HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Re: men/women, etc.
Date: 13 Aug 92 14:04:38 GMT
Article-I.D.: sei.1992Aug13.140438.3475
Organization: Software Engineering Institute


Here is an interesting intercultural note.  It is something that in the early
part of our marriage caused endless strife: both my wife and sister-in-law
came to the U.S. with the definite prejudice that "all American women are
prostitutes..."  Now I'm no flagwaver, but let me tell you, if you want to
piss an American off, just say stuff like this.  It is in essense to say,
"modar jendeh."  Indeed, it was to imply that my mother and sister were both
whores.  I don't think this was the intention behind my wife's and
sister-in-law's remarks, but I found it rather insensitive that they didn't
seem to care whether I understood their sentiments or not.  Further, I would
guess that many of you share the same sentiment.  Of course I understand that
by Iranian standards, that you have a right to your opinion.  There is less
premarital sex in Iran no doubt.  In fact, referring to American women as 
whores is probably in some sense a cultural imperative in order to protect
the Iranian value against premarital sex. 

Frankly, I think this value is in keeping with my parent's generation more
than mine.  Perhaps it is sound, or perhaps it is obsessively sexual in a 
distorted, puritanical sense.  For example, my mother took strong exception
to Indian students who came to the US in large numbers for the first time in
the 60's.  She was appalled at the habit of males strolling down the street
hand-in-hand.  In her mind, this was disgusting.  Obviously her presumption
was that this was a licentious (presumably homosexual) act.  My mother is
76 years old, what do you expect?  Nonetheless, it is my mother's perverted
frame of reference that allows her to have this ridiculous perspective.  She
can't even fathom something so beautiful as two men being able to hold hands
in a brotherly way, without the imposition of her blind imposition of a moral
template.  It is a tragedy of the mind and soul.  Unfortunately, I cannot 
claim immunity from this prejudice entirely myself.  Some years ago, a friend
of mine from Nigeria grasped my hand as we walked up a crowded hillside to
watch an outdoor movie.  It made me *extremely* uncomfortable, because I was
caught between my perception of how marvelous it was that we could actually
hold one another's hands, and the prospect of having many people look at us
and say to themselves "look at those fags."  

Life is so interesting isn't it?
From: kambizm@fidibus.uio.no
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Sharia law
Date: 17 Aug 92 11:39:30 GMT
Reply-To: kambizm@fidibus.uio.no
Organization: University of Oslo, Norway



>The above information is wrong. The victim's family has one the following
>choices:
>1) kill the killer
>2) one degree forgiveness: accept an amount of money instead of killing.
>3) forgive totally and just let the killer go!
>The decision is up to the family of the victim. Now if the killer is a 
>professional killer who threatens the security of the community, he is 
>"mofsed fel-arz" and he will be executed.(I am not sure, he might even 
>have to pay the victims' family too, if they claim!).
>This seems fair to me. DO YOU HAVE A BETTER SUGGESTION?
 
>Seyyed


Does this mean that the killer who has got money has an option
or two more than the one who has not got money?!!

                                    Kambiz
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: seyyed@wuee1.wustl.edu (Seyyed Mahdavian)
Subject: Re: Spain and Iran
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 03:16:33 GMT

In article <1992Aug18.224540.29725@ucunix.san.uc.edu> minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas) writes:

> The secret is simple. All the people of SCP talk about revolve in a few 
> diections; Pakistan is great in cricket; India sucks; Islam v. Hinduism; 
> Islam v. Secularism; India sucks; are Pakistanis part of the Indian 
> subcontinent or the Muslim world?... This has been the subject matter of SCP
> for the past I don't know how long. Along the way there has been a barrage of
> e-mail articles on which man has been harrassing which woman over the e-mail.
> Also the articles degenerate invariably to personal insults. I read SCP but
> I have nothing to say about unless there is a new and lively discussion going
> on. Most of what the people of SCP have to say I agree to some extent with
> because if you haven't noticed Pakistanis are more religious than... I for
> one am proud of that fact, but it is fraught with boredom. So why should I 
> read articles that don't interest me? That's my secret. And BTW, it's not
> like I constantly stick to this newgroup. Why don't you go to SCArabic,
> or SCBangladesh, or SRIslam, alt.weightlifting, I post there too.

I see.

> Janab-e-Alai what is the problem?

Nothing, I just noticed that you didn't understand what Kambiz posted.
This is what Kambiz posted:

>                                    In the openning ceremony Iran was the 
> only country who did not let a woman to carry its flag. This made the 
> Scandinavian womanTV commentator very angry.

and this is your answer:

>                                                                 If Mr. Kambiz
> did not like the idea that a woman commentator was not allowed to carry a flag
> it does not mean that all or even most or even a large minority of the Iranian
> culture is bad, all it means is that there are somethings that need to be 
> changed. 

So I just thought maybe other Pakistanis are smarter than you and you cannot
conduct a discussion with them, and maybe you thought that Iranians are
stupid, so you decided to post here. Alhamdolellah with your explanation 
above, I understood that this is not the case.
By the way, if personal attacks and harassments in SCP is the major reason
you do not post there, here is not a good place for you either, because
with the arrogant attitude that you have (an anti-Islamic attitude), soon
or late you will get one of those attacks.

> 
> zafar
> 

Seyyed.
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Iran/Ireland
Date: 19 Aug 92 20:57:51 GMT
Article-I.D.: sei.1992Aug19.205751.1208
Organization: Software Engineering Institute


How interesting... Ireland and Iran.  "Halle shoma chetoureh, me laddy..."

Anyway, more interesting is that in his book, "Autobiography of a Yogi,"
Paramahansa Yogananda mentions (citing Kant among his sources) that the Aryans
may have spread their influence in music and in symbols.  He says that the
scales used in bagpipes (an Irish and Scottish instrument) are very similar to
Indian ragas (and by extension almost certainly dastgah).  He cites the
eastern swastika as symbol among the Basque people as well.  Of course we know
that the gypsies have many Persian words in their vocabulary as well.  They
use the word "kard" for knife, for example.  Pretty neat stuff.  I have always
wanted to do a word trace of Persian to American Indian words.  I was tipped
off primarily from the eskimo word for boat being "kayak" not terribly
dissimilar from the Persian "qayek."  I wouldn't doubt that the early
migrations of peoples across the Bering Straights could have included some
"Iranians," eh?
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: seyyed@wuee1.wustl.edu (Seyyed Mahdavian)
Subject: Re: Spain and Iran
Organization: Washington University, St. Louis Mo.
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 01:14:50 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.181613.28368@ucunix.san.uc.edu> minhaszt@ucunix.san.uc.edu (Zafar T Minhas) writes:

>In light of some of the mail and the followups that were posted I am going to 
>repost the relevant portion of one of my followups to Mr. Kambiz's post. I
                                                                         ^^^^
>don't think I misunderstood but in case I did, just let me know. BTW this 
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>portion of the followup diverges onto a different subject matter; maybe about
>what causes peoples ways of thinking to change.
...
>
>zafar


You mean you still don't understand what was wrong with your comment? That's
incredible!!! What kind of food do you eat in Pakistan?
OK, let me give you a hint. 
Again this is what Kambiz wrote:

>                                    In the openning ceremony Iran was the 
> only country who did not let a woman to carry its flag. This made the 
> Scandinavian womanTV commentator very angry.

And this is what you wrote:

>                                                                 If Mr. Kambiz
> did not like the idea that a woman commentator was not allowed to carry a flag
> it does not mean that all or even most or even a large minority of the Iranian
> culture is bad, all it means is that there are somethings that need to be 
> changed. 

Now try to solve this short quiz in just one minute. Ready?
Question: Why the woman commentator was angry?
Answer:	1)Because she didn't like Iran
	2)Because she didn't like Zafar
	3)Because she wanted to carry Iran's flag with pride, but they didn't
	  let her.
	4)All of the above

...

Ok, I still have a lot of comments to make, but I don't think it's a good idea
to make fun of a Muslim brother.
Look Zafar, until now you have insulted our religion (Shi'a), you have
insulted our culture (you called us Persiophile or something, ...), you insulted
Islamic scholars and called them fanatics, while you are so primitive in Islam
that you even don't accept "Sahih Muslim" and "Sahih Bukhari" (these books are
so important among SUNNIES that they put it only after Qur'an!). You are the
one who posted the stupid list of your degrees and departments, showing how
self-conceited you are, you blamed Iranians of "being Moslem, but knowing
nothing about Islam" showing how arrogant you are, you ...
What you need is a little bit "taghwa", which is the foundation of Islam.
I have been very patient with you, and still am willing to be. By the order
of Qur'an, since you say that you are a Moslem, I'll accept it. But I am
not stupid. If you have "taghwa", you are my dear Moslem brother, if you
choose to be like hypocrites, I'll be watching!

Seyyed.
From: euaamt@eua.ericsson.se (Amir.Taheri)
Subject: Re: Survey on summaries of Kayhan highlights
Organization: Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs, Stockholm, Sweden
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 07:55:32 GMT

farzin@apollo3d.apollo3.ntt.JP (Farzin Mokhtarian) writes:



>So far I have posted a couple of articles in which I summarized
>the highlights of Kayhan Havaii. This should have given people
>a taste of the kind of news it has. I like to continue ONLY IF
>there is sufficient interest out there to justify the effort.
>That is why I am asking people to let me know whether they are
>interested in reading those summaries (that is all, you are
>NOT required to believe all of it  :-) ) So if you are
>interested, please post a short message to SCI (so that others
>can see it too) clearly indicating your interest. If you are
>not interested, please do not post a reply at all (negative
>replies will be ignored anyway since those people can simply
>skip to the next article). 
>      
>So, here we go ...
>    
> - Farzin
>   


I have a great interest to follow the news from Keyhan. The
business of believing in the news published in Keyhan is
very personal.

Amir.
From: farzin@apollo3d.apollo3.ntt.JP (Farzin Mokhtarian)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Re: Republican Convention
Date: 19 Aug 92 09:43:52 GMT
	<1992Aug18.221513.463@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Organization: none

In article <1992Aug18.221513.463@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> mkarimna@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Melissa Karimnazi) writes:

 @I do agree that religion and faith are important in a person's life.
 @However, I believe that the government has no business determining what my 
 @religious duty is or is not.  I did watch the Republican Convention and was


But what is religion? Any religion can be thought of as a set of values.
Now, the government is already determining the society's values (by
enforcing them through laws). And you can not possibly have a government
which functions without enforcing values (or it is not governing!)
So your government is already determining your religious duty (= values).
Therefore what they taught you about separation of government and
religion (= values) is a myth.
                            
I think what you meant is that you don't want a *different* set of values
(= religion), as preached for example by Buchanan, to be enforced/determined
by the US government.
                             
                               
  Farzin Mokhtarian
  farzin@apollo3.ntt.jp
                          
              
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: farhang@sail.UWaterloo.CA (Farhang Honarvar)
Subject: For Mr. Navid Vahidi 
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 21:21:56 GMT

Dear Mr. Vahidi,

Unfortunately my mail to you was bounced back. Would you please
send me your E-mail address.

Farhang.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: aref@Tehran.Stanford.EDU (Modda'iyeh har hAzer va Vakileh har ghAyeb)
Subject: Iranian Fortune 500 Company
Originator: aref@Tehran.Stanford.EDU
Organization: VezArateh Addliyyeh
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 19:42:44 GMT




The August 24, 1992 issue of Fortune magazine provides a
financial ranking of the Global Service 500 Companies. The Global
Service 500 are the world's largest (in terms of sales).
These Service companies are primarily:

- Banks, Savings and other financial institutions (investment outfits, etc.)
- Insurance (Nippon Life, Prudential, Sumitomo Life, Allianz...)
- Utilities (Electricite De France, GTE, British Gas, US West, Bell Canada...)
- Transportation (UPS, Deutsche Bundesbahn, Air France, Federal Express ...)
- Divesified Services (AT&T, Mitsubishi, Sumitomo, EDS, Walt Disney ...)
- Retailers (Sears Roebuck, McDonald's, Rewe-Handelsgruppe, Marks & Spencer...)

Some of the GS 500 by Country:

United States   139
Japan           113
Germany         44
Britain         43
France          31
Canada          22
Spain           16
Italy           15
Sweden          14
Switzerland     14
......
China           2
Brazil          1
Denmark         1
**********************
IRAN            1
*********************
Norway          1
Mexico          1
.........

Bank Melli Iran ranked 46 in the 100 largest commercial banking companies.
This is up from the 58th rank received last year. This year's ranking (46)
is based on data from fiscal year ending march 31, 1991.

Overall, the GS 500 showed a 15.5% decrease in profits from 1990 and a 6.2%
increase in sales.

Ranking of some of the banks (based on Assets):
 
All financial numbers in US $millions
 
Rank    Bank            Assets  Deposits        Loans   Profits Equity
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
1       Dai-Ichi Kangyo 475,831 374,631         280,889 624.3   14,942.7
2       Sumitomo        464,113 367,266         270,624 874.5   16,925.8
10      Credit Lyonnais 305,450 125,088         149,792 560.7   13,062
11      Deutsche Bank
15      Barclays Bank
20      Societe Generale
25      Citicorp
40      Banco Di Napoli
****************************************************************************
46      Bank Melli Iran 130,093 87,750          44,281  30.0    556.7
 
Change from 1990:       +32%                            +257%
****************************************************************************
49      Royal Bank of Canada
51      BankAmerica Corp
53      Credit Suisse
59      JP Morgan & Co
65      Lloyds Bank

Bank Melli Iran ranked 50 based on Deposits, 84 based on Loans, 94 based
on Profits, and 99 based on Stockholder's Equity.
 
Judging on the relative ranking of Assets and Equity, it seems as if
Bank Melli Iran is carrying a relatively high level of liability. And
since the ranking on outstanding loans is relatively low, there must
be a drain on the resources of the bank, i.e. heavy liabilities.
Liabilities include interest payments, operational expenses including
maintenance/rent for the branches - salaries - etc., bad loans ...
 
Remember the simple accounting equation: Assets-Liabilities = Equity
 
 
Aref
From: darius@edm.isac.ca (Darius S. Naqvi)
Subject: Re: Culture and Kids
Organization: ISA Corporation, Edmonton, AB
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 15:06:11 GMT

In article <1992Aug14.182514.10618@gateway.ssf-sys.DHL.COM> cmoussav@ssf-sys.DHL.COM (C. Ognibene-Moussavi) writes:
>
>etc... My mom's Swiss, yet my father never allowed her to speak Swiss with
>us, because he couldn't understand what we were saying. We belonged to the
>"Swiss" club, and all the kids were fluent in Swiss except us. I eventually
>took German in school, but it's not the same as being taught it at home,
>especially since my mom speaks a dialect not taught in schools. I was in

You missed more of your mom's culture than you realize: there is no such
language as "Swiss", unless you are referring to some special dialect of
German or French spoken only in Switzerland.

-- 
Darius S. Naqvi              mail at work: darius@edm.isac.ca
ISA Corp.                    mail at home: darius%naqvi.uucp@isac.ca
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada           phone: (403) 420-8081 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: yaser@uxh.cso.uiuc.edu (Ala)
Subject: Re: Spain and Iran
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 01:57:24 GMT

kambizm@fidibus.uio.no  writes:


>                                Iran and Spain

>. It was also
>the 500 year anniversary of the fall of Moslem Granada in Spain and the
>start of a decline which is even now precipitating!

500 years and still precipitating!



Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: bavafa@netcom.com (Hooshyar Naraghi)
Subject: Graphic Expressions (Re: Baghdad is an Iranian city !!!)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 08:47:16 GMT
Organization: naghashi

In article <1992Aug19.190105.24396@ncsu.edu> hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU (Brad Hernlem) writes:

>
>         |      *
>      \  |  \   _
>     __| | __| |__|_|
>              /    *
>             |
>              \_
>
>not
>
>         |      * |
>      \  |  \   _ |
>     __| | __| |_ |_|
>              /    *
>             |
>              \_
>          
>
>Brad Hernlem (hernlem@chess.ncsu.EDU)

Well, I hope only you will express yourself graphically.  Can you imagine if 
Babak or A. Jaber were going to express themselves graphically during their
last episode?  'vah, vah khoda be door,' as shamsy khanoom would say.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist, Brad. :-) :-)

Regards,
Hooshyar F. Naraghi
bavafa@netcom.com
(415) 324-1055
From: bsadeghi@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Behzad Sadeghi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
Subject: Re: Mo'afi , another way of making money
Date: 14 Aug 92 13:22:39 GMT
Organization: Princeton University
Originator: news@nimaster



Here is another article by Hossein, who is having a problem posting
at his own site.

From: ghbr@fmg.bt.co.uk (Hossein Bagherzadeh Rafsanjani)
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 08:59:58 GMT

In article <Bsxto6.IKL@acsu.buffalo.edu> sepehr@acsu.buffalo.edu (Ramin S.) writes:

> Everyday I read something about the regime of Iran ( or should I say the
> regime that has been forced to Iranians ) and their policies and I see they
> do anything to drain people blood into jars and drink them. 

> What the hell is this business of Mo'afi?? A person is supposed to serve
> military no matter what. Only exception is illness and things related to
> that. So why the hell can we buy our military service. 

> They do anything to make money. They send people who are serving home for
> longest time just because they want to make money by not spending it on
> food and military bases. My friind's brother goes to the base 8:00 am and
> he is home by 10:30-11:00 am , what kindda sevice is that ??

> Is it Islamic Republic or Islamic Capitalsm ??

It is indeed symptomatic of a regime who used the poor and the dispossessed to
come to power and then suppressed every opposition to stay there, that the poor
have to pay with their body and blood while the better-off can get away by
paying bribes.

> Here is another first class news from Iran. People get arrested on the
> streets for wearing colorfull and happy clothes specially women. and they
> take them in and people have to pay fine according to their fanciness , and
> if they have nail polish and eyelines and makeups they have to pay more
> accordingly. 

The same again.  Remember, in the Shari'ah law they have introduced, even
murderers (yes, not only manslaughters but murderers too) can escape punishment
by paying money to the victims families.  Those who cannot pay, have to pay
with their lives.

> Hey Down with unstable regime of Iran and it's supporters.

> Ramin

> *****************************************************************************
> * "We hate it when our friends become successfull. And if we could destroy  *
> *  them , you bet your life we would ....   "   The Mozzerman               *
> *****************************************************************************

-hossein
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: mack@isl.Stanford.EDU (mack)
Subject: Re: iran third ?
Organization: Stanford University
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 17:05:16 GMT


farzin@apollo3d.apollo3.ntt.JP (Farzin Mokhtarian) writes:
>mack@isl.Stanford.EDU (mack) writes:
>
> @   [olympic rankings deleted]
> @
> @Well, that's your interpretation. My interpretation is as follows:
> @
> @This is the rankings of team competition, that is the comparison of
> @*overall* performance of *all* the wrestlers. I would say that a
> @country (e.g. Iran) that was able to send a team, and 8 or 9 of them
> @did relatively well should be placed above another (e.g North Korea)
> @that had only 2 or 3 members do extremely well, but not much else.
> @
> @The gold medals compare individual achievement, but from a team point
> @of view, I prefer the point system above.
> @
>
>This discussion is strange! Why "your interpretation" and "my interpretation"?

"My interpretation", is what I have suggested above, which places Iran
3rd. "Your interpretation" refers to the Frenchman's way of ranking
that had placed North Korea 3rd.

>What is the ranking system used by the Olympic authorities? In other words,
>how did they rank the various teams which participated? Did they rank Iran
>as third or not?  

I don't know what the official system is. However, Iranian sport
magazines use the system that I used for the team competition. I have
yet to receive the olympic issue, and I compiled the rankings based on
the reported individual results. I'll check the magazine as soon as I
receive it. As far as the international official way of ranking, I
have no idea what they use.

> - Farzin

    --mack

P.S.
Grand openning of new .sig below. I have a 2 for 1 special for the
first week! :-)

--
When I kiss your lips, I feel the rolling thunder to my fingertips.
And all the while my head is in a spin. Deep within, I'm in love.
You're my everything...                       --Santa Esmeralda
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian
From: mack@isl.Stanford.EDU (mack)
Subject: Re: iran third ?
Organization: Stanford University
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 18:45:41 GMT

mnejat@telesoft.com (Mehregan Nejat @lone) writes:
>
>I believe the team ranking uses standings from first to sixth place
>and not just how many medals.

That's the way it used to be until a few years ago (8 or 9?). They
changed it then and now they have classification matches for 1st
through 10th place to determine the team points.

>--Mehregan

    --mack

--
When I kiss your lips, I feel the rolling thunder to my fingertips.
And all the while my head is in a spin. Deep within, I'm in love.
You're my everything...                       --Santa Esmeralda
Newsgroups: soc.culture.iranian