From: mascdb@gdr.bath.ac.uk (C D Burdorf)
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Re: Ritual Magick Experiences
Date: 17 Apr 92 10:10:13 GMT
Organization: School of Mathematics, University of Bath, UK

In article <1992Apr13.155704.19084@mksol.dseg.ti.com> Christopher.Ward@dseg.ti.com writes:
>
>This may seem depressing, but it sounds like you are way ahead of most of the
>people posting to this group.  However, I have not seen anything useful from 
>you other than "nyah-nyah nin-nyah-nyah you can cast spells" in some odd form
>of psychology to get some one to "show me yours, then I'll show you mine".
>While crack pots and frauds abound here as on many new groups (perhaps moreso
>here because of content), the long-term "member" shares as much as they get.

That's quite refreshing, but also depressing.  I was under this impression
that there were quite a few people that were adept at magick that were
posting here.  I was hoping to learn something without having to pay a
whooping seminar fee.  Obviously my tactics have ruffled a few
people's feathers -- more than I expected. I suppose I should appoligze to the
world, but I don't feel like it.  I've been using a technique I learned
as a journalism student to try and drag info out of people.  I haven't really
gotten the info I wanted, but at least I gotten some.



>I'm not sure that is the purpose of this (or any) newsgroup.  I hear you saying
>that people are not posting their personal cookbooks of magick for you to copy
>and promote yourself from first level magic user to fifteenth level wizard in
>just 30 days.  This isn't alt.microwave.magick (and this isn't a flame).  This
>stuff (magick) takes a lot of time and energy.  I recall this being better 
>expressed in a previous post so, 'nuff said.
>

If I wanted a cookbook, I could buy a book.  What I wanted was some personal
experiences people have had with magick.

>Rarely, you will find that people post direct, straight-forward rituals but 
>occasionally post the hints.  I speculate this is for many reasons:
>
>(1) By the time you get to the actual performance of the ritual there is a
>    whole volume of background information, correspondances, and preparations
>    that are as important (if not moreso) than the actual rite.  There is a
>    wide diversity of approach in this group.

I don't need all the boring details, just a summary will do.

>
>(3) Many spiritual workings are quite personal.  However, people sometimes share
>    smaller parts that work or not as they feel free too (never when man-handled).
>    A post like "Hey, I've been really concentrating on centering but unable to
>    go beyond 20 minutes without breaking into violent sneezing.  Anyone else
>    had this problem (and fixed it)?" evokes many more helpful responses than
>    "You're all a bunch of fakes and can't do anything.  Prove me wrong."


My response was to people that didn't want to give me any information.  All
I was trying to say was that I have no reason to trust what they say if they
don't give me any evidence to back themselves up.

Flames don't bother me as long as people don't get personal vendatas about 
it.  I think that anyone who posts on the net should unfamiliar and unafraid
of flames.  There's something about being out of people's reach that tends
to make them mouth off more.


>
>Remember "cold fusion" several months back?  Scientists are the priests of a
>religion with no heart.

Sure I do.  After much hassle, they finally presented their technique to
the world. After that nobody was able to significantly replicate thier
results, and faults were found in thier technique.  It has since been 
regarded as a hoax.  Eventually, everyone went back to doing something 
useful again.

If people would do the same about their magick, then we could all try it
out, see if it gives the same results, and then go on from there.  That's
all I've been trying to say.

>
>This is the emotional response of a wide variety of antagonists but
>this statement seems more of a thinly veiled version of elementary
>school name-calling.
>

Is it?  Look at all the problems caused in the world by religion.  I think
it is a valid criticism.