HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: kayvan@satyr.Sylvan.COM (Kayvan Sylvan)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Homebirth vs. Hospital birth
Date: 30 Dec 92 06:36:58 GMT
	<1992Dec29.152459.2260@mis.mi04.zds.com>
Organization: Sylvan Associates

In article <1992Dec29.152459.2260@mis.mi04.zds.com> ryonkers@mis.mi04.zds.com (Russell Yonkers) writes:

   Finally,  The most important thing to remember is that the parents have to 
   feel comfortable with the home birth decision.  It is not right for 
   everyone.  If you feel more comfortable going to a hospital then by all
   means do so.  Home birth means in part taking partial responsibility for
   ones health care and the decisions involved in the same and not relying 
   completely on the health care establishment to take care of us.

Very well said.

For the record (as if everyone doesn't already know :-)), Katherine
and Robin were both home births.

Hey Russell, why don't you post your list of references. I'm sure that
there are people who are interested in them.

			---Kayvan
-- 
| Kayvan Sylvan, Sylvan Associates, kayvan@satyr.Sylvan.COM, (408) 978-1407  |
| Consulting, Training, Development, SysAdmin, {BSD,SVr3,SVr4} Unix Systems  |
| "Think Globally, Act Locally." "Only you can make your dreams come true."  |
| Proud Dad of Katherine Yelena (born 8/8/89) & Robin Gregory (born 2/28/92) |
Date: Wednesday, 23 December 1992 12:15:28 MST
X-Mailer: TMail version 1.15R
From: "D. C. Sessions" <dcs@witsend.tnet.com>
Organization: Nobody but me -- really
Subject: Re: A few facts about circumcision
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Distribution: world

In <1992Dec23.035144.26011@cbnewsk.cb.att.com>, noraa@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (aaron.l.hoffmeyer)  wrote:
# "The operation can cause serious damage and creates a substantial
# unnecessary risk of infection.  Many children have lost their penises as
# a result of such complications.  My own brother, who is now 16, had
# serious problems up to age six as a result of his circumcision.  He kept
# getting infections as a result of a small miscalculation on the part of
# the doctor performing the circumcision.  The tip of the glans of his
# penis had been burned and scar tissue kept forming--blocking the ureter.
                 ^^^^^^

  BURNED?  Sheesh!  What did the M(oron)D(ingbat) use, a
  fireplace poker?  Seems like every clown with a few years of
  school becomes an instant expert on The Only Possible Right
  Way to Do Everything.

  Take a hint: if the bozo who cauterized a circ could keep his
  ticket (and he could; there are jerks out there who cruise
  through lots worse), then just imagine what can happen with
  some of the OTHER procedures they do.

  As for the other horror stories, they are mostly unsupportable
  generalizations.  By all means leave your kids intact; but if
  you expect us to respect your choice you'd best start by
  respecting ours.

--- D. C. Sessions                            Speaking for myself ---
--- Note new network address:                dcs@witsend.tnet.com ---
--- Author (and everything else!) of TMail  (DOS mail/news shell) ---
From: krages@ohsu.edu
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Baby Stuff: What are the Essentials?
Date: 21 Dec 92 00:44:31 GMT
Article-I.D.: ohsu.1992Dec21.004431.20564
Organization: BICC - Oregon Health Sciences Univ

Thanks so much to everyone who responded to my inquiry about what baby
furniture/paraphenalia/stuff is really needed for an infant.  I've never gotten
so much e-mail, and I've been so busy at work that I haven't had a chance to
read all of it yet.

From what I've read it sounds as if:

A bouncy infant seat is very desirable/necessary.

A baby swing is definitely necessary (I have found one that I can borrow).

A bssinet is nice but you can do without one.  But only a few people have tried
the baby in a drawer trick.

For the most part a playpen is useful, although some people found that it
wasn't really used.  It can hold toys if nothing else.  If one is buying a
portacrib/playpen, Graco is much better than Fisher-Price.

Many people just put the baby down on the floor on a quilt or blanket.  I don't
think that will work for me with the three dogs (one who is very hyper).

So I'm thinking that a bouncy infant seat and a playpen/portacrib are the
things I still need to get.  I will probably try to get them before the baby is
born since I love to shop and my husband doesn't.

Anyway, I really appreciate all the responses.  If I get a chance I might try
to summarize more of the postings.  But you may read my birth
announcement/story first at the rate I'm going.


Kathryn Pyle Krages
Oregon Health Sciences University
Portland, OR 97201
krages@ohsu.edu
3 weeks to go! And still overloaded at work.
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: tommy@hilbert.att.com (Tom Reingold)
Subject: Re: Stop Grabbing Your Penis!
Reply-To: tommy@boole.att.com
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Holmdel, NJ, USA
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:02:23 GMT

I don't tell my daughter not to play with her vagina.  That would tell
her it's a bad thing to do.  Instead, I tell her that if she wants to
do it, she should do it alone, so I usually suggest that she goes to
her room.  She either goes or stops.
-- 
Tom Reingold
AT&T Bell Labs, Holmdel, NJ
tommy@boole.att.com or att!boole!tommy
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: elise@ticipa.pac.sc.ti.com (Elise Wade)
Subject: Re: "Private Time" with the Kids
Organization: Texas Instruments
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 22:46:58 GMT

In article <2719@tredysvr.Tredydev.Unisys.COM> sg@tredysvr.Tredydev.Unisys.COM (Susanne Gilliam) writes:
>In article <1992Dec19.223538.14230@umiami.ir.miami.edu> ahelmers@umiami.ir.miami.edu writes:
>>In article <85551@ut-emx.uucp>, wiebe@ut-emx.uucp (Anne Hill Wiebe) writes:
>>
>>> (BTW:  where are these
>>> children who actually sleep 12 hours out of 24, that the baby
>>> books talk about???  Mine won't nap at daycare and sleeps about
>>> 8-9 hours at home.)
>>
>>Well, two of them are living at my house...my son will be 4 next month.  He
[...]
>>
>>The "secret"?  Probably partly constitutional but both my children are
>>*EXTREMELY* active.  I always suspect that if you run a kid enough you will get
>>a lot better sleep.  This is my own personal theory, but I know that mine are
>>constantly on the move, not very into television, and extremely physical. 
>>They're just tuckered out :).  The other thing is we keep a pretty firm
>>schedule.  But then again, that just follows from them being tired.  If they
>>weren't it wouldn't make much sense to force 'em into bed.
>>
>>Ann Helmers
>
>  Well, two of them live at my house too, and I have to say that I can't
>concur with Ann's conclusion that activity leads to good sleep habits.
>My daughter (2 years, 9 months) is a very high energy kid, and sleeps
>about 7:30-7, and takes roughly a 2 hour nap in the afternoons.  On the
>other hand, my son (5 years, 11 months) is, and has always been, physically
>very inactive; all the action is either inside his head, or in fine
>motor control type activities.  He enjoys running around and whooping it
>up with other kids or adults, but he doesn't *require* it the way she
>does, and left on his own, he will always gravitate towards quiet activities.
>He sleeps 8-7, and takes a 2 hour nap at home.  He finally gave up 
>weekday naps when he went to kindergarten this fall, but he always naps
>well and deeply at home.        
>  So this shoots a hole in the "activity counts" theory.  Now maybe he is
>
[...]
>						Susanne Gilliam
> 
>

Naw, I don't think activity is a determining factor.  Both of my kida
are *very* active!  The 4.5 year old needs about 8 hours of sleep, which
-- if we are lucky --  she'll do 9:30pm to 6:30am.  (She's a budding night
owl just like her daddy.) She's also pretty much given up naps.  She 
can function relatively well on as little as 6 hours sleep if things
are really exciting.  (I wish I could do as well.)  The 7 month old 
sleeps just like the books say babies should -- zonked about 9pm to 7am
and a two hour nap in the morning and evening.  I don't think the
4.5 year old *ever* slept that much.  

They are just different people.

Elise.


Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: Theresa Jarosz Alberti <sapphire@wings.micro.umn.edu>
Subject: Premie Smiling
X-Xxdate: Mon, 21 Dec 92 10:21:14 GMT
Organization: Authors with Twins
X-Useragent: Nuntius v1.1.1d7
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 21:57:33 GMT

This didn't work the first time I tried it, so we'll give it another
shot--

In article <72065@cup.portal.com> Carol F Topp, ctopp@cup.portal.com
writes:
>My daughter is now 9 weeks old. She  was born at 35+ weeks gestation.
>It seems her development is a mixed bag at this point. She has some
>head control, follows objects, and focuses on faces, but no smiles
>yet. 
>
>What were the experiences of other parents of premies in terms
>of development. Did you need to use an adjusted age? In general,
>I don't think about her  early entrance, but with one key milestone
>being so late, I'm beginning to wonder.

My twins were born at 31+ weeks and did not smile til they were 4-5
months old.  We found it much less frustrating to consider they were
actually only 2-3 months old gestationally.  

It's hard not to worry when babies aren't up to "normal"  progression,
but it may help to not compare your baby to others.  Your baby WILL
smile, sit up, crawl, etc., all in her own good time.  All babies are
different.  Do consider the gestational age of your baby if it will help
you worry less.

Our twins are now 16 months old.  They walked a little later than the
tables suggest, but now they walk fabulously all the time.  I remember
being a little concerned that they weren't walking as early as some of
our friends' babies, but now I think I was silly to worry when I watch
them run and dance!  

Unless it's an extreme case,  your baby won't be 7 years old and not
smiling yet!

--Theresa Jarosz Alberti
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: slg@slgsun.att.com (The Idealistic Cynic)
Subject: Re: "my wife and I are pregnant", revisited
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Columbus, Ohio
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 17:13:49 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.151651.13614@afterlife.ncsc.mil> adculha@afterlife.ncsc.mil (Andrew Culhane) writes:
>Disclaimer: I DIDN'T say "we're pregnant" when my wife was pregnant.  I'm too
>picky about the English language, I guess.
>
>Claimer: Most of my friends, acquaintances, health care professionals, and
>downright strangers were much more determined to downplay my role in the
>pregnancy than my wife and I were.  I went with my wife to all of here
>pregnancy checkups, and I was always the only man in the office (except
>for one of the obstetricians).  The (female) receptionists, nurses, and
>doctors ignored me or talked around me to my wife.  The sole male partner
>of the practice was the only one who appeared to believe that the father-
>to-be might have reason to be included in the discussions.  At the hospital
>after my son was born, the nurses trained my wife in detail on changing
>diapers etc. and ignored me.

What he said!

My wife and I registered for three classes during her pregnancy, and
for two hospital tours.  In all five cases *I* made the phone calls
and *I* wrote the checks and paid the bills.  (No reasons other than
I was the one who had the time.)

Invariably, we were registered under my wife's name, and what really
irritated me:  When we canceled one of the classes, even though I
had written the check, the refund was made out to her.

*Everything* was in her name, regardless of which one of us talked to
the person involved -- even in the more liberal places, and even when
it was for information only!  If I called asking for information, they
wanted my wife's name.  Every time.  Seriously -- in not a single case
involved with the pregnancy did anything I requested or registered for
stay in my name; they *always* requested my wife's name and we were
registered by her name.

I won't say the nurses in the hospital ignored me, but they certainly
didn't assume I would be taking care of our newborn until we explicitly
told them I would.  Even then, I don't believe I got any training in
diapering or anything like that.  Certainly none was offered.

Ridiculas.  Sheesh.

Sean.

---
Sean L. Gilley
sean.l.gilley@att.com sgilley@cbnewsl[.cb].att.com
614 236 5031 (h), 614 860 5743 (w)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: cooper@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Lynette Cooper)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: High chair recommendations
Date: 28 Dec 92 19:14:31 GMT
Reply-To: cooper@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Lynette Cooper)
Organization: Carderock Division, NSWC, Bethesda, MD


My MIL bought us a perego high chair.  It's more expensive than most
but I can't remember how much exactly.  I LOVED it!  It is on wheels
so I could just roll Melissa over to the sink, or into another room.
If you have a small kitchen, and the chair has to sit in the way of
something, you can just roll it out of the way when you need to get
there.  Also, I would roll the chair around in circles with Melissa
in it (yes, I have a big kitchen :-))... boy did she love that.

Also, the chair height was adjustable.  This came in handy when we wanted
her at the table.  We just removed the tray, lowered the chair, and
rolled her up to the table.

And finally, the chair is detachable from the stand.  So you have a
portable high chair.  I used this when we would eat in the backyard
on our picnic table.  I just detached the chair (easy) and sat it on
the table.  It also came in handy when she started crawling, because
I would remove the tray and put the chair on the floor and it was like
her own little chair that she could get into herself.

Gosh I sound like a commercial for perego!  Well it was a great high
chair to use.  Although it's on wheels, it's quite sturdy.  The only
thing I didn't like is that it takes 2 hands to move the tray, but maybe
they've changed that by now.

Lynn Cooper (mom to Melissa 24 mo)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren)
Subject: Re: Hormonally Enhanced
Organization: Test Systems Strategies, Inc., Beaverton, Oregon
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:44:12 GMT

foster@atmosmips.jpl.nasa.gov (Julie Foster) writes:

> 

>>>But Jerry learned to quickly click the remote when McDonald's commercials
>>>came on (I was newly pregnant during the holidays).....a typical holiday
>>>McDonald's commercial would set me to sniveling, boohooing or outright
>>>sobbing without fail.
>>>
>>Well, does anyone else find that just having kids around makes you
>>more prone to being moved by tearjerking movies? I've always
>>been emotional, but it seems that since I have become a mother,
>>I cry more easily at movies and commercials and some books (if
>>you really want a good cry try 'Love You Forever', forget the
>>author right now).
>>                        Patti Twigg

>I'm really bad.  I was crying after the McDonald's commercials even before
>I thought about becoming a mom.    Now, I have to keep tissues handy 
>where ever I go (I usually blame my red eyes and running nose on allergies :).
>I was sobbing in my car on my way home from work after I heard a news
>report about a mother dog and her newborn puppies being removed from the
>center divider of a local freeway.   (I'm even sniffling now as I write this).


My wife is even more emotional than ever during her pregnancy, although her
emotions involving children and families were incredibly enhanced after our first
son was born.  Now, with a third one under construction, she gets pretty teary-eyed
at, seemingly, the drop of a hat, but I notice that I too share in her concerns.

A neighbor, aged 31, died two weeks ago in a winter weater-related accident,
leaving a wife and two boys under the age of 3 behind.  Financially, the family
is incredibly well off, but of course my wife and I both started sobbing when we
heard of the misfortune because we thought, what if that had been one of us who
had died, leaving the spouse and children?  Then I thought about how my mother
died when I was 2.5 and how I wasn't really affected in terms of grieving for her
because I can't remember her.  Anyway, the misfortunes of children and their families
really brings out the tears.

allen
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: kgatling@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Keith E Gatling)
Subject: Re: The Chimney Song
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 92 20:40:16 EST

In article <1660@dcsc.dla.mil> czo84228@dcsc.dla.mil (Kevin L. Wright) writes:
>There's a novelty Christmas song that starts:
>
>"There's somethin' stuck up in the chimney,
>and I don't know what it is...."
>
>It's sung by a little girl (or someone imitating a girl).
>
>Who recorded it?  It's a cute song that gets trotted out on radio stations
>in my city every Christmas.
>
>Kevin 

It's on a CD called "Twisted Christmas" by the Bob Rivers Comedy Corp.  If
you see a copy, snatch it up quick, because one of my contacts in a local
record store told me that it's been discontinued (although they could be
wrong, since I saw 9 million copies in a different store later that week).

It also contains one of my favorite versions of the 12 Days of Christmas.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Keith E Gatling                                  kgatling@mailbox.syr.edu *
*          Opinions?  I've got plenty of them.  Just ask my wife!           *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: allen@tessi.com (Allen Warren)
Subject: Re: Is my baby eating too much?
Organization: Test Systems Strategies, Inc., Beaverton, Oregon
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 18:35:13 GMT

We have two little boys and they have had VERY healthy appetites
ever since they were born, although the appetites have come and
gone, leading us to believe in "growth spurts".  My wife breast-fed
both boys until about 16-17 months, along with regular food after
a few months (the breast-feeding, after a few months, was done
almost exclusively at nighttime and briefly upon awakening in the
morning).  We don't have "junk" food in our house, don't eat red
meat, and DO have lots of veggies, fruit, turkey, chicken, fish,
healthy-type crackers, *some* candy, etc.  We watch our sodium
intake and fat intake and our boys are both in the 90 percentile
for height and 75 percentile for weight for their ages, although I'm
wondering how many years ago these tables were tabulated.  Still,
our pediatrician thinks the boys are exceptionally healthy, even 
though they are subject to the usual random ear infection, cold, etc.

allen
From: dxf12@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas Fowler)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Cute things they say
Date: 3 Jan 1993 16:16:20 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: dxf12@po.CWRU.Edu (Douglas Fowler)
NNTP-Posting-Host: thor.ins.cwru.edu


     Overheard in the furniture section of a department store:  A girl,
around 4 or 5, said to her younger brother:  "Now, we have to behave in
this part, because there are lots of chairs Mommy can make us sit in if
we're naughty."
     In the clothing section, on the other hand...:-)
-- 
Doug Fowler: dxf12@po.CWRU.edu  : Me, age 4 & now: "Mommys and Daddys & other
    Ever wonder if, after Casey : relatives have to give lots of hugs & love
missed the 3rd strike in the poem: & support, 'cause Heaven is just a great
he ran to first and made it?     : big hug that lasts forever and ever!!!"
From: brighid@hern.stonemarche.org
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: "my wife and I are pregnant", revisited
Date: 20 Dec 92 02:58:37 GMT
Organization: Hern the Hunter, Stonemarche (NH)

In article <1gqtnhINN95@crcnis1.unl.edu>, hide@unlinfo.unl.edu (harry ide) writes:

> 
> Men's declaring themselves pregnant does involve a shift in the 
> meaning of `pregnant'. Most people who've posted in favor of that 
> shift have in effect (I think) argued in favor of it as representing 
> the shift in men's attitudes toward children--a shift of which Dena 
> obviously approves, given her comments. 

Data point here: Just checked with Andre to confirm what I suspected.
He concurs that what he thinks about has changed quite a bit, and he's
certainly had to modify some lifestyle aspects. (Making certain that
I eat at regular intervals, etc. (I'll space details like that.) )

-- 
Brighid				Mom-to-be, 5/15/93
brighid@hern.stonemarche.org
From: oispeggy@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Peggy Brown)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Stop Grabbing Your Penis!
Date: 21 Dec 92 13:50:00 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Dec21.130545.9359@cbnews.cb.att.com>, ran@cbnews.cb.att.com (Robert A. Neinast) writes...
> 
> 
>I tried asking him once *why* he was grabbing his penis, and he
>said, "Because it makes it bigger".  Uh, well, yes, I suppose it does.
> 
>Does anybody out there have any suggestions on how to curb this
>undesirable behavior (at least in public).


A few thoughts:

What is his motivation for doing this?  

1.) Needs to pee.  (I've noticed other little boys grab it when
    they have to pee.)  

2.) It feels good.
    2A.) Feels good and relieves stress.

3.) He likes the attention.

From what you describe it sounds to me like it started with 
motive #1, but now is done because of #2 and #2A.  Doesn't sound 
like #3 enters into this.

For #1 all you can do is remind him to go potty.  For #2 you 
could explain that its OK to grab it in private, in the 
bathroom or his bedroom, but not in public.  Make a distinction 
between private parts being handled in public = "no-no" but in 
private = "ok."

Since he now does it in stressful situations, it seems like this helps 
him deal with stress.  Maybe introduce some other behaviors that 
he might find reassurring and stress relieving.  Explain he can 
do these new behaviors when nervous, but that private parts are 
only touched in private.  Getting rid of excess energy when he's 
stressed might help, so these behaviors could be:
  1.) Swinging his arms at his sides a few times.
  2.) Giving himself a hug.
  3.) Turning side to side from the waist a few times.

Good luck!

- Peggy -
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: lauraf@classy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Laura Floom)
Subject: Re: Summary: Fine Art of Introducing Solids
Keywords: infant feeding
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 22:36:40 GMT

In article <1992Dec28.212205.8663@cgrg.ohio-state.edu> ashley@osc.edu (Ashley Burns) writes:
>rice and dry oatmeal cereal), but now he submits to canned rice cereal
>with fruit. That's a big no-no in some people's books because it may
>get him accustomed to sweet things. But that's what we're feeding him.

I remember reading that in several books. They suggested that you offer a
veggie first. High on the list of veggies to offer were squash and sweet
potato. So I cooked a squash for Jeffrey as a first veggie and sweet potato
for his second veggie. Both were at least as sweet as the apple sauce I
made him for his first fruit! I wouldnt worry about it.

Laura Floom