HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: I will assault MUCUS(and he will not respond)
Date: 12 Aug 92 23:04:39 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Aug12.120119.5412@nynexst.com> swalvick@nynexst.com (Steve Walvick) writes:

[entire article by Ged deleted]


>  They are probably CS majors with no outside life (yes
>there are those with a life), a-social, and extremely repressed, 
>including sexually.  Netrek is just an outlet for them to release
>all there pent up hostility to other people who don't know who
>(or what) they really are.  I don't hate mucus...I pity him.  

Can you say projection?

>	Steven
>	Kirk, Elijah Bally, Defenseless

Justin
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: INL Leadership
Date: 16 Aug 92 04:11:40 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <w37mv5+.genie@netcom.com) genie@netcom.com (The Genie) writes:
)In article <Bt1F81.85H.1@cs.cmu.edu) spot@CS.CMU.EDU (Scott Draves) writes:
))
))Tom) I will do whatever I can to make sure that no more than one CMU
))Tom) team (or from any other school, for that matter) makes the
))Tom) playoffs in the fall.
))
))the INL is unlucky to have such a fuck head as its founder and leader.
))you have ruined what could have been a good thing.
))
)Obviously, when CMU teams pull off shit like this tie bullshit,
)then there is reason to be concerned about matching up CMU teams
)in future playoffs.

This is all very ridiculous.  Netrek is a free game without commercialization,
and so should not be compared to the NCAA or NFL or MLBA or any other 
organization whose primary purpose is to make money.

The game is supposed to be fun, and the INL is supposed to allow a high 
caliber of play, to maximize the enjoyment.

When the head of the INL says that he will do whatever he can to do XX out
of motivation based solely on either bitterness or self-interest, and when
the head(??) of AA boldly announce to the (community) before the INL (as 
far as I know) that they will declare the game a tie, then there is 
clearly something wrong.  And the regular season will only enlarge these
problems.

Of course, there will be a council in the fall, which should insulate the
league from all this pettiness, but will it?

Should the league have the power to say to someone:  no, you may not form
a team (provided it is met by a certain deadline).

I really think that, given the intense rivalry between CMU and Berkeley,
having the INL head from either school is a recipe for disaster.

Personally, I know that I will not enjoy a year in which a significant
number of players are not allowed to play (reminds me of pre-integration
baseball), or in which the inl organization imitates the basest parts of
current sports organizations.  Christ, there is no money involved, no
special interests to please, so why can't we fucking eliminate all the
ego bullshit from the INL organization.  Tom, if you're not the man to
do it, then we should find someone else.

Justin
From: stimpy+@cmu.edu (Rick)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: 12AM vs. AA
Date: 15 Aug 92 04:19:14 GMT
Organization: Freshman, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

First, let me say how happy we are we got to play 12AM instead of Team
Crack Pot. whew. Game was played at CMU; at the end of two hours AA owned
19 planets, 12AM owned 1. mvp for the other team was probably Hector.
Without him, we would have genocided. From the .conquer file:
 The galaxy has been conquered by the Federation:
  The Federation:
           Spaceace! (F1) with 17 planets and 71 armies.
           ZZnew guy (F0) with 4 planets and 57 armies.
         Scoutmaster (F2) with 2 planets and 84 armies.
                West (F3) with 3 planets and 49 armies.
          Videodrome (F7) with 2 planets and 55 armies.
             Famine! (Ff) with 0 planets and 95 armies.
             Warlock (F5) with 2 planets and 4 armies.
            Drewski  (F4) with 0 planets and 5 armies.
  The Orions:
              Ayeser (Oc) with 13 planets and 33 armies.
       WeenieBlaster (Oe) with 8 planets and 134 armies.
          SpaceGhost (O6) with 3 planets and 132 armies.
              Hector (O8) with 4 planets and 37 armies.
        Zorkian Grue (O9) with 2 planets and 96 armies.
        My Addiction (Od) with 1 planets and 85 armies.
         Eat Photons (Ob) with 2 planets and 44 armies.
            D'Spayre (Oa) with 2 planets and 6 armies.

Warlock played the second half of the game for Talon. Talon's stats were:
5 planets and 48 armies.

(.conquer armies are armies BOMBED only.)
armies ogged:
Spaceace!  --  9
ZZnew guy  --  3
West  --  2
Videodrome  --  14
Famine!  --  4
Drewski  --  2  (played base most of the game)
Talon  --  9

Ayeser  --  20
WeenieBlaster  --  14
SpaceGhost  --  10
Hector  --  56
Zorkian Grue  --  2
My Addiction  --  21
Eat Photons  --  6
D'Spayre  --  20

armies died with:
Spaceace!  --  15
ZZnew guy  --  31
Scoutmaster  --  8
West  --  41
Videodrome  --  15
Famine!  --  18
Drewski  --  3
Talon  --  10
Warlock  --  18

Ayeser  --  9
WeenieBlaster  --  5
Hector  --  1
Zorkian Grue  --  9
My Addiction  --  1
Eat Photons  --  6
D'Spayre  --  11


People not listed either died with/ogged zero armies.

I'll leave a more colorful game summary to someone else.

We are better than you.

--Rick
"Bronco Netrek Server. You will never find a more wretched hive of
scum and villainy." -- Admiral Kenobi (aka Terence Chang)
Organization: Sophomore, Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
From: nelson@reed.edu (Nelson Minar)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Hockey Night
Date: 22 Aug 92 00:44:39 GMT
Organization: Reed College, Portland, OR

In article <1992Aug21.165635.16536@ncsu.edu> jecoleb@eos.ncsu.edu writes:
>I was skeptical.
>I checked it out.
>Next time, I'm bringing a six-pack and a lot of friends.

yay!

>I'd build my own temp hockey server here for practice time if it
>didn't mean that our sysadmins would hang my liver on a stick... ;)

that server (129.130.4.80) is always running hockey. And, there's even
people playing occasionally, especially about 7PM EST. That specific
game was set up to try to get the 8 or 10 people into hockey all there
at once, and to get a few other people in, too. Glad it worked!

That being said, I found the hockey game really frustrating. Clue
seems doubly important in hockey (compared to regular netrek), and it
is even easier to blame your teammates for bad team performane. Things
will get better as more people figure out how to control the puck.

Thanks again! We should try to play a game again next week.
-- 
                __
nelson@reed.edu \/       Before the cream sits out too long, you must whip it
From: hadley@cad.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley)
Subject: Re: Left direction harder?
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Organization: UC Irvine Department of ICS
Keywords: mouse, keyboard, positions
Date: 21 Aug 92 20:55:46 GMT
Distribution: rec

In <1992Aug21.191255.25979@coe.montana.edu> osyjm@cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) writes:
>In article <2A94B5EE.4202@ics.uci.edu> hadley@thoth.ics.uci.edu (Tedd Hadley) writes:
>>
>>   I find it much harder to dogfight, ogg, or base left then any other
>>   direction.  Anybody else have certain directions they dislike or prefer
>>   over others?
>>
>>   My favorite direction to fight is up, followed by down and right.  Left
>>   just feels awkward for some reason, no matter how many times I play it.

>I agree...  I suspect it might be because when fighting/moving left, your
>cursor is way over on the left, and it's a long way to move it to the
>galactic, and the message windows...

   True.

   It occured to me after I posted that I do have some data on this in the form
   of calvin.usc.edu's .conquer file.  Here's info from 579 genocides
   (who said genocides never happen at calvin? :)  Could there be a correlation
   between genocides and the directions the battles were fought?  Well:

Federation genocided the Orions:	73 times
Orions genocided the Federation:	58 times

Romulans genocided the Klingons:	99 times
Klingons genocided the Romulans:	56 times

   It looks like people may do marginally better fighting right then left.

   Up/down battles:

Federation genocided the Romulans:	112 times
Romulans genocided the Federation:	99 times

Orions genocided the Klingons:		63 times
Klingons genocided the Orions:		33 times.

   Looks like "up" is favored but a disproportionate amount of klingon
   genocides and a very close number for the fed/rom matchup makes it
   hard to draw conclusion.

++
   Tedd Hadley (hadley@uci.edu)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick)
Subject: Re: different approach for INL
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 19:18:07 GMT

petonak@chem.psu.edu (Paul Petonak) writes
> Why not, instead of having teams from specific schools, have a 'draft' at the
> beginning of the season. Simply make a list of people who want to play and
> let the captains draft their team. This way, captains will have to keep in 
> mind choosing someone to play their base, their oggers, etc. In addition, you
> will no longer have to solve the at large problem as most teams would probably
> automatically be at-large. 

The last time this idea came up, one objection was that it would
remove the incentive of playing for your school.  The INL was
originally the Intercollegiate Netrek League, after all.

Having said that, it works well for the CMU draft system.
From: gc2n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Greg K Chung)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SINL finals (long...sorry :-))
Date: 16 Aug 92 05:19:39 GMT
	<l8rk9oINNhvp@girtab.usc.edu>
Organization: Freshman, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 15-Aug-92 Re: SINL finals
(long...sor.. Ron Echeverri@girtab.usc (814)

>  The point of having subs is to
> have people to 'sub' for you if you are unavailable at game time.  Of course,
> your subs aren't as good as the starters.  But they should be competent. 
> Else why are they on your team?  If you feel your subs can't play a good
> game, why did you choose them in the first place?  You don't see teams in
> any sport say "postpone cuz i got a lotta hurt players."  Be professional,
> even if you're not getting paid to netrek :)

> 5150




Well, if you like we can have teams of 8 plus 8 more subs...

But I think your argument is a little lacking... if each team should
have its own subs all the time, then 12AM would have lost horribly in
the playoffs.  To have enough players, 12AM would have had to have been
Thirty-Two Angry Men once upon a time...

Also, 5150, I think you are missing the idea of "sub".  My idea of a
"sub" is someone who is NOT on the team.  It's someone who you get
because your regular team isn't available.  And because of this, you
usually can't be too picky with who you get.  


Greg,
Team Rank Scum
Xref: sparky rec.games.netrek:5336 news.answers:2508
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 10:56:28 -0400 
From: "Joseph E. Beck" <jb8n+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: INL Leadership

>I really think that, given the intense rivalry between CMU and Berkeley,
>having the INL head from either school is a recipe for disaster.

I agree.  Any neutral parties interested?

	joe
	Purple haze
From: botelle@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: embarrassing moments during a game
Date: 12 Aug 92 19:23:19 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Aug11.230142.28991@coe.montana.edu> osyjm@cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) writes:

>Trying to ogg Balton, or Wreck, or LURI, or Yea Boy!!! single handed
>back when I was a more clueless newbie (I've graduated to just a 
>clueless newbie).

hmm.    mixed company there.  Anyway, ogging a good base player 1-1 isn't
often useful to your team except to keep them honest, but it is good
practice and can be lots of fun.

> Jaye Mathisen, COE Systems Manager                (406) 994-4780
> 410 Roberts Hall,Dept. of Computer Science
> Montana State University,Bozeman MT 59717	osyjm@cs.montana.edu


Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: hoswell@tramp.Colorado.EDU (Old Nick)
Subject: Re: Warp vs Acclereation
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 18:14:20 GMT

rjones@dsd.es.com (Ray Jones - Perp) writes:

>So, Ged and I were talking, and I said, "I wonoder what it would be like
>if warp was your acceleration rather than your velocity."  (this idea has
>been on here before, I think... I don't remember).

	Anyone else try out xpilot, yet?  Seems to have some ugly X
usage, but it's pretty fun - a netrek wanna-be, but fun.  In xpilot,
warp *is* acceleration... more of that 'asteroids' feeling.

Mike / Old Nick
-- 
||      -=> Old Nick <=-	 |	  <<<<=- "Dial a cliche" -=>>>>      ||
||  hoswell@tramp.Colorado.EDU	 |   					     ||
|| or hoswell@yoda.hao.ucar.EDU	 |    A cynic knows the price of everything  ||
||       Think Clearly! 	 |          and the value of nothing.        ||
From: lab@mtek.chalmers.se (Lars Bernhardsson)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: the endless quest for the perfect keymap
Keywords: keymap
Date: 19 Aug 92 02:15:29 GMT
Reply-To: lab@mtek.chalmers.se
Organization: Chalmers University of Technology, Gothenburg, SWEDEN

I have noticed that too often I have to look down on the keyboard
while in a dogfight, and of course I usually die.
So... if there are some good player out there who would like to
share his keymap, mail it to me.
It's not that I'm lazy or so, I just can't come up with a good
enough keymap myself...
/lab
PS. Euro netrekkers, try iota42.mtek.chalmers.se 2592
No borgs, get blessed client at duke.me.chalmers.se:~ftp/pub/netrek
From: fortony@sonne.cso.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: The new face of Twelve Angry Men
Date: 14 Aug 92 18:46:10 GMT
Article-I.D.: murphy.fortony.713817970
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Originator: fortony@murphy

wk5w@mtaac.bme.Virginia.EDU (William Thang Katz) writes:

>TWELVE ANGRY MEN: The few, the proud, the ANGRY.

Grrr!

>As noted by mojo, 12 AM is indeed not your father's 12 AM.  But
>all but two players will be returning in the fall (leaving are
>Ged and rjones).  

Close, but.

>Our roster is:

>D'Spayre
>sunscreamer (abscent for playoff: Hector subbing)

I think I am not going to be playing on the 12AM in the fall INL.

>SpaceGhost
>Ayeser
>DarkHorse
>My Addiction
>WeenieBlaster
>Eat Photons
>Zorkian Grue
>Lazy Dog

>Since our roster is currently at 10 for the fall, we are taking
>*applications* for the fall semester.  Yes ... you too can be
>a member of this elite paramilitary organization if you are an
>at-large, clued player.  We are, of course, the premiere at-large
>team with our very own mud (for pre- and post- game meetings),

You'll have to find a new mud site.  I'll provide
throughout the playoffs, but after is unlikely.

>talisman (the rusty crowbar), and pharmacy for anxiety-producing
>effects.  We will grant you the privilege of our trademark
>"GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR" message as well as an all-expense paid
>ANGER vacation trip to NEW YORK CITY where you will be given a car 
>during rush hour.

Good luck, fellas.  It was a blast playing with y'all.

>D'Spayre/Unknown Ogger
>Captain-until-deposed
>Ten Angry Men

GRRRR
-- 
a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
Felix Sebastian Ortony	fortony@murphy.gis.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: petonak@chem.psu.edu (Paul Petonak)
Subject: Re: making admiral
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 1992 05:04:07 GMT

In article <fortony.713497738@murphy>, fortony@sonne.cso.uiuc.edu writes:
|> petonak@chem.psu.edu (Paul Petonak) writes:
|> 
|> >Been thinking about reseting my stats on rwd4, after I make captain w/ ~250 di 
|> > [...]. I have a lot of BAD/cannon fodder/free 
|> >kill/FREE BEER play from the early days that I am trying to over come. With 
|> >about 70+ hours, how much di do you think I'd need to make Admiral? 
|> 
|> four billion.
|> 
|> >Do you think I could do it in this lifetime? 
|> 
|> no.
|> 
|> >Of course, having everyone think you're some jackass commander has it's 
|> >advantages.
|> 
|> But, but, Icky...you *are* one. :)
|> 

FINALLY, someone who agrees with me.

|> >Icarus
|> 
|> >Paul
|> 
|> rear ensign sunscreamer
|> minister of truth, TWELVE ANGRY MEN
|> -- 
|> a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
|> Felix Sebastian Ortony	fortony@murphy.gis.uiuc.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: cmlee@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Tom Chen-Ming Lee)
Subject: Re: the endless quest for the perfect keymap
Keywords: keymap
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 22:18:10 GMT

In article <1992Aug19.210912.29177@dsd.es.com> mmoore@itchy.dsd.es.com (Michael Moore) writes:
> [...]
>
>	What the heck is a "Dvorak" feeling anyway? 

(My interpretation)

It means just as vowels, the most used letters, are positioned in the
"home" row (asdf jkl;) in the Dvorak keyboard layout, so too, are the
"hot" keys used in netrek positioned in the home row.


- Iolo the Bard

>	-Michael (Ged.... one more day of net access.... things are very busy
>--
> [...]
From: gc2n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Greg K Chung)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: 3rd space planet taking
Date: 12 Aug 92 15:33:28 GMT
Organization: Freshman, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 12-Aug-92 Re: 3rd space planet
taking Howard Yin@nyx.cs.du.edu (307)

> Re: ATT robot

> Why bother having a stupid robot in the game.  To stop 3rd space planet taking,
> simply make it a ghostbust or kill by god instantly.

> If a ship attack a neutral race, gets blown away by god.

> In that case, no 3rd race planet takeng and bombing will going to happen any
> more.

> Howard
> -Pirate




No, this is too harsh (esp being ghostbusted!) a punishment.  A lot of
times you might attack a 3rd race planet accidentally!  For example, if
the galaxy was f*cked up from a previous game, Roms might own some Kli
planets in a Rom-Fed game.  Feds would go over and bomb the Rom
planets...but if they bomb the wrong one accidentally, I wouldn't want
to see them instantly die/get ejected from the game!

You say, "Well, a clued player wouldn't accidentally bomb a 3rd race
planet, it's stupid!"  At which point I point you to the recent thread
of posts "Embarrassing Moments In My Netrek Career!"  




Greg
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: jch+@cs.cmu.edu (Jonathan Hardwick)
Subject: Re: I will assault MUCUS(and he will not respond)
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 92 14:10:16 GMT
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon

swalvick@nynexst.com (Steve Walvick) writes
> My opinion on MUCUS and his
> followers?  They are probably CS majors with no outside life (yes
> there are those with a life), a-social, and extremely repressed, 
> including sexually.

And so the MUCUS legend grows...
From: botelle@pixmap.seas.upenn.edu (Justin Botelle)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: Mucus... how good is he? (was Re: I will assault MUCUS(and he will not respond))
Date: 15 Aug 92 02:33:16 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <Bsz0CG.Epr@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig) writes:
>Ok, how about MUCUS and Balton vs. Ditka and Jordan at tiddlywinks?

Is that a full sized or a miniature Ditka.. in any event.. Da Bears :)

)
)	- Entropy
)_____________________________________________________________________________
)| Opinions are like assholes :  Everyone's got one, and they usually stink. |


Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
From: mmoore@itchy.dsd.es.com (Michael Moore)
Subject: Re: Ged. . . how good is he?
Organization: Evans & Sutherland
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 92 08:26:23 GMT

In article <UeWp3xy00VpZAF=EYa@andrew.cmu.edu> tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu (Timothy C. Worsley) writes:
>
>
>	It is possible that you, Ged, are as skilled as those CMU players who
>you compare yourself to, but nevertheless, I would always pick them over
>you if I were picking teams.  It's either a skill thing or a clue thing.
> Craig probably isn't any more skilled at basing than, say, Balinor. 
>Balinor might even be more skilled, but Balton knows what he needs to do
>better.  It's why he's so powerful OUT of a base too.  You can say all
>that you want about your skill, but when you're matched up, you just
>aren't there.  MUCUS is.  Balton is.
>
	
	This is your opinion, and you are certainly entitled to it.
But I certainly think you're really dumb if you think I can't figure
out where I need to be.  Please.  Like this is a difficult thing to
figure out.  And like you've played with me enough to go making
an informed opinion on this in the first place.


>
>	Until some CMU team loses to a non-CMU team I will find your anti-CMU
>probaganda pretty laughable.  OK, we aren't any better than anyone else.
> Those damn CMU players sure are lucky, though.
>
	
	You miss my point.  The point is that you guys consider the
top 5 or so netrek players to be from CMU.  And the folks you choose I
find to be not any better than many other players.  I challenge this,
but you couldn't possibly admit that there might be a player not from
CMU who is better than your choice and so it goes.....

	-Michael (Ged... god it's late, I'm getting *gasp* rude...)
--
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------
|Michael Moore                      \  "The ships hung in the sky in  |
|Evans & Sutherland Employee         \ much the same way that bricks  |
|University of Utah Student          / don't."                        |
|Email      : mmoore@dsd.es.com     /                                 |
|Home Phone : (801) 359-6552        \                                 |
|Office     : (801) 582-5847 x 4721  \  -The Hitchhiker's Guide       |
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: wk5w@luca.bme.Virginia.EDU (William Thang Katz)
Newsgroups: rec.games.netrek
Subject: Re: SINL PLAYOFF UNOFFICIAL RANKING
Date: 17 Aug 92 04:35:27 GMT
Reply-To: wk5w@luca.bme.Virginia.EDU (William Thang Katz)
Distribution: rec
Organization: University of Virginia

In article <QeXh1ya00Vp_8oe1lV@andrew.cmu.edu>, tw1r+@andrew.cmu.edu
(Timothy C. Worsley) writes:
|> Excerpts from netnews.rec.games.netrek: 16-Aug-92 Re: SINL PLAYOFF
|> UNOFFICIAL.. Felix S. Gallo@wixer.cac (3060)
|> 
|> > >Regardless, I think it is better than the current system. 
Premise:
|> > >the best teams should go to the playoffs.  Fact:  12 Angry Men
went,
|> > >and Crack Pot didn't.  Did CP do anything wrong?  Did they screw
up?
|> > >No, they failed to do what no team did (including GBO even with
the
|> > >lag):  beat the Arrogant Assholes.  
|> 
|> > On the other hand, the 12AM-CP conflict shouldn't just be resolved
|> > with CP in mind.  What did 12AM do?  We racked up 3 wins and a no
|> > decision as an at large team.  By contrast, CP racked up 2 wins,
|> > a loss, and a no decision as a CMU SuperTeam.  In the minds of
many,
|> > the choice is clear.
|> 
|> 	12 AM went as per the INL rules.  I haven't heard any grumbling
about
|> that from CrackPot or his team.  There are differing oppinions about
who
|> was, in fact, the better team.  Having played 12 AM twice (once on
nova,
|> and once at CMU) and CrackPot a number of times, I feel that
CrackPot
|> was better.  12 AM is still, certainly very impressive, especially
|> considdering their at-largeness.  I'd love for them to scrimage GB.\
|> 	I *am* curious.  If CrackPot had played a rematch of the lagged 12
|> AM-CP game, and still won, would 12 AM have still played in the
|> playoffs?  Inquiring minds want to know.
|> 
|> ZZnew guy

The I-have-played-both-of-them-and-know argument is always very good,
but
you really have to wonder ZZ, how good would Team CrackPot be if you
gave
them all 160+ ms lag (average) when they played you at CMU.  When two
CMU
teams play each other, it is with relatively zero lag.  I wonder how
good
Twelve Angry Men would be (the original cast) if we were all in one
room
and you played on OUR server so WE had zero lag.

Wondering what the sound of my teammates anger would be like ...

-D'Spayre/Unknown Ogger/ and now, Gandhi (the non-aggressive ogger).

(Did i spell that right?  probably not)