HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jfrawley@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Judy Frawley)
Subject: Re: Question about making Quinoa (Eden brand)
Organization: Syracuse University, Syracuse, NY
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 12:17:01 EDT

In article <1992Aug22.151957.3939@socrates.umd.edu> tara@socrates.umd.edu (Tara McDermott) writes:
>I have been making Quinoa from Eden foods.  I don't have a sieve or a
>fine mesh collander, so I never rinse it, which the directions call
>for. In every recipe for making quinoa, I've always seens the
>directions to rinse it WELL, or else it will taste bitter.  Does it?
>When I make it, it doesn't taste bitter at all!  Does Eden pre-wash or
>polish their grains maybe?  I'm just wondering if there really IS a
>bitter taste that I'm just used to or not... 
>
>Any help anyone?
>
>Tara
>-- 
>Tara McDermott            "We suggest people take their Food Pyramids,
>                            cut off the top and make a Healthy Eating
>tara@socrates.umd.edu         Trapezoid."  -Neal Barnard, M.D.

Tara,	
This is not a scientific answer, and I do not have references except
for personal experiences.  I have cooked quinoa both ways; rinsed and
unrinsed.  I found no noticeable difference in taste; but I did lose
some of it in the rinsing process because my strainer wasn't fine
enough :-)

One caveat:  whatever anyone does, overcooking it makes it really
             yucky (imho).  I forgot to set the timer when I cooked
             it for my mother.  I noticed a difference, but she 
             didn't since she'd never had it before (phew).

I don't know if the manufacturer rinses it or not.  
I will try to check the box when I go home tonight.  

Judy Frawley
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: Vegan dilemma concerning pancreatic enzymes.
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:55:06 GMT

tjfeue@bb1t.monsanto.com writes:

>In article <altar.714802566@sfu.ca>, altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar) writes:
>> Did you know that Anne Nield on another
>> occasion had to once suffer from the repeated and continuous e-
>> mail assult of the message, "YOU ARE AN ASSHOLE" for 2 hours one
>> day?

>If such a thing did occur and I've heard of it happening to people. 
>She should go after the postmaster of the offending system in such
>an extreme case of personal as well as bandwidth abuse.  That 
>often will be enough keep the offender from a repeat performance.

>One such message is an expression (rightly or wrongly) of free speech.
>And as such can be ignored, more is the irresponsible act of a 
>of a miserable human being and a waste of public and private funds. 

Thank you Ted.  We are here at least in full agreement.  I only
wish you might consider that some lesser insults can be equally
irresponsible, hurtful and a destructive waste of funds and 
people's time.
                                ted



>  TED FEUERBACH   Scientific Systems Consultant  Trilogy Consulting, Inc. 
>  Lake St. Louis, MO        (314) 537-6603       tjfeue@bb1t.monsanto.com
>  Disclaimer:  The opinions expressed herein are MY OWN and obviously not
>  the opinions of Trilogy, Monsanto or either of my two ex-wives.           
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: anne@cs.UAlberta.CA (Anne J.R. Nield)
Subject: Re: Quitting milk, another reason (was: winning argument w/meat eater)
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 19:45:51 GMT

red_trek@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:


>1)  The kind of calcium present in milk is apparently not in the 
>best form for your body to absorb it anyway (I'm not clear on this,
>someone please follow up to this and add more info:  is it something
>to do with the lactose and the fact that 3/4's of the population
>can't absorb lactose?  What the heck does lactose have to do with
>calcium?!!).

Check the book "Fit for Life".  I believe they have something on this.
Basically, cow's milk is designed for baby cows and its composition is
quite different from that of human breast milk.  Calves, needless to
say are somewhat larger than human babies (thank goodness....!) and 
also grow at a totally different rate.

Calcium can be obtained from many sources.  Try the FAQ as I have seen
numerous posts on this.

Lactose intolerance makes milk IMPOSSIBLE to process or absorb.  It MAY
cause diarrhea but another indication is severe headaches, indigestion,
and constipation.  The additional problem here is that any food that
is consumed WITH the milk is also not digested properly.  'Tis not
fun!

Anne

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: Version 2 of who is who on rec.food.veg (still not serious)
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 01:23:33 GMT

dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer) writes:


>>Ted Altar	another extremely valuable contributor to r.f.v.; well
>>		informed and well read. Inside information : His postings
>>                are appreciated by many. Good typing speed too. About to
>>                go into hiding, from reliable sources.

>That would be no surprise.  He posted information on vitamins B12 and D
>and I corrected those parts of it which were misleading, or reflected a
>misunderstanding of data, or which were outright falsehoods.  That's
>roughly the time that someone might disappear for a while.  It's easier
>to do that than say "I was wrong."

You were wrong.  And to adopt your style, you were wrong because I
say so, ipse dixit, no references required.


>Frankly, based on what I've read from him so far, I would never take
>anything he said which had the nature of a scientific assertion at face
>value.

I have never asked that of anyone, hence my efforts to provide my sources.
Apparently, we need not ask the same of you, so you seem to assume.

                                        ted
s
From: skutvik@sleepy.UUCP ( ECMS TEST)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: zucchini chocolate cake recipe
Summary: super zukes (and what do do with 'em
Date: 2 Sep 92 16:23:49 GMT
Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle

In article <SHAFER.92Sep1112340@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov>, shafer@rigel.dfrf.nasa.gov (Mary Shafer) writes:
> then the columnist wrote something like "Now, what can you do with the
> _big_ zucchinis?  

I've always marinated them in whatever sauce is handy/appealing and tossed
them on the grill (cut into spears or 'penny sliced'.)  They have also 
started making appearances in my currys and stir-frys...
From: rfelix@netcom.com (Robbie Felix)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Historical perspective
Date: 2 Sep 92 17:14:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: netcom._wkn-=l.rfelix
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

For those of you who are new to the group...

There have always been a lot of flames on this group and I suspect
there will be as long as it exists. Many people consider vegetarianism
a religion more than a sensible lifestyle and they are always trying
to convince the world that salvation comes through adherence to
*their* unique version of vegetarianism.

It is sad that we have to have so much hostility about our religious
convictions. 

We have traditionally squabbled here about topics such as B12, iron,
factory farming and animal rights. We have discussed splitting the
group into two many times and it always fails to occur. Many of these
issues have become topics for the long-winded pontification of those
who have appointed themselves the high priests of nutrition, morality
and conscience.

I have learned to skip over the posts of those who have more time than
manners. I have learned to find the recipes I want and learn a few
things, but I almost never post here! I don't have time to become
embroiled in flame-bait discussions THAT NEVER ACCOMPLISH ANYTHING!

I post recipes on alt.support.diet almost every day. They are  
low or non-fat recipes and all are vegetarian, many vegan. If you are
interested in sharing recipes like these please join in. I love the
other group and find it really helps with my lifestyle decisions.

I am a vegetarian for non-religious reason, hence I see no purpose in
converting others. I am here to offer support to those who sincerely
seek the help or support of a vegetarian with many years of
experience. I continue to read this group in an efort to help those
who sincerely seek help. Generally I respond in e-mail as I try to
avoid the controversy that seems to erupt over almost nothing!

There are many of us who are here to lend support. You will hear from
us when you sincerely request information or firsthand experience. The
vast majority of readers are kind, thoughtful, concerned and trying to
help. DOn't be discouraged by those who prefer controversy to
thoughtful sharing. They  are a small and vocal minority. Remember the
vast majority of us are here to help, to support, to empower and to
learn more ourselves. DOn't be discouraged and do hang in....

Best wishes to all.

rf
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: anne@cs.UAlberta.CA (Anne J.R. Nield)
Subject: Re: The problem of summer pets
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 23:02:43 GMT

abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT) writes:

>This has nothing to do with vegetarian food, or rather very little.

>In this country where I  live,  many  people take  pets for summer and
>discard/abandon  them at the end of  summer. I  read  this in  a local
>newspaper, on  the very  day I  found an  abandoned cat in  the common
>kitchen, a few days back.

>(I tried to feed the cat whatever I ate for lunch, but it did not take
>much.  It  stayed hungry till  evening  when  it ate  more of the same
>kind.  On the next day, it walked out and hasn't returned.)

>Is this normal in many places or is it just the Finns who do this ?

This happens here too -- and I don't know what YOUR winter weather is
like, but in Alberta it can be pretty cruel.  Also, there are numerous
wild animals that would probably be delighted to have a non-vegetarian
lunch composed of "cat".  I really cannot comprehend that people will
just dump or abandon animals-- but it happens all the time.  

So, no -- the Finns are NOT the only ones who do this.  Just FYI.

Anne

>A. Bulsari                                       Tel.  358 (21) 654 721
>V{rmeteknik, ]bo Akademi                         Fax   358 (21) 654 792
>Va"rmeteknik, A'bo Akademi   (for the non-Scandinavian screen impaired)
>SF 20500 Turku, Finland                          Tlx  57 62301 AABIB SF
From: young@serum.kodak.com
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: Where to get Soy Milk?
Date: 28 Aug 92 12:11:46 GMT
Article-I.D.: pixel.1992Aug28.121146.23786
Reply-To: young@serum.kodak.com
Distribution: usa
Organization: Clinical Products Division, Eastman Kodak Company
Originator: young@sasquatch

In article <1992Aug27.204453.7930@udel.edu> carroll@mercury.cis.udel.edu (Mark C. Carroll) writes:

>In article <1992Aug27.173238.29335@cbnewsm.cb.att.com> mks@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (manishkumar.sharma) writes:
>>My wife is lactose intolerant and hence cannot digest regular milk; even
>>lactose-free (lactaid?) milk does her no good. I heard that soy milk
>>(made from soy bean?) is a good substitute. Where can I get it? Brand name?
>>Health food/specialty stores? I couldn't find it in our local supermarket.
>
>I've never seen it outside of health food stores... I've heard that the
>superfresh chain of grocery stores sells their own brand, but I haven't
>seen it in the local one.

[...]

	In the Fingerlakes region of Western New York, there is a supermarket
	chain called Wegman's which carries soy and other types of milk...
	even chocolate-flavored varieties.  I suspect that not ALL stores
	carry it, because it's in the "gourmet/imported" food section which
	not all stores have, but in my local one, there's quite a large
	display of non-dairy milk products.

	As an alternative, the General Nutrition Center (GNC) stores also
	carry these products, at least in Rochester.  They also carry a
	variety of the "Rice Dream" products.


-Rich Young (These are not Kodak's opinions.)
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: an idea
Date: 29 Aug 92 16:39:24 GMT
Article-I.D.: spdcc.1992Aug29.163924.28674
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA

In article <altar.715077359@sfu.ca> altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar) writes:
>In quoting my words, note how you "ommitted" the argument and evidence
>I give to support my conclusion.  What's the matter, are you not
>able or willing to address the argument and evidence on its own terms?`

No, Ted, I'm figuring that people here have already seen it once.
And your "evidence" doesn't necessarily support your conclusion.
Remmeber, we're not talking science here; this is: "Look what Rich
said about Macdougall and Robbins!  This is mudslinging and calumny
of the worst sort!"  Well, maybe.  I don't think you can present
"evidence" that this is so, because the premise is definitely
arguable.

>Is mere sarcasm and nasal noise the best that you have to offer?

Sometimes.

Ted, it's perfectly legitimate to question the motivations of
popular health writers like Macdougall and Robbins or anyone else.
By that I mean not that such questions are a priori correct, or
that sticking to factual matters isn't preferable, but simply that
you can't call such skepticism calumny and spite; these are public
figures operating in the public arena.  You're reacting as if it
constituted blasphemy.

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
From: mike.mcaulay@spacebbs.com (Mike Mcaulay)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: winning argument w/me
Date: 26 Aug 92 04:13:00 GMT
Reply-To: mike.mcaulay@spacebbs.com (Mike Mcaulay)
Organization: SPACE BBS - Menlo Park, CA - 10 Lines + 4gB - 415-323-4193

red_trek@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu writes:

RE>A general comment:  it'd be nice if someone (perhaps out in
RE>rec.food.veg land) who is strongly knowledgable in all thses
RE>matters (the "hunger argument," "environmental argument",
RE>"cancer", "cholesterol", "natural resources,antibiotics, pesticides,
RE>ethics etc) could pull together something like the "How to
RE>Win an Argument With a Meat Eater" poster under discussion, with
RE>the exception that all potentially bogus or strongly questionable
RE>data would be deleted.  Also, some things, I think, require some
RE>explanation:  e.g. "meat eaters" I know want to know why
RE>it matters so much that a meat-centered diet uses as mucyh
RE>as 100 times the water of a vegetarian diet.  Isn't water a renewable
RE>source (within reason)?   I've stopped using this argument
RE>because I have no idea how to respond to questions like this.

This is a great idea.  If no such person is forthcoming we could take
the more common arguments over to alt.folklore.urban and get a lot of
them settled pretty quickly.  (that's a very cool newsgroup, although
the traffic is too high for me to keep up with it).

If someone will type in the "how to win an argument" poster I'll post it
over there and see what happens.

M.
---
 . SLMR 2.1 . It's OK not to think.
                                                                                                        
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: jerpseth@sd.cadence.com (James Jerpseth)
Subject: Vegetarian Diet and Traditional Diets
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, San Diego Center
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 00:10:56 GMT

In reading the usual debate on this newsgroup about being or not
being a vegetarian, I am struck by how nieve people are about 
traditional diets and their meat content.

After becoming a veg. I went to visit my grandparents who eat
meat daily (almost at every meal). After talking with them,
I found out that before and during WWII, they often only ate 
meat on Sunday Noon-time or for holidays. With no refrigeration,
it was often a chicken that was cackling that very morning or
a chunk of beef from a cow that was walking just weeks before
and was now hanging in the ice-house (waiting to become sausage in the 
smoke house). The rest of the week, they ate a bread, grain, potato, 
(potatoe -- if Republican) vegetables, eggs, cheese, etc. mixture.

After WWII, they could afford to eat meat daily (just like the 
rich people who lived in town and could either go to the butcher or
affored a refrigerator) and picked up the habit.
The rest of my stay, they ate like they had before WWII -- 
little or no meat.

After returning home, I got a few cookbooks with traditional
cuisines from around the world and read the reason behind the 
recipes. Not suprisingly, most of the meat dishes were for holidays
or special family gatherings. The day-to-day food is almost all
avo-lacto veg. compatible. For example, I make the traditional
white beans and rice from Louisianna without the Hog Feet, and its
wonderful.


So look around, ask your parents or grandparents about their old-world
eating habits and dig into the daily recipes of cultures.
Traditional cultures (without all of the modern medicine, vitamin
supplements and variety of food) ate meat for special ocassions
and for holidays. So with all those modern advantages, it is 
perfectly reasonable to not eat meat at all (which I haven't for
almost 4 1/2 years).

Happy Eating -- 

James   aka jerpseth@sd.cadence.com

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: tinamou@snoid.cray.com (Doug Nicholson)
Subject: Re: vive valeque
Organization: Cray Research, Inc.
Date: 4 Sep 92 02:23:03 CDT

In article <1992Sep3.195732.19669@newshub.sdsu.edu> stark@saturn.sdsu.edu (Brian D. Stark) writes:

>If you or Michael want to add input to the cause of vegetarianism,
>your free to express your views, as is anyone else, but don't expect
>my sympathy if you both decide that your feelings have been hurt
>too bad to continue to add to discussions.  Why do I keep getting
>this image of a child threatening to take his ball home if the other
>kids don't play right?

Some people are able to disagree without being inflammatory and some
people are not.  Why can't you just tell Traub and Altar that they
are free to express their views without calling them childish?  It
is just this type of pejorative commentary that they got tired of
putting up with.  Why stick around when you are going to get insulted?
From: crabtree@drivem.enet.dec.com (Alyson Crabtree)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
Subject: Re: an idea
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:18:01 GMT
Reply-To: crabtree@drivem.enet.dec.com (Alyson Crabtree)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation




In article <BtIt46.IHv@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us>, popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us (Valerie Mates) writes:
|> From: popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us (Valerie Mates)
|> Subject: an idea
|> Organization: GREX Public Access Unix +1 313 761 3000
|> Date: Mon, 24 Aug 92 21:45:41 GMT+7:00
|> 
|> Anybody interested in considering splitting rec.food.veg into two
|> groups, one for discussion about vegetarianism and the other for
|> recipes and cooking tips?
|> -- 
|> ----------
|> Valerie Mates
|> popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us
|> 
|> 

Yes!  Yes!

- alyson

Alyson Crabtree (crabtree@cookie.enet.dec.com)
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: young@serum.kodak.com
Subject: Re: Who is who on rfv - Version 3
Originator: young@sasquatch
Reply-To: young@serum.kodak.com
Organization: Clinical Diagnostics Division, Eastman Kodak Company
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 12:01:07 GMT

In article <1992Sep3.060327.19549@abo.fi> abulsari@abo.fi (Abhay Bulsari VT) writes:

[...]

>If you take all this seriously, imagine what  Ted F and Rich and other
>omnivores might  think of me.  It  is written in a humourous tone, and
>should be taken as such.   People will be able to write the one or two
>lines for themselves, as we make the list serious.

[...]

	Since you brought it up, I'll add my opinion: I basically agree
	with Shankar in that it might have been funny once, but the whole
	idea smacks of repression.  At this point it is at best puerile,
	and at worst, dangerously repressive.  There is nothing said in
	this forum that can't be ignored, and frankly, I would feel somewhat
	miffed if someone presumed to make my judgements of worth for me
	"for my own good."

	On the other hand, there is nothing which can be put into this
	silly little list which can actually do me any damage, so if it
	is felt that these useless little games MUST be played, have at it
	and characterize me in whatever terms you like.  To paraphrase
	someone far more perceptive than I: I may not like what you say,
	but I will defend to the death your right to say it.

-Rich Young

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My opinions are not necessarily shared by my employer.

"It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral
busybodies...those who torment us 'for our own good' will torment us without
end, for they do so with the approval of their consciences." - C. S. Lewis
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: rfordyce@kurango.cit.gu.edu.au (Rachel Fordyce)
Subject: Re: an idea
Organization: Griffith University, Brisbane, Australia.
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 02:11:58 GMT

I think splitting the group into two would be an excellent idea, I have only
recently become vegetarian and so I am really interested in the various
recipes and tips that other people post here, but I'm really not all that
interested in the arguments about the term vegetarian, or the health related
stuff.  I know that it would save a lot of my time if the group was split in
two, and I don't see the validity of the argument that spliting the group
would stop various discussions.

Rachel

(rfordyce@cit.gu.edu.au)

Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: agc@cci632.cci.com (Anupama Chathampally - co-op)
Subject: Re: an idea
Organization: [Computer Consoles, Inc., Rochester, NY
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 12:36:57 GMT

>popcorn@grex.ann-arbor.mi.us (Valerie Mates) writes:
>>Anybody interested in considering splitting rec.food.veg into two
>>groups, one for discussion about vegetarianism and the other for
>>recipes and cooking tips?
>>-- 
>
In article <altar.714802798@sfu.ca> altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar) writes:
>I don't think this is a good idea.  Vegetarians or would-be
>vegetarians should be interested in a larger horizon of things 
>besides just recipes.  Do you really want this conference to

I think splitting the group is a great idea.  People are vegetarians for 
a variety of reasons.  Putting the recipes and tips in a different group
would save having to wade through all the other discussions.  What vegetarians
should or should not be interested in is not the point.  If they dont want to
read the stuff they will skip it anyway, this just saves time.
Newsgroups: rec.food.veg
From: altar@beaufort.sfu.ca (Ted Wayn Altar)
Subject: Re: Vegan dilemma concerning pancreatic enzymes.
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 05:40:22 GMT

tjfeue@bb1t.monsanto.com writes:

>BTW, what would Freud think about colon cleansing?       ;-)

Freud did speculate, for instance, about how an anal erotic i
interest in feces is carried over to an interest in money and m
may be evinced in a characterological obstinancy.  Some
other Freudians talked about anal evacuative character 
types taking pleasure in "shitting" on people.  One might
playfully speculate, if we were to adopt such a Freudian "inlook",
that some of this surrilious and derisive name-calling of
vegetarians as we have all witness as occurring on this 
conference from certain omnivores, might well stem from
an symbolic anal evacuation of the constipated.   :-)

                                ted