From: asgard@plx.com (J.R. Stoner)
Subject: Re: acoustic vs. electric bass
Keywords: n
Organization: Heironamous Botch's Murk Works
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 19:06:51 GMT

;>Is there any qualitative difference between acoustic and electric
;>basses aside from means of amplification? That is, are they played
;>the same, have the same range of notes, etc?
;>
;>I'm trying to decide if I want to invest in an acoustic or
;>electric bass-- I'm leaning towards acoustic since I'd like to
;>avoid having to lug around an amp, and I'm only planning on
;>playing for fun anyhow.
;
;I have played both acoustic and electric bass for a while, and in my
;opinion, if you want a good, easily controlled sound, go with an
;electric.

Depends on what you mean by easy.  It sounds more like you want a bigger
sound (available from an electric) per application of mechanical energy
than you could get, say, from your fiddle.  It is more accurate to say that
I get more _control_ of the sound from my fiddle, since the controls are not
so 'touchy' about accuracy.  I think of it like driving a car but the steering
wheel only can rotate 45 degrees either way - you could operate such a car
but the tendency is increated for the motorcar equivalent of PIO overcorrection.
The whold system is less controlled.  Ending my tangent, it really matters what
kind of music you want to be playing.  Only once (O.K. twice) have I ever played
my electric bass in the orchestra and no time was that for a season concert.
Always for the pops or concert-in-the-park.  If I were to do jazz work again
it would be a toss-up.  Not many pop/casual gigs around here require my fiddle,
so the music you want to play determines your choice.  I never got around
to putting the pickup in my fiddle but I never had any trouble getting a
big-enough sound for the jazz gigs or the theater work.  YMMV.

;you want a great sounding acoustic bass, it'll cost you at least five
;times that amount.

As in all things relating to stringed instruments, the variance is _wide_.
Anectdotally, I have continued to get by pretty nicely with the second-hand
fiddle I bought 5 years ago for $500.  It pays to be choosy, and you must be
willing to audition quite a number of basses before you select one.  If you
read the AFM newsrag there are often makers in Czechoslovakia, or Poland
making pretty O.K. basses (almost none in the U.S. :(  but you must be willing
to either travel there or buy sight unseen to make a selection.  Bows are
almost the same for selection difficulty.  Fewer makers than for cellos but
more than for basses.  You can even get returns for mailorder bows sometimes.
I have always gotten good support from the Lemur guys for returns.

;So, if you don't want/need a TOTL bass, spend a couple
;hundred bucks (or even less), get a small amp, and you are all set. In
;short: A cheap electric is easier to play and better sounding than a
;cheap acoustic, by a long shot. Plus, I'd rather lug a sturdy electric and
;amp around instead of a huge, fragile acoustic (a good soft case for an
;acoustic costs the same as a good electric bass WITH case).

Oh I don't know.  I got my goretex and reinforced bag from Lemur for about
$350 which is, I admit, pretty cheap.  The only downside of using a good
bag like that is the darn thing weighs almost as much as the fiddle.

;My cheap acoustic was not "fun" to learn on, and acoustic bass requires
;considerably more strength and coordination to play properly.

Another thing to keep in mind, is a lot of the 'fun' of playing a big sound
on a fiddle has much to do with upkeep of the thing.  If you do not make sure
that the resonant surfaces and sound post are clean and properly positioned
the whole thing attenuates and you are playing in vacuum.  That is not fun.

;In addition,
;unless you decide on a fretless electric with no fret markers, you'll not
;have to worry about your intonation, which is a major problem for acoustic
;players. Furthermore, electric basses are much easier to amplify (by
;definition) so if you ever do decide to play in a loud group (or even 
;with a large acoustic group), your tone won't change, nor will your
;playing style. An old acoustic bassist that I know told me that when he
;was in his heyday he could hold a lit cigarette at the tips with his
;thumb and middle finger and feel no pain- think about the kinds of callouses
;that takes (and the time it takes to develop them)! You wanna go through that 
;for "fun"? Not me, not again...

Physical problems are not unique to bassists.  I played for years for community
theater companies in pit orchestras.  Almost every show I had to put the
medi-tape on my fingers to keep the skin on.  Yes it is not fun to play with
that kind of pain, but I know that it is only temporary compared with the
reed guys who get teeth separation and other bad things from chomping on their
mouthpieces.

;Re: your first question- The notes and tunings are the same, but the
;scale length (i.e., length of string) is much greater on acoustic basses,
;and the action (height of string above the fingerboard) is usually much higher
;on acoustic bass, which means you need to move a bigger string a longer
;distance each time you play a note, and that ain't easy. The left hand
;(assuming you are right handed) is not as mobile on the acoustic- classical
;training suggests that you always have your index finger on the string,
;either by itself or as a support for other fingers, and that tends to
;hinder quick position changes, etc., so rapid-fire runs are very difficult
;to execute.

And good orchestration would avoid them in the first place.  As Garrison Keilor
says, the bassist is the philosopher of the orchestra and not the acrobat (and
the percussionists are the most lutheran of the lot :).

;The right (plucking/bowing) hand takes a huge beating when you
;start plucking away- to get a good tone, you gotta PULL that Mutha', and
;that hurts. Don't forget that bowing is an art unto itself- ever hear
;a beginning violinist/cellist?

Part of the coordination problem for you, or anybody else, may be attributable
to an aspect of bass playing that people who play only electrics don't realize.
The tunings are the same, but the fingerings are most definitely not the same.
The normal positions have half-tone fingering sequences organized on guitars
with a 1-2-3-4-1-2-3-4 sequence, using all four of your fingers.  The bass viol
is organized to finger on a 1-2-4-1-2-4 sequence.  Your ring finger is not
used to play b-natural in first position since more strength than that is
needed to finger the high action..

Yes.  Bowing is an art unto itself.  May beginning string players get bad
habits and must be constantly on guard.  One particular is playing as if more
bow pressure makes the sound louder.  It is actually the velocity of the bowing
and proximity of the bow to the bridge.

;Don't get me wrong: I love the acoustic bass, but if I'd started on one
;I'd never have stuck with it. Go with the electric, and get a fretless with
;flatwound strings if you want a warm, woody sound. It'll save you $$$, time,
;and pain to skip the acoustic.

Oh, I would not go that far.  I consider myself very fortunate that I first
learned to play the fiddle, and only then played the guitar.  It tends to 
give one more respect for the capabilities of the instrument to be able to
experiment with the more subtle intonation styles that the fiddle will get you.
-- 
J.R. Stoner, DWMIT - asgard@plx.com - sun.com!plx!plxsun!asgard
Newsgroups: alt.guitar.bass,rec.music.makers