HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: brekshyn@shearson.com (Bohdan Rekshynskyj)
Subject: Re:      Ukraine
Reply-To: brekshyn@shearson.com
Organization: Ordinatio
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 17:05:08 GMT

Greetings!


In article 92122717475678@VM1.NODAK.EDU,         RIGAUT@FRURBB51.BITNET () writes:
>Following Benjamin Okner's <okner@socrates.umd.edu> mail about UKRAINE
>(any information about directories, etc.), I would be interested myself in any
>info about phone/address directories for Kiev. As I imagine that other people
>on the net might be interested as well, please send to All any idea that anyone
>might have about any directories, e_mail addresses for info, etc., about any
For email address send the mail message "GET E-EUROPE INTRO E-EUROPE"
to "E-EUROPE@NCSUVM.CC.NCSU.EDU".
There's a wealth of info, including email address for Russia and Eastern Europe
(of which Ukraine is a part).

Also, there's a "listserver" which one can subscribe to on Ukraine by sending
"SUBSCRIBE UKRAINE firstname lastname"
to
"UKRAINE%INDYCMS.BITNET@pucc.princeton.edu"



>place in Ukraine. And, while we're at it, same query for other ex-USSR
>countries !  (BTW, has anyone managed to communicate by e_mail about
>genealogy with someone from these countries ??)

Barely, it's difficult.



>
>Thanks in advance,
>And a Happy New Year to all !
>With many thanks to all these nice people who made the net so lively and so
>interesting,
>and with warm personal thanks to all those kind Rooters who contributed help in
>my own research.
>
>Jean Paul Rigaut          University of Paris 7, France
>rigaut@frurbb51
>For 1993, in addition to my RIVINAC / USA queries (you know, the RIVINAC organ
>building company in "Benton, USA" in early 20th C, still not found..., among
>other problems), I'd like to find whether there are any living descendants
>from my RIGAUT, VALENTINI and WHITELOCK family in St. Petersburg (Russia),
>Kiev (Ukraine) and Taschkent (Uzbekhistan); and any descendants from my BASSE

It's going to be called Kyiv (Kiyyiv).



>family (originally from Koenigsberg)...
>Good luck to all for your own searches !
>----------------------------------------



					Regards,

					Bohdan













=====================================================================
 
Bohdan Peter Rekshynskyj
 
Consultant                     
 
Compuserve:  72576.1754@compuserve.com


                              
All promulgations are my own.  No corporate entity has authorization
to represent me.
 
Imprimatur.						Nihil obstat.
 
=====================================================================


Newsgroups: soc.roots
From: lawson@acuson.com (Drew Lawson)
Subject: IGI (Re: another question)
Keywords: bavaria ansbach
Reply-To: lawson@acuson.com (Drew Lawson)
Organization: ACUSON, Mountain View, CA
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 20:58:38 GMT

In article <1992Dec23.065432.13281@compu.com> fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home) writes:

>The LDS lists the available records that they have in their library which are 
>apparently microfilmed and entered into the IGI. 
>
>Or am I wrong in that they store stuff which they've not keyed into their 
>massive database?


You are correct that there is a lot more information on microfilm than
there is in the IGI.

The primary purpose of the IGI (despite the name) is to catalog LDS
ordinance information.  The ordinance information is stored with the
event which justified it.  These ordinances are
  baptism
  endowment (a kind of consecration, essentially)
  sealing child to parents
  sealing husband to wife

All but the last are contingent on simply existing.  A birth or
christening record will justify performing these.  The last requires a
marriage record.

This is also why you will never find death events in the IGI.  They are
not significant.  The extraction programs simply work on records old
enough to assume everyone is dead.  I believe the current criteria for
submissions is 110 years from birth.
    [The preceding is personal impression and fuzzy memory.  I am not
     involved with the extraction program.]

As such, you might find a marriage entry and get a date and location
from it, but the original church register showed the participants ages,
location of birth and names of parents.

The IGI is very valuable, but it is nearly impossible to positively
identify anyone from it.  But you can come close, then examine the
source and narrow down the possibilities.

-- 
Drew Lawson                      If you're not part of the solution,
lawson@acuson.com                you're part of the precipitate
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  TOGENIELIST
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Date:         Mon, 21 Dec 1992 18:51:00 MST
Reply-To:     MCBRAYER@SMC.BITNET
From:         MCBRAYER@SMC.BITNET
Subject:      On the light side....Merry Christmas!

Better late than never.......

'Twas the day before Christmas, and still as a mouse,
When I climbed up the steps to the County Courthouse.
The records were all nestled so snug in their bed,
While visions of ancestors danced in my head.
I said not a word but went straight to my task,
Now where were those records?  Whom could I ask?
I heard a slight noise and turned with a jerk,
And came face to face with the County Court Clerk.
He had a round face and a ring full of keys,
He smiled just a bit which put me at ease.
When I asked for some records I showed all my teeth,
And my halo encircled my head like a wreath.
He showed me the marriages, will books and deeds,
Birth records and deaths, Now they'd fill my needs.
Then laying my pencil alongside my nose,
I slipped off my shoes and wiggled my toes.
My hand and my clothes were all covered with dust,
(When searching old records such things are a must).
I gave a great sigh as I closed up one book
And picked up another "I'll just take a look".
Some answers I found; Some I did not,
Somthing found when you've NOTHING is still quite a lot.
The search is not over - Not by any means,
I'm sure I'm related to some Kings and some Queens.
As I worked the clerk said, "You've just five minutes more.",
So I closed up my notebook and hit the front door.
I heard him exclaim as I went out of sight,
Happy hunting to you nuts and we're closed for the night.


James Earl McBrayer, "In Defiance - The McBrayer Family Newletter", 1 Dec 1979.
Used without permission (but I'm sure my cuz wouldn't mind).





Enjoy!   and Happy Holidays!!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill McBrayer                           MCBRAYER@SMC.BITNET
South Mountain Community College        MCBRAYER@SMC.MARICOPA.EDU
Phoenix, Arizona

Lookin' fer MCBRAYER (aka McBrair, Macbrair, McBrier, MacBryre, Mackbrie,
   Mackbray, etc.   Also, BRIER).    Dumfrieshire, Scotland;  South-Central
   Pennsylvania, Eastern North Carolina, Kentucky, Georgia, Alabama, et al.
From: jrs@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (John Spencer)
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 22:02:58 GMT
Subject: Pretty Printing GEDCOM data
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: soc.roots

Can someone point me to a program that will print a human readable output of
of a GEDCOM file in a logical order?  I am using the Family Origins program
and it does not allow printing of all the data and notes for a descendant
tree.  It only prints this information one family at a time.  I read in some
note about a gcom program, but I don't know where to find it.

Thanks,


John R. Spencer  (jrs@fc.HP.COM, (303) 229-3271)
Newsgroups: soc.roots
From: kathleen@casbs.Stanford.EDU (Kathleen Much)
Subject: Re: New GENEALOG files: Royalty GEDCOM
Organization: Center for Advanced Study in the Behavioral Sciences
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 01:09:29 GMT

In article <1992Dec29.164654.11610@midway.uchicago.edu> elle@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>Cerdic, King of Wessex, who died in 534, is the earliest individual
>with a definite date -- but twenty-four generations of his paternal
>line are listed before him, which would take us back before the Common
>Era; I was under the impression that no European line, even a royal
>one, could be taken that far. 
>
>Anyone else have an opinion on these very early claims?

The West Saxon genealogy appears in several versions in the
Anglo-Saxon Chronicle.  The earliest copy of the ASC was written
several hundred years after Cerdic, but the Saxons were very careful
to preserve their royal genealogies by oral transmission, so at least
some of the line may be accurate before then.  Not the part going back
to Noah, though!  The Christians got hold of the pagan genealogies and
doctored them up to make them fit with the bible "begats", and the
pagans before them had stuck in their own gods to legitimate the royal
ancestry.  I'd hazard a guess that the record is reasonably correct
for several generations before Cerdic, but I wouldn't want to bet
money on it.

-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Kathleen Much, Editor		|E-mail: kathleen@casbs.stanford.EDU
CASBS, 202 Junipero Serra Blvd.	|Phone: (415) 321-2052
Stanford, CA  94305		|Fax: (415) 321-1192
From: fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home)
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Subject: Re: Elements of the perfect genealogical software
Date: 31 Dec 92 18:52:45 GMT
Organization: CompuData Inc.

bright@sctc.com (David A. Bright) writes:

>ttw@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (thomas.t.wetmore..iv) writes:

>>Here is an interesting example of how these two kinds of information
>>can get mixed up.  Take a typical IGI GEDCOM file from the LDS.  These
>                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>I'd like to, but so far I haven't figured out how to get these things.
>I'm sure this is a FAQ, but can someone enlighten me on how to get a
>copy of these records?

Basically you need to visit an LDS FHC (a Latter Day Saints Family History 
Center) and get access to their CD-ROM system. Once you get into the IGI 
software it pretty much tells you how to export data to floppies you may have 
brought with you or can purchase there. 

I just figured this out myself recently. The biggest problem is getting 
machine time. Here in the Cherry Hill Center one signs in for a 1/2 hour shot. 
People tend to get there as the doors open just to get their names in line. 
One might have to wait three hours to get 1/2. The extract mode is time 
consuming as ROM disks are not exactly the fastest thing in the world.

Bottom line is that the software is fairly self-explanaitory. I just forgot 
about reading the on-screen directions which tell you to press F9 if you want 
the source information as to how to get more info on the indexed event one has 
just found. Remember, these are only indexes to real information available on 
Microfilm in Utah.

fred 


-- 
W. Fred Rump 	office:	   fred@COMPU.COM     'mans feet have grown/so big 
26 Warren St.   home: fred@icdi10.compu.com  that he/forgets his littleness'
Beverly, NJ. 08010                          		Don Marquis 
609-386-6846    bang:uunet!cdin-1!icdi10!fr   
Newsgroups: soc.roots
From: bright@sctc.com (David A. Bright)
Subject: Re: Elements of the perfect genealogical software
Organization: SCTC
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 17:59:14 GMT

ttw@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (thomas.t.wetmore..iv) writes:

>Here is an interesting example of how these two kinds of information
>can get mixed up.  Take a typical IGI GEDCOM file from the LDS.  These
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I'd like to, but so far I haven't figured out how to get these things.
I'm sure this is a FAQ, but can someone enlighten me on how to get a
copy of these records?
-- 
David A. Bright			dab@Bright.MN.ORG	(home)
Secure Computing		bright@SCTC.COM		(work)
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
From: tmarvan@sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Thomas Marvan)
Newsgroups: soc.roots,soc.culture.czecho-slovak
Subject: Re: Anglisizing Czech Names, Question
Date: 1 Jan 93 02:50:39 GMT
Followup-To: soc.roots
Organization: University of California, San Diego

In article <1992Dec31.110924.1@cgsvax.claremont.edu> berkovej@cgsvax.claremont.edu writes:
>I understand that there is no accepted Anglisized name for Vaclav.  Is this
>true?  My father's birth certificate shows his name as Vaclav but he was James
>for his whole life.  Is this a common Anglisized name for Vaclav?
>
>My Grandfather's English name was John.  I have heard that both Jan and Honza
>are anglisized to John.  Is this true?


I'm not sure of Vaclav, but I know one Czech whose original name is
Honza, and another whose is Jan, and their English-speaking friends
call them John.


It would be interesting to start making up a list of Anglisized
names...

My name at birth was Tomas, and is easily enough translated to
Thomas or Tom.  My middle name at birth was Jiri, but since my
naturalization was changed to George.


So, we've got...


Jan    =   John
Honza  =   John 
Tomas  =   Thomas
Jiri   =   George


There are many more, of course, but I'll allow others, especially
those whose own names have been changed, to offer their
contributions....



*******************************************************************
*  Thomas (Tom) Marvan         Phone: (619) 450 3670              *
*  Dept. of Political Science, E-Mail: tmarvan@sdcc3.ucsd.edu     *
*  University of California,   Snail Mail: 9450 Gilman Dr.,       *
*  San Diego,  USA.            #92092-0644, La Jolla, CA, 92092.  *
*******************************************************************

"Two men say they're jesus, one of them must be wrong," M. Knopfler


Newsgroups: soc.roots
From: lawson@acuson.com (Drew Lawson)
Subject: Re: Parents, Spouses, children
Reply-To: lawson@aldia.UUCP (Drew Lawson)
Organization: ACUSON, Mountain View, CA
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 21:35:46 GMT

In article <ROOTS-L%92122312433175@VM1.NODAK.EDU> George Waller <HBLADM47@UCONNVM.BITNET> writes:

>Color me dumb, but what is the software which Tom produces?

That would be LifeLines, a Sun UNIX based system which he provides
freely.  There is a LINES-L mailing list for discussing its problems
and merits.


-- 
Drew Lawson                      If you're not part of the solution,
lawson@acuson.com                you're part of the precipitate
From: lawrence2@llnl.gov (Dennis Lawrence)
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Subject: Need Research, Cheshire Co, NH
Date: 28 Dec 92 23:41:12 GMT

I wish to have some county and town records searched in Cheshire County,
New Hampshire. I am willing to pay for this. If anyone has had experience
with paid searching in this part of the country, I will appreciate
recommendations (or warnings). Please respond to me via E-mail, to keep
net traffic low and preserve privacy of your comments.

Thanks.
From: fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home)
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Subject: Re: (no subject given)
Date: 28 Dec 92 18:48:20 GMT
Organization: CompuData Inc.

dklein@TENET.EDU (Debbie Lynn Klein) writes:

[skip]
>ski trip to Utah and a visit to the LDS library. We wrote to Germany and
>got his birth certificate and those of his mother and father.
[skip]
>but we would now like to know about his mother's family.  We
>have the names on her birth certificate but now what do we do? We would
>also like to know if she had any brothers or sisters? Any suggestions?

First of all you already know where his mother was born from the birth 
certificate. She also should have her parents listed. Where was all this? If 
the birth record is from a small town, find out what religion they were and 
check on the local church and get a copy of the baptismal certificate from 
there. They might have an index in the back of the yearly books and you (or 
they) can check for more baptisms under the same last name. Make sure the 
parents are the same and you find all the siblings.

You could also try a Latter Day Saints (LDS) library near you. Check in their 
IGI cd-rom files for any Kleins from whereever they are from. Etc etc etc

It's a process you don't do in a few moments. It may take years to assemble 
all available information and the more you find the more you find out you 
need. Have fun in the process.



>We are planning a trip to Germany in the spring (the first in 20 years for
>my husband) and thought we might find some graves that might help. Is
>there any way to find out where someone is buried? Are their cemetaries
>usually near their churches in samll towns? Any and all help would be
>appreciated. debbie

Most German cemeteries are of a temporary nature. Space usually limits an 
active grave site to about 30 years. Older cemeteries are closed and made into 
parks or whatever. It is not like here as a cemetery is either well maintained 
or it is closed and levelled. Any heirs may opt to have their stones removed 
to a new cemetery but by that time, like 3 or 4 generations later, folks are 
typically no longer interested or scattered. Church records will always be you 
best bet, but not cemeteries.

fred

-- 
W. Fred Rump 	office:	   fred@COMPU.COM     'mans feet have grown/so big 
26 Warren St.   home: fred@icdi10.compu.com  that he/forgets his littleness'
Beverly, NJ. 08010                          		Don Marquis 
609-386-6846    bang:uunet!cdin-1!icdi10!fr
From: fr@compu.com (Fred Rump from home)
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Subject: Re: Parents, Spouses, Children (was: Re: PAF tricks)
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:59:12 GMT
Organization: CompuData Inc.

Carol Botteron <botteron@BU-IT.BU.EDU> writes:

>(a lighter note for the holidays)

>Good point, Fred.  I'd say it's a bit more than that -- genealogy has
>made history and other cultures more real to me, for example -- but we
>shouldn't forget that it's supposed to be fun.

That's what I mean by fun. I recently read the bio of Catherine the Great and 
the book touched on many aspects of people in my past. Knowledge of history 
makes genealogy come alive as in a set of windows that open up, one after the 
other. The revelations and conjured images are what drives me on. I'm just 
dying to find out more about that Prussian Jaeger from Ansbach and what he was 
about. I need to find a picture of the uniform he wore. It would fill the rest 
of that image of this tall guy on horseback as if traveling back in time.

Fred


-- 
W. Fred Rump 	office:	   fred@COMPU.COM     'mans feet have grown/so big 
26 Warren St.   home: fred@icdi10.compu.com  that he/forgets his littleness'
Beverly, NJ. 08010                          		Don Marquis 
609-386-6846    bang:uunet!cdin-1!icdi10!fr   
Newsgroups: soc.roots
From: lincoln@rand.org (Tom Lincoln)
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Subject: Re: VIRGINIA FAMILIES
Date: 23 Dec 92 14:05:21 GMT
Organization: RAND

In article <01GSM8L0X3IE8Y5ELB@gallua.bitnet> RJARNOLD@GALLUA.BITNET writes:
>I am also seeking the information on PEMBERTON in Virginia.  My gggg
>grandfather, Stephen Pemberton was born in Virginia sometime in 1775 and
>died in Missouri in 1849.  He married to Sally Rutherford who also was
>born in Virginia in 1767 and also died in Missouri in 1842.
>
You should be aware of the Virginia Historical Index (in Two Volumes)
by E. G. Swem, Librarian of the College of William and Mary, Roanoke Va,
Stone Printing 1934. This is an extensively indexed genealogical reference
by both first and last name, listing books and journal articles.

If you find a in your genealogical travels a Judith Pemberton, daughter of
Elizabeth (Warren) Brooks of "Opekon", who married secondly Henry Lloyd
in 1759-1763 in Berkeley Co. VA, I need all the help I can get!

Good Searching!

Tom
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Via: uk.ac.sheffield-hallam; Thu, 24 Dec 1992 09:21:15 +0000
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Date:         Thu, 24 Dec 1992 09:15:00 LCL
Reply-To:     M.Fitzgibbons@SHEFFIELD-HALLAM.AC.UK
From:         MFITZGIB <M.Fitzgibbons@SHEFFIELD-HALLAM.AC.UK>
Subject:      Re: Any Brits out there?
Comments: To: roots-l <ROOTS-L@VM1.NoDak.edu>

Re the phone... it's done!

.Mike Fitzgibbons. Principal Technical Officer
 Sheffield Hallam University

+------------------------------------------------------------------------+

  Janet.............. M.Fitzgibbons@uk.ac.shu
   Internet........... M.Fitzgibbons@sheffield-hallam.ac.uk
   X400...... /I=M/S=Fitzgibbons/O=sheffield-hallam/PRMD=UK.AC/ADMD=
/C=GB/
   Bitnet.............. M.Fitzgibbons%uk.ac.shu@ukacrl
   Arpa................ M.Fitzgibbons%uk.ac.shu@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk
  Telex...............54680 SHPOLY G
  Compuserve INTERNET:MFITZGIB@SCIPIO.MHS.COMPUSERVE.COM
  Uunet ............. SHEFFIELD-HALLAM.AC.UK!M.Fitzgibbons@uunet.UU.NET
  Ham ............... G8VHB@GB7WRG.GBR.EU
  Tel................... Number    0742 - 533123
   Fax................. Number    0742 - 533161

+------------------------------------------------------------------------+

never try to teach a pig to sing, it wastes your time and annoys the pig!

+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Mailer: Elm [revision: 64.9]
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Date:         Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:06:18 EST
Reply-To:     Brian Abernathy <cba@EWS001.ATL.HP.COM>
From:         Brian Abernathy <cba@EWS001.ATL.HP.COM>
Subject:      Requesting information on Murphy
Comments: To: ROOTS-L@VM1.NoDak.EDU

I am posting this request for a friend.  She would like to get information
on her family, Murphy.  She knows that the name is relatively common, but
said that her branch comes from the Dublin area of Ireland.

Anyone have any research information on Murphy?



                                        Brian Abernathy
                                        Hewlett-Packard Company
                                        Atlanta Response Center
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
X-Vmsmail-To: SMTP%"roots-l@vm1.nodak.edu"
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Date:         Mon, 28 Dec 1992 11:33:22 -0500
Reply-To:     "PAUL BODURTHA, HARTWICK COLLEGE, ONEONTA,
              NY" <BODURTHAP@HARTWICK.EDU>
From:         "PAUL BODURTHA, HARTWICK COLLEGE, ONEONTA,
              NY" <BODURTHAP@HARTWICK.EDU>
Subject:      libraries
Comments: To: roots-l@vm1.nodak.edu

>>Every MELVYL reference here on ROOTS-L seems like a taunt:....<<<

If one needs to discover what's likely to be available on a given subject,
say Chambers' genealogy, check in at MELVYL.  That MELVYL can not deliver
the specific volumes via INTERNET, or that one may not even be able to obtain
the items from MELVYL's libraries via ILL is no great matter.  Usually one
has a little, or a lot of, bibilographic information that one did not have
prior to MELVYL.  Try a half dozen local libraries....bigger the better.
Try ILL (for sources other than those in CA).   Try "Books In Print."
Try "Genealogical Books in Print."  Try Bookstore catalogs.  Try University
Microforms, Inc.  Stick with it....may be weeks, months, years, but one does
get the stuff....or, disocver what library to visit.
Newsgroups: soc.roots