HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: smiley@sdf.lonestar.org (M. Smiley)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Rahal/Johansson/Mario/Tracy
Date: 1 Sep 92 22:41:49 GMT
Organization: sdf Public Access UNIX, Dallas--unrestricted free shell access

In article <1992Sep1.020854.16623@cunews.carleton.ca> marcink@alfred.carleton.ca (Marcin Kolbuszewski) writes:
>In article <1992Aug31.203045.20604@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> dwest@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dan West) writes:
>>I find it very funny that when people defend Johansson they say that
>>he was "just being aggessive" when IMHO he clearly screwed up. I mean
>>where in the hell was he going to put the car? But when Mario hits
>>Tracy or Little Al or ..... he is said to be screwing up. Sorry but I
>>dont see any difference. I think they were both careless. I realize
>>there is a very fine line between hard racing and carefree driving,
>>but in Mario`s cases and in Johansson's case(this time) they crossed
>>the line.
> 
>Rahal incident: Get a copy of Competition Driving
>with the professor Prost who is very careful, look
>at few pictures and sketches about outbreaking and
>you will conclude that Rahal's comment was not very polite
>but quite accurate. Johansson was smoking his tires -
>and if he did not bump Rahal he may have finished in the wall
>himself.
>
>Marcin

Finally someone with the proper perspective. Anyone notice how no one else
even attempted to pass going into that particular chicane ? I'm sure there
is a good reason for that. If Rahal did miss a gear, why didn't Stefan J.
sit back and gather up some extra corner exit speed and easily pass going
into the next corner ? It's obvious that Johansson left his braking way too
late and rammed Rahal. As for his comments, imagine yourself loosing a 22
point margin that you and your team had been working towards all season
because of someone elses carelessness. I doubt anyone would of reacted any
differently, in fact, most of us would of stormed Johannsons pit and 
hurled profanity towards Tony B.

George.
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Cheever/Ganassi
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 15:27:52 GMT

Finger pointing time.

Well, at least both agreed that changes had to be made.
Ganassi felt that change should be in the driver department.
Obviously, he verify this point with, say, Cale Yarborough
(how many different drivers has Cale gone thru the past two
seasons?).

Cheever says the team's troubles stem from a lack of testing
and preparation.  Eddie's quotes:

"Under the current situation, a combination of Aryton Senna,
Nigel Mansell and Jackie Stewart (curious combo, Eddie) couldn't
drive this car to victory.  It would be easier to nail jelly to
a post."

Ganassi plans to continue with a two-car team next year.  You can
bet on Robby Gordon being there (thanks, Mr. Kranefuss) and maybe
Arie getting the second (first?) seat.

Can't think of a different team for Eddie right off hand.  Perhaps
Foyt, who has enlisted the help of Ross Cheever a couple of times
this year, w/o much luck.  But I don't think you'll get the right
chemistry between AJ and Eddie.  AJ needs to get hooked up with a
USA bred driver (someone who has done midgets/sprints/Champ cars/
stocks).  He had intended to go with Jeff Andretti this entire
season, until Indy happened.

Other IndyCar hunches for '93:

- Emmo will likely stay with Penske for another year, and in '94 will
become an owner/driver, ala Rahal.

- Pat Patrick/Doug Shierson are attempted to team up and return in '93.
I'll bet they're talking with Ford.

- A big IF is will Rahal go to a 2-car enterprise?

- Lyn St. James has been working VERY hard in putting together a full-
season ride for '93.  My sources tell me it's pretty close.  She'll
probably run out of the Dick Simon stable.  Simon is likely to switch
from Chev to Ford next year.

- The King Motorsports (Kenny Bernstein)/Budweiser/Ford/Pruett deal is
pretty much a sure bet.

-c'ball-
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1992 08:15:30 EDT
From: <BWF2@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject:    NASCAR - rumors

    OK, I'm tired of all these f1 rumors, time for some REAL
    racing news. :-)
    Picked this up on Bitnet.
    Sterling Marlin is looking to go the Stavola Bros. No confirmation
    but supposedly he still has a contract with JJ.
    Hut Stricklin to replace him.
    Dick Trickle might jump then to Bobby Allison.
   End rumors.
    Now, I guess if Hut would go to JJ, does that mean that Kendall
    and the King are gonna get together? I thought it was down to
    Hut and Tom for the Kings ride.
    I can't wait for Sterling to leave JJ's. Bad teammate for Bill.
    I Mike Beam but with Sterling around I don't care for his
    attitude. They don't work with ANYBODY.

 Brian ' Looking for #2 in 92! It's gonna be AWESOME! ' France
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: marcink@superior.carleton.ca (Marcin Kolbuszewski)
Subject: Re: I had a (F1) dream...
Organization: Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 02:00:31 GMT

In article <memo.601632@cix.compulink.co.uk> shaman@cix.compulink.co.uk writes:
>...and it DIDn't include:-
>
>Senna
>Mansell
>Prost
>Ron Dennis
>McLaren
>Cigarettes
>Frank Williams.
>
>
>And do you know -
>
>it was wonderful. I dreamt of Herbert and Hakkinen, of Berger and
>Brundle, of Schumacher and Alesi, all racing reasonably equal cars
>and ENJOYING themselves.
>
>
>No mega-buck intrigues. No whingeing. No dodgy race tactics. Just
>good engineering and hard racing.
>
>
>sigh.
>
There has been a hort discussion here about F1 vs. INDY.
You dream is almost like indy: Not too much of engineering,
no to much money ( relatively with top salaries around $1M )
and lots of HARD racing.
Scott Goodyear is 5th in points with 3 million budget,
PPG championship is far from being decided, 
drivers pass each other dozens of times per race.
This is open whell racing...
I agree with the opinion that INDY is much better for the viewers.

BTW If you need really close racing - go to local kart race,
especially in one of the "non-modified" classes ( Yamaha KT100 for
example). 

Marcin Kolbuszewski

marcink@ccs.carleton.ca

PS I am tired of Polish jokes. They are plain stupid - and they do not
belong to r.a.p.


Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: cjp53999@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Cory James Padfield)
Subject: Re: U.S. Engines
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 18:19:57 GMT

lallo@stsci.edu (Matthew D. Lallo,622,4577) writes:

>In article 2694@neptune.inf.ethz.ch, marti@nugget.inf.ethz.ch (Robert Marti) writes:
>>
>>I cannot help to conclude that, for some reason, there do not seem to
>>be US companies which are able to design and build chassis which are
>>competitive with British-English companies at the level of F1 or
>>IndyCar/CART racing.  The same appears to be true of engines.
>			^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>How do you reconcile that statement with the fact that we have seen the 
>Ford HB V8 blast its way around F1 circuits of the world with a reliability
>and power *more* than competitive with the rest of the field of 12 and 10
>cylinders from across the globe?  

>Or have I put my foot in my mouth and this engine is made and designed in 
>England?


>Matt


     Actually, Matt, the Ford was designed and made in England by Cosworth
Engineering. Ford supplied the money, and the electronics- the best in the 
biz. But you may have indeed put your foot in your mouth. But, the reason
England is so dominant in car building is because it actually has the facilli-
ties to make the cars. They have the autoclaves to cook a monocoque, they have
suppliers who currently do business with carbon fibre, etc. The only reason
the Truesports car sucks is because of the team, not the design. Americans  
could be competitive, but the initial startup would be very expensive. 

Cory

Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: welty@cabot.balltown.cma.COM (richard welty)
Subject: Re: Road America 200 Results, PPG IndyCar World Series Standings
Organization: New York State Institute for Sebastian Cabot Studies
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 16:09:08 GMT

In article <1992Aug25.204730.23290@aa.cad.slb.com> wilson@mailhost.aa.cad.slb.com (David Wilson) writes:
>Looking down the list of finishers, something odd struck me: there were
>ten cars that all finished 50 laps!  My impression is that I don't often
>see a race, Indy or F1, with so many cars unlapped.  What does it all
>mean?

it means that Road America is a 4 mile long road course, the longest
course that Indy cars run on (indeed, Road America is apparently the longest
course in the US.)

richard
-- 
richard welty                            518-393-7228
welty@cabot.balltown.cma.com
  ``if you can read this, mario, you're too close''
    -- bumper sticker seen on a CART safety truck
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: johng@syacus.acus.oz.au (John GriffithsMel)
Subject: Re: BELGIUM-SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Organization: ACUS Australian Centre for Unisys Software, Sydney
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1992 23:36:18 GMT

thos@suite.sw.oz.au (Thomas Cohen) writes:

>In <3380046@hpcc01.corp.hp.com> boell@hpcc01.corp.hp.com (Donald P Boell) writes:

>>Schumacher was doing everything he could to get around.  The last thing
>>he needed was for Brundle to start getting aggressive behind him, yet this
>>is exactly what happened.

>>For awhile it looked like good old Brutal would ram his nose up Schumacher's
>>tail pipe yet again...thankfully Schumacher was able to make the pass on Senna
>>on Senna's right while at the same time Brundle charged him on the left.

>>Is it any wonder that quite a few people dislike Brundle?  He has absolutely
>>so concept of team driving.  I would hate to see him paired with Mansell, 
>>Prost or Senna for fear that his actions would cause one shunt after another.

>It looks like a couple of you think so highly of Schumacher that
>no one else is able to challenge him. Certainly not his team mate,
>who after all has equal equipment and couldn't possibly be as fast
>in it.

>And who are these 'quite a few' people? There don't seem to be that
>many that I've noticed. And while you may call him 'brutal', who was
>it earlier in the season who kept taking himself and Senna out, through
>stupidity? You may call it youthful exhuberance, but there's no place
>for that in a professional racer.

>IMHO Brundle is a damn sight more professional that Schumacher in his
>approach, and nearly as fast. In fact, probably as fast, just not as
>aggressive (or suicidal).

>>Schumacher is an up and coming star, yet his career could be ended in an 
>>incident such as occured in Hungary.

>Oh puleeeze! Give it a break.
>-- 
>thos cohen  				       |Softway Pty Ltd

I couldn't agree more. The first time I read Donalds attack on Brundle I
thought he must have watched a different race to the one I did.

Brundle has just as much right as Schumacher to try and win races and is almost
as good. AS for people not liking him, well I've not noticed, even ol Nige has
a good word for him ;-).

If you saw the end of the race, Schumacher went to Brundle when Brundle arrived at the end, and did a "high five" . They looked to me as team mates enjoying
success together. Unlike Mansel and Patrasse (sp) who ignored each other on
the rostrum later.
Obviously, Schumacher dosn't share Donalds opinion of Brundle.

It was a great win for Schumacher, and I'm sure he'll win more.

John Griffiths
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: UK vs. USA Fabricators
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 22:20:37 GMT

This stuff regarding the racing manufacturers mostly located
in the UK just got me thinking about something regarding IMSA,
where the current GTP technology rivals that (or surpasses?)
F1.

I know the Nissans have always been fabricated here (the USA),
as well as the Toyotas, Intrepids and I believe the Mazdas.
The Jag of course comes from England as a Group C tub, but is
extensively modified to IMSA specs over here.

That tells me that a proper IndyCar (i.e. Truesports) or F1
machine can be built here.  I would love to see the Gurney
operation put an F1 program together.  He certainly did it
in the past.

-c'ball-
From: tiot_kk@tac.fi (Kimmo Kauranen)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Some results of 1000 Lakes rally from Saturday noon
Date: 29 Aug 92 13:05:46 +0300
Organization: City of Tampere

The rally is now coming to Tampere where drivers have a small 1 hour
break. 

Sebastian Lindholm drove out in the Saturday morning and McRae past
him.

Results after  ( SS 23 of 37)
-------------------------------------------------------------

	1. Didier Auriol	FRA	Lancia		
	2. Juha Kankkunen	FIN	Lancia		-0.30
	3. Markku Alen		FIN	Toyota		-1.07
	4. Ari Vatanen		FIN	Subaru		-1.45
	5. Massimo Biasion	ITA	Ford		-5.55
	6. Lasse Lampi		FIN	Mitsubishi	-6.32
	7. Colin Mcrae		GBR	Subaru		
	8. Sebastian Lindholm	FIN	Ford		
	9. Phillippe Bugalski	FRA	Lancia		
       10. Jarmo Kytolehto	FIN	Mitsubishi	(Group N)


Some unofficial results from "Savo" SS 24
1. Alen        4.34
2. Kankkunen   4.36
   Vatanen     4.36
4. Auriol      4.38
5. Biasion     4.43


Results after "Savo" ( SS 24 of 37)
-------------------------------------------------------------

	1. Didier Auriol	FRA	Lancia		
	2. Juha Kankkunen	FIN	Lancia		-0.28
	3. Markku Alen		FIN	Toyota		-1.03
	4. Ari Vatanen		FIN	Subaru		-1.43
	5. Massimo Biasion	ITA	Ford		-6.00
 

-- 
---
Kimmo Kauranen  *  Department of Information Technology
                *  City of Tampere, FINLAND
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: bob@ncube.com (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: Little/Rypien (NASCAR)
Organization: nCUBE Computers, Beaverton, Oregon, U.S.A.
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 15:43:09 GMT

About two months ago, it was announced that Chad Little
and Mark Rypien were going to team up for 1993.  At the
time, the release sounded like a for sure thing.

Mark (Washington Redskins Quarterback) and Chad pretty
much grew up together in Washington state.

Now I hear scuttlebutt that the deal may not be a sure
deal.  Chad was released earlier in the year by Cale
Yarborough, and has been running selected races with
Harry Melling.  Chad and Harry may be working on a full
season deal for '93.

I will try to contact Chad in the next couple of days to
get his comments.

-c'ball-
From: A735FJO@HASARA11.BITNET
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: F1 News: Patrese to Benetton! (Brundle dropped)
Date: 26 Aug 92 08:23:46 GMT
Organization: SARA - Stichting Academisch Rekencentrum Amsterdam

In article <92237.010151A735FJO@HASARA11.BITNET>, <A735FJO@HASARA11.BITNET>
says:
>
>From Dutch 'Teletekst' (Videotext):
>Patrese will drive for Benetton next year.
>The other driver will be Schumacher, so Brundle will
>be dropped.
>
>Frans
>
 
As some people questioned the above:  The news is, as said, from
'Teletekst', which is like BBC's CEEFAX (Videotext).  I do not know
how it is called in the USA.
Normally Teletekst is very reliable and never publishes rumours as news.
However, I am surprised that I have not yet seen the same news on
BBC's CEEFAX, as CEEFAX is quicker than Teletekst most of the time (when
Motorsport is concerned).
Teletekst said that Patrese will team up with Schumacher.  From this I
concluded that Brundle will be dropped, though Teletekst did not
explicitly say so.
 
Frans.
From: danjones@pyrps5.eng.pyramid.com (Dan Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Driver stats (Spa spoiler)
Date: 30 Aug 92 20:57:12 GMT
Organization: Pyramid Technology Corporation, Mountain View

Michael Schumacher became the second youngest winner of a World Championship
race today.  He is 23 yrs 5 mos 29 days narrowly bumping Jacky Ickx who was
23 yrs 6 mos 6 days at France in '68.  Still the youngest winner is Bruce
McLaren who was 22 yrs 3 mos 12 days at Sebring in '59.

Dan Jones
From: cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (David Cornutt)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Proposal: rec.autos.formula1
Date: 25 Aug 92 17:35:21 GMT
Article-I.D.: lambda.1992Aug25.173521.708
Organization: NASA/MSFC


Er, a couple of small things...

lallo@stsci.edu (Matthew D. Lallo,622,4577) writes:

>Ouch! Aren't we nasty, I'm a big F1 fan (I guess that's a locust) but I 
>also watch CART racing (love the groan of those pushrods goin' up and down)
                                                 ^^^^^^^^
The only pushrod engine that competes in Indycar racing is the Buick V6,
and that is rarely seen outside of Indianapolis (where a different set
of rules makes it more competitive).  The Ilmor and Cosworth engines,
both old an new versions, are overhead-cam.

>and NASCAR road races (I once grabbed the steering wheel of a Winston cup car
>at Dover to discover about 30 degrees of free play in the steering). But 

Well, those cars all run power steering, and it's not unusual to find free
play when the engine's not running and there is no hydraulic pressure.
(If you want to see free play, check out a Sprint car!)

>All in good fun Dave. Perfectly seriously now. If the majority wants a unified
>group then it really isn't appropriate to split it. And as for the F1 posts,
>If you have read this group for a few seasons you'll see that the F1 posts
>always proliferate at the end of the year when the champ's fans are saying
>"told ya so" and the runners' up fans are making excuses. 

True enough, but I for one could do with a lot less of either.

>And remember, F1 is a world sport and this is a world net. 

Wrong, F1 is a European sport.  I get sick of Europeans who try to claim
that Europe = the entire world except for the U.S.  (Yes, they run a few
races outside of Europe, but then again, CART runs races outside of the
U.S., and the F1 fans persist in telling us that CART is still just
a "national" series in spite of this.)  Just because Bernie or Max Mosley
or whoever proclaims FISA to be the only worldwide motorsport does not
make it so.

>As sad as the truth
>is, the u.s. is very isolationist regarding motorsports. It's not hard to 
>believe that folks elsewhere have a hard time getting excited about some of our
>more well known events and series.

I resent the use of the word "isolationist" (how much racing has Europe
imported from the U.S.?), but this does raise an interesting topic.
Obviously, the things that have been successful in Europe are very
different from what has been successful in the U.S.  How did things
evolve this way?  Why, for instance, is there so much oval track racing
in the U.S. and Australia, but almost none (as far as I know) in
Europe or Asia?  A possible topic for another thread...
-- 
David Cornutt, New Technology Inc., Huntsville, AL  (205) 461-6457
(cornutt@freedom.msfc.nasa.gov; some insane route applies)
"The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my employer,
not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary."
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: hagood@sabre.den.mmc.com (Dave Hagood)
Subject: Re: I had a (F1) dream...
Organization: Martin Marietta Astronautics Group
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 19:55:12 GMT

In article <1992Sep4.074312.28392@hasler.ascom.ch>, kevinh@hslrswi.hasler.ascom.ch (kevinh) writes:
|> 
|> [stuff deleted]
|>
|> |> or American drivers
|> |> in F1.
|> 
|> No F1 culture, no desire to race in F1. Indy car/ Nascar etc is the
|> popular motorsport and the thing to aim for when you start your career
|> I suppose and probably no sponsorship from US companies etc.
|> 
	Two of the most prominent IndyCar drivers, Al Unser, Jr. and Michael
Andretti, would both give their eye-teeth to race F1.  Both have won an
IndyCar Championship (Unser in  1990, Andretti in 1991) and Unser won the
Indy 500 this year.  Both are relatively young, very experienced, and very
fast.  Both want to drive F1 to see just how good they are on a world stage.
Unser has also remarked he wants to drive F1 just for the cars themselves.

	The problem is, IMHO, both are at the pinnacle of IndyCar racing,
and neither want to drive for non-competitive teams.  The competitive F1
teams don't want to "take a chance" on drivers unproven in F1 competition
when all the top F1 drivers want Williams or Benetton or (maybe) McLaren
or (eventually) Ferarri.  Both have tested for F1 teams (Andretti for
McLaren, Unser for ??) and the reports were positive, but testing is not
racing against Senna, et al.

	So the current state of affairs is a deadlock:  Unser and Andretti
won't drive for the F1 teams that might be willing to give them a ride.
Once again, it looks like Unser and Andretti will be staying home next year.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
David M. Hagood			Martin Marietta Astronautics Group	|
Voice:  (303) 977-9657							|
E-mail: hagood@den.mmc.com	When in danger, or in doubt,		|
Fax: (303) 977-1530		Run in circles, scream and shout.	|
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
     static char *disclaimer = "My opinions, not Martin Marietta's."    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: smithr@teecs.UUCP (Robert Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Moosehead Grand Prix
Date: 1 Sep 92 18:40:25 GMT
Organization: Litton Systems, Toronto ONT

Moosehead GP

Friday, 11 Sept. - practice
                   qualifying - GM Motorsport Series
                   pole qualifying - American Indycar Series

Sat., 12 Sept.   - practice
                   qualifying - F1600
                    qualifying - GT1, GT2, ITA, ITB, ITC
                   qualifying - MASCAR (stockers)
                   35 lap GM Motorsport race
                   i hour sedan race

Sun., 13 Sept.   - 25 lap F1600 race
                   1.5 hour AIS race
                   35 lap MASCAR race (known to the marshalls as smashcar)

Track: 1.3 mile street circuit in downtown Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

Weekend pass including pit pass only 35.00 (good deal)

Bob.
From: lallo@stsci.edu (Matthew D. Lallo,622,4577)
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
Subject: Re: Chevy A/B catch up with FORD?!
Date: 27 Aug 92 17:10:36 GMT
Reply-To: lallo@stsci.edu
Organization: Space Telescope Science Institute, Baltimore MD

In article @engin.umich.edu, yancm@caen.engin.umich.edu (Eugene Harold Mcnay Ii) writes:

> Aparently they had designed the intake plenum such that under operating
>conditions, standing pressure waves (nodes) were set up to coincide with
>the intake valves. The net effect of this was to get better
>efficiency ( ie more real boost than the static plenum pressure -
>the edge). Was this conciously done before this engine? That's
>why I'm trying to start this thread!

Oh yes. It has been a well known aid to performance for many years, 
even on street cars. It's the same concept that applies to tuned exhaust 
headers but in reverse. Tuned intake manifolds or "plenums" are not
new so I'm thinking perhaps what makes the Chevy A's special is that it
may have variable geometry to change the resonant characteristics at
*different* rpms. Seen recently in some street cars also.

Matt
Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport