HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pcollac@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Paul Collacchi)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Blindness & Justice (A Course In Miracles)
Date: 9 Oct 92 22:06:21 GMT
Reply-To: pcollac@pyrnova.mis.pyramid.com (Paul Collacchi)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Pyramid Technologies, Mt. View, California.

In article <5108@calmasd.Prime.COM>, barry@calmasd.Prime.COM (Barry
Hynum) writes:
|> 
|> >We also dealt with the man who was blind from birth. They couldn't answer 
|> >my question of "*why* the apostles imagined that the man could sin
before |> >he was born. 
|> 
|> I would carefully rethink the short sighted version that blindness is 
|> caused by sin in any way, shape or form. One perspective is that the
|> chosen one is to feel more in this lifetime than see. I do not regard that
|> as bad or the result of sinning. I offer this as an alternative view,
|> not as a criticism.
|>

Sorry to thread jump...  To add a little history to the language.  If my
memory serves me right, the word "sin" derives from Greek and is an
archery term meaning literally "to miss the mark."  An archer "sinned"
if he did not hit the bull's eye.  To correct, the archer adjusted his
aim.  The word used to describe the adjustment was "repent."

Its too bad that the word "sin" has taken on the connotation of having
done something "bad" over and above having made some mistake or error. 
It is indeed most unfortunate that the belief system has been propagated
that suggests that "God" is this mean, petty kind of ego that "punishes"
"sinners."

More neutral understandings posit that "ignorance" perpetuates the
illusion of "separation" -- God is not punishing anyone; we are simply
suffering the direct consequences of our former actions.  If we
discontinue the actions, the consequences will also stop.  "Actions" in
this case also refers to more subtle actions in various mental layers.
  
|> 
|> It's like dreams, the symbols mean something unique to each individual.
|> One meaning for a symbol is ludicrous. IMHO.
|> 
 
Not exactly true I think.  Jung did much research with this and found so
many recurring symbols and themes that he posited a kind of
transpersonal dimension to the human personality in which we were more
the same than different.  True, the manifestion of a universal theme
occurs personally and uniquely, but the theme itself is impersonal and
occurs universally.

An example is the resurrection theme symbolized by Christ's resurrection.
As a pysche theme, Jung and others posit that this means the awakening
of "spiritual" awareness within a person.  It is a universal theme; it
occurs eventually in each; and it appears within the dream in only a few
symbols, though these symbols appear in an unlimited number of sequences
and contexts. 

The double helix is a well known example of how limited building blocks
can yield virtually unlimited variety. 

Paul Collacchi
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,alt.religion.kibology
Subject: Re: Bigfootf spaceman?
From: jkiley@andy.bgsu.edu (James H. Kiley)
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 16:40:07 GMT
Organization: Bowling Green State University B.G., Oh.

In article <67833@cup.portal.com>, John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
|> Dear Big Foot Lovers: Hang on in there folks. We're moving on up to 
|> the big time. I'll post some more when I get some time.
|> John Winston.


	I'd like to point out to all of you that Bigfoot isn't a spaceman, he's 
from Davenport, Iowa.  He's currently in my garage, reading Nietzche.

	Jimbo 
	considering changing it to Jibo, so I can be cool.
From: moskowit@panix.com (Len Moskowitz)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Proof: God wrote the Bible
Date: 11 Oct 92 02:34:36 GMT
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix & Internet, NYC

I again respectfully suggest that intra-Christianity discussions like
this one be taken to soc.religion.christian unless they have a
specifically new age aspect.  Many of us non-Christians are seriously
tired of these "One-Way"-er threads.


Arnold E. Nordeng writes:

>Also Jesus said, 'These Scriptures testify about me, ....' with regards
>to the OT scriptures.  Maybe Jesus was misquoted again?  Maybe Jesus
>is not the way, the truth the life, eh?

Non-Christians (us Jews included) would certainly agree with that last
question.

>Yet the Bible claims, that, 'Thy word is a lamp unto my feet and a light
>unto my path.'  I suggest you should read Psalm 119 very seriously, and
>pray about it.

Of course Jews would say that Psalm 119 doesn't apply to the "New
Testament."

-- 
Len Moskowitz
moskowit@panix.com
From: dougd@uts.amdahl.com (Douglas DeMers)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: what do you mean?
Keywords: a clue
Date: 9 Oct 92 21:01:44 GMT
Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA

In <1992Oct7.194449.16423@cbnewsc.cb.att.com> rjp1@cbnewsc.cb.att.com (be here now) writes:

>)In article rjp1@cbnewsc.cb.att.com (be here now) writes:

>The rhapsodic ugly toe has its special mantra under long toenails
>in plywood lavaflow increasing exit days while it troubles hapless
>extraterrestrials applying compost haphazardly and nonchalant dogs
>envision varicose elephants rejecting yardwork and crochet telepathy.

Bacchus undulates thusly, thinking heaven even bade another naive dryad
wishing it death through hyperbole!

Oh Horus, master yourselves!

:-)
-- 
Douglas DeMers,      | (408-746-8546) | dougd@uts.amdahl.com
Amdahl Corporation   |                | {sun,uunet}!amdahl!dougd
  [It should be obvious that the opinions above are mine, not Amdahl's.]
  [               Amdahl makes computers, not beer.                    ]
From: davidh@cascade.ens.tek.com (David Hatcher)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Proof: God wrote the Bible
Date: 13 Oct 92 18:16:04 GMT
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.

In article <1992Oct12.185528.15804@tc.fluke.COM> nordenga@tc.fluke.COM (Arnold E. Nordeng) writes:
>Isn't that wonderful.  Hindu and Buddhist have just degraded humankind 
>to that of maggots.  This human being is is no less or no more important
>to that of a this or that maggot.  In Christianity, man is a unique creation
>of a personal God and is an important creation of a personal God.


  From the perspective in which I look at this, the maggot is just as an 
important creation of God creating grace as is the human being. Each of us, 
in our own ways, glorify our Beloved God. And, each of us are needed to do
our own parts in bringing God's creation into a whole and united unit. For 
instance, with out the maggots, there would be a lot of dead corps laying 
around for us to trip over.

  Both the maggot and the human being are unique creations of God. And,
God, as experienced within other spiritual traditions, is just a personal
as is God as experienced within Christianity. I can't help but feel that
your barking up the wrong tree on this one.





	Love is the life force breathed
	into the Heart/Mind flower center
	of harmonious human relationships.
			Al Huang

	David Hatcher




Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: nordenga@tc.fluke.COM (Arnold E. Nordeng)
Subject: Re: Proof: God wrote the Bible
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 16:38:52 GMT

In article <Oct.3.08.59.49.1992.12521@ruhets.rutgers.edu> farris@ruhets.rutgers.edu (Lorenzo Farris) writes:
>In article <1992Oct2.191132.13237@tc.fluke.COM>, nordenga@tc.fluke.COM (Arnold E. Nordeng) writes:
>> If you want to claim the bible is untrustworthy in its facts or details, 
>> then how can you as a "christian" support the resurrection as a fact or 
>> detail, the cornerstone of our faith?  The common theme of all non-Christian
>> religions is to first doubt the bible as the inerrant word of God--something
>> that Jesus Christ did not do.
>> Just look at JW's, Mormons, Islam, Newage, Christian Science, Moonies & the
>> Unitarians, Bahai's etc etc etc......  
>> 
>
>Number two, the cornerstone of my faith in Jesus is His message
>of Love, nothing else.  If you bring that one principle into your life
>fully, I think you will find the whole issue of the literal truth of
>the bible rather moot.

Love may be the cornerstone of his message but the his work on the cross 
is the cornerstone of our faith.  I read......

1Cor1:18
The message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing,
but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

1Cor15:14
And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is 
your faith

1Cor15:17
And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile;...

Hebrews 9:22  In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be 
cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no 
forgiveness.

Overzealous or not, it is written by contemporaries of Jesus, and believed
by contemporaries.  God is not only a God of love, but a just, and holy God.

>"Ask me a riddle, and I [should] reply,       Lorenzo Farris
>`Cottleston, Cottleston, Cottleston Pie'"     farris@ruhets.rutgers.edu

-Arnold Nordeng
nordenga@tc.fluke.COM
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp)
Subject: Re: Dream in a dream...
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 08:11:32 GMT

I would be interested in what John Emory and Arnold Nordeng would have to say
about prophetic dreams like that.  Either coincidental, or obviously "of the
devil", since you aren't a Christian.  They forget "A house divided against
itself cannot stand", an apt description of the Church today.

I'd be interested in hearing what people think of prophetic dreams, and
possible explanations behind the process.  Is it like Seth says, that we
are multidimensional beings, and that time and space are illusions?
-- 
Ed Carp, N7EKG                  erc@apple.com                     801/538-0177
"This is the final task I will ever give you, and it  goes  on  forever.   Act
happy, feel happy, be happy, without a reason in the world. Then you can love,
and do what you will."           -- Dan Millman, "Way Of The Peaceful Warrior"
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors
From: pul@hardy.u.washington.edu (Arbaline)
Subject: Re: July 4, 1992 - Global Spiritual Independence Day
Keywords: Happy happy joy joy
Organization: University of Washington
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1992 06:32:30 GMT

In article <67775@cup.portal.com> John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
>Dear Fellow Travellers: The world looks a little better today. Maybe
>we should think like the quote that was in the hippy song that someone
>can probubly remember exactly;

Are you thinking of the "Age of Aquarius" one? Sorry I wasn't able to
OOBE with you guys last night; had other metaphysical commitments.

>Undoubtedly as we look back on this time
>a 100,000 years from now we will realize that things have been going
>on just as they were meant to be.
>John Winston.

100K years from now? Try 25 at most! You say yourself that we are in
for one fun ride. Although you raise a very good point! God is great
and the entire Universe proceeds under the Will and Plan of That!
(even if it doesn't seem like that) Karma acts as Universal Law and
all of us create our own reality.  Have you decided on your reality
yet? Energy follows thought. We are all Godlings. We are all One!

"Give me a little peace."
"A little? Why so modest? How about eternal peace; now there's a thought!"
-Peter O'Toule and Katharine Hepburn in "The Lion in Winter"

- Walter
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: doug@uuisis.isis.org (Doug Thompson)
Subject: Re: Blindness & Justice (A Course In Miracles)
Organization: International Shared Information Service (Ottawa)
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 92 01:06:19 GMT

waddell@firnvx.firn.edu (Kathy Waddell) writes:

> >This is the schoolmaster's idea of justice which is intended to help the
> >children in his charge learn.
>                         ^^^^^
> >    It is remoreselessly *fair*. You get exactly
> >what you deserve, and what you have earned, nothing more and nothing
> >less. Each mistake you make will be paid for in full by future bad
> >karma.
> >   
> >Comments welcome. I hope I didn't offend anyone.
> > 
> >=Doug
> 
> My view of karma is closer to your first passage.  That karmic situations 
> are set up in order to learn a lesson.  Once that lesson is learned the 
> karmaic balance is paid in full.  Usually this is tied up with forgiveness.  
> As we forgive, then we also are forgiven.  Grace can come in if we ask for 
> help.
> 
> To paraphrase Edgar Cayce, you can turn a stumbling block into a stepping
> stone.  He also says that one should neither give nor *take* offence.  

Thanks Kathy. The inevitability and remorselessness of some ideas of
karma do disturb me.  I am sure that forgiveness has power too and can
cancell debt.

=Doug
From: John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,alt.religion.kibology
Subject: Re: Bigfootf spaceman?
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 92 06:41:15 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world
  <67455@cup.portal.com>

Dear Little Foot People: It's saturday morning. Hold on tight because
we're just getting started in this subject. 
John Winston.
Xref: sparky talk.religion.newage:4614 alt.alien.visitors:7277 alt.religion.kibology:4151
From: John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,alt.religion.kibology
Subject: Bigfootf spaceman?
Date: Thu,  8 Oct 92 19:23:15 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: world

Dear Fellow Truth Seekers: It is my purpose to tell you what I know
and have learned about Bigfoot otherwise known as Sasquatch. 
  The first I heard about BF (Bigfoot) came in the form of a story 
told to me by my teacher and Guru, Merele Fagot. It seemed that a 
person had reported that he had been feeding a hairy creature in his
backyard of his ranch in one of the NW states of the USA.  This thing
was the normal 8 feet tall 650 lbs. of walking stalking muscle. A lady
reporter had enlisted the services of a psychic lady and they came in
contact with the BF in the rancher's backyard. The BF immediately
by telepathy said to the telepathic lady, "Why do you people want to 
hurt me?"  The lady then said by telepathy, "What do you mean you big
lug? I couldn't hurt you if I tried."  The BF then told his story.
End of Part 1.
John Winston.
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: doug@uuisis.isis.org (Doug Thompson)
Subject: Re: Proof: God wrote the Bible
Organization: International Shared Information Service (Ottawa)
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 92 19:41:43 GMT

nordenga@tc.fluke.COM (Arnold E. Nordeng) writes:

> >Number two, the cornerstone of my faith in Jesus is His message
> >of Love, nothing else.  If you bring that one principle into your life
> >fully, I think you will find the whole issue of the literal truth of
> >the bible rather moot.
> 
> Love may be the cornerstone of his message but the his work on the cross 
> is the cornerstone of our faith.  I read......
> 
> 1Cor1:18
> The message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing,
> but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

[further supporting texts deleted]

The cross was what? It was a sacrifice of love. "Greater love hath no
man than he lay down his life for another". So the cross is an
expression of love.

Ergo, you are both right :-). There is no contradiction between saying
"love is central" or "the cross is central" since the cross is an
example of love and its power.

=Doug
Xref: sparky talk.religion.newage:4644 alt.alien.visitors:7310 alt.religion.kibology:4160
From: John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,alt.religion.kibology
Subject: Re: UFOs and Newage
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 92 06:38:49 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <1992Sep23.164901.27569@cbnewsc.cb.att.com><1992Sep25.175939.15686@tellab5
 .tellabs.com> <Bv6411.KIv@world.std.com><66981@cup.portal.com>
  <RSHOLMES.92Oct1221127@rodan.syr.EDU> <67392@cup.portal.com>

Dear People: Please disregard all of the letters behind my name. My 
computer is acting up. I woke up with what I consider to be a profound
thought and that is WE ARE ALL ALIENS. By that I mean that we as a 
civilization did not originate or evolve on this particular planet.
John Winston.
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
From: paul@lily.aerc.colostate.edu (Paul Williams)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage
Subject: Eck Worldwide Seminar, Minneapolis MN, Oct 23-25
Date: 16 Oct 92 20:30:42 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: USDA-ARS-WMU, Ft. Collins, Colorado

For anyone who might be interested, the 1992 Eck Worldwide
Seminar will be held Oct 23-25 in Minneapolis, Minnesota
at the Minneapolis Convention Center.

Some sessions are free and open to the public, for others
there is a requested donation.

For information, call (612)544-0066

=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
Paul F. Williams             |
paul@lily.aerc.colostate.edu |
(303)484-1149 Home Phone     |
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
-- 
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
Paul F. Williams             |
paul@lily.aerc.colostate.edu |
(303)491-8277                |
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors
From: jek@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (James Kittock)
Subject: Re: UFOs and Newage
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 19:07:27 GMT

In article <67525@cup.portal.com> John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
>1>+&#$$$$$
>%Subject: Two Chicks From 
>Under Mt. Shasta. Part 2.
[etc. etc]
>John Winston. 
>st you to search for more information.

This is great-- now that I don't have a TV I have to come here for
comedy.  If I could find a good female lead singer I could start a
band, "Sharula and the Hyperbeans".

>,4xNxVxvx%xtxTxKx]
>x7x
>xx&x(x,<
>0Roman 10cpi, cheerful, and rational, and says, she is a Lemurian born 
>under the sign of Leo in 1951 in a city called Tel

Whoa man, watch that editor!

Say, do you ever have bad trips as well?
-- 
James Kittock -- 1st Year PhD Student, Computer Science, Stanford -- Duke '92
	  "What the world needs now is another folk singer,
	     like I need a hole in my head."  -- Cracker
Xref: sparky talk.religion.newage:4590 alt.alien.visitors:7245 sci.skeptic:17628
From: John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: July 4, 1992 - Global Spiritual Independence Day
Date: Wed,  7 Oct 92 20:40:12 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)


Subject: The Gunney Sack Man:
  This weekend (Oct, 3, 1992) while I was up at our property on the sides of 
Mt. Shasta I came in contact with a friend of mine by the name of Lyle who 
is the roving guard for the Mount Shasta Properties Association.  He and I 
were exchanging stories of our experiences.  We would see which one had the 
most unusual experience. I'd tell one and then he would top it.  It was sort 
of a Duel of the Banjoes except we were trading weird stories.  Here we go 
with one of his stories; Lyle will be L. and I (John) will be J.
  L. I used to be a logman and I had a job in Sumatra cutting trees off of an 
area to build a 35 mile long road for an oil company. We had hired a bunch 
of Sumatrans to do the cutting of the trees and one of the men who was a 
friend of mine caught malaria. He went down to the river to wash up and 
suddenly disappeared. His soap, towel and other things were left on a rock 
but he was gone.  He was a normal looking Sumatran of about 140 lbs.  He 
showed up again in about 2 weeks and  looked very sick and only was about 75 
lbs. There were tigers in the area and a person would have a hard time 
staying alive by himself. So they just threw him in a gunney sack, put it on 
a pole and took him back.  He said that the little people had captured him.  
They wanted him to marry one of their women but he  didn't want to because 
he already had a wife and children in his normal life.  The little people 
fed him during this time rice made from trees. J. Are you sure that you said 
rice made from trees? That would just barely keep him alive. They must have 
been torturing him to make him give in.  L. That's right. 
  L. Afer doing this his friend became an instant celebrity and all the local 
people came around to see him because a lot of the people had been captured 
by the little people in the past but very few had returned.  I then asked 
him if he wanted me to take him to an American type doctor and he told me, 
"No he would just go to the local witch doctor.  That's the last I saw of 
him.  
  L. These Sumatrans were a very superstitious bunch.  Ever once in a while 
they would come across a tree that they would call a ghost tree and would 
not cut it down. I'd have to cut it. They would also come across another 
tree that would bleed blood and they would not cut it down.  I'd have to cut 
those too. 
   So that's all of his story.  There is one things I didn't tell Lyle and 
that is some people believe there are little people in, on and around Mt. 
Shasta.
John Winston.
 I tell one and then he wouewZ
22@8r{`E
D9z
,x(x~x8	xVxexgxihl{RF
D9z
,
0Roman 10cpid for an oil company. We had hired a bunch of Sumatrans to do 
the cutting of the trees and one of the men who
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
From: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu (Robert McGrath)
Subject: Re: July 4, 1992 - Global Spiritual Independence Day
Reply-To: mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:21:19 GMT

In article <67636@cup.portal.com>, John_-_Winston@cup.portal.com writes:
|> Dear Map Experts: It seems that I have touched a nerve with my mentioning
|> the map. I will have to be more careful next time and not talk about
|> such things.  It is a very deep subject.
|> John Winston. Of course facetious is my middle name, John F. Winston
Dear John:  If you post claims of fact to sci.skeptic, you will find
them analysed and criticised.  Hint:  if you insist upon posting
things you read in the Weekly World News, you will continue to hit
nerves.

-- 
  Robert E. McGrath
  Urbana Illinois
  mcgrath@cs.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: talk.religion.newage