HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn)
Subject: VNS: Tue, 15-Sep-92
Organization: Digital Equipment Co. Ltd., Reading, England
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 11:37:49 GMT


 ------- Forwarded mail received on 15-Sep-1992 at 10:04:43 -------

From:	FORTY2::LEROUF::CASEE::VNS "The VOGON News Service  15-Sep-1992 1007"
To:	VNS-Distribution
Subj:	VNS #2662  Tue 15-Sep-1992

<><><><><><><><>  T h e   V O G O N   N e w s   S e r v i c e  <><><><><><><><>

 Edition : 2662              Tuesday 15-Sep-1992            Circulation :  7762 

        VNS MAIN NEWS .....................................   51 Lines

VNS MAIN NEWS:                                     [Tom Povey, VNS UK News Desk]
==============                                     [Reading, England           ]

    Here is the News at 07:00 BST on Tuesday 15-September-1992
    ----------------------------------------------------------

    UK News
    -------

    The treasury say that a cut in UK interest rates is "on its way"
    following the cut in a key German interest rate of .5% to 9.5%
    yesterday. However, officials said that they were disapointed that the
    German cut was not greater and that the pound was still too weak for an
    immediate cut in UK rates.

    Following a study of crime figures for 89-90, the Commission for Racial
    Equality say that black and asian youths are more likely to be treated
    more severely by the police than white youths. They say that this
    conclusion is backed up by more recent studies.

    The Governor of Hong Kong, Chris Patten, has returned to London today
    for talks with the Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary over the
    details of the future of Hong Kong. Mr Patten is due to outline the
    plans for the former colony in a speech later this month.

    A report says that bus services have not improved significantly so as to
    lure passengers away from cars.


    European News
    -------------

    The UN have approved the sending of some 6,000 more troops to Bosnia to
    safeguard the relief supplies and to assist in the release of prisoners.
    Some 1,500 Britsh troops will be amongst them. The UN agreed upon the
    use of force if the troops were attacked but could not agree on an air
    exclusion zone around the areas of fighting.


    World News
    ----------

    More than 2,000 people are reported to have died in the floods in
    Pakistan. 


    {News courtesy of the BBC}


    Local Weather
    -------------

    A bright start, becoming cloudier but with sunny periods. Warmer, high
    19-21C/66-70F

<><><><><><><><>   VNS Edition : 2662     Tuesday 15-Sep-1992   <><><><><><><><>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Craig Cockburn, Digital Equipment Co. Ltd, Reading, England.     Suas
  Internet: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com                           leis
  UUCP:..!decwrl!edieng.enet.dec.com!cockburn                      a'
                                                                   Gha\idhlig!
  Views here are my own, and are not necessarily those of Digital
From: clements@bbn.com (Bob Clements)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Classic-FM (was: VNS: Mon  7-Sep-1992)
Date: 8 Sep 1992 15:23:29 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: classic.bbn.com

-<><><><><><><><>  T h e   V O G O N   N e w s   S e r v i c e  <><><><><><><><>
- Edition : 2656               Monday  7-Sep-1992            Circulation : 7790 

-     A new national radio station, Classic-FM, started broadcasting at 6am
-     today. It is Britain's first national commercial radio station and will
-     broadcast a mixture of classical music, chat and news. The service is
-     said to be intended to complement rather than rivel BBC Radio 3.

Too bad.  I really enjoyed the bird calls they were testing with.  They
were the most informative transmissions I could find on the dial...

Perhaps someone could post a review of the new service in a while?
I can't hear it over here in the colonies.

Bob Clements, K1BC, clements@bbn.com
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: miriam@seismo.gps.caltech.edu (Miriam Jackson)
Subject: O-levels, A-levels etc was Re: THE COMPLETE BRITISH TO AMERICAN DICT.
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 19:21:03 GMT

In article <0iNLqB8w164w@kryton.UUCP> ace@kryton.UUCP (Catherine Beckstead) writes:
>
>Now speaking of A levels, could someone please explain to me what
>"levels" are.  I hear them talked about in the British shows we get 
>here in the US, and here on the net, so I'm curious.  Thanks in
>advance!
>-Cathy
>
>Catherine Beckstead                    ace@kryton.uucp

Okay, this is the English and (I think) the Welsh system.  (Phew, shouldn't
get flamed so much this time).  The Scottish system is different, and
I am sure someone will enlighten you.

O-levels were an exam that kids would take at the age of 16.  All their
work for the last two years were judged on 2 or 3 papers that they would sit
at the end of the two years.  Usually, 8 to 10 different subjects are
taken.  They were meant to be for the top 40%; the rest would do C.S.E.'s
which often did include some element of continual assessment.  How well
you performed in you G.C.E. O-levels affected what kind of job you got,
which A-levels you did and even which university you went to.  THis is 
written in the past tense because the system changed a year or two ago.
The new exam is called the G.C.S.E. and is meant for all abilities (I
think) and involves more continual assessment.
A-levels are taken at age 18, and are to judge shoolwork done between
the ages of 16 and 18.  These are more specialised and usually a studen
would take only 2 to 4 A-levels.  Also, generally A-levels are done by
a minority of pupils, usually only those who intend to go on to take a
degree. 
There are also O/A levels, halfway between O-levels and A-levels,
and S levels which are harder that A-levels, and are taken by
people aiming for Oxbridge.
After being a T.A. at Ohio State, I would say an A-level is slightly above
2 quarters of introductory work at university for majors in that subject.
(e.g. A-level geology is higher that GE 121 and 122, which are far above
GE100 for non-majors).

Hope this helps.

	  Miriam Jackson
	  (miriam@seismo.gps.caltech.edu)


Newsgroups: soc.culture.british,rec.arts.tv.uk,rec.arts.drwho,alt.tv.prisoner
From: jac54@cas.org ()
Subject: Re: Tanstaafl (was:Americanising of the UK
Organization: Chemical Abstracts Service, Columbus, Ohio
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 10:39:31 GMT

In article <1992Sep10.022322.2102@spang.Camosun.BC.CA> dbarker@spang.Camosun.BC.CA (Deryk Barker) writes:
>In article <1992Sep09.081125.15198@bnr.uk> agc@bmdhh298.bnr.ca (Alan Carter) writes:
>[...]
>>In the early 80s (Ronald Reagan, Maggie Thatcher, Anal Retentiveness,
>>Radioactive Megadeath etc) Milton Freidman, a pseudoeconomist who didn't
>>beleive that economics has feedback loops in it, it's just 'individuals and
>>their choice', pretended he invented TANSTAAFL. He nicked it.
>
>I always understood (probably I have Alastair Cooke to blame for this)
>that H.L Mencken originated the phrase.
>     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

	That's about the right time, but the true origin lies in the
	folk wisdom of the Great Depression (not to be confused with Four
	More Years).

	To attract business, bar owners would advertise a free lunch.  When
	you entered the bar, the food was free but the drink wasn't.  The
	food involved a lot of salty foods such as brine pickles that made
	you thirsty and you ended up paying more for drink than the cost
	of the food you ate.

	Mencken was probably the first person to use the phrase under
	conditions where it became a matter of record.

	Alec.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: jac54@cas.org ()
Subject: Re: What is a 2.1 equivalent to ?
Organization: Chemical Abstracts Service, Columbus, Ohio
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 11:23:40 GMT

In article <PLUMMER.92Sep13145939@cilantro.cs.swarthmore.edu> plummer@cs.swarthmore.edu (David Barker-Plummer) writes:
>In article <1992Sep13.171153.13788@rdg.dec.com> cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn) writes:
>
>   I've never heard of GPA. I guess it stands for gross points average
>   or something similar. This measurement isn't used in the UK. If you
>   do well in a course, then you'll get a merit, and most people put this
>   info on their CVs.
>
>Grade point average.  Usually 4 for an A, 3 for a B and so on.
>Interpolate appropriately for decorated grades.
>
>   There is no standard, for these numbers. e.g. if you averaged 70% in
>   all your exams and coursework you might get a 2:2 in one place and a
>   first in another.
>
>I think that it is possible to find out how many of each class of
>degree are awarded in a given subject at a given institution each
>year.  So one could probably compute the percentiles that each class
>of degree "equates to" with information gathered over the years.  My
>perception is that a first in the UK is rarer than a 4.0 GPA in the
>US.  I would be surprised if, in a typical year, a US college doesn't
>have a few graduates with a 4.0, but I understand that often UK
>departments can often go for years without awarding a first.


	Many institutes of higher education in the U.S. are very large:
	our local one (the main campus of the Ohio State University) runs
	to 68,000 students+staff+faculty and is the largest.

	Most universities are liberal arts colleges.  This means that you
	have do a little bit of everything in addition to your main subject
	to graduate (Places like MIT, Caltech, and Georgia Tech. do not
	subscribe).

	The first of these leads to large impersonal classes and the second
	leads to compulsory subjects that many seem to attend with all the
	enthusiasm of the compulsory classes in Marxism-Leninism in the
	former USSR.

	The only way to keep track of students in such a system is to do
	everything by numbers.  Students have become very sophisticated in
	juggling classes and numbers to keep things looking good.

	In Britain the Universities are a lot smaller, it is not unknown
	for a small dept. to graduate a single student, and the degree
	syllabus will require a main subject and one or two subsids. in
	the first and second year and none in the final year.  Taken
	together, these allow the staff to get to know students quite well
	and to accurately assess the intangible components of academic
	achievement.  When final degrees are awarded, this also plays a
	role.  It won't allow someone who achieved a III in the exams to
	get a II(i), but someone on the borderline of II(ii) and II(i)
	may find themselves nudged upwards if the faculty think that
	they are worth it.  There can be none of the sophistication of
	working the curve that is found in the U.S.

	Alec.
From: dam@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (David Morning)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: buying peerage
Date: 8 Sep 92 08:56:29 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.

ag129@cl.cam.ac.uk (Alasdair Grant) writes:

>>In <CC.92Sep4124007@arran.dcs.ed.ac.uk> cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke) writes:
>>
>>>Yes, it's quite possible.  Donating money to charity will only get you a
>>>fairly minor title, though.  To get a big, important title you have to donate
>>>lots of money to the Conservative Party.  Sad but true.  The whole thing is
>>>corrupt beyond belief.

>Not nearly as corrupt as under Harold Wilson's Labour government, though,
>where random personal friends of senior Party members got peerages.

>The fact that industry leaders get peerages may be as much to do with the
>fact that they are perceived as creating jobs and helping exports, as with
>the amount they give to the Tories (which may be nothing - I think there
>were at least a couple of industrial peers who signed the pro-Labour letter
>in the Times before the election). Remember that the Tories value the
>tradition of the peerage, and are actually less likely to be partisan about
>it than Labour.

>A steady supply of new peers is necessary for a balanced House of Lords.

Excuse me for a moment...

Ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha!
Ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha!

A steady supply of new peers is neccessary to ensure that the incumbant
government has a sufficient majority in the House of Lords to rail-road through
its various legislation. Its as simple as that and as corrupt as it's ever
been.

As to the value the Tories place on the tradition of peerage - half the
hereditary peers are never there and have to be carted in by there political
masters if the going gets tight to swing the vote. "Backwoods men" I believe
is the phrase often used to refer to these invisible people.


Dave

-- 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: hallam@zeus02.desy.de (Phill Hallam-Baker)
Subject: Re: The LSE
Reply-To: Hallam@zeus02.desy.de
Organization: Deutsches Elektronen Synchrotron, Experiment ZEUS bei HERA
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 12:50:45 GMT

In article <1992Sep8.111718.8730@vax.oxford.ac.uk>, reese@vax.oxford.ac.uk
writes:

|>In article <1992Sep6.181723.12765@dscomsf.desy.de>, hallam@zeus02.desy.de
|>(Phill Hallam-Baker) writes:
|>> I hope the Japanese hotel get the site.
|>> 
|>> Getting rid of the LSE to restore city hall would be impossible. Getting rid
|>of
|>> a tawdry Japanese hotel no problem.
|>> 
|>> That site is reserved for democracy in London.
|>
|>When/If democracy is restored in London, it can be housed in the old
|>LSE building.

Aternatively once the Queen mum hath poped her clogs we could bung 'em in her
shack.

If that dosen't work we could always wait for Brenda to shuffle off he mortal
coil and put 'em in Buck house. Charles certainly dosen't want to have to live
there, neither did Brenda, it was Churchill who forced them into it.

--

Phill Hallam-Baker
From: wilcox@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Dum dee dum...
Date: 7 Sep 92 16:52:36 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <10187@uqcspe.cs.uq.oz.au>, colin@cs.uq.oz.au (Colin Millerchip) writes:
> In <1992Sep3.182008.8644@vax.oxford.ac.uk> wilcox@vax.oxford.ac.uk writes:
>> [...]
>>But surprisingly Mummy is putting up with Lizzie and Nigel's business ventures
>>remarkably well. Rather than a Grim Reckoning I would expect a Pargetter
>>nuptual fairly soon, or even two if Nelson does his job well enough---as he
>>seems to be.
> 
> Can this mean... the Good Guy is going to win in the end?! Lizzie and
> Nigel?!! Shurely shome mishtake.
> 
At the end of last week, Lizzie and Nigel had a row because of Mummy's
interference in the business. She was on the point of leaving for good when she
realised that there was no way she could, and we had a Grand Reconciliation.
That to me spells True Lurve, only Nigel is probably to silly, and Lizzie too
proud to recognise it. An evens chance perhaps.

> ... and Nelson and "Mummy"?

Sounds unlikely, I know, but he has been a model guardian to her, and she seems
to be reciprocating with some affection. Unless Nelson is in the closet, as has
been suggested, Something May Develop.
> 
> Anyone care to hazard a visual description of Mummy Pargitter?
> 
How could we? That would be sacrilege!

Her voice is razor-sharp when it hasn't been dulled by gin, and her hearing is
exceedingly selective. Her one aim in life is to take up the style of living of
one of the landed gentry and to put down that stupid Archer woman.
-- 

Stephen Wilcox             |   Remember what happened to the dinosaurs!
wilcox@maths.oxford.ac.uk  |    I did---and look what happened to me.
From: phd85@seq1.keele.ac.uk (D.H. Holden)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Nigel Mansell
Date: 15 Sep 92 18:13:48 GMT
Organization: Keele University, England

From article <1992Sep15.100918.472@cs.hw.ac.uk>, by neilp@cs.hw.ac.uk (Neil Postlethwaite):
> 
> I see from the Grand Prix on TV at the weekend, Nigel Mansell has taken
> a tantrum and 'quit' again 'cos Williams won't give him excessive amounts
> of money.
> 
> Good riddance to the toss-pot. Roll on Senna and Prost for Williams
> next year.
> 
> Also, did anyone believe Mansell when he was interviewed by Jonathon
> Palmer and said he was going to let Patrese win anyway. I didn't.
> 
> Neil
> 
     I believed Mansell ment it when he said he was going to let Senna
     win fo the following reason,

     1)  He let Patrese past in the first place.
     2)  If you watched the race he then proceeded to hound
	    patrese from then onwards ( instead of letting him go)
	    he also I an excellent oppurtunity to pass Patreses on 
	    the Straight but apparently backed off (causing Jame Hunt
	    and Murray Walker  to be very perplexed)
     3) this all fits in with Mansells personality,i.e., wanting
	  to be loved and seen as the sportsman but making sure 
	  that everyone knows that he could have won if he wanted
	  to.

    what ever, If Mansell does retire he will be a great loss to 
    the sport whether you like him or not, because he is a born 
    racer who hates to lose and isn't afraid to risk everything.

	Dave.


	All statements are entirely my opinion only.
--
Dave.
phd85@uk.ac.keele.seq1
From: spk@uk.ac.aber (Stephen Kingston)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: Exchange Rate (trivial)
Date: 7 Sep 92 11:30:29 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept., University of Wales at Aberystwyth.

errol@leland.Stanford.EDU (errol craig) wrote:
> Please excuse my posting, but could someone e-mail me the exchange rate
> for the dollar that I could get in Britain.  American Express here
> wants 2.083 $ to the pound; is this unreasonable?

When I last checked (last week) the exchange rate was 1.99 dollars to the
pound. An exchange rate of 2.083 does not then sound too unreasonable, 
although you could possibly do better with some other credit card exchange.
(Credit cards give better exchange rates then buying notes or travellers
cheques).

> 
> Any BTW, what was the exchange rate a year ago this time?

The exchange rate has been fluctuating around the 1.80 dollars to the 
pound mark for the last two years or so. Currently the dollar is about as
weak as it has been against the pound for well over ten years.

> 
> Much appreciated,
> 
> Errol
> errol@leland.stanford.edu

All the best,
  Stephen.

-- 
Gweleis i rac neb nym gweles pop annwyl. ef diwyl yneges. Gweleis i pasc.
(I saw the one above all men,  he saw me;  he, the beloved of his people,
who fulfills his mission. I saw Easter.) "Yspeil Taliesin" ---Taliesin---
spk@uk.ac.aber --- spk%uk.ac.aber@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk --- Stephen Kingston
From: anw@maths.nott.ac.uk (Dr A. N. Walker)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Re: O-levels, A-levels etc
Date: 15 Sep 92 15:38:29 GMT
Reply-To: anw@maths.nott.ac.uk (Dr A. N. Walker)
Organization: Maths Dept., Nott'm Univ., UK.

In article <1992Sep13.154552.8820@vax.oxford.ac.uk>
ams@vax.oxford.ac.uk writes:
>This [...] Oxford graduate came here after being
>turned down by Nottingham.

	So did many others.  In an attempt to limit the numbers flooding in,
all of our popular departments are limited by the administration as to the
number of offers we are permitted to make.  Making an offer to someone who
has received and accepted a matriculation offer from Oxford simply means
that some other perfectly reasonable applicant cannot even be considered.
In these circumstances, we reject a large majority of our best applicants
[only, of course, after confirming that they are set to go elsewhere].

>			  The letter we sent in reply to their rejection slip
>was a joy to read.

	Perhaps it was.  But such letters generate a great deal of work at
UCCA, in our administration, and for our admissions tutors (including me).
If you were rejected by *this* department, you should have received a
letter explaining carefully what the decision meant, and inviting you to
confirm that you no longer wished to come to Nottingham before we went
ahead with the official rejection.

	Sorry if this sounds like an over-reaction;  but we receive
*thousands* of applications each year, and processing them in a humane
way is a major activity that impinges significantly on teaching and
research time.  Dealing with applicants who have misunderstood what
was clearly explained to them (as opposed to those who have genuine
queries) is a complete waste of time.

-- 
Andy Walker, Maths Dept., Nott'm Univ., UK.
anw@maths.nott.ac.uk
From: RWG@buc.edu.au (Rod Griffin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
Subject: Leamington Spa
Date: 9 Sep 92 06:39:53 GMT
Organization: Ballarat University College
NNTP-Posting-Host: 141.132.8.8

Is there anyone out there residing in the Leamington/Warwick/Kenilworth area?
If so let me know I lived there years ago and am keen to get in touch with 
some people in the area
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british,rec.arts.tv.uk,rec.arts.drwho,alt.tv.prisoner,alt.usage.english
From: terry@thisbe.Eng.Sandy.Novell.COM (Terry Lambert)
Subject: Re: Gordon Bennett! Re: No smegma please, we're American
Organization: Novell NPD -- Sandy, UT
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 17:08:40 GMT

In article <1992Sep3.215537.29274@macc.wisc.edu> husted@vms.macc.wisc.edu (Jack) writes:
>In what other dictionary of its size and relative low cost can
>you find the proper term of address for the married daughter
>of a marquess/marquis? (ref. 1965 edition)

All right.  Give.  What is the proper term of address?


					Terry Lambert
					terry_lambert@gateway.novell.com
					terry@icarus.weber.edu

---
Disclaimer:  Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of
my present or previous employers.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Subject: Re: Pardon my ignorance.
Summary: What are the states with in the British Kingdom?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Keywords: states within a nation
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 20:14:00 GMT

In article <1992Sep15.173202.24435@ucsu.Colorado.EDU>, nishiyam@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (NISHIYAMA  KO writes...
> 
>Hello.  My name is Kohtaro.
> 
>I would like to learn how many states there are in Great Britain.
>You might not even call them states, but I mean those places such as
>England, Scotland, etc.  Do you call them states?
> 
>I just started to learn the British Political System in school, and I
>just became curious about how many states constitute the Kingdom of Great
>Britain.  You also have "states" outside Europe.  Is this correct?
> 
>Please answer my question when you have nothing else to do.
> 
> 
>Kohtaro Nishiyama
>The University of Colorado at Boulder
>International Affairs Major
>Where there is a will, there will be an accomplishment.
>Where there is a hope, there will be a future.
>Everything is thought in mind at first, and then becomes reality.
>  

On a recent thread, what better illustration of the differences between
the US and UK education systems.  Why this student should immediately
be awarded a PhD and appointed US ambassador to the UN.  After 10 years
further experience she could perhaps be entered for GCSE in politics or
geography.

Laurence

Xref: sparky soc.culture.british:12477 soc.culture.usa:7289 soc.culture.canada:6566
From: gerard@caliban.soest.hawaii.edu (Gerard Fryer)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.british,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Are foreignborn kids of UK citizens british?
Date: 15 Sep 92 03:22:33 GMT
Organization: Scum Of the Earth and Senile Tenured

Ignore my earlier post, <1992Sep14.185632.1493@news.Hawaii.Edu>. Our
mail handler was put out of whack by Hurricane Iniki; I had no chance
to read the discussion in s.c.b. before I posted.
-- 
Gerard Fryer  (g.fryer@soest.hawaii.edu)
School of Ocean & Earth Science & Technology
University of Hawaii at Manoa