HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames)
Subject:  New Command Control Product Announcement
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 12:08:56 GMT

I am pleased to be able to announce a new command control product.
Yesterday Electronic Rail Products, an electronics model railroading 
company, announced that their new command control product would 
conform to the proposed NMRA standards.

Electronic Rail Products believes that their market is at the lower end of 
the market so their receiver will concentrate on speed and direction with 
only one extra function in their first product.  Their receiver will use no 
custom chips and thus will be larger than provided by Lenz.  The size will 
likely be more in line with the current HO receivers.  The scales that 
Electronic Rail Products is working on first are HO and larger.  Expected 
price quantity 1  is less than $40.  Time frame for product is Winter 92..

Electronic Rail Products will also produce a command control station 
with walk around controls.  They demonstrated some of it in Columbus at 
the NMRA trade show.  They are taking a "razor&blades" philosophy to 
their system and thus will sell the command station with only a small 
profit.  No cost numbers at present.  It will be available in kit form.  The 
system should be available for conformance testing in early fall.

For more information contact 

	Paul Maier
	Electronic Rail Products
	113 Betty Spring Road
	Gardner, MA 01330

I have no ties what so ever with this company but wish them success.

Stan Ames
From: sdejour@mksol.dseg.ti.com (stewart l dejournett)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Command Control Standard Status Update
Date: 12 Aug 92 18:35:06 GMT
Organization: Texas Instruments, Inc

In article <4657@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> macman+@pitt.edu (Dennis H Lippert) writes:
>saw it, it was too expensive for the market).  Meanwhile the CTC 16000
>(a beast I've never heard of... not been following this thread till now)
>sounds like something I'd look into out of curiosity.  The name implies
>(possibly wrongly) a compatibility with CTC-16 and it's derivatives
>(CTC-32, I believe, and the Mann-Made system).
>I think that's a technical impossibility.  My second preference is for
>a CTC-16 compatible system.... because it's the one the do-it-yourselfers
>have been using for many years (14 of 'em, in fact).

The CTC-16000 is Keith Gutierrez's (father of CTC-16) new system.  The new
system retains compatibility with old receiver's a plus in my book but allows
more channels and does some error correcting to give better performance on
dirty track.

stewart
Xref: sparky rec.models.railroad:1603 alt.flame:11998
From: K.Buck@ma30.bull.com (Ken Buck)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad,alt.flame
Subject: Re: usps vs. ups was Re: Late mag subscriptions
Date: 12 Aug 92 16:33:03 GMT
Article-I.D.: mips2.1992Aug12.163303.15944
Reply-To: K.Buck@ma30.bull.com
Organization: Bull HN Information Systems Inc.
Originator: buck@granite.ma30.bull.com

In article <1992Aug7.205507.10527@telebit.com> bjork@telebit.com (Steven Bjork) writes:
>Well, I've heard that bulk mags are distributed via United Parcel
>Service to hobby stores, and other subscribers are inflicted with
>us postal service delivery. A pretty good example of how lame the
>usps is.

it depends, and you may be able to request special service, but most
of the bulk magazines usually come via the Post Office (not UPS).
part of it has to do with when the publisher ships the magazines -
they may elect to ship the bulk shipments earlier or later, than the
regular subscriptions, etc., etc.  i also think the bulk shipments move
as a different "class", though i never bothered to look what it was...
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: wrbanek@fnalf.fnal.gov
Subject: Cleaning Brass Rails
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 10:25:03 EDT
Organization: Fermi National Accelerator Lab

My parents have an HO layout made of old brass track which is too dirty to run. 
We (my wife and I) have taken a Bright Boy to it, but we went through a good
portion of the block (and many hours) cleaning a 2" section of track.  Any
suggestions?

Thanks.

  Fermi Nat'l Accelerator Lab.       |        |          |           |   
  RD/SOD?/Operations            .  _ |_  _   _|    , , ,_|_  _, _  _ |/  
  P.O.Box 500 MS 355           /| /_/| || | /_|\. /\/\/| |_||_\| ||/_|\  
  Batavia, IL 60510             |/                                       
                               /|    john d. wrbanek    fnal::wrbanek         
  My opinions aren't those     \|    fnald::wrbanek     wrbanek@fnal.bitnet   
  of the FNAL, URA, DOE, or          disney::wrbanek    wrbanek@fnalf.fnal.gov
  anyone except myself (thank God)   warner::wrbanek    wrbanek@elmer.fnal.gov
From: hooverb@h.cs.wvu.wvnet.edu (Bruce Hoover,Armstrong)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Command Control Standard Status Update
Date: 13 Aug 92 04:22:22 GMT
Originator: hooverb@a.cs.wvu.wvnet.edu

From article <1992Aug12.183901.14259@pixar.com>, by Bruce@Pixar.com (Bruce Perens):
 > In article <4649@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> ebe+@pitt.edu (Elmer Beachley)  
 > writes:
 > 
 >> with a open system, multiple sources and competition, will the demand
 >> for this type of stuff every drive the prices low enough to meet the
 >> goal of a $50 decoder?
 > 
 > Gosh, I don't see why not. Let's look at the hardware we are talking about
 > here:
 >
(describes the price of several components...)

Yeah, but if you add up the component price of the Marklin system, you
sure don't get $1500 or whatever it takes to get started with that
either. :-)

Bruce Hoover
From: mike@ra.cs.umb.edu (Michael J. Thibodeau)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Is there a FAQ?
Keywords: FAQ
Date: 13 Aug 92 18:29:48 GMT
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston, Dept of Math and CS

Is there a FAQ for r.m.r. ?
   If so is it archived somewhere?
      If so is it FTP able?

-mike
KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP-KEEP
chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug
.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug.chug
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu (Herb Poppe)
Subject: Re: More Command-Control ...
Organization: National Center for Atmospheric Research
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 20:14:55 GMT

In article <4791@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> ebe@pitt.edu (Elmer Beachley) 
writes:

> Doesn't it seem strange Kato is very quiet about all this?  (Actually, 
they do have
> a Command-Control system in their catalog, and the boxes bear a strong
> resemblance to Marklin, but Stan says this is completely different.)

What is the status of Kato's command control system? Is is being sold at 
all, or just not in this country? (I haven't seen an ad for their system 
in years.) The rumor I heard was that the system failed FCC Class B type 
acceptance, and Kato wasn't interested in bringing the system into 
compliance.

Which makes me ask: does each locomotive containing the Lenz 
microprocessor have its FCC sticker? Or more to the point, (assuming that 
I am accurate about the Kato rumor) what aspects/components of a command 
control system, and under what circumstances, require it to meet FCC 
regulations.

Herb Poppe                 National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR)
hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu       1850 Table Mesa Dr.
(303) 497-1296             Boulder, CO  80303
From: "steve waller" <steve.waller@canrem.com>
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: via gp30??
Date: 12 Aug 92 22:03:35 EST
Reply-To: "steve waller" <steve.waller@canrem.com>
Distribution: rec
Organization: Canada Remote Systems

BT>    Subject: Looking for GP30; should have said FP30...
BT>Sorry for the mistake, I'm  looking for an FP30 as used by VIA rail.

Brian...Let's try again...would you believe F40PH-2?  FYI, they have
59 of them numbered 6400-6458.

Steve
---
  DeLuxe 1.1 #1665  from The Minden and South Haliburton Railroad
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario/Detroit, MI
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: greene@edisto.mro4.dec.com (Michael Greene)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: More Command-Control ...
Date: 19 Aug 92 10:59:25 GMT
Reply-To: greene@edisto.mro4.dec.com (Michael Greene)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


--
|>Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
|>Path: ryn.mro4.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!news.crl.dec.com!deccrl!decwrl!sdd.hp.com!caen!destroyer!ncar!ncar.ucar.edu!hpoppe
|>From: hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu (Herb Poppe)
|>Subject: Re: More Command-Control ...
|>Message-ID: <1992Aug18.201455.23248@ncar.ucar.edu>
|>Sender: news@ncar.ucar.edu (USENET Maintenance)
|>Organization: National Center for Atmospheric Research
|>References: <4791@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP>
|>Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:14:55 GMT+5:00
|>Lines: 23
|>
|>In article <4791@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> ebe@pitt.edu (Elmer Beachley) 
|>writes:
|>
|>> Doesn't it seem strange Kato is very quiet about all this?  (Actually, 
|>they do have
|>> a Command-Control system in their catalog, and the boxes bear a strong
|>> resemblance to Marklin, but Stan says this is completely different.)
|>
|>What is the status of Kato's command control system? Is is being sold at 
|>all, or just not in this country? (I haven't seen an ad for their system 
|>in years.) The rumor I heard was that the system failed FCC Class B type 
|>acceptance, and Kato wasn't interested in bringing the system into 
|>compliance.
|>
|>Which makes me ask: does each locomotive containing the Lenz 
|>microprocessor have its FCC sticker? Or more to the point, (assuming that 
|>I am accurate about the Kato rumor) what aspects/components of a command 
|>control system, and under what circumstances, require it to meet FCC 
|>regulations.
|>
|>Herb Poppe                 National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR)
|>hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu       1850 Table Mesa Dr.
|>(303) 497-1296             Boulder, CO  80303
|>

A Kato representative at the Great Train Show in Columbus told me the system 
was not being sold anymore in the US. He did not specifically say as regards
to other countries. But he also indicated that as market demand grew in the
US, Kato would have a product on the market.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
** The opinions expressed above are not necessarily those of my employer **

Michael Greene                  Phone:     +1 508.467.2149
Networking Consultant           FAX:       +1 508.467.3106
Public Sector Marketing         E'mail:    greene@edisto.mro4.dec.com
Digital Equipment Corp.         
Marlboro, MA USA                Member, 470 Railroad Club
----------------------------------------------------------------------------In article <1992Aug18.201455.23248@ncar.ucar.edu>, hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu (Herb Poppe) writes:
From: hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu (Herb Poppe)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Command Control Standard Status Update
Date: 14 Aug 92 20:41:44 GMT
Organization: National Center for Atmospheric Research

In article <1992Aug12.141133.7093@ryn.mro4.dec.com> 
greene@edisto.mro4.dec.com (Michael Greene) writes:

> I too was one of the attendees at the presentations in Columbus. Here's
> a few of my comments/observations:
> 
> 1) I attended the:
>         CTC 16000 clinic on Tues evening

Can you or anyone else comment on what the on-track signal looks like for 
CTC16000?

Did Keith say whether technical info is available from his company?

Did he mention when Model Railroader is going to publish an article on his 
system?

Is he shipping receivers, command stations, etc?

Herb Poppe                 National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR)
hpoppe@ncar.ucar.edu       1850 Table Mesa Dr.
(303) 497-1296             Boulder, CO  80303
From: btarbox@sw.stratus.com (Brian Tarbox)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Looking for GP30; should have said FP30...
Date: 12 Aug 92 12:29:30 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.


I just got back of photo of the engine in question:
#6455   with the following designation under the number:
GPA-30c.

Is this a FP40?  If so, what does GPA-30c mean?

(it does 'look' like a FP40....)
From: 31ochs@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Looking for GP30; should have said FP30...
Date: 12 Aug 92 18:45:39 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

In article <5503@transfer.stratus.com>, btarbox@sw.stratus.com (Brian Tarbox) writes:
> 
> I just got back of photo of the engine in question:
> #6455   with the following designation under the number:
> GPA-30c.
> 
> Is this a FP40?  If so, what does GPA-30c mean?
> 
> (it does 'look' like a FP40....)
Many railroads classify the types of engines they own according to their own
classification. I would assume that the designation comes out something like
this:
GP general purpose 
A a-unit(cab, as opposed to a booster)
30 3000 HP
c ??????
This is only a guess however, I'm not familiar with VIA's classifications.
I do know that the 30 stands for 3000 HP though.
Amtrak uses F40PH because it is in their 40 series of engines, an F40PH has
the same prime mover as an SD40 or GP40, except it has a cowling(F) and
is a passenger(P) with head-end power(H)
Another was of doing it I guess would be to call it a GP40-2HF or something
crazy like that, but they stuck with F40PH, sorta like their earlier F45 and
FP45's. Or they could have done like with the SDP40F and called it a GPH40F
to. Doesn't that look funny???
I guess I'll quit rambling on for now, I have to go to work.

Fred
From: sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames)
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
Subject: Re: Homosote <- paint it ??
Date: 19 Aug 92 18:26:15 GMT
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA

In article <2199@h.cs.wvu.wvnet.edu> muth@a.cs.wvu.wvnet.edu (Wayne A Muth) writes:
>  My roadbed will be plywood, with homosote atop that, with G-guage
>  track on top.  I SEEM TO RECALL SOME PREVIOUS DIALOG THAT ONE
>  NEEDS TO PAINT THE HOMOSOTE RIGHT AWAY WITH A LATEX PAINT --
>  seemingly to "seal" it against moisture.
>
Sealing Homosote with a paint that is mosture proof will greatly reduce
the expansion problems that some have had with homosote.  It also aids
the retention of spikes.

Stan
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: greene@edisto.mro4.dec.com (Michael Greene)
Subject: Re: Command Control Standard Status Update
Reply-To: greene@edisto.mro4.dec.com (Michael Greene)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 13:07:15 GMT


In article <1992Aug13.120840.9424@newstand.syr.edu>, cwebster@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Chris Webster) writes:
|>Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
|>Path: ryn.mro4.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!pa.dec.com!decwrl!uunet!psinntp!newstand.syr.edu!rodan.acs.syr.edu!cwebster
|>From: cwebster@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Chris Webster)
|>Subject: Re: Command Control Standard Status Update
|>Message-ID: <1992Aug13.120840.9424@newstand.syr.edu>
|>Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
|>References: <1992Aug11.164254.15152@linus.mitre.org> <4657@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> <1992Aug12.183506.26698@mksol.dseg.ti.com>
|>Date: Thu, 13 Aug 92 12:08:40 EDT
|>Lines: 12
|>
|>In article <1992Aug12.183506.26698@mksol.dseg.ti.com> sdejour@mksol.dseg.ti.com (stewart l dejournett) writes:
|>>
|>>The CTC-16000 is Keith Gutierrez's (father of CTC-16) new system.  The new
|>>system retains compatibility with old receiver's a plus in my book but allows
|>>more channels and does some error correcting to give better performance on
|>>dirty track.
|>>
|>>stewart
|>
|>Is it a commercial system, or is it going to be something you can build 
|>yourself, as the original CTC-16 system was?
|>
|>

From the presentation I saw in Columbus, the components will
be available in both kit form and "RTR" form from Keith & company.
I have a copy of the 1 page product sheet with estimated prices, but 
unfortunately it is not here in the office.


Michael
From: SDupa@xview.csuohio.edu (Scott Hewis)
Subject: Re: Cleaning Brass Rails
Organization: Cleveland State University - Telecomm 
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 19:17:21 GMT

In article <1992Aug16.082503.1@fnalf.fnal.gov> wrbanek@fnalf.fnal.gov writes:
>From: wrbanek@fnalf.fnal.gov
>Subject: Cleaning Brass Rails
>Date: 16 Aug 92 14:25:03 GMT

>My parents have an HO layout made of old brass track which is too dirty to run. 
>We (my wife and I) have taken a Bright Boy to it, but we went through a good
>portion of the block (and many hours) cleaning a 2" section of track.  Any
>suggestions?

>Thanks.

>  Fermi Nat'l Accelerator Lab.       |        |          |           |   
>  RD/SOD?/Operations            .  _ |_  _   _|    , , ,_|_  _, _  _ |/  
>  P.O.Box 500 MS 355           /| /_/| || | /_|\. /\/\/| |_||_\| ||/_|\  
>  Batavia, IL 60510             |/                                       
>                               /|    john d. wrbanek    fnal::wrbanek         
>  My opinions aren't those     \|    fnald::wrbanek     wrbanek@fnal.bitnet   
>  of the FNAL, URA, DOE, or          disney::wrbanek    wrbanek@fnalf.fnal.gov
>  anyone except myself (thank God)   warner::wrbanek    wrbanek@elmer.fnal.gov
Try using a product from Pacer called RAILZIP.  You wipe it on with a cloth,
Q-tip, or something simular and leave it on overnight, then with a clean 
cloth wipe the rails the next day.  I've had good success with it and like
using it because unlike brite boys there's no little goobers to clean up.
--------------------------------------
* Scott Hewis; Telecom Specialist    *
* Cleveland State University         *
* email c/o scott@asgard.csuohio.edu *
--------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: cwebster@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Chris Webster)
Subject: Re: K-Line engines: Worth buying?
Keywords: O27 guage
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 13:49:18 EDT

In article <1992Aug20.130032.7100@Princeton.EDU> bill@soil.Princeton.EDU writes:
>There is a local store selling KLine switchers (NY Central markings) for $70.
>Since I am in the market for a diesel engine, this looked like a very good price.
>The question is whether I should spend about twice this amount for a Lionel RS3
>type or buy this one.
>
>Are K Line engines worth purchasing?  Their rolling stock appears very cheaply
>made so I hesitate even at this price.  Any insight appreciated.
>
>-Bill
>
>-- 

My limited experience -- the only tinplate I own is a four car K-line set
with the Alco S-2 switcher, probably the one you are referring to -- is
satisfactory.  I'm quite happy with it, but not having anything of my own
to compare it to, I can't really say....

However, a local (Utica, N.Y.) dealer/operator friend recommends the K-line
locomotives.  According to him, they're the best price/performance deal out
there.  You can evidently pay 2 to 3 times as much for a Lionel of about
the same quality.



Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad,rec.railroad
From: sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames)
Subject: New Mailing List to Disscuss NMRA Command Control Standard Issues
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 17:22:27 GMT

I have set up a mailing list to discuss the NMRA Command Control Standard
Issues.  Significant events will continue to be posted on rec.models.railroad
If you did not get a test message by now you are not yet on the list.  
We consider people on the list to be members of the standards committee.
Anyone who wishes to contribute can become a member and join the list.

To add or substract your name from the list please email your request
to sra@mitre.org.

The mailing list is nmra@linus.mitre.org or linus!nmra

Stan Ames


Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: sra@bistromath.mitre.org (Stan R. Ames)
Subject: Re: Command Control Standard Status Update
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 21:29:54 GMT

>Can you or anyone else comment on what the on-track signal looks like for 
>CTC16000?
>
The information Keith sent me indicates that the on track signal is the
same as in CTC 16 but with shorter time slots.

>Did Keith say whether technical info is available from his company?
>
Product information is available from CTC Products (Keith's company)

>Did he mention when Model Railroader is going to publish an article on his 
>system?
>
I some how doubt that Model Railroader will print a new article  but
I may be mistaken

>Is he shipping receivers, command stations, etc?
>
He is shipping new command stations, and upgrades to existing command stations
Shipments of receivers are scheduled for late fall.  He has not actually
invested the money to manufacture the new chip.

If you are looking for CTC compatability or all you want to do is
operate trains (speed and direction) or you must have a good walkaround
system today than I think that Keith's system is now at the top of ones list.

If you do not fall into one of those catagories I might suggest waiting as
Keller will come out with a digital version of OnBoard, Keeler will come
out with a digital version of CTC 80 Lenz will come out with a new command
station and in the background is the proposed standards effort.  This next
year promishes to be interesting.  Some fallout will likely occur in the
not to distant future.

Stan Ames


Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: rray@lookout.it.uswc.uswest.com (Randy J. Ray)
Subject: Followup on subscription lags
Organization: US WEST Communications, Inc. -- Denver, CO
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 15:56:21 GMT

I have talked to both N-Scale and Model Railroader, about the problem I had
earlier. For those new or not in the know, I filled out subscription cards
on both publications, then when new issues hit the stands before my 
subscription (apparently) had started, I bought them. In both cases, I received
the exact same issue in the mail just days later. Well, N-Scale agreed to roll
back my subscription, so that it officially starts with the NEXT issue, but I
had to mail back the duplicate issue to them. So it cost me $1.33, but it cost
less than just eating that duplicate issue. MR also agreed to start my 
subscription on the next issue, but they didn't ask for the issue back, but
rather that I give it to a friend or something. This did not suprise me, since
I have been doing business with them for years as a subscriber to FineScale
Modeler, and I've always been impressed with their customer service dept.

Anyway, both magazines were willing to work it out. So, from a customer service
perspective, I can recommend both.

Randy
-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Randy J. Ray -- U S WEST IT/CSD         rray@{lookout,uswat}.it.uswc.uswest.com
I'd rather talk religion with Charles Manson than discuss ethics with Congress.
     -me                                                   Phone: (303)595-2852
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad
From: priddle@ace.acadiau.ca (PETER RIDDLE)
Subject: Toy Trains
Organization: Acadia University
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 17:31:01 GMT

Got any questions about toy train collecting, restoration or operation?  
I'll try to help.  My main interest is prewar:  Lionel, Ives, Flyer, Dorfan, 
Bing, etc., O and Standard Gauge; but I like postwar stuff, too.
Newsgroups: rec.models.railroad