HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Amigas Announced!!!!
Date: 16 Apr 92 23:51:17 GMT
Article-I.D.: cbmvax.30378
Reply-To: daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie)
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA

In article <1992Apr11.055319.7373@ux.acs.umn.edu> har@ux.acs.umn.edu (--SeebS--) writes:
>skip@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip 'AdaX' Sauls) writes:
>>I hope no one gets too pissed off by this post, but if you are, why don't
>>you grab a cold one, get a little buzz, and enjoy life a bit.  :-)

>Mostly, though, I don't drink... See, alcohol slows down your brain,
>right? 

Sure.

I don't drink beer much in the lab, but I usually have a few when I'm
programming....
-- 
Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Amiga 3000) "The Crew That Never Rests"
   {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh      BIX: hazy
      "What would they do if I just sailed away?" -Jimmy Buffett
 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: barrett@iastate.edu (Marc N Barrett)
Subject: Re: The new A600/A600HD & A500 CD.
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 07:38:17 GMT

In article <1992Apr17.045455.5018@uwm.edu> gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block) writes:
>gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
>: I am more interested in the use of the computer.  Potential does not
>: sell well, at least not to me.  If an increased bandwidth had been
>: included, with new graphics modes, then the new chipset would be an
>: excellent upgrade.  All I can say about it now is, "Super Hi-res.
>: Productivity mode.  Ooooo.  Aaaahhh."
>
>Well, I tend to look a little deeper.  I can see at least some of the
>tremendous amount of work it must have taken to make a Denise that can
>do 31KHz.  I can see future benefits, as well as current usability.
>And I can see it as a smart move.  Tell all the productivity users
>that their mode is useless.  Tell the ones that could afford to buy
>the Multisync, but couldn't get the Display Enhancer, that a mode that
>allows them to have really big, non-interlaced screens that the mode
>is useless, and they'll tell you otherwise.

   Anymore, 640x480 isn't a particularly high resolution.  Besides this,
productivity is really only usable on the one system that doesn't need it:
the A3000.  For the systems that do need it (A500 and A2000), productivity is
too slow to be usable.

>
>Then there's the fact that they make great WB resolutions, and the
>fact that Productivity-Interlaced is a really BIG useful resolution
>for lots of applications which require looking at full pages...

   But then you run into the problem of interlace flicker, which productivity
was supposed to eliminate in the first place.  This is made worse by the
fact that productivity interlace is only usable on VGA and multisync monitors,
and most VGA a multisync monitors tend to use especially short persistance
phosphors.  Also, many VGA and multisync monitors don't handle interlaced
modes very well.

>
>There are applications for technology everywhere--The hardest thing to
>do is to find them.

   True.  Productivity seems to be raw potential with little immediate
usefullness.  With more bitplanes (in a hypothetical new chipset), 
productivity would be useful, but it isn't right now.

>
>Greg
>-- 
>"Walking in London, and you are watching me walk,      gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu
> Talking Italian, and you are watching me talk,            Gregory R Block
> Singing in Sydney, and you are sitting right there,
> Feeling you with me, everywhere, everywhere."  -Concrete Blonde


Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: justin@graphlab.cc.uky.edu  (Justin Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Mac OS just sucks -- "ease of use" = "lack of freedom" ?
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 20:39:28 GMT
X-Bytes: 

Paula Lieberman writes
> Was talking some hours ago with someone who writes applications software on
> Suns.  The machine on his desktop [as opposed to the machines in the
> computer lab where the Suns and other workstations are] is a Mac IIci,
> running System 7.0.  One of the questions that keeps being asked about the
> applications he's working on is about porting it to Macs; not the way to
> go, he feels, the apps need interprocess communications, mutiple processes
> running, and as for the dialog boxes on Macs........ anyhow, he doesn't
> consider Macs appropriate platforms for the applications.....  

You can have multiple processes.. You do have interprocess communication and  
control, and you have good networking support. What's his problem? Ignorance of  
the system, it would seem..
--
*******************************************************************************
* "Imagine sky.. High above, in Caribbean Blue.." <sigh>                      *
* The University of Kentucky doesn't pay well enough to share my opinions.    *
*******************************************************************************
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: justin@graphlab.cc.uky.edu  (Justin Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Mac OS just sucks -- "ease of use" = "lack of freedom" ?
Organization: University Of Kentucky, Dept. of Math Sciences
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 20:43:21 GMT
X-Bytes: 

Skip 'AdaX' Sauls writes

> It is an orphaned graphics card.  BTW, if Quickdraw is so quick, then why is
> an accelerator needed?

It is an older card, yes. It was one of the first accelerated 24-bit color  
cards. THAT is why it is accelerated, because of the 24-bit video it provides.  
QuickDraw lives up to its namesake.
  
--
*******************************************************************************
* "Imagine sky.. High above, in Caribbean Blue.." <sigh>                      *
* The University of Kentucky doesn't pay well enough to share my opinions.    *
*******************************************************************************
Xref: sparky comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:12601 comp.sys.amiga.games:6922 comp.sys.amiga.misc:8534 comp.sys.amiga.multimedia:824 comp.sys.amiga.graphics:3712 comp.sys.amiga.hardware:8857
From: gfm@ccs.northeastern.edu (george f mcbay)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.games,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.multimedia,comp.sys.amiga.graphics,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Date: 11 Apr 92 17:22:11 GMT
Organization: Comp. Sci. @ NU

In article <1992Apr11.022805.9281@seas.gwu.edu> gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
>chucks@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Erik Funkenbusch) writes:
>>tron1@tronsbox.UUCP (Kenneth Jamieson) writes:

>>>	And I can honestly say that there are almost no programs that
>>>make use of any feature I don't have.

>>>	Yeah - here's something to be proud of! ( 1/2 :-) )
>>

	[List of many programs that require extra hardware deleted]

>Curious.  How do you know his A1000 does not have these features?  There are
>many upgrade paths for the A1000, including replacing its motherboard with
>an A2000-type board.

	Well I didn't post either article, but I think it would be safe
to assume that the first poster was talking about a 'plain' Amiga 1000
MAYBE EHB and some extra memory... It would seem silly for the first 
poster to have a fully decked out A1000 and then say "there are almost
no programs that make use of any of the features I don't have", at least to me.
From: dano@usl.edu (Dan Stephenson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Juicy tidbits
Date: 8 Apr 92 07:35:56 GMT
Article-I.D.: srl05.dano.702718556
Distribution: na
Organization: Univ. of Southwestern Louisiana

jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:

>leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt) writes:
>>
>>What sort of fool displays 8 bit GIFs in 32,000 colors?
>>
>>I mean, what is the point?
>>

>Suppose you don't want the colors of your GIF to interfere with those of
>your GUI?  Maybe you do color DTP or image processing and you need to display
>more than one GIF at a time?

Golly, until I just read this article, I never _knew_ that having a
well-colored GIF onscreen *could* *ever* screw up how the rest of the
screen looks.  Reall,y this hapens?

_Dan
.
>| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
>|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
>|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
--
Daniel Anthony Stephenson dano@nasa15.usl.edu das9674@usl.edu 
"I'm a staunch Independant.  Every time I think I am a Republican, they
 do something greedy, and every time I think I am a Democrat, to go and
do someting stupid." - Jay Leno from _60 Minutes_ interview 3/15/1992
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.games,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.multimedia,comp.sys.amiga.graphics,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: Occidental College, Los Angeles, CA  90041
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 00:16:27 GMT


Hey, y'all... we did an interesting experiment the other day... converted
two IBMers into Amigaphiles.

I walked in, saw my buddy playing a demo on his new $100 Soundblaster
in mono... UltraForce copy of the Amiga (they said, "and you thought this
could only be done on an Amiga..." and "inspired by the Amiga?  Yes!"

Well, aside from the absence of a plot... the thing did have some interesting
control functions... but the graphics, running on a 386-25dx with 1 meg
videocard and svga monitor... weren't really that smooth or finished... I 
noticed some similarities to the Hardwired Demo.

So, I said, "Hey dude, this is the best demo I've seen for the IBM" he
agreed, "but you have to see Hardwired".

So he did... he said, "Wow... I gotta get my computerfreak buddy over here."
So, we hauled him over.  Show him some stuff.  He said, "Where can I get
one."

HAAAAAAA!

God, I bet it must've been shitfuckin' awesome to own an Amiga in '86.

Still is.

Thom
From: bret@technix.mn.org (Bret Indrelee)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: EISA vs. ZorroIII
Date: 10 Apr 92 18:03:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: technix.1992Apr10.180323.24287
Organization: Technix Inc., St. Paul, MN, USA

In article <30210@cbmvax.commodore.com> daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes:
>
>EISA is clocked by the normal AT bus clock, which is generally in the 
> neighborhood of 8MHz.  

[ Text deleted ]

>Performance-wise, I've read that the EISA burst mode peaks at 33MB/s.  That's
>based on the EISA specification -- no guarantee that any particular 
>implementation can ever go that fast.  There's also always a question of
>just how much burst any given device can use.  The Mac's NuBus has 32-33MB/s
>burst, but at least up to the IIfx, nothing in the Mac system supported it.

The EISA actually allows up to a 8 1/3 MHz clock.  The DMA maximum transfer
rate is dependent on the clock rate.  The 33MBytes/sec rate is for a
8.33 MHz system.

It is possible to get the full maximum bandwidth for short bursts on EISA.
The sustained rates (as for any bus) are lower.  

We have been able to run a normal application, using read()/write() calls,
on a HP 700 and get sustained rates of greater than 17MB/sec.  This is
real good, since it includes all the UNIX overhead of executing a device
driver call, locking down the pages, transferring the data, servicing the
interrupt, and returning to the original user process.

Please note, these numbers are NOT for a PC class machine.  The HP 700
uses EISA as it's system I/O bus, and that is the EISA system I am most
familair with.

>   I did hear some low end estimates on the Mac II, that the
>original 16MHz II's would average around 5MB/s across NuBus, but of course
>that improved in the 25MHz systems, again in the synchronous systems like
>IIfx or IIsi, and probably yet again in the Quadras with their double-speed
>NuBus implementation.

The NuBus runs with a synchronous bus at a fixed clock rate.  The initial
Apple NuBus implementations had a lot of delay between accesses, that seems 
to be caused by needing to synchronize between the CPU clock and the bus 
clock.

Although the performance on some of the MacII systems did improve, the
performance on the NuBus did not.  The time required on the bus stayed
the same, the hardware overhead of interfacing to the bus was reduced.

The clock doubling you mention is only used for burst transfers, something
the early NuBus implementations didn't support.    Random accesses still
run at the same speed on the NuBus.  I haven't kept up with what has
happened in the last two years on NuBus, so I don't know if Apple
started implementing the burst transfers.  I would not be surprised to
hear it.

-Bret

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bret Indrelee		    |	Howe's Law:
email: bret@technix.mn.org  |	Everyone has a scheme that will not work.
I am not an employee of Technix, nor do I represent them in any way.
From: harp@netcom.com (Gregory O. Harp)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: 040 and 486 and nap42487 knows nothing about CPUs.
Date: 17 Apr 92 17:54:40 GMT
Article-I.D.: netcom.w#2jdxc.harp
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:

>peterk@public.sub.org (Peter Kittel) writes:
>>
>>>Wow.  For a man of your education, a PhD, your attitude sure is arrogant.
>>
>>Well, I always *try* to be polite, but I don't always succeed.
>>
>>Yes, I really bash on Intel, I have very bad experiences with their
>>design, and this I reported. And I got the impression that this opinion
>>is shared by all people I know that come from the same experience,
>>having programmed both brands. Why on earth is that arrogant?

>Assuming that your opinion is shared by everyone else *is* arrogance.

However, for this particular subject, it's a pretty safe assumption.

I don't think there's a single person in the software division of my
company that would advocate Intel over Motorola for _anything_.  Most
comments about Intel around here are complaints about architecture,
etc.

And, FYI, almost all of us have developed in both Motorola and Intel
asssembly.

-- 
---------------Greg-Harp----------------harp@netcom.netcom.com---------------
           "We're not hitchhiking anymore.  We're riding!" -- Ren
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: costin@cs.mcgill.ca (Costin RIZAN)
Subject: Re: EISA vs. ZorroIII
Organization: SOCS, McGill University, Montreal, Canada
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 05:34:48 GMT

In article <1992Apr10.152819.27777@ctr.columbia.edu> jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>sctconno@kraken.itc.gu.edu.au (Dave Connors) writes:
>>
>>>Nish Patel   nap42487@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu
>>
>>It's very rarely that I meet someone who insights so my damned anoyance in
>>me. NiSHITh, unless you've got something productive to so, go away and play
>>wordprocessors on your IBM.
>>
>
>All right, Dave.  I've resisted flaming you for your abusive articles full
>of bullshit generalizations, but I can't stand for this.  Trying to degrade
>someone by vandalizing his name makes you, in my book, a lower form of life
>than the excrement of Asian fruit bats.
>
>If you've got nothing better to do than post articles insulting people in
>this way, without so much as a mention of the things they said with which you
>disagreed, I urge you to get a life as soon as possible.
>

	Careful! You might be accused  of child abuse. Judging by Dave's
recent posts he's probably under 14! I wouldn't be surprised if Daddy
gave him a Usenet account for his birthday. 

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: har@ux.acs.umn.edu (--SeebS--)
Subject: Re: Intel HW
Organization: University of Minnesota
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 06:06:32 GMT

In article <1992Apr11.052921.21547@sbcs.sunysb.edu> dtiberio@csws17.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio) writes:
>In article <1992Apr10.213210.5408@seas.gwu.edu> gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
>>In any event Mr. Shekhel did not say what performance he was comparing.
>>Perhaps the 386 falls faster from a 2nd story window.

>	You are so out of it that I can't believe you would think such
>a thing. Now I know better than to listen to any more of this crap. I don't
>care if you have been using a 486 or an XT; your personal opinion doesn't
>mean anything. How dare you claim that the speed of a 386 is any different
>than an A3000 when dropped from a 2nd story window...they both accelerate
>at 9.8 meters per second, which is around 32 feet per second!

Not necessarily; see, there is also air resistance, which is a function
of size. So, like, you have to compare weight per square inch, at least,
and possibly aerodynamic concerns.

Perhaps Mr. Haynie can help us out here... What *is* the maximum airspeed
of an unladen A3000?

>      //   David Tiberio  SUNY Stony Brook 2-3662  AMIGA  DDD-MEN   
>     //  Not the llama! Come here Earl; I want to tell you something...
>   \X/  Liverpool, New York	flames to suggestions@cbmvax.commodore.com

-s
-- 
Peter Seebach, using my fiancee's acount. (Please use "SEEBS" in the subject
line, so we know who it's for.)  Polygamy: "There can be more than one."
I use an amiga because it works better than all the other machines I tried.
har@ux.acs.umn.edu (Love Incarnate)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 15:59:26 GMT

masten@beta.lanl.gov (David A. Masten) writes:
>Norman St. John Polevaulter <MBS110@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>And it would still be a junky old Intel-powered MessyDOS-crippled clone.
>>I wouldn't pay $10 for one. (Well, maybe to play Jetfighter II, but
>                                                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>OK, here's a serious question.  I found Jetfighter to have excellent
>graphics (at least in terms of frame rate) on the PC.  But to be
>horrible in terms of flight model.  A short demo of JF II seemed to
>indicate it was similar.  Is this the type of  game that Amiga users
>prefer?  I'm only partially generalizing from one post.  It seems
>there is a lot more raves in this group about super mario type
>games than sims and RPGs.

Perhaps.  If you want to know what games Amiga users prefer in general,
then read comp.sys.amiga.games.  Much of the discussion there is about
games such as "Black Crypt", "Eye of the Beholder", "Chaos Strikes Back",
various Psygnosis games, and many other new releases.

-- Gerald
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Gregory R Block)
Subject: Re: Hmm..
Organization: University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 14:29:06 GMT

damiel@netcom.com (Paul Theodoropoulos) writes:
: ajaffe@amiganet.chi.il.us (Adi Jaffe) writes:
: 
: >Why dosent someone just shoot Marc Barrett?

: ...all that granted, it is at best in poor taste, at worst highly
: irresponsible to advocate using deadly force to silence a person 
: because most of us don't like his opinions. There are enough deeply
: disturbed flakes and sociopaths out there who might take that 
: statement as license. For all we know, you might be one yourself.

I don't think it could have been put better.  So Adi, think "AK47".
;)

It is dangerous to say things like that, especially without a
smiley...  Take it easy on him.  At worst, he's stupid, and should be
ignored.  At best, he's argumentative.  ;)

Greg
-- 
 __________________________________________________________________________
|				     The Chesterfield Electronic Towel (TM)|
|gblock@csd4.csd.uwm.edu                    Don't leave Krikkit without it!|
|__________________________________________________________________________|
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 04:52:53 GMT

leavitt@cheshire.oxy.edu (Thomas VanNess Leavitt) writes:
>
>My buddy Paul has this cool looking wallpaper program on his Workbench...
>he's currently got this wild-looking midevial dragon.

If anyone considers switching to IBM after this, then he has got to be
crazy.  Kidding.

-- Gerald
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: dano@usl.edu (Dan Stephenson)
Subject: Re: Screens vs. Windows, Graphics Modes
Organization: Univ. of Southwestern Louisiana
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1992 18:27:30 GMT

rhealey@kas.helios.mn.org (Rob Healey) writes:

>In article <1992Mar31.152959.21152@ctr.columbia.edu>, jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>|> >    Nor would you. VLT can open a custom screen. The "unobscured" thing
>|> >    is a red herring. Only takes C=-M to cycle the screens, and I do it
>|> >    all the time (VLT, editor, newsreader, music player, etc).

>|> How typical, John.  Someone names something the Amiga can't do very well;
>|> 5 Amiga buffs come right back with, "Well, who needs that anyway?".
>|> 
>	Who said the Amiga doesn't do windowing very well? You can have
>	multiple windows on multiple screens at multiple resolutions
>	under either AmigaDOS or AmigaUNIX. This is a moot issue. Under
>	UNIX one task can control/span multiple screens, the mono
>	X11R5 server does this for controlling multiple X screens
>	running under one X server, of dubious use but what the hell,
>	this IS c.s.a.a! I'm sure the same thing could be done under
>	AmigaDOS if somebody WANTED to do so.

No, we were all talking about how the standard 640X200 Amiga resolution
could not acceptably have more than one full, unobscured windows on
screen at one time.  This, as was noted in other follups, is especialyl
nice to program things.
    
-Dan
.

>		-Rob
--
Daniel Anthony Stephenson dano@nasa15.usl.edu das9674@usl.edu 
"I'm a staunch Independant.  Every time I think I am a Republican, they
 do something greedy, and every time I think I am a Democrat, to go and
do someting stupid." - Jay Leno from _60 Minutes_ interview 3/15/1992

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington)
Subject: Re: Intel HW
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1992 07:47:16 GMT

dtiberio@csws17.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio) writes:
>	You are so out of it that I can't believe you would think such
>a thing. Now I know better than to listen to any more of this crap. I don't
>care if you have been using a 486 or an XT; your personal opinion doesn't
>mean anything. How dare you claim that the speed of a 386 is any different
>than an A3000 when dropped from a 2nd story window...they both accelerate
>at 9.8 meters per second, which is around 32 feet per second!

No.  I was talking about velocity.  Velocity is not a constant factor.
If a greater force is applied to one system as it leaves the window (i.e.,
the system is hurled forcibly from the window towards the ground), it will
have a greater velocity; the system will, therefore, arrive at the ground
sooner than one which is regretfully dropped from said window.

I see that it may be necessary to start including smileys.

-- Gerald