From: bil@burka..aix.kingston.ibm.com (Igor Belchinskiy)
Subject: Re: More education talk...
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 21:37:36 GMT
Organization: Be. I am.
Keywords: Russian students, "cookbook recipes."

In article <1992Sep29.170201.26325@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> frants@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Leonid Frants) writes:
>In article <1992Sep29.135430.33221@watson.ibm.com> bil@burka..aix.kingston.ibm.com (Igor Belchinskiy) writes:
>>In article <_j+prrb.oleg@netcom.com> oleg@netcom.com (Oleg Kiselev) writes:
>>>In article <1992Sep28.142827.17509@watson.ibm.com> bil@burka..aix.kingston.ibm.com (Igor Belchinskiy) writes:
>>>>Kind of strange - at least 4 grammar errors in  one paragraph.  Should be 
>>>>tough Ph.D.
>>>
>>>Grammar flames, like spelling flames, are a sign of a feeble mind and
>>>blatant disregard for the establised USENET conventions.  They look even
>>>worse when their author makes the same kinds of mistakes in his/her own 
>>>article.
>>
>
>>2. Please, apply your posting to itself, and result of this application 
>>to own mind.
>>
>>>Besides, those were typos, not simple grammar errors. 
>>So what? Is it OK for Ph.D. in US? Or typos are OK for HS graduate in US?
>>Explain, please - I know only education norms in Russia, where 
>>typos were (grammar) errors.
>>>-- 

Hm, selective citation instead of reading is more and more popular. 
But I'm too lazy to repeat the same third time. So this would be
my last posting on this subject no matter which other mind problems
would be discovered.
>
>Igor,
btw, if it's only for me - use e-mail :-)
I'd answer in public because you post it, OK?
>
>1. The basic fact is that here the contents of the message count
>rather than the typos -  if you do not understand this fact you should not be
>posting at all :). I, for one, do not care when others make mistakes
>as long as I can understand what they are saying.

Me too. But not when typos contradict things said.

>2. This is not the third grade of a soviet high school.

Often it's lower, I know. :-)

>3. Making a point of someone's typos is a sign of a feeble mind no
>matter what you say.

As long as typos aren't connected with message - yes. 
Btw, explain me, what would be your reaction if somebody would write 
"I has exselent anglish lagnvuege novledge" giving this as an example
of fine education system?

And - why should you care about my mind?

>4. The education norms in Russia, as far as the spelling is concerned, suck.
>Anyone who can justify getting a C grade instead of an A grade for
>writing a brilliant university entrance composition on (... whatever topic
>..) because of 2 or 3 spelling errors is an idiot by default.

FYI - in Russia composition gets two marks: one for grammar and spelling, 
other for "raskrytie temy" (composition on given theme).
And you may write brilliant composition off subject and get you "banan" -
but it's like in math exam you would start to prove theorems and give
solutions to tasks nobody asked you instead of looking at your ticket.
Don't know why, but in math exams that never happens, while 
in composition - every other time.

And for 2 spelling errors (probably for 3 too) plus some punctuation
errors you would receive 4 (fyi - grade system is 5-1 in Russia, not A-D).
If you want detailed table mark vs. number of spelling errors
I may look and post it.

>5. Most editors have spell-checkers now. So avoiding spelling errors is
>in not a sign of anything but knowing how to use these spell-checkers.

Are you trying to say that US computer related Ph.D. 
(author of original full of bugs article about high quality of US high schools)
don't know how to use spell-checker?

Stran'she i stran'she :-)

>6. CHYA BY KOROVA MYCHALA....

A chto, v strane svobody slova muchanie strogo reguliruyetsya?
Ladno, ostavlyayu pole - tyavkayte na zdorov'e. Lish' by vetra ne bylo.

>
>>>Oleg Kiselev at home			...use the header to find the path

						neulovimyi Joe
>>
>>Disclaimer: I never thought or told my English is error-free.
>
>Leonid Frants.
>
	-igor