From: hartigan@ac.dal.ca
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Why I am an atheist/Christian (orig. poster speaks)
Date: 26 Aug 92 13:34:53 -0300
Organization: Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

In article <sbuckley.714784479@sfu.ca>, sbuckley@fraser.sfu.ca (Stephen Buckley) writes:
> hartigan@ac.dal.ca writes:
> 
>>Nice post, Mr. Kendig. You are not alone. I have been willing and able to
>>become a Christian for several years now, but I have never had the slightest
>>indication that it might actually be true. I find your comment that 
>>Christianity is quite solidly worked-out to be true in my experience. 
>>But, as a friend of mine put it: "Nice house they've got there - too bad there
>>isn't any door!" 
> 
>>Before anyone says, "You haven't tried!" Let me add that I have accepted
>>Jesus into my heart many times, in hopes that SOMETHING would change, even
>>a tiny spark of a faith, a micro-iota of a sense that something was even
>>SLIGHTLY different. Not looking for letters of fire in the sky, not looking
>>for a warm feeling. Anything. A sense of hope. Anything. I've abandoned my
>>family, friends and worldly posessesions before - how gladly would I not do
>>it for a being as great as the Christians keep going on about!
> 
>   funny about this.  same thing happened to me.  a couple months after
> deciding to turn to jesus, i climbed a mountain and spent an isolated weekend
> looking for some sign/indication that it was actually happening.  i came
> back without any indication.  when telling a christian friend of mine, she
> just laughed at me.  she asked what i was expecting to see, and i 
> basically responded that i was looking for a two-by-four over the head,
> eureka! experience on the level of a burning bush.  then i began to laugh.
> sometimes we're just looking for confirmation in ways that god isn't
> offering confirmation.  since that mountain experience, i've found the
> truth of it all, mainly in the healing in my soul from a darkened depressed
> place to a healthy, god-filled place.  after stopping trying to get god
             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Could you explain what you mean by this? Try not to use religious language,
if possible. I find that Christians often don't seem to be real people
because they never talk in experiential terms. It's always "God did this,
God did that, God filled my soul..."  These are interpretations. But tell
me what you experienced, and let me try to see if I see the hand of the
Divine in it. Do you understand why this is important?
            
> to prove himself to me, and i could only do this when i became exhausted in
> trying, i just said "o.k., it's true, i'll believe tho i've seen no 
> evidence in my life, show me in YOUR ways."  and then everything changed.
> really, it did.  and i don't think abandoning family, friends
> and possessions will show you jesus.  but you need to have faith based on
> no evidence for the evidence to come into your heart--a contention that
> merits the highest ridicule in this newsgroup, i know, but it's still
> true.
> 

This is indeed a remarkable statement, but paradoxically, it does not 
alienate this atheist.  Christianity seems to me to be a wreck from an
evidential point of view. The only thing that can salvage it is a faith
that "the Lord works in mysterious ways."   A note for Christians - 
come on like human beings! Not like people with a direct hot-line to heaven.com.
I think a rationally-based Christianity is possible only for the 
intellectually-challenged, but posts like Mr. Buckley's indicate that
Christians ARE human beings after all!

This comment gives me some idea of HOW a person can be a Christian - it has
a ring of truth. Of course, it doesn't change things a lot for me, 
but it does make me see that Christianity is as valid an approach to life
as atheism. 

And that's worth something, I guess!

> ---                          
>      Stephen Buckley        /    the meaning of life is the answer
>      sbuckley@sfu.ca       /      to God's question in the Bible:
>    TrueNorthStrong&Free   /        
>       1-800-REALITY      /    "What are you going to do with my Son?"                   

Maybe!! 

Sean Hartigan
hartigan@ac.dal.ca