HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: boening.pad@sni.de (Martin Boening)
Subject: Re: Running isode 8.0 on top of SunNet(TM) X.25 7.0 - possible and useful?
Organization: Siemens Nixdorf Info.Sys. AG, Paderborn, Germany
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1992 12:07:22 GMT

Hi again,

here, in short, what I learned since asking the question described in
the subject line:

a) you can indeed run Isode 8.0 on top of Sunnet X.25 7.0, and PP on top
  of Isode.

b) If I had read the configuration hints more closely, I would have seen
   that besides a sunnet7.{h|make} combo, which is intended for Sunnet
   OSI 7.0 [and which I hacked for my Sunnet X.25 setup, thinking there
   was nothing else], there is also a sunnetx.{h|make} combo for Sunnet
   X.25. Using this after having it pointed out to me, I didn't even
   need to patch anything in the tsap directory any more - the
   compilation went without a hitch.

Thanks for your answers. I got answers from the following people:

Andreas Israel <A.Israel@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de> <- German support center
                           for Isode, working for the DFN Verein, e.V.

Harald Tveit Alvestrand <Harald.Alvestrand@delab.sintef.no>

Ian (?) G. Batten <I.G.Batten@fulcrum.bt.co.uk>

and

Gerhard Winkler <gw@cc.univie.ac.at> (by way of a news postings)

I'd like this to be the acknowledgement for the received answers.
Thank's for your support.

So long,
Martin
--
Email: in the   USA ->  boening.pad@sni-usa.com
       outside  USA ->  boening.pad@sni.de
Paper Mail: Martin Boening, Siemens Nixdorf Informationssys. AG, SNI STO SI 325,
	Riemekestr. 160, 4790 Paderborn, W.-Germany  (Phone: +49 5251 835641)
From: c1741@moncol.monmouth.edu (MICHAEL CARSON)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso.dev-environ
Subject: ISODE 8.0 docs
Date: 13 Aug 92 13:11:15 GMT


	Does anybody know where I can get a Postscript copy of the ISODE 8.0
docs?  They don't seem to be in the files I FTPed from ftp.psi.com.  

	Does anybody know where I can get some basic info on the uses of
ISODE?

	Are there any Public Domain/Free Re-distributable network performance
analyzers available for the Sun?  Especially valuable would be a S/W package
that allows for the insertion of errors for testing purposes.

					Thank you,
					Michael Carson
				   c1741@moncol.monmouth.edu
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso.dev-environ
From: luiki@tuvie.can.ac.at (Mario Luiki)
Subject: Hello World! - FTAM test partners needed very much!
Organization: Center of Academic Networking, Vienna, Austria
Distribution: comp
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 07:08:20 GMT


hello world!

We are a small group of students at University of Technology Vienna
testing the interoperability of ISODE-7.0 FTAM, VAX/VMS 1.1 FTAM and
DEC/ULTRIX FTAM. The tests are based upon the user-interfaces of the
FTAMs. 

In order to check the IO over Wide Area Network (Internet, X.25), we are
looking for partner-sites, which have one of the above installed and
can provide us a testing account on their machine, so we can get started
the FTAM-initiators remotely to test our FTAM-responders and vice versa.

We would accept offers from all over the world, if one or more of the
FTAMs mentioned above is available. Please feel free and email me or my
colleague mishra, who is reachable under the same Internet-address.
At the end of November this year a test report will be finished and openly
available by via FTAM or FTP.

Thanx a lot in advance,

---

    /|  /|   Mario Luiki		      email: luiki@acosi.can.ac.at
   / | / |   Centre of Academic Networking    phone:      +43 1 58801 3621
  /  |/  |
 /   |   |          Gusshausstrasse 25
/    |   |__/       A-1040 Vienna, AUSTRIA
From: sthomas@mitchell.hac.com (Scott Thomas)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso.dev-environ
Subject: non-public ISODE
Keywords: $$$
Date: 17 Aug 92 19:33:12 GMT
Reply-To: sthomas@mitchell.hac.com (Scott Thomas)
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Company

This may be stupid misconception on my part, but...
I was just reading over the updates to ISODE and it appears to me that
after version 8.0, ISODE will no longer be publicly available, but
rather only available as a commerical product from X-Tel.  Is this
true?  If so, can anyone out there tell me more information such as
product cost, consortium membership fees, etc?  

If this is a mistake, please keep flames to a minimum.

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott Thomas                         || 
Hughes Information Technology Co.    ||    "In the land of the dark,
e-mail: sthomas@mitchell.hac.com     ||     the Ship of the Sun is 
 phone: (703) 759-1382               ||     driven by the Grateful Dead"
   fax: (703) 438-8430               ||          - Egyptian Book of the Dead
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso.dev-environ
From: old@corea.mumath (Olivier Dubois)
Subject: Re: Hello World! - FTAM test partners needed very much!
Reply-To: old@corea.mumath
Organization: Sun Microsystems
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 13:59:52 GMT

HI you,

I sincerelly wish you an happy FTAM testing.

Two years ago, I was assigned to do the same kind of testing for the Commision of the European Communities. I made extensive testing of FTAM implementation (Isode RETIX on NCR, BULL, IBM, DEC VMS FTAM, Siemens BS2000 and UNIX, Marben, RETIX on SCO).

my tests were far from sucessfull. some implementation did not worked at all. Other combination showed some interoperability problems.

Upon the combination you mention, I can assess several thing:

	- Isode has a bug in the file ftam2/ftam-put.c.
	It will use 8k FADU on Sun (and BSD derived systems) while the profiles will
	limit FTAM APDU to 7K. I proposed a fix when the current Isode was version 6.0.
	now here is the diff in version 8.0. It consist in deplacing a test in this file.

*** ftam-put.c  Mon Jun 29 12:31:31 1992
--- ftam-put.c~ Tue Jun 16 14:15:47 1992
***************
*** 335,340 ****
--- 335,342 ----
            break;
      }
  
+     if (magic > 6 * 1024)     /* FTAM profile T1 or A/111 limits  to 7K */
+       magic = 6 * 1024;
  #ifdef        BRIDGE
      bsize = BUFSIZ << 2;
      size = magic >= bsize ? magic : bsize;
***************
*** 348,357 ****
  #endif
      size = (1024 <= magic && magic < bsize) ? magic : bsize;
  #endif
- 
-     if (size > 6 * 1024)      /* FTAM profile T1 or A/111 limits  to 7K */
-       size = 6 * 1024;
- 
      if (watch) {
  #ifndef       BRIDGE
        (void) printf ("Selecting FADU size of %d\n", size);
--- 350,355 ----


	- DEC FTAM on vax had some standard violation on the concurrency attributes. I 
	added a variable (concurrency) wich allow you to turn off their use by the 
	initiator. 

By now, I only manage an Isode FTAM site and thus can't propose you any interoperability testing.

I hope to hear from you that FTAM products did progress in the two last years. Two years ago, Isode was one of the bests. Some product are really only interoperable with themselves.

Good luck,


---
   __                         _____
  /  \ /\  o       o         ( /   )           o
 /   /| |     _     _  _    _ /  /     /_  _
 \__/_|/_/_/)/ |_/_(<_/____(_X__/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/)____

Olivier Dubois,
old@sunbim.be
c=BE;A=RTT;P=BIM;O=HORIZON;S=Dubois;G=Olivier
From: schwartz@ipx08 (Privataccount Roman Schwartz)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso.dev-environ
Subject: older isode versions
Keywords: ISODE,ISO,NIST package
Date: 19 Aug 92 09:28:03 GMT
Organization: PPG Hellige, Freiburg, GERMANY
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

Hi netters,
I'm looking for a ISO TP4 implementation (CONP/CNLP) for UNIX and
MS-DOS.

I found a hint
in the preface to ISODE 7.0

       Development Environment:
           User's Manual
       Volume 1: Application Services
       (Marshall T. Rose)

page xviii in preface (near the bottom):

"...
 A previous release of the software contained an ISO TP4/CLNP package
 derived from a public-domain implementation developed by the National 
 Institute of Standards and Technology (then called the National Bureau of
 Standards). The purpose of including the NIST package (and associated
 support) was to give an example of how one would interface the code to a
 "generic" native TP4 implementation. As the software has now been interfaced
 to various native TP4 implementations, the NIST package is no longer present
 in the distribution. 
 ..."

Do someone know something about the NIST-package? 

Do someone own an older version (maybe ISODE 3.0 until 5.0) of ISODE including
the NIST package?

Do someone own an email of the NIST?

With regards

Roman Schwartz 

--
Roman Schwartz, dep. M-SA
PPG Hellige GmbH                           email: schwartz@ppgfr.uucp 
Heinrich-v.-Stephan-Str. 4                 voice: +49-761-4011-495
D-7800 Freiburg, GERMANY                   fax:   +49-671-4011-495
From: enag@ifi.uio.no (Erik Naggum)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Re: Archive site for docs?
Date: 20 Aug 92 01:07:24 GMT
Organization: Department of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway

don provan <donp@novell.com> writes:
|
|   In article <23311C@erik.naggum.no> enag@ifi.uio.no (Erik Naggum) writes:
|   >...it would be a simple matter for one
|   >vendor to edit out the hardest parts to implement, increase an error
|   >margin, or whatever, and to supply the customers with this copy.  This
|   >would be much easier if they were electronically available...
|
|   Oops.  Backwards thinking.  Such a plan of deception is only conceivable
|   in an environment where access to the documents is restricted, such as
|   the existing OSI world.  In a world where OSI documents are distributed
|   electronically at a low cost, a scam like this wouldn't be worth the
|   effort to consider.  It wouldn't fool anyone, but it might easily lead
|   to a fraud conviction.

Consider the fact that vendors already deviate from standards they claim
to conform to and lie to the customers about it.  I'm not saying that
I'm agreeing with this, but I can understand that ISO is concerned.

Amendmends, corrigenda and new editions of international standards take
place at infrequent intervals, and getting the latest edition is also a
major concern for ISO.  With eletronic copies, they don't know, and
can't ascertain control over the available versions.  I have received
updates and amendments to the Blue Book I bought from CCITT at two
occasions, and have received notification of amendments and corrigenda
to ISO 8613 several times.  This is an important service when you have
organized distribution of such documents.

Counter-examples: How do you know that RFC 822 is no longer the final
answer?  How do you know what the final answer in mail is?  Which is the
latest telnet option RFC?

There are benefits from a controlled distribution, just as there are
benefits from free distribution.  Just because some of the benefits you
are used to don't apply to controlled distribution doesn't mean it's all
bad, which is what seems to be implied.

Best regards,
</Erik>
--
Erik Naggum             |  ISO  8879 SGML     |      +47 295 0313
                        |  ISO 10744 HyTime   |
<erik@naggum.no>        |  ISO 10646 UCS      |      Memento, terrigena.
<enag@ifi.uio.no>       |  ISO  9899 C        |      Memento, vita brevis.
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
From: wai@csuvax1.csu.murdoch.edu.au (Julian Wai)
Subject: ISO 8211
Organization: Murdoch University
Date: Mon, 17 Aug 92 06:30:18 GMT

HI,

Does anyone know if ISO 8211 is being used?  I would appreciate any 
information (particularly implementation examples).  I am doing a project
and may have to use the standard.

Thanks
Julian
wai@csuvax1.csu.murdoch.edu.au
From: mskuhn@immd4.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Markus Kuhn)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: ISO Procedures
Keywords: ISO, Standards
Date: 20 Aug 92 12:40:45 GMT
Organization: CSD., University of Erlangen, Germany

I just read Erik Naggums insights in the position of ISO in this world
with great interest, but one question is still open for me:

Who are the people responsible for technical decisions in the standards making
process? How are they selected? How is guaranteed, that they represent the
creme-de-la-creme of academic and industrial experts? Is everything organized
more in a democratic or aristocratic way? If it is intended to be a democratic
process, how can highly motivated independent people (e.g. like me ;-)
have influence on the standardisation process without being employed in
the marketing department of a huge company? Is it really a democratic process
if my hobby of reading ISO documents is nearly as expensive for a student
as drug abuse (as Erik Naggum wrote a few weeks ago :-)?

Markus

-- 
Markus Kuhn, Computer Science student -=-=- University of Erlangen, Germany
Internet: mskuhn@immd4.informatik.uni-erlangen.de  |  X.500 entry available
-A distributed system is one in which the failure of a computer you didn't-
-even know existed can render your own computer unusable. (Leslie Lamport)-
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
From: hta@boheme.er.sintef.no (Harald Tveit Alvestrand)
Subject: Re: Archive site for docs?
Reply-To: harald.alvestrand@delab.sintef.no
Organization: SINTEF DELAB, Norway
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 07:08:42 GMT

Note that at the last IETF, one guy was trying to collect signatures
in order to make the US Congress make ANSI put the ISO standards
on-line. If anyone in the US is interested in supporting this,
I suggest that someone tries to remember the guy's name.....
(as a non-US citizen, I don't think Congress pays much attention to me)
-- 
                   Harald Tveit Alvestrand
Harald.Alvestrand@delab.sintef.no
C=no;PRMD=uninett;O=sintef;OU=delab;S=alvestrand;G=harald
+47 7 59 70 94
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
From: eichin@athena.mit.edu (Mark W. Eichin)
Subject: Re: Archive site for docs?
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1992 07:29:55 GMT

> I guess we need an "ISO standards FAQ" with this question answered and
> mailed weekly to a number of newsgroups.
	Yes, that would probably be appropriate... particularly given
the number of us used to having RFC's and IETF working papers online.
(It is extremely useful to wais-search (or even grep) for a particular
concept, such as "out of band messages" and find the standards that
refer to it...)
	I suppose I should withdraw my earlier reference to the
"European" network standards process when refering to ISO, thanks to
the gentle correction of another reader (who pointed out that ANSI is
an ISO member :-) ANSI standards aren't available online either, I've
heard this is also because they make back operating expenses by
charging for them. (I've never heard "tampering risk" suggested
seriously as a reason not to publish them in electronic form -- if
you consider it a threat, you can either put them up yourself (or get
other parties you trust to do it) or simply put some sort of digital
signature on the document.)
	I did receive a pointer to a doc that satisfied my original request:
>> The file ASN.1.ps.Z on ftp.uni-erlangen.de in pub/doc/ISO/english
>> contains an introductory text about ASN.1 and the basic encoding rules.
	This paper is "A Layman's Guide to a Subset of ASN.1, BER, and
DER" by Burton S. Kaliski Jr. of RSA DSI; it is written with an
emphasis on parts of ASN.1 needed to implement the PKCS standards.  It
refers to CCITT X.208 and X.209, not to the ISO documents -- perhaps
the above mentioned FAQ should explain the meaning of the distinction
between CCITT and ISO. (Erik Naggum's description of the two groups
was clear, but it didn't explain why the CCITT makes recommendations
in the first place, or which direction the standards flow...)
	Thanks for your patience. I suspect these questions are coming
up more often (from American developers, at least) due to the growing
use of SNMP, RSA PEM, and Kerberos version 5, specifications for which
are freely available yet which rest on ASN.1 in particular which is
not.
				_Mark_ <eichin@athena.mit.edu>
				MIT Student Information Processing Board
From: Roger_Nordin@f302.n901.z92.badnet.bad.se (Roger Nordin)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Texter jag inte borde f}, de f}r jag {nd}... (vilket fint rim! ;-)
Date: 17 Aug 92 22:25:43 GMT
Reply-To: Roger_Nordin@f302.n901.z92.badnet.bad.se (Roger Nordin)
Organization: ANet Test Bench, Karlstad, Sweden
OD-Comment-To: Mathias_Korsback

> fr}n YG_NEWFILES och YG_STARNET nu, och det borde jag inte f}tt d} jag
> inte kopplat p} de m|tena.
> 
> Som vanligt gl|mde jag tyv{rr spara de paketen...

Och som vanligt s{ger mig ovanst}ende intet!

Mvh Roger

---
From: donp@novell.com (don provan)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Re: Archive site for docs?
Date: 19 Aug 92 21:10:22 GMT
Organization: Novell, Inc., San Jose, California

In article <23311C@erik.naggum.no> enag@ifi.uio.no (Erik Naggum) writes:
>...it would be a simple matter for one
>vendor to edit out the hardest parts to implement, increase an error
>margin, or whatever, and to supply the customers with this copy.  This
>would be much easier if they were electronically available...

Oops.  Backwards thinking.  Such a plan of deception is only conceivable
in an environment where access to the documents is restricted, such as
the existing OSI world.  In a world where OSI documents are distributed
electronically at a low cost, a scam like this wouldn't be worth the
effort to consider.  It wouldn't fool anyone, but it might easily lead
to a fraud conviction.
						don provan
						donp@novell.com
From: hta@boheme.er.sintef.no (Harald Tveit Alvestrand)
Subject: Re: Using one syntax for more than one attribute - comments?
Reply-To: harald.alvestrand@delab.sintef.no
Organization: SINTEF DELAB, Norway
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 92 19:38:19 GMT

In article <01050130.b0ta21@trail.sharpstone.com>, asp@trail.sharpstone.com (Alexandre Sasha Polozoff) writes:
....example deleted...
|> 
|> Now we have two attribute templates which are going to both use the
|> same syntax.
|> 
|> == OR ==
|>
|> We could have two syntaxes
|> and reference these syntaxes instead.
|> 
It depends on the application.
But if this was, for instance, Directory, I would strongly suggest that
you keep the number of separate names as low as possible.

You should only use separate names for things when there is a need to actually
distinguish between the two objects, as for instance if the name syntax was
the only thing that set a human apart from a computer (not good design,
I think).

My opinion only.....
-- 
                   Harald Tveit Alvestrand
Harald.Alvestrand@delab.sintef.no
C=no;PRMD=uninett;O=sintef;OU=delab;S=alvestrand;G=harald
+47 7 59 70 94
From: psm@nosc.mil (Scot Mcintosh)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Archive site for docs?
Date: 18 Aug 92 17:43:03 GMT
Organization: Naval Ocean Systems Center, San Diego

I'm looking for an archive site that contains ISO/CCITT documents. X.25 is
the immediate quest, but a place where all of them are gathered would be
very useful for future reference. I've checked wuarchive.wustl.edu,
ftp.uu.net, and world.std.com and haven't been able to locate what
I'm looking for (which is not to say that it isn't there, just that
I can't identify it). Any other suggestions whould be appreciated.

----
Scot McIntosh
Internet: psm%helios.nosc.mil@nosc.mil
UUCP:     {ihnp4,akgua,decvax,decwest,ucbvax}!sdscvax!nosc!psm
"It's not a bug, it's a limitation" - Microsoft Tech Assistant
-- 
----
Scot McIntosh
Internet: psm%helios.nosc.mil@nosc.mil
UUCP:     {ihnp4,akgua,decvax,decwest,ucbvax}!sdscvax!nosc!psm
From: J.Crowcroft@cs.ucl.ac.uk (Jon Crowcroft)
Newsgroups: comp.protocols.iso
Subject: Re: was ISO Documents Cause OSI Failure?
Date: 21 Aug 92 08:30:31 GMT


I'm interested in why the whole area of standards is so gothic
anyhow...

most the western world is enganged in a move away from monopolies,
state intervention etc and yet ISO represents one of the most
central repositories for standards around

contrast with the far more distributed approach of de facto standards
(e.g. internet, dare i say...)

i think until proper competition is introduced, and open peer technical
review, and discursive definition of standards as opposed to the
current hierarchical approach and dry post facto presentation style of
most full standard documents...

i know we can put anyone up to attend standards meetyings (and myu
community, UK academics, does) - however, trying to pursuade anyone 
really good from the technical world to go for any length of time 
results in cries of "oh mi gawd, no, anything to avoid that political 
quagmire"

in fact, i believe that the "internatinal standards" in general and "open
systems" in particular have almost exact opposite effects from the
original supposed intentions - 

they result in deliberate obfuscation by any companies with good technical
input in an area, as who wants to subvert their own sales

they result in zero competition where there is a good standard, and
semantic free standards where competition is likely (e.g. just look at
MPEG - deliberately avoids defining strict coding rules, since thats
where different companes will achieve an edge in
performance/quality...ends up underspecifying things...)

as for document availability, i don't object to copyright and so forth 
to protect costs, but there is legal recourse rather than simple
witholding of electronic versions

as for the idea of someone altering a standard spec, well that is a
very amusing idea - i can see a short term malicisous motivation - i
cannot see how changes would persist through any implementation by any
responsible company...

anyhow, there are technical solutions to that (e.g. issueing one way
crypto sums that can be recalculated by people on reciept of document)
- see lots of standards work on integrity and privacy in e-mail, document 
interchange and elctronic funds transfer

i mean to say, can you imagine a bank not connecting to swift on the
grounds that they might get told wrong numbers by another bank - would
last long would they...

or Dire Straits not issding an album on DAT on the grunds someonme
might alter it subtly to make knoppfler sound like he could play
guitar anymore:-)

how about some OPTIMISIM in how to do things, with legal redress for
when it goes wrong later

i spose its too much to ask for - iso is based on levelling
down/lowest common denominator almost by defn.

 jon