HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: peterg@netcom.com (Peter Goodall)
Subject: Re: Bug-Fixes for Digitalk products: where?
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 03:48:50 GMT

marten@feki.toppoint.de (Marten Feldtmann) writes:

>> Is there any FTP-site (or e-Mail server), where I can get these
>>bugfixes also? I bought products from Digitalk and not from CompuServe,

> I've got several responses to this mail, therefore: would there be any
>interest in building a mailing list for these purposes, perhaps one can
>persuade Digitalk to do this .... ?

I suggest mailing info@digitalk.com and trying to convince them. I believe Dan 
Goldman has no problem with the Compuserve stuff going onto the Internet. 
The folks who were previously with Instantiations have an Internet node. So I 
suspect that they are best placed to send it all to an archive and keep it 
up-to-date.

Peter Goodall -- peterg@netcom.com
From: jgs@funsys.funsys.se (Jan Gifvars)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: command line parsing
Keywords: Smalltalk commandline
Date: 16 Dec 92 13:10:29 GMT
Organization: .funsys.se


Hello !

Is it possible to parse the command line when you start a ParcPlace image.
Example:

	$ st80 myImage.im argument1 argument2

or will the virtual machine throw them away ?

Thank you in advance !

Jan Gifvars
ENATOR Functional Systems AB
Sweden
jgs@funsys.se
From: penning@sumax.seattleu.edu (Mat Penning)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: Re: 3D Graphics Classes?
Date: 16 Dec 92 00:54:22 GMT
Organization: Seattle University, Seattle, WA


> I'd also be interested in any info on this.  I don't know about Mat,
> but I'm using ST/V Win 2.0.  (I know there are classes at the Manchester
> archives, but I believe those are mostly ST80-flavors.)
> 
>    - Ashley

I'm also using ST/V Win 2.0, but others have expressed interested in other
ST/V packages. So far I haven't received any info on this, but if I do I 
will post it ...

	- Matt


Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: paulgc@sad.hp.com (Paul Christensen)
Subject: GNU Smalltalk
Summary: Smalltalk 
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 05:46:53 GMT
Organization: HP Sonoma County (SRSD/MWTD/MID)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]


Does anyone know if I can compile Little Smalltalk on the amiga using GCC for
the amiga?

thanks

paulgc@hpsadmq.sad.hp.com




Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Date:         Wed, 16 Dec 1992 12:30:46 +0100
From:         Joerg Rade <jrade1@GWDG.DE>
Subject: Re: GNU ST and SegV w/CFuncs.st
Comments: To: SMALK%FINHUTC.BITNET@ibm.gwdg.de

Hi Kevin,
the system here is:

|ULTRIX V4.2A (Rev. 47) System #4: Wed Jan  1 01:38:15 MET 1992
|UWS V4.2A (Rev. 420)

mst answered:

|gwdu03> mst -V
|Smalltalk 1.1.1 Ready
|
|st>


Is it possible that you are on mst 1.1 ? Prep.ai.mit.edu has the newest
version.

-Joerg
From: jakesky@cup.portal.com (Johnny Fred Stewart)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: Re: Gemstone
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 13:45:16 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Jan Gifvars
jgs@funsys.se 
Jan,

Our environment for Gemstone was a Sun 630MP server,
Objectworks/Smalltalk 4.0 with Tigre as the front end,
SUN 'C' as the backend,
and Gemstone 3.0 as the arbitration expert.

Basically our front end consisted of a Help Desk Automation
system written in Smalltalk front ended via Tigre
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: paulgc@sad.hp.com (Paul Christensen)
Subject: SmallTalk for Amiga?
Summary: Is there ST for Amiga?                      
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 22:14:31 GMT
Organization: HP Sonoma County (SRSD/MWTD/MID)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1.4 PL6]
Keywords: Amiga Smalltalk amiga smalltalk 

Has anyone out there heard of an Amiga port of smalltalk so I can
try it out and see if I like it?

thanks,

paulgc@hpsad.sad.hp.com
 


Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: peterg@netcom.com (Peter Goodall)
Subject: Re: anything isKindOf: nil ==> true (Objectworks)
Keywords: bug, smalltalk, st-80
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 03:56:28 GMT

knight@mrco.carleton.ca (Alan Knight) writes:

> Somebody here noticed an interesting "feature" in ObjectWorks 4.0.
>Due to the way inheritsFrom: is implemented, the expression

>  anObject isKindOf: nil

>evaluates to true for any object. This was discovered when a class
>which should have been in the system had not been loaded and had been
>instead declared as a global, its value defaulting to nil. As a
>result, the isKindOf: test never failed. Presumably the same thing
>would happen with a class name that was undeclared.

>This does not appear to happen in Digitalk implementations.

Well, I suppose this depends on how you test that a class inherits
from another. The Digitalk #inheritsFrom: tests for nil to terminate
the seach. I haven't got ST-80 to look at, so they must do it differently.

I assume you could trace the implementation in the Debugger.

Peter Goodall -- peterg@netcom.com
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: dposey@well.sf.ca.us (David Posey)
Subject: Re: PARTS
Organization: Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 21:48:27 GMT

In <1g9m1lINN7br@montaigne.lif.icnet.uk> js@montaigne.lif.icnet.uk (Jack Shirazi <js@biu.icnet.uk>) writes:

>I understood that PARTS is deliberately supposed to hide
>all code that a PART is created from. The idea being that
>one can sell a PART object without having ones code taken
>by the user. For myself, I find this less than useful. Being
>able to browse code in Smalltalk is a definite must. If I had to
>rely only on the documentation of what the classes do and their
>interface, I think I'd probably move into another language.
>Admittedly PARTS is supposed to support objects built from
>a range of languages, but anyone with a few years of experience
>in programming tends to be able to read code in a variety of
>languages.
>-- 
>       Jack               js@bison.lif.icnet.uk
>                         
>If you only have a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.
>                -- Maslow
Sorry, Jack, I don't follow you. PARTS 'hides' code from the user,
but if you've licensed PARTS, you can examine, modify, resave, reuse (etc.)
all of that code w/o restriction. The 'wrappers' around C/C++/COBOL don't
hide that code from a developer, they just give one a consistent interface
to it - as a 'PART'. An end-user, of course, sees none of this, just your
brilliantly concieved, painstakingly executed, 32-bit creation. :>)
I'm sure glad I *can* read the code, it's my primary tutorial on Smalltalk,
so far...

-David
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: knight@mrco.carleton.ca (Alan Knight)
Subject: Re: anything isKindOf: nil ==> true (Objectwork
Reply-To: knight@mrco.carleton.ca (Alan Knight)
Organization: Carleton University
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 14:57:21 GMT

In <1992Dec11.141556.7961@hasler.ascom.ch> steinman@hslrswi.hasler.ascom.ch (Jan Steinman - Bytesmiths, 3946) writes:

>In article 723917157@cunews, knight@mrco.carleton.ca (Alan Knight) writes:
>> Somebody here noticed an interesting "feature" in ObjectWorks 4.0.
>>Due to the way inheritsFrom: is implemented, the expression
>>
>>  anObject isKindOf: nil
>>
>>evaluates to true for any object...

>As I recall, this has been true since at least Smalltalk-80 V1 (ca. 1982).

>This behavior is probably necessary if you want a multi-rooted class
>structure.

Why? Even if I have multiple roots I wouldn't expect there to be nil
superclass pointers except at the top of a hierarchy. I can just test
for nil superclass pointers and return false if I hit one. It could be
true, I've never tried to use a multi-rooted class hierarchy, but I
don't see why.

>It sounds like yet another reason to avoid #isKindOf:.

I realize that isKindOf: is not a very good thing to use, and that was
the first thing I told the person who discovered this. I like the
Boolean messages approach myself. It's faster than isKindOf: or
testing a set of messages using respondsTo:, and more flexible than
isKindOf:. It does require you to add the Boolean message to any class
you want to use in that context, but I haven't found that too onerous
so far.

On very large projects I can imagine that the respondsTo: test might
be better, since it will automatically accept appropriate classes from
different places in the hierarchy without having to implement the
Boolean message for them. On the other hand, respondsTo: might accept
classes that happen to implement a semantically different method with
the same name (where semantically different might include
#shouldNotImplement).


Alternative methods aside, saying that a language facility is bad
style is a poor excuse for it not working. Either isKindOf: should be
eliminated from the language or it should work. Strictly speaking
isKindOf: does work (as far as I know) if called with an argument
which is actually a class. However, being called with nil is a
sufficiently easy mistake to make that I think it would be a good idea
to check for it.


-- 
 Alan Knight  knight@mrco.carleton.ca  +1 613 788 2600x1027 
 Dept. of Mechanical and Aerospace Engineering              
 Carleton University, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, K1S 5B6      

Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: 890179s@dragon.acadiau.ca (Michael R. Smith)
Subject: BOSS question for Smalltalk gurus 
Keywords: smalltalk
Organization: Acadia University
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:21:15 GMT

Hello, 
	I have a small problem that perhaps all those Smalltalk gurus 
out there could help me with.

I am using ObjectWorks on a PC.     

I am trying to write objects to a BOSS file.
I can write a small number by using onNew: then nextPut: 

but when I try to write a reasonably large number of objects
I just get a 0 byte size file.

ugg.. 
I think it has something to do with committing the buffers
or something like that .....

Oh, I close the file after I write all of the objects by nextPut:
From: jeff@is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Jeff McAffer)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: NeXT st?  (again)
Date: 14 Dec 92 08:28:17 GMT
Reply-To: jeff@is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp
Distribution: comp
Organization: University of Tokyo, tcejorP Project.

A while ago I saw some things float by about ST on a NeXT but did not
pay attention as I did not have a NeXT.  Guess what?  I have a NeXT
(well, its broken right now but when its fixed...)

Could someone refresh me on the availability of ST (PPS I assume) for
the NeXT?

Thanks,


--
--
ato de, |m        -- Truth peels from the burning halls of words.
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: knee@netcom.com (Mark Lanett)
Subject: Re: Self: where can I find it
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 05:24:12 GMT

Joerg Beekmann <jbeekman@prodigy.bc.ca> writes:

>A while ago there was an anouncement of the availability of Self.
>Any pointers to where I can find it would be aprieciated.
>Many thanks

The self archive can be browsed via anonymous ftp to self.stanford.edu. There
is also a mailing list, self-interest; information is at the archive.
-- 
/* Mark Lanett */
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: irvine@ntmtv.UUCP (Chuck Irvine)
Subject: Re: Smalltalk/V for Sun (Sparc)
Organization: Northern Telecom Inc, Mountain View, CA
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1992 18:30:53 GMT

In article <BzDFoJ.CB1@dale.cts.com>, glippert@dale.cts.com (George Lippert) writes:
|> Chuck Irvine (irvine@ntmtv.UUCP) wrote:
|> > I vaguely seem to recall hearing something about Digitalk doing a port
|> > of ST/V for the Sun Sparc. Does anyone know if there's any substance to
|> > this? Any information is much appreciated. Thanks
|> 
|> I talked with Digitalk about two days ago (I wanted them to port to the NeXT)
|> and they told me that they where making their first foray into the world of
|> Unix and that, based on user demand, they were going for the IBM RS/6000!  No
|> definite plans about further platforms.

There is NO WAY that user demand could be higher for the RS/6000 than for the
Sparc! User demand would be in proportion to market size and, there, Sparc wins
hands down. If they're going the RS/6000 way you can bet that it's because of
their close and vested interest with IBM.

|> 
|> You can call them at
|> 
|> * Digitalk, Smalltalk, Los Angeles 310.337.3135
|> 
|> --
|> George A. Lippert           work:          glippert@dale.cts.com
|> Titan Satellite Systems     home: zucchini!glippert@dale.cts.com (NeXTmail ok)
|> San Diego, CA                                            
|> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: kevinl@tisdec.tis.tandy.com
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: GNU ST and SegV w/CFuncs.st
Date: 15 Dec 92 18:08:00 GMT
Nf-ID: #N:tisdec.tis.tandy.com:8400002:000:2637
Nf-From: tisdec.tis.tandy.com!kevinl    Dec 15 12:08:00 1992


I am trying to use GNU Smalltalk, but when I try to load it using
	mst -V
I receive the following output:

Processing builtins.st
Processing Object.st
Processing Message.st
Processing Magnitude.st
Processing Character.st
Processing Date.st
Processing Time.st
Processing Number.st
Processing Float.st
Processing Integer.st
Processing LookupKey.st
Processing Association.st
Processing Link.st
Processing Process.st
Processing Collection.st
Processing SequenceableCollection.st
Processing LinkedList.st
Processing Semaphore.st
Processing ArrayedCollection.st
Processing Array.st
Processing String.st
Processing Symbol.st
Processing ByteArray.st
Processing CompiledMethod.st
Processing Interval.st
Processing OrderedCollection.st
Processing SortedCollection.st
Processing Bag.st
Processing MappedCollection.st
Processing Set.st
Processing Dictionary.st
Processing IdentityDictionary.st
Processing SystemDictionary.st
Processing Stream.st
Processing PositionableStream.st
Processing ReadStream.st
Processing WriteStream.st
Processing ReadWriteStream.st
Processing FileStream.st
Processing TokenStream.st
Processing Random.st
Processing UndefinedObject.st
Processing Boolean.st
Processing False.st
Processing True.st
Processing ProcessorScheduler.st
Processing Delay.st
Processing SharedQueue.st
Processing Behavior.st
Processing ClassDescription.st
Processing Class.st
Processing Metaclass.st
Processing MethodContext.st
Processing BlockContext.st
Processing Memory.st
Processing WordMemory.st
Processing ByteMemory.st
Processing MethodInfo.st
Processing FileSegment.st
Processing SymLink.st
Processing initialize.st
Processing CFuncs.st
"CFuncs.st", line 44: Segmentation violation
Object class>>#isVariable
Object class>>#variableSubclass:instanceVariableNames:classVariableNames:poolDictionaries:category:
UndefinedObject>>#executeStatements
UndefinedObject>>nil

	I receive similar messages when smalltalk gets to the CFuncs.st
when I try to load it in the examples and stix directories.
	I'm trying to get it to load on Ultrix 4.2A (Rev. 47).  I had to
do a couple of things with alloca to get it to compile, but I figured
if it got through the rest of the stuff, it shouldn't just choke on the
CFuncs.st section.
	Is there a bug in CFuncs.st?  Did I just do something stupid?
I know smalltalk not at all, so I can't tell if the syntax is bad.  I
really want to get this going because I want to learn smalltalk, and
try to port GNU smalltalk to OS/2.  Any and all help would be greatly
appreciated.

Kevin.
--
Kevin K. Lewis             | My opinions may be unreasonable
kevinl@tisdec.tis.tandy.com| but such is the voice of inspiration
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: hoppie@kub.nl (Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers)
Subject: Linguistics and Smalltalk?
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 92 07:59:26 GMT
Organization: Tilburg University, Tilburg, The Netherlands

Hello world,

Anyone out there that uses Smalltalk for linguistic applications? I know
that interest in inheritance among linguists is rising, but their language-of-
choice to implement anything seems to be Prolog forever. Personally I am
fairly on the way of getting a Smalltalk linguistic application out the door
(research project) and I wonder if more people use Smalltalk for this.

Any reactions appreciated.


Jeroen

-- 
Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers, research engineer at     |  Stop connecting computers;
Infolab, Tilburg University, The Netherlands    |  start connecting people!
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: ak202576@sol.yorku.ca
Subject: Store image in disk ?
Organization: York University
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 06:11:26 GMT

I am using DigitTalk's SmallTalk/V for Windows, is any one can advise me
how can I store a object into disk and retrieve it back.  In DigitTalk's 
SmallTalk/V, I can "File out" a complete class into disk and rebuild the class
by reading the disk, however the object is stored in image (ie Memory) and
there's not any build in function in the system I can store the object 
into disk.
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: dockx@cs.kuleuven.ac.be (Jan Dockx)
Subject: Digitalk Email address
Reply-To: 'dockx@cs.kuleuven.ac.be (Jan Dockx)' 
Organization: Dept. Computerwetenschappen
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 12:26:07 GMT

Can anybody tell me Digitalk's Email address for commercial issues?

Jan (dockx@cs.kuleuven.ac.be)
From: neil@ogicse.cse.ogi.edu (Neil W. Van Dyke)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: CHG 0.3 is Available
Date: 19 Dec 92 06:33:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: ogicse.47531
Distribution: world
Organization: Oregon Graduate Institute, Computer Science & Engineering

As a final project in an object-oriented programming class, I wrote a graphical
class hierarchy browser for ObjectWorks\Smalltalk 4.1.

In case someone out there in netland might find it useful, it's available via
anon-ftp from "cse.ogi.edu", in the file "/pub/smalltalk/chg_0_3.tar.Z".

I will probably submit it to the Manchester archive once I get a chance.

-- 
Neil W. Van Dyke <> neil@cse.ogi.edu <> +1 503 690 1300
From: jgs@funsys.se (Jan Gifvars)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: Gemstone
Keywords: Gemstone
Date: 14 Dec 92 12:43:48 GMT
Reply-To: jgs@funsys.se
Organization: Enator Functional Systems AB.


Has anyone used Gemstone together with Smalltalk-80 or Smalltalk/V ?
Jan Gifvars
jgs@funsys.se



Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
From: hoppie@kub.nl (Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers)
Subject: Re: ST/V PM problems
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 92 13:42:45 GMT
Organization: Tilburg University, Tilburg, The Netherlands

In article <1992Dec15.082845.1578@uni2a.unige.ch>, dugerdil@uni2a.unige.ch writes:
|> Dear Netters,
|> 
|> As I run into problems with ST/V 1.4 on OS/2 every day, I wonder if
|> someone on the net is experiencing the same kind of problem.
|> I run ST/V PM version 1.4 on OS/2 2.0. From time to time the Smalltalk
|> system simply closes without any warning (but OS/2 does not crash). We
|> also have problems with I/O's: when saving source code into files, the
|> systems add some garbage at the end of the file (usually the end part
|> of the source code). As we experienced the same kind of problem with ENFIN/2 
|> (although less frequently) I would guess the problem is not that of ST/V...
|> 
|> When working under windows (ST/V 2.0) I was accustomed to work in a very
|> robust system. But I must admit that under OS/2 the system is much less
|> reliable.
|> 
|> Could that be a problem of OS/2 ?

Could be, but the OS/2 2.0 system is normally *very* reliable, and in my case
(and many others) much more reliable than Windows. E.g., if an app in Windows
crashes, it takes the system with it. Under OS/2 only your app crashes.

|> Would the problems come from the fact that we run the 16 bit version of ST/V
|> under the 32 bit version of ST/V ?

(you mean: 32-bit version of OS/2?)
Probably not. OS/2 2.0 contains almost all old 16-bit interface calls that are mapped
onto 32-bit calls internally. No severe problems about this thunking have been
reported yet.

|> Is the OS/2 versions of ST/V definitely less robust than the Windows version ?

Might be, but then you should complain to the ST/V manufacturer!

|> 
|> Thanks in advance for any comments on this

As OS/2 traps an application, in most cases the application really *is* at fault,
e.g. accessing memory that it does not own. If the PM version is a quick-and-dirty
port of the Windows version, there might be some bugs in the common code that
go unnoticed under Windows (well... they show up two hours later while running
WordPerfect :-) ).

Adding garbage at the end of files certainly is not an OS/2 problem because
all other apps do not have this problem. Alright it *can* be an OS/2 problem
but then Digitalk uses some very weird system call :-)

Do you have the CSD aka SP installed over your OS/2 GA release? The SP originated
somewhere in October. It consists of 14 diskettes that patch up the whole system.
After this upgrade, most problems dissapear in most cases with most people.
The CSD can be gotten off the normal OS/2 ftp sites such as ftp-os2.nmsu.edu .


Jeroen


-- 
Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers, research engineer at     |  Stop connecting computers;
Infolab, Tilburg University, The Netherlands    |  start connecting people!
From: jgs@funsys.se (Jan Gifvars)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: Foating point
Keywords: Mac, VisualWorks
Date: 18 Dec 92 12:17:01 GMT
Reply-To: jgs@funsys.se
Organization: Enator Functional Systems AB.

Hello !
Does anyone know if VisualWorks run on Machintosh without floating point unit.
Thanks in advance.


Jan Gifvars 
ENATOR Functional Systems AB
Box 1213
S-16428 Kista
+46 08 7036200
jgs@funsys.se
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: ST/V PM problems
From: dugerdil@uni2a.unige.ch
Date: 15 Dec 92 08:28:45 +0200
Organization: University of Geneva, Switzerland

Dear Netters,

As I run into problems with ST/V 1.4 on OS/2 every day, I wonder if
someone on the net is experiencing the same kind of problem.
I run ST/V PM version 1.4 on OS/2 2.0. From time to time the Smalltalk
system simply closes without any warning (but OS/2 does not crash). We
also have problems with I/O's: when saving source code into files, the
systems add some garbage at the end of the file (usually the end part
of the source code). As we experienced the same kind of problem with ENFIN/2 
(although less frequently) I would guess the problem is not that of ST/V...

When working under windows (ST/V 2.0) I was accustomed to work in a very
robust system. But I must admit that under OS/2 the system is much less
reliable.

Could that be a problem of OS/2 ?
Would the problems come from the fact that we run the 16 bit version of ST/V
under the 32 bit version of ST/V ?
Is the OS/2 versions of ST/V definitely less robust than the Windows version ?

Thanks in advance for any comments on this



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Philippe Dugerdil
Geneva/Switzerland

dugerdil@uni2a.unige.ch
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk