From: peter@cs.vu.nl (Grunwald PD)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: The nasty Kohl, was: EC membership of Sweden and Austria, and so WHAT ?
Date: 6 Apr 92 13:28:55 GMT

abraham@iesd.auc.dk (Per Abrahamsen) writes:


>>>>>> On 3 Apr 92 08:42:00, fischer@iesd.auc.dk (Lars P. Fischer) said:

>>>>>> "Karl" == Karl-Christian Hansen (karl@diku.dk)

>Karl> Hitler dreamed of a Europe under German leadership, and that is
>Karl> what we are moving towards.

>Lars> I can't believe you're for real, Karl. Disgusting remark.

>But he is right!  Unless the European union becomes real, we will have
>a Europe under German leadership.  

Exactly.

>That is fair, considered that Germany is the only nation doing
>anything for Europe.  Who else does anything more than talking about
>helping eastern Europe?

Couldn't agree more.

Why don't all these people see that, if anyone is really dangerous in Germany,
it's the people AGAINST the EC, NOT those PRO!

You can cry around that Germany is becoming a superpower and that that is a
bad thing, and that 'subtler than 50 years ago, not by tanks but by capitalist
means' the Germans are slowly 'conquering' the East...

...but the east is, in fact, for a big part asking for it (cf. Walesa's visit
to Germany last week) and Germany is the only country in the whole wide world
responding to it...and whether this will amount to a terrible future with
Germans in control or a great future with more welfare in eastern Europe is
not at all decided yet. Making -indeed disgusting- comparisons between present
Germany and its leaders and Nazi Germany certainly won't help at all in working
towards the latter option.
A strong EC with a strong parliament has a lot more chance to rule out the
first possibility than all EC-people saying 'the X is for the X' (fill in
any country you'd like, e.g. Denmark) with Germany rapidly becoming the most
powerful of them all.

Haven't we learned anything from De Gaulle c.s.? How do we think it is possible
that after 1100 years of war & envy (843 a.d., when Charlemagne's empire was
split in three parts) if you'd ask a German nowadays whether he'd like to snatch
some nice pieces of French soil, he wouldn't even understand your question?
Because the French didn't turn their back on Germany but (without saying so)
effectively embraced it - though they REALLY had all reason to turn their backs
on them forever!

The Germans will play a large role in the future of Europe, that's for sure.
Whether they will be the 'heroes' or the 'villains' does not only depend on themhowever.

BTW:
I wonder whether the people making these Nazi comparisons (there's  more and
more of them) have any idea about how terrible and different from now it really
was in Nazi Germany. (maybe they also have no idea of how it is now...
considering NYT's rather biased statements about Germany of a few months ago?)

Government officials that didn't do what Hitler wanted got shot, not fired
 { (-; , but it's true in a lot of cases }
and I'm not talking of 1940 now, I'm talking about as early as 1933/34.


Ciao,

Peter
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Newsgroups: soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.french