From: eje@irenaeus.mlo.dec.com (Eric James Ewanco)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian
Subject: Re: Liberal vs. Conservative
Date: 10 Sep 92 07:37:35 GMT
Reply-To: ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

In article <Sep.9.03.27.55.1992.20822@athos.rutgers.edu>, aaw4229@ultb.isc.rit.edu (A.A. Warmack ) writes:
From: aaw4229@ultb.isc.rit.edu (A.A. Warmack )
Subject: Re: Liberal vs. Conservative
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 92 03:27:56 GMT+5:00
Organization: Rochester Institute of Technology

> In article <Sep.1.03.42.19.1992.13602@athos.rutgers.edu> mib@geech.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Michael I Bushnell) writes:
> >
> >This is obvious with some parts of the letter.  It is not appropriate,
> >for example, to ask "what is the text trying to say to me" in
> >reference to Romans 16:1.  ("I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a
> >deacon of the church at Cenchreae.")  I don't see any deacons named
> >Phoebe, so I can't obey.  But even if there were, this would be
> >irrelevant, even if the woman in question were actualy from Cenchreae.

> [rest of article deleted]

> Excuse me, but what translation of the Bible is this from?  The King
> James Version says:

>      "I commend unto you Phebe our sister, which is a
>      servant of the church which is at Cenchrea..."
>      ^^^^^^^
> Also, I think that the Bible clearly does not make any implications that
> women are intended to be deacons.  In fact, the opposite is the case.

> Of course, I got the point of the article.  I just felt I should say
> something about the quote above.

> Andy  <><

You could be right insofar as hermeneutics, but nevertheless you are wrong in
that the early church did have female deacons.  Both the Orthodox and the
Catholic church will tell you that this is so -- neither of which will ever
admit female presbyters or bishops, nor should they (IM-NSH-O).

However, they will also tell you that female deacons were never ordained, as
male deacons were, and could not be.  The primary job of female deacons when
they existed (they don't anymore) was to aid in the immersion baptism of women
-- so that the male presbyters and bishops would not be accused of impropriety.

However the role of deacon (in the Catholic church at least, not sure about the
Orthodox church) today is markedly different from the early role, which is why
you will probably not find any talk about female deacons welcomed.  This is
entirely appropriate today given the current role of deacon (one of preacher,
and necessarily an ordained office) (IM-NSH-O).

Eric
--
/=============================================================================\
| Eric Ewanco - Software Engineer     For the rash and outrageous opinions ex-|
| Digital Equipment Corp, Maynard MA  pressed herein I alone am responsible;  |
| ewanco@kalvin.enet.dec.com          they do not belong to DIGITAL(TM).      |
\==============================- 2 Th 2:15 -==================================/
    "...[T]he greatest and most ancient Church known to all, founded and
    organized at Rome by [] Peter and Paul, [is] that Church which has the
    tradition and faith which comes down to us after having been announced
    to men by the Apostles.  For with this Church, because of its superior
    origin, all Churches must agree ...  and it is in her that the
    faithful everywhere have maintained the Apostolic tradition."
       -- St. Irenaeus, Against Heresies, c. 180 A.D., 3,3,3.