From: phuag@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr C J Tilbury)
Newsgroups: alt.rave
Subject: Re: Rave or Techno?
Followup-To: alt.rave
Date: 11 Jan 1993 22:14:42 -0000
Organization: Somewhere in the UK
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: lily.csv.warwick.ac.uk
Summary: Not this old hat again

>Stephen Quigg writes:
>>Hipno House writes:
>>>Daniel DuBois writes:
>>>I like Sesame's Treat, I like Apotheosis, I like Dominator, I like
>>>Destoryer, I like Mother Fu*ker Man, I like Na Na, I like Ping Pong,
>>>I like Pullover, I like Speed Racer.  I dont care if these are
>>>considered old, or crappy, or commercial, or sellout, or nauseating
>>>by some guy in the Uk, or some chick in the US.
>>>
>>>
>>>Ok?

Fine by me. Just don't play them near me.

>>>
>>>-Dan
>	Oooooh Baby ! Speak hard to me ! I didn't know anyone could be so tuff.
>You're no Raver , your basically the dance version of a Def Leopard and
>Extreme fan ...... enough said !
>

Ouch. 

>> My feelings exactly!  I go to raves because they play the latest techno
>> tunes, nonstop.  I dance and enjoy the music.  I could care less about
>> acid, X, laughing gas, whatever, it's your perogative.  However, it's 
>> that shit that is ruining the reputation of raves.  What we need are

Unfortunate perhaps, that it was "that shit" that created the original rave
subculture back in the UK, in 1988/89. Because, without "that shit" its 
quite possible that you wouldn't be going to raves, because they wouldn't of
happened. You've either never heard of Acid House music, or are so completely
clueless as to realise that the acid in it is LSD, and it was acid house 
that really started the raves going over here in the UK. The most ironic part
of it is that acid house music was an American creation. 

>> clean drug-free raves.  If you can't dance without drugs, then that means
>> you can't hang with the music.  You should learn to enjoy it without any
>> additional help.  It's for your own good.  If you want to rave forever,
>> then decrease the drugs, the sooner the better.

If anything, this shows more than anything that you are clueless (in a nice, 
cute innocent sort of way). In a sort of "Winners Don't Take Drugs" sort of
way. This is not the place  to launch into a long pro/anti drugs debate, 
alt.drugs is the forum for that. Suffice to say, you seem to have completely
misunderstood the whole POINT of taking drugs whilst out "raving" (god I HATE
that word now). People don't take drugs simply because they enable them to 
dance. If you're careful with what you buy (as careful as you can be), and
provided that you are reasonably clued up on whats going to happen, then 
taking a 'brand-X' can turn a "regular" night into a whole new experience. 
"Rubbish" you'll say. And it really wouldn't suprise me. Like everything else,
a drug-experience is something that 99.9% of people can only understand if they
have had one themselves. Therefore my friend, unless you are one of the very
rare .1% of people who can, which I doubt, I shall ignore you whenever you 
spout about drugs at raves/clubs in an unconvincing and ignorant fashion. 

Better still, you can go to your "clean, drug free raves", I'll go to my clubs
(Shine at the Hacienda, The Cage in Coventry, Love Revolution at the Digbeth 
Institute). I don't think I want to be near someone so narrow minded.

>> Now, the reason for my post is because of these so-called "crossover",
>> "commercialized" groups that most of you do not like.  For example,
>> Smart E's, 2 Unlimited, and whoever else.  Yeah, they're popular and
>> overplayed, but this is how people hear techno and begin to enjoy it.

>Nah , I listened to dance because it evolved from the music I listened
>to in the Mid 80's , people like the Happy Mondays and New Order , and the
>mixes of 'indie' records by people like Andrew Weatherall , whenI first heard
>piano house ..... if people start off by listening to 2-Unlimited bollocks ,
>then they will probably keep listening to them , and then grow up and destroy
>all dance music from existence .... a bit like yourself .

I'd follow these lines more or less, but I'd rather say that the music made me,
rather than vice versa. Music is an extremely powerful medium. It can 
alter your whole viewpoint on life. 

>> I mean people start listening to these bands and begin exploring the 
>> world of techno.  Plus, you have to admit that these groups aren't that 
>> bad.  They do have some good jams on their records (Especially, Smart-E's).

They are. Sorry, but I hate them. As much as I hate most other 'rave' music. 
In general I tend to find if a tune has been given the label 'rave' it stinks
like a pile of turd in the noon-day sun. IMHO of course.

>What good Jams ??? Get this music to hell , and shoot everyone who listens to
>it .... I would rather listen to Kylie, at least she's good looking.

I wouldn't. I think I'd rather have silence.
 
>>Well, that's it.  This is all my opinion of course, and if you do not agree,
>>that's why you didn't write it.

>your opinion , it stinks ..... get some attitude and stop sucking up to
>your peers ... get caught smoking dope or something , I don't know , anything
>that boosts your 'image' .... "look mom , that mans got arrested"
> 
>> Rave, rave, a little longer.
>>

Please do. Rave off.


Chris.