HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: henry@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Unitarian Universalists vote pro-LGB
Date: 25 Jul 92 19:53:16 GMT
Organization: Advanced Decision Systems; a div of Booz, Allen & Hamilton

mdrayton@hpmwtd.sr.hp.com (Mike Drayton) wrote: 
->It's pretty damn easy, but you've got to find one first (look in your
->local phone book).  Then stop in on Sundays for a while to see if you
->hear anything that makes sense to you.

that's it.  i did this some years ago and have never regretted it
(although i have regretted not always having the time to become as
active as i'd like in UUA affairs.)

->Depending on the particular congregation, you may find an active and
->visible gay membership, or you may not.  Each Unitarian-Universalist 
->church has to do its own "homework" on helping GLBO people feel at home,
->and some do better than others.  The U-U's have been passing pro-gay
->resolutions at the continental level since 1969, but the attitudes
->of individuals vary, of course. 

my first UUA congregation, in lafayette, in, was a fairly small outfit
which didn't have enough critical mass for a gay group ... but, then
again, the town was sufficiently small that this wasn't really
necessary: we all know each other and silently said "ooh!  i know him
and him and her and ..."  it also attracted some of the most respected
people at the local university (that is, the most respected people who
had a penchant for exercising their own grey matter),  and this helped
make sunday morning interesting.

->I have identified as Unitarian all my life, and upon getting
->re-involved with the church, I decided that if it were to have any
->real value to me, I would have to be able to be completely out.  
->This experiment is going well for me.  You'll have to try it for 
->yourself.

what he said.

the hardest part about unitarian-universalism is finding a
congregation you are comfortable with ... there is significant
variance between local congregations (in the boston area, when i was
last active as a UU, there were congregations which basically
resembled *very* liberal anglican congregations, and others which
resembled the congregation i started to describe above.  the arlington
street church had (when i left, anyway) a lesbian minister heading up
the congregation (arlington street hired her away from a p-town
congregation).

you are encouraged to shop around.

--
# henry mensch / booz, allen & hamilton, inc.  / <henry@ads.com>
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: emcmanus@gr.osf.org (Eamonn McManus)
Subject: Re: resonances
Organization: Open Software Foundation Research Institute, Grenoble
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 17:28:35 GMT

amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:
>  Kannapell has tried to see oralism from the viewpoint of hearing parents
>  of deaf children.  "THEY'LL DO ANYTHING TO MAKE THEIR CHILD LIKE
>  THEMSELVES," she signs.>
...
>yes, we *have* heard these ideas before.

I doubt if I am the only person on this newsgroup to have read Oliver
Sacks's _Seeing Voices_ with a deep sense of the parallels between the
oppression of deaf people and that of gay people.  While (as Arnold
points out) there are important differences, the tales of deaf people
resisting attempts to force them to be "normal" and of the
establishment of Deaf Pride groups are surely striking to any gay
person.

,
Eamonn
From: markm@ogicse.ogi.edu (Mark Morrissey)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Portland reflections (short form)
Date: 31 Jul 92 01:21:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.40754
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute (formerly OGC), Beaverton, OR

In article <1992Jul30.230520.23563@osf.org> coren@osf.org (Robert Coren) writes:
>
>Also, nobody knows how to have *fun* like a bunch of queers. 

Almost the exact quote I got from a couple of Powell's employees tuesday night.
I think that as much as everyone appreciated Powell's, Powell's appreciated
everyone from the con.  Word is that the Gay and Lesbian Studies section
hasn't been that busy in years!

>Thanks to all the locals who made it possible (Alan & Mark,
>organizers; Nelson, who keeps insisting that he didn't do anything;

Except, of course, be Nelson, which is quite sufficient in its own right.

>Chris M., compiler of packets; others too numerous to mention); and
>thanks to all who were there, for making it great.

And of course, BBC and Fred who gave loads of time to run down the final
details at the very last minute!

And to add fuel to the fire, who is going to post the story of the waterfall?
The main character is still touring (is he still a muffin??).  I am not
sure I can do justice to the whole thing.

--mark
Let's do it again next week!
From: his@the-temple.East.Sun.COM (Howard Solomon - SunExpress Support Engineer)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Well, God Damn It!  SPILL THE BEANS!
Date: 29 Jul 1992 18:57:01 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Distribution: world
Reply-To: his@the-temple.East.Sun.COM
NNTP-Posting-Host: the-temple.east.sun.com

OK, jason.  I'll peep.  The Portland con was absolutely wonderful!  I can't repeat
that often enough.  For those of you who don't remember, me, I am the person who
started these con things and ran the first two.  I am so impressed at the events,
the organization (yes, even you Alan!), and the collateral provided for people
who don't know Portland.  From the hot springs to the BBQ, to the picnics to
Trivial Pursuit at 3 AM, everything was a blast.  There seemed to be about 60
or so of us in town (probably a little more) and we have the pictures to prove it!!

The locals were more than hospitable, the weather got better as the weekend 
progressed, and the company was excellent.  I have several stories I could tell,
but I think I won't just now  (some never....).   Suffice it to say that a good
time appeared to have been had by all (me especially!).

As an aside, I have the archives (pictures mostly) from the first con.  I have taken
pictures myself at all but Toronto.  I would like to put together a huge album
of the cons.  For those who have pictures, please make copies of your best shots
and forward them to me for inclusion in the album to:

Howard Solomon
37 Spruce Road
North Reading, MA 01864

I will bring it to all future con-type events.  Having our history will be fun.

As another aside, congratulations to Ron Rizzo for being the only member to attend
all 5 cons (San Francisco, Boston, Denver, Toronto, Portland).  Steve Dyer, Alan
Batie, and I have attended four.  To those who never attended a con (and those who
have) I hope everyone can try to attend the future ones wherever they might be
(both initial suggestions -- Austin and Chicago) sound wonderful to me!

After a several year absence,

Rgds,

Howard


In article 14226@watson.ibm.com, jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com (Jake Coughlin) writes:
> tal@plts.uucp (Tom Limoncelli):
> > ....and do *I* have stories to tell about the 'con! :-)
> 
> well, will someone kindly put their fingers to the keyboard and
> tell us some stories?  here it is Wed, and not a peep...
> 
> [although i did hear about a certain, ummm cacophonous, member
> of soc.motss doing his impersonation of a, ummmm cachalot...
> that ought to be cryptic enough, but just so the perpetrator
> of slutdom knows who i'm talking about -- "The Orgasm Heard
> Around The World", next on Oprah...]
> -- 
> Jason Coughlin ( jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com )
> Queer Without A Cause!
> "I find myself suddenly in the world, and I recognize that I have one
> right alone: that of demanding human behavior of the other." -- Fanon



---
========================================================================
Howard I. Solomon			|ELECTION '92
Software Support Engineer, SunExpress	|Hold your nose and vote for Bill!
his@east.sun.com			|
=========================================================================

Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: Engineer bashing
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 18:23:18 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.122334.17962@queernet.org> rogerk@queernet.org (Roger B.A. Klorese) writes:

>In article <1992Jul22.213707.23700@amhux2.amherst.edu> twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce) writes:
>
>>Or perhaps they have a strict distribution requirement, the lack of
>>which placed Amherst high on my list of desirable colleges.
>
>Interesting... why?  The delusion that you know what goes into a useful
>educational program better than those nasty ol' professional educators, 
>perhaps?

It was indeed that very delusion.

I'm not ungrateful for it, though.  Not having to work with a
distribution requirement hanging over my head has permitted me to move
out of the sciences and into the humanities at my own pace.  I think
that waiting to study different subjects until I felt interested
enough to do so has been much more conducive to actual LEARNING than
signing up for a course simply to appease the requirement.

Sometimes I wish we (as a society) placed more emphasis on continuing
education programs, and less on undergraduate degrees and major
programs.  I agree that it's pretty ridiculous to trust a
nineteen-year-old to construct an educational curriculum for himself,
but I honestly don't trust the old fogeys (hi, Jess) in the Dean's
office to do that task well, either.  Am I just being short-sighted?

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "You mean there are TWO of you, Pierce?
\  / twpierce@amherst.edu      /  God help us all."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Major Charles Emerson Winchester III
From: larry@bradley.bradley.edu (Larry D. Stratton)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: G/L Youth Suicide
Date: 21 Jul 92 15:16:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: bradley.1992Jul21.151624.24463
Organization: Bradley University

In <1992Jul21.062731.11372@unlinfo.unl.edu> cbe@unlinfo.unl.edu (cbe) writes:
>The problem of adult GLBs counseling and interacting with queer teens 
>has been mentioned because of being open to charges of recruiting.
>A not deeply considered but nevertheless potentially viable
>solution: Lesbian and Bi females counsel queer males and Adult Queer 
>and Bi males counsel lesbians and Bi females.  Not ideal, but hey, 
>maybe it will help all GLB folks develop closer ties in time.
>Also, the rather isolated town of Burwell, NE (pop. about 1500)
>has had three teen male suicides in recent months.  As usual, every 
>possibility is considered except the obvious......
>Sigh....
>Colburn Eigen                             H|u> = E|u>

   Here in Peoria, Illinois we have had the CrisisLine and Teen-Line
   for quite a few years (1964).  The biggest problem is to find
   volunteers for the C/L T/L who are not phobic.  The lack of 
   counseling facilities is a problem.  I work specifically with
   GBLs and there isn't a hell of a lot out there for counseling.
   The local Human Services Center is notoriously homophobic and
   the waiting time is 6+ weeks to even get in.  Obviously, Catholic
   Social Services and Lutheran Social Services are no help.

   In lieu of this, I have been sending kids to PFLAG, the University
   and local community college counseling services, the Unitarian and
   MCC churches (our MCC is very conservative), Unity Church and various
   individuals who are empathetic.  Since I work the line under a 
   psudonym, the callers don't know who they are talking with and I 
   have very little direct contact with the callers. (I recognize
   voices, situations and names and it makes it difficult when placed
   in a social situation with those clients.)  

   If you want to do something within the gay community, try to get
   some counseling services started that are free and anonymous for
   the kids.  I find Colburn's suggestion workable to avoid any 
   conflict.  And, for god(dess) sake, be sure that the people doing
   the counseling have had some training and are trustworthy.  You
   can blow the whole thing with one incident or accusation of seduction.
From: kimpl@soda.berkeley.edu (peter lee kim)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: it's a plot
Date: 28 Jul 1992 04:17:08 GMT
Organization: U.C. Berkeley, CS Undergraduate Association
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
Keywords: plot

words i read at work everyday.  it amused me when i finally made the list.
it's must be some plot...

ball
body
cock
coupling
cruise
head
load
lubricant
member
nipple
nut
orifice
rear
rod
screw
shackle
shaft
strap
strip
stud
tie
tool

peter li'ir key
(soon to be anyhow ;)
kimpl@soda.berkeley.edu
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: There was this sign in the window...
Date: 22 Jul 92 03:58:31 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Jul22.035831.10755
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1992Jul22.013626.14792@spdcc.com> dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:
>>>I think the notion that these morons got propositioned by anyone at
>>>the march is as likely as Frank Rizzo being reincarnated as a drag queen.

>>Steve, but do you know anything about the specific case?
>>I ask, because your dismissal of their claims of being sexually
>>harassed sounds an *awful* lot like the way women's claims of being
>>sexually harassed or raped are frequently ignored.

>There's a big difference: they're not women, and the situation is
>not symmetrical.

You still haven't explained why you think that they weren't sexually
harassed.

I understand that putting a sign that says "We're straight" in the
window is obnoxious. And I could definitely see that *if* some men had
been running around with a "we're straight" sign, then they'd be
taunted.

But I can just as easily see some hunky ambulance workers getting
propositioned by raucous parade attendees. Why? Because I've seen it
happen, not specifically to ambulance workers but to police, food
vendors, etc.

This still doesn't justify doing something as stupid as advertising
"we're straight" to a gay pride parade, but I really don't see why
this chain of events is so unlikely.

>>Do you know something beyond the general description of the situation
>>that was given?
>It's called experience, young fellator.

you were there? 

(thanks for the compliment, btw.. wouldn't you love porn movies that
said "fellate my phallus" instead of "suck my cock"?)

>(We can duke this out this coming weekend...)

and I can meet my complement.
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/     In a totally sane society, madness is the only freedom
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: manz@ee.ualberta.ca (Brett {Druid Queen} Manz)
Subject: Re: the new innocent
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 08:06:14 GMT

In <1992Jul29.055526.4911@menudo.uh.edu> elee74l@Rosie.UH.EDU writes:

>In article <1992Jul29.053127.26318@wam.umd.edu>, jns@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:
>>      According to the results of a 1991 study by
>>   the Maryland Campus AIDS Research Effort, 21%

>>I was shocked to see that so many had reported
>>having *heterosexual* Gay Sex [tm], not to mention
>>their unbridled promiscuity.

>The article you read is only based on the 3394 students who are WILLING to
>volunteer for this survey.  In which means, there is a failure in random
>simpling.  So there is no need to be shocked.

>By the way, the article says "heterosexual anal intercourse", doesn't it
>mean male's penis inserts into female's anal?  So where did you get this
>"heterosexual *GAY* Sex" idea???

Anal intercourse has generally been attributed as a Gay sexual practice.  That's
where J.N. `got this idea from.'

>Well.... I guess it can mean female brings over a fake penis and insert into
>male's anal, but that's HIGHLY unusual.

You think so?  I don't.  I know quite a few straight men who like that
sort of thing.

>>When some of these people develop AIDS, how long
>>will it take to transform them into 'innocent'
>>victims?
>>
>What do you mean?  I assume your definition of 'innocent' victims are the ones
>who are HIV negative.
>One doesn't have to have AIDS developed to transmit the decease.
>As long as one who is HIV positive, he can transmit decease to anyone by 
>sexual intercourse or by blood transfer at anytime.

Can you say `sarcasm?' 
-- 
---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
 My opinions are my own.         |  You can't be proud of who you are
 The truth belongs to everyone.  |  if you're ashamed of what you are.
 Civil Rights Are For Queers!    |  Cruise Men, Not Missiles! - anon
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: all you fags out there!!!!
Keywords: who wants a date!!!!
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 07:35:58 GMT

In article <24914@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM> rcw@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM (Robert White) writes:

>In article <1992Jul23.142131.24841@seq.uncwil.edu> harrist@seq.uncwil.edu (Trey Harris) writes:
>
>[crap deleted]
>
>This is quite obviously a forged article, and a poor one at that.
>The address given for Trey in this post is also incorrect. 

Really??  One of the best forgeries I ever saw, then.  My mail
response even got to Trey -- now how they arranged for THAT I'll never
imagine.  Nor will I understand how they managed to forge a talk
session between himself and me.

>Just FYI.

Thanks!

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "You mean there are TWO of you, Pierce?
\  / twpierce@amherst.edu      /  God help us all."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Major Charles Emerson Winchester III
Newsgroups: soc.motss,rec.martial-arts
From: Paul.Elkins@bbs.oit.unc.edu (Paul Elkins)
Subject: Hard & soft ?
Organization: Extended Bulletin Board Service
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 14:00:16 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.192522.13496@> cuzz@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
[snip snip]
>The other is a shodan in Kajukenbo kung fu.

This is a very curious combination.  Kajukenbo (very hard) and Kung fu
(typically soft).  Of course my Hsing-I head instructor was/is a student of
Emperado (one of the founders of Kajukenbo).  It just seems odd to me.

What is the net.thought on combining such dissimilar arts?


(Or am I misreading this entirely; where Kajukenbo kung fu, just means to
practice/do Kajukenbo very well).


		-Monta

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: lfoard@Turing.ORG (Lawrence C. Foard)
Subject: Re: HIV- cases of full blown AIDS?
Organization: The Turing Project, Charlottesville Virginia.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 14:51:06 GMT

In article <2a75a785-41be.21soc.motss-1@vpnet.chi.il.us> akcs.justice@vpnet.chi.il.us (Yuri Keegstra) writes:
>Two: I have some real doubts concerning the HIV tests.  I regularly test
>positive on the initial test.  My Western blots have always (with one
>exception) come back negative.  One of the W. blots was positive.  I
>have, however, been assured that I am HIV negative.
> 
>Ever wonder whats going on?

I've heard a few other accounts of things like this, I have also seen
reports on sci.med.aids that there can be a reaction to HIV present
in people who where exposed but not infected. Unfortunitly my knowledge
of medicine isn't that terrific so I'm not sure if this reaction could
result in a positive test, I had the impression that it would not.

-- 
>>Unix/C Contract worker available 5 years C/unix work experience<<  ______
Available for Telecommuting/Travel and contracts on the T Line       \    /
in the Boston MA area. Send me e-mail for a copy of my Resume.        \  /
       -- VWIS 508-793-9568 (2400 baud), Linux support BBS.--          \/
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: "Reverse" discrimination by NAGAAA
Keywords: Discrimination, NAGAAA
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 16:01:37 GMT

In article <1674@aviary.Stars.Reston.Unisys.COM> stine@Stars.Reston.Unisys.COM (John P. Stine) writes:
>In article <1992Jul28.044049.8144@midway.uchicago.edu> rivk@midway.uchicago.edu writes:
>>In article <1672@aviary.Stars.Reston.Unisys.COM> stine@stars.reston.unisys.com (John P. Stine) writes:
>>>One of NAGAAA's bylaws states that heterosexual individuals may
>>>not participate in NAGAAA events.
>>How could they tell? Maybe straights could try their hand at 'passing'.
>>What about bisexuals; are we allowed? Just curious...
>
>Indeed, one straight player just signed the form as "bisexual" to
>avoid the problem.

They could also sign the forms as "gay."  Or "lesbian," if female.

My personal take on this is that the sort of straight person who wants
to participate in and be strongly associated with a gay organization
of this type is welcome as far as I am concerned.  I agree that
gay-male-only, lesbian-only, bisexual-only spaces, or any combination
of the three, can be very rewarding as well, but I'm not sure that the
entire organization needs to exclude heterosexuals as a rule to
accomplish this.

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "You mean there are TWO of you, Pierce?
\  / twpierce@amherst.edu      /  God help us all."
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Major Charles Emerson Winchester III
From: stevenso@Apple.COM (David Stevenson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: RFD: Still in print?
Date: 29 Jul 92 21:40:52 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

kgdykes@thinkage.on.ca (Ken Dykes) guesses:
>>
>>(Perhaps Steve just did too much LDS in the '60s. ;-)
>                                  ^^^ Long Distance Sex ??
                                   ^^^ Long Dong Silver ???
From: booter@Autodesk.COM (Elaine Richards)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Hey, who invited *you* in here? :-)(Re: The sexiest man on TV
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:34:56 GMT
Organization: Autodesk, Inc., Sausalito, CA

In article <1992Jul21.191241.14212@watson.ibm.com> jakec@ralvmm.vnet.ibm.com (Jake Coughlin) writes:
>
>umm, i didn't say that "someone is an idiot because they're straight."
>i said that someone is an idiot if they tell us they're straight in a
>space considered to be ours.  it's offensive, and i demand more human
>behavior from you.  got it?


I guess I am not behaving "human", then. I have been invited into gay
space, welcomed back into gay space, and asked to bring a covered dish
and a six-pack into gay space.

I refuse to be lumped into a box labeled "NOT WELCOME" simply because
my appreciation for Alison Bechtel cartoons is on a tourist rather
than resident level.


ER
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't know when it was that I scratched Fate's car door, but I should have
left a note. --Tim Mefford
From: jfh@netcom.com (Jack Hamilton)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Snow (not much motss relevance)
Date: 22 Jul 92 05:09:25 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1992Jul20.105518.1@admin.usask.ca> broughton@admin.usask.ca writes:
>In article <4f=m9qh.jfh@netcom.com>, jfh@netcom.com (Jack Hamilton) writes:
>> 
>> Why do you think I put "eskimos" in quotes?
>
>Because it wasn't the word you wanted to use?

As someone else pointed out, it's a literary device.

>I guess it is okay then to talk about 'negros' and 'redmen' as long as I put
>quotes around the words.

In some circumstances, yes.  

>Quotes make anything correct, I guess. :-)

I didn't quote enough.  The excerpt I posted was from a longer article
about a book entitled something like "The Myth of Eskimo Languages";
I guess it was too much to expect you to figure out that I was using
quote marks because I was quoting. 


-- 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Hamilton   jfh@netcom.com   P. O. Box 281107   SF, CA   94128-1107
Xref: sparky soc.motss:32682 rec.arts.tv:15466 rec.arts.tv.uk:4542 soc.bi:9626