From: pngai@adobe.com (Phil Ngai)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan,talk.politics.guns
Subject: Re: Japanese exchange student killed in Louisiana...
Date: 10 Nov 92 00:58:59 GMT
Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated

In article <BxGyrs.BI7@ncifcrf.gov> masuda@fcs280b.ncifcrf.gov (Michiaki Masuda) writes:
>>If you want to persuade people through voluntary education, that is
>>great.
>
>   Good to know that you finally agreed that the education is meaningful.

What I agree is that *voluntary* education can be helpful. Anyone buying
a gun knows how deadly it can be, anyone with a hint of responsibility
will on their own seek training, assuming it is possible to get it
without undue restrictions. (an example of an undue restriction is
having to place your gun into the custody of a government storage
facility forever and only being allowed to use it there)

Mandatory education is too easy to turn into a gun ban and wouldn't
affect criminal misuse anyway.

>>  You and the NRA are on the same side, except the NRA actually
>>offers training.
>
>   Then, the problem seems to reside on the side of gun owners who do not
>take these opportunities. How would you solve it? 

The problem is with CRIMINALs who misuse guns. How would you solve
the problem of rapists? Train them how to use their penis?

>> I don't believe in big government so I'm opposed to both. 
>>But I think that people with a clean record should be able to carry
>>weapons with them when they go out.
>
>   If you are talking about a record in the government's hand and you distrust
>the government, wouldn't you think of a possibility that they might be able to
>manipulate what they have? It might be possible for them to frame
>innocent citizens and make criminals out of them. It might be also

Certainly there are some abuses the government can commit. I think this
can be made to be harder to abuse. What is there now to stop the
government from framing innocent citizens and putting them in jail?

>possible to delete some climinal records. If the government is not

Am I supposed to worry about the government deleting criminal records?

>   If the training is required by the government and the government is out 
>of control, they might be able to require the schools to teach the students
>that the violent resistance against the authority is an unforgivable
>crime under any circumstances. Didn't you mention that the government is

They could do that now.

>capable of misusing the training system?  

The kind of abuses most likely are requiring courses and not giving
them. The scheme I proposed avoids this by making a diploma defacto
evidence of competency.

>>>     What made your attitude? Your genetic materials?
>
>>It sounds like you don't know the US very well if you think attitudes
>>are easily changed by education.
>
>     Then, why don't you enlighten me by answering my question above?

I think the bottom line is criminals commit crimes. If we could solve
that problem, we wouldn't have to worry about gun crimes. If we
can't solve that problem, other types of gun restrictions are like
looking for lost keys at night under a lamp post even though you
didn't lose them there.

>     We are not talking about gun bans, are we?

You propose the same measures the gun banners propose, measures which
are ineffective at reducing crime but highly effective at hassling
gun owners. Why don't you clear the air and tell us exactly what
you propose. Go into clear detail about your ideas. Be sure to
address the reservations gun owners have about measures that have
already been tried. Don't forget the lesson of the voter literacy
tests.

-- 
My opinions are my own.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.japan