HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: busey@milton.u.washington.edu (Thomas Busey)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: You're dead -- unless you pull (was Re: Tiny Broadwick
Date: 28 Sep 92 15:59:12 GMT
Article-I.D.: milton.busey.717695952
Organization: University of Washington

I've never jumped, but as a statistics person I thought I'd throw my 
e^-(x-mu)^2/2 sigma^2 / sqrt(2 pi sigma^2) cents worth into the fray.  When
calculating the probability of a death, two things must happen:  the main
chute must fail, and the reserve chute must also fail.  Otherwise either 
chute will save the jumper's life.  Now the crucial thing here is whether
these two events are independent.  They might not be independent, for example,
if the jumper went unconcious or bad weather pevented both chutes from opening.
If we consider that the two events are independent, then the probability of
dying = prob (first chute doesn't open) * prob (second chute doesn't open). 
Using the numbers given by previous posters, this is equal to :
1/500 * 1/1000 or 1/500000.  Considering that any time you don't die is 
a successful jump, the probability of success is 499999/500000.  These are 
pretty good odds.  

Of course in real life, the two events are never truly independent- the same
person packs both chutes, and if the first chute fails it probably indicates
that something is going on that's bad, like bad weather.  This suggests that
the likelyhood of the second chute failing is going to be higher that 1/1000.
The worse case scenario is when the probability of the second chute failing
given the fact that the first chute failed is 1, i.e. the second chute always 
fails.  Certainly the evidence I've seen is that the reseve chute works some
of the time, so this can't be the case, but if it was, the probability of a 
death would be 1/500, the same as the first chute failing.  And so given your
faith in your reserve chute, your chances of dying are between 1/500 and 
1/500000.  The probability of the second chute failing GIVEN the first
chute failed can be estimated from the general population, although one poster
implied that it had never happened, making this difficult to judge.

I've tried to address the issue on statistical grounds.  Certainly real-world
arguements can appeal to the fact that the 1/500 and 1/1000 are averages, and 
don't apply to individuals.  I would respond that this is true, and the 
crucial use of statistics is deciding whether you as an individual fit into
the group under consideration.  I would argue that most jumpers do, except 
for 1)  people who are extrodinarily careful about packing their chutes, 2)
people who are rather careless about packing their chutes, and 3) those who 
jump without a chute at all.  Jumpers who are in the second two groups can
probably ignore the debate.  If you consider that training and good equipment
make jumpers a pretty homogenous group, and you are trained and have good 
equipment, then I'd say that the above calculations apply to you.

Tom Busey
Department of Psychology
University of Washington
Seattle, WA 98195
From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: 7th floor drop
Date: 1 Oct 92 04:02:01 GMT

Reply-to: Hans.Falkeman@p0.f126.n203.z2.fidonet.org (Hans Falkeman)
Fido-To: bill caefer

 r>> - the hack circle
 r>> - the manifest
 r>> - the Chief Instructor's Volvo
 r>> - ten feet from a first jump course
 r>> - Farmer McNasty's roof
 r>> - the freeway
 r>> - the local football ground, while a game is on
 r>> - my ex-girlfriend's caravan
 r>> - my ex-girlfriend :-)


 BC> You left out

 BC>             - the pea gravel
 BC>             - near any photographer
 BC>             - your own car
 BC>             - the runway



And...
                 - Jerry Bird's cape

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From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Big Blue Skies
Date: 1 Oct 92 16:10:10 GMT

Reply-to: Bill.Caefer@p0.f853.n102.z1.fidonet.org (Bill Caefer)
Fido-To: romulus!zephyr.cair.du.edu!tjreynol

 r> In this weeks Communications Week, IBM has a two page add introducing
 r> IBM LAN Systems. In large print, they claim:

 r> A lot can depend on how you're hooked up.

 r> Almost a page and a half of the ad is a great big way, I counted some 45+
 r> jumpers, andthey cut off the edges. Pretty cool, for IBM, eh? They tout

Pretty neat from the same folks who said  "The less you know about computers, the more you will like the PS/1."



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From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Hey!
Date: 4 Oct 92 14:20:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: ehsnet.1155.2AD198EB

Reply-to: Hans.Falkeman@p0.f126.n203.z2.fidonet.org (Hans Falkeman)
Fido-To: anthony maglietta

 * Anthony Maglietta skrev Thursday October 01 1992 till Hans Falkeman:

 ->> You ar not crazy! Sky Diving is fun...
 AM>   I know.  Its everyone ELSE that is crazy!

Hmmm...the are crazy not to try.:-)


     /D-73 Sweden

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Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: horn@tegan.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark Horn)
Subject: Re: Setting DYTERS 
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Center
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 18:50:10 GMT

In article <BvGwK0.4IL@virtech.uucp> mark@vti.com writes:
>Hell, only a
>little more than half the dive was over and my pull instinct was
>kicking in.
>
>Anyone else?

Yes.  Happens to me all of the time!  Well, that is before I moved.  In 
Wisconsin, I jumped at a Cessna only DZ from 10k' AGL.  I would spend three or
four weeks jumping there, then I would trek down to Tennessee for the weekend
to jump Mike Mullins' King Air from 14k'.  The first few jumps were almost
always screwing with my internal clock.  Then I would get used to the longer 
freefall and not think a second thing of it.

Even worse was coming back after a weekend of making 10-15 jumps!

Now, I jump pretty consistantly at 13k' so the difference isn't that bad.

Blue skies over TeXXas, hope so in your neck!
- sparkie
horn@mickey.jsc.nasa.gov
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: koning@koning.enet.dec.com (Paul Koning)
Subject: Re: Advice for new jumpers buying gear 
Reply-To: koning@koning.enet.dec.com
Organization: Digital Equipment Co., distributed systems architecture
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 14:50:41 GMT


In article <1992Oct1.142813.3694@eng.ufl.edu>, esj@viper.eng.ufl.edu (Eric S. Johnson) writes:
|>...
|>The industry has come up with all kindsa neet new methods to make minirisers
|>stonger and/or safer. A few I have seen in the last few months include:
|>
|>1. Mounting the RSL attachment ring below the grommet, in the hopes 
|>that if the sucker breaks it still won't pull the reserve. 

I saw that (one manufacturer apparently said theirs were ok since they
were built this way.  But it doesn't make sense.  Look at the picture of
the shredded riser that was published in (I think) Skydiving mag. a few
issues back.  While the fabric below the grommet is quite badly mangled,
it's NOT gone; the picture showed about half of the riser material still
approximately in place.  So if your RSL ring is attached below the grommet,
but to the part of the riser that happens not to be reduced totally to dust,
you're in the same situation as you would have been with the RSL ring above
the grommet.

So I wouldn't buy this one.  The other two make sense.

|>2. Making the mini riser out of folded over standard risers, which are 
|>unfolded and standard sized down at the 3ring attachment area. Vector
|>is making some like this I beleive.
|>
|>3. Not having a gromment through the mini riser, but instead having the gromment 
|>on a small flap of fabric. Hard to explain this one, but it is my favorite.
|>Done by Strong Ent. and RI uses on the flexon too I beleive.
|>...
|>Ej
|>
|>Who will one day buy some risers like #3 above, but for now still sports death
|>with conventional Javalin minirisers. But no RSL.

	paul koning, a-13683

Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: tjreynol@zephyr.cair.du.edu (The Jumpin Dude)
Subject: Altimeter experiment
Organization: University of Denver
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 03:46:29 GMT

I didn't go up with two, but it wasn't necessary. I made a freestyle jump
on Sat., 1st jump, one of those unexplainable scary ones, I don't know
what to make of it, once in a while I just get really scared, it took me
a few hours - until someone invited me to an 8 (10) way to relax... maybe
.. wll, anyway..

I went out of the Beech at 12,000', right on my butt, watched my altimeter
for several seconds, it read exactly as I expected it to. Then I realized
how fast I was falling. All my time watching my altimeter on my back has 
been right out of the plane. As I build up vertical velocity, the pressure
difference of course becomes greater, and the mistake displayed by my 
altimeter grows as I fall, gradually. Make sense?  When I realized how 
very fast I was falling, my altimeter read 11,000'. Given the time I'd been 
out, it had seemed to be right. I flipped. I watched the needle drop to 
10,000. 


Tim
BTW, one guy on the 10 (9) way had 1,300 jumps and got his SCS. He bought
beer. :-)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: jvilhube@diana.cair.du.edu (Jan Vilhuber)
Subject: Re: Double Horny Gorilla
Organization: University of Denver, Denver, Colorado
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 92 03:13:42 GMT

In article <1992Sep30.212532.12554@cass.ma02.bull.com> jmills@cass.ma02.bull.com (John Luke Mills) writes:
>The base was a regular 4-way star.  Each of the outer 4 people seemed
>to take a main lift web grip on 2 of the base people.  The outer 4
>kicked into the center with everyone keeping their grips.  After this
>the base people dropped grips and kicked into the center.
>
I've seen that one. At the time I saw it (sorry, don't know which video
it's on either), I labeled it 'sphincter-dive'.. looked that way anyway..
;)

-- 
 Jan Vilhuber            | Internet: jvilhube@du.edu or jvilhube@[130.253.1.4]
 (The skydivin' Bass)      | Bitnet  : jvilhube@DUCAIR
--------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: horn@tegan.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark Horn)
Subject: Re: Public Apology
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Center
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 16:07:31 GMT

In article <1992Sep27.233125.17822@mercury.cair.du.edu> tjreynol@zephyr.cair.du.edu (The Jumpin Dude) writes:
>I just got to wondering how much of the Charlie discussion made
>it to Mike's hands :-)

As far as I could tell.  ALL of it!  Fortunately, I didn't say bad things about
Charlie.  I said good things.  Unfortunately, I think Mike may have read the
bad things that I quoted, and saw my name at the bottom and just assumed that
I wrote it.  I tried to explain that any lines with a '>' in front of them
were quotes and not necessarily attributable to me.  I hope he understood.

Blue Skies,
- sparkie
horn@mickey.jsc.nasa.gov
P.S.	Yes, it's really me!  I just got a job!
From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Our daily philosophy question
Date: 1 Oct 92 15:40:50 GMT

Reply-to: Bill.Caefer@p0.f853.n102.z1.fidonet.org (Bill Caefer)
Fido-To: romulus!zia.aoc.nrao.edu!dbriggs

 r> Here's a extra credit question:  What's the oddest circumstance in which
 r> you actually bought beer?

Hasn't happened to me, but might not a "Mile High" qualification be a good candidate for this category?

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From: jmills@cass.ma02.bull.com (John Luke Mills)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: CYPRES operation
Date: 29 Sep 92 22:20:41 GMT
Organization: Bull World Wide Information Systems Inc.


Here is the complete operation of a CYPRESS.

The control panel consists of 1 button, 1 red LED, and an LCD display.
The LCD display has 4 digits, one up arrow, and one down arrow.

To turn it on you press the button for the 1st time.
when the LED lights, you press the button for the 2nd time.
When the LED lights again,you press the button for the 3rd time.
When the LED lights yet again, you press the button for the 4th time.

The LCD then starts a self-test countdown from 9999.  It will stop
once between 6900 and 5700 to tell you the battery voltage.  Mine
usually says 6400 which means 6.4 volts.

There are brief pauses at 5000 and 100 that don't mean anything.
This display end with "0v".  (zero down arrow)
If you stay at the same place and take off and land there, you only do
this once before the first plane ride.

If you want to land at a different altitude that were you take-off you
hold the button in on the 4th press.  After the self test it will then
display 30^, 30v, 60^, 60v... 1500^, 1500v.  These are read as, "I am
going to land 30 feet above where I take off, etc.  You let off of the
button when it displays what you want.

There are caveats about the plane flying lower than what you key in as
ground level.  In the case where the plane starts out lower, once the
plane gets above the keyed in ground altitude, the plane must not
come back thru ground altitude.  The plane must be at least 1500 feet
above the keyed in ground level at exit.  They also say if you are in
doubt about the need to recalibrate, do it.

The manual gives very little detail about firing altitude differences
like we discussed earlier.  
--
From: mandel@jumprun (Hector Mandel)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: You're dead -- unless you pull (was Re: Tiny Broadwick
Date: 30 Sep 92 03:50:08 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
X-Newsreader: Tin 1.1 PL4

yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille) writes:
: 
: Just for kicks and concerning malfunction rates of main parachutes, why
: don't we all write the number of jumps we have and the number of main
: malfunctions we got so far.
: I doubt that we will be enough to get a statistically significant number
: but who knows?!
: Note that I am not interested into equipment failure but human failure.
: 
: 		rounds					squares
: 	#jumps		#mal			#jumps		#mal
: 
: Philip	50		1			1200		8

  Hector         0              0                 260             0
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: horn@tegan.jsc.nasa.gov (Mark Horn)
Subject: Re: Bungee vs. Skydiving
Organization: NASA Johnson Space Center
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1992 14:09:37 GMT

In article <1108.2ACD24AD@ehsnet.fidonet.org> SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE) writes:
> r> Kinda like the difference between riding on a Merry-Go-Round and going
> r> horseback riding.
>
>Hahaha!  ROFL!

Ok, I'll bite.  What does ROFL mean?

- sparkie
horn@mickey.jsc.nasa.gov
From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: malfunction stats (oops, repost)
Date: 3 Oct 92 03:54:32 GMT

Reply-to: Paul.Stansberry@p0.f22.n233.z1.fidonet.org (Paul Stansberry)
Fido-To: romulus!alantec.com!pvf

Wednesday September 30 1992, romulus!alantec.com!pvf writes to Skydive:

 rc> To make my life easier, please give me the information in the
 rc> following format:

 rc> 500 1 0 pvf@alantec.com

17 0 0 pauls@jumprun.ehs.uiuc.edu

:-)


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From: egz@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Fast King Air
Date: 6 Oct 92 18:48:58 EDT
Distribution: rec
Organization: Cornell University

About the WFF report not mentioning the owner of "The Fast Climbing King Air":
It looks like USPA is negatively discriminating against Mike Mullins,
because his son (14 yrs now) is jumping. His son is not USPA member.
He has the fastest climbing jumpship (not counting the 727 :-)  ),
although sometimes is takes a bit more than 7 minutes to get to 14000'.
Maybe he wants to save on fuel, and does not go full power. :-((
Even then, it's faster than those Otters.

  Zoltan
From: suhler@pollux.usc.edu (Paul A. Suhler)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Re: Number of jumps
Date: 2 Oct 1992 10:02:07 -0700
Organization: USC Advanced Computer Architecture Lab
Distribution: world
NNTP-Posting-Host: pollux.usc.edu

In article <1992Oct2.140606.22835@news.ysu.edu> joe@avs.com (Joe Peterson) writes:
                rounds              squares             aad
            #jumps   #mal      #jumps    #mal      saves    #mal
Mark          10       0          450      1         0       2
Pete           0       0         1300      0
Philip        50       1         1200      8
Pierre        45       0         1200      0
Vilhuber       0       0          115      0
Gerhard        0       0           82      0
H. Wain       36       0         1200      1
Hector         0       0          260      0
Jan            0       0          115      0
Tim            0       0          175      0
Charlie     1500       3          750      3
Bob V!        60       0         2000      2
Joe            0       0          630      1
Paul           0       0          431      1


[Actually, I've got 5 military static line jumps, but I think they're
irrelevant.  They were certainly barely relevant to having fun.]

Paul Suhler
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: eap@leland.Stanford.EDU (Eric Perozziello)
Subject: Re: High altitude bungee jump
Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 92 18:49:05 GMT

In article <1992Oct3.121203.1@acad3.alaska.edu> fsbgf@acad3.alaska.edu writes:
>With all this talk about skydiving and bungee jumping I started thinking...
>has anyone ever exited an airplane like a Casa or Caribou connected to the
>plane with a long rope/bungee and been towed behind the airplane then cut
>away from the cord to freefall?? It sounds like it could be fun if done
>right.
>				Brandon

Sounds like it could also piss off the pilot!
From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: RE: Re: compressed air-horn
Date: 1 Oct 92 04:24:10 GMT

Reply-to: Alex.Curylo@p0.f928.n153.z1.fidonet.org (Alex Curylo)
Fido-To: romulus!@uxc.cso.uiuc.edu:mark@virt

: ground in the event they miss my opening.  My concern is, just how well
: is one of these horns going to stand up to being depressurized
: to 13,500FT and back to sea-level multiple times.

I can tell you that suntan lotion plastic bottles and Deep Woods Off! (R)
spray cans both will explode before hitting 14,000 ASL. But if the horn does
it once, it should do it into perpetuity without any problems.
(I can't swear to that altitude ... I saw the exploded remnants, but I wasn't
actually in the glider. I just know it CAN happen ;-)

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From: SKYDIVE@f15.n233.z1.fidonet.org (SKYDIVE)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: need bungi Chord
Date: 30 Sep 92 13:12:00 GMT

Reply-to: Hans.Falkeman@p0.f126.n203.z2.fidonet.org (Hans Falkeman)
Fido-To: bill caefer

 BC> Do not even think of this.  These parachutes would never open in time.

Never do BASE jumping with rund parachute!

 r>> How would I have to modify for personal use?

 BC> First off, you would have to put lines on them.  Not a trivial task.  And
 BC> only a rigger should do it.

Dont even think about it... he will frap!

 BC> You're entirely welcome.  That is, if you live long enough to read this
 BC> message.

Blue Sky and Black...
                             BASE Jumping is Fune!
                                                         TV10


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From: nironen@ntc02.tele.nokia.fi (Pasi Nironen , OH2BKX)
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
Subject: Number of jumps
Date: 30 Sep 92 20:39:45 GMT
Organization: Nokia Telecommunications.

In article <7120@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com>, yzarn@lhdsy1.lahabra.chevron.com (Philip Yzarn de Louraille) writes:
> 
> Just for kicks and concerning malfunction rates of main parachutes, why
> don't we all write the number of jumps we have and the number of main
> malfunctions we got so far.
> 
> 		rounds					squares
> 	#jumps		#mal			#jumps		#mal
> 
   Pasi   1              0                       470              0

 Last 50 jmps studying CRW, knocking on wood...
-- 

            "Don't panic,skydiving makes a lot of sense"
        Helsinki Institute of Technology   PASI@FINHIT.HIT.FI
      NOKIA TELECOMMUNICATIONS         NIRONEN@NTC02.TELE.NOKIA.FI
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: helmut@sorgen.enet.dec.com (Helmut Stoecklin)
Subject: how much $$$ for AFF
Reply-To: helmut@sorgen.enet.dec.com (Helmut Stoecklin)
Organization: Digital Equipment GmbH, Munich
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1992 16:27:57 GMT




        I'd like to know how much a complete (i.e. you get
        a license) AFF course in the US/Florida/Deland/etc
        area would be and what schools you could recommend.

        Courses in Deland and Z-hills are offered here in
        Germany but $2200 for only 10 jumps seems a bit too
        much.

        helmut
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving
From: WALKERK@ssvax1.ssd.loral.com ('Kent Walker')
Subject: Re: Our daily philosophy question
Organization: Space Systems/Loral
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 18:14:10 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.20

In <f9ZS02GF23lb01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> drp40@cd.amdahl.com writes:
  
> Who goes through your pockets for beer money when you go in?

Didn't think anyone goes through the pockets.  In fact, there may be no pockets
to check on some jumps (swimtrunks/lingerie/nude!).  Was told the tradition is
to carry $20 with your packing card to: A) try to bribe the FAA inspector if
your rig is out of date; B) pay for a taxi ride back to the DZ on a really
bad spot; C) pay for the beer when you go in.
Newsgroups: rec.skydiving