From: AIESEC - Ohio State <aiesecrs@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: Re: Bush Secretly Aided Saddam Until August 1990
Organization: The Ohio State University
  <9204090740.AA08939@bottom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> <9204100336.AA12032@bot
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1992 09:59:07 GMT

tom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Organization: The Ohio State University
Cc:
Bcc:

NOTE:  Brian seems to think it a a necassary tactic to insult other cultures 
and their methods of communication, in order to win a debate.  IN NO WAY ARE MY
RETORTS TO HIS STUPIDITY INTENDED TO INSULT PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT CITIZENS OF THE 
U.S.A.  I am merely throwing his below the belt tactics back into his face!  
Would the entire world sans Brian not take insult.  None is intended.

In article <brian.703047784@coombs> you write:
>AIESEC - Ohio State <aiesecrs@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> writes:
>

>>>    Turkey, a "democracy"?  I wonder, do you know exactly how much
>>>democracy the Kurds have been allowed to have in Turkey for the last 60 year
s?
>>>
>>>    I think if you actually went and did a little research you'd realise
>>>that armed insurrection is about the only avenue left to them WRT to being
>>>able to express their democratic desires for an independent Kurdistan.
>>>
>
>>There are plenty of people who want independence in demococracies.  Look at
>>Quebec "Depending on how you put the question, you'll get anything from 52% t
o
>>62% (on the level of support for sovereignty from Canada)" Time April
>>13,1992 pg.38.  I have been hearing lately about Scottish attempts to get out
>>of the United Kingdon.  I have also heard of a small (very small) movement of
>>Native Hawaiians who wish to have independence.  The only difference, these
>>movements don't shoot people.  I just don't buy that the Kurds have no other
>>recourse or even that they deserve violent recourse.
>
>    Do you know just how much repression the Kurds have put up with at
>the hands of the Turks?  If you did, you wouldn't be suggesting that they had
>anything else except armed insurrection to turn to.
>
>    A country which deliberately destroyed the culture, language and
>institutions of a large proportion of its population over an extended period
>hasn't exactly left many avenues of protest open to that part of the populatio
n.
>Particularly when those people, the Kurds were not even allowed to speak their
>own language for over 50 years, as it was outlawed!
>
>    Sure, the resort to armed insurrection should be the last thing
>attempted, however I don't think you'll find too many Kurds who'd disagree
>that all other avenues have either been blocked or tried before.

TURKEY HAS NOT EVEN BEEN A DEMOCRACY FOR FIFTY YEARS!!!!  I am siding with the
current government of Turkey.  Using your logic, I should defend Hitler because
of Napoleon's actions, defend Stalin because of Gehngis Khan's actions, and
defemd Mao because of British involvement in the Opium Wars.  You have leapt
beyond the bounds of idiocy.  That's USpeak for incompetence in case you are 
too stupid to understand, which you have proven beyond a doubt.

>>[... an arguement to which I have been corrected on.  I missed the thread...I
>>apologize to those involved, but Brian's response opens up another can of
>>worm's.]
>>>
>>>>[I called Israel a democracy.]

>>>    Again a case of calling a Holden a Ford.  Israel is not a "democracy".
>>>Have you ever considered if the Palestinians who are under Israeli occupatio
n
>>>have been given a chance to express their opinion democractically about
>>>whether or not they want to become part of Israel?  Were the Palestinians
>>>within Israel proper given a choice in the matter?
>>>    Don't you think for a moment, that the surrounding Arab states just
>>>might have a case for causis belli when they complain about the imposed
>>>creation of a new, alien state in their midst by external, powers?
>>>

No.

>>>    BTW, don't think I'm justifying what has gone on since 1948 in that
>>>part of the Middle-East, I'm not.  I am though at least attempting to
>>>apportion the blame a little more fairly that either Mr.ppugliese or this
>>>latest poster seem interested in.
>>>
>
>>Israel is a democracy.
>
>    Israel is a theocracy.  The Theocrats hold the balance of power in
>the Knesset.

     But, not all the power.  Simply because the people have elected Theocrats
(and that statement is incredibley debateable), does not mean that Israel is a
Theocracy.  Also, you cannot possibley deny that these Arab countries, Israel
has to face, are not Muslim Theocracies.  They don't even hold elections you
moron.  That's USpeak for someone who is not very smart.

>>>             These Palistinians were at the heart of four wars with
>>Israel.  In case you have forgotten history, the Palestinians originally
>>contolled the West Bank.  By getting their Arab neighbors to attack Israel th
ey
>>totally blew it.  It was the Palenstinians who couldn't live with Israel.  No
t
>>the other way around.  Maybe by their actions, they don't deserve that choice
Xref: sparky alt.desert-storm:849 talk.politics.misc:16924