HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: igor@access.digex.com (Dan White)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.marketplace
Subject: FOR SALE: Model Aircraft
Date: 13 Jan 1993 03:36:19 GMT
Organization: Society for the Prevention of Paronomastic Defenestration
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: access.digex.com

For Sale:


   ->  A rare collectors item
           1/72 scale Lockheed YF-12A (A-11) Interceptor
                This is an old, fighter version of the Blackbird SR-71,
                kit by AHM.  It is complete.  The kit has been opened and
                fondled a bit, but no assembly has begun.

                I doubt if this kit is still available.

                Price: $20 or best offer recieved no later than
                18 January 1993.  I will ship the model UPS-COD
                unless you, the buyer, wish to pay for faster shipping.

                Please respond via e-mail to igor@Access.digex.com
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                               Dan White
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Sometimes  I  think  the  surest  sign  that  intelligent  life exists
From: glazier@isr.harvard.edu (Andrew Baker Glazier)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.marketplace
Subject: Day Of The Triffids ---  $10 (U.S.)
Date: 5 Jan 93 14:23:29 GMT
Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, MA

Plus shipping from above address to you...
-- 
"A horse! A horse! Somebody give me a horse, man, because|glazier@ 
I come to bury this dirtball, not to praise him. Whaddya |harvard.isr.edu
think I am? Whether it's nobler for the mind to make people suffer with all
these totally outrageous arrows arrows for a fortune, or what!" -- D.R.
From: jeh@cmkrnl.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Re: Boskone
Date: 12 Jan 93 08:34:08 PST
Distribution: world
Organization: Kernel Mode Consulting, San Diego, CA

In article <1isnmjINNbv@newsstand.cit.cornell.edu>, phydeaux@guru.med.cornell.edu (Dave Weingart) writes:
> In article <C0IAo3.Fy@knot.ccs.queensu.ca>, polowin@chem.queensu.ca (Joel Polowin) writes:
> |> If it CAN be used as a weapon, it IS a weapon.  Any and all objects which
> |> can be used to harm someone in any way must be left in the room.
> 
> Hmmm...does this count my guitar and amp on the way to the filk?
> Do I need to peacebond my whammy bar?  B{)

Depends.  Does the amp go to "11", or just "10"?  :-)

	--- Jamie Hanrahan, Kernel Mode Consulting, San Diego CA
Internet:  jeh@cmkrnl.com, hanrahan@eisner.decus.org, or jeh@crash.cts.com
Uucp:  ...{crash,eisner,uunet}!cmkrnl!jeh
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Re: Boskone
From: seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp)
Date: 8 Jan 93 12:27:41 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh
Originator: seawasp@unixd1.cis.pitt.edu

In article <C0IAo3.Fy@knot.ccs.queensu.ca> polowin@chem.queensu.ca (Joel Polowin) writes:
>In article <199301062041.AA28939@aerospace.aero.org> obrien@AERO.ORG (Mike O'Brien) writes:
>>>Boskone Weapons Policy
>>>As is standard at most conventions, no weapon, or anything that looks like
>>>a weapon, is allowed at Boskone at any time. This includes clubs,
>>>quarterstaves, wizard's staves, lasers, squirt guns, toy zap guns, or

		[...]

>>If banning wizard's staves is standard at most conventions it's news to me.

>If it CAN be used as a weapon, it IS a weapon.  Any and all objects which
>can be used to harm someone in any way must be left in the room.

	I can kill or injure with my bare hands, clothing, wire, combs,
straps, belts... So I guess all con-goers are going to next be required to
come nude, and chop off their extremities too, and wear muzzles?

	Why not simply require that PEOPLE BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR ACTIONS
and let them pay the price....


                                 Sea Wasp
                                   /^\
                                   ;;;
From: jeff.kling@brent.uucp (Jeff Kling) 
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: RE: VILLAGE OF THE DAMMNE
Date: 6 Jan 93 23:28:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: The Brentwood BBS Harrison, NY  914-835-7898
Reply-To: jeff.kling@brent.uucp (Jeff Kling) 

-> Trivial.  There were lots of groups of Children, this was made clear
-> even in the movie version of _The Midwich Cuckoos_.  Just because
-> Zellaby managed to destroy his group, doesn't mean that other groups
-> didn't survive completely or partially intact.

Not so.  In Village of the Dammned, they made it quite clear that these
were the last group of children.  Perhaps the book was different, but
the movies should be consistent with themselves.  You can't very well do
one thing in the first movie, and then in the second, go according to
the book.  Not trivial.  This view condones the very activity that I
will not.

J
         
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc,rec.arts.sf.fandom
From: jjfink@skcla.monsanto.com
Subject: Re: Convention Masquerades 
Organization: Searle, Skokie, IL
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 09:25:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan5.210911.8467@mail.cornell.edu>, phydeaux@guru.med.cornell.edu (Dave Weingart) writes:
> Despite the so-far underwhelming attention given it by the concom and the fen,
> it looks like my wife and I will be running the I-Con XII masquerade.  What I'd
> like to hear is what _you_ the costumer and _you_ the fan prefer at a masquerade?
> 
> We know what _we_ like, but then again, that's just based on our own limited
> experience entering.

As a participant in a few recent masques, I have a few suggestions:

1) Start your tech setup earlier than you think.  You'll want more time than
that, even.

2) In the green room, have ample mirrors, water and STRAWS!!!!  Get a bigger
room, too.  Somebody's skirts always get stepped on, and those Klingons are
always a little antsy before a fight.

3) Somebody's bound to lose a piece of something.  Emergency needles, thread,
duct tape, hot -- and cool -- glue...

4) If at all possible, have the tech run-throughs be by appointment some time
prior to the final arrival prior to the show.  I've been at a couple recently
where the lights and sound were never finished until just before the show
began, and there were no tech run-throughs for the participants, though we sat
around in costume and makeup for about two hours.  Consequently, one of the
backstage people tried to bodily move me onto stage when my tape began (I'm
about 250lbs* -- I'm not moving), rather than at the entrance cue. 

Especially for children, having a rehearsal BEFORE the costumes are
put on will greatly ease the flow, and prevent the kids from shredding the
costumes while waiting for the rehearsal to finish.  Making the rehearsals by
appointment means I don't have to miss the rest of the con.  If you miss your
time?  Well, you snooze, you lose.

5) Please videotape the show.  Otherwise, I never get to see the presentations,
though being backstage does let me get a better idea as to how the competition
built their stuff. 

(If anyone has a videotape from Windycon, please let me know)

Joel Finkle
-- 
jjfink@skcla.monsanto.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I want peace on earth, and goodwill towards man."
"We don't do that kind of thing, we're the United States Government!"
  -- from _Sneakers_
From: 01fortec@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: aeroflights in space
Date: 11 Jan 93 11:26:46 -0400
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

This is as close to an appropriate newsgroup as I can get.

Are there any aerospace engineers out there reading this? Could you tell
me the following: would it be possible to design a spacecraft with computer
controlled thrusters arranged in such a pattern around the ship so as to
simulate atmospheric flight in space? I can't think of any really good reason
to do this except that it might simplify navigation in space a little.

The question arose after a marathon evening of watching StarWars (all three).
If it can't be done, why not? If it can be done, how complicated would it be?
(it occurs to me that fuel tankage, if nothing else, might complicate matters)

Joe
01fortec@ac.dal.ca
From: wixer!cactus.org!wixer!pro-smof.cts.com!rfletcher@cactus.org (Robert Fletcher)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Re: Writers groups
Date: 11 Jan 1993 11:12:51 -0600
Organization: The SMOF-BBS: Science Fiction Online Since 1985 [512-467-7317]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu

  Macomb is about a hundred thousand people small, check the library.
I am guessing about the population.
----
ProLine:  rfletcher@pro-smof
Internet: rfletcher@pro-smof.cts.com
UUCP:     crash!pro-smof!rfletcher
ARPA:     crash!pro-smof!rfletcher@nosc.mil

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc,rec.arts.sf.movies
From: troy@athena.cs.uga.edu (Troy Johnson)
Subject: Your aid is needed! Please read.
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:47:32 GMT

This is a short request to all the users of the Net I can reach.
I and several friends have been assembling a list of "Noble
Rhetoric and Snappy Comebacks" from tv, movies, books, politics, etc. 
as a hobby for sometime now and we've reached around 600 different
quotes in all.  I have noticed the vast number of quotes to be found
throughout the net in peoples' sig.s, quotes, etc. and I would like
to ask for some help from all the users of the Net world-wide.
If you have a suggestion for a quote that is funny, creative, etc.
and you feel fits in the category of "Noble Rhetoric" or "Snappy
Comeback" in some vague way, please e-mail the suggestion to me
with the word "QUOTE SUGGESTION" as the subject line.  Also,
to prevent my mail from being overloaded please, just send in the
quotes for the next week only.  Please don't send me anything
after that time, as I am posting to a few newsgroups at a time, a
new set each week.  This should slow down the flow of mail sufficiently
so that I can handle it.  I will post all quotes which I and my comrades
in crime decide to use and we will only use those which have proper 
documention so that we may credit the source without getting in any
trouble.  Thanks in advance and your help is very much appreciated.

Grummy
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
From: chris@keris.demon.co.uk (Chris Croughton)
Subject: Re: Articles About Internet in Mass Media (Was Internet (Glob 
Distribution: world
Organization: Keristor Systems
X-Mailer: Simple NEWS 1.90 (ka9q DIS 1.19)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 20:54:22 +0000

In article <1993Jan4.163216.11001@mail.cornell.edu>
            phydeaux@guru.med.cornell.edu writes:

>Now here comes a question to make this more SF.  Given some "archival" media
>(i.e. one that lasts for centuries), and a clever enough archaeologist in
>the future who can _read_ the disks/CDs/what-have-you, what picture could they
>draw of life among the 20th Century Usenetter Tribe?

I thought it already was SF - Cyberspace and all that...  However...

A weird picture, to be sure!  Look at all the comments about 'anoraks'
that were floating around a while back, and the strange names people
call themselves (or other people).  Not to mention some of the really
strange newsgroups out there...

Mind you, perhaps they'd be right - there *are* some real wierdos on the
net...

***********************************************************************
*  chris@keris.demon.co.uk      *                                     *
*  chriscr@cix.compulink.co.uk  *  FIAWOL (Filking Is A Way Of Life)  *
*  100014.3217@compuserve.com   *                                     *
***********************************************************************
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
From: polowin@chem.queensu.ca (Joel Polowin)
Subject: Re: Boskone
Organization: Dept. of Chemistry, Queen's University
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 23:02:27 GMT

In article <199301062041.AA28939@aerospace.aero.org> obrien@AERO.ORG (Mike O'Brien) writes:

>>Boskone Weapons Policy
>>
>>As is standard at most conventions, no weapon, or anything that looks like
>>a weapon, is allowed at Boskone at any time. This includes clubs,
>>quarterstaves, wizard's staves, lasers, squirt guns, toy zap guns, or
>>anything else that resembles a weapon. If you violate this rule you will be
>>asked to leave the convention.
>
>If banning wizard's staves is standard at most conventions it's news to me.
>Far as I can tell this is unique to Boskone.  It's too bad, but not as bad
>as it might be, because Boskone, unlike most conventions, has a reputation
>among some fans, at least, as being boring.

If it CAN be used as a weapon, it IS a weapon.  Any and all objects which
can be used to harm someone in any way must be left in the room.

How could this be boring?  The only problem would be keeping the vice
squad off your butts...  :-)

Joel Polowin
polowin@silicon.chem.queensu.ca, polowin@chem.queensu.ca,
polowinj@qucdn.queensu.ca
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
From: polowin@chem.queensu.ca (Joel Polowin)
Subject: Re: Boskone
Organization: Dept. of Chemistry, Queen's University
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 15:17:47 GMT

In article <1527@blue.cis.pitt.edu> seawasp@vm2.cis.pitt.edu (Sea Wasp) writes:
>>>>As is standard at most conventions, no weapon, or anything that looks like
>>>>a weapon, is allowed at Boskone at any time. This includes clubs,
>>>>quarterstaves, wizard's staves, lasers, squirt guns, toy zap guns, or
>
>>If it CAN be used as a weapon, it IS a weapon.  Any and all objects which
>>can be used to harm someone in any way must be left in the room.
>
>	I can kill or injure with my bare hands, clothing, wire, combs,
>straps, belts... So I guess all con-goers are going to next be required to
>come nude, and chop off their extremities too, and wear muzzles?

For the sarcasm-impaired, that's exactly what I was implying.  To repeat:

> How could this be boring?  The only problem would be keeping the vice
> squad off your butts...  :-)

I'd rather hoped that mentioning the vice squad, immediately followed by
"butts" and a ":-)", might make my meaning clear.  Never mind...

Joel Polowin
polowin@silicon.chem.queensu.ca, polowin@chem.queensu.ca,
polowinj@qucdn.queensu.ca

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
From: tabron1@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Subject: Re: SF fans show libertarian inclination
Reply-To: tabron1@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 21:50:56 GMT

In article <1i9mnnINNgvn@transfer.stratus.com>, jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann) writes:
>In article <725750803snz@keris.demon.co.uk> chris@keris.demon.co.uk  
>(Chris Croughton) writes:
>> For a start, any Heinlein fan (i.e. one who *agrees* with him) is  
>going
>> to have a lot in common with libertarians.  Ditto anyone who agrees  
>with
>> Leslie Fish (well, she's nearer anarchist, but it's similar).
>
>I disagree. I'm a Heinlein fan in the sense that I like a lot
>of what he has written. That doesn't mean I agree with him.
>
>
I have to agree here. I like almost everything that Heinlein has
written, but I'm not a libertarian. I find it difficult to believe that
one could read most of his books and still feel that he was a libertarian.
I don't think the supposed "Heinlein" who wrote books like Starship
Troopers or Time Enough for Love could be considered a libertarian.

>But of course live and let live is not all there is to 
>libertarianism. If that's all it was, a lot more of us would
>probably fall into the category.  Too much of libertarianism
>is also "if they can't work, let them starve, but don't make
>me spend my tax money on them."  
>
This is probably not always true (is anything _always_ true?) but
I must say that most of the libertarians I have interacted with on the
net have fallen into this category, and it disturbs me. The libertarians
I have known _were_ rich, gun-loving, don't-tax-me sorts.
>--
>Jim Mann            
>Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  
>

Judith Tabron
Brandeis University
tabron@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
From: dlow@pollux.svale.hp.com (Danny Low)
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 23:20:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re: SF fans show libertarian inclination
Organization: HP LOVECRAFT DIVISION
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc

>(Jack Choquette) 
>|> But of course live and let live is not all there is to 
>|> libertarianism. If that's all it was, a lot more of us would
>|> probably fall into the category.  Too much of libertarianism
>|> is also "if they can't work, let them starve, but don't make
>|> me spend my tax money on them."  
>But that all there is to libertarianism: "Live and let live".  Taken
>to its extreme logical conclusion, it also means: "if they can't work
>{**and no one is willing to support them**}, let them starve, but
>don't make me {**i.e. force me**} support them.
>
>Notice that I slightly modified your quote, specifically note the text
>added between the {** **}.  It is the most often omitted when
>explaining the libertarian mindset, but is the most crucial bit needed
>to understand libertarianism.

In either situation the Libertarian is providing no aid to the starving
people. In the second quote the Libertarian is not stopping anyone
else from helping the starving people but is still not helping them
himself. A rather meaningless difference. All Libertarian responses
I have ever seen to such a situation has always omitted any mention of
what the Libertarian is doing about the situation. It's always
don't make me do it. This implies the Libertarian is doing nothing
and relying on others to feed the starving so they will not loot
his house looking for food. This makes the Libertarian a parasite
relying on the good work of others to keep the peace.

			   Danny Low
    "Question Authority and the Authorities will question You"
	   Valley of Hearts Delight, Silicon Valley
	     HP CPCD   dlow@pollux.svale.hp.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
From: tabron1@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Subject: Re: SF fans show libertarian inclination
Reply-To: tabron1@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
Organization: Brandeis University
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:33:36 GMT

>In fact, it even occurred 
>to me that the requirements for franchise in Starship Troopers (i.e.,
>some kind of government service required for you to vote, etc) could
>be seen in a libertarian light -- i.e., you have to pay for whatever you
>want.                                               ^^^^^^^

Service, even in the military, is not money. Service is something anyone can
give, in one form or another, given the will. Money is an external object --
some people have it, some people don't! -- and not at ALL involved in what
Heinlein was positing in Starship Troopers.

I know you didn't mean to imply a connection between service and money - that's
why I'm pointing it out. the language of "pay for" reflects this kind of
concern with conservation or protection of one's money that seems to
characterize a lot of libertarians.

Now, I too want to conserve and protect my money :-) , and I would certainly
like more control over the ways in which my government spends the money it
confiscates from me in the form of taxes. but I _want_ a government, I even
want them to take _some_ of my money (though maybe, Mr. Clinton, a little
less? :-) and I want them to USE IT WISELY on behalf of the rest of the people
in my society who are in bigger trouble than I am. 

But then again, whoever said this isn't the place to discuss this stuff was
undoubtedly right. (I just can't help myself.) Sorry.

Won't bite the bait again,

Judith Tabron
tabron@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
From: jackc@vermont.mti.sgi.com (Jack Choquette)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Re: SF fans show libertarian inclination
Date: 5 Jan 93 01:39:13 GMT
Organization: Silicon Graphics, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: vermont.mti.sgi.com

In article <1i9mnnINNgvn@transfer.stratus.com>, jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann) writes:
|> But of course live and let live is not all there is to 
|> libertarianism. If that's all it was, a lot more of us would
|> probably fall into the category.  Too much of libertarianism
|> is also "if they can't work, let them starve, but don't make
|> me spend my tax money on them."  
|> 
|> --
|> Jim Mann            
|> Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  


But that all there is to libertarianism: "Live and let live".  Taken
to its extreme logical conclusion, it also means: "if they can't work
{**and no one is willing to support them**}, let them starve, but
don't make me {**i.e. force me**} support them.

Notice that I slightly modified your quote, specifically note the text
added between the {** **}.  It is the most often omitted when
explaining the libertarian mindset, but is the most crucial bit needed
to understand libertarianism.

Libertarianism is not against charity (although some people who are 
libertarians are against it).  Libertarianism is against FORCED 
charity.  Each person decides what is important to him/her and 
what s/he will support.

If you feel it is important to support some charity, you may.  Just do
not FORCE others to do the same.  If you will not do it unless
everyone else also does it, then maybe you should look more closely
at your own motives.

/jack
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.misc
Subject: Re: THE GRIPPING HAND by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle
Date: 6 Jan 1993 21:26:26 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer Inc, Marlboro MA
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: gondolin.pubs.stratus.com

In article <1993Jan6.204535.28193@netcom.com> dani@netcom.com (Dani  
Zweig) writes:
> ecl@mtgzy.att.com (Evelyn C Leeper +1 908 957 2070):
> 
> >This is billed as the "long awaited sequel to THE MOTE IN GOD'S  
EYE."
> >Some things aren't worth the wait.
> 
> Too bad.  Ah well, the library will get it eventually.
> 
> >The Navy does seem to have one woman officer...
> 
> This is actually a step backwards from Mote, in which there were  
none.
> It's legitimate to declare, as they did there, that because of the  
wars
> and their aftermath the cultural wheel turned and women once again
> became protected/second-class citizens.  But authors who do this  
should
> stick to their guns:  To then decide that the 31st century marks  
the early
> phase of the second women's movement is to have the worst of both  
worlds.
> 

I don't really have a problem with writers portraying a future like
this.  I hope that we don't regress in the future, but we may.
What I do object to, though, is something else Evelyn mentioned:
authors who, every time they describe a woman, describe her
physical appearance, but don't do so for men.  While I don't 
necessarily find the portrayal of a sexist society as
sexist, I do find this type of writing to be sexist, and rather
annoying.  (I'll make an exception here for books written
in the first person, where the way the viewpoint character
views men and women is part of his or her character.)

--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com