From: swann@acsu.buffalo.edu (Stephen Swann)
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc
Subject: Re: Improvisation!
Date: 23 Aug 92 21:10:39 GMT
Organization: UB

In article <RANNOU.92Aug22100806@zuse.info.polymtl.ca> Rannou@info.polymtl.ca (Patrick Rannou) writes:
>
>   The way my group plays it, there -is- no mystery to be solved, just
>   a world full of events that you can partake in, struggle against, 
>   observe, or ignore, whatever strikes your fancy.
>
>OK, this can be fun. But the impression *I* get is that there is no mystery
>because WHATEVER your PC do, the mystery will ALWAYS get solved!

I don't understand what you're saying there.  Do you mean that it
seems that no matter what my player do, they'll always succeed at
whatever it is that they're trying to accomplish?  That's not true at
all.  I would say that my players have failed catastrophically about 4
or 5 times in the history of my campaign, and failed in lesser ways
any number of times.  I would say that most of what they do is
probably about an 80/20 mix of success/failure with regard to what
-they- consider to be their goals.

>When you set a campaign world in just a "fullness of events", then you
>take away everything related to long term goals/objective, because the
>world becomes just a disconnected chain of events. 

Oh, this is simply wrong.  My campaign is more like a giant spider web
of interconnected people, places and events.  Do something here, and
it's liable to set up vibrations felt across the continent.  Just
because most of it was made up on the spot doesn't mean that it ceases
to exist after the players leave.  It's now a fixed part of the
reality of my campaign.  The people and places continue to exist, and
the events become part of the overall history of my campaign.

>Not at all what I'd call a world that runs like clockwork and that could
>exist and function without the PCs acting in it. For that to be possible,
>it would need the tree to make a sound even if there is no PC to hear it.

It does.  The PC's just don't find out about it (unless they happen to
be there, of course).  There are lots of events transpiring in my
campaign that take place only within my mind, as I think about what
is going on in other parts of the world while the PC's are doing their
own thing.  If the PC's somehow come into contact with those eventsm,
they may get involved in them.  Or they may not - sometimes it's their
choice, sometimes they get drawn in whether they mean to or not.

>Well, anyway, the point os moot, since it greatly depends on the style of
>campaign you got. Paranoia, where the GM must be in full control,
>practically requires full improvisation gaming. Free-floating campaigns,
>where the PCs go "exploring" just about anywhere, require improvisationnal
>gaming also, since at any given moment the GM don't know where the party is
>headed anyway. But the style of playing I play, epic gaming, where the
>party's quest is divided into roughly defined "chapters", requires
>preparationnal gaming. An epic quest, like all quests, must have a
>beginning, and an end. 

See, you're doing a traffic cop style of GMing, telling the players
"Ok, your next job is to do this...".  My players would laugh at me
(actually, they'd probably ask me what drug I was under the influence
of) if I started telling them what they were supposed to do next.  My
NPC's might ask for their help with something, but in my role as DM, I
would never presume to tell them what their next adventure is going to
be.  I may tell them (through discovered info or through an NPC) that
a new adventure is available, but whether they pursue it is up to
them.

>To use full improvisationnal gaming in such a quest
>is removing the very purpose of it, IMHO, because *whatever* the PCs do, if
>they do it right they will succeed at the quest, which can be anything. I'm
>trying to make people see that doing thje right or wrong thing is limiting
>oneself. There are far more possiblilitiesw than that. 

You know, at times, I can't tell whether you're agreeing with me or
arguing with me.  :-)  I don't run an epic campaign, I run an ongoing
storytelling campaign, and the players "goals" are whatever they set
for themselves, if any.  Their actual goal is to do roleplaying and
to have fun, which they do.  So I guess you're right, they do always
succeed.  :-)

-- 
Steve Swann                 |    Speak to me in many voices; make
swann@acsu.buffalo.edu      |      them all sound like one...  -BOC
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc