From: grimlok@hubcap.clemson.edu (Mike Percy)
Subject: Re: Hate Speech Okay, says the Supreme Court
Keywords: egnilges
Organization: Clemson University
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 13:40:33 GMT

pauld@cs.washington.edu (Paul Barton-Davis) writes:

> perez@mgr.hjf.org (Charles Perez) writes:
>>> egnilges@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Ed Nilges) writes:
>>>and which is often directed
>>>against women.  Much of this violence against women arises because of
>>>the insane expectations of relationships created by magazines like
>>>Playboy and Penthouse.
>>

>I don't believe that Mr. Nilges claimed that readers of pornography as
>it appears in such magazines as Playboy actually *hate* women. What he
>was drawing attention to was the "insane expectations of
>relationships" such publications create. If that isn't clear enough,
>think about this for a minute. I'm sure you don't believe that all
>women have biographies (or bodies) like those described in Playboy.
 
While certainly most women don't have bodies like those in playboy, if
one actually bothers to read the extended captions and descriptions of
the women in the cenerfold (and not just the Bio page "my favorite foods
are..."), one would notice that the vast mojority of centerfold women
proclaim that they are seeking a long-lasting, loving relationship
with a special guy; or are currntly involved with such a guy (or married
to one).  What I mean to say is, that apart from an exibitionist streak
and fabulous bodies, these women hardly project the idea that they are
sluts ready to jump into bed with any guy they find attractive.  Of
course, morons too stupid to read might just associate exhibitionism and
attractiveness with nymphomania...

>However, I submit that most men who have been exposed to Playboy and
>similar magazines develop a view of female sexuality which is utterly
>at odds even with its highly diverse reality. That view includes, as
>one of its central themes, the notion that women who want sex want it
>with anyone (or anything), anywhere, anytime. 

As a long-time subscriber to Playboy, I have to disagree entirely.
Playboy is not in the same league as Hustler, Screw, Cheri, etc.  These
other magazines often do portray their models as ready and willing for
anyone in the vicinity, and while, on occasion, I have found them easy
to look at but the unrealistic portrayal doesn't do much.  As I've
gotten older, these sorts of magazine barely attract more than a
fleeting glance at the cover from me anymore when I'm at the newsstand.

>Our experience of real
>life sex does a good job of modifying this view somewhat, but its
>amazing how much of written pornography/erotica/whatever centers on
>the theme of one or more women who are just so desperate for sex that
>they will have it with *you*, right here, right now. Yes, I have a few
>friends who have gone to nightclubs and met people with whom they have
>immediately had sex, but such encounters are rare, and seem to me
>inappropriate for a culturally dominant view of sexual relations.

All true.

>The prescence of such common themes (this is just one example) does a
>great deal to create "insane expectations of relationships", and has
>nothing to do with hate at all.
 
Playboy carries Asa Baber's "Men" column, Cythia Himmel's "Women"
column, The Playboy Advisor column, Playboy Forum (not at all like
Penthouse forum, a bag of fabricated mail that invariably begins "I
never thought I'd be lucky enough to have an experiance I could share in
Penthouse forum" and describes an adolescent fantasy), compelling
interviews with people like Dr. Ruth, the Mayflower Madame, and so on.
All frank and informative articles dealing with sexuality in quite
responsible terms, as well as politics, news, entertainment, reviews.
And all topped off by some fabulous picture of gorgeous women in various
states of undress (about 15-18 pages contain photos out of a 220-240
page magazine).

Say what you will about other magazine, but Playboy is, in my opinion,
not guilty of what you claim.

Mike Percy             | grimlok@hubcap.clemson.edu  | I don't know about
Sr. Systems Analyst    | mspercy@clemson.clemson.edu | your brain, but mine
Info. Sys. Development | mspercy@clemson.BITNET      | is really...bossy.
Clemson University     | (803) 656-3780              | (Laurie Anderson)
Xref: sparky talk.politics.theory:3010 misc.legal:14795 alt.postmodern:2184 alt.censorship:6268