Newsgroups: bit.listserv.christia
Date:         Sun, 23 Aug 1992 21:39:05 EDT
From:         MKLINE%VDH.BITNET@VTVM2.CC.VT.EDU
Subject:      Aborted what?
X-To:         christia%asuacad.BITNET@VTVM2.CC.VT.EDU

Subject: Aborted what?


Steve responds, I agree and comment ------------------------------------>
   I realize not everyone considers the unborn to be people, but based on
what I have just said, the argument must ultimately come down to whether or
not the unborn are people.  If they aren't, then abortion isn't murder (but
according to the Catholic Church, it still would be at least as immoral as
birth control).  However, if the unborn really are people, then abortion
really is murder.

   But what if the unborn become people at some point before they are born?
Well then, at what point is this?  And are you certain enough of your answer
that there is any age of an unborn child that you can be absolutely certain
that they are not yet people?  If not, then by allowing abortion you run the
real risk of allowing real people to be killed.  Certainly if you drive by
someone's house, and shoot through a window with closed curtains, you may
not intend to kill a person, but you run the risk of doing so if you don't
know for certain no one is there.

MAKS> Giana or who ever the child is that WAS aborted is one one of the
      new "Life: What a beautiful choice".

      For those not familiar, Giana IS an aborted fetus and was left to
      die. She IS the PRODUCT of a saline abortion. She was not a
      carrot, a dog, a cat, or a blob of tissue, she was a human, a
      girl badly burned, had to have many operations and has Cerebral
      Palsy as a result of her being ABORTED.

      What grieves my soul, and makes me wonder if Jesus cries, is that
      people could see this and think "She'd be better off dead." Some
      may say "Now, I didn't say that.", but they are "for choice".
      Giana(I hope I have her name right, if I ever get the chance to
      tape the commercial, I'll get the whole thing, it's short), will
      live with her abortion all her life. She praises God for her life,
      and sings His praises everywhere she goes in speeches against
      abortion.

      But remember, when she was born, her body was badly burned, she
      may have already had Cerebral Palsy, and she had no family, no
      one who cared for her. If she were a dog, then she WOULD have
      been better dead perhaps, but she wasn't, she was a girl.

      Not necessarily the people on this list, but I'm sure there would
      be a ton of people who would be "Pro Choice for Abortion" if they
      could with nearly 100% success TRANSFER the fetus to an incubator
      for say, $200 or abort for $150. In Ankerberg's last tape they
      had a PP lawyer who said it didn't matter what the fetus was
      determined to be, human or not. They were talking freedom and
      this thing, person or not, stood in the way of that freedom,
      and freedom comes first. Makes one wonder, "When I become old,
      would I want this person defending me if I wanted to stay with
      my children?"

      Chuck Colson has a plan for prisoners to work for and pay back
      those they have hurt. He says it is scriptural, and I haven't
      taken the time to look up the references, but I know Paul called
      himself a "bond servant" and I remember that a person could sell
      himself say, for 7 years for some goods or services. If this
      man's "master" offered a better life than what he could ever hope
      to make as a "free man" than the person could then become a
      "bond servant" for life. I would think that this may have been
      some of the people the scriptures were talking about.

      Anyhow, to tie this all in, an "unexpected pregnancy" is a sin,
      and a crime if they didn't want the baby. Still, perhaps, the
      mother should, I believe she should, at least serve her nine
      month sentence and deliver the baby. The baby was not the one
      who committed the crime, but the mother and the father. I think
      at a minimum the woman should carry the child (mind you, if she
      would die, or anything like that, it may be different, but
      barring that...) to term and the father (and with genetic
      examination, they can determine that) foot the bill. I also
      agree with something Pat Robertson once said, that we could
      tape the father's Social Security if he wanted to be a @#$$
      about the whole thing. And, like I said, they have genetic
      examinations now that could determine the father if he tried
      to deny it. They caught our "Hillside Strangler" that way,
      and used it to determine how many patients Kimberly Bergallis'
      dentist infected with AIDS.

      Well, I've rambled on enough.

Maks
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