From: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: American Bashing
Date: 28 Sep 92 13:05:30 GMT
Reply-To: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U

In article <25SEP92.14063820@enh.nist.gov> downey@enh.nist.gov writes:
>Here are one American's comments to recent postings that seem
>to be somewhat kin to American-bashing:
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>Well, I think this proves my point about American nationalism.
>>If someone in Britain were to say "We are VERY proud of Britain
>>and what the country and we stand for. There is NOTHING wrong
>>for standing up for what you believe in", we would immediately
>>suspect that person of being a member of an extreme right-wing
>>nationalist political party. In Britain we find that level of
>>nationalism embarassing.
>
>As an American, it is difficult for me to understand why anyone
>would be embarassed about nationalism.  Many Americans are very
>patriotic; it is part of our culture.  We do cherish our freedom,
>especially our freedom of speech.  I agree with Suzanne, standing
>up for what you believe in is a fundamental in American society.
>I'll also agree with you, I believe you made an earlier observation
>that our cultures our different and so they are.  Let me also make
>one other point, Americans can be proud of their country and still
>recognize the many problems we have to solve.  Ours is not a
>blind patriotism.

Well, your above statement reinforces what in Suzannes statement looks - 
to be honest - a bit weird from a British point of view.

What should "loving" your country" and "standing up for what you believe
in" be related at all? It is embedded in plenty of cultures that one
should "stand up for what you belive in" for goodness sake!!

I stand up for what I believe in ( I hope ) but that's got nothing to do
with whether I "love my country" or not. It's surely not an obvious fact
that there's anything good about "loving your country" at all, no matter
which country it is.

We keep seeing pictures of hate-filled Germans on the News in recent
weeks, all proclaiming that they "love their country". In their case, I
would contend that their mistake is not that their country (Germany) is not
worth loving, but that it is this blind love for a state, and it's assumed
values and ethnic order that is the problem. It could happen in the US -
it could happen here - it sometimes looks like it's happening in France.

People who "love their countries" don't tend to be terribly attached
to the black populations of those countries for example.

In the case of those dreadful Siol nan Gaidheal stickers I saw last week
in Edinburgh, "loving Scotland" to them probably means booting out the
"English White Settlers". This of course has it's appeal ( :-))but I
expect they'd soon be after the Black settlers too. 



So, I am not a member of the Scottish National Party and never will be,
despite hoping for Scottish Independcance in the not too distant future.





M

p.s. In case anyone wants to reply to me, I "kill" all cross-postings to
".politics" in this group.
--
Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 
	Thanksgiving For a National Victory (Robert Burns)
Ye hypocrites! are these your pranks? To murder men and give God thanks?
Desist, for shame! Proceed no further: God won't accept your thanks for murther.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic