From: tak@leland.Stanford.EDU (David William Budd)
Subject: Re: Tibet: People Continue to Hope [forwarded article]
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 93 02:07:00 GMT

In article <93Jan24.141758est.150@orasis.vis.toronto.edu> liuyh@vis.toronto.edu (Yuanhui Liu) writes:
>In article <1993Jan24.024907.22103@leland.Stanford.EDU> tak@leland.Stanford.EDU (David William Budd) writes:
>>In article <1993Jan23.021239.6083@bnlux1.bnl.gov> ping@bnlux1.bnl.gov (Shiping Zhang) writes:
>>>In article <C166I5.LAC@ulowell.ulowell.edu> cshi@cs.ulowell.edu (Chunde Shi) writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Tibet was part of China since 13xx, Tibet had representative in KMT's
>>>>government before 1949. You guys using manufacured issue on Tibet, trying to
>>>>equate that with colonilism of yours, to alleviate your responsibility on
>>>>past colonial crimes, because China was/is a major country that supported many

>>
>>Tibet is interesting for one other very important reason. In the early
>>1950's, the CCP negotiated a programme very similar
>>to the "one country, two systems" set-up in Hongkong. Tibet
>>was promised a number of things such as non-interference in religion,
>>and a great deal of autonomy, much as Hongkong people have been
>>promised. Unfortunately, talk and practise have not been the 
>>same. The PRC has on many occasions violated the terms
>>of the agreement. Tibet is an important indicator
>>of China's actons after 30.6.97.
>>
>I wonder since during 1950-51 the PLA routed the local Tibetan forces,
>entered Larsa, and since they obviously are ruthless bunch of liers and
>murderers like you said, why bother negiotiate an agreement with
>Dalai Lama?  why not shoot him then and there, since Tibet had nothing
>to negoiate with?  While at it, why do the Communist put PanChen Lama
>back on his rightful Throne which his peer Dalai took away from him
>and force him into exile?  or they can get rid of Dalai, dethrone
>him and his supporting nobles, like Yuan, Qing dynasties did it
>before, and install some other wet-behind-the-ear 2 year old,
>(come to think of it, how to you prove the current Dalai or the
>way before him the "real" living budda?  didn't the Qing Emperor(aka "invader"
>got rid of the "real" one a couple of re-incarnations ago?  if
>so the current one is a fake!  ;-> )  
>and "God-King No. 2"  Panchen be his teacher by right & tradition, they 
>ought to brain-wash the little brat to be very grateful to Panchen 
>and loyal to his "chinese invaders".   
>
>oh, how stupid the the "invaders" are, allow both Dalai and Panchen
>to keep their titles, and travel aboard to India freely in the 50s,
>continue have influence in government, hesitate on land reform,
>fearing it would really piss off the nobles(which they later did), 
>which is the real power behind the boy god-King.   
>
>>Just a thought..
>
>just another thought.  
>>
>
>


Oh. I am so sorry to have mistaken the history of the relations
between the PLA and Tibet. I see the error of my ways, now.
The PLA "routed" the tibetan forces for the good of tibet.

Actually, I never accused the CCP of being "murderers and liars."
Please. Check my post. I simply pointed out a fact. That
Peking has not always lived up to the terms of its agreement
with the gov't in Lhasa. While it is true that the
PLA was under no obligation whatsoever to give any terms
to the government in Tibet other than its own, {it
conquered, after all} it DID make an agreement.

Likewise, the CCP was really under no obligation to give terms
to HK either. We all know that the PRC has the right after 1997
to take back the so-called "New Territories." Also, it
is true that the PRC could take back not only the NT, but
Kow Loon and HK island as well, and without firing a shot.

Politicians, however, are the same everywhere. Whether
in the UK, the US or China, they all try to maintain
the illusion that they are not motivated solely
by the interests of their state. To summarily
execute all of the Dalai Lama's men would not
have been a shrewd move at the time. This type of total
victory is rare. (recall, the US did not exectute Emperor
Hirohito of Japan in 1945, although it certainly had the
power to do so. The overrun of Japan was much, MUCH more 
compleat than that of the PLA in Tibet.

I did not call the leaders in China liars and murderes. I simply
called them politicians, which is what they are. I called a 
spade a spade.
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