HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ncherry@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (neil j.cherry)
Subject: Re: Accident on a Bike/Ped P
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 13:24:25 GMT

In article <715077020.F00007@mcws.fidonet.org> Art.Melworm@f806.n102.z1.fidonet.org (Art Melworm) writes:
>NJ>I'm not trying to start a flame fest, but I know of a _couple_ of 
>NJ>places that
>NJ>using the bike route (there really dirt roads at best) is safer. 
>NJ>There are
>NJ>some
>NJ>roads where I prefer to ride rather that a bike path.
>
>What bike paths in the 818 area do you use?  I'm in the San Fernando 
>Valley (Reseda) and would be interested in checking out some bike paths -- 
>if they are not too crowded with toddlers, and pedestrians.
>
> * Origin: CycleBoard - West Hills, CA - 818-71-CYCLE  (1:102/806)

I think I may have caused some confussion, I ride out of NJ (908 or 609).
Sorry.

NJC
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: mcclella@yertle.Colorado.EDU (Gary McClelland)
Subject: Re: What to rename "clipless" pedals?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 15:22:50 GMT

BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM writes:

[extensive "hopefully" discussion deleted] 

and Gary McClelland

>> Hopefully, this will end discussion of this issue.  :-)

>I'm glad you feel competent in deciding that you have stated the definitive
>words and that these words constitute the end of the discussion.  You might
>have more luck if you expressed yourself more assertively instead of
>deferring to anonymous hope.

>jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com

Hey, may I be the umpteenth person to suggest that you lighten up, jobst?
Did you notice the smiley face at the end of my comment?  Or perhaps you
were joking in your comment and just forgot to include the smiley  :-)

As a professor, I must confess that I have long harrassed students for
using "hopefully" in the way Jobst criticizes.  It was only the recent
discussion here that caused me to check "hopefully" in the Webster's
Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary.  Its editors said they were going out of
their way to include a usage note because of arcane idiots like me and Jobst
who aren't aware that adverbs can modify entire sentences.  While I
still don't like "hopefully" in the way it is usually used and while I don't
intend to start using it in my own writing, I will stop harrassing my students
and any posters to rec.bicycle.* who might use it. 

Hopefully, Jobst will do likewise.  :-)  :-)  :-)

gary mcclelland, univ of colorado, mcclella@yertle.colorado.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: nadell@gandalf.lerc.nasa.gov (Shari-Beth Nadell)
Subject: Paramount Series 3 Bicycle
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center [Cleveland, Ohio]
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 15:52:30 GMT

I may have an opportunity to buy a 1992 Paramount Series 3 road bike
at a good price (sales on 1992 models are starting...).  It comes with
Shimano RX100 components, Super SLR twin-pivot brakes, and 105 clipless
pedals.  I'm interested in any comments, good or bad, or experiences
with this bicycle, or another Paramount model.  Direct e-mail would
be appreciated!

Thanks!
-Shari
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Shari-Beth Nadell			nadell@gandalf.lerc.nasa.gov
NASA Lewis Research Center, MS AAC-1	(216)977-7035
Cleveland, Ohio  44135
From: fyhg8422@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Frederick Y Huang)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Smoke/Dart, Ground Control
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:48:02 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

truesdel@ics.uci.edu (R. Scott Truesdell) writes:

>Currently I use Ritchey Z-Max kevlar 2.1 on both front and rear wheels
>and I like them a lot. They are light and have great traction. I ride
>mostly So. California fire roads and single track, both of which tend
>to be combinations of hard, rocky, sandy, dusty, and--the worst--1-1/2"
>deep soft sandy dust with pea gravel over a hard base. My tire selections
>have striven for solid and predictable high-speed descents (no front wheel
>wash-out) and good climbing traction.


Z-Max 2.1's came stock on my bike.  Not a bad tire at all.  As Truesdell says,
they are light, and I'd say, good traction.  On mud, though, (which, other than
grass, is all you get out here in Illinois) I didn't like them at all.  The
Z-Max didn't shed mud well, period, and usually sent me slipping (into trees,
no less).  I'm currently using a Smoke 2.1/Dart 2.2 combo and I like it much
better, although they are a bit heavier (OK, a lot heavier).  The Dart doesn't
seem to have any mud buildup problems, nor does the smoke.  I'd like to try the 
Cannibal tire on the back sometime, as I've heard good things about it.


BTW, can anyone explain to me the difference between Z-Max and Z-Max WCS tires?
I've seen them listed together in some mail order places.  It's not just a 
difference in bead material, is it?

Fred
fred%uigela.dnet@garcon.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: stigmata@athena.mit.edu (???)
Subject: Re: Celestial Seasonings Classic
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 17:25:54 GMT

does anyone have the results to the Celestial Seasonings
Stage Race?  also, a specific queation about the last
stage, Morgul Bismark.  what percent is the last climb,
the wall, at and how long is it?

thanks

andy
From: BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Campy pulls a Shimano -- buy another tool
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:45:48 GMT
Article-I.D.: hplomg.9208251745.AA01623

> I have both '85 & '92 C-Record cranks with the "one-key release".
> I do check the bolt tightness every couple of weeks or so & detect
> a couple of degrees of wrench turn required to re-snug them.  No doubt
> this would be a pain in the neck for some, but it's ok with me.

As I have mentioned before, crank bolts are tight when installing the
crank, but in use, cranks work on the taper and squirms away from the
retaining bolt (a retainer is all it is, once installed).  This gives
the false impression that the crank might be loose.  The bolts do not
unscrew.  It is the crank that moves away from the bolt.  If the bolt
is repeatedly tightened, the crank can be split in half, especially if
the crank receives repeated high torque use.

You will find that left crank bolts become looser than right side ones.
This occurs because the left crank transmits bending and torque when
the left foot pedals while the right crank transmits only torque or only
bending because it is connected directly to the chain.

The loosening of crank bolts from use is why the "dust caps" are not
only dust caps but also bolt retainers.  That is, even if the bolt
is entirely loose, it cannot rotate and back out.  The looseness does
not result from unscrewing but from the crank advancing up the taper.

jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: SUMMARY: WIFE doesn't wear helmet...
From: F.Brown@massey.ac.nz (F.J. Brown)
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 20:41:08 GMT
Organization: Massey University, Palmerston North, New Zealand
Summary: Women, riding strength amd bike maintenance (not funny)
X-Reader: NETNEWS/PC Version 2c

Hi netters, this is Frith again.   On behalf of all the strong, competent
women on the net I couldn't let this one go by (I'm getting less and less
amused by some of these postings).

>#2 Re wife not maintaining the bike: almost all respondents suggested that I
>do it. The best response was: "Would you trust her doing the maintanance
>anyway? Don't you want her to be {\it safe\/}?" OK guys (and some gals), you
>convinced me; from now on (as in the past, and just like with her car etc.)
>I'll do the tires and the chains etc. (Question to the ladies: does {\it any
>of you} ever maintain your own bike? 

Yes, large numbers of us maintain our own bikes.   Some of us are goddamned
experts (say hi to pamela, netters, and give her a round of applause for BMB
while you're at it).   Some of us find it more difficult,
but persevere with help from understanding friends, some of whom are men.
Funnily enough, most of us ***choose*** to surround ourselves with people
without bigotted attitudes, which then comes in handy when seeking assistance.
And finally, some of us don't have mechanical talents.   Luckily, since we
choose to have pleasant friends in our lives, they generally share ***their**
talents gladly with us, as we do with them.

Incidentally, mechanical aptitude is only poorly correlated with riding 
strength.

(For some reason, none of my female
>family members (mother, wife, daugther, etc.) were ever even able to replace
>a light bulb!))

If this is really the case, you should have a long, hard think about the type
of people you have chosen to share your life with, and why you need
people like that on this journey.
 
>#3 Re wife riding slower than I: this is a universal problem. 

NO NO NO NO it is not!   What secluded sect do you come from that every woman
you know is slower than her partner?   Wake up!

>Many suggested
>that we buy a tandem (not practical) or that I work out before and/or after
>our ride (that's what I've been doing) or that I carry a weight on my bike
>or, and this is the GRAND PRIZE WINNER, that I should "pedal with one leg
>only".  Wow!!! I luv the suggestion, and I'll do it.

Sounds like pretty sleek revenge to me.   Pamela or Marybeth, was this your 
idea?

Cheers,

Frith
-- 
==============================================================================
Frith Brown                     E-mail:  F.Brown@massey.ac.nz
Agronomy Department             Phone:   +64 06 356 9099 ext. 8800
Massey University               Fax:     +64 06 350 5614
Palmerston North
New Zealand                     Do you Du it too?
==============================================================================
From: Dave Snyder <davesnyder@igc.apc.org>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Date: 29 Aug 92 22:02 PDT
Subject: Re: Gas Taxes R Us
Nf-ID: #R:189malb.tomk@netcom.com:1723501007:cdp:1449700040:000:182
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!davesnyder    Aug 29 22:02:00 1992


Hey folks,

I'm visiting rec.bicycles.soc for great conversatinos such as these,
and NOBODY'S THERE. Let's carry these kinds of conversations to 
rec.bicycles.soc, ok?
cheers,

dave
From: tgorb@rrc.chevron.com (Joe Gorberg)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: QUESTION about aero bars
Date: 27 Aug 92 14:54:11 GMT
Reply-To: tgorb@rrc.chevron.com
Organization: Chevron, Richmond, California


I recently purchased the same model aero bars.  If you look on the back of the
box, there is a measurement guide which helps you identify which size is appropriate
for you.  It measures the distance from your elbow to your index finger knuckle.

Good luck.

Joe.
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: choy@skorpio.usask.ca (I am a terminator.)
Subject: Re: Passing etiquette
Organization: University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 1992 20:08:15 GMT

In article <2a358b37@babyoil.ftp.com>, hobbit@babyoil.ftp.com (*Hobbit*) writes:
|> S'poze I overtake someone else going the same way.  Is there any particular
|> thing people do or say in this situation?  A number of things come to mind.
|> 
|> Follow him for a while, so he thinks he's doing better than he is.  Maybe
|> strike up a conversation.  Not useful if I'm in a hurry to get there, and
|> talking is difficult on a road with cage traffic.
|> 
|> Kiss the wheel and crank up a good head of steam from a ways back, and
|> blow him off the road.  Potentially useful for the guys in the electric
|> neon shorts puffing away down on their aero-bars, especially if I look
|> like just some scruffy schmoe who couldn't possibly be going any farther
|> than a couple of blocks.
|> 
|> Offer to lead for a while, do so, and slowly pull away.
|> 
|> What promotes the most feeling of goodwill with the least hindrance?
|> 
|> _H*

Just mind your own business.

Henry Choy
choy@cs.usask.ca
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: What to rename "clipless" pedals?
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 92 23:32:18 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <9!-nb7#.obrien@netcom.com> obrien@netcom.com (Robert O'Brien) writes:
>In article <9208222149.AA16927@hplomg.hpl.hp.com> Jobst  writes:
>>
>> By that time I hope we will have a
>>descriptive term.  Or should I say, hopefully?
>>
>Jobst, I am *hopeful* that you used that non-word for humor value.  But
>that is part of 'common usage' and it is how our language evolves, or in
>this case, deteriorates (IMO).  And, before "hopefully" becomes an accepted
>word, perhaps we of the net can accomplish what you suggest.

Webster's New World dictionary lists hopefully as an adverb without
further notes. This in two editions. 

Do you find something wrong with that word?

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: top five innovations
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 17:28:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <9208292231.AA06050@hplomg.hpl.hp.com> BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@hplomg.hpl.hp.com writes:
>
>It may not be obvious but no work is wasted when you push down on the brass
>rail (or on the floor) at the bar while bending elbow.  If you could push
>on rapidly rotating pedals as hard as the guy at the bar pushes down on the
>floor, you could be world champion... and not even be out of breath. The
>point is that no energy is lost by the sinusoidal motion of the pedals
>because only the work counts, not the non-work force.

Jobst, I think that in that paragraph there is something of importance.
Too bad it's so well hidden.
>
>Since you can't fool physics it makes no difference what the variation in
>rate is (assuming the stroke is appropriate) so the other main consideration
>is dynamics.  Although you claim to spin Biopace, it is generally perceived
>to be difficult and I can see that an irregular rate requires acceleration
>that otherwise would not occur.  Since the old rule F=ma is true, work is
>required to just keep up with the pedals.

The rear gogs are round, the crank pedals move in a circular and steady
motion. The chain bobs slightly wider or narrower on the elliptical
rings. Certainly the effect is much less than the two different ways
to achieve  the same ratios (where one person had heard that a 42-17
was faster than a 52-21 or whatever) problem that you just recently
'debunked'.  Certainly the chain acceleration/decelleration doesn't
change along the major axis.

Not that I disagree with your conclusions, just suggesting that you
make yourself more clear instead of assuming that indirection
is sufficient.

(BTW, what I felt from Biopace was that it produced longer 'down'
strokes and shorter changes at TDC and BDC. This was actually 
counterproductive because my legs didn't have the smooth
sinusoidal effort curve of round rings. I don't believe that you
could 'train' your legs to accept this motion as readily as round
rings.)

Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: shenry@cs.rice.edu (Sam Henry)
Subject: Re: top five innovations
Organization: Rice University, Houston
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 20:40:00 GMT

>Ken Lehner is listing to the off-side:
>
>> My suggestions for the top recent innovations (after consulting with
>> jobst) (in no special order):
>>
>> 1. ...

In article <9208251908.AA02317@hplomg.hpl.hp.com>
BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM corrects the cant: 

>Well now that you mention it I think in classic fashion this list should
>be the "Top Ten" as in many other comparisons and to that I can add a
>few items.

>  1. Tire savers
>  2. Flickstand
>  3. Camelback
>  4. 3, 4, and 5 spoke wheels
>  5. Park/Vetta chain cleaners
>  6. Drop in bars
>  7. Shift levers at the tip aero-bars
>  8. Automatic shift derailleurs
>  9. Two wheel drive
> 10. Iridescent Spandex

I concur with the top ten.  Enables more effective and efficient
inclusiveness. 

>This is a yet incomplete list ...

By your own standards.  I can't imagine why irradium-lensed Oakely
sunglasses for the rider and matching Oakley window decals for the
bike-transporter are not included.



-- 
sam henry <shenry@rice.edu>
Wanna ride?
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: tomk@netcom.com (Thomas H. Kunich)
Subject: Re: Hubs built for straight spokes
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92 22:42:57 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <9209021949.AA01823@hplomg.hpl.hp.com> BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM writes:
>
>Now this is a novel idea.  Am I to assume that spokes only break on
>road bikes, from this statement.  I would like to hear more on this.
>Why are MTB wheels less subject to failures and what causes them in
>one kind of wheel and not another?

This must be another of your worries about getting screwed again?

From your own book, 26" wheels have far fewer problems because the
spokes are shorter and therefore stiffer. This couldn't be why most
people get away with 15 gauge spokes could it?

And MTB tires are inflated to 10-30 lb.s for real offroad riding which
keeps the shock loadings pretty low. The spoke faillures I've seen have
mostly been in bikes with japanese spokes.
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Wednesday, 26 Aug 1992 08:27:22 EDT
From: Ed Paradis <IO20222@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Another vote...

Another vote for rec.bicycles.mtb!
From: drobinso@mendel.une.edu.au (D.Robinson)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: My Bicycle Helmet Experience
Summary: Reasonable expectations for compensation
Date: 26 Aug 92 08:27:28 GMT



In article <1652@grivel.une.edu.au> drobinso@mendel.une.oz.au writes:
>> In article <Bsu5ot.BEo@well.sf.ca.us>, marquis@well.sf.ca.us (Roger Marquis) writes:
>
>>I partly agree.  But if a cyclist, helmeted or not, is injured through no
>>fault of his own, by a car driver slamming into him, that motorist, or his
>>insurance should be responsible for ALL these costs.  Think of the 
>>implications of the alternative.
>>
>The law requires construction workers to wear hard hats in construction
>areas.  If a worker drops a bolt and injures someone who is not wearing
>a hard hat, do you think that worker should be responsible for the injuries?

Good question!  I think it might depend on the circumstances.
    If the worker who dropped the bolt had reasonably expected that all 
workers underneath him were wearing hard hats - because this was a site 
regulation, then he might not be entirely to blame.
    If he happened to know that someone beneath him wasn't - e.g. a visiting
VIP inspecting progress of the site, or even if he saw a co-worker disobeying
regulations, then he should have made sure there was no chance of dropping
anything on their heads.  Otherwise he would be to blame.
    The question is therefore:  is it reasonable to expect that all cyclists
should wear helmets all the time?  I would argue that it is not, since the
statistics stongly suggest that this increases the dangers of cycling.
Any individual who wears a helmet reduces his chance of being severly
injured, but the expectation that every cyclist should do so has the
opposite effect.  Presumably because fewer people cycle, so motorists are
less able to judge their speed, and are more likely not even to see them in
the first place.
     Therefore, if it is not reasonable to expect every cyclist to wear a
helmet, any motorist who is entirely to blame for an accident, should have 
to pay.  What if he hits a pedestrian instead?  Should they be expected to
wear helmets?
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Info on Carpel Tunnel Syndrome
From: cbarilleaux@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu (Cyberpreppie)
Date: 25 Aug 92 21:44:49 -0500
Organization: The CyberSwamp

In article <3YLPB7P3@cc.swarthmore.edu>, Glenn Stauffer <stauffer@cc.swarthmore.edu> writes:
> In article <1992Aug25.150008.19038@unislc.uucp> Michael Thompson,
> miket@unislc.uucp writes:
>>The problem I have experienced has been a sharp, rather short duration
> (10
[description of pain deleted to perserve bandwidth]
>>
> 
> I read that symptoms include the "numb" hand syndrome that some riders
> experience. 
> A recent article in Bicycle Magazine stated that correct handle bar width
> had alot to
> do with this problem for bike riders.  The idea is to keep the wrists as
> straight as
> possible when riding.
> 
> STAUFFER
	One of the catches is that I swap positions on the bars not only from 
tops-drops-hoods, but subtle variations on these positions. This is to save my
back. How can I accomodate this?
	Do any of the pros have CTS?
	Further, would fans of REC.BICYCLING be doubly at risk, as we both type
on internet AND ride?
	Just my two cents...
	Charles
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I. Charles Barilleaux III                 occasionally know at Miami Univ
CBARILLEAUX@MIAVX1.ACS.MUOHIO.EDU         as Cyberpreppie.

"So long, long ago/The seconds tick the time out
 So much left to know/And I'm on the way to find out."
		-Cat Stevens
From: jym@mica.berkeley.edu (Jym Dyer)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Rednedk [sic] alert
Date: 1 Sep 92 18:08:19
Organization: The Naughty Peahen Party Line
	<JYM.92Aug11091516@remarque.berkeley.edu>
	<1992Aug11.230831.8634@kronos.arc.nasa.gov>
NNTP-Posting-Host: remarque.berkeley.edu
In-reply-to: iba@kronos.arc.nasa.gov's message of 11 Aug 92 23:08:31 GMT

> jym@mica.berkeley.edu (Jym Dyer) writes:
>
>> [generalizations and denigrations of church going folks]

=\= Your attribution is all wrong:  I made no generalizations
or denigrations.  Somebody reported their own observation about
aggressive motorists on their way home from church.  I made a
joke (a joke!, bwah, a joke!) about how perhaps *some* of them
might have been to sermons on the eeevils of Spandex.
    <_Jym_>

P.S.:  All kidding aside, the wearing of Spandex really is
clearly contraindicated in Leviticus.
From: BRANDT_JOBST/HP1900_01@hplomg.hpl.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: FAQ for new subgroups?
Date: 29 Aug 92 21:37:06 GMT

Dave Severn writes:

> My vote is to keep one FAQ for all the groups.

I concur.  Besides, it would take a King Solomon decision where to
cut the subjects apart.

jobst_brandt@hplabs.hp.com
From: jrdodd@waikato.ac.nz
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
Subject: Re: Uni-Discs?
Date: 27 Aug 92 12:43:11 +1200
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

In article <16190400@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM>, gmh@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Greg Hughes) writes:
> I've had a Uni-Disk for about a year.
> 
> Good points:
> 	Light	180 grams.
> 	Cheap   $35-$45
> 	Seems to work as expected.
> 	Quiet, doesn't sound like a 55 gallon drum rolling down the road.
> 
> Bad points.
> 	Wrinkes with temperature decrease or moisture.
> 	Makes it a pain to inflate your tire.
> 	Wears where it contacts spokes.
> 
> I don't use it for everyday rides, but it's good for the odd TT.
> 

> Greg Hughes.

	This may sound crazy,  but bear with me.  By Uni-Discs I presume you're
discussing covers that attach to the rear wheel as a cheap disc.  In New
Zealand the equivilent is around $140,  so I built my own.
	Don't laugh yet!  With a bit of time and care,  I built two discs from
light cardboard that perfectly fit my wheel.  For attachments I used a small 
piece of velcro between each spoke.
	I only use it for multi-event races or less-serious races where I plan
on an early break,  but once you break 35km/hr things do make a difference.
	Bicycling mag had a good,  impartial write-up of disc wheels a few
months back too...

Jonathan
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles
From: "David Coursey" <demoinfo@mail.psi.net>
Subject: SFO/San Jose rides wanted
Reply-To: david_coursey@infoworld.com
Organization: InfoWorld News/Dallas
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 18:31:43 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink (3.01)

I am moving from Dallas to San Mateo and would like to link up with some 
folks to ride with in the Palo Alto/Menlo Park (where I expect to be 
living and bike commuting to work) area. I am a 16 mph average 
recreational rider who does about 130 miles a week when I am not 
traveling and would like to find some non-racer types to show me the 
ropes of riding in California. I would also like to find a bike 
club/advocacy group to join and could you some finding an apartment tips 
as well!

David