HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu (Jay Maynard)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Air Lifeline experience
Date: 30 Aug 1992 22:35:12 GMT
Organization: UT Health Science Center Houston

In article <2#gnr0m.rkaplan@netcom.com> rkaplan@netcom.com (Richard Kaplan) writes:
>I do not feel that a patient's acute medical need justifies
>a private pilot lowering his weather standards.  This
>could easily result in additional deaths or injuries and
>could create a bad reputation for GA.

One side note in this discussion: This has recently been the source of much
controversy in the helicopter EMS service. EMS pilots are finally getting to
the point where they feel comfortable turning down missions; this is in large
part due to the number of accidents that happened from pushing the limits.

>As I mentioned in my previous posting, I just signed 
>up for AirLifeline myself, particularly since I understand
>many of their missions originate or terminate in Rochester,
>Minnesota.  However, I view my role as providing a
>charitable service for a non-emergent situation only.
>If critical medical materials or an unstable patient
>needs to be transported, that would be much more 
>appropriately handled under Part 135.

Not necessarily. There's nothing that says that private/part 91 operations
can't be just as professional as part 135 operations, just as there's nothing
that says that volunteer EMS services can't be just as professional as paid
services. (Sorry if this sounds too strident; I'm a volunteer paramedic, and I
just got back from a call where a bystander who was an RN commented to the
mother of an 11-year-old patient about how long we were taking to get him
ready for transport by saying, "That's the thing about these volunteer
services. You get what you pay for." ARGH!)

There are cases where transport by air with Lifeguard handling would be
appropriate in other than an air ambulance. I don't know if I'd take such a
case, though; I'd probably spend too much time worrying about the patient's
medical condition and not enough worrying about flying. Fortunately, it's not
a problem yet, as I don't own an airplane...
-- 
Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC, PP-ASEL | Never ascribe to malice that which can
jmaynard@oac.hsc.uth.tmc.edu      | adequately be explained by stupidity.
 "Keep in mind that Amateur Radio As We Know It Today will cease to exist
            at midnight tonight." -- Dave Newkirk, WJ1Z
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: waugh@rtpnet05.rtp.dg.com (Matthew Waugh)
Subject: Re: crossing a runway, and instructor relations
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 21:30:09 GMT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Data General Corporation, RTP, NC.

In article <CSTACY.92Aug26144058@wheat-chex.ai.mit.edu> cstacy@ai.mit.edu (Christopher C. Stacy) writes:
>My first inclination is to behave the way he says when he is sitting there,
>and then behave the way I think is proper when he leaves in 4 hours.
>But that's not honest, and I would feel bothered by it constantly.
>Besides, I would be easily discovered by observation or radio monitoring.
>(And, anyway, maybe he's right and I've just been confused all this time.)

Instructors are only human (oh man, blasphemy, and he's only just started
typing). They all have their little quirks, and mis-understanding of
the rules and regulations. They probably have less mis-understandings
than us mere mortals, but take my word for it, they all have plenty of
quirks.

>I wonder if I should raise the issue with him again.
>Who is correct?  What should I do?

I would raise the point again outside the plane, with references handy,
and trying not to be confrontational (right, easy for you to say). You'll
probably find this instructor has a great story to tell about why he
always asks for permission to cross a runway, despite it not being
required. He may then say "well, you're right, maybe I am obsessive
about this, just make sure you look really well", or he may say, "look,
I'm obsessive about this, it's the only right thing to do, regulations
not withstanding". You then have to decide if you can live with
this instructor. 

If you fly with enough instructors you will end up doing some things
just to please the instructor and make them shut up about it. You
may do different things for different instructors. No doubt about
it, you got a safety question there, because you aren't consistent.
On the other hand, flying with one instructor all your life, apart
from being a statistical impossibility, isn't going to expose you
to all those useful tips, techniques and quirks instructors have.

Mat

Matthew Waugh			waugh@dg-rtp.dg.com
RTP Network Services 		
Data General Corp.		
RTP, NC. (919)-248-6034
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: greg@inmos.co.uk (Greg Nunan)
Subject: Re: Hawker Siddeley Vulcan
Organization: Inmos
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 09:50:23 GMT

Ron Natalie (ron@pilot.njin.net) wrote:
: Speaking of Vulcans, an article in Atlantic Flyer says the RAF is
: auctioning off one of the remaining ones.   Aviation museums and
: salvage people after the museum are likely candidates.
: 
: -Ron

Yes, unfortunately the last flying Avro Vulcan made its last
appearance at an airshow a couple of weeks ago :-( I actually
saw it a few days later when it flew in to the BAe airfield at
Filton. What a lovely sight!

I also once saw about 12 Vulcans and 12 Valiants/Victors all in
formation flying low over an airfield - the noise was phenomenal.

Greg.
--
Greg Nunan,  INMOS Ltd         |  Tel +44 454 616616 x664
1000 Aztec West,  Almondsbury  |  UK: greg@inmos.co.uk
Bristol BS12 4SQ,  UK          |  US: greg@inmos.com
From: dfr@usna.navy.mil (PROF D. Rogers (EAS FAC))
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Quebec City Trip Report (and Customs Horror Story)
Date: 28 Aug 92 16:36:27 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: U. S. Naval Academy

In article <1992Aug28.020521.16407@xn.ll.mit.edu> olsen@xn.ll.mit.edu writes:

Story about poor treatment by U.S. Customs.

!While Quebec City was very nice, our homecoming wasn't.  In future,
!when I have to subject myself to US Customs, I will punctiliously
!record all details of any call, get the name and badge number of the
!inspector, and explicitly ask for permission to land.  (In fact, I'll
!think twice about going at all.)

This is terrible but a fact of life in this `free' country.

Here are some suggestions based on my experiences

1. If possible, always file IFR.
2. Put ADCUS in the remarks section.
3. Keep a copy of your filed flight plan (easy to do in Canada)
4. Plan to land at a large international airport that has commercial
   traffic or one that has lots of international arrivals (e.g. Fort
   Pierce in Florida)
5. The first U.S. Controller you hit ask to confirm ADCUS.
6. Ask the tower controller to confirm ADCUS and that Customs
   has been notified.
7. Know what paperwork you need and have it all in one place, i.e.,
   aircraft paperwork in one place, personal paperwork in one
   place not necessarily the same. Be paranoid about paperwork.
8. Do not arrive outside regular hours.
9. If possible, call ahead to Customs AND get the name and badge number.
   Record them and the time and know where they are. Make the phone
   call on a credit card.
10.Upon arrival, stay with the aircraft. If no one comes after a reasonable
   time (10 minutes say), ask ground control if Customs is on their way.
11.When the Customs official arrives be polite (and humble), ask what the
   procedure is, do they want you to take all the baggage out, do they
   want the aircraft documents, your license etc.

However, even with all the above, if the official is having a bad day
or they have notice of an undesirable inbound that even vaguely fits
your description be prepared to be hassled. At least with the above
procedure you have `papered your anatomy' and you have a chance if
the worst happens.

Dave Rogers
From: prang@ssc-vax.boeing.com (Ron Wanttaja)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Propping big engines
Date: 2 Sep 92 05:01:22 GMT
Organization: Boeing Defense and Space Group, Seattle WA

In article <17v8qoINNibk@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> rob@cats.ucsc.edu (99708000) writes:
> Getting home, I asked the founder of the club about it, and he
> opined that he would have propped it.
> Hmm, now I weigh 165 and he weighs about 180--not much difference.
> The engine is a Conti IO520 on a 210 (with a 3 bladed prop, no less).

Adding my two cents worth:

I don't consider hand propping an option unless you've had some training. 
And preferably some experience.  There are too many ways to get munched.
Even though I've had two articles published on hand propping, the "Get some
dual" comment in them wasn't just a CYA legal move.

Even with four years' experience at propping, if someone asked me to prop
their 210 I'd refuse.  It's just too different from what I'm used to.

                                          Ron Wanttaja
					  prang@ssc-bee
					  ...rutgers!uw-beaver!ssc-bee!prang
                                          prang@ssc-bee.boeing.com
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: wb8foz@skybridge.SCL.CWRU.Edu (David Lesher)
Subject: Re: Building your own (dirt) runway? 
Reply-To: wb8foz@skybridge.scl.cwru.edu (David Lesher)
Organization: NRK Clinic for habitual NetNews abusers - Beltway Annex
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 23:36:09 GMT

Others said
# Hoi> Landing lights?  Home-make maybe?  (no, please no dropping flares from
# Hoi> airplane, cannot do that day in and day out) 
# 
# The little box that turns the lights up when you click the mike
# cost about $1,000 in 1988.  The fixtures to hold the lights were
# about $50 and the lights themselves were about $12 each.  The
# rig to hold the fixtures is just made from 2" pipe.

If you buy them.....

Long long time ago, there was this strip in a cornfield in
XXXXXX, Ohio. It had lights and 'click' control of same.

The lights? Well, you see, a 120v lamp fits nicely in a Mason
jar. And a 1/2" pipe flange rivets nicely to the top^X^X^Xbottom
piece. Romex even runs up the conduit. To keep the temp down and
lengthen the lamp life, a transformer ran the lamps at ~~100
volts.

As for the clicker, well the FCC type-accepts transmitters, not
scanner type receivers. And the digital logic and timer needed;
well - working need not mean "state of the art" rather "state of
the junkbox" ;-}

Oh, you better hurry. I just saw a news report that Mason is
going out of the jar business...
--
A host is a host from coast to coast..wb8foz@skybridge.scl.cwru.edu
& no one will talk to a host that's close..........................
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433
From: dick.zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com (Dick Zeitlin) 
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: airway colors
Date: 29 Aug 92 16:13:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Advanced Computer Concepts BBS, New Rochelle, NY 914-654-1981
Reply-To: dick.zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com (Dick Zeitlin) 

JM> .Well, I can give you about 60% of what you want:  the first four letters
  > .were WUDT; letters 8 and 9 were BG:

JM> .  When
  > .  Undertaking
  > .  Difficult
  > .  Tasks
  > .  ?
  > .  ?
  > .  ?
  > .  By
  > .  Good
  > .  ?

Close, but no cigar!  It's

 When Undertaking Very Hard Routes, Always Navigate By Good Methods.

Any idea how many of the beacons are still functional?  And where?  I
missed out on the last A-N range, and I'm NOT going to miss out on the
last beacons.  (But it's SOOOO far! <~>)

        D/

 * OLX 2.2 * Dick.Zeitlin%acc1bbs@ssr.com
From: ron@pilot.njin.net (Ron Natalie)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: There I was - mag check
Date: 30 Aug 92 17:03:22 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

> There's really no reason that something like this needs to be posted
> anonymously.  Pilots are human.  Pilots make misteaks.  Pilots can learn
> from mistakes made by other pilots -- and by comments which other pilots
> might have about their actions.  And comments can be made gently and
> positively -- as, I hope, these were.

Yes, I agree.  You can sit there and read the NASA safety reports or
NTSB extracts, and say "Boy was that guy stupid" but it isn't nearly
as compelling as the "I Learned About Flying From That" stories.  If
there's not going to be any legal problem with telling the story (like
it invlolves a serious FAR violation ...there I was crusing along and
just missed a 727, then I realized I wasn't cleared into the TCA), we
all benefit from hearing about it (if people can keep their replies
civil).

Here's a number of small things that have happened to me, that
probably have happened to many people (see how many of these
you have done):
    Forget to latch door on 172.
    Forget to retract 10 degree takeoff flaps after short field
	practice.
    Attempt to start engine with mixture at idle C/O.
    Precautionary landing due to strange noise (passenger seat belt
	out door).
    Extereme confusion on funny noise on climbout (main gear spinning
	on 172).
    Attempt to taxi over chock.
    Attempt to taxi with one main brake set.
    Forget to turn on transponder (inside 30NM TCA, er um, Class B
	veil)
    Unknowingly retracted flaps on short final while trying to land plane.

Some of these are more serious than others.  Most of these are not
serious.  They are just the "I hope nobody was watching types."
Others are more serious and you work to avoid them happening again.

Just for elaboration, the 172 door problem (it's not as serious in
Cessnoids as in other planes) comes from too much 152 flying.  152
doors are slam shut like cars, 172's need to be latched.  I've done
this twice (about ten years apart).

The one brake set has just led me to avoid using the cessna Parking
brakes at all.  For engine start I just stand on the toe brakes.
Otherwise I chock the wheels.  Also a break check (both for release
and to make sure they work) is part of my "First movement checks"
now.

The last one came from flying an unfamiliar plane.  This was a 150
with 40 degrees of flaps and the "UP/OFF/DOWN" type of electric
control.  I had just lowered down to full flaps, and let go of the
handle.  Evidentally I knocked it up to the UP position.  As I
got closer to the runway, I knew something was wrong as I started
going faster.  Then I saw the flaps fully retracted an the switch
still in the "up" position.  Oddly it doesn't stick in the down
position, only up.

-Ron
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: seymour@milton.u.washington.edu (Richard Seymour)
Subject: Re: scenic tours
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 19:24:36 GMT

During flights between Seattle and <anyplace south>,
it was almost common for Western Airlines and Hughes AirWest
to take circles around Mt. St. Helens during the mid-80's

(Mt.St.Helens is a volcano which blew in May 1981, located
 just north of Portland Oregon)

--dick
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: jon@dikas.no (Jon Marthins)
Subject: Re: GLIDER: stall landings (Was: Transition Glider to Power)
Organization: Dikas (Digitale Kartsystemer)
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 17:25:23 GMT

After gliding clubs started to buy those new (expensive) fibreglass
two-seaters (ASK-21, Grob Twin Astir etc.) for basic training, we've
experienced that students didn't learn to land properly.  They usely made 
high speed/high energy landings on the main wheel, with little airbrakes
deployed.  The reason for this is that these types of gliders do not
handle very well if you pull up the nose too early and too much.  The
glider "falls through" very sudden and if hard enough the undercarriage
breaks....

The result is that many clubs have gone back to Blanik, K-7, K-13, Bergfalke
etc. for basic training.  

Does anyone else have experience on this?
       ___
________|________  Jon Marthins
        0	   jon@dikas.no      "Gliderpilots keep it up longer...."
From: ritter@claude.ma30.bull.com (Roger Ritter)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Two planes collide over Santa Paula Airport
Date: 3 Sep 92 13:51:23 GMT
Organization: Bull HN Informations Systems Inc.

kzk00@ccc.amdahl.com (  200  Klaus Kraemer) writes:
>Now THAT might be a frightful thing: Both pilots dutifully listening and
>making their reports - but on different frequencies.

The only tool that has a chance of detecting *all* traffic is still the
Mark I eyeball.  Use the other stuff (radios, flight following, etc.),
but never stop looking!
-- 
Roger Ritter N1FZZ (R.Ritter@ma30.bull.com) PP-ASEL, AGI
1946 Luscombe 8A N71983 "Rocky"
Sheep do not so much fly as plummet!        NH CAP: Profile 49
From: cjackso@uswnvg.com (Clay Jackson)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
Subject: Re: Finding toxic waste (Re: Flying for the Environment)
Date: 1 Sep 92 23:38:11 GMT
Organization: U S WEST NewVector Group, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

I know I shouldn't but....

John De Armond (jgd@dixie.com) wrote:
: No we're not.   We're talking about a busy-body poking her nose into
: things she likely knows nothing about.  Are the drums full of evil
: assault baby-killing CHEMICALS or are they empty?  Is that color in
: the pond EABKC or is it an algae bloom?  To her type, that does not
: matter.  
Now WAIT JUST A MINUTE, JOHN - I think YOU'RE missing the point.  The
problem here is NOT Margret, or anyone else REPORTING what they saw.
 
IMHO, the problem is twofold:
	One - there are just enough "bad guys" out there to make it
	not very safe for those of us without protection to go around
	asking questions about things like piles of drums.  Sure, in
	your case, they're being used for Bar-B-Ques, but in SOME
	cases, the guy using 'em IS running an (illegal) hazmat dump,
	and maybe, just maybe, he has a shotgun by his door, and is
	prepared to use it.

	Two - (perhaps because of point #1) - Our so-called authorities
	have gotten completely, totally out-of-control.  Rather than
	VERIFYING information (as in your drug bust scenario), they
	go barging in with TOO MUCH firepower and an "attitude".

: Just call 'em all in and to hell with the harrassment or cost
: suffered by her victims.  The old ends-justify-the-means argument 
SHE'S not causing any harrassment or suffering - the "authorities"
are the ones to blame.  

Of course, the ends don't justify the means, BUT, does that mean that
we're supposed to look the other way?

: I'll bet you'd be appalled if she went snooping around other people's
: property while on the ground.  Why does being in a plane suddenly 
: make it acceptable to you?

What snooping?  If my neighbor had a funny smell coming out if his
back yard (over the course of several days), or a pile of drums
visible from my window, I'd probably figure out a DISCRETE way to
ask him, or at least pass the info along to someone who could investigate,
hopefully w/o undue harrassment.
--
Clay Jackson - N7QNM
US WEST NewVector Group Inc
Bellevue, WA
uunet!uswnvg!cjackso
From: schinner@vcd.hp.com (Jim Schinnerer)
Subject: Re: What do you do during long boring flights?
Organization: Hewlett-Packard VCD
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 20:39:25 GMT

: In article <ritter.715270580@claude>, ritter@claude.ma30.bull.com (Roger 
: Ritter) writes:
: > Let's see now, I check my position on the chart, look for obvious
: > landmarks on the ground, check for traffic, look ahead for my next
: > checkpoint, check my compass course, check for traffic, look at
: > the engine gauges, note en-route timing, check for traffic, check
: > my position on the chart ...

Even with all that, I find my portable CD player very useful on long trips.
Of course, I fly in the west, where you may have 150 miles between NavAids
and nothing but a desert underneath you.

---------------------------------------------------------
Jim Schinnerer  -  PP-ASEL-IA       |  Hewlett Packard
Mooney - 350X  -  "Buster"          |  Vancouver, WA
email - schinner@vcd.hp.com         |  (206) 944-3324
---------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: jbrown@qdeck.com (Jordan Brown)
Subject: Re: Air Lifeline experience
Organization: Quarterdeck Office Systems, Santa Monica CA
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 04:15:26 GMT

rkaplan@netcom.com (Richard Kaplan) writes:
> This [AirLifeLine] is an organization which in their published
> informational brochure quotes a pilot bragging about "Despite the
> thunderstorms....  and the fog.... we made it."

I can't be sure, but if you're thinking of the promo piece I'm thinking
of, some context is appropriate.

First, for the full story you could probably dig in somebody's rec.aviation
files from about four or five years ago... yes, the pilot was a rec.aviator.
(Don't know whether he's still around; if so perhaps he can fill in whatever
I'm missing.)  His name, unless I'm misremembering, is Dave Fiedler, and
he lives someplace in the Sacramento area.

This was a real honest-to-goodness Lifeguard flight.  Seems that someplace
on the northwest coast of California there's a shelter for kids with AIDS.
For obvious reasons it's very remote.  (I think the nearby civilization was
Shelter Cove.) They had suffered an outbreak of chicken pox, and needed
serum IMMEDIATELY.  Like, days was far far too long, hours were important.
Our hero got a call in the wee-hours-of-the-morning to fly this stuff from
someplace civilized (San Jose comes to mind) up there.  The weather was
lousy, and it was tough getting into the destination airport, but he
succeeded and quite possibly saved several lives.

It wasn't quite the open-and-shut stupid case one might extrapolate from
Richard's quote above.  The risk level was probably higher than normal,
perhaps even higher than one would normally accept.  The urgency level was
also quite high, and in my mind at least that justifies accepting a higher
risk level.

(Please pardon any errors; this is generally correct history but almost
certainly contains mistakes in details.  It's been years since I read
the r.a article, and years since I briefly skimmed the ALL flier describing
the flight.)

Note, incidentally, that ALL may well have, shall we say, carefully chosen
their words to make the piece appear as if this valiant volunteer risked
life and limb to save the poor suffering children; after all, it's PR for
them and the importance and utility of GA.
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: arw4@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Aaron R Wininger)
Subject: Robert Taylor
Reply-To: arw4@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Aaron R Wininger)
Organization: Columbia University
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 23:49:06 GMT

Does anyone know where I can get posters/prints of Robert Taylor's combat
aircraft paintings?

Thanks,
Aaron



Aaron R. Wininger, Carnivore                 Columbia Plasma Physics Laboratory
arw4@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu                                 Columbia University
wininger@cuplvx.ap.columbia.edu                              New York, NY 10027
      'That which does not kill us, makes us stronger.'  -Nietzche
Newsgroups: rec.aviation
From: greg@saltydog.dpsi.com (Gregory R. Travis)
Subject: Re: Flying saves money (sic)
Organization: Data Parallel Systems, Inc
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 17:09:12 GMT

In <1992Sep2.144206.11929@eecs.nwu.edu> phil@eecs.nwu.edu (William LeFebvre) writes:

>But why shouldn't ATC and Flight Service be subsidised by airline
>tickets?  Those services benefit airlines as well as GA.  And my
>understanding is that GA does pay for those services in part thru
>fuel taxes.

Most, if not all, airlines do not use Flight Service except for
EFAS and HIWAS.  When was the last time you had to fight with American 423
trying to get a flight plan in on 122.2?  As for briefings,
they have their own met. guys to give them that;  Captain Smith of
Delta doesn't call up 1-800-WXBRIEF first thing in the morning.

It is my understanding that Flight Service is pretty much 100% for
GA.

Glossary:

EFAS	- Enroute Flight Advisory Service (Flight Watch)
--
Gregory Reed Travis				D  P  S  I
Data Parallel Systems Incorporated   greg@dpsi.com (For MX mailers only!)
Bloomington, IN			     greg@indiana.edu (For the others)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation