HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: clc@kepler.unh.edu (Llamist Lliason)
Subject: Re: Looking for 2 books: help on author & title needed.
Organization: Holy Church of the Llama
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 14:29:34 GMT

In article <RENE.92Sep29114901@solsort.iesd.auc.dk> rene@iesd.auc.dk (Rene Boe Soerensen) writes:
>
>This weekend a friend of mine and I started to discuss some of the
>fantasy and science-fiction books we have read. I told him of two
>books I have read, of which I couldn't remember the author and the
>title, but only some of the plot. Now I'm hoping that some of you out
>there can help me to find these books again.
>
>The first book was about a second rate actor who gets drafted into
>acting as President/Ambassador/Businessman when this P./A./B. gets
>kidnapped, since he has a striking similarity to this P./A./B. and
>this P./A./B. has to appear before the public. This is done to gain
>time to find the real P./A./B.

Sounds a _lot_ like "Double Star," by Bob Heinlein.

						Christian

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "I like the girls I go out with to have a head on their shoulders." | Wasted|
| "I hate necks."        -- Steve Martin                              | Space |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|  Christian Claiborn, proud owner of over 4,000 individual Amy Grant albums. |
| Maintainer of Snake for kepler@unh.edu, brilliant BNF parser, fun dude.     |
|        Christian@unh.edu/clc@kepler.unh.edu/C_CLAIBORN@unhh.unh.edu         |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: duzan@polaris.cis.udel.edu (Gary D. Duzan)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Robert Jordan's, "Shadow Rising" *SPOILER USAGE*
Date: 3 Oct 92 20:05:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: udel.1992Oct3.200553.29222
Organization: Your Organization Could Be Here!

In article <BvK9tt.uu@acsu.buffalo.edu> pierce@acsu.buffalo.edu (Gregory M. Pierce) writes:
=>
=>Just a quick reminder to those reading Jordan's new book.  Please take pity
=>on those of us who don't want the novel ruined for us by indicating the
=>presence of possible spoilers in the subject line, and by liberally using
=>them CTRL-Ls (or lots of blank lines).
=>
=>It's hard enough to avoid paging through it in the bookstore :-).
=>
   Indeed. You can count on me. Of course, we could always make an
alt.fan.wot.tsr group for it. Personally, I can't stand having a good
story spoiled, especially books like these.

                                        Gary Duzan
                                        Time  Lord
                                    Third Regeneration
                                         Aielman



-- 
                             duzan@cis.udel.edu
   _o_                       ------------------                         _o_
 [|o o|]       Virtual Reality? No thanks, I've already got one.      [|o o|]
  |_O_|       Disclaimer: I have no idea what I am talking about.      |_O_|
From: steyn@cs.rochester.edu (Gavin Steyn)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Recommendations??
Date: 29 Sep 92 23:46:11 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Computer Science Department University of Rochester

In article <1992Sep29.171520.15007@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> cpeckham@nyx.cs.du.edu (Chris Peckham) writes:

>1) Unusual/questioning relationships between _good_ and _evil_

Tanith Lee's _Night's Master_ does an interesting job with this.  (As
do a bunch of her other book, come to think of it--this one just
stands out in my mind).

>2) Loss of innocence/corruption by _evil_

Tons of horror books fall into this category.  _The Shining_ comes to mind,
but I'm not really sure why.  (It wasn't bad, but wasn't great).

>3) Mysticism and ambiguity

What sort of ambiguity?  For that matter, what sort of mysticism?  The
fantasy books employing mysticism are too legion to count.

Gavin Steyn
steyn@cs.rochester.edu
"So he's had the lifelong ambition of reversing the polarity of the earth?"
From: harrity@sumax.seattleu.edu (Zak)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: The Dragon Reborn
Date: 30 Sep 92 01:25:06 GMT
Organization: Seattle University, Seattle WA

In article <1a8svuINNgjf@phakt.usc.edu> rmcgover@phakt.usc.edu (Rob McGovern) writes:
>
>
>Just thought you all might want to know that I've seen both the 
>paperback of The Dragon Reborn and the hardback of The Shadow
>Rising in bookstores around here (Southern California) and I know
>for certian that both are out in New Mexico.  

The yokels up here in Seattle haven't been able to get hold of it yet,
damn them...I told them it's available elsewhere on the West coast, and
even is Western Pennsylvania for god's sake, and I still get this dumb
look and "it's not *due* out till November".  (Sorry to whoever it was
from Pittsburgh, but I have a right to rank on the state...I'm from PA :)

>My father has 
>already acquired The Shadow Rising, but sadly, he is going to 
>read it BEFORE he gives it too me as a LATE birthday present
>(major negative smily face here).  He has said that it is better
>than The Dragon Reborn (so far) and continues an excellent
>series, In His Humble Opinion (IHHO?)  I personally can't wait
>untill he finishes!!!

Just be merciful here on the net when he does, and declare spoilers!  This
discussion has to get full-blown this time....it got cut majorly short
last time.

>Rob McGovern                  rmcgover@aludra.usc.edu

--
Daniel John Kelly-Harrity ---------| |--------- "Sooner spit in a 
Seattle University ----------------| |---------  Wolf's Eye,
Seattle, Washington ---------------| |---------  than cross an
USA 98122 -------------------------| |---------  Aes Sedai."

  "Welcome to All Things Scottish...If it's not Scottish, It's *CRAP*!"
From: hyde@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Piers Plowman
Date: 28 Sep 92 18:46:41 -0300
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

In article <1992Sep28.130352.12024@sei.cmu.edu>, firth@sei.cmu.edu (Robert Firth) writes:
> In article <1992Sep23.165435.7719@ac.dal.ca> hyde@ac.dal.ca writes:
> 
>>       "Rings of Ice" also dates from this time.  As a novel
>>	it beats his current stuff, though the science in it is of
>>	a drivelous level to put Velikovsky to shame.
> 
> True, but that's part of the joke.  The story is set in a universe
> based on the Welteislehre of Hans Hoerbiger.  The immediate precursor
> of the novel (there, I said it without uttering the ugly word
> "plagiarism") seems to be "Moons, Myths and Man", by Bellamy.


	Judging by the afterword anthony allowed to be printed,
	I'm far from sure that anthony intended this as a joke.

	I have never seen in any of his works that anthony
	has any sense of what science is, but rather he tends
	to puff pseudo-science in many of his works.

	Lack of science is not a problem (as I say, I greatly
	admire Chthon, which is about as science-free as an
	sf novel can get), but Anthony seems to subscribe to
	the great "Satanic scientist conspiracy" theory.



						Bill Hyde
Department of Oceanography
Dalhousie University,
Halifax, Nova Scotia
hyde@ac.dal.ca or hyde@dalac
From: michaelb@cse.fau.edu (Michael Rogero Brown)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: ALT.PULP FAQ List
Date: 29 Sep 92 15:07:37 GMT
Organization: Florida Atlantic University, Boca Raton, FL, USA

In article <Art_Beyersdorfer.03cv@edtng.Kenosha.WI.US> Art_Beyersdorfer@edtng.Kenosha.WI.US (Art Beyersdorfer) writes:
>In a message dated Tue 22 Sep 92 15:21, Michaelb@cse.fau.edu (michael Roger
>wrote:
>
>
> MR> Q: Have there been attempts to do new pulp-style hero characters?
>
> MR> A: There have been a few attempts at doing original pulp-style
> MR> characters in
> MR> books, comics, and movies with limited success.  Ones I am aware of
> MR> are:
> MR> (NOTE: These are original characters, not adaptations of classic pulp
> MR> 
> MR>  characters.  This rules out stuff like Conan movies, Doc comics,
> MR> etc.)
>
>
> MR>   COMICS:   Agent 13(TSR) graphic novel & comic based on pulp-style
> MR> books.
>
> MR>             Wordsmith(Renegade) series deals with a writer of pulp
> MR>              heroes.  This 12-issue series has been collected in a
> MR> trade
> MR>              paperback by Caliber. 
> MR>              There is a 'companion' series called _Heroes from
> MR> Wordsmith_
> MR>              dealing with the pulp characters.  Only one issue has
> MR> appeared
> MR>              so far (from Special Studio).
    
>the type you are refering to here.  It has been almost five years since I
>have even casually followed the comic industry, but, I followed it VERY
>seriously for about 3 years (I came this close --> <-- to acquireing a
>first printing of TMNT #1), and I know the Wordsmith title.  It might be
>worth your time to pick up overstreets, and see what's listed.
>
>I am certain that the Ms. Tree comic falls in your genre.  It's written by
>the same person that writes Dick Tracy (now) for the daily and sunday comic
>strips.  There is typically a Mike Mist story in each issue of the comic. 
>According to my records, it is still published by Renegade press (but, my
>records are five years old <g>).
>

I am a heavy comics collector.  There are only 12 issues of Wordsmith.  In
the 12th issue they even SAID that they where ending the series.  I do not
know of anyone else picking it up.  I checked Overstreet.  They do not list
Wordsmith.  Not supprising as they are poor on b/w titles.

I'm familiar with Ms Tree, but she would be a continuation of the detective 
pulps, not the hero pulps.  There's a fine line dividing them.  Renegade hasn't
published it in a few years.  Its now a quarterly published by DC.

-- 
<<                                                               >>
<< Michael R. Brown    CS Graduate Student-Florida Atlantic Univ >>
<< Internet: michaelb@sol.cse.fau.edu                            >>
<< BitNet: m_brown@fauvax                                        >>
From: bruce@uxb.liv.ac.uk (Bruce Stephens)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Interzone
Date: 6 Oct 92 17:41:36 GMT
Distribution: uk
Organization: Centre for Mathematical Software Research, Univ. Liverpool, UK

(Distribution set to uk)

>>>>> On 6 Oct 92 09:24:20 GMT, jdng90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Gorsuch JDN) said:

>   Hi, 
>   
>     In several of my paperbacks I can see a reference to a magazine
> called 'Interzone', which I believe is published in Brighton(UK).
> Does anyone out there subscribe to this magazine, and, if so, could 
> you send me current details, as mine are several years old. 
>     Plus send details of the magazine, if you can reccomend it. 

Go along to your local W.H.Smith and buy a copy.  (If they don't have
it, then go to a bigger one or ask them.)  It's readily available in
the bigger magazine shops.

I don't subscribe, I just buy the occasional copy.  I find it to be
very good.
--
Bruce Stephens
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: akerson@deimos.srg.af.mil (Pete Akerson - akerson%srg@uunet.uucp)
Subject: Re: Poughkeepie
Organization: ARINC Research, Corp.
Date: Fri, 02 Oct 92 19:29:00 GMT




ani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) observes:

>...
>but most fantasy settings are far more similar to each 
>other than tenth century Italy was to twelfth century England. 
>...
>Part of the reason Elfland and Poughkeepsie are so mixed up is that
>most of these authors either don't know better or don't care.

Perhaps, also, this author's readership has no clue about mideval
(european) history. Most folks think that it was a romantic time,
not one of mass plagues, crop failures, and forced military service,
where the status of the peasant was 'property of the lord'.
--
Usually Reply-to: akerson%srg@uunet.uucp
Internet: akerson@srg.af.mil@uunet.uucp
Uunet: uunet!srg!akerson
Milnet: akerson@srg.srg.af.mil     maybe ...
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: kless@lindau.inf-wiss.ivp.uni-konstanz.de (Bernhard Kless)
Subject: Fredric Brown
Keywords: Fredric Brown
Organization: Information Science, Univ. of Konstanz
              D-W-7750 Konstanz, Germany
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 13:26:30 GMT

Looking for books or magazines from the sf-author fredric brown. 
Language english or german. 

Please write to:
Nicole Rahm, Zum Keltenring 6, D-W-7570 Baden-Baden, Germany,
Tel.: +49-7221-29656


Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: "Ian Sutherland" <p00117@psilink.com>
Subject: Re: C.J. Cherryh, Women characters in SF
Organization: Key Software, Inc.
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1992 21:49:28 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink (3.2)

In a previous article, hsr@physics.ucla.edu (Harisankar Ramishan) says:

>I think this is also the reason why Cherryh's fantasies never work for me.
>Morgaine was not a woman, she was an icicle. You could only guess at her
>feelings through how she _acted_ towards her follower <forget his name>.

Are you saying you would have been happier if she had talked a lot about 
her feelings?  Really, some people don't do that.  I know several women 
who don't talk about their feelings much.  As for her demonstrating 
warmth, this happens more in the later books, which you might not have 
read if you didn't like the earlier ones. 

>And for me, fantasy requires a delicate treatment of emotional issues if
>it is to be satisfying, wheras SF can get away with good ideas alone.

I find this a curious comment.  Why this dichotomy?  Do you think 
"mainstream" literature requires a delicate treatment of emotional 
issues to be satisfying?

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: msmith@beta.tricity.wsu.edu (Dragon Lord)
Subject: Re: author'n'title...
Organization: Washington State University Tri-Cities, Richland
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 04:28:15 GMT

In article <1992Sep28.213242.21458@newshost.unh.edu> clc@kepler.unh.edu (Llamist Lliason) writes:
>In article <1992Sep28.183203.14991@kth.se> TordM@VanA.PhySto.SE writes:
>>
>> hello! I remember reading a book a long time ago about some dude going to
>>another planet keeping contact with earth. during his going over the surface
>>he heard a voice saying something like "my brains for yours!", and this slime
>>mold thing did something to him. back on earth he was able to transform to
>>some kind of wolf-like creature, and he was hunted. this is all I remember.
>> does any of this ring a bell? does anybody know what book this is??
>>any replies appreciated!
>
>Yeah.  It was called _Foundation._  I think Piers Anthony wrote it.
>

You're supposed to put in a smiley when you're ripping something.. ;)



Bill the Cat for Pres.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: librik@cory.Berkeley.EDU (David Librik)
Subject: Re: Qool LeGuin Essay (was Re: _Winds of Change_ by Mercedes Lackey (no spoilers))
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 00:20:37 GMT

curtis@cs.berkeley.edu (Curtis Yarvin) writes:

>In article <1992Sep25.212853.27437@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> urban@sideshow.jpl.nasa.gov (Michael Urban) writes:
>>
>>Mercedes Lackey can put out a good yarn, pace well, and
>>come up with characters you care about, but it might
>>do her (and the rest of us) a world of good if she would
>>read Ursula LeGuin's essay `From Elfland to Poughkeepsie'.

>Anyone know where I can find this?

Yes -- it's in LeGuin's collection of essays on sf and fantasy, THE LANGUAGE
OF THE NIGHT.  This has been recently reprinted and should be available in
most good bookstores.  In Britain it's published by The Women's Press, so
you might have to check under "Women's Studies" -- though I suspect that,
like everything else she writes, no matter how unrelated to sf it is, it's
shoved in "SCIENCE FICTION" by every unthinking bookstore clerk this side
of the Pecos.

THE LANGUAGE OF THE NIGHT is the best SF criticism I've ever seen.  Better,
certainly, than Darko Suvin; possibly even than Lem -- but the reason is
that LeGuin only writes when she has something to say, and thus it's very
scattershot.  On the other hand, DANCING AT THE EDGE OF THE WORLD, her
second collection of essays, is *dreadful*.  It reads like the product of
too many "guest speaker" appearances at literary conferences and not enough
actual thought.

It's a bit discouraging to see that THE LANGUAGE OF THE NIGHT -- the insightful
essays -- are all products of the '70s, and that almost nothing from the 80's
is very worthwhile.  Worse, she "revised" TLoTN in 1989, to add some commentary
after ten years of reflection; and none of it says anything at all; it's just
that sort of picky pseudo-feminist linguistic reshuffling that gets so boring
so fast.  (The exception is "Is Gender Necessary?: Redux" which is worth
thinking about.)

- David Librik
librik@cory.Berkeley.edu
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: duffey@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Thomas Duffey)
Subject: Re: Gene Wolfe's New Sun stuff
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1992 16:06:25 GMT

dani@netcom.com (Dani Zweig) writes:

>mbowman@andromeda.rutgers.edu (Michael Bowman):
>>...Dorcas is Severian's GRANDmother, not his mother.  He thinks that the 
>>waiter is her son (and hence Severian's father) and that the old man is her 
>>husband (and Severian's grandfather).  His questions was: Who is Severian's 
>>mother?  His answer is that it was the Autarch.

>Nothing reading the book wouldn't cure.  Dorcas is Severian's grandmother.
>She died about forty years earlier, giving birth to Ouen, the waiter.  Ouen
>never married, but did have several lovers.  One of those, Catherine, who was
>given to the torturers, was Severian's mother.  The Autarch was a eunuch.
>Most of the details are brought out near the end of "Citadel of the Autarch".

>-----
>Dani Zweig
>dani@netcom.com

>   God helpe the man so wrapt in Errours endless traine  -- Edmund Spenser


	I agree, but this still leaves the question; where is Severian's mother
in the BotNS?  Almost certainly she appears somewhere.  I wonder if she might
not have been the woman who played Holy Katharine in the torturers' initiation
rite.  Perhaps she was spared death in exchange for playing this role?

	On another note, in Sword of the Lictor, it's implied that Severian
may well have a sister (in the  section where he meets the pioneering family).
Does SHE appear in the book anywhere?  Likely candidates, I'd say, are Merryn
the Cumaean's apprentice, the apprentice witch Severian met on a childhood
errand to the witches' tower, and possibly the Pelerine postulant (Ava?) he
converses with at the lazaret.

Tom Duffey
mebsunll.me.uiuc.edu
From: hughes@dogwood.botany.uga.edu (Wayne Hughes)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: author'n'title...
Date: 28 Sep 92 22:58:48 GMT
Organization: Botany Department - U of Georgia, Athens

In article <1992Sep28.183203.14991@kth.se> TordM@VanA.PhySto.SE writes:
>
> hello! I remember reading a book a long time ago about some dude going to
>another planet keeping contact with earth. during his going over the surface
>he heard a voice saying something like "my brains for yours!", and this slime
>mold thing did something to him. back on earth he was able to transform to
>some kind of wolf-like creature, and he was hunted. this is all I remember.
> does any of this ring a bell? does anybody know what book this is??
>any replies appreciated!
>
    Clifford Simak _The Werewolf Principle_  "Hey pal!  Let's trade
    minds!" or something like that.

    Wayne
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.books
From: spb0457@venus.tamu.edu (SubGenius)
Subject: Re: Science Fiction books with linguistic content
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 01:03:00 GMT

Curtis Yarvin writes...
>SubGenius writes:
>>Now imagine that you're criticising Sam Clemens instead of Russel Hoban:
>>Quoteth Huck:  "What ho, negro?  Hast thou finished thine work?  And a fine
>>job thou dost, verily!"
> 
>Ah, how easy it is, to fall into the flytrap of bogus analogy.
>Someone has tipped the outhouse over on you, SubG.
>Twain (1) used an existing dialect which was known to his readers
>to (2) contrast against the educated southern dialect of the time.

+------------------------------------SubG----------------------------------+
Of course.  Clements was a political commentator using fiction set in his
own day, therefore he used dialects that existed a priori of the writing. 

Hoban is a political commentator using science fiction set in some future
day, therefore he uses a dialect that might exist a postori of the writing.
+------------------------------------SubG----------------------------------+

>[bong...bong...bong...]

[deletia]

+------------------------------------SubG----------------------------------+
No thanks;  I'm trying to cut down.









Yours etc.,




SubGenius
From: "Ian Sutherland" <p00117@psilink.com>
Subject: Re: Science Fiction books with linguistic content
Organization: Key Software, Inc.
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 01:44:38 GMT
X-Mailer: PSILink (3.2)

(Aside:  I do believe we've found the Mikhail Zeleny of the SF groups in 
Curtis Yarvin.  Keep your pH low, Mr. Yarvin! :-)

On the whole, I agree with Mr. Yarvin's evaluation of the "linguistic 
content" of "Riddley Walker".  The main function the dialect served for 
me was to make the book into a sort of puzzle in which I had to figure 
out the information which was obscured by the dialect.  This actually 
increased the interest of the book for me, but many people might find it 
annoying and silly, and I wouldn't blame them.

Mr. Yarvin writes:

=A cynic would call it point in itself; would say that elsewise
=such a novel might easily be forgotten amidst the sf pulps, and
=not proclaimed by literati and dunce alike as the vanguard of
=an Important New Movement in Literature.

I'm not aware of anyone having done this.  I certainly haven't seen any 
other books which seemed to be in the same vein.

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: REBECCA@YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu (Rebecca Drayer)
Subject: Re: Books I Hate to Love
Organization: Yale University
Date: Mon, 05 Oct 92 15:05:43 EDT

In article <MJB.92Oct4164725@oak7.doc.ic.ac.uk>
mjb@doc.ic.ac.uk (Matthew J Brown) writes:
 
>
>In article <1992Oct1.012736.1@fnalo.fnal.gov> morrow@fnalo.fnal.gov (Lake Elmo, MN) writes:
>>In article <1ad5nsINNqrj@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>, sdh5@po.CWRU.Edu (Scott D. Hurley) writes:
>>> This train of thought reminds me of an observation I've made
>>> lately--is it just my imagination, or does there seem to be
>>> a shifting trend towards protagonistic villains, antagonists so
>>> wonderfully shaped that one ends up rooting for them instead of
>>> the 'Good Guys'?
>>>
 
 
Absolutely.  Check out the current thread on Julian May's books.  One of her
characters (Marc Remillard, the Adversary) was so well done and
sympathetically portrayed that I kept reading the book quickly so I could get
to more scenes with him in it!
 
 
*************************************************************************
Rebecca A. Drayer, EMT        |    Rebecca@Yalevm.YCC.Yale.edu
P.O. Box 6349 Yale Station    |    Computing Assistant
New Haven, CT 06520           |    Silliman College, Yale University
 
Q: What did Dan Quayle get on his IQ test?
A: Drool
*************************************************************************
From: Colleen_Anderson@mindlink.bc.ca (Colleen Anderson)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Name query
Date: 28 Sep 92 17:24:12 GMT
Organization: MIND LINK! - British Columbia, Canada
Distribution: world

Dana Goldblatt writes:

Msg-ID: <1a75rrINNlqa@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu>
Posted: 28 Sep 1992 14:46:19 GMT

Org.  : Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)


In a previous article, JOKHC@CUNYVM.BITNET (Joshua Kronengold) says:

>Can't remember everything about the book (like, f'rinstance, the author, or
>much of the story) but could it have been a historical fantasy about a half-
>elven(that is, sidhe) woman who is cursed by her father to have a fish's tail;
>she bears a son (to a king?) and the story covers mabye 200 years.(I think
it's
>called melisande, but I'm not sure)
>anyone else?
>

>>This is sort of the version of a story about Melisande (or Melisende?)
>>in _Possession_ by A.S. Byatt.  One of the characters wrote a long
>>poem about a half snake (not fish, I think) faerie woman named that.
>>-dana
In medieval times there was a mythical creature called a melusine which was a
woman with a bifurcated fish tail.  Perhaps the name is also derived from that.
Colleen