HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: c60c-2gj@web-2c.berkeley.edu (Alan S. Pearson)
Subject: Re: SF offer for Giants
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: usa
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1992 22:04:32 GMT

In article <13OCT199210063429@mary.fordham.edu> nissim@mary.fordham.edu (Leonard J. Nissim) writes:
>In article <1992Oct12.222615.3279@adobe.com>, snichols@adobe.com 
>(Sherri Nichols) writes...
>>Just heard on KCBS radio:
>> 
>>Despite the pullout of lead investor George Shinn, a coalition of SF
>>investors led by Safeway chairman Peter Magowan has presented NL president
>>Bill White with an offer to buy the Giants for $95 million.  In addition to
>                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^  
>>[names of others deleted] 
>
>>The reported bid by the Tampa Bay group was $115 million, which included a
>                                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>$10 million loan by Bob Lurie.  
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> 
>>Sherri Nichols
>>snichols@adobe.com
>
>Why should Lurie even consider an offer for $20,000,000.00 less?  (Unless the 
>owners vote down the move.)  Has SF given him $20,000,000.00 worth of good 
>feelings?  Hardly. 

There are many reasons, the first of which you overlooked above.  The $115M
offer was not $115 cash, but included Lurie making a loan for an additional
$10M.  Also there is some money involved with the new NL expansion, (I read
this in the SanFran Chronicle a couple of weeks ago, but cannot remember
the exact details), where the owners receive some type of "expansion bonus"
which turned out to be an equalizing factor in the financial difference.

Additionaly, the decision is not all Luries.  The other NL owners must vote
on any sale, and they have indicated that they would rather see the Giants
stay in S.F. given a reasonable offer.

Finally, I know with the San Jose and S.F. votes going against Lurie, it may
seem that he would not be very cordial to the Bay Area anymore, but he has
expressed a desire to keep the Giants in S.F. if possible.

This offer is completely reasonable, and I for one am hoping to see the Giants
in Candlestick on opening day '93.

alan
From: ehlerswm@hackney.ecn.purdue.edu (William Mark Ehlers)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Line Up
Date: 13 Oct 92 20:36:26 GMT
Distribution: usa
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

This is a call to all the stat heads out there.  I have been coaching
little league baseball for about 6 years now.  I've managed to have a
winning record for all but the first 2 years.  During that time, I have
used the traditional approach to the Batting order.  I keep more stats 
than the other coaches in the league and could therefore benefit from 
using a stathead approach to the game vs the traditional.  What I want to
know, is there another method for determing the batting order.  I would
like to try and limit the stats used to On Base Percentage and Slugging Pct.
Or is there a stat that combines those two stats to give the "ideal"
batting order.  Bear in mind that even though I keep more stats than most
coaches, I still don't have all the stats that seem to be floating around
the net in the stathead debates.

Either email me your ideas or post to the net.   I'm really interested in
what Gary H. has to say since he not only is a stathead, but plays as well.
But bear in mind that all opinions are welcome.

Thanks,
				---Mark
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: reynard@susie.cs.scarolina.edu (John Reynard)
Subject: Re: Incentive for fourth place?
Organization: USC  Department of Computer Science
Date: 12 Oct 92 20:53:02 GMT


Bill Thomas <bt16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

> 
>The final AL East standings were:
>                                   Home  Away    Last10  Stk.
>>x-Toronto    96  66  .593  --     53-28 43-38    7-3    W-3
>>Milwaukee    92  69  .571   3 1/2 53-28 39-41    8-2    L-1
>>Baltimore    89  73  .549   7     43-38 46-35    6-4    W-2
>>Cleveland    76  86  .469  20     41-40 35-46    4-6    L-2
>>New York     76  86  .469  20     41-40 35-46    4-6    L-2
>>Detroit      75  87  .463  21     38-42 37-45    4-6    L-3
>>Boston       73  89  .451  23     44-37 29-52    6-4    W-2
> 
>Won-Lost record shows that the Indians tied with the Yankees (so does
>Home, Away,
>Last10 and Streak, in an amazing coincidence, unless the UPI screwed up).
>My question is:
> 
>    Who is officially fourth? Or is it officially a tie? Is there a
>tie-breaker, such as head-to-head, for anything other than first place?
>(In fact, I don't think there's any tie-breaker in baseball for even
>head-to-head; there's a one-game playoff, right?)
>    Also, is there any incentive for finishing higher than last place,
>but not first, other than pride (in short, do the players divide up
>decreasing amounts of cash)? 

The teams who finish in the top half of their divisions recieve a higher
portion of the TV revenue.  It is almost insignificant only a million or
so per team, but still is an incentive of sorts.

John
From: paul@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Paul R Krueger)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Jack Morris, Mr. Clutch!
Date: 9 Oct 1992 01:38:07 GMT
Organization: Computing Services Division, University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: 129.89.7.4
Originator: paul@csd4.csd.uwm.edu

  I had a great time watching the A's-J's game last night. I just knew the
  stat-fanat's would be loving the outcome. Yes, he gave up 4 runs (about
  his season average), but I thought he pitched very good. One bad pitch in
  my book killed him--the one to McGwire. Stienbach's dinger was just a 
  piece of good hitting. He should've never been around in the ninth. Cito
  is not a good manager. A good-hitting lefty and two guys who have already
  taken him deep tonight? There's no way Jack should've been around.

  I also loved all the stat-guys "I told you so" (in a way) posts! I guess
  all I can say about that is that one start is not enough evidence to come
  to a conclusion on if he's clutch or not (spoken in true stat-guy form!).

  I still believe Jack will come back and pitch well in game 4 and if
  necessary 7. I guess we'll find out more later (and regardless of the
  outcome, be given more chances to ponder--one of my favorite nuances of
  sport).   
   
  I'll stick with my original prediction of Jays over Braves in 7 (actually
  it was Jays over Reds in 6 back in April).

  Plenty 'o grins spread about,

  --salty

Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: wilbanks@spot.Colorado.EDU (Wendell Gee)
Subject: Re: BRAVES (JINX) WILL LOSE
Organization: University of Colorado, Boulder
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 22:51:41 GMT

<RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:

>Sorry to all Braves fans, but you can declare the Blue Jays as baseball's
>1992 World Series Champions?  Why?  For the past 7 consecutive years, the team
>I have predicted to win the World Series has lost, and I have just predicted
>that the Braves will win the World Series this year.  So, all you Jays fans,

Yes, but you have now predicted that your prediction will be wrong, meaning 
it will be right. In essence, a jinx vote for the Braves is lock on the Series.
Nice job there. :)

>rejoice.  Consequently, I have correctly predicted the Super Bowl winner the
>past eight seasons.  Look for a correct prediction from me in January.

Heck, I could've predicted the Super Bore winner. It'll be (NFC champion) by 
(obscenely huge number of points).

>-The expert
>perdicter
>(in football)
-- 
Dylan Wilbanks, Classics major, AND NOW Environmental Conservation!
Hobbes:"Why do we always play war and not peace?"|Currently at:
Calvin:"Too few role models."                    |Box 1143
Ren-n-Stimpy in '92! Vote for a real cartoon!    |Boulder, CO 80306
From: barrym@informix.com (Barry Mednick)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: NL jacpac stats
Date: 16 Oct 92 16:50:00 GMT
Organization: Informix Software, Inc.
Originator: barrym@infmx



NL JACPAC stats
                 HR allowed  IP           HR / 9 IP

OLIVERAS,F        11        44.2             2.22
BOWEN,R            8        33.2             2.14
BERENGUER,J        7        33.1             1.89
BOLTON,T           9        46.1             1.75
CARTER,L           6        33.0             1.64
HILLMAN,E          9        52.1             1.55
PATTERSON,K        7        41.2             1.51
PENA,A             7        42.0             1.50
ASHBY,A            6        37.0             1.46
HANEY,C            6        38.0             1.42
BOSKIE,S          14        91.2             1.37
ABBOTT,K          20       133.1             1.35
ROBINSON,D         6        43.2             1.24
MATHEWS,G          7        52.1             1.20
BLACK,B           23       177.0             1.17
OSUNA,A            8        61.2             1.17
GLEATON,J          4        31.2             1.14
MASON,R           11        88.0             1.13
ROGERS,KE          4        34.0             1.06
WILSON,T          18       154.0             1.05
GUETTERMAN,L       5        43.1             1.04
CARPENTER,C       10        88.0             1.02
GIBSON,P           7        62.0             1.02
BELINDA,S          8        71.1             1.01
RUSKIN,S           6        53.2             1.01
MCCLURE,B          6        54.0             1.00
From: steph@m.cs.uiuc.edu (Dale Stephenson)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Top of 9 may have been it
Date: 16 Oct 92 02:04:07 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept. of Comp. Sci., Urbana, IL

erude@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Erick Rudiak) writes:

>	Indeed a good point.  Justice's perfect throw might have been the biggest
>play of the game (Lind's error not withstanding - that was a non-play).  Here's
>why: had he not thrown out Merced, and had the Braves not scored another run,
>the game would have gone into extra innings.  Lemke was already out of the game,
>as was Belliard (since Cabrera had pinch-hit for Belliard).  There were no
>infielders left on the bench.  The players left in the game were: Gant, Nixon,
>Justice (OF); Pendleton - 3B; Blauser - SS; Cabrera (a catcher by trade) - 2B;
>"Speedster" Bream (did anyone notice that he was about 2/3 of the way to 3rd
>base when Cabrera hit the ball) - 1B; Berryhill - C.  The Braves would have been
>stuck with Cabrera at second base.  This could have led to *lots* of problems
>(double-plays, etc...)  

Cabrera probably would have played left.  Former infielder Gant would have
played second.
-- 
Dale J. Stephenson |*| (steph@cs.uiuc.edu) |*| Gigabit Study Group 

  "It is considered good to look wise, especially when not 
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: kbos@carina.unm.edu (Kurt "Some Guy" Bose)
Subject: Re: jack morris, pitching to the score.
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 92 19:38:26 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <steph.718532601@pegasus.cs.uiuc.edu> steph@cs.uiuc.edu (Dale Stephenson) writes:
>
>Second inning aside, Jack pitched quite well.  But I don't think he should
>have pitched the ninth.  He didn't look *that* sharp.

The thing I found hilarious was the reaction of the announcers...

6th inning or so: "Y'know, Morris is one of those pitchers who just gets 
stronger as the game goes on.  Remember that gutsy performance in Game 7 last
year??  You've got to get to him early, 'cause you aren't going to beat him
late..."

After the Baines HR: "I really don't know what Gaston is thinking.  Morris is
_very_ vulnerable late in the game, and Baines proved that."

Geez, you'd think these guys were pitching coaches for the '69 Pilots...

-- 
Kurt Bose (as in Daisy, not Rose) * kbos@carina.unm.edu * Make outs, not walks!
Keeper of the R.S.BB FAQ, and Junior Stathead {tm} * Maintainer, R.S.BB Archive
Be kind. Don't flame the mediots. * Look, stupid comments are funny!'-R. Lustig
I'd rather see Doug Dascenzo pitch than suffer through John Burkett's batting..
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: kthompso@kronos.arc.nasa.gov (Kevin Thompson)
Subject: Re: SF offer for Giants
Organization: NASA/ARC Information Sciences Division
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 17:39:46 GMT

In article <13OCT199210063429@mary.fordham.edu> nissim@mary.fordham.edu (Leonard J. Nissim) writes:
>In article <1992Oct12.222615.3279@adobe.com>, snichols@adobe.com 
>(Sherri Nichols) writes...
>>The reported bid by the Tampa Bay group was $115 million, which included a
>                                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>$10 million loan by Bob Lurie.  

>Why should Lurie even consider an offer for $20,000,000.00 less?  (Unless
>the owners vote down the move.)  Has SF given him $20,000,000.00 worth of
>good feelings?  Hardly.

What goes around comes around.  According to this morning's San Jose paper,
when Lurie bought the team (~1974), he offered about 1/3 less than a group of
Toronto buyers (something like 10 vs. 17 million?).  Owners approved the
Lurie deal in the interests of franchise continuity (and gave Toronto an
expansion team within 2 or 3 years).  So don't pity Lurie for not getting
"fair market value", he didn't pay it either ....

Kevin Thompson
-- 
kthompso@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov     Artificial Intelligence Research Laboratory
(415) 604-4767 (voicemail)        NASA-Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball

LaRussa is an idiot.

Game three - McGwire on 3rd, no outs.  McGwire runs like my grandma.  Short
fly to right.  McGwire sent home.  Double play.  End of rally.  This was one
of the stupidest moves I've ever seen.  The play wasn't even close.  

Game four - Brown gets bunted to 3rd by McGwire.  The A's give up an out with
their 4 hitter to set up the winning run.  Steinbach hits a grounder right
at someone.  Runner is sent.  Double play.  Not even close.  End of threat.
A's lose in next inning.

LaRussa is an idiot.  The Jays deserve this series simply because Gaston 
refuses to do stupid things.  

Go Braves, kill the Jays.
From: genetic+@pitt.edu (Dr. Dave)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Pittsburgh Fans
Date: 14 Oct 92 21:05:56 GMT
Organization: Department of Industrial Engineering

Thus spake jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com:
>
>To repeat my proposal of a few months ago: let's rip down the 
>Pitt Law school and replace it with a nice ball field with
>ivy covered walls,  all the seats close in, a nice 
>old-fashioned scoreboard in left, etc.  Maybe we can even
>name it after one of the nearby streets: how about Forbes Field?

Nah, you'd never get away with it.  I mean, tear down the Law School, sure.
Tear down the Katz School of Business (in CF)?  Sure.  Tear down Forbes Quad,
with its ugly building, ugly rooms, and uglier parking garage?  Sure.  But
they'll never, ever let you rip out Roberto Clemente Drive, which runs between
the Quad and the B-School... :-)


-- 
       David Tate        |"Out of the dugout endlessly swinging,
 dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu | Out of the manager's throat, the sound fundamentals,
 Prof. of Story Problems | Out of the six-month season..."            
 Member ORSA, TIMS, SABR | 	Walt "Lefty" Whitman
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: kbos@carina.unm.edu (Kurt "Some Guy" Bose)
Subject: Re: Pirates!!!1
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 92 06:26:34 GMT
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque

In article <4eqrNWe00WBK47o18o@andrew.cmu.edu> sk4n+@andrew.cmu.edu (Scott Ryan Kirkpatrick) writes:
>
>inning 2    ANY QUESTIONS?????????????
>
>PIRATES!!!!!PIRATES!!!!!PIRATES!!!!!PIRATES!!!!!PIRATES!!!!!PIRATES!!!!!PIRATES

Er...just one.  Are _all_ the exclamation point keys at CMU jammed, or just 
yours and Eric Shapiro's?


-- 
Kurt Bose (as in Daisy, not Rose) * kbos@carina.unm.edu * Make outs, not walks!
Keeper of the R.S.BB FAQ, and Junior Stathead {tm} * Maintainer, R.S.BB Archive
Be kind. Don't flame the mediots. * Look, stupid comments are funny!'-R. Lustig
I'd rather see Doug Dascenzo pitch than suffer through John Burkett's batting..
From: gajarsky@pilot.njin.net (Bob Gajarsky)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Some thoughts...
Date: 10 Oct 92 16:11:54 GMT
Organization: Somewhere in Hoboken

i should have clarified; when i call him the third best pitcher in
 baseball, i'm basically using the past 3 years as comparison.  so
 mussina and guzman wouldn't fall in, and, yes, i think mcdowell
 is worse than cone.  the d wasn't the best in new york, although 
 i don't know how his earned runs/runs compares to the rest of the league.

but from all the reports we have in the n.y.c. area, his #1 choice
 to go to is the yankees.  if they offer him anything remotely near
 market value, he's probably going to go there.

- bob gaj
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
From: kbowers@esrc1.uucp (Ken Bowers)
Subject: Nationalism (was Re: Three runs ... ) 
Organization: University of California at Berkeley
Distribution: na
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 16:44:53 GMT

In article <1992Oct15.040107.12349@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> doli@troi.cc.rochester.edu (David Oliver) writes:
>
>I'll be rooting for the Braves now that it's the US vs. Canada.
>

I don't quite understand why some of my fellow Americans are getting 
so worked up over the Canadian business. We were the ones who started
calling it a "World" series, so we should welcome anyone to field a
team. As for Canadian baseball fans being excited, why not?  It's 
a breakthrough. Their tone is generally pro-Canada without being
anti-US. On the other hand, some Americans (note, *not* D. Oliver
above, who is just stating his rooting preference) seem to be
anti-Canadian. Sure, the flag-waving is annoying, but after the 1984
Olympics, we have nothing to complain about. 

Besides, isn't just a little absurd to get worked up over Roberto
Alomar, Cito Gaston, Candy Maldanado and Juan Guzman as Ugly 
Canadians?  The U.S. v. the rest of the hemisphere ... yeah, that's
the ticket. 

Ken B. 

U.C. Berkeley student, in response to question by the Daily 
Californian about Columbus:

"I have no comment on the whole thing. I'm just a math major."
From: sivaram@plains.NoDak.edu (Sivaram Hariharan )
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: World-Series ...... Jays have the edge
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:43:59 GMT
Organization: North Dakota Higher Education Computing Network


Sorry to  Braves' fans, but IMO, the Braves deserved to lose
yesterday to the unlucky Pirates, who have won many hearts.

I do not want to jinx the Jays, but I feel that the Jays
hold the edge in the World series

Advantages
Jays: Strong Bullpen, Good starters, Good hitting and a new
found hunger.

The Braves have this advantage of Home-field, but how far
that counts, I do not know. With the HF in the NLCS, they
almost lost to the Pirates. 

As an AL-fan i feel that the J-hitters like Carter and 
Winfield and Alomar will feast on Avery and Glavine 
with only Smoltlz offering good resistance. Probabaly,
Cox should gop with Pete Smith.

Cox should feel fortunate that the As did not make it,
as their hitters murder left hand pitching.

But there is this factor called luck....and I feel
the Braves are a lucky team.

S.H
Forever Twins'
From: RVESTERM@vma.cc.nd.edu
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: Braves win 5-1
Date: 8 Oct 92 01:23:36 GMT
 <1992Oct7.171254.5075@cs.cornell.edu>

regarding, "bond also advanced bell to third on a very nice walk."

not.

bond advanced bell to second.  the pitcher, catcher, and bell advanced
bell to third, unless you're going to tell me that barry used his psychic
powers to make the pitch be thrown in the dirt.
From: niepornt@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (David Marc Nieporent)
Subject: Re: NLCS Game #5 at 9:41
Originator: news@nimaster
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1992 03:28:28 GMT

In article <7487@blue.cis.pitt.edu.UUCP> psg+@pitt.edu (Paul S Galvanek) writes:
>In article <Ahn-101092214135@branford-college-node.net.yale.edu> Ahn@pop.cis.yale.edu (Eugene R. Ahn) writes:

>>Alex Cole and Jay Bell both struck out. Andy Van Slyke crushed a line drive
>>down the RF line. The ball bounces off the wall (parallel to the foul line)
>>at a sharp angle back to CF. Justice is way out of play. Slyke gets a
>>triple. Bonds walked. Jeff King KO's.

>Once again we see that a WALK is definitely not as vaulable as a HIT.

Once again, we see people setting up straw men.  Nobody ever said it was, 
unless there's a man on first and he's slow.

But then again, it's infinitely better than an out.

A single isn't as valuable as a double.  A double isn't as valuable as a
triple.  A triple isn't as valuable as a home run.  Does any of this
have a point?

-- 
David M. Nieporent   | Orioles 1993 World Series Champions
niepornt@phoenix.    | Mike Mussina 1992 AL Cy Young Winner
   princeton.edu     | Roland Hemond: SIGN BARRY BONDS!!!!!!!!
Vote Clinton/Gore '92.   Four more weeks!!!   		"Bloody urine"
From: PunisherX@cup.portal.com (M Phil Collins)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Re: freon Deion
Date: Thu,  8 Oct 92 13:13:00 PDT
Organization: The Portal System (TM)

Like most people who have little or no abilitiy in one let alone two different
professions, you choose to criticize a person for doing both of thier jobs and
doing them well.
From: rickert@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (John H. Rickert)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Post season scheduling (WAS Re: Why bother to watch the World Series?)
Date: 7 Oct 1992 21:11:35 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department at Rose-Hulman
Reply-To: rickert@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (John H. Rickert)
NNTP-Posting-Host: g215a-1.nextwork.rose-hulman.edu

In article <1992Oct6.060211.9367@sfu.ca> jjook@fraser.sfu.ca (Jessica Jook)  
writes:
>      I suggest that the Home-field advantage should be awarded to
> the team that has the best record.  In that way, it will encourage
> the teams play better baseball even they are about to clinch/or have
> clinched the division already.    It is also more fair, and lesser
> change for a poorer team to win purely because of playing at home.
> 
>     Any thought??

One problem I see with this is advance planning for the fans.
In 1982 I knew by late Sept. that I'd be going back to Milwaukee 
during the weekends for the post-season games.
In many years, the best W-L record isn't decided until the last weekend.
This creates the possibility of being unaware of the location of 
Tuesday's game as late as Sunday. 
This isn't such a big problem in football - all the games are on
weekends and there's a week between the season and the playoffs -
or basketball&hockey - the crowds are much smaller, fewer people are  
inconvenienced and less preparation needs to be done.
It's not like they can reasonably push the post-season back any farther
(or like that would stop them if they thought it'd make more money),
so it's probably better to know several weeks in advance that 
'if the *** get to the post-season they will play on these dates'

seeing, hearing
john rickert
rickert@nextwork.rose-hulman.edu
back after a long 'News' crash: Picks: Pirates over Toronto in 6.
Organization: University of Maine System
Date: Wednesday, 7 Oct 1992 18:28:35 EDT
From: <IO81144@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.sport.baseball
Subject: Raul Mondesi

I hear talk on occasion about how this guy should be protected and is
projected as outfield starter next year, but I can't track any information
down on him.  He didn't appear to be called up and I couldn't find any
minor league information on him.  Can anyone out there enlighten me?
Brian Scheller