HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ken@aiai.ed.ac.uk (Ken Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Operating cost of a car (was: More on Metrolink (L.A.))
Date: 16 Oct 92 13:02:31 GMT
Followup-To: rec.railroad
Organization: Bugs-R-Us


In article <1992Oct15.121050.25877@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>
ggg9y@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Garth G.  Groff) writes:

#  $16 might not seem so outrageous if you consider the cost of gasoline,
#  car amortisitation, parking, etc.  A few years ago I saw an article that
#  said the real cost of operating a car was about .50 per mile. 

The Automobile Association (UK) says a car costs the average family
3,500 pounds per year.  If you travelled 8,000 miles (12,800 km) a year,
that would be 44p a mile (27p/km). 

-- Ken Johnson


-- 
//// Advice to dieters:         ////  Ken Johnson, A I Applications Institute
////   Never eat more than      ////       80 South Bridge, EDINBURGH EH1 1HN
////   you can carry.           ////                 E-mail ken@aiai.ed.ac.uk
////              -- Miss Piggy ////     phone 031-650 2756  fax 031-650 6513
From: 737ochs@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Amtrak train 364 today
Date: 13 Oct 92 12:49:30 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

I know this is along shot, but is there anyone in Michigan or Canada that
is gonna see Amtrak/Via International, train 364?
It just went by me in Kalamazoo (12:30 pm, Oct 13) and had some kind of
pointy-car on the rear. All I can see is the tops of the cars from my dorm
room, so I couldn't tell what it was. It kinda looked like it could have
been one of those oval end observation, but I couldn't really tell for sure.
Thanks,
Fred Ochs
737ochs@gw.wmich.edu
ochs@sol.cs.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: andradee@woods.ulowell.edu
Subject: Who was this tender from?
Organization: University of Lowell
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 14:31:40 GMT

	I know that we have a number of people out there that are good at 
identifing equipment. Well, here is a little twist on that. Yesterday, as I
was leaving school to go home, I saw something in the Lowell National Historic
parks maintience facility that interesed me. It was an old steam engine 
tender. I know that much. What I would like to know is who it was from.
The lettering is well fadded, but I was able to make out some of it. The name
was  ______ (no idea how many letters before?) FICHER CO.
	I would take a guess that it would not hold much more than about 
20 tons of coal, and a proportional amount of water. A crude ASCII drawing
follows if that helps any.

                               /|
                             /  |
                           /    |
                         /      |
                       /        ------------------------------------
		     /     ----/                                   |
		   /      |  /                                     |
		 /     ----/	                                   |
		|     |  /	                                   |
		|  ----/                                           |
                | |  /                                             |
                 | /                                               |
                 |                                                 |
                 ---------------------------------------------------


The trucks were missing so I have no idea what they were. If you know what 
company this was lettered for, and if you know the type of engine this was
from, or What would the Lowell National Historic parks maintience would want
with this, it would ba appreicated.

Ed Andrade

Disclaimer: I have won the national spelling bee contest.  NOT. :)
From: jadams@vixen.uucp (22475-adams)
Subject: Re: Diesel vs. Electric Locomotive Maintenance
Organization: Bellcore, Livingston, NJ
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 13:00:45 GMT
Summary: Who killed the GG-1s?

In article <1992Oct14.121947.2558@erenj.com>, bdboyle@erenj.com (Bryan D. Boyle) writes:
> In article <Bw0rEz.30F@access.digex.com> terryfry@access.digex.com (Terry Fry) writes:
> 
> >>   (stuff deleted re: GG1 design and electrical config....)
> >
> >It was a moot point, the other poster was also correct, main chassis
> >deterioration was to the point of no return, and after 40-50 years of
> >running, I think that they made their money's worth.
> >
> 
> It wasn't so much metal fatigue on the frames, as crystalization of the cast iron 
> from age and vibration.  

I had heard (from a colleague at work) that the final death knell was the
environmentally dangerous effect of disposing of the transformer oil in the GG1s
which was laced with carcenogenic PCBs.  Can anyone corroborate or refute this?

Jack (John) Adams		| Bellcore NVC 2Z-220
(908) 758-5372 {Voice}		| (908) 758-4389 {Facsimile}
jadams@vixen.bellcore.com	| kahuna@attmail.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
         -- If it's a good idea, go ahead and do it.  It's much easier to 
	 apologize than it is to get permission. -- Grace Murray Hopper (1906-1992). 
From: bill@hpcndaw.CND.HP.COM (Bill Kepner)
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 13:47:22 GMT
Subject: Re: Notes from recent transcontinental vacation
Organization: HP Network and System Management Division
Newsgroups: rec.railroad

/ hpcndaw:rec.railroad / elw4@po.CWRU.Edu (Evan L. Werkema) /  9:31 am  Oct  3, 1992 /


>>There were a number of BN SDP-35s (or SDP-40s, I'm not sure) around
>>Denver on 9/7.  Based there?

>  Those are former Great Northern SDP40's.  BN usually keeps about three on
>hand in Denver and uses them, along with SD9's, on the "beer train" out to the
>Coors brewery in Golden.  I saw one SDP40, 6397, at Denver last August, along 
>with a few of the not-dead-yet SD9's.
-- 

An update:  recently BN started running 3 trains a day out to Golden, and 
with slightly shorter trains, only 2 SDP-40's are needed.  So the 3rd unit
is in helper service (on coal trains south to Palmer Lake).  When an SD9 is
on a beer train, it is usually for the "Golden Switcher", and gets left 
behind at the BN yard there.

They've been in Denver for at least the last 5 years and I've never seen them
on mainline trains.

Bill Kepner
From: jwj2@po.CWRU.Edu (Jermaster)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Diesel vs. Electric Locomotive Maintenance
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 19:49:26 GMT
Organization: Eastern & Ohio Railroad Company
NNTP-Posting-Host: b63154.student.cwru.edu

In article <1992Oct15.170505.2398@athena.mit.edu> sathomas@athena.mit.edu (Stephen A Thomas) writes:

>There are a number of GG1's preserved in museums around the country.  I've seen
>them at three.  The previously mentioned Strasburg museum has the original GG1 -
>4800 (rivets, not the production welded construction) and another I believe 4877
>that was preserved during Amtrak's phasing out of the engine.  The B&O museum in
>Baltimore (near the new ballpark) has one outside the museum building.  Steamtown
>had one or two (?) when I went there for an unofficial visit before it reopened
>in Scranton, PA.  I think there are GG1's preserved in other locations as well
>-the Henry Ford museum and The St Louis Transportation museum ring bells with me.

The 4913 is at the Railroaders' Memorial Museum in Altoona, PA.

Later,
-Jer
--
Jerry W. Jordak       "And if I am elected, I promise the formation of a
a.k.a. Jermaster       new party.....a third party......A WILD PARTY!!"
(jwj2@po.cwru.edu)                                          --Alice Cooper

Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: zephyr@cory.Berkeley.EDU (COIFMAN)
Subject: Water scoops 
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 03:06:19 GMT

 I recall reading about high speed steam engines on the east cost that 
would take on water via water scoops on the bottom of their tenders while 
on the fly, so to speek. This struck me as quite odd, but I soon forgot
about it. Now all of this talk about GG1's has dredged it back up. 

 I am currious about the mechanics involved with these water scoops. e.g.
where was the the water held (between the rails or outside)? How long of
a run did it talke to fill a tender or how much water could they take
on? Were they successful? Was there a lot of dammage associated with
their use? (ripping the scoop off and leaving abig hole in the bottom of
the tender for example) Etc.



   _ -----------  -------------  ----------- _  -------------/^^^^^^^^\----
  /^____________||_____________||____________^\|[] ==== ====  ___ ___   == |
 'o-o ------ o-o  o-o ----- o-o  o-o ------ o-o o-o ------------------- o-o
Way of the Zephyrs         zephyr@cory.berkeley.edu             Benn Coifman


Newsgroups: rec.railroad,alt.planning.urban,ba.transportation
From: Nigel.Allen@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Nigel Allen)
Subject: APTA Statement on Congressional Adoption of "Transit Pass" Commuter Benefit
Organization: NDA
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 03:35:03 GMT


Here is a press release from the American Public Transit Association.

 APTA Statement on Congressional Adoption of "Transit Pass" Commuter
Benefit in Energy Bill
 To: National Desk, Transportation Writer
 Contact: Chip Bishop of the American Public Transit Association,
          202-898-4114

   WASHINGTON, Oct. 8  -- Following is a statement of Jack R. 
Gilstrap, executive vice president of the American Public
Transit Association, on congressional adoption of the "transit 
pass" commuter benefit:

   Transit commuters received a major tax break from Congress today
with final passage of the $60 monthly commuter benefit in the energy
bill.  We expect President Bush will sign this legislation into law.
   This new law will take away the unfair advantage held by workers
who drive alone to work because the boss pays for parking.  It's the
government's way of acknowledging and encouraging daily commuting by
bus or train.  The benefits to everyone are real: less traffic
congestion, cleaner air and energy conservation.
   Beginning Jan. 1, companies will be able to offer their workers
free transit commuting just as they do free parking today, without
tax penalty to the receiver.
   Under current law, when such a benefit exceeds $21 a month,
workers must pay income taxes on it just as if it were cash.  With
the new law, the tax-free ceiling will nearly triple, to $60 per
month.
   We congratulate the Congress for their wisdom and foresight,
especially Rep. Robert Matsui of the Sacramento area and Sen. Daniel
Patrick Moynihan of New York, the leaders in the House and Senate,
and the Bush administration for lending its support at a critical
time.
   We intend to mount an intensive public education effort to
encourage commuters and businesses to use this new tax benefit to its
maximum, for the benefit of all.

   APTA is the international association of operating transit
authorities, their suppliers and other advocates of improved transit
service.
  For further information and interviews, contact Chip Bishop of
APTA at 202-898-4114.
 -30-

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
From: hugo@huge.West.Sun.COM (Hugo Tafel - South Bay SE)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Santa Clara County, CA Measure A info
Date: 14 Oct 1992 22:37:29 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: hugo@huge.West.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: huge.west.sun.com

In article 141092092641@dgb.storage.tandem.com, Baird_David@Tandem.com (David G. Baird) writes:
>   For those of you in Santa Clara County, California, here is an address
> and phone number for supporters of Measure A. It's a 20 year extension to
> the current 1/2 cent sales tax that's expiring in '95. The funding would
> be for mostly rail and bus express projects, and some highway improvements.
> I got a flier in the mail with a map of the proposed projects. On it was
> a number to call to get a description of the projects. I received my list
> yesterday in the mail.
> 
>   The phone # is 408-562-5757
> 
> Address :
> 
> Citizens' Coalition for Traffic Relief
> 5201 Great America Parkway
> Suite 429
> Santa Clara,CA
> 95054


Cool, I can walk down the hall to get a copy!!
What a coinkydink.




     /\
    \\ \      Hugo Tafel                  
   \ \\ /     Systems Engineer, South Bay Office
  / \/ / /    5201 Great America Parkway. 
 / /   \//\   Suite 400
 \//\   / /   Santa Clara, Ca. 95054-1122
  / / /\ /    Voice: 408/562-6321  
   / \\ \     Email: Hugo.Tafel@West.sun.com or 
    \ \\              hugo@topsun.west.sun.com
     \/
From: forags@smokey (Al Stangenberger)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: SP logo
Date: 9 Oct 1992 22:56:13 GMT
Organization: U.C. Forestry & Res. Mgt.
NNTP-Posting-Host: smokey.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Oct9.213551.15532@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> zephyr@cory.Berkeley.EDU (COIFMAN) writes:
> while driving US101 between San Francisco and San Jose, there is one or
>two ex-SP (now the pinsula commutr line) overpasses that have the old SP
>logo on them. I believe there is similar SP overpass on the way to Santa
>Cruz from San Jose.
>
There is also an abandoned SP underpass in Oakland west of the West Oakland
BART station which has the SP logo set in concrete.  I think 7th Street in
Oakland runs thru the underpass now.

-- 
Al Stangenberger                    Dept. of Forestry & Resource Mgt.
forags@violet.berkeley.edu          145 Mulford Hall - Univ. of Calif.
uucp:  ucbvax!ucbviolet!forags      Berkeley, CA  94720
BITNET: FORAGS AT UCBVIOLE          (510) 642-4424  FAX: (510) 643-5438                      
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: cal@ee.ryerson.ca (Calvin Henry-Cotnam)
Subject: Re: garbage trains, money trains, and other novelties for out of towners.
Organization: Ryerson Polytechnical Institute, Toronto
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 15:04:45 GMT

v106qhlw@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (NEW YORKER IN EXILE) writes:
>NYC people generate huge amounts of garbage.  A lot of this takes place in
>the subways.  It's totally unfeasable to have station personell clean up
>stations and empty baskets only to remove it all to street level for municipal
>pick-up. (Probably, NYCTA can't have municipal pick-up, anyway.)  Consequently,
>the garbage is bagged and stored on the platforms (generally away from the 
>public, but sometimes not) and then is picked up in the middle of the night
>by what are referred to collectively as "work trains".

I always thought this was standard practice.  Here in Toronto, the TTC has
a fleet of special equipment for specific purposes.  Their "garbage train"
consists of a single motor car with an operator's stand at both ends
(as opposed to the regular passenger-carrying equipment that must be
semi-permanently coupled in pairs as the operator's cab is at only one end).

The garbage train makes it's run through the entire system around midnight
to pick up garbage that is usually storred in a small space that is just
inside the tunnel beyond the platform (most stations have this at each
end on each track).


Calvin Henry-Cotnam, CATE            |    MY CANADA INCLUDES CANADIANS!
Ryerson Polytechnical Institute      | I would really like this to include
Toronto, Ontario, Canada             | Quebec - but I won't hold my breath.
From: elw4@po.CWRU.Edu (Evan L. Werkema)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: GG1s, E33s, etc.
Date: 16 Oct 1992 21:21:25 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: elw4@po.CWRU.Edu (Evan L. Werkema)
NNTP-Posting-Host: slc5.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, BHARPER@VTVM1.CC.VT.EDU (Bruce B. Harper) says:

>   I'll add two cents to two parts of what started as the "Electric vs.
>Diesel Maintenance" thread. . .
>   GG1s in Museums --
>   There is a GG1 in the Virginia Museum of Transporation in Roanoke,
>although I don't remember the number offhand.  It qualifies for exclusion
>since the GG1s did cross into Virginia to Potomac Yard.
>   There is a GG1 under the trainshed at the Harrisburg (Pa.) passenger
>station.  Again I don't remember the number, but it was significant because
>it was the first unit into/out of Harrisburg when the passenger line was
>electrified to Philadelphia.

   From what I understand, there are about 13 preserved GG1's.  Someone 
complained once in _Extra 2200 South_ that while groups were busily saving
so many GG1's, other less glamorous models went extinct, but that's another
story.  There is a GG1 in the back lot (under "restoration") at the National
Museum of Transportation in St. Louis, MO, and another in solid black Amtrak
paint at Elkhart, IN right across from the Amtrak station.

>   As to E33s --
[...]
>   Apparently there is also another EL-C in existance somewhere (in
>New Haven paint maybe?). Any details on this would be appreciated.
>Any details on the disposition of the other EL-Cs/E33s would also be
>appreciated.  

  Last spring, I saw three Conrail electrics in the deadline by GE's Erie, PA
plant: 2 E44's and one E33.  The E33 and one E44 were in Conrail blue, but
the other E44 (#4400) was still in Penn-Central black with a small, white
"CR" stenciled on it in appropriate places.  They're probably still there,
I don't think GE has any plans to make them into Super 7's. :)

-- 
      ______.._,____,__._._     _.__.__,_.._,_..______      
   ___IooI==          ====I     I====  \====/   ==IooI___   __________________
 |_I__I__I____Santa Fe____I_| |_I___Evan Werkema__I__I__I_| Ielw4@po.cwru.edu 
~`-~O==O~============~O==O~-`~`-~O==O~=============~O==O~-`~~o==o~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: forags@smokey (Al Stangenberger)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: Info on North Pacific Coast RR
Date: 16 Oct 1992 18:19:26 GMT
Organization: U.C. Forestry & Res. Mgt.
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: smokey.berkeley.edu

In article <18203@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> hill@madrone.eecs.ucdavis.edu (Rich Hill) writes:
>  Yes, I've seen these books.  They both have a bunch of interesting stuff but
>due to their age are, they are a little sparse in one area:  How much stuff
>is left and can be seen?  The grade by Tomales Bay is easy to see, as is
>the bridge over Keys Estuary and a tunnel near Tomales.  Is there anything
>else worth looking for?  What about Saucelito?  Tiburon?  Any info. would
>be greatly appreciated.
>

In southern Marin County, the route of the NWP is still fairly easy to follow
since the Sausalito branch and the Tiburon branch were both used for freight
until the late 1960's.  Many parts of these branches are now bicycle paths,
especially between Sausalito and Alto, and along Richardson Bay on the 
Tiburon branch.

The ferry slip in Sausalito is still downtown right in the middle of the city.

The Corte Madera tunnel began caving in especially on the Corte Madera (north)
end, and both ends have been sealed.  All of the tunnels on the Tiburon branch
are also sealed and there have been a few cave-ins which endangered nearby
houses.

Originally, the line from Sausalito crossed a trestle to Strawberry Point, and
crossed the hills to Corte Madera through the same gap where US 101 freeway
runs.  A few traces of the grade are visible on the east side of the freeway
between the Tiburon interchange and the top of the hill.  Probably some
traces are also visible on the Corte Madera side of the hill - these would be
west of the freeway.

Before the tunnel through White's Hill to Woodacre was built, the railroad
climbed over the hill on a long grade which started near Manor, and then went
through a tunnel which was buried when Sir Francis Drake Blvd. was built.
Some traces of the grade are still visible.

The tunnel under White's Hill to Woodacre caved in in the late '50's, but
both ends should be visible.


-- 
Al Stangenberger                    Dept. of Forestry & Resource Mgt.
forags@violet.berkeley.edu          145 Mulford Hall - Univ. of Calif.
uucp:  ucbvax!ucbviolet!forags      Berkeley, CA  94720
BITNET: FORAGS AT UCBVIOLE          (510) 642-4424  FAX: (510) 643-5438                      
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
From: eoliver@laurel.ocs.mq.edu.au (Eddie Oliver)
Subject: Re: Track Record
Organization: Macquarie University, Australia.
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 06:18:24 GMT

In article <1992Oct5.120614.20972@engage.pko.dec.com> pierson@cimcad.enet.dec.com (Dave Pierson) writes:
>Over the past weekend, the local PBS (Public Broadcasting System) showed
>back to back half hours of a show called "Track Record ".  This seems to be a
>video history of Railroading in Australia, made in 1991.  Enjoyable so far.
>
>Can anybody in Australia comment on how many of these there are?
>

Not very many, either four or six.

Although they were interesting and generally commendable (and I didn't see
the complete set), I thought they had a rather strange selection of items;
I ultimately concluded that they were designing the series around available
film, rather than choosing the optimal content and THEN finding film to match.

Making a video history of Australian railways in two or three hours is an
essentially unachievable task; providing a reasonable coverage of the history
of the gauge-differences problem would take almost that long without even
touching on any other issues. So Track Record should not be seen as a history
of Australian railways; it is in my view just a (quite well done) set of
Australian railway film fragments, set in a historical framework.

Eddie Oliver
From: gurd@next04wor.wam.umd.edu (Daffy Duck)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Metrolink Commuter Rail Article
Date: 14 Oct 92 01:41:19 GMT
Reply-To: gurd@wam.umd.edu

In the current Issue of Trains (November) there is a great article about
the other METROLINK (one word) opening soon in Southern California. I  
advise anybody interested in the system to pick up a copy of the magazine  
because it includes a system map, nice pictures, and the opening dates of  
future line.   It is a very interesting article and ends with the  
following passage which is very appropriate:

"Los Angeles. My City.  I work here.  Maybe I'll even be able to get  
around in it again.  As Metrorail and Metrolink begin to unfold, I'll soon  
find out."
From: mangoe@cs.umd.edu (Charley Wingate)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Re: MORE ON POT YARD
Date: 17 Oct 92 02:42:14 GMT
Article-I.D.: mimsy.61236
Distribution: usa

A short addendum: there is a continuing dispute between RF&P and Alexandria
over zoning.  As I understand it, Alex. wants lower density than RF&P is
willing to accept.
-- 
C. Wingate        + "The peace of God, it is no peace,
                  +    but strife closed in the sod.
mangoe@cs.umd.edu +  Yet, brothers, pray for but one thing:
tove!mangoe       +    the marv'lous peace of God."
From: rah@public.BTR.COM (Richard A Hyde  rah@btr.com)
Newsgroups: rec.railroad
Subject: Railwork in Cupertino
Date: 9 Oct 92 04:16:07 GMT
Distribution: ba
Organization: BTR Public Access UNIX, MtnView CA. For info contact: info@BTR.COM

Hi,

I'm a rail novice, but I thought I'd post this to "ba" in case anyone
is interested...  :-)

There is some kind of spur? line running along the west side of Bubb Rd
in Cupertino and by the 85/280 junction.  It appears to be undergoing
extensive renovation.  They (SP?) have replaced every 10th tie or so
along the tracks, dumped a lot of new ballast, tamped it down, and
straightened the tracks (which were badly out of true).  The work has
progressed to the 85/280 intersection and seems to be proceeding westward.

Hopper cars filled with crushed granite go by every few hours during the
day.  The regular traffic on the section seems to go by between 4:30 and
5:00 pm weekdays carrying 8 to 10 Rio Grande hopper cars filled with
coal (coal?  who uses that much coal in the bay area?)   Another, longer,
train passes north to south along Bubb Rd about 6:30 pm.  I don't
believe there is any other regular traffic on this route.

Two days ago, there was a SP? employee in a truck driving down the line
checking for electrical continuity.  Whenever he found a copper jumper
missing from the rails, he would use some sort of pyrotechnic device
to weld a new one to the tracks..  an interesting procedure.  Thermite
perhaps?


-- 
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|   Richard Hyde  |  RaH@btr.com  |    This space intentionally left blank   |
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