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Date:         Mon, 6 Apr 1992 19:35:00 EDT
Comments:     A VAX cluster with VMS V5.3-1, PMDF V3.2-19,
              JNET V3.5 & UCX V1.3A
From:         LIZ MOREAU <EMOREAU@UMASSD.BITNET>
Subject:      Re: abortion

>Marty & Liz:
>  Both of you expressed an interest in knowing how a Christian
>could be pro-choice. Here is my perspective:

Wasn't me, but I'll respond anyway :).

>It seems that people who vote against abortion also vote against
>social programs, and educating teenagers about sex. If she is
>uneducated, she will probably have several more children not
>meaning to, and become more and more poor, and probably abusive
>to her children, who, from lack of attention by their parent,
>do poorly in school and grow up with a total lack of respect
>for any authority, and thereby become juvinile delinquints.

I don't vote against social programs.  I feel they are definitely
needed, should be supported by all, BUT they should also be revamped a
bit.  I do vote against education teenagers about sex.  For example,
at one of our local high schools last week a nurse presented a talk on
AIDS.  She game it to the seniors and juniors first and many kids and
teachers walked out.  Why, because she was making comments like "Lets
hear it for pleasure", "Lets hear it for masturbation".  No thank you,
I'd rather teach my kids at home!

IMO kids grow up to be juvenile deliquents because there was no
discipline and morality in their homes.  I know adults today who came
out of one parent, low-income homes who are wonderful people.  Many
two income homes also suffer from stress.  There are still financial
problems and very tired parents who do reach their limits also.

> What if she were a teenager raised in a church? she made a
>mistake, and having heard all her life how terrible it is to
>be an unwed mother, and how evil abortion is, she cannot face
>her community. Abortion is the the better choice because no
>one will know. It may be evil, but it is better than facing
>the judgement of her church and parents, who would probably
>send her off to some home for misbehaving teenagers. (or so
>she imagined, in her panic.)

Yes, she can definitely hide her problem from everyone by aborting,
but can she hide it from God?  I would applaud anyone in my church who
was pregnant and single.  I would admire them for not compounding
their problems.

>   Now consider another woman. She was molested by several
>different people as a child. As a young adult, she is date-
>raped. Her church and p arents treat the incidences with
>complete silence. She is advised not to bring charges on the
>man who date raped her because in all probability he will get
>off because there is not enough evidence. Besides, she does not
>want to, she is already mortified and feeling that somehow it
>is all her fault, since it is a pattern, and because no one
>wants to talk about it. Later in life, she is horrified to
>think that her government is debating whether or not she can
>have an abortion. As a christian, she would never consider it.
>But as a woman, she feels her helplessness about her body
>and how here again men are taking control of her body. She
>wants the right to sin. She figures if men had babies, Abortion
>would not even be debated. They would get maternity leave with
>pay, social assistance, and abortion on  demand. Contaception
>would be free.  And sex education would abound, at home and
>school.

I can certainly see why you feel this way about abortion, but can we
pick and choose what the Bible says?  What about adoption?  Why should
a baby be burned out of its mother's womb or pulled out limb by limb?

>  Other thoughts:  if children are a blessing, celibacy douses
>the flame surely as abortion.

God calls some people to live a celibate life.  He has a purpose for
doing this.  I don't know what it is but I trust that it is for the
best.

>  Is abortion playing God? Genesis 3:22, God calls Adam and
>Eve "like one of us."

We are all appointed to die once.  We don't decide, God does.

>   Is abortion murder? Exodus 21: 22-25 shows that the woman
>and her fetus have different legal status.  Also Numbers
>5: 5-31.

I must be reading this differently than you.  To me, Exodus means that
the fetus is very important.  If anyone harms the fetus there is
definite retribution.  Also, I have seen cases in the paper where a
drunk driver hit a car with a pregnant woman and the baby died and the
offender was jailed for manslaughter!

Numbers 5:5-31 as explained in "The Wycliffe Bible Commentary":

     It is obvious that the swelling body refers to pregnancy.  The
ICC (?) suggests that the falling thigh means a premature birth.  The
same root nepel, "a falling," is rendered untimely birth in Job 3:16;
Ps 58:8,9; Eccl 6:3.  Thigh or loin (yarek) is used similarly as the
seat of procreative power, in Gen 46:26 (and elsewhere): "Those that
come out of his thigh" (or "loins").  So her thigh shall fall could
mean she will give birth."  That napal, "fall," can mean "born" is
clear from its usage in Isa 26:18.  We would translate this phrase as
follows, "Her body shall swell and she shall give birth (or give an
untimely birth), and that woman shall become a curse in the midst of
her people.

     The guilty woman, then, was not made to die, which would have
been unjust, since the guilty man went free.  However, illegitimate
children were not allowed to become a burden to the camp because of
God's supernatural intervention in instances like this (cf. Deut
23:2).  There is no evidence that this law was practiced at any time
except during the period of Moses' leadership.

>  Abortion makes me sick. But, since my sister is the second
>example and I am the third, I am terrified that my uterus is
>under someone elses control. I only give that control to God.
>I will not protest abortion alone; I protest the whole system.
>And I believe , as Kurt said, that if we take away the demand,
>as as church welcome women in trouble, it would go away.

I'm sorry for your pain.  I will pray that God heals you and your
family of your memories.  Thank you for being so open in sharing your
thoughts, and I hope you do not take offense at my thoughts.

                                        God Bless,

                                                Liz
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