HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: raja@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Malur Ra Rajashekhar)
Subject: Re: language again
Keywords: uu, uu, uu
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 18:15:26 GMT


  Sanskrit is the mother of most of the Indian languages and 
hence in my opinion there is nothing wrong in using sanskritised
kannada.  The relationship is so old and so close that it hardly
makes a difference. Actually it adds to the beauty.

  Then whats wrong in using  anglicised kannada ? Well the 
difference lies in the perception of enrichment/growth. Can a totally
alien language like English really enrich Kannada ?  The real
enrichment can be done by coining new kannada words for such words
which don't have equivalents. For eg. 'Ganakayantra' has been coined 
for computers while it can mean a calculator as well. A language can
grow by creation of words instead of simply taking words from other
languages in toto.

 "tumba LATE agirodakke ishtondu TENSIONnu SAAR. eega URGENTagi BOSSge
PHONE madbeku...." 
  "TIME illa. tumba BUSY agibittiddene."
   Talking like this is quite common. But is this enrichment of the
language ? 

  Talking about "Right" and "Hold on" of Bangalore Conductors, I very
much remember one bus conductor who used to say "Nillisi Chaalakare"
and "Chalisiri Chaalakare" ! I used to laugh at him in my high school
days travelling from Minerva Circle to Vijaya High School. Even for
the bus stops, he used to shout "Kempu thotada pashchima dwara",
"upaadhyayiniyara vidyalaya", "Ashoka sthambha", "Rani saraladevi baalakiyara
proda shale", "Madhavan udyanavana "....... It was fun. The BTS kannada guide
uses these words. And I would prefer to use these words and words like
"Chalaka" and "Nirvahaka" atleast while writing in Kannada.
From: ravi@panini.eecs.umich.edu (C. V. Ravishankar)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: Re: language again
Keywords: uu, uu, uu
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:40:37 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: University of Michigan EECS Dept., Ann Arbor

In article <1992Oct2.021951.24951@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> raja@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Malur Ra Rajashekhar) writes:
>In article 180, Naveen writes :
>  Words like pencillu, pennu, paperu, bottlu, booku ......
>Can some one comment on this.
>
>Its a pity that these words have become kannada words !
>There are words like Lekhani, Kaagada, Sheeshe, Pustaka etc. which
>after sometime may eventually vanish owing to the usage of such words.


Languages grow by assimilation, so there's isn't much one can do about
colloquial use of loan words, or the their subsequent importation into
more formal forms.  Kannada is a Dravidian language, but we accept the
large Sanskritic vocabulary within the formal Kannada in vogue today.
We even formally recognize this phenomenon by noting the "tatsama" and
"tadbhava" versions of such words.

Usage often changes imported words, and pretty soon we cease to recognize
them as of foreign origin.

In your list of Kannada words listed above, at least two are of Persian
origin.  "Kaagada" is a derivative of "kaghaz" and "sheeshe" is exactly
as in Persian.  Other Persian words in Kannada that we have long ceased
to recognize as foriegn include such words as "saamaanu" ("saamaan" in
P.), "sumaaru" ("shomareh" = number, count in P.), "raja" ("reza"=leave
in P.), "jameenu" ("zameen" in P.), "raajeenaame" ("raazeenaameh" in P.),
and "jartaari" ("zar taari"= golden threaded in P.).  The words "reshmi"
and "sarkara" are both of Persian origin, as are a preponderance of words
in the military ("sipahi", "pyade", "topu") and administrative ("jille",
"arji") vocabularies.  Some of these have even come from Arabic through
Persian into Kannada.  I'm sure we'd find hundreds of such words.

And if there comes a day when we eliminate all English words from Kannada
usage, I do wonder what Bangalore bus conductors will do to replace the
highly effective "ray-ht" and "whol-dane"?!


-- C. V. Ravishankar
From: bkrishna@enuxva.eas.asu.edu (Balachandra Krishnaswamy)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: H4 visa
Date: 1 Oct 92 00:48:27 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Arizona State University


Hi Everybody,

	I am sorry to post this on this net. I am not getting
any response from culture.indian net. So, I thought this posting
might help.

		I recently got my H1 visa. I am planning to get
my wife on H4. Can you tell me what are the papers necessary for
my wife to take to the consulate. Also, I like to know how the 
scene is right now for H4.

My wife is a MBBS doctor passed out recently. Any tips about 
what she should respond to the queries about her degree? 

Please respond to krishna@fileserver.wco.ftp.com OR krishna@ftp.com

Dhanya vada galu,


Bala Krishna.
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: p0j2684@tamuts.tamu.edu (Pradeep Jana)
Subject: POWER SITUATION
Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 23:47:29 GMT

Hi all,

	It is indeed a very stimulating topic that has been brought up in
discussion.  More importantly, a very needed one.

	From what I remember about the southern grid, there is always a
short supply of power from Tamil Nadu to Karnataka (than the actual share
due to Karnataka).  This is true particularly in view of two major central
investments in TN power generation - Neyveli (NLC) and Kalpakkam atomic
power.  This being the situation, (there is always bickering about the 
exchange of water & power between the two states) a more wise solution for
the state is probably to draw a higher central investment in the power sector.
Also, if I remember right, the figures quoted by Bhanu Shankar about power
imported from TN is correct. 

Thanx and bye

Pradeep Jana
jana@eemips.tamu.edu


Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: bernd@cc.uow.edu.au (Bernd Wechner)
Subject: Make a friend today, send a postcard to Oz ...
Organization: University Of Wollongong
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 04:32:42 GMT

I just started to stick some old postcards on the wall at home and found
it growing into a very interesting collage, or wallpaper of sorts even. A 
great deal of interest value and a dash of nostalgia for me personally as 
well. Now although I had a fair stack, I was a little surprised at how small 
a postcard is and how large a wall is. 

So, I'd like to invite you to send me a postcard for which I will:

a) be eternally grateful
b) send one back (if desired)
c) invite you around for a cup of tea, a chat and even to stay a few days 
   (if you like ...)

Just think, you'll make your mark on my wall, and my life, and maybe
even make a friend for life. Or then again, maybe just a postcard for
your own wall ;-).

To join the revolution, just mail a postcard to me here:

Bernd Wechner
5 Charles Avenue
Minnamurra 2532
Australia

Remembering to include your own name and address if you like and see
what interesting things you can add to that. 

All the best then, and here's hoping we have some friendly people with
some motivation in the audience tonight ;-).

Ciao,

Bernd.
From: r3s@ecl.psu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: KEB - Kallaru Ella Banni !!
Date: 27 Sep 92 04:19:22 GMT
Organization: Engineering Computer Lab, Pennsylvania State University


Well this is an eternal problem and as long as the essential serivice sector
like power, water, and gas is in the hands of govt. especially run by crooks
like Bangarappa, we have very little hope. The power plants are run at very 
low efficiency and added to that is whopping transmission loss. The very idea
of govt. managing power (KEB , which my friend used to call "Kallaru Ella
Banni" and Karnataka power "corruption") is ridiculous. It's time we open up 
power, water and public transportation  to private sectors                    
management and look at how things are going to improve. In Bombay, where Tata
Electric manages power supply, they hardly have any problem on that belt.
We must take a leaf from this country in that matter - privatisation is what
works ! 
 
Ravi
 
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: raja@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Malur Ra Rajashekhar)
Subject: Re: language again
Keywords: uu, uu, uu
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 22:58:29 GMT


In article 192, Srinivasan talks about 'person who used to do
calculation ....'
In villages, the village accountant was the so called 'shanbhog' 
he was also termed 'grama lekkhiga' ...
As for accountants in courts/businesses ....

In 193, he says about 'net'
we can use 'bale' (jedara bale - spider's net) or 'jaala'
probably 'yantra jaala' ?

 forum of discussion - 'vedike' such as 'vichara vedike'
probably 'yantrika vedike' ? or 'vidyuth vedike' ??

In article 194, Ravi says :

"One can't legislate a language, or alter popular trends even by passionate
argument.  Incorporation of loan words is a natural process, and has always
happened, and with all languages, and at all times.   Assimilation of loan
words simply does not occur unless a language is being enriched in the
process.  It makes no difference whether the new words come from Sanskrit
or from Bantu."

If it is loan words which are assimilated, it is different, but I wonder
how and where one could draw the 'lakshmana rekhe'. It is definitely in
our hands to use existing words. We seem to be too prone to outside
influence unlike others, bengalis for example. I don't think written
bengali has many 'foreign' words. Just a survey - about what percentage
of bengalis write letters in bengali to home from here and what
percentage of us do the same (I mean, write in kannada, and not bengali !)
- we lack that love toward our language and often term our neighbours as
'fanatics'.

Tamil probably has not been affected by sanskrit. Is it poorer becuase
of not assimilating ?  

Talking about 'prakrit' , it is often quoted that 
"prakrutihi samskritam; tatra bhavam, tata aagatam vaa prakritam "

Prakrit is sanskrit spoken in a crude form by people / sanskrit is a
cultured, disciplined prakrit.

Terming 'panini' as being responsible for the death of sanskrit is 
hard to take. Many  'natural language processing' and 'machine
translation' groups, I have seen, regard 'panini's framework' very
suitable for their work today. For that matter, your machine is
termed 'Panini' ! 

Ravi, you have talked about vedic sanskrit and so on ... Let us keep our
difference over language assimilation apart, could you write something
about origin of languages ... specifically with respect to kannada if
you have any information ?


In article 196, Ananda Vardhana says 

"It is the same old repeating history. Parents when the kids are young to
facilitate themselves throw the kids in to Day Cares and when they grow big
and start dating crib! They neither know the language, nor understand the
culture."

very true !

And I congratulate your four year old daughter.

#######################################################################

Malur R Rajashekhar
Visiting Scholar                       "Jenina Holeyo Haalina Maleyo
Department of Civil Engineering         Sudheyo Kannada Savinudiyu"
The Johns Hopkins University
Baltimore, MD 21218

########################################################################
From: naveen@Autodesk.COM (Naveen Chandra)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: language again
Keywords: uu, uu, uu
Date: 1 Oct 92 23:40:08 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Autodesk Inc., Sausalito CA, USA



   Looking (listening) to kannada it seems like we add uu uu's at
the end of most words. Does pure Kannada dictate this or is it just
phonetics. Most of these words also seem to be from english or other
languages.

  Words like pencillu, pennu, paperu, bottlu, booku ......
 
Can some one comment on this.
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: krishna@seas.smu.edu (Sanjay Krishna)
Subject: Re : Power hungry Karnataka  
Organization: School of Engineering and Applied Science
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 01:29:34 GMT


I am sorry to nit-pick on two articles - by Bhanu Shankar and by Pradeep
Jana. But at the same time let us keep our articles TECHNICALLY SOUND.
You simply cannot allocate MW to any state or any place for that matter.
You have to allocate units of power - kilowatt hours or whatever. Could
it possibly be 40 Million units of power  and not 40 MW ? 

I am also fully aware that sometimes Karnataka has not received its 
share of power from central power stations. 

Sanjay 

Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: paulchem@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Atharvan)
Subject: Hey anybody from good old belgaum ?
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 07:51:05 GMT

1] Anybody from belgaum out there ?
   Would love to get some info from someone from there on e-mail
   about my second most favourite city. The first one is of course
   you guessed it: Bangalore.

   Really would like to talk about belgaum.
   Someday will write article.

   I was in belgaum, st.pauls and g.s.s. college till 1984.
   Things must have changed a lot now.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
.   Rain makes me remember,                                                .
.   The sunset of that golden hour,                                        .
.   When my eyes were first opened,                     Paul Chemmanoor    .
.   And I saw your eyes, No longer blind.                   Boulder.       .
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: raja@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Malur Ra Rajashekhar)
Subject: Re: language again
Keywords: uu, uu, uu
Organization: HAC - Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 02:19:51 GMT

In article 180, Naveen writes :
  Words like pencillu, pennu, paperu, bottlu, booku ......
Can some one comment on this.

Its a pity that these words have become kannada words !
There are words like Lekhani, Kaagada, Sheeshe, Pustaka etc. which
after sometime may eventually vanish owing to the usage of such words.

There exists a difference between 'maataaduva kannada' and 'bareyuva 
kannada'.  The 'maataaduva kannada' is more adulterated because of the
influence of other languages and if the trend continues we will lose
most of the words in kannada and 'bareyuva kannada' would also be full
of such words.  Does anybody use the word 'duravaani' ? 'Telephone' has
become the replacement possibly in other languages as well.

If one sees as issue of 'Amerikannada', one can have a feel for the level
of this adulteration. May be this is a foreign land and excuses can be
made. But this is not only here. Even in Karnataka, some of the 
neonovelists use a similar language. May be one can use such words when a
kannada word for that word is very difficult to get or can not be thought
of. But even for very simple words, we often see usage of words from other
languages. And ultimately, the language suffers.

And with most of the present generation children being educated in english
I can't even think of the 'sirigannada' which future generations read, let
alone speak.


Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka,alt.culture.kerala,alt.culture.tamil,alt.culture.tuva,alt.culture.us.asian-indian
From: cgordon@vpnet.chi.il.us (gordon hlavenka)
Subject: Re: Make a friend today, send a postcard to Oz ...
Organization: Vpnet Public Access
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 1992 04:31:05 GMT

 bernd@cc.uow.edu.au (Bernd Wechner) writes:
>So, I'd like to invite you to send me a postcard for which I will:

Bernd, meet Craig Shergold :-)

-- 
----------------------------------------------------
Gordon S. Hlavenka           cgordon@vpnet.chi.il.us
  Don't forget:  Dave Barry/Joe Walsh in November!
Xref: sparky alt.culture.karnataka:76 soc.culture.indian:33064
From: kgh@ulysses.att.com (Krishna G. Hegde[jgr])
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka,soc.culture.indian
Subject: Visit to BADAMI, HAMPI and BELUR-HALEBEEDU
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:36:38 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Murray Hill, NJ, USA


Hi folks:

A friend of mine who doesn't have access to the net is going to visit India 
very soon, and he wants to travel by train only if possible due to his 
health condition and restrictions.  He wants to visit  

                      BADAMI, HAMPI & HALEBEEDU 

I want to make sure that his travel route is most efficient 
and also, he needs names of good Hotels around these areas.  I would 
appreciate the following information:

1.  Most efficient route to visit all three places(starting from say 
    Bombay or bangalore) by train; please include names of train 
    stations and jucntions to change etc.

2.  Names of good Hotels for lodging and boarding.

3.  A place or agency or telephone number in U.S or India where all 
    this info can be obtained easily.

4.  Any other info or suggestion given these objectives.


Thank you and please e-mail to me at

                 kgh@ulysses.att.com
From: sanjay@cray.com (+Sanjay Krishnamurthy)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: Re: Make a friend today, send a postcard to Oz ...
Keywords: Bogus
Date: 30 Sep 92 16:53:51 GMT
Organization: Cray Research Superservers Inc., San Diego CA, USA

I am still trying to figure out what the hell this posting
is all about. Yeah, yeah, yeah-make a friend in, oh lets
see, AUSTRALIA!!! Yenu-valle Malleswaram ninda Palyakka
hogoon tharaha aadthaane. Actually, if you want friends,
Bernd, why don't you write to:
      Raj K. Gulati
      AMS Matrimonial Services
      Somewhere in USA
From what people have written on the net, it appears
he represents an integral part of Indian
culture(??!!!)

Guruve, kaapaadi....
-Sanjay M. Krishnamurthy
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: st1s0@rosie.uh.edu (Hans, Samir)
Subject: Help:Want Email ad of IIM B'lore & A'bad
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 22:47:00 GMT

Hi guys,

Is there anyone out there who knows the email address of the IIM's at
B'lore and A'bad? Please let me know, I am desparate! Would be very
grateful.

Regards,
Samir Hans.
From: r3s@ecl.psu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: Professional education for sale in Karnataka
Date: 29 Sep 92 16:35:19 EDT
Organization: Engineering Computer Lab, Pennsylvania State University

	
	Recently KA CM Bangarappa sanctioned 9 engg. colleges, some more in
Bangalore and not very coincidentally some run by liquor kings. Looks like 
there will be more engg. colleges in B'lore than nursery and primary schools 
within a few years. The quality of professional education in the state has 
gone down considerably thanks to mushrooming of colleges based on capitation 
fee. Many of these colleges (B'lore alone had 12 engg. colleges, which 
may go up now to 18 or 20 !!) don't have proper infrastructure to impart 
professional education. Some don't even have qualified people to teach
the courses. They just turn out substandard graduates diluting the quality of
professional manpower considerably. Sometimes even harmful, like a doctor 
from one of these colleges who starts his own practice with his half baked 
knowledge ! Is there a solution to this problem ?

Raviprakash
From: srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: Power Hungry Karnataka
Date: 1 Oct 92 14:08:17 GMT
Reply-To: srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca (K.Srinivasan)
Organization: IREQ, Hydro-Quebec, QC, Canada
Originator: srini@acr

I thought the Nuclear and fossil power stations were installed
in states with poor hydro electric potential. If the production
from such plants were to be shared with those with higher hydro
potential, I suppose the hydro-electric production is also to be
shared.

That apart, this discussion would have lot more meaning, if the
figures for the following are presented.
Percapita kwh production for Karnataka:
Percapita kwh production for India:
Percapita kwh production for the TN:
Could Sanjay Krishna find out these figures, if he can please?
I have the population figures, but not electricity production.
I read in an article from IISc, that electricity is very in-efficiently
used in India. The wastage is enormous, particularly in the industrial
usage in Karnataka.

In North America, nuclear power production is getting phased out.
Its safety is still unsettled. Chernobyl and Three mile island
are not forgotten. Kalpakkam, located close to urban centre,
has been cited as a potential time bomb by many. Those, who are
so keen on getting 'their share' of power production, I doubt
if would be prepared for their share of disaster. I doubt even if
they would even shed their share of tears for the neighbour,
if ever such a disaster strikes.

K. Srinivasan  srini@ireq-num.hydro.qc.ca
From: naveen@Autodesk.COM (Naveen Chandra)
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
Subject: Re: Looking for these persons
Date: 1 Oct 92 23:47:55 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Autodesk Inc., Sausalito CA, USA




>> In a previous article, Venkatachalam Aruna <aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu> said:
>> :-  I tried everyother possibility to locate these persons but every effort
>> :- went futile.As a last resort, I'm posting here in the net. So, refrain 
>> :- from flaming.

   
 
    Isn't it mildly ironic that if these persons wanted to meet you, they
  would have found you by now, before you got desperate. :) :) :) :)



AWWWwwww!! just kidding. Good luck finding them.
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: sbale@netcom.com (Swamy S. Bale)
Subject: Kannada movies....
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 92 05:40:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

Hi Kannada Bandhugale,

I am looking for some good movies, released after 1987.(That's when I left
India). I have seen couple of movies acted by Ananta Nag, "Ganeshana Madhuve"
"Gowri Ganesha". I enjoyed them and also heard one more movie called
"Ondu cinema kathe" is being made by the same director. Have anybody seen
that?

Can anybody recommend good kannada video stores in Bay Area? I have
been to Spiceland and Mailbag, but looking for other stores who has 
wide variety of kannada movies.

I would appreciate any kind of suggestions.      

vandanegalu

Swamy S. Bale
Newsgroups: alt.culture.karnataka
From: scn8120@zeus.tamu.edu (NANJUNDAIAH, SHASHIDHAR CHANN)
Subject: FORT HAYS ST. U. - HELP WANTED
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 18:43:00 GMT

KannaDa bandhugaLalli vinanti.

	I have got admission to the COMMUNICATION dept.( MS ), Spring 93. 
I need to get some info about the school and moving in.  Could someone help 
me in this regard?  Please send mail to

		SCN8120@ZEUS.TAMU.EDU

Thanx and bye.

Shashidhar