From: varnavas@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (varnavas constantine)
Subject: Re: Macedonian World Congress
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 20:43:27 GMT

sachz@montebello.ecom.unimelb.EDU.AU (SAS) writes:

Nice revision of history!  It even rivals the Mighty One, a.k.a Hasan B.
Mutlu, a.k.a Serdar Argic.  I couldn't refrain from answering to a few of
the most obvious revisions.

> 3) Macedonian was never a region of Greece. On the contrary, Greece
>    was often subject to Macedonia. In 1913, Greece and her Balkan
>    allies partitioned Macedonia, and if today a portion of
>    Macedonian belongs to Greece, it is by virtue of an illegal
>    partition of the whole and occupation of a part of Macedonia.

Do those who still have doubts about the territorial claims of "M" on
Greek territory still need more proof?  How about those that say that
the citizens of "M" do not lay any claims on ethnic and cultural 
heritage from ancient Macedonians?

>   The Macedonian "barbarian" defeated Greece at the battle of
>Chaeronea in August 338 B.C. and appointed himself "Commander of the
>Greeks." The date is commonly takes as the end of Greek history and
>the beginning of the Macedonian era.

Hm!  I suppose that the Hellenistic era, Byzantium, Modern Greek history,
etc. are part of the Macedonian History?  Then as Spyros Triantafyllopoulos
said, modern Greeks (or should we call them Southern Macedonians) are brethren!

> * In the sixth century, the Paeones, now called Slavs, came back

So they just changed their name to Slavs?  (Notice no mention of the
settlement of Slavs, a distinct nation from the previous inhabitants of
the area).

>   Dobrudja with their herds. Since the sixth century, the native
>   Macedonian language had been the dominant speech of the land. It
>   was first systematized in the middle of the ninth Christian
>   century by SS. Cyril and Methodius, the apostles of the Slavs who
>   were born in Thessalonica, Solun. The Macedonian language has
>   functioned as the principal literary, liturgical, and colloquial
>   language of Macedonia ever since.

However, there is no mention of a "Macedonian" language from that era.
Cyril and Methodius (who were Greeks, unlike what the revisionist passage
implies) systematized the SLAVIC language.  This is why the slavic alphabet
is also known as Cyrillic alphabet.

> * In 867, the first European dynasty assumed power in medieval East
>   Rome. The dynasty is called Macedonian because the parents of its
>   founder, Basil I, originated from the Byzantine province of
>   Macedonia. The Macedonian rulers in Byzantium spoke Macedonian
>   and Greek and thought of themselves as Macedonians and Rhomaioi.

Basil I was a Byzantine emperor of Greek heritage.  He did not speak
Macedonian.  He thought of himself as a Byzantine.

> * In 1827, the Christian European powers intervened on behalf of
>   Greek rebels and forced the Turks to grant them independence. In
>   1832, the same powers established the first modern Greek state,
>   chose Prince Otto of Bavaria to be "King of the Hellenes", and
>   sent him to Athens.

So the Greeks had nothing to with their independence!  The Great Powers
just gave it to them!

> * Macedonian entered this century as a province of the Ottoman
>   Empire, divided among the Solun, Bitola, and Kosovo vilayets.
>   The region was occupied primarily by Macedonians. The census in
>   the three vilayets taken by the Ottoman state in 1905 found
>   3,181,690 inhabitants. Other than to Macedonians, this region was
>   home to many Albanians, Turks, Romi, Vlachs, Jews, and Greeks.

But the census of 1905 does not indicate any Macedonian nation!  It
mentions all the above nationalities but no Macedonians.  The Census was
posted several times in s.c.g.

> * The Republic of Macedonia was created out of the ashes of the
                                  ^^^^^^^ (true)
>   Second World War by Josip Broz Tito, the anti-fascist leader of
>   Yugoslavia, who recognized the Macedonians as a distinct people
                    ^^^^^^^^^^ (read: created)
>   with their own nationalist, language, and culture when he created
>   modern Yugoslavia. Macedonia became a sovereign state by a
>   popular referendum held in September 1991 when the majority of
>   voters chose independence.


>   Linguistic continuity between the ancient and modern Macedonians
>is shown by the survival of Philip's original native name. Philip
>was known abroad as 'Philippos'. The native Macedonian and Thracian
>form of his name was recorded in the name of the Thracian town which
>he has conquered and named 'Pulpudeva', "the city of Philip". In the
>language of its Slavic citizens it is known today as 'Plovdiv'.

Nice try!

>the idiom called Macedonian or Old Church Slavic.

So which is it?  Macedonian is an ancient language or a Slavic language?

-- 
Constantinos Varnavas
University of Illinois
Xref: sparky soc.culture.yugoslavia:10037 soc.culture.croatia:69