HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1992 22:18:33 GMT

harp@netcom.com (Gregory O. Harp) writes:
>
>I _know_ what V8086 mode is, and I don't recall asking you.  Please do
>not answer questions nobody asked.  It is quite unlikely that we are
>interested in your answer.
>
>However, now that you've brought it up, you can't use several programs
>that run in V8086 mode together.
>

Then I guess my multitasking of 5 DOS apps, each running in V86 mode (under
OS/2 2.0), is just an illusion?

>
>Try EMM386 or QEMM with Turbo 
>Debugger 386, for example.  Nope...
>

These are OS-level programs that cannot co-exist due to *their* nature,
not that of the CPU.  It's like trying to run two protected OS kernels
on the same single-CPU machine.

>
>So much for the V8086 mode being useful for multitasking.
>

So much for your knowledge of what V86 mode is and how it's used.

>
>It has taken over 10 years for PCs to even standardize such things
>as extended memory access.  The number of people who have the old
>versions of many packages who won't bother to upgrade are going
>to keep the PC in the dark ages, where it belongs IMO.
>

At least there is progress being made.  The previous extended memory
access interface (VCPI) was used for a long time.  It was eventually
deemed unacceptable because it compromises system integrity by allowing
apps to wreak havoc with the hardware.  On the other hand, AmigaDOS does
*nothing* to maintain system integrity; it totally ignores the problem.
I wish I had a nickel for every time I've seen an Amiga user scream,
"I *hate* these games that take over the machine!".

By the way, it has taken the OS-less *DOS* world over 10 years to
standardize on extended memory access, not the PC world.  There are plenty
of people running OS/2, UNIX and other OS's on their PC's.

>Greg
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: iank@microsoft.com (Ian Kennedy)
Subject: Re: Juicy tidbits
Date: 05 Apr 92 22:33:11 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.
Distribution: na
Keywords: Amiga receives mentions

In article <1992Mar27.085558.16806@disk.uucp> specter@disk.uucp (Byron Max Guernsey) writes:
>>Does someone in the Amiga world want to show me an OS with a GUI,
>>multitasking, memory protection, *and* virtual memory that runs
>>in 2MB (OS/2 1.3)?
>
>Lesee, the 3000 is capable of virtual memory because of its MMU. Its multi-
            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Yes, any hardware can do virtual memory if you want to spend the
time coding it. FACT: The A3000 running AmigaDOS 2.04 does NOT
have virtual memory. You statement is misleading.

>So Amigados 2.0 offers everything but memory protection, which is a PROCESSOR
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Really? Where is the Virtual Memory? How do I activate is on my
A3000? Answer: I don't.

>feature, not operating system feature. On the other hand OS/2 is less
          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Memory protection can be a feature of the OS and can be done without
special hardware.

>popular than WINDOWS, and ADOS 2.0 is faster than both, offers everything
>but Memory protection, and runs in 1.5 megs. 

Again, you're full of shit. ADOS 2.04 does not offer Virtual Memory
and a slew of features available in the Windows and OS/2 API such
as device independant graphics and seamless networking support. AmigaDOS
2.04 is a hot operating system but it ain't the holy grail. Get
a clue.

<Crap about scrolling GIFS deleted as most people do more than scroll
GIFS on their machines>

>The point is, if these same applications were supported on amiga, they would
>run just as fast, in just as friendly and OS, with just as many trivial
>extras, but for less $$$. 

True.


-- 
/* It's not a cruise... It's the Love Boat*/
/* Iank@microsoft.com                     */
/* I wan't my 32bit chip set              */

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: University of New Hampshire  -  Durham, NH
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1992 23:00:00 GMT

In article <1992Apr15.154417.11659@seas.gwu.edu>, gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
> ggg@kepler.unh.edu (Gregory G Greene) writes:
> >gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
> >>Curious.  Who wants you to buy an Amiga?  The Amiga, like anything else, is
> >>for people who can afford it.
> >>
> >	Well, if you had read the whole post, I was responding to a person
> > who said that the A3000 was less expensive then a 486 system.  I was simply
> > showing that thats not the case, at least around here ( in NH ).
> 
> Of course I read the whole post.  Of course a 486 system is cheaper than an
> equivalent A3000.  If you cannot afford an A3000, then don't buy one.  If you
> do not like the Amiga, then ignore it.  Simple.
> 
> -- Gerald


	Why is the A3000 so expensive though?  I wanted to upgrade to it from
  my A500 but the 486 was just to good of a deal.  Commodore has the low end
  priced very well, why isn't the high end a better deal?  


					G.Greene
From: Paula_Lieberman@amicol.UUCP (Paula Lieberman)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: CDTV
Date: 8 Apr 92 00:25:30 GMT
Organization: Amiga Colony BBS

The A600 slot apparently IS for industry-wide standard compatibility -- I
noticed some articles about that exact-named acronym in EE Times last fall,
including, as I posted, that there were a couple of Japanese camera
companies using that type of card in their digital cameras, which card
would then be pulled out and stuck in a computer for display and
manipulation and tranfer to printers for hardcopy......

I would hardly say that going that way will hurt Amigas -- it's in my
opinoin a quite forward-looking thing for Commodore to be doing!


-- Via DLG Pro v0.991
From: boberg@lysator.liu.se (Stefan Boberg)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Gail-chip and its uses
Keywords: chip, piracy, AFD, Gail
Date: 8 Apr 92 11:32:28 GMT
Organization: Lysator Computer Club, Linkoping University, Sweden

grubba@lysator.liu.se (Henrik Grubbstr|m) writes:

>One use of the Gail-chip I have not heared someone on the net mention yet, is
>that it incorperates the AFD-technique.

> <... description deleted ...>

>You could try to copy the disks before the code is transfered, but Gail will
>sense it and erase the disks.
>CBM have been installing the Gail-chip in all amigas since the first of April.
                                                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>All of the above information from issue #7/1992 of `DatorMagazin' (the largest
>swedish computer newspaper).

  Man, this is most definitely an April fools joke!!! And besides, that mag
is usually full of bogus information anyway. It's better considered a comic
than computer mag (The Q&A section is hilarious - but that's unintentional).

  Maybe they fooled a couple of newbies to stop pirating stuff, anyway :)
And that's considered a Good Thing from my point of view.. definitely.

>Henrik Grubbstrom					grubba@lysator.liu.se
>Lysator Computer Club,
>Linkoping University, Sweden
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 _        _       | Applied Physics & Electrical Engineering @ LiU | Author
(_`      ]_)      | Fido: "Stefan Boberg" @ 2:204/404              |   of
,_)tefan ]_)oberg | EMail: boberg@lysator.liu.se  or  lha@augs.se  |  LhA.
From: damiel@netcom.com (Paul Theodoropoulos)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Apple "Loses" Look-and-Feel Lawsuit
Date: 16 Apr 92 15:05:35 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling) writes:
>The best hope is that Apple's lawyers have been discredited enough that
>Apple won't continue to throw money at these lengthy court cases.  Then
>again, maybe they'll just pick someone smaller to go after next time.

they've gone after many small businesses in "protecting" their hallowed
MacIntosh *name*... it's rather surprised me that they've never even 
mentioned C= and the Amiga, considering C= has used Trashcan Icons,
window sizers, etc etc that are fundamentally similar (there's that
"look and feel" idea!) to the Mac. 



-- 
paul theodoropoulos                                         damiel@netcom.COM
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington)
Subject: Re: A2065/AS225 works with Slingshot!
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 05:36:20 GMT

mx8@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
>    The A2065/AS225 Ethernet system from Commodore works just fine on an A500
>with Slingshot, a low-cost A2000 adapter ($40).  It also works when Slingshot
>is plugged into the bus pass-through of a Supra 500XP.  The power of networking
>(Amiga networking) is now available to all Amigas.  A base 500 with the
>A2065/AS225 may be the cheapest way to network in the entire computer market.

This Slingshot sounds great.  What other A2000 cards will work with it
(accelerators, video board, etc.)?

-- Gerald
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel)
Subject: Re: 040 and 486 and nap42487 knows nothing about CPUs.
Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1992 15:20:41 GMT

rjc@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Ray) writes:
>
>  Let's just face the fact (my personal opinion) that the Intel
>instruction set sucks, its kludgy, modal, limited in registers, not
>orthogonal. Its a real bitch to program in assembly compared to Motorola.
>

I disagree.  Why don't you stop throwing around the word "kludge", since
you obviously don't know what it means.  Geez, according to Amigoids,
everything non-Motorola and non-Amiga is a "kludge".  As far as the
instruction set goes, I maintain that it's different, not worse.  Ortho-
gonality isn't everything.
--
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
| Jerry J. Shekhel  | Molecular Simulations | Time just fades the pages      |
| Drummers do it... | Inc.  Waltham, MA USA | in my book of memories.        |
|    ... In rhythm! |     (617) 890-2888    |              -- Guns N' Roses  |
+-------------------+-----------------------+--------------------------------+
|           ...! [ princeton mit-eddie bu sunne ] !polygen!jerry             |
|                            jerry@polygen.com                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Jerry "knows" 486's faster than 68040.
Date: 7 Apr 92 14:58:43 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki

In article <1992Apr6.174756.17361@ctr.columbia.edu>, jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
> har@ux.acs.umn.edu (--SeebS--) writes:
>>
>>Untrue. An '040 is three to five times faster in floating point. The
>>25 Mhz 040 is only slightly faster than a 33 Mhz 486 in *integer*.
>>
> Wrong, Peter.  Read the benchmarks that appeared here a while ago.  The
> 25MHz 486 is slightly *faster* than the 25MHz 68040 in integer performance,
> but significantly slower in FP, although not 3-5 times.  Please look it
> up; maybe it'll make you stop posting bullsh*t with such arrogant conviction.

Wrong Jerry.
Do not belive in benchmarks so blindly. Benchmarks are too dependent on other
things (compilers, external caches etc.).

Why don't we look at some other things:

68040 instrucions are in average perhaps 30-50% faster than equivalent 486
instrcutions while instruction set on both is comparable.

68040 has 8 general purpouse registers and 7 general purpouse data registers
(all 32 bit). Didn't 486 have 2 *general purpouse* registers and several
others? That means more register shuffle on 486.

68040 has copyback mode on it's data cache.

68040 can perform both floating point and integer instrcutions at the same
time. Can 486 do the same (I don't know)?

68040 has separate data & instruction cache, both are 4k. 80486 only one
unified cache of 8k.

FMUL on 486 takes 16 clocks, on 68040 it takes 5 clocks. FADD takes 10 on 486,
3 on 68040, DIV takes 73 on 486, 37 on 68040. To me it seems that floating
points seem to go 3 times faster. Also to much hated MFLOPS: Intel claims it's
486@25 to have 1 MFLOPS while Morotola claims 3.5 MFLOPS @ 25 MHz. And floating
point instructions are quite similar on both floating point units.

--
Jarkko Lindblad
lindblad@cc.helsinki.fi
From: navas@cory.Berkeley.EDU (David C. Navas)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: What will C= sell you for $999 in '92?
Date: 8 Apr 1992 04:18:07 GMT
Organization: University of California, at Berkeley
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: cory.berkeley.edu

He's back -- with wisdom, wit and wisecracks; full of vim, vigor, vitality
and verve.  [And bored, completely bored ;)]

In article <1992Apr7.234322.4106@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> hauer@roby.ecn.purdue.edu (Corey Hauer) writes:
>C= needs a flicker-free....

C= needs a clue.

>There are some _serious_ holes in Commodore's line.

There are some serious holes in Commodore's head.

>And I don't see any signs of this changing soon.

Commodore doesn't see any signs of this changing soon either.

Last I checked, they were with Oral Roberts in the middle of the Yucan
mountains waiting for signs, too.  You can always count on them being on
top of things.

Why, just yesterday they announced their support for George McGovern for
President....

They have also announced that they see no reason to go scooting off into
exotic electronics like transistors, as vacuum tubes more closely approximate
their own, quite superior, human brains anyway.

>Maybe C= should sell the A600 to Nintento or Sega and be done with it.

Maybe C= (management) should do its developers a favor and let us know just
what the devil they think they're doing plunging our hard work back into
the dark ages of computer console programming.

Maybe C= (management) should do its own -employees- a favor and do the same.

>While I think the A600 (if it ever hits the US shore) is a great idea, I think
>C= needs to have a higher powered machine to hit the $999 price point.

The A600 was a good idea -last- year.  It would have been a useful product
-this- year if only it had a processor that could compete with what's on
the market.  [Argument subject to change when pricing becomes available.]

C= needs to have a 68030 available for under $1000, a 68040 for under
$2500, and a -real- machine for the programming fringe.  You know, the
guys that make the software that's supposed to run on all of these new
machines....


And before I get any flames -- remember, maybe I won't read this newsgroup
for the next month -- better for my health.... :)

David Navas                                   navas@cory.berkeley.edu
"TWA: if you're not terrorists BEFORE you board...."
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: aissmith@kraken.itc.gu.edu.au (Doug Smith)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: ITC, Griffith University, Brisbane, Australia
Date:  9 Apr 92 10:37:32 GMT

kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling) writes:

>Most Amiga owners here are mature, intelligent people... and can give
>decent arguments without bashing someone.  Try it, you might like it.

I used to do that often - quite often - too often in fact.  To be brutally
honest, there is a stark difference between Amiga and IBM owners.  Amiga
owners tend to look into things and don't follow blindly (thats probably
why they own Amigas over IBMs) whilst IBM owners tend to be geeky people
who just follow the croud.  I have *NEVER* seen an IBM owner offer
truthful facts in an argument against Amigas.  Its either lies (stretched
truths mostly) or plain insults.  They just don't listen to anything
rational/sensible you have to say.  There are many people I know who have
also derived this same conclusion independantly.  They'll back me up.
Anyway, I'm so used to their behaviour that when I see something *SO*
rediculious and off-the-mark as that, I lash out - and it usually works. ;-)

>It's all up to you as to how you wish to be viewed.

As I said - I gave up on rational debate long ago - I now handle the abuse 
department.  It almost works.

See ya,
Doug.
>kevin <kdarling@catt.ncsu.edu>
From: mkoch@amisys.UUCP (Mike Koch)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re:  AppleEvents, how to they work?
Date: 6 Apr 92 07:11:38 GMT
Organization: AMiSYS Consulting

In article <kdarling.702469592@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu> kdarling@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (Kevin Darling) writes:
>
>I have an ARexx (or any Rexx, I guess) question:  what if you're running
>two incarnations of an application?  How do you specify which one's port
>you're wanting to talk to?   Or does one simply avoid this situation?

Depends on the application.  Both Baud Bandit and WShell (for examples) give
each invocation's ARexx port a different name.  Baud Bandit starts with
'BAUD', then 'BAUD2', 'BAUD3', etc.  WShell gives each shell a port name of
'|WSHx', where 'x' is the shell's number.

As for other apps, you'd have to check the docs.

>thx - kevin <kdarling@catt.ncsu.edu>

--
    ... Mike

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Koch            mkoch@amisys.uucp            BerksAmiga BBS:215/921-1016
{uunet,allegra,rutgers}!cbmvax!rehab1!amisys!mkoch            CI$: 70017,2677
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: mmcalees@cs16.UVic.CA (Michael McAleese)
Subject: Re: Archimedes?
Organization: The Forgotten Legions of... umm... uhh...
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 21:17:45 GMT

In article <torrie.702874384@Xenon.Stanford.EDU> torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie) writes:
>  The Archimedes is certainly sold through ordinary dealers in NZ
>and Australia.  I believe you can even get it in Canada if you 
>look hard enough... It's just here in the U.S. that it's never been
>seen.

  I dunno about Canada.  At least on the west coast, I've seen nothing about
it anywhere outside of Usenet.  I'd *like* it to be available.  It sounds 
quite impressive.
-- 
*     mmcalees@csr.UVic.CA (Michael McAleese) : I speak only for me...       *
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington)
Subject: Re: Intel HW
Organization: George Washington University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 20:15:16 GMT

jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
>>jerry@connection.prospect.com (Jerry Shekhel) writes:
>>>Well, if the Intel-based machine cannot even hope to compete, then why does
>>>*my* 386 clone consistently perform better than a comparably equipped A3000?
>>
>>How are they suitably equipped (i.e., what hardware does each system have)?
>>Curious.
>>
>As far as I can tell, each has a fast 32-bit CPU, graphics, a hard disk, a
>diskette drive, a keyboard, and a mouse :)

As far as you can tell?  I was hoping for a bit of technical specifications,
like amount of RAM, type of graphics, etc.  I apologize if I ask too much of
you.

-- Gerald
From: Mike_Whalen@agwbbs.new-orleans.LA.US (Mike Whalen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Beer (was Re: New Amigas Announced!!!!)
Date: 12 Apr 92 15:07:45 GMT
Article-I.D.: agwbbs.Mike_Whalen.0bu6
Organization: The Amiga GateWay BBS * New Orleans, La.

In a message dated Sun 12 Apr 92 01:29, Dtiberio@csws7.ic.sunysb.edu (david
wrote:

 D>  Could we please stop these beer conversations? Many of us are 
 D> already tired of hearing all this beer crap. Anyway, when everyone
 D> here
 D> decides that it is csa.advocate.drinking, and when I turn 21
 D> (Thursday),
 D> then you can talk about beer, okay?

  No.. we will continue talking about it. Why? Because it's a silly
subject. Just like this newsgroup in a way. Let's all fight about which
beer gives the best head.. (you can read that ANYWAY YOU WANT!)

 D>  By the way, my favorite Beer is the great and infamous
 D> Grizzly Beer know to terrorize early explorers of the northern
 D> territories. Many men have been know to confront one of these
 D> fieresome, yet graceful, beasts, weighing in at over a ton and
 D> standing over twelve feet tall... and my old Physics teacher
 D> Mr Jensen said that he wanted to wrestle a beer at the New York
 D> State Fair but they wouldn't let him because he was to big. He said
 D> the trick to winning is to take them by surprise; sing to them,
 D> rub the beer's belly, and give them cookies. Then when they aren't
 D> looking,
 D> hit them over the head with a chair from the audience (in the true
 D> spirit of Beer Wrestling, while the referee isn't looking).

  Hmmmm...


-- Via DLG Pro v0.991

Yet another fine quality message from.. Mike Whalen Brand Message Prod.
If you like it.. you like it.. if not... FNORD!
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InterNet:                  Mike_Whalen@agwbbs.new-orleans.la.us
UUCP:                             rex!agwbbs!Mike_Whalen
                                 
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: davidme@qdpii.comp.qdpi.oz.au (David Meiklejohn)
Subject: Re: Archimedes?
Organization: Qld Dept Primary Industries
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 10:07:23 GMT

In article <torrie.702874384@Xenon.Stanford.EDU> torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie) writes:
>
>  The Archimedes is certainly sold through ordinary dealers in NZ
>and Australia.  I believe you can even get it in Canada if you 
>look hard enough... It's just here in the U.S. that it's never been
>seen.

I've never come across an Archimedes dealer here in Australia.  I have seen
Arcs at computer shows for the last few years, so obviously there _is_ some
dealer selling them, but they're pretty invisible otherwise.  I wouldn't have
a clue where to go if I wanted to buy one.  At least I know of a couple of
music stores that sell STs, but for the Archimedes?


-- 

David Meiklejohn                  | Internet : davidme@qdpii.comp.qpdi.oz.au
Computer Systems Officer, QDPI    | Fax      : +61 70 92 3593
Mareeba, Australia                | Voice    : +61 70 92 1555
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: cython@ais.org (Tim Devlin)
Subject: Re: Considering switching to IBM
Organization: UMCC
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 92 21:48:52 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.200807.6645@seas.gwu.edu> gerald@seas.gwu.edu (Gerald G. Washington) writes:
>cython@ais.org (Tim Devlin) writes:
>>you guys are kidding right?  You really don't know why an A3000 cost more
>>then 3rd party 486 cloans??  sigh.....
>
>Of course we were being less than serious; at least, I was.  Perhaps I am
>still bitter about Commodore releasing that @#$* Amiga clone--the A600.  Is
>it necessary to include smileys with every post?
>
>-- Gerald

Actualy, my message was more directed at the other poster more then you, but
you DID state that you did not know, so I used "You guys" rather then just
respond to him alone.  Preahaps a few more smileys would not hurt, when you
make statments that look to MOST sane people like an honest question, or are
all your post just flames at CBM now? ;)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy