HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mitrovic@tik.ethz.ch (Srdjan Mitrovic)
Subject: News from Switzerland
Organization: TIK, ETH Zuerich, Switzerland
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 14:33:10 GMT

Reported by NZZ, 22.July:

Massive brawl in the prison Thorberg
(Kosovo Albanians against Croats & Serbs)

Eight prisoners have been hurt in a fight between the prisoners
of Croatian, Serbian and Albanian nationality. The war in Jugoslavia
tightened the relations between prisoners. 
The fight has been started by the Albanians after the lunch, on their
way to the work. After opening of the cells the group
waited on the Serbs and Croats to come down. The attack started
very fast: the men used knives, screwdrivers, chairs etc..
From now on, the Croats and Serbs will not be kept
in the same prison as the Albanians.


Srdjan Mitrovic
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: victor@jezebel.wustl.edu (Victor Wickerhauser)
Subject: Croatian Liberation Front CDs
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 03:29:53 GMT


I got the following information by Email.  ccrma is a very well known
computer music lab at Stanford.  Swarthmore is one of those excellent little
liberal arts colleges which dot the East.  Other than that, I know nothing
about the CLF project or its CD, so caveat emptor.  I will post a review of
their CD when I get it, though.

Cheers,
Victor
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

     Thank you for your interest in the Croatian Liberation Front.  In case
you are unfamiliar with our project, we would like to offer this brief
background and statement of purpose.  The CLF was created at Swarthmore
College in Pennsylvania by Mario Vuksan, Rob Greenawalt, and Van Curtis.  It
is a band devoted to raising public awareness of the conflict in Croatia and
providing monetary aid to humanitarian relief programs there.  It soon gained
non-profit status under the college's supervision and recorded several songs
about the war in Croatia.
     The first of these songs, "Croatia's Gotta Be Free," quickly rose to the
#2 on Radio 101, Zagreb's charts.  It spent over 12 weeks in the top ten.
Currently, the second song, "Dubrovnik is Burning / Sunday Bloody Sunday," is
#1 and has been so for 4 weeks; and a third song, our rendition of the
Beatles' "Hard Day's Night," has entered the charts at #32.  The band has
played benefit shows to raise money for Croatian cultural centers in New
York, Chicago, and Cleveland.

	For more information and to order CD's contact Van Curtis at his home
address: Van Curtis
                   6666 N. Cocopas Rd.
                   Tucson, AZ
                     85718

CD's are available from the artists directly for $10 each (postage and
handling included).  Please make checks out to Van Curtis.  CD's will be sent
immediately upon receipt of paid orders.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Victor,
Thanks a lot for getting hold of us.  We would appreciate hearing
back from you about how you heard of our project (electronic
mailing list?).

Thanks,
Chris
      otto@ccrma.stanford.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Victor,

Thanks for getting back to us.  Sure, it would be great if you could
post the information to the newsgroup.  We would really appreciate it.

hasta,
otto.
    @ccrma.stanford.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Prof. M. Victor Wickerhauser (314)935-6771  <victor@jezebel.wustl.edu>
Dept. of Mathematics, Washington University, St. Louis, MO  63130  USA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 17:19:27 -0400 
From: Nenad Antonic <na0i+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Serbian language
	<23JUL92.10635440.0188@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA>

George Bogavac writes:

> The two alphabets were not "created" just like that. Originally,
> all south Slavs used the Cyrillic alphabet (including Croats), but

	Cyrillic alphabet was used in Croatia only marginally.
Glagolitic was the one you might have in mind (for Croatia,
it was `uglata glagoljica', like the stone plate - ba\v{s}\v{c}anska
plo\v{c}a). The script invented by St. Cyril and Method, as I learnt
in school. 

		Nenad Antoni\'c.
From: Eric_S_Klien@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Electronic Matchmaker
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 92 21:39:13 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world

Women, I am about to launch a free electronic matching service on 
Usenet.  Unfortunately, more guys than gals have expressed an 
interest so far.  If you would like to see the fourth draft of my 
questionnaire so we can alter it to also fit women's needs as well as 
men's, either send me mail or look at the copy I posted in 
alt.personals.
 
This service is serious and I already have 119 men and 86 women signed
up so far.  The site of the service has already been selected and
programmers are being lined up for the construction of the listserver.
 
I should point out that this questionnaire really, really, really, 
needs some more input on CULTURES.  I need some questions to make sure
that matches are compatible culturally.
 
                                                            Eric Klien
 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA>
Subject: Greater Serbia (was: Re: Opposition)
Organization: University of New Brunswick
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 23:22:45 GMT

>dmatic@athena.mit.edu (Davor Matic) writes:
>>                                                                      e SIXTH
>>As one Slovene military expert said, this war is the SIXTH (yes, 6th)
>>time in the last two centuries that serbs stared a war for a Greater  Great
>>Serbia.                                                               ian

I can't help but wonder: If this is the sixth, what/when were the
previous five...?

Regards,
George Bogavac
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: neven@ece.orst.edu (Neven Orhanovic)
Subject: Re: Serbian language
Originator: neven@orca.ECE.ORST.EDU
Organization: Oregon State University - Univ. Computing Services
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 20:23:17 GMT

In article <21JUL92.12161453.0212@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> K2GT@UNB.CA (George Bogavac) writes:
>
>The language spoken in the majority of ex-YU republics (Croatia,
>Bosnia-Herzegovina,Montenegro & Serbia ) is essentially the same
>language, meaning that people from these republics can communicate
>without any problems. There are different dialects, and some
>differences in vocabulary, but again, these differences are minor.
>The grammar (including spelling) is the same.
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It is not so. Please have a look at the Croatian orthography
(Babic, Finka, et al.) originally published in 1971 but banned
during communist rule. (It was carefully written (watered down) 
not to offend Serbian "friends", but was still banned.)
It will dispute your claims.

Regards,
Neven

Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: merlic@jacob.UVic.CA (Mile  Erlic)
Subject: Shooting
Organization: University of Victoria, Victoria, BC, Canada
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 22:16:34 GMT


  The Serbs won a bronze medal in shooting!

  My Comment: Hell, with all the practice they've had
              I'm surprised they didn't win the gold!



-- 
Mile Erlic, Dept. Elec. & Comp. Eng., Univ. of Victoria
Victoria, B.C., Canada V8W 3P6, (604) 721-8660
merlic@sirius.uvic.ca

Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: mirsip@risky.ecs.umass.edu (Ivan Popstefanija)
Subject: Re: USA - Croatia  103: 70
Organization: University of Massachusetts, Amherst
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:44:32 GMT

In article <Bs2q1B.6u8@ecf.toronto.edu> blazic@ecf.toronto.edu (BLAZIC Joseph R) writes:
>In article <27JUL92.20895779.0048@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA> writes:
>>The US has won the basketball game against Croatia by
>>103:70     ( not bad, all things considered :-)
>
>Well, Croatia has a population of only about 4.5 million.  So if we do a 
>simple linear extrapolation, they would have defeated the US quite handily
>if Croatia had the same population.  Simple, eh?  Maybe the Olympic committee
>should introduce a handicap system. :-)
>
>It is curious how Croatia and Lithuania, two of the smaller nations in
>the world, are rated second and third by most basketball 'experts', 
>behind the US that is.
>

Only among the ones who are allowed to compete!

>Does anyone know how many Croatian Serbs on are the Croatian basketball
>team?
>
>Joe Blazic

  There needs to be some clarification: Do you mean how they declare
themselfs or what other people think what their ethnic background should
be? This would be based on their parents  background or similar! I think
I know of several Croatian Serbs how are bigger Croatian nationalist 
(on words) then most Croatians. BTW, way it matters, they represented
yesterday their new country well! Right?

  Ivan Popstefanija
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA>
Subject: Re: Serbian language
Organization: University of New Brunswick
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 21:06:02 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.043659.15756@talon.ucs.orst.edu> neven@halibut.ECE.ORST.EDU (Neven Orhanovic;737-3448;;757-1803;halibut) writes:
>
>Here are some ije/je/e examples that Serbs don't have to worry about.
>

Hm, Serbs *DO* have to worry about these things, because as I said
earlier, the Serbian language can also come in the "ije" form.
If you take any original edition of a book by Ivo Andric, you will
see that he uses it. Andric is undoubtebly a Serbian writer.
The "ije" dialect is also spoken throughout Montenegro. Read
"Gorski Vijenac" (not "venac") by P.P. Njegos.
These are not "imported" dialects, but authentic versions of the
language spoken by Serbs in Montenegro,Bosnia,Hercegovina,Lika...

Thanks for the ije/je examples. :-)
Here's one from "the top of my head".

In Croatia, one would say: "Televizijski PRIJENOS"
I say: "Televizijski PRENOS", even though I use "lijep","mlijeko"...

And a question: is the verb then, "prenositi" or "prijenositi"
in Croatian...?

Regards,
George Bogavac

P.S.

Somebody told me that a lot of people from Zagreb speak "ekavski"
as a "local slang". Is that true?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: dmatic@athena.mit.edu (Davor Matic)
Subject: Re: Serbian language
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 22:17:48 GMT

In article <22JUL92.18468858.0192@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA> writes:
>In article <1992Jul22.043659.15756@talon.ucs.orst.edu> neven@halibut.ECE.ORST.EDU (Neven Orhanovic;737-3448;;757-1803;halibut) writes:
>>
>>Here are some ije/je/e examples that Serbs don't have to worry about.
>>
>
>Hm, Serbs *DO* have to worry about these things, because as I said
>earlier, the Serbian language can also come in the "ije" form.
>If you take any original edition of a book by Ivo Andric, you will
>see that he uses it. Andric is undoubtebly a Serbian writer.
>The "ije" dialect is also spoken throughout Montenegro. Read
>"Gorski Vijenac" (not "venac") by P.P. Njegos.
>These are not "imported" dialects, but authentic versions of the
>language spoken by Serbs in Montenegro,Bosnia,Hercegovina,Lika...
>

Those are exactly imported dialects, since they are spoken by the
Serbs outside of Serbia.  They have mixed and assimilated with the 
dialect from the surrounding Croats.  The authentic language they
spoke was Serbian at one time.  As far as Monte Negro goes, it is
a whole new dispute how much Serbian Monte-Negrians really are :-)

>Thanks for the ije/je examples. :-)
>Here's one from "the top of my head".
>
>In Croatia, one would say: "Televizijski PRIJENOS"
>I say: "Televizijski PRENOS", even though I use "lijep","mlijeko"...
>
>And a question: is the verb then, "prenositi" or "prijenositi"
>in Croatian...?
>

I think it's "prenositi".
BTW, it was never considered to be a good style mixing Cortian
and Serbian literary forms where I went to school.  You either
speak "ekavski" or "ijekavski".  It's quite easy to be consistent
about that.
 
>Regards,
>George Bogavac
>
>P.S.
>
>Somebody told me that a lot of people from Zagreb speak "ekavski"
>as a "local slang". Is that true?

I've never heard that.  Zagreb slang is "kajkavski" but still
"ijekavski".  Although in Zagroje you might find "ekavski", but
by no means is it a literary form, only a slang.
From: pshane@andromeda.rutgers.edu (Ana M. Shane)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Re: opposition
Date: 25 Jul 92 06:48:47 GMT
Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J.

dmatic@athena.mit.edu (Davor Matic) writes:

>In article <1475300283@igc.org>, pnmideast@igc.org writes:
>|>         So we beg the world to help us.Don't be mistaken,it is not
>|> the overwhelming majority that supports the position,there are a
>|> lot of us striving for truth and justice.Please,help us,we are
>|> desperate.You will not help us by bombing us,the sanctions are
>|> enough.         
>|> 
>|> Bojana Cvejic,Belgrade. 

>I don't think that anyone wants to bomb civilians.  If any bombing does occur, it
 ^^
>will be military targets only.  And in my opinion, this actually WOULD help 
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^                           *******************
>you. 
****
>Taking the toys away from the steam-heads that think they can have their way if
>they have the pover, will be a positive move.  Once Serbian generals start being
>affraid of Croats or Bosnians, because their military superiority has been
>destroyed by an outside factor, maybe there will finally be a ripe athmosphere
>for negotiations.  As one Slovene military expert said, this war is the SIXTH
>(yes, 6th) time in the last two centuries that serbs stared a war for Great
>Serbia.  It's about time to end this nonsence and put a damper on Serbian
>military power.  Just like with Germany after WWII.


^^You are either naive or stupid or both...

**and also vicious...

but maybe just a victim of propaganda...

You didn't learn yet that aggression only perpetuates aggression and will
never bring any peacefull solutions? 


Peace
Ana M. Shane
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: victor@jezebel.wustl.edu (Victor Wickerhauser)
Subject: Silence Serbia's Big Guns
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 11:57:01 GMT

(Unsigned editorial from the New York Times, Wednesday, July 22 1992)

SILENCE SERBIA'S BIG GUNS

Serbia's murderous shelling of Bosnians in Sarajevo and Gorazde has intensified despite last Friday's cease-fire accord.  The Serbs had pledged to place their artillery, mortars and other heavy weapons under United Nations supervision.   Instead they have continued blasting away at Bosnia, forcing temporary suspension of food and medical relief to Sarajevo.

Thousands more will die in the heart of Europe unless the security council rouses itself to send the Serbs a stern warning:  Let the U.N. take over the Serbia's big guns or it will bomb and strafe them into submission.

That means moving beyond humanitarian assistance to armed enforcement of peace.  The U.N. has the authority to do that.Now it is up to the U.S. and other members of the Security Council to supply the collective will, and collective military muscle, to end the slaughter.  

				o o o
				
Douglas Hurd, Britain's Foreign Secretary, visited stricken Sarajevo last week while the Serbs' bombardment continued without letup.  He told Bosnia to put its faith in another cease-fire that neither he nor anyone else expected Serbia to honor.  ``No country,'' he said on departing, ``is willing to contemplate military intervention.''  Now he has Serbia's reply --- shelling without end.

If Britain cannot summon courage to seek collective punishment of Serbian aggression, surely America can.  It can persuade the Security Council to authorize air strikes on Serbian gun emplacements around Bosnia's cities.  And it can muster the air power to carry them out.

Such military action will not only allow relief efforts to resume.  It will also raise the price of aggression and bolster Bosnia's bargaining leverage at talks with Serbia and Croatia to arrange a settlement.

If the Security Council does not act soon, Gorazde may succumb.  The mostly Muslim Slav town of 20,000, now swelled by twice that number of refugees, could become the next victim of ``ethnic cleansing'' --- driving out Muslims to facilitate resettlement by Serbs.   That would consolidate Serbia's control over two-thirds of Bosnian territory and further isolate Sarajevo.

Failure to act now would be a disgrace for the U.N.  And it would expose President Bush's new world order as an empty pretense.

Serbia's success in dismembering Bosnia is already sowing domestic instability in neighboring states.  Most dangerous of all. it could inspire other petty dictators in the region to exploit nationalist resentments to seize power.  Once they do, their neighbors dare not rest easy.

The blood from the Balkans is seeping under Europe's door.  If Europeans won't staunch the flow,  then America has to lead them in a joint rescue.


----
Prof. M. Victor Wickerhauser (314)935-6771  <victor@jezebel.wustl.edu>
Dept. of Mathematics, Washington University, St. Louis, MO  63130  USA

Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA>
Subject: RE: Ethnic loyalty and politics
Organization: University of New Brunswick
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 20:59:42 GMT

In article <1992Jul31.115731.25147@isy.liu.se> predrag@isy.liu.se (Predrag Pucar) writes:
>In article <30JUL92.22934847.0039@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA>, George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA> writes:
>> In article <Bs801D.L54@ecf.toronto.edu> blazic@ecf.toronto.edu (BLAZIC Joseph R) writes:
>> >In article <30JUL92.12919745.0098@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> George Bogavac <K2GT@UNB.CA> writes:
>
>>
>> I'm talking about Milan Djukic. He is the president of a party
>> called "Srpska Narodna Stranka Hrvatske" or something like that.
>> According to the articles I've read over the months (Croatian
>> and Serbian) that party has about 10 members :-) I also understand
>> that he was paid dearly for his "services". I think you are
>> reffering to Milorad Pupovac. He is being hunted down by Vladimir
>> Seks, Croatia's attorney general. See the Globe & Mail article
>> that I've posted earlier today.
>
>No, George I think you're wrong. Milan Djukic has criticized the
>current Croatian government often and sharply the last weeks. I think
>it is Milan Djukic Joe is thinking about. I of course don't know if he
>is payed or not by FT but according to what he states in public and
>sending letters to HW and AI he is a lousy investment. He is NOT elected
>by the Serbs, but he runs a party (SNS) and for that you don't have to
>be elected !! That is what he's trying to become.
>

The point is that he was put in place by the government of Croatia,
without any mandate, that's all. So the things that he is saying
can be considered just his personal opinion. I can just as easily
write a letter to all those bodies, but they won't have much "weight"
would they? Also, even though this is purely speculation on my
part, he could be saying those things just to create the impression
that he is legit, which he is not. Why would the Croatian government
keep a guy who is supposedly saying bad things about it ( I haven't
seen anything, personally ), even though they have no obligation
to do so - he wasn't elected so they could just as easily kick him
out on the street - no harm done.

>Pozdrav
>--
>/Predrag      email: predrag@isy.liu.se

Regards,
George Bogavac
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
From: jec@pilatus.zurich.ibm.com (Jean Cherbonnier)
Subject: Re: Panic on Serbian concentration camps
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 08:58:43 GMT
Reply-To: jec@pilatus.zurich.ibm.com (Jean Cherbonnier)
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center

What do they call concentration camps ? 
Are they just camps for refugees or displaced people ?
Or are they camps where serbian put the people they don't like,
to eliminate them ?

J.Ch.
From: pnmideast@igc.org
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Date: 21 Jul 92 21:17 PDT
Subject: Refugees Update
Nf-ID: #N:cdp:1475300293:000:1122
Nf-From: cdp.UUCP!pnmideast    Jul 21 21:17:00 1992


From: <pnmideast>
Subject: Refugees Update

/* Written 10:44 pm  Jul 21, 1992 by ark_zg@zamir-zg.comlink.apc.org in cdp:yugo.antiwar */
/* ---------- "Refugees Update" ---------- */
Update on Refugees
Figures from the Croatian Government

Table 1
The number of displaced persons found in the territories of the 19 
regional offices in the Republic of Croatia.

Bjelova                 7.753
Cakovec 2.274
Dubrovnik 18.850
Gospic 1.365
Karlovac 12.222
Makarska 3.918
Slavonski Brod 9.665
Opatija 4.840
Osijek 33.705
Pula 8.065
Rijeka 13.504
Sisak 14.745
Sibenik 9.782
Varazdin 3.583
Virovitica 6.112
Zabok 2.797
Zadar 24.675
Zagreb 66.738

Total 264.865

Table 2 Number of refugees from Croatia located in other countries

Austria 2.500
Germany 55.000
Hungary 32.600
Italy 1.500
Switzerland 15.000
CSFR 2.117
Macedonia 2.000
Slovenia 4.600
BiH Unknown
Montenegro Unknown
Serbia Unknown

Table 3
The Number of refugees according to the republics from which the 
escaped to the Republic of Croatia on 17 Juli, 1992

BiH 336.300
Macedonia 73
Serbia 114
Volvodina 18.540
Kosovo 11.786

Total 366.995

Total in CROATIA 631,860
From: CP6uH@plains.NoDak.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia
Subject: Note ( VREME NDA 22 Jul 1992 )
Date: 22 Jul 92 19:20:48 GMT
Organization: University of North Dakota at Grand Forks


    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
     "Vreme" News Digest Agency                       No. 43, July 20, 1992
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Note
    ----


                           Without Zivorad Kovacevic


    Among Panic's ministerial candidates, in addition to the others that did
    not  figure on  the official   list, was  Zivorad Kovacevic  whom Serbia
    recalled as Yugoslav Ambassador to the United States of America in 1989.
    Neither side  wishes to say anything  about this unbelievable candidacy.
    By all accounts, Panic did not consult anybody but the candidate for the
    post of foreign minister, which imposes a series of questions - from the
    serious attitude of the prime minister designate to his real intentions.

    What is  interesting in the latter  is how long will  Panic have to keep
    convincing  Washington's state  and  financial  authorities of  his real
    intent to  implement his policy.  In other words,  what kind of  and how
    much support  did Panic get  with the permission  to take over  as prime
    minister in Yugoslavia. Judging by  the movements of the warships, Panic
    would  more than  welcome a  person  who  enjoyed such  a reputation  as
    Kovacevic  did in  America. Perhaps  he would  equally welcome America's
    engagement in Zagreb and Sarajevo.
                                                                        Z.J.


    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
     "Vreme" News Digest Agency                       No. 43, July 20, 1992
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------


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Newsgroups: soc.culture.yugoslavia