HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gletty@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Bruce Gletty)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: Europa
Date: 28 Aug 92 16:46:23 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

Carl Fago <CDF1@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:

>I have been thinking about the Europa game system and considering whether
>it would be worth it to purchase part of it (the campaign areas that I am
>interested in.)  So I am soliciting comments on Europa.

>Specific questions...

>(1)  Is it still being published?
Yes, but by GRD not GDW. They are working on Second Front and just put 
out Winter War.

>(2)  I have heard that there were problems with the rules and it was
>evolving.  Is this still the case?
Yes, they have changed things since DNO. 

>(3)  What are the various titles available and what are the campaigns
>that they apply to?
Fire in the East - German attack on USSR
Scorched Earth - continues Fire in the East through 12/44      
The Urals - modifications to FITE/SE
First to Fight - Poland 39
Winter War - Russia vs Finland in 39
Narvick - German invasion of Norway
Their Finest Hour - Battle of Britain
Balkan Front - Starts with Italy vs Greece and goes through early 1942
Western Desert and Torch? - the war in Africa
Middle East - extra stuff with Turkish, Iraqi, and Persian armies
Spain and Portugual - hypothetical German assault on Spain
Fall of France - France 1940
I think thats it, there were some older ones that have been supplanted by these.

>(4)  What do you think of the game?  Good or bad.
I like it a lot. Some of the games are LARGE. Supposedly they are working on
Grand Europa to link all of above together. I'm not holding my breath, but 
hoping.
Newsgroups: rec.games.board,news.groups
From: lph@inel.gov (Randolph M. Pacetti)
Subject: Re: Titan
Summary: Play by Email
Keywords: titan
Organization: Idaho National Engineering Laboratory
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 14:35:54 GMT

Nathan Pfluger and I both run PBEM Titan games using the same rules of order
(we have some stylistic differences in the way we present information to the
players).  Between us, we have 12 games completed/in progress over the last
year.  I maintain the common waiting list.  Anyone interested in being put
on the list should contact me.

	Randy


-- 
---
Randy Pacetti, Engineering Specialist, AI and Information Engineering
Idaho National Engineering Laboratory, PO Box 1625, Idaho Falls, ID 83415-2090
Internet: lph@inel.gov  Office: (208) 525-5442  FAX: (208) 525-5996
========== long legal disclaimer follows, press n to skip ===========

Neither the United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering
Laboratory or any of their employees, makes any warranty, whatsoever,
implied, or assumes any legal liability or responsibility regarding any
information, disclosed, or represents that its use would not infringe
privately owned rights.  No specific reference constitutes or implies
endorsement, recommendation, or favoring by the United States
Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory.  The views and
opinions expressed herein do not necessarily reflect those of the
United States Government or the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory,
and shall not be used for advertising or product endorsement purposes.
From: v077mdph@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (John of Gaunt)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: JUNTA - help please
Date: 26 Aug 92 21:03:00 GMT
Organization: University at Buffalo
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41

In article <Bt50E3.EAK@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.
edu (Alec Habig) writes...
>In article <2684@nlsun1.oracle.nl> gbradley@uks197.Berkeley.EDU (Gary Bradley)
>writes:

>Well, everyone KNOWS that the president is skimming money anyway.  Who
>wouldn't?  What they don't know is how much.  This is a great part of the game
>- exactly how much can the president appear to be skimming and get away with
>it?  How much does he pay out, and to whom, to keep enough people on his side
>in a coup?
> 
>>3) Does a single game have a high death rate for the players?
> 
>What's high?  You can expect to die once or twice a game, at least with the
>people I play with.

	The people I play with usually manage to kill each player twice, often
three times, and occasionally four or five.  Of course, this is the same group
that once made someone El Presidente and then killed him in the same turn.

>>4) Is the Minor JUNTA game (2 & 3 players) worth playing?
> 
>I haven't tried it, but it didn't sound real good.

	I know nothing.

>Now I've got a question : according to the rules, each player can move 1 (one!)
>stack per turn during the fighting in a coup.  Since the coup lasts for such a
>short time (3 turns??), how does anything ever happen (especially if you're the
>guy with the police spread out all over, or have a few extra mobs under your
>control).

	I don't own the game, but we play with the rule that each stack moves
once in each turn.  We'd better reread that rule, I guess.  Playing it this way,
coups tend to be really ugly.

>We read that rule, and immediately made the house rule that each unit you have
>can move once per turn.
> 
>Has anyone tried the way the rules suggest?  If so, how does it work, and/or
>how are we interpreting it wrong?
> 
>	Alec

Snoopy
From: bbaydar@pcpc_next.UCIS.Dal.Ca (Baha Baydar)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: What's needed to play BattleTech?
Date: 2 Sep 92 19:22:00 GMT
Reply-To: bbaydar@pcpc_next.ucis.dal.ca
Organization: NSTN Network Operations Centre, Nova Scotia, Canada

In article <BtJLvM.MDK@math.uwaterloo.ca> jglarson@watmsg.uwaterloo.ca (Johan  
Larson) writes:
> How much stuff is needed to play BattleTech?
> Is it playable with just the basic boxed set, or is it like
> Star Fleet Battles in that many supplements have to be purchased
> before the game becomes worthwhile?
> What are the main supplements?
> 
> 
> <context switch>
> Is anyone in the Kitchener-Waterloo area playing the game regularly?
> -- 

The main game can be played quite suitably with just the boxed set. Most people 
like to have the various Tech readouts which list more 'mechs and vehicles for
use in the game.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BBAYDAR@HUSKY1.STMARYS.CA        |   Never believe you have plumbed the depths
bbaydar@pcpc_next.ucis.dal.ca    |        of any place... or of any human. 
THE_FOO   on IRC                 | - Reverend Mother Superior Alma Mavis Taraza
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: caraher@pn32.petnet.med.umich.edu
Subject: Re: Wings
Organization: pet/cyclotron
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 19:40:26 GMT

>  It's a great WWI Air Game. It was done by the same guy who did the AH
>games Dauntless and Airforce, after he did those games for Battleline
>games, so they essentially use AF/D mechanics, but the inconsistancies
>have been ironed out. It's a very good game with the following
>imperfections (IMO):
>
>   2) It's a bit slow to play. It uses written orders to plot movement.
>If you're flying a lot of planes, order writing is time consuming.
>
>   3) Fire takes place at the end of movement in all but the most
>complex game. This means that you can be following an enemy who is going
>dead level and straight for the entire turn (5 seconds?) and then not be
>able to hit him, because in the last segment of movement you turn R or L
>and he doesn't. 
>
>   4) They corrected for problem #3 by giving most guns 60o arcs of
>fire. This is very unrealistic for fixed guns. It can also be easily
>corrected by allowing fixed guns to only fire straigh ahead. This also
>makes the game much harder.
>
Why not go for the heart of the problem and either force disadvantaged aircraft
to move before advantaged aircraft (per Air Superiority or the Avalon
Hill-edition Air Force) or provide some mechanism for the trailing aircraft to
see at least part of the leading plane's move. Simultaneous plotted movement
makes a certain amount of sense when the turns are so short (and makes for an
anything-can-happen suspenseful atmosphere), but it takes a lot of the skill
out of the game. 60 degree gunfire arcs are a horrible solution to a game
mechanics problem.
 I assume that like in Air Force aircraft may only face hexsides? I'm too sold
on 12-point facing in tactical air games to ever go back.
 Sounds like people have fun playing it, though.
From: graham@cs.washington.edu (Stephen Graham)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: WWII strategic level games
Date: 2 Sep 92 15:04:01 GMT
Organization: Computer Science & Engineering, U. of Washington, Seattle

In article <1992Sep01.141136.20184@srg.srg.af.mil> dpipes@spica.srg (Dave Pipes x4552) writes:
>In article <peters.715307558@physics.ubc.ca> peters@physics.ubc.ca (Dan Peters) writes:
>>>                                                             ... check out
>>>TSR's re-release of SPI's WWII:ETO (European Theater of Operations). 
>>
>>Could someone help clear up my confusion:
>>
>>Before TSR's recent release of WWII:ETO and WWII:PTO, I had never heard of
>>these games, despite them being clearly some old SPI games re-released.
>>Are these the same things as "War in Europe" and "War in the Pacific" (SPI
>>monsters that I remember seeing as a kid but never played)?
>
>Whoops.  They are not old games re-released, but new ones.  TSR has released
>new games under the SPI logo, notably the SNIPER! follow-ons.  Definitely
>not WIE/WIP rereleased.

Just to clarify: WWII: ETO is a rerelease, but not of War in Europe. WWII: PTO
is a new release based on the old SPI WWII: ETO.


-- 
Stephen Graham
graham@cs.washington.edu	 uw-beaver!june!graham
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: willows@cslall.enet.dec.com (Steve Willows)
Subject: Re: Victory in the Pacific: Questions
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1992 19:37:18 GMT


In article <1992Sep1.144811.7254@exu.ericsson.se>, exukozi@exu.ericsson.se 
> 
>1) The rules state a patrolling ship can move x sea zones. For both raiding
>and patrolling ships, is the sea zone surrounding the port it starts from
>counted in the number ? Say a ship starts in Yokusaka Naval Yard. Is the
>first sea zone Japanese Waters, or does it go to sea, THEN begin counting ?

    Yes, that is correct. The sea zone surrounding the base is counted.

>2) Is the Japanese decision to retire/remain after air raiding Pearl based
>before or after the placement of Groups W,X,Y, and Z ?? This could really
>affect the decision as he KNOWS where the carriers are.

    If memory serves, it is before. This is clearly stated in the rules 
somwhere. If it's not in the Sequence of Play, check the rules section that 
deals specifically with Pearl Harbor on turn 1.

---
Steve Willows		willows@cslall.enet.dec.com
    			--or-- ...!decwrl!cslall.enet.dec.com!willows
    			--or-- willows%cslall.dec@decwrl.enet.dec.com
    			--or-- willows%cslall.enet.dec.com@uunet.uu.net

    "Even historians fail to learn from history - they repeat the same 
mistakes." - John Gill
---
From: ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: 1rst draft of the FAQ/introduction to the group
Keywords: FAQ
Date: 27 Aug 92 16:23:36 GMT
Organization: Indiana University Astrophysics, Bloomington, IN

Someone's sent me the diplomacy list directions, I'll add that in.

	Alec
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: urban@sideshow.jpl.nasa.gov (Michael Urban)
Subject: Re: rec.games.strategic 
Reply-To: urban@sideshow.jpl.nasa.gov (Michael Urban)
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, CA
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 15:09:05 GMT

Looking at the proportion of postings in rec.games.board devoted to
this one topic, I suggest the creation of a new newsgroup,
rec.games.newsgroup-discussion so that people who want to discuss
Pente, Abalone, and Nine Men's Morris can post their stuff to
rec.games.board as they always have.

Jeez.  This happens every year, in every group.  Some people will
never be satisfied until we have newsgroups with names like
rec.arts.tv.1960s.sitcoms.domestic and comp.sys.hp.compilers.fortran.bugs.fixed


	Mike Urban

	urban@cobra.jpl.nasa.gov

Xref: sparky rec.games.board:8246 news.groups:17165
From: mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at (Markus Stumptner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board,news.groups
Subject: Re: rec.games.strategic controversy
Date: 26 Aug 92 12:43:34 GMT
Organization: DB and ES Subdivision, TU Vienna

From article <BtL8tu.Cx@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, by ahabig@bigbang.astro.indiana.edu (Alec Habig):
> 2) A more serious problem is that of scaring away people who are not aware of
> the scope of the group.  I propose we have a FAQ [...]

I think this is a very good idea, and should take away most of the
fears that people have when asking about any games that by chance do
not belong to the currently ongoing discussions in the group.


-- 
Markus Stumptner                                mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at
University of Technology Vienna                 vexpert!mst@relay.eu.net
Paniglg. 16, A-1040 Vienna, Austria             ...mcsun!vexpert!mst
From: gt7994a@prism.gatech.EDU (ORMOND,SEAN PATRICK)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: SFB: Alternate Damage Allocation Methods
Date: 31 Aug 92 17:48:57 GMT
Organization: Georgia Institute of Technology


	Any suggestions on quick methods of allocating massive amounts of
damage?  This can significantly slow a game down, and with the release of R5
I imagine we'll have lots of ships executing 100+ damage points to ships 
that can easily brush it off...after a lengthy period of allocation, that is.
The cards help, but must be frequently shuffled and depending on the number 
of decks used, they are not entirely random.
	The absolute quickest method we've ever used is to simply have a
computer or calculator generate X rolls of 2d6 and report the results as
"5 rolls of 2"
"4 rolls of 3"
"6 rolls of 4"...
Then damage is called out starting with rolls of 2, then 3, etc.  Obviously,
this generates different results than taking one point at a time.  Can anyone
who has experimented with this system comment on its "fairness"?  Does
ADB have an "official" position on this or a program available?  Admittedly,
this is a bit of a nit-pick: if all players agree do use the same system it 
really doesn't matter.  On the other hand, it's probably a good idea to
try and maintain the integrity of the DAC.

Any opinions would be appreciated!  :-)

Sean
-- 
Sean P. Ormond
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
uucp:	  ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt7994a
Internet: gt7994a@prism.gatech.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: thornley@nano.cs.umn.edu (David H. Thornley)
Subject: Re: A3R - Naval Rules
Organization: University of Minnesota, Minneapolis, CSci dept.
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 04:47:24 GMT

In article <14336@mindlink.bc.ca> Bruce_Harper@mindlink.bc.ca (Bruce Harper) writes:
>The naval rules in Advanced Third Reich are quite different from those in 3R,
>although if someone didn't like the old rules, it's hard to know if they will
>be satisfied with the new rules without knowing why they didn't like the old
>ones.
>
>[Changes in detail to the old 3R rules, allowing more flexibility and
> interception, and a different method of resolving combat.]
>
>Without going into the increased effectiveness of air against fleets, those are
>the highlights.  The same basic system will be used in Rising Sun (except for
>hidden movement and carriers).

Do you really think these are adequate rules for a naval game?  Naval
actions in Europe were sideshows, while naval actions in the Pacific were
what it was all about.  Sounds like a dull game.

DHT

Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: awm21326@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Al Mahoney)
Subject: Re: Nova Game Designs, Ace of Aces
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 06:11:05 GMT

I believe there was at one time a similar game (perhaps also by Nova) based
on the Dragonriders of Pern books in which you piloted a dragon around
charring thread.  

Newsgroups: rec.games.board,news.groups
From: irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu (Josh Smith)
Subject: Re: rec.games.strategic
Originator: irilyth@fenris
Organization: HMC Academic Computing Services
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 05:42:35 GMT

In a prior article, Justin Wells (sizone!justin@ee.ryerson.ca) writes:
> Maybe the best approach would be to start a mailing list, and see how
> busy it is for about a year.  If it gets good traffic, turn it into
> a newsgroup.

Best idea I've heard yet. The existence of a need to split rec.games.board
has not been demonstrated; I haven't even heard any really good arguments
for same. All we have is a suggestion that there are a bunch of people out
there who play games like chess and go, but which aren't chess and go, and
so don't belong in the .chess and .go groups, who feel excluded from
rec.games.board. I can understand how someone could feel excluded from a FTF
meeting of a game-playing group where all the group did was discuss games
in which said person was entirely disinterested, but it's hard for a
newsgroup to supress conversation if there are people interested in talking.

It would probably be uncharitable to suggest that this silent body of game-
players who just don't feel comfortable posting to rec.games.board may be
wishful thinking. Start a mailing list, and if it generates huge amounts of
traffic (like the Cosmic Encounter mailing list did), start a newsgroup.
Otherwise, I don't see the need to split or otherwise alter rec.games.board.
It's a group for discussing board games; that's what gets discussed there;
and if players of games that aren't often discussed want to start a
discussion, I'm sure they won't be shouted down or told to take their
conversation elsewhere.
-- 
original text by Josh Smith    ::   Comments, questions, etc. welcomed
irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu   ::   #include <std.disclaimer>
"If you ever fall off the Sears Tower, just go real limp, because maybe you'll
look like a dummy and people will try to catch you because, hey, free dummy."
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: eam3@po.CWRU.Edu (Eric A. Meyer)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Subject: Re: Game Master series
Date: 25 Aug 92 16:32:11 GMT
Reply-To: eam3@po.CWRU.Edu (Eric A. Meyer)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)


In a previous article, garrett@math.rice.edu (David Garrett) says:

>	I am looking for the following games in the Milton Bradley Game 
>Master series. If anyone has any of the following games that they'd like 
>to sell, let me know.
>
>	Shogun

   I am also looking for this game in particular....so if you try to sell
it to David and he's already bought it from someone else, drop me a line!

		-EMeyer

-- 
"Unstable condition--a symptom of life       | Eric A. Meyer (eam3@po.CWRU.edu)
 In mental and environmental change          |  Alumnus,  Beta Nu of Theta Chi
 Atmospheric disturbance--the feverish flux  |---------------------------------
 Of human interface and interchange-"  -N.P. |    "What do you think, sirs?"
Newsgroups: rec.games.board,rec.games.pbm,bit.listserv.dipl-l
From: irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu (Josh Smith)
Subject: Re: Nova Game Designs, Ace of Aces
Originator: irilyth@fenris
Organization: HMC Academic Computing Services
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 07:24:11 GMT

In a prior article Chris Fuhrman (fuhrman@litsun.epfl.ch) writes:
> Did Nova do any other games besides Ace of Aces?

In a later article, Ed Humble (wehumble@iastate.edu) replies
> Nova also published a set of 6 Battletech books, with a system similar to
> Ace of Aces, I believe.  (I don't have AoA, but I've got the BT books)

I've heard this genre of games described as "flipbook games", presumably
because they involve flipping through a book to find page numbers. Nova also
produced a fantasy combat series called Lost Worlds, with some 20 - 30
characters ranging from "Orc with Mace and Shield" (wimpy) to "Cold Drake"
(highly kick-butt). I have about ten of the Lost Worlds books, and though I
haven't used them much since high school (i.e. 4+ years), they were fairly
fun and easy to get the hang of. We had to do some playtesting to figure out
balances between the characters, but we came up with a ranking system which
worked pretty well as an indicator of how relatively powerful they were.

And as far as I know, they're still in print.
-- 
original text by Josh Smith    ::   Comments, questions, etc. welcomed
irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu   ::   #include <std.disclaimer>
"If you ever fall off the Sears Tower, just go real limp, because maybe you'll
look like a dummy and people will try to catch you because, hey, free dummy."
Organization: Information Technology Center, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 15:14:21 -0400 
From: Adam Stoller <ghoti+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Scrabble Address 


Does anyone know of an address I can use to send something to Selchow &
Righter ?

The address I found inside my copy of the game was:

	PO Box 800 / Amsterdam, NY / 12010

but the mail got returned to me with:

	"Undeliverable As Addressed / Forwarding Order Expired"

Please check your copies of the games (there's usually a slip of paper
for getting tile replacements or something like that) - and see if you
can find a different address that I could use.

(Note: I don't want the Scrabble Players Inc news address 
	[POBox 700/Greenport, NY 11944])

Please address replies to:

	ghoti+@andrew.cmu.edu

as I do not regularly read this newsgroup.

Thanks much, in advance,

--fish
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu (Josh Smith)
Subject: Re: Diplomacy Rules Query
Originator: irilyth@fenris
Organization: HMC Academic Computing Services
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 23:01:44 GMT

In a prior article, Joshua Randall (bz556@cleveland.Freenet.Edu) writes:
> The question is: can you support a unit which is supporting another unit,
> such the the latter unit's support will not be cut by an unsupported attack?

Nope. If a unit giving support (A) is attacked by a unit other than the one
from the space into which it is giving support (B), the support is cut,
regardless of whether the supporting unit (A) is supported by some other
unit (C).
-- 
original text by Josh Smith    ::   Comments, questions, etc. welcomed
irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu   ::   #include <std.disclaimer>
"If you ever fall off the Sears Tower, just go real limp, because maybe you'll
look like a dummy and people will try to catch you because, hey, free dummy."
Xref: sparky rec.games.board:8275 news.groups:17184
From: mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at (Markus Stumptner)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board,news.groups
Subject: Re: rec.games.strategic controversy
Date: 26 Aug 92 19:23:18 GMT
Organization: DB and ES Subdivision, TU Vienna

From article <1992Aug26.173342.26311@ists.ists.ca>, by os9ug@gkcl.ists.ca (OS-9 User Group):
> I think there is another problem here.

I think there is the problem here that you ignore posts that do not
coincide with your intentions.

> Apparently people who play the
> wargamer/simulation brand games, and who no doubt have only a minimal
> interest in seeing posts about checkers, shogi

"Apparently".  "No doubt".  Killer phrases.  There have been posts
from several people who explicitly wrote that they are interested in
both these categories.  Again, don't enforce your narrow interests on
others.

> So I guess I have to ask:  Since you don't play these games, why do you
> care?

Well, I do.  So I care.

> And why do you insist that we read your posts?

We do not.  You don't have to look beyond the subject lines. (This is
getting repetitive.)

> Someone mentioned "only takes 5 minutes" -- but that is UNREASONABLE,

I knew this was going to come up.  He meant 5 minutes ONCE.
-- 
Markus Stumptner                                mst@vexpert.dbai.tuwien.ac.at
University of Technology Vienna                 vexpert!mst@relay.eu.net
Paniglg. 16, A-1040 Vienna, Austria             ...mcsun!vexpert!mst