HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tnixon@hayes.com
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: V.Fast - Where and how fast?
Date: 19 Aug 92 17:18:08 EDT
Distribution: world
Organization: Hayes Microcomputer Products, Norcross, GA

In article <14300@mindlink.bc.ca>, Frank@mindlink.bc.ca (Frank I.
Reiter) writes: 

> Two questions about V.Fast modems
> 1) Are there any on the market yet?

Yes and no. No, because the standard isn't even DRAFTED yet, much 
less adopted.  CCITT is still at the stage of collecting proposals 
on what the modulation scheme and other characteristics of the modem 
should be.  But "Yes", because some of the companies that are MAKING 
those proposals have started to ship modems which include their 
proposals.  These are NOT standard "V.fast" modems, but generally 
are V.32bis modems which have proprietary, non-standard, 
higher-speed modes.

> 2) How fast are they going to be?  I've read that the basic data pump will be
> 19200 bps, but I've also heard that it will be 28800.

There is consensus that the top speed will be at least 24,000 bps, 
and it may be 28,800 (with a 26,400 intermediate speed) if actual 
performance on real telephone lines with a real implementation can 
be demonstrated.

-- 
Toby Nixon, Principal Engineer      | Voice   +1-404-840-9200  Telex 401243420
Hayes Microcomputer Products, Inc.  | Fax     +1-404-447-0178  CIS   70271,404
P.O. Box 105203                     | BBS     +1-404-446-6336  AT&T    !tnixon
Atlanta, Georgia  30348             | UUCP uunet!hayes!tnixon  Fido   1:114/15
USA                                 | Internet                tnixon@hayes.com
From: eadie5295@iscsvax.uni.edu
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Intel 400
Date: 1 Sep 92 15:19:10 -0500
Organization: University of Northern Iowa

I have the Intel SatisFAXtion 400 internal modem.  
With ZModem file transfers, I can get around 1610-1650 steady throughput with
compressed files.  Does anyone know what the best configuration would be to
allow for the fastest speeds (i.e., some AT commands) or have I reached its
peak already?  In other words, are there some special secrets to get some
awesome xfer rates?
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems,news.groups
From: chip@chinacat.unicom.com (Chip Rosenthal)
Subject: should comp.dcom.modems be split?
Organization: Unicom Systems Development, Austin, TX
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 10:33:36 GMT
Followup-To: news.groups

[Followups redirected.]

Traffic on com.dcom.modems is pretty high and growing.  I'm seeing an
average of over 36 messages a day.  It gets even worse when volatile
topics come up (e.g. the infamous modem tax [sic]).  Maybe it is time
to split the group.

This is NOT a formal Usenet Request for Discussion (RFD).  If there
is some sort of consensus that this would be desirable then I will
proceed with an RFD.

I've done a quick traffic analysis of the articles currently on my
system, and tried a couple ways of breaking down the traffic.  I came
up with a three-way split which might present the most reasonable
breakdown of the traffic.

    * create comp.dcom.modems.products

	Questions, problems, discussions, advice on modem products
	and modems from specific vendors.  Also appropriate would be
	comments on modem dealers and suppliers, and general market
	survey type questions.  This is the bulk of comp.dcom.modems
	traffic.  I estimate it would hold about 65% of the current
	traffic.

    * create comp.dcom.modems.tech

	Technical discussions about data communications, especially
	communication standards, datacom engineering, etc.  This covers
	about 15% of the current traffic.  I would be expect that this
	would be a fairly low-volume newsgroup, but I would also hope
	that it is typified by informative rather than chatty messages.
	Some people I've talked to have suggested that this newsgroup
	might be moderated, and that might be a good thing to do.

    * create comp.dcom.modems.misc (replacing comp.dcom.modems)

	Discussions of related aspects of data communications, e.g.
	communication programs, communication services, etc.  And yes,
	modem taxes (sigh).  This is about 20% of the existing traffic.

If you have comments or suggestions on this idea, pro or con, please
either email them to me or post them to news.groups.  I will summarize
comments I receive, both pro and con.  (If you wish your email on this
topic to be held in confidence, please clearly indicate so in your
message.)  I will proceed to a RFD only if there is general support
for a split.

-- 
Chip Rosenthal  512-482-8260 | The secret to a long life is
Unicom Systems Development   | knowing when it's time to go.
<chip@chinacat.Unicom.COM>   |  - Michelle Shocked
From: geoff@zswamp.UUCP (Geoffrey Welsh)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: Zmodem "Resending from xxx" error -- Please help!
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 21:12:00 EDT
Organization: Izot's Swamp

smythe@cats.ucsc.edu (Brian Matthew Aljian) writes:

> I'm having a problem uploading with my new ZyXEL U-1496E modem.  During most
> uploads I get an error that says "Resending from xxx".

   Most likely cause is that you're not using hardware handshaking properly.  
Both your modem and your terminal program must be configured to use RTS/CTS 
handshaking.  Since you have an Amiga, you may have to make this change in 
Preferences, though I'd suggest that you scour your terminal program(s) first.

Geoffrey Welsh, 7 Strath Humber Court, Islington, Ontario, M9A 4C8 Canada
geoff@zswamp.uucp, [xenitec.on.ca|m2xenix.psg.com]!zswamp!geoff (416)258-8467
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: haseka@aix.rpi.edu (Atilla A Hasekioglu)
Subject: multimedia
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy NY
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1992 17:30:46 GMT

Newsgroups: comp.windows.x.apps
Subject: multimedia
Summary: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: world
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy NY
Keywords: 

I am looking for a multimedia software that compresses images and has mailing 
options. This should be in Xwindows. I have images in many formats.
I would like to be able to change their formats and have printouts. I also
would like to be able to view them. The software I am looking for should
have all these options. I also would like to have the option to decompress and
view the image from where it is sent by mail, so this will be a two sided
software that can be used both by the sender and receiver  side.
  If anybody can help me,I will very much appreciate it.
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: larry@gator.rn.com (Larry Snyder)
Subject: Re: My buddies at USR
Organization: The Gator Public Access Unix Site - 219-289-3745
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 12:19:56 GMT

bash@tware.com (Paul Bash) writes:

>At all levels of the company I've dealt with, even when they were swamped
>with Loyalty Pays, Telebit has never been less than pleasant to deal with.
>Their pricing isn't so different from USR's, their modems work well and 
>Telebit Tech Support is second to none.   

And their v.32bis throughput is about 10-15% less than what is possible
with the USR v.32bis modems.   - Hmm -- throughput or pleasant people -
too bad we can't have both :)


-- 
Larry Snyder                                    internet: larry@gator.rn.com
keeper of the Gator                                  uucp: uunet!gator!larry
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: mrapple@quack.sac.ca.us (Nick Sayer)
Subject: V.42bis effectiveness (was Re: V.42bis - on 2400 baud)
Organization: The Duck Pond public unix: +1 408 249 9630, log in as 'guest'.
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 17:39:35 GMT

I have done quite extensive benchmarking on v.32bis/v.42bis transfers.
I have a Sun 4/25 at home, and an identical one at work. The two
are interconnected via dial-on-demand PPP over v.32bis/v.42bis.
Any sort of compressed file routinely gets 1.7 kbps. An uncompressed
executable gets about 2.2 kbps. Things like /usr/dict/words get
3.1 kbps or even better on a good day. Stupid files, like big
blocks of 0s get 3.7 kbps (38400 bps seral ports).

I don't think v.42bis is probably all that helpfull for "traditional"
uses, which amount to reading text interactively or transfering
compressed files (typical BBS usage), but for IP linking, it's
great, since traditional IP services for the most part are uncompressed
(the one big exception is typical use of ftp, but smtp, nntp... all of
those are plain ASCII for the most part). And even with VJ header compression,
there are some small redundancies that v.42bis can wiggle out.

Imagine an nntp session... All of the traffic in one direction is
going to be made of the "Ok" "Thanks" or "Got it" responses (and
the "hello" and "goodbye", which occur only once). All the traffic
in the other direction is going to be "IHAVE <.*@.*>", and
ASCII messages with at least partially predictable header text.
V.42bis shouldn't have any trouble squishing all that stuff pretty
well.

-- 
Nick Sayer <mrapple@quack.sac.ca.us> | "Actors don't like to play comas.
N6QQQ @ N0ARY.#NOCAL.CA.USA.NA       | They feel it limits their range."
37 19 49 N / 121 57 36 W             | 
+1 408 249 9630, log in as 'guest'   |    -- Soapdish
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems,comp.dcom.fax
From: ray@ole.cdac.com (Ray Berry)
Subject: Supra BFT fax xfers
Organization: Cascade Design Automation, Bellevue, WA
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 17:13:34 GMT


    The Supra announcement mentioned a 'BFT' binary file transfer option.
I presume this entails transmitting binary data via the FAX modem at 14.4K
with error correction.  Can anyone confirm this?  Further, is this capability
part of a formal standard- or is it a proprietary add-on of Supra?  TIA.
-- 
Ray Berry kb7ht ray@ole.cdac.com 73407.3152@compuserve.com /* inquire within */
From: pozar@kumr.lns.com (Tim Pozar)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: V.35 interface for PC?
Date: 1 Sep 92 19:45:26 GMT
Organization: Late Night Software (San Francisco)

hope@huracan.cr (Theodore Hope) writes:
>Does anyone know who makes/sells a V.35 interface card for a PC-type machine
>(preferable accessible under DOS)?
>
>With existing public-domain router software (ka9q, pcroute) for DOS, it would
>be nice to connect V.35-compatible equipment (CSU/DSU).
>
>Thanks....
>
> -Theodore Hope

KA9Q will support a number of sync cards with V.35 interfaces.  Check out
the autoexec.nos configuration file.  Tom Jennings also did a modification
to the "Generic" sync (Zilog 8530 chip) driver to work with the Sealevel
sync cards.  I have the modes if folks want them.  

        Tim

-- 
Internet: pozar@kumr.lns.com               FidoNet:  Tim Pozar @ 1:125/555
UUCP:     ...!uunet!kumr.lns.com!pozar
Snail:    Tim Pozar / KKSF / 77 Maiden Lane / San Francisco CA 94108 / USA
Voice:    +1 415 788 2022
From: myhre@plains.NoDak.edu (Robert Myhre)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Supra Roms???
Date: 27 Aug 92 23:06:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: plains.19919
Organization: North Dakota Higher Education Computing Network


  Hi.  I would like to know how to open up a Supra 1.4k Fax/Modem external
to determine which ROM it contains.  There seem to be only two screws on the 
bottom but when I removed them nothing would come undone.  I don't know if I
need to use a little more force, but I would rather get some info before I
do that.  Thanks

Robert Myhre
Computer Engineer in Training... and Training... and Training
North Dakota State University
myhre@plains.nodak.edu   (Internet)     
myhre@plains             (Bitnet)      
uunet!plains!myhre       (UUCP)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: 16550 vs. 16550AFN
From: lchiu@animal.gcs.co.nz (Laurence Chiu)
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 21:41:02 GMT
Organization: GCS Limited, Wellington, New Zealand

In article <7926@lee.SEAS.UCLA.EDU> jong@boole.seas.ucla.edu (Jong Y. Lee) writes:
>In article <BtIDJ1.Ex2@animal.gcs.co.nz> lchiu@animal.gcs.co.nz (Laurence Chiu) writes:
>>I am not sure the Boca's do that yet. In my experience with a 386/40
>>8M running Windows 3.1 and Procomm/Win 1.0 I can get up to 1600cps
>>but if I switch away, I get overruns.  My Boca distributor tells me that
>>there are some firmware upgrades coming which will buffer data and thus
>>help to alleviate the high interrupt rate to the CPU.
>>
>>Laurence Chiu
>
>
>I was wondering..Do you still get 1600cps in windows with disk caching program 
>on such as smartdrv or ncache?  In order for me to get anything higher than
>1000cps in windows with my SupraFaxModem v.32bis, I always have to turn my
>cache off otherwise I get interrupt latency problem.  Maybe it's just
>smartdrv.exe that I'm using, but..
>
>Jongyoon
> 

Yes I do have caching on. I use the 3.1 smartdrv with 2M of cache. I turned
off write caching since I was a little worried about that. Perhaps your
drives are not fast enough? I use 17ms Seagate IDE drives (1144A and 3144A)

Laurence Chiu

Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: sam@ms.uky.edu (Mike Mills)
Subject: Re: Where *NOT* to buy your Supra
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 00:32:48 GMT
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences

MLPOWE01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU (Michael Powell) writes:


>Oh, yeah, I also DEFINATELY would not expect to sell any more of these over
>the Modem list as I plan to let them all know that you do not take returns
>and that, once they buy it, if Supra can't fix it, they're stuck....Supra
>won't take it back unless you buy it from them.

This has not been my experience.  I bought my Supra v.32bis from
BFJ Enterprises.  A couple of weeks ago it died -- lightning.  Supra took
it back no questions, and shipped it back to me blue label (they ship it
back the same way you send it.)


-- 
--Mike Mills              E-Mail:  sam@ms.uky.edu, {rutgers, uunet}!ukma!sam
--UK Math Sciences Dept.                  mike@ukpr.uky.edu    
--(606) 257-1429 (work) 263-0721 (home)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware
From: bcm5880@u.cc.utah.edu (Brad Midgley)
Subject: Ancient stuff... "gandalf 4800"
Organization: University of Utah Computer Center
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 23:05:18 GMT

A friend of mine picked up this beastly-looking modem the other day...
apparently, it may predate AT commands, but he'd like to see it working, if
only for entertainment purposes.  Could anyone who's seen one of these
things working mail me the details?

it calls itself "Gandalf LDM 414"

bcm5880@cc.utah.edu
-- 
X-Mn-Key: slip

bcm5880@u.cc.utah.edu
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: Modems, compression, and SLIP or PPP (was Re: Using Telebit PEP with SLIP)
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 00:45:02 GMT
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology

In article <1992Aug23.203750.22670@terminator.cc.umich.edu> honey@citi.umich.edu writes:
>i fail to see the point in having the link layer drop the packet. 
>even if it gets past the ip header check, the transport layer will
>surely drop it.  the ppp checksum is entirely redundant, wasteful.

"Surely"?  Peter, TCP or UDP has only a 16-bit checksum, which has one
chance in 65536 of being okay on random garbage.  Modem errors don't
produce random garbage, of course, but they are a lot more creative than
they used to be.  When many bits are being transmitted simultaneously,
many-bit errors are just as easy as one-bit errors used to be.  The TCP
(et al) checksum is intended as a last-ditch defence against errors that
get past lower layers, not as an impenetrable shield.  (Indeed, some of
the RFCs on related issues imply that higher levels really ought not to
depend on the checksum being 100% impenetrable... but most do.)  It
functions well as a last backup, but only if the underlying layers are
reasonably reliable to begin with.  If the hardware isn't good enough,
you need either a better TCP checksum/CRC or some sort of link-layer
error detection.  The latter is easier to fit in, and also lets you
throw the packet away as soon as it is corrupted, rather than making
you carry it to the receiving end (which might entail several more
hops, perhaps over low-speed links, for a packet that is probably
useless to the recipient).
-- 
There is nothing wrong with making      | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
mistakes, but... make *new* ones. -D.Sim|  henry@zoo.toronto.edu  utzoo!henry
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: moy@cae.wisc.edu (Howard Moy)
Subject: HELP: using v.42bis to call v.32/bis modem
Organization: College of Engineering, Univ. of Wisconsin--Madison
Distribution: usa
Date: 4 Sep 92 15:59:12 CDT


Hi,

This is probably a easy problem that's been through before.  But,
I have a v.42bis (Practical Peripherals 2400SA v.42bis [w/ MNP]) and trying
to call up on 9600 baud.  My friend made a cahnge (like a &Q6) or something
to make it work correctly, but I accidentally reset my profiles.  Now he
and I can't remember what we did.

Everytime I call (where they have a v.32 v.32bis), the other end answers
and they start handshaking (I guess), but my carrier detect light does
not light.  All the others I think are fine.  After a few seconds,
the other end hangs up on me and I get the message of "NO CARRIER."
All my data/stop/etc bits are set correctly.

I can call up fine if I only restrict myself to 2400 baud.

Does anyone know what to do?  I tried calling their tech support and they said
they'd get back to me in a week.  Any help will be appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Howard
moy@cae.wisc.edu

P.S.	Please e-mail me if possible.
From: jeffo@uiuc.edu (J.B. Nicholson-Owens)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: What's a good 14400 modem??
Date: 29 Aug 92 21:07:11 GMT
Reply-To: jeffo@uiuc.edu (J.B. Nicholson-Owens)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

Wolfgang Henke writes
> I have reports that the Zoom connects well with Multitech modems, even
> the Multitech 14,400. I am not so sure about Zoom<->Telebit connections?
> Any reports?

I don't know about that, but the Zoom modems do connect well to USR  
v.32bis modems.
--
-- Jeff (jeffo@uiuc.edu)
-- no NeXTmail please
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: tls@panix.com (Thor Lancelot Simon)
Subject: Re: Word of Advice
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 19:48:48 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix & Internet, NYC

In article <1992Aug26.063904.8574@samba.oit.unc.edu> Denny.Chuang@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Denny Chuang) writes:
>      University of Louisville
>Phone: (502)588-6744
>
>DO NOT BUY A SUPRA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>Resist the temptation and buy something worth your money...not a $350 (or
>whatever the price) paper weight.  I've gone through three and number three
>will probably go out this afternoon...none have worked.  Instead of seeing
>some LD savings (over 2400 baud), I've paid lots more to send this damn thing
>back and forth between here and Oregon....it isn't worth the stress.
[...]
>	I suggest for those people who don't like to live with with any
>	minor problems with their modem not to purchase any cheap priced
>	modems.  Hey, if you perfer to save a few bucks and don't mind
>	those little bugs in it go for it.  It's not bad at all!
> 
>       	 	  Seriously, all modems comes with 5 years or more
>	warranty, if you have time to wait for them to get those bugs out of
>	their ROMS someday you will get a perfect working modem. 
>	That's what those warranties are there for.	Right?

Wrong.  If the problem is something along the lines of cheap parts in the
analog side of the box or perhaps (which I believe explains the horrid 'ping'
latency test results of the Digicom Scout+, and probably applies to some of the
el-cheapo Rockwell chipset modems, as well) a tremendously underpowered
microcontroller as a CPU, 5 years of revisions to the EPROMS will do nothing
at all.  There's a 68030 in my Telebit, so I'm quite happy (though I don't
really quite understand why _that_ much horsepower is needed to run the v.32bis
side, yet Telebit say v.32bis is impossible on the slower T1600 platform, though
I believe ZyXeL et. al do it just fine on similar hardware.  Opinions anyone?)
-- 
Thor Lancelot Simon	 tls@panix.COM
  "Oh, you have wounded me!  I have very few prejudices, actually.  The
biggest problem is that I am intolerant of fools.  That is why I have
such a low tolerance level for Libertarians."  -- Jim McMaster
From: geoff@zswamp.UUCP (Geoffrey Welsh)
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
Subject: Re: 16550 vs. 16550AFN 
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 22:16:19 EDT
Organization: Izot's Swamp

eputnam@vax1.umkc.edu writes:

> I was just wondering if any modem manufactures (or anyone) would still be
> putting 16550 chips on their internal modems.  The reason I ask this is that
> I am planning on purchasing an internal 14.4kbs modem and plan to use it with
> both OS/2 2.0 and Windows 3.1.  As I understand, the 16550 is defective and
> the chip to have is the 16550AFN.  Is this correct?  If so, do I need to make
> absolutely sure that I am getting an "AFN" chip, or am I safe with any modem
> which claims to have a 16550?

   My understanding is that there was a bug in the NS16550, hence the 16550A.  
The "F" seems to have been added after some improvements to the chip or the 
mask, though apparently not any bug fix.  The "N" means that the chip is in a 
40 pin DIP package, whereas a "V" would indicate a 64-pin square carrier.

   When a company says "16550", you have no idea whether it's an NS16550A.  
However, it's less likely an NS16550-non-A than some other manufacturer's 
16550 clone.  There are problems with Western Digital's 16550 at low speeds 
(under 2400 bps), and I've been downright unable to get MX 16550s to work 
for me.  Then again, I had some trouble with National's PC16550 batch.

Geoffrey Welsh, 7 Strath Humber Court, Islington, Ontario, M9A 4C8 Canada
geoff@zswamp.uucp, [xenitec.on.ca|m2xenix.psg.com]!zswamp!geoff (416)258-8467
"Feel for the winter but don't have a cold heart" - Little River Band, "Lady"
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: jpr@jpradley.jpr.com (Jean-Pierre Radley)
Subject: Re: Pricing on Telebit modems
Organization: Unix in NYC
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 1992 02:25:37 GMT

In article <115.23480@incc.com> jerry@incc.com (Jerry Rocteur) writes:
> Does anyone know of any company who sells mail order Worldblazer
> modems, or anyone I could contact via Email for info.

UUNET sells Telebits. Big full page ad in the latest Open Systems Today
gives the address: modems@uunet.uu.net
-- 
Jean-Pierre Radley   Unix in NYC   jpr@jpr.com   jpradley!jpr   CIS: 72160,1341
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: hpverwei@cs.ruu.nl (Dick Verweij)
Subject: Help wanted with FAXIT for windows
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 10:52:07 GMT
Organization: Utrecht University, Dept. of Computer Science
Keywords: fax,modem,windows,faxir


Recently my brother in law purchased a FAX/MODEM card. (Faxit for windows)
He installed it, and after a few difficulties : a conflict with the mouse(COM1) with the card (COM2) , 
he could run it from windows, by assigning it to COM4.
BUT... it still does not work in windows, the only thing that works is the modem software "QuickLink II".
And when a Fax is about to be transmitted, windows crashes.  

System: 386DX 25Mhz Windows 3.1 Enhanced Mode
Mouse on COM1:


Could someone who also owns such a modem tell what he did wrong???

-- 
DICK H.P. VERWEIJ

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------- D:-) I:-) C:-) K:-) email : hpverwei@cs.ruu.nl 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems
From: maarten@fwi.uva.nl (Maarten Carels)
Subject: Re: Supra FAX bug! (?)
Organization: FWI, University of Amsterdam
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 07:46:59 GMT

s37756d@puukko.hut.fi (Casper Gripenberg) writes:
>In article <1992Aug27.130331.22363@titan.tsd.arlut.utexas.edu> lofaso@tsd.arlut.utexas.edu (Bernie Lofaso) writes:
>>maarten@fwi.uva.nl (Maarten Carels) writes:
>>>Possibly this is a problem of the 'other' modem.
>>>Scenario:
... deleted ...
>>
>>Yep, I disabled escape entirely (T3000's will let you do that) and the
>>problem no longer exists. Thanks.

>Yes, worked for me too, now why didn't I think of THAT? :)
Well, sometimes it is difficult to see the obvious.
Think it's better not to say how long it took me to see it...

--maarten
-- 
In real life:	Maarten Carels
		Computer Science Department
		University of Amsterdam
email:		maarten@fwi.uva.nl
Newsgroups: comp.dcom.modems,comp.unix.sysv386,comp.protocols.misc