HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: les@chinet.chi.il.us (Leslie Mikesell)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Organization: Chinet - Public Access UNIX
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 22:05:30 GMT

In article <2409@adagio.lemis.uucp> grog@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey) writes:

>>Dell has an escape clause that sometimes helps if the problem is
>>just a bad kernel build.  When you boot up it gives you a few seconds
>>to hit the space bar and get a prompt for an alternate kernel to
>>boot.  Unix.old is always the last copy that worked.
>
>Funny you should say that. Look:
>
>+ === grog onlyyou:~ 66 -> ls -l /stand
>+ total 7096
>+ -r--r--r--   1 root     root        3980 Dec 20 14:56 mip
>+ -r--r--r--   1 root     root        4204 Dec 20 14:56 sip
>+ -rwxr--r--   1 root     root     1945520 Dec 20 17:40 unix
>+ -rwxr--r--   1 root     root     1678764 Dec 20 16:14 unix.old
>+ === grog onlyyou:~ 67 -> 
>
>The thing is, of course, that I didn't know that, and - like Fred Fish
>- didn't know how to get out of the graphics screen. If this had been
>documented, it wouldn't have been a problem, but documentation is
>almost non-existent.
>
>BTW, the old kernel is the vanilla flavour, the other one adds TCP/IP
>and NFS support. Compare with a similar kernel under BSD/386:

Dell would have unix.ok as the vanilla version, unix.old would be the
previous build, unix would be the current build.  I think TCP/IP and
NFS are in unix.ok, though since the default dell load comes up with
the network enabled if you have hardware in the right place.

Les Mikesell
  les@chinet.chi.il.us
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: zeke@fasttech.com (Bohdan Tashchuk)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Organization: Fast Technology
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 10:00:28 GMT

In <1992Dec19.010713.23959@isc-br.isc-br.com> ricks@odin.isc-br.com (Rick Schaeffer) writes:

>Amen, brother!  I'm **real** biased toward Unix...but I just cannot
>believe that USL/Univel don't seem to understand the economics of volume!
>They could sell many thousands of copies at $150 and take over the 
>home PC market.

You can give Unix away for free and you won't penetrate the home PC market
until you have

	a better dos than dos
	a better Windows than Windows

Ie, you need compatibility with existing applications, or new applications
that are just as good and don't cost any more per copy. The home PC market
isn't going to use Unix unless it runs sofware like Excel and Word for Windows
and Managing Your Money and Prodigy and the hundreds of other apps that people
have accumulated over the years.

This is OBVIOUS, OBVIOUS, OBVIOUS. And has been repeated over and over on
the net. And yet people persist in thinking that all you need to do is lower
Unix's price and the world will beat a path to its door.

Lowering the price is necessary but not sufficient.
From: davidsen@ariel.crd.GE.COM (william E Davidsen)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re:    Novell bought USL?
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:46:51 GMT
Reply-To: davidsen@crd.ge.com (bill davidsen)
Organization: GE Corporate R&D Center, Schenectady NY

In article <92356.155628U54294@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U54294@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:
| Hi folks,
|    A colleague was on the phone to another colleague in Westwood, Mass.
| about an hour ago. The Mass. colleague is listening to the radio, and says
| that he heard a report about Novell buying USL. I'd read that rumor in the
| trade press. True or false? If true, who has further details? Thanks...

  Yes it was in the morning paper, fittingly with the obituaries.

-- 
bill davidsen, GE Corp. R&D Center; Box 8; Schenectady NY 12345
    Keyboard controller has been disabled, press F1 to continue.
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.sys.novell
From: rogerk@queernet.org (Roger B.A. Klorese)
Subject: Re: Novell bought USL?
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 19:35:42 GMT
Organization: QueerNet

In article <PCG.92Dec31162920@decb.aber.ac.uk> pcg@aber.ac.uk (Piercarlo Grandi) writes:
>But, surprise, while the base UnixWare is fairly cheap, the server
>package is quite expensive -- about as much as the NetWare package.
>It is also more convenient to run (you get a timesharing system *and* a
>netware server), but less performing than a dedicated NetWare server.

You *also* (and I believe this is the core of the strategy) you get a far
cleaner, for more functional compute-server interface than NLM's provide.
-- 
ROGER B.A. KLORESE                                              +1 415 ALL-ARFF
rogerk@unpc.QueerNet.ORG              {ames,decwrl,pyramid}!sgiblab!unpc!rogerk
"Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from."
                                                                   -- J. Foster
From: grog@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Date: 23 Dec 92 09:06:07 GMT
Organization: LEMIS, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

In article <1992Dec22.202127.8638@crd.ge.com> davidsen@crd.ge.com (bill davidsen) writes:
>In article <BzL0p3.A1K@chinet.chi.il.us>, les@chinet.chi.il.us (Leslie Mikesell) writes:
>
>| Dell has an escape clause that sometimes helps if the problem is
>| just a bad kernel build.  When you boot up it gives you a few seconds
>| to hit the space bar and get a prompt for an alternate kernel to
>| boot.  Unix.old is always the last copy that worked.
>
>  And their standard boot floppy has an option to do system maintenence,
>too. A fairly painless way to go, although I wish they gave me an easy
>way to generate a new boot floppy with my own fiendishly hacked kernel.

Have you tried using a utility program such as DOS/diskcopy to make a
physical copy of the boot disk, then mount it and replace the kernel?
---- 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: qbarnes@urbana.mcd.mot.com (Quentin Barnes)
Subject: dead header files?
Organization: Motorola Computer Group, Urbana Design Center
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 20:54:36 GMT

While cleaning up our SVR4 header files, I ran across three files
that I belive are dead in our source base and probably other SVR4
source bases as well.  I was wondering what they were used for and
if there is any good reason for not just removing them. 

stand.h
-------
This file looks like it was used for building stand alone programs.
(Programs that could run without the kernel.)  The only place the
file is referenced in our source base is in the S5 fsck utility
inside a conditional (#ifdef STANDALONE) which is never turned on.

stand.h has '#include <sys/inode.h>' which is a file that's never
existed on our R4 systems, so I know no application has ever included
<stand.h>.

The file <sys/inode.h> exists on our R4 i386 reference box, but not
ours.  Should this be a dead file for other systems or is this an
error on ours?  I suspect the former.

core.h
------
This is a machine-dependent file which was never really ported to
our R4 environment.  It is not referenced anywhere in our R4 source
base. 

This file on our sparc has the comment "from S5R2 1.3".

prof.h
------
This is another very machine-dependent file (asm()s only) which was
never ported to our R4 environment.  It is not referenced anywhere
in our R4 source base. 


Has anyone run across other known dead files?


-- 
Quentin Barnes
qbarnes@urbana.mcd.mot.com | ..!uiucuxc!udc!qbarnes
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: rfg@netcom.com (Ronald F. Guilmette)
Subject: Re: C++ Compiler, debugger really, under SVR4
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 09:04:23 GMT

Some time ago, Thomas Roell wrote:

> The problem with g++ is that the C++ part of gcc doesn't work with
> '-g' on the command line. It just dies on half of my files ...


That is quite correct.  The -g option does not work for g++ on most SVR4
based systems.  The reason is simple Cygnus Support is either unwilling
or unable to fix the interface from the g++ front end to the DWARF
generation routines (in dwarfout.c).

Note that DWARF output for GNU C works flawlessly on SVR4 however.

-- 

// Ron ("Loose Cannon") Guilmette    uucp: ...uunet!lupine!segfault!rfg
//
//      "On the one hand I knew that programs could have a compelling
//       and deep logical beauty, on the other hand I was forced to
//       admit that most programs are presented in a way fit for
//       mechanical execution, but even if of any beauty at all,
//       totally unfit for human appreciation."
//                                              -- Edsger W. Dijkstra
Xref: sparky comp.unix.sys5.r4:1051 comp.sys.novell:10917
From: guy@Auspex.COM (Guy Harris)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.sys.novell
Subject: Re: Novell bought USL?
Date: 29 Dec 92 22:18:18 GMT
Followup-To: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Organization: Auspex Systems, Santa Clara

>NT (from what I've heard) is only being targeted at servers, not workstations
>(high end or otherwise).

NT, from what *I've* heard, is *not* being targeted only at servers (no,
person A claiming that persons B, C, and D from Microsoft said so in
"comp.os.os2.advocacy" is *NOT* sufficient evidence for me):

	1) DEC and the ACE people (or what's left of them) have been
	   showing it off on workstationoid boxes;

	2) Microsoft has been showing off desktop applications;

	3) a Microsoft spokesperson, as I remember, indicated that they
	   *do* view it as a desktop OS.

I can believe that they don't expect it to immediately become a
*mass-market* desktop OS, and that they view servers as being *one* of
the initial markets for NT, but I've seen nothing to indicate that they
intend it to be a server OS, henceforth and forevermore, world without
end, amen.

>Unixware does not provide DOS-type networking support (IPX/SPX) as a
>server; only as a client (always possible that I missed something, though).

It'll be interesting to see if that continues to be the case if they
acquire USL....
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: scott@asd.com (Scott Barman)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Organization: American Software Development Corp., West Babylon, NY
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 01:50:50 GMT

In article <sheldon.725577934@pv141b.vincent.iastate.edu> sheldon@iastate.edu (Steve Sheldon) writes:
> I just kind of hate these root directories with 100 different directories
>within them.  Seems rather unorganized...

It is.  So what.  If the user of that machine likes it, then let them
suffer through it!

> Ok, so I kind of prefer structured directory trees.

Me too.  It's funny how my pee cee at home has a directory structure
similar to my Unix machine here in the office.

> Like why don't windows programs go into a directory within C:\windows?
>like c:\windows\bin\amipro, for instance...
>
> Amipro's a bad example, it has a proper installation program.

On a relative's computer, I installed the Windows Entertainment Pack and
Microsoft Money.  Both packages asked me where to install the binaries.
While I didn't pick names like yours, the Windows Entertainment Pack was
installed in c:\windows\wep and MS Money in c:\windows\money.  This is
not the "default" locations, I told the installation to put them there.
So it can be done.
-- 
scott barman			| <This space intentionally left blank>
scott@asd.com			|
 (I can barely speak for myself, you expect me to speak for my employer??)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.protocols.tcp-ip,comp.unix.sysv386
From: garnett@refuge.Colorado.EDU (Santiago de la Paz)
Subject: Re: BSD ftpd doesn't work?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 21:03:30 GMT

In article <BzD6un.2JB@news.rn.com> larry@news.rn.com (Larry Snyder) writes:
>karl@ddsw1.MCS.COM (Karl Denninger) writes:
>
>>I'm trying to bring up the ftpd from the wustrl archive; the one UUNET uses.
>>I would like to be able to log connections among other things.
>
>Does it support symbolic links?  My problem is that I can't have
>symbolic links off my anonymous ftp directories.  The directories
>can be made, and will show up when logging into the directory from
>from the shell, or valid login's using ftp, but don't show up when
>logging in via anonymous ftp.

The problem is not the symbolic links, but rather the chroot() that ftpd 
does when you come in as an anonymous user.  Once the ftp homedir is made the
root directory, you can't reach anything outside of it whether symlinked or
not.

~james

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  James Garnett, Network Engineer                               (303) 444-1338
  garnett@cogwheel.com

  Cogwheel Incorporated, Boulder  ***  Producers of low-cost dialup IP routers
                        Boulder-Denver/Hong Kong

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: larry@gator.use.com (Larry Snyder)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Organization: Gator Communications - Feeds-R-Us 219-289-3745 
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1993 16:40:32 GMT

peter@ferranti.com (peter da silva) writes:

>You got a usable boot floppy with a comercial UNIX? I haven't seen one
>in a shipped commercial system since Microsoft Xenix. You generally have to

Well you haven't seen Dell SVR4 2.2 (release 4.0).  One can boot off the boot
disk, switch to the system disk when prompted, then exit to the shell and 
mount your hard disk drives and modify (and execute) your applications 
to you hearts content.


-- 
Larry Snyder                                    internet: larry@gator.use.com
keeper of the Gator                                   uucp: uunet!gator!larry
From: news@uel.co.uk (Netnews Administration)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Summary: how to recover from floppy - svr4.2
Date: 30 Dec 92 09:25:01 GMT
Organization: UNIX System Laboratories, Europe Ltd.

In article <2412@adagio.lemis.uucp> grog@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey) writes:
>In article <Bzss9r.Ds8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst) writes:
>>Well, with Unix you can boot off a floppy and fix it as well.  You
>>don't need a custom boot floppy; what's wrong with the boot floppies
>>the OS came with?
>
>In the case of the new SVR4.2 offerings, they don't give you a chance
>to start a shell - that's wizardry, and Unix for the Masses (not yet
>(tm)) doesn't cater for that sort of thing.

What follows is a summary of how to recover your SVR4.2 system from the
boot floppies. Note that this is for the USL reference binary and has not
been tried on UNIXware or Concensys V4.2.

Here's how to recover:

(1) Insert boot floppy1 and bring your system up, then Insert boot 
    floppy2 as prompted.

(2) Go through fdisk(1M) without changing your partitions allocation. 
   (i.e. type "5" for exit at the screen asking you whether to create 
    a partition, delete a partition, etc.) . You do not need to choose 
   to create partitions on the second hard disk. The boot flops will figure 
   out whether you were using it.

(3) At the screen asking you to choose between non-destructive/destructive 
    installation, choose (1) for non-destructive install.

(4) Insert the third floppy when prompted.

(5) When you see the prompt to remove the third floppy, hit DEL.

(6) You will see a screen asking you to choose between resuming install or 
    canceling the installation.  Just hit DEL here. You may need to hit it 
    a couple times.  You should then see a prompt ("#").

(7) Do what you need to do. Note the following:

    -- You can now put any floppy you wish into either floppy drive,
       and you should have access to your tape controller if it is
       there.
    -- you have up to 2 serial ports configured in your kernel.
    -- you have no networking.
    -- your root file system is mounted as "/" (as opposed to
       /install or /mnt). Other file systems except /home
       and /tmp are mounted on it. You will need to mount /tmp and /home.
    -- you should be able to run standard editing commands (like vi)
       since all libraries will be available to you.
Xref: sparky comp.unix.sys5.r4:947 comp.unix.sys5.r3:151
From: jcsu@minya.UUCP (John Chambers)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.unix.sys5.r3
Subject: Can Sys/V force DTR low or high?
Keywords: DTR
Date: 22 Dec 92 22:43:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: minya.1406
Followup-To: poster

The subject is probably self-explanatory. On BSD-like systems, you can
make a call of:
   ioctl(dev,TIOCCDTR,0L);
and  DTR  will  instantly  drop, telling a (sane ;-) modem to hang up.
I've poked around in TFM for several Sys/V releases (both R3 and  R4),
and as near as I can tell, there is no (documented) equivalent of this
operation in Sys/V.

The manuals do say vaguely (without mentioning DTR) that the line will
be closed when the last program closes the port, if HUPCL is set.  But
that isn't even close to what is needed. To use that, my program would
have  to first find out what processes have the port open, and this is
known to be a very difficult problem in general.  Then, if this  could
even  be  determined,  my  program  would have to kill all the others,
which means that I'd have to  be  running  as  root,  which  is  quite
unacceptable.

In any case, even if doable by this method, it  can  potentially  take
many  seconds  (or  minutes)  to  grovel  around in the kernel for the
information, and when you want to hang up on a caller, you want to  do
it  NOW,  not  some  time in the indefinite future that depends on the
size and complexity of the kernel's process table.

Another reason not to do it in such a byzantine fashion is that for my
program  to  close  the  port would leave a short window when it isn't
open, leaving  it  up  for  grabs  by  other  programs.   That's  also
unacceptable for the application, which is supposed to own the port.

So is it possible for a Sys/V process that has a port open to forcibly
drop DTR? (If not, I have yet another entry in my list of reasons that
we should list variants of Sys/V as unacceptable for the project.  ;-)
Might it be documented anywhere?
From: sturm@sun490.fdu.edu (Neal Sturm)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Multi boot
Date: 4 Jan 93 01:56:20 GMT
Organization: Fairleigh Dickinson University

1. Has anyone had any luck with BOOTMENU by Gordon W. Ross. Actually,
the bootmenu program works fine, it's the PFDISK program that I have
been having trouble with. There seems to be a bug in it when the
partition size is greater then 99 Meg.

2. Is anyone using a different multi partion boot program the works
well. I have also tried BOOTANY and I have a different problem with it.
It only supports 3 Partitions, Not the 4 that are available.

3. Does anyone know of a good partition table editor where I can
manually enter partition info such as Begin head, sector, cyl, etc...


Thanks
Neal Sturm
sturm@fdu.edu
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: mbundy@tghost.gbdata.com (M.B. Bundy)
Subject: Re: Bug in SVR4.0.3 /usr/include/sys/socket.h
Organization: TimeGhost Systems
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 04:47:40 GMT

In article <C02s2D.6DL@gator.use.com> larry@gator.use.com (Larry Snyder) writes:
>tma@encore.com (Thanh Ma) writes:
>
>>mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst) writes:
>
>>>There is a closing comment pair ("*/") missing at line 132 of
>>>/usr/include/sys/socket.h in Esix 4.0.3.  Could people with newer
>>>versions of SVR4 (4.0.4 and maybe even 4.2) check to see if their
>>><sys/socket.h> include file suffers from the same problem?  Here is a
>>>cdiff to fix the file.  Remember, folks, "gcc -Wall" is your friend...
>
>>Yes. ESIX 4.0.4 has the same problem but at line 131.
>
>Dell (of course) has this problem corrected in their SVR4 release
>4.0 (2.2) product

It is also fixed in 4.2...

Michael
-- 
Michael Bundy                                            Houston, TX
mbundy@tghost.gbdata.com                                (713)933-3640
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: tma@encore.com (Thanh Ma)
Subject: Re: Bug in SVR4.0.3 /usr/include/sys/socket.h
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 15:39:16 GMT

mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst) writes:

>There is a closing comment pair ("*/") missing at line 132 of
>/usr/include/sys/socket.h in Esix 4.0.3.  Could people with newer
>versions of SVR4 (4.0.4 and maybe even 4.2) check to see if their
><sys/socket.h> include file suffers from the same problem?  Here is a
>cdiff to fix the file.  Remember, folks, "gcc -Wall" is your friend...

Yes. ESIX 4.0.4 has the same problem but at line 131.

--
Thanh Ma
tma@encore.com
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
From: dwex@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (david.e.wexelblat)
Subject: Re: EISA disk driver for SVR4
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 21:14:36 GMT
Keywords: EISA SCSI BUSTEK 742

In article <1992Dec21.164503.14261@analsyn.gts.org> anton@analsyn.gts.org (Anton J Aylward) writes:
> I'm running Microport SVR4.  Its fine except that I have a 
> EISA bus and a Bustek 742 controller.
> Unfortunately the OS doesn't know how to run this in 32-bit mode.
> 
> I was wondering if there are any other vendors - apart from SCO -
> who do driver which will run the 742 in 32bit mode.
> 
> Alternatively, a third party product.
> 
> Utter last stop alternative, anyone have source for one ?
> 
> --
> Anton J Aylward

Microport has a driver for the Adaptec 174x in enhanced mode.  Last time
I talked to them they were hard at work on supporting the Bustek 742.
Give them a call.  If they stonewall you, ask to speak to Jack Craig
(he did the 174x driver; I think someone else is working on the 742).

--
David Wexelblat <dwex@mtgzfs3.att.com>  (908) 957-5871
AT&T Bell Laboratories, 200 Laurel Ave - 3F-428, Middletown, NJ  07748

"The meaning of life?  That's simple.  Try to be happy, try not to hurt
 other people, and hope to fall in love."  -- Mallory Keaton
From: hst@mh.nl (Klaas Hemstra)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: Bug in SVR4.0.3 /usr/include/sys/socket.h
Date: 30 Dec 92 07:19:37 GMT
Organization: Multihouse Automation, the Netherlands
X-Md4-Signature: 933982d012bd3f231e3c9b902b79da0e

I also fould this error in the Unisys SVR4 version 2
(I beleive the low version number = 4.0.0 or 4.0.1 for this system).

Klaas
--
Klaas Hemstra  (hst@mh.nl)                      |   /  / ,~~~ ~~/~~
uucp: ..{uunet!}sun4nl!mh.nl!hst                |  /--/  `-,   / ___ |_/ |__|
Multihouse Automatisering B.V. Gouda,Netherlands| /  / ___/   /  --- | \ |  |
---- Incompatible: relation between two computer(software-)products. -----
From: anton@analsyn.gts.org (Anton J Aylward)
Subject: Re: EISA disk driver for SVR4
Organization: ASCI: UNIX Database and Communications
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL7]
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1992 16:47:53 GMT

Sorry, that's a HOST ADAPTER, not a controller.
This is SCSI.
--
Anton J Aylward
From: edhall@rand.org (Ed Hall)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: Novell bought USL?
Date: 24 Dec 92 15:57:33 GMT
Organization: RAND

We're getting a bit paranoid, aren't we?

I prefer to look on the bright side.  Maybe now AT&T will loosen up with
regard to the continuing OS research that's been going on at Bell Labs,
make it freely available to any educational institution which wants it,
and help move OS technology out of the 1970's.

		-Ed Hall
		edhall@rand.org
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.unix.sysv386