HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: akbar@cs.mcgill.ca (Alain BOUCHARD)
Subject: Re: UNGAY GAY
Organization: SOCS - Mcgill University, Montreal, Canada
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1992 10:48:35 GMT

In article <1992Aug12.203002.659@uwm.edu> pst@csd4.csd.uwm.edu 
(Peter Stephen Thomas Iii) writes:
[Bob Donahue's article on HWP, linear density and volumetric density deleted]
>Hmmm, nice idea, but let's try for more accuracy!  Instead of averaging out,
>just get this HUGE graduated cylinder, fill it half way with water and dunk
>our test subject.  Make sure he's completely submerged for an accurate volume
>test.
>
>Take the difference with between the two volumes (water with test subject and
>water without test subject) to find true volume.  This had best be done with
>the test subject wearing no clothes.  
>
>Now take the dry weight of the subject and divide by volume to obtain an
>accurate, averaged mass/volume density.   ...
>
>...  See, isn't that nice and simple!
>
>Now where can we find these *HUGE*  *GRADUATED*  *CYLINDERS*

I think we could save some time by putting the huge graduated cylinder 
on a calibrated scale.  Record the mass and the volume, dip the subject,
record the difference, and then  VOILA!  The only problem is that the
subject needs to exhale before submersion so that the air in the lungs
is not weighted.  This will decrease the volume slightly but the ratio
should not suffer too much.

A nice side effect of the experiment will be the lovely blue coloration 
of the subject while waiting for steady state of the water-air interface 
before taking the readings.

Alain (blame it on the full moon)
From: fjvwing@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Introduction
Date: 20 Aug 92 13:05:48 GMT

anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
>Honey, it's hell being over the hill.  Thought you'd like
>to know.

Well, you should certainly kno.......never mind. :P ;>

>And I'm a staunch partisan of your using your full name,
>which I think is gorgeous.

It reflects me, I guess.        ( even more :)
							  , 
						FJ!! (Fabian Jacob, for
						all those wondering)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: twpierce@amhux1.amherst.edu (Tim Pierce)
Subject: Re: Sexual attraction
Organization: Amherst College, Amherst MA
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 14:26:52 GMT

In article <64047@cup.portal.com> Furr@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:

>Of course, I've just recently been in a flame war on a local BBS
>on a related topic, and a semi-neutral observer noted that (at
>least in this particular context) when a Bear-lover such as
>myself made a comment directly equivalent to one made by someone
>into another type, it was *perceived* as being much more hostile
>and negative, judgemental, &c.  It's been interesting.

Ah.  Now was that "when a Bear-lover such as yourself made such a
comment," or "when someone with a history of posts as fiery and
indignant as yours made such a comment?" :-) Serious question, anyway;
if you and Larry Stratton made similar borderline-hostile statements,
I'd probably judge yours to be more aggressive, but the same rule
would apply if you and BBC made similar comments.

-- 
____ Tim Pierce                / "Bisexual just means you pay for it."
\  / twpierce@amherst.edu      /  
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /   -- Rock Hudson
From: rcw@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM (Robert White)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Gay Homophobia (was Re: Too straight looking to be gay???) (was re: UNGAY GAY)
Date: 19 Aug 92 07:49:15 GMT
Organization: The WhiteStar Corporation

In article <1992Aug17.231434.13126@microsoft.com> bobsarv@microsoft.com (Bob Sarver) writes:
>Because of what people like you do / say, it becomes very hard for
>those in the closet to ever come out.  Again:  people like you
>make coming out very difficult to do, because the precedents set 
>are not positive ones.  

Rubbish.  If it weren't for the activists over the last 20 to 30 years,
we'd all still be in the closet.  The brave few have paved the
way for the many, and frankly the work is far from over yet.

What a perfectly odd perspective you have.  There have always been
weenies who are unwilling to stand up for their rights, and there
always will be.  We really can't take the time to worry about them,
but rather forge ahead whenever possible.  If that means green
hair and spikes around my neck to eliminate invisibility, so be it.

>To illustrate:  Lt. Tracy Thorne, the naval aviator who came out on 
>national TV (ABC News Nightline), did more for the cause of 
>gay acceptance in America than all the leather parades & drag
>queens will ever do.
>Why?  Because he was nonthreatening, calm, reasonable, and firmly
>believed in his rights as an individual.  

You've purchased the typical straight definition of "nonthreatening, 
calm, reasonable..."  The definition of these terms is probably quite
different from person to person.  I am unaware of any revolution, even
scientific revolutions, which were achieved exclusively through such means.  
If African Americans had taken this approach, they would have gained
nothing during the civil rights battle of the 60s.

>People across America
>looked at Thorne and said, "My god, he looks just like my son / my
>neighbor / my friend."  It made America sit up and take notice.
>Same for Col. Kammemyer; another bright, hardworking individual who
>stated her case with conviction and calm assurance that she was
>in the right.

For what it's worth, my brother made the comment "great, another
fag purged from the military".  I just don't agree that it has
the effect that you'd like it to have.  Those people who are educated
enough to care are already converted.  You certainly can't change the
minds of fundamentalists like my brother, so you have to fight for 
equal rights in any way that you can.  The alternative is to be ignored
in the hope that you will just "go away".

-- 
  [   Robert Carleton White, Jr.                      rcw@scicom.alphacdc.com]
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: mls@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (mike.siemon)
Subject: Re: name the similarity [game!]
Organization: AT&T
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 15:16:23 GMT
Summary: a Tolkienesque correction

In article <1992Aug17.045516.29802@wam.umd.edu>, jns@wam.umd.edu
(J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:

> George Dalton Madison (Furr@cup.portal.com) wrote:
 
> > Nelson Minar writes:
> > >ObDish: What's there in common between Sim Aberson and Robert Coren?
> > 
> > Aside from the fact they both have facial hair?  ;-)

> The letters 'b', 'e', 'r', 'o', and 'n'?

> > [Y'all were *expecting* this comment -- I couldn't let you down.]

In line with our expectations of George's reaction, I should think
that the letters should be reordered to "beorn"
-- 
Michael L. Siemon		The Son of Man has come eating and drinking;
				and you say "Behold, a glutton and a drunkard,
mls@usl.com			a friend of tax collectors and sinners."  And
standard disclaimer		yet, Wisdom is justified by all her children.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: kjaskiew@zeus.calpoly.edu (Keith Ross Jaskiewicz)
Subject: Re: UNGAY GAY ad report (probably the last)
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 14:38:12 GMT

adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
>amz@cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky) writes:
>
>> meanwhile, i have this picture of "richard" meeting his ad-date
>> "robert" in syracuse or denver or san luis obispo, [...]
>
>And this is *exactly* what strikes me still as so fishy about
>the Ungay Gay ad.  Why would someone in Boston place an ad
>in Syracuse or, of all places, *SAN* *LUIS* *OBISPO*?  The only

And why, pray tell, should he not want to place an ad in San Luis Obispo?
Perhaps because he wanted to go fishing in an area known for its high
percentage of intelligent, attractive men?   :)

____________________________
Keith
kjaskiew@polyslo.calpoly.edu
kjaskiew@demeter.calpoly.edu
From: amz@cis.ohio-state.edu (Arnold M Zwicky)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: "Smut"
Summary: lyrics by lehrer
Date: 20 Aug 92 19:53:17 GMT
Followup-To: soc.motss
Organization: out in linguistics, etc.
Originator: amz@iguana.cis.ohio-state.edu

[the words to "Smut" by tom lehrer, as requested last week
by someone on soc.motss.  the stuff in angle brackets is
spoken rather than sung.]

Smut!
Give me smut and nothing but!
A dirty novel I can't shut,
If it's uncut,                  [should i remark on this?  naaah...]
and unsubt-----le.

I've never quibbled
If it was ribald
I would devour where the others merely nibbled.
As the judge remarked the day that he
  acquitted by Aunt Hortense,
"To be smut
It must be ut-
Terly withou redeeming social importance."

Por-
Nographic pictures I adore,
Indecent magazines galore,
I like them more
If they're hard-core!           [shout it out, tom!]

<Bring on the obscene movies, murals, postcards,
  neckties,
samplers, stained-glass windows, tattoos, anything!
More, more, I'm still not satisfied!>

Stories of tortures
Used by debauchers, 
Lurid, licentious, and vile,
Make me smile.                  [*smile*?]
Novels that pander
To my taste for candor
Give me a pleasure sublime
<Let's face it, I love slime.>

All books can be indecent books  [and you thought this was just
Though recent books are bolder,     silly stuff, didn't you?]
For filth (I'm glad to say) is in the mind
  of the beholder.
When correctly viewed,
Ev'rything is lewd.
<I could tell you things about Peter Pan,
And the Wizard of Oz, *there's* a dirty old man!>

I thrill
To any book like _Fanny Hill_,
And I suppose I always will,
If it is swill
And really fil----thy.

Who needs a hobby like tennis or philately?
I've got a hobby: reading _Lady Chatterley_.
/But now they're trying to take it all away from us
  unless
We take a stand, and hand in hand we fight for
  freedom of the press,/
In other words,
Smut!
Like the adventures of a slut.         [moi?]
Oh, I'm a market they can't glut,
I don't know what
Compares with smut.
Hip hip hooray!
<Let's hear it for the Supreme Court!>
Don't let them take it away.           [now *where* did i put
                                          _Carnival in Rio_?]
(alternate for slashed material:)

/I love the Bill of Rights with all the
  fervor I possess,
And when I pray, I always say,
"Thank God for freedom of the press."/
From: larsm@ifi.uio.no (Lars Markhus)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Request: Info on GLB-filmfestival organizers
Date: 19 Aug 92 18:30:40 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway
Originator: larsm@holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no



We'll as an intro, this is my demuffinazation on soc.motss.  Hello
all!  To those who know me allready, I finally got round to applying
for an international posting permit from the university, and got one.



Now to the subjectmatter.

This summer some friends were the organizers of the Gay Filmfestival
during the Oslo Gay Week (19-28. june 92).  For the films shown look
at the bottom of this posting.

Some of the problems encountered during the organizing of the
filmfestival were:

- Finding good films to show.  

- Finding reviews or people who had seen the films.

- Finding who had the rights for the film.  The committee often found
that companies had been dissolved and the rights had been transferred
or just ended up in some legal limbo.

To help avoid such problems the organizers feel that they need contact
with other organizers of GLB-filmfestivals.  If people out there know
and could e-mail me the contact name, address, telephone-,
telefaxnumbers and/or e-mail address of organizers we would appreciate
it.


On behalf of the Oslo Gay-filmfestival

LarsM
--
Lars Markhus -- larsm@ifi.uio.no (Student)
Institute of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway


The film-list follows:

Films shown during Oslo Gay Week 1992.
--------------------------------------

"My own private Idaho", USA 1991, 105 min., Gus van Sandt (directing). 
    (The opening film and a sell out with many people not getting in.)

"Nocturne", UK 1990, 58 min., Joy Chamberlain (dir.).
"Westler - East of the Wall", Germany 1985, 94 min., Wieland Speck (dir.).
"The Times of Harvey Milk", USA 1980, 87 min., Epstien/Scheichen (dir.).
"Cought Looking", UK 1991, 35 min., Constantine Giannaris (dir).
"Star-Crossed Lovers", Denmark 1991, 21 min., Irene Werner Stage (dir).
"Paris Is Burning", USA 1990, 70 min., Jennie Livingston (dir).
"Olivia", France, Jacqueline Audry (dir).
"Nous Etions Une Seul Homme", France 1979, 90 min., Philippe Vallois (dir).
"November Mond", Germany/France 1984, 106 min., Alexandra von Grote (dir).
"My Father Is Comming", USA/Germany, 92 min., Monica Treut (dir).
"What Can I Do With A Male Nude", UK 1985, 23 min., Ron Peck (dir).
"Silent Pioneers", USA 1985, 42 min., Lucy Winer (dir).

(Typos in the list aren't necesarilly mine.  :-) )

--
LarsM
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: robertl@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Robert Lodenkamper)
Subject: Re: Utopia (was Re: mandatory service)
Organization: Stanford University
	<1992Aug14.170005.7011@riacs.edu>
	<ROBERTL.92Aug15152928@luciano.Stanford.EDU>
	<l8r87oINNd7n@mizar.usc.edu>
Date: 16 Aug 92 02:57:24

In article <l8r87oINNd7n@mizar.usc.edu> adolphso@mizar.usc.edu
(adolphson) writes: 

   You know, Robert, it's really very difficult to figure out who
   said what from the way you quote material.  I assume what I've
   quoted below is all yours.

It is.  I'll see if I can get my newsreader to do standard rn style
quotes rather than the indenting it does now, although I do try to
avoid excessively complicated quoting.

   In article <ROBERTL.92Aug15152928@luciano.Stanford.EDU> 
   robertl@luciano.Stanford.EDU (Robert Lodenkamper) writes:

   > I think at least a partial classification is possible.  For
   > example, I can't think of anything positive about hate, so
   > classifying hate as negative seems accurate.

   I would rather die than live in a utopia where everyone is in
   a lobotomized state, walking around loving everyone else.

So would I.  Love is, however, rather more than the absence of hate. 

   In any case, I can think of a number of positive features about
   hate, the most obvious being that it's a great motivator.

We may be talking about different kinds of hate here.  For me, hate is
not anger, rage, irritation or exasperation.  Instead it is the cold
certainty that I would be delighted if the person(s) hated were to die
immediately, preferably in agony.  It is difficult to see how such an
emotion could motivate anything except cold-blooded murders.

Since this is rather more intense and specific than the dictionary
definition of hate, I should have made it clearer what I was talking
about.

   > Even if one could devise a method of altering human
   > characteristics that would work, would it be right to impose it
   > on everyone?  If so, how should it be implemented?  Hard
   > questions to answer.

   No, they're really very easy to answer.  No, it wouldn't be right
   to impose this on everyone.  And since these alterations shouldn't
   be imposed, you needn't worry about how to implement them.

Well, there are simple cases, such as totalitarian thought control,
which are easy to answer.  But I maintain the questions themselves are
nontrivial.

For example, the various civil rights movements in the US have changed
human behavior to some extent.  Is the change enough to be called an
"altered human characteristic"?  Maybe.  If such a fuzzy question can
be answered at all.

But there is no doubt that the ultimate goal of the civil rights
movements --- the elimination of bigotry --- has to be considered an
altered human characteristic.

What progress has been made thus far has been imposed on society as a
whole by a majority.  Since there is bitter opposition to civil
rights, future progress will also be imposed on those who disagree.
Of course, the fact that the values of civil rights are imposed on
those who don't agree with them is not, by itself, a valid argument
against civil rights.

- Bob
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Whizzzzzzz ( was Re: Introduction)
Date: 17 Aug 1992 13:46:12 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <l8vt7hINNfb@mizar.usc.edu> 
adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:

> ...  But I did run to the library to check out
> _The Complete Lyrics of Cole Porter_, edited by Robert
> Kimball (Knopf, 1983).

Which includes an early version of the first refrain
of "Anything Goes":

   If saying your pr'yers you like,
   If green pears you like,
   If old chairs you like,
   If backstairs you like,
   If love affairs you like,
   With young bears you like,
   Why, nobody will oppose.

 Arne
From: stevenso@Apple.COM (David Stevenson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: becoming a linguist
Date: 12 Aug 92 19:52:28 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

bbeer@milton.u.washington.edu (Bob Beer) writes:
>
>Remember:  If English was good enough for our Lord Jesus Christ, it
>is good enough for us!
>
That would be the King James (motss relevance) English, Bob.
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: roger@quantime.co.uk (Roger Phillips)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: redefining masculinity
Date: 19 Aug 92 09:14:13 GMT
Reply-To: roger@quantime.co.uk (Roger Phillips)
Organization: Quantime Ltd, London (software for market research)

In article <2a913ae1@ThreeL.co.uk>,
jf@threel.co.uk (John Fisher) writes:
> Nearly everyone's dissatisfied with the voice they hear on
> recordings.  That's because the voice they *think* they have
> they usually hear through about two inches of head. 

Oh, no, not me!  I *never* talk with my mouth full.
-- 
Roger Phillips                            roger@quantime.co.uk
"poot, (Scot.) v.i. to shoot at young partridges or young grouse."
-- Chambers English Dictionary (1988)
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: st. cole porter
Date: 15 Aug 1992 15:33:39 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Aug14.161026.24306@hemlock.cray.com> 
steven@cray.com (Steven Levine) writes:
> In article <Bszq1F.9DK@apollo.hp.com> 
> betsyp@apollo.hp.com (Betsy Perry) writes:
>
> >Thttttthpppp!  Ella (or her arranger) censored Porter something
> >fierce.
>
> Not near so fierce as others.

Cole Porter had to do a lot rewrites himself just to get
the music published.

> "I Get a Kick out of You," as we all know, contains the lines:

[about cocaine]

> In the movie "Night and Day" it is sung (by Ethel Mermen?)

[about perfume from Spain]

No, but I don't know who did sing it.  And isn't that movie
*awful*?  Alexis Smith as Linda Porter is bad enough, but what
about the relationship the movie purports they had with each
other?  Yuck.  Anyway, Merman sang the "perfume from Spain" 
(what *would* that be?  Maja?) line until the late '60s.

I just thought of another Cole Porter naughty lyric.  It wasn't
in the published music, and Merman and Bert Lahr didn't record it,
not that they would have been able to.  It's from "But in the 
Morning No" from _Dubarry Was a Lady_, and it was sung by the
two of them in bed:

Lahr:    Are you good at figures, dear?
         Kindly tell me if so.
Merman:  Yes I'm good at figures, dear,
         But in the morning no.
         Do you do double entry, dear?
         Kindly tell me if so.
Lahr:    I do double entry, dear,
         But in the morning no.

Arne
From: adolphso@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson)
Newsgroups: soc.motss
Subject: Re: Too straight looking to be gay??? (was re: UNGAY GAY)
Date: 14 Aug 92 23:46:59 GMT
Organization: Nelly, Campy, Radical Fringe Faggots From Hell
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu

In article <1992Aug14.172701.3835@microsoft.com> 
bobsarv@microsoft.com (Bob Sarver) writes, in one of 
the most homophobic articles I've ever seen on soc.motss:

> I have met many gay men, handsome, masculine, and closeted--and they will
> probably stay that way forever.  Why?  Because the once-a-year trip to a gay
> function or gay bar reinforces their fears of being surrounded by nelly,
> campy gays that are embarassing and fringe radicals.

That paragraph is unspeakably vile.

> Gay, masculine men who are happy being that way are threatening to
> feminine gays.  You threaten them.  It also disturbs feminine gays
> that a masc. gay man can move 'with the straight crowd'; you have
> betrayed the fem. gays by having close straight friends.

Utter bullshit, but if you feel like continuing with the arm chair
psychoanalysis, I think you might want to look at your motivations 
here.  

So just how butch are *you*?

> Don't worry about it.  The problem is not with you.  It is with them.

Fuck off.

Arne
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: ae642@yfn.ysu.edu (Kelley Miller)
Subject: Re: mandatory service (was Re: Metzenbaum introduces Senate bill to end military ban)
Reply-To: ae642@yfn.ysu.edu (Kelley Miller)
Organization: St. Elizabeth Hospital, Youngstown, OH
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 05:02:42 GMT


In a previous article, shore@theory.TC.Cornell.EDU (Melinda Shore) says:

>In article <1992Aug13.191528.14774@news.ysu.edu> ae642@yfn.ysu.edu (Kelley Miller) writes:
>>Read the entire post, Melinda.  I'm illustrating that the draft is wrong, 
>>regardless of the gender or marital status.  
>
>I read the entire post, and my response hasn't changed.
>The draft isn't wrong because what you consider to be the
>average American would be upset by the thought of women in
>combat (and I'm hoping that you can expand on what you
>apparently see as the necessary link between conscription
>and combat).  One would hope that you would recognize that
>there are far more essential reasons than that.
>

Of course I recognize this!  I have been against the theory of the draft since
I was a kid, during the Viet Nam conflict.  I actively protested against it
in 68 and 69. No person should be forced to enlist in the armed services against
their will. 

>  I might
>also note that you don't get points in heaven or in a
>rational debate by assuming that most of your countrymen
>and -women are sexist neanderthals.  If you would bother to
>read the net (instead of just posting) or the newspapers or
>the magazines or would try watching the news on television
>or listening to the news on the radio, you'd find that
>there's considerable support for the notion that if we
>should have a draft it ought to include both genders.
>
Given.  But that point is irrelevant.  Those who make these decisions (the 
president and the congress) will never aprove of or enact a universal draft.
Women and gay people will always be excluded.  

>  But
>hey, if you'd rather barge in here and throw around
>inaccurate irrelvancies and then insist that you're
>contributing to the conversation, well gosh - that's what
>the net is here for.
>
The premis3e was that Sen. Metzenbaum was proposing a universal draft, 
which most seem to support.  I simply pointed out that most men (have you
spoken to any about it lately?) oppose the idea of womwn being drafted,
for the Ideas I outlined above.
-- 
>       Melinda Shore - Cornell Theory Center - shore@tc.cornell.edu
>
-- 
*...your Friendly Neighborhood Atheist // "Peter...PETER!!  I can see    *
*      the KelleyMan:Kelley L. Miller // your house from here!"          *    
*                  ae642@yfn.ysu.edu // Jesus Christ, from the cross     *
****************Know God...No peace.  No God...Know peace.****************
Newsgroups: soc.motss
From: spencer@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (S. Spencer Sun)
Subject: Convention anagrams in rec.humor.funny
Reply-To: spencer@phoenix.princeton.edu (S. Spencer Sun)
Organization: Live Organ Transplants
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 04:15:25 GMT

Someone who apparently has a lot of time on his hands ran an anagram
program on his Mac and came up with oodles of anagrams for Democratic
National Convention and Republican National Convention.

They're in rec.humor.funny.  I think the H. Ross Perot ones in Dave
Barry's recent column (two weeks ago maybe?) were better (the best was
"Short poser"

----------- The opinions expressed in this article are solely mine. -----------
<Insert lame attempt at disclaimer humor>
sss/PU'94 Dept of CS (spencer@phoenix.princeton.edu)/JvNCnet (spencer@jvnc.net)
"No, just _a_ Zaphod Beeblebrox.  Haven't you heard I come in six packs?"

Newsgroups: soc.motss