HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: C580503@mizzou1.missouri.edu (Albert Foo)
Subject: Immigrants Problem (Re: MY: Think Malaysian, ...
Organization: University of Missouri
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 20:33:27 GMT

Since we on the topic of "bumi" and "non-bumi", how do the Malaysian
govt. classify the imigrants who reside in Malaysia?  Take for example
the vast population of Indonesian immigrants who had assimilated into
the Malaysian culture, adopted Malay names, etc., but DO NOT practise
Islam.
 
Do they get the "special priviledge"  too (assume they are citizens with
blue ID card) ?  What about their children (assume they are natural-
born in Malaysia) ?  If the answer is "yes", now, compare that with the
chinese or indians or whatever races who have been in Malaysia for many
generations,  who do not have the "special priviledge".  Now, the question
of fairness has to be asked by many rightful citizen of Malaysia, isn't it?
 
Any comments?
 
Albert Foo
Biometric Computer Consultant
Dept. of Wildlife and Fisheries
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: subraman@andy.bgsu.edu (ANAND)
Subject: Re: MY: Think Malaysian, not Malay, Chinese, Indian.
Organization: Bowling Green State University B.G., Oh.
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 15:50:48 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.085032.11464@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg>, eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:

> Anywhere you are, you must work hard to get rich, and this includes bumis as
> well. The fact is, the chinese and indians are the richer groups of people in
> Malaysia.

  Where did you get this fact from?????

> 	Strange, there is none in the constitution of Malaysia which states
> that a non-bumi cannot be the prime minister. They may not be the agong,
> but the agong is only ceremonial.
> 	You claim to be a Malaysian and yet you do not know Malaysian 
> constitution.

  Oh ya!  Maybe you should go and take a second look at the Malaysian
   constitution..

> 	Maybe Malaysia should have asked those who got their citizenship
> by being in Malaysia in 1963 to take tests on the Malaysian constitution.

   Maybe you should take an I.Q. test before you start posting replies without
   verifying your facts.
   
> Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,
From: sulistio@sutro.SFSU.EDU (Sulistio Muljadi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: All Indonesians everywhere in this world please c
Date: 5 Nov 92 23:26:40 GMT
Organization: San Francisco State University

Well, there is a new newsgroup for Indonesia, called alt.culture.indonesia
its now filled w/ Portugese posts about East Timor...  If u are going to read
that newsgroup, please dont respond to those Portugese posts...  Its an
infinite loop discussiioon...  better spend time for something else...

Other mailing lists for Indonesian:
indonesians@janus.berkeley.edu    

PBDLIST@suvm.bitnet

-- 
Mul			    |  Alt. address: sulistio@sutro.sfsu.edu
sulistio@futon.sfsu.edu	    |		     sulistio@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu
#include "std/disclaimer.h" | NeXTmail ->    sarong!sulistio@cs.sfsu.edu 
>Genius is one per cent inspiration and ninety-nine per cent perspiration.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: psyctwo1@cc.newcastle.edu.au (PSYCTWO1)
Subject: Re: Malaysia's racial policies
Organization: University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 06:43:41 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.011946.1282@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg>, eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:
> everybody. NO, ONLY deserving ones, that is those who cannot afford. The fact
> that there are more non-bumis overseas students show that they can afford it
> more than the bumis. Figures do not lie. You blatantly lie.

Staying with Malaysian O'sea's students, they tell me that they are out here
because they couldn't get into a local university.  Some of them have hardly
any cash, and I know of one who signed an agreement with the Australian
Government not to return to Aus. for at least two years, if he had an Aus.
Gov. loan.  In fact, I have yet to meet a Malay 'Bumi' student.

Fal...c9110499@brolga.newcastle.edu.au
From: fajack@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Malaysia's racial policies
Date: 10 Nov 92 14:16:26 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In article <1992Nov10.185510.10956@leland.Stanford.EDU>, azran@leland.Stanford.EDU (Azran Osman Rani) writes:
> 
> I have but one more thing to say to this flea circus of a newsgroup.
> 
> Ok, I can't and won't speak for other Malays but I can say that I for
> one think that it absolutely sucks to receive these so-called 'special
> priviledges'. Makes me feel like a handicapped invalid. Does anyone
> actually think that, well, since I can't speak for all Malays, I *like*
> to have these special privileges given to me? When I talk of these
> privileges, pride is the last thing that comes to mind.
> Its not the best feeling to have all my achievements belittled by
> people saying things like "Well, the only reason you managed to do that
> is because you have all these priviledges and advantages."
> 
> Does anyone think its cool to be labelled "bangsa subsidi", to belong
> to a group that allegedly cannot achieve anything significant without
> gov't assistance??? How about having adjectives like "helpless", "pathetic";
> "unproductive", "slow" be associated to your group of people???
> Hey, I'd like to get out of this mess as soon as any of you want to.
> 
> I realize that the implementation of the NEP and the "special priviledges"
> hasn't been in the fairest and smoothest sense. But from
> what I see it, without the NEP, I don't think my friends and family might
> be able to move up, out of our kampungs. I probably might not have
> all these educational opportunities given to me. 
> Its not the most perfect system but this is also an extremely complex
> and sensitive issue. Just simply banging on it without giving any thought
> to how other people feel, to its history, to its bare essence, is not
> going to help at all.....
> 
> 
	You seem to contradict yourself.  At the beginning of the post,
you said you do not prefer the 'special priviledge' because it belittle
your achievement (I agree with this sentiment).  However, you kind of favor
NEP on your last paragraph.
	I think most of us agree with the objective of the NEP, and that
is to eradicate poverty.  But we feel strongly about the way it was 
implemented.  The policy should be based on the conditions of the people and
not the race.  The speical priviledges should be given to the needy and to 
people who deserved it. 
	There is no point for me to discuss the merits of NEP because it has 
been hotly  debated in the newsgroup in the past and probably will be in 
the future.  Have a nice day.


Jack Teh  


> All my love,
> 
> Azran Osman-Rani
> Stanford University
Organization: Masters student, Urban and Public Affairs, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 12:53:53 -0500 
From: Tee-Ming Ooi <to23+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: TO YOU CHINESE..
Distribution: world

Excerpts from netnews.soc.culture.asean: 12-Nov-92 TO YOU CHINESE.. by
isds11989009@memstvx1.me 
> HI...
>       ALL THESE ARTICLES ABOUT RACISM ARE SO BOOOOOOORING.....YOU KNOW WHY?..
>       BECAUSE YOU'LL CHINESE ACTING LIKE YOU'RE THE BEST RACE IN MALAYSIA..
>       WHY? EVEN I'M NOT MALAY ...

Please note that others may find the discussion about equality of
opportunities a fruitful exercise of those gray cells and a productive
exchange of viewpoints.  It is important to bring up the issue of equal
opportunities as many of us students will be returning to our home
country to be managers of a multicultural workforce.  How do we manage
the clash of values of diverse employees?

Speaking from the perspective of a Malaysian of Chinese origin, I do not
consider the Chinese a superior race.  I believe in the availability of
equal opportunities to ALL Malaysian citizens.  Is it not a fair and
sensible practice to hire the best person for the job irrespective of
ethnic origin?  Racial superiority is a dangerous force as evidenced by
the atrocities committed by the Nazis during the Hitler regime.

Another thing, taking the caps lock off before typing would reduce the
antagonism caused by screaming text.

t-ming

Tee-Ming Ooi


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: eletanjm@nuscc.nus.sg (Tan Jin Meng)
Subject: Re: SGP: NUS students an apathetic lot
Organization: National University of Singapore
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 06:20:39 GMT


Certainly lack of time is a factor. But this does not account for the
fact that ECA participation in NUS hostel activities is high (why
ECA activity in hostels is high is irrelevant). I don't think that the
average standard of a student hostelite is very much below that of the
student population at large. BTW I was a hostelite for 4 yrs.

Certainly, the perception (and the reality) of the lack of power of the
Union is a factor. It is truth that students - even UNION reps - do not
get taken very seriously by the authorities. This contributes both to
frustration/disillusion at the student leader level as well as in the
general student population. I have some personal experience of this.

Invoking ISA etc is a overreaction. Almost all of us are not incipent
troublemakers (by any definition). Most well meaning students just want
the system to work better. It is simply a general perception that
running for the UNION is just not worth the effort - this is especially
since the University is not particularly badly run. 

my 2 cents

jin meng
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: How to subscribe to SIFlash (SIF- S'pore International Foundation)
From: teh@latcs2.lat.oz.au (Richie L C TEH)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 04:07:16 GMT
Organization: Comp Sci, La Trobe Uni, Australia

    OK, in the Nov 7th edition of the Singapore Straits Times (Oversea Editon),
there was an article entitled "News link-up for overseas students".
     Here it is:
	" A NEWS bulletin linked to an international computer network has been
launched to inform overseas Singapore students about happenings back home.
	The bulletin, SIFlash, was started by the Singapore International
Foundation (SIF).
	Overseas students can receive it free of charge on their university computers if theyr are connected to the Internet computer network.
	The news, updated twice weekly, will be culled from Singapore newspapers
and magerzines like the Straits Times, Business Times and the New Paper".

	This sound very interesting for us homesick S'poreans. Please,
anyone who had any info regarding this service please email me or post it to
this newsgroup. Thanks!!!!! 


-- 
Richie   ( that's me....)

Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: s8923098@macnab.mqcs.mq.oz.au (Josef WIDJAJA)
Subject: Re: MY: Think Malaysian, not Malay, Chinese, Indian.
Organization: Macquarie University, School of Mathematics, Physics, Computing and Electronics
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:32:51 GMT

In article <1992Nov9.084733.10348@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg> eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:
|Mr. Thaddaeus (ins774h@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au) wrote:

      ....

|: 
|: aggregrates of 20s and more (surprise, surprise) got it. 
|: 
|: 	But hey, after a politician intervened on his behalf, he was sent to
|: 
|: the US of A. Draw your own conclusions.
|At least he finally got it, that is what counts, doesn't it?
|I did not have any politician to help me.
|

What if he didn't? Just because of that stupid law, he could've easily
missed out altogether. He was already rejected because his skin colour
is not quite right. A Malay as bright as he is wouldn't have the same
problem, don't you think?

 
--
 _________Josef Widjaja____________  
|  s8923098@mackay.mpce.mq.edu.au  |
|  Macquarie University, Australia | 
|__________________________________| 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: mhmann@nyx.cs.du.edu (Me Mann)
Subject: Re: SGP: NUS students an apathetic lot
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 17:24:42 GMT

In article <1992Nov10.100538.26794@nuscc.nus.sg> eng20009@nusunix1.nus.sg (TAN GIM WEE) writes:
>Hey, when u have 27 hours of class per week, tons of homework and
>projects to do, and considering that some of us are not that
>intelligent, well, how can a person find the needed time to take part in
>ECA? What's more, over here, u can't take your own sweet time to
>complete your degree. The university has specific rules as to how many
>years u are allowed to take to complete your degree. given this
>environment where failure is strongly penalised, there is of course the
>inevitable 'kiasuism'. Furthermore, most courses only have end-of-year
>exams, which means that that is the only chance for one to do well. For
>many cases, there are no regular class assessment, no marks given for
>class participation and so forth. So, EVERYTHING hinges upon the
>year-end exams. With this kind of system, how do u expect us not to be
>worried about our work most of the time?

Actually, I find that the one final exam system on the contrary
works to my advantage.   I do not have to worry about my grade
too much until perhaps a month or so before the exams.
Factoring in that they cannot possibly asked you all the things
you learned that  whole year, with a little "question spotting" and
emphasis on core concepts, most you should have no problem
passing or even get a reasonable grade.  If you think the constant
examination and grading method here is easier, you maybe wrong.
The pressure can be great too if you want an A. Ask those with a 
quarter system.  Of course, this method of grading is perhaps a little
more forgiving. I think one big factor is the fear of failing in NUS.
Statistically the "May convention" (supplementary exam) only draws
in less than 30%(?) and the overall failure rate for the whole
exam is perhaps less than 10%.   IMHO, NUS students are worrying too
much. Don't get me wrong, it is healthy to worry a little but
not excessively 8).




>No matter how much I try to say, I guess the best
>thing is for u to personally experience these things yourself, so that u
>understand the constraints faced by students in NUS.

By the way I have experienced it. It ain't that bad.  Infact I found
life easier and more enjoyable than doing A-level. Perhaps that's my
perception and I found ways to release the pressure.  Work hard, I did
and still do 8).


I remember a  Professor in the EE dept said, "A grade student 
make good professors, B grade students good administrators, and
C-grade students make good money".   I hope not all of you are
aiming to be professors. With that it should leave a large number
with time in hand to particiapte in ECA.  Anyway to each his own.



-Mann


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: af620@yfn.ysu.edu (Andrew Tan)
Subject: Re: U.S Presidential Election
Reply-To: af620@yfn.ysu.edu (Andrew Tan)
Organization: St. Elizabeth Hospital, Youngstown, OH
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1992 13:24:24 GMT


In a previous article, gt6737b@prism.gatech.EDU (E.A. JAAFAR) says:

>	I also would like to put forth a question that of importance to
>	the majority of moslems around the world, and the question is that
>	how will the new government-elect react towards Israel.  Israel's
>	PM, Rabbeen(sp?) today was quoted in an interview that he believe
>	that the new president will bring good towards Israel.  That would
>	certainly affect the peace talk process would it?  Towards which
>	direction we dont know yet.
		  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Those are the key words. Don't know yet. The effect on the peace talk
process is unknown.

Was reported that Saddam Hussain was so elated that he took out his pistol and 
fired shots into the air when he found out Bush lost. If he's not careful,
his shots might hit one of the bombers already hovering over his head. What
a pea-brain.


ATAN
  

>	Well, those are just my views and why I think actually one should
>	get informed of what's going on even when in a foreign environment.
>	If we learn anything from history, JWW Birch was killed partly
>	because he didnt respect the culture and the people of his new 
>	environment.
>
>
>-- 
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>**  E.A. Jaafar, "...a ramblin gamblin a helluva engineer...", Atlanta.    ***
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
>
From: nlatif@stipple.seas.upenn.edu (Nor Azlisya Abdul Latif)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Think Malaysian, not Malay, Chinese, Indian????????
Keywords: Malaysia for Malays, more likely
Date: 12 Nov 92 16:20:43 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania

In article <1992Nov11.194459.29080@news.Hawaii.Edu> guiyu@spectra.eng.hawaii.edu (The Big Color Wolf) writes:
>
>	25 years ago, Mr. Lee Kwan Yew proposed a slogan
>
>	"Malaysia for Malaysians"
>			    ====

Does the word "Malaysians" here mean Malays ONLY???  If thats so, are you 
saying that LKY made Singapore for the Chinese??? Then what the hell are the 
Singaporean Malays/Indians doing there?? 

>
>	while he was campaigning in the then Federal states(including S'pore)
>
>	......
>	In the end, he was given 2 choice by the Tungu
>		1)go to Singapore and make Singapore Independent
>		2)get arrested the next day for causing social UNREST
>
>	He had no choice but to choose 1) and that is why we have the
>		Republic of SINGAPORE
>							Sincerely yours,
>							Julian CHANG

Just a note to the Malaysians "non-bumis", OUR government is trying the best
to appease every Malaysians no matter what the color of their skin is. Please
dont say that the Malaysian government is biased, unfair, etc. Look here, if 
u chinese think that u r being discriminated against, then, what about the
Malays in Singapore!!??? At least in Malaysia there are Chinese n Indians in 
the cabinet.  Hasta Luego.

Azli.
 
 


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: ttan@nyx.cs.du.edu (tom tan)
Subject: testing
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix (sponsored by U. of Denver Math/CS dept.)
Disclaimer1: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University of
Disclaimer2: Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
Disclaimer3: control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 01:32:15 GMT

   Just testing so don't be angry and look happy.
From: eng20009@nusunix1.nus.sg (TAN GIM WEE)
Subject: Re: Anwar Ibrahim's Qualifications
Organization: National University of Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 10:24:08 GMT

Othman Ahmad (eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg) wrote:
: 
[stuff deleted]

: To ME someone who do not get a first class honours is a failure. To get it
: 
hmmm...in that case, for the past ten year, the schools of engineering
in NTU must have produced tons of failures! How many, on average, of the
graduating students from NTU get first class honours?
Please lah!!!! Don't insult NTU graduates!!!!!!
About your point of getting first class honours in prison. Hmm...well,
there don't seem to be much else to do in prison is there? *hehehe* So
spending most of one's time on books may be very easy! :-)

: --
: Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,
: Nanyang Technological University, Singapore 2263.
: Internet Email: eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg
: Bitnet Email: eoahmad@ntuvax.bitnet
: 

--
---------------------------------------------------------
Tan Gim Wee
EE Dept, NUS
internet: eng20009@nusunix1.nus.sg
bitnet: eng20009@nusvm.bitnet
"It was a dark and stormy night......"	-  Snoopy
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: sp@rigel.cs.pdx.edu (SP Ng)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: SGP: Recycling
Date: 10 Nov 92 04:25:55 GMT
Article-I.D.: pdxgate.6297


	Can someone in Singapore give an update of how are we doing in
term of recycling?  Is the government doing anything to promoting recycling? 
Any information is appreciated.

SP
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: sci240s@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au (Wey Jing HO)
Subject: Re: Malaysia's racial policies
Organization: Monash University, Melb., Australia.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 05:45:50 GMT

In <1992Nov9.010351.27878@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg> eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:
>Has it occured to you that giving the chinese citizenship is a very major
>sacrifice? 
I am not in the position to criticise or commend on the Malaysian's government's
so called "racial policy" but with people making this sort of statement, I do
not know what to say (sort of lost for words). I am sick of people treating the
non-bumis in Malaysia as "second class citizen" or recent immigrant. What about
the chinese, indians, and the other races of the 2nd, 3rd, or even more generations that were born in Malaysia? I know many of us would love to call Malaysia
our beloved homeland but statement like those of Othman's really make me think
twice very often. Am I really a true-Malaysian? Can I call myself Malaysian 
since there are so many people out there like Othman who think that we, the
non-bumis are merely squatters of their land.
I am not talking about govenrment policies here. I am not talking about 
restrictive policies for the different races. But I believe that all Malaysian
born in the Malaysian soil and is of Malaysian parents should be called a real
Malaysian and words like "you chinese/indians are not Malaysians", "orang luar",
and etc etc should never be used. How can we achieve the aim of living harmoniously if we continue to harbour such ideas in our mind and heart?

>Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,
>Nanyang Technological University, Singapore 2263.
                                   ^^^^ Is living in Singapore that bad for you?

-- 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Wey Jing Ho    Tel: 61-3-573-2567   E-mail : sci240s@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au<
>Physics Dept., Monash University ( Caulfield Campus ), Melbourne, AUSTRALIA<
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
From: espfm@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr K C Gan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Looking for someone who study at Melbourne University,Australia
Date: 8 Nov 1992 22:41:46 -0000
Organization: Computing Services, University of Warwick, UK
NNTP-Posting-Host: clover.csv.warwick.ac.uk


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: nor@hekla.pnge.psu.edu (Nor-Azlan Nordin)
Subject: Re: racial harmony- Yasmin
Organization: PSU Earth and Mineral Sciences
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 16:57:45 GMT

In article <1992Nov12.074431.4657@nuscc.nus.sg> engp2120@nusunix2.nus.sg writes:

>Oh, Zam *is* still alive! I thought you have been killed in a
>car accident, or maybe decomposing in the bush somewhere. Aren't
>you suppose to graduate by now? Fail again eh? Never mind, there
>are lots more of the tax payers money for you to squander.
>
>Alan

Wrong person dude!!!  

>- Beam me up Scotty, there's no intelligent life here -Kirk looking at Zam

Ask Scotty to help you...


-azlan nordin-
  Penn State

>**********************************************************************
>* engp2120@nusunix2.nus.sg     engp1222@nuscc.nus.sg                 *
>* VLSI CAD and Design Laboratory, Dept of Electrical Engineering     *
>* National University of Singapore, 10 Kent Ridge Crescent           *
>* Singapore 0511.     Telephone: 7726319     Fax: 7773117            *
>**********************************************************************
>-----                     Lets get dangerous                     ---DW


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean