From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Subject: Re: Is Thailand that terrible, Khun Laurence?
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Keywords: Thailand
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 1992 23:13:00 GMT

In article <BvFnwy.EJs@news.cso.uiuc.edu>, ssg9328@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Samart Srijumno writes...
> 
>In responding to Khun Sripen, godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:
> 
>>.............................
> 
>>One reason why farangs get paid more is that Thai people frequently charge
>					      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>them at least twice as much (and often 5 times as much) as they charge each 
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
>>other for the same : housing, taxis, renting cars and motorbikes, food on
>>the street etc.  Do you, for example, know of ANY 
>>hotels in Thailand (other than the very smallest) that do not operate a two-tier
>>price structure, charging less than half the price to Thais?  Even the airport
>>hotel at Don Muang does this.
> 
>I am not sure this is a valid observation. I assume Khun Laurence used his 
>own feeling and put it into numbers (more scientific?). 
> 
>It is true that most of the services provided to farangs are charged higher
>than to Thais but they GET BETTER SERVICE.  I am not sure about the Airport
>Hotel case. If it is true, Khun Laurence should have files a complain to the
>authority. Probably he did not trust them. To him, all Thai authorities would
>have been equally corruptible. What an experience to live in such barbaric
>country like Thailand!
> 
>Concerning double price structure, I believe there are two prices for two
>different quality of services. Of course, farangs pay more for housing but
>could they live in the same quality of house their Thai counterparts do!
>There had been a farang couple who went on Fulbright to CMU where I taught, 
>no matter how easy they tried to be, they could not stay in a house that
>did not have airconditioner. The couple could not even wash their dish with 
>Thai pipe water. I learned this on the day they were about to leave when 
>they gave us a party. I asked them how they took a shower, they said they
>had to close their mouth neatly. They use bottled water for dish washing and
>mouth cleaning. We are still good friends despite their attitude. They didn't
>not look down at Thai society and I am not raising their case to say they
>are good or bad. I simply want to exemplify a case which requires better
>standard of living in a poor country like Thailand. 
> 
>>a Thai Assoc Professor, but the Thai gets free housing, a permanent job rather
>>than a short-term contract, earns extra from corruption, bribes etc.  There
>			     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>is no doubt that the average Thai professopr has a far higher standard of
>>living than his farang equivalent in Thailand, despite being paid half
>>as much.  In addition, the family of the farang are not entitled to work
>>while in Thailand.
> 
>Again, I am wondering what field Khun Laurence had studied or engaged in his
>postdoctoral training. It is apparent that he could easily come up with any 
>observation without any reference. I begin to feel a bit worried about whom
>his service had been done to (teacher, faculty members, etc). I just hope he
>does not represent the whole class of farangs in Thailand. Otherwise, I
>would have to agree with Khun Sripen.
> 
>>........................
> 
>>I would take the opposite point of view to you on the whole - I don't
>>believe the Thais pay higher salaries to farang because they think the
>>farang are better, they pay them because they think they get more than
>                                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>their money's worth out of the farang and they frequently laugh behind 
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>the farang's backs because they are taking
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>advantage of them.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
>Here in the US, women are complaining that they are paid less than men of 
>the same competence. Yes, your observation could also apply in their case
>too that it is because their employers "think they get more than their money's
>worth out of" men. That's the point, my dear friend Laurence! It is the
>perception of the employer that is the central issue of debate here. 
> 
>The second obervation that we, Thais, will laugh behind their back as we
>are taking advantage of them is purely illogical given the fact that
>Khun Laurence has argued all along that farangs are paid better because
>they (the farangs) are smarter. How could the Thais be smart enough
>to take advantages of the farangs, then?
> 
> 
>>...........................
> 
>>to go to work in Thailand - it's a very interesting experience.  However,
>>I personally would never again work for a Thai university or a Thai company,
>>only a foreign-run outfit.  
> 
>I envy you, Khun Laurence, that you have such a high degree of freedom. 
>You can go any place you want. You can leave it any time you wish. As Thai
>citizens, however, we cannot HATE it (Thailand) that much! 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


I apologise for repeating the whole of your email above, but I'm in a hurry.

I did not say that farangs were better than Thais - just your interpretation
- I simply said that the Thais pay twice as much for foreign academics 
because they think they are worth it - in other words, they expect to get foreign a
academics that are better than the average Thai academic.  Of course there
are many foreign academics that are much worse than the  average
Thai academic (I know quite a few), but one assumes that they would not
get a job in thai university.

My PhD is in High Enegry Nucl Phys (calledParticle Phys in the US) from University Col
College, London, England.n  The work I did in Thailand was in nuclear physics
(intermediate energy ion physics).

Hotels, airport included, charge more than double the prce to farang for
EXACTLY the same rooms and service - unless you think that having a 
farang staying there represents an additional burden on the staff!.  Be assured
that I wrote an extremely lengthy complaint about this to TAT on my last two
visits and got absolutely no response.  In the second case, my 11 page 
complaint was sent to TAT head office from TAT airport office with a 
specific promise of a response - but no reply.

The complaint dealt with hotel double-charging, a limousine problem at
the airport, a  large number of so-called couriers at the airport who
latch on to farang (pretending to be "official couriers") and cheat them very badly, and a few
other things.  No answer to a single one of them. 

I do not hate Thailand - quite the reverse.  It is not necessary for a 
place to be faultless in order to love it, nor a person for that matter,
nor if a place is criticised does it mean that I hate it.  Strange logic.

laurence

Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai