From: 97994779@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu
Subject: Re: NCCA - Let's Fix It
Organization: SYSTEMS & COMPUTING
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 93 11:33:41 PST

In article <1993Jan27.164212.3130@colorado.edu>
jac@noaacrd.colorado.edu (Julia Collins) writes:
 
>
>Inequality for who? For the women?
 
YES, for the women!! If you are a women and your men's team is not very good
you cannot compensate by having a good women's team. The women don't receive
as many points for winning. Its plain and simple math here!! If school A
places men 1,5,7 and women 3,9,10 they should tie the team B who places
men 3,9,10 and women 1,5,7. But, we say that women aren't as valuable as
men and thus team A wins. Is that fair?? NO. Women are hindered more by not
having a good men's team than men are by not having a good women's team.
 
Or do I detect the voice of a man feeling
>just a little bit threatened that the success of his team might depend just
>as much upon its female members as it does its male members?  You haven't
>yet convinced me that you have the female riders' best interests at heart.
 
I am pretty offended about what you are insinuating! And I am sorry if you
can't follow the math above and see the reality in which we live!
 
>As a previous poster indicated (Mike McCallum, I think, but I'm not sure),
>it's up to the team to recruit and support the members it needs to be
>competitive.  This works both ways.  For the most part, it helps the
>women, because the men know that if they don't keep the women involved,
>we not only lose women from the sport, but the competitiveness of the
>entire team is reduced.  Yes, your team can "survive" without the women.
>I have to say, however, that that statement is very, very scary.  Why does
>WSU have very few women? I would guess that you have a pretty significant
>female student population.
 
WSU is located in Eastern WA we actually have a winter. It gets very cold and
miserable here in the winter time. As you know with any new new cyclists
winter training is pretty low on the scale of excitement, especially in the
winter we have here. We have encouraged everyone we can to get involved in the
sport we love. We have even gotten bikes for people who wanted to get involved.
Our biggest problem isn't finding women who want to ride, its in finding
women who want to race. there is a woman at our school who is one of the best
cyclists I have ever ridden with. I know that if she put her mind to it she
could be an incredible US athlete and probably compete in the international
arena, but she just doesn't want to race. Its that simple.
 
For someone who has a pretty good
>opportunity to further women's riding staring them in the face,
>you seem to be unusually worried about the women who have no men to
>support them.
>
 
I am sorry that you reading in false details. I am genuienly concerned about
al cyclists, female, male whatever. I would ask you this question that I
already posted in a reply to another post. If school A places men
1,5,7 and women 3,9,10 and Team B places men 3,9,10 and women 1,5,7 Team A wins
can you honestly say as a woman that you are not being devalued? It looks to
me like the two teams should tie, and possible be decided on the lowest TTT
time. But in the NCCA we say no, the men's wins are worth more. Have you
ever looked at it that way?
 
>>I think that there are differences though in participation and rather than
>>treat some people as less important, we should treat them as equals and
>>let everyone compete on their own level.
>
>As a female rider, I would say that this is exactly what collegiate
>cycling does.  And if I were a strong enough rider to compete at the A
>level, I think I would also enjoy the fact that I can contribute directly
>to the _entire_ team's success.  That sounds like equality to me.
 
Please folow the math above and rethink this.
 
>Julia
--
Patrick David Walters                     President WSU Cycling Club
97994779@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu                Race Dircetor WSU Stage Race
Undergrad Soc Minor in Fren and Bus         Send Mail for more info on
Washington State University   Pullman, WA   either !