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Approved-By:  Bill McGarry <wtm@SHELDEV.SHEL.ISC-BR.COM>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.l-hcap
Date:         Thu, 19 Nov 1992 02:01:37 EST
Reply-To:     Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
From:         Bill McGarry <wtm@sheldev.shel.isc-br.com>
Subject:      Handicap Digest # 3025

                             THE HANDICAP DIGEST

                                 Issue # 3025

                         Thursday, November 19, 1992

Today's Topics:


                                ******


                                   STUPID
                                Re: BRAVO!!!!
                        Cochlear Implant Controversy
                                   signing
                              Re: CARDS IN BARS
                                Re: Education
                                Re: BRAVO!!!!
                                Thanks jack!
                                    Wow!
                                 Lip-Reading


                                ******


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                              Bill McGarry (Moderator)
                              (203) 337-1518



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Subject: STUPID
From: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org (Laurel Gealt)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:273/201 - US Telematics, Yardley PA


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

This question about giving deaf people braille menus is just part
of a larger problem  -- which is that people are getting stupider.
No matter whom you have to deal with, they don't know what they're
doing.  My mother once said, regarding calling businesses or
professionals on the phone --  They have these people answering the
phone, and they train them to say two things ---"Hello" and "I
don't know."   I have a friend who is into macrobiotics and
ecology, and we were talking today about how stupid people are
getting, and she says it's the chemicals in the food and air.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!273!201!Laurel.Gealt
Internet: Laurel.Gealt@f201.n273.z1.fidonet.org



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Subject: Re: BRAVO!!!!
From: Jay.Croft@f421.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Jay Croft)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:109/421 - Twilight Clone Mac, Rockville MD


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 > because they are deaf.  Maybe the reality is that they just don't
 > accept the fact that they have to make an effort (i.e. learn
 > lipreading) to be part of the MAJORITY.  It's called INTEGRATION.

Just about every academic program for deaf children includes
lipreading instruction.  Some become more proficient at it than
others.

There are also other factors.  Moustaches, smoking, shadows,
rapidity of speech, accents, fatigue, emotions all affect
lipreading.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!109!421!Jay.Croft
Internet: Jay.Croft@f421.n109.z1.fidonet.org



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Subject: Cochlear Implant Controversy
From: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:124/2120 - Fingers Talk, Irving TX


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 JO> 60 minutes will broadcast lead segment on the cochlear implant
 JO> controversy tomorrow, Sunday 11/08/92.  Ed Bradley will interview
 JO> Harlan Lane, Roz Rosen, Caitlin Parton (6 1/2 year old implant
 JO> recipient), Caitlin's parents and doctor, and Diane Brackett of
 JO> NY League for HoH.  7 pm Eastern, 6 pm Central, 7 pm Pacific on
 JO> CBS.  Watch it!

I watched it!  And I'm so glad I did - I thought Caitlin was so
delightful and further proves what I've been saying all along
about cochlear implants.  I liked what her parents had to say -
reminded me a lot of mine during my childhood years.  :-)

I was not very impressed with Harlan Lane and Roz Rosen's
comments.  It would be a real shame to ban cochlear implants
for children.  Did you noticed that Ed Bradley didn't spend
much time on their negative comments?  ;-)

Thanks for letting us know in advance because I certainly would
have missed it.  I've not had much time these past few weeks to
watch TV but I did make an exception Sunday evening.

Glad to have you back - hope all is well with you and Ret.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!124!2120!Ann.Stalnaker
Internet: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org



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Subject: signing
From: Ann.Sab@f605.n322.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Sab)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:322/605 - The Lighthouse, Leicester MA


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

theres a braillesign language book now cakle"a basic course in sign
langugeage." if any of you know a deaf-blind person needing such a
book, its free frrfrom mrs. lois baskerville 1015 oxford ave sparks
nevad89431. i have it and find it useful. its very easy tto foll=.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!322!605!Ann.Sab
Internet: Ann.Sab@f605.n322.z1.fidonet.org



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Subject: Re: CARDS IN BARS
From: Jay.Croft@f421.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Jay Croft)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:109/421 - Twilight Clone Mac, Rockville MD


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 > A man approached me in a bar last week and offered me a card.  The
 > card
 > introduced him as a deaf person and he sold these cards for a living
 > and
 > that he was asking for contributions.  How do you feel about that?

He probably had his Rolls Royce parked around the corner.

Most deaf people are embarrassed by the peddlers.  They will not
approach another deaf person!

Work out the mathematics of how much that peddler earned per hour
for his "labors."  You will be surprised.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!109!421!Jay.Croft
Internet: Jay.Croft@f421.n109.z1.fidonet.org



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Subject: Re: Education
From: Hugues.Blanchet@p0.f136.n167.z1.fidonet.org (Hugues Blanchet)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:167/136.0 - Ab.'s Place, Montreal PQ


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 -=> Quoting Jennifer Satterwhite to Hugues Blanchet <=-

Howdy Jennie,

 JS> I agree.  The whole theory of Bicultural/bilingual is to use the
 JS> minority language (ASL) if that is what they know and communicate
 JS> with, and use that to teach them English and the properties thereof.

Shouldn't we learn a language that would enable us to communicate with
MORE people instead of learning one that enables us to communicate with
LESS???  This is the reason why, if I'd have a choice (supposing I
wasn't bilinguial) between learning english or ASL, I wouldn't even
think about it two seconds.  I would learn english!!!  I would want to
communicate with more people, not less.

 JS> Make sense?

Yep! <GGG>

 HB>Come on Jennie!!!  I know you ain't trying to start anything!!!

 JS> You sure?  Maybe I like to see people get irate...NOT!  I'm just
 JS> testing the waters out there. hehehehe

You're doing great!  Don't worry about me. I'm an Arie and VERY hard
headed but I also love humor.... ;-)))  So you're quite safe with me
;-)))

 HB>Well... as a tol' ya, a jis' don' think we both can hav' a wa'! A
 HB>believ'z ya too much of a nice lady (Now don' be jealous Annie
 HB>an' Karen!!!  <GGGGG>)  A really 'preciate bright wimen ya see?
 JS> Hmmm, I could think that you're teasing me about the southern drawl,
 JS> Hugues.  Naw, you wouldn't do that.  ;-)

Nawwwwwwwww... c'mon Jennie!!! Ya know a wouldn't do such'a thang,
huh!!! ;-)  Still, I think it could be better I guess.

 JS> Catcha later!

Sure thing!

Hugues

 JS> ps--If this makes absolutely no sense, just diregard it.  I have been
 JS> cranking out research papers and abstracts on research papers etc etc.

WHAT shouldn't make any sense!?!?!  Everything is ok by me!  You asked
for an opinion and I gave you mine, so where's the problem???  You ask
me, there isn't any!!

 JS> I'm not too sure how much of my brain is left.  Argh!!  <grin>

Well, if we compare both our heads, your's has the most working parts!
<Huge Grin>

Hmmmmm... I'm STILL thinking of having my ears surgicaly removed from
my head.... ;-)))))

... BEWARE - Tagline Thief in this echo

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!167!136.0!Hugues.Blanchet
Internet: Hugues.Blanchet@p0.f136.n167.z1.fidonet.org



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Subject: Re: BRAVO!!!!
From: Hugues.Blanchet@p0.f136.n167.z1.fidonet.org (Hugues Blanchet)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:167/136.0 - Ab.'s Place, Montreal PQ


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 -=> Quoting Jay Croft to Hugues Blanchet <=-

Well hello Jay!!!

 JC> There are also other factors.  Moustaches, smoking, shadows, rapidity
 JC> of speech, accents, fatigue, emotions all affect lipreading.

Yes indeed!!!! I don't know Jay but somehow, it seems to be easier for
me to read women's lips!!! Why is that??? Is it because they are more
expressive then men? Or that their faces are more attractive? <G>

Regards,

Hugues

... Documentation - The worst part of programming.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!167!136.0!Hugues.Blanchet
Internet: Hugues.Blanchet@p0.f136.n167.z1.fidonet.org



------



Subject: Thanks jack!
From: Margaret.Overath@f14.n279.z1.fidonet.org (Margaret Overath)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:279/14 - Project Enable, Dunbar WV


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

Reading your message makes me feel good!  You are right about the
general population not fully understanding the subuties (sorry can't
spell today, and never well haha) of terms related to deafness.  As a
psychologist, I had a hard time writing the labels on some of the deaf
and hard of hearing kids.  The deaf community is adamant about the term
"Hearing Impaired" but these kids in the public schools view themselves
as HI instead of "Deaf" or whatever other term they feel comfortable
with.  I always though "Hard Of Hearing" is a odd term even though I
called myself that when I was growing up, I never meet other deaf people
until I went to Gally, where I learn more about what is Deaf culture and
all that Jazz.

I wonder how Blind people handle it, I mean those who have usable sight
even though they are legally blind, do they call themselves partially
sighted? What? Why give more terms to the general public to make it more
confusing? Why be just simple, Blind or DEAF?!

Referring back to psychological reports, I been trying to be creative in
writing terms regarding the student's abilities and so on.  I been
saying "this so so is hearing impaired, wears hearing aids to assist in
communicatining...."  I just don't feel comfortable saying that, I
rather say Deaf but some of these kids don't view themselves that, so
recently I decided to just say the child has a hearing loss in whatever
range ...say for example ...has a bilateral sensineural hearing loss in
the severe to profound range. I don't bother put in numbers usually
people have no idea what that really means.

Anyway, My hat of to you Jack O'Keefe! :-)

Margie O!

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!279!14!Margaret.Overath
Internet: Margaret.Overath@f14.n279.z1.fidonet.org



------



Subject: Wow!
From: Margaret.Overath@f14.n279.z1.fidonet.org (Margaret Overath)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:279/14 - Project Enable, Dunbar WV


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

Hughues,

You certianly have right to express your opinion. I congratulate you for
having me think some more on this issue.  Ok let me ask this, what is
"normal"?  By psychological definition is a set of behaviors that is
considered to be acceptable by others.  Ok America and Canada maybe the
other countries too, have their set of typical behaviors that is
acceptable -- take for example being "FAT" - the American TV is
shamelessly showing all those skinny minnies out at the so call true
american dream.  I have two sisters both overweight, and I don't hate
them because of that "physical" characteristic, I love them sure we
have our usual sibiling spats from time to time.

I guess I am trying to say, I like your attitude, I wish their are more
of that out there, society seems to been on excluding the "undesirables"
whatever that may be.

Now my opinion has not changed completely, I still consider myself Deaf
as part of my cultural idenity, its more of a physical charactersitic
attribute.

I am curious my Canadian Neighbor, is it snowing up there? It's a wonder
its cold!  The West Virginia weather is unpredicatable as usual, its
been cold until yesterday it warmed up!  I never know what kind of
clothes to wear, at least you know you have to dress up warmly! ;)

Looking forward to more of your interesting views!

Sincerely Margie O!

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!279!14!Margaret.Overath
Internet: Margaret.Overath@f14.n279.z1.fidonet.org



------



Subject: Lip-Reading
From: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org (Ann Stalnaker)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:124/2120 - Fingers Talk, Irving TX


[This is from the Silent Talk Conference]

 DB>  Of course, I'm able to lip-read in Italian only. Are you able to lip-
 DB> read in English? I ask this because I know that
 DB> English, like German, has many more consonants than Italian, Spanish or
 DB> French, and has a greater variation in vowel sounds
 DB> than any other language. You know, Italian words almost
 DB> always terminate in vowels, and there are 5 or 7 vowels
 DB> in all (7 if you make a distinction between the closed and the open sound
 DB> of E and O, otherwise they're only 5: A E I O U, always
 DB> having the same sound in any word and position).

I've found lipreading Japanese and Chinese to be the most difficult.
Sometimes those who have learned English as their second language
position their tongues a bit differently than the norm when speaking
English are hard to understand but like all things, I've found the
more you are around the person, the more you get the practice and
learn to recognize the way they form certain words.

Speaking a different language is another whole ballgame but it is
not impossible for one who is deaf or HoH to learn, just takes
a little more time.  I don't know why people feel because one is
deaf or HoH, one cannot learn to speak - what a misconception.

--
Uucp: ..!uunet!bunker!hcap!hnews!124!2120!Ann.Stalnaker
Internet: Ann.Stalnaker@f2120.n124.z1.fidonet.org



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                                ******

                  End of Issue # 3025 of the Handicap Digest

                                ******
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU