HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dml@Athena.MIT.EDU
Subject: Psionics question
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 19:44:43 GMT

Well, I was home for the holidays and got to play lots of torg
(in my now 2+ year campaign).  We had some new players with
the group who asked some good questions that I'll try to ask
about as I remember them.

One player wanted to have a psionics character who was a fire-
starter.  Now, having avoided the Space Gods book because of
all the flaming on the net (I have it, but have never had a 
space gods character in my campaign) and not seeing anything
like this in the book, I persuaded him to choose something else,
explaining that the psionics rules were terrible.

1)  Are they really *that* bad?  Has anyone tried to play
    or gm a Space Gods character that used psionics?

2)  I saw the "energy channeling" power in the book, but that
    just refocuses existing energy and doesn't create energy
    (i.e. he wouldn't be able to create the fire but would have
    to use a lighter or a flamethrower).  Any ideas for a
    power closer to what my player was looking for?

The campaign (which included Brian Postow: the pasta knight, and
t. erik brown) also introduced some new eternity shards, we got
our first glory card played and had our first death.  I'll post
shard stats and a synopsis later.

--dave 

---------------------------------------------------------------
Dave LaMacchia                               dml@athena.mit.edu
From: jogle@aoc.nrao.edu (Ks. Jim)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: More Nile calendar stuff
Date: 4 Jan 93 16:45:43 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

While I was figuring out the Nile planet cycles I also worked out the
Egyptian calendar; seasons, months, holidays, etc.  (And in another
case of synchronicity, holidays sacred to diety X were occuring on days
that planet was configured!)  I will try and get that info posted this
afternoon.

Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: New book
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 22:41:46 GMT

Came across this ad in the latest issue of _Asimov's Science Fiction
Magazine_:

GOD ISN'T DEAD UNTIL YOU PULL THE PLUG.

(Cover artwork for "Deus X", by Norman Spinrad)

The earth is finished, ozone fried, greenhouse choked, a dying world.
Humanity is barely hanging on, struggling against rising oceans,
polluted air, its callous abuse of the planet.  Our last hope is the
Big Board: a vast electronic net containing media, education, finance -
and new, controversial duplicates of its human users.  They're called
successor entities, renegade pixel energies, struggling for self-
identity.  And now, during earth's final hour, the Roman Catholic
Church confronts the ultimate challenge....

-----
Now what does this remind you of?

Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
From: Dave_Wetzel@vos.stratus.com (David Wetzel)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Scatterzone
Followup-To: alt.games.torg
Date: 7 Jan 1993 16:36:03 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: dwetzel.mis.stratus.com

In article <910427m.95.726413841@axe.acadiau.ca>, 910427m@axe.acadiau.ca
(JASON MATTHEW MCDONALD) wrote:

> I hate to bring something like this up on the Holy Torg Group, but what does 
> everybody know about Scatterzone( I think that's it's name) the new West End 
> Game?  Any idea on rules basis (Torg, StarWars, innovative new system), or 
> basic plot of game?
> 
> Any info would undoubtedly be interesting.

Well, it's in playtest now (our group's got it).  It's based on Torg with a
lot of changes.  I don't know how much I'm allowed to say about it just now
and it's far from complete, suffice it to say that Torg-sters (Torg-ites? 
Torg-ers?) will recognise most of the rule concepts.  It is much closer to
hard-science fiction than the space-opera of StarWars or the science
fantasy of Torg.

Thanks,
Dave_Wetzel@vos.stratus.com
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: PERRY@acsd5.dnet.ge.com
Subject: Re: Infiniverse #29
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 15:43:00 GMT


>> NEGATING POSSIBILITIES: According to whoever answers the letters,
>> *anyone* who is aware of what is going on in a given situation can
>> cancel a Possibility that has been spent, not just the person who is
>> being acted upon (which is how I and most people seem to have
>> interpreted that rule).  The example they give is six Storm Knights
>> against one P-rated villain; if the villain spends a Possibility on a
>> die roll, any of those six (who are conscious) may negate the P-Point.

> To put it simply (IMHgm'ingO) ... NOT!!!  This response would imply such
> things as: Priest 'blesses' himself, fails, and spends a p-point -- enemy
> counters, even though the bless has nothing to do with enemy.  With a
> precedent like this, I can see no reason to deny a player who says, "I
> *know* he's burning a p-point to reduce damage -- I want to counter!". 
> Either you can only counter those p-points that are threatening to you, or
> you can counter anything, anytime, anywhere.

> BTW, for those of you who do require awareness for countering, how do you
> play said sniper?  Obviously you can't counter a p-point spent to increase
> the shot (since, if the sniper knows his job, the SK isn't aware), but can
> the Knight reduce damage once the shot is fired?

Our group has always played that if you are aware of a P-point being spent
it can be countered with the only exception being those spent on damage.
As far as a the sniper, our debate allows only the target to cancel this
(somehow justified, because he/she is directly being affected and gains some
 inate protection - Otherwise, we would have taken out HighLords and their
 minions long ago)

     __       ____            __   
    /\ \     /  \ \          /_/\ Brian Perry
   //\\_\   / /\ \_\        _\_\/  perry@Taurus.dnet.ge.com
  / \// /   \ \/ /_/___    / /\
 /   /_/     \  ____/_/   / / /   "You can't have everything, 
/ /\ \_\      \ \ \      / / /     Where would you put it?"
\ \/ / /       \ \_\    /_/ /
 \__/_/         \/_/    \_\/
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: cpearce@nemesis.acs.unt.edu (Chris Pearce)
Subject: Re: Infiniverse #29
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:06:43 GMT

> NEGATING POSSIBILITIES: According to whoever answers the letters,
> *anyone* who is aware of what is going on in a given situation can
> cancel a Possibility that has been spent, not just the person who is
> being acted upon (which is how I and most people seem to have
> interpreted that rule).  

> Now, since they say you have to be aware of what is going on, that
> would imply (to me at least) that if you don't know someone is
> spending a P-Point (say a sniper targeting your unsuspecting head, or
> a ninja you aren't expecting making a Stealth roll) you cannot negate
> it.  We discussed that a few months ago but I don't think we ever
> arrived at a net-consensus.

Well, that's a nice sort of implicit ruling. It makes surprise attacks
from Stealth more effective, that's for sure... (as well as Tricks,
Manuevers, etc.) I like the change, I think. (I like it, that is, until
the first time I get attacked by surprise!)

> Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)

-- 
Chris Pearce -- cpearce@nemesis.acs.unt.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Re: REVIEW: Character Collection (long!) [not really]
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:20:05 GMT

Rick writes:

> 	Hmm, well, the powerful characters in my game have been playing
> over a year, once a week (minus vacations and such).   They also learned
> the trick of, when making a new character, buy lots of skills at level
> one.  That makes it easier in the long run, as you don't have to shell out
> 5/10 possibilities each time you want a new skill.  This works even better
> for experienced characters.

Thats about the situation with the high end of the current crop of
characters in my game, though we haven't averaged gaming once a week
very often (really sucks when no one else has a flexible schedule).

> 	All the pictures make Kyoto look very bulky, like SWAT team
> body armor (but moreso).  Consider the scale in CoD, however.  The
> Samarui Battlesuits were as large as techno-demons, which makes them
> much bigger then humans.  

Hmmm...could be, but doesn't one of the pictures show the PCs with a
guy in Samurai armor?  He wasn't that much larger as I recall.

I'm just wondering why we haven't seen anything from Kanawa (so far)
that takes advantage of the higher Tech axiom in LA; if Kanawa already
has factories and production centers there, why is it taking so long
to churn out the stuff?  Surely he's still got the plans from his
Cyberpapal installations and it didn't take any time for them to bring
out a Tech 27 knockoff of an Akashan weapon down in S. America.


Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Re:  Disconnection Question
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 21:20:42 GMT

Dave writes:

> i was most disconcerted with the 40+ result, and the comment
> "gotta love the bravery miracle"
> now, i have no idea of the mechanics of the bravery miracle
> (up or somesuch, i think)
> but this specific application unnerves me
> in most cases, i wouldnt care about the axiom level of the miraclee's action,
>but in this case,it is specifically a god that likes his axioms where they are
> on top of a world law that enforces them
> so the question is:
>should a ravok miracle be able to help when being contradictory? (to T'zRavok)

I'm afraid I don't understand your question here; how is the miracle
being contradictory to Tz'Ravok?  It is within Tz'Ravoks Spiritual
axiom so it isn't a contradiction to the ravagon regardless of what
realm he is in.

Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Re: REVIEW: Character Collection (long!)
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 19:06:57 GMT

Smooge begs:

> Jim just read this post please put one possibility point on Zeke please
> since I know the reference :).

But who says that Zeke knows the reference?  Sorry, you'll get the PP
but your character doesn't qualify.  8-)


Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
From: burt@ptltd.com (Burton Choinski)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Psionics question
Date: 4 Jan 93 20:17:43 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

I'd like a copy as well, unless it's stashed on Morticia.
   -- Burton
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: burt@ptltd.com (Burton Choinski)
Subject: Re:  Active Defense
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:07:03 GMT

Well, not really, but I was lazy and just replied instead of looking up
the address and posting...:p
-----
I have some people starting to look at Nippon Tech for character sources.
One of the maneuvers 'Stunning blow' appears to be worthless...all hand
to hand damage is "stunning blows" (the way I play it, unless you have
something hard to convert it to killing, like brass nuckles, or have "strike".
How do you make this maneuver worthwhile?
    -- Burton
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Rick Jones <albert@crick.ssctr.bcm.tmc.edu>
Subject: Re: Psionics question
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 20:07:02 GMT

> One player wanted to have a psionics character who was a fire-
> starter.  Now, having avoided the Space Gods book because of
> all the flaming on the net (I have it, but have never had a 

> 1)  Are they really *that* bad?  Has anyone tried to play
>     or gm a Space Gods character that used psionics?

	Well, I have some problems with it, and made a homebrew
system somewhat along the lines of the magic spell system.  If 
you're curious, I'll dig out some email I sent to someone with
a similar question.  Be warned, my method keeps "super-detector"
from being "super-telekinetic", but allows them outrageous levels
of power in something they're specialized.

	I missed "firestarter".  I'd put it in the same group with
energy routing.  Perhaps something along the lines of TK.
-- 
Rick Jones		"People come back from the dead all the time.  I mean,
albert@bcm.tmc.edu	 I've come back from the dead.  I bet you have to!"
Systems Support Center	"Well... Yes, I have.  But I AM a professional."
Voice: 713-798-7352	       -Rick Jones and Dr Strange, Incredible Hulk #399
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: burt@ptltd.com (Burton Choinski)
Subject: Re: Stunning Blow
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:50:15 GMT

Okay, I guess that will have to do.  So many maneuvers 9Felling the Oak, 
Stone Fist, etc) have the same damage and are effectively the same
(game wise, not visual wise)
     -- Burton
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Re: Disconnection Question
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 19:25:09 GMT

Colin writes:

> > He would still disconnect with the blaster since he does not support
> > its existence.  Since the area he is in does support the weapon, it is
> > only a 1-case contradiction and not a 4-case.
> 
> OK, about what I figured.  This, I assume, is because the 'reality bubble'
> from LoMost Real replaces standard SG Mixed Zones?  Or is it actually
> possible to disconnect with a one-case in a mixed zone (I know, a dumb
> question -- but, other than this adven, I really can't recall the last
> time I played in a mixed zone...)?

It is still possible to disconnect in a mixed zone if the character
himself does not support the action.  An Ayslish character in a CE/SG
mixed zone will still have a 1-case contradiction with a Tech 27 gun
because he doesn't support it.  The Law of the Most Real has no effect
on this situation.

What the Law of the Most Real does is it just allow the ravagon to
avoid disconnection if what he is doing is supported by his reality
but not by the one he is in.  In a SG zone the only thing a ravagon
can do that would be a contradiction to the Space God reality would be
to perform a miracle that is above the SG axioms; the Law of the MR
would keep that from being a contradiction though.

Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Rick Jones <albert@crick.ssctr.bcm.tmc.edu>
Subject: Re: REVIEW: Character Collection (long!) [not really]
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 18:01:21 GMT

> 
> Rick replies:
> 
> (Maintaining spoiler protection, just in case)

> 
> The most experienced characters are pushing the high 50's, but most of
> them are down in the 20's or so.  Of course, most of my players swap
> out their old characters for new ones about once a year so they don't
> get much opportunity to reach the higher ends of experience.  I do

	Hmm, well, the powerful characters in my game have been playing
over a year, once a week (minus vacations and such).   They also learned
the trick of, when making a new character, buy lots of skills at level
one.  That makes it easier in the long run, as you don't have to shell out
5/10 possibilities each time you want a new skill.  This works even better
for experienced characters.
	

> That was pretty much my reaction, but not knowing the situation of the
> campaign the character is from I didn't want to make too many
> conclusions.  If the GM is using the (apparently canon, unfortunately)
> assumption that high-tech Kanawa armor is thin and lightweight (ie,
> the artwork for the Samurai power suits in "City of Demons") then you
> could theoretically disguise it as a business suit.  Me, I've always
> assumed that the Kyoto armor was very Robocop-looking in appearance.

	All the pictures make Kyoto look very bulky, like SWAT team
body armor (but moreso).  Consider the scale in CoD, however.  The
Samarui Battlesuits were as large as techno-demons, which makes them
much bigger then humans.  


-- 
Rick Jones              "People come back from the dead all the time.  I mean,
albert@bcm.tmc.edu       I've come back from the dead.  I bet you have to!"
Systems Support Center  "Well... Yes, I have.  But I AM a professional."
Voice: 713-798-7352          -Rick Jones and Dr Strange, Incredible Hulk #399
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: hudson@dragon.cpe.ulowell.edu (Kevin Maurice Hudson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: languages
Date: 7 Jan 93 23:12:59 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b


==> On Thu, 7 Jan 93 16:04:51 MST, fiacha@jupiter.nmt.edu (Michaael Cantrell) said:

  MC> Regarding the Edeinos use of extended sibilants and pidgin
  MC> English:

  MC> Does the Edeinos (at Tech 7 remember) even rtecognize the brain
  MC> as the seat of higher reasoning power?  Can the DD turn on the
  MC> language machine in an Edeinos brain if the Edeinos doesn't
  MC> possess one.

So, the DD performs a miracle to grant the Edeinos the language
permanently.  The Spiritual axiom should be high enough for that.  It
is also explained in the terms of the genre.

--
Hudson@dragon.cpe.ulowell.edu		uhqfba@qentba.pcr.hybjryy.rqh
Kevin Hudson, Systems Manager		Xriva Uhqfba, Flfgrzf Znantre
Center for Productivity Enahncement	Pragre sbe Cebqhpgvivgl Ranuaprzrag
University of Massachusetts Lowell	Havirefvgl bs Znffnpuhfrggf Ybjryy
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: French verse
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 15:33:59 GMT

Just some mindless stuff I found on one of the Star Trek Usenet groups
this morning...


Sur le pont d'Avignon
L'on y danse, l'on y danse
Sur le pont d'Avignon
L'on y danse tous en rond

The correct english translation for this verse (forget the measure & rhyme, 
please...)

On the bridge of Avignon
We are dancing, we are dancing
On the bridge of Avignon
We are dancing a round


Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Language relations
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1993 17:08:52 GMT

I was going over the language trees and tables that a couple people
posted last month and came up with a couple comments...

Didn't Towlyn make some comment in one of the novels about similarities
between the main Ayslish language and either English or Gaelic or some-
thing like that?  Anyone else remember this or is my subconcious making
things up again?

The language of the Nile is probably related to Arabic, though I figure
that most of the population speaks English (it fits the genre better;
anyone who's not speaking in English is obviously Evil!)

Is it actually said anywhere that the Marketplace language is similar
to Japanese?

Since the Darkness Devices can automatically imprint a native language
into the mind of someone who crosses over a maelstrom bridge (though
it obviously doesn't have to, since the Victorians in Orrorsh still
speak the Queens English), does it imprint the 'proper grammer' form
of a language or does it imprint the 'popular' form of a language?

Everyone has the image of edeinos speaking pidgin English with long
hissing 'S' sounds, but what if all the edeinos that came down in New
York spoke perfect "Brooklynese", including accent and slang?  Or they
were to speak perfect, proper English (the kind you find in business
letters and the like, with 'whom' and 'forthwith' and other big words
like that)?

Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: Re: Active Defense
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:34:49 GMT

Colin writes:

> > This raises the question in my mind of the 'minimum +1 bonus' you get
> > for Point Blank range; is this handled in the same way?  I'll ask WEG
> > tonight (if I remember to 8-) when I check for an answer to the questions
> > I posted last night about negating Possibilities.
> 
> I just talked this one over with my gm:  On the modifiers section of the
> gm screen, M1 is listed as a modifier for to hit value at point blank, but
>*not* for damage.  Meaning, you hit the guy, but you may still only graze him.

Well, I knew that; my question is if you were to do a point blank
vital blow, is the penalty for the vital blow assessed before or after
you apply the 'minimum +1 bonus'?  I've run it both ways over the
course of my campaign though I don't remember why I switched my
interpretation when I did.

Kansas Jim (jogle@aoc.nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg