From: dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton)
Subject: Re: Before Buying Japanese.
Reply-To: dclayton@bnr.ca (Don Clayton)
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:40:01 GMT

In article <1isrbiINN38g@transfer.stratus.com>, cdodson@beast.cac.stratus.com (R. Craig Dodson) writes:
|> Continuing saga of Dave trying feebly to knock the SC . . .

My name is Don.

|> > And I've driven the Saturn, the MX-3, the Impulse, and the Talon and I report
|> > exactly the opposite.  I thought the handling of the Saturn was terrible.   
|> All
|> > this proves is that we have different opinions.
|> 
|> I think it proves an underlying anti-GM feeling you have that affects
|> your judgement. Every major magazine from CU to R&T has reported
|> favorably on the handling of the twin cam cars. To quote R&T "..it's
|> as if they've grafted the confident cornering stance of the Camaro/Firebird
|> onto the much smaller cars (Saturn SC2/SL2)" . Please tell us exactly
|> what made them "handle terrible". I just can't see how you can say a car
|> with excellent variable-rate steering, negligible body roll, and very
|> high cornering limits handles badly. Compared to a F1 car, maybe. Compared to
|> Diamond Stars, MX-3's and Integras - I don't think so.

Well, Camaro/Firebird handling is hardly anything to brag about (i.e. big engine,
heavy car, less than desirable suspension).

|> 
|> If you insist on continuing this, I'll drag in the mags and post handling,
|> braking and acceleration figures for the above cars. You won't be
|> happy with the results - trust me.

I think you should.  As a matter of fact I'll do it for you.  From March 1992
Road and Track :

  Car                         $    0-60     Braking (ft)   Skidpad  Slalom (mph)
  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Mitsubushi Eclipse GSX*  18,550   6.8       244            0.84      65.3
  Isuzu Impulse XS$        13,999   9.3       249            0.84      61.1
  Acura Integra GS         16,840   9.4       252            0.83      62.6
  Mazda MX-3 GS            15,500   9.2       252            0.85      61.1
  Saturn Coupe             14,000   8.6       259            0.76      62.0
  Camaro Z28               18,153   6.7       270            0.89      60.4

* - Sorry, turbo numbers are all I have.  So these numbers are not really fare,
    but I do know that the non-turbo is 7.5 in 0-60 and cost $15,000.  I suspect
    the Skidpad is about the same, as is the braking, while the Slalom would be
    about 62.0.
$ - I was initially refering to the RS model in this discussion, which 0-60 in 7.6
    and has better Slalom due to 4 Wheel Drive - it costs about $16,000.

These numbers indicate that every one of these cars corners better than the Saturn
(Skidpad), has better braking, and that the Slalom and 0-60s are about the same.
The Talon (Eclipse) is faster, while the all the rest are about the same (a 0.60s
difference is close enough to make up for driver error) except for the Z28, which
is a V8 after all. 

Note that the Camara is relatively good Skidpad but bad Slalom indicating that is
relies on big tires too much.

I believe all of this backs up my initial comments about the Talon and Impulse 
being faster, and the Acura and MX-3 being the same, while you non-turbo comments
concerning the Impulse are true.  However, these numbers are close enough to make
the final comment concerning handling up to each driver, and in this drivers humble
opinions, all of these cars are as good are better than the Saturn.

|> > 
|> > |> In maintenance and insurance, I win that contest easily over these  
|> imports.  
|> > |> I'm happy with my car, and that's what matters to me.  According to Mr.  
|> J.D.
|> > |> Powers' firm, Saturn owners are much happier with their cars than Honda or 
|> > |> Acura or Mazda owners.  Isn't that what really matters after all?
|> > 
|> > Whatever - I still say 1 year isn't long enough.  If Saturns fall apart after  
|> 2 or
|> > 3 years everyone will scream that they are crap and GM hasn't changed.   
|> Personally,
|> > I'll wait and see.
|> > 
|> > Don Clayton
|> 
|> Well mine is just about 2 years old now and it's been absolutely fantastic.
|> I drive the car pretty hard, too. But then again, I've always had good luck
|> with GM cars (believe it or not) which is why I ultimately decided on
|> Saturn.

I still say 2 years of Saturn compared to 10 years of Accord makes this comparison
invalid.  Come back in 2 or 3 years.

Don Clayton
a.k.a. Admiral Maverick, DM of the Drow
My brain, my thoughts, my words.
"I'm all lost in the Supermarket.  I can no longer shop happily.
 I came in here for the special offer, guaranteed personality."
Newsgroups: rec.autos