HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: mcbeanb@brandonu.ca
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: MCAT scores?
Date: 13 Apr 92 17:37:18 GMT
 <1992Apr10.163059.1553@brandonu.ca> <1992Apr12.020045.25882@Princeton.EDU>
Organization: Brandon University, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

In article <1992Apr12.020045.25882@Princeton.EDU>, 
roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
> In article <1992Apr10.163059.1553@brandonu.ca> mcbeanb@brandonu.ca writes:
>>> In article <1992Apr8.113356.1535@brandonu.ca> mcbeanb@brandonu.ca writes:
>>>> 
>>>>Is anyone out there able to tell me how an MCAT score can be translated
>>>>to "overall 95%" or overall any%?
>  
>>Just an off-shoot of this:  Why is a test such as the MCAT considered
>>to be applicable to Mensa?  Any idiot savante (or anyone who could read
>>even) could study their butts off for the MCAT and do quite well.
> 
> Go look up "idiot savant." Such people are incapable of studying any
> part of ther anatomy off, on, or around.

Ok, suppose we drop the technical term "idiot savant" and take into account
the people who are capable of having vast knowledge of human anatomy
(more than most who take extensive coursework) from reading a few choice
books, yet they have quite average knowledge/intelligence otherwise.
 
> Anyone who hasn't taken a lot of those subjects, and worked hard at
> them, and who can make do with a little specific study for the test and
> still do "quite well" is probably pretty intelligent.

Probably, but not necesarily.  Ever studied really hard for a test,
regurgitated the appropriate information, and promptly forgotten it?
  
>>Reading Comprehension part is a snap if you read efficiently, and the
> 
> Something HIGHLY ocrrelated with intelligence as it is usually measured,
> I might add...

Correlation correlshmation  :)
 
>>written portion is so subjective that I can't see it being integrated
>>very easily into an overall score anyway.  Mensa is the organization for
>>high IQ, but MCAT has nothing to do with IQ.
> 
> You say that as though you'd ever studied the matter and determined a
> lack of correlation.  I'd be very surprised if that were actually the
> case, and I bet ACT has determined otherwise.

I wouldn't know, I was just taking an educted guess.
 
>>  It's more a test of education and the ability to utilize that education.
> 
> "Ability to utilize education" -- sounds like a pretty good definition
> of intelligence from here...yeah.

Sounds good, but the definition of intelligence (according to a couple
Mensans here (one of them is quite qaulified to say so)) is "what is
measured by IQ tests".  Whatever.
 
>>> Of course, anyone who's taken the MCAT has probably also taken the SAT
>>> or ACT (though I guess that's not on the list) and perhaps also the GRE.
> 
>>Well, I only took the MCAT (no more tests for me, thanks :) ).
> 
> Ah, didn't get in, eh?  No board certification, no licensing?  8-)

Smiley or not, I still don't like this message.  I did fine and dandy on
my MCAT, but that doesn't mean I'm going to be accepted by a med school.
I won't know until June, and I'm still working on courses that will decide
whether I'm "worthy" or not.
 
Brian McBean  -  McBeanB@BrandonU.Ca
From: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Fermat's flunkeys (was Re: A Real Challenge)
Date: 10 Apr 92 06:43:31 GMT
Reply-To: cjdcosta@eos.ncsu.edu (CHRISTOPHER J DCOSTA)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University

kyle@uunet.uu.net (Kyle Jones) "summarises"

>In a nutshell:  If you have the immodesty to speak out in a
>worldwide forum you should have at least checked your facts.
>If you don't, then you're going to catch some heat for it.

"immodesty to speak out in a world wide forum"?
Once again, the posting was NOT an assertion, Kyle, but a request for more 
information.

IMHO, the tone of my original posting invited comments and/or corrections:
In a nutshell:
"To the best of my knowledge, this hasn't been proved as yet, but I find
it an interesting problem."

Read: If anyone knows more about this, please let me know.

And I see nothing wrong with that.
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/T/ mrmrks and beating a dead horse ...
Date: 6 Apr 92 18:57:20 GMT
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory

jess%miracle@merk.com (Shi'nayne) writes:

> Scott, if your last name is any indication, you yourself are part of a
> minority, so what are you complaining for???

I don't know... sounds like stereotyping to me! :)

---------
Scott Tai
From: amitchell@mac.cc.macalstr.edu
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa,alt.atheism
Subject: Re: Brainwashing (was Re: IQ and religious belief)
Date: 7 Apr 92 19:36:34 GMT
Article-I.D.: mac.1992Apr7.133634.2388
Organization: Macalester College

In article <1992Apr3.091154.2363@mac.cc.macalstr.edu>, amitchell@mac.cc.macalstr.edu writes:
> In article <graham.702002243@bizet>, graham@maths.su.oz.au (Graham Matthews) writes:
> graham writes:
>> Before I answer what do you mean by 'belief' and do you mean something
>> different when you say 'belief' and 'assumption'.

> me (I'm responding to myself because no one's really said anything since):
> Yes, Graham, I'm afraid it is the Jarek thread rearing its *ugly* head once
> more.  I'll have to think a little before I define terms like 'belief' and
> 'assumption' for you -- I'm sure I'll stick my foot in my mouth on, but I
> hope to do so as little as possible! 8)  I *do* mean something different from
> assumption, though, when I use the term belief.

In my search for a suitable definition, I'm finding that my assumptions tend to
be much easier to renounce than my beliefs are.  Maybe I should go look it up
in Webster or something, but I'm trying not to be cheap about this.  I may end
up doing it anyway....

> However, Graham, you tend to state that you *believe* that all beliefs are
> irrational, not that you *assume* that all beliefs are irrational, and
> therefore, I think my question still applies.  I could understand if you stated
> beliefs were *non*rational, but you don't.  I think all of this just boils down
> to sticky semantics, though....

No one's responded to this yet: you're all too busy flaming each other.  If
you're serious about this discussion, PLEASE try to answer the questions raised
in it!
Allison
amitchell@macalstr.edu
amitchel@math.macalstr.edu

"Where's the damn pig?" -Jamie Wineberg
From: dh4j+@andrew.cmu.edu (David O Hunt)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: intelligence bashing
Date: 7 Apr 92 03:53:27 GMT
Article-I.D.: andrew.gdsFmrK00UhBQ74Usi
 <1992Apr1.045125.2539@gorgon.uucp> <gdqYHKS00WBK87n7Zw@andrew.cmu.edu>
	<1992Apr3.100048.1504@brandonu.ca>
Organization: Masters student, Mechanical Engineering, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA

>dh4j+@andrew.cmu.edu (David O Hunt) writes: 
>> I was very low on the social totem pole in elementary school.  Fortunately,
>> several people at the top liked me, so the word was put out not to
bother me.
>> If not for that, I do believe that I would have received a lot more flak and
>> trouble than I did receive (more-or-less none).
>> 
>> The two times someone ignored the message and tried to pick on me, I
ended up
>> beating the shit out of one and threatening to in the other case.  While I
>> hate to admit it, at that stage might did make right.
> 
>I disagree.  While I had my share of run-ins with bullies, I never (ever)
>had to resort to any sort of physical prowess to save my skin, and I'm not
>saying that I had to be very intelligent to do so.  There are other ways
>than hitting those who make your life Hell.  Even in cases similiar to
>the one described above.
> 
>> David Hunt 
> 
>McBeanB@BrandonU.Ca

I'm glad that you were able to resolve issues without violence.  Me, I tend to
be a violent kind of guy, AT LEAST WHEN I'M HIT FIRST.  I don't start fights,
but by Yandros, I'll finish one!



David Hunt - Graduate Slave | My mind is my own.          | Towards both a
Mechanical Engineering      | So are my ideas & opinions. | Palestinian and
Carnegie Mellon University  | <<<Use Golden Rule v2.0>>>  | Jewish homeland!
============================================================================
Email:  dh4j@andrew.cmu.edu        I think, therefore I am paid. (S. Harris)

"You should be furious that polluters are threatening your great-great-
grand children's lives!"---Iroquois chief speaking about the environment.
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/T/ Mensa Frauds Exposed - Fraud #1
Date: 6 Apr 92 18:51:43 GMT
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory

roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:

>>No, MENSA has implied all along that these tests are the equivalent of IQ
>>tests.

>Can you cite a source for this?  Hwo do you know that Mensa has done
>*anything* "all along"?  Do you have ANY Mensa literature, let alone a
>historical trace of it?

As I stated above, MENSA has never explicitly claimed that these tests
are the equivalent.  However, they imply that they are, by accepting them
as entrance requirements.

---------
Scott Tai
From: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Fermat's flunkeys (was Re: A Real Challenge)
Date: 14 Apr 92 14:58:16 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:143/207.1 - Sunnyvale Fido Conn, Sunnyvale CA


John Chambers writes about "Re: Fermat's flunkeys (was Re: A Real Challenge)"
to All  [13 Apr 92 22:29]

[...]

JC> After that day, I tried the same "experiment" on many more students, 
JC> and I repeatedly got the same results. Eventually the news got 
JC> through to me: Most of the grad students here are functional 
JC> illiterates. They can't extract the meaning of English text, 
JC> yet they understand the same text when someone reads it aloud 
JC> to them. 

JC> Try this yourself if you are ever in a similar situation. The 
JC> results may impress you. Or they may depress you. 

Reading about it depresses me.  Luckily, I'm not in an academic environment
now, and have found no functional (or nonfunctional, for that matter) illiterates
where I work.
 
/207 143/207
--  
Mike Steiner
UUCP: uts.amdahl.com!kennel!207.1!Mike.Steiner
INTERNET: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG
"The views expressed above are those of Mike Steiner only."
From: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/ Harsh Language in Recent Post
Date: 6 Apr 92 10:25:08 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:143/207.1 - Sunnyvale Fido Conn, Sunnyvale CA


Scott Tai writes about "/T/ Harsh Language in Recent Post" to All  [05 Apr 92
23:55]

>>In all seriousness, this makes me sicker than anything I've ever seen here.
>>This is simply uncalled for!  I realize that not everyone has the same
>>religious preferences.  However, please respect others and watch the
>>language in future posts.

 >It does NOT make you that sick!

ST>  It does.

Tough shit, you cock-suckin, shit-eatin, mutha-fuckin, summ-bitch asshole. 
You are so full of bullshit that the fertilizer industry has declared you a
national resource.

I have been meaning to ask you, when are your parents going to get married?
 Oh yes, I almost forgot:  Yo mama cain't figger out which of those dozen guys
who paid her five bucks that night is yo papa.  I wonder though, did she get
her rabbies shots before or after?
 
/207 143/207
--  
Mike Steiner
UUCP: uts.amdahl.com!kennel!207.1!Mike.Steiner
INTERNET: Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG
"The views expressed above are those of Mike Steiner only."
From: rhs@world.std.com (Richard H Schwartz)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Which is the Best RG? (Was: Re: A Truly International Gathering)
Date: 16 Apr 92 23:40:12 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

crossgl@infonode.ingr.com (Gordon Cross) writes:

>In article <TERRYK.92Apr15190641@headroom.encore.com> terryk@encore.com (Terence M. Kelleher) writes:

>>No.  Manchester, MA is on the Massachusetts north shore, between
>>Glouchester and Salem.
>>
>>Of course, I wasn't there, so I am assuming this is the Manchester
>>Phil was refering to.

>No, I'm positive that it is in Manchester, NH (New Hampshire) because I came
>this close -->|  |<-- to going there in '91.  

It was New Hampshire.  It still is New Hampshire.  And if anyone thinks 
either:

		Massachusetts, New Hampshire... no difference

or

		The Center of the Universe is non in New Hampshire,

I'll introduce you to Treelady.  Then I'll run.  :-)

>The problem was that no single
>airline could get me from Huntsville, AL (or environs) to Manchester, NH
>without taking two days for connections (ridiculous) or using two different
>airlines (expensive!).  Perhaps things have changed now; we'll see...
>-- 

Manchester is served by a few commuter airlines.  Precision Air is one of
them, and they arrange cross-ticketing with Northwest for connections 
through Boston and Newark.  Also, there's one major airline (maybe United
or Delta) that has a couple of flights to Manchester from Chicago.  But
anyhow, you can always fly in to Boston and catch a ride up from there.
It's less than an hour.

-rich
-- 
             Richard H. Schwartz, Scheduling Systems Inc.,
            1000 Massachusetts Avenue, Cambridge, MA  02138
                  (617) 864 8330; FAX (617) 864 8377
                          rhs@world.std.com
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: MCAT scores?
From: mcbeanb@brandonu.ca
Date: 15 Apr 92 10:59:33 CST
Organization: Brandon University, Brandon, Manitoba, Canada

In article <1992Apr13.192454.4919@Princeton.EDU>, 
roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
> In article <1992Apr13.113718.1568@brandonu.ca> mcbeanb@brandonu.ca writes:
>>In article <1992Apr12.020045.25882@Princeton.EDU>, 
>>roger@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Roger Lustig) writes:
[Roger:]
> Still won't get you far on the MCAT.  The MCAT doesn't depend on
> reciting information, but on problem-solving.

You really think so?  I didn't.  I thought there was the odd question which
could be answered by looking at the information and solving the problem,
but it mostly depended upon raw knowledge of the subject.
 
>>> Anyone who hasn't taken a lot of those subjects, and worked hard at
>>> them, and who can make do with a little specific study for the test and
>>> still do "quite well" is probably pretty intelligent.
> 
>>Probably, but not necesarily.  Ever studied really hard for a test,
>>regurgitated the appropriate information, and promptly forgotten it?
> 
> Yes.  What does this have to do with your point?  
 
Point is, plenty of people could take the MCAT in this matter (and get 
a good mark) whether they're in the 98th percentile or not.

> Especially since one can't regurgitate on the MCAT and get a good score,
> even if the regurgitation is of the figurative variety...

Alright, so it isn't straight regurgitation, but there is little more
thought involved in writing the test in a manner as outlined above.

>>>>Reading Comprehension part is a snap if you read efficiently, and the
> 
>>> Something HIGHLY ocrrelated with intelligence as it is usually measured,
>>> I might add...
> 
>>Correlation correlshmation  :)
> 
> Yeeees????

Why so tense?
  
> Well, I've actually worked for a major testing firm and studied the
> matter a bit.  Take it from me, there's a correlation between MCAT and
> IQ.

How much of a correlation?
  
>>Sounds good, but the definition of intelligence (according to a couple
>>Mensans here (one of them is quite qaulified to say so)) is "what is
>>measured by IQ tests".  Whatever.
> 
> Snore.  Why are the tests constructed the way they are?

How would I know, I didn't write them.  Do you suppose they are all 
constructed in the same way?  (Why so sleepy?)

>>Smiley or not, I still don't like this message.  I did fine and dandy on
>>my MCAT, but that doesn't mean I'm going to be accepted by a med school.
>>I won't know until June, and I'm still working on courses that will decide
>>whether I'm "worthy" or not.
> 
> OK, sorry.  But trust me: there's plenty of tests still to go if you get
> in.  You have two years of book larnin' before they hit.

DUH (sorry couldn't resist)...  But seriously, my major peeve here is that
I'm going through ll this pre-med crap which really has very little meaning
to me.  That's what's frustrating.  I know I can perform just as well in 
med school as any other freshman med student, so ll this preparation stuff
can get monotonous.

Brian McBean  -  McBeanB@BrandonU.Ca
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: terryk@encore.com (Terence M. Kelleher)
Subject: Re: Which is the Best RG? (Was: Re: A Truly International Gathering)
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: 15 Apr 92 08:34:51

In article <15Apr92013514@miracle.com> phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill) writes:

   My top 5 (in order) are:

   New England Pilgrimage          Marlboro, MA
                                             ^^
   Mensautumn                      Conn & West Mass.
                                               ^^^^
   RG at the end of the Universe   Manchester, MA
                                               ^^
   Snowball                        Central NJ
   Cape Cod Mini-RG                Dennisport, MA
                                               ^^

Do I detect a SLIGHT regional bias here, Phil?   Naw, couldn't be.

So, when is your next truely wonderfull RG in the Commonwealth?

--

                                 +----------------+
Terence Kelleher              +--+-------------+  |
Encore Computer Corp.         |  | E N C O R E |  |
terryk@encore.com             |  +-------------+--+
607-687-2644                  +----------------+
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/T/ MENSA Groups Nonexistent in this Area
Date: 8 Apr 92 22:25:07 GMT
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory

phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill) writes:

>>Okay, I tried just that.  The Raleigh phone book contained no listing of any
>>MENSA group.  Hard to believe, considering it is home to the largest
>>university in North Carolina and South Carolina!  Let me know how where the
>>closest MENSA group is.  (Chapel Hill or Durham, perhaps?)

>CHARLOTTE/BLUE RIDGE

You mean the nearest MENSA group is roughly 150 miles away?  Sheesh!

---------
Scott Tai
From: hollombe@polymath.tti.com (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: Re: Use of this newsgroup (Was Re: TIME TRAVEL)
Date: 6 Apr 92 18:55:15 GMT
Article-I.D.: ttidca.34334
Organization: The Cat Factory


Folks, I hate to point this out, but this whole discussion is pretty much
moot.  This is an unmoderated group.  We have no control over what gets
posted here, except to ignore what we don't like.  People are going to go
on posting what they want to talk about, regardless of who disapproves. (I
might add that my impression is the vast majority prefer it that way, with
only a tiny minority insisting the rest of us confine our posts to their
narrow definition of appropriateness).

This is the way it is.  Learn to live with it, or leave if you must.

Could we stop flaming each other now?  Things are hot enough as it is.

The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, M.A., CDP, aka: hollombe@soldev.tti.com)
Head Robot Wrangler at Citicorp                   Turn the rascals out!
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.   (310) 450-9111, x2483     No incumbents in '92!
Santa Monica, CA  90405 {rutgers|pyramid|philabs|psivax}!ttidca!hollombe
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: sue@netcom.com (Sue Miller)
Subject: Re: Who's in charge here?
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 92 04:42:12 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 

In article <2198.29E7AB45@kennel.FIDONET.ORG> Mike.Steiner@p1.f207.n143.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Mike Steiner) writes:
>
>Sue Miller writes about "Re: Who's in charge here?" to All  [11 Apr 92 13:13]
>
>SM> All in fidonet-land repeat to yourself: usenet is anarchy, usenet 
>SM> is anarchy, usenet is anarchy.
>
>The people on RIME say Fidonet is anarchy.  I guess that it is all relative.


Ummmm, what's RIME?  And yeah, it's definitely relative.  I experienced
usenet first, compared to it fidonet seemed (and is) relatively
well-controlled and structured.  Each has its advantages.

In fact now that I think about it, I may (depending on resources)
look into the idea of setting up a point in my new location.  I seem
to remember that fido was relatively popular in the UK.  Sorry
to stray from Mensa.  Anybody wanna talk about my test scores?
I got a 98% on my Wasserman!!  (heheheh)
From: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
Subject: /T/ I hate /T/
Date: 8 Apr 92 23:10:18 GMT
Reply-To: tai@ailab.ncsu.edu (Scott Tai)
Organization: NCSU Artificial Intelligence Systems Laboratory

phil%miracle@merk.com (Phil Hill) writes:

> I have a question though.  Why the /T/'s it looks like that Scott Tai is
> inserting them in his postings?  Does he want to see how much traffic he
> is making?  Or does he want to make it easy to KILLFILE him?

Come on Mr. MENSA, even you should be able to figure this out!  Here's a hint:
the T does NOT stand for Tai... :)

---------
Scott Tai
Newsgroups: rec.org.mensa
From: gmark@cbnewse.cb.att.com (gilbert.m.stewart)
Subject: Re: Where is Scott Tai?
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: na
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 21:29:08 GMT

In article <1992Apr17.183016.29163@ncsu.edu>, streynol@es.stat.ncsu.edu (STEPHEN TODD REYNOLDS) writes:
> Whatever happened to Scott Tai?
> 
> This group has been incredibly boring since his departure...
> 
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> Steve Reynolds
> SO, Applied Mathematics

He was accepted into Mensa on the 15th, and is busy working on an
RG.  

GMS

Xref: sparky rec.org.mensa:2894 alt.atheism:8164