From: spl@ivem.uucp (Steve Lamont)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: COUNTER BLITZ  -= Strike out against Pork-Party-Politics =-
Date: 4 Oct 1992 19:32:02 GMT
Organization: University of Calif., San Diego/Microscopy and Imaging Resource
NNTP-Posting-Host: ivem.ucsd.edu

In article <4OCT199213290297@utarlg.uta.edu> b645zaw@utarlg.uta.edu (Stephen Tice) writes:
>In article <1aijk3INN6vg@network.ucsd.edu>, spl@pitstop.ucsd.edu (Steve Lamont) writes...
>>Unless set up and administered carefully, this sort of districting
>>could lead to unequal representation, over-representing certain
>>segments of the population.
>
>I wasn't clear. The number of towns or counties grouped together in 
>a district doesn't matter. The point is that the connection between
>the locale being represented and the district # is lost. When we have
>to have a map to figure out who's in what district (even our own, as
>well as neighboring districts), then the system no longer provides
>for common recognition (or identification). Unless of course one is
>a political insider -- but representation shouldn't be geared to just
>insiders.
>
>Numbered districts are more evidence of the politics of division.

I don't think it's the numbered districts themselves that are evidence
of the politics of division... it's the egregious gerrymandering that
makes for divisiveness.

However, a system such as you suggest is also prone to creating
divisions.  Districts would be all white, all black, all chicano, all
poor, all rich, reflecting the cultural, economic, religious, etc.,
ghettoization of this country.

Hmmmm... now that I think of it, that may not be such a bad idea.
Perhaps this would result in representation of some people who are now
definitely unrepresented.

Objection provisionally withdrawn.

>>Personally, I think I'd worry more about having something to vote for
>>than the time and place of voting.
>
>I think worrying is a waste of time. "Worrying" like "fear" is letting
>one's mind dwell on things which have not occured. The fact is that 
>Americans are being excluded from voting and poorly represented. 

Well, "worry" might be the wrong word... concern is probably more
accurate.

The point here is that until we have a political system that
accurately relects the views, needs, and desires of every person,
rather than just one that serves the right and extreme right wings of
the propertied, tinkering with the mechanics, as laudatory as that
might be, is simply a waste of time, rearranging the chairs on the
deck of the Titanic.

>>It's often hard to tell what is a lie and what is the truth.  Politics
>>are frequently very subjective -- my lie is your truth and vice versa.
>>Certainly if someone steals money and then denies it, that's a lie.
>
>If someone misrepresents the stance or the words of another that is
>also a lie. The same is true of failing to acknowledge another's 
>viewpoint, which attempts to provide valuable criticism. 

To believe that people will not put their viewpoints in the best
possible light is unrealistic.  What we need is a system that is
capable of critical examination of those dissimilations,
misrepresentations, and outright lies and isn't afraid to tell what it
has discovered.  Unfortunately, we don't have such a system.  Rather,
we have a media that happily takes whatever handout the offical "press
spokesperson" slops into the trough that day and unquestioningly
parrots known falsehoods as "news."  Managed news has come a long way
since JFK's prototypical attempts in the early 1960s.  We now have a
managed press, full of Scud Studs who stand up in front of the cameras
(or sit down in front of their word processors) and repeat whatever
tripe the official sources feed them.

>250 million Americans provide enormous diversity and wealth of views.
>The media provides 2 of them in politics -- if that. And it often 
>seems they only provide one -- *spend money*.
>
>This addiction being pushed on us is killing America. No act which
>leads to slavery is an act of freedom.

Little disagreement there.

What we, the people, are privileged to observe and participate in
during our periodic "elections" is most often just an internecine
squabble between petty and increasingly indiscernible factions of the
Property Party, to paraphrase Gore Vidal.

							spl
-- 
Steve Lamont, SciViGuy -- (619) 534-7968 -- spl@szechuan.ucsd.edu
UCSD Microscopy and Imaging Resource/UCSD Med School/La Jolla, CA 92093-0608
"If you don't think people are this crazy, you need to move to LA!"
                                     - Gary Stollman