From: tomh@wes.on.ca (Tom Haapanen)
Subject: CFV:  comp.windows.ms reorganization
Followup-To: poster
Reply-To: vote@wes.on.ca
Organization: Waterloo Engineering Software
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 18:16:09 GMT

				CALL FOR VOTES
				--------------
			comp.windows.ms reorganization

This proposal includes the moving of the comp.windows.ms hierarchy from the
current comp.windows subtree to the comp.os subtree, to comp.os.ms-windows.

Further, this proposal includes six new newsgroups designed to reduce the
volume of traffic in the existing groups in the windows hierarchy to
manageable levels, as well as the renaming of the two existing general 
groups to .misc groups for consistency with the rest of the comp hierarchy.
The current level of traffic is approaching 2000 messages/month in the main
group, and is expected to increase with the impending release of Windows 3.1.
The current Arbitron-estimated readership is 95,000.

The proposed moderator for the Windows hierarchy .announce group is Todd Derr
(infidel@unix.cis.pitt.edu).

This Call for Votes consists of two parts: first, the ballot form you need to
fill out to vote for or against the groups, and second, a detailed explanation
of the proposed groups.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~cut here~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~cut here~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

HOW TO VOTE:
    For each of the following proposals, enter YES or NO after the colon at
    the end of the line (or leave blank if you do not wish to express a
    preference).  Return the completed ballot to vote@wes.on.ca, to be
    received by 11:59 pm, May 3, 1992.  Received votes will be
    ackowledged en masse in a posting to news.announce.newgroups.


PART 1:

    MOVE comp.windows.ms TO comp.os.ms-windows         :


PART 2: these group names are relative to either comp.os.ms-windows or to
	comp.windows.ms, depending on the result of the vote in PART 1.

    RENAME base group to .misc                         :
    RENAME base .programmer group to .programmer.misc  :
    CREATE new group .advocacy                         :
    CREATE new group .announce (moderated)             :
    CREATE new group .apps                             :
    CREATE new group .setup                            :
    CREATE new group .programmer.tools                 :
    CREATE new group .programmer.win32                 :

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~cut here~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~cut here~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

A. MOVE comp.windows.ms TO comp.os.ms-windows

    "An operating system provides the means for the proper use of [hardware,
    software and data] in the operation of the computer system.  Like a
    government, the operating system performs no useful function by itself.
    It simply provides an environment within which other programs can do
    useful work."  [_Operating_System_Concepts_, Peterson and Silberschatz]

    For all the debate about Windows versions deserving the title "Operating
    System", it should not be doubted that Windows is intended to be one.  No
    one would doubt that Windows NT is a complete operating system, and upon
    closer examination, Windows 3.0 Enhanced mode should be recognised as a
    complete operating system which lacks only a native file system. Windows
    Enhanced mode fields all hardware access, and performs all process control
    and memory management functions. Sometimes Windows passes on virtual I/O
    requests to the virtualised MS-DOS which is encapsulated by Windows, in
    order that MS-Dos can use 'old' device drivers, TSRs and applications,
    and sometimes Windows passes on physical I/O requests to its own native
    device driver model known as VxDs or "Virtual Device Drivers".  It is not
    correct to say that Windows runs "on top of" MS-Dos, rather, once Windows
    is loaded Windows runs on top of the hardware, encapsulates MS-DOS, and
    uses it for backward compatibility.  Windows NT does not use any part of
    MS-DOS at any time to perform its functions.

    If comp.os.cpm & comp.os.msdos are deserving of their place in the
    hierarchy, then comp.os.windows is more deserving.  Windows competes
    with OS/2, AT&T Unix, Solaris, NextStep, Univell, OSF/1 and Macintosh
    for the attention of developers and customers.  Windows NT clearly
    belongs in the comp.os hierarchy, and it would be wrong to separate
    comp.os.windows.nt and comp.windows.ms, since they have a common API,
    a common user interface and a common set of applications.

    Finally, whether or not you agree that Windows is an operating system,
    millions of Windows users do believe it.  Placing the hierarchy at
    comp.os.ms-windows will make it easier for these users to find the 
    correct newsgroup.

    Now is the time to move comp.windows.ms to comp.os.ms-windows, and to
    discuss relevant issues in the relevant place.

----------------------------------------

B. CREATE and/or RENAME groups as shown below:

    {base-group-name} is either comp.windows.ms or comp.os.ms-windows,
    depending on the result of the vote on moving to the comp.os hierarchy.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.announce
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Moderated by Todd Derr <infidel@unix.cis.pitt.edu>
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This moderated newsgroup is intended for all
		       announcements relating to the Windows environment.
		       This may include, but is not limited to, Windows
		       software products, Windows-compatible hardware and
		       any Windows-related conferences and other events.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.apps
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for discussions about the
		       applications available for running in the Microsoft
		       Windows environment.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.setup
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for discussions and questions
		       about the Windows setup and installation process,
		       hardware compatability issues as well as general
		       hardware use and performance issues.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.advocacy
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for general-level discussions
		       about Windows, and especially rumors, speculation,
		       unannounced products, pricing, support, upgrade poli-
		       cies, and comparisons to other operating systems.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.misc  (RENAMED)
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for all other discussion and
		       questions about specific Windows issues, such as topics
		       relating to Program and File Managers and use of fonts,
		       except issues covered by {base-group-name}.advocacy.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.programmer.tools
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for discussion and questions
		       about Windows development tools.  This includes topics
		       such as compiler selection, help compiler, CASE tools,
		       integrated environments and any tool-specific issues
		       (such as using DLLs from Visual Basic).

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.programmer.win32
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for discussion and questions
		       about the Win32 32-bit Windows API (application prog-
		       ramming interface), including Windows NT and Win32s.

    PROPOSED NAME:     {base-group-name}.programmer.misc  (RENAMED)
    PROPOSED STATUS:   Unmoderated.
    PROPOSED CHARTER:  This group is intended for all other discussion and
		       questions about specific Windows development issues,
		       such as DLLs, DDE, OLE, handles, memory management,
		       common dialogs and other relevant issues.

----------------------------------------

ARBITRON STATISTICS FOR comp.windows.ms.*

       +-- Estimated total number of people who read the group, worldwide.
       |     +-- Actual number of readers in sampled population
       |     |     +-- Propagation: how many sites receive this group at all
       |     |     |      +-- Recent traffic (messages per month)
       |     |     |      |      +-- Recent traffic (kilobytes per month)
       |     |     |      |      |    +-- Crossposting percentage
       |     |     |      |      |    |    +-- Cost ratio: $US/month/rdr
       |     |     |      |      |    |    |     +-- Share: % of newsreaders
       |     |     |      |      |    |    |     |   who read this group.
       V     V     V      V      V    V    V     V
Last month (March):
 31  95000  1940  86%  1850  2852.2 12%  0.05  4.5%  comp.windows.ms
142  53000  1090  82%   680  1006.6  4%  0.03  2.5%  comp.windows.ms.programmer

Previous month (February):
 48  75000  1709  87%  1554  2388.0  6%  0.06  4.0%  comp.windows.ms
157  45000  1021  82%   820  1176.0  7%  0.04  2.4%  comp.windows.ms.programmer
-- 
[ \tom haapanen    "i don't even know what street canada is on" -- al capone ]
[ tomh@wes.on.ca                   "trust the programmer" -- ansi c standard ]
[ waterloo engineering software      "to thine own self be true" -- polonius ]
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.databases