From: cs123057@cs.brown.edu (Chainsaw)
Subject: Re: Stand up girls! (OUT OF Gas, Chainsaw's last flame in this subject)
Organization: Brown Computer Science Dept.
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 17:40:09 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.002814.8560@cmcl2.nyu.edu>, memco@cns.nyu.edu  writes:
|> 
|> In article 20638@cs.brown.edu, cs123057@cs.brown.edu (Chainsaw) writes:
|> 
|> [Stuff Deleted]
|> 
|> > |> Chainsaw, perhaps you hadn't noticed that this is almost the 21st century. Perhaps you
|> > |> haven't comprehended that women, who make up half the planet,have as much right to speak as
|> > |> the other half.
|> > 
|> > Did I mention anything about women "NOT HAVING THE RIGHT TO BITCH"?  I think you misread something
|> > there.  Everyone has the right to speak his mind out, so don't think YOU can shut me up!
|> 
|> A) Chainie, I'm not trying to shut you up. I'm complaining about the crap you're saying. Spew on.

Ha, that's what your article sounded like when it gets abusive.

|> B) You wrote in your original post:
|> 
|> "AND GALS also better start building up a right attitude to treat male, bitching alone
|> is NOT gonna get you any where.   Do you know why people consider Chinese (& American)
|> wives the worst?  That's because they can't keep their mouths shut!!  If you want things
|> changed, DO something about it."
|> 
|> You're right. You didn't say they didn't have the right to bitch. You just said people
|> (and you still haven't identified these people) hate Chinese (& American) women who 
|> can't shut up. Now maybe women unfortunate enough to be around you spend all their
|> time bitching. You right again, though. They should do something. Move away from you.

Yeah, that's why people like YOU and ME are assholes!  But I don't care, cause that's the
way I like it.  So following YOUR logic I would have to come to the conclusion that there
ain't any women near you.  How unfortunate for you.  However, some weird women that I know
happen to like this type of asshole.

|> > |> Most of all, I know you haven't that figured out that the biggest
|> > |> HISSY-FIT BITCHING is coming from YOU. You whine that women don't have the right attitude
|> > |> about how to treat men, that they can't keep there mouths shut.
|> > 
|> > Who can?  At least YOU can't keep your noise-cavity shut.  If you read and actually have enough
|> > intellect to understand that I am talking about women's willingness to Do something to change
|> > the problem instead to complaining.  You will realized that the reason why the situation has 
|> > come to this is partially female's fault, relationship is a 2-way game.  Female has to give
|> > room for the male to move in and get abusive. If the female had fought for their causes from 
|> > the start, it wouldn't have ended up this way.
|> 
|> Maybe you don't really understand the technology involved here, Chainie. This is a computer.
|> I type into it. Unlike you, I don't have to speak the words as I write them.

Ah, so we are getting technical here.  Written words != Words, I like this type of reasoning.
Stephen Hawkings speak by using a keyboard and transmitting it as spoken words, so you are saying
that people who talk to him "hears" the ascii syllables typed on the computer.
It's also nice to know that there people in universities that don't understand the use of
imageries.

|> As for your statement that the central precept of your original missive was that women must
|> accept partial blame for bad relationships (your eloquent "Female has to give room for the
|> male to move in and get abusive." touched me), when exactly will men start accepting any?

Some men actually do, but any relationships that goes too far (either way) is bound to end up in 
disaster.  People are weird and I don't think there is really anything that we can do about it.
But does that really matter?  I know it's not gonna happen during my life time, if one forces
changes like that more conflicts are guaranteed.

|> I've sat here (and wrote nothing, much to my discredit) for three weeks or so and witnessed 
|> a thread saying that men should a)marry some woman who'll give her all to a guy, advancing
|> his career b)get a hot mistress, once he has enough money, for hot sex
|> c)bonk anything he can get in between, etc. etc. etc. 

Same thing here!  the difference is someone took that as a joke (like me) and someone took it
seriously (like you)!  So why don't you sit back and enjoy?  Isn't that why you subscribe
to this newsgroup anyway?  You can always use kill file or flame (which you didn't do to those
people).

|> You are right though, women should do something about people like this.
|> They should never marry assholes like that. And if said asshole uses guile to convince 
|> said woman that he is not the little cheating bastard he is, she shouldn't bitch. She 
|> should sue him for everything and leave him in the gutter. Was this the sort of action 
|> you were thinking about? Hmmmmm? Why do I doubt it?

Then the woman it too gullible!  Ofcourse she can sue for damage but she has fault in her
own part, she should have kept her eyes open in the first place.  She gambled and she lost,
tough luck, but it's part of life.  I've lost several games on my part... sigh!

|> > |> I'll give you a clue
|> > |> (obviously the first you've ever had). Women don't bitch about men who treat them with
|> > |> respect. And a man who is confident in himself isn't afraid of a woman who talks (or
|> > |> are you just afraid of all those teeth?)
|> > 
|> > Wrong, women bitch about everything!  Now let Me enlighten YOU a BIT.  People likes to complain,
|> > it's because humans are never satisfied with what they have.  People are greedy, they always
|> > desire more, they never thought about WHETHER they deserved anything but always want something
|> > better.  If a men treats them with respect, they then bitch about how little money they make,
|> > how unattractive they are.... etc.etc.  THEY always nitpick on details!  (people of both sexes
|> > do this, don't deny it!)  My point is I hate bitching, as much as stupid, idiotic, pseudo-pc,
|> > lame postings like yours.  But I still can't deny you your right to express you "well-thought"
|> > (or lack thereof) arguements.
|> 
|> If as you say "(people of both sexes do this, don't deny it!)", why are you so crazed to 
|> ascribe this behavior only to women?

That's because the person who started this flame war was a woman who placed ALL the blame on man!
It's this type of irresponsibility that I abhor the most.

|> Your first sentence if it read "People bitch
|> about everything" would true, unarguable and insipid. But if you'll read my original
|> statement, I said women don't bitch about men who treat them with respect. 

Wrong!! respect has nothing to do about it, see below.

|> You say "If a men treats them with respect, they then bitch about how little money they make,
|> how unattractive they are.... etc.etc.". I'll admit I'm not exactly sure about what you mean 
|> here. If the second and third "they" is the guy the woman is with, then he should stop
|> bitching to this newsgroup and leave said woman.

I am not sure where I lost you, but I will try again.  No matter how good a certain thing is,
there are always something better in certain quality.  e.g. smart person vs. innocent person.
If your partner is smart, you will sometimes want him/her to be more innocent;  similarly, if your
partner is innocent, you may wish him/her to be more intelligent/mature.  The fact is, since
people are greedy, they always wish something more out of their partner.  Even though they
may not spit their hearts out, they are still not satisfy with what they have.  No matter how
one changes, one's partner is bound to demand something more.  Same hold true if you replace
intelligent vs. innocent with respectful/macho.

|> If these "they"s refer to the woman herself,
|> well, Chainie, this is known as conversation. Something you might not understand, 
|> conversation with women goes beyond "Get me a beer" and "Where's the T.V. Guide?" and
|> "Shut up, wrestling is on".

I feel sorry about you if you grew up in a family like this, no wonder you have such a
warped view of man.  Maybe some psychological services are needed if this has such an impact.

|> And if you are so sick of bitching, stop bitching here and
|> challenge said woman to get a better job and accept herself for who she is. And support 
|> her emotionally (just look it up, Chainie)

Yeah, since it seems hopeless to brighten you up, I will stop bitching.  I will no longer
answer to any more flame letters you have in store for me on this subject, satisfied now?
(I know you won't be)

|> Also I'm not being PC, pseudo or otherwise. You are being a neanderthal, non-pseudo.

Now look who's talking!

|> > BTW, man is not afraid of a woman who talks.  MAN is TIRED of woman who talks and does nothing
|> > else.
|> 
|> You're a shining example. Instead of talking to said females, 

Ha, how do you know I didn't.

|> you sit in your office, 
|> metaphorically bitching to hundreds of thousands of complete strangers.

Which I am TIRED of, but there are just certain idiots who wouldn't stop B.S.ing!  Thus I am
forced to "fight poison with poison", I see that this is probably not working with a hard-necked
person like you but at least I tried.

|> > |> > |> What is the right attitude, do you think?
|> > |> > 
|> > |> > Stop bitching and act up!
|> > |> 
|> > |> As for acting up, what would suggest? Having women stab abusive morons in their sleep?
|> > 
|> > That would be a start!  Maybe men should also strangle demanding-bitches in their sleep.
|> 
|> Or maybe if you would take 2 seconds to talk to a woman who approached you like she was a
|> human, without your misogynistic prejudices clogging your ears, you'd find out she
|> was as human as anyone else you speak to, deserving of the same attention as any man
|> you talk to, deserving the same respect as any man you talk to (though why do I have
|> trouble seeing you giving anyone you talk to any respect, Chainie?)
                             ^^^^^^
Well, that's simple, the reason is that the person that I am talking to don't deserve any respect!

|> ---
|> memco@wotan.cns.nyu.edu

Glad to make your acquaintance Tannie.
									ciao
									Chainsaw