HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gordon@siemens.com. (Igor Gordon)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Looking for software to evaluate CMs
Date: 21 Dec 92 22:18:39 GMT




We are in the process of evaluating several CM systems. I am looking for
software (source + [repository] + make files) to be used in the evaluation 
process.

Could anyone point me in the right direction for public domain
software that I could use for my purposes. The desirable characteristics
of such software are, in order of importance:

1. Number of modules (files): 500 -  3000

2. Executables are built using make

3. The software is organized hierarchally (not all files are
   dumped into one directory).

4. Language C/C++ (other languages are ok if public domain
   compilers are avaiable on Sun).

5. Large number of versions per file.

Pointers to any reasonably large piece of software are appriciated, 
even if it does not meet the above criteria.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
I speak only for myself

Igor V. Gordon			tel:   (609) 734-3321
Siemens Corporate Research      fax:   (690) 734-6565
Princeton NJ			email: gordon@siemens.siemens.com



Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: paulg@clsi.COM (Paul Graham)
Subject: Subtype check on RETURN statement
Organization: CAD Language Systems Inc.
Distribution: comp.lang.ada
Date: 22 Dec 92 15:55:57


Why is it that the subtype of a RETURNed expression must match the
return subtype of the containing function, without allowing for an
implicit array subtype conversion?  That is, why are the rules for the
RETURN statement different from the corresponding rules for a variable
assignment?

Paul Graham	(paulg@clsi.com)
--
Paul Graham			(paulg@clsi.com, support@clsi.com)
CAD Language Systems, Inc.	410-992-5700
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: val@news.ccutah.edu (Val Kartchner)
Subject: Re: Lets split comp.lang.ada into multiple groups to confine flames
Organization: University of Utah Computer Center
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL3
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 18:03:19 GMT

In article 62879@mimsy.umd.edu, alex@cs.umd.edu (Alex Blakemore) writes:
>make comp.lang.ada obsolete and create a small set of groups instead.
>
.. comp.lang.advocacy, comp.lang.programmer, comp.lang.announce,
.. comp.lang.misc (all for Ada discussions)

This is definitely an ethnocentric view of programming languages, isn't it?
Or, did you forget the ":-)"?

In <EACHUS.92Dec18133934@oddjob.mitre.org> eachus@oddjob.mitre.org (Robert I. Eachus) writes:
:    If this is becomming a serious proposal, the names should be
: comp.lang.ada.programmer, etc.  However comp.lang.advocacy might be
: more appropriate than having a separate group for each language.  (Of
: course, as soon as this is mentioned in news.groups, the C and C++
: groups will play keep up with the Jones.)

There simply isn't enough volume in the comp.lang.ada group to really
consider this.  Since there is at least twice the volume in each of the
comp.lang.c and comp.lang.c++ groups, it will be sooner justified there
than here.

Nevertheless, the comp.lang.advocacy group does have some merit.  It should
be used when discussions degenerate from simply correction of facts.

mccall@mksol.dseg.ti.com (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
> Sounds good to me.  It would let me read the stuff I want to read
> without having people in each group trying to tell me how "language X
> is better than language Y", and people who WANT to do that could go to
> comp.lang.advocacy.  ...
>...
> [There seem to be fewer of these 'my language is better/your language
> is crap' wars in the C/C++ groups than I've seen in the Ada group.
> Not sure why that is, precisely.]

I could speculate.  Could it be "Napoleon Syndrome"?

Or could it be...
> "Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
>  in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden

--
|============ with disclaimer; use disclaimer; =============///=============|
| If programmers designed languages like Congress passes   /// Weber State  |
| laws, we'd have a language that was mandated. -- Val \\\///   University  |
|============== val@csulx.weber.edu ====================\///= Ogden UT USA =|
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: dtl8v@holmes.acc.Virginia.EDU (Heracleitus)
Subject: Compilers and RTEs
Originator: dtl8v@holmes.acc.Virginia.EDU
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 18:57:56 GMT


  I am currently gathering information on various Ada compilers for
the MC 680x0 platform, and I have not found the compiler-specific
information I have been looking for.  I'd like to see some benchmarks
or receive some project reports on the use of specific compilers and
RTEs (and the corporate support staffs) on projects involving
real-time control, safety-critical programs, and design for
verification and validation.  In specific, I am examining the Tartan
Labs Ada, Verdix Ada, Telesoft Ada, but I would appreciate another
other suggestions.

Doug Lamb
University of Virginia
dtl8v@Virginia.EDU
From: g_harrison@vger.nsu.edu (George C. Harrison, Norfolk State University)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Language Disorders (was Re: FORTRAN, C++, whatever)
Date: 29 Dec 92 18:05:39 EDT


Mike Feldman writes:
> George C. Harrison writes:
>> Mike Feldman writes:
>>> John Bollenbacher writes:
>>>>God, don't you people ever tire of this?
>>>>
>>> I do.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>I do too.  Reminds me of what seventh grade boys do in locker rooms, but I'll
>>not take the analogy beyond that.
>>
> Funny thing, George. Every now and then my wife looks over my shoulder
> when I'm reading this group, and she always chuckles at what she calls
> "typical male pi**ing contests". She is still waiting to see a female
> name on comp.lang.ada (she hasn't lucked into seeing one of Deborah's
> posts).
> 
> Mike

With luck John McCormick (who can't respond) is reading this.  His wife is a
sexual disorder (or something like that)-psychologist.  

If his wife wishes to respond, I'll forward her message on here.  
 
George

Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: pattis@cs.washington.edu (Richard Pattis)
Subject: Re: Visibility
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 92 02:16:55 GMT

In article <1992Dec23.233519.21523@netfs.dnd.ca> BERRYMAN@orca.drep.dnd.ca (DON BERRYMAN) writes:
>
>
>I have a quesiton on Visiblity. The following Ada code
>generates the following error.
>
>
>     package datatypes is
>         subtype widget is integer;
>     end datatypes;
>
>     with datatypes;
>     package testvisibility is
>         function widget (a: integer) return datatypes.widget;
>     end testvisibility;
>

The LRM says in 8.3(16) "every declaration with the same designator" is
hidden. And designators are only identifiers or operator symbols. So it looks
like your designator widget, even when declared in another package and
selected, is still hidden.  There are two notes on this, but both involve
generics

Now, can anyone say why this interpretation "is a good thing".

Rich Pattis


-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Richard E. Pattis                     "Programming languages are like
  Department of Computer Science         pizzas - they come in only "too"
    and Engineering                      sizes: too big and too small."
From: victor@cs.concordia.ca (KRAWCZUK victor)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: POSIX Ada bindings (where can I get them)
Date: 26 Dec 92 14:14:08 GMT
Organization: Computer Science, Concordia University, Montreal, Quebec


Howdy, 

	Can someone please tell me where can I get the latest POSIX
Ada bindings (i.e., P1003.5)?  Is there a place I can ftp them from?

	I have the August 90 draft.  Has P1003.5 changed more than
superficially since then?

	Thanks...



-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
|     Victor Krawczuk   (e-mail : victor@cs.concordia.ca )            |
|     Concordia University, Dept. of Computer Science  (H-961)        | 
|     1455 De Maisonneuve Blvd. W., Montreal, Quebec, Canada, H3G 1M8 | 
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: SAHARBAUGH@ROO.FIT.EDU
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: Ada Readability, Book Reference
Date: 28 Dec 92 13:55:00 GMT
Organization: The Internet

I received one request for a pointer to Bryan & Mendal's
book so I may as well post it (same amount of keystrokes).

Exploring Ada, Volumes 1&2
Douglas L. Bryan and Geoffrey O. Mendal
Prentice Hall
ISBN 0-13-295684-5 V1
ISBN 0-13-297227-1 V2

The book is in LRM order.  Program examples are given
in levels of difficulty.  The levels are:
Novice
Programmer
Designer
Language Lawyer

For many examples the book asks, "What will this
program print?"  For example 7.3.12 the answer is
"The answer to the question is indeterminate."

So I ask "Is Ada readable if you can express an indeterminate
program using it?".

I am gathering my thoughts on "readability" and may
post them later.  This posting is to give the pointer
to the book above.

sam harbaugh
---
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: sparks@baron.uucp (Tim Sparks)
Subject: Re: DoE software reuse as bad as DoD
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1992 23:14:56 GMT

In article <BzGoCF.ECM@world.std.com> srctran@world.std.com (Gregory Aharonian) writes:
>    I often note how ineffectual and wasteful are DoD software reuse policies,
>especially from a private supplier point of view.  To be fair, the DoD
>does no better or worse than other government agencies when it comes to
>creating rational policies for effective reuse of government software and
>its transfer to the private sector.
>
> [ remainder of lengthy article deleted ]

Greg,
  I don't necessarily disagree with most of what you said, but you should
have also included that your statements are based on the premise that all
government agencies live to re-invent the wheel or worse, suffer from the 
Not Invented Here Syndrome(NIHS). In many if not all cases it would be 
economically sound to buy the more expensive version if that is what is 
required because it is cheaper than spending the time and therefore money
to port the "cheaper" code up to the appropriate platform. This is not a
problem that endemic to the government and their contractors. That is a 
problem that the country as a whole is suffering from.

  Or was the premise a given?   8-{)
 
===============================================================================
Ignorance can be tolerated because it  + Tim Sparks 
can be Overcome!                       + Email: jadpc!sparks@trout.nosc.mil
Stupidity on the other hand should     +        sparks@satsys.san.mrms.navy.mil
crushed whenever and wherever          +
encountered.....                  Me   + I may be easy...but I'm not cheap!
===============================================================================
Logical
Intelligent         And Uncle Sam Doesn't want to hear about any LIES!!!
Efficient
Supportable                                                  Also Me  8-{)
===============================================================================
-- 
===============================================================================
Ignorance can be tolerated because it  + Tim Sparks 
can be Overcome!                       + Email: jadpc!sparks@trout.nosc.mil
Stupidity on the other hand should     +        sparks@satsys.san.mrms.navy.mil
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: emery@dr_no.mitre.org (David Emery)
Subject: Re: I/O and the LRM
Organization: The Mitre Corporation, Bedford, MA
	<1992Dec21.182000.25255@aplcen.apl.jhu.edu>
Distribution: usa
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:09:45 GMT

Opening the same external file multiple times within TEXT_IO is
clearly specified as implementation-defined.
				dave
From: mbayern@mlb.win.net (Mark Bayern)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: RE: C++ vs. Ada -- Is Ada loosing?
Date: 23 Dec 92 08:03:47 GMT
Reply-To: mbayern@mlb.win.net (Mark Bayern)
Organization: The Internet
X-Unparsable-Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 9:34.1.52

Jack Beidler writes:

>> ... Practically all of the posting are missing the "real"
>> reason. It has to do with economic considerations (read
>> my company wants to make more money).

I'm afraid you're absolutely correct! But you don't have to look
into the update cycle to see Ada's commercial problems.  Look at the
original cost of getting the language.  Want to use C in your
embedded 80x86? Both MSC and TurboC list for (much) less than
$1000.  That and a little work and you're up and running.  Ada? How
about $25,000 for a license, and $5,000 for the _required_ first
year 'support'! 

If I choose to use C I've invested less than $1000 in software,
instead of $30,000.  I've also invested a little work in porting
the C runtime startup code to the embedded system, but during that
time the team has been learning the details of the hardware.  Plus
the money is spent locally on labor, instead of spent to some large
Ada firm.

(Hmmm... now I'm having problems remembering why I choose Ada for my
commercial products.  Oh yeah! It had something to do with
validated compilers and run-times that wouldn't have any bugs or
support problems, silly me!).

Mark
 

Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: varner@saifr00.cfsat.honeywell.com (Sue Varner)
Subject: compilers for i386/i486
Organization: Honeywell Air Transport Systems Division
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 19:43:16 GMT


I am interested in Ada compilers for the Intel 386 or 486 running under
Unix (especially VentureCom Venix).  Prices, addresses, phone numbers,
recommendations would be greatly appreciated.  Is there some central list
like a FAQ that may ennumerate available compilers for various platforms?

Reply by e-mail if possible. ->varner@saifr00.cfsat.honeywell.com
    
 Thanks in advance.
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: herkusut@amiga.physik.unizh.ch (Herdarmadhi Kuswandito Utomo)
Subject: Please send me Fractal code 
Organization: ICU - University of Zurich, Dept. of Computer Science
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL8]
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 19:20:27 GMT

Hi Friends

Could you please send me some nice Fractals code. I have write also 
4 fractals like Orbits, farn, ahorn and triangles. Im still learning
and trying to find out the nice side of ADA Programming with graph.
I used here compiler from miridian.

For all your help i thank you so much

Iwan alias

ia92herd@htl02.htl-bw.ch
herkusut@amiga.physik.unizh.ch

Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: james@cfmu.eurocontrol.be (James Henderson)
Subject: Ada Logo Poster
Originator: james@finch
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 92 13:13:54 GMT
Organization: Eurocontrol - Central Flow Management Unit

 I used to have an Ada (wall) poster containing the Logos of all companies 
 currently vending Ada compilers. I would like to get an updated version of
 it for my wall!

 If anyone could mail me the address of the American company who produces it,
 I would be obliged. Alternatively, post it on the News if it might be of more
 general interest.

 Thanks in advance!
From: SAHARBAUGH@ROO.FIT.EDU
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: NCOSE, Invitation to Join
Date: 30 Dec 92 20:59:00 GMT
Organization: The Internet

Dear Bulletin Board Readers,

	I know that all of you are interested in seeing that the systems we 
build are a success.  Systems engineering is essential to system success. 
Traditionally, systems engineers start their careers as specialty engineers 
and then switch to systems engineering.  There is a need for Software 
Engineers to become Systems Engineers.  The emerging DOD-STD-SDD 
(slated to replace DOD-STD-2167A) admits the case where the system is 
mostly software and requires system engineering activities and products for 
this case.  I ask any readers who are now performing systems engineering 
or who are thinking of performing systems engineering to consider joining 
NCOSE.

	Note that one of the four tracks for Tri-Ada '93 technical program is 
"Systems Engineering, Process, and Integration"

sam harbaugh
---

NCOSE - National Council on Systems Engineering

NCOSE was created in 1990 by individuals at General Dynamics and 
Boeing to address the need to have a forum for discussion of systems 
engineering issues, to improve the practice of systems engineering, and to 
create a national voice for systems engineering.  It has grown to over 800 
members nationwide and has held two national symposia.

For more information contact:
Bernard G. Morais (Barney), Treasurer
Suite 107
333 Cobalt Way
Sunnyvale, CA 94086

NCOSE - National Council on Systems Engineering
Third Annual Symposium 
Arlington, VA
July 26-28, 1993

------------

NCOSE - Space Coast Chapter

In August the Space Coast Chapter of NCOSE was formed at a meeting 
attended by 33 people from prominent local companies. 

For more information contact:
Eric Honour, President (407) 242-5192, harris.ehonour@ic1d.harris.com
Sam Harbaugh, Chairman of Membership Committee (407) 984-1986, 
saharbaugh@roo.fit.edu

Space Coast Meetings (Just show up, no need to be a member)

January Meeting (US Citizens Only)
Tuesday, January 5th
MIC Auditorium
Harris Space Systems
295 Barnes Blvd.
Rockledge, Florida
7:30 - 9:00 PM

The speaker will be Gary Natwick of Harris Space Systems, speaking on 
the topic:  SEI Model:Threat/Opportunity?


February Meeting
Tuesday, February 9th
Gannett Plaza Community Room
U. S. 1 South
Rockledge, FL
7:30 - 9:00 PM

topic:  Systems Engineering of a Reusable Spacecraft

p.s. dues are $60.00 per year
--- end of posting 
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: sampson@nosc.mil (Charles H. Sampson)
Subject: Re: C++ vs. Ada -- Is Ada loosing?
Organization: Computer Sciences Corporation
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1992 16:11:50 GMT

In article <withrow.13.0@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov> withrow@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (Jim Withrow) writes:

>If I did not work on a project which REQUIRED the use of embedded Ada, I 
>don't think I would have purchased that 30K cross compiler from Alsys.  I 
>see no justification for the high cost of that compiler.  (That cost 6x more 
>than the cost of the 486/DX2-66 computer you use to work on the project!)  
>Imagine if you had 4 people working on the project, you would need 48K for
>the four compilers, for just the first year!

     While I can't defend Alsys's specific prices without more information,
one justification for the high cost of a compiler for a naked machine is
that the vendor has had to develop an entire executive (rather than tying
into an existing DOS or UNIX) and must amortize that cost over a small
customer base.  Basically, the high cost is for the RTE and the cross-
compiling utilities, not for the compiler itself.

				Charlie
From: michael.hagerty@nitelog.com (Michael Hagerty) 
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Subject: DoE software reuse as bad as DoD
Date: 21 Dec 92 22:24:00 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Nitelog BBS - Monterey, CA - 408-655-1096
Reply-To: michael.hagerty@nitelog.com (Michael Hagerty) 


On 12-21-92, GREGORY AHARONIAN wrote to ALL:

GA> Why is this a bad pricing structure?  First, most DoE codes are in
GA> Fortran, and most scientists and engineers are used to porting such
GA> codes across platforms with ease, which for supercomputers is helped by
GA> tools from the manufacturer.  Thus to save money, I would buy the
GA> personal computer version and port it myself, given the very high
GA> markups for the non-personal computer versions.  Thus if there is any
GA> economic need by the DoE center to charge high prices to recoup or
GA> cover some support cost, it is undermined by the market.

I believe that DOE is merely aping what every vendor in the country does
already: base the cost of the software on the perceived cost of the hard
ware on which it is to be run.  Note the difference in cost of compilers
for PCs, workstations, minis and mainframes.  I've heard justifications
ad nauseum from vendors for this structuring and they all sound equally
foolish.

Regards, Mikey (michael.hagerty@nitelog.com)

 * JABBER v1.3B1 #B042 * Include this in your CONFIG.SYS File: SET BUGS=OFF
                                                                                                                                  
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: ncohen@watson.ibm.com (Norman H. Cohen;355589)
Subject: Re: VALUE and IMAGE operations for FLOAT
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 14:45:55 GMT
Reply-To: ncohen@watson.ibm.com
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM
Organization: IBM T.J. Watson Research Center
Keywords: Type Conversion VALUE IMAGE FLOAT

In article <1h9j75INNs2i@rave.larc.nasa.gov>, matthias@nimbus.larc.nasa.gov
(Larry Matthias) writes: 

|>      I am interested in finding a software reuseable package that
|> performs the equivalent VALUE and IMAGE operations but for the FLOAT
|> type. I saw that Grady Booch has a package in his "Software Components
|> with Ada" that supports this in the package Floating_Point_Utilities.
|> However, only the package specification is included in the book. You
|> must send away for the implementation.
|>
|>      Where can you get these package? How much are they (remember
|> the deficit)?

Here's a solution that even those on a government budget can afford: 

Instantiate Text_IO.Float_IO.  Use the string-to-float version of Get to
write your own Value function (or use Get directly if that solves your
problem).  Use the float-to-string version of Put write your own Image
function (or use Put directly).

Your compiler maker has already done the hard work by providing these
procedures.

--
Norman H. Cohen    ncohen@watson.ibm.com
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: maysee@ss1.af.mil (Eric E. Mays)
Subject: Re: Meridian phone number wanted
Reply-To: $HOME@ss2.sews.wpafb.af.mil
Organization: U.S. Air Force
Distribution: comp.lang.ada
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 15:29:22 GMT

In article <LARRY.92Dec17123313@peak.nmsu.edu>, larry@peak.nmsu.edu (Evil Engineer doin' it the Cowboy Way) writes:
|> I'm wanting a current phone number for Meridian. Can anyone help me?
|> 
|> Thanking you in advance,
|> 
|> L.
|> "Yeh, Buddy..            | larry@psl.nmsu.edu (Larry Cunningham)|  _~~_
|>  I've got your COMPUTER! | % Physical Science Laboratory        | (O)(-)
|>  Right HERE!!"           | New Mexico State University          |  /..\ 
|>  (computer THIS!)        | Las Cruces, New Mexico, USA 88003    |   <> 
|> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
|> Disclaimer: Opinions expressed here are CORRECT, mine, and not PSLs or NMSUs..
|> Tularosa: tullies, roses, lava, white sands, and home of THEM! (atomic ants).
|> 
|> 

Larry,

  Meridian Software Systems
  Mr Jim Smith
  (800) 221-2522

Eric
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
From: eachus@oddjob.mitre.org (Robert I. Eachus)
Subject: Re: Visibility
Organization: The Mitre Corp., Bedford, MA.
	<1992Dec24.021655.22555@beaver.cs.washington.edu>
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 21:08:54 GMT

In article <1992Dec24.021655.22555@beaver.cs.washington.edu> pattis@cs.washington.edu (Richard Pattis) writes:

   Now, can anyone say why this interpretation "is a good thing".

   Sure.  First of all the restriction in 8.2(16) only applies to the
use of a name within a subprogram with the same simple name.  The rule
is there so that there is no need to do (potentially circular)
overload resolution of a name which may be affected by the current
declaration before the parameter and result type profile of the
declaration itself can be resolved.  Second any simple name which
which matches would be illegal for other reasons, so the only
"overgenerality" that the rule could be accused of is in exactly this
case.  But--you still need to do (potentially circular) overload
resolution to determine whether or not this name is legal:

    procedure P is
      type Q is new Integer;
      function P return Integer is
        function Q return P.Q is...

   (Please no responses on the other rules which come into play here.
I know that beacuse of 4.1.3(18), this simple case is alway ambiguous.)

   So the intent of the rule is to allow an implementation not to put
function Q into the overload resolution database until the whole
declaration is resolved, and the minimum restriction possible is as
written.

--

					Robert I. Eachus

with Standard_Disclaimer;
use  Standard_Disclaimer;
function Message (Text: in Clever_Ideas) return Better_Ideas is...
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada