From: josip@src.umd.edu (Josip Loncaric)
Subject: Re: Banjica the death camp   Was: Re: Flames
Organization: Systems Research Center, Maryversity of Uniland, College Park
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1992 19:11:15 GMT

In article <1992Aug20.121635.14942@husc3.harvard.edu> stojanov@husc10.harvard.edu (Milan Stojanovic) writes:
>In article <1992Aug20.145626.21570@src.umd.edu> josip@src.umd.edu (Josip Loncaric) writes:
>>
>>Also, circumstantial evidence: her "Serbian-Jewish Friendship Society"
>>is a propaganda organization formed in response to the Croatian situation,
>>it has precious little to do with Serbsian-Jewish friendship.  Her primary 
>>function is to advance Milosevic's propaganda about "fascist Croats".
>
>Would you mind elaborating this?  Is Simon Wiesenthal also the 
>Serbian propagandist?   Am I not telling the truth, or is Mrs. Mandic 
>not telling the truth, while I am just naive?  I am waiting to
>see your documents.  Would you like to talk to Mrs. Mandic and 
>ask her whether she might be doing this because Croatian nationalists
>killed her mother, while president Tudjman was trying to prove that Jews 
>were killing each other, and killing Serbs?

So, she's engaging in hatemongering because she seeks revenge?  Although
the people who did her wrong are long dead?  Does she believe in collective
guilt, and how does she reconcile this stand with the fact that Tudjman,
a Croat, had fought against the people who did her wrong?  Are all Croats,
especially the present generation of Croats who had nothing to do with
WWII, and whose parents were NOT fascists either, supposed to be in 
torment so that Mrs. Mandic could enjoy her revenge?  

Don't you think that the reprisals carried out by the Partisans after WWII 
were more than enough revenge?  Do you think that even ONE sworn Ustasha 
was left alive after WWII in Yugoslavia?  So, whom are the Serbian forces
shelling: descendants of those Croats who were against fascists in WWII?

Your propaganda claims are grotesque.

Mr. Simon Wiesenthal would be horrified to find himself being mentioned
in this context of hate.  His research (and you have quoted his
fascination) has to do with WWII -- and he would NEVER want to see it
used as a justification for carnage, shelling of cities, and ethnic
cleansing going on TODAY.  And yet, this is precisely what Mrs. Mandic
is doing.

>>>>(1) Regarding prisoners being taken from Banjica to be shot:
>>>>YOU SAY:
>>>>>In Jajinci.  Again.  And in your last posting you claimed that 20-30.000
>>>>>people were killed in Banjica.  So check your math.
>>>>             ^^^^^^
>>>>INCORRECT. Here is what I said:
>>>>
>>>>"Banjica", Historical Archives of Belgrade, Belgrade, 1967.
>>>>
>>>>This book clearly shows that (1) Germans were not working alone, (2) that
>>>>Banjica was primarily staffed by Serbs, (3) that the concentration camp was
>>>>funded by Belgrade municipal budget, (4) that the camp chief was Svetozar
>>>>Vujkovic, a Serb.  Banjica camp processed over 23,000 people many of whom
>>>>were Jews and children.  Many people were shot not by Germans but by
>>>>Serbian guards.  The prisoner lists were kept in Serbian, in cyrillic script.
>>>
>>>
>>>So what is the meaning of " processed?" 
>>>Euphemism of killing ? 
>>
>>"Processed" is what happened to concentration camp prisoners.  Some were
>>then (indeed) killed, others were sent elsewhere to be killed, some
>>may have even survived the ordeal.  A camp which processed over 23,000
>>people is a fairly large camp.
>>
>In another article you claim: 
>
>In article <1992Aug19.214145.7420@src.umd.edu> Josip Loncaric writes:
>>
>>>        -Banjica - not a death camp, but concentration camp.  Hostages
>>                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>Incorrect.  It WAS a death camp, people held there were taken out to be shot 
>>in groups ranging from 100 to 300, day by day.
>>
>>>were kept there, under the request from Germans.  Special police had
>>>secondary authority there, and kept resistance fighters.
>>>Some people resisting, were really killed there by Serbian police.
>>
>>Including at least 128 children shot by Serbian guards, according to the 
>>reference I've quoted.  Do you really believe that only "some people 
>>resisting" were killed by Serbian police?
>
>
>Banjica operated for 3 years.  Would you mind providing us with some 
>date, how many people were actually killed in Banjica?  Something is 
>fishy with you numbers and claims.  And you seem to be backing away from 
>128 children.  What is the age of those children?  25? 

So what is your point?  That Serbs did nothing wrong in Banjica?
That what happened there is negligible and can be ignored?

Maybe you think it can be ignored.  But, consider what Serb forces are
doing in Bosnia today.  WHY ARE THEY DOING THIS?  Are Bosnian Muslims
and Croats lesser life-forms than Serbs?  What makes you so superior that
you can be so inhumane?

Josip