HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jarvis@psych.toronto.edu (Brian Jarvis)
Subject: Colorado Amendment
Organization: Department of Psychology, University of Toronto
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 15:46:35 GMT

Does anyone have handy the *exact* wording of the proposed amendment to
the constitution of Colorado?  I'm aware of the gist of it and have talked
about it extensively with friends there, but I haven't yet seen the
precise wording of the proposed statement.  A copy of the text would be
greatly appreciated.

Brian
-- 

Brian A. Jarvis,          Rm. 4026, Sidney Smith Hall, Dept. of Psychology,
jarvis@psych.toronto.edu  University of Toronto, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
System Administrator      M5S 1A1  (416) 978-3948
From: jf@threel.co.uk (John Fisher)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Rob
Date: 21 Aug 92 14:05:51 GMT
Organization: 3L Ltd, 86/92 Causewayside, Edinburgh EH9 1PY, UK


In a sense I didn't know Rob well.  Occasionally we
exchanged e-mail about this and that, but we weren't
serious correspondents.  And of course we never met.

But in some ways I knew him better than many people I meet
face-to-face every day.

I read his postings with admiration, and looked forward to
them.  Lots of people, like me, must have looked at this or
that piece of nonsense and thought: "Heh.  I wonder what
Rob'll say about *that*".  The Talmudic precision Steve
wrote about was a crucial tool in what we do here, even if
occasionally it could drive you up the wall.  I shall miss
it (hell, I've been missing it already) more and more.  
And I loved his enjoyment of the life he led, and his
feeling of deliberation and repose.

It's desperately sad that he's gone.

--John
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jfh@netcom.com (Jack Hamilton)
Subject: Re: Redefining masculinity
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 06:05:18 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <ROBERTL.92Aug17213922@luciano.Stanford.EDU> 
robertl@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Robert Lodenkamper) writes:
>
>And you delude yourself if you think that question is rhetorical,
>since our enemies don't hate us for how we act.  They hate us for what
>we are, and they will never be satisfied until we are ALL gone.

*This* is the important thing to know.  It's very hard for us to imagine
that people who don't even know us might want us to die.  It's especially 
hard for those of us who are employed college-educated middle-class white 
males - we're not used to being marginalized and categorized. 

It's easy for us to go into denial about this.  The thought is almost too 
awful to contemplate.  But those people, the Buchanans and Dannemeyers and
the OCA, are out there.  They're not so strong by themselves, but they can
count on the tacit complicity of the Bushes and Wilsons (who see only the
political opportunities), and on the inaction of a well-meaning but apathetic 
public. 

Would Rob Bernardo and Terry Sutton and hundreds of thousands of others have
died if the government had taken action against AIDS as quickly as it did 
against Legionnaire's Disease?  If as much money were spent on AIDS
education as on the mostly ineffective "War On Drugs", what would the
infection rates be like now?  

-- 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Hamilton   jfh@netcom.com   P. O. Box 281107   SF, CA   94128-1107
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Gay Homophobia (was Re: Too straight looking to be gay???) (was re:
Summary: nothing much
Date: 21 Aug 92 06:12:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Aug21.061227.5596
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1992Aug20.183940.9395@microsoft.com> some nasty man writes:
>Not getting enough lately, Elf?

bahahhahaa

bahhahaha
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                   There is absolutely no other possibility
From: gklein@uoft02.utoledo.edu (Gary Klein, bear at heart)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Buchanan's speech
Date: 20 Aug 92 20:58:02 EST
Organization: Carlson Library, Univ of Toledo

     Folks, lets not forget the words of this orator who is "right besides 
himself":                       (courtesy NEW YORK TIMES)

          "My friends, even in tough times,
           these poeple are with us.  They don't
           read Adam Smith or Edmund Burke, but
           they came from the same schoolyards and
           playgrounds and towns as we did.  They
           share our beliefs and convictions, our
           hopes and our dreams."
           ...
          "And, we need to reconnect with them.
           We need to let them know we know they're
           hurting.  They don't expect miracles,
           but they need to know we care."

     Such a kind, caring and thoughtful soul!

     Amazing, how those sentences, when standing by themselves on the
phosphors of the screen can take on a whole new meaning.

     Don't you just want to embrace him for his concern over OUR hurt!  After
all, he did grow up with us, in the same schoolyards, playgrounds and town as
we did.  He knows us so well -- he could never turn away from a friend in need
of a bit of support!

     DOESN'T HE DESERVE AN HONORARY DEGREE in Social Work!

     We ought to find a pair of Siamese Twins who can give this man the sort of
two faced kiss-off that he truly deserves.  Where are Blaine & Antoinne when
you really need them?

	READ MY LIPS MISTER BUCHANAN	(written by Gary M. Klein, 8/20/92)
                
		We're queer,
		We're here,
	       	And we grew up playing in your schoolyard!
 
		We're queer,
		We're here,
		And we were once friends!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And we once cared about each other!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And we never hated anyone!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And you don't respect us anymore!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And we ain't gonna hide!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And we've got love on our side!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        Can you see the rising tide!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And Roy Cohn wants a bride!

		We're queer,
		We're here,
	        And God is on YOUR side?

		We're queer,
		We're here,
                And we're all gonna cheer!	        	       


P.S.  Guess who is going on a vacation in the woods?
      And coping without a newsfeed.
      But I will be spending time with an e-mail buddy!
-- 
"Read Queer Books"                                  "Librarian, Leather bound"

Gary Klein,   Business Librarian,  (Univ of Toledo)           * * * * 
PO Box 12650                  Toledo OH  43606-0250            *   *   
(w): 419-537-2629      fac2813@uoft01                            *   
(h): 419-243-2740      fac2813@uoft01.utoledo.edu         B4 t+ w- g s+ k
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: glp@fig.citib.com (Greg Parkinson)
Subject: Re: AIDS speech Wed @9PM EST Republican Convention
Originator: glp@merlin
Organization: Citibank IBISM
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 15:38:40 GMT


In article <1992Aug19.221152.6041@unocal.com>, stgprao@xing.unocal.com (Richard Ottolini) writes:

.......  Her positions sound more like
|> the P.C. aids community than conservative republican.
       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Fighting to stay alive is now PC?

Fuck off.

-- 
Greg Parkinson                  Phone: 212-657-7814  Fax: 212-825-8607
Citibank,111 Wall Street        E-Mail: glp@fig.citib.com
New York, New York  10043
The opinions expressed are my own and not those of the big 'ol bank.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Whizzzzzzz ( was Re: Introduction)
Date: 19 Aug 1992 12:30:19 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <19AUG92.11513511@enh.nist.gov> aberson@enh.nist.gov writes:
> In a previous article, adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) wrote:
> >I don't have air conditioning at home.  Last night at midnight
> >it was over 90 in my bedroom.  Can you guess why I'm just a wee 
> >bit cranky today?
>
> You missed celebrating Mae West's 100th birthday Monday?

That, too.  It was just too *hot* to get all dolled up 
for the birthday celebration.

[Aside: What *was* that horrible restaurant Mae West used to
like?  Damn, I wish I could remember.  Anyway, the father of
a friend of mine was in the national tour of "Sextette" and
he has all sorts of funny stories about her.]

> >>  Bzzt. Too hot. How can you screw in heat like this?
> > 
> >I can't even *think* about screwing in heat like this.
>
> Oh my.  That is serious.  This brings up the images of the supposedly hot
> love scenes in movies in which, after orgasm, the protagonists are dripping
> with sweat.  It looks good in the movies at least.

The sweat scenes always make me laugh.  Are they having sex
in a sauna?  Do any of *you* work up a lather like that?
(I imagine Arnold is going to jump in and say yes.)

> >You mean Sim might have been making *fun* of us?  What nerve!
>
> Anyone can come visit in the middle of February when it is sunny and 85F.

We've had that here, too.  I think it was 2, maybe 3 years 
ago that we had 90 degree weather for most of January.  

The restaurant came back to me: The Tam O'Shanter <shudder>.

Arne

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: wearing symbols
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 06:14:06 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.022122.29908@gordian.com> mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas) writes:

>If Borgesa King
>co-opted the Star of David it's meaning would be irretreivably lost?
>What utter drek. You honestly think that the Jews wouldn't point
>this out, and make certain that everybody knew *exactly* what was 
>being co-opted? I guess they'd just roll over and play dead, by golly.

Hang on.  A little while ago you were saying that the mass marketing
of a pink triangle is simply cultural cross-pollination, which
suggested to me that you recommend that we simply "roll over and play
dead" in response.

>  Like I've said three times before, if the meaning of the symbols
>are lost because we didn't speak up, whose fault is that?

It wasn't clear that you were saying this; it sounded more like "it's
no big deal if the meanings are lost."

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "I don't know how much support NAMBLA
\  / twpierce@amherst.edu      /  has in the gay community."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Clayton Cramer, August 1992
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: Introduction
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 17:32:43 GMT


In article <64292@cup.portal.com> Furr@cup.portal.com
(George Dalton Madison) writes:

>adolphson squeals:

>>What the fuck do you think you're talking about? 

>The fact that you've been behaving like a vicious queen of the
>worst kind for no apparent reason, to someone who hardly even
>begins to merit it.

You're on the slippery slope, George.  What is a vicious
queen of the best kind?  What kind of reason would make it
all right or not all right to be vicious queen of the worst
kind?  How about kindly queens of the worst viciousness?


-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
From: jchovan@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (John D Chovan)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Visiting Israel
Date: 19 Aug 92 20:51:30 GMT
Article-I.D.: magnus.1992Aug19.205130.14941
Organization: The Ohio State University

Dave and I are going to be in Israel next month for two weeks.  We're going
to be with a tour from Columbus, but will have some free time.  We are extending
our stay to take in sights that won't be on the tour.  Any suggestions for
some unusual and interesting sites and things to do that wouldn't be in your
standard tour package?

What's the shopping like?  :-)

Please respond via email to chovan+@osu.edu

Thanks!  jc
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com (Jake Coughlin)
Subject: Re: Speaking for others (was Re: Introduction)
Originator: jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 14:43:46 GMT
Organization: IBM T. J. Watson Research

adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson):
> (and why is it that we get under your -- plural, and you know 
> who you are -- skin like this?)

what's this ``we'' stuff?
-- 
Jason Coughlin ( jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com )
Queer Without A Cause!
"I find myself suddenly in the world, and I recognize that I have one
right alone: that of demanding human behavior of the other." -- Fanon
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: balistik@big-brother.nevada.edu (Shawn Hicks)
Subject: Re: Subject?
Organization: Not yet, but we're working on it...
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 01:19:30 GMT

In article <FeosPB2w176w@west.darkside.com>, safecrac@west.darkside.com (Chris Colvin) writes:
>Jesus Saves

Jesus Saves souls and redeems them for valuable prizes!


Moses has the ball... he passes...  and Jesus Saves!




Just say NO to crossposting.


Shawn
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Re: Why Benson Hedges #2 gay cigarette?
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 03:44:23 GMT


In article <91@bbx.basis.com> scott@bbx.basis.com (Scott
Amspoker) writes:

>In article <1992Aug15.023218.24901@macc.wisc.edu>
anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:

>>I used to smoke Home Runs or Gauloise (both unfiltered,
>>short, strong).  Now (for the past 25 years or so), it's
>>Camel straights (unfiltered, short, strong).

>>Fuckin'-A, right?

>Nah.  Camel unfiltered was my backup if Lucky Strike wasn't
>available (like in a vending machine).

I'm only going on about this because some fool thinks Camels
are so butch.  In my case, that's a real laugh!  However, in
my life-long struggle with cigaret vending machines, I've
observed that they more often have Luckies than Camels if
they have any unfiltered short cigs.  I buy Luckies if I
can't get Camels (just opposite of you, I guess).

But though I can get all the way through a pack of Luckies,
they have (you should forgive the phrase) a fruity taste (as
in sweet, aromatic) of some kind, to my palate.  What I
wonder is, is this the thing you miss when forced to smoke a
Camel?

(God, what people won't do for a drug!)

-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
From: fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Redefining masculinity
Date: 22 Aug 92 14:02:26 GMT

bobsarv@microsoft.com (Bob Sarver) writes:
>/Bob, do you believe that what you call 'flamboyant gays' are flamboyant
>/because they want to deliberately upset straight society? 
>Sometimes.  The shock value can be fun in and of itself.  
>Sometimes people do it because it's fun.  
>Sometimes it's escapism.

And what else motivates 'flamboyant gays (*)' according to you? Or is this all? 
Or might there be more you know nothing about?


>/If not totally, do you think that that is a major big component in their
>/motivation to be flamboyant?
>I don't understand this question:  what do you mean by "major big component 
>in their motivation to be flamboyant"?

Sorry you can't handle FJ-speak, I play with words sometimes.

Refrase: "Do you believe that 'flamboyant gays (*)' act 'like that' totally or
at least mainly for shock value?


>/Do you believe that if you get freaked out by me wearing one red and
>/one green sock, you being upset is my responsability?
>It depends.  If your goal is to impress me, or convince me that you wear
>socks just like I do, or that your sock-wearing habits are no different
>than mine, you will fail.

Fascinating answer.

First, I think it is a given that my sock-habits would be different than 
the person I'm freaking out.

Let me follow up that question: and if I do it to express my wonderful ability
to coordinate my wardrobe, and you are still upset, is it then my problem?

							FJ!!
From: billy@briarpatch.uucp (Billy Green)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: UNGAY GAY
Date:      12 Aug 92 19:35:22 pdt
Organization: Briarpatch Associates, San Francisco, CA

 anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
>>Wes Orr, Dude
>>I love Bugs Bunny!
>
>A woman-hating dude whose world is a cartoon character.

And not just *any* cartoon character, but one who frequently wears dresses, 
bras, fake tits and *lots* of make-up.  Hmmmmmm..........


Billy Green
lever.com!briarpatch!billy
toad.com!briarpatch!billy

One prefers, of course, on all occasions to be stainless and above reproach,
but, failing that, the next best thing is unquestionably to have got rid
of the body.
				--Joy In the Morning (1946)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: "Human Nature" wrt Civil Rights (was Re: Utopia)
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 13:59:46 GMT


In article <ROBERTL.92Aug16025724@luciano.Stanford.EDU>
robertl@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Robert Lodenkamper) writes:

>But there is no doubt that the ultimate goal of the civil
>rights movements --- the elimination of bigotry --- has to
>be considered an altered human characteristic.

Only if bigotry can be considered a human characteristic,
a property of human beings.  I don't think it can be.

>What progress has been made thus far has been imposed on
>society as a whole by a majority.

I don't have numbers to back me up, but I would bet the
progress that's been made (which is damn little) hasn't been
imposed on society as a whole at all, and certainly not by a
majority.  Rather, by a minority (thereby giving lots of us
some hope).  I see it not as a matter of being imposed on
the society, but rather wrested from it and paid for in
blood and suffering.  It seems to me the society as a whole
is about as racist as it ever was.

>Since there is bitter opposition to civil rights, future
>progress will also be imposed on those who disagree.

If the premise falls, so does this conclusion.

>Of course, the fact that the values of civil rights are
>imposed on those who don't agree with them is not, by
>itself, a valid argument against civil rights.

Which suggests that there might *be* a valid argument
against civil rights.  Not in my book, at any rate.

<> I have enough of a brain left that I can attribute these
<> actions [fag-bashing] to a very small and certainly not
<> representative slice of the population of Mexican Americans.
<> -- Roger Leuthner (rogerl@ingres.com)
<> Well then, I must not have a brain left anymore.  The beatings
<> from young white heterosexual men in New York, in Houston, in
<> Miami, in Chicago, in Boston, in Lincoln, in Raleigh, and many
<> other places must have driven from my head the subtle distinctions
<> between one group of young white heterosexual men and another.
<> -- Tim Pierce (twpierce@amherst.edu)
-- 
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: anderson@yak.macc.wisc.edu  Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888
From: Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: musical finale
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 92 13:50:09 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Aug22.181725.30164@watson.ibm.com>

Jason Coughlin writes:
>ohhhh, putz on all of you!  at my funeral, *everyone's* going
>to dance to Madonna's _Like A Prayer_, the version on her
>Immaculate Collection album...

I myself was more thinking of Metallica's _Fade to Black_ and
_End Game_ by Ian Anderson.... but that's more how I'd see
the music *starting*.... I'd probably end in a similar fashion,
though perhaps not with that particular song. (I tend to prefer
_Into The Groove_ or _Express Yourself_ for dancing... ;-)
 
() "Status quo" is Latin for the mess we're in.
()      -- West Texas farmer
-----
[> George D. Madison | NBCS: B8f+t+w-e+s+k+a!cv | Just say NO to razors! <]
[> It's a BEAR thing -- you wouldn't understand. <|> furr@cup.portal.com <]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jfh@netcom.com (Jack Hamilton)
Subject: Re: Quilt
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 92 07:11:21 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1992Aug22.050656.9682@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>
>On the other hand, donations to a suitable charity and a performance of
>the Durufle _Requiem_ in my honor will be much appreciated.
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Yes!  I went to sleep the other night with that on the CD player.  It
inspired a wonderful dreamy feeling in my half-awake/half-asleep state. 

-- 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Hamilton   jfh@netcom.com   P. O. Box 281107   SF, CA   94128-1107
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: cbe@unlinfo.unl.edu (cbe)
Subject: Re: Just please shoot me : )
Organization: University of Nebraska - Lincoln
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 14:44:44 GMT

tdbear@tandon.com (Tom Barrett) writes:

>In article <h!6mhqf.foucault@netcom.com> foucault@netcom.com (Howard Arthur Faye) writes:

>>Except for the mosquitos and black flies which swarm in the summer,
>>it seems like a nice place.

>Eeek!  I forgot about the bugs!  At least they mostly all die
>out during the winter.  Burlington does sound like a good
>place... only a few miles from Ben & Jerry's (wonder if they
                                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^   
>take borders?)...
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Jumping Jupiter, you mean Ben & Jerry's maintain their own armed 
forces or do they just contract to the Bundesgrenzschutz?

Colburn Eigen                    H|u> = E|u>
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Subject: our wake for rob
Followup-To: soc.motss
Summary: on with it!
Organization: none at the moment
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 23:57:24 GMT

this is just to point out that we are in fact having a great big
disorderly [it's literally out of order, with chuck having come after
a bunch of the rest of us - like i just said to melinda, you can't get
faggots to stand in line, and dykes want to get *you* to stand in
line] marvelous wake for rob, with reminiscences, bits of his letters,
poetry, and all the rest.  on with it!  (i, for one, am feeling
less crazy by the hour, thanks to what i read here.)

disorder within order, and order within disorder - something rob found
in gay life, country life, country music [thanks, howard, for posting
the 22 steps!].  when he tried anxiously to force order, it didn't
work.  he once wrote me about trying to arrange a jack-off party -
this because i had some idea of doing the same and was seeking his
advice - and said it was just a disaster because he was so *earnest*
about it, hoping to get it all *right*.

we are not earnest now, we are unhinged, and rob would love the
craziness in what we have to say (and, yes, fear it, but ask for
more).  say more...

arnold


Newsgroups: soc.motss