From: byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer)
Subject: Re: Gas subsidies and taxes (was Re: Bicycle Paths
Reply-To: byer@adobe.com (Scott Byer)
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 21:41:08 GMT

Thomas H. Kunich writes

> Scott, are you sure that you know what you're talking
> about? Who are these people that are paying for your
> driving? The 13% of the American public that don't own
> and operate automobiles?

Oh, it's certainly not something as simple as 'those who
don't drive pay for those who do'.  It's a matter of
distance.  Someone who drives 5000 mi/yr contributes
about the same amount as someone who drives 30000 mi/yr.
Yet the latter is costing the system (in terms of damage,
etc) four times as much.

> Maybe you don't realize that 100% of the American
> population uses the roads. If it isn't for their personal
> transportation it certainly is for the transportation of
> the goods and services that are necessary in a population
> density like the world is developing.

Sure, but some 'use' the roads far less than others.
And if road use was priced at what it actually cost, it
would diminish greatly.

> Apples are here overnight from Washington state via
> those roads. Not railroads. Vegetables from the Imperial
> valley are in stores within 24 hours of being picked
> and packed. Even slaughterhouses bring your steaks to
> you on those roads that you want to pay more for.
> Emergency vehicles, war material, and yes bicycles use
> those roads.

Well, I don't eat meat - so those trucks don't drive for
me :-)

Tom, I'm *not* advocating a reduction in the highway
system.  *Or* a forced reduction in automobile usage.
I think diamond lanes are ridiculous.

The *only* thing I'm after is to remove the heavy subsidy
that is currently there, so that supply and demand can
properly allocate capital for transportation.  Subsidies
benefit nobody in the long term.  They cause market
inefficiencies that hurt us all.

> You claim that private vehicle drivers don't pay their
> fair share.  So tell us how you arrive at that. There
> isn't a single citizen of this country that doesn't rely
> completely on this highway system.  Without this highway
> system this technological society couldn't exist. Even
> TV reporters rely on traveling these roads. In case you
> didn't know it, after the earthquake, with the road system
> pretty much unuseable TV coverage was very poor until
> roads got opened.

I don't completely rely on the highway transportation
system.  I really could get along without it - I cycle
to the store, I buy locally grown fruits and vegetables
and locally made pasta.  Maybe not as efficiently or as
easily, maybe more.  How do I know when the costs of the
system are completely hidden from me, and I receive no
monetary benefit from my reduced usage?

And instead of increasing reliance on the highways,
technology tends to decrease it.  Video conferencing,
telecommuting, etc.  If the costs of driving were obtained
through direct taxes, the incentive for such applications
of technology becomes even greater.

> Increased taxation means only one thing, increased
> spending. Your idea that government can somehow resist
> spending $2 for every $1 they have coming in certainly
> isn't backed up with any historical evidence. So you are
> a dreamer of the first magnitude if you think that they
> are going to change any time before the economy collapses.

Yes, it would have to be cautiously done, so that the
current insane methods of stealing money for the
transportation system would be phased out at the same
rate as the direct usage taxes would be phased in.

However, if it could be done, the use of the money
collected would be far more efficient - connected very
closely to the only way the people truly vote, with their
wallets.  It would also properly connect the costs with
the benefits - those who benefit most would have the
highest cost.  That just isn't currently the case.

(Sales taxes going to highways?  A regressive tax that
hurts those most who least use the system?!?)

Scott Byer                                   NeXTMail: byer@adobe.com
Adobe Systems Incorporated               These are *my* opinions, and  
1585 Charleston Road, P.O. Box 7900        do not necessarily reflect
Mountain View, CA 94039-7900             the opinions of my employer.
---------------------------------------------------------------------