HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp)
Subject: Re: mpd
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Organization: Unisys Corporation SLC
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 19:39:54 GMT

Gavin Flower (Gavin.Flower@comp.vuw.ac.nz) wrote:

: In article <1992Sep30.213456.24153@unislc.uucp> erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp) writes:
: >Bones (anon-1005@twwells.com) wrote:
: >
: >: I'm also multiple but not due to cult abuse.  Do any of you have
: >
: >Uh, "cult abuse"?  I wasn't aware that this was at all the case - the stats
: >I've seen say that "cult abuse" and such are very rare, except in the minds
: >of those who either have an axe to grind or have something to gain from running
: >around screaming "The Satanists are everywhere!"
: >-- 
: 
: There was *at least* one woman last year on asar, who was working on
: recovering from extensive cult abuse.  She spoke extensively of what
: happened to her and the effects on her.  Regardless of the true
: incidence of actual culture abuse, it *does* happen. 

I never said it didn't - only thaty that it *is* rare.

: Ed, these people need support, not ridicule based on your implication
: that it is so rare, that they are probably making it up!

Gavin, stop jumping in my shit.  I didn't say that, I didn't imply that,
I didn't even think that.  It's all in your mind.

: Also, even if the objective truth is that the real problem is
: something else, they still need to be encouraged to talk out their
: perceptions in a suportive manner.
: 
: At no stage have I read anything on asar which even hinted at a
: suggestion that *all* or most MPD was caused by cult abuse, maybe I
: missed a post which did.  This post indicates to me that the person
: who posted probably knows of at least one person who has, or possible
: talked to someone who has that idea.

I make a simple post asking a simple question.  I don't need shit from you or
anyone else about it, thank you very much.
-- 
Ed Carp, N7EKG     erc@apple.com                801/538-0177
"This is the final task I will ever give you, and it  goes  on  forever.   Act
happy, feel happy, be happy, without a reason in the world. Then you can love,
and do what you will."           -- Dan Millman, "Way Of The Peaceful Warrior"
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: anon-1217@twwells.com (Adam)
Subject: Grief Lessons
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 15:16:50 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com


Well, I guess grieving must be my lesson at this point
in my life. I lost my primary relationship last month, and
am still sorting through that.  And then, last night, my
Men's Survivors group was greeted with a letter stating 
that due to financial problems in the sponsoring organization,
all contract therapists were being let go.  My group is
facilitated by two therapists, both contract, so we will
be getting an entirely new person as facilitator.

I have liked the format of having both a male and female
facilitator, and I have grown very accustomed to my current
ones.  They were just starting to feel safe.

Most of the other groups at this facility will not be losing
both facilitators, and I feel angry about this.  I also feel
just plain angry over the hurt and abandonment.  My kid has
been hurt enough.

The facility charges on a sliding scale, and because I am
a "high-paid, computer professional", I am slid out to the
high end of the scale.  Due to other problems in my life, and
my mistaken assumption that my insurance would cover 1/2 of
the cost, I have been finding it difficult to afford the weekly
cost myself.  I find myself questioning my commitment to this
group.  I think much of this is an expression of covert anger
on my part.

Well, just wanted to complain in a place where I think people
are listening and might understand.  Thanks,

Adam




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Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: anon-1002@twwells.com (scared)
Subject: Sleep vs. Dreams
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 03:12:45 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com

Help. 
Been having some trouble sleeping.....well actually going to sleep. Maybe
going to bed is better said. I have been going through some rough times lately
and find myself feeling very depressed. I won't go to bed until I can't stay
awake any longer or I have to go to work and then I can't go to bed. I know
this isn't any good for my nerves, but it's almost like I'm punishing myself,
like I don't deserve to go to sleep. Stupid, huh? Anyway, I finally went to
sleep today (I'm working a stint on nights so I sleep days) about 4:30 and had
a dream in which I was molested by a friend's mother. I've never even met this
friend's mother! This is a really good friend who knows that I'm in healing.

Anyway, so much for an hour of sleep.
Anyone else having dream problems? Sleep problems? I'm like a little kid who 
just WON'T go to bed once I get to a certain point. After today's dream though,
I really don't want to.



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Organization: Penn State University
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 08:04:29 EDT
From: <SCG107@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Sleep vs. Dreams

In article <Bv9q9D.L2E@twwells.com>, anon-1002@twwells.com (scared) says:
>
>Anyone else having dream problems? Sleep problems?

Yes, and I'm tired of it!!!!!

I don't have much if any trouble falling asleep, and I'll usually sleep
soundly for a few hours, but then I wake up and spend the rest of the night
tossing & turning/wide awake/having nightmares. Not pleasant at all. So I
end up going to sleep later and later (especially after a particularly bad
nightmare) often, hoping that I will be tired enough to really sleep. It
doesn't help, just makes me even more tired the next day. But if I try to take
a nap so I'm rested enough to stay awake in class and maybe even get some
work done, I can't fall asleep at all because I'm so stressed about everything.
So maybe the only reason I'm falling asleep at night is because I'm so tired
bythe time I go to bed?

Anyway, if anyone has any suggestions, they would be appreciated greatly.

Sarah
From: anon-1236@twwells.com (The Peaceful Warrior)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Crisis about the holidays
Date: 5 Oct 92 19:43:12 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com


The holidays are coming up. As they approach,
I'm forced to deal with something that I've been
putting off dealing with. I thought maybe some
of you might know what I'm going through...

My mother wants my husband and I to come visit
her and my stepfather for Christmas this year. I
don't want to, but I told her that we would. Now
I'm really having some trouble with my stupid decision.
I've been in therapy for the past couple of months
and have started remembering a lot of stuff that
happened as I was growing up and don't want to
have to face my mother and stepfather right now.
I'm scared of them and the thought of
spending Christmas with them terrifies me.

If I do go, I know that my mother will just treat
me the same way she has always treated me and I'll
end up in tears and feeling worthless and stupid.
If I don't go, I'm afraid of the letters and phone
calls I'll get telling me about how I've ruined
everyone's Christmas and why can't I think of
anyone other than myself.

My mom and stepfather know I'm in therapy and
think I'm stupid and crazy for it. I'm afraid
that they will tell that to everyone at Christmas
and everyone will hate me for talking about
such private things with someone outside of the
family.

I really don't want to see either of them right
now, but I don't know how to tell them that. I
feel like the way I feel is wrong and that I'm
hurting everyone and that I should just do what
my mother says and just shut up. Whenever I call
their house to tell them I don't want to see them,
I just get all paralyzed and numb and end up
agreeing to do whatever they ask me to do. It's
like I don't really have a choice in things, because
they're my parents and you should always do what
your parents say, (like your parents are always right.)
I know that this is not the way it is, that my parents
are really not justified in doing what they do, (or
what they have done) but
my mind still thinks that I have to do what they say.

I know all this probably sounds really disjointed
and stupid, but of anyone has any suggestions
on this, I could sure use them...

Thanks,
The Peaceful Warrior



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Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: tdelaney@penn.Gwinnett.COM (ted delaney)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Sleep vs. Dreams
Date: 29 Sep 92 03:08:55 GMT

SCG107@psuvm.psu.edu writes:
> In article <Bv9q9D.L2E@twwells.com>, anon-1002@twwells.com (scared) says:
> >Anyone else having dream problems? Sleep problems?
> Yes, and I'm tired of it!!!!!
> I don't have much if any trouble falling asleep, and I'll usually sleep
> soundly for a few hours, but then I wake up and spend the rest of the night
> tossing & turning/wide awake/having nightmares. Not pleasant at all. So I
> end up going to sleep later and later (especially after a particularly bad
> nightmare) often, hoping that I will be tired enough to really sleep. It
> doesn't help, just makes me even more tired the next day. But if I try to tak
> a nap so I'm rested enough to stay awake in class and maybe even get some
> Anyway, if anyone has any suggestions, they would be appreciated greatly.

well, for me, here are a few-
1) teddy bears (and dinosaurs and mooses and chickens and raccoons(!) and heck,
get the whole menagerie up there if it helps) it can help with SAFETY and
compfort
2) an animal (cat or dog) besides the safety factor (esp with a dog) there is
the added bonus of someone who will snuggle, the sounds of rythmic breathing
and warmth...
3) a fan, or music (I used a small desk fan) helps to drown out other noises
(cars, crickets, what have you....) I got hooked over the summer....
4) light- is your room nice and dark? or do you need a light? (heck, nightlights
can be a real great help....)
5) silly books- my personal favorite 'light reading" is the Bloom County books,
the Foxtrot Books, or any good kids books...


and my SECRET weapon (gad, I can't believe I am telling anyone this, but it
really really really helps us...)

is the "alphabet game" (my primary alter who is 8 and I play it almost EVERY
night (other folks help/play too sometime)
anyway, the game is simple-
pick a TOPIC. I found something general and fun helps (animals, things with 4
legs, food, places, names, ONLY silly things, etc...
and start NAMING them (ie for silly things-
A=applesauce, B= bunnyrabbits, C=caterpillars,D= dinasaurs, E= Elephants noses,
or....you get the idea- some nights we start with different letters
(ie L,M,N (cuz we rarely last that long)

variations on this are thinking of the words to TV sitcoms (gilligans island)
counting toes (think of toes at different animals)
the key is KEEP IT LIGHT (silly)...
(my alter has started this rather bizzarre/silly "big toe theater", where my/his
toes act out t.v. comercials....(I know....(odd mood tonight, telling all
our silly secrets.....))

hope this helps....
From: krikket@meltdown.chi.il.us (D. 'krikket' Krick)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: To poohbear
Date: 5 Oct 92 17:29:14 GMT
Organization: The Meltdown - A Team Star BBS

Poohbear,

I have tried to send you email, as your requested, and it bounced bigtime. 
Next post I see by you, I'll respond to that and see if it works...

------

Everyone, I did go and turn myself in at the local Police Station, and they
REFUSED TO ARREST ME!  (The local county courthouse is undergoing some major
problems due to health hazards, and hence the county court system is fucked up
bigtime...)  So I get to wait until the cop computers catch up with reality
before I can turn myself in and post bond...

Will post more later, as I'm about to pass out from exhaustion.

+--------------------------------------------------+-------------------------+
|Krikket              | krikket@meltdown.chi.il.us | USnail: 3 Danada Sq. E. !
|a.k.a Doug Krick     |NOTICE: Your Milage May Vary|   Suite 246             !
|Data # 708/665-9732  | #include<std.disclaimers>  |   Wheaton, Il 60187     !
+--------------------------------------------------+-------------------------+
|                What God wants, God gets, God help us all!                  |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: fsacp@acad3.alaska.edu
Subject: Thoughts and a welcome!
Organization: University of Alaska Fairbanks
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 1992 19:34:31 GMT

Vickie, and everyone else who has the courage to post here!

  Congratulations I was glad to see that you finally posted.

I've been doing ok lately, just kinda working at my own pace.
I never really realized how uncomfortable I am around men I don't know until
lastnight when a close friend and I were sitting in Denny's at 3:30 in the
morning.  This guy at the next table started talking to us and reaching through
the sectional between the 2 tables.  He was drunk off his ass to begin with
which didn't help matters any.  My friend saw that I was uncomfortable and was
doing her best to make the situation more comfortable, because she didn't want
a scene, which I agree especially with the guy being drunk.  He was trying to
stick a frenchfrie in my face an I was turning the other way.  I felt violated
in many ways.  I can't remember the last time I felt that way.  I mean a year
ago this past spring, I didn't seem to have a problem with strange men that
would come to where I was going to school (after I had talked to them on Relay)
and I would happily jump in the sack with them!
Just some thoughts!
Jay
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: mpd
From: Gavin.Flower@comp.vuw.ac.nz (Gavin Flower)
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 01:15:56 GMT
Organization: Dept. of Comp. Sci., Victoria Uni. of Wellington, New Zealand.

In article <1992Oct1.193954.29385@unislc.uucp> erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp) writes:
>Gavin Flower (Gavin.Flower@comp.vuw.ac.nz) wrote:
>
>: In article <1992Sep30.213456.24153@unislc.uucp> erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp) writes:
[...]

I'll reply in depth to this and similar posts later, maybe after my
exam on the 16th.

I'm also seeking (email) comments on this.  

I think this is a crucial issue, and I want to reply in a carefully
considered way, I certainly don't have time now, to do it justice.


Gavin


-- 
Tomorrow's Society                              | flower_g@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
    Depends on                                   ----------------------------
Today's Children  - help us raise them properly! 
*******  These comments have no known correlation with dept. policy!  *******
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: anon-1002@twwells.com (scared)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Sleep vs. Dreams
Date: 28 Sep 92 15:16:11 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com

Well,
  Got to sleep around 1am last night. THink I slept throgh till alsrm went off
at 9am. Had some more nightmares about abuse. Silly stupid parts to some of
it......can't I even escape this stuff by sleeping anymore?

     ******minor spoiler**************some dream stuff**************








In the first part of the dream a friend of mine who used to be married to this 
Iranian student (I think they are divorced now...I coached her during the birth
of her son) was in the car with the guy and they were driving to some place so 
he could rape her. It was something about the fact that he still had rights to 
her body until he left the couuntry or some such rot. She basically felt she 
had no choice and sadly went along w/it.
Then (this is the somewhat silly part) I remember a bunch of us (for some 
reason it was like a big discussion group and my mother was in the group) were 
talking about the latest news...that Marie Osmond had been raped by some guy,
apparently she knew him. I remember the discussion centering on Marie's
wholesome personna and how this awful thing was so opposite that.
Next (seemed like some time had passed) I saw the friend and her ex-husband
again and they once again were in a car, he driving--she in the passenger seat,
and they were again going somewhere where he could rape her.....like it was
matter of fact, no discussion, nothing she could do! It was his claim on her. I
felt so helpless.
Next I'm once again in this "discussion group" sitting around in this living
room and my brother (MY abuser) is sitting next to me talking! I remember
scooting over away from him, scared, and scooting next to someone in a chair (I
was on the floor) and it turns out to be my mother! I told her "It happened
again." referring to my friend and her ex-husband.  She answers, "I know." I
couldn't figure out how she knew since I JUST saw them.....but the thing is,
she was talking about Marie Osmond and that she had gotten raped AGAIN!
Looking at this now it seems so never ending, so cyclical, maybe that's how I
feel about things in my healing now. I don't know. I'm just glad I woke up.
Writing it all down helps somehow. Is it okay to share these dreams with you 
all?



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Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: enigma@netcom.com (Enigma)
Subject: Re: Anyone like me?
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 92 01:13:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)

In article <1a517qINN12n@arwen.hal.com> phanes@hal.COM (Pamela D. Hanes) writes:
>  I guess what I am wondering is if there is still a place for me here?  
>  Are there others like me reading this group? and can we really make a
>  contribution to this link?
>
>  ~Pamela D. Hanes
>  aka WildFlower

I'm not sure exactly why you feel "different".  Of course, this is the
only post of yours that I've read, but you don't seem so different to
me.  If you felt like posting more, I would look forward to reading
whatever you have to say.

Holly
-- 
Holly McGrath   <enigma@netcom.com> 
1803 Mission Street, #339          
Santa Cruz, CA 95060              
(408) 479-4072  (voice mail)
From: stote@tomcat.den.mmc.com (M. Stote)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Hints for SO's: Sleep (Possible Spoiler)
Date: 2 Oct 92 19:25:30 GMT
Organization: Martin Marietta Astronautics Group

I wanted to accentuate JASO's suggestion of another place to sleep.  For a 
fairly long period - 3-6 months, I forget exactly - either Shelly or I would
sleep either on a spare bed or the couch downstairs.  It made a BIG difference
for both of us.  When I was having trouble sleeping, sleeping on a couch
really helped - a different environment from that related to abuse.  Also 
when one of us is squirming around, being in another place makes it a lot
easier for the other to get a good nights rest, and it sure helps if at
least one of us got a good nights sleep :)

--
Mike Stoughton
stote@den.mmc.com
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: blaze@westmark.Stanford.EDU (Suki)
Subject: Re: Adult Male Recovery
Organization: Stanford University
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 22:07:34 GMT

>>In <Buzs0q.4M1.2@cs.cmu.edu> anonymus+502@godiva.nectar.cs.cmu.edu writes:
>>>I am looking for a book or books on the affects of viloent and sexual abuse
>>>of male children. How they cope as adults. Any help would be appreciated.
>>
	Ok folks, here's as much as I could find.  This list comes
courtesy of Glad Day Bookstore.  I asked their permission to post
their number because they do phone orders and ship books.  With
their permission their Boston number is 617-267-3010.  They also have
a number in Canada.  I did not verify whether the Toronto store
ships and takes phone orders or not, but their number is 
416-961-4161.  

	The books on male survivors I found were:

Victims No Longer
Abused Boys-The Neglected Victims of Sexual Abuse   By Mic Hunter
Recover from Childhood Sexual Abus Broken Boys, Mending Men
	by Steven D Grubmen-Black
Anthology of Lesbian and Gay Survivors of Childhood Sexual Abuse
	Living In Fear by Q press* 
Double Duty Help for the Adult Child Who is also Sexually Abused**

* Also covers issues of sexual preference
**Do not know if it is specific to men, women or both

Good Luck

		-Suki

-- 
	>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Suki<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
		    blaze@westmark.stanford.edu  or
		 anonymus+284@godiva.nectar.cs.cmu.edu.
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
From: dyer@spdcc.com (Steve Dyer)
Subject: Re: um, so much for mourning...
Organization: S.P. Dyer Computer Consulting, Cambridge MA
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1992 02:09:32 GMT

In article <1992Oct2.232529.2287@u.washington.edu> cloister@stein.u.washington.edu (Jason Black) writes:
>so what are we *supposed* to say?  this sort of thing leaves me at a loss for
>words.  

Exacty what you've said in the rest of your article.  Eloquence is never an
issue at a time like this.  Hearing nothing (even allowing for the typical
excuse of not knowing what to say) is terribly painful to those who are left
with their grief, and even the smallest expression of sympathy or concern
matters a lot.

I like Sim's idea of a donation to fund, and second it.

-- 
Steve Dyer
dyer@ursa-major.spdcc.com aka {ima,harvard,rayssd,linus,m2c}!spdcc!dyer
From: cloister@stein.u.washington.edu (Jason Black)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: Karla Marie Alwan, wonderful person (was Re: um, so much for mourning)
Date: 2 Oct 92 23:34:44 GMT
Organization: University of Washington

aberson@enh.nist.gov writes:

>In a previous article, scottk@cs.umd.edu (Scott King Walker) wrote:
>>	Karla had many things that she never got to do... but one in
>>particular was very important to her.  She wished to make some major
>>contribution towards the fight against Child Abuse of all kinds.  I
>>am going to continue this fight that I started with her.  You may do
>>with this information whatever you feel is appropriate.

>Perhaps finding a charity to which donations could be made in her name 
>is in order.

i think this is a wonderful idea.  i have been wondering about just such a
thing for the past several days.  scott, are there any organizations to which
she would have liked to contribute?

-- 
+-------------------------------------------------+---------------------------+
|tactical nuclear sdi stealth nsafood signature.  | cloister@u.washington.edu |
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Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery