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Date:         Sat, 7 Nov 1992 15:45:46 -0500
Reply-To:     Ioannis REKLEITIS <yiannis@BINKLEY.CS.MCGILL.CA>
From:         Ioannis REKLEITIS <yiannis@BINKLEY.CS.MCGILL.CA>
Subject:      Re: Forward mail apo to Lewnida Iraklioth
Comments: cc: HELLAS@brownvm.brown.edu
              REKLEITIS" at Nov 7, 92 02:52:03 pm

> > O nomos autos einai entelws xalia kai mpazei nera apo mia seira
> > meries merika apla problhmata:
> > 1) Autarxikh strofh me suggentrwsh eksousiwn stous kathigites
> > prwths bathmidas kai asfuxtiko elegxo apo to upourgeio.
>
> Edw poY kollas: sto oti yparxei sygkentrwsh ejoysiwn 'h sto oti
> tis exoyn oi kauhghtes a' baumidos? Sygkentrwsh ejoysiwn yphrxe
> kai prin. To PASOK ta'xe kala me toys epikoyroys kai arketoys
> anaplhrwtes kai etsi edwse ejoysies s'aytoys. H ND ta xei kala
> me toys kauhghtes a', ki etsi s'aytoys dinei ejoysies twra.
> Giati oloi poy shmera diamartyrontai gia sygkentrwsh ejoysiwn
> sta xeria twn kauhghtwn a' den diamartyrhuhkan otan oi ejoysies
> sygkentrwnontan sta xeria twn epikoyrwn kai anaplhrwtwn;
>
> Epishs ua prepei na eimaste poly prosektikoi otan miloyme gia
> asfyktiko elegxo (to X apo poY to bgazeis sto "asfyxtiko" enas ueos
                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
1>> Prin ligo kairo kapoios sunlistobios san ena apo ta kolpa
meiwshs tou antipalou eixe anaferei kai thn epishmansh
orthografikwn-grammatikwn-suntaktikwn lathwn kalo einai na
apantas se apopseis kai oxi se lathh ;-))

> jerei). To 1982 h tote kybernhsh mhnyse sta AEI kai se polles
> dhmosies yphresies na mhn agorasoyn PC prokeimenoy na mhn
> ayjhuei h ejarthsh ths xwras apo tis HPA. Aytoi poy shmera
> milane gia asfyktiko elegxo, tote kanan thn papia.

Mhn ksexnas tous arithmous!. To na spazeis tis eksousies anamesa
se epikourous anaplhrwtes lektores prwtobathmious kai foithtes
einai
safws pio dhmokratiko apo to na tis exeis mono stous Abathmidas.

Akoma elegxos asfuktikos einai to na pernaei olh h ereuna kai ta
programmata apo to upourgeio kai polla alla!

>
> > 2) Kathierwsh 2 kuklwn spoudwn kai me auto ton tropo parapera
> > salamopoihsh twn foithtwn kai ousiastikh dunatothta elegxou tou
> > artithmou twn ptuxiouxwn apo "periergous" kathigites aplws me
> > ena mathima. Aukshsh twn xronwn spoudwn me auto ton tropo.
>
> "periergoi kauhghtes", "oysiastikh dynatothta elegxoy" kai
> alla eytrapela. Otan omws zhtoyntai stoixeia poy na tekmhriwnoyn
> tetoies katastaseis prokeimenoy oi fhmes na steriwsoyn ws gegonota
> kai na jekinhsoyn kapoies diadikasies, tote kaneis de mila.
>
Yparxoun suggekrimenes kataggelies kata ana sxolh profanws den
thumamai apeksw ta onomata.

> > Mesa sto nomo uparxei thesmos na plhrwnontai ta biblia kai o
> > upourgos pseudetai asustolos otan dhlwnei oti auto den einai
> > megalo eksodo. Akoma einai aithma gia ousiastikh sitish kai
> > stegash twn foithtwn. Paragontes pou einai anagkaioi gia na
> > mporei na spoudasei mia merida foithtwn.
>
> O uesmos twn dwrean syggrammatwn einai o,ti pio FASISTIKO kai
> LA.I.KISTIKO perase pote apo ta ellhnika AEI. Kauierwuhke epi
> xoyntas (gia osoys den uymoyntai) kai ypobibase anepanoruwta
> thn poiothta ths anwtaths paideias sthn Ellada.
>
> To biblio einai ena pneymatiko loyloydi poy anuei sta bibliopwleia
> kai oxi stoys diadromoys twn ypoyrgeiwn opws shmeiwnei ki o Traxanas.
>
> O foithths ua prepei na mporei na dialegei. Otan loipon o idios
> foithths kaue bradi dialegei se poio mpar ua t'akoymphsei, as
> epilegei kai dyo fores to xrono poia biblia ua agorasei. *OLES*
> oi alles xwres me tis opoies antagwmizomaste oikonomika/politika
> einai kauysterhmenes kai den exoyn dwrean syggrammata kai mono
> emeis eimaste oi ejypnoi dhladh?
>
Leonida den perimeneis bebaia na apostomwseis tous pantes me
auto to aplo epixeirhma pou exei teleiwsei pro dekaetias ;-)
Yparxei mia polu aplh apanthsh A) Anaptuksh bibliothhkwn.
B) Dhmiourgeia panepisthmiakou bibliopwleiou. G) Efarmoghs
kartas bibliwn pou o kathe foithths tha mporei na epileksei
anamesa se mia seira apo isaksia biblia kai malista na
upoxrewnete o kathighths na bazei themata ta opoia na mporoun na
apanththoun me gnwsh opoioudhpote apo autwn twn bibliwn.

Me autous tous treis polu aplous tropou kai sunexizetai h dwrean
dianomh bibliwn kai den uparxei problhma episthmonikothtas ;-))
Monomerh metra katargoume ta dwrean suggramata kai.......
kai.... kapote tha sas ftiaksoume kai bibliothikes!!! den
pernane




> > Ara loipon na mhn uparxei forologia na mhn uparxoun koinwnikes
> > paroxes!!! Kala to epipedo eufias tou einai kataplhktiko!!
>
> Poyuena o syntakths toy OT den anefere kati tetoio.
Oxi kata leksh alla sthn ousia!

>
> > Exei kamia idea o suntakths peri tou ti einai to panepisthmiako
> > asulo??? Telika exei idea peri tou ti einai diekdhkhsh 'h mhpws
> > epeidh autos sernete kai glufei gia na anebei nomizei oti mono
> > etsi ekselhsete h koinwnia???
>
> O syntakths isws exei. Esy kai oi katalhcies omws? Gia dokimase
> to parakatw "multiple choice test":
>
> 1. Poios kauierwse to panepisthmiako asylo;
>    A. O Eleyuerios Benizelos,
>    B. O Gewrgios Papandreoy,
>    C. O Basilias Ouwnas (apo kei bgainei kai to tragoydi stoy
>       Ouwna ta xronia opoy Bayaroi xwrofylakoi kanoyn ntoy sto EMP),
>    D. H xoynta,
>    E. O Karamanlhs,
>    C. O Antreas.
>
> Swsth apanthsh: D.
>
> To '71 h diktatorikh kybernhsh twn Auhnwn katw apo thn genikh katakraygh
> ths dieunoys koinhs gnwmhs gia katapiesh twn anurwpinwn dikaiwmatwn se
> mia ypokritikh prospaueia epideijhs kalhs diagwghs metajy allwn kauierwse
> kai dyo akratws la.i.kistika metra: (a) dwrean panepisthmiaka sygrammata
> kai (b) panepisthmiako asylo (to opoio dyo xronia argotera dixws
> distagmo katelyse).
>
> Ektote kamia kybernhsh kai kanena politiko komma (oyte kan to KKE) den
> zhthsan thn katarghsh aytwn twn epaisxyntwn xoyntikwn "eyergethmatwn".
>
> To pneyma toy panepisthmiakoy asyloy ua prepei na einai h diafylajh ths
> omalhs leitoyrgias ths akadhma.i.khs koinothtos. Epi xoyntas h omalh
> leitoyrgia apeiloyntan apo ta katastaltika organa toy kratoys kai gia ayto
> to panepisthmiako asylo apagoreye thn eisodo ths astynomias sto panepisthmio.
>
> Sto idio pneyma shmera: einai h astynomia ayth poy diatarassei thn omalh
> leitoyrgia ths panepisthmiakhs koinothtas? Oxi fysika. Eirwnia ths tyxhs:
> oi diekdikoyntes thn isxyropoihsh toy panepisthmiakoy asyloy einai aytoi
> poy to katapatoyn.

H ennoia tou panepisthmiakou asulou einai oti den mporei na
ginete pneumatikh dhmiourgeia me thn rabdo twn MAT sto diadromo.
H uperaspish tou asulou apenanti stous "kakous katalhpsies"
einai apo ta pio klasika epixeirhmata. Kai meta kai ta teleutaia
gegonota (agriws ksulodarmos foithtwn/triwn iatrikhs apo ta MAT)
thetw to polu aplo erwthma : Telika h monh lush antistashs einai
h tromokratia! Auto einai to mono pou sebete to kratos???

Mia kai opoiadhpote allh eite krinete paranomh kai pane sta
dikasthria eite katasteletai me ta MAT.

Polu sobara me auth thn katastash erxomai na anarwththw telika
mono h enoplh bia apenanth stous ekfrastes tou kratous einai h
apanthsh?




>
>
> > Einai gnwsto ths pash oti h fwtia mphke apo eksw eite apo
>                ^^^
> > aganakthsmenous polites (etheathisan merikoi sto panspoudastiko
>
> Ax Iwannh, oi katalhceis se maranan meta :-)
Blepe to prwto sxolio panw sta lathh ;-)

>
> Telos pantwn. Ekeino to "ths pash" kane to "ths pash"/2 dioti oi alloi
> misoi pisteyoyn pws h fwtia mphke apo mesa.

H logikh omws leei oti kanenas den kaiei to asulo-katafugeio
tou! kai den me peithei idiaitera  to apo mesa mphke se ena xwro
malista pou eixe diakoph h prosbash logw twn pollwn
dakrugonwn!!! apo polu nwritera.



>
> > Auto giati den to sxoliazei o kurios einai paralogo na
> > enddiaferontai oi aurianoi episthmones gia tis sunthhkes
> > eleutherias tou logou sthn xwra tous. Oi 5 ths OSE (kai oxi tou
> > OSE) diwkontai giati ebgalan ena biblio me apopseis diaforetikes
> > me ths epishmes.
>
> Mono poy tyxainei oi symperifora twn katalhciwn na mhn toys
> dikaiologei ton titlo ayrianwn episthmonwn. Twra ta peri
> synuhkwn eleyuerias, asto kalytera: dhladh h eleyueria twn
> ypoloipwn foithtwn poy ueloyn na parakoloyuhsoyn mauhmata ti
> ginetai? Mia tetoia eleyueria einai elleipobarhs fainetai gia
> toys ayrianoys episthmones oi opoioi entoytois ektimoyn thn
> eleyueria logoy poy edikaioynto oi 5 ths OSE. Lampra!
Nai bebaia h eleuteria twn kalo kuriwn emporwn na sunergastoun
me tous Germanous kai na bgaloun merika lefta parapanw mhpws
;-))
Telika uparxoun duo eleutheries fainete mono pou egw den
anagnwrizw ekeinh pou exei thn mesh diplwmenh kai thn glwssa sta
5 metra ;-)



>
> > Nomizw oti einai logiko an kopoun kai ta 90% twn foithtwn na
> > uparxei kapoio problhma.
>
> Symfwnw apolytws. To na kopei ena postosto > 60% s'ena mauhma einai
> problhma toy kauhghth, oxi twn foithtwn. Omws apo thn allh to na zhtoyme
> na kobetai ena pososto < 5% einai to idio paralogo. Anti oi fwsthres ths
> gewponikhs na zhtoyn megisto pososto aporrichs 5%, as diekdikhsoyn me
> hpio tropo prwta thn epanalhch ths ejetastikhs otan to pososto apotyxias
> einai > 60% epi twn foithtwn poy ejetazontai sto mauhma gia prwth fora.
> (ayto efarmozetai epityxws sto Fysiko Iwanninwn - ole! - exei arxisei
> na pernaei kai se alla tmhmata toy idioy panepisthmioy, dixws na exei
> ginei pote kamia dynamikh kinhtopoihsh).
>
Prepei na ksereis to panepisthmio Iwanninwn einai apo ta pio
prodeutika logiko kapoia tetoia metra na pernwntai eukola opws
px kai sto oikonomiko athinas ;-) alla gia traba na to
koubentiaseis me ton Moulopoulo ths Iatrikhs ;-)

> Filika,
> Leonidas

Yiannis