HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: bhv@areaplg2.corp.mot.com (Bronis Vidugiris)
Subject: Re: MORE GM Questions
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 15:56:19 GMT

> 2) Haste Spell.  2 versions.  Does EITHER of them effect Melee, Unarmed or
>    Martial arts?  I know they do not effect ranged combat, but I think that
>    if you moved faster, you'd hit more often in close combat.  ALSO, there
>    seems to be a discrepancy between the spell in the Main rules and the one
>    in PPG.  PPG states that it is for SPEED ONLY, can someone please expand
>    on that (Ie, is it for running only?)

I'm not 100% sure on this either, but I think haste affects running, jumping
and the *limit values* for same.  (You can thus run faster than the normal
human max of 10 without pushing when hasted, same for jumping.)

There is nothing in the spell design rules to limit it this way, though -
according to the offical rules, it should be possible to increase all
DEX related abilities with a spell, though increasing limit values would cost
a little extra.  The write up does seem to imply a more limited effect, but
unfortunately it's not totally unambiguous.

There ought to be a standard 'combat spell' that increases STR, DEX (and
maybe TOU) but you have to design your own I guess (it's talked about in
the spell design rules).

Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: cpearce%nemesis@nemesis.acs.unt.edu (Chris Pearce)
Subject: Testing testing testing
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 23:09:29 GMT


Test. Anyone reading wfrp anyway?
-- 
Chris Pearce -- cpearce@nemesis.acs.unt.edu
From: wolf@cheshire.oxy.edu (Clinton Richard Wolf)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Atheism
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:56:33 GMT
Organization: Occidental College, Los Angeles, CA 90041 USA.

In article <gatemail1.0b203104846484@morticia> "James H. Kiley" <jkiley@andy.bgsu.edu> writes:
>
>Hoo boy, That's a good one.  Are the ideas of an individual limited by the
>local social axiom?
>My immediate guess is, unfortunately, yes, but not absolutely.  You can't 
>conceive of things too far ahead, social-axiom-wise, but I don't think
>it'd be a problem for an individual to have thoughts a few points above
>his axiom, remembering that the axiom itself limits what society as a
>whole can do, not a few members.  Think about Marxism, back when it was first
>concocted.  Society as a whole didn't go along with it, though someone had
>conceived of it...
>
Bravo, monsieur!
>
>
>Are there any atheist edeinos? :)
>
Well, I can't say I know of any atheist Edeinos, but I'm trying to develop
a Descartesian Edeinos in Mike's campaign (Yes, Lanala exists, and boy is
she wonderful, but let me get rid of all this traditional and Baruk Kaah
mandated stuff and work out the truth on my own, according to my own be-
liefs and what I can prove to be true...)

A lizard somewhat ahead of his time... I hope Mike buys your argument (and
mine) that he can exist, since he is an individual and no one would listen
to him if he tried to spread his own views (except maybe Baruk Kaah, who'd
want him dead as soon as possible 8-).

As I said to Mike, maybe his unique views are why he is Possibility-Rated ;)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: hudson@dragon.ulowell.edu (Kevin Maurice Hudson)
Subject: Magic knowlege
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1992 14:11:54 GMT

==> On 22 Jul 92 14:54:06 GMT, Dave Wetzel said:

  MNN> Anyone out there know if a mage needs to know all the magic
  MNN> knowleges use in the spell he's designing?

To quote from Pixaud's, page 88, first column, second paragraph:

	"  Spell design begins when the mage observes a supernatural
	pattern.  The mage must have a general idea of what he wants
	the spell to accomplish.  The mage must have all four magic
	skills and adds in the spell's pattern arcane knowledge"

Since it does not specifically state that the arcane knowledges of the
state path, other than the pattern knowledge, are required, I would
conclude that they are not.

--
hudson@dragon.cpe.ulowell.edu		uhqfba@qentba.pcr.hybjryy.rqh
Kevin Hudson, Systems Manager		Xriva Uhqfba, Flfgrzf Znantre
Center for Productivity Enahncement	Pragre sbe Cebqhpgvivgl Ranuaprzrag
University of Massachusetts Lowell	Havirefvgl bs Znffnpuhfrggf Ybjryy
From: cluther@morticia.cnns.unt.edu (Clay Luther)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Test 3
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:31:42 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

Testing
-- 
Clay W. Luther                                                (214) 994-1377
Internet: cluther@morticia.cnns.unt.edu                    Applelink: PDSDEV
Macintosh/Unix Programmer for Vortech Data, Inc.
"I think the word you're looking for is AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!"
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: stgpkdh@st.unocal.com (Kevin Hammel)
Subject: Re: Stelae Pronounciation
Organization: Unocal Corporation
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 14:20:51 GMT

From my desk copy of Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary:

Stela or stele n, pl stelae : A usually carved or inscribed stone slab or pillar
used for commerative purposes.  I am sure that this is the word which West End
wanted to use for boundry markers, the even refer to the stelae in the myan
region of HLOE...  so the singular is stela, NOT stelae...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin D. Hammel
Unocal Science & Technology Division     phone:  (714)693-6871
Anaheim, California, USA 92817-8076      E-Mail: kevin.hammel@st.unocal.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
The views expressed above are those of the author, NOT UNOCAL Corporation.



Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: Jim Ogle (Ks. Jim) <jogle@aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: More hi-tech stuff
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 16:51:31 GMT


While you're out looking at the Tech 24 motorcycle in Popular Science,
there's also a one-page article about holographic memory storage (you
know, 10 gigabytes storage in a sugarcube-sized crystal, etc etc).
There's apparently a typewriter-sized storage device in development now
(no word on its storage capacity though).

So is this a piece of Tech 24 equipment being developed in a Tech 23
environment?  Or is the technology Tech 23 and the devices will just
keep getting smaller as the Tech level advances?  If Tech 23 produces a
typewriter-sized device, what will Tech 26 get down to, the infamous
sugarcube size (storage plus read/write device)?

Yes, its another slow Friday morning at the AOC....

Kansas Jim (jogle@nrao.edu)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: bpostow@occs.cs.oberlin.edu (Brian Postow)
Subject: Re: Faith(Science)
Organization: Oberlin College Computer Science
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 05:32:34 GMT
X-Posted-From: occs.cs.oberlin.edu
X-Posted-Through: sol.ctr.columbia.edu

faith(science) should also have to be able to limit high tech
"miracles of technology" stuff at the high end of the tech spectrum
that looks like magic, for example, faster than light travel is a tech
of like 28 or so [I may be way off on the number, but there is a
number] and a CE scientist will not believe in faster than light
travel. and there are probably other things in the tech spectrum that
could be disbelieved by a CE scientist. 

on another note, a sort of objective one, you could look at
faith(science) compared to Reality as equivalent to a one on one fist
fight vs a tavern brawl. one is one on one, the other involves many
people and many get hurt. it isn't a perfect analogy but few are. 

I don't know, but I still don't like the idea, it is still too similar
to reality storming, and what clinches it for me is that WEG put a
very large disadvantage to using Reality as a weopon, namely that it
gets everyone else involved and they don;'t like it. THis faith is too
simmilar, and yet I don't see any equivalent limitations to keep
people from abusing it. 

SO, summing it up, I think that the mechanism is faulty, and doesn't
fit under the heading of Faith, and I think that it unbalances the
game.

--
Brian Postow :: The Pasta Knight - that noodle head in shiny armour
reachable at:
bpostow@occs.oberlin.edu
sbp2530@ocvaxa.cc.oberlin.edu		this space left unintentionally blank.
sbp2530@oberlin.bitnet.edu

Yes, I KNOW that 6*9 is 42 in base 13.
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: "Colin J. Wynne"  <WYNNE.C@fs.sciences.WLU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Ok, a few more Q's
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 16:36:10 GMT

mly@sei.cmu.edu (Michael Yacht) writes:

> 1) When a mage disconnects, using his spell, he takes lotsa
> backlash damage. The question arises to how much.  If the mage has
> packages, that when he disco's he lowers his stats (Ayslish Elven
> Mage), do you figure the Backlash with his higher, or lower stats?

Beats me.  I don't have to deal with magic too much.  But, keep in
mind, that the Axiom level to support enhancements is lower than most
potent spells (I don't know the number -- 13 maybe?)

> 2) When you fail a Miracle, you lose the ability to cast that
> miracle for 24 hours.  Plus, you lose faith for 24 hours.  Does
> that mean that the priest cannot use thier Faith Adds, or just
> cannot use miracles?  (The same goes for Unconsciousness from
> Faith-Faith battles with Focus and Faith)

The priest loses his ability to use focus for that miracle for one
day, or until ritual of purification.  If the priest provided the
faith for the miracle, he also loses his faith for all miracles for a
day, or until RoHope.  He can still invoke other miracles as long as
somebody else supplied the appropriate faith.

If he disconnects, so the arguement goes, the focue for that miracle
is the tool required, so he can't reco until he gets his focus back.

3) In the orroshan book, there is a Miracle Called hellfire.  Are
any other GM's out there having problems with excessive use of
this Miracle?  If so, what did you do to tone it down, or somesuch?

It ain't that bad.  Damage value of Faith total, vs. the natural TOU
of the target, with Faith as a DN.  There are much worse miracles.
If you think there is a problem, however, reread the Miracle
modifiers in the Basic Rulebook:  Need not immediate +5, etc.

CJW

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>                                         wynne.c.j@p9955.wlu.edu  >>
==  Colin J. Wynne                                  - or -          ==
<<                                      wynne.c@fs.science.wlu.edu  <<
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: johnson@ebony.rtsg.mot.com (Brad Johnson)
Subject: Pulp Powers (etc)
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 20:00:29 GMT

Pulp powers have never come up in our game before, but now we
have a couple of new characters with them.  Can anyone help
me with a couple of general questions?


1a) Can the PPs received for activating power flaws exceed the total
adventure cost of the power(s), thus resulting in a net gain of
PPs?  (I'm talking about only completely legitimate uses of power flaws, 
not contrived Munchkinism.)  For example, if I have a power flaw activated
by being Heavily Wounded, it might be possible to heal back to
Wounded and then become re-Heavily Wounded several times in one
adventure (if it spans several days).  If that's a 6-point
power flaw, your power's paid for after the first time, and you
could really rake in the PPs before you know it.  Has anyone 
considered putting a cap on power flaw PP awards?

1b) Since the PPs for power flaws are awarded when the flaw takes
effect, it seems to me like that momentary "glut" of PPs would
make it relatively easy for the character to avoid any really
bad consequences of the flaw itself.  For example, if the flaw is
a deadly one, you would take one automatic wound per round until
the flaw is deactivated, but with an award on the spot of 9 PPs,
you could spend to reduce damage for quite a little while, even
if nothing else happened to help you.  (I don't have the book
handy -- Is this correct?)

1c) Does anyone else think that a setback power flaw where all
that happens is you temporarily lose your power is a really
bogus flaw for 6 PPs?  It just doesn't seem all that harmful.
(Gosh, you have to pretend you're just a normal Core Earth 
character for a short time.  Horrors!)

2) Can you have power flaws for powers contained in gadgets?

3) Do you have any other cautionary tales of pulp powers?

Thanks for the info,
Brad Johnson (johnson@ebony.rtsg.mot.com)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: bhv@areaplg2.corp.mot.com (Bronis Vidugiris)
Subject: Re: Spell Design example; Q: Making a permenent spell?
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 17:59:44 GMT

> You shouldn't try to get fancy -- your math fails horribly in your
> parenthetical comment. The Torg value, five times the common log of
> the measurement, is the logarithm to the base (roughly) 1.5849, or the
> common log of the fifth power of the measurement.

Ooops!
You're exactly right, of course.  [Except I'd say log10 rather than the
equivalent common log personally.]

BTW - it does turn out to be more efficient to roll many times rather
than spend a lot of time on the first roll, at least if you intend to
spend less than a month on it.

Here's the result I got for the expected value of the maximum bonus rolled
in N attempts:

 1 roll     2 rolls    3 rolls    4 rolls
-0.834665   2.335808   3.805090   4.691499

For comparision, the value for 4 weeks spent for 4 rolls would be +3,
yielding an expected result of about 3.2.

There does seem to be a point of diminishing returns for multiple rolls,
ultimately, but not unless you're planning to spend a *lot* of time to
really get a good result.

Here's the probablility I got/used of gaining any particular bonus number
for the above, BTW:

-12   0.050000
-10   0.050000
-8   0.100000
-5   0.100000
-2   0.100000
-1   0.050000
0   0.105000
1   0.105000
2   0.052500
3   0.052500
4   0.052500
5   0.052500
6   0.052500
7   0.000000
8   0.025625
9   0.020500
10   0.014406
11   0.011525
12   0.002002
13   0.001601
14   0.000820
15   0.000656
16   0.000141
17   0.000113
18   0.000048
19   0.000038
20   0.000009
From: cdr@kpc.com (Carl Rigney)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Serialized Torg
Date: 30 Jul 92 04:52:03 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

In article <gatemail1.0b203101636385@morticia> 
albert@crick.ssctr.bcm.tmc.edu writes:
>(And I'm getting really tired of Opponent Fails cards causing
>mega villains to whiff their shots.)

So go through the drama deck beforehand and remove all or all but one
of the Opponent Fails cards.

If you're *really* tired of it, *then* send 'em to Orrorsh! :-)

--
Carl Rigney
cdr@kpc.com

"It's a fact -- Torg vehicles ALWAYS explode" -- Chris Pearce
From: bhv@areaplg2.corp.mot.com (Bronis Vidugiris)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Re: Torg PDF's
Date: 28 Jul 92 22:07:27 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

> 
> Torg PDF's 
> 
> Assumes skilled and unstymied roller
> 
> 
>  Range       Prob./Digit in Range        Cumulative Prob. to Top of Range
>  -----       --------------------        --------------------------------
>   1-9                5%                                 45%
>  11-19               5.25%                              92.25%
>  21-29               0.5125%                            96.8625%
>  31-39               0.27563%                           99.34317%
                                                          ^^^^^^^^

>  41-49               0.05253%                           99.81594%
>  51-59               0.01641%                           99.96363%

I get a different number for this one value only!  (I only looked at
the cumulative numbers)

I get:
99.4556%

Doing a consistency check, (p <= 40) =
90% chance rolling anything but a 10 or 20 +
5% chance of rolling a 10 and 96.8625 chance of rolling <= 30
5% chance of rolling a 20 and 92.25% chance of rolling <= 20
---
.9 + .05*.968625  + .05*.9225

99.456% chance of rolling <= 40, given above

This may explain the small difference we had in expectation of the
bonus number, though I didn't double check this figure.  [Also, I truncated
the bonus at 40 for my expectation calculation, perhaps a bit early.]

---
cumulative probability of rolling less than or equal to specified bonus

-12   0.050000
-10   0.100000
-8   0.200000
-5   0.300000
-2   0.400000
-1   0.450000
0   0.555000
1   0.660000
2   0.712500
3   0.765000
4   0.817500
5   0.870000
6   0.922500
7   0.922500
8   0.948125
9   0.968625
10   0.983031
11   0.994556
12   0.996558
13   0.998159
14   0.998979
15   0.999636           non glory
------------------------
16   0.999777
17   0.999890
18   0.999938
19   0.999976
20   0.999986
21   0.999993
22   0.999996
23   0.999998
24   0.999998
From: cluther@morticia.cnns.unt.edu (Clay Luther)
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
Subject: Testing
Date: 23 Jul 92 16:19:32 GMT
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b

Testing.

-- 
Clay W. Luther                                                (214) 994-1377
Internet: cluther@morticia.cnns.unt.edu                    Applelink: PDSDEV
Macintosh/Unix Programmer for Vortech Data, Inc.
"I think the word you're looking for is AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!"
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: hudson@dragon.ulowell.edu (Kevin Maurice Hudson)
Subject: Uniqueness and change target
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 18:20:15 GMT

==> On Tue, 21 Jul 92 13:37:27 EDT, "Terence A. Wynne" <taw8h@uva.pcmail.Virginia.EDU> said:

  TAW> I may be mistaken, but I think uniqueness means the spell will
  TAW> only effect one target per casting.  If the duration of the
  TAW> spell was made greater than zero, uniqueness means you can't
  TAW> shift targets.

The problem with this is that to change the target of a spell (or even
do multiple targets in a single casting) you need to have the change
target aspect.  A spell always goes in a straight line to a single
target unless apportation, area/volume, and/or change target are
designed into the spell.  

This seems to be a limitation enough without needing uniqueness.  I
interpret uniqueness to mean one and only one unique creature/person.
Remember a difference named is a difference perceived.

--
hudson@dragon.cpe.ulowell.edu		uhqfba@qentba.pcr.hybjryy.rqh
Kevin Hudson, Systems Manager		Xriva Uhqfba, Flfgrzf Znantre
Center for Productivity Enahncement	Pragre sbe Cebqhpgvivgl Ranuaprzrag
University of Massachusetts Lowell	Havirefvgl bs Znffnpuhfrggf Ybjryy
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: "Colin J. Wynne"  <WYNNE.C@fs.sciences.WLU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Cyberpsychosis spell
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 15:30:13 GMT

Dave Wetzel writes:
{about TAW's PsyberCychosis spell}

> Duration = 0?  The psychosis only lasts for the round it's cast?
> Or am I missing something?

Cychosis (like the abbreviation?) is an instant effect.  If the spell
goes off, a Cychosis check is triggered.  That's all the caster needs
to worry about.  The results of the spell are non-magical, and need
not be contained within the pattern of the spell.

This is an example of an immediate effect that has lasting
consequences.  Since the purpose of the spell is to induce a Cychosis
check, the duration need only cover the length of the check, which is
instantaneous.

> On the theorums, I don't get "uniqueness".  Doesn't uniqueness
> imply one specific person?  To get uniqueness, wouldn't the spell
> have to be "Invoke Cyberpsychosis in the Cyperpope" for example?

I am not quite sure this jives with the rules.  I suppose the
explanation of the creator was "Uniqueness <-> only one person
affected at a time".  But, on an instantaneous spell, that doesn't
seem like a very limiting limitation (as per Hero system: a
limitation that does not limit the character is NOT worth anything!).
The only real "limitation" this use of the theorem implies is that
you couldn't use OoM to affect more than one target with it per
casting.

Since I have not designed any of my own spells yet, and have only
read the Spell Creation system a couple of times, I'd like to hear
what the rules (or, if they're ambiguous, what some of you magic-
mongers out there) have to say about this application of Uniqueness.
I can't recall exactly, but it does seem a bit funny to me.

CJW

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>                                         wynne.c.j@p9955.wlu.edu  >>
==  Colin J. Wynne                                  - or -          ==
<<                                      wynne.c@fs.science.wlu.edu  <<
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Newsgroups: alt.games.torg
From: malloy@nprdc.navy.mil (Sean Malloy)
Subject: Re: A Sean Sort Of Question (WWII rifle - panzerbusche)
X-Gated-By: The Black Marble Wombat@morticia.cnns.unt.edu
X-Gated-From: torg mailing list
Organization: University of North Texas
X-Gatemail-Version: 1.0b
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 19:23:14 GMT

> Sean, any other gun designs you have already done and online?  Good stuff.
> (and I'm still waiting to see your vehicle stuff. *drool* *slobber* :)

Well, I've got a rough cut on the explosives rules; I've tried to cut
them down to a quick-and-dirty set of computations to make them easier
to use.

Explosives:

To determine the damage from an explosive charge, determine what the
TNT equivalent charge weight in kilograms is. Most high explosives
will be close to that of TNT, so you can skip this step if you like.

Example: A 1500g charge of an explosive with a 1.05 multiplier
relative to TNT has an equivalent charge weight of 1.575kg TNT.

The blast radius for this charge, in meters, is equal to 35 times the
square root of the equivalent charge weight:

                         ___
		R = 35 \/wt

To determine the base DV for this charge, divide the blast radius by 2
and add 8:

                           R
		DV = 10 + ---
                           2


All targets within the blast radius of an explosion are 'hit' by the
explosion, and generate separate Bonus Number for each target in the
area (unless you've got a bunch of Ords, then just make one roll and
apply it to all of them for speed); the DV at a distance from the 
center of the explosion is the base DV for the explosive charge minus
one-half the distance in meters from the center of the explosive:

                             R
		DV  = DV  + ---
                  R     B    2

This isn't entirely accurate, but it's a quick approximation that
won't slow the game down much.

-- 
random sig #51:
Sean Malloy                                  | 
Navy Personnel Research & Development Center | If ignorance is bliss, why aren't
San Diego, CA 92152-6800                     | more people happy?
malloy@nprdc.navy.mil                        | 
Newsgroups: alt.games.torg