HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dougw@grebyn.com (Doug Worthington)
Subject: Re: Whats Mario's excuse this time?
Organization: Grebyn Timesharing
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 00:32:02 GMT

In article <1992Jul23.135802.28671@cbnewsm.cb.att.com> garr@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (guido.a.rijo) writes:
>>        Hey Terry, people and lives are at stake when racing gets above
>>30 miles an hour.  It's people like you, and your approach to racing that
>>gets people hurt.  Michael and his currently inept father, have been in
>>more problems over the years, that are their own fault, then anybody else.
>>If your race cars and you feel comfortable when somebody does something
>>stupid next to you, and you say to yourself, "this is balls to the walls
>>racing no problem" then you might not be around to see to many more
>>races.  If you don't race then I wont take any of your comments.
>>
>>dougw
>
>Clam down Dougw,
>Do you think Rahal's crew would have send him out if
>it was Ted Prapas coming up to speed?. I guess their goal was, if we
>cannot catch him on the track, we'll get him in the pits. Well it
>did not work. I tapped the race, and it is obvious that Rahal was VERY
>WIDE coming out of his pit. If you want a copy of the tape, I'll be
>glad to send it to you.  Whether you like or not Michael is terrific
>driver, maybe the fastest driver in CART today. Just look at the first
>lap of The Toronto race, it cannot get any better than that. 
>
>Guido Rijo

Calm down, why.  I agree that Michael is a great driver.  But time and
time again he uses every means, sometimes too much, to win.  When was
the last time you saw an open wheeel driver become so intent on passing
and/or not being passed that they would bump like the GOB's and use the
walls to help throught the turns like Michael did with Paul Tracey?   
I don't remember commenting on Michaels ability to race a car, just his
fathers, but there are limits that people try to stay within.  What
realy kills me is that Michael is so fast he could win if he were just a
little more smooth and calculating instead of just running people over.
Michael could well be remember for being a, "fast at no cost driver"
when he finished instead of for the awesome talent that he does possess
but does not use.

dougw

From: rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com (Richard Beckett)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 1992 11:47:40 GMT
Subject: Le Mans PS
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Labs, Bristol, UK
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Reply-To: rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com


In article <1992Jul31.114247.1764@hplb.hpl.hp.com>, rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com
(Richard Beckett) writes:
|> 
|> 	This may be a little late to you guys, but I've only just got onto 
|> 	the net, so please excuse me.
|> 
|> 	Who won this years Le Mans 24 Hr ?
|> 
|> 	Honestly, I don't know. It's apalling isn't it.
|> 	Last year I was so fed up with the lack of any coverage whatsoever
|> 	in England that I went, but this year I was unable to go, and 
|> 	unable to afford a satellite dish.


	RIK



Email: rik@hplb.hpl.hp.com

PS  forgot the signature, sorry.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: jsnow@moons.sim.es.com (John Snow)
Subject: Re: John Watson on German GP
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corporation
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 16:17:12 GMT

bspahh@gdr.bath.ac.uk (Andrew Henry) writes:

>In article <122490023@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> bruno@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Bruno Melli) writes:
>>> John Barnard has been one of the most
>>> influential engineers in Formula One
>>> over the past decade.
>>
>>A few questions about John Barnard:

>This is off the top of my head ... 

>Yes. Barnard had designed a F5000 car in the mid seventies (for
>Penske?). He designed the original carbon fibre McLaren MP4, with help
>from a Californian aerospace composites company (Hercules I think)
>Steve Nichol is an American who left Hercules to work with Barnard.
>Barnard stayed at McLaren until about 1988.

Small quibble, but the division of Hercules that built the MP4s is in
Utah, the MP4s were built in Salt Lake City - about a 2 miles from my
house - and one was put on display at the plant for a while after
Prost won his championship in one.

Steve Nichols still lives in Salt Lake City.

--John
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
John F. Snow                         INET:           jsnow@moons.sim.es.com
Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.    
Salt Lake City, Utah                 America Online: JohnSnow  GEnie: J.SNOW2
From: t9014143@phillip.edu.au
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Chicane jumping
Date: 28 Jul 92 17:44:22 GMT
Organization: RMIT (Bundoora Campus)

When Mansell went off after trying to pass Senna was it through a chicane or
just a cornered section of the track. If it was a chicane shouldn't he have
been disqualified as Senna was in Japan '90 after his shunt with Prost.


			CJ
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Re: NASCAR news (7/21)
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 14:17:04 GMT

In article <tlm1.711771478@Ra.MsState.Edu> tlm1@Ra.MsState.Edu (Terry Matula) writes:
>- Bobby Hillin has been selected to replace Davey at Talladega.  Robert
>  Yates said that many drivers were considered including Cale Yarbourgh,
>  Mario Andretti, and several Busch drivers, but Bobby was selected because
>  he is a current WC driver (and won at Talladega in 1986).  Bobby said
>  that his Team Ireland team would take the race off to work in the shop.
>
>- Robert Yates also said that for Watkins Glen, probably a road-course
>  'specialist' would be found instead of Bobby.  No names here.
>

Mario Andretti??

Since this is a bye-weekend for IndyCars, Al Jr. has chosen to drive the
Intrepid GTP at Portland.  While that's good for us here, wouldn't you'd
love to see Al drive relief for Davey at Talladega?

'Course, the Chebby Lawyers would probably not have approved of this.

-c'ball-

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: mchivers@uniwa.uwa.edu.au (Michael Chivers)
Subject: F1 93 rumors after Germany
Organization: University of Western Australia
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 16:55:16 GMT

I have just finished watching the German Grand Prix.  Not a
bad race - one of the best we have had this year.

Anyway, Alan Jones (80 F1 World Champ) said
after the race that BMW have had a 3.5l engine under development
for 3-4 years and he would not be surprised if they went into
the McLaren next year.  Jones was at the BMW factory ? years ago
and said "they would not show me the engine but they definitley
had it there" (I think those were his words).

How 'bout that.

Anthony Doig (using yet another account)
Perth, Western Australia

E-Mail : mah@Dialix.oz.au
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Re: F1: Honda
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 19:20:07 GMT

In article <16833C581.GR743@uacsc2.albany.edu> GR743@uacsc2.albany.edu (Greg Rickes) writes:
>>With the old man gone, the beancounters at Honda are redoing their sums, and
>>the conclusions are perfectly predictable.  If we look at Honda's situation
>>rationally, as opposed to looking at it as emotional racing fans, it's hard
>>to argue that they're wrong.
>>
>>Dave Wilson
> 
>Following on Dave Wilson's theme, it just may be truism that once
>you've won a championship, there's no reason for a car compnay
>to stay in a series, because the odds are you're only going to
>lose, and the other manufacturers can, and will, make a point
>of it when they beat you. That seems to be the philosophy of
>at least one German manufactuer, i.e. Mercedes. Will anyone
>be surprised if Nissan, for example, decides to leave the
>Camel series, having won three championships, but now
>apparently falling behind. Ditto Jaguar, though they can't
>point to a title winner. The amount of money they, Castrol,
>and Bud have put into the effort over the last several years
>must be quite impressive.
> 
> 

Two of my observances on this subject.

1.  From what I've gleaned, Honda International's beancounters are
seeing a high amount of red right now.  Traditionally when this happens,
one of the first things to be slashed in a automotive company is the
R&D budget.  I believe Honda's approach in F1 in the past years is to
"win no matter the costs".  Now, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see
their F1 program be the first to suffer a downsizing, or complete ax.

2.  Now, going on to the IMSA GTP series.  My own opinion is that
they're realizing an upswing of sorts and the series will grow in the
next year.  The most significant thing that happened recently is the
new TV contract for the '93 season.  Basically, ALL '93 GTP/GTL races
will be televized live or tape delayed on either NBC or ESPN.  Now we're
talking!  I have a hunch that IMSA is reading a few pages in NASCAR's
book on how to revitalize a series. 

I don't believe Nissan will go away and Jaguar will be around next year.
Mazda is in it in a big way now and without a doubt Acura (nee Honda)
will enter the GTP ranks.  Toyota is doing well now (what an
understatement!).  Now, if we could get GM to reconsider......

One thing we might look for is for GTP to think about is to adopt the
2-driver rule that the Lights went to this year (mandatory that each
driver spends a minimum 25% seat time during the race).  The biggest
reason for this was the fact that more drivers bring more money (in the
form of sponsorship).

Before I sign off --- I'm predicting Dorsey Schroeder will drive the
#28 car at Watkins Glen.  If so, he could very well win the thing.

-c'ball-

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: KHEIKOLA@finabo.abo.fi (Kai Heikola)
Subject: Re: Late to the track II - Hakkinen
Organization: Turku School of Economics and Business Administration
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1992 17:43:03 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <92199.160045LORAX@wvnvm.wvnet.edu> LORAX@wvnvm.wvnet.edu writes:

> ESPN said Hakkenin missed the pre-race warm up due to incarceration.  David
> Hobbes reported the cops pulled him over for doing something behind the wheel
> besides driving.  Andy Marriott (ten times the pit reporter John B. was) asked
> Hakkenin about the incident after the race but he turned coy and dodged the
> question.  I'm dyin' to know what he was doing in the car that was bad enough
> to be thrown into the slammer for.  Hobbes insinuated Hakkenin wasn't alone at
> the time so a scene from "The World According to Garp" comes to mind.
> 
> david neal                                     lorax@wvnvm.wvnet.edu
> Elk and Kanawha Rivers
> Appalachia

 (BTW: right spelling is Hakkinen)
I have read a bit different story from finnish newspapers. Hakkinen was stuck
in traffic and asked cops to clear him the way to the circuit. He was told that
patrol is in its way to help him. He decided not to spend time waiting for the
patrol and started to drive towards it. At this point Hakkinen was stopped for
driving in wrong side of the road by some policemen who didn't know about the
situation. It took some time before they cleared the mess and therefore
Hakkinen missed the morning warm up.

Kai Heikola
  
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: marti@nugget.inf.ethz.ch (Robert Marti)
Subject: Re: Senna and Me...
Organization: Dept. Informatik, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH), Zurich, CH
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 16:23:06 GMT

In article <5133@transfer.stratus.com>, pr@last.pubs.stratus.com (Paul Ryan) writes:
|> Senna may retire for the rest of the season "rather than risk my life to  
|> finish third", because he doesn't have a competetive car.
   [ comparison with Paul Ryan including his childhood reminiscences deleted ]

Seeing Senna drive at Hockenheim this weekend, it sure looked (to me)
as if he was prepared to risk quite a lot.  Then again, it was for
SECOND place rather than third ;-)

Actually, I thought Senna drove very well, even though some of his
zig-zagging during his fight with Patrese was (IMHO) on the border-
line.  On the other hand, noone can expect him to wave another driver
by when fighting for second.  Also, I wouldn't be surprised if he
braked a little sooner than usual when approaching the new Ostkurve-
chicane with Mansell breathing down his neck.  In any case, the most
amazing thing to me was that Mansell almost blew it again there and
then, much like in Canada.  Will Mansell cool it a little in the next
races, now that arch rival Senna can't become world champion this year?

-- 
Robert Marti                    |  Phone:    +41 1 254 72 60
Informationssysteme             |  FAX:      +41 1 262 39 73
ETH-Zentrum                     |  E-Mail:   marti@inf.ethz.ch
CH-8092 Zurich, Switzerland     |
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: drew@mars (Drew Rogge)
Subject: Re: Boo Boo Senna (German GP minor spoiler)
Organization: Pixar -- Point Richmond, California
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 18:33:59 GMT

In article <1992Jul27.000949.24693@cc.uow.edu.au> ddd@cc.uow.edu.au (David  
Dodds) writes:
> >   It seems that if Senna does not look to have a competitive car next
> >year he is going to seriously consider retiring for a season.  I ask all
> >of Senna's fans: Do you still think he is the best driver in the world
> >or just maybe it is a 3 time WC because of great cars?
> 
> After watching the German GP do you still think Senna is the 3 time
> world champion just because of his car ? (Don't think so)
> 

Anybody else notice Senna point Mansell by after Nigel's tire stop?
Senna was trying real hard to keep Nigel behind him but it looked to
me that Senna finaly decided that there was a big possibility that
Mansell might take them both out if he was blocked for much longer.
Either that or maybe he thought that Mansell was out of the race
anyhow for "cutting the course".

Senna just went up a notch in my book.

Drew Rogge
drew@pixar.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: rbanksjr@nyx.cs.du.edu (Richard E. Banks Jr.)
Subject: Re: ReL Senna and Me...
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 92 18:10:40 GMT

In article <memo.549943@cix.compulink.co.uk> shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk writes:
>cnl@bnr.ca (Christopher Larmour) writes..
>
>>shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk (Leo Smith) writes:
>Nigel has obvious flaws: Senna's are not so obvious, but I think
>getting yourself disliked intensely by your fellow drivers may turn
>out to be a flaw in Senna that will cost him dear...Senna has never
>as far as I can remember had a major bone breaking accident. Maybe
>that is why he feels invunerable.
>
>

Are you implying that Senna's tactics will lead other drivers to
deliberately cause him harm on the race track?
From: dafuller@sequent.com (David Fuller)
Subject: Re: WC Mfg's Points & Talladega Controversy
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems Inc.
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 03:23:29 GMT

In article <tlm1.712288654@Ra.MsState.Edu> tlm1@Ra.MsState.Edu (Terry Matula) writes:
>bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe) writes:
>>Could someone please post the current points standings
>>for the Winston Cup Manufacturer's Championship.  I've not
>>seen them for ages - for some *strange* reason our local
>>news never mentions them
>
>It's a Chevy conspiracy to prevent Ford from getting any publicity
>from leading the standings.  :) :)
>
>About Sunday's Talladega race...(spoilers ahead)
>
>I just saw a local news report showing that Sterling Marlin and his
>crew chief Mike Beam were very angry about Ricky Rudd's drafting of
>Ernie Irvan at the end of the race.  Their contention was that Rudd should
>have moved aside and let Marlin by to challenge for the win (Rudd was
>a lap down to the leaders).  A quick sound bite from Rudd was "<big grin>,
>No comment."  

I think Mike Beam got snookered.
-- 
Dave Fuller		 	All opinions expressed are my own and not
Sequent Computer Systems	those of Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
dafuller@sequent.com
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bulls@cbnewsg.cb.att.com (debra.s.martis)
Subject: Re: Mario and Little Al go Sea-Dooing (was Re: Whats Mario's excuse?)
Organization: AT&T
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 00:03:39 GMT

In article <71174782718822@c00009-118dan.eos.ncsu.edu> jcsmith@eos.ncsu.edu (Jay C. Smith) writes:
>From the July IndyCar Racing "Pit Talk":
>
>"Al Unser Jr. stopped by the Newman/Haas motorcoach in Detroit to see how
>the recovery was going.  'We are still going "Sea-Dooing" after New
>Hampshire, aren't we?' Unser Jr. asked.  'Absolutely,' replied Mario."
>
>What the heck is "Sea-Dooing"?

 A Sea-Doo is a watercraft. Like a waverunner only made by a different
company besides Yamaha (Kawaski, Suzuki??).

                         -Jammer
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: naren@fang.att.com (Naren Chauhan)
Subject: Re: Facts and Rumors before Hockenheim
Organization: AT&T Tax Systems Development, Maitland FL
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 19:52:55 GMT

From article <1992Jul21.084438.4744@neptune.inf.ethz.ch>, by marti@nugget.inf.ethz.ch (Robert Marti):
> Facts:  Unofficial Testing at Hockenheim
> 
>  1. Mansell, Williams		1:39.60
>  2. Patrese, Williams		1:40.13
>  3. Berger, McLaren		1:41.64
>  4. Schuhmacher, Benetton	1:41.76
>  5. de Cesaris, Tyrrell		1:43.22
>  6. Alboreto, Footwork		1:43.42
>  7. Alesi, Ferrari		1:43.44
>  8. Senna, McLaren		1:43.55
>  9. Comas, Ligier		1:43.56
> 10. Martini, Dallara		1:44.13
> ...
> 16. Moreno, Andrea Moda Formula	1:49.27
> 
> 
> Rumors:
> 
> - Ivan Capelli is not allowed to test drive anymore since he will
>   not be driving for Ferrari in 1993
> - John Barnard will work for Ferrari again;  chances that Senna
>   will drive for Ferrari are therefore higher

    Didn't I read somewhere (Autoweek??) that Prost would be willing to go
    back to Ferrari if John Barnard went there?  I would suspect that
    it is more likely that Prost would end up at Ferrari with Barnard
    instead of the Senna/Barnard scenario.  What a turn that would be?

    Team Picks for 1993:

    Williams	Mansell/Prost
    McLaren	Senna/Andretti
    Benetton 	Schumacher/Brundle
    Ferrari	Alesi/Morbidelli
    Lotus	Herbert/Al Jr. 

Naren
> - Mansell stays at Williams, with or without Prost 
> 
> -- 
> Robert Marti                    |  Phone:    +41 1 254 72 60
> Informationssysteme             |  FAX:      +41 1 262 39 73
> ETH-Zentrum                     |  E-Mail:   marti@inf.ethz.ch
> CH-8092 Zurich, Switzerland     |
-- 
-----
Naren Chauhan
naren@fang.att.com
AT&T Orlando, Fl
From: dans@rehab1.UUCP (Dan Schein)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: GOBs at Pocono; D.Allison, DW, the BIG one ...
Date: 21 Jul 92 13:30:36 GMT
Reply-To: dans@rehab1.UUCP (Dan Schein)
Organization: Reading Rehab Hospital, Reading PA

In article <19JUL199215573343@zeus.tamu.edu> pmh2962@zeus.tamu.edu (Pat Hayes) writes:
>Howdy!
>	WARNING; discussion of results follow.....

>	Sure was a scary-looking crash.  Hard to tell what happened
>first; Davey getting outta shape (maybe DW's quick move to the inside
>behind DA took the air/downforce off DA's rearend) or the contact
>between DA & DW.  Looked like 'one o' them racin' things' ...

  I agree it was a racing thing. After watching that part of the race for
 1/2 hour (forward, backward, slow, still, you get the idea) its amazing
 that Davy is not hurt worse. That impact with the guard rail could have
 made him the 2nd Allison to retire at Pocono. Regardless... I dont think
 anyone can say the cause was not contact between the #28 & #17. Why the
 contact happened is a different story. Ol DW (#17) was being tailed by
 BB (#26) for about 1/2 lap before the wreck. BB made every move DW did
 and looked like they had locked bumpers! It appears that when DW finally
 lost BB and went to the inside of #28 either (#1) the air was taken off
 the rear of #28 and it skid into the #17, or (#2) the #28 had brain fade
 and tried to block #17, or (#3) the #28 was trying to make a pass of his
 own and didn't see #17 there. I still don't have an opinion on which of
 these was the cause. And based on other drivers memorys of similar wrecks
 I don't think Davey will be able to reveal any inside.

>	Hope Davey's OK -- ESPN mentioned something about a broken
>right arm and possible fracture of the skull above his eyebrow.  Anyone
>have latest info?  Thanks.

  Check MRN's daily updates and their 'NASCAR Live' show on Tuesdays. You
 couldn't ask for better daily info.

 -Dan
-- 
  Reading Rehabilitation Hospital                 Network Adminstration,
  Dan Schein - Information Systems    __|__       Programming, Parenting,
  RD 1 Box 250                   ______(*)______  Rappelling, and soon...
  Reading, PA 19607                   o/ \o       Sky Diving!
                    Rusty's due in 92       Go #2
   ...{uunet,allegra,rutgers}!cbmvax!rehab1!dans  -OR- dans@rehab1.uucp
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Sponsorship Exposure in Motorsports
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 16:24:16 GMT

The following information came across my desk this week and
I found it fascinating information.  I used to think that it
was wierd to see people at Bonneville Dam counting the fish
that pass thru the ladderways, but I guess the same sort of
thing holds true for television and sponsorship.     

You racers out there hunting for the ever-elusive sponsors should
take note.

"Through the first eight races in 1992, Ford accumulated $6,856,735 of
exposure value from one hour, 52 minutes, 59 seconds (1:52:59) of clear,
in-focus exposure time and 842 mentions.  On the average, these figures
translate into more than 14:00 of on-camera time, 105 verbal references
and $850,000 per event for the automobile maker.

In 1991, through the same number of Winston Cup races, Ford had
collected $2,852,755 of income via 1:01:15 of in-focus time and 281
mentions.  On the average, the car company secured more than 6:30 of
exposure time, 35 verbal references and $350,000 of equivalency earnings
per event.  The percentage increase from 1991 to 1992 amounts to 51.7%
in exposure time, 66.6% in mentions and a 58.4% rise in exposure value."

Then they include a performance chart comparing individual races in 1991
and 1992.  An example would be the Daytona 500.  In '91, Ford received
exposure of 6:11, 23 mentions worth a value of $1,602.670.  In the same
race in '92, Ford received 6:26 of time, 50 mentions for a value of
$2,362,670.

Another tidbit:

"During ABC's rain-interrupted coverage of day-one qualifying for this
year's Indy 500, Stroh's collected $423,000 of exposure value, an
incredible accomplishment considering that Stroh's is no longer involved
with IndyCar racing.  Stroh's hefty intake stemmed from ABC's highlights
of the final 70 laps of the '89 Indy 500 battle between Fittipaldi and
Unser, Jr, with whom Stroh's was formerly associated.  The majority of
Stroh's earnings were complements of identity on Al's helmet in view of
his in-car camera, which appeared in-focus for 3:57 and secured an
impressive $355,500."

Using golf as a comparison, regarding Fred Couples during the final
round of the Nestle Invitational:

"Couples' visor, adorned with the Lynx logo, was clear and in-focus on
tv screens for 5:14, worth $418,665 of value equivalency based on the
broadcast's estimated cost per :30 commercial rate.  Additional Lynx
exposure was derived from Couples' golf bag, his caddy's hat and an
umbrella.  All told, the sponsor amassed $464,000 via 5:48 of exposure
time."

So that's it.  I found this infor fascinating.

-c'ball-

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport