HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Re: NASCAR & Mickey D's
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 16:34:17 GMT

In article <393@rehab1.UUCP> dans@rehab1.UUCP (Dan Schein) writes:
>  McDonalds is so concerned about the Bud sponser that Jr is building a new
> shop for the #27. It will not be aside or across the street from the #11,
> but quite a bit farther away.
>
I think the local wordage would be 'cross the holler'  :-)

I've been thinking about this whole McD's thing the last couple of days
and certainly, I'm going to make an attempt to get a small piece of the
action in the form of some sponsorship for PITSTOP.

I can already envision the huge marketing blitz that McD's will conduct
next year, surrounding both the NASCAR deal as well as the fact that
they've heavily involved themselves with NHRA this year with McCullough
in Top Fuel and Pedregon in Funny Car.  I'm sure that in past years you
in the Southeast USA have already seen localized marketing by McD's,
including their "most popular driver" fan voting which has been around
for a couple of years.  But at least up here in the Northwest, there are
no local McD's promotion in motorsports.  I think that'll change next
year.  I forsee lots a paraphanalia, like die-cast cars with your basic
kid's meal, etc.  It'll be big time across the US.

One note on NHRA.  I was told that at the last event (Topeka?) that
there were some McD's CEO-types working in the pits that weekend with
the McD's cars - like getting dirt under their fingernails.  Good sign,
like Ford execs attending Bondurant's school.

So will IndyCars be next?  Remember McD's being an 11th hour sponsor on
Willy T's ride at Indy in '91?

Also, will this deal force the hand of, say, Burger King?  Will the 
hamburger wars spill over to motorsports?  Either way, it's good for the
fans, as this involvement means racing continues.

-cball-
From: meier@thumper (Christopher Meier)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: WC Champ (was Re: Rumors of my death...)
Date: 14 Oct 92 02:47:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: thumper.1992Oct14.024724.9485
Organization: Image Manipulation Systems Inc.

In article <1992Oct13.211758.7171@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov> cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (David Cornutt) writes:
>Now, to start a new topic: does anyone *really* want to win the WC
>championship?  The Elliott and Allison teams sure don't look like it...
>could this be Mark Martin's year after all?

I would like to see Harry or Kyle win.  Has Davey been beat up just
a little too much this year (both physical and emotional) ?  Bill
had a great string of luck early on, but has experience the more
common type of luck since.  Mark seems to have had quite a few
driveline mechanical problems that don't take him out, but either
do or have the potential to slow him down in a race (batteries, headers,
clutches, etc).  Look for him to drop out of a race soon.  Did Bill
hit the wall to break the track bar, or were all welds triple checked
this week on his stable?

Given this year's and last year's stats, plus recent happenings,
I would have to put the finish at:

1.	Alan Kulwicki (7)		Ford
2. 	Mark Martin (6)			Ford
3.	Davey Allison (28)		Ford
4.	Bill Elliott (11)		Ford
5.	Kyle Petty (42)			Pont
6.	Harry Gant (33)			Olds

But who knows, one or two crash fests, and someone below the top 6
might make it.

Chris
-- 

@ Christopher  M.  Meier                    Image Manipulation Systems
@ Voice: (612) 753-5602 Fax: -5603          17595 Partridge St NW
@ meier%thumper@src.honeywell.com           Andover, MN 55304-1456
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: jcsmith@eos.ncsu.edu (Jay C. Smith)
Subject: Re: Nazareth Notes  IndyCars
Organization: North Carolina State University, Project Eos
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 14:35:46 GMT

In article <396@rehab1.UUCP> dans@rehab1.UUCP (Dan Schein) writes:
>  I couldn't find the Marlboro Penske's Saturday or Sunday! However I was
> listening to Paul Tracy on Sunday. He chats quite a bit for a guy whos
> in competition.

During the TV coverage of one race (was it Detroit), an announcer mentioned
that Penske had told Tracy to quit talking so much on the radio....

Does Tracy have a future as an announcer?  :-)

--
Jay C. Smith
Domain/internet: jcsmith@eos.ncsu.edu
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Good.  For a minute I thought we were in trouble."
From: wilson@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (David Wilson)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: AutoWeek on Patrese's crash
Date: 7 Oct 92 14:16:47 GMT
Organization: Schlumberger CAD/CAM; Ann Arbor, Michigan (USA)

The AutoWeek account of Patrese's crash added the tidbit that his car
passed under a bridge while vertical!  The items of luck required for
him to have walked away from this one are beyond belief.  The account
also stated that Berger knew before exiting the previous corner that
he was going to pit.  He claimed that the g-forces made it impossible
to raise his arm to warn Patrese.  Patrese was presumed to not be
impressed.  As it was taught to me at driving school, raising one's
hand before deliberately slowing is basic etiquette in all racing series.

While I am generally inclined to look at situations with an eye to the
complications facing the drivers, rather than assuming them wrong, this
is one case where I could agree with some sort of sanction against
Berger.  He admitted that slowing to pit was deliberate and planned.
He admitted he didn't signal in any way.  The excuse why doesn't cut it.
By the time of the contact the corner was long since completed -- the
g-forces had subsided.  If the pit entrance WAS too close to the
corner's exit to permit time for a signal (and reaction time for the
following driver), he was obligated to signal earlier if necessary.

Guilty.

Dave Wilson
From: b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison
Date: 15 Oct 92 22:13:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: utarlg.15OCT199217132134
Organization: The University of Texas at Arlington
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley) writes...
>jsw@umiacs.umd.edu (Jeff Webber) writes...
>b102smi@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley) writes:
>>>Oh, but wait, you guys will love this one:
>>>
>>>Track       Motorcycle Lap Record  (91)   91 Nascar Pole Time
>>>
>>>Watkins Glen   1:32.340                      1:11.851
>>>Sears Point    1:42.000                      1:40.095
>> 
>>Watkins Glen has different lengths depending on how it is set up.
>>Were they both using the same course length??
>> 
>It has been pointed out to me that Nascar drivers are afraid to
>run the full course whereas the WERA Sprints were run on the long
>version. So one can safely assume that a 500cc GP machine 
>would be somewhat faster than a NASCAR WC car around a road
>circuit. 
> 
Er, I have erred. Yes NASCAR does run the short course, but, either
the given lap time is off or the distance of the track is off. I have 
short course listed at 2.428 miles, can anyone confirm this ?
If the lap time is correct than the speed should be 131 mph. If
the given speed is correct (121 mph) than the course distance should
be 2.2385 miles. 

Also the WERA Sprints were run on a completely different course
than either of the two currently in use. It was mere 2.064 miles
in length, but, this was way back in 86 and it was set on 86 
FZ750 (not a very fast bike, even for 86). The average speed was
93.56 mph. One can only guess as to direct comparison between
NASCAR and a topline motorcycle at Watkins Glen. 

One more addendum, the Sears Point record was set back in 87 on
a 87 GXR-750 during an AFM Sprint by none other than Scott Gray 
himself. I think at least 4 seconds could be taken off that time
buy a 500cc ridden by a Schwantz or Rainey (sorry, no Ozzies 
allowed) so I stand by my sweeping statement of 500cc supremecy
over NASCAR WC cars on road circuits. 

George
From: danjones@pyrps5.eng.pyramid.com (Dan Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison
Date: 15 Oct 92 21:31:45 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View

f.w.kerfoot..iii writes:

>>>Track       Motorcycle Lap Record  (91)   91 Nascar Pole Time
>>>
>>>Watkins Glen   1:32.340                      1:11.851
>>>Sears Point    1:42.000                      1:40.095
>> 
>> Watkins Glen has different lengths depending on how it is set up.
>> Were they both using the same course length??
>
>Nascar only runs the short course, and in any case the lap time of 
>about 1:12 for 3.37 miles (the long course) would be about 170 MPH
>average, which, if you have driven it, is entirely unrealistic.
>
>The motorcycle lap time shown would be an average speed of about 132 MPH
>for the long course, which is less unrealistic, but still sounds
>on the fast side. However, it sounds slow for the short course, which
>I recollect to be about 2 miles (78 MPH) and is relatively fast.
>I suspect therefore that the motorcycle time is in fact for the long
>course.  F1 cars used the long circuit when they ran there (up until 
>the early '80s). Does anyone remember the record? I would expect that
>modern F1 cars would be significantly faster, so this may not yield
>a good comparison.

In '80, Alan Jones set the fastest lap in a Williams at 1'34"068 which
works out to 129.244 mph on the 3.37 mile track.  Formula One cars are 
alot fastest now than they were in '80 though.

Dan Jones
From: scdorcy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (JAMES DORCEY)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Nazareth Grand Prix Results, PPG IndyCar World Series Standings
Date: 7 Oct 92 17:39:00 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: NASA Lewis Research Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <945@bbkingMDC.unisys.COM>, rmarks@MDC.Unisys.COM (Richard Marks) 
writes...
>In article <5OCT199214282959@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov> 
>scdorcy@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (JAMES DORCEY) writes:

>>Al Jr. had a G93 and I think that Danny drove a '92.  The intelligence of 
>>driving what is basically a brand new chassis while having a miniscule lead 
>>in the PPG points with two races to go is _very_ debatable.  The only thing 
>>that I can think of that could justify that car selection would be the 
>>performance of the '92 Galmer on the 1 mile oval was so poor that they had 
>>nothing to lose by trying the '93.

>Look, jerk, who do you think you are making such snide statements.  

Hmm...  I guess that I'd better pop the Halon bottle cause it's getting a 
little warm in here :-)  I probably should have of phrased the first statement 
a little differently (ref: intelligence), but strangely enough, that 
statement is a pretty accurate paraphrase of Derek Daly's comments during 
the Sunday night race broadcast on ESPN.  

As far as referring to poor performance of the '92 Galmer on 1 mile ovals, 
Unser finshed 5th at Phoenix, 7th at Milwaukee, and 8th at New Hampshire.  
His only other finishes worse than the 5th at Phoenix were at Toronto and 
Detroit.  Danny Sullivan had 12th place finishes at Phoenix and Milwaukee, 
9th at Hew Hampshire (to go along with the 17th at Nazareth).  Danny's only 
other finishes worse than the 9th at New Hampshire came at Portland and 
Cleveland.  Maybe "poor" was the wrong word to describe the '92 on one mile 
ovals, but there is little arguement that their finishes have been better at 
the "big ovals" and the road/street courses.

There is no doubt that the '93 Galmer had undergone extensive testing and 
there was sound rationale behind the decision.  My intent was to spark a 
discussion regarding that decision.

As far as your new nickname for me goes, I've been called worse by better.

Jim Dorcey
From: bradley@reed.edu (Ben Bradley)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: San Remo Rallye - Anyone?
Date: 16 Oct 92 00:50:05 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Oct16.005005.27672
Organization: Reed College, Portland, Oregon

In article <3364@ariel.its.unimelb.EDU.AU> awatkins@mullara.met.unimelb.edu.au (Andrew B. Watkins) writes:
>I believe the San Remo is on at the moment, or at least will be 
>starting very soon. Can someone please post in some details - 
>stage times, drivers competing, technical details of cars, 
>stage conditions, general goss etc.

In the Friday Australian they mentioned that Andrea Aghini scored
his first ever WRC victory at San Remo in a Lancia.  Kankkunen was 
close, and Fords showed well in the interim standings..  It appeared that
the Japanese teams gave this event a miss.  I don't know any more
than this.

Ben
-- 
Ben Bradley                            Rally Drivers Do It Sideways!!
Reed College
Portland, OR                           The little critters of nature,
bradley@reed.edu                       They don't know that they're ugly.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: adams@spss.com (Steve Adams)
Subject: Re: NH Cup race???!!!
Organization: SPSS Inc.
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 15:39:21 GMT

William.A.Hall.Jr.@dartmouth.edu (William A. Hall Jr.) writes:

>I heard somebody on the net say that NHIS will have a race next year.
>Is this true? When is it?! Thanks!

Following the second Daytona race.  This expands the scedule to 30 races
plus The Winston.

At least according to Winston Cup Scene.

 -Steve
--
  The opinions expressed above are those of the author and not SPSS, Inc.
                         -------------------
   adams@spss.com                                  Phone: (312) 329-3522
   Steve Adams        "Space-age cybernomad"       Fax:   (312) 329-3558
From: t9014143@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Senna test drive Williams
Date: 8 Oct 92 17:01:11 GMT
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

In article <1992Oct7.001922.26338@cc.uow.edu.au>, ddd@cc.uow.edu.au (David Dodds) writes:
> Apparently this was reported on Australian TV last week according to a
> friend of mine...Is this true..I asked my friend if he may have misheard 
> and instead it was Prost test driving..but he is adamant that he heard Senna.
> 
> Anybody ??
> 
> David

		From what source did he get this info, I hadn't heard
		info of this nature and I am curious.
 
-- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C J                                         |
                                            |  Space for rent....
Internet : T9014143@phillip.edu.au          |
E-mail   : cwebb@arcadia.mc.phillip.edu.au  |
                                            |
================================================================================
From: aep@aber.ac.uk (Andrew Pagett)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Lombard, RAC Rally
Summary: DATE FOR ??
Date: 12 Oct 92 15:24:38 GMT
Organization: University of Wales, Aberystwyth. ( Physics Dept. )


 I was wondering does anybody out there know the dates for the Lombard
RAC rally????????? 
 Being in this little backwater of a town where information ain't exaclty 
easy to come by I am having difficulties finding out the exact dates...

Cheers Pag.....
----------------------------------+------------------------------------------
 email to aep@aber.ac.uk          | This article in no way represents the   
 or       aep%aber@ukacrl         | views of anyone at my place of work, if
 or even  ...!mcsun!ukc!aber!aep  | it did we would all be in trouble.
-----Hi, I'm a signature Virus :-) Copy me into your sig to join in.---------
From: met@ariel.its.unimelb.EDU.AU (Meteorology General)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Speed Comparison
Date: 14 Oct 92 00:58:21 GMT
Organization: University of Melbourne Dept of Meteorology

In article <Oct12.174726.15809@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> dan@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Danilo Silva) writes:
>I was watching a motorcycle race on TV and wondering how those bikes (500s)
>would compare to F1 on a same track. I understand that a bike is usually
>faster than a car (like 0-60 in 2.7 sec for ZX11), but F1 ...???
>
F1 race cars are definately faster than 500cc Grand Prix bikes for the simple
reason that they are so much faster in cornering due to; the aerodynamics (that
cant be achieved on a bike), more rubber on the road than a bike to aid in 
lateral grip, and four BIG brakes dragging four big tyres (a bike really only
has one tyre (the front) doing all the work). Acceleration times are probably
similar (up to  probably ~100mph, but after that the aerodynamics of the car 
would probably make it slower), but take this with a grain of salt as I have 
not read this last part as fact. (Anyone?) What I do know as fact is that a 
comparison was done at Eastern Creek racetrack (where they hold the Australian
round of the 500cc GP (boo-hiss Phillip Island forever!)) between a touring car,
an open wheeler that had all the F1 like wings etc and  ran a modified V6
Buik engine (I think), a sports sedan (like a totally unrestricted touring car;
this one was an Alfa gtv, but with MASSIVE wings and running (I kid you not) a
BIG Chevvy V8), a 750cc superbike (ridden by Scott Doohan, brother of Mick and 
just as good (well almost)) and a super kart (go-cart!). Now I, before I thought
about it, expected the bike to win. (It was simply two hot laps each, with 
no other vehicle on the track.) The result - 1st the open wheeler, 2nd the
sports sedan (!!!) and third the superbike. Aerodynamics and rubber-on-ground
just mauled the bike. I was very suprised. By memory though, the bike was (only
just) the fastest at the end of the straight.


Andrew B. Watkins                    |    `To strive, to seek, to find and
awatkins@mullara.met.unimelb.edu.au  |     not to yield'  
awatkins@buster.met.unimelb.edu.au   |                  - Lord Tennyson 


Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: madmax@maths.tcd.ie (Mark Taylor)
Subject: Re: flat engines
Organization: Dept. of Maths, Trinity College, Dublin, Ireland.
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 13:53:56 GMT

johnson@wrs.com (David Johnson) writes:

>abochann@cisco.com (Alex Bochannek) writes:

>>Pardon me? What makes you say that Ferrari once upon a time made flat
>>twelves?

>The point was: that the opposed cyl. format (in *my* argument) was
>a superior beast, whereas is seems that the real performance engines
>that Ferrari are promoting now, are stemmed from the V format (F-40), and
>the flat (superior???) engines are, by Ferrari, being cast in the shadow.

The new 456 certainly uses the V12 as far as I know. Now isn't 
that a gorgeous looking machine.


Mark

-- 
thesideeffectsoftravellingatthespeedoflightcoloursflyandcatherinewheel-kerr  
\  madmax@maths.tcd.ie   \ "Satellite gone way up to Mars, soon it         \
/ --------Mark---------- /  be filled with parking cars" - Lou Reed        /
igivefoodtothepooryoucallmeasaintiaskwhythepoorhavenofoodyoucallmeacommunist    
Newsgroups: rec.autos
From: mark@wdcwdc.sps.mot.com (Mark Shaw)
Subject: Re: flat engines
Organization: Motorola Western MCU Design Center, Chandler Arizona
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 23:37:12 GMT

In article <johnson.719041178@wrs.com>, johnson@wrs.com (David Johnson) writes:
|> abochann@cisco.com (Alex Bochannek) writes:
|> 
|> >Pardon me? What makes you say that Ferrari once upon a time made flat
|> >twelves?
|> 
|> The point was: that the opposed cyl. format (in *my* argument) was
|> a superior beast, whereas is seems that the real performance engines
|> that Ferrari are promoting now, are stemmed from the V format (F-40), and
|> the flat (superior???) engines are, by Ferrari, being cast in the shadow.

I have followed this thread for some time, and as yet have heard what the
superior traits are.  Merely because a Ferrari, Porsche, whatever used it
is not an attribute.  What is the real advantages of flat engines with
respect to performance, durability, or costs?

Mark
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
From: tmkk@uiuc.edu (Khan)
Subject: Re: H. Ross Perot's proposed gas tax
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 20:44:45 GMT


In article <92284.152848MWA102@psuvm.psu.edu> <MWA102@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>     From what I got out of Perot's tv spot Friday night, He wanted to raise
>gas taxes to support construction and maintenance of transportation systems.
>Despite the fact that a gas tax will definitely hurt the working poor, the vast
>interstate highways are reaching the end of their design life.
>     With increasing auto traffic, these old roads must be maintained or
>upgraded, and new roads should be built.  The only other option is mass transit
>which, to me, does not seem feasible for a country with a large rural
>population.  With either improved roadways or developing mass transit systems,
>a large amount of $$$ is needed!  How else should one raise transportation $$$
>than by taxing those who use the systems?

Precisely. As for long commutes, I suspect those days will be over with
sooner than many people think. Instead of driving from your nice
suburban detached house to your job in the downtown area of a major
city, you'll hop on a bus to a satellite office located right in your
own neighborhood and networked to all your other satellite offices as
well as the main headquarters (or what's left of it) downtown. Some
employees will even telecommute, which means they need never leave their
homes if they don't want to.

How's that for an argument starter? ;-)

Xref: sparky rec.autos.driving:5955 sci.physics:16110
From: tmkk@uiuc.edu (Khan)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving,sci.physics
Subject: Re: LIDAR workings (was Re: Laser Jammer Sighting?)
Date: 7 Oct 92 17:03:13 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.BvrGpG.304
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana


In article <Bvps0r.5r2@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> teek@kingcong.UWaterloo.ca (Prateek Dwivedi) writes:
>
>I'm interested in knowing if the laser doesn't work on different types of
>paint jobs.
>
>If laser works on reflecting light.... then if I have a "buff" black car
>that absorbs most light...would I be stealth.

Only if all your chrome, your headlights, your license plates, your
reflectors (e.g. turn signals, fog lights, etc.) are ALL painted dull
black as well. If your car if flat balck, but you have a nice shiny
license plate, a LIDAR gun will still be able to get a reading from your
car.

>Another thought re: laser detectors.  Are they only working on deflection
>from atmosphere particles?  Or does it work on the laser hitting the car
>itself.  The latter would be too late, wouldn't it?

You're absolutely right. There is no "scatter" from a LIDAR gun, and its
beam is very narrow. When your LIDAR detector goes off, it's because the
LIDAR beam is hitting YOUR CAR. It doesn't bounce off of other vehicles,
trees, the road, signposts, or any of the other things that RADAR will.
This is why Car & Driver judged LIDAR detectors to be worthless in their
report on LIDAR.
From: bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ron Bense)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.driving
Subject: Re: H. Ross Perot's proposed gas tax
Date: 14 Oct 92 13:55:03 GMT
Reply-To: bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense)
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD

In rec.autos.driving, kemasa@ghost.hac.com (Kemasa) writes:
>In article <26309@oasys.dt.navy.mil> bense@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Ronald Bense) wri

>>Because the debt needs to be paid also. Is this so hard to recognize?

>If someone is wasting something, it is generally not a good idea to give
>them more of it so they can waste it to. Understand?

Yeah, I do, actually. Guess you missed the previous post where in I
said that this new money could only be used for the *principle* of the
debt. Not for the deficit, or anything else. IOW, they would have to
spend wisely, as this money is money they'll never see. BTW, I'm all
for removing all pork barrel projects and stuff, but I think it'll still
be insufficient to balance the budget. Right now, 60% or so of your
tax money goes to welfare type spending. 33% or so is defense. You've
still got a lot of other things to pay for, such as the general running
of government and such, and less than 7% of the budget to do it with.
This is reality. To make a really balanced budget, a lot of people are
going to be refused help, or get less of it. Defense cuts aren't going
to be able to balance it. And you know how those constituents are going
to react, right? And why those in congress are reluctant to really do
it.

Ron                          Think about this one (seen on a bumper sticker):
			     The road to hell is bumper-to-bumper
			     Make a U-turn to God.
The irony is priceless.