HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: gerard@progress.COM (Gerard Bras)
Subject: Re: Cage flooring
Organization: Progress Software Corp.
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 23:55:59 GMT

pholland@iastate.edu (Paul J Hollander) writes:

>In article <20592@ucdavis.ucdavis.edu> nathan@charles.ucdavis.edu (Nathan Rollins) writes:

>>Some people use newspaper, but others say that the
>>ink is harmful and besides the looks leave something to be desired.

>Just an hour or so ago I was looking at Frederick Frye's recent 2 volume work
>(_Diseases of Captive Reptiles_, or similar title).  He was down on everything
>listed above, for just the reason Otter gave.  He liked paper (newspaper
>or butcher's paper) and indoor/outdoor carpeting.  As I recall, he said that
>printers ink had PCBs in them, but the PCBs had been discontinued.  So 
>newspaper is OK even if it isn't very aesthetic.

>I read somewhere, long ago, that it was the colored ink in newsprint that
>was not real good for reptiles.  The black ink in newspapers never seemed 
>to hurt my animals.  My cages were cleaned out whenever the water bowl was
>spilled, so they never got very wet, though.  I still won't use colored pages
>because most of them are so slick that they can't absorb much liquid.

I get unprinted newsprint for short money at the local paper dealers.  If you can 
find it get the unfilled kind since it's more absorbent and even cheaper.  The
size I like is 36"x24".  It can be folded to fit most any cage.  I don't recall
the exact price but I think I got 1500 sheets for about $50 last time.  This much
lasts me close to a year.

Newsprint is so quick and easy to replace, so easy to keep clean, and so cheap that
other than being a little drab I can see no reason to use anything else.

gerard
From: marianne@stevie.bsd.uchicago.edu (Marianne Guntow)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Shipping Reptiles
Date: 30 Dec 92 21:55:13 GMT
Reply-To: marianne@stevie.bsd.uchicago.edu (Marianne Guntow)
Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations

I would like some advice/information about shipping reptiles.

I posted recently about several iguanas which I would like to find good  
homes for. The only responses I have gotten have been from people many  
states away. From some of the postings to this group, it sounds like  
reptiles can be shipped safely. I am very concerned about the welfare of  
my little buddies and would like to know how to send them safely... and  
whether or not that's even possible.

______________________________________________________________________
Marianne Guntow                               gun6@midway.uchicago.edu
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: pholland@iastate.edu (Paul J Hollander)
Subject: Re: Gratuitous Kills
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 16:31:56 GMT

In article <s0499528.48.0@let.rug.nl> s0499528@let.rug.nl (R. Dijkhuis) writes:
> (Deleted)
>
>This (rat) snake also had this thing about white mice, BTW. He just didn't
>want to eat them. Has anybody got any idea why?

I don't know why, but I saw the same thing in my first Burmese python, a
rather picky feeder.  Give him a black rat, a hooded rat, and a white rat, 
and he'd take the black first, the hooded next, and then think about the 
white.  I can't see smell having anything to do with it, as they were out of
the same colony.  I wonder if the snake would still differentiate between
mice of different colors if the mice were dead and it was fed in a totally 
dark box.  Experiment.

Paul Hollander    pholland@iastate.edu
Behold the tortoise: he makes no progress unless he sticks his neck out.


Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: kyle@Csli.Stanford.EDU (Kyle Wohlmut)
Subject: Re: Gratuitous Kills
Followup-To: rec.pets.herp
Summary: Seeing you in action is a joke.
Keywords: This article printed on 100% recycled electrons
Organization: Rocking Pig Enterprises
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 17:11:48 GMT

In article <Bzq0L8.60I@news.iastate.edu> pholland@iastate.edu (Paul
"BANG!  Freeze!"  Hollander) writes:

>I don't know why, but I saw the same thing in my first Burmese python, a
>rather picky feeder.  Give him a black rat, a hooded rat, and a white rat, 
>and he'd take the black first, the hooded next, and then think about the 
>white.  I can't see smell having anything to do with it, as they were out of
>the same colony.  I wonder if the snake would still differentiate between
>mice of different colors if the mice were dead and it was fed in a totally 
>dark box.  Experiment.

Well y'know, my own Burmese exhibits pretty much the same behaviour--
not that she'd ever refuse food, but it takes her much longer to bag a
pure white meal than any other. (It was true with rats, and now it's
true with rabbits.) In our case, anyway, I'm pretty sure it's because
white rabbits are rather hard to see against the white newspaper
floor, and against the white wall behind the glass cage.  She really
has to be right up at the (white) rabbit, and then wait for it to move
a little, before she will go for it, whereas she will bag a
brown/black/spotted one almost before it's even left my hands
(thankfully, -almost-).  By the way, Paul, you don't actually feed
multiple prey items at the same time, do you?

/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/
                       /               
/'''   Kyle Wohlmut    -  'Heute back ich, morgen brau ich, und       
c-OO                   /   uebermorgen hol ich mir der Koenigin ihr      
   \   Rocking Pig     -   Kind.  Ach, wie gut dass niemand weiss,
  -     Enterprises    /   dass ich kyle@csli.stanford.EDU heiss.'    
                       -                                              
-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-
From: bell-peter@yale.edu (Peter Bell)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Cage flooring:  an Astroturf reccomendation
Date: 29 Dec 1992 08:57:20 -0500
Organization: Yale University Science & Engineering UNIX(tm), New Haven, CT 06520-2158
NNTP-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu

If you are concerned about astroturf draining--and you should be, as most
cases of necrotizing dermatitis that I have seen result from poor drainage
of waste--there are a couple of solutions.  One applies to wood-frame or 
plexi tanks--just drill a drain hole in a corner of the tank, keep the tank
at a slight incline, and let it drain into a collecting pan.  another is to 
go to an aquarium store and get a bag or two of fairly large pebbles, about 
1/4-1/2 inch in average diameter.  Make a bed of these below the turf layer,
and waste will drain into the spaces below.  Of course, you will occasionally
need to clean these, too, another reason for their being farirly large and 
easy to scoop up into container....

Peter
bell@minerva.cis.yale.edu

From: ruska@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Dave Ruska)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1993 03:44:38 GMT
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp

In rec.pets.herp, aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri) writes:

> There's an old console-type stereo in the attic where I'm living.  If  I can
> verify that it's abandoned, I plan to convert it into a home for the Burmese
> mentioned above.  Since it's stained wood, what concerns should I have? 
> Should I sand off all the finish?

You brought up a good point. Old TV consoles can be turned into a really
nice looking snake/reptile cage without spending much money. A friend of
mine picked up two nice TV consoles for FREE from a local TV repair shop
(the TVs were apparently not repairable, so they scrap the whole thing).
I'd recommend covering the interior with plastic bath panel. This will
prevent any fungus problems with the wood, as well as making it much
easier to clean up a *wet* dump. A glass/plexiglass front window and
some hinges on the top and you're ready to go (well, you probably need
to figure out how to heat the thing too...).

> >A dozen aquariums, a bunch of cages, and a lot of mouths to feed....
> 
> Any advice on finding a rodent breeder?  I can't find anything in the local YP.

I have half of a garage wall dedicated to rodent breeding (mice, rats,
rabbits).  I haven't decided if it's worth it yet. I spend more time each day
taking care of all the feeders than I do with my snakes and lizards.

Maybe you can find a responsible kid in your neighborhood willing to
breed rodents for you (in THEIR garage). I found a local boy that breeds
rabbits and will sell them for $2 each. At that price I should just give
him my breeder rabbits and buy all my rabbits from him.

> ======================================================================8--<

Dave                     (daver@hpgrrd.gr.hp.com)
From: Dave.Hunter@f3.n243.z1.fidonet.org (Dave Hunter)
Sender: fredmail@helldisk.uucp
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: FREE HERP NEWSLETTER
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 10:30:39 -0500

Please add me to your subscription list.

Dave Hunter
34D Forester Cres.,
Nepean, Ontario,
Canada.
K2H 8Y2

Rgds.

 * Origin: Hawaiian Shirts 'R Us (1:243/3)
From: tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: FOR SALE: Boas & Scarlet Kings
Date: 28 Dec 92 22:30:08 GMT
Article-I.D.: shelley.1hnv5gINNj41
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
NNTP-Posting-Host: carson.u.washington.edu

The following snakes are for sale:

-Captive bred & born Boa Constrictors
 Feeding well & Healthy
 Price: $95 (open to discussing discounts for 6 or more)

-1.1 Scarlet King Snakes (_Lampropeltis triangulum elapsoides_)
 Long term captives, healthy, & feeding on small rodent fuzzies
 Price: $200 for the pair

 Will ship (air freight collect) if necessary.

 If interested send e-mail to tracer@u.washington.edu 
 or call 206/548-0679 after 5 pm (pacific time)

 Happy Holidays!

-David
From: nathan@charles.ucdavis.edu (Nathan Rollins)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Date: 2 Jan 93 02:09:28 GMT
Organization: Department of Music, UCDavis


 Is it true that guinea pigs, left alone in a snake cage, will not harm
the cage's reptile occupants? (unlike rats, mice, etc)..

 This is what my Xmas gift (_The Completely Illustrated ATLAS of Reptiles
and Amphibians for the Terrarium_, by T.F.H. books) says, but I have
found other facts in the text to be somewhat misleading and/or 
erroneous...

 -otter


Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer)
Subject: Re: Gratuitous Kills
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 09:13:57 GMT

In article <=xfrb1#@lynx.unm.edu> smeagol@carina.unm.edu (Karl P.) writes:
>
>      Anyone know why a full grown bullsnake might make a gratuitous kill?
> I fed him a large mouse which he had some difficulty killing.  He never
> actually got a good bite in, instead he pinned down and crushed it.  Then
> he never went back to it.  
>      Curious.
>
>      Any ideas of why he may have done this or what it might mean?
>
>
>						---Reverend Smeagol 
>


I don't have experience with _P. m. sayi_, but I am the proud owner of 1.1
_P. m. affinis_ which are closely related.  Although these snakes are
long-term captives, not at all skittish, and do not mind handling, they
absolutely will not eat while being watched (unless the watcher can remain
nearly 100% motionless).  

I bet that if you left the dead mouse in the cage, and had left the room
for a good while, it might have eaten it.

As far as pinning the mouse down rather than conventional constriction
goes, this is not at all uncommon in the wild.  Gopher/Bull snakes will
frequently go down small rodent burrows and sometimes pin several animals
down against the burrow walls.

To offer a little more insight on why your snake left the mouse after
constricting it, I'd need to know whether you were watching it/moving near
the cage, whether the animal will typically eat with you watching, whether
the animal is a long term captive or is in the process of acclimating, etc.
But this is the best I can offer given the info in your posting.

-David

Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri)
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Organization: Siemens Corporate Research, Princeton (Plainsboro), NJ
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1992 20:00:38 GMT

>Tell he seems to like it. But most of the Snake-enthusaists that I have met
>Seem to think that an Aquariums are poor and Cages are better... Is this true?

The usual concern is for ventilation.

-- 

======================================================================8--<
From: gbartoli@netcom.com (Guy Bartoli II)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Sailfin dragon - HELP!
Date: 22 Dec 92 04:27:10 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL5

description of lizard: beautiful sailfin dragon, ~6" from nose to butt.
		       Purchased from pet store last April (he has
		       since almost doubled in size). He is my second
		       Sailfin, the first died of an infection that
		       we fought almost from the day I bought him.
		       He still has that characteristic sailfin wariness,
		       and prefers to flee rather than be touched or held.

description of environment: I keep him in a 40 gallon tank, newly re-
		surfaced with cedar wood chips (I know, I know, I read
		this newsgroup a day or two too late.) The tank is
		heated by a vita-light and a heat-rock. There is ample
		cover for the lizard to avoid getting burned or too
		hot from the two heat sources (not a problem in these
		cold months.) He also has a large water basin that is
		roughly 3-4 times the size of his total volumn (so the
		liz could sink/swim 'til he turns green in the face.)

description of problem: Prince has never gotten the hang of "glass."
		Especially recently, Prince continually throws himself
		at the glass walls of the aquarium, which has now
		caused his lips and snout area to become raw. I know
		I need to put a stop to this immediately, or the lizard
		will suffer permanent damage, but I don't know what to
		do! If it weren't so cold out, I wouldn't mind Prince
		to be a free-roamer, but I have caught him behind his
		water-basin (where it is VERY wet and cold) in a state
		of near hibernation/death. I'm scared that if I don't
		get these problems corrected asap, that my lizard will
		not live out the winter!

If anyone has a sure-fire solution, could you please email it to me in
addition to posting!? I would appreciate any help that can be given to
myself and Prince as soon as possible!

Thanks, and Happy Holidays!

Guy (gbartoli@netcom.com)
From: nathan@charles.ucdavis.edu (Nathan Rollins)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Burmese python cage question/idea
Summary: Double leveled?
Date: 1 Jan 93 15:38:03 GMT
Organization: Department of Music, UCDavis
Originator: nathan@charles.ucdavis.edu


 Happy herpy New Year! 

 It's time to build a cage for my Burmese python, and in addition to
the usual size requirements, I also need for the cage to 1. have a water
container big enough for the snake to soak in (very dry up here), 
2. Be very sturdy and stable (in case of earthquakes).
 Because a water container that big will have to take up so much of the
space in the cage, I was wondering; if you made the cage "two-leveled",
like a cabinet with 2 shelves and a hole in the top shelf so that the snake
could climb "upstairs", could you thus possibly double the ammount of
surface area the snake would have to live on, or would a Burmese never 
bother to climb up into this higher level? 
  If it would, of course, you'd still have to put the snake into a different
cage as it approached full-growth (I don't know how many woodworkers I'd trust
to build a shelf that could support almost 200 lbs of snake). 
 Also, is it just me, or does anyone else have a Burmese that doesn't
defecate very often? I give her baths etc, but nothing... she acts healthy
though.
   
 -Otter not Nathan
.
From: tracer@carson.u.washington.edu (David P. Tracer)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Cage flooring
Date: 29 Dec 1992 22:01:33 GMT
Organization: University of Washington, Seattle
NNTP-Posting-Host: carson.u.washington.edu

I currently use aspen bedding in most of my snake cages.  It's main
advantages are its cost (very cheap) and its extreme absorbency (important
in the Burmese cage, since they produce a lot of liquid waste).  I also
use it in some of my cages with my smaller colubrids (i.e., corn snakes)
and here it has a really interesting property.  When tunneled in, the
bedding holds its shape.  I use a very deep layer of substrate in with the
corn snakes and they've created a network of tunnels that they use.  They
can also go further down to get undertank heat or further up to cool off
(in addition to the side-to-side gradient provided).

Thusfar I haven't really found any bad problems with it at all.

-David

Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri)
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Organization: Siemens Corporate Research, Princeton (Plainsboro), NJ
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1993 02:28:55 GMT

>Corns ARE climbers though, so your concern about the unweighted edges are
>well-taken.  I'd just make sure to weight the top all around!  

Which covers up the holes in the pegboard, though -- at least when using the
traditional weights -- a dictionary and a CRC handbook.

I've got a commercial cover on the Pine's 20g that works reasonably well, but
I've not been able to find any more of the same make.  Sigh.
-- 

======================================================================8--<
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Tracking escaped snakes
From: <CBTCC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Date: Thursday, 31 Dec 1992 12:12:51 EST
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center

I spoke to a herpetologist friend of mine recently, and he made an excellent
suggestion for finding escaped snakes.  We all know that when a snake escapes,
it like to cruise around next to walls, right?  Well, take advantage of this.
If you don't have carpeting on the floor, get a few pounds of salt or sand,
and lay it out next to the wall (on the floor, obviously).  IF the snake is
still around, and IF it is active (i.e., not too cold or something) you may
very well find slither tracks in the substrate.  You can then try and follow
the marks to its current hideout, or you will at least know that there is a
chance that staying up all night in a certain spot might pay off.

If you do have carpet, try this.  Go out and buy a bunch of little plastic
toy soldiers.  (I can't imagine a household without them, myself).  Set them
up next to the wall in places you think the critter might be cruising.  If
you find them knocked down in the morning, you can then follow the tracking
tips given above.

Obviously, you can mix and match any way you like.  Dominoes will also probably
work.  You get the idea.  Paul told me that he has gotten calls in his lab
from security guards in his building ("There's a SNAKE in here!!!") 2-4 floors
above his lab; when he got there, it was a snake that had been missing for
a year.  Good luck!  (Maybe now I'll find my Pacific gopher!).

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!

Chris Thompson
From: mpease@dream.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca (Michael David Pease)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Re: Gratuitous Kills
Date: 24 Dec 92 04:39:02 EST
Organization: The Dreaming City BBS * (519)896-0863

On Thu 24-Dec-1992  4:34a, R. Dijkhuis Wrote:

RD> A friend of mine who has a rat snake has seen his snake do this. His 
RD> explanation, as I recall, was that the snake wasn't actually hungry, but 
RD> because the mouse was moving around the terrarium and got in the snake's 
RD> way, the snake killed it out of pure annoyance.


       I can sympathise with what you have said... I have a Ball Python,
   who has on Numerous occaisions, simply killed his prey and left it alone
   afterwards...The reasons for this behavior elude me....


RD> This snake also had this thing about white mice, BTW. He just didn't want
RD> to 
RD> eat them. Has anybody got any idea why?

      My Ball Python [Monty], also has a preference for White Mice, he will 
    NOT eat any other colour ..... And belive me, we have experimented....
    It does not matter how hungry he is, the mice HAVE to be WHITE, Strange
    HUH?

--- Via UCI v1.16 (C-Net Amiga)

|-------mpease@dream.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca---------------------------------|
|                         |                                               |
| The Dreaming City BBS   |        ADULT/Fantasy Based Theme BBS          |
|    (519)-896-0863       |       WEll over 200 Megs of Adult Software    |
|______Mike Pease_________|_______________________________________________|
From: Jack.Honeycutt@f52.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Jack Honeycutt)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: Red Eyed Tree Frogs
Date: 26 Dec 92 05:07:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: therose.725515631.AA00000

Hello All!

Anyone working with Red Eyed Tree Frogs out there?

Jack
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
From: aad@siemens.com (Anthony Datri)
Subject: Re: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Organization: Siemens Corporate Research, Princeton (Plainsboro), NJ
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1992 14:47:49 GMT

>If you have vents above both the cold end and the warm end of the cage you
>can get decent air circulation from convection currents.

8^)  Exactly the way I figured it -- I cover the midsection of the top.

I haven't come up with a good way of securing a pegboard top, though.

>Another problem with glass is condensation, although glass is much better 
>than plastic in that regard.

I see that if I cover too much of the top *and* place the water dish above
the UTH.

>I also would recommend wood cages, and line then with plastic bathroom panel.

Sound advice no doubt, but the biggest single feature of glass aquaria is
availability.

-- 

======================================================================8--<
From: mpease@dream.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca (Michael David Pease)
Newsgroups: rec.pets.herp
Subject: The Makeup of A Snake's Housing...
Date: 24 Dec 92 04:53:56 EST
Organization: The Dreaming City BBS * (519)896-0863



               Greeting to you all....

     I am A Royal Python owner, My snake is little over 4 feetin length and
  is in good health. But I have a few questions for the SNAKE GURUS out here
  on the NET.
    [Monty] My Snake's housing is a 150 gallon Aquarium, now I wish to know the reasons why an aquarium is a poor shelter for my snake...as far as I can
Tell he seems to like it. But most of the Snake-enthusaists that I have met
Seem to think that an Aquariums are poor and Cages are better... Is this true?


      Also, for bedding... I have been reading all your posts of late and I
have heard of "Paper" and that is it... For two years i used This  product
called Corn kibbles, It made my aquarium look artifical and I did not like
it, not to mention that Monty [My snake] would occaisionally get them logded
in his mouth. So I have changed to a new bedding... It is Wood shavings...
    As far as I can tell, it provides better insulation for My snake, but I 
was wondering if it might cause respiration trouble?

          what type of Bedding do you people use for your Snakes?

--- Via UCI v1.16 (C-Net Amiga)

|-------mpease@dream.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca---------------------------------|
|                         |                                               |
| The Dreaming City BBS   |        ADULT/Fantasy Based Theme BBS          |
|    (519)-896-0863       |       WEll over 200 Megs of Adult Software    |
|______Mike Pease_________|_______________________________________________|