HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: How to give birth to a son?
Date: 15 Oct 92 14:26:52 -0600
Organization: Muskingum College

In article <shl1.719118855@crux1.cit.cornell.edu>, shl1@crux2.cit.cornell.edu (Steven Lee) writes:
> 
> Thanks to all the outdated tradition that you described above.  Even today, 
> more than four years I landed in the U.S., I still have trouble share some of 
> my feelings with my family.  Because I was taught that "real men should be 
> strong and should not have feelings like those wimpy women."
> 
> Now call me wimpy if you want, but I am speak from my experience as a teenage
> son not too long ago.

	** You have been told wrong. That's why you need to teach
	   your son a correct way of being a man. Otherwise, your
	   son will just learn the same as you did from the society.

	   Of course you should hug your son as frequent as you can.
	   If you are not used to do that, hug your wife in front of
	   your children instead. They will learn.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: jch@netcom.com (Jack Hwang)
Subject: Re: Republic of Taiwan Resolution passed
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 17:34:21 GMT

In article <1992Oct8.113326.3795@vax.muskingum.edu> ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department) writes:
>In article <1avf8jINN836@pollux.usc.edu>, mcyang@pollux.usc.edu (Bien-Chao Iunn) writes:
>> I read a report on last week's Independent Weekly News.  It mentioned
>> that the city council of Tainan just passed a resolution which
>> urges the central government to join the United Nations using the 
>> name "Republic of Taiwan".
>
>	** You read the wrong newspaper. Just like what you think
>	   about KMT's paper is, The IWN reports are SERIOUSLY biased
>	   and should not be trusted.

What?  How a newspaper is SERIOUSLY biased and provide wrong reports?
Do you suggest that the city council of Tainan didn't pass a resolution
but IWN said it did?  Is that what it is said in your RIGHT paper?

Talking about the RIGHT paper, there is only one -- Wall Street Journal.

:-)

Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:14389 soc.culture.china:27881
From: stlin@stevelin.Eng.Sun.COM (Steven Lin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Oct. 1 or Oct. 10, which is the more important day for China?
Date: 15 Oct 1992 01:25:32 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Mt. View, Ca.
NNTP-Posting-Host: stevelin

In article <1992Oct14.183607.25072@beaver.cs.washington.edu>  (Pai Hsiang Chou) writes:
>
>In TV programs (even till this day!!) people speaking with
>a non-Mandarin accent are portrayed as people with no
>This is effectively forcing Taiwanese into second or third class
>citizen status by imposing a linguistic and social handicap.
>
Here YOU GO AGAIN!     The second class citizens have a president, more
than 50% of government posts. Isn't it true? 

What kind of mentality is this? If Chinese people all want to preserve
dialects, how is China going to be? 

The emperors of Ming could give up mother-tongue, why you guys cannot?
The emperors of Qing could give up mother-tongue, why you guys cannot?
The overseas Chinese could give up mother-tongue, why you guys cannot?

What is the big deal value of Taiwanese language(s)? Which dialects
are you trying to preserve? ( Min-nan: 3, Hakka: 2, Aborginal: 9+ )

People try to compare with the US and Japan. Why don't you guys look into
the language policy of these two nations. Japan imposed an iron rule to 
unify languages, if Taiwan still under Japan ruling, what would have happened
now?  There will be another Okinawa!!!!!

Did any one see/hear any non-American accent official in the US government?
From: GuiCom Data Syste
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: How to give birth to a son?
Keywords: How to give birth to a son?
Date: 16 Oct 92 14:04:55 GMT
Organization: Schlumberger Austin Systems Center
NNTP-Posting-Host: cedrick.asc.slb.com

In article <23582@optima.cs.arizona.edu>, bsou@cs.arizona.edu (Brandon S. Ou) writes:
|> In article <shl1.718573806@crux1.cit.cornell.edu> shl1@crux2.cit.cornell.edu (James T. Kirk) writes:
|> 
|> >What's wrong with having five daughters?  Please don't be so sexist.  Trying
|> >to have more children would only increase the burden of the parents both
|> >financially and emotionally.  If I were you, I would concentrate on raising
|> >the five daughters you have instead of worrying about how to give birth to
|> >a son.  
|> >The supposedly "male superority" in Chinese tradition is outdated in today's 
|> >society.
|> 
|> I think you're right.  But here's something interesting:
|> You work, you sweat, you argue (with your wife?), you worry sick of them,
|> you go through all the hardships to raise your daughter, and finally
|> having the joy of seeing them grow up... only to give them away to 
|> someone else...			    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^
So, what do you get to keep when your son marries someone else's daughter?
Are you still thinking about the joy of "three generations under one roof"? 

In today's society, one'd have a hard time to get adjusted if he/she holds
the view like yours, not to mention 30/40 years down the road. The world
has changed, get real..
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: p_mahnken@tamar.compserv.utas.edu.au
Subject: Address of 'Free China Journal'?
Organization: University of Tasmania at Launceston
Date: 15 Oct 92 12:33:27 +1000

Hi,
I would really appeciate if anybody could tell me the address for subscribing
to the English language 'Free China Journal' (Ziyou Zhongguo Jishi Bao)
published in Taipei.  I used to borrow it from a friend of mine, but since I
moved to Tasmania I do not not have any access to news in Taiwan.  I find it an
excellent source for current affairs in Taiwan, and an invaluable reference for
my teaching.
Thanking you,

Andrew Papadimos
Lecturer in Asian Studies
University of Tasmania at Launceston
AUSTRALIA
From: ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: How to give birth to a son?
Date: 16 Oct 92 13:15:51 -0600
Organization: Muskingum College

In article <shl1.719186597@crux1.cit.cornell.edu>, shl1@crux2.cit.cornell.edu (Steven Lee) writes:
> 
> Hey!  An old Chinese proverb says:  "Real gentlemen stay away from the     
> kitchen."  How COULD you forget that??  I guess you are not a REAL man, either,
> huh?  <sarcasm>  :-b

	** I only cook at my home.

	   You will find out what Confucius said is correct if you
	   cook for a restaurant.
> 
> "Fortunately, we don't have to know the difference to be different"????
> What kind of logic is that?  To disprove something, at least ONE counter-
> example must be given.  If you have taken any elementary course in logic, you
> should know this very well.

	** Fortunately, God's creation is beyond logic.
> 
> So now, I state:
> "Men and women, despite some physical differences, have the same needs and 
> should be treated equally in the society."
> 
> Now disprove what I have just said!


	** Not to disprove but to amend:

	   However, in private, man should treat woman differently 
	   from treating other man.

	   Again, I need not to say this. Even one doesn't understand,
	   he will do it correctly.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu (Peter Wung)
Subject: Re: Traditional vs Simplified Characters
Reply-To: wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 21:40:46 GMT

In article 24111@zip.eecs.umich.edu, cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes:
>|Although I do agree with you that the traditional Chinese characters do
>|have some nice things and reasons about it. But, those were invented
>|thousands years ago, if they don't fit well in the modern technology,
>|such as computer system, what are you going to do ?

The simplified characters were not designed with the computer in mind either, so the point is moot.  

>|The real simple question is that if the good old things don't fit 
>|into the new world which one are you going to choose ? 
>|I think I don't need to remind you the tragedy happened in the last 100
>|years of Ching dynasty. Are you going to repeat the same tragedy to
>|preserve some things were good then but don't work quite well now ?

I don't believe that is a valid arguement either.  The language itself has evolved over five thousand years, and sure enough it will evolve as time passes by.  My main complaint is that the simplified characters were designed without much forethought and 
were motivated by political considerations.  If the language evolved through time to 
give itself a different form, that is one thing, but to adopt a rather dubious set 
of characters whose main raison d'etre is because someone did not like the old ways is rather rash and irrational.

>|
>|Yi-Chieh



********************************************************************
*Peter Wung			Email:wung@ee.gatech.edu	   * 
*Electric Power Laboratory	Snail mail: 33787 Ga. Tech Station * 
*School of Electrical Engineering	    Atlanta, GA 30332      *
*Georgia Institute of Technology			    	   *
*Atlanta, Georgia						   *
*   	"Pass, Set, CRUSH!"...					   * 
*  	Well, 2 out of 3 ain't bad for a short, fat guy. 	   *
*								   *
********************************************************************
From: ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Thoughts after Minister Wang requested for resignation
Date: 16 Oct 92 06:26:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: vax.1992Oct16.122653.3853
Organization: Muskingum College

(I don't know who wrote the following)
>>No matter how great Wang's idea is, he must get support from the majority
>>of people, it's democracy. The first land reform succeeded because no
>>democratic way. Look at what happens at U.S., Clinton and Bush tried so
>>hard to explain to American people how his method will work while the other
>>won't. This is democarcy and usually the policy selected through democratic
>>approach is more likely to be good.
> 
> 	I also have few words to say about the democracy system in the US.
> 	Do you think any of the three front runners (bush/clinton/perot)
> 	will make a difference in solving the problems US faces? I don't.
> 	Given that US is facing some serious problems, why US people have no
> 	other viable choices besides two political monoploy machines and one
> 	super rich man? That's one important problem they have in their
> 	system.
> 

	** What Taiwan and US need now is not democracy. They need
	   authority.

	   If Wang work for Old Chiang, the 2nd land reform will push
	   Taiwan to a successful 21th century. Now, under democracy,
	   Wang can only resign.

	   I agree with YK Hsu. Bush or Clinton or whoever, will not
	   make much difference to US. US need a Gorby.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu (Peter Wung)
Subject: Re: Oct. 1 or Oct. 10, which is the more important day for China?
Reply-To: wung@puttgen.ee.gatech.edu
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 21:45:05 GMT

In article 24600@zip.eecs.umich.edu, cyc@quip.eecs.umich.edu (Yi-Chieh Chang) writes:
>|>
>|
>|I thought ROC is another dynasty who replaced Ching dynasty. For two
>|reasons. (1). ROC used a new calendar after it is founded, exactly like
>|Ching dynasty. 

As did the PRC.

(2). The Old Chiang grabbed power until he died, then let
>|his son do the same thing, exactly like what happened in Ching dyansty. 
>|But none of the above occurs to PRC. 

So Lin Piao, the gang of four, Huo Guo Feng, Deng Little bottle, Zhao Zhi Yang, Li Peng weren't grabbing power?  What the hell were they doing, drinking tea and masturbating?


So, which one is more like
>|Ching dynasty ? which national day deserves more to be celebrated ?
>|

All the crows under heaven are equally black.


>|Yi-Chieh
>|



********************************************************************
*Peter Wung			Email:wung@ee.gatech.edu	   * 
*Electric Power Laboratory	Snail mail: 33787 Ga. Tech Station * 
*School of Electrical Engineering	    Atlanta, GA 30332      *
*Georgia Institute of Technology			    	   *
*Atlanta, Georgia						   *
*   	"Pass, Set, CRUSH!"...					   * 
*  	Well, 2 out of 3 ain't bad for a short, fat guy. 	   *
*								   *
********************************************************************

Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: ding@eng.auburn.edu (Z. Ding)
Subject: Re: Bush or Clinton?
Organization: Auburn University Engineering
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 13:44:14 GMT

Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Bush or Clinton?
Summary: 
Expires: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: na
Organization: Auburn University Engineering
Keywords: 

In article <1992Oct10.221825.1295@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca> huang@mwilliams.eche.ualberta.ca () writes:
>I just want to remind folks that Bush's VP is Dan Quayle.  And Quayle, like
>many other conservatives in GOP, is an ardent ROC supporter. He was almost 
>successful in getting enough votes to pass his amendment to the Taiwan Relation
>Act in 1979 which would have maintained formal diplomatic relationship with
>ROC.  If Clinton were elected, then expect a Secretary of State called
>Stephen Solarz, who has not been friendly to Taiwan.

Dan Quayle may be an ardent ROC supporter, but he is also the most idiotic
VP in the history of USA. 

As for Solarz, he may not be a strong ROC supporter but he surely is a
very vocal Taiwan Indep supporter. I can see how he's been unfriendly to
Taiwan at all.
From: tylee@austin.ibm.com (Ter-Yuan Lee)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: ITASA/TASC Midwest Cultural Conference Nov20-22
Keywords: Cultural Conference
Date: 9 Oct 92 21:41:06 GMT
Organization: IBM
Originator: tylee@leety.austin.ibm.com


In article <Bvv454.6yL@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, fcl39210@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Flee-Flea) 

> Hope to see you in November!
> 
> Sincerely,
> :) Felicia Lin

This could be called a conference for Taiwanese Eggheads-to-be, for
it only summons the students. Who is going to come to where Tim
Chuang inhabits.
-- 
/* The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of IBM's.         *\
 * Take care and have a nice day.                                            *
\* Ter-Yuan Lee                                                              */
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: claudius@leland.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: How to give birth to a son?
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 19:49:42 GMT

In article <1992Oct14.124948.3833@vax.muskingum.edu> ericlaw@vax.muskingum.edu (Eric Law, Geology Department) writes:

>	** You need to teach your boy how to be a man who is 
>	   supposed to behave differently from a woman. This is
>	   not related to whether you love your boy more than your
>	   girl. You show your boy how should a man be different from
>	   a woman by distinguish your own thoughts and behaviours 
>	   from that of .your wife

What does it mean to be a man?  In the past, it meant that they boy
should not shed tears, should remain indifferent to his family
members, and if he has the money and resources, he should have
several wives.  Is it applicable any more?

Why *should* a man and a woman think differently?  There are
obvious anatomical differences, but other than that, why should
they be different?

>	** Sexism remark? No, that is what I mean by "eaual".
>	   Equal does not mean "the same". It means "match"

Not that it is ever going to be able to become a fully equal
society, but your logic reminds me of the "separate but equal"
arguments by the southern whites.
Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:14468 soc.culture.china:28060
From: jyu@sleepy.mti.sgi.com (James Yu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Oct. 1 or Oct. 10, which is the more important day for China?
Date: 16 Oct 92 02:56:12 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: sleepy.mti.sgi.com

In article <1992Oct15.233438.396@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>,
philliao@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Hsin-Chao Phil Liao) writes:

|> Could you rephrase your question so that we can understand it?
|> There is no official language in the USA.  Defining an official 
|> language is a violation of the first amendment - the freedom of
|> speech.

I think you are a little confused.  Freedom of speech means you have
the freedom to express your opinions verbally, written, or in whatever
other forms.  I guess having the right to communicate in whatever
language one chooses might also be protected by the same clause.

However, having an official language does not in anyway violate this
clause - i.e. one can still express his/her opinion and if it happens
to be another language it is still permitted without fears of being
thrown in jail.  Of course, during the McCarthy era, things were
slightly
different.

Look, Canada has both English and French as its "official" language.
And yet, do you think people who speak other languages are thrown into
jail?  I'm pretty sure they have similar protections in their
constitution.

Regardless of whether there is an official language or not, not
speaking
in the official language does NOT equate to committing a crime.  Got
it?

James Yu

DISCLAIMER: My employer has nothing to do with this posting.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: jclei@sage.cc.purdue.edu (Jason Lei)
Subject: Thoughts after Minister Wang requested for resignation
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 06:35:15 GMT

The International Channel (a cabel TV channel) just had quite news coverage
on resignation of Minister of Finance (Mr. Wang2 Jien4 Suan1).  I am sure you 
know why he requested to resign.

Personally, I felt sad because I have not seen one in the political field 
I would admire as much as I would admire Wang.  Just some thoughts:

	(1)  Is his ideal on the so-called "2nd land reform" justified?  
Considering the soaring price and the limited resource (i.e., land) in Taiwan,
I think measures to prevent land being controlled by some people and used as
the major capital-collecting tools (i.e., Too3 Dee4 Tsao3 Dzou4) are necessary.

	(2)  My impression is that most of the supporters for Wang are "small"
ordinary people.  Surprisingly, many legislators (both KMT and DPP members) at
various levels are Wang's most furious opponents.  These legislators claimed
they represent what most people think on this issue.  Why are these two
observations against each other?  Why do those legislators from both major
parties united so closely this time (which never happened before)?

	(3)  President Lee said in public that the proposal by Wang is not
feasible.  Does he have a stand to say so (politically, scientifically and
socially)?

	(4)  Even if Wang's ideal is justified, did he describe his plans
in good details to convince people his proposals are implementable?  I 
never saw his detailed plans but just the outlines.  I am not quite convinced
although I basically support his principles.

I am sorry to bring up discussion on a political issue, but I just thought 
people in this newsgroup should not take shower (or bath) for too long. :)



Jason

 

-- 
   Jason Lei                            |   ==== ==== ====     
   Botany and Plant Pathology           |   (==) (==)        Various kinds of   
   Purdue University                    |    8 8 8           virus particles   
   West Lafayette, IN 47907             |    o o o
From: ychen@sp1.csrd.uiuc.edu (Yung-Chin Chen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: Re: Bush or Clinton?
Date: 15 Oct 92 19:57:07 GMT
Article-I.D.: sp1.YCHEN.92Oct15125707
	<1992Oct15.081929.16577@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca>
Distribution: na
Organization: /homes/ychen/.organization

In article <1992Oct15.081929.16577@kakwa.ucs.ualberta.ca> huang@mwilliams.eche.ualberta.ca () writes:

>   Republican Party's 1992 platform strongly favours ROC.  It refers
>   to Taiwan as "our ally."

I thought that you are a Dan's supporter. Now you seems to be a
Republican Party's supporter. We all understand that, when the
election day gets close, each condidate will try to keep everyone
happy. They do not want to make new enemy. However, only god knows
what happens after one gets elected. The most famous case is Bush's
"read my lips, no new tax". I never believe them.  When the election
ends, we will see whether Americans believe him or not. It is too
early for us to argue on this point.

In addition, based on the situation in recent four years (or twelve
years), would you say that Republican Party's goverment is friendly to
Taiwan? I would not say so. Bush always tried to please PRC, and thus
he never tried to make ROC happy.  We all know why Bush wants to sell
some F-16s to Taiwan this time. Otherwise, tell me anything good that
he has done to Taiwan in these four years.  God knows what he will
say if he gets elected again.  "Read my teeth. No F-16?"

I suppose that you saw the TV vice-presidential debate. What do you think?
Dan just kept attacking the personal character of Clinton. After the debate,
I quote from CNN: "Dan Qualye (sp?) is a disaster for President Bush.
People just keep thinking that he has a chance to be the President...."
Again, do not argue with me that media is not a reliable source. What
is more reliable in your point of view? 


ychen
Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:14556 soc.culture.china:28193
From: chiang@spot.Colorado.EDU (CHIANG TZU-PANG)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
Subject: The Double-Tenth Celebration Party at CU Boulder
Date: 8 Oct 92 02:22:13 GMT
Distribution: co
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder


Hi ! :

	There will be a party sponsored by the CU Boulder Chinese (Taiwan) 
Student Association to celebrate the R.O.C. 81th anniversary. 
The details are listed below: 

	Time: 		October 10th 7:00pm~10:30pm
	Place:		Wesley Chapel 1290 Folsom St. Boulder.
	Admission:	Free.

	Reception will be provided by the Chinese Student Association.
	
	If you have any question, please contact Lin Kai-Yung (Tel): 786-0798.
Every one is welcome.
	
			
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: RNM192@paccvm.corp.mot.com (Irene Pan)
Subject: What's Taiwan's furture???
Organization: Motorola
Date: 9 Oct 1992 08:14:34 HKT

------------------------- Original Article -------------------------
In article <1avf8jINN836@pollux.usc.edu>, mcyang@pollux.usc.edu (Bien-Chao Iunn)
> I read a report on last week's Independent Weekly News.  It mentioned
> that the city council of Tainan just passed a resolution which
> urges the central government to join the United Nations using the
> name "Republic of Taiwan".

What will be the best way for Taiwanese.  Independent?
If you even went outside the Taiwan to life, you should realize how
difficult it is to use Taiwanese passport. Hmm...

Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
From: ykhsu@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (yung-kao.hsu)
Subject: Re: How to give birth to a son?
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 14:09:39 GMT

In article <23582@optima.cs.arizona.edu> bsou@cs.arizona.edu (Brandon S. Ou) writes:
>
>I think you're right.  But here's something interesting:
>You work, you sweat, you argue (with your wife?), you worry sick of them,
>you go through all the hardships to raise your daughter, and finally
>having the joy of seeing them grow up... only to give them away to 
>someone else...

	Hmmm... Why so often when I called home, my married sister and
	her husband would pick up the phone :-)

	Being a male, I feel guilty when I see the advantages I had
	over females in the course of growing up. I hope the least I
	can do is to ensure not to pass down this bad "idea" to my next
	generation.

Yung-Kao Hsu

Xref: sparky soc.culture.taiwan:14348 soc.culture.china:27782 soc.culture.hongkong:12468