From: dab@vuse.vanderbilt.edu (The Nashville Flash)
Subject: R80G/S Tire Survey Results (2 damn long)
Originator: dab@space3
Organization: Vanderbilt University School of Engineering, Nashville, TN, USA
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 21:59:36 GMT

OK.  I asked for input about 21" tires for dual purpose bikes and got 3 big
responses.  One said, "I heard..."  And the other two were of some interest.
I have 2 R80G/Ss.  One was totalled and resurrected and raced and given to
my wife.  It was resurrected with a 19" front wheel.  The other has been used
two-up in Europe, solo and two-up for "thousand mile weekends", and on an 
assortment of trips with an assortment of other riders along.  Here are what
my records show over an 11 year period...

Rear Tire			Miles
--------------------------------------
Metzeler Enduro			2800
				4100
Iroquois Trials 		3400  (Later became Carlisle Tire)
 				5000
				3150
Avon Roadmaster			6500
Dunlop Touring Elite		3733  (K391T?)
Metzeler ME77			4650
Avenger(?!)			4600
Continental TK44		2160
Continental K112		4400
				4200
				2600
				4025
				2975
Metzeler ME88			7300
				5100
				5500
				8117
Yokohama GP1			SUCK

Continental TK17		Just on.  Like it for commuting.  No mountain
				testing yet.
Bridgestone SE11	 	Just on.  Like it for commuting.  No mountain
				testing yet.
Left off the list is an assortment of race compound tires (which also screwed
up the record keeping).

Front Tire			Miles
--------------------------------------
Metzeler Enduro			17000
				16200
Metzeler ME33 			Good when new.  At .5 wear, started to suck.
Continental TK23		Dislike it.  But not enough to chuck.
I stopped worrying about the mileage on the Enduros since they were about the
only thing available in a 21" DP tread.  

General Conclusions:
My search for the proper balance between stick, wear, and price has shown me 
that the relationship between the 3 is screwball.  I loved the Iroquois 
"trials" as a $25 compromise.  NLA.  But then again, that was before I could
scrape the jugs.  I can't remember many of the tires.  But the Enduros were 
pretty good but cost too damn much.  I had pretty well settled on the ME88 for
a while with the Enduro front as a good compromise.  This pair will return
reasonable mileage at 85-90mph freeway,,, plus stick well enough to drag stuff
in the mountains.  A bit more expensive than some... but worth it.  But times
change.  There is new technology out there.  Being a grad student I don't have
the time or money for 1000 mile weekends (for now).  So, WHO OUT THERE IS 
GOING THROUGH A LOT OF TIRES?  And what have you found?

BTW, I ride with Rich Gardner sometimes.  The latest BMWMOA news shows a
photo he took of his bike with the tire bald on the sides and plenty of
tread in the middle.  He didn't used to ride like that 'til he met me 'n'
Foote. :-)

<include original request>
From: dab@vuse.vanderbilt.edu (The Nashville Flash)
Subject: 21" Tires for BMW G/S
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1992 15:44:13 GMT

Back when I bought my first R80G/S, about the only choice for the front tire
was the Metzeler Enduro unless I wanted a knobby.  Since I ride mostly on the
street, I don't want a knobby.  Now, DP bikes have become popular and the 
choice has broadened.  Does anyone have experience with any of the following
that they would like to share...

Metzeler Enduro		dp
	 Sahara		dp
	 ME88 (yes it now comes in 21")	street
Dunlop   Elite (yes, 21")		street
IRC	 GP110		dp
Avon	 AM24		dp
others?
__________________________________________________
<include responses and repartee>
Date: 10 Mar 1992 10:21:03 GMT
From: adh@minster.york.ac.uk

In response to your rec.motos survey:

I've got a Yamaha XT600 with Avon Gripsters (AM24?) on it,
and use it mostly on-road. The front has done 10,000 miles
and looks like being good for 12-15k or so. The rear has
done 6k, and will run to 8k+. This has included long
distance 80mph cruising in high (for me, 35C) temperatures
while heavily loaded.

Grip seems fine (especially given life and dp tread):
I'm probably not the most heroic of cornerers, but I
have touched a toe down on a dry roundabout, and got to
within 1/4" of the edge of the tread.

Off road dry ground is fine, and my couple of tries on wet
tracks showed that damp sand etc would allow me to spin
the back tyre, but there was an associated rapid acceleration.
I have no point of reference for this behaviour, and would
expect to get stuck if the going got tough...
Andy H.
_____________________________________________________________________
Date:         Thu, 19 Mar 92 06:48:07 PLT
From: Bill Johns <JOHNSW@WSUVM1.CSC.WSU.EDU>

You seem to have given up on any sort of DP tire in your search.  With
the low mileages you got from the Enduro (the name is a joke, right) I
don't blame you.  In chatting with the folks around here, people are
using the Pirelli MT-50.  This is a tire that is designed (the
manufacturer claims) for 80% highway, 20% non-pavement. It looks like a
DP type of tire, with deep grooves and bold relief.  The locals claim
to get 7-8 K miles out of a rear and good on and off road performance.
I will probably try these on my next change, and post my impressions
after a few miles.
- Bill
___________________________________________________________________
<From dab to Bill wrt Road Rider "Dual Sport Tires" (4/92)>
I got the article.  Thanks!  I found it to be a comprehensive list of DP tires
covered in typical Road Rider fashion... lacking attention to detail.  Almost
every tire mentioned had a street/dirt or dirt/street percentage bias.  THIS
was the column missing from the list at the end.  I tried to add this column to
the list, but there was not quite enough info.  Furthermore, they screwed up
Metzeler in the list and used Metzeler most often for comparison to other
brands/models. 

Be that as it may.  *I* definitely agree with the author's opinion that it is
the FRONT tire that must be "dirtable" moreso than the rear.  That's why I have
been using a Metzeler Enduro front with a Metzeler Marathon rear.  The G/S
is too damn heavy to do any REAL dirt biking (like riding power lines in 
Tennessee).  However, it is nice to be able to go down a fire road with the
confidence that every rut is not a danger.  Since almost 90% of my riding has
been on the street, I am admittedly street biased.  I have found that the
Enduro front and Marathon rear will let me scrape the jugs on the street and
not get into too much trouble in the dirt... all while maintaining what I
feel is a "reasonable" tire mileage.

Now I am trying a Bridgestone dual-compound sport/touring tire on the rear.
I am giving serious consideration to trying their TW21 or TW41 on the front.
Probably go with the TW21.  The article became unclear here.  Bridgestone is
literally down the street from me (0.5 mile) and I plan to call them to talk 
to a sales engineer like I did before I bought the SE11.  BTW the 'stones are
made "off shore."  I thought there might be seconds available locally since
there are 3 tire plants within 50 miles of here.
============================================================================
 "No hour of life is lost that is spent in the saddle." - Winston Churchill
    The Nashville Flash	  -   dab@vuse.vanderbilt.edu   -   DoD # 412 

Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles