HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: chron@ecl016.adsp.sub.org (Christian en Ron)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: Semi-novice programming questions
Date: 9 Nov 92 03:01:12 GMT
Organization: Heijmans & Joosen

In article <1992Oct29.212502.1948@digibd.com> steve@digibd.com (Steve Wahl) writes:

>However, I'm concerned that the GadgetRender and SelectRender fields
>might be one of those things that can cause trouble when you change
>them behind the system's back.  Is that so?  If so, what *should* I be
>doing to change the images that a gadget uses?

The best thing to do is:

 - Remove the gadget with RemoveGadget(window,gadget)
 - let GadgetRender and SelectRender point to your new images
 - Add the gadget with AddGadget(window,gadget,position)

--
 _____________________________________________________________
|                                                             |
| We go to the moon and do the other things,                  |
| Not because they are easy but because they are hard.        |
|                     Moonlanding speech J.F. Kenedy          |
|_____________________________________________________________|
|                                                             | 
|    Christian Joosen,                                        |
|    Heijmans & Joosen                                        |
|    chron@ecl016.adsp.sub.org                                |
|                                                             |
|    etmrhey@young.ericsson.se                                |
|_____________________________________________________________|
From: bjst@sth.frontec.se (Bjorn Stenberg)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: New hardware reference guide?
Date: 11 Nov 92 13:12:37 GMT
Organization: IDK/Frontec - System Design Group

bjst@sth.frontec.se (Bjorn Stenberg) writes:
> >Can you give me the names of 10 advanced demos which all work on the full
> >range of Amigas (A500, A500+, A600, A1000, A1200, A2000, A3000, A4000)?

mortene@Lise.Unit.NO (Morten Eriksen) writes:
> So, please give us the names of 10 great democoders which all have unlimited
> access to all the computers you mentioned.

You just proved my point.

Not many people have the ability to test their blazing hot-shot routines on all
Amiga models to make sure it works all over.
The Commodore Engineers are one of the few teams having that capability. The
stuff they release are properly tested (I presume! :) on all Amiga models.

Why reinvent the wheel? Why not trust their well tested routines and
algorithms?

		-- Bjorn

       ///  Bjorn Stenberg, Stockholm, Sweden         bjst@sth.frontec.se
      ///  main() { printf(&unix["\021%six\012\0"],(unix)["have"]+"fun"-0x60);}
 \\\ ///  "- Your documentation no longer confuses me, old version!"
From: Roger_Martensson@p3.nola.bbs.bad.se (Roger Martensson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: 3.0 includes
Date: 4 Nov 92 22:35:12 GMT
Reply-To: Roger_Martensson@p3.nola.bbs.bad.se (Roger Martensson)
Organization: The Third Point, Mellansel, Sweden
OD-Comment-To: Carsten_Sorensen

Let me quote something Carsten S|rensen said on  2-Nov-92:

 CS> I'd just like to know where I can get the 2.0 includes? FTP site and
 CS> dir?

It's hard to believe, but you buy them. Call C= in your country for more 
details. Ask for Native developers kit or something.

/Rm - InterNet: Roger_Martensson@p3.f607.n901.z92.badnet.bad.se
---
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: wlanders@nexus.yorku.ca (W L Anderson)
Subject: Commerical Dice
Summary: WHEN?
Organization: York University, CS Dept. Toronto
Distribution: comp
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 02:07:56 GMT

Mike, any idea what the release date will be?  We are eagerly awaiting.

Tom Hayko
wlanders@nexus.yorku.ca
From: kilitzir@csd.uch.gr (Kilitzirakis christos 122)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Basic questions about BASIC
Summary: I have to find a good language
Keywords: basic,compilers
     
     Hello to everyone out there,
Date: 8 Nov 92 17:33:15 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Department, University of Crete HELLAS


     Well,I got my Amiga 500 plus almost two monnths ago,and I would
like to ask all of you that own one for more time, some questions...
         What I want to do with it (except from impressing people whn
PCs :)) is mostly programming.But as soon as I worked a little with
Microsoft's Basic, I got really dissapointed.The user interface is 
, at least, unatractive...you can't see the cursor!!!And if we talk
about speed, well I haven't test it yet but I think that Microsoft's
Basic V7.0 for my CBM128 had almost the same speed...But I can surely
state that my CBM128 is moving eight (8) sprites on the screen with
more ease than my Amiga can move one (1).(!!!)
     Now,I just wonder why this happens...Who have I to blame?My Amiga??
Or Microsoft for developing such a Basic???
     I don't have to think a lot to see that Amiga is far superior to
CBM128, and guees what that means I have to blame Microsoft for making
such an awfull basic.But how can they?I mean,they make CBM128's basic
as well, and if you don't know, that was a pleasure to use.I just don't
understand why they didn't use Amiga's superiority to build a super Basc
     Now, as I said, I want to use my machine for programming,and I  
intend to learn C in the future (as well as 68000 asm) but because this
is going to take some time,I would appreciate if I had a Basic like
language (which I master ;)) to program in the meanwhile.
Now is where you come in and suggest what to do?Are there any good
basic languages for the Amiga?What I am asking for is SPEED.
And finally I want your opinion about what I am going to use fot
learning C and assembly
For C: Dice (Public Domain)
For Asm: Devpac2
Thank you all for taking the time and read this,but I haven't 
anyone else to ask here in Greece,they all use their Amigas for games!!

					Thanks again
						Alkis Argiropoulos

P.S. I have 2Mb of chip ram,if that makes any difference
you can e-mail me also at ypolo37@athina.cc.uch.gr
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: nilsco@ifi.uio.no (Nils Liaaen Corneliusen)
Subject: Re: New hardware reference guide?
Organization: Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:11:05 GMT
Originator: nilsco@vaavud.ifi.uio.no


In article <1992Nov10.135706.383@ugle.unit.no>, mortene@Lise.Unit.NO (Morten Eriksen) writes:
> >Yeah, sure.
> >Can you give me the names of 10 advanced demos which all work on the full
> >range of Amigas (A500, A500+, A600, A1000, A1200, A2000, A3000, A4000)?
> >
> >No, I didn't think so either...
> 
> So, please give us the names of 10 great democoders which all have unlimited
> access to all the computers you mentioned.
> 
> Nope, didn't think so either...   ;)

What is the problem anyway? In fact, I was quite impressed by the number of
demos that would actually run on the 4000 in ECS mode. The nicest by far must
have been Cube-O-Matic which runs REAL fast on 4000! I have also heard that
Vector Preview by Complex and some more vector demos work nicely on all Amigas
and take advantage of the added speed.

If anyone really needs a list of 10 advanced demos that runs on the mentioned
machines, then I'll do it. I have an A3000 personally and some friends have
4000's and 500's.

------------------------------------------------------------
INCLUDE "disclaimer.i"                       Zrouoggathog
Nils Corneliusen                             Cthulhu in '96!
internet: nilsco@ifi.uio.no                  Hasoithshuna
From: mwm@contessa.palo-alto.ca.us (Mike Meyer)
Subject: Re: LISP - Don't use it.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Distribution: world
X-NewsSoftware: Amiga Yarn 3.4, 1992/08/12 15:49:52
Keywords: 
Summary: 
Date: 10 Nov 92 11:16:39 PST
Organization: Missionaria Phonibalonica

In <1992Nov10.132424.28892@sth.frontec.se>, bjst@sth.frontec.se (Bjorn Stenberg) wrote:
> oahvenla@snakemail.hut.fi (Osma Ahvenlampi) writes:
> > Having all operations on numbers 2 and 3 in format (oper 2 3) means
> > that your program can easily change the operator, without having to modify
> > the structure of the command. 
> 
> That's not powerful at all. That's just plain silly.
> Code should be written to be: A) Easy to read. B) Easy to reuse. C) Effiecient.
> 
> Code shouldn't be written with respect to how easily it can be altered to do a
> completely different thing. That's not a very good purpose for your code...

Please make up your mind. Either code should be easy to reuse (i.e. -
changed for some completely different purpose), or it shouldn't.

> I agree that TO THE EXPERIENCED USER, LISP can be a pretty powerful language
> (not much more than others, though) but for beginners it's simply not a good
> choice.

So, I'll ask again - what's language available on the Amiga has
something near the power/flexibility of a modern LISP? You called that
question "silly" before.

> This discussion arised from my plead that developers programming end user
> Amiga applications should use another script language rather than LISP.
> I have never claimed that people programming applications *USING* LISP should
> quit doing so

Hah. I quote:

In <1992Nov10.134559.1133@sth.frontec.se>, bjst@sth.frontec.se (Bjorn Stenberg) wrote:
> Of course. No one wants a new style of an old language. I'm not saying you
> should alter LISP to be something else. I'm saying you should dump LISP
> completely.

Please make up your mind - either you think LISP should be dumped
completely, or you think it should be used where it's appropriate. For
applications not intended for end users (i.e. - programmers text
editors), it would be perfectly appropriate as a scripting language,
even by the criteria you stated in this posting.

	<mike

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: jdickson@jato.jpl.nasa.gov (Jeff Dickson)
Subject: Re: Semaphores and software interrupts
Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 23:09:03 GMT

In article <1992Nov6.165747.24043@oracle.us.oracle.com> usenet@oracle.us.oracle.com (Oracle News Poster) writes:
>In article <36735@cbmvax.commodore.com> mks@cbmvax.commodore.com (Michael Sinz) writes:
>>Semaphores are task-level semaphores.  As such, they have no protection
>>from being interrupted during the semaphore routines themselves and would
>>be very unsafe in an interrupt.  Also, as an interrupt, how would you hold
>>onto the semaphore (what task would be the owner?)
>
>Indeed, and what would happen if you -couldn't- get the semaphore?  You

AttemptSemaphore would return a zero (false). ObtainSemaphore puts you to
sleep if the semaphore is not readily obtainable. Actually, I thought it
might be a nifty thing to be able to have some way of knowing it was ok to
muck with public data. I planned to have the software interrupt generated
as result of a message arriving at a message port (PA_SOFTINT). 

mks@cbmvax.commodore.com (Michael Sinz) writes:

>how would you hold onto the semaphore (what task would be the owner?)

Okay, Ok....It just an idea (A dumb idea yes)

>David C. Navas						dnavas@oracle.com
>Working for, but not speaking on behalf of, Oracle Corp.

Jeff
From: heinz@edohwg.adsp.sub.org (Heinz Wrobel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: sprites in 3.0?
Date: 30 Oct 92 20:05:16 GMT
Organization: Edotronik GmbH

In article <Bww1Mo.HoG@fc.hp.com> koren@fc.hp.com (Steve Koren) writes:
>anything to do with sprites in 2.0 no longer run under 3.0.  I don't
>think I've found one sprite-related program yet than works under 3.0,

What SW do you mean? What setup do you have? What version number is your OS
and the potentially buggy SW?

>Is the old method for accessing them no longer supported?  Just
>wondering...

What _old_ method?

>   - steve

--
Heinz Wrobel, Edotronik GmbH (ECG018)
FAX +49 89 850 51 25 / TEL +49 89 850 25 20 (HOME!&VOICE, sometimes...)
From: dave@dogbox.acme.gen.nz (David Dustin)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: 64bit / 32 bit = 32 bit code for 68000 
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 92 22:06:22 +1300
Organization: The Dawghaus BBS, Palmerston North, New Zealand (+64 6 357 9245)

monster@mbear.apana.org.au (Martin Ozolins) writes:

> Could someone EMail me some examples of how to do
> 
> 64 bit / 32bit = 32bit Divide code for assembler for a 68000 processor.
> I need it so that I can write my program to run on either a 680x0 or 68000 sy
> I already have a 32 * 32 = 64 bit Mul routine so I only need the above.

Why don't you do what I did.  Wrote a routine which made use of a 2.x 
functions (in your case, there is a call in the utility.library), and 
then Run it through a De-bugger. :)

That way, you can make a dump of the ROM call, and this write your own 
one, so your programs can work on earlier machines.  Mine checks to see 
if the system is 2.04+ and if so, it uses the ROM version, otherwise it 
uses the routine that I have included in my program.

                                                                 :)ave

--
David Dustin             |  "Nice jail.  Looks strong."
Dave@Dogbox.acme.gen.nz  |                               - H. Houdini
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: breese@monet.imada.ou.dk (Bjoern Reese)
Subject: What kind of hardware? (was Re: New hardware reference guide?)
Organization: Dept. of Math. & Computer Science, Odense University, Denmark
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:49:37 GMT

This was previously part of the "New hardware reference guide" discussion,
but as this isn't about whether C= should release a hardware reference
guide or not, I decided to change the subject line.

In article <1992Nov9.030429.22175@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> eeklund@nyx.cs.du.edu  
(Eivind Eklund) writes:
>The problem is that I want my code to run on older machines too. SO - I
>need some doc on how to find out wether the machine is running the older
>chipset etc...  What I really would like, was to know how to set the
>machine back to run in ECS mode for the duration of my demo.  And check
>wether there is an ECS compatible mode on that machine - if not to jsut
>stop the running.  Come on, CBM, a request for the docs for a function to
>check what chipset and set it back to ECS mode can't be that hard?
>(This way, things that DO hit the HW can be made to work on those machines
>it CAN work on...)

This gave two answers:

bjst@sth.frontec.se (Bjorn Stenberg) writes:
> You don't really mean you want hard core hardware specs just to CHECK for
> the hardware, do you?
> There are (OS) routines for checking things like that. Please surprise me
> with a reason why these routines wouldn't be good enough.

Which routines? I may be an ignorant fool, but I honestly don't know.

chrisg@cbmvax.commodore.com (Chris Green) writes:
>	To get some approximation of ECS mode before taking over the
>hardware, call LoadView(NULL) followed by 2 WaitTOF()s.

This may be common knowledge, but what happens if I do as said, and
how will I know the result (look at the screen??) Approximation?
How about AGA?

In short: How do I, using the OS, check what kind of hardware (CPU
and chipset) is in use on an arbitrary Amiga?

Could someone please answer? We are some people who actually are
concerned about how we get our games/demos to run without crashing.

--

Bjoern Reese                   |     Email: breese@imada.ou.dk
Odense University, Denmark     |     Voice: +45 65 932 182 (private)
From: denson@sdd.hp.com (Craig Denson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: LISP - Don't use it.
Date: 11 Nov 1992 12:33:25 -0800
Organization: Hewlett Packard, San Diego Division
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpsdln.sdd.hp.com

In article <CASEY.92Nov9143047@anxiety.lexmark.lex.usa.na> pacasey@lexmark.com writes:

>So, I'd like to know reasons why other people like ELisp, or Lisp!

ok,
an example of some working elisp. it seems to me that, even if you
have only the foggiest idea of what a regular expression is,
- you can follow what's going on here fairly easily. i.e. simplicity
- the built-in functions are powerful, when it's byte-compiled, it's
  relatively fast,
- when you use it in batches with gnuclient it's even faster.
- it integrates well in the un*x environment and i assume that with
  the arexx version of gnuclient it works well in the amiga
  environment (i have a stock 1.3 A2000, so i don't use it at home.)

craig

------------------------------
(defun clean_clpa ()

; get rid of sql junk

(beginning-of-buffer)
(flush-lines "---+" )
(flush-lines "affected" )
(flush-lines "END OF QUERY" )

; flush leading and trailing whitespace

(beginning-of-buffer)
(replace-regexp "^[ 	]+" "")
(beginning-of-buffer)
(replace-regexp "[ 	]+$" "")

; compress blanks in front of date into 1

(beginning-of-buffer)
(replace-regexp " +\\([0-9]+ 199\\)" " \\1")

[... stuff deleted ...] 

)

; do all of above and then write buffer to temporary file 

(clean_clpa)
(write-region (point-min) (point-max) "/tmp/cp.txt" nil "NO MSG")
From: stern+@pitt.edu (Eric G Stern)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Problems between SASC 5.10 and SASC 6.00
Date: 12 Nov 92 14:30:50 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh
Originator: stern@unixd2.cis.pitt.edu

Hi,

    Unfortunately, I will probably have to have some sort of Fortran
capabilities on my Amiga at some time in the future, so I've been
taking a look at f2c, the Fortran->C converter from Bell Labs.  I
retrieved the source code from the net and was able to compile it on a
unix machine at work, so I thought I should be able to compile and run
it on my Amiga.  I wanted to compile under SASC V6.00 so I have the
benefit of all the new optimizations but I found that when I do so, it
compiles (with a lot of warnings about missing prototypes), but
running it just gives gibberish.  However, I can compile it under SASC
v5.10 with equivalent compilation options and it works correctly.
What should I do?  Possibly something is wrong that SAS should know
about, but this is a huge program that I don't really know anything
about, so I can't localize the problem as they need to do anything.
Did anything really change so that working code breaks between 5.10
and 6.00?  I have read the section in the manual about changes between
5.10 and 6.00 and none if it seems to imply that things would break in
this fashion.  I don't hink that the missing prototypes will cause
this because: (1) all off the function parameters are sizeof(int)=4
bytes wide, and (2) whatever assumptions it made about missing
prototypes under 5.10 should still work (I think).  There are no weird
things in the code like bitfields in structures, or dependencies on
alignment or order of allocation in structures that did change as far
as I can tell.

Also, how compatible is the object format between 5.10 and 6.00?  Can
I mix modules in one program in an attempt to determine the failing
module?  What about library formats?


				Eric Stern
From: bell@ecs.umass.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: SAS/C 6.0 'se' bug?
Date: 5 Nov 92 16:29:50 GMT

   I may have found a possible se problem.  Twice now I've been building
a program (using SMAKE) and I've gotten the following Warning:
	Warning 105 in <file>.c line 0: module does not define any
	externally-known symbols.
   When I reopen the file it's empty.  The first time I had no idea what
happened.  This last time I had just opened the file made some changes and
decided I really didn't want them so I quit and said yes to abandon my work.
Luckily I've been backing up my work to my Unix account or I would be very
upset at the moment.  I'm still not sure what's going on and it's not
something I really feel like messing with.  I was wondering though if anyone
else had had similar problems or what.

		Shane L. Bell
		bell@ecs.umass.edu

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: eyvind@Lise.Unit.NO (Eyvind Bernhardsen)
Subject: SAS address in Europe?
Organization: Norwegian Institute of Technology
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 92 13:10:31 GMT

Does anybody still have the SAS Institute address in Germany?  I STILL haven't
received any info about 6.0, and I was going to call yesterday, but...  The little
scrap of paper I'd written their number on had disappeared to the Land of Little
Scraps of Paper with Very Important Things Written on them.  Also, has anyone in
Norway actually got a 6.0 upgrade yet?  (Hvor mye koster den?)

Thanks...

-Eyvind

-- 
     //|                             | DISCLAIMER: I don't HAVE opinions.
    // |                             | I just repeat what everyone else says!
\\ //--|miga: There can be only one. |
 \X/   |         eyvind@lise.unit.no | Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!  Ackpth!
From: aa302@Freenet.carleton.ca (Russell McOrmond)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
Subject: Re: New hardware reference guide?
Date: 13 Nov 92 21:12:21 GMT
Reply-To: aa302@Freenet.carleton.ca (Russell McOrmond)
Organization: Carleton University, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada


In a previous article, bloc1469@ee.ee.uwm.edu (Gregory R. Block) says:

>In article <BxGvwE.4op@visix.com> brett@visix.com writes:
>>Please! Hitting the hardware != POORLY Written Software

>Fortunately, it does as of 3.0.  And frankly, I'd rather see DIG than
>the newest version of Frogger, 'kay?  ;)

  There are always going to be legitimate reasons for hitting the hardware as
there will likely always be conditions where CBM doesn't provide the right
functionality in their O.S. that is required for certain applications. I
know you are a Welmat user and by your definition Welmat is
a poorly written package because it has to hit the hardware in order
to get control over the DTR line on the internal serial port.  It would
be seconds for CBM to fix this blatantly obvious bug that they were informed
of quite some number of years ago, but so far they have not.

  I myself don't know much about the reasons why other hardware is hit, but
from this simple example I bet there are legitimate reasons for getting
around bugs in the O.S.


-- 
 Russell McOrmond, Ottawa Ontario, Canada    | Standard Disclaimer applies.
 Freenet: aa302@freenet.carleton.ca (Faster) | Current WELMAT 'keeper of
 Home: rwm@Atronx.OCUnix.On.Ca,  1:163/109   | sources.
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.programmer
From: breese@monet.imada.ou.dk (Bjoern Reese)
Subject: Re: New hardware reference guide?
Organization: Dept. of Math. & Computer Science, Odense University, Denmark
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 18:39:39 GMT

In article <1992Nov5.184557.17342@sth.frontec.se> bjst@sth.frontec.se (Bjorn  
Stenberg) writes:

Hey, another bear (for non-scandinavian: Bjorn/Bjoern means bear ;-)

> breese@monet.imada.ou.dk (Bjoern Reese) writes:
> >`ample speed' huh? What if you still own an old and slow Amiga (which is  
what
> >the majority of the game-playing people do) ? Sure, the software will run  
nice
> >and smoothly on the new machines, but imagine running an `access-to-the-
> >hardware-through-the-OS-only' game on an old machine.
> 
> You're forgetting something here.
> There *ARE* no old, slow machines with this hardware (AGA) and there won't
> ever be any with less than a 68020 inside, which will guarantee 'ample speed'
> for your code.
> 
> 		-- Bjorn

I have never said that there were any old machines with AGA hardware.
I don't know where you got that idea from.

A major reason to use the OS is 'compability'. This means that a piece
of software should be able to run on any machine using the same OS.
What I was trying to emphasize was that a game using the OS which plays
nicely on a 68030 with AGA, most likely is painfully slow on a plain
68000. AND most gameplaying kids only owns a plain 68000. So if you
develop games, you will have to consider using the OS very carefully.
To gain speed on a plain 68000 you may consider skipping the OS.

--

Bjoern Reese                   |     Email: breese@imada.ou.dk
Odense University, Denmark     |     Voice: +45 65 932 182 (private)