HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lncjb@cc.newcastle.edu.au
Subject: Re: Female "Circumcision"
Organization: University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 12:18:04 GMT

In article <1992Sep29.025045.4889@nuscc.nus.sg>, isc40041@nusunix1.nus.sg (LOO KOK HOE) writes:
> David Wales (wales@ringss.enet.dec.com) wrote:
> : 
> : G'Day,
> : 
> : 	Recently in Australia a Malaysian prince fled back to Malaysia with
> : two children that were staying with their mother in Australia, one a boy, the
> : other a girl.  One of the mother's real concerns was that her daughter would
> : be circumsised.  From the reports that I heard on the radio this was quite a
> : possibility.
> 
> Good Day !
> 
> Well David ... u should know when Love ended, Hell come loose!
> Let imagine u are in the lady's situation ...
> 
> u & ur husband is separating ... both of u want the children ...
> so both of u go to court ... the judge's decision is based on
> who is most suitable for the children ....
> 
> Now, that prince is rich, he can provide endless care, love,
> shelter, food , future educational opportunity, ...

An Australian court awarded custody of the children to the mother. I believe
that they were born here and had lived most of their lives in Australia. The
Prince not satisfied with our justice system decided to come back here from
Malaysia with the sole aim of abducting his children and smuggling them back
to his country where he knew the wife would have a difficult time trying to
get them back. The Australian government is currently trying to negotiate the 
return of the children on the mother's behalf with Malaysian officials.
 
> Well, u can see he has an upper hand ...

Only because he flouted another country's laws. I suspect that since he didn't
attempt the abduction until after his ex-wife had remarried, his motive was
jealousy rather than any ' great love' for his children. There was nothing
impoverished about the standard of living that the mother was able to provide
and I doubt that the Prince could provide those children with as much endless
care (of the personal kind), love, shelter, food, future educational 
opportunity than they would get here.
 
> One more thing which I am not sure whether u people there
> are awared of ... presently the Malaysian & Austrialian governments
> are entering into a 'cold war' ... the reason is the former accuses
> the news medias in Australia for giving a very negative picture
> of the country & the Austrialian government is not doing very much
> to rectify the problem ...  so the news u heard may be only a
> biased version of the whole story .... so beware !

That applies to every countries news media...anything for a 'good' story.
No country likes to see it's 'dirty linen aired in public' but the coverage
that this situation has received on the Australian news media since the
children first went 'missing' including videotaped interviews with the
Prince and the children in Malaysia to get there side of the story has made
it less of a biased version than we might have expected under the
circumstances. 

Did this story get any air-time on Malaysian TV, George?

Carolyn
From: judyd@aspen.CNA.TEK.COM (Judy E. Drake)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Heart Murmur in Infants
Date: 29 Sep 92 18:19:58 GMT
Article-I.D.: master.3672
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Redmond,  OR.

In article <16612@pitt.UUCP> pollack@cs.pitt.edu (Martha E. Pollack) writes:
>When my daughter (now 4-1/2 years old) was an infant, her pediatrician
>also discovered a heart murmur and sent us to a cardiologist to have
>it checked...

I have a heart murmur, called mitral valve prolapse.  I don't know how
long I've had it, but I first found out about it 10 years ago when I was 
seeing a doctor for something and he said, "Has anyone ever told you you 
have a heart murmur?"

A couple of months ago, I was at the doctor's office for something else,
and she told me my murmur was rather loud.  She recommended I get an
ultrasound to determine just how leaky my mitral valve is.  If it leaks
too much, they like to give you prophylactic antibiotics before dental
work or surgery, because the leak makes it more likely for an infection
to settle in the valve.

So I had an ultrasound, which was really interesting.  I could see the
various chambers of my heart pumping away, and the blood shooting around
in there.  I saw the mitral valve and the jet coming out of it, too.  It
turned out that my valve isn't very leaky, so I don't have to worry 
about it, which was good to know.

Mitral valve prolapse is very common, I think particularly among women, 
if I recall correctly.  Most of the time it's harmless, as in my case.

As far as heart murmurs in infants go, I think they're also pretty
common.  A friend of mine has a daughter with a heart murmur, and her
aunt happens to be a pediatric cardiologist.  The cardiologist told my
friend that kids often grow out of their heart murmurs, and the murmurs
are not consistent, i.e., they may not always be audible, and they can
be louder if the child is sick.  Hope this helps a little.

Judy Drake
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: johniac@johniac.austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Subject: Re: YEA, Baby #3 ... Midwife Info
Date: Fri, 02 Oct 92 23:48:48 GMT
Distribution: usa
Reply-To: johniac@austin.ibm.com (John Iacoletti)
Organization: IBM Advanced Workstation Division, Austin, TX

In article <1992Sep30.213826.2575@asl.dl.nec.com>, jackie@ssdss3.asl.dl.nec.com (technicalwriter) writes:
|> Texas midwives do not carry pain medication, other than tylenol, no
|> forceps or other such instruments of torture.  We rely on natural
|> remedies for our mothers.  If mom is tense, we don't give her
|> demerol (sp.), we put her in the bath tub.  If mom is tired, we
|> don't induce the labor, we let her sleep.  If mom wants friends at
|> the labor, we don't say "hospital rules say you can have only one
|> support person at the birth", we say "have whoever at the birth who
|> makes you feel happy and comfortable."  

And midwifes don't typically starve and dehydrate the poor woman for
her entire labor either.  Talk about setting you up for intervention!

-- 
John Iacoletti       IBM AWD Austin       Internet: johniac@austin.ibm.com
        My opinions do not reflect the views of the IBM Corporation
"It takes a big man to cry.  And it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man."
                                                              -- Jack Handey
Xref: sparky misc.kids:25099 misc.education:3547 k12.chat.teacher:4056 sci.med:18469 chi.general:1231
From: mcovingt@aisun3.ai.uga.edu (Michael Covington)
Newsgroups: misc.kids,misc.education,k12.chat.teacher,sci.med,chi.general
Subject: Re: Attention Deficit Disorder Resources
Date: 5 Oct 92 15:18:15 GMT
Organization: AI Program, University of Georgia, Athens


Re "refusing to administer Ritalin":  if you are convinced the child has
a chemical brain abnormality, why _not_ administer a drug that will
correct it?  If he were diabetic would you refuse to give him insulin?

Instead you are depriving him of a couple of years of normal education,
at least.  That is worse than the side effects of the drug.

But you are right that the "open classroom" does not at all suit people
who need to be trained to have a longer attention span.  Attention span
can be increased with training, to some extent -- I've done that to
myself (or graduate school did it to me).
-- 
:- Michael A. Covington     internet mcovingt@uga.cc.uga.edu 
:- Artificial Intelligence Programs       phone 706 542-0359
:- The University of Georgia                fax 706 542-0349
:- Athens, Georgia 30602 U.S.A.          amateur radio N4TMI
From: nola@cats.ucsc.edu (Nola Van Vugt)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: How to get son more career-minded? :-) :-)
Date: 29 Sep 1992 18:44:10 GMT
Organization: University of California; Santa Cruz
NNTP-Posting-Host: am.ucsc.edu


In article <BvCqFx.JpK@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> af5@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Wendy Lin) writes:
>My seven year old son told me the other morning when he was going out of
>the door for school that "I am going to stay home with my children when
>I grow up."  I asked him "Who is going to make money then?"  He replied
>"My wife."
>
>
>So far his most serious career goal was to become a computer game writer.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
So, am I the only person on the net who thinks that staying home with
his kids has more value than writing computer games for a living????
The little voice inside me that keeps saying I made a very poor career
choice for myself this time around keeps growing louder and louder....
-nvv


Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: ooblick@intercon.com (Mikki Barry)
Subject: Re: East Bay Regional Parks/dog restrictions
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 92 18:44:06 GMT
Reply-To: ooblick@intercon.com (Mikki Barry)
Organization: InterCon Systems Corporation, Herndon, VA

In article <6741@transfer.stratus.com>, leadfoot@bigbootay.sw.stratus.com 
(Mark Curtis) writes:
> |> A parent's negligence does not absolve a third party who had a last 
chance
> |> to prevent a child from coming to harm. If a child gets hurt or killed,
> |> there will be plenty of liability to spread around.
> 
> It's your child, how many times do you need to be told that?  Maybe I'll 
come
> over and borrow him for awhile.  I feel the need to throw a hay ride and I
> need some children to complete the picture.  If you're going to borrow my
> liabiliy, time, and force me to be responsible for him I should have rights.
> If I have no rights to effect your childs behaviour then why should I be
> responsible for their actions.  It just isn't reasonable.

To address the liability issue for a minute, the "last clear chance" doctrine 
(which I think was attempted to be invoked here by the poster above Mark) in 
most jurisdictions does not apply to protection of children.  There is, in 
the law, no duty to rescue unless your actions put the person in danger in 
the first place.  

If your child is running around the park and I know about quicksand 10 feet 
away, I have no legal duty to try to stop the kid.  But if I've thrown the 
kid in that quicksand, then I certainly do have a legal duty.  

On the other hand, if the child gets hurt in my house, depending on the 
state's laws, I might very well be responsible, and whether or not I 
ultimately wind up legally responsible chances are I'll get sued over it 
anyway causing a major pain in the neck and a bank account drain.

Litigation in this country has caused LOTS of people to want to avoid 
anything that even smells like a lawsuit.  And, unfortunately, kids are one 
of those categories over which lots and lots of silly lawsuits are brought.  
That oftentimes would cause people who have nothing against your kid to run 
like crazy when a 2 year old comes toddling over in a public area.

We should all be responsible for our own.

---------
Note, the above is not legal advice, ok?  I hate lawsuits too!
From: oispeggy@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Peggy Brown)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: addressing of a step-parent
Date: 28 Sep 92 20:00:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <37204@uflorida.cis.ufl.edu>, mariou@astro.astro.ufl.edu (STG colleague) writes...
>In article <holly.221@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com> holly@mailhub.scf.lmsc.lockheed.com (Holly Wise) writes:
>>In article <Buzs0A.EBu@acsu.buffalo.edu> oispeggy@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Peggy Brown) writes:
>>
> 
>>> Too bad you have a hang-up 
>>>about her using your first name.  
> 
>I already answered this, I am not sure it is *bad*.
> 
>Different nationalities different customs. I am as happy with
>my ways as you are with yours.

Then why did you post asking for advice?

One reply I read suggested "Aunt."  Sounded good to me.

- Peggy -
Newsgroups: misc.kids,alt.sex
From: mpevans@nyx.cs.du.edu (Mark Evans)
Subject: Re: Female "Circumcision"
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 92 10:23:31 GMT

nadja@jetsun.weitek.COM (Nadja Adolf) writes:

>In article <1992Sep28.180113.4039@nwnexus.WA.COM> elf@halcyon.com (Elf Sternberg) writes:

>PLEASE - don't donate to UNICEF until they agree to stop performing this
>procedure in their childrens' hospitals. By 'medicalizing' the practice,
>it is given greater legitimacy. The operation is also frequent in the

Which is exactly what the AMA did for male circumcision in the USA.

>Phillipines. If you have ever watched an infibulated woman walk - she takes
>narrow, tight little steps since the band of tissue grabs and pulls 
>and causes pain with every long step. Watching the Egyptian women's 
>karate team is a revelation - they use very short kicks. It isn't funny.

> 

Anyone know why UNICEF are doing this, suggest that they be had up
for misuse of funds if they are?
From: lcheap@cac.washington.edu (Laurel Cheap {IS})
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: baby backpacks
Date: 1 Oct 92 19:24:53 GMT
Article-I.D.: u.1992Oct1.192453.14717
Organization: UW Computing

In article <IBE1109.92Sep30145430@etbsun1.draper.com> ibe1109@draper.com (Ira Ekhaus) writes:
>
>Are there any success stories out there that involve proper
>adjustment or a different brand  of babypack?

Although it was more expensive, we bought a Tough Traveler
backpack.  It easily adjusts between my husband's 6' frame and 
my 5'2" fame by tightening/loosening 3 straps (2 shoulder and
the hip belt).  We bought this model because it has a regular
backpack frame which we thought was necessary since we were going
to hike with our son who is growing like Clifford the Big Red Dog.
(at 12 months: 29 lbs)  We've definitely gotten our money's worth
since we both use it for going for walks, shopping and hiking.

We have a hand-me-down Gerry pack without a hip belt that we used
for a while until Brendan got too heavy to carry on our shoulders.
I've never used an adjustable other than the TT mentioned above.

Good luck,
Laurel
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Laurel Cheap           University of Washington   lcheap@u.washington.edu
Information Systems    Seattle, Washington  USA   a.k.a. Brendan's mommy
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: misc.kids
From: scott@megadata.mega.oz.au (Scott Humphreys)
Subject: Female "Circumcision" - TV exposure
Summary: OK to do it in OZ - TV soapie exposure
Organization: Megadata P/L, North Ryde, Sydney, Aust.
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 07:27:30 GMT


This subject is being raised on a popular doctor-like soapie
tonight - this is still legal in Oz (circumcision, not soapies).
For me, I only found out about it thru this thread - quite a coincidence.
The doctor, from the promo, has to wrestle with the choice
between doing what is requested or letting some non-professional
doing a butcher's job on the girl.

If anything relevant comes out of the show.... stay tuned
for the next exciting installment !?!
-- 
Dad to Jill (6), Hugh (4), Rhett (2), ? (find out in Dec).
email:  scott@megadata.mega.oz.au |        /\          _/_ _/_ 
fax:    (Int'l +61) (02) 887-4847 |       /  )  _. ____/   /   
voice:  (Int'l +61) (02) 805-0899 |      /__/__(__(_) (___<__
From: biddleco@mizar.usc.edu (Susan Biddlecomb)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: Names - nicknames
Date: 28 Sep 1992 09:44:21 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: mizar.usc.edu


We chose the first name Angelica for our daughter because it gave her a choice
of a couple of nicknames. We had planned on calling her "Jelly" (or "Geli" for
a more sophisticated spelling), which her paternal grandmother abhored. But
in her attempts to prounounce her name, Angelica came up with her own
nickname -- Nut Nut (her first attempts to pronounce Angelica came out
Ah-NUT-nut). Anyway, it's cute, it stuck, she likes it and her paternal
grandmother REALLY hates it. She only uses it at home, when at daycare or
out in public she always calls herself "Angelica" to other people.

And to make her grandmother even more livid, Angelica has begun pronouncing
her last name (which is Bongiovonni) as Bouncy-Bouncy. So if you ask her
name at home, she'll say "I'm NUT-nut bouncy-BOUNCY!" It's mighty cute.
Fortunately her grandmother lives 3,000 miles away ....
From: leeba@mot.com (Leeba Salzman)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: table corner guards??
Date: 5 Oct 92 16:37:30 GMT
Reply-To: leeba@mcil.comm.mot.com
Organization: Motorola Communications Israel Ltd., Tel Aviv

>> >I have heard that they make some sort of cover or guard that you can put
>> >on sharp table corners etc so little toddlers do not whap their heads.
>> >What are these things called?  Does anyone know where
>
>without marks.  We finally gave up and have had no problems.  What have 
>other people done?  I would call The First Years, but I've already 

We simply don't use a coffee table!  There is one in the corner of the
room, but the center of the living room is just empty space for the kids
to roll around on.
From: julie@ucrmath.ucr.edu (julie martin)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Need Advice:  Sheltie puppy for son's 3rd birthday
Date: 30 Sep 92 16:09:29 GMT
Organization: University of California, Riverside

I have been looking for a puppy for our son Michael who will
be "this many" (3 fingers up with two held down with other hand)
on Monday, October 5.  We wanted a collie but decided on a sheltie
because they are said to be just as sweet, and come in a more compact
package.  (Our home is super small and so is our budget).  Plus I
wanted an inside dog that can sleep on the bed, go bye-bye in the
car (also small), go for walks in the wagon or stroller, etc.
Well, I found this cute little male sheltie puppy at the animal
shelter last Saturday.  They said that we cannot have him until
tomorrow, October 1, because they hold strays for 5 days to give
owners time to contact them.  He is 9 weeks old, adorable, and looks
to be in good health.  (My guess is that he was part of a litter and
the owners are probably just hoping that someone has picked him up
and given him a good home.  He didn't have any identification or
collar on him when the humane society picked him up).  Anyway, I've
been calling every day and have gone by twice to say hi to him and
am going out there again tonight after work.  So far, no one has
come to claim him.

I started thinking that I might be jumping the gun.  Aren't shelties
supposed to be good with children?  I have heard that female dogs are more
tolerant than males but I really want to give this little guy a
home.  My son Michael is a sweetheart.  He can be VERY rambunctious and
wild, but he is also very, very gentle and kind.  He is very good with
babies; he likes to love on them gently and make sure they are comfortable...
it's very sweet to watch.  Animal wise - he seems to love all
the creatures he has come in contact with, with one exception ....
spiders (baajoots, he calls them, with a shiver).  He hasn't had
alot of experience being around dogs or puppies, but I really think
he would fair very well being involved in raising a puppy to doghood,
and having a good buddy to get into mischief with.  (I'd kinda like to
have one too.  I grew up with scotties and miss having a house dog).

Anyone out there have a male sheltie that plays with little ones?  

Any and all advice is welcome, by post or email.  Please hurry, time
is short.

Thanks very much!
--Julie

P.S.  He may or may not be a "pure-bred" sheltie.  If he is 
      mixed with anything, it must be very small.  His paws are
      very petite and small boned.
Newsgroups: misc.kids,misc.education,k12.chat.teacher,sci.med,chi.general
From: ltc2h@curry.edschool.Virginia.EDU (Lan Thingoc Cao)
Subject: Re: Attention Deficit Disorder Resources
Organization: University of Virginia
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 04:23:00 GMT

learn@speedy.acns.nwu.edu  writes:
> In article <1992Oct1.130847.7837@ll.mit.edu> Alan Yasutovich writes:
> 
> >	"ADD" is a falacy.  The majority if not all kids/people
> >	with this type of behaviour/attention "disorder" is due
> >	to allergic/sensitivity reactions to various foods and
> >	things in their environment.
> 
> I'm so glad you have the answers for "the majority" when an entire
> medical community is still working on it. Should we stand and salute
> your grand wisdom now or later?
> 
> >	Prescribing something like Ritalin for "ADD", is like
> >	taking "downers" to counteract the "uppers" you just took.
> 
> Ritalin works reasonably well in a very large population of children
> afflicted with hyperactivity and some fellow travelers. I don't like the
> idea of ritalin, but it is a realtively older medication and often gives
> immediate relief to the symptoms. There are newer medications with few
> side effects, including some strongly opposed by the Church of Scientology.
> 
> Are you, Alan, a member of that organization by any chance????
> 
> 
> Bill Vajk
Dear Holly,
	I am a student at the University of Virginia studying
to be a Special Ed. Teacher.  In one of my class today, we
discussed the causes and behaviors of ADD children.  We had
people debating on whether Ritalin or special dieting really
help or not.  Your article have definitely given me new insights
and provoked my curiosity about ADD even more.
	If at all possible, please send me more info about
yourself and how you are coping with ADD.  Have you experienced
any side-effects from the medication?  I would love to learn
more about this from someone with first hand experience!
	Thanks for your time.  My e-mail is ltc2h.@Virginia.edu
or you can reach me through mail or phone:
	Lan Cao
	U.V.A.
	455-5 Lambeth Field Apt.
	Charlottesville, Va. 22904-0032
	(804) 979-6225
Hope to hear from you soon.  Good bye and God Bless!

Lan
From: kassover@rumsey.crd.ge.com (David Kassover)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Re: 92 Re: Names (don't do this to your kids)
Date: 6 Oct 92 21:10:36 GMT
Article-I.D.: crd.1992Oct6.211036.10679
Organization: nope

In article <1992Oct3.014359.21768@schbbs.mot.com> RMNL69@paccvm.corp.mot.com (Les Aquino) writes:
>------------------------- Original Article -------------------------
>Well, I've seen the names-Major Major, who of course, was a Major.

Ah, I believe that was Major Major Major, who was promoted from
lieutenant through Captain in record time.  Needless to say,
Major Major Major Major had not the slightest chance of a making Colonel.

If I recall correctly, Major's father told his mother that he had
the boy named "Caleb", in accordance with his mother's wishes.
Said mother then died happily from childbirth complications.

And now on to real life:

I have an associate, whose name is something like Richards, who
married a guy whose name is something like Vogel, and
subsequently embarked on a campaign to get all of her paperwork
changed to her chosen hyphenated form.

This new moniker is apparently too large for some bureaucrat's
minds, so I suggested a diminutive.  Unfortunately, "Dickybird"
was not well received...

-- 
David Kassover             "Proper technique helps protect you against
uupsi!khazad!kassover	          sharp weapons and dull judges."
kassover@aule-tek.com                   F. Collins
kassover@ra.crd.ge.com
From: scooter@hirgon.hw.stratus.com (Scott Jeffrey)
Newsgroups: misc.kids
Subject: Cute things they say [3.5]
Date: 5 Oct 92 18:00:37 GMT
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.

This happened the other night.  The cast consists of me and son John.

John: Knock, knock.

Me: Who's there?

J: iouvhbipun (or whatever; he's been into making up nonsense words lately).

M: iouvhbipun who?

J: Aren't you glad I didn't say banana?


scooter


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+  scooter@hirgon.hw.stratus.com                  Flat Flip Flies Straight  +
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