From: bickis@skmath3.pa.dec.COM ("M. Bickis")
Subject: Women warriors and male myths (WAS: Military Quote)
Newsgroups: soc.feminism
Organization: University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada
Date: 30 Sep 92 17:14:37 GMT

I want to present a contrary viewpoint about women in the military
and tie it together with the power myth thread.

To preempt any irrelevant flames, let me present at the outset my
perspective with a few statements which I believe noone on this group
will dispute.

I have never been involved in a military situation, so my knowledge
about actual military experience is second-hand.  I am by nature
pacifist, but pragamatism convinces me that in the real world we do
need armies and weapons, and that (unfortunate as it may be) many
conflicts do have to be resolved by violence.

I have no doubt that many women are quite capable of doing things that
soldiers must do, including killing people.  In particular, I am sure
that lots of women would be better at such things than I myself would
be.  Moreover, in modern warfare one can kill quite effectively
without being either strong or tough.

Many men define their masculinity by doing tough and dangerous
things--things which they imagine women could not do.  These men
resent women attempting such things, and resent it even more if they
succeed.  It's quite feasible that the military attracts just such
men.

Women do not always feel "safe" and "protected" by men in general, or
soldiers in particular.  In fact, most women feel threatened more than
protected.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now for the controversial part.

I believe that women should not be soldiers.

(I use 'soldiers' as a generic term for fighting military personnel.
I do not mean to exclude or slur members of other armed forces.  I
*do* mean to exclude support personnel who are not actively involved
in combat, even though such individuals may hold a military rank.)

Why do I cling to this belief?  Because I believe that gender is an
essential aspect of society, and gender is associated with more than
just sex and pregnancy.  If I strip the concept of gender down to its
essentials, I find a nurture vs. protection dichotomy.  To be feminine
is to be nurturing, nourishing and *non-threatening*.  To be masculine
is to be protective and agressive.  (This is the attribute that I
believe Bly calls "fierceness".)  These attributes are naturally
linked to one's biology, and are found throughout the animal kingdom,
almost universally among mammals.

This is not to say that women cannot possess "masculine"
characteristics or that men cannot possess "feminine" ones.  Just as
we all have hormones of both sexes, so we also have the mental
attributes of both genders.  But if gender is to have any significance
at all in society (and I know there are some who think it shouldn't)
then we cannot deny the dichotomy.

This essence of what it is to be masculine or feminine is of course an
ideal (or 'myth' if you prefer).  Real women can be threatening, and
real men can be anything but protective.  But I maintain that society,
and consequently all of us, will be better served if these myths are
*promoted* rather than derided.  Women feel in danger from men (and
therfore talk about having to protect themselves) not because the myth
of masculinity is too strong, but because it is too weak.  An ideal
man would never hurt a woman because it would me unmanly to do so.
Only men who no longer take the masculine myth seriously would beat or
rape a woman.

Being brutal is part of being a soldier.  I don't want a world in
which men are encouraged to be brutal towards women.  It is bad enough
for men to be brutal to other men.  I don't want a world in which
women are brutal at all.  Even if we accept that violence is
unavoidable, would it not be commendable if at least half of the human
race were exempt from it?

blchapma@eos.ncsu.edu (BEKKI LYN) writes:
>However, I'm not too sure that the opponents really want to protect
>women from being killed/captured/ raped.  I think they just don't
>want women potentially usurping some of their "macho" power away from
>them.

There are some (like myself) who really do want to protect women.

>Personally, I would like to see more men thinking about why they feel
>they must die at all costs just for a tad bit of heroism.  I guess
>they are afraid of being called a "coward" or worse yet, a "wimp".

Many men *have* thought about this, and written about it.  Making a
sacrifice for the common good has been considered a virtue, and only a
society that promotes self-absorption would denigrate that.  Courage
has been promoted as a "masculine" virtue--not in that automatically
appears in all men, nor in that it is unbecoming in women--but in that
it is *expected* of men.  Lack of courage can be forgiven in a woman
because she has other burdens to bear.  This is one of the few perks
that women have traditionally had.  Don't knock it.

In article <1a33smINNqpa@agate.berkeley.edu> Julie Wright
<julie@cucbs.chem.columbia.edu> writes in reply to:
>>[...]  I'm sorry, I just think that there isn't any male drive to
>>protect women.
>you meant you didn't think men had any kind of built-in drive to
>protect women any more than they'd protect men, and I agree with
>that.)

Well, I *don't* agree.  I think most men *would* would protect a woman
in preference to another man.  I certainly would.  And if both I and a
woman were in danger, and someone came to save us, I would expect that
the woman would be helped first.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>bickis@math.usask.ca<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Mik Bickis       \,,,       .*#*.  \    University of Saskatchewan
Department of        \,,,  ^\\|//^  ```\   Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Mathematics & Statistics \   )|(        ```\   Canada      S7N 0W0
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<S|A|S|K|A|T|C|H|E|W|A|N|>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



--
Post articles to soc.feminism, or send email to feminism@ncar.ucar.edu.
Questions and comments should be sent to feminism-request@ncar.ucar.edu.  This
news group is moderated by several people, so please use the mail aliases. Your
article should be posted within several days.  Rejections notified by email.