HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: aq817@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Steve Crocker)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: What the Trilateralists truly intend
Date: 24 Jan 1993 08:41:02 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Ted, are you seriously interested in why people criticize the CFR
or are you just asking rhetorical questions to try and make them 
look bad?

-STeve
From: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Conspiracy books
Date: 26 Jan 1993 09:30:09 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, pierce@lanai.cs.ucla.edu (Brad Pierce) says:

>Are any of these books worth reading?
>
>    _Architects of conspiracy : an intriguing history_ by William P.
>    Hoar, (Boston : Western Islands), 1984.
>
>    _Architects of fear : conspiracy theories and paranoia in American
>    politics_ by George Johnson, (Los Angeles : J.P. Tarcher), 1983.
>
>    _Conspiracies, cover-ups, and crimes : political manipulation and
>    mind control in America_  by Jonathan Vankin, (New York : Paragon
>    House), 1991.
>
>-- Brad Pierce --
>
The only one I've read of these three is Vankin.  It had a lot of useful
bibliography and had quite a bit of material on the Birchers, LaRouche,
Discordians, JFK, but nothing on the Moonies.i

I felt the book tended to make the whole field look ridiculous by
including quite a lot of material on such subjects as UFOs, floridation,
Laetrile, etc.

However I would recommend the book if only for the bibliography.

-- 


--------- All my opinions are tentative pending further data. ---------
------------ John W. Redelfs, cj195@cleveland.Freenet.edu -------------
From: spl@ivem.ucsd.edu (Steve Lamont)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Dr. Beter knows as little about Econ as he does about Science
Date: 23 Jan 1993 17:35:26 GMT
Organization: University of Calif., San Diego/Microscopy and Imaging Resource
NNTP-Posting-Host: ivem.ucsd.edu

In article <1993Jan20.234515.19194@oneb.almanac.bc.ca> kmcvay@oneb.almanac.bc.ca (Ken Mcvay) writes:
>Dr. Beter isn't _really_ dead - his Disney-produced robotoid was programmed
>to appear "dead" to fool the international Idahoist Conspiracy! Beter
>himself is said to be in hiding at Disney World, disguised as a rhinocerous
>robot.

Ah.  Idaho.  A conspiracy of cartographers.

							spl
-- 
Steve Lamont, SciViGuy -- (619) 534-7968 -- spl@szechuan.ucsd.edu
UCSD Microscopy and Imaging Resource/UCSD Med School/La Jolla, CA 92093-0608
                 "Tenants of the house,
Thoughts of a dry brain in a dry season." - TS Eliot, "Gerontion"
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:14782 soc.culture.jewish:26335 alt.revisionism:987
From: rburns@StarConn.com (Randall J. Burns)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,soc.culture.jewish,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Schmidling the Populist
Date: 28 Jan 93 00:19:17 GMT
Organization: Starnet-Public Access UNIX--Los Altos, CA  415-949-3133

In article <C1J7GM.7JE@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk> monaghan@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (N.O. Monaghan) writes:

>As far as I have been informed by postings on this group, Bo Gritz is
>certainly not a fascist - quite the opposite - is he advocating
>governmental control and direction of the economy in America. The answer
>is very simply: NO.
All this means is that the groups with which he has attempted to appeal
to see little advantage to themselves in centralized government institutions.
Gritz' ex running mate Duke is an example of someone who went from being 
enamored with Adolph  Hitler to attempting to gain respectability within the 
Republican party.

Now, the original Nazi's weren't all that attached to their economic
agenda either. Hitler started out with cadre of Nazi's that were quite
ideologically attached to a left-wing economic agenda(the predecessor of
the organization Hitler took over called itself "The Kaiser's
Socialists"). Many of the leaders of the economically left-wing Nazi's
eventually got purged.

My feeling here is that Hitler faced a fundamentally different
population than did Gritz. Economic centralism has almost always had
more appeal in Germany than in the English speaking countries. 
The Nazi leaders were, from what I can see more concerned with bringing
order out of a rather chaotic situation in Germany than any particular 
economic agenda(thus Hitlers willingness to cut a deal with large
industrialists when the opportunity presented itself). Since over 1/3 of 
the German electorate were Socialists or communists, any 
attempt to reach a "fair consensus" needed to take their interests
into account. A lot of what they saw themselves as attempting to
accomplish was _unifying_ a people who were seperated by "foreign"
ideologies.

The United States has a much more decentralist tradition than Germany.
Gritz and Duke have simply been trying to adopt to a different set of 
political realities. I honestly doubt very much if they are any more
attached to their present agenda than was Hitler. From what I can see,
Duke is attempting to create consensus among some widely disparate
groups just has Hitler did. He pays lip service to alternative healing,
Mormonism, Christian Identity, Libertarian economics, right-wing
conspiracy theory and blue collar jingoism depending on the audience.
From: lggidden@eos.ncsu.edu (LARRY GRANT GIDDENS)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: MK-ULTRA
Keywords: MK-ULTRA,MK-DELTA,CIA,LSD-25,TSD,mind control,Manchurian Candidate
Date: 28 Jan 93 20:50:40 GMT
Reply-To: lggidden@eos.ncsu.edu (LARRY GRANT GIDDENS)
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Originator: lggidden@c00538-106ps.eos.ncsu.edu


In article <1993Jan24.222535.18788@cbnews.cb.att.com>, jmk@cbnews.cb.att.com (joseph.m.knapp) writes:
> Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
> Path: taco!rock!stanford.edu!agate!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!cbnews!jmk
> From: jmk@cbnews.cb.att.com (joseph.m.knapp)
> Subject: Re: MK-ULTRA
> Organization: AT&T
> Date: Sun, 24 Jan 93 17:25:35 EST
> Message-ID: <1993Jan24.222535.18788@cbnews.cb.att.com>
> Keywords: MK-ULTRA,MK-DELTA,CIA,LSD-25,TSD,mind control,Manchurian Candidate
> References: <ZONKER.93Jan4212254@splinter.coe.northeastern.edu> <C0DwEu.1JL@ais.org>
> Lines: 8
> 
> In article <C0DwEu.1JL@ais.org> seraphim@ais.org (Henry Hardy) writes:
> >Anyone know if Owsley (sp?) is still alive?
> 
> Last I heard he is alive and well and selling designer belt buckles at
> Dead concerts (I'm not kidding, he is running some scam... er business). 
> 
> ---
> Joe Knapp   jmk@cbvox.att.com
> 

I could be wrong but didn't Oswald get shot a day or two after being caght?
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: Re: Report on Gritz from Idaho
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 06:08:04 GMT

In article <1993Jan25.053338.1294@news.ysu.edu> ad626@yfn.ysu.edu (Steve Crocker) writes:
>
>Ted, please explain what your questions about Gritz's alleged 
>anti-semitism had to do with your quote from Joe criticizing
>the doctrine of "code words". Or do you simply follow the 
>Humpty Dumpty school of linguistics.
>
>-Steve

Because attacking "Jewish bankers" is *not* criticizing the
Federal Reserve Board.  Calling for overthrow of "the Zionists who've 
taken over the government from Christians" is *not* criticizing "the 
New World Order."

When people have noted these anti-Semitic statements by Gritz,
we've been repeatedly told that he was *really* criticizing the
Fed, or the NWO.  When he wasn't.  Hence the use of the term
"code words."
-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
standard disclaimers          | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,soc.culture.jewish,alt.revisionism
From: arf@ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: Re: Schmidling the Populist
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1993 04:29:10 GMT
Organization: ddsw1.MCS.COM Contributor, Chicago, IL
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

monaghan@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (N.O. Monaghan) writes:
: harry@hershele.alf.dec.com (Harry Katz) writes:
: >In article <1j09npINN25m@slab.mtholyoke.edu>,
: >jyanowit@mtholyoke.edu (Jason Yanowitz) writes:
: 
: >	The notion that Bo Gritz isn't a racist, anti-semitic, sexist
: >	pig is grounded in a skewed sense of reality.  He's the head
: >	of the Populist Party, a proto-fascist/extreme right-wing
: >	organization...
: 
: As far as I have been informed by postings on this group, Bo Gritz is
: certainly not a fascist - quite the opposite - is he advocating
: governmental control and direction of the economy in America. The answer
: is very simply: NO.

The pathetic point here is that most of what Gritz supports is good for 
American but he happens to oppose the standard blind support for Israel
so the friends of Israel react with all their jewhating rhetoric to
kill the messenger in hopes of drowning out the mesage.

Gritz happens to believe that he and God will run the country if he had
his way and I think we have seen enough of what has been done in the name
of God but aside from that, he is a genuine hero no matter what the
From: lwb@cs.utexas.edu (Lance W. Bledsoe)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: What the Trilateralists truly intend
Date: 26 Jan 1993 10:54:37 -0600
Organization: CS Dept, University of Texas at Austin
NNTP-Posting-Host: im4u.cs.utexas.edu

>In article <1993Jan25.062730.2960@news.ysu.edu> ad626@yfn.ysu.edu (Steve Crocker) writes:
>> I have been a political
>>supporter of Lyndon LaROuche for about 15 years, and during that time I
>>would estimate I have read about 50-80% of his published work, as well
>>as much material written by his associates. 

In article <1993Jan25.165010.8570@starbase.trincoll.edu> nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller) writes:
>Now I understand what I should have realized from the
>start.  15 years!  Enough to pickle anybody's brains.
>In common charity I shall no longer trouble Steve.

Yes, this is fairly common.  Some people (aka Steve) invest their precious
time trying to fix the situation.  Other people (Norman) find it hard to
argue with these people on an intellectual basis, so they resort to
cheap shots and name calling.

Steve, remember that when you get close to the squirrels, the dogs
will start to bark. :-)

Lance


-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  Lance W. Bledsoe        lwb@im4u.cs.utexas.edu        (512) 258-0112  |
|  "Ye shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall make you free."         |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:14448 alt.activism:21150 alt.society.civil-liberty:7471 alt.individualism:6262 alt.censorship:10063 misc.headlines:7538 soc.culture.usa:9973 misc.activism.progressive:10230
From: nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu (norman miller)
Subject: Re: Jewish Bankers
Organization: Trinity College, Hartford, CT.
 <1k2t7kINNcm1@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 15:29:32 GMT

To John Redelfs:

Okay, I'm a Nazi agent.  Fits with your previous bout with
logic.  You really ought to avoid heavy lifting.  Can't you
find a hobby that doesn't require thought?

Norman Miller
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:14487 alt.activism:21203 alt.society.civil-liberty:7488 alt.individualism:6266 alt.censorship:10079 misc.headlines:7543 soc.culture.usa:9998 misc.activism.progressive:10257
From: jad@ckuxb.att.com
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa,misc.activism.progressive
Subject: How to Investigate the Claims of Abnormally Low Traffic on a.c.jfk ?
Keywords: How to investigate the claims of abnormally low traffic on a.c.jfk ?
Date: 22 Jan 93 20:35:58 GMT
Followup-To: alt.conspiracy.jfk,alt.conspiracy
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Originator: rich@pencil.cs.missouri.edu

Over at least the past year, I have seen complaints by posts
and by e-mail that there seems to be an abnormally low rate
of posting to the newsgroup "alt.conspiracy.jfk". The time 
to check out this problem is long overdue.

I'll tell you my way of checking it out. Very soon, I plan to begin 
reposting, to alt.conspiracy.jfk only, the series titled, 
"PACIFICA RADIO Investigates the Murder of President Kennedy."
If anyone reading this series notices that any numbered installment
of that series is missing in the numerical sequence of installments,
I suggest that they post a notice that a specified installment is
missing, and urge readers to e-mail the system administrator of
the site involved with requests to investigate the circumstances of
the missing article. I also suggest that readers ask that the
system administrator report back to the requester with his/her
findings, whence the requester ought to post those findings.
In this way, the net community will be satisfying its need to
know what's going on -- whether or not articles are accidentally
or deliberately being barred from public view. 

Moreover, if anyone has knowledge of the absence of any article
at their site, please post a notice to inform the net participants.
There are ways to detect such absences. I'll leave it to 
follow-up posters to describe such methods of detection.

    John DiNardo
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: rburns@StarConn.com (Randall J. Burns)
Subject: Re: Bo Gritz/Federal Reserve
Organization: Starnet-Public Access UNIX--Los Altos, CA  415-949-3133
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1993 08:31:37 GMT

In article <1993Jan18.131300.27961@midway.uchicago.edu> thf2@midway.uchicago.edu writes:

>Alan Greenspan is not a Jewish bank owner.  He's a government-appointed
>official whose term ends in 1993, and is subject to the whims of the
>president and Congress.  That he's Jewish makes the Fed no more under
>Jewish control than that the Attorney General's office is under Jewish
>control because Zoe Baird is Jewish.  (Baird's husband teaches at Yale
>Law, by the way.  Part of the conspiracy?)

Mr. Frank, let me ask you:

1) Do you feel it is sheer and utter coincidence that several of the
   most prominent financial criminals in recent decades have been Jewish
   (i.e. Ivan Boesky, Michael Milken, Meyer Lansky)? Would it be fair 
   to say that just as Jews have produced a disproportionate number of
   doctors, lawyers and Nobel prize winners, they produced a
   disproportionate number of certain types of criminals.

2) Do you think it would be fair to say that the cohesiveness and
   and educational strengths of the Jewish community have contributed to
   the production of this particular breed of criminals?

3) Do you think it fair to say that the production of this particular
   type of criminal is utterly incomprehensible to people who haven't
   had much direct exposure to cosmopolitan cultures?

------------------------------------------------------------

Personally, I see Gritz's speculation in the same vein as the attempts
of ignorant people to attempt to undertand the dynamics of organized
crime-and Mr. Frank's comments in the vein of comments that attempted
to deny the existance of the Mafia.

n
From: KHILL@nervm.nerdc.ufl.edu
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: CFR/Trilateral - Who's who in Clinton's Govt?
Date: 27 Jan 93 15:36:41 GMT
Organization: University of Florida, NERDC

In article <1993Jan26.115449.35879@ucl.ac.uk>
ubjta56@ucl.ac.uk (Paul Day) writes:
 
>
>Given that we have had the recent posting of "The Insiders", and now
>the current hot debate on whether or not the CFR/ Trilateral
>Commission are *really* trying to create a New World Order, perhaps
>this would be the ideal time for someone Stateside to post a list of
>suspected/possible/definate CFR/Trilateral members that have been
>placed into positions of power in the Clinton Administration. If, as
>claimed in "The Insiders" every government elected to the USA is full
>of CFR/Trilateral stooges then this government should be no exception.
>
>If, of course, these claims are so much hot air, then mayhap we find
>the Clinton administration will be remarkably CFR/Trilateral free.
>
>P.
Well, Clinton himself is a former member of TLC, but the big news is that
Peter Tarnoff, President of the CFR, is the new Assistant Sec of State
for "Political Affairs."  This is a newly created post.
 
 
They're everywhere, they're everywhere
 
 
 
 
 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa,alt.activism.d
From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
Subject: Re: REVERSING THE SCALES OF INJUSTICE: If Iraq Occupied the
Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
	<1993Jan21.024209.11223@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca>
	<C1DEMw.JwC@dartvax.dartmouth.edu>
	<1993Jan24.214943.13705@mcshub.dcss.mcmaster.ca>
Date: 24 Jan 93 14:06:22

The main problem is that the politics of the General Assembly is
corrupt.  The General Assembly has one vote per nation and most
of them are tiny.  It has voted in favor of terrorism, disguised
as a resolution affirming the right of people everywhere to use
"all means necessary" to secure their "national liberation".  The
U.S. pointed out that this resolution appeared to sanction terrorism,
provided it was carried out in the name of national liberation.
Needless to say, the U.S. argument got nowhere.

The General Assembly members would also vote that the richer countries
should pay money to the poorer ones with no requirement that the
poor countries improve their economies.
--
John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
*
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.

Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa,misc.activism.progressive
From: HADCRJAM@admin.uh.edu (MILLER, JIMMY A.)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Part 11,  Within America's Soul, Hitler is Victorious
Date: 26 Jan 1993 20:06:35 GMT
Organization: University of Houston Administrative Computing
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhad2.admin.uh.edu
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <1993Jan23.000619.10295@mont.cs.missouri.edu> jad@hopper.ACS.Virginia.EDU writes:

> 
>         The America Public is evidently in dire need of the truth, 
>         for when the plutocracy feeds us sweet lies in place of the 
>         bitter truth that would evoke remedial action by the People,
							       ^^^^^^
>         then we are in peril of sinking inextricably into despotism.

  Whenever I see the word "people" capitalized, I get nervous.  "People" does
not always = "people".  I daresay it almost never does.


semper fi,

Jammer Jim Miller 
Texas A&M University '89 and '91
********************************************************************************
* Speak for my employers?  They don't even know I exist!		       *
*"Become one with the Student Billing System. *BE* the Student Billing System."*
* "Power finds its way to those who take a stand.  Stand up, Ordinary Man."    *
*      ---Rik Emmet, Gil Moore, Mike Levine: Triumph 		               *
********************************************************************************
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa,alt.activism.d
From: wdstarr@athena.mit.edu (William December Starr)
Subject: Re: REVERSING THE SCALES OF INJUSTICE: If Iraq Occupied the
Organization: Northeastern Law, Class of '93
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 13:56:48 GMT


In article <JMC.93Jan24140622@SAIL.Stanford.EDU>, 
jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU said:

> The main problem is that the politics of the General Assembly is
> corrupt.  The General Assembly has one vote per nation and most of
> them are tiny.  It has voted in favor of terrorism, disguised as a
> resolution affirming the right of people everywhere to use "all means
> necessary" to secure their "national liberation".  The U.S. pointed
> out that this resolution appeared to sanction terrorism, provided it
> was carried out in the name of national liberation.  Needless to say,
> the U.S. argument got nowhere.
>
> The General Assembly members would also vote that the richer countries
> should pay money to the poorer ones with no requirement that the poor
> countries improve their economies.

A quibble: nothing you've said supports the contention that "the
politics of the General Assembly is corrupt," unless you want to
define "corrupt" as "produces votes the outcomes of which I don't
like."

Morally bankrupt, perhaps, but not corrupt.


-- William December Starr <wdstarr@athena.mit.edu>

Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: CFR 
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 10:16:36 GMT

In article <1jr36pINNdf6@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> aq817@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Steve Crocker) writes:
>Gee Ted, how would you have known if the CFR WAS at the inaugaration?
>Did you expect they would all carry signs?

Oh, I forgot.  They're a "secret" organization with a public membership
list and they sneakily hide their journal "Foreign Affairs" on the newsstand.

Your paranoia is showing.
-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
standard disclaimers          | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
From: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: What the Trilateralists truly intend
Date: 23 Jan 1993 08:42:31 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: cj195@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John W. Redelfs)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


> Foreign Affairs prints opinion pieces of widely diverging 
>viewpoints.


While you speak correctly when you say that Foreign Affairs prints 
opinion pieces of widely diverging viewpoints.  It is also correct to
say that they carefully avoid printing certain other viewpoints, and
some of these widely varied viewpoints get a lot more column space than
others.  Editing is a fine art.  And it is NEVER objective.

Since objectivity is ALWAYS absent in any publication, it behooves the
reader to ask himself, "What axe is being ground here?"  The axe ground
over time by FOREIGN AFFAIRS is the axe of globalism.  They want to see
a New World Order, a global government.


-- 


--------- All my opinions are tentative pending further data. ---------
------------ John W. Redelfs, cj195@cleveland.Freenet.edu -------------
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
From: thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu (Ted Frank)
Subject: Re: Yale Law One-World Government?
Reply-To: thf2@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 15:08:31 GMT

In article <1jlm5nINNcgs@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> aq817@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Steve Crocker) writes:
>
>Ted, if you really think that when the politically powerful find 
>themselves across a luncheon table from one another they have 
>nothing better to talk about than social chit-chat, I suggest you
>have a sheltered view of human nature. This would be like suggesting 
>that COMDEX participants do nothing but attend the scheduled sessions,
>that no contacts are made, deals hatched, etc. 
>
>A CFR meeting is like a "trade show" or "orofessional conference" for
>those whose business is the exercise of power as such. To assume they 
>do not use the opportunity to "network" is simply not credible.

May I ask that you (1) clarify your objection, and (2) tell us your
solution?  Is it to label all politically powerful people with a tattoo
on the back of their neck and prohibit them to play golf together or
eat lunch together or listen to a speaker together?  Are they to be
tranquilized, tagged, and tracked?

-- 
ted frank                     | thf2@ellis.uchicago.edu 
standard disclaimers          | void where prohibited
the university of chicago law school, chicago, illinois 60637
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy