From: vanyel@camelot.bradley.edu (Alan Williams)
Subject: Re: Too straight looking to be gay??? (was re: UNGAY GAY)
Organization: Bradley University
Distribution: usa
Date: 28 Aug 92 19:21:36 GMT

In <l9st1kINNeme@mizar.usc.edu> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

>In article <vanyel.715024092@camelot> 
>vanyel@camelot.bradley.edu (Alan Williams) writes:

>> Personally, I don't like "nelly" or "macho" behavior.  My *reason* is
>> because the kind of people I've encountered who utilize these behaviors
>> have struck me as vain, superficial, and out to attract as much attention
>> as possible.  
>For god's sake.

What's the prob?

>> Note: I freely admit that this impression is a result of
>> their personalities interacting with mine.  
>Please keep the subjective origins of your dislike for these 
>behaviors uppermost in mind.

I do.  Do you keep being an asshole uppermost in *your* mind?

>> In fact, I can occasionally
>> lapse into a two-second "camp" phase with certain friends, but I generally
>> feel slightly queasy afterward.  
>Ahem.  
>Why "queasy"?  Afraid people might think you're a girl?

Maybe just because I don't like.  Tell me why I should embrace such
behavior with open arms.  It's a facet of my personality to dislike it.

>> For those of you who've become lost (I
>> almost got lost myself 8-), this is a Reason.  It contains the presumption
>> that this set of behaviors may not be completely rational; it also contains
>> the presumption that if any blame exists (in this case I can't see any for
>> anyone), it's not restricted to the Other Party.
>Am I misreading, or do you really mean to *blame* other people 
>for acting in ways that you dislike?  If you've got a problem with
>nellies and butches, it's *your* problem.

Yes, you've screwed it up again.  There's no such thing as "blame" in this
case.  Some people behave in a manner that I personally (note that word,
bright boy) don't like.  That's a situation that refers exclusively to me.

>> Now, let's look at an Excuse for the same issue.  I could say that I don't
>> like "nelly" or "macho" behavior because the people who indulge in those
>> behaviorisms have severe personal problems if they have to act "that way."
>Your presumption leaves me speechless.

Excuse me; did I say I *believed* this?  Get a clue.

>> Note that this implies not only blame, but also blame on the part of "other
>> parties."
>> I realize, of course, this is also how I interpret the terms.
>Yeah, well, it's not the way *I* interpret the terms or
>the behaviors under discussion.

So tell me something I don't know.

>> No, I'd say it's more so.  I've never really understood the concept of a
>> "gay community" any more than I understand why *any* minority should feel
>> obliged to cut itself off from the "mainstream" society.  
>Are you for real?

Are you?  What's your point, Arne?  That we're demigods who strut across
the face of Earth?


>> Maybe that's my
>> problem (for those of you who think I've got a problem): I think that
>> society needs integration more than it needs to be split up by little
>> groups that can't look past their own noses to see the world as a whole.

>It's a small world after all
>It's a small world after all
>It's a small world after all
>It's a small small world

>> And that goes for majority and minority alike.
>>
>> Chew on *that* for a while.  8-)

>I can't imagine being so famished that I'd want to put 
>*that* in my mouth.

Fuck off, Arne.  Just fuck off.  Not all of us adhere to your the-universe-
is-out-to-get-me attitudes.  Some of us would prefer harmony to the kind of
discord you seem to enjoy.


--

 ________________ Alan Williams | vanyel@camelot.bradley.edu _________________
 \/ "Are you afraid I'm jeopardizing my secret identity, Ned?  I don't     \/
     *have* one, remember?"  --The Black Condor, _Black Condor_ #5