HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: scottm@intime.intime.com (Scott Michel)
Subject: Re: Censoring John Dinardo Violates Constitutional Law
Organization: -- J/24 -- Racers Home for Programmers
Distribution: alt
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 01:00:28 GMT
	<1992Nov4.122101.6349@atlastele.com>
	<1992Nov6.005159.8542@oracle.us.oracle.com>

In article <1992Nov6.005159.8542@oracle.us.oracle.com>
rchilder@us.oracle.com (Richard Childers) writes:
   brians@atlastele.com (Brian Sheets) writes:

   >Hmmm, If I might ask, how does this person who was removed have a right
   >to be on the net? I think that net access is privileged and therefore
   >does not fall under the Constitution or the Bill of Rights.

   He has the right to

	   (a)	due process,

How does that natural right of due process devolve into secular, non-gov't
organisations?

	   (b)	the identity of his accusers,

Point well taken.

	   (c)	the substance of their complaints,

It's usually a good idea to let someone know what everyone is pissed off
at him.

	   (d)	the delineation of how he is misusing resources, IE, how
		   his patterns of use differ from other employees' patterns,
		   and the quantifiable consequences of this pattern of use,
		   IE, was he meeting his production goals or clogging up
		   network bandwidth ?

Grant you that one too.

   If it can't be quantified, then it's subjective and subject to being
   challenged.

I suppose that "Change for the sake of change" is a Good Thing too? But
realistically, we all get peeved at someone being arbitrary, but since
the USENET is not the government, there's precious little the Constitution
can do about it. The Constitution is a political moral code, and whilst
it does me good to see that it's spirit and intent are alive and well in
your intentions (if not somewhat misguided), it still cannot prevent the
USENET from being arbitrary.

   In court, if necessary.

Nah. You'd never find anyone to take the case on contigency. What'd you get
out of it? Damages? If so, how much? Net access again? For that, he could
just sign up for a commercial feed, save the litigation costs, and get
back on the Net.


   -- richard

   -- 
   =====
   -- richard childers		rchilder@us.oracle.com		1 415 506 2411
	    oracle data center  --  unix systems & network administration
		       Klein flask for rent. Inquire within.

Stop reacting for the sake of reacting. Or at least joust at other windmills.

-scottm
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc,alt.activism
From: john@anasazi.com (John R. Moore)
Subject: Re: Censoring John Dinardo Violates Constitutional Law
Reply-To: john@anasazi.com
Organization: Anasazi Inc, Phoenix AZ USA
Distribution: alt
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 14:44:20 GMT

Keywords: 

In article <8512.29890@stratus.SWDC.Stratus.COM> lpb@florida.swdc.stratus.com (Len B.) writes:
]To censor John Dinardo is a complete violation of the
]Freedom of Speech amendment in the Bill of Rights of the
]Constitution.
]
]I speak now to whomever removed John's net access.
]
]Restore his access. A group of us are currently investigating
]this. This will be pursued. That you violated the
]Constitution can be proven by definition of censorship.

I agree with your sentiment. However, your interpretation of the constitution
is wrong unless the government itself restricted his access. The constitution
does not guarantee anyone free speech under all conditions. What is does is
prohibit the government from preventing that speech. It does not apply to
employers or scoutmasters or parents or any other non-governmental group.
]
>Len
>
>--
>*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*@*
>The accountability of government has gone to the point where the very
>use of the law is the instrument of illegality.
>		-- Ralph Nader @ Harvard Law School, 1/15/92


-- 
John Moore NJ7E, 7525 Clearwater Pkwy, Scottsdale, AZ 85253  (602-951-9326)
john@anasazi.com ncar!noao!asuvax!anasaz!john anasaz!john@asuvax.eas.asu.edu
 - - If a field of study has the word "science" in it - it isn't a science - -
 - - Support ALL of the bill of rights, INCLUDING the 2nd amendment! - -
From: Bruce.Scott@launchpad.unc.edu (Bruce Scott)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Is Internationalism bad PER SE?
Date: 8 Nov 92 20:55:21 GMT
Organization: University of North Carolina Extended Bulletin Board Service

>Nolite te bastardes carborunodorum
>       Author unknown :-)

From Margaret Atwood's "The Handmaid's Tale", a story of religious
dictatorship in the US.

In an interview, Atwood amusedly summed up typical reactions to her book
from literati in England, Canada, and the US:

English: "Jolly good yarn"

Canada: "A rather frightening story"

US: "How long have we got?"


-:)

Gruss,
Dr Bruce Scott                             The deadliest bullshit is
Max-Planck-Institut fuer Plasmaphysik       odorless and transparent
bds at spl6n1.aug.ipp-garching.mpg.de                 -- W Gibson

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.individualism,alt.censorship,talk.politics.misc,misc.headlines,soc.culture.usa
From: roelle@uars_mag.jhuapl.edu (Curtis Roelle)
Subject: Re: NASA Coverup
Keywords: Gravity discussions
Organization: Johns Hopkins University
Date:  6 Nov 92 19:13:42 GMT

An R&D electronics techniciann (a.k.a snarfy@cruzio.santa-cruz.ca.us) writes:

>   Also,  I  note that someone on the net has viewed a video of an astronaut
>   on the moon dropping a hammer and a feather  simultaneously.  This  video
>   would  be extremely pertinent in proving or disproving my allegations. If
>   we knew the approximate height and fall times of  the  objects,  assuming
>   the  video  was  played back in real time, we'd know the acceleration,and
>   the argument would be over.

The astronaut was Apollo 14 Commander Alan Sheppard (also the first
U.S.  citizen in space).  He conducted several simple experiments
during lunar EVA including hitting a golf ball.  I recall watching it
live: he took quite a swing then had trouble regaining his balance in
the "thin" lunar gravity.  His forsight in conducting simple science
experiments on the moon have convinced me Shappard anticipated that
the present conspiracy theory would eventually be discussed :-).

BTW, a long-running exhibit at the SASM has a t.v. monitor that
continuously plays video footage from the Apollo moonwalks, including
astronauts (in full 250-lb moonsuits) giving the American flag leaping
salutes, and skidding around the dust in the lunar rover.  Perhaps
the lunar gravity question can be put to rest by timing how long it
takes dust thrown up by the lunar rover to settle :-) ?

Curt Roelle




Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:11938 talk.politics.misc:58606 alt.activism:18451
From: demon@desire.wright.edu (Stupendous Man)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.misc,alt.activism
Subject: Re: Censoring John Dinardo Violates Constitutional Law
Date: 6 Nov 92 15:54:48 EST
Organization: Demonic Possesions, Inc.

In article <1992Nov6.022453.13724@oracle.us.oracle.com>, mfriedma@uucp (Michael Friedman) writes:
> In article <1992Nov6.005159.8542@oracle.us.oracle.com> rchilder@us.oracle.com (Richard Childers) writes:
>>brians@atlastele.com (Brian Sheets) writes:
...
>>In court, if necessary.
> 
> I'd love to see a court case where an employee demands net access from
> his employer.  It would be good for a laugh.

	Soon to be followed by employee demands for the use of a company car to
"pick up babes".

Brett
===============================================================================
80s: 18 million new jobs, deficits down (%GNP), tax rates down, tax revenues up
GNP up, inflation down, unemployment down, interest rates down, cold war won
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,sci.space
From: rjwade@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Robert J. Wade)
Subject: Re: Unmarked Black Aircraft Sightings
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 18:50:46 GMT

In article <1djo0qINNs7a@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> aq817@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Steve Crocker) writes:
>
>There has been some discussion of these on Prodigy on the World
>Government subjects (Arts Club BB, "Books - Nonfiction" topic.)
>Most of the sightings mentioned there seem to be in California.
>I'll try to download some of that discussion to repost here.
>
>-Steve

aren't these our new hypersonic wave-rider planes that replaced the sr-71?

Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism
From: libwca@emory.edu (Bill Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,misc.legal
Subject: Re: Countermanding USA Executive Orders
Date: 13 Nov 92 23:28:52 GMT
Followup-To: alt.conspiracy
Organization: Emory University, Atlanta, GA
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

pierce@lanai.cs.ucla.edu (Brad Pierce) writes:
: 
: Question:
: 
:   Does the USA President have the power to countermand extant Executive
:   Orders at any time with the stroke of a pen? Does the Congress have
:   the power to prevent such a countermand (within certain time
:   limits)?
: 
: 
: -- Brad Pierce --

	Executive orders are under the President's sole jurisdiction,
	since they theoretically cover only matters of executive
	policy.  Any president can rescind his predecessor's orders,
	and Clinton has already promised to do so in the case of the
	abortion gag rule.  Congress has no say in the matter of 
	individual executive orders, but the orders (again,
	theoretically) cannot violate laws passed by congress.
	I suppose congress could effectively override a president's
	rescension of an Executive order by passing a law that
	accomplishes the same purpose.
	Bill Anderson
	D
    
: 
: --
From: cole@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Sandra Stewart-Cole)
Subject: Re: Is Internationalism bad PER SE?
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 22:14:30 GMT

In <4NOV199209152176@mivax.mc.duke.edu> seth@mivax.mc.duke.edu (HTES) writes:

>I am capable of making my own decisions and providing for myself.
>I do not need any govt that tells me how to live.
>Govt should protect its citizens from outside threats and mediate disputes
>(when absolutely necessary).  
>Nothing more, possibly less.

>These are beliefs.  It's hard to prove/disprove beliefs, and I recognize there
>are many (a majority) who believe otherwise.  I can live with that; it's the
>enforcement of *others'* beliefs on *me* by an armed state that scares me.


So, should the armed police of your city be able to force you not to fillet and
roast your kids? (hey, it's a choice of lifestyle. Just another way of 
providing for ones own needs, and making your own decisions) Maybe you should 
be allowed to disconnect your sewer lines and dump your excreta in a hole in 
the back yard (your property...your decision ) Maybe you should be allowed to 
print your own money? 

I just don't buy it. I see the reverse in the US of what many say is an 
incr4easing usurpation of power by the government. Yes there are areas where 
individuals have less freedom today than 50 or 100 years ago, but we also have
many more freedoms in other areas. In this century it has been illegal to 
advocate certain political views, even when no action on them was taken. 
Blacks, women, and young people even vote these days. AMAZING! I need not be a
Christian to hold public office. In ,ost states, I can have any sort of 
consensual sex with anyone or anything I want and not wory about a jail term 
(not yet universal, but predominant)  Admittedly, there are things one can no 
longer do legally. I suspect that if you really tried to compare the increases
in individual liberties with the limits, you will see that the limits are 
almost entirely based on the principle of rsolving conflicts that do tangible 
harm, an area you see as legitimate for government to be involved with.
From: solomon@rocdec.roc.wayne.edu (Orson Scott)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: France, Japan & 1.7 TONS of Plutonium
Date: 9 Nov 92 02:31:49 GMT
Organization: Wayne State University, Detroit
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3

On FRIDAY 11/6/92 the country of France tried to quietly ship 1.7
metric tons of Plutonium on a n Ocean Freighter to the small coutry of
Japan. Greenpeace called attention to this shipment because of the risks
Plutonium can cause if inhaled. One atom of plutonium inhaled could
cause lung cancer. (enough of that)

My question to all of you is this, "Why does Japan need refined~plutonium?"  Is this weapons grade plutonium or is it simply going to
be used in nuclear reactors?

Any way you look at it, Japan is about to get a TON of refined
plutonium. WHY?

-Solomon
Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:12102 comp.music:5152 ba.music:1956 alt.emusic:368
From: tom@mills.edu (Tom Erbe)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,comp.music,ba.music,alt.emusic
Subject: Cactus Needle Project: Symposium - Performance
Date: 10 Nov 1992 23:57:33 GMT
Organization: Mills College, Oakland CA
Distribution: ca
NNTP-Posting-Host: 144.91.4.6

Wednesday, November 11, 7:30 PM
Ensemble Room
Mills College Music Building
5000 MacArthur Blvd.
Oakland, CA 94613

CACTUS NEEDLE PROJECT

Members of CACTUS NEEDLE PROJECT (Sam Ashley, Ben Azarm, Bob Gonsalves, Jim
Horton) will present a multimedia performance of their work on the theme of
anti-democratic conspiracies using computer music, video, text and slides.
They will field questions on their techniques and interests in making
progressive conspiracy the core content of their multifaceted work, as well
as technical questions on their use of semi-autonomous musical instruments
in an improvisational context.

CACTUS NEEDLE PROJECT is presented by the Center for Contemporary Music as
a part of SONGLINES, symposia on sound, nature, technology and performance.

For more information call (510)430-2191.
Admission is free.

-- 
Tom Erbe * Technical Director * Center for Contemporary Music * Mills College
  tom@mills.edu * Mills College, Oakland, CA  94613 * (510) 430-2191
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,misc.legal
From: guido@island.COM (Guido Marx)
Subject: Re: USA President's power to pardon
Organization: Island Graphics Corp.  San Rafael, Ca.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 22:21:30 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.004206.20529@rchland.ibm.com> jdahl@rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Jared Dahl) writes:
>It's what Bush is going to use to set Wienberger free.
>
>Convienient, isn't it?

I have been wondering.  What if Bush used his power to grant
HIMSELF a pardon.  Could he do this and would it hold up ?
It seems to me that if Ford could grant Nixon a pardon for 
crimes which he hadn't yet been charged with, that Bush could
grant himself a pardon for crimes he hasn't (but may well be)
charged with.  Just food for thought.

Guido


Xref: sparky alt.conspiracy:12044 alt.politics.clinton:16510
From: vancleef@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,osu.opinion,alt.politics.clinton
Subject: Re: Bilderberger Victory
Date: 9 Nov 92 04:11:38 EST

In article <1992Nov8.185334.21172@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, ashall@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Andrew S Hall) writes:
> Summary: Stop celebrating!
> 
> Followup-To:
> Distribution: world
> Organization: The Ohio State University
> Keywords:
> 
> This is for all of you who are celebrating Clinton's win.
> 
> (All facts from Texe Marr's book Dark Majesty)

Facts! I like facts!

> 
> Did you know that at last year's (June)  Bilderberger meeting in Baden Baden 
> Bill
> Clinto was present? He was approved by this group, the same group that has
> controlled Bush from his Skull and Bones days at Yale.

Now *this* is big-time news! Wow!

> 
> Did you also know that the Bilderbergers and their agents have given campaign
> money to both campaigns?  At the same meeting in Germany was another
> Bilderberger golden boy, J. Danforth Quayle.
> 
> Did you also know that Clinton is or was a CFR member?

Really? Wow!

> 
> Did you really think this election was about change?

I get it! So it's them Yale Bilderbergers! Shit, and I thought I
voted for an honest man.

Thanks for the info!

-Garrett




Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.alien.visitors
From: solomon@rocdec.roc.wayne.edu (Orson Scott)
Subject: Unmarked Black Aircraft Sightings
Organization: Wayne State University, Detroit
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 19:19:55 GMT

Recently, in the state of Michigan, there have been numerous sightings
of unmarked black helicopters flying manuvers. They have been spotted
over Selfridge Airforce Base and in the Camp Grayling area. We believe
this is part of a multinational peace keeping force which is training
on american soil. Currently, we are trying to locate the home base for
these aircraft. If you have personally sighted any unmarked black
aircraft please send me mail immediately. 

(Sighting Reports Thus Far)

A pilot was flying through Selfridge Airspace. As he was passing
through, he came face to face with a black unmarked helicopter with a
crew compliment of 4 soldiers wearing black uniforms. The tower did not
tell the pilot about the traffic and there was nearly a collision. 

A truck driver driving in the West Virginia hills spotted unmarked black
DC-3 doing low flight training. He also spotted unmarked black
helicopters.

I have never been a person to believe in conspiracys but I believe that
there is a sizeable build up of foreign/international troops on our
soil. I am not sure what it is all about but I believe we should find
out. I have called my congressman and am going to take a trip out to
Selfridge Airforce Base today. Until we find out who is controlling
these troops none of use should sleep easy. 

EMAIL ME if you have any relvent info...

solomon@rocdec.roc.wayne.edu
From: seth@mivax.mc.duke.edu (SETH)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: News coverage of elections
Date: 6 Nov 92 16:59:00 GMT
Organization: Duke University Medical Center
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <1992Nov6.092520.19112@nntp.hut.fi>, jkp@cs.HUT.FI (Jyrki Kuoppala) writes...
>In article <5NOV199216581608@mivax.mc.duke.edu>, seth@mivax (SETH) writes:
>>No, I meant 2% *in North Carolina*.  The *local* news station was reporting the
>>results of statewide contests.  The Libs. consistently got either 0% or 2-3%.
>>A friend confirmed my hunch; the election officials delayed counting 
>>libertarian votes because they weren't supposed to win.  It made it look like
>>no one *at all* voted for the Libs., which wasn't true.

>Can I get confirmed results with all the votes somewhere?

Somewhere, yes, but I don't know where.  If have seen no vote totals published
that include the Libertarians.  Only Rep., Dem., and Perot.  This is 
part of the problem...

The Libertarian party always publishes complete results (of its own candidates)
in the next newsletter.  I'm sure you can find their address somewhere
in alt.politcs.libertarian, or alt.politics.marrou. [I am not sure if those
are the exact group names]
From: mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM (Mark Wilson)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: I Have Been Forbidden to Speak the Truth From THIS Account
Date: 12 Nov 92 15:56:06 GMT
Organization: NCR Engineering and Manufacturing Atlanta -- Atlanta, GA

In <1354@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu> libwca@emory.edu (Bill Anderson) writes:

|>mwilson@ncratl.AtlantaGA.NCR.COM (Mark Wilson) writes:
|>: 
|>: I not with interest that you support a recruitment ban on AT&T because
|>: you believe that they support censorship.  Isn't this ban borderline
|>: censorship?
|>: 
|>: BTW, why shouldn't AT&T have the right to control what employees do
|>: while using comapnay equipment.  Anything these employees say or do
|>: will reflect back on the employer, regardless of disclaimers.
|>: 
|>: The AT&T policy does not cover personal accounts and home computers.

|>Hmm.  Not certain I really understand this... You're saying that
|>ATT has the right to censor Dinardo's work account because anything
|>he says is going to "reflect back on" them; in other words, cost
|>them money.  On the other hand, you're saying that those of us who
|>feel that the suppression of speech "reflects back on" them have no
|>right to make that feeling known in the only way that counts.

You have a right to say anything you want, you also have the right to
not use AT&T if you are upset about any of their products.  You have the
right to encourage other people not to use AT&T's products.  You do not
have the right to force other people to support your opinions of
AT&T by passing a ban on the company.

|>In
|>other words, people who disagree with DiNardo are allowed a say in
|>the matter; people who agree with are not.  Doesn't sound like a
|>free market to me, but yer the expert...

I don't object to anybody saying anything.  I do object to you trying to
limit my options because the company has upset you.  If you don't like
what AT&T has done, then don't use them.  But don't try and prevent me
from using them.

-- 
Mob rule doesn't become any prettier, just because the mob start to call itself
a government.
It ain't charity if you are using someone else's money.
Mark.Wilson@AtlantaGA.NCR.com
From: f_gautjw@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: The Templars
Date: 11 Nov 92 13:16:40 CST
Organization: Stephen F. Austin State University

In article <1992Nov9.183852.5428@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, ashall@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Andrew S Hall) writes:
> Why has no one discussed the Templars in this net? (If people have and I have 
> missed it, I apologize.)
> 
> I make no claims as to their continued existence or influence on the world 
> today, but historically they are interesting. I loved Foucault's Pendulum as a 
> work of *fiction*, but also have read such books as John Robinson's Dungeon, 
> Fire, and Sword, Baigent and Leigh's The Temple and the Lodge, and Edward 
> Burman's book on the Knights. If anyone would like to talk/speculate/ or just 
> enjoy a good historical mystery, please post-up!

Those who are interested in the Knights Templar might enjoy reading
John Robinson's non-fiction work "Born in Blood".  Robinson traces
the possible evolution of the Templar monastic organization into
free-masonry and offers explanations for certain masonic rituals, etc.
Robinson is not a mason but seems to offer a fair-minded presentation.
At any rate, it makes for fascinating reading in historical speculation.
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.destroy.the.earth,alt.slack
From: pdudey@willamette.edu (Peter Dudey)
Subject: Re: Conspiracy to Destroy the Earth?
Keywords: oxygen, military, contract, Satan, signed in blood, soul, discount
Organization: Bulldada Time Control Laboratories
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 19:41:12 GMT

1.  Connector Waves Forest is mentioned in ""Bob" and the Oxygen Wars", which
I think is the last story in _Three-Fisted Tales of "Bob"_.  Didn't the
physicist mention oxygen?

2.  I have a friend in the navy, and they do indeed have to sign a form saying
that they can't express political opinions.  In fact, he is now in military
prison for complaining about unsafe working conditions on his nuclear
submarine.  I don't know about execution, but I do know military personnel
cannot appeal to the supreme court;  if the military court system doesn't let
them off, they're hosed.  Check your encyclopedia on this one...

3.  Remember what happened to H. P. Lovecraft.  Hey, what did happen to him,
anyway?  I sure don't remember.  THEY'RE STEALING MY MIND!  AIYEEEEEE!
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cardinal Yipping Mundungus, Dipped in Curry, and a Robot Arm
Don't just finger me, FINGER THE HELL OUT OF ME!  (Or send $20, or kill me)
900 State St.  C-210,  Salem,  OR,  97301
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism