HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: cl@lgc.com (Cameron Laird)
Subject: Re: Large felines in Greece and Italy?
Organization: Landmark Graphics Corporation
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 14:07:20 GMT

In article <1992Apr1.180512.2106@beaver.cs.washington.edu> louns@cs.washington.edu (Michael Lounsbery) writes:
>Is there any PHYSICAL evidence of large felines as indigenous to the lands
>of the northern Mediterranean (Greece, Italy, etc.)?
			.
			.
			.
>that leopards or lions were wild in the region, and if so, how late was it
>before they were extirpated?
			.
			.
			.
Lions had a remarkably wide distribution until
quite recently--say, two millenia before present.
They were all over Africa, and most of southern
Eurasia.  I don't know when the last wild lions
in Greece died, but it can't have been more than,
say, 2200 year ago, and there's a chance it was
closer to 1000 years BP.  They became extinct in
Italy somewhat earlier.  A good mammalogist
should have references for more details.

Tigers still were found on the shores of the
Caspian late in the nineteenth century, and there
were jaguars (!) around San Francisco Bay at the
beginning of the twentieth.  There were cheetahs
in Europe in recent prehistoric times, and perhaps
later.  I recall nothing about leopards.
--

Cameron Laird				+1 713-579-4613
cl@lgc.com (cl%lgc.com@uunet.uu.net)	+1 713-996-8546 
claird@Neosoft.com
Newsgroups: sci.archaeology
From: cl@lgc.com (Cameron Laird)
Subject: Re: emic; Que?
Organization: Landmark Graphics Corporation
Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 14:18:40 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.164018.14349@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> prs@turing.acs.virginia.edu (Phillip R. Scarr) writes:
			.
			.
			.
>Emic is a word which actually has its roots in linguistics and more
>specifically, in the works of Edward Sapir.  Emic (and it's mate etic)
>derive from the linguistic terms phonEMIC and phonETIC.  In a nutshell
>it works like this:
>
>Phonetic:	What the observer hears in the spoken word
>Phonemic:	What the speaker intends in the spoken word.
>
>These have been appropriated to anthropology to reflect two distinct
>tendencies in anthropological research, one tending towards nomothetic
>approches which impose a western idea of causality and rationality onto
>the native subject (e.g. Marvin Harris, Leslie White, and to a lesser
>extent Roy Rappaport).  This is the ETIC side of things.  On the other
>hand, you have the EMIC folks who are the cultural relativists in a
>direct line from Boas (or Boaz, I never can remember).  Sapir was a
>student of Boas, as was Mead and Benedict.  These folks were into
>description and interpretation of native practices from the native point
>of view.  They did not feel that there was any value in imposing our own
>categories on the natives, rather it was important for us to learn from
>them.
			.
			.
			.
A couple of others have already written here
about emic-etic; I'll try a third approach.

The emic-etic distinction has to do with *style*
in ethnologic discourse.  Cultural relativism can
be a research hypothesis, a methodologic prefer-
ence, or a moral imperative, and the tension
between objectivity and subjectivity also de-
serves our attention.  Skew to all these, though,
is the requirement that a responsible ethno-
grapher be able to control with precision and
sensitivity the interplay between such emic
assertions as

	Pigs are unclean.

	American justice rests on laws,
	not men.

and their etic groundings

	Early hebrews occupied a cultural
	ecological niche in which hog
	husbandry had definite deleterious
	public health consequences.

	Well-to-do US citizens of northern
	European descent do not receive
	capital punishment.

I would gloss the careers of, for example, Harris
and Mead in a different way than you have, but the
important point is that, at their best, they were
able to communicate *both* etic and emic data, and
describe the functional and structural relations
between them.

Advertisement:  anthropology prides itself on its
unique role in bridging humanistic and scientific
perspectives.  Watch for details soon in this space
on a prospective newsgroup, sci.anthropology.
--

Cameron Laird				+1 713-579-4613
cl@lgc.com (cl%lgc.com@uunet.uu.net)	+1 713-996-8546 
claird@Neosoft.com
From: stgprao@xing.unocal.com (Richard Ottolini)
Newsgroups: sci.archaeology
Subject: Re: Large felines in Greece and Italy?
Date: 6 Apr 92 19:32:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: unocal.1992Apr6.193246.12324
Organization: Unocal Corporation, Anaheim, California
Originator: stgprao@xing

In article <1992Apr6.140720.23575@lgc.com> cl@lgc.com (Cameron Laird) writes:
>Lions had a remarkably wide distribution until
>quite recently--say, two millenia before present.
>They were all over Africa, and most of southern
>Eurasia.  I don't know when the last wild lions
>in Greece died, but it can't have been more than,
>say, 2200 year ago, and there's a chance it was
>closer to 1000 years BP.  They became extinct in
>Italy somewhat earlier.  A good mammalogist
>should have references for more details.

Medium sized cats are common in the Rockies and California today.
They eat pets and occasionally attack human beings, usually children.
We hear about them all the time in Orange County.
I see their footprints and droppings often in the parks around here.
From: dan@jonas.berkeley.edu (dan graves)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.fluids
Subject: Re: eddy resolving ocean modeling
Keywords: Gulf Stream transport
Date: 14 Apr 92 04:26:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: agate.sdmtfINNafu
Organization: University of California Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: jonas.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Mar30.191520.14628@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>, sasha@ldgo.columbia.edu (alexander krupitsky) writes:
|> It is known that eddy-resolving quasi-geostrophic models do
|> better job in reproducing Gulf Stream transport than primitive
|> equations models. Could anyone explain why?
|> 
|> 			Alexander

I am not sure exactly what you mean.  Quasi-geostrophic refers
to how the coriolus term in the navier stokes eqn is treated.
Primitive equation refers to the fact that you are dealing
with velocities and pressures and not stream functions and 
vorticities.  These are two different issues.  

dan
Newsgroups: sci.geo.fluids
From: mariano@sgrmag.rsmas.miami.edu (Arthur Mariano)
Subject: Re: eddy resolving ocean modeling
Keywords: Gulf Stream transport
Organization: University of Miami/RSMAS
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 92 22:06:38 GMT

In article <sdmtfINNafu@agate.berkeley.edu>, dan@jonas.berkeley.edu (dan graves) writes:
|> In article <1992Mar30.191520.14628@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>, sasha@ldgo.columbia.edu (alexander krupitsky) writes:
|> |> It is known that eddy-resolving quasi-geostrophic models do
|> |> better job in reproducing Gulf Stream transport than primitive
|> |> equations models. Could anyone explain why?
|> |> 
|> |> 			Alexander
|> 
|> I am not sure exactly what you mean.  Quasi-geostrophic refers
|> to how the coriolus term in the navier stokes eqn is treated.
|> Primitive equation refers to the fact that you are dealing
|> with velocities and pressures and not stream functions and 
|> vorticities.  These are two different issues.  
|> 
|> dan
QG refers to the nonlinear advective velocity in the potential vorticity equation,
it is assumed to be in geostrophic balance at each instance in time, but it is
allowed to vary slowly. Also, on a given level, the flow is horiz. nondivergent
but vortex stretching  is allowed between levels. 
Getting back to the original valid question, could Alexander cite a reference or two
that suuports his claim that QG models are better than primitive equation models
in getting Gulf Stream transport correct. cheers, arthur
-- 
*****************R.I.P., Bill of Rights, 1791-1991********************
Arthur J. Mariano  INET: mariano@umigw.miami.edu  SPAN: arthur@miami.span
Dept. of Meteorology and Physical Oceanography       305-361-4193 
Rosenstiel School of Marine and Atmospheric Science,  U. of Miami
4600 Rickenbacker Causeway, Miami, FL 33149-1098, USA
Newsgroups: sci.geo.fluids
From: rap@csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Robert Pearson)
Subject: Re: eddy resolving ocean modeling
Originator: rap@csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au
Organization: Australian Defence Force Academy, Canberra, Australia
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 22:58:39 GMT

From article <sdmtfINNafu@agate.berkeley.edu>, by dan@jonas.berkeley.edu (dan graves):
> In article <1992Mar30.191520.14628@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu>, sasha@ldgo.columbia.edu (alexander krupitsky) writes:
> |> It is known that eddy-resolving quasi-geostrophic models do
> |> better job in reproducing Gulf Stream transport than primitive
> |> equations models. Could anyone explain why?
> |> 
> |> 			Alexander
> 
> I am not sure exactly what you mean.  Quasi-geostrophic refers
> to how the coriolus term in the navier stokes eqn is treated.
> Primitive equation refers to the fact that you are dealing
> with velocities and pressures and not stream functions and 
> vorticities.  These are two different issues.  
> 
> dan
  Usually primitive equation models do not require the Quasi-geostrophic
which is valid for 'larger scale' flows. Thus the primitive equation
model should be able to include a better model of transfer of energy
between the  scales and diffusion.
  I  know of no papers on the 'it is known' (being in computer science
rather than oceanography at the moment) but I suspect that the limited
resolution/execution time/spin-up/ etc of the primitive equation
models could  lead to the statement being true.
Robert  Pearson			 ISD:	+61 6 268 8171  STD: (06) 268 8171
Dept. Computer Science		 Email:	rap@csadfa.oz.au
University College Aust. Defence Force Academy
Canberra. ACT. 2600. AUSTRALIA		       
-- 
Robert  Pearson			 ISD:	+61 6 268 8171  STD: (06) 268 8171
Dept. Computer Science		 Email:	rap@csadfa.oz.au
University College Aust. Defence Force Academy
Canberra. ACT. 2600. AUSTRALIA		       
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: mehr@oskar.uchicago.edu (David Mehringer)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: Moon's of Saturn
Date: 7 Apr 92 13:45:39 GMT
Organization: Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics

In article <1992Apr2.111433.21420@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu (Joe Cain) writes:
>I note that the 25 September 1990 EOS (well, I don't keep completely
>up to date!) announced the discovery of an 18th moon of Saturn,
>temporarily named 1981 S13. Can someone give me a reference noting the
>specifics of this body, its orbit, and official name please?
>
>Joseph Cain		cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu
>cain@fsu.bitnet		scri::cain

From _The Observer's Handbook 1992_, 1981 S13 has the tentative name of
Pan.  Its diameter is somewhere around 20 km.  Its visual magnitude (as
seen from earth) is around 19 and its albedo is around 0.5.  Its mean
distance from Saturn is 134,000 km (22 arcsec as seen from earth) which
puts it within the Encke gap.  Its orbital period is 0.577 days.  Its
orbital eccentricity and inclination are near zero.  It was discovered
by M. Showalter in 1990 (from Voyager data, no doubt).


--
Dave Mehringer            | "... But the most amazing thing to me is,
dmehring@zia.aoc.nrao.edu |   I/get paid
National Radio Astronomy  |   for doin'
Observatory, Socorro, NM  |   this." -- Steve Martin
From: seaborn@leela.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Jodi Seaborn)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Geology of Yellowstone
Date: 10 Apr 1992 20:01:24 GMT
Reply-To: seaborn@aio.jsc.nasa.gov
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Center

Does anyone know of a good book describing the geology and natural
history of Yellowstone Natl. Park?  I'm planning a backpacking trip
with a group of geologist and we would like to educate ourselves 
before we go out.

Thanks,
	Jodi Seaborn
From: jliskey@amiganet.chi.il.us (John Liskey)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Fossil Collecting
Date: 4 Apr 92 17:41:12 GMT
Organization: Amiga Network Information Systems

Due to the large response I recieved
in mail about starting fossil
collecting, I've decided to post
general information for everyone.

Magazines

Rock & Gem 1yr/$18
c/o Miller Magazines
4880 Market St.
Ventura, CA 93003-7783
(805) 644-3824

This magazine covers the fossil scene
as well. Very good, worth the bux.


Mailorder Dealers

Prehistoric Journeys
box 3376-RG
Santa Barbara, CA 93130
(805) 685-7825 catalog $3

M&M Fossils
7212 Ridgestone Dr.
Ooltewah, Tennessee 37363
(615) 238-4256 catalog $2

J.F. Ray, Dept G.
box 1364
Ocala, Florida 32678
catalog $3

Woods of the World
box 1231
Simi Valley, CA 93065
free price list

Paleo Books (fossil book dealer)
box 542
Hot Springs, SD 57747
(605) 745-5446 catalog $2


NOTES: I have been told most these
places will send you the catalogs free
if you call for them. You can probably
get more for your money from non-mail
order dealers that do the show circuit
only as opposed to mail-order. But
mail order is a good place to start.

I will be more than happy to give you
more specific info on clubs & shows in
YOUR area. Most clubs have
paleontology groups and some have
fossil field trips. However, you MUST
tell me what city,state and what part
of the state (N,S,E,W) you want the
info for. Area codes help also.

jliskey@amiganet.chi.il.us
From: chidsey@smoke.brl.mil (Irving Chidsey)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: New Madrid Fault
Date: 14 Apr 92 14:16:53 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: U.S. Army Ballistic Research Laboratory, APG, MD.

In article <pfritsch.703195539@skid.ps.uci.edu> pfritsch@skid.ps.uci.edu (Paul Fritschle) writes:
<patrick@is.rice.edu (Patrick L Humphrey) writes:
<
<>At least you're on the edge of a plate that's going somewhere -- the folks
<>along the Mississippi get to be right in the middle of a developing rift
<>valley...
<
<Is this the reason for the quakes in the middle of North America? I've
<not seen this brought forward as a cause before this.
<
<Paul Fritschle                                         pfritsch@skid.PS.UCI.EDU

	I have seen the hypothesis that it was a failed rift that is trying
again.  Question, if it opens this time where does it spread to?  I suppose
the West could just move west faster, but wouldn't the east coast have to
convert to a subduction zone?  If it doesn't, and the mid atlantic keeps
spreading, then either the west coast will have to speed up, or the Rockies 
and the Appalachians will have to really fold.

								Irv

-- 
I do not have signature authority.  I am not authorized to sign anything.
I am not authorized to commit the BRL, the DA, the DOD, or the US Government
to anything, not even by implication.  They do not tell me what their policy 
is.  They may not have one.		Irving L. Chidsey  <chidsey@brl.mil>
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology,ca.earthquakes
From: okunewck@psuvax1.cs.psu.edu (Phil OKunewick)
Subject: Re: Geology of Yellowstone
Organization: Random, at best
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 18:07:03 GMT

sgolson@trilobyte.com (Steve Golson) writes:
> seaborn@aio.jsc.nasa.gov writes:
>>Does anyone know of a good book describing the geology and natural
>>history of Yellowstone Natl. Park?
>
>_Roadside Geology of The Yellowstone Country_ by William J. Fritz, $9.95
>_Roadside History of Yellowstone Park_ by Winfred Blevins, $7.95
>
>I have several of the books in The Roadside Geology Series. I haven't seen
>the Yellowstone one, but I bet it is just what you need.

   I'll second that.  The Roadside Geology/History series were written
for the visitor who has an interest in why things look the way they
do.  It's written in layman's terms, so it's easy and interesting
reading.  But it goes into enough detail to keep most amateur
geologists happy.

   Books are available for about half the states in the U.S.; more are
coming out.  I bought the one on PA two days after it hit the market.


   You might also contact the USGS in Wyoming (or whatever state you
may visit) and see what they have.  The USGS publications in PA are
inexpensive (often free) and contain a lot of helpful information.
Catalogs are available from USGS.

Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: amato@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Jeffrey M. Amato)
Subject: Field mapping question
Organization: Stanford Univ. Earth Sciences
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 00:03:11 GMT

Thought I'd pose a question for geologists mapping in the field:
what are some of the
creative ways for carrying map sheets?  Especially in 
regions where wind and rain are factors.  Standard clipboards don't seem
to suffice (even if covered) and larger metal ones such as those sold by
Miner's are cumbersome.
From: hauk@s24.es.llnl.gov (Terri Hauk  (510)423-7332)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: East Coast Quakes, was Re: New Madrid Fault
Date: 15 Apr 92 21:51:42 GMT
Distribution: na

In article <18488@smoke.brl.mil>, chidsey@smoke.brl.mil (Irving Chidsey) writes:
|> In article <1992Apr14.110321.25305@news.Hawaii.Edu> joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu writes:
|> <
|> <What's the current best guess for why places like Charleston, New York, and
|> <Boston get quakes?
|> <
|> <___/    \/    \/Joe Dellinger, Internet: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu\/\.-.__
|> 
|> 	New England quakes used to be blamed on 'post glacial rebound',
|> but that seems a little 'far fetched' for Charleston.  What's the latest
|> guess, theory, hypothesis?
|> 
|> 								Irv
|> 
|> -- 
|> I do not have signature authority.  I am not authorized to sign anything.
|> I am not authorized to commit the BRL, the DA, the DOD, or the US Government
|> to anything, not even by implication.  They do not tell me what their policy 
|> is.  They may not have one.		Irving L. Chidsey  <chidsey@brl.mil>

The eastern U.S. is certainly vulnerable to huge, destructive earthquake 
disasters. The New Madrid sequence in 1811-12 included 3 of the largest
earthquakes in (continental) U.S. history (bigger than the 1906 San Francisco
eq). Coupled with the facts that seismic energy appears to propagate much further
from the epicenter in the eastern and mid-western U.S. than in California,
higher population densities, and lower earthquake awareness and preparedness in this area and the scene is set for a colossal disaster. 

The seismicity observed in the eastern U.S. occurs in the upper and middle crust
and appear to be associated with numerous 'zones of weakness' that are the
result of ancient (Precambrian to Mesozoic in age) tectonic events. 
Continental rifting seems to be an important process in creating these crustal
weak zones. The weak areas seem to persist through time and when their
orientation happens to line up with present-day regional stress fields (which
exist throughout a tectonic plate, not just at active boundaries), you are apt
to see seismic activity. These areas of ancient rifting are in some cases very
deep seated and are thought to be
older than the time of the breakup of Pangea, but there are many structures  
along the Atlantic margin that appear to be related to the subsequent
opening of the Atlantic Ocean and Gulf of Mexico. 
 
Charleston, New Madrid and, I believe, the recent Rhinegraben quake in the Netherlands/
Germany fit the ancient rift, zone-of-weakness category. Boston area seismicity
may actually be a zone of weakness that developed from a large transform 
fault that extends offshore to the east. Fault plane solutions seem to coincide
and seismicity lines up clear to Ottowa.

References include: 

The Geophysical Framework of the Continental United States, 1989, GSA Memoir 
172, editors L.C. Pakiser and W. D. Mooney

Earthquakes and Earthquake Engineering--Eastern United States, Volume 1, 1981,
editor James E. Beavers 


Terri Hauk
Seismology and Applied Geophysics
hauk@s24.es.llnl.gov
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
From: dsc@gemini.tmc.edu (Doug S. Caprette Bldg. 28 W191 x3892)
Subject: Re: East Coast Quakes, was Re: New Madrid Fault
Organization: NASA GSFC CDP VLBI
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1992 15:01:40 GMT

Perhaps you could clarify a little here:

In article <122637@lll-winken.LLNL.GOV> hauk@s24.es.llnl.gov (Terri Hauk  (510)423-7332) writes:
>
>The eastern U.S. is certainly vulnerable to huge, destructive earthquake 
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^
     Do you mean eastern half of the U.S?  New Madrid is in the mid west.
     (Although most of the 'mid west' is in the eastern half of the lower
     48 states-- roughly bounded by Ohio, North Dakota, and Kansas.  The
     term is historical in nature, rather than geographically descriptive.)

>disasters. The New Madrid sequence in 1811-12 included 3 of the largest
>earthquakes in (continental) U.S. history (bigger than the 1906 San Francisco
>...
>
>The seismicity observed in the eastern U.S. occurs in the upper and middle crus

Once again, is this both sides of the Appalacians, or just the east coast?

>and appear to be associated with numerous 'zones of weakness' that are the
>result of ancient (Precambrian to Mesozoic in age) tectonic events. 
>Continental rifting seems to be an important process in creating these crustal
>weak zones. The weak areas seem to persist through time and when their
>...
>
Not a flame, just want to understand what you've written.

D. S. Caprette  dsc@gemini.gsfc.nasa.gov
(A mid westerner from the North Coast of Ohio.)
From: lush@en.ecn.purdue.edu (Gregory B Lush)
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology
Subject: Re: Mid-Oceanic Ridge Metamorphism
Date: 13 Apr 92 16:30:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: en.1992Apr13.163045.14776
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

Anyone  have any info on an earthquake in Europe today?

I heard it was the strongest in 200 years.

Greg
Newsgroups: sci.geo.geology,ca.earthquakes
From: fy@lucid.com (Frank Yellin)
Subject: Re: Moon's of Saturn
Followup-To: sci.geo.geology
Organization: Lucid, Inc., Menlo Park, CA
Date: 8 Apr 92 15:56:42


[I'm posting the following message for Mark Showalter.]

In article <1992Apr2.111433.21420@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>
cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu (Joe Cain) writes: 

> I note that the 25 September 1990 EOS (well, I don't keep completely
> up to date!) announced the discovery of an 18th moon of Saturn,
> temporarily named 1981 S13. Can someone give me a reference noting the
>    specifics of this body, its orbit, and official name please?

How kind of you to ask!

The paper describing my discovery of 1981S13 can be found in Nature 351,
709-713 (27 June 1991).  The IAU has subsequently approved the name Pan.

To answer your questions, the body orbits at semimajor axis 133,582.8 
+/- 0.8 km, near the middle of the Encke Gap in the outer part of 
Saturn's A Ring.  It was never resolved in any Voyager image, but a 
radius of ~10 km can be inferred from its disk-integrated brightness, 
assuming an albedo comparable to that of the other inner Saturnian 
moons.  This radius is also compatible with the mass inferred based on 
the gravitational disturbance that Pan generates in the nearby rings,
assuming that it is composed of water ice. 

--Mark Showalter (showalter@galileo.arc.nasa.gov)

Xref: sparky sci.geo.geology:1057 sci.geo.meteorology:1890 comp.infosystems.gis:1005