From: wlrc@uhura.neoucom.edu (William R. Cruce)
Subject: CITIZEN KANE on LD, was Re: Opinions wanted from couple of LD's
Summary: New CRI CAV is the best!
Keywords: Criterion, Turner, RKO, Image, Voyager 
Organization: Northeastern Ohio Universities College of Medicine
Distribution: rec
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1993 05:32:13 GMT

Re CITIZEN KANE on laserdisc

I (wlrc@uhura.neoucom.edu) wrote:
>>> I know only the old and new Criterion CAV versions, both about $100
>>> list.  Avoid the old.  The new one is a much better transfer.  Superb.
>>         ^^^^^^^^^^^^

Bill Vermillion (bill@bilver.uucp) wrote:
>> I don't find any problem with the old.

Bob Niland (rjn@FC.HP.COM) wrote:
>Ditto.  Furthermore, the old (CAV: CC101L, CLV: CC1115L) editions were made
>from a negative that was subsequently lost in a fire.  The current editions
>(CAV: CC1259L, CLV: CC1285L) were made from source elements at least one
>generation further removed from the camera negs.

Sorry, in my brevity I may have implied that the old Criterion was bad.
What I meant is that $ for $ the new one is VASTLY superior.  And unless
you find the old version greatly discounted, there is no point in buying
it now (it is probably only available used).

I have carefully compared one old version and the new version of
the Criterion CAV and the new RKO/ TURNER/ IMAGE version (CLV).
I should further clarify that the old Criterion CAV that I have is the
Pioneer (PVI) pressing, not the original 3M pressing.  I cannot comment
on differences in the two pressings, but the original 3M is obviously
in limited supply and of some interest as a collector's item.

As I write this I am running the old and new Criterion CAV versions
(the new is a 3M pressing) in synchrony on two laserdisc players,
a Pioneer CLD-3070 and a Pioneer CLD-95 (and I have compared the 2
pressings on each of the two players).  I know that Criterion states
on the covers that the first was `from a 35mm negative found in the RKO
vaults' and the second was `from a fine grain master positive provided
by the UCLA Film and Television Archives.'  And I know that *in theory*
the negative should provide a superior transfer to the positive, GIVEN
THE SAME TRANSFER PROCEDURES.	But this is not the case here.

[In spite of the claims about source differences I find it interesting
that almost EVERY SINGLE scratch and blemish that I could check on
the two Criterions are identical!  Presumably these are on the negative
-and the positive was made from the same negative.  Vertical scratches
on the newsreel footage are darker and more obvious on the new Criterion
than on the old.  If you have both versions available check the scratches
e.g., on side 1, old F#3745-6 and new F#3416-7 for identity].

Without question the image on the new Criterion CAV (3M) is superior
to the old Criterion CAV (PVI).  It has a better balance of gray tone 
whereas the old is washed out by comparison.  The level of detail in
the new Criterion greatly exceeds that in the old.  The sound on the
new Criterion is also a little better balanced tonally but I am more
interested in the image.  Anyone who has followed my comments on the
net knows that I do not necessarily agree with reviewers in print, but
in this case, 3 publications have also declared the new Criterion
vastly superior to the old (Pond Scum 7/92-4, LaserScene Monthly 3/92-7,
Laser Disc Newsletter 3/92-1).

This is not to say that the old Criterion version is bad, by any means.
It was superb in its day, indeed it set THE STANDARD for laserdisc
quality.  And, IMHO, it still surpasses the recent RKO/ TURNER/ IMAGE
release.  Compared to the old Criterion the TURNER version is darker, has
less gray range and fewer details and subtleties.  It also has fewer
scratches and blemishes, suggesting it is from a different source,
altogether, but the overall transfer is poorer.  It also has an
abominable "dolby-enhanced mono soundtrack."

So, in terms of quality I would rate the CITIZEN KANEs as follows:

New Criterion (3M) >> Old Criterion (PVI) >> new RKO/TURNER/IMAGE

Their list prices are (were) respectively $100 - $90 - $30.  So, if
you are looking to buy one NOW, I would say the old Criterion CAV
would be a good buy if it were $40 or less (new, it was available
at 25-30% discount).  I have not seen nor compared a copy, but the
new Criterion transfer is available in CLV for $40 list.  I would GUESS
that it has to be superior to the RKO/TURNER/IMAGE version (also CLV).
I believe that neither have any supplements.  The older Criterion
CAV has a fair supplemental section (again, it set the standard when
it was released in 1984, as Criterion's first).  If you are a perfectionist,
if you love CITIZEN KANE, and if you have dollars to spend on this
rather than some other laserdisc (much harder today than in 1984)
then the newest Criterion CAV release is THE ONE TO HAVE.


-- 
	The answer is never simple and is always changing.
    William L.R. (Bill) Cruce       INTERNET: wlrc@uhura.neoucom.edu 
Neurobiology Dept, NE Ohio U Coll of Med, POB 95, Rootstown, OH 44272 
Newsgroups: rec.video.releases