HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: folta@cs.umd.edu (Wayne Folta)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: P-COPS
Date: 12 Sep 92 13:06:07 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: U of Maryland, Dept. of Computer Science, Coll. Pk., MD 20742

There is a package, COPS, of C/shell out there that checks through a UNIX system
looking for security holes. It has been ported to perl, evidently, and called
P-COPS. I found what claimed to be a beta copy somewhere, but is there a final
copy somewhere?

Also, I gather that it implements a rule-based expert system. That suggests
that maybe a perl/CLIPS (CLIPS is a NASA expert system shell) implementation
might be called for. Has anyone else used a perl/CLIPS combo before?
-- 


Wayne Folta          (folta@cs.umd.edu  128.8.128.8)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: phillips@cs.ubc.ca (George Phillips)
Subject: Re: Perl language formatting conventions?
Organization: Computer Science, University of B.C., Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Distribution: comp
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 92 05:37:12 GMT

In article <1992Sep14.230556.15866@news.eng.convex.com> tchrist@convex.COM (Tom Christiansen) writes:
>From the keyboard of jc@minya.UUCP (John Chambers):
>:Sounds like a win to me. Actually, I think it'd be more readable, more
>:mnemonic, and might even fit, if you used ':' instead of '=>'. Perhaps
>:that's another bit of trivia that could be worth a violent argument or
>:three.  Would this conflict with other uses of ':'?
>
>Well, I at least am on record for voting for packname:variable 
>as a more intuitive (and parsable) alias for packname'variable.

Well, => is a little dangerous in that it looks a whole lot like >=
(especially to old BASIC programmers).  -> might be a slightly less
ambiguous string, but I wonder if perl 5 hasn't already appropriate
-> for some other purpose.

Now, if you like readable, why not use "is" as a synonym for ",".
Sure, maybe &paintbox(color is white, width is 100) looks a little
too much like COBOL (perbol?), but think of the possibilities for
perl poetry (perlverse programs).  "life is death, death is life"
would be legal perl, assuming 'is' is really equivalent to ','.
Despite my levity, I think this is a good idea.  There's already
some precedent with eq et. al.

Even if this is considered, I sure hope real names are not given
to every piece of perl punctuation.  It would be a boon to the
poetry writers, but would lead to the production of perbose perl.

--
print quote Just another Perl hacker quote semicolon
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: sasdxk@skyhawk.unx.sas.com (Dave Kolb)
Subject: OS/2 Perl via .cmd file w/ EXTPROC
Originator: sasdxk@skyhawk.unx.sas.com
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 19:20:45 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.


Has anyone gotten the auto perl invocation to work as documented in the
perl os2/readme.os2 file?  The suggestion was to add a line:

EXTPROC /path/perl.exe -S

as the first line of a .cmd file that was actually a perl program.

And indeed, os2's "help extproc" shows this should invoke a alternate
shell (presumably to execute the rest of the .cmd file) but all that 
happen's is I get a message:

Can't execute <myfile>.cmd.

The best I've been able to accomplish is to add the name of another
perl script file as an argument to the EXTPROC statment and then perl
runs that program but that doesn't seem to be the point of EXTPROC or
any better than just having a .cmd file that runs perl straightforward.

Thanks for any suggestions,


-- 
David Kolb                    Opinions are my own not SAS'
SAS Institute, Inc.           EMAIL:      sasdxk@unx.sas.com
SAS Campus Drive - J206       Phone:      (919) 677-8000 x6827
Cary, NC  27513-2414 USA      FAX:        (919) 677-8123

Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: rlg@IDA.ORG (Randy garrett)
Subject: Prolog within Perl?
Organization: IDA, Alexandria, VA
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 92 21:51:00 GMT

I wonder if anyone has written a simple rule based processor
similar to Prolog that would run within Perl.  I'm having
such a good time using all of Perl's powerful features,
but occasionally, I'd like to be able to run some 
pieces that work like non-deterministic forward or backward
chaining engines.

Anyone done such a thing using Perl?


Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: stetzer@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Frank Stetzer)
Subject: Any guide to MS-DOS Perl?
Originator: stetzer@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 20:48:50 GMT

I'm doing some work with the MS-DOS port of Perl.  Has anyone 
compiled a list of things-to-beware-of in MS-DOS Perl?  For
instance, "\n" generates the CR/LF sequence in MS-DOS Perl, 
giving you 2 bytes where you were used to getting 1.

The "man" page that came with my MS-DOS Perl isn't DOS-
specific.  My impression is that MS-DOS Perl is kind of 
unexplored territory.
==========================================================================
Frank Stetzer                                   stetzer@convex.csd.uwm.edu
Statistical Software Coordinator                P.O. Box 413
Computing Services Division                     Milwaukee, WI 53201
University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee             (414)-229-4571

Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: ejk@ux2.cso.uiuc.edu (Ed Kubaitis - CCSO)
Subject: Re: perl4.035 under SunOS4.1.2
Organization: University of Illinois - Urbana
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 11:08:00 GMT

In article <26194@dog.ee.lbl.gov>, jpc@gauss.msri.org (Joe Christy) writes:
  |I've recently come to this mainly Sun shop and miss my old tools.
  |What are the tricks neccessary to compile perl4.035 on a sparc (IPX)
  |under SunOS4.1.2? I have gcc as well as cc. My naive first attempt
  |using cc gave compile time errors in perl.c:
  |
  |gauss(perl4.0): make
  |`sh  cflags perl.o` perl.c
  |		  CCCMD =  cc -c  -I/usr/include/sun -I/usr/ucbinclude -O  
  |		  perl.c: 95: If-less endif
  |
  |Using gcc I compiled ok but the tests op/eval and op/regexp failed
  |and lib/big dumped core. The one thing, alas, I don't have, is enough
  |time to find what's going wrong ( I want to use my favorite perl
  |script to replace a departed programmer's buggy c code in a crucial
  |application). Surely someone has a recipe for how to build perl in this
  |common configuration. Help!

Perl 4.035 built out of the box for me on a 690MP running 4.1.2. One
thing though, the Sun cc compiler got installed in /usr/local/lang/cc,
not /bin/cc which is a different compiler. The admin had told me to put
/usr/local/lang in my search path before /bin to use the "right" compiler,
which I did. You might check if you're really using the Sun cc compiler 
you think you are.

----------------------------------
Ed Kubaitis (ejk@ux2.cso.uiuc.edu)
Computing & Communications Services Office - University of Illinois, Urbana
From: joel@abigale.UUCP (Joel Rosi-Schwartz)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Standard location of ".ph" files
Date: 12 Sep 92 09:28:13 GMT
Organization: Techne Research, Finchampstead, Berkshire (UK)


Hi,

Motivated by the thread on the "aub" problem and the re-posting of 
of phincter by Randall Krebs (thanks Randall, it worked great), I
built all of the ".ph" files for *.h and sys/*.h.  I now have a
/usr/local/lib/perl full of nicely created ".ph" files.  Personally
I find this a bit messy and it it does not suit my anal disires of
organisation, since it is now difficult to quickly sort visually
between ".pl" and ".ph" files.

Going way out on the limb and knowingly fighting inertia, I would
like to suggest that a new _standard_ home be created for the ".ph"
files.  To excercise my originality, how 'bout something like
/usr/local/lib/perl/include ;-)  

Now, I realise that there is not a problem in my setting up my local
perl environment in this manner---just simply add it to my @INCS.  But,
I put this forth to the group at large mainly because I have *always*
wanted to be the inspiration of a widely accepted standard ;-)))))

While I am at it---fighting inertia that is---I find the usage of ".pl"
a bit inconsistent.  I like to use it *only* for libraries, kind of like
".a" archives.  I wonder what the original intent of ".pl" was, "PerL" or
"Perl Library".  Larry, Randall, Tom????

Larry, your recent comment on cultural/theological diffirences was
interesting.

  > [Though now we're getting into cultural differences, not theological
  > differences.  People often confuse the two--probably because most folks
  > can't tell the difference between an ordinary meme and a theophany.]

I fall into the folk class you refer to, often being unable to clearly
differentiate between the two.  How would you classify the two suggestions
I made?

Cheers,
Joel
-- 
     ==================================================================
     ||               T E C H N E   R E S E A R C H                  ||
     ||  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++  ||
     ||                     Joel Rosi-Schwartz                       ||
     ||   Hildorien House            +   Email: joel@abigale.UUCP    ||
     ||   12 Waverley Way            +    (pyrltd!abigale.UUCP!joel) ||
     ||   Finchampstead, Wokingham   +   Phone: +44 (734) 730.260    ||
     ||   Berkshire RG11 4YD (UK)    +   Fax:   +44 (734) 730.272    ||
     ==================================================================
From: lwall@netlabs.com (Larry Wall)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Re: reopening STDOUT as another stream
Date: 5 Sep 92 07:12:43 GMT
Organization: NetLabs, Inc.

In article <lafrc7INN84@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> tmhoff@oogoody.Corp.Sun.COM writes:
: 
: I can't quite figure out how to freopen STDOUT as another
: stream. Any suggestions?

If you aren't running an ancient version, ordinary open should work
fine for that:

    open(STDOUT, "| lpr")

Larry
From: lynch@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Howard Lynch)
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 23:01:34 GMT
Subject: stdout from 'system'?
Organization: OCD IC MFG
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl

I have a specific and general question:

Specific:  I want to get the hostname of the system my perl script is running
           on into a script variable.

           The ksh equivalent would be:

                HOST=`hostname`
                echo $HOST

           The best way I can figure out to do this with perl is:

           	open(ASDF,"hostname|");
           	chop($hostname=<ASDF>);
           	close(ASDF);
           	print "hostname = $hostname";

General:  I want to get the stdout from a unix command into a script variable.
          It would seem like I should be able to use the 'system' command
          and capture its stdout into a script variable.

Thanks for any feedback.

Howard Lynch
HP OCD IC Manufacturing
hl@hpocia.sj.hp.com
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: asherman@laser.fmrco.com (Aaron Sherman)
Subject: Re: How to convice awk/sed users to use Perl ?
Reply-To: asherman@fmrco.COM
Organization: I-Kinetics, 19 Bishop-Allen Dr., Cambridge, MA
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 17:35:12 GMT


>>>>> folta@cs.umd.edu (Wayne Folta) said:

>   I use ksh/awk/sed very well, why bother to spend a lot of time to
>   learn Perl ?  What's the real advantages of perl over ksh/awk/sed
>   ?
>

folta>    2. Shells do not compile their scripts at runtime, but
folta> instead run through them repeatedly. This makes shell scripts
folta> slower and also creates the possibility of run-time syntax
folta> errors. You don't find these errors until your logic flow takes
folta> you through the erroneous path. Since perl compiles its
folta> scripts, if you get it to run at all, you won't encounter a
folta> syntax error later. And perl is *fast*.

Well, you can get run-time errors from eval, but they are "polite"
(non-fatal to the top-level interpreter) errors that can be trapped.


			-AJS

--
--------
Disclaimer: I am solely responsible for the content of this message.
The views expressed here may not be the views of I-Kinetics, Fidelity,
any of the Fidelity-owned corporations or my mother.
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: jkt@SED.Provo.Novell.COM (Jack Thomasson)
Subject: Re: stdout from 'system'?
Organization: Novell, Inc.
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 07:53:56 GMT

>>>>> On Wed, 9 Sep 1992 23:01:34 GMT, lynch@hpcc01.corp.hp.com
>>>>> (Howard Lynch) said:

Howard> Specific: I want to get the hostname of the system my perl
Howard> script is running on into a script variable.

use the backticks operator!

Howard>            The ksh equivalent would be:

Howard>                 HOST=`hostname`
Howard>                 echo $HOST

and the perl equivalent is:

chop($HOST = `hostname`);		# remove trailing newline also

Howard> General: I want to get the stdout from a unix command into a
Howard> script variable.  It would seem like I should be able to use
Howard> the 'system' command and capture its stdout into a script
Howard> variable.

$OUTPUT = `command`;

or

@OUTPUT = `command`;

just be careful: perl will gladly (now how did Larry put it?  man
perl; ah, yes!) "slurp in your whole file as a single string".  i
wouldn't recommend:

$OUTPUT = `find / -exec cat {} \;`;

Howard> Thanks for any feedback.

Howard> Howard Lynch
Howard> HP OCD IC Manufacturing
Howard> hl@hpocia.sj.hp.com
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Thomasson                   :{)}               (the bearded one)
Internet:Jack_Thomasson@Novell.COM                     MHS:JKT@NOVELL
Novell Consulting Services\E-23-2\122 East 1700 South\Provo, UT 84606
Phone: (800)453-1267x7604 | (801)429-7604          FAX: (801)429-5511
"WARNING: the comments do not necessarily reflect the implementation"
From: nall@sun8.scri.fsu.edu (John Nall)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Tips and Techniques...
Date: 9 Sep 92 20:02:10 GMT
Followup-To: comp.lang.perl
Organization: SCRI, Florida State University

This is kind of a long shot, but.....has anyone by any chance made
a collection of the Christiansen/Schwartz/Wall responses to questions?

It occurs to me that over a period of time, the responses from those
three would make a good compilation of tips and techniques for using
Perl in a variety of situations.  Now, before anyone gets hurt feelings,
let me hasten to add that I'm sure there are other frequent responders
who are also well-versed in Perl.  But those three, between them, seem
to respond to *every* question.

So if someone has already made such a compilation, perhaps I could get
a copy.  If not, well, guess I might grab some of the back-mail from
the archives and give it a shot myself :-)

Thanks,

John



--
John W. Nall              | Supercomputer Computations Research Institute
nall@mailer.scri.fsu.edu  | Florida State University, Tallahassee, Florida
  "Sugar and spice/and everything nice/blend it twice/add more spice/
   Then serve over ice..." - original recipe for making southerners
From: sasswb@unx.sas.com (Scott Bass)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: What's the difference between `command` and system('command')?
Date: 10 Sep 92 13:16:53 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.

Sorry for the basic question, but I couldn't find this in the Camel book.

What the difference between saying `some Unix command` and
system('some Unix command')?  Are they synonymous?  Are there situations
where one is better than the other?

Finally, what I need to do is export the DISPLAY variable from a PERL
script that's submitted via cron.  I was just going to give the
"export DISPLAY=value" (ksh) command.  If there is a better PERL way of
doing it, please let me know.

BTW, I'm running HP-UX, if that matters.

Thanks,

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Scott Bass                           |  SAS Institute Inc.
Integrated Systems, A216, x6975      |  SAS Campus Drive, Cary, NC  27513-2414
sasswb@k2.unx.sas.com                |  (919) 677-8001 x6975
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: mpeppler@itf.ch (Michael Peppler)
Subject: Re: Using perl for databases - experiences req
Organization: ITF Management SA, Geneva, Switzerland
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 09:24:56 GMT

In article <lahvrhINN169@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> tmhoff@oogoody.Corp.Sun.COM writes:
>>4. Other comments, experiences?
>
>Think of the future. Go with a real database. Use a good interface builder
>and report writer. You can do a lot of your programming in perl. I'm also
>exploring the use of wafe with  perl and sybase for a really kick ass 
>development environment.
>

I've written a simple forms system (using XView) for Sybase. It's not
ready for distribution yet, but I'd like to merge this forms system
into Sybperl, which would let you write full applications (including
user interface code) very quickly and simply.

Michael
-- 
Michael Peppler	             mpeppler@itf.ch {uunet,mcsun}!chsun!itf1!mpeppler
ITF Management SA            BIX:   mpeppler                         
13 Rue de la Fontaine        Phone: (+4122) 312 1311  
CH-1204 Geneva, Switzerland  Fax:   (+4122) 312 1322
From: jhd@irfu.se (Jan D.)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Re: stupid questions : deleted ing leading spaces
Date: 7 Sep 92 06:26:49 GMT
Organization: Swedish Institute of Space Physics, Uppsala, Sweden

In article <1992Sep7.022351.1137@unilabs.uucp> chare@unilabs.uucp (Chris Hare) writes:
>This is stupid.
>
>I am running 4.035 and I need to delete a single leading space at the
>beginning of a line.
>
>I would have thought that 
>
>         tr/^ //;
>
>would have worked since the line is in $_.
>
>But alas, it doesn't.  There are other spaces in the line, but I don't want
>them affected.

I think you are confusing tr// and s// here. s/^ // works.

>
>As a matter of ofact, if you can suggest a way to remove the leading
>spaces, and compact multiple spaces any where else on the line to be one
>space I'd appreciate it.
>

	s/^ //;
	s/ +/ /g;

If you want to replace general white space (i.e. tabs and space) you should say

	s/^\s//;
	s/\s+/ /g;


	Jan D.
From: connolly@convex.com (Dan Connolly)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Re: Parsing RTF
Date: 15 Sep 92 18:22:41 GMT
Organization: Engineering, CONVEX Computer Corp., Richardson, Tx., USA
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In article <1992Sep15.035214.13097@Trirex.COM> mmelling@Trirex.com(Michael Mellinger) writes:
>I'm interested in writing a small RTF parser in Perl.  Given rtf text,  
>like that shown below, what is the best way to extract tokens from the  
>text?
>

Here's some perl code that parses RTF and writes stuff that a lisp
parser could digest.

#!/usr/local/bin/perl
#

while(<>){
    while($_ ne ''){
	if(s/^\{//){	# open {
	    print "( ";
	}elsif(s/^\}//){ # close }
	    print ")\n";
	}elsif(s/^\\//){ # control sequence
	    if(s/^([a-zA-Z]+)(-?[0-9]*) ?//){ # control word
		if($2 ne ''){ # with parameter
		    print "($1 $2) ";
		}else{
		    print $1, " ";
		}
	    }else{ # special control sequence
		if(s/^\'//){ # hex encoded char
		    s/..//;
		    print "#x$& ";
		}elsif(s/^[:{}\\]//){ # single char escape
		    print &lisp_string($&);
		}elsif(s/^\|//){
		    print "rtfFormula ";
		}elsif(s/^\~//){
		    print "rtfNoBrkSpace ";
		}elsif(s/^\_//){
		    print "rtfNoReqHyphen ";
		}elsif(s/^[\n\r]//){
		    print "par ";
		}elsif(s/^\*//){
		    print "rtfOptDest ";
		}else{
		    s/.//;
		    warn "look this one up: $& ", ord($&);
		}
	    }
	}else{
	    if(s/^\t//){
		print "TAB ";
	    }else{
		s/^[^\t\\{}]+// && print &lisp_string($&);
	    }
	}
    }
}

sub lisp_string{
    local($_) = @_;

    s/\n//g;
    return '' if $_ eq '';
    s/\"/\\\"/g;
    return '"' . $_ . '" ';
}
From: djbpitt+@pitt.edu (David J Birnbaum)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Re: aub problem finding sys/socket.ph
Date: 9 Sep 92 13:02:48 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <1992Sep9.060810.6205@cs.ubc.ca> dhami@cs.ubc.ca
(Mandeep S Dhami) writes:

>>             Running with '#!/usr/local/bin/perl -I <X>' doesn't help.
>
>#! notation allows only ONE argument (for example you may use
>-pi.bak but not -p -i.bak). This is the semantics of #! invocation
>(at least on my system, SunOS) and has nothing to do with perl.

I have been told that my system (Ultrix 4.2) has a problem reading
long #! lines, which I circumvent by preceding the first two lines
of the script with:

	eval 'exec perl -S $0 ${1+"$@"}'
	        if 0;

I have also tried running aub without these lines, but by calling it as
'perl aub', i.e., getting to perl without relying on the #! line at all.
The sys/socket.ph file is still unresponsive.

--David

-- 
Professor David J. Birnbaum         djbpitt+@pitt.edu [Internet]
The Royal York Apartments, #802     djbpitt@pittvms   [Bitnet]
3955 Bigelow Boulevard              voice: 1-412-687-4653
Pittsburgh, PA  15123  USA          fax:   1-412-624-9714
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: debande@info-sparc1.info.ucl.ac.be (B. Debande)
Subject: Perl course material needed ..
Reply-To: Debande@smd.ucl.ac.be
Organization: School of Medicine, Catholic University of Louvain (Belgium)
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 13:28:34 GMT

Hello,

I would like to teach Perl to students following the system administration
option of a computer science course.

As there isn't a university level course, I'd like to provide them a global
overview of Perl, supported by some course material.  

Unfortunately, O'Reilly's book is too rich for the small amount of hours 
I've to teach Perl.  So I must extract the main features of Perl, leaving
the details for interested users.  The aim of this course is to give them
enough information about Perl so they could be able to write simple
programs and experience the power of Perl vs C or shells

Does anyone has already done this job and be kind enough to help me preparing
this course

Thanks in advance

===============================================================================
      Dr. Benoit DEBANDE                      E-MAIL : debande@smd.ucl.ac.be
      School of Medicine                               debande@buclln11.bitnet
      Catholic University of Louvain	      FAX    : 32-2-7645322
      Av. Hippocrate 50 (50.20)               PHONE  : 32-2-7645268
      B-1200 BRUXELLES (BELGIUM)
===============================================================================
                Theory : it doesn't work an you know why
              Practice : it works an you don't know why
         C programming : it doesn't work and you don't know why	
===============================================================================
From: rm55@cislabs.pitt.edu (Rudolph T Maceyko)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
Subject: Re: aub problem finding sys/socket.ph
Date: 8 Sep 92 18:46:27 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

In article <5601@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> djbpitt+@pitt.edu (David J Birnbaum) writes:
>I can cut the needed lines out of the socket.ph file and paste them
>directly into the aub script, i.e., h2ph did create the appropriate file
>with the appropriate data.

If you ever posted the specific error, I can't seem to find it, so...

Does socket.ph end with a line like:

	1;

"require" likes the files it includes to indicate "success" in this
(or a similar) manner.

Rudy

Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl
From: mcook@melkur.dev.cdx.mot.com (Michael Cook)
Subject: Re: What's the difference between `command` and system('command')?
Organization: Motorola Codex, Canton, Massachusetts
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 17:39:11 GMT

sasswb@unx.sas.com (Scott Bass) writes:

>What the difference between saying `some Unix command` and system('some Unix
>command')?  Are they synonymous?  Are there situations where one is better
>than the other?

`foo` captures foo's output.  system('foo') doesn't.

To see the difference, try this:

	$foo = `echo foo`;
	print "foo=($foo), exit=$?\n";
	$bar = system('echo bar');
	print "bar=($bar), exit=$?\n";

>Finally, what I need to do is export the DISPLAY variable from a PERL script
>that's submitted via cron.  I was just going to give the "export
>DISPLAY=value" (ksh) command.  If there is a better PERL way of doing it,
>please let me know.

See %ENV in the manual:

 $ENV{'DISPLAY'} = 'foo:0.0';

Michael.
Newsgroups: comp.lang.perl