From: cobb@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Mike Cobb)
Subject: Re: THE MIND OF THE BIBLE BELIEVER
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Distribution: world,public
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 20:24:38 GMT

In <1993Jan6.175954.3577@ra.royalroads.ca> mlee@post.RoyalRoads.ca (Malcolm 
Lee) writes:


>In article <98c=p8_@engin.umich.edu>, ingles@engin.umich.edu (Ray Ingles) 
writes:
>|> In article <1993Jan5.223146.29327@ra.royalroads.ca> 
mlee@post.RoyalRoads.ca (Malcolm Lee) writes:
>|> >
>|> >But we can have eternal life and the knowledge of good and evil.
>|> 
>|>  Sure, god has done it for all time. So why not make more gods? But
>|> anyway...
>|> 
>|> >Sure, when God placed the Tree of Knowledge of good and evil in the 
Garden, HE
>|> >knew that the people would partake of it and be condemned to death as 
well as 
>|> >all the generations that followed them.  GOD knew this!  
>|> 
>|>  So God took responsibility for the pain and suffering involved, right?
>|> 
>|> >   That is why He provided a plan for salvation through His one and only 
Son,
>|> 
>|>  (Say, why *is* there "one and only" one Son? Why not a couple of 
Daughters?
>|> Maybe a Nephew or two? What I'm jocularly getting at is the "Why not make
>|> lots of perfect beings from the start?" question posed above.)
>|> 
>|> >Jesus Christ.  We are living in the age of grace whereby we may be saved 
IF we
>|> >choose to follow Jesus.  There's nothing more to it than that.  
>|> >    Maybe I'm being too simplistic.  I don't post too often but I am a 
firm
>|> >believer and I just couldn't stand by silent in admidst this debate.  I 
don't
>|> >mean to flame anyone.  After all, Jesus came into this world to save not 
to
>|> >condemn.  And in His likeness, I would not do the same.
>|> >    I welcome your response.
>|> 
>|>  Here's my problem with the whole idea. Let's assume that eating fruit will
>|> corrupt people, or at least doing it against orders will. (Yes, I know this
>|> may not be *literally* eating fruit, but hey..)
>|>  Now...
>|>  1) *I* didn't eat any "fruit of knowledge of good and evil." I just had a
>|> banana, but I don't think that counts. Am I being held responsible for
>|> something I didn't do? What about Deuteronomy 24:16... "Fathers shall 
>|> not be put to death for their children, nor children put to death for
>|> their fathers; each is to die for his own sin." I refuse to take
>|> responsibility for an action that I could not prevent.
>|>  2) Okay, maybe the act of eating the fruit, through some kind of 
"spiritual
>|> genetics," made the decendants corrupt, too. But... god must have set up
>|> the laws regarding that. Why make a whole *race* fallen if one falls?
>|> How about starting off each kid from scratch? It happened in the cases of
>|> Adam, Eve, and maybe even Mary if certain circles are given credence.
>|> Why not do it for everyone and give each person the choice about rebelling
>|> or not?
>|> 
>|> 
>|> Sincerely,
>|> 
>|> Ray Ingles                  || The above opinions are probably
>|>                             || not those of the University of
>|> ingles@engin.umich.edu      || Michigan. Yet.

>Okay.
>I'll try to explain this as best I understand it.  Only He knows for sure.
>When A&E ate the fruit from the Tree, the entire human race became aware of 
good
>and evil.  But we are not born into this world with sin, but it is inevitable
>that we will sin.  It is a part of our nature.  When a baby comes into this
>world, he is without sin.  But, the moment he sins, he becomes a sinner.  And 
he
>will sin because it is part of his inherent human nature.  So, in a sense, 
each
>kid does start off with a clean slate but it will eventually become tainted by
>sin.  

>The only kid who made it to adulthood WITHOUT sinning is Jesus Christ, the 
one and
>only Son.  The reason that there is only one truly begotten Son of God is 
because
>He is God.  I'm not going to get into arguements about the Trinity because 
that
>is a separate, very involved topic of its own accord.  No one fully 
understands
>the true nature of God and it is not our purpose to do so anyways.  Who cares
>how many angels can dance on the head of pin?  Is Jesus Christ your personal 
Lord
>and Saviour?  That is what really matters.

>God loves, Man kills.

Amen.