HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: pfieland@citron.sw.stratus.com (Peggy Fieland)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: And Coors said....(was Re: Colorado Replies)
Date: 7 Jan 93 16:11:14 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Software Engineering
NNTP-Posting-Host: citron.sw.stratus.com

In article <103879@netnews.upenn.edu> sfsmith@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Sandy F. Smith, Jr.) writes:
>What did the folks at Coors tell you?
>
>Did they express sympathy?  Did they say something about the money they've
>tossed at various gay organizations in an effort to buy back the allegiance
>of gay/lesbian beer-drinkers?  Did you ask them about how the members of the
>family that owns the brewery voted (I doubt it was against, but I'm open to
>surprises)?

They didn't say much, really, mostly that they hoped I would keep drinking
Coors.  

They told me that "company policy" prevented them from getting involved.
I told them that as far as I was concerned, this was an issue in which
they HAD to get involved, but it was clear pretty fast that I was talking
to the wall. They were PR peons pushing company policy, so I tried 
not to be too impolite, but frankly I was pissed as hell. I didn't ask
them about the family vote , and I also didn't call them on their lousy
record right back to the Vietnam war.

>Or did you tell them that from now on, you were going to cry in your Bud?

Personally, I'm going to cry in my Miller or my Sam Adams.

>Btw: none of the local bars that serve Coors Light have stopped serving it.
>How about in your neck of the woods?

Nope, they're all still serving it.

>__________________________________________________________________________
>Sandy F. Smith, Jr. ___________________________sfsmith@mail.sas.upenn.edu
>Graduate Division, School of Arts and Sciences, University of Pennsylvania
>16 College Hall, Philadelphia, PA 19104-6378.  (Opinions mine, not Penn's)

Peggy
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Nominations for best Men's cologne
Date: 5 Jan 93 16:34:49 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1993Jan5.163449.9469
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <1993Jan5.111541.5492@macc.wisc.edu> anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
>I have several scent stories, which I could be persuaded to
>tell if coaxed.

I'll bet George does, too. :-)

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
From: mickw@autodesk.com (Mick Washbrook)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Nominations for best men's colognes
Date: 7 Jan 93 21:25:27 GMT

In article <1993Jan6.222725.5130@psych.toronto.edu>, paul@psych.toronto.edu (Paul Hastings) writes:
> >
> >Or the uniquest????
> >
> Wouldn't that be 'most unique'?

Sorry--my little attempt at humor. It's either unique, or it isn't; there are
no degrees.



--
Death to all fanatics!!

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law.
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Wil Wheaton at MacWorld!!!!!
Date: 11 Jan 93 02:58:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1993Jan11.025853.11332
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1993Jan10.234115.27880@dvorak.amd.com> tdbear@dvorak.amd.com (Thomas D. Barrett) writes:
>just forget about me sending you that special GIF that came through a
>sub-space channel last week from Data (He captured Wesley and...
>well, you don't get to see it or hear about it).

hey, are there any pictures of Brent Spiner in there? I want to play too.

>So there!  You, you, vegesexual you! I even bet you are one of those
>GREEN apples!  ICK!

is "vegesexual" the sexual orientation parallel to "vegetarian"?

For what it's worth, I eat "those GREEN apples". Granny Smith and I
are best friends.
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/        You stupid vulgar greedy ugly American death sucker
From: rizzoe@FASECON.ECON.NYU.EDU (Emily Rizzo)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Colorado Replies
Date: 5 Jan 93 14:02:02 GMT
Organization: New York University


In the last week I have received 5 replies from mail sent to Colorado 
organizations right after the passage of Measure 2.  

The most hopeful response was from Rich Meredith, Executive Director of the 
Colorado Tourism Board (1625 Broadway, Suite 1700, Denver, Co. 80202).  I 
will quote only the first paragraph:

  Thank you for writing to express your feelings regarding the passage
  of Amendment #2 in Colorado.  We appreciate knowing your point of 
  view, and want you to know we are frustrated over the negative per-
  ceptions people have formed about Colorado because of this political
  issue.

The most disturbing piece of mail was from Focus on the Family.  Enclosed 
in their letter, explaining that "the majority of voters in Colorado
merely stated that no one should have special privileges--above and beyond
the rights of other citizens--simply on the basis of his/her sexual 
behavior," were four reprints of articles from their newsletter.  They are
entitled "Oppressed Minority, or Counterfeits?", "Hidden Agenda Produce 
Biased Interpretations", "Is Homosexuality Destiny or Choice?' and 
"There is Hope for the Homosexual."  Furthermore, they have promised to send 
me a complimentary copy of a broadcast by Dr. Dobson on casette.  My only 
consolation is that they have already wasted 47 cents postage on me and 
that doesn't even include the cost of the cassette or its mailing cost.  

If anyone can make use of this garbage for some legitimate reason, please 
let me know and I will be happy to mail it to you, otherwise its going to
the recycling bin.

Emily  
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I admire women who shake their heads and say, "What's the 
world coming to?"  Because of them, I hope, it will always 
stop just short of getting there.
                                  David Leavitt
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: h431@quads.uchicago.edu (heather e blair)
Subject: uchicago oks domestic partnership
Reply-To: h431@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 01:48:18 GMT

Motss.people:

The University of Chicago's board of trustees just ok'ed spousal
benefits for same-sex couples in long-term, economically interdependent
relationships.  They will announce on Jan 15, what their criteria are
for deciding whether a couple counts.

My question for y'all is, how have other schools like the University of
Iowa, or businesses like Lotus decided who counts as a committed enough
couple to get these benefits?


-- 

- Heather Blair       h431@midway.uchicago.edu
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Ambrose Bierce
Date: 12 Jan 93 01:33:32 GMT
Article-I.D.: reed.1993Jan12.013332.8549
Reply-To: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1it38aINNjce@mizar.usc.edu> hbaldwin@mizar.usc.edu (Harry Baldwin) writes:
>>There's a wonderful horror story of [Bierce's] titled something like
>>"What may happen in fields of wild rye." Stephen King stole
>>"Children of the Corn" from this story.

>I thought King stole it from Tom Tryon's "Harvest Home" which was stolen
>in turn from Shirley Jackson's story "The Lottery."
>Or am I getting my tribal scapegoat stories mixed up?

No, it turns out that I'm getting my stories mixed up.

As a different lovely motsser told me, the story I'm thinking of is
"That Damned Thing". It's an odd little story about a farmer who keeps
being tormented by "that damned thing" out in his fields. It's
indescribable and icky, and makes me recall both "Children of the
Corn" (King) and "The Colour out of Space" (Lovecraft). It also
reminded me of Jess and John fucking in the fields, which is why I
brought it up in the first place, practicing my non sequitors.

There's also a Beirce story subtitled "What may happen in fields of
wild rye". I forget which story it is, but I think it may have to do
with a murder.

I maintain that this is motss material, simply because of Bierce.
Except that Bierce himself was probably straight. At least, he was
known as a womanizer.
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/                   There is absolutely no other possibility
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: wells@athena.cs.uga.edu (Scott Wells)
Subject: Re: Southern Etiquette (was Bar Etiquette)
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:37:33 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.160434.11704@infonode.ingr.com> norris@infonode.ingr.com (Jeff Norris) writes:

>And then there's giblet gravy, which *I* define as (and I'm just *sure* many
>other definitions will follow) all-the-parts-of-the-Thanksgiving-turkey-that-
>you-would-never-eat-if-you-knew-what-it-was, chopped up with a hard boiled 
>egg or two, and cooked in with gravy.  I don't think it's milk gravy (as ScoT
>correctly identifies it), it's usually too runny.  I'm not too fond of it.
>
>jeff [who, for the record, doesn't like grits either.]

Well, glory me, I just roasted up a chicken and made giblet gravy
with the Unidentifyable Parts and pan drippings. It was lovely served
with cornbread dressing and field peas. Milk gravy is best with
sausage and served over toast. Yum. And grits casseroles, which are
perfect for the potluck which precedes the Grand Unified Coalition
Consortium of Lesbians, Gay Men, Transgenered Persons, Transvestites
and Tolerable Bisexuals for the Promotion of Potluck Dinners. 



-- 
Scott Wells                        +  Always looking for (of all things)
Internet: wells@athena.cs.uga.edu  +  Christian Unitarians and Universalists
University of Georgia		   +  . . . before the UUA runs us out.
Athens, Georgia, USA               +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +
From: joe@spdcc.com (Joseph Francis)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: BAR Manners in Boston....
Date: 6 Jan 93 11:25:06 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1993Jan6.112506.6765
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <76161@apple.apple.COM> richard@Apple.COM (a flying squirrel) writes:
>Mike Reaser writes:
>
>>Coming out of the tunnel from Logan at night onto 93-95-80-eieio (aren't
>>there about 5 Interstates that come together at once?), with eight 
>>lanes worth of traffic moving north but _no_ lanes marked anywhere, 
>>is a heart-pumping experience I never want to see again.
>
>Y'all are a bunch of pantywaists.  When you can handle l'Etoile under any
>circumstances, _then_ you get your Butch Driving Badge.  It can be up
>to a dozen (dynamic) lanes all going in a circle.  All traffic entering 
>from the right has unconditional right-of-way.  Thus, it is sporting to 
>come charging up, say, ave Kleber, and whack into the mass doing 70 kph.
>The first time I did this in my new, just-driven-from-the-dealership GTI,
>I _knew_ I was butch.  Exiting takes another set of skills entirely.
>
>Damn, I miss Paris.

When I think of U.S. Driving, and when I drive in Europe, they haven't
a clue. The Etoile is a nightmare, of course, but then there is
fabulous Britain. And Saudi Arabia, which makes the Etoile look like
lockstep SP semaphore processing. I remember the time driving in
Lucca, trying to get to my hotel, which I passed several times,
because I got on oneway streets that simply one city wall entrance to
another. There were three or four distinct, non-connected tracks.
Triple-parked on the Via Veneto in Roma, pretending to be in a remake
of La Dolce Vita. Still remember the nightmare turnabouts in a RHD
Jeep Wagoneer in Borneo. Boston? They'd get eaten alive.
-- 
US Jojo; damp, slighly soiled, but tasty nonetheless.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance)
Subject: Re: Maria Montez vs Burl Ives, or Lighten Up a Little, Folks
Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 09:53:39 GMT

Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:

>Michael Thomas writes:
>>> A more accurate way to frame my opinion is that anything Arne
>>> says has a roughly 95% chance of being a whine.
>>> Usually, a bitchy whine at that.
>>  
>>But it usually has style and panache. An observation you might consider.

>"Style" in venom and "panache" in being nasty hold no particular
>interest for me.  The kind of "style and panache" you're talking
>about tend to strike me as pompous wastes of time.

George much prefers styleless venom and flaccid nastiness, thank you.

--
thaaang@cwis.unomaha.edu * John Dorrance * Disco Diva y Flamenco Chico
      You would be surprised at what resides in your insides.
	  S7/9 g++l+(+)y++z++/--(++!!!)o+(+)x+a++uv(++)j+
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: sbgreene@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Steven Greene)
Subject: Re: ex-gays and the church
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Distribution: USA
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:34:08 GMT

In article <1993Jan05.131323.11062@convex.com> cgraham@convex.com (Chip Graham) writes:
>Recently there was a group called Exodus International (or soemthing like that)
>which was a 'ministry' to help gays go straight thru some twist of Christian
>teaching.  I remember seeing the founder on TV not too long ago saying that
>although he began this ministry, was gay, went straight, married, the whole
>schmeel, he could not quit being gay and finally left the 'ministry'. The 
>whole thing was said to be a sham. Now, I know there are several groups out 
>there who do this sort of thing, but this one interests me the most. I need
>to know who this person was that was converted and then fell back into 
>gaydom... 

From "Sexual Orientation Conversion Therapy for Gay Men and Lesbians:
A Scientific Examination," by Douglas C. Halderman, in Homosexuality:
Research Implications for Public Policy, edited by John C. Gonsiorek
and James D. Weinrich, Newbury Park, CA: SAGE Publications, 1991:

"Recently, founders of yet another prominent 'ex-gay' ministry, Exodus
International, denounced their conversion therapy procedures as
ineffective.  Michael Busse and Gary Cooper, cofounders of Exodus and
lovers for 13 years, were involved with the organization from 1976 to
1979.  The program was described by these men as 'ineffective...not
one person was healed.' They stated that the program often exacerbated
already prominent feelings of guilt and personal failure among the
counselees; many were driven to suicidal thoughts as a result of the
failed 'reparative therapy.'"

The author cites the following works for more information:

Blair, R. (1982). Ex-Gay. New York: Homosexuality Counseling Center.

Newswatch briefs. (1990, February 22). Gay Chicago Magazine, 8, p. 43.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"If I wasn't a Christian, I'd take my Bible and slap that
 senator in the head."
    --Emme Mae Martin, Clarence Thomas's sister, of Sen. Metzenbaum
From: John_Graves@cellbio.duke.edu
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: A bad coming out story?
Date: 11 Jan 93 22:08:47 GMT
Organization: TheNews

In article <1993Jan8.210920.1280@midway.uchicago.edu> kolt@quads.uchicago.edu
(Matt K/Gonzo) writes:
>Anyway, she and I had lunch today and she said to me, after an hour's 
>worth of other conversation, "Don't discuss lifestyles with Jay." I 
>quickly respond, "Oh no. We've got way too much work to do." And she 
>follows with "Good. Because he's still innocent. And I'd like to keep 
>it that way."

I think she's afraid you'll try to pick him up.  There doesn't seem to be any
reason for you to mention your lifestyle to him in the first place.  It could
be seen as sexual harassment in a teacher student relationship.

>This is from a really liberal person who I'm sure doesn't consider 
>herself phobic at all. I'm sure she doesn't see her p-o-v as being
>the same hoping-to-sweeep-it-under-the-carpet thing that so many liberal
>type people are guilty of.
Dealing with her is another issue though.  I would take the risk of not being
allowed to continue tutoring in favor of discussing with her the entire issue
of a gay lifestyle for yourself.  Whether she is right or wrong about  you
discussing anything with her son, she is, in essence, your employer and can set
the limits.  She doesn't seem to be discriminating, since you are still
employed.  And don't forget that merely talking about your sexuality could be
construed as sexual harassment.

On the other hand, wearing a political pin would not.  


John Allan Graves
Unitarian Universalist Campus  and Young Adult Minister, 
Raleigh, North Carolina

UU's affirm and promote the inherent worth and dignity of every human being
and the interconnected web of all existence of which we are a part.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson)
Subject: Weekly Summary
Organization: Madison Academic Computing Center, UW-Madison
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 93 16:34:42 GMT


In the department of things I don't want to let pass without
any comment, but on which I have little specifically to add:

1.  Jack Carroll's article on the decimation of his entire
    cohort and their way of life: as always, anything Jack
    says is worth attending, and, as here, well worth it.
    All one can do, I think, is hold the thought for such a
    friend and be there if they need you, appreciating what
    they are and being thankful for it.

2.  Don Yarman's thesis plans: an idea whose time has come,
    obviously, and I think it's an excellent idea.  I have
    a considerable archive (not indexed, simply in time order,
    not complete, and not easily accessed, but) that may be
    useful.

3.  The thread on choices in which race/culture/physical
    attributes are a salient factor: self-consciousness is
    the most unrelenting adversary of intimacy, but once its
    insidious voice ceases to distract from other possibilities,
    the contrasts and similarities between one group and
    another can open intimate prospects one never dreamed
    of before on the level of individual people.

4.  Hate and hard times: people always look outside themselves
    for the sources of their perceived afflictions.  This is
    usually the wrong place to start, and by the end of the
    process it is always the wrong place to finish.


<> It's supposed to be automatic but actually you  have to press
<> this button. -- John Brunner, "Stand on Zanzibar"
-- 
[Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin]
[Internet: anderson@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson]
[Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888]
[---------> Discrimination, Bigotry, and Hate are not Family Values <---------]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mike@gordian.com (Michael A. Thomas)
Subject: Re: Maria Montez vs Burl Ives, or Lighten Up a Little, Folks
Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 04:55:47 GMT

In article <72896@cup.portal.com>, Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:
> A more accurate way to frame my opinion is that anything Arne
> says has a roughly 95% chance of being a whine.
> 
> Usually, a bitchy whine at that.

  But it usually has style and panache. An observation you might consider.


		Mike, who is still giggling about Arne's
		      "I'd rather set myself on fire then 
		       move to *Texas*"
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: tim@ear-ache.mit.edu (Tim Wilson)
Subject: Re: Places to visit in Oklahoma City
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:47:21 GMT

A recent (the most recent?) issue of _The Guide_ featured Oklahoma
City and Tulsa.  Yee haw!
--
Tim Wilson
tim@ear-ache.mit.edu
mit-eddie!mit-athena!tim
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: coren@speed.osf.org (Robert Coren)
Subject: Re: H20, Greehouse, meteorology (was Re: kommotion...)
Organization: Open Software Foundation
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 18:22:17 GMT

In article <1993Jan11.114208.7000@macc.wisc.edu>, anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:

[of a discussion of "greenhouse gases", taken to e-mail]

> >Too bad.  I was interested in the answer to that. 
> 
> So was I.  It certainly beats the George/Arne games or who
> lives in which toxic dump for interest, in my book.

Depends how it goes. I for one was thinking of congratulating BBC for
*not* mentioning the VP-elect, but I'm afraid of what might happen if
the thread lasts for any length of time.

Mind you, I agree that the topic is interesting if discussed
more-or-less dispassionately. It'll bore some people to tears, but so
what?
From: Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Arne Adolphson, etc.
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 93 15:23:43 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
  <73226@cup.portal.com> <1993Jan10.163729.12277@spdcc.com>

Bob Donahue writes:
>        These last two sentences contradict each other.  I think you
>mean "*frequently*" not "*consistently*", and even then I'm not so

"Consistently" is not a synonym of "constantly," which is how
you seem to be taking it.

>sure I'd agree with you.  At the very least I'd have a hard time taking
>you seriously given your penchant to substitute different verbs from
>the line the posting software puts into followup that

BZZZT.  Closed mind, der cub.  Not everyone uses the same
software, just as not everyone uses the same kind of computer.
I generate my own "writes/squeals/shrills/moans/grunts:" lines.

>I can't take someone seriously who could spend a lot of time
>tearing apart someone's character when they haven't availed themselves of
>possibilities to look that person in the face when doing so...

Then I expect you don't take Arn* seriously either.

 
() There is only one difference between a madman and me.
() I am not mad.
()      -- Salvador Dali
-----
[> George D. Madison | NBCS: B8f+t+w-e+s+k+a!cv | Just say NO to razors! <]
[> It's a BEAR thing -- you wouldn't understand. <|> furr@cup.portal.com <]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: dbailey@cix.compulink.co.uk (Diane Bailey)
Subject: News Media People
Reply-To: dbailey@cix.compulink.co.uk
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1993 14:37:00 +0000



Are there any other people directly connected with LesBiGay
news media reading here, or LesBiGays directly associated with
mainstream news media.  I'd appreciate hearing from you if there
are.

Diane
dbailey@cix.compulink.co.uk

The Pink Paper - The UK National Newspaper for Lesbians and Gay Men
"128,960 readers nationwide"
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: jarvis@psych.toronto.edu (Brian Jarvis)
Subject: Re: Year of the Queer
Organization: Department of Psychology, University of Toronto
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:00:39 GMT

In article <1993Jan12.223928.29411@tc.cornell.edu> shore@dinah.tc.cornell.edu (Melinda Shore) writes:

>While there have been other notable victories and losses
>and other high-profile public protests, the Stonewall riot
>was a remarkable event.  I would venture that it's on a par
>with the events that led to the modern-day celebration of
>Hanukah (which seems to me to be about Jewish militarism
>and a particular victory - that miracle business is pretty
>incidental).  Not only were we fighting back and reclaiming
>our neighborhood *for days*, but the ones in the thick of
>it were the most marginal members of our community.  The
>Stonewall Rebellion was dramatic and heroic in a way that
>very little has been before or since.  

I guess then we have irreconcilable differences on the matter then.
I do think that we have seen similar bravery both before and since Stonewall.
And I think brave acts are happening on a day-by-day basis by individuals
and groups around the planet even as we speak.  I'm sorry they don't
make your grade.

Brian
-- 

Brian A. Jarvis,          Rm. 4026, Sidney Smith Hall, Dept. of Psychology,
jarvis@psych.toronto.edu  University of Toronto, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
System Administrator      M5S 1A1  (416) 978-3948
Newsgroups: soc.motss