HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bchurch@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu (Robert Church)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: weirdest items lost in freefall
Date: 30 Jul 92 20:21:11 GMT
Organization: Ohio University School of Art,. Athens

In article <martin.712502040@centaur> martin@centaur.saic.com (Martin Hobson) writes:
>dbriggs@zia.aoc.nrao.edu (Daniel Briggs) writes:
>>Does anyone have a particularly good
>>brand/model of sports goggles to recommend, that provide comparable wind
>>protection to Kroop goggles?
>
>I'd like to hear about a good brand/type of sports goggles to wear,
>also. While I don't usually have a problem with the sports glasses that
>I wear, every once in a while something goes askew and they seem to
>catch a lot of wind, with forseeable results.

I wear HALO goggles. They're the huge ugly black rubber ones. They look 
terrible but have great visibility (no seams) are comfortable with or 
without glasses and give great wind protection. I was given a pair by
a pilot with a friend in the Air Force but I think that Para-Gear sells
them.


-- 
*********************************************
*    bob church                             *
*    bchurch@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu           *
*    D-8195 NFS #27                         *
From: bonitz@madrone.eecs.ucdavis.edu (Bob Bonitz)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: weirdest items lost in freefall
Date: 31 Jul 92 20:33:11 GMT
Organization: UC Davis  Robotics Research Lab

In article <1992Jul31.151639.25837@virtech.uucp> mark@vti.com writes:
>drp40@cd.amdahl.com (Douglas R Puchalski) writes:
>: I heard a story about a little old lady who had a pumpkin crash
>: through her roof at 120 mph and plant itself in the middle of
>: her living room...
>
>That's gotta be urban folklore.  I've heard this same story in
>many different places.  Does anyone have authoritative documentation
>that this really happened?

This is not urban folklore and really did happen.  It was reported in 
Parachtist just a few years ago.  My recollection is that it happened in the 
midwest and that the pumpkin landed in the kitchen.  Quite a stink was raised 
because of the obvious safety issues.  

So if you are going to take anything out with you in freefall, make damn sure 
you not above any houses, people, etc.
From: mdk@siesoft.co.uk (Michael King)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: weirdest items lost in freefall
Date: 29 Jul 92 11:27:14 GMT
Organization: Siemens Nixdorf Information Systems Ltd.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

I was on a lift once where a girl had a stud in her nose (a weird item to
wear in the first place, IMHO) and lost it as she opened - her goggles slipped
(or perhaps she knocked them with her elbow as she reached for the toggles)
and knocked it out. An expensive jump - it was a diamond stud!

Michael King   mdk@siesoft.co.uk   ...!uunet!mcsun!uknet!siesoft!mdk
From: yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Two canopies out
Date: 28 Jul 92 15:55:13 GMT
Organization: Chevron Oil Field Research, La Habra, CA.

In article <1992Jul28.023211.24481@mercury.cair.du.edu> tjreynol@zephyr.cair.du.edu (The Jumpin Dude) writes:
>In article <1992Jul27.150646.2526@virtech.uucp> mark@vti.com writes:
>>
>>I don't think that there could possibly be a reason for keeping
>>two perfectly working parachutes over your head.
>
>the guy that did that here a few weeks ago had this reason: 
>
>I didn't want to chop a perfectly good canopy.
>
>>In response(agreement?) to the above statement, I wouldn't want to
>>steer a personal side-by-side.  Brrrrr...  gives me the shivers.
>
>he said it flew just fine. his reserve lines are at least a foot 
>shorter than his main lines.

Yeah? Well, what would have happened *if* a little air disturbance at
500-600' (or lower...) would have changed that side-by-side into a downplane?

I think that it is extremely risky to keep two squares over your head
*hoping* that they do  not start fighting each other. This is a very
unstable configuration. I would have chopped the main away.
-- 
  Philip Yzarn de Louraille                 Internet: yzarn@chevron.com
  Research Support Division                 Unix & Open Systems
  Chevron Information & Technology Co.      Tel: (310) 694-9232
  P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446     Fax: (310) 694-7709
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: mark@virtech.uucp (Mark Smith)
Subject: Re: Tail exits
Reply-To: mark@vti.com
Organization: Virtual Technologies, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 92 15:29:22 GMT

bchurch@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu (Robert Church) writes:
: I've yet to jump a rear exit airplane such as the CS-130 or CASA.
: Are they better or worse for formations. I understand that the door
: is larger, but what about turbulance and 'falling into' the slipstream.
: Are these factors?

A casa is a rear drop gate, right?  I suppose the exit would be
quite similar to a caribou.

Me and my group were not too experienced with rear gates and decided
to fly-out a 8-way zipper.  We were not close enough together, so
as each of the pairs of the zipper hit the slipstream they were
authoritatively seperated from the remainder of the formation still
in the quiet air.  It worked out that we had 4 2-ways in the blink
of an eye.

The transition from quiet air to slipstream is very abrubt and unless
you're ready for it, it'll take you out.

Given the above statement and your preparation for it, the door is
so large and you can easily lauch very big formations just by taking
the proper grips and then walking out the back.  Very nice, indeed.
-- 
      /_\   Virtual                  Mark Smith            USPA D-13761
    /-~_  \    Technologies          mark@vti.com
  /      ~-_\     Incorporated       (703) 430-9247, (fax) 450-4560
/_____________\      46030 Manekin Plaza, suite 160, Dulles, VA 20166
From: yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Mass-Way
Date: 26 Jul 92 17:57:48 GMT
Organization: Chevron Oil Field Research, La Habra, CA.

In article <1992Jul25.091602.15042@selway.umt.edu> sh666@selway.umt.edu (Azog) writes:
>A hypothetical question for you Sky-gods out there....
>
>What do you think would be the biggest 'way' attainable with an exit
>altitude of 20,000 ft, with the best aircraft and jumpers for the job.
>Do you think we'll every break the 200 mark?
>					     Just Curious,

I think so. (not that I am a skygod, you hear..)
As long as everyone in the blob *flies* their slot, keeps an eye on
everything around him/her and is constantly ready to damp an incoming
wave, and the formation is designed in such a way as to minimize wait and
maximize open slots, I do not see why the 200 mark could not be broken.

Now ask me again for the 300 mark...
-- 
  Philip Yzarn de Louraille                 Internet: yzarn@chevron.com
  Research Support Division                 Unix & Open Systems
  Chevron Information & Technology Co.      Tel: (310) 694-9232
  P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446     Fax: (310) 694-7709
From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.FIDONET.ORG (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Wet Air
Date: 25 Jul 92 00:56:34 GMT

Reply-to: Bill.Caefer@p0.f853.n102.z1.fidonet.org (Bill Caefer)
Fido-To: pvf@alantec.com

>> and wouldn't a stalled plane naturally dive nose first, 
>> with the weight being 
>> towards the nose? or does a stalled plane tend to fall like a brick?

>The weight isn't toward the nose.  If anything, it is either centered or
>(more common, and prefered) toward the tail.  

 p> to make recovery from the stall possible.  Stalls are a very normal
 p> part of a pilot's training, and are not automatically fatal.  Nor do
 p> they "often end up in a spin".

I didn't say they were automatically fatal or anything like that.  The bit about spinning was only for unrecovered or botched stalls.

 p> There is an "AFT CG LIMIT" specified in the manual for an airplane.  A
 p> pilot is supposed to ensure that the aircraft is not loaded in such a
 p> manner as to place the CG further AFT than this position.  If the
 p> airplane is loaded with the CG AFT of the AFT CG LIMIT, then you

[much stuff about exceeding the aft limit deleted]

You misunderstand me.  I never said or meant anything about loading a plane past the limit.  I only meant that when deciding how to load a plane, they are often loaded "more aft than forward" (but still within the limits of course) because this results in better flying characteristics.

Actually, the original post said this:

>> and wouldn't a stalled plane naturally dive nose first, 
>> with the weight being towards the nose? 

I was correcting this misconception.  A jump plane isn't actually loaded with the weight "towards the nose."  It is usually all that can be done to just get it within the aft limit.  That is why it is so important to move forward.  To get it within the limit.

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From: 10u3721@csdvax.csd.unsw.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: tails
Date: 24 Jul 92 07:05:11 GMT
Organization: University of New South Wales


>We don't talk about it.  Just climb in the plane and close your eyes
>for take-off.  Anton should have kept his mouth shut :-).

>Oh all right.  I told you they are a government designed aeroplane.
>The tail is designed to be removed easily.  This sounds like a really
>dumb idea to me, but aircraft engineers tell me its quite normal.
>Makes for some really ugly paint designs when the owners keep swapping
>tails over.  Anyway, every so often, all aircraft get mandatory
>thingumees (I'm sure there's a correct word) that you have to do the
>aeroplane or else their airworthiness certificate is removed.  The last
>one for the Nomad was something to strengthen the tail.  Owners were
>given 6 months to comply, so I guess they didn't expect the tails to
>fall off straight away.  As I said, just close your eyes on take-off
>and don't think about it.

	I thought it was something to do with the tail being an exact half
wavelength of the standing wave generated behind the wing, so that the whole
tail vibrated and fatigued to buggery (engineering speak!).   Consequently it
fell off.   They fixed it by increasing the amount of support in the tail, which
would have taken the stresses below the endurence limit, which is the point at
which it will last forever (so to speak), I would imagine.

Anton
-----
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: sparkie@spock.cs.wisc.edu (Mark Horn)
Subject: Twin Bonanza (Was: Re: Long day at the DZ)
Organization: U of Wisconsin CS Dept
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:16:54 GMT

In article <1992Jul27.051508.758@zia.aoc.nrao.edu> dbriggs@zia.aoc.nrao.edu  
(Daniel Briggs) writes:
>>The only twin beeches I've jumped or flown were B- or D-18s.  I've never
>>heard them called Bonanzas.  ICOCBW.

Me, too.  However, Beech Aircraft does make the Twin Bonanza.  I've heard of  
them called Beech Twin Bonanza's.  Never Twin Beech Bonanza's.

>We also had a Bonanza come in once to cover a weekend
>when the C-18 was busted.  

You meant Twin Bonanza, right?  They make a single engine version of the  
airplane that they just call the Bonanza.  I've never seen it used as a jump  
plane.  The doors are curved.  It would be hard to replace them with an in  
flight door, and probably very hard to fly without a door.

>They are most definitely different planes.
>The very vague impression I have of that weekend is that a twin Bo looks
>not unlike a little tiny King Air.  It holds about 2/3 the people, but
>the general lines of the fuselage reminded me of it's bigger cousin.
>It's been a long while since I jumped it, but we got maybe 10 jumpers in
>it, I think?

Yes, a Twin Bonanza holds 10 jumpers.  But I think that a Twin Bo and a King  
Air don't really look that much the same.  They have a lot of things in common,  
most notably the Tricycle landing gear, but the lines of the airplane I think  
are very differnt.  The tail is all wrong, too.  Anyway, just an opinion.  Of  
course, if you compare a Beech 18 to a King Air, then, yeah the Twin Bo looks a  
lot like a King Air.

There are other differences, too.  Not the least of which is the fact that the  
twin bo has two piston powered engines whereas the King Air has turbine powered  
engines.  This makes the King Air a LOT faster than the Twin Bo.  I suspect  
that it also makes the King Air a LOT quieter, too.  That is the single most  
distinguishing thing about the Twin Bonanza: it is LOUD!  Don't even think  
about boarding the thing without ear plugs.  Also, the rear horizontal  
stabilizers are only a few feet behind the door.  It would not surprise me in  
the least if a LOT of people get hurt hitting those things.  They are very  
close.

Now if we're talking about cool airplanes, we need to mention the Cessna  
Caravan.  What an airplane!  According to pilots that I've talked to, it flies  
just like a Cessna 182.  It'll take off and land anywhere you can take off and  
land a 182.  It's a single turbine prop'ed airplane that climbs to 14000' in  
about 9-10 minutes.  It's got a door slightly smaller than the door of a Twin  
Otter, but MUCH bigger than the door of a DC3 or King Air, etc.  You could  
easily launch a 6 way, and with a little effort you could launch an 8 way.  And  
the tail is far enough back that it isn't a concern.  That is a fun airplane.   
Too bad they cost more than a $1Meg to own!
--
- sparkie (Mark Horn)		D-14578, IAD JM93, FFS1
- sparkie@spock.cs.wisc.edu	<-- NeXT Mail
--
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: sparkie@spock.cs.wisc.edu (Mark Horn)
Subject: Re: Twin Bonanza (Was: Re: Long day at the DZ)
Organization: U of Wisconsin CS Dept
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 14:41:49 GMT

In article <1992Jul28.033612.24989@mercury.cair.du.edu>  
tjreynol@zephyr.cair.du.edu (The Jumpin Dude) writes:
>now Mike claims that 8-ways are regularly launched from his King Air.
>i wonder if you could top that with the C-208.

Yeah, right!  I've got over 100 jumps out of Mike's King Air and I have yet to  
see a successful launch of anything bigger than a 5-way.  You can get 4 people  
outside floating, maybe 5.  That leaves one person in the door for a 5 or 6  
way, and 2 - 3 people diving after the base.  While I believe that it's  
_possible_ to launch an 8-way from Mike's King Air, I've never seen it done.

>i was told too, that those engines are 
>around $250,000 each to overhaul, but i sure don't know.

I've heard the same.  It is quite amazing how much performance the Caravan gets  
with only one engine.

>when the Caravan guys were here, they would on occasion take off in 
>spectacular fashion - they'd just barely get off the ground, build 
>some airspeed, scare the piss out of everyone as they approached the
>end of the runway, then bank HARD and climb incredibly... easily
>surpassing thrill of a rollercoaster!

Yeah, they did that in Freeport, too.  That was a lot of fun riding in that  
airplane.  What was amazing was the angle of attack that the airplane had when  
climbing.  I don't mean during this roller coaster move, just in a normal  
climb, the thing must have been at about 30 degrees!  It really felt like you  
were climbing like a banshee.

>tim
>gonna do a DC-3, Twin Otter, turbine Porter, and maybe a Queen Air
>this week!!! 

Have fun, man!  The 3 is cool because you can build big formations out of it,  
but other than that I don't like it.  It's cold if you're in the back because  
there isn't a door.  It's slow to climb and loud.  The Twin Otter is a  
fantastic plane.  You can put 22 (I think?) people in it, it climbs fast,  
there's an inflight door, and the door is HUGE!  Even relatively inexperienced  
skydivers (like me) can get an 8-way to launch from that door.  Haven't jumped  
a porter, yet, but I've heard it's fun.  The Queen Air looks like a King Air,  
but without the turbine engines, it's basically worthless, although I'd take it  
over a C182 :-)
--
- sparkie (Mark Horn)		D-14578, IAD JM93, FFS1
- sparkie@spock.cs.wisc.edu	<-- NeXT Mail
--
From: bonitz@madrone.eecs.ucdavis.edu (Bob Bonitz)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: weirdest items lost in freefall
Date: 29 Jul 92 23:53:32 GMT
Organization: UC Davis  Robotics Research Lab

In article <1992Jul29.192531.10733@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> masterov@dryer.ecn.purdue.edu (Michael Masterov) writes:
}And I thought I was the only one.  I lost the lenses from my glasses when
}my canopy opened - still have the frames.  Made for a fun landing; 20-400
}with 0.75 Astigmatism.  Wound up following a first-timer down.  Flaring
}was an adventure.  Thank god I was under a Goliath.
}
I lost a lens in freefall once.  I had the replacement lens and the other
lens glued in with super glue and haven't had a problem since.  
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: mark@virtech.uucp (Mark Smith)
Subject: Re: Two canopies out
Reply-To: mark@vti.com
Organization: Virtual Technologies, Inc.
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 15:06:46 GMT

SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.FIDONET.ORG (SKYDIVE) writes:
: Reply-to: Bill.Caefer@p0.f853.n102.z1.fidonet.org (Bill Caefer)
: Fido-To: dsouth@uoft02.utoledo.edu
: 
: > Even the two squares open issue has a couple of sides to it.  If I have
: > both canopies out in my own personal down plane, I'm going to chop.  If
: > instead I have a side by side configuration, I intend 
: 
: I wonder what the motivation is for keeping both canopies.  If it's just a matter of having to look for the main later, consider this option.  Don't cut away until getting set up for final.  Or when you pass over the DZ at a low enough altitude to try and make your main land there.  It solves the problem and could be fun trying to 'spot' the main.

I don't think that there could possibly be a reason for keeping
two perfectly working parachutes over your head.

In response(agreement?) to the above statement, I wouldn't want to
steer a personal side-by-side.  Brrrrr...  gives me the shivers.
-- 
      /_\   Virtual                  Mark Smith            USPA D-13761
    /-~_  \    Technologies          mark@vti.com
  /      ~-_\     Incorporated       (703) 430-9247, (fax) 450-4560
/_____________\      46030 Manekin Plaza, suite 160, Sterling, VA 20164
From: fsbgf@acad3.alaska.edu
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Jump planes...
Date: 30 Jul 92 03:24:40 GMT
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks

On the subject of jump planes, I was wondering if anybody out there
has ever jumped a Piper J-3 Cub? If so, how was it accomplished?
I have access to a J-3 and was thinking about jumping it just to say
I've done it. Any suggestions??
 
Brandon
From: bchurch@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu (Robert Church)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Mass-Way
Date: 28 Jul 92 21:57:16 GMT
Organization: Ohio University School of Art,. Athens

In article <13815@mindlink.bc.ca> Charlie_Gibbs@mindlink.bc.ca (Charlie Gibbs) writes:

>     We noticed that larger formations seemed to fall slower than
>small ones (at least up to a point, but a 15-wedge tended to really
>float).  Someone once extrapolated that a 172-way would fall slowly
>enough that you could land it.  But nobody could try it out because
>the record was only 30 or so at the time.  :-)

And the obvious reply to that was that we'd dirt dive a 200 way and 
float it to altitude.



-- 
*********************************************
*    bob church                             *
*    bchurch@oucsace.cs.ohiou.edu           *
*    D-8195 NFS #27                         *
From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.FIDONET.ORG (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: 72-way over Texas; Film at 11
Date: 21 Jul 92 01:19:40 GMT

Reply-to: David.Sward@p871.f70.n109.z1.fidonet.org (David Sward)
Fido-To: virtech!virtech!mark@uunet.u

Hello virtech!virtech!mark@uunet.u!

Wednesday July 15 1992, virtech!virtech!mark@uunet.uu.net writes to Skydive:

:  b>> Last night Channel 2 here in the Bay Area ran some footage of a
:  b>> 72-way over  Houston.  The report claimed that it was a state
:  b>> record.  Did this get airplay  anywhere else?

ds> : Yep, Washington, DC.

vn> Where are you located? (Chevy Chase?)  What dz do you frequent?

vn> --
vn>       /_\   Virtual                  Mark Smith            USPA D-13761
vn>     /-~_  \    Technologies          mark@vti.com
vn>   /      ~-_\     Incorporated       (703) 430-9247, (fax) 450-4560
vn> /_____________\      46030 Manekin Plaza, suite 160, Sterling, VA 20164

none yet... i've taken 2 s/l jumps in pa while at school (cmu) and am saving for more (or a switch to aff).  where do you jump?

David

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From: bob@pta.pyramid.com.au (Robert Vernon)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: 1st Time Jumper
Date: 22 Jul 92 09:45:11 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Sydney

In article <1992Jul17.002534.24779@gateway.ssf-sys.DHL.COM> bdaniels@groucho.DHL.COM (Ben Daniels) writes:
>Skydiving? Safe? I don't think skydiving is safe.
>
>I made a jump once when I was 20 years old. 20 years later I was
>living in my van going from drop zone to drop zone - my total
>worldly possesions being a parachute, a couple boxes of books
>and some ragged blue jeans.
>
>Well, I exagerated. Actually it was only 19 years later.

It took you 19 years to become a sky-bum.  You mustn't have really
liked the sport that much then :-).

9 year ago I made my first jump.  At the time, I was renting a nice
flat, had nice furniture and lots of savings in the bank.  All the
typical yuppie things.  Within 2 years I was dead broke, moved into a
grotty flat, skydived every weekend and loved it.  The only reason I
kept working was to payoff the credit cards which were always sitting
at their credit limit.

>I don't think skydiving is safe at all.

Not at all.  It totally ruined my original life-style.

You know how I finally caught up with my over-spending.  18 months ago
I tore the ligament in my knee.  Couldn't jump for 9 months.  It cost
me over $Aus4000 in doctor/hospital fees and I still spent less in that
year than I had for the previous 8.  It scares me just thinking about
how much I spend on this sport.

If you want to be rich, don't jump.

>It's worth doing though.

Yeah.


Bob V!
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: nironen@ntc02.tele.nokia.fi (Pasi Nironen , OH2BKX)
Subject: For Finnish parachuters only
Organization: Nokia Telecommunications.
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 12:09:06 GMT

Hello all
This message is only to find out how many Finnish parachuters reads
this topic...

Moi kaikille!

Olen kiinnostunut kuinka moni Suomesta seuraa t{t{ foorumia ja mist{
kerhoista. Heitt{isitk| tervakset mailina allekirjoittaneelle!

Pasi (SLK)
-- 


        "Don't panic,skydiving does a lot of sense"
Helsinki Institute of Technology PASI$FINHIT.HIT.FI
NOKIA TELECOMMUNICATIONS         NIRONEN$NTC02.TELE.NOKIA.FI
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving