HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lkk@panix.com (Larry Kolodney)
Subject: Re: What's wrong w/ Our Skin Color?
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 01:01:57 GMT
Organization: The Devil's Advocate

In <92349.095838FKR@psuvm.psu.edu> <FKR@psuvm.psu.edu>  Fred Rozenblad writes:


>	{Story about a white lady getting freaked out because Fred was
>	nice enough to offer her help with her stuck car.}

>THe situation struck me as funny because one has to wonder was is the
>problem some whites may have w/ AfAms.  I know prejudice is the answer here,
>or some other explanation, but that's immaterial.  What's the problem w/ our
>skin color?


Skin color has nothing to do with it.  If you had been an Indian with
a turban (even if the skin color was the same) she probably wouldn't
have reacted the same way.

The problem is with ethnicity.  White people in America have a deep
seated fear of people whose physical appearance identifies them as a
member of the ethnic group known as "African-American" or "black
American."  

Why?  ITs a complicated question, but I would venture to guess that
its partly based on guilt, partly on real crime statistics, and partly
on deeply ingrained negative archetypes of black people in our
culture.

But skin color *per se* doesn't have much to do with it, IMHO.

-- 
larry kolodney:(lkk@panix.com) 
_(*#&)#*&%)@(*^%_!*&%^!)*&#+!*&$+!?&%+!*&^_)*&#%)*&^%#+&
The past is not dead, it's not even past.   - Wm. Faulkner
From: boing@bounceit.com
Subject: Re: Emitt Tills : Question
Reply-To: boing@bounceit.com
Organization: Rubber Baby Buggy Bumpers, Inc.
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 18:57:53 GMT

Emmett Till was a wise-ass Northern-city teenybopper [1] who, while
visiting relatives in the deepest of the Deep South during the
mid-1950s, did the functional equivalent of walking into the main
mosque in Tehran during mid-day Saturday prayer and screaming at the
top of his lungs:

    "Allah is nothing more than a pork-eating cock-sucking faggot
     who wipes his ass with his RIGHT hand and I know this as
     personal fact! Nyah Nyah Nyah!"

For some reason, the local population that held the strings of power
at the time took umbrage with this and Mr. Till answered for his
knee-jerk outburst [2] painfully and terminally.

As with quite a number of martyrs and causes, Mr. Till has probably
served a very good cause (the Civil Rights Movement) much better dead
than if he had lived [3]; the graphic depiction of his death in both
words and pictures-after-the-fact outraged the country and motivated
more than a few people to "get involved".

-----------------

[1] Yes, associating "wise-ass" with "teenybopper" is repeating myself.

[2] Much of what comes out of teenyboppers' mouths are knee-jerk
    outbursts; I sincerely regret now many years later some of the
    things that spewed forth from my mouth back when I was 14;
    fortunately for me I was not in the wrong place at the wrong
    time when they spewed, thus can pontificate along with the rest
    of the elite here on the USENET -- Mr. Till was not so fortunate.

[3] For those who can't keep themselves from reading more into a "post"
    than is there, no, no one reading-from/writing-to this list thinks Mr.
    Till deserved to die or is better off dead (that's NOT what the above 
    says), no, those Good Ol' Boys weren't good, yes, we all can truly feel
    sympathy for his ma, and no, I'm not, no, I don't, and no, no, and no.
From: ncostello@vms.eurokom.ie
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: To All Disaffected White People
Date: 11 Dec 92 10:44:39 CET
Organization: EuroKom Conferencing Service

In article <1471600065@igc.apc.org>, dmorse@igc.apc.org (Dorothy Morse) writes:
> 
> I think ignoring people is one way of educating them.
> 
> I think it is in poor taste for white people to lecture African Americans
> on racism and discrimination.  Many AA people oppose racism of any kind
> and argue against it.  I do not suppose that African Americans have to
> reachm mistaken conclusions unless white people lecture them.  White
> people concerned with the evils of racism might more appropriately
> direct their energies to white racism and neo-Nazism, I think.
> 
> White people have a *right* to criticize African Americans if they
> choose, and African Americans have a right to listen to that criticism
> with cold disdain and get up and leave, or fast-forward through the
> post, with no reply.

I couldn't agree more. I don't buy this stuff about "reverse racism"
in the first place, but even if you accept it, I think you'd have to
accept that "reverse racism" accounts for, let's say, 1% of racism
in America (or in my country Britain, or in my country of residence
Belgium), or 0.1%, or anyway some small number, measured in terms of its
effects on people's life chances. And if that's true, what do you call
people who spend 99% of their time spent on racism focussed on the 1%
of racism that is against whites?
From: M.Titahmboh@lut.ac.uk (Mana TitahMboh)
Subject: Re: Mweene Islands vs. Normal Islands
Organization: Loughborough University
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 92 12:23:06 GMT

In article <101478@netnews.upenn.edu>, weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu (Matthew P
Wiener) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec10.125644.21359@lut.ac.uk>, M.Titahmboh@lut (Mana
|> TitahMboh) writes:
|> >Quit talking geography and say where these "social islands" are (or
|> were)...
|> 
|> The Lemba people in South Africa were isolated from others in the sense
|> of no intermarriage until the past generation or two.  There are others,
|> but none that I know without looking up the names.
|> -- 
|> -Matthew P Wiener (weemba@sagi.wistar.upenn.edu)

This does not make them a "social island" and anyway, this sort of "isolation"
is quite common even in america (the US) when you think about it. Okay, so you
will cite a few exceptions ... marriages between jews and "wasps",
whites/blacks, ..., but you have to admit these would be exceptions to the
unwritten rule. Also, this issue of "social islands " has been taken way out of
context. As I remember, the implication was that AIDS thrived in these "islands"
- or at least that they didn't help in preventing its spread.
You [not you personally matthew] might even argue that being isolated, these
"islanders" can be presumed not to have been promiscuous and, therefore, could
not have worsened the spread of aids. After all, isn't promiscuity perceived as
a key aggravating factor in the spread of the desease? 
Were you the one who first used this "social islands" concept? because if so, I
would like to read the original post...if not, i would still like to read it if
anyone 's got it.
Joyeux noel/happy Christmas
Mana
From: djohns@elm.circa.ufl.edu (David A. Johns)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Institutional racism in education
Date: 12 Dec 92 17:13:58 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Florida, Gainesville

In article <ByxpA6.F8x@quake.sylmar.ca.us> brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder) writes:

# >     The people here defend programs that are very good at
# >helping blacks who are disadvantaged. You are free to defend
# >programs that are very good at helping other groups of people
# >who are disadvantaged.
#
#
# Would you apply this same reasoning to defend 19th century white
# slave masters who instituted "programs" which werre "very good at
# helping" southern whites?

What an amazing instance of selective reading.

First, remember that the slave-owners' "programs" did not benefit all
whites, but only those whites who were dependent on the industries
that used slave labor.  Whole upland areas of the Confederacy, from
northern Alabama on up the Appalachians, had to be put under military
control to keep them from seceding from the secessionist states.  West
Virginia, of course, did.  The reason was that *those* whites had no
economic stake in protecting the plantation economy.

So we're really talking about programs that benefitted the
slave-owners themselves.  Could you explain in what way they were
a disadvantaged group?

David
From: klewis@AFIT.AF.MIL (Keith A. Lewis)
Subject: ANYONE AT TENNESSE STATE UNIVERSITY?
Organization: Air Force Institue of Technology, WPAFB OH
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 14:57:09 GMT

I'M TRYING TO FIND A STUDENT AT TENNESSE STATE UNIVERSITY.  HER NAME IS 
TRACIE PENNINGTON.  MY UNCLE TOLD ME TO TRY TO LOCATE HER BY E-MAIL.  IF 
THEIR IS ANYONE OUT THERE THAT KNOWS HER TELL HER MY UNCLE MISSES HER.  HIS 
NAME IS MICHAEL PEARSON.  PLEASE WRITE BACK.  ANYONE.



KEITH
From: djohns@elm.circa.ufl.edu (David A. Johns)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Racist/Sexist Role Models
Date: 11 Dec 92 22:18:19 GMT
Organization: University of Florida, Gainesville

In article <Bz2vt0.5D7@quake.sylmar.ca.us> brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K. Yoder) writes:

# If you noticed that too many people were getting cavities, you
# could note that better brushing habits would help eliminate the
# problem.  That way to get people to brush more is for each
# individual to choose to do so.  Education can help, and social
# pressure could change it too.  Passing a law will not make people
# brush more...it'll make them resent the law.

Really?

Do you actually live in a world where no one ever says, "I didn't want
to do it, but I'm glad they made me"?

David

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination
From: lashlepi@newton.ccs.tuns.ca (Phillip Lashley)
Subject: Re: I'm Still Waiting
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 19:35:42 GMT
Distribution: usa,local
Organization: Technical University of Nova Scotia, Halifax, N.S.

In article <1992Dec16.125911.1@milori.ccit.arizona.edu> ohall@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>In article <1992Dec15.195317.26331@microsoft.com>, johnhall@microsoft.com (John Hall) writes:
>> In article ohall@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>> | In article johnhall@microsoft.com (John Hall) writes:
>> | > In article ohall@milori.ccit.arizona.edu writes:
>> 
>> All the wealth derived from slavery in the US was wiped out
>> in the Civil War, plus some.  The Jim Crow laws hurt total
>> american wealth, they didn't increase it.

Hold it on this laws stuff: who ended up eith the land after the civil war??????? i dont knoww, but ......
A

********************************************************************************* Leave the damm ting on the tree, so other people can pass and see            *
*lashlepi@newton.tuns.ccs.ca                                                   *
*Fax: (902)-420-7858                                                           *
*    Look, anything i say, i am responsible for thinking and writing, not      *
*                   withstanding divine intervention                           *********************************************************************************
From: mcbean@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: To All Disaffected White People
Date: 15 Dec 92 11:37:57 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <1992Dec11.104439.12140@vms.eurokom.ie>, ncostello@vms.eurokom.ie writes:
> 
> I couldn't agree more. I don't buy this stuff about "reverse racism"
> in the first place, but even if you accept it, I think you'd have to
> accept that "reverse racism" accounts for, let's say, 1% of racism
> in America (or in my country Britain, or in my country of residence
> Belgium), or 0.1%, or anyway some small number, measured in terms of its
> effects on people's life chances. And if that's true, what do you call
> people who spend 99% of their time spent on racism focussed on the 1%
> of racism that is against whites? 

Hypocritical shitheads... and closet racists.

McBean
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: heath@athena.cs.uga.edu (Terrance Heath)
Subject: Re: What's wrong w/ Our Skin Color?
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 16:08:15 GMT

In article <1992Dec15.175438.7918@crd.ge.com> mmrwlm@sn217.uca writes:
>In article 095838FKR@psuvm.psu.edu, FKR@psuvm.psu.edu () writes:
>+THe situation struck me as funny because one has to wonder was is the
>+problem some whites may have w/ AfAms.  I know prejudice is the answer here,
>+or some other explanation, but that's immaterial.  What's the problem w/ our
>+skin color?
>
>Nothing.  It's some people's perceptions of our skin color that is wrong.
>

	Sometime, though, we all-to-thoroughly absorbed those
perceptions ourselves. Not long ago I had an experience that brought
those perceptions to light in myself, in a way that made me rather
suprised and angry at myself.
	I went out with some friends to meet some folks for coffee not
long ago, and found myself rather effected by a particular young man
(and I do not mean that I was attracted to him). I felt something I
hadn't felt in years, like all of my old complexes were coming back
all at once and with a vengance. The young man wasn't doing anything
more than sitting there being himself, which happed to be the epitome
of the blonde, blue-eyed, wealthy All-American ideal.  In other words,
everything that I am not, and never will be (well, I MIGHT be rich,
SOMEDAY).
	I was surprised that I could still feel this way after so many
years of trying to heal myself, but I find that there is still some
internalized racism within me, that I turn against myself.  I think
that living in a racist society (No matter how much things have
changed, there is still some racism at the bottom of the whole thing)
means that to some degree we all internalize some racism, both blacks
and white. The difference is that internalized racism in blacks is
part of what makes some of us hate ourselves (and or brothers and
sisters) enough to believe we are worthy of wanting, or saving, even
saving ourselves. (The same priciple can apply to women and
internalized sexism, or gays and internalized homophobia). We, to some
degree, learned to hate ourselves; to hate our skin, I hair, our lips
and everything else that makes us "less" than the white ideal.
	I walked out of that resteraunt under a cloud that existed
mostly in my own mind, but which was no less real. I felt as though I
was back at square one, thinking I just had the wrong  skin, the
wrong hair, the wrong eyes, etc. The difference for me this time was
that I was at least aware enough to realize what was happening to me.
That may be the first step toward stopping it, and toward unlearning
the racism in me, which turns me against my self.


-- 
"Black men loving black men is THE revolutionary act!"
			-Joseph Beam_
Terrance Heath 
heath@athena.cs.uga.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: jpa2001@andy.bgsu.edu (Sherlette Dixon)
Subject: Relevance to African-Am. History to U.S. Citizens
Followup-To: soc.culture.african.american
Organization: BGSU
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 00:37:09 GMT

You will find this same article under alt.discrimination, but here I will
add a few more comments:

2 writers by the name of Brian K. Yoder and William Karomo have been
disputing the relevance of teaching Black history at all levels of the
education system, and being the intelligent Black young lady that I am, I
feel obligated to put my 2 cents in.  Black history, Hispanic histories
(with it being the umbrella from which Mexican, Puertoriquese, and other
Latino histories come into play), Asian histories, and the like are all
important to all U.S. residents, if to only remind ourselves of the mosaic 
that exists here.  This country represents neither a "salad bowl" nor a
"melting pot":  terms that have been popularized by the "American"
vernacular.  I am talking about a mosaic, a work of art  that depends upon
its many colors and features for its very existence.  Enough said.

Yoder obviously does not see the significance of learning about his own
heritage, and that is his business.  But I believe  that I know why he
feels this way----as do quite a few Whites.  Yoder had access to his
history before, he has access to it now, and he will continue to have
access to it:  free and unobstructured access.  He can ignore his German
heritage or he can study it:  it is purely his option.  Blacks and
Hispanics do not have the option that Yoder has.  After the "discovery" of
the New World, to keep African slaves in their place, it became necessary
to keep them in a state of cultural self-denial.  This process only took a
generation to reach  completion, but 500+ years later, African-Americans
are still trying to reverse the damage---and the damage is EXTENSIVE.  ALL
people can learn from this damage, but emphasis must be placed on the
enlightenment that Black culture, specifically African-Am. culture, brought
and continues to bring to these United States of America, which said
knowledge has yet to be truly realized.

Sherlette Dixon
From: helfman@aero.org (Robert S. Helfman)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: AA baby
Date: 13 Dec 1992 09:12:11 GMT
Organization: The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: aerospace.aero.org

In article <Erika_L_Blumberg-121292213943@stiles-kstar-node.net.yale.edu> Erika_L_Blumberg@quickmail.cis.yale (Erika Blumberg) writes:
>Nice distorted oversimplification of Bakke.  He did not get refused
>admission because he was Caucasian; he merely did not get into UC Davis Law
                                                                         ^^^   
>School, I believe it was, initally, because they had a specific amount of
>slots set aside for minority students and he was not one....

It was Medical School, not Law School. I understand he's a practicing physician
now.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: Guest@comm.mgmt.purdue.edu (john lagman )
Subject: Omega Psi Phi
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 21:58:58 GMT
Organization: Krannert Graduate School of Management
Keywords: Ques, Que-Dog, Omega, Omega Psi Phi

Any Que-Dogs out there?
From: isbell@ai.mit.edu (Charles L Isbell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: This Week In Black History (12/14 - 12/31 1992)
Date: 14 Dec 92 13:48:26
Organization: MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
NNTP-Posting-Host: panther.ai.mit.edu

Today is Monday December 14, 1992. 

This is the rest of the year for those of you who will miss some stuff
after Christmas.

(My comments are in brackets:  [])

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

December 14  

December 15  

December 16  Negro Methodist Episcopal Church founded in Jackson, TN,
                1890 
             Andrew Young named Ambassador and Chief US Delegate to
                the United Nations, 1976

December 17  

December 18  Congress passed 13th Amendment abolishing slavery, 1865

December 19  Carter G Woodson, historian and father of Black History
                Month, born 1875-1950

December 20  Mother Matelda Beasley, nun, born 1834-1903
             South Carolina secedes from the union, initiating the
                Civil War, 1860

December 21  

December 22  Henry Highland Garnet, abolitionist, born 1815-1882

December 23  Alice H. Parker received a patent for the gas heating
                furnace, 1919

December 24  

December 25  Operation PUSH (People United to Save Humanity) organized
                by Rev Jesse Jackson, 1971

December 26  Kwanzaa begins

December 27  

December 28  

December 29  

December 30  Dr Miles V Lynk, physician, published the first Black
                medical journal, 1892

December 31  

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--
Peace.
                     "There is a level of cowardice lower than that 
                      of the conformist: the fashionable non-conformist."
                                               - Ayn Rand
                                   -\--/-
    Don't just adopt opinions     |  \/  |       Some of you are homeboys
          develop them.           |  /\  | but only I am The Homeboy From hell
                                   -/--\-
From: HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu (Gabrielle Daniels)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Texas State U Marching Band and Rodney King Looting
Date: 20 Dec 92 21:26:28 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Stanford University
NNTP-Posting-Host: morrow.stanford.edu

>In article <71967@cup.portal.com> , Arthur_T_Hu@cup.portal.com writes:
>>There's a tiff over the predominantly black Texas Southern U Band that
>>went on a looting rampage in the electronics shopping district in Tokyo.
>>Seemed they all blatantly grabbed stuff and ran back to the bus, where
>>the cops were all waiting, and they had to leave most of the stuff in
>>the aisle before they were allowed back into the airport. There were
>>remarks from students that "this makes America look bad, it makes the
>>school look bad, it makes the race look bad"
>>
.
.
Not that I am agreeing with Arthur Hu, but this latest controversy
between Afro-Americans and Japanese has got me.
.
It's shameful to say the least.  Bad enough, that these people think
we are animals in the first place, but they get so-called
confirmation of it from the get-go straight from the source: US.
.
Plus, 28 people came who weren't connected with the band.  I hear
the president of TSU is having conniption fits.
.
.
GABRIELLE THERESA DANIELS
E MAIL:  hf.gtd@forsythe.stanford.edu
SNAIL MAIL:  P.O. Box 15, Palo Alto, CA  94302
MA BELL MAIL:  (415) 858-3932, M-F 8:30-5:30,'til 2/1/92

ON VACATION UNTIL 1/4/93.
Merry Xmas
Happy Kwanzaa
Happy Solstice
From: johnson@whitewater.chem.wisc.edu (Art Johnson)
Subject: Re: Louis FarraKKKhan
Organization: Physical Sciences Lab, UW-Madison
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 16:52:44 GMT

In article <1gjcggINN4jr@morrow.stanford.edu> HF.GTD@forsythe.stanford.edu  
(Gabrielle Daniels) writes:
> ..
> Sometimes white guys do smell like wet dogs or chickens!  Or iron.
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^                           ^^^^                        
> Now that they've discovered Drakkar Noir, maybe things will get
> better...

     YES, YES, that's it! Personally, I would have said white women, but  
the basic principle still holds. A cold ingot of iron. It works. :-)

Arthur Johnson
johnson@whitewater.chem.wisc.edu 

      
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american



	the title of the book is--

	JUST PERMANENT INTERESTS: BLACKS IN CONGRESS 1870-1991
	by William Clay;  approx. $25.00


(i should be getting it this weekend :-)
pjm.
From: mmrwlm@sn217.uca (Wanda L McCrae)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Parks doesn't repond: AGAIN
Date: 15 Dec 92 17:53:05 GMT
Reply-To: mmrwlm@sn217.uca
Organization: General Electric

In article 075056KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu, KRB104@psuvm.psu.edu () writes:
+In article <Bz79KH.Jr9@quake.sylmar.ca.us>, brian@quake.sylmar.ca.us (Brian K.
+Yoder) says:
+>
+>Terry Parks:
+>Would you PLEASE explain why you insist on spelling "black" as "blak"?
+ I have asked Terry Parks this question three times already and have yet to get
+a response and frankly I am tired of the way she spells it.

I'm curious; why all the hoopla?  The word "black" is merely a color.
I don't feel it is any reflection on me as an African-American or
"black" person, if someone chooses to spell it different from the
way I am used to seeing it.

---
_______________________________________________
Wanda McCrae - mmrwlm@sn370.utica.ge.com

"A wise old owl sat in an oak.
 The more he heard, the less he spoke.
 The less he spoke, the more he heard.
 Why can't we all be like that wise, old bird?"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american