HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: ys3359@thor.albany.edu (Yazmasterj)
Subject: Re: CFV: soc.religion.islam.ahmadiyya moderated
Organization: State University of New York at Albany
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 21:32:11 GMT

In article <1ee3e0INNqg4@CURIE.SYSTEMSY.CS.YALE.EDU> ahmed-shakil@cs.yale.edu (Shakil Waiz Ahmed) went on about...
>> I have been watching debate for some time (even participated for a while).
>> The point you keep missing, Shakil, is that people don't seem to think
>> you have shown anything very clearly.  In fact, many people seem to have
>> quite a conflict with what you have shown.  You show things according
>> to your own interpretation.  What you keep missing is that your
>> interpretation is not the be-all-and-end-all of Islam.  
>
>Um, Yasmin, how many ways can you interpret the following:
>
>    O People, NO PROPHET OR APOSTLE WILL COME AFTER ME AND NO NEW FAITH
>    WILL BE BORN. Reason well, therefore, O People, and understand my
>    words which I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the QUR'AN
>    and my example, the SUNNAH, and if you follow these you will never go
>    astray.
>
>or any of the numerous other passages I have quoted?  This is not a
>matter of interpretation anymore, but of simple comprehension...  If
>you can refute any of what I said, please do so.

As another poster mentioned previously, the exact translation of the sermon 
from the original Arabic may leave room for doubt.  Frankly, I agree with you.
I am not an Ahmadi Muslim.  I do believe that Muhammed (pbuh) was the final
prophet.  HOWEVER, if the original Arabic leaves room for doubt in the minds
of some, then that is their business.  If some do not believe it is a matter
of simple comprehension, and obviously the Ahmadis don't, they are free to
apply their own interpretations to that sermon and the Quran.  

The point I am trying to impress upon you is that people, like you and I,
have no business passing judgments in the matters of Allah.  A person's
religion is strictly between them and their deity of choice.  If the Ahmadis
choose Islam as their religion and Allah as their God (not saying there
are more than one but that different people see God in different ways), it
is not our place to contradict them.  To do so would be an act of extreme
arrogance and conceit.

Yasmin

-- 
**************************************************************************
*  Yasmin Sohrawardy                *           .sig undergoing          *
*  Internet:  ys3359@csc.albany.edu *            reconstruction          *
**************************************************************************
From: ihusain@pyramid.COM (Intisar Husain)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: PakistaNews GIF File:Editorial Cartoon Graphic File 1119
Date: 19 Nov 92 02:42:13 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View, California


Assalam-o-Allekum

Can someone please tell me how to read this gif file.

Thanks in advance.

Intisar.
From: ousi_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Omer Usmani)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Latest Political News from Pakistan.
Date: 18 Nov 92 04:13:42 GMT
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York


  The Government of Nawaz Sharif has moved against the opposition party's of 

having a march to Islamabad, in protest against the policies of the current

government.

  According to recent reports from Pakistan, members of the main opposition

party PPP are being arrested. Among those arrested are members of the

parliment (not sure if national or provincal) and workers of the party.

Senior members of the party have as yet not been touched.

  The government has declared that it will do its best to avert the march.

  As for the situation in Sind, recently the Army  announced that it would

be withdrawing according to schedule(i.e; in decemberwhich is  6 months from

the date that they moved in). Political sources indicate that this will not

happen as both Nawaz and the Prez don't want that.

   THAT'S ALL FOLKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


OMER....
  

decision to  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
From: arkay@leland.Stanford.EDU (Abdur Khan)
Subject: Re: Was Bhutto an elected Prime Minister ?  No Way !!!!
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 22:54:52 GMT

In article <Bxx9w4.2LF@ulowell.ulowell.edu> nchaudhr@cs.ulowell.edu (Nadeem G Chaudhry) writes:
>
>In article <1992Nov18.034605.97803@slate.mines.colorado.edu>, imustafa@slate.mines.colorado.edu (IBRAHIM  MUSTAFA ) writes:
>|> 	One of Amercian Friends asked me a question that why bhutto was
>|> hanged when he was an elected prime minister ? 
>|> 
>|> I replied him , ' Bhutto was an elected prime minister no way. 
>|> Even in 1971 he was not elected prime minister. If he was
>|> elected prime minister in 1971 the Bangladesh would not have 
>|> been formed . He didnot enjoy the majority of the votes instead 
>|> Mujeeb ur Rahman won more seats than him with a great majority 
>|> only a few people know about this.But with the use of army and
>|> bullshit journal like Yahya khan he unlawfully took the prime
>|> ministership and the consequent loss of East Pakistan. 
>|> 
>|> What you guys think ? 
>I think you are absolutly correct. Bhutto said who ever want to go to 
>East Pakistan (at the question of moving the assembly there) should take
>a one way ticket. And the famous "Idhar hum udhar tum" formula. Now a fellow
>had knee jerk reation and started talking about Zia and Junnejo etc which was
>not the subject.
>

Bhutto didnt have a majority in East and West Pakistan combinewd .........
...... but he did have a majority in '77 . 

Blame west pakistan for the east pakistan debacle, why only bhutto and Yahya.
No one in West pakistan wanted the bengalis to rule, so they threw them out.

sahibzada rafay khan [] 


Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.indian
From: sherwani@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Naveed Sherwani)
Subject: Re: Nationalism....
Summary: We will grwo, if two nations have to prosper
Keywords: pakistani flag hoisting in India
Organization: Western Michigan Univ. Comp. Sci. Dept.
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 01:03:01 GMT

In article <fb78.722563586@sol>, fb78@sol.acs.unt.edu (Ganesh Gopalakrishnan) writes:
> Agree whole-heartedly with you, Naveed, but how many people (on both
> sides) think like you? - ganesh
> 

Ganesh Shahib:

Well, not in millions. But it is clear that if our nations are
to prosper, our numbers will grow. I am willing to wait for that.
We must be patient, hostility was not created overnight, it took a
lot of years (centuries), I am afraid we might have to wait a while.

In the meantime, I will work towards betterment of both countries
and human race, in whatever, little ways I am capable of.

regards,

-Naveed
From: 92ali@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Re: Latest news on the March.
Date: 19 Nov 92 19:15:22 EST
Distribution: world
Organization: Western Michigan University

In article <1992Nov19.185001.6455@gw.wmich.edu>, x90kamali1@gw.wmich.edu writes:
> In article <1992Nov19.200538.21330@sol.UVic.CA>, ahussain@engr.UVic.CA (Amyn  Hussain) writes:
>> In article 10302@galileo.cc.rochester.edu, ousi_ltd@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Omer Usmani) writes:
>>>
>>> Benazir has been arrested and the march has been stopped. Hundreds of
>>>police made roadblocks and stopped all incoming traffic to the Capital.
>>>   Benazir and her entourage when they tried to run one of the blockades 
>>>were attacked and latthi-charged. 
>>>  I saw all of this on the NBC and ABC evening news. They said that many 
>>>western embassies had requested her to stop the march calling it foolish
>>>(this is an internal Paki matter what right have those idiots to interfere.)
>>>  Anyway the lathi-charge was quite bad from what I saw, Benazir had her 
>>>dupatta pulled off and then arrested. This is after she got into her 
>>>Land Cruiser and (I assume) was trying to leave. The police promptly pulled
>>>her out and arrested her.
>>>  Personally I'm not her fan but really Nawaz should have shown more decency
>>>and sensitivity especially as she was a woman.
>>>
>>>   THATS ALL FOLKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>>
>>>
>>>Omer.........
>> 
>> 
>> I agree that Nawaz should not have done that and I am not a fan of
>> Nawaz either, but frankly speaking, it looks like the country is 
>> running better in the hands of Nawaz in comparison to what Benazir did.
>> Other than that I am sure that Nawaz had no idea that the police is going
>> to pull Benazir out of her Jeep otherwise he would have told the police to
>> leave her dupatta on her head and kindly requested to get herself arrested.
>> NOT.
>> 
>> 
> 
> It's obvious that army will be back in less than one year.
> But I don't know, wheather that will be better for the country 
> or not. Any comment on the current Pakistan situation.
> 
> 
> 	--Shakir
> 
>Common Shakir....
   Come backcome back in to the real world after all the army is your protector
if india attacks pakitan who will defend...obviusly the army...so don't be
perinoid regarding the army...Pray to ALLAH that what ever is beneficial to
the country occurs...

Dilshad 
> 
>
From: khan@ces.cwru.edu (Mansoor Khan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Mister Khan in Big Apple
Date: 22 Nov 1992 23:17:00 GMT
Organization: Computer Engineering and Science, Case Western Reserve University
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: fox.ces.cwru.edu

	
		Maa-Badolat, Mister Khan, will be visiting N.Y.C area
		with his Jaah-o-Jalal during the Thanksgiving weekend.
		His Highness will be pleased to meet any cool-headed
		and warm-hearted reader of this posting.
		If interested, please send e-mail at the address below.

Mansoor Khan
khan@alpha.ces.cwru.edu
Cleveland, Ohio
From: imustafa@slate.mines.colorado.edu (IBRAHIM  MUSTAFA )
Newsgroups: soc.culture.pakistan
Subject: Was Bhutto an elected Prime Minister ?  No Way !!!!
Date: 18 Nov 92 03:46:05 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Colorado School of Mines


   

	One of Amercian Friends asked me a question that why bhutto was
hanged when he was an elected prime minister ? 

I replied him , ' Bhutto was an elected prime minister no way. 
Even in 1971 he was not elected prime minister. If he was
elected prime minister in 1971 the Bangladesh would not have 
been formed . He didnot enjoy the majority of the votes instead 
Mujeeb ur Rahman won more seats than him with a great majority 
only a few people know about this.But with the use of army and
bullshit journal like Yahya khan he unlawfully took the prime
ministership and the consequent loss of East Pakistan. 

What you guys think ? 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik )
Subject: Re: Nordic languages
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 04:00:13 GMT
Distribution: soc.culture.nordic
Organization: Apple
Followup-To: soc.culture.nordic

In article <1992Nov23.160904.8495@jyu.fi>, ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti)
wrote:
> Just a shy note, Finnish is spoken outside Finland too, not only
> in Finland. I would not take  from
> the population of a country so direct conclusions as you do.
> There is estimated being c. 500 000 finnish speakers in Sweden alone.
> Swedish Bureau of Statistics surely knows the exact numbers.

And subtract about 300k Swedish speaking Finns in Finland and
about 200k or so Swedish speaking Finns living in Sweden and 
suddenly you are maybe no longer the second most spoken language
in the Nordic countries!

Fun with statistics...


Kent
-------------------
Kent Sandvik (UUCP: ....!apple!ksand; INTERNET: ksand@apple.com)
DISCLAIMER: Private activities on the Net.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik )
Subject: Re: Keskustelua suomalaisten asemasta Ruotsissa
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 20:02:38 GMT
Organization: Apple
Followup-To: soc.culture.nordic

In article <1992Nov20.124654.19843@jyu.fi>, ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti)
wrote:
> The Finns of Sweden want a similar education system from kindergarden
> to the universities as the swedes have in Finland, nothing less.
> There we have an example which does not produce halvspr}kiga people.
> The swedes need not to travel very far to find out a solution for
> their entire Finnish population and Finlandswedes can consult how it is
> made and works. Why should the Finns of Sweden be satisfied something
> less than the Swedes of Finland? No reason.

It's the issue of immigration and people that have lived in the
same country since Medieval ages and before. I don't mind that Finns in
Sweden will start pushing for a bi-langual country, some time in
year 2800 A.D. You can't just move to another country and take it
over, you have to earn the rights for your culture. If this wasn't 
the case most borders would be closed, including the Swedish-Finnish
one. There's a reason behind immigration, in the case of Finns
that moved to Sweden it had to do with jobs and a higher living
of standard. If you immigrated, you made a choice, and you should
be *thankful* that the country accepted you -- instead of demanding
everything between heaven and earth.

Kent
-------------------
Kent Sandvik (UUCP: ....!apple!ksand; INTERNET: ksand@apple.com)
DISCLAIMER: Private activities on the Net.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: zoelen@rulfsw.leidenuniv.nl
Subject: stuga in sweden
Organization: Leiden University Faculty of Social Sciences
Date: 23 Nov 92 14:57:50 +0100

hi ppl :)
i am looking for a stuga in sweden from december 24th to 
januari 2nd, somewhere in dalarna or a bit to the south.
i am looking for a forest, snow, open fire and very few people.

but: the only addresses i could get are up to 3 or 4000 kronen a week
for places i am not sure of they are what i am looking for.
if you happen to know a cheaper one, or a travel agency which has some
nice things for 3 or 4 people, please mail me at :
zoelen@rulfsw.leidenuniv.nl

thanks very much,

adrian van zoelen
holland
From: torkel@sics.se (Torkel Franzen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Keskustelua suomalaisten asemasta Ruotsissa
Date: 16 Nov 92 20:28:54 GMT
	<TORKEL.92Nov16174217@bast.sics.se> <1992Nov16.181129.8957@nntp.hut.fi>
Organization: Swedish Institute of Computer Science, Kista

In article <1992Nov16.181129.8957@nntp.hut.fi> jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala)
 writes:

   >(just to note that Jarmo had some points in the article also.  it
   >would be more fruitful to ignore the noise and concentrate on the signal)

  Sorry, but I don't really see that your suggestion makes any sense. If
somebody has a fixed idea about "hemspr}k" being the term by which inferior
languages are set apart from the Aryan Swedish language, and so forth,
it is simply meaningless to attempt any discussion. And as far as I can see
these notions really are fixed ideas with Jarmo Ryyti.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: mtf@saha.hut.fi (dalens ande)
Subject: Re: Anti-foreign Attitudes in Scandinavia.....
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1992 20:27:06 GMT

In article <ksand-211192221949@wintermute.apple.com> ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik ) writes:
>In article <By3qv9.F8w@mentor.cc.purdue.edu>, bhamis@mace.cc.purdue.edu
>(Satya Bhamidipati) wrote:
>>  I am curious to hear about anti-foreign attitudes in Scandinavia, 
>>  especially in Finland. Does it exist ? If it does, under what 
>>  circumstances and how ? I know there is a lot of resentment against 
>>  foreigners in central Europe (especially Germany). The reason I am 
>>  asking is, I plan to move there there for sometime (few years). 
>
>If I remember correctly about 3000 foreigners live in Finland (mostly
>Swedes),
>a population of nearly five million people. If you get into
>Finland, you are lucky, because it's harder to get a 'green card'
>for Finland than USA.

 I recently read somewhere (alas, can't remember where) that there are
more than 5000 foreigners living in greater Helsinki area alone. So, I don't
think your figure is correct. Still, the number is very small.

 There is no german-style rise of neo-nazism in Finland, but there is
unfortunately a general suspicion and at times even unfriendliness towards 
non-"european" looking people. Finland is not a very mature state in this
sense. The finnish xenophobiacs aren't usually agressive (provided they 
aren't drunk), and I believe it is quite possible to make good friends 
with them when you get to know each other. Also, it will vary depending on 
the place of your stay... in the countryside and smaller towns people aren't 
used to "foreign" looking people, but in Helsinki you shouldn't have much
trouble.
--
Antti Lahelma			GNOTHI SEAUTON       "Common sense is what
mtf@saha.hut.fi  		====== =======        tells you the world
stel@purkki.apu.fi		 TUNNE ITSESI		   is flat."
From: bjorn@ludd.luth.se (Bjorn Fahller)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: International Language Education (WAS: Pakkoruotsi...)
Date: 23 Nov 92 20:16:43 GMT
Organization: Lule} Tekniska H|gskolas Datorf|rening - Ludd

In <1992Nov23.170744.21681@engage.pko.dec.com> chad@ithil.enet.dec.com (Chad Leigh) writes:
>re: knocking US education system

>I get tired of all this knocking US education, and
>how inferior it is.  I went through US schools and
>know where Finland is, as well as major historical

Oh, this is nothing but a way for us to hide our bad conscience because
of our own poor school system. I'll get flamed for this, for sure, but while
I don't know anything about the schols in Finland, Norway and Denmark, I know
the standard in Swedish schools is quite poor. I'm very fed up with this too,
probably more so than you, since I've been fed with this kind of "information"
since I was 7. It was when I was 7 my days of school begun and since then,
every time I've complained about something I thought was bad, I've been
given the answer "Aha, and you'd like it to be the American way then? Where
people can't even [insert whatever half-lie/half-truth you want]".

It wasn't until visited the US, only for a short time, but staying with a
family, I realized how damned twisted the Swedish view is. With this I
don't mean to say that I love everything American, but that things aren't
always the way one is told.
   _
/Bjorn.
-- 
Bjorn Fahller     Phone:              |The opinions above are not necessarily
Trollnasvagen 3A  Intl:+46 920 226870 |those of... Hey! Wait a minute. Do you
S-951 61 Lulea    Natl:0920-22 68 70  |seriously expect Me, a student, to carry
Sweden            << space for rent >>|the official voice of the University?
From: hberg@polisci.umn.edu (Bob Hammarberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Some history about AAland
Date: 16 Nov 92 20:59:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: polisci.hberg.211
Organization: Department of Political Science, University of Minnesota

In article <1992Nov11.094515.5422@ericsson.se> etxjdry@caddie.ericsson.se (John Dryselius TG/HB) writes:

>The affair was solved by NF (1921?) by letting Aalnd be a quite independent
>part of Finland and Sweden agreed on this.
>This was the only time NF actually managed to solve an international
>problem.

NF=League of Nations.  It's questionable, however, to what extent they 
solved the problem.  COnsider that the Alanders wanted to join Sweden, and 
that a plebiscite was held which confirmed that.  According to the Wilsonian 
principle of National Self-Determination, they should have been allowed to 
join Sweden.  This was the first time the League's principles were put to 
the test - and the league failed the test miserably.

Disclaimer: I am not now, nor have I ever been an Alander.  In fact, I know 
very few people named Erikson.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic,alt.sources.wanted,alt.swedish.chef.bork.bork.bork
From: mortenk@dhhalden.no (MORTEN KNUDSEN)
Subject: Re: English text to Swedish accented English text program wanted
Organization: Ostfold College
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 23:38:05 GMT

In article <26446@optima.cs.arizona.edu> dave@cs.arizona.edu (Dave Schaumann) writes:
>In article <1992Nov13.161553.21202@eng.ufl.edu> ruck@zeta.ee.ufl.edu (John 
R Ruckstuhl Jr) writes:>>I've got an immediate need for a program which I 
believe I've seen >>posted to Usenet:
>>It takes English text and transforms it to a English text with a Swedish
>>accent.
>
>Here's a couple of lex sources I grabbed off of alt.sources last summer.
>They both work after a fashion, but some clever-but-underworked programmer
>could surely combine the two and come up with something superior to both...
>
>

I get a 'Unknown symbol: _yywrap' when compiling with 'cc -ll -o'. Anybody 
know why?
From: ryyti@jyu.fi (Jarmo Ryyti)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: The Finns of Sweden
Date: 23 Nov 92 07:00:19 GMT
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

: 
:  1. Do you still claim it was a complete genocide (=folkmord) of the
:     Finns in northern V{rmland? Did the Swedish government kill every
:     single Finn that lived in Finnskogen?

If we consider the treatment of red-indians in USA or in Amazonas
as genocide the answer is yes, the genocide does not mean only concrete
killing but destroying one's culture and language. Some may think
the red-indians of America were not genocided or how you call it
but they just did not manage to survive. For me genocide
means destrying one's  culture &language. So my answer is YES.
It was a genocide.
: 
:  If you answer Yes to question 1, then:
: 
:     2. How can I be alive today? Are you calling me a liar because I
:        say that I have roots from the Finns of Finnskogen?
:        Or maybe some aliens have been around to re-write all the
:        parish registers (kyrk-b|cker)?!
: 
As I wrote, genocide does not mean just sending people to the gas-chambers
but the process where one nation is by force assimilated into an other.
You are a typical example of such a person. A person which has lost
his mother tongue and culture.  I compare this with for instance
today's Amazonas where also the original way of living was "banned",
the outsiders come to explain how they have to live. So happened in
W{rmland , the outsiders came and said how to behave and live. So shortly
said. For me W{rmland was " the Amazonas of Sweden", the destiny of Forest
Finns similar to that of Amaxonas Indians which give up their language,
culture , who have to study protugese in order to be civilized. The size of
the process was just smaller but the basically it was the similar process,
in Swedish scale.

Like your ancestors had to change the language and culture in order
to be "civilized" people. I suppose there is just some huts left, no
person speaking orginal language, no remnants of the culture in everyday
life. There is just a Museum, I would not wonder if there were some
vax copies of the people even who use to live there.
Like the red-indians who gave up their own culture in front of
an other who had the power and the means, many are existing today
in books. 

:  If you answer No to question 1, then:
: 
:     2. I think you owe us a public apology.
:  
I feel more pity of you and your family. Among the Black Americans
you were called Uncle Tom type of person. A person who copies
so much their masters way of thinking that he looses his own roots,
start speaking like their masters and finally turn towards his own
because he has changed the side.
The Swedish governement and administration owe public apology towards
the Finns and mankind.
Terveisi{,
Jarmo
: >
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic
From: booserm@reis61.alleg.edu (Marcia Booser)
Subject: Need address of the University of Lund
Organization: Allegheny College
Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1992 00:41:12 GMT


	   Hello!
	If anyone out there can give me an address or some information  
about the University of Lund,  I'd be very grateful.  I would like to  
study there for a semester and wonder if it is possible.  
		Tack p} f|rhand!
			Marcia

e-mail address:  booserm@alleg.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.nordic