HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: tyen@cs.utexas.edu (Anthony Yen)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Installation Question
Date: 12 Oct 1992 13:18:22 -0500
Organization: Coffee R Us
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: ai.cs.utexas.edu


I'm trying to install the full source distribution on a SPARCsystem
670MP, and am encountering a puzzling error during the make of all the
Makefiles.  The following directories were missing and caused make
errors (my entire source tree starts at /fac4/atk/build, and I've
pointed DEFAULT_ANDREWDIR_ENV to /fac4/atk/andrew):

	/fac4/atk/build/overhead/util/pobbconf
	/fac4/atk/build/overhead/class/machdep/pobbconf
	/fac4/atk/build/overhead/class/pobbconf
	/fac4/atk/build/overhead/eli/pobbconf

There were many more others under the "overhead" tree, and they all
have the "pobbconf" subdirectory missing at various points in the
tree.  Can someone please point me to some documentation that explains
what pobbconf is, and how I could be missing these subdirectories?

-- 
 ____     tyen@cs.utexas.edu.....Kowabunga!...
  /ony -- Claimer: Views expressed here == mine && only mine.  Sail tough.
From: zstern@adobe.com (Zalman Stern)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Re: PLANEMASK_ENV
Date: 9 Oct 92 18:50:48 GMT
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated

In article <wepP50m00Woi5W80ZR@andrew.cmu.edu> rr2b+@ANDREW.CMU.EDU (Robert  
Andrew Ryan) writes:
> In basics/x/xgraphic.c there is some code ifdefed on PLANEMASK_ENV. 
> Does anyone know what this is for, and if it is used by anyone?
> 
> Thanks for any info,
> -Rob Ryan
> Andrew Consortium
Really really vague memories gradually come back to me... (I didn't write  
this code though I've tried to find bugs in it.)

ATK used to do certain operations by setting the planemask to the xor of the  
foregound and background pixel values and then xor'ing in the foreground  
color. This allows you to get something like standard xor rubberbanding on a  
color display where you are only using two colors. (I think that at one time  
Xgraphic wired the planemask to this xor'ed value and left it that way until  
you changed the fore and back colors.)

There are a few problems with this: first actually using the planemask  
turned out to be dog slow on certain servers. Second, there were bugs in  
using the planemask on other servers. (Yet another X11 feature that you  
didn't want to use because it didn't get performance and QA attention.)  
Thirdly, this scheme completely falls apart when there are more than two  
colors in a window.

If I recall, PLANEMASK_ENV at one time set things up to do xor mode drawing  
by xor'ing with the xor of the fore and back colors instead of setting the  
planemask. I'm not sure which direction the flag went. Also, I think other  
stuff has been added under PLANEMASK_ENV that probably doesn't have anything  
to do with the above.

The last time I dealt with ATK (~two years ago), I had to compile it with  
different values of PLANEMASK_ENV for my 1 bit NCD and my 8 bit Magnum. And  
there were still a few bugs either way. I'd suggest figuring out what the  
correct X11 like thing to do is, riping out the PLANEMASK_ENV code (and  
anything else that looks suspect) and rewritting it. (Understand that at the  
time xgraphic was written, X11 theory and practice were relatively  
undeveloped. People actually believed GC's and Windows were dirt cheap for  
example.)

The above ramble may be pure fiction. If you'd like a more direct source,  
talk to Andy Palay or Mark Sherman.
--
Zalman Stern		   zalman@adobe.com		    (415) 962 3824
Adobe Systems, 1585 Charleston Rd., POB 7900, Mountain View, CA 94039-7900
  "Yeah. Ask 'em if they'll upgrade my shifters too." Bill Watterson
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
From: wyneken@sun1.ruf.uni-freiburg.de (Matthew Wyneken)
Subject: org and monochrome SS2
Organization: Rechenzentrum der Universitaet Freiburg, Deutschland
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 92 16:11:26 GMT

I'm quite a fan of org, despite all the bugs. I recently noticed
a nasty problem, though. I normally work on a Sun SLC and there 
everything works fine. Last week I was working on a SparcStation
2 and to my dismay, couldn't get my main org file to appear.
At first I thought I had somehow lost all the information I
had stored in the file and so was relieved when everything
was fine when working on my SLC.

It looks to me like somehow org doesn't get along with the 19"
monochrome monitor on the SS2. We also have IPCs in our
group, and org works fine with them, too.

Has anybody had this problem? Is there a way to fix it?


Matthew Wyneken

Deutsches Seminar I          |   Tel.: ++49-761-2034897
Linguistische Informatik     |
Universitaet Freiburg        |   e-mail: 
Friedrichstr. 50             |   mpw@supreme.coling.uni-freiburg.de
-- 
Matthew Wyneken

Deutsches Seminar I          |   Tel.: ++49-761-2034897
Linguistische Informatik     |
From: Wilfred.Hansen@CS.CMU.EDU
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Re: Newsletter from Andrew Consortium
Date: 7 Oct 92 19:52:14 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet


The new editor for structured image objects (line drawings or figures)
has reached the point where it needs a name.  

What name do you like:

vel, gecko, andraw, figure, lined, elvis, adraw, drawl, 
draft, odraw, g-ode, ode, yahoo, AAAHCHHH, 
<write-in vote>, <not voting, text is enough for me>,
<not voting, I'll use it enough to remember any name>

The decision of the judges is final.  Duplicate prizes will be awarded
in case of ties.  

FredH
From: zh@NIKE.RZ.UNI-KONSTANZ.DE ("Z. Horvat")
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Re: Font Problem
Date: 8 Oct 92 14:31:24 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

<bold><excerpt>Excerpts from mail: 8-Oct-92 Re: Font Problem Todd Inglett@rchl=
and.ibm (805+0)</excerpt></bold><nl>
<nl>
<excerpt><bold><excerpt>Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 5-Oct-92 Font Prob=
lem Z. Horvat@RCHGATE.rchlan (1078)</excerpt></bold><nl>
</excerpt><nl>
<excerpt><excerpt>Apllications start and seem to run fine, but it looks like t=
hey cannot find the approriate fonts</excerpt><nl>
</excerpt><nl>
<excerpt>If you don't have an X11r5 server (you don't if you are running the p=
roduct AIX server), make sure you install .snf rather than .pcf fonts.  To get=
 .snf fonts, simply put a #undef FONTS_TO_PCF_ENV in your site.h.  Until you g=
et things working, you might want to put the following into your ~/preferences=
 file:<nl>
</excerpt><nl>
<excerpt>*.AnnounceFontSubstitutions: true<nl>
*.ErrorsToConsole: false<nl>
</excerpt><nl>
<excerpt>Does xset q show that /usr/andrew/X11fonts is on your font path?  If =
not, the X server doesn't like your new fonts.  Does a fonts.dir file exist in=
 the font directory?  If not, you probably forgot to build the xmkfontd direct=
ory.<nl>
</excerpt><nl>
<excerpt>-todd inglett<nl>
</excerpt><nl>
Thanks for your answers. In the meantime, i have really been frustrated by usi=
ng the IBM Product Server (X11R4 based) too much and have switched without pro=
blems to R5. I rebuilded Andrew entirely (make World) and don't had any more p=
roblems with Andrew so far. So i can't tell if your suggesting will help or no=
t, sorry.<nl>
<nl>
One thing i noticed with ATK 5.1 under AIX 3.2 is that without ANDREW_MALLOC_E=
NV defined any program with the menu point "Delete window" would crash by usin=
g it. I have built with ANDREW_MALLOC_ENV and DEBUG_MALLOC (or something simil=
ar, i can't remember ...) and so far i have not seen problems. <nl>
And, yes, i had to make some minor changes to some .c files which included<nl>=

<lt>errno.h> and then<nl>
<lt>andrewos.h> to swap the two lines to make them read<nl>
<nl>
<lt>andrewos.h><nl>
<lt>error.h><nl>
so that they got compiled. Funny, but it worked.<nl>
<nl>
Greetings,<nl>
<nl>
<nl>
---------------------------------------------------<nl>
SYS337654 Could not locate coffee - Operator halted <nl>
---------------------------------------------------<nl>
<nl>
Z. Horvat<nl>
Rechenzentrum Universitaet Konstanz<nl>
++49-7531-88-2405<nl>
<nl>
zh@nike.rz.uni-konstanz.de<nl>
rzhorv@nyx.uni-konstanz.de<nl>
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
From: leeks@buddle1.kaist.ac.kr (Lee Ki Seob)
Subject:   Is there any internationalized Andrew ?
Keywords: intenational andrew
Organization: KAIST
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 92 03:34:00 GMT

Hi all
Is there any internationalized Andrew ?
So to speak, I hope to use ez with all of alphabets
including korean hangul, japanese kana, chinese hanja.

Anyone who have infos about it, let me know.
 
Thanks in advance.

		


-- 


Lee, Ki Seob                   
System Architecture Lab. 
Computer Science Department KAIST
Seoul, Republic of Korea

phone:  +82-42-869-3554 (Office)
email:  leeks@cosmos.kaist.ac.kr
From: ap1i+@ANDREW.CMU.EDU ("Andrew C. Plotkin")
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Re: Newsletter from Andrew Consortium
Date: 7 Oct 92 23:15:46 GMT
Organization: The Internet

Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 7-Oct-92 Re: Newsletter from
Andrew .. Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.ed (451)

> The new editor for structured image objects (line drawings or figures)
> has reached the point where it needs a name.  

> What name do you like:

> vel, gecko, andraw, figure, lined, elvis, adraw, drawl, 
> draft, odraw, g-ode, ode, yahoo, AAAHCHHH, 

Since I'm responsible for the program, I believe I'll explain some of these....

Vel: This is the current name. It was chosen because the editor is
intended to replace Zip. And, see, using velcro is very similar to using
a zip, except that velcro is cheaper, easier to use, never breaks or
jams.... :-)

Gecko: Geckos are cute. (Well, not very.)

Andraw: Like MacDraw, only without the Mac.

Figure: From the same people who brought you inset names like Text,
Raster, Chart, Table, Footnote...  On the other hand, every time you
started it up, you could say "Go Figure!"

Lined: Well, you can edit lines with it. Among other things.

Elvis: Your guess is as good as mine.

Adraw: See Andraw.

Drawl: See Adraw. (Only this is cornier.)

Draft: A drafting table? I dunno.

Odraw: See Drawl.

G-Ode: Graphic Object Drawing Editor. Advantages: sounds cool.
Disadvantages: we can't use it, because the hyphen will crash all of our
preprocessors and compilers.

Ode: Object Drawing Editor. Like G-Ode, but without either the
advantages or disadvantages.

Yahoo: When Rob sent me his list of suggestions, the subject line was "Yahoo".

AAAHCHHH: This would be the very first program name that you *cannot*
say quietly; you *must* scream it, or you're pronouncing it wrong. This
would be great fun at conferences, demos, etc. Imagine Fred Hansen
standing up and saying "We are proud to announce our new drawing editor
AAAHCHHH!!!!" (You would all have to do it too, of course.)

Consider these factors well, before you choose a name (or make up your own.)

Andrew Plotkin
Andrew Consortium
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
From: tbel@oahu.cern.ch
Subject: CD Rom version running on AIX 3.2
Organization: IBM
Distribution: comp
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 17:43:39 GMT

I've downloaded the CD ROM version of Andrew and unpacked the AIX
3.1 version.  Most of the applications run fine but the messages
application hangs after printing the initial title message.

Do I need to re-compile on AIX 3.2 or will I get the same problem when
I do ?

Tim.

--
Tim Bell
IBM High Energy Physics European Centre
CERN, Geneva, Switzerland
TBEL@CERNVM.CERN.CH
From: tinglett+@rchland.ibm.com (Todd Inglett)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Re: Font Problem
Date: 8 Oct 92 14:11:11 GMT
Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" <tinglett@vnet.ibm.com>
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 5-Oct-92 Font Problem
Z.Horvat@RCHGATE.rchlan (1078)

> Apllications start and seem to run fine, but it looks like theycannot
find the approriate fonts

If you don't have an X11r5 server (you don't if you are running the
productAIX server), make sure you install .snf rather than .pcf fonts. 
To get .snffonts, simply put a #undef FONTS_TO_PCF_ENV in your site.h. 
Until you getthings working, you might want to put the following into
your ~/preferencesfile:

*.AnnounceFontSubstitutions: true
*.ErrorsToConsole: false

Does xset q show that /usr/andrew/X11fonts is on your font path?  If
not, theX server doesn't like your new fonts.  Does a fonts.dir file
exist in the fontdirectory?  If not, you probably forgot to build the
xmkfontd directory.

-todd inglett
From: rr2b+@ANDREW.CMU.EDU (Robert Andrew Ryan)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: PLANEMASK_ENV
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:20:16 GMT
Organization: The Internet

In basics/x/xgraphic.c there is some code ifdefed on PLANEMASK_ENV. 
Does anyone know what this is for, and if it is used by anyone?

Thanks for any info,
-Rob Ryan
Andrew Consortium
From: bill@allegra.att.com (Bill Schell)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: drawing editor name
Date: 8 Oct 92 14:17:52 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

My vote is for anything but the 'ode' names.  We use 'ode' for our
object oriented database.  There have been numerous papers published on
it,  so 'ode' might be confusing for some people.

[An Andrew ToolKit view (lsetview) was included here, but could not be
displayed.]
From: tinglett+@rchland.ibm.com (Todd Inglett)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: Re: Font Problem
Date: 8 Oct 92 14:44:10 GMT
Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" <tinglett@vnet.ibm.com>
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 8-Oct-92 Re: FontProblem "Z.
Horvat"@RCHGATE.rchl (2018+0)

> One thing i noticed with ATK 5.1 under AIX 3.2 is that
> withoutANDREW_MALLOC_ENV defined any program with the menu point "Delete
> window"would crash by using it. I have built with ANDREW_MALLOC_ENV and
DEBUG_MALLOC(or something similar, i can't remember 

Well, unfortunately ANDREW_MALLOC_ENV will cause problems.  Tryrunning
bush for example.  You can work around the problem by setting
theMALLOCTYPE environment variable to the value "3.1".  You can apply
thefollowing patch to atk/apps/runapp.c to permanently "fix" the problem.

*** /tmp/T0WFACzR	Thu Oct  8 09:42:34 1992
--- runapp.c	Thu Oct  8 09:42:34 1992
***************
*** 86,91 ****
--- 86,111 ----
      fd = open("/dev/zero", O_RDWR);
      dup(fd);		/* one greater */
      close(fd);
+ #endif
+
+ #if SY_AIX32
+     {
+         /* This masks some memory corruption problems. */
+ 	extern char **environ;
+ 	char *envent = environ[0];
+ 	void *foo;
+
+ 	/* This is tricky.  The first call to malloc checks
+ 	 * MALLOCTYPE, but putenv uses malloc so we can't use
+          * it.  We probably don't want to propogate MALLOCTYPE
+ 	 * to other progs either, so we temporarly put it into
+ 	 * our environment, call malloc, then put things back.
+ 	 */
+ 	environ[0] = "MALLOCTYPE=3.1";
+ 	foo = malloc(1);
+ 	free(foo);
+ 	environ[0] = envent;
+     }
  #endif


      initClass();

These problems will be fixed "for real" in the next release of Andrew.

-todd inglett
From: Wilfred.Hansen@CS.CMU.EDU
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew
Subject: atk.itc.cmu.edu IP address
Date: 8 Oct 92 19:28:15 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Internet

The correct IP address for 
	atk.itc.cmu.edu is 128.2.45.46

Please accept my apologies if you tried the incorrect address I posted
last week.
The remote demo service is 
	finger help@atk.itc.cmu.edu

(The IP address for emsworth.andrew.cmu.edu, the Andrew Consortium ftp
server, is now 128.2.45.40.)

Fred Hansen
Director, Andrew Consortium
From: missler@csr.uta.edu (James Michael Missler)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: khoros problems on sun4
Date: 15 Oct 92 17:00:25 GMT
Article-I.D.: pprg.41002

To whoever is avalable to assist -

	I am now loading khoros on a Sun 4/490 with Sun OS 4.1.1.
I have configured the sun.cf to reflect no patched loader, no
Saber C, YES to soelim and f77, DefaultCDebugflag -0.  Currently, the
Sun 4/490 has X11R5 installed.  I have successfully compiled khoros
(that is, I got the completion message) with only the following
warning messages:

	"zchdc.f", line 93: Warning: local variable "i" never used
	"zchdc.f", line 93: Warning: local variable "i" never used
	"zchex.f", line 125: Warning: local variable "rjp1j" never used
	"zchex.f", line 125: Warning: local variable "rjp1j" never used
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors
	make: Warning: Target `install' not remade because of errors

The first four warnings appear to be of a lint nature and I suspect
are of no consequence.  The remaining warnings indicate that I need
to define my Fortran library paths per FAQ #35.  I have followed the
guidance in response to FAQ #35 and have discovered two library
paths: "-L/usr/lang/SC1.0/cg87 -L/usr/lang/SC1.0".  How do I
"#define FortranLibDir" given this situation?  When testing the
execution of cantata and xprism3 I get the following runtime errors:

For cantata:
	X Toolkit Error: Widget Vertical has zero width
	and/or height.
cantata aborts before its form is displayed.

For xprism3: segmentation fault	

	Do you have any ideas on how to fix these bugs?  I sincerely
appreciate any assistance.  Thanks!

					- Mike Missler
From: becky@chama.eece.unm.edu (Becky Bishop)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: test2
Date: 16 Oct 92 22:03:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: pprg.41036

test again
From: sbw@turing.cse.nau.edu (Steve Wampler)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: Is this already available in Khoros?
Date: 7 Oct 92 20:54:28 GMT

I just got a call from someone studying sand bars in the Grand Canyon.
They have photographs (over time) of parts of the canyon floor, taken
at an oblique angle (the reference point is known, so any necessary
angles and distances can be given).  They want to 'rectify' the
photographs to a vertical view and then do feature area analysis to
check for changes in the sand bars.

Now, I know diddly about image processing.  Is there an existing
Khoros routine that would do the rectification?  I know Khoros can
do the other just fine...

-- 
	Steve Wampler
	{....!arizona!naucse!sbw}
	{sbw@turing.cse.nau.edu}
From: johnw@ssi-h.pegasus.com (John Williams)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: GMT
Date: 12 Oct 92 21:46:57 GMT

Has anyone built a Khoros/Cantata interface for the 
GMT System -- a data manipulation and plotting package developed
by Paul Wessel (SOEST, UH) and Walter Smith (SIO, UCSD)?

johnw@ssi-h.pegasus.com         John Williams
                                Seafloor Surveys International, Inc.
Phone:  (808) 263-1222          354 Uluniu St., Suite 408
Fax:    (808) 262-5470          Kailua, HI      96734   U.S.A.
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
From: opus@pioneer.unm.edu (Colby Kraybill)
Subject: Problems creating an xvroutine
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 92 22:15:40 GMT
Organization: Space and Planetary Image Facility


We currently have khoros set up on a Sun 670MP running under SunOS 4.1.2,
with Open Windows 3.0.  For the last day I have been reading through Vol II
 Chpt 1-6 on creating an routines to be run under khoros.

After having followed the directions for creating an xvroutine in chapter
one, I have come up against a wall.

First, I had to hack into the Makefile generated by ghostwriter just so that
it would look in /usr/lib/X11 for the proper X libs.

However, after I did that it now comes up with this :

cc -o xvobjects lxvobjects.o  xvobjects.o  -L/u/opus/khoros/lib -L/usr/lang/SC1.0.1 -L/usr/lib/X11  -O -Bdynamic   -ldisplay  -lxvplot  -lgraphics  -lxvforms  -lxvutils    -lghost  -lvexpr  -lnum_anal  -ldspl  -lformat  -lgeo_surf  -lvipl  -lvutils  -lvmath  -lvrast  -lvgparm  -lverror  -ltiff    -lm -ll  -lXaw -lXmu -lXt -lXext -lX11 
ld: Undefined symbol
   __XtInherit
   _sin
   _cos
   _pow
   _get_wmShellWidgetClass
   _get_applicationShellWidgetClass
   _XtToolkitInitialize
*** Error code 2
make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `xvobjects'

Has anyone incountered such a problem as this before?

Any helpful information would be appreciated.

-- 
Colby Kraybill
Space and Planetary Image Facility
University of New Mexico
opus@pioneer.unm.edu
From: wu@folding.hood.caltech.edu (wu)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: Error in compile-FAQ
Date: 9 Oct 92 19:37:29 GMT

Hi,

	There is an error in file "compile-FAQ" line 936.

The original line is:
 #  define DefaultCCOptions -Bdynamic -Qoption ld -assert -Qoption ld
It should be:
 #  define DefaultCCOptions -Bdynamic -Qoption ld -assert -Qoption ld nodefinitions

I used the corrected line to compile khoros on SunOS 4.1.3 and it worked fine.

-Wei Wu  (wu@folding.hood.caltech.edu)
From: gagnep@ere.umontreal.ca (Gagne Pierre)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: DOC price
Date: 16 Oct 92 16:16:01 GMT


	Hello,

	is it possible to get the printed documentation only?

	If yes, for how much?

		Thanks in advance

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pierre R. Gagne                       | e-mail: gagnep@ere.umontreal.ca  |
Services Informatiques                | Universite de Montreal           |                               
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: wes@ux6.lbl.gov (Wes Bethel)
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.khoros
Subject: Preparing for K2 (LONGish)
Date: 14 Oct 92 20:24:03 GMT

I will offer a few comments about k2 based upon my limited view of the
project.

I am helping to build much of the geometry related stuff, as well
as provide numerous modules for scientific visualization.  The modules
fall into the category of those that produce geometry from non-geometry
data, such as isosurfaces.

Our intent is to provide as much flexibility as possible for users to
construct visualization applications, similar to the "other" packages
that are out there floating around. 

I will provide more detailed information about all of this when the spec
starts to settle down.  This should happen within the month.  For now,
suffice it to say that a number of modules will be provided that perform
fundamental visualization functions, rendering capability will be
provided, and an API to a geometry library will also be provided so
that you can roll your own modules for creating and manipulating geometry.
(A longish presentation of this will be given at Vis92 next week in
Boston).

As for timelines, if k2/alpha were to be released within the month, there
won't be any geometry, nor will there be any visualization modules, nor
will there be any renderers ready.  (Some of this depends on VIFF 2, and
some doesn't).  I would expect to see the various pieces of geometry,
visualization modules and rendering starting to work around the first
of the year, in time for K2/beta.

wes