HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper)
Subject: Re: FIFA proposed changes to (OCEANIA) Southern America
Summary: Reply to Kalle Mikkola
Organization: Warsaw University Physics Dept.
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 06:56:19 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.191837.8347@nntp.hut.fi> f36655e@taltta.hut.fi (Kalle Mikkola) writes:
>To be serious, Europe should have more places that SA, but SA had 4 
>teams in '90 which all qualified to the second round. They should 
>have >=6 teams '94, not 2 1/2. As an Europian I can see that at least
>2 places could easily be taken from Europe and 1 from Asia (I think
>they have 2 teams though they have never had any good ones).

You must be joking, Kalle. South America has hardly more than 6
countries at all, so it definitely not just those ">=6 teams" in
WC finals. Europe has got about 30 countries, out of which some
20 are not worse than Paraguay, Peru or Colombia. In my opinion,
South America should have some 4 teams in WC final, but not more.
On the other hand, one could easily reduce the represention of
Asia and North+Central America, since these are most often the
weakest teams in WC finals. But do not reduce the respresentation
of Europe! This is nonsense!

Cheers.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
My opinions are my opinions. Quite predictable.
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Michal~ Szleper                          "All you need is love, love,
(michals@fuw.edu.pl)                      Love is all you need..."

Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: michals@fuw.edu.pl (Michal Szleper)
Subject: Re: Polska liga, round 3
Summary: Reply to Francis Akoto
Organization: Warsaw University Physics Dept.
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 07:07:56 GMT

In article <6399@kielouta.fi> csfraw@vehka.uta.fi (Francis Akoto) writes:
>
>>P.S. Does anybody read this? Waiting for your answer.
>
>Yes and No. Are there any foreign players in the Polish league. I may read it
>if there are, otherwise  ............ :-(

Sorry, Francis. There are no Finnish players in the Polish league
(unless somewhere in 3rd. division). :->

---------------------------------------------------------------------
My opinions are my opinions. Quite predictable.
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Michal~ Szleper                          "All you need is love, love,
(michals@fuw.edu.pl)                      Love is all you need..."
From: 160955r@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Who should play on a national team?
Date: 21 Aug 1992 04:29:00 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu


An interesting question: is the current FIFA system fair enough when it comes to
national team eligibility? As far as I understand, once a player aquires a citi-
zenship he can play for that particular national team provided that he did not 
play for another national team prior to that.
Even the most non-Marxian statistician will notice that rich countries (espe-
cially those that had colonies) attract foreign born players to a larger ex-
tent than poor countries do.
USA has at least four of them; 30 years ago Spain had quite a few Hungarians and
Argentineans clad in yellow/red; I think Switzerland has a forward whose name
is Kubilay Turkylmaz (and who, incidentally, plays in Italy!) I am not sure
where was Rijkaard born (Gullit apparently was born in Amsterdam); and the
list can go on and on.
	The break-up of Soviet Union will most likely result in an equilibrium
similar to the one in the British Isles: at some point in time a player can
elect to be Ukrainean, Bielorussian, Russian, Armenian, etc...
Question is: given the increased player mobility, does international soccer
need firmer nationality criteria? Is place of birth a good enough one?
 


-- 
Radu T. Tomescu at UCBerkeley
Department of Economics
From: coyle@waikato.ac.nz
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: Arsenal Mural (was Maidstone United)
Date: 20 Aug 92 07:43:35 +1200
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

>>On a totally unrelated subject, I saw on breakfast news this morning that
>>Arsenal are going to alter their mural, after complaints from many quarters
>>that there are no black or ethnic minority faces shown in the crowd. There
>>are probably no away fans shown either.
 
There were no femles shown either.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: 160955r@garnet.berkeley.edu ()
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Honduras-El Salvador friendly
Date: 17 Aug 1992 05:27:46 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.berkeley.edu

The Spanish Channel showed here in California the Honduras- El salvador

friendly disputed in the LA Colisseum. Honduras deservedly won 3-0 out-

performing their opponents mainly in the fitness/strength category.

El Salvador has a couple of gifted player in the midfield but they 

seemed unable to hassle or tackle effectivbely; Honduras looks like

a real contender for a CONCACAF WC spot; Mexico, beware of them...



Cheers!


-- 
Radu T. Tomescu at UCBerkeley
Department of Economics
From: cluck@pollux.usc.edu (Carlos L. Luck)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: FIFA propoesed changes to (OCEANIA) Southern America
Date: 19 Aug 1992 17:00:48 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: pollux.usc.edu

In article <1992Aug19.224250.6299@daimi.aau.dk> rorschak@daimi.aau.dk (Jesper Lauridsen) writes:
>car@public.BTR.COM (Carlos Rimola-Sarti  car@btr.com) writes:
>>The tiny nation of Uruguay has always been and still is a power in the
>>the world scene.  They have won two world cups, including the biggest
>>upset in soccer history when they defeated Brasil in the "Maracanazo"
>>final in Brasil in 1950.
>Small correction here: the 1950 World Cup was decided in a final but in
>a 4 team tournament. Uruguay and Brazil meet in their last match with
>Brazil only needing a draw to take home the cup. Uruguay won 1-0.

Even smaller correction here: if I recall correctly (from the records; I'm
not that old :-)), the tragedy of the so-called 1950 final (for us 
Brazilians, obviously) was that indeed Brazil needed a draw and we were
even ahead in the first half 1-0. Uruguay scored twice in the second
half. So the final score was 2-1. That was the inauguration of Maracana~,
the (still) largest stadium in the world, and the record attendance of
over 150 000 is still unmatched in World Cup games (correct me if I'm 
wrong). These numbers have long been surpassed in Brazil though, since
final matches in either Maracana~ in Rio or Morumbi in Sao Paulo (the second 
largest) gather over 230 000.

History is good and it doesn't offend anybody, unlike the crossfire 
we've been reading on this group recently... (no offense intended, please).

-- 
Carlos Ludolf Luck <cluck@pollux.usc.edu>
Office: University of Southern California, SAL309 - tel. (213)740-6500
Private: 322 S. Reno St. Apt. 301 - Los Angeles CA 90057, tel. 736-5221
Program: Aspects of Redundant Manipulators - PhD Robotics
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: archer@hsi.com (Garry Archer)
Subject: Re: Premature termination of a game.
Organization: 3M Health Information Systems, Wallingford CT
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 18:58:34 GMT

In article <2262@shuksan.boeing.com> major@shuksan.boeing.com (Mike Schmitt) writes:
<
<  I think the question was if a league determines that a game will be
<  'replayed' do all the original 22 players on the field at the time of
<  the 'termination' have to start this replayed game.  Interesting question.

Agreed!


<  The laws don't cover it - only when the referee can stop a match and/or
<  abandon a match.  The replaying of the game is the decison of the league.

Yes, I've tried to check also and the Laws do not seem to cover it.  Looks 
like its a league problem :-(


<  My OPINION is that this new match is, in fact, a NEW GAME.  And the coaches
<  can play whoever they want off their roster - complete with still having
<  two substitutes.  Its a NEW MATCH - not a continuation of the OLD MATCH.
<  Demanding the SAME players would then bring into question what about OLD
<  Sent Off players - players with cautions, players with verbal warnings,
<  how 'bout requiring the self-same referees/linesmen?????  We could carry
<  this to the ridiculas (same field, same time of day, wait for the same 
<  weather.....).  A good question nevertheless - but I think it's a brand new
<  game starting from 0.

Excellent points that the League will probably arrive at similarly
considering the Laws give us no direction.

Thanks and Cheers!


-- 
Garry Archer Esq.	archer@hsi.com
3M Health Information Systems,	Wallingford, Connecticut, U.S.A.

"An Englishman never enjoys himself, except for a noble purpose." - A.P.Herbert
From: srd@ukc.ac.uk (S.R.Davies)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: Reply to Carlos'
Date: 13 Aug 92 09:52:17 GMT
Reply-To: srd@ukc.ac.uk (S.R.Davies)
Organization: Computing Lab, University of Kent at Canterbury, UK.

In article <2A8A04D9.3542@ics.uci.edu> fkhoury@bonnie.ics.uci.edu (Diego A. Maradona) writes:
>
>It is too bad that Maradona will always be the best player in the world
>whether some people like it or not. 

     [...]

>I grew up worshiping the Argentenian soccer cuz my whole body shakes when
>they are playing.  When watching these guys play, I get the feeling that a
>lot of them were born with a soccer ball in their hands.  Let us just look

                              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

     Wonderful! A bit of a Freudian slip here methinks.

     Regards, Steve.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer,soc.culture.spain
From: marios@ecs.comm.mot.com (mario smarduch)
Subject: Re: Spain/Poland Final Re:
Organization: trunking_fixed
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 16:08:58 GMT

In article <1992Aug13.083419.3869@morrow.stanford.edu> puerta@camis.Stanford.EDU (Angel Puerta) writes:
>
>marios@ecs.comm.mot.com (mario smarduch) writes:

>

>

>

>-- 
>Angel Puerta
>puerta@camis.stanford.edu

First of all you are making this into a Polish/Spanish thing, and this is not
my point. I couldn't care less who played in that final, it's just that I
have been following football for over 20 years and I aired my comments as
I saw the game. Over the 20 years of soccer Spain never managed to make it
into the final 4 in any WC, even in 82 Spain barely made it past the first round.
Whereas Poland made it into the final 4 in Spain, much better then the host
country.  

>You better start looking better because glory Days for Spanish soccer are
>here already. Who was the Eurocup Champion, and who was the Olympic Champion
>this year, just to mention one?. Please give me a call when Poland does
>something similar.

You can't call anything glory days unless you do good in the World Cup. 

>Let me get this straight. This great, versatile, strong, classy, athletic,
>talented, fast, intelligent, well-coached, mature Polish team was beaten by
>the small, unimaginative, weak, classless, puny, talentless, slow, dumb,
>poorly-coached, and inmature Spanish team because:
>a) the referee made one call
>b) the referee did not make another call, and
>c) the spectators yelled too loud.
>Gee, sounds like it doesn't take much to beat your great team.

First of all it's not my great team, and secondly I did not think so lowly
of the Spanish team. I just feel that overall they are to small and to weak
to be considered of any threat. I think that with the league that Spain has
and the money they dish out they should put something better out there. And
to be honost with you I never enjoyed watching Spain in any of the major
tournament because of their cautious, boring, and theatrical football. 

>You know, maybe Spanish soccer has been so successful throughout its history
>because when a Club or the National team loses, we criticize ourselves not
>the other team.

If you check your history books you will find out that around 1958 when
Hungary was suppressed by the Sovites, allot of the Hungarian players
fled to  Spain which made the Spanish league stronger. And the success
of the the Spanish clubs comes from importing players. As for the National
team success I don't know where you got that from. Even if you look at
Poland's record: 72 Oly. Gold, 76 Oly, Sil. 92 Oly. Silver, 74 WC 3'rd place,
82 WC 3'rd place - sure beats the great Spanish tradition as you put it.

regards,

mario s.






Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: harin@iti.gov.sg (Harinderpal Singh)
Subject: Re: WC Qualifying Results
Reply-To: harin@iti.gov.sg
Organization: Information Technology Institute, National Computer Board, S'pore
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 02:32:02 GMT

The weekend's qualifying results have already been posted. The next few games are:


23 Aug    Concacaf Central	Costa Rica vs Panama (2nd leg)(1st leg - Panama 1-0)
23 Aug ** Concacaf Carribean	St Vincent vs Surinam (1st Leg)
26 Aug    Europe Group 3	Latvia vs Denmark

30 Aug	  Concacaf Carribean	Surinam vs St. Vincent (2nd Leg)

And lots of European games in September....more about that next time!


**          This fixture appeared in my list as 2 Aug, but no result came in.
	    I suspect it might have been a misprint for 23 Aug (as all other games
	    in this group seem to be played on Sundays!).


Cheers,
	Harin
	~~~~~
---
                         Harinderpal Singh Grewal
    Information Technology Institute, National Computer Board, Singapore
            harin@iti.gov.sg        or      harinder@itivax.bitnet
            Tel: (65) 772 0383              Fax: (65) 777 3043
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: J.M.Ross@man0507.wins.icl.co.uk (J.M.Ross)
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Subject: Re: 3 in a row
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 10:00:22 +0000







In message <tan.714354207@depot.cis.ksu.edu.cis.ksu.edu> tan@cis.ksu.edu
(Joo Tan) writes

>When was the last time Arsenal and Man. Utd both started the season
>with three losses each?? That is, of course, assuming Arsenal will lose
>at Anfield (quite likely) on Sunday, and Man Utd lose to Southampton
>(probable but not likely) on Monday.

Well, only one team has ever won the league after starting the season
with three straight losses (Burnley in 1959-60). Sunderland once won the
league after failing to win any of their opening 8 fixtures. I think we can
just about write off Arsenal and United's chances for the season. 


James M. Ross

(j.m.ross@man0507.wins.icl.co.uk)
From: 074SPOCK@Witsvma.wits.ac.za
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Manchester United
Date: 20 Aug 92 16:12:30 GMT
Organization: Wits University

After last night's home defeat to Everton, I think even the most
ardent of Manchester United fans must admit that United is as
ordinary as any other team like Halifax Town or Cambridge Utd.
They are just living in past glory and living in their own illusion.
 
Comments.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: james@brock.b17b.ingr.com (James Brock)
Subject: address for Blackburn Rovers
Followup-To: rec.sport.soccer
Keywords: Address request
Reply-To: james@brock.b17b.ingr.com (James Brock)
Organization: Society for Preservation of ......
Date: Fri, 7 Aug 1992 16:57:03 GMT

Does anyone have an address for the Blackburn Rovers?

Please e-mail.
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: L0IW <L0IW@UNB.CA>
Subject: questions about "le championnat"
Organization: The University of New Brunswick
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 15:35:03 GMT


 I heard somewhere that next year there will be a new super-division2
 in france, which will replace the two 2 divisions existing so far.
 An thus 18 teams of this actual division will go in third.
 does anyone know more on that?
  who are the new foreigner players this year in the french champ?


               VIVE LE FOOT ET L'OGC NICE COTE D'AZUR



Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
From: Juergen.Schaepker@arbi.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de (Juergen Schaepker)
Subject: German Bundesliga 92/93 Predictions
Organization: University of Oldenburg, Germany
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 13:41:37 GMT

A little late, but I wished to be able to compare my predictions with
the reality in '93 ...

So here my HO:

1. Borussia Dortmund
They will just do fine as they have the best teams overall.
Chapuisat will win the scorers trophy and Zelic will play sweeper.
In the UEFA-cup I expect them to reach at least the quarters.

2. Bayern Muenchen
Will come back strongly - 15 star players certainly do not make
automatically the best team - but a good one for sure.

3. Eintracht Frankfurt
Only because of Uwe Bein. Will lose in the second Uefa-cup-round.

4. VfB Stuttgart
Will lose against Leeds and have a very bad start into the season.

5. Werder Bremen
Playing boring football. They will not score very often.

6. 1.FC Kaiserslautern
Suprisingly good season.

7. Karlsruher SC
Have chances to win an UEFA-spot.

8. Schalke 04
Some good players and a fanatic audience.

9. Bayer Leverkusen
Coach Saftig will get fired before X-mas.

10. VfL Bochum
Wosz is one of the best players, have bought good strikers.

11. Hamburger SV
Struggling for survive.

12. 1.FC Koeln
Totally disappointing season thanks to a very weak defense.

13. Bor. M'gladbach
Beacause of Moelby and Dahlin.

14. 1.FC Nuernberg
Entenmann is a good coach, and they have some good strikers.

15. Dynamo Dresden
Can survive because of the team spirit. Coach Sammer will be fired
around the 15th round.

16. Wattenscheid 09
Finally. Nobody wants to see them. Defense too weak.

17. 1.FC Saarbruecken
Wuttke gets injured. No good striker. Midfield is a mess.

18. Bayer Uerdingen
Have no good striker.

CU
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-  Juergen Schaepker , Carl von Ossietzky Universitaet Oldenburg           -
-  Inhouse: inxs@faramir                                                   -
-  Internet: Juergen.Schaepker@arbi.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de            -
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
+  'I had to read the script. Usually I don't do that ..."                 +
From: cctr123@csc.canterbury.ac.nz (Alan Murray, CSC Operations, Uni of Canty)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: Reply to Carlos'
Date: 17 Aug 92 00:39:23 GMT
Organization: University of Canterbury, Christchurch, New Zealand

In article <1992Aug14.090948.3161@syma.sussex.ac.uk>, mppu3@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Conor McMenamin) writes:
> fkhoury@bonnie.ics.uci.edu (Diego A. Maradona) writes:
> : 
> : >> As a Syrian, I grew up worshiping the Argentenian soccer cuz my whole body
> : >> shakes when they are playing.  When watching these guys play, I get the
> : >> feeling that a lot of them were born with a soccer ball in their hands.
> : >
> : >Well that would explain a lot :-) :-) :-).
> : >
> : >Alan
> : 
> : Well.  Could you further explain what you meant?
> : What does the fact of me being Syrian have to do with me worshipping the
> : Argentinian soccer?
> : If NewZeland played the same soccer, I would have probably liked theirs
> : as well.
> 	Whooah there! I do believe this was a joke:

Thanks, Connor, got it in one.

> You said:
> 	'a lot of them were born with a soccer ball in their hands'
>                                                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> I think Alan was referring to the (lest we forget) 'Hand of God'
> incident.

Not really - more others' continued insistence that handball is an integral
part of Diego's game.

Alan
From: psgjf@cc.flinders.edu.au (<G.J.Fraser>)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Predictions - English League
Date: 17 Aug 92 07:15:26 GMT
Organization: Flinders University
Originator: psgjf@gamgee.cc.flinders.edu.au


Well, after the first round it may be that I'll have to eat my words.
I haven't seen the action, but we'll get it on TV tonight, so I can at
least see the horrible errors that Arsenal made to let Norwich come
back from 0:2 to win 4:2 :-(

In my predictions I said of Norwich, Entertaining is not enough!

Well, at least Arsenal scored twice.

If anyone would still like to make a prediction, then send it in
quickly.

Cheers, Geoff.
-- 
Geoff Fraser, School of Psychology| AARNet        : psgjf@cc.flinders.edu.au
Flinders University, GPO Box 2100,| Phone (Int.)  : 61-8-2012469
Adelaide, 5001, Australia         | Phone (Aust.) :   08-2012469
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: srd@ukc.ac.uk (S.R.Davies)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: English League 92-93
Keywords: Leeds, Liverpool, Man. Utd, ...
Date: 13 Aug 92 09:44:57 GMT
Reply-To: srd@ukc.ac.uk (S.R.Davies)
Organization: Computing Lab, University of Kent at Canterbury, UK.

In article <12484@ecs.soton.ac.uk> tjc@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Tim Chown) writes:

>So I'll be having a little flutter on Leeds and Aston Villa.  I wonder
>who the last team bar Liverpool was to retain their title?  But if you've

     Excluding Liverpool, the last team to successfully retain the
 English Championship was Wolverhampton Wanderers, who won it in 1957/58
 and in 1958/59. The two seasons prior to these, the Championship was
 won and successfully retained by some team called Manchester Utd. (who?).

     Regards, Steve.
From: jimcar@cabezon.uucp (James Carrasquer)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: Spain-Poland discussion
Date: 17 Aug 92 23:55:04 GMT
Organization: Logic Modelling Corporation of Beaverton Oregon

In article <1992Aug14.173420.10164@lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com> marios@ecs.comm.mot.com (mario smarduch) writes:
>
>Here I disagree with you a bit. FIFA like always fucked up on its selection
>of the referee (or for that matter whoever chose the ref.). You see the
>Columbian referee might be the most honost and niceset guy in the world, 
>however he speaks the same language and he's use to a less physical, dribbling
>style of South American play. So what I'm saying is that no matter how 
>he try's to call the game even, sub-consciously he will always favor the 
>less physical style of play. And in a game where split second decisions
>are made it's the subconsious progammed decisions that are made by the
>referee. I felt the Spanish players (especially Alonso, Enrique) saw that
>and took advantage of it. Was it the right thing for them to do - NO,
>would the Polish players do samething if the ref. allowed them to - YES.
>For big games like that a referee must be chosen who understands both
>styles of play, not some 5ft 6in guy that could barely keep up with the
>game and follow the play.
>
>regards,
>
>mario s.
>

How is the referee chosen for the final game?  Is it not possible that
referee assignments were made at the *start* of the Olympic tournament,
before the final teams were known?

Jim Carrasquer
jimcar@lmc.com
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer
Subject: Re: FIFA proposed changes to (OCEANIA) Southern America
From: cctr123@csc.canterbury.ac.nz (Alan Murray, CSC Operations, Uni of Canty)
Date: 20 Aug 92 11:48:01 +1200
 <FISCHER.92Aug18053107@steiner.iesd.auc.dk> <18AUG92.09205755.0022@lafibm.lafayette.edu> <1992Aug19.011121.17716@CS.ORST.EDU>
Organization: University of Canterbury, Christchurch, New Zealand

In article <1992Aug19.011121.17716@CS.ORST.EDU>, visconm@fog.CS.ORST.EDU (Marcello Visconti) writes:
>
>                       <somr text deleted>
>
> 	For ex, in 1982 South America had 4 hard spots: Brasil, Argentina, 
>       Chile and Peru, and some European team was defeated by New Zealand who 
>       attended the Cup.

Nope - sorry. In 1982 the Oceania winner took the Asian route through to the
finals in Spain. In the group New Zealand played in Kuwait were the automatic
quailifiers whilst New Zealand played off against China for the last spot.
'Twas after this that Oceania teams were ommitted from the Asian zone.

Alan
Newsgroups: rec.sport.soccer