From: danwell@IASTATE.EDU (Daniel A Ashlock)
Subject: 1-9-5-0-s D-a-r-r-y-l-e
Reply-To: danwell@IASTATE.EDU (Daniel A Ashlock)
Organization: Iowa State University
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:33:57 GMT

   At the end of his post Darryle gets his time frame wrong again and
claims victory as a result.  He also admits (again) that he didn't
even try to look at the evidence.  In detail:

In article <XrB=1k@engin.umich.edu>, dem@engin.umich.edu (Darryle E Merlette)
writes:
> In article <1992Nov10.134053@IASTATE.EDU>
> danwell@IASTATE.EDU (Daniel A Ashlock) gives irrefutable proof
> that the rabies virus can cross species boundaries by acting like
> a mad dog! He writes:

   I tend to do that when an idiot can't follow simple resoning well
enough to even ask for substantiating detail.  Thank _you_ for finally 
hitting a higher level.
 
>>   Darryle, AIDS appeared in the fifties.  Everything you have to
>>say is rendered nonsense by this observation.  Could you please
>>stop wasting time and space and take cognizance?  Ay least post a
>>_possible_ conspiracy theory.  At the moment you're repeating
>>yourself like a parrot while ignoring an objection that destroys
>>your whole thesis.  Why?
 
> Even if AIDS appeared in the 50's (what evidence is there of this?)

   HIV virus sequenced from stored blood samples of people that died of
mysterious causes in the late fifties.  I believe there are samples from a
British Sailor and also from several people in ?Zaire.  The HIV was
recoverd by DNA polemerase chain reaction and sequenced.  It is an HIV
pseudospiecies.  At least one of these cases was reported in Lancet.  If
Jim Lippard is still reading sci.skeptic, he has the data.

> and is a naturally occurring virus, that doesn't preclude its use in wiping 
> out populations just as smallpox was used to wipe out the indiginous people 
> of North America. So you are wrong if you think everything I'm saying is
> rendered nonsense by your dubious claim.

   Okay; your claim that the virus could have been engineered is clearly
bullshit, let us address the idea someone went out and found it and used
it as a population control/nazi tool.  This claim is also without
foundation (you have no evidence, just a laundry list that shows people
have been evil in other instances) and only slightly less unlikely than
the other.  The HIV virus is a retrovirus.  AIDS was already spreading
before anyone knew what a retrovirus was.  It takes a wild leap of faith
to claim some located it and intentionally spread it in the proper time
frame.  It requires a huge secreat research project run by the governement
that comes up with an uncontrolable agent that does a bad job, with no
leaks from the thousands of scientists and technicians involved.

   In brief, you need some evidence.  The whole thing is as silly as the
UFO stuff.  Anyone that can find or design HIV in 1955 can build a sickle
cell anemia enhancer that will wipe out scads of black far more
effectively.  Remember your imaginary lab has been chugging along all
these years.
 
> The AIDS virus isn't the only immuno-deficiency causing agent.

   Great.  Why is this relevant?
 
> Are you sure what was found in the 50's was actually the same AIDS virus?

   Positive.  Also it was _found_ in the late 80's or early 90's.
 
> I'd like more information on this.

   Check out sci.med.aids.  We can sequence the genes of a virus now and the
relevant sequences are available at any genebank FTP site.


>>You posted know crap refuted before HERE.  What did you expect?
> 
> When was that? I have never posted to folklore or skeptic before this thread 
> and I've been on hiatus from s.c.a.a, but I've never seen your name before.
> If you mean my claim that viruses don't cross species, that just happened
> yesterday and I've admitted my mistake. Can we move on!?

   Look, stupid, when you crosspost to sci.skeptic you should either do your 
homework or prepare to be flamed to cinders.  You cited Strecker's video, a
piece of total bullshit that can be invalidated by published scientific data 
and has been.  You had every single supporting detail except the historical
laundry list wrong.  You admitted you "didn't know the details".  If you had 
come in politely asking us to share our knowledge you would have gotten good 
treatment, but you came in with the usual idiocy.  "I suggest you watch
Strecker's
video in which he gives a scientific explaination..."  CRAP!  You never checked
to see if Strecker had done any science at all, you just uncritically accepted
bullshit because it said something you wanted to hear.  This is a
net.mortal.sin
on sci.skeptic.  Got it now?


[Darryle goes on to support his claims that AIDS could be engineered by
pointing to techniques that exist in the wrong time frame, 1969, or about
twenty years too late.  He uses as his source the popular press.]

Darryle, get a clue.  Do you have any evidence that WHO knew there was HIV in
those samples?  I thought not.  The AIDS virus was unknown then unless you want
a
ludicrous 1000+ person secret lab, undiscovered to this very day.

Dan
Danwell@IASTATE.EDU
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.urban