HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: spain@galvia.enet.dec.com ()
Subject: Re: Nationalism - or Why do people have flags in their gardens?
Reply-To: spain@galvia.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 12:37:43 GMT

--
In article <BvDyHy.2oz@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk>, dam@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (David Morning) writes:

|>Amazing!!...but I thought they'd have been about as welcome as Eddie Murphy
|>at a Klu Klux Klan meeting?

There is quite a high level of religious tolerance here.  The country is
94% RC (according to the last census) but there is rarely any trouble 
regarding religion.  Generally nobody knows what religion you are anyway.

You could walk down the street in most Irish towns waving a Union flag 
in perfect safety.  Many visiting football fans have done this.  You
would get some funny looks though.

|>Out of curiosity, do any of the Northern Ireland Orange bas^H^H^H personalities
|>attend? Like Paisley or Robinson?

Generally No, however Ian Paisley has preached at thew Free Presbyterian 
church in Cavan/Monaghan (can't remember which county it's in).  



       Gary Spain, DEC, Galway, Ireland   - spain@galvia.enet.dec.com

  On being a football fan: "I am aware of the downside to this wonderful 
  facility that men have: they become repressed, they fail in their 
  relationships with women,their conversation is trivial and boorish, they 
  find themselves unable to express their emotional needs, they cannot relate
  to their children, and die lonely and miserable. But you know, what the hell?"
								   Nick Hornby
From: mike@fionn.lbl.gov (Michael Helm)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Nationalism - or Why do people have flags in their gardens?
Date: 3 Oct 1992 16:37:01 GMT
Organization: N.I.C.E.
Reply-To: mike@fionn.lbl.gov (Michael Helm)
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.128.60

Ulick Stafford writes:
>(Are the Englishman and the American still arguing in this inappropriate
>group about which Evil empire is more evil?  Don't they have email facilities
>at their sites?)

Of course -- we cultural & economic imperialists insist that all
our subjects take particular interest in whatever petty disputes
disrupt our self satisfaction.  Using email would deprive our
subjects of this educational opportunity, making it more difficult
to ascertain which side they are on.  Once we know which side they
are on, we can determine whether we charge them sales tax, or VAT,
on their purchases, but until then, they get off scot-free.
From: odlin@reed.edu (Iain Odlin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Kilt availability.
Date: 6 Oct 92 05:22:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1992Oct6.052251.11377
Organization: The Stuffed Animal Trauma Team  (We're Trained Professionals)

In article <1992Oct5.113955.1@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu> syswtr@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu writes:
>In article <1992Oct5.031646.9967@reed.edu>, odlin@reed.edu (Iain Odlin) writes:
>>   Just don't drill 'em out and turn 'em into dog-whistles, please...
>
>  Tired of buying a new chanter every few years? :-)

  Nope:  My pipes (handmade Robertsons that're older than I am...) are still
  in A as "God intended."

  I'll readily admit that dog-whistle pipes have their place, but buy new pipes
  made to be in that tuning.  Don't do as a gentleman I'd love to strangle
  did and get ahold of a one-of-a-kind item like a Gold-mounted set of presen-
  tation Robertsons (handmade by the Man himself) and then re-bore them to a
  B-flat tuning just so's you can play in a band with your brass-playing
  friends.  My skin still crawls just thinking about that...
=
-- 
 --------------------------------- Iain Odlin ---------------------------------
                  10 Crosby Street, Level 3, Portland ME 04103
                                 odlin@reed.edu
 ------------ When you're not looking, this sentence is in Gaelic. ------------
From: ray@philmtl.philips.ca (Ray Dunn)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: My Ugly American post for the year....
Date: 3 Oct 92 22:58:49 GMT
Organization: On the Brew.

In referenced article, gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell) writes:
> Gee - I'm impressed - this almost counters the 8 messages I've gotten cheering
>me on for telling the pompous twits to kiss my a**.

I'm disappointed in you Gary, pulling this old net ploy - claiming support
from hidden correspondants.

> Don't any of you have the 
>balls to tell these self-righteous "folks" to kiss offf?

Clearly not, including your anonymous emailers, but then most people don't
participate in this newsgroup to feed their raging xenophobia.

But thanks anyway, without postings like this we might run out of the
inclination to American bash.
-- 
Ray Dunn at home  |  Beaconsfield,  Quebec,  Canada.
(514) 630 3749    |  ray@philmtl.philips.ca  or  ..uunet!sobeco!philmtl!ray
From: cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: But I like Television Evangelists
Date: 30 Sep 92 09:45:52 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

In article <NIALL.92Sep29213039@scheria.nmsu.edu> niall@nmsu.edu (Niall Graham) writes:

   My favorite recolection is of a foaming-at-the-mouth speech made by Jimmy
   Swaggart (before he was photographed leaving a brothel, the first time) on
   the blasphemy of Cliff Richard for singing religious pop songs. His
   diatribe lasted at least half an hour. (This appeared on a cable channel
   in Austin in Spring 1987.)

Huh?  A Christian, criticising a Christian singer for singing Christian
songs?  I don't understand.  Or is it that Cliff is British, therefore
European, therefore not only un-American but also evil and possessed by the
devil?  Yes, that must be it...  :-)

--
	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)
From: newt@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Michael Steven Newton)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: My Ugly American post for the year....
Date: 30 Sep 92 12:29:45 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.

mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach) writes:

>From: gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell)
>>Frankly - who gives a damn? I couldn't care less what Europeans think of
>>the US or Americans. In fact, I doubt if most americans would give
>>two-cents for the views on the US from Europeans. We are still the leader
>>of the free world and we are still the most powerful nation on earth.

>This sort of blind "we are the best" attitude was just the
>thing which brought Britain down. History shows us that this
>complacent trumpet-blowing is one of the prime signs of
>decline. Everything is allowed to fall to pieces, sharper and
>more competent competitors are ignored, debts are built up
>which can never be repaid. Every empire in history shows this
>pattern - Rome, Spain, Britain. "Who gives a damn - we're the
>best" could be the epitath for all of them.

  Yes, pride goeth before a fall.  Thanks, Gary, for displaying the
  unspoken truth which so many Americans hide deep in their tiny hearts
  but are too often afraid to expose in the cold light of day.  The rest
  of us are terribly ashamed of our culture, language and country, and
  wish we could adopt the greatness of your shining exemplary country,
  especially as advertised on your wonderful cultural awareness campaign
  you've been promoting through television.

  How shall we start?  Perhaps we could first find a number of poor
  third world nations with untapped natural resources, overthrow their
  governments (by replacing less just rule by "democracy"), and put in
  some rulers who would owe us something.  Much like the CIA has done
  to ensure the dominance of the US.

  Any more suggestions, oh enlightened one?

  -- mn
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: hughes@physics.unc.edu (W. Christopher Hughes)
Subject: Re: Nationalism - or Why do people have flags in their gardens?
Organization: Dept. of Physics and Astronomy, Univ. North. Carolina at Chapel Hill
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 13:58:28 GMT

In article <44997@skye.dcs.ed.ac.uk> morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay) writes:
>In article <1992Sep25.163221.24445@news.clarkson.edu> walker@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Graham Walker, 227 West Old Main,268-3847,) writes:
>
>I'm just back from Denmark where one sometimes sees houses with flagpoles in 
>the gardens flying the Danish flag, ot sometimes a red and white
>streamer that I suppose represents the Danish flag.
>
>I remember seeing this in Switzerland, Austria and Turkey when I visited
>those countries. Certainly, as mmh syas, if anyone un the UK had the
>Union Jack in their garden, you'd suspect them of being some kind of
>fascist loony. Only the Queen has a flag in her garden, which proves my
>point rather well :-)
>
>Perhaps the people flying these flags are some kind of elected officials
>or something. Does anyone know? I've never seen such displays in France
>or Ireland.
>
>M
>--
>Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 

I was traveling between Donegal and Mayo on the 12th of July in 1991
and saw a large group of people with sashes following a Union Jack.
However, in Mayo I also saw quite a few homes, pubs, and businesses
flying either the tricolor or the papal flag.

Of course, Ireland during marching season isn't quite like the rest
of the world.

Liam O/ hAodha
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: couch@unislc.uucp (Keith Couch)
Subject: Learning The Gaelic Language
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1992 15:05:32 GMT

"newt" made mention in a previous post about a magazine called
"GAELIC-L" - I would like to obtain their address. Can anyone help me?

I am planning a three week holiday to Ireland in July of 1993 and I
would like to find cassette tapes which would help me to learn enough
Gaelic to be a good tourist.

I have found very little information here in the States. Any help from
those of you with direct knowledge would be appreciated.

Thank you.


-----
Keith Couch					(801) 594-6088
Senior Software Engineer			(801) 594-4861 FAX
Unisys Corporation				couch@unislc.slc.unisys.com
322 North 2200 West
MS-D1V03
Salt Lake City, Ut 84116
From: gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: My Ugly American post for the year....
Keywords: ugly Americans relax
Date: 30 Sep 92 10:02:21 GMT
Organization: U of Arizona CS Dept, Tucson

In article <1992Sep30.064954.11807@netcom.com>, eamon@netcom.com (Charles E Taggart) writes:
> Dennis McNamara writes:
> >>Gary L. Newell writes:

    < a bunch of "eat me Europeans" stuff deleted >

> >I just wanted to say that this arrogant ranting is not shared by all USA'ans.
> Seconded, Dennis.

 Gee - I'm impressed - this almost counters the 8 messages I've gotten cheering
me on for telling the pompous twits to kiss my a**. Don't any of you have the 
balls to tell these self-righteous "folks" to kiss offf? Your willingness to 
bend over and take your medicine does little but indicate to me that you
like to be shit on - so be it... I don't particularly like it, especially when
it comes from hypocritical groups as we have seen here.... but hey - be proud...


				gln
From: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: If the Scotts want to be rid of the Iron Masters....
Date: 28 Sep 92 13:22:53 GMT
Reply-To: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U

In article <1992Sep26.015343.20953@emr1.emr.ca> davidson@ccrs.emr.ca (David Davidson) writes:
>From the little I have heard in the Canadian press, and from other readings
>I do not see the Scotts Nationals exploiting history to their maximum benefit,
>as the Irish so effectively demonstrate in their struggle. It would
>seem to me that if you want to stir up nationalism in societies that are as
>soft as ours, then you'll have to dig up ancient quarrels.
>
>Just a thought, so what do some of you lads across the pond think?
>


I think you can't possibly be serious.


M







--
Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 
	Thanksgiving For a National Victory (Robert Burns)
Ye hypocrites! are these your pranks? To murder men and give God thanks?
Desist, for shame! Proceed no further: God won't accept your thanks for murther.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: walker@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Graham Walker, 227 West Old Main,268-3847,)
Subject: Re: American Bashing
Organization: Clarkson University
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 14:12:07 GMT

From article <1992Sep29.084311.2898@dcs.qmw.ac.uk>, by mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach):
>
> . . . . . . . . . . I might as well be proud of the no.25 bus
> route.
> 
> Matthew Huntbach

And whats WRONG with the No. 25 bus route, I may ask!!!!

										GW
From: mlhb@mammoth.dr.att.com (Sky Warrior)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: American Bashing
Date: 28 Sep 92 15:24:25 GMT

I have a hard time with people who don't know or understand anything about
a particular country (namely, the US) who can so thoroughly criticize it,
especially when you take offense when someone else criticizes your country.

You've heard the saying, "People who live if glass houses, shouldn't throw 
stones"?

-- 
-----------------------------                                              
SKY WARRIOR aka MLH Bonham  | "Good tea.  Nice House." -- Lt. Worf
mammoth!mlhb@druhi.att.com  |----------------------------------------------
mlhb@drutx.ATT.COM          | SKY WARRIOR RACING KENNELS - Coming to an
                            | Iditarod near you!
----------------------------- 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: eamon@netcom.com (Charles E Taggart)
Subject: Re: Nationalism - or Why do people have flags in their gardens?
Summary: Never knew there were Orange marches in the Republic ...
Keywords: Orange marches Ireland
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 07:01:55 GMT

Gary Spain writes:

>David Morning writes: 
>>Someone tell me Garry is having a wee joke here!  Orange marches in the
>>Republic?? 
>
>Dave, seriously there are a few.  Generally in the Donegal and Cavan areas.

Fascinating ... I never knew this.  It seems ironic that Orange marches
would occur in the county with Ireland's largest Gaeltacht.

The stated purpose of the Orange marches has been for expression of pride
in Protestantism and "Britishness", but it seems that their main purpose
in the North is to intimidate the nationalist population.  This would be
pointless in the Republic, so I would guess that the marches' purpose
would be the former.

How are they viewed by the majority population of Donegal and Cavan?

Le mo bhui/ochas,
  ,
  Eamon

-- 
          ,                                          
  Charles Eamon Taggart   | "Time and space are playing games with people 
     eamon@netcom.com     |  who don't understand / You can't talk about
   eamont@well.sf.ca.us   |  the weather when you've killed the weatherman."
 Santa Monica, California |                      -- Toasted Heretic
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: fusco@ucsu.Colorado.EDU (Andrew Fusco)
Subject: Re: Cliff Richard
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 20:13:26 GMT

shazam@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:

>Maybe I did not make myself clear.  Cliff Richard did not have any
>popular hits other than Devil Women in AMERICA that i know of.
>That song WAS recorded and released in  AMERICA a couple of decades
>ago...it was in the 70's.  As far as what he has done in other countries, 
>I do not know.  If he had any Christian music released in the USA, I 
>had not heard it.  

Well, I remember that he had a few hits in the early 1980s in the US.
"We Don't Talk Anymore," in 1980, and then "Suddenly," a duet with
Olivia Newton-John a little later. Also, I think there was a song called
"A Little in Love."

-ACF
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: hughes@physics.unc.edu (W. Christopher Hughes)
Subject: Madrai/ na hE/ireann (was Re: This is *not* soc.culture.american)n
Summary: Woof 
Organization: Dept. of Physics and Astronomy, Univ. North. Carolina at Chapel Hill
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 17:07:08 GMT

In article <1992Sep29.131515.2168@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu> shazam@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:
>
>Also, is there anyone here who is particularly interested in
>the dogs of Ireland?  Like the Kerry Blue, Soft-coated Wheaten
>Terrier, the Irish Terrier and the Black and Tan Terrier?
>I am looking into the history...and again, I read the Kerry
>Blue came from Spain during the Spanish Armada.  The Kerry Blue
>and the Irish, along with a little Black and Tan brought 
>about the Wheaten I have read.
>
>Suzanne

OK, I'll bite. :-)

As the proud but foolish owner of a Red Setter, I have to admit
to being a dog lover.  Until recently, I didn't even realise that
there were all these other Irish breed of dogs.  The only ones
I knew of were the setter, terrier, and of course wolfhound.

My question is: do all these breeds exist in Ireland, or were they
just created there and then popularized by the American Kennel Club,
Royal Kennel Club (?), Botswanan Kennel Club, etc.?  I know from
having seen setters in Ireland that they exist there, though I
noticed that they were somewhat smaller in stature.  Of course, I
have an obscenely large dog so I'm not a good judge of such things.

Finally, is dog _breeding_ (that is for show and such) something
that has come down from the landed classes in Ireland, or is there
some more historic component to it?  That is, were dogs just dogs
until the aristocracy got a kick out of inbreeding them?

By the way, I don't mean to leave out other celtic countries in this.
I know the Welsh corgi is a fine dog and there are many good breeds
from Scotland (terrier to elkhound).

Thanks,
	Liam O/ hAodha
From: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: More on Kilts - Dreaded 'Merkins tampering With
Date: 2 Oct 92 14:09:57 GMT
Reply-To: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U



An aside to this thread. 

I saw an article in ( I think ) the Herald recently about a "Hillwalkers
Kilt" which is being produced by an American man now settled up north
somewhere.

He being an enthusiastic kilt wearer, felt that the modern garment was
so unsuitable for striding the wet hills of Scotland, that the
highlanders of past centuries would never have worn it ( as indeed we
know they didn't wear it in this form). He said it was too hot and took
too long to dry to be useful.


He has adapted the modern stitched kilt to a form more suitable ( he
says) for days on the hills. As I remember, his version is made of 4
yards of cloth ( instead of 8) and has two pockets stitched into the
sides somewhere.

He is now manufacturing these and they are proving popular, according to
the article, though I"ve never seen one. I'd be interested to know if
anyone else has.


M

--
Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 
	Thanksgiving For a National Victory (Robert Burns)
Ye hypocrites! are these your pranks? To murder men and give God thanks?
Desist, for shame! Proceed no further: God won't accept your thanks for murther.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Mr. Walker's comments about welfare in Ms. and Ala.
From: Aengus Lawlor <RBYAML@rohvm1.rohmhaas.com>
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 08:54:33 EDT
Organization: Rohm and Haas Company

What is this persons problem?
In article <1992Oct5.194156.2202@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu>,
shazam@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu says:
>
>Ummm.....Excuse me, Mr. Walker, but before you start staing facts
>about the people in other states, perhaps you should live there first?
Do you know for a fact that Graham hasn't lived in Ms and Ala? Or do you
apply different rules for posting for other people than for yourself?
>
>You mentioned Alabama and Mississippi and living off welfare and
>food banks.  Perhaps you should visit here and see hwo many familys
>are living off welfare and WHY they are living off welfare?
>
>I worked as an Eligibility Worker for the Food Stamp Department here
>in Mississippi.  I was employed for 5 years by the Welfare Department.
>So if you have any doubts as to waht I am saying, feel free
>to write me persoinally, but please do not start another flame war
>on this list.
How the hell can he disagree with what you are saying if you aren't
saying anything coherent? Graham said that it appalled him that there
are poor people who live on welfare while other people glory in conspicuous
consumption. (Yes, I know Gary was being deliberately provocative).
Do you disagree with him? Are there _NO_ poor people in Ms and Ala?
Why were you working for the Food Stamp program?

Or do you believe that Graham was just being gratuituously insulting to
those states, and you just felt the need to stick up for them? If you
want a gratuituous insult, try this for size: Learn to read!
>
>I sent this to the list and not to him personally, because I wanted
>to make sure that people did not get the wrong impression
>because someone who may have never lived in a state can
>supposedly state facts about said state.  *smile*
Here we go again. Graham should keep to e-mail, but you get to post to
the list. And Cliff Richard has noting to do with s.c.c, but you have to
squeeze in that one, last post.

>
>Suzanne

I never used kill files in scc, but I wish I had succumbed to the temptation
the first time I saw *smile* (*wince*) in a post.

Aengus
--
RBYAML@ROHMHAAS.COM                    Aengus Lawlor
RBYAML@ROHVM1.BITNET                   (who used to be ALAWLOR@DIT.IE)
"How about some of that famous Dublin wit, Barman?"
"Certainly, sir. Would that be Dry or Sparkling?"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: halpin@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Dave-ball
Date: 6 Oct 92 20:43:27 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <BvpGsH.n1w@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk>, dam@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk
(David Morning) writes:

> Why are you so desperate to "Americanise" it into 'soccer' anyway?

> Dave

It is not an Americanism, dammit! 

I'm Irish, and Soccer is the name that comes first to my mind (and
I've never played Gaelic football). People around me here in Oxford
are more or less as likely to say soccer as football, and like I
said in a previous post, ``footie'' is favoured among some of the
English here. 

Indeed, ``soccer'', like ``rugger'', is a typical English schoolboy
slang formation. 

This is getting a bit like association football as religion:

            "Football" <==> "Catholic"       (what we call ourselves)
"Association Football" <==> "Roman Catholic" (what "they" call us)
              "Soccer" <==> "Papist"         (what "they" call us
                                              when they're trying to
                                              be offensive)
       :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) 
Brendan

Brendan Halpin                    Email: HALPIN@VAX.OXFORD.AC.UK
Nuffield College                  Phone: +44 865 278642
Oxford OX1 1NF
United Kingdom
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Problems subscribing to Irish Emigrant.
From: Aengus Lawlor <RBYAML@rohvm1.rohmhaas.com>
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 17:18:32 EDT
Organization: Rohm and Haas Company

A friend recently got a job with AT&T, and he asked about getting the
Emigrant. I sent a request to irish-net-request@cs.cornell.edu but
Noel didn't receive the next issue. I then suggested that he send a note
himself, in case there were routing difficulties, but he just called to say
he hasn't received todays issue either.

Is Pat Stephenson still administering the list, and if so does anyone have
his address? Is the list still administered manually, so a freeform "please
add Joe Bloggs JBLOGGS@HOST.DOMAIN to the list" message will work? Does
anyone know of problems with ! in the path. (The new address is
ldsadw!ntravers@attmail.com.)

Thanks,

Aengus
--
RBYAML@ROHMHAAS.COM                    Aengus Lawlor
RBYAML@ROHVM1.BITNET                   (who used to be ALAWLOR@DIT.IE)
"How about some of that famous Dublin wit, Barman?"
"Certainly, sir. Would that be Dry or Sparkling?"
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic