HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: adzinic@sun14.vlsi.uwaterloo.ca (Adnan Dzinic)
Subject: Re: Sharon's at it again.
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 19:14:49 GMT



stojanov@husc11.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic) writes:

>  Well, let me tell you something, Sharon.  Back in 1990, there were 
>anti-Serbian riots in the town of Foca, which is in Bosnia. Then the Serbs in
>Foca wanted to protest against discrimination from the muslim majority in the 
>town, but the brutal commie police forces forbade the Serbs from holding any 
>demonstration or saying anything public about being oppressed by the majority 
>muslims. This is but one example of the Serbian suffering in Bosnia.  
[....]

>Regards,
>Milan
Can you please, give me some facts about this. Probably this is reason why
5.000 Muslims have been killed in 1942 and unknown number in 1992 in town of
Foca. My father was wittnes of that killing in 1942, probably you can explain
him something. Don't trust your own eys, TVS (TV Serbia ) is there to explain
everything to you.

Adnan Dzinic

Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.bulgaria,soc.culture.soviet,soc.culture.turkish,soc.history,talk.politics.mideast
Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Wednesday, 23 Dec 1992 14:19:40 CST
From: <U52148@uicvm.uic.edu> (Chicago Cro)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia
Subject: Re: Ana M. Shane this is s.c.c
 <R474VB1w165w@infopls.chi.il.us> <BzMKCI.CI7@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca>

In article <BzMKCI.CI7@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca>, abrodnik@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca
(Andrej Brodnik (Andy)) says:
>
>In article <R474VB1w165w@infopls.chi.il.us>, damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir
>Matanic) writes:
>>
>>    There are three major languages in the former Yugo.
>>
>>   1 is Albanian, another is Serbian, and the other which Croatians speak
>> is   CROATIAN.  End of discussion.
>
>Hk, hm. And which one should I choose as my language? Or mine was not
>"major" or was not in former yugo?-//
>
>Andrej
>
I apologize for Damir...
He forgot the Slovenci as well as Braco Makedonci... The point that Damir was
trying to make is, that there is no such thing as the "Offensive" language.
The said language offends all of us, except Yugos like Ana. I am proud of the
Croatian language, Croatian literature, which both were around long before
the "Offensive language" came around to subjugate the Croats.

===============================================================================
                              __
        )|(     ----      |__|__
        ---     ----       __|  |
        )|(
                 Srbi su Nacisti  (Serbs are Nazis)
-Cro
===============================================================================
From: abrodnik@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia
Subject: Re: Calling a spade a spade
Date: 3 Jan 93 19:25:09 GMT
Organization: University of Waterloo

In article <C0AE2J.FHF@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca> abrodnik@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca writes:
>
>>Ana:
>>
>>9. Is it true that Albanians from Kosovo had organized meetings "of
>>truth" in Slovenia, protesting against the imposed Serbian government
>>regime?

			[ my answere deleted ]

>>10. Is it true that the same opportunity had been denied to the
>>Serbians from Kosovo by the Slovenian authorities?

			[ my answer deleted ]

I forgot to mention here that Serbs prepared at least two rallys in
Slovenia I'm aware of and none of them was forbidden. Though these
rallys were attended by Serbs living in Slovenia only. One was in
Ljubljana and the other in Kranj.

Best regards,

Andrej
Xref: sparky soc.culture.croatia:190 soc.culture.yugoslavia:10215 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:927
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: More from Majstorovic about Serbs
From: stojanov@husc11.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic)
Date: 21 Dec 92 20:50:56 EST
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

 Excerpts from the hearing of the Franciscan Miroslav Majstorovic
Filipovic before the Comission to Determine War Cirmes, Document 
number 2006 ( References were given in two books I recommended to
Joe, by Dedijer and Miletic):


Protocol of 25 June 1945


Q: How many Serbs were killed in the NDH up to now, in your opinion?


A: According to reports of Maks Luburic who probably keeps the
lists of killed Serbs, about half a million Serbs were killed in the NDH 
during these four years.  That includes those Serbs who died in battle.


[My comment:  This agrees perfectly with the census numbers corrected by 
Muslims that declared themselves as Serbs.  I'll comment more about
demography in one of the later postings.  Documents Luburic collected
were of the following type:

Radio mesage,

11. february 1942
To the Directorship for Public Order and Security in Zagreb

...  In the villages of Motika, where about 715 people were killed,
Drakulic and Sargovac where about 1,500 people were killed ...



According to the witnesses he was very carefully gathering all information
to determine how efficient Croats were.
It is interesting that Tudjman in his book does not mention this
testimony, at least I do not remember, but menitones the one of Ljubo 
Milos, giving similar account.]



Regards,

Milan N. Stojanovic

.......
Xref: sparky soc.culture.croatia:196 soc.culture.greek:11750 soc.culture.europe:10691 soc.culture.bulgaria:1983 soc.culture.soviet:11397
From: hilmi-er@tess.enet.dec.com (Hilmi Eren)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.bulgaria,soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: Serdar's admirer!!! (Re: Merry Christmas, Argic)
Date: 22 Dec 92 11:50:35 GMT
Reply-To: hilmi-er@tess.enet.dec.com (Hilmi Eren)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


|>Yannis Schoinas writes:



|>>faruk@bcars6f5.BNR.CA (Faruk od Bosne) writes:



|>>I would like to extend my thanks to Serdar Argic in revealing us the truth 
|>>about the events in Turkey during WW1. Before reading his articles I have 
|>>suspected (altough never believed) that Turks massacred Armenians during 
|>>a campaign of defending the very existance of their homeland. His thorough 
|>>documentation showed that Armenians were in fact massacreing Turks in 
|>>unprotected villages while Turkish Army was busy defending the country. 
|>>However, for some people the truth seems to be very painful. As the case 
|>>is, Serdar, this (desperation?) is their problem, not yours. Thanks again 
|>>and keep up good work. May I extend very best wishes in upcoming year.


|>Yes, it is Christmas and it's this time of the year that miracles do
|>happen. And even Serdar Argic, the most despised net persona, the lover 
|>of the kill files, the (in)famous broken AI program, has found an admirer.
|>Days of magic and grace,:-).
|>
|>Perhaps, I should get Serdar out of my kill file these loving days. Don't 
|>you think that I was too mean to have kept him there for so long?
|>
|>					Enjoy the holidays,
|>					     Yannis.
|>
|>ps: Faruk, you were kidding, right?
 
PS2: No, i think he was not kidding, and i agree with him.
     If you don't have anything sensible to say then shut up!





Hilmi Eren
Stockholm University 
Sweden
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia
From: damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia
Subject: Ustase bashing?!?!?!$!@$
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 93 11:30:53 CST
Organization: INFOPLUS support, Wheeling, IL

For the past couple of weeks, I've noticed that there has been alot of
Ustase bashing by a number of individuals.  I'm sure you all know what I 
mean (such as that long conversation about Jasenovac).
  I find this absolutely appalling.  I'd expect this kind of behavior on 
soc.culture.yugo, but not on a croatian newsgroup. With the start of WW 
II and the subsequent fall of the 1st Jugoslavia, N.D.H. was created.  
This has been the dream of the Croatian nation since the fall of the 
Croatian kingdom in the middle ages.  In 1941, the Serb dictatorship 
which went by the name of Jugoslavia fell, and an Independent State of 
Croatia was formed.  In order for this to be accomplished, Pavelic had to 
accept Hitler and Mussolini as his overlords, but as I see it, he had no 
other choice.  Yes, Dalmatia was lost to the Italians.  But the real fact 
is that the Italians simply took the Croatian coast.  I don't think 
Pavelic could have prevented this in anyway.  Do you people think that he 
really wanted to give up our marvilous coast?  I think not.
  The soldiers of the regular Croatian army and the Ustase fought under 
the Croatian flag.  They fought to restablish Croatia in her historic 
borders, i.e. Drina\Zemun, with the full support of the Croatian Muslims 
in Bosna (Pavelic himself was a "Bosnian").  The Cetniks fought against 
N.D.H. because they wanted a "Greater Serbia", and the communists 
(Croatian and Serb) wanted to recreate Jugoslavia as a communist "bratsvo 
jedinstvo" state.  ALL who fought against N.D.H. in WW II were 
anti-Croatian, be they Serb Cetniks, or Croat communists.  The Croat 
communists are national trators.  Sure, I'm not deining that some 
attrocities were committed by the Ustase.  BUT, they were defending the 
Independent State of Croatia against the Yugoslavs and Cetniks.  The 
soldiers of N.D.H. sacrified their lives in the defence of "Nezavisna 
Drzava Hrvatska".  They fought for the same reasons why the Croatian army 
of today fights. i.e. so that Croatia be a free and independent state.
  To spit on the soldiers and N.D.H., is to also spit at present day 
Croatia and her present day fighters.  Politics aside, the fact is that 
in 41 Jugoslavia fell, and a Croatian state was formed.


         ZIVJELA    NEZAVISNA   DRZAVA   HRVATSKA!!


                   ZA        DOM
             
                    SPREMNI !!


I am not ashamed of the "U"; neither should any Croat.
Matter-of-fact, I'm more then proud of our Croatians defenders of WW II.
The Ustase brought fear to the hearts of our enemies, and they deserve 
our respect and admiration.


U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
U               U
 U             U
  U           U
   UUUUUUUUUUU



Damir Matanic



--
damir@infopls.chi.il.us (Damir Matanic)
Infoplus BBS, +1 708 537 0247, v32bis. Home of Infoplus.
From: wickerhauser-victor@math.yale.edu (Victor Wickerhauser)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia
Subject: Re: WWII, again (was Re: Dr. Mishitch, the Bishop of Mostar)
Date: 28 Dec 1992 01:41:08 -0500
Organization: Yale University Mathematics Dept., New Haven, CT 06520-2155
NNTP-Posting-Host: golem.math.yale.edu

In article <Dec.26.15.40.17.1992.26077@andromeda.rutgers.edu> pshane@andromeda.rutgers.edu (Ana M. Shane) writes:
>There is nothing "Serbian" nor "croatian" nor "Muslim" nor "albanian"
>about being a dictator or a "slave" of the communist rulers.

On the other hand, when Yugoslavia collapsed, it seemed that only
ethnic Serbs had the weapons from the Yugo Army.  Under these
circumstances, one should be very suspicious about any claims that all
ethnic groups were equally oppressed by the Communists.

Victor
-- 
Prof. M. Victor Wickerhauser                      <victor@kirk.wustl.edu>
Department of Mathematics, Washington University, St. Louis, MO 63130 USA
Telephone:  USA(314)935-6771, USA(314)727-0749;     FAX: USA(314)727-4963
Sto se ljuckim trudom uzdignulo, Ljuckim znojem jopet se ponavlja. --Medo Pucic
Xref: sparky soc.culture.croatia:191 soc.culture.yugoslavia:10217 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:928
From: stojanov@husc11.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: More German sources about Croatian crimes against Serbs
Date: 22 Dec 92 02:02:13 GMT
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

From Vatikan i Jasenovac, by Vladimir Dedijer:

[I am giving the original text in German ]

SS-Brigadefuehrer
u. Generalmajor der Waffen-SS
Ernst Fick

z.Zt. Kulmbach/Obfr.-Plassenburg			den 16.3.44


Anden
Reichfuehrer-SS
Heinrich Himmler

Berlin

Prinz Albrechtstr. 8


Reichfuehrer!

Nach muendlichen Mitteilung des Staf. Byer. weltansch. Fuehrer im
SS-Nen.KdoV/SS-Geb.Korps, sind im kroatischem Balkanraum folgende 
Zustuende:

1. Die kroatische Parteitruppe Ustacha ist katholisch, undiscipliniert,
schlecht augebildt, kampfmaessig teilweise unzuverlaessig und dafuer 
bekannt, c. 6-700.000 konf.und pol. anders Eingestallte nach 
Balkanmethodem "geschlachtet" zu haben Ihr Kampf geht gegen Cetniks und 
Partisanen.  Sie bezeichnen sich als kroatische SS.

....................................................................

End of text


Milan N. Stojanovic
Xref: sparky soc.culture.croatia:226 soc.culture.greek:11840 soc.culture.europe:10768 soc.culture.bulgaria:2010 soc.culture.soviet:11509
From: schoinas@fox.cs.wisc.edu (Yannis Schoinas)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia,soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.bulgaria,soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Re: Serdar's admirer!!! (Re: Merry Christmas, Argic)
Date: 24 Dec 92 05:49:11 GMT
Organization: U of Wisconsin Madison - Computer Sciences

hilmi-er@tess.enet.dec.com (Hilmi Eren) writes:

>|>Yannis Schoinas writes:

>|>>faruk@bcars6f5.BNR.CA (Faruk od Bosne) writes:

>|>>I would like to extend my thanks to Serdar Argic in revealing us the truth 
>|>>about the events in Turkey during WW1. Before reading his articles I have 
>|>>suspected (altough never believed) that Turks massacred Armenians during 
>|>>a campaign of defending the very existance of their homeland. His thorough 
>|>>documentation showed that Armenians were in fact massacreing Turks in 
>|>>unprotected villages while Turkish Army was busy defending the country. 
>|>>However, for some people the truth seems to be very painful. As the case 
>|>>is, Serdar, this (desperation?) is their problem, not yours. Thanks again 
>|>>and keep up good work. May I extend very best wishes in upcoming year.

>|>Yes, it is Christmas and it's this time of the year that miracles do
>|>happen. And even Serdar Argic, the most despised net persona, the lover 
>|>of the kill files, the (in)famous broken AI program, has found an admirer.
>|>Days of magic and grace,:-).
>|>
>|>Perhaps, I should get Serdar out of my kill file these loving days. Don't 
>|>you think that I was too mean to have kept him there for so long?
>|>
>|>					Enjoy the holidays,
>|>					     Yannis.
>|>
>|>ps: Faruk, you were kidding, right?
> 
>PS2: No, i think he was not kidding, and i agree with him.
>     If you don't have anything sensible to say then shut up!

>Hilmi Eren
>Stockholm University 
>Sweden

Hi,

it must be pretty cold up there in Stockholm, right? I 've heard that low 
temperatures can be the cause of significant brain damage. It seems that
it's true. 

					Wishes for a quick recover,
						 Yannis.


ps: How can you really agree with what an A(non)I program has to say.
    A program that responds to articles about sheeps and turkeys by 
    quoting articles on the treatment of jews 500 years ago?
Xref: sparky soc.culture.croatia:314 soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna:1067
From: stojanov@husc11.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.croatia,soc.culture.bosna-herzgvna
Subject: Re: Credibility of Helsinki Watch, Amnesty International - II
Date: 3 Jan 93 19:27:39 GMT
Organization: Harvard University Science Center

In article <1993Jan3.010150.8657@cc.uow.edu.au> cicic@cc.uow.edu.au (muris cicic) writes:
>blazic@ecf.toronto.edu (BLAZIC Joseph R) writes:
>>..............
>
>Joe, I am apsolutelly amazed with your patience, at least.  However, you
>shouldn't question logic and coherence.  They aren't an issue in discussion
>with fascist.  Anyway, by handling the shit you will stink long after.
>
>Muris


Thanks Muris.  You might soon start offending Joe in the similar 
manner.  Both Croats and Serbs accepted the Vance/Owen proposal,
Muslims refused.  Also, two days ago there was a story on CNN 
abot Muslim village being surrounded by Croat forces for few
months, where desperately needed help came only few days ago.
Rather interesting, isn't it? 

Milan
Xref: sparky soc.men:21669 alt.abortion.inequity:6133 alt.feminism:6415
From: beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver)
Newsgroups: soc.men,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.feminism
Subject: Re: Male Choice Revisited
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:51:19 GMT
Distribution: na

In article <bob1.725051279@cos> bob1@cos.com (Bob Blackshaw) writes:
>In <BzMI8D.L4H@cs.psu.edu> beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver) writes:
>
>>In article <bob1.724607266@cos> bob1@cos.com (Bob Blackshaw) writes:
>>>In <BzB858.6EL@cs.psu.edu> beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver) writes:
>>>
>>>>In article <1gg7lvINN5mk@gap.caltech.edu> peri@cco.caltech.edu (Michal Leah Peri) writes:
>>>>>beaver@castor.cs.psu.edu (Don Beaver) writes:
>
>>>>Are you actually so parochial that you think that any person who
>>>>has a one-night stand, who breaks up after a year-long relationship,
>>>
>>>I guess I must be. In love with someone you met three hours ago in a
>>>bar and have just jumped in the sack with?
>
>>How does "three hours ago" compare to "year-long relationship."
>
>Well, I would hope that within the space of a year, some meeting of
>minds could take place. Also, in such a time period the minds might
>have 'thought' they met, only to discover it was not the case.

Exactly.

If you agree with Michal's position that the vile offense of
"not keeping in touch" should be grounds to terminate a father's
parental rights, then what do you think about the following:

 A couple is together for a year, but they break up and
 move to different cities, with each other's address.  The
 woman is two weeks' pregnant.  She later has the baby but 
 doesn't tell the father.

Michal would like the laws to permit her to terminate the
father's parental rights, because he has, in Michal's words,
"fled the scene."

According to Michal, the man can preserve his parental rights
only by traveling to the woman's new city eight months after
breaking up, in order to pursue her and see in person whether
she is now pregnant.

Do you agree?

Don
-- 
beaver@cs.psu.edu                       Opinions from the PC-challenged
Newsgroups: soc.men
From: payner@netcom.com (Rich Payne)
Subject: Re: Male Choice Revisited
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 02:48:15 GMT

In article <1i4ul0INNjf6@gap.caltech.edu> peri@cco.caltech.edu (Michal Leah Peri) writes:
>forb0004@student.tc.umn.edu (Eric Forbis ) writes:
>
>>In article <1h8fq5INNono@gap.caltech.edu> peri@cco.caltech.edu (Michal Leah Peri) writes:
>>>We were discussing father notification of a woman's pregnancy
>>>in order to allow him to claim the child should the woman choose
>>>to give that child up for adoption.  My position is that the
>>>birth of the child is already a matter of public record on 
>>>which the father can easily follow up (eg, by writing to the
>>>county recorder).  Thus there is no need for legislation 
>>>mandating "paternal notification".  Moreover, notification
>>>of the woman's pregnancy (as distinct from the *birth* of the
>>>child) is a violation of the woman's right to privacy.
>
>>highly mobile and people relocate frequently. Notifying a local government 
>>where the father will likely never find the record is hardly making it 
>>"public" in any meaningful sense-- but that's what you want, no?
>
>>Notification of pregnancy is not a violation of the mother's right to 
>>privacy. Rights end where others begin; a pregnancy exists in part because 
>>of the other, and when fatherhood is the issue, that "other" certainly has 
>>the right to know. 
>
>Would you be satisfied with paternal notification of the child's birth?
>I would have no problem with that with regards to privacy considerations,
>since the birth is already a matter of the public record.  (I have problems
>with requiring additional governmental paperwork, but that is not an 
>direct inequity issue.)  However, requiring a woman to notify anyone of 
>her pregnancy is a violation of her privacy.

If she wants 18 years of child support, then the father should be notified
of the pregnancy. Otherwise the man has no say. After birth, all she has to
do is to take hime to court, it is too late a joint decision. 

The notion that the pregnancy is not the fathers business, but the child after
birth is is a bit odd. If she wants to raise the child herself, she need not
notify the father at all. If she wants child support, then the father has 
a need and a right to know about the pregnancy. Unless, as you seem to feel,
it really does not matter what the father feels/wants/can afford, the women
has every right to make the decisions for him, after all, the idiot unzipped
his zipper. 

>
>                                                --  Michal
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Of course there's no reason!  


Rich

payner@netcom.com



Newsgroups: soc.men
From: cgates@mitre.org (Curt Gates)
Subject: Re: Living in a State of Siege
Organization: The MITRE Corporation
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:53:37 GMT

In article <MUFFY.92Dec21154021@remarque.berkeley.edu> 
muffy@remarque.berkeley.edu (Muffy Barkocy) writes:
> every time someone talks about the violence that
> is practiced against women, some people here start shouting about the
> violence that happens to men

Believe the original statement was to the effect that *white* men  do not 
understand the feelings of women for whom violence is a major issue in 
their lives.   I don t know where Dave found the original post, but I do 
take issue with a racist approach to a gender issue, if violence to the 
person is indeed an gender issue.

> No one has *denied* that men have
> problems, those are simply not necessarily the problems that many
> feminists are concerned about.

Are feminists concerned about violence against their male children? 
Newsgroups: soc.men,soc.singles,soc.women
From: Diane
Subject: Re: About the contract issue
Organization: University of Missouri
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 92 13:27:03 CST

In article <1992Dec24.104708.11880@wetware.com>
drieux@wetware.com (drieux, just drieux) writes:
 
>Also worth noting in all of this,
>My favorite NonCustodialParent is driving a 1974 volvo station wagon
>and the CustodialParent is driving a new car that just got paid off....
>
 
Okay, if we're going to mention case histories: My favorite CustodialParent
(moi) has about $1.50 in expendable income after the orthodontist, the
piano teacher, the martial arts instructor and food bills are paid for
two teen-agers. The NonCustodialParent spends TWICE as much on boarding/
training of his dogs as he does on child support. He is constantly
griping about the property taxes on the house HE kept (I couldn't
afford the mortgage). He makes at least 20K more a year than I do
but will only 'give' the kids birthday presents if I actually buy them
and put his name on them!
Just thought it was worth noting...
 
>
>equity? Is this an issue that women are interested in?
>Or is it just one of those things that we do NOT wish
>to bother their little fool heads about?
>
 
Drieux sweetie, pour a glass of white wine, put on some soft
instrumental music, run a nice hot bath with some scented bathsalts,
and go SOAK YOUR HEAD!!!
 
Happy Holidays!
Diane
From: erik@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Erik Lode)
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 16:33:16 GMT
Subject: Bulletin:  Jif discovers dads
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: soc.men

	This just handed me:
  
  On Monday, November 16, 1992, a Jif peanut butter commercial ended with
the slogan

			Choosey Moms   Choose Jif.
				     ^
				  and Dads

(Yes, the "and Dads" part was stuck in with a little arrow.)

  Granted it was still an afterthought, and the commercial showed a mom,
who used Jif, enlightening a dad, who used the other brand, but it's a
baby step towards the realization that dad's might in fact care what their
kids are eating.

  We now return you to your regularly scheduled flamefest, already in
progress.
Xref: sparky soc.men:21582 soc.women:21759