HDTenEightyP/NetNews huggingface dataset:
From: sysmgt007@spacm1.spac.spc.com (Dean Nedelman)
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
Date: 3 Sep 92 08:13:32 PDT
Organization: Security Pacific Automation Co., LA, CA

In article <j8knnmd.bskendig@netcom.com>, bskendig@netcom.com (Brian Kendig) writes:
> Backrubs, by definition, involve sensations of pleasure generated by a
> lot of physical contact.  To me, they therefore also have a sexual
> meaning.  I'd just as soon ask for a backrub from another man as I'd
> ask for a backrub from, say, a woman I know only from working with in
> the office -- in other words, probably never.  I will only ask for
> backrubs from people towards whom I have even just a little physical
> attraction, and since my brain's chemistry has made me het, I'll
> probably never be physically attracted towards a man, and thus I'll
> never accept a backrub from a man.
> 
> If I don't accept contact which I consider to be sexual from a person
> towards whom I'm not sexually attracted, does this make me homophobic?
> 

Well, I have two comments to make here:

	o I can tell you that I was a little uncomfortable the first time I 
	  gave a male friend of mine a massage (full body).  I was 
	  uncomfortable for the standard reasons of being raised that men do
	  not make physical contact with men.  I am glad I got over it, though.

	  (After he was sure of my abilities, he than started having massage
	   his girlfriends).

	o I think nothing of offering massage to a female co-worker (with the
	  understanding that it is ONLY massage).  As such, I would not be
	  uncomfortable accepting from one.

In all fairness, I should comment that I worked at the local Rennassaince Faire
for 6 years.  Most people who work Faire are a little more (umm) `open' about
things (the coed showers for example) and I got over a lot of hangups because 
of it (the ability to see a naked female body in a context other than sexual).

This, of course, helps when I give massage.

-- 
Dean (The Shadow)
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Dean I. Nedelman                            sysmgt007@spacm1.spac.spc.com |
| Advisory Systems Engineer        sysmgt007%spacm1.uucp@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov |
| Bank America System Engineering       spacm1!sysmgt007@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov |
| 333 South Beaudry Ave.       {...,decwrl,ames,usc}!elroy!spacm1!sysmgt007 |
| Los Angeles, CA  90017                                                    |
|                                                                           |
| Systems programmers are the high priests of a low cult.                   |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
From: richard@octel.com (Richard Karasik)
Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
Organization: Octel Communications Inc., Milpitas Ca.
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1992 20:10:24 GMT

>>I am at college, and sometimes I get stressed out.  What is the most polite
>way
>>to ask for a backrub? I could use one quite a bit.
>>
>>Thanks.
>>roger
>
>I'd also like to hear people's advice on this. I suppose it's the fear that
>the massage will be sexualized that makes people wary. I feel it's best to
>resolve the issue in one's own mind before asking someone.... only because
>we _do_ live in a Christian state (family values, remember?) and that means
>that there are people out there that villify sexuality (fornication,
>remember?).

1- How to ask a friend - Ask -if its a friend then most things are askable -if not
deliverable.
   If at a party -it depends - Most people do not offer services by hanging
   shingles on their neck (except for lawyers and some doctors) - Most people
   know I do massage - I wait for them to ask before I decide to get involved one
   way or another. I refuse to accept innuendos or hints or things like
   " Gee - my backs sore" I usually say -"Hmmmm"  For people I know I usually say
   "where does it hurt , and when do you want it worked on" -Even then most people
   say "My back's sore -can you work on it sometime ??"

   Start a converstaion -Hey my back's been bothering me -know anyone into body
   work?

2. Sexual problems. 
	A. Can you distinguish sensuality from sexuality? Can you distinguish
	theraputic touch from erotic fantasy? If not then you will probably alwyas be
	plagued by these problems. And you will probably ascribe them to the deliverer
	of service rather than the requestor!

	B. Learn theraputic touch -doesnt the church (any church) speak of the ritual
	laying on of hands? - Where in hell (heh heh) do you think such speaking came
	from -not from lust in the dust -early mideastern style -but from a desire to
	heal and help.

	C. Who's fear -certainly not mine.  Are you asking for aan esalen style
	massage or a swedish style massage. Are you asking for something more
	appropriate to a couples "exploration and training" session or for 
	something that will really help you theraputically.

	 In all cases look to yourself to see what my lie there -that is where you can
	 start in learning what to expect when you ask the questions. You may be
	 pissed at what you see.

   D  Ask for a massage -not a massage (wink wink nudge nudge) If you don't know
   the difference -ask a massage practitioner to instruct you. IE How can I
   ask for a massage without being misinterpreted? You will be very very surprised
   at the answers.

-- 
|UUCP  richard@octel.com                 VOICE (HEY YOU!) or 408 321 6372
| 
|             Speaker for the dead - among them:
|                 Liberty, Justice, Freedom
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
From: bskendig@netcom.com (Brian Kendig)
Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 92 00:23:42 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Headquarters: San Francisco

alerman@terapin.com (Alexander Lerman) wrote (in article <alerman.1c24@terapin.com>):
>Unless of course, you happen to be homophobic, in which case you might
>want to seek psychological counseling.

Hey, that insinuation isn't very nice.

Backrubs, by definition, involve sensations of pleasure generated by a
lot of physical contact.  To me, they therefore also have a sexual
meaning.  I'd just as soon ask for a backrub from another man as I'd
ask for a backrub from, say, a woman I know only from working with in
the office -- in other words, probably never.  I will only ask for
backrubs from people towards whom I have even just a little physical
attraction, and since my brain's chemistry has made me het, I'll
probably never be physically attracted towards a man, and thus I'll
never accept a backrub from a man.

If I don't accept contact which I consider to be sexual from a person
towards whom I'm not sexually attracted, does this make me homophobic?

     << Brian >>

-- 
_/_/_/       Brian Kendig  Macintosh Jedi           Live never to be ashamed
 _/_/   Starfleet Captain  Oracle Employee         if anything you do or say
  _/  Intrepid Adventurer  Saturn SL2 Owner    is published around the world
      bskendig@netcom.com  Wizard of Frobozz    -- even if what is published
    Princeton '92! BSE/CS  Writer/Actor/Singer                   is not true.
From: alerman@terapin.com (Alexander Lerman)
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
Date: 30 Aug 92 11:23:46 PST
Organization: BBS

In article <1992Aug30.002330.1@vaxb.acs.unt.edu>, roger@vaxb.acs.unt.edu (Roger
'Not the Rabbit' Cook) writes:
>I am at college, and sometimes I get stressed out.  What is the most polite
way
>to ask for a backrub? I could use one quite a bit.
>
>Thanks.
>roger


I'd also like to hear people's advice on this. I suppose it's the fear that
the massage will be sexualized that makes people wary. I feel it's best to
resolve the issue in one's own mind before asking someone.... only because
we _do_ live in a Christian state (family values, remember?) and that means
that there are people out there that villify sexuality (fornication,
remember?).
From: PA142548@utkvm1.utk.edu (T. Archer)
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
Date: 3 Sep 92 12:23:56 GMT
Organization: University of Tennessee Division of Continuing Education

In article <alerman.1c24@terapin.com> alerman@terapin.com (Alexander Lerman) writes:
>Path: utkux1.utk.edu!utkcs2!darwin.sura.net!wupost!sdd.hp.com!decwrl!csus.edu!netcom.com!netcomsv!terapin!alerman
>From: alerman@terapin.com (Alexander Lerman)
>Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
>Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
>References: <EIGENSTR.92Sep2094341@susan.cs.rose-hulman.edu>
>Message-ID: <alerman.1c24@terapin.com>
>Date: 2 Sep 92 13:23:57 PST
>Organization: BBS
>Lines: 19
>In article <EIGENSTR.92Sep2094341@susan.cs.rose-hulman.edu>,
>eigenstr@cs.rose-hulman.edu (Todd R. Eigenschink) writes:
>>>>I am at college, and sometimes I get stressed out.  What is the most
>>>>polite way to ask for a backrub? I could use one quite a bit.
>>>
>>>I like "Hey, would you give me a backrub?" myself.  Many people are
>>>more than happy to.
>>
>>Unless of course, you go to an all-male school like I do, in which
>>case you might want to live with the stress... :)  (But we're going
>>coed in 1995, by which time I'll be long gone... :( )
>
>Unless of course, you happen to be homophobic, in which case you might
>want to seek psychological counseling.
>
Yeah.  That fear of sameness can be a bitch.
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
From: orr@engr.latech.edu (John Orr)
Subject: Re: Backrubs don't have to be sexual.
Organization: Louisiana Tech University
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 18:24:20 GMT

In article <EIGENSTR.92Sep4122545@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> eigenstr@cs.rose-hulman.edu (Todd R. Eigenschink) writes:

>>Sometimes we might get into a kissing session, but sex is not an 
>>option for us until after we are married.  

>Wow!  That makes _three_ people I know that think that!  I thought I
>was the only one...  :-)

>--
>Todd Eigenschink (eigenstr@CS.Rose-Hulman.Edu)
>Psychopathic Peon System Administrator
>Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology, Terre Haute, IN
>"I've seen it work before..." -- Stephen Smalley
  

   That's right, there are still a few of us who believe in the sanctity of 
marriage.  My fiancee', Rebekah, is divorced, and we have gone all through 
the Scriptures concerning that, but we have committed for the two of us 
to  "remain as we are" until we are married.  The Bible shows that a 
marriage is to be a relationship between three people: man, woman, and 
Creator.  Scripture says that "a chord of three strands is not quickly 
broken." That is something that Rebekah and I believe in and will dedicate 
our lives and marriage to the Lord.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
        John Orr            |  A big oak is simply a little nut that  
    Systems Engineer        |    stood its ground.  -- Copied
 Louisiana Tech University  |------------------------------------------------
318/257-3097        (voice) |   "All views expressed are personal opinion, 
orr@engr.latech.edu (email) | not necessarily the views of this station."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: alerman@terapin.com (Alexander Lerman)
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
Subject: Re: How to ask a friend.
Date: 2 Sep 92 13:23:57 PST
Organization: BBS

In article <EIGENSTR.92Sep2094341@susan.cs.rose-hulman.edu>,
eigenstr@cs.rose-hulman.edu (Todd R. Eigenschink) writes:
>>>I am at college, and sometimes I get stressed out.  What is the most
>>>polite way to ask for a backrub? I could use one quite a bit.
>>
>>I like "Hey, would you give me a backrub?" myself.  Many people are
>>more than happy to.
>
>Unless of course, you go to an all-male school like I do, in which
>case you might want to live with the stress... :)  (But we're going
>coed in 1995, by which time I'll be long gone... :( )

Unless of course, you happen to be homophobic, in which case you might
want to seek psychological counseling.

>Todd Eigenschink (eigenstr@CS.Rose-Hulman.Edu)

Alex
From: roger@vaxb.acs.unt.edu (Roger 'Not the Rabbit' Cook)
Newsgroups: alt.backrubs
Subject: How to ask a friend.
Date: 30 Aug 92 06:23:30 GMT
Organization: Going Insane.  Want to come along?

I am at college, and sometimes I get stressed out.  What is the most polite way
to ask for a backrub? I could use one quite a bit.

Thanks.
roger
--
********************************Roger Cook*************************************
roger@vaxb.acs.unt.edu OR roger@untvax.BITNET (UGH!) OR NTVAXA::ROGER

The opinions stated herein are my own to my knowledge. If, however, you happen
to agree with me, they can be yours too, after paying the requisite fees to
me. Please contact me at one of the above addresses if you need to.
Organization: Penn State University
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1992 13:13:22 EDT
From: <JAL137@psuvm.psu.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
Subject: Do you all realize what you're doing?

     Alt.cascade is one of my favorite newsgroups because it proves that the
 surrealis spirit is an integral part of the playfullness inherent in human
 nature.  A cascade is strangely akin to a massive piece of group poetry (Dali
 & co. would be proud).  A cascade can take a !@#$#@ flame and turn it into a
 harmles, petty, little string of innane babble.  Cascades are a natural ex-
 tension of the un-natural evoultion of words.  Cascades are political state-
 ments (ex: The Constitutional Cascade).  Cascades mock Society & Beuraucracy
 (ex: The Sexual Checklist).  Thank you all for keeping the Surrealists alive.
                                                     -Jonathan A. Leistiko
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
From: st10t@Rosie.UH.EDU
Subject: Re: IN _____ THEY HAVE ___ DIFFERENT WORDS FOR ________
Reply-To: st10t@Rosie.UH.EDU
Organization: University of Houston
Distribution: world,local
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 06:56:42 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.063730.8036@uwm.edu>, callan@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Joel E Callan) writes:
>From article <1992Aug27.002659.1705@pellns.alleg.edu>, by mccombj@alleg.edu (Joseph McCombs):
>> f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin) writes:
>>> paulchem@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Icarus) writes:
>>> >f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin) writes:
>>> >>paulchem@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Icarus) writes:
>>> >>>galt%peruvian.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu writes:
>>> >>>>ken@aiai.ed.ac.uk (Ken Johnson) writes:
>>> >>>>>In Iceland they have 8 different words for Snow
>>> >>>>>In Italy they have 42 different words for Buttocks
>>> >>>>>In Spain they have 58 different words for Sleep
>>> >>>>>In Hungary they have 32 different words for Sausage
>>> >>>>>In Scotland they have 0 words for Rush
>>> >>>>>In Argentina they have 671 different words for Secret Police
>>> >>>>>In America they have 5630 words for Car
>>> >>>>>In Britain we have 260 different words for Food Poisoning
>>> >>>>In alt.cascade, they have 1 word for misc.test baitors
>>> >>>In Passing, they dont have any words at all.
>>> >>Incognito, we have too many words to hide.
>>> >In Credible, they have too few, you lied.
>>> In Decision, the waste of a generation of Kids.
>> In retrospect, I'm proud of what I did.
>Indespensible, we cannot do without.
In the 'xpensive wall, shoes we cannot do w/out
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
From: lmanning@valve.heart.rri.uwo.ca (Laura Manning)
Subject: exit stage left
Organization: The John P. Robarts Research Institute, London, Ontario
Distribution: na
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 18:32:19 GMT


exit stage left
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
Subject: Re: IN _____ THEY HAVE ___ DIFFERENT WORDS FOR ________
From: f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin)
Date: 26 Aug 92 15:58:45 MST
 <1992Aug26.043620.14124@colorado.edu> <1992Aug26.080138.1@violet.ccit.arizona.edu> <1992Aug26.221448.4752@colorado.edu>
Distribution: world,local
Organization: University of Arizona
Nntp-Posting-User: f67700241

In article <1992Aug26.221448.4752@colorado.edu>, paulchem@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Icarus) writes:
>In article <1992Aug26.080138.1@violet.ccit.arizona.edu> f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin) writes:
>>In article <1992Aug26.043620.14124@colorado.edu>, paulchem@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Icarus) writes:
>>>In article <1992Aug25.164404.1@violet.ccit.arizona.edu> f67700241@violet.ccit.arizona.edu (Greg Franklin) writes:
>>>>In article <1992Aug25.225433.27712@colorado.edu>, paulchem@tigger.cs.Colorado.EDU (Icarus) writes:
>>>>>In article <1992Aug25.120034.3146@hellgate.utah.edu> galt%peruvian.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu writes:
>>>>>>In article <7335@skye.ed.ac.uk>, ken@aiai.ed.ac.uk (Ken Johnson) writes:
>>>>>>>In Iceland they have 8 different words for Snow
>>>>>>>In Italy they have 42 different words for Buttocks
>>>>>>>In Spain they have 58 different words for Sleep
>>>>>>>In Hungary they have 32 different words for Sausage
>>>>>>>In Scotland they have 0 words for Rush
>>>>>>>In Argentina they have 671 different words for Secret Police
>>>>>>>In America they have 5630 words for Car
>>>>>>>In Britain we have 260 different words for Food Poisoning
>>>>>>In alt.cascade, they have 1 word for misc.test baitors
>>>>>In Passing, they dont have any words at all.
>>>>Incognito, we have too many words to hide.
>>>In Credible, they have too few, you lied.
>>In Decision, the waste of a generation of Kids.
>In Terior, the taste of a penetration of lids.
In Significant, the hides of the filtration of squids. 
-- 
Greg "Mockingbird" Franklin      Interviewer: "Sir, how do you spell relief?"
f67700241@ccit.arizona.edu               Dan: "R-O-L-A-I-D-S-E."
From: conrad.thompson@p2012.f75.n3603.z1.FIDONET.ORG (conrad thompson)
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
Subject: generic cascade #6,905
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 92  0:29:00 EDT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:3603/75.2012 - Psycho.FidoNet.Org, Clearwater FL

My penis is big and shiny.

--  
Internet: conrad.thompson@p2012.f75.n3603.z1.FIDONET.ORG
UUCP: ...!myrddin!tct!psycho!75.2012!conrad.thompson
Note:psycho is a free gateway between Usenet & Fidonet. For info write to
     root@psycho.fidonet.org.
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
From: Venkatachalam Aruna  (Affable)
Subject: Re: The Tiger Cascade Departure - III
Reply-To: aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu (Venkatachalam Aruna)
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 21:26:48 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.210827.15526@src.umd.edu> chidi@src.umd.edu (Chidi  
Subramanian) writes:
> (Cliff Neighbors) writes:
> >(Icarus) writes:
> >>(Venkatachalam Aruna) writes:
> >>>(M  
> >>>Ramesh) writes:
> >>>> Venkatachalam Aruna) writes:
> >>>> >Ramesh) writes:
> >>>> >> Venkatachalam Aruna writes:
> >>>> >> >(Nath S. Gopalaswamy) writes:
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>I will close you by my ices.
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> I will lose you by my dices.
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>  I will kill you with my spices.
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>    Hi willki, you with mices ?
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>    No Vepal, that would be crises.
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>>      No pal, begone, that suffices.
> >>>> >> >> >>>>>       I car US life's main spices?
> >>>> >> >> >>>>        I caress her vain crevices.
> >>>> >> >> >>>         I could do without artificial devices.
> >>>> >> >> >>          I kudo you with art on what premises ?
> >>>> >> >> >           Could you be SCating on thin Ices?
> >>>> >> >>             Methinks Icarus will pay terrible prices.
> >>>> >> >              Yes, he will be crushed down to juices.
> >>>> >>                No, he will crush any such sloppiness.
> >>>> >                 Wait and see, he won't get such happiness.
> >>>>                   Waiting stables fits your type I guess!!
> >>>                    Absurd! Uncalled for! You will be in distress.
> >>                     Crossword ! Unsolved for ? Blue filmy nightdress !
> >                      Coward! Unloved whore! Mealy maggots, worms and lices!
>                        Howard loved who? Money? A million for me please!
                         Forward thinking! Other people's money! Cease!
Venkat
--
venkat@jetson.uh.edu                  | If you love something,set it free.
venkat@menudo.uh.edu                  | If it comes back, it is yours.
aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu(NeXT mails okay)| If it does not, it never was.
(713)-923-7773(h) & (713)-743-4250(w) |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
From: mramesh@nyx.cs.du.edu (M Ramesh)
Subject: Re: Let's all get a life here, people!
X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University
	of Denver for the Denver community.  The University has neither
	control over nor responsibility for the opinions of users.
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Distribution: world,local
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 15:43:04 GMT

Greg Franklin) mocks:
>Icarus) sez:
>>Greg Franklin) writes:
>>>Icarus) writes:
>>>>(Cliff Neighbors) writes:
>>>>>(Icarus) writes:
>>>>>>(Venkatachalam Aruna) writes:
>>>>>>>(M  
>>>>>>>Ramesh) writes:
>>>>>>>> Venkatachalam Aruna) writes:
>>>>>>>> >Ramesh) writes:
>>>>>>>> >> Venkatachalam Aruna writes:
>>>>>>>> >> >(Nath S. Gopalaswamy) writes:
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>I will close you by my ices.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> I will lose you by my dices.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>  I will kill you with my spices.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>    Hi willki, you with mices ?
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>    No Vepal, that would be crises.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>      No pal, begone, that suffices.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>       I car US life's main spices?
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>        I caress her vain crevices.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>         I could do without artificial devices.
>>>>>>>> >> >> >>          I kudo you with art on what premises ?
>>>>>>>> >> >> >           Could you be SCating on thin Ices?
>>>>>>>> >> >>             Methinks Icarus will pay terrible prices.
>>>>>>>> >> >              Yes, he will be crushed down to juices.
>>>>>>>> >>                No, he will crush any such sloppiness.
>>>>>>>> >                 Wait and see, he won't get such happiness.
>>>>>>>>                   Waiting stables fits your type I guess!!
>>>>>>>                    Absurd! Uncalled for! You will be in distress.
>>>>>>                     Crossword ! Unsolved for ? Blue filmy nightdress !
>>>>>                      Coward! Unloved whore! Mealy maggots, worms and lices!
>>>>    Froward pun loved bore! Steely langots, drains and bastard born thrices !
>>>                        Line too long, it pains the critics' throbsomeness.
>>>
>>>                        Let's all get a life here, people!
>>                         Butts all wet ? a lie, fair and simple.
>                          Nuts to get, lines to snort, dare me, wimp.
                           Cut to gut; lying upstarts or be deer meat!

-- Ramesh

=========================*****=====================================
.sig file under construction - misc.test is very useful. It even
generates responses from far and wide. why insist on testing pliss?
=========================/////=====================================
   
Newsgroups: alt.cascade
From: Venkatachalam Aruna  (Affable)
Subject: Re: The Tiger Cascade Departure - II
Reply-To: aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu (Venkatachalam Aruna)
Organization: University of Houston
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1992 14:10:52 GMT

In article <1992Aug27.133352.29914@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> mramesh@nyx.cs.du.edu  
(M Ramesh) writes:
> Nath S. Gopalaswamy writes:
> >Icarus writes:
> >>>>>>>>>>I will close you by my ices.
> >>>>>>>>> I will lose you by my dices.
> >>>>>>>>  I will kill you with my spices.
> >>>>>>    Hi willki, you with mices ?
> >>>>>>    No Vepal, that would be crises.
> >>>>      No pal, begone, that suffices.
> >>>       Adieu, to you and your vices.
> >>        Farewell then to fame's avarices ?
> >         Is there no end to your artifices?
>           Their end begins our filial arts!
            Why do you begin these starts?
--
venkat@jetson.uh.edu                  | If you love something,set it free.
venkat@menudo.uh.edu                  | If it comes back, it is yours.
aruna@tree.egr.uh.edu(NeXT mails okay)| If it does not, it never was.
(713)-923-7773(h) & (713)-743-4250(w) |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.cascade