From: anon-1218@twwells.com (Anika)
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Subject: Re: response to ed
Date: 18 Nov 92 17:24:16 GMT
Organization: Anonymous Posting Service at twwells.com
X-Email-Accepted: yes


Warning***Anika's strongly felt opinions follow****


17-Nov-92 22:38	erc@unislc.uucp (Ed Carp)	Re: response to ed  writes:


>Teresa Kline (aatresa@lims02.lerc.nasa.gov) wrote:
>
>: >Nope, not at all.  Your name was drawn merely as an example.  Anyone would've
>: >done as an example.  Tell you what ... replace "Teresa" with "Person A".  
>: 
>: Since this is your usual way of formatting examples, by *not* using it, you 
>: made it personal.
>
>It is?  Hmmm...thanks for bring it to my attention.  No, I didn't make it
>personal - you took it personally.

	Since Ed has continued posting this exchange, I assume responses
	from the peanut gallery are acceptable? I remember looking over the
	letter when this began, and I know I really REALLY loosely paraphrase,
	but it seemed the two instances where names were used were like this:
	If Teresa feels a certain way, it reflects her feelings of self-love.
and 	Stephen likes me, so the reflects *his* feelings of self-love.
	Now before anyone jumps down my throat for mis-quoting and basing a 
	judgement of sorts on it, please note that *however* it was written,
	that's how I interpreted, and clearly, so did Teresa. 
	*Anyway*, since the names were used and references to the owner of
	those name's self-love were made, I think it *becomes* pretty 
	personal, regardless of the intent. If someone said, "If Anika doesn't
 	like me then that's a reflection of her self-love," I'd come back
	with either, "Who said I don't like you?" or "What the @#!@ do you 
	know about my self-love?" As the latter is what Teresa did, I suspect
	this is why. 

>: >But I *do* know you, and, to somedegree, how and why you think as you do.
>: 
>: No, you *think* you know me, how I think and why I think as I do.
>
>Well, I stand corrected.  I never knew you could dance so well on the head of
>a pin.  <sigh>

	*sigh*????!!?!?!?! Resignation at being manipulated and down-trodden 
	by yet another woman. *sigh* (Anika sticks finger down her throat)
	Give me a break. She has a legitimate reason to be upset, IMHO.
	If it was really a misunderstanding, why the hell can't Ed just say,
	"I'm sorry you took it that way, that's not how I meant it. I'm sorry
	if it hurt/upset you." Why force the issue and hope for Teresa to
	break and apologize for a misunderstanding that clearly came
	from what *Ed* wrote? I do NOT suggest apologizing for writing it.
	I suggested apologizing for the pain it's caused. Is that so tough?

>: And it was based on that past association that I resented the personalization
>: of your post.  It is because of the "personal history" that seeing my name in
>: your post made it personal. 
>
>It was a not-so-random personalization.  Perhaps I should've turned it around,
>perhaps I should've mentioned someone else.  But why are you so upset?  What's
>the big deal?  I think by now everyone on asar is aware that I was using an
>example.  Why are you still so offened by it?  Why are you trying to hurt and
>insult me by trying to rub my nose in the opinion that I made a poor choice in
>examples?

	No, everyone on asar is aware that you *feel* you used it as an
	example. Teresa has stated several times why it upset her. Why can you
	not say you're sorry for the misunderstanding and let it go? I think
	of all the posts you've been flamed for and note that NOT ONCE have
	you said, "Hey - sorry if you misunderstood me." Your stance has
	always been, "Fuck you if you misunderstand me. I'm right I'm right
	I'm right." In fact, on that memorable occasion you called us all
	illiterate dipshits because we "misconstrued" your post. You never
	apologized for that smear, either.

>: >Who told you I wasn't a survivor?  You and I have had many long-distance
>: >phone conversations about both my abuse and your abuse.
>: 
>: Allow me to be more clear.  The newsgroup is alt.SEXUAL.ABUSE.recovery.  I made 
>: the worst engineering error, I ASSUMED that people would realize that by using
>: the generic "survivors", I was talking about survivors of SEXUAL abuse.  In our
>: conversations, you never mentioned *any* sexual abuse.
>
>I'm not aware that this newsgroup is limited to survivors of sexual abuse only.
>It certainly isn't mentioned in the FAQ.  And, yes, I believe I *did* mention
>my own sexual abuse history, because I clearly remembered mentioning the "ex-
>pulling the gun" incident to you.

	Actually, it *is* mentioned in the FAQ, but that's neither here nor
	there. This group has often welcomed survivors of other forms of
	abuse, though generally they ask if it's alright first.

>: >I hardly know *everything* there is to know - 
>>: 
:> But your posts have the tenor of this omniscient.  This has been pointed out
:> to you before, by me and others, in posts and e-mail.  And you have not 
:> responded.  It should be clear to you by now that the *way*, the *tone*
>
>I believe I have.  And how do you know what email I have gotten, and what
>email I haven't, and how I have answered it?  For your information, I *do*
>answer *all* email I get, insulting or not.  Why don't you stop trying to
>build this thing up into a "us-vs-Ed" mob mentality thing?  I'd advise you
>to let it go, Teresa.  All that hate and anger's gonna eat you up, to paraphrase
>a movie...
>At least take it to email, instead of cluttering up asar with your own personal
>vendetta...

	She may know what e-mail you've received if *she's* received e-mail
	concerning it...  Just a thought. And answering e-mail doesn't mean
	responding to the complaint. As has been said, it's not generally
	the content which is offensive, but the *tone*, yet you refuse to
	express your intent and assure yourself and us that your tone is
	not misunderstood. And also, you've never once said you're sorry these
	misunderstandings occur. Is *this* your intent? To create flames in
	order to elicit support from the group?
	Incidentally, Ed, *you* posted this one, so who's doing the
	cluttering? Looks like you just need the last word.

	But now I've got it! Ha! ;) (For the moment, anyway...)

							Anika



--
To use this service, send EMAIL to:
anon-ping@twwells.com  -- test path/get anonymous id
anon-help@twwells.com  -- for an automatically returned help message
anon-admin@twwells.com -- ANON administrator
anon-0@twwells.com     -- anonymous e-mail to ANON administrator
anon-asar@twwells.com  -- post anonymously to alt.sexual.abuse.recovery
Newsgroups: alt.sexual.abuse.recovery