HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: fax0243@uoft02.utoledo.edu
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: What's the point?
Date: 13 Apr 92 16:19:53 EST
Organization: University of Toledo, Computer Services

In article <1992Apr13.040039.1376@udel.edu>, weigand@pecan.udel.edu (Steve Weigand) writes:> 
> There's one other thing you forgot... A feeling of inner-peace, strength, and
> harmony. Mental fitness, if you will. Perhaps even beyond just "fitness".
> 
> Ciao!
>   -Steve Weigand
>    (weigand@freezer.cns.udel.edu)
> 

Yeah, I've heard a lot about this mental fitness thing. I think  mine could 
use a bit of tuning. 

Sonya
From: sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: White: Color of Gis, Color of Mourning - ?
Date: 7 Apr 92 05:26:59 GMT
Organization: Cray Computer Corporation

In article <1992Apr7.052335.756@craycos.com> sog@craycos.com (Steve Gombosi) writes:
>>
>
>Heh heh heh. Never done suwari-wazam, have you?
        			    ^
Make that "waza" -- they *must* have put Fluorinert in the coffee...

Sumtaimz ay kint tipe tu goud...

Steve
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Bruce Lee on...
Date: 9 Apr 92 17:58:02 GMT

09-Apr-92 17:01	tac@cs.brown.edu (Ted A. Camus)	Bruce Lee on Classical Karate

> In 9/71 Black Belt, reprinted in this year's winter Yearbook, he wrote
> a famous article entitled "Liberate Yourself From Classical Karate",
> in which he basically says that regimented drills can only create 
> conditioned responses and inhibits the creativity and ultimate potential
> of the martial artist.  Let me focus on one particular quote :
>
>   "Through instictive feeling, each of us KNOWS [emp. his] our own 
>    most efficient and dynamic manner of achieving effective leverage, 
>    balance in motion, economical use of energy, etc."
>
> I think this statement basically says it all.  It's complete, total,
> unmitigated rubbish !!  There are *countless* attributes, characteristics,
> capabilities and even "secrets" of the human organism that take years 

I am certainly (no longer anyway) a big Bruce Lee fan, but I do believe there
is a nice element of truth in the quote.  In truth I think you are both
correct.  For most of us, we won't discover much without being taught.  That
is why I think you are correct.  This is also why I am not thrilled about
karate of course, because to me it is kung fu stripped of all the secrets the
Chinese masters incorporated in the original art.  On the other hand, _with
good instruction_, I believe that in order to really excel in an art, one must
make discoveries on one's own, and in my view they are typically humble
extensions of what the master has already provided.  For example, my teacher
emphasizes that the shoulder joints *must* be supple.  Compared to his, mine
are like stiff clay BUT, just I happen to meet a woman named Oopalie, who is
one of India's most famous classical dancers, and who, 5 years ago, took up
instruction in an Indian martial art called Cho (sp? rhymes with "joe").
Anyway, her "guru" (as she calls him) taught her a specific exercise intended
to loosed the shoulder joints.  Of course now I use it.  This is my extension.
Big deal right?  Right.  I have not yet mastered my teacher's teachings,
therefore I must be very cautious about additions.  Too often I have seen him
open up a whole new world for me with just a word about something that strikes
me afterward as having been patently obvious if only I had "discovered" it
myself.  

Besides this, I think virtually everyone has annointed Bruce Lee with a
god-hood of which he is undeserving.  He was a good martial artist.  I think
there are many who are much better.  It was our ignorance of *any* martial
arts that permitted him to strike the American conciousness when he did,
opening the gateway for others to follow.  I believe to continue to worship
his image is real dumb.
From: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: MA stuff
Keywords: demo, youth_breaking, e-chi, stretching
Date: 9 Apr 92 17:56:11 GMT
Reply-To: snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil (Stephen Northcutt)
Organization: Naval Surface Warfare Center

Dakin was asking about kids breaking, per micro fractures and all
and this is indeed a large concern for me, of course kids jump off
6' high or taller walls, fall off their bikes on concrete and all
that other stuff, nevertheless when my 7 yr old is practicing breaks
I have him wear his MA shoes and restrict him to hammerfist for
hand techniques.

Electronic Chi.  The latest flap about dougie_poo and all.  Pooh
is the "pet" name for my red rotteweiler yogi who isn't purebred and
we were told he was half GSD, but since people kept saying "Funny you 
don't look GSD" or more to the point "Is he a pit bull" I went back to
the marine from whom I got him.  "Oh yeah, I found out the dad is a
Staffordshire Bull Terrier"  So Pooh can be a most interesting endearment.
Not to mention Tao of Pooh.  But getting old it all is, except that
I did want to ask..... does anyone else sometimes think they feel the
force of a poster?  Electronic Chi if you will.  Could just be the
words they write or the way they write them, but there are some folk
that over time, I have decided have stong chi, Doug being one BTW.
Anywho don't feel bad Marty, when I was young I knew it all too, alas
I have forgotten more now  than I never learned :-)

Demo, this Sat.  April 11, 4 -5 PM Downtown Fredericksburg VA as part
of the pear blossom festival.  Just follow the signs to old town, demo
at market square.  There is also a big tourney in MD same day and
a bunch of my best people are going so the demo team will be a mix
of two schools and some non team member students, but even so I hope
to put on a good show.  I understand I will be manning the mike vis
actually performing, but as oldest surviving member of the team, if
anybody does not show up or gets injured it is my lot to take that
place. Call the school (703) 898-8111 for further info.

Can't fight now, I gotta stretch.  Surely we are joking right?  Sure
there are days I am tight (every Thursday, the day after BB training)
but no problem, that means I have a hearder time putting my head on
my knee, not kicking.
===================================================================
   ** my dream: voice, video, data, 3 services, 1 network **
===================================================================

Stephen Northcutt (snorthc@relay.nswc.navy.mil)     Networks Program Manager
From: ogorman@unix1.tcd.ie (Lucifuge)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Favorite Sparring Combinations
Keywords: sparring, combinations
Date: 13 Apr 92 12:43:42 GMT
Organization: Trinity College, Dublin

In <1992Apr12.023043.7421@athena.cs.uga.edu> greg@athena.cs.uga.edu (Greg Whitlock) writes:

>I was wondering if people would post/email me their favorite sparring
>combinations?  I have a tournament coming up next month and I'm looking
>for some new and interesting combinations.  

>Someone mentioned in another thread that they just stood in one place and
>waited.  I thought that was funny (and will probably try it) but I need 
>something for when I do move.  

>This will be my first "official" tournament so anything will be appreciated.

Depends on the rules but:

1. Opponent straight punches.
2. Shuffle forward and to outside with outward block. 
3. With blocking hand throw a back knuckle to the face/head.
4. Step behind. Hit him in the back.

Basic Point. It isn't what you throw, it's when you throw it and from
where.

That's the defensive one.            

Alternatively.

About half way through your match (say two to three points in) after you
have just hit/been hit, go on guard, when referee says 'begin', wait a
mo, if your opponent hasn't attacked immediately, drop your guard, stand
up straight, walk to your opponent calmly and hit him. I know it sounds
silly but you wouldn't believe the amount of people who stand there
looking dumbfounded when you don't act as you're meant to...

Ollie...
From: twcaps@tennyson.lbl.gov (Terry Chan)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Bruce Lee on...
Keywords: -=-=-< humor >-=-=-, oh absolutely!
Date: 16 Apr 92 18:37:52 GMT
Article-I.D.: dog.22751
Reply-To: twchan@lbl.gov (Terry Chan)
Organization: Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, Berkeley
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.3.12.117

In article <1992Apr14.175245.8150@eng.umd.edu> doug@eng.umd.edu 
	(Douglas N. Cohen) writes:

  [lots of stuff edited and deleted out]

 +>JACKIE CHAN IS GOD !!!!!!!!!!!! 
 
 +>missed and he got nailed. Therefore, logically, and with no emotian clouding +>my argument, he is God. :-)
 +
 +	who could argue with this....  * i'm * convinced...

Hey, I thought we weren't supposed to discuss religion on this newsgroup.
Please take it to alt.talk.bruce.lee.


Terry "Who is this Bruce Lee guy anyway?" Chan
--
================================================================================
INTERNET:  twchan@lbl.gov              BITNET:  twchan@lbl.bitnet
  "I think it's stupid. We collect all these business cards, and it turns
                    out nobody wants them."
From: psc@sei.cmu.edu (Peter Capell)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Police/Otis (D. Poore)
Date: 10 Apr 92 16:06:02 GMT


I am curious why Otis' feels his Go Ju instruction is inadequate for police
work.  My Go Ju instructor was a marine who used his Go Ju in front line
combat in Vietnam, and then became a policeman for the University of
Pittsburgh.   He was constantly citing examples of how he managed to subdue
perpetrators without use of overwhelmingly violent force (pressure points,
grips, etc.) in his daily work.  I must say though, that our Go Ju training
had a great deal of Jiu Jitsu involved in it, so perhaps I don't know a very
"pure" form of Go Ju.  Anyway, I'm still surprised by the comment.
From: cammarta@bucknell.edu (aaron cammarata `93)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: EXODUS, et al.
Keywords: forms, music
Date: 11 Apr 92 23:25:20 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: Bucknell University, Lewisburg, Pa.


	I am a middle-belt student of TKD, and during my last class, I was
introduced to the form called Exodus.  It's done to music, and I beleive it's
supposed to be a black belt form.  My questions are these:
	1) What do you think of forms done to music?
	2) Does anyone know for sure what level it's supposed to be, or if it's
just a form that anyone can learn?  (i.e., I think that brown belts must
perform it to music in order to pass to black, making it a black belt form.)
	3) What other forms are you aware of that are done to music?

	In all fairness, I'll start the thread by answering...
	1) I loved learning it.  The music to Exodus is from a 50's movie, I think
about the liberation of Israel, but I'm not sure.  The music itself is very
powerful, and when you're out there performing the hyung, you can feel it
coursing through your veins.  It's a really neat experience.
	Also, doing forms to music is GREAT practice for your other forms, as
well.  If you miss a move in, say, DoSan, no problem.  Just hesitate for a sec,
think what's next, and move on.  If you hesitate in Exodus, "forget it.  The
train's already left town, and you have to catch it at the next station."  (In
the words of my instructor.)
	2) Like I said, I think it's black belt, but I'm not so sure...
	3) I've also heard of a form called Beethoven's 5th.  I'd really like to
learn that one, being a fan and all.

-- 

					Aaron


==================================================================================
cammarta@bucknell.edu|     "Life is pain, Highness.
                     |         Anyone who says differently is selling something."
        DT2B         |                     "The Princess Bride"
==================================================================================
From: scheid@danzan.EBay.Sun.COM (David Scheid)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Ouch! Groin kick
Date: 9 Apr 92 00:09:04 GMT
Reply-To: scheid@danzan.EBay.Sun.COM
Distribution: na
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: danzan.ebay.sun.com

In article zt7Hdm6l6@cs.psu.edu, liblit@cs.psu.edu (Benjamin R. Liblit) writes:
>In article <1992Apr8.162452.25948@colorado.edu> ejh@khonshu.colorado.edu (Edward J. Hartnett) writes:

>> Anyone else ever hear of this jumping up and down on the heels?

>First time I took a groin shot, I didn't jump up and down on my heels.
>My instructor grabbed around my ribcage from behind and *bounced* me!
>Guess that's more or less the same thing....

The jumping up & down on the heels is a Kappo for minor groin injuries.
There are a series of Kappos which are taught in Jujutsu (reduced number
are taught in Judo).

---
Dave Scheid - All Disclaimers Apply
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
From: jonathan@psych.psy.uq.oz.au (Jonathan Dwyer)
Subject: _JuJutsu_ (was: Which Style To Take) 
Followup-To: rec.martial-arts
Organization: Psychology Department, University of Queensland
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 00:38:34 GMT

ninjam@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Marty) writes:
|> tk@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Tommy Kelly) says:
|> 
|> >Jiu-jitsu - Is more flexible than karate and TKD, but classes in my
|> >	 area are few and far between.
|> >	  Also, I wonder if there is any possibility of competition.
|> 
|> Jiu-Jutsu as far as I know does not have competition, because the techniques
|> emphasize joint locks, ect.  I would think that in the heat of competition
|> someone might go too far by accident and break someone's limbs, etc...

I've always believed that competitions are unusual in Jujutsu because it
was first designed more as a means of survival on the battlefield (after being
knocked off your horse and divested of your weapon) than as a way as such.
There are lots of blocks, defenses against hand-held weapons, joint locks,
low kicks (to unbalance knees and so forth) and ground-fighting skills.
It is a set of various techniques borrowed from many different martial-arts
with a single aim in mind: to keep you alive.  That is,  it is for serious fighting
and not really intended for study as a 'way' of any sort.

Awareness of ki and other such esoteric exotica is only there insofar as it
can help you hurt someone who is trying to hurt you.  (Open mouth, remove
tongue from inner side of cheek....wipe grin from face :-)

Jonathan Dwyer
jonathan@psych.psy.uq.oz.au
Just the FAX: +617 365 4466
From: pauljone@aludra.usc.edu (Michael Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: How to choose a Martial Art discipline?
Date: 10 Apr 1992 14:11:26 -0700
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Distribution: na
NNTP-Posting-Host: aludra.usc.edu
Keywords: Crunch, Break, Ow!

There's been a lot of editing in the below quoted material, but I
hope I have preserved the intent of what was written.

In article <36033@ogicse.ogi.edu> hakanson@bogart.cse.ogi.edu (Marion Hakanson) writes:
>In article <1992Apr6.202737.24494@bnr.ca> naldrett@bcarh893.bnr.ca (Steve Naldrett) writes:
>>4. Gentle or Crush-and-Maime?
>>   a) Gentle (protect yourself without hurting opponent):
>>      P - aikido, tai chi

>Uh, the Tai Chi philosophy I've been exposed to, when talking about
>self defense, has been more in the Crush and Maim category.  Here are
>some quotes from my teacher.  "You punch him here, Hng!, break his
>ribs."  "You pull him like this, then you break him, Pah!."  "Best
>defense is a strong offense."

>If you've ever seen Chen Style, these things are fairly obvious.  I
>happen to study Yang Style, where it's a bit more hidden, but the
>principles are the same (my teacher does both).

>However, you can learn Tai Chi without ever being exposed to any of
>this defense stuff -- just depends on the teacher and on what you want.


I have to agree with this.  T'ai Chi has the capacity to be very
gentle, while still being an effective means of self-defense.
But it is also true that as a MA, the basic philosphy seems to be:
Use the soft grappling techniques to render your opponent helpless,
then trash him.  In fact, I have a hard time imagining the use of
any 'fa jing' movements, without causing severe injury to your
opponent (well, maybe some of the simple pushes).  Still, I think
there is a lot to be said for the gentle use of this art.

I have been trying to teach some friends the Yang form with the
emphasis on gentle self-defense, as in Aikido.  Short of leaving
several movements out of the form, or simply not explaining what
all of the martial uses of the movements are, I find this very
difficult.  I trust that by the time they are able to use the
strikes effectively, they will have advanced enough to know
when use them.  (Hmm, leaving movements out or not explaining them.
Seems like the standard for many TCC schools.)

I have to disagree with the idea that you can learn T'ai Chi Ch'uan
without learning the self-defense aspects.  Many people like to
think that if they ignore violence sincerely enough, that it will
just go away.  Often, when these people are confronted with violence,
they are still filled with rage, anger, and hatred.  One of the
greatest benefits of studying any MA is that you have to face the
violence within yourself.  By confronting your desire to harm another
person, coupled with the eventual understanding of how easily we
can and do hurt people every day, hopefully you will be able
overcome this.  I have seen many non-martial T'ai Chi schools,
and usually I find them to be without substance.





JMNSHO,
Mike Jones
From: tms@cs.umd.edu (Tom Swiss (not Swift, not Suiss, Swiss!))
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Ouch! Groin kick
Date: 8 Apr 92 05:11:02 GMT
Organization: The Reality Liberation Front (pixels to the people!)


     Thought I'd share a hard-learned lesson with the net...

     We did some tournament-type sparring tonight (usually we just
bang away, but this time we were keeping points). I was going up
against a friend who usually outscores me. At the end of two minutes,
we were tied 1-1, so we went into a one-minute sudden death (I really,
really don't like the use of that term in a m-a context...) overtime.

     I tried to be clever with a jumping front snap kick, to give him
something unexpected to deal with. Unfortunately, he decided to throw
a front kick at my midsection the same time, and my groin was where
my midsection used to be. The kick was angled in such a way that my
cup provided little protection; I haven't hurt like that in a long time.

     Observations: 

     1) While this sure hurt like hell, if this had been an actual
combat situation it would have slowed me down, but not stopped me.
(For purposes of the sparring, though, I was done for the night.)  So
beware of thinking that a groin kick will finish a fight. It will slow
your opponent down, but it might also make him more despirate.  If
this had been an actual fight, I probably would have dropped to one
knee to try to recover and gone into fight-as-dirtily-as-possible mode

     2) Thou shalt not attempt a jumping kick against an opponent who
may attempt to kick you. You're opening up a prime target. If that
kick had been full force and on center...well, I don't want to think
about it.

     3) I was wearing a kind of flat, triangular cup. I think I'll
stick to my better-fitting bannana-shaped one in the future.

     4) If you should be so unlucky as to take a shot to the groin
during sparring yourself, I highly suggest retiring to the locker
room ASAP and removing your cup; I found it to be a great relief.

     5) The first thing that popped into my head after I was hit was
an old Bill Cosby routine about being hit in the groin during a 
nationally televised football game...

===============================================================================
Tom Swiss/tms@flubber.cs.umd.edu| "Born to die" | Keep your laws off my brain!
     "What's so funny 'bout peace, love and understanding?" - Nick Lowe 
          This is a .signature antibody. Vaccinate your .sig!
     "Around computers it is difficult to find the correct unit of time
      to measure progress.  Some cathedrals took a century to complete.
      Can you imagine the grandeur and scope of a program that would
      take as long?"
      -- Epigrams in Programming, ACM SIGPLAN Sept. 1982
From: tep@mbunix.mitre.org (Price)
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
Subject: Re: Herbal Poultices
Date: 16 Apr 92 17:56:22 GMT
Article-I.D.: linus.1992Apr16.175622.26128
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, Bedford, MA

I have used herbs in my martial arts studies for many years, both taken
internally and as a poultice or other external application.  I am convinced
of their effectiveness for many applications.  The availability of Chinese
herbs has varied considerably in the various places I have lived and studied,
so I have used many native North American herbs that provide the same or
equivalent healing and medicinal properties.  

In particular, I found that an herbal treatment that I used early in 
my iron palm training to be extremely
effective.  We called it "boil the hand medicine" and it uses Comfrey and White Oak Bark that is heated in water.  Other herbs are sometimes used in combinationbut the primary ingredient is the Comfrey.  The hands are immersed into the hot water and remain as long as can be tolerated (while heating the water), then 
removed and allowed to air dry.  This is repeated several times.  I found it to be extremely effective for relieving the cramping and tightness of the joints in the hand.  It also has similar properties as teh iron palm linament in the 
dispersement of bruises.  It was indespensible in my early training periods whenmy  hands were not accustomed to the training trauma.

   I have had the opportunity to use many other herbs and herbal combinations
over the years and found them to be an integral part of my training regimine.

   

-- 
		    Bye for now,
				Tom

DISCLAIMER: Deesclamer?? I doan' need no steeenkin' deeslamer!!!
Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts