HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kosinov@ceg.uiuc.edu (Greg Kosinovsky)
Subject: Re: Communism as a Russian guilt (racist conception)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 20:17:36 GMT

muh@physics.Berkeley.EDU (Yury M. Mukharsky) writes:

>In article <kosinov.724705426@ceg.uiuc.edu> kosinov@ceg.uiuc.edu (Greg Kosinovsky) writes:
>>Anatoly Marchenko). Can you name me ONE Russian Nationalist, who did NOT
>>challenge the fundumental Leninist dogma, who was imprisoned during Breznev
>>era.

>What for he will be imprisoned, then? He did not challange goverement.
>Every other nationalist would require at least some autonomy or something,
>diminishing control of the goverement. Russia is so big, that idea of
>separation from USSR was only ridiculous.

>BTW, formally Russian federation was least autonomous of all republics.

>Yury M.
>.





  The point that non-extreme-anticommunist form of Russian Nationalism did not
threaten the hegemony of USSR is well taken, and, in fact, consistent with
my post. However, it doesn't fully explain the exclusive tolerance of Russian
nationalism by Soviet authorities. The Jewish Nationalism as it was expressed
by Scharansky and others was not threatening to the hegemony of the USSR (they
did not advocate the cessation of Biribidjan :-) ), and yet they were merceles-
ly persecuted.
  I therefore repeat my claim that the tolerance of Russian nationalism by the
Soviet authorities reflected a degree of effinity.
						     Greg.
From: viznyuk@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: BUYING RUBLES
Date: 22 Dec 92 13:08:56 EST
Organization: Midwest Rat's Hole

In article <1h6b56INNnni@agate.berkeley.edu>, robohen@ocf.berkeley.edu (Henry Robertson) writes:
> I am collecting foreign currencies....if interested, please contact me
> by e-mail.                            
> 

 And me is collecting local one as well...if interested, please contact me
by e-mail.                            

Serega
From: covdy@cronos.metaphor.com (Ivan Covdy)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Kovarnye estontsy: skazhem NET ih surrogatu!
Date: 21 Dec 92 15:45:47 GMT
Organization: Metaphor Computer Systems, Mountain View, CA  USA

Ja tut, davecha, vodku pil, v Safeway'je prodaetsja, kstati.

Chto interesno, vvezena ona iz Estonii, nazyvajetsja Volganskaja (!!), 
na etiketke napisano "Old Russian Vodka" s Soborom Vas'ki Blazhennogo
na perednem plane i bashnej Starogo Tomasa (!!!) na zadnem, prichem 
bashnja na kartinke chut' vyshe, chem sobor.

Nu ne kovarnye li eti rebjata estontsy, a?

Chut' chto, tak oni, blja, otdeljat'sja, da eshche russkim grazhdanstva
ne dajut. A kak vodku Amerike prodavat', tak oni, blja, podmazyvajutsja
k "Old Russian", da eshcho propihivajut moskovskije kartinki popered
tallinnskih, ne govorja uzhe o Volge.

Koroche, prizyvaju vse progressivnoje chelovechestvo dat' reshitel'nyj otpor 
etomu besstydnomu posjagatel'stvu na drevnju russkuju kul'turu.

Ej vy, podlinnye znatoki, tseniteli i pochitateli drevnih rasejskih traditsij!
Ne dopustim popolznovenij kovarnyh chuhontsev! Ob'javim BOJKOT ih surrogatu!

(Kstati, vodka eta tak sebe, slaben'kaja, hotja tam i napisano "40%".
Ja, lichno, budu po-preznemu pokupat' Volfshmidtovku, razve chto po osobym
sluchajam Absoljut ili Finnskuju %-)

-- 
  Ivan Covdy, covdy@shemesh.metaphor.com, METAPHOR Inc.,  CA,  USA
 *** People are looking for a Mind somewhere in the Universe,      ***
 *** because on the Earth they've been finding only the Stupidity. ***
Xref: sparky soc.culture.soviet:11349 talk.politics.soviet:9878 soc.culture.europe:10661
From: viznyuk@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet,talk.politics.soviet,soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: Vorlund, the man.
Date: 21 Dec 92 13:10:29 EST
Organization: Midwest Rat's Hole

In article <12152@scott.ed.ac.uk>, alexei@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Alexei Moiseyev) writes:
> In article <12049@kesson.ed.ac.uk> alexei@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Alexei Moiseyev) writes:
>>>I apologise for attributing this to you.  It's Mr.Tammet's term.  You
>>>obviously do not regard Russian speakers in Estonia as colonists.
> 
>>  I call you troglodytes and bazzi-bazucs. Is that better ?
> 
> Yeh, this is the kind of thing I expected form you, you SQUELCHING CUNT!

       :
 ...  Vorlund    
     ..


Xref: sparky soc.culture.soviet:11468 k12.lang.russian:627
From: el@netnews.upenn.edu (El Smith)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet,k12.lang.russian
Subject: Cyrillic Transliteration
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:13:26 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.soviet
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Zrastve,

I've noticed lots of interesting and creative schemes in use
for transliterating Cyrillic to ASCII.  Some even seem to have some 
relationship to Russian orthography. ;^)

I'd like to use a Cyrillic font for displaying Russian on a terminal, but 
the transliteration schemes make this come out no closer to Russian.
I have enough trouble spelling Russian correctly without this added 
wrinkle.

I am guessing that Russians don't use the "zh", "shch" etc. 
conventions, since this is an English orthographic convention.  And I'm 
guessing that they do use ASCII.  What is that something?

Would some kind soul be willing to explicate the vagaries of how Cyrillic 
is | can be | ought to be rendered via ASCII?

So, my questions are:
1) What is the arrangement of keys on a Russian typewriter/terminal?  Is that 
the arrangement that you use?  What's the best way for an English-speaking 
typist?  
2) Is there anything close to a standard for letter-for-letter 
transliteration of Cyrillic into ASCII (or, less desirably, extended ASCII) 
characters?  And what is it?  How is this being done in Russia?  
A correspondence of ASCII (or less-desirably-but-probably-necessarily, 
extended ASCII) codes to Cyrillic would be very helpful.  
3) Last but not least, do any of these schemes provide for representing 
stressed syllables?  Or at least /jo/.

Bolshoe spasibo,
--
"All of the statements here are false, including this one."
      El Smith | Networking Consultant, CRC, University of Pennsylvania
(215) 898-9090 | el@lwnext.crc.upenn.edu                     ()B^)>X


--
"All of the statements here are false, including this one."
      El Smith | Networking Consultant, CRC, University of Pennsylvania
(215) 898-9090 | el@lwnext.crc.upenn.edu                     ()B^)>X
From: swinitzk@jade.tufts.edu (Serge Winitzki)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: Another zagadka.
Date: 26 Dec 92 23:44:02 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA

In article <1hfefoINN4ef@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> br707@Cleveland.Freenet.Edu writes:
>
>Here is another zagadka for all of you. I could not solve it and could
>not locate ther person who posted it so maybe someone in this group can
>solve it:
>
>
>   Well there is this one guy who wants to get into this city. To get into
>the city he has to go through one of the two IDENTICAL gates. Only 1 GATE
>leads to the city but it's impossible to tell since they are identical.
>'Podle' (near) each gate there is a guard. So there is a total of two
>guards who are twins and they are exactly IDENTICAL. The only difference is
>that one of them always tells the TRUTH and the other always LIES.
>
>What question must the guy ask (only 1 question) to get into the city?
>
>This is not as easy as it seems...
>
>
>
>TTYL,
>M.
>
>Happy Holidays.
>
>-- 
>   Nighthawkk   | "No one holds command over me.  No man.  No god.  No Prince.
>       of       |  What is a claim of age for ones who are immortal?  What is a
> NIGHTMARE Inc. |  claim of power for ones who defy death?  Call your damnable 
>                |  hunt.  We shall see who I drag screaming to Hell with me."

To: br707@Cleveland.Freenet.Edu
Subject: Re: Another zagadka.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA
Cc: 
Bcc: 
		The "Identical Gates and Sentries" Puzzle, Etc.
(What should you ask to find the correct answer to a question if the person is
either always telling the truth or always lying?)
Here is a scientific way to get the answer.
	Suppose G is a Boolean variable meaning "your question",
and H means "The person tells lies". Suppose F(G,H) means any question to be
asked being a logical function of G and H. Then the answer the person gives
will be obviously F(G,H) .XOR. H (exclusive OR). Our purpose is to get G as the
answer - therefore we have 
				F(G,H) .XOR. H = G,
 and solve this for F:
  				 F = G .XOR. H

  The question, therefore, should be: "is it true that either G
 or you always lie but not both?"
I think it is not easier to see why this works than to check the
validity of the previous answers given in the articles 10183 and 10184 - and
the methodological value of the suggested solution is undoubtable. 
		
		Serge Winitzki (swinitzk@jade.tufts.edu)
From: CDELL@VAX1.UMKC.EDU ("VALENTINE M. SMITH")
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Annual call for your old calenders ...
Date: 23 Dec 92 21:35:27 GMT
Reply-To: "soc.culture.soviet via ListServ" <SCS-L@indycms.iupui.edu>

Dear Listreaders,

As some of you undoubtably know, every year I've been on the nets
(sine 1989), I have put out a request for your old calenders; odd,
new, novelty, art, in different languages, photo, whatevver, send
them along to -

Valentine Smith, 5324 Virginia, Kansas City, Missouri, USA 64110-2663

Any I get will be gratefully appreciated, include your e-mail address
and I'll be sure to send you a thank you note. With regards, VMS
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
From: rubarkh@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Alex Rubarkh)
Subject: Ukrainian consulate
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 05:23:04 GMT

Hello everyone,

I am seeking info about the Ukrainian consulate to the US.
Does someone know where the consulate's office(s) are? The
address and/or phone number of the consulate would be appreciated.

Please reply by e-mailing to rubarkh@phoenix.princeton.edu.

Thanks,

--Sasha
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
From: mkagalen@lynx.dac.northeastern.edu (michael kagalenko)
Subject: Re: Communism as a Russian guilt (racist concepti
Organization: Northeastern University, Boston, MA. 02115, USA
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 00:03:18 GMT

In article <kosinov.725068630@ceg.uiuc.edu> kosinov@ceg.uiuc.edu (Greg Kosinovsky) writes:
>verbit@brauer.harvard.edu (Mikhail S. Verbitsky) writes:
>                  ..................................
>
>>	The saying "I was raped more heavily that thou"
>>	is of extremely bad tone. Contemporary Russian
>>	writers who lived outside of USSR were banned,
>>	as were Jewish ones; dissidents too. All others
>>	were tolerated as far as their loyality went.
>>	Monarchists and anticommunistic nationalists
>>	(as, say, neo-Nazi) were considered most disloyal,
>>	and otkazniks - less. Period.
>
>>	Misha.
> I would sincerely hope that otkazniks were treated better than Nazis; if that is
>the kind of argument that's needed to disprove my case, then I might as well rest
>it, which I will, as soon as I make the following observations.
> 1) "I was raped more heavily than thou" is a normal statement, if it happens to
>be true.               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I'm impressed again. I guess the Soviet press is not your only source of
info: definitely there're some feminist journals as well.
From: schoinas@fox.cs.wisc.edu (Yannis Schoinas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: Bulgarians, Bosnians, and Croats (was re: Will Russia stand beside Serbia?)
Date: 22 Dec 92 06:57:39 GMT
Organization: U of Wisconsin Madison - Computer Sciences

iad@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Ivan A Derzhanski) writes:

>In article <1992Dec21.033927.18749@husc3.harvard.edu> zeleny@husc10.harvard.edu (Michael Zeleny) writes:
>>Bulgarians are an authentic thorn in the side of the Baltic fascists:
>>Orthodox Christians, speaking a Southern Slavic language, but descended
>>from an ancient Finnish tribe, who conquered the Slavs of Moesia in the
>>seventh century C.E.; the facts are well-known, and incontrovertible.

>The facts are well-known and incontrovertible, except the above
>contains three grave errors: (1) the Proto-Bulgars were not a Finnish
>(or even Finnic), but a Turkic tribe, (2) they came to the south side
>of the River Danube as settlers, not as conquerors, and they became
>allies of the Slavic population in their struggle against Byzantium,
>and (3) since the Slavs were much more numerous than the Bulgars,
>present-day Bulgarians are descendants of the Slavs to a much higher
>degree than they are descendants of the Bulgars.

I would say that you are very accurate on your second point. 
Do you care to explain to me the difference between settlers
and conquerors? As for the relationship of the Bulgars and
their Slavs subjects, I would not say it was as romantic as 
you suggest.

					 Bye,
					Yannis.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
From: LANDSBERG@sbhep2.phy.sunysb.edu (Greg Landsberg)
Subject: Re: Communism as a Russian guilt (racist conception)
Organization: SUNY at Stony Brook
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 04:06:07 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <1992Dec23.185741.18806@husc3.harvard.edu> verbit@brauer.harvard.edu writes:

> If you consider only
> "mestechkovye" Jews as Jews (is there a translation, btw?)
> 
> Misha.

"Russko-Anglijskij slovar'" by Taube et al. propose to use ``township'' for
"mestechko." However,  ``Webster's New World  Dictionary'' does not contain
any comments on Jewish settlements, though the lexical meaning is close:

``town-ship (toun'ship)  n. [ME tunscipe < OE,  people living in a tun: see
TOWN & -SHIP] 1. orig., in England,  a parish or division of a parish, as a
unit of territory and administration  2. in parts of the U.S. and Canada, a
division  of a   county,   constituting a  unit of  local   government with
administrative  control of  local schools,  roads, etc. 3.  In New England,
TOWN (sense 4b) 4. a  unit of territory in the  U.S. land survey, generally
six miles square containing 36 mile-square sections, and sometimes, but not
necessarily, coextensive with a governmental township.''

According   to  this   definition   (sense  3)  you,  Misha,  is a  typical
"mestechkovij evrej" :-)! (Sorry, can't resist)

Cheers,

Greg
From: hubey@pilot.njin.net (Hubey)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: Bulgarians, Bosnians, and Croats (was re: Will Russia stand beside Serbia?)
Date: 22 Dec 92 06:24:09 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

In article <1992Dec21.033927.18749@husc3.harvard.edu> zeleny@husc10.harvard.edu (Michael Zeleny) writes:


> Bulgarians are an authentic thorn in the side of the Baltic fascists:
> Orthodox Christians, speaking a Southern Slavic language, but descended
> from an ancient Finnish tribe, who conquered the Slavs of Moesia in the
> seventh century C.E.; the facts are well-known, and incontrovertible.


Does this mean that the Bulgars were Finnish and spoke Finnish and
not Turkic ?  Are the Balgars (Balkars) of the Caucaucus also
Finnish ? Any relation to the Bulgars of Bulgaria or the Bulgars
of the Russian steppes ?  

Is the word Bulghar of Turkic origin (as in from the root of the
verb 'bulgha') or is it Finnish ?  

Are some of their words left over such as kutrigur, alpertem etc
also Finnish ? 

Were the Bulgars descended possibly (or related to) the Avars
or the Huns ? Were they Finnish too ?


Perhaps you are referring to the Slavic speaking inhabitants
of a country called Bulgaria, which was named after the
Bulgars which might or might not be the Finnish people that
you are referring to.  Who was Finnish, the Turkic speaking
Bulgars or the Slavic speaking inhabitants of the area who
eventually assimilated the Bulgars ?
-- 

	mark	


   hubey@pilot.njin.net                   hubey@apollo.montclair.edu
 ...!rutgers!pilot!hubey                  hubey@logos.montclair.edu
From: sorokin@ps1.iaee.tuwien.ac.at (Zhenja)
Subject: Re: Russian Speakers in Estonia: The Linguistic Approach.
Organization: Inst. for General Electrics & Electronics, TU Vienna
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 13:48:13 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.140921.1@cc.helsinki.fi> thietaniemi@cc.helsinki.fi writes:

>In article <1992Dec20.181605.24654@enea.se>, sommar@enea.se 
>(Erland Sommarskog) writes:

>> If you are talking every-day life, you are probably right that there
>> are many situations where the Russians face a negative attitude because
>> of their language. But don't you think that it might have something
>> to do with the fact that the Estonians associate 50 years of oppression
>> with the Russian language? 



>Only one curiosity:
>The Estonian communist party (which was neither "Estonian", nor "communist",
>nor "party") held it's first plenary session in Estonian in September 1988
>- during the so-called "singing revolution".


>> This association may or may not be correct,
>> but what I am interested to know is: do you have any understanding
>> for such sentiments?


>The question Erland has posed is an important one indeed! I would
>be glad to hear more Russian reflections on this. The Russians have
>to accept the fact that many Russians have to live abroad - but can you
>understand the feelings and different kind of language legislations
>of small countries that have a Russian-speaking minority?

Yes, I understand it very good. For example, my mother studied German in her
school years, but after her brother was killed in the WWII, she instinctively
couldn't listen to german speech, found it ugly, and so on. This will not
go away, she will die with it. The same is true for very many families in 
Russia, Ukraine, Byelorussia, Poland. So what?!!??

There is a big, very big difference between democracy and direct democracy.
There is a huge amount of street-level anti-semitism all over the world,
there is street-level racism in the US (from both sides, actually), but 
could you imagine that such argumentation like Tanel's were used for issuing 
laws and constitutions? 
Direct democracy can be used only in such cases like Switzerland.
When Balts get some 700 years of democratic tradition, independancy,  
neutrality and welfare behind them, then maybe they could use direct 
democracy, based upon common prejudices (that's actually what direct 
democracy is). To get it stable, they must  provide also the same 
practically sealed immigration legislation for some 200 years. The whole  
will take about a hundred years of civil wars (like it took for 
Switzerland). And, do not forget, there are 3 languages in Switzerland, and 
at least two of them were from previous oppressors (German and French).

>asks 
>the observer
>Tapani Hietaniemi, Universitas Helsingiensis
>                   urbs fennorum
From: DLVGC@CUNYVM.BITNET (Dimitri Vulis)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: modem for Russia
Date: 27 Dec 92 19:36:45 GMT
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

In article <BzwH3A.JAn@world.std.com>, ralex@world.std.com (Aleksey Y Romanov)
says:
>A friend of mine would like to buy a modem to use it in Russia.
>What is a reasonable speed he should look for ?
>Are hays modems popular in Russia ?
>Can fax modem work over Russian telphone lines ?
Don't get HAYES brand modem, unless you have lots of money to blow.
Hayes is an excellent choice for U.S. because of good support and warranty
but you're not going to get them in xSU anyway, so go for a Hayes compatible
(actually, it's hard to find a modem that's not Hayes compatible these
days :).  Because Russian phone lines are so dirty, it's a good idea
to get a modem with some sort of error correction/detection: MNP 5 and/or
CCITT. (Note that the modem on the other end must support it too).
I've heard particularly good reports about ZyXEL modems' performance
in the USSR.  For about $320 you get an up to 14.4K modem and fax,
all sorts of protocols, and unlike Hayes, you can raise the transmit
level (the volume at which the modem shouts into the phone line) ---
very helpful there. :)

But if you're going to communicate, say, only within Moscow city limits,
then a $30 2400 bps modem with no error correction may do as well.

Dimitri
Disclaimer: CUNY/UCC and modems are two things incompatible :)
From: zeleny@husc10.harvard.edu (Michael Zeleny)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Bulgarians, Bosnians, and Croats (was re: Will Russia stand beside Serbia?)
Date: 21 Dec 92 08:39:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Dec21.033927.18749
Organization: The Phallogocentric Cabal

In article <1h3p3oINNb1a@agate.berkeley.edu> 
muh@physics1 (Yury M. Mukharsky) writes:

>In article <1992Dec20.154305.1@jaguar.uofs.edu> 
>mam18@jaguar.uofs.edu writes:

MM:
>>Now, if you talk about "Slavic brothers", then don't include Bulgaria in this
>>list, for it's a common mistake to call them Slavic, while they are not Slavs
>>at all.  The other point is, that Serbs are not the only Slavic people of
>>x-Yugoslavia.  What about Bosnians and Herzegovinian, along with Croats?  Well,
>>Croats are Muslim, but they still Slavs, and the obligations of Russia toward

YM:
>Let others correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Bulgarians slavs? I would like
>to see some more arguments against this. They were concurred by Bulgarians from
>Volga, from whom they inherited the name and about nothing else, but who of
>slavs was not?

Bulgarians are an authentic thorn in the side of the Baltic fascists:
Orthodox Christians, speaking a Southern Slavic language, but descended
from an ancient Finnish tribe, who conquered the Slavs of Moesia in the
seventh century C.E.; the facts are well-known, and incontrovertible.

YM:
>As for Croatians, aren't they Catholics. It's Bosnians who are Muslims, aren't
>they. It's true that Bulgarians and Serbs, beeing Orthodox were closer to Russia
>then other Slavs.

Correct.  Croats have the One True Church written all over them.
Bosnians are the descendants of the urban elite, who were converted to
Islam by their Ottoman Turkish rulers.

>Yury M.

cordially,
mikhail zeleny@husc.harvard.edu
"Le cul des femmes est monotone comme l'esprit des hommes."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.soviet