From: jonh@david.wheaton.edu (Jonathan Hayward)
Subject: Re: Dice rolling
Organization: Wheaton College, IL
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 05:33:10 GMT

In article <1992Jul22.143634.13187@rchland.ibm.com> BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com writes:
>Please post your opinions (with reasons please! :-) and experiences on a few
>wargame design issues I have been pondering.
>
>For wargames how much dice rolling is "too much"?  For instance, is it too
>much for both the attacker and defender to roll dice (simultaneously) to
>determine the result of an attack?  How about if the defender can modify
>the result by a 2nd roll (instead of or in addition to the simultaneous roll?)
>
>Also, what about the number of dice to roll.  Is one d6 (or d10 or d20...)
>too few (no bell curve)?  Are 3 dice too many?

First, as a framework for everything else I say: Too much dice rolling is when
rolling dice starts to get irritating.

I wouldn't say that X amount of dice rolling is just too much.  Or, more
precisely, I wouldn't say that X amount of _dice_rolling_or_simulated_dice
rolling_ is too much.

I would reccomend dice for dramatic moments (it's hard for anything else to
give the drama of, at a tense moment, a d20 slowly rolling around the 1 and
settling at 20), and see them as usable when there's only a couple of dice to
roll (when a sweep of the hand will grab all of the dice, and a glance will
tell what they say).

For everything else, I reccomend dice simulation - unless it's convenient to
lug a computer around, a programmable calculator.  I personally use an HP28S,
but would be extremely surprised if any of the "bigger" calculators aren't
very capable of the necessary operations.  I have two programs that usually
suffice (and hack around if I need others): 1 to roll a die with an arbitrary
number of sides, 1 to roll an arbitrary number of dice with an arbitrary number
of sides.  How long does it take to roll 20d6?  Well, let's see.  How quickly
can you type 5 keystrokes?  What if I want a number 1-16 instead of the usual
range?  Don't worry, the calculator doesn't care if the number of sides
corresponds to a die that you can easily buy.

(if there's one die roll that you are going to use often, like 3d6 or 6d6, with
those two programs you should be able to create a third that will generate the
die roll in one keystroke)

Here are the programs for the HP28* and probably HP48SX calculators (-;sorry,
owners of other calculators, you have to think.):

First, a program used by both other programs.  I call it (store it as) int, and
it takes the greatest integer less than or equal to its argument:

<< DUP 1 MOD - >>

(a less compact, less efficient, but more readable form:)

<< -> A
  << A A 1 MOD -
  >>
>>

To roll one die of an arbitrary number of sides:

<< RAND * INT 1 + >>

(a less compact, less efficient, but more readable form:)

<< -> A
  << A RAND * INT 1 + >>
  >>
>>

To roll an arbitrary number of dice with an arbitrary number of sides:

(the first number, A, is the number of dice.  The second number, B, is the
number of sides on the dice)

<< -> A B
  << 0 1 A START B RAND * INT + NEXT A +
  >>
>>

I see the advantages and disadvantages of calculator as follows:

Advantages:

1: Speed and convenience.  Calculators don't take two minutes to add up, don't
   roll under the sofa and hide, and don't bounce (if used properly).  The
   added speed means that, within the game, mechanics become much more
   transparent - taking the focus away from the dice and towards whatever the
   game is about.

2: Concealibility.  It is difficult (not impossible) for a game master to
   really conceal die rolls from players.  A screen helps, but you can still
   fairly easily tell roughly how many dice et cetera by sound - and sometimes
   gamemaster's screens can become exceedingly annoying. When you are punching
   keys (something that you can do when wandering around, or in a corner
   talking with one player about something that pertains only to that one),
   it's very difficult for a player to look and see what you are doing.

Disadvantages:

1: Not as dramatic.  The calculator doesn't really say "Hey, I'm here!"  At
   least in my opinion, there are some role play situations where it just has
   to be dice.

2: (this is something to think about) One person has said "The importance of
   random number generation is too important to leave to chance."  Kind of an
   odd thing to say, but the quality of random numbers is something to think
   about.  No electronic device that I know of (well, at least no calculator or
   computer) is capable of generating truly random numbers - instead, they
   follow algorithms to generate pseudorandom numbers.  The quality of these
   numbers is directly dependant on the quality of the algorithm.

   I personally am confident in my calculator.  This is both because of years
   experience (I have enough knowledge of probability and statistics to see
   when there are patterns or non-patterns that don't really belong, given
   enough numbers), and because dice are not perfect - they are not completely
   symmetrical (particularly the traditional dotted six-sided dice), and there
   are certain (very minor) tendencies in how they are rotated between throws
   unless you shake them for minutes in your hands.  I have seen bad
   algorithms, however.  If your device is over a long period of time
   consistently generating bad numbers (not just (un)lucky streaks - with
   randomness, you will see extremely improbable occurences), you may wish to
   revert to dice for the more important rolls.

If you haven't guessed yet, I see calculators as much more appropriate than
dice for the definite majority of game situations.  I've spoken for long enough
now.  Having waded through this, I'd love to see other opinions on the matter.

################################################################################
# If you disagree, think I'm missing an important point, or would like me to   #
# elaborate, then by all means send me e-mail.  We probably both have          #
# something to learn from the other.                                           #
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# "God, give me mountains # But the greatest    # Jonathan Hayward             #
# to climb and the        # of these is love.   # Jonathan_Hayward@wheaton.edu #
# strength for climbing." # I Corinthians 13:13 # jhayward@imsa.edu            #
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