HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: butteris@dingus.ssc.gov
Subject: Re: Is homesteading still possible?
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 20:25:12 GMT

Lawrence London writes
> In article <1992Sep2.160656.11049@sunova.ssc.gov>  
butteris@dingus.ssc.gov writes:
> > I was wondering if any countries, including the USA, still homestead.  
If  
> > so, which ones and how do I get more information about them? 
> I thought this was something you did after procuring a piece of land;
> you go out there and live on it, gradually becoming self-sufficient
> after installing the necessary facilities, i.e. water, garden,  
livestock,
> housing, processing and storage, workshop, etc.
> What are you referring to?

I was primarily referring to the acquisition of "free" land for further  
(personal) development. i.e. the land costs nothing and you own it after  
5-10 years and have developed it to the standards agreed to. 



    The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
>      North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
>         Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
>            internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: amirza@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu (Anmar Caves)
Subject: Re: Ban Gas * and other stuff
Followup-To: sci.energy,sci.environment
Keywords: weedeaters, chainsaws and tractors oh my
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 01:24:32 GMT

In article <bill.714424569@chaos.cs.umn.edu> bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu writes:
>In <1992Aug12.133951.26763@relay.nswc.navy.mil> snorthc@nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt) writes:

I'm not trying to be down on bill here, it just happened to be his
posting I picked to followup to.

Really folks, this series of threads are much better left to the
various such discussions that go on on sci.energy and sci.environment.

Misc.rural used to be such a quiet, tranquil place, 'cept for the
roosters at 5am, and the cows mooing and deer jumping the fence to
munch the garden.  Oh, and of course the grain dryers in the fall.
But aside from that misc.rural is a nice place to live, please let's
try to keep it that way.

Discussions of the emmisions of power yard tools fit right in with
sci.environment and sci.energy, and keeping in with such, followups
are directed there.


-- 
Anmar Mirza   # Mayor of Dogspit, IN  #My Opinions! Not IU's!# Will be
EMT-D         # Located somewhere in  # Legalize Explosives! # President
N9ISY (tech)  # the Outback of the    #I've got my own fusion# for Food
Networks Tech.# Mirza Ranch.C'mon over#plant. Just ask me.   #Space For Rent
Newsgroups: misc.rural
Newsgroups: misc.rural
Subject: Re: Is homesteading still possible?
From: <JCLEWIN@MTUS5.BITNET>
Date: Thursday, 3 Sep 1992 11:22:54 EST
Organization: Computing Technology Services, Michigan Technological Univ.

In article <1992Sep2.152749.2945@hemlock.cray.com>, dadams@cray.com (David
Adams) says:
>
>In article 11049@sunova.ssc.gov, butteris@dingus.ssc.gov () writes:
>|
>| Hi,
>|
>| I was wondering if any countries, including the USA, still homestead. If
>| so, which ones and how do I get more information about them?
>|
>| :+]
>| Jamey B @ SSC
>
>
>I have heard rummors that certain counties in Northern Minnesota still
>offer Homesteads.  The idea is to attract people to move north.  I don't
>know how to verify that.
>
>---
>--David C. Adams  Statistician  Cray Research Inc.  dadams@cray.com
>___________________________________________________________________
I seem to remember this too.  If I recall they WERE giving away land... but
there was a catch... You had to have some means of supporting yourself:either
lots of money, or had some skill that could be readily used in the area.  I
also seem to recall that you had to fill out a form saying you were the
"right" kind of person (i.e. not a felon, you might have had to been married,
I can't recall the details).  I believe that generated alot of interest, but
they cancelled the whole plan.

Jeff Lewin MTUS5.bitnet.

Houghton, MI.  Gotta get out my snow blower, leaves are already changing.
Maybe we will get more snow, 150 inches was sort of a drought, you know ;).
>       Old Sourdoughs never die.  They just ferment away.
>
>
>
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu ()
Subject: Re: well's - pumps/pressure tanks
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:21:02 GMT

In <bill.714792608@chaos.cs.umn.edu> bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu () writes:

>In <2304@devnull.mpd.tandem.com> marym@mpd.tandem.com (Mary Matejka) writes:


>>We are buying some property that comes with a deep well. I am

>>It is shut off for the most part. I had to turn power on to
>>get any water out. And I guess the water had all drained out of

>this is normal. you will also notice the water pump firing up even
>when no water is currently being used. this is only a problem when it 
>runs a lot (yea, right! whats 'a lot'?)

ok. well (ha!) since you asked. i thought i'd answer here, so's we can
compare. for example at night (no water usage) the pump will run for about
60-90 seconds every oh hour and half two hours (never really timed it
and i don't notice it anymore, hmmm i think i'll time it if i can remember
to do that. it may take a while for me to get back on this as i'll need 
to wait for it to happen, without falling asleep or forgeting what i was
doing :-)

so what have others noticed?
obtw i'm using a 20 gal pressure tank, i would use a static pressure tank
mounted up high, but it'd freeze in the winter without a heated space 8-O

bill pociengel
--
bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu ()
Subject: Re: Ban Gas Weedeaters
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 23:09:42 GMT

In <122980015@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> byrnes@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (John Byrnes) writes:

>> While oil is cheap....we should be making Ethanol production more feasable, 
>> which has the following benefits:
>> 
>> 3> made here in the USA, or wherever you are & can build a still
>> 5> renewable resource (corn, etc)

>I've posted this before, so this will be quick...
>Environmental experts (quoted in Time, etc) have concluded that burning
>Ethanol instead of Oil is *worse* for the environment by a large factor.
>The amount of fresh water used, pesticides, fermentation gases, etc.
>cause more damage overall.

hmmmmmm. ok riddle me this. what does not use pesticides, contains fermintation
gases, and does not waste water??

ok?

organic farming. so what if i loose some crop to bugs or it's not 'pretty'
i a) don't care if it has a long shelf life b) don't care if a bug has been
eating on it.

closed system digester. why should i want to waste all that 'waste' methane?
hmmmm is there some inherent reason why that can't be removed from the system
as it is generated, condensed, and stored? now i can cook with it, etc. i'll 
bet i can power it via photons, free of charge no less. we accually have
alot of sun up here thats why it gets chilly sometimes in the winter :-)

closed system digester. why must i waste water? yes i will need to add some
water to the system (no i have not yet done a systems analysis of a closed
loop digester, this is all from memory of some nasa work i've seen).

the waste can be composed and returned to the fields as fertilizer.

last but not least, i prefer to get most of my real scientific information
from those who do it. not those who write about someone who wrote about
someone, who knew someone, who thought they'd heard about it from their
brothers wife's cousin :-) it is amazing how much information is available
that you and i have already paid for. some of this info (i hope) will be
available online when/as the project talked about (breifly) here come to
fruition.

bill pociengel

ps no i'm not an Environmental experts (tm) just a joat (ok gene, here it is:
Jack
Of
All
Trades
^
|


usually refered to in the shipbuilding industry as one who can do any job
required to repair or build a ship i.e. use a cutting torch (professionally)
weld (professionally), read blueprints (professionally), operate heavy eqpt,
etc, etc, etc ... on and on ho-hum. now i do the same with computer hw and sw.
it pays the bill's.)
--
bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: mpleis@iastate.edu (Cowboy)
Subject: Real Farms
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 20:59:24 GMT

We need a discution about real farms here. I mean a farm you make your living
from, not just a little plot in the country.  Can everybody post what kind of
operaton they have and the size and something about it.  Maybe we can get
a threat that is "rural" related other the how to make bread or dig a well.

Our farm this year is as follows:
2500 acres crops
90 head dairy soon to be 300+ (Reg. Jerseys)
4 families live and work the farm
N.E. Iowa location
We are all computerized.
Plus we write software for farms, sell software and hardware, and design new
special equipment for farms and dairys.

-- 
mpleis@iastate.edu     Mark L. Pleis 
Agricultural Systems Technology, Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa
From: de5@ORNL.GOV (Dave Sill)
Newsgroups: misc.rural
Subject: Re: Composting
Date: 1 Sep 92 19:35:27 GMT
Organization: Oak Ridge National Lab, Oak Ridge, TN

In article <ASHWIN.92Sep1110829@leo.gatech.edu>, ashwin@gatech.edu (Ashwin Ram) writes:
>We want to start composting leaves (yes, fall is here!) and kitchen garbage
>in our back yard, and would like some advice on exactly how to go about doing
>this.  Where does one start?

There's a good book published by Rodale Press, I believe, called _Let it Rot_.
But it's really easy to do.  Stack some cinderblocks into a 4-5' square open
on one side.  Fill it with leaves, clippings, scraps, manure, etc.  A handful
of lime might help.  Keep moist but not wet.  Turn with a fork occasionally
(more frequently for faster composting).  Final product is dark, moist, earthy
smelling with some recognizable leaves & twigs.  It can take anywhere from
weeks to months, depending on size of heap, turning rate, moisture,
ventilation, material composted, etc.  Running materials through a shredder
will speed up the breakdown.  Bins can be made of wood, wire fencing, or
pretty much anything else that'll contain the heap and allow it to breath.

Turning keeps the smell down.

>I asked this question on sci.environment, and was told that misc.rural might
>have a FAQ that answers it.  If so, could someone please point me to it (or
>it to me :-))?

We don't have a FAQ, just a collection of sources (books, magazines,
mailorder, etc.) that I post infrequently.  It'd be great of someone would
volunteer to create/maintain a real FAQ	(as well as the sources articles).  I
can think of a few topics off the bat that would be good to address:

     -wells
     -water problems & conditioners/filters
     -septic systems
     -buying land
     -tractors/implements
     -livestock
     -composting
     -fencing
     -advice for urban/suburban emigrants
     -where to get X or info about X (my Sources articles)

If you followup on the FAQ thread, please change the subject.

-- 
Dave Sill (de5@ornl.gov)	   For every Bill Joy there is a Kirk McKusick.
Martin Marietta Energy Systems     For every Bill Gates there is a Richard
Workstation Support                Stallman.                     --Paul Graham
From: afitz@next.com (Alex Fitz)
Newsgroups: misc.rural
Subject: Keeping ants away
Keywords: ants
Date: 25 Aug 92 20:30:43 GMT

Does anyone know of an effective, environmentally safe way to keep ants  
from coming in your house?  (I posted this on ca.environment, but rec'd no  
responses.)

Thank you in advance, and please hurry!  

Alex Fitz
alex@next.com
Xref: sparky misc.rural:1942 rec.gardens:6272
From: klier@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: misc.rural,rec.gardens
Subject: Re: weed control (aka seed bank stirring)
Date: 27 Aug 92 12:23:06 GMT
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

langston@langston.cs.utk.edu (Mike Langston) writes:
> just when you thought it was safe to go back out in the sun
> comes this, fresh from the latest issue of `science news'
> (vol 142-8, p 127):
> 
>    "test plots plowed only at night grew roughly half as
>    many weeds as plots plowed during the day...daylight
>    plowing exposes buried weed seeds for roughly 1/4
>    second...just long enough to activate photoreceptors
>    in the seeds that prompt germination"
> 
Phytochrome activation is required for seeds of many dicot species,
so this may indeed help a lot of us out!

The hitch may be plowing on slopes is a _lot_ trickier than
plowing on level ground -- night plowing would probably be riskier.
Still, if it helps reduce dependence on herbicides, or takes one
less pass with a cultivator, this is good news!  May also help 
with prairie restoration -- one of the big problems there is
the weed seedlings tend to outcompete the prairie plants for a 
year or so!

Kay Klier   Biology Dept  UNI
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu ()
Subject: Re: well's - pumps/pressure tanks
Organization: University of Minnesota
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 23:29:02 GMT

In <1992Sep1.080129.4580@mr.med.ge.com> hinz@picard.med.ge.com (David Hinz Mfg 4-6987) writes:

>Allan BA Schlaugat (AllanWS@cup.portal.com) wrote:
>: Along the same thread, my pump, in the wintertime when the temperature 
>: is below freezing, will run every 5-10 minutes while it is not in use
>: all day and night long! 

uh this ain't right. theres no way it should be running near that much unless
you are using water, a lot of water. try and listen (when the house is quiet)
the only thing i can think of is a) the tank is incapable of holding pressure
(not likely to give you this type of symtom) b) a crack in the line which
when its cold and the pipe contracts opens the crack therby releasing 
pressure and causing the pump to start. during warm weather rust and etc
help to temporarily patch the crack. opps c) bad pressure relief valve on the
pump will cause it to 'leak down'. also not likely to cause symtoms quite
like you've described.

>: Is there any solution to this irritating problem during the winter
>: other than shutting the pump off during the evenings when we are not
>: using water?

if possible turn off all water leaving the tank. the only thing left
pressurized will be the supply side. if it still does this then (if possible)
turn off the tank. the only thing left will be the pump and supply line to
the house. if it still does this then i would guess item b) above. if not
then it must be something related to a) above. if shutting down the house
stops it then you obviously have a leak in the house plumbing. find it as
your house will prob be rotting where ever the leak is :-(


>I guess I'd have to wonder why it's cycling at all.  I would think you are
>using an awful lot of water somewhere.  Most systems have a check-valve

agreed. 

>between the pump and pressure tank, yours may be leaking H2O past it, back
>down into the well.  This would cause house pressure to go down, and kick
>in the pump again.  That's the ONLY thing I can think of unless of course you
>have a faucet or toilet running somewhere.

>BTW, I've heard that it's a good idea to leave a faucet somewhere in the house
>running somewhat during the VERY cold days (below zero), so your septic
>doesn't freeze up.  Last thing you need, in that cold Wisconsin winter, is
>to have the crapper freeze up.

this is an interesting thing to have happen. but accually i have 2 drain
fields and a transfer box to select which one is used. it froze umm 2 years
ago (no snow cover, very chilly temps) i needed to start a fire above it
(on the ground) for oh, about 7-10 hours to thaw it. then i buried the whole
thing (sans fire) under bales of straw. that helped. btw it never gets cold
here, just a bit chilly, sometimes, on occasion, in the winter, at night.;-)

bill pociengel
--
bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: mpleis@iastate.edu (Cowboy)
Subject: Farm toys
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 21:08:22 GMT

If any one is interested in Ertal toys the Iowa FFA Foundation is selling
a limitited edition on a Farmall Super H and a Farmall 350 both are $30 plus
$3 dollars shipping.  They also have a limited edtion print of an eagle for
$125.  You can get more info. by calling (515) 967-4000 or writing
Iowa FFA Foundation
Box 400
Mitchellville, IA 50169
Thanks Iowa FFA State Vice -President Northeast District M. Pleis


-- 
mpleis@iastate.edu     Mark L. Pleis 
Agricultural Systems Technology, Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa

Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: hinz@picard.med.ge.com (David Hinz Mfg 4-6987)
Subject: Re: dealing with "meat" bees
Organization: GE Medical Systems, Magnetic Resonance
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 92 07:51:04 GMT

Tom Perigrin (tip@lead.aichem.arizona.edu) wrote:
: 
: Hi,  I'm a beekeeper.
: 
(loads of fascinating stuff deleted)

: I'll be happy to discuss anything about beekeeping.


I've got an old oak log in my pasture that I was hoping to burn this winter.
It's about 3' in diameter, by 8' long.  Lotsa wood.   Problem is, the bees
(don't know for sure, but they look like honeybees) have taken up residence in
the hollow part in the middle.  I'd hate to kill off the hive, but I'd hate
to have the log rot.  Would you advise leaving it until spring, and having
a local bee-keeper take them out?  I assume that you wouldn't reccomend doing
it at this time of year, especially in sunny Wisconsin.

--

Dave Hinz  -  Opinions expressed are mine, not my employer's.  Obviously.
hinzd@picard.med.ge.com
From: clewis@ferret.ocunix.on.ca (Chris Lewis)
Newsgroups: misc.rural
Subject: Re: Keeping ants away
Keywords: ants
Date: 30 Aug 92 07:10:00 GMT
Organization: Elegant Communications Inc., Ottawa, Canada

In article <4852@rosie.NeXT.COM> afitz@next.com (Alex Fitz) writes:
>Does anyone know of an effective, environmentally safe way to keep ants  
>from coming in your house?  (I posted this on ca.environment, but rec'd no  
>responses.)

We seem to be having pretty good luck with a band of borax (you know,
the 20 mule team stuff) poured adjacent to the foundations all the
way around the house.  We had a rather major infestation of carpenter
ants (foraging for food, there's no nests inside the house *yet*)
and the borax stopped it completely.
-- 
Chris Lewis; clewis@ferret.ocunix.on.ca; Phone: Canada 613 832-0541
Psroff 3.0 info: psroff-request@ferret.ocunix.on.ca
Ferret list: ferret-request@ferret.ocunix.on.ca
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu ()
Subject: Re: well's - pumps/pressure tanks
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 01:30:08 GMT

In <2304@devnull.mpd.tandem.com> marym@mpd.tandem.com (Mary Matejka) writes:


>We are buying some property that comes with a deep well. I am
>having the water tested for bacteria. But haven't a clue as

you should have the water tested. see your county extension agent. look in
the yellow pages for their phone number.
they can tell you how they want the sample taken and delivered. the seller
should have this taken care of, and a provisso added to the offer that if
the water is bad then you have some kind of options (up to you at this
point, back out, new well somewhere else, cleanup, whatever)

>to how to what else I should look for. Or how to maintain a well.

have the water tested periodically.

>It is shut off for the most part. I had to turn power on to
>get any water out. And I guess the water had all drained out of

this is normal. you will also notice the water pump firing up even
when no water is currently being used. this is only a problem when it 
runs a lot (yea, right! whats 'a lot'?)

>the pressure tank since the well started pumping as soon as
>I flipped the switch and water kept running for several minutes
>after I turned it off. 

it was just building up pressure.

bill pociengel
--
bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: de5@ORNL.GOV (Dave Sill)
Subject: Re: Real Farms
Organization: Oak Ridge National Lab, Oak Ridge, TN
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 15:22:55 GMT

In article <1992Sep4.141350.23898@nevada.edu>, rpji@nye.nscee.edu (Rick Jenks) writes:
>... but let me tell you (as a new person to farm/ranch
>operation) it ain't "an easy road to hoe."

Maybe you should be hoeing *rows* instead of roads.  I mean, even if they're
dirt roads they're gonna be rough hoeing.  :-)

-- 
Dave Sill (de5@ornl.gov)           For every Bill Joy there is a Kirk McKusick.
Martin Marietta Energy Systems     For every Bill Gates there is a Richard
Workstation Support                Stallman.                     --Paul Graham
From: mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin)
Newsgroups: misc.rural
Subject: re: dealing with "meat" bees
Date: 31 Aug 92 01:54:18 GMT
Article-I.D.: Tomobiki.MS-C.715226058.1103527590.mrc
Organization: University of Washington
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: sawtelle@stonecutter.com
Mime-Version: 1.0

Your `meat bees' sound like Yellow Jackets, which are not bees (Apis
mellifera) at all but rather a yellow-colored wasp of the Vespidae family.
They have a well-deserved reputation for ill temper and ruining picnics and
barbeques.  My Venus Fly-Trap likes 'em though.

Yellow jackets are often attracted by perfume, cologne, or deodorant, so if
you use any of these watch out.  They usually won't sting unless provoked, but
`provocation' can include trying to brush them away from your face or your
food...

They nest in thick brush (keep your bamboo thinned out if you know what's good
for you...) and, unfortunately, in attics.  You have a *major* hassle if
yellow jackets build a nest in your attic -- it's time to call an exterminator
if that happens (and some exterminators charge extra to deal with yellow
jackets).  They also build nests under the eaves.

It's impossible to get rid of them if you live in any kind of wooded area, but
frequent application of chemicals will chase them away from your house.  There
are various folklore remedies for keeping yellow jackets away from your
barbeque, but most people just give up during the prime yellow jacket season.

Presumably the nasty things have some useful purpose for existing.  I hope so,
since they're an inescapable part of rural life.
Newsgroups: misc.rural
From: bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu ()
Subject: Re: Ban Gas Weedeaters
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 00:50:29 GMT

In <25260034@hpcvra.cv.hp.com> ben@hpcvra.cv.hp.com (Benjamin Ellsworth) writes:


>> ... weeds are far better [than grass] at erosion control.

>There are those who would class grass as a weed--"weed" being such a
>vague term--but in general, there are few plants better at erosion
>control than grass, especially root propagating grasses.

gee thats funny, but i don't see much of what many have in thier front yard
growing in any naturized pasture or woods around here. i really doubt that 
the stuff scotts(tm) sells would make it out in the field. yes 'grass' is
really pretty darn generic; as it held the great plains for a real long time!
maybe i should have said 'ornamental lawn cover, cut to a rediculious height'.

bill pociengel
--
bill@chaos.cs.umn.edu
Newsgroups: misc.rural