HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: irvine@en.ecn.purdue.edu (B-rent)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Manifest Destiny (Was :Re: 200 years of Peace and Friendship
Date: 7 Apr 92 14:02:26 GMT
Organization: Purdue University Engineering Computer Network

> > The actual text is: 
> > 1844 - The British land grab into the Oregon territory became a
> > political issue.  Polk's cry of "54-40 or fight" stirred Americans once
> > again to fight the British to preserve our national borders.
> > 
> 
> But it wasn't ours to begin with.  The Oregon territory was claimed by 
> US, Britain, and Russia.  Russia finally decided it was too far away to
> bitch about and gave up their claim.  It was not owned by the United States.
> It was not part of the United States.  The Oregon territory was jointly
> claimed by both US and Britain.  Britain had a legitimate claim to it and
> that is why they ended up with half.
>
Right, but in this case the British did not want to even give up 'half.'
I believe America's 'Legitimate Claim' was the L. Purchase.  I think
I remember an overlap, but am not sure (no old-map text nearby).  Anyway
I would like to see a deeper historical probing of it.  I think I
remember (dredge WAY back now...) something about negotiations with the
British about it ... can someone help me out with this?
 
> Also if it "stirred Americans once again to fight the British to preserve
> our national borders" why didn't we fight for it?  Mainly because we knew
> we couldn't have it all.  What you are talking about is Manifest Destiny.
> A concept so screwed up we thought we owned everything!
>

I don't agree.  Manifest Destiny as a docterine stated that we may not
own everything now, but in time we would.  It was not screwed up, but
gave the psychological impetus for settling this entire swath!  Screwed
up - NOT AT ALL.  Totally inappropriate for the modern times, but 
VERY GOOD for those times!  (Don't trash something because it is 
inappropriate(sp) for modern times!)

Also another underlying assumption - mass media.  There really was
none in America.  The big campaign speeches, and 'great' things
like that were limited to a local speech by the representative
or (if you were VERY lucky) a single presidential speech!  If you
lived in DC, however, it would be different.  Thee was none of the
so-called 'deep probing' of candidates.  The whole idea of 
'stirring' America by a speech or two is totally ludicrous!
My question to the textbook and to a lot of posters is HOW????
Smoke signals?    

:)
 
-- 
Brent Irvine						irvine@ecn.purdue.edu 
 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa
From: frederik@leland.Stanford.EDU (Frederik MAES)
Subject: Re: Media Violence (was Re: Oscar Revulsion)
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305 USA
Distribution: na
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 92 23:54:14 GMT

In article <1992Apr6.222311.11106@cbnewsl.cb.att.com> jlacey@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (james.w.lacey) writes:

>I think part of the problem is the relative acceptance of violence
>and sex in the US.  

>Jim Lacey          
>my own opinions    
>email:  att!cbnewsl!jlacey  or  jlacey@cbnewsl.cb.att.com


Make this : "... acceptance of violence in the US ".

Movies would be a lot more interesting if only all violence scenes
were replaced by love scenes... ;-)

The major film producers can afford to show explicit violence without
having to fear of not getting an R rating. Showing explicit sex
however is opening a box of Pandora (cfr. Basic Instinct).

I wonder how the rating committee would react on a movie that
has an explicit bed scene of wife and husband in it. Can anybody
remember having seen any major movie lately that showed a married
couple having sex ? I get the impression that movie makers
want to teach us that sex between married partners does not occur or
at least that it is unimportant. Just wondering...

Frederik

_______________________________________________________________________________
Frederik Maes 		     | Odi et amo. Quare id faciam, fortasse requiris ?
365 Lincoln Avenue	     | Nescio, sed fieri sentio et excrucior.
Palo Alto, CA 94301, USA     | 
frederik@leland.stanford.edu |			 Catullus, Carmen 85
_______________________________________________________________________________
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.canada,rec.arts.comics.strips
From: jdnicoll@watyew.uwaterloo.ca (James Davis Nicoll)
Subject: Re: Comic Strips -- American Cultural Imperialism over Canada
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1992 01:21:12 GMT

In article <1992Apr16.173138.23559@sol.UVic.CA> bjr@csr.UVic.CA (Brian Ross) writes:
>In article, people write:
>>>Canada has already successfully applied Canadian content regulations to 
>>>music, so why not apply it to comic strips?
>>
>>  Because it's a bad idea, that's why.
>
>No, it's a good idea, as long as the currently published comics are
>left alone.  In other words, we want MORE COMICS STRIPS! Yeah!  
>(And don't touch The Far Side.)

	No problem: we just annex those sections of the US which contain
cartoon artists who would be a national asset by covertly altering US geography
texts to show the improved Streamlined America. Given the alleged state of
geography education down south, it'll be decades before they notice.

	Best include Charles Schulz for lifetime achievement, I suppose,
and the Okeefonokee (sp?) Swamp in memory.

								James Nicoll
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.china
From: m_lehoul@oz.plymouth.edu (Michael L. Le Houllier)
Subject: Re: Don't be misled!!!
Reply-To: m_lehoul@oz.plymouth.edu (Michael L. Le Houllier)
Organization: Plymouth State College - Plymouth, N.H.
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 92 23:27:33 GMT

In article <1992Apr8.055813.18794@cs.yale.edu> horne-scott@CS.YALE.EDU (Scott Horne) writes:
>In article <1992Apr07.020832.22940@medsys.rn.com>, bbs@medsys.UUCP (Public BBS System) writes:

>Your number is way off.  In any case, I find it curious that people like you
>never fail to bring up the Great Leap Forward but always try to cover up all
>the many great achievements of Mao and the PRC.

Such as?  Can it justify the hardship and human rights of the
Communist government?  If you want to glorify communism, why don't you
go live in it?  All but four have already fallen however.  My roommate
is from a communist country (Viet Nam) and he has nothing but horror
stories relating to the communist regime.
>
>					--Scott
>

-- 
 Michael Le Houllier           *  John 3:16  * Nov 12, 1991 - Dili      
 (m_lehoul@oz.plymouth.edu.us) *  Remember: June 4, 1989 - Beijing
 Go BLUE JAYS   1-0   at Tigers Monday (4-2), Wednesday and Thursday
 The Rangers jinx continues.  The year they could win, they strike.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.canada
From: greg@cs.washington.edu (Greg Barnes)
Subject: Canada's enivronmental record (was Re: Canada and the U.S.)
Organization: Adolph Eichmann's Evil Cake Factory
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 92 17:42:55 GMT

In article <yjqj5+q.kemnitz@netcom.com> kemnitz@netcom.com (Greg Kemnitz) writes:
[about Canada]
>For my own
>part, I admire its excellent (compared to anywhere else I know of)
>environmntal record, and its national healthcare system.  

I used to think Canada had an excellent environmental record, too.  But it
took only a few years living in relatively close proximity to realize that 
things aren't that great on the other side of border.

Consider the clear-cutting of Vancouver Island and the discharge of toxics
into the Columbia and of sewage into the Straits of Juan de Fuca.  Turning
to the east, what about the proposed huge hydro projects (James Bay, for 
example)?

True, things aren't greatly better in the best places here, and
positively abysmal in certain places (the Gulf Coast, L.A.), but I question
whether Canada has an environmental outlook that is essentially more
enlightened than the U.S., or that it's just that they don't have as many
people to muck the place up as we do.

				Greg Barnes
				greg@cs.washington.edu
From: gavrila@imhfhp16.epfl.ch (GAVRILAKIS Spyros IMHEF DME EPFL)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: NOT NEWS : GREEK ECONOMIC SHAMBLES
Date: 14 Apr 92 14:09:35 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne



Thanks to the contributor for the article in the Kathemerini. Below is
an extract from the 2day's FT-Europe.

'It is more than a year since Greece promised strict implementation of
a medium-term stabilisation programme in return for Ecu 1.1bn EC loan.
But annual inflation is still stubornly high at 18.3%, despite a public
sector pay freeze, while public debt, which amounted to 95%(!!) of GDP
last year, shows little sign of shrinking.
'Virtually no progress has been made on the structural reform part(?)
of the programme, which aims at reducing the deficit thru broadening the
tax base, trimming the civil service payroll and cutting state welfare
outlays by raising the pesionable age'


Below are also some stats on Greece from Le Monde :

Area : 132 000 Km**2
Pop. : 10 033 000 (-1)
Econ. Distribution of the pop. :  Primiry sector : 25.3%; Secondary : 27.5%;
Tertiary : 47.2%
Unemployment : 8.6% (1991)
GNP : US$ 6 099 (1990)
Distrib. of GNP : Primiry sector 17%; Secondary 27%; Tertiary 60%
External debt : 1984 : $ 10bn ;  1990 : $22bn (Thanks Papadoc)
Budget deficit : 20% of GDP
Invisible earnings : 29% of GDP (tourism 4%, remit. 3%, Ship. 3%)
Inflation : 1990 : 23%,  1991 : 18%
Growth of GDP in 1990 : 0.1%

Yrs, Spyros Gav. EPFL Switzerland.
~
From: UCNICK@UMUC.BitNet (Nick Gavrielatos)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: mutlu-malak
Date: 17 Apr 92 02:39:54 GMT

>From: han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu)
>Subject: 'Withers - Or Whatever His/Her Real Name Is.'
 
>Have you ever felt guilty, apologetic, or responsible for your
>drinking?
 
Have you mutlu-malak ever felt embarrassed, responsible or
or apologetic for your unsuccessful musturbation???
 
>Chronic mental illness may range from subtle and mild to obvious and
>disabling, 'withers - or whatever your real name is.'
 
We know what you have mutlu-malak, we know it too damn well!!!
 
>Now, what would you like to add?
 
I'd like to add that you are just as much of a prostitute as your
whole family in the turkish proopaganda bureau is!!!
 
Nick Gavrielatos
To Sixameno Plasma
UCNICK@UMUC
 
/********************************************************************/
/* You are a liar mutlu-malak, you are one big allah-damn liar      */
/* BANANA REPUBLIC TERKIYEKI CHICKEN                                */
/********************************************************************/
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
From: dabbott@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU (Derek Abbott)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.soviet
Subject: Pontians
Date: 10 Apr 92 02:38:17 GMT
Organization: Electrical and Electronic Eng., University of Adelaide

Does anyone know any references on the history and demographics
of Pontians or "Pondi"?
From: 89u1569@csdvax.csd.unsw.edu.au
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Degrees and some little info
Date: 9 Apr 92 10:37:36 +1000
Organization: University of New South Wales



	Auto to gramma elaba apo ton Axilea. Postmaster sthn Ariadnh sthn
Ellada. den prepei na exei andirhsh pou to kanw post. pandws exei kapies aples
apandiseis se kapies pi8anothtes apofighs Dikatsa.


>>> Ua symboyleya pantvs na pareis kanena master-aki
>> Isws na to kanw sthn Ellada, 0elw na balw mpros sth zwh mou. Olo panepistimio
>>...
>> A ne mporw na kanw Master sthn Ellada;
>
>Sthn Ellada den einai toso safhs h katastash gia ta masters kai
>giayto kai olh ayth h istoria meto DIKATSA. Pantvs exei chfistei enas
>nomos poy kauiervnei metaptyxiaka diplvmata eidikeyshs (aka Master) alla
>den nomizv na exei ylopoihuei sthn prajh.
>
>> 	Ti leei o idiotikos tomeas an den exeis dikatsa;
>> Kia an anagnorizei mia allh xwra ths EOK to ptixeio twtes den upoxrewnetai
>> kail h Ellada;
>
>Dystyxvs edv einai Balkania, den einai paije gelase. H isotimia sto DIKATSA
>einai aparaithth oxi mono gia to dhmosio. Kai na doyleceis se idivtikh etaireia
>ua prepei na asfalisteis kapoy kai an den ues na se madhsei to IKA ua
>prepei na grafteis sto TSMEDE. Gia na grafteis omvs sto TSMEDE prepei
>na grafteis sto TEE poy shmainei DIKATSA ktl.
>

	Re paidia auto to teleftaio me ekane na gelasw,
	an kai eprepe na klew ta halia mou.
	Ande twra enan akoma xrono sthn Ellada sun
	starto ... mono gia ptxio. telos pandwn kanw pws
	den ta blepw kai proxwrw.
	Pws paei to tragoudi ... pou leei gia traba th anhfora :-)


>-- 
>						   __            _  _
>						  /  )    /     // //
>						 /--/ _. /_  o // // _  _
>						/  (_(__/ /_<_</_</_</_/_)_
>
>
	Eipa na balw kai to tag line tou giati einai wraio.
		Gia haradan
			Giorgis T.
From: rwstarke@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Ross W. Starkey)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Bibliography on Sappho
Date: 8 Apr 92 20:29:37 GMT
Reply-To: rwstarke@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Ross W. Starkey)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester MI

Note: This is not Ross Starkey, its Ilan U. Woll posting with permission.

Hi, does anybody know how to get some poetry  by Sappho, I have a
friend who needs Bibliographic references for a paper.  Thanks, Ilan

"Avoid cliches like the plague" George Bernard Shaw

-- 
Ross Starkey                         "Of course you know, this means WAR." 
rwstarke@vela.acs.oakland.edu        "This whole thing is goony, I shou'da
                                      stood in bed!"  "Gruesome, isn't it?"
FIGHT DICTATORSHIP!  VOTE!!!!                                  --Bugs Bunny
From: "alex bosika" <alex.bosika@canrem.com>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: this conference
Date: 10 Apr 92 23:48:53 EST
Reply-To: "alex bosika" <alex.bosika@canrem.com>
Distribution: soc
Organization: Canada Remote Systems

 Hello to everyone. I am new to this conference in terms of posts but
 I have been reading the MASS of messages for about a week now. I
 must say that this conference is nothing more than an interesting
 one but politically explosive.

 Tell me a few things. I want to know who is Mr. Mutlu Hassan...sorry
 if the name is wrong. Where are the posts originating from. I have
 seen a lot of facts presented by this gentleman, but facts & figures
 can be manipulated by anyone. Even the UN and OECD.

 I also would like to know more about this Macedonian/Greece issue
 as I am confused about it. Are the Macedonians being idiots in
 trying to establish their state of recognition OR are the Greek
 people denying it? This is a politically packed question since
 there is a lot of history involved and so much has evolved within
 the region that one can almost find it difficult to prove. Almost like
 the JFK assassination! (Which I have been analysing for some time).

 Are the Macedonians really Greek. Or are they legitimately different?
 I would like HARD DOCUMENTED FACTS for my research. Also, neutrality
 is important. Either side could give me a mountain of material
 supporting their claims but they can easily be manufactured for their
 own purposes. Therefore, I ask for legitimate points of view and
 comments. And THANK YOU ALL for any suggestions and help. Since this
 material would be very important for my own studies (I am doing
 some work on Greek history but the Macedonian part has impeded on
 my work a bit as I don't know how they fit in) I would like accurate
 information.

 I really do feel sorry for all the people in the Balkan region. While
 they are fighting overall petty historical disputes such as this, the
 rest of the developed industrialised nations are moving on with their
 goals...Japan, Germany, United States...etc etc..It seems like Greece
 seems to be in the middle of it all with the Macedonians and Turkey.
 Is it because these two groups of peoples have valid claims OR is
 Greece a victim of imperialist motives?

 I expect to see the results and responses to this question, soon.
 THANK YOU and I hope to obtain valuable information from the Greek
 people themselves.

 Mr. Bosika
--
Canada Remote Systems  - Toronto, Ontario/Detroit, MI
World's Largest PCBOARD System - 416-629-7000/629-7044
From: UCNICK@UMUC.BitNet (Nick Gavrielatos)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: Your lies mutlu-malak, your allah-damn ugly lies....
Date: 16 Apr 92 04:24:43 GMT
Article-I.D.: WISCMACC.22041523343807

Someone wrote:
>Well, I did it. Went to the library and tracked down one of Hasan
>Mutlu's sources: Adventures in the Near East by A. Rawlinson. I
>am probably going to be covered with spittle and derision by the
>other netters for actually taking Mutlu seriously enough to go
>and check his sources, but what I found by reading Rawlinson's
>book may be helpful in shedding some light on how Mutlu organizes
>his propaganda.
 
Its not the firts time pal.... I know that son of a bitch from
87... I have big huge phonebook-like manuals with mail I've
been collecting since then... he had some other little vaginas
as team members back then, like toppcan and ketin... well, one
day, they had a taco... (joke for very fiew)
 
They said they were copying stuff from who-the-fuck-knows-where,
and had the nerve to present it as sources... multiple times
of checking of their sources revealed..... toilet paper...
There werent any sources like that... some did in fact exist,
but they contained no articles at the pages they were listing
as evidence, they contained no such articles in the book. Period!
 
Now mutlu writes:
Mutlu>So you are the man who changed history more than anyone alive.
 
YOU turkish paid-propaganda dirt cheap tuberculosis victim!!!
 
You keep on lying your ass, you keep on writing lies upon lies
malakies upon malakies, and now YOU are trying to accuse someone
else, for "changing history"...
 
You have not just altered, you have distorted history same way
your mind is and your cor-ass will be after I get you to dance
lambada with me...
 
Mutlu> I am going to save this article of yours, and reproduce it at
Mutlu> appropriate moments.
 
SAVE THIS, mutlu-MALAK! SAVE THIS!!!!!
 
Nick Gavrielatos
To Sixameno Plasma
UCNICK@UMUC
 
/********************************************************************/
/* You are a liar mutlu-malak, you are one big allah-damn liar      */
/* BANANA REPUBLIC TERKIYEKI CHICKEN                                */
/********************************************************************/
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
From: GF.JXC@forsythe.stanford.edu 
Subject: Attica resorts question
Organization: Stanford University, California, USA
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1992 15:47:19 GMT

   [Sorry if this gets posted more than once --- somethings
wrong with the local posting software so I keep trying to post
this from different machines.  Replies are best sent to the
"lindy" address in the sig.]

   I'm planning a trip to Greece this May and June, and I wondered
whether readers of this newsgroup might be willing to give me some
advice.

   Since I've already made several trips to Greece and have gone to most
of the major "axiotheata," I thought that this time when I was in Athens
I would try visiting some of the other places in Attica which aren't so
well known.  So I am looking for interesting places near Athens where I
could go on a day trip or perhaps for several days.

   There are three places I've heard about that sound interesting:

      * Porto Germano, on the eastern tip of the gulf of Corinth

      * Porto Rafti, on the east coast of Attica

      * Agioi Apostoloi, north of Athens on the coast facing Evvia

   It's difficult to find out much about these places from the
guidebooks, so I wanted to ask here about them, specifically:

       * what are the beaches like at these places?

       * are there hotels and tavernas, and will they be open
         during May?

       * is it easy to get there by bus from Athens (I won't have
         a car.)

       * what else of interest is in the immediate area? (I know about
         the classical fortress near Porto Germano, but don't have
         any information about other things worth seeing near these
         places.)

   I'd be very grateful for any advice via posting or email.  Thanks
very much,



                            Jon Corelis


Jon Corelis               jon@lindy.stanford.edu
Stanford University       BITNET:  BA.JYC@RLG.STANFORD.EDU
From: UCNICK@UMUC.BitNet (Nick Gavrielatos)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek
Subject: mutlu-MALAK, I have visited 'turkiye'
Date: 17 Apr 92 03:42:08 GMT

>From: han@anadolu.michigan.com (hasan.b.mutlu)
 
>Greece and Turkiye are in the same category.
 
Your mama and your ass and turkey is in the same category....
Turkiye will never be in the same category with Greece mutlu-malak,
NEVER!!! No matter how much you cry, no matter how openly you bend
over and expose your asses, no matter how many prostitutional
propaganda you sell your dirty selves for, no matter how many
'soft nargiledes'(=tsimpoukia) you give the rest of the world...
NEVER mutlu-MALAK! NEVER!!!
 
 
>Hard to swallow?
 
I know its hard for you to swallow mutlu-malak, but dont worry....
I'll... help out!!!!
 
 
>Why not visit Turkiye and see for yourself?
 
I did a few minutes before I started this mail.... I visited Turkiye!
Now I feel about 3-4 pounds lighter... much much better....
 
 
Nick Gavrielatos
To Sixameno Plasma
UCNICK@UMUC
 
 
/********************************************************************/
/* You are a liar mutlu-malak, you are one big allah-damn liar      */
/* BANANA REPUBLIC TERKIYEKI CHICKEN                                */
/********************************************************************/
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.turkish
From: lolonis@umaxc.weeg.uiowa.edu (Panagiotis Lolonis)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.yugoslavia,soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: Macedonia according to a 1940 National Geographic Map
Date: 11 Apr 92 20:50:42 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.greek
Organization: U of Iowa, Iowa City, IA

>From: sommar@enea.se (Erland Sommarskog)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.greek,soc.culture.europe,sco.culture.yugoslavia
>Subject: Re: Macedonia according to a 1940 National Geographic Map

>In the map of the Roman Empire in The Times Concise Atlas of World
>History, the Roman province of Macedonia clerly includes most, maybe
>all of present-day Republic of Macedonia. (And possibly some of Serbia
>too.) Since the current borders are not included, it is  a bit difficult
>to draw exact conclusions. It is however safe to say that the spot where
>Skopje is today was part of Roman Macedonia, since the Vardar/Aixos river
>is one the map, and the border is just north of the northenmost "hook" 
>of Vardar. Skopje is located on Vardar some 20-30 km south-west of
>this "hook".

This means that one of the maps is inaccurate (perhaps due to lack of 
more accurate information about the Northern border of Macedonia) or
the two maps show the Roman empire at two different times and therefore
there might be a boundary change.  I will try to locate the Time's map and
see the borders of Macedonia. 

>And it seems that it changed a couple of time before WWII too.
>We all know that Macedonia as a concept extended beyond the Greek
>portion of Macedonia, in the international politics in the 19th
>century, so an occassional map from National Geographic in 1940 
>does not prove very much.

Certainly it does not prove anything but it is a piece of evidence that
must be considered, especially if sound sources were used to compile that
map.  I hope that National Geographic does not put labels on maps occasionally.
That would be a serious blow of the journal's credibility.  A journal that 
has the diffusion of geographical knowledge as its main objective cannot be
excused for making lousy maps.

It is interesting to see if the National Geographic has published other similar
maps of the same area and if there have been changes in the names of regions.

Maps published during the period 1880(?) (year the National Geographic was
established) and 1950 would show if the map that I mentioned was occasional.

Also, looking at maps published by other credible organizations (particularly
those that did not have political attachements) would show the same thing.

If I find some time I will look in the library for such evidence and I will
post the results. 

>-- 
>Erland Sommarskog - ENEA Data, Stockholm - sommar@enea.se

Panos Lolonis,
Department of Geography