From: RCJ@AUTOMATION.UNIVERSITY-LIBRARY.CAMBRIDGE.AC.UK
Newsgroups: rec.music.dylan
Subject: Krogsgaard and listing etiquette for Stacey
Date: 6 Jan 1993 09:07:33 -0600
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs.utexas.edu



                        __________________
                      _/ ||                ~-_
                    ,/   //       /~-       /  ~-_  ________---------------//
  -----------------------------------\-------------------____________  __//
 O--------------                  ~~^ |                                 | ~|
 }======{--------\____________________|______________________________   |  |
 \===== / /~~~\ \ \                   |         ________________________|-~
  \----|  \___/ ||--------------------'----------|  \____/ //
        `______''                                 `_______'

                  Nice car to drive, after a war



From: co273@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Stacy Tartar)

> Please excuse my ignorance, but what is this Krogsgaard
> source that many of you keep referring to?

John  Krogsgaard   was  an   African  big  game  hunter  who
specialized in  leopard skins  when pill-box  hats  were  in
fashion. He  came to Greenwich Village to be the editor of a
famous etiquette  book in November of 1959 and met Bob Dylan
at a  transvestite club  called the "Red Rosey Bush" in East
Orange New  Jersey. Anyone  know if  it still exists? And do
not forget  that lyric "pull off, pull off those high heeled
shoes well  made of  Spanish leather"? Be that as it may, in
the song Acne with Jack Elliot broadcast on WRVR-FM New York
and recorded at the Riverside Church, New York City, 29 July
1961 and  not at  Bonnie  Beecher's  apartment,  when  Dylan
refers to the 22 rifle his parents gave him for his birthday
IT IS  NOW CERTAIN that he did NOT get it from them but from
John who  also did not understand him. Assuming the incident
is true of course...

                        :-) :-) :-)

Was that  some kind  of joke?  All  these  people  that  you
mention, yes,  I know  them, they're  quite lame  I  had  to
rearrange their  faces and give them all another name. Right
now, I can't read too good, don't send me no more e-mail no,
not unless  you mail them from cleveland.Freenet.Edu. [Sorry
Stacey, something not quite right here]



Anyway  he  had  a  boring  older  brother  Mike  who  liked
compiling lists and wrote:
Krogsgaard, Michael.
    Positively Bob Dylan : a thirty-year discography,
    concert & recording session guide, 1960-1991 / by
    Michael Krogsgaard.
    [Ann Arbor, MI] : Popular Culture, Ink., 1991.
    xiv, 498 p. : ill. ; 29 cm.
    (Rock & roll reference series ; 33)
    Includes indexes.
    Dylan, Bob, 1941- Discography.

In this the events are numbered as are the songs. So [014.9]
would suggest  to a  Krogsgaardian Dylan addict song nine of
event 14.   014 is the Minnesota Hotel Tape, Minneapolis, 22
December 1961  (recorded by  Tony Glover at Bonnie Beecher's
apartment). Song 9 is Dink's Song. Make sense?

Now Michael Krogsgaard is neither infallible nor omniscient,
he makes  mistakes and  misses things.  But everyone  has  a
copy. Either  a personal  bedside copy  or they  duped their
local library into coughing up for one. So it is a standard.
A bit  like Mozart  has K. numbers after Kochel's catalogue,
so  Robert  Zimmerman  has  K.  numbers  after  Krogsgaard's
catalogue. It is intended to aid reference and be specific.

Where Krogsgaard  is wrong  you simply  use his  numbers and
note his error with your correction.

[If I am boring you just skip on to the next posting.]

So let's  suppose you  wish to  tell someone  about a CD you
saw. This  may be in e-mail or as a rec.music.dylan posting.
You could say :

"I saw the Hootenany thingy with that Wings song on it."

Or you could be more precise and say:

I saw this today:

--
Dr. Zimmerman's Original Old Time Hootenany / Bob Dylan [1963-1964]
Archive Productions  AP 89003
Disk titled Bob Dylan:"Who You Really Are"
Made in Italy
Total Running Time: 67:59
"Stereo" [sic]

A.  (Quest TV, Canada 1964):
1.  The Times They Are A Changin' [1]
2.  Talking World War III Blues [Bob Dylan's Dream listed in error!] [2]
3.  Lonesome Death of Hattie Carroll [3]
4.  Girl from the North Country [4]
5.  A Hard Rains A Gonna Fall [5]
6.  Restless Farewell [listed incorrectly as Farewell!] [6]

B.  (Live with Jean Bear [sic], 1964):
7.  Troubled And I Don't Know Why [with Joan Baez] [1]
8.  Blowin' in the Wind (partial) [with Joan Baez] [2]

C.  (Wings 1962):
9.  If I Had Wings [Fare Thee Well, Dink's Song] [8]
    Living The Blues [listed but not on CD]
10. In The Evening [In The Evening (When the Sun Goes Down)] [14]
11. Long John [18]

D.  (Turner's Basement 1963):
12. Lonesome River Edge [not listed] [1]
13. Who You Really Are [Back Door Blues] [2]
14. Bob Dylan's Dream [3]
15. You Can Get Her [not listed] [4]
16. Farewell [5]
17. If I Could Do It All Over I'd [All Over You] [6]
18. Keep Your Hands Off Her (really poor sound- a mess!) [9]
19. Used To Do [Honey Babe] [10]
20. Going Back To Rome [11]
21. Stealin' [12]
    Hootenany [listed but not on CD]

(1-6)   CBC TV Studio, Toronto, Quest television show, 1 February 1964
(broadcast 10 March 1964). [064]
(7-8)   Forest Hills  Tennis Stadium,  New York  City, 17 August 1963,
guest appearance at Joan Baez concert. [056]
(9-11)   Minnesota Hotel Tape, Minneapolis, 22 December 1961 (recorded
by Tony Glover at Bonnie Beecher's apartment). [014]
(12-20)   Banjo tape,  home of  Gill Turner, New York City, January or
February 1963. [038]

Terribly misleading  track list.  This CD  is composed of four tracks,
each having  multiple  songs,  making  seeking  out  individual  songs
difficult.

The packaging  with this  disk is  nice, containing  a fold-out  front
paper, with  several pictures of Bob in his youth.  For the most part,
the recording quality varies from only fair to very good.

PERFORMANCE: 8
SOUND: 4
RECOMMENDATION: 7 worth considering


--

============================================================

Readers of  long standing  will recognize  this  format  has
developed  out  of  something  created  by  Anthony  Kapolka
anthony@cs.pitt.edu.
The general format is:

-- <=== these two hyphens suggest the beginning of a listing
Title / statement of attribution [dates of material]
Producer  CD number  date of CD (feel free to guess, e.g. [?1990])
Extra information found on CD or inserts (Don't forget - if it is
there - company and number information punched in found on that little
ring near the centre and read with extreme difficulty)
Place of manufacture
Total Running Time:
Other odd information ([sic] if the info is wonky, "" if it is
printed)

Divisional titles if relevant

Numbered track listing, consecutively through multiple CDs under one
title (repair errors on CD by info in square brackets, or give
supplementary information in square brackets, especially alternate
titles for a song)

(track numbers on CD)  Source event as found in Krogsgaard.
[Krogsgaard number] [supplementary information, e.g. "Is Krogsgaard
insane? 1961? I know this took place on 1 April 1992 in my bathtub and
was recorded on a wax cylinder recorder. George Harrison and Sinead
O'Connor are the two tuba players you can hear in the distance. The
soap was Camay, if my memory serves me well...]

General comments on anything, the CD, packaging, price, the event, the
recording, hairstyles, comparison with other boots of same material,
the present political situation in Albania, warts, anything which did
not fit in elsewhere, anything at all.

Numerical performance, sound & recommendation ratings, supplemented by
words if you must. Be extremely subjective it helps spark the
rec.music.dylan discussion.

======================================================================

Now should you religiously follow this format? No. You are a
Dylan fan.  Be lazy. Type in as much as you can manage given
the debilitating effect of your addiction.

Did I forget you Stacey?

> Please excuse my ignorance

Not ignorance,  not at all, you just ain't properly addicted
yet. Pass  me my  Krogsgaard please,  hmmm, now I've started
out on  burgundy but  I'll soon  hit the  harder stuff,  the
sweet pretty  things are  in bed  now of  course, yes, bring
that bottle  over here,  and that  too, and  let's see  what
shall we play, [014.19] sounds good to me....
Craig Jamieson
University of Cambridge

                           .     .
                          /^\___/^\
                         (  o _ o  )
                          \  /v\  /
                           \_*-*_/
                             `-'
                          With no
                     attempts to shovel
                 the glimpse into the ditch
                        of what each
                         one means.