From: dking@raul.nas.nasa.gov (Dan King)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,alt.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: rights and responsibilities
Date: 20 Nov 92 15:54:59 GMT
Organization: NAS Program, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA


In article <Ef2zRZq00WBLE4rVkJ@andrew.cmu.edu> Elizabeth Cornelia Green <eg1o+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
 
>Boy do you have some messed up ideas!  
 
It would have been nice to know who you are referring to.  I eventually 
figured out it was my post.  Man that hurt.
 
>You think abortions should be used as a source of birthcontrol if
>necessary?!?  And that the practice of abstinence is a ridiculous
>solution?!?!!  Wow you're confused.  
 
The point you missed was that Paul Smith claimed abstinence was
an alternative to abortion.  It is not at all.  I think even he 
is now convinced how foolish that statement was.  
 
Abortion is generally used for birth control.  If you are 
pregnant and do not want to give birth, abortion can resolve
that problem.  Occasionally it is used for health reasons,
but I'd say (with out stats to back it up) that abortion
is generally used to avoid giving birth.  And with things as 
they are now in society, I think abortion can be a responsible
method of dealing with an un-wanted pregnancy.
 
>I (obviously) agree with the other side of the argument.
 
You mean not everyone agrees with me?
 
>Abstinence is the only good method of birth control.  It's obviously the
>only 100% certain method.   
 
Abstinence is not 100% effective.  You can attempt to practice
abstinence all you want, this is no guarantee you will not end
up having to deal with an un-wanted pregnancy.
 
There are other more reliable methods of contraception.  Mutilating
your sex organs is guaranteed to be 100% reliable.  Many of us do
not feel the cost is worth it and will continue to use abortion
when less reliable, but also less costly methods fail.
 
>If a couple considers themselves adult enough to engage in sex, they
>should face the adult responsibilities that might accompany the action. 
>And making sure that the child that results from your actions is cared
>for is an obvious responsibility.  I strongly believe that killing that
>child through an abortion is not facing your responsibilities. 
 
Then don't do it.  Others of us strongly disagree with you and 
you should leave us alone.
 
>Sure, sex may be fun, but be prepared to deal with all that it entails 
>No Sex is Safe Sex. 
>Everybody knows that there isn't any condom that guarantees no pregnancy
>will result.  And they don't prevent the horrible diseases that can
>result from sex, either. 
 
Then don't have sex.  Some of us feel the rewards from sex are 
worth the risk.  Some of us are willing to leave our houses 
knowing that it could result in harm, but knowing the reward 
is worth the risk.  If you feel safer staying in your house 
and avoiding all outside risk, hey I would never pass legislation
forcing you to leave your house.
 
>Hope I don't sound too old fashioned.  But I'm only nineteen and I've
>already been able to figure this out.  What's the matter with the rest
>of you?
 
Well since you are only nineteen let me clue you in.  I have spent
a much greater amount of time practicing abstinence than you have.
As a matter of fact, as I type this in, I am practicing it.  But
I see no reason to get obsessive about the idea.  I'd advise you 
not to get compulsive about this whole abstinence idea.
 
>                          --Elizabeth C Green
 
Dan King
Newsgroups: talk.abortion