HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: dam@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (David Morning)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Sinead O'Connor's cute little performance
Date: 7 Oct 92 09:41:35 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.

gln@cs.arizona.edu (Gary L. Newell) writes:


> I'm curious how Sinead's little act on the most recent Saturday Night
>Live show is being taken in Ireland and the UK. I happened to be watching
>the show with my wife and daughter and must say I was surprised when she
>decided to end the Marley song that way.

I haven't seen it, only heard it on the radio.
Wasn't it a Bob Dylan song she was finishing off?

> I know little about her - where
>was she born? 

Ireland.

>Is she Catholic?

I believe so.

> Is this simply an attack on the influence
>that the Catholic church has had on Ireland or is this simply a case
>of catholic-bashing?

I think it was the former. She's been quite critical in the past on the church's
influence in Irish politics, particularly the stand against abortion and
contraception.

Dave



--
From: tahonen@katk.Helsinki.FI (Timo Ahonen)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Sinead O'Connor's cute little performance
Date: 9 Oct 92 16:07:00 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki, Computing Centre

In article <1992Oct8.194034.22843@news.nd.edu> ulick@beethoven.helios.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford) writes:

>In article <1992Oct8.142530.21794@cabell.vcu.edu> dresler@cabell.vcu.edu (Dan Resler) writes:
>>
>>>Most Irish people attempt to ignore her
>> ^^^^
>>This is not true. For better or worse, Sinead has a large following
>>in Ireland. Even the Taoiseach met with her several months ago to
>>hear her views. But, of course, that might say more about Reynolds
>>than Sinead <grin> ...

>By my understanding most means more than half.  I never said that ALL Irish
>people try to ignore her.  Yes, she has a large following, but the fact that
>Europeans based netters hadn't a clue what we were discussing proves that her
>performance was ignored (come to think of it they were mostly British based.
>Did Sinead's performance make the news in Ireland?)

It wasn't ignored, at least not totally, in Finland. The tearing of the 
picture was shown on a 'current affairs commentary' programme of the 
Finnish Broadcasting Company with a few minutes of an interview 
following. The general tone of the story was: she's sincere in what she 
does and she'd like to keep it separate from her music, but her actions are 
not well thought through and are missing their audience due to their less-
than-subtle approach.

My 2 pennis worth: I more or less agree with the above mentioned view. 
Still, when one looks at all those idiots and maniacs that get so much 
publicity nowadays without any thought which could have been born in a human 
soul, Sinead at least says something sane.

Timo Ahonen                        "Sometimes I think the surest sign that
University of Helsinki             intelligent life exists elsewhere in the
Finland                            universe is that none of it has tried to
Timo.Ahonen@Helsinki.FI            contact us." Calvin by Bill Watterson
From: ulick@beethoven.helios.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Sinead O'Connor's cute little performance
Date: 8 Oct 92 19:40:34 GMT
Organization: OUC, University of Notre Dame

In article <1992Oct8.142530.21794@cabell.vcu.edu> dresler@cabell.vcu.edu (Dan Resler) writes:
>
>>Most Irish people attempt to ignore her
> ^^^^
>This is not true. For better or worse, Sinead has a large following
>in Ireland. Even the Taoiseach met with her several months ago to
>hear her views. But, of course, that might say more about Reynolds
>than Sinead <grin> ...

By my understanding most means more than half.  I never said that ALL Irish
people try to ignore her.  Yes, she has a large following, but the fact that
Europeans based netters hadn't a clue what we were discussing proves that her
performance was ignored (come to think of it they were mostly British based.
Did Sinead's performance make the news in Ireland?)


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 
+ 'There was a  master come unto the earth, + Ulick Stafford, PP-ASEL       +
+    born in the holy land of Indiana,      + Dept of Chemical Engineering, +
+ in the mystical hills east of Fort Wayne'.+ Notre Dame, IN 46556          +
+      B'fhearr liom bheith ag eitilt.      +    ulick@bach.helios.nd.edu   +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From: mmh@cs.qmw.ac.uk (Matthew Huntbach)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Celts-Christianity-Catholicism
Date: 13 Oct 92 17:37:26 GMT
Organization: Computer Science Dept, QMW, University of London, UK.

From: wb9tow@bluegrass.ecn.purdue.edu (Steven A Marquie)
> First, as a Wiccan, I practice certain Celtic religious beliefs that

It helps if you limit yor line lengths. Your message was
completely garbled. Now the problem is you have not defined
what you mean by "Wiccan". It comes from the Anglo-Saxon word
meaning "witchcraft". There is no close link between Anglo-Saxon
witchcraft and Celtic paganism. It is a bit like saying "as a
Buddhist I follow certain rituals from the Church of England
Book of Common Prayer".

>        And lastly, there were comments reguarding the transition of Celtica
>to christianity.  It was violent.  Ever hear of the inquisition?  (By the
>way,     Celtica was and is the entire culture of the Celtic people.
>reguardless of theirplacement on the earth

The Inquisition has nothing to do with the conversion of the
Celtic lands to Christianity. The inquisition started many
centuries after the conversion, was not active in the Celtic
lands, and was not directed at survivals of Western European
paganism but at Jews, Protestants, Cathars (whose religious
beliefs came originally from Asia and were nothing to do with
European paganism) and Moslems.

Matthew Huntbach
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: spain@galvia.enet.dec.com ()
Subject: Orange marches in the Republic 
Reply-To: spain@galvia.enet.dec.com ()
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1992 14:00:42 GMT

--

To get off the subject of football/ulickball/daveball/soccer/...

Back to Orange marches in the Republic,

At the risk of being called a raving loony orange unionist masonic bigot
(again :-) ) I'll summarise-

Marches are held in the Republic in Donegal and Cavan.  They are much more good
humoured and far less threatening than those held across the border.  I
believe that they don't sing sectarian songs or celebrate the fact that
4 Catholics were gunned down in a betting shop.
I've never seen an orange march in the Republic but from the TV reports and
newspaper reports the Catholic locals appear to tolerate them and out of
curiousity go and watch the parades.

The parades in Northern Ireland are a different matter entirely.  

       Gary Spain, DEC, Galway, Ireland   - spain@galvia.enet.dec.com

  On being a football fan: "I am aware of the downside to this wonderful 
  facility that men have: they become repressed, they fail in their 
  relationships with women,their conversation is trivial and boorish, they 
  find themselves unable to express their emotional needs, they cannot relate
  to their children, and die lonely and miserable. But you know, what the hell?"
								   Nick Hornby
From: halpin@vax.oxford.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: now no longer Re: My Ugly American post for the year....
Date: 9 Oct 92 13:50:22 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620

In article <1992Oct8.153206.15795@news.nd.edu>,
ulick@stravinsky.helios.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford) writes:
> In article <1992Oct7.094252.9308@vax.oxford.ac.uk>
> halpin@vax.oxford.ac.uk writes:

  [The patriotic Englishman, unlike the]
>>heuristic American is more likely to be heard enthusing about real
>>ale, or fine English cheeses, or complaining about Brussels banning
>>prawn-cocktail flavour crisps. 
> 
> What!!!  When and why did they do this?  Eurocrats are getting ridiculous.
> Banning all packageing in non-standard sizes was one thing, but prawn cocktail
> flavoured crisps!!!  Are pork scratchings next?
> 

See what I mean? Here we have a true English patriot, for all his
abuse of Gary Spain.

:-)

Brendan

Brendan Halpin                    Email: HALPIN@VAX.OXFORD.AC.UK
Nuffield College                  Phone: +44 865 278642
Oxford OX1 1NF
United Kingdom
From: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Scots Gaels
Date: 8 Oct 92 12:50:13 GMT
Reply-To: morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay)
Organization: Laboratory for the Foundations of Computer Science, Edinburgh U

>The school on Raasay stopped
>>teaching in Gaelic because of the number of non-speakers who are now
>>attending. White settlers expect their children to be taught in
>>English.
>> 
>
>
>Whilst I agree with most of your article, I disagree with this
>
>On 21-Aug, BBC Breakfast time noted that the number of pupils learning
>through the medium of Gaelic at Portree outnumbered those learning
>through the medium of English for the first time. Many of the parents
>interviewed for that piece were _English_ and were stressing how important
>it is for their child to learn the language, even if they don't speak
>it themselves.

This is good news. As a person who occasionally harbours urges
to leave the city and go and live up north like the other
white settlers, I would be quite happy for my wee Rosie to be taught in
gaelic.


Perhaps if the people of Raasay ( in my example) were a bit more
bolshie, they'd still have their Gaelic primary school. Portree
is only half a mile away across the water from them.

Incomers should *expect* to have to fit in with the local culture
in many ways - educating their bairns in the local language, for
example. I presume English white settlers in France send their
sproglets to French schools, after all.

As you say, incomers often have a lot to offer the communities which
they join. The real problem with them is they often *swamp* the locals.
Mull is a pretty good example of the bad effects of mass immigration.

M





--
Morna Findlay 					JANET:morna@uk.ac.ed.dcs 
	Thanksgiving For a National Victory (Robert Burns)
Ye hypocrites! are these your pranks? To murder men and give God thanks?
Desist, for shame! Proceed no further: God won't accept your thanks for murther.
From: smckinty@sunicnc.France.Sun.COM (Steve McKinty - Sun ICNC)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Celtic Holidays
Keywords: Celtic, holidays
Date: 12 Oct 92 16:13:02 GMT
Organization: SunConnect
NNTP-Posting-Host: hardy.france.sun.com

In article <Bw0L3B.DFG@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>, ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib) writes:
> In article <1992Oct3.171458.1092@news.nd.edu> ulick@angelico.helios.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford) writes:
> 
> >The June Bankholiday.  First holiday weekend of the summer - the first
> >Monday of June.  It is a 'fixed' Whitsun.
> 
> What _is_ a "Whitsun"

 'White Sunday, 7th Sunday after Easter, when converts to the primitive
 church wore white robes'  (Chambers Dictionary)

> and what the heck is a "Bank" holiday?

A day when the Banks (& most government offices) are on holiday. (me)

Steve

-- 
Steve McKinty
SUN Microsystems ICNC
38240 Meylan, France
email: smckinty@france.sun.com	   BIX: smckinty
From: newt@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Michael Steven Newton)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Celtic Dance questions
Date: 8 Oct 92 09:52:01 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.

pollard@cucbs.chem.columbia.edu (Tom Pollard) writes:

>I don't know how meaningful it is to talk about 'Celtic' dance, because one
>gets the impression that dance styles are fairly different in different
>'Celtic' cultures (at least in Irish and Scottish cultures) and that many
>of these dance styles are of fairly recent origin, with strong Continental
>influences.  I know of three Irish dance styles, which are ceili ("kay-lee")

  Well, there would certainly seem to be characteristics of Celtic dance.
  Sure, the Church especially had a big influence on dance styles in Gaeldom
  in the last century or so, and hence many differences between Irish
  and Scottish dance.  But they are very much akin.  And the Nova Scotia
  Scots have dances which are older survivals of dances lost to Scotland.

  And further, there are certainly visible links between the dances of
  Ireland, Scotland, Brittany and Galicia, for example.  So one could
  argue that there *are* Celtic dance elements.

  Dancing in a Celtic context is first portrayed on Hallstatt pottery
  in the 6th century BCE.  There are also figurines from the La Tene
  period in dance - but of course it is impossible to know exactly what
  this dance was like from these figures.

  -- mn
From: ray@philmtl.philips.ca (Ray Dunn)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: soc-Ulick
Date: 9 Oct 92 22:41:28 GMT
Organization: Not Philips

When I was a lad, in Scotland, "soccer" was regarded as the _English_ name
for the game.

Who cares, I hear you say?  Ok, OK.

Anyway, I just looked "soccer" up in the OED, and found:

    soccer n. cooloq.  Association football
                       Assoc + ER

Now this I found interesting.  To begin with, I'd no idea of this simple
derivation of the word, and secondly the word soccer being a _colloquialism_
for football, puts the argument firmly to bed doesn't it?

Why do we always RTFM last?
-- 
Ray Dunn at home        |  Beaconsfield, Quebec  |  Phone: (514) 630 3749
ray@philmtl.philips.ca  |  dunn@cam.org          |  uunet!sobeco!philmtl!ray
Xref: sparky soc.culture.celtic:6659 soc.culture.canada:7331 news.admin.misc:121
From: ray@philmtl.philips.ca (Ray Dunn)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic,soc.culture.canada,news.admin.misc
Subject: Re: RAID 7 Disc Array Platforms in Belfast & Cork
Date: 9 Oct 92 03:23:18 GMT
Organization: On the Brew.

In referenced article, MICHAEL.WILLETT@OFFICE.WANG.COM ("Michael Willett") writes:
> [large commercial hype posting deleted]

This rubbish has been appearing from time to time in soc.culture.canada,
with Canada in the subject line rather than Belfast and Cork.

I'd assumed that at least it was a genuine followup to a posting I hadn't
seen, but now it's started in soc.culture.celtic so clearly that's not so,
though that "Re:"  is quite a neat trick.

I'm not sure what the connection is between WANG, or Mr. Willett, and
Storage Computer, but I'm going to try to find out.  Perhaps if we all ask
postmaster@wang.com we might get some answers.
-- 
Ray Dunn at home        |  Beaconsfield, Quebec  |  Phone: (514) 630 3749
ray@philmtl.philips.ca  |  dunn@cam.org          |  uunet!sobeco!philmtl!ray
From: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Scottish Newsgroup
Date: 12 Oct 92 17:51:41 GMT
Reply-To: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Organization: COMANDOS Project, Glesga Yoonie

ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Iskandar Taib) wrote:
> morna@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Morna J Findlay) writes:
>> Why don't you order a veggie [haggis] from McSweens - some people (me)
>> prefer them!
>> I often take one with me if I'm doing a spot of weekend hill-walking.
>> A veggie haggis, a bit of turnip, some tatties and some butter cooked
>> in a youth hostel on a cold evening after some honest exercise is a
>> rare tea.
> Describe one of these wonders to us. What do they use for the bag? Do
> they use soy protein instead of sheep parts?

The bag is plastic (some sort of tough clear film, like what's used
for other boil-in-bag foods).  The meat is replaced by chopped nuts
and vegetable fat; the label doesn't say what the proportions are,
but definitely doesn't list TVP or any such abomination.

If I was trying to do it myself, I think I'd add a small amount of brown
lentil, which isn't in the MacSween's version.

-- 
--  Jack Campin    room G092, Computing Science Department, Glasgow University,
17 Lilybank Gardens, Glasgow G12 8RZ, Scotland   TEL: 041 339 8855 x6854 (work)
INTERNET: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk or via nsfnet-relay.ac.uk    FAX: 041 330 4913
BANG!net: via mcsun and uknet     BITNET: via UKACRL    UUCP: jack@glasgow.uucp
From: newt@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Michael Steven Newton)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Wanted: Demonstration ideas
Date: 15 Oct 92 13:37:52 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.

People from within Britain have tried for a *long* time to get any
degree of independence from the English with little success.  The
English are unlikely to grant very much to the Irish, Welsh or Scots
unless they are somehow pressured or embarassed at an international
level, is my best guess.

Such an opportunity for embarrassment is coming!  The EC will be
meeting in Edinburgh in December, and with the media attention there
people in Scotland will finally have some international attention.
This seems like a prime time to let the world know how fed up Scots
are with trying to deal with the English on their own terms, that the
normal channels of political "change" aren't letting the Scots get the
sovereignty they desire.

So, does anyone have any good ideas for how to voice that opinion
in a dramatic, attention grabbing way?  There are surely good models
or examples or anecdotes from other pressure groups in the States or
Europe that we could learn something from.  Can anyone give any
such ideas?

(Private replies are welcome, and will be kept confidential.)

Thanks
mn
From: cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Sinead O'Connor's cute little performance
Date: 12 Oct 92 09:47:41 GMT
	<1992Oct7.155411.9657@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>
	<1992Oct8.075858.26318@dcs.qmw.ac.uk>
	<CC.92Oct8130422@arran.dcs.ed.ac.uk>
	<1992Oct09.100904.10506@bas-a.bcc.ac.uk>
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Edinburgh, Scotland

In article <1992Oct09.100904.10506@bas-a.bcc.ac.uk> skaamjm@ucl.ac.uk (Matthew Moore) writes:

   cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Chris Cooke) writes:

   >I thought Ireland was converted into the Celtic church, not the Roman
   >Catholic one.  It only became Catholic afterwards when travel between Rome
   >and Ireland became much easier, and emissaries arrived from Rome...?

   When Ireland 'became' christian, there was no difference. (St Pat was
   a Roman wasnt he?). What happened sometime later (like one thousand
   years) was that the protestant churches hived off

I was talking, probably not very clearly, of the unofficial & forced
separation between the ancient Church in Scotland+Ireland and that in Rome,
which led to quite different practices and organisational methods here.  It
diverged quite strongly from the Roman church until they were brought back
together again some centuries later.
--
	-- Chris. 	cc@dcs.ed.ac.uk   (on Janet, cc@uk.ac.ed.dcs)

		
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
From: bwalsh@dsg.cs.tcd.ie (Bridget Walsh)
Subject: Re: Sinead O'Connor's cute little performance
Organization: DSG, Dept. of Computer Science, Trinity College Dublin
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1992 07:59:02 GMT

while on the surface, Sinead O'Connor seems to have a point, people in
Ireland mainly try to ignore her little-thought-out and immature political
statements ...

A classic case in mind is the case of the 14-year-old rape victim trying to
have an abortion earlier this year ... Sinead flounced across from
London, demanded to see the Taoiseach, Albert Reynolds, and stated that
she supported this girl ....... because she herself had two abortions in the
last couple of years because there was no chance of long-term relationships
with the potential fathers !

Since the abortion/contraception lobbies in Ireland
have been saying for years that wide access to information and help in
getting decent contraceptive methods would mean abortion, except in
extreme circumstances, would NOT be introduced into Ireland, most people
on both sides of the debate were pretty p*ssed off with her whole attitude. 

She has a great voice, but her political views are largely ignored here
at this stage ...

Bridget

-- 
For perfect safety ... sit on a fence and watch the birds. --Wilbur Wright

Bridget Walsh, Distributed Systems Group, 	        email: bwalsh@cs.tcd.ie
Computer Science Dept, Trinity College Dublin, Ireland  phone: +353-7021543
From: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Ugly Americans-It's not our fault
Date: 15 Oct 92 20:20:00 GMT
Reply-To: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk (Jack Campin)
Organization: COMANDOS Project, Glesga Yoonie

andy@infotec.ch (Andrew Warinner) wrote:
> What nation in Europe has had a civil war in the 19th
> or 20th century?  Russia/USSR and the Balkans with all their 
> transient nation-states.  Guess where there is widespread
> violence in Europe now?  The U.S. seems to have gotten over 
> its Civil War rather well by comparison.

Not quite sure what you are expecting us to infer from this comparison, but
I can also think of:

Germany and Hungary in 1919
Turkey in the early 20s (the suppression of the Green Army)
Spain in 1936-7
the Italian Risorgimento and the March on Rome and the Partisan Revolt
the Silesian Uprising
the Irish Republic in 1923
Greece in 1947-8
Hungary in 1956
France in 1848 and 1871

and sundry lesser revolts in Czechoslovakia (several times), Scotland (1820
and 1919), Ireland (1916), Poland (1971), Wales (Rebecca), Italy (the
factory occupations after WW1, the dirty war of the 70s), France (the OAS
terror tactics of the 50s, the 1968 events) and Romania (the suppression of
the Iron Guard).

In total that lot left many more people dead and caused far more
destruction than the US Civil War.  But Americans still have this peculiar
image of Europe as a quaint backwater where political violence is something
out of the ordinary.  It isn't.  This continent is far less politically
tamed than North America.

-- 
--  Jack Campin    room G092, Computing Science Department, Glasgow University,
17 Lilybank Gardens, Glasgow G12 8RZ, Scotland   TEL: 041 339 8855 x6854 (work)
INTERNET: jack@dcs.glasgow.ac.uk or via nsfnet-relay.ac.uk    FAX: 041 330 4913
BANG!net: via mcsun and uknet     BITNET: via UKACRL    UUCP: jack@glasgow.uucp
From: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com (Craig Cockburn)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Re: Scottish Newsgroup
Date: 8 Oct 92 20:55:11 GMT
Article-I.D.: rdg.1992Oct8.205636.12854
Organization: Digital Equipment Co. Ltd., Reading, England


In article <1992Oct8.174256.4410@netcom.com>, eamon@netcom.com (Charles E Taggart) writes...
> 
>Indeed ... there are rashers, sausages and salmon vacuum-packs for sale at
>the Shannon and Dublin duty-free shops, for instance.  I've brought back
>Irish bacon to the States with no problems.
> 
>I think that US Customs has a specific problem with haggis, though, from
>what I've heard.
> 

It isn't meat that's the problem, it's haggis. It is haggis which has
been deemed unfit for human consumption and it is haggis which as been
banned. Other meat is less restricted.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Craig Cockburn, Digital Equipment Co. Ltd, Reading, England.     Suas
  Internet: cockburn@edieng.enet.dec.com                           leis
  UUCP:..!decwrl!edieng.enet.dec.com!cockburn                      a'
                                                                   Gha\idhlig!
  Views here are my own, and are not necessarily those of Digital