HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 11 Sep 1992 11:08:34 -0500
From:         Tom Ford <tford@NEPTUNE.CONVEX.COM>
Subject:      Prayer request, Romania

I am going with a group from my church on a missions trip to Romania and
Moldavia.  I would like to ask for prayer for us that it would be a fruitful
trip and that many would be brought in to the Kingdom of God.  Please pray for
our safety, favor at the borders, and favor with the police and army.  Moldavia
has had some civil unrest recently that has just settled down, but I believe
it is still occupied by a Russian peace keeping force.  It also has seen little
if any missionary outreach since the fall of communism.  Our church has an
on-going relationship with Daniel Matai, a pastor in Timisoara, Romania.
He has a church and bible school in Timisoara and has trained pastors and sent
them to other cities around the country.  This year he is holding conference
for pastors from all over the nation and a pastor from Moldavia is also coming.
(Moldavia is the mostly Romanian speaking region of Russia.)  Our team will
go back to Moldavia with him to help him build up his church.

We will fly to Budapest, Hungary on October 16 and drive in to Romania and on
to Moldavia.  Most of us will return October 31.   There are about 12 of us
on the team.

I would appreciate your prayer covering for this trip.

In Christ,
Tom Ford
tford@convex.com
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 9 Sep 1992 12:01:55 EDT
From:         carol nemec <YA67@FERRIS.BITNET>
Subject:      Spiritual Gifts -- part 3

Continuing with the special gifts...

3.  Evangelist - The special attribute given by the Holy Spirit
to certain members of the body of Christ (church) to share the Gospel
with unbelievers in such a way that the unbeliever becomes a
disciple of Jesus Christ and a responsible member of the body of Christ.

4.  Pastor-teacher - The special.....to assume a personal responsibility
for the spiritual welfare of a group of believers.
                     The special... to communicate information
relevant to the welfare and ministry of the body and its members in
such a way that others will learn.

II  speaking gifts
1.  Exhortation - The special...to draw close to individuals in the
body with comfort, consolation, encouragement, counsel, and prayer
in such a way that they feel helped and healed.

2.  Wisdom - The special...to know the will and work of God as pertains
to the practical and spiritual management of life.

3.  Knowledge - The special...to have an exceptionally thorough
understanding grasp of the great truths of divine revelation,
particularly the mysteries of the Gospel, coupled with the ability to
expound them in a clear and convincing manner as well as to apply
them to individual cases in life.

III.  Serving gifts
1.  serving - The special attribute... to identify the unmet needs
involved in a task related to God's work, and to make use of
available resources to meet those needs and help accomplish the
desired goals.

2.  helps - The special...to invest the talents they have in the life
and ministry of other members of the body thereby enabling/helping
them to increase the effectiveness of their own spiritual gifts.

3. leadeship - The special... to give direction to worthwhile
endeavors and/or people in such a way that people follow and
goals are accomplished to the glory of God.

4.  Administration - The special... to understand clearly the goals
and objectives of a particular unit of the body of Christ and to
develop and execute effective plans for the accomplishment of
those goals.

to be continued... keep :-)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Sun, 13 Sep 1992 00:14:42 EST
From:         Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: NEWSWEEK: GAYS UNDER FIRE

Barry:

I think you answered your own question with the verses you chose to cite.
Is there a better description of American popular culture to be found
anywhere?

Love (and sorrow) INC,
                      --Kerry
From: psyrobtw@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Robert Weiss)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: How to FTP On-Line Bible
Date: 10 Sep 92 02:00:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <9209091801.AA07153@itesocci.gdl.iteso.mx>, A16905@ITESO.BITNET writes...
>Bob,
> 
>I have OLD 5.00.17 and I will FTP version 6 as soon as it is available.
>You say that I can use the text modules I have. Will v.6 text modules
>be any different from current modules ?
> 
>What modules will continue the same ? what modules will be new ?
>what modules will be upgraded ?

	My understanding is that the text modules will be the same. 
You will be able to use what you already have with the new program.

	There will be a new topics module that will be more point and 
shoot than the way that it is now. There will be a Thompson 
chain-reference module that will be out in October. The Darby OT 
should be done soon, and the Youngs literal translation should be done 
in October too.

	The Webster Bible is being proofread again. There were some 
changes in the lexicons too. It seems that Strongs Concordance has 
about 10% error, and that will be corrected for the Online Bible.

	There is also a very nice laser printed manual that will be 
available for $5 US. BUt that doc files should be sufficient.

	Also, a MacIntosh version is also being released. This is due 
in October too. However, I don't know when this will make it to the 
archive.


 en agape,
 Bob 
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
From: creps@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Steve Creps)
Subject: Re: Re>Absolution
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 17:15:46 GMT

In article <BuC750.7rn@world.std.com> timk@world.std.com (Tim King) writes:
>Furthermore, if we can, without committing any heresy, take the emphasis off
>of the act of confession to a priest, why can't the word "priest" in (A)
>and (B) above be replaced with the words "qualified protestant minister"
>(without, for now, defining the word "qualified")?

   The difference between a Protestant minister and a Catholic or
Orthodox priest is that the former cannot administer the _Sacrament_
of Penance.  I'm pretty sure that God's forgiveness would be obtained
by confessing to a Protestant minister (unless the person confessing
knows he needs a priest, but is rejecting that knowledge), but this
forgiveness would be due to the action of the penitent person, not
that of the minister. On the other hand, a priest, by virtue of his
Holy Orders, is able to administer Penance sacramentally, along with
the grace which accompanies it.

   I'm explaining Catholic teaching here, so I'm not too interested in
arguing about this.  Just giving the Catholic perspective.

-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
Steve Creps, Indiana University
creps@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Original_To:  CHRISTIA
Original_cc:  HUTTER
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 10 Sep 1992 13:57:00 N
From:         Wolfgang Hutter <HUTTER@DULRUU51.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Spiritual experience

In a message of Tue, 8 Sep 1992 17:03:00 GMT
Received on Tue,  8 Sep 92 20:41 N
Z_STAFF_CL@SOUTHAMPTON-INSTITUTE.AC.UK wrote:

>I am interested to hear how rare it is that Christian experience such things
>and what others think, so I'd like to ask all or you to post me your thoughts
>(directly or via the list)
>
>Spiritual experience - yes - had one
>Spiritual experience - no - born sceptic
>Spiritual experience - yes - biblical

Could you be more specific as to what you count under 'spiritual
experience'?

Willing to respond,

Wolfgang <><
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:04:36 EDT
From:         "St. John Koczan" <CA36%CATCC.BITNET@VTVM2.CC.VT.EDU>
Subject:      Who does this belong to???

   Who does this belong to ??  Is there open communication to each
other?  I already have a bad taste of this. I got taste of clique
attitude among you on this.

--Stephen Kotchen
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 8 Sep 1992 14:08:04 CST
From:         Ian Williams <iwilliam@AU.ORACLE.COM>
Subject:      Re: Spiritual Gifts
              "jstahley@QUALCOMM.COM" at Sep 7, 92 10:38 am

>
>Can anyone define what spiritual gifts are and how to tell which spiritual
>gifts I may have?
>                                JSTAHLEY@ATHENA.QUALCOMM.COM
>
>                                RECEIVING INSPECTION DEPARTMENT
>
If by Spiritual Gifts you mean what most charistmatics/pentecostal types
mean by the term then you mean th gifts described in 1 Corinthians 12
through to 14.
They are the following manifestations of the Holy Spirits power for the
edification (building up) of the church
such as

Speaking in Tounges
Interpretation of Tounges
Healing
Great Faith
Prophesy
Working of Miracles
Word of Knowledge
Word of Wisdom

You cannot work out which gift you have because no one has them, they are
given for a period of time by the Holy Spirit to acheive a certain
purpose and then are taken away again.

You may like to check out Romans for 'gifts' that we are more likely to
'have' such as The Gift of Serving, Leadership, Helps, Encouraging etc ect
(i cannot remember the reference off hand).

In Him


---------------------+-------------+-----------------------------------------
Ian Williams         |    _--_|\   |      Internet: iwilliam@au.oracle.com
Oracle Systems       |   /      \  |	  Phone	  : +61 8 239 3900
Adelaide, Australia  |   \_.--*_/  |
                     |         v   |
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X-Orig-To: Christia@asuacad
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Sat, 12 Sep 1992 16:38:31 CDT
From:         MICHELE LOFTON <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
Subject:      BRAD(PROTESTANT)

The post titled PROTESTANT was send by Theresa.  She felt the urge
to answer the post you sent me.

                                       Michele

Michele Lofton <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
From: psyrobtw@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Robert Weiss)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: Blest is the nation ...
Date: 7 Sep 92 01:37:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <CHRISTIA%92090405553343@ASUACAD.BITNET>, GRAHAM%DRCV06.decnet@DRCVAX.AF.MIL (DRCV06::GRAHAM) writes...
>Kerry, a nation can no more choose to be a nation for God than a person
>can.  What King David said aplied only to the Jews, and they didn't choose
>God, He chose them.  The United States cannot be a Godly nation.  It is

Dan,
	Should Christians vote?
	

 en agape,
 Bob 
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
From: creps@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Steve Creps)
Subject: Re:      Re:Seeking a Catholic Perspective
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 22:43:28 GMT

In article <920912.13323436.070978@USM.CP6> MICHELE LOFTON <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET> writes:
>You asked why can't a Protestant minister do the same things as the
>Catholic priest?  He can, which is why I explained that a Catholic priest
>is like "any minister".

   This is incorrect.  The difference in confession to a priest, and
to a Protestant minister, is that the former can truly administer
sacramental forgiveness of sins, and has real authority from God
through His Church.  With the latter, the forgiveness comes about
through the penitence of the confessing party, not through the
minister.  This is assuming that he does not know he needs to confess
to a priest.  Otherwise, he is not forgiven, because he is explicitly
rejecting God's sacrament.

-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
Steve Creps, Indiana University
creps@silver.ucs.indiana.edu
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 8 Sep 1992 12:51:24 CDT
From:         Jesse Carnes <NOTJIC@LSUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Double Meaning Prophecy
              8 Sep 1992 12:46:59 EDT from <Leo_W@QM.CIRCA.UFL.EDU>

Dear Leo ;

The prophecy was Connotative in nature.
The fulfillment was connotative in nature.
Neither was dennotative.
Both concur.



Jesse Carnes
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X-Orig-To: CHRISTIA@ASUACAD.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 8 Sep 1992 19:07:19 CDT
From:         MICHELE LOFTON <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
Subject:      HEY

I'm on the Christia list and I am glad to be here.  I'm
looking forward to hearing from everyone and to
responding to and adding to the interesting discussions
on the list.
                                          *Michele

Michele Lofton <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Wed, 9 Sep 1992 11:37:53 EDT
From:         carol nemec <YA67@FERRIS.BITNET>
Subject:      Spiritual Gifts

This is from a Bible study by David Hoover and Roger Leenerts,
published by Parish Helps, Inc (I have address if anyone is
interested)

Quoted: (mispelling and typos are mine :-) )

Four passages in the New Testament have something to say about the
subject of spriritual gifts.  They are 1 Corinthians 12, Romans 12,
Ephesians 4, and 1 Peter 4.                            pg. 23

Definition:  A special attribute given by the Holy Spirit to every
member of the body of Christ (the Church) according to God's grace
to be used within the context of the body of Christ (the Church)
for the purposes of glorifying God and edifying the Church.  pg. 36

Difference between spiritual gifts and the fruit of the Spirit...
Galatians 5:22-23 lists fruits as love, joy, peace, patience,
kindness, goodness, faithfulness, humility(gentleness), self-control.


Note that all the things listed above concern attitude.  On the other
hand, spiritual gifts habe to do with activity.  Furthermore, the
Christian has one or a few of the gifts (not all) while the fruit (note
that it is singular and not plural) is all-inclusive.

But remember this:  spiritual gifts become useless unless used in the
context of the fruit of the Spirit.This was the problem among the Corin-
thian Christians.  They had spiritual gifts and were using them, but
with the wrong attitude (pride, for edication of self, to cause division
etc.).  No wonder Paul places the great chapter on love (1 Corinthians
13) between the two chapters in which he discusses spiritual gifts.
That is a good reminder:  at the center of your use of spiritual gifts
must be the attitude of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness,
goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control.

According to God's Word each person in the church has at least one
spiritual gift given to him/her to be used in the church for the
building up of the church.  Imagine what that means.  You are a gifted
person in God's Kingdom.  Do you know what your gift(s) is?  Are you
using your gift(s) to build the church?  You see, all God's people
are important, play a significant part in the work of the church.
God so much desires your involvement in the church that He gifted you
with at least one spiritual gift...            pg 38-39

Part 2...what are the spiritual gifts

Carol Nemec
ya67@ferris
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X-Orig-To: CHRISTIA@ASUACAD.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 10 Sep 1992 18:59:55 CDT
Comments:     Answering received message
From:         THERESA BLACKWELL <TBLACKWL@USMCP6.BITNET>
Subject:      YO, MEMO!!!

 YOU GOT THAT ....
 Prayers bein' sent up right now, as far as "G"'s concerned.
 Ouija boards are NOT TOYS....
 Theresa

 * <TBLACKWL@USMCP6.BITNET>
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 10 Sep 1992 12:30:30 EDT
From:         Leo W <Leo_W@QM.CIRCA.UFL.EDU>
Subject:      Scripturette 9/10

"In the past we were foolish people, too.  We did not obey, we were wrong, and
we were slaves to many things our bodies wanted and enjoyed.  We lived doing
evil and being jealous.  People hated us and and we hated each other.  But then
the kindness and love of God our Savior was shown.  He saved us through the
washing that made us new people.  He saved us by making us new through the Holy
Spirit.  God poured out to us that Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ our Savior.
 We were made right with God by His grace.  And God gave us the Spirit so that
we could receive the life that never ends.  That is what we hope for.

"This teaching is true.  And I want you to be sure that the people understand
these things.  Then those who believe in God will be careful to use their lives
for doing good.  These things are good and will help all people" (Titus 3:8).

Yours in Christ Jesus,
Leo

Scriptures quoted from the International Children's Bible (ICB), New Century
Version, copyright 1986, 1988 by Word Publishing, Dallas, Texas 75039.  Used by
permission.
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Organization: Penn State University
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1992 19:44:25 EDT
From: Tim Bieling <QAA@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Subject: Re: Gays want to be left alone???

Barry,

Seek professional help - the BS you rant about is just that - a rant.
You must have a personal problem with gay people.

If anyone actually believes the BS you have written, get them an
appointment as well.

For all:  I'm sorry, but this kind of mis-information is what keeps
the homophobia alive.  I'm going to be sick.

(sigh)

-Tim (exercising restraint after reading a particularly offensive piece)
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 15 Sep 1992 02:33:41 EDT
From:         JEK@NIHCU.BITNET
Subject:      RE : Total Depravity

Lon writes:

 > The issue of the total depravity of man was settled at the
 > ecumenical Council of Orange, in 529 AD.

At the risk of nit-picking, I point out that the Council of Orange
is not an ecumenical council. Ecumenical councils presumably
represent the whole Church. Orange was a Western regional council.
It is important evidence of the currents of thought prevailing in
the West at the time, but should not be called ecumenical.

 Yours,
 James Kiefer
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X-Orig-To: CHRISTIA@ASUACAD.BITNET
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Thu, 10 Sep 1992 14:05:45 CDT
Comments:     Answering received message
From:         MICHELE LOFTON <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
Subject:      re:Catholicism ?s

...why was Mary exalted and not Jesus?

I cannot explain everything that happened at the wedding, but I can
say what Catholics believe in general.

We do exalt Jesus and because Mary was chosen to be the mother of Jesus
we exalt her as our mother in the family of Christianity.

I don't know about the Pope's blessing.  I guess the family thought it
was nich to have.

I hope that you will have all of your questions of Catholicism are
answered.

                                  Michele

Michele Lofton <MLOFTON@USMCP6.BITNET>
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Fri, 11 Sep 1992 14:14:16 CDT
From:         Jesse Carnes <NOTJIC@LSUVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Second Parousia
              11 Sep 1992 13:25:00 CDT from <BKCOBB@LIFE.UAMS.EDU>

Dear Brian ;

Yes, they do.

An amil./Pret. advocate ;
Jesse Carnes
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 14 Sep 1992 17:34:20 EST
From:         Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      RE: Homosexuality (again)

Dan:

No, Jesus said, "and the second is like unto it."  But he called the
first the "first and greatest."

Love INC,
         --Kerry
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Tue, 15 Sep 1992 10:29:00 GMT
From:         Z_STAFF_CL@SOUTHAMPTON-INSTITUTE.AC.UK
Subject:      Short Summaries of Christianity

Off the top of my head and under another subject (Homosexuality (again)) I
took the tone of the discussion (live and let live) and provided this as
a possible summary of Christianity in relation to our fellows :
   "Love and let live and judge not lest you be judged"


Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@EARN.PURCCVM> responded with this :
How about "You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all
your soul, and with all your mind."  This is the FIRST and GREATEST
commandment.  The second is "you shall love your neighbor as yourself."

Which of course is the definitive pithy saying.

If we put a word limit of 50 words on this, can anyone else come up with
an "off the cuff" definition of Christianity ?

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Carol A Long,  					DISCLAIMER - unless otherwise
IT Service,					stated this message contains
Southampton Institute of Higher Education	my opinion...probably only mine
East Park Terrace,
Southampton	SO9 4WW,   England		RELEASE - Repost at will, with
	UK Fax No : (0703) 222259		acknowlegements to author.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Z_STAFF_CL@UK.AC.SOUTHAMPTON-INSTITUTE
===============================================================================
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Sun, 6 Sep 1992 17:35:54 EST
From:         Kerry Stephenson <KSTE@PURCCVM.BITNET>
Subject:      Jesus comes to church

Hi all:

I just *had* to tell you.  I went to the student Ministry worship
service today.  I didn't really feel like going, I was really tired,
I barely made it on time, and I was just going because I haven't
been anywhere in about 7 weeks, and Mark was bugging me about it
last night on the phone.  I was planning to go to a local conservative
presbyterian church next week, when my ride gets back into town; this
was just to see if this was the kind of place I could feel comfortable
going to if there wasn't anywhere else to go.  So I went.

And you know what?  Jesus was there.  He really was.  From the first
song ("Shut De Do, Keep Out De Debil")to the sermon, to the sharing time,
to communion, to the very last second of the very last song, He Was *There*.
It's been a very long time (a year at least) since I felt the presence of
God in a church service, but here He was, waiting for me.
  I think I've found a home.  And, as Dorothy said, "it was right in
my own back yard the whole time" (or something to that effect.  You
get the point.)

  Praise God for His patience, and for His willingness to overcome my
stubbornness and my laziness.  Praise Him for knowing what I needed
and supplying it in abundance.  Praise Him for the life in Him that
flows through my spirit even now, hours later.  Hallelujah!  He is
risen!  Again.

  One more thing:  I highly recommend a tape called "Hope of the World"
by Donnie Harper and New Jersey Mass.   Joy joy joy!  Turn it up and
sing your praise to the Lord (and nevermind the neighbors.  It's the
weekend, and they're out of town anyway.  Crank it.)

Love (and HOW!) INC,
                    --Kerry
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