner/etc. Go ahead and eat your normal breakfast, and
then lots of veggies. When it comes to buffet time.. you can either just
stick to dishes that are low fat, or taste everything and eat nothing. 
By this I mean have a forkfull of anything you want, but that's it. 
And, as someone else suggested, have something waiting for you to munch
on when you get home.. just so you won't feel deprived. I've found
success with this so far this holiday season. Good luck to you
(and to everyone else) :) 
-- 
                                _   /!
                                \'o_O'
                                  ( )
                                   U
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: leslie@cgrg.ohio-state.edu (Leslie Bishko)
Subject: Re: HELP!!!! (me again)
Organization: OSU Advanced Computing Center for the Arts and Design
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 14:03:37 GMT

In article <By4z56.84x@undergrad.math.waterloo.edu> mefoster@lambert.uwaterloo.ca (Mary Ellen Foster) writes:
>
>Today was just AWFUL!!! ...
>
>Now, I feel a little better (mentally) - however, physically my belt is
>digging into my waist and I feel mildly ill. I don't think that I will
>be eating supper tonight!
>

Mary Ellen,
The best thing you can do to regain control is EAT A NORMAL MEAL.
If you deprive yourself now, you'll perpetuate the pattern!  Just
focus on getting yourself back on track and feeling normal, instead
of jumping between extremes.  See if you can make it through the day
with the idea in mind that you are taking care of yourself: get some
excercise, drink lots of water, snack on veggies if you need a
snack, and go to bed early!

Don't worry about having gained weight and facing your family.  It
could be that the thought of dealing with your family is what is
causing you the anxiety that pushes you towards food!  If anyone
says anything about your figure, just tell them, "Yes, I'm
struggling with this and I sure could use your support."

When you see your family over the holidays, focus on conversation
and not food!

Boy this holiday thing is a big issue!

- Leslie



-- 
Leslie Bishko
leslie@cgrg.ohio-state.edu


Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
From: allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren)
Subject: Re: Nonfat Eating; Lunch
Organization: Test Systems Strategies, Inc., Beaverton, Oregon
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 00:04:38 GMT

jessica@wrs.com (Jessica Hart) writes:

>In article <BxtqEo.A76@dale.cts.com> npm@dale.cts.com (Nancy Milligan) writes:
>>
>> (Spa Burrito recipe)
>>
>>Burrito sized flour tortillas
>>                    ^^^^^^^^^




>Another job for Fat Fanatic!!

>Most commercial tortillas are made with lard. This means they contain more fat
>than they have to. PITA BREAD is a good substitute, and you can find it made
>without shortening. Or I like to use corn tortillas... 'cause they have more
>flavor and I find I need maximum flavor per calorie to avoid "nonfat boredom"!

Don't forget about whole wheat tortillas.  My wife makes a big batch of brown rice
and a big batch of black beans (raw beans cooked, not precooked coming from a can).
She then makes mega-burritos with the beans, rice and some lowfat, low sodium
cheese.  We freeze the burritos and pop 'em in the microwave for about 5-6 minutes
for a quick, healthy meal.  BTW, the combo of beans and rice makes a complete
protein.

allen

From: brooksp@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Peter Brooks)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 19:23:24 GMT
Subject: Re: Diet Methods
Organization: the HP Corporate notes server
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet

/ hpcc01:alt.support.diet / gagrawal@cs.tamu.edu (Gopal Agrawal) /  6:50 pm  Nov  6, 1992 /
>Isn't a loss of more than 2 pounds a week considered dangerous ?

Not necessarily.  On my fast, my steady-state weight loss was running
about 7 pounds a week.  This was under strict medical supervision.  On 
the other hand, I am not willing to lose more than 2 pounds a week on
my normal diet.

The usual restriction is minimum caloric intake.  It's the famous
1300 cal/day for women, and currently 1500 calories per day for men.
The last time I had to lose 2 pounds in a week, I took advantage of
my capacity for exercise and still got 3000 calories/day.

Pete Brooks
From: jsl+@pitt.edu (John S Lundberg)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: When Food Is Love
Date: 20 Nov 92 15:09:59 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Nov19.232742.11565@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>This "Geneen Roth" stuff seems to be particularly attractive to women,
>for whatever reason, I don't know why.  I haven't come across a man who
>is inclined to push it.  But it's mostly women who seem to be
>brainwashed into thinking that there has to be some emotional basis to
>their overeating and obesity and that "being nurturing to yourself"
>somehow breaks this cycle.  

I guess I think it's possible for one's rational side to shove aside
the emotions and assert control.  I think this is necessary to break
the "devil's loop" that many overweight people are stuck in: 
overeating->weight gain->sedentary lifestyle->emotional distress->
overeating, etc.  You simply have to say "enough is enough" and
start rigorously controlling what you eat.  Getting involved in
trying to understand the emotional basis of overeating is, for me,
hopeless.  My feelings are too ambiguous and uncertain.  All I know
is that I have a tendency to engage in certain behaviors that if 
not controlled have undesirable results with dangerous consequences.

My diet started back on June 8.  Certainly before June 8 I would
have agreed with every statement in the above paragraph.  But where
I failed, and where my thinking fundamentally changed, was in my
coming to understand that a diet must be rigorous yet adaptable.  
Before I used to aspire to a kind of dietary perfectionism, an
absolute standard of behavior.  Deviating from that standard meant
that I had failed and thus I might as well have a good time.  Now
I have a somewhat more flexible and long term point of view.  I
try to think in terms of months and years rather than days and
weeks.  I keep a food diary and suspect that it would be a good 
idea to do so for the rest of my life.  But if I told myself that
I could eat whatever I wanted, as Roth seems to be suggesting,
then I'm sure I'd fail.  Last night, for instance, I was fairly
hungry yet my food diary said that I had consumed 1400 calories
for the day, a bit over my target of 1200.  Instead of eating I
went for a drive and bought a magazine.  This morning I had breakfast
and I don't feel particulary hungry at the moment--I don't think
there's some reservoir of unfilled hunger that accumulates until
the dam of your self-control breaks.  Hunger is just a feeling
and it passes.  
-- 
John Lundberg
From: jsl+@pitt.edu (John S Lundberg)
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet
Subject: Re: The word FAT
Date: 19 Nov 92 19:03:24 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Nov19.001746.19552@tessi.com> allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren) writes:
>jessica@wrs.com (Jessica Hart) writes:
>>Does anyone here object to the word FAT, used to describe an overweight
>>person?
>I think your first line is best when you use the word 'overweight'.  The
>word FAT has many, many negative connections to it.  I usually just refer
>to someone carrying extra weight caused by too much fatty tissue as just
>overweight.

The best approach is not to make characterizing remarks about *any* aspect
of another person's physical self unless absolutely necessary.  Most adults,
and particularly, I have found, adult professionals, abstain from doing
so.  And when it is necessary to discuss the matter it's best to treat it
as if it were a simple fact of someone's life and not evidence of some
absolutely damning personal defect.

That said, as someone who is still quite overweight, I don't have any
particular problem with the word fat.  Isn't there some outfit called
the national association for fat acceptance?  Even if we don't "accept"
being fat it seems to  me that it'd be healthy to eliminate much of the
emotional reactions toward fatness and learn to treat it somewhat more
clinically.  I personally think over-emotionalizing an issue is the
first step to denial which makes it harder to deal with the problem.  
Not reacting emotionally to terms such as "fat" or "obesity" may be
an important step in recovery, if that makes any sense to anyone.
-- 
John Lundberg