HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: yongyuth@munnari.oz.AU (Yongyuth Pahirah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Marut suggests panel to study Senate revamp
Date: 27 Sep 92 14:03:17 GMT
Organization: Mail/News gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: munnari.oz.au


MARUT SUGGEST PANEL TO STUDY SENATE REVAMP
 
SUMITRA HANPANYAPICHIT
 
The Nation Sunday Sept 27 edition
 
HOUSE Speaker Marut Bunnag said yesterday an ad hoc committee should be formed
to study the possibility of amending the Constitution to reduce the size of
the military-dominated Senate.
 
  ``The Senate should be no more than 120 people and authorised only to screen
  legislation,'' Marut said.
 
  He proposed that the selection of senators be the same as that of
  legislators in 1974, when about 2,000 members of the national assembly,
  dubbed the ``Racecourse Council'' because they held a meeting at a local
  racecourse, selected 120 legislators.
 
  The assemblymen were appointed by HM the King following political turbulence
  in 1973.
 
  There are now 270 senators whose parliamentary powers have been largely
  curtailed by an amendment to the Constitution following the May uprising.
  The Senate, which is largely composed of either military or police officers,
  is tasked with the processing of legislation passed on by the elected House
  of Representatives, although they have no power to veto them.
 
  Marut said if there are too many senators, they would become idle.
 
  ``Frankly speaking, it's a waste of national budget,'' he said, adding that
  the Constitution should be amended to cut the size of the Senate.
 
  The first Anand administration adjusted the monthly salary of a senator from
  Bt18,000 to Bt30,000. Senators also enjoy fringe benefits as members of
  parliament.
 
  The present Constitution limits the number of senators at two-thirds the
  size of the House of Representatives.
 
  Deputy Navy Commander in Chief Prachum Kruawan said yesterday the Senate
  should be authorised only to screen legislation. He did not say whether the
  number of senators should be cut.
 
  Supreme Commander ACM Voranart Apicharee recently proposed either a
  reduction in the size of the Senate or its dissolution altogether to
  underline the country's move towards democracy.
 
  ``It's exactly what we have in mind,'' said Prime Minister Chuan Leekpai, in
  response to Voranart's comment.
 
  Chuan was among several leading politicians who had called for a reduction
  in the number of senators during the election campaign. He suggested the
  Senate should number between 100-120.
 
  But Senate Speaker Meechai Ruchuphan objected to the move to cut the
  Senate's size, saying this is not an urgent issue.
 
  ``There are many other national problems to be solved,'' Meechai said,
  adding that the issue should not be raised to create disunity.
From: yongyuth@ipied.tu.ac.TH (Yongyuth Pahirah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Chat Pattana hopeful to join new government
Date: 1 Oct 1992 12:57:40 +1000
Organization: Mail/News gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: munnari.oz.au


 
Chat Pattana hopeful to join new government.
 
The Nation Oct 1 edition
 
THE Chat Pattana (National Development) Party expects rifts to occur in the
government of Prime Minister Chuan Leekpai and that it will lead to the party
being invited to join the coalition.
 
  Party Secretary General Prachuab Chaisarn said yesterday that the rifts
  could not be resolved and Chat Pattana is asked to join the government, it
  would consider the invitation.
 
  ``The Democrat Party itself should be aware that the situation with the
  newly-appointed Cabinet is somewhat similar to when a group defected from
  the Democrat Party following internal conflicts,'' said Prachuab, a former
  Democrat deputy leader who defected to Chat Pattana before the Sept 13
  general election.
 
  He warned the five-party coalition government could face internal rifts as
  only two parties _ Democrat and Social Action _ had experience in
  government.
 
  He said he wished to convey a message to Chuan that the stability of the
  government should be based on pragmatism but with regard to principles.
 
  Asked if he believed the government would encounter disputes within its
  ranks and ask Chat Pattana to join the coalition, Prachuab said the party
  was expecting such a development.
 
  ``However, once the government makes such a request, Chat Pattana will first
  have to consider the matter,'' he said.
From: mptj@vax5.cit.cornell.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Welcomong Khunying Supatra
Date: 29 Sep 92 23:10:28 EDT
Distribution: soc
Organization: Cornell University

I think that after the big welcome we have given Khunying Supatra
we can now sit back and enjoy two things we did not have before:

1. The ear of someone who is considered to be a sincere and dedicated 
	politician.
2. The mouth of such a person.

I hope Khunying Supatra will not be discouraged by the outspoken way 
in which people express themselves on this network, but will take it as 
a challenge to make her word heard and to listen to what people say in 
this highly free-expression environment, which she may not be very used to,
but which will, hopefully, have a positive effect on politics and on freedom
of speach in Thailand.

I also hope that she will become an active participant in the network very
soon. If that happens, I am sure she will automatically take what is said
here into her considerations as an active politician.

Abi
From: charoe@memstvx1.memst.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Re: Yong Thais do not ""wai"" any more
Date: 28 Sep 92 22:00:54 -0600
Organization: Memphis State University

In article <28SEP92.19034437@meena.cc.uregina.ca>, emaruchi@meena.cc.uregina.ca writes:
> I notice that now a day, young generation of Thais, say those with the age lower than 30, are reluctance to "wai" any longer.  I have experienced this very
> often.  Wai is a polite way to respect olders, now I am afraid that it is likely to disappear from our Thai society.
> 
>         Bunlur
From: yongyuth@ipied.tu.ac.TH (Yongyuth Pahirah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: (none)
Date: 5 Oct 1992 12:53:44 +1000
Organization: Mail/News gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: munnari.oz.au
From: yongyuth@ipied.tu.ac.TH (Yongyuth Pahirah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: (none)
Date: 5 Oct 1992 12:57:23 +1000
Organization: Mail/News gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: munnari.oz.au


Chuan still reluctant on adopt governor election system.

The Nation Oct 4 edition

  PRIME Minister Chuan Leekpai said yesterday a drastic move to introduce the
  system of electing provincial governors nationwide could result in the
  refusal by the provinces to send tax revenues to the Bangkok government.

  The prime minister said that such a drastic administrative restructuring
  would have a severe impact on the collection of tax revenues across the
  country for the government's budget.

  ``I agree in principle to decentralizing administrative powers from Bangkok
  but we also have to take into consideration our budgetary readiness,'' he
  said.

  Decentralizing administrative powers is one of the key topics on the agenda
  of the government's policy statement now in the making. Chuan previously
  said that he had instructed his cabinet to draw up the policy statement with
  emphasis on distributing income and job opportunities into the provinces,
  bringing about more development and improving the infrastructure outside
  Bangkok, and decentralizing administrative powers.

  Asked to comment on the proposal by the Palang Dharma Party for a
  step-by-step introduction of an electoral system to supercede the
  appointment of governors by the Interior Ministry, Chuan said that if the
  electoral system was introduced in big provinces, then the government had to
  consider how to modify the present appointment system in the rest of the
  country.

  ``This issue has to be ironed out through our consultations with all the
  coalition partners. After all, whatever move we are going to take, we have
  to consider the entire system. System must be system,'' he said.

  ``We have to regard all provinces as integral parts of a sovereign state,''
  he said.

  While Palang Dharma advocates the introduction of the gubernatorial system
  adopted in Bangkok, Interior Minister Gen Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, who is
  leader of the New Aspiration Party, has cautioned that such a move would run
  counter to the concept that Thailand is a sovereign nation which cannot be
  separated, and not a federation of smaller sovereign states. Instead,
  Chavalit advocates an approach which would grant tambon councils legal
  status to increase their administrative and budgetary powers.

  The Democrat Party, the core of the coalition government, was cautious and
  ambiguous on its stand over the issue during the election campaign.

  
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
From: nilsuwan@cae.wisc.edu (Sunchai Nilsuwankosit)
Subject: Farang?
Organization: U of Wisconsin-Madison College of Engineering
Date: 29 Sep 92 08:13:48 CDT

I think now we are going too far. There is no point to say that 
somebdy are worse than what we are and do nothing to improve.
Even if we do improve, to blame the other with an intention of
making fool and ashame out of them do not help resolve the problems.
I agree that Farang (and many other foreigner) are not qualified
for their earning, but again I know many Thai that are also
unqualified for their high salary. Unfortunately that most of
the time we are the observers who always think we know better
than the player and think that we can do better. Once we are
the player, we inturn think we have done the best and no one
should blame you. It's true that to be an observer can let you
see everything clearer, but at the same time it make you
misunderstand the situation, especially when you have some good
or bad impression in background. I think, in Thai, we said "
Doo Nang+ Doo LaKorn Laew Yorn Doo Taue". This is still true for
us. Again I think in Christianism, we said "If you have no sin,
you are qualified to blame the other." This does not mean that
we cannot tell anyone that he/she is doing something wrong, but
it means that before you make an accusation, think first.

At this point, I would like to say something personal. Look at what
you see in the USA. One thing that will not help improve American
recession is the racism. American used to be the place of the
opportunity and everyone did the best of them to get to their own
success. This, more or less, made America go forward. Now,
when someone begin to accuse the other simply just because they
are different, they are losing their own potential to retain
their superiority (at this point someone may not like this word,
but I cannot think of the other that give me the closer meaning.)
What we need is not that someone is better than someone.
What we need is that someone, sometime, can be better than
the other. We may not know who and when (what and where) and
that is why we have to prepare and listen to the other.
From: anuchit@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Anuchit Anuchitanukul)
Subject: Money
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University.
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1992 04:04:46 GMT


A friend of mine once said, 

     "Money is not everything.  Money is the ONLY thing."

Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Subject: Re: Khunyings and M.Rs
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1  
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1992 20:43:00 GMT

In article <1992Sep27.174256.25064@usl.edu>, pxu8785@usl.edu (Uthayopas Putchong)      writes...
>In article <26SEP199221212060@sscvx1.ssc.gov> godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY) writes:
>>
>>Personally I think it's likely to be much more interesting to hear what
>>ordinary Thai people think, than what the Khunyings, M.R.'s and others
>>privileged by accidents of birth have to say.  I don't think they have
>>ever lived in the real world anyway.
>>
>There are 2 point here:
>1) Khunying Supattra is not a born aristocrat. She got this title as
>a reward for her goodness. You have a little misunderstanding about this.
>2) I think it more interesting to hear from EVERYONE even from the
>priviledge birth person. From them we can know the different point of
>view of the problem from where they stand.
> 
Thank you for correcting me on this point, you are right that I did not
know she had been awarded the title.  M.R, as far as I know, is a 
title that cannot be awarded and means king's family.

Does it matter much where the privileged Thais stand, since there are so
very few of them compared to the others?

Laurence
From: yongyuth@ipied.tu.ac.TH (Yongyuth Pahirah)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: (none)
Date: 5 Oct 1992 12:58:46 +1000
Organization: Mail/News gateway
NNTP-Posting-Host: munnari.oz.au




Prime Minister:
Chuan Leekpai, Democrat


Deputy Prime Ministers:
Banyat Bantadthan, Democrat

Amnuay Viravan, non-MP (New Aspiration quota)

Boonchu Rojanastien, Palang Dharma

Supachai Panitchpakdi, non-MP (Democrat quota)


(Prime minister's secretary general
 Tawat Wichaidit,      ) 


PM's Office Ministers: 
Tirdpong Jayananda, Democrat
Savit Bhothiwihok, Democrat
Surasak Thiamprasert, New Aspiration
Chinnawut Sunthornsima, Palang Dharma


Defence Minister:
Gen Vijit Sookmark, non-partisan
Deputy:
Maj Gen Sombat Rodphothong , Palang Dharma


Finance Minister:
Tarrin Nimmanahaeminda, non-MP (Democrat quota)
Deputy:
Trairong Suwankhiri, Democrat
Boonchu Trithong, New Aspiration


Foreign Minister:
Prasong Sunsiri
Deputy:
Surin Pitsuwan, Democrat


Agriculture Minister:
Nipon Promphan, Democrat
Deputies:
Suthep Thaugsuban, Democrat
Sawat Suebsaiprom, New Aspiration
Thawil Chanprasong, Palang Dharma



Communications Minister:
Winai Sompong, Palang Dharma
Deputies:
Charas Puachuay, Palang Dharma
Sawai Pattano, Democrat
Thawee Kraikupti, New Aspiration
Somsak Thepsuthin, Social Action



Commerce Minister:
Uthai Pimchaichon, Solidarity
Deputies:
Chaiyos Sasomsup, Solidarity
Jurin Laksanavisit, Democrat
Paitoon Kaewthong, New Aspiration



Interior Minister:
Gen Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, New Aspiration
Deputies:
Den Tohmeena, New Aspiration
Suthas Ngernmuen, Democrat
Chamni Sakdiseth, Palang Dharma
Chaowas Sudlabha, Social Action



Justice Minister:
Suwit Khunkitti, Social Action

Science Minister:
Phisarn Moonlasartsathorn, New Aspiration
Deputy:
Preecha Musikul, Democrat


Education Minister:
Samphan Thongsamak, Democrat
Deputies:
Pramote Sukhum, Democrat
Sangthong Sritharet, New Aspiration
Adisorn Piengkate, Palang Dharma



Public Health Minister:
Boonphan Khaewattana, Social Action
Deputies:
Rakkiat Sukhathana, Social Action
Anek Tabsuwan, Democrat
Udomsilp Srisaengnam, Palang Dharma


Industry Minister:
Sanan Kachornprasart, Democrat
Deputies:
Pornthep Tejapaibul, Democrat
Kiatichai Chaichaorat, New Aspiration



University Affairs Minister:
Suthep Attakor, Palang Dharma





Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
From: sdurong@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca (sripen durongdej)
Subject: SICK
Organization: University of Waterloo
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1992 18:17:35 GMT

Since I posted the matter of hiring farang in Thailand, I received several
responses from farang who said again and again that they love Thailand so much
and they love Thai people so much.  The responses are like :
- poison 
- racist
- ____ you
- in general, Thai lecturers and officials earn money from corruption
- childish
- personality disorder
- hating farang and having serious personality problems
- incapable of logical thought
- I would take action against you in Canada.
- etc.
If some of you do not get my points what I tried to give to my Thai friends. 
I'll clearify again.
1.  Why do we hire one farang when we can hire 3 Thai lecturers who are well-
qualified?
2.  Why our Thai government still have the policy to pay farang higher than 
Thai when Thai officers have equal qualification to farang.  Is this the old
beleive that we think farang is better? And I said I don't think they are.
3.  When the Thai students here go back to work, please keep this in mind.

I am really sick of all those responses.  I raised this issue because this is
some food for thoughts for Thai users in this net.  There were some opinions
which I listened to from some polite farang.  But these rude comments are not
welcome!!  I think I am responding to the well-educated people as some of you 
holds Ph.D.  After all I am not sure about this.  Stop sending me these rude
words if you can not do it in a proper manner.  The more you send the clearer
we learn about your real colour.  Thank you all.
From: godfrey@sscvx1.ssc.gov (LAURENCE GODFREY)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Re: Mail from a muddle-headed xenophobe
Date: 30 Sep 92 16:17:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: sscvx1.30SEP199210172766
Organization: Superconducting Super Collider Laboratory
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.4-b1

I apologise for refering to Khun Sripen as "he" rather than "she" in my
last posting.  Everything else I said still stands.

Laurence
From: trin@tlaeng.enet.dec.com (Trin Tantsetthi)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Re: Hiring Farang in Thailand.
Date: 26 Sep 92 07:23:07 +0700
Organization: Digital Equipment (Thailand), Ltd.

In article <Bv434D.Muu@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>, sdurong@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca (sripen durongdej) writes:
> ....
> I have 
> experienced Farang working in Bangkok before and I can say that I am not    
> impressed by their work.

I don't believe ethnic background or nationality has anything to do with
quality of the work.

> We are still think that Farang is better than Thai.

If `we' are still thinking like that or the other way around, perhaps `we' 
should sit back and think of it again.

> We all experienced racism in North America
> but don't you think we are discriminated by our own people.

I have no idea about racism/xenophobia you `all' are experiencing but if
there is any kind of discrimination here in Thailand, it should be
eliminated.

> Why do we have to 
> pay Farang higher salary when they can't speak Thai and they are not better 
> than us?

An employment is not a one-sided decision. In fact, it must be mutually
agreed upon by both employer and employee.

If the employer hires a person at premium but the person does not deserve
the extra cost (or does not qualify for the job), there is something wrong
with the employer (or recruitment process) -- not the new hire -- definitely
not his/her race.
From: cooneys@gw.wmich.edu
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
Subject: Re: SICK
Date: 30 Sep 92 22:33:35 EST
Organization: Western Michigan University

In article <BvELHC.Dqo@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>, sdurong@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca (sripen durongdej) writes:
> Since I posted the matter of hiring farang in Thailand, I received several
> responses from farang who said again and again that they love Thailand so much
> and they love Thai people so much.  The responses are like :
> - poison 
> - racist
> - ____ you
> - in general, Thai lecturers and officials earn money from corruption
> - childish
> - personality disorder
> - hating farang and having serious personality problems
> - incapable of logical thought
> - I would take action against you in Canada.
> - etc.


I am sure that very many of us who read s.c.thai are sick 
too, to hear of these hurtful and insulting messages sent to 
someone who posted her views in good faith.

Insults are not arguments.

I imagine too, that many of us are tired of the very 
personal attacks back and forth from Mr. Laurence. Let's 
keep to the pieces of evidence, personal testimony, and 
other kinds of interesting facts.

I remember the original posting about the privileged 
position of farang in Thailand. I thought I could feel the 
writer's anger and resentment and I imagined that I might 
feel that way if I were a Thai and saw what I thought 
unqualified persons being preferred just because they had 
the prestige of being foreign. But anger leads to blindness 
and exaggeration. And other posters reminded us of the true 
complexities of the position of farang in Thailand: 
sometimes ill-paid and generous; sometimes over-privileged; 
sometimes every shade of good and bad and in-between.


So let's not give in to the simplicities of strong feelings 
or anger, hurt, impatience to change everything at once, 
etc.

Jai yen, na khrap?
			-- Seamus Cooney
Newsgroups: soc.culture.thai
From: ssg9328@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Samart Srijumnong)
Subject: Re: Khunying Supatra on Internet
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1992 10:19:42 GMT

ang@theory.lcs.mit.edu (William S. Ang) forwards Khun Anuchit's reply:


>---------------------------cut here-------------------------------
>From: Anuchit Anuchitanukul <anuchit@CS.Stanford.EDU>
>To: ang@theory.lcs.mit.edu
>Subject: Re: Khunying Supatra on Internet
> 
>Khunying Supattra Masdis is an executive member of the Democrat party.
>She was a MP and was in the cabinet many times in the past.  She is a
>outspoken and very active female politician.  In this election, she
>didn't run for a seat but let her brother run in her constituency.
>She is propably an example of good politicians in Thai politics.
> 
>Anuchit Anuchitanukul
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Let me add some information to that provided by Khun Anuchit. Khunying 
Supatra is the daughter of the late Surin Masdis, an incorruptible MP from
Nakorn Sri Thammarat, a southern province of Thailand. Besides being an
articulate MP, Supatra has engaged in a movement to upgrade Thai women. 
Though her honorific is "Khunying" (which is roughly equal to "Lady"), 
Supatra has not joined the elegant circle of most typical "Khunying"
who have superficial view about things. 

I want also to correct Khun Laurence here that in fact Khunying Supatra is
not in Thailand. As mentioned by Khun Theerasak, she is now a fellow at
a Boston institution. Nonetheless, since she has just left Thailand, plus
her first hand experience in Thai politics, she should be a good source 
of ideas. 

Like that of most western countries, Thai politics suffers from being 
dominated by men. Politics sets priorty to the problems a society faces.
Men are aggressive so is politics. Soft personality is regarded as wimp
in political circle. I don't adore a female politician simply because she
is a woman. Former British PM, Thatcher, is a woman but she had used men's
strategies. She even acted like a man. Given the fact that women makes half
of the world population, the world has waited for women to put ingredients
to the solution of the world's problems (e.g. environment, proverty, 
prositution, drugs, and so on so forth). 

Supatra has set a good model for Thai women. She is a hope of Thai politics.
Of course, it is too bad she had not run in Sept.13 election. In a way,
taking a break from politics and engaging in research activities may help
her. She can then sit down and look at things in non-partisan way. In case
she wants to come back to politics, all these experience she engages in 
this "vacation" (from politics) should help provide her with more alternatives.
I just hope that our eager to interact with her would not disturb her
mission at the insitution.