HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: jzimm@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Joann Zimmerman)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re:  Love in the Time of Books
Date: 13 Oct 92 16:56:08 GMT
Reply-To: jzimm@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Joann Zimmerman)
Organization: The University of Texas at Austin, Austin TX
Originator: jzimm@huey.cc.utexas.edu


I don't really have a tale to tell of books which I read while I was
in love, or of books which caused me to fall out of love, or of any of
that; what I usually (if not always) remembered about affairs of the
heart were musical things.

But books have caused others to fall in love with me. I speak here of
actual physical books, in large agglomeration. One scholarly type, who
had met me for the first time on an evening when he had accompanied
some other persons to my flat, was sufficiently overwhelmed by the
riches on my shelves to call me up and ask to see me again--which he
did for a year. Two or three years later, my later-to-be-husband,
having just moved into the aprtment above mine, was attracted by the
sight of many shelves and piles of books glimpsed through the open
doorway. We had already met, but the effect of this bibliographic
vision was to cause him to come down and knock on my door--with a
book in hand! 


-- 
"Every passion borders on the chaotic, but the collector's passion
borders on the chaos of memories" 
                                                -- Walter Benjamin
 ...!cs.utexas.edu!ccwf.cc.utexas.edu!jzimm   
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
Subject: Re: Limpopo?
Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:08:22

In article <1992Oct9.223205.14738@morrow.stanford.edu> francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir) writes:

   Mark Taranto writes:

	   John McCarthy poses the question:

		   "All set about with fever trees".  
		   What's a fever tree, Fido?

	   Hey!  What is the matter with you guys out there?  What happened 
	   to that world-famous On-line OED?  Why don't you just look it up 
	   in the dictionary?

	   My Webster's says:

		   [blah, blah, blah...]

   Mark, dear Mark. If words meant no more than their assigned dictionary
   meaning then there would be little point in reading beyond the *Airline
   Guide* and *Yellow Pages*, or, in your case, the ticker tape. McCarthy
   was picking up on a literary illusion and I seriouly doubt whether Kipling
   meant the Scrub Acacia.

							   Fido Yes,
Mark, I was hoping for something more than the OED would consider
proper to supply - Something beginning, "Ah yes, fever trees.  There
we were camped among the fever trees, eating the last of our pack
elephant's hind legs, the crocodile having dined off him starting with
the trunk, when out of the bush came ..."
--
John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
*
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
From: cam@castle.ed.ac.uk (Chris Malcolm)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Kuhn
Date: 15 Oct 92 02:47:27 GMT
Organization: Edinburgh University

In article <1992Oct14.181045.4681@cbnewsd.cb.att.com> lew@cbnewsd.cb.att.com (lewis.h.mammel..jr) writes:

>Here's an excerpt from the chapter, Social_Construction_and_
>Natural_Knowledge in the book The_Great_Devonian_Controversy
>by Martin J. S. Rudwick ( CAPS are italics in the original: )

>	The opposite extreme has better intellectual credentials but
>	is no more credible in the light of this particular case
>	study. This is the extreme social constructivism espoused
>	by some sociological analysts of modern science.

[detail omitted.]

>	the "knowledge" produced cannot claim more than
>	instrumental status.

1. Those who consider (e.g. William James) that no knowledge can have
any more than instrumental status anyway would regard this as a
trivially true observation.

2. On the other hand, those who believe that science is gradually
approximating to a description of how the external objective reality
actually is might point out that sociologists and psychologists have a
tendency to interpret everything they see in terms of social or
psychological reality. For example, a famous case was the
psychologist, investigating traffic behaviour, who explained the
observed fact that Minis (a very small front-wheel drive car) tended
to go round corners faster than other cars as due to the drivers
trying to compensate for the feeling of inferiority produced by being
in a small car. It had entirely escaped the notice of this
psychologist and his colleagues that Minis, by virtue of their design,
_could_ easily go round corners faster than most other cars of the
time.
-- 
Chris Malcolm    cam@uk.ac.ed.aifh          +44 (0)31 650 3085
Department of Artificial Intelligence,    Edinburgh University
5 Forrest Hill, Edinburgh, EH1 2QL, UK                DoD #205
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: msmorris@watsci.uwaterloo.ca (Mike Morris)
Subject: Books in the Time of Love
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 16:32:36 GMT

 
                                      Friday, the 9th of October, 1992

Just happened to come across this famous passage, and I
realized a mention of it belonged to this thread:

  E quella a me: ``Nessun maggior dolore
  che ricordarsi del tempo felice
  ne la miseria; e cio sa 'l tuo dottore.

                [And that one to me: ``No greater sorrow
                 than to remember a happy time
                 in misery; and that knows your guide.]

  Ma s'a conoscer la prima radice
  del nostro amor tu hai cotanto affetto,
  diro come colui che piange e dice.

               [But if to know the first root
                of our love you have so much desire,
                I will tell it as one who cries and speaks.] 

  Noi leggiavamo un giorno per diletto
  di Lancialotto come amor lo strinse;
  soli eravamo e sanza alcun sospetto.

              [We were reading one day for delight
               of Lancelot how love him constrained;
               alone we were and without any suspicion.]
               
  Per piu fiate li occhi ci sospinse
  quella lettura, e scolorocci il viso;
  ma solo un punto fu quel che ci vinse.

              [By more breaths our eyes drove
               that reading, and uncolored our face;
               but only one point was the one that vanquished us.]
               
  Quando leggemmo il disiato riso
  esser basciato da cotanto amante,
  questi, che mai da me non fia diviso,

              [When we read the desired smile
               being kissed by such a lover,
               this one, who never from me will be divided,]

  la bocca mi bascio tutto tremante.
  Galeotto fu 'l libro e chi lo scrisse:
  quel giorno piu non vi leggemmo avante.''

              [the mouth my kissed all trembling.
               Galeotto was the book and who wrote it:
               That day no more we read further.]

                   Dante, _Inferno_, Canto V, lines 121-138

The English is mine, and meant only to be a crib to track the
Italian. ``Quella'' is of course Francesca da Rimini, telling
Dante from out of the whirlwind of those who have been punished
for lust in the Second Circle, how she and Paolo Malatesta first came
to be lovers, and later how her jealous husband caught them and
ran them through with a single sword or something like that.

                  Mike Morris
         (msmorris@watsci.uwaterloo.ca)
From: maverick@fir.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Vance Maverick)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Literature Students/Small World
Date: 7 Oct 1992 17:59:55 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: fir.cs.berkeley.edu

In article <1992Oct7.005717.10708@athena.cs.uga.edu>, fuller@athena.cs.uga.edu (James P. H. Fuller) writes:
|> 
|> maverick@fir.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Vance Maverick) writes:
|> [...]
|> 
|> By contrast, W. H. Auden writes:
|> [...]

It really doesn't bother me to find myself disagreeing with Auden.
I'm sure you could find something in E. D. Hirsch to contradict
me too....

	Vance
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: chuckg@meaddata.com (Chuck Greenwald)
Subject: Re: food
Keywords: OK, then, books on food
Organization: Mead Data Central, Dayton OH
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 16:13:10 GMT

In article <1452@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM> emolinar@stake.DaytonOH.NCR.COM (Elizabeth Molinaro) writes:

> >        I am looking for a suggested/favorite(s) booklist, the
> >        general topic is: food.

I found _Food_in_History_, by ?, to be a great discussion of how
food and eating have changed through history and been affected by
where and how we live.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chuck Greenwald                     |   chuckg@meaddata.com  
Mead Data Central                   |   (513) 865-1020

Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mgraham@nyx.cs.du.edu (Malcolm Graham)
Subject: Re: How good is Barker's "Damnation Game".
Organization: University of Denver, Dept. of Math & Comp. Sci.
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 92 23:41:56 GMT

fi@grebyn.com (Fiona Webster) writes:

>Someone named "Duner" asks a question that surely belongs in our FAQL:
>> Also what is the book that "Hellraiser" was based on?  Was there a boo
 called
>>  "Hellraiser" or what?

>The movie "Hellraiser" was based on Barker's "The Hellbound Heart," a 
>short novel (vs. long short story) collected in _Night_Visions_3_,
>edited by George R. R. Martin.  _NV3_ was released as a Berkley
>paperback in 1988, under the title _The_Hellbound_Heart_.

>							--Fiona W.



     _The Hellbound Heart_ has also been released as a separate paperback.
 Should be in any bookstore near the other Clive Barker paperbacks. 
About 120 pages for $4.95.

--Mgraham
From: zeleny@husc10.harvard.edu (Michael Zeleny)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: This is Freedom? (was: REWARD OF $US100 TO END FA
Date: 15 Oct 92 21:06:23 GMT
Article-I.D.: husc3.1992Oct15.170624.16423
Organization: The Phallogocentric Cabal

In article <scottj-151092154915@iamac-1.dml.georgetown.edu>
scottj@magic.dml.georgetown.edu (John L. Scott) writes:

>In article <1bisdsINN5ng@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>, 
>wojdylo@maths.uwa.oz.au (John Wojdylo, aka INFIDEL) wrote:

JW:
>>Any person who claims the right to freedom of speech is dutybound to
>>fight for it. If the necessary means turn out to be war with Iran, then
>>so be it.

JLS:
>Applying some elementary logic:
>
>IF you claim the right to freedom of speech THEN you must risk life and
>limb for it.
>
>Logically then, IF you refuse to risk life and limb for it THEN you cannot
>claim the right to freedom of speech.
>
>Doesn't sound very free to me.  Doesn't sound like much of a right to me.

Then you should consider the difference between a moral obligation and
an external constraint, as well as the complementarity of rights and
responsibilities.  Maybe that would suffice to end your confusion of
freedom of speech and free lunch.

>--John Scott

cordially,
mikhail zeleny@husc.harvard.edu
"Nous donnons la mort, nous saurons la subir."
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir)
Subject: Re: Philately (will get you nowhere)
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1992 17:19:47 GMT

Tracey Dianne Layng writes:

	Andrew Baker writes:

		And then there was the story of the political candidate 
		who accused his opponent of "matriculating with his own 
		sister" who was known to be a "thesbian."

	I believe it was "thespian". A professor I once had used the 
	above example of how one's life can be affected by the mere 
	sound of words.  Even though these words are not at all indecent, 
	they closely resemble a couple that could set a person's morality 
	buzzer going.

During Ronald Reagan's gubernatorial campaign in California, when "family
values" and like phrases were codes for whipping up anti-gay sentiment, 
some wag produced and quite widely desemenated (do I mean that?) a bumper
sticker that proclaimed:

		Ronald Reagan is a Heterosexual

						Fido. Net watchdog.
From: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com (Jim Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Borders Bookstores sold to K-Mart
Date: 8 Oct 92 19:02:45 GMT
Reply-To: jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com
Distribution: na

In article <1992Oct8.163852.1271@HQ.Ileaf.COM> tyg@HQ.Ileaf.COM (Tom  
Galloway) writes:
> According to last Saturday's Boston Globe, Borders has been sold to 
> K-Mart, who also own Waldenbooks and had been starting to get into
> the megastore market with Bassett Books. The purchase price was a  
bit
> unclear; the article mentioned that Borders had self-valued at $190 
> million (presumably including their inventory tracking system  
subsidiary),
> but it wasn't clear if that was the price paid by K-Mart.
> 

Oh, well. That's really upsetting!!  Borders is by far the best
chain in America. They were better than the other chains in their
"one of everything, even if we only sell one copy every couple of
years" philosophy.   I'd heard that Waldens wanted to do this,
but hoped it would hold off a while. (I keep hoping the next
administration will have policies that discourage this kind
of corporate take-over.)

My guess is that Borders may stay the same for a short while,
but a year or two from now some corporate bean counter will
notice they can save money by not bothering to buy books from 
these little companies, and not "wasting" shelf space on 
stuff that doesn't sell. After all, if they get rid of all
that literature stuff that doesn't sell much, they can triple
the number of romances in the store.  Sigh!

--
Jim Mann            
Stratus Computer   jmann@vineland.pubs.stratus.com  
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: marcy@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca (Marcy Thompson)
Subject: Re: Oh yeah, *great* book ...
Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Surrey, British Columbia, CANADA
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 20:32:38 GMT

In a recent rec.arts.books article, Lauren L. Crawford wrote:
>
>Which books have you _pretended_ you read but really didn't?

The reason I *know* I'd rather hear _Tess_of_the_d'Urbervilles_
discussed than read it is...

When I was in high school, this book was assigned to be read over
Christmas vacation, and I forgot. So I got to school after New
Year's Day only to discover that my class was about to embark
on a discussion of the book, which we did. The discussion lasted
about two weeks, and was pretty interesting.

A couple years later, based on how interesting the discussion was,
I actually forced myself all the way through the book. Ugh.

Anyhow, I not only pretended I had read the book during the class
discussions, I managed to pretend all the way to a decent grade on
the exam we had on the book. (And I think I used it as an example
of something or other in one of my AP English essays, an exam on
which I did quite well. However, that was more than 15 years ago,
so I may simply be embroidering the tale. "How I got a five 
on the AP English exam by writing essays about books I hadn't even
read"...)

I also once pretended I'd read large parts of a chemistry text, but
that didn't work out nearly as well when the exam rolled around.

Ah, memories...

Marcy

-- 

Marcy Thompson		
  SoftQuad (West)			
    marcy@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca (preferred) or marcy@sq.com
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir)
Subject: Re: Limpopo?
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 22:32:05 GMT

Mark Taranto writes:

	John McCarthy poses the question:

               	"All set about with fever trees".  
		What's a fever tree, Fido?

	Hey!  What is the matter with you guys out there?  What happened 
	to that world-famous On-line OED?  Why don't you just look it up 
	in the dictionary?
 
	My Webster's says:

		[blah, blah, blah...]

Mark, dear Mark. If words meant no more than their assigned dictionary
meaning then there would be little point in reading beyond the *Airline
Guide* and *Yellow Pages*, or, in your case, the ticker tape. McCarthy
was picking up on a literary illusion and I seriouly doubt whether Kipling
meant the Scrub Acacia.

							Fido
From: cramer@optilink.UUCP (Clayton Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Once I put this book down, I could not pick it up again.
Date: 13 Oct 92 20:53:27 GMT
Organization: Optilink Corporation, Petaluma, CA

In article <1992Oct9.161846.17884@netcom.com>, tmaddox@netcom.com (Tom Maddox) writes:
> In article <rfjp3q=@lynx.unm.edu> rsquires@cyclops.eece.unm.edu (Roger Squires) writes:
> >	I enjoyed _The Spell_ quite
> >	a bit in my Fascism class awhile back.
> 
> 	Christ it's worse than C. Cramer thinks:
> 
> 	the liberals are taking *classes* in fascism;

If someone is taking classes about fascism, this is a very good
thing.  But most liberals are too embarrassed to call the classes
in which they expound their worldview, "Fascism."

> 	and using books of *magic*!
> 
> 	Good thing Cramer's got his guns.
> -- 
> 				Tom Maddox

Mr. Maddox laughs.  Would he laugh if David Duke were President?
Or ask to borrow something for the barricades?

Fortunately, many gun owners are members of the "Assault Weapons
for the Clueless" program.
-- 
Clayton E. Cramer {uunet,pyramid}!optilink!cramer  My opinions, all mine!
Lesson learned from Gov. Wilson's signing of AB 2601: if you don't get 
your way, have a riot.  Next time, Gov. Wilson will cower appropriately.
From: mtaranto@shearson.com (Mark Taranto)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: Well Met in Austin!
Date: 16 Oct 92 22:03:09 GMT


Francis Muir writes:
 
        Joann Zimmerman writes:
 
                The Austin cell of the raberati held a meeting on Saturday,
                October 10, at 10 a.m. with all current active members
                (Katherine Catmull and myself) in attendance, supplemented
                by Austin raberatus emeritus Mike Godwin, who was in town
                on (mostly) business.
 
                [stuff]
 
                Francis will be disgusted to know that we didn't mention
                him at all.
 
        In fact, the Zimmermanic, Catatonic, Godwitless Silence was music
        to the Fiducial Ear.
 
It would certainly have been preferable to being dismissed as a "nice guy."
 
Mark
From: ncramer@bbn.com (Nichael Cramer)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Fixing Damaged Books
Date: 14 Oct 92 17:51:41 GMT
Article-I.D.: news.ldonhdINNfnm
Reply-To: ncramer@labs-n.bbn.com (Nichael Cramer)
Distribution: world
Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman Inc., Interzone Office
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com


There's a (rather expensive) set of books that I've been wanting for some
time now.  A couple of weeks ago I was able to pick up a set for ~30%
retail.  The set was brand new, however it looks as if someone has driven a
forklift into the side of the box.

I was extremely lucky in that the set was bascially untouched except for
one volume.  It has about 150 (out of some 600) pages that have been
seriously mashed along the top edge.  The binding was untouched and the
text is still readable, but the pages have suffered some serious cosmetic
damage.  They are made of very good quality paper and there was virtually
no tearing.  I've gone through the damaged pages one at a time and smoothed
them out as best I can by hand, but, if possible, I'd like to fix them up
even more.

Anyway, two questions:

1] Any specific suggestions on how to further straighten the damaged pages?

2] More generally, can anyone recommend a general resource (e.g. a book) on
how to repair/care for damaged books?

Thanks

NICHAEL  
nichael@bbn.com  --                Bush/Gorbachev: One Down, One to Go
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin)
Subject: Re: Fictitious Fiction
Originator: mnemonic@eff.org
Keywords: Morgenstern, Garp, Trout
Organization: Electronic Frontier Foundation
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1992 21:34:05 GMT

In article <1992Oct15.144833.882@netwise.com> hilary@netwise.com (Hilary Lane) writes:

>I think it fell apart because Byatt all of a sudden resorted to implausible
>happenings. However, I don't want to give the ending away to spoil it for
>those who haven't read it. But it involved graveyard diggings, storms, trees
>falling and everyone ending up in one room attempting to solve the mystery
>(kind of like Christie's _Ten Little Indians_).

Do you suppose this may be why Byatt took pains to call her book "a
romance" rather than "a novel"?

>As far as the reviewer I read who said she hates women: the reasoning was
>that the women in the book were either not bright, unpleasant, unendearing,
>shrinking violets or garish, harsh fools. I wish I remembered where I read
>that review! I thought the protagonist, Rowland, was a wimp and not very
>bright, either. Ash was a jerk and chauvanist. All in all, I didn't like any
>of the characters, but I thought the story was an excellent read and kept me
>up for a couple of nights just to see how the mystery was unfolding.

If Byatt's men don't come off that well either, it seems odd to generalize
from her characters that she hates women.


--Mike




-- 
Mike Godwin,    |"I can solve this Orient Express thing without
mnemonic@eff.org| breaking a sweat. It's that simple."
(617) 864-0665  | 
EFF, Cambridge  |                           --Hercule Perot
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: francis@oas.stanford.edu (Francis Muir)
Subject: Re: Once I put this book down, I could not pick it up again.
Organization: Stanford Exploration Project
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 12:31:05 GMT


As a confirmed Brundy basher, I must confess to some pleasure at seeing 
*Wuthering Heights* top the list of unreadable books. Why had I not
included it myself? Remember that the original thread was limited to
good books that were, nevertheless, unreadable. It was Mark Taranto who
broadened the thread and listed four categories (I think). *Wuthering
Heights* -- as does anything from the pens of the Sisters Brundy -- comes
under the heading of Unreadable Trash.
	
						Fido
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
From: mnemonic@eff.org (Mike Godwin)
Subject: Re: More Notes from the Decline
Originator: mnemonic@eff.org
Organization: Electronic Frontier Foundation
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 1992 17:36:25 GMT

In article <12677@optilink.UUCP> cramer@optilink.UUCP (Clayton Cramer) writes:

>Consider yourself fortunate that's all that being done.  A friend of
>mine was driving back from San Francisco.  A man drove up next to
>him, and, apparently expressing his feelings about the Bush/Quayle
>bumper sticker on my friend's car, proceeded to mouth various 
>obscenities.  My friend smiled back, and said, "Have a nice day!"
>The raving lunatic then picked up and waved a handgun at my friend.
>Fortunately, the nice Highway Patrolman two cars back saw all this,
>and pulled the raving Democrat over.

I take this story as a disproof of the commonly asserted proposition that
Democrats are opposed to the Second Amendment's guarantee of the right of
the people to keep and bear arms.


--Mike



-- 
Mike Godwin,    |"Liberty resides in the rights of that person
mnemonic@eff.org| whose views you find most odious."
(617) 864-0665  | 
EFF, Cambridge  |                           --John Stuart Mill
From: wojdylo@maths.uwa.oz.au (John Wojdylo)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.books
Subject: Re: More Notes from the Decline
Date: 8 Oct 1992 08:53:23 GMT
Organization: The University of Westrn Australia
NNTP-Posting-Host: madvax.maths.uwa.oz.au

msmorris@watsci.uwaterloo.ca (Mike Morris) writes:



>Mind you, the photograph wasn't quite a depiction of the total of my
>fantasied happiness. 

Picture-of-Happiness for the Day:

Joan Shields spinning around on Mike Morris's erect dick while he's 
reading "Gravitation" --- Meisner, Thorne & Wheeler --- on a reclining 
armchair, in front of a fire.


I.






Newsgroups: rec.arts.books