From: J056600@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Newsgroups: ba.politics
Subject: Re: The Harrassing Phone Calls Can Stop NOW!
Date: 10 Sep 92 21:45:13 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Missiles & Space Company, Inc.

In <8288.12310@stratus.SWDC.Stratus.COM>, Len Bucuvalas writes:

>In article <1992Sep9.175454.14962@odin.corp.sgi.com> zursch@whizkid.wpd.sgi.co

(Quite a bit of old stuff deleted)

>>In article <12164@optilink.UUCP>, Clayton Cramer writes:
>>
>>>A true liberal -- Mr. Bucuvalas believes that the correct
>>>response to free speech is jail time.

A "true" liberal--a *classical* liberal--is actually closer to a libertarian.
Don't you mean a true "left-leaning fascist with an agenda?"  I think what's
what you intended.  I KNOW you weren't trying to call him a libertarian.
And yes, there are fascists on the right also.  Fascism isn't an ideology--it's
a method of enforcing your ideology.

>>
>>I have come to the conclusion that Mr. Bucuvulas is a little scattered in his
>>A few bits short of a byte, if you will.
>>
>>Beyond that, I'd love to see the look on the judge's face as he threw that cas
>>court. They're overbooked these days and don't look kindly on frivolous cases
>>by people who simply don't like each other.

>I am "a few bits short of a byte"???? While Cramer spreads his
>hate talk all over the net and I AM crazy?!?! That's what I love
>abouthtis stae man.....poeple .. to me...seem to have their
>priorities completely reversed.

Gesundheit.

No, many of us disagree on things, but most of us (except fascists who want to
silence people they oppose) come together to support the First Amendment.  I
think *you* have *your* priorities reversed--ignoring the Bill of Rights in
favor of your pet political agenda.  Both the left *and* the right can be
guilty of this, so partisan finger-pointing is best left out of this kind of
fascist rhetoric.

>>
>>You may be a jerk and you may have a screw loose, Clayton, but that's the exte
>>of it.
>He is more than a nut case bud....he is a hate monger. and if
>you can support that then YOU are as bad as he is.

Sounds to me that all he supports is Clayton's *right* to say those things.
I've never heard him say that he agreed with him.  Quite to the contrary...
It also sounds to me that *you* support fascist measures to silence those whose
beliefs you dislike.  This is America...NOT Amerika.  You may feel that Mr.
Cramer is a hatemonger, and that's your right.  However, you have no right to
deny rights to those you oppose--only the right to dissent.

>>I want to add my voice to those calling for any private harassment of you
>>to stop immediately. I would like to suggest to you, though, that sending off
>>organizations is a terrible thing to do, as was your suggestion that you may g
>You are attempting to reach a blind and deaf person...blind and
>deaf to all except his own slef-contained hatred.

Don't blind and deaf people have rights?

>>off (along with unnamed others) and join the various organizations devoted to
>>stifling freedom in this country. Isn't that a prostitution of everything you
>>claimed to stand for?

If he consistently applied his individualist philosophy, then yes.

>>
>>JZ

>Len

Tim Irvin   j056600@lmsc5.is.lmsc.lockheed.com
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"In a free government the security for civil rights must be the same as that
 for religious rights." -- James Madison, Federalist #51