HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: woodhams@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Michael Woodhams)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Re: Cosmic Zap
Date: 11 Sep 92 21:05:55 GMT
Organization: Princeton University Observatory
Originator: news@nimaster

In article <1992Sep11.202317.19912@cbnewsi.cb.att.com> Brian.C.Kohn@att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality) writes:
>One player shuffles the main deck and deals each player seven cards
>face down. Players start the game with these cards as their hands and
>may look at them. They may not show these cards to other players OR
>COMMUNICATE WHAT THEY HAVE. [emphasis mine]
>
>So, as I've discussed with some in email already, you may indeed lie
>about what you have, but you may not tell the truth.

"Don't worry about the looser, I haven't got a cosmic zap."

Allowing only lies about what is in your hand is just as bad as
letting them tell the truth.

Michael W.
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: mallen@wyvern.twuug.com (Marc Allen)
Subject: Re: Cosmic Zap
Organization: Tidewater UNIX Users Group
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1992 05:06:49 GMT

I'm new to this group, and my source only keeps a few days of news, so I'm
entering kinda late into they frey.

When I played CE, we always played that pretty much anything went.  Unless
silenced (or something similar) you can say anything you want to anyone.

You can't however, show your cards, as that lends a factual basis to your
mutterings.  We always felt that total freedom in statements added a
bluffing ability into the game.  People that did it properly could not be
predicted one way or the other.

We were much more concerned over seeker forcing questions, and the like.

Marc

Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu (RING, DAVID WAYNE)
Subject: Mike Arms' email address
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1992 02:52:00 GMT

I was discussing the timing rule by email with Mike when I seem to have lost
his latest message along with the email address. Could someone send the
address to me?

Thanks,
Dave Ring
dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu
From: bz556@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Joshua E. Randall)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Allies Timing
Date: 10 Sep 1992 03:50:46 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Reply-To: bz556@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Joshua E. Randall)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


My interpretation was that the order in which players ally is mandatory,
but only if someone wants it to be.  For example, someone later in the
order can ally ahead of time, but someone earlier in the order cannot force
someone after him to ally before he does.

-- 
Joshua E. Randall
bz556@cleveland.freenet.edu
My motto:  "So little time, so little to do."  --Oscar Levant
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu (RING, DAVID WAYNE)
Subject: Re: a few questions...
Followup-To: rec.games.board.ce
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41    
Organization: Texas A&M University, Academic Computing Services
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 01:25:00 GMT

Brian.C.Kohn@att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality) writes...
>>Mirror and Sorcerer are also 'two players' but here's where the similarity
>>with the timing rule ends. Their powers are not contradictory (it's clear
>>what would happen if both were invoked). They are not simultaneous (each
>>wants to invoke after the other). And they are not invoked (each refuses
>>to invoke unless a certain condition is met).
> 
>They are indeed contradictory as they would oppose each other's effect.

So if they _enhanced_ each other's effect, and the players still wanted
to go _after_ each other, how would you resolve the deadlock?

>They are indeed simultaneous as they are both invoked in the same step
>(same icon).  

Wow. So if the defender finder's a dangerous card from someone's hand,
that card cannot be plagued out of his hand until the next phase, when it
might be too late? Have we all been playing wrong all these years?

>               And they are indeed invoked when either player decides
>they want to play their power.

But when that occurs, you don't have a problem anymore.

Dave Ring
dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: hankins@cs.swarthmore.edu (Luke Hankins)
Subject: Re: Cosmic Zap
Organization: Swarthmore College
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1992 21:52:04 GMT

bicker@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality) writes:

>So, as I've discussed with some in email already, you may indeed lie
>about what you have, but you may not tell the truth.

	So I can say "I don't have a Cosmic Zap.", thus informing everyone
that I do have one, since I couldn't be telling the truth about what I
have...  (Or can you tell the truth about what you don't have?)

		-luke
-- 
______________________________________________________________________________
Luke Hankins hankins@cs.swarthmore.edu |"I don't care anymore" -P Collins
for(MyAge=0;!Dead;EnjoyLife);          |"I'm here and here I'll stay" -SOC
While not (EndOfLife) do Havefun(me);  |"...stay sane inside insanity..." -RHPS
From: fasciano@nil.IRO.UMontreal.CA (Massimo Fasciano)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Asking for allies (timing order)
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:34:05 GMT
Organization: Universite de Montreal -- Laboratoire Incognito

Hi,

the Mayfair rulebook states the following:  (CHALLENGES 6 p.7)

"Starting with the player to the left of the offensive player and
proceeding clockwise, each player decides whether or not to ally with
one of the main players."

it doesn't say that this order is meant for cases where one potential
ally wants to wait until another has decided (timing conflict). do i
assume then that this order is mandatory? i ask the question because
putting 4 tokens in the cone (without waiting for your turn in the
order) before the other allies decide sometimes influences their
decision...

	Massimo-

--
=================================================================
=  Massimo Fasciano       E-MAIL: fasciano@IRO.UMontreal.CA     =
=================================================================
From: gharris@jade.tufts.edu (George W. Harris)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Unbeatable Power Combinations -- Not!
Date: 11 Sep 92 13:58:43 GMT
Organization: Tufts University - Medford, MA
Originator: gharris@jade.tufts.edu


	Well, on the subject of unbeatable combinations, just last Tuesday I
was in a game where someone got teh supposedly unbeatable combo of Seeker-
Gambler.  Obvious Seeker question:  are you going to call my bluff?  So,
we should have been at his mercy, right.

	(Oh, by the way, we play that powers are hidden until they have an
effect.)

	He gets challenged, asks the Obvious Seeker Question, and the answer
is no.  Cards are played.  The challenger reveals a 4.  The Gambler reveals
a 40.  The challenger reveals that he is Anti-Matter.  Gambler-Seeker is 0-1.

	Then, I challenge G-S.  The OSQ is asked, and I reply no.  Cards are
played.  I reveal a 'looter 7' (an Attack 7 that turns into a compromise if
you would lose).  Gambler claims a 40.  My card turns into a Compromise, and
I reveal that I am Pacifist.  G-S is 0-2.

	Next challenge, somebody plays Insanity (net effect: all that is not
forbidden is mandatory).  So, G-S has to play the Pentaform flare and lose
one of his powers.  G-S retires 0-2.

--
gharris@jade.tufts.edu          "She had ever chance for happiness, ever 
George W. Harris                chance in the world, and stomped ever one 
Dept. of Mathematics            of them chances down in the dirt like a 
Tufts University                bug."   _The Devil's Dream_
From: fasciano@nil.IRO.UMontreal.CA (Massimo Fasciano)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Questions about Mayfair Mutant
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:07:38 GMT
Organization: Universite de Montreal -- Laboratoire Incognito

Hi,

can the Mayfair Mutant use his power more than once in a given turn?
and can he play a card immediately after taking it (before finishing
to fill out his hand, thus taking more than 7-the number of cards he had)?

imagine the following scenario:

Mutant has 15 and plague in his hand. We are at either the
interphase or the destiny flip phase, so Mutant can use his power (Mayfair).

Mutant plays the plague on another player. 1 card left.
He draws 6 cards. 3 are playable, he plays them. Draws 3 others. 1 is
playable, he plays it. He draws another. So he has drawn 10 cards
total. This means he could remove A LOT of flares and edicts from the
others if he manages to draw them. Of course, if he draws challenge
cards, he can't play them immediately and his hand will stay at 7.

Is Mutant limited to filling out his hand to 7 just once without
playing these cards while the hand is being filled up? or is my above
scenario possible?

Thanks in advance

	Massimo-

--
=================================================================
=  Massimo Fasciano       E-MAIL: fasciano@IRO.UMontreal.CA     =
=================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu (Josh Smith)
Subject: Re: Cosmic Zap
Originator: irilyth@fenris
Organization: HMC Academic Computing Services
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1992 18:57:03 GMT

In a prior article, Brian Kohn (bicker@hoqax.att.com) writes:
> It is clear that you can't reveal that you have the Cosmic Zap,
> however, unless your group is extremely facist you could say, "I'm SURE
> that his Loser power won't cause us a problem."  That should get the
> message across.

Except wouldn't this be "communicating what you have", which is forbidden by
the rule you cited elsewhere in is thread? Perhaps I'm extremely fascist.
(grin) Nevertheless, barring "communication" seems to me to bar any action
which conveys clearly the contents of your hand, which has the bizarre
effect of only allowing you to make ambiguous statements about your hand.
Whether positive, negative, or subtle, any statement that clearly
communicates to the other players what you have is explicitly forbidden.

I'm playing Devil's Advocate here; I still think this is a dumb rule. I'm
trying to argue that by showing how using it makes the game a lot less fun.
-- 
original text by Josh Smith    ::   Comments, questions, etc. welcomed
irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu   ::   #include <std.disclaimer>
"If you ever fall off the Sears Tower, just go real limp, because maybe you'll
look like a dummy and people will try to catch you because, hey, free dummy."
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: bicker@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality)
Subject: Re: a little more silliness...
Reply-To: Brian.C.Kohn@att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality)
Organization: The Internet
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 1992 13:06:20 GMT
Followup-To: rec.games.board.ce

In article <4SEP199220255443@zeus.tamu.edu> dwr2560@zeus.tamu.edu (RING, DAVID WAYNE) writes:
>Brian.C.Kohn@att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality) writes...
>>They are indeed contradictory as they would oppose each other's effect.
>So if they _enhanced_ each other's effect, and the players still wanted
>to go _after_ each other, how would you resolve the deadlock?

I would tell the two players to "grow up."  :-)

-- 
Brian Charles Kohn               using !bicker's account
Poet-Magician of "Quality"       E-MAIL: bicker@hoqax.ATT.COM
    'Hope, not fear, is the most positive advocate of action.' - S.R. Lawhead
                   Stamp Out "SO": "RP" = "Romantic Partner"
From: npfluger@cs.tamu.edu (Nathan J Pfluger)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Re: a few questions...
Keywords: LONG
Date: 6 Sep 92 16:45:50 GMT
Article-I.D.: tamsun.1992Sep6.164550.7563
Organization: Computer Science Dept., Texas A&M University

I am going to skip quoting the relevant articles.  The question is the timing rule and its application to`
two main player powers.  My two cents worth:

1) If insect and sorceror were at it, then why doesn't the same thing happen.  One sorceror waits for the other
to switch.  But this is negated, I beleive, by the card referring back to the timing rule.

2) In the example given, both players are playing as if they have the only power, and invoking thier power
gives them, usually, an automatic win.  Part of the CE experience is getting players to help you to win by
using thier power.  So in this case, maybe mirror should play a 10 and call mirror, hopefully conning 
sorceror into switching, and getting a better card anyway.  The art of the con is definetly(sp?) present
in this game.  The defender has an advantage, but that doesn't imply that a crafty offender can't win.
-- 
|############################################################################|
| Nathan Pfluger            Work: (409) 845-8865   1903 Dartmouth #1206      |
| npfluger@cs.tamu.edu      Home: (409) 696-1646   College Station, TX 77840 |
|############################################################################|
From: vbl@mace.cc.purdue.edu (Randall Julian)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Token Movement
Keywords: ce (what else ?)
Date: 16 Sep 92 02:47:25 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Purdue University

Here's a newbie question:

Can players freely move tokens between their existing bases at any time ?

I other words when are a planets defenses fixed so the offensive player
can choose ?
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: UnoJ
Subject: Deuce
Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1992 21:22:52 GMT


Question:

Sorry if I offend anyone from the Eon camp,
I just joined the CE kraze with the Mayfair
edition.
I recently played a game where Deuce and
Anti-Matter were both in the game. Now, the
explanation of the use of the Deuce power
on the card does not seem to give the player
any choice, i.e. you MUST play two cards 
(although it is not stated this way, but this
is what we all inferred). In general, I think
you would want to play two cards, except against
Anti-Matter of course. Is this correct and Deuce
does not stand a chance with Anti-Matter in the game
or is it the player's choice whether to play two
cards or just one?


  Help appreciated
                          UnoJ
From: fasciano@nil.IRO.UMontreal.CA (Massimo Fasciano)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Re: Questions about Mayfair Mutant
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:14:36 GMT
Organization: Universite de Montreal -- Laboratoire Incognito

ME> Hi,

ME> can the Mayfair Mutant use his power more than once in a given
ME> turn?  and can he play a card immediately after taking it (before
ME> finishing to fill out his hand, thus taking more than 7-the number
ME> of cards he had)?

Related question: if he chooses to fill out his hand, must he go on
until he has 7 cards? i imagine he can stop before that if he doesn't
want 7.

	Massimo-

--
=================================================================
=  Massimo Fasciano       E-MAIL: fasciano@IRO.UMontreal.CA     =
=================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: wwolf@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (ronald.k.park..jr)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Re: Cosmic Zap
Date: 11 Sep 92 15:18:47 GMT
Organization: AT&T

From article <1992Sep10.161406.13643@cbnewsi.cb.att.com>, by bicker@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (The Resource, Poet-Magician of Quality):
> In article <1992Sep9.193138.24160@muddcs.claremont.edu> irilyth@fenris.claremont.edu (Josh Smith) writes:
>>... You can, however, say to your potential allies, "Don't worry, I have
>>a Cosmic Zap, and I'll zap Loser so that we'll win." Of course, you might be
>>lying, but life is risky sometimes. (grin)
> 
> Buzzz...wrong answer Josh.  :>
> 
> You cannot say that.  The rules clearly state that you cannot reveal
> what you have in your hand to others...at least not in such an open
> manner.
 
I've always interpreted that to mean you can not show ("reveal") your
cards to other players.  However, you can claim to have any card whatsoever.
The other players don't know if you are being truthful or not until you
either play the card you say you have or are forced to discard your hand
and they can see it in the discard pile or someone else plays it or the
game ends.

All hinges on your definition of "reveal," I guess.   Or am I seriously
off base on this point.

Later,
Ron
-------------------
Ronald K. Park, Jr.              AT&T Bell Labs             System Developer
rkp@mink.att.com                Middletown, N.J.                att!mink!rkp
"The Holocaust was an obscene period in our nation's history.  I mean this
century's history. But we all lived in this century. I didn't live in this
century."					 Vice President Dan Quayle
From: fasciano@nil.IRO.UMontreal.CA (Massimo Fasciano)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Adding the 3-4-5 icons to powers...
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:50:40 GMT
Organization: Universite de Montreal -- Laboratoire Incognito

Hi,

in Encounter Volume 2 Number 2, it is suggested to add the 3-4-5 icons
the some powers such as Mind, Seeker, Trader, Mutant, Philantropist.
is this only a suggestion, or an official Mayfair clarification?
adding these icons makes these powers stronger and thus changes the
delicate balance between all powers. were these icons forgotten or was
it a design decision not to include them? were these modifications
suggested because the Mayfair version of these powers were weaker than
the EON versions?

my personal opinion is that these powers definitely need these
additions (except Mutant), but i was just wondering if anybody uses
them...

	Massimo-

--
=================================================================
=  Massimo Fasciano       E-MAIL: fasciano@IRO.UMontreal.CA     =
=================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
From: dmccart@gomez.intel.com (D. J. McCarthy)
Subject: Re: A (possibly old) evil thought
Organization: The NorWEB Federation
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1992 18:45:47 GMT

jthorpe1@cc.swarthmore.edu () wrote:
> isn't Terrorist/Healer pretty damn powerful?  If you
> bomb all planets somebody has tokens on, and then heal each set as it
> explodes, it would be simplicity itself to get a player entirely into the
> warp, assuming they had less than six bases (including those in their
> system).

	Pretty powerful word, "if", isn't it?

	The big problem here is that you have to bomb planets in
advance.  Sure, during game setup you could bomb every planet in
someone's home system (assuming there are 5+ players in the game), and
hope that they don't get an external base before they lose a token.
But game setup only happens once, and once someone has more bases then
there are players in the game, this strategy breaks down.


> 	Seeker:  Are you going to play a card higher than an 8 and answer no to
> this question?

	Questions like this have come up on this newsgroup before...
basically I suspect that the "truth" of an answer to this question may
be impossible to verify.  But I don't want to get too philosophical
here.


--
D. J. McCarthy <dmccart@gomez.intel.com>
"Whenever you come across something you don't understand, just think up an
 answer that SOUNDS as if it might work and forget about it."
                                      --Katrina Hill, alt.tv.red-dwarf, 8/19/92
From: fasciano@nil.IRO.UMontreal.CA (Massimo Fasciano)
Newsgroups: rec.games.board.ce
Subject: Cosmic Zap
Date: 9 Sep 92 16:25:25 GMT
Organization: Universite de Montreal -- Laboratoire Incognito

Hi,

the Cosmic Zap card says "Negate the alien power of any player just as
he attemps to use it. He may not use his alien power during the remainder
of that challenge".

the "just as he attemps to use it" part implies that the following
scenario is impossible:

i want allies. my potential allies are scared to ally with me against
Loser. i Cosmic Zap Loser to encourage them to ally with me. he cannot
use his power for the rest of the challenge.

i assume this scenario is not possible because Loser was not
"attempting to use his power" at the time i wanted to zap him, so the
zap is useless. i have to wait until he tries to declare an upset to
zap him, right?

	Massimo-

--
=================================================================
=  Massimo Fasciano       E-MAIL: fasciano@IRO.UMontreal.CA     =
=================================================================
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: maboyiny@ccvax.as.edu.tw (Bo-Yin Yang)
Subject: Re: Marsh/Plains
Summary: More on Minotaurs vs. Warbears
Originator: boyiny@kovalevskaya
Keywords: titan, minotaur, warbear, movement, combat
Reply-To: maboyiny@ccvax.as.edu.tw (Bo-Yin Yang)
Organization: The Cosmic Titan
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 92 00:00:40 GMT

[Timothy Worseley, on the Minotaur vs. Warbear front]

>No question about it, movement and rangestrike make a big difference. 
>Normally, though, I'd like to keep my Minotaurs/Warbears back until
>They've had a chance to recruit.

If you mean defending in the native terrains, a Minotaur in the Mountains
or Hills gets a great advantage while a Warbear in the Woods gets nothing
(if not a disadvantage) and in the Tundra gets a slight plus.

Now if you mean that your Minotaurs and Warbears never get into battle,
your group must be really timid in attacks....  

>If you want to range-strike or move 4 spaces, you almost HAVE to move up
>to the front, where you are quickly targeted.  Meanwhile, the warbears are
>defended by Trolls, which are MUCH better than the minotaurs' lions.

See, I told you you have a different group from my old one.  In my games the
Minotaurs are frequently defended by Trolls and Warbears by Lions-- guess
why!  In any case, it is irrelevant as we are comparing the pieces
themselves not their guards.

>Another advantage of the Trolls which I forgot to mention is ...

I thought we were comparing Minotaurs and  Warbears, not Trolls and Lions.
There is no doubt in general that Lions are not as good as Trolls.  Titan
is a well-balanced game precisely because of this aspects-- Centaurs are
better than Ogres but Lions aren't as good as Trolls and Cyclopses are
better than both....

>A number of people has sneered at the woods as a place to fight.  The
>woods as always a good place to defend and a bad place to attack.

>Normally a warbear stack is not looking to start any battles, because
>warbears and minotaurs are more recruiting peices than combat peices.

Well, no, I typically do not like to fight with them either, but sometimes
you gotta make do with what you have.  Notice how Minotaurs are more
attractive when mixed with Rangers OR Unicorns OR Gorgons.

Also, a Warbear is often useless if you are trying to preserve it in a
superior attack (it becomes a liability) while a Minotaur can rangestrike
from behind a "death-hole" or a bog, not to mention take two Cyclops-rounds
and survive (a majority of the time).

>Another advantage of the woods is that the trees to a lot to block
>range-strikes, and, as woods natives, don't range-strike, they don't lose
>anything by it.

Au contraire-- a restrictive terrain is a BOON to rangestrikers since in a
mutually locked position they can often force the opponents to come out (or
be executed by rangestrikes) into 2-on-1's.  Both the usual directions from
Newsgroups: rec.games.board
From: tsuk@kelvin.enet.dec.com (Michael Tsuk)
Subject: Games for sale!
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Distribution: na
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1992 21:18:22 GMT

I'm moving, and I have the following games to sell.  If you don't like my
price, make me an offer! (All prices include shipping).

Shogun, Milton-Bradley, excellent condition, $50.
Down with the King, Avalon Hill, fair condition (box worn), $20
Warrior Knights, Games Workshop, good condition, $20
Supremacy, Supremacy Games, good condition (originial large box), $20.

			      -Michael