HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: khor@bnr.ca (Kyle Hor)
Subject: Re: SGP: NUS students an apathetic lot
Reply-To: khor@bnr.ca
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 19:36:15 GMT

In article <1992Nov12.033933.7028@nuscc.nus.sg>, eletanjm@nuscc.nus.sg (Tan Jin Meng) writes:
|> khor@bnr.ca (Kyle Hor) writes:
|> : Back to Singapore, other than activities in the hostel, the other
|> : activities are perceived as non-value added.  It is not going to help
|> : one get a job in Singapore.  But getting lousy grades will certainly
|> : hinder a person from getting a good start in the business world.
|> 
|> What is "value-added"? There are people here who would participate if
|> only they felt they would be appreciated or if they thought they could
|> do some good.
|> 
I'm refering to ECA,etc that would not help (or do not seem to have
any immediate usefulness) a person in building up his/her career. 
Sure there will always be participaitions for diffenrent reasons, but
the % of participation is small wrt its student population.  I believe
this to be true and one of the reason being such activities does not
seem to have any benefit to the individual.  But maybe you can proof
me wrong with hard data.
 
|> I am just against categorising NUS students as apathetic or kiasu or
|> selfish or whatever. This is an insidious (sp?) myth which I feel must be
|> countered.
|> 
There is nothing wrong being kiasu.  Singapore would not be where it
is today if kiasu-ness had not been so prevalent.  Apathetic is what a
kiasu-illiterate calls a kiasu-person.  You can simply ignore them.
Selfish??...did not come across anyone accusing NUS of that yet.
 
|> jin meng

...Kyle


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: ttan@lynx.coe.northeastern.edu (Charles Tan)
Subject: Re: testing
Organization: College of Engineering, Northeastern University
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:27:36 GMT


>      Just testing so don't be angry and look happy.

Nope...not angry. Glad to see another ttan on the net 8^)
From: fellow@cs.utexas.edu (Heng Wei Osbert Tan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Othman's argument
Date: 10 Nov 92 14:57:10 GMT
Organization: CS Dept, University of Texas at Austin
NNTP-Posting-Host: yoakum.cs.utexas.edu


As a true practitioner of dirty "politics", Othman uses the ever convenient
diversion tactics whenever he is rebuffed with arguments he could not have
easily answered. Rather than spending some time going over issues in his
head, he simply mouth off saying that "Malays in Singapore is worse off", 
"Malays in Singapore is being suppressed", you fill in the rest stuffs.

I will not comment on the situation in Malaysia, many have though no visible 
constructive discourse has emerged, and I'll leave it as that.

I'll appreciate if Othman can point out ONE law, regulation, or government
practices that may have put our Malay brothers in a disadvantage situation.
That any competition of any kind is not base on merit ONLY. I'll also 
appreciate anybody who replies to this posting, including Othman, to refrain
from using ill founded non-evident, such as "I talked to SOME of MY Malay 
friends and they TOLD me", to support your argument, it will only demonstrate
your lack of abilities to argue your point. Furthermore folklore never stand
up to rigorous excercise of logical thinking any way.

It is a challenge to you Othman, one that you may choose to duck. The only 
condition is, have you fact straighten out before you say anything incoherent
again. Surely, as an educator you will understand that.
-- 
                                     _ _
---------------------------------ooo--U--ooo------------------------------------
fellow@cs.utexas.edu  Standard disclaimer applies. My opinions are, simply mine.
"heng2 mei2 leng3 dui4 qian1 fu1 zi3, fu2 shao3 gan1 wei2 ru2 zi3 nu2" Lu3 Xun4
From: ustai@memstvx1.memst.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: To you malasian Singapore basher
Date: 8 Nov 92 19:26:02 -0600
Organization: Memphis State University

In article <ygoh.721260093@sfu.ca>, ygoh@fraser.sfu.ca (Kelvin Goh) writes:
> ustai@memstvx1.memst.edu writes:
>
>>      Seems that a M'sian student in California was extremely irked by the
>>constant questions by all and sundry "Do you still live in trees?"  He
>>on to tell him that *YOUR* ambassador lives in the tallest one."  A friend
he*
>>lift"....
>>      Any other tales out there??  :)  Ciao.
>
>       My prof also told me that some dumb fools doesn't know that
> fraser.sfu.ca is in British Columbia, Canada. Don't learn from Pak O,
> know your facts before you shoot. :-) ^^^^^^
>
        Errr....  my tale came from Life's Like That (or something like that)
in Reader's Digest.  No reference at all to you...  Could you please repeat
your last sentence again??  <*smirk*> 
        Ciao.

-Tai "go on, tell me about edu, org, net, my, sg, au, etc etc...  <Sheesh>"
From: v3keong@student.business.uwo.ca (Victor Keong)
Subject: RE : DANNY CHAN
Organization: University of Western Ontario
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 09:40:13 GMT

ckc2@Ra.MsState.Edu (Chuen Kheong Chiew) writes :

> Would like to know if Hong Kong singer Danny Chan's health is 
> a o.k.?

Get a life my friend - this newsgroup has already lost directions on 
several counts. I would not think your request will be entertained here. 
Have you tried soc.culture.hongkong? 

v3keong@student.business.uwo.ca (Victor Keong)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario
From: ghblee@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Test)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Computer Jobs in Singapore
Date: 6 Nov 92 01:43:31 GMT
Organization: GINTIC Institute of CIM, NTU
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]

J.T. Teh (jtteh@borland.com) wrote:
: 
: The other R&D place is 
: 
: Institute of Systems Science
: National University of Singapore
: <Don't know the address here>

Institute of Systems Science
National University of Singapore
10 Kent Ridge Crescent
Singapore 0511

(Now, why am I doing PR for ISS? :)

- h.b.-

ps.  Howdy JT, long time no "see".
--
 Lee Han Boon, GINTIC Institute of CIM   \/   Fone:             (65)-799-5613
 NTU, Nanyang Avenue, Singapore 2263   \/   Bitnet:             ghblee@ntuvax
 Republic of Singapore               \/   Internet:    ghblee@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg 
\/~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\/  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\/
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad)
Subject: Re: MY: Think Malaysian, not Malay, Chinese, Indian.
Organization: Nanyang Technological University - Singapore
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 09:04:01 GMT

YONG KUEN FATT ALAN (engp2120@nusunix2.nus.sg) wrote:
: Did *I* agree on the discriminating special previledges for Malays/bumis?

Did I ever agree to all the laws and constitution of Malaysia?
WE just have to agree to what our ancestors had formulated for us.

: Anyway, is the previledges for the bumis or Malays? It seems that only
: the Malays get the previledges not the bumis (IMHO, flame > /dev/nul).

Do you still think that it is ONLY due to the special privileges provision?
It runs deeper than that. Misuse of power is everywhere.

: I am born in Malaysia (am proud of it). My father is born in Malaysia
: (also proud of it). My father's father was born in Malaysia (I think he
: is proud of it too, didnt get to know him :-( died before I was born).
: In fact I dont even know which of my ancestor is from China. So *dont*
: give me the crap about the so call discriminating special previledges
: for the Malays/bumis. We all built the country, hence we should share
: the fruits of our success.

Have anyone taken away the fruits of your success. The beauty of the Malaysian
democracy is that it does not burden the non-bumis unnecessarily. They let
them get rich without even taxing them heavily.
	After all, if they are rich, the people in power will be rich.

Malaysia is fortunate that the misuse of power is only in giving scholarships
to Malays who hold the political power in Malaysia. It is better to be
governed by intelligent educated masters than stupid ones.
	I just hope that UMNO can maintain its intellectual base instead of
eroding it by admitting "pak turut" as their leaders.
	The reality is UMNO is the power base. Rember that anyone who can
get over 50% votes is the power. Even Clinton do not got 50% votes and yet
he is the absolute power in USA.
	Everyone must obey him. If not, there will be chaos as in other
nations. Malaysia is still young, we have never DIE for democracy. We never
have to confront the problems of DEMOCRACY.
	With so many dictators and potential mass murderers in Malaysia and
Singapore, I just pray that we are all right. 
	Remember that Philippines were peaceful for so many years although
they have no apparent racial tensions.
	I TELL YOU, if there are no chinese, malay, indian divisions, people
will find other DIVISIONS. Just to get excuse to be DIFFERENT.

--
Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,
Nanyang Technological University, Singapore 2263.
Internet Email: eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg
Bitnet Email: eoahmad@ntuvax.bitnet
From: gt6737b@prism.gatech.EDU (E.A. JAAFAR)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Malaysia news, Oct, 3, 1992. =>N-Power Plant.
Date: 11 Nov 92 15:41:51 GMT
Organization: Ramblin Wreck from Georgia Tech

In article <1992Nov10.230919.1@kean.ucs.mun.ca>, kshan@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
> 
>   THE STRAITS TIMES WEEKLY EDITION, OCT, 3, 1992.
> 
> 
> DOCTORS ADVISE AGAINST HAVING N-POWER PLANT.
> 
> 
> By: K.S.SHAN

	Before someone thinks what the M'sian govn't should do or someone
	else thinks why the gon't should do it(N-plant), I feel it is
	only fitting for me to provide this article below:

	=================================================================
	Disclaimer:  reprinted without permission and the article could
	be read in its entirely from the NST, Saturday, 10/10/92, front
	page.
	=================================================================

	PM: No nuclear power plant
	-------------------------
	Malaysia to stick to four-fuel policy for electricity generation
	---------------------------------------------------------------
	By Manan Osman and A. Rahman Osman
	---------------------------------

	KUALA LUMPUR, Fri.-Datuk Seri Dr. Mahathir Mohamad today dismissed 
	the possibility of Malaysia building a nuclear-powered electricity
	generating plant, saying that such an option would only be 
	considered after it has exhausted all other means of power gener-
	ation.

		The Prime Minister was replying to questions from newsmen 
	on plans to build the country's first nuclear power generating
	plant as the fifth form of energy source.

		He said it was the government intention to stick to the 
	current four-fuel policy for electricity generation.  They are
	hydro power, gas, fuel oil, and coal.

		Energy, Telecommunications, and Posts Minister Datuk Seri
	S. Samy["butter-up-power-crazy-corrupted"] Vellu had stated two
	weeks ago that Malaysia hoped to set up its first nuclear power
	generating plant in 10 years.[NOT]

		Asked whether a nuclear power plant could overcome massive
	distruption of power supply as had happened recently, Dr Mahathir said t	that a massive blackout would still occur even with such a plant.
	[...and I thought simply increase the efficiency and quality of
	maintenance plus a more productive management would do the job!!!]
	===================================================================

	Just a remainder, the article above is not in its entirely.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
**  E.A. Jaafar, Atlanta.  I guess we just stick to BUZZ-ketball!!!          ***
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: low@plains.NoDak.edu (Steve Ong and Kheng Low)
Subject: testinglah !!!
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1992 06:02:49 GMT
Organization: North Dakota Higher Education Computing Network
From: espca@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr Y C Quah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Satelite T.V
Date: 7 Nov 1992 23:26:58 -0000
Organization: Computing Services, University of Warwick, UK
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: clover.csv.warwick.ac.uk


Does anybody know how to install satelite T.V in Malaysia for personal use ?

Thank you


Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: htng@ece.cmu.edu (Hiok-Tiaq Ng)
Subject: Re: Malaysia's racial policies
Originator: htng@aries.ece.cmu.edu
Organization: Electrical and Computer Engineering, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 04:14:25 GMT


In article <1992Nov9.010351.27878@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg>, eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:
|> TAN GIM WEE (eng20009@nusunix1.nus.sg) wrote:

[stuff deleted]

|> 
|> 	You have struct a nerve cord somewhere but the reason is due to the
|> basic nature of the Malays. They do not like to talk much. Even here, you 
|> notice that they are very quiet.
|> 	Even the original poster, mention that he does not want to discuss
|> further. Jaafar was apologetic with my "defences".
|> : : Yes, perhaps these policies sacrifice quality but national unity comes
|> : : with a price and it is all a matter of priorities. Yours is probably
|> : : not the same as the govt, perhaps?
|> : Yes, you are right again. However, it would be rather unfair to ask any
|> : single community within the country to sacrifice. After all, for
|> : national unity, all people should share both the gains and the
|> : sacrifices isn't it?
|> 
|> Has it occured to you that giving the chinese citizenship is a very major
         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|> sacrifice? And limiting the quota to only 30% is also another major 
|> sacrifice? What prevents them from achieving 50%?

How condescending. If I may remind you, the Indian and Chinese peoples
who were brought in by the British had no small role in making  pre-1957
Malaya thrive and contributed to the economy. Yes, profits went to the UK,
but the desirability of  the Peninsular then was linked to the raw materials
of which Malaysia is so lucky to have. For the country to thrive and for the
country to build up a base which made Malaysia what it is today, depended
on the labour of the Chinese and Indians also.  You don't think they have earned
their keep? You may ask yourself, why weren't local labourers used then?  
I am not too sure of the answer, but whatever the reason, the  "immigrants " have, 
in my eyes, made a positive contribution to the country.  
"Jus soli"  seems logical anyway. 

By the way, the "limiting" quota of 30% of the economic pie(which I assume you
are referring to) is not a limit in any sense of the word at all. There is no law that
forbid the Malay population from  eventually owning 100% of the economic pie.
Mr Othman, are you going to champion the case of the downtrodden minorities then
if that happens? Can you not understand the apprehension of the non-bumis
as to that happening if they do not speak up now or forever hold their breath?
Instead of beating the "citizenship" drum, let's go on to more constructive 
discussions, yes? 
 
 

|> --
|> Othman bin Ahmad, School of EEE,

Hiok-Tiaq Ng
From: cf379@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (J. Alan)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Interested in Homosexuality in Southeast Asia
Date: 10 Nov 1992 05:01:01 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
NNTP-Posting-Host: hela.ins.cwru.edu


Hi.  I'm doing research on homosexuality in Southeast Asia.
I am interested in collecting a wide range of information
about this subject.  I hope to hear from people who are gay/
lesbian/bisexual, and also from others who are straight, but
want to express their views.  It doesn't matter if your views
are positive or negative.  What concerns me is your perspective.
 
I promise not to mention your name or identify you in any way.
If you decide to write back to me, I guarantee full secrecy.

Possible issues you might want to comment on:
 
*What you think of homosexuality.
*If you have had any gay/lesbian/bisexual experiences or desires.
*Do you even recognize these categories as applicable to the
	sexuality of Southeast Asia?
*How do you think people with same-sex orientation are are
	treated in ASEAN, or your own country?
*If you reject (or object to) homosexuality, please explain why.
*Do you have friends or family members you know are gay/lesbian?
	What is your attitude toward him/her?
*Do you think the status of gays/lesbians in ASEAN is good and/or
	improving with time?

Thank you for your cooperation.
J. Alan
From: chuah@sail-260.cc.u-tokyo.JUNET (Chuah Yeow Chiang)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Malaysia's racial policies
Date: 9 Nov 92 04:02:45 GMT
Organization: Department of Electronic Engineering, University of Tokyo

In article <1992Nov9.010351.27878@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg> eoahmad@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Othman Ahmad) writes:
[much deleted]
>: : Yes, perhaps these policies sacrifice quality but national unity comes
>: : with a price and it is all a matter of priorities. Yours is probably
>: : not the same as the govt, perhaps?
>: Yes, you are right again. However, it would be rather unfair to ask any
>: single community within the country to sacrifice. After all, for
>: national unity, all people should share both the gains and the
>: sacrifices isn't it?
>
>Has it occured to you that giving the chinese citizenship is a very major
                            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>sacrifice? And limiting the quota to only 30% is also another major 
                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>sacrifice? What prevents them from achieving 50%?
^^^^^^^^^^

	That's one of the kind of attitudes that's slowing down the pace
towards racial hormony(or is it moving towards harmony at all??) With all
the people putting their efforts to help building up the country, there are
still people like you who still consider those non-bumi's as outsiders, 
and the country is sacrifying herself to GIVE CITIZENSHIP to them!!! When
I say all the people, I mean everybody, including bumi's and non-bumi's. We
are born in Malaysia, we grow up in Malaysia, we live as Malaysians, we work
as Malaysians, and we die as Malaysians! And yet, we are still considered as
outsiders, immigrants to whom the country gives citizenship. However, so
very fortunately, it's only a very minute portion of people who think this way.
	And you call the setting of quota to ONLY 30% as a sacrifice! I can't
believe this! I was tempted to give an analogy of robbery, but figured out
that it would be quite harsh. So, use your own imagination. 

	That's some comments about Mr. Othman's remarks. Now, some opinion
about the quota policy itself,... Can understand the original explaination
of the priority allocation where you place national unity above education
and service quality. But, personally, I feel that a balance should be made
in between this two. I am not saying that the Malays are not good in their
studying or what,.. but if you keep lowering the entrance qualification to 
the university, especially fields like medicine, engineering,... God! What
will the country be if it's full of doctors and engineers that's below
standard? [no offend, please!] Ask yourself frankly, how high do you think
the standard of our Medicine Degree is, or rather, how many countries 
recognize our Medicine Degree? Don't ask me, I don't know. Perhaps someone
else can give a better comment.
	Just my 2cents! 

Y.C.Chuah

PS: Sorry for the above flaming if it's too radical, but it just broke my
heart to be a born Malaysian yet to be considered as outsider,.... :(
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
From: guiyu@spectra.eng.hawaii.edu (The Big Color Wolf)
Subject: Re: Singaporean process (was: Canada and Quebec (was: REFERENDUM '92))
Organization: University of Hawaii, Dept. of Electrical Engineering
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 20:14:07 GMT

In article <KYTAN.92Nov9093237@mantra.fia.dmg.ml.com> kytan@mantra.fia.dmg.ml.com (Kok-Yong Tan) writes:
>In article <BxDr7J.K3G@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> tdwebste@sparta.uwaterloo.ca (Timothy D. Webster) writes:
>
>   From my knowlege Singapore is not controlled by a dictator, but rather
>   people have chosen to the same party repeatedly over the last 25 years.  
>   This difference is fundamental. If the party currently in power enrages
>   the public they will be defeated. 
>
>When there has been but one party for the majority of the 25 years with the odd
>cuckoo in a one-man party from time to time, there isn't much choice.  The
>elections are based on the British system, where the winning party chooses its
>own Prime Minister internally.  As such, there are no direct votes for a
>candidate for the post.  e.g.  It would be like Clinton campaigning and winning
>only in Arkansas and hoping that members of his party will win in their own
>districts throughout the US, so that when the Democratic party wins as a whole,
>the Democratic party would then elect him as their leader.  Kind of a reversed
>version of the American process.
>

For your information, there are presently two major systems of democracies
	1)Cabinet
	2)Presidential
Read a book regarding the above before making any conclusion that a Cabinet
system is non-democratic. Modern democracy ORIGINATES from the Cabinet system.

Why the same party dominated S'pore govt for 25 years is another matter that
we can discuss. Some reasons are : disincentives for being an opposition, few 
qualified persons in the opposition(you get some professions like fireman,etc),
people not really concerned about opposition, etc.

BTW, during the most RECENT elections we did get some good opposition candidates
elected.
							Sincerely yours,
							Julian CHANG
================================================================================
  _  __                    _ 		ADDRESS: CHANG Kui Yu
  _||__       _|_       | |_|			 2440 Date Street #1002
 |_ |__      __|__     \|/|_|			 Honolulu, HI 96826	
   |+---                | _|_			 U.S.A.	
   ||\/       _|_       / \ /
  \|L \      __|__     / \---		E-mail : guiyu@spectra.eng.hawaii.edu
================================================================================
From: ygoh@fraser.sfu.ca (Kelvin Goh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean
Subject: Re: Satelite T.V
Date: 8 Nov 92 22:07:55 GMT
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada

hykok@nyx.cs.du.edu (Herbie Husker) writes:

>espca@csv.warwick.ac.uk (Mr Y C Quah) writes:


>>Does anybody know how to install satelite T.V in Malaysia for personal use ?

>>Thank you

>Do you have permission to use the setelit T.V. in Malaysia??????

	No and so do the other hundreds of dish owners.

	
Newsgroups: soc.culture.asean