Organization: Virginia Department of Health
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 06:08:45 EST
From:         "Michael A. Kline" <MKLINE@VDH.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: Clinton's Plans, Already

On Mon, 9 Nov 1992 02:52:46 GMT (G.J. McCaughan) said:
>In article <CHRISTIA%92110718264130@ASUACAD.BITNET>, "Michael A. Kline"
><MKLINE@VDH.BITNET> writes:
>
>>     Clinton reportedly will get rid of the so called "gag rule" that
>> restricts anyone but doctors at federally subsidized clinics from
>> counselling women about abortion.
>
>This will, for instance, allow pro-life workers to offer counselling to
>women who are considering abortions. Or is this allowed already? What
>constitutes "counselling" anyway?
>
The purpose of this was to prevent abortion clinics who have a "special
interest" in abortion (say about $200-400 a crack) to recommend abortion.

From one of the Ankerberg series on this very subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
    John: HOW ARE WOMEN COUNCILED AT ABORTION CLINICS?

    Carol: Let's talk about those kids when they find out that they are
pregnant. They may not want an abortion. They many want information, but
when they call that number, it's paid for by abortion money. What kind of
information do you think they're going to get? Let's remember they sell
abortions, they don't sell keeping the baby, they don't sell giving the
baby up for adoption, they don't sell delivering that baby in any form.
They only sell abortions.
    Nita: It's a lie when they tell you they're doing it to help women,
cause they're not. They're doing it for the money.
    Carol: So this girl calls this number and says "I'm pregnant". Well,
how far along are you, what's the first day of your last normal period?
They've got their wheel there and they figure it out. Now this councilor is
paid to be this girls friend. She is paid to be the authority for this
girl. She is supposed to seduce her into a friendship of sorts to sell her
the abortion.

    Nita: I was trained by a professional marketing director how to sell
abortions over the telephone. This man came into our clinic and he took
everyone of our receptionists, all of the nurses, anyone that would be on
the phone and he took us through an extensive training period where we
learned how to sell abortions over the telephone. So that when the girl
called, we hooked the sale, so she wouldn't go down the street and get an
abortion somewhere else, and so that she wouldn't adopt out her baby, or so
that she wouldn't change her mind. We were doing it to get her money. It
was for the money.

    Debbie: After the basic questions they were told briefly about what was
to happen to them AFTER the procedure. All that they were told about the
procedure itself was that they would experience slight cramping similar to
menstrual cramps and that was it. They were not told about the development
of the baby. They were not told about the pain the baby would be
experiencing, or the physical effects it would have on them themselves, or
the emotional effects. They had no idea who was going to be there to help
them when they fell apart afterwards.
    The women were never given any type of alternatives to abortions. It
was automatically assumed that they knew what they wanted. They were never
told adoption agencies. They were never told about people who are out there
willing to help them, to give them homes to live in, to provide them with
care and even financial support.

    Carol: And then they say "Is it a baby?". No, it's a "product of
conception", it's a "blood clot", it's a "piece of tissue". They don't even
really tell them it's a fetus, because that almost humanizes it too much.
But it's never a baby. They can't admit it themselves when they go in the
back and have little 6 week fetuses, babies, they put down disposals.

    Dr. Levatino - I want the general public to know what the doctors know.
That this is a person. This is a baby. That this is not some kind of blob
of tissues that doesn't make any difference.

    Carol: So they go through this whole gambit of reselling abortion,
encouraging, suppressing, call us if you have a problem. And the girls
leave, and they do have problems.

    Debbie: One of the famous lines that the doctor's wife used to use
after the procedure. She'd come in when the women were crying, she'd pat
them on their shoulder and say "It's okay, honey, everybody makes mistakes.
That's why pencils have erasers." But how can you erase that thought from
your mind? Where is she going to be when that woman is threaten suicide
cause she realizes she killed her child and there's no bringing that baby
back. Where's she going to be then? She's off counting her money and buying
new cars, what ever. She doesn't care.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carol Everet owned about 5 abortion clinics, Dr. Levatino did several tens
of thousand abortions, Nina and Debbie both worked in clinics. Not to
debate if true, but *IF* true, would these people really council in a way
that was in the woman's best interest?

THAT was the purpose of the gag rule.

Maks
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia