HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 18:49:45 EST
From:         dave pretty <ST402747@BROWNVM.BROWN.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Liberal (was Capt. Thomas Abbe & the elect
Comments: To: history@rutvm1.rutgers.edu

Posted by Lenny
>
>What's wrong with being a liberal?
>
>Well, in the US being a liberal usually does NOT mean that you are a person
>who is unafraid of new and unusual solutions to old problems. (My definition of
>a REAL liberal.)

You mean like non-AMA-sanctioned health care? Industrial research projects like
those which have helped so much in Germany and Japan? Infrastructure? New  and
more cost-efficient approaches to defense. Good defense of the democrats, Len.

>In this country it means that you are a craven, selfish, evil, person who will
>do anything possible to "serve" your clientele.  This means lots of nifty
>programs which pass out money almost free of charge.  Money paid in taxes
>by those who cannot afford the luxury of being liberal.

Man, I agree entirely. I hate those Neal Bush and Ivan Boesky types. Wasn't
Reagonomics a bummer?

>They are truly vile.  They would destroy the human soul for
>their own profit.

Ooh, I hate those republicans! Nothing but the profit motive. Uggh.

>Lenny

dave pretty    st402747@brownvm
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 12:40:17 -0400
From:         WANNAKER@AC.DAL.CA
Subject:      Capital of ohio

I hate to be a nit-picker, but the capital of Ohio is Columbus, Steve.

Salut
Giuliano Valentino  Wannaker@Dal1
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 17:58:31 PST
From:         "Don W." <webbd@CCVAX.CCS.CSUS.EDU>
Subject:      Democrat(ic)?
Comments: To: History@UBvm.cc.Buffalo.EDU

Was the truncated usage of the adjective "Democratic," as in
"Democrat party" first used by Sen. Jos. R. McCarthy?  Or did
he simply popularize a previous usage that had not caught on
widely?

The question is of interest to a current discussion on
the Linguist list.

Don W. (DonWebb@CSUS.EDU)
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Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 21:20:04 EST
From:         Steven H Silver <SHSILVER@UCS.INDIANA.EDU>
Subject:      RE: Khazar Empire

Joe-

I have some knowledge of the Khazar Empire, please contact me and I'll see if
I can help.

Steven H Silver               |         "When I get a little money, I
Indiana University            |         buy books; and if any is left,
SHSILVER@ucs.indiana.edu      |         I buy food and clothes."
SHSILVER@IUBACS.BITNET        |         -Erasmus:  In Praise of Folly
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Date:         Thu, 12 Nov 1992 16:26:53 CST
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From:         steve mcnutt <Z1SSM@TTUVM1.BITNET>
Subject:      help from ohio?

     i was wondering if there was anybody out there who lives anywhere near
the ohio state capital (cincinatti?). i'm told that the capital has all the
existing flags flown by civil war regiments from ohio. i'm trying to find out
if there is anyone out there who would be willing to take a picture of it for
me. i would be more than happy to pay for whatever it costs to
take/develop/mail the picture.
     also, i was wondering if anyone has ever heard of "the conn cemetery,
perry co. ohio"? My great-great grandfather was supposedly buried there (he
died may 27, 1915 in "the plains, ohio"). i've searched in various records for
it but can't find it.
     thanks in advance.


I am researching the following individuals and families. i would appreciate
hearing from anyone working on the same lines: Mcnutt family, blahnik family,
rowena chase, elias garland fisk, howard george fisk, tuttle family, maxwell
family (particularly james eli & jacob ?), letitiagriffin, linton family,
joseph hartel.

     most of these families were families were from the ohio area, with the
following exceptions: the fisks may have been from s.d., in., or il.
                    the blahniks & hartels settled in (kewaunee?) wi, but were
                       originally frombohemia.
                    some of the earlier mcnutts (before c.1850) may hve been
                       from pa.

thanks again,
steve
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From: akerr@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Austin Kerr)
Subject: Re: History Database?
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 01:14:21 GMT

My recollection is taht History Database is a program advertised (and 
"reviewed") in either (or both) the newsletter of the Organization of American 
Historians or Perspectives of the American Historical Assn.

If it is the program I saw presented at the OAH convention a few years ago, my 
response was the something like FYI 3000 or Nota Bene with TextBase (Now Nota 
Bene with Orbis) was much more suitable for my needs.

Austin Kerr
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 09:39:59 -0500
From:         SWIFTDON@EDINBORO.EDU
Subject:      Re: help from ohio?
Comments: To: HISTORY@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu

The state capitol is in Columbus. The Ohio Historical Society's historical
center displays many regimental flags, etc.

The state library is located on the top floor of the largest state office
building. Geneologists frequently use it.

My information may be out of date as I have not been to the state library
in 25 years. I did revisit the historical center several months ago.
It is worth a visit. It has an excellent library. I have not visited
the library since it was on the OSU campus, but it too has
information useful for geneology.
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 12:56:56 EST
From:         Ed Haupt <haupt@PILOT.NJIN.NET>
Subject:      Re: Book List Request: Frederick the Great
Comments: To: History <HISTORY@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu>

Frederick is a mixed bag.  Lessing praised the freedom of speech by saying
that it only consisted in saying inanities about religion.

Much of the 19th-century German view has to do with illustrations of his
life made by Adolf Menzel for a biography.  There's an article in the
_Art Bullettin_, 1977, v. 59. that might get you started.  The Frick
Museum had a show of his work in 1990 that includes some stuff.

Good luck


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Dept. of Psychology     |      "Kein Bier,        |   HOME (201) 783-0561
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From: regeorge@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Robert E George)
Subject: Re: Presidents who studied abroad
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 00:15:13 GMT

In article <HISTORY%92110912372541@PSUVM.PSU.EDU> DGPAZ@CLEMSON.BITNET writes:
>Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar at Oxford, as everyone
>knows. John Kennedy was a junior year abroad student (I
>think) at the London School of Economics. Did any of
>our other US Presidents study abroad, either at the
>universities, or the Inns of Court, or outside Britain?

I would suggest you examine the life of Herbert C. Hoover. IMO he is the most
likely 20th century President (aside from the President-elect) to have
studied abroad.  Pres. Hoover was a very-renowned engineer who lived outside
the U.S. for an extended period of time.


>What is Clinton's Oxford degree?

I think I remember reading in a news weekly (probably USN&WR) that
Gov. Clinton was a nondegree student at Oxford.

Robert George
(speaking only for myself)

"The very essence of individual freedom is equal justice under a rule of
law, a law to which every man shall be subject and which no executive
can modify."
    Senator Robert Taft , March 11, 1944
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From: akerr@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Austin Kerr)
Subject: Re: Graduate schools
Organization: The Ohio State University
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 03:23:00 GMT

I suggest to students considering graduate schools that they think about a 
scholar's work that they have admired, and then apply to the school where that 
scholar serves.

Another consideration younger people sometimes forget: will the faculty member
be retiring soon?

WE also have reason to suspect that reputations of graduate programs may well 
lag their reality, so you might want to check the faculty list against, say, 
the library catalog to see how active they are, and if their activity is of the
sort that interets you.

One pickes a graduate school differently than an undergraduate school
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Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:06:58 -0500
From:         KOHANJJ@HIRAMB.BITNET
Subject:      Graduate Schools

I am interested in attending a good graduate school for 20th Century social and
cultural history.  What are your opinions on a good school for this subject?  I
   really have no idea where to look, and aside from the names like Wisconsin an
   d
Michigan, I can find no information save the Guides, and much of that info is
lacking or propoganda.  Any ideas?

Jim Kohan
(in%"kohanjj@hiramb.bitnet")
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:09:27 EST
From:         "THOMAS M. RICKS" <RICKS@VILLVM.BITNET>
Subject:      US NATIONAL EPIC

Dear History Colleagues:
My Humanities Seminar has been discussing a number of "national" epics, ie, fer
dowsi's Epic of the Kings for Iran, the Epic of Gilgamesh, the Song of Roland f
or France, etc. We turned to the US and tried to find our "national" epic. Alth
ough some of the students suggested Gettysburg Address, Preamble to the Constit
ution, etc. none of the students felt we had found the US National Epic.

Any ideas, suggestions or comments - if we have no national epic, why not?

Epically yours,

Tom Ricks

Thomas M. Ricks
Villanova University
Ricks@Villvm.Bitnet
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:16:00 EST
From:         DGPAZ@CLEMSON.BITNET
Subject:      Re: Graduate schools

Other factors that (in my view) are important in selecting
a graduate school (in the U.S.A.) include:
(1) quality of the library -- go for a graduate school at a
    university that has been around for a long time, and that
    therefore has been able to collect lots of books, pamphlets,
    and periodicals from the C19 and perhaps earlier.
(2) break out of your region -- If you have been educated in
    the South, go elsewhere for your degree. If you are a
    Midwesterner, go to a good graduate school somewhere else.
(3) quality of life -- go to a graduate school that is located
    in a town that prizes diversity in culture, politics,
    and society, and that exposes residents to a wide spectrum
    of experiences == I have in mind Ann Arbor, Chapel Hill,
    Berkeley, Madison // or that is located in a big city like
    New York, Chicago, Boston, Philadelphia.
(4) study abroad -- think, work, and even save money to include
    study abroad as part of your graduate training.

Denis Paz
Department of History
Clemson University
South Carolina, U.S.A.
dgpaz@clemson.bitnet
From: IACESP@ASUACAD.BITNET (Elliot Palais)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Subject: Re: Presidents who studied abroad
Date: 12 Nov 92 16:30:56 GMT
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU

From: Elliot Palais
Although scholars of Woodrow Wilson's time typically studied
abroad, Wilson never did, possibly because his first career
choice was the law. Of seven faculty members at newly
established Bryn Mawr, Wilson was the only one who had not
studied in Germany and who had not yet earned a Ph.D. Another
reason for the lack of overseas study: a learning disability
(a form of dyslexia?) that caused some reading problems and
difficulty in mastering foreign languages. See August Heckscher,
Woodrow Wilson (NY: Scribner, 1991). Of course, he was President
of Princeton University.

Elliot Palais, Social Sciences Coordinator
Arizona State University Libraries,
Tempe, AZ 85287; IACESP@ASUACAD; IACESP@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU
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Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 08:05:46 EST
From:         "Mary A. Gallagher" <CATQC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject:      British naval officer

J. Richard Nokes, a scholar who has written on the Pacific Northwest,
would like the list's help in finding information on the life of John
Meares, a British naval officer who served during the American Revolution
and explored the Pacific Northwest during 1786-1790.  He is interested in
information about Meares before and after the period 1776-1790.  He may
be contacted at his home: 14650 S. W. 103rd Ave. Tigard, Oregon, 97224,
or I will gladly forward any e-mail replies to him.

Mary A. Y. Gallagher
The Papers of Robert Morris
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Wed, 4 Nov 1992 14:33:59 EST
From:         Steven H Silver <SHSILVER@UCS.INDIANA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: election day comment

I've found a number of mistakes in the American version of Trivial Pursuits,
 andimagine that the Canadian and British versions are also filled with errors,
 so
it only increases my doubt as to the quote's veracity.

Steven H Silver                =         "Outside a dog, a book is a
Indiana University             =         man's best friend.  Inside a
SHSILVER@ucs.indiana.edu       =         dog, it's too dark to read."
SHSILVER@IUBACS.BITNET         =            -Groucho Marx
From: J_CAUSEY@CCNODE.COLORADO.EDU (Frederick the Great)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Subject: Book List Request: Frederick the Great
Date: 5 Nov 92 18:39:38 GMT
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        At the risk of starting up that "hero worship" discussion again:

        My personal historical hero is Frederick the Great.  Can anyone
recommend some good books about him?  Being a military historian, I am
especially interested in his wartime exploits, though anything about him
would be welcome.  I mainly read secondary sources at this point in my
undergraduate career, but translated primary sources would also be welcome.
Thanks in advance.

        Jim Causey
        j_causey@ccnode.colorado.edu
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:35:00 EST
From:         DGPAZ@CLEMSON.BITNET
Subject:      Re: high school mythmakers

On Mon, 9 Nov 1992 14:54:37 EST Lenny <LABBEY@GTRI01.BITNET> said:
> The Mexican constitution might forbid slavery, but when I was in Baja
> last year, I saw thousands of slaves.  I think that 90% of the
> population is slave.  Their chains are economical and educational, but
> are these chains less real?

Of course you are right. Wage slavery and the slavery of
petty tradition both are as much slavery as chattel
slavery (so Marx pointed out).

Denis Paz
Department of History
Clemson University
South Carolina, U.S.A.
dgpaz@clemson.bitnet
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 12:57:33 CST
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From:         STEVE MCNUTT <Z1SSM@TTUVM1.BITNET>
Subject:      Thanks for the help!

Hello, Everyone,

     Thanks for all the responses to "Help from Ohio." (By the way, the
"Cincinatti thing" was an oversight on my part. Sorry to everybody both there
and in the Real capital of Ohio.)
     Anyway, thanks for all the response. Very Helpful. The letter was
supposed to be sent to ROOTS-L but I inadvertantly put the wrong address on it
     If anybody has any more info, I'd love to hear it.

Steve
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Date:         Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:47:14 -0500
From:         SHIRLEY@RHODES.BITNET
Subject:      US NATIONAL EPIC
Comments: To: history@psuvm.bitnet

Thomas,

        You might consider a 19th c. work, George Bancroft's 10 volume HISTORY
OF THE UNITED STATES FROM THE DISCOVERY OF THE CONTINENT (1834). Bancroft
saw all of American history coming into focus at Lexington when the local
militia lined up against the British Army. In Bancroft's view, "liberty" and
"divine providence" were the two principles of action that lent unity and
significance to the narrative of the American experience. According to Russell
B. Nye, one reviewer of Bancroft's work believed that Bancroft wrote the
history of US "as if it were the history of the Kingdom of God." The first
few pages of the Introduction elaborates all of those themes about liberty,
mission, and last hope for humankind that have become staples of the
American national identity.

Michael Shirley
Dept. of History
Rhodes College
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
From: rbp@netcom.com (Bob Pasker)
Subject: Re: History Database?
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest) 
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 16:22:44 GMT

akerr@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Austin Kerr) writes:

>If it is the program I saw presented at the OAH convention a few years ago, my 
>response was the something like FYI 3000 or Nota Bene with TextBase (Now Nota 
>Bene with Orbis) was much more suitable for my needs.

where does one GET nota bene?  or FYI 3000 (whatever that is?)
-- 
--- bob pasker
---- rbp@netcom.com
Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center
Date: Saturday, 7 Nov 1992 13:03:19 EST
From: <PRHHC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Subject: History of Sci. Conf. in CUBA

History, Sociology, Philosophy
Dear Colleague,
We have like to invite you to attend a connference on the history and
philosophy of science, to be held in Habana, CUBA, January 4 to 14, 1993.
The conference is sponsored by the University of Habana and their faculty
from the department of Philosophy, History, and Sociology.
The United States delegation will be of 35 people.

There will be four panels:

a. Science, the environment, and appropriate technology.
b. Capitalism, technology, and the first world/third world realtion.
c. Philosophy and politics of science.
d. Contemporary issues in philosophy and history of science.
We expects thatthe cost will be $1100 for airfare between Miami and Habana
lodgin, a basic meal package, programming, and trasportation within Cuba.
This do not includes the cost of airfare between your home and Miami.
The conference will constitute "Profesional Research" for those within the
fields or realted fields of study.  This is one of the few exceptions to the
United States restrictions on travel to Cuba.
If you are interested in participating and require more information, please
sent me a message and I will sent information to you soon.

Sincerely yours,
P. Rafael Hernandez
Sociology Department        Medical Sociology
Hunter College CUNY         Cornell Univ. Medical Center.

The Conference General Coordinators

Joy Gordon  Philosophy Dept. at Yale University
Adolfo Olea-Franco   History Dept. Harvard University
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Tue, 10 Nov 1992 09:33:00 EST
From:         DGPAZ@CLEMSON.BITNET
Subject:      Hoover in Oz (Was Presidents who studied abroad)

Amazing -- I had no Idea that Herbert Hoover was a founding
father of RTZed -- Does that make him the Grandfather of
Tiny Rowland?
Can anyone supply the lovesong to the barmaid?

Denis Paz
Department of History
Clemson University
South Carolina, USA
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Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Date:         Mon, 9 Nov 1992 08:59:00 EST
From:         DGPAZ@CLEMSON.BITNET
Subject:      Re: high school mythmakers

I got into this late, having been at the Southern.
Tom Powers asks about children of the segregated South
and school myths.
I grew up in San Antonio, Texas, which of course was
segregated, but which quietly accepted integration
in schools and public accommodations pretty early on.
So although I am old enough to remember segregated
buses, black entrances to theatres, and segregated
lunch counters, all those had gone by the time I was
in Junior High School in 1957. What remained, however,
were potent myths. We learned about the Lost Cause,
about how bad Reconstruction was, and about how honest
government was restored when the South was Redeemed.
Blacks ceased to figure in US history after 1877, save
George Washington Carver, of course. Blacks were
referred to as "Negroes," which for the time was
enlightened.
Texas being Texas, we had another set of myths
relating to Texas history. We had to take
Texas history in Junior High School. The textbook
repeated the abovementioned myths of Southern history
within the special context of Texas history. In
addition, we had our own myths relating to Texas
independence. the "Heroes of the Alamo" were
martyrs to liberty. We did not learn that slavery
was an issue (the Mexican Constitution forbade
the institution, while the Anglo settlers wanted
to break away in order to maintain the institution),
nor that the Anglo settlers had agreed to convert
to Roman Catholicism as the price of being
allowed to settle in Texas, but then attempted
to back out of their agreement.
In addition, we had a little booklet, distributed
free by an oil company -- Texaco, I believe -- which
retold the story of Texas in comicbook form, and
which throughout used the term "greasers" to refer
to Mexicans. "Greaser" is to Mexican what "nigger" is
to black. So Texas had its own distinct elements
of mythology and of racism in addition to sharing
the broader racism and mythology of the South.

Denis Paz
Department of History
Clemson University
South Carolina, U.S.A.
From: akerr@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Austin Kerr)
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.history
Subject: Re: History Database?
Date: 6 Nov 92 20:30:30 GMT
Organization: The Ohio State University

The dealer for Nota Bene that was once in CMH is gone.  The company is located 
in New York City and is now called N.B. Informatics.  I do not have the phone 
number handy in this office.  It is area code 212 or 800.  They give big 
academic discounts.

FYI 3000 was written up in the Organization of American Historians about 1985.
There are probably newer programs on the market.  A popular program in some 
places is Notebook II for keeping one's notes.  I have never, however, talked 
with a practicing researching historian who has used. it.

kerr.6@osu.edu
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