HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sstover@sumax.seattleu.edu (   Kate   )
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: Re: Neutering question
Date: 18 Nov 92 00:26:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: sumax.5822
Distribution: usa
Organization: Seattle University

In <1e8nn4INN99v@agate.berkeley.edu> spp@zabriskie.berkeley.edu (Steve Pope) writes:
>rhart@haas.berkeley.edu (Richard Hart) writes:

>>Is is normal for the vet to keep the cat overnight after
>>neuter surgery? This is a male cat. I don't remember this
>>being the practice last time I had a boy cat (years ago).
>>
>>I don't think they even kept my girls overnight, come to think of it.
>>
>>Net wisdom?

>Your vet has learned much from watching cats over
>the years.

>He's learned to fluff up his invoices.

>Steve
 
Steve, I hope you don't take this attitude the next time your cat is really in
need of being under observation for something at the vet.  Hemingway
stayed at the Humane Society for two extra days after neutering (the age
at which it was done will be left out of this example, though it's part of
the reason) at no cost to me because they were not satisfied with the way
that he came out of the anesthesia.  

I can't say it's a *normal* practice, but I unless your vet does this
every time something major occurs in your cat's health care, even when it
doesn't seem necessary, I certainly wouldn't consider it a simple fluffing
of the paycheck.


-- 
       Sheryl Stover  %  If you ask me what I have come to do in the world,
  & Hemingway & Clio  %  I who am an artist, I will reply: "I am here to
sstover@seattleu.edu  %  live aloud."                    -Emile Zola
From: berthiau@IRO.UMontreal.CA (Andre Berthiaume)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: Re: Cat out of control!
Date: 21 Nov 92 01:25:56 GMT
Reply-To: bunny@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Distribution: usa
Organization: Universite de Montreal


My Finster does that with his food despite all my protests.  He'll use his
paw and fish out a pawful onto the floor and proceed to play then eat the 
food.  Result: crumbs all around the bowl.  And, it's only been in recent 
months that he has been doing this.  Another mess he will make is when he
drinks from the water bowl.  Sometimes, he will stick his paw into the 
bowl first before drinking, other times, and I have yet to see him do this
he will make such a mess that the newspaper under the bowl becomes all
wet!  Argh!  How to teach these kitties some table manners! :)

- Eva

= Eva Chan 		| Never lose my youth, I hope it never ends. =
= bunny@gnu.ai.mit.edu	| Hope I never lose my wallet!               =
= on IRC: bunny 	|	- Bosstones			     =
=			| 					     =





--
	Andre Berthiaume 	 |  "Sometimes you're the windshield,
				 |   Sometimes you're the bug"
    berthiau@iro.umontreal.ca    |			
				 |	       Dire Straits, The Bug
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: anne@cs.UAlberta.CA (Anne J.R. Nield)
Subject: Re: travel
Keywords: travel
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 20:06:38 GMT

In addition to the suggestions made in another post, I would recommend
making sure that the carrier has a very secure fasten.  I put a small
lock on mine.  Or you could reinforce it in some way that makes it
possible for someone else to check on the cat if necessary.  But it IS
possible for cage doors to be opened accidentally.  

I would also put a piece of your clothing in with the cat for reassurance --
or a familiar toy, blanket etc.  No food or water though.  They seem to do
fine for a few hours without it -- as long as the temperature is
reasonable.

I've travelled several times with cats and never had a problem -- so
I hope your experience will be the same.  Good luck!!

Anne
From: dritz@papasun.mcs.anl.gov (Ken Dritz)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: Cat pulling its hair out
Date: 15 Nov 92 19:11:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: papasun.7218547098867
Distribution: na
Organization: Argonne National Laboratory, Chicago, Illinois

My girlfriend is very concerned about a problem that has developed with one
of her cats.  Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.  Her story
follows.

--Ken

==============

Our 7-year-old spayed female cat, Tiger, started a nasty habit while we were on
vacation in August.  Tiger and her 1 1/2-year-old neutered male companion,
Simon, stayed at home with a "sitter" checking in on them twice daily.

Upon our return, we noticed a small patch of hair missing from Tiger's back.
It seems to be a result of her pulling her hair out when she grooms.  It does
not seem to bother her otherwise (no itching).  She enjoys eating the mouthfuls
of hair and if some falls on the carpet, she goes back for it.

We can find no medical reason why she would do this to herself.  The balding
patch is now about 5" x 1" and she's working on other areas now, too.

The vet checked for fleas, etc., and for skin disease and found nothing.  He
had no other suggestions.

At a friend's suggestion, we've been putting some KM, a potassium supplement,
in her food daily.  No results.

The only other cause we can think of is that perhaps her friend, Simon, is
terrorizing her during the day.  However, they both appear to get along pretty
well except when the 15-pound Simon wants to play with the 10-pound Tiger who
doesn't.  He forces the issue and sometimes "pins" her.  She's not totally
innocent--she'll "deck" him whenever she gets the chance.

We're really getting desperate for a solution here.  She's a special cat who
seems to have an emotional problem but we don't know the cause.  We will try a
homeopathic animal practitioner next (there isn't a homeopathic vet in our
area).  We're very frustrated with being unable to help her.

--Diane
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: ederpc@rtsg.mot.com (Pamela C. Eder)
Subject: Kitty teeth
Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group
Distribution: rec.pets.cats
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 19:26:05 GMT

I have four little furballs that live with me.  (or should i say, i live
with them!)  The baby, Scooter, a male calico, requires that his teeth 
be cleaned professionally once a year.  All these little guys eat only
the dry Science Diet.  The two old cat's (12 yrs) eat the Maintenance 
and the two young cat's (5 yrs) eat the light maintenance.  He seems to be
the only one with bad teeth and gums.  Other than brushing his teeth, (yes,
the vet suggested this, and no, Scooter will absolutely not tolerate it)
is there anything else that works to clean a cats teeth.  These guys can't
do the dogbone thing like their canine counterparts.  

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.  I will continue to have the
vet clean his teeth when necessary, but it is very costly ($94) and would
like to explore any other options that are available.  Thanx.
  
-- 
---------------------
   Pamela C. Eder                   Due to budget cuts, the light at the end   
   ederpc@void.rtsg.mot.com         of the tunnel has been turned off. Thank
   Motorola, Inc.                   you for your cooperation. 
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: liana@nexus.yorku.ca (Liana Simons)
Subject: Re: Thanksgiving Holiday
Organization: York University, CS Dept. Toronto
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 13:24:33 GMT

When we went on our honeymoon this year we had one of our student friends
stay in the apartment as we are on campus.  If we couldn't get someone to stay
we would have contacted a sitting service because I felt that it would be
bad enough if I left much less taking her from her home.  From past experience
Spirit would not eat very well when we took her to the cottage, she seemed to
need about a week to become comfortable in any changed environoment.  I'm
not sure about your kitten but I think that she'll be better off at home with
someone feeding her, she may hiss at the person feeding her because its not
her mom but otherwise she'll be home.

Liana 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Liana Simons                         | WANDERER - Robert Simons
Cat Owner,                           | Wandering through cold silicon hallways,
Cat Lover                            | Seeing everything, but nothing,
and Cat Owned!                       | Forever Wandering, The Wanderer
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    Those who compute together, stay together.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: das@voodoo.boeing.com (Deb Schwartz)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: Re: Bye to MaiTai
Date: 16 Nov 92 07:14:24 GMT
Organization: Yet Another Graphics Project, Bellevue, WA

Many hugs and condolences from me, KC and Oreo.
------
Debbie Schwartz // das@voodoo.ca.boeing.com  // ....uw-beaver!bcsaic!voodoo!das
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Thursday, 19 Nov 1992 15:13:50 CST
From: <U58549@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: Re: What to name a male BLACK kitten...
 <1992Nov11.190807.1204@zmax.com>

We named our black male cat Harvey after the giant rabbit in "Harvey". In the d
ark of night, he's just as invisible as the pooka.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: diana@wetware.com (CatWoman )
Subject: Re: Cat out of control!
Organization: Castle WetWare MouseCatcher
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 13:34:16 GMT

larryw@sun.lclark.edu (Larry Westdahl) writes:

] There is a lovely cat living in my apartment, but she does two things that
] drive me up the wall.  First, she does not eat out of her bowl.  She ficks 
] the pieces of dry food on to the floor and then eats some of it, leaving the
] rest all over the place.  

Keep a whisk-broom near the food dish?

] Second, when I come home from work, I can't walk
] across the room without the cat running in front of my feet.  I nearly
] trip over every time, and I'm afraid I'm going to step on her one of 
] these days.  

Now THIS one is easier - just pick her up and 
carry her!  Or feed her - or whatever else it
is she's trying to say to you.

8-)

Diana
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: sbiles@nmsu.edu (Susannah E Biles)
Subject: Re: Goodbye to MaiTai
Organization: NMSU Computer Science
Distribution: rec.pets.cats
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 01:04:10 GMT


Purrs and licks from Agustus and Sydney
Hugs from me

Susan
From: moose@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (Kristine Anne De Leon Jugo)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: LitterPurrfect
Date: 20 Nov 92 08:03:32 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: ucscb.ucsc.edu


  Has anybody tried to flush down LitterPurrfect, the kind
  from Costco?  I know it says not to flush it but so does
  all the other scoopable kinds.
From: dedward1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Deirdre Edwards)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: Re: Neutering question
Date: 17 Nov 92 22:22:20 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Swarthmore College

In article <1e8lu7INN911@agate.berkeley.edu>, rhart@haas.berkeley.edu
(Richard Hart) writes:
> 
> Is is normal for the vet to keep the cat overnight after
> neuter surgery? This is a male cat. I don't remember this
> being the practice last time I had a boy cat (years ago).
> 
> I don't think they even kept my girls overnight, come to think of it.
> 
> Net wisdom?
> 
> 
> 
OK, I've got a lot to say here.  
1.  The overnight question:
I worked for a vet for three years, and while we kept the females
overnight, (it is after all, abdominal surgery) we let the males go home
the same day, and never seemed to run across any problems.  The  cat's
powers of healing are amazing!  We also had cats which we served as a
shelter for, and when neutering them, the vets'  usually didn't put
stitches in, 'cause they would be at the hospital where we could watch
them.  It was really rare not to have the wound completely closed the next
day.  I would ask your vet why s/he doesn't let males go home the same day.
 It may be that they use a different anaesthetic or something which gives
them a valid reason, but if not, there is no reason why you should pay the
extra cost of hospitalization.

2.  I agree with Jen.  This is not to say that every cat owner should go
all out for every surgery, but if you do not have enough money for the
basics, you  should not adopt a cat.  would you have a child on the grounds
that if it got too expensive, you would give it up?  

3.  The innuendoes and outright statements that vets are only in it for the
money are pretty extreme.
Of course, there are some vets who try to make as much profit as possible,
but if it's possible for you, you should find one who is in the business
for animals, and get a second opinion if costs seem exorbitant.  Consider
this: Veterinary school is even more competitive than medical school, just
as expensive, but unless a vet goes into research, they don't stand a
chance of making  nearly as much money as a doctor of the same caliber. 
Most vets that i know are still struggling to pay off their school loans,
and I know many  who spend much of their free tiome volunteering their
services to the ASPCA, so that the organization can offer low-cost surgery,
and have expert witnesses at animal cruelty trials.  The vets that I worked
for gave substantial discounts to those who were in financial difficulty,
and those with multiple pets.  I freely acknowledge that their are vets who
are primarily businessmen, but  the majority that I know do it for the
animals.
From: ph600fcy@sdcc14.ucsd.edu (Matthew Harrington)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Subject: UPDATE:  Ecudoran kitty-abuser is OUTTA-HERE!  (broken leg story)
Date: 18 Nov 92 03:21:09 GMT

The roommate who broke my kitten's leg will be leaving in December.
Evidentally Daddy Warbucks doesn't want to finance her unending
hedonistic vacation in California, and she isn't the type to get a
job and actually WORK.

She feels sort of guilty about the incident.  At first she denied
that the kitten could have broken his leg when she threw him.  Then,
she admitted that it must have been her, and she said that she
didn't mean to do it. 

Well, I guess that's an apology, but my girlfriend and I aren't that
impressed.  The roommate avoids the cat (and us), but my kitten,
Simon, doens't know any better to stay away from her.  There haven't
been any more incidents, and I don't anticipate that there will.  I
certainly would not have treated Simon in that way, and if I did
accidentally harm him, I would feel awful for a long time.  She
isn't that remorseful.  Maybe she is the sociopathic (felinepathic?)
anti-roommate from HELL!  

Anyhow, I'll be certain to check out the next roommate more
thouroughly. 

					Matt Harrington

-- 
---------------------------------
Matthew B. Harrington
mbharrington@ucsd.edu

Lines: 18
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 92 14:51:48 MST
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: $stephan@sasb (Stephan Fassmann, Software)
Subject: Hallmark Cards
Organization: BYU
Distribution: world

I don't know if anyone else has seen these but on Saturday we were at 
Hallmark getting Christmas cards written in German and right next to them 
was a series of cards of a kind I had never seen before. 
To the cat
From the cat
To the dog
From the dog.
These were some very cute and funny cards. On a seperate note we did get a
birthday card for my wife's mother on cats top ten favorite Christmas songs
such as Silent Mice, Wreck the Halls, Oh come all ye fishful.
Ever since we have been trying to come up with words for these but it is 
hard.
Enjoy.
_____________________________________________________________________
|Stephan Fassmann  Internet: $stephan@sasb.byu.edu  GEnie: S.FASSMANN
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
|The Random Acts of Kindness will Continue until Morale Deteriorates|
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Organization: Masters student, Industrial Administration, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 19:47:44 -0500 
From: Sigrid Olson <so17+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Cat pulling its hair out
Distribution: na

My cat did the same thing for a while.  She chewed the hair off her
fore-arms and stomach and legs.  The vet said that the way you can tell
when it is stress licking is that the hair was not pulled out by the
roots, but broken off (very short hair).  
    SHe went to the vet a lot.  First we tried a kitty-valium drug,
which I eventually gave up on.  The vet said the stress could be
anything, and might not be anything I would either notice or be able to
correct.  The problem continued off and on with larger and smaller bald
spots.
    The problem ceased when I moved out of the apartment.  Zoukie became
a cat living with 2 students rather than a cat living with 3 working
people.  I'm not sure it was just having more time with people that
helped.  I never had any time in the old apartment when I was alone.
    Now, I live by myself and Zoukie is alone for most of the day for
several days a week, but the problem hasn't recurred.
    My advice is not to worry about the cat.  Certainly my attempts to
solve the problem did no good.  I suspect my stress over her problem
contributed to it.
    Good luck. :-)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: ssnyder@sunai.er.usgs.gov (Steve Snyder)
Subject: Re: cats&music 
Organization: Never in a million years
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 18:22:59 GMT

In article <24050@hacgate.SCG.HAC.COM> deeds@solaria.hac.com writes:
>
>My big kitty runs away when I play my recorder (or clarinet or guitar
>for that matter).  But she's basically a scaredy-cat.  I haven't tried 
>it out on the new kitten yet...
>--
Occasionally, I'll put on one of those meditation type cds, the ones
that feature sounds of the seashore, a rainstorm, or woods sounds.
So I was playing one of the seashore, and my kittens sat facing the 
speaker when the sounds of seagulls calling appeared. Both of my
kittens then ran upstairs and hid under my bed.

Steve and Tribble and Hobbit



Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: jlc5f@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Jean L. Cooper)
Subject: Re: Kidney Failure
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 20:39:54 GMT

My 18-year-old cat Lizzie has the same problem, but in
her case it is essentially old age.  When we discovered
it, she had a slight urinary tract infection, but the
vet could not tell if it was caused by the kidney
problems or the cause of the kidney problems.  She
still has 25% kidney function, and has been holding her own
for slightly over a year now.  The vet put her on a
low-protein diet, to keep the kidneys from being over
worked.  However, she will not eat the prescription
"Kidney Diet" food, so we have compromised on the
"CD" instead.  She has lost a lot of weight, but
she seems to be as active as a very elderly cat could
be.  The vet has given her Winstrol, which is a steroid,
to encourage the production of red blood cells and 
prevent anemia.  He is also giving her a vitamin 
supplement on general principles.  She does look awfully
frail though, kind of like my grandmother when she was
very old.
--
Jean L. Cooper    (BITNET: JLC5F@virginia.edu   CIS: 70253,1114)
"The true University of these days is a Collection of Books." 
                                           --Carlyle                        
Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: werpetin@risky.ecs.umass.edu (Katrina Werpetinski)
Subject: Tail names
Followup-To: werpetin@risky.ecs.umass.edu (Katrina Werpetinski)
Summary: from _Tailchaser's Song_
Organization: I'm *not* organized...that's the problem
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 13:52:14 GMT



Since someone mentioned _Tailchaser's Song_ (which, BTW, I thought was
a good book, too), I figured I'd toss in the passage from that book
about the naming of The Folk (cats).  This is, of course, transcribed
without permission...

From page 16 of _Tailchaser's Song_ by Tad Williams

"At the first Meeting after their third Eye, young cats were brought
to be Named.  The Naming was a ceremony of great importance.

It was sung among the Folk that all cats had three names: the heart
name, the face name, and the tail name.

The heart name was given by the mother at the kitten's birth.  It was
a name of the ancient tongue of the cats, the Higher Singing.  It was
only to be shared with siblings, heart-friends and those who joined in
the Ritual.  Fritti was such a name.

The face name was given by the Elders at the young one's first
Meeting, a name in the mutual language of all warmblooded creatures,
the Common Singing.  It could be used anywhere a name was useful.

As for the tail name, most of the Folk maintained that all cats were
born with one; it was merely a matter of discovering it.  Discovery was
a very personal thing--once effected it was never discussed or shared
with anyone.

It was certain, at least, that some Folk never discovered their tail
name, and died knowing only the other two.  Many said that a cat who
had lived with the Big Ones--with M'an--lost all desire to find it,
and grew fat in ignorance.  So important, secret and rare were the
Folk's tail names, and so hesitantly discussed, that nothing much
about them was actually agreed upon.  One either discovered this name
or did not, said the Elders, and there was no way to force the
matter."

Hence the name of the book.  It's the story/song of Fritti Tailchaser
who is discovering his tail name.

My cat's name (Mri'fa) comes from the limited glossary of the Higher
Singing in the back of the book.  Literally, it means "sleep-jump" but
that translates to "dream".  I think both translations are equally
appropriate.  Like most kittens, she has 2 modes, sleep and race-around-
the-house-jumping-on-or-attacking-everything-that-isn't-bolted-down-and-
some-things-that-are.  :-)

Katrina

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
  Who: Katrina Werpetinski	      Where: werpetin@risky.ecs.umass.edu
       (but what's in a name)		     werpetin@umaecs.BITNET
 What: Anything I can get away with	Why: Because I like to
 When: Anytime they turn their backs	How: That's for me to know...


Newsgroups: rec.pets.cats
From: diana@wetware.com (CatWoman )
Subject: Re: My roommate broke my kitten's leg!!!! 
Organization: Castle WetWare MouseCatcher
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 15:12:58 GMT

jim@n5ial.chi.il.us (Jim Graham) writes:

] ac94691@dunix.drake.edu writes:
] 
] > [Jim wrote:]
] 
] >> if it were me, and someone deliberately did that to Smokey, I'd return
] >> the favor...to them.  no smiley intended or implied here.  there'd be a
] >> human going to the emergency room, too.   [and so on...]
] 
] > Hmmm...I've been seeing an interesting pattern in some of these
] > responses.  I AGREE absolutely that the abuse of any animal just because
] > it made a mistake is inexcusable.  But I've repeatedly seen people
] > saying they'd do the same thing back to the abuser!!!
] 
{Jim's reasoning about children, and how most of
us consider the cats to be part of the family deleted}

I, too, am not a violent person - I'll go out of
my way to avoid hostility-driven physical contact.

BUT

I've also had a motto that is known to anyone who
knows me:

Harm me - I'll probably ignore it.
Harm a friend or family memeber - you'll probably hear
     about it.
Harm one of my cats - you die.

Reasoning is that they depend on me to keep them
safe - I have trained them that humans are good,
so if a human harms them, I am responsible for
having allowed my cats to trust humans.  So - I
will respond in kind.

Now - I sincerely doubt that I would have killed
the roommate in question - but I cannot guarantee
that I would not have caused her grievious bodily
harm...fortunately, nobody I've known has given
me cause to test my motto.

Diana