HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: s.c.a.a.penpals
From: galan@netlink.cts.com (Greg Gross)
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 92 20:44:13 PST
Organization: NetLink Online Communications, San Diego CA

cr614@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Monee C. Kidd) writes:

> 
> I'm not sure this is going to be met with approving eyes, but I
> didn't wasn't particularly interested in the traffic over in 
> soc.penpals  or alt.personals ;). My request is this; I do 
> believe that I am the only African-American woman at Penn who 
> likes both intellectual discussion and computers. As one of a
> rare breed it's rather lonely. I was curious if there are any
> college aged Af-Am men out there interested in cultivating a
> friendship (*purely* friendship) based on the assumption that
> there aren't that many of us out here. If so, send me e-mail
> direct (only those with a sense of humor need bother ;)
> 
> Again I apologize 1000 times over if this note is inappropriate!
> Forgive me, I'm still new to this!
> -- 
>        "Whatever happened to Peace?"    -Eric B. & Rakim
>      ********    This is our year - GO CAVS!!!    ********
>                          ~ mc kidd ~
> ~ cr614@cleveland.freenet.edu ~ kidd47@wilma.wharton.upenn.edu ~ 


Well, if you can stand to talk to someone who was using computers when 
dinosaurs roamed the earth...or maybe *was8 the dinosaur himself...will 
be happy to correspond with you.
G.

--
Gregory Alan Gross      Welcome to life, where no good deed goes unpunished.
San Diego Union-Tribune         (619) 293-1270 (voice)
P.O. Box 191                    (619) 293-1896 (fax)
San Diego, CA 92112-4106        galan@netlink.cts.com (Internet)
From: cmort@NCoast.ORG (Christopher Morton)
Subject: Re: Let's Move MIM News Outta Here...
Reply-To: cmort@ncoast.org (Christopher Morton)
Organization: North Coast Public Access *NIX, Cleveland, OH
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 21:37:57 GMT
Followup-To: soc.culture.african.american

As quoted from <13060061@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM> by patm@hpfcso.FC.HP.COM (Pat Murphy):

> 
> 
> 	hey, i'm sorry if i'm steppin' on anyone's toes...
> 
> 	BUT, is this s.c.a.a or is it a soapbox for the NY
> 	Transfer News Service and the MIM?!  shouldn't these
> 	postings be placed on alt.misc.news.postings or 
> 	something?  o.k., some of the topics are somewhat
> 	interesting, but enough is enough!  think for yourself...
> 	don't just re-post a news clipping.
> 
Apart from the inherent destructiveness of their philosophy, I've found them
rather surprisingly polite and willing to carry on a civil conversation via
e-mail.  Besides, I can ream somebody politely as well as I can rudely if
the situation calls for it.... :)
> 
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------  

"Well whose opinions did you THINK these were...?" 
------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ww@nyxfer.UUCP
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Date: 24 Dec 92 15:48 PST
Subject: Somalia:Anti-Intervention Demos
Nf-ID: #N:647awB6w165w@nyxfer.uucp:-833906123:000:1689
Nf-From: nyxfer.uucp!ww    Dec 24 15:48:00 1992


Subject: Somalia:Anti-Intervention Demos
From: nyxfer!ww (Workers World Service)


Via The NY Transfer News Service * All the News that Doesn't Fit


                   Food, not troops in Somalia!

Demonstrators in five U.S. cities took to the streets Dec. 21 to 
protest the Pentagon's military intervention in Somalia and call 
for the immediate withdrawal of U.S. and allied troops. The 
protests took place in New York, San Francisco, Houston, New 
Orleans and in Washington, D.C., in front of the White House. 

The demonstrations were called by the International Action 
Center. They were the first nationally coordinated protests of 
the Pentagon move. At the New York demonstration, shown above, 
IAC spokesperson Monica Moorehead said, "After a year of doing 
nothing, while hundreds of thousands of Somali people starved, 
the Bush administration suddenly decided to militarily occupy 
Somalia. They intervened not so much to feed starving children, 
but to dominate the Horn of Africa and turn it into another 
strategic military base in the oil-rich Middle East."

That evening, Brian Becker of Workers World Party spoke at a live
forum in New York hosted by WBAI-Pacific Radio's Samori Marksman.
The multinational audience strongly applauded Becker's 
denunciation of the U.S. military intervention in Africa.

(Copyright Workers World Service: Permission to reprint granted if
source is cited. For more info contact Workers World, 46 W. 21
St., New York, NY 10010; email: ww%nyxfer@igc.apc.org; "workers"
on PeaceNet; on Internet: "workers@mcimail.com".)
 

 NY Transfer News Service * All the News that Doesn't Fit
 Modem: 718-448-2358  *  Internet: nytransfer@igc.apc.org
From: betsys@cs.umb.edu (Elizabeth Schwartz)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Another personal example - being taken for a racist
Date: 29 Dec 92 18:29:25 GMT
Distribution: soc
Organization: University of Massachusetts at Boston


  This is a "what could have happened differently?" question.

  Somerville is a primarily white, poor-to-working class suburb of
Boston, that has received an overflow of students and hippies from
neighboring Cambridge.
  A few years ago, I was interviewing candidates to share my
two-person apartment. I met one person I really liked, and decided to
take her, pending the landlord's approval, even though one more person
was scheduled to see the apartment.
   When the doorbell rang, I opened the door, prepared to tell the
person that the apartment was probably taken. 
  It was like being trapped in a movie. My face fell... I knew she was
going to think I was telling her because of her skin color. Her face
fell...I could see her thinking it was a mistake to go look in
Somerville. All this before I said a word. I ended up saying a whole
lot, too fast, and I don't think I even beleived myself at the end. 
    I could have lied, and pretended the place was still open, but I
was so excited at having found this really great roommate (who didn't turn
out that great...she was a bit of a con artist, but that's another
story) that I would have sounded like I was only faking considering
her as a roommate....and people are good at telling fakes.
  These damn walls...I ended up feeling like I had added another
brick.

--
System Administrator                  Internet: betsys@cs.umb.edu
MACS Dept, UMass/Boston               Phone   : 617-287-6448
100 Morrissey Blvd                    Staccato signals
Boston, MA 02125-3393                      of constant information....
From: q2tj@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Education
Date: 28 Dec 92 19:01:19 EST
Distribution: soc
Organization: Cornell University

galan@netlink.cts.com (Greg Gross) writes: 
> 
> While we're trying to improve education across the board, how do we 
> ensure that black children and other minority children don't end up being 
> psychologically sabotaged in the classroom by the very people they look 
> to to teach them?
>
	I suppose Afrocentric education was supposed to address
	this.  I hope someone will post on how well that is working.

	This issue has been dealt with in a very unusual way by

		Peter Farb, in a book "Word Play"

He had a most excellent idea on this subject.  May be part of the ANSWER.
He's a linguist who claims that most black children speak a 
dialect of standard American English.  He refers to it as Black English.
It has different grammatical structures to it, and since the blak kiddies
learn from textbooks that use standard english grammar a frustrating
confusion can set in early.  these grammar structures are unconscious,
and even a black school teacher will be unaware of what's going on
(they may have long since forgotten their own struggles adapting to
a new grammar)        

Well, because of this problem, the black kids have problems reading
from the outset, get frustrated (and yelled at by the teacher) etc.
and the rest is history.  All our education is based on reading skills!

Failure in education coupled with all the other negative messages
in our society will have a negative impact on black kids of 
disastrous consequences.

Farb recommends, in effect, that black kids, besides becoming 
bicultural, need to be educated to be bi-dialect-ical.

They need to learn, in effect both White English, and Black
English.  He recommends that the black kids be taught the 
distinction from the very beginning and recieve education
in both (this is based on parallel methods of dealing with
bi-lingual kiddies).

Does anyone have any experience with these educational methods?
If Farb is correct, then this is a dynamite idea, and could
be a GIANT help.

Steve Seidman
seid@ee.cornell.edu
:

ps:  I also believe that black kids will need to taught the value
(and pride) in being bi-cultureal.  They will need to be discouraged
from making fun of each other for "acting white" out of a misplaced
sense of pride in Black Heritage.  The fact is, they are the 
inheritors of BOTH Black and European Heritage and should take
pride in knowing both.
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Mssrs. King & Denny
From: galan@netlink.cts.com (Greg Gross)
Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 21:27:13 PST
Organization: NetLink Online Communications, San Diego CA

At the risk of unleashing the flame-fest of all time, here goes:

In the Los Angeles area, specifically South-Central LA where my relatives 
live, there is a strong sentiment in many quarters that the young black 
men accused of beating Reginald Denny should be acquitted because the 
four officers accused of beating Rodney King were acquitted.

I understand the sentiment. Indeed, if the Denny defendants were to get 
the kind of jury of their peeers in South-Central that the LAPD 4 got in 
Simi Valley, odds are they *would* be acquitted with little debate.

All this troubles me.

the four uniformed thugs who clubbed Rodney King into Brain damage
*never* should've been allowed to walk. And yes, I've seen the entire
tape...and yes, I know how tough it is to be a cop out there....and
you know what? It *still* was unjustified and unlawful.

BUT--

Neither the beating of Rodney King nor that travesty of a verdict can 
justify what happened to Reginald Denny, nor can it justify acquitting 
those who assaulted him.

Justice can't be reduced to a simple tit-for-tat. 

In NY right now, a lot of Jews are outraged that a young black man was 
acquitted recently in the stabbing death of a Jewish man.  In their 
outrage (rightly or wrongly), should they feel entitled to snatch some 
young brother out of his passing vehicle and beat him within an inch of 
his life, as was done to Denny?

It cuts both ways, you see.
G.

--
Gregory Alan Gross      Welcome to life, where no good deed goes unpunished.
San Diego Union-Tribune         (619) 293-1270 (voice)
P.O. Box 191                    (619) 293-1896 (fax)
San Diego, CA 92112-4106        galan@netlink.cts.com (Internet)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: isbell@ai.mit.edu (Charles L Isbell)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination
Subject: Re: I'm Still Waiting
Date: 28 Dec 92 22:14:09 GMT
	<1992Dec18.124513.1@violet.ccit.arizona.edu>
	<1992Dec18.232436.25984@panix.com>
	<1992Dec21.101933.1@milori.ccit.arizona.edu>
	<ISBELL.92Dec22083900@pop-tarts.ai.mit.edu>
	<1992Dec27.165820.10451@panix.com>
Distribution: usa,local
Organization: MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
NNTP-Posting-Host: pop-tarts.ai.mit.edu
In-reply-to: lkk@panix.com's message of 27 Dec 92 16:58:20 GMT

lkk@panix.com (Larry Kolodney) writes:
|isbell@ai.mit.edu (Charles L Isbell) writes:
|>lkk@panix.com (Larry Kolodney) writes:
|>|>>  Brazil if it is so brutal as compared to the U.S.?
|>|> 
|>|> The same reason there was not civil unrest among U.S. blacks except in
|>|> the past two generations.  Besides, Brazil has been under military
|>|> dictatorship for most of its history.  Your observation demonstrates
|>|> nothing.  

|>But, actually, this isn't true, unless you're defining some really
|>strict meaning of "civil unrest."

|I guess I meant "civil unrest sufficiently widespread to cause real
|changes in popular attitudes on the subject."

Oh.  You mean Sucessful Civil Unrest(tm) as opposed to a riot.  (It's
a riot when the protestors lose and its a revolutionary act whem they
win).

|  Racial riots tend to occur in
|>bunches about once a generation (~25 yrs--those who have been on the
|>net long enuff recall I said three years ago that the next set were
|>due 1992-1993) and in the case of US Blacks this goes back to around
|>the time of the civil war (as I recall) and, if you count slave
|>revolts and the like, even much further back than that.

|Yeah, but only in the 60s (correct me if I'm wrong) was there a
|systematic political movement to change U.S. racial policy in
|conjunction with widespread civil unrest.

I'd quibble with this, as stuff like this happened in the 1940's and
the (early?) 20's, but my quibble would hinge upon "widespread" and
how the meaning of the word has changed since the advent of TV, so I
won't pursue it.
--
Peace.
            "Look! An X-man movie's coming out!"
                    care of a 10 year old in a Tulsa movie
                    theater, looking at a poster for _Malcolm X_
                                   -\--/-
    Don't just adopt opinions     |  \/  |       Some of you are homeboys
          develop them.           |  /\  | but only I am The Homeboy From hell
                                   -/--\-
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: Maoist Internationalist Movement <SCIENCE@mitvma.BITNET>
Subject:      *Secret of MIM
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1992 22:58:35 GMT

Now that Christopher Morton has clarified that the Maoist
Internationalist Movement is not affiliated with Bob Avakian
and the RCP, there is not much left to his criticism
of our movie review of "South Central" directed by Steve Anderson.

The only thing left is his implication that we somehow support
independent Black drug-dealing in Black neighborhoods. People
need to go back and read our original review that said, "While
drug-selling shows the self-destructive and capitalist side
of gangs and must be eradicated, the rest of his talk could be
a Maoist speech about building power of the oppressed to seize
power." (MIM Notes 70, p. 8) This sentence referred to a
depicted gang leader in the movie.
      --Maoist Internationalist Movement
From: djohns@elm.circa.ufl.edu (David A. Johns)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: What A White Person Learned in College About AfAm Culture
Date: 29 Dec 92 16:42:14 GMT
Organization: University of Florida, Gainesville

In article <1992Dec25.234510.10634@athena.mit.edu> solman@athena.mit.edu (Jason W Solinsky) writes:
# I'd like to know how it is that at least three people in this
# discussion have determined that large numbers of whites
# discriminate on the basis of racial hatred. There is no way to do a
# proper survey because a majority of people who discriminate on the
# basis of racial hatred will justify it. I made that observation
# based on the many thousands of people I have met as you.

I take it you don't know much about social science research.

This determination does not have to be made by survey, and it would be
silly, as you point out, to think that a survey would produce valid
results.

But there are experimental means for determining bias, as in the
highly publicized cases of matched pairs of applicants being sent to
apply for a job or a loan, buy a car, etc.  Obviously there are ways
of biasing the outcome here also, but the design is basically sound.

With adequate access to facilities, it's also possible to do
legitimate observational studies.  For instance, bank loan
applications or faculty promotion decisions could be reviewed by a
panel of people who did not know the race of the applicants.

Note that the observational studies and some of the experimental
studies (those that might be interpreted as fraudulent application,
for instance) would have to be backed by government authority.

David


Xref: sparky soc.culture.african.american:13282 misc.education:5564
From: galan@netlink.cts.com (Greg Gross)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,misc.education
Subject: Re: What A White Person Learned in College About AfAm Culture
Date: 28 Dec 92 05:59:32 GMT
Organization: NetLink Online Communications, San Diego CA

DRPORTER@SUVM.SYR.EDU (Brad Porter) writes:

> In article <1992Dec18.045728.27773@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>
> ndw2u@curry.edschool.Virginia.EDU (Nicole Danielle Woodard) writes:
>  
> >The claim that African-Americans are just like other minorities
> >that have come to this country is completely erroneous.  From
> >the moment of our interaction in North America, whites
> >exploited African-Americans.  Unlike any other minority, the
> >oppression of African-Americans was legislated by the founders
> >of this nation since its inception.  The oppression
> >began with slavery and continued with disfranchisment, Jim Crow
> >laws, the Black Codes, segregation, and it continues today
> >through covert forms of oppression.
> Really?  That's sincere, not sarcastic.  I don't live in the real world,
> I live in a town in NY with an African-America population of at most 10 out
> of 3000.  Yet even while I've probably only know 5 or 6 African-Americans
> personally, I don't think I have a deep-rooted hatred for any minority group.
> At the same time, I'm not qualified to debate what the rest of society
> believes.  I guess I have a hard time believing there is an underlying
> prejudice against African-Americans throughout white society.  Prejudice
> is a personal, not societal matter isn't it?  My fear however, is that
> because of AA, I'm going to have an extremely difficult time finding a job -
> much more difficult than a woman or minority will.  Don't get tripped up
> by this question:  Is is worse for an African-American to be prejudice
> against a white because his/her ancestors were slave-holders, or is it
> worse for a white to be prejudiced against an African-American because
> his/her ancestors were slaves?
>                                    -Brad Porter
> PS - Could someone tell me what is PC:  Blak, Black, African-American, and wh
> DRPORTER@SUVM
>  

Brad:

1) You're right. Where racial matters are concerned, you *don't live in 
   the real world. 
2) Your fears about the impact of affirmative action on your life are
   greatly exaggerated, as is the affect of affirmative action on the
   country as a whole. Just prepare yourself well for whatever career
   you wish to pursue and odds are, you'll do fine.
3) Racial prejudice is not something made more palatable by degree, or
   which end of it you're on. Prejudging someone because of their race
   or ethnicity is always unfair, always stupid and always wrong.
4) Not sure what's "PC," but can tell you what's always AC, Always 
   Correct:
   Mister
   Mrs.
   Miss
   Ms.
   Sir
   Madam
   the person's name
   A human being
G.

--
Gregory Alan Gross      Welcome to life, where no good deed goes unpunished.
San Diego Union-Tribune         (619) 293-1270 (voice)
P.O. Box 191                    (619) 293-1896 (fax)
San Diego, CA 92112-4106        galan@netlink.cts.com (Internet)
From: nyt@nyxfer.UUCP
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Date: 24 Dec 92 15:50 PST
Subject: England Anti-Racism News/ECN
Nf-ID: #N:H08awB18w165w@nyxfer.uucp:-114011118:000:2179
Nf-From: nyxfer.uucp!nyt    Dec 24 15:50:00 1992


Subject: England Anti-Racism News/ECN
From: nyxfer!nyt (NY Transfer News)


Via The NY Transfer News Service * All the News that Doesn't Fit

from The European Counter Network (ECN)

from: ECN London

15 December 1992

ANTI-RACIST NEWS:

-Five thousand people marched against racism in Glasgow on
November 28th in a demonstration called by the Scottish Campaign
Against Racism and Fascism (SCARF). At one point the demonstration
was attacked by 20 fascists. 15 fascists and three anti-fascists
were arrested.

-Asian and African-Caribbean youth in Newcastle (north-east
England) have formed a campaign after the racist murder of 66-year
old Aziz Miah on 14 September. A week after Mr Miah was battered
to death by a racist gang while on his way to a mosque, there was
an angry demonstration from the estate where he lived to the
police station. The Mr Miah Justice Campaign has now been formed,
with a newsletter called Kal Ki Awazz (Voice of Tomorrow).

contact: Mr Miah Justice Campaign, c/o 262 Westgate Road,
Newcastle Upon Tyne, NE4.

-in the West Midlands, police have been harassing the Ahmed
family.  In June the family were assaulted and racially abused in
their own home by police who claimed they were investigating a
complaint about noise. Three brothers were arrested and charged,
and their 61-year old mother suffered a cut arm after being pushed
by police. Later, she was also arrested when she went to the
police station to enquire about her sons. A few weeks later,
police again forced entry into the family home, and shook awake a
four year old child to ask her where her father was. 

The Sandwell Action Committee Against Racist Police Harassment
have been organising regular pickets of the court where the Ahmed
brothers have been standing trial.

contact: Sandwell Action Committee Against Racist Police
Harassment, c/o Sandwell REC, High Street, West Bromwich.


information from: Campaign against Racism and Fascism, BM Box
8784, London WC1N 3XX (CARF produce a magazine, which is probably
the best regular UK anti-racist publication).
 

 NY Transfer News Service * All the News that Doesn't Fit
 Modem: 718-448-2358  *  Internet: nytransfer@igc.apc.org
From: gaff@sr.com (Jon Gaff)
Subject: Bone Marrow Donor Program Ph. #
Reply-To: gaff@srhqla.sr.com (Jon Gaff)
Organization: Silent Radio, Los Angeles
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1992 17:03:38 GMT

Here is a toll-free number to  find out where / how to register to
become a bone marrow donor: 1-800-654-1244

I saw the info on a story about the Fox-TV show "ROC" where Charles
Dutton is urging Af-Ams to register to become bone marrow donors --
apparently Af-Ams with Leukemia need Af-Am donors.  The bone marrow donor /
ethnicity factor applies to all other races as well, I assume...

Peace. 
  
-- 
Jon Gaff / SilentRadio head tech support bozo.

Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
From: kevinc@sequent.com (Kevin Closson)
Subject: Re: (O My Darlin, Sweet Darlin) Desiree
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.
Distribution: usa
Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 17:29:17 GMT

In article <1992Dec10.205544.19037@cbnewse.cb.att.com> ronaldd@cbnewse.cb.att.com (ronald.h.davis) writes:

> but then tyson's explanation that vaginal abrasions
>found on washington were due to the size of his "anatomy" sounded pretty lame.
>the net result is that i didn't know what to believe.

   You can bet that Tyson knows exactly what the size of ones anatomy and
  abrasion is all about by now.
From: q2tj@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Who cares what whites think about racism ?
Date: 26 Dec 92 19:59:24 EST
Distribution: world,soc
Organization: Cornell University

peewee@infoserv.com (Philip Stromer) writes: 
dowdy@tochtli.biochem.nwu.edu (Dowdy Jackson) writes:
>
These guys (plus others) have been going at it hammer and tongs...
really arguing like crazy....and now I'm getting MAD!!!!

I don't think these sorts of arguments are going anywhere...plus
I made a followup post to the original articl (by Dowdy Jackson,
I think) that I hoped might lead to some sort of decent discussion.
No one started taking issue with MY post...(I guess I'm glum when
my posts are ignored)

Here's what I'm really sore about in the past posts
(and please read what I posted before to get the full story)

I'm really sore to see        

1) people don't make much effort to LISTEN.               

2) too much talk like "YOU don't know what it's like to be __________"

with talk like this no wonder we never get anywhere!!!!!
arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

someone say something USEFUL.  WHAT is it LIKE to be ____________________.???
recommend books or something....don't despair....and don't throw the
bull anymore....i just can't stand it anymore!!!!!!!!!!!!

Steve
q2tj@vax5.cit.cornell.edu