HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren)
Subject: Re: Sesame Street is HARMFUL to children (Was something else)
Organization: Test Systems Strategies, Inc., Beaverton, Oregon
Distribution: misc
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 20:08:33 GMT

dlhanson@nap.amoco.com (David L. Hanson ) writes:

>In article <KMURPHY.92Dec16095759@orangutan.cv.nrao.edu> kmurphy@orangutan.cv.nrao.edu (Kim Murphy) writes:
>>
>>While I'm sure most of us agree that
>>Sesame Street is great, we know it was never meant to be a teaching
>>tool inside the classroom.  We did tell the principal if we found this
>>to be excessive, we had no choice but to take it to the school board.

>Sesame Street is NOT great.  Jane Healy has a whole chapter in
>"Endangered Minds - Why Children Can't Think and What To Do About It"
>on the damage that Sesame Street does to young childrens' minds. 
>In a nutshell, the fast moving "non-reality" images are not good for
>children. If anything thinks they are helping their children by sitting them
>in front of the TV, think again. (Healy's book is highly recommended for
>all parents; it is especially important for those who ship their children
>off to a daycare center or use the TV to keep them occupied.)	

Are you the only one highly recomending Healy's book for all parents?
Are there any other author's out there besides Healy who think Sesame Street
is not great?  How does Healy find that the "fast moving 'non-reality' images
are not good for children" (your in-a-nutshell conclusion)?  Does she
instruct children, or is she a child psychologist?  Are we to assume that
people "who ship their children off to a daycare center" are doing an 
injustice to their children?  Are all daycare's bad?

Your ramblings are your opinions and you don't leave very much room
for a discussion.  I can't possibly take one publication (Healy's, for
instance) and base my convictions on only one source.  I read as much
as I can and try to glean consistent and/or relevant information from 
several sources.

allen
From: lisas@pucc.princeton.edu (Lisa S. Lewis)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: slow talker
Date: 16 Dec 92 21:42:49 GMT
Organization: Princeton  University
Originator: news@nimaster
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1

In article <1992Dec16.112437.62102@cc.usu.edu> Punk Rocketeer,
slb3y@cc.usu.edu writes:
>     While I'm not saying you're wrong in this case, you're wrong in
>general.  I have one uncle who did not talk at all until he was 4.  He
>had no actual problems.  He simply did not begin talking until then.
>
>     Yes, I know it's only anecdotal evidence.  And the first sentence
>of the above quote does say "in all probability."  But statements like
>that can lead to overreacting.
>-- 

No, I'm NOT wrong in general.  I may be wrong in the particular case of
your uncle, but in GENERAL children who have no language past the age of
three are suffering from a developmental delay, if not disability.

I wish I had a quarter for every time I've heard that "Einstein didn't
talk till he was four" or  "my uncle/brother/grandfather/insert relative
of your choice/ didn't talk until he was five...."

I know many, many, many children with all kinds of developmental delays
and disabilities.  While it may be true that an occasional child is
perfectly normal but "just doesn't talk" until a late age, I firmly
believe that it usually isn't.  Most children are DRIVEN to communicate. 
If a child isn't, or can't (and the original poster said her nephew was
using his own sign language to try to make his needs known) then there is
a problem.  And this child isn't even capable of making all the sounds
necessary for speech.

And even if I am wrong, better for ME to be wrong and for a team of
experts to declare that the child is "fine" than to neglect helping a
child who needs it. When there is a developmental delay, the earlier the
intervention the better.  And speech therapy doesn't HURT any child.  For
a three year old it is basically a 'play session' with someone who knows
how to get a child talking.  Just by watching a session a parent can
learn an amazing number of tricks to help their child.

I get very angry when I hear (read) people discouraging parents from
getting evaluations.  They are wasting valuable time, denying that there
is a problem.  And they will feel guilty and regretful later.

I went through this with my own son, and he was evaluated by the age of
27 months.  I still felt that I should have acted sooner.

It's true that a VERY rare child doesn't fall within the usual
developmental timetable, and still "turns out all right." But the
majority don't.  Don't discourage people from seeking information and
help because of a single (odd) datapoint.
From: ctopp@cup.portal.com (Carol F Topp)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: When Will She Smile? (35/36 week Premie)
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 92 19:53:30 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world

My daughter is now 9 weeks old. She  was born at 35+ weeks gestation.
It seems her development is a mixed bag at this point. She has some
head control, follows objects, and focuses on faces, but no smiles
yet. 

What were the experiences of other parents of premies in terms
of development. Did you need to use an adjusted age? In general,
I don't think about her  early entrance, but with one key milestone
being so late, I'm beginning to wonder.

Carol
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: Tamara Shaffer <SASTLS@mvs.sas.com>
Subject: Re: Kid not eating good food - only JUNK!!
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 19:32:00 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.

>From: tbachman@hamline.edu. (Toni Bachmann 6412947)
>Message-ID: <1992Dec11.141539.22259@uc.msc.edu>
>
>Hi:
>
>Once again I am seeking out net wisdom!
>
>My youngest son (six) Fredrick has taken to refusing to eat anything
>except junk (cookies, popsicles, candy, gum, suckers, and occassionaly
>some apples and oranges).  He plays with his food at the table and
>won't eat no matter what we try.  (We have tried bribery, Santa's
>watching, etc).  He has dark circles under his eyes, is pale, and
>thinning quite a bit (this has been going on for quite some time).  We
>tried not having any snacks in the house for him to eat but then he
>just didn't eat anything.  We locked up the snacks and said if he
>finished his dinner he could have some.  We're at wits end!!!  He will
>normally eat one or two bites of whatever is dinner - unless its
>spaghetti in which case he will eat all of it - should I just make him
>spaghetti everyday?
>
>Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!!
>
>Toni
 
 
Hi Toni. 
 
Where does Fredrick get the "junk"?  Do you break down and give it
to him?  If so, I would make sure he doesn't get it from you NO
MATTER WHAT.  (IMHO)  And yes, I'd make him as much spaghetti as
he will eat if that's what he wants.  I'm not a short-order cook,
but the kid has to eat, and hopefully it's just a phase.  And give
him all those apples and oranges he wants.
 
Have you asked him to help you plan dinners?  Maybe he wants something
you haven't tried.
 
Has he been checked by the family doctor or pediatrician?  Vitamin
supplements are probably in order.
 
Good luck.
 
TAMARA
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Tuesday, 15 Dec 1992 13:54:50 EST
From: Cindy J. Mitchell <CINDY@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject:    Cute kid story [2 yrs]

Actually this is two stories. The first is from my two year old daughter
(2 yrs, 1 month) who is very interested in potties and all the trappings
of potty training, as well as Santa Claus and Christmas.  This is a
conversation we had this morning.

Me: Erica, what would you like for Santa Claus to bring for you this year?
Erica: A present.
Me: What kind of present would you like?
Erica: A BIIIIIGGGG Present.
Me: What would you like to find inside the present?
Erica: A new potty chair!
 (One isn't enough? Wrong color? Who know!)


This is Erica's almost two year cousin during a conversation with a
daycare provider about his birthday. He'll be two on Friday.
DCP: How old will you be on your birthday Stuart.
Stuart: (Obviously doesn't know, but seeking to say something says...)
       My daddy is OLD!
DCP: How old is your dad Stuart?
Stuart: four!
  (Phew!  We're talking middle aged here!!!)

Cindy
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: staffan@ca.serum.kodak.com (Kenneth Staffan (x37507))
Subject: Dr. Dean Edell (was Re: A few facts about circumcision)
Organization: Clinical Products Division, Eastman Kodak Company
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 20:49:15 GMT

In article <gdavis.724534032@griffin> gdavis@griffin.uvm.edu (Gary Davis) writes:
>In <1gm9h6INNnp5@crcnis1.unl.edu> mpaul@unlinfo.unl.edu (marxhausen paul) writes:
>
>>gdavis@griffin.uvm.edu (Gary Davis) writes:
>
>>>In my opinion circumcision is both cruel and entirely unneeded.
>>>In fact Ben Spock does not recommend it nor Dr. Dean Edell.
>>>These MDS are some of the most well known in the culture.
>
>>And neither is a urologist.  Their notoriety has no bearing whatever
>>on their compentency to speak _on this particular issue._
>
>   Paul, I wonder who you would presume has competency in  this area.
>If you expect urologists not to defend the practice,forget it;they make
>a good fee for doing them and secondly the only foreskins they usually
>see are the ones that "don't work". I hardly think they are the speciality
>to ask. Dr. Dean Edell is paid quite handsomely,I understand,to review and
>interpret medical literature. He certainly would be the man I would trust
>in the area.


This is starting to get off the track, but since his name is being thrown
around so much, I wanted to comment.  I like Dr. Edell, but I don't totally
agree with the last couple of sentences above.  First, he is paid for his
radio and TV shows, because they draw listeners/viewers.  This does not
necessarily lend any credence to his views.  Secondly, I think a keyword
used above is that he _interprets_ medical issues.  It's true he is
_very_ anti-circumcision.  It's also true that he's _very_ pro-legalization
of drugs, but I don't see as much support for this position, as I do
for his anti-circumcision stance.  (Incidentally, I remember one show 
where he was practically jumping up-and-down from glee because an adult
male called in to say that he was less sensitive to sexual feeling since
his recent circumcision.  Dr. Dean took off on his "see what you're 
depriving your son of" speech, based on anecdotal evidence, without even
discussing other possibilities which might be related to the recentness
of the operation, etc.)  But, like I said above, I do enjoy listening to
him.

Ken
---
staffan@serum.kodak.com
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: GeraldR@sunfish.ratsys.com (Gerald Ruderman)
Subject: Re: cookie making worries
Organization: Rational Systems, Inc.
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 01:02:48 GMT

In article <1992Dec3.212324.6644@ulysses.att.com> smb@ulysses.att.com (Steven Bellovin) writes:
>I don't know your kids, but I certainly wouldn't worry about a 7 year old,
>and maybe -- depending on the kid -- about a 4 year old eating the batter.

>First of all, tell them why they need to be extra careful, and why they
>should wash their hands immediately afterwards.  Second, although the
>risk is far from negligible, it's also not the case that eating raw
>eggs guarantees you a case of salmonella.  It's just that the incidence
>is sufficiently high that it's probably not a good idea.

My daughter has acted very responsibly in this area since she was 6. Indeed 
she is the watchdog who points out when the grownups don't take adequate 
care!

Gerald Ruderman                                   geraldr@ratsys.com
From: bsmith@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (ROBERT SMITH)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Mischievous Things They Do (3 YO)
Date: 14 Dec 92 16:29:28 GMT
Reply-To: bsmith@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (ROBERT SMITH)
Distribution: na
Organization: Stakeholder Relations, NCR Corp in Dayton,OH

My wife was paying for a small order of groceries at a local chain, when she
heard some loud, unintelligible noises on the intercom.  Everyone in the store
was startled.  The manager came dashing out of the office with a puzzled look
on his face.  Then my wife looked behind her -- Tyler, our 3 YO, was at the
empty cashier's station.  He had picked up the phone and had somehow turned on
the intercom.  He was happily making noises for everyone to hear.

-- 
Bob Smith
E-mail => Robert.D.Smith@daytonoh.ncr.com
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: anne@dolores.Stanford.EDU (Anne Paulson)
Subject: Re: "my wife and I are pregnant" - NO WAY
Organization: Stanford University
Date: 20 Dec 92 20:11:31


My best friend (a man) announced a while back that he and his wife
were pregnant.  Now they and their new son are nursing! I'm 
not sure what part of the nursing my friend does...

-- Anne
From: dlin@weber.ucsd.edu (Diane Lin)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Cute Things They Say (2 yo)
Summary: mother's appetite
Date: 14 Dec 92 16:36:14 GMT
Article-I.D.: network.1gid5uINNbs8
Distribution: world
Organization: University of California, San Diego
NNTP-Posting-Host: weber.ucsd.edu

After brunch yesterday, we were on the patio of the shopping plaza,
when Dylan spied a dog.  The dog turned out to be very friendly and
so was its "grandmother."  The woman explained that her daughter,
the dog's "mom", was getting some food and would be back soon.
Dylan piped up, "My mommy eats *lots*."  However, he pronounces l's
like y's so it actually came out as "My mommy eats *yachts*."
-- 
Diane C. Lin			"Live now; make *now* always the
dlin@weber.ucsd.edu	         most precious time.  Now will 
(Dylan's mom, 2 years)	 	 never come again." (ST:TNG)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: js@cs.tulane.edu (Jan Silbermann)
Subject: Difficult baby-revisited
Organization: Computer Science Dept., Tulane Univ., New Orleans, LA
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 22:21:56 GMT
Nntp-Posting-Host-[nntpd-5515]: caesar

   Today my world fell apart. Eliana was diagnosed as having "Infantile
   Spasms." The prognosis is not good. She will probably be in a
   wheelchair and have some mental retardation. I have been crying all
   day and am devastated. She has been admitted into the hospital
   and is having all kinds of scary tests. They already did a EEG
   on her. Tonight she is having a CAT scan and a spinal tap.
   Associated with the seizure disorder is something called "tuberous
   sclerosis."
   If anyone  knows anything, please tell me.
   If you know any good books about dealing with the grief, anger,
   and guilt I am feeling, please let me know.
   Please pray for Eliana.

      Jan Silbermann js@cs.tulane.edu
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: prmader@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov (MICHELLE MADER)
Subject: Early Puberty
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
Distribution: usa
Date: 16 Dec 1992 12:11 EST  

I'm interested in comments/suggestions/advice from anyone who has
had an experience with a girl entering puberty (onset of the menses)
at ages 9 or 10.  Due to the way my daughter is developing, I 
suspect we may be in this situation soon and I'd like to be prepared.

She knows the facts of life.  What I want to know is:

1.  If you were the one who experienced early puberty, what kind
(if any) of social problems did you experience and how did you
handle them?

2.  If your child (or near female relative) was the one who
experienced early puberty, how did you handle it?  Are there things
you can do to make it easier for them?

Please respond by E-Mail & I will post the responses.

Thanks,

Michelle 
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: elonich@cbnewse.cb.att.com (diane.e.pedersen)
Subject: Re: Sign of the times
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Naperville IL
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 18:58:13 GMT
Summary: diapers

In article <1753@optigfx.optigfx.com>, wang@optigfx.optigfx.com (Alice Wang) writes:
> In article <1992Dec9.205748.6194@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> dlittle@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (David E Little) writes:
> >
> >  Increasingly I have noticed that many large department stores and
> >shopping malls have begun to install 'baby changing stations' ( not
> >sure of the official sound byte ) in men's restrooms.
> 
> Westernized.  So did the American fathers (in the 60's) changed
> diapers or is this a new phenomenon? ;-)  Maybe it's related to the
> fact that most mothers work also now?
> 
> 
Actually, I suspect this "phenomenom" is mostly due to the
advent of disposable diapers and baby wipes, which makes
changing a baby pretty easy and hard to do badly, even for
the most diaper-impaired.

o  No washcloths to moisten
o  No diapers or washcloths to soak
o  Lots less leakage into the baby\s clothes
o  No powders/ointments (no longer PC)
o  No worries about sticking fingers or babies with pins
o  Faster to fasten (matters a LOT with squirmy babies)

Diapering is no longer an ordeal.  The real test of fathers'
(and grandfathers') "enlightenment" would be measuring how
readily they'd change diapers the old-fashioned way.
-- 
Diane Pedersen
AT&T Bell Laboratories
Naperville, Illinois
att!ihlpe!elonich
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: hart@nipmuc.fsl.noaa.gov (Leslie Hart)
Subject: Re: Christmas Tree
Reply-To: hart@nipmuc.fsl.noaa.gov (Leslie Hart)
Organization: Forecast Systems Lab, NOAA - Boulder CO, USA
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 16:28:16 GMT

For our first year that our toddler was mobile, we got a 4' tree
and placed it on a table.  In our case it was our dining room table
since we were working offset schedules and didn't get to sit down 
to eat anyway.
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: bgoin@moe.coe.uga.edu (Beth Goin Math Education)
Subject: Crawling and reading...
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 15:50:49 EST
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X-To: misc.kids.usenet
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Hi.  I am new to this group, so I have missed the beginning of this posting.
But, my mother told me that I did not crawl.  I learned to sit up.  Then I 
learned to pull up,  stand up , and finally walked by holding on to things.
I also got my first library card at age 3, the requirement was that you could
sign your name.  I learned to read some before kindergarten.  My mother told
me she thought that I read early because she had influenced me so much.  She
and I would spend lots of time reading and looking at pictures.  I remember
getting my first library card.  It was very exciting to be able to get my
very own books out of the library.  I have a daughter who is crawling, but
even if she didn't crawl before walking I don't think I would be alarmed.  Or
was I really an exception to the rule.  Comments?

Beth
bgoin@moe.coe.uga.edu

These opinions are mine only and do not reflect upon The University of Georgia
in any capacity whatsoever.  OK?


Xref: sparky misc.kids:30522 news.answers:4549
From: J.Osborne@cam.compserv.utas.edu.au
Subject: Re: Cute curse-words (Was: Re: Children's own language)
Organization: University of Tasmania
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 02:45:43 GMT

We used to make quite a thing of creating our own swear words in our family
when I was little. My parents never swore (except I do remember my father
saying 'Stink!' with great force when something really went wrong). I have
wondered whether our penchant for making up swear words was because we never
heard the alternatives.

I still can't say 'lampshade' in front of my brother and sister without us
remembering that that was one of *the* words!

In fact my brother and I used to make  a game of finding 'real' words to use as
swear words, while we walked to school in the mornings. 'Dirty mushrooms' was
one of mine, which must have come to light when I was about 4! I could shock
you with a few more I remember too.

Jo


Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: clg@cray.com (Coni Gehler)
Subject: Re: "my wife and I are pregnant" - NO WAY
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 16 Dec 92 13:25:00 CST

In article <869.9212161848@bonzo.xylogics.com> rollo@xylogics.com (Dena Rollo) writes:
>
>A recent post contained the statememt: "My
>wife and I are pregnant..." There's no point
>in naming the poster, as this is something I
>read/hear quite often.
>
>Now, I *know* it is meant to convey the fact
>that the man  is involved, concerned, supportive,
>etc.
>
>It always annoyed me on principle, because it's
>inaccurate. But now that I've carried a pregnancy
>to term, it makes me crazy.
>
>So here's a message to all non-pregnant partners of
>pregnant women: YOU ARE NOT PREGNANT. Your *partner*
>is pregnant. She is experiencing all kinds of emotions,
>sensations, aches and pains, flutters and kicks that you
>are not experiencing.
>
>I know that if Michael had used this terminology, not
>only would I not have considered it supportive - I would
>have considered it as trivializing the pregnancy and
>my experiences.
>

Okay, my $.02.

I, too, have carried a pregnancy to term.  And I'm not offended by the use
of this phrasing.  Certainly, in a medical sense, it's inaccurate.  However,
my feeling was that, when I was pregnant, I directly experienced the emotions,
physical sensations, aches and pains going on in my body--and my husband
"experienced" ME at that time.

I can't remember exactly how we spoke of it when I was carrying Sam inside my
body.  We may even have used the phrase "We're pregnant" at that time.  I
think we also would say, "We're expecting."  (That, at least, is accurate. :)

My eating habits changed when I discovered my condition.  Consequently, my
husband's did, too.  My sleeping habits changed.  Consequently, my husband's
did, too.  I had to deal with my new "emotionality."  Consequently, my
husband did, too.  Etc.

Not a flame.  Just another point of view.

How do you men out there feel about this?  Are other women put off by this
also, as Dena is?

>So, isn't there another way to express your feeling of
>being part of the team?
>
>thanks, Dena

Coni
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: njamal@unix.amherst.edu (Nuhad Jamal)
Subject: Re: AMA Calls for Ban on Infant Walkers
Organization: Amherst College
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 13:56:08 GMT

Dena Rollo (rollo@xylogics.com) wrote:
: 
: Kate Gregory writes (in a post I thought was
: a good response to questions about walker safety):
: 
: 
: As for why they are banned, that is another issue. Does the danger
: outweigh the benefit? Is there any benefit? Can alert parents
: counteract the danger? 
: 
: ************************8
: 
: Well, the only real benefit to walkers I can
: see (and it's a big one) is that, at that
: age (4-6 mos or so) when infants are wanting
: to be more vertical, but are not sitting on
: their own yet, walkers afford them a better
: view of the world.
: 


What I have used with my two sons are the baby jumpers or
baby excercisers (I'm not sure just what they're called --
but they hang from a doorway and the baby can bounce themselves
up and down and are able to turn 360 degrees in them).  My
first son (now almost seven years) had an intense need to be
vertical.  He never crawled, but used to roll all around the
floor and always got to where he wanted to go quite fast.  He
walked when he was 9 and a half months old.  We've had no
problems with him reading, etc.  My seven month old baby
also loved the jumper/bouncer eventhough we haven't used it for
a while.  The particular model we have this time is not designed
as well as the one we had for our eldest.  Awate (the seven month
old) gets his head stuck between the ropes that hang the bouncer.

Just my experiences,

Nuhad Jamal
njamal@amherst

Newsgroups: misc.kids