From: Brian.Randell@newcastle.ac.uk
Newsgroups: soc.roots
Subject: An IGI/FamilySearch query concerning Wales
Date: 11 Jan 93 10:28:38 GMT
X-Sender: nbr@shotton.ncl.ac.uk
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I have been for some time trying to trace the birthplace of a Francis
RANDELL (1797-1839), who married Rebecca Thomas in Kidwelly,
Carmarthenshire, Wales in 1797. Though my suspicion is that he came from
Devon, another possibility is that he came from elsewhere in Wales. I am
wondering therefore whether one reason for my failing to find him arises
from problems with the IGI that I have just learnt about, though the
problems are of more general interest to me than just in connection with
this particular search.

Although the use of surnames started in the 15th and 16th centuries, the
practice of using patronymics rather than surnames continued even into the
19th century in some places in Wales. As a result the IGI for Wales
provides both a surname and a given name index. However I understand that a
number of problems remain, because of the way that the Welsh IGI was
compiled. The only detailed account I have found of these problems is one
that I have just found by C.P. Lewis ("Using the IGI for Wales and
Monmouthshire," Gwent Family History Society J., vol. 3, no. April,1982),
which I was led to from one of my favourite genealogical "bibles", P. Saul
and F.C. Markwell ("The Family Historian's Enquire Within", Countryside
Books, 1991). In contrast, the two most detailed general accounts of Welsh
genealogy I have found, those by G. Hamilton-Edwards ("In Search of Welsh
Ancestry", London, Phillimore, 1986) and by Daniel L. Parry ("Digging up
your Welsh Roots", Oct 1987 - a file, described as having been compiled
from a variety of public sources, which is to be found on various
genealogical bulletin boards) do not mention these problems with the Welsh
IGI.

Lewis explains that, despite the fact that provision of both a surname
index (SN) and a given name index (GN), there are nevertheless major
difficulties in locating pre-1813 baptisms. (It was only in 1813 that
special forms came into use for baptismal entries in Welsh parish registers
which made the surname explicit.) 

Quoting Lewis:

"The IGI assumes, in all cases before 31st December 1812, and [thus very
often] wrongly, that the child took its father's christian name as its
surname. Thus when William, son of John and Sarah Thomas was baptized at
Cowbridge, Glamorgan on 17th October 1783, he appears on the microfiche
thus:-

In GN, indexed under William:
  William  (son of)  John Thomas/Sarah

In SN, indexed under John:
  John, William (son of) John Thomas/Sarah

He does *not* appear in the surname index under Thomas.
. . . 
Early registers in Wales often give a string of patronymics such as 'Rachel
d. of Thomas John Charles' (baptized at Panteg, Mon., on 25th March 1741) 
. . . The Morman computer assumes the first two are the important ones and
totally discards the rest. So the Panteg entry becomes:-

GN  Rachel (d. of) Thomas John

SN  Thomas, Rachel (d. of) Thomas John
. . .
Although this is the basic system, which applies to the vast majority of
entries, it is not a hard and fast rule. A lot seems to depend on the
intelligence or whim of the individual who made the original input into the
computer. Several examples of 'multiple' names can in fact be found in full
in the index, and also some baptisms before 1813 which have been indexed
under the correct surname."

At the time Lewis wrote his article the Welsh IGI was not divided into
counties, thought I note that the 1988 and 1992 editions are so divided.
This is the only major change I am aware of in the Welsh IGI since 1982.
Can any soc.roots/ROOTS-L IGI experts confirm that the problems described
by Lewis still exist, and provide any advice? 

My hope is that the LDS Family Search system, which I trust will be
available in the UK before long, provides a means of searching for names
occurring in the "Father/Mother or Spouse" field, since this would help in
getting round at least the first of the two classes of problem illustrated
above. Is this in fact the case?

Cheers

Brian Randell

Dept. of Computing Science, University of Newcastle, Newcastle upon Tyne,
NE1 7RU, UK
EMAIL = Brian.Randell@newcastle.ac.uk   PHONE = +44 91 222 7923
FAX = +44 91 222 8232 
Comments: Gated by NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU