HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: lpj@col.hp.com (Laura Johnson)
Subject: Re: Errors in Covers (was Re: Hyperion covers)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 20:14:15 GMT
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division

jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann) writes:
> > 
> I don't see the point of such a boycott. You are punishing
> an author for something that is completely out of his/her control.
> Most authors don't get much of a say in cover art.  And as for the
> publisher: what would you like them to do?  Remember that the
> purpose of the cover is to help sell the book.  Should they say
> to hell with sales and put on a cover that will hurt sales?  Should
> they perhaps not have any cover illustration at all?

Yeah, OK, you're right, I'm wrong. I got a little bit irrational 
thinking about this whole thing. My intent, of course, was not to
punish the author, but to punish the people who hire the distributors
and buyers (who is this anyway? bookstore chains? who else?), all
of whom, presumably, get a cut of the sales, and would therefore
be hurt to some extent by a boycott. 

After all, if Chuq's contention is true--that this whole thing is
caused by a few bigots in influential positions--then there's a
theoretically simple answer: get rid of those few people. Problem is,
I don't know how to get at them. (I asked Chuq for their addresses &
license plate #s, but he didn't give them to me :-)). 'Cause I *don't*
expect the author or publisher to ignore sales, of course; that's
entirely impractical.


> 
> >Ideally, of course, such a boycott is accompanied by letters to the
> >publisher, explaining "Why I Didn't Buy This Book" in short words and
> > simple sentences.
> 
> You implied insult at publishers ("short words and simple sentences")
> is rather silly.  Most publishers are in fact better read and more
> literate than 80-90% of their readers.  
> --

Uh, here I just meant "this is a simple issue, don't complicate it."
I didn't mean publishers are illiterate.

Fine, so a boycott won't work because (a) it may not target the people
at fault and (b) even if it does, a lot of innocent bystanders (such as
the authors) will get caught in the crossfire. So how can we (effectively!)
complain about this appalling situation?

-Laura "foot in mouth" Johnson
-- 
lpj@hpctdls.col.hp.com
Opinions expressed are my own, but may be licensed for a nominal fee.

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: rcharbon@athena.mit.edu (Ray Charbonneau)
Subject: Re: Iain Banks "State of the Art": where can I find it?
Keywords: Iain Banks novella
Organization: Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 1992 10:57:06 GMT

In article <1992Jul21.135942.27176@mic.ucla.edu>, bruce@bnkl01.astro.ucla.edu (Bruce Macintosh) writes:
|> During one of the earlier iterations of the cyclically regenerating
|> Iain Banks discussion, I noticed a couple of references to a Culture
|> short story or novella called "State of The Art." Where did it appear?
|> Is there any way at all that I, living here in the US, could possibly
|> find a copy?
|> 

I've has it on special order at my bookstore for almost 2 months now....
They don't guarantee they can get it.

-- 
Ray Charbonneau              | The fifth dentist makes all the money.
rcharbon@athena.mit.edu      |             -- me
MIT and the Library Systems Office are glad that I'm posting my opinions
here so that they don't have to listen to them anymore.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: rjk@iastate.edu (Russell J Kraemer)
Subject: Re: Great SF Shorts
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames, IA
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1992 20:08:13 GMT

In article <9207211604.AA02251@rutgers.edu> D.GEISLER@ACAD.SUFFOLK.EDU writes:
>I will be teaching a course in the Fall semester on science fiction,

{request for fiction deleted}
>Much thanks,
>Deb Geisler
>"Academe_is_the real world; all else is bad fantasy."
>d.geisler@acad.suffolk.edu

Hmm you didnt mention what level of education you were talking about,
but I would recommend _The Moon is a Harsh Mistress_ by Heinlien.
It is not short by any means, but you can use it to open discussions
on artifical intellegence, various forms of goverment, alternative
marrige systems ( this might get you in trouble with the local school
board, which is a bad thing) and a host of other topics.

You can also use it to show that if an author writes one good book,
it dosent mean they are all good:). (Flame suit donned)


-- 
rjk@iastate.edu                 

I think therefore I.......shoot, was I saying something?
From: kipper@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Kip Ingram)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Dune Mailing List
Date: 28 Jul 92 13:04:53 GMT
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX

Dune Fans:

   I have created a "Dune" mailing list.  Anything related to Frank Herbert's
Dune series is fair game for this discussion group.  If you're interested in
joining, please send a request to kipper@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu.  I'll add you to
the mailing list.  To post messages to the list, send mail to
dune@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu.  I don't think you have to be a member to post; you
just won't receive any mail from the list unless you join.

Take care,
Kip Ingram
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: chris@MorningStar.Com (Chris Miller)
Subject: Beyond the Fall of Night
Organization: Morning Star Technologies
Distribution: na
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1992 20:32:11 GMT



I just finished reading _Beyond the Fall of Night_  and would like to hear
the net.consensus on this one.  The book is by Arthur C. Clarke and Gregory
Berenford (sp?) , but is based on and earlier Clarke work called 
_Against the Fall of Night_.

In order to keep this spoiler-free,  I will only say that I found the 
First part of BtFoN to be more-or-less straightforward "hard" sf.  The 
Second part, however, was really off the deep end.  It reminded me of
_Childhood's End_ and some other Clarke work. 

Does anyone know of authors other than Clarke who do this kind of writing?


Chris Miller
Chris@MorningStar.Com

Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: bruce@bnkl01.astro.ucla.edu (Bruce Macintosh)
Subject: Iain Banks "State of the Art": where can I find it?
Originator: bruce@bnkl01.astro.ucla.edu
Keywords: Iain Banks novella
Organization: UCLA Dept of Astronomy
Date: 21 Jul 92 13:59:42 PDT

During one of the earlier iterations of the cyclically regenerating
Iain Banks discussion, I noticed a couple of references to a Culture
short story or novella called "State of The Art." Where did it appear?
Is there any way at all that I, living here in the US, could possibly
find a copy?

Much thanks for any assistance anyone can give me . . . 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bruce Macintosh					bruce@bnkl01.astro.ucla.edu
UCLA Department of Astronomy			Infrared Imaging Detector Lab
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Many people ask us what our songs are about."
John Flansburgh, "They Might Be Giants", earning a nomination for the
1992 Understatement Of the Year Award . . . 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: DBA0007@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU (Joel Cunningham)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: re: "Slow Glass"
Date: 30 Jul 92 14:42:14 GMT

The story is "The Light Of Other Days" by Bob Shaw. Sorry, I can't remember
where I read it. It's at the house somewhere...


                                       -- Joel
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: at674@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Pete Nofel)
Subject: 10 Best Space Operas (Written / Film)
Reply-To: at674@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Pete Nofel)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 92 17:50:45 GMT


In the Re: space opera -- definition thread someone suggested a
list of the 10 best. Here's an off-the-cuff contribution in no
particular ranking:

   Written                        Film

The Mote in God's Eye          Star Wars
Skylark of Space               The Return of the Jedi
Footfall                       ST:TNG, the Borg episodes
The Black Star Passes          ST:TNG, Yesterday's Enterprise
Forever War
The last 0.25 of Earth
  (this doesn't really count)
Invaders from the Infinite
(and any other John W. Campbell
 super-science epic)

-- 
"It's money, and adventure, and fame. It's the thrill of a lifetime.
 And a long sea voyage that starts at six o'clock come morning."
     -- Carl Denham
        "King Kong"
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: mdl@phelixsalt (Michael Lynch)
Subject: Re: space opera:  definition
Reply-To: mdl@phelixsalt (Michael Lynch)
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 11:44:42 GMT



I have a difficult time defining "space opera" in anything but VERY
general terms.  First, it must take place in space.  Interstellar
space, specifically.  Second, it must contain liberal doses of corn
and melodrama.  Third, I want to think that the auther had fun
writing it.  I don't want to feel that I have to take anything I read
very seriously -- a space opera shouldn't place undue strain on my
intellect, because I'm merely using it for escape.  I want to leave
reality behind for a while, and I don't want to have to work too hard
while I'm away.

Resnick's _Santiago_ comes to mind immediately, as does Hubbard's
_Battlefield Earth_ (I don't want to start a discussion of Hubbard's
character, or of his ummmmmmm, "interesting" psychological ramblings).


Mike Lynch
From: katie@physics.Berkeley.EDU (Katie Schwarz)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Author Polls -- Sturgeon Results
Date: 28 Jul 92 00:52:05 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: physics.berkeley.edu

doom@leland.Stanford.EDU (Joseph Brenner) writes:
>I thought I might actually vote for once just because it was
>a Sturgeon poll, but when I actually tried to do it I
>couldn't figure out how.  How do you pick out the best
>"book" of a man who excelled at short stories?  _More Than
>Human_ and _Some of Your Blood_ are probably in the top
>three, but then I'd have to pick a collection.  Maybe
>_Sturgeon is Alive and Well_?
>
I had the same problem. The format of the poll seems to require
voting for individual stories, so I picked three stories. But two
of those (and several others I wanted to vote for) are in the
collection _E Pluribus Unicorn_; that's the book I'd recommend
most, except I think it's out of print.

_Sturgeon is Alive and Well_ contains Slow Sculpture, which I think
is the quintessential Sturgeon story, but I don't think the rest of
the collection is quite as good.

................
katie@physics.berkeley.edu, Sturgeon-addict
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written,rec.arts.sf.science
From: szabo@techbook.com (Nick Szabo)
Subject: Re: Restricted breeding (was Re: The Moat around God's Eye)
Organization: TECHbooks --- Public Access UNIX --- (503) 644-8135
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1992 10:25:21 GMT

In article <726@tdat.teradata.COM> swf@tdat.teradata.com (Stanley Friesen) writes:

>If there is a crash, then *everyones* offspring are at risk,

But each individual offspring is at equal risk.  The rabbit which had
10 bunnies, perhaps helping to cause the crash, will have 10 times
the chance of offspring surviving the crash than the rabbit which,
in a fit of ecological correctness :-), restricted itself to one
offspring.  Genes for "ecological correctness" will be eliminated.


-- 
szabo@techbook.COM  Public Access User --- Not affiliated with TECHbooks
Public Access UNIX and Internet at (503) 644-8135 (1200/2400, N81)
From: fuller@athena.cs.uga.edu (James P. H. Fuller)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Umberto Eco's _Name_of_the_Rose_ Companion/Reference
Date: 22 Jul 92 17:03:05 GMT
Organization: University of Georgia, Athens

cwes1@cs.aukuni.ac.nz (Clare West) writes:

> [Sorry couldn't resist this, don't treat it as a flame, it's not]

  's okay... it went a bit wide of the mark anyway.


>> fuller@athena.cs.uga.edu (James P. H. Fuller) writes:
>>
>>   _The Key to _The Name of the Rose_ _ 
>>       Adele Haft, Jane White, Robert White
>>       Ampersand Associates Inc, Harrington Park, NJ
>>       
>>    Includes a guide to the historical and literery references in TNOTR and
>> translations of all non-English passages.
>
> So it contains a full translation then? Wouldn't it be better just to
> give translations of those bits not alreay translated into english in
> the English translation of TNOTR?


    Ahem.  It seems pretty clear from the title of the companion volume
(_The Key to TNOTR_) and my references to TNOTR, and *your* reference to
TNOTR, that we're talking about _The Name of the Rose_ and the non-English
passages therein -- as contrasted with _Il Nome Della Rosa_, which is a
different fish....
                                                -- jf
From: FARMERMJ@VAX1.BHAM.AC.UK
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: RE: Daniel Keyes
Date: 31 Jul 92 20:18:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: rutgers.9207311519.AA29378

Since there'e been discussion of whether Flowers for Algernon was based on
a real case, I thought I'd mention something concerning another Keyes work:

A few years ago, there was an article in New Scientist about multiple
personalities, and what they showed about the workings of the mind.  This was
all very well, but the author quoted, to demonstrate her theory, the case
reported in _The_minds_of_Billy_Milligan_ by Daniel Keyes.  I'd never heard of
the book, but the author's name made me do a double-take.  The author of the 
article apparently thought that it was the story of a real person, rather 
than a novel!  So if you think that Keye's characters sound real, there are 
people out there who actually think they *are* real. (I only got that issue of
New Scientist, so I never found whether any correspondent broke the bad news to
the author)
From: rogrif@SNLL-ARPAGW.LLNL.GOV (griffith richard o)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Iain Bank's "Use of Weapons"
Date: 22 Jul 92 20:19:16 GMT

I had posted earlier upon finishing Iain Banks "Consider Phlebas", so for those
following the Banks postings I thought I would toss in some more comments upon
finishing "Use of Weapons".

***SPOILERS, for those who care ***

I found CP to be quite good and incrediably depressing, all at the same
time.  Having been warned by other Bank's fans on the net, I was better
prepared for "Use of Weapons".  Although I found the writing in UoW to be
more disjointed that CP, for some reason the ending was much less depressing
to me.  I am now trying to decide if it was ACTUALLY less depressing than`
CP, or if I was simply prepared for Bank's style and therefore was not
shocked as much as I was with CP.  I WAS extremely suprised, but perhaps
finding out that the good guy was the bad guy, so to speak, twisted up my
feelings and kept me from getting pissed about the ending.

Speaking of the ending, did Zekalwe (sp?) actually DIE, or what?  I admit
to being semi-concious when I finished the book last night (it was LATE),
but I believe that the drone succeeded in saving him.  Also, the closing
little scene had our "hero" in the same setting that opened the book, but
with a bald head, indicating that it happened after his near death when
he went to visit his "sister".  On the other hand, Sma was out recruiting
a NEW man to apparently do the kind of work Zekalwe was doing, but I
somehow had the impression that she only "controlled" one such person at
a time.  

I appreciate any thoughts and comments on these topics (or any others,
actually; I am not picky!)

richard griffith
From: verbit@brauer.harvard.edu (Mikhail S. Verbitsky)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Michael Moorcock's Swords Trilogy
Date: 26 Jul 92 14:53:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Jul26.105342.14184
Organization: Dept. of Math, Harvard Univ.

In article <24056@castle.ed.ac.uk> fofp@castle.ed.ac.uk (M Holmes) writes:

	[ most of very interesting article deleted to save bandwidth ]

>Moorcock's most famous connection with rock music though is undoubtedly
>with the British band "Hawkwind".

>Hawkwind started out in 1969 as very much an acid rock/hippie band. The
>UK answer to the Grateful Dead. They played Free Festivals and layby's.
>Their music had settled down by 1972 to a kind of soft metal with loads
>of synthesisers. They varied it though, some tracks were just
>straight-out acid rock jams and some were quite lilting snth tracks
>featuring saxophone or violin depending who was in the band at the time.
>They had one major hit single with "Silver Machine" in 1972.

>Moorcock came across Hawkwind in 1973 simply because they were all
>hanging around Portobello Road/Ladbroke Grove in London. through their
>itinerant poet Robert Calvert (now deceased) Hawkwind had developed a
>science fiction background to their music, often basing songs on a
>mixture of SF and hippie mysticism. Moorcock appeared at a few gigs and
>read poetry while the band played.

>Eventually, in 1974 the Collaboration led to the album "Warrior on the
>Edge of Time" based on Moorcock's Eternal Champion books.  Moorcock both
>plays and narrates on the album.  It's one of Hawkwind's best albums by
>one of their best lineups. 

	Moorcock also wrote one of their best songs, "Sonic Attack", 
	circa 72 or 73. Around 1977, he wrote a trilogy (in collaboration
	with M. Buttersworth) about Hawkwind musicians in sf/apocalyptic
	setting. The personages of the story have had the same aliases
	as they have on Hawkwind records.

	A little correction: Robert Calvert is rather decayed than
	deceased :(. He died in 1989 from a heart attack, being 
	~ 40 years old. He put out several solo albums; the
	list of guests included Moorcock, who played banjo,
	and Brian Eno.

	Misha.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: tedk@jpl.NoSubdomain.NoDomain (Ted Ko)
Subject: Re: BOOKS BY DAVID EDDINGS
Organization: Bellcore
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 92 13:08:13 GMT

In article <10726446.78.711694821@eng2.eng.monash.edu.au>, 10726446@eng2.eng.monash.edu.au (LAU WAI KUEN) writes:
|> In article <920720153956.4340081f@bigvax.alfred.edu> BANKERR@BIGVAX.ALFRED.EDU writes:
|> >From: BANKERR@BIGVAX.ALFRED.EDU
|> >Subject: BOOKS BY DAVID EDDINGS
|> >Date: 20 Jul 92 19:39:56 GMT
|> 
|> 
|> 
|>     Very good.  I find that sums up all the books Mr Eddings has written 
|> extremely well.  Do you want to comment on the crap he vomits up too?
|> 
|> Halcyon

Let's put an IMO on that there statement, eh?  Eddings original Belgariad
(IMHO) is one of the all time classics of fantasy.  True that everything since
then has been much weaker, but that's due in a large part to his style repetition which can get old after a series or two.

<--The-Dark-Elf-<<<
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: hal@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Hal Wadleigh)
Subject: Re: "slow glass": story reference sought
Reply-To: hal@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Hal Wadleigh)
Organization: Interleaf, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 16:23:59 GMT

Those "slow glass" stories were published in Analog in the '70's.  The main
title I remember is "The Light of Other Days."  Look through some of the
award and "Year's Best" collections around 1972.
From: dave@cs.arizona.edu (Dave Schaumann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: List of voters in ESF award so far
Date: 30 Jul 92 15:56:22 GMT
Reply-To: dave@cs.arizona.edu (Dave Schaumann)
Organization: University of Arizona

In article <1992Jul28.161415.22035@math.ucla.edu>, dstein@rhea (David Stein) writes:
>Brad Templeton writes:
>>20 times as
>>many people grabbed the stories, [as voted in the ESF]
>>people are waiting to read them and vote.  Voting closes Aug 10.
>
> 20 times?!?  It's hard to believe so few people voted then...
>
> Either they do not like the stories or they dislike the voting system.

Or they just haven't read them all yet.  It takes maybe 5 minutes to
ftp them; perhaps an hour to read them all.

C'mon, people -- let's vote! (I have.)

-- 
You unlock this door with the key of imagination.  Beyond it is another
dimension: a dimension if sound, a dimension of sight, a dimension of mind.
You're moving into a land of both shadow and substance, of things and ideas.
You've just crossed over into... the Twilight Zone.
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
From: mcconnel@Chaos.mcs.kent.edu (Mike McConnell)
Subject: Re: Going Back in Time to Meet Jesus Christ -- What Would You See?
Organization: Kent State University
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 21:27:37 GMT

In article <1992Jul30.010350.2000@unlinfo.unl.edu>, jam@cse.unl.edu (James Macfarlane) writes:
|> pmoloney@maths.tcd.ie (Paul Moloney) writes:
|> 
|> >pharvey@mipos3.intel.com (Paul Harvey) writes:
|> 
|> >>If you want to know what it was like, watch Monty Python's "Life of Brian".
|> >>The original title was Life Of Jesus, but some people felt that would be
|> >>too realistic. Always look on the bright side of life ...
|> 
|> >Actually, there's a very good Sf short story about package holidays
|> >to Jerusalem at the time of Jesus to witness his crucifiction. Can 
|> >anyone remember the title?
|> 
|> I have the story in question, but right now I can't seem to remember its
|> real title, but it's something on the order of _Time Patrol_.  This 
|> segment is only a small part of it, but the whole story is quite goodIMHO.
|> I also can't remember who the author is, but it is something like Moorcock
|> would write.  I'll look when I go home, and if noone else has responded, will
|> fill in the blanks.
|> -James
|> 
|> >P.
|> --
|> 
|> James A. MacFarlane    |                           | 2500 S. 10th St.  #30
|> jam@cse.unl.edu        |    THIS SPACE FOR RENT    | Lincoln, NE  68502-3439
|> University of Nebraska |                           | voice: (402)438-6632
  
  I think the book you're refering to is _Up the Line_ by Silverberg.

Mike McConnell
Department of Mathematics
Kent State University
From: Debra.Power@UM.CC.UMICH.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Len
Date: 23 Jul 92 01:08:28 GMT

A great Stanislaw Lem book for new readers is 
"The Futurological Congress"
It's very humurous and satirical while giving the reader
a taste of Lem's unique style.
From: aaron@space.ualberta.ca (Aaron Humphrey)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Niven dials
Date: 31 Jul 92 19:51:59 GMT
Reply-To: aaron@space.ualberta.ca
Organization: University Of Alberta, Edmonton Canada
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

In a number of his short stories, Larry Niven has his characters "dial" for
things--in teleport booths; I seem to remember them dialing for food more than
once, etc.  I always read this picturing an actual dial--you know, like on the
older(pre-touch-tone)model of telephone.

Suddenly last night it occurred to me--dialing could also be considered to
include using a telephone-type keypad.  Which makes a >lot< more sense to me.
But I don't think that "dial" is the right word here.  What would be?  "Punch?"
Something like that, I guess.

It reminds me of somebody(I think it was Isaac Asimov)talking about Heinlein's
famous line "The door dilated."  He proceeded to analyze the fact that a door
that dilates like a camera shutter would take up a lot of space, besides being
round, an inconvenient shape for doors, especially for wheeled vehicles and
other devices.  He contended that, taking a more general meaning of dilated,
that all it referred to was the door opening from the middle, much like in
Star Trek.  And I thought, "Well, if that's what he meant, wouldn't he have
said it that way, rather than use a world that's so misleading?"

Now I can think that of Larry Niven and his "dials" too.  Because I no longer
think he meant a round dial, but a punch keypad--which would seem more logical
in the first place.  So why use dial?

Comments?  Questions?  Flames?  Sympathy?  Cigars?  Cigarettes?  Poi?

--
---Alfvaen(a.k.a. Aaron V. Humphrey, Page of Newts)
Canadian Network For Space Research, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
"You see, if I was in your blood, then you wouldn't be so ugly."
Current Album--Kid Creole & The Coconuts:Wise Guy
Current Read--M.J. Engh:Wheel of The Winds
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written