HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N. Barrett)
Subject: Re: Future Amiga chipset
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 07:16:46 GMT

In article <38103@cbmvax.commodore.com> andy@cbmvax.commodore.com (Andy Finkel) writes:
>>exchanged e-mail messages with the president of Word Perfect Corp., way back
>>when they first announced that they were abandoning the Amiga.  If anything, 
>>it was primarily due to the letter-campaign that I initiated that Word Perfect
>
>You've posted this claim before, and it still doesn't ring true;  

   Do you have any back issues of Commodore Magazine?  Take a look at the last
few issues.  I forget exactly which one it is, but one of the last two or three
issues has a letter by me, urging people to write Word Perfect Corp. about 
their decision to pull Amiga support.  The issue of AmigaWorld for the same 
month has the same letter from me.

   I wish I could name the dates and issue numbers for the magazines that have
my letter, but I can't.  I only have about half of my magazine collection here
at home.  The rest is at my apartment.  I could not find the issue among the
ones I have here.

>Basically, you have not proven to me that you've ever done anything
>that will help the Amiga, Amiga users, or, in fact, anyone.

   I was your typical Commodore-can-do-no-wrong Amigoid for a long, long time.
It took a lot to change me.

---
| Marc Barrett -MB-  |  email: barrett@iastate.edu
--------------------------------------------------
From: fheitkamp@desire.wright.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Does reading this group make you depressed? The story of a victim.
Date: 3 Jan 93 10:07:28 EST
Organization:  Wright State University 

In article <C072zK.6Ao@cs.mcgill.ca>, jerry@cs.mcgill.ca (Gerald (Jerry) KUCH) writes:
> In article <1993Jan1.205502.10918@klaava.Helsinki.FI> lindblad@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Jarkko Lindblad) writes:
>>Marc N. Barrett (barrett@iastate.edu) wrote:
>>> In article <1992Dec31.191959.9373@klaava.Helsinki.FI> lindblad@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Jarkko Lindblad) writes:
>>> >Marc N. Barrett (barrett@iastate.edu) wrote:
>>> >
>>I would never say that Intel is ahead of Motorola with their
>>CISC-line. Fastest 68040 is easilly a match for fastest 486. P5 may
>>give the lead to Intel if they manage to get it out before Moto is
>>ready with 060.
> 
> Agreed here.  The 486, other than being available at higher clock rates 
> than the 040 currently is, isn't really a clearly superior chip.  The
> Motorola instruction and register sets are still a bit nicer for the 
> assembly language programmer to deal with.
> 
>>	The reason why Moto may even lose the CISC-wars is not because
>>they don't want to make fastest CISCs but because they can't afford to
>>invest as much as Intel on their CISC's (I'm pretty sure Intel makes
>>more money with CISCs thatn Moto even as they sell similar quantitys
>>of them as Intel does sell more 486's than Moto 040's).
> 
> Actually, according to some statistics that I saw last summer, it looks 
> like the x86 line outsells the 680x0 by about two to one.  I think that
> this total includes non-Intel manufactured x86 knockoffs as well, though.

	It looks like the 680x0 lines future is becoming less and less
	certain all the time.  Apple is probably going to start using the
	PowerPC chip for their products.  HP and others have already
	dropped the 680x0 line.  There are no personal computer or 
	workstation makers that I know of that have expressed a firm 
	commitment to moto, at least not like Intel in the PC-Clone world.

	Since Apple and Commodore are perceived as playing catch up with
	PC-Clones  ( which is only true in some areas, they are clearly
	ahead in others, as we here know ),  the availablilty of the '060 
	months after the Pentium will be seen as a further lagging behind by 
	Apple and Commodore.

	The Pentium seems like a little too much processor for the current
	PC-Clone architecture and MS-DOS to handle, IMHO. I mean having
	AT hardware compatibility.

	
> 
>>Jarkko Lindblad         | sleep my friend and you will see
>>lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi | that dream is my reality
>>------------------------| they keep me locked up in this cage
>>          - MetallicA - | can't they see it's why my brain say rage
> 
> 
> -- 
>  Jerry Kuch (jerry@cs.mcgill.ca) | Wishing I were an emaciated chihuahua. 
>  "I was wrong to play God.  Life is precious, not a thing to be toyed with.
>   Now take out that brain and flush it down the toilet."
>                   --- M. Burns  "Treehouse of Horror II"
Fred Heitkamp,  ** Not an organization.  My opinions only **
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Don't let the Amiga Die (Part II)!!!
From: jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz (John Bickers)
Date: 1 Jan 93 13:37:00 PST
Organization: TAP

Quoted from <1992Dec29.173309.5562@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> by jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel):

> And BTW, the PC can't run any of the above-mentioned apps with just 640K.

    Even inferior PC demos seem to require more RAM than demos for
    the A500.

> | JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
--
*** John Bickers, TAP.                   jbickers@templar.actrix.gen.nz ***
***    "Radioactivity - It's in the air, for you and me" - Kraftwerk    ***
From: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us (MARK BROWN)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: VistaPro & clones
Reply-To: mbrown@legend.akron.oh.us
X-Software: Legend (216-825-2747) UUCPShell v4.9/med20Dec92
X-Disclaimer: Opinions of users do not necessarily reflect those of managment
Date: 3 Jan 93 00:43:40 EST
Organization: The Legend BBS Public Access (216)825-2747

You'll Find That Popular Science is LUDICROUS to the Point of 
Pointedly ignoring the Amiga. They do and will Make an Active point of 
ignoring the Amiga(they never even said any thing about the toaster 
far as I know, most likely becuase it doesn't run on the mac.). They 
also talked about VR on the IBM but won't point out that the only 
Commercial VR companys now, Exclusivly use the amigas in the Customers 
VR setups.
   For all I know, there is No VR company marketing VR systems that 
use the MAC or IBM.(I know I could be wrong, but I don't think I am).
    Mark
From: Lee_Robert_Willis@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: 1200/4000 pricing
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 15:56:11 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Distribution: usa
  <1992Dec29.180028.13742@midway.uchicago.edu>

Question:  Can the A1200 use harddrives intented for the A500?  If I don't
have to be a new harddrive, I'll be very interested in power-ing up!

Lee		Lee_Robert_Willis@cup.portal.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: dtiberio@engws10.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio)
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11
Organization: State University of New York at Stony Brook
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 14:51:16 GMT

In article <1992Dec21.193851.25752@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>Aric.Caley@ofa123.fidonet.org wrote:
>:
>: He's  talking  HARDWARE.   The  Amiga  hardware  allows  for true, multiple
>: screens,  in  a way thats different from any computer I have ever seen.
>:
>
>Yeah, yeah.  The Atari 400 could do similar things, although, of course, it
>didn't have a multitasking OS to take advantage of it.  The video display
>was constructed from a list of instructions, each of which could specify
>the resolution and pixel data address of a single line of graphics (or text).
>Add horizontal blank interrupts, and you can modify the palette after each
>scan line.  Interesting, but really nothing new.
			  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

	Wrong, the Atari 400 and the C64, with all their screen interrupts,
can not display multiple screens like the Amiga can...an Atari ST can do a 
Boing! demo, but not like the Amiga can. You have obviously never used an
Amiga...I can't stand using other computers since I have become so used to
fast screen updates and multiple screens. I will upload a pic of what it 
looks like.
		

>| JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |


-- 

      Amiga Graphics Association BBS (516) 473-6351  24 HRS 14.4 v.32bis
Thanks Gwen. Like I said, I had faith in #3. At least it answers the phone now.
	
                                                                            
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:32264 comp.sys.amiga.misc:19137
From: das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A)
Subject: Re: The 'Screens' debate:
Organization: University of Southwestern Louisiana
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 05:48:25 GMT

In OS/2, that full-screen windows you drag around: if you're really THAT 
particular, you could just un-maximize it,and re0maximize it and it _does_
then go to full, fullscreen.

Also, How much need is there to have SO many different palletes?  I am
not too up on the technicals of this, but I *think* that in OS/2 at
least the icons can how truly different palletes (in 16 colors I've
designated different 'true' colors- no dithers), usually that is the way
the come (when I downloaded them).

--
Dan Stephenson                                         das9674@usl.edu  
"Yes Dan, I have heard of Ultima Underworld.  From my point of view it
 appears to be a rather large stick which you seem to be using to beat
 everbody in this group with." -Mark Steyn, comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jdutka@wpi.WPI.EDU (John Dutka)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Does reading this group make you depressed? The story of a victim.
Date: 1 Jan 93 01:22:51 GMT
Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpi.wpi.edu

In article <58155@dime.cs.umass.edu> barrett@astro.cs.umass.edu (Daniel Barrett) writes:
>	Marc, when will you learn to qualify your sentences instead of
>making sweeping, false generalizations?

Probably not even on his death bed.  You forgot to add "and when your bluff is
called, changing your argument to support your conclusions..."

>	You mean that there is "no really good productivity software" FOR
>*YOUR* PURPOSES.  Whatever they may be.  Other people use the Amiga
>productively just fine.  If there is no good productivity software, then
>please explain how computer professionals have used Amigas for work
>consistently for years and years and still enjoy it.  (I know plenty
>of them.)

Like me.  I use my Amiga for flow visualization.  I run fluid flow simulations
on a DEC Alpha, and a program to convert the velocities to Tektronix graphics,
saving them as an IFF with VLT, and forming the IFFs into animations with FRED
and MorphPlus, or using AmigaTeX to get an article out for an ASME journal
(still crossing my fingers there).  Sure, the Amiga is lacking in some areas
of productivity software, but there ARE plenty of high-quality packages
available.

>	Face it -- you bought the wrong computer, and you have nothing
>better to do with your time than complain about it.  Four years of
>complaining... that's a lot of time and effort.  You must enjoy it.
>	Anybody with sense, rather than sitting around complaining, would
>have moved on to another computer years ago.

We can always hope.

>                                                        Dan
>							(Still no relation)

-- 
| John A. Dutka, Jr.   | Micro Credo:                                        |
| jdutka@wpi.wpi.edu   | Never trust a computer bigger than you can lift.    |
| Worcester Polytechnic Institute ___________________________________________|
From: jaker@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Jake Rose)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Portable GUI Builders and *YOU* (Call now!)
Date: 23 Dec 92 17:01:38 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech Computer Science Dept, Blacksburg, VA

tmc@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA (Tim Ciceran) writes:

>In article <BzoI61.CoE@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> jaker@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Jake Rose)
>writes:

>>Two ads in the most recent Byte (which contained a fair review of the
>>A4000 and A3000T, by the way) from XVT Software Inc (1-800-678-7988)
>>and Case Design (1-800-880-1100) offer products for interface creation
>>which support multiple platforms, but *neither* supports the Amiga.
>>XVT even claims that they support "all GUIs"!...

>Why not save your breath and do something constructive? Inovatronics has
>been working on AppBuilder in conjunction with CBM for the past couple
>of years. If you want to express some interest in an application of this
>sort, give them a call:

>Inovatronics: (214) 340-4991

I'm well aware of the existence of the AppBuilder project - believe me,
it makes a difference (now if it were only *free* :) ), but the point of
this is not to have an interface builder for the Amiga, it's to make
people aware of the Amiga as a viable market.  If they're writing software
on a PC with these systems, it's no sweat to build an Amiga version if
they support the Amiga.  This means there's a much better chance of these
companies porting to the Amiga, which means big names from other markets
testing the waters.  I expect, since they wouldn't need a seperate Amiga
development team (or not much of one), they would find the Amiga market
profitable, and that would mean more software for the Amiga that people
recognize.
-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Jake Rose               :: Two men look out through the same bars.
jaker@csugrad.cs.vt.edu ::                     One sees mud, and one the stars.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: danaf@bray1b.its.rpi.edu (Frank R. Dana Jr.)
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Reply-To: danaf@rpi.edu
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, NY.
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 03:28:19 GMT

In article <1992Dec22.222921.29271@sol.ctr.columbia.edu>, jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
|> 
|> It's funny how Amigoids love to assume that "Only Amiga Makes It Possible".
|> I routinely run several command line sessions, a game, and the Windows
|> (or OS/2) desktop, each in its own screen on a PC with VGA.

Hmm... interesting. You neglected to mention what marvelous feat of master
programming allows you to do this. Also, your use of the word "in" makes me
rather suspicious, as you usually run programs "on" screens. You *ARE* talking
about multiple SCREENS, right? Not windows...

Oh, right. I remember now. Windows does that silly full-screen-mode app switch
thing that nobody ever uses. It takes FOREVER to switch between those screens!
I prefer being able to drag ProPage halfway down the screen and still be able
to see what I was doing while I search for a missing file in a Shell window 
(which I did yesterday..)

|> : and as far as performance
|> : goes on the Amigas GUI, I believe from experience that you would be hard
|> : pressed to beat the speed of the Amigas Windowing.
|> :
|> 
|> Actually, I'd be hard pressed to find a 640x200 4-color Windows screen to
|> compare with an Amiga.

Really? Compare my 16-color 640x400!

You people are impossible. NOBODY runs in 640x200 anymore. The standard, as of
TWO FRIGGIN' YEARS AGO, is 640x400! Commodore even drew all the icons in that
resolution for 2.04.

And a lot of Amigans have gone to more than 4 colours. I started using 8 about
a year and a half ago, and switched to 16 recently. I'm still very happy with 
the speed, which will be even better when I replace my last bit of dog-slow
16-bit RAM with 4 more megs of GVP 32-bit. 

Y'know, on every system information program I've used, the SupraRAM comes up
in the same listing [32-bit...] as the GVP RAM. The addresses seem to be 
merging together, and I think the Supra board might even come FIRST. Does 
anyone have any suggestions on how to stop this? It would up my system speed a
lot if I could save the 16-bit RAM for emergencies...
 
|> --
|> +-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
|> | JERRY J. SHEKHEL  | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
|> | Drummers do it... |     Burlington, MA USA     | in my book of memories.   |
|> |    ... In rhythm! |        jerry@msi.com       |         -- Guns N' Roses  |
|> +-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+

-- 
/////////////////////////[[[[[[[[[[]]]]]]]]]]\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
(718)             (212)                        (516)             (518)
=======Amiuser============Frank R. Dana, Jr.============Doc Ami=======     
--------My opinions rarely reflect those of any sane person,----------
	   living, dead, or undead... that's gonna CHANGE.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
From: plummer@hercules.cs.uregina.ca (Dave Plummer)
Subject: Re: Byte A4000/A3000T-040 Review
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 20:53:44 GMT
Organization: University of Regina, SK, Canada

In article <BzyrAo.FEp@NeoSoft.com> peter@NeoSoft.com (Peter da Silva) writes:
>I think a lawsuit might be in order, since for a personal computer with slots,
>opening it up to install cards is part of normal and expected usage. I can see
>this sort of restriction on the 500 through the 1200, but on the 2000 on up
>it's like voiding your car's warranty because you changed the oil yourself.
>-- 

Don't laugh too hard.  Some new-car warranties require that you take your
car to the dealership for an oil-change.  The difference, of course, is that
the oil change itself is included in these warranties.

If Commodore sends someone to my house within 24 hours to install the card
I plan on installing, great.  If not, as far as I'm concerned, the machine
doesn't actually have a warranty.

Know what I think will save the Amiga?  Bridgeboards that cost the same as
entire PC motherboards.  If I could buy a 386-40 Mhz bridgeboard, AND use
a VGA card, and share my Amiga peripherals, I'd already have one.  Since
I could buy that motherboard for $225, and a Seagate ST01 SCSI controller
for $28.95, that's what I did.  I have to switch monitor cables to go
back and forth between machines, of course, but it was cheaper than a
bridgeboard. 

I hear there's a third-part 486-25 bridgeboard for about $950, which is
not bad, but 486 motherboards still go for < $600.  Understandably, there's
more R&D in a bridgeboard than a motherboard for most third party
companies, but CBM should have the concept cased after what, 8 years?

All in all, the Amiga still awaits its "compelling application".  It was
123 for the PC, DTP for the Mac.  

I still love my Amiga, but WinWord replaced Excellence, Borland C++ replaced
SAS C (SAS wants more for an upgrade than it cost to buy C++ for Windows
off the shelf).

Like I said, I still love it and I still use it, but there are fewer and
fewer reasons for people to buy for the FIRST TIME, at least in North
America.  Give them one, and there won't be a need for threads like this.

- Dave

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: zxmoa01@studserv.zdv.uni-tuebingen.de (Andreas Otte)
Subject: 16 cls Hires Icons
Keywords: Where ?
Organization: Comp. Center (ZDV) U of Tuebingen, FRG
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 22:35:26 GMT

Where can i get thode GREAT MC Vey Icons !! Got some
on amiga physik but it seems a lot of them are missing ! So where can
i get the rest of them ??? Andy

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: 22black@sol.cs.wmich.edu (Martin Black)
Subject: Re: Dan got the Amiga 1000!
Organization: Western Michigan Univ. Comp. Sci. Dept.
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 17:17:34 GMT

das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A) writes:

>Ok, I've REALLY LOOKED for the way to switch to 640X400, but I
>cannot find it.  Where??  I have looked a lot in the Preference
>program, but I didn't see it.

Well in the prefs, select interlace on, and 80 columns.  That is it.
Oh forgot hit save and reboot, in 1.3 you can't change the wb on the fly.
I thought you were in it, you said you had flicker, ie interlace 400

Martin

-- 
Bill SATAN LIVES Gates is the biggest enemy to personal computers ever.
From: Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: CBM mention on 12/11/92 Computer Chronicles
Distribution: world
Date: 22 Dec 92 22:08:01 EDT
Organization: Amiga Colony BBS

re article by Jerry Shekhel:  "The Mac has had a useful clipboard since day
one." 

<sarcasm mode>  Yeah, sure, r-i-i-g-h-h-t-t.  Uh-uh.  Maybe it was useful
to -you- but I like to SEE what I'm doing, and since Macs didn't get an
even partially multitasking system for years after the machine was
introduced, one could NOT -SEE- what was/was not getting WHERE on the
clipboard, and once one got out of one application and into another, and
wanted something from the first application put into the clipboard for the
second........ Barf. Vomit. etc. etc.  I actually had CLASSES in using the
damned things, and a week later, the retention of how to deal with it,
which wasn't a sensible thing to start with, was -zilch-.  Useful clipboard
since day one, no way! [By the way, I've been using a Mac in the box
intensively the past few days.... and the more recently and more
intensively I have to use the things, the less polite I get about the
machines.  Amiga 500s are infinitely less abominable as far as I'm
concerned, when trying to get -WORK- done!!!!!!


-- Via DLG Pro v0.992

Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:32314 comp.sys.amiga.misc:19182
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: Byte A4000/A3000T-040 Review
From: liam@durie.amigans.gen.nz (Liam Greenwood)
Date: 29 Dec 92 19:08:16 GMT+12
Organization: It's Home, really...
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

Tim Ciceran (tmc@spartan.ac.BrockU.CA) wrote:
> In article <1hjpouINN43b@gap.caltech.edu> andrey@cco.caltech.edu (Andre T. Yew) writes:
> >> o CBM forbids internal expansion by owners
> >     A very workable solution to this is to find a dealer
> >who is more understanding of the user than C= apparently
> >is, who is willing to honor your warranty despite your
> >admission that you did open your computer...
> >     As for going to my closest dealer and having them
> >open it for me, mine is 25 miles away, how about yours?
> <sigh> 45.
    It works for me. (...but then he's only 2 km +- a coupla hundred meters..)
--
 Liam Greenwood ------ liam@durie.amigans.gen.nz ------ Wanganui, N.Z.
                 Don't tell my Mother I'm a programmer,
               she thinks I'm a piano player in a brothel
From: marks@castle.ed.ac.uk (Mark Steyn)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Some Amiga questions!
Date: 23 Dec 92 13:38:05 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

das9674@usl.edu (Stephenson Daniel A) writes:

>I found where to change the point... I made something a lot better...
>but now when I click on the desktop, or something, it changes into
>the number '1016' with a red band on the top and bottom if it...
>and THAT acts as the '
>pointer!

It's a clock Dan.  You must be using the Clock pointer utility in the
Utilities directory.  To edit the pointer you use the preferences
utility. 

>Hey, I figured out the 'screens' trick!  Granted, I'd rather just iconize    
>something, perhaps...  hey, how DO I iconize something?!

You don't.  At least not without 2.0 or greater.  Even then you can only
shrink windows and you can't iconify screens.

>Also, did you guys know that if you fold down the feet on the keyboard it
>can fit snugly *under* the Amiga 1000?   Nice to get it out ofthe way sometimes.
>I cannot imagine why C= would make the A500..well, AT ALL with the nice 
>looks and detached keyboard ofthe Amiga1000.  The A1000 looks a lot
>'better' than the A500, IMO.

No comment.

>What's this 'F -> E' scrollbar thing on the left of my windows?  What is it?

This is the free disk space indicator.  Just imagine 'f' stands for full
and 'e' for empty and you will get on justy fine.

[...]

>--
>Dan Stephenson                                         das9674@usl.edu  
>"Yes Dan, I have heard of Ultima Underworld.  From my point of view it
> appears to be a rather large stick which you seem to be using to beat
> everbody in this group with." -Mark Steyn, comp.sys.amiga.advocacy

AARRRGGGHHHHH!!!!! :-( :-( :-(

	Mark

-- 
"A little nonsense now and then,                \ Mark Steyn :          \
 Is relished by the wisest men"                  \ marks@castle.ed.ac.uk \
          Willy Wonka                             \ mpjs@dcs.ed.ac.uk     \
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy