HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: utingli@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Tingli Pan)
Subject: Re: Mainland China is #3 Economic Superpower?! :-(
Organization: Educational Computing Network
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 03:11:46 GMT

In article <79208@ut-emx.uucp> joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang) writes:
>In article <Bty2vH.Lr7@multisys.com> rot@multisys.com (Republic of Taiwan) writes:
>>What's good of a huge country?
>
>Large markets with uniform economic regulations tend to generate more
>wealth than small markets.  There are several reasons for this.  With
>
......

>Also, a huge country is more likely to take a look at the big picture.
>If you have a collection of little countries, then each country may be
>tempted to take action that benefits it, but hurts them collectively.
>
>Finally, a huge country is in a better position to negotiate with
>outside countries than a collection of small countries.  With a group
>
....

And of course, a large coutry has much more chance to use its muscle to
swallow its neibours, and anything it doesn't like.

Tingli Pan

Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:25539 soc.culture.taiwan:13358
From: v999rke8@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Specification of F-16, SU-27 (I)
Date: 14 Sep 92 20:58:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Sep14.152206.4559@linus.mitre.org>, 129.83.161.10 (H. Chao) writes...
> 
>2) I just heard about Q-7 a ground-attack aircraft based on J-7.  Do you
>have any info about that?


I didn't heard anything about that Q-7. But if it is really built based on 
J-7 (Mig 21), it is a hopeless plane.  You can know this from the style of 
Mig-21 which has a very large length/wing-width ratio (almost 2) which means 
poor ability of turning. For an attacker, this is a fatal problem.

In fact, J-6 is better than J-7 in dogfight, especially in low and middle 
altitude.
From: a@b.c.d
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: anonymous posting
Date: 4 Sep 92 23:33:07 GMT
Organization: dontcare
Originator: a@b.c.d

To post anonymously is neither high-tech nor hacking. Hacking is something
original, not many people can be ranked as hackers.

1. find your local host running nntp server, using 'df' or just check the
   first host in "From:" field in any of your 's'aved news article.

2. type
	telent nntp-server nntp (or 119)

3. inside the telnet, type
	post

4. To make a header like this article, you need to input:
> Path: beijing!china
> From: a@b.c.d
> Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
> Message-ID: <0010@b.c.d>
> Sender: a@b.c.d
> Originator: a@b.c.d
> Subject: anonymous posting
> Organization: dontcare
> Distribution: world
> Nntp-Posting-Host: nntp-server

Some explanation:
    'Path:' will be appended to the real Path: and From: fields, make it
            difficult for someone to trace the originator. I didn't use
            any real site names for the field in this posting, so you know
	    where this posting is originated.
    'From:' use at least three fields after @, so the real address not appended.
    'Me..-ID:' must be unique for each posting.

5. leave an empty line with the header, and start your text.

6. put a single '.' at the begining of a line to end your input and post it.

7. Have fun!!!!!!!
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: jjs@iedv7.acd.com ( James J. Song       )
Subject: Re: Shen Tong Takes the Challenge
Organization: Applied Computing Devices, Inc.
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 16:48:08 GMT

In article <14895@mindlink.bc.ca> Sanyee_Tang@mindlink.bc.ca (Sanyee Tang) writes:
>
>    Shen Tong took the challenge and went back.
>
>    I am pride that not every CSS is grabbing the US greencard in the back,
>meanwhile kissing CCP's ass in the front, even if CCP is waving.
>

Over this labor-day weekends, I have heard several stories about such CSS's.

One guy has been known as loyal to CCP and for a while people thought he was
genuine in this famous midwest University. During turbulant summer of 1989, 
he dared to draft an open letter to the Chinese government golorifying CCP 
with suggestion to smoothly end the students' movement. Later, while almost
all the CSS' defected to the rebellious Chinese student organizations, he
started a pro-CCP CSS club. With the money and other materials such as movies
and moon cakes of low price from Consulate in Chicago, his club did attract 
some CSS' in that school and he seemed to be doing very well with both CSS'
and the Chinese government. I had heard many people praising him as being
honestly loyal to his party and government as well as patriotic. 

Now, after having been staying in this midwest school for several years 
since his graduation, he finally landed a job in China: an American 
representative of a joint venture. His connection to the Chinese government 
really caught American businessman's eyes. At the same time, his wife is 
pregnant and going to give a birth to an American citizen. Now the Chinese 
people get a new pro-CCP "Mai3 Ban4".

Another head of the club got an extension of his passport and abandoned
the club and school to pursue his career somewhere else.

Kissing CG and CCP does result in personal benefit, especially in a 
place and at a time CCP really needs a hand. What is tragic is that 
those CSS' who followed these truely faked patriots have only been 
assists to their gains. 

These stories shouldn't be strange to all CSS from the mainland China.
What is strange to me is that people are still fooled by these fakes. 
___
From: stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: The purpose of a country. (Was: F-16's fear?)
Date: 10 Sep 1992 18:31:19 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: stevelin

In article <1992Sep10.164120.10785@news.acns.nwu.edu> (Usenet on news.acns) writes:
>
>I think it's good to keep Taiwan in its current status. It's good to both  
>Taiwan and mainland. It's always important to have something to check and  
>balance the social systems. I think Taiwan's 43-year-seperation from mainland  
>at least checks and balances mainland politics to some degree. 
>
>Carl

Taiwan provides a good model that Chinese people are capable to manage their
land as well as westerners. Taiwan gives a hope to all Chinese people that
democracy in Chinese style can be carried on. Taiwan gives confidence to all
Chinese people that Chinese can overcome the most difficult economy stituation
and reverse it. Taiwan provides a hard evidence to deny that most Chinese
said that China is too big to change, it is too hard to improve, Chinese are
beyond of education, Chinese are not able to catch up westerners.
From: liqiang@kramden.nyu.edu (Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Chinese culture
Date: 14 Sep 92 01:22:23 GMT
Organization: New York University

lix@murray.bu.edu (Xiaowen Li) writes:

>In article <1992Sep13.223119.5922@tamsun.tamu.edu> x0y3510@tamuts.tamu.edu (Xuejun Yang) writes:
>>(deleted)
>>get real, be realistic and objective. Don't apply rich people's 
>>way of thinking on poor people, that's so-called Chinese reality but
>>I doubt if poor is equal to bad culture.      

>Not equal, but being poor itself suggests something wrong in Chinese
>culture. We, especially young people, are responsible to learn from
>western cultures, and find out exactly what is wrong in Chinese one.

>It is not easy, but in 80,000 CSS, there must be someones.
>-- 

I agree we should learn from the west to update our own culture. However,
I hope you were not discounting the older generation in your posting. They
too are "responsible to learn from the west". A younger generation 
alienated from the older doesn't do any culture much good.

My point is age really means something. Lu Xun's more influential articles
were all published after his 30's and Confusius said he basically hadn't
understood much of the world before 30 yrs of age. The truth is in Chinese
history few people had a consolidated career before they became mentally
mature. Liu2 Bei4 was a shoe vendor till 28 and he was still being chased
around till 46. I think it's the traditional Chinese mentality that youth
not be trusted or at least credited too much. The reason is age plus
experience can make a difference.

The economic reform in China now is mostly carried out by the older
generation and I think they are doing a good job in bringing about
positive changes to the country and they have been pretty fast in mastering
what are skills for a market economy. 

Of course, I think we have a good shot too (I am 26). By the time we are
ready, they might have laid much of a foundation for us so that the skills
we are learning now should become more applicable.

Good day.

- Li, Qiang
From: rsanders@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (RRobert M Sanders)
Subject: Re: Change in spelling of Chinese names
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 04:38:16 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.170450.4038@desire.wright.edu> steve@snake.appl.wpafb.af.
mil (Steve Zabarnick) writes:
>I've noticed that the English spelling of Chinese names and places changed
>drastically during the 1980's. That is Peking changed to Bejing, Chang changed
>to Xiang, etc. I am curious as to the reason for this change-- who instituted
>it, why was it done, where there any changes in the Chinese versions of these
>names? Thanks.
>
>Steve Zabarnick
>steve@snake.appl.wpafb.af.mil


Steve,

The reason that for changing the spelling of Chinese names was an attempt to 
accommodate to the spelling system promulgated by the Chinese government in the
1950's.  Many different ways of spelling Chinese by means of an alphabet have 
been developed, primarily by Western missionaries.  In fact, spellings like 
'Peking' are examples of an earlier system.  The system proposed by the Chinese
government did not change the way these names were spoken by the Chinese, but 
did change significantly the way they were spelled by non-Chinese.  It is 
interesting to note this probably one of very few cases in which the English 
language has made changes to accomodate the native spellings of another 
culture.  Just look at how we spell (and hence pronounce) the names of European
cities, e.g. Rome/Roma, Munich/Munchen.  It is also interesting to note how 
Chinese represent non-Chinese place names in their language.  Very often the 
first group of Chinese to come into contact with a particular place claimed the
honor of rendering that place into Chinese.  Most of the first Chinese to do 
this were from southern China, and hence had a very different system of 
pronunciation than what is now the standard language of China.  By convention, 
certain Chinese written symbols came to be used for the naming of foreign 
places, based not on the pronunciation of what is now standard Mandarin, but on
the basis of southern Chinese. For example:

California uses two symbols, one to render a sound something similar to the 
English pronunciation of California, the other to give the meaning of state.  
If one uses the unofficial southern pronunciation the first syllable sounds 
something like pronouncing 'car' with a Boston accent.  In standard 
pronunciation, on the other hand, the pronunciation is quite different, 
sounding something like the combination of 'gee' + 'ah'.  Standard Chinese does
have the Boston car sound, as used in the word for truck.  The question I would
like to ask any Chinese reader who has taken the trouble to read this (maybe 
one or two of you actually got this far) is, given China's insistence that 
foreigners change their way of spelling Chinese names, does China have an 
obligation for modernizing the way it renders the pronunciation of foreign 
place names?

Robert Sanders
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: y0z8374@summa.tamu.edu 
Subject: test
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 17:23:00 GMT

test!

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: claudius@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: Territory of Ancient China : Zhou Dynasty
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 92 01:52:03 GMT

In article <9225200.20605@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby) writes:
>**Period:
>
>1111 B.C. -> 770 B.C. is known as the West Zhou Dynasty.
>(770 B.C. -> 256 B.C. is known as East Zhou, but better known as
>Spring/Autumn Period and Warring States Period, as the Empire
>has lost central control, with independant States fighting
>amongst each other.  This will be discussed later.)
>
>**Dynasty:
>
>Zhou (West) Dynasty
>
>**Area under Central Control:
>
>North:  to Machuria and south of current Great Wall of China.
>West:  Most area of modern GanSu is lost.
>South:  most area in modern China, except the Provinces of
>GuangDong, GuangXi, and FuJian.

Well, depending on if you consider Chu Chinese or not.  I don't.  (At least
they still haven't been conformed to the Chinese culture at that time)  And
I don't think even Chu controlled Jiang1 Xi1 and Hu2 Nan2 either, at least
not effectively.  Chu mostly controlled the area near the Yangtze, except for
the east coast, which was controlled by Wu.
>
>Three Tribes to the North (Mongolians) were major threats.

Whether if they are the same stock as Mongolians is a big question mark.
Remember, the Mongolians had not appeared in history until thousands of years
later.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.taiwan
From: rchoy@clarify.com (Raymond Choy)
Subject: Re: I'm very disappointed in Chinese (A sort of defeatism) 
Organization: Clarify, San Jose
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 17:58:26 GMT

In article <9224612.1330@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU> william@natimuk.acci.com.au (William Lo) writes:
>In article <1992Sep1.113239.12546@cs.mu.OZ.AU> dht@mulga.cs.mu.oz.au (Joyous Dave) writes:
>>I'm very disappointed in Chinese people.
>
>	Defeatism?
>	Don't be. Disappointment will not do any good for
>	us, either. Why don't you offer a few words of encourage-
>	ment then, mate?
>>
>>I want to improve China, improve its people's living standard,
>>improve its productivity, improve its economy, improve its
>>stand in the world.  And I asked people to contribute suggestions
>>to how to improve China.
>	
>	So do we. Got a lot to achieve.
>	
>
>>[...Stuff(your blaming) deleted...]  
>
>	Why your so interested in blaming innocent pasttimes?
>	Maybe you need to be a little patient I suppose. 
>
>>Now, I really believe that Chinese are a grain of sand.  PLEASE PLEASE
>>PLEASE prove me wrong by posting some suggestions on how to improve
>>the country!
>
>	Some essential input then:
>
>	The most urgent one is to get the Chinese eduated. I reckon
>	you can just stand still with a bulk of people who don't have a
>	grain of sense(not sand!) and are uncivilised. Put some investment
>	in our people first! 
>
>	You still seem to ignore politics. So, politically, the gov't
>	must play its part, too. That is, we want to have the CCP start
>	to recognise that we all have our rights - it's just such an
>	essential and natural thing that people's happiness heavily depends
>	on. It however still turns the stomachs of our beloved comrades. What
>	should you think then, mate? 
>	 
>	  
>---Cheers,
>	Bill
>

Looking into so many articles in this thread, finally got someone 
mentioned the Keyword "Education"! I think the most important and
urgent thing for China nowadays is education. Although there are 
a lot of brilliant scholar in China that are technically strong,
the majority of Chinese are still very ignorant. 


-Raymond Choy-
From: peng@castle.ed.ac.uk (W Peng)
Newsgroups: eduni.general,ed.general,soc.culture.china
Subject: test
Date: 8 Sep 92 18:15:08 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University


test! 1234567890!!
From: melinda@Software.Mitel.COM (Melinda Tan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: travel in China
Date: 14 Sep 92 15:53:38 GMT
Organization: Mitel. Kanata (Ontario). Canada.


Hello,
I'm making a request on the net for information regarding travel in
the east coast and north of China.
I'm thinking of travelling to China with my boyfriend next Spring.
We plan to start our journey in Bejing and end in Shanghai.
I have a few questions and would appreciate any offers to help.
I would like to know:
- if there are any festivals during April/May.
- what method of transportation is advisable for travel along the coast
  ie. is backpacking/ taking the train a good method?
- where the most scenic places are (mountain ranges etc.)
- where the most interesting cultural cities are

Thanks in advance for your help.
Please email me, if possible.
Melinda Tan
-- 
Melinda Tan                        
Melinda.Tan@Software.Mitel.COM   
(613)592-2122 x4064
From: rnathan@penuts.enet.dec.com (V RAMANATHAN)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Help
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:04:08 GMT
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

Hi Friends,

	I'm trying to contact one Ms. Susan Xuang student of Virginia

University. All I have is the E-mail address xuang@vcuvax. But this

seems to be an incomplete address. Please send me a mail message if

any one of you know the complete address for Virginia Univ or of

Ms. Susan.

	Your help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks & Regards,

/Ram
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:25311 soc.culture.taiwan:13170
From: jqtan@northstar60 (Jian-Qi Tan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Who Cares 150 F-16s.
Date: 11 Sep 92 17:48:25 GMT
Organization: Project NORTHSTAR, Dartmouth College

Taiwanese government's feeling of insecurity is a result of its own ambition
to rule the whole China someday.  Especially these days, many foreign powers
are keen on promoting "human rights and democracy" in China.  Taiwan couldn't
wait for the day when the central government collapse and it becomes the
biggest warlord in China, with many F-16s and Mirages.

Right now as the informal exchanges across the straight become heavier, the
Taiwanese government fears losing its influence over its own business and
industry.  That's why it's balking on any talk on more official exchange.
Why can't Taiwanese government accept the fact that it doesn't have any
real foreign politicy and it is only a provincial power.  This realization
is a good starting point of any meaningful talk.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: 150 F-16 to Taiwan
From: Tao Yao <TAYAO@MTUS5.BITNET>
Date: Saturday, 5 Sep 1992 14:02:11 EST
 <65500087@acf3.NYU.EDU><1992Sep5.024735.20710@unixg.ubc.ca><1992Sep5.035350.18
 711@zip.eecs.umich.edu> <92249.132048TAYAO@MTUS5.BITNET>
Organization: Computing Technology Services, Michigan Technological Univ.

1:150 F-16 are protecting ROC, not ROT, right?
2:Is a war the solution for TI? The right way is TIers try to persuade
  1): Taiwanese. Is every taiwanese TIer? definitly not!
  2): KMT. Will KMT agree that?           No
  3): Mainlander. Do they like TI?        No
  4): CCP. Will they give up using force to prevent taiwan from being independe
nt?                                       No

SUMMARY: Try your best to persuade people accept your opinion. dont think how m
any F-16 you have so that you can say: Long live TI.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.taiwan
From: dht@cs.mu.OZ.AU (Joyous Dave baby)
Subject: Re: I'm very disappointed in Chinese
Organization: Computer Science, University of Melbourne, Australia
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 23:51:33 GMT

joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang) writes:

>In article <1992Sep1.194111.25930@csl.sri.com> dchan@cisco.com (Derek Chan) writes:
>>   How much money do you get
>>   from a population that is 80% illiterate. 

>One small correction.  75% is the LITERACY rate.  The population on
>the Mainland is about 75% literate and 25% illiterate. 

I also like to mention that 80% of those 25% illiterate are women, and
mostly aged.  If you only count the active [in the economy and society]
group of people, I'm sure you'll find up to 90% (if not more) literacy.

-- 
1)-----------------------Rev 6:8 "... They were given authority over a quarter
of the Earth, to kill by the sword, by famine, by plague, and wild beasts."
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
From: heathd@ucs.orst.edu (Du Shi-hua Heath)
Subject: Re: Michael Chang in US Open Semi-Final!
Organization: University Computing Services - OSU
Distribution: na
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 00:09:40 GMT

>>	Sampras:	second generation from Greek
>
>     Does Lendl become a citizen of US?
>    I guess he is still keeping Czech citizenship
>    even though he lives here over 10 years. Patriot?
I heard that Czechoslovakia is going to split into two countries late this
year.  Which nationality will he be about that?
From: v999qx29@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: F-16's fear?
Date: 9 Sep 92 02:36:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <65500110@acf3.NYU.EDU>, yangze@acf3.NYU.EDU (Ze Yang, , , ) writes...
> 
>Only a small pecentage of people think there is such a thing called
>ROC, all others think of GMD as a rebel group, but they have control
>over Taiwan, just like Philipine Communist gurrillas have controls
>over part of that country.
> 
> 
>Ze Yang

Are you a communist?
Xref: sparky soc.culture.china:25035 alt.chinese.text:271
From: pinghua@emily4.Berkeley.EDU (Pinghua Young)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,alt.chinese.text
Subject: ~{A:W#P!LaGYP-W`Gz~} Liang2-Zhu4
Date: 8 Sep 1992 05:24:31 GMT
Organization: University of California at Berkeley
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: emily4.berkeley.edu

The complete Sun-Sparc created .au sound file of ~{A:W#P!LaGYP-W`Gz~} is
available for anonymous ftp at <sun-robot.nuceng.ufl.edu>, courtesy of
Mr. Dai, the site manager.  This complete .au sound file is about 13MB,
and it's 8-bit, 8000hz and u-law (whatever that means :-).  A short
file called liang_zhu_short.au is also on that site.  Both are under
the directory of audio.  When ftp-ing, please exercise extreme courtesy
as it's a hugh file and we don't want to put too heavy a load on the site.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Pinghua Young, Department of Economics        pinghua@Econ.Berkeley.EDU 
University of California at Berkeley        pinghua%econ@ucbcmsa.BITNET 
Berkeley, California 94720, U.S.A.   ~{C@9z2.?K@{<SV]4sQ'>-<CO5QnF=;*~}
From: stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: 150 F-16 to Taiwan
Date: 9 Sep 1992 22:59:23 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: stevelin

In article <laggheINNr2v@nada.cs.utexas.edu> s245@cs.utexas.edu (Spring Class Account)writes:
>>
>>Well, probably not too much. But it is only the beginning, isn't it ?
>>The total cost of 150 F-16s is about $4 billions, it is not a big deal based on
>>Taiwan's trade surplus, its about $90 billions now.
>>
>China will cancel its $6b airplane order with the US.
>
The loser will be CCP. Big deal, $6b airplane order! Don't you see the difference?

>Also, it is very likely that China will risk its entire trade relationship
>with the US.  
>
Who will lose the business? Of course, the RED SUN header.

>The Chinese govn has consistantly retaliated against all countries which
>sold  arms to Taiwan.
>
Big deal! RED SUN rises from the west!!!

Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan
From: cc015@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Vito T. Kwan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: he didn't know UNIX
Date: 10 Sep 1992 13:31:50 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Weird subject title, uh? Ok, here is what I am going to say today:
On Sep 9th, 1976, Mao died. (Cheers from the crowd) 
And the following message is strictly personal:
Mao, may your generations, boys become idiots and girls become prostitutes and
screwed by every man who can pay for it.
Mao, if your soul at the bottom of the hell some how get this mail,
go talk to me, don't send a virus to this group. Wait a second, he 
doesn't know UNIX, deos he?
Again, this mail is strictly personal.
(I mark Sep. 9th on my calendar every year)
-- 
Vito Kwan                 
Academic Computer Center,   Hofstra University
INTERNET:   accvtk@vaxc.hofstra.edu
BITNET  :   csc3vtk@hofstra.bitnet
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china