From: jdahl@rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Jared Dahl)
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: MurderPhobes, RapistPhobes, etc. (was: Re: antihomosex...)
Keywords: Phobia, Homosexual
Date: 21 Dec 92 18:29:56 GMT
Organization: IBM Rochester
Disclaimer: This posting represents the poster's views, not necessarily those of IBM

I am cutting stuff out to keep this short.

In article <1gte37INNb9s@flop.ENGR.ORST.EDU>, roderir@hobo.ECE.ORST.EDU (richard roderick) writes:
|> In article <1992Dec18.152917.10769@rchland.ibm.com> jdahl@rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Jared Dahl) writes:
|> >Homosexuality includes two consenting adults, not children.
|> >
|> 
|> We aren't just talking gay rights here! We are talking sexual rights and
|> we DO have the right to limit them.
|> 
|> >The government should stay out of peoples bedrooms.  What 
|> >happens between consenting adults is their own business.
|> >
|> 
|> We aren't coming into your bedrooms, YOU are coming into our living rooms
|> and make everything VERY public.

These two points are BS.  You're not addressing my points.
How are homosexuals coming into your living room?

|> Would he condem them?  NO!
|> You see I don't wish to condem Homosexuals, and passing laws against
|> them isn't necessarily the right answer, it isn't what Christ would
|> have done.  If you will read the Bible you will find that the law
|> came because the people wanted it, not because God said do this or
|> that.  The law did not come until Moses, many years after the creation.

People justify laws like these by saying "the bible says it's wrong".

|> Gay's in the military?  Are there not already gays in the military?
|> Is it ABSOLUTELY necessary?

Yes.  There hasn't been a good reason presented on this group yet on
why they shouldn't be.
   
|> Well, I believe it is not necessary to allow gays in the military.
|> Some facts: less than 5% of the population is gay.
|> 	    60% of all cases are of gays.
|> Can we afford to pay the bill?
|> Nope.

You have to prove these numbers.  I haven't seen any real scientific
study anywhere to indicate this or the 10% figure.  And we don't have
to pay for the AIDS cases since people are ALREADY screened for it when
they enter the military.

|> >It is not my free choice if the law is based on the bible.  Then
|> >I am forced to live by it whether I choose to or not.  This is 
|> >unconstitutional.  Don't try to force your beliefs on others.
|> 
|> Again a mistake.  Because we have laws that are based on the Bible,
|> or anything does not mean you have to agree with those laws.  You
|> just have to follow them.  You are welcome to try and change them,
|> just please don't call us HomoPhobes if we don't let you.

WRONG.  I stated that a law based solely on religion is unjust
because it may not be my religious beliefs.  Laws forbidding murder
are not contested because all people see murder as a bad thing.
With homosexuality, you are forcing your belief that it is wrong on
others.

|> >Other than the bible, you couldn't come up with one good
|> >reason why homosexuality should be banned.  And in this
|> >country, "the bible told me so" is not a good enough
|> >reason for a law.
|> 
|> Other than the Bible AND the stoping the spread of terminal diseases,
|> there are no good reasons. Sooo.... As long as the Bible is not diproved
|> MILLIONS of americans will continue to believe in it.

Homosexuality does not create AIDS.  AIDS is spread through 
most types of sexual contact, needle sharing, and infected 
blood transfusions.  It is a virus, not the wrath of GOD.

|> >I don't care if you oppose homosexuality, and I don't care
|> >if you hate them.  What I do care about is people whose
|> >civil rights are being taken away by a group of narrow
|> >minded persons like yourself.  If you want to live by
|> >the bible, you don't have to try push it on others.
|> 
|> I do oppose homosexuality, but I do not hate homosexuals.  Who decides
|> what are civil rights?  You?  NOT!  We do, as in the majority.  So if
|> the majority decides Christianity should be banned then it would.
|> Although I wouldn't count on that happening anytime soon.
|> (That is what some groups are trying to do though)

This may be what you want for America, but not everyone thinks like you.

|> >This country and Christianity are two different things.
|> 
|> Wrong again.  People religous beliefs are the core of this country!

Wrong.  The Constitution is.

|> >Folks like you make other Christians look bad.  You 
|> >remind me of the Iranian Fundamentalists, completely
|> >intolerant of anyone who is not exactly like you.  
|> >To say homosexuals are all pedophiles is ignorant and
|> >bigoted.  And I will not say that you are homophobes
|> >any longer.  I will call you righteous, religious bigots.
|> 
|> When did I say I was intolerant?  When did I say homosexuals are
|> pediphiles (sorry for previous mis-spelling)?  I said the homosexual
|> movement wants complete sexual freedom and pediphiles is include in
|> that.  Also, do you think pediphilia is wrong?  Isn't it their business
|> what they do in their bedrooms?  No, because society says so.
|> It is not a civil right to have sex with a conseting child. PERIOD.

You show me where anyone who was credible within the gay movement
was standing up for the rights of pedophiles.  Once again you've gone
back to comparing something that is inherently wrong to homosexuality.

|> Jared I appreciate your views and thank you for reminding me that we
|> are not to be judgemental (so don't judge me), but rather to love one
|> another, for love is God and God is love. (Love does not mean sex!)

I don't need a sermon on what is.  BTW, I am married and my wife has some
things to say to you about the wording of your post.  I am not standing
up for homosexuals, but for all people who are oppressed in any manner.
Why can't you just say "Live and Let Live"? 

|> I hope people see that it is not necessary for the military to accept
|> homosexuals and that passing laws against homosexuality is not necessarily
|> correct either.  We should not teach it as normal in schools! And we
|> should not promote it as a normal life style to others.  We just don't
|> need to pass laws AGAINST it.

It is necessary if the USA wants to say we have full civil rights
for all of our citizens.  Also, by saying that homosexuals are not normal
you ARE judging them. According to you, that is God's job, not yours.
 
Jared Dahl
Opinions expressed are mine, not my employer's.
Don't send e-mail - I won't get it.
Newsgroups: alt.rush-limbaugh