X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.hellas
Date:         Wed, 15 Apr 1992 19:36:01 PDT
Reply-To:     Perikles Konstantinides <perkon%aludra.usc.edu@USC.EDU>
From:         Perikles Konstantinides <perkon%aludra.usc.edu@USC.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Apavtnsn stov Avtwvn gia PASOK
Comments: To: PANTSIAL%SPOTVA%SNYPOTVA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu
Comments: cc: hellas@uga.cc.uga.edu
              "PANTSIAL%SPOTVA%SNYPOTVA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu" at Apr 15,
              92 4:26 pm

> Oso gia tn frasn "o Mevios Koutsogiwrgas eivai mia
> trafikn figoura stn sygxrovn ellnvikn politikn zwn", tnv opoia avefera se
> eva mou posting otav pethave o Koutsogiwrgas, prosferetai ws syvnthws out of
> context. Osoi kata kairous exouv diabasei tis theseis mou, gvwrizouv ta
> aisthnmata mou gia tov makaritn. Kai av kapoios dei tnv poreia tou Koutso-
> giwrga, ap' ta poly xamnla sta poly psnla, kai thavato katw apo tis gvwstes
> syvthnkes, mesa sto Dikastnrio, kai gvwrizei tnv evvoia tns leksns
> "tragikos",
> mporei va katalabei tnv evvoia tns frasns. O kakopistos omws, to movo pou
> prospathei va kavei, eivai va apodwsei stov syggrafea ypovoies sympatheias
> stov makaritn Koutsogiwrga. Ayta ta liga gia to thema ayto.

               Nai o axreios: se parexhghsa! San den ntrepomai ligo na se
      0ewrw prasinofrouro, eidika ustera apo osa les parakatw.... Ts, ts, ts
      ntroph mou.... Exw merikes apories omws, gia sunexise:

> Stnv ousia twra twv erwtnsewv tou Avtwvn. Na avaferw prwta oti egrapsa
> kapoies
> skepseis mou gia to apotelesma tns eklogns stn B' Athnvwv se prongoumevo
> posting mou, opou kyriws ypostnriza oti av to PASOK thelei va metatrepsei
> polles apo tis psnfous diamartyrias pou pnre, se psnfous empistosyvns, prepei
> va doulepsei sklnra gia va avavewsei tous desmous empistosyvns me strwmata me
> ta opoia apoksevwthnke tnv periodo 87-89.

             Mporeis isws na mas upen0umiseis giati xa0hkan autoi oi
      "desmoi empistosunhs"; Ti egine akribws dhladh; Mhpws forese o
      Papandreou palhomoditiko sakaki kai tsantisthkan oi pshfoforoi;
      Mhpws emathan oti tou aresei to mprokolo kai ahdiasan kai ton
      "maurisan" stis ekloges; Gia kanto mas ligo liana, auto....

> Gia to apotelesma ayto katheayto
> stis eswterikes ekselikseis sto PASOK, prepei vamaste prosektikoi priv bga-
> loume symperasmata. Kai prwta ap' ola va mnv katngoroume tov lao oti odngnse
> tnv politikn zwn pros ta pisw. Giati, o kosmos pou pnge va psnfisei, dev eixe
> gvwmova tis eswterikes ekselikseis mesa sto PASOK. O kosmos se mia tetoia
> eklogn dev psnfizei gia ksekatharisma eswkommatikwv logariasmwv, alla gia
> themata kai problnmata oikovomika, koivwvika, ethvika.

           Auth thn dhlwsh na thn 0umasai ean bgeis kai mas peis oti o
      laos "parasur0hke" apo ekstrateia spilwshs enantion tou Papandreou
      to 1989 kai pshfise ND....

> H ND ekselegn priv 2
> xrovia me tnv yposxesn va MHN meiwsei to pragmatiko eisodnma twv ergazomevwv
> (to brovtofwvaze se kathe poln kai xwrio o vyv prokathnmevos tns kybervnsns,
> alla kai Ypourgos Ekswterikwv, kai Ypourgos Aigaiou), kai va dnmiourgnsei
> 100.000 vees theseis ergasias sta prwta 2 xrovia tns diakybervnsns tns. Twra
> ola ayta bebaia akougovtai asteia. Mesa s' ayta ta dyo xrovia, dev lythnke
> sxedov kaveva problnma kai dnmiourgnthnkav xilia vea.

            Oudemia dhladh diafora apo ta OXTW XRONIA tou PASOK, to opoio
       den ekane TIPOTE apo osa eixe uposxe0ei to 1981 kai paredwse sthn
       Nea Dhmokratia mia xwra se APEIRWS xeiroterh katastash apo o,ti
       otan thn parelabe. Giati loipon diamarturesai; Mia apo ta idia...

> H krisn eivai batheia kai ta ethvika problnmata diogkwthnkav.

          Wra einai na kathgorhseis ton Mhtsotakh gia thn katarreush tou
      ka0estwtos Alia kai ton emfulio polemo sthn Giougkoslabia... Wra einai
      na to akousoume ki auto apo ton "metriopa0h" Arxonth...

> O kosmos esteile eva mnvyma gia ola
> ayta, to PASOK diekdikei tnv eksousia stn Dnmokratia tns xwras mas, kai to
> av bgnke kerdismevos o A. Papavdreou eivai allo thema, epnrreia tns avti-
> kybervntikns psnfou. S' aytes tis ekloges to PASOK eixe katebei evwmevo oso
> pote allote, kai ta kerdn eivai "moirasmeva". Sigoura omws dev perimeves va
> psnfisei o mesos Athnvaios, rwtwvtas tov eayto tou av ayto tha bonthnsei
> tov Avdrea kai av ferei "ekselikseis" sto PASOK.

          Edw o Arxonths ginetai ... exposed, pou tha elege kai o Mutlu:

> Edw va prosthesw oti
> pisteyw oti av to PASOK thelei va meivei evwmevo stnv meta-papavdreikn epoxn,
> exei megalyteres pithavotntes va to kavei oxi me "yperbasn" tou Proedrou tou
> ("patroktovia" tha tnv ovomaze kaveis), alla me evergo to rolo tou Proedrou
> tou stn METABATIKH periodo. Ayto dyskola mporouv va to katalabouv osoi
> arvouvtai va douv realistika tov rolo tou A. Papavdreou stn dnmiourgia tou
> PASOK kai tnv metepeita poreia tou.

          Edw exei dikho o Arxonths... Ti na prwto0umh0ei kaneis; Tis
       diwxeis tou '76; Tis sunoptikes diagrafes melwn; Ton xarakthrismo
       melwn ws pousthdwn gia na tous xefortw0ei; Ton ari0mo (2 ....)
       Sunedriwn tou PASOK gia thn ekfrash ths bashs; Thn xrhsh tou E.G.
       kai ths K.E. san forum doxasias tou Arxhgou kai edraiwshs ths
       proswpikhs tou monokratorias; Ton ari0mo sunedriasewn ths Koino-
       bouleutikhs omadas tou Kommatos; Thn prow0hsh OIKOGENEIAKWN melwn,
       prwta ths "omadas" Margaritas kai twra ths "omadas" Dhmhtras, eis
       baros melwn me megalh prouphresia kai drash; Thn ka0e examhno
       uposxesh oti 0a enisxu0ei h eswkommatikh dhmokratia; Ti;

         Einai safes oti xwris ton Andrea to PASOK, an mh ti allon, 0a
       htan dhmokratikwtero komma.... Meta ton lew Aurianisth ton Arxonth
       kai me kathgorei gia kakoh0eia... The guy boggles the mind....

> Ayto omws dev snmaivei oti dev exei "wrimasei" to PASOK.

               San ntomata ton Augousto. Arkei na sou 0umisw tis krauges
       tou arxhgou sou perusi sto Pedio tou Arews: "Poulhsan ta braxonhsia,
       se ligo tha poulhsoun kai thn Akropolh"......

               Tetoia wrimothta....

> Aytn tn stigmn, oi
> perissoteroi sto Kivnma taytizovtai me tnv parataksn kai oxi avagkastika me
> tov Arxngo tou. Etoimazovtai gia tnv poreia sto mellov xwris tov idrytn tns
> parataksns, otav erthei etoutn n wra.

              Siga re Arxonth, polu sugkinhtika mas ta les: tha mas paroun
       ta dakrua gia ton epikeimeno 0anato tou Messia re paidi....

> To PASOK apo movo tou kai mesa apo tis
> katastatikes tou diadikasies, tha apofasisei ayto to mellov, kai oxi gia va
> ikavopoinsei tous "eksw" pou protimouv tnv mia n tnv alln grammn. Yparxouv
> polla ikava stelexn sto PASOK pou apnxouv tis diafores apopseis tns basns.
> Egw mporei vaxw (kai exw) tis dikes mou protimnseis, alla pavta givetai
> sygkerasmos apopsewv gia tn dnmiourgia tou efiktou. H ellnvikn koivwvia kai
> n poreia tns stnv Eyrwpn avagkastika tha epnreasei tis opoies ekselikseis sto
> PASOK. Thelw vamai aisiodoksos oti aytn n poreia tha eivai dnmokratikn,
> proodeytikn kai aksiopistn.

            Allh mia megalofuhs politikh tou PASOK kai tou arxhgou tou, thn
      opoia bebaia, conveniently, thn kanoume twra brushed aside san na
      htan lepra, etsi; "EOK kai NATO to idio sundikato..."

            Den xexnw thn oktaetia 1981-89 kai den tha afhsw kanenan sthn
      lista auth na xexasei filarako oso kai na theleis esu na parousiazeis
      to PASOK san ananhpsan.....

> Oso gia tnv erwtnsn tou pws krivw tnv ekswterikn politikn tou PASOK, thewrw
> tnv opoia syzntnsn akadnmaikn kai oligov ti parelkystikn.

             Kala eisai: gia thn tampakiera logos na mhn ginetai....

> To PASOK mporei va
> epidothnke se orismeves akrotntes (agkalies me Kavtafi, klp),

     ... h opoia mas stoixise thn kakh dia0esh ths Gallias kai thn proswpikh
     psuxrothta tou Mitterand.....    (na teleiwneis tis protaseis sou)

> alla n sthevarn ypostnriksn ethvikwv thesewv odngnse metaksy allwv kai
> sta Mesogeiaka Oloklnrwmeva Programmata.

          Auto einai PSEMMA kai paraplhroforhsh:

          1. Ta MOP htan koinh apaithsh Elladas-Irlandias-Ispanias-Portogalias
       kai oxi mono ths Ellados.
          2. Ta MOP den htan tipote parapanw apo auxhsh twn konduliwn gia ta
       legomena diarthrwtika programmata-dhladh thn elehmosunh twn Boreiwn
       pros tou Notious-pou tous do0hke diaforetiko onoma gia na ta dextoun
       oi hgetes tou Borra kai na ta "xwnepsoun" oi pshfoforoi tous.
          3. H Ellada aporrofhse apo ta MOP gurw sto 20% (EIKOSI TOIS EKATO)
       twn konduliwn kathe xrono.... Ta upoloipa emeinan adia0eta giati h
       Kubernhsh epaize me to petsaki ths otan eprepe na upoballei ek0eseis
       aporrofhshs tous....
          4. Polu megaluterh uphresia stn xwra tha eixan prosferei ean, anti
       na zhtane elehmosunes, MEIWNAN TA ELEIMMATA, MEIWNAN TA EPITOKIA KAI
       BOH0OYSAN TIS IDIWTIKES EPENDYSEIS.... Poia an0ousa idiwtikh etairia
       apekthse h Ellada apo to 1981 mexri to 1989, Arxonth; Kammia, na sou
       to pw egw ean den to xereis.....

> Xwris v' avaferthw stov thetikotato rolo pou diedramatise
> kai diadramatizei n Basw Papavdreou, epifaves stelexos tou PASOK stnv Eyrwpn.

               Stelexos tou PASOK sthn Eurwph; Mhpws sou xefuge kana komma;

> Stnv Eyrwpn, opou exei strepsei tov prosavatolismo tou to PASOK, afnvovtas
> stnv akrn ta lavthasmeva tritokosmika peiramata.

           Sternh mou gnwsh na s' eixa prwta. Kai erwtw: giati na empisteutei
     o Ellhnikos laos ena komma pou exei ANTISTREPSEI OLES SXEDON TIS BASIKES
     TOY POLITIKES DIAKYRHXEIS kai na mhn empisteutei to komma pou PANTOTE
     aspazotan TIS 0ESEIS POY TO ALLO KOMMA TELEYTAIA   A N A G K A S 0 H K E
     na aspas0ei; Giati;

> Snmera omws, kyberva tnv Ellada
> n ND, aytn pairvei apofaseis, kai pros ekei prepei kyriws va eivai strammevn
> n kritikn, giati oi opoies apofaseis tns krivouv to mellov mas.

            Kahkes megale giati to PASOK apeilei na epanel0ei sthn exousia kai
      emeis ths allhs pleuras exoume thn upoxrewsh na upen0umizoume ston
      Ellhniko Lao poia akribws einai h enallaktikh lush, ti presbeuei kai
      poio einai to parel0on ths.

            Den mou les omws: erxesai kai mou kaneis esu ma0hma kaloh0eias
      thn stigmh pou exw bgei apeires fores kai exw kraxei thn Kubernhsh gia
      tis anohsies pou kanei kai thn a0ethsh uposxesewn. ESY omws kurie
      metriopa0h kai kale suzhthth, POTE ekraxes to PASOK gia ta osa aisxh
      ekane kai sunexizei kai kanei;

            Katalabes poia einai h diafora mas kai giati oute sto mikro mou
      daxtulaki den mporeis na ftaseis;

> Perase omws n wra, kai prepei va kleivw.

           Ante kai skepasou mhn kruwseis.

> Filika,
>
> Arxovtns


PFK
Southern Cal ................... akomh perimenw na mou pei o Arxonths TI
                                 akribws tha kanei to PASOK thn exousia:
                                 POIO einai to programma tou kai POIES oi
                                 ideologikes tou theseis; Mhpws oi ....
                                 "kaluteres hmeres" kai to koritsaki ths
                                 afissas;
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU