HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rc@chaos.boston.sgi.com (Roger Corron)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi
Subject: Re: Seeking info on logical volumes
Date: 22 Jan 93 22:15:11 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

Shrinkfs would be nice. But if you have the opportunity to plan ahead, 
you can probably do without it.

First, it helps if you don't set up /usr as a logical volume. You can
often relocate directories onto other disks and set up symlinks to them.
Among SGI products, WorkShop, Insight, and Explorer are explicitly designed
for this. In fact, Insight will read from its installation CDROM. Since inst
is smart enough to follow symlinks, you could move things like /usr/src and 
/usr/catman elsewhere. On my own system, /usr/people, /usr/Insight, and
/usr/WorkShop have been on a seperate disk for weeks. It works fine.

Second, if you must expand /usr, why not set aside a partition or two?
Set aside partition 1 on one or two of the disks in your volume for future
swap expansion. To paraphrase Captain Montgomery Scott, if you want your
boss to think of you as a miracle worker, you have to keep some reserves.

Expanding /usr does carry some risk. Once it's done, you must depend on
the well-being of more than one disk. If there is a problem with any disk,
you may have your data backed up, but you will have to fix the problem
in single user mode or in the miniroot. Shrinkfs wouldn't change the risk,
although it would increase your flexibility. 

Roger Corron

In article <3303@contex.contex.com>, frank@marvin.contex.com (Frank Perdicaro) writes:

|> The only thing I need is the ability to reconfigure logical volumes
|> when subtracting disk partitions, disks, or shrinking file system
|> size,  and thereafter shrinkfs(1).
|> 
|> The typical problem is like this.  User has one disk with root, swap,
|> and /usr.  His demands grow, so he buys n extra disks and grows the
|> /usr filesystem on to them.  His demands grow more, and he wants more
|> swap space.  Now the huge /usr fs has to be backed up, deleted, the
|> swap grown, and the /usr lv&fs remade and re-loaded.
|> 
|> It sure would be nice if one could do a shrinkfs(1) on /usr, fx the
|> swap parameters, and reboot.  Can we have it in IRIX 5.1?
|> 
|> 
|> -- 
|> 	 Frank Evan Perdicaro 				Xyvision Color Systems
|>       Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.		101 Edgewater Drive
|>    inhouse: frank@marvin, x5572				Wakefield MA
|> outhouse: frank@contex.com, 617-245-4100x5572		018801285
From: mike@isgtec.com (Mike Sellers)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: who did "fusion"?
Date: 28 Jan 93 15:40:01 GMT
Organization: ISG Technologies Inc., Mississauga Ontario

Apologies if this is a FAQ or not the right place to ask...

How can I get in touch with whoever (at SGI, apparently) did the 
"fusion" directory visualization program?  Is anyone using this 
other than as a toy?  Does SGI have any plans to expand it?

Enquiring minds, etc. :-)

--
              Mike Sellers      User Interface Team Leader
           mike@isgtec.com      ISG Technologies, Toronto, Canada
              "Actum ne agas" -- Do not do what has been done.
                         Furare tantum ab Optimis
From: vjs@rhyolite.wpd.sgi.com (Vernon Schryver)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: QuickTime
Date: 25 Jan 93 20:55:16 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA

In article <C1F9D7.3Ay@wm.estec.esa.nl>, guy@wmsg02.wm.estec.esa.nl (Guy Brooker) writes:
> ...
> I'm sorry Michael, but it seems I am not the only one to have missed your more
> enlightening reply on Quicktime in comp.sys.sgi.graphics. ...

> Would it be possible for you to outline the levels of integration of
> Quicktime into IRIX and its supporting applications that are being
> planned ?
> ...

Michael can, should, and no doubt will respond or not as he feels
appropriate.


However, very few of the people with return addresses within sgi.com
who post to comp.sys.sgi* can prudently say much about future products,
plans, or ideas.  Very few of us who post have the authority to offer
nondisclosure agreements.  Most of us are only soldiers in the trenches.

Many of us have worked on projects that have been cancelled, and based
just on statistics, it is quite possible that a few of us are now
working on something that we will all be surprised to have cancelled.
The pain of that is enough.  No one likes to have that pain augmented
by disappointed customers shouting at Ed and threatening or filing
lawsuits about broken promises.

There is no such thing as effective net-news disclaimer.  An innocent
answer can be taken by third parties as an official promise.

It is impossible to predict exactly what a future product will do when
complete enough to ship.  Anyone making a pre-announcement knows that
what, if anything, is finally shipped will differ from the current
hopes and plans.  Thus, almost any pre-announcement is a lie, a
statement intended to make someone believe something known to be false,
even in those perhaps rare cases when the announcement is a complete
statement of current plans.  Some companies more regularly
"pre-announce", but they do not let the peons do the announcing,
because those "truths" must be managed carefully.

If you want pre-announcement, it-could-turn-out-to-be-the-truth, your
best source is your salescritter.  Yes, I know about "non-disclosures",
customers who need information for planning, and others who just need
to feel the cutting edge.  Still, sales people and big bosses are paid
to take the risks associated with pre-announcing, and to keep the
stories straight.

I thought Michael's answer, "when it's ready", was a humorous (because
of the name "quicktime") response to a question that might not be
answerable here and perhaps should not have been asked here.


Vernon Schryver,  vjs@sgi.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
From: buck@ra.nrl.navy.mil (Loren Buchanan)
Subject: Re: QuickTime
Followup-To: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Summary: Buy it from Apple
Keywords: Quicktime Apple SGI
Organization: Naval Research Lab, Washington, DC
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 14:48:19 GMT

In article <C1ID2C.AL4@wm.estec.esa.nl> guy@wmsg02.wm.estec.esa.nl (Guy Brooker) writes:
>The help and information given through comp.sys.sgi by all the sgi people is 
>quite magnificent, and highly praiseworthy. We love you all! Isn't that right!

I agree 100 percent.

>Excuse me, but wasn't it SGI who made a big fanfare about porting QuickTime 
>onto their platform last year, getting thier name in the news of a number of 
>respected industry journals... Since that 'pre-announcement' everything 
>appears to have gone silent. 

This is very common in the industry as a whole.  There have been a large
number of multimedia annoucements, proposals, contracts, etc. bandied about
not only by SGI but lots of other companies.  I would like to see most of 
these competing formats disappear.  The format I prefer is CDI from Philips,
but for mostly political reasons I expect it will fail, likewise I expect
Quicktime to fail for similar reasons.  Whatever does succeed will be
encodeable onto CD-ROM, is compatible with Photo CD, supports full motion
video, and has at a minimum of NTSC and PAL output (SECAM, and both 60HZ and
50HZ HDTV being desired additional outputs).

Until a clear leader emerges from the multimedia swamp I have decided to
standardize on Quicktime.  Right now if I want to play a Quicktime movie, it 
has to be on a Mac.  This is not such a bad thing.  We have the Quicktime 
Movie Exchange toolkit installed on our IRIS and we can shove stuff into it, 
and we get Quicktime movies out that we can transfer to our Macs for display.  
My only wish is that it was Version 1.5 instead of 1.0.  This toolkit is sold 
by Apple in source code form (you need to supply a C++ compiler).

>Lets hope that the (quick)time is nigh !

Something to also consider is SGI's viewpoint on paying royalties to Apple
when they have their own movie format.  I really don't care whether it is
CDI, Quicktime, PREMO (the proposed ISO new work item), DVI, Ultimedia, MPC,
VIS, IMA's proposal, CDTV, ect. as long as I can play it on any reasonable
computer (it has a display, audio, and a mouse equivalent) and can be down
loaded to a CD-ROM for playback on something like a Philips CDI 360.

B Cing U

Buck

-- 
Loren Buchanan (buck@curie.nrl.navy.mil) | #include <standard.disclaimer>
NRL Code 5842, 4555 Overlook Ave.        | #include <computer.graphics>
Washington, DC 20375      (202) 767-3884 | #include <electronic.music>
Phone tag, America's fastest growing business sport.
From: dwatts@ki.com (Dan Watts)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Is there a way to get rid of CC warning message?
Date: 28 Jan 93 15:34:57 GMT
Organization: ki Research, Inc. Derry NH

While compiling programs with -O, I get the following warning message:

  uopt: Warning: main: part(s) of procedure have no exit point

Is there a way to tell cc when I expect this to occur?  This happens
when I have a program that has a while(1) loop which I don't expect
it to ever exit other than via ^C.  It'd be nice if I could make
the warnings go away.

-- 
######################## Have A Nice Nude Day #########################
# EMail: dwatts@ki.com  UUCP: ...!uunet!ki.com!dwatts  Dan Watts      #
# Voice: 410 290 0355   FAX:  410 290 0397          ki Research, Inc. #
# The Bill Of Rights: Void Where Prohibited by Law. Vote Libertarian ##
From: portuesi@tweezers.esd.sgi.com (Michael Portuesi)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: QuickTime
Date: 25 Jan 93 21:52:48 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA


In article <C1F9D7.3Ay@wm.estec.esa.nl>, guy@wmsg02.wm.estec.esa.nl writes:
> I'm sorry Michael, but it seems I am not the only one to have
> missed your more enlightening reply on Quicktime in
> comp.sys.sgi.graphics.

What I said in my earlier message in this thread is
essentially a shorter version of what I said in
comp.sys.sgi.graphics.

> The fanfare announcement of the Quicktime port sometime ago was
> enough to push us that little bit further and purchase some
> Indigos here. We are a little worried at the current silence...

You should not be worried.  In this case, no news is good news.

> Would it be possible for you to outline the levels of
> integration of Quicktime into IRIX and its supporting
> applications that are being planned ?

As Vernon Schryver said in a separate message, I cannot
comment on features and availability dates for unreleased
products.

I do want to point out, however, that if your needs for
movies on the Indigo do not include exchange with Macintosh
applications, we already provide a Movie Tools pacakge
bundled with IRIX 4.0.5F.  You get a movie player, an
application for creating and editing movies, and a utility
for recording live video from the IndigoVideo board.

If you own an Indigo and have a maintenance contract for OS
releases, simply contact Silicon Graphics and ask for an
upgrade to IRIX 4.0.5F.

m.
--
Michael Portuesi   Silicon Graphics, Inc.   portuesi@sgi.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
From: wes@uf.msc.edu (Wes Barris)
Subject: Re: biff equivelant
Reply-To: wes@msc.edu
Organization: AHPCRC, Minnesota Supercomputer Center
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 19:26:33 GMT

In article <1993Jan21.165454.22210@gserv1.dl.ac.uk>, S.H.Kinder@daresbury.ac.uk  (Steve Kinder) writes:
|> 
|> Is there anything to do the same as biff for SGs
|> 
|> Steve
|> 

How about /usr/sbin/mailbox?

===============================================================================
Wes Barris                                                   PH: (612) 626-8090
Minnesota Supercomputer Center, Inc.                         Email: wes@msc.edu
From: andy@jhunix2.hcf.jhu.edu (Andy Poling)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: biff equivelant
Followup-To: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Date: 22 Jan 1993 17:13:38 -0500
Organization: Homewood Academic Computing, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore, Md, USA
NNTP-Posting-Host: jhunix2.hcf.jhu.edu
Summary: simple

In article <1993Jan21.165454.22210@gserv1.dl.ac.uk> shk@gserv1.dl.ac.uk writes:
>
>Is there anything to do the same as biff for SGs

Yes: "chmod u+x `tty`".  That's all that "biff y" does.

Of course, if you aren't running a comsat daemon it'll do little good.  I
recall that porting comsat was pretty easy.  Nonetheless, an IRIX 4.0.*
ready version is available for anonymous FTP from jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu in
pub/public_domains_software/SGI.

Then, of course, your mail system must know how to poke the comsat server --
can't really help you there...

-Andy

Andy Poling                              Internet: andy@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu
UNIX Systems Programmer                  Bitnet: ANDY@JHUNIX
Homewood Academic Computing              Voice: (410)516-8096    
Johns Hopkins University                 UUCP: uunet!mimsy!aplcen!jhunix!andy
From: rogerk@queernet.org (Roger B.A. Klorese)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: QuickTime
Date: 21 Jan 93 05:43:05 GMT
Organization: QueerNet

In article <utnn0o4@zola.esd.sgi.com> portuesi@tweezers.esd.sgi.com (Michael Portuesi) writes:
>
>In article <1il6ddINNpih@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, rdargahi@wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu writes:
>> 
>> When will Quicktime be available from SGI
>> 
>
>When it's ready.

A refreshing change, then, Mike.  ;-)
-- 
ROGER B.A. KLORESE                                              +1 415 ALL-ARFF
rogerk@unpc.QueerNet.ORG              {ames,decwrl,pyramid}!sgiblab!unpc!rogerk
"Sometimes you wake up.  Sometimes the fall kills you.  And sometimes, when
you fall, you fly."                                                -- N. Gaiman
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps,comp.sys.sgi
From: welman@cs.sfu.ca (Chris Welman)
Subject: Re: Anyone using UIM/X?
Followup-To: comp.sys.sgi.apps,comp.sys.sgi
Summary: Apparantly not
Keywords: UIM/X
Organization: CSS, Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1993 01:21:17 GMT

In article <1k0recINNc2j@rave.larc.nasa.gov> alan@hal.larc.nasa.gov (alan dare) writes:
>
>We are looking into getting UIM/X. If you are using it how about some 
>feedback on the product. Is it easy to use? How much X development are
>your required to do outside of the package? Is the GL/X widget supported?
>
>And we thank you for your support...

I posted a similar request a while back, with no response.  But I discovered
that one of the Hot Mix CDs (number 2, I think) has an evaluation copy of
UIMX on it.  Try calling SGI Express to see how you could get your hands
on it...


-- 
========================================================================
Chris Welman					Simon Fraser University
welman@sfu.ca					(604) 291-3610
From: stanj@ferrari.corp.sgi.com (Stan Jensen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: SGI Developer's Forum
Date: 28 Jan 93 18:50:34 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.

In article <1993Jan27.190347.13425@odin.corp.sgi.com>, yusuf@aries.esd.sgi.com (Yusuf Attarwala) writes:
|> In article <C1GnDB.G30@ecmwf.co.uk>, Richard.Fisker@ecmwf.co.uk (Richard Fisker,x2355) writes:
|> |> I have heard that there is an  annual  SGI Developer's Forum. but would like more information if possible - place, date, fee, tentative agenda etc.
|> |> 
|> |> If anyone could give me a SGI email contact address for this, that would 
|> |> be perfect!
|> 
|>   try this email   devprogram@sgi.com 
|>   or  this #        415 390 3033
|> 
|>   for more information

You might try "devforum@sgi.com" for info on the 8/30/93 Forum at Stanford.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Stan Jensen, Systems Engineer                          stanj@corp.sgi.com
Silicon Graphics Inc., M/S 14L-120                    Phone:(415)390-5822
P.O. Box 7311, 1350 Charleston Road                   FAX:  (415)962-1589
Mt. View, CA  94039-7311                                "I (heart) Tonks"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: tshin@husc8.harvard.edu (Tae Shin)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Help with compiling Elm2.4 on SGI
Date: 24 Jan 93 05:09:42 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc8.TSHIN.93Jan23210942
Distribution: world
Organization: Harvard Arts and Sciences Computer Services, Cambridge, MA

Hi there!  I'm sort of a novice at this, so bear with me if my question isn't
very clear.  Hopefully someone can help me anyways.

I'm using a SGI Indigo computer (4.0.5) that is connected to two other Indigos
by NFS and NIS.  Recently I downloaded the source code for Elm2.4 for unix and
attempted to compile it on our systems.  I used the 'Configure' program which 
went through a series of questions about the system; I believe I answered these
correctly.  When I finished, I entered the command 'make documentation' which
started correctly but ended with an 'error #255; Stopped'.  A similar result 
occurred when I entered 'make all >& MAKELOG &', which was supposed to create
the /bin files (it didn't).

	First some simple questions.  The documentation doesn't specifically
say that Elm will work with SGI's.  Has anyone been able to this successfully?
If so, could you supply some hints or a 'walkthrough'?.  Any help would be 
greatly appreciated.

T.B.Shin
tshin@husc8.harvard.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps,comp.graphics
From: elvis@unlv.edu (Frederick Haab)
Subject: Editor on pixel level? (SGI)
Originator: elvis@sonny-boy.cs.unlv.edu
Organization: UNLV
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 93 20:06:30 GMT


	I am trying to find a "drawing" program that will allow
editing at the pixel level.  I need to be able to capture some
screen images and then edit them for documentation purposes.
Other features would be nice, but I don't need anything too
fancy.

	The machine being used is an SGI, any help is appreciated,
please post or reply to:

		haabn@nye.nscee.edu


Frederick Haab
University of Nevada at Las Vegas
National Supercomputing Center for Energy and the Environment
haabn@nye.nscee.edu
otto@helios.nevada.edu
elvis@cs.unlv.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
From: S.H.Kinder@daresbury.ac.uk  (Steve Kinder)
Subject: biff equivelant
Reply-To: shk@gserv1.dl.ac.uk
Organization: Daresbury Laboratory, UK
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 16:54:54 GMT


Is there anything to do the same as biff for SGs

Steve

Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
From: yusuf@aries.esd.sgi.com (Yusuf Attarwala)
Subject: Re: SGI Developer's Forum
Organization: sgi
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 19:03:47 GMT

In article <C1GnDB.G30@ecmwf.co.uk>, Richard.Fisker@ecmwf.co.uk (Richard Fisker,x2355) writes:
|> ---
|> We are anticipating to becoming a new SGI site, using Indigos and Crimsons.
|> 
|> I have heard that there is an  annual  SGI Developer's Forum. but would like more information if possible - place, date, fee, tentative agenda etc.
|> 
|> If anyone could give me a SGI email contact address for this, that would 
|> be perfect!
|> 
|> Many Thanks,
|>  
|> Richard Fisker (European Centre for Medium-Range Weather Forecasts)
|> --------------------------------------------------------
|> -- Internet: RFisker@ecmwf.co.uk
|> -- Post:     ECMWF, Shinfield Park, Reading RG2 9AX, England
|> -- Phone:    - (44) 734 499355 (direct) (44) 734 499000 (switchboard)
|> -- Fax:        - (44) 734 869450
|> ---------------------------------------------------------


  try this email   devprogram@sgi.com 
  or  this #        415 390 3033

  for more information

-- 
      _     _
\/| |(_ | |[_
/ \_| _)\_||
                                           
SGI - Applications                           
yusuf@esd.sgi.com                           
415 390 3342
From: portuesi@tweezers.esd.sgi.com (Michael Portuesi)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: QuickTime
Date: 22 Jan 93 17:08:16 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA


In article <1jn7hcINN4l9@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, rdargahi@wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu writes:
> In article <utnn0o4@zola.esd.sgi.com>, portuesi@tweezers.esd.sgi.com (Michael Portuesi) writes:
> > In article <1il6ddINNpih@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, rdargahi@wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu writes:
> > > 
> > > When will Quicktime be available from SGI
> > > 
> > 
> > When it's ready.
> > 
> > --
> > Michael Portuesi   Silicon Graphics, Inc.   portuesi@sgi.com
> 
> Thank you for that enlightening answer.
> 
> Many Thanks

I did post a longer reply on this topic in comp.sys.sgi.graphics.

I'm sorry if you were upset by this response.  I appreciate
your desire to see QuickTime on our platform, but the reality
of the situation is that in order for it to be a product that
you're going to be able to use, we have to invest a significant
amount of engineering effort into making it work well, and
integrated with the movie software which is already available
on our system.

Finally, SGI employs me to design and develop software
products.  SGI does not employ me to provide ship dates for
unreleased products on Usenet, and in fact many people at SGI
would get quite upset with me were I to do so.

I hope you found this answer more enlightening than the first.

--
Michael Portuesi   Silicon Graphics, Inc.   portuesi@sgi.com
From: rdargahi@wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu (Ross Dargahi)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: QuickTime
Date: 21 Jan 1993 22:19:24 GMT
Organization: Baylor College of Medicine
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu
Originator: rdargahi@wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu


In article <utnn0o4@zola.esd.sgi.com>, portuesi@tweezers.esd.sgi.com (Michael Portuesi) writes:
> 
> In article <1il6ddINNpih@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>, rdargahi@wilkins.iaims.bcm.tmc.edu writes:
> > 
> > When will Quicktime be available from SGI
> > 
> 
> When it's ready.
> 
> --
> Michael Portuesi   Silicon Graphics, Inc.   portuesi@sgi.com

Thank you for that enlightening answer.

Many Thanks

Ross Dargahi

**************************************************************************************
From: olson@anchor.esd.sgi.com (Dave Olson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: Re: Is there a C-shell equivalent of "trap"?
Date: 21 Jan 93 18:21:52 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.  Mountain View, CA

In <1993Jan21.051424.17868@ringer.cs.utsa.edu> senseman@lucy.brainlab.utsa.edu (David M. Senseman) writes:

| This is almost certainly the wrong group to post to, 
| but the question is so dumb, it probably doesn't matter...
| 
| I'm use to programming in Bourne/Korn and use the "trap"
| builtin command from time to time. Is there a similar
| service in C-Shell or a way to emulate a "trap"? I don't
| see anything at all like "trap" in my C-Shell reference
| books. Is it there and I'm not seeing it or this feature 
| not found in C-Shell?

onintr, but it isn't as general as trap.  One of the many
reasons people recommend writing any non-trivial shell
script with sh or ksh.
--
Let no one tell me that silence gives consent,  |   Dave Olson
because whoever is silent dissents.             |   Silicon Graphics, Inc.
    Maria Isabel Barreno                        |   olson@sgi.com
From: Richard.Fisker@ecmwf.co.uk (Richard Fisker,x2355)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps
Subject: SGI Developer's Forum
Date: 26 Jan 93 12:15:11 GMT
Reply-To: Richard.Fisker@ecmwf.co.uk
Organization: ECMWF

---
We are anticipating to becoming a new SGI site, using Indigos and Crimsons.

I have heard that there is an  annual  SGI Developer's Forum. but would like more information if possible - place, date, fee, tentative agenda etc.

If anyone could give me a SGI email contact address for this, that would 
be perfect!

Many Thanks,
 
Richard Fisker (European Centre for Medium-Range Weather Forecasts)
--------------------------------------------------------
-- Internet: RFisker@ecmwf.co.uk
-- Post:     ECMWF, Shinfield Park, Reading RG2 9AX, England
-- Phone:    - (44) 734 499355 (direct) (44) 734 499000 (switchboard)
-- Fax:        - (44) 734 869450
---------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.sgi.apps