HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: rubin@watson.ibm.com (Bill Rubin)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: B&B's in Maine and Cape Cod that accept children
Date: 6 Apr 92 22:35:10 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM

We're planning our vacation, and we are thinking of heading up to the
Kennebunkport and Kittery, Maine areas for a few days, and then maybe to
Cape Cod for a few days.  We have 2 children, one is 5 and the other is
just 1. Can someone please recommend nice B&B's in these areas that accept
(or even welcome) children and that aren't too expensive?

Thanks...
-- Bill rubin@watson.ibm.com
From: karen@madhouse.cavebbs.gen.nz ((Karen Hayward))
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Helping 5 YO Learn to Read
Date: 12 Apr 92 16:00:38 GMT
Organization: The Hayward Circus, Wellington, New Zealand.

mbb@keps.kodak.com (Maureen Busch) writes:

> In article <4APR199208354355@vxcrna.cern.ch>, veitch@vxcrna.cern.ch (Liz Veit
> writes:
> > Of course 5 year olds are ready to start reading!
> 
> So far, nobody has flamed me for inquiring, so I guess we are all in agreemen
> 
> > In the UK, all children must be enrolled in school on or before their 5th 
> > birthday - so a British child of this age would have been in school and 
> > learning to read for almost a year.
> 
> Great!  And what are they reading?  And what kind of an approach are they
> using to teach it?  If you would be so kind as to forward more info, I would
> love to include it in my summary.  Several people have asked for a summary,
> since they are in the same boat I am.

The normal age for starting school, here in NZ, is 5 as well. My four all
began their schooling at age 5.
I'll check up on the what they are reading bit....all mine are now at college,
or Junior and Senior high school if they were in the US.
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: grs01132@runt.appstate.edu
Subject: Repost:  Ideas needed on mainstreaming
Organization: Appalachian State University
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 19:53:36 GMT

Sorry for the Repost.  I did not get many responses on the last post.

I am researching methods to promote peer and/or teacher interaction in 
integrated settings.  My research is geared toward mainstreamed preschools but
I would appreciate ideas for all ages.  

Please send E-mail because I don't read this newsgroup often.  Thanks in 
advance.
-- 
Cecilia Adams     			The only things certain in life are	
<GRS01132@stat.appstat.edu>             death, taxes, and the Duke Blue
<GRS01132@appstat.bitnet>               Devils in March.
Appalachian State University            Sweet Repeat in '92
Academic Computing                      Threepeat in '93
Xref: sparky misc.kids:13106 alt.kids-talk:647 alt.parents-teens:690
From: pjl2@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Paul J Landsberg)
Newsgroups: misc.kids,alt.kids-talk,alt.parents-teens
Subject: Re: Minors right of access to contraceptives?
Date: 16 Apr 92 13:58:15 GMT
Reply-To: pjl2@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Paul J Landsberg)
Organization: Columbia University

John M. Joy writes:
>It is the responsibility of the public education system to ensure
>a properly educated populus, essential to the operation of a
>democracy.  Not only that, but "promot[ing] the general welfare"
>may include making available knowledge/means to promote a healthier
>society overall, by taking simple action to limit unwanted pregnancies and
>STDs.

Gad, the above is the exact educrat mantra that so ticks me off.  Rubber
Joe Fernandez, Chancellor of NYC school system hasn't figured out a way
to have textbooks for the classrooms but by god, he sure can make sure
they have rubbers.

The problem is that you are allowing nameless, faceless, politically
appointed hacks to make decisions rightly left in the hands of parents.
Actually, by your above reasoning, if the local board gets an injection
of religious fervor, "obviously" prayer in the classroom would be
"promoting the general welfare."


>During a relatively recent Presidential campaign, it was revealed that
>a certain candidate was opposed to REQUIRING school children to
>recite the pledge of allegiance.  The individial in question was
>subject to EXTREME criticism from some of the very people who
>are fighting so hard to enforce THEIR religious ideals in the classroom:
>despite their flag position denying others, theirs.

Gee, somebody's ox was being gored.  That is the whole point of my 
opposition though.  The schools are having big problems teaching 
the kids, don't burden them with health and moral issues.


Paul Landsberg
From: dal3@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (dale.e.parson)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: "Whole Language" teaching concept
Date: 13 Apr 92 18:07:16 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

In article <elambert.702940171@qualcom> elambert@qualcom.qualcomm.com (Eber Lambert) writes:
>scottb@col.hp.com (Scott Brunton) writes:
>
>>	Has anyone had any experiences or encounters with the teaching
>>concept known as "whole language?"  I'm going to be attending a short
>>course on the subject and would be interested in the opinions of others.
>
>I'd (and probabluy others) would sure be interested in hearing what you find
>out. My ignorant understanding of it is essentially that it replaces 
>phonics with the concept that children learn to sight read words. This is
>stupid. (big uproar at our school over this but I've been hanging around
>the edges picking up 2nd and 3rd hand info). 
>

I think your summary is pretty accurate: sight reading words as chunks.
My wife & I are home schooling & we often discuss strategies with her
sister, who is a first grade teacher of 20 years with an M.S. as a reading
specialist. The schools around here are apparently letting the pendulum
swing from one extreme to another. The "whole language" has the benefits
of using more complex and interesting stories as source material,
which is good, but using the technique exclusively, which is what the
schools here are pushing, result in kids getting lost when trying to
read stories that they haven't rehearsed. My sister-in-law plans to
use both 'whole language' (thereby according with school policy) and
phonics (albeit on the sly). My typically cynical response was that
in practice "whole language" loads the kids up with vocabulary that we
can be sure they'll see on standardized tests, pushing the test scores
up. My wife pointed out that some of the stuff we do with the kids is
"whole language"--we tried the Hobbit out at bedtime with our 5 1/2
yr. daughter (parents reading aloud), she insisted on continuing with the
Lord of the Rings trilogy, it's amazing how much even our 2 1/2 year
son picks up on while listening quietly. Reading this story as a 'whole'
certainly expands their repetoire of vocabulary & sentence structure,
far beyond what they'd get in a basal reader. But we also do phonics
& simple readers to let her gain a port of entry into reading, and
she loves reading stories to her brother. I think the two perspectives
complement each other, but in these parts any way, the schools as usual
fall off the wagon one way or the other.


Dale Parson, Bell Labs, dale@alux2.att.com

 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
|    "These words are too solid, they don't move fast enough           |
|     to catch the blur in the brain that flies by, and is gone..."    |
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------
|     Suzanne Vega                                                     |
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Pregnant for my wedding - need advice!
From: prevmary@otago.ac.nz
Date: 13 Apr 92 09:15:07 +1300
Organization: University of Otago, Dunedin, New Zealand

In article <10APR199216084755@quark2.aero.org>, flaskerud@quark2.aero.org writes:
> In article <RyX1iB1w164w@tz.wimsey.bc.ca>, holly@tz.wimsey.bc.ca (Wendy Woodcock) writes...
>>My fiance and I have been planning our wedding for almost a year now, and it 
>>is scheduled for August 15th.  It is to be a fairly elegant affair, with a 
>>sit-down meal at an old mansion overlooking a lake, etc...  We have 
>>relatives flying in from all over Canada and from California and England.  
>>These people have already booked their tickets.
>> 
>>The problem... I just found out yesterday that I am betwen 12 and 15 weeks 
>>pregnant, meaning I will be about 7 months pregnant at the wedding.  So much 
>>for the $1000 fitted wedding dress.
>> 
>>Abortion is not an answer for us, I am definately pro-choice, and so is he, 
>>but we already have two children (ages 4 yrs, and 10 mths) and were planning 
>>for two more (although, not right now!) so this baby is "wanted", just 
>>inconvenient timing-wise.
>> 
>>The advice I need is in regards to the wedding... should we postpone it for 
>>a year, meaning that guests would have to cancel plane tickets, and we would 
>>lose deposits on many things we have already booked, but by next August I 
>>would be able to wear the dress, drink wine with dinner, and be more 
>>"bridelike", or should we go ahead with the wedding as scheduled?  Would it 
>>be terribly bad form for me to get married at 7 mths. pregnant?
>> 

I was also in a similar position 9 yrs ago. I was engaged to my present
 husband and then got
pregnant. We went ahead with the wedding against quite a lot of family
opposition but we were actually proud of the fact that I was pregnant. I was
5.5 months pregnant on my wedding day. We made sure that everyone who was
invited to the wedding knew that I was pregnant so if anyone felt uncomfortable
they needn't come . It was not a grand affair but thoroughly enjoyable and I
was obviously pregnant.
Mum made me a lovely maternity wedding dress in cream silk with a pintucked
bodice and she made the bridesmaids dresses to match in pale buttery yellow.
My daughter now almost 9yrs loves to get out our wedding photos and show people
that she was there- in my tummy!
In the end it really is only the 2 of you who have to be satisfied and if you
are proud and happy then your guests will be too.
I've always been pleased we chose to go ahead with the whole thing but that of
course is my own opinion.

Mary Jane
 
>
From: scott@Apple.COM (scott douglass)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Starting Kindergarten
Date: 13 Apr 92 04:52:40 GMT
Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA

gazit@antigone.usc.edu (Salit) writes:
>
>However, the trend postponing all kids by a year worries me. At this rate
>my son (birthday mid-July) will end up being the youngest in his class when
>kindergarden time comes...
>
>Salit
>gazit@iris.usc.edu

Yeah, this bugs me too.  My son will be five in late October, and the
cut-off is the first of December.  There is really no doubt that he's
ready for kindergarten, and his nursery school teachers agree.  The
only reason I would consider holding him out is that everyone else
does and he'll end up in a class with kids more than a year older than
he is!  And when the difference is between five and six, that's a big
difference!

I was talking with a mom I met at the park and asked where her son
went to nursery school.  She said Young Fives, which is a local program
for kids who are waiting out a year.  So I figured he had a late fall
birthday.  Wrong -- he had turned five in May!  This kid will be six-and-
a-half when he starts kindergarten -- at the same time my kid starts
at four!  Hopefully not in the same class....

I talked about this with the teachers at the school Alan will go to.  They
said it is a big problem.  But they said they try to aim things at the kids
who kindergarten is meant for -- the five-year-olds.  I figure Alan
can hold his own with five-year-olds (he's the youngest in his nursery
school, and does fine) it's the six-year-olds I'm worried about.

Oh well, just my two gripes' worth.

		--  maggie
-- 
				--scott douglass
Any opinions above may be mine and are not necessarily those of Apple Computer.
domain: scott@apple.com  UUCP: {nsc, sun, voder, well, dual}!apple!scott
CSNet: scott@Apple.CSNet  AppleLink: Douglass1
From: X045KF@tamvm1.tamu.edu (Kimberly Faircloth)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Daycare
Date: 9 Apr 92 20:19:13 GMT
Organization: Texas A&M University

In article <1992Apr7.144913.29893@nynexst.com>
clare@nynexst.com (Clare Chu Ayala) writes:
 
>
>In article <1992Apr6.203608.25965@cbnewsi.cb.att.com> radika@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (kumar.s.narayanan) writes:
>>We need some words of wisdom from the netdom on startegies to ease our
>>13 month old into the world of daycare. April 1 was his first day at the
>>daycare near work (a wonderful palce, in our opinion). Much to our dismay,
>>he did not quite appreciate the change of scenary and has been bawling
>>his heart out during our absence form the daycare center. Our choices are
>>these 1) allow him to ahve alenghty tarnsition. His g`pa is willling to spend
>>time with him at the center (and the center permits this) so that he is not
>>amidst strangers  or 2) steel our hearts and turn oue backs on him every
>>morning. We are in a quandry and any advice would be appreciated. Thanks - Kumar
Give him time.  I worked in a daycare for two summers between semesters
and, I saw many new children coming into the wild environment of 50+ children.
They were very distressed to see Mom and Dad walk out the door without them
(and believe me, it broke my heart everytime).  But after a few weeks (yes,
I know that's a lot of time for him to be upset) and the set routine that
I and the other women set up for our groups, the children were just fine
and still VERY happy to see Mom and Dad.
 
Kimberly Faircloth                |x045kf@tamvm1.tamu.edu
Users Consultant                  |kdf8236@tamvm1.tamu.edu
Texas A&M University              |kdf8236@zeus.tamu.edu
(409) 845-8956
"But Soft!  What rock through yonder window breaks? It is a brick!
           and Juliet is out cold..."
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: tigger@satyr.Sylvan.COM (Grace Sylvan)
Subject: Re: At what age is day care appropriate?
Organization: Sylvan Associates
Date: 9 Apr 92 22:53:24

On the topic of supreme sacrifice....

The other day, I was totally frustrated by the end of the day. Robin
needed to nurse about once an hour, Kathy needed things... I barely
got to eat lunch. The kitchen was a disaster area, as was the
livingroom. Every time one was taken care of, the other needed again.
I didn't get a thing done other than 'kids'. I asked Kayvan to hold
the baby when he came home, and told of my frustrations in not getting
'a thing' done all day. He (who really loves a clean house) told me
that was ok, that if I did nothing but care for the baby and kid, that
I was doing my job just perfectly. Whew.

My choice is not about sacrifice -- but heck, *someone* would have
needed to hold that baby almost all day, why not ME?

It's my bedtime - Robin seems to be having a growing (well nursing)
spurt, and I'd better rest.


-- 
Tigger (Grace Sylvan)                Mom of Katherine Yelena, 2.6 &
tigger@satyr.sylvan.com              Robin Gregory <born 2/28/92>)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It seems to me that our large goal is to find the ways to help our
children become humane and strong."

             - Dr Haim Ginott quoted by Adele Faber & Elaine Mazlish
From: llf@alice.att.com (alice!llf)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Theory (was: Re: Seeking information about Tuboplasty)
Date: 13 Apr 92 22:03:33 GMT
Reply-To: llf@alice.UUCP (alice!llf)
Organization: New Jersey State Home for Bewildered Kittens

In article <5stjmw#.valentin@netcom.com> valentin@netcom.com (Valentin Pepelea) writes:
>In article <22533@alice.att.com> llf@alice.UUCP (alice!llf) writes:
>>he says is "theoretical", and I have frequently wanted to strangle those child
>>development theoreticians.  (What do they know?  Their WIVES raised their
>>kids! :-) )
>
>This is unfortubately a widely held view. In reality parents are amateur
>"theorists", as might also be religious leaders and politicians, while
>researchers such as Eric are the only ones qualified to discuss rearing
>methods.

Ah.  But we weren't talking about general rearing methods, were we.  And to be
perfectly honest, just because theorists have spent time officially studying
the general issues, doesn't mean they are necessarily right.  It just means
they have a higher probability of being right, on average, assuming they've
done their science correctly.  (Asimov got it right when talking about
predicting masses vs individuals, btw.)  Even more, theorists have no more
qualifications to pass moral judgements on others than anyone else does,
and that was the gist of the original protest to which I was responding.

>A parent's view will be based on observations of his children and his own
>childhood; both life experiences are rather irrelevant when it comes to
>projecting the outcome of child rearing to the general population.

We weren't talking about generalized child rearing practices and their
effect on masses of children.  We were talking about individuals with
individual problems.

>among dozens, houndreds and thousands of children in controlled groups. Does
>the typical parent have a thousand children to experiment on?

No.  Probably not.  And to be perfectly honest, I wouldn't WANT to.
You miss my point.  Theorists have a great deal to contribute, but they are
not the only ones whose work counts, and they don't have all the answers.
It's too bad that you imply that parents comments have no validity because
they haven't "studied" the issues.  Most parents I know study their children
very carefully.  Parents are the proof test of whether a theory is
implementable, and a real life study of the results.  Most parents I know
also want to hear implementation details, results, and stories.

Lynda
-- 
					Member HASA, Atheist-Scum Division
"The One Horseman and Three Pedestrians of the Apocalypse" - Terry Pratchet
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: melissa@spanky.jpl.nasa.gov (Melissa Probst)
Subject: Boy (8 yrs.) wearing out shoes
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA.
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 19:44:42 GMT

My son who will be 8 in May has been going through shoes like
crazy lately.  We are having to buy him new ones every month!
It doesn't matter if we spend $15 or $50 for shoes they seem
to wear out just the same.  Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks,

Melissa
From: miki@aftac1.llnl.gov (R. Miki Moore 423-9712)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: At what age is day care appropriate?
Date: 9 Apr 92 16:05:04 GMT
Reply-To: miki@aftac1.llnl.gov (R. Miki Moore 423-9712)
Distribution: na
Organization: Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory


In article <1992Apr9.073354.14970@lmpsbbs.mot.com>, 
leeba@mot.com (Leeba Salzman) writes:

...stuff deleted on individual feelings about 
staying at home versus going to work..

>I tried to list the things I love and hate about 
>working and being at home.  Anyone else out there 
>have lists of their own? 

My individual situation is that both my husband and
I work full-time. We both do this out of choice. One
of us could stay at home. If I did we would have to
sell the house, move to a different area (we now live
in the Bay Area) and rent. If he stayed at home we
would sell our current house and move to a nearly
area where we could buy. The problem is he neither of
us wants to stay at home. The good part is we both 
love our jobs and we have a great daycare situation! 
This all tempers the following list.

Working Mom Summary:
Hate:
1. Loss of flexibility to participate more fully
   in the kids day. Because my son will be starting
   kindergarten in the fall i am especially sensitive to
   this. I really want to spend time with him in his
   class.  
2. dealing with management who are completely unaware of
   my ability to be committed to BOTH my job and family..
   ...family is first though.

Love:
1. Technical challenges
2. Social interaction 
3. Environment the paycheck provides..nice neighbors,
   big back yard, vacations.

Stay Home Mom Summary
Hate:
1. The incredible amount of work. Yes, I know this is
   just me; I was only at home with an infant(s). Boy
   was it alot of work...incredible. I know it eases up.
   Maybe if I were at home now I could have less
   work ; but i have a feeling that my standards of "good
   enough" would change if I were at home.
2. Division of labor. If I stayed at home the division of
   labor situation would worsen. I would be responsible for
   maintenance and he would be zonked out by work. 
    
Love:
1. Gaining flexibility..the opposite situation of what i
   stated above.
2. Hey come on...my kids are fun. This would mean more time
   with them. .. lots of work to do things but fun.

As I mentioned in another posting, this whole issue of
stay at home versus work is just not going to be resolved.
I enjoy what going to work. My kids come first. Yes, I
recognize that some people will see this as a conflict,
but it takes all kinds of people...no one should have
expectations that their beliefs (religious or otherwise)
represent ultimate TRUTH. 
---------------------------------------------

Miki Moore
Lawrence Livermore National Labs
All opinions are those of the author only
miki@aftac1.llnl.gov
From: geoffrion@merrimack.edu
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Portable Carseat?--info needed!
Date: 6 Apr 92 09:53:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: merrimac.1992Apr6.095353.1558
Organization: Merrimack College, No. Andover, MA

Approximately a month (?) ago, someone posted a message about a portable
car seat that consisted of a 5-point restraint attached to a back plate
for the seat belt.  It was being marketed as ideal for air travel.
(Guess who's taking a trip?)  I've been to my local "Toys-R-Us" and they
have a vague idea that the thing exists, but can't find it.  
Can anyone give me any more info on it?  Particularly the manufacturer and
where it may be available in the Boston area.

Thanks so much!

**kath**

			geoffrion@merrimack.edu
From: statar@cbnewse.cb.att.com (sherry.l.tatar)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Day Care Worker Pay Scales - Shameful!
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:28:47 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: AT&T

From article <17974@oasys.dt.navy.mil>, by dsegelho@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Diane Segelhorst):
> Here is an interesting article from a local paper (The Baltimore Sun)
> from today, 10 April 92.  I'm almost hesitant to post it, because of
> the flamewars over daycare vs. stay at home parenting.
> (Article reprinted without permission)
> ------------
> DAY CARE WORKERS GET LOW PAY, FEW BENEFITS

This may be true of daycare centers, but my daycare provider works
out of her home and has 10 part-time children.  She has no children
of her own.  She charges $3/hour for 1 child, and I would guess that
she has an average of 5 children there at a time, sometimes more and
sometimes less.  She works 50 hours/week.  I don't believe that she
is underpaid.  I also like having a caregiver who is taking care of
children with a wide range of ages, rather than one person for a bunch
of 2 year olds.  The kids there range in age from 1.5 to 7.  The older
ones help a lot with the younger kids.
Newsgroups: misc.kids