Organization: University of Missouri-Columbia Campus Computing, 314-882-2000
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.catholic
Date:         Fri, 8 Jan 1993 10:05:24 CST
From:         CCCAMPER@MIZZOU1.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Lies about the Consecration
              8 Jan 1993 10:25:00 EST from <achavez@UMSA.UMD.EDU>

On Fri, 8 Jan 1993 10:25:00 EST Alfred S. Chavez said:
>Elizabeth writes:
>
>>The article Fred sent has a few unconvincing
>>comments (ie 'the Pope was upset about letters being sent to have
>>the consecration done properly'...only it didn't say *why* he was
>>upset....perhaps he was upset because he wanted to do it and could
>>not get it accomplished?) Then some quotes that exactly opposite
>>other things I've read. (not just Fr. Gruner)
>
>Well, I think the implication was pretty clear.  Certainly the Pope is an a

But making assumptions about "implications" is leading to problems both
ways. For example, (and at this point I'll say "allegedly" since I don't
have a copy of the article itself) the Osservatore Romano, the Vatican
Newspaper, reported that *after* the 3/25/84 consecration the Holy Father
said, speaking to Our Lady, "Enlighten especially the peoples of which
You Yourself are awaiting our consecration and confiding". Several hours
later in St. Peters Basilica he again addressed her "...especially those
peoples for who You Yourself ARE AWAITING our act of consecration".
(See Avvenire 3/27/84, page 11)

>position to correct any misimpression, knowing how much consternation is out
>there.  He strikes me as too strong an individual to be held hostage by his
>bishops; the reverse is more commonly alleged.

I cannot comment on this. If one were to choose to listen to Our Lady
(allegedly) speaking to Fr. Gobbi, there would be no such confidence.
>
>>I pray that we may find the truth. If we are led to believe it
>>has been done satisfactorily when it has not, God help us all...
>
>It's hard to believe you would place the ultimate end of us ALL in this one

Good, don't believe it. It simply seems rather important since the sooner
the consecration would be done, the less there would be to suffer.

>act.  "Blessed is the womb who bore you and the breasts that nursed you"
>said an onlooker to Jesus. "Rather, blessed is the person who hears the
>word of God and keeps it" he replied.  Point is, IMHO, the consecration of
>Russia to the IHM, and the metaphor Russia represents here--all that is
>evil, in the world, in nations, in groups, in individuals, in me--is
>intended to draw us back to Christ. When we go to her, the first words we hear
>are the last time she is quoted in scripture, at Cana, "Do as He tells you."

I'm not quite sure how you mean to relate this to the conversation.
We are encouraged to come closer to Christ, and to help draw others to
Him. However, it seems to me that God, working through Our Lady at
Fatima, placed a great deal of importance on the consecration. I'm
sure I can never give it another thought and eventually get to Heaven.
(providing, of course, i attend to many other matters) It is simply
that I hear God asking for something and am compelled to assure that
it is attended to. It does not rule my every action and moment, but
I will pursue this.

Again, I do not wish to appear to "argue" about this. Until I can find
more information that would be credible to many, it is better to not
speak on the matter. It has been extremely helpful to read the various
postings and thanks to everyone who has taken time to respond.

In Christ,
Elizabeth
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