HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: Rosemary Waigh <rwaigh@zooid.guild.org>
Subject: Re: Godhead or Meathead?
Reply-To: rwaigh@zooid.UUCP (Rosemary Waigh)
Organization: The Zoo of Ids
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:07:02 GMT

In article <altar.720900520@sfu.ca> altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar) writes:
>problems of the planet, but they will buy us time.  The
>root problem has been and always will be, that of humn
>overpopulation.  The fact of the matter is that our human
>population of 5.5 billion people is not likely to decrease
>but only increase for some time to come.  You are looking
>at a population of some 10 billion people in the next
>25-40 years!

Population is an important and fascinating issue.  If you're interested
you might like to read the 1992 Sept. issue of _New_Internationalist_
magazine, entitled "sex, lies and global survival".

Ro
rwaigh@zooid.guild.org
From: tara@starburst.umd.edu (Tara McDermott)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: VEGAN: Coffee Cake
Date: 9 Nov 92 03:43:51 GMT

This is from the New Farm Vegetarian Cookbook:

Coffee Cake
-----------

Mix together:
3 cups unbleached flour
1 cup sugar (I used sucanat, which worked wonderfully)
1 tsp. cinnamon
3/4 tsp. nutmeg
1/2 tsp. allspice
1 1/2 stick margerine (3/4 cup)

After mixing, set aside one cup of this mixture for the topping.  Add
the following ingredients to the remainder of the mixture:
1 1/4 cup soymilk
3 tsp. baking powder
1/2 cup raisins (opt. - I left them out)

Mix well, and don't worry about the lumps.  Pour into an 8" x 8" oiled
casserole pan.  Sprinkle the rest of the mix on as a topping, adding
1/2 cup chopped walnuts if desired (it tastes better, believe me!).
Cook in oven at 375 degrees (preheated of course) for 25 - 30 minutes.
I ended up cooking mine closer to 40 minutes, but I'm now using a
derelict old small oven.  You'll know it's done when a knive inserted
into the middle comes out clean.  YUM!  Best coffee cake I ever ate.
My new dog loves it too.

--
Tara McDermott                                  tara@starburst.umd.edu

Sweet and sweet is their poisoned note, the little snakes' of silver throat,
in mossy skulls that nest and lie, ever singing "die, oh! die."
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg,talk.politics.animals
From: jhoskins@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (James M Hoskins)
Subject: Re: AR Prisoners in need of your written support
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 18:33:56 GMT

In article <1dbo99INNa6s@agate.berkeley.edu> spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve
Pope) writes:
>vanetten@unix.cie.rpi.edu (John S. Van Etten) writes:
>
>>Steve Pope writes:
>>
>>>"poaching" is also a form of HUNTING.
>>
>>Do you honestly believe this?
>
>Yes -- it's obvious isn't it?
>
>>All I can say is WOW.  You really don't get it.  I don't consider
>>myself any more responsible for poachers because I have a hunting
>>license, than I do for drunk drivers because I have a driver's
>>license.
>
>Van E., I didn't ASK you whether you felt responsible for
>poachers...
>
>Steve


And plowing a field up the hill instead of with the contour is
also a form plowing, not to mention somewhat tautological.  Should
plowing, including modern forms of plowing, be absolutely outlawed?

If you believe that poaching is an unavoidable inherent behavior
wherever people with weapons are allowed, that moreover leads to 
a form of hunting that inevitably decimates wildlife populations,
then you've got a debatable point.  Is this what you're getting at?
Or are you just restricting your statement to the mountain lion?
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: georgec@eng.umd.edu (George B. Clark)
Subject: Re: Why vegetarianism ?
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 92 15:11:37 GMT
Organization: University of Maryland

In article <1992Nov6.132624.13222@abo.fi> abulsari@aton.abo.fi writes:
>It has been stated time and again that :
>
>Some of us will continue to post informative articles on these topics.

And others like yourself will continue to post misinformation, along
with your "list of participants," which numerous subscribers have
openly complained about.

>          You will plenty of information from new postings. Followups
>mainly have arguments.

Stop posting, Mr. Bulsari, and the tone of the dialog will improve
dramatically. Those of us who have been around awhile, already know
who you are. Those of you who are new should beware.
From: rghoff@bb1t.monsanto.com
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: AR Prisoners in need of your written support
Date: 9 Nov 92 15:45:08 CST
Organization: Monsanto Company, St. Louis, MO

In article <swood.720929059@vela>, swood@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Scott Wood - EVENSONG) writes:
> proberts@informix.com (Paul Roberts) writes:
> 
> `In article <swood.720478637@vela> swood@phoebe.acs.oakland.edu (Scott Wood - EVENSONG) writes:
> 
> `As for "inconvenience .... for a short time", you might want to look into
> `the subject a bit more. It depends on the substance being tested of course,
> `but at least sometimes they go on until the eyeball is basically destroyed.
> `I guess you don't think this matters, but you shouldn't try to misrepresent
> `just how nasty this test can be.
> 
> 
> Maybe you might look into my arguement a bit more.  If in fact it destroys
> the eye, then in fact it is better than having the end product do the same
> to a human eye.  That is the purpose of the test!
> 
> swood
> 

Keep in mind that not every single substance tested will cause total
blindness. Or any other damage for that matter.  Remember, the test is
used to determine DEGREE of injury, and that can range from none to 
extremely severe.

I think an argument for continueing the test is not only for posting 
warnings, but also anticipating treatments that would be needed in the 
cases of accidental exposure.

Rick Hoffman.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: disgusting food? (was: Re: Godhead or Meathead?
From: abel@vax.sonoma.edu
Date: 9 Nov 92 12:05:03 -0800
Organization: Sonoma State University

In article <1992Nov6.220907.14656@unlv.edu>, robert@unlv.edu (Robert Cray) writes:
> In article <1992Nov6.135506.17909@alw.nih.gov> don@helix.nih.gov (donald seto) writes:
>>In article <1992Nov6.001319.2390@unlv.edu> robert@unlv.edu (Robert Cray) writes:
>>>I know a Chinese person who likes wharf roaches.  Not eating insects
> [...]
>>Get outta here!  Are you implying that eating roaches is a chinese
>>cultural thing?  Because of all the chinese people I know, none eat
>>roaches or anyother kind of insects.  In fact, the only insects eaten
> 
> Well, I'm not sure how common it is, but I know one person from Hong Kong
> who claims to like roaches (prepared in HK).  I beleive it is a special
> kind of roach, i.e. not the ones you find running around the house.  I've
> eaten lots of stuff prepared by Chinese people that many Americans wouldn't
> consider Chinese food, stuff like tripe (cows stomach), jellyfish, pork
> uterus, pigs blood boiled and left to turn into solid cubes, chicken/duck
> feet, etc.
> 
[stuff zapped]

Well, different cultures eat different foods.  My brother, who is a 
somewhat picky eater, married a woman from Taiwan.  They went there 
for a visit to meat (not meet!) the relatives.  He went to lots of 
fancy meals at restaurants.  It was not the custom for each person to 
order what they wanted, but for the host to order many courses which 
everybody would eat.  He attended a 10 course dinner where he could 
only eat one course!  He showed me a couple of menus.  There were 
extremely few dishes that looked vegetarian.  There were an awful lot 
of intestines, tendons and various sealife that I had never considered to 
be food before.

On the other hand, my brother cooked a fancy dinner for New Years 
(not the Chinese one), and I was surprised at how many deviled eggs 
he was making.  He explained that his in-laws refused to eat most of 
the food he cooked, and it seemed like the deviled eggs would be the 
only thing that his brother-in-law would eat!
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: twain@milton.u.washington.edu (Barbara Hlavin)
Subject: Re: Conclusions about Ted Altar
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:48:35 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.070847.13173@abo.fi> abulsari@aton.abo.fi writes:
>The result of last several postings is a consensus - 

Who did you poll to arrive at this general agreement?  You didn't         
contact me.

>So Ted, please keep posting. People like everything you post,

I don't. 

>and we all look forward to reading your postings.

I don't. 

>We should be grateful to him for being the single most
>important source of informative postings on r.f.v. It is
>to a good extent because of him and Ferrell Wheeler and
>Michael Traub that people want to read this newsgroup.


I don't agree with either of these statements in the least. 


--Barbara 



Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: tjfeue@bb1t.monsanto.com
Subject: Re: The Most Important (tm) Poster + recipe
Organization: Monsanto Company, St. Louis, MO
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 18:27:42 GMT

In article <1992Nov12.205431.22689@pencom.com>, ph@pencom.com 
(Patrick Hester) writes:
> The most important poster to rec.food.veg is whoever posts the next
> excellent recipe I've never tried before.
> 
> Here's my attempt to become YOUR most important poster...

[Patrick's most worthy recipe deleted to make room for mine]

Nice try, but sorry Patrick, your feeble attempt at stopping a flame 
war *AND* becomming the most important poster is to be thwarted!!!!  
*AND* at the same time (being a member of the "Evil Omnivore Conspiracy")
I will kill off all the Ovo-lacto's by clogging their arteries!!!!  
BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!    ;-)

Cold Vegetable Salad
--------------------
1   Cup grated radishes
1   Large cucumber, seeded and grated
3/4 Cup sour cream (you can substitute yoghurt but it isn't as creamy)
1/4 Cup mayonnaise
1/2 Tsp salt
2   Tbs Yoghurt 
1/8 Tsp pepper
1/4 Tsp paprika
1   Clove garlic, finely minced
1   Tsp lemon juice
4-5 Cups of your favorite cooked vegetables, chilled. 

Drain the radish and cucumber gratings by wrapping in a clean towel
for 1/2 hour.  Mix all the ingredients except the cooked vegies
together well and refrigerate for about 2 hours to allow the flavors
to mingle.  Serve over the cold vegies.  The low fat/calorie/immitation
 versions of mayo and sour cream are ok but not as smooth in this. 

I now repeat Patrick's brave challenge:  I dare you to post a recipe!
(well, i did paraphrase just a little bit  ;-)

P.S.  To any Vegan that has gotten this far, you probably know what
      to do to modify it to Vegan.  I've never tried it with any of the 
      soy substutute type stuff but they should work ok.  If not, then 
      just shut up and eat your carrot  ;-).  

Ted Feuerbach - Scientific Systems Consultant
Disclaimer:     Monsanto didn't say this, I did!
Stupid Quote:   Money is simply alcohol in a 
                more easily transportable form.
                                           - Me
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT)
Subject: Re: Making Vegetable Biriyani
Organization: Abo Akademi University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 14:52:55 GMT

In article <1992Nov12.095543.10923@iti.gov.sg> bharath@iti.gov.sg (Bharath Narayanan (CCL)) writes:
>Could somebody give the details of making 
>
>		VEGETABLE BIRIYANI...Indian Style and Spicy
>
>Thanks
>Regards
>Bharath Narayanan
>bharath@iti.gov.sg

Ask someone on Serangoon rd. There are tens of thousands of people of
Indian origin in your town. You must be knowing some.

I am just wondering what to say if the same query comes from 
Bombay tomorrow.

Abhay

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: molnar@Bisco.CAnet.CA (Tom Molnar)
Subject: Re: Vegan Resturants in Bay Area?
Organization: UTCS Campus Access
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 11:53:39 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.023718.27715@delfin.com> brad@delfin.com (Brad Heckman) writes:
# Forgive me if this has been asked already.
# 
# Due to a heart problem I'm limited to 5 mg cholesterol/day and <10% of
# calories from fat.
# 
# This essentially does away with cooking with dairy products and oils of
# any kind.
# 
# I assume that unless I have a special agreement with the chef, I may
# as well just forget nonvegan vegetarian establishments.

Unfortunately I have never come across any restaurant (including vegan)
that does not use significant amounts of oil in preparing their meals.
I never use oil at home and I can really taste the oil in restaurant
food.  I can't think of any way to do it other than ordering non-fat
foods like steamed rice, steamed vegetables, plain potatoes, salads
with the dressing on the side etc.  I wouldn't rely on just telling the
chef to use less oil.  You can do well in any restaurant
that offers a good selection in their salad bar, for then you can
choose plain beans along with broccoli and other low fat choices.  The
"Fresh Choice" restaurant chain offers a great salad bar.

You can buy pre-packaged salads in the supermarkets, along with fruit.
You can buy local sourdough bread (french style).  You can also buy
meal replacement bars that are low fat (like Power Bars which aren't
vegan) in health food stores.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: chips@eskimo.celestial.com (:crp:)
Subject: coconut flakes
Organization: >>> Eskimo North (206)-FOR-EVER <<<
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 03:09:47 GMT

Does anyone know where (or how) i can get UNsweetened coconut flakes?
The Bakers's flakes are just way too sweet.	Thanks.

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: 11jsutton@gallua.gallaudet.edu
Subject: Soy milk in 5-gallon boxes?
Organization: Gallaudet University
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 13:26:19 GMT

A group of vegans here at Gallaudet University recently met with
the cafeteria management to see why the soy milk promised back in
September hadn't materialized.  We were told it's because the
machines our cafeteria uses to dispense milk will accept only
five-gallon boxes of milk, and so far they've been unable to
find anywhere that sells soy milk in these five-gallon boxes.

If anyone knows where we might be able to locate soy milk our
cafeteria would be capable of serving readily, please email me.

(And no, those one-cup boxes aren't acceptable - they're much
too expensive, and rather wasteful in terms of packaging.)

Thanks,
Jennifer Sutton
11jsutto@gallua.bitnet        <---prefered address
11jsutto@gallux.gallaudet.edu
From: mlw@cisco.com (Monica Waldman)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: What is nutritional yeast?
Date: 10 Nov 1992 07:45:13 GMT
Organization: ()
NNTP-Posting-Host: lager.cisco.com

In article <1992Nov6.130635.25250@news.cs.brandeis.edu> abrams@binah.cc.brandeis.edu writes:
>In college I learned to make "Country-Fried Tofu" which involved 
>dredging the tofu in nutritional yeast.  The way I like to do it 
>now is to press the water out of the tofu, cut it into  flat
>triangular shapes, and roll each piece in nutritional yeast.   
>Then I make sure to put a couple of cloves of garlic into the oil
>before I put in the tofu.  (I press my garlic, but if you like to
>chop it, go ahead.)  Sometimes also a little curry powder in the
>oil beforehand, too.  I fry the tofu about five minutes on a side.
>You can also marinate the tofu, drain it, and then dredge it in 
>the yeast.

I marinate it in tamari w/a small amount of fresh lemon juice.  I too cut up
garlic and fry it with the tofu.

I like to sprinkle nutritional yeast on bok choy when I stir fry it.

-- 
standard disclaimer, etc. ad nauseum

"If your opponent picks up a hammer, you need to pick up a meat-ax and
cut off his arm"  -- Bill Clinton, 1981
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: lrose@titan.ucc.umass.edu (LORI H ROSENTHAL)
Subject: Recipes with Grains
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 16:08:53 GMT

I'm looking for recipes using various types of grains.  Especially interesting
new grains that I've never used like quinoa and wheatberries.  Does anyone
have any good ideas?

Thanks in advance!
-Lori
From: fawcett@unix1.cs.umass.edu (Tom Fawcett)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Conclusions about Ted Altar
Date: 13 Nov 92 22:07:16 GMT
Reply-To: fawcett@unix1.cs.umass.edu (Tom Fawcett)
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst

proberts@informix.com (Paul Roberts) writes:

> Check out soc.culture.british. It is an unwritten rule there that no-one
>uses smileys, you are supposed to be able to work out what is meant to me
>humourous and what is meant to be funny by (a) reading it, and (b) thinking
>about it.

A poor example.  Soc.culture.british shares a common culture, which facilitates
communication.  Rec.food.veg is not homogeneous in culture, nationality,
attitude, purpose, motivation or any other noun that comes to mind.
I don't think you can disambiguate humor from seriousness by thought alone -
you have to understand something about the person making the remark.

On the other hand, yes, people should think about what they read.

That's a big ten-four,
-Tom
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: howard@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Conclusions about Ted Altar
Date: 11 Nov 92 17:18:10 -0600
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

In article <1992Nov11.120026@helix.nih.gov>, susanc@helix.nih.gov (Susan Chacko) writes:
> In article <1992Nov10.070847.13173@abo.fi>, abulsari@aton.abo.fi writes:
> |> The result of last several postings is a consensus - 
> |> 
> |> So Ted, please keep posting. People like everything you post,
> |> and we all look forward to reading your postings.
> |> 
> |> We should be grateful to him for being the single most
> |> important source of informative postings on r.f.v. It is
> |> to a good extent because of him and Ferrell Wheeler and
> |> Michael Traub that people want to read this newsgroup.
> |> 
> 
> Must be nice to be so confident that you speak for "everyone". 
> It's obvious that you think Ted Altar and Michael Traub post
> wonderful information, which opinion you're welcome to, but 
> this  relentless deification of them is most irritating. You don't 
> speak for everyone, and I for one am much less likely to read 
> the ethical threads because I now expect to see yet another 
> pompous pronouncement by you about what "everyone" thinks. 
> Nor is it your business to decide who "counts" and who doesn't.
> Nor do I like being told that I "should be grateful to" anyone.  
> This is rec.food.veg, not alt.fan.anyone, and no one is the most 
> important poster here. Even the infamous "LIst of posters on 
> r.f.v", which claims to be people's descriptions of themselves, 
> contains such obvious personal perspectives such as 
> "Michael Traub: the single most important..." 
> 
> I would have preferred to ignore your post, but I get the feeling
> that you take lack of opposition as confirmation of your
> own particular views. If we could stay with recipes, discussions
> of vegetarianism, and even ethical threads, I'd be most pleased.
> 
> Susan.

I agree with Susan. My opinion of PCRM and related writers has 
gone way down upon reading these posts. It is the tone that they
are written in that I find most annoying. By the way, when Michael
Traub was actually posting here, I don't recall him ever posting anything
written by PCRM. Presenting well-researched information about the
percent of animals that are given antibiotics, the problems of the
disposal of animal waste, and the high fat content of many meats,
the increased concentration of large numbers of animals into 
buildings, and so forth,  would be a lot more convincing than these 
posts are.  These posts remind me a lot of requests for money from 
"charity" organizations, who give you some tearbreaking story about a 
child, but actually use the money they earn not on the child, but 
on "administrative costs". 

-Mary Howard
From: mkay@sequent.com (Mary Kay Petersen)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Freezing Tofu
Date: 7 Nov 92 00:56:11 GMT
Article-I.D.: sequent.1992Nov7.005611.10616
Distribution: usa
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.

pattyh@sequent.com (Patricia A. Hansen) writes:

>Hello all!

>I've been reading this group for a while now and putting some of the
>ideas I've found here to good use.  But now I have a question.  I've
>noticed that many of the recipes posted here used frozen and thawed
>tofu.  What does freezing do to tofu that makes this step part of the
>recipe?  Does is change the texture?  I'm guessing from context that
>it makes it more solid or chewy or something.  Any enlightenment is
>appreciated!

>Patty

Freezing/thawing does change the texture.  Imagine trying to grate
raw tofu.  It can actually be done after freezing/thawing!  I'm not
sure how to describe the texture; sort of sponge-like.  One tip
I'll pass on regarding freezing tofu.  It works best if you remove
the tofu from the water it is packed in then put it in a freezer
bag.  I let the tofu thaw overnight in the refrigerator.  I press
the tofu to remove as much water as possible by wrapping it in a
couple of paper towels and putting it between two plates weighted 
down with some heavy (like a canister of flour) for 1/2 hour.

Good luck!
---
  /_ _   /		sequent computer system, inc.	+-----+
 / / /  /__/ __		15450 sw koll parkway		|   # |
/ / /  / \__(_/_/_/	beaverton, or  97006-6063	|     |
mary kay petersen/	mkay@sequent.com 		+-----+
(503)578-5817 __/
Xref: sparky rec.food.veg:10119 talk.politics.animals:9401
From: spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg,talk.politics.animals
Subject: Re: AR Prisoners in need of your written support
Date: 5 Nov 1992 18:10:19 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley -- ERL
NNTP-Posting-Host: zion.berkeley.edu

(Scott Wood - EVENSONG) writes:

>spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope) writes:
>
>`The government programs to erdicate mountain lions consisted
>`of HUNTING them for a bounty.
>
>Market hunters - not sport, meat OR recreational hunters (ie the ones that I
>see being targeted by AR-head groups)
>
>`"poaching" is also a form of HUNTING.
>
>Correction.  "poaching" is a form of ILLEGAL hunting.  In that context I
>will accept the statement.

The original point being debated was whether hunters
were decimating wildlife populations.  

The point appears to be true, in that the counter-arguments
all seem to involve redefining who a "hunter" is in a
very narrow sense.

Something like:

"Legal hunters, operating only in the very recent past, in a
jurisdiction with strict laws protecting wildlife 
populations are NOT decimating wildlife populations".

This I'll go along with.  BFD.  It's basically tautological.

Steve
From: shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu (Susan R. Hagan)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: The protein myth
Date: 11 Nov 92 16:24:59 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

andrea@crispus.camb.inmet.com (Andrea Greenidge) writes:


>I am very interested in the references you make to protein and how "meat" is 
>not truely required in our diets.  However, you continually refer to meat. 
>I know that fish and poultry are also both sources of protein but do the 
>same rules stand for them as they do for beef?


I think your error is in assuming that chicken and fish are not "meat".
Poultry and fish are types of meat, as is pork, beef, mutton, venison,
alligator, etc.  Meat is a very general term.  A good rule of thumb is,
if it has a face, there is usually meat on it. :)

-- 
Susan R. Hagan (shagan@gandalf.rutgers.edu) 
Publications Coordinator - User Services
Rutgers University Computing Services
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: eerbl@cc.newcastle.edu.au
Subject: Re: Conclusions about Ted Altar
Organization: University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 22:09:12 GMT


> We  should be  grateful  to him  for being  the single  most important
> source  of informative  postings  on r.f.v.  It is to  a  good  extent
> because of him and Ferrell Wheeler and  Michael Traub that people want
> to read this newsgroup.
> 
> 
> With regards,
> 
> A. Bulsari

I hope the person who started this thread is reading this. It is such
postings that make me want to read this group. As to the recipes and other
extraneous matter, I just keep hitting the down arrow. Thats something
I've come to accept with usenet.


- Russel