From: peercy@crhc.uiuc.edu (Mike Peercy)
Newsgroups: rec.autos,rec.autos.driving
Subject: Ticket for running stop sign
Date: 1 Oct 1992 01:11:54 -0500
Organization: Center for Reliable and High-Performance Computing, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Distribution: usa
NNTP-Posting-Host: lasso.crhc.uiuc.edu
Keywords: court help 4am curvy right turn

Considering how many of the posts are on tickets, accidents, and
insurance, there ought to be a rec.autos.legal.

Here's my contribution.

I got a ticket for running a stop sign on a gentle right turn from
one deserted road to another deserted road at 4am.  (For those in
the Champaign area, it was in Mahommet from southbound 47 onto 150.)

_______________________________

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
                            150
______         ___    _________
  ****|   |   |S /   /
  ****|    ...| /   /S                      south
  ****|   |   |/.../                          |
      |           /                            ----> west
      |   |      /                            |
      |    47   /

The main point seems to boil down to this:  is it a waste of my time
to go to court if I cannot assure the court that I did in fact stop?

I honestly do not remember whether I stopped or not.  (I am not in the
habit of committing all my stops to memory.)  All I can assure the
court is that (a) there was nothing in my path on 150, (b) there were
no vehicles coming from the east on 150, (c) there were no vehicles on
the road anywhere, (d) I certainly could have made a safe and controlled
stop if there were.

Will the judge say, regardless, "She says you ran the stop sign.  You
say you don't know whether you did.  I have to find you guilty."

Can any of the following be used as grounds for anything?

(1) The stop bars (indicated by ...) on the right turn are at such a
    point that it is _impossible_ to see traffic from the left.  A
    "legal" stop would be absolutely worthless.  However, if one slows
    as she approaches 150, her car is directed virtually west and her
    visibility is perfect.  A stop here when no cars are coming is
    (it's the only word that comes to mind) unnatural.

    I sat for a while at this intersection (after taking photos of
    it), and I saw only 1 car out of many actually stop when there
    were no cars approaching from the left.  All the rest treated this
    curvy turn as a yield.  And all those who met traffic stopped
    safely at the end of the curve, well past the stop bar.

(2) It was 4 in the blessed am, and not a car on the road.

(3) The officer was apologetic, saying, "It's policy in Mahommet to
    give tickets for running stop signs."  She may have said this
    to stave off argument, or she may have really felt sorry for
    ticketing me for this alleged infraction.

Any hope?  Monday's my last date to avoid hearing by paying the fine.
Preliminary court date is Thursday the 8th.  By the way, it's a five
minute walk to the courthouse for me, a 15-20 minute drive for the
officer.

Also, I have a New Mexico license.  (This infraction occured in
Illinois.)  The back of the ticket says the Sec. of State who issued
my license will be notified.  Does anyone know if this is the truth
or just an idle claim?  As most will agree, I don't mind the $50:
I mind the record.

Thanks for your response.

Mike Peercy
peercy@crhc.uiuc.edu