HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rhh@alice.att.com (r hardin)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: behavior modification or dog training
Date: 19 Nov 92 15:02:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.24243
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill NJ

Marla Belzowski writes:
> In my opinion Keohler teaches your dog nothing but stimulas/response
> behaviors in a military drill style.  The dogs I know that have been
> trained this way are practically robots.  The react without much
> thought to the command.  

I didn't see your article before I posted another one about the robot
theory, honest!

The military drill style (Koehler pioneered K-9 dogs in WWII) is more
directed at the handler than the dog, I'd say.  It is worth reading through
it - I think it puts people off, and I'd say just read past it.

I think myself that the style is necessary probably, because he has to
get the reader to do something.  In his advanced books, that aspect is
not present and not necessary.

I'm trying another style in rpd, and Vicki Hearne tries yet another, so say
the same thing about the demise of the idea of the great dog in modern
training theory.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: bbrown@infonode.ingr.com (Bailey Brown)
Subject: Re: UPDATE: Gaseous GSD...
Organization: Intergraph Corporation, Huntsville, AL.
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 04:58:51 GMT


Plain yogurt helps keep my dogs from having gas.  It may work for you.

------------
Bailey Brown                               "Above all else, confusion reigns."
Intergraph Corporation                                  
bbrown@casca.b11.ingr.com                              Procol Harum
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: emm@cbnewsj.cb.att.com (ellen.m.mcsorley)
Subject: re:  story to say "OH NO" at (or whatever the title was)
Organization: AT&T
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 13:59:09 GMT

About 6 years ago some friends of mine got their first
Newf puppy.  She was so dreadfully cute they just HAD to
get her litter mate the next day!  Now they had two adorable
35 lb. balls of black fluff, that slept in the kitchen.

The pups were positive angels and never did ANYTHING wrong -
until one night when my friend didn't completely close one
of the lower kitchen cabinets.....

The pups found a plastic bottle of Hershey's syrup and a LARGE
box of corn flakes......

My friend collapsed in hysterics the next day when she went to
see her darling little angels.... who looked like they had been
tarred and feathered!  And of course they were SO happy with
themselves!!

(my first thought was OH NO - chocolate!  but it didn't hurt them -
 they played with it rather than eat it!  Newfs will do that...)


Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger)
Subject: fur and dirt
Reply-To: jpk@Ingres.COM (Jon Krueger)
Organization: Ask Computer Systems Inc., Ingres Division, Alameda CA 94501
Date: 21 Nov 92 07:30:48 GMT


On Tuesday I gave baths to two dogs.  The one I thought was hardly
dirty took several applications of shampoo before the water stopped
turning brown.  The one I thought was real dirty, the water was almost
clear throughout the bath.

So I'm wondering: do some dogs just "show dirt"?  Like some cars or
clothes show dirt more than others?  Obviously a white dog will look
dirtier sooner.  But perhaps it's something about the coat, too,
how the fur lays on the dog?

And does this mean that some dogs "hide dirt"?  Are usually a lot
dirtier than they look?  Need a bath if they look even a little dirty,
maybe even if they look clean?  And where does the dirt go?  Next to
the skin?  Hidden by the coat?

It used to be that I would tell prospective adopters about skin and
coat care.  These days I put a brush in their hands and we work
"hands-on" :-) They learn more, and the dogs get more grooming.  And
it's another way for the people to get acquainted with the dog, decide
if he's right for them.

-- Jon
--
Jon Krueger  jpk@ingres.com
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Retrieving the Paper
From: RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Ruth Ginzberg)
Date: 20 Nov 92 16:28:19 EDT
Distribution: world
Organization: Philosophy Dept., Wesleyan University
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20In-Reply-To: rhh@alice.att.com's message of 20 Nov 92 19:02:22 GMTLines: 31

In <24261@alice.att.com> rhh@alice.att.com writes:

[description of Koehler's Open book method of teaching forced retrieve, &
advice to wait until dog is 6 mos old]

Gee, Buffy's trained to get the paper already at 4-1/2 mos & I hardly had to
train her at all.  Here's how I/we did it:

Starting from the day I brought her home (at 8 weeks), the *FIRST* thing that
happened every morning was that I took Buffy out for her walk, & on the way
back inside I'd pick up the paper & say "Get Paper" & *I'd* bring it in the
house.  Then I'd feed her her breakfast while I read the paper.  By the time
she was about 14 wks or so, when I'd say "Get Paper" she'd WANT to help me
bring it in (but often it was too big, etc for her).  So Buffy & I would carry
the paper into the house *together* (I'd stoop down & let her "help" carry it).
Now that she's big enough to carry it herself, I *barely* even have to say "Get
Paper" for her to go fetch it, partly because she knows that she gets fed her
breakfast as soon as I have my paper!  Already she doesn't need to go out for a
walk 'til after she eats, but if I just crack open the front door & whisper
"Get Paper" she'll dash off to get it & bring it back in.  Then she gets her
breakfast & I read my paper, & then we go for the morning walk.  It helps that
we have a paper carrier who *reliably* gets the thing far enough from street &
driveway so that this is not dangerous. *THAT* is helped by our giving the
paper carrier a generous & automatic tip each time we renew the paper by mail.
:-)



------------------------
Ruth Ginzberg <rginzberg@eagle.wesleyan.edu>
Philosophy Department;Wesleyan University;USA
From: zaccone@rigel.cs.bucknell.edu (Rick Zaccone)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Experience with Electronic Collars?
Date: 23 Nov 92 17:39:23
Organization: Bucknell University, Lewisburg, Pa.
Reply-To: zaccone@bucknell.edu
NNTP-Posting-Host: rigel.cs.bucknell.edu

Does anyone have experience with training a dog with an electronic
collar?  Was it effective?  Which brands are good (if any)?  Was it
worth the investment?

Rick Zaccone
--
zaccone@bucknell.edu
From: drg@biomath.mda.uth.tmc.edu (David Gutierrez)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Dog had kidney failure, is better but won't eat!
Date: 16 Nov 1992 21:15:51 GMT
Organization: Univ. Texas M.D. Anderson Cancer Center

In article <Bxq7C6.Avy@news.ucs.mun.ca> kirsten@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Kirsten
Starcher) writes:
>We're going to take her back to the vet, but I'd like to get some suggestions.
>Does anyone know how to convince her to eat again?  We're at the stage now
>where we've taken a turkey baster and squirted liquified food down her throat.
>At this rate it doesn't look like she's going to make it.  And I don't want to
>lose her.

My dog, Wurzi, is also reluctant to eat the way she used to. We have to place
kibbles of food into her mouth one at a time. About one out of four times, she
eats it - the rest of the time she spits it out. It can take an hour or more to
get her to finish a meal, but she is still getting down about one and half to
two cups a day.

On the occasions when Wurzi gets extremely weak, we give her a bowl of milk to
drink - she'll always take that and it helps bring back her strength. You might
also try scrambled eggs.

David Gutierrez
drg@biomath.mda.uth.tmc.edu

"Nothing is easy." - Homer Simpson
From: bloom@ece.ucdavis.edu (Jeffrey A Bloom)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Wanted: Used Travel Kennel
Date: 16 Nov 92 21:51:41 GMT
Distribution: ca
Organization: U.C. Davis - Department of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
Originator: bloom@madrone.eecs.ucdavis.edu


I am looking for a used kennel to for my dog to travel on a plane.
She is  5 mos. and weighs about 35 lbs.  She is a black lab so I
would like to get a kennel which she will not outgrow.  I think she
needs size 300 or 400.  If you have one to sell, please let me know.

- Jeffrey

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey A Bloom				bloom@CIPIC.ucdavis.edu
Computer Vision Research Laboratory
Center for Image Processing and Integrated Computing
University of California, Davis
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Distribution: jadpc2
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 11:28:04 -0800
From: ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Subject: Re: Deaf-Dalmation needs home!
Comment-To: All@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Reply-To: ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
X-FSC-PATH: 202/703 701
X-FSC-PID:  RA 0.04

 > >  It is totally irresponsible to be talking about placing this
 > >pathetic thing in a family home.  SIX families already.  How many
 > >people does this represent who opened their homes and hearts to a
dog
 > >that they were led to believe was adoptable?
 > >  I understand that at least Some of the people envolved felt the
dog
 > >could adjust if only it had the right situation.  It was just that
 > >their Best efforts were never enough.  Stop this now.  Put that
 > >pitiable animal out of it's misery, and stop running good people
in
 > >circles.
 > >--- FMail 0.92
 > > * Origin: HILLCREST COMMUNITY BBS, SAN DIEGO. HST 619-291-0544
 > (1:202/703)
 > 
 > I'm not sure about anyone else, but I'd have a hard time
 > taking such
 > harsh advice from someone who can't even spell DalmatiAn...
               I'm unclear about which part of my statement you find
harsh- that perhaps as many as 20 people tried to provide for the dog,
but couldn't?  That the dog is crippled and brain damaged? That this
crippled dog has been ripped from six different homes? That this is
not fair or humane behavior for Anyone envolved?
  I think you are mean.  It is the height of discourtesy to belittle
someone's SPELLING on a BBS.  What does Spelling have to do with
humane behavior?
--- FMail 0.92
 * Origin: HILLCREST COMMUNITY BBS, SAN DIEGO: HST 619-291-0544 (1:202/703)
From: kirsten@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Kirsten Starcher)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Dog with kidney problems that wouldn't eat -- thanks to all
Date: 17 Nov 92 19:18:50 GMT
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland

Thanks to the many of you who offered constructive suggestions on how to get
Sheila to eat.  It really is nice to know that there are people out there who
are willing to help out.

Unfortunately, Sheila was put down yesterday.  My parents brought her in to the
vet, and he told them some things about kidney failure that had obviously shown
up.  

Apparently dogs develop ulcers in the stomach and in the mouth (there was one
starting in her mouth), which would explain why Sheila wouldn't eat -- it just
hurt too much.  The nitrogen that escapes the kidneys crystallizes in the
joints -- and in the brain.  Not only was she limping, but she'd have moments
of apparent ... well, blankness.  Confusion.  Things like standing outside as
if she didn't know what she was supposed to do next.

He said we'd done pretty much everything we could as far as looking after her
went.  The only thing we could do then would have been to put her on IV for
about 3 weeks, which just wouldn't have been fair to her; even after that she
might not have recovered fully, and we would have had to go through it all
again in a few weeks.

She was a wonderful dog.  This is really much more a death in the family than
the loss of a pet.  It's just starting to sink in now.

Thanks to all of you who responded with help.  I appreciate it...


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kirsten Starcher		"All I want is that second of time
kirsten@morgan.ucs.mun.ca        and a few square inches inside of your mind."
							- Joyful Noise
This post brought to you by the letters f, y, v, and the number i.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: scm@harvee.billerica.ma.us (S. Mudgett aka little gator)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: question about size
Date: 15 Nov 92 07:48:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: harvee.H.ea.o7aPnouZgfQ
Reply-To: scm@harvee.billerica.ma.us
Organization: gators 'r us
X-Software: HERMES GUS 1.04 Rev. Sep  5 1992

In <1992Nov12.041619.24948@midway.uchicago.edu>, Betsy Weatherhead writes:

>old puppies is, "How big will they get?"  I can show them the mother, but
>I don't really know how large a factor she plays.  Is it safe to expect
>puppies to be within 20% of the weight of their mother.  With no information
>on the father(s?), how confident can we be in predicting the size?  
kyou can't know what to expect.  if both parents are purebreds of the same,
 breed you can have some idea of adult size, but with mixes you never know.
if a small dog breeds to a large dog the pups can be any size at all.  i've 
seen dogs which had purebred parents of different breeds, and the offspring
looked nothing like *either* breeed.  and if the father(s) is unknown it's
even harder to tell.  all you can do is guess.

just one example: jake, a dog i knew once, was the son of a purebred small
cocker and an unknown father, he weighed 75 lbs and looked 90% collie.
-- 
-- little gator aka s. mudgett     email: scm@harvee.billerica.ma.us
-- friend of a gator is a friend of mine
From: srlee@beta.lanl.gov (Stephen R Lee)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: behavior modification or dog training
Date: 18 Nov 92 23:02:53 GMT
Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory

In article <24223@alice.att.com> rhh@alice.att.com (r hardin) writes:

[stuff deleted]

>If you teach what Koehler does, the way he does, it always works.

No.  There is no teaching methodology or philosophy that will work on
all dogs in all situations all of the time.  I don't care how many 
anecdotal pieces of evidence you care to give me about Kohler, or
anyone else cares to give me about their favorite method.  There is
NO method that will work on ALL dogs ALL of the time.  Period.

-- 
============================================================
Stephen R. Lee                 | 
OooWoo Racing Kennel           | I'd rather be driving sled
E-Mail: srlee@beta.lanl.gov    | dogs.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Distribution: jadpc2
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 13:30:00 -0800
From: ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Subject: Problem With Neighbors' Cat
Comment-To: All@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Reply-To: ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
X-FSC-PATH: 202/703 701
X-FSC-PID:  RA 0.04

  What to do about the neighbor's cat, and the neighbor's cavalier
attitude?
  I agree with you totally.  That kitten should be kept indoors where
it can live safely.  It is very sad that people like your neighbor are
so hard hearted and cannot be reasoned with.
  Yes, the kitten Will probably die, and from the sound of things,
will suffer horribly.  I am not in your shoes, but if I were, I would
take the kitten into my own house the next time it got out. This
rather than see it mutliated or murdered.
  Once the kitten is in your custody, you will have to think of a way
to get it a good home, hopefully on the other side of town.
  Your neighbor my look for the kitten.  You, of course, must never
admit that you rescued the kitten.  If she asks you point blank if
you've seen it, for everyone's sake, you must say no.
  Ultimately, you must think of the Result of your act.  A sweet
kitten gets a chance at life, and there is Even a chance that your
bonehead neighbor will miss having the kitten.  Possibly this person
can learn a lesson from the experience.  It's not safe to leave your
cats loose to run the neighborhood.
--- FMail 0.92
 * Origin: HILLCREST COMMUNITY BBS, SAN DIEGO: HST 619-291-0544 (1:202/703)
From: mjohnson@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (Marget Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Rottweilers for search & rescue
Date: 18 Nov 92 17:08:58 GMT
Reply-To: mjohnson@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (Marget Johnson)
Organization: Stakeholder Relations, NCR Corp in Dayton,OH

>Michael Sierchio writes:
>>I can't imagine a Rottweiler making a good search and rescue dog -- they
>>don't have the long distance endurance/speed combination for wilderness
>>search and rescue, and they are too big/bulky for disaster search and
>>rescue.
>>Not that they can't be trained to do the exercises, but if you're serious
>>about S&R, you'll do better with a GSD, Lab, Dobie, Malinois, etc.

Michael: If you think that Rotts are too big for SAR, what about
Newfoundlands? The Black Paws Search & Rescue organization in Montana has been
turning out trained SAR Newfs for the last 3 years. And from what I've read,
there isn't a better breed for avalanche or drowned victims locating. Newfs -
and Rotts - might have a hard time negotiating tiny crawl spaces after an
earthquake, but I can't think of any other outdoor setting where a big,
trained, highly motivated dog wouldn't excell.

Marget Johnson

--
From: rhh@alice.att.com (r hardin)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: behavior modification or dog training
Date: 22 Nov 92 13:05:19 GMT
Article-I.D.: alice.24268
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill NJ



Jon Krueger writes:
>> as if we're OUTSIDE and all we see is behavior.

>Correct.  Did you think you were inside Susie?

It's a completely bogus geometry, part of the skeptical recital.

Let me take my example of what doubt-about-thinking is,

  I might tell somebody about something, and be asked, ``What did he think
  about it when you told him?''  And I might say, ``I don't know.''
  _That_ is what being in doubt about what someone is thinking is like.

and change it to what doubt-about-thinking is according to you,

  I might tell somebody about something, and be asked, ``What did he think
  about it when you told him?''  And I might say, ``I don't know, all
  I have is behavior!''

That has to be read as burlesque, some sort of send-up of Jon perhaps.
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Distribution: jadpc2
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 23:36:00 -0800
From: ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Subject: Chewing question
Comment-To: All@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Reply-To: ELAINE_GALLEGOS@f703.n202.z1.fidonet.org
X-FSC-PATH: 202/703 701
X-FSC-PID:  RA 0.04

 * Replying to a message originally to All
 * Replying to a message originally from elisa
 > I have a four month old chocolate lab.  Needless to say, he
 > is a chewing
 > machine.  I call him Mr. Mouth.
 > Recently he got his mouth on a pair of sunglasses.  It didn't
 > take long
 > for him to ruin them.  My question 
 > is this - should I let him keep them?  Or should I take them
 > away from
 > him?  Would letting him continue
 > to chew on them reinforce bad behavior or not?  
 > 
 > I'd appreciate any suggestions or advice. Thanks.
 > --- rfmail 1.1.J
 >  * Origin: Orphan Board West  fido <-> unix gateway
 > (1:202/723)
  No, no, no!  Under No circumstances should you allow your pup to lay
claim to items he distroys.  look at the message you send.... "You're
in Big trouble for wrecking my possessions, Bud, as long as I can't
use it anymore, here- enjoy."
  This is a mixed message that would certainly drive anyone nuts.
--- FMail 0.92
 * Origin: HILLCREST COMMUNITY BBS, SAN DIEGO: HST 619-291-0544 (1:202/703)
From: gbelli@opal.tufts.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
Subject: Re: Vacation...
Date: 22 Nov 92 17:09:35 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA


In article <Alex.72.722283457@camp.wpic.pitt.edu>, Alex@camp.wpic.pitt.edu (Alex Ferguson ) writes:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> 	I remember briefly reading something awhile back about a list that 
> you can mail away for which gives information about vacation-type places 
> which allow pets.  I can't find the address & I was wondering if anybody had 
> it handy & could send it to me.
> 
> 	What would be ideal is a condo type place, relitively secluded on 
> the shore (East Coast).  I know that Holiday Inn's allow pets, but I'm not 
> really looking to rent a cell for my time off. 
> 
> 						Thanks,
> 							Alex
> 
> /~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\
> | Alexander J. Ferguson III                                          |
> | Database Manager, DAC (Data Analytic Core)                         |
> | Child Psychiatry, Western Psychiatric Institute & Clinic           |
> | University of Pittsburgh Medical Center                            |
> |                                                                    |
> | alex@camp.wpic.pitt.edu   voice (412) 624-3705                     |
> |                           fax   (412) 624-0223                     |
> \~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~/
Alex,
     I have an ad here for a book called "Touring with Towser", which is 
a directory of hotels and motels that allow pets.  I haven't seen the book, 
so I can't endorse it or anything, but here's the address to send for it:
        Quaker Professional Services
        Touring with Towser
        585 Hawthorne Court
        Galesburg, IL  61401
The book costs $3.00, and the ad says that it includes coupons for pet food.

And on a related note, my mom has a friend who has a St. Bernard named Bull-
winkle.  When this friend went on her honeymoon last month, she had to book
a room with 2 queen size beds (one for the happy couple, one for Bullwinkle).
The friend wants to get another St. Bernard (!), but as my mother said to
her, "Where are you going to find a hotel with 3 queen size beds in the
room!"
Happy travelling!
    Gretchen (who is working on a Sunday, and is not happy at all)
& Spense (who is probably sleeping on the sofa, and is very happy, indeed)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs
From: shari@modcomp.uucp (Shari Bernhard)
Subject: Re: Want to get a pooch
Organization: MODCOMP, an AEG company
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 15:34:21 GMT

In <1992Nov12.165619.7163@ultb.isc.rit.edu> jmm7076@ultb.isc.rit.edu (J.M. Maurer) writes:

> Folks,
>	I am a  new poster so here goes.  I am thinking about getting a
>dog in the summer.  I would like a German Shepard, but I have heard
>mixed reviews.  I have also hear that a shepard/lab mix makes a good 
>pet.  Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.  Please send to 
>JMM7076@ultb.isc.rit.edu

>Jimbo

If you think I'm going to let THIS one go by without mentioning Raven,
THE BEST DOG THAT EVER LIVED (your opinion may vary :-) ), you've never
read my posts!  Raven is a Black Lab/White German Shepherd mix.  Her
mom was the Lab, dad was the Shepherd.  She has all the wonderful
attributes of the Lab: great with kids (even though we don't have any
of our own, just neighbors, nieces and nephews), loyal to the ends of the
earth, intelligent, loves to retrieve, loves to swim, loves attention,
very playful, even at 10 years old.  She has all the best attributes of
the Shepherd:  protective, possesses great strength and courage, loyal,
intelligent, loves kids, loves attention.  The funny interaction is that
although the Lab in her loves to retrieve, the Shepherd in her decides to
keep it.  She's black with Shepherd hair, tail, snout, and body shape.
Her eyes are Lab, and her paws are webbed.  Her ears don't know WHAT to do!
I never took her to obedience classes; she practically trained herself.
I know I've been very lucky when I read in this newsgroup what so many
people go through.  Aside from a digging streak when she was kept outdoors
all the time, she was a model dog once I started keeping her inside.  She
didn't chew, scratch, shred or dirty.  She would go for food kept on a
counter, but, GEESH!  She's still a DOG.  I'm well trained now! :-)

By the way, she also understands English.  Go for it!

Shari (Raven's Mom) Bernhard