From: edelheit@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit)
Subject: Re: Jesus vs. Cub Scouts?
Keywords: religion hyproctite rubbish
Organization: The MITRE Corporation, McLean, VA
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1992 03:23:17 GMT

In article <1992Oct11.223119.11046@ra.msstate.edu> dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu (Donald R. Newcomb) writes:
>In article <1992Oct6.134310.3288@linus.mitre.org> edelheit@smiley.mitre.org (Jeff Edelheit) writes:
>>In article <1992Oct5.214737.1354@infonode.ingr.com> stevenst@iaserv.b1.ingr.com (Todd Stevens) writes:
>>>
>>>I have a responsibility to share Jesus Christ with the world, but not to force
>>>it upon anyone.  The problem I have is being viewed in any way as PROMOTING a 
>>>false belief.
>>>
>>>Todd Stevens
>>>stevenst@iaserv.b1.ingr.com
>>>
>>Todd - You are just showing how much of a hypocrite you are.  You are
>>suggesting that anyone who does not agree with your view holds a false
>>belief.  That is outright rubbish!!!
>>
>>From my perspective, you DO NOT have a responsibility to share Jesus
>>with me or anyone else.  You HAVE a responsiblity to let me practice
>>my religion as I wish, without any interference or proseltizing.
>>
>>Judaism predates your form of Christianity by several thousand years
>>of practice and history.  It has well founded beliefs that state, and
>>I repeat it again, that the Messiah will be announced by Elijah the
>
>I have reread this posting several times and I wonder if the poster
>would be so quick to condemn religious intolerance and bigotry on the
>part of his coreligionists or in a country where his is the dominant
>religion? Has he spoken out about laws in some countries that made
>it a crime to raise crops that do not conform the dominant religion's
>arcane dietary laws? Has he spoken out to condemn gangs that roam
>the streets building barriers to prevent anyone from driving on their
>day of religion-enforced non-work? Would he be so quick to condemn
>a Scout Leader from that country who expressed concern that a Scout
>was bringing "unacceptable" food on camp-outs? Perhaps arrows like
>"rubbish", "hypocrite" should be put back in the quiver and saved
>for a target a little closer to one's religious home. From someone
>who claims to have Scouting's interests at heart, IMHO, the above
>was a very unscoutlike argumentation.
>-- 
Before Mr. Newcomb opens his mouth, he should check his facts.  First,
If he is suggesting that religious intolerance and bigotry is found 
among Jews or in Israel, let's set the record straight.  Jews have
been subjected to religious intolerance for well over 4,000 years and,
making a generalization, may be the most open towards it relations
with other religions.  Judaism does not challenge the right of any
religion to exist.  It does not actively seek converts; in fact it
attempts to discourage converts.  The laws of Kashrut may seem to be
arcane to you, but have an important historical significance.
Furthermore, the State of Israel does not have laws which prohibit the
raising of non-kosher animals (one of Israel's biggest food exports is
pork!!).  What crop are you suggesting is it illegal to grow in
Israel?  (Marijuana? Coca?)

I do condemn the ultra-orthodox extreme who stone cars in Meara
Sherem (sp?), as well as the Temple Mount Faithful.  I am concerned
about others eating preferences and and am concerned about dietary
restrictions (religious, health or otherwise.)  I am concerned about
indviduals rights to practice their religious beliefs without
interference or attempting to impose my set of beliefs on another.

The original posting clearly reflected a position that his practice of
religion would cause him problems in allowing a scout to practice a
religion different than his own and that it was his duty to try to
convert the scout to the leader's religion.  There have been many
postings and email to the Scouter.  He has modified his position
after reading the concerns of Christian and Jewish scouters.  I
propose that we end this discussion and start a new thread.  How
about what should a 2nd yr. Webelos look for in a Boy Scout Troop?

Jeff Edelheit
edelheit@mitre.org
Cubmaster and Webelos Den Leader
>Donald R. Newcomb
>dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu
>newcomb@usmcp6.bitnet  


Newsgroups: rec.scouting