HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dwl@watson.ibm.com (David W. Levine)
Subject: Snowmaking while skiers are skiing (Was Re: KILLINGTON OPEN?)
Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1992 20:29:54 GMT
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: dwl@watson.ibm.com 
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM Thomas J. Watson Research Center

It's not unusual for an east coast ski area to have guns running on open
trails. Early in the season, in particular, a lot of places will have
the guns going full tilt while people are skiing. For exmaple, in the
early going, Killington has a very specific plan to expand terrain. They have
enough capacity to make snow on all the open terrain *and* a fair lot of
closed terrain. Most of the big snowmaking hills have similar abilities.
As they get more and more terrain open (And maybe get some natural snow,
and it stays cold) they reach a point where they can't make snow on all the
terrain at once, and don't want to. If it's a good season, they will be
making snow in concentrated blasts on parts of the mountain, often closing
trails mid week. A lot depends on how well the "moneymaking" runs are
covered, and what the weather looks like for the upcoming week. I've
seen several east coast resorts making snow like mad in the middle of
snow storms, when the forecast showed rain or warm conditions for later
on that week. 

Early in the season, I expect to find trails with snow guns going and dress
for it, and look over the mountain carefully, before picking trails to ski. 
These days, I try to pick my days of eastern skiing so I don't have to
ski in the
guns, but it's still the best way to get the legs in shape, and bad
skiing beats
good staying at home :-)

p.s. Killington's  back closed, but it's supposed to be *COLD* starting
tonight,
so I'd expect them back open any day now.




David W. Levine --  dwl@watson.ibm.com  -- IBM Thomas J. Watson Research Center
                   -- My Opinions, IBM's hardware. -- 
"Fanaticism consists in redoubling your efforts when you have forgotten your
aim" - George Santayana  
From: mike@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Mike McNelly)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 16:45:16 GMT
Subject: Re: Ski Vacation
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.skiing

> Dear Skiers,
> 
> We are planning to take a family ski vacation during sometime in Dec.
> (When schools are closed).
> 
> Two of my children are expert-advanced intermediate,
> myself is an intermediate, and my wife is a beginner.
> We would like to ski together sometimes and use the same lift
> lines. 
> 
> With a limited budget, we plan to visit a ski resort for a week.
> Do you have any suggestions which place is the best for our case?
> 
> Places considered are: Vail, Beaver Creek, Keystone, Big Sky, Aspen.
> I am afraid that Vail and Beaver Creek might be too expensive for
> family vacation. Aspen may be too far from Denver Air port.
> By the way we plan to fly from Michigan.
> 
> If you have used some ski package and enjoyed it, such
> information can be useful too.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> ---Moon Jung   chung@cps.msu.edu
> 
> 

Moon,

Aspen is possibly the most expensive of all of the areas you mentioned.
Drive time probably isn't relevent since you can fly directly to Aspen
(or very nearby) via commercial carrier.

Some alternatives:

1) Summit county.  If you stay in Silverthorne, Keystone or Breckenridge
you are within 20 minutes of three separate areas (Breckenridge,
Keystone, Arapahoe Basin).  I believe there's still a free shuttle bus
from most condo areas to these areas although you might find driving
quicker in the morning.  Winter Park is 30-45 minutes from Silverthorne.
These are big areas with a lot of diverse skiing, particularly for
intermediates.

2) Steamboat.  Served by commercial air carriers, too.  It has a wide
diversity of skiing.  It also has a real town nearby if you tire of the
glitz.

Mike McNelly
mike@fc.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: geoff@pmafire.inel.gov (Geoff Allen)
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 92 16:32:05 GMT
Organization: Roller Coaster fanatic with no hope for a cure
Subject: Re: Lift prices roll toward $50
Summary: 
Followup-To: 
Organization: Roller Coaster fanatic with no hope for a cure
Keywords: 

<ssh@vnet.ibm.com> writes:
>Condensed from today's Denver Post (2 Oct 92), page 1 of the Business News
>section:
>				       
>			  Lift prices roll toward $50
>			  ---------------------------
[Stuff deleted]
>"`A complaint about price is really a complaint about unmet expectations,'
>said Bob Kunkel, Winter Park's vice president of marketing."

No, when I complain about the price, it's really wishing that my wife
and I could go skiing for a day, and buy lunch, for under $50, total.

My ``expectations'' are really quite minimal.  I'm *not* looking for a
Sun Valley/Aspen/Vail/Whatever experience.  I just want to ski and eat a
disgustingly greasy burger that costs less than $5.  That's all.

>CU professor Chuck Goeldner is quoted as saying that lift ticket prices
>are, "one of the finest values in America today." 

Compared to what?  A full day at *any* amusement park in the country is
cheaper than $50.  In most cases, *much* cheaper.

>He comments that lift ticket prices cover lift installation,
>parking, shuttle service, on-mountain facilities, maintenance, and ski patrol
>services. 

And amusement park prices cover ride installation, parking (well, it's
often a couple of bucks extra), in-park facilities, maintenance,
security/first aid services, and the ever-popular liability insurance.

>"However, consumers' demands for more value means resorts must find ways to
>offer the ski experience at a price attractive to both the skilled, full-day
>skier and the skier who chooses to ski -- and pay -- for just a few hours a
>day, Kunkel said."

They just don't get it.  I want to pay for fewer ``services'' and ski
all day.

I think it's time to finally get some skinny skis.

I know, it's capitalism in action, and I shouldn't complain because
*someone* is obviously willing to pay these prices.  But I will be
sticking to lesser-known, lesser-overdeveloped, and lesser-priced places.  
Or heading off into the woods.  A day of skiing just isn't worth $100+
to me.

Geoff, disgusted with ski resorts and their associated price tags.

-- 
Geoff Allen          \  Usenet is distributed network anarchy at its best---
uunet!pmafire!geoff   \   or worst, depending on what is posted on any
geoff@pmafire.inel.gov \   particular day.   --David Fiedler in _Byte_
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: rbalko@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (robert.a.balko)
Subject: Nordica Boots (F8)
Organization: AT&T
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 19:22:24 GMT
Keywords: recommendations


I'm shopping for boots (among other things) and Fred (the salesguy)
recommended the Nordica F8 for about $300. They felt ok,
but being pretty new to the scene I don't know have a benchmark
to go from.   Anybody have any comments about this boot
or any others I SHOULD take a look at.  I'll be using them for
high intermediate to expert skiing.

Thanks!
rbalko@attmail.com

And now back to the regularly scheduled Texans/Snowmaking discussion...
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: michael9@cs.mun.ca (Michael Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Skiing in the Rain
Organization: CS Dept., Memorial University of Newfoundland
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 20:36:01 GMT

cloyd_j@apollo.hp.com (John Cloyd) writes:

>    Some years rain is the predominant condition
>in New England, so you pretty much have to ski

  Here in Newfoundland we get lots of strange weather, which is why it useful
to hit the slopes prepared for anything!

  The last day of the ski season last year (the rain pretty much finished off
the slopes) was...different.  First the fog was so thick that you couldn't see
five feet in front of you.  I felt like I should have been wearing a foghorn.
The the rain came.  And did it ever come down.  The mogul run turned into
river (imagine the water running between all the bumps).  We have one run 
called Cascades - kind of ironic.

  The worst of it is when you're on the chair lift and it comes to a halt.  It
seemed to rain hardest at those points.

  But how did we keep dry?  We didn't.  Everyone who was a true skier got 
soaked.  But it was warm rain, and everyone had a good time.

  Anyone else care to describe their rainy ski experiences?

  BTW, for those not in the know, Newfoundland is Canada's most eastern
provice, and some would describe the island as just a big rock sticking
out of the Atlantic ocean.

-- 
|uunet!garfield!michael9|'"Proof denies faith and without faith I am nothing,"|
|michael9@odie.cs.mun.ca| says God.  "But you have given us proof," says      |
|POB 756,St.John's,Nfld.| man, "Therefore you do not exist. QED." "Oh, my,"   |
|A1S 1G8                | says God, and disappears in a puff of logic.'       |
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: snarfett@athena.mit.edu (Nicole A Harris)
Subject: Re: Boots recommendations wanted
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 18:08:50 GMT


>Ok. Fit is the single most important concern when purchasing boots.
>Now, what about other features? How useful is the "walking position" feature?
>Any opinions on the Rossignol/Lange Mid series? 
>
>Also,
>What are the respective nationalities of ski equipment companies?
>Raichele--Sweden?
>K2?
>Rossignol--French?
>Nordica?
>Saloman?.
>.
>.
>
>
>Thanks for any help,
>-hd


I have Lange's Mid 4.8.  I like them.  The only thing I wish they
had was forward lean adjust.  I don't think the 'walking position'
makes much difference.  That same button also makes it easier to 
get into the boots but it is already pretty easy.  In the newer models
you only have to open the middle buckle for the 'walking position'.
That should be better than the button.  I would buy the Lange Mid 5.5
if I was going to buy another Mid type of boot.

'respective nationalities of ski equipment companies'
Raichle- Swiss
K2- USA
Rossi-French
Nordica-?
Salomon-French
Kastle-Austrian
Fischer-Austrian
Dynamic-French
Dynastar-French
Elan-Yugoslavian
Blizzard-Austrian
Atomic-French?
Pre-USA
RD-USA
Voelkl-German
Lange-Italian (I think Rossi bought Lange so now it is French?)
Tecnica-Italian
Munari-Italian

Is that enough?  

Happy Skiing!
From: spud@beaner.cs.wisc.edu (Pat Splinter)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Lake Tahoe?
Date: 6 Oct 92 15:17:02 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison -- Computer Sciences Dept.

Hi folks,

I have an offer to ski Lake Tahoe next March (real cheap). I was 
wondering what the conditions were like the last few years. I If 
anyone has skied there and could give me an opinion of the conditions,
I would appreceiate it.

Please reply e-mail spud@cs.wisc.edu

Thanks ps
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: gerber@solbourne.com (Andrew Gerber)
Subject: Re: Snow in Colorado!
Organization: ParcPlace Boulder
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 23:34:26 GMT

In article <BvpKtw.8Cs@solbourne.com> gerber@solbourne.com (Andrew Gerber) writes:
>
>Vermont may have beaten us this year, but the snow is starting to fall
>in Colorado's high country.  A friend in Montezuma (outside of
>Keystone) said it was snowing yesterday afternoon about 4:30PM

It has been pointed out to me that Colorado had snow in August; let me
rephrase the above as "Killington may have beaten us this year", as no
lifts are running in Colorado yet.

It snows every month (even July) in Montezuma, CO; at 10,600 feet a
cold rain will turn into snow. My point was, I guess, that the real
winter storms are starting in the Colorado mounatins; it's the snow
from these storms that will form the base for the 92-93 ski season.

Andy
-- 
/-----------------------------------------------------------------/
/ Andy Gerber		     / gerber@solbourne.com [for a while] /
/ ParcPlace Boulder, formerly Solbourne Software Business Unit    /
/-----------------------------------------------------------------/
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu (Chris Webster)
Subject: Re: MPG & Re: roof racks ?
Reply-To: chris@chinook.atd.ucar.edu
Organization: Research Aviation Facility, NCAR, Boulder, CO
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 14:54:25 GMT

In article 9838@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU, von@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Steve Von Worley) writes:
>
>There isn't a drop of water within 200 miles of Taos, except on the
>Native American reservation, and only because they do rain dances.
>

Bzzzt.  Thanx for playing, next contestant.  Typical peaks these
days on the Rio Grande is over 2000 cfs at Taos, albiet very short
peaks (last week of may).

>Steve
>-- 
>Steve Von Worley
>von@cory.berkeley.edu
>Computer Science Gradual Student
>University of California at Berzerkly
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Re: Skiing in the rain
From: carlson@dwp.la.ca.us (Carlson Peters x7898)
Date: 28 Sep 92 23:11:04 GMT
Organization: L.A. Dept. of Water & Power

>Does anyone have any suggestions as to what to wear in the way of a ski pant
>for those rainy days when it is important to stay dry? The pants I wear during
>the cold weather would not be bad except that at the start and the finish of
>the season they are just too hot to wear. So what do all you people wear?

Well, here in So. Cal we get our share of extremely wet snow and rain
so I have gotten ample oportunities to test out my ski pants.  They're
made by Killey and have a special ceramic coating.  When they get wet,
they look totally soaked on the outside but keep me relatively warm
and dry on the inside.  They are also thin and light but do a great
job of keeping me warm on cold, windy days.  They are pretty plain
looking and come in a conservative assortment of colors (blue, black,
red) but are definitely worth the $220 or so I paid for them.  They
seem to be cut like a pair of 501's.  I think it would be pretty hard
to find them on sale as they are made in limited quantities and are
usually sold out around here by mid season.  I was turned on to them
by a Powder garment review that touted the same virtues I extoll here.
The only negative was the belt buckle, which tends to slip.  I
replaced the whole belt with a leather model of my liking which gives
them even more of a 501 look.  Killey makes jackets to match too.



-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Carlson Peters			L.A. Dept. of Water & Power
carlson@manta.dwp.la.ca.us	111 N. Hope St., Room 1129
213.481.7898			L.A. CA 90012
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: eugene@wilbur.nas.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya)
Subject: Re: archive servers : recommendations
Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 21:01:59 GMT
Distribution: rec.skiing

I gave Walt Haas code for an archive server, but for the purposes of Area
info rather than old articles.  He chose to use FTP instead (which most
people don't have, but tough, get your employer to get full Internet
facilities [not cheap]).  Other sites wanting to broadcast area info
can have it (it was used for the graf-bib server, you can use netlib code
as well).

--eugene miya, NASA Ames Research Center, eugene@orville.nas.nasa.gov
  Resident Cynic, Rock of Ages Home for Retired Hackers
  {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene
Second Favorite email message: Returned mail: Cannot send message for 3 days
A Ref: Mathematics and Plausible Reasoning, vol. 1, G. Polya
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: parkyn@fraser.sfu.ca (Dale Parkyn)
Subject: Re: Blackcomb opening?
Keywords: When? 
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 21:03:57 GMT

Sooner rather than later.  I hope, I hope, I hope, I hope, I hope.
From: mhoyt@crchh47.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Michael Hoyt)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: BOOT Recommendation:TECHINCA  Re: Nordica Boots (F8)
Date: 6 Oct 92 20:49:52 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research, Richardson, Tx

In article <1992Oct6.192224.25591@cbnewsk.cb.att.com>, rbalko@cbnewsk.cb.att.com
(robert.a.balko) writes:
|> 
|> I'm shopping for boots (among other things) and Fred (the salesguy)
|> recommended the Nordica F8 for about $300. They felt ok,
|> but being pretty new to the scene I don't know have a benchmark
|> to go from.   Anybody have any comments about this boot
|> or any others I SHOULD take a look at.  I'll be using them for
|> high intermediate to expert skiing.
|> 
|> Thanks!
|> rbalko@attmail.com
|> 
|> And now back to the regularly scheduled Texans/Snowmaking discussion...

When considering boots, consider the difference between front and rear entry.  

Rear Entry boots will try to sell you on comfort and ease of getting on and off.
They are easy to get on and off and they are comfortable.  The problem that I have
experienced with Rear Entry boots is that it is difficult to get a good snug 
firm hold on your foot.  

A salesmen once described the difference between Rear and Front entry boot: A rear 
entry boot attempts to hold your foot in place via INTERNAL mechanisms (cables and 
plates).  The shell is just a shell.  A front entry (or buckle front) boot 
uses the shell to hold your foot in place.  I have never owned a rear-entry 
boot but have rented or barrowed them enough to feel very strongly about
front entry boots.  I am willing to sacrifice a little ease in getting my boots
on and off for a much more confident and no less comfortable fit.

I have Technica's TX model from 2 years ago and have been very pleased with them.  
They have adustments for : arch support, forward lean & flex tension, and lateral
pitch to match any bow-leggedness of my legs so that the boot rests flat.  This 
model is a notch below Technica's top boot TNT which is their race boot.  The TX 
is pretty stiff and took some getting used to but the responsiveness is fantastic.    
I find them great from powder to bumps to ice.

I would recommend a front entry boot for high intermediate to expert skiing and 
suggest that you consider the Technica line-up.  I don't think they make the 
TX anymore.  

I paid $400. 

Mike.
From: roszko@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: Info wanted on Ski Patrol
Date: 2 Oct 92 15:22:20 GMT


  I am interested in getting on the ski patrol at some mountain this winter or
sometime in the next few years.  But, I'm not sure of what type of 
certification, experience, variations between mountains, ect.  I am an ex-racer
(with reconstructed ACL), and also First Aid, CPR, and Lifeguard Certified.
Any input at all would be great.  (please e-mail to me, I will post a summary
if there is intrest).

	Steve Roszko 
From: glenb@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com (Glen Baker)
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 07:00:08 GMT
Subject: rec.skiing FAQ 04/13
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Santa Rosa, CA
Newsgroups: rec.skiing

In rec.skiing, jonw@hpgrla.gr.hp.com (Jon Wade) writes:

>  ??????????  Who was the skier and what other ski flics has he appeared in?

 Given the hint I'll assume it was Plake.

 ..glen "with one n and normal hair"
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: drew@hamlet.cs.colorado.edu (Drew Eckhardt)
Subject: Re: Ski Vacation 
Organization: University of Colorado at Boulder
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 02:33:40 GMT

In article <1992Sep23.210620.22472@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> chung@cps.msu.edu.cps.msu.edu (Dr Moon-Jung Chung) writes:
>Dear Skiers,
>
>We are planning to take a family ski vacation during sometime in Dec.
>(When schools are closed).
>
>Two of my children are expert-advanced intermediate,
>myself is an intermediate, and my wife is a beginner.
>We would like to ski together sometimes and use the same lift
>lines. 
>
>With a limited budget, we plan to visit a ski resort for a week.

What is a "limited budget" defined as?  

>Do you have any suggestions which place is the best for our case?

Summit County.  Lodging in Dillion and Fresco is very affordable, 
and there is a shuttle bus to all of the Summit County resorts (ie,
A-Basin, Breckenridge, Copper Mountain, and Keystone.

You can get multi-day summit tickets that are good at all of them.

>
>Places considered are: Vail, Beaver Creek, Keystone, Big Sky, Aspen.
>I am afraid that Vail and Beaver Creek might be too expensive for
>family vacation. Aspen may be too far from Denver Air port.
>By the way we plan to fly from Michigan.
-- 
Microsoft is responsible for propogating the evils it calls DOS and Windows, 
IBM for AIX (appropriately called Aches by those having to administer it), but 
marketing's sins don't come close to those of legal departments.
Boycott AT&T for their absurd anti-BSDI lawsuit.
From: pdelaney@morgan.Berkeley.EDU (Peter Delaney)
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
Subject: ********
Date: 1 Oct 92 21:20:05 GMT
Reply-To: pdelaney@fester.Prime.COM
Organization: Computervision  Bedford, MA

Hi;

 I am looking for some information on skiing in New Zealand.
  I want to know where to go, what time of the year to go, 
  what type of skiing to expect, what the costs are, 
  and other general information.

 I plan to go late next summer and I am researching the
 trip early.

 Thanks
 Peter Delaney
 246 Corey Rd.
 Brookline, MA  02146
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: harsant@headplant.trl.OZ.AU (Dave Harsant)
Subject: Re: My Favorite Falls, episode N
Organization: Telecom Research Labs,Melbourne, Australia
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 03:11:07 GMT

In article <14779@auspex-gw.auspex.com> johnf@Auspex.COM (John Fereira) writes:
>>down the hill head over heels at about 40 mph.
>
>I think you're greatly overestimating your speed.  Unless it was an very

It sure is difficult to tell without some reference.  On a couple of
weekends over the last 2 seasons, the Ski School at Mt Buller has set
up a speed course on the summit.  The slope is a groomed intermediate,
probably about 20-25 degrees (plus a small starting gate), and the
measurement point about 100 metres downhill (estimates).  The best
technique was to give about 2 skates then tuck, and maximum speeds of
85km/hr were recorded on moderately quick snow.  This exercise has
shown that a good advanced skier can readily reach speeds up to 90km/hr
on groomed (uncrowded) slopes.  Wind resistance is a significant
limiting factor at this speed.

--
Dave Harsant,
Telecom Australia Research Laboratories  |  d.harsant@trl.oz.au
Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From:  vlad@inavex.neoaci.msk.su (Vladimir D. Korovkin)
Subject: Wanted: Help for Russian skiing glossary
Reply-To: vlad@inavex.neoaci.msk.su
Organization: INTERNATIONAL AVIATION INDUSTRY EXCHANGE
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 09:52:24 +0400 

>From vlad Mon Sep 28 18:58:31 MSD 1992
I have an idea to create English-Russian skiing glossary.
Russia have just been opened as skiing country. There are many fantastic
skiing areas as Noth Caucasus, Ural, Hibini, Alty etc. in Russia. Our guides
badly need to speak modern English on slopes. But they have not much
practice. Issue of skiing glossary would be help to solve the problem.
However I have a shortage of books, magazines  about skiing in English
which can help me to carry out the task.
It would be greatly appreciated if you help me in this way.
You could send me skiing terms or phrases like 'traverse and kick turn',
'side slipping' etc. All of your advices would be usefull.

Vlad

-- 
----- * phone (095) 361-6473 * Korovkin Vladimir * INAVEX * -----


Newsgroups: rec.skiing
From: rbalko@attmail.com ()
Subject: Skiing in Utah, seeking recommendations
Organization: AT&T BCSy S&PD FS/SI Dev MPS
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 16:39:59 GMT
Keywords: UT SKI

Hi Gang:

	I spent the end of last season enthralled by the world
	of downhill skiing... 'look at all you been missin!'

	Well, I've worked my self up to a solid intermediate with 
	my sights on the diamonds...
	So, I'm heading for Utah from 12/26/92 to 1/2/93.  If there
	is ahything you can share with me I'd REALLY appreciate
	it.  In patricular, I'd like to know about the following:

	1) What ski areas are best for me :
		(intermediate->[whatever PC term applies])

	2) Where are the low cost but clean places to stay near the
	   slopes in #1. Clean and cheap are higher priority than
	   night life, but in a pinch I can handle it.

	3) What I should know that I don't because I have never been 
	   west of Pennsylvania and the West is infinitely different
	   from the East.

	4) Anything else you think I should know about.

Thanks a heap!
rbalko@attmail.com
My .sig is proprietary, If I show you I'll have to kill you.